# Strike Bezel - gimmick or useful?



## SuperTrouper (Nov 20, 2009)

Hello,

I'm fairly new to the forums however I can't seem to find a topic on this subject around the forums already.

I've mainly used Maglites in the past, primarily because of what I believed to be good runtimes and their self defence properties. I've recently updated to the new Rebel Maglites.

I live in a country where you're not allowed to carry anything for the express purpose of self defence, you are expected to go about less well protected than criminals, but a torch, having another purpose, I believe is generally fair game if you're out walking at night.

Does anyone have any information on wether or not the strike bezels on products like the Surefire E2DL are actually useful? It's not my intention to start a flame war or anything so forgive me if this is one of those sensitive topics that outsiders unwittingly kick off from time to time that sparks the flames.

I've been reading reviews on Surefire lights and I do like the small sizes offering more personal protection options than my current EDC, a Rebel AA Mini Maglite.

So thanks in advance for any advice/opinions.


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## ZRXBILL (Nov 20, 2009)

I would say it's always better to bust your flashlight up on someones head than your knuckles.


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## SuperTrouper (Nov 20, 2009)

But are any of them up to that kind of punishment?


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## strinq (Nov 20, 2009)

They are definitely strong enough for their intended purpose BUT most of us would probably not need it.


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## Sgt. LED (Nov 20, 2009)

SuperTrouper said:


> It's not my intention to start a flame war or anything so forgive me if this is one of those sensitive topics that outsiders unwittingly kick off from time to time that sparks the flames.


That's what this pretty much is. Also this is more suited for the general flashlight section.

Think about where you live and just use your hands.


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## ateallthepies (Nov 20, 2009)

I know what you mean. The chavs run round with knives and more guns since the pistol ban came in and our laws on defence are pathetic and it seems 9 times out of 10 if you bash someone in self defence you will be the one to get done. It would only take one punch or kick after they are down for you to be arrested for assault.

I would think a strike bezel would cut more than a maglite if pushed into skin but the size of lights now you couldn't use them as a cosh as with a mag so need the bezel to compensate for the size and weight?


Steve.


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## SuperTrouper (Nov 20, 2009)

Sgt. LED said:


> That's what this pretty much is.



For some reason I suspected it might be one of those iffy subjects. I posted it here because I am considering purchasing an LED light with a strike bezel. I wouldn't want an incandescent light.


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## Yucca Patrol (Nov 20, 2009)

Great for mashing potatoes too! :naughty:


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## TooManyGizmos (Nov 20, 2009)

Welp ..... here we go again :mecry:

It's probably also legal where you are to carry a rock .... they're so abundant.

The bezels you speak of are very useful for what I personally think they were initially intended for .....

which was .... If you leave your light on , and place it head down on a flat surface , the escaping photons thru the crenulation curvatures , alert you that the light was left on . That which is not so easy to tell if you have a light with a smooth/flat bezel , placed on a smooth surface .

If there IS a gimmick to be associated with it , it must be the "Mr. Bad-A$$" marketing approach that redefined it for their needs as an "Attack Bezel".

I wonder which marketer was first to redefine it ?

Check with the Authorities in your region to see if its considered a weapon and how they would rule on it if you used it as one .

And YES - there have been many threads on this topic in the past. Which most didn't go well .

It's always best to stay away from areas , events and people that might involve hostilities .
The best advice I can give you is to be very careful who you associate with . Most fights break out in areas where that type of mentality is present . But if you are NOT in that type of environment , and you are attacked for no good reason - then anything goes , and fight for your life the best way you can .
.


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## zs&tas (Nov 20, 2009)

i feel much safer having my low strike bezel on my Nex - its a small torch anyway with no weight behind it. it also gives usefull protection to the light - one of mine have bent after droping my light, rather that than something else braking.
you do not need one of those overly massive strike bezels and you could get done with one of them, a 'normal' strike bezel is enough with the 'points' on them, and you wont get stoped.


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## ateallthepies (Nov 20, 2009)

TooManyGizmos said:


> Welp ..... here we go again :mecry:
> 
> It's probably also legal where you are to carry a rock .... they're so abundant.



To have a rock on you without good reason is punishable with instant death in the UK.
However stab or shoot someone and you will get a slap on the wrist and told to not do it again

Sorry for going off topic and the sarcasm but our laws do frustrate me sometimes you have to seriously think before doing anything these days for fear of breaking the law.

Back to LED's, I would prefer a strike bezel if only like toomanygizmos to see if the light is on when placed lens side down.

Steve.


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## KeyGrip (Nov 20, 2009)

They are certainly effective, but if you are trained to used a flashlight as a defensive weapon, the addition of pointy bits won't add much more. By that I mean a properly trained person could do more damage with a Mini-Mag than I could with an E2DL.

