# My observations from the Super Light Shoot Out # 2



## S4MadMan (Jan 23, 2005)

Just got back from the Super Light Shoot Out # 2 (SLS2) and I'm still seeing stars. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/icon15.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/happy14.gif

I'll post some pictures in about 15 minutes...

It was an honor and great to finally meet In The Dark, Kenshiro and Mr. Ted Bear...

Some impressions:

I've been around and have experienced some very bright lights but The Big 3 (Sleeper, Ken 4 and Ken 5) are in a whole new category. They are "retarded" bright, lighting up everything in their paths with the Ken 5 being the brightest by a noticeable margin. The Ken 4 was the most shocking because it's in such a small and light weight enclosure, you would *never* expect that much light. If you ask whether they are spot or flood lights, my response, "Yes"... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crazy.gif

Very impressive was the spot of the Blitz/Laser Force 240 at 50 watts, almost Maxabeamish with good side spill but it could not hang with The Big 3...

Sorry, The Crocodile, The Beast and Thor 10MCP were completely outgunned in this test. But the Thor is impressive for a $25 Costco special.

The Havis-Shield, X990, and Thor Upgrade, Kum Kang and others performed decently well but again, fell way short of The Big 3...

I didn't know what to expect meeting these CPFers but when Mr. Ted Bear said to meet them at a Sushi Bar, I knew they had to be good people... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif 

The Sure Fire L4 is an excellent EDC and great for close-up work (Duh! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif)...

More comments and some photos in a few... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

P.S. By the way, the Sushi was very good. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif


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## S4MadMan (Jan 23, 2005)

Look at all those goodies! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif







A whole lotta light from the Ken 5!






See what I mean by the Ken 5 being both a flood and spot light? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif
Distance to trees: ~200 meters /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/ooo.gif







More pictures tomorrow, need sleep. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crazy.gif


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## ledebuhr1 (Jan 23, 2005)

Where do you get a ken 5 light? and how much do they Cost??


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## StEaLtH_ (Jan 23, 2005)

I'm such a geek, I'm sitting in my chair going OMG OMG WOW..
Cant wait for more pictures /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
Awesome!!


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## MikeF (Jan 23, 2005)

S4MadMan,
Thanks so much for posting these!! Also thanks for keeping them under 600 pixels so the pics don't need to be panned.


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## Kiessling (Jan 23, 2005)

*Re: My observations from the Super Light Shoot Out*

S4MadMan ... congrats on your meeting with those people! You have been promoted to Sir S4MandMan ... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
bernhard


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## S4MadMan (Jan 23, 2005)

[ QUOTE ]
*ledebuhr1 said:*
Where do you get a ken 5 light? and how much do they Cost?? 

[/ QUOTE ]

The Ken 5 is custom made by Kenshiro and is a prototype. I do not believe it's for sale. It's a whole lotta light: ~16,000 lumens (I believe). /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/ooo.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crazy.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif


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## AlexGT (Jan 23, 2005)

Maybe If you open your checkbook really wide you might convince him to sell it to you.

BTW how much did Kenshiro invest in his light? 

Thanks!
AlexGT


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## Andreas (Jan 23, 2005)

hello,

I was wondering if you could tell me what light that is laying in the back of your vehicle all the way to the left???

thanks so much!!!

Andreas


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## McGizmo (Jan 23, 2005)

*Re: My observations from the Super Light Shoot Out*

Andreas,
That would be the Beast me believes. 

S4MadMan, 
thanks for the pics!

Kenshiro,
Where ever you are, good sir, /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/nana.gif


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## CroMAGnet (Jan 23, 2005)

*Re: My observations from the Super Light Shoot Out*

16 THOUSAND Lumens!?!?!!! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/faint.gif


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## NewBie (Jan 23, 2005)

*Re: My observations from the Super Light Shoot Out*

Whats the THOR upgrade, is it a HID setup?


