575w HMI flashlight

danthexenonorc · Mar 3, 2017

Hello all, any help on this topic would be deeply appreciated, thank you for your time!

I am in the process of making a 575w HMI (Hydrargyrum Medium-arc Iodide lamp) flashlight, but I would like some help on some questions I have regarding the ballast/power supply. The bulb I will be using is a Osram 575w HMI lamp. The batteries will be eight 5.5 ampere at 4s LiPos, with a total of 633 Wh. I plan to use a parabolic reflector which a I scored off of Ebay just 4 years ago as a 550w xenon locator. The reflector was manufactured by Optical Radiation Corporation in Azusa California(my favorite lamp supply manufacturer), and is 6 ¼ inches in diameter. So this is where my two questions for you incredibly intelligible flashlight freaks comes in; can I use a Nanolux 600w Mh ballast to run the HMI, and if not, what could I use as an alternative. This would help me incredibly. I have seen some people use a 600w Mh ballast to run a 575w HMI just fine, but other say that they tried it and it would work for 30 seconds, then it would flicker and turn off. Also, I am running a 800w inverter off of the 633 Wh worth of LiPos in order to power the Nanolux digital ballast. The operating voltage of the HMI is about 95v at 7a. The ballast provides around 120v, is this ok for the HMI? Will this setup even work?
~Danilo Rosich

P.S. I will post some pictures of the reflector this weekend, and pictures of the lamp, batteries, and inverter once they come.

FRITZHID · Mar 3, 2017

I'm curious as well... i personally follow the "why ask when testing is so much more fun" method but i understand that style can get costly,... fast. lol
imho, builds like this are cool and all but i hate the inverter losses and such in a man portable unit.

danthexenonorc · Mar 3, 2017

FRITZHID said:
I'm curious as well... i personally follow the "why ask when testing is so much more fun" method but i understand that style can get costly,... fast. lol
imho, builds like this are cool and all but i hate the inverter losses and such in a man portable unit.

I am testing. I ordered all of the parts and hope that it works. The parts should come by March 8th. Until then I can only hope for the best. And if this setup works, I plan to build a power supply that works directly off of the batteries to eliminate inverter losses, but for now the prototype will have an inverter.

-Danilo Rosich

danthexenonorc · Mar 4, 2017

A question arose whilst building the light, do HMI lamps have a specific polarity?

PolarLi · Mar 4, 2017

HMI are AC lamps, so no.
Regarding the ballast question, I'm not sure if the MH ballast will work. The over wattage isn't the issue, but I believe the MH lamps runs on higher voltage (to the lamp) than HMI, but don't quote me on that.

danthexenonorc · Mar 4, 2017

PolarLi said:
HMI are AC lamps, so no.
Regarding the ballast question, I'm not sure if the MH ballast will work. The over wattage isn't the issue, but I believe the MH lamps runs on higher voltage (to the lamp) than HMI, but don't quote me on that.

Yes, I believe that they run about 20v higher, which is not perfect, but possible for just one test run. But does anybody know how to make a magnetic ballast transformer. I am looking into designing amd building one that starts with a higher voltage, but when the lamp is connester, drops down to maintain the 6a at 95vvrequirement for the HMI. I tried running it off of the mh ballast at 400w, and when it started to near full brightness, the arc began flickering wildly and extinguished after 30 seconds of this. So if anybody knows how to build a proper choke inductor for the current or why the arc started flickering, please respond. I am posting a video on me running this lamp off of the mh ballast shortly, will be linked in this forum.

A_L_R_O_M · Mar 4, 2017

danthexenonorc said:
Yes, I believe that they run about 20v higher, which is not perfect, but possible for just one test run. But does anybody know how to make a magnetic ballast transformer. I am looking into designing amd building one that starts with a higher voltage, but when the lamp is connester, drops down to maintain the 6a at 95vvrequirement for the HMI. I tried running it off of the mh ballast at 400w, and when it started to near full brightness, the arc began flickering wildly and extinguished after 30 seconds of this. So if anybody knows how to build a proper choke inductor for the current or why the arc started flickering, please respond. I am posting a video on me running this lamp off of the mh ballast shortly, will be linked in this forum.

