# Surefire ARC1 & ARC2



## Bushman5 (Feb 10, 2009)

saw these in the catalog. 2000 lumens in a small EDC sized flashlight for the ARC1. Same for the Arc2, but it has 2800 lumen then a 5000 lumen momentary mode.

does'nt say what batteries though? any idea on price and who carries them? this is more my style of an EDC light (lumens output wise) than my current 120 lumen Surefire "matchstick" 

EDIT: sorry, just noticed it uses 12 CR123s. Any thoughts on modding it battery wise?


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## Guy's Dropper (Feb 10, 2009)

Does it use the battery to charge some capacitor or something?


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## Monkiee (Feb 10, 2009)

I believe there are going to be 3 Arcs, 2 of which are going to use primaries and 1 are going to be rechargeable. 
I am just reading in the catalog, these are not set in stone.
The Arc1 (2,000 lumens) is going to hold 12 SFcr123as and burn time is about 1 hour.
The Arc1R (rechargeable) is slightly longer but will burn for about 2 hours with batteries fully charged in less than 1 hour O_O
The Arc2 is also rechargeable and will burn about 1 hour.

Also i wouldn't say that it would be an EDC light. The length of the Arcs are all about the same length as a Surefire M4. The body is also as thick as an M6 with a 3.5-3.75 inch bezel. IMO i would classify this as a searchlight.

Also to add I've heard a rumor from Shot Show 2008 that it might run about 1k. Pretty steep but at least less than SF Beast.
Surefire is really horrible at setting a time to release products, so it might not even come out this year


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## Bushman5 (Feb 10, 2009)

i'm down for a rechargable is this is the case! I was going to buy a Microfire Warrior but if Surefire is making HID lights i might wait. I need one for a night security gig at a festival in May.


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## Tempest UK (Feb 11, 2009)

As Monkiee said, there are three models:

ARC-1 (primaries, 2,000 lumens)
ARC-1R (rechargeable, 2,000 lumens)
ARC-2 (rechargeable, 2,800/5,000 lumens)

I wouldn't call any of them "EDC" size, either. Also keep in mind that the ARC lights have been floating around as vaporware for a while now...

Regards,
Tempest


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## monkeyboy (Feb 11, 2009)

I believe that the 5000lm mode on the ARC-2 is in fact a continuous mode. It's thermally managed though meaning it throttles down if things get too hot.


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## Patriot (Feb 11, 2009)

I also would not consider any of them to be EDC's. I know that's a broad terminology but if it can't fit comfortably in a person's pocket while at work or play, I don't consider it EDC. Every day pack carry, or vehicle carry are different categories imo. 

In another thread below, someone has suggest a msrp of $1500 which would put it 300% more expensive than the K3500 but probably 300% the quality and performance too. Unfortunately I just can't see SF offering a variable output, 5000 lumen HID for $1500. My guess it that it will cost substantially more which of course makes the Polarion X1 shout "me, buy me!" There will always be the "gotta have" SF collectors who choose the ARC but I guess we'll just have to wait and see. 

SF told a CPFer in the other thread that they plan on shipping them the last week in Feb. Either the dealers are acting really dumb and pretending not to know anything or I'd say that date isn't realistic at all.


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## 65535 (Feb 11, 2009)

I think the Arcs will be competitive with the imported 35/50W big dollar lights like Polarian. They have been in catalogs for over a year now I would imagine that they are working around a price point rather than just building it and pricing it what they have to to make the profit they want. The Beast is there HID light and it's $4-6000 I'm guessing these will fall far cheaper.


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## FrogmanM (Feb 11, 2009)

$1000-1500 sounds like an achievable price range for me! I just hope we're not chasing vaporware again...

Mayo


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## Patriot (Feb 11, 2009)

FrogmanM said:


> $1000-1500 sounds like an achievable price range for me!
> 
> Mayo




Anything is possible I guess.

Here are my off the wall guesses..

Arc1 $1600
Arc1R $1900
Arc2 $2400


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## FrogmanM (Feb 11, 2009)

Patriot36 said:


> Anything is possible I guess.



Indeed! I have been looking at Polarion recently, however if SF can come up with something I'll have to sell some Titanium...

...pass the popcorn plz!

Mayo


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## Entrope (Feb 11, 2009)

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## Patriot (Feb 11, 2009)

FrogmanM said:


> Indeed! I have been looking at Polarion recently, however if SF can come up with something I'll have to sell some Titanium...
> 
> ...pass the popcorn plz!
> 
> Mayo




Polarion has been awesome but even they haven't yet produced a variable output HID. If Surefire can pull this off at a sensible price range they'll really have something.

