# LED Christmas Lights, 2007



## Darell (Oct 9, 2007)

I can't find a current thread on these for this year... so here it is. That time of year AGAIN. Anybody have the poop on the best LED strings out this year?! I want all white! None of this multi-colored stuff for me. And I'd like some strings that actually last a season or two... no more "ForeverBright" that isn't!


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## PhotonWrangler (Oct 9, 2007)

I saw some strings on display at Loew's that have the foreverbright cone shape but they're GE branded. I pushed the button on the "try me" display and found that the white ones are actually a pleasing, slightly warm white. At least the two in the demo panels were.

I have no idea whether these are full-wave or half-wave strings. The "try me" power source is often a battery pack so it's not a true indication of how they'll look in real life.


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## Darell (Oct 9, 2007)

Ah yes. Thanks for the "half wave" reminder as well! I do think it is time for some non-flickering units as well!

I've been told that the local Costco is filled up with this year's LED strings, but know nothing more about them. And there's NOTHING online about them.


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## yuandrew (Oct 9, 2007)

My WalMart SuperCenter conversion just started stocking Christmas decorations around the beginning of this October as well. I remember seeing some Sylvania branded LED Christmas lights there as well as their own "house brand" sets in multicolored. 

I haven't been to Target in a while but I do expect them to have the Philips brand LED lights again. I have a string of white from when they were first introduced and the second generation string with in-line resistors on the cord. The second generation (and I assume the current ones) are noticeably a lot brighter; almost blinding than the first set.

Still have my 2001 Forever Bright sets.


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## sledhead (Oct 9, 2007)

Replaced all my lights last year with the philips brand LED's from Target. All red and white. I'll be putting them up early this year, hopefully they will all work! The whites have a slightly blueish tint but it grew on us.


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## yuandrew (Oct 11, 2007)

I was down at Lowe's today for some electrical stuff (replacing a cracked ceramic light socket) and decided to check out the Seasonal items while I was at it. I found the GE light sets and a pre-lit tree using the white (actually a warm white colored LED about 2800 to 3000K judging from some compact fluorescent lamps). I decided to take a box over to the pre-lit tree area where I can get access to a power strip. Upon removing the plug from the box, I noticed the plug itself did not look anything like the usual "Christmas Light" plug with the end to end type connection but it was a longer than normal green "rectangle" which looked as if it had some sort of driver electronics in it. There were four wires coming out; a pair that went to the LEDs themselves and another thicker pair that went all the way to the other end where it terminated in a socket so you can plug another set into the first.

Anyway, I plugged the set in and looked closely and noticed there was no 60hz flicker at all so it may have a full wave rectifier. I removed one of the LEDs from the set and the rest stayed on so I looked at the contacts in the socket to see how the set was wired. Sure enough, the LEDs in the GE set are wired in parallel. Besides the rectifier, I'm sure there is some voltage reduction in that special plug. Before re-packing the light set back into it's box, I checked the side and it said it was manufactured by "santa's best workshop ?" using the GE name under license. I forgot the website on the box though but I'll check it again.


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## greenlight (Oct 11, 2007)

Costco has multi colored strands in two 'bulb' sizes, and also flickering white snow dangling sets. They were 7.99, but I didn't buy any. I'm more interested in single color strands.

They also had a mini xmas house with a controller and a music sync'd display. I'm sure the controller could be hijaked and modded for your household lighing scheme..


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## kelmo (Oct 11, 2007)

It's not even Halloween yet!

Gimme a break...


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## Darell (Oct 11, 2007)

kelmo said:


> It's not even Halloween yet!
> 
> Gimme a break...



While I *totally* understand your sentiment... I know from experience that if you don't get on this NOW, that it can easily be too late in November and December. I'm not putting them up! I just want to buy them now so I don't miss out... _again_. It is never too early to buy LEDs, ya know? In a perfect world, I wouldn't even think about this stuff until December. It isn't a perfect world.

Thanks for all the input, guys. The Lowe's stuff sounds interesting. Seems that Costco only carries the multi-colored stuff year after year.


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## 700club (Oct 11, 2007)

Thanks for the tips guys, I stopped by Lowe's tonight and found an indoor Christmas tree 7 ft. tall with 504 LED lights for $300.


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## yuandrew (Oct 12, 2007)

Stopped by Target today on my way home from work. They have the Philips sets similar to the 2006 lineups but they added some new icicle type sets with "twinkling" LEDs every four or six sockets and I also found some sets near the bottom of the shelf with warm white LEDs (the box said "Soft White" on it) 

In a nearby aisle where they had things like timers and other decorating accessories, I found a couple packs of 5mm LEDs in white and blue for use as replacements in the Philips LED sets. They were only $1.19 for a pack of three LEDs and were on the shelf next to the usual replacement bulbs for most other Christmas light sets. When I get some more money in my wallet, I'm going to purchase a few packs of those so I'll have spares on hand.


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## 700club (Oct 12, 2007)

Here is a link to the website you were referring to in you earlier post _yuandrew.

http://www.santasbestcraft.com/index.htm
_


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## Darell (Oct 12, 2007)

Thanks 700. I'm somewhat surprised after watching the slide show to see all the 120VAC connections. Would seem far safer to convert to low voltage at the base, and pass that up and around the tree - or at least at each level.


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## PhotonWrangler (Oct 13, 2007)

I bought a package of the white G-E "C5" LED lights today at Loew's. It turns out the lights are the same pleasing warm white color as the ones in the "try me" display at the store, and after waving them around I detected NO flicker at all. There must be full-wave rectification and filtering going on inside that long plug. :thumbsup:

Now if they only offered a multicolor version of these they'd have a home run! I have a feeling that the reason for the single-color strings has to do with managing the different voltages required for different colors with the way that they're regulating the current.

My only complaint about the design (and it's a small one) is that the LEDs are set deep into the sockets, below the level of the lenses, which seems to reduce the off-axis brightness a bit.

I wonder if these are using the newer UV-based emitters and better phosphors. G-E has that Gelcore division that's dedicated to LED lighting research.


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## 700club (Oct 13, 2007)

Target has a huge selection of LED Christmas lights in my area. I looked a Home Depot, Lowe's, Walmart, and Target. Prices aren't half bad either.


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## PhotonWrangler (Oct 13, 2007)

The Targets in my area always set up a nice display of their lights, allowing you to see them lit up. I wish more stores would do this.


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## Darell (Oct 13, 2007)

PhotonWrangler said:


> I bought a package of the white G-E "C5" LED lights today at Loew's. It turns out the lights are the same pleasing warm white color as the ones in the "try me" display at the store, and after waving them around I detected NO flicker at all. There must be full-wave rectification and filtering going on inside that long plug. :thumbsup:.



Thanks for the report, Mr. Wrangler. Since I'm after the single-color units, this sounds like a winner. Different lengths available? Spacing? Sizes?


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## PhotonWrangler (Oct 14, 2007)

They only have one length available, 16.3 ' total string length, 4" spacing with 50 LEDs. I believe they have white, red, green and blue strings. I'll double check that next time I'm there.

