# IRAQ/Military Deployment lights-Sticky



## Balog (Aug 9, 2005)

Hi everyone, my name is John Handley. I'm a frequent poster over at the High Road forums. I'm a Marine stationed in 29 Palms, and I'm getting set to deploy soon. One of the "highly recommended but not issued" pieces of gear is a good ultra-bright flashlight. I've been trying to research the subject and I'm just blown away at the number of options. I had no idea it was such a large and complex market! 

Surefire seems to be the best quality, altho most of their products are out of my price range. It's hard to compare their lights w/ others as I've heard they measure actual light thrown rather than that generated by the bulb before reflecting. It's also confusing because many other lights are measured in candlepower, not lumens.

In any case, I can only afford the G2, 6p or 9p. Are there other options in that price range that would compare, or do I just have to bite the bullet and cough up for a Surefire? I don't mind paying for quality, but I've got a _real_ small budget and lots of other items that are also important to buy.

Any help is greatly appreciated. I'm feeling swamped w/ all this information, and I just want some help deciphering it all and making a wise decision.


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## UVvis (Aug 9, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

A tan G2 would be a good place to start. They are tough, durable, relatively cheap and compact.

I'd check to see if your unit will supply, or if you will be able to buy 123a cells. Also consider getting a spare bulb.

Good luck,
PM sent.


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## JasonC8301 (Aug 9, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Welcome to the forums. 

29 Palms, I remember that place like it was yesterday (I was one of those MCCES students back in 2002/2003.) I just got back a few months ago from Iraq and I can offer some advice. 

My most used light was a Longbow Micra, yes expensive (figure $50-$60), runs on CR123's (got them for free), and not too bright. 

Sometimes a light is too bright, for most common tasks I found a high powered 2 or 3 X CR123 battery light was just the wrong tool. At times my Longbow Micra was too bright. 

You don't need to go Surefire, there are other options out there. 

A good set-up is a lowoutput common cell light, like a Arc AAA or Gerber Infinity. Those work well getting around at night. The next step up is a single CR123 LED light (Luxeon) that offers more output but sacrifices run time. 

I figure space is the ultimate goal, so having one light to do it all is what I aim for. I had one too many lights when I was there, sometimes I'd pick the wrong tool for the job (nothing like using a Streamlight TL-3 to visit the porta-john, similar to 9P in output, night vision is totally gone.) 

I guess alot of it depends on what will you be doing. Are you a grunt, motor t, comm, operator, or something else? 

www.surefire.com for well options on Surefires. I got a few myself. I have seen A2 Aviators, G2's, and some E2e's out in the sandbox. I had a E2e but never brought it out to play. 

www.batterystation.com/cpf.htm for a nice selection of other lights (Inova, Gerber, Pelican.)

Candlepower is light measured at one spot, so a laser can have a really high candlepower rating but have no sidespill/overall output. Lumens is what most CPF members follow because it measures total output versus output at just one spot in the beam. 

I personally got my next deployment all laid out (if and when I go again) to have a Surefire U2 hooked to my body armor (2 lumens to 80 lumens variable output), and a Surefire weapons light on my M16. That pretty much covers everything I need, got the U2 for low/medium output levels, and the SF weapons light for when I need a lot more light. 

I felt swamped at first with all this information, but I slowly gained the knowledge and picked lights I figure will get practical use. 

I know a lot of guys with the G2 and 6P's and they burned through batteries like no other because of the run time (1 hour) vs. having a second light to cover all the low light needs. 

If you can swing it, go with the Surefire A2. Have the red or green LED's for low output / night vision, then you have the option for 50 lumens of light (which is a lot with dark adapted eyes in a dark area (uhm, pretty much all of Iraq bases I've been to.)


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## greenLED (Aug 9, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

I'd say Pelican M6. There was a thread a while ago reporting on the use of PeliM6's (rifle mounted) in Afghanistan. Apparently they held better than other brand (can't remember if it was Streamlight, and I can't find the thread.

Don't forget a smaller, LED-based light for walking around at night. Gerber Recon (colored LEDs you can cycle through), or Trio, maybe, or an Infinity Ultra.

_Edit:_ 
Ha! Found it, it was SL Scorpions failing and the PM6 going strong:
SL Scorpions in Afghanistan flop thread link.


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## Balog (Aug 9, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

I'm defintiely leaning towards the G-2, but I just wish I was able to _see_ the difference between 60 and 105 lumens. I also don't know how good the "lock out tailcap" thingy the 6p has is.

As for the batteries... Technically we don't rate them, since we don't get issued lights. The comm shop gets 'em, however, and our comm guys assure us they'll hook us up. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif

Edit: Wow, several people posted whlst I was typing. Some info...
I'm a grunt (0351) and I'm planning on using this light for nothing but offensive use. We're going to a city, and as a '51 I'll be doing a _lot_ of breaching and MOUT ops. I've got lower output/red lense lights for walking around the base at night. I'm just looking for something to blind hajjis w/ on raids.


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## JasonC8301 (Aug 9, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Nice, comm hooking everyone up /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif I always had a box sitting in my trunk for people that need their battery fix. 

If you get the G2, get a spare lamp assembly (P60) and a SC1 spares carrier to hold batteries and the lamp assembly. 

Try to find the new G2's, they have the pyrex glass window (vs lexan) and have the LOTC (lock out tailcap) capability. The LOTC is good to have because you don't want to reach over and grab a light that was run down due to accidental on. 

G2-$34, SC1-$16, spare P60 lamp-$17, freaking out the guy with a 2 AA mini mag, priceless.


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## flashlightDR (Aug 9, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Any chance that you can spring the cost of a GLADIUS ? (You won't have to worry about the cost of replacment lamps.)
It sounds like it might be exactly what you are looking for(?)


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## watt4 (Aug 9, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

check the base exchange for a G2 and other flashlights. a local air force base stocks them in the military clothing sales store. (batteries, too)


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## Fat_Tony (Aug 9, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Hi John. Welcome aboard. Anyhow, to get on with trying to answer your questions, I have to 2nd greenLED's recommendation. I think that my Pelican M6 is a great light. It's as bright (to my eyes) as my Surefire E2D, and replacement bulbs for it cost a lot less than they do for surefire lights. It is also made of aluminium, and costs about the same as a Surefire G2 (if you buy it at www.batterystation.com/cpf.htm ). It also seems really rugged and durable, although I have never used my Pelican M6 in combat conditions, so YMMV. In the end, I hope that everything turns out well for you, and you get the best light for your needs.


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## StoneDog (Aug 9, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Hi Balog and welcome.

The G2 or even the G2Z would be a good fit. As the others have mentioned buy at least one extra lamp assembly - and make one of them the P61. It will give close to 100 lumens and should really make it easy to spot ... well, I guess I have to be PC since I'm a civilian.

Another nice light is the Streamlight TL-3. Here is a great deal on them. Wicked bright at 200 lumens (manufacturer's claim). Solid aluminum and a nice grippy pattern on the barrel. Replacement bulbs are cheaper than SureFires' - just make sure you definitely have a supply of CR123 batteries to feed it.

If the budget can handle it, the Surefire L5 kicks @ss. Not as bright as the version of the G2's P61 lamp (or the TL-3) but it should be even-money with the P60, it will never burn out and it will stay brighter longer than the G2 or TL-3. 

Jon


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## bwaites (Aug 9, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Balog,

There are lots of options.

My Brother in Law had a mounted PM6 on his rifle with a pressure pad switch. He didn't have to replace a bulb while in Baghdad for 13 months. 

The difference in the G2 or other Surefire 60 and 105 lumens is less than you would expect, with the 105 lumen P61 lamp basically having a bigger hotspot. Throw is slightly longer also, but still not as far as the tighter hotspot Pelican M6, which technically doesn't put out as much light as a P61 but has a deeper, more focused reflector.

If this is a gun mounted light your needs will differ somewhat, so we can help a little more if we know that.

Also, many of us have extras that we donate from time to time, so knowing about when you will deploy may also help.

Feel free to PM me if you have any questions.

Bill

Bill


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## John N (Aug 10, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*



> *JasonC8301 said:*
> Try to find the new G2's, they have the pyrex glass window (vs lexan)



AFAIK, this is not correct. New G2s still have the Lexan window. 



> and have the LOTC (lock out tailcap) capability.
> The LOTC is good to have because you don't want to reach over and grab a light that was run down due to accidental on.



Agreed. If you go for the G2, make sure you check first to make sure it has the LOTC. Either confirm on the phone with whoever you are ordering from (telling people where you are going might add a certain amount of cooperation in this respect) or check the light out in person. 

In addition to making sure it doesn't activate by accident, it is also a better design and should keep dust out better, and it won't fall apart when you are trying to change batteries.

If you can swing it, you might look at the G2Z or the NRA Combatlight (same as the G2Z but with a discount if you are a NRA member). Main benefit of the G2Z would be the different grip, so if that isn't useful to you I'd pass.

With a limited budget, I don't see the benefit of going to the 6P. The new G2 is a very good tool. If I was going to upgrade, I'd consider the G2Z or 9P. 

Yah, get spare lamp assembly and a spares carrier to fit the spare lamp assembly. 

Good luck and thank you!

-john


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## 7bears (Aug 10, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

I would get two lights that would cover your personal needs. 

A Photon Freedom micro-light with the COVERT nose in either white or turquoise, just perfect for going to the latrine at night, checking your gear on the C-130 or Blackhawk, etc. Wmart will have double CR-2016 battery packs cheaper than buying them individually. Many people will have these or the Inova microlights clipped to the button hole of their DCU lapel.
http://www.photonlight.com/products/freedom_micro/index.html

For the second light I would get an E2e HA. The advantage of the E2e over the G2 is that it is smaller, comes with a pocket clip, and is hard anodized aluminum metal rather than nylon. It is a high quality light; very tough, small, and plenty bright for most purposes. I carried a C2-HA my first year in Iraq but I like the E2e much better because of the smaller size and weight. I know the p61 sounds tempting but it is just a 25% larger hotspot over the p60 with no increase in distance. The MN03 for most purposes is just as good. The A2 would be great but it is larger and more expensive. For the price of an A2 you could get an E2e plus a Photon serving both high and low lighting functions and still have a lot of money left over. If possible, I would get the SC3 spares carrier, some batteries, and an extra MN03 bulb before mobing out. The PXs at the larger bases carry surefire batteries in a clear plastic dozen pack and sometimes spare bulbs.

7bears,
Mosul, Iraq.

P.S., please PM me, I will gladly buy the micro-light for you.


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## John N (Aug 10, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*



> *Balog said:*
> I'm defintiely leaning towards the G-2, but I just wish I was able to _see_ the difference between 60 and 105 lumens.



Not so big. The big win (in terms of brightness) would be a 9P with the optional P91 lamp assembly. However, the higher cost of the light, plus the extra lamp assembly ($27), plus a spares carrier to keep the extra lamp assembly in and we are talking probably more than you wanted to spend.

Heck, considering the budget, the cost of a spare lamp assembly, and the nature of dealing with failures and battery changes at a bad time, perhaps you might consider just getting two G2s. You could always keep one with new batteries as a backup.



> I also don't know how good the "lock out tailcap" thingy the 6p has is.



While it is a good thing, the G2 now has this feature. However, there are old style G2s out there, so make sure you insist on getting one with the LOTC. 

Here is a thread on how to tell the old G2 (no LOTC) from the new G2.

-john


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## John N (Aug 10, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

BTW, how do you intend to deploy the light? It seems like using a flashlight with a rifle would be awkward at best.

-john


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## Balog (Aug 10, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Thanks for the info everyone. Lots to look at.

I'll be deploying in the first week of September. 

Re Pelican M6's, what are the differences between 2330's and 2320's? The Pelican site doesn't list multiple models, but there is an $11 price difference. And how much are the pressure switches for them? Is it hard to transition between the regular switch and the pressure switch?

I'm looking for a light that could be mounted on a rifle easily, but that is also usable handheld. I've got an A-4 w/ the 1913 rails so I should be able to wangle a set of rings to hold it in place under the fore-end. Would the G2 have problems being in rings since it's made of nylon?

Anyone have experience w/ that Streamlight TL-3? That's a wicked good price for 200 lumens, if that claim is accurate. However, I've heard some manufacturers measure the lumen output differently than Surefire, and the claims may not measure up to the performance.


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## JohnK (Aug 10, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Anyone have experience w/ that Streamlight TL-3? >>>>>

Yep, many of us do. I own two, and you won't find a longer throwing light anywhere for that price. Has a very tough body, and carries a spare bulb ON THE LIGHT, an advantage of immense proportions when you need a light that works. Bulbs are inexpensive, compared to the Surefires.

It also has a very useable clip on the light.

A winner for the price.


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## JasonC8301 (Aug 10, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

My error on the G2 pyrex window. I assumed it was on the new ones. I probably got them mixed up with the UCL lens for the G2. 

Anyway, SL TL-3, this light outputs a lot of light. I think the lumen rating is a bit fluffed up. From memory, no way is the TL-3 200 lumens when compared to a 60 lumen G2. The TL-3 has more throw (larger reflector and 9v vs 6v) and a marginal amount of more lightout. I figure 120-140 lumens. 

As JohnK said, spare bulb in the light already. The throw on this smallish light is very good (not bad for a $60 light.) Also the clip and lanyard work well in making the light handy/dummy tied to the body. I had one riding on the left side of my vest. 

There is no LOTC function on the TL-3 but I found it kind of hard to activate when clipped to my vest. The tailcap is flush (if my memory serves me correctly, sold my TL-3 a while ago when I got back) and hard to depress accidentally vs. sticking out like the G2's. 

No comment on the M4 with 1913 rails, I had my M16 bone stock when I was out there. I plan on getting a Surefire weapons system before the next deployment though.


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## Grubbster (Aug 10, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

You might want to check out the X2 or X3 from Pentagon Lights . They are close to Surefire quality at a better price. They also have remote switch options for weapons mounting.


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## matthewdanger (Aug 10, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Brightguy has a good price on the Pelican M6 Here. 
You can get a great price on the remote tape switch here. 

I have been extremely satisfied with my M6. It throws better than any other 1.25" bezel light I have owned and it is focusable. Since it has the 1.25" bezel it will be compatible with Surefire filters, so you may want to pick up a beamshaper and red/blue filter. Also keep in mind that this can take the Bugoutgear 3W LED drop in. Pelican M6 spare bulbs are considerably cheaper than Surefire bulbs. All in all I think they are a great deal.


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## DaveT (Aug 10, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Lots of good advice in this thread. 

I'm a big fan of the Pelican M6. I've sent two of them, plus a tape switch, to my nephew serving in Iraq now. That said, I don't think he's attached one to his rifle (he's a mechanic).
As others have said, it's a sturdy, good-throwing light. The lamps are much cheaper than those for the Surefire lights (about $7 from brightguy.com). One configuration that would give good flexibility would be getting a pair of these, tape switch, and a 3-watt LED drop-in module from bugoutgear.com. This way, you could have on-rifle and on-body high-power lights, swappable lamps, and one would be instantly replaceable if you had a failure. (You could also do this with the Surefire G2s as hosts, if you prefer the Surefire family). If you go with Pelicans, I'd recommend you deploy with a supply of spare lamps - someone with some experience might want to chime in on availability of spare lamps once in the field. My guess would be you'd have an easier time getting Surefire lamps at a PX - if you'll have access to one on something approaching a regular basis. Of course, there's always mail order. For my nephew it usually takes 3-4 weeks for priority mail packages to arrive from the U.S.

Another vote goes for the Infinity family of lights - whether regular Infinity or Infinity Ultra. Batterystation.com would be a good place to check - they have the Pelicans, plus Infinitys, including some of the colored regular Infinitys with very long runtimes, and AAs are available anywhere.

My nephew also carries an Arc AAA as a dogtag light - these are excellent lights, although they'll cost as much as either a G2 or Pelican M6 - you may end up using these low-power lights a LOT more than the high-power ones.

The suggestion of a Photon Freedom is a good one...but another suggestion would be to drop $20 or so on the $1.25 keychain lights sold by CPF member KevinL. These are Photon II clones, run on a pair of 2016 coin cell batteries, and they're an amazing value at that price. With a stack of them, you could attach them to zippers, collars, pull tabs - always have a light available, and they're practically disposable at that price. Plus, he often has red-LED lights in the same size.

All the best to you as you prepare to deploy - and thanks so much for your service. Take care
Dave


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## John N (Aug 10, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*



> *Balog said:*
> I'm looking for a light that could be mounted on a rifle easily, but that is also usable handheld. I've got an A-4 w/ the 1913 rails so I should be able to wangle a set of rings to hold it in place under the fore-end. Would the G2 have problems being in rings since it's made of nylon?



I don't think there would be any problem based on the material, but it brings up two thoughts. 

1) Is there an appropriate mounting solution? <font color="red">Al, can you help us on this one?</font> 

2) You may want a clickie type tail switch. That is a switch that you click-on, click-off. This would make it much more usable than trying to twist the tailcap to turn the light on or off while it is mounted to the light. Probably the most likely are the SF Z48 or Z49 tailcaps.

Obviously these two factors are importaint not only in terms of function, but in terms of budget as well.

-john


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## John N (Aug 10, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Is the Pelican M6 a bi-pin bulb?

-john


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## Paul_in_Maryland (Aug 10, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Fellas, should he bite the bullet and go straight to a light or two that use rechargeable lithium-ion cells? That way, he won't have to stress over the cost of using the light. On the other hand, runtime is shorter, and his choice of lights more limited.

There are two approaches to use lithium ions in a xenon light:
Use two large "Pila type" 3.7V rechargeables (150A, 150S, 168A, or 168S) instead of three 3V 123A cells. Runtime will stay about the same, but you'll have fewer lumens.
or:
Use two small 3.7V rechargable 123A cells (RCR123A) in place of three 3V 123A cells, or three 3.7 cells instead of four 3V cells, using a 3-cell lamp in a 2-cell body or a 4-cell lamp in a 3-cell body. Think of it as a poor man's Surefire M3. 

The power-to-size ratio from using the second approach can be phonomenal. For example, take a 227-lumen G&P 12V high-pressure bulb from Digilightusa.com) (which claims 80 or 90 minutes of runtime!), place it in a 3-cell body that uses a Surefire-compatible head, and you have 227 lumens for 30 minutes in a body as short as 6 inches (Wolf Eyes 6T handheld) or 6.5 inches (Wolf Eyes 6H for guns).

Or knock off an inch, use a G&P high pressure 9V lamp, and "settle" for 175 lumens for 30 minutes, using 3 RC123A cells in a 2-cell body.

I love my Pelican M6 dearly, but it's currently my only light that can't use RC123A cells, and that limitation is gnawing at me.


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## matthewdanger (Aug 10, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

FYI The Surefire Z48 clickie will work on the Pelican M6.


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## John N (Aug 10, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*



> *Paul_in_Maryland said:*
> Fellas, should he bite the bullet and go straight to a light or two that use rechargeable lithium-ion cells?



It isn't clear this would be practical in John's operational situation. Certainly adding the cost of lithium-ion cells and charger would be a problem in the budget department.

-john


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## bwaites (Aug 10, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

There is a weapon mount for the Pelican M6.

As I said, my brother in law carried one for more than a year mounted on his M4. No lamp failures, no problems.

Some of the Streamlights in his group broke, including a couple TL-3's, but I suspect it is a much an issue of abuse as a Streamlight problem. My brother in law is also a mechanic, but with an infantry unit, so he did carry his weapon. 

He carried an A2, Inova X5T red, and the Pelican Gun mount.

Bill


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## John N (Aug 10, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

The reason I asked if it is a bi-pin, is I've had problems with my Streamlight Scorpions. The bi-pin works itself loose. I don't know if the M6 has this problem, but it has scared me off of bi-pins for rough use.

That said, the tape switch for the M6 sounds like a very nice option. I would assume you could get one for the G2/6P, but my guess is they would be more expensive.

We should also try to get John very specific information. It doesn't look like he has much time to get everything together.

Seems like we need:

1) Link for weapons mount for Pelican M6.
2) Link for weapons mount for SF G2 (if exists).
3) Link for tape switch for G2/6P.

-john


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## KevinL (Aug 10, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

You definitely don't want to blow your entire budget on the main (bright) light, you'll want to pick up something else that will help you during all those moments where you don't need to blind others or yourself by accident from reflections. Moments like when you're digging in your bag, when lights are out, and such. 

I recommend the Infinity Ultra as well, $15 from Batterystation.com (tell them you're from CPF and where you're headed, they really make an effort to support those defending the cause of freedom). This light runs forever on one AA cell, so you needn't feel bad about using it, AA's are one of the easiest cells to come by, and it helps you conserve the batteries on your G2 so that it WILL be there to blind when you need it to. (and you don't owe the comm guys so many favors /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif)

FLDB (the link in my signature) has a little bit more info on what other users feel about these lights. 


Homebrew hacked-together lights may not provide the mission critical reliability that someone in his situation may require. Even if lithium ions were a consideration I'd prefer to recommend something that's been professionally put together and tested. Put it this way: large companies like Surefire have infinitely more resources than even full time modders to do extensive abuse testing of their setups. PK is company-sponsored to throw a Beast around like a baseball to prove that the HID capsule won't pop under extreme conditions, how many of us can claim the same? 

I also recommend the SF 9P over the 6P. Trust me, it's a big difference between the two. My sig was inspired by the difference, life really begins at 100 lumens - the beam is so much brighter than 65 lumens. Plus, if you're using it for short bursts, it eating 3 batteries instead of 2 is not so painful. 

Relative efficiencies: 

6P with P60 : 65 lumens x 60 minutes = 3900 lumen-minutes
6P with P61 : 120 lumens x 20 minutes = 2400 lumen-minutes
9P with P90 : 105 lumens x 60 minutes = 6300 lumen-minutes
9P with P91 : 200 lumens x 20 minutes = 4000 lumen-minutes

Divided by their cells:
6P/P60 with 2 cells : 1950 L-M per cell
6P/P61 with 2 cells : 1200 L-M per cell
9P/P90 with 3 cells : 2100 L-M per cell
9P/P91 with 3 cells : 1333 L-M per cell

As you can see the 9P/P90 combination wins hands down no matter which way you count efficiency. In this kind of situation you really need ALL the light you can get.


