# P&G G90 vs Wolf-eye 9v bulb?



## Joseph (Mar 29, 2006)

Hi!

I wonder if I'm asking questions already answered, but I hope someone will genorously answer my questions

I'm planning to run 9v bulb with two rcr123s in my C2 and what I found is
these two.

Which will be better to run in 2 rcr123 setup? Any difference in brightness
or runtime?

Thank you!


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## rikvee (Mar 29, 2006)

we-ve just had a bit of confusion over different varieties of G90's, and guess what, Wolf Eyes are just now changing their specs.
Our trusted Paul in Maryland will no doubt shed some light soon....


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## Paul_in_Maryland (Mar 29, 2006)

rikvee, 
I assume you mean that Wolf Eyes is phasing out its old stock of yellowish flood lamps and replacing them with the brighter, whiter, tighter 2006 lamps. The new 9V lamp--which, tragically, uses the same "9V D26" designation (won't they ever learn?)--is available only from Pacific Tactical Solutions. It will not work on two rechargeable 123A cells.

I'm not prepared to say that any G&P-made 9V lamp will work on two protected rechargeables, though someone has posted--more than once--that he does just that, using the lamp and cells from CPF dealer Lighthound. The VHP Digilight 9V lamp (the cadillac of G&P-made 9V lamps) "should" also work with two R123A cells. The problem is that CPFers have sometimes received the less efficient Digilight, at least when ordering from Dilight dealer BlackRifles.

If you "must" use the 2x123A body, I suggest using a 3.7V Wolf Eyes D26 lamp (with a Surefire adapter spring) and one 168B, 168S, or new AW 17500 cell. It will throw nearly as far as the 9V, but with less runtime and a narrower beam.


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## pbs357 (Mar 29, 2006)

Not to step on any toes, but the 9v D26 from Pacific Tactical Solutions WILL work with unprotected rcr123's. I use 800mah unprotected cells from Lighthound.com, and it lights every time on first click. It yields a "wall of light" effect, very bright, very good throw for a 2 cell light. Hope this helps.


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## Heck (Mar 29, 2006)

Hey Paul, don't you mean the 17670 instead of the 17500?

Anyway, so are the new AW's 17670 confirmed to light up the new 3.7V D26 Wolf Eyes bulb?

I e-mailed wolf eyes here in Canada and they say the bulb draws 2A's....ain't that alot, especially for the AW cells?


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## Paul_in_Maryland (Mar 29, 2006)

Heck said:


> Hey Paul, don't you mean the 17670 instead of the 17500?


You're right--my bad.



> Anyway, so are the new AW's 17670 confirmed to light up the new 3.7V D26 Wolf Eyes bulb?


Not by direct testing; I'm going by the new 1.9C rating; 1.9x1.6A should have plenty of reserve to start a 2A lamp.



> I e-mailed wolf eyes here in Canada and they say the bulb draws 2A's....ain't that alot, especially for the AW cells?


The old Wolf Eyes/Pila drew about 2.2A. The G&P G5R draws 1.8A. I'm not sure how much the Strion lamp draws. There's no way around high amps if you want to pump 6 to 8 watts into a 3.7V lamp.


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## CoffeeAchiever (Mar 29, 2006)

Paul_in_Maryland said:


> I'm not prepared to say that any G&P-made 9V lamp will work on two protected rechargeables, though someone has posted--more than once--that he does just that, using the lamp and cells from CPF dealer Lighthound. The VHP Digilight 9V lamp (the cadillac of G&P-made 9V lamps) "should" also work with two R123A cells. The problem is that CPFers have sometimes received the less efficient Digilight, at least when ordering from Dilight dealer BlackRifles.



That someone that our good friend Paul is referring to is me. I have indeed posted numerous times that the DRB-9VHP 9V lamp assembly that I bought directly from DigiLight USA lights with only one click when driven by two protected RCR123A 3.7V 750mAh rechargeable Li-ion batteries that I bought from LightHound. 

Based on the reports of other CPF hotwires including Paul, I have come to suspect that my personal experience with the DRB-9VHP lamp assembly may be a fluke. It could be that my RCR123A batteries' protection circuits have an abnormally high current cutoff threshold or that my particular DRB-9VHP lamp draws a little less current that others of its kind. Either way, I have no test equipment with which to test this theory. 

