# Fenix or Olight worth the extra money over a Romisen on Ultrafire?



## humblefan (Aug 3, 2010)

Seems very similar but more price but assuming can take a whack better. Any opinions here, not sure what to buy.


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## mcnair55 (Aug 3, 2010)

A very simple answer is yes,generally but not always the case,a major manufacturer will use product of higher quality in terms of many factors which include to certain standards like din for instance plus durability and quality.Many major makers will gladly publish there spec rates including drop tests etc.

Put it another way and see my post you have 5 seconds to decide,my first grab of a light would be my Fenix EO1 because to me I know it works and bomb proof and I trust it.

As collectors and users we read and swap stories with each other,we try,test buy sell trade and so on to gain the knowledge.I am at the stage now in collecting to know where I am going and currently selling off or trading lights to concentrate on what I consider to be lights of higher quality.I was lucky enough last night to buy a Nitecore EZAA at a very decent price,plus I managed to dispose of my Thrunite Tikey because I really am not keen on 
those pesky little button cell jobbies.

Nothing wrong with cheaper lights but I want a Jetbeam/Nitecore/Eagletac etc in my collection and not the DX type.My budget for buys is by selling trading model cars and now using surplus Led lights.


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## sol-leks (Aug 3, 2010)

Basically yes, but it depends I guess on what you want from a light. Its also important to not only buy the right brand but from the right vendor as well who will back up their products.

I think you are missing the vast differences between the brands. Romisen doesn't even make multi-mode lights but they still have very good quality. Ultrafire has cheap multimode lights but they often have iffy quality?

Am I saying you need to buy something like a fenix or another mid range brand(fenix is nowhere near the most expensive brand incidentally). No you don't. However, you have to decide what features you want and what those features and overall quality is worth to you.

Personally, I own more budget lights than high end lights but everyone is different.


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## carrot (Aug 3, 2010)

For some, the difference is worth it. Many budget lights these days can match a lot of high end lights on a point for point on specs and features. A lot of the difference has to do with build quality, which directly affects reliability, durability, and long-term performance of a light. For me, I say yes, it is worth it. It depends on your uses and expectations of a product.


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## randomlugia (Aug 3, 2010)

sol-leks said:


> I think you are missing the vast differences between the brands. Romisen doesn't even make multi-mode lights but they still have very good quality.



Shiningbeam sells many Romisen lights with more than one mode.

One thing that would make it worth it to me is mode selection, most importantly the selector ring. I've never seen a selector ring on a budget light, and it seems that they all have some flashy mode you have to cycle through. I have seen a lot of budget lights that I consider to have as good durability as an expensive light, so a lot of the time it just depends on _which_ budget light you're looking at.


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## mcnair55 (Aug 3, 2010)

randomlugia said:


> Shiningbeam sells many Romisen lights with more than one mode.
> 
> One thing that would make it worth it to me is mode selection, most importantly the selector ring. I've never seen a selector ring on a budget light, and it seems that they all have some flashy mode you have to cycle through. I have seen a lot of budget lights that I consider to have as good durability as an expensive light, so a lot of the time it just depends on _which_ budget light you're looking at.



Interesting reply when you say you have seen a lot of budget lights that you consider to have as good durability as an expensive light.Are you saying this from owning both side by side and looking inside to the build quality or making an assumption based on how they feel and look in real life.

I envy you if you are lucky enough to own and run budget and quality lights side by side to really get the nitty gritty workings of both.


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## shipwreck (Aug 3, 2010)

I am somewhat of a newbie... I caught the bug a few months ago - and I am up to 17 lights now, with #18 on the way. I have done a LOT of reading, and Iam no longer a total newbie.

I did some asking on here prev, and it seems that some of the cheap lights, and even the "high end cheap DX type lights" are likely a better deal for someone who knows how to make their own flashlights, or at least do their own mods. Quality seems to vary greatly from model to model.

I do have two DX lights - the C30 spot to flood. I gave the first a try for $9.52 and I really like it. I decided to order a 2nd one - it's not nearly as good. and had I gotten the 2nd one first, I would not have ordered another.

I own several of the higher end lights - and I do think they are worth the $.


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## humblefan (Aug 3, 2010)

shipwreck said:


> Quality seems to vary greatly from model to model..



I think this is a great point so let me ask it this way: What are the best models in the $15 to $25 range, $40 to $55 range and 1"ish rifle mountable options (with compatible pressure caps). My priorities for each price point are in order are throw, reliability, true lumens, size/weight, modes, bells and whistles.


