# BLF/TLF FW3A - now available



## Fireclaw18 (May 1, 2019)

I just received my order of two FW3As. Here's a picture of an FW3A (right) next to my modded Emisar D4 (left):






The FW3A is a compact single 18650 EDC light. This was a project made by Lumintop with assistance from members of BLF and TLF. It uses a standard 20mm Carclo triple-TIR optic and 20mm triple star. It has an e-switch driver with Toykeeper's Anduril firmware and a tailcap electronic switch.

Compared to other small triples on the market, the most unusual feature is the tailcap e-switch with metal switch button. The contact for the eswitch is a narrow tube that sits inside the battery compartment. This is the same method of e-switch contact as used by Liteflux in their classic LF2XT, except that the insulation for the inner tube is anodizing instead of the LF2XT's separate plastic tube.

The FW3A uses a 3-channel linear driver Fet+8+1 driver. This is simiilar to but a bit more efficient than the Emisar D4's 2-channel Fet+1 driver. I have not way to measure the peak output, but since my version has a FET and 3x XPL HI 3D, I expect around 3000 lumens max is about right.

The exterior of the light is clean with no heatsink fins. Because of this, I expect runtime at max turbo to be quite short.


*My initial impressions*:

* Looks beautiful and feels great in the hand. Though as expected it does not feel as secure in the hand as my white D4. This is because the D4 has slightly gritty grippier anodizing and a side switch.

* Very clean looking design with no logos. The bare switch looks great.

* Length: 92 mm. Same length as my white aluminum Emisar D4, but slightly thinner at the head and body tube. Tailcap is about the same thickness as a D4 tailcap. The short length puts this in the "ultracompact" category of 18650 light.

* Weight including battery is 98g compared to 112g for my white Emisar D4 (NOTE: my D4 is modded to include a metal switchboot and a Lexel lighted bezel board so might be slightly different from stock weight).

* Tailcap e-switch has a nice positive click.

* No glue. Tailcap and front bezel can both be unscrewed by hand. No tools needed. I haven't completely removed it yet, but it looks like changing the emitter does not require removal of a pill or driver. Instead you just unscrew the top portion of the bezel, remove the optic and have direct access to the star.

* Tint appears to indeed be 5000K. I'll likely fix that tonight on one of them via an emitter swap.

* Dark Grey anodizing looks well done. Looks like the anodizing on a grey Emisar D4. I don't expect that the anodizing is as durable or as thick as that on a Zebralight, but on the other hand this light cost less than half the cost of a comparable sized Zebralight.

* I have not tried to remove the clip. Previously I used to always remove clips, but now I sometimes keep them on to serve as antiroll devices. Given that the tailcap is not glued I expect clip remove would be easy.

* The clip is not deep carry, but it has adequate spring tension and the body tube is nicely contoured around it. It is fairly easy to insert this clip into the pocket of a pair of pants.

* The clip touches the body tube just before the head. The head does NOT grind against the clip when changing the battery.

* Since this light uses a standard Carclo triple TIR optic, I suspect Lexel could make a nice aux bezel board for it. However, TK mentioned that there isn't an available pin to control it so it might have to be wired in the "always on" configuration.

Kudos to the development team. Nice to see this project come together.


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## lion504 (May 1, 2019)

Good review. Thanks for posting. Hope to get mine soon. You didn’t comment on the firmware. Do you like The ramping? This is probably the feature I’m most looking fwd to. Are you going to use this for EDC? Any chance it will replace anything in your rotation/collection? Thanks again for sharing!


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## Fireclaw18 (May 1, 2019)

Ramping is the same as any other light with Anduril in it. 

Anduril is currently my favorite e-switch firmware. I reflashed a couple of my Emisar D4 lights with it.

The firmware is quite powerful and has a lot of options. But to summarize the most commonly used features:
- 1 click from off - last used ramped mode. Light will not remember double-click shortcut to high or turbo.
- 1 click from on - off
- click and hold from off - start at moonlight and ramp up rapidly to high. Ramp time is about 2 seconds to cycle the full range.
- Ramp has something like 150 steps and appears totally smooth. There is a very brief blink in the middle of the ramp. This lets the user know that they have hit the top of the regulated modes (8x7135) and are entering unregulated modes (FET).
- Click and hold from on - Ramp up. Repeat to ramp down.
- Double-click from off - High
- Double-click from on - Turbo
- Double-click from Turbo - last used non-turbo mode.
- 4 Clicks from off - electronic lockout. Another 4 clicks to unlock.
- the firmware has a lot of special hidden modes including various blinkies and strobes, lightning mode, candle mode, timeout mode, battery voltage checker, temperature sensor reading, etc.
- the firmware is quite customizable. You can manually program the temperature sensor. You can also change the cap for ramping. If you want to get rid of high and have the ramp (and double-click) go all the way to max turbo it is relatively easy to set that. However, personally, I like having high and turbo be different. On my D4 having the light ramp all the way to turbo was a bad thing. Light turned on in pocket when button accidentally held down by my pocket stuffing = hole burnt through pocket. With Anduril you can set the ramp so it caps at a safe level for your pocket making lockout much less necessary.


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## lion504 (May 1, 2019)

Sorry, should have clarified I don’t have any experience with Anduril. Thanks for tutorial.


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## Random Dan (May 1, 2019)

Thanks for posting your thoughts. It's great to see this project come together so well after all the wait and uncertainty.

Did you go for the expedited shipping? I did free shipping and mine says it is still in Guongzhou.


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## Fireclaw18 (May 1, 2019)

Yup I went for expedited shipping. And I was one of the early preorders. Ordered as soon as my code came in on BLF last week. Neal had 200 units in stock and I lucked out and got my shipment from them. Over 1000 orders came in so most will get them from when he restocks on May 8.

Expedited shipping to California was amazingly fast. Placed the order on Friday and it arrived via DHL from China today Wednesday. That's pretty much the fastest I've ever received anything from China.


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## Lucky Duck (May 1, 2019)

Now available...Where? :thinking:


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## Fireclaw18 (May 1, 2019)

Lucky Duck said:


> Now available...Where? :thinking:



Nealsgadgets is currently the only vendor. A quick Google search should give you the link. The FW3A is in the Lumintop section.


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## thermal guy (May 1, 2019)

This looks good.


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## WalkIntoTheLight (May 2, 2019)

Yeah, I ordered one in the 7A tint. I only have one other light with a 7A tint, and I like the very warm light from it. Probably too warm for EDC, but my plan is to use it as a nightlight. I just have to find a diffuser for it.

I put my name on the list long ago. To be honest, I have mostly given up on ever seeing this light get done. I think it was 2 years in development. Good to see it did get finished.


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## Tixx (May 2, 2019)

Thanks for the info! Very cool! Any chance a pic of it with a ZL SC64?


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## willc68 (May 4, 2019)

I placed my order last week, hopefully I get it by the end of May. 
It is a very sleek looking light and it is fun carrying these little powerhouses.


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## Random Dan (May 4, 2019)

Tixx said:


> Thanks for the info! Very cool! Any chance a pic of it with a ZL SC64?


These pictures are not mine. They are from user Noir on BLF.


Noir said:


> The FW3A has arrived :THUMBS-UP:
> A few size comparisons:


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## Tejasandre (May 4, 2019)

Random Dan said:


> These pictures are not mine. They are from user Noir on BLF.



Oh wow. I had imagined it smaller that the rrt-01.


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## LightObsession (May 4, 2019)

Thank for the review. I may have to check into this light.

Is the 3D option on nealsgadgets the same 3D as in my BLF A6 with 3D? I really like the tint on my A6 with 3D.


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## Fireclaw18 (May 4, 2019)

Tejasandre said:


> Oh wow. I had imagined it smaller that the rrt-01.



The FW3A is very small for an 18650 light, but it's not smaller than an RRT-01. At just 81mm long, the RRT-01 is much shorter than ANY 18650 light, including the current shortest (DQG Tiny 18650).

On the other hand, the FW3A is powered by an 18650, while the RRT-01 uses a much lower capacity 18350.

They're also quite similar in weight. Checking on a postal scale, I weighed both lights with battery installed:

*97 grams *- FW3A with 3000 mAh Samsung 30Q installed
*98 grams* - 2019 edition RRT-01 with 1100 mAh Aspire 18350 installed.

The FW3A as a FET driven triple is also much brighter, with output peaking at 3300 lumens, compared to around 800 lumens for the RRT-01.


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## Tejasandre (May 4, 2019)

I thought about the battery after I posted. Hope mine doesn’t take too long.


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## JimIslander (May 4, 2019)

Sold out on Neal's? Not showing up in Lumentop section.

FOUND IT: They have a BLF section now. Ordered one each Cree XP-L HI 3D(NW 5000K) and Cree XP-L HI 7A(WW 3300K).


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## jon_slider (May 4, 2019)

Fireclaw18 said:


> The FW3A is very small for an 18650 light, but it's not smaller than an RRT-01



nor lighter, nor buttonless, nor stepless rotary ;-)

*97 grams *- FW3A with 3000 mAh Samsung 30Q installed
*74 grams* - Original RRT-01 with 1100 mAh Aspire 18350 installed.

both is better.. LOL


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## Random Dan (May 4, 2019)

My free shipping FW3A arrived in the US today. Hopefully it will reach me soon.


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## justanotherguy (May 4, 2019)

Fireclaw18 said:


> The *FW3A is very small for an 18650 light, but it's not smaller than an RRT-01.* At just 81mm long, the RRT-01 is much shorter than ANY 18650 light, including the current shortest (DQG Tiny 18650).
> 
> On the other hand, the *FW3A is powered by an 18650*, *while the RRT-01 uses a much lower capacity 18350.
> *
> ...



WtaH?

It's also not as big as a 26650 light...because..different batteries.. ???


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## bigburly912 (May 4, 2019)

justanotherguy said:


> WtaH?
> 
> It's also not as big as a 26650 light...because..different batteries.. ???



🤔 I’m as confused as you are haha


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## Fireclaw18 (May 4, 2019)

jon_slider said:


> nor lighter, nor buttonless, nor stepless rotary ;-)
> 
> *97 grams *- FW3A with 3000 mAh Samsung 30Q installed
> *74 grams* - Original RRT-01 with 1100 mAh Aspire 18350 installed.
> ...



Well yeah... the original RRT-01 is much lighter weight than the 2019 version RRT-01. The 2019 version has a wider head and a brass pill. The older version is all aluminum. Even the titanium TCR-01 weighs less than the 2019 edition RRT-01. Personally, I think the old RRT-01 is better than the new one. But only after modding (reflector replacement to get rid of the rings, emitter swap to something newer, resistor mod for more amps).

As far as small 18650 lights go, the FW3A is exceptional: it boasts light weight, small size, nice metal button tail-cap e-switch, great UI, very high peak output.

Sure the UI isn't as good as a rotary ring RRT-01, but the FW3A does have an exceptionally good e-switch UI. And for a slight penalty in length and weight you get 4x the max output and 3x the battery capacity. And unlike the RRT-01, the FW3A has a temp sensor and low voltage protection built-in to the driver.

FW3A is also much cheaper than an RRT-01. So is a good choice for those on more of a budget.

*That said:*
I really like my RRT-01s (I have both versions modded), and my TCR-01. They are great lights with the best available UI. But when I'm reaching for an edc light sometimes I just want more power. And for those times an FW3A is a good choice. It's like a lightweight version of a tailcap switch Emisar D4, with lower max output and more protection against accidental pocket activation.


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## bigburly912 (May 4, 2019)

I’m still confused as to why you are comparing specs of an 18350 light to an 18650 light. Of course the 18350 will be smaller. And of course the 18650 will be higher capacity


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## Random Dan (May 4, 2019)

Bigburly912 said:


> I’m still confused as to why you are comparing specs of an 18350 light to an 18650 light. Of course the 18350 will be smaller. And of course the 18650 will be higher capacity


I believe the discussion was prompted by this post:


Tejasandre said:


> Oh wow. I had imagined it smaller that the rrt-01.


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## Tejasandre (May 4, 2019)

Yeah. That was me. :blush:


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## lion504 (May 5, 2019)

Bigburly912 said:


> I’m still confused as to why you are comparing specs of an 18350 light to an 18650 light. Of course the 18350 will be smaller. And of course the 18650 will be higher capacity



I think the basis of the comparison is something like 'technically unique options for EDC.' In the case of the RRT, you have the magnetic control ring UI. With the FW3A, you have the smallest 18650 light with a special firmware and e-switch. 

My opinion is that all multivariate comparisons are imperfect. In this case, one has an 18350 and the other a 18650. So the runtime, weight, and length variables aren't exactly similar. But I see this same fundamental inconsistency in any comparison of lights that use two different drivers, and/or two different LEDs, and/or two different UIs, and/or two different materials (ie Ti or Al). Taken to the extreme, this means that any review would either have to (worst case) avoid any comparison at all (because the variables are not exactly the same) or (best case) compare two lights that are almost exactly the same save a single variable - for example, comparing the HDS Executive High Noon vs the HDS Executive 3 o'clock. I think the art of writing a good review is rationalizing these different variables together towards some type of conclusion/recommendation. :tinfoil:

Bottom line, I think fireclaw did a good job on his review. And I'm really looking forward to receiving mine! 



Random Dan said:


> My free shipping FW3A arrived in the US today. Hopefully it will reach me soon.



How are you tracking this? The tracking number I received links to some express shipping page, but doesn't show any shipping information.


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## idleprocess (May 5, 2019)

lion504 said:


> How are you tracking this? The tracking number I received links to some express shipping page, but doesn't show any shipping information.



If you chose the free shipping option like I did, you'll see a tracking number that's also a link. _Copy the number_ and open the link, which takes you to Flyt Express. Click on "Package", paste the tracking number, click "Submit". A summary of Flyt Express's activity will load, _including another *actual* tracking number_ after a few days - take *this* tracking ID and load it into the package tracker of your choice - 17 Track, Package Radar, etc.

Of course, right now Flyt Express's website is moving along at a glacial pace.


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## lion504 (May 5, 2019)

Thanks! I didn't notice that "package" link. Unfortunately mine is stuck in Guangzhou


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## Random Dan (May 5, 2019)

lion504 said:


> Thanks! I didn't notice that "package" link. Unfortunately mine is stuck in Guangzhou


Mine chilled there for about 5 days before making it to the US.


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## Fireclaw18 (May 5, 2019)

One warning:

The tailcap is not glued and there is no retaining ring to prevent the switch guts from falling out. Lumintop wanted to glue it, but BLF talked them out of it since they wanted to be able to access the switch guts for modding and clip removal. When changing the battery always remove the head, not the tail.


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## ven (May 5, 2019)

Thanks fireclaw for the info/review, i am looking forward to tuesday when mine should arrive. Its ended up costing me nearer to $50 than $36 though after customs. No biggie, just dont like being ripped off with the UK handling fee of £8 alone(£4 duty).Anyway, still appears excellent value, not like i needed another triple, but the long wait and build up, one more cant hurt can it haha. Looking forward to the new tweaked UI and the 3d HI's. I do prefer the HI to the sst20 thats available soon, i have 4k and 5k 20's and although fine, they are just not as nice to my eyes as the 4k and 5k HI's. 

Cheers! Will add a pic or 2 when i get.


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## idleprocess (May 6, 2019)

Random Dan said:


> Mine chilled there for about 5 days before making it to the US.



Mine looks to be aspiring to a similar stay. Probably a consequence of choosing free shipping: will wait for surplus capacity before moving along.


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## idleprocess (May 9, 2019)

idleprocess said:


> Mine looks to be aspiring to a similar stay. Probably a consequence of choosing free shipping: will wait for surplus capacity before moving along.



And 5 days later it's suddenly in New Jersey. Perhaps I will get it early next week.

I've got to say this is one of my more eagerly-anticipated purchases and I didn't wait _anywhere near as long_ as some people, joining the list ~08/2018.


