# Surefire E1L - 2013 model



## tonkem (Jun 10, 2013)

Available at Bhphotovideo.com $180! 

Who is going to get one? I have 2 of the old ones 45/5 dual stage, and love them. I am a bit concerned of the regulation with the EB1 lack of regulation. Anyone have any information on this?

Thanks Tony


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## dano (Jun 10, 2013)

tonkem said:


> Available at Bhphotovideo.com $180!
> 
> Who is going to get one? I have 2 of the old ones 45/5 dual stage, and love them. I am a bit concerned of the regulation with the EB1 lack of regulation. Anyone have any information on this?
> 
> Thanks Tony



The EB1 issue was overblown, IMO. Having used one for several months, I haven't experienced any issues with the light due to the regulation "Issue."


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## tonkem (Jun 10, 2013)

dano said:


> The EB1 issue was overblown, IMO. Having used one for several months, I haven't experienced any issues with the light due to the regulation "Issue."



I get that, but if I am going to spend $180 on a light, I want it to be flat regulation, as are all my other lights. I guess it is just a personal preference.


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## Tana (Jun 10, 2013)

Argh... rather same setup, E2L-AA is on my to-get-list (as I really want E2L-AA body that would go with my powerful Nichia219 power-house) and was planning to pick one up for $126 in the US on my upcoming vacation trip (they average $126 old model, $130 on amazon)...

But now that new head is going to be offered... I would have to wait even MORE to get same body and better head as $180 is rather... backing me up where I was for past 12-16 months...  I might as well swallow the bullet and hope for even more discount on old model when this 2013 gets out...


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## MatthewSB (Jun 11, 2013)

tonkem said:


> Available at Bhphotovideo.com $180!
> 
> Who is going to get one? I have 2 of the old ones 45/5 dual stage, and love them.* I am a bit concerned of the regulation with the EB1 lack of regulation.* Anyone have any information on this?
> 
> Thanks Tony



I wouldn't worry about it, the E1L isn't exactly 'pushing the limits' with it's nowhere-near-200-lumen power.


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## kyhunter1 (Jun 11, 2013)

I doubt that regulation would be a problem with this light like the others said. According to the BH photo specs, it's only rated 80 lumens. The runtime on max is 4 hours which is much better than the old model E1B which ran on hi for about a hour or so in regulation. Looks like this light has a newer more efficient emmitter, so regulation should not be a issue.


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## Flashlight Dave (Jun 11, 2013)

kyhunter1 said:


> I doubt that regulation would be a problem with this light like the others said. According to the BH photo specs, it's only rated 80 lumens. The runtime on max is 4 hours which is much better than the old model E1B which ran on hi for about a hour or so in regulation. Looks like this light has a newer more efficient emmitter, so regulation should not be a issue.



The current one that I have looks to be about 80 lumens and its not the new KX1B. I think the new one will have a higher output than 80 lumens


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## Patrik (Jun 11, 2013)

Where are you getting This information about the new E1L, is it official from SF? Was it displayed at Shot Show? Edit: Oh, found some info about it. Looking for a new 1 x CR123, 4 hours of output, would be more interesting then the Eb1. And nicer knurling. = )


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## tonkem (Jun 11, 2013)

BHphotovideo now has all the new outdoorsmans in stock, e2l, e1l, and e2l-aa for $190 for the e2l and e2laa and $180 for the e1l.


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## Up All Night (Jun 11, 2013)

For a second, I actually thought you were quoting output. I puckered!


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## tonkem (Jun 11, 2013)

Up All Night said:


> For a second, I actually thought you were quoting output. I puckered!



OOPS sorry, added dollar signs


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## kelmo (Jun 11, 2013)

I'm pretty sure the "new" E1L has been shipped for a while now. I recently picked up one cheap from LApolicegear and it came with a KX1B head but the box indicated it was a 3/45 lumen model. The packaging is finally catching up to the product being shipped. This is also discussed here:

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...re-E1L-and-it-Came-with-KX1B-New-in-Box/page2


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## dcycleman (Jun 11, 2013)

The new model appears to have a larger optic, like the new defender


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## tonkem (Jun 11, 2013)

kelmo said:


> I'm pretty sure the "new" E1L has been shipped for a while now. I recently picked up one cheap from LApolicegear and it came with a KX1B head but the box indicated it was a 3/45 lumen model. The packaging is finally catching up to the product being shipped. This is also discussed here:
> 
> http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...re-E1L-and-it-Came-with-KX1B-New-in-Box/page2



No, the new one just came out at shot 2013, 80 lumens advertised vs 45 lumens. Larger optic, etc.


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## kelmo (Jun 11, 2013)

What does the new optic do? More flood? Does the new bezel have a different designation, KX1C?


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## Sgt. LED (Jun 11, 2013)

Oh great
Ordering....
Thanks for the expensive post pal lol


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## tonkem (Jun 11, 2013)

kelmo said:


> What does the new optic do? More flood? Does the new bezel have a different designation, KX1C?



Supposedly a longer throw, as the head is larger. That is per the shotshow videos that have been done, on youtube. That is what the surefire rep said.


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## tonkem (Jun 11, 2013)

Sgt. LED said:


> Oh great
> Ordering....
> Thanks for the expensive post pal lol



Post back comments when you receive


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## Sgt. LED (Jun 12, 2013)

Done 
I'll give you a run down of it in 8-9 days.
I wonder if they stuck with the plan of leaving the head unglued so its sorta focusable?


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## tonkem (Jun 12, 2013)

Looks like BHphoto is already sold out of them.


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## Tana (Jun 12, 2013)

I was under the impression that Surefire would use the same head for both E1L and E2L-AA... I do believe that last packaged models of current generation was both shipped with same KX1B head (no reason to believe that they would have different setup driver in heads marked with same KX1B marks)...

But it does that new head will allow some kind of focusability...


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## BigBluefish (Jun 13, 2013)

tonkem said:


> No, the new one just came out at shot 2013, 80 lumens advertised vs 45 lumens. Larger optic, etc.



Well, that might explain why the 45/3 lumen model has seen some discounting this year, less than $100 at various places, used to be about $120 - $140, I think. At 80 lumens, isn't the new one basically just an E1B but with low/high, rather than high/low? Ok, I've heard that the new optic gives a nicer beam...so maybe enough differnce to take notice. Not sure that this a real improvement, I rather liked the "45" lumens, 4.5 hour runtime on the dual level Cree version we've all come to know. Maybe we'll see a few of these now "old" versions on the Marketplace if people opt for the 2013 "improved version."


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## dcycleman (Jun 13, 2013)

BigBluefish said:


> Well, that might explain why the 45/3 lumen model has seen some discounting this year, less than $100 at various places, used to be about $120 - $140, I think. At 80 lumens, isn't the new one basically just an E1B but with low/high, rather than high/low? Ok, I've heard that the new optic gives a nicer beam...so maybe enough differnce to take notice. Not sure that this a real improvement, I rather liked the "45" lumens, 4.5 hour runtime on the dual level Cree version we've all come to know. Maybe we'll see a few of these now "old" versions on the Marketplace if people opt for the 2013 "improved version."



Now it has an 80 lumen 4 hour runtime, as opposed to the e1bs 80 lumen 11/2 runtime.


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## 880arm (Jun 13, 2013)

UPS delivers! 








Anyone notice something surprising here?







