# Z2 Combat Light



## dirtynorseman

Been reading lots lately and figured I should finally join this great forum. While going through the junk bin of old equipment at work I came across a Surefire Z2 Combat Light. It was not working but was in mint like new condition. I started checking for a replacement lamp and came across CPF. I found out the light could be converted to LED. Due to everything I read on here I decided to purchase a Malkoff Devices M61L. It seemed to be a good balance between lumen and run time. 

The drop in arrived this past weekend and the Z2 is now an awesome torch. I feel like this may be starting me on a dangerous path towards an expensive new hobby. Thanks to all who post here and share your knowledge. 

Now to see what can be done with some old Surefire 8X and incandescent Streamlight Strions...


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## ven

Z2's :rock: 











p60 engines are almost endless, cheaper end(of good) the sportac range, sinlge LED or triple options in various flovours and modes(single or dual mode).
Custom, vinhs p60's, Oveready's to name two makers...............Of course the OE bulb which no doubt would have failed hence not working. These are actually excellent , around 60 or so lumens of warm 100cri illumination. 

Cells wise, i run 16650 sanyo's in mine, 2500mah and a lot cheaper to run than cr123 fuel for me here in the UK. 4.2v or 4.35v(unprotected sanyo) are less V than the 2x cr123's 6v's, but its not much to the eye and as good as free after buying. 





Enjoy:welcome:


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## id30209

@ven , i was just waiting for your reply ) OP, ven can give you proper advice about how to use Z2!
And enjoy his pic post🤗

About 8X...i have one also but not much can be done except buying TadCustoms 18650 battery adapter to run X80 a bit brighter and longer. Try to find KT5 turbo head (one danish shop has it) and enjoy even more beautifull beam.

About streamlights can’t say anything cause i don’t have any 

Oh yeah, this is how i start this neverending hobby[emoji48]


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## ven

Haha i love the z2 and just cant help posting as pic...................or 3


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## ven

Never ending!





Got to add the mighty 6p 





Must have c2 as well





Little E series although not p60 compatible, modules can be bought


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## id30209

Oh man, you did it again. I’m drooling while updating my TO BUY list LOL!


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## ven

Some of my fav's





E triple nichia's, 





Speaking of triple nichia, the end 4 are p60 nichia's


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## id30209

ven said:


> Some of my fav's
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> E triple nichia's,
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Speaking of triple nichia, the end 4 are p60 nichia's



Top picture, second from left, next to a PK rocket. WHAT IS IT????


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## ven

id30209 said:


> Top picture, second from left, next to a PK rocket. WHAT IS IT????



Its the head and tail off the PK PRX weapon mount with the pocket rocket body, here swapped around


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## id30209

Aaaaaaand another item in BUY list.....
I should stop following your posts.


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## ven

id30209 said:


> Aaaaaaand another item in BUY list.....
> I should stop following your posts.



Yes fantastic little lights, 16340 fed.

My apologies,


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## id30209

Not to go off topic, in my Z2 is Sportac 2-level triple Nichia. Love this combo...

PS dang it ven, need to go for a “calm down” pills now


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## dirtynorseman

Do the 16650’s require modification/boring to the Z2 body? Which rechargeable batteries can be used with no modifications?


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## ven

I have a SF incand bulb or 2 in work, now and then i swap out the sportac triple 219b dual mode for it.


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## Kestrel

Z's are my favorite, also. 

https://www.dropbox.com/s/qlhrfgy0ixpvz71/20180610_132727.jpg?dl=0


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## irongate

Very nice collection there Ven.


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## id30209

Kestrel, nice oldies! Love’em


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## knucklegary

^^ Ven is the beam shots Sportac triple 219b tint?


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## kamagong

I wish I could luck into a mint like new condition Z2.


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## id30209

kamagong said:


> I wish I could luck into a mint like new condition Z2.



Well if you plan to just look at it on the shelf...
I preffer users, not abused


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## Bullzeyebill

kamagong said:


> I wish I could luck into a mint like new condition Z2.



I would take a beaten up z2, in fact just the body would be good.

Bill


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## Chauncey Gardiner

ven said:


> Some of my fav's
> 
> 
> Speaking of triple nichia, the end 4 are p60 nichia's



Tall order to outdo ven when it comes to most interesting lights photo. :thumbsup: 

~ CG


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## scout24

Kestrel- Is the 7Z/ 2x18650 Zerores/ Triple still in your stable? I should bump that build thread... 😁

(At the risk of going off-topic...)


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## dirtynorseman

Those are some amazing looking lights ven. Surefire 6P is at the top of my list for next light. I do have a hard time leaving anything stock so should be perfect.


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## scout24

dirtynorseman- Welcome! Here's some required reading...  

https://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?182392-Why-is-the-SureFire-6P-so-good


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## dirtynorseman

scout24 said:


> dirtynorseman- Welcome! Here's some required reading...
> 
> https://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?182392-Why-is-the-SureFire-6P-so-good




Thanks for for the recommendation. That is a thread I’ve already been reading through. 😏👍


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## novice

dirtynorseman said:


> Do the 16650’s require modification/boring to the Z2 body? Which rechargeable batteries can be used with no modifications?



dirtynorseman,
You can use either 16650 rechargeable Li-ion cells, or 17670 cells, in the Z2 without any modifications being done to your light. These days, because of more R&D being done to 16650 cells, certain 16650 cells have more storage capacity than the 17670 cell. Paying attention to voltage, you could use either a single 16670 cell (3.7 volts), or two 16340 cells (7.4 volts) in your Z2. There are aftermarket choices for incan lamp assemblies in either 3.7v, or 7.4v, as well. Lots of options. Rechargeable Li-ion cells are frequently referred to as 4.2 volts, but that is their "resting voltage". When you put them in something and turn it on, their voltage immediately (well, within nanoseconds...) drops to 3.7 volts. Some led modules safe for 7.4 volts will also run at full output on 3.7v for a briefer period, and some will not.


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## dirtynorseman

Thank you for the reply novice. Much appreciated.


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## ven

Kestrel said:


> Z's are my favorite, also.
> 
> https://www.dropbox.com/s/qlhrfgy0ixpvz71/20180610_132727.jpg?dl=0



Awesome family, love the z3!!! Also a fan of the g2z, 








irongate said:


> Very nice collection there Ven.



Thank you sir



knucklegary said:


> ^^ Ven is the beam shots Sportac triple 219b tint?



The beam pics are the incand drop in, here another of said




IMHO its an amazing beam, and although weak in todays lumens, can still hold its own for quality. For CRI it of course kicks LED's a55! Hot spot is a little too focused for my work uses, but does get some use still. Also have a few bulbs at home for the nostalgia times(and mr fixers incand week)




I love the E incand as well












All be them a little under driven on sanyo 16650 fuel(4.35v), the beam is still super nice


Chauncey Gardiner said:


> Tall order to outdo ven when it comes to most interesting lights photo. :thumbsup:
> 
> ~ CG


Thank you for kind words CG



dirtynorseman said:


> Those are some amazing looking lights ven. Surefire 6P is at the top of my list for next light. I do have a hard time leaving anything stock so should be perfect.




Thank you, there are many too add over time. 6p a must, the c2 another. Beauty is, you can swap the engines around when ever(p60) you feel. Back to the 80's and 90's with incand flavours. Triples and quads of now for huge output, with programmable drivers, oslon flat for crazy throw(even in the small p60 reflector). Various malkoff p60's as well........................enjoy the ride.


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## konifans

My favorite 2-cell Surefire.


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## konifans

It fits the turbohead perfectly!


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## ven

:kewlpics::rock:


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## id30209

Beautifull!!!


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## Kestrel

scout24 said:


> Kestrel- Is the 7Z/ 2x18650 Zerores/ Triple still in your stable? I should bump that build thread...


You bet, it's the longest one, a slot from the right; My all-time favorite 'big light', but only 1/2" longer than a 2x17500 'C3' for example. 



ven said:


> Awesome family, love the z3!!! [...]


Thx; but actually no Z3 in that pic; I owned a /very/ nice one for a while, but it crossed the Atlantic after an offer I couldn't refuse - IMO the Z3 is the rarest production 'Z' (with the possible exception of the 12Z).
But I do prefer the earlier 9Z's slightly more, which explains the selection in my pic above.


