# starting a new project, bezels and tails



## DrafterDan (Nov 19, 2015)

Some of you remember my first foray into making a 6P torch (five of them actually). I did create the bodies, but didn't have the time or $ to delve into internal threading. It always felt like I should make the entire torch, not just the body.

This is the torch in question.






It didn't turn out exactly like I wanted, but considering my skill level at the time, it worked great. So I've got some new tooling and have ACAD'ed the bezel dimensions as a point to start. Got some ideas for design, but nothing finalized.

I did some testing a few days ago, made a threaded post for machining the other end of the bezel after I part off from the stock. Wasn't too exciting photo-wise, but my threading is getting much better. Hopefully I'll get some shavings going this weekend.

~D


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## Str8stroke (Nov 19, 2015)

Looks like a great start. The blue trits are a nice touch with that color light. Keep going, you will get it! Wish I had the skills to do it.


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## DrafterDan (Nov 23, 2015)

Got some shavings cut this last weekend. My first efforts with internal threading, and it was quite the challenge. I had a hard time figuring what clearances between max and min dimensions. I haven't done any reading on thread classifications (2B and whatnot), and after this, it appears some (ahem, much) research is needed. 

I also need some refinement in returning to zero after making a threading pass. Several times I must have not got it set, because either the cut was only a couple thou deep or, a bit too much, which ends in chatter. Unfortunately, my lathe is already set to the lowest speed, and it feels like it is still too fast. 

Overall, the internal dimensions turned out nicely, if a bit loose. I'll probably end up using this as a testing sample for when I clamp it into the mill to cut some type of design on the exterior. I've got plenty of meat to work with here. 

Note that the photo below was a sample, the final result below has a shelf for the lens/ o-rings to sit on.






It was tricky to run the bit in the lens side and get it stopped after only about .350 cut depth. I've got a hard stop setup, but when you misjudge the time to unhook the half nut, the lathe doesn't want to disengage easily. I saw a vid where a fellow used a mag-base dial indicator. That would show me when to stop, but not punish you if you don't unhook in time.
After doing it this way, I may want to just buy a set of dies for these two thread types and do it manually. This insert isn't really good for a flat-bottomed cut.






Overall, I gained some experience and familiarity with the lathe. That is a good thing.
~D


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## gadget_lover (Nov 23, 2015)

There are three ways to easily deal with stopping when threading inside.

1) Create an "overrun" zone at the end of the thread. This is simply an area where you make a groove that is two or 3 threads wide and as deep as the thread is. This will keep the insert from crashing into the uncut area at the end of the thread.

2) Run the lathe in reverse, and cut the threads on the far side of the bore or turn the tool upside down. This will start the thread at the deepest point and will move the carriage to the right as it cuts.

3) Turn the chuck by hand. Some folks even put a handwheel or crank handle on the end of the spindle to make it easier to spin the chuck. You have to be careful to never turn it on when the hand crank is connected. 

I use technique #1. It's worked well so far. 

Daniel


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## DrafterDan (Nov 27, 2015)

I probably didn't give quite the clearance I needed on T #1.
I do like the idea of inverting the tool and manually cutting towards the outside.


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## precisionworks (Nov 28, 2015)

DrafterDan said:


> ... I also need some refinement in returning to zero after making a threading pass.



A couple of suggestions ...


If you have a DRO be sure to zero it out so you can return the cross slide to zero after backing away at the end of the cut.
Without a DRO use a mag base indicator that can be zeroed out the same as the DRO.
Advance the tool with the compound set between 25° and 29.5° and use the depth progression shown in Machinery's Handbook or online.

Many lathes have a cross slide screw & nut that fit not so precisely. When returning to zero be sure to go only clockwise (external threading) or CCW (internal threading). If you overshoot be sure to start the zero process over again as this preloads the screw/nut in the correct direction.


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## DrafterDan (Dec 14, 2015)

So I finished the bezel over last weekend. 

Still needs some final polishing, but overall pretty happy with how it turned out. 