**Edit** I just noticed the phrase "soft white" on the box. I wonder if this is the same LED that's used in the warm white LEDs at Target. The GE string is made in China by a company called LEDUP and distributed by Santa's Best.


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## CanadianGuy (Oct 14, 2007)

I'm looking at buying some "NOMA" LED lights from Canadian Tire. They are color changing with 8 modes or something. Steady on for each color, color changing, and smooth color changing or something.

I believe they are $75-80, and C7 sized plastic "bulbs" I think.

Can't wait to pick them up and put them on. Gonna put them on solid orange mode for Halloween!

Haven't bought something LED for a while.


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## yuandrew (Oct 14, 2007)

The Philips "Warm white" sets at Target say "Soft White" on the box and I only found the "mini-light" style ones in that color; none in C-6 or bare 5mm "dome" style. 

I bought these from Target earlier and already used all three white one as replacements for a few LEDs that have dimmed out on one of my older Philips sets.







*Note: They DO NOT have the "Lumileds" logo on them; I photoshopped that it in just for fun.


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## CanadianGuy (Oct 15, 2007)

Well, I have to correct myself. I ended up buying the NOMA lights, and they were a 9 function set with 30 lights (29 ft). They do the following:

Solid on for each color (blue, white, green, orange, red)
Alternating between two colors (blue red, green red, and i forget)
and then steady on mixed colors

I was excited, but after fiddling with the remote (!) for a few minutes, half the set stayed one color. I think it was a wire fault, but i was very dissapointed.

And lastly, the instructions said you could join up to 100 leds to one adaptor. The ends didn't even match, so I couldn't put two together!

Back they went! $85 each and they sucked!


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## Canuke (Oct 16, 2007)

There's a bunch of info on 2007 LED light string releases in here.


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## 700club (Oct 17, 2007)

Stopped by Sam's Club last night, they have an 7.5 ft. indoor Christmas Tree with 700 LED lights for $99.


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## Sigman (Oct 17, 2007)

Darell said:


> ...And I'd like some strings that actually last a season or two... no more "ForeverBright" that isn't!


You must have kept the "seconds" and sent me the "firsts"? It must be something you "Fornians" are doing wrong!!  

(Hey, turn the plug over & reinsert!)


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## Darell (Oct 17, 2007)

Sigman said:


> You must have kept the "seconds" and sent me the "firsts"? It must be something you "Fornians" are doing wrong!!


Glad to hear that yours are still working, Sig. After all these years, about half of my strings are dead. Some of them only half the string is dead - and I can't figure out how to breath life into the other half. :shrug: I give up.

Bought a bunch of Lowe's strings today. I have high hopes! I have to admit that the "seasonal area" in places like that does make me a bit ill. Just give me the LEDs, and nobody gets hurt.


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## Minjin (Oct 17, 2007)

I'd like to pick up some white LED Xmas lights this year to use as permanent lighting in a dark hallway but I'm starting to get the impression that they aren't made to last.


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## Darell (Oct 18, 2007)

Minjin said:


> I'd like to pick up some white LED Xmas lights this year to use as permanent lighting in a dark hallway but I'm starting to get the impression that they aren't made to last.


Sig and I are talking about some of the first generation strings. Many of the ones made today should last indefinitely.


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## LED-FX (Oct 18, 2007)

One of those reasons why you should call a lighting professional ;-)

http://www.mrchristmas.com/video.php?vid=av/Original-430.mov

Still have acouple of lengths of Foreverbright that use, its traditional, but being in 240V land they`re underrun on an autotransformer.

Dont know about Ikea US but UK have nice enough 50 LED RGB self colour changing with side emmitting LED and an intertsing moulded green leaf with white LED insert.

Gerorge Square Christmas lights in Glasgow are changing to LED this year , cutting power use by about 80%

Cheers
Adam


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## yuandrew (Oct 18, 2007)

> One of those reasons why you should call a lighting professional ;-)
> 
> http://www.mrchristmas.com/video.php...iginal-430.mov



I saw one of those controllers at Lowe's Hardware. Unfortunately, the one they had on display didn't work :shakehead


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## made in china (Oct 18, 2007)

ahem, repost I am sure, but none the less....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rmgf60CI_ks


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## Darell (Oct 18, 2007)

made in china said:


> ahem, repost I am sure, but none the less....
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rmgf60CI_ks



EVERY TIME I hear that music, I see that light show which was burned into my brain last year.


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## [email protected] (Nov 1, 2007)

I finally found LED christmaslights I like, they mimic the incan ones pretty good. :thumbsup: Even my wife liked the color... 





(The flashlight is a Fenix Lo-Ti with a nice white beam...)

The LEDs are 5mm inverted cone type ones, non user replacable normally, but they have a 2 year warranty.
I paid 8 Eu for a 50 LED string, not bad at all for here.  I'm going to pick up some more sets, my tree is going LED this year.


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## GaryF (Nov 2, 2007)

Last year we put up the multicolored led sets around our deck. I was happy to be saving a little energy, and to have a set where I probably wouldn’t have any problems for many years. The lights looked great. Then the squirrels attacked!

First it was a cut string, then a missing bulb. By Dec 26, they had chewed off close to half the bulbs, and we could see them carrying them around the yard. I found one laying in the street about a block away when I was out walking one day, but when I got it home I realized it was a little bit different size and style… so they chewed up somebody else’s lights as well.

This year I’m thinking about going for some kind of high voltage setup. :devil:


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## PhotonWrangler (Nov 2, 2007)

I stoppe dby Target tonight and noticed that they have a new version of the Philips LED sets that include strings that include some blinking LEDs. I watched the demo string of whjite LEDs for awhile and studied the twinking pattern. It appears that each blinking LED has it's own independent flasher circuit on board as they were blinking at ever-so-slightly different rates. It was a nice effect.

However the demo lights appear to be powered by a filtered DC supply as they were much brighter than the "real" strings they had on the trees. The demo lights showed no flicker but the strings on the trees flickered.

They also had a reindeer sculpture (also Philips) that was made with blue LEDs, and those exhibited NO flicker at all. It looked really pretty, especially from a short distance away. Those deep blue LEDs produce a pleasant blue halo effect that's so characteristic of almost-UV LEDs.


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## EricB (Nov 3, 2007)

It's next year that is to wait for! One of the familiar brands is coming out with a string of controllable RGB's; 30 lights for *under $50!* An OEM rep told me, and it was like kind of like hush-hush. I had found the OEM product online and called to ask about it, but it is not yet on the consumer market.

Also, since Philips is a major LED string maker, and I found they bought out Color Kinetics, I called and asked if Philips might make a consumer version of their similar RGB string, the iColorFlex. They said they are still acting as separate companies this year, since the takeover just occurred. So maybe next year or afterward they might do something like that.

The UK RGB string; by "self-changing", that means just the 7 color cycle, right?
They also have a bunch of strings, including RGB, on the China wholesale sites. (alibaba.com, etc). I don;t know where or how to actually find that stuff.