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## Andreas (Jan 23, 2005)

*Re: My observations from the Super Light Shoot Out*

How about the one that is the fourth light over from the left??

thanks

Andreas


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## Sway (Jan 23, 2005)

*Re: My observations from the Super Light Shoot Out*

In the second picture the head of the light on the tripod looks strangely familiar /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thinking.gif 

MadMan thanks for the update /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumbsup.gif I can't wait to see all the pic's.


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## McGizmo (Jan 23, 2005)

*Re: My observations from the Super Light Shoot Out*

Well,
I would guess it's a KenRad PSL35. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/icon3.gif

BTW, I met with Mark of Ken Rad fame the other day and he showed me a new HID that will be out sometime this year; after legal patent issues and production is nailed down. What I saw was a prototype and frankly, it was very impressive! Some features were a rotating collar switch behind the head like the Beast which took you from off to 50 watts and then down to 35 watts. The head has another rotating collar in front of the switch which allows for reflector adjustment that gives you the ability to either focus the beeam into a spot or defocus it into a flood. The really cool feature was a very quick disconnect of the battery tube which is hot swappable and consists of an integrated Li-Ion rechargeable battery stick. I believe the reported runtimes were about 90 minutes at 50 watts and sligntly in excess of 2 hours on 35 watts. The "dumb" battery stick can be exchanged for other methods of power source and it looks like this system can be fairly modular and versatile! The electronics are of German design and the host and mechanicals are of Swiss design. There is an integrated sholder strap that can be quickly removed. From what I could see and what I was told, this is going to be a serious entrant but the price will be up there with the other serious and professional HID illumination tools. I was really impressed with some of the engineering I could see!!


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## MaxaBaker (Jan 23, 2005)

*Re: My observations from the Super Light Shoot Out*

WOW!!!!!!!

I havn't been here for a couple days and look what I missed! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/eek.gif!!!!

Thanks S4MadMan: those are some excellent shots. I can't believe how much light that Ken5 puts out 16,000 lumens!!!!!!!

Sleeper /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/xyxgun.gif by the Ken5. I never thought I'd get to say that!!!!!!!!!

Wow. Kenshiro is gonna have to make them and sell them or there might be some major problems /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumbsup.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/nana.gif

How did the HS hold up comparatively to the other 35watt HIDs?? I know it has great throw, but total light output isn't that great.

O ya, nice minivan /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif


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## symes (Jan 23, 2005)

*Re: My observations from the Super Light Shoot Out*

Awesome results....

Any pictures of the various lights just cold and sitting there to compare size/length etc...

Thanks y'all for doing this!


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## Kenshiro (Jan 23, 2005)

*Re: My observations from the Super Light Shoot Out*

McGizmo,

Thank you very much for your /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/nana.gif.
And a BIG /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/nana.gif to you, too.

Madman, wow. That was a fast post. Talk about "fast off the grill", the lights were probably still warm when you posted those shots.

Everyone, the Ken 5 is a total PROTOTYPE(I was actually connecting wires and stuff that night), and IF I ever made a real "production" version, it would be a bit different. Also, because of it's "untested" state, it was actually underdriven last night, just to be safe.
There was also another prototype, the "Ken 4 with large reflector", which has the same output as the regular Ken 4, but has a more focused beam.

Anyway, the "official" photos will be posted soon (hopefully). I'm still analyzing the results using my slow, outdated, and dumb computer (my brain). This time there's more factors to consider than the shootout last month.

Mr. Ted Bear has the photos also, and since his computer is better than mine, he might post them sooner.

In the meantime, Madman will be posting some other photos.

My sincere thanks to all who helped out last night.


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## raggie33 (Jan 23, 2005)

*Re: My observations from the Super Light Shoot Out*

awesumeeeeeeeeeeeee man thats so cool like the darn sun


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## Mr Ted Bear (Jan 23, 2005)

*Re: My observations from the Super Light Shoot Out*

reject.... need to redo...