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## John N (Aug 10, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Kevin, agree on the Infinity Ultra. Perhaps one in red?

I think if you double check John's posts, it looks like the 9P would blow his whole budget. It doesn't leave any room for alternate switches, spare bulbs, mounting brackets, etc.

-john


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## Paul_in_Maryland (Aug 10, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Kevin,
I LOVE analyses like yours! You've made the numbers meaningful. Thanks.

I believe that, unlike the 6P, the 9P still uses a Lexan lens. Is this correct? If it's glass, immediately fit it with a G&P high-pressure 9V lamp assembly (175 lumens for 80 minutes, $20 from Digilightusa.com):

9P with Digilight DRB-9VHP: 175 lumens x 80 minutes = 14,000 lumen-minutes

Divided by its cells:
9P/DRB-9VHP with 3 cells : 4,667 L-M per cell


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## matthewdanger (Aug 10, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

The new 9P has Pyrex.


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## John N (Aug 10, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*



> *Paul_in_Maryland said:*
> If it's glass, immediately fit it with a G&P high-pressure 9V lamp assembly (175 lumens for 80 minutes, $20 from Digilightusa.com):



I'm not familiar with the lamp assembly in question, and I know you mean well Paul, but for reliability it seems that putting an aftermarket lamp assembly in (or running alternate batteries) increases risk of a failure. The various SF lights have a good track record when tested as a system (light + lamp + batteries) in hard use conditions. Change a variable and you no longer have the benefit of that track record. It might be fine, it might not. For you and me, this is a perfectly fine risk to take. For John, I suspect it would be better to stick to a more proven configuration.

-john


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## watt4 (Aug 10, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

has anyone mentioned a brinkmann maxfire? (seen at walmart and target)


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## cheapo (Aug 10, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

I think you should get the tan G2 with the 3w drop-in.... better battery life than the G2, and nice beam-quality. Oh, and its bright too.

-David


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## DaveT (Aug 10, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Balog - you'll find we CPFers have lots of great ideas on how to spend other peoples' money. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
As an addition to the stack of stuff I was recommending earlier, I'd add that you might want to have a Pelican case loaded with spare CR123 batteries in your pack. Solid protection, won't let them get wet or rattle around, with the potential for shorting out/causing a fire.
http://www.batterystation.com/cpf.htm has the Pelican 1010 box with 15 CR123s for $25, or, if you have the room, the Otter 3000 box with 32 batteries for $50. 

Going back to the Pelican M6 - there's an aftermarket swapout that lets you convert it to being a clickie tailcap instead of a momentary. Calls for a lot of elbow grease, but works nicely. (I bought both of my PM6s used, with the clickies already installed).

If I still had one here, I'd send it to you as a sort of "one person passaround" to let you test-drive it before you buy.
May I suggest a few CPFers give this a try? If you've got an example of one or two of the lights that have come up repeatedly on the thread - especially if it's one you don't use daily and wouldn't miss for a little while - maybe you could PM Balog and offer him the chance to try it for a week and send it back to you? 
This might make his decision a lot easier - in the course of a week or so he could try out a half dozen lights or so, get his hands-on feeling for them, and KNOW which ones he wants.
To start the ball rolling, I can lend him some of the smaller lights I have - an Infinity Ultra, an Arc AAA and a KevinL Photon2 clone.
Balog, PM sent!
Dave


----------



## John N (Aug 10, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*



> *DaveT said:*
> If I still had one here, I'd send it to you as a sort of "one person passaround" to let you test-drive it before you buy.
> May I suggest a few CPFers give this a try? If you've got an example of one or two of the lights that have come up repeatedly on the thread - especially if it's one you don't use daily and wouldn't miss for a little while - maybe you could PM Balog and offer him the chance to try it for a week and send it back to you?



Great idea, but keep in mind he only has about two weeks before he ships out.

-john


----------



## bwaites (Aug 10, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

How about this--Let's just suck it up. Lets quit making suggestions and start making things happen like people on CPF always have!

Lets PP a little money each to BatteryStation and get some progress going. 

If everyone here on this thread chipped in just $5 we'd have a PM6 with tape switch, cells, a small light, etc.

I'll start the ball rolling by sending a small contribution to BatteryStation as soon as he says it is OK, (I emailed him asking permission to set this up).

In addition, I have a 2 stage Nuwai Q3 that I will throw in the pot by sending it to John if he will PM me his address. It's a long way from a weapon light, but it is a great general use light that is tiny and only takes 1 cell.

Bill


----------



## John N (Aug 10, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*



> *bwaites said:*
> How about this--Let's just suck it up. Lets quit making suggestions and start making things happen like people on CPF always have!



Agreed. Note he is only going to be at his current address until the 19th.

I just mailed John a SF G2 w/Z48, an Infinity Ultra with red LED and a few batteries. I sent it via USPS Priority, hopefully it will get to him in time and in one piece. 

Someone can get him a M6 if they like. Worst case he can give the one he likes least to a buddy.

Thoughts on what he might still need:

1) spares carrier
2) spare lamp assembly or spare light
3) weapons mount

-john


----------



## matthewdanger (Aug 10, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Bwaites,

I'm in for $5, let me know when you have the OK.


----------



## BentHeadTX (Aug 10, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

John Handley,
Keep your head down! As a USAF medical person, weapon lights are not my in my deployment crate but other lights are. Went there twice so far and have a few thoughts.
A small single cell AA or AAA LED light works well for walking around, getting up and running 200 meters to the bathroom in the middle of the night and reading. I have used Peak Matterhorn 3 LED lights (AAA cell) Peak AA lights, Arc AAA and AA lights with great results. Mine were on a dog tag lanyard around my neck and worked through many months of showers, midnight bathroom runs and countless miles of roaming around. 
Another light that worked well for spotting things at 100 meters and (with head removed) an amazing flood light for stacking sandbags, playing cards and maintaining oxygen machines. It is a 2D Mag with a voltage regulator pushing a high output (R2H bin) Luxeon LED. It produces around 70 lumens or so and runs for 8 hours on two 11,000 mAH rechargable D cells. 
If you would like, I can send my light from my APO to your APO and let me know if you want the rechargable D cells with it. The only downside about the light is I have my name and USAF EMEDS with a medical symbol engraved on the barrel. 
I could also ship it to a friend/family member of yours so they could ship it to you when you have your new address. All I ask is to have you ship it back when you are done and scratch your unit name in the barrel. 
Let me know if you want the 2D Mag modified with the 70 lumen LED. If not, stay safe and may your only visit to a USAF hospital be to pick up a cup of coffee (Army coffee sucks... they liked ours better)


----------



## bwaites (Aug 10, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Kevin at BatteryStation has jumped on board with an email back to me.

John, if you will PM me your address, we'll get stuff going. 

John N and Benthead,

You're typical CPF'rs, thanks for jumping in and getting something done!!

I'll let you know how Kevin wants us to send money.

Bill


----------



## bwaites (Aug 10, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Kevin says that we can PayPal BatteryStation and just designate it as "For the troops" and it will go in the right fund. Just make sure you DON'T put anything like Hellfire on it and he will channel it correctly.

He will kick some money in from the raffle funds as well.

Lets go CPF'rs step it up!

My PP sent!

Bill


----------



## Balog (Aug 10, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

I'm just overwhelmed by this. Many thanks to all involved for their generosity.

The money this will save me allows me to purchase other important gear like Kevlar/Nomex gloves to protect my hands, Walker's Game Ears to both preserve my hearing _and_ let me hear the BG's etc. 

I'll try to keep ya'll updated while I'm in-country, either by directly logging on or thru my wife. A thousand thanks.

Edit: oops, just looked up game ears and they're all over a hundred. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/blush.gif Oh well, I can still get my gloves. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif


----------



## Reptilezs (Aug 10, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

might wanna try somthing like this for a cheaper alternative to the game ears http://shop.store.yahoo.com/earplugstore/aosinranplug.html


----------



## Reaper (Aug 10, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Just sent him a couple of lights and some batteries. Hope he gets it before he ships out. Not the higher powered lights but lights he can hopefully make good use of while in barracks at night.


----------



## Balog (Aug 10, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Reptilezs: I was issued a set of those. Good piece of kit.
I got a pair of SSI's that are supposed to function like the Game Ears. We'll see how they work.


----------



## John N (Aug 10, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*



> *Reaper said:*
> Just sent him a couple of lights



You tryin' to keep us in suspense?! Spill it!

(Besides, others will want to know what is already sent so they don't duplicate)

-john


----------



## Reaper (Aug 10, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Almost embarrassed to say. I didn't have any really bright lights to send so I sent him two lights THAT might be useful for him at night in camp. One is a Brinkmann 3 x AA that has an Opalec bulb in it and then one of those 8 led 2 x AA's that was sold here by Haveblue? I installed both with Battery Station Lithium's and also included a few packs of AA's just in case. I thought about my MadMax minimag but my son has that and my KL3 with the 3x123 UBH would definately be too large and cumbersome. Everything else that I have is already parcelled out so ------ ? I do hope he can find some use for them. Kinda embarrassing isn't it?


----------



## bwaites (Aug 10, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Not embarrassing at all!

Those are great additions.

Bill


----------



## marcspar (Aug 11, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Paypal sent to Kevin. Thanks for the heads-up, Bill.

Marc


----------



## John N (Aug 11, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Absolutely not. The Opalec Newbeam is a very nice task light. Not super cheap either. Absolute flat regulated output for 10 hrs with a 2xAA configuration. Not sure about 3xAA, I didn't know it supported it, but must be even better. 

Not familiar with the other options, but certainly cool beans.

-john


----------



## Balog (Aug 11, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Reaper: trust me, those will be wonderful. Do you still want me to return those, or shall I consider it an "extended loan?" /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif Sorry, but I can't remember if you were the fellow who wanted his stuff back or not.


----------



## Reaper (Aug 11, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Consider it an "extended loan". Better you use them than for me to keep them in a drawer and have them gather dust. In fact, if they still work when you rotate home- you can just pass them along if someone else has a need. BTW, don't forget that the head is glued solid so trying to turn it will do nothing.

John N, 
I believe that the Brinkmann gave me around 16hrs with alkalines before the red bulb lit up. I never tested it with lithiums before and wouldn't you know it - that's what I just put in.

If you're worried about burning out the led's with the lithiums, just replace them with the alkalines in the package.


----------



## Balog (Aug 11, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Reaper: thanks, I understand where you're coming from. Good to know the head is glued, woulda looked silly tring to turn the darn thing, /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/yellowlaugh.gif


----------



## John N (Aug 11, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*



> *Reaper said:*
> John N,
> I believe that the Brinkmann gave me around 16hrs with alkalines before the red bulb lit up. I never tested it with lithiums before and wouldn't you know it - that's what I just put in.



Ok, here is what I've been able to find out about lithiums and the Newbeam:

From Opalec's web site:



> Q: Can the NewBeam be used with lithium batteries? Will that make it brighter?
> A: The NewBeam can be used with 1.5 Volt lithium batteries (Energizer 91, etc) since these have the same voltage as regular alkalines. The long storage life and high capacity of these makes them attractive for emergency light use, caving, etc. The brightness will be the same as with alkaline batteries. We do not recommend the use of higher voltage lithium batteries (see NewBeam voltage range FAQ below).





> *The maximum voltage capability of the NewBeam has changed. We now build the NewBeam with either of two control circuits, which have different voltage ranges. One version will operate up to 8-9 Volts, although the LED current regulation begins to degrade above about 6 Volts. The other version only operates up to a little over 5 Volts, and then draws excessive current above about 6 Volts and will be damaged. You can tell the two apart by looking with a magnifier at the parts under the clear epoxy. If you see a rectangular silver colored part labeled “1B”, you have the version which works above 5 volts. If you do not see this part, you have the lower voltage version. Again please be aware that we do not encourage use of the NewBeam above the standard 2 x 1.5 volts. If you want to do custom work, please keep these limitations in mind.



I also noted you indicated you sent Battery Station lithium AAs. Here are a couple links of interest:

YIKES!!! Battery Station Lithium AAs 1.9v !

Battery Station AA-Lithiums (Dazed and Confused)
(Note, a regulated light like the Newbeam makes it optimal for ironing out that weird little voltage dip at the begning of the BS Li AA, as long as you don't go over voltage of the light.)

So, here is my take on it:

Energizer L91 Lithium AA: 3 x 1.7V = 5.1V. It sounds like this is boarderline on the old style Newbeam, but just peachy on the new style. Check the quote listed above to determine if it is old or new style.

Battery Station Lithium AA: 3 x 1.9V = 5.7V. I'd call this a no-go in the old style Newbeam, but sounds like it should be OK in the new style.

I don't know if the glued head means you can't remove the Newbeam module from the light, but if not, you might consider taking it out of the Brinkmann and putting it in a 2xAA Mini Maglite.

Energizer L91 Lithium AA: 2 x 1.7V = 3.4V
Battery Station Lithium AA: 2 x 1.9V = 3.8V

So, in a 2xAA configuration, the Newbeam should happly eat pretty much any type of battery you can throw at it, regardless if it is a new or old style. Oh, and it would be smaller, which might be good too.

-john


----------



## 3rd_shift (Aug 11, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Check your local www.biglots.com for any Foresight branded 3xcr123'ed lights.
These are usually in a plain white box.
Go look in the reviews forum for one I reviewed.
It was only 7.99, all aluminum body, very bright incan bulb, 3 cr123 batteries included.
And remember that one flashlight is never enough.
Take a few to several.

If you can't find any, I can send over a couple, plus postage if that would help.

An led modded maglite may also be a very good idea.
Myself and several others here make those.


----------



## Outrider (Aug 11, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Hi Balog! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink2.gif Welcome to CPF. If you will PM me with your mailing address I have 4 of the Countycomm.com keychain
lights, 2 white and 2 blue for you. These are great little lights. They weigh nothing, clip darn near anywhere and will
not affect your night vision. I wish you God Speed and safe return. (Always "check six")


----------



## matthewdanger (Aug 11, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Paypal sent to BatteryStation. I'm glad to see things getting done.

I think that Opalec will serve you well. They are great little units and if you wear out the Brinkman you can drop it in a readily available 2AA Mag host.


----------



## Reaper (Aug 11, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Now you got me thinking about those lithiums. Should be ok but you never know. Sure would hate you to receive the lights then have them burn out and unusable. To be on the safe side, you could replace them with the regular alkalines included.


----------



## js (Aug 11, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

[ QUOTE ]
*bwaites said:*
Kevin says that we can PayPal BatteryStation and just designate it as "For the troops" and it will go in the right fund. Just make sure you DON'T put anything like Hellfire on it and he will channel it correctly.

He will kick some money in from the raffle funds as well.

Lets go CPF'rs step it up!

My PP sent!

Bill 

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm in for $15 donation to this worthy cause. What exactly is the paypal address? Would someone post it explicitly please?

Bill, isn't that just like you, a nice balance of action and talk. What's wrong with you? Don't you know you should be all talk and no action, 'cause talk is cheap. It's the thrifty thing to do. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/nana.gif But then again, I just paid $300 for a haunted potato chip, so what do I know? BTW, when are you going to send me my haunted potato chip?


----------



## bwaites (Aug 11, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

js,

The Haunted Potato Chip must be properly packaged in the appropriate shock resistant packaging to arrive without structural damage which would impinge upon its hauntedness!!

That packaging, with the attendant appropriate "haunting proofness" so the haunting eminence does not escape, is difficult to come by and in turn require special packaging to be sent to me. When it arrives, I shall forward on the aforementioned Haunted Potato Chip!

Back to topic.

This is shaping up nicely, I had hoped for a few more donations to BatteryStations address: 

[email protected]

Bill


----------



## marcspar (Aug 11, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

I sent mine to [email protected] I hope that will work ok.....

Marc


----------



## Wolfen (Aug 11, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

I'm sending 15 bucks also. I'll make sure Kevin throws in a Pelican M6 remote pressure switch. It will fit the G2 and the PM6.

According to a marine friend of mine the PM6 is a good combat light. A forum member donated some and they arrived in time for the second battle for Fallujah where they were used to good effect.


----------



## bwaites (Aug 11, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

I suspecy it will, but a quick email to Keviv to doublecheck might help.

Bill


----------



## Wolfen (Aug 11, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Pelican 630 gun mount I e-mailed Kevin to see if he can get this. 

Balog, keep in touch so we can send a care package or two!


----------



## Wolfen (Aug 11, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Balog, Kevin at Battery Station needs your shipping address.
Also the Pelican gun mount is taken care of.

[email protected]


----------



## John N (Aug 11, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*



> *Wolfen said:*
> Also the Pelican gun mount is taken care of.



Outstanding. Can someone post the specific make and model of the gun mount?

-john


----------



## DaveT (Aug 11, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

OK, I just sent him an Arc AAA, Infinity Ultra, and a Photon II to check out.
Dave


----------



## Wolfen (Aug 11, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

JohnN; the Pelican gun mount link is in one of my posts above. 

DaveT; Kevin at Battery Station needs a good address for Balog / John Handley.


----------



## js (Aug 11, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

[ QUOTE ]
*bwaites said:*
js,

The Haunted Potato Chip must be properly packaged in the appropriate shock resistant packaging to arrive without structural damage which would impinge upon its hauntedness!!

That packaging, with the attendant appropriate "haunting proofness" so the haunting eminence does not escape, is difficult to come by and in turn require special packaging to be sent to me. When it arrives, I shall forward on the aforementioned Haunted Potato Chip!

[/ QUOTE ]

Bill,

I just had a horrible thought! What if the haunting eminence *does* escape? What then? I'd have only a garden variety lays potato chip! *gasp* Can I add insurance against loss of the haunting eminence? And how much extra would that cost?


----------



## Codeman (Aug 11, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

I'm in!

/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/paypal.gif

Does all this talk about haunting eminence and such mean your next project will be a hauntwire? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/nana.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crackup.gif


----------



## Balog (Aug 11, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Just sent my address to info(at)batterystation.com,
Lemme know if he doesn't get it.


----------



## js (Aug 11, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

OK. paypal sent.


----------



## Wolfen (Aug 11, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Kevin is going to ship a box of goodies Tuesday. So there is still time if anyone else wants to make a contribution.

Kevin's paypal is [email protected]


----------



## John N (Aug 12, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*



> *Wolfen said:*
> JohnN; the Pelican gun mount link is in one of my posts above.



Oops. I had missed it.

Thanks,

-john


----------



## Balog (Aug 12, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

I've been e-mailing w/ Kevin from batterystation. What a great guy! 
Is there any problem with me spreading the news of ya'lls good deeds across the Internet? Like I said I'm a regular on another forum, and I'd love to tell them how great this board has been.


----------



## bwaites (Aug 12, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

I have no problem with that, though it might deluge us with people looking for handouts!!

We tend to support those who make the effort to find out more on their own, like you did!! 

We hope for more enthusiasts! 

Please pick the lights you use, then share the rest with your not so fortunate buddies!!

Bill


----------



## Balog (Aug 12, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Hmmm, hadn't thought about the "floods of people wanting handouts" angle. May be a poor idea.


----------



## Balog (Aug 13, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Just got a package from John N. My first reaction to a SF G-2?

*Sweet merciful crap that's bright!!!*

Now, I'll admit I've been an unwitting flashlight Luddite. My only experience has been w/ Maglites. I've read the lumen ratings; I've even seen the beamshots, but I was _completely_ unprepared for this level of light in such a light and compact package. Good stuff. Makes me lust after that 951 lumen modded Maglite a fellow is selling over on The High Road. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/ooo.gif I think I may have found something just as interesting as guns and knives. 

Thanks again, altho I've got a feeling this could be expense when I get back from Iraq. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif


----------



## BentHeadTX (Aug 13, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Balog,
I will be shipping you my 2D Mag that has been modified with (approx) 70 lumen LED (R2H Luxeon driven by Madmax+ regulator) It makes a great search light with the head on, a wonderful white flood light with head removed. 
Did you want me to send the Powerex 11,000 mAH NiMH rechargable D cells with the light? Not sure if you have a way to recharge them but they last about 8 hours on a charge. Alkalines run around 10 hours so it would prevent you from needlessly burning up your lithiums. 
The USAF EMEDS engraving should cause some amusement with your Marine buddies.


----------



## Hoghead (Aug 13, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

[ QUOTE ]
*Balog said:*
I think I may have found something just as interesting as guns and knives. 


[/ QUOTE ]

Yea, guns, knives, lights. You fit right in here. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grinser2.gif


----------



## bwaites (Aug 13, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Balog,

The Nuwai Q3 with 2 stage tailcap is on its way, Priority mail to AZ. 

You should have it no later than Wednesday, and I suspect Tuesday.

Bill


----------



## jeffb (Aug 13, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Just found this thread and sent contribution;

Balog,

Thank You for serving.............very best wishes.

jeffb


----------



## Wolfen (Aug 13, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Balog,
With some help from people here you can make one of those high output mag lites. Either LED or hot wire.
Make a good project for you when you are deployed.


----------



## Deanster (Aug 13, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

$50 to the BatteryStation Marine Flashlight Fund

I'm trying to see my way clear to parting with my beloved Z3w/ HOLA... I don't use it much, but I really like it. 

A door-kicker needs it much more than I do. 

OK - I'm in for my Surefire Z3. 

Balrog - please send me your address.


----------



## John N (Aug 13, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Geez, a Z3! 

Well John, you thought the G2 was bright... I can see that G2 is destined for one of your buddies! 

Deanster, you rock! 

-john


----------



## bwaites (Aug 13, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Deanster,

That's awesome!

Bill


----------



## Balog (Aug 14, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Deanster: you've got PM's disabled so I e-mailed you. PLease let me know if you get it ok.

Quick question; Surefire lists the Z3 as a 9v combatlight, but I can't seem to find its specs? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif Could someone please point me in the right direction re what to expect from the light?


