# Zebralight H60



## EuphoricGrIn

It seems the H60 just made it's first appearance on the zebralight website - it's listed as "out of stock", but there is a photo, and a price... $79(!) - which is really steep, especially if all we're looking at is an somewhat larger version of the H30, with the same emitter and a "tweaked" driver. Do the increase in size and somewhat more complex heat dissipation measures really justify a 60%+ price premium?

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BTW, I have an H30 and love it.


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## SureAddicted

Looks like it's powered by an [FONT=Verdana, Arial]18650, interesting.
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## brjones

It has arrived! Sweet! Nice looking, very interesting and sophisticated-looking. Button looks flush/recessed this time, unlike the H30 which has a protruding button, which is nice when on your head, but helped put me off as I had wanted to use the H30 as a large keychain light (you can still partially unscrew it, I hear, but then it's a twisty-clicky). I find it a little ironic that the button types aren't reversed for those models.

Here are the close-ups. Only 1 photo of the H60 on the website yet but it is a good one:

H60 closeup
http://www.zebralight.com/includes/templates/zebra/images/H60_1_large.jpg

H30 closeup
http://www.zebralight.com/includes/templates/zebra/images/H30_1_large.jpg


I don't want to beat a dead horse, but what I said above about the buttons just further proves to me that there should be a CR123A tube upgrade option for the H60. With the flush button, it would make more sense for keychain/pocket carry. It would be like getting an H30 and H60 in one. I wonder if the H60 head can even work on the H30 body, even if you bought both? Maybe Zebralight hopes people buy both models, but despite a few enthusiasts willing to do so, the masses have a hard time dropping $30+ on any flashlight so to have that upgrade option adds value by adding versatility. 

The electronics (current draw) of the H60 might be prohibitive, though, using that type of battery. But my recollection is that Zebralight scales down the current draw due to the size of their lights. It'll be interesting to see current draw differences H60 vs H30 if someone tests it. I don't know about the H60, but I know that many other manufacturers (as seen on DealExtreme) commonly include both 123A and 18650 tubes.

I can see ribbing on the body of the H60 which must be some of the "unique" heat management strategies George was talking about. In which case, it appears they're right. We've all seen some ribbing before as heat vanes, especially with the newer crop of 18650 lights, but I've never seen them down the length of the light. I suppose it wouldn't hurt grip either, at the same time. With the vanes, the body of the H60 appears slightly thicker than the H30. I imagine that without the vanes, the body would only be 1mm larger than the H30, which is the difference in diameter of the batteries. 

With the lessons Zebralight has learned with the H50 and H30 up to this point, obviously being cumulative and applied to the H60, it begs the possibility of an H30 redesign (with the vanes/other heat management, and possibly a new switch). My guess is that with the money spent on tooling, designs, and supplier sourcing, upgrading a design is probably harder than it sounds, so an "H30 2.0" is probably unlikely. However, that knowledge could be applied to a CR123 body option for the H60. An optional CR123A H60 body would have the vanes and therefore same diameter, so a second head mount would not be necessary. A 123A body would also have 1mm thicker metal inside, partially offsetting the shorter length. 

I like the shiny metal around emitter of the H60 if it amounts to an actual functional difference.

From ZL's website: "We will upgrade the shipping to EMS with all orders valued 80 USD or more." The price set for the H60 will be $79. Hum. That sounds intentional, somehow. 

I'm interested to see if the accessories package will be similar or equivalent. Zebralight simply includes the best standard accessories of any manufacturer, IMO. 

Looking forward to more. Also kinda curious to see if this thing will be light enough to be realistic for head use, esp w/the vanes and all. The 18650 battery style definitely has the capacity and current, and right voltage. And Li-Ion chemistry is light to begin with. It is pushing the limits. But that is what Zebralight does best. If anyone can do it... Zebralight can.


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## TITAN1833

I wonder! if I just Paypal zebralight $80.00 will I get the free EMS upgrade hmmm,worth a try I guess :naughty:


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## brjones

Oh, yeah! If you just hand them an extra dollar? Lol!


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## nzbazza

Looks good!
 waiting for official announcement.


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## EngrPaul

Nice flush button. I hope it isn't just attached with sticky stuff.


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## Patriot

brjones said:


> Looking forward to more. Also kinda curious to see if this thing will be light enough to be realistic for head use, esp w/the vanes and all. The 18650 battery style definitely has the capacity and current, and right voltage. And Li-Ion chemistry is light to begin with. It is pushing the limits. But that is what Zebralight does best. If anyone can do it... Zebralight can.




In which areas do you feel that they're pushing the limits with this particular model. It has extra cooling fins and it wont be drawing excessive current or anything. It all sounds fairly stable and solid to me. I also think it would be great if they updated and improved the H30.

I think the H60 does look great but seems expensive compared to their other two models. That part is a little disappointing I think.


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## Blindasabat

I think ZL knows the H60 will be lower volume than the H30 or H50, so they need to make it worth their while. 


EuphoricGrIn said:


> ...and a price... $79(!) - which is really steep, especially if all we're looking at is an somewhat larger version of the H30, with the same emitter and a "tweaked" driver. Do the increase in size and somewhat more complex heat dissipation measures really justify a 60%+ price premium?


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## Thujone

Looking forward to output numbers, if they keep the low low and have a really high high it will be enough for me to look at snagging one. Love ZL!


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## Art Vandelay

I think that is the MSRP. The H60 will followed by the H31 and H51, which have reflectors.


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## dblagent

Art Vandelay said:


> I think that is the MSRP. The H60 will followed by the H31 and H51, which have reflectors.



I was told there was a H501 coming out after the 60, and that it too will be a higher price, though not how much more. I have no other details, but was told it would be more H30 like in operation. I may be waiting on this I suppose.


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## EngrPaul

Nice HANDLEBAR GRIP


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## Woods Walker

Looks good but will hold off to read the reports on CPF from users.


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## RGB_LED

Wow, finally seeing an 18650 headlamp is... a bit weird. I've read the threads and have been waiting but, if the clicky is the same as that on the H30, I might have to pass as I did not like the switch and it's functions at all. Somewhat bizarre since I tend to like clickies over twisties but I currently still prefer my H50 even though the H30 has more output.

As for price... at first glance, it's pricey but, if you consider PT Apex is approx. $70-80, puts out 60 lm [Edit: Current model is 80lm) for just under 2hrs regulated and up to 4hrs diminishing output (Flashlightreviews.com) and *_*IF*_* the H60 is comparable to other 18650 based lights and puts out 150-200 lm for 2-3hrs, then it's clear which I would prefer. Granted, it's comparing apples to oranges but there isn't another headlamp that I know of at this time that runs on 18650.

Having said that, I think still I'll wait for the output / runtime numbers and reviews on UI, etc...


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## PhantomPhoton

I like the looks of it. $79 isn't too bad of a price imho. Not if it performs well. If it's a nice, efficint low low, and decent level on high then  


(as soon as I wrangle up some funds that is.  ... )


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## AvPD

A$120 

I waited for the H60 and now I might as well just buy some more RCR123As for the RC-N3 (sans reflector) that I clip on the front of a hat.


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## Edro

dblagent said:


> I was told there was a H501 coming out after the 60...


 
I thought so too. That's the one I'm waiting for, AA light with the H30 refinements. It hopes to be a great light.


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## cchurchi

I think it's great! This is exactly the light I have been waiting for Zebralight to make. I also feel the price is fair and I'll be ordering one as soon as I'm able to on their web site. If it works properly and dosen't have any QC issues, I'll order several more.


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## brjones

Patriot36 said:


> In which areas do you feel that they're pushing the limits with this particular model. It has extra cooling fins and it wont be drawing excessive current or anything.



I said that ZL pushes the limits in general, meaning as a company. And, specifically, I thought it was obvious. The answer, for all their lights is their unique combination of: extremely small size, good output, and being side-firing. They're not pocket rockets, but emit the most light reasonably possible for their size, due to heat management issues (wherein more innovation now cometh). Just being a pocket rocket anymore is not so unique in itself, either--in fact, kind of becoming the norm. So I think they zag when everybody zigs.

Just on size alone, very few make smaller lights... the lights are barely bigger than the batteries themselves. That goes for all 3 models. Look at any light that's considered "small" for its battery size, and ZL will be smaller than most any. If that's not unique or pushing the limits--I mean with flashlights, not nuclear physics or anything--I don't know what is. 

For that matter, even the 'pure flood' optics thing is rare--less rare in headlamps, but still (and ZL's are flexible beyond headlamping, esp with the included accessories). I owned 3 headlamps and none are perfect flood. See the post where one guy used his H30 as a clip-on light for his professional camcorder/VTR (are they still called VTR's?).


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## brjones

Art Vandelay said:


> I think that is the MSRP.


 
Well, from what I've noticed, ZL prices are actually lower when purchased directly from them [....in China]. So... maybe actually more expensive when purchased from in-country dealers(?). 

You actually save a little money purchasing directly from them, even with any shipping costs from what I've seen, and they want it this way as they make a ton more off of it, but then returns are more of a hassle... and I guess pricier. Oh, and a minor note, but still a consideration for me: a company on mainland China then has your credit card number... not that I don't trust ZL *[remainder of post removed - DM51]*


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## nzbazza

4Seven's has a page on their website for the H60 here. No technical details available yet but the page states that it will be in stock 7th November. 4 7's price is $99.


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## DM51

brjones... I have removed the last half of your post, in which you went off-topic with an unattractive and abusive rant.

You are warned that posts of that nature will not be tolerated. No more, please.


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## Thujone

Lets hope that the 99 price tag is a placeholder... 25% markup from ZL's website is not the case on any other torch..


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## Art Vandelay

Thujone said:


> Lets hope that the 99 price tag is a placeholder... 25% markup from ZL's website is not the case on any other torch..



The markup from ZL's website on the H30 and H50 is now 41% (From $49 to $69).


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## Thujone

Art Vandelay said:


> The markup from ZL's website on the H30 and H50 is now 41% (From $49 to $69).



Well $hit. :mecry: Think they may have just priced themselves out of a few customers... I can't justify that cost when you can pick up a NT120p for barely any more than a hundred these days... That is truly a shame, I feel like they were fairly priced before.


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## PhantomPhoton

:ironic:
$99 is not going to sell many imho.
I might pay $80, and if you really twisted my arm I'd be willing to pay $70


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## Art Vandelay

How long is it?


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## Lite_me

Yep, +1 I just saw those prices and I've been waiting for their new releases. I can't justify that much. I got in on the early run of the H50s. Looks like that's gonna have to do me.


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## f22shift

Art Vandelay said:


> The markup from ZL's website on the H30 and H50 is now 41% (From $49 to $69).


 
i dont see that. do you mean 4sevens site?

that would mean flashlights would be a better investment than stocks..


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## Art Vandelay

f22shift said:


> i dont see that. do you mean 4sevens site?
> 
> that would mean flashlights would be a better investment than stocks..


From the Zebralight website and 4sevens website.

Lately flashlights have been a better investment than stocks.


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## 04orgZx6r

It used to be $49 + $6 shipping form Zebralight and $59 - cpf8 and free shipping from 4sevens it pretty much evened out.

But now the prices have all went up, I wonder why:thinking:

Usually it is the other way around buy direct you pay MSRP, buy from a dealer and you get a discount.


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## Patriot

Art Vandelay said:


> The markup from ZL's website on the H30 and H50 is now 41% (From $49 to $69).



It makes we wish I would have picked up 3 or 4 of them. I don't think I'll be buying them at the new price. That's a large jump. I hope that 4seven's is looking out for us price wise in his dealings with Zebralight. I'm not sure if it's fact or not but I feel that CPF took a part in launching the success at Zebralight.


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## gunga

Yep, I really wanted an updated AA model, but not at these prices...


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## Art Vandelay

Patriot36 said:


> It makes we wish I would have picked up 3 or 4 of them. I don't think I'll be buying them at the new price. That's a large jump. I hope that 4seven's is looking out for us price wise in his dealings with Zebralight. I'm not sure if it's fact or not but I feel that CPF took a part in launching the success at Zebralight.



Being in 4sevens store gives them a big creditability boost in my book.


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## moses

Yes, I was wondering what is behind the jump. . Could it be that Zebralight no longer gives a special dealer's pricing to 4Sevens? Regardless of the reason - that's a huge jump!

MO


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## geek4christ

Zebralight, if you're listening...

I think it's a bad idea to under-sell your dealers. Dealerships will sell lots and lots of lights for you, because people know and trust their dealers. However, if you out-price your dealers by selling directly from your online store at a much lower price, you will start losing those dealers.

Please take this as constructive advice from someone whose parents' small business went under due to dealer under-pricing. I humbly suggest you consider making it cost the same to buy a light from your online store as it costs to buy it from your dealers.


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## jirik_cz

geek4christ said:


> Zebralight, if you're listening...



Are you sure that this is the manufacturer's problem? We can't judge if we don't know what is behind this price change. Btw. Zebralight didn't change their web prices. 4Sevens did. :shrug:


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## geek4christ

jirik_cz said:


> Are you sure that this is the manufacturer's problem? We can't judge if we don't know what is behind this price change. Btw. Zebralight didn't change their web prices. 4Sevens did. :shrug:



No, jirik, I'm not sure. That's a good point. I made many assumptions.

I am just concerned that 4sevens price increase is related to an increase in their cost to obtain the product from ZL. But again, I do not have any inside information, only assumptions.


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## ironhorse

There is more information listed now on the Zebralight website.


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## Eric_LED

http://www.zebralight.com/index.php...ducts_id=185&zenid=vju8oqk7kes0js6clm57epu9i4


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## Thujone

the details look great.. Looks like it will get free ems shipping also. Bummer 4Sevens have priced themselves out of the ZL market IMO. Shipping will be a bit slower but 20$ is 20$ if ya know what I mean, sorry david...


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## Patriot

Thujone said:


> the details look great.. Looks like it will get free ems shipping also. Bummer 4Sevens have priced themselves out of the ZL market IMO. Shipping will be a bit slower but 20$ is 20$ if ya know what I mean, sorry david...




I do wish he would chime in and let us know why the big price difference. Maybe there is a logical reason for it all. I have to be honest though...I don't think I'd pay $100 for the H60, especially since $80 is already pushing it.


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## d1dd1

Patriot36 said:


> I do wish he would chime in and let us know why the big price difference. Maybe there is a logical reason for it all. I have to be honest though...I don't think I'd pay $100 for the H60, especially since $80 is already pushing it.




Zebralight.com will ship the light for $85 via EMS :twothumbs
($79 H60 + $6 for regular shipping + free EMS upgrade)

http://www.zebralight.com/index.php?main_page=shippinginfo


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## notnormal

> The ZebraLight H60 is a high performance all aluminum headlamp. Powered with one 18650 battery, the H60 can produce a maximum of 190 Lumen out the front with a smooth flood beam and can continuously run for 26 days nonstop on its lowest output level. The H60 can be used as a headlamp as well as a task light with supplied accessories.
> *Main Features and Specifications*
> 
> 
> 
> LED: Cree XLamp XR-E Q5
> Battery: one 3.7v 18650 size Lithium-ion rechargeable. Works with batteries that have flat positive terminals while still maintaining reverse polarity protection.
> 3 modes, each can be set and memorized to one of the two levels for that mode
> High: *190* lm (1.5 hrs) or *110* lm (4 hrs)
> Med: *45* lm (10 hrs) or *15* lm (50 hrs)
> Low: *0.5* lm (26 days) or *3* lm (9 days)
> Factory default settings are 110, 15 and 3 lm. Tested with Panasonic 2550 mAh 18650 batteries.
> Out of the six levels, four (190, 110, 15, and 3 lm) are current regulated and two (45 and 0.5 lm) are PWM derived.
> 80o flood beam, without a hotspot.
> 
> 
> *Operations*
> 
> 
> 
> From Off
> Press and hold to cycle through Low, Med and High, release to set.
> Click to High, click again quickly to cycle through Med, Low and High.
> 
> When On
> Click to Off.
> Press and hold to cycle through Low, Med and High, release to set.
> Double click to toggle between the two levels for that mode.


Wow! I like the 2 different low modes (0.5 lumens or 3 lumens), though I'm not too fond of the user interface.


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## Thujone

d1dd1 said:


> Zebralight.com will ship the light for $85 via EMS :twothumbs
> ($79 H60 + $6 for regular shipping + free EMS upgrade)
> 
> http://www.zebralight.com/index.php?main_page=shippinginfo



I missed the $6 fee on ZL, I guess that makes it about a $6 difference after the CPF8 code. The inclusion of the dual levels at each mode is a real value add. I think this will make a great task light. We will see how it plays out, I would rather do business with David, but a guys gotta look out for himself also...