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## NewBie (Jan 23, 2005)

*Re: My observations from the Super Light Shoot Out*

Mr Ted Bear

Now thats what I call a tease!


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## Mr Ted Bear (Jan 23, 2005)

*Re: My observations from the Super Light Shoot Out*

NewBie

No tease intended. Kenshiro and I did't like the way these came out. There's an intermediate ridge which cause a shadowing


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## cy (Jan 23, 2005)

*Re: My observations from the Super Light Shoot Out*

does this mean sleeper has been dethroned?


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## S4MadMan (Jan 23, 2005)

*Re: My observations from the Super Light Shoot Out*

[ QUOTE ]
*Mr Ted Bear said:*
NewBie

No tease intended. Kenshiro and I did't like the way these came out. There's an intermediate ridge which cause a shadowing 

[/ QUOTE ]


That only means one thing...errr...two things:

#1: Redo

#2: MORE SUSHI!!! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif


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## S4MadMan (Jan 23, 2005)

*Re: My observations from the Super Light Shoot Out*

[ QUOTE ]
*cy said:*
does this mean sleeper has been dethroned? 

[/ QUOTE ]

I guess you'll have to wait until next time. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif


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## S4MadMan (Jan 23, 2005)

*Re: My observations from the Super Light Shoot Out*

Well, since there's gonna be a redo, here are some more observation pics:

The uber Maxabeamish spot of the Blitz HID50 vs. the Ken5:






Pictures are worth a thousand words here:









Some lights were just retarded bright. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crazy.gif


IMHO, the most impressive light overall was the Ken4. Picture this, it's enclosed in an 8" x 6" enclosure, it's very light compared to its peers, will run for ~20 minutes and is ~10,000 lumens. You just would not believe some thing so small could be so bright. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif


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## MaxaBaker (Jan 23, 2005)

*Re: My observations from the Super Light Shoot Out*

WOW!!!! That's just awsome. Great work!!!! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumbsup.gif


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## cy (Jan 23, 2005)

*Re: My observations from the Super Light Shoot Out*

how about some closeup pics w/inards of Ken 3,4, 5?


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## S4MadMan (Jan 23, 2005)

*Re: My observations from the Super Light Shoot Out*

[ QUOTE ]
*BakerOnFire90 said:*
WOW!!!! That's just awsome. Great work!!!! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumbsup.gif 

[/ QUOTE ]

All the credit goes to In The Dark, Kenshiro and Mr. Ted Bear.

I just stood back, observed, and took pictures. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif


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## MaxaBaker (Jan 23, 2005)

*Re: My observations from the Super Light Shoot Out*

Well great work to y'all too!!!!


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## S4MadMan (Jan 23, 2005)

*Re: My observations from the Super Light Shoot Out*

[ QUOTE ]
*cy said:*
how about some closeup pics w/inards of Ken 3,4, 5? 

[/ QUOTE ]

I was in light awe and I didn't get any close-up pictures. In fact, I missed many pictures because there was so much light being produced, I was disoriented. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/yellowlaugh.gif


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## MaxaBaker (Jan 23, 2005)

*Re: My observations from the Super Light Shoot Out*

Looks like that Ken5 is a mod of the Lightforce 240.


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## Sway (Jan 24, 2005)

[ QUOTE ]
*S4MadMan said:*
Very impressive was the spot of the Blitz/Laser Force 240 at 50 watts, almost Maxabeamish with good side spill but it could not hang with The Big 3... 

[/ QUOTE ]

Dan thanks for the complements on the HID Blitz, I really didn’t think my mod would perform so well against the heavy hitters that arrived for the shootout redo. 

If another redo is going to happen some beam shots at 800 meters or more would be very interesting while all these Uber lights are together /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif 

Later
Kelly


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## S4MadMan (Jan 24, 2005)

Kelly: at 200-300 meters, it's nothing for the upper tier Super Lights. At 800 meters, I think most of the lights will be hurting.