I didn't have a huge plan in place for the actual external design, I kinda winged it. The project allowed me to use an indexing horizontal turntable on the mill, so that was interesting. Was so involved in getting the dimensioning right that I forgot to take any photos of the process. My biggest challenge was perfectly centering the part on the turntable. Basically holding the bezel down with a big coarse thread bolt doesn't lend well to micro adjustments. I was a few thou off, but not too bad. It's more noticeable in the flats on the base of the bezel, where a couple thou drastically affects the overall length of the cut. I suppose I can hit them with a file to even them out, but who knows if that will actually happen.

I think I'm just going to buy a flat-bottomed tap to thread the upcoming tailcap project. I believe that will give me a better result for a small ID.


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## DrafterDan (Dec 22, 2015)

So all this time, fighting with internal threading, I just found out how to halve the spindle speed. My fathers' lathe has a reducing gear that is enabled by unscrewing a thumb-nut. When I was making the bezel, Pops was out of town. I mentioned to him about the slow speed and he showed me that trick. It's always good getting a few tips-n-tricks from the more experienced. My father is 79, and self-taught on his lathe. It's fairly old, and not too accurate, but I've managed to coax out the tolerances I need for flashlights. Maybe I'll make an afternoon of taking apart the tool holder apparatus and seeing if I can tighten it up more. I do remember pulling apart the carriage feed, and the half-nut has definitely seen better days.


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## ven (Dec 22, 2015)

Love it dan


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## Strintguy (Dec 22, 2015)

Great looking, unique bezel


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## DrafterDan (Jan 2, 2016)

made some progress a couple days ago. Only had a short time, so most of it was spent on making a threaded jig so I can work on both ends of such a short piece (1.27").

ID is done, at least on this end. Ready for tapping.







Using a dial gauge worked much better than using the screw table to zero out the threading.







The beast. No DRO here, that's for sure.
Using that half-speed spindle trick worked great, best threading I've produced so far. The power was also cut in half, so I had to manually spin the head in a few places. I'm sure I'm missing something.


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## jdboy (Jan 9, 2016)

Great job so far! I've been talking to my wife for the past little bit about buying a lathe. With no machinist knowledge I've been a little hesitant on the purchase though.


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## DrafterDan (Jan 11, 2016)

Both my father and I had no experience before he purchased his lathe, although we knew the person that owned it. I'm sure he got some quick lessons.

I'm seriously considering finding somebody that would be willing to spend a couple hours showing me 'best practices'. I think that would save me a lot of time and grief in figuring out things the hard way. I feel I'm turning out a decent product given my current abilities, but they can always be improved.


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## supawabb (Jan 24, 2016)

DrafterDan, PM sent


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## DrafterDan (Feb 1, 2016)

Some progress yesterday. Internals of the tailcap is complete. 






This shot was taken before I tackled the outside details. It's only the max OD at this point.
I did probably 85% of the externals last evening, but stopped before using the end mill. My first attempt on a threaded hold-down for the tailcap didn't work out. Will have to rethink the design. Basically a 3/4-10 threaded section with a shoulder to fit against the turntable.


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## bartko09 (Feb 1, 2016)

Great thread. I'm enjoying following it.


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## DrafterDan (Feb 3, 2016)

Checking fit. The max OD's have been cut on the tailcap, and I'm still deciding on what final design to apply with the end mill. I may keep it round with cutouts, or may put in flats like the head.






I will probably cut down the very end slightly, to reach the button easier. It just has to barely clear to be able to tailstand. Gotta figure out how to put in a few tritium vials, since I've kinda got used to having them on this light.


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## ven (Feb 3, 2016)

I dont like it...........i love it, fantastic work, such a good looking host


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## MRsDNF (Feb 5, 2016)

This is one trick looking light DrafterDan. I'm looking forward to see what you come up with on the finishing touches.


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## DrafterDan (Feb 7, 2016)

One step closer. I had limited time in the shop today, but did solve the problem of how to hold down the tailcap on the turntable.






