Incans are heading towards exctinction

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etc

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Because nobody is buying incans anymore. The vast majority are going you know where. It's not the lumens. It's the total cost of ownership that's the bottom line. And the consumer is a price shopper. The bulbs constantly blow out and have a limited lifepsan. It's a PITA to deal with that and carry spare sets on mission-critical assignments.
The things go through batteries like crazy. The performance generated is not all that great versus possibilities. Runtime is downright awful. So it's not really the lumen level.

Surefire is no longer offering any incan models. Hasn't for years.

The incan bulb industry is fast heading the way of the CRT monitor, non-digital photography and the VHS tapes. All of these still have holdouts to various degrees but are either a seriously endangered or extinct species, either right here and now or just around the corner. The traffic on this subforum is 1/10 to 1/15 of the LED sub-forum.

Support is slowly drying up as evidenced by this post. When sales are low, stores close. Or re-tool for new technologies. Like Kodak. Has become irrelevant because they did not in time adapt to the digital photography and stuck to an old paradigm. So, evolve or perish. A device invented in the typewriter era has outlived it but is about to join it. So why even invest in dying technology.

OTOH, mint condition 20 year old incan Surefires will bring premium prices to eccentric collectors. Like the people that collect typewriters and ford model T's. (And then don't really use them but use laptops and new Toyotas to get around).


I did several searches to see if there was any new info about the closing of bulb search site Donsbulbs.com and I didn't find anything on CPF about this.
Tonight I tried to go to Donsbulbs.com and this message is all that showed up.

--- Don has retired, and donsbulbs is permanently closed ---

No plans yet on possible future liquidating of assets.

If anything changes in the future, news will be posted here.

I have used this website for years when researching incandescent bulbs. Dons site was a wealth of information about bulbs of all types. He had info on everything and as far as I know his site is the only one of its kind. I checked on the internet archive Way Back Machine and they seem to have an incomplete archive of his website. I tried to do a few searches but the information is not there.
I'm sad to see this valuable resource go dark on the net.
Does anyone have any info on this situation or do you know Don? I guess I'm wondering if there is any possibility of getting his entire website archived for future use?
 
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archimedes

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.... The bulbs constantly blow out and have a limited lifepsan....

I see this (or similar words to that effect) posted regularly, but I am really amazed at how infrequently I need to replace high-quality (like most SureFire) lamps, when using a soft-start setup....

It is difficult for me to quantify exactly, since I don't track runtime, but I have to replace a lamp much less than once per year on average :shrug:
 

bykfixer

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IMG_20180226_204803.jpg

1940's oem bulb still working

IMG_20171013_142141.jpg

1990's ROP still working

IMG_20170906_204252.jpg

1917 bulb... still working

IMG_20161216_131848.jpg

1920's bulbs... still working

IMG_20171228_133001.jpg

Late 90's/early 00's SureFire bulbs... still working

IMG_20171005_170730.jpg

Laser Products P60... still working.
 

id30209

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Thread title is as much as we don't like it, true. After years of inactivity, i just start building stash of available bulbs and moding led mags on incans just because of eminent. And beside the fact i feel like a weirdo posting WTB incans request, also have a feeling i'm the only one buying something for incans. Point of incans, money wise, it's missed subject. It's the look i like switching that light on and don't care how long and what price. Sorry for my bad english but i had to write something.
 

etc

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I see this (or similar words to that effect) posted regularly, but I am really amazed at how infrequently I need to replace high-quality (like most SureFire) lamps, when using a soft-start setup....

It is difficult for me to quantify exactly, since I don't track runtime, but I have to replace a lamp much less than once per year on average :shrug:

High-quality has nothing to do with it. there is a limited runtime built-in. That's all. When the time is up, it's up.

Let me illustrate it this way. If I had go to on a mission-critical and life-threatening assignment where light / illumination technology and its reliability was absolutely paramount to my success and survival, I would most definitely not take any light with any incan module that was even remotely capable of being blown out. It's not the odds but what's at stake.

