# ArmyTek Predator 2.5 (XP-G2 R5 1x18650 2xCR123A/RCR) Regular and Pro Review: RUNTIME+



## selfbuilt (Jul 12, 2013)

*Warning: pic heavy, as usual. *



















In early 2011, I reviewed the inaugural light from ArmyTek – the Predator (v1.0, XP-G R5). Today, I follow up with a dual review of the latest iterations of this light – now known as the regular Predator and Predator Pro (both in version 2.5, with XP-G2 R5 emitters). Please see my concurrent companion review of the Viking and Viking Pro (v2.5 with XM-L2 emitters), published separately.

*Manufacturer Reported Specifications:* 
Note: as always, these are simply what the manufacturer provides – scroll down to see my actual testing results. Specs have been highly condensed from ArmyTek website and manuals (and where inconsistencies arise, I have presented what is included in the printed manuals).

*Common Specs:*

LED: XP-G2 R5 Cool White
Light output 670 LED lumen
Beam distance up to 400 meters
Constant brightness for whole operation time
Powered by one 18650 Li-Ion or two CR123A/R123 batteries
Ultra-transparent and tempered glass with anti-reflective and lens coating, normally used in photo equipment only.
Angle of the light spot: 5 degrees, angle of the light spill: 40 degrees.
Removable stainless steel clip, functional and easy to use.
The ability to use batteries with a flat contact.
Tailcap lockout.
Impact-resistant bezels - steel bezels are covered by titanium compounds with a hardness of 2000-3000HV.
Body cover: matte, anodized. Hardness: 350-400HV. Resistant to scratches and impacts.
Body material: aviation-grade aluminum T6061-T6.
Water resistance standard: IPX-8 (the highest)
Dimensions: Length: 6.1 in, Body diameter: 1 in, Head diameter: 1.56 in, Weight (without batteries): 5.82 oz
*Predator v2.5*

Output levels and runtimes: 670 lm (2h 50min), 200 lm (7h), 70 lm (20h), 6 lm (155h)
Easy manipulation of modes
New-generation electronic driver with STEP runtime technology. 
MSRP: ~$86
*Predator Pro v2.5*

Output levels and runtimes: 670 lm (1h 20min), 200 lm (7h), 70 lm (20h), 6 lm (155h)
Fully programmable settings
Current stabilization types are entirely changeable through the user menu: full stabilization (FULL), simple semi-stabilization (SEMI), stepped stabilization (STEP).
Electronic driver is placed in a special aluminum capsule and has been completely covered with a durable compound. This actually protects it from both the environment and from mechanical damage.
Lowest Firefly mode of 0.1 lumens, working for 130 days with ONE 18650 Li-Ion battery.
S-Tek™ driver constantly monitors the temperature of LED and the electronic circuit and will prevent the LED overheating in extreme environments.
Supports batteries without protection board (PCB), for example: LiFePO4 or Li-Ion.
The automemorization of the last used mode can be turned on or off.
Has the ability to save the user's individual settings in the Custom preset.
Has the ability to reset of all settings of the flashlight to those built-in by the manufacturer (Military or Outdoor presets) or to the user's saved preset (Custom).
MSRP: ~$105














Packaging is common for both versions - a typical carboard box, with ArmyTek logos and graphic design on it. Inside, the light comes packaged between two pieces of packing plastic-styrofoam, with a good quality holster with closing flap, wrist lanyard, spare o-rings, tail switch boot replacement cover, manual and product insert/warranty card. 














From left to right: AW Protected 18650; Armytek Predator Pro v2.5, Predator v2.5, Viking Pro v2.5, Viking v2.5, CR123A.





From left to right: AW Protected 18650; Armytek Predator Pro v2.5, Predator v2.5, Predator v1.0; Nitecore MT25; Foursevens G5. 

All dimensions directly measured, and given with no batteries installed:

*ArmyTek Predator V2.5:* Weight: 161.8g, Length 155mm, Width (bezel): 39.5mm
*ArmyTek Predator Pro v2.5:* Weight: 161.0g, Length 155mm, Width (bezel): 39.5mm
*ArmyTek Viking V2.5:* Weight: 159.8g, Length 153mm, Width (bezel): 39.5mm
*ArmyTek Viking Pro V2.5:* Weight: 161.9g, Length 152mm, Width (bezel): 39.5mm
*ArmyTek Predator V1.0:* Weight: 134.6g, Length 153.9mm, Width (bezel): 36.7mm
*Foursevens G5*: Weight: 145.5g, Length 156mm, Width (bezel): 38.9mm
*Nitecore SRT7*: Weight: 172.4g, Length: 158mm, Width (bezel): 40.0m
*Eagletac G25C2-II* (stock): Weight 141.0g, Length: 150.6mm, Width: 39.6mm
*Olight M22*: Weight: 148.4g, Length: 144.8mm, Width: 41.2mm (bezel)

Overall dimensions are similar to the original Predator, but the new ArmyTek lights are heavier now, with a more typical bezel diameter. Overall dimensions are consistent for this class.






















As always, ArmyTek build quality is very high, and the lights have a very robust feel. Physically, the models are distinguished primarily by their emitters (XP-G2 on the Predators, XM-L2 on the Vikings) and corresponding reflectors. The Pro versions differ from the regular versions in terms of circuit features and interface. All lights come with a choice of bezel/tail ring colors and crenelation styles. 

The ArmyTek finish is fairly unique in my testing - the bodies of their lights have a very thick matte finish anodizing that feels almost molded (i.e., it is very "grippy"). According to ArmyTek, this coating is much thicker than most lights (i.e., harder anodizing). Although the light lacks knurling, grip is actually quite decent thanks to this unique finish. And there are some ridge detail elements to help further with grip.

Note the grippier finish may show dirt, hand oil, etc, more easily than traditional glossy knurling. There are also few anti-roll features, aside from some cut-outs in the bundled rubber grip ring.

Lettering is very bright and clear, and exceptionally legible. In additional to model information on the body tube and bezel, the voltage range and supported cells are printed right on the light.

Screw threads are thick square-cut (trapezoidal), and anodized at the tail region of the battery tube and in the tailcap (for lock-out).

The tailcap switch is a forward clicky in all lights, with good feel. The spring is thicker and longer than typical on these sorts of lights, with a flat connector piece (so as not to scratch your batteries). The lights cannot tailstand.

There is a small raised contact point in the head, so high capacity flat-top batteries can be used. All my 18650 cells fit in the lights – there is in fact quite a generous amount of cell length space.














The Predator reflector is optimized for max throw, with a 5 degree spot angle for its XP-G2 emitter. In contrast, the more general purpose Viking has a 10 degree spot angle for its XM-L emitter (both series have a 40 degree spill angle). As you see in the pics below, even though the Predators put out less light overall, they can deliver more light on target at a distance.

Both my samples in this series came with smooth reflectors, so some artifacts are possible. Emitters were all well centered on my samples. There is an anti-glare coating on the lens, which gives the signature ArmyTek green tint. ArmyTek claims this is a higher quality anti-glare coating normally found on photographic equipment.

ArmyTek doesn't supply diffusers, but the Olight M22 diffuser fits fine on all bezel styles (as should most ~40mm diffuser covers). 

*User Interface (UI)*

The bundled manuals are sufficient to explain the basic functioning of the lights. However, the current v2.5 Pro manual lacks a description of the programming interface. :thinking: You will need this if you are going to take advantage of the full feature set. 

Fortunately, you can still download a copy of the old Predator Pro v2.3 instructions. According to ArmyTek, the main difference is in the specified output levels (i.e., refer to your v2.5 manual for the correct ones). Also, the default battery is now the LiFePO4 18650, and FULL stabilization is turned on by default on both lines, for both Military and Outdoor (these terms are all explained below).

I will give some highlights of what to expect below, but you will need to download those earlier instructions to actually configure everything. Note that the Pro light is reasonably straight-forward to use once programmed, but has a sophisticated programming interface (somewhat akin to the HDS/Ra and older Novatac/LiteFlux lights).

In simple terms, either light is turned on/off by the forward tailcap clicky switch (press for momentary on, click for lock on). 

_Regular version_

For the regular version, turning the light on with the head tight against the body gives you Max output.

With the head loosened, you get the choice of three modes accessed in sequence by soft pressing or clicking the tail switch off/on: Middle > Lo > Lower Lo, in a repeating loop. Note that you need to pause ~1 sec between presses or clicks to advance the modes. 

The light does have mode memory for the head-loosened state, and returns to the last mode you had it in (if you leave it off for a few seconds, or click off-on rapidly).

And that's it – no blinky modes on the regular version. :wave:

_Pro version_

For the Pro version, output modes are arranged in what ArmyTek calls two "lines" (i.e. head tight for "First line", and head loosened for "Second line"). Within each of these head states/lines, there are multiple modes that you can switch between. Switching is controlled by twist cycles of the head relative to the body (i.e. loosen/tighten or tighten/loosen to advance modes within each "line"). 

How many modes per line, and what they are, are fully user-programmable. The light comes with two factory pre-set set states, called "Military" and "Outdoor", and you can also set your own saved custom one. Military comes set by default, but you can switch between them in the programming menus.

Military is set with Full regulation, with the First line (head tightened) having three modes, accessed in sequence: “670 lumens” > "6 lumens" > "200 lumens". Second line (head loosened) has two modes: Strobe 15 Hz, and Firefly “1.5 lumens”. Again, you switch between modes by tighten/loosen (second line) or loosen/tighten (first line) head twists in under 1 sec.

I don't have specific lumen settings for the Outdoor mode pre-set, as these aren't detailed in the simple manual that accompanies the light. :shrug: Also, see my actual testing results later in this review to see how these lumen estimates actually measure up.

_Features of the Pro Model_

To start, you can change any of those pre-set output modes to one of three Firefly modes, or anywhere along a 1-100% continuously-variable ramp (with flashes at 25%, 50%, 75% and 100% output over a 40 sec timeframe). In addition to constant output modes, you can select SOS, Beacon or Strobe mode. Within Strobe, you can set the frequency from 1 Hz to 50 Hz (see below for my actual analysis).

You can change the number of pre-set modes in First line from anywhere from 1 to 10 modes, and Second line from 1 to 5 modes (default is 2-3, depending on whether Outdoor or Military defaults are chosen).

You can set the auto mode-memorization feature for each line independently (i.e. remember last mode for both lines, neither, or only one or the other).

You can specify the battery voltage being used (2xCR123A 3V batteries, 1x18650 3.7V Li-ion, 2xRCR 3.7V Li-ion, 1x18650 LifeP04 3.2V). Unprotected batteries can also be used.

But what is truly innovative is the ability to set three different regulation patterns for the light. FULL regulation is as you’d expect – perfectly flat regulation for as long as the battery can handle it, then an immediate drop to off (although in this case to an ultra-low output state, rather than off). SEMI regulation is what you typically find on a number of multi-power lights – the light maintains flat regulation for a while, then drops into direct-drive as the battery power dwindles. STEP regulation has is a similar overall efficiency to SEMI, but shows a step-down pattern of lowering outputs rather than a smooth drop-off. All of these patterns are shown in my runtimes graphs later in this review.

_How to Program the Pro Model Settings_

Again, you are going to have to download the old Predator Pro v2.3 instructions for the time being, if you want to be able to program the light. The manual explains what each of program selection options are.

But I can at least explain the general process. To select a variable output level in the first line, start from head tight and loosen the head for at least 1 sec and wait for the light to switch lines. Once it does, then immediate tighten, and wait again for the line to switch back. When it does, immediately turn off-on at the clicky. All the above has to be done in under 3 secs total, so timing is very tight (i.e. don’t delay on the head twist any longer than necessary to switch lines). It is highly unlikely that you would ever enter the programming state by accident. 

Here is what the light will do, as plotted in estimated lumens (note: this is not my relative output scale, but actual computed lumens):






I show a blow-up insert of the first ~11 secs or, as the Firefly modes are too dim to compare to the continuously variable ramp. 

As you can tell above, you get three Firefly modes in sequence, for about ~3 sec each with a ~1 sec off pause between them. This is followed by continuously-variable ramp from Lo to Max, which takes about 40 secs in total (with flashes at 25%, 50%, 75% and 100% output). Once Max output is reached, the light restarts at lowest Firefly and cycles through again. Make your selection by a loosen-tighten head switch.

The continuously-variable ramp is relatively visually-linear to the eye (at least up to the 75% mark), and the quarter percent flashes are helpful to calibrate your relative setting. Beyond the 75% mark though, light output seems pretty constant. I am not quite sure why this is, but note that my Viking Pro v2.5 continues to risk in output over the whole ramp.

But you will have to be quick to select any of the truly low outputs. Note that the lowest non-Firefly level that I was able to capture off the contrinuous ramp was ~25 estimated lumens. 

To enter the general programming menus, you start in the second line modes. Do the same as the first line output selection above, only starting with the head loosened (i.e. tighten, wait 1 sec, loosen, wait 1 sec, click off-on – all under 3 secs in total). Once inside the programming state, you double-click the tailcap to advance through menu levels, and tighten/loosen the head to select the menu entry you want. Menu levels and sub-levels are presented as a series of bright flashes. Please refer to the manual for a description of what each of the menus represent.

Again, the point here is that you will need the full instruction sheet to be able to re-program the light. You really can't do it without the proper manual in front of you. But once programmed the way you want, the light is straight-forward to use (as described at the top of this section).

*Video*: 

For information on both the Predator and Viking series lights, including the build and user interface, please see my video overview:



Video was recorded in 720p, but YouTube typically defaults to 360p. Once the video is running, you can click on the configuration settings icon and select the higher 480p to 720p options. You can also run full-screen. 

As with all my videos, I recommend you have annotations turned on. I commonly update the commentary with additional information or clarifications before publicly releasing the video.

*PWM*

Light has no evidence of PWM on any mode, leading me to believe it is current-controlled. :twothumbs
_
*UPDATE JULY 13, 2013*: Actually, there is a reoccurring signal on the second Firefly mode (but not the first or third) of both the Viking Pro and Predator Pro. Unfortunately, the light intensity is too low for my oscilloscope sensor to detect, but I can measure the frequency by freeze-frame photography: it is 180 Hz on both lights. Without an oscilloscope trace to examine, I am unable to ascertain whether or not this is actual PWM. But regardless, this frequency of "flicker" is detectable by eye._

*Strobe/Beacon*

There is no strobe mode on the regular series model – it is only the Pro version that supports blinking modes.

The default strobe on the Pro is rated as 15 Hz:






Which, as you can see, seems pretty accurate according to my oscilloscope. 

According to the full manual, you can set the strobe frequency anywhere from 1 to 50 Hz. Here's what I managed to set as the lowest and highest strobes:










And again, pretty good concordance with my oscilloscope. :thumbsup:

Note that the original Predator claimed this same 1-50 Hz range as well – but the strobe frequency changed so quickly (i.e., at an accelerating rate) it was next to impossible to select the really high modes. I am happy to report the new Pro models provide a slower acceleration rate. You now have ~28 secs to select your strobe frequency, although you have less than ~8 secs to choose anything in the 20-50 Hz range. Still, this is much better than the original Predator, when you had ~1 sec to select anything in this range.