----------



## John N (Aug 14, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

I think the lamp outputs will be the same as the SF C3.



> the C3 Centurion® produces 105 lumens output for 60 minutes, or 200 lumens (up to 13 times brighter than a two D-cell flashlight) for 20 minutes using an optional ultra high output lamp.



I think Deanster said his Z3 is equipped with the high output lamp assembly. The G2 I sent you has the P60, "low output" lamp assembly which makes 65 lumens.

And the Z3 is aluminum instead of Nitrolon.

-john


----------



## Deanster (Aug 14, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Hi John - got your mail - it'll ship Monday, Tuesday latest. 

The Z-series got pulled from Surefire's line last year (2 years ago?), as the D, Z, and C series were all very similar, and they simplified the line down to the C-series only. The performance specs are effectively identical to the current C-series detailed here http://www.surefire.com/maxexp/main/co_disp/displ/prrfnbr/894/sesent/00#

The only significant differences are the non-HAIII anodizing, so it's not quite as tough-skinned, a Lexan lens (less likely to break, more likely to melt, especially if you leave it standing on the bezel with it running), and a slightly narrower body. It's also a hair lighter than the C3, but not enough to really notice. Finally, as a 'Combat Light', it comes with a decent lanyard. 

I'm sending it with a fresh set of Surefire 123 batteries, a P90 Low-Output Lamp Assembly (LOLA - 105 Lumens/60 min runtime), and a P91 High-Output Lamp Assembly (HOLA - 200 Lumens/20 min runtime). I don't know how available these are in Iraq - if anyone else has one of either LA sitting around, it'd be a good add-on. 

In my experience, the Z3 w/LOLA is a VERY bright light, and will do nicely for nearly any general 'bright-light needed' use. 

The Z3 w/HOLA on fresh batteries is crazy bright for a six ounce light. However, it's so bright, and the battery life so short, that it's really best for specialized uses (door-kicking in Iraq would be high on this list...). Watch out for mirrors, shiny surfaces, or light-colored walls - the reflection or splash will blind you just as well as anyone else. 

Enjoy!


----------



## John N (Aug 14, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Oh, John, keep in mind the Z48 I sent you should fit the Z3. 

I'm not sure the Z3 tailcap will work on the G2 tho, so you might have to put the G2 tailcap back on the G2. If you do that and give it to a buddy, warn them about the tailcap comming apart when they change batteries (play with it and you'll see what I mean). Also, because of this, the G2 tailcap isn't waterproof. Newer G2s come with a LOTC which is much better, but the one I sent you is the older style since I figured you'd use the Z48 anyway.

-john


----------



## Deanster (Aug 14, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Yep, it'll fit, and clicky is nice....


----------



## John N (Aug 14, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Deanster,

BTW, if you are looking for a light to replace the Z3, I noticed a M3-CB at a local sporting good store the other day. I'm not into the whole CB thing, but man it was a beautiful light. The CB isn't actually very pronounced, so the main difference is the head is much more shapely. If you get a chance to see one in person check it out.

-john


----------



## Paul_in_Maryland (Aug 14, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

[ QUOTE ]
*John N said:*
Oh, John, keep in mind the Z48 I sent you should fit the Z3. 
-john 

[/ QUOTE ]
That's no ordinary tailcap. Lest anyone forget, the Z48 sells for $32 to $40 online.


----------



## Deanster (Aug 14, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Thanks, John N - I'm generally against the CB's, but the M3's is nicer than average. 

that said, I think I'm... acceptably covered... for lights at the moment, even with the Z3 sent out to play. Thanks for putting in the Z48 - amazing that a tailcap is worth nearly 1/2 the price of a whole light, and more than a lamp assembly. I just don't get Surefire's pricing some days. 

Thanks again to all who have chimed in on this - I've had a soft spot for Marines ever since I worked in a US Embassy - some mighty fine folks there. 

Anyone have thoughts about 'adopting' this unit? While I think the Hellfire squadron has been an excellent recipient, perhaps it's time to move on and support some guys a little closer to the cutting edge?


----------



## bwaites (Aug 15, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Deanster,

I would agree, we've been with the Hellfire guys for nearly 2 years. A Marine unit or an Army infantry unit would be appropriate, I think.

Bill


----------



## Wolfen (Aug 15, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Adding a Marine Unit and an Army unit would be a superb idea. CPF member Weaponlight is in the Army and is stationed in Iraq.  He has passed out lights and equipment that I have sent him. I'm sure his men would appreciate anything else sent their way. I was going to send care packages to Balog once he gets deployed. A group effort would be make it easier for everyone.


----------



## bwaites (Aug 15, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

I'll email Kevin at BatteryStation and see if he would consider keeping the books for these also.

Bill


----------



## bwaites (Aug 16, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

js,

The haunted potato chip is packaged in the appropriate escape proof packaging and will be on it's way tomorrow!

This packaging is double layered, metallic coated and is guaranteed to stop any hauntedness from escaping while protecting the fragility of the potato chip! 

This particular haunted chip has rather unique, fairly well focused illuminance and should be just what you're looking for. 

Should it not be, please notify me immediately.

Bill


----------



## Blades (Aug 16, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Does anyone have a NSN(if they have one??) for the Surefire lights?? Maybe that would help also.
Just an idea.



Blades


----------



## matthewdanger (Aug 16, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

[ QUOTE ]
*Blades said:*
Does anyone have a NSN(if they have one??) for the Surefire lights?? Maybe that would help also.
Just an idea.



Blades 

[/ QUOTE ]

Surefire NSN ordering


----------



## Blades (Aug 16, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

That was quick!!
/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif



Blades


----------



## matthewdanger (Aug 16, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Ask and ye shall receive. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif


----------



## Balog (Aug 16, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Been busy the last coupla days. Received several packages, but there is a problem.

One of them (padded manilla envelope) is stamped "Received without contents." Obviously someone stole the contents at some point, but I'm trying to figure if it was a flashlight or an ASP baton someone from another board was sending to me.I don't want to post the return address, but it was from CA, zip code 92610. If that was from anyone here please let me know.

I'll update about what else I've received later, gotta run for now.


----------



## bwaites (Aug 16, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Now that truly is beyond the pale!

To steal from the mail like that is true BS!!

Sorry about that Balog!!

Bill


----------



## daloosh (Aug 16, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

That sucks, man. 
Donation sent to Kevin today. 
Stay safe balog, and welcome to CPF, why dontcha stay awhile!
daloosh


----------



## Reaper (Aug 17, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Well s***, that ticks me off.

Balog, that was the package I sent you. The one with 1 Brinkmann 3xAA with Opalec and one other led light plus batteries.


----------



## matthewdanger (Aug 17, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

That is terrible! Is there any recourse with the USPS?


----------



## bwaites (Aug 17, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Only if it was insured!

bill


----------



## Reaper (Aug 17, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

I don't know but I'm going to find out. I've been through this once before years ago and it was not a picnic waiting for them to do their thing. The whole light and batteries package is/was not of any value or use to me (since they were not being used) but they could have been to Balog or passed on to another. Maybe I should have put them in a steel box and wrapped in barb wire.


----------



## matthewdanger (Aug 17, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

[ QUOTE ]
*Reaper said:*
I don't know but I'm going to find out. I've been through this once before years ago and it was not a picnic waiting for them to do their thing. The whole light and batteries package is/was not of any value or use to me (since they were not being used) but they could have been to Balog or passed on to another. Maybe I should have put them in a steel box and wrapped in barb wire. 

[/ QUOTE ]

Then they would have confiscated it as a 'suspicious package.' /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/icon15.gif


----------



## bwaites (Aug 18, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

John,

Could you please post as you receive items so we know what has arrived?

Bill


----------



## Balog (Aug 18, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Sorry I haven't been posting, busy busy busy.

I've got packages from; bwaites, BatteryStation, DieselDave, the Reaper's (empty /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif ), DaveT, JohnN, and outrider. 

Still waiting on Deanster's and Benthead's. Should be coming in today.

Ok, inventory time! 2 SF G-2's w/ 1 clickie tailcap, 1 Gerber red LED, 1 Pelican M6 LED w/ tape switch and gun mount, 1 Blaster Jr from ElektroLumens and two battery holders (altho one is damaged, I think it'll still work), 2 yellow Infinity's (1 marked CMG, 1 not. And the battery goes in different ways in each light), a GP-4L radio w/ LED, a Gerber 3 LED w/ AAx2 (altho it was NIB the damn thing doesn't work /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif), Nuwai 3 watt, Princeton Tech Rage, 6 Photon style keychain lights (2 blue, 2 yellow, 2 white), and an Arc AAA plus a variety of batteries and containers. 

So far the Pelican and Arc are my favorites. The Pelican isn't as brights as the G-2's, but it's hella bright for an LED. And I just love that Arc; not sure why, but it's just a nifty little light.


----------



## bwaites (Aug 18, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

The Nuwai is a two stage tailswitch, Push on, Push off, Push on for bright.

Well, looks like your ready to go!!

Bill


----------



## matthewdanger (Aug 18, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Is the the 1W or 3W Pelican?


----------



## bwaites (Aug 18, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

3Watt from what Kevin told me, I wonder if it is HAIII?

Bill


----------



## Wolfen (Aug 18, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

The Pelican gun mount and remote pressure switch will (should) work with the Surefire G2. You might want to consider getting a filter or cover for the G2 and / or PM6.

Surefire Accessories


----------



## Balog (Aug 18, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

The box for the Pelican says it's one watt.

I was a bit confused at first about the Nuwai tailcap, but I see how it works. Cool.


----------



## matthewdanger (Aug 19, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Balog, is it black/silver or a greenish grey color?


----------



## Balog (Aug 19, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Mathewdanger: I assume you're talking about the Pelican? It's black.


----------



## turbodog (Aug 19, 2005)

It seems like every other day someone is asking about lights for iraq deployment.

I think we could use a sticky that details different kinds of lights in each class (aa/aaa/123) that are iraq approved (withstand heat/SAND/etc). It would also deal with battery availability and which departments can get EASY access to different types of cells.

What do the admins think of this?


----------



## ob1 (Aug 19, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Balog, good luck and keep your head down. Those IEDs can be a *****. I'm out here in Iraq now. I found this thread late, but read through it and it looks like you have all the lights you need. =) take care

I'm a signal/commo guy out here in Iraq so I have access to all the cr123a batteries my lights need =)


----------



## Geologist (Aug 19, 2005)

*Re: IRAQ lights - sticky???*

I agree! Perhaps a very SHORT FAQ and a list what is most likely going to be the top choices for avg servicemember based on usage, price, and availability.
I'll help!


----------



## dano (Aug 19, 2005)

*Re: IRAQ lights - sticky???*

Okie Dokie...So it's done...But I changed the title, for more appropriateness...

-dan


----------



## turbodog (Aug 19, 2005)

*Re: IRAQ lights - sticky???*

excellent, thanks Dano

--------------------------------------
Ok, If you guys will start posting suggested lights, I will keep this post updated so all the info stays on page 1.
--------------------------------------
Here's the "official" Iraq/Sandbox recommended light list.
--------------------------------------


I'm just gonna throw some stuff in here from memory/etc.

Most of these lights are available from www.brightguy.com or www.batterystation.com
Batterystation has a CPF discount at this time. You can also check the B/S/T threads.

AA lights:

1. infinity ultra - single led, regulated for long runtime, runs from single aa battery, lanyard hole, approx $15, hours of runtime, great for everyday tasks and bathroom trips, lots of good feedback on this light

2. minimag WITH a dropin module - opalec newbeam, approx $16, 10+ hours regulated runtime, low batt indicator, 3 5mm leds

123 lights:

1. Surefire g2 - nitrolon, 2 x 123 lithium cells, 60 or 120(?) lumens lamp assembly (with 60 and 20 min runtime respectively), approx $35, you need a spare lamp if you get this light

2. Pelican M6 - led light, 2 x 123 lithium cells, track record is good based on reports from the field, tape switch is available as an option, runtime is about 5 hours, 1 watt, clicky tail switch, about $65 from brightguy, 41 lumens

3. Surefire A2 - 3 5mm led, 2 x 123 batteries, 50 lumen incandescent lamp, 2 stage switch, 1 hour regulated burn time on main bulb, bulbs last a long time but you do need a spare, "double duty" light, very popular


----------



## turbodog (Aug 19, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

***************************************
****************************************

Yahoo..... hello guys

We've now got a sticky thread in the general light discussion forum for this topic.

Please venture over there and post the light that have been recommended. I will then update the main post into a sort of FAQ for this subject.

link 


********************************
*******************************


----------



## Lunal_Tic (Aug 19, 2005)

*Re: IRAQ lights - sticky???*

I've read that the Pelican M6 was well received and held up well. You can get weapon mounts and tape switches too. It also takes the Bug Out Gear 3W drop in too.

I also read here that the Streamlight Jr. Luxeon has switch problems that make it a poor choice for a bombproof light.

IIRC it was BentHeadTX and posts in the Operation Enlightenment that confirms these comments but the search function is being a pain today.

-LT


----------



## BentHeadTX (Aug 20, 2005)

*Re: IRAQ lights - sticky???*

Your right Lunal, the Streamlight Jr. Luxeon had switch failures. The guy that used it worked night shift so the light was always being used. It happily gulped NiMH rechargables and alkaline AA batteries until it died after three months. My kroll switched sandwiched minimags would kill a switch every 2 to 3 months due to wear, but I brought spare switches with me. 

For non-combat related lights, an AA/AAA single cell light works well on a lanyard. Peak, Arc and Infinity can fill your requirements depending on your needs. If you want a red blackout light or cyan for nightvision goggles, Peak will make them for you. Mine worked well the entire tour with monthly "clean the dust out of the threads" maintenance. 

Since I work on medical equipment, the Peaks give a truer color with their snow LEDs...that helps with electronics and wiring identification or when a doc borrows the light for diagnosis. 

My old Arc AA was a hit with the tailstanding capability, small size, decent output, very long runtime (12+ hours) and lightweight when running lithium AA batteries. The removable lug on Peaks work well if you need to stand the lights on end. Gerber now makes the Infinity although I never used that one.

My preferred light is 2AA format with a bright Luxeon LED. If Streamlight could make a twisty version of their new 4 hour runtime Luxeon Jr., they would have a winner. Throw a reflector in it and the standard minimag would dissappear. $30 for the light gives financial room for a few dozen lithium CR123A batteries for the weapon light. Not sure about the Longbow 2AA LED light as I have never used one. 

For weapon lights, I saw many Surefires with compliments on construction, reliability and performance. Only downside was the batteries cost and runtime. If my butt was on the line when doing nightops with a weapon light, cost would be a minor consideration. 

The minimag fits well in the loops on ceramic body armor. Throw a Terralux drop-in and thread a lanyard through the tailcap. Attach a stainless clip to the lanyard so the light will not fall off. 

For rechargable 12V vehicle/ 110/220 LED lights, the Inova T4 looks to be a winner. $75 for one at lapolicegear would give a durable light with very high output. No worries about feeding it batteries but runtime might be a concern. Mount the charger in the hummer and keep the lithium-ion battery charged for use.

As far as CR123A lithium powered lights go, take your pick of Surefire, Pelican, Peak, HDS and others to fit your needs. Check the review sites (LED Museum and flashlightreviews) ask around, keep your head down and arrive home safe.


----------



## Sigman (Aug 20, 2005)

*Re: IRAQ lights - sticky???*

What about the Gerber Recon (with the red/blue/green/white dial) or the Gerber Trio? Any practical use comments?


----------



## ob1 (Aug 20, 2005)

*Re: IRAQ lights - sticky???*

I do not own the Gerber Recon but a guy in my company does. He brought it out here to Iraq with him and I had the chance to try it out.

I was pretty disappointed by the brightness of it. My 3 LED Peak Mattrhorn totally outshined it on the white mode. I do like the idea of being able use red/blue/green all in one light, I only wish it was brighter.

The size, it is way too large to wear on 550 cord around your neck(Where I wear my EDC Peak 3 LED matterhorn)


----------



## Deanster (Aug 20, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Balog - 

I had a bit of a miscommunication with my 'shipping assistant' (wife), and she missed the urgency of the shipping date. I discovered the package in the car today, and repacked it into the USPS Priority flat-rate envelope (all I had cash on me for... stupid, really), and re-addressed it for your base address. It went out USPS Priority today. Sorry for the delay. 

Included in the package are the Z3 w/p91 HOLA and batts installed, a P90 LOLA, and a Leatherman SuperTool/MiniMag combo in a dual nylon sheath for your buddy, as discussed. 

The repack is a little flimsy - Not my usual standard. I'm hoping everything arrives OK. It's insured, though, so let me know if it arrrives in other than great shape.


----------



## weaponlight (Aug 26, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

All,

Wolfen mentioned adopting my unit, and we could use a few more lights. But if it's not too much of a thread hijack, I wanted you to know what you have done for Balog and all of us. Here is the story of one recently donated light. 

It was not that impressive to look at really, just a collection of odd mismatched parts built into a Surefire E2 style light that worked. But the light was sent on a journey to the Middle east by Wolfen in the hope that it would make a difference in the life of a young Soldier. 

The Soldier was happy to get it and quickly fabricated a lanyard, then clipped it to his armor vest. A week or so ago while a convoy was stopped on a dirt road, the Soldier dismounted from his vehicle and with a buddy used the small but bright light in quick flashes to search the ground around, and road in front of the vehicles for explosive devices.

And there one was. Revealed by the light, half buried in the road was an anti tank mine. It would have never been seen without the light, and if the convoy had not stopped, one of the vehicles would surely have run over it.

That little light made from leftover parts saved lives and is now the talk of the section.

The generosity of Wolfen and others at CPF is astonishing. Please know that a good light is a servicemember's best friend over here next to thier weapon and armor.

Those of you who donate lights, batteries and accessories to us make a real difference. From finding explosive devices, holes in perimeter fences, blinding hostile enemies, reading maps, repairing broken down vehicles, and just our way around a pitch dark porta potty, the lights you send help us evrey night of the deployment. And becouse most of the Servicemembers will deploy multiple times, the lights will keep on helping the Servicemembers.

Thanks again for all you do for us.

Weaponlight


----------



## Codeman (Aug 26, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Just tryin' to do our part! It certainly warms one's soul to hear how lives are saved.


----------



## KevinL (Aug 26, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wow.gif

It's always wonderful to hear that a simple light made so much difference in the world.


----------



## Wolfen (Aug 26, 2005)

*Re: Need help w/ light for Iraq*

Hello,
I just got back from the post office. I sent Weaponlight three lights and some candy and gum. Lights were an L2 that I took in on a trade and couldn't sell, a Lux III 3-C magmod and and a McGizmo donated 2 x cr123 body and two stage tailcap which I put a modded KL1 on top of. I have Weaponlights address and so does Kevin at BatteryStation. If anybody would like to send something contact me by PM and we can set something up. Maybe we can send a few more lights, batteries and munchies his way so he can pass them on to his people.

thanks,
Tim B.


----------



## weaponlight (Aug 31, 2005)

I have been in Iraq for about seven months now and have used lights in many diffrent situations.

I recommend this setup: A New Surefire G2 Nitrolon with lock out tailcap and Bugout Gear 3w drop in, tipoff red filter, lanyard, and Surefire spares carrier. Carry this in a SPEC OPS tactical flashlight pouch, which can be attached to an armor vest or a belt.

The 3w drop in gives good light and much longer runtime. Keep the P60 lamp in the spares carrier for use when intense light is needed or for use during dust storms and in smokey situations. The tipoff red lens preserves night vision, helps to conceal you, and prevents you from blinding yourself when reading maps, medivac cards, etc, while giving quick access to white light. 

The lanyard is a must! looped over the wrist or through a loop on the armor vest, the light can just be dropped if both hands are suddenly needed. It also helps to prevent loss and theft in general. 

If the supply of 123's is an issue, I would suggest using the rechargeable 123's and charger from the Battery Station with the 3w drop in (Which I use most of the time anyway.) I have been on many bases in Iraq and 98% of them have power. I would check if a 220-110 transformer is necessary for this. We have then on our base. Also, DO NOT use these rechargeables with the P60! it will fry. Keep some regular 123's in the spares carrier for this.

I use a similar setup for most situations here (C-2 instead of G-2) and it is extremely useful. Light, relatively small, and not too expensive for what it is capable of.


----------



## brightnorm (Sep 9, 2005)

I recall an Iraq poster stating that he found the Streamlight Scorpion unreliable. It might have been in the operation enlightenment thread.

Brightnorm


----------



## ob1 (Sep 13, 2005)

weaponlight, what FOB are you on? I haven't ran into any CPFers out here yet =)


----------



## Unicorn (Sep 24, 2005)

A Mini-Mag with LED conversion and the accessory kit with the anti-roll rubber piece that also holds the red lens in place.

OR the light by Dorcy that is the same size but has 4 LED's. Not as robust though.

A PT40 with Mag 4 cell bulbs. Just bright enough for searching people and cars. (I worked days, so it probably would have worked better at night for vehicle searches.)

A SureFire weapon light and plenty of 123's. The M200 might be bright enough for close work.

An Infinity or something similar in size and output. Easy to carry with you at all times.

For when you know that you won't need a lot of light at all, the Gerber Recon is nice. Just bright enough to read a map and root around inside a rucksack. The red isn't quite bright enough to safely walk to a porta potty though, even with pretty dark adapted eyes. At least not mine, though I do have pretty poor night sight I think.

Some AA NiMh batteries and a charger.

For vehicle ECP's that have power outlets, a good bright rechargeable light is essential for searching cars. A MagCharger, SureFire 9AN, SureFire 8AX/NX, Tigerlight, maybe Stinger HP (I wasn't impressed with the ones they had at the gate I was on though. Maybe a personally owned one that wasn't so abused.)
I used my old SF 9N and MagCharger everyday I was working for vehicle searches. The 9N, and I'm thinking the Tigerlight, was actually better because it had a nice even beam that made searching easier, especially under the car.