Meanwhile, an entire year later, and Triklits never came back. I did find out online more about exactly what the problem was. It was a fire hazard with a component overheating or something like that. I knew it couldn't be just because some hanging loop came loose or whatever that problem was.
I don't know why they even keep the site up. It is apprently history. Can't even find any on ebay.

LedEffects have added a new product called CoolDotz. They are similar to the DingDotz, but have colorcorrection, for when it gets old and colors start fading. That too ha a 10 light "demo Kit" for $100. If I can scrape up some money before it's too late; I want to get the controller for the DingDotz I got 2 years ago. (they have a preprogrammed CPU chip, that does all sorts of displays, but I want to make my own).


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## PhotonWrangler (Nov 3, 2007)

I stopped by a couple of stores today and looked at their holiday lights.

Target had something I've never seen before - replacement LEDs for some of their strings.

Sears has what looks like the 2005 version of ForeverBrights, rebadged as their own brand. They also had a 6-channel 120vac lamp controller w/built in holiday music, clearly inspired by "that" video from a couple of years ago. I even heard some of the same musical riffs from that "Wizards of Winter" song. It did not appear to be user-programmable, so you're stuck with the songs and patterns that come with the unit. Neat idea, although having only six channels seems rather limiting in terms of effects.


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## asdalton (Nov 3, 2007)

I've been using my 2003 Forever Brights every year with no problems yet.


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## LED-FX (Nov 4, 2007)

Lot of Chinese items of varying quality around,look for dim reds...
Leaf design Ikea light s are interesting in use of white LED hot glued into green moulding, green LEDs being that bit nmore fragile and certainly expensive.

Yup, RGB string is 60 RGB self changing, 7 colour, 5mm inverted cones.So starts at one colour and then they drift out of sync into random colours.

Led Effects, no relation,have just been bought over and the ex top man from Philps North American lighting installed, believe Fuzzy is also still involved, so could see some interesting stuff aimed at consumer level from there in future. Colour correction is very handy on very big arrays for things like video screens.

Cheers
Adam


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## The_LED_Museum (Nov 4, 2007)

PhotonWrangler said:


> ...I wonder if these are using the newer UV-based emitters and better phosphors...


The only way to tell with absolute, positive, 100% certainty is via spectroscopy.
If anybody wants to send me a set of these for this purpose, I'll happily perform spectroscopy on them to see what's up. :wave:


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## PhotonWrangler (Nov 4, 2007)

The_LED_Museum said:


> The only way to tell with absolute, positive, 100% certainty is via spectroscopy.
> If anybody wants to send me a set of these for this purpose, I'll happily perform spectroscopy on them to see what's up. :wave:



Already bought a set for you with that in mind! It will be included in the next shipment.


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## The_LED_Museum (Nov 4, 2007)

PhotonWrangler said:


> Already bought a set for you with that in mind! It will be included in the next shipment.


Thank you PW!!! :thanks:


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## EricB (Nov 5, 2007)

LED-FX said:


> Lot of Chinese items of varying quality around,look for dim reds...
> Leaf design Ikea light s are interesting in use of white LED hot glued into green moulding, green LEDs being that bit nmore fragile and certainly expensive.
> 
> Yup, RGB string is 60 RGB self changing, 7 colour, 5mm inverted cones.So starts at one colour and then they drift out of sync into random colours.
> ...



Thanks! 
1) Who is "Fuzzy"?
2) Yes, LEDeffects' DOTZ products are really for video screens. I just got the Demo Kit for my window because it was the only RGB out 2 years ago that did more than that 7 color thing (such as CarpenterDecorating's "Intellishines", which I had gotten a few bulbs the year before, BTW, last year, it seems these bulbs began dimming, and with the colors not being mixed right.)

The only string aimed directly at Christmas/decorative lighting was the Triklits, and again, those seem to be gone for good.

So I imagine the new owners of LEDeffects will eventially produce a consumer string from the Dotz as well. It looks like a lot of good stuff will be coming out in the coming years.

Also, LEDtronics has some very good looking incandescent colored strings. Not just the pale yellowed white look, but real 2700K color. LEDeffects had these in their showroom as long as 2 years ago. Last year, I began seeing the pale yellow "faceted strawberry" ones.


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## LED-FX (Nov 5, 2007)

EricB said:


> Thanks!
> 1) Who is "Fuzzy"?



From Led Effects old site:

http://ledeffects.jkserv.com/aboutus/fuzzy.htm

A genuine innovator who has been involved with LEDs since long before CK even existed, a gentleman who deserves some recognition.

Decent colour, not green cast or dog urine (tm ledmuseum)yellow,consistent and bright warm whites would be nice, at moment it appears to be pick 2 out of 3 charecteristics.

Cheers
Adam


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## Illum (Nov 5, 2007)

PhotonWrangler said:


> I bought a package of the white G-E "C5" LED lights today at Loew's. It turns out the lights are the same pleasing warm white color as the ones in the "try me" display at the store, and after waving them around I detected NO flicker at all. There must be full-wave rectification and filtering going on inside that long plug. :thumbsup:


 
probably a cap somewhere, in earlier models I recall seeing what appears to be the base of a light with no place for the lamp to fit in and wires going through it...is that the case with the newer CS led links also?


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## Cecilathan (Nov 6, 2007)

This seems like the right place to ask this, forgive me if it's not. I've looked all over for LED Christmas lights for some ambient lighting in my computer room. All I want is a few multicolored strings that have a few effects (pulsating, chasing, etc) and I've yet to find any. I can find chasing, but not multi colored, or multi colored, but only solid. Never both.

I've checked both locally and online and I think I'm just not checking the right places. Anyone have someplace for me to start?

Thanks.


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## theoldwizard (Nov 6, 2007)

I'm looking for feedback on Everstar LED Christmas Lights sold by Merchant Overstock on Amazon and eBay.

Good, bad, durable, etc ?


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## Canuke (Nov 7, 2007)

So far, the "Warm white" juggernaut seems to have already outnumbered the "cool white" offerings. I'm seeing them *everywhere*, even a store around Thousand Oaks (I *think* it's the Oaks Mall, not sure) is using them for exterior building lighting.

I find that most of the warm white LED's I've seen come closest to matching the look of 3500k CFL's rather than incandescents in color. As actual incan strings often run cooler than even 2700K for longevity, I expect that even 2700K LED's will still be a bit bluer.

Regarding color changers, I picked up a 4AA battery-powered string of 20 LED's ($10 @Target) that uses 5mm devices with the color-changing circuitry all inside the epoxy package. The thing that struck me about it is that the LED's are not fixed into the string at all -- they are simply bare diodes with their leads plugged into two holes in the socket!

Advantage: it's easy to swap diodes around or re-use them. Disadvantage: about 6 or 7 of them don't light up. The diodes are fine, it's the flimsy mounting.

The flickering cool-white LED's at Target uses diodes with similar-looking guts to the color-changers, so I surmise that the switching mechanism is also entirely inside the diode, like the similarly-styled incandescents.