The only thing that I consider to be on the negative side is that the Arc's reflector appears to be heavily orange peeled. It's just not going to produce the throw but it will have the smooth beam which they have become known for.


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## FrogmanM (Feb 11, 2009)

I am willing to pay for SF's new HID lineup, mainly because I feel the need for solid CS backing my first(and possibly only) HID. I am not knocking on anyone else, its just for the price, and type of flashlight/searchlight, I'd like to know down the road I'll be able to pick up the phone and call someone for help/part replacement/repair.
The duel level HID does intrigue me, and the orange peel seems ok as well. I think that as a searchlight, throw may not be THE priority.

Mayo


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## Entrope (Feb 11, 2009)

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## Patriot (Feb 11, 2009)

Entrope said:


> Only the Arc-2 is variable though aye? The only reason for me to hold off on the Polarion right now is to wait until the end of the month to see if the Arc series will really be launched soon.
> 
> I have to say though even the Beast II's "variable" (okay, the low mode were 12 little LED's) was pretty useful. Sure, it was 12 god damn lumens... but inside a reflector that big it did produce enough visible light for urban navigation short-distance.





Yes, only the Acr2 is variable. 

I would consider the Beast II to be a multi-mode HID light but not a variable output HID. I also think the LED's are kinda neat and add to the usefulness of the Beast II.


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## Patriot (Feb 11, 2009)

FrogmanM said:


> I think that as a searchlight, throw may not be THE priority.
> 
> Mayo





I'd probably disagree with that one. :tinfoil:

I think one of the key features of HID which really sets it apart is throw. 


Good point about factory support for big money lights. SF has been around for a long time and will likely be there in the distant future. They seem to be a very solid organization, to say the least.


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## socom1970 (Feb 11, 2009)

Hey Patriot!

Do you think you're close on those prices? I hope so. I would really like to own a Surefire HID, but there's NO WAY I'm spending $5,000.00 on ANY light, HID or otherwise. (But then again, I never thought I would own 2 SF M6's or any other of the expensive lights I have) 

BTW, did you see my picture of the U2 I bought from you? I can't remember if I showed you a pic of it after Milky got a hold of it, but...






Thanks again, Patriot, for such an enjoyable purchase experience. You are truly a class act. 

Know that I pray for you and you are loved.


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## FrogmanM (Feb 11, 2009)

Patriot,

I have no HIDs I'm one of those "kiddie Ti pocket torch guys" I am hoping the HID I purchase will indeed have a good amount of throw. So for all purposes, I'd like to throw away my previous statement on HIDs not having throw as a main purpose...:laughing:

Bring on the Non-vapor-ware SF HIDs please!:huh:

Mayo


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## Patriot (Feb 11, 2009)

Heck no...I haven't seen your U2 since it was modded. Holy Cow!! Can I buy it back now?...lol. 

Seriously, that is really trick and looks great too. It's a very techy mod and performed by the best. I also remember that U2 having an especially smooth power ring on it. Smoother than my other U2 and others that I've operated anyhow. 

Thanks for the nice compliment...and right back at you. That goes for the prayer too. :thumbsup:


Regarding the Arc prices...no, I'm not sure at all. The dealers have been frustratingly tight lipped about them which make me think that the light is still a ways off. Some dealers stated flat out that they don't know what the price will be yet.


P.S. There is a Beast II selling on ebay right now. Has about 16 bids and $2400 as we speak.


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## Entrope (Feb 11, 2009)

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## Patriot (Feb 12, 2009)

Entrope said:


> As mentioned above though many seem to say it'll be out either on the 28th of this month or Q1 of this year... and since the 28th is in Q1 of the year I have some hopes that it may actually be true. I shall wait till the 28th and if there still ain't any news Polarion will have a new customer




The other thing to consider has been the absence of any pre-orders or waiting lists from dealers if the Arc is really just two or three weeks away. I've been on another list for 3 other Surefire LED's for almost a year now and they were all scheduled to be released last year. If this Arc does suddenly appear it will be the CPF surprise of '09.


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## Entrope (Feb 12, 2009)

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## PsychoBunny (Feb 14, 2009)

You guys talk about Surefire ARC whatever, but I have never seen
anything like that on their website.
The highest Lm light they have is only 500!

So, what am I missing?


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## Tempest UK (Feb 14, 2009)

PsychoBunny said:


> You guys talk about Surefire ARC whatever, but I have never seen
> anything like that on their website.
> The highest Lm light they have is only 500!
> 
> So, what am I missing?