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## Patriot

d1dd1 said:


> Zebralight.com will ship the light for $85 via EMS :twothumbs
> ($79 H60 + $6 for regular shipping + free EMS upgrade)
> 
> http://www.zebralight.com/index.php?main_page=shippinginfo






But they're sold out...
http://www.zebralight.com/index.php...ducts_id=185&zenid=k6phh2nqiifed7sndhvhcugof3


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## rayman

Patriot36 said:


> But they're sold out...
> http://www.zebralight.com/index.php...ducts_id=185&zenid=k6phh2nqiifed7sndhvhcugof3



I think there weren't even out yet. On 4sevens website there is only a preorder.

rayman


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## PhantomPhoton

Patriot36 said:


> But they're sold out...
> http://www.zebralight.com/index.php...ducts_id=185&zenid=k6phh2nqiifed7sndhvhcugof3



They haven't been available yet. I've been watching the website every day for the past week or two.  
I'm quite happy with the specs. As always nothing is 100% to my liking, but in general this light looks incredible. 

As for 4Sevens' site, when you factor in the CPF discount and free shipping the price difference is less than it appears. $85 direct from ZL, $91 from 4sevens. So it's not as bad as it initially appeared, but still six bucks is six bucks.


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## Art Vandelay

PhantomPhoton said:


> They haven't been available yet. I've been watching the website every day for the past week or two.
> I'm quite happy with the specs. As always nothing is 100% to my liking, but in general this light looks incredible.
> 
> As for 4Sevens' site, when you factor in the CPF discount and free shipping the price difference is less than it appears. $85 direct from ZL, $91 from 4sevens. So it's not as bad as it initially appeared, but still six bucks is six bucks.


 
I think you are right.


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## curby

Unfortunately I just switched to using LiFeP04 batteries and this doesn't seem to take em. Hopefully as people play around with it different configs could be tested. Maybe it can buck a 6V input for much more flexibility.


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## PhantomPhoton

What makes you believe LiFeP04 won't work?
I've seen no information about this at all. Only Zebralight can say for sure if the light will regulate down to the lower voltages. My guess is they would work though perhaps not give full regulation. :thinking:
Also IMR 18650 cells are coming out from AW soon which should exceed LiFePO4s in most applications while giving better safety than standard 18650s.


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## Patriot

PhantomPhoton said:


> What makes you believe LiFeP04 won't work?
> My guess is they would work though perhaps not give full regulation. :thinking:




Absolutely. They should still work but with shorter regulated and overall run-time. I'm also looking forward too AW's new 18650.


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## Empyfree

curby said:


> Unfortunately I just switched to using LiFeP04 batteries and this doesn't seem to take em. Hopefully as people play around with it different configs could be tested. Maybe it can buck a 6V input for much more flexibility.



The Zebralight website now has the following info:

_Battery: one 18650 size rechargeable (2.5v to 4.5v), including 3.6v/3.7v Li-ion or 3.0v LiFeP04 chemistries. Works with batteries that have flat positive terminals while still maintaining reverse polarity protection._

Also, I see that they've changed their free EMS upgrade offer to $79 to include this light.


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## Empyfree

My bad, I should read the info first...

The offer isn't for free shipping, rather it's for a free upgrade to EMS from normal shipping. Still costs $6


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## rayman

Found this in another forum. It's written by the one of the Zebralight customer service.


> The max output should be around 110-130 Lumens. We will finalize the max output
> figure from the production batch instead of a few pre production samples. All output
> are 'Out the Front' figure. We believe that is more meaningfull than the LED lumens
> estimated from current that goes through the LED. We measure the output with our
> integrated sphere.
> 
> We will not use SSC P7 (we tried), but will use MC-E in our headlamps. We are waiting
> for the Cree to have the MC-E produced in large quantity. We do have engineering
> headlamp samples with MC-E and 18650, and they are bright!



So what do you think about a 18650 Zebralight with a MC-E? In My opinion the 190lm of the H60 are enough.

rayman


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## notnormal

rayman said:


> So what do you think about a 18650 Zebralight with a MC-E? In My opinion the 190lm of the H60 are enough.



I'm more interested in their reflector version of the headlamps (H*1) and a reduction in price . Though, I've already  for the H60.


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## tsask

I'll buy it from 4 Sevens. I hate to "waste $$" paying more there yet I trust those folks. It's worth at least $10 to know I'll have zero hassles!!!!!


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## cchurchi

Me too... Pre-ordered from 4sevens. I have 30 18650's laying around, waiting for this lamp..


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## Burgess

_


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## choppers

Very nice:thumbsup:


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## Polar Light

Any news about the release date?


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## PhantomPhoton

Supposedly 4sevens was supposed to be shipping them out yesterday. I haven't checked MP yet to see if there's any news from him. I'm still waiting for them to show up as well.


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## shining

Did they publish the size of this lamp anywhere?


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## kaichu dento

I can't find it anywhere.


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## shining

Hmm, some people here pre-ordered it without this minor "piece of information". Late stage of flashagolism :thinking:


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## adamlau

Looks good, gotta give this one a shot. Already have the 50 (awesome product) and 30 (buggy as shiz, but awesome when it works). Hope the QA issues have been worked out with the 60  .


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## Empyfree

I don't know why I have to have this product... My H50 flickers constantly, and I can't turn the H30 0ff without unscrewing it... but, I love the build quality and innovation that Zebralight brings with each new offering, can't wait for the HX1 series lights that they promised a while ago!


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## Lite_me

Empyfree said:


> I don't know why I have to have this product... My H50 flickers constantly, and I can't turn the H30 0ff without unscrewing it... but, I love the *build quality* and innovation that Zebralight brings with each new offering, can't wait for the HX1 series lights that they promised a while ago!


I'm not knocking the product but, isn't "build quality" a part of your two complaints? 

As far as the H50 flickering goes, it's probably a bad connection inside the tailcap where it meets the end of the tube. Clean inside tailcap (DeoxIt alcohol), and lightly sanding (tube base) might help. It did mine.


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## eyeeatingfish

Well it doesnt say so, so im not holding my breath but I wonder if it can take 2x rcr123 batteries. 

Another odd thing about the zebralights. Why are they $20 more on 4sevens.com than on zebralight.com? ????


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## Empyfree

Lite_me said:


> I'm not knocking the product but, isn't "build quality" a part of your two complaints?
> 
> As far as the H50 flickering goes, it's probably a bad connection inside the tailcap where it meets the end of the tube. Clean inside tailcap (DeoxIt alcohol), and lightly sanding (tube base) might help. It did mine.



Ok, I probably should have stuck to build design/structure rather than "quality" but I hope my point carried. I love the side firing design, and zebralight's machining work is excellent.


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## rayman

Did anybody get his H60 already?

rayman


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## notnormal

I've been informed that my pre-order shipping date has changed from 11/7 to 11/20.


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## cat

d1dd1 said:


> Zebralight.com will ship the light for $85 via EMS :twothumbs
> ($79 H60 + $6 for regular shipping + free EMS upgrade)
> 
> http://www.zebralight.com/index.php?main_page=shippinginfo



Which is much quicker than from the USA. In my experience, shipping from China is quicker than from USA. EMS will be the same - 7-8 days. And now that's it's christmas, forget shipping from the USA.


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## eyeeatingfish

Anyone know why its so much more expensive on 4sevens website?


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## Art Vandelay

It 's been out of stock for a while at zebralight, we will see later what they change when they have some to sell.


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## ichoderso

official preorder is starting now on the zebralight website!
I got a info from zebralight, that a "warm white" Q3 5A version will be available later.
greetings from germany, Jens


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## EngrPaul

ichoderso said:


> I got a info from zebralight, that a "warm white" Q3 5A version will be available later.


 

Hopefully sooner than later. 

Glad the price was brought a little more into reason.


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## Shorty66

Paypal Loaded....
Now comes the hard part: Will i wait for an H61 with reflector or will i take this one? :thinking:


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## eyeeatingfish

Do you mean Q5 3AAA?

And if you want a small 18650 just with the reflector you could go for the lumapower encore.


I still wonder if this thing can take 2x123a cells.


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## Shorty66

The Q2 5A is a Cree LED with warmer tint than those Q5's found in many high power lights.

I aint searching for a hendhled reflecotr light but a Zebralight with angled Lightsource and Reflector for more Throw. Though by now im quite impressed by some Beamshots of the h30 wich should have basically the same beamshot but brighter.
Perhaps i will go for the H60 because i dont got enough patience to wait for an H61...


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## eyeeatingfish

Shorty66 said:


> The Q2 5A is a Cree LED with warmer tint than those Q5's found in many high power lights.
> 
> I aint searching for a hendhled reflecotr light but a Zebralight with angled Lightsource and Reflector for more Throw. Though by now im quite impressed by some Beamshots of the h30 wich should have basically the same beamshot but brighter.
> Perhaps i will go for the H60 because i dont got enough patience to wait for an H61...


 

If you want an angle light with a reflector get a first light tomahawk. They can get expensive, however the more basic models arent so expensive, maybe $120, and they are reviewed very well.


----------



## PeLu

eyeeatingfish said:


> I still wonder if this thing can take 2x123a cells.


And I wonder how deep it will discharge the cell. Meaning: can I use my plethora of good, but unprotected cells? 

Was there anything mentioned about this?


----------



## eyeeatingfish

Maybe it will take a 123 with a dummy 123?


----------



## shining

The specifications state that it discharges to 2.5v. So, no, unprotected cells are not supported.




PeLu said:


> And I wonder how deep it will discharge the cell. Meaning: can I use my plethora of good, but unprotected cells?
> 
> Was there anything mentioned about this?


----------



## PeLu

shining said:


> The specifications state that it discharges to 2.5v.


 Hmm, they write: 


Zebralight website said:


> one 18650 size rechargeable within the 2.5v to 4.5v range,


 You think that means discharge down to 2.5V? This would be fine for using unprotected cells for me. We will see.


----------



## Shorty66

I just noticed thet they do not list any GITD items (button, headband holder) under "Accessories in the package" of the h60.
Sad thing...


----------



## shining

Discharge LiON to 2.5???  I suggest doing this while it's in a fire-proof container 
And also I thing it will power light till 2.5V, but will not disconnect the chain at 2.5v.
In fact, I cannot see the purpose of not having overdischarge protection - there are no primary 18650. Ah, it's for the new lower voltage safe chemistries.




PeLu said:


> Hmm, they write:
> You think that means discharge down to 2.5V? This would be fine for using unprotected cells for me. We will see.


----------



## PeLu

shining said:


> Discharge LiON to 2.5?


 Yes, no problem. It will not happen very often. 



> I suggest doing this while it's in a fire-proof container


 Why? There is no safety problem with deep discharging single cells. it only shortens the lifetime a little bit.



> I cannot see the purpose of not having overdischarge protection


 There are lots of reasons. But no one is forced to use either protected or unprotected cells. I'm not willing to pay the penalty in capacity, price and relyability.


----------



## PeLu

double post deleted


----------



## Shorty66

Well, i couldnt hold on me:


----------



## shining

They are listening - they added GITD accessories :thumbsup:. What do you think, 100g, is not it too much to use for running without the central strap without it sliding down into your eyes?


----------



## ToTo

Battery 

One 18650 size rechargeable within the 2.8v to 4.5v range, including 3.6v/3.7v Li-ion or 3.0v LiFeP04 chemistries.
Reverse polarity protection circuit. Works with batteries that have flat positive terminals.
Discharging protection circuit turns off the light when the battery voltage drops below 2.8v.

sounds good


----------



## Shorty66

Wow i was right ordering the H60. GITD rocks hell! :wave:

100g are absolutly ok for a headlamp. My Tikka XP weights 104g with batteries and headband and 79g without the headband. So the h60 is lighter.


----------



## WadeF

I just put in an order on 4sevens. So it's $99.00 - 8% from 4sevens, and 79.99 + 6 from Zebra? So it's like $6-7 more from 4sevens, but it should ship quicker if you are in the USA, and you have 4seven's support (you can send it to him rather than Zebralight if there is a problem). Sounds like a deal!  

That extra $6-7 is cheap when you consider it includes his support/warranty and faster shipping. 

Also I've heard that the H30, H50, etc, were really cheap for what they are. They should cost more than they do considering the 3D machine work, etc. At $99.00 the H60 is probably still a deal consider the machining, programmable UI, etc.


----------



## qtaco

WadeF said:


> Also I've heard that the H30, H50, etc, were really cheap for what they are. They should cost more than they do considering the 3D machine work, etc. At $99.00 the H60 is probably still a deal consider the machining, programmable UI, etc.



Especially considering the H50 at least was originally sold for $50USD. It's now up to $70USD.


----------



## Haz

Zebralight was an unheard of light when it first came out with the H30 and H50 so i gather they had to price it on the lower end, and make less profit to gain brand awareness. Given the fact they have been proven to be relatively good lights, they probably have decided to charge more for their lights. I still believe at the US$50, it will still be profitable, but at USD$70, it will be much more profitable. Zebralight has a niche market because of their unique designs utilising single cell batteries in their headlight. The current range of lights from Jetbeam, Fenix, Nitecore cannot compete directly with them.


----------



## shining

They certainly decided to become more profitable. Remember the $40 H50-P4? Not that Q5 now is more expensive than P4 then...



Haz said:


> Zebralight was an unheard of light when it first came out with the H30 and H50 so i gather they had to price it on the lower end, and make less profit to gain brand awareness. Given the fact they have been proven to be relatively good lights, they probably have decided to charge more for their lights. I still believe at the US$50, it will still be profitable, but at USD$70, it will be much more profitable. Zebralight has a niche market because of their unique designs utilising single cell batteries in their headlight. The current range of lights from Jetbeam, Fenix, Nitecore cannot compete directly with them.


----------



## nars42

It's still $50 if you buy from them, they are just a little more expensive from 4seven, though I think that is fair since you get faster shipping and more local support.


----------



## shining

They started from $40 for the P4 version.



nars42 said:


> It's still $50 if you buy from them, they are just a little more expensive from 4seven, though I think that is fair since you get faster shipping and more local support.


----------



## christian gpr

Couldn´t help myself  for a H60:twothumbs


----------



## Shorty66

Welcome to the club.


----------



## WadeF

shining said:


> They certainly decided to become more profitable. Remember the $40 H50-P4? Not that Q5 now is more expensive than P4 then...


 
Or maybe they were lossing money and now they are lossing less. Without seeing their books, we'll never know.


----------



## shining

Another 8 days delay. I expected this after they added the GITD accessories. But I really, really hope that they will use this time for QA.

*Accepting preorders, will start shipping on Dec 5th.


*


----------



## PhantomPhoton

Hopefully they can get some nice Q3 5A (or close to that tint) H60's up soon as well.
Too bad there's another delay but hopefully it is for improving quality or adding a bit more polish to the product.


----------



## Patriot

PhantomPhoton said:


> Too bad there's another delay but hopefully it is for improving quality or adding a bit more polish to the product.





ditto that!

I managed to luck out through the initial H30 problems and ended up with a good one right out of the first batch. This time I'd rather they get everything perfect first.


----------



## Shorty66

Yes, delay is better than poor quality.
Though i hope my h60 will be here by the 18th of december.... im on vacationafter that.


----------



## eyeeatingfish

I dont know, you can get an MRV for $100, and while im sure this new light is great, I just dont think its worth $100.


----------



## Shorty66

I would like to see you with an MRV stripped to your head :-D
I think, the h60s size is small enough for EDCing it. I dont want to have a MRV in my pocket.
These are just too completly different lights. If you dont like the h60 dont buy it.
I think that it is well worth the 85$ i payd for it if its working as pormised.


----------



## vincebdx

Quality, quality 

H60 isn't the most expensive headlamp : http://www.batteryjunction.com/surefire-saint.html

Zebralight please a small gift for the first H60 preorders and delayed shipping


----------



## eyeeatingfish

Shorty66 said:


> I would like to see you with an MRV stripped to your head :-D
> I think, the h60s size is small enough for EDCing it. I dont want to have a MRV in my pocket.
> These are just too completly different lights. If you dont like the h60 dont buy it.
> I think that it is well worth the 85$ i payd for it if its working as pormised.



Is that a picture request?

I have the AA Q5 version and its great but this is almost double the price. I dont doubt it has various improvements that make it cost more, but 100 seems like a bit much for an LED headlamp.


----------



## Shorty66

you are comparaing apples and oranges:
This is an 18650 light. So dont compare it to an AA light.
This is a headlamp. So compare it to other headlamps.
This is not 100 bucks. Its 85$. thats 15% less.

Like i said, if you don't like it, dont buy it.
It think its well worth 85 bucks. At least, its a far better deal than a 45$ Tikka XP wich is about the same weight and Volume.

Show me any real Headlamp with similar Specs at a lower price. A Headlamp is just a plain different thing to use than a handheld one - in my opinion there is no real sense in buying a handheld flashlight because its a little cheaper with the same specs. A headlamp just does the job better.