You should put the clamp multimeter to measure the AC current, and the other one to measure voltage ( parallel to the lamp).
Do that in a safe way, only after ingition.

I did that before, i was running UHP bulbs using magnetic ballast.
And i actually tried to dim MH(not UHP) bulbs using TRIAC dimmer, attached in series before ballast.
And it caused the same issues, i played with 75W MH bulb driving it with 250W ballast and 400W ballast, and i was able to dim it, but just before pressure inside caused internal resistance to raise and caused voltage increase. At that time any dimming using Triac caused extreme flickering, unstable arc and failure.
I discovered that if you doing that very carefully, slowly adjusting the voltage you can dim it, but there was another experiment that caused triac to die and some electroshock from ignition 5kV circuit, since the ballast was not handling good those pulses, if i touch the metall shield - there is a risk of electric shock.

P.S I was able to drive the UHP mercury bulbs using magnetic MH ballast 400W and 250W, there was absolutelly no problems, just 400W was too much for the 200W mercury bulb
But i was not able to stabilize the arc inside 75W MH bulb using 250W and 400W magnetic ballasts, even if the dimming was possible during start up phase.
I believe that amount of current was just too much, and extreme heating raised the pressure inside arc chamber, so there was not enough of voltage to stabilize the arc. I should try to use 380 AC power line to power up the ballast, and see what will happen, but only for experiment, magnetic ballasts are just heavy and kinda useless in flashlights, unless it's only the way to power up your flashlights.

danthexenonorc · Mar 4, 2017

A_L_R_O_M said:
You should put the clamp multimeter to measure the AC current, and the other one to measure voltage ( parallel to the lamp).
Do that in a safe way, only after ingition.

I did that before, i was running UHP bulbs using magnetic ballast.
And i actually tried to dim MH(not UHP) bulbs using TRIAC dimmer, attached in series before ballast.
And it caused the same issues, i played with 75W MH bulb driving it with 250W ballast and 400W ballast, and i was able to dim it, but just before pressure inside caused internal resistance to raise and caused voltage increase. At that time any dimming using Triac caused extreme flickering, unstable arc and failure.
I discovered that if you doing that very carefully, slowly adjusting the voltage you can dim it, but there was another experiment that caused triac to die and some electroshock from ignition 5kV circuit, since the ballast was not handling good those pulses, if i touch the metall shield - there is a risk of electric shock.

P.S I was able to drive the UHP mercury bulbs using magnetic MH ballast 400W and 250W, there was absolutelly no problems, just 400W was too much for the 200W mercury bulb
But i was not able to stabilize the arc inside 75W MH bulb using 250W and 400W magnetic ballasts, even if the dimming was possible during start up phase.
I believe that amount of current was just too much, and extreme heating raised the pressure inside arc chamber, so there was not enough of voltage to stabilize the arc. I should try to use 380 AC power line to power up the ballast, and see what will happen, but only for experiment, magnetic ballasts are just heavy and kinda useless in flashlights, unless it's only the way to power up your flashlights.

Here is a like to a video of me running the light off of the ballast https://youtu.be/GqUrPGq7RYU . I measured the voltage and found it to be about 140v ac, with peaks of almost 170v!! This is unacceptable when compared to the rated 95v.

A_L_R_O_M · Mar 4, 2017

danthexenonorc said:
Here is a like to a video of me running the light off of the ballast https://youtu.be/GqUrPGq7RYU . I measured the voltage and found it to be about 140v ac, with peaks of almost 170v!! This is unacceptable when compared to the rated 95v.

I will answer on youtube!

danthexenonorc · Mar 5, 2017

So where could I find a hmi ballast cheaply, or how can I build on?

PolarLi · Mar 5, 2017

Keep an eye on "schiederwerk" on ebay. There has been several brand new electronic 575W HMI ballasts for sale there during the last year or so. I think they went for $110. You do need a separate igniter, so be sure you find that too.

danthexenonorc · Mar 5, 2017

Perfect, I found a ballast for $120 and an ignitor for $120. Which is a lot cheaper than buying it brand new for $450 from Schiederwerk. I returned the old ballast and got a full refund. My adventure with the 575w HMI light continues....

