# [project] OrthoDogs aka D26 killer



## dsche

Here's the thing: there are a lot of Surefire-compatible goods you know. And no other may offer same. Yeah, Surefire-lego so attractive 







A fly in the ointment? Well, there is no heat sinking at this kind of body. Foil? Stripped beer can? You guys have a lot of fun with it, but this road not a glory one, sorry

Give a minute… that's this?






18650 extender! This one from Solarforce, but 5Mega have same too. May we use it?

Please one more minute… voila!






And now…






I think it's a good idea, isn't it?






C'mon – any C tail, any C head, any anything!


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## Conte

This is kind of interesting. But, I'm trying to understand what I'm seeing here. 

You made a custom designed head. 
It has a C head on one side and a C tail on the other, and it screws into any c-tail body extension ?

Then, you have a copper pill that screws into the head to mount the LED star ?

Where do you put the driver ? On the other side of the copper insert ?
What size reflectors fit ?


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## Eric242

dsche said:


> You gays have a lot of fun with it....


:thinking:  :green: ............


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## dsche

*Conte*, absolutely!

There are two custom parts: aluminum neck (C head to C tail) + 'big' or 'small' copper insert for it (usually I've put silver on copper for prevent corrosion)

Here's the pic from very first experimental run (dimension slightly different)











With 'small' one you may use single LED + TIR optic











^copper MCPCB soldered on copper silvered insert
















^ TIR inside C-head











^ another TIR






and with 'big' one we may use standard Carclo triple|quad optic

We may put driver inside copper part or inside aluminum one, as we like


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## dsche

*Eric242,* fixed, thanks! :duck:


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## Conte

I'd like to see an example of the driver fitted. 
Post the update when you get to it.


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## dsche

Fitted in the neck: 8x7135 linear, WhiteBird buck (vise versa on the bottom pic)






)


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## Conte

I like it. It's pretty slick. 

Have you considered also making the adapter out of copper? 

In fact, if you made it out of copper, you could probably eliminate the insert all together and get even better thermal performance. 
The question is, what is more economically feasible, making 2 different kinds of adapters cut to different depths?
Or making one kind of adapter, and just using the inserts as you do now to set the depths?

I guess this way is cheaper. 

Are these for sale ?

Meanwhile, if you wanted to use a reflector instead of those optics, what kinds of reflectors fit ?


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## dsche

It's look like I need to explain more about the project instead of posting endless pictures) in fact my poor language skills force me to do it this way, sorry

The main idea is a making some D26 killer as title says; i.e. some universal basic for building of every sort and kind of LED flashlights.

This basic ("The Neck") accept C-tail (or extender), C-head and a special threaded "Insert". Also Neck may accept standard 17-mm driver, but a driver may be installed in insert too (because sizes of drivers may be larger)

So we have one 'constant' part (Neck) and another various part (Insert).

For the moment we can't imagine which kind of optic|MCPCB|driver may be called next year for example, so all non-constance must be removed out of equation.

Another idea is a making some kind of "One Set" with different prêt-à-porter heads (e.g. one is warm EDC flooder with three or four modes, another is cool long-range with one mode, third is HiCRI neutral Nichia quad for photo etc). One body, different heads. This is a good occasion for naming it after the Ὄρθος, multi-headed mythological dog.

As to me, I like TIR a lot, especially LL01ED-AJ25L for single LED; it's makes best Gauss I've even seen











Of course, in terms of efficiently triple or especially quad work better; so we need to work with Carclo arrays too

Sum up, for the now we have only two kinds of inserts (but in future some new forms may be expected)


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## nfetterly

Hmm, viewing on laptop / firefox browser - no photos??


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## dsche

Two more answers )

1. Yes, it's possible to make full-copper neck, but due heavy-weight of copper it's limit the use of this kind of light. The biggest deal is heat-management near the source (LED), massive good-connected (special paste other the thread) silvered copper insert resolve it in full.