----------



## eyeeatingfish

4sevens.com shows it at $99.00


----------



## Woods Walker

Speaking just for myself 85 bucks is a great deal of money these days. Also a headlamp for me is field gear. So I don't have use for a 18650 headlamp as everything in my pack uses AAA or AA. I like to keep everything using the same cells with the only exception of my Surefire lights for a few very harsh winter pulk sled extended trips in crazy cold weather. But may consider the new AA when it comes out or even the CR123 Zebra. These would be for camp work as the flood light sounds nice and even better inside the shelter with the very low low mode. But this is just what I want and is no statement as to the value of a 18650 headlamp for others. In any case I will hold off when the newer lights come out as I remember the reports of bugs in the first Zebra lights. I tend to read the reviews first.


----------



## eyeeatingfish

Maybe im missing something in the print but one of my complaints is that it cant accept 2 X CR123 batteries, at least that way you would have a backup!


----------



## naked2

eyeeatingfish said:


> 4sevens.com shows it at $99.00


If you buy it directly from Zebralight, it's $85 shipped anywhere in the world.


----------



## Woods Walker

With the 8% CPF discount the cost is 91.08 shipped to anyplace from 4sevens.com. If or when I buy a Zebralight it will be from 4sevens as I think if there are issues it would be better for me to return the product to GA.


----------



## naked2

I wasn't suggesting where to buy it, just that it *is* available for $85. As a matter of fact, I bought my H30 from 7777, which (at the time) was $54.28 w/ cpf discount (54 even directly from Zebralight).

I bought from 7777 for the same reason you mentioned, plus shipping was alot quicker. But now (for some reason), 7777 raised the price. :thumbsdow If I were to buy another H30, I'd probably buy directly from Zebralight; partly in principal due to 7777 raising their price (now $63.48 w/ cpf), but mainly because I've not had one problem with my current one, and also I read a story on Light-Reviews Forum about an Aussie flashaholic's (Hi Philbee!) excellent customer service experience with a return/replacement directly from Zebralight :twothumbs (they're no KD or DX!)


----------



## jirik_cz

From what I've heard. Zebra raised their wholesale prices...


----------



## Shorty66

Yeah i just received my tracking number for the H60. Now lets see how fast EMS is...


----------



## ichoderso

Shorty66 said:


> Yeah i just received my tracking number for the H60. Now lets see how fast EMS is...




I too.....:wave:


----------



## Cheesy

Yep, mine has shipped too, ordered 16th Nov if that helps anyone.


Kev.


----------



## Team Member

You guys are lucky..... Mine is to be shipped late next week...


----------



## Shorty66

Mine ist now at the sorting center in Shanghai and soon to be flown to germany.
I Ordered on the 19th November.

[edit: it just left the sorting center.... does that mean its on the plane right now? Perhaps it will reach me tomorrow...that would be awesome...]


----------



## climberkid

welp, im on the pre-order list. im actually very excited. just accidently bought 2 18650s thinking they were a differnt size, so decided to go ahead and order it. You know you are a flashaholic when you order a flashlight because you have extra batteries.....


----------



## naked2

There's no such thing as "extra" batteries, you must have a flashlight to go with every two sets, LOL (one in the light, and one spare!). Muhhaha! :devil:


----------



## ichoderso

Shorty66 said:


> Mine ist now at the sorting center in Shanghai and soon to be flown to germany.
> I Ordered on the 19th November.
> 
> [edit: it just left the sorting center.... does that mean its on the plane right now? Perhaps it will reach me tomorrow...that would be awesome...]



Hi, the most, I got with EMS from China/Korea etc arrived me after 4 days... I think Tu. or We. next week....

greetings from thuringia, Jens


----------



## vincebdx

Shipped too


----------



## ichoderso

H60 arrived me in this moment:nana:


----------



## Irling

ichoderso said:


> H60 arrived me in this moment:nana:



BEAMSHOTS!!!


----------



## Paul

ichoderso said:


> H60 arrived me in this moment:nana:


Beamshots? Pictures? Impressions? Tests? Demanding, me??? :laughing:

Ok, more serious: What do you think about it? Does it appear to be as impressive as it looks on the paper?


----------



## ichoderso

Paul said:


> Beamshots? Pictures? Impressions? Tests? Demanding, me??? :laughing:
> 
> Ok, more serious: What do you think about it? Does it appear to be as impressive as it looks on the paper?



Hi, I am satisfied! very good machining/anodyzing and (for me) perfect UI, simply but good. Very low Low and very bright on High
In this evening, if I have more time, I will compare it with my H50 and H30.


Jens


----------



## Paul

Sounds good! I find the ability to have it running on a very low setting for a long time very a very interesting feature.


----------



## Shorty66

grml... min just left the sorting center at frankfurt...so it will be here tomorrow.


----------



## Dreamlander23

Mine left Shanghai on the 5th,got to Coventry UK yesterday 8th and was presented to customs so I may get stung but it should be here Wednesday or Thursday,can't wait! My 18650 is all charged and waiting for it's garage!
:twothumbs


----------



## ichoderso

Shorty66 said:


> grml... min just left the sorting center at frankfurt...so it will be here tomorrow.



I said tuesday or Wensday, mine Tuesday, yours Wensday:wave:


----------



## Shorty66

Haha!
Mine just arrived. Its really nice!
The low at 3lm is just a little dimmer than my Tikka XP on low with shortly used Batterys.
The 110lm High is quite a lot brighter than the Boost mode of the tikka Xp.

Everything is well manufactured, no dust or unclean contacts. The whole lamp is well anodized in a natural color (not black as the picture on the site suggests). the thread is lubed und twists like a charm.
Im Happy


----------



## ichoderso

some pictures ....
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/posts/2733316#post2733316


----------



## Shorty66

Short review and some Pictures in a German Outdoor-community:
http://forum.outdoorseiten.net/showpost.php?p=420042&postcount=22


----------



## naked2

Nice pics, shorty. The clip looks much more at home on the H60 than it does on the H30 (imo).


----------



## Shorty66

I especially like my new EDC combo:





Fits perfectly well in my Jeanspocket. The H60 is looking out of the pocket and is always ready for an instant floof of light to lighten up anything in front of me...

With H60, Leatherman Charge and the GPS/3G/Wikipedia-enabled Smartphone HTC Kaiser am prepared for almost anything...


----------



## notnormal

Yay, I finally received my H60:mecry:. However I noticed some of the specifications have changed since I pre-ordered the light.

Originally, all the three modes could be set and memorized. Now, only the low and medium modes may be set and memorized. Also, the high mode setting of 190 lm is limited to 10 minutes. After 10 minutes it will revert back to 110 lm, to prevent overheating.


----------



## Thujone

well notnormal that is not cool... that should have been publicized functionality...


----------



## naked2

Sounds like a good thing though; wouldn't want it going  on your head, now would'ya? :duh2:


----------



## notnormal

Thujone said:


> well notnormal that is not cool... that should have been publicized functionality...



Well the information is now posted on their website.










Here are photos of the H60 packaging.










Just thought I'd let people know the new specifications and the slight change in ui.


----------



## WadeF

notnormal said:


> Yay, I finally received my H60:mecry:. However I noticed some of the specifications have changed since I pre-ordered the light.
> 
> Originally, all the three modes could be set and memorized. Now, only the low and medium modes may be set and memorized. Also, the high mode setting of 190 lm is limited to 10 minutes. After 10 minutes it will revert back to 110 lm, to prevent overheating.



I never looked to close at the UI before I ordered mine. I understood the 190lm mode to be a burst mode and they warned about not using to too long. So the 10 minute limit before switching back doesn't bother me. I assume after it drops to 110 lm you could switch it right back to 190 lm for another 10 minutes? It may just be a reminder that you had it on for 10 minutes and to be careful. Say you put it on 190 lm and walked away and 20-30 minutes later your Cree is burning up.  

The drop to 110lm would prevent accidents like that. They could also use a thermal sensor, but if the light gets too warm then you'd have no way to get the 190lm. It sounds like this way you maybe able to set it for 190lm even if it's getting too hot, say in a situation where you really really need it. It may shorter the life of the LED, but hopefully it wouldn't die on the spot.

If you need 190lm often for more than 10 minutes you could buy two H60's and run each at 110lumens for 220 lumens total. 

Or to be really cool you can wear 3 Zebralights like me:



(Disclaimer: Doing this may make one look like an idiot. I was only doing this to look like an idiot.)


----------



## Yucca Patrol

Well I am officially bummed that 7777 didn't get their H60's shipped out today. I know it is not their fault that things sometimes take longer to make it through customs, but I had so much wanted to try it out caving on Sunday. . . .

Oh well, I'll be excited when it finally does show up. . . .


----------



## StandardBattery

I love Zebra, I love 18650, but I was hoping that maybe the price would drop at 4-7's. It's not a bad deal (with coupon), but I don't really need the light so I'm looking for a better price. It seems a little over priced. If I wanted to use PP and register with Zebra I could get it direct... but... 

Since the 4-7's shipping date just keeps getting bumped I'm going to wait for maybe a January sale. So many nice lights right now. If it had a warm tint LED I'd probably jump on it right now, as I just seem to be really liking them and they seem the perfect fit for a headlamp.


----------



## YourTime

I'm curious if this is a true Q5 LED as my H30 Q5 is silver.

I know that china produce Q5 LED with silver around the die but this LED has yellow (phosphorous?) around the die. Can some expert check it out to confirmed. 

SO sad I've accident dropped my h60 20cm above my computer desk, it's now has a chip out the HAIII colour but didnt have any dent as i run my nail across.

Ill try to post a foto next week


----------



## Empyfree

Q5's come with either silver or yellow backings, as far as I know it makes little or no difference.

Wade... Great photo!, but where's the GITD accessories?


----------



## notnormal

WadeF said:


> If you need 190lm often for more than 10 minutes you could buy two H60's and run each at 110lumens for 220 lumens total.



When I need 150 lm or more, I use a flashlight instead :nana:.



WadeF said:


> Or to be really cool you can wear 3 Zebralights like me:



Doh! Guess I'm not part of the cool crowd. I'll only be using two Zebralights (H60 and H50) at the same time.


----------



## Theatre Booth Guy

Does anyone know how long it takes to get a Zebra in the US? I could not resist on 12-7-08, it shipped on the 10th and seems to be in limbo. . . .
Also, do I need to bug UPS, USPS or some other delivery guy?
My CR2 Ion really needed a Floody Brother


----------



## Cheesy

Theatre Booth Guy said:


> do I need to bug UPS, USPS or some other delivery guy?



I assume ZebraLight emailed you a tracking number?

There is no US link listed on the EMS tracking page here but a Google search for 'ems usa' provides this as the first hit, you could try your tracking number in there. You could also try tracking it at the EMS page but sometimes that only tracks until it leaves the sending country.


Kev.


----------



## Burgess

For what it's worth . . . .


I received my ZebraLight H50 in October, 2007.


Took *16 days* to arrive. (Midwest U.S.A.)


This was plain 'ol "U.S. mail" service. No special treatment.


Hope this is helpful.

_


----------



## Yucca Patrol

I receive stuff from fenix-store overnight most times when sent by regular first class mail, but I live only a couple hours away from them. 

My H60 was shipped out on Saturday and I expect it will be in my mailbox tomorrow. I'll let you know.


----------



## Theatre Booth Guy

Cheesy said:


> I assume ZebraLight emailed you a tracking number?
> 
> There is no US link listed on the EMS tracking page here but a Google search for 'ems usa' provides this as the first hit, you could try your tracking number in there. You could also try tracking it at the EMS page but sometimes that only tracks until it leaves the sending country.
> 
> 
> Kev.



I sent an e-mail to ZebraLight - they replied in only a few hours (on a Sunday)!! There is some sort of error with my tracking number in that things don't look normal to them. They said they would look into it and get back to me. Hopefully, the beam is wide enough - I want both a general purpose flood and light for reading in bed without waking my wife.

True floods seem very hard to find.


----------



## Paul

Theatre Booth Guy said:


> Hopefully, the beam is wide enough - I want both a general purpose flood and light for reading in bed without waking my wife.
> 
> True floods seem very hard to find.


When you get the light, please share your thoughts on the flooding 
I'm also interested in getting a light with good flood and I think the H60 might be a good choice.


----------



## Yucca Patrol

Theatre Booth Guy: You may want to look into the AA powered H50 as it will be floodier than the H60. 

It is the only flashlight I own that my wife loves because it gives me great light on low for reading and doesn't keep her up when I am reading in bed. It is by far the best headlamp I have for night reading (and as a caver, I have a LOT of headlamps around the house)

Once I receive my H60 today (hopefully), I'll let you know how it compares. It will certainly be great for reading in bed too. . .


----------



## notnormal

I prefer the wider angle output of my H50 compared to the H60 for close distances. The H50, at close distances, covers my peripheral vision much better. When I try to look to my sides, without turning my head, there's light. The H60, by comparison, feels like tunnel vision as there's darkness to my sides. 

For further distances, like taking a walk outside, the H60 is much better. The light is brighter and more concentrated, whereas the H50 seems diffuse.

If you don't want to disturb people around you, the H60 is probably better as it's less floody than the H50, thus less likely to disturb those around you. Yet it's still more than floody enough to read a book/magazine.


----------



## Paul

Perhaps a silly question, but I tried to google it with no success: Zebralight says that two of the output levels are _PWM derived_, but what exaclty does that mean and how does it differ from the others which are current regulated?


----------



## Hondo

PWM, or pulse width modulation, means that the LED will be pulsed on and off rapidly to produce the dimming effect. The duration of the off time relative to the on time will determine the degree of dimming produced. It is good in that it always drives the LED at the same current, and avoids some of the color shift issues at extremely low drive currents. It can be bad if it is at a low enough frequency that people see the strobe-like effect of it. The first gen. JettBeam C-LE and the Fenix L0D's use frequencies around 100 Hz, and they are noticable to most people and irritating to many. It is possible to boost this into the thousands of Hz, and then no one can tell that it is there. I have some lights that I can find it on, but don't notice it when using them which I am guessing are at least a few hundred Hz in frequency. I will be most interested to find out what frequency my alternate low and mid levels are at on my H60 when it arrives.


----------



## Theatre Booth Guy

Yucca Patrol said:


> Theatre Booth Guy: You may want to look into the AA powered H50 as it will be floodier than the H60.
> 
> It is the only flashlight I own that my wife loves because it gives me great light on low for reading and doesn't keep her up when I am reading in bed. It is by far the best headlamp I have for night reading (and as a caver, I have a LOT of headlamps around the house)
> 
> Once I receive my H60 today (hopefully), I'll let you know how it compares. It will certainly be great for reading in bed too. . .



I was a bit worried that the H60 may be too narrow of a beam for close up book reading. Can't tell you how tempted I was for 30 seconds to order an H50 after reading how well you like it. Instead, I'll wait a bit for your thoughts on comparing the two 

Maybe, we eventually need a FA (Flashlight Anonymous) to help us curb the excess of our hobby?!?


----------



## Hondo

Cool, it's here!

To answer my own question, the two PWM derived levels are fine, it actually looks like the higer medium is a bit higher frequency than the lower low. And it is a lot higher, about four times. I just compared them with a model airplane tachometer, and the low is about twice the frequency of my Jett C-LE, and the medium nearly four times that. I didn't use Hz, because I am a bit confused, since the unit is calibrated to 3600 rpm under a 60 Hz flourescent light when set for a two-blade prop, and I only get 2200 rpm on the Jett, which means it is only at about 40 Hz, which sounds too low :shrug:.

Anyway, in sweeping a room with them, the PWM levels seem just fine to me, and I seem to have middle-of-the-road sensitivity to it.

The brightnesses are about the same on default low and med as the H30, but high is quite a bit brighter. 190 lumen high is even brighter, but it is already so bright at 110, I don't see me using it much, unless I am trying to generate throw by brute force, in which case I have totally the wrong kind of light. The low-low is still darn usefull, and the hi-medium seems almost the equivalent of the H30 high, a very nice step to have between 15 and 110 lumens.

The beam shape is just like the H30, as advertised.

I like the feel of the switch better than the H30, it feels more positive, less mushy. The whole UI works very well for me, having read the product description, I had no difficulty getting exactly what I wanted.

At 110 lumens, I can start to feel a little bit of warmth in the head, but not bad, where the H30 on high stays pretty much cool. At 190, you start to notice it heating pretty quickly, and I think the 10 minute step-down is a good plan. 

So in my opinion, assuming that you don't mind the added weight, this is the ULTIMATE Zebralight. Lowest low, highest high and longest runtime, all in one light.

By the way, I know some folks were a bit turned off by the price at 4Sevens, but I have to say I got a heck of a deal, besides the $10 "black Friday" discount and the availability of great in-states service. I am not sure if it was a bonus for being a patient early pre-orderer, but I also got a pair of protected Tenergy 2600 mAh 18650's and a Tenergy two-position compact 18650 wall charger in my package :twothumbs. Thanks David!


