# What to build with 3 IMR C cells????? brightest!



## bigchelis (Nov 5, 2009)

Hi all,

Now that I been putting together a couple of ROP's I want to see how far I can push it with the stock switch and no soft-start.

I have a spare 2D Mag and with the tail cap short spring it fits 3 IMR C cells perfectly. I already have 2.5in Throwmaster and KD reflectors along with UCL lens from lighthound.com and now want the most bulb lumens possible.

My buddy has a 3D that he wants to give me for a 4 IMR C cell build too, but I want to keep the stock mag switch and no soft-start. 

All I need is the fivemega kit to be able to use bulbs like WA1185 ect...., so I will be getting this tommorrow.

I looked at Lux most powerfull builds and some of those 100watt monsters seem to have battery packs and aftermarket switches, but I want to build something the average Jose can do:duh2:

Thanks,
Jose


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## Mjolnir (Nov 5, 2009)

The Fivemega 1909 bulb seems to be designed for 3 IMR cells, but you have to buy it with one of fivemega's hosts.


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## Outdoors Fanatic (Nov 5, 2009)

What about the elusive AW 30 watts bulb?


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## Dioni (Nov 5, 2009)

Outdoors Fanatic said:


> What about the elusive AW 30 watts bulb?


 
+1 on AW 30 and its 2000lm...


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## cernobila (Nov 5, 2009)

From Luxluthor's data.......

AW 30: 11.5V, 7.6A, 2242 lumens, 0.8 hours

FM 1909: 11.4V, 5.5A, 2260 lumens, 20.0 hours


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## Dioni (Nov 5, 2009)

Wow.. realy the lifetime of AW30 is drastically lower.


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## KiwiMark (Nov 5, 2009)

Dioni said:


> Wow.. realy the lifetime of AW30 is drastically lower.



At 11.5V - Yes!

Of course it is rated as a 6V bulb so it is being pushed rather hard.


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## cernobila (Nov 5, 2009)

KiwiMark said:


> At 11.5V - Yes!
> 
> Of course it is rated as a 6V bulb so it is being pushed rather hard.



Exactly.....


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## bigchelis (Nov 5, 2009)

I apologize in advance if this is a dumb question, but since I just purchased the fivemega G4 bin and his FM 1909 for 3 IMR C cell duty and he adviced me on this:

"*FM1909 will work with 3x26500 IMRs but resistance fix needed if M*g is the host.* "

I don't know how to add resistance to the tail. Is there a thread or link somewhere that I can read up on this?

Thanks,
bigC


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## gswitter (Nov 5, 2009)

"resistance fix" generally refers to _removing_ resistance - specifically at the switch and tail.


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## ^^Nova^^ (Nov 5, 2009)

Not add resistance, reduce it.

The main 2 ways are to add some copper braid to the tail spring (solder wick works well), providing a path from the top to the bottom, letting the current bypass the spring. You can also add some to the top spring inside the bulb pedestal, I'll see if I can dig up a link. Also some DeOxit inside the contacts of the switch really help.

http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=130965
http://homepage.mac.com/rouses/circuits/PhotoAlbum289.html

You probably don't need to go to the trouble of completely hard wiring the switch, just doing the 2 spring mods and deoxit inside the switch contacts will make a big difference.

Cheers,
Nova


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## ^^Nova^^ (Nov 5, 2009)

Oops, too slow. Good choice on the links though...

Cheers,
Nova


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## Dioni (Nov 5, 2009)

:nana: late


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## Kestrel (Nov 5, 2009)

BigC, I'm very much looking forward to the result of this thread...


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## fivemega (Nov 6, 2009)

^^Nova^^ said:


> Not add resistance, reduce it.
> Cheers,
> Nova


*Sometimes adding resistance (NTC) is necessary too.
For instance driving direct a 5761 with two IMR 26500
I am not recommending this mod but recommending the solution.*


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## bk737 (Nov 6, 2009)

You are going to love this mod!:devil::devil: I am running the same set-up as you are (2.5 Throwmaster, ) and it is a beautiful beam. Enjoy Jose!