But as Kenshiro and Mr. Ted Bear were pointing out to me, and I agree, any thing beyond (say) 300 meters, at night, is not useful because the human eye cannot discern it. Their Super Light test is based on useful light that can be seen by the naked eye.

If testing at extreme distances such as 800 meters, the throw kings will win but we won't be able to see it with the naked eye. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crazy.gif Also, we'd want to bring back the Maxabeam and the rest of the "spotting devices". /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif


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## MaxaBaker (Jan 24, 2005)

/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/buttrock.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/popcorn.gif MAXABEAM!!!!!!!!!!


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## peakbeam1 (Jan 24, 2005)

Maybe I could be of some help getting the Maxabeam in on the tests. Who would I contact? Where is it held?
Rob
Peak Beam Sytems Inc.
Director of Engineering


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## larryk (Jan 24, 2005)

[ QUOTE ]
*peakbeam1 said:*
Maybe I could be of some help getting the Maxabeam in on the tests. Who would I contact? Where is it held?
Rob
Peak Beam Sytems Inc.
Director of Engineering 

[/ QUOTE ]

Hi Rob, any news on the new line of lightweight, 
long-running batteries for the Maxabeam ?


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## peakbeam1 (Jan 24, 2005)

larryk, 
The nimh batteries are just being released. They are 6.4ah, 9.5ah, and 15ah. I wouldn't call them lightweight but some of them are smaller than the nicad 7ah. The old nicad was about 5.5lbs and the new 15 ah nimh(in the same sized case) is almost 6.5lbs. but with twice the runtime, and a built in fuel gauge. We have begun work on the lithium ion packs, but gov't regulations on lithium transportation have slowed the process. Look for those in a few months.
Thanks for the interest,
Rob


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## MaxaBaker (Jan 24, 2005)

You could send a Maxabeam to me peakbeam 1 /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/naughty.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif

You might not get it back /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rolleye11.gif, but you could just call that an occupational hazzard.

Man, I must say I'm glad to have the director of engineering for Peak Beam Industries here on CPF. I don't know why, but it makes me feel as though we are getting behind-the-scenes information from the company, even though we're not.


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## S4MadMan (Jan 24, 2005)

[ QUOTE ]
*peakbeam1 said:*
Maybe I could be of some help getting the Maxabeam in on the tests. Who would I contact? Where is it held?
Rob
Peak Beam Sytems Inc.
Director of Engineering 

[/ QUOTE ]


Hi Rob, that would be great! I'll have Mr. Ted Bear contact you. He organizes these shoot outs which are held some where in Southern California. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif


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## cmacclel (Jan 24, 2005)

So How did my light do???? It's in front of the THOR..........BTW I have a Flood reflector for it if your interested pay shipping and it's yours....

Mac


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## Sway (Jan 25, 2005)

[ QUOTE ]
*S4MadMan said:*
Kelly: at 200-300 meters, it's nothing for the upper tier Super Lights. At 800 meters, I think most of the lights will be hurting.

But as Kenshiro and Mr. Ted Bear were pointing out to me, and I agree, any thing beyond (say) 300 meters, at night, is not useful because the human eye cannot discern it. Their Super Light test is based on useful light that can be seen by the naked eye.

If testing at extreme distances such as 800 meters, the throw kings will win but we won't be able to see it with the naked eye. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crazy.gif Also, we'd want to bring back the Maxabeam and the rest of the "spotting devices". /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif 

[/ QUOTE ]

Dan I agree completely it’s difficult for me to pick out objects out over several hundred meters at night that is not my goal. I needed a light that would fully illuminate a target beyond the range of normal spotlight and bring as much candle power to bare as possible for the “reach out and touch you effect” Enter the HID Blitz Mod short of buying a Maxa Beam I’m still looking /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/nana.gif

Later
Kelly


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## S4MadMan (Jan 25, 2005)

Kelly: ahhh, I see, different strokes for different folks. If you need that kind of spotability, yes, Maxabeam, your Blitz HID, and I would imagine the Ken5 would be best. The Ken 5 lit up that 200 meter target like it was at 20'. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif


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## Luna (Jan 25, 2005)

Don't forget that the massive lights light the Kens would be useless in the rain or fog(or haze). That is the true value of the Maxa Beam. I can only imagine how the Ken5 would blind me if using it on a dark foggy night.