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## KurtS (Aug 4, 2010)

One issue I've seen with the cheaper (aka DX) models is the product changes but the model # and description doesn't.
Whereas the 'better' manufacturers would give it a new model # or at least description.


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## Zatoichi (Aug 4, 2010)

randomlugia said:


> Shiningbeam sells many Romisen lights with more than one mode.



They do, because shingingbeam customise them. The customised 2 mode Romisen lights have 2 very similar levels though which makes it almost pointless. I believe they are rectifying this, if they haven't done so already.

I have Olight, Fenix and a few Romisens and Ultrafire lights, and I'd say Olight and Fenix are much better made. I've been lucky I think, in that I've never had problems with Romisen or Ultrafire lights, but the difference in quality is hard to miss close up.

The DX lights I'm most happy with have been the Skyray (R5), Ultrafire C3 in stainless steel (although it no longer has the Q5 emitter as advertised, and the build quality has dropped slighty), and the Trustfire F23. I don't go up to $40 - $55 lights with DX. The Romisen RC-N3 and RC-G2 are decent for the money, but I'd only buy them from shiningbeam now. For the extra bit of cash it's worth it for the upgraded LED's and better service IMO.


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## shipwreck (Aug 4, 2010)

humblefan said:


> I think this is a great point so let me ask it this way: What are the best models in the $15 to $25 range, $40 to $55 range and 1"ish rifle mountable options (with compatible pressure caps). My priorities for each price point are in order are throw, reliability, true lumens, size/weight, modes, bells and whistles.



That will ALWAYS be an opinion there - and you will get various opinions.

I have several flashlights of various pricepoints. Even an 800 lumen Eagletac.

My fav light of all the lights I have is the Eagletac P20C2 Mk II. It is a $64 light.

For $25 - I say but a Solarforce Light from their vendor in Honk Kong. They have higher priced lights and light combos. But for $24.99 SHIPPED from Hong Kong, the L2 is a great light. I just ordered my 3rd Solar Force Light a few days ago.


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## joe1512 (Aug 4, 2010)

I think you are missing a tier.

There are lights from DealExtreme, and these tend to be very cheaply made with poor quality control. Getting it replaced under warranty is time-consuming due to the shipping factor.
These are your ultrafire, aurora lights. They can be fine lights but you do take somewhat of a risk with them. Since they arent THAT much cheaper than the next tier, I don't really deal with them.

The next tier is budget quality. These are Romisen and itp and MG. itp is the budget brand of olight and makes very nice lights. The A series of keychain lights are well received and the itp A6 Polestar is one of the best lumens to dollars ratio lights around. 
Romisen lights are decent though they usually are lacking many modes which can be good or bad depending.
MG from shiningbeam makes solid lights too.
I consider this the ideal price point.

Then you step up to Fenix and 4Sevens which are similar to the itp/Romisen but with more options and more heavy duty build construction.
I am unsure that they are worth double the money over the budget quality though.

Then there is Surefire and other brands which are over a hundred dollars for a 200 lumen lightl. Many swear by them, but I cant see them being THAT much better than an itp/Romisen at 8x the price or more.

Finally you get into McGizmo and other custom-made lights. At 600 dollars and up they are not cheap. They are the best you can get though and owning one is more of a matter of buying a Rolex over a Timex; the function works better but that is not why you get one. Its mostly for bragging rights and to 'have the best' of something. I personally do not agree with this, but I admit that owning the best flashlight in the world is a lot cheaper than the best watch or car in the world.


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## humblefan (Aug 4, 2010)

Joe the ITPs look awesome and the reviews back them up. I'm going to get an A6 but are there some cheaper models of itp or MG you recommend that are in the 25 to 35 buck range besides keychain lights? What do you think of the Romisen RC-2R4 II R5 LED? Isn't the XP-G R5 the latest and greatest?


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## Zatoichi (Aug 4, 2010)

humblefan said:


> What do you think of the Romisen RC-2R4 II R5 LED? Isn't the XP-G R5 the latest and greatest?



Personally I like the R5's. Some complain about the greenish tint that seems common with them (doesn't bother me, I much prefer it to a blue or purple tint), and they are quite floody. If you prefer throw over flood the R5's might not be your best choice. So whether they're the greatest depends to some extent on what kind of beam you prefer.