They also have a downside in that the sharper bezel is more likely to break the skin. Some people might look at that as an advantage but do you really want some junkie's blood all over your light?


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## P220C (Nov 20, 2009)

Meh...

it's gimmicky marketing, and a good way to rip your pockets.

However, using a flashlight as a field expedient Kubaton is not a new idea by any stretch, so there is at least some legitimacy to the idea. I just don't see as how they would make any measurable difference when deployed in such a manner.

Plus I think they look awful.


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## TooManyGizmos (Nov 20, 2009)

Just remember , if it's just a fist fight , and you use a Quote "strike bezel" , in the end you may be the one judged as using excessive force by the authorities.

In the USA , You are only allowed to use as much force as is necessary to defend yourself and cease the attack - but not excessive force - or you yourself in the end will be charged.

But only as of lately , that rule does not apply in *some* states when it involves home invasion crimes.

I think we as a flashlight community are doing ourselves a disservice by reffering to it in those terms. Maybe brainwashing ourselves in a bad way. If you are ever in front of a judge and jury , and let it *slip* , that you hit him with your *strike bezel* , then the tables may have just turned - out of your favor.

You better learn to just refer to it as your Flashlight and Every Day Carry for emergencies.
You also don't want it taken away from you , and used against yourself , which can happen in a skirmish.
A common tire tool is for changing tires , but if used in a fight , it becomes viewed as a response with a deadly weapon , and you better have a darn good reason for using it that way. A mean looking light , to the jury , might look like a deadly weapon as well . You better have a good defense lawyer . (one that can explain the original intended purpose of a crenelated bezel .
.


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## clg0159 (Nov 20, 2009)

Blind them with the light and punch with the other fist. Remember that if you strike them with your light you may scratch it


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## pipspeak (Nov 20, 2009)

TooManyGizmos said:


> In the USA , You are only allowed to use as much force as is necessary to defend yourself and cease the attack - but not excessive force - or you yourself in the end will be charged.


 
Yeah, but the police in the US generally use some common sense and ain't gonna bust a mugging victim just because they threw one punch too many in self defence. In the UK I'm not so sure that's the case al the time. 

I understand people saying such bezels were not generally intended for anything other than showing a light is on when bezel down, but that's not always the case. Surefire porcupine? Heh. Even the E2DL is marketed as being a self defence tool, and that bezel is sharp enough to make a hole in someone's skull (literally). 

However, simply having such a light on you is not going to guarentee anything... it's certainly not going to scare your average chav. Just be sure you know how to use it most effectively when push comes to shove so you don't end up breaking your wrist or having your arm broken while attempting. A well-aimed and effective punch is probably going to be just as effective in many cases... but then you have to know how to actually punch properly :devil:


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## Alberta-Blue (Nov 20, 2009)

Strike bezels are generally very useful... I have used the one on my E2DL 3 times before with a fairly impressive effect.

HOWEVER... since you are in the UK and Police are more inclined to use the very very broad definition of weapons for their purposes(anything and everything)... I would talk to a PC that you trust and find out what the regional services policy is on "what consitutes and wespon".


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## TooManyGizmos (Nov 20, 2009)

U.K.'ers ,
Please tell an ignorant American ....

What is a "chav" that you refer to ?


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## SuperTrouper (Nov 20, 2009)

TooManyGizmos said:


> U.K.'ers ,
> Please tell an ignorant American ....
> 
> What is a "chav" that you refer to ?



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chav


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## outersquare (Nov 20, 2009)

you guys living in UK need to revolt already

your self defense laws are beyond insane

if you are going to prison for defending yourself anyways, you might as well carry as crazy a weapon as you can easily get..


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## SuperTrouper (Nov 20, 2009)

outersquare said:


> you guys living in UK need to revolt already
> 
> your self defense laws are beyond insane
> 
> if you are going to prison for defending yourself anyways, you might as well carry as crazy a weapon as you can easily get..



I'd agree with you but we also have no freedom of speech over here either, so I'd be concerned that such agreement could possibly be used against me by whoever monitors the internet for us in the UK.


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## TooManyGizmos (Nov 20, 2009)

SuperTrouper said:


> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chav



"the 'Chavs' are depicted as being anti-social bullies."

Thanx , I see now ...........

Soon they will be added to the NoNo list of "Racial Profiling" at world wide airports.

Are there any black,brown,grizzly or polar Bears in your part of the world ?

Could you carry a large aerosol can of "Bear spray" better known as pepper spray (capsium)(sp).

You really need something to make them keep their distance from you .
.