I promised another CPF member that I would take a picture of my DigiLight DRB-9VHP lamp assembly and send it to him. I'm making arrangements to borrow a digital camera over this coming weekend. I'll be on a camping trip that I've had scheduled for almost two months now. Even if I can't get my hands on a digital camera I'll still take some pictures of my DigiLight lamp and LightHound batteries and post them to CPF. I have an older Olympus 35mm point-and-shoot camera and I can always request a Kodak photo CD when I get my camping pictures developed. 

In the mean time, I'm going change my entry for the DigiLight DRB-9VHP lamp on The Rechargeable Battery Compatibility Chart and list this lamp as requiring a double-click to light when driven by two protected RCR123A Li-ion rechargeable batteries.


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## Joseph (Mar 31, 2006)

Thanks for replies, but I'm kind of getting confused. 

Yes Paul, I want it to be 2*123 size and I'm planning to run the bulb with two unprotected cells.(which I found not that dangerous)

What I have leared so far is that the new Wolf-Eye 9v bulb is not as bright as P91, and it won't work with protected 2rcr123s. But I hope it works on two "unprotected" rcr123s. Does it?

Another bulb that I found is digilight 9v bulb kindly explained by coffeeacheiver(thanks) which is very good for 2 rcr123s.

Here are my new questions.

How brighter is Digilight bulb compared side by side with wolf-eye 9v?
Is there any other brighter bulbs for surefire C2 with 2rcr123s setup?

Sorry if these are all answered but I really don't have enough time to do a search..  Thank you very much!

(Edited after a little more learning)


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## pbs357 (Mar 31, 2006)

:huh2: 

Not sure if you saw my post #4, but the 9v D26 lamp I bought from Pacific Tactical Solutions DOES WORK on unprotected 123's. Just tell them you want the new D26 9v lamp. I have not seen any other posts saying that it won't work in this setup, so I feel comfortable recommending it. I don't have any personal experience with HPG90's so I can't comment there.


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## Heck (Mar 31, 2006)

Joseph, I just wanted to say that yes if used correctly unprotected cells aren't that bad, but don't put your guard down. A simple mistake, a simple over discharge or what not can cause a lot of bad stuff. Also, some bad things can happen to unprotected cells over time and may not be immediate, so depending on application, it could be a tickin' time bomb. Either way, just wanted you to becareful.


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## Paul_in_Maryland (Mar 31, 2006)

Joseph said:


> Thanks for replies, but I'm kind of getting confused.
> 
> Yes Paul, I want it to be 2*123 size and I'm planning to run the bulb with two RC123 unprotected cells.(which I found not that dangerous)


Every 9V lamp assembly should work with three unprotected 123A cells.



> How brighter is Digilight bulb compared side by side with wolf-eye 9v?
> Is there any other brighter bulbs for surefire C2 with 2rcr123s setup?


Have you seen the 9V beamshot thread? That's your best source for answers. The best samples of the Digilight can outthrow the Wolf Eyes D26, but as we're all coming to learn, the entire Digilight/G&P lamp-buying experience has become one big crap shoot. The D26 throws nearly as well while providing more total light. The wider D36 will give you the best of both worlds (throw and total light), but you'd need to use a Wolf Eyes 6MX body/head/42mm bezel.


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## LumenHound (Mar 31, 2006)

CoffeeAchiever said:


> Based on the reports of other CPF hotwires including Paul, I have come to suspect that my personal experience with the DRB-9VHP lamp assembly may be a fluke. It could be that my RCR123A batteries' protection circuits have an abnormally high current cutoff threshold or that my particular DRB-9VHP lamp draws a little less current that others of its kind. Either way, I have no test equipment with which to test this theory.


It's not a fluke. My DRB-9VHP is the same as yours. Works fine on protected cells. The current draw on my lamp on different batteries is as follows:


protected rechargeable 123A.......855 mA
unprotected rechargeable 123A....840 mA
unprotected 18650's...................850 mA
3 fresh Battery Station primarys...820 mA

I used 4 different multimeters to check these numbers and they always come up the same.

My DRB-9VHP is labeled DigiLight-9V-H.P.BULB and matches the label shown on the DigiLight DRB-9VHP web page.


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## Joseph (Mar 31, 2006)

Heck said:


> Joseph, I just wanted to say that yes if used correctly unprotected cells aren't that bad, but don't put your guard down. A simple mistake, a simple over discharge or what not can cause a lot of bad stuff. Also, some bad things can happen to unprotected cells over time and may not be immediate, so depending on application, it could be a tickin' time bomb. Either way, just wanted you to becareful.



Hi heck! 