Sure looks like a "collar" on the head as described on the B&H site. However, if it's adjustable, I'm not up to the task. :shrug:







The business end. The head has a spring contact, just like the EB1 and E2DL Ultra







Just a little bit longer than my old E1L







The full line-up. Notice the 2-way clips shown on the E1L-A and E2L-A (mine came with the same short clip as the old E1L, E1E, etc.)







It's still 4 hours until dark so I don't have any solid impressions of the beam yet. I can say that it has the ever popular green tint like other recent releases and it seems to have a similar beam profile, just not quite as bright, as my old E1B (110 lumen). 

I'm a little tight on time tonight but, weather permitting, I plan to get some beamshots tomorrow night and have a mini review ready this weekend.


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## tonkem (Jun 13, 2013)

UH yeah! 2 hours more runtime than advertised, and 10 more lumens that advertised. May have to order me one now! They are already sold out at BHphoto though


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## Darvis (Jun 13, 2013)

Must... resist


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## tonkem (Jun 13, 2013)

880arn, does the surefire manual note that the 6hrs on high is to 1 lumen, or?


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## Sgt. LED (Jun 13, 2013)

Oh boy oh boy oh boy
My quick jump to buy this one seems like an even better move now.
Continue posting the good news....


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## 880arm (Jun 13, 2013)

tonkem said:


> 880arn, does the surefire manual note that the 6hrs on high is to 1 lumen, or?



The only information regarding runtime is on the cover of the manual as shown in the last photo in my previous post. Tomorrow or Saturday I will sacrifice a battery to see what the output looks like over time. I just didn't have 4-6 hours tonight to do it.

My impression is still that the E1L-A compares pretty closely to E1B with regard to output. On low, at a distance of 10 yards, I can't really tell them apart. On high, at around 30 yards, I think the E1B has the edge (as it should) but it's still pretty close. However, I have changed my mind about them having the same beam profile. I think the E1L-A overall has a smoother beam and the typical TIR rings are not nearly as noticeable as they are on the E1B. It also has a broader spill than the E1B which, considering its intended purpose, makes good sense. I suppose I should have expected this as that seems the trend with the other newer TIR lights I have reviewed (EB1 and E2DL Ultra).

If my E1L-A is typical then users who hunt white walls will probably not like it. I think it may have the most obvious green tint of any of the new SureFire lights I have seen so far. Even so, it amazes me how that seems to make no difference when outside.


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## tonkem (Jun 13, 2013)

880arm said:


> The only information regarding runtime is on the cover of the manual as shown in the last photo in my previous post. Tomorrow or Saturday I will sacrifice a battery to see what the output looks like over time. I just didn't have 4-6 hours tonight to do it.
> 
> My impression is still that the E1L-A compares pretty closely to E1B with regard to output. On low, at a distance of 10 yards, I can't really tell them apart. On high, at around 30 yards, I think the E1B has the edge (as it should) but it's still pretty close. However, I have changed my mind about them having the same beam profile. I think the E1L-A overall has a smoother beam and the typical TIR rings are not nearly as noticeable as they are on the E1B. It also has a broader spill than the E1B which, considering its intended purpose, makes good sense. I suppose I should have expected this as that seems the trend with the other newer TIR lights I have reviewed (EB1 and E2DL Ultra).
> 
> If my E1L-A is typical then users who hunt white walls will probably not like it. I think it may have the most obvious green tint of any of the new SureFire lights I have seen so far. Even so, it amazes me how that seems to make no difference when outside.



I am looking forward to your review of the e1l-a versus the outgoing model e1l-kx1(b). I have 2 of the outgoing models, one with a greenish tint and one with a milky white tint. They are one of my fav lights. Thanks again for the detailed response and thanks in advance for sacrificing a battery to determine runtime and (hopefully) determine if fully regulated


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## tonkem (Jun 13, 2013)

Sgt. LED said:


> Oh boy oh boy oh boy
> My quick jump to buy this one seems like an even better move now.
> Continue posting the good news....



SGT. LED, let us know your impressions of it when you receive and if yours came with the new or old style clip.


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## BigBluefish (Jun 14, 2013)

880arm said:


> The only information regarding runtime is on the cover of the manual as shown in the last photo in my previous post. Tomorrow or Saturday I will sacrifice a battery to see what the output looks like over time. I just didn't have 4-6 hours tonight to do it.
> 
> My impression is still that the E1L-A compares pretty closely to E1B with regard to output. On low, at a distance of 10 yards, I can't really tell them apart. On high, at around 30 yards, I think the E1B has the edge (as it should) but it's still pretty close. However, I have changed my mind about them having the same beam profile. I think the E1L-A overall has a smoother beam and the typical TIR rings are not nearly as noticeable as they are on the E1B. It also has a broader spill than the E1B which, considering its intended purpose, makes good sense. I suppose I should have expected this as that seems the trend with the other newer TIR lights I have reviewed (EB1 and E2DL Ultra).
> 
> If my E1L-A is typical then users who hunt white walls will probably not like it. I think it may have the most obvious green tint of any of the new SureFire lights I have seen so far. Even so, it amazes me how that seems to make no difference when outside.



Well, so it seems we have a whole different animal, not just an emitter upgrade. WIth a smoother TIR beam profile, this is looking very appealing.

Hmm. So now maybe I need to get one of these in addition to the EB1, which I also like. Though now having an MDC Hi/MED/STROBE, the E1L-A looks more intersting than the EB-1. So maybe just stick with my E1B, and get the E1L-A. But I do hate green tints, and had to sell a couple lights because that green tinge bugged me. 

I sold my 45/3 lumen E1L over a year ago (not because it was green, it wasn't), was missing it and am now suddenly thinking it may be just as well, as I can pick up one of these. Glad I just picked up a 30 lumen single level E1L, rathar than grabbing the now "old style" 2-mode.

Who am I kidding? I'm going to buy both the E1L-A, the EB1, and will still probably grab a 45/3 lumen E1L as the prices go down.


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## carrot (Jun 15, 2013)

BigBluefish said:


> Who am I kidding? I'm going to buy both the E1L-A, the EB1, and will still probably grab a 45/3 lumen E1L as the prices go down.


You've just said how I feel right now too. I love single cell lights and the E1L has always been a particular favorite of mine, with the single stage Cree model being a particular winner. I'm feeling like I might snag an EB1 first and wait til the new E1L (EL1?) shows up in stock.


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## 880arm (Jun 15, 2013)

Review is up! :twothumbs

The short version . . .

The beam has a very obvious green tint (as already discussed). I don't have one of the previous generation EL1's so I can only compare to the E1B (110 lumen), L1 (65 lumen) and E2L with KX2 (60 lumens). With that said, considering the conservative output ratings of those 3 lights, I feel like the E1LA is putting out an honest 90 lumens, but probably not much more. I would say the days of SureFire wildly under representing the output of their lights are drawing to a close.

Taking beamshots is still a challenge for me and I wasn't able to capture the spill in the photos I took. Although you can't see it in the photos, the E1L-A has a fairly broad spill beam, just not as bright as some other TIR-equipped lights.








Garage wall @ 20 yards





Wooden swing @ 30 yards





Tree @ 35 yards





Comparisons to some other lights can be seen in the review.