For the gunner position on trucks or Humvees a good spotlight, a cigarette plug adapter (with fuse) with aligator clips to attach to a single battery. Or if you (or the servicemember) knows how, it can be wired directly to the battery, but again please us a fuse. This is from an experience that one of the QRF teams had. It was a small fire when the wires were damaged and shorted out.
We also had them in all our guard towers. We first had the Galls 2 million rechargeables, but after they all started weaing out, the XO pushed and those, and the ones that QRF used were replaced with the Thor 10million ones. Nice for a guard tower, but a bit too big to use with one hand in a vehicle. The smaller 2 million ones are fine for looking for suspicious things alongside the road, warning off other cars (and seeing who's inside and what they are doing), and even shining in windows to distract the occupants when another team is entering. Assmuing you don't want to just shoot the place up for whatever reason.


----------



## BentHeadTX (Sep 24, 2005)

I have been throwing around, dropping in water and using my Peak Mediterranean with 2AA body option for the last 6 weeks. It replaces my minimag BB500 R2H modded lights and works very well. It can be operated with a Kroll clickie switch or with the plug piece in place of the Kroll, can be operated as a twistie switch for better reliability and water/dust proofness. 

In twistie configuration, the removable lug is a great attachment point for a Berkley stainless steel clip. Slide the 2AA Luxeon light in the loops of the body armor and clip it in place so it won't get lost. Attach the clip to a lanyard when needed. 

The Mediterranean uses a LuxeonIII LED driven at 1.5 watts in a head that is larger than the body. It runs much cooler than a minimag mod and can handle the heat of the desert when it is used for long runtimes. I run mine with NiMH AA batteries and I have tested it with AA alkalines and the included CR123A body. There are rumors of a 2 position (high/low) clickie coming out which would make the light more useful in the darkness. 

There is a 2D Mag mod coming out that is an adjustable output 4 LuxeonIII head. 450 lumens of output at the highest level and it adjusts down by turning the head on the Maglight. I would hate to be on the receiving end of that monster if it was switched on in my general direction. It takes less than a minute to install the drop-in module so there is no soldering, machining or fabrication for the BAM mod. It will be able to run on 8AA NiMH rechargables so if standarizing to the AA battery size is important to you, it will be a winner. Availability should be in the October/November timeframe so I am keeping watch. 

My WX1S LuxeonV "2D Mag" uses the 8AA to 2D adapter and it works very well. The 8 brightness level 170 lumen light has not been proven out in the dust as I completed the build after I returned. High output (100+ lumen) LED lights are starting to become available and should be used as an incandescent light backup.


----------



## weaponlight (Sep 27, 2005)

ob1 said:


> weaponlight, what FOB are you on? I haven't ran into any CPFers out here yet =)



ob1,

I am on Camp Victory, MNCI C7 Engineers. Good luck catching me though. Lately I have been bouncing all around the sandbox in a UH 60. Where are you? Shoot me a PM.


----------



## John N (Oct 1, 2005)

turbodog said:


> It seems like every other day someone is asking about lights for iraq deployment.
> 
> I think we could use a sticky that details different kinds of lights in each class (aa/aaa/123) that are iraq approved (withstand heat/SAND/etc).



Maybe it would be handy to have links to other related threads such as the Need help w/ light for Iraq thread.

-john

Edit: I found another one: Iraq night convoy duty light
And another: Back from Iraw with a few flashlight reports
And another: Patroling in Iraq.... need help
Another: Looking for Iraq gear/lessons learned threads


----------



## John N (Oct 1, 2005)

brightnorm said:


> I recall an Iraq poster stating that he found the Streamlight Scorpion unreliable. It might have been in the operation enlightenment thread.



I think it was mentioned in that thread, but the original post was about use of the Scorpion in Afghanistan. I tried to find it, but the search function still doesn't go back that far and I can't find it.

In any case, as a Scorpion owner, I would not pick a Scorpion. The biggest problem is the bi-pin lamp can come loose, leaving you in the dark unexpectedly. Worse yet, it gets stuck in the head which you can't open. It takes a fair while of 'fishing' with needle nose pliers to fish the thing out.

The rubber boot gets ripped and cut up with hard use which doesn't directly cause the light to fail, but can lead to dust and water intrusion which can impact the function of the light.

Also, the light is also not really water proof, and there really isn't a way to make it water proof which is a minus in my book.

I think the SF G2 with the new LOTC is a much better option. The lamp assembly is fixed and not prone to the bulb-falling-out problem. The older G2 w/o the LOTC I think would still be better than the Scorpion, but in that model the tailcap is not waterproof. Of course, you can add a SF Z48 tailcap to fix the shortcoming of the older version.

-john


----------



## nerdgineer (Oct 7, 2005)

*Re: IRAQ lights - sticky???*

Maybe someone should try the Fenix L1P there to see if it holds up. It's output and run time on 1xAA are really extraordinary, and the pouch looks sturdy and comes with a clip attachment.


----------



## Deanster (Oct 9, 2005)

I just had lunch with a good friend who's a Peace Corps Volunteer in a small village in Mali, in the desert part of the country. Hot season is 120*F in the shade, there's dust, etc., and very tough usage conditions. 

I had given her an Inova X1 before her departure, and she notes that it's the only light that has lasted the whole year she's been there. All others have died from heat, vibration on the 'bus' that runs only 15km walk from her village, dust ingestion, or lousy batteries. Apparently the cheap carbon-zinc batteries sometimes melt in the summer heat... Minimags, a Petzl headlamp, etc. have all died, though she's gotten good at cracking them open to scrape out mud and dust. 

However, the X1 has stayed solid, dust-free, and doesn't mind the heat or batteries. 

She did mention that she left it out in the sun one day last summer, and then picked it up - apparently the black version gets flesh-burningly hot when left in 120*F+ sun. 

A different kind of 'front lines', but I consider this a solid recommendation to look at Inova for deployment use.


----------



## AdamW (Nov 3, 2005)

I deployed about 8 months ago. Only a few left!!!!

We were issued Inova X5's with the blue LED's. I hate this light. If only they had ordered the white LED version, it would have been fine.

We do a lot of night operations, and with the need to use navigation charts, I have found the Gerber Infinity Ultra (red output) to be acceptable. It is not too bright like the blue X5, and with the lug on the back it is clipped to my gear. Only problem: nav charts have writing in red ink. And blue, and green. Our boats are equipped with a thermal imaging system, and we are issued night vision goggles. We normally turn the screen brightness way down on the thermal to maximize our natural night vision.

I carry an HAIII MiniMag with a Mini-Pro III TWOJ and a Kroll switch. Outstanding light, and as suggested, bring extra Kroll's. I am on Kroll #2.

The Fenix L2P looks to be an excellent choice, assuming it is reasonably close to it's published specs. HA3, 2AA NiMh or alkaline, long regulated runtime, bright enough for most tasks. This would be an excellent light for the guys manning the ECP's. Run it on Energizer NiMh's and you are good to go.

Another will be the LRI Proton. HA3, 1AA, single red LED for folks like me, regulated and variable brightness (!) in an easily EDC size.

I prefer AA lights that can run on NiMh or alkaline. The versatility is obvious.

Lastly, 3AAA headlights such as the Princeton Tec Aurora and the Petzl TakTikka Plus are nice when you are back in the tent. Awesome runtimes and useful flood output. It makes reading, studying, or doing little tasks possible without waking up the guy on the cot next to you. I have both, prefer the Aurora, but either way, GET ONE!

Adam


----------



## BentHeadTX (Nov 3, 2005)

A co-worker of mine is going to "Trashcanistan" and was going through all my goodies and asking suggestions. He has the shortwave/clock radio (Grundig), Maya NiMH charger with sixteen 2500mAH Powerex cells, Berkley stainless steel clips, Ripoffs CO47F holster, Nite Ize double pocket holster, double-edged Gerber combat folder, other various things and then to flashlights. 

I gave him 7 lights to play around with including a Mediterranean 2AA, Peak red/UV AA lights, Arc AAA red LED, Arc AA, Peak Matterhorn 3 Snow29 HO and 8AA to 2D Mag nFlex variable output WX1S LuxeonV with UCL lens. He got used to them and asked a few questions. He wanted the Peak 3 Snow29 Matterhorn with removable lug for his lanyard, Peak single red LED AAA with lug for blackout, Peak 3 UV LED AAA, Mediterranean 2AA for higher output and my 8AA LuxeonV Mag. 

His point was he wanted to carry the red and UV lights with the combat knife holster since it would fit better. The Mediterranean 2AA would run NiMH along with his Grundig shortwave and powered computer speakers. He has ordered the 4 Peak lights and they should work well for him. Since I am not going to let him take my $$$ Mag mod... he will figure out something. Not familiar with any 8AA light cannons that run on NiMH (except for modded lights)


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## ob1 (Nov 10, 2005)

I've been in Iraq now since January, going back to the States within 2 months, looking back now a headlamp would really be very useful


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## Jumpmaster (Nov 10, 2005)

I thought you all might get a kick out of this...I took this picture this past weekend in my armory's medic section office. Looks like they like Surefire... (They are currently deployed...this must have been a list they made before leaving before I got there...)







The George Foreman grill is a nice touch too...

JM-99


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## Warleader (Nov 11, 2005)

*Re: Kraplakistan Deployment - weapon lights, etc - suggestions?*

I just found out that I may be deploying to Kraplakistan or some similar God-forsaken place, and I needed some suggestions on equipment.

I have some great small personal lights - ARC AAA-P ver 4, ARC AAA UV & colors, ARC AA, ARC LS, CMG Ultra-G, Inova T3, Nuwai Q3. I'm waiting for Warren to finish his JIL extensions, so I can have a JIL that can take AAs too.

I was thinking of picking up a Surefire U2 Ultra and/or a L4 LumaMax. I would perfer to go LED only. Furthermore, I don't know if these are only set up as flashlights or can be mounted for use on weapons?

Regarding weapons, we're getting M-4 carbines and M9 pistols - need suggestions on weapon mounted lights or lights that can be mounted.

The Surefire M600 Scout Light looks very interesting . . . . It looks like an L4 Digital LumaMax with a different tailcap and tube. I assume that's a K4 head they use. 

I may need an infared filter or illuminator . . . don't know if we're getting NVGs.

Laser sights . . . any suggestions.

I'm also thinking of having someone mod me a ARC LS so that it's up to current technological standards as far a brightness, maybe with H3 vials built in so I can find the darned thing . . . any suggestions?

I'd like to get the biggest bang for the buck . . . . plus I need to get as much and varied use from what I take, since I can't carry everything I would like on my back.

Thanks!


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## Wolfen (Nov 11, 2005)

*Re: Kraplakistan Deployment - weapon lights, etc - suggestions?*

I would first buy a Surefire G2 and three Lamp Assemblys and a red filter and an IR filter. I would buy a Tape Switch for it and get the Surefire spares carrier and extra cr123a batteries from Battery Station, tell Kevin you are military and get the discount.

Forget refitting the Arc LS get an Aleph I, II or III. The Aleph III has great throw and brightness and if you want the light can be put on a weapon using a scope mount and some duct tape. The Surefire clicky switch works pretty well using your thumb.

http://theledguy.chainreactionweb.c...aleph&osCsid=d0d5920ae814d1643e2db323cea7449a

https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/93466

http://www.batterystation.com/cpf.htm

L4 with a McGizmo Two stage switch and red filter makes a great light for all types of searches.

Pelican HA III LED is a really good, bright long throwing light it's on the Battery Station CPF page. The Pelican tape switch also fits on the Surefire G2 / 6P series of lights. Battery Station carries them.


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## Unicorn (Nov 12, 2005)

Weaponlights.

The only real option for rifles is Surefire. Other companies make lights that can be mounted to rifles (sometimes with adapters), the Streamlight M3 and M6 for example, but they don't have the throw as they are usually made for pistols. The M500 is good if you don't use a rail system, the M900 fantasitc if you are using the rail system, and want a front hand grip. There are others that can be had with or without the tape switch, and the switch comes in different lengths as well. Look at their sight for the various options you can get for the M16 family. Too many to list here.


For the M9 you also need to get an adapter since it doesn't have a built in rail. This could cause problems with holster selection though.
I'm partial to the SureFire M200, either the A model for more distance, or the B model for a broader flood. Bright, durable, and long lasting.


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## Warleader (Nov 12, 2005)

One Surefire weapon light that caught my eye is the M600 Scout Light - 

http://www.surefire.com/maxexp/main/co_disp/displ/carfnbr/345/sesent/00

This looks like it has the KL4 head . . . . same as the L4 Digital Lumamax

This comes either as the basic light setup M600A or as a kit (M600 Kit01) that comes with a infared filter and an incandescent head in addition to the LED head.

Can anyone shed any LIGHT on this? LOL! Thanks!


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## Wolfen (Nov 12, 2005)

The LED head looks to be a KL4 which is good for indoors / CQB stuff. Looks like they then have a adapter to fit a standard 6P bezel (type) which would be good for more throw than the LED head. The IR filter of course for N/V. You would probably want to pick up an E-series body and tailcap so the other light parts could be put to use when not on the rifle.


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## AdamW (Nov 13, 2005)

Warleader: GET A HEADLIGHT! You do not need a throw monster with a short runtime. Rather, get a 3AAA version running 5mm LEDs. PrincetonTec Aurora and Petzl TacTikka+ are both excellent. I own both and recommend either. They are small, comfortable, and very handy.

You will use a headlight as much or more than the big lights. Reading, moving about the tent, etc. Both of the headlights I recommend have an advertised runtime of something like 150 hours on low. Low is perfect for reading, and the runtime is so long, I measure it in months, rather than hours. A few hours a day, and the batteries last MONTHS. Please trust me on this and spend the money. If you have time, get either one, and swap out the LEDs with Nichia CS.

Bring your Arc AAA-P ver4 and/or your Ultra G. You will not need the tritium for your lights. Get small clips like the ones berkelypoint.com sells or the cheap plastic ones on the rack where you get keys duplicated. If you are not actually using the light, it is clipped. Period. In hand, or clipped. You won't lose lights if you follow this philosophy. I keep a red Infinity Ultra clipped to my belt loop on night ops.

I can second the G2 suggestion. It is sold at the exchange, as are the lamp assemblies. If you lose it, since it won't be clipped like the little lights, you won't cry like you would if you lost a U2! Belt holster is your friend!

Did I mention head light?!?

Adam


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## John N (Nov 14, 2005)

Warleader,

Disclaimer: I'm not an expert!

My understanding is there are some longarm mounts for the SF 6P/G2 sized lights, as well as Pelican M6. However, I would only consider going that route if I really couldn't afford a purpose built weaponlight.

In regards to what type of lamp assembly for the light, I suspect this has a lot to do with what situations you are likely to be in. If you are going to working from far away, you are going to want a "turbo head". At closer ranges the turbo head is probably not going to be desirable.

In regards to LED vs incandecent for a weaponlight, I think it is a tradeoff. 

The L4/KL4 head is ~60-80 lumens. Reasonable brightness, but not super bright and probably not going to work at much distance. I recall the L5/KL5 head has a bit more throw but still is in the same brightness range. You should be able to replace the incandecent lamp assembly of a weaponlight with the LED lamp assemblies assuming they are for the correct number of cells. This is supposed to work for the SF U2 as well. 

However, if you want BRIGHT, 3 cell or greater incandecent is the only real option at this time. Of course, consider the brighter the light, the more batteries you will eat. Incandecent lights will also probably be cheaper than LED models.

Incandecent lights with shock isolated bezels should be quite sturdy in this application, but LED lights are going to be more so.

Personally, I'd want a Gerber Infinity in red for low light use.

I think the suggestion for a headlamp is good. I'd want something with multiple output levels.

For infared/night vision, I'm not really sure what your options are other than the SF M1.

In regards to other lights, the SF U2 is probably a great general purpose light, perhaps with a tip-off diffuser and a lanyard. Certainly this would fill the function of a fair number of lights. I recall someone reported using a U2 in Iraq on one of these threads and was happy with the result.

I actually think that with the following lights:

- Gerber Infinity, Red
- SF M1 (if needed)
- Headlamp
- SF U2
- Dedicated weaponlight

That you are pretty well set and really only need a backup light. 

Perhaps something the Nuwai Q3 you already have, or perhaps a SF G2 or such. It might be good if the backup light was a single brightness and bright with momentary on that you could use with a handgun since none of your other lights are optimal in that role.

Best wishes, good luck, and thanks!

-john


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## NextLight (Nov 16, 2005)

Warleader said:


> ...caught my eye is the M600 Scout Light -
> (M600 Kit01) that comes with a infared filter and an incandescent head in addition to the LED head.
> 
> Can anyone shed any LIGHT on this? LOL! Thanks!



I presently own one. The advantage is the small size of the 600 combined with the durability of the KL4 LED lamp assembly, plus the easily changeable incan visible-IR head combo. The incan head will also take take (optional) green filters to prevent NVG blooming. This small sexy combo is good for tight tactical situations, like entry into a travel trailer, small house, crawl space, cave, or tunnel. (I'm not a M4 user, nor am I a soldier, but) In the street I personally would want a bigger light, at least an M500A, on my rifle or even 16 inch carbine.

This is more a question for AR15.com, but the Scout is for travelling light, or if your weapon is already loaded down with other gear, like a PEQ, PAQ, or other laser illuminator.

It is hard to choose a Mil light from the SF web site. Look in the Tactical Products catalog (click in lower left corner of the page below) on page 23, to see the Scout kit.

http://www.surefire.com/maxexp/main.pl?pgm=co_catreq&func=disp&strfnbr=6&sesent=0#


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## Shirley (Dec 23, 2005)

Hi, I'm John. I like good lights, but it seems most of y'all got me beat by a mile. It looks like I've gotten out of deploying for now (I begged the Army to just let me graduate with my BA first, but they said no, so I signed with the Guard). I would like a good light for the field. It should be tough (I killed a little Pelican L1 years ago by falling 9' and landing on it), small, and (not as important, but nice) cost efficient if possible.

I have 3 SureFires. One is the version with 3 Red LEDs and a central white bulb, which works okay, but I really would like something that:
has a red LED;
uses AA batteries (prefererably 1);
has a pushbutton switch.

I guess the Gerber *Infinity Ultra *would be about perfect if it had a pushbutton switch, or maybe the little Fenix, if a red LED version were available? I know there are some folks here who like to mod lights~ any chance of so modifying a Fenix?

(edit)I have a 3AA Streamlight TwinTask light that I like pretty well, (except for location of pushbutton), but I wouldn't trust one even if I could find a red filter, since mine has never really worked well since taking a mild bump...

TIA,

John


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## John N (Dec 24, 2005)

Shirley said:


> It should be tough





> small





> cost efficient





> has a red LED





> uses AA batteries (prefererably 1)





> has a pushbutton switch.


 
That's a tough one. 

While not perfect, you might consider the SF L1 with a red LED. On "low", it runs nearly forever.

Which reminds me, do you want a clickie, or just a push button? The SF L1 is not a clickie.

There is also the LRI Proton which is supposed to come out soon. It has a red LED for ultra-low mode and white LEDs for brighter modes. Of course, since this light is not yet available, we don't really know how tough it is going to be.

In the end, even tho it isn't a push button, a red Gerber Infinity is probably still one of the better options. 

Hopefully you'll get some other responses with other ideas.

-john


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## Unicorn (Dec 25, 2005)

Inova? Or do they not make their single AA powered one (the X-1 I think it is) with a red LED? I'm pretty sure I've seen white and probably blue. Even the PX and MCSS are selling these now. Take a look if you can.


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## Shirley (Dec 26, 2005)

No red, at least on the X1...

I have 2 SF LED units, one the KL-4 (not sure what the "K" indicates, the head says KL-4, the body says L-4). I think the other's an A2? I need to look at it again. Anyway, it has 3 red LED and a brighter central bulb. 

Unfortunately, I seem to have a hard time figuring out just how to twist it so that only the red comes on~ kinda sucks to be on FTX and accidentally pop out with the high intensity white light! Also, not AA. 

John


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## GWC3 (Dec 27, 2005)

my A2 isnt as turn senstitive to transition from LED to incan. Until you get it down, turn it against your body or hand to get red before u use it - especially tactically


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## London (Mar 19, 2006)

I've been quite pleased with the LDI (laser devices inc) products which are a true US product, and especially their 5w luxeon LED weaponlights. there are two that I'm intimately familiar with: one with the SWAN quick disconnect lever mount (to attach most conveniently to a mil-spec rail) and then the simple 1" body version which you can us a 1" scope ring to mount to the rail. a multitude of tailcap/switching arrangements are available.

the Pelican M6 is a nice little light but really heavier than it needs to be for it's size/class.

for a personal carry light I've finally stuck to the surefire D2 digital LED. it's really a performer and I've carried it for more than a year from Israel to Panama, freezing Minnesota winters and it just rocks. the dual-intensity combined with "no worries LED" makes it my best pal for a pocket/work light.

for a weapon laser the SE532 "mean green" holds up well in my testing on a 16" AR and it's an American product and is easy to mount with it's 1" OD body.

for you guys pulling out to the sandbox: thank you! we appreciate your service and you have our admiration.

cheers,
London


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## KDOG3 (Jun 4, 2006)

*Good flashlight for a Marine? (cousin is going to Iraq)*

My cousion is going to Iraq sometime in or near September. I am trying to think of some good gear to give him before he goes. And of course, one of the things I want to give him is a good light. I would like it to be LED based. I was thinking of getting him a desert tan G2 with the BOG 3W drop in, but the horrible tint that those have gives me pause. For right around the same price I could get him an E1L and a red flip filter. If I could get help with the $$$ from other family members I would get him an E2L with the filter, or even higher than that such as a L5, L6 etc.... The Pelican 3W LED HAIII light is on my list as well. Any suggestions would be appreciated.


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## pilotmx5 (Jun 4, 2006)

*Re: Good flashlight for a Marine? (cousin is going to Iraq)*

Right now I only have one "real" flashlight (someone is borrowing my g2), and that's my L2. You probably know more about these than I do, but I love the flexability, durability, and visibility(brightness) this light has provided me over the last year. I went through 3 hurricanes (2 with week long power outagaes), swimming, general maintence, 1 flat tire at night, 20 hours of night flying, and several returns from night hiking with it. I bet it would serve him well, but i'm just a newbie to this stuff. I'm also sure there are many surefires like it, but this one is mine.