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## fishx65 (Aug 4, 2010)

The best way to find quality budget lights is by spending lots of time reading the threads on this website. Also, keep an eye 0n the Good-Deals section. Some budget lights can be of very high quality such as the 13 dollar Solarforce L2 host. I still can't get over how nice my $27.00 Solarforce Skyline 1 is!!!!


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## Zatoichi (Aug 4, 2010)

fishx65 said:


> The best way to find quality budget lights is by spending lots of time reading the threads on this website. Also, keep an eye 0n the Good-Deals section. Some budget lights can be of very high quality such as the 13 dollar Solarforce L2 host. I still can't get over how nice my $27.00 Solarforce Skyline 1 is!!!!



:thumbsup: to Solarforce. Sadly I think the Skyline sale is over, but the L2 is still a top budget option.


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## carrot (Aug 4, 2010)

joe1512 said:


> I think you are missing a tier.
> 
> There are lights from DealExtreme, and these tend to be very cheaply made with poor quality control. Getting it replaced under warranty is time-consuming due to the shipping factor.
> These are your ultrafire, aurora lights. They can be fine lights but you do take somewhat of a risk with them. Since they arent THAT much cheaper than the next tier, I don't really deal with them.
> ...



I think you are pretty insightful but on the other hand you lack experience with the more expensive tiers, which colors your opinion here. 

There certainly is a marked difference between Surefire and Fenix, 4sevens. It's not always easy to put to words but it's the same jump between Ultrafire and the like to Fenix, 4sevens. You just get better quality: reflectors and lenses and electronics that have been agonized over by engineers to provide the best possible illumination tools. On the lower tiers, there is more concern over churning out the next light rather than perfecting each light. 

47s and Fenix clearly do not spend as much on R&D as Surefire and the like but they do a good deal of their own engineering and it shows. Fenix has particularly good efficiency in their drivers and 47s pursues engineering perfection, such as programmability, current regulation and Li-ion support. 

McGizmo and customs have a very special allure for flashaholics, but nobody buys them for bragging rights. You're nuts if you think owning a $600 flashlight will make you cool. Customs tap into the culture that started CPF: What's on the market doesn't match a person's vision, so he sets out to make it happen. Many of the popular custom makers make these lights for themselves and decide to share them with the rest of us. 

Everyone's after the "perfect EDC." Custom makers just happen to be the ones with fortunate enough circumstances to be able to MAKE their perfect EDC. Bet you'll never see a maker EDC someone else's design. These lights are by flashaholics for flashaholics. No other tier can offer that, except perhaps HDS who seems to enjoy defying categorization.

Since these lights are made without regard to a large target audience they can be extremely specialized and offer features that you couldn't sell to the general public. Everything's a compromise, of course. Perhaps you can achieve something great but if you had to sell it for $3000 would it sell much? Here it would, but nowhere else, and so custom makers are afforded freedoms to explore ideas that would be cost-prohibitive for manufacturers who sell lights by the thousands. They can be made without trying to hit the precious sub-$50, sub-$100, sub-$200 price points.


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## humblefan (Aug 4, 2010)

Zatoichi said:


> Personally I like the R5's. Some complain about the greenish tint that seems common with them (doesn't bother me, I much prefer it to a blue or purple tint), and they are quite floody. If you prefer throw over flood the R5's might not be your best choice. So whether they're the greatest depends to some extent on what kind of beam you prefer.



Well the Romisen R5 is all of $25 bucks. If I wanted to go more throw less flood in the same quality but price limit whats a good option. For example I'd like the R5 for the nightstand for checking a noise in the backyard but I'd also like another option with long throw for seeing deep in the tree cover when camping.

As far as color and modes and rolling settings thats all nice down the road but right now I'm new and don't know what exactly I need so I'd rather have a few durable specific use budget lights to see where I want to go from here. I just would like input from you guys so I don't buy something already obsolete, a poor designed model, or something when theres a better option even within the same brand or price point.


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## Zatoichi (Aug 4, 2010)

I think for a decent amount of throw, decent quality and in that price range, a Solarforce L2 with an R2 would be a decent choice. There are throwers on DX that will throw further for the same money, but not the same quality. There's a 2 x AA version of the L2 if you prefer AA batteries, or a version that will take CR123 and 18650.


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## randomlugia (Aug 4, 2010)

And if you decide on an R5 for flood, you can buy a Thrunite R5 drop-in later. Really good quality, and $35 with your choice of multi-mode, and 1.4 or 1.0 amps.