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## aginthelaw (May 10, 2019)

I’m 20 minutes from the shipping center in cranbury nj. It took about a week to get to me


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## ven (May 10, 2019)

Well pretty impressed, like the design and feel. Does remind me of the HDS in ways, although not as substantial. Nice beam/tint from the 3D HI's also to be expected. Clip has decent retention, not too firm, not too flimsy. One thing i dont care much for, although not a deal breaker........the switch. Just lacks any decent feel like a normal (well clicky) feel. Appears more responsive turning on, fraction of a second delay on the off. Not keen on the design with the switch either, but i am sure it saves on travel. 

It is one of those lights to fondle and keep hold of for me. For $36 it is hard to beat, certainly worth a look for a fun EDC light.


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## scout24 (May 10, 2019)

Nice pic, Ven! Agreed on the clip, I was expecting less retention but was pleasantly suprised. And it tailstands, which makes me happy. The switch feel, as you said, isn't a dealbreaker. I'm just happy to have an e-switch light I can actually carry and use. I can find the switch, and it doesn't appear that accidental activation is likely. So glad it wasn't another side switch. And yes, for the money, a fun little light.


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## Fireclaw18 (May 10, 2019)

I really like the metal switchbutton electronic tailcap switch. I like it much better than any clicky switch.


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## justanotherguy (May 13, 2019)

just got it, diggin it so far


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## idleprocess (May 13, 2019)

aginthelaw said:


> I’m 20 minutes from the shipping center in cranbury nj. It took about a week to get to me



It's now a mere ~25 miles away. I'm hoping that it shows up sometime this week. Is there a handoff to the USPS or does DHL manage the last mile delivery?


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## scout24 (May 13, 2019)

Mine showed up on a DHL truck. I waived signature, knowing I'd be home that day.


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## idleprocess (May 13, 2019)

Don't recall any delivery options with the free shipping tier.


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## lion504 (May 13, 2019)

Rcvd mine today. Booyah! 

Tossed in a fresh 18650 and started playing with Anduril, right?

Wrong.

All kind of problems. Wouldn't ramp properly. Then started strobing at the end of a 0.3 sec ramp. Then I think it entered candle mode and then shut off.

Terrified, I swapped batteries. Problem fixed? 

No.

More UI problems. [started frantically googling "how to reset Anduril"]

Now I'm in full on panic mode. 

Swapped batteries again. 

And.... then it starts working properly. :twothumbs

Operator head space and timing? Maybe, since I'm a Anduril newb.

Fortunately no issues since the 3rd battery change. (BTW, all the batteries tested out 4.1 or 4.2V)

Overall, very happy with the light. Size is amazing. A mm or two taller than my HDS executive. Unless you look close, they seem basically the same size. I think the Rotary is a little longer than the Exec, so the Rotary might be a tad longer than the FW3A.

I really like the anodizing. The steel grey/blue looks really nice.

My only complaint is about the tint. I wish the LEDs were a little more neutral. Not very knowledgeable on how to interpret the bin codes, but the XP-L HI triple LEDs on my BOSS are so much nicer.

Thinking about getting a second one to mod with some better LEDs.

Not sure how I'm going to use this light though. My EDC is an HDS Executive, which I swap out immediately at home for the BOSS 70. Can't see it displacing either of those two. But I really like the UI, now that it's working properly.

[BTW - I don't think it's possible to do a 'factory reset' on Anduril. Do I have that wrong?]


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## idleprocess (May 13, 2019)

lion504 said:


> Rcvd mine today. Booyah!
> 
> Tossed in a fresh 18650 and started playing with Anduril, right?
> 
> ...



From posts on facebook and BLF, I gather that the tailcap *must be properly tightened* otherwise battery _and_ switch contact is not consistent which sounds like the root cause of your issues.


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## lion504 (May 13, 2019)

Strange, I think I checked that. Rechecking it now. Thanks.


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## WalkIntoTheLight (May 14, 2019)

Loosen the head, loosen the tailcap. Then, firmly tighten the tail. After that, tighten the head. That should fix the issues.

If that doesn't work, check the thin driver retaining clip in the head and tighten it down.

IMO, those should really be done at the factory, but at least they're easy fixes for us to do.


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## id30209 (May 14, 2019)

Is there anyone who still didn’t get any shipping info for order placed pre-May?
Am i the only looser here? 


Sent from Tapatalk


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## the0dore3524 (May 14, 2019)

id30209 said:


> Is there anyone who still didn’t get any shipping info for order placed pre-May?
> Am i the only looser here?
> 
> 
> Sent from Tapatalk



Depends on which one your ordered. 7A was delayed because Neal didn’t have them yet so only 3D went out. Him and his wife just had a son in like the past week so understandably most orders are delayed.


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## Tejasandre (May 14, 2019)

id30209 said:


> Is there anyone who still didn’t get any shipping info for order placed pre-May?
> Am i the only looser here?
> 
> 
> Sent from Tapatalk



I ordered 4/28. A 3D. Nothing yet.


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## idleprocess (May 14, 2019)

At the local post office per 17Track but not available for pickup the one day I'm at home this week. Hoping they can deliver without signature since I'd have to beg WFH _for cause_ to get it in person this week.


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## scout24 (May 14, 2019)

Well, I found out the 4 click lockout is a must. I found it turned on in my pocket for the third time this afternoon. I'm trying to decide if that's a dealbreaker for me or not. I like the form factor, like the UI and features, like the beam shape, but can't have it turning itself on. Twice in jeans, once in cargo shorts. Clipped to the left front pocket. I'm a few pounds overweight, but don't wear skinny jeans or anything.


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## Fireclaw18 (May 14, 2019)

I think this light might be a candidate for adding an extra spring in the tailcap around the switch.

I did that with my camo Sunwayman V11R.

- I had a Steve Ku (Veleno Designs) e-switch module designed for the V10 that I'd purchased years earlier for a different project. But I only had the circuit board. I didn't have the mounting hardware or Steve Ku switch button.

- I took the stock Titanium ring that came with early V11R and then built fresh switch guts out of epoxy putty, scraps of plastic, and a section of a large spring. Result: My V11R has an electronic switch with metal button. And unlike other electronic switch lights my V11R has a fairly stiff switch owing to the extra spring I added into the tailcap.

If the same treatment can be done to the FW3A, it might significantly stiffen the switch making it more resistant to accidental pocket activation. The goal would be to add a section of a fairly wide spring around the switch button and under the boot.

Also, if you don't like 4-click electronic lockout you can also lock the FW3A out by unscrewing the head 1/8 turn. That's enough to break the connection to the switch rendering the switch inoperable until you screw it back in.


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## idleprocess (May 14, 2019)

scout24 said:


> Well, I found out the 4 click lockout is a must. I found it turned on in my pocket for the third time this afternoon. I'm trying to decide if that's a dealbreaker for me or not. I like the form factor, like the UI and features, like the beam shape, but can't have it turning itself on. Twice in jeans, once in cargo shorts. Clipped to the left front pocket. I'm a few pounds overweight, but don't wear skinny jeans or anything.



Sounds like my experience with the Emisar D4: *ALWAYS* lock it out for pocket carry - either electronic or mechanical.


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## Fireclaw18 (May 14, 2019)

idleprocess said:


> Sounds like my experience with the Emisar D4: *ALWAYS* lock it out for pocket carry - either electronic or mechanical.



I burnt through 2 pants pockets with an Emisar D4. I always turned them off on moonlight mode, but if the button got held down in my pocket it would ramp up to max turbo. 4300 lumens was more than enough to make short work of any pocket lining.

That said, I think the risk is much smaller with the FW3A. The FW3A's button is mounted on the endcap and doesn't protrude. That makes it a little more resistant to accidental activation than a D4. More importantly, the FW3A uses Anduril rather than the D4's Ramping IOS. In the FW3A if the button is held down in the pocket, it will ramp up to max ramp (about 800 lumens) and stay there. The only way to get to turbo is to double-click, which is unlikely to happen accidentally. 800 lumens will drain the batteries, which isn't good. But on the upside it's not bright enough to burn a hole through your pocket.

I modded a couple Emisar D4 lights to make them much more resistant to accidental pocket activation, including doing the following:

- mounting a modified #14 nickel-plated brass finish washer around the switch button. This turns the raised switch button into a recessed one.

- replaced the rubber switchboot with a metal one that doesn't protrude as much (the metal switchboot is scratchbuilt and consists of a circle of silicone sheet with a much smaller circle below for the piston, and a sheet aluminum circle on top. All glued together with plastic super-glue. The new switchboot requires more pressure to activate than the original rubber one.

- flashed firmware to Anduril so in the unlikely event the switch does accidentally activate in the pocket it won't get to turbo so won't burn through my pockets.

With these modifications my D4 has never turned on accidentally in the pocket. I feel confident in carrying it without lockout.


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## lion504 (May 14, 2019)

Follow up:

I've experienced a couple of accidental discharges as well. Like scout24, I quickly figured out how to enable the lockout mode.

Unfortunately, I'm still having UI problems with mine. After a full day of testing, I zeroed in on the problem. It won't ramp up to high. Or go directly to high with a double click. As I ramp up (using smooth ramping), the light will just turn off. Sometimes it will go into a very faint rapid momentary strobe. Other times it will turn on at medium. If I get the sub-lumen strobe, I have to reset the light by loosening and retightening the head. 

I've tried the head/tail loosening/retightening with no success. Haven't yet checked the driver retaining clip. Will do that next.


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## scout24 (May 14, 2019)

Mine was a bit wonky out of the box, the driver ring was loose. Since tightening, the UI has been perfect. I think I'm going to find or make a washer to JB weld to the tail in an effort to recess the switch button just that little bit. I can't need to quad click every time it comes out of my pocket. Just not feasible.


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## lion504 (May 14, 2019)

scout24 said:


> Mine was a bit wonky out of the box, the driver ring was loose. Since tightening, the UI has been perfect. I think I'm going to find or make a washer to JB weld to the tail in an effort to recess the switch button just that little bit. I can't need to quad click every time it comes out of my pocket. Just not feasible.



Boom, that worked. Thanks! It only moved about 0.2mm, but I finally achieved a full ramp!

BTW, what kind of tool did you use to adjust your retaining ring? I used a eyeglasses screwdriver to push clockwise on each side, but it seems like the wrong tool for the job.


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## scout24 (May 14, 2019)

I used the smallest screwdriver on my Leatherman. Definitely the wrong tool, but it worked. Same method, tighten from both slots in the ring, working back and forth. Maybe 10 battery changes and it's still tight.


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## WalkIntoTheLight (May 15, 2019)

idleprocess said:


> Sounds like my experience with the Emisar D4: *ALWAYS* lock it out for pocket carry - either electronic or mechanical.



IMO, that ruins much of the usefulness of an EDC light. Even though it doesn't take long to unlock a light, it still adds time and after a few times becomes a PITA. I just want to take the light out of my pocket, and click the switch to turn it on.

I've carried various Zebralights in my pocket (SC52's, SC5, SC600's, SC64), and never had a problem with them turning on accidentally.

That said, I don't plan to use the FW3A as a pocket light, so it won't be an issue for me. But, if I was pocket-carrying it, that would cause me to think twice about carrying it.


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## idleprocess (May 15, 2019)

Got the package today. Initial impressions extremely positive. The tailswitch has a pleasing snap. The UI differs a bit from my Emisars but is still predictable. The overall shape and size is ideal for my large hands. I appreciate the minimal utilitarianism of its design. The 500K tint isn't anything to write home about but the beam profile looks to be between my stock and floody D4 optic. Turbo gets hot FAST.

Will see how it performs this evening.

EDIT: One thing I've noticed is that the FW3A is sensitive to both the tailcap and the head being firmly tightened down to the battery tube. It might pay to use some removable loc-tite on the tail.

I find it easier to hit click sequences with the tailswitch than on my Emisars. Big surface, more movement, more assertive tactile click in response.

I'll need to remember some of the menu sequences peculiar to the FW3A - it's a bit different than the D4/D1/D1S, which are different from the D4S. I ought bother with the thermal config (on all of them) if nothing else - I gather that's almost always rather low as a precaution due to wide convergence in factory calibration.


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## scout24 (May 16, 2019)

Setting thermal config is a must if you plan to use it in "muggle mode" at all. Mine would step down to 5 lm or so in less than 10 seconds prior to setting the temp. Works fine now. Oddly, in "normal" mode, I didn't notice it being an issue. It's a neat light, I just wish the switch was a bit more recessed.


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## Tejasandre (May 17, 2019)

Well, my box worked fine. Tail was loose on the light, tightened before I even tried it. Seems to be working fine. It is easy to turn on when putting it away (I Cary in a leather holster/pocket organizer). Tint is a little green , come on sst20, I got the 3D. I found the 4 click lockout, it’s too good, had to unscrew the head to resume normal operation, mind you I have not read the instructions.
What a barn burner for $35!

High



Turbo


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## Ozythemandias (May 20, 2019)

I'm super pleased with mine. Only two things to note, don't expect it to be able to sustain turbo for any amount of time, it's very lightweight and compact, the heat from 2800 lumens has no where to go and the stepdown kicks in rapidly (this should be expected really). Second thing is like everyone said, After a couple days of carrying it I found the electronic lockout a necessity.


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## Fireclaw18 (May 20, 2019)

If you don't like 4-clicks for electronic lockout, alternatively you can disable the switch with a 1/8 turn of the head. This isn't a true physical lockout since the driver is still powered. However, it can be treated as a physical lockout since the switch no longer works and the parasitic drain is so low.

I'm using my FW3A with no lockout. It has turned on in the pocket on low once or twice, but no harm done. Main reason I use lockout in a light is I don't want it to burn through my pocket. I don't mind accidental pocket turn-on so long as this doesn't happen and the accidental turn-ons are rare.

An Emisar D4 needs lockout or mods for safe pocket carry. The button protrudes and if depressed and held down it will ramp to turbo and stay there, which is easily hot enough to burn through a pants pocket in seconds.

In contrast, the FW3A uses Anduril. Even if the button accidentally depresses and is held down it will only ramp up to 2.8 amps output... not high enough to cause pocket damage. Only way to get to turbo is a double-click when on, or manually changing the ramp configuration settings. Neither of which are likely to happen accidentally in the pocket.


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## Fireclaw18 (May 20, 2019)

Tejasandre said:


> ... I found the 4 click lockout, it’s too good, had to unscrew the head to resume normal operation, mind you I have not read the instructions.
> What a barn burner for $35!


If you had to unscrew the head to resume normal operations you clicked 5 times rather than 4 I think.

5 clicks activates momentary mode. Only way to get out of it is unscrew the head. 4 clicks activates lockout. To get out of it do 4 clicks again.


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## scout24 (May 20, 2019)

Well, I'm not fussing with 1/8 turns or 4 click lockouts. If I'm carrying a light this size, it's clipped to my left front pants pocket. If it comes on accidentally when I move, (get in or out of the car for example) onto the BST it goes unless there's another solution. HDS, for example. As much as I love their raised button, I would get accidental activation. Changing to flush buttons has solved this problem for me. My attempt at a solution for this light, however inelegant, was to disassemble the tailcap, remove the ano from the flat portion on the end, and JB Weld a flat aluminum washer to the tailcap in an effort to recess the switch far enough to try to eliminate the problem. It'll go in my pocket tomorrow morning, I have my fingers crossed as otherwise it seems to be a great little light. I wish they had taken tailcap design cues from McGizmo or Okluma, however...


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## Tejasandre (May 20, 2019)

This seems to help with false starts


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## scout24 (May 20, 2019)

Well that'll work too! And yours is instantly reversible! Nicely done. :thumbsup:


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## Tejasandre (May 20, 2019)

Well, there’s a little double sided tape... for


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## nightshade (May 21, 2019)

Just ordered one for a bud that always wanted a 18650 NiteCore D10. Also, I really like firmware.


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## peter yetman (May 22, 2019)

Would i be right in thinking that isn't really a light to give to a Muggle?
I'm always looking for decent, good value lights that I can give to friends. but what with the tailcap tightening, accidental switch on and the complex UI, should I leave this one out?
Thank you,
P


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## id30209 (May 22, 2019)

Nealsgadgets just annoumced that 219C 4000K is available...
So much of SST-20 


Sent from Tapatalk


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## nightshade (May 22, 2019)

peter yetman said:


> Would i be right in thinking that isn't really a light to give to a Muggle?
> I'm always looking for decent, good value lights that I can give to friends. but what with the tailcap tightening, accidental switch on and the complex UI, should I leave this one out?
> Thank you,
> P



It's most definitely not a light for the uninitiated. For personal safety reasons  
The chap I'm sending one to is very familiar with the somewhat complicated user interfaces, such as HDS and the NiteCore D10.