So far, the GE lights I found at Lowes have the best look to them; they are rectified, and may have some filtration too; there is no flicker at all unless you look for them. My main disappointment with these is that the rectifier in the plug is tiny; it runs palpably hot in its plastic housing even when there are no other loads added to the string! (That might just be a ballast resistor in there; I'll have to crack it open to see). That is as opposed to the rectifier "pods" on last year's Home Depot strings, which could handle 25 foot of one-LED-per-inch ropelight in addition to its own 50 LED's -- and then it only gets warm! (That being said, that plastic pod is no heatsink, so one amp is the most I'll push through it).


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## PhotonWrangler (Nov 7, 2007)

Canuke said:


> My main disappointment with these is that the rectifier in the plug is tiny; it runs palpably hot in its plastic housing even when there are no other loads added to the string! (That might just be a ballast resistor in there; I'll have to crack it open to see).



Hmm, does anyone have access to an x-ray machine? :thinking:


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## jtr1962 (Nov 8, 2007)

Canuke said:


> I find that most of the warm white LED's I've seen come closest to matching the look of 3500k CFL's rather than incandescents in color. As actual incan strings often run cooler than even 2700K for longevity, I expect that even 2700K LED's will still be a bit bluer.


Amber LEDs probably come closest to matching the look of incandescent christmas lights if that's what one wants to duplicate (yes, a lot of incandescent Christmas lights really are _that_ bad). I personally wish they would aim for something pure white (neither blue nor yellow tint). That to me looks best, especially outdoors reflecting off snow. Yellow-tinted lights plus snow looks to me like urine on the snow. Strongly blue tinted ones just lack presence. Pure white (probably 4500K to 5000K) looks best, but those seem to be as rare as hen's teeth.

Yeah, you're right that most of the warm-whites are closest to 3500K. I think this is driven by both market preference and ease of manufacture. I've heard a lot of people say that "white" incandescent Christmas lights are not really white, but closer to the sodium-vapor yellow which most people can't stand on account of being severely underdriven for longer life. 3500K resembles the whitest incandescents, but not so blue that it makes people think of fluorescent. Even in the CFL market, 3500K seems to be catching on big time now that people realize these things can be made in different shades of white. My guess is 3500K will be the "new warm white" in the LED market as fewer will want that very yellow 2700K look. From a purely manufacturing standpoint 3500K are going to be brighter than 2700K if using the same blue chip, and everyone wants their lights to be brighter. I still find too many warm whites have either a green or a pink tint to them. The Cree P4 warm white XR-E which I tested actually had more of a blackbody look to it, but most of the warm white 5mm's don't. As a model railroader, I'd actually be seriously interested in warm whites which duplicate the look of typical 2850K to 3000K general lighting incandescents.

Any thoughts on the aesthetics of mixing different shades of white in a string? Since LED tints vary a lot anyway, it might make things more interesting to do that. Kind of like different color stars.


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## TorchBoy (Nov 8, 2007)

Darell said:


> EVERY TIME I hear that music, I see that light show which was burned into my brain last year.


Is this the one?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=szLmAPW39uE&NR=1
Probably not, since that was 2005.

Do these neighbourhoods have a problem with people blasting the music from their car radios?


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## EricB (Nov 8, 2007)

> So far, the "Warm white" juggernaut seems to have already outnumbered the "cool white" offerings. I'm seeing them *everywhere*, even a store around Thousand Oaks (I *think* it's the Oaks Mall, not sure) is using them for exterior building lighting.
> 
> I find that most of the warm white LED's I've seen come closest to matching the look of 3500k CFL's rather than incandescents in color. As actual incan strings often run cooler than even 2700K for longevity, I expect that even 2700K LED's will still be a bit bluer.





> Amber LEDs probably come closest to matching the look of incandescent christmas lights if that's what one wants to duplicate (yes, a lot of incandescent Christmas lights really are that bad).



These look good, and even say they are 2*3*00K! http://www.ledtronics.com/ds/LEDSTRING15/Default.asp I also saw ones at LEDEffects' showroom, and the color looked EXACTLY like a typical incandescent! They also had the higher colors (3000's, and I think 4000's, etc)

It's Foreverbright, and the imitations ("strawberry shape") that use that pale slightly yellowed white. St. Patrick's Cathedral had a few of these on their exterior decorations last year. 



> I personally wish they would aim for something pure white (neither blue nor yellow tint). That to me looks best, especially outdoors reflecting off snow. Pure white (probably 4500K to 5000K) looks best, but those seem to be as rare as hen's teeth.


 You mean like the ones used in "Walk" signs at crosswalks in many places? Those seem less blue then others, and they are 8-10mm LED's, and pretty bright. Why they are not used elsewhere, I do not know.


> Yellow-tinted lights plus snow looks to me like urine on the snow.


 Incandescent white goes nice when mixed with red in decorations. Otherwise, it just looks so out of place and antiquated on exterior decorations.


> Strongly blue tinted ones just lack presence.


 They can go nice with the "winter, icy" atmosphere. As I have mentioned before; the first white Foreverbrights I had gotten, when seen from inside behind the venetian blinds at night, makes it look a like a cool snowy daylight. (Can keep some people up, though). The following year, they came out with the frosted C7's, and these were a more pure white, and didn't have that effect as much. (They were also dimmer).



> Yeah, you're right that most of the warm-whites are closest to 3500K. I think this is driven by both market preference and ease of manufacture. I've heard a lot of people say that "white" incandescent Christmas lights are not really white, but closer to the sodium-vapor yellow which most people can't stand on account of being severely underdriven for longer life. 3500K resembles the whitest incandescents, but not so blue that it makes people think of fluorescent. Even in the CFL market, 3500K seems to be catching on big time now that people realize these things can be made in different shades of white. My guess is 3500K will be the "new warm white" in the LED market as fewer will want that very yellow 2700K look.


 Funny; wan't the 3500 range the *original* "warm white" CFL color, and hence why it had to be distinguished from SOFT white in the first place? ("Soft" was the word always used on the incandescents). If anyone remembers, the first CFL's that tried to imitate incandescent were the "Earth Lights" (which were in those tubular ribbed frosted plastic envelopes). Those were roughly the same "yellowed white" as the Foreverbright "incandescents" you all are talking about. Then, they improved it to the present 2700K (matching incandescent), but kept the name "warm white". The 3500's have now taken on the name "daylight" by at least one brand. I think they should restore the original names.



> Any thoughts on the aesthetics of mixing different shades of white in a string? Since LED tints vary a lot anyway, it might make things more interesting to do that. Kind of like different color stars.


 Look at this:
http://www.colorkinetics.com/ls/intelliwhite/intelliwhite.html
Interesting idea.


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## 2xTrinity (Nov 15, 2007)

> Funny; wan't the 3500 range the *original* "warm white" CFL color, and hence why it had to be distinguished from SOFT white in the first place? ("Soft" was the word always used on the incandescents). If anyone remembers, the first CFL's that tried to imitate incandescent were the "Earth Lights" (which were in those tubular ribbed frosted plastic envelopes). Those were roughly the same "yellowed white" as the Foreverbright "incandescents" you all are talking about. Then, they improved it to the present 2700K (matching incandescent), but kept the name "warm white". The 3500's have now taken on the name "daylight" by at least one brand. I think they should restore the original names.