2. Yes, I may build any custom light on this base for sale. I have different types of LED (HiCRI Nichia 219B, Cree gen 2 etc), and optic as well as drivers and direct-connected MCPCB


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## dsche

*nfetterly*, no idea :thinking: maybe some sanctions against Russian hosting IP?


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## Conte

I See the photos just fine. I'm in Canada it it matters.


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## 880arm

Nice job. As much as we all like playing LEGO with our lights this is something to open up some new possibilities.



nfetterly said:


> Hmm, viewing on laptop / firefox browser - no photos??



MalwareBytes was blocking them for me on Chrome. It didn't like the lumenaddicts domain name.


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## dsche

*880arm, *Why they do that? LumenAddiction not dangerous you know! Well, it may be dangerous, right.

Some new pics






^ silvered copper insert, silvered copper direct-connect quad board






^ soldered together with 219B HiCRI






^ good thick wires needs some tricks


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## dsche

first done


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## Conte

Quad Nichia ?
What driver did you use ?


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## dsche

*Conte**, *WhiteBird ultra-efficient buck


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## Conte

Can't seem to find any information on the white bird.


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## dsche

Conte said:


> Can't seem to find any information on the white bird.



It's Russian/Ukrainian, some info here (first experimental run, discontinued) and here and here (all Russian)

Manufactured in Alchevsk (Ukraine / self-proclaimed Lugansk People Republic) so I don't know about actual availability due massive hostility in that region. But I may ask if you want.


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## Conte

Mostly just curious of the specs. 
My guess is you're running them in parallel, but at what total current ?

Since the point of this unit is for good cooling, I'm wondering how hard you can drive them.


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## dsche

*Conte*, basically I've interested good heatsinking not for overdrive but for stabilized and predictable brightness: as you know LED brightness drops with high heating (even if human eye don't notice it)

Of course, for building thrower I may overdrive small LED like XP-E2, but this one head was intend as EDC, so each Nichia receive 750mA only; it's good choice.

Is it possible to overdrive quad to receive 2500+ lumen? No problem, but we need more complicated cooling head (Cryos or Solarforce A001) and 2xLiIon.

Drawing 5-6 and more amperes from single cell not a good idea. Yes, it's possible, but it obviously may cause some problems.


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## texas cop

dsche, really nice work there. 2500+ lumen overdriven quad, that's how we roll around here. I'm also a fan of really bright quads or triples considering the XP-L's are here. Just need a practical low and medium mode to use the other 99% of the time.


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## dsche

texas cop, No problem with it when you do it for yourself. Serious problem if you do it for sale )

Well, build-in thermal control do it work, but if buyer use it for says photo or some… he may dissatisfy with it


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## Conte

I'm interested in doing a multi nichia build one day. Probably in a mag tho.

Meanwhile, If you have common Qlite driver, you can stack it up to maybe 4a. 
I wonder how well a quad of Nichias would run 1a each in something that small. 

You might be interested in something like this:
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?361212-Full-Copper-Ultra-Cool-C-head-By-Fivemega


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## dsche

White Bird may draw up to 4.5A without problem, limits not here.

Of course, we need good 'layered' head, maybe like 5mega '*Beefy*'


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## dsche

Well, it's time for second head )



























One body + two different heads


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## texas cop

So now instead of "dropins" we have "screw ons". I do hope this becomes the next trend. Your copper inserts, are they using an existing pill size and threads?


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## cland72

Any beamshots outdoors of the TIR optic? Looks awesome!


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## dsche

Some beamshots for 10 and 25 degrees TIR with XM-L











Wide XM-L vs narrow XM-L wallshot:











narrow XP-G2 wallshot:






Carclo triple XP-G narrow vs Wide XM-L, different exposure


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## dsche

*texas cop,* based of standard size I've choose M24x1 thread, and we still may use lamp drop-ins as inserts


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## Conte

What's this ? Are you figuring out what reflector fits ?