I really appreciate your notice. Thank you very much!
Yes I will be very careful using those cells. I won't take my eyes off while
charging and won't let it turned on until it dies. I'll always keep my guard up!

Thank you again!


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## Joseph (Mar 31, 2006)

Paul_in_Maryland said:


> Every 9V lamp assembly should work with three unprotected 123A cells.
> 
> Have you seen the 9V beamshot thread? That's your best source for answers. The best samples of the Digilight can outthrow the Wolf Eyes D26, but as we're all coming to learn, the entire Digilight/G&P lamp-buying experience has become one big crap shoot. The D26 throws nearly as well while providing more total light. The wider D36 will give you the best of both worlds (throw and total light), but you'd need to use a Wolf Eyes 6MX body/head/42mm bezel.



Hi Paul!
Wow! what a thread! My curiousities are all settled now. I'd better go
for the wolf-eye 9v. Thank you very much!


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## rikvee (Apr 1, 2006)

Paul_in_Maryland said:


> Every 9V lamp assembly should work with three unprotected 123A cells.



shouldn't that be *two* unprotected R123, _or_ 3 standard 123A cells?


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## mdocod (Apr 1, 2006)

(he meant to say 2(TWO) unprotected li-ion cells.)

running a P91 from 2 unprotected rcr123s, would work, but would be dangerous. Think of it like a 30-50% overdrive for the cells. The rest of the 9V lamps available, are less amp-hungary, and would be less dangerous.

personally, I wouldn't even run a P91 on 2 17500s, but I am going to run it on 2 17670s.


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## pbs357 (Apr 1, 2006)

mdocod said:


> (he meant to say 2(TWO) unprotected li-ion cells.)
> 
> running a P91 from 2 unprotected rcr123s, would work, but would be dangerous. Think of it like a 30-50% overdrive for the cells. The rest of the 9V lamps available, are less amp-hungary, and would be less dangerous.
> 
> personally, I wouldn't even run a P91 on 2 17500s, but I am going to run it on 2 17670s.


 
Hi Mdocod, when you say dangerous, what types of things could happen? I'm running 2xrcr123 unprotected cells now behind a D26 9v. I'm not waving around an hand grenade every time I light up am I?
:candle: :duck:


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## Paul_in_Maryland (Apr 1, 2006)

mdocod said:


> (he meant to say 2(TWO) unprotected li-ion cells.)


Bingo.


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## rikvee (Apr 1, 2006)

while we're on this 'how dangerous' subject, 

- if my little R132's say 800mA on them, 

- and Li-Ions are safe to discharge up to twice their capacity,

- does that mean that 3 of them in series should still have no more than 1.6A (2x .8A) running through them?

in other words, is my Z3 with 3 unprotected R123's and a G&P 12V G120 also breaking the rules?

AND, can you _tell_, by diminishing brightness(?), that there is a dangerous situation developing, as in one battery being heated up by the other ones???


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## SilverFox (Apr 1, 2006)

Hello Rikvee,

You are correct. Your 800 mAh cells are designed to be used in applications that draw 1600 mA or less.

You will notice gradual dimming if all cells are balanced and working together. If one cell is weaker, it has the possibility of getting into trouble near the end of the run. In this case, the light would rapidly dim down and the cell would heat up. If it gets hot enough, it can present problems.

Tom


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## rikvee (Apr 1, 2006)

Hi Tom :wave: , thank you

so as long as there is no dimming, there should be no danger....., even when the cells are pushed beyond 2C ?


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## rikvee (Apr 6, 2006)

?


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## mdocod (Apr 6, 2006)

> Hi Mdocod, when you say dangerous, what types of things could happen? I'm running 2xrcr123 unprotected cells now behind a D26 9v. I'm not waving around an hand grenade every time I light up am I?



The D26, from my understanding, is a relativally low current light, probably well within the safe limits of RCR123s.

The P91 on the other hand- which I just recieved, is pulling 2.7+ amps from a pair of 17670 li-ions (1600mah, 3.2A max safe drain rate). Pulling 2.7A from a 800mah cell, would be bad unless it was a cell spacifically designed for high drain rate applications (I am unaware of any RCR123s on the market with this design emphesis). Would be the equivalent of "3.4C" instead of the "2C" max drain rate. (2.7A instead of 1.6A). I would expect that it would destroy the cells quickly, and in theory, might cause some sort of violent reaction on a long runtime...

But, fear not if using a lower current lamp.


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## rikvee (Apr 6, 2006)

Thank you mdocod!
There is a need for a simple list with current drawn by different globes, check this thread


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