----------



## 4sevens

Hondo said:


> Cool, it's here!
> 
> To answer my own question, the two PWM derived levels are fine, it actually looks like the higer medium is a bit higher frequency than the lower low. And it is a lot higher, about four times. I just compared them with a model airplane tachometer, and the low is about twice the frequency of my Jett C-LE, and the medium nearly four times that. I didn't use Hz, because I am a bit confused, since the unit is calibrated to 3600 rpm under a 60 Hz flourescent light when set for a two-blade prop, and I only get 2200 rpm on the Jett, which means it is only at about 40 Hz, which sounds too low :shrug:.
> 
> Anyway, in sweeping a room with them, the PWM levels seem just fine to me, and I seem to have middle-of-the-road sensitivity to it.
> 
> The brightnesses are about the same on default low and med as the H30, but high is quite a bit brighter. 190 lumen high is even brighter, but it is already so bright at 110, I don't see me using it much, unless I am trying to generate throw by brute force, in which case I have totally the wrong kind of light. The low-low is still darn usefull, and the hi-medium seems almost the equivalent of the H30 high, a very nice step to have between 15 and 110 lumens.
> 
> The beam shape is just like the H30, as advertised.
> 
> I like the feel of the switch better than the H30, it feels more positive, less mushy. The whole UI works very well for me, having read the product description, I had no difficulty getting exactly what I wanted.
> 
> At 110 lumens, I can start to feel a little bit of warmth in the head, but not bad, where the H30 on high stays pretty much cool. At 190, you start to notice it heating pretty quickly, and I think the 10 minute step-down is a good plan.
> 
> So in my opinion, assuming that you don't mind the added weight, this is the ULTIMATE Zebralight. Lowest low, highest high and longest runtime, all in one light.
> 
> By the way, I know some folks were a bit turned off by the price at 4Sevens, but I have to say I got a heck of a deal, besides the $10 "black Friday" discount and the availability of great in-states service. I am not sure if it was a bonus for being a patient early pre-orderer, but I also got a pair of protected Tenergy 2600 mAh 18650's and a Tenergy two-position compact 18650 wall charger in my package :twothumbs. Thanks David!



All H60 orders come standard with two 2600mah protected 18650's with a dual bay charger. Some have asked if we will sell the H60 without the chargers and the answer is no, not at this point in time


----------



## Hondo

4sevens said:


> All H60 orders come standard with two 2600mah protected 18650's with a dual bay charger. Some have asked if we will sell the H60 without the chargers and the answer is no, not at this point in time


 

:twothumbs :twothumbs :twothumbs

Thanks David, I thought I remembered Peter posting a while back about pre-orders getting a Tenergy protected 18650 cell, but was pleasantly surprised to see a two pack plus charger! I see now that your site shows this on the order page and Peter has it on the first post in the Dealer's corner thread.


----------



## nuggett

I agree with Hondo.
Got mine today from 7777.
shipped Sat, FAST.
Very pleased with the light and Davids service. The package deal is a great value.


----------



## Yucca Patrol

I received mine today from 7777 also. I was particularly pleased to find that I received TWO batteries, as I had originally thought that the product description only included one battery. When you add up the price of the batteries, the charger and the headlamp and subtract the CPF member discount, this is one HECK of a deal! 

When I first looked at it in the box and compared it to my H50, I thought that it was WAY too big and bulky and might be too big. But once I felt how lightweight it really is and played with it for a minute, I was hooked. I quickly realized that my H50 is now quite obsolete, except for the fact that it can run AA's which I often need to use in remote areas when working in the field where reliable power to charge lithium batteries is spotty at best.

I did switch out the black switch cover for the glow in the dark one because, well, why not????

Thanks 7777 for putting together such a top-notch package deal on this fantastic headlamp.

Theater Booth Guy: Both the H50 and the H60 are perfectly suitable for reading in bed. The H50 does have a wider beam, but both of them illuminate both pages of a book at a normal distance, so you can pick either and have a great reading light. . .


----------



## Paul

Looking at the 4sevens page the list of accessories to the H60 appears to be different:


> One black silicone holder with headband
> Pocket clip, can be put on or removed without any tools
> Two O-rings
> One black silicone holder with neck lanyard


Vs. this on the Zebralight site:


> One black silicone holder with headband
> Pocket clip, can be put on or removed without any tools
> Two O-rings
> One glow in the dark silicone switch cap
> One glow in the dark silicone holder


Just some typos, right?


----------



## Yucca Patrol

Paul,

Mine came from 7777 with the list of accessories listed at the zebralight site. It made me happy because I like the glow in the dark holder and switch cover.


----------



## Thujone

4sevens said:


> All H60 orders come standard with two 2600mah protected 18650's with a dual bay charger. Some have asked if we will sell the H60 without the chargers and the answer is no, not at this point in time



Bummer, I have plenty of 18650's, plenty of chargers... But I have exactly 0 H60s


----------



## Yucca Patrol

Thujone said:


> Bummer, I have plenty of 18650's, plenty of chargers... But I have exactly 0 H60s



I'd be happy to take the extra charger and batteries off your hands for a few bucks. The Tenergy 2600mAh batteries are very very nice. . .


----------



## litetube

Is the pocket clip the same as the other 2 versions of this light? is it actually viable for EDC role? Do you all think as an EDC there wouod be issues with accidental activation of the switch all the time? I cant tell if it is recessed or not from the pics. I dont know if there is a button lockout feature in the programming? and does it step down with thermal protection if left on high now ? or is thisplanned for the future?

Thanx!!


----------



## notnormal

litetube said:


> Do you all think as an EDC there wouod be issues with accidental activation of the switch all the time?



Just untwist the battery cap a little, to deactivate the switch.


----------



## Yucca Patrol

notnormal said:


> Just untwist the battery cap a little, to deactivate the switch.



I was happy to see that I only had to untwist it a little bit to deactivate the switch. This is great because it ensures that it remains waterproof when locked out.


----------



## nuggett

The Tenegrys are a tight fit.


----------



## FTL

nuggett said:


> The Tenegrys are a tight fit.



Yes they are. I put one of my Tenergys in and twisted it around hoping it would loosen up. It did. It also cut through the wrapper so that the metal strip that runs up the side of the cell is exposed. Whoops. I suggest not doing this.:sigh:


----------



## Theatre Booth Guy

Theatre Booth Guy said:


> I sent an e-mail to ZebraLight - they replied in only a few hours (on a Sunday)!! There is some sort of error with my tracking number in that things don't look normal to them. They said they would look into it and get back to me. Hopefully, the beam is wide enough - I want both a general purpose flood and light for reading in bed without waking my wife.
> 
> True floods seem very hard to find.



Update - no further word from ZebraLight other than my light seems to have been lost in shipping. They said that my original tracking number results look "odd" and that my tracking number had been changed.
For those of you who shopped 7777, it seems like the better choice.


----------



## nuggett

"For those of you who shopped 7777, it seems like the better choice."

OF COURSE IT IS.

MERRY CHRISTMAS EVERYONE


----------



## notnormal

nuggett said:


> The Tenegrys are a tight fit.



The blue Trustfire 2500mAH fit perfectly.


----------



## WadeF

I got my H60 from 4sevens early this week, I think Monday, but it went under the tree.  I fired it up today. It works fine with my AW 18650, but I only tried one of my AW 18650's so far, and it has a nipple, it's not the old flat-top ones. 

I love the H60. The UI works great. I love how you can click for high, press and hold for low. You can click through high, med, low, or hold for low, medium, high. Then a double click in any mode lets you toggle between super low / low, medium low / medium, high / burst. Good stuff.


----------



## WadeF

It's a shame we don't have a topic about this light in the main LED forum. The Zebralight is so much more than just a headlamp and it is a LED light. The H60, due to it's size, can be held in hand and the button operated with your thump. It's very comfortable to use this way. It's also great to just tail stand it, or use it with the available clip. It can be used so many ways and a headlamp is just one of them.


----------



## JetskiMark

Thanks to this thread I just ordered an H60 from 4Sevens.

I have ordered from David before and have always been satisfied. If it ships Saturday, I might have it by Tuesday.

Just what I need, another light.

I can hardly wait. At least I have a Lunasol 20 to console me until the H60 arrives.


----------



## socalrunner

Has anyone tried the Zebralights as a bike helmet light.. Could you use velcro straps through the silicone grippers and create a good helmet light? How stable is the H60 when running, any issues with it moving?

Thanks..


----------



## notnormal

socalrunner said:


> Has anyone tried the Zebralights as a bike helmet light.. Could you use velcro straps through the silicone grippers and create a good helmet light? How stable is the H60 when running, any issues with it moving?
> 
> Thanks..



I use the H50 and now the H60 as a helmet light for off-road mtbiking. I zip tie the silicone holder to the front of my helmet, and have no problems with movement. On the top of my helmet are flashlights.

The pairing of a spot beam (flashlight) with a flood beam (H50 or H60) on the helmet is great!


----------



## socalrunner

do you think you could you use velcro to mount the H60 on the helmet? what is the runtime using 18650's?


----------



## notnormal

socalrunner said:


> do you think you could you use velcro to mount the H60 on the helmet? what is the runtime using 18650's?



Yes velcro can be used to mount the H60 on the helmet. Just loop the velcro through the strap holes and the helmet ventilation holes for a secure fit.

Runtimes:
High: *190** lm (2 hrs) or *110* lm (4 hrs)
Med: *45* lm (10 hrs) or *15* lm (50 hrs)
Low: *0.5* lm (26 days) or *3* lm (9 days)


* Can only be used in 10 minute bursts.


----------



## socalrunner

that is great.. I am thinking of ordering a h30 for running and h60 for bike riding.. How long does it take for shipping from Zebra direct to USA?


----------



## JetskiMark

I would suggest 4sevens.com which is in the US. They are a CPF authorized dealer. They ship fast, have excellent customer service and a good reputation here at CPF. Use code CPF8 to receive 8% off of you order. I am not affiliated with them. I am just a satisfied customer who recently ordered from them again. 

They shipped my H60 today. I can hardly wait.


----------



## Yucca Patrol

My dear wife who is always making fun of me for "reading about lumens" on the internet finally "got it" tonight when she borrowed my H60 to go out and look for tiny miniature daffodil leaves poking up from the lawn where she planted them earlier this fall. 

She was amazed at the incredibly bright flood beam which allowed her to pick out the shadows of these tiny leaves that don't look much different from the grass they are growing out of. In bright daylight, she was able to find a few of these, but the perfect flood beam of the H60 made it possible for her to easily pick them out all over the lawn.

She was so impressed that she gave me permission to replace my lost/misplaced H50. . . .


----------



## ScubaSnyder

Still debating on this light, I think it would get way to hot if you were using it in the field.


----------



## StandardBattery

Well I bit the bullet and ordered the light, thinking I would sell the Charger and Batteries. Turns out the charger is so small and is all self contained that I decided I like it for a travel charger. I did not test it yet to see how well it actually charges. Although it would have been nice to have a cheaper price on the light from 47s, the Charger/Batteries are nice even though I didn't really ever want to own those batteries. 

*The Light* is quite nice; bigger than the other models obviously, but a very nice size for an 18650 based light. Since it's output is angled, it would have been nice if there was a squared off side on the back of the head for anti-roll and to allow the light to be layed down and used for ceiling bounce. 

*The UI* is interesting, but I need to use it more. The light does get quite warm, even in Med mode. It's maybe a little big for some as a headlamp, but it makes a great carry light off the headband, either in the hand or clipped to a pocket with the clip for really easy hands free illumination with no head gear. Anodizing looks great, lock-out is great. 

*The Beam* is absolutely fabulous! Reminds me of when I saw the H50 for the first time; I was in awe! It can produce such a wonderful illumination with a real ambient light feel that it just seems so natural. It really is amazing.

Maybe Fenix should try to by Zebra? They need some new product, and it must be hard for Zebra to make a go of it with their limited line-up. However, they would have to let the Zebra team do their thing... no interference; Zebra knows what they are doing.

*Love it! Highly Recommend It!*


----------



## Yucca Patrol

StandardBattery said:


> Maybe Fenix should try to by Zebra? They need some new product, and it must be hard for Zebra to make a go of it with their limited line-up. However, they would have to let the Zebra team do their thing... no interference; Zebra knows what they are doing.



If Fenix (or Zebralight) were _really smart_, they'd produce a similar headlamp with two emitters. One with the zebralight flood beam and the second with a reflector for some throw. I imagine something like a combination of an H50 and an L2D as a single unit. Such a headlamp would blow away everything on the market except for the expensive custom-built caving headlamps.


----------



## LightObsession

Yucca Patrol said:


> If Fenix (or Zebralight) were _really smart_, they'd produce a similar headlamp with two emitters. One with the zebralight flood beam and the second with a reflector for some throw. I imagine something like a combination of an H50 and an L2D as a single unit. Such a headlamp would blow away everything on the market except for the expensive custom-built caving headlamps.



That light would get my attention.


----------



## jzmtl

Yucca Patrol said:


> If Fenix (or Zebralight) were _really smart_, they'd produce a similar headlamp with two emitters. One with the zebralight flood beam and the second with a reflector for some throw. I imagine something like a combination of an H50 and an L2D as a single unit. Such a headlamp would blow away everything on the market except for the expensive custom-built caving headlamps.



You would lose the compactness thou, which is part of the attraction of zebralights.


----------



## jzmtl

Quick question for those of you bought H60 from FS, are the bundled tenergy 18650 protected, and how long does it take for the charger to fully charge an empty cell (or both)?


----------



## Shorty66

what would really blow away the zebralights would be a clip-on aspherical lens for enormous throw while preserving everything else the zebralight is. Make the clip on lens retractable while being clipped to the light and you get something quite similar to the petzl Tikka XP but brighter and nicer.

I am already considering a mod with an asph. lens...


----------



## StandardBattery

jzmtl said:


> Quick question for those of you bought H60 from FS, are the bundled tenergy 18650 protected, and how long does it take for the charger to fully charge an empty cell (or both)?



The Batteries are Tenergy Protected cells rated at 2600mAh (fairly flat top).

Sorry I have not tested the charger yet.
On the Charger is says output is: 4.2V @ 600mA

The Box package says; Digital Camera Battery: 3.6/3.7V 2Hrs , 7.2V 2Hrs, High Cap 2.5Hrs. and Camcorder Battery High Cap 4Hrs.

The instructions say output 4.2-8.4V @600mA Charging time 2-6Hrs.

It looks like a generic charger that can be adjusted for different applications at the factory.

The bottom line is 600mA, and I'm guessing that means 2 cells take 2 twice as long as 1 cell, but I have not been able to measure if a single cell is charged at 300mA or the full 600mA.


----------



## Yucca Patrol

jzmtl said:


> Quick question for those of you bought H60 from FS, are the bundled tenergy 18650 protected, and how long does it take for the charger to fully charge an empty cell (or both)?



The included charger puts out 500mA. Depending on state of charge, expect 3-5 hours. 

The included batteries are protected.


----------



## jzmtl

Thanks! So figures 4 hours each cell, not as quick as I'd like, but not too bad I suppose. I'll have to give it some more thoughts before getting one from FS.


----------



## Hondo

The charger is parallel, or single channel, meaning it will charge two cells at half the rate of one. Also be careful about putting highly mis-matched cells on it together, as the higher voltage one will discharge into the lower voltage one until they are matched (checked this out with a meter). Not a disaster or anything, but unnecessary wear and tear on the higher voltage cell. The DSD chargers work the same way, BTW.


Edit: I am not going crazy (well, at least not with regard to this question), I thought I had forgot to hit post earlier when I answered this question. You asked this earlier in the MP, jzmtl, and asked again here after I answered! :whoopin: Go easy on me, it does not take much to convince me I am losing it!


----------



## jzmtl

Sorry!  I posted in MP first then posted here too (actually did it before you answered, looks like time here and MP is not synced) to get answer quicker, since I literally had it in my cart and was going to hit the submit button. 

Thanks again, I'm going to order one and jump into the 18650 pile.


----------



## Hondo

No problem, I was just begging for mercy as I am easily confused :duh2:! Not surprised that the post times got buggered up, I should have known better.

I think you will really like the H60, I was blown away, and I already have the H50 and H30. The only drawback relative to those, obviously, is that it weighs more, so with the single headband I would not want to try to use it while jogging, as it would tend to bounce down into your eyes. No problem other than that.

One other thing to note, since this is your first 18650 light, is that the Tenergy batteries, being protected, i.e. having the contact strip down the side, can be a tight fit in the tube. I have been using many unprotected 18650's salvaged from laptop packs, so this was a non-issue for me. If it appears that the battery will jam tight, as in not be able to be extracted, there is the option of re-covering it. The shrink wrap is thicker than packing tape, and you can cut and peel it off, and re-wrap it in packing tape. Not as pretty, but it will fit a bit smaller tube that way.