I think the names they have now work quite well. 

2700-3000k: soft white
3500k: bright white
5000k: daylight

Sylvania used to refer to the 3500k varierty as daylight, though their lastest batch of new CFLs now features 5000k as daylight (makes more sense) and 3500k as bright white. Sylvania also uses 3000k, rather than 2700k, for their soft white -- which I believe is slightly better.


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## EricB (Nov 15, 2007)

So they're using "soft white" again now? It seems everyone still refers to it as "warm white". I'll have to look when I do my LED Christmas light browsing at Home Depot, Lowes and Target. 
It's good that they have changed daylight back to the 5000+ range. Calling 3500K "daylight" I think we all agreed was a bit misleading. 

Also, some news now; if anyone remembers; I had found Shenzhen (China) OEM RGB LED products on alibaba.com, and didn't know how to get them, or who sold them in the US. Well, now; I have finally found a stateside VAR! 
WIEDAMARK: (www.wiedamark.com)
They now have just started carrying these Shenzhen Viss RGB strings:

http://www.wiedamark.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=2857
http://www.wiedamark.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=2860

They are very similar to the iColor Flex "dome" lens. These of course are not commercial "Christmas" lights, but like DingDotz and iColorFlex are graphic display pixels, but can of course be used for small decorative displays. So I'm now waiting for a price quote, and hopefully it will be cheaper than the other companies' products.


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## Dantor (Nov 18, 2007)

Every year the lights get better and better, and they start going up next weekend! I hope you people post some pictures and share the light


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## AndyTiedye (Nov 18, 2007)

PhotonWrangler said:


> The "try me" power source is often a battery pack



The "Try Me" on the ones I have bought was a couple of batteries and a small boost converter 

I haven't tried doing anything else with the boost converter yet.


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## asdalton (Nov 19, 2007)

Canuke said:


> So far, the GE lights I found at Lowes have the best look to them; they are rectified, and may have some filtration too; there is no flicker at all unless you look for them. My main disappointment with these is that the rectifier in the plug is tiny; it runs palpably hot in its plastic housing even when there are no other loads added to the string!



I got a string of GE warm white LEDs at Lowe's yesterday. The tint is very nice, appearing neutral on a white wall next to the hot incan beam of my E2E. So 3500 K color temperature is a good estimate.

I also got a string of GE C7 size multi-color LEDs. These appear to have similar brightness to my 2003 Brookstone lights (re-branded Forever Brights, I think), except that the yellow and red LEDs on the GE string are a bit brighter.

The plugs on mine do get slightly warm, but nothing alarming.


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## made in china (Nov 20, 2007)

asdalton said:


> I got a string of GE warm white LEDs at Lowe's yesterday. The tint is very nice, appearing neutral on a white wall next to the hot incan beam of my E2E. So 3500 K color temperature is a good estimate.
> 
> I also got a string of GE C7 size multi-color LEDs. These appear to have similar brightness to my 2003 Brookstone lights (re-branded Forever Brights, I think), except that the yellow and red LEDs on the GE string are a bit brighter.
> 
> The plugs on mine do get slightly warm, but nothing alarming.



Any flicker? And how much at Lowe's?


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## asdalton (Nov 20, 2007)

No flicker.

They were $9.97 for each string of 26 bulbs.


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## ks_physicist (Nov 24, 2007)

I picked up a set (~$7 US) of 60 white at Wal-Mart, under the house brand. There are at least four big fat heat-shrunk cylinders that I presume are resistors, so perhaps this string is seperated into four (haven't fully unwrapped it).

I did just use one of the two provided spares to replace the incan bulb in my doorbell button. The doorbell is on a 19.5v AC circuit, so I used a 1 kohm resistor tucked into the body of the doorbell switch housing.

That should under-drive it a bit, and so far it looks like it does the job well. It is of course noticeably whiter than the front door button, which still has the incan bulb.


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## The_LED_Museum (Nov 24, 2007)

You should check that resistor for heat if it's just a garden-variety 0.25 or 0.50 watt version.
19.2 volts is quite a bit; the resistor will be dissipating significant power - more than you might think.
A 1Kohm 1 watt resistor (or two 2Kohm 0.50 watt resistors in parallel) will keep your doorbell happy & safe.


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## ks_physicist (Nov 24, 2007)

The_LED_Museum said:


> You should check that resistor for heat if it's just a garden-variety 0.25 or 0.50 watt version.
> 19.2 volts is quite a bit; the resistor will be dissipating significant power - more than you might think.
> A 1Kohm 1 watt resistor (or two 2Kohm 0.50 watt resistors in parallel) will keep your doorbell happy & safe.



I calculated for a 2.1 volt LED, which is probably low for a white (though I haven't checked...I estimated, thinking the 60-LED string was directly powered by 120 volts, which would lead to about 2 volts per bulb. Now I see they're on a few separate strands, so it's probably higher...). 

Basic LED formula: (Vsup - Vfor)/Iled = Rled

(19.5 V - 2.1 V) / 0.02 A = 870 Ω

Since I'm using a 1000 Ω resistor, the current should be 

(19.5 V - 2.1 V) / 1000 Ω = 0.0174 A

If the forward voltage is higher than 2.1 volts, the current will be less than that calculated above, so this is a "worst case" scenario.

In a dead short condition, the resistor would have 19.5 volts applied across it, leading to a current of 

I = V/R = (19.5 V / 1000 Ω) = 0.0195 A

and a power dissipation of 

P = IV = (19.5 V * 0.0195 A) = 0.381 W

Since the resistor is free-standing, though in an enclosed switch housing, I am comfortable with the ≈ 0.4 W maximum dead-short power dissipation for an 0.5 W resistor. 

Under normal operating conditions, the voltage drop over the resistor is going to be 

(19.5 V - 2.1 V) = 17.4 V,

so the normal dissipation at that resistor should be 

(17.4 V * 0.0174 A) = 0.301 W, 

well below the 0.5 watt rating of the resistor.


(ETA: The website editor won't allow leading spaces? That's terrible for writing out math. Tsk tsk.)
(ETA 2: All of the above was calculated for a DC 19.5v source, which this is not. The circuit is running at half duty cycle due to the AC supply, so the margin of safety is considerably greater.)


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## ks_physicist (Nov 25, 2007)

Dang. Went to buy more LED strings and Wal-Mart is /out/. They don't even have the shelf space there for white and colored LED strings, only the more fancy ones (with stars or fake "bulbs" over the LEDs).

I did see some festive mini LED strings, 10 LEDs for about $3.40. Pretty bright...


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## PhotonWrangler (Nov 25, 2007)

If you have a Walgreens in your area, they've got LED strings on sale.


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## laserblue (Nov 26, 2007)

Nide LED christmas lights hehehe. a bit expensive but cool and very safe too.


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## The_LED_Museum (Nov 26, 2007)

ks_physicist said:


> I calculated for a 2.1 volt LED, which is probably low for a white (though I haven't checked...I estimated, thinking the 60-LED string was directly powered by 120 volts, which would lead to about 2 volts per bulb. Now I see they're on a few separate strands, so it's probably higher...).


