Explain to me my options with Emisar lights?

hazna · Dec 31, 2017

I've been away from the flashlight scene for some time now, quite impressed at some of the improvements that have happened since I was previously active.

Was looking at the best flashlights of 2017 thread, and the Emisar lights seemed to come up a few times. They are also reasonably priced, so I'm interested...

Just wondering if someone could explain all the options available?

So there is the d1, d1s and d4? I assume in terms of throw d1s>d1>d4 , with the d4 being a more floody light? I think I prefer the more sleek profile of the d4. And then there is a the d4vn, which I assume is more throwy version in a d4 body? How does this compare to the d1 in throw?

Next question is the difference between the emitters. Nichia 219CT, XP-G2 S4, XP-L HI V3, XP-L HI V2 . In terms of max lumens, throwiness, runtimes, any artifacts in the beam? Is it still that the higher CRI and warmer tints have less max lumens than the cooler tints?

I see they recommend unprotected batteries. If so what is currently the "best" ones available (in both 18350 and 18650). Do I need IMR or standard li-ion okay. I assume IMR still has less capacity than the best li-ion?

KITROBASKIN · Dec 31, 2017

hazna said:
Just wondering if someone could explain all the options available.

Wow.

Do you have an application for your purchase? Might be simpler to tell us what your plans are for this light. Your questions just about encompass all the wonderful options in flashlight designs in this day-and-age (except for user interface).

Or are you looking for someone to give you copy for your blogspot?

ChrisGarrett · Dec 31, 2017

While Ven has bought me more lights over the recent years, than I have. I was good the last few months and bought a D4 219C in cyan, with the optional 18350 body. I also bought two Sony VTC-5A 18650s and two more Aspire 10A 1100mAh 18350s, from Li-Ion Wholesale, out of Pennsylvania, USA. I went with Hank over at International-Outdoors. The other guy selling them is on his honeymoon, evidently and working not the BLF GT light that everybody is buying.

The D4 is a bona fide pocket rocket, but it really needs specialty cells, since it can pull upwards of 15A-18A. It will heat up in turbo within seconds, so don't expect 3 minutes at ~3,300LM.

I blew up my DQG Tiny Triple yesterday, my second one, so I don't feel so guilty.

Should be here in a week, or two.

Chris

hazna · Dec 31, 2017

KITROBASKIN said:
Wow.

Do you have an application for your purchase? Might be simpler to tell us what your plans are for this light. Your questions just about encompass all the wonderful options in flashlight designs in this day-and-age (except for user interface).

Or are you looking for someone to give you copy for your blogspot?

No particular application. To be honest, I probably don't actually have a need for a new flashlight. All my older generation flashlights are still working okay, and pretty much satisfy all my needs. Just recently started rebrowsing these forums, impressed at how much lumens you can get out of these latest emitters. When I was last active, XMLs were the new thing and gave around 600-700 lumens. If I am after something new, probably something and all-round. Emisars seemed to keep coming up the "best flashlight of 2017" thread, and seems reasonably priced. I like the look of the titanium D4 now available. UI seems interesting. Bit overwhelmed with the options available. I see there is a huge thread for some of the emisar lights, was looking to get the info more quickly that browsing through so many pages.

Not looking for a review copy or anything either... I haven't posted anything on my blog for quite some time. Don't have the time/urge to write review or anything atm.

archimedes · Dec 31, 2017

hazna said:
....
Was looking at the best flashlights of 2017 thread, and the Emisar lights seemed to come up a few times. They are also reasonably priced, so I'm interested...

Just wondering if someone could explain all the options available?

So there is the d1, d1s and d4? I assume in terms of throw d1s>d1>d4 , with the d4 being a more floody light? I think I prefer the more sleek profile of the d4. And then there is a the d4vn, which I assume is more throwy version in a d4 body? How does this compare to the d1 in throw?

Next question is the difference between the emitters. Nichia 219CT, XP-G2 S4, XP-L HI V3, XP-L HI V2 . In terms of max lumens, throwiness, runtimes, any artifacts in the beam? Is it still that the higher CRI and warmer tints have less max lumens than the cooler tints?

I see they recommend unprotected batteries. If so what is currently the "best" ones available (in both 18350 and 18650). Do I need IMR or standard li-ion okay. I assume IMR still has less capacity than the best li-ion?

Bezel size = D1S >> D1 > D4
Throw = D1S > D1 >> D4

"vn" = custom emitters and/or hot-rodded (current boost)

Emitters ... N219 = very hot very fast (best color rendering) , XPG2 = well rounded, XPL = max output

Battery = high quality high current IMR only

KITROBASKIN · Jan 1, 2018

Thanks for your explanation.