----------



## jzmtl

That's good to know. My previous headlight is an Apex that weights three times as much, so I think H60 should feel quite light. Ordered it yesterday so should have it in a week or two.


----------



## Shorty66

if you wan to go jogging with the h60 i would do the wiremod to the silicone holder i did to mine. That way its really hard to get the light bouncing.

In the mean time i did some other mods to my h60:






As you can see, i added a pocketclip to the front of the headband holder. That way i got some more options to use the light. i didnt like the process of switching from headband to pocketclip. this way i got a one fits all solution and its glow in the dark.
I shortend the headband to the exact lenght i use because i never wanted to chenge the fitting lenght on any other headlamp. That way i saved the second plastik buckle und reduced the packing size alot.
What you wont be able to see is, that i added three small but stron neodym magnets to the headband. they sit between the to ends of the band and are capable of holdng the whole light if clipped to a plain metal surface.
Im planning to add two other magnets of bigger size (2X20mm), one to the batterycap of the h60 and one to the silicone headbandholder. With the magnet on the holder i am able to wind the headband up and fix it between the magnets inside the headband and the one on the holder. 

Another mod i am planning to do is to add an addon asph.lens to the h60 in form of a part of a plastiktube to slip over the top. Im currently wating for the lens though...

Bye, christian

Ps: the whole lamp with headband,magnets,battery and pocketclip now weights 104g. Pretty light for all that stuff :-D


----------



## jzmtl

Let us know how the lens work out, sounds interesting.


----------



## StandardBattery

Wow Shorty, you're Mr. Mod man on that light. They all sound good. I'm scared of those small magnets that are showing up a lot as I'm sure if they get any where near a credit card it's toast. So i keep them on my fridge.

I really like the idea of adding the clip to the headband holder so you don't have to change holders for a clip. That's what I think I would like, if I could easily just remove the head-band as well. I have to study your wire mod, that looks very interesting and a big improvement.


----------



## JJV

I just got mine yesterday and as others have mentioned the battery is one tight fit. In fact I could not remove it. And I shook this thing pretty hard to dislodge it. 

Anyone have this same experience? Any helpful hints? It doesn't seem to me that the emitter end comes off, so I can't just push it out. 

Thanks.


----------



## Shorty66

i got no problems diameter-wise. Mine is only tight if you are trying to fit protectet cells which are a bit longer than unprotected ones. I have to squeeze the spring alot to get electrical contact then.
You should try some other cells. I am using trustfire 2500mah protected ones.


----------



## Hondo

For a moderately stuck battery, holding it tightly in your fist while slamming your fist on the edge of a table can work, i.e. stop the light fast and let the battery carry on out of the tube. If that is not enough, you could try to fix something to the end of the tube that would be able to be tapped directly on a hard surface, ideally a piece of plastic pipe the same inside diameter as the light tube. You might be able to fake that with a couple of popsicle sticks lap joined over one another (hot glue or whatever), so you can hold the outer stick along side the tube, and have the inner stick butting end on with the end of the battery tube. Do that on each side of the light and tap the ends of the inner sticks on a hard surface. Usually in that kind of scenario I would be looking for the right size socket in my socket set, but the wall of this light is so thin, I doubt that I could get that to work.


----------



## JJV

Hondo said:


> For a moderately stuck battery, holding it tightly in your fist while slamming your fist on the edge of a table can work, i.e. stop the light fast and let the battery carry on out of the tube. If that is not enough, you could try to fix something to the end of the tube that would be able to be tapped directly on a hard surface, ideally a piece of plastic pipe the same inside diameter as the light tube. You might be able to fake that with a couple of popsicle sticks lap joined over one another (hot glue or whatever), so you can hold the outer stick along side the tube, and have the inner stick butting end on with the end of the battery tube. Do that on each side of the light and tap the ends of the inner sticks on a hard surface. Usually in that kind of scenario I would be looking for the right size socket in my socket set, but the wall of this light is so thin, I doubt that I could get that to work.


 
My kids were asleep last night when I tried to get it out, so banging on the table was not an option but I know what you mean so I will give that a whirl. Ironically something else you said hit home-hot glue. I wonder if I can hot-glue something like nylon cord and give it a yank. I can see that failing miserably though. It's an option though-I just need the end of the battery to come out juuust a little so I can grab it with pliers or something. 

I was trying to take them out because the batteries were not fully charged, but I wanted to try the darn thing out. They're my first rechargeables :huh:


----------



## Hondo

JJV said:


> Ironically something else you said hit home-hot glue. I wonder if I can hot-glue something like nylon cord and give it a yank. I can see that failing miserably though. It's an option though-I just need the end of the battery to come out juuust a little so I can grab it with pliers or something.


 

Good idea, only try hot gluing the neg. end of a AA battery to your 18650, for more bond area!


----------



## JJV

Hondo said:


> Good idea, only try hot gluing the neg. end of a AA battery to your 18650, for more bond area!


 
Hondo, great idea-thanks!


----------



## Yucca Patrol

The protected Tenergy batteries that came with my kit from 7777 are a tight fit, but they still slide out. You'd think that flashlight manufacturers would take into consideration our desire to use protected batteries and give us an extra millimeter or so to ensure that our batteries don't get stuck in there


----------



## JJV

Yucca Patrol said:


> The protected Tenergy batteries that came with my kit from 7777 are a tight fit, but they still slide out. You'd think that flashlight manufacturers would take into consideration our desire to use protected batteries and give us an extra millimeter or so to ensure that our batteries don't get stuck in there


 
Agreed. I ordered a Raidfire Spear as well and the 18650 fits in there perfectly-just a little play; plenty of room for the protected cell. It's strange to me that a light that is designed to run on 18650s (the H60) doesn't have wiggle room for protected cells.


----------



## JetskiMark

Same story here.

I have a bunch of 1/4 inch cube neodymium magnets that I bought to make charge leads. I just put 8 together arranged 2 x 4 and the cell pulls right out. I also have a bunch of 1/4 x 1/16 round neo mags and they were too weak to pull it out.

A mechanics magnet MIGHT work. You should be able to get one at any auto parts or home improvement store. Maybe they have a neodymium version. 



JJV said:


> I just got mine yesterday and as others have mentioned the battery is one tight fit. In fact I could not remove it. And I shook this thing pretty hard to dislodge it.
> 
> Anyone have this same experience? Any helpful hints? It doesn't seem to me that the emitter end comes off, so I can't just push it out.
> 
> Thanks.


----------



## pobox1475

> I quickly realized that my H50 is now quite obsolete, except for the fact that it can run AA's


 I have been wanting a Zebra for many months now and initially waited for the H60. Now I'm not so sure :thinking:. I generally intend to use it as a utility light of sorts for close up work. I assume the H50 with it's floodier beam would better suit my needs, right?


----------



## JetskiMark

The H60 has a very floody beam.

From from a distance of 12 inches, the circle is 22 inches in diameter. And it is completely smooth and artifact free.

By the way, my AW 18650s slide in with room to spare. I feel that the batteries and charger from 4sevens are a good value though. Even though you have to use a magnet to remove the cells.


----------



## pobox1475

^ Would you consider the H60 to be the best value (cost/performance) and all-around light in the Zebralight line up?


----------



## JetskiMark

The price of any light is usually at the bottom of my list so I won't comment on value.

This is my first Zebralight.

The lowest low and the highest high combined with the capacity of an 18650 are what sold me.

I really like the UI too. Very nice to be able to start from low or high and have six levels.

I just clipped it to the front of my belt and took a walk and this thing rocks.

It is perfect for reading too.

The only thing I would change are the holders. It takes a few seconds to insert or remove. It should just clip in from the front. While there is no chance of it falling out of the holder, it does rotate easier than I would prefer. It does not seem to rotate by itself though. That is the only negative I see and it is very minor.


----------



## JJV

Update-I took Hondo's advice and held the body in my hand while banging my fist on a table. It took 5 whacks but it came out enough for me to grab and pull out. As long as I don't make it a habit, I think I can live with that method. 

Thanks everyone!


----------



## Yucca Patrol

pobox1475 said:


> ^ Would you consider the H60 to be the best value (cost/performance) and all-around light in the Zebralight line up?



Definitely. With the lowest low mode and the highest high mode, it has the widest range of performance. And the 18650 battery really gives it some serious runtime.

I'm amazed at how well I can read at night at the very lowest setting, and my wife appreciates that I can read without my light disturbing her in the least.

However, I also really like my H50, and wouldn't give it up since I am a big fan of the AA battery since it is universally available and I sometimes find myself in places where recharging an odd lithium battery is not really convenient.


----------



## pobox1475

Thanks for the input guys. I'm  now. With my last order to Lighthound I got a AW 18650 protected for future use. The future *is *now .


----------



## Jesseri

I just got mine today. Since i already have H30 i was expecting good and versatile light that does its job as promised and and i wasn't wrong. It's even better than i thought. UI is just great and 18650 batteries gives much better runtime than r123/cr123 in H30. 

IMO Only one minor flaw is too loose holders as JetskiMark mentioned already. I mostly use the h30 with the pocket clip holder (and now H60 also) and i would like it to be adjustable vertically. I have already designed a tilting pocket clip holder for H30 and i'm going to send drawings to my machinist friend. I hope he is willing to do a prototype for me. 

I think it's better than H30 in every other aspect than its size. But i'm not going to loose my H30 either.


----------



## Glock27

pobox1475 said:


> ^ Would you consider the H60 to be the best value (cost/performance) and all-around light in the Zebralight line up?


I'd have to say the H50 for a general work light. I've been using my H50 for work the last week. Cost is lower especially if you already have AA's and a charger. 
G27


----------



## LESLIEx317537

4sevens said:


> All H60 orders come standard with two 2600mah protected 18650's with a dual bay charger. Some have asked if we will sell the H60 without the chargers and the answer is no, not at this point in time


Does the H60 still come with the two batteries and dual bay charger?
I don't see anything on the product page that says so. Thinking about getting one if they come with the batteries and charger.


----------



## JJV

LESLIEx317537 said:


> Does the H60 still come with the two batteries and dual bay charger?
> I don't see anything on the product page that says so. Thinking about getting one if they come with the batteries and charger.


 
Yes it does. I just got mine this week and all of that is included.


----------



## [email protected]

LESLIEx317537 said:


> Does the H60 still come with the two batteries and dual bay charger?
> I don't see anything on the product page that says so. Thinking about getting one if they come with the batteries and charger.



It does come with the two 18650s and the battery charger. I forgot to update the product listing to reflect that! 

Sorry for any confusion!


----------



## 4sevens

LESLIEx317537 said:


> Does the H60 still come with the two batteries and dual bay charger?
> I don't see anything on the product page that says so. Thinking about getting one if they come with the batteries and charger.


Peter tried to post but was not able to from his account :thinking:

Yes, the H60's from us always come with two protected high capacity 18650's and a compact dual bay charger


----------



## Yucca Patrol

The fenix-store package with batteries and charger makes for one heck of a good deal!

Thanks 7777!


I had previously been worried about transitioning to rechargeable lithium batteries, but the H60 has gotten me hooked and I'm switching over a lot of my lights to run rechargeables now.


----------



## HanzoTheFlashlight

I've boarded the Zebra train!!! Thanks to all for the great reviews and mod ideas. 

Also to 4 7's for the great package combo!:devil: One hot deal! :devil:Can't wait.


----------



## lightburns

Hello,I can't find the H60 on the Fenix store website ? Is it somewhere else that you can find the 4Sevens H60 battery+charger bundle ?Thank You


----------



## lightburns

OK I found it !Must be that big link on the homepage ? Sorry but I did not see it at all first visit.Thank You Cathastrophix


----------



## CathastrophiX

https://www.4sevens.com/product_info.php?products_id=622


----------



## Shorty66

petzl just agreed to send me a Zipka headband for free. I think i will receive it tomorrow.

Im really excited to test this with the h60....

Just another mod:







Makes the pocketclip much more compact


----------



## Paul

That's a really clever mod shorty66! And please post pictures of the H60 with the Petzl headband 

Btw, are you still thinking about doing a snap-on lens mod? If it works that would make the H60 perfect for close to any situation.

For those who has bought the 4sevens H60-deal:
Does the charger have a round grounding plug or not?
would the charger work on a 240V power network or just on 120V?


----------



## 4sevens

Paul said:


> That's a really clever mod shorty66! And please post pictures of the H60 with the Petzl headband
> 
> Btw, are you still thinking about doing a snap-on lens mod? If it works that would make the H60 perfect for close to any situation.
> 
> For those who has bought the 4sevens H60-deal:
> Does the charger have a round grounding plug or not?
> would the charger work on a 240V power network or just on 120V?



It does not have a ground plug.
The charger specs in the back shows 100v-240v


----------



## Shorty66

I am still planning to add an asph. lens. The lens is ordered but it takes a while to ship from china.
I dropped the idea of making it snap on. I want to make the lens retractable as seen on the tikka xp with the diffuser.
Im still unsure in which way i am going to add the zipka headband. Hopefully we'll see tomorrow.


----------



## Shorty66

Finally the zipkastyle headband for the h60 is finished.
I simply took the winding mechanism of the zipkaband, and screwed a Plastik tubeclip to it. That way the mechanism is fixed to the lamp and the only moving part is the retractable cord. This minimizes volume and the whole lamp is easily pocketable.


















Its a real breeze to wear - a little more bouncing than with my wiremodand the original headband but less bounsing than without the wiremod.
The headband can work as an anti-roll device for ceiling bounce configuration.

The weight came down to 95g including battery(47g),pocketclip and zipkastyle headband (12g).


----------



## jzmtl

As it turned out, fenix store forgot to send me the 18650s and charger with my H60, and they are out of stock right now so they can't send any either. 

I dropped in a LiFePO4 123a in there together with a wad of aluminum foil and it seems to work lol. Haven't got the hang of level switching yet, it seems to jump all over the place.

Okay something weird is going on with my UI. When the light is on, and I hold the button to cycle modes, if it's in low or medium, it'll go through low-med-hi on the first time, but only med-hi after if I kept the button held. If it's in high and I hold button, it'll only go through med-hi without ever going in low. However, this only happens if low is set to 3, if set to 0.5 everything works fine. Is it only mine act like this?


----------



## Jesseri

jzmtl, I tried that and UI indeed started to act crazy. I almost thought now the light is gone bad, because it didn't want to go high anymore and the light was switching itself off when button was released. I removed and inserted the same battery couple times and UI was still acting crazy. 
Then I swapped the fresh battey and everything normalized again. With the fresh battery UI doesn't go awry at all. 

I measured the voltage from removed battery and it was only 3.05V. 

It seems that the light starts acting crazy when battery voltage is low enough and modes are cycled as jzmtl describes.


----------



## CathastrophiX

What batteries are you using in your H60's?
I have tried 8 different Trust- and Ultrafire protected ones (2400-2500 mAH, grey and blue ones) and only one of them is short enough.
I had to put a thin copper wire around the circuit board in the bottom to make contact with the other seven.
I wish they made the battery tube 1 mm longer so protected batteries would fit. In mine the battery must be shorter than 67 mm to work.


----------



## WadeF

jzmtl said:


> I dropped in a LiFePO4 123a in there together with a wad of aluminum foil and it seems to work lol.



This might be your problem. :laughing:

I haven't run my 18650 down enough to see what happens at low voltage.


----------



## jzmtl

Yeah maybe, hehe, just got an email from fenix store that 18650 is backordered till next week so looks like I won't find out for at least two more weeks.

Zebralight website did say it can use LiFePO4 chemistry thou. I know I can't go on 190 lumen because the voltage from 123a sag too much and the light shuts down, but that doesn't explain strange UI behavior, unless the light isn't actually designed to use LiFePO4. I'll see when I get 18650.


----------



## Jesseri

I'm using AW batteries. Those tenergy batteries which came with the H60 from 4sevens were too tight fit. 



CathastrophiX said:


> What batteries are you using in your H60's?
> I have tried 8 different Trust- and Ultrafire protected ones (2400-2500 mAH, grey and blue ones) and only one of them is short enough.
> I had to put a thin copper wire around the circuit board in the bottom to make contact with the other seven.
> I wish they made the battery tube 1 mm longer so protected batteries would fit. In mine the battery must be shorter than 67 mm to work.


----------



## CathastrophiX

I think something is wrong with mine. Most of the time it's reliable but I can't really trust it.
- Cycling trough modes have different patterns sometimes just like others have mentioned.
- Sometimes it only comes on in low, I can't change modes, and I have to take out the batteries to shut it of.
- When in "110" mode, it sometimes just shuts of after a couple of minutes.
- Sometimes flickers in 0.5 and 3 lumens mode.
- Sometimes it doesn't light up, unless I remove and install the battery again.
- Sometimes it lights up and shuts down immediately again.