Here are some additional strobe modes that I captured, after ~6 secs and ~23 secs:










A minor point for you techno-geeks: as with the original Predator, the strobe pulse duration (duty cycle) does not stay entirely consistent across the full range of frequencies. A typical strobe mode has a 50:50 on/off cycle. But starting at the >30Hz frequencies on the Pro version, the on-pulse duration gradually increases to ~60% by the max 54 Hz (i.e., 60:40 cycle). That is more consistent than the original predator though, which was already at ~65% by 30Hz. None of this matters in terms of how disorienting the strobe is, but I thought I'd point it out. :wave: 

As an aside, I don't find 54 Hz strobe very "disorienting" … it's almost like a really bad PWM rate at that level. 

Beacon mode:

Beacon mode was 1 flash every 7.5 secs in my testing. 

*Beamshots:*

For white-wall beamshots below, all lights are on Max output on an AW protected 18650 battery. Lights are about ~0.75 meter from a white wall (with the camera ~1.25 meters back from the wall). Automatic white balance on the camera, to minimize tint differences (but there may still be some variation).

Let's start with a comparison of the Predator and Predator Pro against the Viking and Viking Pro.





























































To show how you the Predator Pro compares against the competition, here are some comparisons to XP-G lights in my collection. In the pics below, "Predator" refers to the original V1.0 model, "G5" is the Foursevens Maelstrom G5 (now MMS) and the "TD-15" is the original Lumintop TD15.





























































The new Predator v2.5 XP-G2 models are clearly higher output – with greater peak throw – than these earlier XP-G lights. 

_Outdoor Beamshots_

For outdoor beamshots, these are done in the style of my earlier 100-yard round-up review. Please see that thread for a discussion of the topography (i.e. the road dips in the distance, to better show you the corona in the mid-ground). FYI, any "streaks" you see across the images are bug-trails. Flying insects are often attracted to the bright lights, and their flight trails get captured as swirly streaks due to the long exposure time.  Also, ignore any tint differences below – they are mainly due to the automatic white balance setting on the camera.

Again, let's start with a comparison of the Predator and Viking classes. For outdoor shots, I am only showing the Pro versions of the Predator and Viking.










ArmyTek intends for the Predator and Viking models to be used by different groups. As you can tell from the beamshots above, the beam patterns at a distance are clearly very different.

Now, let's see how the Predator Pro compares to some relatively throwy recent XM-L2 lights in my collection.






While lower overall output, the Predator certainly does throw a more focused beam than your typical well-focused XM-L2 light.

*Testing Method:* 

All my output numbers are relative for my home-made light box setup, a la Quickbeam's flashlightreviews.com method. You can directly compare all my relative output values from different reviews - i.e. an output value of "10" in one graph is the same as "10" in another. All runtimes are done under a cooling fan, except for any extended run Lo/Min modes (i.e. >12 hours) which are done without cooling.

I have devised a method for converting my lightbox relative output values (ROV) to estimated Lumens. See my How to convert Selfbuilt's Lightbox values to Lumens thread for more info. 

*Throw/Output Summary Chart:*

My summary tables are reported in a manner consistent with the ANSI FL-1 standard for flashlight testing. Please see http://www.flashlightreviews.ca/FL1.htm for a discussion, and a description of all the terms used in these tables. Effective July 2012, I have updated all my Peak Intensity/Beam Distance measures with a NIST-certified Extech EA31 lightmeter (orange highlights).














As expected, The Predator models have less output – but more throw – than the Viking models. 

The two Predator versions are rated to the same max output level ("670 LED lumens"), although my regular Predator seemed surprisingly bright at an ~560 estimated ANSI FL-1 lumens. Note that "LED lumens" typically refer to theoretical max output of the emitter for a given drive level, and do not take into account actual losses due to the circuit, heat build-up in the emitter, reflector and lens effects, etc. All told, these can easily cut ~25-30% off the theoretical output levels. Note that ANSI FL-1 testing standard requires actual measurement of output "out the front", between 30-120 secs after activation.

My direct beam measures show an impressive result for the XP-G2-based Predators.

How do my lumen estimates compare across the various levels?






As you can see, my results are fairly consistent across the board (taking into account my ANSI FL-1 estimated lumens vs ArmyTek's published "LED lumens").

*Output/Runtime Graphs:*

_Note: Unless otherwise stated, all my runtimes below are based on AW 2200mAh 18650 cells._

Ok, let's start with the base Regular model, on different types of cells.






The Regular model uses a "STEP" regulation method, where the light steps down in output by discrete levels, depending on the amount of battery power remaining. This is typically quite efficient (scroll down for comparison runtimes). What you can see above is that on Max, 2xRCR hits an abrupt termination (due to the protection circuits being triggered). But the 2xCR123A and 1x18650 show a very clear step-down pattern.

Let's compare that to the default "FULL" regulation method on the Pro version:






In FULL regulation, the light should abruptly shut-off on all Li-ion sources, without prior step-down. You can see that above quite clearly for the 1x18650 and 2xRCR runtimes. Interestingly, 2xCR123A continues to have a step-down pattern, even when FULL regulation is selected. One general comment here – you can expect a significantly shorter runtime on 1x18650 when FULL regulation is selected.

To demonstrate that, let's compare the various regulation patterns on the Pro model (STEP, SEMI and FULL – see UI section earlier in this review for an explanation of the terms):






As you can see above, SEMI and STEP have generally equivalent runtime – it just comes down to whether or not you like to see discrete steps. I am a bit surprised as how much lower the Max runtime was on FULL, but that may reflect the lower capacity 2200mAh cells used here (i.e., it's possible higher capacity cells may have handled the high drive level better). Personally, I recommend you program the Pro version to STEP or SEMI for maximum runtime (and clearer indication of battery life remaining).

Alright, let's see how the Regular and Pro versions do compared to the competition. To make the runtimes easier to distinguish, the Max modes on the Pro version were done in FULL and SEMI regulation (in contrast the typical STEP of the Regular versions).




















As expected, the XP-G2-based Predator models don't have the same max output as the XM-L2 Vikings (or other XM-L/XM-L2 lights, for that matter). Note that XM-L2 will produce more light than XP-G2 for the same current. But at lower drive currents, there typically isn't much of an efficiency difference between these emitters. You can see that in the results above – at lower levels, the Predator (XP-G2) perform similarly to the XM-L/XM-L2 lights.

Note also that I left the Pro version on FULL stabilization for the Med mode runtime. Based on my previous experience, there typically isn't much of a runtime difference between stabilization methods at the sub-maximal drive levels. 

In terms of overall efficiency, the Predators seem to hold their own quite well, at all levels tested. 

*Potential Issues*

Both Regular and Pro versions are easy to use in their default state. However (and as with all lights with complex programming modes), you will need to refer to the manual if you want to re-program any of the features or output levels of the Pro version. 

The programming modes can be a bit tricky to navigate (i.e. requires multiple twists and clicks). You will need to make sure you keep the head threads clean.

The heavy thickness anodizing is interesting, and provides for reasonably good grip (i.e., I found these lights at least as good as most models with light-to-medium aggressiveness knurling). However, this finish shows up dust, dirt and fingerprint oils more easily than most lights.

The Predator models are intentionally focused for max center-beam throw. Those looking for less distinction between spot and spill should check out my concurrent Viking review. 

Note that the spillbeam width is narrower on these lights than most of the competition. That said, most ~40mm size diffuser covers should fit and work on these lights (e.g., the Olight M22 diffuser works fine).

*Preliminary Observations*

ArmyTek made quite a splash here with the launch of their inaugural light – the Predator – over two years ago. It is nice to see some of the refinements that have been introduced to the Predator over that time, while keeping the same general build and interface.

As always, I find the ArmyTek build to be very robust – these are solid lights to handle. The trademark thick matte anodizing finish is very distinctive, and gives the lights surprisingly decent grip. The lens has a high-quality anti-glare coating, and the rubber grip rings and titanium-coated steel bezel rings and clip help to round out the package.

Of course, what has really distinguished ArmyTek lights are their sophisticated programming interfaces. In this latest iteration of the Predator series, they have opted for two steams – a Regular version (with a simplified clicky-controlled interface), and the Pro version (with the traditional programmable interface). Note that you don't need to actually program the Pro version to use it – it comes with a set of defaults (using a head-twist interface) that works easily, right out of the box.

But if you like to have a full range of control over the light, the Pro version's sophisticated interface lets you set as many pre-set levels as you like (anywhere from 2-15), with an extremely wide range of constant outputs and special modes available (e.g., three Firefly modes, strobe frequencies from 1 to 50+Hz, etc.). Probably the most unique feature of ArmyTek is the choice of three stabilization (regulation) patterns. Check out the UI and Runtimes section of the review for more information here. :wave:

As before, I am glad to see that output/runtime performance is right on par with other decent current-controlled lights of this class.  

In terms of beam pattern, the Predator models maintain the traditional focus of this series on max centre-beam throw. The XP-G2 emitters used here are well suited to this task. For those looking for a less "throwy" option, check out my concurrent Viking series review. But in any case, many of the ~40mm diffuser covers should work with the Predator, giving you option of diffuse light if you want it. 

ArmyTek is really trying to give you a clear choice between throw and a broad hotspot (i.e. Predators vs Vikings), and simple or sophisticated interface (i.e., Regular vs Pro versions). With the continual improvement updates to the Predator/Viking lines, there is little to criticize here – I like the subtle build and interface improvements that have been introduced since my original V1.0 review.

I know this has been a rather long review, and there is common text to my companion Viking series review. Hopefully all this will help you decide if an ArmyTek light is right for you, and which model you should choose in that case. :wave:

----

Predator and Viking models provided by ArmyTek for review.


----------



## gopajti (Jul 12, 2013)

Hi selfbuilt, thank you for your hard work, of course.


You said "Light has no evidence of PWM on any mode, leading me to believe it is current-controlled."


Can you checking the second lowest mode? This mode has pwm(?) flickering. I checked my lights (Viking Pro 2.5 and Predator Pro 2.5) What do you think?


----------



## blackFFM (Jul 12, 2013)

Over 30K lux sems pretty impresive for a light of this size. I think I'm sold. Is there any other light of this build with XP-G2? 




BTW thx for this fantastic review


----------



## whatswrongwithmee (Jul 12, 2013)

That's an amazing amount of throw from that size of a light.


----------



## selfbuilt (Jul 12, 2013)

gopajti said:


> Can you checking the second lowest mode? This mode has pwm(?) flickering. I checked my lights (Viking Pro 2.5 and Predator Pro 2.5) What do you think?


Do you mean the second lowest Firefly mode, or one of the default regular modes? I didn't notice any flicker during testing, but didn't leave them in the Firefly modes for long. I will double-check, but I am unlikely to be able to get a reading from the lower two ... generally, <1 lumen is typically below the detection threshold from my oscilloscope sensor.

In my experience, flicker is not uncommon on moonlight/firefly modes. It seems to be hard for current-controlled makers to stably run lights at such low currents. But I will double-check tomorrow and report back what I am able to see and measure.



blackFFM said:


> Over 30K lux sems pretty impresive for a light of this size. I think I'm sold. Is there any other light of this build with XP-G2?





whatswrongwithmee said:


> That's an amazing amount of throw from that size of a light.


Yes, it is interesting how the XM-L/XM-L2 has virtually completely replaced the XP-G/XP-G2 - even though the latter is far better suited for throw applications. I can only imagine that people chase the highest possible lumen output, and manufacturers respond to that. 

But I think the outdoor beamshots tell an interesting story - all those extra lumens of the XM-L2 get dissipated in the spill (unless you have a much larger reflector to focus them). If you want to put a good amount of light on a target in the mid-to-far distance (with a reasonably compact flashlight build), XP-G2 is a better way to go.


----------



## gopajti (Jul 13, 2013)

> Do you mean the second lowest Firefly mode, or one of the default regular modes?



The second lowest firefly mode.


----------



## tubed (Jul 13, 2013)

great review!
I'm in need a new pocket size thrower and am struggling which to choose. One handed operation and simplicity are key for me. Can you twist the bezel with one hand? I'm looking at the basic model so I wouldn't be doing this move a lot. Just going from low to turbo and back occasionally.


----------



## selfbuilt (Jul 13, 2013)

gopajti said:


> The second lowest firefly mode.


Yes, there is a reoccurring signal on the second Firefly mode (but not the first or third) of both the Viking Pro and Predator Pro. Unfortunately, the light intensity is too low for my oscilloscope sensor to detect, which is why I missed it before (i.e., no signal above background).

But I can measure the frequency by freeze-frame photography: it is 180 Hz on both lights, as shown below. 






Without an oscilloscope trace to examine further, I am unable to ascertain whether or not this is actual PWM. But regardless, this frequency of "flicker" is detectable by eye. Thanks for the heads up gopajti. :wave:



tubed said:


> I'm in need a new pocket size thrower and am struggling which to choose. One handed operation and simplicity are key for me. Can you twist the bezel with one hand? I'm looking at the basic model so I wouldn't be doing this move a lot. Just going from low to turbo and back occasionally.


Unless your hand grip strength is a lot higher than mine, I would have to say no. The Pro lights really need two hands to do a head twist. I suppose the right lube, grip (and strong hands) could do it, but I wouldn't want to rely on that.


----------



## gopajti (Jul 13, 2013)

Thanks selfbuilt


----------



## blackFFM (Jul 14, 2013)

In a light that size a xp-g2 makes more sense to me imho. Most xm-l2 competitors can't hold their 900l over the entire runtime due to heat generation. If I want some flood I can always use a diffuser on the predator. For a compact thrower this would be my favourite choice.


----------



## dajabec (Jul 16, 2013)

gopajti said:


> The second lowest firefly mode.



Just to chime in on what you guys have already confirmed, I think high frequency PWM was necessary to get that lumen level ever since V 1.2.


----------



## selfbuilt (Jul 16, 2013)

dajabec said:


> Just to chime in on what you guys have already confirmed, I think high frequency PWM was necessary to get that lumen level ever since V 1.2.


That's certainly possible for the other two Firefly modes - although the frequency would need to be extremely high for it not to be visible when shining on a fan. Since my oscilloscope sensor can't detect levels that low, I can't verify the PWM on these levels. But it is odd that only the middle Firefly level (on both Pro models) needs to have such a low frequency visible PWM. :shrug:


----------



## Wiggle (Jul 17, 2013)

selfbuilt,
On more of a personal preference note, how do you find the narrow spill of the Armyteks compared to their competition in terms of beam usefulness?


----------



## selfbuilt (Jul 17, 2013)

Wiggle said:


> On more of a personal preference note, how do you find the narrow spill of the Armyteks compared to their competition in terms of beam usefulness?


Well, I typically use a diffuser on most lights outdoor, so native reflector spill angle doesn't matter much to me. When I want throw, I just remove the diffuser - at which point, hotspot intensity is what really matters to me. The Predators are certainly impressive throwers for this size.


----------



## Wiggle (Jul 18, 2013)

Thanks for the input. Speaking of diffusers, you mentioned the M22 diffuser fits, would this also fit the M20 diffuser?


----------



## selfbuilt (Jul 18, 2013)

Wiggle said:


> Thanks for the input. Speaking of diffusers, you mentioned the M22 diffuser fits, would this also fit the M20 diffuser?


