# I want a red LED thrower



## The Wolverine (May 3, 2010)

I am new to LED lights. I am looking at getting a _EagleTac T100C2 Mark II, or a TK11 for a white long throw weapon light.

I also hunt hogs at night, and need a red long throw LED weapon light. Can i modify a long throw white into a long throw red?

If I am going to modify it any way, can I start with a cheaper light off of DX?
_


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## kingofwylietx (May 3, 2010)

I am not aware of any red led drop-in's available on DX. You'll want either a red lens (less desireable option) or a red led drop-in (most desireable option). Nailbender has P60 red (and green) drop-ins.....maybe others do too.


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## cmendoza (May 3, 2010)

DealExtreme SKU 20333. Can add a smooth reflector or aspheric lens for even more throw. Both work well, the lens will throw a square.


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## smokeychris (May 3, 2010)

uhm whats up with the fake cigarettes? i get bi typing your code? SKU 20333


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## fyrstormer (May 3, 2010)

I bet someone could modify a Surefire E1B with a red Cree emitter for you. That would throw quite well.


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## alpg88 (May 3, 2010)

it'll be a lot simpler to find a white thrower and put a red filter on it.


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## spencer (May 3, 2010)

But a white LED contains so little red light because it is really a blue LED with phosphor so output will be dramatically cut. Better to start with a red LED.


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## mudman cj (May 3, 2010)

Another option would be a Surefire L1 in red. The model number is L1-HA-RD. It is my understanding that they aren't made anymore, but are still stocked in some online and brick and mortar stores or you could put out a request on CPFMP. I have used one (modded it actually), and can attest that it had pretty good throw for its size. A search for the part number will turn up some websites with them still in stock (so they say).


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## Pacecar (May 3, 2010)

Look at the Sniper Hawg Lights red Destroyer model.
I believe it is a modified DX SKU 16538 light (UniqueFire HS-802).


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## The Wolverine (May 3, 2010)

Thanks cmendoza. I looked all over DX and never saw that one, I looked more today, and found this sku.26345 it says it is a cree, this one show 1000mA. The SKU 20333 shows 800mA, does that mean the 26345 is brighter? I could not find the listing for the 20333 with a smooth reflector.

The 26345 says it is a drop in, how do you know what lights it will drop in? 

I need some 18650's, is DX a good place to get them? which charger? I see some rated for 2400mAh, 2600mAh, and up to 3000mAh, which ones are best? Some have button, some do not.

Like I said I am new to LED lights, and I do not have a clue.

I do not want to go with a filter, I have a red cover for my mag rechargeable, and it cuts the light by over 50% maybe 75%.


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## The Wolverine (May 3, 2010)

Pacecar, 

I think you are correct, if you look at the video on the destroyer, it is identical to the DX 16538. can I use the SKU 26345 red LED DX drop in, in the 16538?

-----------------------------

I responded twice, but my posts are not posting?

------------------------------

*ATTN: NEW MEMBERS!!*


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## alpg88 (May 3, 2010)

spencer said:


> But a white LED contains so little red light because it is really a blue LED with phosphor so output will be dramatically cut. Better to start with a red LED.


 light will be cut with any bulb, wheather led or hotwire.


i never said it was the best way, just fastest, simplest, cheapest, and fully reversible. and perfectly usable, night hunters used filters for decades, some pbly still do.

but yea red led will kick ***, especially sbt 120

to op, sure you can mod the white led, thou you'll pbly need to swap not only the led itself but a driver too, red leds need less v.
sure you can start with cheap dx, it would actually be the best way, in case of  you wont loose much.


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## IMSabbel (May 3, 2010)

alpg88 said:


> light will be cut with any bulb, wheather led or hotwire.



Er... no?
A red led will not procude anything but red light. No neat to cut anything...


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## Gryloc (May 3, 2010)

The Wolverine,

Pardon this message if it is overwhelming : A quick fix would be a pre-built light using a basic red LED or a filter (less desireable for output), but a higher performance option would be a flashlight that is modified or built by someone in the CPF community or by a store that CPF members would visit, or one that uses a high quality drop in.

I wanted to mention that a cheap option is asking for a modified maglite that uses a red LED emitter. The maglites are cheap, and modding services may be reasonable as well. The C or D cell maglite reflectors produce a really nice pencil thin beam. 

I also wanted to mention that if you modify, you may have to break away from the popular Cree brand, but that depends on the type of optics you use. For a maglite, or any light with a big and shallow reflector (less deep compared to its width), a LED emitter that emits light in a wider angle (lambertian -just a term for a wide angle emitter) would work best because more light would strike the surface of the reflector. The ideal emitter would be something like the discontinued Lumileds red or red/orange Luxeon III emitter. It produces up to 190 lumens in red light from a single tiny source (but using like 5W of energy). The Lumileds K2 red or red/orange emitters would also work great because they are high power packages, but these are not as powerful as the Luxeon III and will put out less red light. Lumileds makes a smaller and slightly lower power package called the Rebel. Cree's XP-E red emitters are comparable to the Rebel.

