# Sunwayman V11R (XM-L, 1xR/CR123A, 1xAA/14500) Review: RUNTIMES, VIDEO, BEAMSHOT+



## selfbuilt

*Warning: pic heavy, as usual. *











The 1xCR123A/RCR-based V11R is the new version of the V10R from Sunwayman. Although I haven't tested the older V10R, I did review the 1xAA-version, the V10A – which shares the same head. 

For this review, I have also picked up the Sunwayman AP-05 AA-extender for the V- and M-series lights. So you can look forward to a wide range of testing across all supported battery types here. :wave: 

*Reported Manufacturer Specifications:* 

LED: CREE XM-L U2
Output/Runtime using 1 x CR123A: Max 190 lumens (1.5 hrs), Min 1 Lumen (35 hrs)
Using 1 x Li-Ion 16340, Turbo Mode: 500 lumens (25 min) - CAUTION: Do no run for more than 5 minutes in Turbo Mode
Constant current circuit, constant output
Effective range of 456 feet (130 meters)
Uses: One CR123A Lithium battery, or one RCR123A. AA extender allows for use with AA Alkaline and 14500 cells.
Working voltage: 0.9~4.2V
High quality OP reflector maintains great throw distance and spread with an ideal beam pattern
Dimensions: 3.3" x .9" (84 x 23mm)
Weight (w/o Battery): 1.7oz (49g)
Aerospace-grade aluminum alloy
Military Specification Type III hard anodized body
Waterproof, in accordance with IPX-8 standard
Ultra-clear tempered glass lens resists scratches and impacts
Tactical forward click switch with momentary on
Tail stand capable (can be used in "candle" mode)
Accessories: Clip, O-ring, lanyard, holster
MSRP: ~$85






Standard Sunwayman packaging includes a belt holster, clip-on style pocket clip, lanyard strap, extra o-rings, manual, warranty card and product insert. 








From left to right: CR123A; Sunwayman M11R, V11R, M10R; JetBeam PC10; Thrunite Neutron 1C; Zebralight SC30; 4Sevens Mini 123.

All dimensions are given with no batteries installed:

*Sunwayman V11R*: Weight 50.5g, Length: 84.3mm, Width (bezel): 23.1mm
*Sunwayman M11R*: Weight 45.8g, Length: 76.4mm, Width (bezel): 23.1mm
*Rofis JR10*: Weight 75.0g, Length (max): 110.6mm (angled): 92.9mm, Width (bezel): 24.8mm
*Jetbeam PC10*: Weight: 50.5g, Length: 93.6mm, Width (bezel): 22.6mm
*Lumintop ED10*: Weight: 21.5g, Length: 70.4mm, Width (bezel): 20.7mm
*Thrunite Neutron 1C*: Weight: 45.2g, Length: 91.5mm, Width (bezel) 22.0mm

As mentioned above, Sunwayman also sells an optional AA-extender for the V11R:










With this extender in place, you can now run AA/14500 batteries.  Note the extender has a narrower internal diameter than the regular CR123A-size battery tube, thus preventing AA-size cells from rattling inside the light.


















From left to right: Duracell AA NiMH; Sunwayman V11R with AA extender, V10A; Foursevens Quark AA; Fenix LD10; Jetbeam E3S; Tiablo E2A; Zebralight SC51.

*Sunwayman V11R with AA extender:* Weight 59.70g, Length: 100.5mm, Width (bezel): 23.1mm














The build has a number of updates to the earlier V10R/V10A.

But first what hasn't changed – you still get the same rich, dark gray natural finish anodizing. Sunwayman has always had one of the best quality anodizations, with a very attractive finish (IMO). As always, all labels are fairly small and bright white against the dark background.

One of the main physical differences is the addition of reasonable knurling to both the body tube and control ring, thus enhancing grip. This makes the control ring easier to access by feel, and improves the overall gripability of the light. 

The clip-on style clip is of improved quality, and holds more firmly against the light now. It is still not as robust as a screw-on clip (e.g., see the M11R I have just reviewed), but a definite upgrade from before.

The switch cover is something else that has changed – you now have a distinctive-looking metal boot cover. Personally, I have always preferred rubber boot covers – the main issue with metal ones is that you have to hit the cover right on the center, or you may not activate the underlying switch (i.e., less forgiving than rubber). The switch feel with this type of cover is also different – you may worry about not reliably activating the switch, due to the perception of less direct contact. However, I understand Sunwayman will soon begin shipping a rubber cover with the light, so you will have the option to change it yourself. :thumbsup:

The light can still tailstand, but with more scalloped edging around the base (which facilitates access to the switch). 

Screw threading size and diameter has not changed from the early Sunwayman lights, which means you can still mix-and-match heads and bodies across all models. Screw threads are anodized, for head lock-out.

*User Interface*

As before, you activate the V11R by the tailcap switch. Half-press the tailcap for momentary-on, click for locked-on 

Output level is controlled by the magnetic control ring in the head. As before, the V11R features a continuously-variable interface – you control the output level by twisting the ring. You can thus select your desired mode while the light is off (at least approximately). 

And that's it - no blinking modes, no standby modes.  For a more detailed examination of the build and user interface, please see my video overview: 



Video was recorded in 720p, but YouTube typically defaults to 360p. Once the video is running, you can click on the configuration settings icon and select the higher 480p to 720p options. You can also run full-screen. 

*PWM*

There is no sign of PWM that I can see, at any output level – I presume the light is current-controlled, as claimed.  

*Circuit Overhead*

There is no Standby/Off mode on the control ring – if you click the switch on, the light will come on at whatever level the ring is set at (i.e., from Min to Max).

At the lowest output level, I measured the current as 19.7mA for 1xCR123A installed, and 14.4mA for 1xCR123A. Although only approximate, that gives you an estimated runtime at the lowest level of just over 4 days on 1400mAh CR123A, and just over 2 days on 750mAh RCR. These exceed the 35 hr max runtime spec provided by Sunwayman. 

*Output Ramp*

One question users often ask is whether a given continuously-variable ramp is "visually linear". The short answer is the V11R – like its predecessor V10A/V10R - is generally "visually-linear" (in the sense commonly understood here).

The reason that this is an issue is that we do not perceive brightness in a linear way, relative to actual lumen output (e.g., a 200 lumen does not actually look twice as bright as a 100 lumen light to us). So if the light varies the output through a control ring in a lumen-linear fashion, it will seem very distorted to our relative perceptions (i.e., it will seem to spend a lot of time at the higher end of the output range, with little perceptible difference). 

The common solution that flashlight makers have adopted for this problem is to adjust the variable interface to correspond to a logarithmic ramp of circuit power. This is what is known as "visually-linear" here, as there is a long-standing belief in many lighting/electronic/optic communities that we perceive light in a logarithmic way.

To compare two otherwise similar lights – one with a circuit-linear and one with a logarithmic "visually-linear" ramp – see my reviews of the Jetbeam RRT-21 and the Sunwayman V20C, respectively.

While most consider a logarithmic ramp a huge improvement over a standard circuit-linear ramp, it is still not perfect from a relative perception viewpoint. This has become increasingly obvious to me as flashlight makers have expanded the dynamic range of their offerings (i.e. both higher Highs and lower Lows) – the logarithmic relationship for our perceptions just doesn't seem to hold true at the extremes

In reviewing the scientific literature, I have discovered that the logarithmic adjustment model actually dates back to 19th century testing methods. More recent psychometric research from the late 20th century to today has indicated that the range of relative human sensory perceptions appear to more closely follow specific, discrete power relationships. For perceived brightness of a non-point source of light (which would include a flashlight beam), current research findings typically find power values in the 0.30 to 0.35 range (i.e., very close to a cube root, or 0.33). 

For a full discussion of this issue - including detailed graphs and primary literature references - please see this post and the subsequent discussion.

To show this graphically, let's start with what the V11R's ramp would look like in terms of estimated lumen output. To measure this, I slowly turned the ring at as close to a constant rate as I could manage, over ~25 secs or so. My lightbox collected output readings every second, which I then converted to estimated lumens and plotted against the estimated degree shift of the ring (i.e. with 360 degrees being a complete turn). Note the ring only turns about 1/3 the circumference of the light, or about 120 degrees.










I have blown-up the first quarter of the ramp in the inset graph, to show you that output does indeed increase over the whole ring (albeit seemingly slowly at first). As you can probably tell, the pattern does look rather logarithmic (i.e., if I were to plot these on a log scale, you get something approximating a straight line).

_But again, as more recent research has showed, we don't really perceive light in a perfectly logarithmic way._ Plotting with a cube root transformation should give the best indication of what you are likely to see by eye.










The point to the above is to show that the V11R uses a logarithmic ramp (like the earlier V10A), but rises to a higher max output. I haven't plotted the performance on 1xCR123A, but it should look intermediate to my AA and 14500 ramps above. :wave:

*Beamshots:*










The V11R has a fairly typical looking head for a light this size. The reflector is lightly textured (i.e., LOP). Emitter was not perfectly centered on my sample, but it was pretty good. 

And now, the white-wall beamshots.  All lights are on Max output on the identified battery type. Lights are about ~0.75 meter from a white wall (with the camera ~1.25 meters back from the wall). Automatic white balance on the camera, to minimize tint differences. 

1xRCR (AW Protected 750mAh) Li-ion Comparison:





























































1xCR123A Comparison:

















































1x14500 (Aw Protected 14500) Li-ion Comparison:





























































1xAA (Sanyo Eneloop) NiMH Comparison:





























































Ok, those are a lot of beamshots. :sweat: But the take-home message is that the beam pattern is what you would expect for a light this size.

*Testing Method:* 

All my output numbers are relative for my home-made light box setup, a la Quickbeam's flashlightreviews.com method. You can directly compare all my relative output values from different reviews - i.e. an output value of "10" in one graph is the same as "10" in another. All runtimes are done under a cooling fan, except for any extended run Lo/Min modes (i.e. >12 hours) which are done without cooling.

I have devised a method for converting my lightbox relative output values (ROV) to estimated Lumens. See my How to convert Selfbuilt's Lightbox values to Lumens thread for more info. 
*Throw/Output Summary Chart:*

My summary tables are reported in a manner consistent with the ANSI FL-1 standard for flashlight testing. Effective March 2012, I have updated the Max Output ANSI FL-1 lumen estimates to represent peak output measured at 30 secs (my earlier gray tables were based on a later time point for Max output). Please see http://www.flashlightreviews.ca/FL1.htm for a discussion, and a description of all the terms used in these tables.






The reported 190 lumens Hi output spec on 1x CR123A seems pretty accurate in my testing. But the 1 lumen Lo output spec seems very conservative - mine went down to one of the lowest levels I've ever seen. oo:






On 1xRCR, the reported 500 lumens Hi output spec again seems pretty believable for the light. Although the Min output increased somewhat, it is still among the lowest I've seen for this battery type.

The reported 130m Beam Distance spec seems rather optimistic. On 1xRCR, it does approach something close to that – but the ANSI FL-1 spec should relate to 1xCR123A performance.






On standard AA batteries, V11R output has increased my older XP-G-based V10A, but throw has decreased (as you would expect for an XM-L emitter)






On 14500, you get comparable characteristics to the 1xRCR, naturally.

*Output/Runtime Comparison:*

1xRCR: 









1xCR123A:









The V11R performs well for the output levels (i.e. overall efficiency is good). 

One oddity however – on all levels below Max levels, the light doesn't hold its initial output. Rather, it drops off over time, eventually stabilizing at a level <60% lower than the initial output. :thinking:

This may be a quirk of my one sample, but on 1xRCR it actually rises in output slightly over the first 1-2 mins, before starting off on its descending trajectory (you can't really see it the runtime above, due to the scale height). 

