# Bad experience with Prometheus Lights



## knife117 (Apr 2, 2015)

I ordered an alpha ready made which arrived with what I found to be a somewhat dirty reflector after talking with other ready made users. It had a lot of dust-like stuff and a fiber on the reflector:







So I contacted Jason about it, and he seemed like he was willing to fix the issue by exchanging my light for one with a clean reflector. I sent the light back to him and waited. I had to send a reminder to him to get my light back because he apparently forgot about it. So he sends a new light back to me, and this is what I get:










The new light had scratches, dust, and what looks like an intentionally placed finger print smudge! The hell? I sent several emails to Jason about the issue, and he never responded. I had to file a claim through PayPal to return the light and get my money back. I'll never do business with Prometheus lights again. Buyer beware!


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## kj2 (Apr 2, 2015)

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/forumdisplay.php?143-Cheers-N-Jeers


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## Cerealand (Apr 2, 2015)

Dark sucks has a subforum on here if you want to voice your concerns there. The dark sucks following may not be too happy with negative feedback.


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## knife117 (Apr 2, 2015)

Cerealand said:


> Dark sucks has a subforum on here if you want to voice your concerns there. The dark sucks following may not be too happy with negative feedback.



Dark SUCKS is right.


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## Up All Night (Apr 2, 2015)

Check the bottom of his warranty page for the "don't be a jerk" clause.
Pretty much gives himself carte blanche in the "after sales" department. I read that years ago when I was close to punching the buy button, no thanks.

Remember . . . . .he's "making the rules" :shakehead


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## kj2 (Apr 2, 2015)

Up All Night said:


> Check the bottom of his warranty page for the "don't be a jerk" clause.
> Pretty much gives himself carte blanche in the "after sales" department. I read that years ago when I was close to punching the buy button, no thanks.
> 
> Remember . . . . .he's "making the rules" :shakehead



Just read it.. Also a no-go for me.


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## knife117 (Apr 2, 2015)

Up All Night said:


> Check the bottom of his warranty page for the "don't be a jerk" clause.
> Pretty much gives himself carte blanche in the "after sales" department. I read that years ago when I was close to punching the buy button, no thanks.
> 
> Remember . . . . .he's "making the rules" :shakehead



Yeah. I saw that. I wasn't a jerk about this issue at all. I guess his definition of a jerk is whatever he decides it to be at the time. He should follow his own clause.


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## Cerealand (Apr 2, 2015)

The cosmestic marks are outlined in the terms: 'I do not attempt to deliver cosmetically perfect products. Minor cosmetic defects in the surface and/or finish should be expected and are not covered by warranty. Nicks, dings, and scratches are common. Everything I make goes through dozens of handling steps. Materials like aluminum, brass, and copper are very soft. My shop is full of machinery and tools that are made of hardened steel. Add gravity to the equation and you can see the potential for small defects.'


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## Amelia (Apr 2, 2015)

Cerealand said:


> The cosmestic marks are outlined in the terms: 'I do not attempt to deliver cosmetically perfect products. Minor cosmetic defects in the surface and/or finish should be expected and are not covered by warranty. Nicks, dings, and scratches are common. Everything I make goes through dozens of handling steps. Materials like aluminum, brass, and copper are very soft. My shop is full of machinery and tools that are made of hardened steel. Add gravity to the equation and you can see the potential for small defects.'



Translation: I run a sloppy shop and drop things, bang things into each other, and don't bother to keep my workpieces separated and padded from my tools and materials. Expect a dinged up and scuffed light, since I just don't care enough about my product to handle it properly like the 100+ other flashlight manufacturers out there have somehow managed to get the hang of doing.

No thanks - I won't be buying any lights from him.


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## knife117 (Apr 2, 2015)

Cerealand said:


> The cosmestic marks are outlined in the terms: 'I do not attempt to deliver cosmetically perfect products. Minor cosmetic defects in the surface and/or finish should be expected and are not covered by warranty. Nicks, dings, and scratches are common. Everything I make goes through dozens of handling steps. Materials like aluminum, brass, and copper are very soft. My shop is full of machinery and tools that are made of hardened steel. Add gravity to the equation and you can see the potential for small defects.'



