# what will do the job ?



## nightbeam (Jul 16, 2007)

Hello all


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## lasercrazy (Jul 16, 2007)

The Zeray is about 2,000 lumens brighter and has a much longer runtime (almost 3 times the runtime if my memory is correct). The zeray can throw as far as the thor but it's main advantage is the higher color temp and color rendering. The Barnburner is no longer available.


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## Sinjz (Jul 16, 2007)

If throw is what you want, I think the Polarian (sp?) is an attempt at copy the Maxabeam, for a few hundred bucks. Never seen one and know almost nothing about it, but just thought I throw that out there.


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## Ra (Jul 17, 2007)

Hi nightbeam,

Indeed the HID's are more powerfull, but one thing needs to be mentioned:

In this case you need instand on capebillity!! The HID's need time to start up, some do this quite fast, but still need some 10 seconds!

Maxabeam does not even have the lumens-output of the 100watt halogens, but with its high surface-brightness and instant-on, its definitely a "shock and awe"- device. But this doesn't help you because of its prizetag!

The best I can think of: The standard 100-watt bulbs in spotlights mostly have lower surface-brightness compared with the top-projection bulbs of for example Osram.. 

The Osram HLX 64625 (12volts 100watts 3600lumens 50hrs bulblife) has about the highest lumens-output and surface-brightness possible (in the 100watt halogen world). And with a little overdrive, it will be a monster! (with only about 5 hours of bulblife left tho..)

So if you have the skills, mod your light with the 64625.

EDIT: 3000 uk pounds for a Maxabeam!!!!!??? Basic pakkage is about $1850 to my knowledge !!


Regards,

Ra.


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## nightbeam (Jul 17, 2007)

hey thanks for the info.

:twothumbs


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## lasercrazy (Jul 17, 2007)

If you replace the stock bulb with a higher wattage one make sure to put heavy gauge wire and a better battery in it.


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## Ken J. Good (Jul 18, 2007)

Consider any of these:

http://www.polarion-store.com/cat_polarion.cfm

I have one PXM-35P1 left in stock, which was Polarion's first offering. Great light for the price.

They do not take 10 seconds to warm up, they are instant strike with immediate, extreme light output.


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## XeRay (Jul 18, 2007)

nightbeam said:


> Hello all
> I got attacked by a poacher a few years ago, using a powerful lamp he was.
> Since then I have the thor 100w halogen with me, its powerful and I can scan about for idiot poachers, but I want something a little more powerful.
> So can anyone tell me how the _XeRay 50 watt hid compares to the thor 100 watt._


 
The XeRay 50 watt produces about 3,000 lumens instant on and ramps up from there to over 5,000 lumens in about 15 seconds or so. CPF members get a $100 discount off standard price.


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## nightbeam (Jul 18, 2007)

:thumbsup: thanks for all the info.
Hey i would love to have all the super lights haha.


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## lotsalumens (Jul 20, 2007)

You asked what would "do the job", and my guess is that any of the sams club and Harbor Freight style HIDs would probably fit the bill. They are all over ebay for $60-$80 and would be much brighter & further throwing than your Thor. In terms of pure throw, some of these cheaper models may also outperform the much more expensive HIDs simply because they have larger reflectors. You should consider trying one before spending a lot on a high end light since it might be all you need.


Charles


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## nightbeam (Jul 20, 2007)

Oooh now ya talking :twothumbs

Its the sort of thing on this link ? 
http://www.hidfoglight.com/productsAndServices/hidSpotlight.html

35 watt sounds a little weak though :thinking: , but from what I have maniged to see from a few pics on here they do seem to out throw the 10000000cp thor. 

My qestion now is are there any of these lowcost huge hid lamps above 35 watt ?


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## lotsalumens (Jul 21, 2007)

Yes that's the kind of thing, though that one seems a little overpriced. I have a switchable 35w/50w light I built before these things were readily available commercially, and while I haven't tried a 75w light, I can say the difference between 35w and 50w is incremental and not that big. You only notice it as a slight difference. 75w should be another incremental step, but even a 35w light will blow away your thor.

Charles

p.s. I don't know any low cost HIDs that run at more than 35w.


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## nightbeam (Jul 22, 2007)

*Re- can I boost the power of a 35watt hid to 50watt*

If I get a costo hid or whatever they are now called, can I boost its throw with one of these boost thingys

http://www.xenonvalot.com/boost.html

Any thoughts ?

Nightbeam


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## lotsalumens (Jul 22, 2007)

I suppose you could, but honestly it's not worth the effort and expense to boost a 35w light to 50w. You are talking several hundred dollars for a 15 watt increase, and you may not even notice much of a visual difference when you are done.