Although peculiar, this drop-off was still gradual enough that you will not notice it happening by eye. 

1xAA:























Overall efficiency is again very good, on all standard AA-class batteries, at all levels tested. 

1x14500:









Again, overall efficiency is good on Li-ion. 

But the same pattern of shifting output over time (with a delayed stabilization) is observed here. Indeed, it was even more pronounced on all my 14500 cells – there was a clear increase in output over the first 3+ mins, sometimes rising by as much as 30%, before descending into a gradual drop-off. As before with 1xRCR, the light eventually leveled off somewhere <40% of its initial output level. :shrug:

Note I observed this on a number of 14500 and RCR cells (including different brands), and the effect seemed to be consistently greater on 14500. Interestingly, if you scroll back up the standard AA runtimes, you'll note something similar (but far less pronounced) seemed to be occurring there too. 

Not sure what it all means, but again it is not something you can notice very easily by eye (i.e. it is still gradual enough that you can't notice the change in output). And you can of course always turn the ring if you want more light later on – that's the advantage of continuously-variable.

*Potential Issues*

The included metal clicky switch cover can make it difficult to reliably access the switch, and the switch feel with these sorts of covers is never as good as with rubber boot covers. But I understand Sunwayman plans to start including a separate rubber boot cover with the light soon, so you will have the option of switching it over yourself.

As before, relatively few screw threads hold the head onto the body – but this means the light continues to be backward compatible with all the earlier M- and V- series lights.

Given the circuit overhead of the continuously-variable ring, runtime at the lowest output might not be as long as you would expect (i.e., 2-4 days, depending on battery type). This is comparable to the earlier V10R/A series.

The initial sub-maximal output levels set by the ring are not full stable on Li-ion batteries, but rapidly rise and slowly drop-off over time, eventually settling at a much lower stabilized level. I don't know if this was a quirk of my one sample, but it is not a problem in practice – the change in output is gradual enough for you not to notice by eye, and you can always adjust the ring for more output later if needed.

_UPDATE July 2, 2012:_ The control ring is a bit stiffer than I would like, and you can potentially unscrew the whole head (breaking contact) when trying to turn it (depending on how you are holding the light). Others have commented on this latter point, but it hasn't been a big issue for me in practice for single-handed use (I think because the longer length of the AA-size makes it easier for my hands to grip it solidly - may be more of an issue in default 1xRCR length). 

*Preliminary Observations*

Over the years, I have carried a number of different lights on my person – from Fenix, Jetbeam, Zebralight, 4Sevens, Liteflux, Nitecore, Sunwayman, and more. One key spot is a 1xRCR or 1x14500 class light in a holster on my belt – and for last six months or so, that position has been held by the Sunwayman V10A. It has done the job well, which is why I haven't felt compelled to replace it. Until now, that is. 

The V11R (with the 1xAA extender tube) fixes a few of the minor concerns that I had identified on the V10A. To wit, the lack of suitable tactile differentiation of the control ring from the rest of the head, the lack of sufficient knurling/grip elements on the body, and a weak clip that can easily be pulled off. All of these are better on the V11R (I wouldn't say perfect, but much improved certainly).

About the only new feature that I don't like is the metal switch cover on the V11R – I am therefore glad to hear that Sunwayman will be offering an extra rubber boot cover with the V11R from now on. 

I am also glad to see what hasn't changed – most notably, the logarithmic "visually-linear" ramp of the control ring. :thumbsup: The lack of detectable PWM, the good overall output/runtime efficiency, the excellent anodizing, and the consistent threading (allowing you mix-and-match heads and bodies across the whole M- and V-series line) are all worthwhile things that I am glad they kept unaltered. The circuit glitch of not maintaining the initial set output level on 3.7V Li-ion sources is a bit strange, but not really a problem in use (i.e., gradual enough not to notice, and can always adjust the ring for more light eventually). 

Oh, and the natural-anodized AA-extender piece is a nice addition, so that you don't have to buy a whole new light for added AA/14500 flexibility. 

At the end of the day, this is really more of a cosmetic upgrade to the V10A/R line. There may not be a lot here to compel an upgrade from those who hold the earlier series (although I appreciate the extra grip features and improved clip). Certainly, if you are in the market for a well-designed, continuously-variable light in the CR123A- or AA-class sizes, the V11R is a strong contender.

----

V11R was supplied by Battery Junction for review.


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## dc38

As always, a wonderful review! Just out of curiosity, I noticed on your comparison chart of the RCR 123 size cells; the Sunway man actually OUTSHINED the Jetbeam PC10?!?!?! Although it doesn't seem to be by much, do you visually notice any difference between the outputs, and how do the tints compare??


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## selfbuilt

dc38 said:


> As always, a wonderful review! Just out of curiosity, I noticed on your comparison chart of the RCR 123 size cells; the Sunway man actually OUTSHINED the Jetbeam PC10?!?!?! Although it doesn't seem to be by much, do you visually notice any difference between the outputs, and how do the tints compare??


There's not much of a difference. The V11R is touch brighter overall, with a slightly wider spill beam. The PC10 seems to have a touch more relative throw. 

As for tint, that is likely to be highly variable across samples. For what it's worth, my V11R seem to be a more consistent premium white tint across the whole beam pattern (The PC10 had some warmer tint shifting in the corona relative to the hotspot). On the whole, the V11R was probably a touch cooler than my PC10 sample - but again, that could be completely different for another two samples. :shrug:

Certainly not a lot to distinguish one from the other, at the end of the day.


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## peterharvey73

Wonderful review as always Selfbuilt.
Nice to hear that the V10A has been your EDC; sounds like you prefer the V10 for its compact size, and the V10A for the run time over the V10R.
Wow, I wish Jetbeam themselves or BatteryJunction would lend you an RRT-01 18350 for testing, but without a AA 2200 mAH, it may still not make it as your new EDC...


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## fishndad

the build in the tailcap on the pc10 is cheep not excited about that however i still like the light.
i just dont think everything comes down to how many and how far.
i dont own a sunwaymay yet! but this review convinced me they build lights better than jetbeam and i do own some of those.
thanks for your time and effort.


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## Dubois

Great review, as usual, Selfbuilt. I'd also be interested in your views of the RRT-01, which I guess is the closest competitor to the V11R.


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## briankanderson

*Sunwayman V11R (Mods?)*

Thanks for the great review. I'll be purchasing one of these very soon as my new EDC. 
As always, I'm thinking of mods and I'm wondering if anyone out there who already has one of these in hand could comment on the likelihood of this working:

Bore out the 14500 adapter piece to around 17.3mm so it would accept a 17500 cell in place of the 14500. With a rough calculation, that's almost a 50% increase in energy and therefore worth a small bit of hassle if feasible. There's a reviewer out there on a certain "limited money"-light-forum that mentions the body can accommodate a 17mm cell (if just) so in theory the spacer is all that stands in the way of much improved run times...

Continuing that train of thought, it seems that one (with modification to spacers /and/ main body) could also accommodate an 18650 cell with the utilization of two spacers back to back, assuming they screw together. Definitely a bit of work on the lathe but theoretically possible...?

Thoughts on either mod?


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## selfbuilt

peterharvey73 said:


> Wonderful review as always Selfbuilt.
> Nice to hear that the V10A has been your EDC; sounds like you prefer the V10 for its compact size, and the V10A for the run time over the V10R. Wow, I wish Jetbeam themselves or BatteryJunction would lend you an RRT-01 18350 for testing, but without a AA 2200 mAH, it may still not make it as your new EDC...





Dubois said:


> Great review, as usual, Selfbuilt. I'd also be interested in your views of the RRT-01, which I guess is the closest competitor to the V11R.


The RRT-01 does look interesting, but I have not been sent one to review. The 18350-option on that light is appealing for extra runtime capacity (does the circuit have a protection feature though? all 18350 cells I'm aware of are unprotected).

In any case, one thing for me is that I prefer the AA-length. My hands are fairly large, with relatively long fingers - anything smaller than a typical 1xAA light feels a little too small (i.e. hand cramps up try to operate it). I have the same issue with little mini travel mice or fold-up keyboards - I like a full size computer mouse and keypad.



fishndad said:


> the build in the tailcap on the pc10 is cheep not excited about that however i still like the light.


For some reason Sysmax (parent company to Nitecore and Jetbeam) has settled on a common switch for most their models that has a somewhat "squishy" feel. :shrug: I don't know about the RRT-01, but the PC10 definitely uses this switch.


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## Kilovolt

Thanks for the excellent review. :thumbsup:

I have quite recently received one of these lights and in actual facts a rubber switch boot was installed while the infamous metallic cover was in a ziplock bag together with its mounting hardware and a spare switch. I do not plan to put it on but I have to say that the switch cover of my Ti2 after some initial scraping noises has now settled down to an absolutely unobtrusive behavior.


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## candle lamp

Excellent review. Eric!
Thanks for sharing good information. :thumbsup:

KyeongHo.


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## Bl4ckSheep

I wasn't 100% sure if i should take the V11R or the V10R. But now i know that i must buy the V11R.
I love this light and i love your review.

Thanks a lot!


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## MichaelW

Since Energizer has seen fit to upgrade the L91 & EA91 cells, going from 8x to 9x & 4x to 6x respectively, will the upgrade of the L91 affect your testing?
Did the upgrade from 7x to 8x do anything noticeable to a reference light?


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## selfbuilt

MichaelW said:


> Since Energizer has seen fit to upgrade the L91 & EA91 cells, going from 8x to 9x & 4x to 6x respectively, will the upgrade of the L91 affect your testing?
> Did the upgrade from 7x to 8x do anything noticeable to a reference light?


Hmmm, don't know how much of that is just marketing spin. I know from my CR123A testing that manufacturers continually tweak their formulations over time, so i presume the same is true with L91. But it may not specifically correlate with packaging. For what it is worth, my L91s were from a "8X" labeled pack.


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## Rokron

:twothumbs Top notch review, Safebuilt! When I got my V11R back in early April, I too was disappointed with the crappy feel of the button so with all the switch assemblies that I had from my V10R conversion to Steve Ku trit switches I just went right ahead and changed the assembly right off and the V11R has been clipped to my pocket ever since. One thing though, SWM made things right by shipping new switch assemblies for us but one thing that I dont understand is why did they include the switch itself?  The switches are the same. All they needed to do was to send out the white nylon washer with the raised collar, the rubber boot and the threaded ring. Thats all I used from the assemblies that I had. See http://www.cpfmarketplace.com/mp/showthread.php?268740-Sunwayman-V11R&p=4647195#top "Sunwayman V11R" thread, post #11 for photo of parts.


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## srvctec

Amazingly detailed review as always, selfbuilt! How does the beam in real life actually compare to the V10A (kind of hard to tell in the photos)? I have a V10R and it has been my EDC for 8 months or so and absolutely love it, except for the clip and the non-tactile brightness adjustment ring. What I'm wondering is if the beam of the V11R is more floody, as I suspect it is, which would actually work even better in my line of work. Also, did Sunwayman mention when they would be including the rubber switch cover with these? I don't want one unless it comes with the rubber cover and Battery Junction doesn't mention the rubber cover yet, either.

Thanks for your great reviews over the years! When I want to check out a new light, I just hop on CPF and search for your reviews. :thumbsup:


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## selfbuilt

srvctec said:


> What I'm wondering is if the beam of the V11R is more floody, as I suspect it is, which would actually work even better in my line of work.


Yes, in most senses of the word "floody": the V11R has a slightly wider spillbeam, a broader hotspot, and a brighter spill than the V10A. You add all that up, and the subjective impression is definitely "floodier". There is also a more noticeable beam ring around the spillbeam periphery on my V11R sample, though.



