# Elektro Lumens P7 2D 3C Maglite



## ernsanada (Apr 10, 2008)

For submission in the Reviews forum.



I just received the Elektro Lumens P7 2D 3C Maglite.

This is a 2D Maglite that is made to use 3C Batteries.

From the Elekto Lumens thread.

This is direct drive, optimum brightness from NIMH cells. The switch holder light post will be cut off, and wires soldered to switch and directly to the LED. Heat sink will be pressed in, and is not removable easily (removed with floor press). This is a permanently modded flashlight.

The bin number is 'B' or higher, that's what it will be. Might be 'C', but no guarantee.

Run time should be about 4 hours.

I measured 87F at the head, when the room temp was around 65F. Doesn't get hot. The sink I'm using is 1/2 inch thick. 

Option #1: Mag 3D with P7 LED, $99.99 option not available any longer. 

Option #2: Mag 3D with P7 LED, guaranteed 'C###' or better: $129.99 plus $6.60 shipping to USA, $14 for International (Global Priority Flat Rate Envelope)

Option #3: Mag 2D/3C (2D Maglite modified to use 3C cells) with P7 LED, guaranteed 'C###' or better: $139.99 plus $6.60 shipping to USA, $14 for International (Global Priority Flat Rate Envelope)


I installed an UCL Lens from Flashlight Lens.

The stock reflector is installed but the "tail" is cut off.

The beam is very white. The beam can be adjusted to remove the donut in the beam. The beam is not as smooth as the Malkoff 2-3D Drop In. I was very surprised how bright the beam was when I first turned the light on. 

Current draw taken after the lux readings after 2 minutes. 2.92A

I got a lux reading of 14,600 @ 1 meter after 2 minutes. I used Radio Shack C Nimh Batteries 1.2V 4500mAh.


From the outside it look like an ordinary 2D Maglite.












This is the the P7.


























The battery tube has an aluminum tube to hold the C batteries. The batteries do not rattle. Looks to be 1/4" thick.






This is the talicap. The inside looks machined out with the spring lower to accept the extra C cell battery.







Left, Elektro Lumens P7 2D 3C Maglite. Right, Maglite 3D Malkolf Drop-In







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These are the lux readings I got. I am using a Meterman LM631 Light Meter measured at 1 meter. I waited 2 minutes before taking the readings. Both lights had fully charged Radio Shack C & D Nimh Batteries 1.2V 4500mAh.







Elektro Lumens P7 2D 3C Maglite - 14,600 lux @ 1 meter

Maglite 3D Malkolf Drop-In - 12,580 lux @ 1 meter (Current Draw - 1.61A)

Maglite 3D MT-I, 3D Nimh Batteries - 4,130 lux @ 1 meter

Maglite 3D MT-III, 3D Nimh Batteries - 5900 lux @ 1 meter

Refer to for MT-I And MT-III

MT-I uses 1 SSC with 27mm reflector

MT-III uses 3 SSC'S with 3, 20mm Reflectors.







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Elektro Lumens P7 2D 3C Maglite @ 83"






Maglite 3D Malkolf Drop-In @ 83"






Elektro Lumens P7 2D 3C Maglite @ 83" Stepped down exposure






Maglite 3D Malkolf Drop-In @ 83" Stepped down exposure






Left, Elektro Lumens P7 2D 3C Maglite. Right, Maglite 3D Malkolf Drop-In @ 83"






Left, Elektro Lumens P7 2D 3C Maglite. Right, Maglite 3D Malkolf Drop-In @ 83" Stepped down exposure













Elektro Lumens P7 2D 3C Maglite @ 32' Tight Focus






Elektro Lumens P7 2D 3C Maglite @ 32' Wide Focus






Maglite 3D Malkolf Drop-In @ 32'






Maglite 3D MT-I @ 32'






Maglite 3D MT-III @ 32'







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The Malkoff Drop In uses a SSC P4

When the Elektro Lumens P7 2D 3C Maglite is set to "Wide Focus" you start to get the donut hole.


