Charger pops fuses.

lightseeker2009

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Guys and girls. Firstly I am sorry that this is not flashlight related, but you are so good with electronics, that I do want to post here.

My car's battery was one morning stone cold flat, about two months ago. So flat that I could not even unlock the car with its remote.
The battery center said I had to leave something on, as the car charges fine and the battery is like new. They did not wanted to replace the battery.

Fast forward to today, same story. Battery as flat as it can get.

Why does my charger, and others I've borrowed, all pop their fuses the moment I switch on the power?
Is there something I can do about it? Or should I invest in a older ''dumb'' charger?

I wonder what causes my battery to drain overnight? All the doors were closed, boot was closed, no radio or nothing was left on.
Its a Ford Kuga 2.5T if it matters.
 

MikeSalt

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I would say that your car must have an intermittent short-circuit somewhere if it keeps popping the fuse in all the chargers you try to use. It would also explain the flat battery. Very lucky not to have a fire on your hands with the current that car batteries can deliver.
 

lightseeker2009

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I would say that your car must have an intermittent short-circuit somewhere if it keeps popping the fuse in all the chargers you try to use. It would also explain the flat battery. Very lucky not to have a fire on your hands with the current that car batteries can deliver.

Now I will be too scared to go to sleep..
 

WalkIntoTheLight

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Is this a charger you plug into your car's cigarette lighter socket? That socket should have a 10 amp fuse on it, itself. So, I don't understand why your charger is blowing its own fuse. Maybe there's some voltage spike going on? Maybe the car's fuses aren't working? Or maybe your charger's fuse is less than 10 amps. In any case, it should not be blowing a fuse. Something is seriously wrong.

Yeah, if your car battery is draining flat overnight (with nothing plugged in), but the garage is testing the system as okay, I'd go to another garage. Car batteries have about 1000 watt hours of energy in them. That's a lot of energy being drained somewhere, and probably not very safely.
 

lightseeker2009

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Is this a charger you plug into your car's cigarette lighter socket? That socket should have a 10 amp fuse on it, itself. So, I don't understand why your charger is blowing its own fuse. Maybe there's some voltage spike going on? Maybe the car's fuses aren't working? Or maybe your charger's fuse is less than 10 amps. In any case, it should not be blowing a fuse. Something is seriously wrong.

Yeah, if your car battery is draining flat overnight (with nothing plugged in), but the garage is testing the system as okay, I'd go to another garage. Car batteries have about 1000 watt hours of energy in them. That's a lot of energy being drained somewhere, and probably not very safely.

Nope, its a charger with clamps that connects directly to the poles of the cars battery.
Thing is just, after my car has done this two months ago, it has driven without any issues, till today again. Perhaps the fault comes and goes.
 

MikeSalt

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Perhaps it automatically senses the voltage sag associated with starting the car and briefly provides the 30 amps. I used to have a mains-powered jump-starter, and it was pretty effective.

However, if your car does have a short-circuit, as I suspect, it's just going to ruin this jump-starter too.
 

xxo

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Check the battery connections, something might be loose.
 

lightseeker2009

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It's charging now. What I did was to connect my fully charged jump start pack. Cars ignition etc works then. But it just is not powerful enough to start the 5-cylinder. So I then switched it off and connected the charger that pops fuses like it's supposed to do so lol to the battery together with the jump starter. I first switched on the jump starter, then the charger, and voila, there was enough power to not pop the fuse. So I will charge it like this throughout the night. I believe it should be fine. But I will have to get this checked out as I do not want to get stranded anywhere else than at my house.
Do you guys think a lifepo4 jumpstart pack with a 14ah pack will have enough juice to start my car, even though n ump starter with a 18ah lead acid cannot? I must add that this lead acid is about 4 years old now.
 

MikeSalt

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Ah is just measure of capacity, what determines whether it will start your 5 cylinder engine is the Cold Cranking Amps (CCA).

If the fault ever happens again, just try charging with the battery negative lead detached. It could be an internal short with the battery. The reason I say that is from your symptoms where an external jump pack fixed it. The additional heat generated at the internal short due to the external power could warp the plates so they're no longer touching. I have seen one incident of that occurring.
 

bykfixer

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I have a truck that about every 3 weeks to 3 months would have a dead battery.