> Also, did Sunwayman mention when they would be including the rubber switch cover with these? I don't want one unless it comes with the rubber cover and Battery Junction doesn't mention the rubber cover yet, either.


I don't have specific information, but I understood that all shipping lights now (soon?) would include both. And according to KiloVolt, his actually came with the rubber boot installed. 

I would recommend you directly contact any vendor you are thinking of getting the light from, and confirm what they are currently shipping. Most dealers are typically fairly responsive on such matters.


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## GordoJones88

Looks like the new top dog . . . for now.

Thanks a bunch for the review and especially this graph I use.

Thank you Battery Junction for the Sunwayman V11R review sample.

Now I need to see the JetBeam RT-001 on here too. :naughty:


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## GordoJones88

dc38 said:


> I noticed on your comparison chart of the RCR123 cells, the Sunwayman V11R actually outshined the Jetbeam PC10?



Referring that JetBeam PC10 claims 550 ANSI FL-1 lumens and Sunwayman V11R claims 500 lumens.

I had some PC10 questions Selfbuilt answered here and here.

Hmmm, I wonder how the V11R would respond to an AW IMR 16340 . . . 

Oh well, I suppose we will just never know . . .










Obviously, you'll want to recharge your battery every 30 seconds for max brightness.


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## Teobaldo

Thanks for the great review. It was seeking a flashlight that functioned with diverse types of battery and this is the one that more I have liked. I bought it in KD and I am expecting that arrive at my house.

Thanks again and congratulations for you work.


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## Bl4ckSheep

I ordered it a few days ago from hkequipment.net and can't wait to hold it in my hands


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## kosPap

> Output/Runtime using 1 x CR123A: Max 190 lumens (1.5 hrs), Min 1 Lumen (35 hrs)
> Using 1 x Li-Ion 16340, Turbo Mode: 500 lumens (25 min) - CAUTION: Do no run for more than 5 minutes in Turbo Mode


Do I read this that with Li-Ion batteries the light looses its modes?


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## NoFair

kosPap said:


> Do I read this that with Li-Ion batteries the light looses its modes?



You still have all modes with a Li-ion


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## selfbuilt

NoFair said:


> You still have all modes with a Li-ion


Confirmed, the V11R works fine on RCR (on 14500 for that matter).

The warning from Sunwayman is just to limit runtime on Max on RCR, as it brighter (and therefore runs hotter) than 1xCR123A.


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## Bl4ckSheep

The light arrived today from Hkequipment and i have to say that its absolute amazing.
I love this EDC! Thank you for the review selfbuilt it was one of the reasons i bought it.


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## JudasD

I just received the V11R as well. Honestly i thought i would be happy with it, but then i read the review of the EagleTec D25C. The D25C is even shorter! In XML it has more lumens and in XPG it has more throw! ohh the choices!!!

JD


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## Kilovolt

JudasD said:


> I just received the V11R as well. Honestly i thought i would be happy with it, but then i read the review of the EagleTec D25C. The D25C is even shorter! In XML it has more lumens and in XPG it has more throw! ohh the choices!!!




You have clearly explained why each one of us has many many lights ....


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## JudasD

Kilovolt said:


> You have clearly explained why each one of us has many many lights ....



Never before have i seen a support group that actually reinforces the "bad" behavior :rock:


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## thaugen

I just ordered a V11r and was wondering if I can use my Red AW IMR 16340 (unprotected)? Thanks for the great reviews!


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## NoFair

Sure, just charge it regularly since the light will happily overdischarge an unprotected cell.


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## thaugen

NoFair said:


> Sure, just charge it regularly since the light will happily overdischarge an unprotected cell.



Got it. Thanks! 

Will it be brighter on an AW IMR 16340 (unprotected) than an AW ICR123 (protected)?


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## NoFair

Slightly on max normally. afaik it draws a bit more current from an IMR because it can better cope with the high current draw (compared to a normal AW li-ion) Runtime on lower brightness levels is lower, but an IMR can sustain max a bit longer before dropping in brightness. 

I use IMRs in mine when not using 17500s (with a bored out extender). 17500s better cope with the 2A current draw than most 16340s


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## thaugen

my Sunwayman V11r arrived today and I am very pleased with the quality of this light! The fit and finish are perfect, the switch is great (now that I've installed the included rubber boot switch), the XM-L beam is nice and white without too many rings or artifacts and this thing is a little powerhouse on AW ICR 123 or IMR 16340's. 

I am glad I gave Sunwayman a chance and understand why there are so many positive reviews of this tiny tank of a light!


----------



## selfbuilt

thaugen said:


> I am glad I gave Sunwayman a chance and understand why there are so many positive reviews of this tiny tank of a light!


FYI, I've been EDCing this light (with AA-extender, on 14500) since the review, and it has continued to perform well.

Two quibbles that I have are on the control ring - it remains stiffer than I would like (I had hoped it would loosen up with time), and you can potentially unscrew the whole head (breaking contact) when trying to turn it.

Others have commented on this latter point, but it hasn't been a big issue for me in practice for single-handed use (I think because the longer length of the AA-size makes it easier for my hands to grip it solidly - may be more of an issue in default 1xRCR length). When I've handed the light to someone else to inspect, they often wind up loosening the head because they use two hands to turn ring (and thus wind up twisting the body slightly). But for the single-handed way I use the light, it hasn't been much of an issue (i.e., a relatively rare occurence).


----------



## thaugen

selfbuilt said:


> the control ring - it remains stiffer than I would like...



Selfbuilt...thanks for your great reviews! I am glad to hear your V11r is holding up well over the long haul. Also, my V11r's control ring is very easy to turn, not too easy, but just about right in my opinion. Perhaps it depends on the light sample...


----------



## Newguy2012

selfbuilt said:


> FYI, I've been EDCing this light (with AA-extender, on 14500) since the review, and it has continued to perform well.
> 
> Two quibbles that I have are on the control ring - it remains stiffer than I would like (I had hoped it would loosen up with time), and you can potentially unscrew the whole head (breaking contact) when trying to turn it.
> 
> Others have commented on this latter point, but it hasn't been a big issue for me in practice for single-handed use (I think because the longer length of the AA-size makes it easier for my hands to grip it solidly - may be more of an issue in default 1xRCR length). When I've handed the light to someone else to inspect, they often wind up loosening the head because they use two hands to turn ring (and thus wind up twisting the body slightly). But for the single-handed way I use the light, it hasn't been much of an issue (i.e., a relatively rare occurence).


It is true that the v11r max is 190lm on an single AA? I asked because goinggear just reviewed the v10r ti. He said it's around 120lumens on AA. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xHFp1PCTbZA&list=UUbIlyOsx2GFLIqDTaFlS0Ig&index=3&feature=plcp The specs for v10r ti is the same as the v11r.


----------



## selfbuilt

Newguy2012 said:


> It is true that the v11r max is 190lm on an single AA? I asked because goinggear just reviewed the v10r ti. He said it's around 120lumens on AA. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xHFp1PCTbZA&list=UUbIlyOsx2GFLIqDTaFlS0Ig&index=3&feature=plcp The specs for v10r ti is the same as the v11r.


My lumen estimate for the V11R on 1xNiMH was 190 lumens, so that sounds bang-on with specs. Don't know about the V10R Ti ... but my original XP-G R5-equipped V10A I estimated at 140 lumens on NiMH.


----------



## Up All Night

Excellent review! Thanks!

Out of the box my sample would not work with a 14500 or any AA size battery. After contacting the vendor, a suggestion of backing off the set screw & retightening seemed to work. However, I've had to do this several times and regardless of how tight I have this screw I can detect a rattle in the head. If I place a fingertip on the actual pos contact the rattle stops but this continual tightening has me "rattled"! Would anyone care to chime in as to whether they can induce a rattle on theirs when the head is removed from the body? Just a simple "give your head a shake"!
I'm liking the tint and travel of the control ring and would prefer not to return it, but I fear this issue is a harbinger of things to come!

Any feedback is welcome.
Thanks!


----------



## cyclesport

Up All Night said:


> Excellent review! Thanks!
> 
> Out of the box my sample would not work with a 14500 or any AA size battery. After contacting the vendor, a suggestion of backing off the set screw & retightening seemed to work. However, I've had to do this several times and regardless of how tight I have this screw I can detect a rattle in the head. If I place a fingertip on the actual pos contact the rattle stops but this continual tightening has me "rattled"! Would anyone care to chime in as to whether they can induce a rattle on theirs when the head is removed from the body? Just a simple "give your head a shake"!
> I'm liking the tint and travel of the control ring and would prefer not to return it, but I fear this issue is a harbinger of things to come!
> 
> Any feedback is welcome.
> Thanks!



My V11R developed a slight rattle in the head after two months that I tracked down to the reflector being slightly loose. After some o-ring changes to the lens/reflector interface and no luck, I wrapped a slim strip of teflon tape one revolution around the circumference of the widest part of the reflector to take up the loose slack/fit and it worked. Nice and tight now with no loosening after several weeks of carry.


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## benji.hi

There are two review threads up, I've posted my initial impressions on the other : http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...-review-%28XM-L-U2-1-x-16340-1-x-AA-w-ext-%29
But for the heck of it I thought I'd post it here as well to up the visibility.

I received mine from HKequipment yesterday.
Sorry to say, but out of the box my first impressions where fairly negative for a light this price. :mecry:
The BIG issue was that the light was stuck always on! I could click the tail switch as much as I liked and the light just stayed on.
After trying all possible forms of batteries(I got the extender) I decided It must be the (rubber) switch. If I followed the manual I should now return it to the dealer! 
Instead I thought I'd try to change the switch for the metal one and figured out that you could unscrew the cap with needle nose pliers.
That gave me the idea that maybe the switch was on too tight. I backed it out half a turn and BINGO it works perfect.:thumbsup:

During all this the Threads seemed VERY dry and quite dirty, so I cleaned and lubed them. THEY WHERE FILTHY.

The light works fine now and I'm very happy with the beam (color shape and throw) and the control ring (a bit stiff). I'm runing it on a 16340 and it's great, the Low is SUPER low and the high is definitely blinding.

I guess I just expected better finish (clean lubed threads) and QC from what I've heard about sunwayman. My unboxing experience was WAY below a Fenix, more on par with a XXXXfire :sigh:

Maybe I'm being a flashlight noob, any opinions?
Also whilst the momentary on is working ok, am I correct in thinking that if I back out the switch a bit more it'll be a bit longer before the "click" (full on) ? could this cause problems?


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## selfbuilt

benji.hi said:


> I received mine from HKequipment yesterday.
> Sorry to say, but out of the box my first impressions where fairly negative for a light this price. :mecry:


That seems unusual - in my experience, SWM lights have always been fully functioning and in very pristine condition coming out of the box. 

In terms of the switch, it is true that misalignment could lead to issues (i.e., not turning on or off). But again, that should have been properly set at the factory. I wonder if you don't perhaps have a returned sample? That could explain the diry threads as well. I wonder if the eBay vendor could be a factor - are they an authorized SWM distributor (outside of Asia)?


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## benji.hi

I got it direct from the HKequipment e-store not ebay, thought they also sell on ebay. As for if they are an authorized SWM distributor I confess I didn't do my research. 
I did get the light with shippign to Europe + the ap05 extension for $81,50 USD though.


