# Eagletac D25aaa



## jonathandowers (Dec 2, 2014)

Looks like Eagletac revealed the D25aaa couple days ago. Anyone have any ideas when it will be available? 

I am so friggin happy with the company. Minimalist design, slim profile, supports li-ion, CLICKY, and Nichia 219 = answer to my EDC prayers for the past 5 years


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## Duramarks (Dec 2, 2014)

The site says it has a twisty head


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## yoyoman (Dec 2, 2014)

I'm OK with twisty. Like the magnet in the tail. The clip looks clunky but robust. I like the choices of emitters. Now, where can you get it?


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## reppans (Dec 2, 2014)

I like my D25As and that ET seems to appreciate nice tints and good low low modes with long runtimes. I'm pretty disappointed to see that their lowest battery capacity model has the highest low low output of the entire D25 line up. Also, ET doesn't seem use buck drivers for most of its D25 line so "Li-ion support" will likely = M/H/T[urbo] modes only. I'll have to pass on the runtime. 

However, it's nice to see ET continues to be very honest with its specs - the equivalent Fenix specs doubles the ET's lumen-hours of efficiency on L/M although I suspect their actual performance will be close.


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## netprince (Dec 2, 2014)

I like these lights too. They appear to be using PWM for modes according to the specs, am I wrong? Constant current dimming is so nice for these small lights, shame if these are PWM dimming.


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## twl (Dec 2, 2014)

I prefer PWM dimming. In most cases it is not detectable, and it preserves the beam tint, instead of going green in the lower modes.
I would take PWM over current control every time.


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## gunga (Dec 2, 2014)

12 lumen low? Looks nice, I'd go for a ti version if it had a real low mode, but 12 lumens is way too bright for me.


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## mcnair55 (Dec 2, 2014)

gunga said:


> 12 lumen low? Looks nice, I'd go for a ti version if it had a real low mode, but 12 lumens is way too bright for me.



I am with you 12 lumens far to bright considering how low my AA cell D25 is.Would be tempted though to put in my r/c hobby box if it was not for having a clicky as I hate out of date technology such as a twisty on/off.


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## gunga (Dec 2, 2014)

I don't mind twisties on AAA, clickies work but usually can't tail stand. It's funny, I'm talking about tail standing but my current Edc, preon revo is a notoriously poor Tailstander. 


Sent from my iPhone using Candlepowerforums


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## mcnair55 (Dec 2, 2014)

gunga said:


> I don't mind twisties on AAA, clickies work but usually can't tail stand. It's funny, I'm talking about tail standing but my current Edc, preon revo is a notoriously poor Tailstander.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Candlepowerforums



D25A AA tail stands well.


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## gunga (Dec 2, 2014)

Yes, but we are taking about AAA lights. 


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## jonathandowers (Dec 3, 2014)

Just heard back from Eagletac on availability. Their response: "D25AAA will be available at dealers (andrew-amanda.com) in a week."


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## mcnair55 (Dec 4, 2014)

jonathandowers said:


> Just heard back from Eagletac on availability. Their response: "D25AAA will be available at dealers (andrew-amanda.com) in a week."



Sounds like a kitchen sink home operation :huh:


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## defloyd77 (Dec 4, 2014)

I have hoped for a long time for a AAA version of the D25 Mini series and now that they have decided to make it, I'm a little disappointed to be honest, mostly with the output levels.

High is good, no problem there with 85 ANSI lumens, I'm okay with low being 8 lumens, but wish it had a better runtime than 6 hours and I don't know why they think 40 lumens with only 1.3 hours of runtimeis a good idea, that's barely less than half the output and less than double the runtime of high.

I wish it were 5, 20 and 80 or something like that to give a nice range of outputs.


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## Str8stroke (Dec 4, 2014)

Ti and I am all in! These are some nice lights. They are a especially great value IMHO.


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## mcnair55 (Dec 4, 2014)

defloyd77 said:


> I have hoped for a long time for a AAA version of the D25 Mini series and now that they have decided to make it, I'm a little disappointed to be honest, mostly with the output levels.
> 
> High is good, no problem there with 85 ANSI lumens, I'm okay with low being 8 lumens, but wish it had a better runtime than 6 hours and I don't know why they think 40 lumens with only 1.3 hours of runtimeis a good idea, that's barely less than half the output and less than double the runtime of high.
> 
> ...



It does not bother me 6 hours is more than enough for me and it takes less than a minute to swap out a battery.None of my AAA lights have extended use.


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## CreeCrazy (Dec 7, 2014)

Just ordered one [emoji12]


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## mrdabble (Dec 7, 2014)

Hey all, new to the forum. Love Eagletac lights and I just saw these lights last week, is it ok to ask where to find some in stock?


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## __philippe (Dec 8, 2014)

mrdabble said:


> Hey all, new to the forum. Love Eagletac lights and I just saw these lights last week, is it ok to ask where to find some in stock?


Google around...here, ferinstance:
http://lightjunction.com/catalogsearch/result/?q=d25aaa

Welcome on board !

__philippe


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## markr6 (Dec 8, 2014)

gunga said:


> 12 lumen low? Looks nice, I'd go for a ti version if it had a real low mode, but 12 lumens is way too bright for me.



This, plus I hate when they make a tiny light but put a clip on it that sticks out 1/2 mile.


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## mrdabble (Dec 8, 2014)

__philippe said:


> Google around...here, ferinstance:
> http://lightjunction.com/catalogsearch/result/?q=d25aaa
> 
> Welcome on board !
> ...



Thank you!
This was the same result I found at light junction...I was kinda hoping to find some in stock somewhere but a pre order is better than nothin!


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## Big_Sam (Dec 8, 2014)

For EU/UK members, I hear that flashaholics.co.uk will be getting their stock next week, I'll be ordering a couple! Don't forget to get the discount code from marketplace


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## NonSenCe (Dec 8, 2014)

big dissapointment that it once again is a twisty light. i was really hoping a clicky. and also would like the moonlight mode to be kept as an option. -oh well.. maybe v2 will be clicky and moonlight as option too. (really liking the nichia or neutral tint option in it.)


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## orbital (Dec 8, 2014)

+

*NICHIA 219b D220 LED (4500K, HIGH CRI 92)
*LED Lumen: 115*/48/10
OTF Lumen: 68*/32/7

7 lumens to start with is usable for me,,, from illuminationgear.com


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## gunga (Dec 8, 2014)

markr6 said:


> This, plus I hate when they make a tiny light but put a clip on it that sticks out 1/2 mile.



Yes, that clip is pretty big!


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## defloyd77 (Dec 8, 2014)

mcnair55 said:


> It does not bother me 6 hours is more than enough for me and it takes less than a minute to swap out a battery.None of my AAA lights have extended use.




For me, this light would be a part of a minimal EDC when I have to wear clothes with very little pocket room, no backups, so good runtime is definitely a plus, especially when you are as forgetful as me and forget to do a swap before going out. That's what I love about the E01, my current light for this use, it's very forgiving.

With that said, I still may get one, I never had a 219 before.


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## MojaveMoon07 (Dec 8, 2014)

I'm concerned about the magnet in the tailcap after reading a negative testimonial about the foursevens atom's magnet.



> http://www.eagletac.com/html/d25aaa/index.html
> A strong rare earth magnet is installed at the back of the tailcap





> http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?384538-4Sevens-Atoms-Family-Review
> 
> Last weekend, I spent the night in a hotel. Since I had 2 room keys, and having seem claims that the magnet will not effect credit cards, etc., I left my keys near one of the room keys overnight. The key did not work the following morning.
> --
> ...


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## fliptwister (Dec 8, 2014)

Very interested in this light. Can the clip be removed? I have no interest in having clip. Thanks!


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## Glofindel (Dec 8, 2014)

Will they make Ti version?


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## defloyd77 (Dec 9, 2014)

The clip is removeable according to ET's site.

As far as the magnet, I do recall somebody (possibly someone at Foursevens) mentioning that you can weaken the magnet on the Preon P0 by heating it up. I'll try to find where I read that.

Found it


http://www.cpfmarketplace.com/mp/showthread.php?306228-The-Atom&p=4795377&viewfull=1#post4795377


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## LEDburn (Dec 9, 2014)

Chuck it tail down on a frying pan for a short period. Remove it and test to see if there is still some residul magnetism. If there is then just heat it for a bit more.

I believe the heat should be somewhat cumulative, so you should be able to do it in a couple of short stints. Shouldn't be a need to leave it on there for ages. 

I would recommend you obviously remove the head, battery and o-ring.


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## Chicken Drumstick (Dec 9, 2014)

twl said:


> I prefer PWM dimming. In most cases it is not detectable, and it preserves the beam tint, instead of going green in the lower modes.
> I would take PWM over current control every time.


Not all current controlled lower modes suffer tint shifting. Although I don't know why.

And PWM is very noticeable. Don't believe me, just wave your index finger up and down infront of the torch and observe the disco like strobe affect.


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## Chicken Drumstick (Dec 9, 2014)

Anyone know if it's 10440 compatible?

Also looks to be a shame about the modes. I think a lower low would have been nice in a light this size. Afterall it seems crazy to find a large light just to get a moonlight mode.

Note sure about the mid either, seems you'd just use high or low. And I still can't see the point in a strobe on a light this size and with a UI that takes so long to get to it. There really is ZERO point in it.

Love the clip and the magnet however.

Last up, do you think they drive the Nichia at the same amps as the XP-G2? Seems a shame to see the lumen drop. Guess it would not help the Nichia sales, but a shame they don't offer something like an XP-G2 R5 3C NW and 80CRI. It's pretty darn close to the Nichia visually, but more lumens.


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## Chicken Drumstick (Dec 9, 2014)

Just noticed something else on the specs page:


[h=3]Lens[/h]

Waterwhite glass lens w/ harden treatment
Anti-reflective (AR) coating on both side (96% transparency)
[h=3]Reflector[/h]

Optical grade acrylic TIR optics





Do you really think it has a plastic TIR and a glass lens?


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## Bad_JuJu (Dec 9, 2014)

Chicken Drumstick said:


> Just noticed something else on the specs page:
> 
> 
> *Lens*
> ...



Only one way to find out...


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## twl (Dec 9, 2014)

Chicken Drumstick said:


> Not all current controlled lower modes suffer tint shifting. Although I don't know why.
> 
> And PWM is very noticeable. Don't believe me, just wave your index finger up and down infront of the torch and observe the disco like strobe affect.