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## Chronos (Jun 4, 2006)

*Re: Good flashlight for a Marine? (cousin is going to Iraq)*

You may want to look at the Night-Ops Gladius too.


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## Jumpmaster (Jun 4, 2006)

*Re: Good flashlight for a Marine? (cousin is going to Iraq)*

I am a soldier...when I get deployed, I will be taking a red LED CMG Inifinity for wear on my ID tags and a Surefire L1 (red).

That's what I'd prefer. With the L1, there's no possibility of showing any white light (in case the filter pops open on the e1l)...also, the L1 only uses one CR123 so won't go through batteries 2 at a time (as with the e2l).

Oh, and my SF helmet light, of course...

JM-99


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## KDOG3 (Jun 4, 2006)

*Re: Good flashlight for a Marine? (cousin is going to Iraq)*

Does anyone carry those new Polymer Pelican lights yet?

Great suggestions everyone.

I would like to stick with Surefire since they have a proven track record, but I certainly will consider other brands, such as Pelican.

I'd like to get him a great all around light. 2 stage would be great but not necessary. Thats why I don't want to get him a red led. I'm sure he'll need white light sometimes! Hence the ability to put a red filter on would be a plus. I would also get him a beamshaper if I get him the optic based LED lights.


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## d_clark (Jun 4, 2006)

*Re: Good flashlight for a Marine? (cousin is going to Iraq)*

Depends on what his specialty (job) is, and where he is going to be based at. When I was over there ( Feb 04-Feb 05) I used a Red CMG and a Surefire L4 a lot. The CMG was for heading to the Latrine, the L4 was for when we had to download fuel in the middle of the night. (yeah, seems stupid using a bright light in the middle of the night when working around fuel )

Another thing to consider: Availability of CR123's. Of the 3 PX's that I visited that carried CR123's was in Annaconda, the rest just carried AA, C, D. That was a year ago, so a lot has probably changed. If you get him/her a CR123 light, I would recommend to send a small supply of batteries to go with it.


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## KDOG3 (Jun 4, 2006)

*Re: Good flashlight for a Marine? (cousin is going to Iraq)*

Oh yeah, don't worry about that. He'll be getting a boat load of batts...


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## skalomax (Jun 4, 2006)

*Re: Good flashlight for a Marine? (cousin is going to Iraq)*

Good light will be a SureFire L6!


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## bwaites (Jun 4, 2006)

*Re: Good flashlight for a Marine? (cousin is going to Iraq)*

A red Inova X5T. The nice thing about these is they run forever on a single cell and will suck the juice out of depleted 123 cells from other lights

Surefire A2/Red. This is the closest that anyone has come yet to Flashlight perfection.

If you are determined to have a high output LED, M3 w/KL6 or one of the Lumamax series. 

Doing this for a brother in law in late 2003 is what got me started in CPF!

Bill


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## cslinger (Jun 4, 2006)

*Re: Good flashlight for a Marine? (cousin is going to Iraq)*

Surefire A2 red. No chance of white light coming on but an option of very bright white light if you need it.

Chris


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## KDOG3 (Jun 4, 2006)

*Re: Good flashlight for a Marine? (cousin is going to Iraq)*

I wonder if Kroma will be available by then? Hmmm, maybe I'll get two of those....


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## jclarksnakes (Jun 4, 2006)

*Re: Good flashlight for a Marine? (cousin is going to Iraq)*

It has been 15 years since I was in Iraq. If I was going today I would take a Microfire M2 (six LEDs plus a bright incan bulb) or a Wolf Eyes Sniper with the LED tailcap. These lights are first class and cost a whole lot less than Surefires.
jc


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## KDOG3 (Jun 4, 2006)

*Re: Good flashlight for a Marine? (cousin is going to Iraq)*

Hey Jumpmaster, you know what?

How 'bout you keep your comments out in the open instead of hiding them in a PM, ok? Your comments were uncalled for and just plain stupid. You think I'm trying to get my cousin killed? Are you stupid? Just shut up will you?

Anyway, he's not leaving until September so that gives me plenty of time to kick around what I'd like to get him. Including possibly (*gasp*) more than one light. Ever think of that? One white all around light and a smaller red light. Sounds like a plan to me.

As for the rest of you, I thank you wholeheartedly for your suggestions and will take them to heart.


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## dragoman (Jun 4, 2006)

*Re: Good flashlight for a Marine? (cousin is going to Iraq)*

I'd second the Surefire A2 with red leds....the switch can be locked out so that only the red light can come on in combat....

Or one like mine, with the Yellow/Green LEDs that work well with Night Vision Devices...

dragoman


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## frisco (Jun 4, 2006)

*Re: Good flashlight for a Marine? (cousin is going to Iraq)*

Hey KD,

Don't worry about the negetive PM sent to you. It's very obvious you want whats right for your cousin. You are doing the right thing to do research. My suggestion would be to see if you can find out from other Marines what they used and what they wish they had.
Another approach is to find out what is NOT wanted. 

frisco


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## Jumpmaster (Jun 4, 2006)

*Re: Good flashlight for a Marine? (cousin is going to Iraq)*

I was going to send this via PM, but remember -- you said you preferred it here.



KDOG3 said:


> Just shut up will you?



Wow...so you ask for opinions and then get angry when you get them. That is classic. 

Do whatever you want...I'm in another branch, so it won't endanger me. Sorry for the flippant attitude...I'm sure your cousin will know better than to actually carry that thing into a tactical situation, so at worst it will be wasted money.



KDOG3 said:


> Including possibly (*gasp*) more than one light. Ever think of that? One white all around light and a smaller red light. Sounds like a plan to me.



Oh, and about getting two lights -- that's not what you said before...let me quote here, so we can all see what you were wanting to do after I recommended against the flip-off / e1L combo...



KDOG3 said:


> I'm sure he'll need white light sometimes! Hence the ability to put a red filter on would be a plus.



The reason I sent you the PM was because even after I recommended against that (so there wouldn't be any possibility of white light being emitted), you seemed to still be contemplating that flip-off filter as a viable solution.

IT'S CALLED "LIGHT DISCIPLINE"!!!

Geez...if you want everyone's opinions EXCEPT for people that actually understand this concept, just say so next time.

JM-99


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## frisco (Jun 4, 2006)

*Re: Good flashlight for a Marine? (cousin is going to Iraq)*

Jumpmaster brings up good points.

My dad was a dual Vet. WWll and Korean, he told me stories of guys getting shot while lighting or smoking a cigarette.

frisco


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## Jumpmaster (Jun 4, 2006)

*Re: Good flashlight for a Marine? (cousin is going to Iraq)*



frisco said:


> Jumpmaster brings up good points.
> 
> My dad was a dual Vet. WWll and Korean, he told me stories of guys getting shot while lighting or smoking a cigarette.
> 
> frisco



Yes...exactly. That's all I was trying to stress.

Light discipline is strictly enforced in tactical situations...often even within "secure" areas.

Thanks...

JM-99


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## mcl2u (Jun 4, 2006)

*Re: Good flashlight for a Marine? (cousin is going to Iraq)*

I don't know much about this stuff but what is the purpose of the red lite. I'm sure it's because the white is brighter but is there more to it? 

Thanks.


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## rgc (Jun 4, 2006)

*Re: Good flashlight for a Marine? (cousin is going to Iraq)*

If you are looking for two lights then maybe a good ol G2 for good throw with a bright white light and the an Inova X5T in red LED for when that is needed. The bonus is the inova will suck the juice out of the batteries that the G2 runs down.

That said, if I was in a situation like that I would take my L1 in red LED (two stages one for going to the head and one that has pretty good throw for bumps in the night) and my gov. issue infinity ultra white LED (nice low light that runs forever and is bomb proof). Then again, if I had the jack I would pick up an A2 too.

But what do I know about desert ops, I was in the Coast Guard. . . .


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## d_clark (Jun 4, 2006)

*Re: Good flashlight for a Marine? (cousin is going to Iraq)*

Light Discipline (or the lack of) goes back to my previous comments...Depends on where he will be stationed, what his specialty is. Some places (Annaconda for one) have street lights that stay on all night, plus every building has lights located on the outside. And it is a REQUIREMENT for vehicles to drive with the lights on. With all the lights, night vision is already gone, so a red light wouldn't do much good there. While I was in Iraq, a lot of the infantry had Surefire weapon light issued to them, they were all white, with not beam filter/ cover.

My 2 cents: 

1 . I would get a small keychain light (white or red) that your cousin can always have available. 
2. Get a separate light for situation when you need more light.


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## bjn70 (Jun 5, 2006)

*Re: Good flashlight for a Marine? (cousin is going to Iraq)*

If you search the forums you might find the messages posted by others who have returned from Iraq and what their experiences were with their lights.


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## chesterqw (Jun 5, 2006)

*Re: Good flashlight for a Marine? (cousin is going to Iraq)*

ask your cousin what is his needs. e.g. colour, battery, size, brightest, throw or flood.

but seriously, an l1 with a green lux makes such a cool light


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## NaturalMystic (Jun 5, 2006)

*Re: Good flashlight for a Marine? (cousin is going to Iraq)*

My younger brother was stationed in both South Korea and Iraq (Sadr City) for a year each with the US Army and I got him one of the Streamlight PP 4AAs and a small SL Key-Mate for more discreet close-up work. He had several other lights with him for different purposes, but used these two extensively. 
I'd also recommend a small light like the Key-Mate, or one of the Photon Microlights. A less expensive alternative to the Microlights is the $1+change Microlight clones or even the Picolights that CPF member KevinL sells. I also got some of the 5mm 40K mcd LEDs and replaced the stock clone LED and it's way brighter, bigger spot and more throw. Something to also consider with these small LED lights is durability, waterproofness, etc. 
One of the things I considered when getting him the lights was the availability of compatible replacement batteries. If you're getting him a light with less common/readily-available batteries, it'd be a good idea to also pick him up a bunch of replacement batteries for said lights, eg the Photons take 2x CR2016 button cells, the SL Key-Mate takes 4x A76 or equivalent button cells, etc, etc. Get him a Pelican hardcase for everything, or at least the batteries, and he'll be all set. 
Finally, I hope he has a successful tour and returns home safely to your/his family. I know first-hand the stress that a family can endure while a loved one is away serving in under less than ideal surroundings.


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## batman (Jun 5, 2006)

*Re: Good flashlight for a Marine? (cousin is going to Iraq)*

I got a flip filter in red for my A2. Even if it never did let out white light in combat you still wouldn't awnt it. just too dull. Go with the red leds for your cousin if you finally decide on the A2. beam shots, including an evil colonel kurtz shot for effect.oh = just realized that privilage is not activated


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## RadarGreg (Jun 5, 2006)

*Re: Good flashlight for a Marine? (cousin is going to Iraq)*

KDOG3,

I don't think you will find any light that is perfect in all situations. I am currently deployed to LSA Anaconda (Balad, Iraq) and this place is lit up like the Vegas strip. Light dicipline here generally means not shining your light into someone else's eyes at the movie theater.:laughing: 

That being said, I also travel to other camps here in Iraq, and each one is different depending on their threat. Some camps are no white light after dark areas. I'm not of the school of thought that "Only a RED light is suitable for Iraq". The work I do requires some white light for correctly reading resistor color codes, wire colors, etc. I don't do the door kicking down type missions, so white light is ok for my needs. I just got back from Ar Ramadi yesterday and the base is pretty well lit, so white lights didn't seem to be a problem. The part of the camp I was working on was pretty well exposed, so I did try to use a red or green light as much as possible.

If you want to get the best of all worlds, order your Marine cousin a Surefire Kroma-Milspec. It has white, red, blue yellow-green and IR LEDs. The price is kinda high, but tacticalsupply.com has great prices on them. The military supply system has CR123A batteries in it, but you might want to send him a couple dozen batteries every once in a while.

Whatever light you get him, I'm sure he will appreciate. The PX/BX/MCX here in Iraq do carry flashlights, but they are generally the mini-Mag, Inova Squeeze lights or military D-cell angle head flashlights. Some of the stores have Surefire lights, but they do go quickly. 

Good luck to your cousin. And thanks to you for thinking of him. I'm sure he appreciates it.


----------



## KDOG3 (Jun 5, 2006)

*Re: Good flashlight for a Marine? (cousin is going to Iraq)*

RadarGreg: Thanks for the suggestions - and for serving! The Kroma MilSpec is what I'd like to get him if I can get the money. OpticsHq.com list them for a good price as well, but I will certainly look around. I've also been thinking of getting him a bunch of red photon clones for him and maybe to pass out to his buddies.


----------



## mcl2u (Jun 7, 2006)

*Re: Good flashlight for a Marine? (cousin is going to Iraq)*

I've never been in the military or used a red filter but why is the red filter prefered for the military.


----------



## jason9987 (Jun 7, 2006)

*Re: Good flashlight for a Marine? (cousin is going to Iraq)*

red is used because it does not comprimise your night vision(how well you can see after turning it off) it is also much harder for the enemy to see your red light and shoot at it as they would with a white light. do a search for it and you will see find a very detailed explaniation.

Are batteries, 123s to be specific issued to the soldiers in Iraq, or anywhere or do they have to pay for their batteries themselves?


----------



## RadarGreg (Jun 8, 2006)

*Re: Good flashlight for a Marine? (cousin is going to Iraq)*

Jason,


The CR123A batteries are available in the military supply system, but it usually depends on each unit as to how many, if any, they order. Units that use a lot of Surefire weapon lights should have plenty on hand. A unit that doesn't have many, or any, will probably not stock them. NSN 6135-01-351-1131 will get you a box of 12 Panasonic CR123A batteries. Some of the military PX/BX/MCX stores have the Kodak and Surefire brand CR123As, but not all.

Someone here did a really detailed explanation of why red filtered lights are best to preserve your night vision. Something about the white lights destroying certain cells or chemicals in your eye that helps you see at night. I don't remember all the details of the post, so please don't frag me if I got it wrong.


----------



## schrenz (Jun 8, 2006)

*Re: Good flashlight for a Marine? (cousin is going to Iraq)*

If your cousin needs a red filter, buy the big ones from sf, they are much better than the little filters for the e-series.

Because of that think about buying a M2, M3 or L5, L6, all this lights are able to be used as weapon lights, (even with some cable-strips (don't know if it's right word )).
Also think about using a head-light, I use a little Petzl Takktika plus on my helmet, it's small an has a red Filter.
Good luck for your cousin, greets Jens


----------



## NoFair (Jun 8, 2006)

*Re: Good flashlight for a Marine? (cousin is going to Iraq)*

I'm retired from the infantry, so I'm no longer in service.

I'd advise getting him 2 lights: 1 a G2 or the new pelican polymer light (I think there is a special for i in the dealers section $28? shipped) and a small red LED light (5mm led and cr123,AAA or AA). 
You could also give him a bunch of keychain-lights in red to share with his squaddies. 

It is easier to keep 2 lights apart and avoid blasting yourself with 100+ lumens when the lights are separate and so different that you can't grab the wrong one. Red keychainlights are also good for putting on your vest to check gear and so on. The 5mm reds are plenty bright for this.

These recommendations are for general infantry use, he'd probably need very little light or very much light if that is his profession. If he is a mechanic or medic I would advice getting him a headlight + one other light. 

Just my 0.02. Hope your cousin stays safe in the sandbox


----------



## pkennethv (Jun 8, 2006)

*Re: Good flashlight for a Marine? (cousin is going to Iraq)*

here's a pretty good explanation of Red light and night vision http://www.flashlightreviews.com/qa/nightvision.htm

-----ken-----


----------



## strat1080 (Oct 11, 2006)

*Light for helicopter crew in Iraq*

My brother recently shipped out to Iraq. I gave him my Surefire G2 as a birthday present before he went out. He managed to drop and it apparently got crushed by something. He wasn't able to fully disclose what happened nor what his duties are. The bottom line is I want to get him an awesome flashlight as he will be using it on a nightly basis. He is working primarily on a helicopter crew at night as a National Guardsman. From what I've gathered he protects convoys that travel at night. He is a machine gunner and is usually using night vision equipment. He said that the G2 was certainly coming in handy until it got broken. He is getting some leave in November and he wanted me to go with him to pick out a light. I know there have been similar threads but they involved somewhat different circumstances.

I'm thinking something like an A2 Aviator would probably be excellent, except I'm a little tough on funds right now. Do you know any place that gives discounts for lights that are going to soldiers in the line of duy? I think the A2 Aviator was somewhat designed for tasks that he is currently doing. He probably will need a lot of low output for doing stuff at really close range, while occasionally needing a good blast of light to illuminate a large area of equipment. The only other thing is that I'm not sure if he is already issued another flashlight. I was concerned with the G2 being is only light that he will be spending a fortune on batteries. If he is issued something else that runs longer on inexpensive batteries, maybe I will just get him a really bright incand. Surefire.

The prospect of an E2L or other SF LED light crossed my mind but all this recent talk of SF clickie switches breaking doesn't give me warm fuzzy feelings for a soldier about to serve another 9 months in Iraq. I want something that is going to hold up to abuse. Does anybody know what lights have come in handy in the sandbox? Again, is there a place where my brother might be able to get a discount on an illumination tool. I want him to have a durable and useful flashlight as he will really be needing one. What does everybody think?


----------



## Jumpmaster (Oct 11, 2006)

*Re: Light for helicopter crew in Iraq*

Check OpticsHQ. With the CPF discount, it's probably the best deal you'll find. $157.95 over there...seems a little high at that, though...

Surefire also offers a discount to military personnel but (I think) it has to be shipped directly to them.

JM-99


----------



## Roy (Oct 11, 2006)

*Re: Light for helicopter crew in Iraq*

How much light does he need? If he dos'nt need a light that will burn the hair off your arm, the new MiniMag AA LED is a good light. It uses AA batteries. Lights that use 123 batteries are bright but the batteries can be hare to find and can be expedsive.


----------



## John N (Oct 11, 2006)

*Re: Light for helicopter crew in Iraq*

Here are a couple of threads on related topics:

CPF Wiki - Flashlights for military use 

I think you are right on with the A2 tho. A2 with red LEDs maybe. 

But if you can't swing it, the G2 is a good light. If the G2 you gave him broke, it wouldn't have mattered which light he had -- it would have been toast. If you go the G2 route, you might consider getting him a Gerber Infinity in red to go with it.

-john


----------



## strat1080 (Oct 11, 2006)

*Re: Light for helicopter crew in Iraq*

Thanks for the replies. Thanks for the tip about the discounted price at OpticsHQ. Regarding how much brightness he needs. I imagine that he needs pretty good light output for preflight equipment checks and things of that nature. I was actually thinking about buying him a Minimag LED or Minimag with LED conversion as well as a G2 or 6P. I was thinking something like a Minimag with a NiteIze red LED upgradge would be pretty handy for close tasks and won't disrupt his night vision too much. He can use the G2 for emergencies and more serious ligthing tasks. 

From the sounds of it, he does have a good supply of 123L batteries at the base where he is stationed at. He mentioned that they also have Surefire accesories. I was thinking a dual light setup might be pretty handy and preferrable to a single A2 in the event that the light were to fail. Has anybody had any reliability issues with the Minimag LED or NiteIze upgrades for the Minimag? I'm concerned primarily with robustness and durability of the lights as he is going to be over there for a long time when he goes back in December. I guess I will have a better understanding of his needs when he comes back in November.


----------



## Silversurfer (Oct 11, 2006)

*Re: Light for helicopter crew in Iraq*

pm sent


----------



## rgp4544 (Oct 11, 2006)

*Re: Light for helicopter crew in Iraq*

Red doesn't mix well with NVG gear.

I'd pick a white SF A2 with a green Bushwacker filter and either a yellow green SF L1 or a white SF L1 with a green Bushwacker filter. SF's yellow green LED option on the A2 and the L1 are optimised for NVG use.

Richard


----------



## greenLED (Oct 11, 2006)

*Re: Light for helicopter crew in Iraq*

There was a Y/G A2 on BST recently. I don't think it ever sold, and the price was around $110 or so.

+1 on what JM said, give [email protected] a call and see what he can do for your bro - hope he returns home safely.


----------



## Jumpmaster (Oct 11, 2006)

*Re: Light for helicopter crew in Iraq*



rgp4544 said:


> ...and either a yellow green SF L1...



No such thing or I would have one.

JM-99


----------



## freerdr17 (Oct 11, 2006)

*Re: Light for helicopter crew in Iraq*

This coming from somone over in the Middle East, We do not have access to 123 Cells(at least where im at), So if your going to get him a Surefire, make sure you send lots of cells... And surefire does discount for military, But you need to order them through our military supply system to get the discount!

Edit: Sorry I didnt read the post about he had access to batteries...


----------



## Jumpmaster (Oct 11, 2006)

*Re: Light for helicopter crew in Iraq*



freerdr17 said:


> And surefire does discount for military, *But you need to order them through our military supply system to get the discount!*



Emphasis mine.

This is not true. If you are a servicemember, call them on the phone and they will take care of you. I've done it this way and it worked fine.

JM-99


----------



## John N (Oct 11, 2006)

*Re: Light for helicopter crew in Iraq*



rgp4544 said:


> Red doesn't mix well with NVG gear.
> 
> I'd pick a white SF A2 with a green Bushwacker filter and either a yellow green SF L1 or a white SF L1 with a green Bushwacker filter. SF's yellow green LED option on the A2 and the L1 are optimised for NVG use.
> 
> Richard



Ah, sorry. Was just thinking low light signature. Wouldn't IR be prefered for NVG gear?

Could pair a G2 with a M1 IR perhaps? Or put an IR filter on a G2? [Edit: Wow! The FM33 IR  filter for the G2 is $101! Wow!]

In any case, it sounds like the Millspec Kroma might be good (ir + yellow/green?), but it seems like you start opening the possibility of mistakes the more complicated the light is. And it more expensive of course.