It was my understanding that this applied to the OUTSIDE of his lights which I don't care about. An internal component like the reflector ,which is extremely fragile, should be handled with more care.


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## Cerealand (Apr 2, 2015)

Jason's lights are marketed as easy to fix/upgrade. I'm actually surprised he did not just switch out the boom reflector for you. I have been looking at his lights for a while, but so far I have not made a purchase.


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## knife117 (Apr 2, 2015)

Cerealand said:


> Jason's lights are marketed as easy to fix/upgrade. I'm actually surprised he did not just switch out the boom reflector for you. I have been looking at his lights for a while, but so far I have not made a purchase.



I think he did switch out the whole head of the flashlight..... for one with scratches and a fingerprint smudge on the reflector.


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## ahtoxa11 (Apr 2, 2015)

Amelia said:


> Translation: I run a sloppy shop and drop things, bang things into each other, and don't bother to keep my workpieces separated and padded from my tools and materials. Expect a dinged up and scuffed light, since I just don't care enough about my product to handle it properly like the 100+ other flashlight manufacturers out there have somehow managed to get the hang of doing.
> 
> No thanks - I won't be buying any lights from him.



Agreed. This and the "don't be a jerk" clause turned me off from purchasing. 

"_Add gravity to the equation and you can see the potential for small defects" 

_
That's not a very good excuse. When I buy a new product, I want to buy it in like-new condition. I'll put the scuffs, dings and scratches on it myself.


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## Str8stroke (Apr 2, 2015)

Could you have taken it apart and cleaned it to your standards? Granted it likely shouldn't have come that way, especially on the second go. Let down, yup, bummer yup. I have received many-a lights with stuff like this from various manufactures. If possible, I just fix it myself. For me it is usually easier. 

All the lights I have gotten from him have been jam up jelly tight. So seems kinda odd.


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## recDNA (Apr 2, 2015)

After reading this thread I wouldn't consider buying a light from them. I don't like the second one being in worse condition and I HATE dealers who won't respond to emails.


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## knife117 (Apr 2, 2015)

Str8stroke said:


> Could you have taken it apart and cleaned it to your standards? Granted it likely shouldn't have come that way, especially on the second go. Let down, yup, bummer yup. I have received many-a lights with stuff like this from various manufactures. If possible, I just fix it myself. For me it is usually easier.
> 
> All the lights I have gotten from him have been jam up jelly tight. So seems kinda odd.



Nope. Reflectors are so fragile that they are almost impossible to clean without creating more problems or introducing more dust. I've never done it, and I shouldn't have to attempt it with a light that costs almost $300.

Also, the light was water tight too, so it's not like I got one that was letting dust in. The stuff got there when he assembled the light. Here is the smart *** remark I got from him with the first reflector. 

"Without seeing it, my advice is thus: I work in a machine shop, not a clean room  "

No "sorry for sending a dirty reflector" or anything.


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## hombreluhrs (Apr 2, 2015)

Knife117, Did Jason respond after you opened a Paypal claim? I've only ordered one light from him...actually just arrived yesterday. I also noticed some specks on my reflector, not as bad as in your pics but there were some. Other than that mine looks good. 

I'd be interested in seeing how this turns out for you. I realize Jason has a business to run but maybe something serious happened. Hopefully not....but you never know.


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## nbp (Apr 2, 2015)

I've had good experiences with Jason in the past, as have most. I am surprised at the result here. I'd be very interested to hear his side of the story...


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## knife117 (Apr 2, 2015)

hombreluhrs said:


> Knife117, Did Jason respond after you opened a Paypal claim? I've only ordered one light from him...actually just arrived yesterday. I also noticed some specks on my reflector, not as bad as in your pics but there were some. Other than that mine looks good.
> 
> I'd be interested in seeing how this turns out for you. I realize Jason has a business to run but maybe something serious happened. Hopefully not....but you never know.