It's probably no surprise that the E1L-A maintains regulation better than some of the higher powered lights. However, part of how it achieves such long runtime is through the use of a programmed step down to 75% output after 2 minutes. This can be bypassed/reset by simply turning the light off and back on again. The change is only noticeable if you're staring at the light and really looking for it. For my part, I think it's a fair trade-off for the long runtime.


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## Sgt. LED (Jun 16, 2013)

Loved the long review man! I Facebooked it


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## 880arm (Jun 16, 2013)

Sgt. LED said:


> Loved the long review man! I Facebooked it



Thank you sir. I appreciate it.

Somewhat off topic note: I paid a visit to the link in your signature and I support the cause. I think it's worth mentioning that my mom participated in the night time beamshots taken for the review. Around my house I have nothing but green (grass, trees, weeds, bushes, etc.) and I also live near a radio tower with a flashing beacon that plays havoc with long exposure photographs at night. As a result, I have been driving to my mother's house to take the outdoor photos. 

Friday night the curiosity got the better of her and she came out to see what all the activity was about. When she first walked out, I believe I was photographing one of the E2L's and she commented how bright it was. Of course, I had to point out that it was one of the lower output lights and then introduced her to the E1B, E2DL Ultra, Fury, M3LT, M6LT, Hound Dog, and Wildcat. Each time I handed her a new light she would marvel at the output and seemed to take great delight in shining the "spotlight" around in the night sky. It appears she is a budding flashaholic too . . . who would have guessed? :thinking:

At any rate, after taking photos of the swing and the bench, I was ready to call it a night but she was still looking for other opportunities to take photos and it was her idea to take the photos of the garage and tree that were included in the review. In fact, she even called me early yesterday afternoon, wanting to know why they weren't on the internet yet 

I think I'm going to teach her how to use the camera and put her in charge of photography now :naughty:

Moms are special.


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## carrot (Jun 17, 2013)

880arm, thanks for the fantastic insight and runtime graph and beamshots. This light just jumped to the top of my "must have" list!


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## DAN92 (Jun 17, 2013)

880arm said:


> Review is up![/URL] :twothumbs


Great as usual, thanks 880arm!


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## Sgt. LED (Jun 17, 2013)

Got it!  
I'm very pleased.
It's the old clip on here.
The tint is not green, it's more neutral to my eyes. Sweet
The bigger head is noticeable versus the older one but it doesn't seem cumbersome.
Oh, there is no diffusion between optic and lens like my other Outdoorsman examples. Or it's so light I can't see it. Interesting. 
Decent throw (in my garage lol its noon) There is some flood but I'd never call it floody. The "Cree" rings are quite minor. Head is firmly glued, no focusing this one.
Now the hotspot is ........ a little different. There isn't a donut in there but I do see a hint of something. Some tiny scattered minor artifacts in there. Very minor whitewall only stuff guys, no worries. 

Lego's GREAT with the E2L AA body too. I really hoped it would play nice. Not tried it with alkies yet but full function on Eneloop. I will test tonight if there is any noticeable output difference. Shouldn't be. 
I should think a AA runtime chart would be interesting to look at if anyone out there has the means to do so! 

Like I said, I'm very pleased. Can't wait till tonight for outside testing and see what it can really do.


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## dcycleman (Jun 17, 2013)

Wish they came with the new style clip


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## Brasso (Jun 17, 2013)

Is it worth the upgrade from the current model with the KX1B head? I wouldn't think a 10 lumen difference would be noticable, but you never know. I was wanting a second E1L, but the "old" 3/80 lumen models are under $100. I'm trying to justify to myself the $180 price tag over the old model, but I'm not doing a very good job. Maybe you can help. 

Is the run time much better? And are they using an xpg in the new one?


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## Sgt. LED (Jun 17, 2013)

Looks like an XpE in there to me. 
I'm almost positive the runtimes have changed for the better.

is it worth the $80 jump? That's a very valid question. It was for me, I resisted the last incarnation but this one hooked my attention right away.


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## tonkem (Jun 17, 2013)

Brasso said:


> Is it worth the upgrade from the current model with the KX1B head? I wouldn't think a 10 lumen difference would be noticable, but you never know. I was wanting a second E1L, but the "old" 3/80 lumen models are under $100. I'm trying to justify to myself the $180 price tag over the old model, but I'm not doing a very good job. Maybe you can help.
> 
> Is the run time much better? And are they using an xpg in the new one?



The runtime was tested above by 880arn on his personal review: Pasted from that review:The extended runtime is achieved, in part, by stepping down to 75% output after 2 minutes of operation. The step-down is barely noticeable and, in fact, I did not notice it at all while actually using the light. It only became apparent as I was conducting the runtime test.The E1L-A maintains this level of output for another 5.5 hours before falling out of regulation and declining in output down to 10% at the 6 hour mark. The E1L-A was still producing a small amount of light at the 7 hour mark when I ended the test.

I would prefer that the light be smaller, not larger, but it remains to be seen, if I will pony up for one, as I have 2 of the 3/45 models


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## 880arm (Jun 17, 2013)

Sgt. LED said:


> The tint is not green, it's more neutral to my eyes. Sweet



With mine there is definitely some green to speak of but I do agree that the center of the beam is fairly neutral. It doesn't do a bad job of color rendition for the most part.



dcycleman said:


> Wish they came with the new style clip



Me too brother. I would say they have at least considered this possibility considering the illustrations in the owner's manual. Of course, that could mean they considered and then discarded the idea or it could mean that future versions will have it. I guess we will have to wait and see.



Brasso said:


> Is it worth the upgrade from the current model with the KX1B head? I wouldn't think a 10 lumen difference would be noticable, but you never know. I was wanting a second E1L, but the "old" 3/80 lumen models are under $100. I'm trying to justify to myself the $180 price tag over the old model, but I'm not doing a very good job. Maybe you can help.
> 
> Is the run time much better? And are they using an xpg in the new one?



I wish I had a KX1B to compare it to. I have no way of knowing this for sure but I suspect that there was no huge gain in output (regardless of what the ratings were on the older versions) but instead, some increase in runtime.


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## Brasso (Jun 18, 2013)

Well, I couldn't control myself, but since I already have an E1L and an E2LAA, I got the new E2L. Hopefully it will be here within a week.


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## tonkem (Jun 18, 2013)

Brasso said:


> Well, I couldn't control myself, but since I already have an E1L and an E2LAA, I got the new E2L. Hopefully it will be here within a week.



Let us know how it compares to your other lights.


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## Brasso (Jun 18, 2013)

I'm sincerely hoping that a 17670 will fit in it. For those of you with the new E1L, have you tried to fit a Tenergy or LifPo 3v into it?


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## kelmo (Jun 19, 2013)

880arm said:


> UPS delivers!



3 different outputs on high, interesting! Does this mean there will be 3 variants to the KE1 bezel?


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## Brasso (Jun 19, 2013)

May simply be a difference in votage, but I'm no EE. I find it strange that the E2LAA has better runtime than the E2L. I wouldn't have thought that. Not on low at least.


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## WilsonCQB1911 (Jun 19, 2013)

Seems pricey to me, even for a Surefire. I'm going to go with the new E2L AA when it becomes more widely available.


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## tonkem (Jun 19, 2013)

WilsonCQB1911 said:


> Seems pricey to me, even for a Surefire. I'm going to go with the new E2L AA when it becomes more widely available.