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## ven

I learn something everyday, i had to google fu both and see . The z3 is the one that came out after the 9z. So confusing haha, but i am a surefire noob. 

Very


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## Kestrel

I have always found it interesting that the rare Z3 was the most recent model (besides the Z2), but I'm thinking that sales were lower than the previous models because the grip ring C2/C3 now competed with them for market share, leading to only a short production run - there were no C's to compete with the 6 & 9Z's in their heyday.

And the three-cell SF's have always been less popular than the two-cell versions - despite the increase in performance & efficiency with the third cell; I have always preferred these longer versions for that reason.
And then the monster 18650's came out, finally edging out the last of the 3xCR123 SF's.


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## ven

I am yet to add one of these, I have had a few chances as well. Cell choice is the reason why I never jumped at the times. It’s been very close, as with a couple of C3’s ,which I also love the look of. Not sure what would work, would not want to bore it for 2x 18500(do have a couple of bored surefire, but like the idea of keeping the original strength more than extra output, maybe more so in a longer light). So limited to 16 ,maybe 17mm diameter cells.

Or I could just man up and feed 3xcr123 cells

z3 and c3 could be next years surefire additions, providing I find them at right time!


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## Dave D

dirtynorseman said:


> While going through the junk bin of old equipment at work I came across a Surefire Z2 Combat Light.



I highly recommend fitting an Xeno Bezel ring, it will give the head far more protection from drops. They are available on eBay.


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## dirtynorseman

I was wanting to add a bezel ring but looking at this Z2 it looks like it isn’t one piece with no removable ring. Did the Z44 head come in different configurations as far the bezel goes?


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## ven

Yes the earlier ones afaik did not have the bezel ring. I dropped mine a few months back and dented the end. How the lens did not break is beyond me. A little gentle persuasion with a mallet soon got it round again(originally off a z2, then fitted on 6p when dropped)





Back to round(kind of)





Plastic rings are junk 





All with zeno rings Dave mentioned, defo make a difference. If the light is going to get beat on some, worth looking for a z44/with ring.

Have many xeno's, all pretty good and nicely made. Think i have all the flavours as well, brushed or matte, shiny and even gold(black of course)
matte silver





Found an old pic with that bezel on my home z2, also pre mod bored v54 6p(has a ring in since pic)


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## dirtynorseman

Thanks for the info. I’ll be checking around for an updated Z44. Can never have “too many” spare parts right?


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## ven

dirtynorseman said:


> Thanks for the info. I’ll be checking around for an updated Z44. Can never have “too many” spare parts right?



Defo never have too many, then get another body for the old gen head!! On it goes:twothumbs


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## kamagong

kamagong said:


> I wish I could luck into a mint like new condition Z2.



I did just that. Got this in yesterday -- complete with box, papers, and lanyard. Only thing missing was the original batteries.








​


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## ven

Very nice, even today spoiled by many flavours of lights......a new z2 is hard to beat imho. It the classic looks/design and the in hand feel. Out of the box all this time on, it’s a strong all time fav of mine. Can’t see it changing any time soon either(read never).


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## kamagong

ven said:


> Very nice, even today spoiled by many flavours of lights......*a new z2 is hard to beat imho*. It the classic looks/design and the in hand feel. Out of the box all this time on, it’s a strong all time fav of mine. Can’t see it changing any time soon either(read never).



Already on the lookout for another Z2.


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## rrego

kamagong, I recommend the Z2's old school brother, G2Z (polymer version). Those are very cool too :thumbsup:


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## kamagong

Thanks, it's on the list. I'm having a harder time finding G2Zs compared to Z2s though.


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## rrego

Yes, G2Z not as common, although I think there are some on the bay right now....but, kind of pricy. I found a random score of a tan G2Z in the middle of the night for 29 and scooped it up the second I came across it (was kind of dirty, tore it down, cleaned it, lubed it, now back in action with a 3.7 volt xenon drop in). And with my black G2Z, I lucked out and scored on the bay NIB a while back (runs a SolarForce warm tint drop in) . Cool lights.


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## ven

Like the g2z as well, more so than the g2 anyway. Its again the design/shape what i like and feel. Bottom left side


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## LRJ88

The Z2 to me tends to follow a certain trend that applies to a great deal of things in life; better when naked.


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## rrego

LRJ88 - PM sent


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## lion504

kamagong said:


> Already on the lookout for another Z2.



d337944 has a Z2 WTS post up right now.


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## bykfixer

Is that screen name 'lion' or short for 'lithium ion?" 

Flashaholics wanna know 504....

Never mind, I saw the avatar....or is that a secret code to keep big bro from crashing through your door and confiscating your vape gear and flashlight batteries? Those things explode ya know....


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## lion504

bykfixer said:


> Is that screen name 'lion' or short for 'lithium ion?"
> 
> Flashaholics wanna know 504....
> 
> Never mind, I saw the avatar....or is that a secret code to keep big bro from crashing through your door and confiscating your vape gear and flashlight batteries? Those things explode ya know....



Yes, it is a portmanteau, specific to the battery type - figured it was a good fit since flashlights use batteries.


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## lion504

More on topic for this thread... Just bought a new Z2 on the bay. Pretty good price. Need to make sure it's legit though.


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## ven

lion504 said:


> More on topic for this thread... Just bought a new Z2 on the bay for $90. Pretty good price, right? Need to make sure it's legit though.



Sounds about right imho, ones i have picked up have varied from around £45 ish to near £80 or so off the top of my head. I would be happy with a new one for $90 anyway, if i was in the market for a 4th, i would not want to part with more than $100-$120 ish tops. As with anything, its worth as much as someone is willing to pay. Congrats anyway, one of the best in hand feeling lights out there(if not the!) imo.


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## kamagong

ven said:


> ...ones i have picked up have varied from around £45 ish to near £80 or so...



The only problem with getting a good deal is that it gives you unrealistic hopes should you look for another.


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## ven

kamagong said:


> The only problem with getting a good deal is that it gives you unrealistic hopes should you look for another.



Curse this flashaholism!


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## kamagong

ven said:


> Curse this flashaholism!



Ain't that the truth. As a kid I would have been ecstatic to have anything like the SureFire 6P with M61NL drop-in I have as my go-to light. At last count, I have a C2, G2, Z2, four 6Ps of various flavors, and a Malkoff MD2. And I'm still looking for more!

First world problems... :shrug:


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## ven

kamagong said:


> Ain't that the truth. As a kid I would have been ecstatic to have anything like the SureFire 6P with M61NL drop-in I have as my go-to light. At last count, I have a C2, G2, Z2, four 6Ps of various flavors, and a Malkoff MD2. And I'm still looking for more!
> 
> First world problems... :shrug:



:rock:my favourite flavours you have right there. Still today, i love the p60 format and flexibility as much as when i started(maybe more). Not bored, not tired of, just a hunger for more haha


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## kamagong

I'm no collector. I tend to miss the little details that the collectors obsess about. Playing with my new Z2 yesterday I noticed one little quirk -- it doesn't have a bezel ring! I think I have an early production specimen.


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## ven

Yes, had a couple of z2's and unless its going to be beat on and dropped daily, i would not be bothered. Also it gives it a little cleaner lines with less fuss up front imo. Still, can always swap it for another head if a bezel ring is a want/need. Nice light!!! those z2's are sexy(if a flashlight can be, a z light is!!)


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## greatscoot

This is one of my favorite looking lights. I was lucky enough to acquire a G2Z, which is really nice in cold weather. My daughter carries this in her car.


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## kamagong

greatscoot said:


> This is one of my favorite looking lights. * I was lucky enough to acquire a G2Z*, which is really nice in cold weather. My daughter carries this in her car.




Shouldn't it be your daughter was lucky enough to acquire a G2Z?


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## greatscoot

kamagong said:


> Shouldn't it be your daughter was lucky enough to acquire a G2Z?



That too, as it's sporting an M61 drop in.


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## kamagong

You're a good dad. My daughter only has a G2L, still sporting its original P60L module.


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## peter yetman

There's a nice OR Camo Z2 for sale...
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?456563-WTS-Malkoff-Maglite-Drop-Ins-Oveready-Z2

Quick!
P


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## greatscoot

My stretched out Z2.