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## Newguy2012

Up All Night said:


> Excellent review! Thanks!
> 
> Out of the box my sample would not work with a 14500 or any AA size battery. After contacting the vendor, a suggestion of backing off the set screw & retightening seemed to work. However, I've had to do this several times and regardless of how tight I have this screw I can detect a rattle in the head. If I place a fingertip on the actual pos contact the rattle stops but this continual tightening has me "rattled"! Would anyone care to chime in as to whether they can induce a rattle on theirs when the head is removed from the body? Just a simple "give your head a shake"!
> I'm liking the tint and travel of the control ring and would prefer not to return it, but I fear this issue is a harbinger of things to come!
> 
> Any feedback is welcome.
> Thanks!





cyclesport said:


> My V11R developed a slight rattle in the head after two months that I tracked down to the reflector being slightly loose. After some o-ring changes to the lens/reflector interface and no luck, I wrapped a slim strip of teflon tape one revolution around the circumference of the widest part of the reflector to take up the loose slack/fit and it worked. Nice and tight now with no loosening after several weeks of carry.



My V11r rattle since the day I got it. It's the magnet. If you guys didn't notice, the black circle under the head is the magnet.


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## hawk45

Thanks for the great review and updates. Just ordered one tonight (with extension). It's my first real flashlight (outside of some basic headlamps, toolbox lights and Steamlight Polytacs). Really excided.. came down to this or the ZebraLight SC80. I wanted to try the XML LED first and this allows the use of so many battery options.


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## selfbuilt

hawk45 said:


> Thanks for the great review and updates. Just ordered one tonight (with extension). It's my first real flashlight (outside of some basic headlamps, toolbox lights and Steamlight Polytacs).


Let us know how you like it. I am still EDCing mine on my belt pouch, with the extender. While still not quite the perfect EDC, it does do the job well.

Of course, what would be the perfect EDC?  ... outside of some sort of transforming, Inspector Gadget-style multi-tool ... :laughing:


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## Up All Night

Up All Night said:


> Excellent review! Thanks!
> 
> Out of the box my sample would not work with a 14500 or any AA size battery. After contacting the vendor, a suggestion of backing off the set screw & retightening seemed to work. However, I've had to do this several times and regardless of how tight I have this screw I can detect a rattle in the head. If I place a fingertip on the actual pos contact the rattle stops but this continual tightening has me "rattled"! Would anyone care to chime in as to whether they can induce a rattle on theirs when the head is removed from the body? Just a simple "give your head a shake"!
> I'm liking the tint and travel of the control ring and would prefer not to return it, but I fear this issue is a harbinger of things to come!
> 
> Any feedback is welcome.
> Thanks!



After having the above issue start to occur w/123's I sent the light back for exchange. I received the replacement today and have had the issue that benji.hi encountered. While not constant as his was I've had to cycle the switch a couple of times to get it to shut off. After several on/off cycles it seemed to be fine, so I thought all was well. I then came back to this review because I remembered benji's post and as I started reading the light just came on of its own accord. I can't seem to win for losing with this model! Benji, has your backing out the switch been a permanent fix?


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## benji.hi

Sorry It's taken me a while to reply, yes backing out the switch about a 1/3 turn has been a permanent fix for me.


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## Up All Night

benji.hi said:


> Sorry It's taken me a while to reply, yes backing out the switch about a 1/3 turn has been a permanent fix for me.



No worries, I appreciate the reply. I backed mine out about about the same and had one misfire, so I continued until I could see the retaining ring through the lanyard holes. I then slowly tightened it(switching as I did) until firm & clear of the lanyard holes. Seems to be ok, fingers crossed! I hope that's it because I hate playing shipping tag!
Thanks again!


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## michelkenny

One question, is the clip sturdy enough to have the light clipped on a belt, but not in a pocket (i.e. will the clip remove itself with a jolt?)


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## selfbuilt

michelkenny said:


> One question, is the clip sturdy enough to have the light clipped on a belt, but not in a pocket (i.e. will the clip remove itself with a jolt?)


I haven't tried carrying it this way. While fairly sturdy (and not likely to come off easily), it could come off with enough force.


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## Swedpat

Hi Selfbuilt,

As usual I will give an eloge for the amazing reviews you do! 
I just have a question: 4Sevens AA Mini XP-G and Fenix LD10 XP-G R4 are two lights who according to the manufacturers specs are not allowed to be used with 14500(4Sevens actually put the 1,5V limit) I earlier read that these lights then should be damaged. But you still give report of brightness with these lights and 14500s. Just curious...


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## selfbuilt

Swedpat said:


> I just have a question: 4Sevens AA Mini XP-G and Fenix LD10 XP-G R4 are two lights who according to the manufacturers specs are not allowed to be used with 14500(4Sevens actually put the 1,5V limit) I earlier read that these lights then should be damaged. But you still give report of brightness with these lights and 14500s. Just curious...


There's a difference between not recommended and not supported by the circuit. The Fenix lights have always been able to take 14500, but you loose all the low modes initially (i.e., run as direct drive until the defined level is reached - usually shortly before protection circuit shut-down). The early Foursevens lights I tested were similar in this regard.

It's possible Foursevens has changed the circuit to no longer take higher voltage 14500 (if that's the case, the circuit could go  immediately). But it may also simply be that that they have lowered the specs to try and prevent people from running the lights this way. As you can tell from my runtimes, there was never an issue with the various Foursevens lights taking 14500 (at least at the time of those reviews - although you do loose the lower modes).

As a general rule, I only test officially supported batteries in any given review. But if a specified voltage range (again, at the time of the review) allows higher voltage cells, I typically give it a try (unless the manufacturer explicitly warns me against it). The Zebralight SC51 comes to mind ... I tested 14500 before the manufacturer came out and said they were not supported. I don't know if there was a circuit change along with that, but my early sample appears to handle them fine.


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## Swedpat

Thanks for the explanation selfbuilt!


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## KDM

I received my v11r in the mail today. I've always liked the looks of this light and after reading your review decided to pull the trigger on one. Tried it first with the 16340 and was immediately impressed by the beam. Opened the extender up and couldn't resist. Dremel time! The AW17500 fits in there nicely. It's definitely a great little light for the money.


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## Newguy2012

KDM said:


> I received my v11r in the mail today. I've always liked the looks of this light and after reading your review decided to pull the trigger on one. Tried it first with the 16340 and was immediately impressed by the beam. Opened the extender up and couldn't resist. Dremel time! The AW17500 fits in there nicely. It's definitely a great little light for the money.


Sunwaman didn't recommend 17500 with the extender. Would it be bad if you use them in the light long term? How much bigger is the 17500 to 14500? I just checked the spec. I wish I got the 17500 instead of 14500. :[


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## climberkid

michelkenny said:


> One question, is the clip sturdy enough to have the light clipped on a belt, but not in a pocket (i.e. will the clip remove itself with a jolt?)



I actually carry mine this way. It has come off my belt from being caught on my seatbelt but the clip was still on the light. 

I've had 2 V11Rs fail with the AA extender. Tightening the head screw was a short tern fix last time. Then it stopped and I sent it back to HID candada. About a month and a half later I got it back with a new extender. It worked for a day then the same problem occurred as I put the clip on. It just went out. I took the clip off and it still didn't work. Switched to cr123 and it shone like normal. Put the clip on and off and it never shut off. Put the extender back on and it still wouldn't turn on. Put clip on and off again and still nothing. 

Jason with HID Canada has been wonderful throughout the process but I have officially given up on the extender. Why is it doing this?

-Alex


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## Newguy2012

climberkid said:


> I actually carry mine this way. It has come off my belt from being caught on my seatbelt but the clip was still on the light.
> 
> I've had 2 V11Rs fail with the AA extender. Tightening the head screw was a short tern fix last time. Then it stopped and I sent it back to HID candada. About a month and a half later I got it back with a new extender. It worked for a day then the same problem occurred as I put the clip on. It just went out. I took the clip off and it still didn't work. Switched to cr123 and it shone like normal. Put the clip on and off and it never shut off. Put the extender back on and it still wouldn't turn on. Put clip on and off again and still nothing.
> 
> Jason with HID Canada has been wonderful throughout the process but I have officially given up on the extender. Why is it doing this?
> 
> -Alex



Did you make sure the AA extender is fully tighten to the head?


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## KDM

Newguy2012 said:


> Sunwaman didn't recommend 17500 with the extender. Would it be bad if you use them in the light long term? How much bigger is the 17500 to 14500? I just checked the spec. I wish I got the 17500 instead of 14500. :[



Not sure on the exact dimensions of the AW 17500 (Market place/dealers has all the specs) it will fit the host diameter. The extender is what has to be bored for it to fit. A 16340, 14500, &17500 all have the same voltage. The 17500 is just going to give you more run time.


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## KDM

climberkid said:


> I actually carry mine this way. It has come off my belt from being caught on my seatbelt but the clip was still on the light.
> 
> I've had 2 V11Rs fail with the AA extender. Tightening the head screw was a short tern fix last time. Then it stopped and I sent it back to HID candada. About a month and a half later I got it back with a new extender. It worked for a day then the same problem occurred as I put the clip on. It just went out. I took the clip off and it still didn't work. Switched to cr123 and it shone like normal. Put the clip on and off and it never shut off. Put the extender back on and it still wouldn't turn on. Put clip on and off again and still nothing.
> 
> Jason with HID Canada has been wonderful throughout the process but I have officially given up on the extender. Why is it doing this?
> 
> -Alex



Have you checked the spring on the switch? Bent, mashed down? When the battery is in the tube with the light apart does it stick out the end of the tube? Sounds like a contact problem.


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## Up All Night

climberkid,
Read posts 37,45 and 47. My first one had the extender issue, then it wouldn't work with 123 size batts. The second one seems to have no issue with the extender but misfires occasionally when switching off. Even after backing the switch out and retightening I still get the odd misfire.
I agree about about Jason's customer service, it's top notch. I'm sure SWM are usually pretty solid but two bad ones in a row has left a bit of a bad taste.


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## Newguy2012

Up All Night said:


> climberkid,
> Read posts 37,45 and 47. My first one had the extender issue, then it wouldn't work with 123 size batts. The second one seems to have no issue with the extender but misfires occasionally when switching off. Even after backing the switch out and retightening I still get the odd misfire.
> I agree about about Jason's customer service, it's top notch. I'm sure SWM are usually pretty solid but two bad ones in a row has left a bit of a bad taste.


 Did try to tighting the lens head? If the lens head is loose it doesn't turn on. Also is that a retail light? Your OP says sample.


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## climberkid

It is a retail light, the High CRI version. 

I tried all the things you all suggested. I even started by using eneloops then 14500s. The primary 123s and 16340s both work. Jason said it worked for him all day before he sent it to me. The first time I had the issue I tightened the screw in the head but it was only a temporary fix.

-Alex


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## Ualnosaj

Quick off-topic... If you have an issue with your V11R LE and extender, drop me a line and we'll try and work something out as well.

On a side note, I haven't had any issue myself with the V11R, or LE or PE versions with extender (always used extender for better grip) but then again I don't EDC them religiously. I EDC the TCR1 (gasp!).



________________
Sent from my mobile device. Please excuse the brevity of this message.


----------



## Up All Night

Newguy2012 said:


> Did try to tighting the lens head? If the lens head is loose it doesn't turn on. Also is that a retail light? Your OP says sample.



I often refer to my own lights as "samples", yes it was a retail purchase. As far as troubleshooting a light goes, I remove, clean, retighten and check every user accessible part before posting problems.


----------



## Newguy2012

climberkid said:


> It is a retail light, the High CRI version.
> 
> I tried all the things you all suggested. I even started by using eneloops then 14500s. The primary 123s and 16340s both work. Jason said it worked for him all day before he sent it to me. The first time I had the issue I tightened the screw in the head but it was only a temporary fix.
> 
> -Alex


So you're saying the AA size battery worked for Jason before he shipped it to you? Is it possible to test the contact by using 2 wire or paperclips? Did you also try fully screw without the O-rings? I wonder if the HCRI is designed to work with the Extender.