I used the online LED/resistor calculator at http://led.linear1.org/1led.wiz to come up with that 1 watt value.
I input the parameters as follows:

Source voltage: 19.2
LED voltage: 3.6
LED current: 20mA

And it produced the following:
"*The wizard recommends a 1W or greater 820 ohm resistor. The color code for 820 ohms is grey red brown.*"


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## EricB (Dec 1, 2007)

Went to Target today, and saw the selection of Philips. They had that nice new C9 with the large facets in the display, but I didn't see any on the shelf.
They had the "warm white" mini ice shape, and cool white "dome light" (bare LED's) in the display. On the shelf, you could not tell which hue the "whites" were. It doesn't say on the box.

I was considering getting some new strings for the window instead of the frosted C7's, because those bulbs are heavier, of course, and it can be hard to get them to stay up in the window. They're really made more for trees. Plus, the forsted whites were not as bright as other whites, but the new ones are bright. Also, to try out the new soft white.

Next, it's Lowes. Anyone been there yet? They usually had the jump on the latest LED lights. But last year, when I went, the shelves were empty, rather early!


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## PhotonWrangler (Dec 1, 2007)

EricB said:


> Next, it's Lowes. Anyone been there yet? They usually had the jump on the latest LED lights. But last year, when I went, the shelves were empty, rather early!



Lowes has a new line of GE LEDs including a pleasing warm white (reviewed on The LED Museum recently) as well as colored versions. The white strings that I bought there had NO flicker at all. I'm assuming the colored ones are of the same construction. At $9.95 a set I'm sure you'll like them!


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## 65535 (Dec 2, 2007)

Just browsed through this thread, those GE things for home light shows imo are BS, they do S****y light shows that detract from the people that take their time to make their own lights.

Aside from that I have always used 3v incandescent bulb strings, they work great for me.


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## KROMATICS (Dec 2, 2007)

PhotonWrangler said:


> Lowes has a new line of GE LEDs including a pleasing warm white (reviewed on The LED Museum recently) as well as colored versions. The white strings that I bought there had NO flicker at all. I'm assuming the colored ones are of the same construction. At $9.95 a set I'm sure you'll like them!



Is there another source for these warm white GE LEDs other than Lowes? They are long gone at all the locations I've been to.


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## PhotonWrangler (Dec 2, 2007)

I've only seen them at Lowe's so far, but I'll keep an eye out for other locations. I believe you can buy them on their website though.


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## adirondackdestroyer (Dec 2, 2007)

I bought some no name White LED mini lights from Rite Aid since my local Walgreens didn't have anything. They were $7.99 for 60 bulbs which is 16.5 feet long. 
I think I'm going to take them back tomorrow because these things are way too bright (I didn't think I would ever say that. LOL). They are also a bit too blue for my liking. They have a multicolored one that should be much less intense, and I'm going to return these for them.


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## PhotonWrangler (Dec 2, 2007)

The GE-branded strings at Lowe's state on the package that they're made in China for LEDUP Enterprises. It's possible that they're sourcing them for other brand names also. They also announced an interesting looking C9 replacement lamp that will be ready for the 2008 holiday season. From the looks of the C9 lens on the website, I wonder if this is an offshoot of the Intellashine product (which I really like also).


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## The_LED_Museum (Dec 2, 2007)

I just checked mine again, and as I thought they did last time I checked, they *DO* flicker like most other LED Christmas lights do.
These are the GE "Soft White" lights that PW sent not too long ago.


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## The_LED_Museum (Dec 2, 2007)

PhotonWrangler said:


> ...LEDUP Enterprises. It's possible that they're sourcing them for other brand names also. They also announced an interesting looking C9 replacement lamp that will be ready for the 2008 holiday season. From the looks of the C9 lens on the website, I wonder if this is an offshoot of the Intellashine product (which I really like also).


I see that these lamps screw directly into 120 volts AC sockets; the Intellashine bulbs operate from 12 volts DC.


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## PhotonWrangler (Dec 2, 2007)

The_LED_Museum said:


> I see that these lamps screw directly into 120 volts AC sockets; the Intellashine bulbs operate from 12 volts DC.



Excellent point, Craig. Not that anyone would be dumb enough to screw an Intellashine bulb into a 120v socket...


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## The_LED_Museum (Dec 2, 2007)

Well, not anybody who reads my evaluation of them on my website anyway...on that page, I have the following:

****VERY IMPORTANT!!!**** DO NOT under any circumstances screw these bulbs into a standard 110-120 volts AC string of C7 1/2 lamps. They *WILL* fail at once, and possibly quite spectacularly so, if this is done. :green:




:green: You don't want rats or flies...I mean...you don't want *an unwanted fire.*


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## PhotonWrangler (Dec 2, 2007)

The_LED_Museum said:


> Well, not anybody who reads my evaluation of them on my website anyway...on that page, I have the following:
> 
> ****VERY IMPORTANT!!!**** DO NOT under any circumstances screw these bulbs into a standard 110-120 volts AC string of C7 1/2 lamps. They *WILL* fail at once, and possibly quite spectacularly so, if this is done. :green:
> 
> ...



Yup, spectacular... that pretty much described it, Craig! It made some interesting colors. Briefly.  :laughing:


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## asdalton (Dec 2, 2007)

KROMATICS said:


> Is there another source for these warm white GE LEDs other than Lowes? They are long gone at all the locations I've been to.



I haven't seen them in other places. Even the Lowe's where I got mine (Sunnyvale, CA) was out of stock yesterday and had no LED strings left except solid green.

Brookstone is selling various shapes of warm white online. Link goes to one type. I don't think that these are the GE brand. Back in 2003, I bought some colored flame-tip LED strings that were supposedly the same as the Forever Bright lights being sold elsewhere at that time.


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## PhotonWrangler (Dec 2, 2007)

Gads. Brookstone's price is twice that of Lowe's! I've always thought of them as the overpriced-yuppie-gadgets-store, but geez.


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## made in china (Dec 3, 2007)

Our local Ace Hardware has the C7 and C9 LED 120v incandescent replacement lamps. Anyone tried these yet?


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## EricB (Dec 3, 2007)

PhotonWrangler said:


> The GE-branded strings at Lowe's state on the package that they're made in China for LEDUP Enterprises. It's possible that they're sourcing them for other brand names also. They also announced an interesting looking C9 replacement lamp that will be ready for the 2008 holiday season. From the looks of the C9 lens on the website, I wonder if this is an offshoot of the Intellashine product (which I really like also).


Those look just like the Philips they had in the display, but not on the shelves.
(They wouldn't put someting on diosplay that was not going to come out till the next year, would they?) I didn't check to see whether it was a screw-in.

When you say "offshoot", you don't mean an actual connection do you? These actually do not look like the Intellishines. The "faceting" pattern on the Intellishines is more "square", with straight vertical and horizontal lines, rather than that rhombic pattern with the geodesic lines. So these are completely different bulbs. Intellishine was supposed to come out with 120v bulbs, but I'm not sure where they are with that.


