# 5*Cree Q5 [email protected]



## Hill (Nov 21, 2008)

Hi fellow CPF members!

I am new here lurking and learning for several months. Many thanks to the efforts of all at posting pictures and easy to follow tutorials. I have really come to admire many of your customized parts and builds. 

Now for me, as a newbie, I am trying my hand at a custom [email protected] mod using techniques described in various threads by poster such as Northernlights, Nereus, Modamag, 3rd shift, Icarus, bluecrow76, magmodmike. The specs of my build are:

[email protected] 2D (custom “bored”) host with switch modified to momentary action
5* Cree Q5 “premium” stars (DX)
5 x Fraen 19mm reflectors (Arrow FRC-N1-XR79-0R )
Maxflex3 boost driver (Taskled)
8AA modamag adapter (Sandwich Shoppe)
PES heatsink ((Sandwich Shoppe)

This is nothing new, but I felt it was a managable first for me and I felt up for the challenge. Initially, I intended to build a 4*Cree Q5 mod. I successfully trimmed down the Cree stars to squeeze 4 comfortably within the [email protected] head (sorry, no pic – I already disassembled it!). I connected them in series, powered them up from 8AA NiMh cells pushing out ~11 volts and driven with a maxflex3 boost driver. Everything worked very nicely and the maxflex3 UI circuit gave several options to control illumination levels and maximum output that was easily controlled by the modified momentary switch. It was at least as bright (if not brighter) than my Terralux 300M in a [email protected] 3D host running off 9AA NimH cells pushing. 







So far, so good….BUT….I wanted MORE light (surprising??) So, after more tinkering, I found that I could fit 5*19mm Fraen reflectors into the head. The Cree Q5 stars needed extensive filing to get them to fit. (Picture below are from my cell phone, apologies for the blurry images!)

5*19mm Fraen reflectors fitting into [email protected] head







Cree Q5 star - filed down left vs stock right








2*Q5 stars side by side






4 x Cree Q5 stars in [email protected] head









4*Cree Q5 + 4*19mm Fraen reflectors – is there room for 1 more???








5*Cree Q5 stars – don’t quite fit!!!









As you can see, the 5th star (arrow) doesn’t quite fit between the others (arrows). So, my question is this: how much more can I file these down? I am afraid to go beyond the +/- contacts for fear of creating a short circuit. Can I cut the star something like the picture below? I know others have made these mods using bare emmiters, however, DX only sells them mounted to a PCB.




Finally, is it bad to have the contacts of adjacent stars so close together - maybe I should insulate them from short circuiting by coating with AA? 

Any comments/critiques are welcomed. 

Thanks!!!
Hill


************************************************** 
Update 11/24/08

Finally finished my build - well enough to get if fired up at least.

I managed to file down the stars enough to comfortable squeeze 5 into the [email protected] head. I also had to file down the very edge of the 5 Fraen reflectors since they were just a bit too wide to fit.


5 stars all wired in series









19mm Fraen reflectors (stock left vs modified right)























Head assembly all together and ready for action!









Fired it up and it works great!!! I haven't run it too long since the maxflex3 is not heatsinked yet. 


And finally, my VERY crude but functional "soldering station" (credit for customized wire holder goes to CPF)






********************UPDATE 11/25/08***************************

And now for some beam shots (still with cell phone so only used as comparison) comparing against a Terralux 300M in [email protected] 3D with 9AA adapter. Lights aimed at ceiling ~3ft away. Maxflex3 was set to maximum current output (1200 mA according to Taskled specsheet)

Terralux (LEFT) vs 5*Cree Q5 (RIGHT)

5*Cree Q5 Level 1





5*Cree Q5 Level 2





5*Cree Q5 Level 3





5*Cree Q5 Level 4





5*Cree Q5 Level 5






Also did a lux reading from the ceiling bounce using this cheapo meter from DX. Keep in mind that this is done to compare these two only, so don't take too much stock in the actual numbers!


Terralux 300M ~500 lux 
5*Cree Q5 ~ 1000 lux on Level 5 (max)

So, my mod is giving me ~2x output of the stock Terralux drop in (rated ~500 lumens). I would guess I'm getting ~ 1000 lumens total.

Also, took measure of current draw at all five illumination levels (L1 to L5) with Maxflex set on 350 mA, 500mA, 700mA, 1000mA, and 1200mA maximum drive level.







Thanks for reading!!
Hill






Build thread continued here


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## brighterisbetter (Nov 21, 2008)

*Re: practice*

What is for sale?


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## olrac (Nov 21, 2008)

*Re: practice*

I think Hill just misposted in the wrong forum. 