So I first started out with a PayPal dispute which lets the seller and buyer try to work things out, but he didn't respond to that, and I didn't have any reason to believe he would after ignoring my emails. So I escalated it to a PayPal claim which lets PayPal decide the outcome. He must have responded to PayPal because they basically froze the ~$300 in his PayPal account until I returned the light. Then I got my refund once PayPal confirmed that the package was delivered through the tracking info I gave them. 

No email response from Jason at all once I got the messed up replacement light from him. I heard about this same sort of thing happening with others as well, so my gut told me it needed to be handled with a PayPal claim.


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## calipsoii (Apr 2, 2015)

nbp said:


> I've had good experiences with Jason in the past, as have most. I am surprised at the result here. I'd be very interested to hear his side of the story...



+1. Would be interested in getting both sides of the story before passing any kind of judgement on either party.


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## knife117 (Apr 2, 2015)

calipsoii said:


> +1. Would be interested in getting both sides of the story before passing any kind of judgement on either party.



The pictures pretty much say everything in my opinion. Why would a self respecting "high end" flashlight maker send out a flashlight with a fingerprint smudge and scratches on the reflector?


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## calipsoii (Apr 2, 2015)

knife117 said:


> The pictures pretty much say everything in my opinion. Why would a self respecting "high end" flashlight maker send out a flashlight with a fingerprint smudge and scratches on the reflector?



I have no idea, that's why I'd like Jason to chime in here on the matter.


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## jmoyat (Apr 2, 2015)

knife117 said:


> The pictures pretty much say everything in my opinion. Why would a self respecting "high end" flashlight maker send out a flashlight with a fingerprint smudge and scratches on the reflector?



Mistakes happen.. I would think that Jason will fix the problem.
He must be very busy making lights (he's a one man operation) and will likely get to this asap. I bought 10 lights from him and have always been more than happy with both the quality of his lights and the communication and buying process (order confirmation, shipping confirmation, all in a timely manner). 
All of my ten lights were perfect, though you can always find a small scratch or little dust as expected with a custom light (many of my customs have dust inside the reflector, I can always clean that up).
True, these photos are disturbing, but I would think it is a one time incident that should not deter anyone from buying a Prometheus light. They are just outstanding - this is an unfortunate event and I am sure Jason will stand up to this and fix things up.


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## nbp (Apr 2, 2015)

knife117 said:


> I heard about this same sort of thing happening with others as well, so my gut told me it needed to be handled with a PayPal claim.



Could you provide links to any of the previous incidents you are referring to? 



calipsoii said:


> I have no idea, that's why I'd like Jason to chime in here on the matter.



+1


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## Mrhoades (Apr 2, 2015)

I have a feeling that Jason's version of the story would be different. I understand the OP wanting to have a perfect light for $300, but I question why the issue is put in three duplicate threads on CPF. This is the first customer service issue I've heard about regarding Jason. I don't know what the OP is looking for, but I hope they find it.


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## knife117 (Apr 2, 2015)

nbp said:


> Could you provide links to any of the previous incidents you are referring to?
> 
> 
> 
> +1



It was a cached post on his facebook page that I found on Google. It talked about poor customer service and no responses to email. I can't find a link anymore.


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## knife117 (Apr 2, 2015)

Mrhoades said:


> I have a feeling that Jason's version of the story would be different. I understand the OP wanting to have a perfect light for $300, but I question why the issue is put in three duplicate threads on CPF. This is the first customer service issue I've heard about regarding Jason. I don't know what the OP is looking for, but I hope they find it.



Different how? I wasn't looking for a perfect light. The one I got had tiny scratches all over the body of the flashlight that I was fine with. Tell me you wouldn't return the light if the reflector was scratched and had a fingerprint smudge. That is beyond ridiculous for a $300 light. I have lights that cost less than $100 with spotless reflectors.