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## ernsanada (Apr 10, 2008)

Elektro Lumens P7 2D 3C Maglite @ 146'






Maglite 3D Malkolf Drop-In @ 146'


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## martonic (Apr 10, 2008)

Hi Erny, Thank you for the quick work and outstanding photography! It is really amazing how much more can be seen from the "real world" shots than from the "white wall" shots. Wow!:twothumbs


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## StefanFS (Apr 10, 2008)

Nice pics. P7 Maglites are wonderful lights. What is your feeling when using it? I still get the 'oh sh*it reaction' when I use my own (homemade) P7 Maglites. They are so bright that they make SSC P4 modded Mags look like incan MiniMags! It's difficult to show that difference in beamshots, but your outdoor pics were really good in that respect.


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## 5.0Trunk (Apr 10, 2008)

Thanks for the nice review and photos. You guys are really going to get me in trouble with my wife. Every time I see a new review, its just another item I want... 

ernsanada ,

I was wondering if you had a DBS Q5 w/OP reflector and if so, how does it compare with the Elektro Lumens P7 2D 3C Maglite in flood?

Thanks


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## qip (Apr 10, 2008)

why does your malkoff draw 1.61a ?


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## ernsanada (Apr 10, 2008)

StefanFS said:


> Nice pics. P7 Maglites are wonderful lights. What is your feeling when using it? I still get the 'oh sh*it reaction' when I use my own (homemade) P7 Maglites. They are so bright that they make SSC P4 modded Mags look like incan MiniMags! It's difficult to show that difference in beamshots, but your outdoor pics were really good in that respect.



I said the same thing when I first turned the light on. I tried the light with alkalines first because my nimh's were charging. Once I put in the nimh's I said the same thing again. There was a very noticeable difference from using alkalines to using the nimh's.

I took lux readings with the alkalines and the lux readings doubled with the nimh. I think it was because they were used alkalines.


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## rizky_p (Apr 10, 2008)

nice review, i didnt know elektro Lumens offers P7 moded light.


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## pbs357 (Apr 10, 2008)

martonic said:


> Hi Erny, Thank you for the quick work and outstanding photography! It is really amazing how much more can be seen from the "real world" shots than from the "white wall" shots. Wow!:twothumbs


 
I agree! In the whitewall shots it appears as though the Malkoff has a stronger spill, but in the practical beamshots the difference is much more clear. I think this is caused by the light overpowering the camera's ability to capture the image or something?


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## husky20 (Apr 10, 2008)

ernsanada how far do you think that thing can throw and be like wow thats awesome feet wise?:thumbsup::goodjob:


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## ernsanada (Apr 10, 2008)

5.0Trunk said:


> Thanks for the nice review and photos. You guys are really going to get me in trouble with my wife. Every time I see a new review, its just another item I want...
> 
> ernsanada ,
> 
> ...



Elektro Lumens P7 2D 3C Maglite @ 32' Tight Focus






Elektro Lumens P7 2D 3C Maglite @ 32' Wide Focus






DBS V2 Q5 3 Way Module OP 18650 @ 32'






Elektro Lumens P7 2D 3C Maglite Tight Focus @ 146'






Elektro Lumens P7 2D 3C Maglite Wide Focus @ 146'






Maglite 3D Malkolf Drop-In @ 146'






DBS V2 Q5 3 Way Module OP 18650 @ 146'


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## Chao (Apr 10, 2008)

Nice review and beamshots as usual, thanks a lot, I want a P7 light :rock:


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## swxb12 (Apr 11, 2008)

Great review, ernsanada. All that from one emitter. Just imagine being able to slap that P7 into a smaller bodied light.


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## TONY M (Apr 11, 2008)

Cool light and great review! 
I want a p7 light now too!


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## Steve L (Apr 11, 2008)

swxb12 said:


> Great review, ernsanada. All that from one emitter. Just imagine being able to slap that P7 into a smaller bodied light.


With a 2.8a current draw, the smallest light I can see it in is an 18650 light(still much smaller than a 2 or 3D Mag). It also seems to work better with a bigger reflector because of its size.
Thanks Ernsanada. Excellent review, the outdoor shots are very revealing.


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## 5.0Trunk (Apr 11, 2008)

Thank you very much for the shots of the DBS ernsanada. Outstanding! Now I want a Elektro Lumens P7 2D 3C Maglite.


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## ernsanada (Apr 11, 2008)

The distance to the tree is 146'.

The above posts are corrected.



Elektro Lumens P7 2D 3C Maglite Tight Focus @ 146'


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## DavidC (Apr 11, 2008)

Please forgive my ignorance - but - what is the value of using 3 C's instead of 2 D's?