It is available to US customers at BHphotovideo as well, but for $190  Surefires are a bit more expensive than other lights, as I am sure you well know. Probably paying for the R&D in the new light


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## tonkem (Jun 19, 2013)

Brasso said:


> May simply be a difference in votage, but I'm no EE. I find it strange that the E2LAA has better runtime than the E2L. I wouldn't have thought that. Not on low at least.



The E2L-aa has had better runtime since it came out, versus the E2L, at least what is given by surefire. Not sure why that is either, since the 123 batteries have more power


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## WilsonCQB1911 (Jun 19, 2013)

tonkem said:


> It is available to US customers at BHphotovideo as well, but for $190  Surefires are a bit more expensive than other lights, as I am sure you well know. Probably paying for the R&D in the new light



Why does bhpotovideo seem to have the new SFs before anyone else? I've never dealt with them before. Are they reputable?


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## carrot (Jun 19, 2013)

WilsonCQB1911 said:


> Why does bhpotovideo seem to have the new SFs before anyone else? I've never dealt with them before. Are they reputable?



B&H is a huge photography store here in NYC. They are great, both in person and on-line. If you order early enough in the day they'll ship out product the day of.


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## leon2245 (Jun 19, 2013)

Glad to see this line, this style in general continue from sf.

Now get an E1L-AA done & I'm in.


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## tonkem (Jun 19, 2013)

WilsonCQB1911 said:


> Why does bhpotovideo seem to have the new SFs before anyone else? I've never dealt with them before. Are they reputable?



Yes, they are awesome. I have purchased many Apple products from them, and their pricing and shipping policies are awesome. Would not hesitate to order from them.


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## 880arm (Jun 19, 2013)

The new E1L-A, E2LAA-A, and E2L-A are now listed on the SureFire site with MSRP's of $225, $250, and $255 respectively. If they follow the same MAP as previous lights we should start seeing them retail for $158, $175, and $179.

That's more in line with what their other new lights have been selling for.


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## Brasso (Jun 19, 2013)

The stats for the E2L, which I just purchased, seem weird compared to the E1L and E2LAA. The E1L does 90 lumens for 6 hours on a single battery, but the E2L 125lumens for only 7.25 hours on two batteries?


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## tonkem (Jun 19, 2013)

Brasso said:


> The stats for the E2L, which I just purchased, seem weird compared to the E1L and E2LAA. The E1L does 90 lumens for 6 hours on a single battery, but the E2L 125lumens for only 7.25 hours on two batteries?



I am sure you can do a runtime test for us, when you get it? Perhaps it is actually 11 hours, twice the runtime of the e1l, as per tested above


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## WilsonCQB1911 (Jun 19, 2013)

880arm said:


> The new E1L-A, E2LAA-A, and E2L-A are now listed on the SureFire site with MSRP's of $225, $250, and $255 respectively. If they follow the same MAP as previous lights we should start seeing them retail for $158, $175, and $179.
> 
> That's more in line with what their other new lights have been selling for.



Looks like they dropped the focus ability that we were expecting to see on the AA model. So they just bumped runtime and lumens a bit across those models.


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## WilsonCQB1911 (Jun 19, 2013)

I'm kind of disappointed that the AA won't have focus ability. As it is they all just got a slight boost in stats.


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## 880arm (Jun 20, 2013)

kelmo said:


> 3 different outputs on high, interesting! Does this mean there will be 3 variants to the KE1 bezel?



I would suspect at least 2 variants. The AA version might use the same KE1 as the E1L-A and the E2L-A may use a different version (KE2?)



Brasso said:


> The stats for the E2L, which I just purchased, seem weird compared to the E1L and E2LAA. The E1L does 90 lumens for 6 hours on a single battery, but the E2L 125lumens for only 7.25 hours on two batteries?



Until one of us gets our hands on the E2L-A and tests it, we don't know what it's output curve is like. It may use a different step-down strategy and/or run longer after it falls out of regulation.


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## LumensMaximus (Jun 21, 2013)

My new E2L AA has a KE1B on the bezel...


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## tonkem (Jun 21, 2013)

LumensMaximus said:


> My new E2L AA has a KE1B on the bezel...



Pictures, impressions, beamshots


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## dcycleman (Jun 22, 2013)

tonkem said:


> Pictures, impressions, beamshots



+1 please


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## Suuko (Jun 23, 2013)

I want one of these so bad.


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## Sgt. LED (Jun 23, 2013)

DO IT!


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## Brasso (Jun 24, 2013)

The E2L arrived today. The light looks fantastic. The beam is very smooth and relatively ring free. Unfortunately mine has a bit of a green tint to it, which is disappointing. I don't have the equipment to do a real run time test, but a 17670 will fit. Side by side with my 2 80 lumen KX1B heads, I can't tell a difference in brightness, but they are much closer to a white tint and the beams are a bit more focused so that may be why they look the same. . It also came with a two way clip. Overall I'm very satisfied. I have to give it a 8 out of 10 though because of the green tint. As long as XPE's have been in production you'd think they could get better tints.


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## BenChiew (Jun 26, 2013)

Time for me to save up for one.


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## Sean (Jun 26, 2013)

Great info!


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## tonkem (Jun 28, 2013)

These are back in stock at BHphotovideo. FYI


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## kelmo (Jun 28, 2013)

WilsonCQB1911 said:


> I'm kind of disappointed that the AA won't have focus ability. As it is they all just got a slight boost in stats.




I don't see why everyone is disappointed about the lack of being able to focus the beam. Beams that focus give you half a$$ flood and half a$$ throw IMHO.


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## pjandyho (Jun 28, 2013)

kelmo said:


> I don't see why everyone is disappointed about the lack of being able to focus the beam. Beams that focus give you half a$$ flood and half a$$ throw IMHO.


And it sacrifices water-tightness and integrity too.


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## pete3 (Jun 28, 2013)

does anyone else make a light like these with the thin diameter body and larger diameter head? they are awesome looking, always been a fan of SF, but i haven't bought one in 4 years... mainly cost.


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## tonkem (Jun 28, 2013)

880arm, have you ever run a runtime graph for the E1L kx1 head? I have never seen anyone run a test on this light. Any interest in doing that for us  thanks


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## WilsonCQB1911 (Jun 29, 2013)

So it looks like some of the new ones have the 2-way pocket lip and some don't? I'm interested, but only if I can get the 2-way clip.


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## Federal LG (Jun 29, 2013)

Oh man... I really HATE green tints!

I know that you can only see it while you´re white wall hunting, but I hate it. I already sold one old L1 because of it´s terrible greenish tint.

All my Surefires (Two E1L, E2L-AA, E1B, LX2...) have a pure white tint. 

Greenish tint in low mode is a rule on this new E1L-A??


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## 880arm (Jun 29, 2013)

tonkem said:


> 880arm, have you ever run a runtime graph for the E1L kx1 head? I have never seen anyone run a test on this light. Any interest in doing that for us  thanks



I have lots of interest in doing that. Will you loan me one? :twothumbs

Unfortunately, I only have an E1L with the KL1 head.



WilsonCQB1911 said:


> So it looks like some of the new ones have the 2-way pocket lip and some don't? I'm interested, but only if I can get the 2-way clip.



I guess some of the early ones got out with the short clip. I sent an e-mail a couple of days ago and SureFire is sending me a 2-way clip to replace it.