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## dsche

Conte, sure, any D26 drop-in fit my 'Neck' (of course it have sense with lamp modules only)

And yes, we can use D26 reflectors instead of TIR if we like it


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## dsche

*cland72, *more outdoor with LL01ED-AJ25L (my favorite)

control






light on (60m distance)






on the road


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## AndyF

This concept looks like a good option for the Leef 27LT bodies at Lighthound. The internal thread is 13/16" x 20 TPI, approximately 3/4" deep. However, the internal threads are anodized.





Basically a male version of an E-C adapter.


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## dsche

AndyF said:


> for the Leef 27LT bodies at Lighthound.



*AndyF*, bingo! It was a first my idea. And I make some 'Necks' for Leef 27lt.

Actually on this pictures Leef body shown (note a leaf sign!)
















But on second thoughts I've found this idea not quite good

First, I don't know how large LH stock for it. Who will need my work when they completely done? Produce heads for discontinued bodies… well, it's not a good business plan
And more: these bodies are long. Extra inch make it uncomfortable, it can't fit standard holsters etc
Third, there are no short (18350) 27lt bodyes

So, if you need 27lt neck – I have some, but main course for the day – C-C extenders

And some weight measurement (all lights with batteries, weight in grams)


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## AndyF

I would be interested in the 27LT necks. PM sent.


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## Conte

Any news?


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## dsche

Well, just now I'm playing with tactile button


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## Str8stroke

Neat project for sure. Are you selling these?? 


Thanks for taking the time to post all those pics. Looks like that one pic in the tunnel is some sorta Cold War bunker entrance! What part of Russia is that?


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## Conte

You know what I've been looking for that this setup might be good for . . . 

And E series head. 

There are lots of nice E series bodies that Fivemega makes that I'm interested in, but I want a blank DIY head to build a LED system with. 

YOu figure you could turn one of these up but with a diff body thread to mount on an E body ?


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## dsche

Str8stroke, there are a lot of abandoned underground communication just below central part of Moscow. Some are military, another for underground stream (because historically Moscow has a lot of small rivers around, but later almost all of them was tunneled). This one lay out for some kind of cables but in fact used very moderately (four to five thin wires, maybe de-energized). So local diggers found it and now it used for making beamshots safe from prying eyes ) And about 500 meters farther it break with underground stream.

And yes, I may build (almost) any head for sale, you are welcome )

Conte, E series bodies looks interested, but I don't hear about cheap ones. C-extenders cost from $6 to $60 and it matter for me: we have a chance to build cheap or expensive custom as customer need. Maybe after I bring current project into shape – I'll try another threads, but I need complete the project first


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## Conte

Any news.


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## dsche

*Conte*, early at June I've placed an order and paid for batch of anodized OrthoDogs necks on one Ukrainian factory... well, they are still somewhere, but nobody can pick they up

I hope once it's must be resolved, but now I cut off from my Ukrainian partners (both for electronics and shell) and it make production very tricky, sorry


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## dsche

One more bad news: FiveMega extender have too short thread







So we need to exclude it from compatible list

But! New OR extenders looks good






and fit good


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## darkknightlight

This looks like an awesome idea! I'd be really interested in one-piece copper unit, with a high amp single mode xml.


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## nfetterly

dsche said:


> *nfetterly*, no idea :thinking: maybe some sanctions against Russian hosting IP?



Came across thread again, photos all appear now - looks great !!


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## Conte

dsche said:


> One more bad news: FiveMega extender have too short thread



Check the o-rings, he adds an extra oring that sometimes does not let things screw on all the way unless it was designed to go with his part.

Is it possible that the threads on your head are too long?
Maybe you could shorten it a bit for added compatibility?


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## scottyhazzard

So are these for sale?


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## dsche

*darkknightlight*, I have copper ones and may solder it together with copper insert (we need two-piece construction due different optic sizes)

*nfetterly*, thanks!

