# Modifying 35w ebay ballast questions



## liteitup (Oct 20, 2009)

Hey guys i have these 35w ebay ballasts that i bought before i realized they are no where near the 35w rating. I bought the 55w ballasts which are still not truly 55w but they are atleast putting out what a "normal" 35w hid ballast is. Im quite happy with the output of these 55w ballasts. Needless to say in cpf fashion the 35w dimmer ballasts are now paperweights that are in need of modding.

Ive ripped this 35w ballast apart and want to overdrive it. Ive read all kinds of threads here on modifying ballasts. One of the best threads from MorePower looked like it dealt with the 55w version i have. This 35w one is a different design. Appartently modifying the sense resistors on the 55w ballast only changed the start up current. Im wondering if adding resistors to this 35w ballast would on do the same thing? Has anyone played with one of these and can give me a direction to run with? I can solder but really have no idea what each piece in this ballast is or does... here are some internal pictures. click to get full size











thanks!


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## roadie (Oct 21, 2009)

i got abit blurred trying to read yr problem ....

kindly state the main issue .. and kindly have a pic of the ballast in its orginal form ... and prove details where u got it ... etc


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## liteitup (Oct 21, 2009)

roadie said:


> i got abit blurred trying to read yr problem ....
> 
> kindly state the main issue .. and kindly have a pic of the ballast in its orginal form ... and prove details where u got it ... etc



no issues it works, just no where near 35watt. I want to overdrive this ballast and am wondering if anyone has dealt with this particular one. its a 35w from xtreme hids. thanks


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## Patriot (Oct 21, 2009)

I understood your question fine I just don't have the knowledge to help you. I would PM Morepower and send him some detailed and sharp pictures of the ballast with insulation removed. Even though it's not the same ballast, he might be able to point you in the right direction.


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## liteitup (Oct 22, 2009)

Patriot said:


> I understood your question fine I just don't have the knowledge to help you. I would PM Morepower and send him some detailed and sharp pictures of the ballast with insulation removed. Even though it's not the same ballast, he might be able to point you in the right direction.



he hasnt been online since august


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## bshanahan14rulz (Oct 22, 2009)

look for a bunch of resistors in parallel and hope that they are for adjusting current after warmup. 

Looks like they tried to save money by partially potting instead of completely potting? bleh.

But yeah, if the 55W has the same parts layout, you might could find out how. Have you tried doing anything with the other || resistors? the ones that aren't marked "sense resistors"


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## liteitup (Oct 22, 2009)

bshanahan14rulz said:


> look for a bunch of resistors in parallel and hope that they are for adjusting current after warmup.
> 
> Looks like they tried to save money by partially potting instead of completely potting? bleh.
> 
> But yeah, if the 55W has the same parts layout, you might could find out how. Have you tried doing anything with the other || resistors? the ones that aren't marked "sense resistors"



havnt attempted anything yet. dont want to smoke it lol... i think i will try first with the resistors i marked as sense resistors. they are in parallel and im assuming .05 ohms a piece? Like i said i dont know that much about components but im not afraid to learn new things.


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## IgNITEor (Oct 22, 2009)

Getting more of the potting material off the critical areas is worth the effort.
Here are two resistor charts that might help. I think the ones to look for are in groups of equal value :

http://www.webcalc.net/calc/0231.php
http://www.hobby-hour.com/electronics/resistorcalculator.php

Nice that they went easy on the potting! :thumbsup: Go for it.


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## liteitup (Oct 22, 2009)

IgNITEor said:


> Getting more of the potting material off the critical areas is worth the effort.
> Here are two resistor charts that might help. I think the ones to look for are in groups of equal value :
> 
> http://www.webcalc.net/calc/0231.php
> ...



the black coating is actually rubber... unfortunately it doesnt really come off easy. The underside with the circuit board was a foam. Im hoping the 3 r050 resistors in parallel are the current sensing resistors. I would add more to make it see less current correct?


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## joedm (Oct 22, 2009)

might be time for someone to take one for the team and try this out :thumbsup:

I'd definitely be doing something along these lines if someone could figure this out.


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## IgNITEor (Oct 22, 2009)

That's one way to describe it. Decrease resistance, increase current flow.
If you can find a potentiometer/variable resistor with your existing value near it's midpoint, you've got easy flexibility to fine tune things.

Locating all the solder traces and where resistors are bridged is helpful.
You'll eventually want to find room for some heat removal as the board's gonna get cookin' later!


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## liteitup (Oct 23, 2009)

IgNITEor said:


> That's one way to describe it. Decrease resistance, increase current flow.
> If you can find a potentiometer/variable resistor with your existing value near it's midpoint, you've got easy flexibility to fine tune things.
> 
> Locating all the solder traces and where resistors are bridged is helpful.
> You'll eventually want to find room for some heat removal as the board's gonna get cookin' later!



i was wrong about the top coating... it is potted with a thin rubber layer. i scraped at it a little harder and it starter coming off. 