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## KROMATICS (Dec 3, 2007)

PhotonWrangler said:


> I've only seen them at Lowe's so far, but I'll keep an eye out for other locations. I believe you can buy them on their website though.



Unfortunately they only have the color versions on their website. Perhaps I will post a WTB in the marketplace.


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## ledrange (Dec 11, 2007)

The GE sets use a split rectifier and a 1W resistor in each part of the plug and end connector. The plug and end connector get warm due to the heating effect of the resistor.

The GE sets are unfiltered. Also, while wired in parallel, they will go out if the right two bulbs are loose or removed, just remove the first two bulbs and the circuit will go out, or remove every 5th bulb and either one on either side of it, and it will go out.

Also, when a bulb is loose, or removed, the power to the remaining LEDs increases, causing them to go out quicker.

How do I know, I took the plug and end connector apart, and started removing some bulbs to see how the "constanton" worked. LEDUP has the patent for this parallel wiring configuration, and made the sets for them.


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## ledrange (Dec 11, 2007)

The 2006 Home Depot LED sets rectified the LEDs, but, it also rectified the end connector (so the output was DC), which it shouldn't have, also the rectifier is not good for the fuse rating in the set, so becarefull. For 2007, there is no rectification, as it would have required extra wires for the end connector so that it would have AC power and not be through the rectifier.

The PHILIPS twinkling LED sets has DC rectification, and filtration to allow the IC's in the twinkling LEDs to work, and has AC output to the end connector. So if you want to get rid of the flicker, buy the PHILIPS twinkling sets.


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## Darell (Dec 11, 2007)

ledrange said:


> The GE sets use a split rectifier and a 1W resistor in each part of the plug and end connector. The plug and end connector get warm due to the heating effect of the resistor.


Thanks for all the great info! Here's my contribution to the cause.








I was having issues. Turns out to be a continuity issue from the tines to the circuit. Fuse was fine, but something wasn't cutting the mustard. Took it all apart, and used contact grease. Works way better. I think I voided my warranty though.


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## LukeA (Dec 11, 2007)

I don't know if anyone cares, but a light coat of rustoleum 'frosted glass' spray will diffuse 5mm lights very nicely, and warms the CCT nicely (warmer with a heavier coat).


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## PhotonWrangler (Dec 11, 2007)

Thanks for the great info and pics, guys! It's nice to know exactly what's inside that elongated plug. So it looks like the 1/2w 560 ohm resistors are in series with each of their respective legs and the 1w 1000 ohm resistor is in series with the whole kaboodle, yes?

Yeah Darell, I'd say your warranty is toast on that one!  Thanks for posting the fix though. I'll use it if necessary.


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## CM (Dec 11, 2007)

Darell said:


> Thanks for all the great info! Here's my contribution to the cause.
> 
> I was having issues. Turns out to be a continuity issue from the tines to the circuit. Fuse was fine, but something wasn't cutting the mustard. Took it all apart, and used contact grease. Works way better. I think I voided my warranty though.



Nice picture. It appears that they are wasting a lot of power in the resistors if they are in line with each of the legs of the plug. Could have used the wasted power to put more lights on the string. I need to run down to Target and pick up some Philips soft white lights. Sounds like they are finally doing this right.


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## Darell (Dec 11, 2007)

PhotonWrangler said:


> Yeah Darell, I'd say your warranty is toast on that one!  Thanks for posting the fix though. I'll use it if necessary.



Well, I had several other options:

1. Return it to Lowe's and get no exchange since they are sold out.
2. Leave a giant gap in my light coverage
3. Buy another brand of lights that wouldn't match tint/spacing/brightness/length.
4. Send it back to the mfg who promises to quickly replace it in 6-8 weeks.

So after considering those possibilities, opening it up wasn't such a big deal.


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## asdalton (Dec 12, 2007)

PhotonWrangler said:


> Gads. Brookstone's price is twice that of Lowe's! I've always thought of them as the overpriced-yuppie-gadgets-store, but geez.



Brookstone's website is now offering the 70-LED strings for half price: $9.99.

:rock:


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## tim003 (Dec 12, 2007)

I want to see some picture of your Chrismas LED lights, please post some picture. Thank you.


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## EricB (Dec 13, 2007)

Just ran across this one yesterday:
http://www.cosmo-lighting.co.uk/shop/catalog/browse?shop_param=

Actually; I had seen the trees in a deli near Rockefeller Center back when I first went there for this season. When you're by the tree, and you look north to the end of the plaza, you see all these LED's in a wondow, and when I went to look at them, there were the little trees with the ribbons, and the multicolor LED's. The lower products are _color changing_ ones as well. In the window; I saw what looked like pale cyan LED's on one of the trees, and you could see that there were actually the three primary color dies lit. It was steady at that color, and the deli was closed so I couln't ask about them. Instead, I am in Manhattan Mall, and I see a store with all these LED decorations inside, and I go in, and it is the same trees! They also have the strings by themselves! (very thin. Those might be more of those Shenzhen strings I used to see on alibaba.com! The picture looks just like it).

There is a control knob that allows it to do 8 different paterns. $30 for a string of 144 color changing (the string used on the smaller tree), and $60 for 264 (used on a larger tree). The tres themselves are $hundreds! The single color lights, including the ribbon encased ones, are less.

I was tempted to try to get it, but I don't know. The colors are poor (that dull cyan is apparently supposed to be "white"). Nothing like the DingDotz! The 8 patterns don't look like much, some chases and I think different color combinations, but it's hard to tell. The colors seem to be mostly blues and greens. The red is in there, but you don't see it much by itself, and you don't seem to see any yellows or true white either. I would be more interested if I could hack into it and, make my own colors and patterns. To me, it looks like is is really worth $10 or less (or whatever an incandescent string of those sizes costs), but I know it is the first consumer rgb string. When the others start coming out (hopefully, next year, still) and become established, that one will be the "cheap discount store" kind!


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## Darell (Dec 13, 2007)

tim003 said:


> I want to see some picture of your Chrismas LED lights, please post some picture. Thank you.



Been meaning to do that. I'll get them eventually. Nothing to write home about! I just put one string of white up on the first story roofline. Still, they look pretty classy. They make good landing lights for santa.


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## EricB (Dec 13, 2007)

Went out today and saw _another_ rgb! It was a prelit tree, incandescent based fiber optic with 7-color changing LED plastic flower lights, and a six pointed star on top with the color changing LED's in the points. The flower lights looked just like this: http://enochtech.trustpass.alibaba.com/product/11308118/Color_Changing_LED_Flower.html

It might actually be this manufacturer, but nobody seemed to know for sure. 
I saw it in a salon in Grand Central Terminal, and asked where they got it from. They gave me, basically, just an intersection in Queens. I did some searching, and found out about a chain store called Michael's located near there, who had Christmas stuff. I didn't see this tree on their site http://www.michaels.com/art/online/home, so I called that store, and sure enough, that's where it came from! I asked them who the manufacturer was, and they told me "Jimmy". Can't find anything on that as a Christmas tree manufacturer. 
Most of the lights used the standard "pure" 525 as the primary green, but a few of them used the 565 yellow green! (actually, the first rgb's using yellow green I have ever seen. I knew they they existed (Ledtronics has had them for sale as long as rgb's have been out). One color I saw some of them making was a very good imitation 2700 incandescent. I don't know if that was simply the "white" of the ones with the yellow green, or it was a specially mixed color.