----------



## Newguy2012

Ualnosaj said:


> Quick off-topic... If you have an issue with your V11R LE and extender, drop me a line and we'll try and work something out as well.
> 
> On a side note, I haven't had any issue myself with the V11R, or LE or PE versions with extender (always used extender for better grip) but then again I don't EDC them religiously. I EDC the TCR1 (gasp!).
> Aren't you the guy that was giving one out for free? Do you have anymore for sale?
> 
> 
> ________________
> Sent from my mobile device. Please excuse the brevity of this message.


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## KDM

Could it be the extender wasn't threaded enough to make a solid contact. Threads bottoming out before it makes contact. Sand some of the anno off.


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## Newguy2012

Anyone notice the threads on the head isn't continuous? The threads near the screw are missing. Is it just on my light or is it like that for you guys too?
How do you guys turn the ring? 1.With the index & thumb on the ring? or 2. Index wrap on the head and using the thumb to turn it? It more comfortable with 1, but head gets loose easier. Does anyone have a solution to prevent the head from coming loose easier?


----------



## Gadgetman7

I have the same problem. My v11 doesn't work with a single AA battery, or 14500, with the extender. Oddly, I can put the extender in M11 and it works fine on AA. I've previously used RCR123 only in the V11. Is there a reset that I need to do?


----------



## Up All Night

Gadgetman7 said:


> I have the same problem. My v11 doesn't work with a single AA battery, or 14500, with the extender. Oddly, I can put the extender in M11 and it works fine on AA. I've previously used RCR123 only in the V11. Is there a reset that I need to do?



There's no reset my friend. If you read earlier posts in this thread by myself and climberkid you will see that we have encountered this problem as well. You can try to retighten the set screw in the head and see what happens. It was a temporary fix that I had to keep repeating until I started having issues w/123 size batteries. I then sent it back for exchange. Clean & tighten all contact points and if you get no results you should contact your vendor.


----------



## stylo

Hello,

just a question about output power,

It is stated by the manufacturer to limit to 5mn max intensity,
Does the torch support full power for around 30 mn as you mesured ? is it possible to hold it in hands ? any risk to burn it ?


----------



## selfbuilt

stylo said:


> It is stated by the manufacturer to limit to 5mn max intensity,
> Does the torch support full power for around 30 mn as you mesured ? is it possible to hold it in hands ? any risk to burn it ?


The light will certainly run for an extended period of time on max - the question is whether or not it is advisable to do so. Like many manufacturers, they give the reasonable instruction to limit to your time on max (especially for RCR), and to provide some kind of cooling (i.e., hand holding, fan, etc.). Note that all my tests are done under a cooling fan.

It stands to reason there is a greater risk in running any light on max (especially with limited or no cooling). In this case, if you found it too warm while carrying, you can easily dial down the output a little. But I certainly don't recommend you try to pick up a light that has been running for an extended period on max unattended/uncooled - it is likely to be a little too hot to handle comfortably with bare hands at that point.


----------



## AFearlessBirdOfParadise

In people's opinion is it worth going for the V11R over the V10A if you are only going to use AA nimhs and just like having the option of "what if I go RCR" in the future?


----------



## Ualnosaj

AFearlessBirdOfParadise said:


> In people's opinion is it worth going for the V11R over the V10A if you are only going to use AA nimhs and just like having the option of "what if I go RCR" in the future?



It's about the "what if".

The V10 package is sleeker and slippier/smoother finish. Think more executive like.

If you want the 400+ lumens, you can run 14500.



________________
Sent from my mobile device. Please excuse the brevity of this message.


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## moldyoldy

some reactions and comparisons between the V10a, V10r, and V11r w/ or w/o the AA extender. 

All output testing was performed with cells that came off a full charge w/in less than 30 minutes of using them in a test. After any test more than 5 min, they went back on the charger. why? The discharge curves show that nearly all "regulated" lights decrease their output fairly quickly after a runtime initiation. 

Testing methods: I direct the beam from either light to the same point on the ceiling and look at the bare wood floor underneath the point of aim and alternate between lights by covering up one light or the other with my thumbs or palm. or I compare the direct illumination of a target at varying distances. ie: my neighbor has a gazebo some 30+ steps away which serves nicely for spot/spill size and brightness comparisons.

The V10r was the first light that introduced me to the Sunwayman continuously variable ring. Since I could never find the control ring by feel in a timely fashion, I cut a strip of duct tape slightly narrower than the control ring with a bit of overlap end-to-end around the ring. Now I have no problem with finding the control ring. my nephew thought so too and absconded with that light. sigh. The V10r is a nice light! The V10a retained the smooth control ring of the V10r, so I applied the duct tape correction to the control ring as well. The V11r has the knurled control ring and I have no problem finding the ring by feel as is. 

Note that I just received my copy of the V11r and appear to have a later version than the one Selfbuilt tested. 

1. My copy came with the rubber switch cover installed and the stainless steel switch cover in a little baggie. I prefer the rubber boot anyway.

2. My copy of the V11r has an arguably smaller spot than the V10a. the spill sizes are roughly the same. The V11r & V10a ring patterns are consistent with Selfbuilt's beam photos. The V11r has a bit more pronounced rings than the V10a which is has minimal ring effects. If the V11r is turned on by itself, the color appears to be a bit warm white. By comparison the V10a has a coolish white beam that is consistent from spot thru spill edges. with both lights turned on, only then does a slight greenish color to an outer ring on the V11r become noticeable. Frankly, for an XML, the V10a has a nearly flawless beam spot/spill!

3. Regarding the cells being used: I use primarily the AW IMR 16340 unprotected cells and the AW (ICR) RCR123a protected cells. Same for the 14500 size: AW IMR or ICR cells. Both the V11r and V10a increase their output perceptibly when using the IMR cell as opposed to the ICR cells. That characteristic is consistent with the current capabilities of the cell types. To my perception, XML lights generally demonstrate a slight increase in their output with IMR cells. When using the same cell type in both lights, the V11r is slightly brighter than the V10a. If I use an ICR cell in the V11r and an IMR cell in the V10a, the V10a appears to be slightly brighter.

4. The V11r has a noticeably higher "low" than the V10a. Since I almost never use the lowest setting on any light - thanks to old eyes - that lowest setting makes no difference to me.

5. The V11r with a NiMH cell has a slightly lower output on high than my copy of a ZL SC51 on H1 - which is consistent with their ratings.

6. The V11r does have a more viscous damped motion to the control ring - sort of as if there was some sort of oil or silicon damping to any motion. By comparison, the control ring on the V10a moves very easily - perhaps too easily. I find the output with the V10a unintentionally changing. with the V11r that might happen, but relatively little. I do not have a problem with twisting the control ring and inadvertently twisting off the head of the light. Admittedly I cannot turn the control ring on the V11r as fast as on the V10a with thumb/forefinger. I have to admit that, like Selfbuilt, I prefer the length of the V10a or the V11r with the AA extender better than the V11r w/out the AA extender. My fingers more naturally find the control ring with the AA length.

7. My AA extender functions correctly - no problems. no random on/off or poor contact.

In general I agree with Selfbuilt - the V11r appears to be correcting the various ills of the previous V10a/r series.

Which do I prefer? As my nephew said, the V10r (XP-G) has a really nice beam pattern. However between the V10a and V11r w/extender, both with XM-L LEDs, I slightly prefer the V10a for it's comparatively smooth white beam for an XM-L. The primary advantage to the V11r with the AA extender is battery type versatility.


----------



## MojaveMoon07

I am having a difficult time deciding between a Sunwayman V10A and a V11R with AA-extender. My family is interested in using only a rechargeable Sanyo eneloop AA battery.

The V10A seems to have a rock-solid rating in reliability and performance with members of this forum.

But I know that a family member would benefit from the higher maximum lumen rating for the V11R with AA-extender.

But there are several issues reported for the V11R that have me concerned:

-- an employee from an online retailer hidcanada named Jason expressed a criticism of the V11R [quoted immediately below]. There seems to be a lot of respect from customers here and on two other flashlight forums for the service received from HIDCanada for Sunwayman warranty repairs. So when a HIDCanada employee has a lack of confidence in a sunwayman model, I feel like that comment carries a lot of weight.

"_The biggest thing is the V11R is trying to be too much with poor execution. This says a lot since I'm a SWM fanatic..._"
source: post #17 in this thread _(link)_

-- due to the high resistance of the control ring, while adjusting the brightness the extender ring can become unscrewed thereby turning off the flashlight. But this may be an issue limited to the lubrication used for the control ring in the limited edition high CRI V11R

-- a customer reported that after several months of use, a rattle developed in three areas: the reflector, the head assembly, and switch. That customer also reported a "minor issue w/outgassing of internal plastic components that cause the lens/reflector to get cloudier over time as well"
see post #14 in this thread _(link)_

- and in pages 2 and 3 of this thread, there are several more reports of issues both with rattling and with the extender; furthermore, for some the suggestions for fixing the issues wound up only temporarily correcting the rattling


----------



## AFearlessBirdOfParadise

Well I don't have experience with the V11r (I'm deciding between the same two) the V10A values on this review are for the XP-G model, and the is a XM-L model out now, which should be brighter.


----------



## selfbuilt

AFearlessBirdOfParadise said:


> Well I don't have experience with the V11r (I'm deciding between the same two) the V10A values on this review are for the XP-G model, and the is a XM-L model out now, which should be brighter.


That's right, I never tested the XM-L-version of the V10A, so I don't know how it compares to the V11R+extender. It is probably pretty comparable.

I've carried both the V10A and V11R+extender as EDC, and would be fine with either frankly. I actually like the extra grip of the V11R better, and I've personally not had trouble with the head unscrewing or rattle. Although I can see how the head could unscrew, depending on the tolerances and lubrication (especially if you were to partially grip outside the control ring area, while ramping up).


----------



## borealis

MojaveMoon07 said:


> I am having a difficult time deciding between a Sunwayman V10A and a V11R with AA-extender.


They're almost identical lights, so the control ring resistance and the rattling could affect both models. It really just comes down to whether you want to be limited to AA in one case, or higher output and the CR123 option in the other.

Mine have a very slight rattle if you shake them close to the ear. The control ring on my V11R HCRI is a little tighter than stock V11R, and the first time it turned off on me due to the head unscrewing was a rude surprise. It's probably unnecessary, but I got into a habit of re-tightening the head after each use. If it becomes a real problem I'll just detach the head and remove some of that lube.


----------



## MojaveMoon07

Thank you all ; I'm grateful for the replies and help






The extra grip via the knurling of the V11R control ring appeals to me, too -- it seems like it'd make it easier to blindly locate the ring with little to no ambient lighting. I had read a comment that one person had put a skinny strip of duct tape along the control ring of the V10A to give it more grip. 

Since Sunwayman's website does not appear to have any specs for the XML version of the V10A, I'm relying on those provided by the retailers which list a maximum of 110 lumens while using an AA-battery. In contrast, the maximum lumens of the V11R XML using an AA-battery and extender was gauged by selfbuilt to be 190 lumens _(link)_. Since we would only ever be using AA-batteries, this is presenting a dilemma for me. The only means I have of approximately comparing these two lumen values is to compare our Fenix LD15 and 4sevens MiniAAx2 which are rated at 117 lumens and 180 lumens, respectively, by their manufacturers. The difference in brightness to me looks modest but appreciable. My interest in just the XML versions of the V10A and V11R is the wider hotspot; that's what I'm not considering the XPG V10A.

At the same time that I posted my previous post, I sent an email to hidcanada to hear as a retailer their perspective. The following is a paraphrasing of what they said. They've had quite a few reported issues with intermittent contact issues using the V11R and the AA extender. Their experience with the V10A XML is that it has a control ring that is initially stiffer than that in the V11R. And they also said to be aware that the V10A has a very slippery surface compared to the V11R.