The three parallel resistors appear to be between a FET and some type of coil (flyback converter on the following link)... 


Im trying to follow this thread. It appears that they have a similar setup as far as the resistors, fet, and the coil. https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/151030 


That particular ballast also has 6 .1 ohm resistors which would have the same value as 3 .05ohm resistors, correct? Im hoping i can just add 2 more resistors to bump the output into the 40w OUTPUT range. Now i just have to source some of these r050 resistors and give it a shot i guess. I guess i could also try to unsolder one of the resistors and see if the output goes down.

Now there is another thread dealing with the 55w rated ballast and adjusting the resistors only changed the startup current. but they also talked about a pot. to adjust but i cant find any pot. on this board...


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## liteitup (Oct 23, 2009)

joedm said:


> might be time for someone to take one for the team and try this out :thumbsup:
> 
> I'd definitely be doing something along these lines if someone could figure this out.



ill take one for the team, but i dont want to go shooting in the dark either lol!


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## IgNITEor (Oct 23, 2009)

Correct.They're probably using six to dissipate some heat. Interesting that they are having to use six all together in parallel. Hmmmm...... 
Make notes, you've got a big audience. Like all those people during the Dark Ages up in the galleries watching open room medical operations.

Snip, snip...........


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## LumenHound (Oct 24, 2009)

I have a "35 watt" spotlight and it's ballast has an almost identical layout. On mine there is a tiny pot on the side of the small board closest to the case. The pot was covered with potting compound and was initially hard to detect due to it's small size.
I had to put a hole in the side of the ballast case in order to get at the compound surrounding the pot with sharp toothpicks.


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## mvyrmnd (Oct 27, 2009)

LumenHound said:


> I have a "35 watt" spotlight and it's ballast has an almost identical layout. On mine there is a tiny pot on the side of the small board closest to the case. The pot was covered with potting compound and was initially hard to detect due to it's small size.
> I had to put a hole in the side of the ballast case in order to get at the compound surrounding the pot with sharp toothpicks.


My 35W was similar - after finding the little pot under the rubber and clearing around it, it was just a matter of turning it a little and measuring the output amps. 

Mine kept going all the way to .0023 Amps on the bulb side. At 20,000V (average output from ballast, my DMM doesn't go high enough to confirm) thats a tasty 46W from a 35W ballast. It's racked up a few hours at that rate and so far no hassles.


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## joedm (Oct 28, 2009)

got any pics of this pot?

If you have, it may tempt me to bust mine open and have a look


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## mvyrmnd (Oct 28, 2009)

Check out Morepower's post 
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/posts/2581207&postcount=7

The first picture shows the pot. It's tiny ans looks like a raised Philips head screw.

His advice in an earlier post *"Anyway 1/4 turn clockwise is all it takes, but don't go any further than that or you will start going backwards as the pot dosn't seem to have a definate stop."

*The pot does not have a stop. it will just keep on turning all day. Think of it like a clock. At 11:59 it's at it's highest resistance. at 12:00 it's at it's minimum. You just need to find 12:00. I took the time to turn a little and test, and kept going until I found it.

You can go for the resistor mod that followed in the linked post, but I didn't want to puch much more thatn that on cheap hardware.

Good Luck!


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## bshanahan14rulz (Oct 28, 2009)

There are many many ballasts with the "Hella gen3" case. Anybody have any insight as to which one is the kind with the easy-to-mod pot? One user found the pot in the ballast that was already installed in his HID light, but just curious if others have found ballasts from aftermarket sources with the same components.


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## BVH (Oct 28, 2009)

just a note on some of the POTs out there. Seems some of us with Xeray ballasts found that the POT's are not geared for much turning of the screw. I know of one who increased from 75 to 80 Watts or so and no matter how many times he tried to bring it back to original position, it would not change output any longer.


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## liteitup (Oct 29, 2009)

Ok well i looked high and low and on this particular ballast there is no pot anywhere to be found. Morepower had the 55w ballast which has the mounting tabs molded on which is supposed to have the pot.

Now for the GOOD NEWS!!! Ballast is currently running at 51 watts input (as opposed to a measly 32 input watts stock). I did have it as high as 70 watts input. more on that later.

Some numbers to crunch:

Stock ballast 13.5 volt input, 2.42 amps input. 32.67 input watts.

Modified ballast 13.02 volts input, 3.94 amps input. 51.29 input watts. 





51 watts was attained by soldering 2 additional 0.05 ohms resistors on.I test fired it with a total of 3 extra resistors and got 69 watts input!! Assuming 75% efficiency (low side probably?) thats 51w at the bulb! Not bad for an el cheapo ebay ballast. I only ran it for a minute like that as i dont want to burn it up at a level im not going to be using it at.