They are in the 2009 catalog, which is available in PDF format on SureFire's website.

Regards,
Tempest


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## PsychoBunny (Feb 15, 2009)

Tempest UK said:


> They are in the 2009 catalog, which is available in PDF format on SureFire's website.
> 
> Regards,
> Tempest


 
Oh, thanks Tempest


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## PsychoBunny (Feb 15, 2009)

I dont see any prices for these 2 models.

I have a feeling they are way out of my price range though :mecry:


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## Patriot (Feb 15, 2009)

PsychoBunny said:


> I dont see any prices for these 2 models.
> 
> I have a feeling they are way out of my price range though :mecry:





The prices have not be disclosed yet. We were guessing about what they would cost in the posts above.


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## Bushman5 (Feb 17, 2009)

Patriot36 said:


> I also would not consider any of them to be EDC's. I know that's a broad terminology but if it can't fit comfortably in a person's pocket while at work or play, I don't consider it EDC. Every day pack carry, or vehicle carry are different categories imo.
> 
> I
> 
> .



each to their own i guess, i consider EDC to be Every Day Carry.....what i carry every day on my person. I carry a lot of stuff me every day, and i have no issues with it fitting in my pockets or in my 5.11 jacket (lots of pockets). A Pelican 7060 and 8060 to me are EDC lights. Everything smaller than that i consider backups and keychain lights (liek my TK11). My EDC knives range from a 5" hunter fixed blade to a BK7, and a Emerson super commander and A100.

all are with me every day so hence they are EDC. Throw in my Maxped Jumbo shoulder pack with a FAK, camera, tripod, food water and misc and i think i'm pretty well equipped.

If the ARC's actually become available, there is a perfect pocket for it in the 5.11 jacket....

:thumbsup:


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## Entrope (Feb 19, 2009)

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## Entrope (Feb 19, 2009)

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## Patriot (Feb 19, 2009)

I also did not expect SF to offer both lights at the same time but there may be something to the timing.


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## Entrope (Mar 1, 2009)

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## Parker VH (Apr 9, 2009)

Anything new to report on these lights, rumors, anything?


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## Patriot (Apr 10, 2009)

The latest news is that they may or may not be releasing this product to the public this year but if not this year, probably never. No, SF didn't specifically state that anywhere but it's just my swing at humor when pointing out that their marketing strategy seems a bit strange as of late. Many featured catalog products never make it to production and that's just the sad truth of it. I can't imagine this light being of higher priority than many of the long expected LED's lights which still aren't in production so my expectations are pretty low and probably always will be with SF. I only get excited about their products when they arrive at my door step. Hey, at least there are some other interesting developments going on with AE Light and Xevision electronics in the custom Mac body. Those are real and not just pics in a catalog somewhere. The build quality and beam shots of Mac's creation look amazing. I'm excited to see where it leads.


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## Entrope (Sep 2, 2009)

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## Entrope (Sep 2, 2009)

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## Patriot (Sep 2, 2009)

I'd sure like to see it introduced. The price is what will make or break the deal for me. Considering how fantastic Polarion products are, I'll likely not spend the extra for the ARC if is costs much more.


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## DaFABRICATA (Sep 2, 2009)

Just called SF...

No release date yet for the Arc 1 or 2.

She said maybe next year.


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## Litbobber (Sep 3, 2009)

Patriot said:


> I'd sure like to see it introduced. The price is what will make or break the deal for me. Considering how fantastic Polarion products are, I'll likely not spend the extra for the ARC if is costs much more.



+1


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## Patriot (Sep 3, 2009)

DaFABRICATA said:


> Just called SF...
> 
> No release date yet for the Arc 1 or 2.
> 
> She said maybe next year.











Maybe next year? This after they told the other guy, 'around December.' 

This brings me to my rare but primary gripe with SF, which is listing products in their catalog years before they can deliver, if they even ever intended to in the first place. Obviously I realize that the rising and setting sun isn't depended on SF product releases but which person doesn't experience some level of disappointment when highly anticipated products don't come to fruition?

Relating to this, I wonder how many calls they have to answer from people who are simply inquiring about when 2008-2009 products will be available and how that plays into the cause and effect ramifications for customer service with regards to manpower. It seems to me they could skip or reduce the advertising of speculative product fluff and instead hire someone to respond to email, for example. The CPF community is of course privileged to know that sending and email to SF is generally regarded as futility but I can't help but to think of all the unenlightened who labor in anticipation with the expectation of 21st century customer service. Just the other day some poor soul who was having problems with his M3 made his first posts in several threads generally calling SF the anti-Christ due to their lack of response to his dilemma. Like most regular people, he didn't realize that you have to call them because most responsible companies as large as SF are good about responding to email within 24-48 hours. Once he phoned, the problem was resolved quickly and he praised SF for the help. 