----------



## awes

Hi,
can someone tell exactly why the variable regulation is less efficient than defined brightness levels? For example, Olight S10 (defined levels) runs in the moonlight mode for 15 days, V11R (variable) runs on minimal level for 2 days only. Both flashlight are current regulated. I know and it's obvious that variable regulation has some kind of overhead, but what is it in detail? What are the differences in their circuits?
Thanks!


----------



## borealis

awes said:


> Hi,
> can someone tell exactly why the variable regulation is less efficient than defined brightness levels? For example, Olight S10 (defined levels) runs in the moonlight mode for 15 days, V11R (variable) runs on minimal level for 2 days only. Both flashlight are current regulated. I know and it's obvious that variable regulation has some kind of overhead, but what is it in detail? What are the differences in their circuits?
> Thanks!


The chip that allows infinite variability eats up a few milliamps. I'm guessing ~10mA. Some math below.

In my experiments, the lowest current required to turn on the LED on a customized (for a low-low) V1*R is ~13mA. With an 850mAh battery, this might last ~ 850/13 = 2.7 days. So if another light can run for 15 days, and assuming the same battery/voltage, I'm guessing it only needs 2.3mA to turn on. In either case the low-low is pretty useless -- it's barely visible to dark-adjusted eyes.

Turn up the brightness to a useful level, and the difference in how long they last will start to disappear.


----------



## awes

Thanks borealis. I wonder if someone will ever build a variable regulated driver with a smaller overhead.


----------



## holylight

good review as usual. tyvm


----------



## Eric242

@ holylight

You made 16 posts today, always the same: "good review as usual. tyvm " What´s up with that?

Eric


----------



## holylight

Eric242 said:


> @ holylight
> 
> You made 16 posts today, always the same: "good review as usual. tyvm " What´s up with that?
> 
> Eric



after reading peoples hard work of reviewing, is fair i gave a pat on the sholder


----------



## xevious

I wonder if it would have been feasible for Sunwayman to provide a command to bypass the control ring circuit. Basically, you double click the power switch and whatever mode you're on is "locked". You double-click again to release and allow the control ring to change the brightness level. This way you in can get far better runtimes when locked, which is useful when you're going to be using the selected mode for a long while.


----------



## Native89

So, I've been EDC'ing this light for about a month and love it. I have never had a light with "infinitely" variable brightness and am new to the Sunwayman brand as well, but I have almost no complaints about it. Currently running my Neutral White XM-L version on a 16340 and still am amazed at the wall of light that this torch can put out.

If I had to nitpick though, there are two things that I noticed:

-I kinda wish this light had a bezel up clip. I rotate between this and a Quark123 and prefer the Quarks bezel up clip. Though, I can see why this is not the case as it would most likely interfere with the control ring.

-Still can't find a comfortable way to change output one-handed in the overhand position. Currently I just turn on the light overhand and then transition to underhand which is fine, but I still find awkward sometimes.


Having said that, the light is just perfect as and EDC with a really low low and blinding Max (already accidentally blasted myself with ~500lm) I find it really versatile. I also don't miss the flashy modes as much as I thought I would. Makes me really look forward to Sunwayman's future lights.


----------



## borealis

xevious said:


> I wonder if it would have been feasible for Sunwayman to provide a command to bypass the control ring circuit. Basically, you double click the power switch and whatever mode you're on is "locked". You double-click again to release and allow the control ring to change the brightness level. This way you in can get far better runtimes when locked, which is useful when you're going to be using the selected mode for a long while.


The control ring circuit doesn't set a "mode" -- it (probably) regulates the current. The bypass would have to have its own levels, like other multi-level lights.


----------



## JJohn

As I would want more throw than flood, should I try to locate an older version of the V10 that doesn't use a XM-L LED? Thanks for a great review but, since the only V10's that I have found for sale have the newer LED, I am left wondering will it be too floody for me? The light will be used for nighttime hikes where I sometimes find that too much flood, especially when its foggy or raining, hurts visibility.


----------



## selfbuilt

JJohn said:


> As I would want more throw than flood, should I try to locate an older version of the V10 that doesn't use a XM-L LED? Thanks for a great review but, since the only V10's that I have found for sale have the newer LED, I am left wondering will it be too floody for me? The light will be used for nighttime hikes where I sometimes find that too much flood, especially when its foggy or raining, hurts visibility.


Hard to say - the main difference is that "throwy" XP-G/XP-E lights can be dialed down lower, reducing spill (while maintaining the relative center beam intensity you want). Honestly, this has generally been my preference in an EDC, as I like to use as little light as possible to complete my task. That said, I've easily adapted to XM-L in the last couple of lights I EDCed. :shrug:


----------



## xevious

^ SB, I noticed that this light has displaced your ZL SC52 as EDC. Is the infinite brightness control what made the difference, or are there some other characteristics? What, if any, would you say is lacking about the SC52 in comparison? Also, how would you compare their beam outputs in terms of tint and artifacts/smoothness?


----------



## selfbuilt

xevious said:


> ^ SB, I noticed that this light has displaced your ZL SC52 as EDC. Is the infinite brightness control what made the difference, or are there some other characteristics? What, if any, would you say is lacking about the SC52 in comparison? Also, how would you compare their beam outputs in terms of tint and artifacts/smoothness?


Actually, the V11R has been my EDC for awhile (and the V10A before that - which replaced the SC51). I was just field testing the SC52 for awhle, before return to my old standard.

The main reason is the intuitive feel of the control ring to me. The SC52 is great, but I still occasionally miss-the-mark when getting my timings down - and I am very fussy about getting hit in the face with full power in low light conditions. That's another point of my personal preference - I use only as much light as I absolutely need for a situation, and I like being able to dial down the V11R to really low levels before activating. I am also not so concerned about runtime efficiency (normally an issue for me), because I am disciplined enough to recharge frequently (especially before any travel). 

And that's really about it - the beam doesn't matter so much to me, and both lights have a good beam. I actually prefer the throw of XP-G in small lights, but I have previously found you can used to almost anything.  I switched from the V10A (I had the XP-G version) to the V11R because I prefer the grippiness of the body and ring. 

Again, the above is just my personal preference - I wouldn't necessarily recommend one light over the other. But as always, it is worth asking yourself what really matters to you. I would have thought that beam pattern, profile and tint would be big issues for me, but the practicality of grip/user interface wins out in practice. :shrug:


----------



## xevious

selfbuilt said:


> Actually, the V11R has been my EDC for awhile (and the V10A before that - which replaced the SC51). I was just field testing the SC52 for awhle, before return to my old standard.
> 
> The main reason is the intuitive feel of the control ring to me. The SC52 is great, but I still occasionally miss-the-mark when getting my timings down - and I am very fussy about getting hit in the face with full power in low light conditions. That's another point of my personal preference - I use only as much light as I absolutely need for a situation, and I like being able to dial down the V11R to really low levels before activating. I am also not so concerned about runtime efficiency (normally an issue for me), because I am disciplined enough to recharge frequently (especially before any travel).


I can identify with your concerns. With recent efficiency improvements in LED emitters, the older flashlight models start looking a bit less appealing unless their emitters are upgraded. I'm pretty good about not using the highest settings for long periods, so runtimes between cell replacement with my lights are usually pretty good. Still, it's nice to extend that as long as possible. While the SC52 doesn't have the ease of variability that the V11R features, at least you can adjust the pre-programmed settings as you wish.



> And that's really about it - the beam doesn't matter so much to me, and both lights have a good beam. I actually prefer the throw of XP-G in small lights, but I have previously found you can used to almost anything.  I switched from the V10A (I had the XP-G version) to the V11R because I prefer the grippiness of the body and ring.
> 
> Again, the above is just my personal preference - I wouldn't necessarily recommend one light over the other. But as always, it is worth asking yourself what really matters to you. I would have thought that beam pattern, profile and tint would be big issues for me, but the practicality of grip/user interface wins out in practice. :shrug:


My first exposure to LED lights was via the Fenix brand. The L2S had a really nice smooth ringless beam pattern with a tolerable greenish tint. My NovaTac EDC and Surefire U2 that followed also exhibited very smooth transitions from hot spot to spill without glaring rings. But some other lights I've bought showed not only rings and blobs but even multiple tints (greenish/yellow rings with purplish/blue spills). If used outdoors it's not a big deal, but inside against smooth plain walls or over white paper the beam pattern becomes quite noticeable. I did discover that using a diffuser can smooth it over with no problem, which is great. So like you, I feel like the grip and UI is more important than the beam tint and artifacts. Still... if you can get it all in one package, it's nice. 

I've been itching to get an SC52w, but will have to give the V11R more consideration before making the plunge. Thanks again for all of your useful info. :twothumbs


----------



## selfbuilt

xevious said:


> My first exposure to LED lights was via the Fenix brand. The L2S had a really nice smooth ringless beam pattern with a tolerable greenish tint. My NovaTac EDC and Surefire U2 that followed also exhibited very smooth transitions from hot spot to spill without glaring rings.


I see we are from the same time period (a greenish Fenix L2S was my first "real" LED light too).  Of course, the reason you had nice beams is that you went for a luxeon III, SSC P4, and a luxeon V for your first three lights. :laughing:

There seems to have been a considerable shift to throw in recent years, possibly due to its inclusion in the ANSI FL-1 standard. I recall the hoopla from the first "turbo" head lights - even though they don't throw as far as many pocket models now (e.g. my Nitecore EC1 would out-throw my original Lumapower D-mini). Times change ...


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## xevious

selfbuilt said:


> I see we are from the same time period (a greenish Fenix L2S was my first "real" LED light too).  Of course, the reason you had nice beams is that you went for a luxeon III, SSC P4, and a luxeon V for your first three lights. :laughing:
> 
> There seems to have been a considerable shift to throw in recent years, possibly due to its inclusion in the ANSI FL-1 standard. I recall the hoopla from the first "turbo" head lights - even though they don't throw as far as many pocket models now (e.g. my Nitecore EC1 would out-throw my original Lumapower D-mini). Times change ...


Heh, pretty funny coincidence on the L2S! Yeah, the "need for throw" certainly pushed the market in a different direction. But if chatter I've been seeing is any indication of the next trend, I'm wondering if it will shift back more to tint and spill with less emphasis on throw. Or perhaps both will continue in parallel?

Anyway, I need to do more reading up on the various emitter brands and their models. The market has become quite crowded and ones I'd thought were going to fall by the wayside still seem to keep on innovating. It'll be interesting to see how it all pans out, if the more successful ones will buy out the lesser ones and we'll end up with only a few major emitter makers in the near future.


----------



## borealis

selfbuilt said:


> I would have thought that beam pattern, profile and tint would be big issues for me, but the practicality of grip/user interface wins out in practice. :shrug:


You could, of course, replace the stock LED with another and/or use diffuser film to address these issues.


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## SOUL PATROL 510

Hello all, Fist Thank you VERY much for the killer reviews on ALL THESE lights. I am currently looking into getting a good EDC single cell battery light.
I have narrowed it down to two possible lights.. The Jetbeam PC10 and the Sunwayman V11R.
My question is are there any other makes that offer similar adjustability as the V11R ?
Again thank you for the insight into this relm of lights as I have allways carried a cheap-o and am looking forward to "seeing" the differance.


----------



## cyclesport

SOUL PATROL 510 said:


> Hello all, Fist Thank you VERY much for the killer reviews on ALL THESE lights. I am currently looking into getting a good EDC single cell battery light.
> I have narrowed it down to two possible lights.. The Jetbeam PC10 and the Sunwayman V11R.
> My question is are there any other makes that offer similar adjustability as the V11R ?
> Again thank you for the insight into this relm of lights as I have allways carried a cheap-o and am looking forward to "seeing" the differance.



See attached...