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## zs&tas (Nov 20, 2009)

outersquare said:


> you guys living in UK need to revolt already
> 
> your self defense laws are beyond insane
> 
> if you are going to prison for defending yourself anyways, you might as well carry as crazy a weapon as you can easily get..


 
im in the uk, i should have added to my post earlier, i would not use my light as a first choice except for blinding, if the light is stock and i happen to be in real trouble i would not hesitate to use it. i only carry it on night walks so have a ligitimate reason to carry it, the bezel is there to protect the light no other reason, but if i need it, i will use it. it will be a natural reaction and not premeditated. i really wouldnt use it unless i had taken a good few hits. i would not think this would cause a problem in court. now modified lights are different.........


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## SuperTrouper (Nov 20, 2009)

TooManyGizmos said:


> Are there any black,brown,grizzly or polar Bears in your part of the world ?
> 
> Could you carry a large aerosol can of "Bear spray" better known as pepper spray (capsium)(sp).



No bears.....seriously, not heard of the UK before?

Pepper spray, CS Spray, Stun Guns, Tasers, etc are all illegal weapons here in the UK. It's ok for the Police to use them though.


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## outersquare (Nov 20, 2009)

I'm not a lawyer, but let me add that if your legal system is as insane as it sounds, if you intend to do this, don't use a flashlight with anything like "defender" written on it, the implement you use will almost certainly be taken as evidence, and with a name like that written on it, prosecution will probably try to paint some intent of weapons use from it.

Hell if you ever have to actually defend yourself, you may want to just consider scooting immediately afterward, esp if you are gonna be punished heavily for it. There is no benefit to hanging around..

Good luck to you guys in UK, hopefully you find a peaceful way to regain your natural rights..


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## SuperTrouper (Nov 20, 2009)

outersquare said:


> don't use a flashlight with anything like "defender" written on it, the implement you use will almost certainly be taken as evidence, and with a name like that written on it, prosecution will probably try to paint some intent of weapons use from it.



Obvious though that sounds, it's actually a really good bit of advice and something I hadn't considered.

Thanks!


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## TooManyGizmos (Nov 20, 2009)

Sorry to hear about it - things are bad WorldWide - I don't get out much.

What your community needs is an 8 foot Robot ....... called "Gort".

It's from a 1951 movie titled " The day the Earth stood still".

klaatu-barada-nikto .......... He would take care of all your troubles.

We have something similar to that here on our forums ...........

He's called ...... " Robocop " ........ he's an aggression stopping Moderator .

Wish we could send you one .... but your postal rates are too Hi .
.


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## TooManyGizmos (Nov 20, 2009)

SuperTrouper said:


> No bears.....seriously, not heard of the UK before?
> .




seriously, yes .... I've heard of the United Kingdom 

(as I recall .... it was a wildlife show .... somewhere in Omaha )

I wish you guys could get more United , like us Gun-totin-rednecks , here in the United States of America .


Gosh ... how can you guys not have any bears up there ?
We even have non native China Panda bears here in the U.S.A.
.


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## ateallthepies (Nov 20, 2009)

Things aren't all bad over here but the law abiding persons liberties are being eroded all the time. 
We have the human rights act that seems to only protect the criminals, a police and court service that is bogged down in red tape and under resourced and with no where to send the criminals when we do catch them as our jails are FULL! If we do jail people it is for pitiful short sentences, not like you Americans who send evil people away for life with no chance of parole. 
Time and again we hear of law abiding people pushed to the limit by yobs and either are killed or hurt or stand up to them and are prosecuted. I tell ya, sometimes it is better to just walk on by a situation as if you intervene you will either get hurt or nicked!


Sorry this has nothing to do with flashlights. 

Steve.


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## ateallthepies (Nov 20, 2009)

TooManyGizmos said:


> I wish you guys could get more United , like us Gun-totin-rednecks , here in the United States of America .



Oh how true.

The latest thing is they are trying is to ban air guns in Scotland. Not your American high power ones but our 12 ftlbs 'pop' guns!
If this happens it will only be time before the rest of the UK goes the same way.
They banned pistols over 6 ftlbs power after the Dunblane shooting and all the legitimate shooters lost their guns while the criminals kept theirs.
Still our government thinks banning stuff is the answer. All the bans have only affected the law abiding while the scum carry on regardless!

I am a air rifle shooter and am dismayed that soon I may be forced to give up shooting because of a few idiots that behave badly with air guns.

We do have a few organizations that 'represent' shooters but they are divided and need to come together to fight for our shooting rights.

It seems in the UK the only past time we are allowed to do legally is drink ourselves to death in all our 24 hour pubs and clubs.

Sheesh

Steve.


