# Roar of the Pelican: Big D 24W bulb and SubCs!



## KevinL (Feb 18, 2005)

Building upon Phaserburn's research, which involved using a Pelican Big D SLA 24W bulb in a Maglite to create a superlight, I present the Roar of the Pelican. 

Early research by Fh.D Hooked_On_Photons has indicated that the Pelican bulb provides a reasonable approximation of Mag60 performance when driven on 7 AA Energizer/Sanyo 2100mAH NiMH cells ( WA Bulbs - Alternatives for the meantime). The Mag60 is a well known mod using the Welch-Allyn 1160 bulb, delivering 326 lumens at spec and 618 lumens when pushed to a nominal 6V ( WA Group Buy). However, this is far from the most impressive mod in the book and the Pelican Big D delivering sub-Mag60 performance seems underwhelming especially when the Big D's bulb is rated for 600 lumens at its nominal voltage. 

I have discovered that AA NiMH, even high quality 2100mAH Sanyo NiMH, do sag significantly under load. My recently constructed Mag3X-1D using AA NiMH cells driving 3xLux3 in parallel delivered a sustained current of 800mA, due to the voltage sag being too close to the Vf of the Luxeons (the benefits being runtime, vs crazy brightness. 3xLux3 underdriven is still twice as bright as 1xLux3 driven at 800mA).

As such, I worked on a solution to bring more powerful cells to the table. My preferred implementation would drive the Big D at a nominal 7.2V, with as little sag as possible due to my choice of ultra-high-current cells. Initially this plan called for 6 Sub-C GP3300 30-amp cells, but due to product availability, was changed to Sanyo 3600mAH high-rate RC cells, which should provide adequate performance as well. The cells were professionally assembled into a straight stick of six, charged on a Maha C777 and left to rest for two days while the bulb got here. 

The 4D Mag housing was donated by the OA4D Cookbook Mag, which it started life as, and now has come to realize its true destiny. Sorry, 80 lumens just doesn't cut it, not when you can get 800!! A quick look at the rerating formulas yields (((7.2/6.0)^3.5) * 600) = 1135 bulb lumens. Derating by 30% for optical losses yields approximately 794 effective lumens. This puts the Pelican Big D squarely in Mag85 territory. 

Now I was never one for theory, I'm more into operations - what actually happens when you click the switch and let the lumens rip. The six SubCs were too long to accomodate the original Mag spring, so I removed the spring and deanodized the tailcap with the assistance of a sharp screwdriver and 200-grit sandpaper. I also rolled a paper sleeve for the SubCs to fit inside the D-cell light. 

Install the bulb as you would any ordinary PR bulb, change the lens and reflector, reassemble, and light it up. 

Even when going up against a Mag85 with packs HOT off the charger (2100mAH Sanyo NimH, 9 cells), the rested Pelican holds its voltage so much better that it yields both a brighter and whiter beam, as confirmed by the ceiling bounce test. The higher CCT of the beam is especially appreciated since I love white light and lots of it. 

Conclusions? With the right power pack (none of this wimpy AA business) built out of high-current Sub-Cs to match the awesome 4 amp drain of the Pelican lamp, the Big D SLA bulb is all but unstoppable. Bright white beautiful light, brighter and whiter for much longer. It fits in a standard PR base and one of CPF's most popular metal reflectors fits - perfectly. 

The downside of the Roar of the Pelican is that it requires a specialized pack charger, putting it out of the reach of flashaholics without the benefit of pack capable chargers, but this will not even slow down the truly hardcore with programmable pack chargers that put mine to shame. Some may object to 4D length, others may enjoy it, it's a matter of personal preference. But me? I'm glad it turned out well. 


Special thanks to:
litho123 for making the reflectors happen
Phaserburn and Hooked_On_Photons for blazing the trail
Fivemega for the bulbs - they were getting hard to find (and if you guys want some I think he still has them - $9 for the two-pack)
Silverfox for confirming that the reflectors will fit before I threw down money on the bulbs


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## KevinL (Feb 18, 2005)

Beamshots taken on the 15 feet indoor range, using my large yellow spotlight as a target. Exposure time 1/30, F2.8, auto WB, ISO 100, Canon Powershot S40. 

