BATTERIES FOR "GO-BAG"?

I'll be keeping batteries in a flashlight (MH20) that will sit in my car on the hottest days and coldest nights that WV has to offer and might be years (except to top off charge) before i use it again. The light will run on 18650 or cr123 cells. I have 18650's but the cr123's are (from my research anyway) better suited for this type of storage.

"What are the best qaulity cr123's for this application?

These are the brands I recall as being some of the better ones; others can chime in and clarify.

Surefire
Streamlight
Panasonic

LEDAdd1ct said:

These are the brands I recall as being some of the better ones; others can chime in and clarify.

Surefire
Streamlight
Panasonic

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Anything made by Panasonic USA (~1550mAh), Panasonic Japan (~1550mAh), or Sanyo Japan (1400mAh) should be good.

Panasonic USA makes Battery Station, some Energizers (non-made in China), some Rayovacs (USA marked) and Duracell.

I think for the temperature extremes, these might be the way to go.

I'm in Miami, so I don't worry too much about freezing, or super hot climes.

Chris

Thanks for the suggestions!!! I thought there might be a certain type that was more suited to long term storage in a hot car than others. Seems like as long as I stick to a good brand then i shouldn't have any trouble using them in this manner correct?

I don't know about West Virginia, but here in Iowa I have registered temps above 140° F in a car sitting out in the sun for the day. Even if a cell is rated to be able to handle that temp, I wonder what it does to the cell's endurance? I wouldn't worry about the opposite, because cold just slows things down, and I doubt it gets down to -20° F where you live.

Also, it will make a difference where in the car you stow things. Under the front seat or in the center console would probably be the best spots. Since neither place will probably accept your complete Go Bag, you might want to move the batteries and/or light to a separate smaller pouch of some sort that can be attached to the main back, like with MOLLE clips. That way the small pouch can be placed in a hopefully cooler area, yet be quickly attached to the main bag without having to take the time to open it.

Let us know what you come up with, and any problems and solutions you come across.

Timothybil said:

I don't know about West Virginia, but here in Iowa I have registered temps above 140° F in a car sitting out in the sun for the day. Even if a cell is rated to be able to handle that temp, I wonder what it does to the cell's endurance? I wouldn't worry about the opposite, because cold just slows things down, and I doubt it gets down to -20° F where you live.

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Exactly on point. A car gets much hotter than the outside temps. I may have to dig into serious research on high temp degradation of primary lithium cells to come up with a solution that suits me. Your right in that it never gets super cold here (-14 is lowest i remember recently) but thats not very often, it is 0-30 most of the winter and i can keep the batteries close to body for some warmth if using them.

Also solid advice on where you store them. At the moment i keep my 18650's and other temp sensitive items in a cooler in the trunk, ( in a small molle compatible pouch nonetheless lol) and swap them out every month so they arent at the full voltage more than that amount of time. But would like something more simple and practical. I just worry i'll pull my 18650's out to use them one day and they'll be toast if i leave them in a pack in the car oven. Even with the swaps as above.

I'll for sure share any knowledge on a solution when i find one. Thats why I come here, to see if anyone has went through the same trials. Might be awhile though as i research heavily and dont come to conclusions easily. Would it be better to repost that info here or is there a better thread for things like prepper solutions for electronics?

I didn't realize you were talking about Li-Ion cells. I assumed LiFeS04 primary cells. Panasonic lists their CR123A cells at -40° to 70°C, which translates to -40° to 158°F.
Many years ago, I drove a Honda Civic CRX. [Loved that car!] It had as its storage compartment a small one in the middle on top of the dash, with a lid, of course. I happened to have received a sample of production temp test strips, which had a series of what looked like Hershey kisses on it, with each one slumping at a set temp. I had thrown it into that storage space when I got it. I had to park my car in the sun all day, and even with a windshield sun shade and a solar fan in the window, the 140° drop had slumped. I don't remember if it had A/C or not, but I know it was darned hot when I opened the door that afternoon. [And every day that week - the Grand Jury met for a week every month. If you have never been on a grand jury, it is an experience!]

No grand jury experience but i do know what a scorching car feels like. Might be similiar lol.

I like 18650's for the ability to use them with my powerbanks but dang its hard to think i'd spend good money (and time) on a cell then shove it in an environment that i know kills it! Do you think there is a better solution?