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## cody12 (May 22, 2019)

Just stumbled on this in the "what's new" section. Sounds good. Just finished my order. After reading here I definitely went with expedited shipping. I chose xpl hi 3d. Someone want to tell me how that compares to the other options? Bit of an impulse buyer.

Steve in L.A 

Sent from my SM-T800 using Candlepowerforums mobile app


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## xevious (May 22, 2019)

nightshade said:


> It's most definitely not a light for the uninitiated. For personal safety reasons
> The chap I'm sending one to is very familiar with the somewhat complicated user interfaces, such as HDS and the NiteCore D10.


Very true. The muggle mode is a nice way to limit that. However, even better is to put it into momentary mode.

Anduril takes some getting used to but I find it more intuitive than NarsilM and certainly superior to the old NovaTac 120P / HDS programmable UI (those were great for their time, but really outdated at this point). I really like how you can set the floor and ceiling levels (independent of Turbo) and the step count for stepped ramping. I use 10 steps, so the 1st mode after moonlight isn't too bright. Stepping up doesn't take long to do. And I find it easier than smooth ramping (requires too much "trial and error" going up/down to decide on a brightness). Even still, if you decide you want smooth ramping, you don't have to go through a laborious series of clicks to get to it. A triple-click while on toggles smooth/stepped ramping. VERY easy.

I really wish they'd make a better tailcap with a retaining ring for the switch. The fact that the 3 switch components can easily fall out when removing the tail cap is severely annoying. There's also a small "nubbin" that's friction docked to the rubber switch cover, and it can fall out. If that happens? Forget about your light functioning.



peter yetman said:


> Would i be right in thinking that isn't really a light to give to a Muggle? I'm always looking for decent, good value lights that I can give to friends. but what with the tailcap tightening, accidental switch on and the complex UI, should I leave this one out? Thank you



The "muggle mode" is useful for when allowing a flashlight neophyte to use it... but not own it. I think the tail cap vulnerability is the glaring flaw in this flashlight that would be a deal breaker for giving it to a muggle for ownership.


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## scout24 (May 22, 2019)

I would guess that when Lumintop brings out their branded version, it'll be glued in the tail and head end. I was under the impression they left everything accessible on these early versions by request of the design group...


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## xevious (May 22, 2019)

scout24 said:


> I would guess that when Lumintop brings out their branded version, it'll be glued in the tail and head end. I was under the impression they left everything accessible on these early versions by request of the design group...


That makes sense--if the intention was to enable modders easy access to make changes. I've already seen someone cut a groove in the metal tail cap switch cover for installing a tritium vial. But a retaining ring would've been a better idea for the tail cap. If it meant $5 more, i'd have paid it. I don't intend on doing anything with the switch so maybe it might be worthwhile to use a simple flexible glue to help avoid annoyance if/when having to remove the tail cap.


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## Fireclaw18 (May 22, 2019)

Agreed they should have used a retaining ring in the tail.

If they had cut the threads the same as the head they probably could have just used a retaining ring identical to the one in the head.


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## staticx57 (May 22, 2019)

xevious said:


> That makes sense--if the intention was to enable modders easy access to make changes. I've already seen someone cut a groove in the metal tail cap switch cover for installing a tritium vial. But a retaining ring would've been a better idea for the tail cap. If it meant $5 more, i'd have paid it. I don't intend on doing anything with the switch so maybe it might be worthwhile to use a simple flexible glue to help avoid annoyance if/when having to remove the tail cap.



BLF lights are usually made with modders in mind given the audience. Glue is a huge PITA when modding.


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## BobGarrett (May 22, 2019)

I'm new to the modern LED flashlight obsession (but longtime lover of the old mag lights and cool lights in general). Despite reading many, many hours of threads here and on r/flashlight and BLF, and buying a light every few days it seems, I'm still basically a muggle. But making progress. Anyway, I say all that to agree that the FW3A is a light best for enthusiasts, not for muggles. I do love mine but it's a lot to learn for the uninitiated (like me). It might be my favorite light so far, but I've been reluctant to give it as a gift for the same reason, will probably stick to gifting simpler models. Still, I feel lucky to have found the community in time to participate in the FW3A, really big fan.


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## xevious (May 22, 2019)

staticx57 said:


> BLF lights are usually made with modders in mind given the audience. Glue is a huge PITA when modding.


Depends upon the glue. A little "shoe goo" is adhesive enough to do the trick while still being removable.


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## staticx57 (May 22, 2019)

That's a tough one, perhaps the first run should be marketed as such. But here I am happy there is zero glue ha.


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## xevious (May 22, 2019)

staticx57 said:


> That's a tough one, perhaps the first run should be marketed as such. But here I am happy there is zero glue ha.


I'm especially glad there's none in the head. Changing optics is really simple in this light. And with Carclo offering a nice selection, you can easily customize the beam pattern in mere minutes. This capability is terrific to have.

Here are some photos to give a better representation with matched beam shots (instead of just separate stock LED Supply photos).












Some GITD tape applied on the inside wall...


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## RobertMM (May 24, 2019)

10507 optic looks great!!!

I have one in 5000k due to arrive later at my courier branch. 

Where do you guys order your Carclo optics?


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## ven (May 24, 2019)

I have the clear narrow in mine and much better imo. As much as I like a soft floody useful beam (have enough anyway), I seem to prefer the clear optics for the large tighter hot spot and reach .

I bought a few carclo optics USA side , think I just did a google and bought that way.

Edit- comedy auto correcting words


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## Fireclaw18 (May 24, 2019)

I also prefer the 10507 clear narrow for the extra throw. The beam pattern in the 10511 or polished 10511 looks prettier, but the extra punch of 10507 is more useful.


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## xevious (May 24, 2019)

ven said:


> I have the clear narrow in mine and much better imo. As much as I like a soft floody useful beam (have enough anyway), I seem to prefer the clear optics for the large tighter hot spot and reach .
> 
> I bought a few carclo optics USA side , think I just did a google and bought that way.
> 
> Edit- comedy auto correcting words


Yeah, after playing with them for a while, I'm leaning towards the more conventional 10507. You do get more of a hotspot with it, but with diffused enough edges so that it's not harsh. Still decent spill. The light is more efficient than with stock. The 10509 is very nice and floody. It's great to have the option for when you're planning to do broad near-field illumination. The 10510 is fun. I like the elliptical pattern, giving the light orientation. It's more floody than a 10507, but still has a nice hotspot. The moonlight in this FW3A is definitely too bright for firefly. The 10510 and 10509 reduce it nicely. The lines on the 10510 make for nice eye candy on low modes. When efficiency is called for, the 10507 would be my choice, over stock.



RobertMM said:


> Where do you guys order your Carclo optics?


In the USA we have LED Supply, which is very economical. With a little discount, each optic was $1.50 and shipping was free. Can't beat that!


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## Ozythemandias (May 24, 2019)

peter yetman said:


> Would i be right in thinking that isn't really a light to give to a Muggle?
> I'm always looking for decent, good value lights that I can give to friends. but what with the tailcap tightening, accidental switch on and the complex UI, should I leave this one out?
> Thank you,
> P



There's a literal "Muggle Mode" in the UI to make the UI non complex, and also limit the output for safety


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## peter yetman (May 25, 2019)

OK, thanks everyone - I have a few misgivings, so I'll pass on this one.
Thanks for all the feedback.
P


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## jon_slider (May 25, 2019)

xevious said:


> Some GITD tape applied on the inside wall...



outstanding photos!
Im also a fan of the 10507... here on an Eye10 Rotary


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## xevious (May 26, 2019)

jon_slider said:


> outstanding photos!
> Im also a fan of the 10507... here on an Eye10 Rotary


Thanks, Jon.  Originally I had lined up stock photos and they just didn't capture the nuances well, so I was happy to do a group shot once I got them. I've been running the 10507 by default too. Mainly I find that while it does give a decent spot, there's still a good bit of usable spill. When going to the 10509, it's way floody... which is fine for some applications. It's a bit much when taking a walk, as it lights up passersby quite a lot, while the 10507 is more forgiving. Are you going to go with a trit slot drilled optic eventually?


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## jon_slider (May 27, 2019)

xevious said:


> Are you going to go with a trit slot drilled optic eventually?



that sounds like a great option!
what holds me back is I dont have an FW3a, or a light that uses a stock Carclo
the triples I have use slightly modded posts to fit the smaller head of my RRT-01

I have no trit experience yet, just glow rings.
I definitely like the way they work to help me locate a light on the nightstand

And I totally agree that there is a time and place for floody beams, and outdoors is not one of them 
The beauty of the Carclo system is that it is so easy to change beams. But Im more likely to change lights. So I have some lights with floody beams for close use, and others with spotty beams, for outdoors..

In fact, I choose to EDC a light with a single LED, for the tight hotspot.. The Carclo 10507 is MUCH floodyer than a single LED in a reflector. And triples use about double the power of a single LED, to produce similar lumen levels on target, because of the larger hotspot.

Choices are good 

3500k 219b narrow clear triple, and 4500k 219b single


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## xevious (May 27, 2019)

jon_slider said:


> In fact, I choose to EDC a light with a single LED, for the tight hotspot.. The Carclo 10507 is MUCH floodyer than a single LED in a reflector. And *triples use about double the power of a single LED*, to produce similar lumen levels on target, because of the larger hotspot.


You're talking exclusively about throw, right? Because my understanding is that overall, _given the same driver type_, more LED's means generally more efficient output (less power from each LED to produce same output, which saves on thermal buildup), but greater cost to implement. That's why many manufacturers are coming out with triples and quads. But you don't see them for long range throwers, presumably because the single LED having larger reflector will produce a tighter but longer throwing hot spot.


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## jon_slider (May 27, 2019)

1200 lumens from a single LED
or 400 lumens from each of 3 LEDs

suggests each LED in the triple, is running cooler, individually, but the total heat is the same if the total lumens is the same

so multi LED lights can produce more total lumens
if each of the 3 leds is running at 1200 lumens
they will also produce 3 times more heat in total

and will use 3x more power on a maximum of 3600 lumens, than a single LED on maximum of 1200 lumens


what I was also pointing out is that a larger hotspot uses more power

1200 lumens from a single LED focused into a smaller hotspot will use less power, to reach a certain lumen level in the center of the small hotspot

1200 total lumens from a triple, whose hotspot is larger, will not be as bright in the center of the hotspot, because lumens is usually a total out the front, but not all the light coming out the front is focused on a small central target

so, a beam with a larger illuminated area, requires more total lumens, than a beam with a smaller illuminated area, on the target in the center of the hotspot

it then becomes a question whether the hotspot of a single beam, is sufficient for the task at hand

there are times when I want a wider field of illumination, and that costs more power


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## Fireclaw18 (May 28, 2019)

jon_slider said:


> 1200 lumens from a single LED
> or 400 lumens from each of 3 LEDs
> 
> suggests each LED in the triple, is running cooler, individually, but the total heat is the same if the total lumens is the same
> ...



However, also note that LEDs are more efficient when run at lower power. This means the battery in a triple running at 1200 lumens should last longer than in the same light running a single emitter at 1200 lumens (assuming both lights use the same type of emitter).


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## peter yetman (May 28, 2019)

Yes, I was thinking exactly the same thing.
If you look at emitter output against current curves, the efficientcy does start to drop off at the higher levels.
I don't think the increase in efficiency is much to write home about, but it's certainly there.
P


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## WalkIntoTheLight (May 28, 2019)

I've often wondered about the stated efficiency drop-off of LEDs at very high output. I know there is plenty of data showing this, but does it apply to lights that use PWM?

For example, a FET driver will always drive the LED at maximum power, given a battery with high-enough voltage. I know that means it's not efficient if you're driving it constant current. Perhaps some of that to do with heat?

Anyway, what if you're using a PWM cycle of 50% (same FET driver), with cycles in the hundreds or thousands per second. We perceive that as a light at 50% output, identical to if it was running constant-current at half-power.

But is it less efficient than a constant-current at the same average power? If so, is it really as bad as the efficiency you get when running at 100% duty cycle?


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## jon_slider (May 28, 2019)

Fireclaw18 said:


> However, also note that LEDs are more efficient when run at lower power. This means the battery in a triple running at 1200 lumens should last longer than in the same light running a single emitter at 1200 lumens (assuming both lights use the same type of emitter).



I agree with you comments, thanks for the brainstorming.

I think you will also agree that a triple at 1200 lumens will not look as bright on a target in the center of the hotspot, as a single LED at 1200 lumens, in the center of a hotspot that is half as large.

My experience is it takes twice as many lumens of total output from a triple TiR, as it does from a hotspot that is half as large, from a single LED focused by a reflector.

Example, say I use a flashlight to see a 12" diameter painting on a wall 12 feet away. The focused single LED in a reflector will mostly illuminate the painting, and less light will be on the surrounding wall. OTOH, the triple TiR will illuminate the painting PLUS a twice as large portion of the surrounding wall, thereby "wasting" half the output on an area outside the target painting.

Of course there are advantages to larger illuminated areas from a triple, but they Do cost extra lumens, and extra power, ime.


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## Random Dan (May 28, 2019)

That also depends on the specific optic and reflector though. Some reflector lights can be as floody or more than a narrow clear triple optic.


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## Fireclaw18 (May 28, 2019)

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> I've often wondered about the stated efficiency drop-off of LEDs at very high output. I know there is plenty of data showing this, but does it apply to lights that use PWM?
> 
> For example, a FET driver will always drive the LED at maximum power, given a battery with high-enough voltage. I know that means it's not efficient if you're driving it constant current. Perhaps some of that to do with heat?
> 
> ...


Since lights that are fully controlled by PWM always runs the LED at full power, they are the least efficient.

If you compare a current-control light v. a PWM control light, at full power both lights should have the same efficiency. However, at lower power settings the efficiency difference is visible with the current-control having significantly more battery life. Sometimes twice as much.

Note, however, that some drivers, use a combination. The FW3A is primarily PWM controlled, but has 3-current controlled channels. At the lowest power settings, the first channel with just 1x 7135 chip (max 350 mAh) is active giving high efficiency. At intermediate settings the remaining 7x7135 also activate for up to 2.8 amps current. At the highest settings the FET also activates for the lowest efficiency, but highest output.


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## jon_slider (May 28, 2019)

Random Dan said:


> That also depends on the specific optic and reflector though. Some reflector lights can be as floody or more than a narrow clear triple optic.



yes, to do a relevant comparison we would need to use two identical lights with identical LEDs, and drivers.

I have a pair of essentially the same size lights w same driver, one triple and one single, but, they dont have the same LEDs, so, we need someone to do a more accurate test, with identical LEDs.. 

even so
ime the narrow clear optic produces a larger hotspot than the single LED in the same size light

my main point is that a larger hotspot will not be as bright on target, at the same total out the front lumens, as a smaller hotspot. The small hotspot, is why HDS lights can be brighter on target with less total lumens out the front, than a light with more output. Case in point, the HDS 325 w XP-L is not as bright on target (and does not throw as far), as the HDS 250 with single XP-G2. HDS does not publish the throw specs, if they did, we would be able to know if the HDS 200 High CRI w sw45 throws further than the HDS 325 w XP-L (which has a larger hotspot)


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## WalkIntoTheLight (May 28, 2019)

Fireclaw18 said:


> Since lights that are fully controlled by PWM always runs the LED at full power, they are the least efficient.
> 
> If you compare a current-control light v. a PWM control light, at full power both lights should have the same efficiency. However, at lower power settings the efficiency difference is visible with the current-control having significantly more battery life. Sometimes twice as much.



I certainly notice that my current-controlled lights, like Zebralights, are more efficient than my FET lights. However, I'm not sure if that's just the more expensive Zebralight has a better design overall.