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## scot (Jun 29, 2013)

Does anyone know if this new version can run on a RCR123? Thanks


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## BenChiew (Jun 29, 2013)

scot said:


> Does anyone know if this new version can run on a RCR123? Thanks



I would like to know that too.


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## WilsonCQB1911 (Jun 30, 2013)

880arm said:


> I guess some of the early ones got out with the short clip. I sent an e-mail a couple of days ago and SureFire is sending me a 2-way clip to replace it.



I'm leery of purchasing one right now since I don't know what clip I'll get. All the stock photos show the old clip, but have the tag line about how "steel clip allows for multiple carry options". I want one bad but don't know who to go to to get the 2-way clip for sure.


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## Sgt. LED (Jun 30, 2013)

So Surefire ****-blocked themselves by sending the first few out without a second bend in their clip?

LoL CPF is priceless


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## pjandyho (Jun 30, 2013)

WilsonCQB1911 said:


> I'm leery of purchasing one right now since I don't know what clip I'll get. All the stock photos show the old clip, but have the tag line about how "steel clip allows for multiple carry options". I want one bad but don't know who to go to to get the 2-way clip for sure.


I think you could always check with the dealer first before ordering?


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## WilsonCQB1911 (Jun 30, 2013)

pjandyho said:


> I think you could always check with the dealer first before ordering?



I thought the same, but now I can't find it for sale other than through SF.


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## WilsonCQB1911 (Jun 30, 2013)

Sgt. LED said:


> So Surefire ****-blocked themselves by sending the first few out without a second bend in their clip?
> 
> LoL CPF is priceless



And even dumber on their part, all the stock photos show the old clip. I'm sure a major selling point would be the new clip. On a small light like that the old clip is useless.


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## Sgt. LED (Jun 30, 2013)

I agree, the 2 way clip would get used if mine had it.......
Guess a quick call to Surefire to get the proper one wouldn't hurt.


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## 880arm (Jun 30, 2013)

This is only speculation, but it looks to me as if they originally planned to release the E1L-A and E2l-A with the straight pocket clip. The photos on the B&H site which have been up for quite a while show this configuration. Upon release of the E1L-A the box and the manual both show the 2-way clip. When SureFire finally added the E1L-A and E2L-A to their website last week they also show the 2-way clip in the product photos (with the exception of the "in hand" photo of each light which still shows the straight clip).

It seems like B&H always gets a few of each product prior to other retailers which makes me think some of the earlier copies of the E1L-A got away without the 2-way clip. When I contacted SureFire about this, they first wanted to verify I got an E1L-A rather than an E1L. After taking care of that, they apologized and said they would get the new clip on its way to me.


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## Brasso (Jun 30, 2013)

I'll bet you good money that if you did get one with the old clip that a call to Surefire would have you fixed right up.


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## WilsonCQB1911 (Jun 30, 2013)

Brasso said:


> I'll bet you good money that if you did get one with the old clip that a call to Surefire would have you fixed right up. I called to replace a broken clip once and they sent me 3 new ones.



I'm pretty sure I'd end up marring the light changing out a clip, hence my desire to get one "right" the first time.


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## Sgt. LED (Jun 30, 2013)

No no no. It's so easy, and CPF can help if needed. 
You won't hurt it.

take off the head
take off the o-ring 
take a toothpick and push out the little black plastic square under the clip - press it out towards the head
take the end of the clip and put it on the edge of a countertop and press straight down 
it will slide up and off the head end 
reverse procedure with new 2 way clip minus the little black plastic bit.... it is not used with the new clip design


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## Brasso (Jun 30, 2013)

What he said. I've never marred the finish on a Surefire by changing the clip and I haven't gone to any trouble not to. It's so simple it's impossible to mess up. I usually just grap the end of the clip and wiggle it back and forth as I push it out. Takes all of about 3 seconds. That's after you remove the head and o-ring. Slide the new clip on. You'll marr the finish more than that taking it out of the box.


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## 880arm (Jul 1, 2013)

A new 2-way clip arrived in the mail today and is installed on my E1L-A. I like it so much better than the short straight clip.


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## tonkem (Jul 2, 2013)

I have 2 of them, but I am in Dallas Area Texas 



880arm said:


> I have lots of interest in doing that. Will you loan me one? :twothumbs
> 
> Unfortunately, I only have an E1L with the KL1 head.


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## WilsonCQB1911 (Jul 4, 2013)

Does anyone have the new E1L with the 2-way clip in stock?


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## tonkem (Jul 4, 2013)

WilsonCQB1911 said:


> Does anyone have the new E1L with the 2-way clip in stock?



BHphotovideo.com has the e1l-a in stock. http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produ...e_e1l_a_upgraded_outdoorsman_5_80_lumens.html


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## WilsonCQB1911 (Jul 4, 2013)

tonkem said:


> BHphotovideo.com has the e1l-a in stock. http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produ...e_e1l_a_upgraded_outdoorsman_5_80_lumens.html



I contacted them. They have the old clip design. They are going to sell out the old clip design before they begin selling the 2-way clip. It sounded like they had the 2-way clip version as well, but wouldn't be selling them until the older model was exhausted.


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## 880arm (Jul 4, 2013)

WilsonCQB1911 said:


> I contacted them. They have the old clip design. They are going to sell out the old clip design before they begin selling the 2-way clip. It sounded like they had the 2-way clip version as well, but wouldn't be selling them until the older model was exhausted.



Order the light and then call SureFire to get the correct clip. They should arrive at about the same time :thumbsup:


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## 1313 (Jul 7, 2013)

This new head throws like crazy. Does anyone know for certain LED is in there? I cant help but want to supercharge this thing... right now the LED is probably getting about what, maybe 350ma on high? Think if you put a multi level driver in there, even sticking with 1 amp to be safe with primaries this thing would throw like crazy... imagine going even higher using a 16340? 

If anyone is feeling confident and wants to experiment and see how much throw this thing is capable of shoot me a pm and ill send you the head - im using the body for a triple anyways this could be a fun project.


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## 1313 (Jul 7, 2013)

By the way has anyone tried this head on a e2e body?

UPDATE - Its been running fine on a 16340 for about 15 minutes now.

Does not work with 2x123 primaries... made strange noises and wasnt as bright for the few seconds I had it on switching modes, put it back to a single 123 and worked normally again though. 

Im having vihn see what he can do to this head.


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## WilsonCQB1911 (Jul 8, 2013)

1313 said:


> This new head throws like crazy.



Is it the same head as the EB1? I have an EB1T and that thing is amazing for throw on high. It outthrows most lights twice its size. I never had really played with it like that since I assumed a small light like that wouldn't be so impressive, but it rocked my world.


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## tonkem (Jul 9, 2013)

WilsonCQB1911 said:


> Is it the same head as the EB1? I have an EB1T and that thing is amazing for throw on high. It outthrows most lights twice its size. I never had really played with it like that since I assumed a small light like that wouldn't be so impressive, but it rocked my world.



No, not the same head as the EB1. The E1L-A has the KE1 head, and is not the same as the EB1. EB1 is rated at 200 lumens vs 90 lumens on the E1L-A.


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## 880arm (Jul 24, 2013)

tonkem said:


> I have 2 of them, but I am in Dallas Area Texas



Well, even though you didn't offer to bring one of those to Kentucky, I did manage to get a previous generation E2LAA with the KX1*B* head on it. 

It's not the KX1 you were hoping for me to test but hopefully this chart will give you some idea of what it would be like. 