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## Mrhoades (Apr 2, 2015)

knife117 said:


> Different how? I wasn't looking for a perfect light. The one I got had tiny scratches all over the body of the flashlight that I was fine with. Tell me you wouldn't return the light if the reflector was scratched and had a fingerprint smudge. That is beyond ridiculous for a $300 light. I have lights that cost less than $100 with spotless reflectors.



There are two sides to every story. I don't deny hat you should have received a light free from imperfections. What I don't get is why you felt the need to start three threads in three different sub forums to complain about it. I didn't see anywhere that you stated the timeline of events. How long was it from the time you sent back the original light to the time you filed the PayPal claim?


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## Str8stroke (Apr 2, 2015)

Random thoughts:
Interesting thing here to think about. He uses Kickstarter to do business. So he must be fully aware what social media can do these days. Threads like this have to have an negative impact on sales. Perhaps he has enough sales not to worry? Seems like many small shops operate this way, regardless of the business. In my opinion, one of the reasons for paying a premium for custom/semi custom work is so that the customer can get things the way they want them. No matter how minor the detail. 
I am happy with all my purchases from him. I hope he comes through and makes it right.


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## Mmassey338 (Apr 2, 2015)

knife117 said:


> So I first started out with a PayPal dispute which lets the seller and buyer try to work things out, but he didn't respond to that, and I didn't have any reason to believe he would after ignoring my emails. So I escalated it to a PayPal claim which lets PayPal decide the outcome. He must have responded to PayPal because they basically froze the ~$300 in his PayPal account until I returned the light. Then I got my refund once PayPal confirmed that the package was delivered through the tracking info I gave them.
> 
> No email response from Jason at all once I got the messed up replacement light from him.* I heard about this same sort of thing happening with others as well, so my gut told me it needed to be handled with a PayPal claim.*


*
*
If you're going to make a statement like that, cite specifics. I was starting to believe you up until this, but you lost credibility in my opinion. 
I have two of the Beta v2's, and think they're great


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## knife117 (Apr 2, 2015)

Mmassey338 said:


> [/B]
> If you're going to make a statement like that, cite specifics. I was starting to believe you up until this, but you lost credibility in my opinion.
> I have two of the Beta v2's, and think they're great



Specifics about what? I've been telling the truth about everything. I got the scratched reflector light and immediately sent him an email. I sent another email the next day and still no response. After about 5 days from getting the scratched reflector light, I filed the PayPal dispute. No response to that after a day, so I figured he wasn't going to do anything about the issue. That's when I escalated it to a PayPal claim.


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## Mmassey338 (Apr 2, 2015)

When I quoted you, I bolded the phrase I was questioning. Something about what you've heard. Hearsay. Innuendo. Not your experience. Rumor.


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## knife117 (Apr 2, 2015)

Mmassey338 said:


> When I quoted you, I bolded the phrase I was questioning. Something about what you've heard. Hearsay. Innuendo. Not your experience. Rumor.



You didn't bold anything. Also, the thing I saw about Jason's poor customer service was on the Prometheus Lights facebook page. It has been deleted from the facebook page. Imagine that. [emoji52]


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## nbp (Apr 3, 2015)

knife117 said:


> It was a cached post on his facebook page that I found on Google. It talked about poor customer service and no responses to email. I can't find a link anymore.



I just thought with a blanket statement about others having problems with Jason's products and getting no responses or support from him maybe you had some evidence of that happening. 

I'm not saying you didn't have this experience, only that as has been noted, this situation seems to me (can't speak for others) to be an outlier when it comes to Jason's customer service record. If that is the case, is there a specific reason for it? Jason would be the only one to answer that.


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## Raze (Apr 3, 2015)

I have a couple of lights from Jason, and it has been good so far. That includes the correspondence with him. He does run his business as a one-man show though, and he might get occupied. 

I would be upset in getting a $300 light that has obvious flaws too, I hear ya. But let's give Jason the benefit of the doubt and let him chime in. I believe he can sort this out properly.