I suppose I'll continue to accept the belief that PWM with FET is less efficient than current-regulated. And, it makes sense. But I'd still like to see some specific testing showing this. I've seen lots of tests, but they all use direct drive (i.e., FET at 100% duty cycle).

For example, are there any tests that measure watt-hours consumed after X minutes, when a LED is driven at 100% vs PWM at 50%. If the watt-hours are exactly double at 100%, then that would erase any doubt I have.



> Note, however, that some drivers, use a combination. The FW3A is primarily PWM controlled, but has 3-current controlled channels. At the lowest power settings, the first channel with just 1x 7135 chip (max 280 mAh) is active giving high efficiency. At intermediate settings the remaining 7x7135 also activate for up to 2.8 amps current. At the highest settings the FET also activates for the lowest efficiency, but highest ouptut.



Okay, but 7135 chips are horrible at efficiency, unless the battery voltage is very close to the forward voltage of the LED at the output you want to run. Any higher voltage, and the 7135 chip just burns away that excess voltage as heat. So, a fully-charged cell at 4.2v is wasting about 25% of its power just heating up the 7135 chip.

And if the battery voltage is lower than what is required, I think the 7135 just does PWM, doesn't it?

The best efficiency comes from a boost/buck driver.


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## peter yetman (May 28, 2019)

Fireclaw18 said:


> Note, however, that some drivers, use a combination. The FW3A is primarily PWM controlled, but has 3-current controlled channels. At the lowest power settings, the first channel with just 1x 7135 chip (max 280 mAh) is active giving high efficiency. At intermediate settings the remaining 7x7135 also activate for up to 2.8 amps current. At the highest settings the FET also activates for the lowest efficiency, but highest ouptut.


I like what you did there, you almost got us back on topic.
P


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## id30209 (May 28, 2019)

Just got mine, impressed with the size for a 18650. Heatsinking is awefull but luckily i have set the output (from min to max) to be regulated by 7135, constant current all the way. Like TK described, 1 is moonlight level and 150 is Turbo(FET). 
CC is regulating this little one up to 130 level (2.something Amps) and i set mine to 100.

Now looks even better, especially when temp sensor is recalibrated. Almost no heat as the first light up...


Sent from Tapatalk


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## WalkIntoTheLight (May 28, 2019)

id30209 said:


> i have set the output (from min to max) to be regulated by 7135, constant current all the way.



IFAIK, it's not "constant" current unless you have it using exactly 350mA or 7x350mA of current. If you use less current than 350mA, then it just uses PWM with the 7135 chip. At least, that's how I understand it. Could be wrong. Probably makes no difference to the eye, though, since the PWM is too fast to see.


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## Fireclaw18 (May 28, 2019)

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> IFAIK, it's not "constant" current unless you have it using exactly 350mA or 7x350mA of current. If you use less current than 350mA, then it just uses PWM with the 7135 chip. At least, that's how I understand it. Could be wrong. Probably makes no difference to the eye, though, since the PWM is too fast to see.


I think "Constant Current" refers to a flat amount of current sent to the LEDs. IE.: regulated modes. The output should be relatively flat as the battery depletes and voltage goes down. This is in contrast to the unregulated modes controlled by the FET where output declines sharply as voltage decreases. Regulated modes work just fine with PWM drivers.

"Constant Current" is the not same thing as "Current Control", which refers to a different method of controlling brightness by reducing the current to the LED.


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## id30209 (May 28, 2019)

That’s correct but the thing i didn’t mention is flashing of driver’s UI. 
Then you can choose output to be regulated with each step with one additional 7135.
And as always, double tap for turbo. If you like


Sent from Tapatalk


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## staticx57 (May 28, 2019)

A few things. Efficiency LED or driver efficiency. There's two part to this and each's efficiency is different. Easiest example of the separation is when you consider what an efficient driver is. A driver is efficient when the flow of power into it matches most closely to what exits, we want our drivers to have as little power loss-heat-as possible. 

We know 7135 drivers are most efficient when the voltage matches what the LED wants, as little voltage burned off as heat. This is a pretty simple solution. Then take something like a Zebralight with its buck boost design where instead of burning off the voltage it transforms it into what the LED needs. This is better but it costs more to design and build. Well what is our most efficient driver then? Well! It is the FET in direct drive. There is near no losses in the driver as its sole role is to just get out of the way of the current and voltage.

But we just said previous that our lights get super hot when using the FET drivers right? Well yes, operating direct drive with our high current 18650s will run the LEDs where _they _are least efficient.

OK next topic. PWM. The FW3A is PWM controlled in all modes in all levels. That is to say each regulating chip is controlled with PWM. So what is this talk of constant current? Well a 7135 _can_ be constant current with a duty cycle of 100% or PWM value of 255. This just means it is always held on instead of rapidly turning on or off.

I am looking at the ramp tables for the FW3A and there is preciously one level where all channels are in complete constant current. This is where 1x7135 and 7x7135 are both 100% and the FET has not turned on. This is ramp level 130/150.


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## Bucknkd313 (May 28, 2019)

When you get your first 18650 light, a watched battery never charges...


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## Fireclaw18 (May 28, 2019)

staticx57 said:


> A few things. Efficiency LED or driver efficiency. There's two part to this and each's efficiency is different. Easiest example of the separation is when you consider what an efficient driver is. A driver is efficient when the flow of power into it matches most closely to what exits, we want our drivers to have as little power loss-heat-as possible.
> 
> We know 7135 drivers are most efficient when the voltage matches what the LED wants, as little voltage burned off as heat. This is a pretty simple solution. Then take something like a Zebralight with its buck boost design where instead of burning off the voltage it transforms it into what the LED needs. This is better but it costs more to design and build. Well what is our most efficient driver then? Well! It is the FET in direct drive. There is near no losses in the driver as its sole role is to just get out of the way of the current and voltage.
> 
> ...



1x7135 level should also be constant current I think. First channel at max, other 2 channels off.


----------



## staticx57 (May 28, 2019)

Fireclaw18 said:


> 1x7135 level should also be constant current I think. First channel at max, other 2 channels off.


You are probably correct, I did take a fairly quick glance


----------



## jon_slider (May 29, 2019)

staticx57 said:


> I am looking at the ramp tables for the FW3A and there is preciously one level where all channels are in complete constant current. This is where 1x7135 and 7x7135 are both 100% and the FET has not turned on. This is ramp level 130/150.



thank you for the very clear and helpful explanations!



Fireclaw18 said:


> 1x7135 level should also be constant current I think. First channel at max, other 2 channels off.



and thank you also for the added level of detail


----------



## peter yetman (May 29, 2019)

Bucknkd313 said:


> When you get your first 18650 light, a watched battery never charges...


I can remember that. Don't worry, it gets better.
P


----------



## id30209 (May 29, 2019)

staticx57 said:


> I am looking at the ramp tables for the FW3A and there is preciously one level where all channels are in complete constant current. This is where 1x7135 and 7x7135 are both 100% and the FET has not turned on. This is ramp level 130/150.



The thing about flashing custom UI is that there’s possibility to use each of 7135’s installed individually, not only by PWM. In this case you loose smooth ramping and steped is the option in that case. 
I still need to confitm after testing or agree that i was bla blaing.
H17F is CC except on turbo...


Sent from Tapatalk


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## Fireclaw18 (May 29, 2019)

id30209 said:


> The thing about flashing custom UI is that there’s possibility to use each of 7135’s installed individually, not only by PWM. In this case you loose smooth ramping and steped is the option in that case.
> I still need to confitm after testing or agree that i was bla blaing.
> H17F is CC except on turbo...
> 
> ...


I don't think that is correct.

You could only control each 7135 individually if there was a separate control channel for each one from the Atiny MCU. There isn't. The MCU doesn't have enough pins. There are just 3 channels: One for the 1x7135. One for 7x7135 (which are wired in parallel so what happens to one happens to all), and one for the FET.


----------



## id30209 (May 29, 2019)

Oh bummer


Sent from Tapatalk


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## vadimax (May 30, 2019)

Regarding voltage issues. Yesterday I have received my FW3A — perfect, with a battery — perfect. But when I removed an isolating film and tried to switch the light on nothing has happened. Yes, the light blinks when I assemble it. But the button is “dead”.

Ok, I take another battery — the light functions properly. Hmm… I take a DMM — the battery that has arrived with the light turns out to be 3.462V. Well, nothing extraordinary. I charge it — now the light is functioning properly.

Now the question: was that just a first power on issue or will the light die this early (voltage sense) always by design?

BTW, my light is clean from inside, threads are lubed, retaining ring is tight.


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## Fireclaw18 (May 30, 2019)

You might have a defective light. Someone else on BLF reported something like this... the light not working on a battery that arrived with a rested voltage around 3.4v.

Toykeeper (who wrote the Anduril firmware) confirmed in that thread that the FW3A should continue running until the battery is almost depleted at around 2.8v or so. If yours won't work at 3.4v then something is off.


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## Archibald Tuttle (Jun 4, 2019)

Such a incredible product, especially at it's price point. It's a modding dream too! It's a keeper😂!!
Now,it won't replace my EDC. I still prefer a simple, rheostat style interface and I don't need the runtime. I have several outstanding work and drop lights that I prefer to flashlights.


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## xevious (Jun 4, 2019)

Archibald Tuttle said:


> Such a incredible product, especially at it's price point. It's a modding dream too! It's a keeper!!
> Now,it won't replace my EDC. I still prefer a simple, rheostat style interface and I don't need the runtime. I have several outstanding work and drop lights that I prefer to flashlights.


I like that protective bezel surround on the FW3A. Who makes it and where'd you find it?


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## eh4 (Jun 4, 2019)

Awesome... 
This looks like a really sweet light, and if you prefer the Emisar variant UI over the Andruil, it should be easy enough to swap boards or reflash, or send it to off to reflash.
- one nice thing about the Emisar UI variation is that the 4 clicks to momentary only HIGH - it persists when the battery cap is loosened... unlike the "lockout mode", which is lost if the battery contact is loosened for even a second... not much of a lockout if you ask me. 
But according to a youtube review I just watched, it appears that with the Andruil UI, that the tactical mode suffers the same mode amnesia with loss of battery contact as the "lockout" does with the Emisar UI (which is an Andruil variant).
I'd love to be mistaken about that. 

I'd still have an HDS if I could have gotten an 18650 tube for less than 100$.


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## eh4 (Jun 4, 2019)

When people comment that "heat sinking is awful"... does that mean that the light heats up super fast?
- or that the body of the light Doesn't heat up fast enough, and the thermal regulation is kicking in before the body heats up?

I understand that this is a light with very little mass to it... if the heat sink contact with the body is good, then the aluminum body of the light Should get Hot Fast on high or turbo. 
If the heat sinking is bad, the light should ramp down before the body gets impressively hot.


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## Fireclaw18 (Jun 5, 2019)

Heat sinking to the outside of the light is excellent. The shelf is solid and very thick. And this light does not use a pill... the knurled section at the front of the light is one piece containing the shelf.

However, the head itself overall is quite lightweight. Not much mass there other than in the shelf and there are no heatsink fins to increase surface area to get the heat out of the light. Also the FW3A does use a separate head... it's not a one-piece unibody construction like a Zebralight. 

As a result, if you put in a fresh high drain cell and blast 3500 lumen turbo out of your FW3A the head, bezel and upper half of the battery tube is going to heat up FAST ... which will cause the temp sensor in the driver to ramp output down fast. I think the max sustained output is around 300 lumens. That's less than the 500 lumens you can get from an Emisar D4 with its beefier head and battery tube and heatsink fins.


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## eh4 (Jun 5, 2019)

Thanks for clarifying that. 
Yeah 300 lumens sustained is pretty reasonable for a light that weighs so little. 
Good reminder of how good ZL unibody heat sinking really is, looks like this little light weighs about the same as an H600. 
Setting the thermal sensor to the max that I can continuously hold will have to do, and use hand and blood flow for additional cooling.


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## WalkIntoTheLight (Jun 5, 2019)

BTW, I find the Anduril thermal controls on the FW3A to be much improved over the Narsil controls on other lights (like the Astrolux S43). It seems to have a much more measured ramp-down, and doesn't overreact. So, while 300 lumens may not sound like a lot, it's pretty decent compared to an over-active thermal ramp-down. And, for a light this small and light, you can't really expect much more.

Oh, and on a completely unrelated topic....


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## eh4 (Jun 5, 2019)

Nice video review!
One thing to notice is that while we're talking about 300 lumens max for constant use as a significant limitation, -you won't see much more than that listed on ZL site for any of its lights without a PID in parentheses next to the output. 

This light looks great to me, if I wanted a sustained high power battery burner I'd get a heavier light, but I'm almost always more interested in flexible configuration and light weight, with momentary turbo. 
Should be a great successor to my 3000 Kelvin Emisar D4, which is a great light, but a tad bulky, and I never quite got comfortable with finding the side switch reliability without distraction.


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## Archibald Tuttle (Jun 5, 2019)

xevious said:


> I like that protective bezel surround on the FW3A. Who makes it and where'd you find it?



It's my very first attempt at a 3D printed bezel protector, for this light. It's similar to the design from a Olight FM10 filter adapter. I like it, but have to reduce the front end a bit. It every so slightly reduces the side spill. And need to add slot for filters as well. Once I'm happy with it I'll probably upload it to Thingiverse so it's there for everyone.
The thermal management of this light is up to the discretion and common sense of it's owner. You have the ability to make this a insanely short lived pocket rocket or a nicely managed illumination device. Kudos to the 'script' writer on this one.:thumbsup:


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## xevious (Jun 5, 2019)

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> BTW, I find the Anduril thermal controls on the FW3A to be much improved over the Narsil controls on other lights (like the Astrolux S43). It seems to have a much more measured ramp-down, and doesn't overreact. So, while 300 lumens may not sound like a lot, it's pretty decent compared to an over-active thermal ramp-down. And, for a light this small and light, you can't really expect much more.
> 
> Oh, and on a completely unrelated topic....



Wow, long review! Thanks for taking the time to be thorough. I was really glad you pulled out white paper as shining beams on the wooden desk was doing the tint observations no justice. My suggestion is to use white wall next time so you have ample space. I also think it would've helped to mention the XP-L emitter tint identifier options: 7A (WW) vs. 3D (NW). As for the Lumintop production model, I expect they'll glue down the switch assembly to the cap so that both ends can be unscrewed. It would be a real PITA if they cemented the tail cap in place, because if you need to service the switch it'll be a real struggle.

I am also a Zebralight fan. I have the SC64c LE and so that's why I oped for the 3D instead of 7A. Overall, I like the fact that the FW3A has a rear electronic tail cap, as you can press it regardless of rotated light orientation. With the ZL having the switch on the side, it does encourage holding the light in one orientation so you've always got the switch with a finger (or thumb) on it. But the deep recessed position on the ZL means it's easy to pocket without having to lock out. The FW3A switch activates too easily so I frequently do a minor turn of the head to manually lock it out.


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## WalkIntoTheLight (Jun 5, 2019)

xevious said:


> Wow, long review! Thanks for taking the time to be thorough. I was really glad you pulled out white paper as shining beams on the wooden desk was doing the tint observations no justice. My suggestion is to use white wall next time so you have ample space. I also think it would've helped to mention the XP-L emitter tint identifier options: 7A (WW) vs. 3D (NW).



Yes, normally I do night shots, but I got lazy. Just so many mosquitoes to eat me alive at this time of year. White wall would have been better than paper.

I think they also have a cool white option now (1A).



> As for the Lumintop production model, I expect they'll glue down the switch assembly to the cap so that both ends can be unscrewed. It would be a real PITA if they cemented the tail cap in place, because if you need to service the switch it'll be a real struggle.



They could use something like blue Loctite. I think that should be able to come off, with some force. But you wouldn't do it by accident. Or, some kind of retaining ring for the tail contents.

The spring in mine is way off center. It doesn't seem to affect the light, though. QC seems a little lax with this design, and should be improved even if it makes the light cost a couple of dollars more.