At start up the E1L-A has about 10% more output than the E1L with KX1B combo. After the E1L-A makes its drop at the 2 minute mark, the E1L has about 20% more output. Obviously the E1L-A runs much longer, at a reduced level, than the E1L with KX1B.

The programmed step down on the E1L-A really makes these two behave completely different. If you're someone who wishes the E1L's had a "medium" mode for longer battery life then the E1L-A would be the light for you. On the other hand, if you're someone who plans to use the light for more than 2 minutes at a time and you need the little bit of additional output (without having to cycle on and off), then E1L+KX1B would be just the ticket.

The beam of the E1L-A is cleaner (fewer rings) with a broader spill. The E1L+KX1B has a slightly more focused beam with a whiter tint.


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## tonkem (Jul 25, 2013)

880arm said:


> Well, even though you didn't offer to bring one of those to Kentucky, I did manage to get a previous generation E2LAA with the KX1*B* head on it.
> 
> It's not the KX1 you were hoping for me to test but hopefully this chart will give you some idea of what it would be like.
> 
> ...



How does the brightness compare once the e1l-a drops it's output for the remainder of the runtime, versus the E1L-Kx1b on max? Is it obviously brighter (kx1b?)


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## MatthewSB (Jul 25, 2013)

Reading more on this, how is this light possibly worth $150+?

It's not brighter than the E1B that sold for $110, and you could just get an EB1T for $155. I see that the runtime is pretty impressive, on high at 6 hours, but is that enough to command such a price tag?

Help me understand what I'm missing...


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## tonkem (Jul 25, 2013)

MatthewSB said:


> Reading more on this, how is this light possibly worth $150+?
> 
> It's not brighter than the E1B that sold for $110, and you could just get an EB1T for $155. I see that the runtime is pretty impressive, on high at 6 hours, but is that enough to command such a price tag?
> 
> Help me understand what I'm missing...



Likely to recoup R&D costs? The fury when it was released was $150, but is now $108 at most etailers. I am sure with time, the price will come down.


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## dcycleman (Jul 25, 2013)

To some the runtime is worth money


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## 880arm (Jul 25, 2013)

tonkem said:


> How does the brightness compare once the e1l-a drops it's output for the remainder of the runtime, versus the E1L-Kx1b on max? Is it obviously brighter (kx1b?)



The E1L-KX1B has a tighter and whiter beam than the E1L-A so it definitely appears brighter.



MatthewSB said:


> Reading more on this, how is this light possibly worth $150+?
> 
> It's not brighter than the E1B that sold for $110, and you could just get an EB1T for $155. I see that the runtime is pretty impressive, on high at 6 hours, but is that enough to command such a price tag?
> 
> Help me understand what I'm missing...



For what it does, the E1L-A does seem a little overpriced to me. Like tonkem mentioned, maybe we will see the price come down in the future.


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## gnlw (Jul 25, 2013)

Thanks for the run-time chart, 880arm. I think it's the only one out there for the E1L w/KX1B head.


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## tonkem (Jul 30, 2013)

880arm, can you add a beamshot of the kx1b to the review on your website to compare to the ke1of the e1l-a?

Thanks for all the work you have done already


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## 880arm (Jul 30, 2013)

tonkem said:


> 880arm, can you add a beamshot of the kx1b to the review on your website to compare to the ke1of the e1l-a?
> 
> Thanks for all the work you have done already



I didn't have the KX1B at when I first did the review which is why it wasn't included. I have taken a few photos since then that could be used for comparison and I will try to add the to the site tomorrow. I have been moving a lot of my beamshots to a different image server so things are a little scattered right now.

In the meantime, here's a sample of three different versions (KL1, KE1, and KX1B) . . .


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## tonkem (Jul 31, 2013)

Thanks!


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## tongkang (Jul 31, 2013)

The 4th Gen of E-Series TIR really do they are job well IMO...it's killing me actually...only the problem is the tint maybe for some player...but for me sometimes I don't really care about the greenish tint as long is still spot like champs plus very usefull spill with no border...all we need now is withdraw some cash huh..Thanks for the helpfull beamshot sir :thumbsup:


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## skyfire (Jul 31, 2013)

your run time tests are really tempting me to get some of the newer outdoorsman lights.
now that i think about it, im starting to really like the automatic step down for extended runtimes. 
im one of those that are too lazy to cycle through more than 2 modes, and the auto step down kind of does that does it for me. :devil:

im still a little confused about the differences of the KE1 and KE1B heads. im assuming those heads operate in the same voltage range and can be interchanged with each others bodies? if so, which head do you prefer? right now im leaning towards the E2LAA-A for its body.


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## MatthewSB (Jul 31, 2013)

dcycleman said:


> To some the runtime is worth money



With the current (lower) cost of CR123 batteries, how many hours of runtime would it take to pay for itself, I wonder?

Edited to add:

I'm not trolling, I really want one of these, I'm just having a hard time justifying the cost.


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## pjandyho (Jul 31, 2013)

MatthewSB said:


> With the current (lower) cost of CR123 batteries, how many hours of runtime would it take to pay for itself, I wonder?
> 
> Edited to add:
> 
> I'm not trolling, I really want one of these, I'm just having a hard time justifying the cost.


Sometimes we have to put aside logic when purchasing something. If you like it just buy it. A couple of hundreds is not going to make you that much poorer. :devil: Go get it!


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## tonkem (Jul 31, 2013)

MatthewSB said:


> With the current (lower) cost of CR123 batteries, how many hours of runtime would it take to pay for itself, I wonder?
> 
> Edited to add:
> 
> I'm not trolling, I really want one of these, I'm just having a hard time justifying the cost.



If you need a light to work when you are wanting it to, just buy it  Otherwise, if you are more concerned with the most runtime, look at zebralight, etc.


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## tonkem (Jul 31, 2013)

880arm said:


> I didn't have the KX1B at when I first did the review which is why it wasn't included. I have taken a few photos since then that could be used for comparison and I will try to add the to the site tomorrow. I have been moving a lot of my beamshots to a different image server so things are a little scattered right now.
> 
> In the meantime, here's a sample of three different versions (KL1, KE1, and KX1B) . . .



880arm, can you do a photo of the KE1 AFTER the stepdown compared to full of the KX1B? Just trying to get an idea.


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## Brasso (Jul 31, 2013)

"If you need a light to work when you are wanting it to, just buy it Otherwise, if you are more concerned with the most runtime, look at zebralight, etc. "

I have a couple of Zebra's and I do like them for around the house, but I don't find their run time to be anywhere near advertised. I use them mostly as nightstand lights because of their low modes, but I carry an E1L for edc.


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## tonkem (Jul 31, 2013)

Brasso said:


> "If you need a light to work when you are wanting it to, just buy it Otherwise, if you are more concerned with the most runtime, look at zebralight, etc. "
> 
> I have a couple of Zebra's and I do like them for around the house, but I don't find their run time to be anywhere near advertised. I use them mostly as nightstand lights because of their low modes, but I carry an E1L for edc.



Reviewing Selfbuilts review of SC52 and SC600, seems the runtimes are in line with what are claimed, if not off by an hour here and there on the lower modes. I use them like you do, as I think I bought your SC80 from you  I use my SC52 for the nightstand, and the E1L and SC52 for EDC.