-john


----------



## RemingtonBPD (Oct 11, 2006)

*Re: Light for helicopter crew in Iraq*

The KROMA Milspec is _easily_ the best buy for that type of work. Unfortunately given your price requirments, and the lack of availability your better option would be the Aviator and L1.

Yes IR is good for signaling with NV. Red is not good for maps where it can wash out red details. YG is the better option. I also like the blue on the KROMA for any yellow flourescent markings on paper.


----------



## Jumpmaster (Oct 11, 2006)

*Re: Light for helicopter crew in Iraq*

The military has "red-light readable" maps. On these, the features normally in red are marked in a reddish brown. Shows up fine in red light.

But if he's using NVG's, I'd go with the A2-YG. The M1 would be ok, but he'd probably get more use out of the A2 with YG LED's. 

JM-99


----------



## PeterSundelin (Oct 11, 2006)

*Re: Light for helicopter crew in Iraq*

Or go with a cheaper incand light such as the G2 and solve the nightvisionproblem by using a 1,25" Butler Creek lenscover for riflescopes that you modify to hold a 99% blocked IR-filter. I buy mine from a guy on the Ebay and they are topnotch, almost zero visual signature to the naked eye, yet very useful for NVG. 
Just use it with filter when you are in a NVG-environment, and flip open the lid when you need lots of lumens.


----------



## yellow (Oct 11, 2006)

*Re: Light for helicopter crew in Iraq*

If he needs much of a light, then any army in the world will outfit him.

For everything else (even some medium area lighting), a *Fenix L2T* is the winner, especially if there is access to an aa-NiMh-charger.
(as MagLed has been mentionned and sucks heavily against all of the Fenixes)


----------



## Long John (Oct 11, 2006)

*Re: Light for helicopter crew in Iraq*

I second the Fenix L2T. With a modded Minimag-rubber protection-set for the head, useable with red, green and orange plastic windows.

Best regards

____
Tom


----------



## rgp4544 (Oct 11, 2006)

*Re: Light for helicopter crew in Iraq*

Jumpmaster is right on the L1 and I was mistaken, apparently no yellow green option, can only get the L1 in plain green.

John, that Mil Spec Kroma would definitely be fantastic although is anyone receiving them yet? I thought the original post indicated he might have to buy it himself and send it to his brother and SF might not be shipping them yet unless it is ordered directly by someone in the military.

Richard


----------



## John N (Oct 11, 2006)

*Re: Light for helicopter crew in Iraq*



rgp4544 said:


> John, that Mil Spec Kroma would definitely be fantastic although is anyone receiving them yet? I thought the original post indicated he might have to buy it himself and send it to his brother and SF might not be shipping them yet unless it is ordered directly by someone in the military.



Hmm. Yes, I just checked the tacticalsupply.com Kroma Milspec thread and you are right, it doesn't sound like they are shipping yet, at least to civvie channels. It also sounds like you are right that military will take precidence so ordering through a civvie channel might not be optimal.

No idea what the availability is for someone in the military ordering directly from Surefire...

-john


BTW, it wasn't until this thread that I actually understood why anyone would want a Kroma.


----------



## FlashInThePan (Oct 11, 2006)

*Re: Light for helicopter crew in Iraq*

I'd consider buying a Surefire A2 Aviator and a Fenix E0. (About $175 total, from OpticsHQ.com and Fenix-Store.com respectively.)

The A2 is a great primary light with everything he should need: it's compact, sturdy, and has a combination of lighting sources that should serve him well. The low-level LEDs will work for most tasks, while the incan will allow him to dial up the power and get better depth perception. And since you never want to depend on just one light, the Fenix provides a great backup light: it provides regulated light for 16 hours on a single lithium, and is so small that it'll literally disappear in his flightsuit.

Good luck!

- FITP


----------



## rgp4544 (Oct 11, 2006)

*Re: Light for helicopter crew in Iraq*



John N said:


> BTW, it wasn't until this thread that I actually understood why anyone would want a Kroma.



I'm waiting for Mil Spec Kromas to be delivered too, I ordered one because I think it might be even better than an A2 to use while flying. Since I'm a civilian though I could easily get by with just red and white low beams. As is I normally carry two A2's, one red and one white.

Richard


----------



## Cornkid (Oct 11, 2006)

*Re: Light for helicopter crew in Iraq*

Through Aafes you get some pretty sizeable discounts.
-tom


----------



## Lighthouse one (Oct 11, 2006)

*Re: Light for helicopter crew in Iraq*

How about the Wolf Eyes 6 or 9 volt with the 4 LED tailcap? I have one- it's great...two lights in one! If you have 123a avail or and 18650 ( or 2 18500) rechargables...


----------



## Jumpmaster (Oct 11, 2006)

*Re: Light for helicopter crew in Iraq*



Cornkid said:


> Through Aafes you get some pretty sizeable discounts.
> -tom



The prices at the PX are ok...but not that great.

Online at aafes.com, I could not locate any SF products. If you go to the Centric Mall to Brigade Quartermasters, the price on the A2 (and the yellow-green version is not availble at all there) is about $20.00 higher than with the CPF discount from OpticsHQ, so...yeah, I would skip AAFES.

JM-99


----------



## rgp4544 (Oct 11, 2006)

*Re: Light for helicopter crew in Iraq*

Another option might be tacticalsupply.com (aka Spyder Tactical Supply) with a CPF discount which would amount to $156 for an A2 and he has free shipping on orders over $100.

Richard


----------



## InfidelCastro (Oct 12, 2006)

*Re: Light for helicopter crew in Iraq*

Got a hard enough time finding spare batteries and lamps around here, sure as hell wouldn't be using a Surefire in Iraq.


If the Army is providing batteries and spare parts, that's a different thing, but if they're anything like any other government agency, then in my experience, you're pretty much on your own. The lowest comment denominator factor comes into place here. Use what works and is available. Get a 2D mag and some xenon bulbs.


----------



## crocodilo (Oct 12, 2006)

*Re: Light for helicopter crew in Iraq*

Being myself a military helicopter pilot, here's my two cents' worth:

1. Do not go below double cells in AA or C format. They are easiliy obtainable, and pack quite a lot of energy for providing both intensity and runtime. This is for a general use flashlight, anything in the range of 20-40 lumens should suffice. Pre-flights, packing, camping out, survival, etc. Should be something you can put on your belt, vest or pack, use daily at will and change batteries only in long intervals. Those L-shaped OD plastic aviators use around the world, with metal clip, double C batts, filters and spare bulb in the basecap are near perfect. If they had them in LED... (dream on...). G2s are too much light for a too short time. I guess an L2P/T/S should suffice.

2. Anywhere around night-flying, a low intensity flashlight is an absolute necessity, in the 5-10 lumens range. Red filters are a possibility to preserve natural night vision (an expedient is painting the glass with red lumograph pen). Inside my cockpit, the meager Fenix E0 with 5.5 lumens is a beast for all tasks, perhaps even a tad too bright. A Photon in red also served me faithfully for some years.

3. Around NVGs, skip the flashlight use.

4. Go for quality, not high price. It will get dropped, bumped, borrowed around the crew, and forgotten about when not in use. However, when needed, reliability is a must.

5. Battery interchangeability is also a plus. If you have, for instance, a GPS on 4 AAs, a double AA flashlight provides reciprocal battery backup (I used this quite often).


Best of luck to your brother and his crewmates!


----------



## strat1080 (Oct 12, 2006)

*Re: Light for helicopter crew in Iraq*

Thanks crocodilo for your input. First hand knowledge is always good to have. That is what I was thinking that he will probably need a lot of low output most of the time. I'm just not sure how much light he will need for pre-flight stuff. Although he isn't a pilot himself his lighting needs should be similar. I was thinking a high quality low output light with a long runtime would be very valuable. I figured since the A2 was designed specifically for flight crew that it would serve very well for that purpose. 


Another option would be to use a dual flashlight setup that would do both tasks that the A2 would do and also provide a backup light in case one of them takes a dive. I think something like the Fenix L2T is a handy tool in a civilian role but probably not very well suited to my brother's purpose. I think the low setting is still too powerful and the high setting might not be enough for serious military lighting tasks. When my brother gets back I will ask him about everything that he needs for lighting. All of your recommendations have been very helpful. Thanks a bunch.


----------



## Illum (Oct 12, 2006)

*Re: Light for helicopter crew in Iraq*



Jumpmaster said:


> No such thing or I would have one.
> 
> JM-99



isnt there beam filters that can have the YG capability?


----------



## Jumpmaster (Oct 12, 2006)

*Re: Light for helicopter crew in Iraq*



Illum_the_nation said:


> isnt there beam filters that can have the YG capability?



Not that I have seen.

JM-99


----------



## TigerhawkT3 (Oct 12, 2006)

*Re: Light for helicopter crew in Iraq*

How about a ProPoly Lux and an E0?


----------



## PeterSundelin (Oct 13, 2006)

*Re: Light for helicopter crew in Iraq*

Or do as a friend of mine who is currently at Rangerschool.... buy a 2AA Magled and take a Butler Creek lens cover to fit over the bezel. then drill a 2mm hole in the lenscover wich allows just the amount of light necessary for reading and stuff. And if you need more light, just flip it open. (I really like BC lens covers!) 
If you want you could glue a red plastic lens to the inside of the lenscover....
Now thats two level brightness and colourchange for the technically impaired!:naughty:


----------



## gregval68 (Aug 2, 2007)

*Advice? Which light to middle east.*

Hello, my Brothers leaving to Afghanistan, so what light would you recommend to take? He's in Airforce, works in medical field, will be picking up soldiers and working on them everywhere.... im sure at all times as well, so want to get him one before he leaves...Thank You....


----------



## LukeA (Aug 2, 2007)

*Re: Advice? Which light to middle east.*

One of the new Cree Surefires.


----------



## ViReN (Aug 2, 2007)

*Re: Advice? Which light to middle east.*

P3D (Cree / Rebel) Textured Reflector, P1CE Textured Q2 could serve as good backup lights ... especially p3d considering the multilevel and long runtime on low


----------



## Taepo (Aug 2, 2007)

*Re: Advice? Which light to middle east.*

I don't know much about military ops (or how they use their flashlights), but I imagine there might be some similarities with LE requirements.

Does he need strobe and SOS? Then maybe a Fenix P2D/P3D

If he doesn't need a strobe or SOS, then a Surefire L1 or E2L sounds good.

Add a pack of batteries + battery case too.


----------



## Windscale (Aug 2, 2007)

*Re: Advice? Which light to middle east.*

Definitely no SF or Fenix, unless your brother is prepared to bring tons of batteries with him. You may consider a crank light. Most of these are quite cheap, but they don't need batteries. You can get one with 3 or 5 LEDs and, with care, they will work forever. Just needed winding. The light produced would be sufficient for most situations. I always have one when travelling just in case I ran out of batts and everything else failed. Touch wood , this has never happened.


----------



## scottaw (Aug 2, 2007)

*Re: Advice? Which light to middle east.*

If they're out in time before he leaves, get him a Novatac 120P, the military is already using them so he may have one before we can get them (lucky...) Other than that, id say a surefire as well, it's just so much better built than my fenix. Check out a L1, maybe an older version with longer runtime.


----------



## Outdoors Fanatic (Aug 2, 2007)

*Re: Advice? Which light to middle east.*



scottaw said:


> If they're out in time before he leaves, get him a Novatac 120P, the military is already using them so he may have one before we can get them (lucky...) Other than that, id say a surefire as well, it's just so much better built than my fenix. Check out a L1, maybe an older version with longer runtime.


SureFire A2 Aviator, L2 or the Novatac EDC.


----------



## meuge (Aug 2, 2007)

*Re: Advice? Which light to middle east.*



gregval68 said:


> Hello, my Brothers leaving to Afghanistan, so what light would you recommend to take? He's in Airforce, works in medical field, will be picking up soldiers and working on them everywhere.... im sure at all times as well, so want to get him one before he leaves...Thank You....




I think he can't go wrong with a Surefire, with one huge caveat -> not sure how accessible CR123 batteries would be where he's going. 

If that's a concern, then an L2D-CE Fenix is a good bet. Has very long battery life/strobe/SOS or the ability to be VERY bright when necessary. 

I am sure at various army bases there'll be electricity, so if he takes a 220/110 adapter, a charger, and an 8-pack of Sanyo Eneloop batteries, he should be fine almost indefinitely. Certainly a 4-pack of L91 lithiums as backup is also in order. But in any case, he should be able to get his hands on AAs at some point.

A headlamp should also be considered... since he might need to use his hands as a medic. I think PrincetonTec Apex is considered very good.


----------



## fishx65 (Aug 2, 2007)

*Re: Advice? Which light to middle east.*

I would make sure it's an AA or AAA powered torch with long runtime! My guess would be that he will need the use of both hands most of the time so maybe a headlamp and a handheld would be better. Might be tuff to use a handheld while carrying a stretcher!


----------



## bondr006 (Aug 2, 2007)

*Re: Advice? Which light to middle east.*

Hello, and welcome to CPF.

I would say an Fenix L2D CE. It is small and light. It takes AA batteries which are about the easiest to find. He could also use nihm rechargeables. It has great run times and output. It comes with a lanyard and holster. Free shipping from Fenix-Store, and only $52.00 with the CPF 8% discount. With that $52.00 you get a reliable, well built light from a dealer that provides A#1 customer service. 

[FONT=&quot]9L = 55hrs, 40L = 10.5hrs, 80L = 4hrs, SOS, 135L = 2.4hrs, Strobe

 I think it would fit just about any situation your brother could run in to over there.
 





[/FONT]


----------



## Flying Turtle (Aug 2, 2007)

*Re: Advice? Which light to middle east.*

You might consider the Photon Proton unless he will be needing something with lots of throw. Runs on one AA and has variable brightness control for white (6 LEDS) and red (1 LED). Full power white is about like a medium level in the typical Cree, but with lots of flood. Low power is down to where you can see the wires in the LEDs. The red is enough to walk around in very dark conditions. It's supposed to be weather-proof. Has a great pocket clip, too.

Geoff


----------



## ViReN (Aug 2, 2007)

*Re: Advice? Which light to middle east.*



Flying Turtle said:


> You might consider the Photon Proton unless he will be needing something with lots of throw. Runs on one AA and has variable brightness control for white (6 LEDS) and red (1 LED). Full power white is about like a medium level in the typical Cree, but with lots of flood. Low power is down to where you can see the wires in the LEDs. The red is enough to walk around in very dark conditions. It's supposed to be weather-proof. Has a great pocket clip, too.
> 
> Geoff



yup proton has this advantage of having red LED with full brightness control, i just hope they come up with Rebel and Red LED's


----------



## meuge (Aug 2, 2007)

*Re: Advice? Which light to middle east.*



bondr006 said:


> It comes with a lanyard and holster.



A word of warning -> the Fenix holster has an open top. If your brother is taking this light with him in the field, a closed holster is in order, simply to avoid losing the light.


----------



## PhantomPhoton (Aug 2, 2007)

*Re: Advice? Which light to middle east.*

IF he has access to CR123 Batteries, which most deployed military personnel that I personally know do, then...

+1 to the Surefire L2
Plenty of light on low power for ~16 hours
Even more light on High for a much shorter time. Rugged, no gimmicks, easy to use.

The A2 might be a nicer option due to color rendition under incandescent light though. Medical field might prefer that. I know a lot of people around here absolutely love that light.


----------



## LightJaguar (Aug 2, 2007)

*Re: Advice? Which light to middle east.*

I would recommend the Fenix L2D-CE. I would of loved to have one of those when I was in the military. SureFires use expensive batteries (if he can even find them out there) and with enlisted pay he would probably go broke just buying them. It has also been my experience that cash is not ready available when one is out there. Buy him some recharchables NiMH and he would be good to go.


----------



## Hans (Aug 2, 2007)

*Re: Advice? Which light to middle east.*



LukeA said:


> One of the new Cree Surefires.



But not the L1 Cree as long as it's not clear that the problems with the problems some people had with this light have been sorted out. Sending back an L1 back to the US to have it fixed isn't really a good idea when you depend on your light. 

Hans


----------



## gregval68 (Aug 2, 2007)

*Re: Advice? Which light to middle east.*

Thanks for the info, will check all out, you guys are great...!


----------



## meuge (Aug 2, 2007)

*Re: Advice? Which light to middle east.*



PhantomPhoton said:


> The A2 might be a nicer option due to color rendition under incandescent light though. Medical field might prefer that. I know a lot of people around here absolutely love that light.



That's actually a good point. I've never tried using the Fenix to examine patients (haven't had a chance yet), with its rather pretty white tint. 

But I've used my Photon III on several occasions in emergencies, and I've always found the color rendition of tissues to be offputting and difficult to interpret. 

I'll try the Fenix tonight, see if the improved tint (it's much less blue) makes a difference.


----------



## boosterboy (Aug 2, 2007)

*Re: Advice? Which light to middle east.*

I'm gonna discourage the use of rechargeables or "crank lights" for they are a liability in an unpredictable environment. Don't get me wrong, I love my Eneloops for their low discharge rate but they are still a liability. I mark each cell with letters to remind myself which cells have been discharged.

It gets pretty cold in A'stan especially in the winter, I don't know where your brother is going to be stationed but Lithium cells operate much better in extreme temperatures (-60° to 80°C, or -76°F to 176°F). The price of a quality lithium AA cell is pretty much the same as a quality CR123.

I recommend two lights, one in CR123 and one in AA. They'll serve as backup to each other and for those days when supply is out of particular battery.

I highly recommend a light with a simple interface, so it's easy to operate under duress and to maintain good light discipline to insure that you don't blind the **** out of everybody or give away your position. A good switch system that you can operate with gloves (whether they be nitrile or nomex).

Red Filter for preserving night vision, Blue filter for highlighting veins.


CR123:

150$ Novatac EDC 120T with Surefire Red and Blue filters.
135$ (about 100$ through NSN) Surefire Cree L1 with filters
65$ Surefire G2L with RED and BLUE filters
Inova 24/7


AA:

50$ Streamlight Sidewinder: with Primary white LED, and auxillary red, blue & IR LED. The IR LED would be really helpful for IFF ( Identification, Friend or Foe) purposes. The sidewinder can be clipped to things like a MOLLE panel.
31$ Lumapower LM301 with Red and Blue filters ( you have to force the filter onto the light)



That or just get your brother a headlamp for handfree

Just remember, Surefires have surived direct mortar hits, lawn mower blades, and frozen winters. And they'll replace your lights with no-questions asked ESPECIALLY for Mil/LEO customers.

Don't forgot a good spare battery carrier too!


----------



## 83Venture (Aug 2, 2007)

*Re: Advice? Which light to middle east.*

I agree with boosterboy on considering the Streamlight Sidewinder.


----------



## stonehold (Aug 2, 2007)

*Re: Advice? Which light to middle east.*

Does he need a hands free light, low or high output, long run time? As a medic a small hands free Pelican Versabrite or VB3 might might work, or maybe a Surefire tactical helmet light (multi levels & colors). [FONT=arial, helvetica]

[/FONT]


----------



## jbosman1013 (Aug 2, 2007)

*Re: Advice? Which light to middle east.*

the L2D-ce or the surefire A2, since he is in the medical field most of the use will be up close and he will want something with low light levels.


----------



## Campdavid (Aug 2, 2007)

*Re: Advice? Which light to middle east.*

No cranklights! They are bulky, unreliable and will probably fail very quickly in a mid eastern environment (sand will gunk up the crank right away....many family and friends of mine have been to Afgan, Kuwait and Iraq.....they say the sand and grit gets into everything!). 

G2 incan with a red filter is a great choice. Inexpensive, I have not heard of any probs getting CR123s, incan is typically a better choice in a dust storm as it reflects less, durable, etc. Heard that the G2 and 6P are very popular over there.


----------



## slick228 (Aug 2, 2007)

*Re: Advice? Which light to middle east.*

I would cast a vote for a SureFire Kroma and the Cree E2L. Please keep in mind that the new Cree E2L can run nine (9) hours in full regulation!


----------



## cave dave (Aug 2, 2007)

*Re: Advice? Which light to middle east.*

Is he flying through Turkey to get there? At least one military CPF'er has talked about Turkey airlines confiscating CR123 batteries and lights. 

If he is going to want to read at night a Tac Tikka headlamp perhaps? Maybe that Rayovac 1AA headlamp.

For a non-combat light Fenix is still a good option. You could get a L1D (1AA) and the P2D (Cr123) body for it as well for ultimate battery flexibility.


----------



## koala (Aug 2, 2007)

*Re: Advice? Which light to middle east.*

I suggest a headlamp + a handheld torch.

I am pretty sure he's getting busy and pretty confused now...

This is what you guys have just mention...
Cree Surefire L1 E2L
Fenix P2D
Fenix P3D Cree/Rebel
Fenix P1CE Textured Q2
Dynamo Crank Light 3 or 5 LEDs
Novatac 120P
Surefire New L1, Old L1
Surefire A2, Surefire L2
Fenix L2D-CE
Photon Proton
Rebel Red LEDs
Photon III
Surefire Red Filter, Blue Filter
Novatac EDC 120T
Surefire G2L
Inova 24/7
Streamlight Sidewinder....
Lumapower LM301
Pelican Versabrite or VB
Surefire tactical helmet
Surefire 6P
Surefire Kroma
Tac Tikka headlamp
Rayovac 1AA headlamp
Fenix L1D


----------



## LukeA (Aug 2, 2007)

*Re: Advice? Which light to middle east.*



Campdavid said:


> Incan is typically a better choice in a dust storm as it reflects less, durable, etc.


I seriously doubt that because an incan would reflect more of the color of sand and dust.

I suggest a Rebel-based light (if you can find one), because as a medic, he'll want accurate light to see wounds better.


----------



## mhubble (Aug 2, 2007)

*Re: Advice? Which light to middle east.*



> IF he has access to CR123 Batteries, which most deployed military personnel that I personally know do, then...