No, the M20 has a smaller diameter opening. Only the larger M22 diffuser will fit.


----------



## Wiggle (Jul 19, 2013)

Thanks, I will look for the larger M22 diffuser.


----------



## Wiggle (Jul 22, 2013)

My Predator should be in tomorrow. I am anxious to see how the runtimes are on a 3400mAh cell.


----------



## Wiggle (Jul 23, 2013)

Got mine in finally! (After Fedex managed to lose my first one). Very nice little light. I knew the dimensions and saw it next to some P60 lights but for some reason I was still surprised at how small it was. The beam it throws out is nice and throwey. It outthrows my 2A XP-E2 P60 light and puts up a fight with my Solarforce MPP-1 at closer ranges. The programming is not so bad at all once you just dive in and try it. Only issue that I'm seeing is the lanyard, it attaches through the rubber grip and I'm a little nervous that I would accidentally tear the soft rubber of the grip if the lanyard snagged something.

Also should mention that the narrow spill angle doesn't seem to be an issue at all, for me anyway.


----------



## MBentz (Jul 23, 2013)

Purchased this light today through GoingGear to replace my Eagletac T20C2 as my nightstand light. Thanks for the review selfbuilt.


----------



## Wiggle (Jul 25, 2013)

Did a quick runtime test last night on a Fasttech 3400 mAH protected 18650. Seemed a bit short, got 55 mins on full regulation. However, after I ran it down in max mode I was able to get another 45 mins regulated in 200 lumen mode so it seems to not be draining the cell completely. This cell was at about 4.05V I believe before starting, I'll re-do it with a totally topped off cell just to see if there is a noticeable difference. It should be noted that the light gives you plenty of warning before dropping to firefly, it seems to blink 3 times once per minute roughly for the last 20% or so of the battery life.

I will likely be using the stepped or semi mode in regular use rather than the full regulation.

I had the light out on a trail in the city here last night. Even without complete darkness and drizzle in the air the light seriously impressed. One thing I noticed, this light is just about perfect as a mid to mid-far range light. 20-100 yards is handled beautifully by this beam. I had some reservations about the narrow spill and tight beam but it also works in a pinch as a walking light, though I'd probably prefer a floodier light or a diffuser for a longer hike, especially on uncertain terrain. 

I passed a group of people walking on the trail (they were using no lights most of the time and a phone light when needed it looked like) with the light on 5 lumens just to see where I was going and not to aggravate them with a bright light. After passing them by a good 20-30 yards I decided to switch to max mode and see what it could do. Instantly the entire trail was clearly lit up in front of me with the beam reaching easily 80+ meters out to the back of the trail leading into a turn. I heard someone behind me say "oh my god what is that". I have no doubts that in a more open area, without light pollution and rain you could comfortably hit 250m with this light.

Compared to my favorite thrower in my collection, Solarforce MPP-1 /w UCL (XR-E R2, large smooth reflector, likely around 50-55 kcd) the Predator compares quite favorably. The intensity is only slightly outdone by the MPP-1 but you get a hot spot about 4 times bigger, and a narrower but noticeably brighter spill. Not to mention the head diameter is much smaller than the MPP-1.


----------



## selfbuilt (Jul 25, 2013)

Thanks for the field report. :wave:


----------



## Wiggle (Jul 25, 2013)

Did a proper runtime test. Still came up a bit short to Armytek's spec but got a good bit closer. Cell was charged this morning, measured at 4.19V before commencing test:

3400 mAh Fasttech on Max output, full regulation
Low battery indication - *53 minutes*
Runtime til moonlight - *66 minutes *
Additional runtime on 200 lumen mode -31 minutes


----------



## brighteye11 (Jul 26, 2013)

selfbuilt said:


> Well, I typically use a diffuser on most lights outdoor, so native reflector spill angle doesn't matter much to me. When I want throw, I just remove the diffuser - at which point, hotspot intensity is what really matters to me. The Predators are certainly impressive throwers for this size.


 Selfbuil, thanks very much for your impressive analyses! Would you have an estimate of or comments about how a beamshot of the Predator Pro with M22 diffuser would compare with the beamshots of the Predator Pro (without diffuser), the SRT-7, and the M22 in your last photo sequence in this thread? Thanks much! Brighteye11


----------



## MBentz (Jul 26, 2013)

Well my 2.5 Pro arrived today. I haven't bought a new flashlight since 2009, so this is a massive jump for me. The options this light has is simply astounding! I have some new 18650s charging and can hardly wait to take this beast out tonight to compare to my ancient T20C2. (Circa 2009) This is my first Armytek light, and the first thing that stands out about it is the fit and finish. Simply second to none! However, why they don't include an instruction manual detailing how to customize the light is beyond me. Thank you selfbuilt for the link to the 2.3 version.


----------



## lightcycle1 (Jul 27, 2013)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator Pro 2.5*

Mine arrived today too. I just fired up the first nighttime beam a few minutes ago.

All I can say is wow. This is one hell of a light. Lighting up a parking garage 125 yards away like it's nobodys business. In the rain too. I thought my T20CS threw, and it does, but the Predator outdoes it by far.

Build quality seems top notch. And no flickering issues on it, yet anyway. This is a keeper. 

Sent from my SCH-S720C using Tapatalk 2


----------



## selfbuilt (Jul 28, 2013)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator Pro 2.5*



brighteye11 said:


> Selfbuil, thanks very much for your impressive analyses! Would you have an estimate of or comments about how a beamshot of the Predator Pro with M22 diffuser would compare with the beamshots of the Predator Pro (without diffuser), the SRT-7, and the M22 in your last photo sequence in this thread? Thanks much! Brighteye11


Well, with the diffuser, it doesn't really light up 100 yards very much, so there is not much to compare! :laughing: You will definitely get a wider spill, and much more even beam. Personally, I find a diffuser very useful for checking out things within maybe a ~10m radius without a glaring hotspot ... beyond that, and you are going to want to switch back to throw fairy soon.



MBentz said:


> Simply second to none! However, why they don't include an instruction manual detailing how to customize the light is beyond me. Thank you selfbuilt for the link to the 2.3 version.


Yes, it is a mystery to me why they dropped the manual. I gather they want to re-write it, as apparently they have received feedback that the previous manual was "too complicated". Honestly, I think the issue is that the interface is complex, and so it is hard to describe in words. Like many here, I think a flow-chart diagram would be a useful resource (I've seen a few around over the years here, you could probably find them in a search). But hopefully they will start including a revised manual soon.


----------



## lightcycle1 (Jul 28, 2013)

*Re: Armytek Predator Pro*

I have to get the M22 diffuser. I toolk the Predator out on a walk tonight, the beam is so tight and so hot.....great distance spotter, but for general use it needs some help. I was glad I had my SF C2 M61 on me, and also that SWM T20CS is kind of a nice compromise between a long throw and short range spill. I was especially pleased by the SWM during the comparo tonight.

Sent from my SCH-S720C using Tapatalk 2


----------



## Wiggle (Jul 29, 2013)

*Re: Armytek Predator Pro*

I think I'll get the diffuser as well. I had it out the other night alternating between the Predator and my Blaze. The blaze is a great close to medium range light but lacks the punch of the Predator. If I get the diffuser I can carry just one light  Does anyone know where to buy the M22 diffuser?


----------



## lightcycle1 (Jul 29, 2013)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator*

Can you post or PM source if you find one? Thanks.

Also, for the Predator owners I bought a XENO holster from EDC+. 
It is the HD42. Fits the Predator PERFECTLY, better than the holster included with the Pred and its a much.much higher quality and substantial holster. If you own and carry a Predator this is a must have accessory. EXCELLENT holster.

Sent from my SCH-S720C using Tapatalk 2


----------



## kj2 (Jul 29, 2013)

*Re: Armytek Predator Pro*



Wiggle said:


> I think I'll get the diffuser as well. I had it out the other night alternating between the Predator and my Blaze. The blaze is a great close to medium range light but lacks the punch of the Predator. If I get the diffuser I can carry just one light  Does anyone know where to buy the M22 diffuser?


When I search on eBay, I find one seller (located in the US) that has the M22 diffuser. And many other filters form Olight.


----------



## Wiggle (Jul 29, 2013)

*Re: Armytek Predator Pro*

Thanks found it. Didn't investigate that one closely enough, now I see he has a drop down menu I can pick the M22 diffuser from  I'm going out to the country next weekend and may be able to get some outdoor beamshots to compliment the ones already provided by selfbuilt. I hope to compare the Predator alongside the following lights: Solarforce MPP-1, Solarforce L2T with vinh 4000K XP-E2 2.0A SMO, Shiningbeam Blaze, Jetbeam PA40. Should be a good comparison of lights in the medium lumen range with a variety of beam styles.


----------



## lightcycle1 (Jul 29, 2013)

*Re: ArmyTek*

I cant find it. Can you guys post pr PM me an item #

I just searched on the big computer....no dice.

Sent from my SCH-S720C using Tapatalk 2


----------



## Wiggle (Jul 29, 2013)

*Re: ArmyTek*

PM'ed you.


----------



## lightcycle1 (Jul 29, 2013)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator 2.5*

Thanks guys both of you.

Found and ordered! Should add a good deal of versatility to this light.....huge throw, or diffused floody.

Awesome.

Sent from my SCH-S720C using Tapatalk 2


----------



## lightcycle1 (Jul 31, 2013)

*Re: ArmyTek*

Got my diffuser today. Fits perfectly on the Predator.
Attached it to the Predator body with its own lanyard in one of the grooves of the flashlight body. Pull it off and let the diffuser cap dangle if I want the throw beam.
I also have a 6P style steel ring with a lanyard attachment under the cigar grip ring so the lanyard has a hard attach point instead of the rubber hole in the grip ring. I shortened the lanyard and added a wooden bead slider. Original lanyard was too long unless youll neck carry the light.

Couple this setup with that really nice XENO HD42 holster, and this is now a 1 light do-all setup. 

The diffuser is nice. Coupled with the hi power of the Predator, it washes my entire small backyard in nice soft even light. This will be an outstanding camp light now. I love it.

Sent from my SCH-S720C using Tapatalk 2


----------



## Wiggle (Jul 31, 2013)

Good to hear the diffuser works well. Now I can carry it as a general outdoor light without needing a floody light as well! I'm beginning to really dig the UI as well. I have my first line for outdoors with 20, 80, 200, 450 and second line for indoors with lowest firefly, highest firefly and 5 lumens. How does the light work indoors with diffuser in a lower setting? Comfortable for creeping around without much glare?


----------



## lightcycle1 (Aug 1, 2013)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator*

Yep. Good for indoors on the low settings. Very floody but no glare. I'm really digging this light, especially now that I have both flood and throw. Its a bit large, but I dont mind packing a bigger light if I need to.

I havnt gottwn into the custom programming yet. Defaults are fine for me right now.
The diffuser is such a necessary option for the light I think one should be included.

Sent from my SCH-S720C using Tapatalk 2


----------



## selfbuilt (Aug 1, 2013)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator*



Wiggle said:


> How does the light work indoors with diffuser in a lower setting? Comfortable for creeping around without much glare?





lightcycle1 said:


> Yep. Good for indoors on the low settings. Very floody but no glare. I'm really digging this light, especially now that I have both flood and throw. Its a bit large, but I dont mind packing a bigger light if I need to.


Yes, it is a good diffuser for it. I don't think you would find much of a need on the firefly modes, as they are low enough to be comfortable to even dark adapted eyes. Of course, in those cases, it is really only all hotspot (i.e., the spill is too dim to see).


----------



## blackFFM (Aug 6, 2013)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator*

For $77 I ordered the regular version after I read your review and just received the pro version. Should I be happy? I wanted the normal predator for the higher output but I prefer the constant brightness and the moonlight mode of the pro version. It's all in all a superb flashlight and the f&f is excellent.


EDIT: I can't figure out how this thing works. Mine just flashes when I turn it on and then it stays on moonlight mode? Is is broken?


----------



## MBentz (Aug 6, 2013)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator*

The Pro version for $77 is a steal. It's up to you on sending it back. My guess is if you emailed whoever you bought it from that they'd say keep it. By the time they paid for postage it would even out. Selfbuilt has a link to the FULL instruction manual in his review. I highly suggest reading it.


----------



## MindToAsk (Aug 7, 2013)

Great review, as always!

Is there any major difference in apparent brightness between the white and warm white version of the Predator Pro?


----------



## lightcycle1 (Aug 7, 2013)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator 2.5*

Sadly I think my new Predator Pro is developing the dreaded switch problem after about 40 click cycles.
Ill have to contact Armytek.

Sent from my SCH-S720C using Tapatalk 2


----------



## MBentz (Aug 7, 2013)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator 2.5*



lightcycle1 said:


> Sadly I think my new Predator Pro is developing the dreaded switch problem after about 40 click cycles.
> Ill have to contact Armytek.
> 
> Sent from my SCH-S720C using Tapatalk 2



This makes me nervous. There are a couple people on CPFMP who had the same issue and Armtek sent them new tail caps. No idea if the newer ones have been redesigned to fix the issue though. Knock on wood, my light has no issues.


----------



## WilsonCQB1911 (Aug 7, 2013)

*ArmyTek Predator 2.5 (XP-G2 R5 1x18650 2xCR123A/RCR) Regular and Pro Review: RU*



lightcycle1 said:


> Sadly I think my new Predator Pro is developing the dreaded switch problem after about 40 click cycles.
> Ill have to contact Armytek.
> 
> Sent from my SCH-S720C using Tapatalk 2



What is the switch problem?


----------



## MBentz (Aug 7, 2013)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator 2.5 (XP-G2 R5 1x18650 2xCR123A/RCR) Regular and Pro Review: RU*



WilsonCQB1911 said:


> What is the switch problem?



http://www.cpfmarketplace.com/mp/sh...cap-issues-Light-flickers-when-turning-on-off


----------



## lightcycle1 (Aug 7, 2013)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator 2.5*



WilsonCQB1911 said:


> What is the switch problem?



Flickers off and on when clicking the tailswitch on.
Click switch, light blips amd goes out, click again of you are lucky it will stay on. Ive had it happen through two complete click cycles now. In other words it took three clicks to start the light. 

Sent from my SCH-S720C using Tapatalk 2


----------



## Wiggle (Aug 8, 2013)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator 2.5*

Regarding the switch issue, I had that flickering issue as well and Armytek took care of me really well. It was basically a flickering while being used in momentary mode only, locking in wasn't an issue. They sent me a new tailcap just two days after I brought up the issue and exchanged some e-mails. New one works perfect, I tried to make it flicker with no luck.

Got in my M22 diffusser, like selfbuilt suggests it fits quite well and definitely softens up the beam pattern. Doesn't seem to lose very much output and really turns the light into a 90% flood pattern with just a bit more intensity towards the center, no real hotspot anymore just a gradient. Aesthetically, the diffuser matches the light quite well having a similar matte black finish. The number of cuts in the head even lines up the flat parts on the Predator bezel.


----------



## BeastFlashlight (Aug 10, 2013)

blackFFM said:


> In a light that size a xp-g2 makes more sense to me imho. Most xm-l2 competitors can't hold their 900l over the entire runtime due to heat generation.