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## yazkaz

greatscoot said:


> My stretched out Z2.


Excellent candidate for host's strip and reanodization, should I get my hands on one.
The resulting HA3 hard black finish is simply phenomenal (I have a few 6Ps gone thru such treatment).


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## yazkaz

The Z2/Z3s are great classic models -- as long as a Pyrex-lensed Z44 is installed.
Still looking for these but on eB either the prices are too high, or the units are in dilapidated condition.

OTOH I already have a C3, three C2s and a native M2, all re-legoed with updated components.


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## kamagong

yazkaz said:


> The Z2/Z3s are great classic models -- as long as a Pyrex-lensed Z44 is installed.
> Still looking for these but on eB either the prices are too high, or the units are in dilapidated condition.



Don't give up the search. They've long been discontinued, but they're out there. I picked up this light a couple of weeks ago for a very fair price. Excellent condition except for one spot of worn anodizing where the flat meets the round on the body, right above the "AT" in COMBATLIGHT. 






I took my new-to-me light camping the day after I received it, and then proceeded to drop her! :fail: There are a couple of new dings on the bezel now. Oh well, I bought it to be a user. A quick start to getting that lovely, wabi-sabi'd look.


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## thermal guy

One of my Z2 I have coming in is old school and has the non removable lens Pyrex maybe? I think I remember something about watching the heat on them or they could warp. Anyone???


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## archimedes

thermal guy said:


> One of my Z2 I have coming in is old school and has the non removable lens Pyrex maybe? I think I remember something about watching the heat on them or they could warp. Anyone???


Lexan, not Pyrex ...

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?195478-Warped-Pyrex-with-LF-EO-9


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## ven

Still after all this time, maybe just my fav of all time in design/looks/feel.
work z2


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## thermal guy

archimedes said:


> Lexan, not Pyrex ...
> 
> http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?195478-Warped-Pyrex-with-LF-EO-9



👍. Yep that’s it thanks arch. Must of got it confused with my measuring cups.you ain’t going to warp Pyrex are you.


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## thermal guy

ven said:


> Still after all this time, maybe just my fav of all time in design/looks/feel.
> work z2



I think I like the design of it because being ex military I can definitely see this light being able to fit in that role very good.


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## archimedes

thermal guy said:


> 👍. Yep that’s it thanks arch. Must of got it confused with my measuring cups.you ain’t going to warp Pyrex are you.



Wikipedia says 820°C will do it ....


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## thermal guy

So I should be ok running a p91 in it??? 

😂😂😂😂😂😂


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## ven

thermal guy said:


> I think I like the design of it because being ex military I can definitely see this light being able to fit in that role very good.



Yes, super comfy with cigar grip, just easy on the eye, slim body, not too fussy. I dont care too much for fussy these days, by that extra switches, crazy heat sinking fins all over(dust gatherers) . 

Workfires






Homefires(spot the 2x z2's)


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## kamagong

ven said:


> Still after all this time, maybe just my fav of all time in design/looks/feel.



Z2 > C2?


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## ven

kamagong said:


> Z2 > C2?



Honestly it’s too tough to call these days. C2 was my fav, but the z2 is defo up there. I do find the z2 more comfy..... I at the moment have 3 of each. Nope too tough to call haha


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## lion504

The clip on the C2 bothers me in that the body has the protusion where the clip attaches. I wish it looked more symmetrical. Weird, I know... My Z2 is a keeper! Are you guys running bezel rings in your Z2s? Which ones? Thinking about getting a Xeno off of fleabay. Price seems reasonable.


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## lion504

One more question for the experts here. I saw a thread asking about boring an e-series and the consensus feedback was that it was a bad idea because it (boring) made the walls too thin, compromising the ability of the body to withstand impacts/drops/etc. Does the narrower diameter of the Z2 have the same problem? I've seen bored Z2s for sale, and for a while was bummed I didn't pull the trigger on one. My current Z2 is not bored. Since most of my other lights use 18650s, I was a little annoyed about having to pick up a couple of protected 16650s. But now I'm thinking that I may have dodged a bullet by avoiding the weaker (bored) Z2s, despite having to compromise on my 18mm battery standardization. Anyone have experience with a bored Z2?


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## archimedes

Anything bored will be weaker :shrug:


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## kamagong

lion504 said:


> Are you guys running bezel rings in your Z2s? Which ones? Thinking about getting a Xeno off of fleabay. Price seems reasonable.




I probably should. I've already destroyed one bezel. A Z2 and a Malkoff drop-in is a nose heavy beast.


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## lion504

archimedes said:


> Anything bored will be weaker :shrug:



I understand that in the general sense... like a bored 6p will not be (ultimately) as strong as a stock 6p. I guess the important consideration is whether the weakness introduced in the 6p by boring is detectable through ordinary use? 

Comments in that e-series (E2E?, can't remember for sure **EDIT: EDCL1-T**) thread was that dropping the light would compromise the tube.

Wondering if the weakness caused by boring the thinner Z2 approaches this same extreme fragility? 

If the weakness isn't detectable in the majority of use cases, maybe the risk is negligible for us weekend warriors (I'm an average kind of user)?


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## lion504

Here's the thread I was referencing: https://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?457596-Surefire-EDCL1T-18mm-upgrade


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## archimedes

There are so many 18mm stock options now, that I would simply choose a different host, rather than weakening one at additional cost.


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## Dave D

lion504 said:


> Wondering if the weakness caused by boring the thinner Z2 approaches this same extreme fragility?
> 
> Are you guys running bezel rings in your Z2s?



I have a bored Z2 and a bored Fury neither suffer from 'extreme fragility', it depends on how much you are going to abuse your lights.

I have bezel rings on my P/G series lights and use both the Xeno and the Lumens Factory versions, both are highly recommended and of similar quality.
The LM version has a thicker ring, about 2mm deep whereas the Xeno one is just under 1.5mm. I don't think it makes the Xeno version extremely fragile though!

:thumbsup:


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## thermal guy

I just run a 16650 in all my 2 cells. 2500mah. Believe it or not you don’t lose a ton of runtime compared to a 18650.


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## ven

I also run 16650 in my z2’s. I have 3 bored surefires (c2,6p,L4). Body wise does not seem to be an issue, but it can get pretty close(too close in some cases in the L4/E series ) on the tail threads. 

Unless running drop ins in anger, 16650 will be fine up to 4 or 5a.


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## Kestrel

With regards to the C2 vs. Z2 aspect; I did a low-light handgun/flashlight training session & used both the C2 and the Z2. I ended up preferring the Z2 due to its purely-omnidirectional hold compared to the more complicated shape of the C2. I always thought the C bodies were better looking, but the Z's just have a better grip.


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## KITROBASKIN

Kestrel said:


> With regards to the C2 vs. Z2 aspect; I did a low-light handgun/flashlight training session & used both the C2 and the Z2. I ended up preferring the Z2 due to its purely-omnidirectional hold compared to the more complicated shape of the C2. I always thought the C bodies were better looking, but the Z's just have a better grip.


Complete agreement. 
One extremely minor factor is that the Z is lighter in weight, right?


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## Kestrel

I didn't really notice the weight, but I do imagine the difference would be more significant w/ the 3-cell bodies. :thinking:

It was a number of years ago; but if anybody is curious, I did a CPF writeup here: (the C2 & Z2 featured prominently)
*Low light / Night fire training class*


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## kamagong

Kestrel said:


> With regards to the C2 vs. Z2 aspect; I did a low-light handgun/flashlight training session & used both the C2 and the Z2. I ended up preferring the Z2 due to its purely-omnidirectional hold compared to the more complicated shape of the C2. I always thought the C bodies were better looking, but the Z's just have a better grip.





KITROBASKIN said:


> Complete agreement.
> One extremely minor factor is that the Z is lighter in weight, right?



If we're talking strictly about grip, I think the G2Z wins. It's truly omnidirectional, as opposed to the Z2 which is merely nearly-omnidirectional. 

Of course, the G2Z's nitrolon body limits the available updates due to heat issues. I suppose the ultimate light would be a 6Z, upgraded with a Pyrex lens/head assembly.


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## Tachead

Thread resurrection lol...

Well, I finally scored a BNIB Z2-BK! I have wanted one for a long time. I'm hoping for the one with the bezel as I already ordered a Xeno for it. I guess I will see when it gets here. I am excited[emoji16]. 