Charles


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## XeRay (Jul 22, 2007)

lotsalumens said:


> I suppose you could, but honestly it's not worth the effort and expense to boost a 35w light to 50w. You are talking several hundred dollars for a 15 watt increase, and you may not even notice much of a visual difference when you are done.Charles


 
Thats a very generalized statement. 35 watts (bulb input) HID provides typically 91 lumens per watt for a 3200 lumen output. A TRUE 50 watt to the bulb system produces about 106 lumens per watt providing about 5300 lumens. Thats about a 65% increase in output over a 35 watt system.
Yes, 50 watt HID is more efficient than 35 watt about 16% more. 75 watt systems produce about 110 lumens per watt yielding WELL OVER 8,000 lumens.

If you are talking the Auerswald 35/50, maybe the output is somewhat less than 50 watts to the bulb in the boosted mode.


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## lotsalumens (Jul 23, 2007)

Nighbeam asked about putting a 50w ballast in a 35w light, which I have done, and the difference is incremental. I am not commenting on a true 50w bulb and ballast system, however the 65% increase you mentioned is also incremental. Remember that visual perception of "brightness" is essentially logarithmic and even a doubling of output will not produce as much of a perceived difference as one might think. Whether it is worth the $829 ($600 euros) they are charging for the ballast on the site he referenced is up to him, but it would certainly make sense to try out a $70 35w hid and see if it meets his needs. I contend that the big difference here is going to be the switch form the incandescent thor to the HID with its higher efficiency and superior throw.

Speaking of throw, which was one of the criteria, reflector size is the thing to look for. The link below is relevant to this discussion. Note how a cheap costco HID compares to other HIDs:

http://home.earthlink.net/~kenshiro2/hid2/35comp.html

Charles

p.s. This isn't a discussion about the value of the XeRay. From what I have read on these forums I gather the XeRay is a great light and has features and build quality that make them more worth a higher price. The $70 hid gives you a plastic body, cheaper components, etc.


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## XeRay (Jul 23, 2007)

lotsalumens said:


> Whether it is worth the $829 ($600 euros) they are charging for the ballast on the site he referenced is up to him,


 
If that is the price, it is a total waste of money for what is being provided. "Highway robbery"


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## frogs3 (Jul 26, 2007)

What is the value of the items/livestock being poached?

Add this into the equation and a true quality HID starts to make economic sense.

My bias: I have a XeRay 75 W and IMHO it is about the best balanced, well-made high output light I could buy. The 50 W gets great reviews on CPF, and the difference in output is probably noticeable only "side-by-side".

If you don't want to be buying another and yet another light, save money and just get the reliable best one now.

Dan's not pimping me to say this. I just feel that I invested my cash well in his product.

-HAK


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## catman (Aug 16, 2007)

Get a lightforce 240 blitz has a 9 inch reflector,milwaukee v28 lithium-ion battery pack and charger,64655hlx bulb(24 volt 250 watt 10000lumen) from bulb connection $2.70. Clean bulb with pure alcohol before lighting. Should be about 15min. runtime. Have not used mine hot off charger yet,may work hot. Mine works fine with rested battery. Connect the two outside spade connectors on battery to the light.leave center connector alone,it is used in charging process. Or get a dc-dc converter and run from car. A 35watt sams club HID light is about 3200 lumens. My light is 10000 stock and is overdriven some. This battery pack has 7 emoli batterys in it. If you get 3 more batterys and wire in series with the pack you can use this bulb;64663(36v 400watt 16000 lumens). You would need another charger to do the loose emoli's. They charge same as li-po batterys. My 64663 bulbs should be here today and I will try the 36v setup. Will be starting with about 42v. 25% over on 36v is 45v so 42 should work fine. Should also be about 15 min. runtime. The v28 battery pack weighs 1 1/2 to 2 pounds,the blitz light is almost weightless. A large hid light weighs 8 lb. If anyone builds one of these they will NOT be disapointed. Queenslander did the same with lead acid batterys, much heaver.


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## data_lore (Aug 16, 2007)

You got attacked by a poacher with one of these?!!! Heavens above, where do you live? I'm in Herefordshire, and they're known to carry knives (at times) but not flaslights like this!

Anyways, I just bought a Wolf Eyes Boxer 24W in case things get a little dodgy on our fishery. Bright enough to do the job I would have thought. Else, get a SGC, there's no deterrent like a shotgun over your shoulder. Hope you don't encounter any more ppl like these.

Rich.



nightbeam said:


> Hello all
> I got attacked by a poacher a few years ago, using a powerful lamp he was.
> Since then I have the thor 100w halogen with me, its powerful and I can scan about for idiot poachers, but I want something a little more powerful.
> So can anyone tell me how the _XeRay 50 watt hid compares to the thor 100 watt.
> ...


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## scott.cr (Aug 16, 2007)

Ra said:


> In this case you need instand on capebillity!! The HID's need time to start up, some do this quite fast, but still need some 10 seconds!
> 
> The Osram HLX 64625 [....] has about the highest lumens-output and surface-brightness possible
> 
> ...



Yes!!