My CuTi D4 shipped about a day ago, having chosen the natural body, Nichia 5000K 90% CRI emitters and just the 18650 size tube. Nothing wrong with the XPL Hi, that's for sure, but the boost in lumens on an area-light like this flashlight is not going to make a big difference for dog walking like we do. And while color rendering on the three other XPL Hi (5000K) flashlights I have are just fine, the Nichia is a tad bit better for the light brown coat color and cream variations of the fur on the dogs we have. Maybe the XP-G2 have a better cast than the earlier iterations; don't know.

We'll see if the titanium construction requires this little hot rod to be throttled down because of less heat dissipation from the titanium. Copper is great for that though. They will be heavier than the standard aluminum D4 and ultimately may not perform as well as the base model. At half the price of the CuTi, it is a good value and the user interface makes it a great tool.

Been using the Emisar D1S (XPL Hi 5000K) for a few weeks now, having gone out every night except maybe 3 times. It is a performer. When not doing direct comparisons with other throwers, I pair it with an area light (usually the excellent PFlexPRO quad drop-in Nichia 5000K) the D1S works out very effectively to configure into momentary max setting, activating the switch with the pad of the third finger in a normal walking position, switch facing downward. A shock cord lanyard keeps track of it. Winter gloves can hinder decisive activation but it Is doable. The throw is sufficient for our terrain of forest/meadow mix.

Unprotected flat top batteries are pretty much required. I use the very capable 18650GA and Sony VTC5 and Sony VTC6. When the D4 gets here, you can bet it will be fed the Sony batteries. It may come to pass that I will change the temperature regulation setting on the D4. The D1S does not get hot for our use, but it is cold outside at this time of year.

2 nights ago, I read about half of Toykeeper's thread (almost 4000 posts) on the D4 over at that other flashlight forum, focusing mainly on her writing and a few others. She put some excellent finishing touches to the Emisar firmware. She sums up a lot on the first few posts of the thread, having updated them throughout the second half of this year.

Still not quite sure what you want. A Convoy C8 would be a good choice if you clearly prefer a tail switch, and comes close to what the D1S throws with an XPL Hi LED. But the Emisar UI works for a lot of experienced people. The D4 is sure to please, for an area light, but others have multi emitter options, with PFlexPRO using a compact Convoy host with full, and I mean full, programmability. Then if you want to go legacy, go Oveready, but you may have to get in line, and possibly have to make payments on a credit card.

By-the-way, some of us here have put Yuji, hi CRI emitters in our Photon pinch lights. There's one on my keychain. (Saw your 2014? review on your blog)

eh4 · Jan 1, 2018

We'd call the D1 a compact thrower, but it's also what I'd call a traditional flashlight, good spot and wide spill, it pulls maybe 3 amps on high compared to 15+ (?) with the D4, and throws further than the D4, while still being remarkably compact.

I think the D4 is amazing but that the D1 is the more capable light, not for illuminating an entire alley or yard at once as the D4 can, but for seeing what you need to look at without overheating or rapidly wearing out an 18650. The spill is wider than many lights that throw as well as the D1, you can light an area with it just fine if you crank it up and look aside from the hotspot.
I'm sure that the D1S must be amazing as well, and before overspending on Christmas I fully expected to have one by now, but I think that like the D4, I'll find the D1S to be on the opposite side of the Goldilocks zone across from the D4, with the D1 right in the middle.

I wish the neutral HI were warmer, and had a tighter spot, and a even Lower lowest level ( it's something like 1 lumen and 7.5mA), but the D1 is an amazingly versatile light. It's very small for what it can do with 1 led vs the 4 leds of the even more diminutive D4.

hazna · Jan 1, 2018

Thanks for the reponses

So a D1 is still more throwy than a modded d4vn with 4 LEDs?

I assume the XPL is a larger emitter and more floody than the XPG2/N219 (similar to old XML vs XPG)?

So reading the interface, the higher modes are direct drive and the lower modes are regulated. Are they PWM regulated in the lower modes, and is the PWM very noticeable?

Sounds like the D1 is a better all-rounder flashlight vs the D4 sounds pretty floody. I have zebralight sc600w with XML (probably one of the first versions out), it's pretty floody. An armytek predator with an XPG is my thrower (but its only around 300 lumens max). A D1 would help to fill out a niche I don't already have... but the titanium D4 versions look so darn sexy. I really like the look of the annodised Ti ones, but from some of the other threads sounds like it will wear off pretty quickly. A D1s sounds like a awesome thrower but I rarely need a hardcore thrower, so won't see much use.

KITROBASKIN said:
Thanks for your explanation.

My CuTi D4 shipped about a day ago, having chosen the natural body, Nichia 5000K 90% CRI emitters and just the 18650 size tube. Nothing wrong with the XPL Hi, that's for sure, but the boost in lumens on an area-light like this flashlight is not going to make a big difference for dog walking like we do. And while color rendering on the three other XPL Hi (5000K) flashlights I have are just fine, the Nichia is a tad bit better for the light brown coat color and cream variations of the fur on the dogs we have. Maybe the XP-G2 have a better cast than the earlier iterations; don't know.