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## nightshade (Jun 7, 2019)

Just...Wow:twothumbs.... this light is a modding cornucopia. So many rabbit holes you could pursue. Its a homage to modders. i can really dig the simple and clean lines, no hipster flutes and no skulls. You can tell that folks with a history of lights, and with a love of lights, made this thing. Gave one away to a old bud who always wanted a NC D10 with a 18650 and the longer runtimes. Liked it enough to order another for myself. Just cracked mine, and ToyKeeper is a pragmatic genius, IMO. 
Is it perfect? No.
Is it fun? YES!!


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## eh4 (Jun 7, 2019)

Agreed, No Doubts.


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## Fireclaw18 (Jun 13, 2019)

Looks like Neal is hard at work on a ton of variants for the FW3A. 

*On BLF there are already prototype photos of the FW3A in a number of different materials*:
- All copper (these are already available for sale on his site)
- Titanium copper - (titanium bezel, body tube and tail with copper head). Looks to be with both bare and colored anodize titanium like the Emisar D4 Ti-Cu.
- All brass
- Blue colored anodized aluminum
- White colored anodized aluminum
- Bright purple colored anodized aluminum
*
Plus a number of other options are available or soon to be available from his shop including*:
- SST-20 4000K 95CRI FA3 bin. Supposedly less green than other available high-CRI SST20.
- Glow in the dark colored optic cavity inserts.
- Optics with trits pre-installed in the legs.

Looks like the FW3A will very shortly have even more options available than the Emisar D4.


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## Flashlike (Jun 13, 2019)

The copper version (FW3C) was just posted on Neal's website today.


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## RobertMM (Jun 14, 2019)

Copper, nice!!!
I want a black Al version though. 

My 10507 narrow clear spot optics arrived today and I instantly installed one of them.

I hate floody beams so this is a lot better for my taste.


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## ven (Jun 15, 2019)

RobertMM said:


> Copper, nice!!!
> I want a black Al version though.
> 
> My 10507 narrow clear spot optics arrived today and I instantly installed one of them.
> ...




Exactly what i did Robert, narrow clear optics in. Much better(and i like a floody beam). I think the idea was with the floody optic, was to reduce the little fugly in the beam pattern. I find the narrow fine though, also find the extra punch it gives more useful generally(still a wide beam anyway). 

Must resist the cu, must resist the.......


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## id30209 (Jun 15, 2019)

ven said:


> Must resist the cu, must resist the.......


It's 59$ with BLF code....)


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## Nichia! (Jun 15, 2019)

What copper?? I don't see anything about it?


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## id30209 (Jun 15, 2019)

Nichia! said:


> What copper?? I don't see anything about it?



https://www.nealsgadgets.com/collec...e-xpl-hi-2800lm-edc-led-flashlight-anduril-ui


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## Nichia! (Jun 15, 2019)

Looks good! Is it out yet?


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## justanotherguy (Jun 15, 2019)

1.FW3C COPPER POLISHED version available to order, 

Estimate ship start at July 1st.


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## justanotherguy (Jun 15, 2019)

Nichia! said:


> Looks good! Is it out yet?



I attempted to send you a pm regarding this light


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## Nichia! (Jun 15, 2019)

justanotherguy said:


> I attempted to send you a pm regarding this light



Inbox cleared


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## ven (Jun 15, 2019)

id30209 said:


> It's 59$ with BLF code....)



:devil:


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## Heywood Floyd (Jun 18, 2019)

_*@Fireclaw18*_ Re Original Release RRT-01 Modding ... pm sent. TIA


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## daffy (Jun 20, 2019)

Awesome torch, with thermal @ 60 c i get a few minutes out of Turbo.
So much torch in 1 package, love the size, weight etc.
Im afraid that my soon to arrive Fireflies 07 may take pole position as its a 21700 with longer runtimes.
Either way after spending a small fortune on stock factory lights (mainly Olight) I've now discovered the flashlights I like most, even adding some colour along the way.


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## mortuus (Jun 20, 2019)

daffy said:


> Awesome torch, with thermal @ 60 c i get a few minutes out of Turbo.
> So much torch in 1 package, love the size, weight etc.
> Im afraid that my soon to arrive Fireflies 07 may take pole position as its a 21700 with longer runtimes.
> Either way after spending a small fortune on stock factory lights (mainly Olight) I've now discovered the flashlights I like most, even adding some colour along the way.



hm how does thermal help ? if i double click within 10 seconds it starts to get very hot that i dont longer want to run on that high... ?


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## Fireclaw18 (Jun 20, 2019)

mortuus said:


> hm how does thermal help ? if i double click within 10 seconds it starts to get very hot that i dont longer want to run on that high... ?



High powered pocket rockets like the FW3A get quite hot during operation. This is normal. Thermal regulation in the driver ramps down output to prevent the light from getting too hot.

In general, the light innards and battery can take a LOT of heat. The usual limiting factor is your hand, since the head should never become hot enough to cause burns.


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## LedTed (Jun 27, 2019)

After a couple of email requests, I can’t seem to get a shipping update. Does anybody know when these are going to be available again?


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## Heywood Floyd (Jun 28, 2019)

LedTed said:


> After a couple of email requests, I can’t seem to get a shipping update. Does anybody know when these are going to be available again?


This might provide some context ...
https://youtu.be/WNttME00cDc


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## gonefishing (Jul 22, 2019)

So my clip got caught on my seatbelt and when I took the clip off to bend it back, this little O-Ring ripped. Anyone know where I can get a replacement? 







Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Fireclaw18 (Jul 22, 2019)

That little o-ring isn't there for water resistance. It's just there to provide some friction to keep the clip from rotating. I recommend just sticking it back in the light as-is. Even broken it should still be able to fulfill its function.


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## gonefishing (Jul 22, 2019)

Fireclaw18 said:


> That little o-ring isn't there for water resistance. It's just there to provide some friction to keep the clip from rotating. I recommend just sticking it back in the light as-is. Even broken it should still be able to fulfill its function.



Thanks! I noticed immediately that the clip did slide a little. I tried to reinstall it, but it does not stick. Not the end of the world, but I would like to pick a few up if anyone knows where I can find them. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## boo5ted (Jul 22, 2019)

Any hardware store should have them.


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## LedTed (Jul 23, 2019)

The FW3A is close to replacing my NC HC30 as my daily EDC. If I could get a few more in different colors, it would be.

My thought is not based on looks alone. Though the FW3A is a handsome little light, it is as fun as it is functional.

For fun, I really like the candle mode. And I really enjoy a rear clicky.

Per function, I like lockout mode and the bright useable beam. I remember lock / unlock by the following, “for safety”. That is, four (4 - safety) clicks to put the light into safe mode and another four (4 - use) clicks to take the light out of safe mode. To explain what I mean as a useable beam requires the following practical example.

I took the trash out the other night. Yes, just so I could have an excuse to use my new flashlight. But then I had to temporarily use both hands. So I easily took advantage of the light’s clip and quickly, simply pocked the light; without effort or even looking. Just as I used my now free hands to spin around the garbage can, something approached me, low to the ground, and from my blind side. Without as much as a thought, I whipped the light out of where I had just pocketed it and double-clicked the button. I appreciated that the first click gave me light right where I was aiming and appreciated even more that, without moving my aim, the second click gave the intruder a blast of light.

By-the-bye, the “intruder” turned out only to be a friendly neighborhood kitty-cat who was merely investigating the commotion I was causing. Thought the kitty did take a moment to rub up against me, I don’t think she had any appreciation for the bright light I had the intuition to blast but not the good since to turn down. For, she sauntered off as easily as she had drifted in.

I, on the other hand, did then and do now appreciate the light. Let me iterate, I cannot overrun the switch. Safety back inside, I tried but could not. And, taking advantage of the clever way actions are consistently handled, I also had fun playing with candle mode.

Though the FW3A it’s not what I would call a “tactical” flashlight. The UI is well thought out and the SW is perfectly responsive. It’s a blaster which can be easily tuned by simply switching out the optics. And, thought I prefer a snowy white beam, there are a few LED choices available.

Now if I could get a few more in different colors.


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## JimIslander (Jul 23, 2019)

LedTed said:


> Now if I could get a few more in different colors.



Indeed, you can get it in several colors (soon), and polished copper (now)!


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## boo5ted (Aug 4, 2019)

Does anyone make a deep carry clip for the FW3A? That's the only thing that's missing imo.


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## LedTed (Aug 7, 2019)

According to Neilsgadgets, the FW3X is available for preorder, to be tentatively shipped on August 20th, in various materials and colors.


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## joshk (Aug 8, 2019)

What's the main difference between the Nichia and SST20 option? Aren't they both great CRI and about the same brightness?


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## LedTed (Aug 9, 2019)

There is something about it on Reddit. Just Google your question and hit the Reddit link.


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## raggie33 (Aug 11, 2019)

is the cree hi version use pretty newer eficent leds?


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## joot (Aug 16, 2019)

I ordered mine from Nealsgadget a week ago. I installed the battery in per instructions. It does NOT turn on, no light, nothing. Did I get a dud? I charged, re-charge the blue battery it came with, no difference. Went on Amazon and ordered the premium Japanese ORBTRONIC battery brand and flashlight still does not work.


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## peter yetman (Aug 16, 2019)

Have you checked to make sure you've not locked the light out?
4 clicks from off will toggle the electronic lockout.
P


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## joot (Aug 16, 2019)

peter yetman said:


> Have you checked to make sure you've not locked the light out?
> 4 clicks from off will toggle the electronic lockout.
> P




How would I unlock it (if it was lockout)? When I twist the top end on, there is a momentary light but once it's screwed secured on, clicking the back end does nothing.


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## raggie33 (Aug 16, 2019)

im haveing a hect of a time locking mine love the light but i need to be able to lock it


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## boo5ted (Aug 16, 2019)

joot said:


> How would I unlock it (if it was lockout)? When I twist the top end on, there is a momentary light but once it's screwed secured on, clicking the back end does nothing.




4 clicks from off will turn off the lockout feature. Also loosen the head and then try to tighten the tail, then tighten the head. Plenty have reported the tail being loose upon delivery.


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## raggie33 (Aug 16, 2019)

is this light pretty battery runtime good?


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## thermal guy (Aug 19, 2019)

You know I’m going to order one of these I think. What 18650 are most using?


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## LedTed (Aug 19, 2019)

Due to: current requirements, fitment, and shipping - I went with what nealsgadgets had as an add on to my order.


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## idleprocess (Aug 19, 2019)

thermal guy said:


> You know I’m going to order one of these I think. What 18650 are most using?



I'm running Samsung INR18650-25R's (principally because I already had them for my Emisars); Samsung INR18650-30Q's would surely be a better choice since peak current delivery doesn't matter so much on a platform like the FW3A which thermally throttles *promptly*.


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## iamlucky13 (Aug 20, 2019)

joot said:


> I ordered mine from Nealsgadget a week ago. I installed the battery in per instructions. It does NOT turn on, no light, nothing. Did I get a dud? I charged, re-charge the blue battery it came with, no difference. Went on Amazon and ordered the premium Japanese ORBTRONIC battery brand and flashlight still does not work.



One thing to try is loosening the head, then tightening the tail firmly, then re-tightening the head.

It's a simple enough assembly detail to fix, but has been a common problem, because if not assembled by tightening the tail first, the battery switch signal tube might not make good contact.

Also, it is design to have the battery inserted by removing the head, not the tail.


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## wardn1 (Aug 21, 2019)

I've been enjoying this light for a couple weeks now. Had some friends over on the deck one night and both the candle mode and lightning mode were enjoyed by all. Something I never thought I would use.


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## TheDoctorNL (Aug 21, 2019)

Thinking about getting this for EDC
Copper one looks really nice but the colored ones do too!
Decisions decisions...


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## DAN92 (Sep 10, 2019)

Received my FW3A. 


I use an AW IMR18650 battery, is it a good choice for this light?


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## boo5ted (Sep 10, 2019)

Looks like an FW1A is now available on Neals site.


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## borealis (Sep 10, 2019)

DAN92 said:


> I use an AW IMR18650 battery, is it a good choice for this light?



I think if it turns on, then it's good. I have a few protected batteries that don't work in it.


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## DAN92 (Sep 11, 2019)

borealis said:


> I think if it turns on, then it's good.


Thanks for your message borealis. 

Mostly, I use these unprotected batteries with my Oveready lights, But I will surely buy a 18650 Samsung INR18650-35E battery. 



borealis said:


> I have a few protected batteries that don't work in it.


Normally, use an unprotected battery.


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## Lane32x (Sep 22, 2019)

joshk said:


> What's the main difference between the Nichia and SST20 option? Aren't they both great CRI and about the same brightness?



I believe the Nichia version gets hotter than the other emitter options. I know the SST20 is hotter than the XPL-Hi but if I recall correctly the Nichia is even hotter. 
that said, I tend to love all of my Nichia lights that I’ve had so far and I want an FW in Nichia at some point.


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## Lane32x (Sep 22, 2019)

DAN92 said:


> Thanks for your message borealis.
> 
> Mostly, I use these unprotected batteries with my Oveready lights, But I will surely buy a 18650 Samsung INR18650-35E battery.
> 
> ...



Have you found some protected cells that fit inside this light and allow it to work? The original thread about this light specifically calls out the need for u protected cells, and I haven’t found any that meet the width/length requirements yet.


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## id30209 (Sep 23, 2019)

Lane32x said:


> Have you found some protected cells that fit inside this light and allow it to work? The original thread about this light specifically calls out the need for u protected cells, and I haven’t found any that meet the width/length requirements yet.



Fenix 18650 fits perfect


Sent from Tapatalk


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## 5S8Zh5 (Oct 28, 2019)

Where is the best place to get one?


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## joshk (Oct 28, 2019)

I got mine from Illumn. I hear it's the only place to get the good bin of SST-20. https://www.illumn.com/lumintop-fw3a-tlf-blf-edc-aluminum-flashlight-2047.html
Another option is Neal's gadgets, but I've heard he can take over a month to put your order in the mail, and another month after that to arrive. And it's not unusual for him to not reply to emails and other forms of contact during that time. So I've never ordered from him.


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## justanotherguy (Oct 28, 2019)

5S8Zh5 said:


> Where is the best place to get one?



Neal has been mediocre for me... One out of two never came, it took weeks for the replacement..
TiCu and Cu.. Those came fast.
The fw1a is another lost in the mail, waiting a month for replacement...

So I guess..illumn.com might be your source of least concern


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## 5S8Zh5 (Oct 28, 2019)

Thanks guys.



joshk said:


> I got mine from Illumn. I hear it's the only place to get the good bin of SST-20. https://www.illumn.com/lumintop-fw3a-tlf-blf-edc-aluminum-flashlight-2047.html
> Another option is Neal's gadgets, but I've heard he can take over a month to put your order in the mail, and another month after that to arrive. And it's not unusual for him to not reply to emails and other forms of contact during that time. So I've never ordered from him.





justanotherguy said:


> Neal has been mediocre for me... One out of two never came, it took weeks for the replacement..
> TiCu and Cu.. Those came fast.
> The fw1a is another lost in the mail, waiting a month for replacement...
> 
> So I guess..illumn.com might be your source of least concern


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## 5S8Zh5 (Oct 29, 2019)

I was interested in the FW3A, and even the EDC18, until I saw a video which showed / mentioned that they have a magnet. Unfortunately, I avoid lights with a magnet and those that I do have (47 Atom AAA and AA - love the flood!) are kept far away from my wrist watches. So this is a no-go for me. Had it in my illumn cart yesterday along with a Sony VTC6. That was close.


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## id30209 (Oct 29, 2019)

Magnet? Have both of them and no magnet in vicinity...
Also, whoever is ordering from US, illumn is the only fast option. And they have discount codes as well[emoji41]


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## AVService (Oct 29, 2019)

Another happy Illumn customer here,they seem to arrive so quickly that I am always surprised really!

Also there are no magnets in the 3 that I have and I am not sure where they would have them as the light uses a tail switch?


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## justanotherguy (Oct 29, 2019)

To be clear.. The fw3/1 series have no magnet

The edc18 side switched lights do......
Correct?


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## 5S8Zh5 (Oct 29, 2019)

Thanks *id30209 *& *AVService*.