FRITZHID · Mar 5, 2017

danthexenonorc said:
Perfect, I found a ballast for $120 and an ignitor for $120. Which is a lot cheaper than buying it brand new for $450 from Schiederwerk. I returned the old ballast and got a full refund. My adventure with the 575w HMI light continues....

GL!

A_L_R_O_M · Mar 6, 2017

danthexenonorc said:
Perfect, I found a ballast for $120 and an ignitor for $120. Which is a lot cheaper than buying it brand new for $450 from Schiederwerk. I returned the old ballast and got a full refund. My adventure with the 575w HMI light continues....

I'm happy that you found!
I also did a search all over the ebay for the schiederwerk ballasts, i think the lack of the ballasts in my mind push me to buy any cheap good electronic ballast!

danthexenonorc · Mar 6, 2017

Yeah, I don't know if I was lucky or something, but as soon as PolarLi said that someone was selling it for $110, a listing popped up on ebay, with the exact ballast for $110. Is someone here in on it and put it up for sale, because you got me.

A_L_R_O_M · Mar 6, 2017

danthexenonorc said:
Yeah, I don't know if I was lucky or something, but as soon as PolarLi said that someone was selling it for $110, a listing popped up on ebay, with the exact ballast for $110. Is someone here in on it and put it up for sale, because you got me.

We are lucky enough, since God sending us such a nice people, so we can get knowledge from them, and we also became a knowledge filled people, who can help others.
It's looking simple to suggest some schiederwerk, rotec (PolarLI), but i know there can be a hours.... of searching, insane things, when you really want to find a solution suitable, i know how it feels, i spent a hundreds of hours to get forwarders/suppliers, speaking/searching/reading for some projects.
P.S May be it's really someone here who put this item on ebay just for you, that sounds kinda cool!

danthexenonorc · Mar 6, 2017

A_L_R_O_M said:
We are lucky enough, since God sending us such a nice people, so we can get knowledge from them, and we also became a knowledge filled people, who can help others.
It's looking simple to suggest some schiederwerk, rotec (PolarLI), but i know there can be a hours.... of searching, insane things, when you really want to find a solution suitable, i know how it feels, i spent a hundreds of hours to get forwarders/suppliers, speaking/searching/reading for some projects.
P.S May be it's really someone here who put this item on ebay just for you, that sounds kinda cool!

That would be really fantastic if they did. Anyways, all the parts will come on march 15th and assembling it will take a long time as well. And I dislike it as well when something as simple as a current controller can run you upwards of $550 without the housing, but thats what companies do when they know they have little to no competition on the market for the part and a relatively high demand, they over price it. :/

danthexenonorc · Mar 29, 2017

Ok guys. Sorry that is has been a while since I have posted, I have been busy with school and such. But I have finished the head of the flashlight, and just need to finish wiring the ballast. I have the dimmer and on switch wired, but need to finish the pwm controlled for the fans, amp meter, and power cable. I have pictures of what I have completed so far, and I have tested it out. It can make a surprisingly tight beam even with the HMI lamps large arc. The lamp I used was a 575w Osram UVS lamp, with 50,000 lumens that I managed to columnize. There is a volt/watt/KwH meter on the flashlight head, and also a dimmer switch that switches between full and ~300w, and also an on off switch. I mounted a blower to keep the reflector cool, as it can get incredibly hot. I handmade the handle from taking steel tubing, welding and grinding it down. The ballast is really lightweight, only 10 Lbs, and has 2 10500 rpm delta cooling fans mounted to a heatsink, which is attached to the flashlights heat dissipater. The parabolic reflector is an only Optical Radiation Corporation made in 1992, but originally made by Ushio in 1988. Overall I am really proud of this build and enjoy sharing it with you guys!

Here is a link to the Flickr with all of the photos: https://www.flickr.com/photos/149162507@N03/?

575w HMI flashlight

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