Likewise it is good for lighting up an area for others that are in the area being lit.


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## NewBie (Feb 8, 2005)

I wonder, if the Ken5 clears the fog by vaporizing the water droplets?


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## S4MadMan (Feb 8, 2005)

[ QUOTE ]
*NewBie said:*
I wonder, if the Ken5 clears the fog by vaporizing the water droplets? 

[/ QUOTE ]

Absolutely! In fact, I got too close to the Ken5's beam and it burned off part of my eye brow! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/naughty.gif


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## Hallis (Feb 9, 2005)

crazy stuff, i need a Ken5 and a Blitz85 now /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

Shane


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## MaxaBaker (Feb 9, 2005)

Blitz85?!?!?!? Did I miss something!!!!!!!! (I'm guessing that is a Lightforce240 with a W/A 1185 bulb in it?)


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## Kirov (Apr 7, 2005)

*Re: My observations from the Super Light Shoot Out*

[ QUOTE ]
*Kenshiro said:*
McGizmo,

Thank you very much for your /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/nana.gif.
And a BIG /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/nana.gif to you, too.

Madman, wow. That was a fast post. Talk about "fast off the grill", the lights were probably still warm when you posted those shots.

Everyone, the Ken 5 is a total PROTOTYPE(I was actually connecting wires and stuff that night), and IF I ever made a real "production" version, it would be a bit different. Also, because of it's "untested" state, it was actually underdriven last night, just to be safe.
There was also another prototype, the "Ken 4 with large reflector", which has the same output as the regular Ken 4, but has a more focused beam.

Anyway, the "official" photos will be posted soon (hopefully). I'm still analyzing the results using my slow, outdated, and dumb computer (my brain). This time there's more factors to consider than the shootout last month.

Mr. Ted Bear has the photos also, and since his computer is better than mine, he might post them sooner.

In the meantime, Madman will be posting some other photos.

My sincere thanks to all who helped out last night. 

[/ QUOTE ]

To bring you back to this thread....
Kenshiro is it a secret what did you use for a base for the Ken5 and what kind of modifications did you do to it??? I would love to do it myself!!!
By the way what is Blitz 50????
And one more question - do you power these lights with a separate baterry or you use the car baterry?

Thank You!


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## MaxaBaker (Apr 7, 2005)

*Re: My observations from the Super Light Shoot Out*

The Blitz is an awsome mod that was built by Sway. It uses a 50watt HID system in a LightForce 240 body. It's one of my favorite lights because it throws arounf 4500+ lumens and has the throw of a MaxaBeam. I trully awsome light!

No car batteries for the Blitz!!!!! They weigh a bit to much to be very portable /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif I am not 100% sure, but I think it runs off of two 7.2 volt parallely connected R/C batteries. It's very light (weight wise) and is very very portable.


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## MaxaBaker (Apr 7, 2005)

*Re: My observations from the Super Light Shoot Out*

Also, I'm not 100% sure, but I think the Ken5 is built of the Lighforce 240 body as well. I think the 9 1/2 inch reflector is just about the only thing that can contain and throw that many lumens in a semi-ight beam! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif


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## MaxaBaker (Apr 7, 2005)

*Re: My observations from the Super Light Shoot Out*

Okay, just looked at the Ken5 pic again. It's DEFINITLY a Lightforce 240 body /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif


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## Kirov (Apr 7, 2005)

*Re: My observations from the Super Light Shoot Out*

Thank You for the understanding of my problems!
LightForce body I guess would be easy to get!
Why not using the original 100W short-arc bulb and instead replacing it with 50W HID(that's for the Blitz) and what kind of bulb do you think Ken5 Uses!
And again where do you get a 50W HID Bulb+ballast???