I'm not sure if I was ranting or not but if so, it's over...for now.


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## RobertM (Sep 4, 2009)

Patriot said:


> Maybe next year? This after they told the other guy, 'around December.'
> 
> This brings me to my rare but primary gripe with SF, which is listing products in their catalog years before they can deliver, if they even ever intended to in the first place. Obviously I realize that the rising and setting sun isn't depended on SF product releases but which person doesn't experience some level of disappointment when highly anticipated products don't come to fruition?
> 
> ...



On the other hand, maybe SF gauges which lights to produce based on how many release date inquiry calls they receive? :thinking:


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## RobertM (Nov 8, 2009)

Any news on the development/release of these?



-Robert


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## Patriot (Nov 8, 2009)

RobertM said:


> Any news on the development/release of these?
> 
> 
> 
> -Robert







> *DaFAB
> * Just called SF...
> 
> No release date yet for the Arc 1 or 2.
> ...


Isn't that exact enough for you? :nana::wave: 

I'm being waggish, of course...


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## DimeRazorback (Nov 8, 2009)

C'mon next year!!

:naughty:


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## DaFABRICATA (Nov 8, 2009)

DimeRazorback said:


> C'mon next year!!
> 
> :naughty:


 


Do you mean next year as in 2010 or a year from now meaning 2011??

I love my Hellfighter, but I really hope these will be priced a little more toward the consumer and they are supposed to be brighter!!
Just as long as they get it right....Only time will tell.....


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## DimeRazorback (Nov 8, 2009)

I don't know what year 

I am too hopeful that they will be more affordable!

I'm keen on the Arc 2! :devil:


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## Patriot (Nov 8, 2009)

DaFABRICATA said:


> I love my Hellfighter, but I really hope these will be priced a little more toward the consumer and they are supposed to be brighter!!
> Just as long as they get it right....Only time will tell.....





...and who wouldn't love it, right? I mean, their HID's have always been the among the cream but untouchable for most people. Many that exist in member's hands around here were purchased second hand at greatly depreciated prices. Hopefully they'll get it right as you say. I should would like to see them on the HID map again.


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## RobertM (Nov 9, 2009)

Patriot said:


> Isn't that exact enough for you? :nana::wave:
> 
> I'm be waggish, of course...



Haha, yeah I know, patience...patience... 

SF is pretty good at testing my patience though... 

I just wish we would at least find out ballpark pricing. This way a lot of us would be able to know whether or not it might be a possibility if/when they are released.

I'm probably alone on this, but I still have hope that it will come in around $1000 (at least for the ARC1). This is based on the mention of the "$1000 flashlight" in the Dr. Matthews interview from the 2008 SHOT show. Maybe I'm just reading into it though... 

-Robert


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## dcycleman (Nov 9, 2009)

I bet that the arcs will be at LEAST 3 grand. isnt the beast like 5? unless they are trying to get more of the general public to be able to afford them. I guess we'll have to wait and see.


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## Patriot (Nov 9, 2009)

dcycleman said:


> I bet that the arcs will be at LEAST 3 grand. isnt the beast like 5? unless they are trying to get more of the general public to be able to afford them. I guess we'll have to wait and see.





I'm guessing at least 2K+ also just because of what's involved in producing American made products. 



The parts and materials, machining and other aspects of business running and profits leave me doubtful it could ever come in under that. I think Mac of Mac's Customs burned well over a grand on parts and materials for his dual mode 50W and that's to say nothing about his labor time invested. I'm just guessing, but if he put 20 hours of labor into that light I could see where he wouldn't want to sell one for any less than 2K and he's just builder that doesn't have to pay for a lot of overhead. 

Whatever the price, it would would be nice to have the option to purchase on. On paper, the ARC2 is really my style where the BeastII never quite was for me. The form factor just missed the mark for me personally but like all SF products I can appreciate them regardless of my preferences.


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## Litbobber (Jan 25, 2010)

Any new info on these from surefire at shot show 2010?

Thanks


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## Patriot (Jan 25, 2010)

I've been watching the shot show thread but nothing about the ARCs so far.