Can the Viking Pro hold it's 850 for it's entire runtime?


----------



## selfbuilt (Aug 11, 2013)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator 2.5 (XP-G2 R5 1x18650 2xCR123A/RCR) Regular and Pro Review: RUN*



BeastFlashlight said:


> Can the Viking Pro hold it's 850 for it's entire runtime?


If you run it in FULL regulation mode, output will stay constant. Note the true lumen output is less than those theoretical specs. See the tables and charts in the review, where this is all described.


----------



## TKhanson (Aug 12, 2013)

Does anyone know if there is a defuser extension that would easily accommodate its use for use in tents? I'm so new to flash light research that I apologize for not knowing the proper term of these additions. For smaller lights they are the fogged, clear top that mounts on the top and makes turns the light into a great room light source when camping, functioning with a power outage, etc. 

Thx.


----------



## selfbuilt (Aug 12, 2013)

TKhanson said:


> Does anyone know if there is a defuser extension that would easily accommodate its use for use in tents? I'm so new to flash light research that I apologize for not knowing the proper term of these additions. For smaller lights they are the fogged, clear top that mounts on the top and makes turns the light into a great room light source when camping, functioning with a power outage, etc.


Yes, what you are looking for is typically called a diffuser wand around here. Anything that's designed to work with a 40mm bezel opening would be fine. I don't know if Fenix has one to fit that size, but Nitecore does - the NDF 40 (not to be confused with the NFD 40, which is the flat-top diffuser style). You can also find cheaper generic versions (such as this one), but I haven't tried any myself.


----------



## Wiggle (Aug 23, 2013)

Some more impressions after using the light more:
Quite impressed with the throw and quality in this form factor. Love the flexibility of setting the light up exactly how you like. Combination of high modes make this a great mid-far range spotter and adding the diffuser to the low lumen makes it totally useable as an all around light if you choose not to carry a smaller light for these needs. As evidenced by subwoofer's runtime test on .1 lumen, the light has some very respectable efficiency on the bottom end.

Only area of concern, little worried about tearing an o-ring with all the head twisting, even with lube it feels like a lot of drag. But perhaps this may be due to the two o-rings and doesn't indicate a problem. It certainly feels well damped and high quality at least. Has anyone else had their o-rings wear down prematurely or is this how the light is supposed to feel during head twists?


----------



## stevieo (Aug 24, 2013)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator 2.5*

ditto. same exact problem here after a couple of days on the regular predator 2.5.
also, 2nd line memory, if there really is one, is lost when flickering on in 1st line & switching to 2nd line. my experience before the problem is that 2nd line memory is lost if the light is turned off in 1st line & left off for a while. it seems to eventually reset itself to the low mode not that it matters since it does not have any mode memory if turned off in 2nd line. with some batteries the clicky only works as a twisty. I expect Armytek will promptly correct problem.



lightcycle1 said:


> Flickers off and on when clicking the tailswitch on.
> Click switch, light blips amd goes out, click again of you are lucky it will stay on. Ive had it happen through two complete click cycles now. In other words it took three clicks to start the light.
> 
> Sent from my SCH-S720C using Tapatalk 2


----------



## lightcycle1 (Aug 26, 2013)

*Re:*

My tail cap is on the way. Sandra from from Armytek was quite responsive and helpful.

Sent from my SCH-S720C using Tapatalk 2


----------



## stevieo (Aug 26, 2013)

*Re:*

same here. i agree that sandra is quite responsive. she wanted me to send the entire light back. I told her that if the whole light went back it would be for a refund. she sent another email on how to test to see if all I needed was a replacement tailcap. her tailcap testing instructions made zero sense in english. I removed the tailcap & touched a paperclip to the negative end of the battery & made contact with the shiny exposed bottom rim of the tube end & the light fired up indicating tailcap problem. new tailcap will be shipped. excellent service.



lightcycle1 said:


> My tail cap is on the way. Sandra from from Armytek was quite responsive and helpful.
> 
> Sent from my SCH-S720C using Tapatalk 2


----------



## Swedpat (Sep 7, 2013)

*Re:*

*Hi Selfbuilt*, and thanks for the great review. I received a predator PRO with warm tint earlier this week. This is an excellent flashlight with a comfortable hold and an awesome tint. Also it's a really great thrower for it's size. 
I did some runtime tests with different batteries:

**2RCR123 Tenergy LifePO(640 and 190lm)
*2CR123 Titanium Innovation double pack
*AW 17670
*EagTac 3400mAh*

With all these cells I had a step down of 18-19% after a while. But still I think the setting is FULL brightness; it didn't really behave like the STEP down in your graphs(no 3flashes with CR123s while 2 times with Li-Ion 3400, didn't try 17670 so far).

*Tenergy LifePO*: stable output at highest level for 16 min, then an instant drop to ~81%, a few seconds after that an instant drop to firefly level.
Updated: At 190lm mode(~140 OTF lumen) I got 95min stable output until 3 flashes and then drop down to firefly level.

*Titanium Innovation:* stable output for 27min, then instant drop to ~81%. Then stable at that output until 33min 45s, followed by instant drop to firefly level

*AW17670:* stable output until 15min, then instant drop to ~81%, then stable at that output until almost 39min, 3 flashes and a drop down to ~64% of initial brightness. I stopped the test at that moment.

*EagTac 3400mAh:* stable putput until 15min, then instant drop to ~81% until 66min, then 3 flashes. and a drop down to ~64% of initial. This time I let the light go on. It continued at that level until 80min. Then a second time 3 flashes, directly followed by an instant drop to firefly level.

To be honest I am a bit dissaponted with the runtimes of this light, it' not close to what specifications could make one to expect. Also the advanced manual(not included in the package) I find horrible complicated to understand. I really would like this light with only a few simple modes and nothing more. 
About the batteries I am surprised that AW17670(1600mAh) provided more than half the performance of EagTac 3400mAh. Especially when I take in consider that the 17670 I used in this test isn't recently charged, it's some month ago, while the EagTac 3400 was charged yesterday.
Because the drop down to ~81% still means around 400 OTF lm it's not a big issue for me. It's a supreme thrower anyway...

I welcome your thoughts about my results.


----------



## selfbuilt (Sep 7, 2013)

*Re:*



Swedpat said:


> With all these cells I had a step down of 18-19% after a while. But still I think the setting is FULL brightness; it didn't really behave like the STEP down in your graphs


Actually, what you describe in your post sounds exactly like a STEP down pattern. The fact that the precise timing of the steps varies from mine likely just reflect the different batteries used. Thanks for the sharing the additional testing experience.



> About the batteries I am surprised that AW17670(1600mAh) provided more than half the performance of EagTac 3400mAh. Especially when I take in consider that the 17670 I used in this test isn't recently charged, it's some month ago, while the EagTac 3400 was charged yesterday.


The rated capacities of various cells is always a bit misleading. They are based on single discharge current (likely a low one), and don't scale linearly between different cells. That means that while a 3400mAh cell could have more than twice the capacity of those 1600mAh AW cells at a low discharge current, at a high current (as you are examining here) you'll find the difference isn't as great.


----------



## Swedpat (Sep 7, 2013)

*Re:*

Thanks for the reply Selfbuilt!

Ok, then I have to decide if I want to have stepdown with the Li-Ions. I understand the useful runtime will be shorter with FULL while the STEP in my example actually hardly is noticed in real use. Though I could notice the fast drop with my eyes like a slight decrease of brightness the lightmeter was necessary to know how much it dropped. Even at ~81% of initial brightness(similar output at Fenix TK15S2) I measured close to twice the lux of the hotspot!

*By the way:* on the body it stands: 2,4-8,4V. This means the Predator could be runned by 2x18650 if an extender could be used. Right? If so it should result in a dramatical improvement of the flat runtime!


----------



## lightcycle1 (Sep 7, 2013)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator 2.5*

Its been three weeks now since Sandra emailed that my tailcap had shipped out and I havnt recieved it.

China Post tracking says "origin is preparing shipment"

Really?

I emailed Armytek about it today. We'll see what happens.
Sent from my SCH-S720C using Tapatalk 2


----------



## selfbuilt (Sep 7, 2013)

*Re:*



Swedpat said:


> *By the way:* on the body it stands: 2,4-8,4V. This means the Predator could be runned by 2x18650 if an extender could be used. Right? If so it should result in a dramatical improvement of the flat runtime!


No, you can run it on 2x 3.7V Li-ion sources (~4.2V fully charged). 2xRCR or 2x18650 (with an extender) would be fine.

And you can always try SEMI for the same overall efficiency as STEP, but without the noticeable drops.


----------



## Swedpat (Sep 7, 2013)

*Re:*



selfbuilt said:


> No, you can run it on 2x 3.7V Li-ion sources (~4.2V fully charged). 2xRCR or 2x18650 (with an extender) would be fine.
> 
> And you can always try SEMI for the same overall efficiency as STEP, but without the noticeable drops.



I guess you meant yes?  

I went out this night a bit outside the city and walked by a path in the forest where people use to walk and jogg at daytime. 
I brought with me the Predator and the Nitecore MT40(Excellent flashlight for the price). The predator and MT40 have very similar hotspot lux on max, even if MT40 has a slightly larger hotspot and wider spill. A totaly higher output as well.
Then I could notice the advantage of warm(at least neutral in this case) tint: The warmer tint of Predator warm makes it possible to much better see the natural colors of the nature. Also a narrow spill has it's advantage in some cases, because you don't always need to shine up your shoes at the same time you want to see a distant object. A wide spill sometimes dazzles on the foreground.
The ArmyTek Predator Pro is an excellent flashlight and if it would be possible to get some extender for 2x18650 use I will get it! 

Apart from that I am interested in as well a Viking Pro and a Barracuda warm tint!


----------



## degarb (Sep 7, 2013)

*Re:*

What is the candela of the light? 400 meters is a subjective term, unless there is a conversion formula that I don't know.


----------



## blackFFM (Sep 7, 2013)

*Re:*



degarb said:


> What is the candela of the light? 400 meters is a subjective term, unless there is a conversion formula that I don't know.



Look at the chart on page 1.


----------



## AILL (Sep 8, 2013)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator 2.5*

Hello,

did anybody ever measure the voltage of the cell after being drained by the light?

I have some strange results:

http://www.messerforum.net/showthre...edator-Pro-2-5&p=936050&viewfull=1#post936050

1st picture: full regulation, battery type 2,5v protection, NCR18650B protected. 3,3V at the end of the measuring.
2nd picture: full regulation, battery type 2,8v protection, NCR18650B protected. 3,35V at the end.
without picture a third measuring yesterday with unprotected Samsung ICR 18650 30B. 2,8v protection. The light goes out at 3,6V

These voltages seem rather high to me.

Andreas


----------



## selfbuilt (Sep 8, 2013)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator 2.5*



degarb said:


> What is the candela of the light? 400 meters is a subjective term, unless there is a conversion formula that I don't know.



As BlackFFM pointed out, actual measures are in my output table. Note that cd is the same as [email protected]



AILL said:


> These voltages seem rather high to me.


They sound possible to me (at the least 3.3V). The issue is that on Max, you are driving the light (and thus the battery) very hard. Under a heavy load, the voltage drops very quickly once you get into the low 3 V range. This means it also bounces back very quickly once the load is removed. So it is quite reasonable to find a near-immediate resting voltage in the low 3 V range for a battery with a high 2 V protection cut-off under load.

Incidentally, this is why it is a lot worse to slowy drain a cell near the termination voltage. At a low drive current, you battery could stay well below 3.0V for a very long time, before triggering the protection circuit.


----------



## Wiggle (Sep 22, 2013)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator 2.5*

After more time with this light I can say I've only gotten happier with it. It's a bit of a specific niche but if you want a compact thrower with programmability, this is your light. There is so much versatility to this light it can be almost overwhelming the amount of options you can configure but at the end of the day I enjoy having that choice. The physical impression of this light is very positive too, superb build and feel. The light is very "smart" in regards to the programming but it also gets out of the way for actual use. For this reason I have no reservation about handing this light off to a new user once it is setup, all the gears and complexities behind the scene are well hidden.


----------



## stevieo (Sep 26, 2013)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator 2.5*

my replacement tailcap arrived today. one month after I notified armytek of the defective part and one week after it was shown "shipped". next time I will buy Armeytek from a North American reseller. but it is an awesome thrower for a single cell light. love that tight beam & solid build.



lightcycle1 said:


> Its been three weeks now since Sandra emailed that my tailcap had shipped out and I havnt recieved it.
> 
> China Post tracking says "origin is preparing shipment"
> 
> ...


----------



## liquidwater (Oct 1, 2013)

why is it that the non-pro version throws more?


----------



## selfbuilt (Oct 1, 2013)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator 2.5 (XP-G2 R5 1x18650 2xCR123A/RCR) Regular and Pro Review: RUN*



liquidwater said:


> why is it that the non-pro version throws more?


Because it also shows more output.

I don't know if that is consistent between the regular and pro versions, our just natural variation between my samples.


----------



## Swedpat (Oct 1, 2013)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator 2.5 (XP-G2 R5 1x18650 2xCR123A/RCR) Regular and Pro Review: RUN*



selfbuilt said:


> Because it also shows more output.
> 
> I don't know if that is consistent between the regular and pro versions, our just natural variation between my samples.



When I read at Armytek site the numbers of as well the output and throw are the same for pro- and non-pro versions. 670lm/400m for cool option and 640lm/350m for neutral option. 

Also I notice that the relation between lumens and meters of throw is strange; the difference between throw length of cool and neutral is larger than the difference of lumens, it should be the opposite case, providing emitter size is the same. Or isn't it?


----------



## selfbuilt (Oct 1, 2013)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator 2.5 (XP-G2 R5 1x18650 2xCR123A/RCR) Regular and Pro Review: RU*

Typically, official output lumen measures and beam distance are based on the averages of multiple samples. Since throw measures are dependent on exact positioning of the reflector, they are bound to be more variable than the output measures. Depending on the samples, this could skew beam distance average measures somewhat.

Armytek's output measures are not ANSI FL1 lumens, so I am not sure how they determine them. Typically, based on specs, you should not expect any significant throw or output differences between regular and pro. Both throw and output should be equally affected in any lower output bin (eg, neutrals).


----------



## kj2 (Nov 17, 2013)

selfbuilt said:


> No, the M20 has a smaller diameter opening. Only the larger M22 diffuser will fit.


Got the Predator Pro since yesterday  Only the filters I got for my M22, won't stay on the Predator. It fits but it will come-off, if I have the light up-side-down.


----------



## rickypanecatyl (Nov 17, 2013)

Just curious, do you think the XML2 version of this light would outthrow the XPG2 if you dedomed the XML?


----------



## blackFFM (Nov 17, 2013)

rickypanecatyl said:


> Just curious, do you think the XML2 version of this light would outthrow the XPG2 if you dedomed the XML?



The XM-L2 version of this light is the Viking. Unless You try and mod a viking no one will know.


----------



## selfbuilt (Nov 17, 2013)

kj2 said:


> Got the Predator Pro since yesterday  Only the filters I got for my M22, won't stay on the Predator. It fits but it will come-off, if I have the light up-side-down.


