SkyRC — IFA 2014 — MC3000 charger-analyzer

[Ravel]

Hi, i can't think of any way to make DEX synchronize the Discharge routines of your different slots/slot programs. Neither mc3k device can do it nor can DEX afaik. Yes we would need to post-process the data with Excel for this purpose. There is no other way afaik.

Maybe in the mc3k there could be an option to start the next step of all the cycles
only when all the active slots have achieved their resting time ?
I suppose the idea is intended with the same program running on 2 to 4 slots (similar batteries).
In that case the resting time programmed in all the slots is in fact a minimum,
some batteries may be experiemcing longer durations, but one may not care.

The other possible implementation, whichever slot reaches first its spent resting time,
would command going to the next step (next cycle) for ALL slots.

Do I make sense ?
Regards

 

[doctordun]

AFAIK, there is no "warranty Process" At least not in the USA.

That said,there are "some" sellers who do take that role upon themselves it seems.

Has ANYONE in the USA sent their MC3000 back for warranty service?
If so, please say how.

Why doesn't SkyRC have a US based office for handling warranties?

I want to buy one but have had too much defective product from SkyRC with no solid warranty availability (in the USA)

My apologies in advance if I'm simply uninformed and there is an easy way to get warranty service.

I, too, am curious about the warranty process. I was unable to see any answer to this question and hoped to be directed to one.

It appears from GearBest website, that if you upgrade the programming on the charger, even with their supplied update, the warranty is void.
So there is a strong reason to never do that.

The customer voids the warranty if they:
- Flash the firmware of a device or root a device

Thank you.

 

[kreisl]

Maybe in the mc3k there could be an option to start the next step of all the cycles
only when all the active slots have achieved their resting time ?
I suppose the idea is intended with the same program running on 2 to 4 slots (similar batteries).
In that case the resting time programmed in all the slots is in fact a minimum,
some batteries may be experiemcing longer durations, but one may not care.

The other possible implementation, whichever slot reaches first its spent resting time,
would command going to the next step (next cycle) for ALL slots.

Do I make sense ?
Regards

Thanks for the vague suggestion but imho it is not viable or not acceptable in the end for 3 reasons: it is complicated, the implications are complex, and even if i kinda understood it at the date of posting (2017-02-11), i've forgotten how it should work how it functions by today (2017-02-14) and i would need to think hard again to make sense out of all of it; an option in SPV (which concrete option with parameters?) for such a control-related function would clutter up SPV which is to comprise rather algorithm-related functions, it simple would not fit in between; last but not least we can dismiss it because you can ask squirrel doesn't dig it

On the other hand, i do like in general the idea of the user control function 'Pause' in form of a key press. It would empower the user to take own control over the pausing not let the machine take over automatic control after some implemented scheme which not everybody agrees with or needs or wants.

@everyone, assuming that the implementation is doable and the implementation result great as intended, would you welcome a 'Pause'-button, do we need or want this? If yes, how about the <STOP>-key, a short-press ("click") on <STOP> in DDV/SOV? (As you remember from the Cheat Sheet, a long-press ("press-and-hold") on <STOP> in DDV/SOV results in 'Finishing' the slot program prematurely.)
So if someone accidentally clicks the key in DDV or SOV, nothing bad will happen, no slot will be finished/stopped/reset/etc; he can then press the 'Unpause' key and all paused slots will continue. For the 'Unpause All'-key we could probably use the <ENTER>-key and only in TOV. (Pressing <ENTER> in DDV/SOV means 'Return to TOV', as you remember.)

So. This is my own concrete idea of implementing a <PAUSE>-button, and in a vote (What's the vote question? Lol) i would vote Yes for it

Actually this is now an offer. If you don't need or want manual pausing and or don't like my idea of its implementation, then please say so. If you don't say anything for example because you don't mind or care, then i'll count it as a Yes (Lol again).

haha

ha.

 

[buss78]

Hi @All,


In the last weeks I read very much about the different Chargers an I decided to buy the MC3000 (FW.1.13).
I have one Question and i hope to be right here to get some help.

At Home i have some old NiMh/NiCd Accus (no LSD) and i want to check, refresh and reform them.
To save some time, i decided to use the mode "Cycle" with a C.Current of 8Hours@0,2C instead of the recommended 16Hours@0,1C.

