Survival LED Flashlight Testing.

Woods Walker

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I have been working on finding the best (for me) survival flashlight which IMHO is different from EDC or Prepping. Aw heck who am I kidding. This is really just another excuse to spend money, use gear and run through the dark dank woods with a pack. What's the downside here? For survival only the most trusted kit will do. Then again if in a bad way would gladly take whatever was available but that goes without saying. Working up a list of requirements but first need a good baseline. Runtimes, tint, output, battery type, voltage range, modes, beam pattern etc etc etc are all factors to consider.


To start this I am going to compare two possible options. In this case I am not really testing the hosts rather the engines. They both go into either light. To get a baseline before working out the requirements I need to check a few things out. Does higher output really matter as much as one might expect. Does tint really matter? There are many other factors but can't consider them all at the same time. Best to review multiple gear options over multiple tests.


So lets GO!


The setup is ideal to cover a few topics. Heavy rain and thunderstorms has flooded the woods. The dramatic temperature change will probably produce fog in the hills. It's going to be dark, dank and foggy. First the overall preference of a flashlight to headlamp during foggy conditions will be tested and what effect if any does tint really have? Is less light really a negative in these conditions? So here are two lights which should work fine. They're also two considerations for the best (for me) survival light.


1. Surefire C2 with Malkoff M61LL Cool White. The gray one.


2. Malkoff MD2 with M61N. The black one.








The woods. This is a section of little used blue trail. Basically I haven't seen anyone hiking this stretch for years though is maintained at least once year near as I can tell. Maybe had one actual encounter with another person and they were surprised to see me. It's not in the middle of the Congo rather there just isn't easy or obvious access unless you know the town very very well or are willing to walk for some hard miles from a dirt parking lot which even then is actually down a little used dirt road. Also got bears. LOL! No seriously but they're ok! Basically I can fly down it without really worrying about bumping into another person. Also nice to keep the fantasy alive as fun is really what this is all about.





It's now dark so game on. Up first MD2. The output is around 300 lumens but can't hold that forever. Runtimes are another factor but that's not on my plate for today. The tint is neutral white. The fog was thick in some areas and as elevation changed would thin out only to get thick again.





I am moving at about 5 mpr and intend to do this for maybe 5 miles total however taking photos etc will slow me down. Also at times it was just too slippery. In no way would I do this if actually lost. Why? Because there are things looking to do me harm. Water, mud and rocks are all over the place. A mechanical injury would really complicate things.





The 300 lumens made trail markers easy to see despite the wide floody beam of this engine. Pros and cons to this beam profile.





Also fallen branches from the storm.





Nope not a brook, rather the trail because of excessive water runoff. Had to slow down on this section.





Dang. It was getting harder to see father away when pushing through the thicker fog. Anyone remember the movie...The Fog. The owls were acting up which is always fun.





Time to change pitchers.





100 cool white lumens. Noticed the output reduction but started back on the test.





Things really came up on me fast so had to slow down a bit. The reduction in lumens did have some effect but I was still moving forward kinda the same. What's a mpr less among friends?





As stated there are things looking to do me harm which I want to see and avoid going under or over. I went around. Nature isn't for or against anyone. It just is.





Still saw the trail markers though had to be a bit closer (goes without saying) however 200 less lumens wasn't really all that bad. I mean the extra output was missed but not by an extreme measure. Why the trail marker tests? Not getting lost in the first place makes the entire survival situation much less likely. Seems getting lost or getting hurt are the two primary prerequisites. Cutting one's odds in 1/2 off the top is sure worth testing IMHO.





Testing observations.


1. Based on this and other countless miles on foot in about every condition possible tint was less of a factor even within the fog, rain, snow etc etc. Personally I like NW better but bottom line they both got me back to the truck and have done so over and over again be it Warm, HCRI or Cool White. Pleasing or sucky the end results were always the same. Sure I think a less blue shifted tint makes seeing blue and white blazes easier in certain backgrounds but still in the end the job always got done. Within the context of a survival LED flashlight I am pushing this consideration lower on the list.


2. For moving around more lumens might not give enough of a benefit when their cost in runtimes are considered.


3. Yup a flashlight is better than headlamp in the fog. Too much glare. Had a headlamp on me as well and it was harder to use in these conditions but already knew that from experience.


So that's it for today's testing. Will do more updates to this thread and remember these are just my observations for my conditions. Your mileage might vary.
 
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cp2315

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Re: Suvival LED Flashlight Testing.

Thanks for sharing!
I wonder if you could see better in the fog with a warm light like incandescent, stock 6P with 16650 or bored 6P with 18650.
 

wjv

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Re: Suvival LED Flashlight Testing.

For survival purposes I'd also consider having a very low low for reading maps and such without attracting attention, and also waterproofness.
 

redvalkyrie

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Re: Suvival LED Flashlight Testing.

Maybe I missed it...but how did you get 300 lumen from a M61NL? Malkoff rates those as 160 lumen with a five hour runtime.