Sent from my SM-N975W using Tapatalk


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## KITROBASKIN

Jolly Good!


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## ven

Excellent Tac, you wont be disappointed! Such a classic, puts new lights of today in the shade. They are fun in standard form to, those little p60 bulbs kick out a decent 50 or 60lm beam. When compared to other incand lights, they are a beam of beauty. I am still taken back now when i fire one up, to think(what maybe 20+ yrs of age) can hold its own and some. Granted weak in the spill, but still more than ample if no light pollution around. Enjoy!


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## Tachead

Yeah, I can't wait. I am a little nervous as it hasn't shipped yet... Hopefully soon. 

I may need to order a Z59 for it so I have a Clicky option or would it be better to just order a McClicky conversion from OR or EDC+? 

I think I got a pretty good deal. What is a decent price for one of these BNIB anyway? Not that it really matters as this one is going to be a user and I couldn't resist even if it was twice as much lol. 

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## ven

I would just McClicky it Tac, thats what i have done. As for price cost, i can tell you what i would be happy and pay for a BNIB. If in market and a new one was say on a certain auction site, i would maybe pay up to £100/£120. So a total max of $150 US . 

Obviously thats me, most of mine have been around £80 for mint, paid £60 for my works beater.


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## Tachead

ven said:


> I would just McClicky it Tac, thats what i have done. As for price cost, i can tell you what i would be happy and pay for a BNIB. If in market and a new one was say on a certain auction site, i would maybe pay up to £100/£120. So a total max of $150 US .
> 
> Obviously thats me, most of mine have been around £80 for mint, paid £60 for my works beater.


Ok, if I can't find a Z59 for a descent price that's the way I will go.

Ok, I did good then. Got it for $80US. 

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## Tachead

I found a brand new in sealed package Z59 for $32US. It's $19US(and the shipping is $5 more then the Z59) for an EDC+ Copper McClicky kit off the bay so, I am thinking the Z59 is the way to go value for the dollar wise and to keep it more SF if you know what I mean. Am I right in thinking it should match well looks and colour wise? Thanks for all your help as usual Ven[emoji106]. 

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## Tachead

The description sucks so I am not 100% sure which model I am getting but, I think it is this one...













If that is the case, I should be getting a model with a removable bezel and can still swap to a P60 or P61 incan module correct? Also, I wonder what emitter it uses and what's the tint is like? It looks like there may have been an 80 & 120 lumen version of this model too so, I guess I will have to wait and see what I get(the description says 65 like the incan lol). 

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## ven

Yes the LED p60 is lame at best, it hateful and not even close to the incand(IMO). So its good for the bin or give away. Yes the xeno will fit perfect once the plastic ring is removed. Offering a cooler look with far better protection. I hope its incand for your eyes sake

Yes swap the p60 no probs

LED wise, not sure, maybe ssc p4, its cold, weak, and not easy on the eyes(can only speak to what LED p60's i have had though).


As for colour match, if its black type II, then it should be good. Not like trying to match the type III with all the shades.


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## ven

Just seen it is LED, not to worry, its about the Z2 not the LED. If you dont have any bulbs, pm me your add . I will happily send a few to you if you want/need some.


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## Tachead

ven said:


> Yes the LED p60 is lame at best, it hateful and not even close to the incand(IMO). So its good for the bin or give away. Yes the xeno will fit perfect once the plastic ring is removed. Offering a cooler look with far better protection. I hope its incand for your eyes sake
> 
> Yes swap the p60 no probs
> 
> LED wise, not sure, maybe ssc p4, its cold, weak, and not easy on the eyes(can only speak to what LED p60's i have had though).
> 
> 
> As for colour match, if its black type II, then it should be good. Not like trying to match the type III with all the shades.



Ok good to know. I ordered this with it anyway... 




And, I have several Malkoff dropins as well. Definitely going to need an incan module to try as well(gotta love incan).

Thanks ven[emoji106]. 

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## Tachead

ven said:


> Just seen it is LED, not to worry, its about the Z2 not the LED. If you dont have any bulbs, pm me your add . I will happily send a few to you if you want/need some.


Thank you for the generous offer sir, I owe you one[emoji106]. I'll hold off to PM you until it gets here to see what it is. It could be an incan still as the description says 65 Lumens. It's like the Z2 lottery[emoji23]. 

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## ven

No probs, i wont be going anywhere soon

The EDC+ are great drop ins, i have had my triple xp-g2 neutral(lovely 4000k ish warmth ) for a while now. To get picky! Starts in high, medium looks very close to high and low. But if say to use as a single mode(always starting in high) its a bright large hot spot of eye friendly light. 
As seen here in the cooly 26650 host on the left
Mine a triple though, i have had my eye on the HI flavour for a while. 





Couple of little bonuses with the EDC+, 1st due to shell shape/design, it fits surefires nicely(some p60 shells not so), so for example, using in an MD2 with the ring works/fits. 2nd, the container to the EDC+ has the bezel tool on the bottom, this has come in very useful many times. Being plastic it wont last too long, but it causes no damage either.
EDC/Malk









Ending with a triple z2


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## novice

Tachead said:


> ...The description sucks so I am not 100% sure which model I am getting but, I think it is this one...
> If that is the case, I should be getting a model with a removable bezel and can still swap to a P60 or P61 incan module correct? Also, I wonder what emitter it uses and what's the tint is like? It looks like there may have been an 80 & 120 lumen version of this model too so, I guess I will have to wait and see what I get(the description says 65 like the incan lol).



Just for clarification, the incan G2Z model with the P60 is rated at 65 lumens (and the optional P61 lamp assembly is supposed to be 120 lumens), the G2Z-L with the P60L led module was rated at 80 lumens, and the later "transitional" G2Z-L with the non-removable ribbed lens-retaining-ring was rated at 120 lumens. The only difference between the incan model and the 80-lumen led model are the light engines they come with (and maybe the printing on the body?). You can put whatever you want in the bezel of either of those two models.


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## thermal guy

Can you tell the difference from the 80 and the 120 lumen models by looking at the P60L?


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## novice

I'm not sure I understand the question, but the 120-lumen led model has a sealed bezel.

I may be getting confused about some model numbers in my previous post. Part of the reason is because I have both G2Z lights and G2 lights, and I have done enough swapping of different colored bezels (both nitrolon and aluminum powder-coated), that I no longer remember all of the original configurations. I apologize for that.

There was a Z2 incan, and a Z2-L version with the P60L in the bezel. The finish on the bezel on both was HA-II black

There was an incan G2Z with a nitrolon bezel in BK, OD, and TN, and I believe the 120-lumen sealed bezel version also came in a G2Z-L version, although I don't know how many colors it came in. I do remember seeing a desert tan 120-lumen version with a sealed tan head online, inscribed with a USMC logo on the bezel. 

I have both yellow and tan empty bezels in nitrolon, and yellow and tan empty bezels in powder-coated aluminum.

I don't know if any of this has helped.


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## Tachead

ven said:


> No probs, i wont be going anywhere soon
> 
> The EDC+ are great drop ins, i have had my triple xp-g2 neutral(lovely 4000k ish warmth ) for a while now. To get picky! Starts in high, medium looks very close to high and low. But if say to use as a single mode(always starting in high) its a bright large hot spot of eye friendly light.
> As seen here in the cooly 26650 host on the left
> Mine a triple though, i have had my eye on the HI flavour for a while. Couple of little bonuses with the EDC+, 1st due to shell shape/design, it fits surefires nicely(some p60 shells not so), so for example, using in an MD2 with the ring works/fits. 2nd, the container to the EDC+ has the bezel tool on the bottom, this has come in very useful many times. Being plastic it wont last too long, but it causes no damage either.
> EDC/Malk
> Ending with a triple z2


Thanks for all the info sir[emoji106]. I went with a single mode dropin so should be no issues with modes. 

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## Tachead

novice said:


> Just for clarification, the incan G2Z model with the P60 is rated at 65 lumens (and the optional P61 lamp assembly is supposed to be 120 lumens), the G2Z-L with the P60L led module was rated at 80 lumens, and the later "transitional" G2Z-L with the non-removable ribbed lens-retaining-ring was rated at 120 lumens. The only difference between the incan model and the 80-lumen led model are the light engines they come with (and maybe the printing on the body?). You can put whatever you want in the bezel of either of those two models.