These are my settings:

Mode=Cycle
CycleWay=D>C
CycleCount=3
C.Current=0,2C
D.Current=0,2C
EndChargeVolt:1,65V
EndDischargeVolt=0,9V
ChargeRestTime=20 Minutes
DischargeRestTime=10 Minutes

The Problem is, that the -deltaU Termination does not work correctly with a C.Current below 0,3C......
To match the Termination of the charge process at 1,6C, i have to set the CAPACITY to 1,6C or the TimeProtection to 8 hours.
When i use one of these two settings, the whole Cycle Program terminates when one of these values matches (there is no second Cycle).

What should i do, that the Charger can match my Requirements?
Sorry for my English, but i hope you can understand my Feature Request.


Regards
Christian

 

[Ravel]

Hi @All,


In the last weeks I read very much about the different Chargers an I decided to buy the MC3000 (FW.1.13).
I have one Question and i hope to be right here to get some help.

At Home i have some old NiMh/NiCd Accus (no LSD) and i want to check, refresh and reform them.
To save some time, i decided to use the mode "Cycle" with a C.Current of 8Hours@0,2C instead of the recommended 16Hours@0,1C.

These are my settings:

Mode=Cycle
CycleWay=D>C
CycleCount=3
C.Current=0,2C
D.Current=0,2C
EndChargeVolt:1,65V
EndDischargeVolt=0,9V
ChargeRestTime=20 Minutes
DischargeRestTime=10 Minutes

The Problem is, that the -deltaU Termination does not work correctly with a C.Current below 0,3C......
To match the Termination of the charge process at 1,6C, i have to set the CAPACITY to 1,6C or the TimeProtection to 8 hours.
When i use one of these two settings, the whole Cycle Program terminates when one of these values matches (there is no second Cycle).

What should i do, that the Charger can match my Requirements?
Sorry for my English, but i hope you can understand my Feature Request.


Regards
Christian

Please sera first page of this thread, link to Idea oncapacitynext

 

[Ravel]

Hi @All,
At Home i have some old NiMh/NiCd Accus (no LSD) and i want to check, refresh and reform them.
To save some time, i decided to use the mode "Cycle" with a C.Current of 8Hours@0,2C instead of the recommended 16Hours@0,1C.

Christian

See Re: Crystal removal in old NiMH batteries http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?336590-Crystal-removal-in-old-NiMH-batteries

IMHO, it seems that for OLD you will either revive them after 1 to 3 cycles,
I mean back to prestine state, that is lucky to have performance > 80% than their initial capacity,
and the baterry would charge and stop normally on dV criterion alone.

OR, you will revive them (1 to 3 cycles also), to the so-called CRAP state, see in the forum,
but many cycles will not lead to lots (or any much) improvement.
Batteries will be functionnal though with capacity <80% and sometimes/often the only way to charge them
without overcharging is to work on a capacity cut criterion.

I have as example a set of 4 AA NiMH 2300 mAh
They work reliably on a charge of 1400 mAh (any more and this gets lost while charging and would probably damage further the AA)

Try to discharge your lot and charge them to half capacity, and give us the internal resistance of those baterries
(+ all details of wahth they are, brands, capacity, model), and even better an internal resistance of a not so old
comparable batterie. One may tell you if they are near busted.

You want to save time : maybe not always feasible (cycles implementation seems ok only for good baterries)
See also my previous post

Also not even sure you are goinf the right way by ''reforming by going 1,6 C''
Cycling full - empty - full may be enough, see the link at the top of this post

 

[hahoo]

Re: 2nd gen dreamcharger presented on IFA Berlin 2014…

ok, so i bit the bullet and got one of these today
so far not too bad figuring it out
your not going to do it in 1 night, thats for sure!
only let down was the 1 amp max discharge , with 4 18650s
i was thinking it was 2 amp
oh well
the 3 amp charge for 4, 18650s is what sold me on it mostly
ive got a pile of 3500mah, SANYO NCR18650GA batteries to run thru this thing
what would you guys consider a safe charge rate on these?
can i max it out at 3amp per channel and be ok, doing 4 of them at a time ?
also, what should i set my low volts for when discharging, around 3 volts or so?

 

[ninjasmoke]

Re: 2nd gen dreamcharger presented on IFA Berlin 2014…

ok, so i bit the bullet and got one of these today
so far not too bad figuring it out
your not going to do it in 1 night, thats for sure!
only let down was the 1 amp max discharge , with 4 18650s
i was thinking it was 2 amp
oh well
the 3 amp charge for 4, 18650s is what sold me on it mostly
ive got a pile of 3500mah, SANYO NCR18650GA batteries to run thru this thing
what would you guys consider a safe charge rate on these?
can i max it out at 3amp per channel and be ok, doing 4 of them at a time ?
also, what should i set my low volts for when discharging, around 3 volts or so?