Dont leave it up to the military to supply his batteries, he should go well supplied. Ive had to send tons of batteries to soldiers who were supposed to have access to batteries.

Forget about any light than has more than one level. He needs something simple he can work very quickly with. On/ off. Hell need a neck lanyard and get a light small enough he can put in his mouth so he can use his hands. This will be his backup light.
For a medic he needs a headlamp, simple and bright, on/off. All his work will be up close no need for anything big and bulky with alot of throw. Just a headlamp that uses AA batteries.


----------



## NA8 (Aug 2, 2007)

*Re: Advice? Which light to middle east.*

If it was me, I'd want to keep close to one of these: 

http://www.surefire.com/maxexp/main/co_disp/displ/prrfnbr/24279/sesent/00


----------



## Taepo (Aug 2, 2007)

*Re: Advice? Which light to middle east.*



boosterboy said:


> 135$ (about 100$ through NSN) Surefire Cree L1 with filters




What is NSN???


----------



## MacTech (Aug 3, 2007)

*Re: Advice? Which light to middle east.*

Personally, i'd go with one of the more proven SureFire designs, i'm going to make what i'm sure will be an unpopular reccomendation here....

don't go with a Cree Surefire yet... they haven't been out long enough to prove themselves in a life-or-death situation, go with a Lux based or incan model, they've been out long enough to have a proven reliability record....

the 6P/G2/E2/C or M series for incan
the A2 Aviator for a Hybrid Incan/LED
E1L/E2L Luxeon, L2, L4, U2, Kroma, or rev. 2 L1 for LED

yes, the Cree SureFires are nice, no argument there, they just haven't been battle-proven yet, the L1 Cree's growing pains are a testament to that, i'm confident SureFire will fix the problem with the L1's, it'll just take time, and the CreeFires *WILL* prove themselves worthy of trust, right now it's just too early to take an essentially untested design into battle


----------



## BlackDecker (Aug 3, 2007)

*Re: Advice? Which light to middle east.*

For a headlamp, I'd recommend the Rayovac Sportsman Extreme at Wal-Mart for $18.83. Uses 1AA battery, has red, blue LED's and a 1watt luxeon main emitter. Runs about 2 hours on a plain old AA alkaline, or about 4.5 hours on a L91 AA Lithium cell.


----------



## sysadmn (Aug 3, 2007)

*Re: Advice? Which light to middle east.*

I'd echo the headlamp advice. They are great for close-by hands free use and adequate out to ~20 feet (i.e., latrine visits). You'll still want a good quality flashlight to see things 20 or more feet away. Worst case, he carries a flashlight, and puts the headlamp in a gear bag to loan to someone else 

There are more sophisticated headlamps (princeton apex... ask in the headlamp forum for others), but the Rayovac just plain works, is versitile, and cheap. If you think he needs a brighter "main light" look for a Xenon + led version, but be aware that they eat batteries.


----------



## greenLED (Aug 3, 2007)

*Re: Advice? Which light to middle east.*

Ask RadarGreg. He's "been there, done that" and will have much better advise than most of us who've never really seen combat or are familiar with what _really _works out there.


----------



## Pistolero (Aug 3, 2007)

*Re: Advice? Which light to middle east.*

My bro (68W Medic w/ 82nd in Baghdad) said that he made good use of the Energizer 3LED headlamp I sent him. The red is really handy.

Also, depending on where he's at, he should have a decent supply of Surefire batteries. He said they ALL got surefire combat lights on their M4. And he's not even one with any of the regular Inf. types.

Maybe also a clipable photon or similar in white and red. 
There's also the Pentagonlight Molle light, but I've heard mixed reports on those.
Also, the Streamlight Sidewinder... although I haven't heard much in the way of reviews on it.

A good/small AA charger and some reliable cells might be in order too. 

AF & Medical? Doing pickups? He's not a PJ, is he?!?!? Either way, give him my thanks and gratitude.


----------



## gorn (Aug 3, 2007)

*Re: Advice? Which light to middle east.*

My son is in Iraq. I have sent him probably a dozen lights. His main light is a Gladius. There are only 2 kinds of batteries that are issued over there, AA and CR123.


----------



## zk188 (Aug 4, 2007)

*Re: Advice? Which light to middle east.*



Taepo said:


> What is NSN???


 
Nato Stock Number i think.


----------



## LEDninja (Aug 4, 2007)

*Re: Advice? Which light to middle east.*

There was a couple of threads about providing lights for troops going over there. The most important information I got reading them was:
*123A batteries are just about impossible to get over in Afghanistan*
So unless you want to lug all your battery requirements over yourself Surefires, Fenix P series or HDS/Novatecs are out!!!

Here is a thread on how BentHeadTX equipped his unit for service in the middle east and what each light is used for..
http://www.cpfmarketplace.com/mp/showthread.php?t=99946


----------



## Monocrom (Aug 6, 2007)

*Re: Advice? Which light to middle east.*

Considering this isn't going to be a General Use light for a civilian, I can't recommend technology that doesn't have a long, proven, track record. Stay away from Cree and other newer LEDs. 

I also can't recommend Fenix lights. Yes, they are extremely bright, reasonably priced, and popular. But even the most die-hard Fenix fan has to admit that durability is not a strong suit of this brand. 

I recommend an Inova X5. I hear Inova donates many of these lights to active Service men. Inova _does _have a reputation for both reliability and durability.... and at reasonable prices. You can find their X5 model at Target. Other Inova models in the X and T series of lights are just as reliable and tough. Inova also uses proven technology.

If he needs a smaller light that runs on non-123A cells, there's Inova's X1 model; also found at Target.


----------



## PJD (Aug 6, 2007)

*Re: Advice? Which light to middle east.*

I'm gonna go out on a limb and say Energizer Hard case Tactical. You can see my comments about it in this thread:

https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/146573

VERY tough light designed specifically for the military. Don't let the "brick and mortar" store name of Energizer fool you...this is one tough and robust light that the folks at Energizer, IMHO, put a LOT of thought into. Also, I'm a retired Marine, again IMHO, this light WILL serve the purpose well!

PJD


----------



## Bright Scouter (Oct 29, 2007)

*Cousin going to Iraq, what lights to send?*

My wife's cousin is going to Iraq in November. The Air Guard squadron she supports is going for a tour. She is office staff, but will still be on the air base they are at. I want ideas on lights to send. 

I was thinking about three. 

A Surefire G2. Everything I have heard on here says that all bases over there have ample supplies of 123s. So, that should be ok if she wants something bright. Thought about an led model with a P60 lamp, or maybe a drop in led also. 

Next a two stage AAA light. Maybe a Fenix. Any other ideas? This could be her main light if it was two stage. With this size, it could hang around her neck most of the time.

Last, some kind of a red light. I was thinking either in a Photon style/size or possibly something like a Peak Matterhorn? 

Any thoughts on anything else?


----------



## Windscale (Oct 29, 2007)

*Re: Cousin going to Iraq, what lights to send?*

Your G2 is only a good idea if, as you mentioned, there is ample supply of 123As for free. If not, you should think about, say, a 6P with some kind of a LED drop-in running on 1x17670. Make sure you send a few 17670s and a charger. This way she will never run out of power as there must be suitable sockets in the military base.


----------



## Blue72 (Oct 29, 2007)

*Re: Cousin going to Iraq, what lights to send?*



Windscale said:


> Your G2 is only a good idea if, as you mentioned, there is ample supply of 123As for free. If not, you should think about, say, a 6P with some kind of a LED drop-in running on 1x17670. Make sure you send a few 17670s and a charger. This way she will never run out of power as there must be suitable sockets in the military base.


 

most bases have plenty of 123a for free for their issued surefire helmet lights and weapons light


----------



## Windscale (Oct 29, 2007)

*Re: Cousin going to Iraq, what lights to send?*



dd61999 said:


> most bases have plenty of 123a for free for their issued surefire helmet lights and weapons light


 
If even office staff can get 123As for free in the base, then I would totally agree with the G2 suggestion.


----------



## RainerWahnsinn (Oct 29, 2007)

*Re: Cousin going to Iraq, what lights to send?*

If size and money is not a main point, send a KROMA white/red/blue.

Rainer


----------



## dcowboyscr (Oct 29, 2007)

*Re: Cousin going to Iraq, what lights to send?*

Why not a Surefire L1 Cree? 2 stages only uses 1 CR123. Just make sure all the bugs are worked out.


----------



## thiswayup (Oct 29, 2007)

*Re: Cousin going to Iraq, what lights to send?*

Too large a light won't get carried and be with her if she needs it. Send her a good quality single AA or AAA, and a red photon. *Maybe* consider a small light using a single Cr123. Make sure the interface is a simple one, I'd suggest.


----------



## LightJaguar (Oct 29, 2007)

*Re: Cousin going to Iraq, what lights to send?*

I was in the US military for four years and did a deployment to Iraq for eight months. While I was out there I did not see CR123s being issued for free (or at all as a matter of fact). Maybe the Air Force guys get them or maybe not since they are not usually involved in direct combat. I'm almost certain that they sell them at the exchage if your cousin is near one. Expect to pay the same price as in the US though. Depending on your cousin's pay grade, that may be an issue. 
Perhaps a light that does not use fancy batteries might be better.


----------



## ZMZ67 (Oct 29, 2007)

*Re: Cousin going to Iraq, what lights to send?*

I am also skeptical about the availability of CR123 batteries.I would send a good AA light to be sure.The Fenix L1T,L2T or maybe the Lumipower LM31 seem like good choices and they are not overly expensive.One is none two is one,I would send a second light in case the first is lost or damaged.If you do go with a CR123 light it might be a good idea to give a decent supply of batteries as well.The Photon should be a good choice as well, again one is none two is one.


----------



## Gunner12 (Oct 29, 2007)

*Re: Cousin going to Iraq, what lights to send?*

Why not a G2L, more runtime at around the same brightness but runtime is 80-60 lumens in half an hour and stays around 60 for about 4 hours. This is due to the lower current(temperature sensor, polyester bodies do not conduct heat well) to prevent the LED from overheating.

I would also agree with sending a AA light, just in case(and also for the low mode). The Fenix L1/2T V2.0 would be a good choice one of the very few with the newer LED and a forward clickie.

A good and tough AAA light would be the Arc AAA but it is not the brightest.


----------



## Bright Scouter (Oct 29, 2007)

*Re: Cousin going to Iraq, what lights to send?*

Well. Talked with a few people that have been at the air base she is going to. The 123s are available. But they also agree that the G2 is probably too much light most of the time. But they themselves carry an M2 or M3 for when they need throw so think it would be ok as a big bright backup.

As for the main light, I think I decided on a Fenix L0D with a Rebel. That gives her a pretty good amount of light on one AAA batt for a decent runtime. The guys said a lot of people over there carry something like this or an Arc AAA on their id neck strap. Since they have to always have that, they can't forget it. 

I probably will still throw in a Photon Freedom, probably with a red led. Doubt that she really needs that because she won't be off base hardly ever, if ever. But, it is a nice last resort light.

Thanks everyone.


----------



## kurni (Oct 29, 2007)

*Re: Cousin going to Iraq, what lights to send?*

For military... I prefer to be sure... fire... or probably Novatac.

I prefer a tank over a cheap / fancy light.


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## thiswayup (Oct 29, 2007)

*Re: Cousin going to Iraq, what lights to send?*



Bright Scouter said:


> Well. Talked with a few people that have been at the air base she is going to. The 123s are available. But they also agree that the G2 is probably too much light most of the time. But they themselves carry an M2 or M3 for when they need throw so think it would be ok as a big bright backup.
> 
> As for the main light, I think I decided on a Fenix L0D with a Rebel. That gives her a pretty good amount of light on one AAA batt for a decent runtime. The guys said a lot of people over there carry something like this or an Arc AAA on their id neck strap. Since they have to always have that, they can't forget it.
> 
> ...



Forgot to mention - red photons with the standard battery are *amazingly* dim. But I'm told they brighten up a lot (at the expense of runtime) if you use the 2 thin coin cells (like the white and green photons, etc) instead of the one thick one.


----------



## Braddah_Bill (Oct 29, 2007)

*Re: Cousin going to Iraq, what lights to send?*



Bright Scouter said:


> Well. Talked with a few people that have been at the air base she is going to. The 123s are available. But they also agree that the G2 is probably too much light most of the time.



I think an L1 Cree would be perfect for her, 2 stages, good run time, and the fit in hand makes the L1 Cree a perfect little light.



> As for the main light, I think I decided on a Fenix L0D with a Rebel. That gives her a pretty good amount of light on one AAA batt for a decent runtime. The guys said a lot of people over there carry something like this or an Arc AAA on their id neck strap. Since they have to always have that, they can't forget it.



I would make this the back up light.



> I probably will still throw in a Photon Freedom,



Put this on her keychain........





Bill


----------



## MarNav1 (Oct 30, 2007)

*Re: Cousin going to Iraq, what lights to send?*

Lumapower Transformer w 2 stage clickie. Or a Surefire L1 Cree and add a Red or Blue filter, best of both worlds.


----------



## Hodsta (Oct 30, 2007)

*Re: Cousin going to Iraq, what lights to send?*



kurni said:


> For military... I prefer to be sure... fire... or probably Novatac.
> 
> I prefer a tank over a cheap / fancy light.


 
I agree totally.................I would stalk B/S/T over in the market place for a couple of days and pick up a Novatac 120P or a HDS mod, this combined with an SF04 Beam diffuser a couple of RCR13s and a cheap Nano charger is about the most versatile EDC I can think of. With an ArcAAA on the keychain I think your cousin will have a light combination that can run for 100's hours on low, provide high burst with a reasonable throw, be a useful reading or flood light with the diffuser attached an be fully redundant with the Arc as backup.


----------



## djblank87 (Oct 30, 2007)

*Re: Cousin going to Iraq, what lights to send?*

I have to agree with the NovaTac suggestion, if you get the P model you can program what ever your lumen heart desires. It's built like a damn tank and is one of the best choices so far. 

Also you can run RCR's threw it so pick up some AW's and a charger and that should be plenty.


----------



## jbosman1013 (Oct 30, 2007)

*Re: Cousin going to Iraq, what lights to send?*

with all the love for the surefire A2 and still no suggestions. I don't own one but it seems like the best light for the job, regulated incan, long runtime leds plus with available cr123's on base hard to go wrong. My vote goes for the A2 and a ArcAAA


----------



## mdocod (Oct 30, 2007)

*Re: Cousin going to Iraq, what lights to send?*

I would think that new zebralight H50 (which can be used as a headlamp or a handheld) would be great for 90% of tasks, then include something with some throwing power. Like any 2xCR123 powered cree out there, be it a Surefire G2LED or Tiablo A8 or even something as simple as a 2C mag with a terralux. Just some sortof decently powerful handheld LED. Incans are nice but they eat cells, and rechargeable systems may be more of a hassle than they are worth when over seas. So just stick with cree based LED lights as they will save her on cell costs in the long run. send a box of quality brand CR123s with her if you do send a CR123 based light because you just never know what the latest CR123 situation is going to be over there and I am hearing different things about their availability all the time. One buddy of mine spent awhile over there doing room clearing and he had access to plenty of SF CR123s and was issued a SF 6P or M2 or something (or at least that's what it sounded like from what he described).... others have reported difficulty getting any batteries let alone CR123s.


----------



## mlhm5 (Oct 30, 2007)

*Need to Send a Flashlight to Marine In Iraq*

Have no idea what to send. 

Suggestions appreciated.


Picked one of these up and am sending it along with the care package.


----------



## Per Arne (Oct 30, 2007)

*Re: Cousin going to Iraq, what lights to send?*

Mini Maglite AA w/ TerraLUX TLE-5 Red LED and SureFire F04 Diffuserlens 
- and an spare TerraLUX TLE-5 White LED or the cree model... for easy swaping...
or SureFire "old" model L1 two-stage Red LED with SureFire F04... 

SureFire G2 w/ F24/FM34 Diffuser lens and SC1 carrier with spare lamp (P60/P61) and batteries... 

And maybe some Nite-Ize items to go with the Maglite AA; headband, mouthpiece, cone etc...


----------



## JimmyM (Oct 30, 2007)

*Re: Need to Send a Flashlight to Marine In Iraq*

Do you know how he/she would employ the light?
If they would just be using it for reading is one thing. Carrying on-duty is another.
Personally, I think several lights from DX would be fine, but if it needs to be a truly "tactical" light, then I'm sure others here would suggest a SureFire. I like the E1e or L1.


----------



## Tiny86 (Oct 30, 2007)

*Re: Need to Send a Flashlight to Marine In Iraq*

If you looking for a tactical type then a Blackhawk Gladius.


----------



## LG&M (Oct 30, 2007)

*Re: Need to Send a Flashlight to Marine In Iraq*

As jimmy said it depends a lot on how it will be used. What ever you send tell them Semper Fidelis for me. Thanks.


----------



## thiswayup (Oct 30, 2007)

*Re: Need to Send a Flashlight to Marine In Iraq*



JimmyM said:


> Do you know how he/she would employ the light?
> If they would just be using it for reading is one thing. Carrying on-duty is another.
> Personally, I think several lights from DX would be fine, but if it needs to be a truly "tactical" light, then I'm sure others here would suggest a SureFire. I like the E1e or L1.



Or maybe not, as the cells might be impossible to find in-theatre. 

Troops will be issued with combat lights if they need them, so this will probably be a personal light. Get something with multiple brightness levels that takes easy to find cells - which means AA's or D's - and doesn't add weight to his gear. A single AA Fenix L1D could be a good choice. Very bright when needed, dims down for reading, easy to buy, easy to feed, made to a high standard re. water and sand proofing.


----------



## mlhm5 (Oct 30, 2007)

*Re: Need to Send a Flashlight to Marine In Iraq*

It is for personal use. Would this be appropriate?
http://www.all-battery.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=1965


----------



## Patriot (Oct 30, 2007)

*Re: Need to Send a Flashlight to Marine In Iraq*



mlhm5 said:


> It is for personal use. Would this be appropriate?
> http://www.all-battery.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=1965


 

Are there any cost considerations? While some decent lights can be purchased for under $30, there are many more higher quality options in the $50 - $100 range.

What does he do with his personal light? Does he use it to read, for walking around the barracks at night, etc?

For all around use the G2L would be a nice light for a soldier. 

http://batteryjunction.com/g2-led-.html


----------



## Gunner12 (Oct 30, 2007)

*Re: Need to Send a Flashlight to Marine In Iraq*

If it for EDC use and won't be seeing a lot of action(I presume this will not be his/her primary light in action). I would recommend a multilevel light like the Fenix P2D-CE Q5. Small and bright. Even a Dealextreme lights would suffice for a EDC light. I would go for something smaller and runs on 1 AA battery.

Instead of the light in your link, how about the 3W Seoul. 2 AA, hefty and good brightness.

For EDC, and very tough, spend extra for the Novatac 120P or 120T.

Any price range and size restrictions?


----------



## Lightguy27 (Oct 30, 2007)

*Re: Need to Send a Flashlight to Marine In Iraq*



Patriot36 said:


> Are there any cost considerations? While some decent lights can be purchased for under $30, there are many more higher quality options in the $50 - $100 range.
> 
> What does he do with his personal light? Does he use it to read, for walking around the barracks at night, etc?
> 
> ...


 

I will second patiot on the g2l. It is very bright and the batteries last a long time. So order him a g2l and a box or two of Surefire batteries and that will make one happy Marine.:thumbsup:


----------



## jbosman1013 (Oct 30, 2007)

*Re: Need to Send a Flashlight to Marine In Iraq*

surefire, surefire, surefire


----------



## Blue72 (Oct 30, 2007)

*Re: Need to Send a Flashlight to Marine In Iraq*

another one for surefire g2l. Why give him a light that might fail during combat.


----------



## willrx (Oct 30, 2007)

*Re: Need to Send a Flashlight to Marine In Iraq*



LG&M said:


> As jimmy said it depends a lot on how it will be used. What ever you send tell them Semper Fidelis for me. Thanks.



+1


----------



## lightemup (Oct 30, 2007)

*Re: Need to Send a Flashlight to Marine In Iraq*

I'll throw in a recommendation for the Surefire Cree L1. Runs on a single reliable lithium SF123 battery (lithium has better temperature resistance as well as shelf life), has two stage output (10 lumens for 16 hours and 65 lumens for 1.5 hours) and is as durable / reliable as you'll get.

I'd also suggest getting a bushwacker tip off red filter for the L1 (it just flips up so you can use the normal beam), i've got one on mine and it makes it perfect. With the red filter on low level it is great for not disturbing others when you're reading or moving etc, and likewise depending on what his role will be the red light will help OPSEC in certain situations. 

If he takes say 2 dozen sf123's then running on a single sf123 he should get ALOT of life out of the L1 if he only uses the high output when he needs it. Maybe in a Pelican 1020 case, or acouple of Surefire spares carriers? The G2L is also a good option, but IMHO because of what i've described here I would prefer the L1 for that application. For some the option of having lower levels of light is just as important as having a bright light. The L1 with the red filter gives you both


----------



## Vermonter73 (Oct 30, 2007)

*Re: Need to Send a Flashlight to Marine In Iraq*

Surefire with a Q5 drop-in. Then he can show-up his buddies who have stock Surefires


----------



## LightJaguar (Oct 31, 2007)

*Re: Need to Send a Flashlight to Marine In Iraq*

The Marines are the smallest branch of the military and the ones with the least money. They don't get all the fancy things that the Army gets. It might be much better to send a flashlight that uses common batteries.


----------



## NA8 (Oct 31, 2007)

*Re: Need to Send a Flashlight to Marine In Iraq*

Ask him what kind of batteries he has access to over there and then send him the appropriate light from the above suggestions.


----------



## boosterboy (Oct 31, 2007)

*Re: Need to Send a Flashlight to Marine In Iraq*

Just a little note, it's pretty hot over there.

So you guys should keep in mind that LEDs don't play well in extremely hot environments.


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## thiswayup (Oct 31, 2007)

*Re: Need to Send a Flashlight to Marine In Iraq*



NA8 said:


> Ask him what kind of batteries he has access to over there and then send him the appropriate light from the above suggestions.