Surefire P90: 






Mag85 on 9-cell pack hot off the charger: 





Roar of the Pelican: 





The Pelican has more sidespill, which is not accurately captured in the beamshot. In the field, it has more spill. However, you can see that the hotspot is a little bit more intense than the Mag85. 

Overall the two lights are very close, and either way, I suspect their owners are not going to be disappointed.

Edited to add: 
By request, the yellow spotlight itself - a "5MCP" that has been field upgraded to a Philips 55W H3 VisionPlus (1600 bulb lumen) lamp:






One more beamshot, of the 11W LOLA: 





"Low" is relative. Plugging the values into the rerating formula gives me something in the region of 550 bulb lumens for the LOLA! That's 384 effective lumens, which is serious competition for the Surefire M4 Devastator (although not in the same size class). Since the low output lamp draws less amperage, there should be even less sag. This would be a credible candidate for drive on AA NiMH if you can't get your hands on SubC packs. 


Of course you can expect to see me using the high output lamp most of the time. I am really enjoying the way that the Sub-Cs hold their voltage under extreme load and how the light stays bright and white without me having to continually top it off like I have to do for the Mag85. I think I just found my new favorite incan..... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif


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## Luna (Feb 18, 2005)

Kevin, if you don't mind would you please post a shot the the thor under the same conditions


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## wquiles (Feb 18, 2005)

Simply amazing - good job !!!

Great pictures too /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Will


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## js (Feb 18, 2005)

Kevin,

NICE! Looks good.

One thing, though:

Yes, most people drive the 1185 with 2100 mAh AA's, and just as you say, the 3+ amp draw does bring the voltage down, and the voltage vs. time curve is not as good as it could be.

But who says there are no high-current AA's? Not you, I hope. The CBP 1650's will deliver 20 amps continuous, and will hold 1.1 volts/cell at 10 amps. At 3 or 4 amps, they would be holding over 1.2 volts/cell with a very nice voltage vs. time curve.

This is why the Tiger85 is brighter than the usual Mag85: because the Tiger85 is using high-current 2/3A cells and not consumer 2000+ mAh AA cells.

The Roar of the Pelican would most likely still be the clear winner, but I just wanted to point out that not all 9 cell 1185 lights are the same.


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## KevinL (Feb 18, 2005)

*Luna:* Added, just above the 11W beamshot. 

*wquiles:* Thanks /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif 

*js:* There are no high current AA cells! There is no Tiger85! There is no spoon! I am in complete and utter denial! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crackup.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crackup.gif

Yup, I'm aware of the CBP1650s. This is my first exposure to high-current cells, and I must say, I really like them. To know about the CBP cells is one thing but to witness high current cells in action is quite another altogether, now I'm starting to see why the CBP's are valued for high powered incan mods like the Polaris MR-16 platform and the Mag85. I might just have to get some, because I'm learning that it's not just the big fat number on the outside of the cell that matters, it's voltage vs time. 

It seems that most specifications are best represented as graphs rather than just numbers, and graphs tell so much more. A Sanyo 2100 may be able to keep it up longer, but not at the ideal voltage levels, so I end up recharging more to get it back to the same level of 'fresh' performance. There is a big difference after just 10 minutes of runtime.


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## Dukester (Feb 18, 2005)

KevinL - Thanks a lot for your work. It gives me hope for my negleted 4D [email protected] Those HC Cell's are a whole new breed that is for sure whether they are "AA's" or "Sub-C's". Thought I would share with you my personal account with the use of the CBP 1650's and the WA 1185 Lamp. I performed a uninterrupted runtime of 30 minutes in the MAG85. I myself was most impressed. It ran super bright up until about 25 minutes and than the last 5 minutes the bulb began throwing a yellow beam. It was as if the bulb was dropping out of regulation that is how dramatic it was in my opinion. At the end of the 30 minutes the lamp was still throwing but a yellow beam, though by this time very weak. This is running 8 1650's hot off the charger. I did not want to chance running 9 HC Cells as I am certain that is a recipie for disaster. I took a reading of the cells at end of test and they held at 1.13v.