If you wanted to use an aspherical (condensor or projector) lens instead of a reflector, or if your reflector is really deep (optimized more for LED emitters -the depth is nearly the same size, or deeper, than its diameter), then the Cree would be great choice (especially for ashperic). The Cree XR-E red has a narrower beam angle than the above lambertian style emitters, and would work best for an aspheric lens, and work good in a deep reflector.

I do not want to get in a brand war. In the field of red or red/orange emitters, all brands are nearly identical in efficiency. The efficiency of red emitters (lumens per watt of input power) is far lower than the bright white emitters that we are so used to today. I mentioned the old, discontinued Luxeon III red (still sold by PhotonFanatic if none are in stock) because it uses a slightly larger red LED die that was able to take more current and put out more light than the newer Lumileds K2 or Rebel, and even the Cree emitters. It was a real red monster! I do not think that there are any flashlights currently (or ever) made with this emitter unless you look at people in the CPF who built or modified a flashlight to use one. The Luxeon III, Luxeon K2, and Seoul P4 has a similar package as this red Luxeon III so it can be swapped pretty easy. If a light already uses a current regulating driver, it should be able to handle a red LED fine. Typical red emitters have a slightly lower forward voltage (Vf) than the white LED emitters, but I think that when you drive the Luxeon III or K2 red at high enough currents, then the voltage range will be well within what normal white emitters range. However, if you use a plain resistor, or direct drive, then you will have to change the resistor value, or add a resistor. 

Swapping is easier than you think as long as it is easy to get to the LED and you can work a soldering iron or use thermal epoxy. So if you want a great light with good performance, then consider the route of modding or swapping unless you can get a good quality drop-in (like one that Gene or any other CPFer makes). I think Gene makes red dropins for maglites (I never checked). That would be a good thing to check since P60 dropins may lack in throw in comparison.

Good luck. We are happy to help you. Please keep us posted if you do make a decision, as many would love to hear more about high performance red LED throwers! I was tempted to make one myself, but I did not have a real application except for coon spotting (I am not a hunter). 


Cheers,
Tony


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## alpg88 (May 3, 2010)

IMSabbel said:


> Er... no?
> A red led will not procude anything but red light. No neat to cut anything...


really??? you don't say.


the bulbs in question are white, with red filter.


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## lightforce2 (May 4, 2010)

I modded a Tiablo A9 Aspheric by fitting a Cree Red XR-E with a 17mm base & direct driving it with an 18650 LiFeP04 battery. the Tiablo A9 lends itself very well for performance mods such as emitter & driver swaps and the also availability of an aspherical lens

Red XR-E's need a lower forward voltage so I experimented with an 18650 LiFePo4 which run at about 3.25V for most of their discharge cycle. I removed the driver from the Tiablo and placed a small coil of thin gauge wire about 1 metre long between the battery & the emitter, this provides just enough resistance so the emitter is driven to 1000ma (still a little overdriven but OK)

The A9 aspheric is a great thrower with the red emitter. It will spot the glint of an animals eye many hundreds of yards out. My only complaint is that the color rendition is very poor & its often hard to distinguish a dark brown or grey skined animal amongst a similar dark background such as tree trunks etc even though you are iluminating the area well

The Tiablo A9 Red Aspheric mounted to scope







My 3 LED lights I use for night shooting. The yellow filtered Dereelight is a spare & stays in my backpack, the second one is a scope mounted red A9
and the one on the right is another A9 Aspheric I use as a hand held when walking


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## datiLED (May 4, 2010)

I experimented with a red CREE XR-E and an aspheric lens last night, and the results were impressive. The throw from the red LED was incredible once the die was focused properly. 

Obviously, the red LED will not throw as well as a white LED when both are driven at their rated maximum current. But with a red CREE LED on a Mag heatsink using a modified driver board, you could project a tight red beam for at least 100 yards.


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## HarryN (May 4, 2010)

Hi, Photon Fanatic built a light for me with a Lumileds Lux III red / orange LED in it. (The same one can power a car tail light). As noted above by Gryloc, it is the brightest conventional package available up to that time, and far above most "modern" packages.

LEDEngin also makes a really bright red/orange LED package, but its larger size will be a bit trickier to focus into throw.

BTW - just so you can get a sense of what red - orange means - it is "traffic light red" - about 615 - 620nm.


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## The Wolverine (May 4, 2010)

Thanks all for your help. 

I am mechanically inclined and can solder, so I feel I can build what I need, if I knew what parts to buy, and where to get them from. 