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## bigchelis (Nov 6, 2009)

Thank you all for the help. The links were very informative and helpfull too.

Off I go to Radio Shack to seek out this infamous cooper braided wire:naughty:

bigC


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## Fulgeo (Nov 6, 2009)

bigchelis said:


> Thank you all for the help. The links were very informative and helpfull too.
> 
> Off I go to Radio Shack to seek out this infamous cooper braided wire:naughty:
> 
> bigC



When your out also grap some lye drain cleaner the gel type to Deanodize the tailcap. Put about 1/4" iside the bottom of the tailcap. It saves you a lot of sanding and the final results looks clean.


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## Fulgeo (Nov 6, 2009)

Mjolnir said:


> The Fivemega 1909 bulb seems to be designed for 3 IMR cells, but you have to buy it with one of fivemega's hosts.



The FM1909 is mythical magical beast. My favorite incandescent bulb period. Highly recommended. The easiest way I know to get one is to order a bi-pin adapter from FM and score a bulb at the same time. See this thread. https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/179891. The bi-pin adapters are an excellent product also.

Happy Mods!


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## bigchelis (Nov 6, 2009)

Fulgeo said:


> The FM1909 is mythical magical beast. My favorite incandescent bulb period. Highly recommended. The easiest way I know to get one is to order a bi-pin adapter from FM and score a bulb at the same time. See this thread. https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/179891. The bi-pin adapters are an excellent product also.
> 
> Happy Mods!


 

Thanks,

That is exactly what I did

Next week I will take some beamshoots to compare the ROP H vs. Fivemega bulb.

I will also try that Drain fluid to remove the anodizing too.

bigC


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## Dioni (Nov 6, 2009)

bigchelis said:


> Thanks,
> 
> That is exactly what I did
> 
> ...


 
Ok, I think I can wait till next week...


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## RichS (Nov 6, 2009)

fivemega said:


> *Sometimes adding resistance (NTC) is necessary too.*
> *For instance driving direct a 5761 with two IMR 26500*
> *I am not recommending this mod but recommending the solution.*


Sorry I am a little confused now, and I'm buying the parts to put this together. 

So will 3xIMR 26500 work with a FM 1909 without adding resistance to drop voltage? Or will the bulb potentially  without added resistance? Now, I will be using this with a soft-starter, so that may make a difference as well. 

Or is was it just recommended to reduce the resistance to increase the output?


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## bigchelis (Nov 6, 2009)

RichS said:


> Sorry I am a little confused now, and I'm buying the parts to put this together.
> 
> So will 3xIMR 26500 work with a FM 1909 without adding resistance to drop voltage? Or will the bulb potentially  without added resistance? Now, I will be using this with a soft-starter, so that may make a difference as well.
> 
> Or is was it just recommended to reduce the resistance to increase the output?


 
If the proper way to use the FM 1909 with 3 IMR C cells is to reduce the resistance than I assume without the resistance mod it would be okay too. The only difference is that to get the full potential in OTF lumens I have to reduce the resistance right?

With resistance mod or not I concluded no  would occur; just more performance.

bigC


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## Mjolnir (Nov 6, 2009)

Why do you need to deanodize the tailcap for 3 IMR C cells in a 3C mag? are they long enough that even a cut down spring wouldn't give them enough room?


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## bigchelis (Nov 6, 2009)

Mjolnir said:


> Why do you need to deanodize the tailcap for 3 IMR C cells in a 3C mag? are they long enough that even a cut down spring wouldn't give them enough room?


 

It makes it less of a tight fit for me. Both ways work, but I just by default do that to all my Mag tails for future possibilities:devil:


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## bigchelis (Nov 7, 2009)

Fulgeo said:


> When your out also grap some lye drain cleaner the gel type to Deanodize the tailcap. Put about 1/4" iside the bottom of the tailcap. It saves you a lot of sanding and the final results looks clean.