I know what PWM is. I have some PWM lights and some current controlled lights. I rarely find myself pointing my lights at fan blades, or doing other "tests" to find out if I can force them into some artificial circumstance where I "might" be just barely able to detect some PWM effects. My PWM lights are essentially undetectable in normal use.

If I had a curremt controlled light that didn't turn green in the low modes, I would like that just fine.
i don't care what method they use, as long as it doesn't cause issues in normal use. And from the experiences I have had, I notice much less intrusion from PWM than current controlled.
That being said, if the PWM was a "strobe light" that is easily detectable in normal use, then I wouldn't like that.
But my lights are primarily quality made lights from the US. The Chinese lights may not be up to this standard to which I am accustomed.

I don't have any EagTacs, but this looked intetesting until I found out it had a magnet in it.
Now it"s no longer interesting.


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## yoyoman (Dec 9, 2014)

I have one light with slow PWM. All the others are fast - I guess the correct term is high frequency - and the PWM is not noticeable. PWM is also sometimes called constant color.

Current controlled lights may change the tint a low level, but I only notice that when white wall hunting. Never noticed it in actual use. 

PWM is a polarizing topic. Some are sensitive to it and many just hate the idea of it. Some people also hate the tint changes that can come from constant current. A very polarizing topic. Almost as polarizing as the ZL UI, lol.


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## orbital (Dec 9, 2014)

+

Flat regulation gives the same tint & output straight across,, you'll likely pop in a fresh cell way before it's out of regulation.
the tint argument is _suggestive thinking_ done by a manufacturer who can't do flat regulation.

*Because the clip is removable, finding a different clip could be a possibility *


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## yoyoman (Dec 9, 2014)

^ What about tint changes at lower modes? Is that a misperception on my part due to the lower output?


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## yoyoman (Dec 9, 2014)

Just checked the specs: Operating voltage 0.8 - 4.2V. Battery Type: AAA or 10440.



Chicken Drumstick said:


> Anyone know if it's 10440 compatible?


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## orbital (Dec 9, 2014)

yoyoman said:


> ^ What about tint changes at lower modes? Is that a misperception on my part due to the lower output?



+

no, but the tint will be a bit warmer anyway even w/ pwm

that bit of time _off _factors in


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## defloyd77 (Dec 10, 2014)

Another observation I just made was that the tailcap almost has to be removeable judging by the look of the clip and the fact that it's removeable. I do not see any opening in the clip's ring that goes around the light, so it's obviously not a snap on clip. I'm guessing it goes on in a similar way to the Preons, which if I am right, this could open up some options for other tailcaps such as a magnetless one or a reverse clicky.


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## leon2245 (Dec 10, 2014)

MojaveMoon07 said:


> I'm concerned about the magnet in the tailcap after reading a negative testimonial about the foursevens atom's magnet.



Look man, I ain't gonna fall for no magnet in the tailcap.


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## Chicken Drumstick (Dec 10, 2014)

twl said:


> I know what PWM is. I have some PWM lights and some current controlled lights. I rarely find myself pointing my lights at fan blades, or doing other "tests" to find out if I can force them into some artificial circumstance where I "might" be just barely able to detect some PWM effects. My PWM lights are essentially undetectable in normal use.
> 
> If I had a curremt controlled light that didn't turn green in the low modes, I would like that just fine.
> i don't care what method they use, as long as it doesn't cause issues in normal use. And from the experiences I have had, I notice much less intrusion from PWM than current controlled.
> ...


I have a reasonable number of lights to chose from. PWM is easy to detect most of the time. You don't need to shine it at a fan. And yes it can be quite noticeable when in use too. Just something you catch out of the corner of your eye while moving about. Or if you are pointing it at something that moves. Being out in the rain or near running water is even more evident.




twl said:


> I don't have any EagTacs, but this looked intetesting until I found out it had a magnet in it.
> Now it"s no longer interesting.


Well that's just weird.


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## Chicken Drumstick (Dec 10, 2014)

orbital said:


> +
> 
> Flat regulation gives the same tint & output straight across,, you'll likely pop in a fresh cell way before it's out of regulation.
> the tint argument is _suggestive thinking_ done by a manufacturer who can't do flat regulation.
> ...


Funny you should say that, as the worst tint shifting torch I own is my EagleTac D25LC2 Mini. A brilliant torch, but heavy tint shift on the two lower output modes.


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## orbital (Dec 10, 2014)

+

ET states for D25AAA = *Non-dimming constant current regulation for all output levels*
Likely not the case w/ li-ion though

really doesn't concern me either way...

What I would like to know is the beam pattern w/ 219 & the optic
hard to tell from this


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## Chicken Drumstick (Dec 10, 2014)

The Nichia 219B and XP-G2 are quite similar sized iirc, that and the combination of using a TIR, I wouldn't expect a hugely different beam profile between them.


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## orbital (Dec 10, 2014)

Chicken Drumstick said:


> Funny you should say that, as the worst tint shifting torch I own is my EagleTac D25LC2 Mini. A brilliant torch, but heavy tint shift on the two lower output modes.









...Low is flat regulated also, maybe double the hours of med.

I have a couple of D25LC2 minis', use them every day
only notice dimming on High,, basically time to put in a fresh 18650.


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## twl (Dec 10, 2014)

Chicken Drumstick said:


> I have a reasonable number of lights to chose from. PWM is easy to detect most of the time. You don't need to shine it at a fan. And yes it can be quite noticeable when in use too. Just something you catch out of the corner of your eye while moving about. Or if you are pointing it at something that moves. Being out in the rain or near running water is even more evident.
> 
> 
> 
> Well that's just weird.


Not really too weird.
I don't want to carry any magnet for any reason, especially built into an EDC flashlight that may be in my pocket with any number of steel objects clinging to the unwanted magnetic tailcap.

Movie frames change at a rate of 24 frames per second, much slower rate than any PWM rate. Do you complain about seeing the changing frames at the movies?


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## Bad_JuJu (Dec 10, 2014)

I'm just excited to pick up one of each emitter. The big question is which color to get which emitter in!? Im thinking blue xp-g2 and red nichia 219 b. That way I wont mix them up! I'm holding out until they are in stock regardless.


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## LG&M (Dec 10, 2014)

Looks like this might be my next light. AAA is great for EDC & I am due for something new.


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## FroggyTaco (Dec 11, 2014)

twl said:


> Movie frames change at a rate of 24 frames per second, much slower rate than any PWM rate. Do you complain about seeing the changing frames at the movies?



Yes I find movies especially during action scenes to be horribly blurry even on Blu-Ray. About the only time they look crisp is when it's a very slow onscreen movement or a very slow scene pan.


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## Chicken Drumstick (Dec 11, 2014)

orbital said:


> ...Low is flat regulated also, maybe double the hours of med.
> 
> I have a couple of D25LC2 minis', use them every day
> only notice dimming on High,, basically time to put in a fresh 18650.


I think we are talking at cross purposes here. I'm not talking about regulation of any kind at all. I'm talking about the tint you get on each output mode.

Low/Moon mode = very green coloured and muddy light
Low2 = still green
Med = white'ish
High = Cool white


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## Chicken Drumstick (Dec 11, 2014)

twl said:


> Not really too weird.
> I don't want to carry any magnet for any reason, especially built into an EDC flashlight that may be in my pocket with any number of steel objects clinging to the unwanted magnetic tailcap.


It might yet be removable.



twl said:


> Movie frames change at a rate of 24 frames per second, much slower rate than any PWM rate. Do you complain about seeing the changing frames at the movies?


Not really a like for like comparison, although at the cinema when the camera pans, yes you can notice it. The same is true with flashlights. I'm not saying it has to bother you, but you have to be pretty ignorant to not notice it under the conditions where it is plainly evident.


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## Chicken Drumstick (Dec 11, 2014)

twl said:


> Movie frames change at a rate of 24 frames per second, much slower rate than any PWM rate. Do you complain about seeing the changing frames at the movies?


Quick vid to demonstrate how evident PWM is:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RuPOScLlkdc&feature=youtu.be


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## twl (Dec 11, 2014)

Omg!

Thankfully, I have been mercifully spared from afflictions such as this, and have managed to eke thru life while enjoying normal flashlight use.


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## yoyoman (Dec 11, 2014)

PWM is a very polarizing issue. In addition, some people are very sensitive to PWM. As I said above, I have 1 light with slow PWM on Low. All my other lights that use PWM have high frequencies so the PWM is not noticeable. I think the only issue more polarizing than PWM is the ZL UI. (Sorry to repeat post my posts above, but this is continuing discussion of PWM is distracting.)


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## orbital (Dec 11, 2014)

+

*EagleTac does not use PWM



__________________________
*


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## Bad_JuJu (Dec 11, 2014)

What were we talking about here again?


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## treek13 (Dec 11, 2014)

Bad_JuJu said:


> What were we talking about here again?



The frame rate of movies & whether magnets can cause them to tint shift, I think.


On topic though, it seems like the low & medium modes are both too high with too short of run-time for me. I would prefer a low of 2-3 lumen and a medium of about 20 lumen with longer run-times than the 6 & 1.3 hours claimed now.


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## Bad_JuJu (Dec 11, 2014)

Yes, back on topic, I wonder if selfbuilt will do a review of the two different versions? I'd be curious to see how different they are.


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## Berneck1 (Dec 11, 2014)

I want to see a review or two of this light before I buy one. I want to see how it compares to some of the other AAA lights, particularly the Thrunite Ti3 which has great output for a AAA light. I also don't know how much I trust that detachable tailcap. I'm sure some will love the magnet, but I personally have never felt the need. I wonder how it would interfere with credit cards, thumb drives or other devices in a pocket.... 


Sent from my iPad using Candlepowerforums


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## CreeCrazy (Dec 13, 2014)

Just got mine! Ordered from Andrew & Amanda. I'm liking this little light.


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## Bad_JuJu (Dec 13, 2014)

You cant just leave us hanging! Thoughts, comments, comparisons....


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## LedTed (Dec 13, 2014)

Chicken Drumstick said:


> Anyone know if it's 10440 compatible?



Yes,
Battery with protruded bottom top required 
AAA: (10-10.5mm/44-45mm)
* When using 10440 li-ion, turn down the brightness when the light becomes too hot to touch.


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## turkeylord (Dec 15, 2014)

LedTed said:


> Battery with protruded bottom top required


I saw that too, I think they meant to say "button top".


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## markr6 (Dec 15, 2014)

I can't get over that clip...darn thing sticks out almost the width of the actual light! At least it's removable, but that would probably kill the deal for me. For AAA lights, you're buying the small size. Why put a bigaz clip on it? I don't think durability has a big hand here. Oh well, still a nice light I may pick up eventually.


