# Best MR16 LED to date?



## machineage (Aug 2, 2009)

Hi everyone!

Can anyone direct me to what is currently the brightest 12V MR16 LED at this time? I'm looking to replace four lights in a vehicle which currently has 50w halogen bulbs at present. Is there anything yet that comes close to a 50W Halogen MR16?

Also being a vehicle the voltage can range from 11.5V up to 14.6V when the alternator is running. I guess this will need to accounted for?

Thanks

Chris.


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## LEDninja (Aug 2, 2009)

This is the brightest I know. Unfortunately it has a flashlight type of beam - tight hotspot and spill light.

This is less bright but the hotspot is a much more useful big blob.

Neither beam is as wide as a halogen bulb.

---

There is a subforum on automotive. Mods please move.


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## machineage (Aug 2, 2009)

Hi LEDninja

Thanks for the info!

I just found these on eBay:

http://cgi.ebay.com/MR16-Nichia-CRE...in_0?hash=item2c501b3364&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14

I'm guessing from reading other posts that many of the stats these lamps have cannot be believed. Anyone any experience of the above?

The beams of the halogens is fairly narrow. I'm not sure though what the actual beam width is?!

Thanks again

Chris.


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## machineage (Aug 2, 2009)

Anymore thoughts anyone?

I also just found these having done a bit more research:

http://www.ledwaves.com/Delphi-MR-16-LED-Light-Bulb-6-Watt-5x-Nichia-083BT-LEDs-p-19702.html


However - it would seem the average output of a 50W Halogen MR16 is anything from 900 - 5000 lumens depending on the angle of beam? That being the case - I'm assuming even the Delphi above falls some way short?

Am I correct in thinking then there aren't yet any LED versions that match the Halogens as yet?

Thanks to all

Chris.


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## videoman (Aug 2, 2009)

Try the Xleds Galaxy series as they are I beleive 8W and the beam angle is nice and wide. I use one of these as a Video light to replace my 35 watt halogen.. Nice..


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## videoman (Aug 2, 2009)

Chris, I forgot to mention, on the specs it says AC 12 volts, but I have it on a 14.5 volt DC battery and it works just fine. I think for now it's the brightest MR16 out there. It has it's own buck driver and a teeny weeny fan in it (inaudible). I also know a friend that uses 3 of them interior in his van. The cool white one is brighter than the warm white.


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## blasterman (Aug 2, 2009)

> Am I correct in thinking then there aren't yet any LED versions that match the Halogens as yet?


 
50watt halogen MR16 = the out-put of *two entire* MC-Es...not a couple of Nichias. However, if their main client is jewelry stores than perhaps we have high CRI Nichias here. Different solution for a different problem, but the 400 lumen / 7watt claim is laughable. Must be one hellava efficient driver and an unobtanium heat-sink 

I have a couple warm/neutral white Bridgelux arrays mounted on a test rig at home, and combined at 800 lumen they make the out-put of a 50-watt Halogen look stupid. Problem is they need a heatsink the size of a grapefruit, so you'll never see them in MR-16 size. That's the problem....handling the heat generated from that much light. Evolux has a bulb with active cooling to handle the issue.

Right now I don't trust *any* bargain LED MR-16 because I don't trust the driver.


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## videoman (Aug 2, 2009)

OK so what is the brightest MR16 out there for our friend Chris ??? anyone??


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## WeLight (Aug 2, 2009)

videoman said:


> OK so what is the brightest MR16 out there for our friend Chris ??? anyone??



We have these made with Cree Q2 Warm white
http://www.cutter.com.au/proddetail.php?prod=cut927
you will notice the extra length of the body which allows these to drive to 500ma. These make 260 Lumen in warm and 320 on cold. Anyone making claims of higher lumens without at least this much heatsinking should be viewed with caution


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## mboni (Aug 3, 2009)

Do you have to have MR16? Does it need to be road-legal?

If you want some nice off-road LED light assemblies, someone here pointed me towards the products of Vision X. The Solstice Solo will match the output of a 50w halogen, it's a single 2" housing for a LED that draws 10 watts and puts out 800 lumens. They apparently can be chained together, making a pretty nice array. They aren't cheap, but seem to be a rugged and well-engineered setup.

I've been looking for a nice high-output MR16 LED, and they just don't seem to exist. The biggest problem is heat and size, if the MR16 LED assembly has any significant heat-sinking, it's far too large to fit into a reasonable sized MR16 housing. And if it didn't have any significant heat-sinking, it was probably lower output than I wanted. I decided that I'd be better off abandoning the MR16 housings I'd planned to use, and just order the Solstice Solo.