A poster in the "airbase" thread already said that Cr123's are not available in Iraq, except in a few areas (like said airbase). I'd go with an AA light, and send a charger and Eneloops - avoiding NIMHs that self discharge is important if the light is needed for an emergency. Unless this *is* a combat light, in which case a Surefire might be best - although the new L1 seems to have real teething troubles, judging from recent threads.


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## thiswayup (Oct 31, 2007)

*Re: Need to Send a Flashlight to Marine In Iraq*



boosterboy said:


> Just a little note, it's pretty hot over there.
> 
> So you guys should keep in mind that LEDs don't play well in extremely hot environments.



Yes, but lights tend to get used at night - when it's much cooler.


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## MarNav1 (Oct 31, 2007)

*Re: Need to Send a Flashlight to Marine In Iraq*



NA8 said:


> Ask him what kind of batteries he has access to over there and then send him the appropriate light from the above suggestions.


I'd say L1, 2 boxes of batteries. You can always send him more batteries. Plus blue and red filters are availible as well. You can send him a box of batteries each month while he's there if he can't get em. Or an Inova X5 would probly work well too. Or a Lumapower Transformer, will work with AA or 123 cells.


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## Lightguy27 (Oct 31, 2007)

*Re: Need to Send a Flashlight to Marine In Iraq*



dd61999 said:


> another one for surefire g2l. Why give him a light that might fail during combat.


 
Sorry, I didnt realize the context of speach at first. My apologies.


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## jbosman1013 (Oct 31, 2007)

*Re: Need to Send a Flashlight to Marine In Iraq*

the G2L would be a great light but because of the heat transfer issue I would go with the 6PL, more output for longer. Don't settle for a lesser light buy a surefire.


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## Oddjob (Oct 31, 2007)

*Re: Need to Send a Flashlight to Marine In Iraq*

Don't know what to suggest for a primary light but may I suggest an ARC AAA for a back up/personal use light. Size and weight are negligable and the newest ones are quite bright with about 5 hours of runtime (with many more hours at lower brightness) on common AAA alkalines. Good to have a back up because as they say, two is one and one is none. Please extend my regards for the safety of your friend and all others serving.


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## Gunner12 (Oct 31, 2007)

*Re: Need to Send a Flashlight to Marine In Iraq*



mlhm5 said:


> ...Picked one of these up and am sending it along with the care package. (Taskforce Cree picture)



That might be fine for a non duty light but IMO quality is still a little on the low side. You might want to test the light if you haven't yet to make sure that it works without flickering.


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## TITAN1833 (Oct 31, 2007)

*Re: Need to Send a Flashlight to Marine In Iraq*

d-mini comes to mind?


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## PPGMD (Oct 31, 2007)

*Re: Cousin going to Iraq, what lights to send?*

Surefire 6PL and a ton of batteries.

Perhaps a high output drop in module for it, and a red filter.


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## DMC (Oct 31, 2007)

*Re: Cousin going to Iraq, what lights to send?*

I know you asked about a light, but have you thought about one of these instead?
http://www.dealextreme.com/search.dx/search.cell phone signal blocker


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## mwelch8404 (Nov 1, 2007)

*Re: Cousin going to Iraq, what lights to send?*

This would be my "best of both worlds" choice to go along with your favourite aaa, like a peak, fenix, etc.

http://www.lighthound.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=2492


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## Illum (Nov 1, 2007)

*Re: Cousin going to Iraq, what lights to send?*

theres a couple old threads on this, a lot of new lights have come out since.
but for reference
*Cousin going to Iraq - need light recommendations!
** Good flashlight for a Marine? (cousin is going to Iraq)*


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## lightemup (Nov 2, 2007)

*Re: Need to Send a Flashlight to Marine In Iraq*

Lightguy I could be wrong, but if you re-read dd's post he is actually recommending the Surefire G2L  .


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## lightemup (Nov 2, 2007)

*Re: Need to Send a Flashlight to Marine In Iraq*

Re LED's and heat: They are a tool, and if you leave them sitting in the Sun etc my thoughts would be you would be causing more issues with batteries than anything else. Surefire are very good in my experience with mentioning possible issues with the operation of their equipment. 

Case in point: the new x300 does reference the problems some Glocks have been having with weaponlights (mainly .40 cals although the problem is rare even with them). This is a responsible practice and one that is appreciated by the end user. If the led's were more susceptible to heat than the incandescents, i'm confident there would be an appropriate warning attached.... 

Using the P60L as an example it has a thermal sensor that prevents it from being damaged from heat when using constant on. As to what this would do in terms of brightness is anyone's guess in real world usage (a dip in 10 lumens compared to the 6pl may not be that noticeable in usage). 

For people using aftermarket led modules as far as i'm concerned alot of them might be great, but the main bonuses they bring to my knowledge are possibly increased output and maybe lower price, not increases in durability or reliability that in the case of a duty light are paramount.

If a LED light has undergone an appropriate research, development and testing phase (such as Surefires, Inovas, Pelicans etc) I don't think heat would be any more of an issue than it always has been in terms of flashlights. 

Just my 2 cents 

Mlhm5: What Batteries does that light take for curiosities sake?


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## darkwing7678 (Nov 2, 2007)

*Re: Good flashlight for a Marine? (cousin is going to Iraq)*

Hi
i'm serving as an officer in Turkish Army.Jumpmaster has a good point of view.As in Murphy Laws; if the enemy is in ur line of sight ur in the line of sight of him too.when u throw tons of lumens around to see them, how can u conceal urself? Light discipline is the word.Probably we watch too many movies of SWATs breaching through walls or windows when lights up. 
if he will be deployed to serve in night combats he will be surely equipped with NVGs and ir emitting pointers to see and aim at night as we do here.But when fighting in caves or houses we do need a powerful ir light source.we also need a light to read maps.
here's my offer; any light that suits the rail system with an optional ir mask.and inova microlight or photon freedom with green led to read map.why green instead of red?red preserves night vision but green has a lover level of visibility and we use sephia and red ink in our maps to mark cities and land shapes which are unable to see with red light.i'm not sure what ur army has..


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## robinsok (Nov 2, 2007)

*Re: Cousin going to Iraq, what lights to send?*



DMC said:


> I know you asked about a light, but have you thought about one of these instead?
> http://www.dealextreme.com/search.dx/search.cell phone signal blocker





Why?


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## LightJaguar (Nov 2, 2007)

*Re: Cousin going to Iraq, what lights to send?*



robinsok said:


> Why?


 
I'm guessing to stop roadside bombs from being activated by remote control.


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## Blue72 (Nov 3, 2007)

*Re: Need to Send a Flashlight to Marine In Iraq*



lightemup said:


> Lightguy I could be wrong, but if you re-read dd's post he is actually recommending the Surefire G2L  .


 
Exactly


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## nanotech17 (Nov 3, 2007)

*Re: Cousin going to Iraq, what lights to send?*

get the nitecore .


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## RebelXTNC (Nov 3, 2007)

*Re: Cousin going to Iraq, what lights to send?*

As a backup that can be used either hands-free or traditionally, the Pentagonlight MOLLE is very useful. I got mine from Tactical Response Gear for $29 and use them quite often attached to a pocket when a headlamp is not available. Nice forward clickie and runs on 1xAA. Also has either a blue filter with the black model or a red filter with the desert tan model.


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## jeep44 (Nov 4, 2007)

*Re: Need to Send a Flashlight to Marine In Iraq*

My son was in Iraq last year in a MiTT team. He had all the 123 batteries he needed. AAA batteries were the one size he couldn't readily get where he was, so I sent him big packs of them. He used them mainly in his headlight,which was a very useful thing to have. If your Marine doesn't already have one, send him one. During his first tour there, he was doing things like nighttime roadblocks and car searches. He had my SF Z2, but if he was going back now, I would make sure he had an MRV or Tiablo. I sent him a Fenix P3D a month or so ago.


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## Outdoors Fanatic (Nov 4, 2007)

*Re: Need to Send a Flashlight to Marine In Iraq*

Cut no corners. Buy him a SureFire.


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## liquidinfo (Nov 5, 2007)

*Re: Need to Send a Flashlight to Marine In Iraq*



thiswayup said:


> A poster in the "airbase" thread already said that Cr123's are not available in Iraq, except in a few areas (like said airbase). I'd go with an AA light, and send a charger and Eneloops - avoiding NIMHs ....


 
yeah, where is the guy at anyway? I can tell you that if hes on or near one of the big camps (ie Anaconda, Victory, or Taji), he has a PX that has a Surefire kiosk with lights galore and surefire 123 pairs for about 4 bucks.. Also the energizer 123's are available at many army PX's and shopettes (for 8 bucks a pair). i havent been able to find a lithium AAA since I've been here though; energizer lithium AA's are plentiful everywhere.

I've been tempted to get a E2E or E2D here a couple times from the PX but I'm holding out for a Lumapower M1-R (batteryjunction.com) which should be in this week. at any rate I'll have plenty of 123's!


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## ROCK6 (Nov 5, 2007)

*Re: Need to Send a Flashlight to Marine In Iraq*



liquidinfo said:


> yeah, where is the guy at anyway? I can tell you that if hes on or near one of the big camps (ie Anaconda, Victory, or Taji), he has a PX that has a Surefire kiosk with lights galore and surefire 123 pairs for about 4 bucks.. Also the energizer 123's are available at many army PX's and shopettes (for 8 bucks a pair). i havent been able to find a lithium AAA since I've been here though; energizer lithium AA's are plentiful everywhere.
> 
> I've been tempted to get a E2E or E2D here a couple times from the PX but I'm holding out for a Lumapower M1-R (batteryjunction.com) which should be in this week. at any rate I'll have plenty of 123's!


 
Well, they finally removed the blocked IP for CPF...it's only been 14 months:scowl: As far as access to 123 batteries, just make sure they check with their local commo-guys as most our COMSEC devices run off 123 batteries. Either that or have Surefire send him a dozen...

I'll say first off, a good light that will do different output levels is very handy. A good headlamp is very handy as well for hands-free work. Contrary to popular belief a massive lumen-output cannon isn't always the right tool for the job. Most of my traveling to the smaller COP's and FOB's has been via helo, so it's nice to have the option for lower light output. I hang my MICH on a larger COB in the the north, and I'm able to do my morning runs. I've been using the single cell LED's (Fenix P2D, L1D and Novatac's 120EDC). The strobe functions are actually a nice option to keep the KBR contractors from running you over

I've been using a Surefire Aviator, L2 (older version), G2 with drop in LED, LumaHunter, Mil Novatac (I was able to get a few to T&E), Fenix lights (most all the Cree versions) and both Petzl and Princeton Tec's EOS headlamps.

As much as I like the robust twist-operated lights, the tailcap clickies are the easiest to operate one handed or with gloves.

ROCK6


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## tobushomme (Nov 5, 2007)

*Re: Need to Send a Flashlight to Marine In Iraq*

Hi there,

I'd also go for the G2L. I like it even better than the 6PL. It is lighter and tougher. The only bad thing is the quick death of the batterys. So he should always carry spares.

Don't take a Fenix!!! Dust just kills it. And the switch sucks.

If your life depends on it - get SF

God bless our troops!

take care


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## clipse (Nov 6, 2007)

*Re: Need to Send a Flashlight to Marine In Iraq*

I would agree with the G2L. I know some military personel in the sandbox that use the regular G2 and or 6P quite frequently for tactical purposes. They have said that it is plenty bright. The G2L is as bright but runs longer. 

clipse


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## Lightguy27 (Nov 6, 2007)

*Re: Need to Send a Flashlight to Marine In Iraq*



dd61999 said:


> Exactly


 
Sorry, I thought that you were saying that it wouldnt be a good light choice.


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## stitch_paradox (Nov 6, 2007)

*Re: Need to Send a Flashlight to Marine In Iraq*



Lightguy27 said:


> FAIL????? Could you perhaps explain to us how you think the g2l would fail! And dont say the heat could hurt the led because the g2l was designed for use by soildiers. And im sure that Surefire tested it in rigourous heat tests. But if you can think of another reason share it with us before you say it will probably fail.




some people should really read the whole thread first before giving comments.
the guy's actually recommending the SFgl2

:shrug:


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## ROCK6 (Nov 7, 2007)

*Re: Need to Send a Flashlight to Marine In Iraq*



tobushomme said:


> Hi there,
> 
> I'd also go for the G2L. I like it even better than the 6PL. It is lighter and tougher. The only bad thing is the quick death of the batterys. So he should always carry spares.
> 
> ...


 
Not sure of your experience with the Fenix lights in a dusty environment, but I've had no issues with all the CE models except the P3D here in Iraq. For general use, they've excelled even when dropped and sunk in 6" of talc-powdered dust, droped on paved airfields/roads and smacked against walls and doors. Now, I do agree, if I was out kicking down doors, I would stick with my Surefires or Novatac. I do agree that the switch isn't the most robust, but again, for general use, they've given me no issues. My only issue with the single output lights like the G2L is that 90% of the time, you won't need that amount of light. The majority of tasks can be accomplished with 10-30 lumens of output...searching through your ruck or around your cot for items without waking everybody else up, heading out to the crapper, running in the dark, etc. 

If you do go with a a good bright light like the G2L, than get a second, such as the Fenix L1D (single AA) as a utility light (also the Nite Ize headband tansforms it into a simple headlamp) or a good headlamp like the TacTikka or EOS. Just to be on the safe side, I would send a couple packs of Lithium batteries for whatever lights you decide on. As already mentioned, you can pretty easily obtain 123 and AA lithiums, but I've had to have my wife send me AAA Lithiums. Another option is some RCR123A batteries and a charger or a small AA/AAA charger and some Eneloops. I've used the rechargeables when on the FOB, but switch to regular lithiums when heading out of the wire.

Both a SF G2L (~$60+) and Pinceton-Tec EOS (~$40) or Petzl TacTikka (~$40) would cover most needs and uses.

ROCK6


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## gopurple (Nov 7, 2007)

*Re: Cousin going to Iraq, what lights to send?*

I was deploy to Iraq for 6 months, this is from my personal experience: The availability of types of battery depends on the unit commander and supply officer. They have certain amount of funds to spend on supplies, they can order via the NSN (National supply Number) system, buy it locally or have members from home station send what they need. Best to check with the unit to see what they stock.

Being on base and not going outside the fence, you won't need Tactical high throw flashlights. I would suggest mult mode light with long run time, being assigned to the office means not using the light outside in the heat or cold for extended period of time, so Li battery is not a requirement but it doesn't hurt.

Don't expect the BX to have what you need, when there is a surge of troops like now, things run out fast.

Also get a low intensity red or green LED light, a lot of guys clip a Photon Micro Light on their uniform ( I had the red Photon and the Streamlight clipmate green LED). More then likely you will be in a tent or dorm like situation with room mates. A bright light at night will **** off a lot of people. A light that can be attached to your cloths or hang on you neck will help going to the Porta-Potty at night.

Don't depend on rechargable, electricity is not the most dependable and will get a lot of surge, I've change a lot of fuse on my power supply. Tell your Cousin to be safe and good luck.

Steve


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## mousehunter (Nov 9, 2007)

*Re: Need to Send a Flashlight to Marine In Iraq*

Just curious, for those who know, which would be preferable (price not withstanding) a g2l or a 6pl. I assume (dangerous thing) that the light output is the same - but is there an advantage/disadvantage for one case over the other.


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## TMedina (Nov 10, 2007)

*Re: Need to Send a Flashlight to Marine In Iraq*

I was stationed on Anaconda for a year - you could always get 123s, but AAs and AAAs were the first to go for CD/mp3 players and the like.

I had half a dozen lights for specific functions - it depends, as others have said, on what he plans on using it for and what kind of budget you have in mind.

I tinkered with five or six different lights to work out a combination for me and my daily needs.

But I kept a Surefire C2 and a spare carrier with replacement bulb and batteries with my 'rattle, just in case.

-Medina

Edit: Mouse, I'd opt for the 6PL - the feel of metal is just more reassuring for me than the plastic in the "oh _hell_" moments.


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## BentHeadTX (Nov 11, 2007)

*Re: Need to Send a Flashlight to Marine In Iraq*

If he needs a combat light, get him a SF with a box of batteries. His EDC depends on what he does with it, walking around or a backup light for his weapon light? 

My brother-in-law was in Baghdad for 15 months and used a Surefire ??? for his weapon light. He also carried a SF G2 although his backup light was a Streamlight Strion rechargable (he is normally a cop in his normal life) The Strion got the most use since it was rechargable. 

A friend of mine went to Afghanistan and I set him up with Peak Matterhorn 1 LED lights, one in white and the other, red. They were fed a steady diet of rechargables as was his Peak Mediterranean 2AA (Luxeon) sitting in a Ripoffs CO47-FL holster. 

He visited me a year later and still wears both Matterhorn 1AAA lights on a neck lanyard!  Although he has no need (or want) for the SF lights, he still uses the 1AAA lights daily. 

Have some guys at work heading to Afghanistan and Iraq and asked for "the list". The list is the top 43 things people don't think about needing until they put boots in the dust. They have the multi-tools (Leatherman Charge Ti w/optional bit kits and bit extension) they are getting other various things but hung up on rechargable batteries, charger and flashlights. 

The charger was easy (Maha C-9000 with optional 12V cord) batteries are a no-brainer (Sanyo Eneloop NiMH) but flashlights was a case of discussion. After much debate, they agreed to three different types. Peak Matterhorn 1AAA with red LED on a lanyard, Peak Baltic SSC LED Ultrapower (fits in Charge Ti holster side pocket and will run on Eneloop AAA) and for the single AA EDC holster light? Peak Pacific standard power (HP) with optional 1AA twistie body. 

They got to play around with a Peak Mediterranean 2AA stainless steel beast (too heavy!) Fenix L2D RB100 (don't believe in the durability) Peak Mediterranean HA-III aluminum CR123A body (nice, hate the batteries) Peak Mediterranean 2AA HA-III Luxeon (too large) Fire~Fly III (too small, too heavy, not available) KD SSC AAA (short runtime, durability of a potato chip) and Peak First Responder (awesome light but too large) 

They loved the Peak Baltic 1AAA SSC HP since it is bright enough for what they need for walking around/working on stuff etc. It also fits in the Leatherman holster pocket so it's a no brainer. The Pacific with 1AA body was selected since it is strong, proven (Iraq 2005 and Afghanistan 2006) has great runtime with Eneloop AA (7-8 hours or all night) They understand the dust bowl will destroy clickie switches so twistie it is. :thumbsup: 

I go next September for 6 months, my 2003 Arc AAA black HA-III "sterile" with red LED will be my lanyard light. Peak Baltic SSC UP in the Leatherman Charge Ti side pocket, Peak 1AA 7 UV LED in holster and ????? for holster EDC. My high powered light will be a modified Peak First Responder with three Cree Q5 emitters and three Fraen FRC reflectors. It will also run the optional extended heat sink and, if I can get it... a two 18500 lithium-ion body. The big cannon will be a Quad Q5 Cree HA-III 8AA bored Mag with a MaxFlex board, Kiu strike bezel running Eneloops. The Peak FR and Mag are in modification stage at this point... they should be done by the end of the year.

I will get those Matterhorn and Pacifics on order next week, the battle still rages over aluminum or stainless Baltic 1AAA for the Charge holsters.  I think the stainless crowd will win since they are bomb-proof.


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## paulr (Nov 11, 2007)

*Re: Need to Send a Flashlight to Marine In Iraq*

They have the baltic and pacific in titanium, I think.


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## TMedina (Nov 11, 2007)

*Re: Need to Send a Flashlight to Marine In Iraq*

My only real hesitation on rechargeables is the potential loss of power.

Even on Anaconda, we had power failures periodically, lasting up to a week and a half at some stretches.

Batteries might get expensive, but you aren't tied to a converter and power source either.

As always, your own mileage may vary.

-Medina

Edit: And the customized electronics can be difficult to replace if they fail, for whatever reason. Even if you don't bring secondaries along, you may want to make a list of stock items that will fill the same roles, if you have to go that route.


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## BentHeadTX (Nov 12, 2007)

*Re: Need to Send a Flashlight to Marine In Iraq*



TMedina said:


> My only real hesitation on rechargeables is the potential loss of power.
> 
> Even on Anaconda, we had power failures periodically, lasting up to a week and a half at some stretches.
> 
> ...



Very true,
That is one of the reasons I spec chargers that run on 12 volt automotive power. Use Eneloops so they won't self discharge and using AAA/AA will provide spare cells to keep the lights running (clocks, self powered speakers, MP3 players etc.) Having spare alkaline/lithium AAA/AA cells is a given and can be brought in with your other stuff. 
I like the C-9000 for the temperature sensors that prevent overheating of the cells. When I was in Anaconda (USAF calls it Balad) my Accumanager 20 was constantly charging AA cells to provide power for flashlights, self-powered speakers and other items. My buddies really appreciated it that I brought along 20 AA NiMH batteries  

Good point to have everything backed up out there. The Pacific has two bodies, one AAA and the other AA. It can use the battery out of the 1AAA red light on the neck lanyard or just use the Baltic 1AAA in the Leatherman holster. The 1AA Pacific can use the 1AA from the Killmanjaro 1AA 7 UV light located in the holster that holds your knife which backs up the Leatherman knife. 

My first trip to Iraq involved a place that had no stores and no re-supply. What your brought with you, that was what you had. Batteries were in very short supply hence why I spec rechargables with chargers that run on 12V. Bring a cheap slow charger with you to back up the C-9000 as two equals one and one equals none rule. Protect the chargers and your other electronics with a Tripp Lite Isobar 4 or 6 EMI/EFI aluminum surge suppressor and you should be fine. 

Don't forget to bring along spare cells for your buddies, they will protect the charger and your other stuff for you.


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## fluke (Dec 1, 2007)

*Flashlight For A Friend In Iraq ???*

As title, suggestions for a flashlight gift for a friend in Iraq.


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## Sigman (Dec 1, 2007)

Closing Part 1 and continuing here in Part 2...


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