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## gunga (Dec 15, 2014)

Wow yeah. That IS a big clip...


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## yoyoman (Dec 15, 2014)

It's an anti-roll feature.


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## markr6 (Dec 15, 2014)

yoyoman said:


> It's an anti-roll feature.



You got that right! I think it would stay in place even if the Earth started spinning in random directions. I guess it's better than a rolling light. My Fenix E05 AAA, can't stand that thing rolling all over!


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## WalkIntoTheLight (Dec 15, 2014)

twl said:


> I prefer PWM dimming. In most cases it is not detectable, and it preserves the beam tint, instead of going green in the lower modes.
> I would take PWM over current control every time.



Just FYI, I have tested that theory by taking photographs of my (Cree XML and XPG) lights in both high modes and moonlight modes (they are current controlled), adjusting for exposure but keeping white-balanced fixed, and there is *no* visible difference in tint between high and low modes. There may be a tint shift as per the spec sheets, but it isn't visible to the eye.

I'll take current controlled low modes every time. IMO, manufacturers that use PWM are just being cheap and lazy, because designing lights with good low-mode current control is trickier than just strobing your LED.


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## twl (Dec 15, 2014)

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Just FYI, I have tested that theory by taking photographs of my (Cree XML and XPG) lights in both high modes and moonlight modes (they are current controlled), adjusting for exposure but keeping white-balanced fixed, and there is *no* visible difference in tint between high and low modes. There may be a tint shift as per the spec sheets, but it isn't visible to the eye.
> 
> I'll take current controlled low modes every time. IMO, manufacturers that use PWM are just being cheap and lazy, because designing lights with good low-mode current control is trickier than just strobing your LED.



Glad you like them.
You can have them.


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## GordoJones88 (Dec 15, 2014)

markr6 said:


> You got that right!
> I think it would stay in place even if the Earth started spinning in random directions.
> I guess it's better than a rolling light.


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## robert.t (Dec 16, 2014)

I'm in two minds about this. I really like my D25A & C and there are not enough AAA lights that are this small, can tail stand and generally don't suck. But a magnet in a AAA light? I'm sure some people think that's not the dumbest idea ever, but I'm not one of them. AAA lights are meant to go in your pocket with all the metal things and electronic things, some of which may be sensitive to magnetic fields. I'm strongly of the belief that if your going to supply a magnetic tail cap, it should be optional. The only good use for them I know of is glovebox lights intended to be kept in a car - and AAA is not the cell size I would choose for that use case.

Oh, and a fun unintended consequence of keeping this in a pocket with your keys is that after a while your keys will most likely end up magnetised, so they'll stick together on their own!

I'm sure I'll end up getting one anyway (also in spite of the no moonlight and too many blinky modes), but I'm going to wait and see what others have to say about it first. Also would like to know if the frying pan method is the best and least destructive way to demagnetise. I'm not interested if it only weakens the magnet. I've got some neodymium hard drive magnets which could perhaps be used to pull the magnetic pill out of the tail, depending on how well it's stuck in there.


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## robert.t (Dec 16, 2014)

Also FWIW, discussion of PWM is pointless without knowing the frequency. I know some are over 1kHz, which should be imperceptible.

I don't really care abou PWM or non-PWM. I care about perceptible strobing when looking at say, a fan, or waving fingers. I care about perceptible tint shift. I care about runtime compared to similar available lights.

Those are all things that are potentially affected by PWM, but let's discuss those as they affect this specific light rather than the religious arguments about PWM itself.

Incidentally, for the "movies are 24Hz" guy, you are so wrong about how the eye works it's hard to know where to begin. Firstly, the lowest frame rate required to consistently give the illusion of motion is 12fps not 24 (even lower in special cases), which is why old Disney cartoons are 12fps. But that's not the same thing as making flicker imperceptible. It's pretty easy to see flicker on a low-persistence display up to about 100Hz, especially in peripheral vision. I forget the actual figures but the eye can detect motion at a "frame rate" over 1,000Hz. However, the eye does not actually have a frame rate so that figure while illustrative, is sort of meaningless.

I have a particular dog in this race in that I get migraines and these can be brought on by flickering lights, including fluorescent tubes (50Hz here in the UK) and older computer monitors. I used to always check if a CRT monitor had perceptible flicker by looking at it indirectly. I could easily see it strobing up to about 90Hz and this only became imperceptible at 120Hz. Frequency in Hz doesn't tell the full story either: not every strobe is a perfect square wave with equal positive and negative phase. You don't get this problem with LCDs because they are high-persistence, so they don't flicker, even with a lower refresh rate (typically 60Hz). Older LCDs had a big problem with "ghosting" because of this. It's still noticeable at times, like if you scroll a web page really fast.

So, unlike most people here, I have a good reason to dislike PWM. And yet, given that exposure times tend to be quite short and total lumens relatively low, I really don't care about it very much at all.


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## WalkIntoTheLight (Dec 16, 2014)

robert.t said:


> But a magnet in a AAA light? I'm sure some people think that's not the dumbest idea ever, but I'm not one of them. AAA lights are meant to go in your pocket with all the metal things and electronic things, some of which may be sensitive to magnetic fields.
> 
> Oh, and a fun unintended consequence of keeping this in a pocket with your keys is that after a while your keys will most likely end up magnetised, so they'll stick together on their own!



Most keys are brass, so aren't affected by magnets at all. It's primarily just steel stuff that will be affected. I also believe the dangers of demagnetizing credit cards is overstated, and that's assuming you still use cards with those 1980's era magnetic strips. I think you'd have to stick the magnet right on the strip to do damage. Remember that magnets are used close to all kinds of more sensitive things; for example, computer hard drives use powerful magnets in their control arms, and those don't affect the contents of the magnetized hard disk.

I have a Preon P0 keychain light that has a magnet in its tail, and I find it more useful than annoying. You can stick the light on just about any steel surface to throw light into a room. Stick it on a light switch screw, a drawer handle, a hinge, a ceiling fan, etc. My keyring is steel, so it has a tendency to stick to it, but that's the only thing in my pocket that is steel, and it's really not an issue.

I do agree that having the option to remove the magnet would be nice.


----------



## 5S8Zh5 (Dec 16, 2014)

CreeCrazy said:


> Just got mine! Ordered from Andrew & Amanda. I'm liking this little light.


How do you like it?
Is the clip pliant enough for a one handed draw, one handed clip to pocket?


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## Flight_Deck (Dec 16, 2014)

Amazing light! 

Using a 10440 this thing is brighter than a four sevens Preon running on a 10440 (though not recommended by the manufacturer), by at least 20% to my eye.

A real keeper to be sure!


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## Flight_Deck (Dec 16, 2014)

5S8Zh5 said:


> How do you like it?
> Is the clip pliant enough for a one handed draw, one handed clip to pocket?



Yes, the clip is quite pliable. A big clip to be sure, but I'm REALLY liking this little light!


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## defloyd77 (Dec 16, 2014)

I'm looking at the instruction manual on ET's site, it says the output levels are 100%, 30% and 8%. That'd be perfect for me, I wonder if the mistake is in the manual or on the site?


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## robert.t (Dec 16, 2014)

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Most keys are brass, so aren't affected by magnets at all. It's primarily just steel stuff that will be affected. I also believe the dangers of demagnetizing credit cards is overstated, and that's assuming you still use cards with those 1980's era magnetic strips. I think you'd have to stick the magnet right on the strip to do damage. Remember that magnets are used close to all kinds of more sensitive things; for example, computer hard drives use powerful magnets in their control arms, and those don't affect the contents of the magnetized hard disk.



I had to test this out, with my over-powered neodymium magnets. Turns out that 50% of my keys are indeed non-magnetic. The other 50% are, as are the key rings.

The aforementioned magnets came from a hard drive, so you may not be surprised to learn I know a thing or two about those. When in place the magnetic field will not interfere with the platters. They are located to the side of the platters, not over them and shaped so that the field is directed in a fairly straight line, not a sphere that affects everything nearby. The magnets are also mounted on mu-metal plates which provides near 100% shielding. Holding a sufficiently powerful magnet over the platters _will_ scramble the data. The case will provide some shielding, but it won't be impervious to strong fields. Secure data erasure companies use degaussers to do this intentionally.

Modern electronics aren't as sensitive as hard drives, but most smartphones contain magnetometers (aka tilt sensors). These, unsurprisingly are sensitive to magnetic fields. You'd probably have a hard time damaging them directly, but if any parts of the phone gets magnetised that could permanently affect them. Also anything that has a magnetic smart-cover sensor will be switched on or off when a magnet gets near it.

There are probably lots of solid state circuits that would be damaged by a very strong magnet such as the hard drive ones, but a small one like you'd get in in this tail cap probably isn't big enough to do much damage, even if it is rare-earth.

To be fair, you're probably right that these magnets are small enough not to cause too much trouble, generally. Most of my memories of bad magnet-related experiences come from carrying hard drive magnets around in my pockets. Pro tip: don't do that. Especially near radiators.


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## WalkIntoTheLight (Dec 16, 2014)

robert.t said:


> There are probably lots of solid state circuits that would be damaged by a very strong magnet such as the hard drive ones, but a small one like you'd get in in this tail cap probably isn't big enough to do much damage, even if it is rare-earth.



I've carried it around in my pocket, along with my wallet that has a few magnetic-strip cards on them, and I've never had an issue. I wouldn't stick it against a CRT monitor or a portable hard drive, but carrying it around in your pocket doesn't seem to be a cause for concern. It's a fairly strong magnet right up against a steel surface, but a centimetre away it won't even lift a paperclip.


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## turkeylord (Dec 16, 2014)

Flight_Deck said:


> Amazing light!
> 
> Using a 10440 this thing is brighter than a four sevens Preon running on a 10440 (though not recommended by the manufacturer), by at least 20% to my eye.
> 
> A real keeper to be sure!


 How is the mode spacing on 10440?



robert.t said:


> Most of my memories of bad magnet-related experiences come from carrying hard drive magnets around in my pockets. Pro tip: don't do that. Especially near radiators.


 :laughing:


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## Flight_Deck (Dec 16, 2014)

turkeylord said:


> How is the mode spacing on 10440?
> 
> :laughing:



I'd say they are right at or about the published values of 8%, 30% and 100%. 

Positively WICKED bright for its size on a 10440.


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## Flight_Deck (Dec 16, 2014)

A note on the clip: 

I'm using mine as a keychain light, so the clip is superfluous. I found that by patiently hyperextending the clip over and over again that I was able to induce a fatigue crack, allowing a perfectly clean removal, ring and all. It looks and works great without it, with just an indented ring at the end where the clip used to be. 