A layer or two of electrical tape on the inside the rubber cover should help with that. I've used this trick on other lights where my existing diffusers don't fit.


----------



## kj2 (Nov 17, 2013)

selfbuilt said:


> A layer or two of electrical tape on the inside the rubber cover should help with that. I've used this trick on other lights where my existing diffusers don't fit.


Uhm.. having my thoughts on modifying my filters. Saw a YouTube video, with a Predator in combo with a Nitecore filter. The guy from that video, says the Nitecore filter fits tight. 
Think I'll go for the Nitecore, and hope it does stay on.


----------



## selfbuilt (Nov 17, 2013)

kj2 said:


> Uhm.. having my thoughts on modifying my filters. Saw a YouTube video, with a Predator in combo with a Nitecore filter. The guy from that video, says the Nitecore filter fits tight.
> Think I'll go for the Nitecore, and hope it does stay on.


My Nitecore NFD40 fits reasonably snug ... but then again, so does my Olight M22 filter. :shrug:


----------



## kj2 (Nov 17, 2013)

selfbuilt said:


> My Nitecore NFD40 fits reasonably snug ... but then again, so does my Olight M22 filter.


Was thinking late last night. I was already planning to visit the ArmyTek-dealer here today, why not get a ArmyTek filter


----------



## MindToAsk (Nov 19, 2013)

Hey guys,

... I finaly talked myself into it and got the Predator Pro. I wanted the warm white version but received the white instead (I think I will keep it though). You have to hold this light in your hand and play with it yourself to fully appreciate it. Figures alone don't do it justice... Well I haven't even got it out in the dark and I am already impressed . I got it yesterday along with the EagTac S25XL3 (MT-G2). Playtime tonight 

Great review selfbuilt! as always... One question though. How much longer of a runtime should I expect with the EagleTac 3100 or 3400 mAh batteries compared to your tests?

An OT question but here it goes:

I have this setup:
- one PredatorPRO 2.5 white
- one Klarus XT 11 (600 lumens version)
- one Fenix TK 15
- one EagleTac S25Xl3 with the MT-G2 emitter
- 3 x EagleTac 3100 (red/white)
- 3 x Eagle Tac 3400 (green/white)

And the question: which battery in which light? What would you do? The 3400s are brand new... still in my charger, so I was thinking of putting them to the same stress, for equal charging cycles in my EagTac and the 3100s in my other lights (as they are already on different charge cycles). The XT11 and Predator are my main lights... Or maybe I should have asked if there is a noticeable difference in runtime between the 2 batteries... Any thoughts?

Thank you.


----------



## rickypanecatyl (Nov 19, 2013)

rickypanecatyl said:


> Just curious, do you think the XML2 version of this light would outthrow the XPG2 if you dedomed the XML?





blackFFM said:


> The XM-L2 version of this light is the Viking. Unless _*You*_ try and mod a viking no one will know.



Actually that's not the only option... someone else could mod a viking!  I was thinking on this vast forum perhaps someone already had. And if not there are some pretty good extrapolaters. So any thoughts?


----------



## mellowhead (Nov 19, 2013)

Maybe PM Vinh and see if he can give you his opinion on that.


----------



## selfbuilt (Nov 19, 2013)

MindToAsk said:


> Great review selfbuilt! as always... One question though. How much longer of a runtime should I expect with the EagleTac 3100 or 3400 mAh batteries compared to your tests?


Typically, you can roughly extrapolate based on the rated capacity. So, 3400mAh would have ~55% more runtime than my 2200mAh. It's a little more complicated because of the specific current used for the ratings (which are fairly low). But it's a good rough guide.


----------



## MindToAsk (Nov 20, 2013)

Good to know that, thank you selfbuilt. 

Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk


----------



## tubed (Dec 5, 2013)

Hey Selfbuilt (or any other owners of the regular version)
i've been trying to find something out about the regular (non pro) version UI.
Your review says the light has mode memory but another review said it didn't. Also the Armytek website isn't clear but seems to suggest it does not have mode memory.

It's very important to me that i can turn this light on in Low
Anyone know the answer?


----------



## alohasurftoad (Dec 5, 2013)

my non-pro doesn't have mode memory. i wish it did, though. sorta makes me think i should have got the pro but i didn't want all the programming hassle. oh well, i mainly have it tightened for max anyway...


----------



## selfbuilt (Dec 6, 2013)

tubed said:


> Hey Selfbuilt (or any other owners of the regular version)
> Your review says the light has mode memory but another review said it didn't. Also the Armytek website isn't clear but seems to suggest it does not have mode memory.





alohasurftoad said:


> my non-pro doesn't have mode memory. i wish it did, though. sorta makes me think i should have got the pro but i didn't want all the programming hassle. oh well, i mainly have it tightened for max anyway...


That is interesting - so your non-pro version doesn't have head-loosened mode memory? My review sample did. Although I can't say how long the mode memory lasts (I didn't test it long term, just over a few mins). And of course, things may have changed since then. :shrug:


----------



## alohasurftoad (Dec 6, 2013)

selfbuilt said:


> That is interesting - so your non-pro version doesn't have head-loosened mode memory? My review sample did. Although I can't say how long the mode memory lasts (I didn't test it long term, just over a few mins). And of course, things may have changed since then. :shrug:



yes, i watched your video and based part of my decision with that in mind, no biggie tho. seems my mode memory only works if you u r using momentary or full clicks with relatively quick presses. i wish there was a LOP reflector option offered awhile back. besides that i really like the construction, matte finish, and overall feel in hand.

btw, selfbuilt, thx for the time and effort for all of your reviews...


----------



## tubed (Dec 6, 2013)

thanks
There was just a post in the LED lights subforum that answered this as well.
There is no real mode memory as far as I can tell. Which is a huge bummer for me since it comes on in the highest setting.


----------



## Wiggle (Dec 10, 2013)

rickypanecatyl said:


> Just curious, do you think the XML2 version of this light would outthrow the XPG2 if you dedomed the XML?



Based on vinhs results it may, but I doubt you'll see a dedomed emitter in a commercial light. Or do you mean to modify it yourself?


----------



## thedoc007 (Dec 10, 2013)

rickypanecatyl said:


> Just curious, do you think the XML2 version of this light would out-throw the XPG2 if you dedomed the XML?



I have a Nitecore P25vn, de-domed XM-L2 and current boosted. It just barely out-throws my Predator 2.5 (close enough that you could reasonably call them the same), but it does it with many more lumens and much wider spill. If you just de-domed (without current boost), I'm fairly certain it would not out-throw the XP-G2 version.


----------



## Swedpat (Dec 14, 2013)

I have played with my Predator 2,5 warm a while now. The possibility to program own modes is great. I removed strobe and have only one mode at line1. I lowered the max output at line1 to ~82% of possible, that's around 400lm. At line2 I have third option of firefly and around 120lm.

But I have got a problem. When I recently dropped in a fresh charged EagleTac 3400mAh cell the light flashes 3 times after only some minute of use and then drop down to firefly. 
I wondered if I made some mistake with the charging and started to recharge the 18650 again. After a minute or shorter the Pila IBC charger shows green. Fully charged according to the charger but empty according to the light...
I tried again with a AW 17670. Here the light worked properly for around 25min and then it flashed 3 times. But the light didn't drop down to firefly. It continued to 3-flash 14-15 times with a minute intervall, before dropped down to firefly, and remained the brightness after every 3flashes. Consequently around 40minutes of total runtime.

A few weeks ago before I changed the factory settings I had much better results. Then the brightness was at maximum(close to 500lm) for around 15min(first time 3 flashes) with both these cells and then dropped to the level I have it now at max. But while it with the 17670 worked for almost 39min before the first time it flashed three times and drop down to firefly, it worked for 65min before the second time 3 flashes and dropped down to an even lower level(~300lm) until, 80min, and then I stopped the test with the 3400 18650.

The question is what is faulty, is it the charger, batteries or the flashlight? It doesn't seem very likely that both these cells have been faulty at the same time so I guess it's either the charger or the light. When it comes to the Predator I can't see any setting which will cause this 2min runtime with a fresh charged 18650. And why the 17670 worked so much better than the 18650, the opposite case as before.

Thankful for comments!

Edit: I dropped the same 18650 cell in my TK22 Neutral and it puts out at least 600lm at turbomode so that shows the cell isn't empty. Something doesn't work properly with the light then..


----------



## Wiggle (Dec 17, 2013)

I think the 3400s are more prone to voltage sag under heavier current draw. So on max mode it may be interpreting this drop as a low battery.


----------



## selfbuilt (Dec 17, 2013)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator 2.5 (XP-G2 R5 1x18650 2xCR123A/RCR) Regular and Pro Review: RUN*



Wiggle said:


> I think the 3400s are more prone to voltage sag under heavier current draw. So on max mode it may be interpreting this drop as a low battery.


That would be my guess as well, especially since the 17670 worked fine (different formulations behave differently under high loads).


----------



## Swedpat (Dec 20, 2013)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator 2.5 (XP-G2 R5 1x18650 2xCR123A/RCR) Regular and Pro Review: RUN*

Thanks for the replies!

In fact, as I described above, the problem occurs when the light is on ~83% of max, while it earlier managed 15 min at max(the same with both these cells). I mailed Armytek about it and received an answer with a proposal of test. I will come back and report the result.


----------



## mward94 (Jan 26, 2014)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator*

Thank you for this review. The tough, rugged look of this light got me interested and your outdoor beam shots sold me. This light was just what i was looking for in a compact thrower.


----------



## Vlk (Jan 27, 2014)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator 2.5 (XP-G2 R5 1x18650 2xCR123A/RCR) Regular and Pro Review: RUN*



Swedpat said:


> Thanks for the replies!
> 
> In fact, as I described above, the problem occurs when the light is on ~83% of max, while it earlier managed 15 min at max(the same with both these cells). I mailed Armytek about it and received an answer with a proposal of test. I will come back and report the result.



I had a problem with Predator Standard too, though of a different kind. The machining of the head and body threads was not matched well, the head was too tight, and after a few twists of it the O-rings got damaged. I put that head on a Viking body and everything was fine. So the Predator went to Going Gear for the exchange. I hope it is just one defective sample. Great light in terms of performance and feel.


----------



## Swedpat (Jan 27, 2014)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator 2.5 (XP-G2 R5 1x18650 2xCR123A/RCR) Regular and Pro Review: RUN*



Vlk said:


> I had a problem with Predator Standard too, though of a different kind. The machining of the head and body threads was not matched well, the head was too tight, and after a few twists of it the O-rings got damaged. I put that head on a Viking body and everything was fine. So the Predator went to Going Gear for the exchange. I hope it is just one defective sample. Great light in terms of performance and feel.



The light is sent back on warranty and I am waiting for a new. With the Predator the head actually wasn't tight but that's the case with my Viking 2.5. And yes; one of the O-rings has became twisted and affected. It's like an edge is carving it. Otherwise the Viking works good as well as Barracuda.


----------



## Vlk (Jan 27, 2014)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator 2.5 (XP-G2 R5 1x18650 2xCR123A/RCR) Regular and Pro Review: RUN*



Swedpat said:


> The light is sent back on warranty and I am waiting for a new. With the Predator the head actually wasn't tight but that's the case with my Viking 2.5. And yes; one of the O-rings has became twisted and affected. It's like an edge is carving it. Otherwise the Viking works good as well as Barracuda.


My Viking Standard developed an interesting problem after couple of months. Immediately after turn on the brightness drops by, say, 10% and stays at this level. This only happens with the head tight max setting. On all kinds of batteries including primaries regardless of the charge. However, it does not happen every time I turn it on but most of the times. Switch okay. I sent it back to China and wait for the replacement. Excellent light aside from that.


----------



## Swedpat (Jan 28, 2014)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator 2.5 (XP-G2 R5 1x18650 2xCR123A/RCR) Regular and Pro Review: RUN*



Vlk said:


> My Viking Standard developed an interesting problem after couple of months. Immediately after turn on the brightness drops by, say, 10% and stays at this level. This only happens with the head tight max setting. On all kinds of batteries including primaries regardless of the charge. However, it does not happen every time I turn it on but most of the times. Switch okay. I sent it back to China and wait for the replacement. Excellent light aside from that.



It seems that Armytek has some issues with the circuits. It's always sad when one needs to send away a light and waiting for a replacement. And Armytek doesn't ship any light before februari 10. Anyway these lights are so excellent so it's worth the wait for getting a properly working sample.


----------



## Vlk (Jan 28, 2014)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator 2.5 (XP-G2 R5 1x18650 2xCR123A/RCR) Regular and Pro Review: RUN*



Swedpat said:


> It seems that Armytek has some issues with the circuits. It's always sad when one needs to send away a light and waiting for a replacement. And Armytek doesn't ship any light before februari 10. Anyway these lights are so excellent so it's worth the wait for getting a properly working sample.



Not until February 10 ? Sandra from Armytek didn't tell me that.
Yeah, they really need to improve quality control. Maybe to move production to Canada? But the lights would cost more. Some, like me and probably you, would pay more for much better reliability, some would not.


----------



## Swedpat (Jan 28, 2014)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator 2.5 (XP-G2 R5 1x18650 2xCR123A/RCR) Regular and Pro Review: RUN*



Vlk said:


> Not until February 10 ? Sandra from Armytek didn't tell me that.
> Yeah, they really need to improve quality control. Maybe to move production to Canada? But the lights would cost more. Some, like me and probably you, would pay more for much better reliability, some would not.



She just must have missed to tell you, because she telled me that. I agree; I am willing to pay more if that needed. Armytek really impressed me: I would describe it as the feeling of Surefire quality to Fenix prices. And the matt unslip surface is SUPERIOR!
It may be that a few issues just need to be solved to make the light complete.


----------



## Vlk (Jan 28, 2014)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator 2.5 (XP-G2 R5 1x18650 2xCR123A/RCR) Regular and Pro Review: RUN*



Swedpat said:


> She just must have missed to tell you, because she telled me that. I agree; I am willing to pay more if that needed. Armytek really impressed me: I would describe it as the feeling of Surefire quality to Fenix prices. And the matt unslip surface is SUPERIOR!
> It may be that a few issues just need to be solved to make the light complete.



Yes, the grip and overall feel of the light is great. Much better than most SureFire lights' grip. It just sticks to your hand. I, in fact, bought Armytek because SureFire has no substitute for this kind of lights. However, personally I don't like the need to twist flashlight head to change modes or even to just change lines like you have to with Viking, Predator and Barracuda. I like to do everything with the click. Like most Surefire and HDS Systems clicky lights. It is faster, more convenient and more reliable. In many circumstances you have only one hand for the light, your other hand is doing something else, working, in a manner of speaking. Nor do I like multiple switches, like Fenix, Klarus, Olight etc.


----------



## The Fish (Mar 18, 2014)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator 2.5 (XP-G2 R5 1x18650 2xCR123A/RCR) Regular and Pro Review: RUN*

*PROBLEM WITH NEW PREDATOR PRO*
I bought this light to use with a handgun in real world situations.
I don't need all kinds of modes/features etc.
The instructions are not understandable due in part to the horrible English.
I simply want to have the tightened line on MAX and the loosened line on strobe or vice versa.
I don't need the light to turn on the water/make toast etc.