I would recommend that you go to this website and find out all of the data on your battery first and it will give you all the information you asked for.

http://lygte-info.dk/review/batteries2012/Common18650comparator.php

 

[kreisl]

Re: 2nd gen dreamcharger presented on IFA Berlin 2014…

ok, so i bit the bullet and got one of these today
so far not too bad figuring it out
your not going to do it in 1 night, thats for sure!
only let down was the 1 amp max discharge , with 4 18650s
i was thinking it was 2 amp
oh well
the 3 amp charge for 4, 18650s is what sold me on it mostly
ive got a pile of 3500mah, SANYO NCR18650GA batteries to run thru this thing
what would you guys consider a safe charge rate on these?
can i max it out at 3amp per channel and be ok, doing 4 of them at a time ?
also, what should i set my low volts for when discharging, around 3 volts or so?

4 18650 is 1 amp max discharge, 1 18650 is 2 amp max discharge
it is ok (for the device) to max it out at 3amp per channel, doing 4 of them at a time
i would not charge ncrga with 3 amp or r u in such a hurry tonight
why do you want to discharge? to determine max capacity you can set your low volts to 2.50V
3 volts is too conservative, flashlights also discharge below 3.00V
can i use my smartphone as screen for raspi 3B through bluetooth 4.1 (BLE) or does it have to be wlan?

 

[doctordun]

Re: 2nd gen dreamcharger presented on IFA Berlin 2014…

Placed my order with GearBest two days ago. Not a moment too soon. Website shows out of stock now.

Any experience on how long the order might take before I get it here in Texas?

 

[hahoo]

Re: 2nd gen dreamcharger presented on IFA Berlin 2014…

just got this last night , trying to get the software to run to no avail...
the pc monitor from skyrc does nothing when i try to run it
says fw version 1.10 on my machine, do i need to update it to make the software run?

tx for the help

 

[Kuhl0040]

Hi,

I just bought the MC3000 from gearbest.com and am getting an Unhandled exception error when using your PC link software. I have tried the soft reset but the that does not work. Any thoughts?

See the end of this message for details on invoking
just-in-time (JIT) debugging instead of this dialog box.

************** Exception Text **************
System.NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object.
at usb_loader_host.FormLoader.timer3_Tick(Object sender, EventArgs e)
at System.Windows.Forms.Timer.OnTick(EventArgs e)
at System.Windows.Forms.Timer.TimerNativeWindow.WndProc(Message& m)
at System.Windows.Forms.NativeWindow.Callback(IntPtr hWnd, Int32 msg, IntPtr wparam, IntPtr lparam)


************** Loaded Assemblies **************
mscorlib
Assembly Version: 4.0.0.0
Win32 Version: 4.6.1586.0 built by: NETFXREL2
CodeBase: file:///C:/Windows/Microsoft.NET/Framework/v4.0.30319/mscorlib.dll
----------------------------------------
MC3000_Monitor
Assembly Version: 1.0.0.0
Win32 Version: 1.0.0.0
CodeBase: file:///C:/Users/tyler/Desktop/MC3000_Monitor.exe
----------------------------------------
System.Windows.Forms
Assembly Version: 4.0.0.0
Win32 Version: 4.6.1586.0 built by: NETFXREL2
CodeBase: file:///C:/WINDOWS/Microsoft.Net/assembly/GAC_MSIL/System.Windows.Forms/v4.0_4.0.0.0__b77a5c561934e089/System.Windows.Forms.dll
----------------------------------------
System
Assembly Version: 4.0.0.0
Win32 Version: 4.6.1586.0 built by: NETFXREL2
CodeBase: file:///C:/WINDOWS/Microsoft.Net/assembly/GAC_MSIL/System/v4.0_4.0.0.0__b77a5c561934e089/System.dll
----------------------------------------
System.Drawing
Assembly Version: 4.0.0.0
Win32 Version: 4.6.1586.0 built by: NETFXREL2
CodeBase: file:///C:/WINDOWS/Microsoft.Net/assembly/GAC_MSIL/System.Drawing/v4.0_4.0.0.0__b03f5f7f11d50a3a/System.Drawing.dll
----------------------------------------
System.Configuration
Assembly Version: 4.0.0.0
Win32 Version: 4.6.1586.0 built by: NETFXREL2
CodeBase: file:///C:/WINDOWS/Microsoft.Net/assembly/GAC_MSIL/System.Configuration/v4.0_4.0.0.0__b03f5f7f11d50a3a/System.Configuration.dll
----------------------------------------
System.Core
Assembly Version: 4.0.0.0
Win32 Version: 4.6.1586.0 built by: NETFXREL2
CodeBase: file:///C:/WINDOWS/Microsoft.Net/assembly/GAC_MSIL/System.Core/v4.0_4.0.0.0__b77a5c561934e089/System.Core.dll
----------------------------------------
System.Xml
Assembly Version: 4.0.0.0
Win32 Version: 4.6.1586.0 built by: NETFXREL2
CodeBase: file:///C:/WINDOWS/Microsoft.Net/assembly/GAC_MSIL/System.Xml/v4.0_4.0.0.0__b77a5c561934e089/System.Xml.dll
----------------------------------------