What's of special interest, is that this tree has some sort of remote controller. I didn't want to bug the sales person so much on the phone, which is why I was trying to find out the manufacturer; so I could see what patterns and stuff can be done on that one. So I'll have to go over there when I get a chance. (Today and yesterday were my days off, so it will have to be next week).

Or maybe someone else has a Michael's and can look out for this.


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## PhotonWrangler (Dec 13, 2007)

There's a Michael's just down the street from me. I saw a pre-lit tree with LEDs built into what looked like white ping pong balls, and they're RGB and change colors. It comes with a controller that plays music and synchronizes the LEDs to the music. I couldn't tell if there was a remote control for it.

There's a nearly identical setup being sold at Lowe's. At $300 it's a little pricey though.


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## EricB (Dec 14, 2007)

Yeah, I think someone I spoke to did say something about the tree playing music or something.

I didn't see anything like that at Lowe's. IIRC, all the prelit trees at the Lowe's I go to have been incandescent. The only LED's there are the GE strings.


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## Darell (Dec 14, 2007)

OK, I'm not going to win any prizes for my night photography, nor for my creative use of Christmas lights on the house. But I promised pictures, so here they are. These are the "white" strings from Lowes (one string of which I had to dissect and repair.


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## EricB (Dec 14, 2007)

[double post. Didn't appear to go through the first time-drop in wireless reception]


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## Canuke (Dec 16, 2007)

ledrange said:


> The 2006 Home Depot LED sets rectified the LEDs, but, it also rectified the end connector (so the output was DC), which it shouldn't have, also the rectifier is not good for the fuse rating in the set, so becarefull.



I got a bunch of these last year; they were not only much less flickery, but were also amongst the cheapest per LED.

The fuse rating is 3A, but after some experimentation I determined that the rectifier pod got decently warm at about 1A; considering it's not heatsinked in the slightest, that's as far as I'd push it. Nonetheless, even at 1A, you can use the rectified output at the end to drive as many as 300 non-rectified lights, and they all get the benefit of the rectifier (though you might have to rewire some of them to put them all in phase). I combined a Home Depot "pointy" multicolor 70 position string with the Costco 100 position version (available now) to get 170+ on one rectifier.

Darell, thanks for slicing your GE's open. That does indeed look like a wasteful design :thumbsdow I mean, 1 Kohm? I wonder if the GE strings might lend themselves to battery power conversions more than the long-series strings do.


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## ckthorp (Dec 17, 2007)

For my Christmas tree this year, I lit with Philips LED lights from Target. The flickering was awful.

My fix was to power the lights off of high-voltage DC generated with a bridge rectifier and 100uF cap. The 60 light 30S2P (30 series, 2 of those in parallel) string can be converted to a 60S1P string by rewiring them it the middle of the string. The sockets adjoining the "2 wire" portion in the middle can be disconnected from the main voltage rails and connected together with a short piece of wire. The "end-to-end" functionality can then be preserved by connecting the cut wires (in such a fashion that they "bypass" the disconnected socket). In total, there are 4 solder joints per string and about 4 inches of wire. If these connections don't make sense, you might want to avoid this project...

In this configuration, running on ~169VDC, as measured with a Fluke true RMS meter, the string draws a reasonable 20mA. I've got 10 strings running on one rectifier and it stays cool. Just make sure the cap has enough average current rating to support the number of lights you wish to attach (Try Panasonic EE series electrolytics). Just make sure not to plug anything else into the string... If you use an incandescent topper, you can usually rewire it with higher voltage bulbs so that it will tolerate the 169VDC without a near-instaflash.


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## KROMATICS (Dec 17, 2007)

The warm white LEDs from Brookstone are awful. A sickly yellow and lots of flicker. They are *not* the same OEM as the GE ones sold at Lowes.


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## Entropy (Dec 20, 2007)

It's been a long while since I've been here at CPF.

I recently bought:
3 strands of Philips "C6" style blue from Target, 60 LEDs each. They are (as far as I can tell) wired in two strings of 30. Two wires come from the plug, a third one comes from the first light and lasts until the middle of the string. Based on this, as far as I can tell it is either half-wave rectified or full-wave without any filtering. The flicker is only noticeable if the lights are moving. If they are stationary I can't see it. I don't know whether it's fullwave unflitered or halfwave unfiltered. If you take a light in your hand and wave it back and forth, it's obviously unflitered.

3 strands of Philips "G12" style red, 60 each. Same comments as the blues. Not as bright as the blues, but when I returned for more strands after testing the blues, Target was out of blues in any style except "dome" which is basically barebulb standard LED. (Not even the concave side emitter style, it's a convex round encapsulation just like a normal 5mm LED.)

All Philips strands were $11.99, and had a 30% discount starting before December 18 and continuing at least through December 20.

4 strands of GE "C7" style green from Lowes, 26 LEDs each. Three wires come from the plug, a fourth wire is added at the first bulb. These are as far as I can tell filtered in addition to fullwave rectified - If you wave a bulb back and forth in your hand there is some brightness variation but it is very little. $9.99/strand, 50% discount on all holiday products at Lowes on December 20.

In short, the GE strands are better but significantly more expensive per LED without discounts, and still slightly more expensive with the discounts offered on December 20 by the strands' respective retailers.

Compared to previous revisions of the Philips strands I've used (and other LED strands obtained at WalMart or Target in previous years), the current generation Philips LEDs are a significant improvement and are the first acceptable LED strands I've used. The GE strands are even better, but quite pricey.

Does anyone know about the "commercial grade" system using an external power adapter sold by places like christmaslightsetc.com? Is the power adapter filtered fullwave, or just rectified but unfiltered fullwave? Next year I'm thinking of constructing a dimmer system for a basic computer controlled light show, and due to the nature of how LED strands consume power from the AC line, a normal AC dimmer won't work well, but PWM of high voltage DC-powered lights might work quite well.


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## Minjin (Dec 25, 2007)

adirondackdestroyer said:


> I bought some no name White LED mini lights from Rite Aid since my local Walgreens didn't have anything. They were $7.99 for 60 bulbs which is 16.5 feet long.
> I think I'm going to take them back tomorrow because these things are way too bright (I didn't think I would ever say that. LOL). They are also a bit too blue for my liking. They have a multicolored one that should be much less intense, and I'm going to return these for them.


I picked up a set from RiteAid yesterday. It was the 30 white LED set, originally $10, now $5. I'm pretty happy with how bright they are. They do seem to flicker and I haven't had time to take a close look at them. I'll see about getting some power measurements if anyone is interested. I plan on using these 24x7 to light a dark hallway. We'll see if they last.


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