:welcome: and good luck with the mod


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## Hill (Nov 21, 2008)

Thanks guys, you're right! Oops, wrong forum.

sorry - newbie mistake. How do I move to the correct thread?

Hill


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## Northern Lights (Nov 21, 2008)

I got 7 into my head but they were not stars and I had the inside of the mag head turned a little bit to give me just a little more room. 
That maybe a solution for you as you cannot get the LEDs off the stars, you may find a machinist that can open the head up a little bit and maybe you can get 6 in there. 
Without turning the head quoted from my post, "Before long I realized I could get 6 LEDs and *MCR-17XR* reflectors in that thing so I got the reflectors and accumulated the parts and upgraded to Q2 but before I had the battery and driver figured the Q5s were here, I upgraded to Q5, before I finished getting the parts the R2 became available…"
I realized if I opened the head I could get one more LED into the center, 7 total.
After opening the head I got a piece of copper sheet from the hobby section of the hardware store and used the head to cut out a perfect circle of copper to fit inside. I used tin snips then a dremel fitted with a sanding drum to get it perfectly round. Obviously I snipped it just a little large to allow grinding down. I glued it to the head sink using Arctic Lumina.
Good luck, nice mod, same thing happened to me, I kept designing and modifying as I went.


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## wildstar87 (Nov 22, 2008)

I dunno how far down you can file the stars, but DX does have Q5s mounted on 14mm round boards. I know those would fit.


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## download (Nov 23, 2008)

I did trimmed them without any problems. 
Just file the edge of star boards at 45 degree from top would be fine. 










Small board will be easier.


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## Hill (Nov 24, 2008)

Hi all,

Thanks for your responses! As you can see, I did manage to finish the build (updated first post) with a little more aggressive filing of the star boards and reflectors.

Download - yes, I did see your post. Very nice job. Now the picture of the modded emitters makes more sense. I still don't understand what the lead wires are soldered to. Did you scrape off some of the anodizing on the star to make new +/- contact points? The way you cut the stars would have completely cut off the 4 stock contact pads. I wasn't sure if doing this would short our the emitter. I guess it doesn't. Next time I can be even more aggressive, or else use bare emitters. BTW, I did purchase some of those nice quick release connectors - great idea!! 

Northernlights - I also saw several of your builds as well, thanks for the postings. Again, very nice!! Thanks for your input. Yes, more sanding/grinding of the head was another option, but I lack the tools for a nice clean job. As it was, openning the body tube to fit my modamag 8AA adapter was a REAL pain!! I didn't want to do anymore sanding, especially if it meant removing the anodizing in the head and possibly creating a short circuit - my soldering skills are pretty rough. I already fried to stars and a blue shark - probably $45 down the drain.


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## LukeA (Nov 24, 2008)

Hill said:


> Hi all,
> 
> Thanks for your responses! As you can see, I did manage to finish the build (updated first post) with a little more aggressive filing of the star boards and reflectors.
> 
> ...



download's top picture has contacts cut off. When you do that you have to make sure that the trace for the contact doesn't get bent and come into contact with the metal of the star. 

The bottom picture shows unmodified small boards.


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## download (Nov 24, 2008)

My star board have 6 contact points, so I did cut out 4 pts and remian that 2 pts like that. 
File the edge of cutting contact point, it will not short ciruit anymore.

Good job Hill :thumbsup:


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## Aircraft800 (Nov 24, 2008)

Nice Work, That was my first multi-emitter mag!

You can trim the heck out of the stars, I did a little overkill here:






There are also 17mm UFO that will fit 7 in a standard D Mag:


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## saabluster (Nov 25, 2008)

Good work Hill!



Aircraft800 said:


> Nice Work, That was my first multi-emitter mag!


Did you just build that? I don't remember seeing that at the Flashapalooza.


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## Aircraft800 (Nov 25, 2008)

saabluster said:


> Good work Hill!
> 
> 
> Did you just build that? I don't remember seeing that at the Flashapalooza.


It was there, right next to the Coke bottle in the 5th picture 
I think I had that one at the first one you attended also.

Sorry OP, back on topic


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## saabluster (Nov 25, 2008)

Aircraft800 said:


> It was there, right next to the Coke bottle in the 5th picture
> I think I had that one at the first one you attended also.
> 
> Sorry OP, back on topic


Guess I'm losing it.


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## Hill (Nov 25, 2008)

Aircraft800 said:


> Nice Work, That was my first multi-emitter mag!
> 
> You can trim the heck out of the stars, I did a little overkill here:
> 
> ...


 
Aircraft800,

Thanks for the pics. I now wish I had ordered those UFOs. It would have saved me a ton of filing and a few razor cuts! How well do the those circles transfer heat to the heat sink? 


