How much do batteries matter? $$$ vs cheap

Weld Inspector

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So this is something thats been on my mind for awhile

I see plenty of reviews of lights with stats listed always from quality batteries like AW and efest, samsung, and LG

When I shop online theres always the bargin basement 18650's from ultrafire and countless other no names

I in no way doubt there are huge differences in run times due to inflated MAH listed by the cheap ones,

But here is very my real question comes in how do they perform in aspects other than runtime?
 

iamlucky13

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It's hard to know what you're getting capacity wise, and the output may be poor, too.

For example, resident battery expert HKJ singled out one of the fraudulent Ultrafires he tested a few years ago for disassembly and inspection.

It was advertised as 5000mAh. It tested at 1000mAh. It was only able to reasonably provide about 2A output. When opening it up, he found a pressure seal, but two other common passive safety devices weren't there. It's also always a question in my mind whether the manufacturing is sufficiently well-controlled to assure defects like internal shorts don't form.
https://lygte-info.dk/info/batteryDisassembly5000mAh UK.html

He's found even bigger fakes. This one claimed 9900mAh. It tested at around 500mA and struggled with even a 2A load.
https://lygte-info.dk/review/batteries2012/UltraFire SZ18650 9900mAh (Yellow) UK.html

Many basic quality 18650 lights need batteries that can provide a decent voltage at 3-4 A output, and many of the high output lights available today really should have cells rated at 10A or in some cases higher outputs.
 

Weld Inspector

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So basically it comes down to a matter of quality standards of the companies with good reputations being much better


Thank you very much for the answers

I need to find some better batteries then step up.my batteries and see the real potential from some of my lights
 
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vadimax

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I have read somewhere that all those fake cells are nothing more than normal, reliable batteries... that have served their life cycle, gone to a trash bin, collected, rewrapped. They were dead long before you buy them.
 

StorminMatt

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It should also be remembered that good cells are actually not too expensive. You can routinely find good quality unprotected cells from the 'big four' for $5 or less (check out, for instance, illumn). Protected cells cost more. But most modern lights are just fine with unprotected cells. In other words, there is really NO REASON to buy cheap cells. Even if you pick up some of the lower capacity older model cells from the 'big four', you will see FAR better performance from your light than you will from cut rate cells.
 
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Connor

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Step 1: search YouTube for "liion fire explosion" or "lipoly fire explosion"
Step 2: be amazed how well these things burn
Step 3: ask yourself if your health and home are worth saving a few dollars on cheap cells of questionable quality
 
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WalkIntoTheLight

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One good safety thing about 10,000mAh Ultrafire batteries, is that they're really only about 500mAh. So, if they do catch fire, they won't burn nearly as much as if a quality cell catches fire. They may not even have enough energy in them to heat up enough to catch fire.

I'd be really worried about using a "real" 10,000mAh Ultrafire cell.

I have a few crap "fake" batteries, mainly used for testing or experiments. When not in use, I keep them in a metal container, partially discharged. When in use, I keep a close eye on them!
 

iamlucky13

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I need to find some better batteries then step up.my batteries and see the real potential from some of my lights

In the US, Illumination Supply (illumn), Mountain Electronics, and Lithium Ion Wholesale are good sources for lithium ion batteries, to the best of my knowledge. I've bought from the first two personally.

A good all around battery for most lights is the Sanyo NCR18650GA. The Samsung 35E has similar capacity and almost as high of current output if the Sanyo is out of stock. The Samsung 30Q is one of the most popular options for a higher drain cell. Sanyo/Panasonic, Samsung, LG, and Sony all make cells themselves, and are reputable manufacturers.

Those are normally sold without a protection circuit on them, but Keeppower makes protected versions of both the 18650GA and the 30Q. The protection circuit helps reduce the risk of over-charging, over-discharging, or external short circuits. The circuit is not critical, but is often recommended for use in lights that don't have their own low-voltage protection or indicators.
 

Tixx

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In my opinion the cheap batteries are a safety risk. The best batteries are very consistent and I can rely on them Time After Time.

Yeah, I don't need my pocket exploding or my house catching fire over a flashlight battery. No way in hell do I even think about the cheap and low quality batteries. Life does not need to be made any more explosively adventurous for me and the family.
 

StorminMatt

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The Samsung 30Q is one of the most popular options for a higher drain cell.

And, as an example, you can currently get this cell for under $5 at Illumination Supply. Still itching to get those Ultrafires?
 
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WalkIntoTheLight

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Yeah, I don't need my pocket exploding or my house catching fire over a flashlight battery. No way in hell do I even think about the cheap and low quality batteries. Life does not need to be made any more explosively adventurous for me and the family.

To be fair, safety concerns are somewhat overblown around here. Yes, stay away from cheap cells. Yes, they are less safe than name-brand cells. But the chances of them catching fire and hurting or killing you, is extremely remote. If you're going to be hurt, you'll be hurt in a car crash, or swimming, or something like that. Killer lithium-ion batteries is way down the list.

Even Google says the lifetime odds of getting hit by lightning is 1 : 12000. I think a battery burn is less than that, given how many crap cells there are in the world. If fires were not extremely rare, we'd hear about them all the time. Especially with all the vapers that push even good cells way past their specs.

A better reason to not buy cheap cells is because they suck, they don't perform well, and you'll be unhappy with them.
 

justanotherguy

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TBH... I want the capacity I expect, and now with higher demand lights, I want the Amps....

Then there is safety concerns... I have hundreds of dollars of light, why play around on batteries
 

Fireclaw18

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In my opinion the cheap batteries are a safety risk. The best batteries are very consistent and I can rely on them Time After Time.
This.

Cheap flashlights can be quite fun. Sometimes you get great quality at a cheap price. Other times a cheap light can be a nice host to tinker around with and mod.

Cheap lithium-ion batteries however are a serious safety hazard. I strongly recommend against skimping on batteries. I suggest only buying name-brand batteries from a trusted source like Mountain Electronics or Illumn. Not only do authentic batteries perform better and have longer life, but they're much less likely to explode in your pocket or burn your house down.
 

JohnnyBravo

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Why is this thread in the LED Flashlights section vs. the batteries part?

At any rate. Yes, it does matter. Before I was enlightened, I "believed" the claims of all of the xxxFire brands for their capacity; and I bought them based on "bang" for the buck. I had some explode while using a Surefire light w/ an LED drop in. It's been a while since I purged all other brands, but I only have Orbtronic cells in my home. I consider them to be the Rolex of rechargeables...
 

StorminMatt

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It's been a while since I purged all other brands, but I only have Orbtronic cells in my home. I consider them to be the Rolex of rechargeables...

Somewhat, but not exactly. Orbtronic doesn't make any cells. They rewrap other cells, like Panasonic or LG, and put their name on it. Some cells bearing their name are protected, others aren't. But regardless, you are buying cells made by someone else. Still, Orbtronic uses good cells.
 

WalkIntoTheLight

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Somewhat, but not exactly. Orbtronic doesn't make any cells. They rewrap other cells, like Panasonic or LG, and put their name on it. Some cells bearing their name are protected, others aren't. But regardless, you are buying cells made by someone else. Still, Orbtronic uses good cells.

Yes, and one problem with rewrappers is that you're not guaranteed they won't change the underlying cell brand. They may test great one year, and then you buy them again and they've changed the cell and no longer are as good. But you won't know that, because the rewrap looks exactly the same.

I'm not suggesting Orbtronic does that, but I just prefer to buy the real cell. Most lights do not require protection circuits anymore.
 

WalkIntoTheLight

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