*Conte*, one more problem with Five Mega extenders – they are have anodized threads so we need slightly bigger thread on neck side for effective contact, but accurate shortening may solve the problem (all another extenders came with non-anodized threads)

*scottyhazzard*, yes, I may build (almost) any config for you, please PM me with detail you needed


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## darkknightlight

Sounds like a good option! What do you mean by different optic sizes? I'm definitely interested in a single mode with 4+ amps getting to the emitter, with the tightest optic you've got 

Edit: different optics for different numbers of emitters. Sorry; my brain stopped working for a minute!


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## dsche

*darkknightlight*, may build 4A version with dedomed XM-L2 or 2A with XP-E2 and 10-degrees TIR but of course D26 format not for a true thrower )


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## darkknightlight

Yes, I realize that this isn't a true thrower. For that I have larger lights  How is the tint shift from a dedomed xml2 affected by the tir? I definitely prefer a good neutral tint. My 3c xpg2 is probably my favorite


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## dsche

With mechanical dedome (cutting with sharp blade) color stays same; with chemical (gazoline etc) tint move to warmer, slightly greenish field so for best result some series of experiments always needed


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## darkknightlight

Oh really? I'd assumed that regardless of the method used, dedoming resulted in tint shift


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## darkknightlight

So I was looking at your white wall beam shots again; xpg2 might be for me. What is the price for an all copper piece with a 3c xpg2?


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## dsche

Hi everybody!

First anodized batch moved from Ukrainian side to me, hallelujah!






*darkknightlight*, need you one-mode or multi-mode version? Complete silvered copper 1-mode neck is $150 and 3-mode with WhiteBird driver is $200; all others parts (tail+switch, body 18650 tube, bezel+UCL+bezelRing) are from $27 (Solarforce) to anynumber (Cryos, McClicky, OR parts etc)

Shipping (airmail with track) about $7.5


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## darkknightlight

Hmmm let me think about that. I'm trying to figure out what would be the best way to drive the led. I'm a big fan of direct-drive lights (no electronics), but it usually requires some pretty specific methods for attaching the led to the heat sink. How do you secure the led star to the sink?


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## dsche

*darkknightlight, *all copper parts (direct-connected MCPCB+insert+neck) must be soldering together just after silvering, so direct-drived XM-L2 must work without any excess, but with XP-G2 AND good high-amp LiIon it may be overload a little


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## DragonHead

So cool, very interested.


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## darkknightlight

I hate to do this, but I have to withdraw my interest for the time being. I just got my supplemental property tax bill a couple days ago. :-(


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## Bellirr6

Great idea and love the concept, any chance for a Black HA version?


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## dsche

Yes, I must try to boil gray ones with some black paint once )

But for the now I may offer three spices only: bare aluminum, gray anodized or copper (copper ones must be silvered)


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## Conte

How's this project going ?


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## Mr. Nobody

Daamn this is pretty. I really like the TIR onboard


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## scottyhazzard

So how much for just the copper shell and spacer set up for a triple or a quad?


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## dsche

*Conte*, now I'm playing with 20W 2x18650 configuration (2xNichia + 2xXP-G2)
















*Mr. Nobody*, thanks a lot!

*scottyhazzard*, copper 'Neck' + copper 'Insert' must be $45 for bare and $55 for drilled and silvered + $7.5 worldwide airmail


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## dsche

New one with last Lux-RC module


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## texas cop

Love your work. Any projections for manufacturing these little gems for the public. Personally I'd like to see a triple or quad XP-G2 S4 pushing 2 amps each in a 2%-25%-100% setup. Or a FET driver.


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## DrafterDan

Bump for a great concept. I've already placed my order with Alexey, and bringing in the needed components for my mad science experiment. 
Heck, I'm even having DragonHead do a special cerakote on the parts for me. This will be fun!

~D


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