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## 880arm (Jul 31, 2013)

tonkem said:


> 880arm, can you do a photo of the KE1 AFTER the stepdown compared to full of the KX1B? Just trying to get an idea.



I can probably do that but it will likely be next weekend before I take any more beamshots. After that I will probably be done with the E1L-A for a while so be thinking about any other comparisons you want.


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## tonkem (Sep 3, 2013)

These are back in stock after about 3 weeks, at BHphoto if anyone wants to pick one up. I had mine on order, and should ship today


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## Federal LG (Sep 3, 2013)

I am trying to get one E1L with the KX1B head before they disappear but I cant find it!

Someone help me please? Do you know some place where they still sell the 2012 model, with the KX1B head??

THANKS


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## tonkem (Sep 3, 2013)

Federal LG said:


> I am trying to get one E1L with the KX1B head before they disappear but I cant find it!
> 
> Someone help me please? Do you know some place where they still sell the 2012 model, with the KX1B head??
> 
> THANKS



Bhphoto still has them in stock. $97. http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produ...E1L_HA_WH_E1L_Outdoorsman_LED_Flashlight.html


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## Federal LG (Sep 3, 2013)

tonkem said:


> Bhphoto still has them in stock. $97. http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produ...E1L_HA_WH_E1L_Outdoorsman_LED_Flashlight.html



"Due to certain restrictions, this item cannot be shipped to BRAZIL."

Damn!!! 

Any other place?


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## tonkem (Sep 3, 2013)

Federal LG said:


> "Due to certain restrictions, this item cannot be shipped to BRAZIL."
> 
> Damn!!!
> 
> Any other place?



Maybe eBay.


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## kelmo (Sep 4, 2013)

Federal LG said:


> I am trying to get one E1L with the KX1B head before they disappear but I cant find it!
> 
> Someone help me please? Do you know some place where they still sell the 2012 model, with the KX1B head??
> 
> THANKS



LA Policegear for $97!

http://www.lapolicegear.com/surefiree1l.html

kelmo


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## tonkem (Sep 6, 2013)

All, I received my E1L-A today from BHphoto. I took the head off and put it on the EB1-T(tactical twisty) body. To my surprise, it works exactly the same as the EB1 does. Light press (low beam), hard press (high beam). Now I have the best of both, IMHO, the tactical switching and the long runtime of the E1L-A. 

HAPPY!

Update: after playing with it for a few, I noted that you have to click lightly first, then mash hard to get the high. So, light press, then hard press. It will not go to full press high, unless you first do a light press. The KX1 head does not behave this way. You can do a light press 2 times to get to high, but not with the new KE1 head. Strange. I will get used to it, so it is not exactly like the EB1, but close.


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## hotbossa (Dec 8, 2013)

Can someone comment on if the newer run of these lights have the greenish tint? Is the greenish tint something that is desired or not? Not a huge flashlight guy but thinking of picking this up for an EDC light.


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## 01foreman400 (Dec 8, 2013)

I just ordered 3 of the E1L's (KX1B) and 2 of the E1L-A yesterday. Can't wait to get them.


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## hotbossa (Dec 8, 2013)

01foreman400 said:


> I just ordered 3 of the E1L's (KX1B) and 2 of the E1L-A yesterday. Can't wait to get them.




Where did you ordered them from?


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## 01foreman400 (Dec 8, 2013)

hotbossa said:


> Where did you ordered them from?



E1L Gander Mountain (use promo code gmt5)

E1L-A B&H Video 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## tonkem (Dec 8, 2013)

When comparing the new E1L-a to my older E1L with Kx1 or Kx1b head, the beam is noticeably greener. But, if you don't have a light to compare it to, it should be just fine. It is quite a matter of preference, as I also had a KX1 head E1L that had a green tint as well. Surefire has stated that the green tint is more useful so they are using more of the green tints in their lights, IE, E2DL Ultra, EB2, etc. 



hotbossa said:


> Can someone comment on if the newer run of these lights have the greenish tint? Is the greenish tint something that is desired or not? Not a huge flashlight guy but thinking of picking this up for an EDC light.


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## hotbossa (Dec 8, 2013)

tonkem said:


> When comparing the new E1L-a to my older E1L with Kx1 or Kx1b head, the beam is noticeably greener. But, if you don't have a light to compare it to, it should be just fine. It is quite a matter of preference, as I also had a KX1 head E1L that had a green tint as well. Surefire has stated that the green tint is more useful so they are using more of the green tints in their lights, IE, E2DL Ultra, EB2, etc.



Awesome, great info. Just curious, why is the green tint more useful?


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## 880arm (Dec 8, 2013)

hotbossa said:


> Awesome, great info. Just curious, why is the green tint more useful?



From Wikipedia:_At moderate to bright light levels where the cones function, the eye is more sensitive to yellowish-green light than other colors because this stimulates the two most common (M and L) of the three kinds of cones almost equally. At lower light levels, where only the rod cells__ function, the sensitivity is greatest at a blueish-green wavelength.
_​
To be honest, when I first received my E1L-A, the greenish tint drove me nuts when I was shining it around on the ceiling and walls. However, when I took it outside and used it for its intended purpose, it was much less of an issue. The more I have used the light, as well as the E2L-A and E2LAA-A, the more I have grown to like the tint as it is warmer and seems to have better contrast than the cooler white found on many older lights.


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## tonkem (Dec 8, 2013)

The green tint is much less of an issue outdoors, as 880arm mentioned. The E1L-a's beam is brighter and has more useful spill than the older KX1-b heads, in my opinion. As well as not having the "rings" that the older model had. Again, this is my opinion, as I still have a KX1-b to compare them.


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## 01foreman400 (Dec 8, 2013)

A lot of great information in this thread.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## hotbossa (Dec 8, 2013)

Thanks guys!!! Lots of great info. This is a great forum with a lot of solid people as members!!!


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## hotbossa (Dec 8, 2013)

Could not resist, just ordered one from B&H. I had a credit due to a tamron lens I sold to them through their used gear department. Can't wait to get it!!


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## tonkem (Dec 9, 2013)

Be sure to post your comments when you receive.


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## 01foreman400 (Dec 14, 2013)

After playing around with the 5 E1L's. I'd buy the E1L with the KX1B again before the E1L-A. Can't really tell a difference in brightness and the KX1B's have a nice white light. The E1L-A have a green light. Plus the KX1B's are a little smaller which I prefer. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Sean (Feb 7, 2014)

What would the runtime look like if you put the KE1B head on the E1L body so it could be driven by 1 CR123 primary? Higher output at the cost of runtime?


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## Brasso (Feb 8, 2014)

You mean a KX1B? All the newer ones are sold like this already. I haven't seen any runtime tests, but I'm guessing that shorter run time would happen. Not really sure though.


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## Sean (Feb 16, 2014)

Brasso said:


> You mean a KX1B? All the newer ones are sold like this already. I haven't seen any runtime tests, but I'm guessing that shorter run time would happen. Not really sure though.



No, I meant the newer outdoorsman lights. The E2L-A uses a KE2 head. The E1L-A uses a KE1 head. And the E2LAA-A uses a KE1B head. 
Since both the E1L-A and E2LAA-A are 3 volt lights, I was wondering what the run-time would look like if you swapped heads between them? i.e. KE1B head on the E1L body and the KE1 head on the 2xAA E2LAA body.

You can see this information on flashlightguide.com's review of the E2LAA-A.