Tonight I was out in -23°C, and it was not fun having to constantly fiddle with it to have light....

My H30 always works as it's supposed to.


----------



## Jesseri

CathastrophiX, does that happen with fresh batteries also or just with the partially depleted batteries?. 

I haven't had such a problems with my H60, touch wood. It was a first time my H60 went bezerk when i tried to cycle modes as jzmtl described and happened to have depleted battery in it. This clearly needs further investigation. I'm going to hook H60 to my PSU and trying to find the voltage when it starts to act crazy.


----------



## CathastrophiX

No, the battery went from 4,11 to 3,85 volts during the time i was out.
Tried some more now (charged battery), and it works better but not perfect when warm, seems it doesn't like cold temperatures?
I have ordered AW batteries, and if it still behaves the same with them, I will return it.
By the way, the holder is not very good, is it? The holes are too big compared to the lamp body and the material is too soft.
The holder for the H30 works better.


----------



## Jesseri

It seems like you've got a bad one. Couple days ago it was -26°C and H60 worked just fine. I was doing a brake repair with my friend to his rally car and H60 worked just great the whole time. 

I've only used the pocket clip holder so i don't know if other holders are any better. It is indeed too loose.


----------



## 43X16

Very informative thread. Is it comfortable for extended use? Thanks.


----------



## CathastrophiX

This evening it is only -5° C, and my H60 has worked perfect.
Seems like it (or the battery) didn't like colder temperatures (i hope).
I put o-rings around mine, touching the holder loops, so now, thanks to the added friction, it stays in adjusted mode.

I think the light would sit more still if the loops were placed further apart.
I will try to put the headband trough o-rings and then put them around the light via the slots in the holder.
It would sit more steady with a band across the top of the head also.
(It is steady enough for walking and cross-country skiing but not for say running)

Enough ranting:
The mode levels, output, beamprofile, run time and build quality are perfect.
Overall this is an excellent headlamp if you like 18650 batteries.
If you wan't an very small, lightweight light, and don't mind the lesser output and shorter runtime, get the H30 instead (or both! :twothumbs)


----------



## jzmtl

CathastrophiX said:


> This evening it is only -5° C, and my H60 has worked perfect.
> Seems like it (or the battery) didn't like colder temperatures (i hope).
> I put o-rings around mine, touching the holder loops, so now, thanks to the added friction, it stays in adjusted mode.



I think the temperature is it, your 18650's voltage must've dipped enough to trigger the erratic behavior we found earlier. I was out a few days ago when it's -30°C and almost everything craps out after a few minutes, only primary lithium works.


----------



## cchurchi

CathastrophiX said:


> I think something is wrong with mine. Most of the time it's reliable but I can't really trust it.
> - Cycling trough modes have different patterns sometimes just like others have mentioned.
> - Sometimes it only comes on in low, I can't change modes, and I have to take out the batteries to shut it of.
> - When in "110" mode, it sometimes just shuts of after a couple of minutes.
> - Sometimes flickers in 0.5 and 3 lumens mode.
> - Sometimes it doesn't light up, unless I remove and install the battery again.
> - Sometimes it lights up and shuts down immediately again.
> 
> Tonight I was out in -23°C, and it was not fun having to constantly fiddle with it to have light....
> 
> My H30 always works as it's supposed to.


 
I have experianced all of these problems with my H60. I have completely given up using protected 18650's because I have killed a Wolf-Eyes protected 18650 as well as one of the Tenergy 18650's supplied with the light because I really have to crush them with the end cap to get them to light up. The tube is just too short...

Now I am running an unprotected IMR18650. These are safe chemistry batteries and they are shorter and slimmer and I haven't had any problems after switching to this battery type. The H60 now performs like it was meant to.


----------



## cchurchi

jzmtl said:


> I think the temperature is it, your 18650's voltage must've dipped enough to trigger the erratic behavior we found earlier. I was out a few days ago when it's -30°C and almost everything craps out after a few minutes, only primary lithium works.


 

I don't believe low temperature was the cause of the problems described above. My H60 was doing the exact same things at room temp. I think the end cap was smashing the protection circuit, causing the odd behavior.


----------



## YourTime

That's exactly what my one does too. You have to twist all the way and I felt like it's going to crush the driver and or battery. I hope they will figure out to fix the tail cap soon.


----------



## Yucca Patrol

Although they fit somewhat tight, my protected Tenergy batteries fit perfectly with no tailcap issues. . .


----------



## JetskiMark

Yucca Patrol said:


> Although they fit somewhat tight, my protected Tenergy batteries fit perfectly with no tailcap issues. . .



Same here. I am very pleased with mine.

The only minor issue (as previously mentioned) is that the silicone holders should have a slightly smaller I.D.


----------



## lyyyghtmaster

I guess this answers my questions. I'll go with the IMR cells then. Thanks!


----------



## CPFMan

cchurchi said:


> Now I am running an unprotected IMR18650. These are safe chemistry batteries and they are shorter and slimmer and I haven't had any problems after switching to this battery type. The H60 now performs like it was meant to.




Sorry for being ignorant but I have a few questions regarding the unprotected IMR18650:

1) How can you tell if the cells are depleted without over discharging it? Any visual clues?

2) When charging the batteries, how can you tell if it's done without overcharging it?

3) How does it compare to the protected 18650 cells? Run time, weight, and lumens.

Thanks


----------



## Hondo

The first question is the toughest. If you always run at low levels, you could be open to over-discharging the cell. But a good way to check once you suspect that the cell may be low is to switch to 190 lumens, where a weak cell won't be able to give full output. This should be noticable before the cell is low enough to be damaged, but still has an element of subjectivity to it. Having a good feel for your usage, or until then just checking periodically for cell voltage, and charging early is the best course I can recommend. It's what I do with all of my mostly unprotected Li-Ions.

The second question is easy, it is no different than a protected cell when charging. Your charger should terminate no later than 4.2 volts. The safety net for a failed charger is not there, but you should never rely on a protection circuit for charge termination.

As far as the final question, I am not positive, but I think most protected cells are the same as the unprotected ones, plus the circuit on the end, so no other difference. Since most lights they are used in are designed for two CR123's or a 17670, the 18650 is already a couple of mm shorter, and adding the protection circuit on the end can make up for that. The H60 appears to be somewhat of an exception to that trend, though, as it obviously runs tight with the protected cells.


----------



## ZebraLight

The over-discharging protection circuit in the H60 will cutoff the battery connection when the voltage drops below 2.8V, even when the light is in the lowest low mode (0.5lm/26days).


----------



## Yucca Patrol

CPFMan said:


> Sorry for being ignorant but I have a few questions regarding the unprotected IMR18650:
> 
> 1) How can you tell if the cells are depleted without over discharging it? Any visual clues?
> 
> 2) When charging the batteries, how can you tell if it's done without overcharging it?
> 
> 3) How does it compare to the protected 18650 cells? Run time, weight, and lumens.
> 
> Thanks



1) the visual cue to tell if cells are depleted is on the display of your digital multi-meter. Anyone using unprotected cells should invest in one of these for their safety.

2) see #1

3) someone else can answer this better since I have not bought those IMR cells


----------



## CPFMan

I got it. Thanks guys. :thumbsup:


----------



## ichoderso

CPFMan said:


> Sorry for being ignorant but I have a few questions regarding the unprotected IMR18650:
> 
> 1) How can you tell if the cells are depleted without over discharging it? Any visual clues?
> 
> 2) When charging the batteries, how can you tell if it's done without overcharging it?
> 
> 3) How does it compare to the protected 18650 cells? Run time, weight, and lumens.
> 
> Thanks




3. weight and lumens the same how other 18650 cells (maybe some gramms more or less than other batteries)
The capacity is 1600mAh from this IMR cells, so the runtime is a bit shorter than with "normal" 18650 batteries, the most have around 2000-2200mAh.
I would say, around 20-25% shorter runtime!

Jens


----------



## jzmtl

Finally got my 18650, charged them and dropped in H60.

Operation is still very finicky, if I hold to try to get low mode, half the time it either start as low but jump to high as soon as I release the button, or briefly flash high then go back to low, or somehow jump to medium. Not sure if it's a button contact problem or UI problem. Not very happy about it, but I'll use it a bit more then decide if it's a keeper.

Oh yes, the tenergy 18650 is a bit tight but comes out easily if I bang it on my hand. However to my suprise after reading all the post about it, it's not too long at all, tailcap goes back on easily.


----------



## CathastrophiX

Remove the tailcap and use a piece of wire between the battery and tube instead. 
See if you still have the problem then.


----------



## lyyyghtmaster

I was having unpredictable operation on a LiFePO4 cell when using max output. Then my AW protected 18650s came in and the problem disappeared!  So it was just the too-low-voltage-under-load of the 3.2V cell causing the problems. Also this cell had a very short run time on 110lm even, let alone 180.

Wednesday I accidentally ran one AW cell till the light's undervolt protection cut out. I had been meaning NOT do do this, as 2.8V is presumably too low to achieve long lifespan from a 3.7V Li-ion.:mecry: But on the job, it's not always easy to keep track of how many hours of use I've racked up, nor to put a meter on it regularly. (Did I mention I EDC a multimeter?) But then, that's why I would never use a Li-ion light that didn't offer any sort of protection at all, so I am thankful for it... BUT...

Why did they set the cutoff so stupidly low if the operation on a LiFePO4 is so marginal anyway??? IMHO they should have set it to something a bit higher and just given up the near-useless-anyway ability to use the 3.0 - 3.2 volt cells. AAAAARRRRRRGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!! (no, I'm not a pirate, just *very* annoyed!)

OR, (complicated) they could have given the user the ability to program in a cutout level somehow. Like 2.8V or 3.2V for example. It probably would have required some complicated button-push sequence, like say, up-up-down-down-left-right-left-right-b-a or something like that so it wouldn't accidentally get set from normal light usage.

Oh, well, it's still a great light!!! I did the spring mod right out of the box; absolutely ZERO problems with cell length from then on. I'll probably still do the headband mod to get rid of the bulky buckle and cinch the strap up closer to the body for less bobble when moving around. The much longer run time than H50 and narrower beam are both very useful for my job, as I no longer have to change the cell anywhere near as often.

Compared to H50, I now notice the edge of the beam a lot more. It's on the verge of being too narrow for the wide-beam class of headlamp, without actually crossing that line. More than twice the effective brightness on the task with the same power usage more than makes up for the beam edges being more visible. Also, there is now much less "intensity surging" when rapidly approaching or backing away from a surface.

One other thing I noticed is that most of those nice 'heat sink' fins don't really do that much. Nearly all the heat is released from the head itself and the first few ribs, with the body tube being too thin to conduct very much heat at all towards the tailcap end of the light. Nonetheless, on 110lm this light gets less warm than the H50 did on 66lm, so it's not a problem in my book!

Overall, I'm glad I bought this light, and I expect it to serve me very well! That beautiful floody beam just can't be beat for anything within about 20 feet navigation/ 3 feet working type conditions. (Though I don't own the H30, it and the H501 promises to be very similar in many of these respects too, I might add!)


----------



## Croyde

I received my H60 earlier this week and it seems to be working just fine with AW 18650 cells.


----------



## CathastrophiX

lyyyghtmaster said:


> I did the spring mod right out of the box; absolutely ZERO problems with cell length from then on.


 
Good! One other advantage is that the wear on the pcb is greatly reduced.


----------



## AvPD

I wonder if Zebralight will drop the price like they did with the H30. The current price is just too much especially after currency conversion

Would also like to know how it performs in warm/hot temperatures.


----------



## jzmtl

What's hot to you, southern u.s. (~40°C) hot or dubai (~50°C) hot?


----------



## pobox1475

Location: Adelaide, Australia

*Down Under* hot :laughing:


----------



## AvPD

jzmtl said:


> What's hot to you, southern u.s. (~40°C) hot or dubai (~50°C) hot?


Thankfully we don't get temperatures over 45°C so it would be southern US hot. Further inland, however, that changes.
Nighttime temperatures of 30-35°C is what I would hope it could cope with, although as this has modes I'm sure it could simply be used on low.


----------



## jzmtl

Worst I've been in is 42°C or so with extremely high humidity, it's actually not that bad if you've lived there for a few years. 

I think it should be fine, also consider how close it's to your forehead, you'd feel uncomfortable before it reaches temperature that'll damage the LED.


----------



## EngrPaul

Is this a good light or not?


----------



## concept0

EngrPaul said:


> Is this a good light or not?


 
What do you care? Only the H501 comes in neutral white (Q3-5A)! And from what I understand, zebras are some of the most difficult lights to mod...


----------



## Shorty66

I am very confident with the H60.
I like the long runtime and the many light levels to choose from - its about as heavy as a tikka xp (both with batteries). I am looking forward to get my h501 warm tint though, as it is much lighter, smaller and more EDC suitable.
If i get my h501 i think i will use the h60 around the house or while working in badly lit areas and carry the h501 as EDC.


----------



## jtrucktools34

I don't mean to sound stupid here but I am new to all of this. Will the H60 run on 2 CR123's? or is the output voltage too low? I realize the runtime will probably stink but I have an abundance of 123's on hand an no 18650's as of yet. Also, I have been using a Streamlight Argo which has a reflector and can be positioned to aim down in front of me while working with my hands would this light be a good replacement? I would appreciate any advice!

Thanks in advance
:shrug:


----------



## PhantomPhoton

jtrucktools34 said:


> I don't mean to sound stupid here but I am new to all of this. Will the H60 run on 2 CR123's? or is the output voltage too low? I realize the runtime will probably stink but I have an abundance of 123's on hand an no 18650's as of yet. Also, I have been using a Streamlight Argo which has a reflector and can be positioned to aim down in front of me while working with my hands would this light be a good replacement? I would appreciate any advice!
> 
> Thanks in advance
> :shrug:



No, 2 CR123 cells will blow out the drive circuit on the H60. 2 CR123 cells fresh will be a bit over 6V. An 18650 cell runs 4.2V maximum (hot off the charger), 3.7V average. But 18650s are well worth it provided you use and charge them properly.


----------



## Linger

Jtrucktools - no, it will not work on 2xcr123's (adding two cells ups the voltage):welcome:

I don't have one (yet) but all reviews are that zebra lights are amazing at providing flood lighting.


----------



## jtrucktools34

WOW! Quick response!

Now I really feel stupid! Obviously a lot to learn!! Thanks for the help. Everything I am reading points me to AW cells and a Pila charger. 4sevens sells the H60 with rechargables but they do not state which batteries they sell with the light. I have read on this post that some protected cells may not fit in the H60. What would be the best way to "break into" the rechargables? I have a Jet-IIIM that I could use the 18650's in as well and have an M1x on order.

Again, THANKS MUCH!


----------



## pobox1475

> Everything I am reading points me to AW cells and a Pila charger.


 I'd say you _hit the nail on the head_ with this. I use mine weekly to top of the protected in my NEX and am looking forward to getting a light to use the AW 18650 I got Lighthound for future use. Maybe a 

 EagleTac T10L ? Any opinions on that one?


----------



## StandardBattery

** Delete **


----------



## Theatre Booth Guy

Up until Monday, I've been VERY happy with my H60. It's been perfect for reading in bed without waking my wife. The angle head works a little better than a regular "ceiling bounce" to light a room.

On Monday, we lost half the power to the house. Since it's cold in Michigan still, it seemed like a good plan to switch some circuits around in the breaker panel to gets things working that we need (like the furnace). First light I grabbed to see in the panel was my H60. Set to medium, it worked perfectly on a shelf shining into the panel and even better held horizontally in my mouth! Unfortunately, the light went out halfway through the job. Thinking it was just an empty battery, I swapped to the spare and still had no light. After charging both cells, neither make the light turn on.

I'll be sending my H60 back to China for a repair or exchange. It's going to be interesting to see how good their customer service is.


----------



## Shorty66

How old was your h60? 
Mine still works like the first day, even though it has seen some serious drops, dust and water...


----------



## Theatre Booth Guy

Shorty66 said:


> How old was your h60?
> Mine still works like the first day, even though it has seen some serious drops, dust and water...



I had pre-ordered the H60. Mine was slow to ship and arrived a couple weeks after the people here got theirs. Mine was babied - never dropped, barely used on the regular high (less than 10 seconds on the highest high). I mostly used it for reading in bed on low to not wake my wife.

Between the angle head, flood beam and low, low, Zebralight really has a unique product.


----------



## Changchung

Theatre Booth Guy said:


> I had pre-ordered the H60. Mine was slow to ship and arrived a couple weeks after the people here got theirs. Mine was babied - never dropped, barely used on the regular high (less than 10 seconds on the highest high). I mostly used it for reading in bed on low to not wake my wife.
> 
> Between the angle head, flood beam and low, low, Zebralight really has a unique product.