Dave


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## KevinL (Feb 18, 2005)

I think I did the Wrong Thing(tm). I caused a bulb explosion, and this time, I mean it. grrrrrr....... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/icon23.gif think I'd better get another Paypal out to fivemega. 






After running the bulb HOT for 15 minutes, I noticed condensation building up inside the reflector, so following a trick I'd learned on CPF, I opened the bezel to vent it. I think the thermal shock may have been way too much for the bulb because the next thing I know, I hear this tremendous *BANG* and half the bulb is blown clear across the room. 

One thing I do respect about the bulb though, is the 1mm thick glass, and it is so tough that the bulb just split in half rather than shattering into a billion little fragments. Yes, this bulb was cleaned with isopropyl alcohol prior to installation and it is a really good thing that I respected the bulb by NOT pointing the bezel at my face while unscrewing it (yes, it was turned OFF before I did anything like that, too). Incidentally, the filament seems to be completely intact. 

Well, I guess you live, you learn. I'm not deterred; still gonna pick up another Pelican bulb. Mission continues /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif


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## larryk (Feb 18, 2005)

Was that the 11 or 24 watt bulb ? Larry.


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## js (Feb 18, 2005)

[ QUOTE ]
*Dukester said:*
KevinL - Thanks a lot for your work. It gives me hope for my negleted 4D [email protected] Those HC Cell's are a whole new breed that is for sure whether they are "AA's" or "Sub-C's". Thought I would share with you my personal account with the use of the CBP 1650's and the WA 1185 Lamp. I performed a uninterrupted runtime of 30 minutes in the MAG85. I myself was most impressed. It ran super bright up until about 25 minutes and than the last 5 minutes the bulb began throwing a yellow beam. It was as if the bulb was dropping out of regulation that is how dramatic it was in my opinion. At the end of the 30 minutes the lamp was still throwing but a yellow beam, though by this time very weak. This is running 8 1650's hot off the charger. I did not want to chance running 9 HC Cells as I am certain that is a recipie for disaster. I took a reading of the cells at end of test and they held at 1.13v.

Dave 

[/ QUOTE ]

Dukester, you should probably have turned off your light at 25 minutes. When they drop rapidly and noticeably, that is the end of cycle. Running beyond that is dangerous for the health of the cells.

Also, 9 CBP 1650's will not blow the 1185 as long as you DO NOT TURN ON HOT OFF THE CHARGER. Wait 30 minutes or longer and you're pretty safe.


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## js (Feb 18, 2005)

KevinL,

Did you let the bulb thoroughly dry out before running it? I'm wondering if some of the iso/water was still in the potting when you turned on. This would explain the condensation, and the explosion and even the intact filament.


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## Dukester (Feb 18, 2005)

[ QUOTE ]
*js said:*

Dukester, you should probably have turned off your light at 25 minutes. When they drop rapidly and noticeably, that is the end of cycle. Running beyond that is dangerous for the health of the cells.

Also, 9 CBP 1650's will not blow the 1185 as long as you DO NOT TURN ON HOT OFF THE CHARGER. Wait 30 minutes or longer and you're pretty safe. 

[/ QUOTE ]

Thanks for the tip js. I only performed that 30 minute runtime test just out of personal curiousity and did so one time. I will heed your advice here on out! Also I will try running with 9 of the HC 1650's but let them rest 30 or so minutes as you suggest. Should take the brightness up another notch running with 9 cells... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif


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## Luna (Feb 18, 2005)

Kevin, thank you kind sir!


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## KevinL (Feb 18, 2005)

*Dukester:* You're welcome.. glad it helped /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif Those are good numbers, and I'm surprised, because the Sanyos give similar runtime. I may really have to check these cells out, in terms of effective runtime, the Sanyos may be falling off too fast to truly utilize all their capacity. 