I could really use simple (English) instructions on how to get it to the above configuration.
I am relatively computer literate so plain English should do the trick.
If anyone would like to help out by PM,I would really appreciate it.

Thanks in advance.


----------



## mellowhead (Mar 18, 2014)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator 2.5 (XP-G2 R5 1x18650 2xCR123A/RCR) Regular and Pro Review: RUN*



The Fish said:


> *PROBLEM WITH NEW PREDATOR PRO*
> I could really use simple (English) instructions on how to get it to the above configuration.


PM sent. Full programming guide can be found on Armytek's site here: http://www.armytek.com/index.php?dispatch=attachments.getfile&attachment_id=3


----------



## The Fish (Mar 19, 2014)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator 2.5 (XP-G2 R5 1x18650 2xCR123A/RCR) Regular and Pro Review: RUN*

Finally got it to have the right "modes" in both lines. I'm sure it was luck.
The light did not come with complete programming instructions and the only place to find them was online and for the prior model.
Even then,the English was often very awkward when precision was needed.
The engineers need to sit down with an English speaker who can write out the info clearly.
For those on this forum for whom English is not the first language,the instructions must be even more difficult.


----------



## The Fish (Mar 23, 2014)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator 2.5 (XP-G2 R5 1x18650 2xCR123A/RCR) Regular and Pro Review: RUN*

.....


----------



## peartree_423 (Jun 24, 2014)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator 2.5 (XP-G2 R5 1x18650 2xCR123A/RCR) Regular and Pro Review: RUN*

Hey guys,

So I am looking to purchase a tactical light and I was wondering- Would a throwy beam pattern (predator pro) be better than a floody beam pattern (with more lumens) (viking pro) if I was looking to temporarily blind an attacker? It seems like a more focused beam might be better even with fewer lumens because "more of the lumens" are actually directed towards the persons eyes…? idk if that makes any sense or if it is correct. I guess what i am asking is "Is a higher lumen rating or a higher candela rating more important when it comes to blinding someone?"

thanks for your thoughts!

*— peartree_423*


----------



## thedoc007 (Jun 24, 2014)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator 2.5 (XP-G2 R5 1x18650 2xCR123A/RCR) Regular and Pro Review: RUN*



peartree_423 said:


> Would a throwy beam pattern (predator pro) be better than a floody beam pattern (with more lumens) (viking pro) if I was looking to temporarily blind an attacker?...I guess what i am asking is "Is a higher lumen rating or a higher candela rating more important when it comes to blinding someone?"



That really depends on your skills, more than anything else. The question is, how good are you at aiming a light accurately under pressure, when you (or the target, or both) may be moving.

A higher candela light will indeed be more effective IF you can hit them directly in the eyes - not a very large target. But if you miss, it will do less, if anything. A flooder has less potential intensity, but it is a LOT easier to ensure that at least some of the beam will hit the target. Kind of like the argument between shotguns and rifles...one isn't "better" than the other, but they have different strengths depending on the situation.


----------



## RetroTechie (Jun 24, 2014)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator 2.5 (XP-G2 R5 1x18650 2xCR123A/RCR) Regular and Pro Review: RUN*

Order a crenelated bezel to go with it...

Then if faced with an attacker, plant the front of that Predator Pro in their face, rather than the flashlight's beam. And do so forcefully - the light is built to take that kind of abuse. That should do to draw some blood, which will scare off a potential attacker much more than a blinding beam of light.

Oh and... only when really, really, reaaallly necessary!  (personally I don't consider this use AT ALL when buying flashlights - a well planted fist would be just as effective)


----------



## peartree_423 (Jun 24, 2014)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator 2.5 (XP-G2 R5 1x18650 2xCR123A/RCR) Regular and Pro Review: RUN*

Thanks for your responses! I will likely go with the predator and buy a diffuser for general use (by the way, how come people are asking what diffusers work for the predator and going for the m22 diffuser when you can get an armytek diffuser made for the light on the armytek website?) Also, can you even get a predator with a flat bezel or a viking with a crenelated one? On the armytek website I believe you only have the option to choose a color...


----------



## TEEJ (Jun 24, 2014)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator 2.5 (XP-G2 R5 1x18650 2xCR123A/RCR) Regular and Pro Review: RUN*

The cd of the "floody" Viking is many times more than the cd of the ancient "100 eye searing lumens" of the old tactical lights, so, generally, either would work, but the floody beam is better at seeing if they are also trying to toss evidence off into the weeds, wiggle a weapon from a leg, if their buddies are behaving, etc.


----------



## RetroTechie (Jun 24, 2014)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator 2.5 (XP-G2 R5 1x18650 2xCR123A/RCR) Regular and Pro Review: RUN*



peartree_423 said:


> Also, can you even get a predator with a flat bezel or a viking with a crenelated one? On the armytek website I believe you only have the option to choose a color...


Only for the "Pro" models, in cool white, it seems. But afaik bezels are interchangeable, most likely between Viking and Predator models too. You can order extra bezels, just fire off an e-mail to Armytek's sales department.

I've got a 'warm' (neutral white) Predator Pro that _came_ in all black (crenelated bezel). But also got a flat *and* crenelated bezel in gold color, matching clip and tail switch to go with it (and diffuser, and a red filter  ). Just e-mail them what options there are...


----------



## Wiggle (Jun 25, 2014)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator 2.5 (XP-G2 R5 1x18650 2xCR123A/RCR) Regular and Pro Review: RUN*



peartree_423 said:


> by the way, how come people are asking what diffusers work for the predator and going for the m22 diffuser when you can get an armytek diffuser made for the light on the armytek website?



When I was shopping for a diffuser Armytek only had color filters but no general diffuser available. Good to see they have one listed now.


----------



## peartree_423 (Jun 25, 2014)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator 2.5 (XP-G2 R5 1x18650 2xCR123A/RCR) Regular and Pro Review: RUN*

does anyone know if the predator pro with the crenelated bezel would be aloud on an airplane? If I get one I would like to be able to travel with it


----------



## thedoc007 (Jun 25, 2014)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator 2.5 (XP-G2 R5 1x18650 2xCR123A/RCR) Regular and Pro Review: RUN*



peartree_423 said:


> does anyone know if the predator pro with the crenelated bezel would be aloud on an airplane? If I get one I would like to be able to travel with it



I've taken a variety of lights on, with and without crenellated bezels. Never had a problem...I'd avoid any serious strike bezels, like the ridiculous one that Nitecore sells, but as long as it is reasonable, it should be allowed.


----------



## peartree_423 (Jun 25, 2014)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator 2.5 (XP-G2 R5 1x18650 2xCR123A/RCR) Regular and Pro Review: RUN*



thedoc007 said:


> I've taken a variety of lights on, with and without crenellated bezels. Never had a problem...I'd avoid any serious strike bezels, like the ridiculous one that Nitecore sells, but as long as it is reasonable, it should be allowed.



Alright, that's what I wanted to hear! Thanks!


----------



## peartree_423 (Jul 3, 2014)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator 2.5 (XP-G2 R5 1x18650 2xCR123A/RCR) Regular and Pro Review: RUN*

Are there any other "tactical" lights that can throw as far as the predator/predator pro? I'm looking for the best tactical thrower out there


----------



## thedoc007 (Jul 3, 2014)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator 2.5 (XP-G2 R5 1x18650 2xCR123A/RCR) Regular and Pro Review: RUN*



peartree_423 said:


> Are there any other "tactical" lights that can throw as far as the predator/predator pro? I'm looking for the best tactical thrower out there



To my knowledge, for the size, the Predator with XP-G2 is the best stock thrower out there. You can get modded lights that throw more, and certainly if you move up in size, you can get a LOT more. But the Predator is top of class. And no other lights I know of with that kind of throw are built as well. Feels like a tank, and the matte finish is excellent. Wish other companies would adopt that type of anodizing.


----------



## peartree_423 (Jul 3, 2014)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator 2.5 (XP-G2 R5 1x18650 2xCR123A/RCR) Regular and Pro Review: RUN*



thedoc007 said:


> To my knowledge, for the size, the Predator with XP-G2 is the best stock thrower out there. You can get modded lights that throw more, and certainly if you move up in size, you can get a LOT more. But the Predator is top of class. And no other lights I know of with that kind of throw are built as well. Feels like a tank, and the matte finish is excellent. Wish other companies would adopt that type of anodizing.



thanks! I am going to goinggear this summer and I will definitely take a look at the predator pro… I'll probably get it...


----------



## TweakMDS (Jul 3, 2014)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator 2.5 (XP-G2 R5 1x18650 2xCR123A/RCR) Regular and Pro Review: RUN*

The new EagleTac S200c2 does a bit better, but it's an xm-l emitter, so likely the increased lux is from having a higher output altogether. The predator will have a narrower beam.


----------



## Vlk (Jul 4, 2014)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator 2.5 (XP-G2 R5 1x18650 2xCR123A/RCR) Regular and Pro Review: RUN*



thedoc007 said:


> That really depends on your skills, more than anything else. The question is, how good are you at aiming a light accurately under pressure, when you (or the target, or both) may be moving.
> 
> A higher candela light will indeed be more effective IF you can hit them directly in the eyes - not a very large target. But if you miss, it will do less, if anything. A flooder has less potential intensity, but it is a LOT easier to ensure that at least some of the beam will hit the target. Kind of like the argument between shotguns and rifles...one isn't "better" than the other, but they have different strengths depending on the situation.




I agree. Predator's hotspot is very intense but very small. For general purpose tactical light I would choose Viking cool white. It is very bright with quite narrow excellent beam. I used to have it but exchanged it for Viking warm - much nicer tint for both indoors and outdoors. I have Predator cool white too. But both my Armyteks are standard not pro, that's more powerful and probably more reliable.


----------



## Vlk (Jul 4, 2014)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator 2.5 (XP-G2 R5 1x18650 2xCR123A/RCR) Regular and Pro Review: RUN*



TweakMDS said:


> The new EagleTac S200c2 does a bit better, but it's an xm-l emitter, so likely the increased lux is from having a higher output altogether. The predator will have a narrower beam.



Yeah. Also, Vinh modded this light to boost the current and throw is now about 700 meters!
Check the review by Selfbuilt.


----------



## Wiggle (Jul 6, 2014)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator 2.5 (XP-G2 R5 1x18650 2xCR123A/RCR) Regular and Pro Review: RUN*



Vlk said:


> Yeah. Also, Vinh modded this light to boost the current and throw is now about 700 meters!
> Check the review by Selfbuilt.



I believe it was de-dome only, no current boost.


----------



## TEEJ (Jul 6, 2014)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator 2.5 (XP-G2 R5 1x18650 2xCR123A/RCR) Regular and Pro Review: RUN*



Wiggle said:


> I believe it was de-dome only, no current boost.



No, he boosted the current to ~ 4.5 amps IIRC. He also upgraded the wires and some other mods as well....all in addition to dedoming.


----------



## Vlk (Jul 6, 2014)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator 2.5 (XP-G2 R5 1x18650 2xCR123A/RCR) Regular and Pro Review: RUN*



TEEJ said:


> No, he boosted the current to ~ 4.5 amps IIRC. He also upgraded the wires and some other mods as well....all in addition to dedoming.



Vinh also used to mod Predator but no longer. He says it is too much bother. Pity. Modded Predator and Viking could be great.


----------



## TEEJ (Jul 6, 2014)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator 2.5 (XP-G2 R5 1x18650 2xCR123A/RCR) Regular and Pro Review: RUN*

Lights that are regulated so as to still be brighter on more current are good candidates. Lights that need new drivers and or a lot of work to be brighter from a boost are worse candidates, etc.


----------



## Vlk (Jul 6, 2014)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator 2.5 (XP-G2 R5 1x18650 2xCR123A/RCR) Regular and Pro Review: RUN*



TEEJ said:


> Lights that are regulated so as to still be brighter on more current are good candidates. Lights that need new drivers and or a lot of work to be brighter from a boost are worse candidates, etc.



Right. I always thought that Predator could be made a little brighter and Viking could have a little more throw. They are pretty good as they are, just could be made better.


----------



## Vlk (Jul 6, 2014)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator 2.5 (XP-G2 R5 1x18650 2xCR123A/RCR) Regular and Pro Review: RUN*

By the way, I tested for runtimes both the Predator standard cool white and Viking standard warm with all kinds of batteries.
With Panasonic 3100 industrial unprotected Predator gave me 249 hours from the lowest mode to the beginning of flickering. Viking ran for 70 hours under the same conditions. Viking's lowest mode is about twice as bright as the Predator's.


----------



## Wiggle (Jul 7, 2014)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator 2.5 (XP-G2 R5 1x18650 2xCR123A/RCR) Regular and Pro Review: RUN*



Vlk said:


> Right. I always thought that Predator could be made a little brighter and Viking could have a little more throw. They are pretty good as they are, just could be made better.



Since the throw and output of a light are directly proportional (when the light itself is kept same in terms of emitter, reflector etc...) both the throw and output of both lights would increase if driven harder. I would imagine the Viking has more room for increase as the XM-L2 can handle way more current, the XP-G2 in the Predator is already somewhat overdriven even in stock form.


----------



## Wiggle (Jul 7, 2014)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator 2.5 (XP-G2 R5 1x18650 2xCR123A/RCR) Regular and Pro Review: RUN*



TEEJ said:


> No, he boosted the current to ~ 4.5 amps IIRC. He also upgraded the wires and some other mods as well....all in addition to dedoming.



Interesting, I had it in my head he couldn't access the potted driver for some reason.


----------



## Wiggle (Jul 7, 2014)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator 2.5 (XP-G2 R5 1x18650 2xCR123A/RCR) Regular and Pro Review: RUN*



Vlk said:


> By the way, I tested for runtimes both the Predator standard cool white and Viking standard warm with all kinds of batteries.
> With Panasonic 3100 industrial unprotected Predator gave me 249 hours from the lowest mode to the beginning of flickering. Viking ran for 70 hours under the same conditions. Viking's lowest mode is about twice as bright as the Predator's.



Thanks for doing this, by low do you mean the lowest non-moonlight mode?


----------



## Vlk (Jul 7, 2014)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator 2.5 (XP-G2 R5 1x18650 2xCR123A/RCR) Regular and Pro Review: RUN*



Wiggle said:


> Thanks for doing this, by low do you mean the lowest non-moonlight mode?



Yes, that's what I mean. The standard models of both Predator and Viking don't have moonlight modes.
I'd say, Predator's lowest mode is about 6-7 lumens, and Viking's about double that. It's a little hard to be more precise because cool and warm tints are quite different and give you different perceptions. As a sideline, I noticed that at least in my case I need less brightness of warm tints than of cool tints. Certainly indoors. Outdoors - it is more complicated and depends on weather and other factors. I noticed this with both Armytek and HDS Systems lights.
So, besides being a thrower Predator also gives you over ten days of 6 lumens light with Panasonic 3100 and about 173 hours with AW IMR 2000. I didn't test it with 123A primaries on the lowest settings, but it should be close to 200 hours with SureFire batteries, and perhaps others too. I just only use SureFire and occasionally Duracell in all my lights.