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## MaxaBaker (Apr 7, 2005)

*Re: My observations from the Super Light Shoot Out*

The original bulb in the Lightforce is only a 100watt halogen bulb, not HID. I really have no idea what bulb the Ken5 uses. Something that has to many lumens than to know what to do with though /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif


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## MaxaBaker (Apr 7, 2005)

*Re: My observations from the Super Light Shoot Out*

The original bulb in the Lightforce is only a 100watt halogen bulb, not HID. I really have no idea what bulb the Ken5 uses. Something that has to many lumens than to know what to do with though /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif

I don't know where to get a 50watt system. It may be around here somewhere, but I don't remember. Markdi, can you help?


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## Lurveleven (Apr 7, 2005)

*Re: My observations from the Super Light Shoot Out*

My wild guess is that the Ken 5 is using a Osram HLX 64663 bulb (rated 16000 lumens).

Sigbjoern


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## Kirov (Apr 7, 2005)

*Re: My observations from the Super Light Shoot Out*

I found one here:
http://www.xenonvalot.com/boost.html
and one here:
http://www.kenradlighting.com/ballasts/eb035_50G01.htm
But Kenrad is not selling it direct. I am trying now the xenonvalot


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## lotsalumens (Apr 8, 2005)

*Re: My observations from the Super Light Shoot Out*

Here are two sources for 50w ballasts.

http://www.kenradlighting.com/

http://www.xenlight.com/

My guess is that the Blitz throws so well because it has a parabolic reflector which collimates the light better than an ellipsoidal reflector. Parabolic reflectors have one focal point where the bulb is placed. Ellipsoidals have two focal points...one at the bulb and another someplace out in front of the reflector. 

cfb


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## MaxaBaker (Apr 8, 2005)

*Re: My observations from the Super Light Shoot Out*

Don't forget that it's 9 1/2 inches wide (and quite deep as well).


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## cheesehead (Apr 9, 2005)

*Re: My observations from the Super Light Shoot Out*

Ellipsoidal reflectors??? I doubt any manufacture wastes his time with those. 

My observations from this "SUPER LIGHT SHOOT OUT", is that none of these lights were spotted at a mile or so. None were actually tested as "SUPER LIGHTS". They all got tested as just simple flood lights. Where's the maxabeam???? Where are the spots of the Blitz 50 or even the Thor HID at 1 mile??? Those are the really nice long range spotting lights. The stuff tested may be good, but it needs to be challenged.


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## lotsalumens (Apr 9, 2005)

*Re: My observations from the Super Light Shoot Out*

I think some are wasting their time on it, or at least on semi-ellipsoidal shapes. Your average sealed automotive searchlight has a parabolic reflector (looks like a PAR bulb), but a lot of lights don't. Look at the Thor reflectors for instance. They are much deeper and closer to an ellipse in shape. Maybe they do this to get exaggerated output claims at th focal point, but they do not appear to be true parabolic reflectors.

For anyone interested in reflectors here is a site with a basic explanation of each:

http://www.thestagecrew.com/Pages/Chapters/stagecraft_lights/lighting_parts/reflectors.html


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## MaxaBaker (Apr 9, 2005)

*Re: My observations from the Super Light Shoot Out*

[ QUOTE ]
*cheesehead said:*
My observations from this "SUPER LIGHT SHOOT OUT", is that none of these lights were spotted at a mile or so. None were actually tested as "SUPER LIGHTS". They all got tested as just simple flood lights. Where's the maxabeam???? Where are the spots of the Blitz 50 or even the Thor HID at 1 mile??? Those are the really nice long range spotting lights. The stuff tested may be good, but it needs to be challenged. 

[/ QUOTE ]

Here Here!!!!!! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/happy23.gif


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## cheesehead (Apr 11, 2005)

*Re: My observations from the Super Light Shoot Out*

lotsalumens,

If the ellipsoidal is focused at "infinity" isn't it parabolic? So, then is it any worse or better than a "par" bulb shape?