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...ngs&highlight=magnetic+control+ring+IV+lights


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## bandit408

Been thinking of picking one of these up for EDC. Currently I have a Jetbeam RRT-2 and love it. Just need something a little smaller for EDC.


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## SOUL PATROL 510

bandit408 said:


> Been thinking of picking one of these up for EDC. Currently I have a Jetbeam RRT-2 and love it. Just need something a little smaller for EDC.


This light is awesome !! I had my reservations on spending close to $100 for a flashlight but I am glad I did. I especially like the ability to turn it all the way down to 1 Lumen, handy when fumbling around my bedroom at 5 a.m. whilst trying not to wake the wife:thumbsup:. It was a bit smaller than I had figured it would be which is great because I can barely even notice it is in my pocket. I highly recommend picking one of these up !! You won't be disappointed !!


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## Bumble

SOUL PATROL 510 said:


> This light is awesome !! I had my reservations on spending close to $100 for a flashlight but I am glad I did. I especially like the ability to turn it all the way down to 1 Lumen, handy when fumbling around my bedroom at 5 a.m. whilst trying not to wake the wife:thumbsup:. It was a bit smaller than I had figured it would be which is great because I can barely even notice it is in my pocket. I highly recommend picking one of these up !! You won't be disappointed !!



thats a bit expensive for it imo. $66.99 with aa extender + free world-wide registered shipping from fasttech. they have the "mirage" special edition v11r for $75 with shipping.


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## shelm

Bumble said:


> thats a bit expensive for it imo. $66.99 with aa extender + free world-wide registered shipping from fasttech. they have the "mirage" special edition v11r for $75 with shipping.



Do you like your v11r or your Eagletac's better? 66.99 including the aa extender sounds like a fair price. I do have Eagletac's and they are lovely.

Is there any mod to the titanium v11r switch cover? Maybe sandpaper rounding off the edges?


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## Bumble

hi, i have become hooked on this magnetic control ring design, it could be just a passing phase though lol. i love eagletac lights though ( beam profile/tint/build quality/runtimes) and still use them often as my edc . im currently using an eye 10 / rrt-01 (both magnetic control and very similar in design) as my edc. im not sure about the mod to the switch cover ? my wife has my v11r in her handbag at the mo..from memory it has a rubber boot covering the switch ?. i thought the earlier version v11r had switch issues which was cured with the rubber boot. ?. (im probably wrong though) lol


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## shelm

Bumble said:


> from memory it has a rubber boot covering the switch ?. i thought the earlier version v11r had switch issues which was cured with the rubber boot. ?



Hi, thanks!
All reviews and product photos including fasttac show that the v11r comes with the black rubber boot pre-installed and the titanium boot as spare part in the accessories bag. So you don't need to bother your wife. Rounding off the ti edges with sandpaper will be first thing when i get the v11r from fasttac


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## Bumble

shelm said:


> Hi, thanks!
> All reviews and product photos including fasttac show that the v11r comes with the black rubber boot pre-installed and the titanium boot as spare part in the accessories bag. So you don't need to bother your wife. Rounding off the ti edges with sandpaper will be first thing when i get the v11r from fasttac



ive had no problems with fasttech at all  they are like a breath of fresh air compared to some chinese companies ive dealt with. i really didnt think this magnetic control ring would prove to be so crucial in my "EDC pocket carry" as it has proven to be.. i just didnt think that having the exact light you need matters much tbh.. but in reality it proves to be very handy indeed. either the v11r/ rrt-01/eye 10 (all magnetic control) are great lights imo.


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## Dubois

shelm said:


> Do you like your v11r or your Eagletac's better? 66.99 including the aa extender sounds like a fair price. I do have Eagletac's and they are lovely.
> 
> Is there any mod to the titanium v11r switch cover? Maybe sandpaper rounding off the edges?



The Mirage comes with a rubber boot switch cover, and spare, but a titanium spare is no longer provided.

The beam of my DA25A (Ti, 2013 edition) is _*much *_nicer than the Mirage, which has artifacts against a white wall, in spite of the OP reflector.


----------



## Bumble

Dubois said:


> The Mirage comes with a rubber boot switch cover, and spare, but a titanium spare is no longer provided.
> 
> The beam of my DA25A (Ti, 2013 edition) is _*much *_nicer than the Mirage, which has artifacts against a white wall, in spite of the OP reflector.



eagletac.. if reading this thread magnetic control ring please


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## shelm

Dubois said:


> The Mirage comes with a rubber boot switch cover, and spare, but a titanium spare is no longer provided.



The Mirage (XM-L U3) never came with a titanium switch cover but i think that the black (XM-L U2) still comes with ti switch cover (in accessory bag) plus the black rubber pre-installed.

Seen that on FastTac photos :huh:


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## DHart

Selfbuilt... of course, your reviews are epic and relied upon by soooo very many, including myself, for a number of years. Many thanks to you for all of your ongoing efforts to help us select ever more lights for our use.

I have a V11R XM-L Neutral inbound. Also two D25A's: one with XM-L neutral in Ti and the other one with neutral XP-G2 R4 and black anodized finish. I'm eagerly anticipating comparing these lights for my own EDC use. I have a Nitecore D10 Neutral tint which I've carried for a few years, which hangs in the "EDC balance" with these new lights arriving. Whatever way it swings, will all work out just fine.

As for beam, I typically use my lights for general, fairly close-in use, both indoors and outdoors. When I step outside into more expansive nature, I often grab the little Jet I-Pro 3.0 XR-E R2, which is a great thrower for such a tiny pocket light. I love it for that convenience and amazing throw. 

Overall, though, I much prefer a soft, wide, neutral beam for general use and the XM-L Neutral lights are perfect for that... especially with the neutral tint, which is all I can bring myself to order in recent years. If a light isn't offered with neutral tint, I won't buy it, personally. The cold tints just look so harsh and clinical to me... as a professional photographer, the aesthetics of the tint does matter quite a bit to me. Tint is that significant. Fortunately, one can find some great options in lights these days with neutral tints... and major kudos to Eagletac for going above and beyond what other makers seem to do in terms of plentiful offerings with neutral tint emitters. SWM seems to be doing ok in that regard as well.


----------



## selfbuilt

DHart said:


> As for beam, I typically use my lights for general, fairly close-in use, both indoors and outdoors. When I step outside into more expansive nature, I often grab the little Jet I-Pro 3.0 XR-E R2, which is a great thrower for such a tiny pocket light. I love it for that convenience and amazing throw.
> Overall, though, I much prefer a soft, wide, neutral beam for general use and the XM-L Neutral lights are perfect for that... especially with the neutral tint, which is all I can bring myself to order in recent years.


Yes, I much prefer neutral white tints where available. That said, I've typically EDCed cool whites, which I don't find too bad as I run them at the lowest possible level for my needs (i.e., less garish when little light is used, somehow). For higher outputs though, definitely a neutral white fan. Years of incandescent conditioning, I guess.

Interesting to hear your Jet I-Pro 3.0 is still in use. A good little throwy light for the time period, and I always liked the IBS interface. Something like the Nitecore explorer series helps fill that gap now, with their XP-G emitters and relatively deep reflectors.


----------



## biker1

Great review as always 
I actually ordered the V11R just prior to reading your thread. A friend of mine had on and I really liked the interface, style, and build quality.
I've been carrying around my Incendio V3+ in various emitter configurations (currently with XM-L U2 emitter, with the U3 emitter on the way )for over a year now as my EDC. Great light, but I sometimes forget what level I last used, and when I light it up, it's on High, which gets a little annoying, cycling thru the levels and all. But that's with most lights this size.
When I saw the adjustable light level ring on the V11R, and my buddy told me it is a pleasure to use, I was like, I had to have one. The build quality looked really robust for a small light.
I'm looking forward to receiving mine in a few days, and most likely it will be my new EDC.

I also see they have the V11R with the XM-L U3 emitter available, but only in the 'Mirage' camouflagelike color.
I inquired about the XM-L U3 emitter as a stand alone drop in and am awaiting an answer.
Ricky @ Lumapower has always been fantastic with his customer service, as well as allowing you to be able to purchase the current drop in emitter assemblies only, so that you don't have to purchase a whole new light every time a new emitter becomes available.
Hopefully Sunwayman also allows you to purchase separate emitter assemblies.

Again, thanks for your fantastic review :twothumbs


----------



## borealis

It's not a "drop-in". SWM head is sealed (glued shut), so they'd have to send you the entire head, which will probably cost as much as the whole light. A few modders on CPF can replace the LED for you (for probably around $20-$30).


----------



## biker1

borealis said:


> It's not a "drop-in". SWM head is sealed (glued shut), so they'd have to send you the entire head, which will probably cost as much as the whole light. A few modders on CPF can replace the LED for you (for probably around $20-$30).


Thanks for that information.Much appreciated.I'll post the response to my email inquiry when I hear back.

Update:
Heard back from SWM, and at this time the LED head assembly is not being sold separately, but cs cc'd the emails to the CEO, and if things change they'll let me know. So who knows, maybe it'll happen. 
With that being said, I received my V11R today and the light is phenomenal in my limited use indoors, since I just received it. 
The XM-L U2 in the V11R appears to be perceptively brighter and whiter than the XM-L U3 in my Incendio V3. This is my first magnetic ringed light and I love the feature. 
The build quality is really nice and robust for such a small light, and it feels great in the hand. This is going to be my new EDC!


----------



## Howiezowie

selfbuilt said:


> 1x14500:



I noticed what was probably a typo in the legend of this graph: The legend has V11R runtime as 4hr 3min to 50%, while the graph indicates closer to _*3hr*_ 3min. I am guessing the 3hr is the correct value?

I've ordered this light, and very interested in runtimes for 14500, and considering modifying the AA Extender to accommodate 17500 batteries. 

*THANK YOU*, selfbuilt, for your amazing reviews and contributions here!! I'm a brand new member to CPF, and I'm in awe! 
:thanks:


----------



## selfbuilt

Howiezowie said:


> I noticed what was probably a typo in the legend of this graph: The legend has V11R runtime as 4hr 3min to 50%, while the graph indicates closer to _*3hr*_ 3min. I am guessing the 3hr is the correct value?


Yes, that sounds likely to me to - it's just a typo in the figure legend.

Glad you are finding the reviews useful. :wave:


----------



## Lite_me

KDM said:


> I received my v11r in the mail today. I've always liked the looks of this light and after reading your review decided to pull the trigger on one. Tried it first with the 16340 and was immediately impressed by the beam. *Opened the extender up and couldn't resist. Dremel time!* The AW17500 fits in there nicely. It's definitely a great little light for the money.


 I'm a bit late to the party but wanted to say that I just did this too. I've always felt that the V11R was a nice light, but at the same time under battery sized ..?, for the size of the light. I really like compact lights that aren't much bigger than the battery they hold. Couple examples would be the EagleTac D25A clicky, or even the ZL SC31 which is nice and tiny. 

What I wanted to say was, that this took a long time for me to get this extender opened up enough to fit the AW17500. Maybe I didn't have the right bits/tools to do the job, I don't know, but I had to stop and let the Dremel tool, as well as the extender cool off several times. Once, smoke was coming off the extender, but I think it was just the friction tape I had around it to secure it in the vice.  But I was able to get it done without any harm and it fits and works well. The additional runtime now seems adequate and more fitting to the size of the light. Win-win.


----------



## Blades

Everybody still loving their Sunwayman V11R's? I played with one at the Blade Show(and Preparedness Expo). I was impressed. 
Anybody have one and a Rotary 200? Wonder how the beam qualities compare.


----------



## DHart

Blades said:


> Everybody still loving their Sunwayman V11R's? I played with one at the Blade Show(and Preparedness Expo). I was impressed.
> Anybody have one and a Rotary 200? Wonder how the beam qualities compare.