I've been meaning to check temps in different parts of the car at different times of the year to get an idea for conditions so it helps alot that u give good details (solar shade, fan...etc.) so THANKS!!

So far what im finding is some lithium chemistries are better at handling temperature extremes, still yet any 18650 stored in a hot car 140°F-160°F is gonna degrade not only electrode components but cause unrecoverable capacity loss. Storing at resting V helps but the whole point is to have fully charged cells when i need them! Cr123's are more tolerant of the temperatures but then again i cant run my 18650 powerbanks off of them, just the light!

So instead of trying to figure out a new battery or setup, im gonna spend the time on figuring out how to lower internal vehicle temps. and start testing some areas of the vehicle during different times to find the best storage solution. Which would also help all the other stuff that i leave in the car all the time (gps, chargers, lights, ammo, electronic measuring equipment, all the primaries i have for the other tools...etc.) since the 18650's are the cells that work best for me, I just gotta learn some more storage TLC.

Just a suggestion: Get a cheap thermometer that has an outdoor sensor, either corded or wireless. Put the sensor in the area that you are testing and leave it there for a day. The thermometer should have a high/low status display that will tell you the max temp of the remote sensor for that day.

Off the wall suggestion for storage: Get a good rigid wall cooler of whatever size needed. Add a layer of rigid styrofoam (1/2" or 1" or whatever), complete with a top piece inside the cooler. In effect, you are building an extra insulation box inside the cooler. Hopefully that will give enough extra protection to keep the highest temps away from whatever you put inside. Again, test with the above mentioned thermometer.

Timothybil said:

Just a suggestion: Get a cheap thermometer that has an outdoor sensor, either corded or wireless. Put the sensor in the area that you are testing and leave it there for a day. The thermometer should have a high/low status display that will tell you the max temp of the remote sensor for that day.

Off the wall suggestion for storage: Get a good rigid wall cooler of whatever size needed. Add a layer of rigid styrofoam (1/2" or 1" or whatever), complete with a top piece inside the cooler. In effect, you are building an extra insulation box inside the cooler. Hopefully that will give enough extra protection to keep the highest temps away from whatever you put inside. Again, test with the above mentioned thermometer.

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Great ideas!
Nothing is off the wall to me, i'm pretty far out there :tinfoil::lolsign:
I should have all that stuff laying around, i'll give it a shot once i get around to finding it lol!!

Speaking of far out!!! Your earlier post got my crazy ideas going and I was thinking of something like a large flat folding solar panel used like the sun shade on your beloved CRX windshield (those ARE rad cars!!). Then it should be big enough to run more fans, for ventilation, while shading the inside AND bein able to charge my 18650's, as well as whatever else is solar compatible!!!!!! Aint looked at how much that'll run me, but it sounds like a good idea on paper anyway!:sick2:

I just wonder how soon i'll get tired of putting a sun shade up (dont use one now)

Get one of the solar panels that folds up, and fasten it to a folding windshield shade, so you get the advantages of both. They are starting to sell the solar powered window fans again. When I had mine, (late 80s, early 90s) cars were just starting to come out with thicker doors that the current design wouldn't fit. I am starting to see them in some of the catalogs again, so I have to believe they have been redesigned for modern doors. Throw in a shade for the rear window, and a couple of those densely dotted clings for the rear side windows and it should make a difference.

I would think so too, didnt think about the clings:duh2:. Im hoping to keep it 130° or below during the hottest days. Kind of a lame time to do experiments on hot environments in cars when we just started winter lol. Starting to get a bit off topic though so im gonna close with this.

The extra solar shades and fans seem to be the most viable options for keeping a vehicle interior cooler. Im gonna look for a temp sensor that has hydrometer and barometer on it as well, then i can use it for more experiments on other locations lol!!

Conclusion: Don't put lithium rechargables in hot vehicles if you care about their longevity. Storing at max charge for extended periods is #1 and heat is #2 killers of most cells.

Also concluded: You can give Timothybil a bit of a hard time in another thread and he'll still come back to help you lol!! Thanks man!

GRAY LITNIN said:

Also concluded: You can give Timothybil a bit of a hard time in another thread and he'll still come back to help you lol!! Thanks man!

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I'm used to it. Been getting it all my life so what's new?

Timothybil said:

I'm used to it. Been getting it all my life so what's new?

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I knew with that avatar you'd be