# Ultrafire C3 SS now not cree XP-E Q5 but XR-C P4 (maybe)...



## Ian2381 (May 13, 2010)

I purchased a month ago my second UF C3 SS but it is now dimmer and of bad quality. 
Stored for a month...
... until I received a CREE XPE-Q3 5A Warm White 5-mode LED Lamp Cap from Kai for my Solarforce L2 which i think is not bright enough...

Removed the Warm LED from the drop in and replaced the LED in the C3.

Now I have a warm LED AA/14500 light which I liked better.


----------



## phreeflow (May 14, 2010)

Ian2381 said:


> I purchased a month ago my second UF C3 SS but it is now dimmer and of bad quality.
> Stored for a month...
> ... until I received a CREE XPE-Q3 5A Warm White 5-mode LED Lamp Cap from Kai for my Solarforce L2 which i think is not bright enough...
> 
> ...



Hmmm...interesting post. I am bummed by the latest batch of SS C3's lately as well. Reminds me of the venerable and original black C3's that were great lights until they started cutting corners on the circuit boards. Both these lights were favorites of mine and I really should have bought more when I had the chance. 

My SS C3 broke a couple weeks ago and I was going to get a replacement until I heard this news about the emitters being XRC. I'm interested in what you did exactly. Did you just plop off the pill from your Solarforce dropin and screw that in directly into the C3?...did it fit without modification. Or did you mean that you unsoldered the star from the Solarforce dropin and soldered it back onto to the C3 pill??

thanks


----------



## Tally-ho (May 14, 2010)

phreeflow said:


> Did you just plop off the pill from your Solarforce dropin and screw that in directly into the C3?...did it fit without modification. Or did you mean that you unsoldered the star from the Solarforce dropin and soldered it back onto to the C3 pill??



Diameters of P60 dropin and UF C3 SS head are very different so I guess he unsoldered emitters and it's what I understand from what he said:



Ian2381 said:


> *Removed* the Warm LED *from* the drop in and replaced the LED in the C3.


----------



## Zatoichi (May 15, 2010)

My new C3 SS just arrived. I can't tell for sure if it's a P4, but it's certainly too small to be a Q5. The small spot and lower output on high will make it less useful to me than the Q5 version I had. The finish looks a bit duller than on my last one too, though it fits together perfectly (no gaps).

It does have a very low low now though, perhaps the only up side to it _not_ having the advertised emitter. :shrug: 

I still think they're nice for the money, especially if you're going to mod it like Ian has.


----------



## Ian2381 (May 15, 2010)

Tally-ho said:


> Diameters of P60 dropin and UF C3 SS head are very different so I guess he unsoldered emitters and it's what I understand from what he said:




Yes, that's what I did. removing the C3 pill is so easy I just swap Led emitters in a minute. For awhile been thinking of geting the Quark Warm but no AA is available, now I don't have to spend too much $$$ and I already have a bright warm light especially using 14500 on it.:thumbsup:


----------



## petergunn (May 15, 2010)

Ian2381 said:


> Yes, that's what I did. removing the C3 pill is so easy I just swap Led emitters in a minute....:thumbsup:



Was the emitter in your C3 glued to the pill? 

When I replaced my C3 emitter with a XP-G R5 (with excellent results BTW) I found only the slightest amount of thermal compound underneath (not glue) and I could move the emitter around or lift it off without effort.

I'm much happier now it is fixed securely in place with Artic Alumina.

-PG


----------



## pounder (May 15, 2010)

petergunn said:


> Was the emitter in your C3 glued to the pill?
> 
> When I replaced my C3 emitter with a XP-G R5 (with excellent results BTW) I found only the slightest amount of thermal compound underneath (not glue) and I could move the emitter around or lift it off without effort.
> 
> ...



are you using the driver in the C3 or are you direct drive? 14500 or AA? where did you get the emitter and what size? is it the 14mm one on kai? thanks!


----------



## petergunn (May 15, 2010)

pounder said:


> are you using the driver in the C3 or are you direct drive? 14500 or AA? where did you get the emitter and what size? is it the 14mm one on kai? thanks!



Yes, I'm using the original C3 5-mode driver - just replaced the emitter. It works with both 14500 or AA as normal and seems much brighter (although more floody) than the original.

The XP-G R5 has a much smaller die than the original and sits lower on the board. You'll need some non-conductive paper around the die if you dont want the board visible through the reflector hole, and an o-ring at the lens to keep everything snug (I used a green GITD one).