 

I let Drain Pro Clog Cleaner over 4 hours, but it didn't remove the anodizing. I read the whole bottle and it doesn't specify if it has lye.

I just realized I have to get a Drain Cleaner as opposed to a decloger. What brand or type worked for you????????

Thanks,
bigC


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## Sway (Nov 7, 2009)

I use a Dremel #442 wire brush to clean the ano from tail caps it takes a minute or less. You can use a power drill if you don't have a dremel type tool, it may take a little longer.

Make sure to wear eye protection when working with power tools 

Kelly


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## Fulgeo (Nov 7, 2009)

bigchelis said:


> I let Drain Pro Clog Cleaner over 4 hours, but it didn't remove the anodizing. I read the whole bottle and it doesn't specify if it has lye.
> 
> I just realized I have to get a Drain Cleaner as opposed to a decloger. What brand or type worked for you????????
> 
> ...


 
I used some cheap stuff made fromm Everday Living called "Drain Opener". It was only $2.29 for a 32 FL OZ bootle. It contains Sodium Hypochlorite (bleach) and Sodium Hydroxide (lye). It works pretty quick. The problem I have found with using a dremel it that it gives you a pretty rough result where as the lye method is very clean. I use it to clean the tailcaps of my 3 D mag builds when using 3xIMR 26650 cells. I also use some copper braid wrapped around a thin rubber washer I make from car heater hose as the tailcap spring. Makes a very reliable and gentle to the cells spring.


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## Mjolnir (Nov 7, 2009)

You don't really need "drain cleaner" to remove anodizing, just a strong base like sodium hydroxide. Sodium hypochlorite is a weak base, so it won't do much to the anodizing. Sulfuric acid should dissolve it as well.


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## Fulgeo (Nov 7, 2009)

Mjolnir said:


> You don't really need "drain cleaner" to remove anodizing, just a strong base like sodium hydroxide. Sodium hypochlorite is a weak base, so it won't do much to the anodizing. Sulfuric acid should dissolve it as well.


 
The reason I use drain cleaner is because it is the cheapest source of lye I can find. The sodium hypochlorite (bleach) in the drain cleaner is just there to kill germs and dampen the ordors as it unclogs your drain. There should be more than a 100 applications to remove tail cap anodizing in one 32 ounce bottle. That comes out to about 2.3 cents per application. Mjolnir do you know a source of sodium hydroxide that is even less expensive?


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## Mjolnir (Nov 7, 2009)

This might work:
http://www.essentialdepot.com/servlet/the-25/2-lbs-Technical-Grade/Detail
It is solid NaOH though, so you would have to put it in solution; however I am not sure what molarity would be ideal for dissolving anodizing.
I also am not sure what the shipping costs are, since these are hazardous materials.
Chances are that 2 pounds of solid NaOH will last quite a while, so it might be cheaper overall.


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## bigchelis (Nov 14, 2009)

I been using the FM 2000 lumen lamp with 3 IMR C cells in a 2D Mag and it is sooooo much brighter than the ROP 3854H.

The bad news is that I get a ugly black artifact in the middle of the beam with the following reflectors:


FM 2in Deep smo
2.5in Throwmaster
KD V3 Smooth reflector
What else can I do to get rig of that ugly center black artifact?

I didn't do any tail cap mods in regards to resistance and it has worked excellent by simply shortening the tail cap spring.:thumbsup:


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## bk737 (Nov 14, 2009)

Are your bulbs inserted all the way down into the socket? Filament centered?
It sounds like maybe it is just the bulb, since you have the same issue with many different heads / reflectors. Any beamshots?


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## Dioni (Nov 15, 2009)

Interesting report! 
About that black artifact in beam, I also think it is relative to bulb centering.