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## smokelaw1 (Apr 11, 2008)

DavidC said:


> Please forgive my ignorance - but - what is the value of using 3 C's instead of 2 D's?


 
150% of the voltage. This allows to have the "oomph" of three cells in the body of the 2D. Tradeoff is capacity/runtime.


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## BigBluefish (Apr 11, 2008)

One word: WOW.


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## toadman (Apr 11, 2008)

Guess I'm a newbie cuz I've never heard of p7 led's. Does anyone make dropins without the wiring & switch mods? Or is that just inherent to make a P7 led work with a maglite?
Incidently those P7 photo's kicked butt for a single led, I've got a Monsterthrow IV driven by 4 C rechargables & it looks like that single P7 will give it a run for the money!

Russell


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## warlord (Apr 11, 2008)

Well, it should be bright since it's 4 leds in one 

How realistic is the 4 hour runtime?


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## X_Marine (Apr 11, 2008)

Thanks so much for the great pics and comparison, awesome job.:thumbsup:
And as stated, real life is so helpful.




DavidC said:


> Please forgive my ignorance - but - what is the value of using 3 C's instead of 2 D's?


As the 3 cells provide 3x1.2v= 3.6v which the P7 requires for good performance. 2 D-cells would only provide 2x1.5v= 3.0v and only for a short time before that falls to much less. 

There is lots of great data available here just by searching. Below is from a Q&A on a battery site.


> *Why are AA and AAA batteries rated at 1.2 volts and alkaline batteries rated at 1.5 volts?*
> In fact, over the course of their discharge, alkaline batteries actually average about 1.2 volts. The main difference is that an alkaline battery starts at 1.5 volts and gradually drops to less than 1.0 volts. NiMH batteries stay at about 1.2 volts for almost 80% of their discharge cycle. Once alkaline batteries discharge to 50% capacity, it will be delivering a lower voltage than a NiMH battery.


Thanks again Erny
X/BillyD..


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## floodlight (Apr 11, 2008)

Erns,

Wayne seems to think that your light is only a "B-bin" instead of a "C-bin". Do you have any ways to confirm that statement?

If this is only a "B-bin".....I wonder what the beamshot would be like for a "C-bin".

You think you could ask Wayne for a "C-bin" loaner to do a comparison.


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## ernsanada (Apr 11, 2008)

floodlight said:


> Erns,
> 
> Wayne seems to think that your light is only a "B-bin" instead of a "C-bin". Do you have any ways to confirm that statement?
> 
> ...




The B Bin is very white and bright.

According to this information below a C Bin would be much brighter.

This from LedNinja's Post.

Binning information:
Flux BIN Code
A : 440 - 570 lumen @ LED *0.65 = ~286 - 370 lumen out front.
B : 570 - 740 lumen @ LED *0.65 = ~370 - 481 lumen out front.
C : 740 - 960 lumen @ LED *0.65 = ~481 - 624 lumen out front.
assuming the torch pushed the LED to the spec of 2.8 A.

My Current draw reading from the Elektro Lumens P7 2D 3C Maglite taken after the lux readings after 2 minutes. 2.92A


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## ernsanada (Apr 11, 2008)

These shots are taken at 210'

There is a Palm Tree that the lights are trying to light up. It looks to be about 50 feet high.


Contol shot







Elektro Lumens P7 2D 3C Maglite Tight Focus @ 210'






Elektro Lumens P7 2D 3C Maglite Wide Focus @ 210'






Maglite 3D Malkolf Drop-In @ 210'






DBS V2 Q5 3 Way Module OP 18650 @ 210'






DBS V2 Q5 3 Way Module SMO 18650 @ 210'


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## Turbo DV8 (Apr 12, 2008)

I have an Elektrolumens K2 Stunner that I am considering converting to eight SSC P4 LED's. Anybody want to guesstimate how the P7 Mag would compare to eight P4's with 19mm reflectors? Or here's an evil thought... how about eight P7's once they come down in price? Just a thought. Wouldn't that draw around 23 amps from 3 D cells? Can a 12 Ah NiMH D cell deliver 23 amps. But I guess it's a moot point because I am sure the stock switch can't handle anywhere near that.