After exhausting hours looking for a discharge, then to see if it was a sympton in others like it I learned the battery just wasn't being charged enough.

I learned that with the output of the alternator combined with all of the computer stuff going on it took an hour of driving to put back the power it took to start it. I figured out through research that the computer takes 2 hours to turn off after it is shut off. It shuts down a little at a time when I lock the doors. If I forgot something and unlocked it, the computer started it's routine again.

The answer in my case was larger output alternator or run it longer. Well as fate would have it I now need it running a few hours a day and there's no more dead battery since January.

Now for your charger popping fuses, I presume you are using a 125 volt electrical supply,
Next time remove the terminals from the battery and try that to ensure you are getting proper circuit connection. Could be if you are connecting to the cars battery terminals you are not getting a proper connection, which shorts the charger thereby popping the fuse.
 

lightseeker2009

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I have a truck that about every 3 weeks to 3 months would have a dead battery.

After exhausting hours looking for a discharge, then to see if it was a sympton in others like it I learned the battery just wasn't being charged enough.

I learned that with the output of the alternator combined with all of the computer stuff going on it took an hour of driving to put back the power it took to start it. I figured out through research that the computer takes 2 hours to turn off after it is shut off. It shuts down a little at a time when I lock the doors. If I forgot something and unlocked it, the computer started it's routine again.

The answer in my case was larger output alternator or run it longer. Well as fate would have it I now need it running a few hours a day and there's no more dead battery since January.

Now for your charger popping fuses, I presume you are using a 125 volt electrical supply,
Next time remove the terminals from the battery and try that to ensure you are getting proper circuit connection. Could be if you are connecting to the cars battery terminals you are not getting a proper connection, which shorts the charger thereby popping the fuse.

I hear you. My cars ignition lights also stay on long after I have locked the car. How much power that takes I do not know. I stay close to work so in the week my battery does not see much charging time. But this weekend I drove at least 100 km on the highway. So to be flat two days later does not work for me. I have not tested it myself for a possible short. But a 4amp charger charged the battery to full now. If there were a short I am sure the charging would have taken much longer. So the mystery remains. It is sleeping time now in South Africa, so I will see if the battery held it's charge overnight.
 

xxo

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Sounds like either a dead short somewhere or again, there is something loose on your battery connections, if it goes dead again see if power comes back on if you "jiggle" the wires/battery terminal connections. Of course the battery terminal connectors should be tight and free from corrosion something you should check regardless. IF there is a intermittent connection it could be unsafe to drive because you could potentially lose all power while you are driving. A dead short is not good either as it could start a fire/damage electrical components.

If everything checks out, it could be a bad battery with a internal short. If the breakers pop after disconnecting the battery from the vehicle as Byfixer suggested, the battery is the problem.
 
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lightseeker2009

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The connections are good. The battery barely registered over 2 volt this morning. So flat it was flat. The fact that the battery lasted more than two months since it did the same the first time, tells me there might be a problem with my car. Or can a battery suddenly behave good for a while, then gives problems again?
 

xxo

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The connections are good. The battery barely registered over 2 volt this morning. So flat it was flat. The fact that the battery lasted more than two months since it did the same the first time, tells me there might be a problem with my car. Or can a battery suddenly behave good for a while, then gives problems again?

Something must be happening intermittently, I never heard of a 12V battery going so low over night......could be a seriously bad battery with a intermittent internal short or some kind of intermittent short in the vehicle. Dose the vehicle have a Volt meter gauge in the dash? If so dose it jump around when you are driving? Does the battery light come on at all?
 

SilverFox

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Hello Lightseeker2009,

My first idea is that you battery has an internal short. This is allowing the charge to drain off overnight. In the morning you go to hook up the charger and the battery has actually deteriorated to a state of somewhat reverse charge. The charger thinks you hooked things up backward and blows the fuse.

If you have time to play...