If I buy this http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.16538 what driver and red LED light do I need? and where do I get it?

If I mod my mag rechargeable to a red LED, what parts do I need?

which 18650 do I need? and which charger?


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## The Wolverine (May 4, 2010)

Lightforce2

The Tiablo almost looks to be too tight of a beam for night hunting, do you have trouble picking up animals that are close, or in wide open areas, like clear cuts, or large green fields?

The beam is so intense its seems it would spook the game even though it is red, have you had any problems with spooking?


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## 007adan (May 5, 2010)

Heres a red Led mounted on a star board http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.1776
You should be able to swap it out to suit your needs


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## bshanahan14rulz (May 6, 2010)

No LED throws as well as a laser


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## lightforce2 (May 6, 2010)

> The Tiablo almost looks to be too tight of a beam for night hunting, do you have trouble picking up animals that are close, or in wide open areas, like clear cuts, or large green fields?


 
On the hand held unit I turn the head section containing the lens in or out to focus from a hotspot to wide angle



> The beam is so intense its seems it would spook the game even though it is red, have you had any problems with spooking?


 
I forgot to mention I upgraded the "wire" resistor unit by installing a 3 mode Dereelight 3SD driver

Yes we still have spooking problems with red light however the severity is reduced, a red light emmiting from a small diameter reflector helps to give the perception of greater distance between the light and the target. We also try to hold the light "low" as much as possible



> Heres a red Led mounted on a star board http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.1776
> You should be able to swap it out to suit your needs


 
Look closely, these cree reds from DX only have one wire going to the diode & cannot be over driven much without being burnt out. Cree also make a red led with 2 wires to the diode which is capable of being driven harder & is brighter


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## The Wolverine (May 7, 2010)

"Look closely, these cree reds from DX only have one wire going to the diode & cannot be over driven much without being burnt out. Cree also make a red led with 2 wires to the diode which is capable of being driven 
harder & is brighter "

Were do i get a better red LED with two wires?


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## 007adan (May 7, 2010)

The Wolverine said:


> "Look closely, these cree reds from DX only have one wire going to the diode & cannot be over driven much without being burnt out. Cree also make a red led with 2 wires to the diode which is capable of being driven
> harder & is brighter "
> 
> Were do i get a better red LED with two wires?


 
The Wolverine,

Ok this should suit your needs..
http://www.mouser.com part # 889-R42182 
Tried to paste the whole link but it wouldn't take. 
Scroll down on this part listing and you will see illumination color "Red"


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## lightforce2 (May 8, 2010)

Here's the link to the red emitters I have used
http://www.cutter.com.au/products.php?cat=Cree+XRC


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## sonicj (May 11, 2010)

The Wolverine said:


> I do not want to go with a filter, I have a red cover for my mag rechargeable, and it cuts the light by over 50% maybe 75%.


have you considered the high quality dichroic glass filters used for theatrical & architectural lighting? Rosco Permacolor Primary Red


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## luckybucket (May 11, 2010)

alpg88 said:


> it'll be a lot simpler to find a white thrower and put a red filter on it.




This is exactly what I did for a friend of mine. He wanted me to swap out his white led for a red one to hunt hogs. After doing my research I realized it would require high current draw and rechargable batteries. That is not an option for him. I ended up going to the camera store and buying a red filter that was 52 mm in diameter and taping it to the front of my sst-90 light. It puts out plenty of red light when driven at just 5 amps. It's also an aspheric so it can cover a large area while throwing the light a good distance. Of course this is an expensive option, but is handy for having red and white in the same light.


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## Sober (May 11, 2010)

Have a look @ the following thread post #41

https://www.candlepowerforums.com/posts/3241748

Sorry for the bad pictures, I will try and get some decent beamshots soon.

I haven't tried an aspheric lens with the red diamond dragon or the SST-90 red but I can tell you that they offer a big improvement over using a red filter with led/incan ect. The red diamond dragon @ 1 amp gives you 200+ red lumens in a D26 host like a surefire/solarforce which is decent for hunting with acceptable run times, if that doesn't satisfy your requirements you can always try the SST-90 red which will give you about 500+ lumens @ 4.8 amps or an aspherical lens or both... A red led is just so much more efficient. Give Nailbender a shout, I have ordered so many red drop-ins from him I lost count...


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## The Wolverine (May 11, 2010)

I am new to this flashlight deal, the link talks about a L2 solarforce, what I can gather that is a surefire 6P copy? What host does the SST-90 fit in?


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## The Wolverine (May 11, 2010)

Like I said, I do not know crap about lights. will this work in a 18650 powerd weaponlight? http://www.luminus.com/stuff/conten...st_90_rgb_product_datasheet__illumination.pdf 

How do I contact nailbender?