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## StefanFS (Apr 12, 2008)

floodlight said:


> Erns,
> 
> Wayne seems to think that your light is only a "B-bin" instead of a "C-bin". Do you have any ways to confirm that statement?
> 
> ...


 
The difference might seem substantial on paper. In use I think it would be hard to see without a light meter.

I have the same type of SSC P7 Maglite with an C-bin P7 emitter in it, only difference is I made mine myself quite some time ago. Beamshots with C-bin SSC P7:
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/192740

Stefan

Edit!
I have a distinct feeling that many led lights don't conform to the 65% torch lumen rule. A good design should be more like 80-90%. Especially a Maglite with a very efficient plastic reflector and UCL-glass lens.


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## Stereodude (Apr 12, 2008)

If you're running the LED direct drive, I would suspect the forward voltage bin would be very important. Direct drive a 3.25-3.5 P7 should be brighter than a 3.50-3.75 one.


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## Brooks (Apr 12, 2008)

Any reason this light uses a 2D mag holding 3C batteris instead of just using a 3C mag?


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## Stereodude (Apr 12, 2008)

Brooks said:


> Any reason this light uses a 2D mag holding 3C batteris instead of just using a 3C mag?


Cause Wayne made his SSCs P7 setup to fit into D cell mag's, not C cell mags.


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## LEDninja (Apr 12, 2008)

https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/194340


swxb12 said:


> Great review, ernsanada. All that from one emitter. Just imagine being able to slap that P7 into a smaller bodied light.



Ernsanada measured just under 3A
12000 mAH D NiMH batteries should get 4 hours,
10000 mAH D LSD NiMH batteries should get 3 hours,
6000 mAH C NiMH batteries should get 2 hours,
4500 mAH C NiMH batteries should get 1.5 hours.
I would not try to use Energizer 2500 mAH. Sorry bunny.


warlord said:


> How realistic is the 4 hour runtime?


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## qip (Apr 12, 2008)

wonder which is brighter ROP or P7, i would think the p7 is the led version of ROP right, both single lamp high output


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## ernsanada (Apr 12, 2008)

LEDninja said:


> https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/194340
> 
> 
> Ernsanada measured just under 3A
> ...



LEDninja,

Thanks!

That's why on this light I stayed away from the run times. Everybody probably uses different nimh batteries. My batteries are the 4500 mAh. So I should get about 1.5 hours run time.


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## werdnawee (Apr 12, 2008)

Sorry, noob question.

Can I just purchase the entire set-up somewhere (link or pm please) or is this something that I have to mod myself by purchasing all the parts?

Thanks


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## ernsanada (Apr 12, 2008)

werdnawee said:


> Sorry, noob question.
> 
> Can I just purchase the entire set-up somewhere (link or pm please) or is this something that I have to mod myself by purchasing all the parts?
> 
> Thanks



I purchased the complete light through Elektro Lumens


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## LEDninja (Apr 12, 2008)

Elektrolumens order page
3D unknown bin $99.99
3D C bin $129.99
He has withdrawn the 2D/3C (as reviewed here) for now.


werdnawee said:


> Can I just purchase the entire set-up somewhere (link or pm please) or is this something that I have to mod myself by purchasing all the parts?



Agreed. I also suspect the current shipping P7s are high B or low C bin, somewhere around 700-800 LED lumens.***
Elektrolumens is currently shipping the lights with the stock plastic lens. Buying a UCL lens from flashlightlens or lighthound should increase transmission ~10%.
My guesstimate:
Stock Mag lens:
700 - 800 lumen @ LED *0.7 = ~490 - 560 lumen out front.
UCL lens:
700 - 800 lumen @ LED *0.8 = ~560 - 640 lumen out front.


LEDninja said:


> Binning information:
> Flux BIN Code
> A : 440 - 570 lumen @ LED *0.65 = ~286 - 370 lumen out front.
> B : 570 - 740 lumen @ LED *0.65 = ~370 - 481 lumen out front.
> ...





StefanFS said:


> I have a distinct feeling that many led lights don't conform to the 65% torch lumen rule. A good design should be more like 80-90%. Especially a Maglite with a very efficient plastic reflector and UCL-glass lens.