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## recDNA (Apr 3, 2015)

I've been waiting to see if he does. Certainly nobody here preventing it. He may not wish to deal with this customer any more but I would be curious what he says.


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## Mmassey338 (Apr 3, 2015)

knife117 said:


> You didn't bold anything. Also, the thing I saw about Jason's poor customer service was on the Prometheus Lights facebook page. It has been deleted from the facebook page. Imagine that. [emoji52]



Read my post #30, and notice in the quote of what you said that part is *bold. 
*After the way you've acted here in public, I can only imagine how you acted in private. I would not want to do business with you either.

Good luck.


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## NoNotAgain (Apr 3, 2015)

*knife117, *A few questions for you. I don't know anyone from *Prometheus Lights*, nor you, but maybe with your answers you can shed some light on this transaction.

When did you place and pay for your order? As close to the exact date as possible. When did you receive the light? When did you notify Prometheus Lights for the issues you have shown in pictures provided here? Any dates of correspondences between you and them.

The reason for my questions are that PayPal has a 45 day window to file a claim from date of purchase. If you were coming up on the date, I can understand the concern. If I don't receive responses from vendors in a timely fashion I also get antsy.

As for Prometheus, I'm sure that some members here have notified them of the threads posted. Unless there are unseen circumstances, the lack of a response speaks louder than words.


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## knife117 (Apr 3, 2015)

recDNA said:


> I've been waiting to see if he does. Certainly nobody here preventing it. He may not wish to deal with this customer any more but I would be curious what he says.



I don't care if he does. I just wanted to let others know about my experience. Jason needs to improve his customer service. My gut tells me that he intentionally sent the bad reflector back to me. If not, he just doesn't care at all about quality control.


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## knife117 (Apr 3, 2015)

NoNotAgain said:


> *knife117, *A few questions for you. I don't know anyone from *Prometheus Lights*, nor you, but maybe with your answers you can shed some light on this transaction.
> 
> When did you place and pay for your order? As close to the exact date as possible. When did you receive the light? When did you notify Prometheus Lights for the issues you have shown in pictures provided here? Any dates of correspondences between you and them.
> 
> ...



It was about a month from the original purchase to when I filed the claim. I didn't want to wait any longer. The communication with Jason was very quick for the return of the first light, but then he never responded to my emails for the second light. After waiting 5 days and no response, I filed the dispute. Then I filed a claim a day later.


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## Crazyeddiethefirst (Apr 3, 2015)

knife117 said:


> You didn't bold anything. Also, the thing I saw about Jason's poor customer service was on the Prometheus Lights facebook page. It has been deleted from the facebook page. Imagine that. [emoji52]



FYI, to see the bold print, select "web view", on my iPhone it was not showing any bold print until I selected "web view". This is a good example of two sides to every story, one person stating they did something(and in fact they had indeed used bold print), yet the person who started this thread stated "you didn't bold anything". A statement of "I don't see any bold print" would have been true and not an accusation. I can only add that even before I bought my first light from Jason, I emailed him and he politely responded very quickly. A lot depends on the tone of emails and how they are perceived.


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## knife117 (Apr 3, 2015)

Mmassey338 said:


> Read my post #30, and notice in the quote of what you said that part is *bold.
> *After the way you've acted here in public, I can only imagine how you acted in private. I would not want to do business with you either.
> 
> Good luck.



You're out of your element.


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## knife117 (Apr 3, 2015)

Crazyeddiethefirst said:


> FYI, to see the bold print, select "web view", on my iPhone it was not showing any bold print until I selected "web view". This is a good example of two sides to every story, one person stating they did something(and in fact they had indeed used bold print), yet the person who started this thread stated "you didn't bold anything". A statement of "I don't see any bold print" would have been true and not an accusation. I can only add that even before I bought my first light from Jason, I emailed him and he politely responded very quickly. A lot depends on the tone of emails and how they are perceived.