I love the output of HIDs, but when things go bump in the night, that's when I grab my Surefire M6 w/ MN21 lamp assembly. For your purposes I think you should stick with a high-output incandescent, and the HLX lamps are an excellent choice. Their efficiency is up there with LEDs, but the lamp life is 30-50 hours usually. But at $2.50 apiece, who really cares?

I have a mini lathe at home and have successfully made adapters to run the bi-pin HLX lamps in the Thor housing (which uses an H4 headlamp). You lose the high/low beam feature though, but who really uses low beam anyway? ;-)


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## catman (Aug 18, 2007)

You need lots of light. So get a Lightforce 240 blitz(9 1/2 inch reflector),milwaukee v28 battery pack & charger,64655hlx bulb(24 volt 250 watt 10000lumens) Connect the battery pack's two outside terminals to the light. The center terminal is just used in charging. Most of the HID lights are 3200 to maybe 5000 lumens. This is 10000 lumens plus about a 28% overdrive at the bulb. I have been charging my battery in the morning so I do not know how it is hot off charger. Bulbs are $2.70 at www.bulbconnection.com in U.S. Light at www.lightforce.com made in Australia. I also am using more emoli batteries in series to run a 36 volt 400watt 16600 lumen bulb (64663). I have another charger for the loose cells. Lights most objects dark and light colored well at 1/4 mile!


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## 65535 (Aug 18, 2007)

Sounds like you need a tank light. 

I would say the Polarion Helios would get the job done, 50 watts HID and instant strike.


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## BVH (Aug 18, 2007)

Close, but the Helios is only 40 Watts but definitely INSTANT strike to at least 3000 Lumens then only a few seconds more to full brightness.

I could be convinced to part with mine.


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## nightbeam (Sep 23, 2007)

Thanks for all the info guys :thumbsup:.


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## data_lore (Sep 23, 2007)

nightbeam said:


> Thanks for all the info guys :thumbsup:.
> 
> Im going to get one of the costco hid lights.
> 
> ...



wow, that's cheap, :welcome:, please let me know the outlet ???:naughty:


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## nightbeam (Sep 24, 2007)

http://www.shop4torches.co.uk/acatalog/Surefire_The_Beast_II_2_HID_LED_Torch.php


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## DM51 (Sep 24, 2007)

nightbeam said:


> http://www.shop4torches.co.uk/acatalog/Surefire_The_Beast_II_2_HID_LED_Torch.php


You're going to buy *The Beast II???* Maybe a bit OTT for use vs poachers?

As someone above suggested, the problem with a lot of (in fact most) HIDs is that they are not "instant on". Some take nearly 30 secs to warm up. On the othetr hand the super-hotwire alternatives, such as a Mag623, would only give you a very short run-time.

If you want a serious light, the Polarion PH-40 is less than half the price of the Beast. It is a 40W HID, ~4,000 lumens, 75 mins runtime, *AND* instant on. $2,195 at the Polarion Store if you are in the USA, or €1,600 at knivesandtools.com if you are in the EU.


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## nightbeam (Sep 24, 2007)

:thinking:.


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## 65535 (Sep 26, 2007)

I may be wrong but I think a laser has the highest surface brightness. Maybe you could convince Ra to rig you up a smaller version of his maxiblaster.


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## nightbeam (Sep 29, 2007)

Just thougt....when I get my hid from usa shiped here to england Im going to want to use it. BUT our electic is 240v and that in the usa is 120v or something ? erm how im i going to charge up the batterys ?

ANYONE KNOW


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## Ra (Sep 29, 2007)

nightbeam said:


> http://www.shop4torches.co.uk/acatalog/Surefire_The_Beast_II_2_HID_LED_Torch.php



Twenty 123A cells ????

I thought Shurefire made practical lights.. Guess not!!


Regards.

Ra.


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## j3bnl (Sep 29, 2007)

Ra said:


> Twenty 123A cells ????
> 
> I thought Shurefire made practical lights.. Guess not!!
> 
> ...


 
That will be a cheap light to run wont it, *NOT!!!!*


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## j3bnl (Sep 29, 2007)

nightbeam said:


> Just thougt....when I get my hid from usa shiped here to england Im going to want to use it. BUT our electic is 240v and that in the usa is 120v or something ? erm how im i going to charge up the batterys ?
> 
> ANYONE KNOW


 
It will depend if the power pack/charger is a universal one ie will work on 110v - 240v.

If it is universal you will only need a US to UK plug adapter.

http://www.beststuff.co.uk/electrical_plug_adapters.htm


If not you will need a stepdown voltage coverter :- 

http://www.beststuff.co.uk/voltage_conversion.htm

Hope this helps.
I have used this company (not the cheapest), but found them very good to deal with.


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## nightbeam (Oct 2, 2007)

Ok, so I go on the harbor freight website ready to buy my hid, but when I attempt to put in my uk address I cant as it will not take it :mecry:.

Erm so how do I buy my hid from them.


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