***
Binning information:
Flux BIN Code
A : 440 - 570 lumen @ 2.8A > 110 - 142.5 lumen per die @ 700 mA > Cree P bin.
B : 570 - 740 lumen @ 2.8A > 142.5 - 185 lumen per die @ 700 mA > Cree Q bin.
C : 740 - 960 lumen @ 2.8A > 185 - 240 lumen per die @ 700 mA > Cree R bin.
The current shipping top Cree bins are Q5 and R2 so my guess is similar dies in the current shipping SSC P7.
***
Lumens out front:
I have compared many manufacturers (calculated LED) lumens against FLRs (measured) lumens and do not see 90%.
In the thread for the DX MTE P7 light, a member came across a Fenix tested at 81%. As Fenix uses AR coated lenses I am using a rounded (80%) # for the UCL lens calculation and dropped it 10% to 70% for the stock mag lens calculation.
I don't think it matters if the P7 torch is 3X or 4X brighter than the current top of the line Q5/R2 lights. It is still WAAAAAY BRIGHTER.


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## StefanFS (Apr 13, 2008)

LEDninja said:


> Lumens out front:
> I have compared many manufacturers (calculated LED) lumens against FLRs (measured) lumens and do not see 90%.
> In the thread for the DX MTE P7 light, a member came across a Fenix tested at 81%. As Fenix uses AR coated lenses I am using a rounded (80%) # for the UCL lens calculation and dropped it 10% to 70% for the stock mag lens calculation.
> I don't think it matters if the P7 torch is 3X or 4X brighter than the current top of the line Q5/R2 lights. It is still WAAAAAY BRIGHTER.


 
Ok, at least we can agree on the fact that 80% is not impossible with led lights. That's a great improvement over 65%. Depending on glass quality I have seen UCL increase flux out front from a few percent to beyond ten percent. 
Stefan


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## ernsanada (Apr 15, 2008)

This is a 3rd Shift 3C 3 Watt Luxeon T Bin Magmod I purchased from 3rd Shift a while back. 












These are the lux readings I got. I am using a Meterman LM631 Light Meter measured at 1 meter. I waited 2 minutes before taking the readings. I used fully charged Radio Shack C Nimh Batteries 1.2V 4500mAh.


3rd Shift 3C 3 Watt Luxeon T Bin Magmod - 10,007 lux @ 1 meter

Current Draw 1.16A


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3rd Shift 3C 3 Watt Luxeon T Bin Magmod @ 32'






Elektro Lumens P7 2D 3C Maglite @ 32' Tight Focus







3rd Shift 3C 3 Watt Luxeon T Bin Magmod @ 146'






Elektro Lumens P7 2D 3C Maglite Tight Focus @146'






3rd Shift 3C 3 Watt Luxeon T Bin Magmod @ 210'






Elektro Lumens P7 2D 3C Maglite Tight Focus @ 210'







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3rd Shift 3C 3 Watt Luxeon T Bin Magmod shots were taken when the moon was out.

There was no moon out when the Elektro Lumens P7 2D 3C Maglite Tight Focus shots were taken.


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## selfbuilt (Apr 16, 2008)

Nice review Ernie. I appreciate all those outdoor shots especially! :thumbsup:

I must say, I've been quite interested in these P7 SSCs ever since I saw Stefan's excellent maglite mod thread. Unfortunately, I haven't had time to do any modding myself lately, so I think it's great that Wayne is making these widely available through his site (and sales thread in CPFM). I'm hoping some of the other makers start taking advantage of the potential of these new emitters soon.

Thanks again for the review! 
:wave:


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## StefanFS (Apr 17, 2008)

selfbuilt said:


> Nice review Ernie. I appreciate all those outdoor shots especially! :thumbsup:
> 
> I must say, I've been quite interested in these P7 SSCs ever since I saw Stefan's excellent maglite mod thread. Unfortunately, I haven't had time to do any modding myself lately, so I think it's great that Wayne is making these widely available through his site (and sales thread in CPFM). I'm hoping some of the other makers start taking advantage of the potential of these new emitters soon.
> 
> ...