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## machineage (Aug 4, 2009)

mboni said:


> Do you have to have MR16? Does it need to be road-legal?


 
They don't need to be road legal as such - they are for use in a Hovercraft! The MR16s are for use in fittings which I already have installed. I have two either side at the moment - although I also have two spare so I could up to three each side to increase the light output. 

These are the fittings I have:

http://www.boatersworld.com/product/199170044.htm


WeLight - what is the length of the body on those lights you manufacture?

Thanks!

C.


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## WeLight (Aug 4, 2009)

machineage said:


> They don't need to be road legal as such - they are for use in a Hovercraft! The MR16s are for use in fittings which I already have installed. I have two either side at the moment - although I also have two spare so I could up to three each side to increase the light output.
> 
> These are the fittings I have:
> 
> ...


59.7mm length, you really need an open end housing which most MR16 mounts seem to have


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## blasterman (Aug 4, 2009)

> The biggest problem is heat and size, if the MR16 LED assembly has any significant heat-sinking, it's far too large to fit into a reasonable sized MR16 housing.


 
Yeah...the MR-16 format works great for Halogen, but it's severly limited in terms of LED because of thermal issues.


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## clg0159 (Aug 6, 2009)

How about these:
http://www.greenlightingsupply.com/Array_Lighting_LED_High_Output_MR16_Lamp_p/namr16.htm
choice of voltage, color temp, and beam angle


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## LEDninja (Aug 7, 2009)

clg0159 said:


> How about these:
> http://www.greenlightingsupply.com/Array_Lighting_LED_High_Output_MR16_Lamp_p/namr16.htm
> choice of voltage, color temp, and beam angle


Those look like 5mm LED arrays. I'd stay away from 5mm LED based lights even though in this case they are unlikely to be run 24/7.

Quote from ad "Approved for indoor applications only". Hovercraft runs outdoors OVER WATER no?

Over water requires waterproof enclosed fittings which Chris has, but they make heat removal worse, bad for LEDs and their power supplies.


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## clg0159 (Aug 7, 2009)

LEDninja said:


> Those look like 5mm LED arrays. I'd stay away from 5mm LED based lights even though in this case they are unlikely to be run 24/7.



Yeah, they do look like 5mm SMDs, but the heatsinking is supposedly "ground breaking". oo: The entire site gave an interesting read...
http://www.arraylighting.com/



LEDninja said:


> Over water requires waterproof enclosed fittings which Chris has, but they make heat removal worse, bad for LEDs and their power supplies.



Well, then that pretty much rules out the use of any LED product with significant output......so for this application then, nothing will match the original Halogens.


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## mboni (Aug 7, 2009)

clg0159 said:


> Well, then that pretty much rules out the use of any LED product with significant output......so for this application then, nothing will match the original Halogens.



Not exactly true. It rules out LED in an MR16 housing, but there are LED products that use the housing itself as a heatsink. Like I said above, the Vision X products might be a good choice for this application, I know the Solstice Solo units will operate just fine while submerged in a bucket of water, and they are going to match a 55w halogen MR16 in output (800 lumens).


Edit:
Here's a link to a toyota forum where the bucket test was done:
http://www.fjcruiserforums.com/foru...7627-solstice-solo-s1102-spot-2-inch-wow.html


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## machineage (Aug 7, 2009)

Thanks everyone for the replies and advice. 

Well I'm currently overhauling the craft so I guess the lighting can wait and I will see what happens with the technology. 

It's likely to be a year or so before she's back on the water so I'll have a look again at that time to see where we're at!

One thing is for sure - it's going in the right direction and I suspect it will only be a matter of time :twothumbs

C.


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## ledwaves (Aug 20, 2009)

Our LED MR16 Delphi's are currently being used to replace 50watt halogens. You can take a look at our showcase gallery to see our customers' installations here:

http://www.ledwaves.com/Showcase-Index-sp-14.html


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## CM (Aug 23, 2009)

ledwaves said:


> Our LED MR16 Delphi's are currently being used to replace 50watt halogens. You can take a look at our showcase gallery to see our customers' installations here:
> 
> http://www.ledwaves.com/Showcase-Index-sp-14.html



Do you have any lower priced options for shipping? I'd like to try the MR11 but the shipping costs half as much as the light.