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## jp2515 (Jan 25, 2010)

Litbobber said:


> Any new info on these from surefire at shot show 2010?
> 
> Thanks





Patriot said:


> I've been watching the shot show thread but nothing about the ARCs so far.



The Arc lights are kind of on the back burner at the moment as Surefire is working on other projects.


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## Patriot (Jan 25, 2010)

jp2515 said:


> The Arc lights are kind of on the back burner at the moment as Surefire is working on other projects.





Historically, "soon" means a year plus for SF, so I fear that "back burner" could mean never. It's not that we don't have other product choices, it's just that as a SF fan myself, I love to see new products become available to us.


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## andromeda.73 (Jan 30, 2010)

sorry, but where you can 'find for sale? Tank's


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## Parker VH (Jan 30, 2010)

I don't think you'll find them for sale any time soon. On the backburner for the moment from what I understand.


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## andromeda.73 (Jan 30, 2010)

Parker VH said:


> I don't think you'll find them for sale any time soon. On the backburner for the moment from what I understand.




sin, we wanted to do a thought .....:thinking:


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## Patriot (Mar 28, 2010)

I had a nice talk in person with a SF rep today and he basically told me that there was no development happening at all with regards to the ARC1 & 2 lights. He basically said that the models were either dead or that they're so far back on the burner that I might as well not even ask. That was about the final confirmation that I needed to go ahead and take his advice, of "not even asking" about these lights. 

A bit of a shame considering how nice the ones in the catalog looked. Judging by their size, SF probably figured out early on that there would be thermal problems, especially at the 50W setting. By comparison, the Beast/II were massive compared to the ARCs and less powerful at 35W.


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## Rat (Feb 11, 2014)

After all this time looks what's on the Surefire website http://www.surefire.com/illumination/flashlights/arc-2-searchlight-spotlight.html

Still no price and they also have the ARC-3 listed.


:wave:


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## Ceya! (Feb 15, 2014)

Also Hell Fighter 5 , Wish it had dual output. 

http://www.surefire.com/product/searchlights-spotlights/hellfighter-5.html

Maybe they are waiting to see how the military may bite after all these drawbacks.

S/F,
CeYA!


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## PocketRocket (Feb 26, 2014)

*Poof*


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## BVH (Feb 26, 2014)

Are you open to the new Xeray LeMax 70? You'll get far higher performance out of it and the quality is certainly comparable. Surefire HID's are not high performers relative to a few other big names in HID. The Lemax produces 160% of the Lumens output of the Arc2 and probably 2 times the candela, or more than the Arc2. I'd guess the Arc2 will cost significantly more than the LeMax - if it is ever available at all.


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## PocketRocket (Feb 26, 2014)

*Poof*


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## XeRay (Feb 27, 2014)

PocketRocket said:


> How would you compare the quality of LEMAX versus Polarion (the Abyss Dual S specifically)?


Perhaps Patriot can comment to this question. Covering this question in both threads, this one and the current thread for our new XeRay lights.


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## Patriot (Mar 23, 2014)

PocketRocket said:


> I was originally very sceptical that the Polarion would live up to its "quality hype" when I purchased mine. Ultimately though while I didn't end up disappointed... I wasn't exactly amazed either (hence why I eventually sold the light).
> 
> There's just something about Surefire's anodizing which I'm an extremely big sucker for. The Hellfighter just felt so much more solid versus the Polarion. It was a much nicer light to hold and feel.
> 
> ...




Yes, the SF feels "solid" because the aluminum is machined to very thick dimensions. I come outdooring and backpacking background so I like a balance of weight vs. performance and I don't think weight was a consideration when SF designed to Beast. We know next to nothing about the Arc-2 and/or Arc-3 because SF still seems to have them in the prototype/may not ever be built except for SHOT Show stage. 

If it's heft that you like, the LX70 is built like a tank and is the same weight as the Hell Fighter 5. It's also 1.5lbs heavier than the Polarion Abyss with heavier construction. Compared to the HF5, the LX70 throws much better, is 3000L brighter, has a far longer run-time and is waterproof to 50M rather than 1M. The Hell Fighter 5 is also more expensive and your paying for hardware that most people would never use, like the rapid attach/detach T-rail clamp that results in a compromised handle design that slings the light way below your point of hold and swivels. The LX70's handle is monolithic and sleek by comparison. Don't take by this that I don't like SF products because I do, but when I compare their HID products to what's currently available with regards to component quality and performance, I would have trouble spending more to get less. If you're just a collector who wants to try them all at one time or another, have at it!


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## PocketRocket (Mar 23, 2014)

*Poof*


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