Thanks man[emoji106]. I will find out what I am getting today as it's out for delivery now. I'm guessing the 80 lumen Z2L-BK that I posted but, we will see... 

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## ven

Tachead said:


> Thanks for all the info sir[emoji106]. I went with a single mode dropin so should be no issues with modes.
> 
> Sent from my SM-N975W using Tapatalk



I have a few single mode, even my h17 drivers, 1 of the 2 groups is .........you guessed it, single mode!!! I just like single stupid , doesn't matter where you start or finish mode. Although not an exact, i tend to be 150-300lm. Manageable for any duration for heat, bright enough for most applications, not too bright for general uses . 

With all the extra light pollution today, our lumens dont go as far as they use to!

Have you got the z2 yet? (sorry if missed it). Look forward to impressions, i found it grew on me pretty quick to love. They just dont make em like they use to!


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## Tachead

ven said:


> I have a few single mode, even my h17 drivers, 1 of the 2 groups is .........you guessed it, single mode!!! I just like single stupid , doesn't matter where you start or finish mode. Although not an exact, i tend to be 150-300lm. Manageable for any duration for heat, bright enough for most applications, not too bright for general uses .
> 
> With all the extra light pollution today, our lumens dont go as far as they use to!
> 
> Have you got the z2 yet? (sorry if missed it). Look forward to impressions, i found it grew on me pretty quick to love. They just dont make em like they use to!


Yep, I am digging the simplicity/reliability of single mode lights as well once again. In fact, aside from headlamps, one ZL(SC64w HI), and a few bedside high CRI AAA twisties, I have went back to all old school single mode lights(all are E or C/Z/P/G compatible too). I am finding 300-400 Lumens is working great for me most of the time but, have several lower power options(dropins) if needed.

That's for sure. Luckily, I spend a lot of my time in the forest and dark industrial warehouses so, I get to get away from the pollution. 

Nope, but it is out for delivery as we speak. I will post pics and impressions as soon as it arrives. I suspect I will love it instantly[emoji16]. I still need to order a Clicky tailcap or McClicky conversion but, the rest of the stuff will be here soon too(Xeno bezel & tool and EDC+ Dropin). I sure wish they made them like they used to... 



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## ven

I would maybe use the (almost/ as good as) bullet proof UI for a little while, see how you get on. Then look at a clicky if its not you. The twist /tighten to light or little loose and press/press hold for momentary is a cool UI. Simple and reliable , the only very slight down side is single hand use. This can be tricky at times, where of course a clicky is super easy to operate one handed. 

Come on mr delivery dude, get ya parcel out man


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## Tachead

ven said:


> I would maybe use the (almost/ as good as) bullet proof UI for a little while, see how you get on. Then look at a clicky if its not you. The twist /tighten to light or little loose and press/press hold for momentary is a cool UI. Simple and reliable , the only very slight down side is single hand use. This can be tricky at times, where of course a clicky is super easy to operate one handed.
> 
> Come on mr delivery dude, get ya parcel out man


Oh, I am definitely a huge fan of momentary tailcaps for certain applications(I have several lights with momentary tailcaps) but, always like to have both options and I tend to use my clickies quite a bit more overall. Ideally I would find another new in box Z41(in HAII-BLK) and rig it with a McClicky so I can quickly swap between the two depending on usage. Maybe I will grab a 6P for parts if I can find one cheap. Have you tried both the Lumens Factory and EDC+ Copper McClicky Conversions by chance? Which is better overall? I am leaning towards the conversion now vs a Z59 as I want this beautiful Z2 to look stock. 

Definitely, my eyes are getting sore staring out the window and I keep hitting my nose on the glass[emoji23]... 

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## ven

Haha, hopefully be there soon, like a puppy at the window waiting for its owner........:laughing:

I have had clicky switches from Lumens factory, EDC, several other places. Honestly to me they are all pretty much similar. Not had an issue with any, all fit without issue. Removing the little nobble thingie inside the OE boot makes it less sensitive. So go with easiest to get imho. If you get bit a little with shipping and plan more down line, might be worth getting a few if can. Good to have spares as i found out. Just that 1 more host never seems to end!!!!


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## Tachead

ven said:


> Haha, hopefully be there soon, like a puppy at the window waiting for its owner........:laughing:
> 
> I have had clicky switches from Lumens factory, EDC, several other places. Honestly to me they are all pretty much similar. Not had an issue with any, all fit without issue. Removing the little nobble thingie inside the OE boot makes it less sensitive. So go with easiest to get imho. If you get bit a little with shipping and plan more down line, might be worth getting a few if can. Good to have spares as i found out. Just that 1 more host never seems to end!!!!


Yes, the wait is killing me lol. I haven't been this excited about a light in years.

Ok, good to know. I will probably go with the LF as it looks a bit better made and is cheaper to my door. I also like to support Mark as he is an awesome guy and just keeps supporting these great old lights. 10-4 on the spares, I have a big box of E & P/C/Z/G parts already but, will have to add a spare conversion as well[emoji106]. 

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## Tachead

Well, it's finally here[emoji16]. And, I am extra happy as I got the original incan by the looks of it(Z2-BK 65 lumen)[emoji3060]. I got it from a retail store so it was open on display but, it is mint condition. Did I do ok for $80US?





















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## sgt253

Nice. Good snag.


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## ven

Tachead said:


> Well, it's finally here[emoji16]. And, I am extra happy as I got the original incan by the looks of it(Z2-BK 65 lumen)[emoji3060]. I got it from a retail store so it was open on display but, it is mint condition. Did I do ok for $80US?
> [quoted pics deleted]
> Sent from my SM-N975W using Tapatalk


Yes!!!!! a beaut, congrats.

The incand is awesome as it is, cool for nostalgic flashlight moments. Enjoy

And yes you did awesome for 80 bucks!!!!!


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## Tachead

This just came too, it's like Christmas lol. Now, just waiting on the Xeno bezel...
https://i.imgur.com/s2a1ItX.jpg

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## Tachead

sgt253 said:


> Nice. Good snag.


Thanks[emoji106]. 

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## Tachead

ven said:


> Yes!!!!! a beaut, congrats.
> 
> The incand is awesome as it is, cool for nostalgic flashlight moments. Enjoy
> 
> And yes you did awesome for 80 bucks!!!!!


Thanks Ven[emoji106].

Yep, pretty cool for sure. I will have to get some more bulbs. I threw the EDC+ dropin in there for now along with an unprotected Sanyo UR16650ZTA charged to 4.35V. You were right, this dropin looks very nice quality.

Ok good. It seamed like a descent deal. Good thing I jumped on it as it was the only one in stock. 



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## ven

The base of the actual drop in case, can also be used as a bezel ring tool.

Also , removing the grip rings(does not help grip lol) but it gives the torch a totally different, elegant/smooth piece of lighting equipment look.


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## Tachead

ven said:


> The base of the actual drop in case, can also be used as a bezel ring tool.
> 
> Also , removing the grip rings(does not help grip lol) but it gives the torch a totally different, elegant/smooth piece of lighting equipment look.


Yep, I saw that on the bottom there thanks[emoji106]. I may use it to install the Xeno so I don't scratch it. Xeno should be here tomorrowish.

Good to know, I will try it without them too eventually. Loving it so far! 

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## ven

Yay, glad to hear. The love just goes from strength to strength. 1 isnt enough, its kind of too nice to beat on. So then you need another, one to enjoy with guilt free drops and twangs. Just sayin

Do you have a c2? If not, that is another must host. The green/grey HA is amazing(not exact but kind of think zebra type).


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## Kestrel

Good catch on that new-in-package Z2.
IMO the 6Z/Z2 lights were the very pinnacle of flashlight body design in the history of SureFire. :thumbsup:


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## Tachead

ven said:


> Yay, glad to hear. The love just goes from strength to strength. 1 isnt enough, its kind of too nice to beat on. So then you need another, one to enjoy with guilt free drops and twangs. Just sayin
> 
> Do you have a c2? If not, that is another must host. The green/grey HA is amazing(not exact but kind of think zebra type).