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## Sean (Feb 24, 2014)

Actually, I'm wondering how good the runtime is on the E1L-A. We know the results if you run the light straight through until the battery is depleted. But what if you use it for brief periods of time, say 2-5 minutes each time. So the light will be running at 90 lumens for most of that time. Every time you turn it off and on it runs at max output for 2 minutes then drops down. Seems as if you will get shorter battery life if your constantly cycling the light off-on and using it at max power than if you just turn it on and leave it on for 6 hours. I wonder what the battery life would be if the E1L-A was forced to run at 90 lumens the entire time?


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## Replicant (Feb 25, 2014)

Would anyone be so kind to summarize the different model names, bezel designations, lumens, and run times of the E1L? I think there are 3 different versions. I'm curious where mine falls.


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## Sean (Feb 25, 2014)

Replicant said:


> Would anyone be so kind to summarize the different model names, bezel designations, lumens, and run times of the E1L? I think there are 3 different versions. I'm curious where mine falls.



You can just google them and click images to see what they look like but from what I recall these are the E1L head versions:

Original KL1 upgrade head for the E1e (and E2e) with low dome luxeon star I think 17 lumens. I think 1.5 hour runtime. I think NX-05 optic. 

Kl1 with luxeon III I think 25 lumens (4 hour "useful" runtime) super tight Surefire made TIR. 

KX1: 30 lumens single mode (10 hours) newer TIR

KX1: 45/3 lumen dual mode (4 hours high mode) same TIR as last version

KX1B: 80/3 lumen dual mode (4 hours high mode) same TIR as last version

KE1: 90/5 lumens the one seen in this thread. New TIR. (6 hours high mode). Comes on E1L-A


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## Gatsby (Mar 6, 2014)

Sean - that chart is quite helpful!

I recently picked up a KX1B to augment my older KX1 45/3 model. I was curious how much of a difference it made and I'll be honest it is brighter but not by as much as the lumen difference would suggest. However, my stock E1L 45/3 model has always been an overachiever being just as bright as my last generation L1 so I think it may be more like 65 to 80 rather than 45 to 80. Nonetheless it is a nice upgrade to the dual mode E1L which is a terrific light in it's own right and I think often underrated with "fancier" options out there.

What I'd like is a E1L-T with the two stage EB1T tailcap - but in HA and using the E1 bodies and head. I have a Milky modded KX1 black head on a black E1B body and I really prefer the knurled E1x style bodies and tailcaps - the smoother EB bodies just don't have enough grip. I love the light but admit to trolling regularly for another black body to use with it... So I've put off the EB1 due to the body style and no natural HA option - but I like my L1 (and another EDC for me is an ARC6 with the same basic UI) and would love an updated model with the same UI but more output in the smaller E series bodies (only complaint about the L1 other than it getting a bit long in the tooth these days is it is uncessarily big for a single CR123 based light).


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## cland72 (Mar 6, 2014)

Sean said:


> No, I meant the newer outdoorsman lights. The E2L-A uses a KE2 head. The E1L-A uses a KE1 head. And the E2LAA-A uses a KE1B head.
> Since both the E1L-A and E2LAA-A are 3 volt lights, I was wondering what the run-time would look like if you swapped heads between them? i.e. KE1B head on the E1L body and the KE1 head on the 2xAA E2LAA body.
> 
> You can see this information on flashlightguide.com's review of the E2LAA-A.



Now why in the heck would they have different heads for the E1L-A and E2LAA-A? Just seems inefficient. 

I checked SF website and sure enough, the AA model shows 115 lumens on high, and the E1L shows 90 lumens on high. Weird.


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## Replicant (Mar 6, 2014)

Thanks for the summary, Sean.


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## WDR65 (Mar 7, 2014)

cland72 said:


> Now why in the heck would they have different heads for the E1L-A and E2LAA-A? Just seems inefficient.
> 
> I checked SF website and sure enough, the AA model shows 115 lumens on high, and the E1L shows 90 lumens on high. Weird.



Maybe it has something to do with runtime. I'm not sure what the capacity is of 2 Lithium AA's but I would assume that they would be able to push that 115 lumens quite a bit longer than a single CR123. I think they matched the heads output to give the maximum runtime per battery type and combination.


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## Sean (Mar 8, 2014)

I performed a runtime test on the E1L-A using lithium-phosphate rechargeable cells purchased from Surefire. 90+ lumens for the first 2 minutes then step down to 70 lumens where it ran for another 2 hours & 20 minutes before dropping out of regulation.


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## tonkem (Mar 8, 2014)

2hrs and 20 mins is not bad for a rechargeable cell. Thanks for the info.


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## tobrien (Mar 9, 2014)

tonkem said:


> 2hrs and 20 mins is not bad for a rechargeable cell. Thanks for the info.



agreed, that's good!


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## mbw_151 (May 19, 2014)

The E1L-A has been around for a while now. Does anyone have an explanation of how Surefire gets over 400 lumen-hours out of a single CR123 cell? My most efficient light is a Malkoff M61LL which 65 lumens x 10hrs for 2 cells = 35 lumen-hours per cell. The low mode isn't particularly efficient at 40 hr x 5 lumens = 200 lumen-hours. I guess thy focused on the high output circuit.


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## electromage (May 19, 2014)

mbw_151 said:


> The E1L-A has been around for a while now. Does anyone have an explanation of how Surefire gets over 400 lumen-hours out of a single CR123 cell? My most efficient light is a Malkoff M61LL which 65 lumens x 10hrs for 2 cells = 35 lumen-hours per cell. The low mode isn't particularly efficient at 40 hr x 5 lumens = 200 lumen-hours. I guess thy focused on the high output circuit.



I can't say that I've seen "lumen-hours" discussed before, but some quick calculations tell me that an SF123 has approximately 4Wh of energy. Since we passed the 100lm/W barrier some years ago, and I think the XP-G2 now exceeds 130lm/W, I believe your 400 lm/h figure holds up. I don't know which cells you used to get those results with the Malkoff lamps, but I can tell you that SureFire's claims are not based on constant output. They usually list the maximum output, and the runtime, but they don't go into specifics about how the output decreases over time.


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## mbw_151 (May 19, 2014)

There's a runtime plot for the E1L-A in post 34 of this thread, output looks pretty constant. LED's have indeed become very efficient, I'm trying to understand how Surefire limited the losses in the driver board of a dual output light to get 75 lumens for 5.5 hours on high. None of my other single cell CR123 lights come close to this efficiency. I'm comparing the E1L-A to my 200 lumen HDS and my most recent Quark 123.


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## GoVegan (Jun 15, 2015)

I was thinking about ordering the E1L Outdoorsman and noticed that it has been removed from Surefire's website. The E2L is still listed and from that page the link to the E1L also comes up as blank. I'm sure it was listed a couple of weeks ago, and it is still listed in the 2015 catalog.
Exciting, I think that it has been discontinued and will be replaced by a single AA model called the E1L AA... which I also thought would make sense for a small pocket light that is recommended for EDC/outdoor activities/emergency use/survival kit.
If I'm right, I reckon it will be 5/100 lumens for 41/6 hours (using an included lithium), and priced at 100 USD (more affordable so places like REI will start selling Surefire again). I'll snap that up if released.


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## sgt253 (Jun 15, 2015)

That's interesting. I saw the same. Wonder what's next?


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