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## humblefan (Aug 4, 2010)

Zatoichi said:


> There's a 2 x AA version of the L2 if you prefer AA batteries, or a version that will take CR123 and 18650.



Are standard (ie non-lithium) rechangeable CR123s any advantage over AAs? btw Zat I sent you a message about a deal I found on a Solarforce L2 R2, want to make sure its the right one.


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## carrot (Aug 4, 2010)

humblefan said:


> Are standard (ie non-lithium) rechangeable CR123s any advantage over AAs?



All CR123s are lithium. Rechargeable "RCR123s" are lithium-ion.

Lithium is more energy dense than alkaline and NiMH, so can be lighter and smaller while providing more energy.

Lithium performs better in cold weather.

Lithium can be stored for much longer (average shelf life is rated 10 years).


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## Zatoichi (Aug 5, 2010)

humblefan said:


> Are standard (ie non-lithium) rechangeable CR123s any advantage over AAs? btw Zat I sent you a message about a deal I found on a Solarforce L2 R2, want to make sure its the right one.



What Carrot said about the CR123's. ^

I didn't get your message I'm afraid. :shrug: Give it another go.


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## joe1512 (Aug 5, 2010)

However, the advantages of lithiums are usually not THAT pronounced in larger lights.

For a quick example lets look at 2 lights.

The itp A6 Polestar with its 6xAAs. With 2000+mah batteries at 1.2 volts that is a total of 2x1.2x6 = 14.4 Watt hours. Thats 19.2 for an 8xAA light like the TK40.

A fenix TK30 or the like with 2x18650s has 2400x3.7average voltage x2 = 17.7 Watt hours.

The 18650 version will be longer and skinnier vs the shorter but fatter Polestar. 18650 shaves off some weight vs 6xAAs but not all that much since NiMH are lighter than alkaline.

The AAs are nice because you can use the AA charger and batteries (also AAA) for other electronics round the house, whereas an 18650 charger is pretty worthless outside of flashlight world.


The big difference where CR123s and 18650s shine is with smaller lights. A small CR123 is about the size of an AA, shorter and fatter, but it has 4.2 volts peak, vs the 1.2 volts of a AA rechargable.

This means that a 1xRCR123 light is a LOT brighter than the same emitter and driver with a single AA. An AA cannot push the same levels of current at the same voltage as the CR123/RCR123. Using a stepup transformer is doable but would mean even MORE current pulled from the battery which it cannot handle. This is why the itp A1 is much brighter than the A3 even with a 3.0 volt CR123. Adding a 4.2 volt RCR123 like I use makes it even brighter.

Ditto in that a 1x18650 light can still drive an emitter at a good 2 Amps or more, whereas there is no real AA equivalent at that size. A 2xAA is longer than a single 18650 light and still can't pull enough amperage. 3xAA is too short and fat to be useful. 4xAA is rare.


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## ryaxnb (Aug 13, 2010)

humblefan said:


> Joe the ITPs look awesome and the reviews back them up. I'm going to get an A6 but are there some cheaper models of itp or MG you recommend that are in the 25 to 35 buck range besides keychain lights? What do you think of the Romisen RC-2R4 II R5 LED? Isn't the XP-G R5 the latest and greatest?



If you want a non-keychain light in the $25 price range, probably your best bet is a solarforce or a romisen. The Romisen RC-N3 is a great light, as is the Romisen RC-G2 and that new Romisen with R5, all from shiningbeam (the DX ones are inferior by far).
Do remember the 1x123 and 1xaa keychain lights are still very bright, on high they are brighter than a 4d flashlight (incan) so consider carefully, a keychain light may be ideal. Short runtime, but extra batteries are small, and in the case of AA, cheap. 
The SolarForce L2 is a great light, but a wee more expensive. from some places you can get one about $35 with an R2. Be sure you get one with the dropin you want, or one without a dropin and a dropin seperately. (they take standard Surefire P60 sized dropins.) Also be sure to get both a light and module designed for 2x123A if you want primaries and 1x18650 if you want Li-Ion, generally they (especially the dropins, which have voltage limitations) are not interchangable, you pick whether to run the thing on primary or rechargable batteries. Also, id advise against DX batteries, particuarly Li-Ions, get yours from a trusted source like AW or 4sevens, where you will be less likely to find a exploding battery, to the point of almost certainity the batteries are safe.


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