Still a little bit of a bother as the magnet continually attaches itself to the steel key ring, but I can live with that (as opposed to trying to dig out the magnet). It's a STRONG manget too, able to support my ring that includes 3 keys, car remote, small knife on a second ring and the light itself, all from a horizontal metal surface.

I'm buying 2 more.


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## turkeylord (Dec 16, 2014)

Flight_Deck said:


> I'd say they are right at or about the published values of 8%, 30% and 100%.
> 
> Positively WICKED bright for its size on a 10440.


Excellent. 



Flight_Deck said:


> Still a little bit of a bother as the magnet continually attaches itself to the steel key ring, but I can live with that (as opposed to trying to dig out the magnet). It's a STRONG manget too, able to support my ring that includes 3 keys, car remote, small knife on a second ring and the light itself, all from a horizontal metal surface


I would take a look at titanium key rings. Something like this maybe. Stainless might work too, though I doubt a stainless key ring would be the right alloy to be non-magnetic.


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## WalkIntoTheLight (Dec 16, 2014)

turkeylord said:


> I would take a look at titanium key rings. Stainless might work too, though I doubt a stainless key ring would be the right alloy to be non-magnetic.



Titanium would work, as would brass or aluminum. Stainless steel won't, because it's still composed of mostly iron (which is magnetic).


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## turkeylord (Dec 16, 2014)

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Stainless steel won't, because it's still composed of mostly iron (which is magnetic).


Not all stainless is magnetic. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stainless_steel#Electricity_and_magnetism


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## markr6 (Dec 16, 2014)

GordoJones88 said:


>



LOL love it! Stressful Tuesday and needed a good laugh today!

I need to stop coming to this thread or I'll end up with one of these and another $30 down!


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## WalkIntoTheLight (Dec 16, 2014)

turkeylord said:


> Not all stainless is magnetic. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stainless_steel#Electricity_and_magnetism



Oh, in that case, it's worth a try. Bring a magnet to the store and try it out on some keyrings to see which ones are non-magnetic. I checked it out on some stainless steel around the house (with a very large and strong magnet), and you're right that some of it is only very slightly magnetic, and probably wouldn't even hold a small magnet.


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## burntoshine (Dec 16, 2014)

Love the Neil deGrasse Tyson clip! His podcast is great.

I'm going to pick one of these up. I was just thinking that I need another AAA light. I got rid of most of them, but I just realized I had A LOT of AAA batteries around.

I'm not sure how I feel about the magnet, but it shouldn't be much of an issue. I don't think I will EDC this thing, anyway. This will be my second nichia 219 light. It's a good tint; not my favorite, which is a warmer high cri, but I like it quite nicely.


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## 5S8Zh5 (Dec 17, 2014)

I see the XP-G2 output is 12 / 60 / 145 lumens. And the Nichia 219B is 115 max. What would be the low / mid output for the 219B?


D25AAA Technical Specifications




_


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## defloyd77 (Dec 17, 2014)

5S8Zh5 said:


> I see the XP-G2 output is 12 / 60 / 145 lumens. And the Nichia 219B is 115 max. What would be the low / mid output for the 219B?
> 
> 
> D25AAA Technical Specifications
> ...



10/48/115 LED lumens or 6/32/68 ANSI.


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## WalkIntoTheLight (Dec 17, 2014)

defloyd77 said:


> 10/48/115 LED lumens or 6/32/68 ANSI.



40% loss in light OTF? Is that normal?


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## Chicken Drumstick (Dec 18, 2014)

robert.t said:


> I'm in two minds about this. But a magnet in a AAA light? I'm sure some people think that's not the dumbest idea ever, but I'm not one of them. AAA lights are meant to go in your pocket with all the metal things and electronic things, some of which may be sensitive to magnetic fields.


I don't understand all this hate towards the magnet :thinking:

What things do you carry in your pocket that will be affected by it? Credit/Debit cards use smart chips, phones will be fine, memory cards won't care a jot.

Most keys are not magnetic....


I often EDC my Olight S15 Baton, tail down in my pocket. It too has a magnet, not once has this been an issue.

I also have a magnet clip on my iPhone case as I'm sure many others do. This too has never been an issue.


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## LedTed (Dec 18, 2014)

markr6 said:


> This, plus I hate when they make a tiny light but put a clip on it that sticks out 1/2 mile.



I wish I had one of these yesterday. I could have used that "1/2 mile" clip to attach the light to a yardstick. Then, use the magnet on the light, with the extra reach, to help recover a dropped screw from under an environmental chamber. Yep, I ordered one of these as soon as I got home last night.


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## markr6 (Dec 18, 2014)

LedTed said:


> I wish I had one of these yesterday. I could have used that "1/2 mile" clip to attach the light to a yardstick. Then, use the magnet on the light, with the extra reach, to help recover a dropped screw from under an environmental chamber. Yep, I ordered one of these as soon as I got home last night.



There you go! Eagletac thought of that beforehand! They forgot to show that application in the marketing materials, though. Darn.


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## robert.t (Dec 18, 2014)

LedTed said:


> I wish I had one of these yesterday. I could have used that "1/2 mile" clip to attach the light to a yardstick. Then, use the magnet on the light, with the extra reach, to help recover a dropped screw from under an environmental chamber. Yep, I ordered one of these as soon as I got home last night.



That's a pretty specialised use-case. Still good to know there's a light out there for everyone


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## kj2 (Dec 19, 2014)

In German.


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## AVService (Dec 19, 2014)

O ordered 2 this afternoon from Light Junction and they said they had them sitting there right now too!
They don't have the HiCri they think but they also were not too convincing so I will just wait and see?

I asked about the colors as I thought they had to be other than just decoration but now I was convinced that they are just a silly accent for some reason?

Anyway with the 20% discount there now I just had to give them a shot,I also ordered one of the Olight Ti AAA rechargeable models,can't say exactly why?


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## Gadgetman7 (Dec 20, 2014)

For the people that want to demagnetize their lights. You can use a cigarette lighter to permanently demagnetize them. Takes about a minute depending on the output of your lighter.


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## GordoJones88 (Dec 21, 2014)

Gadgetman7 said:


> For the people that want to demagnetize their lights. You can use a cigarette lighter to permanently demagnetize them. Takes about a minute depending on the output of your lighter.



You'll end up with a magnetic lighter . . .


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## Fireclaw18 (Dec 21, 2014)

Chicken Drumstick said:


> I don't understand all this hate towards the magnet :thinking:
> 
> What things do you carry in your pocket that will be affected by it? Credit/Debit cards use smart chips, phones will be fine, memory cards won't care a jot.
> 
> ...



Here in the states most credit cards still use magnetic strips.

I noticed that in my latest credit card the bank did add a smart chip. But ALL the stores still use magnetic card readers. Smart chip readers don't seem to exist here yet.


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## defloyd77 (Dec 21, 2014)

Flight_Deck said:


> A note on the clip:
> 
> I'm using mine as a keychain light, so the clip is superfluous. I found that by patiently hyperextending the clip over and over again that I was able to induce a fatigue crack, allowing a perfectly clean removal, ring and all. It looks and works great without it, with just an indented ring at the end where the clip used to be.
> 
> ...



Why did you break the clip off, it's advertised as being removeable, but I doubt this was the method they had in minnd. Did you try twisting of the tailcap?


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## orbital (Dec 21, 2014)

defloyd77 said:


> Why did you break the clip off, it's advertised as being removeable, but I doubt this was the method they had in minnd. Did you try twisting of the tailcap?



^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

can't believe this hasn't been asked yet,,, how do you remove the clip w/o breaking it off
breaking it off is not _user removable_


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## Flight_Deck (Dec 21, 2014)

Deleted.


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## 5S8Zh5 (Dec 22, 2014)

Just a note on the finish of the one that I returned. It reminded me of those news clips of recalled children's toys due to paint, the black is so shiny, cheesy looking. And mine was rushed out the door - there was a touch mark on the body, and in the center of the clip that would not rub out.



_


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## orbital (Dec 23, 2014)

+

Tailcap update:

*"D25AAA During testing, we find the tailcap may loosen, so in batch production we glued the tailcap so clip is no longer removeable, we will edit the (web site) page."
*
glued!:shakehead

___________________________________________________________________


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## Chicken Drumstick (Dec 23, 2014)

orbital said:


> +
> 
> Tailcap update:
> 
> ...


Shame they didn't spend a bit more time in R&D and solve the issue rather than simply offer a bodged solution and a compromised design.


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## Flight_Deck (Dec 23, 2014)

orbital said:


> +
> 
> Tailcap update:
> 
> ...



Personally I won't complain as I lost a Four Sevens Preon once for exactly that reason.


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## AVService (Dec 23, 2014)

Flight_Deck said:


> Personally I won't complain as I lost a Four Sevens Preon once for exactly that reason.


I think I might return mine for this feature?


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## Flight_Deck (Dec 23, 2014)

As I mentioned in post #85, I was able to fatigue and subsequently break my clip off cleanly, but I certainly agree that this is not an optimum solution.


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## defloyd77 (Dec 23, 2014)

So now that we know that the tailcap is a seperate piece glued to the body, one must rethink heating the tailcap to demagnetize the magnet. Is there an o-ring on the tailcap? What would the amount of heat needed to demagnetize do to an o-ring and also to the glue?


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## AVService (Dec 23, 2014)

Well if its true that the Clip is glued in or on AND the finish is as crappy as reported above these sure don't sound like the light I hoped that I was getting.
And they also don't seem closely related to the D25 lights that I already have and really like either.

I will see soon enough.


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## LEDburn (Dec 23, 2014)

Was really interested when I saw the thread. Seems they have attached the D25 name to a poorly thought out light in order to grab sales so will be casually be walking by this one.

They did do some things right to incite a buying frenzy though - li-ion support and 219B - but other than that it seems a bit gimmicky. Especially with the coloured bits.


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## KQL (Dec 23, 2014)

Received mine today, it's pretty junky. The clip is not even touching the body, and since it's not removable I'm not sure how I'm going to tighten it up. The magnet is not glued on flush with the tailcap, so it wobbles terribly when "tail-standing" and just falls over. It flickers in low if you don't tighten the head with authority. 

What a shame. Had such high hopes since I love the lightweight AAA lights and the Nichia. I was already skeptical of the 10 lumen low, as I do like mine sub-lumen lows, but was willing to give it a shot for the other positives already mentioned.


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## ShineOnYouCrazyDiamond (Dec 23, 2014)

Jeeze - reading this thread you'd think this light is a total piece of crap. 