----------



## Vlk (Jul 7, 2014)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator 2.5 (XP-G2 R5 1x18650 2xCR123A/RCR) Regular and Pro Review: RUN*



Wiggle said:


> Since the throw and output of a light are directly proportional (when the light itself is kept same in terms of emitter, reflector etc...) both the throw and output of both lights would increase if driven harder. I would imagine the Viking has more room for increase as the XM-L2 can handle way more current, the XP-G2 in the Predator is already somewhat overdriven even in stock form.



You may be right, I don't know. But Viking certainly gets much warmer on max than Predator. Well, it should, I suppose.


----------



## TweakMDS (Jul 13, 2014)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator 2.5 (XP-G2 R5 1x18650 2xCR123A/RCR) Regular and Pro Review: RUN*

Still eyeing a Predator Pro as a thrower that would spend most of it's duty in my glove compartment. However, I'm not sure which bezel option to get, does anyone have a shot of them side by side?

Currently it's between the Olight M22, Predator Pro and Nitecore P25. 
The M22 has the advantage of coming with a diffuser and being cheaper, maybe also a bit more versatile. 
The Predator Pro is awesome at setting it up JUST how I want it, for example: setting the line one to one high mode of 70-80% or so, and getting line 2 as moonlight, 20-ish, 100-ish and full power, maybe also a slow 1Hz strobe for traffic signalling.
The P25 is rechargeable, but I feel like it's a bit of a jack of all trades, master of none.

I do plan on getting a relatively large traffic cone, which needs a bit of tape on the Predator, also not sure how well a traffic cone will work with a light this throwy. Perhape just the tip would light up...
I also have no clue if I'd want warm or cool white. How warm is the Predator warm?


----------



## thedoc007 (Jul 13, 2014)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator 2.5 (XP-G2 R5 1x18650 2xCR123A/RCR) Regular and Pro Review: RUN*



TweakMDS said:


> Currently it's between the Olight M22, Predator Pro and Nitecore P25.



Well, what are you going to use it for? Is it just an emergency light, or do you plan to use it on a regular basis? 

You are right that the P25 is closer to a jack of all trades, especially compared to the Predator, which is definitely a dedicated thrower. I have both...but I'm planning on getting rid of the Predator. I love the build quality, the look, the matte finish, and the throw...but the narrow spill makes it pretty poor as a general use light, and I don't like the twisty interface. If neither of those things bothers you, I would definitely go with the Predator. 

Another option is to go with a modded version...I have a current boosted, de-domed P25, and it throws just about the same as the Predator, while giving around double the output, and a LOT more spill.


----------



## TweakMDS (Jul 13, 2014)

*Re: ArmyTek Predator 2.5 (XP-G2 R5 1x18650 2xCR123A/RCR) Regular and Pro Review: RUN*

Emergency light mainly, but emergency in the loosest possible sense of the word. It doesn't need to be all that general purpose since I have plenty of floody edc size lights that will always accompany it. I'm also not a huge fan of the twists in the UI, but with setting up the modes properly, I think I can avoid most of the switching. A 300lm high would be a perfect main mode, and the fact that you can set that is the main selling point for this light for me. Combined with the throw of course.

To me throw is more about the shape of the beam than it is about the amount of output... A medium-floody 1500 lumens light will probably out throw a predator on paper, but the lack of flood can be helpful to see better since you have less distractions in the foreground. 
I guess I'll let it marinate in my mind for a bit and see what's available locally when the days shorten again.


----------



## mattjberry (Sep 12, 2014)

The torch itself works fine and puts out a good amount of light and throws better than my THRUNITE TN12.


When I got the torch I noticed almost immediately that one of the rubber seals near the end of the torch was not installed properly.
It's not a seal that you can replace yourself, so I couldn't do anything about it. Therefore, I expected to be able to send it back, get a new one, and they refund the shipping cost of sending it to them. I immediately emailed support about it. I expected them to swiftly resolve it, as their website states:
"We give a 30-day satisfaction guarantee."
"If your purchase, for any reason, doesn't meet your requirements, you may return it within 30 days of receipt of your shipment."
"Please note that we can refund the initial shipping costs only if the return is a result of our error."

Well it's definitely there error, they installed the seal incorrectly. Also it didn't pass quality control if they have it.
Eventually they came back with the response of: "This is a small imperfection which does not influence the marketable condition, the main functionality and the output and brightness of the flashlight. This imperfection is not visible, so, in this case we do not refund for the delivery."

It's not visible? I noticed it pretty much immediately. I even sent them pictures to show them. Half the seal is completely missing, and there is a portion on the other side where the seal sticks out. I told them from the outset that this torch was to be a gift for my dad (parents anniversary). I don't want to give him a product that I know is not in new condition. I know he will notice it as well and it's disappointing as I was excited to give him the torch. Also, the seal is there for a reason, I don't want water getting in to the area where the seal is missing.

All I can say is I hope that the torch you get doesn't have any visible flaws. Because if it does, good luck trying to get a replacement.


----------



## The Fish (Oct 10, 2014)

Need some help with my Predator v2.5
I want to program the "screwed in" line to full brightness and lock it there if possible. Feel free to treat me as a real novice so step by step please!
The manual for the v2.3 is very hard for me to understand.
The "unscrewed" line is already strobe which I want.
I just want to set it this way and leave it.
Thanks a million.


----------



## pebbles (Oct 18, 2014)

I had to scour the Web for a complete manual. Lowest firefly is .1 lumens for 130 days. This light does it all if you dig deeply. Spend some time and set it up to your exact specifications. This is the pro version.


----------



## s013202 (Oct 19, 2014)

The Fish said:


> Need some help with my Predator v2.5
> I want to program the "screwed in" line to full brightness and lock it there if possible. Feel free to treat me as a real novice so step by step please!
> The manual for the v2.3 is very hard for me to understand.
> The "unscrewed" line is already strobe which I want.
> ...



First to say,i'm not a English-speaking person. 
So sometimes you may not understand what i mean , if there is,please point it out and i'll try to explain again.
I think you want to set the "screwed in" line ,which i used to call line 1 ,to only one mode with full brightness,right?
If it is , follow the steps below:
A.Set line 1 to only one mode.
1.Stay in line 2.(Un-screwed)
2.Turn tight to change to line 1. (wait and let it become line 1)
3.Turn loose to change to line 2. (wait and let it become line 2)
4.Click off & on fast. (within 1 second) 
Step 2. to 4. need to be done within 3 seconds!
5.Click off & on fast by three times. (you will see indication with 4 blinks cycling)
6.Tighten & loosen fast. (within 1 second)
7.Do step 6. again immediately after indication with 1 blink
8.Do step 6. again.
9.Done.:huh:

B.Change brightness of line 1.
1.Stay in line 1.
2.Turn loose to change to line 2. (wait and let it become line 2)
3.Turn tight to change to line 1. (wait and let it become line 1)
4.Click off & on fast. (within 1 second) 
Step 2. to 4. need to be done within 3 seconds!
5.Light start first with three firefly modes,then ramp up to the full brightness.(blinks at 25% 50% 75% 100%)
6.Loosen & tighten fast. (within 1 second)
7.Done.:huh:

If you want to save the current settings of the flashlight into user's Custom preset, do the following steps:
1.Stay in line 2.(Un-screwed)
2.Turn tight to change to line 1. (wait and let it become line 1)
3.Turn loose to change to line 2. (wait and let it become line 2)
4.Click off & on fast. (within 1 second) 
Step 2. to 4. need to be done within 3 seconds!
5.Click off & on fast again.(you will see indication with 2 blinks cycling)
6.Tighten & loosen fast. (within 1 second)
7.Click off & on fast immediately after indication with 3 blink. 
8.Done.:huh:


----------



## alltoclear (Nov 6, 2014)

Hi all, i m in a dilemma in deciding whether to get the predator pro or a viking pro. i notice the viking has more lumen but shorter throw. Which light do you guys recommend if i intend to mostly use the light for jungle hiking and trail walking at night.


----------



## selfbuilt (Nov 6, 2014)

alltoclear said:


> Which light do you guys recommend if i intend to mostly use the light for jungle hiking and trail walking at night.


Hmmm, I personally tend to prefer a more general beam for those sorts of tasks - so would generally recommend the Viking. I don't like path walking with a too narrowly focused light - it sort of becomes "follow the bouncing ball" of the hotspot, as opposed to attending to what's all around your feet. In the jungle, you are going to want to see what is all around you, and up ahead.

On the other hand, a good quality diffuser can turn any light into a flooder. If you think you might come into clearings where the extra throw of the Predator would come in handy, then that could be another option (i.e., Predator with a removable diffuser). For that matter, you may even what a diffuser for the Viking, should you go that route (which I still think is probably your best bet).

Somewhat different environment, but I did post my experience of using different style lights in a primary and secondary rainforest a few years ago. The lights have all changed, but the general experience persists. :wave:

_EDIT: thedoc007 makes a good point below that overall spill angle is the same for the two lights - and so both may be a bit restrictive for a trail walk without a diffuser._


----------



## thedoc007 (Nov 6, 2014)

alltoclear said:


> Hi all, i m in a dilemma in deciding whether to get the predator pro or a viking pro. i notice the viking has more lumen but shorter throw. Which light do you guys recommend if i intend to mostly use the light for jungle hiking and trail walking at night.



I'd go with the Predator if you are willing to also buy and use the diffuser. Neither light is any good for hiking, really, without a diffuser attached. While the Viking does have a larger hotspot, the spill angle is exactly the same, and both lights have narrower spill than most other lights of equivalent size. I have found flooders to be immensely more useful for night hiking. Wide spill allows you to see your surroundings much better, and specifically trip hazards are MUCH easier to spot without having to constantly wave the light around.


----------



## alltoclear (Nov 7, 2014)

Thanks for the reply, Advice noted. Btw, does a 5degree vs a 10degree hotspot makes a big different in a near distance say about 5 to 10 meter in front of us? or it is barely noticeable??


----------



## thedoc007 (Nov 7, 2014)

alltoclear said:


> Thanks for the reply, Advice noted. Btw, does a 5degree vs a 10degree hotspot makes a big different in a near distance say about 5 to 10 meter in front of us? or it is barely noticeable??



The Predator hotspot is noticeably more intense, at any range. The Predator's XP-G2 is VERY well focused.


----------



## selfbuilt (Nov 7, 2014)

thedoc007 said:


> The Predator hotspot is noticeably more intense, at any range. The Predator's XP-G2 is VERY well focused.


I concur. The 5 vs 10 degree hotspot is very noticeable at 5-10 meters.


----------



## mellowhead (Nov 7, 2014)

I concur with selfbuilt and thedoc007: I wouldn't use my Predator Pro for hiking/trails unless I had to. Although, I do always bring it with me when I'm backcountry hiking and camping - both as a backup to my headlamp that I primarily use, and for long-distance spotting of trails, markers, landforms, etc. Particularly useful for night hiking and trail finding. It would also be excellent at emergency signalling, if I were to find myself in that sort of situation.


----------



## offroadcmpr (Nov 9, 2014)

mellowhead said:


> I concur with selfbuilt and thedoc007: I wouldn't use my Predator Pro for hiking/trails unless I had to. Although, I do always bring it with me when I'm backcountry hiking and camping - both as a backup to my headlamp that I primarily use, and for long-distance spotting of trails, markers, landforms, etc. Particularly useful for night hiking and trail finding. It would also be excellent at emergency signalling, if I were to find myself in that sort of situation.



That is pretty much what I use it for. I have a Spark Headlamp on my head and the Predator in my pocket or belt. The Spark has a fairly floody beam which is nice for hiking, but because it lacks the long distance throw I use the Predator to supplement it when I need to see something further out.


----------



## recDNA (Nov 20, 2014)

Is this too big to pocket carry? anybody here pocket carry it? Can the cigar ring be removed?


----------



## mellowhead (Nov 20, 2014)

recDNA said:


> Is this too big to pocket carry? anybody here pocket carry it? Can the cigar ring be removed?


The cigar ring can be removed. The package includes a rubber band that you can install instead, which sits flush with the outside of the battery tube. It's the same band that is already mounted just in front of the cigar ring - visible in post #1 of this thread.
I can put it in my pocket, and have a few times, but it makes me look very... um... "happy to see you" - if you know what I mean...:naughty:


----------



## thedoc007 (Nov 20, 2014)

recDNA said:


> Is this too big to pocket carry? anybody here pocket carry it? Can the cigar ring be removed?



It is certainly POSSIBLE to pocket carry it, but it is on the large side for a single 18650 light. And because the head is quite a bit wider than the body, it also doesn't slip in and out very easily. 

You can easily remove the cigar ring. That was the first thing I did when I got my Predator.


----------



## recDNA (Nov 20, 2014)

Thanks, maybe in my parka then


----------



## stanleywen (Nov 22, 2014)

Thanks for your detailed preview! :thumbsup:
I had tried a Predator Pro at a local dealer's store, and felt it's not powerful compared to others cheaper XM-L/XM-L2 flashlights.
Now I know I was wrong. I should try it outdoor, the Predator is a pocket (or backpack) thrower!

One friend surprised me by throwing his Predator Pro to the ground 5 meters away, on the concrete floor. 
When I went to pick the flashlight up, I can't find any damage or scratch on it.
Many of my flashlights got obvious scars after I accidentally drop them to the ground (about 1 meter height).
I have no idea how Armytek make their flashlight so robust? :thinking:

The local Armytek dealer just told me he may have a sale next month.
In fact, I can't already wait ! :hairpull:


----------



## recDNA (Nov 26, 2014)

So I have a new Predator Pro. I must be pretty stupid because I cannot figure out how to put on the clip or even WHERE the clip goes. Could someone help me out? Thanks!


----------



## mellowhead (Nov 26, 2014)

Doesn't it clip into one of the grooves where the rubber grip rings are? I can't recall... but I can take a look at mine when I get home.


----------



## lightmyfire13 (Nov 26, 2014)

If I remember correctly in front of the cigar ring there's a rubber ring that u take off and the clip fits in there ...don't have mine anymore.....


----------



## InquisitiveInquirer (Nov 26, 2014)

I really like the predator, but it was a bit outta my budget. I ended up getting a nitecore p15. I find it to be a poor man's Predator. Size & dimensions very similar and both sport xp-g2. Would be interesting to see the two side-by-side for a beam comparison. Does anyone have both?


----------



## recDNA (Nov 26, 2014)

I noticed that unprotected li ion is set to shut off at 2.8 volts. Of course if my pro is set to LiFe mode that is 2.5 volts which is even worse. Doesn't it need to shut off at 3.7 volts to prevent damaging the battery?


----------



## mellowhead (Nov 26, 2014)

recDNA said:


> I noticed that unprotected li ion is set to shut off at 2.8 volts. Of course if my pro is set to LiFe mode that is 2.5 volts which is even worse. Doesn't it need to shut off at 3.7 volts to prevent damaging the battery?