Turned down a bit of Delrin to contact the tailcap, and it's all held down by a 1/4-20. Now that it's done, it will probably take me a half hour to exactly center it on the table. Has to be exact, or the flats will come out different widths.

The plan is to finish it up tomorrow.
~D


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## DrafterDan (Feb 15, 2016)

Ah yes, tomorrow. That day that never comes. Or at least not as you'd planned it would. I did finish up the tailcap on Saturday. Have to build the light engine for it this week. Here's the one shot I took. Funny that I usually get too involved in the process to remember to take photos...







While it worked, it didn't turn out as clean as I would have hoped. Need to remake this in steel so I can tighten the bolt holding the tailcap more. Otherwise it slips, and causes far more headaches and design recalculations.


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## Modder (Feb 21, 2016)

looks nice ! did you have a chance to make some vids also ? would be nice to see that all in motion (or slo-motion, if you have an iPhone  )


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## DrafterDan (Feb 22, 2016)

Android to the bone here. I believe they do have an app for slow-mo videos, but I've not looked into it. My wife did buy me one of those small action cams, so maybe I can rig up a gooseneck mount for the lathe!

I was waiting to post anything more until I finished with the light engine. My first ever reflow of LEDs onto a MPCB. As this quad is a pretty custom board, I had little choice but to attempt it. I will just say that I'm glad I purchased an extra XPL-Hi.

On with the show!







I put one of DellSuperman's 10a Judco switches in this, such a nice firm click sound!






The business end. 







One of Silva's excellent brass mule bodies. DSCHE made the mpcb, and XPL-Hi emitters from Mountain Electronics. I took the easy way out and did a jumper thing between the two sides of the board on the +






Running Mountain Elec's FET driver, which has a really fun moonlight mode. Just a four speed, which is great for me, including a 30-second turbo. The high is almost stupid-level bright  It's definitely taxing my IMR 18650.
Of course, with such a low low mode, I can see the scratch I somehow got on the inside of the lens...






It does make a nice overlapping rings kind of design at the edge of the beam. I'll try to do a beam shot at some point.

My first complete body. I can readily say that I learned quite a bit of what not to do for the next project!


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## bartko09 (Feb 22, 2016)

DrafterDan said:


> Running Mountain Elec's FET driver, which has a really fun moonlight mode. Just a four speed, which is great for me, including a 30-second turbo. The high is almost stupid-level bright  It's definitely taxing my IMR 18650.
> Of course, with such a low low mode, I can see the scratch I somehow got on the inside of the lens...



Great work dan! I just flowed some XPE2's myself. 





Did you somehow regulate the FETs output? I was using one of Richards 17DDm's. On high I was pulling 18.5A at the tail cap and it was physically de soldering the leads in under 10 seconds using an AW IMR 18650 [emoji33]


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## jdboy (Feb 22, 2016)

Very nice build, that thing is going to put out a WALL of light!


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## Modder (Feb 22, 2016)

any good info here on reflow for these small led projects ?


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## neutralwhite (Feb 22, 2016)

Can I PayPal you now ?!. Lol.


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## DrafterDan (Feb 23, 2016)

I'd love to take your money, but then You'd expect me to do something in exchange 

As for reflowing, I can relay the method I used. I put the MPCB in a clamp holder and used my iron on the underside of the board.






I used silver-based solder paste for the LEDs themselves, and regular solder for the wire contact points. The amount to use of the paste is less than a grain of rice. Too much and it will clump on the center thermal contact spot and keep the edges of the LED from touching the anode/ cathode sides. Ask me how I know this...

Use as little heat as possible, otherwise it will discolor the mpcb. Just set the LED onto the solder-pasted contact point and heat it up. When it reaches the right temperature, it will settle itself without any touching/ aligning from you at all. That's why so little paste is used. In my example, the anode (the positive side) of the LEDs were facing away from center. The anode side has the little wires at the edges you can just see on the photo above. 