I just received mine in the mail, ordered through Amazon, and I am quite pleased with it. The finish looks clean, the clip (while large) is very functional, the magnet flush enough, and the light works just fine.

I got the N219B version and on NiMH and 10440 it works fine. The beam is very usable. Personally I can see this light becoming a nice little EDC companion.


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## 18650 (Dec 23, 2014)

ShineOnYouCrazyDiamond said:


> Jeeze - reading this thread you'd think this light is a total piece of crap. I just received mine in the mail, ordered through Amazon, and I am quite pleased with it. The finish looks clean, the clip (while large) is very functional, the magnet flush enough, and the light works just fine. I got the N219B version and on NiMH and 10440 it works fine. The beam is very usable. Personally I can see this light becoming a nice little EDC companion.


 You have to keep in mind this thing costs 50% more than a lot of other popular AAA (aluminum) lights. $30 vs $20.


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## GordoJones88 (Dec 23, 2014)

Really a very poor design not to be able to remove the pocket clip on a AAA for keychain duty.


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## ShineOnYouCrazyDiamond (Dec 24, 2014)

18650 said:


> You have to keep in mind this thing costs 50% more than a lot of other popular AAA (aluminum) lights. $30 vs $20.



Some of us don't consider $30 a lot for a light. Also - clip option on AAA. Show me others with as good a clip.



GordoJones88 said:


> Really a very poor design not to be able to remove the pocket clip on a AAA for keychain duty.



As above - show me other option with this good a clip for EDC duty? Maybe you need to consider that this light isn't for keychain duty since you have so many other options out there. Besides - what about us who don't carry keys? I haven't carried keys for 8 years since I lived in downtown Boston. My car has proximity key that sits in my coat pocket. My house has a garage door opener. My office has a key card. A big fat keychain is so, well, 2000's. 

Just the way I see it - I like a tiny light with a clip and this fits the bill for me perfectly.

Besides - full LiIon support that doesn't blow out or change the Low/Med levels yet gives DD on high is pretty unique. EagleTac make some very solid drivers.


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## AVService (Dec 24, 2014)

It is more the Bait and Switch nature of advertising the clip as removable and then it not being that way that is aggravating to me.
Whether intended or not this is a pretty huge detail in a pretty small light for me.

I am thrilled for you not seeing it this way but we each have our own standards for judging these things and this is falling fairly short of mine if this is true?

Also the measure of this being related to the family of lights it is to belong in is the reason I pulled the trigger in the first place.
If mine are not obvious members of that family on person why wouldn't I be let down?

I will wait and see like I said and then decide,oh Friday when will you arrive!



ShineOnYouCrazyDiamond said:


> Some of us don't consider $30 a lot for a light. Also - clip option on AAA. Show me others with as good a clip.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


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## ShineOnYouCrazyDiamond (Dec 24, 2014)

AV - I think you are judging the situation kind of harshly. You all calling this a bait and switch when in reality I don't see it that way at all. They had a problem with a part staying on, the literature was already published and printed, they had to make a change - I see that as thoughtful in many ways. I know that people here are more particular than most and some are downright passionate to an extereme (not implying you are either). Thus stronger reactions than the general public. 

I think they saw a problem and fixed it with the clip. Love it or don't, ya know. I would prefer that than them selling 1 million of these lights only to have 500,000 returned because the clip keep falling off. Which is worse?


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## AVService (Dec 24, 2014)

I am trying to reserve judgement at all until I have the light in hand.

I didn't accuse them of Bait and Switch I am just observing that now it looks sort of like that in that it is not as advertised.
I tried to be succinct when making that distinction but evidently I was not clear enough?
I don't have any reason to think they are deceiving anyone intentionally.

I think it is up to each of us how we judge these lights both before buying and once we get them into our hands.

If I buy based on ne set of features but then the light is missing those features how would that be a harsh judgement and not a considered observation?

If there were more choice in this AAA form factor it would be nice,it is a small mystery to me why there is not?

So for me given that the removable clip was a huge selling point as was the lineage implied by the name,I will see how it goes when I get them in my hands but I won't keep and support the light if it does not meet my needs. 
I already have a small pile of those unfortunately.



ShineOnYouCrazyDiamond said:


> AV - I think you are judging the situation kind of harshly. You all calling this a bait and switch when in reality I don't see it that way at all. They had a problem with a part staying on, the literature was already published and printed, they had to make a change - I see that as thoughtful in many ways. I know that people here are more particular than most and some are downright passionate to an extereme (not implying you are either). Thus stronger reactions than the general public.
> 
> I think they saw a problem and fixed it with the clip. Love it or don't, ya know. I would prefer that than them selling 1 million of these lights only to have 500,000 returned because the clip keep falling off. Which is worse?


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## ShineOnYouCrazyDiamond (Dec 24, 2014)

AVService said:


> If I buy based on ne set of features but then the light is missing those features how would that be a harsh judgement and not a considered observation?
> 
> If there were more choice in this AAA form factor it would be nice,it is a small mystery to me why there is not?
> 
> ...



Fair enough - it just came across a bit harsh. I can understand that one would buy a light with certain expectations and feel disappointment if the delivered product is lacking. For me the removable clip was not a huge factor so the workaround to make things more secure is okay for me. 

I love the AAA form factor and it is able to produce enough light (sometimes with limited runtime, but at least enough to still get through a day) for almost all my general use needs. The LF2XT is still the defacto standard on which I judge all lights. On that basis the field of acceptable lights is definitely lacking. I don't understand why more companies haven't come out with better AAA lights. I'd still love to see an AAA light with an infinite UI like the V10R.


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## orbital (Dec 24, 2014)

+

I purchased the light for the sole reason that I could remove that _*fugly*_ pocket clip.
..my first thought was in fact bait & switch

*if that clip was at least halfway decent,, there would not be this discussion*


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## robert.t (Dec 24, 2014)

ShineOnYouCrazyDiamond said:


> the literature was already published and printed, they had to make a change - I see that as thoughtful in many ways.



That's not "thoughtful" that's just crap QA.

OTOH, I think "bait and switch" is a bit strong. They made a mistake, but I can see why people would be annoyed as it's pretty clear that this light is not up to the standard most of us would expect for the D25 series. That said, from what I've read the early D25s had a lot of problems too (especially with lithium ion compatibility) so I hope Eagletac will get all this sorted out in the next generation. I'll be waiting for that, even though there are some aspects of this that I like the sound of. Plus, the cost in the UK is £25 which is $40 US. Not insanely high, but a bit much for a half-finished product.



ShineOnYouCrazyDiamond said:


> I think they saw a problem and fixed it with the clip. Love it or don't, ya know. I would prefer that than them selling 1 million of these lights only to have 500,000 returned because the clip keep falling off. Which is worse?



This is rather the point isn't it? They couldn't very well sell these if they are all just going to get returned because the tailcaps fall off. That's not the customer's problem: they'd make a huge loss dealing with all those returns. In that situation, do you simply glue the caps on and say "job done" or do you get it remanufactured correctly? If they had a proper QA process and weren't rushing it out for pre-xmas, it would have been the latter. Doing the former is what generally puts people off Chinese brands because you never know what you're going to get.


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## ShineOnYouCrazyDiamond (Dec 24, 2014)

orbital said:


> +
> 
> I purchased the light for the sole reason that I could remove that _*fugly*_ pocket clip.
> ..my first thought was in fact bait & switch
> ...



But that's not bait and switch, is it?

Bait and switch is when you view an add for a 40" TV for $500 and you go to the store (ie: you are baited) and they magically don't have that model but they have this great model which is even better and a great deal at only $650 (ie: the switch). 

You product wasn't switched - just fixed. The passion being expressed here is a little extreme and TBH if you don't like it then return the light.


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## AVService (Dec 24, 2014)

It will be tough to accept this important feature as being "Fixed" pun intended of course as it has been changed significantly from the advertised features of this light.

So no I don't think it is out of line to want what we paid for?

On another somewhat related note,I am in the Countdown for my annual Xmas Eve playing of "Wish You Were Here" at the appropriate volume level of 12 or more as it should be!

Sort of a yearly attempt to let the smoke out of my speakers and let the neighbors remember what I do every day!

And from Vinyl usually!

Now that is Xmas Cheer!



ShineOnYouCrazyDiamond said:


> But that's not bait and switch, is it?
> 
> Bait and switch is when you view an add for a 40" TV for $500 and you go to the store (ie: you are baited) and they magically don't have that model but they have this great model which is even better and a great deal at only $650 (ie: the switch).
> 
> You product wasn't switched - just fixed. The passion being expressed here is a little extreme and TBH if you don't like it then return the light.


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## Bad_JuJu (Dec 24, 2014)

Dear lord. All this hubub over a glued clip. All of a sudden this light doesnt work correctly and isnt able to be used for its intended purpose of seeing in the dark. You guys are a little .....um too passionate over a clip. Does it still turn on and light up the dark? You guys should be able to see the extreme you have taken this to.

Honestly guys and gals, wheres the holiday spirit, get off your high horses and join the rest of us.

Merry Christmas, Happy Hanukkah, Happy festivus.


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## AVService (Dec 24, 2014)

Thanks,really helpful comment.

Just wait till the airing of grievances!



Bad_JuJu said:


> Dear lord. All this hubub over a glued clip. All of a sudden this light doesnt work correctly and isnt able to be used for its intended purpose of seeing in the dark. You guys are a little .....um too passionate over a clip. Does it still turn on and light up the dark? You guys should be able to see the extreme you have taken this to.
> 
> Honestly guys and gals, wheres the holiday spirit, get off your high horses and join the rest of us.
> 
> Merry Christmas, Happy Hanukkah, Happy festivus.


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## KQL (Dec 24, 2014)

Bad_JuJu said:


> Dear lord. All this hubub over a glued clip. All of a sudden this light doesnt work correctly and isnt able to be used for its intended purpose of seeing in the dark. You guys are a little .....um too passionate over a clip. Does it still turn on and light up the dark? You guys should be able to see the extreme you have taken this to.
> 
> Honestly guys and gals, wheres the holiday spirit, get off your high horses and join the rest of us.
> 
> Merry Christmas, Happy Hanukkah, Happy festivus.



I'd say that a flashlight lost due to a crappy, unserviceable clip is indeed NOT doing its job of lighting up the dark. It's doing a fine job of laying on the ground in a parking lot. I've had many products with pocket clips, lights, pens, knives, etc, all of them eventually loosen up due to being clipped to different thickness fabrics. So I pop them off, bend them in a little and voilà, I'm back in business. To remove that functionality, seems pretty short sighted in their "fix it with glue" solution.