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## znomit (Aug 24, 2009)

ledwaves said:


> Our LED MR16 Delphi's are currently being used to replace 50watt halogens. You can take a look at our showcase gallery to see our customers' installations here:
> 
> http://www.ledwaves.com/Showcase-Index-sp-14.html



5W of nichia replaces 50W halogen? Really?
Pics or it didn't happen. 

http://www.ledwaves.com/Delphi-MR-16-LED-Light-Bulb-6-Watt-5x-Nichia-083BT-LEDs-p-19702.html


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## ledwaves (Aug 24, 2009)

CM said:


> Do you have any lower priced options for shipping? I'd like to try the MR11 but the shipping costs half as much as the light.


 
How many MR11s did you want to try? I can't imagine the shipping cost being more than $7


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## ledwaves (Aug 24, 2009)

znomit said:


> 5W of nichia replaces 50W halogen? Really?
> Pics or it didn't happen.
> 
> http://www.ledwaves.com/Delphi-MR-16-LED-Light-Bulb-6-Watt-5x-Nichia-083BT-LEDs-p-19702.html


 
Did you browse our showcase section that I linked?

You can see Lucky Chances Casino here that used about 50 of our Delphis in their lobby: http://www.ledwaves.com/Showcase-Lucky-Chances-Casino-sp-97.html

The warm white bulbs you see are our LED PAR38 Pella that replaced 90-100w halogens.

You can also see it here in a Burger King:
http://www.ledwaves.com/Showcase-Bu...y-in-Mexico-with-our-LED-Lighting-sp-103.html

The smaller spots are the Delphis and the larger cans on the right are also our PAR38 Pella.

This isn't our Delphi, but if you want to see a close up of our bulbs you can view this showcase: http://www.ledwaves.com/Showcase-PAR-20-Kitchen-Replacement-Bulbs-sp-98.html

This is our PAR20 that replaced his 50W halogens. This customer ended up buying about 100 Par20s after using his kitchen as a test installation. His house runs on solar power and by making the switch, he's actually generating extra electricity that's being dumped back onto the grid. He's actually making some money by doing this. I can't remember the exact amount but I think it was in the $50 range. It's not much, but it beats paying $100-200 a month in electric.


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## kan3 (Aug 25, 2009)

Need to up the price $3-5 on the athens and use R2 instead of Q2 cree. It's not quite worth the $20 difference between itself and the Cornith.


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## CM (Aug 25, 2009)

ledwaves said:


> How many MR11s did you want to try? I can't imagine the shipping cost being more than $7



Lowest cost is fedex ground at $11.73 (for a $20.95 item).


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## ledwaves (Aug 25, 2009)

kan3 said:


> Need to up the price $3-5 on the athens and use R2 instead of Q2 cree. It's not quite worth the $20 difference between itself and the Cornith.


 
Hi Kan, quite honestly the Corinth doesn't sell as well because it's output is only good enough to replace a 15-20W halogen. It does have it's applications.

I believe R&D is working on incorporating the R2's across our product line for a release this winter.


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## ledwaves (Aug 25, 2009)

CM said:


> Lowest cost is fedex ground at $11.73 (for a $20.95 item).


 
CM, you can email me directly [email protected] with the bulb you want and I will send you a quote to review with the shipping costs.


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## qwertyydude (Aug 25, 2009)

Have you considered MR16 HID? I bet just one of these babies is all you'll need for forward lighting.

http://www.defender.com/product.jsp?path=-1|65136|296901|1013168&id=773412

Then put regular MR16 led on the sides as parking lights or just accent lights.


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## mboni (Aug 25, 2009)

ledwaves,

It looks like you've got a nice set of MR16 LED bulbs there, but I think my point from earlier in the thread is still relevant, especially when using these bulbs on a vehicle. 

How will your higher-output models perform in an enclosed housing? It seems like the heatskink needs outside air, so any type of weather-proof enclosure would rapidly cause the bulbs to overheat. Also, I'm not clear on exactly how strict the MR16 specification is, but it seems like the heatsink might also make the bulb too large to fit within some enclosures.

Your bulbs are probably well suited for indoor lighting needs, but I'm guessing that people looking for vehicle lighting should skip the MR16 style assemblies for now.


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## ledwaves (Aug 26, 2009)

mboni,

We also do not recommend using our bulbs in an enclosed housing. We only have one bulb suitable for outdoor use which would be our PAR38 Arcadia. This is also not recommended in an enclosed fixture but I've had feedback of some people putting them in their landscape lights with no problems.

The size issue has only been a problem once and it's for the Westin hotel. We're working on a custom housing to fit their fixtures.


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## jakclin (May 12, 2010)

ALT V4 7W @ 520lm

http://www.altled.fr/index.php?page...page.tpl&pop=0&option=com_virtuemart&Itemid=1


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## jayb79 (Jul 2, 2010)

this is a best low cost mr16 i have seen
http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.30208


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