I didn't use any mean tones in any of my emails. I think actions speak louder than words though. Jason's lack of response told me everything. If you're running a business, 5 days to respond (or not respond in Jason's case) to a customer service request is an eternity.


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## fyrstormer (Apr 3, 2015)

knife117 said:


> Nope. Reflectors are so fragile that they are almost impossible to clean without creating more problems or introducing more dust. I've never done it, and I shouldn't have to attempt it with a light that costs almost $300.


Translated: "I have no idea how fragile reflectors are or whether it's possible to clean them without ruining them, because I've never tried."



knife117 said:


> "Without seeing it, my advice is thus: I work in a machine shop, not a clean room
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I'd say his "don't be a jerk" clause is entirely justified in this case. This is a custom-made light by a small vendor who doesn't have a clean-room for assembly purposes, and can't afford to just toss every light with a bit of dust in it into a pile for someone else to rebuild prior to sale. The dust you complained about could've been easily removed by unscrewing the light engine, removing the reflector, and washing it with warm soapy water and your pinky-fingertip. If you're any kind of flashaholic the idea of cleaning the reflector to remove a bit of dust should be no problem for you. You might as well go on a car-enthusiast forum and complain that Jiffy Lube spilled a little oil on the top of your engine during your last oil change.

Perhaps a 2xAA Maglite from Home Depot will suit you better.

- - -

EDIT: Here's a picture of a Ledil Boom reflector (that I bought from Jason, coincidentally), then spent three hours grinding-down to fit in a much smaller light. (just _imagine_ how much dust was on it by the time I finished.) Then I washed it the way I described above.













Tell me more about how fragile reflectors are.


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## knife117 (Apr 3, 2015)

fyrstormer said:


> I'd say his "don't be a jerk" clause is entirely justified in this case. This is a custom-made light by a small vendor who doesn't have a clean-room for assembly purposes, and can't afford to just toss every light with a bit of dust in it into a pile for someone else to rebuild prior to sale. The dust you complained about could've been easily removed by unscrewing the light engine, removing the reflector, and washing it with warm soapy water and your pinky-fingertip, and if you're any kind of flashaholic the idea of cleaning the reflector to remove a bit of dust should be no problem for you.
> 
> Perhaps a 2xAA Maglite from Home Depot will suit you better.



His don't be a jerk clause is entirely what's wrong with his approach to running a business. Have you ever heard the phrase that the customer is always right? I'm not saying I was a jerk (I wasn't). I paid good money for a product, and I refuse to accept a product with damaged internal components. 

I didn't claim to be a "flashaholic," and I don't think I want to be one. I wanted to see what the higher-end flashlights were all about. I guess I should try a better flashlight maker.


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## fyrstormer (Apr 3, 2015)

Yes, I have heard "the customer is always right". It's most often used by self-centered jerks who think they're entitled to make endless and unreasonable demands of everyone as long as money is involved. You got the product you paid for; it was never specified it would be perfectly clean and spotless, in fact it was specified that it _wouldn't_ be. The standard of perfection you were expecting existed in your mind and nowhere else.

Stop whining and wash the reflector yourself. It takes less than five minutes to wash a reflector with warm soapy water, a clean fingertip, and then blow the water droplets off the reflector surface -- a much shorter time than you've spent complaining here.


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## knife117 (Apr 3, 2015)

fyrstormer said:


> Yes, I have heard "the customer is always right". It's most often used by self-centered jerks who think they're entitled to make endless and unreasonable demands of everyone as long as money is involved. You got the product you paid for; it was never specified it would be perfectly clean and spotless, in fact it was specified that it probably _wouldn't_ be. The standard of perfection you were looking for existed in your head and nowhere else.
> 
> Stop whining and wash the reflector yourself. It takes less than five minutes to wash a reflector with warm soapy water, a clean fingertip, and then blow the water droplets off the reflector surface -- a much shorter time than you've spent complaining here.