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## Big_Sam (Dec 24, 2014)

Well, I've had my D25AAA (blue) for a week now so can add my comments, I tried to add photos by my phone won't upload. 

Overall finish: very good, anodising is smooth and feels premium. The blue ring is actually the head, so won't wear off.

Output: very impressive, easily as good as the D25A, three levels well spaced. Strobes fun, but not perhaps useful. Beam pattern very even, great for short range inspection. 

Operation: twisty interface is easy to work out, starts on low which is ideal - but, it has the usual eagletac problem of poor head contacts, so tighten down well to stop flickering. 

Build: Good overall, threads fine and smooth, but o-ring is very small diameter so have to be careful, 2 spares in box which is good. The magnet is excellent, very handy. The clip.... hopeless. Bent within an hour in my pocket and fell out onto floor. It is NOT removeable, tried with pliers and made some nice dents, but tail won't unscrew, now the clip is loose. .. Where they went wrong was to punch a hole right at the pivot point and not to shape the clip like the D25A (which is the best pocket clip in my opinion). It is now only used as a key chain. 

I think that it is a shame the clip wasn't as well designed as the D25A, but its not enough of an issue to avoid it, I think it's a great light overall. 

The lens seems tough, dropped it accidentally onto a concrete floor with no effect.

I'll be giving away many of these in the future as gifts, just wish the packaging was as smart as the Olight i3s.

Merry Christmas! 

Sam


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## Bad_JuJu (Dec 24, 2014)

AVService said:


> Thanks,really helpful comment.
> 
> Just wait till the airing of grievances!


I thought this was the airing of grievances? 

To be be fair complaining isnt really helpful either.

Happy holidays AVS


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## SadlyTooLate (Dec 25, 2014)

I have one (Nichia version), and overall my impression is favorable. Tint, beam profile, and brightness levels are terrific. I wouldn't mind a lower low, but I'm fine with the modes as they are. Blinky modes are far enough out of the way not to bother me. 

Magnet is kinda useful, but does definitely discourage me from using it on a keychain. Clip has held up so far, but it's not a strong point. Body design aesthetics are kinda meh, and I could do without the bright white lettering, but that's a minor complaint. 

So basically, the head is fantastic, the body kinda mediocre. If the head could be Lego'd onto a better body, it could be pretty much perfect. I tried a Fenix e01 which is close, but no cigar. (The e01 head more or less works on the D25aaa's body, but not so well the other way around--the threading is just a little off.) 

The external threads are on the head, so it would need to be able to screw into a body. All my other aaa lights (like my LD01) are designed the reverse way, so no dice there either. I'd be curious to know if anyone has any luck with a different combination...


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## Big_Sam (Dec 26, 2014)

Eagletac D25AAA, Eagletac D25A, Olight S15








Beamshot comparison, max output

Eagletac D25AAA, Eagletac D25A The AAA has less spill overall, the TIR optics seem good.


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## ronniepudding (Dec 26, 2014)

Such a shame about the clip. Seeing Sam's pic with the bent clip sticking out (and no way to bend it back) makes this light a pass for me. The search for a 219B keychain light continues elsewhere. 


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## Berneck1 (Dec 26, 2014)

That is a bit of a disappointment about the clip. I would also liked to have seen the ability to swap the end cap with one without a magnet, or at least the option to buy one without the magnet. I feel like that magnet could be annoying with other things I tend to carry in my pocket and on my keychain. I also carry a USB drive with important documents on my keychain. Not sure how that magnet would affect it over time.




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## Glofindel (Dec 26, 2014)

I don't carry aaa flashlight by clipping anyway.
However with that much clip hanging out it might be a bit troublesome. Maybe I just wait if there is any improvement or Ti version.


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## Big_Sam (Dec 27, 2014)

It looks a lot bigger in the picture, it's only about quarter of an inch high, the whole light is pretty small.


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## burntoshine (Dec 27, 2014)

So, is there really no way to remove the clip? I just ordered one of these from illumination gear; the nichia 219 version. I plan to use it around the house, so the clip won't be a big deal either way, however I might try to remove it if I find it annoying in any way. I might just have to cut it off; but perhaps it won't be an issue.

I'll report back with my two cents...


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## Big_Sam (Dec 27, 2014)

burntoshine said:


> So, is there really no way to remove the clip? I just ordered one of these from illumination gear; the nichia 219 version. I plan to use it around the house, so the clip won't be a big deal either way, however I might try to remove it if I find it annoying in any way. I might just have to cut it off; but perhaps it won't be an issue.
> 
> I'll report back with my two cents...



It would appear that the end cap is firmly glued on, after attacking it with tools the clip now rotates a bit, but the end is solid. 

The clip does serve a useful purpose of something to grip when turning it on one handed. 

I think it could be worked off with fatigue bending fairly easily, but that is unnecessary.

Plenty of other lights have pretty hopeless clips also, I think the reason for the negativity is that it has been made a large feature by Eagletac, and our expectations for a 25quid light are too high.


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## jabe1 (Dec 27, 2014)

Could someone try to remove the tailcap after a bit of judicious heat gun application? If it is loctite, that would do it. 

I am disappointed in Eagletac for not making an immediate disclaimer and explanation regarding the clip. It is what should separate this light from so many other AAA lights, and now it turns out to be crap. Not only is it permanently attached, but it is designed poorly as to bend too easily.

fail.


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## burntoshine (Dec 27, 2014)

Thanks, Sam! I could always cut it with a dremel and file the rest down; or perhaps focus on just getting the back off. But the clip may be fine for indoor uses. The over-sized clip is a great anti-roll feature and the magnet is nifty for sticking to things around the house. These things don't translate well for EDC. However some people say the magnet is not an issue for them in the pocket. I might not have purchased this light if it was for EDC duty. I may occasionally travel with this light in some manner and may decide to streamline it and lose the clip. We shall see..

It's main purpose is to eat up all the AAA batteries I have left over from when I had several AAA lights. I had a stainless LOD, olive LOD, stainless neutral revo, Ku Ti LF2XT, natural LF2XT, and a natural LF2X that are now all gone; sold or given away. Now I own only one, a black LOD; it is quite old and has very bad PWM. The PWM is so noticeable that I really hate using it. The D25aaa seems like a good fit for my needs. I prefer warmer tints, but the nichia 219 is a great tint, too.

Is there much of a difference between the 219a and 219b? Or are they pretty much the same??


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## twl (Dec 27, 2014)

burntoshine said:


> Thanks, Sam! I could always cut it with a dremel and file the rest down; or perhaps focus on just getting the back off. But the clip may be fine for indoor uses. The over-sized clip is a great anti-roll feature and the magnet is nifty for sticking to things around the house. These things don't translate well for EDC. However some people say the magnet is not an issue for them in the pocket. I might not have purchased this light if it was for EDC duty. I may occasionally travel with this light in some manner and may decide to streamline it and lose the clip. We shall see..
> 
> It's main purpose is to eat up all the AAA batteries I have left over from when I had several AAA lights. I had a stainless LOD, olive LOD, stainless neutral revo, Ku Ti LF2XT, natural LF2XT, and a natural LF2X that are now all gone; sold or given away. Now I own only one, a black LOD; it is quite old and has very bad PWM. The PWM is so noticeable that I really hate using it. The D25aaa seems like a good fit for my needs. I prefer warmer tints, but the nichia 219 is a great tint, too.
> 
> Is there much of a difference between the 219a and 219b? Or are they pretty much the same??



219b is more efficient. More lumens per watt.


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## turkeylord (Dec 27, 2014)

twl said:


> 219b is more efficient. More lumens per watt.


219B is also slightly cooler (~5000k) and slightly lower CRI. I like them both.


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## StandardBattery (Dec 27, 2014)

burntoshine said:


> So, is there really no way to remove the clip? I just ordered one of these from illumination gear; the nichia 219 version. I plan to use it around the house, so the clip won't be a big deal either way, however I might try to remove it if I find it annoying in any way. I might just have to cut it off; but perhaps it won't be an issue.
> 
> I'll report back with my two cents...



Earlier on in the thead there was lots of talk about the tail cap as someone removed the clip with just bending and also managed to remove the ring, that's what started the entire discussion on if the clip was really removable as stated. Where there is a will there is a way.


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## ShineOnYouCrazyDiamond (Dec 27, 2014)

turkeylord said:


> 219B is also slightly cooler (~5000k) and slightly lower CRI. I like them both.



I was pretty sure the 219B is 4500K like the 219A and I find it a bit warmer (less rosey hue). The one's I've been getting loose from Mountain Electronics are shown to be binned at 4500K and 92 CRI. If you look over on the HDS #18 thread Hogo was saying that Henry tested the 219B to come in around 88 CRI just around the same as the 219A. 

I like the 219B better, but I agree that when you compare then side by side they are both really nice.


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## burntoshine (Dec 28, 2014)

Thanks for the replies! I've been wondering about the a & b thing for a while. I've seen the nichia 219 grow in popularity over several years. At some point, I started noticing people referring to specifically the a or b and it got me wondering if one was preferred over the other for one reason or another. A couple-ish years ago I bought a cheapie AA light with a 219 in it to check out the tint and I was pretty pleased with it. I love the incandescent-like warmer high cri tints. To a lesser extent, I am also fond of neutral white tints. The 219 seems to be a really nice neutral that has a higher cri than common neutrals. So, not a whole lot of difference between the two, then.

I'll have to go back and read more on the clip discussion as it seems I missed a big chunk of it..


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## AVService (Dec 28, 2014)

Well mine arrived Yesterday and I am mixed about it about like I thought I might be.

It is a lot smaller in hand than I thought it would be,about like an LD01 but not as sturdy feeling.

The output is pretty amazing for the size but the low is not really that low which I already knew too.
I do like that it always comes on in low though.
Mine is not the 219 model yet the beam is nicer and less green than I thought it would be,pretty much white and clear and throwy which is a nice change for a tiny light to me.

The clip does suck pretty badly.
The light overall seems much smaller than a Preon for example but the clip is so much bigger than the Preon clip that it makes the light seem bigger and of course it seems the clip is not going anywhere without some type of surgery?
Part of this is how far from the body the clip protrudes?
I might try heat later and see if I can get it off that way.
It seems about the size of the Dark Sucks clip for Preon except that it is not nice either.It is huge but not strong and seems like a cheap afterthought overall.
The clip will prevent rolling though and will allow for top of pants pocket placement where the magnet might not mess with other items in the pocket,it would just be so much better if removable and I would consider a Dark Sucks clip for it although that would about double the price of the light too.