Like walking through some European catacombs or some caves or some scary abandoned city buildings or some outdoor mountainous terrain and a long list of other 1000 and 1 things.
I am not swapping bulbs inside some Paris catacomb with water dripping on my head and so dark that it's thick in front of you.
 

archimedes

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I think most of the remaining incandescent fans probably just don't post much.

After all, how much is there to really discuss any more ?

Essentially no new products and no new development, to speak of, as well as overall declining interest.

That's not to say there is nothing worth talking about, but simply that those who still like and use these, mostly are satisfied with their current setup(s) and others are largely indifferent.

I say this as one who uses an A2 regularly and still finds it to be an excellent and practical illumination tool.

Although I think it would be nice to see more discussion in this forum, it is what it is ....
 
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etc

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So.... what is the point of this thread?

Well, the point is what you make of it.

Incans are still around but are just an expensive hobby for eccentrics at this point increasingly diminishing in their market share and rapidly increasing irrelevance.

Not when you can buy a $40 light that does genuine 800 lumens that expensive incans have a hard time matching (and maintaining runtime for more than 10 minutes) And not when you buy a $20 light than will never quit and have a better reliability record than 1990's or even 2000's top of the line Surefires with all this incan stuff built-in.

The aforementioned Co. recognized which way the ship was heading and jumped off the bandwagon instead of going down with Titanic. Hence various bulb makers / sellers are closing doors. The water is up to the pipe and lights are flickering. You could see the writing on the wall years ago, as many as 10.

Old incan lights, model trains and other esoteric stuff. The stuff that will live forever in various basement collections.
 

etc

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Thread title is as much as we don't like it, true. After years of inactivity, i just start building stash of available bulbs and moding led mags on incans just because of eminent. And beside the fact i feel like a weirdo posting WTB incans request, also have a feeling i'm the only one buying something for incans. Point of incans, money wise, it's missed subject. It's the look i like switching that light on and don't care how long and what price. Sorry for my bad english but i had to write something.

Most people are money shoppers.

They have no concept of tint or runtime of lumens, or only vaguely so.

They just want to get something that never demands bulb swap and only occasional, rare battery swap.

They know than the latest-greatest $25 Chimart item will run for 10 or 20 hours versus incans for 1.5 hours at most and get dim fast.

For one thing, you cannot even buy incans at any big box stores, I don't think. Not even Mag. That's being phased out, either right here, right now or if not, just around the corner.


I gave a 2xAA no-brand name device to an older relative and she said, being completely technologically illiterate, Oh, it's one of those new lights you never have to change the batteries in.
 
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archimedes

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High-quality has nothing to do with it. there is a limited runtime built-in. That's all. When the time is up, it's up....

I don't think this is correct, at least in the sense like a carbon arc lamp electrodes are consumed.

Although I am not an expert on these, my understanding is that the halogen cycle in expensive high-quality lamps promotes redeposition of tungsten back onto the filament.

So, I think these lamps mostly fail, when something actually "breaks" them ... shock, overcurrent, undercurrent, envelope leak, etc, etc.

Yes, the vaporization and redeposition is not perfect, so there is indeed a finite service lifespan, but under optimal conditions that can be quite extensive (albeit unpredictable)
 

etc

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We don't operate under optimum conditions. It gets turned on and off and not heated properly, plus there are various environmental factors. Are you at -40 or +40C?

Incans are not what you want when your life depends on proper "re-deposition of tungsten back onto the filament".

There is a finite lifespan and that's that. The fact you don't know when the time is up adds excitement to this equation. But when it's up - it's up. And it could hit any second. Or run its designated 600 hours. Or exceed them. But still fail at some point.

the above pics of this bulb ran since 1940's, etc. - it just exponentially increases their likelyhood of failure at this point. The longer you cruise. The bulbs have given 99% of what they can give.

There is of course the interesting factor where a lot of electronics fails early in its life, whatever is the term for it. If it passes this critical period, it will run for its scheduled life.
I don't know if this syndrome is specifically applicable to bulbs but would not be surprised.

Regardless of the above, its scheduled lifetime can be canceled by a shock, a hit or a fall. So there goes that equation. The filament is not as durable as solid-state electronics despite all the shock-proof gizmos attached to it.
 