We'll see if the titanium construction requires this little hot rod to be throttled down because of less heat dissipation from the titanium. Copper is great for that though. They will be heavier than the standard aluminum D4 and ultimately may not perform as well as the base model. At half the price of the CuTi, it is a good value and the user interface makes it a great tool.

Been using the Emisar D1S (XPL Hi 5000K) for a few weeks now, having gone out every night except maybe 3 times. It is a performer. When not doing direct comparisons with other throwers, I pair it with an area light (usually the excellent PFlexPRO quad drop-in Nichia 5000K) the D1S works out very effectively to configure into momentary max setting, activating the switch with the pad of the third finger in a normal walking position, switch facing downward. A shock cord lanyard keeps track of it. Winter gloves can hinder decisive activation but it Is doable. The throw is sufficient for our terrain of forest/meadow mix.

Unprotected flat top batteries are pretty much required. I use the very capable 18650GA and Sony VTC5 and Sony VTC6. When the D4 gets here, you can bet it will be fed the Sony batteries. It may come to pass that I will change the temperature regulation setting on the D4. The D1S does not get hot for our use, but it is cold outside at this time of year.

2 nights ago, I read about half of Toykeeper's thread (almost 4000 posts) on the D4 over at that other flashlight forum, focusing mainly on her writing and a few others. She put some excellent finishing touches to the Emisar firmware. She sums up a lot on the first few posts of the thread, having updated them throughout the second half of this year.

Still not quite sure what you want. A Convoy C8 would be a good choice if you clearly prefer a tail switch, and comes close to what the D1S throws with an XPL Hi LED. But the Emisar UI works for a lot of experienced people. The D4 is sure to please, for an area light, but others have multi emitter options, with PFlexPRO using a compact Convoy host with full, and I mean full, programmability. Then if you want to go legacy, go Oveready, but you may have to get in line, and possibly have to make payments on a credit card.

By-the-way, some of us here have put Yuji, hi CRI emitters in our Photon pinch lights. There's one on my keychain. (Saw your 2014? review on your blog)

I like the sound of the UI for the emisar lights. Don't mind the side button, and actually like it with my zebralights. Had a quick google at the convoy lights, seems very generic and basic UI modes?

Thanks for the heads up about the HI cri mod for the photon. Not sure if I'm handy enough to change the emitter, and my photon hasn't been getting much use lately. On my keychain, I'm currently using MecArmy BL43. Still think a modamag drake is one of the best keychain lights even today. Only wish I could have afforded one of the AlTin/TiCN coated ones when they were still available.

KITROBASKIN · Jan 1, 2018

The emitter change on the Photon II is a piece of cake, with the Freedom a little more detailed but still no soldering. Getting a Yuji emitter is the challenge, I think.

The clear (silver) Convoy C8 has decent UI choices but nothing special. PFlexPRO sells an Advance Program model with choice of emitter.

If your use is all-forest or close-in urban/suburban, the D4 will be more pleasant but go through batteries quicker if on high mode a lot. You will not have the 'bouncing hotspot' while walking. Unless a person gets a tiny, bright emitter in the D1, it will be a general purpose light, perhaps a happy medium; certainly more throw with the D1 than the D4. I would think still more throw than the throwiest D4 mod but could be mistaken.

The XPL Hi is the larger emitter, but in principle, the smaller the emitter, the longer the throw, given the same reflector. Surface brightness is a factor in throw; Dome on or no dome also plays a major factor. Someone with more expertise could explain it better.

When the Emisar has a battery put in it. The mode level is at the highest regulated level and does not have Pulse Width Modulation (as I understand it) and the high mode is without PWM. As a person ramps up and down in brightness, there will be a brief flash at that highest regulated level, and at maximum and minimum.

The Photon Freedom has absolutely distracting PWM, the PWM on the Emisar is totally not-seen and totally non-distracting to us. I don't remember the high PWM frequency as reported by Toykeeper. Well made flashlights in this day and age will not be distracting, and unseen pulses in artificial (AC) lighting have been common throughout history.

Only when the Emisar is in momentary maximum, could it be considered 'tactical' or Very Reliably 'quick on the draw'. But useful? Most definitely. The double click for maximum could be flubbed under duress (opinion) but the hold for minimum is pretty doable. Notably (and a credit to Toykeeper) is that after a double click to maximum, one can double click again and that will get you back to the previously used setting. This is very handy for those times when you are navigating on a low level, just walking along, hear something, double click to get a better view, then in order to get back to your previously used light level, just double click. For a single button flashlight, this is greatness.

Explain to me my options with Emisar lights?

hazna

Enlightened

KITROBASKIN

Flashlight Enthusiast

ChrisGarrett

Flashlight Enthusiast

hazna

Enlightened

archimedes

Flashaholic

KITROBASKIN

Flashlight Enthusiast

eh4

Flashlight Enthusiast

hazna

Enlightened

KITROBASKIN

Flashlight Enthusiast

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