 
The SSC P7 works wonderfully in the C-D Maglite reflector, it makes high power SSC P4 modded Maglites look like the stock incandescent variety. This review shows that big difference. I'm putting P7 emitters in most of my already modded Mags. A properly driven SSC P7 in a Mag makes it shockingly bright! Recommended.
Stefan


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## 270winchester (Apr 17, 2008)

StefanFS said:


> The SSC P7 works wonderfully in the C-D Maglite reflector, it makes high power SSC P4 modded Maglites look like the stock incandescent variety. This review shows that big difference. I'm putting P7 emitters in most of my already modded Mags. A properly driven SSC P7 in a Mag makes it shockingly bright! Recommended.
> Stefan



I agree.

the P7 has officially made the 10w HIDs obsolete, unless the user wants maximum throw over all other factors.


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## Turbo DV8 (Apr 17, 2008)

I notice that Wayne has pulled the MT-III's from his catalogue just as I was contemplating getting one for my 3C Mag. Does this single P7 Mag mod make the MT-III "obsolete" in every respect? I mean, so yes, the P7 out-throws the MT-III, right? But if I am more into lots of floody spill and not necessarily long-range illumination, does the MT-III still provide more floody spill than the P7 mod? Or does Wayne's P7 Mag mod give both more throw and at least equivalent spill?


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## StefanFS (Apr 17, 2008)

Turbo DV8 said:


> I notice that Wayne has pulled the MT-III's from his catalogue just as I was contemplating getting one for my 3C Mag. Does this single P7 Mag mod make the MT-III "obsolete" in every respect? I mean, so yes, the P7 out-throws the MT-III, right? But if I am more into lots of floody spill and not necessarily long-range illumination, does the MT-III still provide more floody spill than the P7 mod? Or does Wayne's P7 Mag mod give both more throw and at least equivalent spill?


 
On page one of this thread Ernsanada do perform a comparative photoshoot where both lights are present:twothumbs.


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## melancholyvgs311 (Jun 14, 2008)

Internet spazzed out and I didnt think this one posted.... doh. Deleted!


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## melancholyvgs311 (Jun 14, 2008)

I received this flashlight probably a week ago and just wanted to make a couple of notes about it. I realize this is my first post and I have little to no credibility, but I think pictures should help. Anyway, I just went through my first set of regular alkaline c cells and I was reminded that I wanted to make a post in this thread. First I just want to say that I don't have a whole lot of experience with flashlights, but this thing is pretty dang exciting. I use it mainly when I run on trails deep into the woods at night and need a backup/brighter light than my led hat  The trails cross a few lines of power lines and this flashlight has no problem illuminating much farther than I'd really need to see to begin with.

The aluminum tube is now PVC pipe. At first I was unsure about how I felt... it felt cheap, but honestly does it matter? The batteries fit snugly and it is way more cost efficient to use PVC in place of alum stock. The 2nd thing I was going to note was that the spring isn't anywhere near what the first post had in it. The spring now is much smaller and doesn't fit very well at all and parts look to be hand bent. It takes some playing around to get the spring to seat correctly. When it's together it works fine and only on occasion does the PVC slide around and clunk. I think this inconsistency with the noise is either due to the gnarled ends of the PVC where it was cut or maybe the spring moving around inside. When I put it back together after taking a few pictures it doesn't clunk. Go figure 

Anyway, here's some pictures of what was different in mine than the first post:















...I need to find/order some half way decent c cells...these regular alkaline batteries just aren't cutting it...


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## adamlau (Jun 14, 2008)

I still favor the DBS based on these beamshots  .


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## jcvjcvjcvjcv (Jun 15, 2008)

Brooks said:


> Any reason this light uses a 2D mag holding 3C batteris instead of just using a 3C mag?


 
The D MagLite's allow for better heatsinking. With his quad P7 'Wall of Fire' that's even more important and it's offcourse easier to make just one type and vary the number of LED's.

A 2D Mag is also shorter then a 3C Mag.


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## etc (Jun 15, 2008)

Thanks for the pics.

I have the Malkoff module for 3D Mag, nice. I sometimes use 4C in it. 

One comment is that with C cells, you will get roughly half the run time, as they have half the mAh capacity...

But the big advantage is that the light is actually much lighter...


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## Nell (Jul 15, 2008)

Is it truly direct drive without any resistance built in? How long does it run before it dims noticeable?


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## ernsanada (Jul 15, 2008)

Sorry I haven't run my light down before it noticeably dims.


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## ernsanada (Jul 15, 2008)

I received My Lumapower DX1 P7 Drop In Kit.

Left, Lumapower DX1 P7. Right, Elektro Lumens P7 2D 3C Maglite


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