Thought I saw / heard / read the FW3A had a tailcap magnet. Glad I was mistaken.

The EDC18 does.

_The magnetic tail cap and the reverse stainless steel pocket clip makes it easy to carry and capable of hands-free. _


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## boo5ted (Oct 29, 2019)

Just heard that a stainless model will be available in a couple weeks. Introducing the FW3S.


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## id30209 (Oct 29, 2019)

Neale confirmed it will be ready next week[emoji3516][emoji3516][emoji3516]


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## boo5ted (Oct 29, 2019)

and here I am still waiting on a FW1T.


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## justanotherguy (Oct 29, 2019)

boo5ted said:


> and here I am still waiting on a FW1T.




How long though? My first two FW3A, one never came. Had to File PP dispute, and then re-order a couple weeks later. The Cu and TiCu, those came fast enough. The FW1A, that's is another no show after a few weeks ,he reshipped, still waiting (friday?)....
One of the FW3A, went for powdercoat, got damaged, the guy ordered a replacement to powdercoat .. No word for a couple weeks.. then I got a stock FW3A as a replacement from powdercoat guy, no explanation.

Not even going into the FW21....

these have been a wild ride for sure


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## id30209 (Oct 29, 2019)

boo5ted said:


> and here I am still waiting on a FW1T.



They droped that idea if am reading correctly... [emoji20]


Sent from Tapatalk


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## boo5ted (Oct 29, 2019)

justanotherguy said:


> How long though? My first two FW3A, one never came. Had to File PP dispute, and then re-order a couple weeks later. The Cu and TiCu, those came fast enough. The FW1A, that's is another no show after a few weeks ,he reshipped, still waiting (friday?)....
> One of the FW3A, went for powdercoat, got damaged, the guy ordered a replacement to powdercoat .. No word for a couple weeks.. then I got a stock FW3A as a replacement from powdercoat guy, no explanation.
> 
> Not even going into the FW21....
> ...



Haven't ordered one, still waiting on Lumintop to make it. 



id30209 said:


> They droped that idea if am reading correctly... [emoji20]
> 
> 
> Sent from Tapatalk


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## Archibald Tuttle (Nov 1, 2019)

Corking bit of torch. Chuffed with the raw aluminium . I've turned a recessed switch body, threads are rough, but it fixed the proud switch and occasional hot pocket. 
I was wary of the designs ability to take impact. After several turns to concrete and metal stairs, so far, so good. I've tested mine waterproof to 1 meter of sea water. 
At my age, it's good enough. Remarkable design and engineering.
It isn't great kit for the SAS, Mr. Wick or any other low drag, high speed operators. You know who you are. Yet, it's a fair enough tool for those who will mind the homestead, stay occupied, until the champions return. :wave:


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## boo5ted (Nov 1, 2019)

Someone had too much candy last night.


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## 5S8Zh5 (Nov 4, 2019)

I got my FW3A the other day and have been carrying it every day since. What I like about it? The beam is that best in lighting a path while walking in the early morning (my daily 1). I got the grey / Aluminum (non-anodized) SST-20 4000K Neutral W 95+ CRI. Using the Sony US18650VTC6 3000mAh High Discharge Flat Top. Great reading up about this in CPF, and watching videos, so I knew to not remove the tailcap. My click mechanism is sweet and tactile. I'm getting another with the Cree XP-L HI 1A (Cool White 6500K) next.


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## 5S8Zh5 (Nov 8, 2019)

FW3A #2 arrived - Purple, with Cree XP-L HI 1A (Cool White 6500K). Took her out walking the dog park perimeter and man it's a nice beam. Best beam for walking that I've seen so far.


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## xevious (Nov 11, 2019)

5S8Zh5 said:


> I got my FW3A the other day and have been carrying it every day since. What I like about it? The beam is that best in lighting a path while walking in the early morning (my daily 1). I got the grey / Aluminum (non-anodized) SST-20 4000K Neutral W 95+ CRI. Using the Sony US18650VTC6 3000mAh High Discharge Flat Top. Great reading up about this in CPF, and watching videos, so I knew to not remove the tailcap. My click mechanism is sweet and tactile. I'm getting another with the Cree XP-L HI 1A (Cool White 6500K) next.





5S8Zh5 said:


> FW3A #2 arrived - Purple, with Cree XP-L HI 1A (Cool White 6500K). Took her out walking the dog park perimeter and man it's a nice beam. Best beam for walking that I've seen so far.


Nice to hear of another happy FW3A customer. I have an early release with SST-20 4000k, and I love it. The Anduril UI is truly amazing. I've customized mine a bit, but very inexpensively. The GITD insert is terrific to have.


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## justanotherguy (Nov 11, 2019)

Xevious.. how good does that tape perform?
is it from AliExpress?


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## pappajohan (Nov 14, 2019)

Anybody got an good and easy mod to reduce the sensitivity of the tail switch?

Have a love/hate relationship with this light, the sensitivity of the switch being the biggest issue.

My solution so far to reduce accidentally burning my pockets is to remove the metal switch using only the rubber part of the assembly. 
While this works I find it a bit hard to turn the light on and off due to the rubber part being a bit deeper inside. 

And yes, I know I can quadruple klick to put it momentary moonlight, but I don't really feel like that's a viable option.

Finding myself switching lights between the FW3A and the D4 V2 daily....

Anybody got any suggestions? 

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## joshk (Nov 14, 2019)

Do you have a 3D printer? I could send you a ring to make the button appear recessed.


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## AVService (Nov 14, 2019)

I find it a lot easier and quicker to just loosen the front slightly for a mechanical lockout and I have not had one turn on when unplanned since then.
There are a lot of lights that seem to require this same handling and I am sort of used to it by now.


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## Mr. Shawn (Nov 15, 2019)

pappajohan, I feel the same way about the switch, which is why I glued a washer to the tail, as explained here.


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## pappajohan (Nov 15, 2019)

Mr. Shawn said:


> pappajohan, I feel the same way about the switch, which is why I glued a washer to the tail, as explained here.


Looks like an easy enough solution.


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## gunga (Nov 15, 2019)

My solution is from BLF. I removed the plastic nubbin from under the switch boot. This was replaced with an oring. 1/16 thickness, 3/16 ID, I believe it's #8. This increases the stiffness of the switch. Feels much better. I also added some no -oxit grease under the boot to make it a bit quieter. I put some kapton tape on the button to prevent grease from getting to the switch.


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## pappajohan (Nov 15, 2019)

gunga said:


> My solution is from BLF. I removed the plastic nubbin from under the switch boot. This was replaced with an oring. 1/16 thickness, 3/16 ID, I believe it's #8. This increases the stiffness of the switch. Feels much better. I also added some no -oxit grease under the boot to make it a bit quieter. I put some kapton tape on the button to prevent grease from getting to the switch.


Trying the o-ring thing out, the ones I had laying around seems just a tad to thick, have some inconsistency turning the light on and off. 

If I press more firmly I have no issue though....

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## hjkl (Nov 15, 2019)

How reliable are these lights?

Could I drop it from waist height in a puddle and not worry too much about it?

Will it always come on when I activate the switch?

I have been interested in getting one but have reservations due to concerns of reliability.


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## JimIslander (Nov 15, 2019)

gunga said:


> My solution is from BLF. I removed the plastic nubbin from under the switch boot. This was replaced with an oring. 1/16 thickness, 3/16 ID, I believe it's #8. This increases the stiffness of the switch. Feels much better. I also added some no -oxit grease under the boot to make it a bit quieter. I put some kapton tape on the button to prevent grease from getting to the switch.



I was just wondering what to use to fix the easy-on issue. Thank you for posting! I have tons of O-rings at my office. May have to go into work this weekend.


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## 5S8Zh5 (Nov 16, 2019)

AVService said:


> I find it a lot easier and quicker to just loosen the front slightly for a mechanical lockout and I have not had one turn on when unplanned since then.
> There are a lot of lights that seem to require this same handling and I am sort of used to it by now.


Great tips - thanks.


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## idleprocess (Nov 16, 2019)

pappajohan said:


> Anybody got an good and easy mod to reduce the sensitivity of the tail switch?
> 
> Have a love/hate relationship with this light, the sensitivity of the switch being the biggest issue.
> 
> ...



I would recommend that anyone considering the FW3A (and its variants) _*embrace the lockout*_ - be it the electronic lockout or loosening the head. If four clicks or tightening the head isn't going to work for your use cases then perhaps the FW3A isn't for you.



hjkl said:


> How reliable are these lights?
> 
> Could I drop it from waist height in a puddle and not worry too much about it?
> 
> ...



A mud puddle? Probably. Onto concrete? Not so certain. I have two and both have been dropped from waist height onto hard surfaces. The "v1" (no retaining ring for the tail switch) has had no issues while the "v2" (switch retaining ring) has had troubles ever since the first drop for reasons I can't sort out.


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## JaguarDave-in-Oz (Nov 16, 2019)

I have this torch and the very sensitive button was a big problem for me. I even had it switching on in my top shirt pocket.



gunga said:


> My solution is from BLF. I removed the plastic nubbin from under the switch boot. This was replaced with an oring. 1/16 thickness, 3/16 ID, I believe it's #8. This increases the stiffness of the switch. Feels much better. ....


I did much the same as this by removing the litttle knob from the rubber cap (the knob was a white nylon-ish one in my retaining ring version) only instead of using an off-the-shelf o ring I made myself a flat ring out of thin high density foam using a big and little wadcutter and installed it in the recess of the rubbber cap. The switch now takes much more pressure to activate but is still perfectly able to be actuated for programming etc.

There is no way a four press sequence lock-out would work for me. I use a torch maybe fifty times per day and night, often while bent into wierd positions looking into machines etc and getting it out one handed and having it work instantly is a necessity.

Yes, I'm pretty sure that when looked at objectively, the torch is "not for me", it has a number of negatives when it comes to fitting in with the way i use a torch but it also has a number of features that I really like so I'm a bit torn.

I do prefer my Jetbeam RRT-01 (2019) because it just works perfectly in every situation and you can instantly select brightness (and it has that wonderful super low bottom end) but it's only an 18350 torch and the runtimes and lack of proper low voltage management are a bit of a problem in my usage. 

I love the Fw3a's battery voltage check, I love its programmability and it's nearly as fast to ramp as the RRT-01 but I don't love the fw3a's very slippery body (that weak knurling might as well not be there) and I detest its overly broad beam, great for using indoors (which surely renders the high brightness redundant) but the wide spread of flood light makes it useless for looking any distance out here in the sticks where I live because too much of the foreground is lit making it very hard for the eyes to see further downfield even though the light is powerful enough to illuminate that further ground. For that same reason its not very good for use in looking into gaps in the machinery of things like farm impements, looking under cluttered benches for tools and snakes etc. 

I've ordered the fw1a whose beam will be much more useful in the activities I undertake although I'm still not sure its slipperiness will be able to be accomodated.


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## JimIslander (Nov 17, 2019)

gunga said:


> My solution is from BLF. I removed the plastic nubbin from under the switch boot. This was replaced with an oring. 1/16 thickness, 3/16 ID, I believe it's #8. This increases the stiffness of the switch. Feels much better. I also added some no -oxit grease under the boot to make it a bit quieter. I put some kapton tape on the button to prevent grease from getting to the switch.



A metric #3 is about this size and works fine. It still is not hard enough for me to feel safe in my pocket working, but for EDC, yes.

*NOTE: The hard plastic nubbin can be safely and securely stored under the lens.*


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## WalkIntoTheLight (Nov 17, 2019)

Yeah, the FW3A is not for EDC. I tried it a couple of times, but accidental activations were way too common. Nice light... for a shelf.


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## AVService (Nov 17, 2019)

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Yeah, the FW3A is not for EDC. I tried it a couple of times, but accidental activations were way too common. Nice light... for a shelf.


I carry mine EDC since getting one.
It has its own pocket though in the carpenter pants and it is locked out with a twist too,no big deal at all?


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## Heywood Floyd (Nov 17, 2019)

Ditto for me on the FW3A ... No probs at all locking out with a twist and four taps before if concerned.





A new FW3T / Cu was DoA but some DeOxiT and playing around woke it up and has been rock solid since.







On the down side Nealsgadgets has been on average a two month wait from pay to arrival. One month to ship and another for the slow boat. Also communications have not been what I'd call stellar. Unfortunately this seems to reflect others on this forum.
Will probably go elsewhere next time.









AVService said:


> I carry mine EDC since getting one.
> It has its own pocket though in the carpenter pants and it is locked out with a twist too,no big deal at all?


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## WalkIntoTheLight (Nov 17, 2019)

AVService said:


> I carry mine EDC since getting one.
> It has its own pocket though in the carpenter pants and it is locked out with a twist too,no big deal at all?



I know it's not much effort, but I don't want to have to unlock it to use it. I use a Zebralight for EDC instead. I've never had one of them accidentally turn on.

The way I use a light, it's often used for just a few seconds, but usually many, many times when I'm walking. Locking/unlocking isn't something I'm willing to do that often.


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## Random Dan (Nov 17, 2019)

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> I know it's not much effort, but I don't want to have to unlock it to use it. I use a Zebralight for EDC instead. I've never had one of them accidentally turn on.
> 
> The way I use a light, it's often used for just a few seconds, but usually many, many times when I'm walking. Locking/unlocking isn't something I'm willing to do that often.


I agree. It's not much trouble, but why would I bother when I have so many other options that are faster and easier.


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## AVService (Nov 17, 2019)

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> I know it's not much effort, but I don't want to have to unlock it to use it. I use a Zebralight for EDC instead. I've never had one of them accidentally turn on.
> 
> The way I use a light, it's often used for just a few seconds, but usually many, many times when I'm walking. Locking/unlocking isn't something I'm willing to do that often.



Me too.
The ZL is the number 1 go to and the F3 is the backup.


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## gunga (Nov 18, 2019)

The oring mod is interesting. On one FW3A and FW3T it stiffens things up and is decent for edc (no lockout). On another it makes the switch very firm and definitely ok for edc without lockout. Go figure.


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## euroken (Nov 18, 2019)

I love the electronic lock out. It basically turns on low low or just low with double click hold, even when locked out. Four press to unlock takes less then a second. 

I actually just leave it on lockout for daily use.


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## pappajohan (Nov 18, 2019)

euroken said:


> I love the electronic lock out. It basically turns on low low or just low with double click hold, even when locked out. Four press to unlock takes less then a second.
> 
> I actually just leave it on lockout for daily use.


My doesn't do that, earlier version of Anduril I guess? Just goes into low low. 

My Emisar D4V2 however does it, love that feature.

To bad the D4 is a bit to fat around the head for my pockets generally....

Is there any way to update the Anduril version on the Fw3a using the same system that's available for the D4V2? Haven't found any pin connections on the light(driver?)

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## JaguarDave-in-Oz (Nov 18, 2019)

gunga said:


> The oring mod is interesting. On one FW3A and FW3T it stiffens things up and is decent for edc (no lockout). On another it makes the switch very firm and definitely ok for edc without lockout. Go figure.


maybe try making some rings/washers out of different materials. I used a 5/16" wadcutter to make the outer diameter the right size to fit precisely into the rubber switch cap's recess and a 1/8" wadcutter to cut the centre hole to go around the moulded ring in the rubber switch cap's base (the ring intended to retain the now removed knob/nubbin). Doing it this way meant I could try various materials and thicknesses.

There seems to be different versions of the switch arrangement with different tolerances. Remember it was said early on that if you took out the little plastic knob/nubbin the light would no longer switch on (and pictures show these had a black nubbin). Maybe on the very first versions that's the case but with my version, one with a switch retainer ring, if you take out the nubbin (which in mine was a much larger white plastic step shaped piece) the switch still works fine. Yes, without the nubbin the button has to be pressed further inwards and is less "snappy" due to the press being transmitted to the bulbous metal switchpad on the board by the softer moulded-in rubber ring in the underside of the button rather than the hard face of the nubbin but it stilll works fine.