Hi, I just order mine from Ebay from china, were you get yours? I hope do not have problems with mine...:candle:


----------



## Glock27

Heard from Lillian today. Bummer on the wait for a warm H60. 
G27
​_We are still waiting for the warm white LED's from our Cree distributor. 
We were told it will be at least 2-3 weeks. 
_


----------



## PhantomPhoton

Glock27 said:


> Heard from Lillian today. Bummer on the wait for a warm H60.
> G27
> ​_We are still waiting for the warm white LED's from our Cree distributor.
> We were told it will be at least 2-3 weeks.
> _





:mecry:

Hmmmm sounds like either Cree needs to increase production, or Zebralight needs a new distributor.


----------



## moonfish

I just ponied up for one of these lights. 

It seems annoying that the beam is just a little too narrow to cover my whole field of vision. 

The light wiggles around in the holder. 

I like the UI. I've been playing with it and I haven't read the book yet. 

Last night I think the battery ran down on me and it's the first charge of a new battery so I don't know exactly what to expect. I didn't expect it to go from one click high to OFF after 30 seconds or so and it did it repeatedly. Is that the battery protection kicking in? Is it the light's protection kicking in? Low still worked fine but going from high to low doesn't leave me seeing anything, no less it just shutting completely off.


----------



## WadeF

Moonfish, what battery are you using? Brand, type, etc. Did you fully charge it before using it? Were you able to confirm it took a full charge with a multi-meter?


----------



## moonfish

I was using the Tenergy that came with the light from 4-7's. No idea about whether it was fresh charged or not. Is that how they normally behave when the battery gets low?


----------



## Glock27

moonfish said:


> No idea about whether it was fresh charged or not. Is that how they normally behave when the battery gets low?


Yes it is. You NEED a volt meter to care for your cells.
G27


----------



## AvPD

Deleted


----------



## litetube

Hey Theatre and Moonfish, any updates on your H60 problems?


----------



## Changchung

I just receive mine... I like it... :thumbsup:


----------



## albert

I ordered a H60 on Sunday (30 May) and it arrived on Tuesday (2 June). Talk about efficiency of their service, rated two thumbs UP!


----------



## AvPD

Invested in a H60w, any lingering doubts about going with the Q3-5A were erased as soon as I switched it on (although Selfbuilt's thread helped). I think I will convert all my torches to similar tints in the future if the opportunity presents itself.
The headband seems to suffer from a lack of attention, the silicone bracket isn't that comfortable for long-term use compared to plastic ones (perhaps the design could be revised so that the headband runs behind the bracket) and the H60 is a little weighty for it not to have a band that runs over the top of your head for extra support.

The switch appears to be a little bit sensitive and can switch itself on. Also, I haven't even had it 12 hours so I may get used to it but if you don't get the timing right when switching it off it can cycle to low.

There is no substitute for a proper Zebralight, I've used a Romisen RC-N3 as a makeshift solution but it suffers from either a short runtime or being mounted on the side of your head.

Update: the jump from 90 lumens (close to the H501) to 156 lumens seems like a minor one but that's due to the eyes detecting brightness on a logarithmic scale or whatever. Added an extra strap and it's definitely more secure on the head.


----------



## pteam

I bought 2 h60 zebralights about a month ago and one of them stopped working. There is nothing visually I can see wrong with the contacts or the led itself. Anybody have suggestions? How would I get it warrantied with them being overseas? Is there anything I can try myself to get it working? Its brand new... I have put 5 different batteries in it (trustfire protected 2400 and 2500mah 18650's) none work so it is not the battery. I did get the light to come on for a split second one time...


----------



## SilentK

AvPD said:


> Invested in a H60w, any lingering doubts about going with the Q3-5A were erased as soon as I switched it on (although Selfbuilt's thread helped). I think I will convert all my torches to similar tints in the future if the opportunity presents itself.
> The headband seems to suffer from a lack of attention, the silicone bracket isn't that comfortable for long-term use compared to plastic ones (perhaps the design could be revised so that the headband runs behind the bracket) and the H60 is a little weighty for it not to have a band that runs over the top of your head for extra support.
> 
> The switch appears to be a little bit sensitive and can switch itself on. Also, I haven't even had it 12 hours so I may get used to it but if you don't get the timing right when switching it off it can cycle to low.
> 
> There is no substitute for a proper Zebralight, I've used a Romisen RC-N3 as a makeshift solution but it suffers from either a short runtime or being mounted on the side of your head.
> 
> Update: the jump from 90 lumens (close to the H501) to 156 lumens seems like a minor one but that's due to the eyes detecting brightness on a logarithmic scale or whatever. Added an extra strap and it's definitely more secure on the head.



Ah, how do you like it compared to your h501? i am on a light spree this month and i was thinkiing about getting a h60w. do you think it was worth it?


----------



## AvPD

SilentK said:


> Ah, how do you like it compared to your h501? i am on a light spree this month and i was thinkiing about getting a h60w. do you think it was worth it?



(original message wiped after going back a page)
I don't own a H501, I looked at the website for the output (80 lumens).

Due to their expense I only intend to get one Zebralight (although a price drop on the H501 might persuade me). The brackets are hard to get on and off due to the ridges so you wouldn't want to change back and forth from the pocket clip too often (not something I would use much anyway).
The H501 is probably their flagship product but the H60w can run at 90 lumens for 4 hours and has another level of brightness above that so I don't regret going for the H60w.

Maybe someone on the H501 thread can compare 80 vs 90 lumens.


----------



## kwarwick

Just received my h60w direct from Zebralight. Unfortunately it appears to be DOA . Won't work with a known good protected and unprotected 18650 cell. Now I guess I have to deal with Zebralight to get this replaced. For a $80 light I expect a little better quality control.


----------



## Changchung

kwarwick said:


> Just received my h60w direct from Zebralight. Unfortunately it appears to be DOA . Won't work with a known good protected and unprotected 18650 cell. Now I guess I have to deal with Zebralight to get this replaced. For a $80 light I expect a little better quality control.



So sad my friend... I think is a good light but almost no quality control... :shakehead


----------



## StandardBattery

In case no one has reported it yet. The H60w works perfectly with the new AW 2600mAh 18650. Slides in and out perfectly. 

I was a bit surprised as the battery is tight in my TK11 (at least one of them).


----------



## BirdofPrey

Just got my 60w. Love it. Haven't gotten to do anything but go out and play with it thus far but hopefully next week I'll get to take it for a hike. I love the tint. I've never had an LED that gives that comfortable warm glow before.

I was not expecting much "throw" but was really surprised by how much it does reach out.


----------



## PhantomPhoton

StandardBattery said:


> In case no one has reported it yet. The H60w works perfectly with the new AW 2600mAh 18650. Slides in and out perfectly.
> 
> I was a bit surprised as the battery is tight in my TK11 (at least one of them).



Just what I wanted to hear. Thanks! :twothumbs


----------



## Croyde

That is good to know about the new AW cells. I think that I will have to order a few of them now.


----------



## kwarwick

Changchung said:


> So sad my friend... I think is a good light but almost no quality control... :shakehead



Well a replacement H60w is on the way to me, courtesy of George at ZebraLight. :goodjob:
I'm looking forward to having my faith in Zebralight restored.


----------



## ToTo

Has the h60 any problems with water leak?


----------



## kwieto

ToTo said:


> Has the h60 any problems with water leak?



Yes.
Same as H30, H50, and others...


----------



## Yucca Patrol

deleted duplicate post


----------



## Yucca Patrol

ToTo said:


> Has the h60 any problems with water leak?



Yes, mine took on water through the switch when held under a slow running faucet to clean it after caving. I "fixed" it by removing the switch and running two batteries through it on the high mode to cook all of the water out.

This is what it looked like when I discovered the condensation the day after cleaning it:







If only they made an 18650 version that used the much more waterproof twisty instead of the cute little silicone switch.


----------



## pobox1475

> Yes, mine took on water through the switch when held under a slow running faucet to clean it after caving. I "fixed" it by removing the switch and running two batteries through it on the high mode to cook all of the water out.


 :shakehead... I was looking forward to getting one for night fishing. If it is not sealed then it is of no use to me.


----------



## SilentK

i still cant get over how lucky i am to have a rare waterproof zebralight. :nana: as a matter of fact, i lubed it up today, filled my sink up, and let her sit in the water to get rid of the excess lube on the exterior of the body.


----------



## kwieto

Sometimes you see that the light leaked after a day or two after you put it into the water.

I tested H50 in a glass of water and it seemed to be OK. But the day after, when I was replacing the battery I found the water drops inside the tube (which was clean stright after the bath).
It took some time for the water to move from the leaking head through the circuits to the battery copartment.

The light was still working normally, but for how long?


----------



## Yucca Patrol

kwieto said:


> Sometimes you see that the light leaked after a day or two after you put it into the water.



That's exactly how I discovered it too. Good thing I checked it before storing it away with the rest of my caving gear. 

I'd send my leaky H60 back to them, but they currently have my dead H50 in the repair queue.:sick2:

Nonetheless, I still like these lights, but won't bet my life on them in the caves, but of course I typically have about 10 lights with me while caving. . .


----------



## kwieto

Yucca Patrol said:


> Nonetheless, I still like these lights, but won't bet my life on them in the caves,



Yes I also like the concept, athough I still have a Myo XP and (more recently) Mammut X-zoom as the "main" light sources.

H60 is for the cooking on the camp site or reading in a tent, so I don't need high water resistance in it.
But from the other hand - if you are buying something, you expect that it will meet its own specifications. I prefer to know if the light is waterproof or not, just to be not badly surprised "in the middle of nowhere".


----------



## Martin

ToTo said:


> Has the h60 any problems with water leak?


+1. Brand new light, less than a minute in the sink, barely submerged.
Later I found small drops of water forming between the silvery reflector ring and the body. They were gone when I took the photo:






I've reported the issue to ZL, hopefully they know a fix.

One other issue I found is that the components on the PCB are visible when looking inside the battery tube.
Is it the same on other people's H60s ?
I feel there should be at least an adhesive washer to cover the PCB (minus the positive battery contact in the center).

Update:
ZL customer service quickly responded:
It is normal that the electronics are visible.
The leakage is not normal and I was asked to send the light back for repair, now on the way.


----------



## AvPD

I would never intentionally dunk mine, just in case things like the above take place. The only issue I've had is that it sometimes turns itself back on (maybe 1 out of 10 times) between 0 and 5 seconds after being switched off. I haven't been able to reproduce it on cue so I'm still not sure if it's due to movement or the circuitry.


----------



## pobox1475

> Just received my h60w direct from Zebralight. Unfortunately it appears to be DOA


 Wow, that sucks :thumbsdow. I have been holding off getting mine even though I have a brand new AW protected ready to go. Good luck with their resolution.

Ooops. Some how an earlier post from June was the last entry visible. Hope all is well now Kwarwick .


----------



## Yucca Patrol

It seems that not only is quality control inconsistent, but so too is their customer service.

Some here report that they contacted ZL and had replacements shipped to the right away. I've been waiting over a month now since sending my defective H50 to them and haven't heard a word back.

I'd like to send in my leaky H60 pictured above, but it still works and I need something to read at night with until my H50 comes back (if it ever does).

Hopefully ZL will find a way to make a headlamp that can at least handle being cleaned with water, or perhaps some other company will copy the basic design but make it rugged and waterproof.


----------



## pobox1475

> It seems that not only is quality control inconsistent, but so too is their customer service.


 Exactly why I will probably spend a few bucks more to get 4Sevens outstanding service.


----------



## Yucca Patrol

pobox1475 said:


> Exactly why I will probably spend a few bucks more to get 4Sevens outstanding service.



Just so you know. . . . I bought both of my defective Zebralights from 4-Sevens. But that's no strike against them since all they do is send the light back to Zebralight for warranty repairs/replacement. 4-Sevens isn't going to just take a defective light back and send you a replacement immediately. But I do think that 4-Sevens customer service would be much quicker with their own lights than with other manufacturers' lights.

When I get my H50 back, I will contact ZL directly since that will probably end up being quicker than sending it to 4-Sevens to have them send it to ZL.


----------



## wapkil

Yucca Patrol said:


> Just so you know. . . . I bought both of my defective Zebralights from 4-Sevens. But that's no strike against them since all they do is send the light back to Zebralight for warranty repairs/replacement. 4-Sevens isn't going to just take a defective light back and send you a replacement immediately. But I do think that 4-Sevens customer service would be much quicker with their own lights than with other manufacturers' lights.
> 
> When I get my H50 back, I will contact ZL directly since that will probably end up being quicker than sending it to 4-Sevens to have them send it to ZL.



There is a thread in the Café that ended with the discussion of a similar situation.

I don't want to defend ZebraLight (their lights obviously shouldn't leak) but I don't think you can complain about their customer service. If you sent the light to 4sevens, you used 4sevens' CS. What happened after that depends on the actions and relations between the two businesses (4sevens and ZebraLight) and I think we don't really know anything about it.


----------



## pteam

I have bought 3 zebralight h60, theyre most expensive one. 2 of the 3 have stopped working within 2 months, been waiting over a month for them to get fixed. Just as others have stated above quality control is bad.


----------



## DaFABRICATA

pteam said:


> I have bought 3 zebralight h60, theyre most expensive one. 2 of the 3 have stopped working within 2 months, been waiting over a month for them to get fixed. Just as others have stated above quality control is bad.


 



Well thats not good to hear....I just bought an H60W and an H30.

Hopefully I won't have any issues.


----------



## tankahn

I couldn't set the memory of my new H50W. It always start at the highest level even afer exiting at the lowest dim mode. Any similar experiences and can I fix it?



DaFABRICATA said:


> Well thats not good to hear....I just bought an H60W and an H30.
> 
> Hopefully I won't have any issues.


----------



## wapkil

tankahn said:


> I couldn't set the memory of my new H50W. It always start at the highest level even afer exiting at the lowest dim mode. Any similar experiences and can I fix it?



Do you mean H501w? It doesn't have the memory. If you click the button, it will start on high, if you press and hold, it will start on low.


----------



## ErickThakrar

If someone were to make a replacement button retaining ring for the H60, I'm 99% certain that would fix the issue. The current one is simply too thin and appears to warp when tightened down. A ring/button guard made from a heavier gauge of stainless steel should fix the problem immediately.


----------



## tankahn

wapkil said:


> Do you mean H501w? It doesn't have the memory. If you click the button, it will start on high, if you press and hold, it will start on low.



Oops! I mean the H60W. I got the same reply from their customer service.




> There is no memory function in the H60 or any other current ZebraLight
> headlamps.
> Lillian Xu



But light-reviews.com seems to indicate there is some kind of memory function but of very limited use. 



> The H60 does memorize your choice of regular or alternate levels even after the light is switched off.



Anyway its a shame. I keep blinding myself and those around me each time I turned it back on.
Had to cover the lens first and cycle to dim. Poor marks for that.


----------



## wapkil

tankahn said:


> Oops! I mean the H60W. I got the same reply from their customer service.
> 
> But light-reviews.com seems to indicate there is some kind of memory function but of very limited use.
> 
> Anyway its a shame. I keep blinding myself and those around me each time I turned it back on.Had to cover the lens first and cycle to dim. Poor marks for that.



It has another type of memory - it memorizes which of the two selectable levels you set for Lo and Med. 

I still don't understand what is the problem that makes you blind yourself. If you press *and hold* the button, it will start on low...


----------



## DaFABRICATA

Just got my H60W and H30 in the mail today!

All I can say is WOW!! 

Very Cool lights!

Now the wait for darkness begins.

The tint of the H60W is excellent and the output seems great!

Now the H30 just need to have the Q5 replaced with a Q3-5A..luckily I have one for it already.

Has anyone done any runtime test to verify the runtime claims on either light?


----------



## gsxrac

Well 12 pages later im almost wishing I hadnt ordered an H60. SO many problems. And for the money you spend you dont want to get a POS light and especially when you consider that a lot of headlamp users RELY on their headlamps (Cavers, Night bikers, Etc.) And if you drop it in a puddle it should be perfectly fine. You shouldnt have to worry about water droplets apearing a couple days down the road. Not to mention I ordered 4 days ago direct from ZL and my package JUST shipped today. Thank god its EMS because I hate having to wait for internet purchases.


----------



## pobox1475

I have been waiting for the dust to settle on all the issues. Pretty much decided to go with the 501 as my first ZL and use the 18650 I got in a new DBS V3.


----------



## mdocod

Reading this thread leads me to believe that the H60 is unfortunately not something that can be trusted at this time....

I'm searching for an 18650 powered headlamp option for my neighbor who does a ton of backpacking and uses a headlamp for 3-4 hours per day while doing it. 

Looks like the only option is going to be a hand-held and a strap of sorts to get what we want.