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## Sober (May 12, 2010)

The Wolverine said:


> I am new to this flashlight deal, the link talks about a L2 solarforce, what I can gather that is a surefire 6P copy? What host does the SST-90 fit in?



Yes the Solarforce is a Surefire 6P copy that accepts 18650's 



The Wolverine said:


> Like I said, I do not know crap about lights. will this work in a 18650 powerd weapon light? http://www.luminus.com/stuff/content...lumination.pdf
> 
> How do I contact nailbender?



I used a Seraph host with the D36 Mini-Turbo Head from Lumens Factory for the Red SST-90 - http://www.lumensfactory.com/cart.php?main_cat_id=1&PHPSESSID=cc230da472886ffc701b7b76fcce0f44

You can send him a pm or head over to the classifieds section https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/271519


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## MUSTARD (Nov 25, 2011)

LIGHTFORCE
does your tiable a9 red with the sperical head still throw a good usable beam/light at close to mid range, such as 50 to 100 meteres?
also, could you give a little more info on how usefull your yellow lensed light is at night with varmints?

i am thinking of using this head to build a coyote light.thanks


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## seven11 (Nov 26, 2011)

I built a red throw monster specifically for hunting coyotes. The build details are below.

Host: 2D mag with rebel reflector
LED: Red SST-90
Heatsink: Britelumens SST-90 modified to slide into the mag about an inch
Driver: TaskLED H6CC set to 6.3A (max spec on data sheet for SST-90 in red)
Batteries: Two 26650 cells with a 1-inch schedule 40 pvc sleeve (slightly bored out so the cells can slide in)
Switch: Tower cut off, sanded on both sides, 18awg wire soldered to positive and negative contacts.

This setup puts out around 400 lumens and is an awesome scanning light for picking up eyes. The beamshots below aren't of the best quality, but this setup will throw to about 150 yards and has a very large halo so it's perfect for scanning. I made a green one with the same setup and it is equally impressive in throw and spill.






By davicas at 2011-11-26
By davicas at 2011-11-19





By davicas at 2011-11-26





By davicas at 2011-11-26


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## MikeAusC (Nov 27, 2011)

alpg88 said:


> . . . . . . sure you can mod the white led, thou you'll pbly need to swap not only the led itself but a driver too, red leds need less v. . . . . .



If it's a switchmode driver (has a big inductor/coil) then it will drive a lower-voltage red LED with the same current and efficiency as a white LED.


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## Mark620 (Nov 27, 2011)

The Wolverine said:


> _I also hunt hogs at night, and need a red long throw LED weapon light. Can i modify a long throw white into a long throw red?_



Hogs have good eye sight...as soon as they see your light...they will be gone.

I know of someone who hunts hogs at night with IR scopes etc has the licenses and permits to do so...
He says he can hunt up to the point that he needs light, and as soon as he turns on the IR light they take off.
He says they see the red glow from the IR LEDS...

I would assume RED would be no better.


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## MikeAusC (Nov 27, 2011)

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?283475-Need-Red-LED-for-hunting

This post makes it clear that most hunters find that Red light is the only light that does not spook animals.

This is confirmed by the knowledge that Primates are the only mammals that have Red sensitivity - others can only see the Yellow-Green-Blue spectrum.


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## Sub_Umbra (Nov 27, 2011)

CPF user *IsaacHayes* built a custom cyan thrower for me after Katrina. He has built some bright R and R/O lights on M/\G CC and CCC hosts. He wrote at least one of them up for CPF.


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## Sub_Umbra (Nov 27, 2011)

Ooops


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## willieschmidt (Nov 28, 2011)

I will not argue rods and cones. On my feeder lights most any hog will feed under green or red led light. My camera does show that large older mature single boars will not feed under green light and will fringe feed at best. Red does work better. YMMV


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## jason 77 (Nov 28, 2011)

MikeAusC said:


> http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?283475-Need-Red-LED-for-hunting
> 
> This post makes it clear that most hunters find that Red light is the only light that does not spook animals.
> 
> This is confirmed by the knowledge that Primates are the only mammals that have Red sensitivity - others can only see the Yellow-Green-Blue spectrum.



Why do dogs and cats chase after red laser pointers then?


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## SkyPup (Nov 28, 2011)

jason 77 said:


> Why do dogs and cats chase after red laser pointers then?



Not because they are all red-green color blind.... or is chasing after a red laser some kind of scientific study that has been recently published?:nana:


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## MikeAusC (Nov 28, 2011)

jason 77 said:


> Why do dogs and cats chase after red laser pointers then?



The intensity of a Red laser spot is so high that it's detected by their Green Cone.

For hunting it's a case of picking a colour that has most visibility to us, while having as little visibility to them as possible - the further away from Green you go, the better it works.


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