Whats funny about this light is how small it is?
I tried clipping it inside my shirt front pocket and it is so short that it just will not ride comfortably there? Not terrible clipped to pants pocket but not usable for me in a shirt pocket.
Oddly the Microstream is just long enough to ride in the shirt OK.

I am not saying it is too small as that just seems like something not to complain about but it might be handy to know if you plan on shirt pocket carry like I do in the winter.

The magnet I have not had a chance o think about yet.

Edit: It just occurred to me that I also have an Olight I3 which is almost exactly the same size as the ET light.
The Olight is just slightly longer but the same diameter but the clip on the Olight is almost perfect in comparison too.
The Olight clip is removable but it also is not as in the way when installed and this is a huge difference for me.
There has been so much written about the Olight and I have not compared the output yet so I will leave that alone for now but the form comparison I did want to make.

Overall an interesting light.
I plan to use it more before deciding how I feel overall but it does not feel like a cheap knock off of a D25 to me,it is pretty nice just soooooooooo tiny!


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## LedTed (Dec 29, 2014)

KQL said:


> It flickers in low if you don't tighten the head with authority.



Mine does that as well. Using authority makes it a little hard to switch modes single handily. The corona of the slightly creamy XP-G2 LED beam shifts just noticeably to yellow when the flashlight is on high. But, this is only noticeable when white wall hunting.

My clip is well fitted. I like it. I also like the flush mounted magnet. Maybe the most important part, the beam quality is pretty good for use at hand or across the room. Plus, the "disco" modes are hidden.

Not a bad little light.


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## TweakMDS (Dec 30, 2014)

Nice, I just found this one. Guess there's another ET to add to the collection. I certainly hope they won't also make a titanium version of this X_X.
Definitely picking up a duo of this - although out of stock for now. I long since learned that for my own sanity, it's better to get two lights with different emitters right off the bat, or I'm gonna keep finding myself browsing them ^^


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## Berneck1 (Dec 30, 2014)

Wow, I imagined that light was larger than it is. The clip and magnet are still deterring me from getting it.


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## burntoshine (Jan 1, 2015)

Got my nichia 219 version yesterday in the mail. Quite a small light! The head turns very smoothly and it operates great. The tint is a smidgen cooler than my L3 Illumination L10 (nichia 219), but it's still good.

I've decided I'm going to remove the clip. I'll post pictures...

EDIT:


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## Big_Sam (Jan 2, 2015)

Right, got the clip off last night by accident, was sitting on the sofa absent mindedly bending the clip in and out and after half dozen movements it snapped cleanly at the base of the clip, a small wiggle and it came right off. Seems very weak now I see it off the light.

The damage you see in the photos was due to trying to unscrew the end. It appears to still be fully waterproof and can't see any light getting through where the clip was. My guess looking at the shape of the tube is that the end has a male thread and the body has the female thread and with the threadlock it remains waterproof.
















I would recommend that if you want to remove the clip, the easiest way is to just bend it back and forth till it goes, it did leave a very small mark on the body tube, but nothing major.

Without the clip it is a little more difficult to turn on and off, but the light is now truely tiny!

Despite this, it is still my favourite AAA light at the moment.


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## ShineOnYouCrazyDiamond (Jan 2, 2015)

burntoshine said:


> Got my nichia 219 version yesterday in the mail. Quite a small light! The head turns very smoothly and it operates great. The tint is a smidgen cooler than my L3 Illumination L10 (nichia 219), but it's still good.
> 
> I've decided I'm going to remove the clip. I'll post pictures...
> 
> EDIT:




So - are you pleased with your results? Reason I ask is that it would appear to me that you've basically ruined a nice light.


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## burntoshine (Jan 2, 2015)

ShineOnYouCrazyDiamond said:


> So - are you pleased with your results? Reason I ask is that it would appear to me that you've basically ruined a nice light.



LOL! Actually, when I removed the clip, the light stopped working!! I can't believe I did that!!!!! Can anyone help me???? Oh, wait, just effing kidding. I am indeed pleased with my results. As I am not intending to carry this light on a daily basis, the clip is pretty useless to me. The light's intended use is for miscellaneous around the house stuff. And the magnet is pretty handy for these applications.

Could you tell me how I "ruined" the light? The way I see it, it's not ruined whatsoever. It's only ruined if I decided to sell it and no one wants it sans clip / avec scratches. The light engine is still 100% functional.

I admit that I did a so-so job on removing the clip. I could have been more careful filing down the remaining metal that the dremel left behind. As you can see in the pictures, I accidentally scraped of some anodizing on the tail, near the split ring/keychain hole area. I could have done a much better job, but I really didn't care to. I adjust my care to each situation. 

I guess it's a "nice" light. But in my opinion, it's more of a "decent" light that I'm not too worried about scratching up, which had a clip that only got in the way and made the light unproportionally larger.

Trust me, I am under no illusions that I did a great job removing the clip. I could have done a much better job; didn't care to. I just posted the pictures for others to see. It's one option, but I have just seen a better one, by Big Sam.

Were you trying to make me feel bad about me rendering my "nice" light completely useless? Because it sure comes off that way.


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## burntoshine (Jan 2, 2015)

Big_Sam said:


> ...got the clip off last night by accident...it did leave a very small mark on the body tube...



You ruined it, dooder! ...Totally.


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## robert.t (Jan 2, 2015)

burntoshine said:


> Were you trying to make me feel bad about me rendering my "nice" light completely useless? Because it sure comes off that way.



FWIW, I didn't read it like an attempt to make you feel bad. However, others are obviously reading this with interest to see how viable the various methods of clip removal are. I personally would not want this light with the clip or the magnet, and I wouldn't be terribly happy with a new light that badly scratched up either, so for me this wouldn't be a viable option. Sometimes things look worse in photos, so I'd guess that's how the question was intended. Or you could read it as "do you think others would be happy with this result, or does it look as bad in person as it appears in the photos"? I don't think it was implied that you had ruined the light engine, but I would certainly describe the finish as ruined - maybe that's not important to you, but it is important to a lot of people, especially on a brand new light.

Anyway it certainly seems that bending until it snaps is the simpler and cleaner method all round. It's good that we've seen both results and two people have reported success with the bending method - although I'm still a bit concerned that the clean failures thus far are more luck than anything, and others might not snap so cleanly, forcing them to fall back on your method to clean up the results. A bit of making tape would probably help avoid the anodisation damage, but it all seems like an awful lot of hassle to me - I'd rather just wait for the manufacturer to sort these problems out than reward failure by paying for a light that has several problems, then trying to patch over those problems in ways that can ruin the finish and void the warranty.


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## ronniepudding (Jan 2, 2015)

Has anyone been able to loosen and remove the tail cap to take off the clip without breaking it? From what I've gathered the tail cap is threaded but also glued. Perhaps gentle heating would soften the glue and enable it to be unscrewed... Of course, that would de-magnetize the tail in the process. :/


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## ShineOnYouCrazyDiamond (Jan 2, 2015)

Every statement someone makes can be read multiple ways - how one decides to interpret it is up to the individual. I don't apologize for the things I say - freedom of speech - and I am allowed to express my opinion. It wasn't intended to make you feel bad. It was intended to point out that in my opinion, whether or not you intended, the clip removal ended up with a pretty scraped up light.

Ruined can be taken in many ways. Ruined as in the light doesn't work. Ruined as in the light is no longer aesthetically pleasing. Form or function really. I am sure the function is still there, but the form of the light has been definitely been taken to a place that it can never been recovered from. 

If it works for you then by all means the clip removal mission was a success. :thumbsup:


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## burntoshine (Jan 2, 2015)

I don't think ET or the dealer I purchased from would give me trouble about the clip and finish if I was returning the light due to a defect in the head, but I do understand your point(s). [I could very well be wrong] Yes, it is indeed a new light that already has a series of scratches. I was somewhat careful to not scratch the body. I paid attention to keep the file leaning more towards the tail side; the results: no scratches on the body, a lot of small scratches right by the keyring hole. I'm more careful to not drop the light, so to not damage any important internal parts. I would never be so careless to my HDS lights, or my herd of Zebras. I guess I'm just not so worried about the finish on the tail end of a $25 AAA light. Don't get me wrong, I wouldn't purposely abuse the finish. I'm so used to seeing the area around keyring holes all scratched up. Perhaps I just view the body of a little light like this as merely to protect the insides and keep stuff out; I haven't done much at all to change this.

You see, it wasn't a hassle at all. It probably took about two minutes. That's a big part of my point; or one of my points: minimal effort, a smidgen of care - no hassle. I very easily could have used some gorilla tape. I also could have used my much smaller file - which was sitting right next to the big one - and then filed slower and more carefully... and yet I didn't. I don't plan on selling the light. Maybe my son will be disappointed in me if I try to hand it down to him, but he ain't talkin' yet. I'll burn that bridge when I get to it.

Seeing how thin the part of the clip that wraps around the body of the light is, I'm even more glad I got that weak thing off of there.

I understand that most people wouldn't go my route (including me, after seeing how easy Sam bent his off). But I think it's cool when people share stuff on here. It can spark other (and hopefully better) ideas and so forth; and so on. I've learned a lot of tricks and helpers from this site. And I very much appreciate it. Snarkiness (I'm not talking about you, Robert) doesn't help a darn thing, however.


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## burntoshine (Jan 2, 2015)




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## Big_Sam (Jan 2, 2015)

One of the great things about CPF is the seeing different ways of doing things, I had intended to take a cutting disc to it after the holidays, but the snap saved me the effort. 

Just waiting to see if any UK retailers offer the nichia option, only have the CREE so far. 

Has anyone tried running a battery right down? I had it on high and it was on solid for a long while, then dropped to low and 5mins later went off and would not come on again, the AAA eneloop pro measured 0.86V, but went up to 0.9v before I charged it.

Anyone else tried a runtime test?

I Intend to do a full test when I get some free time. 

Happy New year by the way!


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## KQL (Jan 3, 2015)

Big Sam, that's a nice little claw/clip you have in those pics, could you tell me where it's from? Would love to get a few in that size.


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## Sadsack (Jan 3, 2015)

KOL, That looks like a TEC python clip


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## Big_Sam (Jan 4, 2015)

KQL said:


> Big Sam, that's a nice little claw/clip you have in those pics, could you tell me where it's from? Would love to get a few in that size.



Yes that's right, TEC python clip with tec split ring, seems quite strong. Got it from Flashaholics.co.uk.

The jaw is perfect size for keyrings.