I used a 14mm round XPG-R5 from LCK Led - cost ~$7 with CPF discount.

-PG


----------



## Ian2381 (May 15, 2010)

petergunn said:


> Was the emitter in your C3 glued to the pill?
> 
> When I replaced my C3 emitter with a XP-G R5 (with excellent results BTW) I found only the slightest amount of thermal compound underneath (not glue) and I could move the emitter around or lift it off without effort.
> 
> ...



Same with mine, not glued at all and I easily swapped emitters. I didn't really thought modding a C3 is that easy, anyways I just changed emitters.:shrug:
Now I'm losing any reason to buy a new EDC light. Just upgrade parts for them.


----------



## phreeflow (May 16, 2010)

Ian2381 said:


> Same with mine, not glued at all and I easily swapped emitters. I didn't really thought modding a C3 is that easy, anyways I just changed emitters.:shrug:
> Now I'm losing any reason to buy a new EDC light. Just upgrade parts for them.



I've never modded the emitter before but is it as simple as resoldering the two leads on the led board? If so, I may try it. thanks guys


----------



## FlashPilot (May 16, 2010)

Great thread. Thanks sharing!


----------



## pounder (May 17, 2010)

petergunn said:


> Yes, I'm using the original C3 5-mode driver - just replaced the emitter. It works with both 14500 or AA as normal and seems much brighter (although more floody) than the original.
> 
> The XP-G R5 has a much smaller die than the original and sits lower on the board. You'll need some non-conductive paper around the die if you dont want the board visible through the reflector hole, and an o-ring at the lens to keep everything snug (I used a green GITD one).
> 
> ...


 

awesome thanks! i'm going to try this as soon as possible..


----------



## petergunn (May 17, 2010)

Well I just upgraded 2 more C3s to XP-G R5 emitters - and this time I took some pictures. Unfortunately my 20min mod turned into an hour and a half mod when I discovered my 14mm emitters were really 16mm emitters that don't fit in the pill. 

All was well in the end tho ... will post pics soon.

-PG


----------



## petergunn (May 17, 2010)

2x Stock C3 SS and 2 new XP-G R5 emitters





Silver foil removed from XR-C on pill





Lead wires de-soldered





Old emitters removed - yukky thermal compound underneath - you need to clean all that off with a paper towel.

Its hard to see in that picture but the soldering job on the original emitter on the right was awful (even by my standards) - they melted the circuit on the heatsink and fixed it by soldering directly to the die. Should still be reusable though.





Nooo! LCK Led shipped me 16mm emitters rather than 14mm ones - they wont fit! :scowl:





So I hacked the edge off with wire cutters and filed it down a bit :naughty: - checked there were no shorts and put a little electrical tape on the edge of the pill just in case. Emitters were centered and fixed in place with Arctic Alumina.





The XP-G R5 die is much smaller than the previous emitter so I punched a hole in a piece of banding tape and colored it silver with a marker to fill the space in the reflector hole.





Then I taped it onto the bottom of the reflector with katon tape (electrical tape would do - need to ensure the reflector doesn't short out the lead wires when its screwed together).





Another view (sorry about the blurry pics).






All done ... time to screw them back together...





Ta da! - 3x C3 SS wit XP-G R5 emitters! 

-PG


----------



## Ian2381 (May 18, 2010)

Petergunn,

Great Mod and been thinking of doing the same.

Do you have beam shot comparison between stock and R5?


----------



## petergunn (May 18, 2010)

Ian2381 said:


> ...Do you have beam shot comparison between stock and R5?



Sorry, no - forgot to take one. Hot spot is maybe twice as big.

I replaced on of the orange peel reflectors with a 18.5mm smooth aluminum one from DX. That gives a more rounded beam pattern with less blur at the edges of the hotspot. Not sure if its better (I quite like the XP-G blurriness) but worth picking one up for $2 in case you like it. 

-PG


----------



## pounder (May 18, 2010)

you rock Peter! thanks man..


----------



## Ian2381 (May 22, 2010)

petergunn said:


> Sorry, no - forgot to take one. Hot spot is maybe twice as big.
> 
> I replaced on of the orange peel reflectors with a 18.5mm smooth aluminum one from DX. That gives a more rounded beam pattern with less blur at the edges of the hotspot. Not sure if its better (I quite like the XP-G blurriness) but worth picking one up for $2 in case you like it.
> 
> -PG



Hi PG,

Does the smooth reflector made it a thrower?