Habe you considered going to a full power M61 and using a hi/lo ring where you dn't need max power? Or a M361?
 

Woods Walker

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Re: Suvival LED Flashlight Testing.

Maybe I missed it...but how did you get 300 lumen from a M61NL? Malkoff rates those as 160 lumen with a five hour runtime.

Habe you considered going to a full power M61 and using a hi/lo ring where you dn't need max power? Or a M361?

Typo. Meant to say M61n. Will update post.

edt post corrected. Seems like no matter how many times I read something I still make mistakes that said also own a M61NL in a G2Z. The MD2 has a M61N with High/Low ring.
 
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Woods Walker

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Re: Suvival LED Flashlight Testing.

Thanks for sharing!
I wonder if you could see better in the fog with a warm light like incandescent, stock 6P with 16650 or bored 6P with 18650.
I used an incan P60 for years but runtimes were too low.
 

Woods Walker

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Re: Suvival LED Flashlight Testing.

For survival purposes I'd also consider having a very low low for reading maps and such without attracting attention, and also waterproofness.
For the next test I am going to compare flood vs throw for use in walking through the brush, cross steams plus near tasks including map reading and firecraft. But here is something. I actually got lost on the trail once at night and don't remember needing to turn down my light to a very very low level to properly read the map but will test this again. For me the map and compass was not all that great at night but still useful. Really it was like having book in a bottle of ink aka no land marks. It was good for the blaze as would at least know where a trail might go if picking up a new colored marker. Also was nice to help speculate when crossing steams and roads as these were major things that could be seen at near range then compared to the map. As for attracting attention IMHO that's ideal as this is kinda the opposite of an E&E.
 

Lumencrazy

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Re: Suvival LED Flashlight Testing.

Excellent post. Buying a flashlight for serious use in the wilderness vs sitting on a couch collecting lumens are two very different worlds. High-lumen battery burners are not survival/camping tools. My neutral white and high CRI Armytek and Zebralight headlamps are rarely used above 165 lumens and the battery seems to last forever. Waking up in the middle of the night, even a 0.2 Lumen setting is sufficient to get around inside a pitch black tent without loosing your night vision.
 
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Need a Light?

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Largely day vs. night use is what determines what I use. If I'm carrying a light during day, it's probably got at least 4-500 lumens in a turbo, just because looking under something in a brightly lit room is better served by as much light as you can get.

Nighttime however, my light of choice is a G2 with a 3.7v xenon and a ur16650zta unprotected, which has proven to be a very winning combo. The 4.35v chemistry helps keep the output white and ~2500mah means it'll run for almost 1.5hrs at the measured 1.8A draw. Less than 100 lumens, plenty for most uses.

It's pretty amazing how adaptable our little collection of light absorbing cells are.
 

Woods Walker

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So decided on these two for the flood vs throw. Same tint and battery. Major difference is the beam profile.



Will do several survival related tasks including crossing a stream, firecraft and bushwacking off trail to see which beam is overall best. Also did a little work for the MD2 based on the results of the last test.



The drop-in from the C2 got it's own MDX head and hi/lo mode ring for use on the MDX host. 100 lumens high rather than 300. The low is the same.



 

Woods Walker

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Re: Suvival LED Flashlight Testing.

Excellent post. Buying a flashlight for serious use in the wilderness vs sitting on a couch collecting lumens are two very different worlds. High-lumen battery burners are not survival/camping tools. My neutral white and high CRI Armytek and Zebralight headlamps are rarely used above 165 lumens and the battery seems to last forever. Waking up in the middle of the night, even a 0.2 Lumen setting is sufficient to get around inside a pitch black tent without loosing your night vision.

Agreed.

I hardly ever use the upper modes as well. Low gets used often around camp.
 

Hooked on Fenix

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Re: Suvival LED Flashlight Testing.

For a survival situation, I'm staying put and setting up camp so I don't freeze at night. A survival situation means I'm already lost. No need to make it worse. Navigation happens during the day when I can see (other than locating the North Star and marking it's direction on the ground in camp). Bright settings are reserved for signalling when I hear people, cars, or aircraft at night. You'll use a medium setting (20-50 lumens) the most for setting up camp, collecting firewood, cooking and clean up, and making tools and gear from the environment (spears from sticks, rope from plant fibers, animal traps from sticks, etc.). Conserving your resources is important in survival as you don't know how long you'll be out in the woods alone. My favorite survival light is my Quark Pro 2A. I know you can't get it anymore but it works for me. Several hundred hours on the sub lumen low. Several days on low. Over 20 hours on medium (over 20 lumens). It goes up to around 250 lumens and has strobe and SOS for signalling. It also works with AA lithiums which have the best cold weather tolerance of any battery.
 
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wjv

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Re: Suvival LED Flashlight Testing.

My favorite survival light is my Quark Pro 2A. I know you can't get it anymore but it works for me...... It also works with AA lithiums which have the best cold weather tolerance of any battery.