Cheers


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## skr (Jan 10, 2015)

Berneck1 said:


> Wow, I imagined that light was larger than it is. The clip and magnet are still deterring me from getting it.



I wouldn't let that deter you. The magnet has already fallen out of the tailcap on my D25AAA after only 2 uses. The adhesive used to hold it in appears to be quite weak.


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## jruser (Jan 11, 2015)

Did anybody check for PWM (cell phone test)? The specs confuse me since they mention a switching frequency but also state constant current regulation.


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## LedTed (Jan 11, 2015)

jruser said:


> Did anybody check for PWM.



I had the same confusion, so I did the wave test in front of a mirror. I would have to conclude no PWM perceivable with the unaided eye.


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## thijsco19 (Jan 11, 2015)

As i understand it, it uses 1MHz pwm with constant the same current. So yes it has pwm but a very high one, 1MHz, and constant current at the same time.
(If it makes sense )


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## JKolmo (Jan 16, 2015)

jruser said:


> Did anybody check for PWM (cell phone test)? The specs confuse me since they mention a switching frequency but also state constant current regulation.



Sure has cell phone detectable PWM.


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## ScottJD (Jan 20, 2015)

Was this cell shot on high, med, or low. From what I understand the D 25 series only has PWM on the lower modes but the high mode Doesn't. This is with alkaline or nickel metal hydride batteries. I think they handled differently with Li-Ion.


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## JKolmo (Jan 20, 2015)

It was shot on low. I don't think there is any light that has PWM on high.


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## Tachead (Jan 20, 2015)

JKolmo said:


> It was shot on low. I don't think there is any light that has PWM on high.



There is indeed.


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## ScottJD (Jan 21, 2015)

JKolmo said:


> It was shot on low. I don't think there is any light that has PWM on high.



Yes, yes. Some manufacturers not only use PWM for better heat control of the LED but also because they beleive they can get better battery run times using PWM for all modes. but it can be argued if the design is good using quality parts that better battery life can be gained from contant regulated current control. I'm not going to argue either without the schematics and more knowledge of ones design.

Personally because of migraines I prefer to stay away from PWM lights. Some bother me and some have not but everyone is different and it depends on the Hz and lighting.


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## JKolmo (Jan 21, 2015)

Ahh OK guys, you learn everyday. Seems a bit odd to have PWM for high/max though.


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## Chicken Drumstick (Jan 21, 2015)

Big_Sam said:


> Without the clip it is a little more difficult to turn on and off, but the light is now truely tiny!


Surely it's no smaller than almost any other 1xAAA light.


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## rookiedaddy (Feb 5, 2015)

Received mine from meeting with seller tonight...






nice tint. small. lightweight. just love it!

don't know what changes, I can easily remove the clip from mine...






here's another shot of the light assemble back with clip removed...


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## Big_Sam (Feb 5, 2015)

Very interesting, stopped gluing them perhaps?


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## ronniepudding (Feb 5, 2015)

Interesting indeed... I noticed that at least one online retailer changed their description to say that the clip is not removable.


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## Kilovolt (Feb 5, 2015)

I just got the version with the UV LED and it's excellent for charging up the lume of a watch before going to sleep. At the minimum of the three levels you barely see the light beam and consequently your night vision is not damaged even if you use this D25aaa UV in total darkness. You see only the lumed hands and other marks on the watch dial popping up like magic.


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## thijsco19 (Feb 5, 2015)

Are you be able to unscrew to tailcap to remove the pocket clip?

I hope they have changed it.


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## robert.t (Feb 5, 2015)

Could just be more QC issues - maybe these are supposed to be glued but got missed.


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## srvctec (May 1, 2015)

Any more thoughts on this little light from those who have used it for a while? I'm considering getting one but not sure low is low enough.


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## Big_Sam (May 1, 2015)

I find the low is excellent as a normal level, I tend to think of this light as an upgrade over normal aaa lights (compared to my fenix eo1) and I like having more power available. I most often use it on full power for short bursts. 

The magnet is handy, I used it in the car stuck to the door frame to give light for the baby on long journeys.

The only downside I've found with the clip removed is the body is a bit slippery when trying to turn on with one hand.


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## AVService (May 1, 2015)

I have really grown to love these tiny lights aside from the horrible clip they have.
The low is my normal mode and might be too high for some but I am sold on it and love that it comes on in low first which is all I need many times.

The clip is just near worthless for me.
It is limp and now turns freely on the light. I would remove it but do not want to have to grind it smooth.

I have read that they are shipping now with removable clips like I was sold with mine but I am not sure I will EVER buy ET again after this first run of terrible clip?


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## srvctec (May 1, 2015)

I should have clarified this in my post BUT in my defense, I had spent about 3 hours researching single AAA lights that come on in low, to put on my keychain and it was 2 hours past bed time. 

I had a Titanium Innovations IlluminaTi for several years on my keychain and it died a couple of weeks ago. The low on it (claimed lumens of 3 on low) was perfect for me. I read this entire thread and noticed some had said low wasn't low enough. Is it really 10 lumens, because if it is, it might be a little bright for me since that would be three times what I was used to for low.

Edit:
I should also mention that I've already tried TWO Thrunite Ti's (thought this would be a perfect replacement for my previous light) that were both pieces of junk- horribly machined threads that were rough and head had to be cranked down HARD to get the light to come on, making one handed operation impossible. I'll never buy another Thrunite again as this was my first experience with that brand.


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## AVService (May 1, 2015)

I am pretty sure there is no real debate about this?
The low is not as low as 3L and much brighter than I like in the dark with dark adjusted eyes.

I am inside racks and cabinets all day long and the 8-10L low is ideal for me for that use and the light also goes a lot brighter as needed.
It is also so tiny that it is the easiest in the mouth carry that I have tried which is saying something as I am always trying new lights to find "The One"and I already have several of them?


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## srvctec (May 1, 2015)

That's exactly the info I needed @AVService. I just wanted to verify it really was more than 3 or 4 lumens. Guess I'll be going with a Sunwayman R02A.


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## AVService (May 1, 2015)

srvctec said:


> That's exactly the info I needed @AVService. I just wanted to verify it really was more than 3 or 4 lumens. Guess I'll be going with a Sunwayman R02A.


Well let me throw this out there.
I just got the Streamlight ProTac AAA in the mail and it has a lower low than the ET it appears,overall a pretty worthy upgrade to the already great Microstream to me!
It is rated at 5L and you can program the light for H-Strobe-Low,H only or L-H which is my choice.

It is much bigger than the ET too but the clip and overall construction seems to be classic Streamlight which has always been bullet proof for me.

I will let you know how bright it seems after trying it out Tonight.

I am with you about ThruNite too I have never had a good one that I kept.


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## Big_Sam (May 1, 2015)

AVService said:


> I have really grown to love these tiny lights aside from the horrible clip they have.
> The low is my normal mode and might be too high for some but I am sold on it and love that it comes on in low first which is all I need many times.
> 
> The clip is just near worthless for me.
> ...



I can't remember if I put this earlier in the thread, but I removed my clip by pulling out up to 90deg and then back down a few times and it fractured at the side of the ring and came off easily, didn't seem to damage the light. (The clip and ring are one piece stamped stainless)

Ed: aha ref post #154 for photos of clip removal


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## srvctec (May 1, 2015)

AVService said:


> Well let me throw this out there.
> I just got the Streamlight ProTac AAA in the mail and it has a lower low than the ET it appears,overall a pretty worthy upgrade to the already great Microstream to me!
> It is rated at 5L and you can program the light for H-Strobe-Low,H only or L-H which is my choice.
> 
> ...


I sure wish the ET had a 3-4 lumen low- it would be perfect for me after yanking off the clip. As far as the Streamlight ProTac goes- WAY too big for a keychain light and I've already got the (perfect for me) best 2 AAA light there is in the Terralux Lightstar 80 High CRI which also has a bite grip built into it. Don't carry it any more but still love that light.


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## joelbnyc (Jul 9, 2015)

Can you heat kill the Tail Magnet like you could with the Preon P0 or whatever they are calling it now?

IE holding the magnet in a flame above 400 for 60 seconds or so would deactivate the magnet. Anyone try this? I hate tail magnets on keychain lights...


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## jon_slider (Jul 10, 2015)

fire warning deleted


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## WarRaven (Jul 10, 2015)

Don't most just use a soldering iron applied to magnet?
No need for open flame or ovens.


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## jon_slider (Jul 10, 2015)

duplicate warning deleted


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## WarRaven (Jul 10, 2015)

Just so we're clear, yes heat works.

Soldering iron is your friend.


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## joelbnyc (Jul 23, 2015)

Good to know. Yeah I think I used a small torch for demagnetizing the P0. Obviously without the battery or head attached, and using pliers to hold the tail. Ymmv. Plenty of old threads on this for the P0.

I just know that not all magnets will deactivate at 400 degrees like the P0's neodymium, some would require higher temperatures, which is why I asked.


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## ForrestChump (Jul 23, 2015)

How long have these been in the wild? Any durability / reliability issues?

Cool looking little bugger....


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## AVService (Jul 23, 2015)

ForrestChump said:


> How long have these been in the wild? Any durability / reliability issues?
> 
> Cool looking little bugger....


Aside from the horrible clip my 2 have been flawless and I carry one every minute I have pants on.


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## ForrestChump (Jul 23, 2015)

AVService said:


> Aside from the horrible clip my 2 have been flawless and *I carry one every minute I have pants on.*



Thats very subjective.


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## WarRaven (Jul 23, 2015)

ForrestChump said:


> Thats very subjective.


Could live and work at a hedonistic beach for all we know!!


Edit, I guess, you don't need pants, for the victory dance.


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## AVService (Jul 23, 2015)

I am an Enigma,but usually wrapped in Pants.


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## ForrestChump (Jul 24, 2015)

AVService said:


> I am an Enigma,but usually wrapped in Pants.



MAN, I now think your're pitching on purpose. Very un-family friendly joke there...so much potential with that one.


*Back to the light.....*is that ridiculous clip removable? Anymore feedback on durability / reliability?


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## leon2245 (Jul 24, 2015)

AVService said:


> Well let me throw this out there.
> I just got the Streamlight ProTac AAA in the mail and it has a lower low than the ET it appears,overall a pretty worthy upgrade to the already great Microstream to me!
> It is rated at 5L and you can program the light for H-Strobe-Low,H only or L-H which is my choice.
> 
> ...



Nice.

Those are forward clickies with momentary right?


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## AVService (Jul 25, 2015)

leon2245 said:


> Nice.
> 
> Those are forward clickies with momentary right?



If you are asking about the Streamlight,yes.


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