We hope you can post some comparison beamshots soon. :thumbsup:


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## fivemega (Nov 15, 2009)

bigchelis said:


> The bad news is that I get a ugly black artifact in the middle of the beam with the following reflectors:
> 
> 
> FM 2in Deep smo
> ...



*1)- What do you mean by black artifact? Is this dark spot in center of bright spill?
2)- Are you using stock cammed action focusing switch?
3)- What kind of bi pin socket are you using?*


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## bigchelis (Nov 16, 2009)

fivemega said:


> *1)- What do you mean by black artifact? Is this dark spot in center of bright spill?*
> *2)- Are you using stock cammed action focusing switch?*
> *3)- What kind of bi pin socket are you using?*


 

I was using the cammed version on all my bezels with the Fivemega kit to install the FM lamp. 

The legs on the bulb would not allow me to push it all the way in, but MrGman cut the legs of lamp off a couple mm till it fits flush with the bi-pin kit. 

Now, I get a perfect beam with probably the most beautifull beam I have ever seen from a incandescent. Even MrGman who generally dislikes all incandescents was very impressed. The lamp has to fit flush with the bi-pin kit to look perfect.

Regards,
Jose


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## RichS (Nov 18, 2009)

bigchelis said:


> I was using the cammed version on all my bezels with the Fivemega kit to install the FM lamp.
> 
> The legs on the bulb would not allow me to push it all the way in, but MrGman cut the legs of lamp off a couple mm till it fits flush with the bi-pin kit.
> 
> ...


 
Awesome report - this is great to hear! I have all the parts in route to do this exact build in a 2D, but with an AW soft-start switch - gotta extend the life of these $16 bulbs! I'm also going to do the tailspring mod to get the max juice to this bulb!

I have a Litho SMO and FM bi-focal SMO reflector I'm going to try with it. I'll post some beamshots compared to my 3C Mag85. From what I've read, the Mag09 is going to kick it's butt...:devil:


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## think2x (Nov 29, 2009)

I put a minimag in a ziploc bag and sprayed in "easy off" oven cleaner(yellow can) until the light was covered. Let it sit for 8 minutes, removed the light and rinsed while using a green scotchbrite pad. Works great for me. I found that tip from an RC car forum.


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## bigchelis (Dec 22, 2009)

think2x said:


> I put a minimag in a ziploc bag and sprayed in "easy off" oven cleaner(yellow can) until the light was covered. Let it sit for 8 minutes, removed the light and rinsed while using a green scotchbrite pad. Works great for me. I found that tip from an RC car forum.


 

I just got back from Lowes hardware store and got the Easy Off (blue one). After 4 hours the anodizing is still there... Will try the yellow can and 8 hours next time. At least we can use to clean the stove.


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## Hack On Wheels (Dec 22, 2009)

bigchelis said:


> I just got back from Lowes hardware store and got the Easy Off (blue one). After 4 hours the anodizing is still there... Will try the yellow can and 8 hours next time. At least we can use to clean the stove.



8 hours? He said just 8 minutes...

There is also a thread somewhere about using drain cleaner to de-anodize. There are some reasonably well documented results in that thread as well as instructions for de-anodizing...

Edit: This thread... https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/253126


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## Outdoors Fanatic (Dec 23, 2009)

Beamshots??


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## RichS (Dec 23, 2009)

Outdoors Fanatic said:


> Beamshots??


Well, I had the best of intentions to do this once I finally got mine built, but it's just too frikin' cold right now!


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## Outdoors Fanatic (Dec 23, 2009)

RichS said:


> Well, I had the best of intentions to do this once I finally got mine built, but it's just too frikin' cold right now!


2000+ lumens OTF not enough to keep you warm? LOL!


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## bigchelis (Dec 23, 2009)

Outdoors Fanatic said:


> 2000+ lumens OTF not enough to keep you warm? LOL!


 


I tried, but since I moved to a new apartment my picture camera is missing. I do have the flip video, but it keeps adjusting for brightness:mecry:


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