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## Spacemarine (Apr 12, 2005)

*Re: My observations from the Super Light Shoot Out*

[ QUOTE ]
*cheesehead said:*
If the ellipsoidal is focused at "infinity" isn't it parabolic?

[/ QUOTE ]

That's absolutely right, here's some more information about it, along with some nice pictures:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conic_section 

And here some good explanation with (in my opninion) better pictures:
http://www.greier-greiner.at/hc/bsp/kegelschnitte/kegels.htm


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## lotsalumens (Apr 12, 2005)

*Re: My observations from the Super Light Shoot Out*

Good point, but presumably an ellipsoidal reflector with a focal point at infinity would essentially be a parabolic reflector...i.e. it would be a parabola and not an ellipse.(?) My point earlier was just that some of the reflector shapes I mentioned do not appear to be parabolas. 

A friend of mine has an aircraft signalling light. It is a little handheld thing with a true parabolic reflector in the back and a pretty low wattage bulb in front of it. It was surplus and was probably made in the 60's or so. It is not super bright, but he says it out throws just about any other light he's got, including the Thor. There is surely a tradeoff between efficiency and pure throw since an ellipsoidal or semi-ellipsoidal can collect light better. Guess it depends on what you need...tiny point at a great distance or wider and possibly more efficient output at slightly lesser distances.


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## cheesehead (Apr 13, 2005)

*Re: My observations from the Super Light Shoot Out*

Lots, 

An ellipsoidal won't transmit any light, that's what I learned from your sites. It has no opening.

Ok, enough funny stuff, I think a half-ellipsoidal won't work either since it has no true focal spot, i.e. no place to put the bulb. 

I think only parabolas work. Then, deep parabolas look like "ellipsoidal", although technically they aren't. Ellipsoidals are half way to circles, and circles do not have a focal spot. 

Somewhere on this site, someone explained the differences. Basically the "par" shape has a little better spot, but the deeper reflectors collect more of the light and are more efficient, but have a bigger hotspot. Basically, it's a trade-off of reflector size versus size of your "point" source. A large "par" reflector is a segment of a very large parabola and thus "sees" the point source as relatively smaller, but this at the expense of efficiency. 

Eh, enough blather.


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## Ginseng (Apr 13, 2005)

*Re: My observations from the Super Light Shoot Out*

Hi Cheesy,

The parabolic reflector takes spherically radiated light from a point source located at its focal point and reflects every ray into parallel beam out its main axis.

The ellipsoidal (or half ellipsoidal since a full ellipsoidal would be a closed egg-shape) has two focal points, one inside the reflector much as a parabolic has and one located the exact same location in the missing half of the reflector. This type is commonly used to focus all the light onto a spot, such as for fiber optic illluminators. 

The two main variables that determine the geometry of the parabolic are the focal point and the distance from the apex of the parabola to an imaginary line behind it called the directrix. I know it's pretty unintelligible and totally non-visualizable. I only understood it after spending a few hours creating a program to model parabolas.

I'm sure that didn't help at all /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Wilkey


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## cheesehead (Apr 15, 2005)

*Re: My observations from the Super Light Shoot Out*

Ginseng, 

Nicely said. If I need more info, I'll have to crack open the HS math and physics books. Eh, that's too much effort, I will just wait until my 6 year old daughter gets old enough to explain it to me. 

cheese


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## mossyoak (Oct 26, 2005)

just wondering but how many lumens does a thor 10 million cp put out?


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## mwr (Oct 28, 2005)

Is there any information about that small but super bright Ken 4? Is it available or is it a one-of-a-kind?


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## MaxaBaker (Oct 28, 2005)

Thor puts out around 2500 lumens as a guess (probably a close guess too).


mwr, I don't know about the Ken4, but try contacting Tweek on this forum and ask about his Husky mod.......................it will blow away the Ken4.


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