----------



## pobox1475

^ One of the smaller ZL's might suffice and will be more comfortable for extended wear. Supplement that with a long distance light like a DBS (18650) and bases should be covered.


----------



## jahxman

I got a H60w which only seems to want to work with 17670 batteries, it won't work with any 18650 batteries that I've tried in it - the only thing I can figure is that the 18650 is just a little bit longer than the 17670s that I have.

Anyone else have this issue and solved it, or do I need to contact ZL? It does work fine on the 17670 but I'd like the longer runtime...and for it to work as it is supposed to....


----------



## fareast

For a while now I have wanted to try a Zebralight but I never got around to it. The one that most interested me was the H30 but it is just not available with a 5A tint. So I opted for the H60w. Like most people here I read all the posts and got a bit worried about it's quality. Of course, good CS is great but I am one of those who would rather not deal with CS at all, _ever_! I am looking forward to the first company which doesn't have a CS because there's no need for it. 

Still though, I wanted to try the light and just ordered it a few weeks ago. As everyone has said about the Zebra's, they rock for their intended purpose and I fully agree. _Anyone_ could use one of these! I have not had any issues with it at all. Mine is apparently very watertight but then again I am using a different switch boot (a taller one) and added an o-ring to the retaining ring. Around the circumference I have glued a piece of self adhesive velcro so turning in the supplied holders is only done deliberately. Still though, the accessories are chunky so make your own tight holders as many have done already. For walks I just put it in the 5th jeans pocket and it sticks out enough to light my path. 

Does anyone have issues with a Zebralight they purchased _*recently*_?

edit: alright then, the top part (head/switch part) on the back, has a spot with non-removable stains. An example of bad anodising? Oh well...


----------



## AvPD

Finally tested my H60W on a camping trip, lanterns have become secondary. I should note that I added a strap that goes over the top of the head (should come like this from the factory). With the 5A there's no issues with the colour rendition. Using the default second-to-highest mode drained my first battery pretty quickly, after that I used the medium and low modes. The runtime was long enough that I didn't need to change to a third battery (maybe approaching 10 hours of usage). The third-to-highest mode is bright enough for pretty much any task like collecting firewood or cooking.
Unlike my last trip where I relied upon a LED torch with a diffuser and a cheap dim LED headlamp for illumination, I didn't need general illumination from a lantern except maybe for comfort (when it didn't attract bugs). The runtime of the H60 helps because you can have it on for the whole night if you need to, not something that every headlamp is capable of.

The main annoyance is switching modes, it requires precise timing and if you get it wrong you have to start over again, which is not the most endearing quality if you're often switching from off to one of the five non-default modes. One saving grace is that it remembers which low or medium mode you used last. The fast 'double click' while on the go and switching to low are the most error-prone operations. 

Apart from that it's the only real headlamp as far as I'm concerned, and in combination with a LED lantern saves having to lug around heavy gas lantern equipment and paying extortionate prices to refill gas bottles.


----------



## CathastrophiX

Now it been almost a year since I bought my H60 and H30's, they all work flawlessly (The H60 has worked perfectly since I shortened the spring). I and my family use them almost daily now, since it's getting dark here again. These headlamps rock!
@AvPD -have you tried another battery?
If the voltage goes to low you can get weird effects on the modes.


----------



## AvPD

CathastrophiX said:


> @AvPD -have you tried another battery?
> If the voltage goes to low you can get weird effects on the modes.



Not sure what you're talking about specifically, but I am aware that the ZL will turn itself off when the battery runs low, but will still work for a while on lower modes.

Just trying to relate the experience of using it as my only source of illumination, sort of like a shake-down cruise.


----------



## Martin

Martin said:


> +1. Brand new light, less than a minute in the sink, barely submerged.
> Later I found small drops of water forming between the silvery reflector ring and the body. They were gone when I took the photo:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I've reported the issue to ZL, hopefully they know a fix.
> 
> One other issue I found is that the components on the PCB are visible when looking inside the battery tube.
> Is it the same on other people's H60s ?
> I feel there should be at least an adhesive washer to cover the PCB (minus the positive battery contact in the center).
> 
> Update:
> ZL customer service quickly responded:
> It is normal that the electronics are visible.
> The leakage is not normal and I was asked to send the light back for repair, now on the way.



Today I received it back. It's a different unit where the rubber cap over the switch is now held in place by a press-fit ring, not by a washer that's bolted down.
The light passed the sink-test nicely, no water showed up behind the lens or in the battery tube.
However, 4 hours later, it started to behave funny: It cycled thru modes in a random pattern and could only be stopped by unscrewing the tail cap. Meanwhile it refuses to turn on. I thought that water might still have gotten inside and be causing some random connection on the circuit board, but drying it didn't help so far.
The battery is not the problem, tried a different one and also tried the batteries in another light where they work OK.
So this will need to go back again. Given other user's experience, I don't feel like an H60 will ever be reliable, so need to decide if I ask for an H50 or for a refund.


----------



## one2tim

I'm recieving my h60w and h30 next week, cross my fingers they aint faulty.


----------



## Martin

The more thoroughly you test them, the higher the chance they are...


----------



## Martin

Zebralight support was great and I've now received the 2nd replacement (my third H60). All replacements were the newer models and don't look like they would leak. Photos:











Unfortunately, these newer designs still lack reliability. I submerged them 3cm deep in the sink and had them run for an hour, then took them out and played with them, randomly pressing the button. Sooner or later they both got into a mode where they cycle through 3 levels of brightness continuously, no way to stop it except disconnecting the battery. A few minutes after that, the lights went dead. The first replacement has recovered after about a week of resting, but randomly playing with the button produced the same effects as before and the light went dead a second time. Again a week of resting and it's working again. The second replacement that went dead about 4 days ago has not yet come back to life. When that one still worked, it showed another strange effect: On high level (default high, not turbo), the light would flicker. Not on any other level.
I understand that Zebralight support has done their best to sort this out, but what can they do if the product is weak by design. I think I like to return the H60s and be refunded.


----------



## pobox1475

> Zebralight support has done their best to sort this out, but what can they do if the product is weak by design.


 :thumbsdow :shakehead


----------



## AvPD

“The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results” - Albert Einstein


----------



## DaFABRICATA

That sucks!
I have had zero problems with my H30W and 2 x H30's
I also don't put them in water to test them out. I figure if I get cought in heavy rain or something like that, only then will I see how well the water tightness is.....AND I will have back up lights in case they do malfunction.

I got my Dad an H30 for his birthday and he went swimming in the pool with it and he had it malfuntion and cycle through the levels like you explained...He opened it up, stuck it in front of a fan and it worked correctly after drying out.
He called me before going in the pool with it and asked if it was a good idea, as it states being waterproof on the box....I warned him and said others have had problems and if he doesn't absolutely NEED to get it submerged, Don't!
Of course he didn't listen.

I'm just glad he learned his lesson and his light is working again.:shrug:


----------



## Owen

Well that sucks that you're having continuing problems, Martin. I'd hoped these were more isolated incidents, especially since I recommend Zebralights to people after having such good experiences with all three of mine, and even posted a reply to another thread earlier tonight bragging on their quality. 
My H60W is a pretty recent purchase, but must be the older model, having the smooth boot and retaining ring that screws down. It has had no problems after maybe 30 hours of use, several of those hours in pouring rain, and getting rinsed and rubbed under running water every night since it gets stuff that is similar to wet salt splattered and sometimes crusted on it. 
I haven't done an extended submersion test, though. Guess I figure if the light is on my head, it's not going to be submerged for any length of time. Or if it is, the well-being of my headlamp isn't going to be high on my list of concerns!
In spite of being the cheapest lights I use, I consider my Zebralights perhaps the best and most useful ones. It's disappointing to read about the issues some of you have had, and are still having, with these lights


----------



## pobox1475

> He opened it up, stuck it in front of a fan and it worked correctly after drying out.


 Just don't ever use heat, especially a blow dryer. It will cook the innards as the water once vaporized into steam will not be able to exit fast enough. Sold cell phones for a while and saw many that tried this and made their situations worse.



> several of those hours in pouring rain, and getting rinsed and rubbed under running water every night


 Rain, splashing and rinse is whole different animal than submersion. The added pressure of the water _all around_ will find ways to get in on a light not designed well for this sort of environment.


----------



## Martin

ZL customer service just informed me that for the last few weeks, their QA did a multi-day submersion test on 100% of the H60 and H501 production.
They found 1% leaking and are working to eliminate this.

Yes, 1%. This is how many ppm ?

Now I bet everyone wants to know how to identify a light that has undergone and passed this test


----------



## Owen

Martin said:


> Now I bet everyone wants to know how to identify a light that has undergone and passed this test


They'll be the ones that are dry inside? 
I'm just curious about where it's getting in.

Can't tell you how glad I am to hear that Zebralight is doing this testing. Really reinforces my confidence in them as a manufacturer.


----------



## Martin

Owen said:


> They'll be the ones that are dry inside?
> I'm just curious about where it's getting in.
> 
> Can't tell you how glad I am to hear that Zebralight is doing this testing. Really reinforces my confidence in them as a manufacturer.



Confidence ?
Imagine you're standing at the end of a production line, testing 100% of the output. Your test rejects 10000ppm. Knowing that typical reject rate should be <200ppm, how do you feel about the products that you pass ? Could there be lights that just make it past the final 100% test but already leak a little bit and so will fail later ? Do you think your output would be better quality if your input was 200ppm instead of 10000ppm ?

Now if I was the production manager and had lots of rejected lights building up, that would be a problem for me. But I know a trick: I'll be drying all the rejects and pass them through the test AGAIN. A very substantial percentage will now pass. Whatever passes the test, can't be bad. Right ? Those that fail a second time go for rework. If I'm short on repairers, I'll not hesitate to dry and test again - and again - until PASS.

Bottom line: A 100% test doesn't boost the quality of the lights. The test is there to monitor quality and trigger a corrective action if needed. Now in this case the test has been highlighting an issue that persisted for "the last few weeks". Looks like it's meant to stay around.:naughty:


----------



## davidt1

I found a picture of my ZL light going through a dunk test a while back. I put it in a glass of water for 2 hours. It passed. The majority of the lights are good. There are a lot of silent happy users out there.


----------



## Owen

Martin said:


> Confidence ?
> Imagine you're standing at the end of a production line, testing 100% of the output. Your test rejects 10000ppm. Knowing that typical reject rate should be <200ppm, how do you feel about the products that you pass ? Could there be lights that just make it past the final 100% test but already leak a little bit and so will fail later ? Do you think your output would be better quality if your input was 200ppm instead of 10000ppm ?
> 
> Now if I was the production manager and had lots of rejected lights building up, that would be a problem for me. But I know a trick: I'll be drying all the rejects and pass them through the test AGAIN. A very substantial percentage will now pass. Whatever passes the test, can't be bad. Right ? Those that fail a second time go for rework. If I'm short on repairers, I'll not hesitate to dry and test again - and again - until PASS.
> 
> Bottom line: A 100% test doesn't boost the quality of the lights. The test is there to monitor quality and trigger a corrective action if needed. Now in this case the test has been highlighting an issue that persisted for "the last few weeks". Looks like it's meant to stay around.:naughty:



I've done QC for a living, in a job where the QC department controlled production firsthand. I don't have to imagine, because I've had final say on what ships and what doesn't, and have turned down hundreds of thousands of dollars in product. We still had some products, even closely monitored and heavily tested specialty runs of custom powder coat that would be returned by customers, because it's not a perfect world, and there's no such thing as 100%. 

Yes, it reinforces my confidence in Zebralight *as a company* that they are actively testing their product. Why wouldn't it? How else do you expect them to find the problem units so they can discover the source of that problem when it is only occasionally evident? You obviously have no idea what a pain in the *** that is. 
That extra effort indicates a company who cares about their product, their reputation, their longevity, and their customers. Sure, it's necessary. It's not what you would expect from most overseas manufacturers, though, and I challenge you to name one company on this planet who produces any product in bulk and is testing entire production runs.


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## one2tim

why do you keep putting your light in the sink? its not a diving light and with normal use it will never be submerged in water for an hour, and if that should be the case id worry more about you own health then the light.


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## Martin

one2tim said:


> why do you keep putting your light in the sink? its not a diving light and with normal use it will never be submerged in water for an hour, and if that should be the case id worry more about you own health then the light.


I found that a light that's not sealed to withstand a 1" / 1h dunk, WILL get wet inside when using it outdoors. Think of the tropics, an environment where hour-long downpours don't stop one from going outside. Give it time and water will get in if not properly sealed.
Submersion happens too: With a light strapped on top of a dry bag, water accumulates in the folds of the bag and that's where the light rests. I do take a headlamp on dive trips, not down with me but the boat is still a wet environment where a light easily comes to rest in the bilge water. When climbing a waterfall I usually take a dry bag so I can take shortcuts on the way down. If the light is not inside the bag, it gets wet too.
And don't we all put lights into the washing machine now and then ? Makes sense to get lights that are properly sealed.


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## evgeniy

Zebralight 501 have this problem ?



Martin said:


> +1. Brand new light, less than a minute in the sink, barely submerged.
> Later I found small drops of water forming between the silvery reflector ring and the body. They were gone when I took the photo:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I've reported the issue to ZL, hopefully they know a fix.
> 
> One other issue I found is that the components on the PCB are visible when looking inside the battery tube.
> Is it the same on other people's H60s ?
> I feel there should be at least an adhesive washer to cover the PCB (minus the positive battery contact in the center).
> 
> Update:
> ZL customer service quickly responded:
> It is normal that the electronics are visible.
> The leakage is not normal and I was asked to send the light back for repair, now on the way.


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## elfen1

I've sent out around 5 H60's for new ones and they all would work fine for a day or so, when I would remove the battery and reinstall poof they were dead. So yesterday I got a new H60 model show in the previous post. Looked longer so I emailed zebralight... Looks like it will finally work with protected cells, and stay working. I believe The pressure of the protected cell was damaging the micro-controller.

yes, it's a revised version of the H60. It's internal size in increased about 1.5mm in length so that it can take protected cells up to 68mm. We have to use the switch cap design of the H501/H501R in order to maintain the overall dimensions of the original H60.
Best regards, 

Lillian Xu
ZebraLight


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## ToTo

is it possible to use the light with a spacer and a CR123?
or would the voltage be to low?
and hows about RCR123?


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## gsxrac

I just purchased an H30 for a friend since I liked my H60 so much. I will be testing the H60 out in the shower tonight. Since I do tend to work in wet environments and would like to know if I can trust this thing. Also it seems all the new lights will be coming from Tecas from now on? I ordered from ZL direct and received the H30 in about 3 days with standard shipping? Just wonsering are the H30's any more waterproof?

Edit: Sadly I have to report a non-water-resistant H60. It spent 60 seconds inder the shower faucet and another 60 in a small cup of water. Switch leaked and it is now cycling through modes and switching unreliably. Contacted ZL and hopefully they can fix the problem.


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## fareast

ToTo said:


> is it possible to use the light with a spacer and a CR123?
> or would the voltage be to low?
> and hows about RCR123?




a CR123 cell with spacers does work but only the lower 3 levels will light up. There's not enough power for the higher three. 

an RCR will do just fine since it is basically the same as the 18650 cell but with a smaller capacity. 

Just get the correct spacers.


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## kilimats

Back from the dead

I am about to purchase a H60w Headlamp Neutral White

a year has passed, has the manufacture figure the leak out yet?

I was also wondering if they cover shipping cost when returning the light under warranty


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## Changchung

kilimats said:


> Back from the dead
> 
> I am about to purchase a H60w Headlamp Neutral White
> 
> a year has passed, has the manufacture figure the leak out yet?
> 
> I was also wondering if they cover shipping cost when returning the light under warranty



I am not sure... But their had one mine, maybe their cover, at least inside of USA were the shipping cost is very low...


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## nanotech17

oh no.i just ordered one


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## Changchung

nanotech17 said:


> oh no.i just ordered one



You dont have to worry about it, Zebralight is a very good headlamp...


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## nanotech17

i emailed them right after i went through this thread and this is the reply that i got :-

Hi nanotech17,

Do you want to cancel the order? H60w does not support CR123.
It doesn't have leakage issue. Please let us know. We will hold your
package until your confirmation.

Sincerely,

Lillian Xu
ZebraLight, Inc.
8320 Sterling Street
Irving, TX 75063


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## nanotech17

got mine today,so useful to me,this is my back up edc.
built quality is superb ( at least to me )


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## moonfish

I love my h60. I've had it for about two years? 

I never put it on the shower or in a cup of water. It's been in rain though. 

It's a beast of a headlamp. And the UI is wonderful. Battery life is great. I've used blue protected trustfires in her and recently some AW protected. I didn't realize they don't work. 

When it dies, I'll buy another. I think I'll make some sort of kydex holder for it so I can use it with a real headband when I get bored this winter.


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