*Larry:* 24W, you can see the sharp tip in the picture. In the meantime I'm using the overdriven 11W to tide me over till the replacement gets here. At least the light is down but not out /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif 

*js:* What's a good dry time? It's been an extremely wet and humid day today, too. What I did was wipe the bulb and perform a visual check to ensure the alcohol had evaporated and none remained on the bulb, before putting the entire reflector/bezel assembly back onto it. Thanks for your help with debugging this, I don't want a repeat /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/blush.gif 

I'm also using a 70/30% solution that I got from a local drugstore. 

*Luna :* You're welcome /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif


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## SilverFox (Feb 18, 2005)

Hello Kevin,

Sweet!!!

Tom


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## SJACKAL (Feb 18, 2005)

Nice work!

Aren't Pelicans supposed to be birds? Roar..?


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## Phaserburn (Feb 18, 2005)

I LOVE IT!

KevinL, great stuff. For the record, my Big D 6V/4A bulb is being overdriven by the STOCK 6 Nicad (yes, nicad!) 5Ah D cells. Imagine those beautiful beamshots, but with a textured reflector twice the size of the Mag. Glorious! I was waiting for someone else to jump on this; no one seemed interested when I originally posted my config... or so it seemed at the time...

A 4A drain is no place for AA cells; certainly not commercial ones. The Nicad D's have no problem with a 4A load. It's tempting to go Nimh D to double runtime, but I have over an hour as is, and I love being able to slap the Pelican Big D onto the charger and... just leave it there indefinitely! The Big D has other mod potential... picture replacing the 6 D cells with, say, 24 AA cells, 2x12 in series for 3.2-5Ah and 14.4V. Anyone got a bulb? Unfortunately, that would be quite the custom pack.


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## KevinL (Feb 19, 2005)

Anybody got a spare 24W bulb? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

I kinda.. really.. need one /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif (Brightguy doesn't do international, at least, I'm not paying $40 for UPS - I could buy whatever I wanted from Light Edge in the mean time especially since I have Magcharger BP slugs here)


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## Hookd_On_Photons (Feb 19, 2005)

Kevin: Great work! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/happy14.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/clap.gif

Has anybody used the CBP-1650s with the Pelican Big D bulb, a Mag 85, or other high-drain application? I'd love to use them in a 8AA-to-2D adapter, with one of those bored-out Mag bodies modamag is planning to offer soon.

Ginseng recommended the Energizer/Sanyo 2100 NiMH AA cells based upon their availability, and balance between runtime and current delivery. For high-drain applications like the Mag85 and Pelican Big D high output bulb, current delivery trumps the other two factors.

I prefer the consumer NiMHs, because I can use them for applications other than flashlights. ("No honey, these batteries aren't *just* for my flashlights. We need them to... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thinking.gif uh... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mpr.gif use them in all those toys the kids have! Yeah, that it... the batteries are _for the children_!" /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rolleye11.gif)

I think it's time to stop denying my flashaholism, purchase some CBP 1650s, and openly declare them as exclusively for flashlight use!

SJackal: I think "ROAR" is a reference to the RC racing community. Those guys are as obsessed about batteries as we flashaholics are.

http://www.roarracing.com/


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## KevinL (Feb 20, 2005)

Still ready and willing to offer a nice assortment of keychain LEDs or a generous amount of cash Paypal for a 24W bulb, shipped international!

As for the strange naming of this light, it's just something whimsical I thought up on the spur of the moment. Pelicans are birds. I was denied my share of the RC toys when I was a kid /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif well.... making up for it right now with the lights /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif




*Phaserburn:* I like the charge in place capability, and I'd keep it NiCad. 1+ hour is long enough for a light like that, my light is expected to deliver something in the order of 50 minutes. Good enough for something this bright. There's always the 11W lamp for I-popped-the-bulb or I-need-runtime occasions. 

*Hooked:* See above, some of the contributors to this thread have. I'm running Sanyo 2100s also because of availability - I can get the real thing cheap, incidentally at the same place where I got this SubC pack built. Virtually everything else I run is powered by those. They're pretty good. 

Anyway you should come out of the closet and be all the flashaholic you can be /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif I should thank you and Phaserburn for tipping me off to the existence of this bulb, I'm very impressed.


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