It still works fine for me but (to me) needed more resistance to presses. In looking to "tune" my switch after removing its nubbbin, I tried several things from o rings to flat rubber washers to felt to foam. I settled on a ring I made out of high density 1/16" thick black foam sheet. 

Unlike an o ring which is relatively hard and doesn't really compress, the foam compresses as the button's free play is taken up meaning the resistance increases the further you press and then the resistance peaks just as the moulded-in nubbin-less retaining ring triggers the switch pad. 

To me this setuup gives the switch a good feel and importantly gives it a decent distance of travel before actuating. I felt that using foam also does away with the possibility of a hard O ring itself pressing too hard on the outer portion of the bulbous metal switch on the board and stress fracturing it, i just wanted the centre ring of the rubber button base to do the actual pressing of the bulb with the foam to take up the slack and make for increased resistance to the press.

The reason I did this modification on the first day of having my new torch is because my switch botton was so sensitive that even brushing my finger over it would activate it, it was like the hair trigger on my target rifle. As well as being vulnerable to accidental presses in use, I found it was way too easy to actuate the switch while slipping the torch into my top shirt pocket and the thing even switched on in my top shirt pocket one time I lay face down on my bed. 

Now that it's tuned, the switch has never come on in either shirt or pants pocket and it feels much more robust and much more assured when pressed. Had I not done this I could not have used the torch regularly whether it was in my pocket or not, it was just too sensitive for anythign other than playing with at my office desk.

As I say, try tuning it with different materials you may find there is a combo that suits your switch and makes you much more confident in it.


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## euroken (Nov 18, 2019)

pappajohan said:


> My doesn't do that, earlier version of Anduril I guess? Just goes into low low.
> 
> My Emisar D4V2 however does it, love that feature.
> 
> ...



yeah, it's my understanding that double click hold low was introduced after the first initial run. 

Regardless, very useful in my opinion. On low or low low, it can stay activated for a very long time, even if activated accidentally.


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## 5S8Zh5 (Nov 19, 2019)

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> use a Zebralight for EDC instead. I've never had one of them accidentally turn on.


When I edc'd my zebralight it turned on in my pocket now and then. Especially after I squatted down - so I'd know to check.


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## WalkIntoTheLight (Nov 19, 2019)

pappajohan said:


> My doesn't do that, earlier version of Anduril I guess? Just goes into low low.
> 
> My Emisar D4V2 however does it, love that feature.
> 
> Is there any way to update the Anduril version on the Fw3a using the same system that's available for the D4V2? Haven't found any pin connections on the light(driver?)




There is a way. You'd have to check out the "other forum that can't be mentioned here" for instructions and what you need to purchase. They do sell a kit for it. It's complicated, though.

Also, be careful about upgrading the firmware, unless it's been around for awhile and known to be safe. The D4v2 Anduril firmware had a bug in muggle mode that caused it to turn on after 15 minutes and ramp up to max (with no temperature controls) and literally melt down the light. Extremely dangerous!!!

The bug was fixed in a later version of the firmware, but who knows what else might be discovered?


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## recDNA (Nov 19, 2019)

I don't know how responsive lumintop is. Any chance they will make the switch require a more firm press to avoid the needn to lock out. I love the beam profile of my FW1A XPL HI but it really needs to be a little more recessed with a firmer press to activate. If they did that in the titanium model I'd love to try the sst-20


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## Fireclaw18 (Nov 19, 2019)

*Prototypes of FW3T v2*. Originally posted on Faceboook and then BLF.

I really like how Lumintop is pulling out all the stops with different variations of the original FW3A.:twothumbs So far they have produced or have prototyped the following:
- FW3A grey aluminum
- FW3A aluminum other colors (purple, green, blue, bare).
- FW3T stonewashed Ti, polished Ti, and Ti-Cu
- FW1A - slightly longer with reflector and single-emitter. Much throwier.
- FW3A 18350 and 18500 tubes.
- EDC 18 - basically an FW3A with a different body style and a side-switch.
- FW4A - wider head with quad emitter.
- and now the FW3T v2 with a much more stylish and complex looking appearance.


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## JaguarDave-in-Oz (Nov 19, 2019)

recDNA said:


> I don't know how responsive lumintop is. Any chance they will make the switch require a more firm press to avoid the needn to lock out. I love the beam profile of my FW1A XPL HI but it really needs to be a little more recessed with a firmer press to activate. If they did that in the titanium model I'd love to try the sst-20


They clearly know how a switch CAN be designed to be relatively immune. I now also have their EDC18 and the switch on that has been designed so that it requires a good solid press with plenty of travel and from my short period of testing it there seems almost no chance of that coming on accidently.


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## JaguarDave-in-Oz (Nov 19, 2019)

My FW1A arrived this morning and apart from the much more useful (to me) tighter beam profile I noticed two things that contrast to my FW3A. The knurling is noticeably more grippy on my new FW1a, the light feels a lot more secure in my hands. The second thing is that the switch has a little more resistance and "snappiness" than my FW3A did when I got. It's still not resistant enough to allow pants carry but it is resistant enough that it doesn't come on when I accidently brush it with my fingers when putting the light in my top shirt pocket. I'll probably still do the switch pressure increase mod though.

My new FWA is also a fair bit darker shade of bluey grey than my FW3A, the darker shade is a more pleasing colour I reckon.

I'm not sure if these are production improvements or just indicative of an extreme swing of tolerances.


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## JaguarDave-in-Oz (Nov 20, 2019)

Now that I have an FW1A to go with my FW3A I have been able to make some comparisons in the switching department. 

My new FW1A (arrived today) has a much better feeling switch than my FW3A. My FW3A felt like it had a hair trigger and it was easy to switch on just by accidently brushing the metal switch button. The new FW1A did not feel like it had a hair trigger at all. The travel was longer and the click much more positive than on my FW3A when I first got it

This difference made me decide to take the tailcaps apart side by side and see if there were differences.

Both are retaining ring versions. Both have FW3A printed on the board near the spring. Both have V01 on the "hidden" side of the board.

FW3A has a white stepped shape nubbbin, FW1A has black but the same size and design.

Rubber switch caps appear identical.

The difference is in the stainless switch button. The "retaining lip" on the button (ie the lip that stops it coming out of the outside end of the tailcap) from my FW3A is much thicker than the lip on the one from my FW1A. This is the reason why my FW3A felt like it had a hair trigger. 

That lip being so thick meant that my FW3A's whole press button assembly (stainless button, rubber cap and nubbin) was sitting further towards the e-switch bulb on the board. So much further, in fact, that it was actually pressing the e-switch down part way from the moment the tailcap was assembled at the factory. This meant it only took a brush with a finger to make the button complete its journey and make the contacts in the e-switch close.

I made up a 12 thou spacer from some brass shim sheet to space the switch board further away from the button and release the pre-load from the e-switch bulb. The spacer needed to be metal so that the underneath ring of the switch board retains contact with the tailcap housing (ie the 2nd current pathway, 1 path thru the inner tube, 1 thru the light body).

Now both my FW3A and FW1A switches feel identical and my FW3A (with foam washer mod now removed and nubbin re-installed) no longer has a hair trigger.

If I hadn't got a second torch to allow me to compare I simply would have continued to think my FW3A's hair trigger was how they were supposed to be rather than it being caused by bad machining tolerances.


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## pappajohan (Nov 23, 2019)

Anybody got a suggestion on a diffuser that preferably is GITD aswell?

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## LRJ88 (Nov 23, 2019)

Fireclaw18 said:


> *Prototypes of FW3T v2*. Originally posted on Faceboook and then BLF.
> 
> I really like how Lumintop is pulling out all the stops with different variations of the original FW3A.:twothumbs So far they have produced or have prototyped the following:
> - FW3A grey aluminum
> ...



I'm hoping that's pretty far from the finished product so far, to me they look like someone mixed an FW3T with 5 other brands to get some kind of Frankenstein's flashlight, taking all the parts they thought looked good and slapped them on there without considering the whole.


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## WalkIntoTheLight (Nov 23, 2019)

LRJ88 said:


> I'm hoping that's pretty far from the finished product so far, to me they look like someone mixed an FW3T with 5 other brands to get some kind of Frankenstein's flashlight, taking all the parts they thought looked good and slapped them on there without considering the whole.



Lol. Yeah, they're going to suck the FW3A design dry, and wring as much as they can get out of it, whether it makes sense or not. I'm surprised they're not selling it as a toaster, or remote control, or mouse trap.


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## jonnyfgroove (Nov 23, 2019)

gunga said:


> My solution is from BLF. I removed the plastic nubbin from under the switch boot. This was replaced with an oring. 1/16 thickness, 3/16 ID, I believe it's #8. This increases the stiffness of the switch. Feels much better. I also added some no -oxit grease under the boot to make it a bit quieter. I put some kapton tape on the button to prevent grease from getting to the switch.



Thank you for posting this tip about the oring. I did this to mine and it has made a drastic improvement in feel and resistance. I like the light much more now!


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## JaguarDave-in-Oz (Nov 23, 2019)

As part of my little amateur "tuning" process, I tried the O ring mod and agree that it makes the feel of the button near to perfect, changed the press pressure from about 280 grams standard to over 900 grams but with a lovely solid clear click.

Only problem was that on one light I tried it on it allowed for occasional false presses if the button wasn't hit somewhere close to the centre. If I went around the outer part of the button like a clock, tesing at each five minute point there was always at least one spot where a press went click but didn't register with the light. I think it has to do with the fact that the O ring actuates the switch dome by pressing its outer circumference rather than the centre as it would when actuated by the nubbin and some parts of that outer circumference of the dome don't always make proper contact.

The second ligth I tried it on did not have that problem. Varying tolerances at work again no doubt.


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## LetThereBeLight! (Nov 23, 2019)

Fireclaw18 said:


> *Prototypes of FW3T v2*. Originally posted on Faceboook and then BLF.
> 
> I really like how Lumintop is pulling out all the stops with different variations of the original FW3A.:twothumbs So far they have produced or have prototyped the following:
> - FW3A grey aluminum
> ...



Why did they leave out the one in hot pink?  = j/k


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## xevious (Nov 24, 2019)

jonnyfgroove said:


> Thank you for posting this tip about the oring. I did this to mine and it has made a drastic improvement in feel and resistance. I like the light much more now!


I followed the same solution. I tried the 3/16 o-ring and found it a bit too firm. So I went one step lower. 5/32. That worked out great for me. It's firm, but not overly so, and still won't accidentally activate.


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## xevious (Nov 24, 2019)

Fireclaw18 said:


> *Prototypes of FW3T v2*. Originally posted on Faceboook and then BLF.


Wow! I love it. Looks super rugged. Dig the clip. Trit slots. I'm definitely going to get one of these, if the price is not too outrageous.


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## 5S8Zh5 (Nov 24, 2019)

I'd like to see an aux led array. Have been using the four click lock out and the momentary press moonlight mode is fantastic. < This is where the button shines for me.


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## Fireclaw18 (Nov 24, 2019)

5S8Zh5 said:


> I'd like to see an aux led array. Have been using the four click lock out and the momentary press moonlight mode is fantastic. < This is where the button shines for me.




Lexel sells aux LED boards compatible with the FW3A. You'll need some modding experience in order to install them though.


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## 5S8Zh5 (Nov 24, 2019)

wrong thread.


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## pappajohan (Nov 25, 2019)

I wonder....

Does the Switch on the newer versions, the lights that came after the first run that is, have the same feather light activation as the first runs does?

Considering getting a second FW3a in blue, but still considering the FW1a just to stir things up a bit....

The Switch situation may tip the scale one way or the other....

Skickat från min SM-N975F via Tapatalk


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## Fireclaw18 (Nov 25, 2019)

pappajohan said:


> I wonder....
> 
> Does the Switch on the newer versions, the lights that came after the first run that is, have the same feather light activation as the first runs does?
> 
> ...




Actually I've noticed quite the opposite.

My first two FW3A were first-run lights. They came with a fairly stiff switch with a very satisfying click.

However, all my subsequent FW3 lights came with much softer-touch switches that had less click and required much less pressure.

Note that the switch in the FW3A is dead simple. It's literally just 3 pieces: the tailcap board, a piece of bent springsteel, and a piece of Kapton tape holding them together. I wonder if I can improve the click by removing the springsteel and bending it a bit more. I might give it a shot on one switch module.


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## xevious (Dec 12, 2019)

A great advantage of the FW3A is the wide availability of options to customize your light as you see fit. Few flashlights of this caliber make such an offering.

First, it's great having the Carclo optics, as many different types are available, as I posted about earlier (LINK). Second, with more variety in materials, it's now possible to mix-n-match. I bought a stainless steel bezel and I find it a good visual improvement. There's so many different GITD insert colors. I started with green, which works well. But I decided to try out aqua. Nice coloration. I knew it wouldn't have quite as bright and long a radiance, but it feels rather noticeable.






I apologize for not color balancing this... as it's more blue in person than representative in the photo.

I also wanted a diffuser. There is a 3D printed one available that's decent, but I wanted one a bit more solid. Found one from Nitecore that works perfectly.


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## jkid1911 (Dec 12, 2019)

Thanks for posting all this ^^^^^ great information!!


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## 5S8Zh5 (Dec 13, 2019)

xevious said:


> I also wanted a diffuser. There is a 3D printed one available that's decent, but I wanted one a bit more solid. Found one from Nitecore that works perfectly.



Awesome. Is this the one? link


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## xevious (Dec 13, 2019)

jkid1911 said:


> Thanks for posting all this ^^^^^ great information!!


You're welcome!



5S8Zh5 said:


> Awesome. Is this the one? link


Yes, and it's cheaper on Battery Junction (got mine for $3.95).


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## 5S8Zh5 (Dec 13, 2019)

xevious said:


> Yes, and it's cheaper on Battery Junction (got mine for $3.95).


Found it - thanks! Nitecore 25.4mm Filters


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## Tachead (Dec 16, 2019)

Where is the best place to buy the newest version of these guys? Also, how does this compare to the new Emisar D4v2? 

Sent from my SM-N975W using Tapatalk


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## 5S8Zh5 (Dec 17, 2019)

Tachead said:


> Where is the best place to buy the newest version of these guys? Also, how does this compare to the new Emisar D4v2?


I got my from Illumination Supply. I like how they link to the recommended (high drain) 18650 batteries. Just received my D4V2 and like the tri LED FW3A, the quad LED makes for a perfect walking beam to light your path. The Anduril FW is the same for both, so that makes it easy to have both. You can get a magnet for the D4V2 tailcap, but I don't like magnets since I wear a high end watch now and then and those two don't work well together lol. But it comes in handy for many people. The aux light displays on the D4V2 is quite the site - just in time for Christmas.


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## Tachead (Dec 17, 2019)

Thanks for the reply[emoji106]. 

Sent from my SM-N975W using Tapatalk


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## Fireclaw18 (Dec 17, 2019)

*D4V2 compared with FW3A*:

*Size *- both lights are very similar in size. The FW3A is slightly smaller, and lighter, but not enough to make a very noticeable difference. The FW3A weighs about 100g with a Sony VTC6 battery installed, compared with 115g for the D4V2.

*Ergonomics *- the FW3A uses a rear electronic switch and is meant to be used with a cigar grip (fish the light out of your pocket with index and middle fingers then use thumb to press button). The D4V2 uses an electronic side switch and has grippy square knurling. The FW3A intentionally has no knurling on the center part of the battery tube so that when fishing the light out of your pocket your fingers will slide up the tube until they hit the tailcap.
*
Output *- the D4V2 is a quad emitter light, while the FW3A is a triple emitter light. The D4V2 is also a bit more heavily built with heatsink fins and low resistance springs. This means the D4V2 is brighter (max output 4300 lumens compared to around 2800 for the FW3A). Both lights can use standard Carclo optics. This gives the FW3A more options since there seem to be more 20mm triple optic choices than there are 24mm quad optics.*

Emitters *- both lights are available in various different emitters. If you like neutral tint with max output, the D4V2 is better since their XPL HI 4000K has excellent tint and output. However, if you like high-CRI, the FW3A has noticeably better tint bins for the SST20 4000K 95CRI emitters than what Emisar is using. Lumintop's Nichia 219C high-CRI also has a very nice tint.
*
Options* - both lights are available for sale in a variety of materials and colors and have many optional accessories available:
FW3A - 18350 tube, 18500 tube; colors: blue, olive, purple, bare, grey; materials: aluminum, copper, Ti-Cu, titanium; Glow gaskets for the optic; different clip options.
D4V2 - 18350 tube, 18500 tube; colors: grey, black, gold; materials: aluminum, Ti-Cu, brass; Optional tailcap magnet; switch retaining ring: flush or raised (greatly reduces accidental activation in pocket).