And it's easy to carry an extra 4-8 batteries without taking up much space, or adding much weight.
 

jon_slider

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The owls were acting up which is always fun.




Yup a flashlight is better than headlamp in the fog.

Love seeing pics of your nightventures, and hearing your impressions
Looks like the Owls were not spotted <g>
 
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INFRNL

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Great stuff Woods; I always like seeing your tests and night run pics.

I would have thought the neutral would provide better view in fog. Maybe there was not enough difference in tint. as mentioned by someone else, maybe a warm tint would be better (at least for fog) This is why the old fog lights were are amber or yellow(now we just have driving lights which I don't think are as effective) The amber/yellow fog lights always worked very well in fog, rain, snow; the same should apply here but then you most likely have a loss in overall viewing compared to a neutral/cw.

Thanks for sharing as always
 

BloodLust

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Great post! I used to just bring my G2 incan as my spotlight when camping. Way back when 65 lumens was "wow"!
I'm in the market for a neutral to warm light and was thinking of a neutral Malkoff drop-in or just get a 219b light.

Was the beam profile that much of a factor? My headlamp has a flip-up diffuser so that may generally be sufficient fro flnod and throw.
Would you say that a high output wide throw warm/neutral would be ideal?
 

Woods Walker

The Wood is cut, The Bacon is cooked, Now it’s tim
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Re: Suvival LED Flashlight Testing.

For a survival situation, I'm staying put and setting up camp so I don't freeze at night. A survival situation means I'm already lost. No need to make it worse. Navigation happens during the day when I can see (other than locating the North Star and marking it's direction on the ground in camp). Bright settings are reserved for signalling when I hear people, cars, or aircraft at night. You'll use a medium setting (20-50 lumens) the most for setting up camp, collecting firewood, cooking and clean up, and making tools and gear from the environment (spears from sticks, rope from plant fibers, animal traps from sticks, etc.). Conserving your resources is important in survival as you don't know how long you'll be out in the woods alone. My favorite survival light is my Quark Pro 2A. I know you can't get it anymore but it works for me. Several hundred hours on the sub lumen low. Several days on low. Over 20 hours on medium (over 20 lumens). It goes up to around 250 lumens and has strobe and SOS for signalling. It also works with AA lithiums which have the best cold weather tolerance of any battery.

I am all about the Quark and 4/7. A 1XAA mini on a headband helped me avoid stepping on this bundle of joy miles from no place.



Worn like this.



Same light after Irene decided power was an overrated commodity for a week.





Have a 1XCR123 Quark in one of my kits with a 1XAA body. In fact just bought a tactical version not too long ago. But there is a story...isn't there always...

It was deep cold and was out screwing around with stuff. You know how it is.













I got distracted with the woods.





Headlamp batteries froze but the CR123 in the Quark was just fine. The AAs were good in the camera but once out of my inner pocket knew they wouldn't last long. It was kinda cold.



So Quarks and Minis have been there when needed. Which brings up another point. Sometimes I need to go and not stay. The Quark made it easy to find the larger well used trail back.



The bad situation avoided beats the one overcome by a long shot. Kinda like having a GPS, map and compass, poncho or extra cash in the wallet. The old 4/7 lights have been reliable but probably not as durable as say Malkoff. Still a flashlight doesn't always have to be a brick so long as it works.
 

Woods Walker

The Wood is cut, The Bacon is cooked, Now it’s tim
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New England woods.
Great post! I used to just bring my G2 incan as my spotlight when camping. Way back when 65 lumens was "wow"!
I'm in the market for a neutral to warm light and was thinking of a neutral Malkoff drop-in or just get a 219b light.

Was the beam profile that much of a factor? My headlamp has a flip-up diffuser so that may generally be sufficient fro flnod and throw.
Would you say that a high output wide throw warm/neutral would be ideal?
Years ago I got turned around. Had a headlamp, maybe a PT Aurora with those angry blue dim 5MM....DS... I forget but they were very space alien abduction angry blue. Used the P60 in my G2Z (which in the future got a P60L then M60LL and finally M61NL) to spot light my way to someone's backyard who then called the police. I guess it was the owner cuz the cops picked me up a bit down the road. They were ok and drove me back to the trail head. I have a few 219b lights and don't consider the tint neutral or warm. Also question if the reduction in output is worth it for the outside. It looks great when people show red stuff, color charts etc etc etc on the forums but in the woods it's kinda just another LED. Not bad and I do like it but for pure biz I am not sold the hit in performance is worth it. However it's still light and clearly does the job. Used a 219b lantern this weekend for extended use. Yup I seen stuff in the dark. LOL! I didn't get around to comparing the flood vs throw thing yet. Malkoff M61/31 beam pattern works great for actually doing stuff and moving around but if a dedicated thrower is what yea want the M61/31 isn't it. Good general purpose beam though.
 
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