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## Brasso (Nov 20, 2009)

I think I'd kill myself just to see who got prosecuted.


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## TooManyGizmos (Nov 20, 2009)

Steve and Supertrouper ....... in all seriousness ,

I am truly very sorry you have to live that type of existance !

Your posts remind us to fight for the liberties we still have . Our rights are slowly eroding too .

Human rights have in some ways been abused in our country. But I've always considered that it's every humans right to use the best tools to defend themselves with the best available technology when they are wrongly attacked. I hope no harm comes to you !

Maybe it's time for you to learn to use common tools as weapons like in China when they used farm implements , staffs and canes. A little Kung-Fu perhaps and Shogun warrior Samurai tactics .

I wish you both well .
.

(They may have to pry hot smokey things from my cold dead hands one day . Yay N.R.A. )


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## sabre7 (Nov 20, 2009)

So just how are strike bezels used for defense on smaller lightweight lights the size of a SF 6P?


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## generallobster (Nov 20, 2009)

does anyone know of any strike bezel flashlights that use AA rather than Cr123?


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## TooManyGizmos (Nov 20, 2009)

sabre7 said:


> So just how are strike bezels used for defense on smaller lightweight lights the size of a SF 6P?




I'm sure you can't learn it here on CPF .

And doubt the mods would allow such exchanges .

You might get some helpful instruction if you took the right type of course.
.


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## Ozgeardo (Nov 20, 2009)

Many of my flashlights I would consider as a appropriate defence tool if I felt "threatened" which under common law (ALL western countries I believe have a common law interpretation) you would be in good standing to use a strike bezel if it has not been specifically listed as a prohibited or controlled weapon. (This would require legislation such as the ridiculous UK knife laws).

I am not a Lawyer but I am a first responder (unarmed) to numerous behavioural issues on a daily basis. It is NOT uncommon for me to be dealing with a recalcitrant who brandishes a broken bottle at me for example, to which I would have no hesitation in using a "Flashlight or similar to offer personal defence).

Back on subject, I have found the strike bezel on my Olight M30 to be a ideal filter retainer for the diffusion lens (that rubber sleeve was cumbersome and easily got misplaced or was impractical to store on my person when required. The diffusion lens is glued into the back of the strike bezel and stores easily in an equipment pouch and can be screwed on when/if required. "The crenelation's merely serve as an irregular surface to grip whilst tightening" and that is the defence I will be offering the judge/jury if required!


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## TooManyGizmos (Nov 20, 2009)

generallobster said:


> does anyone know of any strike bezel flashlights that use AA rather than Cr123?



They don't have strike bezels , they just have crenellated bezels .... O.K.


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## sabre7 (Nov 20, 2009)

TooManyGizmos said:


> I'm sure you can't learn it here on CPF .
> 
> And doubt the mods would allow such exchanges .
> 
> ...



Sorry not asking about specifics or instruction, just very general terms such as impact, jab, cut, pressure point/Kubotan, etc. Seems fairly useless on a smaller light, just intimidating looking.


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## Dude Dudeson (Nov 20, 2009)

sabre7 said:


> Seems fairly useless on a smaller light, just intimidating looking.


 
Hah!

Okay, I'm standing in front of you and you get to choose between a smash on the face with my 6P Defender or my fist - what are you going to pick?

But with that said, these things aren't intended as any kind of primary weapon.

They're designed as last ditch, "better than having nothing at all" weapons.


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## TooManyGizmos (Nov 20, 2009)

Family forums don't allow discussion of general terms such as impact, jab, cut, pressure point/Kubotan, etc.

The owner winch is squeamish about descriptive violence .
.


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## sabre7 (Nov 20, 2009)

TooManyGizmos said:


> Family forums don't allow discussion of general terms such as impact, jab, cut, pressure point/Kubotan, etc.
> 
> The owner winch is squeamish about descriptive violence .
> .


My question is relevant to the topic of this thread: gimmick or useful... if they are useful, how are they used? 

Again, my question was not meant to elicit answers involving descriptive violence, tactics, or other details but a vague description of their usefulness. 

If others would care to answer without your intervention, it would be appreciated.


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## TooManyGizmos (Nov 20, 2009)

OK then .... just don't get the thread closed . 

Greta's watching :kiss:


I'm turning this potential suicide thread over to sabre7 now ..... I'm gone


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## MCFLYFYTER (Nov 20, 2009)

Not to be rude, but if you can't figure out how to use it, I would suggest you invest in a good pair of running shoes. All it could do is subject more psi than your fist. If you know where to punch some one, those are your targets. Use your torch and you won't break your hand.


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## SuperTrouper (Nov 21, 2009)

I'm sorry I started this now, I'll stick to the Maglites!


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