I did one at a time, letting it cool down to be able to touch the board with my bare fingers between. This keeps the overall heat down, reducing damage/ discoloration. I found it helpful (per the video that Old Lumens made) to apply a bit of solder to the tip of the iron before applying to the underside of the mpcb. This helps transfer heat from the tool to the piece. 

I then used a CR123 primary to test each side of the quad before I bonded it to the pill. Just a super-quick touch of the leads proved that they were working as desired.


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## MRsDNF (Feb 24, 2016)

You have one sweet looking custom built light DrafterDan. Its a good feeling when you hit the switch and theres light.


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## bartko09 (Feb 24, 2016)

DrafterDan said:


> I then used a CR123 primary to test each side of the quad before I bonded it to the pill. Just a super-quick touch of the leads proved that they were working as desired.



Much easier way is to set your multimeter to 200 Ohms and connect it to the positive and negative pads. The small amount of volts used in this test is enough to power the LEDs assuming that they're flowed properly. 

Another way to tell if they're flowed properly is to place the leads in the same position and run a continuity test. That will also light the LEDs but much dimmer. If you get a positive continuity audible indicator than somethings wrong [emoji6]


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## DrafterDan (Feb 24, 2016)

That's a great idea B9, I will try that (hopefully) tonight. 
It does look like I reset the modes to default when I was messing with the leads. I now have default 4-speed. Not a big deal, but I did lose that moonlight mode, which was fun to play with.

~D


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## precisionworks (Feb 25, 2016)

Very nice machine work. You've come a long way in a relatively short time.



> Using a dial gauge worked much better than using the screw table to zero out the threading.


Sometimes called the poor mans DRO. Just as accurate as a DRO, takes a bit more time to set it up. Machinists have used the dial indicator for this function for decades.



> Using that half-speed spindle trick worked great, best threading I've produced so far. *The power was also cut in half*, so I had to manually spin the head in a few places. I'm sure I'm missing something.


When speed is reduced torque is increased. The chuck should be unstoppable at slower speeds. 



> Turned down a bit of Delrin to contact the tailcap, and it's all held down by a 1/4-20. Now that it's done, *it will probably take me a half hour to exactly center it on the table.*


IMHO the fastest & easiest way to center on the mill is using a Blake Co Ax indicator. Total time to center is well under a minute using the Blake. Avoid the knock offs as they tend to have a short life, Blakes keep going like the EverReady bunny. They can be used like I did in the image below or you may want to use the included rotation stop rod.

Quite a few listings on eBay right now: http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=p2050601.m570.l2632.R2.TR4.TRC1.A0.H0.Xblake+co+a.TRS0&_nkw=blake+co-ax+indicator&_sacat=11804


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## DrafterDan (Mar 1, 2016)

Very nice of you to say PW, thank you.

I like that Blake indicator, will keep my eye out for one. 

It is strange about the reduced torque when halving the spindle speed. What you say makes sense, but it didn't turn out that way in practice. I may have to do some digging to find the op manual for this beast.

~D


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## Ladd (Mar 1, 2016)

Thanks for taking the time to PM, Drafter. Enjoyable thread. Anxious to see what's next!


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## precisionworks (Mar 2, 2016)

DrafterDan said:


> It is strange about the reduced torque when halving the spindle speed. What you say makes sense, but it didn't turn out that way in practice.



Most machines use a combination of belts & sheaves or gears to reduce or increase speed - these behave as expected i.e. the slower the spindle speed the higher the torque. For example, my lathe runs a 3 hp motor & makes about 15 lb/ft at 1750 rpm. That translates to 150 lb/ft at 175 rpm, etc. At 40 rpm, the speed I use for power tapping, the torque is roughly 600 lb/ft. More than most automobiles & even more than many heavy duty trucks. 

Some machines use older electronic speed control referred to as V/HZ (volts/frequency). As frequency is reduced voltage is reduced in the same proportion. One half speed means one half torque, one tenth speed means one tenth torque.


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## DrafterDan (Mar 26, 2016)

edited. wrong post. Maybe I have too many projects going on at the same time


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