Yeah, may have to get another as a backup as it is definitely awesome but, this one is definitely getting used(no safe Queen's for this cat but, I do take very good care of my stuff).

A C2 has been on the list for a while as well. I have actually had one in my cart multiple times. May have to wait for next year though(I generally only do the light game during the winter then switch back to other hobbies and use the lights I have) as I am almost done my light upgrades for this year and have already spent a ton. 

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## Tachead

Kestrel said:


> Good catch on that new-in-package Z2.
> IMO the 6Z/Z2 lights were the very pinnacle of flashlight body design in the history of SureFire. [emoji106]


Thanks Kestrel[emoji106].

Yes, this light is definitely something special. I have always been more of a 1-cell E-Series guy as I prefer small EDC's and don't use large lights much but, I definitely need to grab a couple of Z/C/G/P staples before they are too hard to get(it's already there for many models as you know). I'm thinking C2 in Natural HAIII next. I have never been a collector but, I find it hard to resist old SF as they are pretty much the pinnacle of flashlight history(imo anyway). 

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## Tachead

I'm guessing not but, does anyone know if there was ever a Z2 HAIII(natural or blk) made? If not, I wonder why? I would give my left nut for one in Natural HAIII if there is lol. I may have to settle for a C2... 

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## ven

It still gets dark at night

I wish i could be as disciplined, not a chance!!! Being a big kid would be grown up for me

Yes defo better to use, life is too short. I use mine here and there but careful, so i duped some for beaters. I can get to enjoy some of my fav surefires and get to drop them! How cool is that, and not even care. I actually like a beat on flashlight, but i also like minty ones. I think they are at their worst when perfect, except that little spec or ding that always catches your eye. Strangely the first ding can also help me start to enjoy them more. I am weird lol. Either mint or beat, not keen on the in between part!. 

Glad a C2 is on the list, it will look very nice with your z2.


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## Tachead

ven said:


> It still gets dark at night
> 
> I wish i could be as disciplined, not a chance!!! Being a big kid would be grown up for me
> 
> Yes defo better to use, life is too short. I use mine here and there but careful, so i duped some for beaters. I can get to enjoy some of my fav surefires and get to drop them! How cool is that, and not even care. I actually like a beat on flashlight, but i also like minty ones. I think they are at their worst when perfect, except that little spec or ding that always catches your eye. Strangely the first ding can also help me start to enjoy them more. I am weird lol. Either mint or beat, not keen on the in between part!.
> 
> Glad a C2 is on the list, it will look very nice with your z2.


Lol[emoji16].

Oh, I am definitely not the most disciplined. I just have too many expensive hobbies and not enough money so, I have to concentrate on one or two at a time lol.

If you are weird, I am too[emoji23].

Yes, have to add a C2 going forward for sure. Super nice collection sir[emoji106]. 

On another note, how did you install the Xeno as far as O-rings and gaskets go? It comes with a GITD O-ring(as does the EDC+ dropin). The Z2 has a black rubber gasket then the lens, then the bezel ring. Could you please list the order of the gaskets, O-rings, lens, bezel? I am surprised no instructions were provided. Thanks again Ven. 

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## ven

On mine, i have the gasket under the lens, so flat gasket, lens on top of said, then the xeno screwed down. Depending if you need to space out(so the lens is loose when xeno locked up). Would determine if you need to fit an O ring to make up the extra gap. Its a variable depending on drop in and head.

Not sure which, i am sure the cooly host is one. I had to use O rings in that host to space out. Otherwise the lens ends up loose/rattly if makes sense.


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## greatscoot

You can't have too many "Z" style lights. My daughter has a G2Z in her car and I have one more out for boring. Also, I agree with Kestrel that the "C's" are pretty cool looking, but I never really liked the feel of them.


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## BigBaller

My faithful z2 with a Lumens Factory warm Led drop-in was my favorite every day user light for many many years.. it doubles as my main bike light with thousands of miles ridden running AWs excellent 17670s. .unfortunately i misplaced it several months back and have still yet to find it.. U2 loaned to a friend when he needed an extra bike light to ride home and it's long gone never to be seen again either... I found good in the situation by using these as a reason to build up my collection of old surefires. 😁😁😁


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## Tachead

ven said:


> On mine, i have the gasket under the lens, so flat gasket, lens on top of said, then the xeno screwed down. Depending if you need to space out(so the lens is loose when xeno locked up). Would determine if you need to fit an O ring to make up the extra gap. Its a variable depending on drop in and head.
> 
> Not sure which, i am sure the cooly host is one. I had to use O rings in that host to space out. Otherwise the lens ends up loose/rattly if makes sense.


Ok, thanks. I found it works best with the stock lens and gasket(although not as tight as I'd like). The supplied lens is thinner and rattles with the gasket. The O-ring makes things too tight even with the thinner lens and gasket. 

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## Tachead

greatscoot said:


> You can't have too many "Z" style lights. My daughter has a G2Z in her car and I have one more out for boring. Also, I agree with Kestrel that the "C's" are pretty cool looking, but I never really liked the feel of them.


 That is a sweet collection sir[emoji106]. 

I may not like the feel of the C2 either(I can't remember if I ever held one years ago). I like the Z2 as it doesn't have a clip. If I want I clip, I will add an OR tailcap like you did(I usually don't pocket carry lights this big anyway). I may still get a C2 though as it is a SF staple lol. 



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## Tachead

Hope you find your lights BigBaller[emoji106]. 

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## ven

I am sure i use all the sureifre lens and they are much thicker than others. Gasket, lens, bezel ring nipped by that palm of my hand. I dont even need to use the tool much to tighten. Plus you get a feel for how tight, as long as nipped, it wont go anywhere. When it starts to slip on your palm, its tight enough!.

I need to get some surefire use, my flashlight use has been lacking. :fail:


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## Tachead

Yeah, I cranked it down pretty tight with the plastic tool so as not to scratch it. I wish it was a bit tighter fit though as I would like a bit more compression on the gasket before the bezel bottoms out on the head. I may try and source a slightly thicker gasket. The lens doesn't rattle but, I would feel better about the water tightness if there was a bit more compression on the gasket. No big deal for now though as I don't exactly plan to beat in this thing(at least until I get another lol). 

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## thermal guy

You know like a year ago I bought my first Z2. Now I have like 5. They are great lights.


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## Tachead

thermal guy said:


> You know like a year ago I bought my first Z2. Now I have like 5. They are great lights.


Yep, one the greatest body designs in flashlight history imo. SF was always so far ahead of the times with their designs. Many of their designs from a decade ago or even multiple decades ago still best designs of today imo. Almost my entire flashlight lineup is E or Z/P/C/G compatible and I don't see that changing anytime soon, if ever, for this reason as well as many others(user serviceable, modular, support from many aftermarket companies, etc.). 

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## greatscoot

Does anyone have a Z3 that’s been bored to 18MM?


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## thermal guy

I don’t. But was going to do that. But started looking at wall thickness and thought twice about it. Didn’t look like there would be a lot of meat left. Could be wrong though.


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## greatscoot

thermal guy said:


> I don’t. But was going to do that. But started looking at wall thickness and thought twice about it. Didn’t look like there would be a lot of meat left. Could be wrong though.


This is definitely true for the Z2, but the Z3 has a fair amount of “meat” where the flats are.


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## Kestrel

greatscoot said:


> This is definitely true for the Z2, but the Z3 has a fair amount of “meat” where the flats are.


The thinnest part is under the o-ring groove, an identical dimension for either light, so I believe that area to be the most vulnerable.
The 18-mm boring debate has been worn /very/ thin over the years (with much CPF discussion easily findable via Google Search), so it would be nice to not revisit it here in detail.
Am not speaking as a staff member here, just wanted to send an FYI that this debate has already been explored rather thoroughly.


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## yazkaz

Kestrel said:


> The thinnest part is under the o-ring groove, an identical dimension for either light, so I believe that area to be the most vulnerable.
> The 18-mm boring debate has been worn /very/ thin over the years (with much CPF discussion easily findable via Google Search), so it would be nice to not revisit it here in detail.
> Am not speaking as a staff member here, just wanted to send an FYI that this debate has already been explored rather thoroughly.


It's OK to continuously remind members of the risks of over-boring, no matter how many times that has been discussed.
If they don't listen then it's their problem when a bore job goes wrong -- they have been warned...