----------



## Chauncey Gardner (May 22, 2010)

Ian2381 said:


> Yes, that's what I did. removing the C3 pill is so easy I just swap Led emitters in a minute. For awhile been thinking of geting the Quark Warm but no AA is available, now I don't have to spend too much $$$ and I already have a bright warm light especially using 14500 on it.:thumbsup:


 
They are easy to remove if the threads are decent.

How do you think an R4 xpg or xre r2 would work?

Too bad about the last batch, I got a perfect q5 SS C3 a couple months ago. Great beam & tint, brighter than my Fenix L1D on a 14500.

Doesn't sound like I'll be picking up any more for a while....


edit; 



Peter, thanks for the tutorial. May be the first mod I try. Nice job.


----------



## petergunn (May 22, 2010)

Ian2381 said:


> Hi PG,
> 
> Does the smooth reflector made it a thrower?



No its still floody - hotspot has a nice round edge but is still fat.

-PG


----------



## Ian2381 (May 22, 2010)

Thanks PG,

I think I'll buy a smooth reflector and find a good Cree XRE Warm, Neutral or WC. I wanted to make my C3 a pocket thrower.:thumbsup:

Currently My warm C3 is more on Flood since it have a warm XPE Cree and OP reflector. I'm really having fun modding my lights.

Now hunting for a XRE warm or neutral emitter.


----------



## Minjin (Sep 23, 2010)

Anyone know if these are back to an XRE or if they still use the XRC?

http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.26122

Also, has anyone considered that this other version that is more expensive and no one seems to be buying might be the older "higher quality" version?

http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.11133


----------



## B12 (Sep 24, 2010)

I also swapped the P2 emitter with 14mm XPG-R5 ($6.80 shipped from Dealextreme). The emitter dropped right in. I used "enough" silicone thermal paste.

With P2 the taicap current was 0.9A and with R5 1.2A from 14500. Plenty, plenty of light now but heats up pretty fast. Beam not too bad but I ordered a smooth reflector to try with it.

If somebody has not swapped the emitter yet, now is the F****n time. Or you'll be a *****. Absolute must do mod. Blows just about any 14500/AA light no matter the price range.


----------



## SirJohn (Sep 27, 2010)

Minjin said:


> Anyone know if these are back to an XRE or if they still use the XRC?
> http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.11133


 
Lat I heard, they still have not switched back. However, a few people have reported getting the Q5 version via lightake recently. Not sure if I would take the risk, however.


----------



## aau007 (Oct 1, 2010)

I am thinking of ordering this light from DX. I don't have a P4 or Q5 light so I have nothing to compare with. Is there a sure way to tell whether it is Q5 without disassembling the head?


----------



## Cemoi (Oct 7, 2010)

petergunn said:


> I used a 14mm round XPG-R5 from LCK Led



Wich color bin do you think it is? Their website doesn't specify it.
Not too blueish?

BTW, what is the tool you used to punch holes (seen on one of your pictures), and where can you buy it (online)? I've never seen this tool before, it looks quite handy.



B12 said:


> I also swapped the P2 emitter with 14mm XPG-R5 ($6.80 shipped from Dealextreme).



Same question: not too blueish?


----------



## Ecolang (Oct 7, 2010)

Cemoi said:


> BTW, what is the tool you used to punch holes (seen on one of your pictures), and where can you buy it (online)? I've never seen this tool before, it looks quite handy.



Round here they are sold as belt punches - their primary use is making new holes in belts.


----------



## petergunn (Oct 7, 2010)

Cemoi said:


> Wich color bin do you think it is? Their website doesn't specify it.
> Not too blueish?



Not sure which bin - cool white but no blue tinge.



Cemoi said:


> BTW, what is the tool you used to punch holes (seen on one of your pictures), and where can you buy it (online)? I've never seen this tool before, it looks quite handy.



Its a leather hole punch (usually ~$6 - Amazon carries them online).

-PG


----------



## FlashPilot (Oct 8, 2010)

I purchased the 14mm xpg star along with the SMO reflector from DX. The stock driver works well with NiMh as well as 14500's and rivals in maximum brightness to my TrustFire R5-A3 (also AA/14500 xpg powered). I get 1.2A @ the tailcap in high on 14500's. This incredibly easy mod breathed new life into the the old light.

I cant believe what an absolutely crappy LED in todays standards the xrc was that it replaced. When I read comments on DX from others about how bright their xrc light is, I just have to laugh knowing that those poor people have no idea how comparatively dim and inefficient their lights are when compared to the xpg. Im really enjoying this light now. Thanks for the pics and sharing your mods here.


----------