************** JIT Debugging **************
To enable just-in-time (JIT) debugging, the .config file for this
application or computer (machine.config) must have the
jitDebugging value set in the system.windows.forms section.
The application must also be compiled with debugging
enabled.

For example:

<configuration>
<system.windows.forms jitDebugging="true" />
</configuration>

When JIT debugging is enabled, any unhandled exception
will be sent to the JIT debugger registered on the computer
rather than be handled by this dialog box.




Thanks, Tyler

 

[kreisl]

Re: 2nd gen dreamcharger presented on IFA Berlin 2014…

Placed my order with GearBest two days ago. Not a moment too soon. Website shows out of stock now.

Gearbest webpage shows in stock for me :thumbsup:
As a shopper from the States i would buy the charger from a US dealer, the prices are competitive.

just got this last night , trying to get the software to run to no avail...
the pc monitor from skyrc does nothing when i try to run it
says fw version 1.10 on my machine, do i need to update it to make the software run?

No, you don't need to update your machine to make the software run.
In fact, if the software doesn't run, then it means there is no established data line between charger and computer, and in such a case it would be dangerous to try to update the machine. That's why the instructions for the update include this procedure.

I just bought the MC3000 from gearbest.com and am getting an Unhandled exception error when using your PC link software. I have tried the soft reset but the that does not work. Any thoughts?

Fyi no external driver needs to be installed, once you connect the charger with the Windows PC (e.g. WinXP SP3 or Win7 with .NET Framework 4.0) the necessary driver is installed internally/automatically and it is recognized as USB-HID in the device manager.
Also see section Error Message in the printed instruction manual.

The Problem is, that the -deltaU Termination does not work correctly with a C.Current below 0,3C......
To match the Termination of the charge process at 1,6C, i have to set the CAPACITY to 1,6C or the TimeProtection to 8 hours.
When i use one of these two settings, the whole Cycle Program terminates when one of these values matches (there is no second Cycle).

You can try to set DELTA PEAK to 0dV and test this setting with one of your NiMH batteries at 0.2C. But seriously, even Maha recommends charging at no lower than 0.3C, although the MH-C9000 uses voltage termination: when you feed an ever so small current to a NiMH battery, the battery will eventually get fully charged but its peak voltage level will be lower than at a higher rate, also due to the Batt IR. This phenomenon is different from LiIon charging where the peak voltage level is always around 4.2V no matter how fast or slow you charge, given the same 50mA TERMINATION current.
Your feature suggestion has been discussed before and it may stay on de list. Afaik there are currently no plans to implement something like OnCapacityNext. And what about OnCutTimeNext and OnCutTempNext and all the other possible Error Messages intended for abnormal program termination inherited from hobby chargers all of which terminate programs at the CUT condition? Btw there are charge capacities and there are discharge capacities. So you want OnChargeCapacityNext or OnDischargeCapacityNext, or do you want both separately, or do you want OnEitherCapacityNext? This makes it 4 clear choices and whatever you choose, the choice can't satisfy/please/be liked etc etc
Hmm, i see my two points

You could also send your feature suggestion directly to sky, they might reply with a :shrug:-smiley though gg

 

[cpa]

Hello...

I'm thinking to buying a MC3000, but I have a question.
There is a settings database or webpage/app for battery brand and model??

I mean, I have a Panasonic 18650B 3400mA and I would like to know the "best" typical settings for it, or I have an Amazon Basic AA NiH 2400mA and I want to know what is the typical settings for it....

A place of database where the users can share his configurations....