BTW, Many of my pics seemed to have vanished. Can you still see them in post#1? I don't know what the heck is happening with them. When I edit to add them back, suddenly, I see two of everything. Maybe I'm doing something wrong???
Hill


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## Aircraft800 (Nov 25, 2008)

Hill said:


> Aircraft800,
> 
> Thanks for the pics. I now wish I had ordered those UFOs. It would have saved me a ton of filing and a few razor cuts! How well do the those circles transfer heat to the heat sink?
> 
> ...


 
They seem to transfer heat fine, they are Al backed mounted directly to the heatsink with Arctic Alumina Thermal Adhesive, a better way to go would to use Thermal Grease, and tap/thread holes in the heatsink, and screw them down in the UFO slots, that way you could remove the LED's if you wanted to upgrade.

I never leave that light on too long though, it generates A LOT of heat, and my driver (Shark) is really pushing it, I finished this project before the BlueShark was out.

I checked the link to your pictures, only 2 pics show up here, the rest are broken. You probably need to use www.photobucket.com or another photo hosting site.


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## saabluster (Nov 25, 2008)

Yeah I am seeing two of everything Hill.


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## Nos (Nov 25, 2008)

i was thinking about building the same light with MC-E's :tinfoil: with 3 blue sharks parallel with a external pot........but ....... that light would cost ~400$ 

and how can i heatsink 75 watts  high would only be possible in bursts


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## Northern Lights (Nov 25, 2008)

Nos said:


> i was thinking about building the same light with MC-E's :tinfoil: with 3 blue sharks parallel with a external pot........but ....... that light would cost ~400$
> 
> and how can i heatsink 75 watts  high would only be possible in bursts


How many led's? 5? that should be 1 amp x 5 XRE x 3.5 Volts Forward is 17.5 watts in magnitude numbers. You can run that sure you can do it, 7 Q5s, I did and I can run it in high for much longer than burst, many minutes. 
Did I miss something? How did you figure 75 watts on 5 cree XRE emmiters? Vf is typically 3.0-4.0 volts at 1 amp each for the product line.
Check the TjMax under thermal management spec sheet; it is way up there where it would be too hot to hold before you are too hot for the LEDs. I use 14.4 volts, 4 AW c cells and one blue shark, 25 volts or so, (see specs in the thread and at the Sandwhich Shoppe thread), at the LEDs. The shark handles it flawlessly. The shark is on a Led Zeppelin sync, BTW.
Here are specs:
I worked up the power formula for powering this brute. I decided with the Blue Shark I could use 4 AW C-cells and boost them with the shark. 3.3 Ah that with efficiency losses could run the light for 2 hours.

I figured the efficiency at 95%. 4 cells, 3.6 volts each at 3.3 Ah is 47 watt/hours. The shark runs the 7 Cree at 1 amp. Vf is 3.5 and that is 23.3 watts/hour or @ 2 hours run time on High. Obviously medium if at 50% I have 4 hours, at 33%, low I get 6 hours. Well, this will do for long run.
It is a phenominal flood, see the beam shot. And yes, easily cost $400 in direct parts and another $100 in R&d and other disposibles. Save the cost and frustration, buy one already built. 

Here is the story behind one 7x cree light. The sync has an extra plate which helps, it is the largest sync I could get into it in the first place. I think the sync is a very major part of the thermal management equation. 

7-XRE Q5 Cree, 1600 lumen Scene Flood Light-DIY 
FS-7-XRE Q5 Cree, 1600 lumen Scene Flood Light-DIY


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## Nos (Nov 26, 2008)

i was talking about 7 MC-E's not XR-E ..powered by 6 AW 18650 3s2p, with 3 blue sharks to drive the parallel wired MC-E's at max 3A :naughty:


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## Northern Lights (Nov 26, 2008)

Nos said:


> i was talking about 7 MC-E's not XR-E ..powered by 6 AW 18650 3s2p, with 3 blue sharks to drive the parallel wired MC-E's at max 3A :naughty:


Yea, I missed that. I have an idea that someone should build on. Maybe you could with that beast.
There are two basic heat sync designs, one goes down the tube the other resides in the head. With some I notice that you could put the one in the tube and other in the head and the two would butt up against each other essentially doubling the sync size. If two existing styles cannot be modded to achieve this at least it is an idea to grow with, a two piece sync that will allow building the light and provide more metal when the head is put on it will butt up against each other.
I do not think that has been approached. I would love to see the idea come to fruition. That would be a great LED project to approach with it.
I have a 3x P7 project going into two TM-800x3 and that light has enough room to butt a billet of aluminum up against the back side of the existing flat sync. 
If anyone runs off with the idea please keep me posted. I would like to see a big LED light work for more than a WOW!

Or a ...


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