Why do you even care? I don't buy flashlights expecting that I'll be taking them apart to wash the reflectors. That's why I sent the first light back; to get a clean one. This decision was made based on the other thread I made in the Prometheus lights subforum. Nobody else had ever seen a reflector that dirty before. I was hoping it was a fluke, and I'd get a clean one sent back to me.


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## fyrstormer (Apr 3, 2015)

recDNA said:


> I've been waiting to see if he does. Certainly nobody here preventing it. He may not wish to deal with this customer any more but I would be curious what he says.





NoNotAgain said:


> As for Prometheus, I'm sure that some members here have notified them of the threads posted. Unless there are unseen circumstances, the lack of a response speaks louder than words.



If Jason has any sense (and I'm sure he does), he won't reply to this thread. He would just be inviting an endless argument with people who think he should bend over backwards to make an unreasonable customer happy -- which is impossible at this point, since the customer has already stated he plans to never do business with Jason again:



knife117 said:


> I don't care if he does. I just wanted to let others know about my experience. Jason needs to improve his customer service. My gut tells me that he intentionally sent the bad reflector back to me. If not, he just doesn't care at all about quality control.


...not to mention he actually thinks Jason sent him a defective product out of spite. I mean really, what does that tell you about his personality?

- - -

And before anyone makes any insinuations: No, I am not Jason's employee, or friend, or relative, or acquaintance of any sort. I have never met him and the only product I've ever bought from him was a few reflectors. My reaction in this thread is based solely on my tendency to call-out a jerk when I see one.


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## fyrstormer (Apr 3, 2015)

knife117 said:


> Why do you even care? I don't buy flashlights expecting that I'll be taking them apart to wash the reflectors. That's why I sent the first light back; to get a clean one. This decision was made based on the other thread I made in the Prometheus lights subforum. Nobody else had ever seen a reflector that dirty before. I was hoping it was a fluke, and I'd get a clean one sent back to me.


I care because your claim to being cheated and mistreated is spurious at best, and the way you've handled it has been juvenile, and that sort of thing irritates the crap out of me.

You won't find any custom light maker who will bend over backwards to save you the trouble of removing a bit of dust, because they all have small operations, no support staff, and lives outside of work. Custom lights are valuable because they exist at all, not because they are cosmetically perfect. If you want a light that is perfectly assembled with no dust anywhere in it, go buy a Maglite. A custom light is not for you.


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## 1DaveN (Apr 3, 2015)

My biggest takeaway from this thread is how happy I am with my Fenix lights, which cost at most 1/4 of the Prometheus and have no quality control issues at all. If I were paying a premium price for a custom built light, I would expect better quality than substantially cheaper, off-the-shelf lights, certainly not worse. And usually, those selling premium, custom-built wares have better customer service than K-Mart, not worse.


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## 5S8Zh5 (Apr 3, 2015)




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## fyrstormer (Apr 3, 2015)

1DaveN said:


> My biggest takeaway from this thread is how happy I am with my Fenix lights, which cost at most 1/4 of the Prometheus and have no quality control issues at all. If I were paying a premium price for a custom built light, I would expect better quality than substantially cheaper, off-the-shelf lights, certainly not worse. And usually, those selling premium, custom-built wares have better customer service than K-Mart, not worse.


Yes, those are the virtues of mass-production, and to be fair the light that I EDC is mass-produced, though it was a limited production run. The downside to mass-production is that you can't get the light made just the way you want it, very few genuinely new ideas come from factories, and the light was so affordable because it was assembled by someone in a third-world sweatshop who gets paid in sand and lives in a factory-owned dormitory with anti-suicide nets outside the windows. Life is a series of tradeoffs, and then you die.


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## Bullzeyebill (Apr 3, 2015)

OP, you need to follow the advise that some our experienced CPF'ers are giving you. This is your third thread discussing this matter Your posts aee becoming redundant and they are bringing out unkind words relative to those posts. I am closing this thread before it gets out of hand. 

Bill


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