Thanks in advance, and sorry if this has been treated before (I've read until 130 page)...:sigh:

 

[Kuhl0040]

Re: 2nd gen dreamcharger presented on IFA Berlin 2014…

Fyi no external driver needs to be installed, once you connect the charger with the Windows PC (e.g. WinXP SP3 or Win7 with .NET Framework 4.0) the necessary driver is installed internally/automatically and it is recognized as USB-HID in the device manager.

Yeah it worked one time where it connected to the PC Link software, but now I cannot get it to connect again and it just gives the same error. I am able to get it to sporadically connect to DataExplorer but not reliably. Is it possible to do a hard reset? I am at a loss at how to get it working, I have tried shutting down, restarting, but still can't get it to connect. Is there a certain order I need to plug things in?

Thanks!

 

[cpa]

A place of database where the users can share his configurations....

I meant "A place or database", it was a typo...

Also it would be useful that the app (DEX and PCLS) would have this functionality and you could choose the battery brand and type and automatically transfer the settings to the MC3000.

What do you think about that??...

 

[kreisl]

I meant "A place or database", it was a typo...

Also it would be useful that the app (DEX and PCLS) would have this functionality and you could choose the battery brand and type and automatically transfer the settings to the MC3000.

DEX produces 1 XML file with up to 30 program entries in coded format. It would be possible (and possibly some fun) to cut/paste the coded programs from XML file to forum post and vice versa. Still, that's work, working with databases, editing XML files, operating DEX, etc. And since many settings are optional, one cannot even recommend 1 set of settings over a different set. You can charge NCR-B with 50mA termination current or with 100mA, neither does harm to de battery. The settings are really up to the user's personal preference, so imho it makes little sense to create and share 1 public database because no matter which set of settings you propose, i could argue for a different set, just to make a point.

It makes sense though that everybody creates his own database with no more than 30 entries. DEX already does that with the 1 XML file. I call it 'Backup & Restore'.

 

[kreisl]

had a day or so to mess with it, and noticed that the 4th channel, slot, always runs several degrees cooler than the rest ?
any ideas on this, or any others that have this unit do the same?
maybe thats the slot closest to the fan?

amazing graph, thanks for sharing!
Does it say 96° Celsius for the battery? Must be a typo in the DEX graph, you could check the settings in DEX and in GSV, never mind.
Did you read the full manual? You can search for the term <temperature> in the PDF and read everything what the manual has to say about temperature and sensors. Imho the text is beautifully written and clear as Chinglish can be no offence

Btw there is some chance that your 4th slot sensor does not touch the metal stripe in the slot due to manufacturing tolerances. Even though the battery is warm, the sensor would then not register the battery heat properly because it is a millimeter too far away from battery. On my unit, i put extra thermal paste on the slot sensors to 100% bridge the distance between sensor and metal stripe. Lemme do a test with 4x Eneloop AA too and let's compare my DEX graph then, my pleasure.

Don't worry if your 4th slot sensor was soldered a millimeter too short and or not enough thermal paste was applied on it. But that should be the reason, not the relative location to the fan.

 

[kreisl]

Re: 2nd gen dreamcharger presented on IFA Berlin 2014…

Yeah it worked one time where it connected to the PC Link software, but now I cannot get it to connect again and it just gives the same error. I am able to get it to sporadically connect to DataExplorer but not reliably. Is it possible to do a hard reset? I am at a loss at how to get it working, I have tried shutting down, restarting, but still can't get it to connect. Is there a certain order I need to plug things in?

Since your system experiences connection problems, you cannot reinstall the FW1.13 (which could be called "hard reset" in a specific sense but it is NOT a genuine hard reset in the original sense!), because if during the reinstallation you lose the connection, your device will be bricked. Do NOT touch a running system!

You should try to connect the charger to a different PC, preferably a PC with freshly installed WinXP SP3 or Win7 SP1. And most importantly, try another USB data cable. I have about 10 USB cables squirrelling around in my home and guess what, only 3 cables are usable for the MC3000<->PC connection.

Order in which i connect things:
1) PC is running. All Bluetooth connections are OFF. Bluetooth and DEX (or PCLS) cannot run at the same time
2) charger is powered up
3) i connect PREMIUM USB DATA CABLE (DO NOT USE A USB CHARGE CABLE!!!) first to charger
4) then to PC
5) then i launch DEX (or PCLS)

 

[samgab]

Re: 2nd gen dreamcharger presented on IFA Berlin 2014…

My channel 4 always runs about 2 degrees C lower than the other channels, but it tracks parallel. Doesn't bother me, it's not a lab grade instrument and I can account for the -2 deg C delta on ch4.