Modded 6 resistors 11.92 volts input, 5.8 amps input. 69.13 input watts. 

These ballast were going to be paper weights, but i am glad i can now put them into service and get atleast 35watts at the bulb out of them with im assuming some decent reliability!

Ok here are some beamshots from an old 4 wheeler reflecter that reflector is pitted and lens foggy.. lol
51watt




stock





now i need to go to digikey and get myself some more resistors. I stole the resistors from the other ballast to test with lol...


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## liteitup (Oct 29, 2009)

More beamshots for fun lol...

lens removed from old reflector gives quite a bit better light output. 

modded ballast on left, stanley HID light on the right! 6k bulb vs stanley 8k (love that stanley )






Head on shot... stanley on right


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## liteitup (Oct 30, 2009)

Measured today getting .42 amps at 101 volts t the bulb. 42 watts at the bulb. 83% efficient. not bad.


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## SirJMD (Oct 30, 2009)

liteitup said:


> Measured today getting .42 amps at 101 volts t the bulb. 42 watts at the bulb. 83% efficient. not bad.



Actually, its 99% efficiency!
You can do a quick test to see if im right: (0.42*101)*0.99 = 41.9958W

If its really 99%, its quite damn impressive.


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## BVH (Oct 30, 2009)

Efficiency is measured using input Power (probably near 55 Watts in this case) vrs output power - as measured - 42 Watts. 42 Watts to the bulb is very typical of 55 Watt rated Ebay type ballasts.

Not sure why the POB looks like it's producing so much less light than the Stanley which is putting out about 34 Watts to the bulb, IIRC?


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## SirJMD (Oct 30, 2009)

BVH said:


> Efficiency is measured using input Power (probably near 55 Watts in this case) vrs output power - as measured - 42 Watts. 42 Watts to the bulb is very typical of 55 Watt rated Ebay type ballasts.
> 
> Not sure why the POB looks like it's producing so much less light than the Stanley which is putting out about 34 Watts to the bulb, IIRC?



As i read it, he got 42.42W at the bulb, and meassured 42W - or did i miss something?


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## BVH (Oct 30, 2009)

1. Input Volts x's Amps = Input Watts
2. Output Volts x's Amps = Output Watts

To find efficiency, measure total power consumed by the ballast (1.) and Total power provided to the bulb (2.) Then divide 2 by 1.

Liteitup, opps, your ballast is 76% efficient.

Now there are also some factors I've been made aware of that need to be considered when the output is AC. There's things like sinewave and others that need to be calc'd in. But for our purposes, it's close enough.


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## joedm (Oct 30, 2009)

wow.. how many what's is your lamp shade?


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## joedm (Oct 30, 2009)

ok, ok, I'll play as well.... :nana:

This is my cheap chinese 35w ballast:






Are those the resistors I see?

And what do we have here:






ok now...

Someone can tell me where to measure, when to measure, i.e. how do I measure output at the bulb when this thing is fired up? (without toasting my nuts that is).


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## joedm (Oct 30, 2009)

oh well.... looks like I took one for the team.... 

I had my meter in series on the bulb side trying to measure the output Amps..
Flicked it on and saw the numbers go up.... and then the meter turned off..

No more meter...

Good news though..
Adjusting that pot does the trick..

first I turned it clockwise 1/4 turn and the ballast switched off??
Then I turned it off and on again (after returning the pot to it's orignal position).

The I tried anticlockwise, and lo and behold.... boosted output!!! :twothumbs
How much by??? no idea.. until I get a new meter.
But my eyes can tell and it's daytime here.

Video is here:

http://img682.imageshack.us/i/p1050316.mp4/


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## BVH (Oct 30, 2009)

Joedm, see my thread here for how I measure Watts to the bulb. Hint...the Voltmeter does not get connected until after the strike to avoid the 25KV or so and high associated current.

http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=243509

Any chance there's a blown fuse inside the meter?


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## IgNITEor (Oct 30, 2009)

jodem, please thank your meter for us. For it's sacrifice, so that all of us can succeed in future tweaking of willing 35-Watt ballasts. Thank you, too.
This is a great experiment to witness.


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## BVH (Oct 30, 2009)

:mecry: To the sound of TAPS in the background


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## liteitup (Oct 30, 2009)

BVH said:


> 1. Input Volts x's Amps = Input Watts
> 2. Output Volts x's Amps = Output Watts
> 
> To find efficiency, measure total power consumed by the ballast (1.) and Total power provided to the bulb (2.) Then divide 2 by 1.
> ...