*Firmware *- both lights use Toykeeper's excellent Anduril firmware. However, the D4v2 tends to ship with a more recent version. The D4v2 also has the advantage that it can be reflashed to the very latest version of the firmware via a flashing kit available from International Outdoors. And because the driver has pogo-pin contact pads on the backside it can be reflashed without disassembling the head. In contrast, reflashing the FW3A requires desoldering and removing the driver then using an SOIC clip to attach the flasher to the MCU.

*Driver channels*: FW3A has 3-channel driver: 1+8+FET, while the D4V2 has a 2-channel driver 1+FET. This means the FW3A stays in regulation until 2.8 amps before going direct drive with the FET, while the D4V2 only regulates up to 350 millamps. This means the FW3A's driver is slightly more efficient at intermediate modes up to 2.8 amps.
*
Microprocessor*: ATiny85 microprocessor on the FW3A, while the D4V2 has a more powerful ATiny 1634 with twice the memory. This doesn't matter much out of the box, but the D4V2 has more memory for possible future firmware upgrades.

*Aux Bezel LEDS*: The D4v2 has very pretty colored bezel LEDs. You can change the colors and brightness all via firmware, and can even have them work as a battery indicator. The Ti-Cu and Brass D4v2 also have a white switch boot with LEDs under the boot in addition to the bezel LEDs. These aux LEDs look really cool and give the light an extremely futuristic look. The FW3A does not come with any aux LEDs. You can order an aux LED board for the FW3A from Lexel, but you'll have to install it yourself and even then it won't be able to change colors like the D4v2's aux LEDs.

*Accidental pocket activation*: The FW3A has a large metal tailcap switch that is quite easy to accidentally depress. This can be fixed with a simple mod to the interior of the switch and/or by gluing a washer around the button. The D4V2 is available with a raised switch boot retaining ring that makes it very unlikely the light will activate accidentally in the pocket. The latest models of D4v2 also come with more recent firmware that includes more protection against accidental activation than the firmware version in the FW3A.

*Quality Control*: The FW3A has an inner contact tube that sits inside the outer battery tube. This is what lets the light have an electronic switch in the tailcap. However, it is a bit finicky and users have reported many more issues with the FW3A than with the D4v2's more conventional design.

*My opinion*: I like both lights. But as a personal preference, I think I prefer grippy sideswitch lights to the slippery cigar grip. I prefer the D4v2 over the FW3A.


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## Tachead (Dec 20, 2019)

Holy crap Fireclaw, that was an awesome post. Thanks for taking the time sir[emoji106]. 

Sent from my SM-N975W using Tapatalk


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## WalkIntoTheLight (Dec 21, 2019)

Yes, great comparison.


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## Coinmn (Jan 16, 2020)

I just got my FW3A from NealsGadgets and put in a fully charged 18650 and the light flashed when I first put the battery in and then nothing. I unscrewed the top of the light (the part with the LED) and inserted the battery polarity correctly, and as soon as the screw on LED head touches the battery it has a brief flash, then continued screwing on the top and nothing. Tried different fully charged batteries and nothing. But every time I insert a new battery it seems to ground out and flash and then nothing until I remove the battery and re-insert the battery. Have sent NealsGadgets 4 emails and had no response at all. The instructions say to unscrew the cap and not unscrew the bottom. I think there must be a short, but don't want to screw with a warranty issue or disregarding instructions. It should work out of the box. NO RESPONSE FROM NEALSGADGETS at all, so filing a complaint with PAYPAL and see how that goes. BUT, in the meantime is there a simple fix or does someone have a suggestion to try to get this to work. I think it's shorting out somewhere, just don't know where.
thanks


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## Fireclaw18 (Jan 16, 2020)

The brief flash you're getting when you screw on the head indicates the battery is connected and the driver is powered. It does not sound like you're getting a short. 

If you had a short, you'd get one of the following: (1) battery short: the light would get really hot and then explode or melt the springs; or (2) driver short: the light would turn on at max power the second the head was partially screwed in and the button would do nothing; or (3) switch short: the light would ramp up to max and stay there while not responding to the button.

Fortunately, none of those are happening in your light. In your light, nothing is happening when you press the button.  The problem in your light is the switch and/or the switch path to the driver. This is a fairly common problem with these lights and is usually fixable. Try this:

1. Unscrew and remove the head of the light (the head is the front of the light with the LEDs and driver).
2. Remove the battery.
3. Unscrew and remove the tailcap from the body tube.
4. The body tube consists of an outer tube and a black inner tube. The inner tube is what transmits the electrical connection from the switch at the back of the light to the driver at the front of the light. Check the bare (unanodized) edges of the tube and make sure they are clean.
5. Check the contact rings that the tube sits on on the driver and at the tailcap to make sure they are clear of debris.
6. Screw the tailcap onto the body tube. Screw it down as hard as you can since you need firm contact.
7. Insert the battery.
8. Screw on the head of the light.
9. If it still does not work try screwing on the head and tailcap harder.
10. If that doesn't fix it, the problem could be inside the tailcap. Still fixable, but harder. The switch in the FW3A is dead simple. It's literally just a piece of spring-steel sitting on the tailcap pcb with some Kapton tape holding it in place. Since it is so simple, it is highly unlikely that the switch itself is broken. However, sometimes the tailcap pcb fails to make a good connection with the bottom of the tailcap.


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## WalkIntoTheLight (Jan 16, 2020)

The FW3A can be a frustrating light. Manufacturing tolerances are far too tight to allow it to be cheaply produced. As a result, there are a lot of problems with this light. IMO, no newbie should purchase this light. Unless your post count is higher than 100, stay away from the FW3A.

If you know how to fix the many issues with this light, then it can be a very fun toy. I have one, and enjoy it when I use it, but I would never depend on it where I really needed a light.


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## JaguarDave-in-Oz (Jan 16, 2020)

As mentioned above, this problem is usually caused by the battery tube not making proper contact somewhere. That's the good thing about the flash, it tells you that things are ok with the outer body connections.

The first time my FW3A had this problem was because the little clear O ring was bulged out and jammed between clip and tailcap preventing the tailcap from going completely home. I loosened the tailcap, poked the O ring back in, re-screwed the tail down tight and it was fixed. It's always good to loosen the head a little before tightening the tailcap just to give the inner tube room to move and seat properly. 

The second time I had this problem was with the optional shorty 18350 tube. In that case the shorty inner tube was machined too short and the head needs to be overtightened just to get contact with the end of the tube.


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## LedTed (Jan 19, 2020)

Fireclaw18 said:


> Actually I've noticed quite the opposite.
> 
> My first two FW3A were first-run lights. They came with a fairly stiff switch with a very satisfying click.
> 
> ...



I have now had to fix every FWXX flashlight I have; from first production run aluminum to very end of last year’s titanium.

While performing several different repairs, I noticed that I have three different switch pad nubs.

On two of my FW3As - I removed the nubs and, in place, used o-rings. Though I’m sure this will shorten the useable life of the membrane switches, the consistency of switch actuations and (so far) elimination of accidental switch activations is worth the early end of switch life.


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## idleprocess (Jan 19, 2020)

LedTed said:


> I have now had to fix every FWXX flashlight I have; from first production run aluminum to very end of last year’s titanium.
> 
> While performing several different repairs, I noticed that I have three different switch pad nubs.
> 
> On two of my FW3As - I removed the nubs and, in place, used o-rings. Though I’m sure this will shorten the useable life of the membrane switches, the consistency of switch actuations and (so far) elimination of accidental switch activations is worth the early end of switch life.



I am on the verge of needing to repair my newer unit - suspect I'm going to want a spanner tool to try to remove the switch since that retainer has not yet obliged my efforts to remove it.


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## LedTed (Jan 19, 2020)

idleprocess said:


> I am on the verge of needing to repair my newer unit - suspect I'm going to want a spanner tool to try to remove the switch since that retainer has not yet obliged my efforts to remove it.



Yes, a spanner for camera lenses works a lot better than a tweezers. Choose a spanner that has thin straight tips.


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## 5S8Zh5 (Jan 20, 2020)

My two have been reliable for EDC, and I do EDC and use it on every morning walk. Any problems whatsoever and there's a Quark QK16L w/AA tube and a 14500 just itching to EDC.


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## Duster1671 (Jan 20, 2020)

Coinmn said:


> I just got my FW3A from NealsGadgets and put in a fully charged 18650 and the light flashed when I first put the battery in and then nothing. I unscrewed the top of the light (the part with the LED) and inserted the battery polarity correctly, and as soon as the screw on LED head touches the battery it has a brief flash, then continued screwing on the top and nothing. Tried different fully charged batteries and nothing. But every time I insert a new battery it seems to ground out and flash and then nothing until I remove the battery and re-insert the battery.



I had an FW1A with the same behavior out of the box. The issue ended up being a poorly assembled tailcap. The retaining ring was not tightened at all. I took the tailcap apart and reassembled, tightening the retaining ring. The light works correctly now.


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## 5S8Zh5 (Jan 24, 2020)

Sweetest momentary moonlight. FW3A in 4 click lockout with Nitecore 25.4mm filter.


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## jkid1911 (Jan 26, 2020)

I had a copper FW3A already and the fit between the head and body is perfect. I recently received one in aluminum and find that there is a small gap between the head and body when fully tightened. I can't imagine it matters being that there is an o-ring seal, but just wondering if this is the norm with aluminum compared to copper or maybe just a quality control issue.


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## WalkIntoTheLight (Jan 27, 2020)

jkid1911 said:


> I had a copper FW3A already and the fit between the head and body is perfect. I recently received one in aluminum and find that there is a small gap between the head and body when fully tightened. I can't imagine it matters being that there is an o-ring seal, but just wondering if this is the norm with aluminum compared to copper or maybe just a quality control issue.



I don't see any gap on mine. As long as yours works, I wouldn't worry about it. The QC on these lights isn't very good. If you get one working without any problems, keep it!


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## id30209 (Jan 27, 2020)

Guys, there's a GB for FW3B, FW1T, Cu/Ti 18350 tubes on M4D site. 100pcs is a goal so spread the word

https://m4dm4x.com/fw1a-titanium-fw...6s_jdP5qVfWwpzVLzevhOhYkCU_CUit3uSlAVXPi61fuo


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## Duster1671 (Jan 27, 2020)

jkid1911 said:


> I had a copper FW3A already and the fit between the head and body is perfect. I recently received one in aluminum and find that there is a small gap between the head and body when fully tightened. I can't imagine it matters being that there is an o-ring seal, but just wondering if this is the norm with aluminum compared to copper or maybe just a quality control issue.


When you tighten the head, the driver board needs to seat on the inner switch tube before the head seats on the body, otherwise the switch will not work. As you can imagine, there is a stack up of several tolerances that need to be met for this fit to come out correctly. It's not just the length of the tube, but the distance from the tube stop to the shoulder and the distance from the driver board to the end of the threads on the head, which itself depends on the depth of the head and the thickness of the driver board.

A fit like this, that depends on the tolerance of several components, can be made reliably. But sometimes there needs to be more clearance than you'd like in some spot so that every component can have enough tolerance to be manufacturable.

It's possible Lumintop increased the nominal gap between the head and the shoulder on the body a small amount to add a little more tolerance in this critical stack-up. The large number of issues related to the head/tailcap/inner tube fit does suggest that the original design wasn't especially easy to make with an acceptably low number of defects.


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## JaguarDave-in-Oz (Jan 27, 2020)

Duster1671 said:


> When you tighten the head, the driver board needs to seat on the inner switch tube before the head seats on the body, otherwise the switch will not work.


Precisely right and this is why I had troubles with my shorty 18350 tube for my FW3A. There was no "gap" and the head needed to be screwed down extremely tightly to make that inner tube only just make contact with the driver. Multiple screwing and uscrewing to change batteries making a tiny bit of wear or depression from that innner tube touching the driver board's copper ring and I'd say all contact would eventually be lost on mine. 

Think yoursef lucky you have a gap, that means the inner tube is sticking out far enough that you'll never run the risk of losing switch contact there. It's when there's no gap that there's a potential looming problem.


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## id30209 (Jan 29, 2020)

Well folks chinese government prolongued the holidays due to virus and drunk people so GB has more time before closing.
100 is minimum to manufacture


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## mikekoz (Feb 10, 2020)

xevious said:


> A great advantage of the FW3A is the wide availability of options to customize your light as you see fit. Few flashlights of this caliber make such an offering.
> 
> First, it's great having the Carclo optics, as many different types are available, as I posted about earlier (LINK). Second, with more variety in materials, it's now possible to mix-n-match. I bought a stainless steel bezel and I find it a good visual improvement. There's so many different GITD insert colors. I started with green, which works well. But I decided to try out aqua. Nice coloration. I knew it wouldn't have quite as bright and long a radiance, but it feels rather noticeable.
> 
> ...


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## WalkIntoTheLight (Feb 10, 2020)

id30209 said:


> Well folks chinese government prolongued the holidays due to virus and drunk people so GB has more time before closing.
> 100 is minimum to manufacture



I know I'm being paranoid, but every package I got from China lately I handled with gloves, and threw it into a closet to be opened in a few weeks. Any virus in or on the package should be dead by then.

Luckily, mail from China has been awful lately, so I've only had to do that a couple of times.

And, yes, again, I know I'm being paranoid.


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## mikekoz (Feb 18, 2020)

I have a love\hate relationship with this light! When I first got it, I loved the look and feel of it, but it worked really screwy and I almost returned it to Amazon. However, after reading a lot about the light and learning how to fix its unstable personality, it now works as it should!  I like the user interface and just got used to it after I became more familiar with it. Since then, I have also purchased a FW1A Pro, an EDC18, and an Emisar D4V2! The FW1A Pro is a single emitter light with an increased max lumens on turbo to 3500! I thought it would have a lot more throw, but this is not the case. The EDC18 seems to be a better made light. It has a bit more aluminum on it, a bit of a heat sink on the head, and a side switch that will more than likely not activate on its own. The Emisar is similar to the EDC18, but it gives a max lumen output of 4400 on turbo! I like side switches, but am not sure if I like them better than the tail one. A simple mod with a small rubber o-ring resolves the problem with the FW3A turning on by itself and also gives the switch a better feel. There is also a 21700 version of the Lumintop light that I am looking at that probably gives a little better run time in a slightly larger body!


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## orbital (Mar 14, 2020)

+

If anyone's interested, FW4A is up on Neals for order


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## 5S8Zh5 (Mar 16, 2020)

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> I know I'm being paranoid, but every package I got from China lately I handled with gloves, and threw it into a closet to be opened in a few weeks. Any virus in or on the package should be dead by then.



Dr. Peter Attia #97 – Peter Hotez, M.D., Ph.D.: COVID-19: transmissibility, vaccines, risk reduction, and treatment 3-14-20

Recent paper reported fomite survival on different surfaces:

aerosols, up to 3 hours post aerosolization

up to 4 hours on copper

up to 24 hours on cardboard

up to 2-3 days on plastic and stainless steel (13hr median half-life on steel; 16hr median half-life on plastic)


def: fomites: objects or materials which are likely to carry infection, such as clothes, utensils, and furniture.


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## justanotherguy (Mar 16, 2020)

orbital said:


> +
> 
> If anyone's interested, FW4A is up on Neals for order




what kind of numbers does it put out?


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## boo5ted (Mar 16, 2020)

justanotherguy said:


> what kind of numbers does it put out?





~3600 lm (XP-L Hi), ~2100 lm (Nichia,SST20 4000K)

https://www.nealsgadgets.com/collections/blf/products/tlf-blf-fw4a-edc-flashlight#


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