When you shut things down at night, disconnect the battery. In the morning check the voltage of the battery. If it is dead, the problem is with the battery. Note that with an intermittent problem this may take a few observations to find this problem.

Another thing to check is the parasitic draw. Hook an ampmeter in series with the battery and see what the current draw is.

Another think you can try is to borrow a battery from a friend. If that battery works great, the problem is with your battery. If the same problem occurs, the problem is with the wiring in your car.

A systematic approach should help you figure out what is going on. Good luck.

Tom
 

lightseeker2009

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Hello Lightseeker2009,

My first idea is that you battery has an internal short. This is allowing the charge to drain off overnight. In the morning you go to hook up the charger and the battery has actually deteriorated to a state of somewhat reverse charge. The charger thinks you hooked things up backward and blows the fuse.

If you have time to play...

When you shut things down at night, disconnect the battery. In the morning check the voltage of the battery. If it is dead, the problem is with the battery. Note that with an intermittent problem this may take a few observations to find this problem.

Another thing to check is the parasitic draw. Hook an ampmeter in series with the battery and see what the current draw is.

Another think you can try is to borrow a battery from a friend. If that battery works great, the problem is with your battery. If the same problem occurs, the problem is with the wiring in your car.

A systematic approach should help you figure out what is going on. Good luck.

Tom

Thank you Tom.
When I went to sleep the batteries voltage was 12.41v. This morning it is only 3.52v! So either the car has quite a big short or the battery is done. I will take the car in to put in a new battery and while there also ask that they check for a short. And I will buy a lifepo4 jump starter. Just to be sure!
 

PapaLumen

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Battery will be fubared now anyway if its been down to 2v. They don't like it at all.
 

WalkIntoTheLight

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Thank you Tom.
When I went to sleep the batteries voltage was 12.41v. This morning it is only 3.52v! So either the car has quite a big short or the battery is done. I will take the car in to put in a new battery and while there also ask that they check for a short. And I will buy a lifepo4 jump starter. Just to be sure!

A short that completely drains a car battery overnight should be fairly obvious if you measure the resistance across the battery terminals, obviously with the battery disconnected. You'd probably see a resistance of a few ohms.
 

mattheww50

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The problem with the Internal battery short issue, is that normally it only impacts 1 cell, whereas if it shows 2 volts, that means 5 of the 6 cells have been completely drained, with only 1 cell shorted, the voltage should still be something a little in excessof 12 volts. I'd take a very good look at both the battery cables and the Alternator cables. I had an alternator cable burn up a few years ago, the real problem turned out to be a problem with one of the battery cables coupled with the fact that vehiclehad a large (120 amp) alternator. The vehicle had a relatively small (at least for a big SUV, a 3.3 liter engine, so it would start, but when running the entire vehicle was always being powered by the Alternator, and the continuous high output from the alternator caused one of the alternator wires to burn up (although I suspect the real culprit was the connector at the Alternator was a crimp on, and I have seen those develop relatively high resistance due to a combination of not very good crimp in the first place, and several years exposure to road salt and calcium chloride used on roads here corroding it over the years. At some point you get thermal runaway, and that's the end of the cable. The other question is how old is the battery. Over the life of the battery, the apacity drop quite markedly, and automotive storage batteries are design to tolerate overcharging. They really dislike deep discharge, don't last long if it happens very often. As the battery approaches end of life your 1KwH capacity battery drops down to literally a couple hundred watt hours, so it is much easier to run it flat. The other thing I would do is to use a DC clamp on meter with a low range, and put the clamp around the positive lead, and see what kind of current is being drawn with the ignition off. On most vehicle it is less than 100ma, often much less, which while low will completely discharge the battery if the vehicle isn't driven for 50-60 days. My ex used to take the kids to Chicago for several weeks to get them out of the Phoenix heat during the summer. I had no reason to drive her Volvo, and several times when she came back, the batteryin the Volvo was close enough to dead that it wouldn't start the vehicle. Anyway if the drain is more than 100 ma, I'd start using the clamp on meter on parts of the wiring harness and see where the current is actually going, if there a short somewhere, that will tell which device is likely to be the culprit.
 
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