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archimedes

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I'm not sure where this strawman argument about mission critical life-or-death situations is coming from ?

No one here has said anything of the sort.

Yes, lamps can and do fail.
Yes, LED flashlights can and do fail.

Yes, the emitter portion of the equation, looked at in isolation is generally speaking rather (substantially) more reliable for LED than incandescent at this point in time. But you still need backups for mission critical functions.

Who is using incandescent lamps for these purposes at present ?

But, are incandescent flashlights still useful, for at least some of the 99.999% other non-dangerous utility purposes where some illumination may be wanted ?
 

bykfixer

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Mr Byke, Does that 1908 take a bulb or a CW paper cap?
Can I please some I.D..

It's a 1917 Franco flashlight that used 2 aa's and was a promo item to help sell batteries. It was largely used as prizes for newspaper subscription contests and stuff like that.

IMG_20170913_164408.jpg


IMG_20170913_163719.jpg

A diagram of the mechanics when you pull the trigger.



I think the original intention of this thread showcases a lack of understanding of the big picture. Sure, $3 Rayovacs are no longer incan. And yes the industry output aint what it used to be. But ask Mark at Lumens Factory or Tad at Tads Customs their thoughts. There are still lots of light bulbs being produced and sold across the planet earth. Just because a CPF'r thinks and industry is defunct does not make it so.

Titanic? Not really. Matter of fact a couple of lab coat wearing chaps at MIT have a prototype light bulb that in it's infancy is already brighter and more efficient watt per watt than LED's.
 

scout24

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I know for fact that as recently as four years ago, at least one FBI agent in my neck of the woods was using a SF M3-headed weaponlight on his issue M4 carbine. I know this because I was shocked to see an MN-10 bulb in there when it came out of the case in his trunk. (I was working as a mechanic for my local P.D. at the time, and was friendly with a wide assortment of officers from a bunch of agencies having worked there for 20+ years.) I tried to give him an MN-11, but was told any deviation from issue equipment was a no-go. Hence, no Malkoff or anyone else's dropin, either. He was still carrying a 6P at the time as well. I haven't seen him since, but I'd be shocked if that situation had changed.
 

id30209

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Most of the gents using incans are the ones using small form like A2 and those using super-ultra bulbs long or short lifetime but used primarily in microscopes, projectors etc. First group is using them cause of the size, tint and some emotions, other group because they don't care about runtime (mostly) but to have old school bright, power drain monster, same like muscle cars. Best ones are old bodies stuffed with technology (AlanB or Jimmy's regulators) and most of all huge cc engine (osram 64623,657...)
The point of having that car...so you can say you have it and be seen. Or drag race, the same thing is with incans these days. Not economical, blowing off from time to time but we like it!
But there are some aplications where incans still cannot be replaced. Can't remember it which ones exactly this moment but there are.
They are on a brink of exctinction but people still have fun with them.
After all, who doesn't like to see paper been torched by a flashlight?
Can led do that?
There's no replacement for displacement.
 

ma tumba

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An electric fireplace is more efficient, ecological, etc, etc than a traditional one, fed by the wood. A money minded person would never go natural here. But a lot of people would
 

knucklegary

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Bykfixer, What a cool promo flashlight.. Thanks for sharing photos!

Btw, I burn almond wood, it's clean and efficient - Far more economical than pellets (electricity) So what does that have to do with incan vs leds?
 

LiftdT4R

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Because nobody is buying incans anymore.

Nobody? :duh2:

Granted it's not a big market but do you think horses went extinct when people started buying cars? I'd say it's more of a niche market now but it certainly still exists.

Heck I wouldn't say that the people on this forum who still regularly post in the incan section are nobodies. We have a pretty dedicated following and like our incans just fine.
 

LiftdT4R

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1940's oem bulb still working

1990's ROP still working

1917 bulb... still working

1920's bulbs... still working

Late 90's/early 00's SureFire bulbs... still working

Laser Products P60... still working.

Come on Mr. Fixer. Surely nobody uses those. :ironic:
 
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