It depends on what the manufacturer's recommendations are for the cell that you are using. If you look at the most common cell out there - the 3400mAh Panasonic NCR18650B - Panasonic's spec sheet has a discharge graph that shows a 2.5V cutoff for a 100% discharged cell. I don't recommend 100% DOD cycles, as they will not only diminish the capacity of the cell, but also put you at higher risk of a "thermal event". That's a nice way of saying "catch fire". I think 2.7 or 2.8 is a reasonable level; it puts you into the 80-90% DOD range.


----------



## recDNA (Nov 26, 2014)

If I use protected AW li ion 18660 flat top at what voltage does it cut itself off by protection?


----------



## mellowhead (Nov 26, 2014)

Sorry, I don't have any AW cells to check that. Maybe try asking over on the AW sales thread in CPFMP. I'd say it's likely to be 2.7 or 2.8 as well. AW uses Panasonic cells for their 3100's and 3400's.


----------



## alltoclear (Nov 28, 2014)

Hi all, i am wondering what is the real different between the predator pro and the non pro version besides the driver in it. From what i read it seem that the pro has constant brightness and the non pro a step brightness driver. How is the different in real world? In term of max output, both is suppose to be the same at 670lm right? Should i save the usd 20 different from the non pro for something else?? Thanks


----------



## mellowhead (Nov 29, 2014)

If you're just looking for max throw and brightness, then save yourself the $20 and just buy the regular model. For me, I like having the advanced driver of the pro, as it has some really beneficial features - should you need them. They include:
- Firefly mode (great for rooting through a backpack or reading a map in the pitch black)
- Separate backup circuit for firefly mode
- Programmable for battery types, output levels, regulation type, last mode memory, flashy disco modes...
- Battery voltage measurement indication
- Low battery indication

If you're the type to fiddle with settings and if you like a light to be set up "just so", then the Pro is totally worth the extra $20.


----------



## recDNA (Dec 5, 2014)

I am actually considering offering a trade of my pro for the regular. I really like the flashlight and usually I don't mind twisty ui but it is a little difficult to twist such a big head and it is stiffer than eagletac to twist.

If I understand correctly the ui of predator it is push button vs twisty.

I find programming too difficult and have no need for candlelight mode from such a big light. I tried the voltage check and it said my freshly charged aw 18650 was 3.6 volts. I know it was 4.1

No offers please. If I decide to offer a trade it will be at cpfmp.

On the good side my nitecore filter arrived today. It not only makes the pro more usefull indoors but makes a nice lens cover to protect the lens in my coat pocket.

I just hope the next version is somehow made with a lighter material. I don't need a light to gun mount so I don't need a light to be so heavy. Feels like it is built to hammer nails.


----------



## s013202 (Dec 17, 2014)

> I am actually considering offering a trade of my pro for the regular. I really like the flashlight and usually I don't mind twisty ui but it is a little difficult to twist such a big head and it is stiffer than eagletac to twist.
> 
> If I understand correctly the ui of predator it is push button vs twisty.
> 
> I find programming too difficult and have no need for candlelight mode from such a big light. I tried the voltage check and it said my freshly charged aw 18650 was 3.6 volts. I know it was 4.1


I agree with you.So,I sold recently my predator pro& bought a regular viking (warm).
Because I think viking regular with warm tint is much suitable for me.
I think the UI with button push of regular one can be improved much beter,like the UI of sunwayman S10A.


----------



## alltoclear (Dec 22, 2014)

Does this light have a turbo stepdown? Have anyone run into thermal protection that activate to reduce the light temperature?


----------



## mellowhead (Dec 22, 2014)

alltoclear said:


> Does this light have a turbo stepdown? Have anyone run into thermal protection that activate to reduce the light temperature?



The manufacturer definitely specifies that there is thermal protection. From ArmyTek's website: "The S-Tek™ driver, due to a built-in sensor, constantly monitors the temperature of LED and the electronic circuit and will prevent the LED overheating in extreme environments."

That being said, it doesn't look like Selfbuilt ran into any thermal stepdown during his runtime tests - judging by the graphs in post #1.


----------



## selfbuilt (Dec 22, 2014)

mellowhead said:


> That being said, it doesn't look like Selfbuilt ran into any thermal stepdown during his runtime tests - judging by the graphs in post #1.


That's right, I didn't - but then, all my runtimes are done under a cooling fan. Under "extreme" conditions, there may very well be thermal safety features that kick. A number of lights in this class are likely to have this.


----------



## C.M.S (Jan 24, 2015)

I don't see a lot of talk about this particular flashlight here , is it considered a top contender in it's class ?


----------



## selfbuilt (Jan 24, 2015)

C.M.S said:


> I don't see a lot of talk about this particular flashlight here , is it considered a top contender in it's class ?


That may be because this review is ~1.5 years old. But it is still quite competitive, given by the 6 pages of feedback on this review.


----------



## thedoc007 (Jan 24, 2015)

C.M.S said:


> I don't see a lot of talk about this particular flashlight here , is it considered a top contender in it's class ?



Depending on what criteria you are considering, yes, it is definitely a top contender. 

Still unmatched for throw (in the 40mm class) as far as I know, and certainly one of the toughest 1x18650 lights out there for any price. Also has excellent anodizing, and personally I love the look. 

Most of the discussion tends to be early on, when a light is released for the first time, or when problems occur. It is an older design, and given the build quality, I doubt there have been many failures. Hence the quiet thread.


----------



## Romanko (Jan 25, 2015)

Would be nice to see new version with XP-L.


----------



## TEEJ (Jan 25, 2015)

The XP-L would be like the XML2 in performance, as the LED is the same size and output as far as the emitter goes, its just on a smaller die.


----------



## C.M.S (Jan 25, 2015)

Was the test done with the warm version ? Beam looks a bit warmer compared to the other two lights on the first page beam comparisons .


----------



## thedoc007 (Jan 25, 2015)

C.M.S said:


> Was the test done with the warm version ? Beam looks a bit warmer compared to the other two lights on the first page beam comparisons .



No, if you read the specs, both emitters were cool white. XP-G2 and XM-L/XM-L2 have different tints, though, so that may explain the perceived difference. Honestly I think they look fundamentally similar anyway...if it was a warm white version, the tint difference would be MUCH more obvious.


----------



## C.M.S (Jan 25, 2015)

I'll probably get this one vs the ET S200c2 soon and report back ..


----------



## recDNA (Feb 5, 2015)

I love mine


----------



## mellowhead (Feb 5, 2015)

recDNA said:


> I love mine



Did you end up trading your Pro for the Regular one?


----------



## thedoc007 (Feb 6, 2015)

Took my Predator skiing today. Chucked it as far as I could downhill quite a number of times...but the ski patrol killed my fun before I took any pics. Ran over it with my skis once...did scratch the anodizing a bit. Other than that, looks like new, and certainly its performance did not suffer AT ALL. I love being confident enough to abuse it, and know that it will keep working.







This is all that happened when I ran it over with my ski...175 pounds or so resting on a hardened steel edge. Works for me! Now I can say that it has character .


----------



## bloodtype_Z (Mar 18, 2015)

Can somebody please explain the process to reset the predator pro to factory settings? While trying to use strobe I somehow changed a mode and no longer get simple low/med/high with quick head turns. I've tried reading the manual but unfortunately I am a mere mortal and the instructions are obviously designed for superior intelligence super-beings. I'm starting to regret the predator pro as it's settings are convoluted as all hell.


----------



## mellowhead (Mar 19, 2015)

bloodtype_Z said:


> Can somebody please explain the process to reset the predator pro to factory settings?



Predator Pro programming... not for the faint of heart.
I haven't done a reset personally, but I interpret the instructions as follows:

*Part I - Entering the setup menu*
Starting with your light on and head loose (line 2), enter the setup menu by:
1) Tighten head. Wait until the light switches to the First Line (approximately 1 second).
2) Quickly (within 3 seconds of light switching to first line),
a) Loosen head 1/4 turn
b) Turn the flashlight off and on again with two full presses of the tail button.

*Part II - Selecting the correct setup menu function*
The light should blink between 1 and 5 times. Take note of how many times it blinks. We want it to blink twice - for menu item #2: Factory Reset.
If it blinks 1,3,4, or 5 times, you will need to cycle through the items to get to #2. Cycle through them one item at a time with a fast (less than 1 second), off-on double click of the tail button.
Once you've reached 2 blinks for menu item 2, do a fast (less than 1 second) tighten-loosen of the head.
You should now be in the Factory Reset menu. How to tell whether you are or not? Read on in Part III to find out!

*Part III - Activating a factory reset
*If you successfully entered the factory reset menu, the light will now cycle automatically through the three preset programs: 1 blink for military (factory default), 2 blinks for outdoor, and 3 for custom. Then it starts back at 1 again, etc...

So to do the reset, you need to wait for the desired preset to appear (1 blink - military), and then do a quick (less than one second) tighten-loosen of the head. The light will load the factory defaults for that preset, and exit the setup menu completely.

Chances are, it's the military preset that you need to do a factory reset on because that's what these ship from the factory with as the active preset, so start with that one and try using the light again. If it's still all wonky for you, then repeat the whole process above to reset the "outdoor" and "custom" presets as well.

After reading the above steps, you might find this graphic to be a useful visual reminder. It shows the menu selection process after Part I above:


----------



## selfbuilt (Mar 19, 2015)

mellowhead said:


> Predator Pro programming... not for the faint of heart.


Indeed. Thanks for the detailed summary mellowhead, that matches my reading of the instructions as well.

Factory reset (as described above) should work for you bloodtype_Z. I've used it myself on the original predator, to ensure consistent mode settings across tests.


----------



## bloodtype_Z (Mar 19, 2015)

Thank you much mellowhead those instructions make sense. I was thinking the pred pro would be a good duty light/bedside light but not when you need a quantum physics phd to operate it lol. Don't get me wrong it's the best quality light I've ever owned and I'm impressed with every other facet of it.


----------



## desmobob (Apr 25, 2015)

My first Zebralight hooked me on the advantages of programmable lights. I've been looking at the armyTek lights for a while now, and since the programmable versions of the Pro models are soon to be gone, I took advantage of a 50% off sale at Ilumin and picked up a Predator Pro and Viking Pro.

I don't have them yet, but downloaded the instruction manuals from links in this thread. Wow. It looks like armyTek programming is a *bit* more involved than the Zebralight process....

Wish me luck,
Bob


----------



## mellowhead (Apr 25, 2015)

My recipe for Armytek Pro programming:
1 part - luck of a unicorn
2 parts - concentration of a leopard
2 parts - patience of a saint
1 pinch - fairy dust

Mix all ingredients thoroughly for at least 30 minutes, and hope for the best! 
:laughing:


----------



## ven (Apr 25, 2015)

@bob,i am yet to have a dabble on the viking pro,tbh i am pretty happy with line 1 modes and seem good for my use,line 2 which is strobe and firefly ,i have saved firefly.

Simply put,i have it on the medium on head tight,head loose firefly for most uses i anticipate. The momentary is very useful,in fact finding fault is quite hard........i cant!....pre programming :laughing:

Light wise,well its fantastic,the feel of the ano,build,just a very nice light to hold. I did try the clip on but found a little "in the way" to hold(prefer comfort without and dont need clip tbh). It has a a air of confidence about it...........

:laughing: mellowhead,no doubt i will see how good the ano is once thrown with frustration....... when i get chance to try the "pro" part out!


----------



## desmobob (Apr 25, 2015)

ven said:


> It has a a air of confidence about it...........



I recently purchased my first armyTek, a Tiara Pro C1, and share your feelings about the brand. It's just a tiny little light but it feels like the best-built of the brands I own. 

I'm a gadget nut and couldn't resist the programming features on the v2.5 Predator and Viking Pros, especially at half price. I only really wanted one and was having a hard time deciding on the Viking or Predator. I like floody lights but, on the other hand, I could use a weapon light for a rifle. The 50% off price made it easy to make the flashaholic's choice: get both!

It's a shame armyTek is dropping the custom programming feature. They claim their marketing research shows so few people use it (or figure it out?), they figured it wasn't worth the expense. Oh well...

Take it easy,
Bob


----------



## ven (Apr 25, 2015)

desmobob said:


> I recently purchased my first armyTek, a Tiara Pro C1, and share your feelings about the brand. It's just a tiny little light but it feels like the best-built of the brands I own.
> 
> I'm a gadget nut and couldn't resist the programming features on the v2.5 Predator and Viking Pros, especially at half price. I only really wanted one and was having a hard time deciding on the Viking or Predator. I like floody lights but, on the other hand, I could use a weapon light for a rifle. The 50% off price made it easy to make the flashaholic's choice: get both!
> 
> ...



Did not know they were dropping it,shame they did not look at another way to programme if that was the reason.


----------



## desmobob (Apr 25, 2015)

ven said:


> Did not know they were dropping it,shame they did not look at another way to programme if that was the reason.



armyTek says only about 2% of the owners ever used the programming feature to set their own modes. _(See post #10 in the "Predator/Predator Pro. Tactical Lights" thread in the armyTek forum in the CPF Commercial Corner section.) _

I was mistaken when I said they figured it wasn't worth the expense. It was removed to simplify operation of the light and make it more marketable.

Take it easy,
Bob


----------



## Woods Walker (May 17, 2015)

Took about 3 hours but mastered some of this. One question. Does the factory reset to military also reset the power supply setting to default which I believe is 1X18650 per the previous version's manual?

*2. One 18650 Li-Ion 3.7V (Li-Ion rechargeable battery, minimum voltage 2.8V) - by default*


----------



## UBERSOLDAT (May 26, 2015)

hey guys and ladies.. I have orderd a new Armytek Predator 3.0 with new XB-H SMO warm LED ....

Anyone experience with it??

Maybe throw of XB-H is better than XP-G2.. i do not know..


----------



## Wiggle (Jun 15, 2015)

I can't speak it to it but hopefully a review comes out soon


----------



## D6859 (Aug 14, 2015)

I got my Predator pro v2.5 warm this week and last night I had time to program it. 

First impressions:
- the tint seems quite purpleish to me on a white wall 
- I wish it had metal grip ring instead of rubber 
- the head is lot stiffer than in M22, impossible to use with only one hand
- the pocketclip attaches so that it cringes on the head when changing modes
- manual (v2.3) was written in a way that it was hard to read 
+ programming the light isn't so hard after all and is possible without the manual
+ I found whole new spectrum of green and brown in the nature when comparing it to my TN12 (CW)
+ the throw is so long I haven't found a place to test it to its maximum yet

We're going to see Perseid meteor shower tonight so I have good chance to test the light more thoroughly


----------



## chadvone (Feb 26, 2021)

Armytek website link to the manual is broken. I emailed them and they informed me they deleted all the old manuals.

Does anyone have an advanced manual they would share. Thanks in advance.


----------



## shrike2222 (Mar 2, 2021)

Maybe this manual?
http://www.ecologeek4u.com/media/40712/Predator_PRO_quick_guide_eng.pdf



chadvone said:


> Armytek website link to the manual is broken. I emailed them and they informed me they deleted all the old manuals.
> 
> Does anyone have an advanced manual they would share. Thanks in advance.


----------



## chadvone (Mar 6, 2021)

Thanks shrike2222 that is the basic manual. The advanced manual shows how to program each line and level. I got mine back to Outdoor setting.

Thank again.


----------