So just to reiterate, for a ~18.9mm bore there will be just around 35C of thickness left at the o-ring groove area. Some machinists think it's still strong enough, but not all agree.
I'd say, maintaining a minimal thickness of at least 50C would be safer, even though that would sacrifice some protected hi-cap 18650 compatibility.


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## bykfixer

With 16mm cells getting pretty good, why bore anymore? 
5 years ago, yeah. But things have changed and the benefits of 18mm cells has become less these days.


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## Tachead

Not to mention boring an old and long discontinued collectors favorite light is kind of sad imo. Kind of like drilling holes and installing a carbon fiber spoiler on a 69' Z28... 

Sent from my SM-N975W using Tapatalk


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## lion504

bykfixer said:


> With 16mm cells getting pretty good, why bore anymore?



Battery standardization. But if given a do-over, I would probably go exclusively with 16mm plus spacers. 3 years ago, lacking this expert knowledge, I bought my 6Ps bored (from Bugsy). Fortunately I’ve had no problems.

At least my Z2 is stock!


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## yazkaz

lion504 said:


> Battery standardization. But if given a do-over, I would probably go exclusively with 16mm plus spacers. 3 years ago, lacking this expert knowledge, I bought my 6Ps bored (from Bugsy). Fortunately I’ve had no problems.
> 
> At least my Z2 is stock!


My understanding is that there aren't many good 16650/17670 out there these days. The AWs are way too outdated (and obsolete), but the current Pana one (in the guise of Keepower protected, for example) must charge up to 4.35V to achieve the advertised 2500mAh.

By contrast a good quality but unprotected 3500mAh 18650 can fit into slightly narrower bores without issue, say, ~18.7mm, meaning the o-ring groove neck can be kept at slightly thicker (40-50C).

The other thing is that a well-bored C-body (6P especially) usually increases resale value. That doesn't mean one can make a fortune from that, however -- it depends on luck and hard work. The bore needs to be consistent, has upper side battery guard lip (some don't AFAIK), and optionally, reamed and honed for a smoother feel for battery sliding.

But NO, Z2/Z3/C2/C3 hosts are not ideal for bore mod. When a bore job goes wrong, so does the (precious) body concerned.
That said, HAIII reanodize is something highly suggested, as the stock HAII does't last for very long, before nicks, dings, chips develop in the long run.

But LiIon-wise, as long as the C-body's stock bore needs to be preserved, your best bet would be the Pana 16650 (2500mAh/4.35V).


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## WarriorOfLight

All my Z2's are bored. Most were done by Oveready. There are no issues at all. The Z2 is my prefered Surefire P60 light. I have tons of Z2's  I love the Z2's combat grip a lot. If I remember correctly I have somewhere in my parts box still a sealed Z2 ...

At all the Surefire P60 hosts are a great piece of history. Unfortunately in the last years the Surefire products were not that interesting anymore to me. My last Surefire was a Surefire Aviator Blue, I was bored and wanted to buy a Surefire. That was my last one... 

Here some Z2's I own:


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## yazkaz

WarriorOfLight said:


> All my Z2's are bored. Most were done by Oveready. There are no issues at all. The Z2 is my prefered Surefire P60 light. I have tons of Z2's  I love the Z2's combat grip a lot. If I remember correctly I have somewhere in my parts box still a sealed Z2 ...


OR might have done some really nice C-body customizations, but that's history now as they're moving on to their own Boss systems.

AFAIK OR's 18mm bore measures ~18.6mm which IMO is conservative, but at safe levels, even though some protected 18650s (or anything poorly wrapped for that reason) won't fit in.


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## lion504

Love the camo and yellow Z2s. A multi cam OR popped up on the WTS a number of months ago and I delayed (ultimately sold to another member). Still bent about that...


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## lion504

Good points yazkaz. I have a few keepower 16650s, purchased exclusively for my Z2. Only light I own that has a specific matched battery.


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## Kestrel

yazkaz said:


> [...] *HAIII* reanodize is something highly suggested, as the stock *HAII* does't last for very long, before nicks, dings, chips develop in the long run.)


HA *is* Type-III anodizing; so saying either "HA" or Type-III is sufficient.
Furthermore, there is no such thing as HAII; that is called Type-II anodizing.

-----

All of my favorite SF's are 18-mm bored & I use them heavily; most of them were bored conservatively by OR/TL, and I've been very very satisfied.

My very few oversized cells can go in my Bugsy-bored 6Z or my 18mm-bodied U2 thanks Bill - which I note has a steel insert reinforcing the vulnerable rear o-ring area, and subsequently loads 18650's from the front.


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## WarriorOfLight

Normally I would go outside with my camera equipment and take pictures. But since Europe and Germany also is in "Hybernate" state I did a picture of my Ceracote Z2's a few minutes ago.

From left to Right (all Z2s are Cerakoted): 
OR Camo, OR GITD White, Schoolbus Yellow (*), Bugsy Orange, Bugsy Burnt Bronze and a Bronze HDS that will not start with Patina  - but I like the look of my "still new Looking" Bronze HDS also.
(*) Don't remember the CPF user anymore, who offered the cerakote service… 







But since the Cerakote is easy to Scratch and to wear out the Cerakote, this 5 Z2's are my Z2 Shelf Queens not intended to be used. The other Z2s I own are in normal use.


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## ven

Love it, awesome line up of z2's


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## lion504

Dang, you have a beautiful family WoL! How come it's so easy to scratch??? I thought this stuff was supposed to protect handguns....


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## Kestrel

lion504 said:


> [...] How come it's so easy to scratch??? I thought this stuff was supposed to protect handguns....


That's because the marketing department doesn't care about input from the engineering department.


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## WarriorOfLight

lion504 said:


> Dang, you have a beautiful family WoL! How come it's so easy to scratch??? I thought this stuff was supposed to protect handguns....


I saw here in CPF a few cerakote lights that had scratched cerakote or on the edged rubbed down cerakote. I can not tell you if the cerakote processing was not perfect or if this is the "normal" behaviour of cerakote.

The intention of the 5 lights above was getting them because they are looking cool and the Z2 is my favorite P60 host, :huh: not because I want to use them. To use a Z2 I have lots of stock Z2s I can use daily. Could be possible I am the person with the most Z2s in one single room…?

I do not have a lot shelf queens, and my feeling is a flashlight should be used. But this cerakote Z2s are an exception. Would be a pity if this lights would not look this perfect anymore.


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## ven

I would be exactly the same if as lucky to own WOL. I won’t even beat on mint ones! So I get a beater ........to beat! Guilt free enjoyment . Maybe I am just as crazy as you


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## lion504

WarriorOfLight said:


> But this cerakote Z2s are an exception. Would be a pity if this lights would not look this perfect anymore.



Understandable. The first rule is to look cool...


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## Tachead

Wow, nice collection WOL. Love the camo one. Is that also Ceracoated or right from SF? (I know they did some limited camo E2e & C2's at least). 

Sent from my SM-N975W using Tapatalk


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## yazkaz

Kestrel said:


> HA *is* Type-III anodizing; so saying either "HA" or Type-III is sufficient.
> Furthermore, there is no such thing as HAII; that is called Type-II anodizing.


Yes, yes. This is a deeprooted mistake many of us here have been making all the time, but is somehow not easy to correct.
But in various casual communications many do understand what HA2 and HA3 really mean (ie. Type 2 and Type 3 HA respectively), even at metal processing facilities. So I guess it's OK. (Once an anodizing facility I had business with called me asking what I meant by "HAIII HB" on the job quote sheet. I told them "Type 3 Hard Black" and the staff instantly understood.)

So should I be making corrections by referring the ano processes as "Ty2" and "Ty3 HA"? Possible, just not easy to adapt to. So old habits come back.

The other thing: in some online selling platforms some sellers still confuse with Type 2 and Type 3 ano and thus describe the items to be sold wrongly.
For example, a standard Z41 tailcap with Ty2 black is being referred to as "HA black." So, if I were the buyer interested in that tailcap, and if the listing picture does not show the product's color properly, I would press the seller: "Is it n HA2 [Type 2] black or HA3 [Type 3] Hard Black?" Usually I would get the answers in a timely manner.