Not sure how you are calculating efficiency but :

((output)/(input)) * 100 = efficiency %
(42 / 51) * 100 = 82.35% (i rounded up before). Not sure where your getting 76%. 

your right about measuring it with a multimeter though, not an exact science. And yes dont measure volts until its been running for a minute to be safe... too bad that multimeter got ruined 

Also you said something in another post about a POB putting out a lot less light. Im assuming your talking about the Power On Board hid spotlight? I only have the stanley. In the beam shots i was using the 880 series bulb in an old 4 wheeler headlight which has potted faded chrome and a foggy lens. It sucks up the lumens lol, thats why its no where near as bright as the brand new stanley at 35 watts


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## liteitup (Oct 30, 2009)

Lets see how many brave people we can get in here to open and mess with their ballasts! Id love to see how many different configurations there are of these ebay ballasts going around and how each one can be modded differently.

Oh and do be careful around these things when they are on lol... i touched part of the circuit board completely by accident and my thumb got nice buzz through it! I dont know if i would go adjusting pots when the ballast is running. Some parts of these ballasts run at very high voltages before its outputed to the bulb. A screw driver makes nice conductor if you make a stray movement!


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## BVH (Oct 31, 2009)

Trying to think of a way to explain it better. If a ballast is pulling 100 watts DC from it's power supply as measured in its input wires and it is only providing 76 Watts to the bulb as measured at the output wires, then it is only 76% efficient. 24% of the input power is being used to power the ballast components and wasted as heat.

So if this particular ballast if pulling 55 Watts from its power supply and it is only providing 42 Watts to the bulb, then it is only 76% efficient. 42 Watts is only 76% of 55 watts. 13 watts is being used to power the ballast components and wasted as heat.

Does this help?


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## liteitup (Oct 31, 2009)

BVH said:


> Trying to think of a way to explain it better. If a ballast is pulling 100 watts DC from it's power supply as measured in its input wires and it is only providing 76 Watts to the bulb as measured at the output wires, then it is only 76% efficient. 24% of the input power is being used to power the ballast components and wasted as heat.
> 
> So if this particular ballast if pulling 55 Watts from its power supply and it is only providing 42 Watts to the bulb, then it is only 76% efficient. 42 Watts is only 76% of 55 watts. 13 watts is being used to power the ballast components and wasted as heat.
> 
> Does this help?



i think your misunderstanding. this ballast is pulling 51 watts modified at the input. Its not a 55w ballast but a "35" watt that only pulled 32 watts unmodified.


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## BVH (Oct 31, 2009)

That would explain the difference. I thought it was pulling 55 Watts input.


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## liteitup (Oct 31, 2009)

BVH said:


> That would explain the difference. I thought it was pulling 55 Watts input.



glad were on the same page now.. lol


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## joedm (Nov 1, 2009)

So.. I'm thinking of re-potting these ballasts now, but still want access to the pot. Any opinions on whether I should use a tube down to the pot and use thermally conductive epoxy around the tube?

Also, Since I've removed some of the old potting compound, is it worth while trying to use a bit of aluminium to sink some heat directly from some of the other components to the side of the ballast? and then pot over that?

The small trimpot is so small that I'm reluctant to try soldering anything to it.


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## mvyrmnd (Nov 2, 2009)

joedm said:


> So.. I'm thinking of re-potting these ballasts now, but still want access to the pot. Any opinions on whether I should use a tube down to the pot and use thermally conductive epoxy around the tube?
> 
> Also, Since I've removed some of the old potting compound, is it worth while trying to use a bit of aluminium to sink some heat directly from some of the other components to the side of the ballast? and then pot over that?
> 
> The small trimpot is so small that I'm reluctant to try soldering anything to it.



Back to that ballast modding thread to end all threads, this post
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/posts/2584681&postcount=15

shows how to add an external pot. wire that in, then pot the whole thing up.


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## deo71 (Mar 10, 2013)

liteitup said:


> Ok well i looked high and low and on this particular ballast there is no pot anywhere to be found. Morepower had the 55w ballast which has the mounting tabs molded on which is supposed to have the pot.
> 
> Now for the GOOD NEWS!!! Ballast is currently running at 51 watts input (as opposed to a measly 32 input watts stock). I did have it as high as 70 watts input. more on that later.
> 
> ...


Thanks!!!

I followed this guide - and added first one and after second R050 resistors, borrowed from broken ballast and succeeded!!!

The results are:

1.Stock (3x R050) the input power is 12.13V * 4.01A = 48.6W

2.Modded 3+1x R050:
input power 11.5V * 5.31A = 61.1W
output power 111V * 0.44A = 48.8W

3.Modded 3+2x R050:
input power 10.75V * 6.74A = 72.5W
output power 116V * 0.51A = 59.2W

I will obtain some 0.05 om resistors and 12V relays for swiching and post pictures when ready…
I’m thinking to downgrade with 1 R050 for daytime and use full power for night.
Maybe small radiator will be attached to the case on top of FET. ​


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