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## WarriorOfLight

Tachead said:


> Wow, nice collection WOL. Love the camo one. Is that also Ceracoated or right from SF? (I know they did some limited camo E2e & C2's at least).


All of the 5 Z2's are cerakoted, no HA. The E2e and C2 directly from Surefire are at least from what I remember HA, aren't they?

The two Z2's from the left (the camo and the GITD white) are done by Oveready looooong time ago. There are not much around, maybe 5(?) camo and maybe 10(?) GITD white. They were regular available in their online shop.

The other 3 are kind of unique. They were done individually for me on request. The orange one and the burnt bronze one was done by Bugsy years ago, and the yellow one also on request for me by an other CPF guy I do not remember anymore.


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## yazkaz

WarriorOfLight said:


> All of the 5 Z2's are cerakoted, no HA. The E2e and C2 directly from Surefire are at least from what I remember HA, aren't they?
> 
> The two Z2's from the left (the camo and the GITD white) are done by Oveready looooong time ago. There are not much around, maybe 5(?) camo and maybe 10(?) GITD white. They were regular available in their online shop.
> 
> The other 3 are kind of unique. They were done individually for me on request. The orange one and the burnt bronze one was done by Bugsy years ago, and the yellow one also on request for me by an other CPF guy I do not remember anymore.



No offence but you really had a lot of money to burn, for all those Cerakoted Z2s? Not my cup of tea though -- I mean the practice of having these customizations carried out.

The E2e, I'm not sure. Think there were Type 2 variants from the very early batches (incl. Wine Light and anything in Gun Metal) but the rest were in Type 3 HA (OD).

Meanwhile the C2 was available in both Type 2 Black and Type 3 HA (OD). I too was planning to get the former hoping to turn it into Type 3 Hard Black, but sadly missed that opportunity.


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## WarriorOfLight

yazkaz said:


> No offence but you really had a lot of money to burn, for all those Cerakoted Z2s? Not my cup of tea though -- I mean the practice of having these customizations carried out.


I did not bought this Z2s at the same time. The first one was the camo, the 2nd one the GITD White, the orange and Bronze were bought at the same time, and than later the yellow.
But I guess today I would not buy cerakoted lights anymore because it scratches easy and wears out. I also normally use my expensive lights too. The Bronze HDS that is on the picture with the 5 Z2s will also be used, but not always.


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## greatscoot




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## Megalamuffin

I just recently got a Z2. What a nice light. Looks good, feels good. A bit less convenient to carry than a c2 due to the lack of a clip, but also much lighter.


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## fulee9999

I have noob question... what's the difference between the Z2 and the 6P?

They are both twist for constant on, push for momentary, p60 head and 2xcr123, but other then the body shape and the three taps for disco light is there any other difference?


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## sween1911

fulee9999 said:


> I have noob question... what's the difference between the Z2 and the 6P?
> 
> They are both twist for constant on, push for momentary, p60 head and 2xcr123, but other then the body shape and the three taps for disco light is there any other difference?



Nope. The Z2 and the 6P are both aluminum tubes, they take the same bulb. Not sure what you mean about three-taps disco, that must be for a particular LED drop-in. The Z2 has the stepped-down section and the rubber grip rings.

The transition light between the 6P and Z2 was the 6Z, which has the older round bezel without the anti-roll hex edges, but has the stepped-down section. Early on, the number in the model referred to the voltage, like 6P, 12Z, 3P, 9Z. As time went on, the number referred to the number of cells, C2, M2, E2, Z3, M4, etc. You will see early examples of the 6Z that have the stepped down grip section be smaller than on the Z2, so it's half smooth 6P body and half grip section. The REALLY old ones have the lanyard ring with a little protrusion to act as a pocket clip.


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## thermal guy

Is that why the ring is bent?


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## knucklegary

I read the bent loop on the lanyard ring, pointing towards the rear, was designed to hang the Z2 around the necks of gov't agents.. Could be that didn't work too well for many reasons


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## fulee9999

sween1911 said:


> Not sure what you mean about three-taps disco, that must be for a particular LED drop-in.


The one I saw for sale had it, that's why I asked if that's a usual setup for these. 




But to condense what you just said, it's basically a 6P with different body and grip.


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## vicv

I was always wondering more of the difference between the z2 and c2. Both have the rubber rings and flat machined sides


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## Megalamuffin

vicv said:


> I was always wondering more of the difference between the z2 and c2. Both have the rubber rings and flat machined sides



The bodies are quite different between the two, C2 is bigger and heavier with a squared body that tell you where fingers go, and the Z2 is round with small flats but you can comfortably grip it anywhere. The c2 also has the same pocket clip stud as an e series, and the grip ring is more solidly attached than the Z2.


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## vicv

OK thank you for the explanation. So the C series is more of their premium line where the Z is just a P series with an extra option


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## thermal guy

fulee9999 said:


> The one I saw for sale had it, that's why I asked if that's a usual setup for these.
> View attachment 25492
> 
> But to condense what you just said, it's basically a 6P with different body and grip.


That’s the newest model the Z2. not a original incandescent. 


fulee9999 said:


> The one I saw for sale had it, that's why I asked if that's a usual setup for these.
> View attachment 25492
> 
> But to condense what you just said, it's basically a 6P with different body and grip.


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## Megalamuffin

vicv said:


> OK thank you for the explanation. So the C series is more of their premium line where the Z is just a P series with an extra option



Glad to help. The C2 is sort of like a military grade version with the heavier duty body and much tougher HA type III finish. The c2 is my favorite but it’s worth having both.


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## novice

I don't know that I would characterize the C2 as the 'premium' version of the 6P and Z2. It's true that the latter two lights, sadly, never came out in a version with HA III anodizing. I think that supposedly the 6P, coming out first, was intended as a 'cop light', so the type II black anodizing was intended to visually match a cop's patent black leather duty belt and accoutrements. Someone on this forum years ago claimed that the wall thickness of the Z2 was actually thicker than the flat panel sections of the C2. Also, for a few years (and don't ask me to name those years), both the FBI and the Air Marshal service issued the Z2 to their armed agents.


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## TMedina

dirtynorseman said:


> Been reading lots lately and figured I should finally join this great forum. While going through the junk bin of old equipment at work I came across a Surefire Z2 Combat Light. It was not working but was in mint like new condition.


Holy carp, guy - that is a spectacularly massive stroke of luck.

Glad you were able to give it a whole new life.


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## bridgman

Hah... I just finished converting my Z2 back to incandescent - replaced the 17670 and Malkoff M60F with an HO-9 and two AW RCR-123's. The LumenFactory HO-4 is actually pretty good with an old 17670 (early AW) and I have some 16650s coming in to try as well.

I ordered the Malkoff drop-in before they were making warm tint LED upgrades, and I actually ordered the flood version by accident, but I have been very happy with the M60F for a decade or so and will probably rotate it back in at some point.


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## AndyZy

Gotta share my good luck with you folks who can appreciate it. Stopped in at our local Goodwill today and spotted this SureFire Z2. Wow! Remembered reading about SureFire here so checked out the forum. Cost me $1.99. Sometimes the sun shines right on you!


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## thermal guy

Wow! The lanyard is worth more then that😁


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## knucklegary

Nice score, rumage stores are the best👍


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## tech25

Amazing find!


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## sween1911

GREAT FIND! Classic! Get thee a Malkoff unit for that beauty.


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## Monocrom

AndyZy said:


> Gotta share my good luck with you folks who can appreciate it. Stopped in at our local Goodwill today and spotted this SureFire Z2. Wow! Remembered reading about SureFire here so checked out the forum. Cost me $1.99. Sometimes the sun shines right on you!


That is a truly amazing score! 
Unfortunately my writer's imagination is going wild about how that ended up at Goodwill. I really hope it wasn't a case of a flashaholic passing away, and his wife deciding to donate a bunch of his stuff, including that Z2 because she had no clue how much it was worth.


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## knucklegary

It happens Mono.. I was at dumps unloading my keepsakes, and came home with more than I brought.
I found a collectors old motorcycle license plate collection. The plates were stored in cardboard shoe boxes. They were there for awhile, some plates were already burnt from landfill burns.
All in all I took home a treasure. Since CA DMV passed YOM Year of Manufacture, old bikes can be registered with original plate. They became very valuable to antique bike builders and collectors


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