I ordered the SWM V11R X-ML and a D25 at the same time. The V11R has very nice build quality and is a nice light indeed. I am surprised to find, though, that the rotary level control is more bothersome to me than I thought it would be and having infinitely adjustable output levels is less advantageous than I realized. Therefore, I have taken much more for the D25, with it's much smaller size and quick level changes. Through it all, I have really come to appreciate that the UI of the Zebralight tops them all... for me, anyway.


----------



## Humminbird

DHart said:


> I ordered the SWM V11R X-ML and a D25 at the same time. The V11R has very nice build quality and is a nice light indeed. I am surprised to find, though, that the rotary level control is more bothersome to me than I thought it would be and having infinitely adjustable output levels is less advantageous than I realized. Therefore, I have taken much more for the D25, with it's much smaller size and quick level changes. Through it all, I have really come to appreciate that the UI of the Zebralight tops them all... for me, anyway.



I've also had the V11R, SC51 and D25 clicky. Of these three my EDC for more than a year has been the D25. The UI is pretty much perfect after I locked out the turbo mode with a thin cardboard spacer. It never turns on accidentally in the pocket, unlike the other two. The V11R had a weak clip, I nearly lost it twice because of that. Also, the infinite adjustment did nothing for me. I ended up selling the V11R. I still occasionally use the SC51 though, love the UI but hate having it turn on in the pocket.


----------



## Blades

DHart said:


> I ordered the SWM V11R X-ML and a D25 at the same time. The V11R has very nice build quality and is a nice light indeed. I am surprised to find, though, that the rotary level control is more bothersome to me than I thought it would be and having infinitely adjustable output levels is less advantageous than I realized. Therefore, I have taken much more for the D25, with it's much smaller size and quick level changes. Through it all, I have really come to appreciate that the UI of the Zebralight tops them all... for me, anyway.





Humminbird said:


> I've also had the V11R, SC51 and D25 clicky. Of these three my EDC for more than a year has been the D25. The UI is pretty much perfect after I locked out the turbo mode with a thin cardboard spacer. It never turns on accidentally in the pocket, unlike the other two. The V11R had a weak clip, I nearly lost it twice because of that. Also, the infinite adjustment did nothing for me. I ended up selling the V11R. I still occasionally use the SC51 though, love the UI but hate having it turn on in the pocket.




Thanks for the information. I don't carry using a clip, so that isn't an issue. I like the adjustable light levels, and being able to set a level before I turn the light on is an advantage to me. Maybe it is time to sell the Rotary, no telling.


----------



## DHart

Humminbird said:


> I've also had the V11R, SC51 and D25 clicky. Of these three my EDC for more than a year has been the D25. The UI is pretty much perfect after I locked out the turbo mode with a thin cardboard spacer. It never turns on accidentally in the pocket, unlike the other two. The V11R had a weak clip, I nearly lost it twice because of that. Also, the infinite adjustment did nothing for me. I ended up selling the V11R. I still occasionally use the SC51 though, love the UI but hate having it turn on in the pocket.



We're each having a parallel EDC flashlight experience! While the V11R is a cool light, I've discovered that it's just not a good EDC light for me. Infinite level adjustment - meh. Dramatically larger form factor compared to the D25... not so great. D25 is the winner for me.

I find the SC51 to be an amazingly handy, useful, and superbly designed light. While I prefer the D25 for pocket EDC, I keep an SC51 neutral by the bed and another at my desk and use them both around the house and RV constantly!


----------



## moldyoldy

not to beat a dead horse any more, although I have done it twice now - inserted a 14500 AW Li-MN cell in backwards in to a V10 and now a V11R with the extender and pressed the switch. Both lights failed instantly. Both times the ambient light was low and I incorrectly thought the polarity was correct. wrong. grump. There appears to be NO reverse voltage protection in the V10/V11 series. The failure was clearly my fault. Sunwayman does not offer a replacement head for sale. The dealer could not help either.

I posted the failed V10a on the Marketplace for free and someone picked it up. I will probably do the same with this failed V11R. Not sure if someone has the driver electronics for a V11R.

Historically, I am moving out of the Li-xxx format and back towards the AA format. ie: no more multiple cell CR123a lights, only one light left in the 1x CR123a format. Either I will sell that or it will become a shelf queen. The 1x 18650 or 3x 18650 lights provide all the light I need at the high end. The Nitecore EA4 with 4x AA cells is a reasonable replacement with a lot more safety during use.


----------



## snakyjake

moldyoldy said:


> I am moving out of the Li-xxx format.



Why?


----------



## moldyoldy

snakyjake said:


> Why?



why? Primarily because of the very needed protection circuit in the Li-Ion chemistry which cuts off the current when the voltage drops too low. It is very unpleasant to be working in some dark location and have the light disappear. Yes, I might carry another light, but then I have to stop everything, be careful that I do not knock something down in the dark while hunting for the spare light.

Realistically, the RCR123a format commonly has a short run time compared with normal AA NiMh LSD cells. ie: with a 1x AA SC51, I obtain almost an hour at high lumens with a gradually decreasing output. The RCR123a format provides less than 30 min and cuts off. unacceptable.

I could carry my 1x 18650 light (SC600) or 3x 18650 (T60) light since the run time is long for most any nominal task, but then the size is increasing. In that case, I would rather carry an AA NiMH light with a long track record of consistent charging, performance and safety. I started the RCR123 format because of the fast self-discharge of the NiMH chemistry of that day and low output from the NiMH lights. The LSD cells solved that problem. Lights like the EA4 solved my lumens output problem - I often need 800-900+ lumens for the racoons in my back yard that screech at each other and keep me awake. I need to find them in the trees and bother them with the light. they usually get the message.


----------



## moldyoldy

BTW, ref my above commentary comparing the SC51/52 output & runtime on Eneloops vs the V11R output & runtime on RCR123/16340 or 14500 chemistries: 

Strictly speaking I was comparing apples and oranges since the V11R has a much higher output & the output can be dialed down. However, that is a good seque to observe that under normal use, I typically dial in a higher output level with the V-lights as compared with a light with fixed step output levels. Other posters have also observed this usage characteristic. Thereby the problem is that the V11R runtime winds up being a lot shorter than it should be if the output levels were matched. If the output levels were exactly matched, I suspect that the fully variable circuity would be less optimum (shorter run time) than a comparable light using a specific fixed level with the same cells.

Back on the thread topic: When used properly w/in it's limitations, the V11R is a really nice light with a high output and a nice floody beam that lights up rooms very well. I have had no problems with either the extender contact or the extender twisting loose when dialing in a light level. 

Also, another quirk of mine. I tried out several 2x cell lights in the long format and rather dislike that format. I strongly prefer the side-by-side format - short and stubby which in my opinion fits more easily into random pockets.


----------



## snakyjake

moldyoldy: For the reason you mentioned is why I switched to LiFePO4 from K2. No protection circuit, no cutoff, no explosion, more charge cycles. The runtime is less than than LiCo, but I don't recharge often, and don't mind when I do (maybe once a month). A lot of the lights unfortunately aren't optimized for NiMH or available. If you have more questions, post in the battery section so we don't take the thread too far on a tangent.


----------



## Blades

Well, sold my Rotary, bought a V11R, thanks for the reviews. I figure $69 shipped was a good price, and I am able to pay a little on a bill, put gas in my car.


----------



## Blades

My V11R showed up today and was excited to see this:






Woo-hoo! 7% more umph!! Thanks Going Gear!


----------



## srvctec

EDC'd my V11R from May last year until October or November. I guess I just needed to feed my flashaholism with a new light and got an Olight S10, which I've EDC'd since then. I've always thought the low and medium levels were too far apart (medium is just way too bright, IMO) for most of my needs, but really love the small size of the S10 and the magnet in the tailcap. 

I've been putting up with the brightness issue until tonight. I decided to EDC my V11R again so I can have the perfect brightness for any task. Can't believe how much I've missed being able to dial up the EXACT brightness I need. When the Nitecore SRT3 becomes available from Going Gear, that will be my new EDC.

Edit: The V11R will remain my EDC since the SRT3 is so HUGE- 1/8" larger in diameter and 5/8" longer than the V11R. The SRT3 has some cool features, I just don't want to carry something that big clipped inside my pocket.


----------



## selfbuilt

srvctec said:


> I've been putting up with the brightness issue until tonight. I decided to EDC my V11R again so I can have the perfect brightness for any task. Can't believe how much I've missed being able to dial up the EXACT brightness I need.


Yes, I continue to go back to my V11R (with AA-extender and 14500) for this exact reason. As much as I am fan of efficient current-controlled lights, the flexibility of precisely adjusting output with the continuously-variable ring is hard to beat.


----------



## holylight

selfbuilt said:


> Yes, I continue to go back to my V11R (with AA-extender and 14500) for this exact reason. As much as I am fan of efficient current-controlled lights, the flexibility of precisely adjusting output with the continuously-variable ring is hard to beat.



Agreed. This v11r and sc52 will be my edc light for a long long time.......


----------



## Gryffin

srvctec said:


> Edit: The V11R will remain my EDC since the SRT3 is so HUGE- 1/8" larger in diameter and 5/8" longer than the V11R. The SRT3 has some cool features, I just don't want to carry something that big clipped inside my pocket.





selfbuilt said:


> Yes, I continue to go back to my V11R (with AA-extender and 14500) for this exact reason. As much as I am fan of efficient current-controlled lights, the flexibility of precisely adjusting output with the continuously-variable ring is hard to beat.



What they said.

I love my SRT7, but geez looeez the SRT3 is huge, as big as some compact 2xCR123A lights. I stopped carrying my RRT-0 due to it's dimensions, which happen to be the same as the SRT3 — but the RRT-0 is only thick at the bezel, the SRT3 is an inch wide it's full length. And at least for the size, the RRT-0 throws like crazy, from what little I've seen the SRT3 reflector doesn't look to be deep enough to do the same.

This time of year, my EDC is usually just whatever AAA light is on my keychain (currently, Klarus Mi X6), unless I know I'll be out after dark, in which case I pack a 1xAA light, and that's *still* almost always the V11R+adapter. Gonna take a lot for another light to dislodge this one!


----------



## ChrisGarrett

I had a tan V10R that I loved for about a year and in April, I noticed a jump in output, right about 2/3rd into the rotation of the power ring and it was a substantial jump. I went to try it with a 123 primary and it wouldn't lite up at all. I used it pretty much exclusively with AW ICRs, IMRs and Soshine ICRs, so I don't know when the flaw started.

I contacted Battery Junction and got a RMA number at the end of April and they received it on May 1st, stating that they'd look it over and send it back to China, to SWM, to get fixed. Last week, I got a nice phone call from Battery Junction stating that they had heard back from SWM, who stated that they couldn't fix the V10R and didn't have any replacements to send me. Bummer.

I love the tan finish, as most stuff is black. BJ stated that they'd send me a new V11R XML-U2 in place of the broken V10R and I was happy with that level of service, as my light might have been over a year old. Only problem is is that the 11R only comes in black, or at least that's all BJ has to send me.

Customer service was great on BJs part, as they picked up the shipping to China and the light might have been out of warranty, I'm just not sure on that point.

It should be here Monday, so I'm looking forward fiddling with it and I may pick up the AA extender, as I have some Sanyo 14500s here to go along with my 16340s.

Chris


----------



## Gordo

I bought this light based on selfbuilt's recommendation and I'd like to add a question and a few comments.
Q: With the "ring" this light doesn't step down when the battery gets low like non-ringed lights. What does it do?

Comments: 
While I'm not bubbly over this light I'll keep and use it often. 
I wasn't really looking for another light but what sold me (besides the recommendation) was the ability to use so many different battery types. Happy.

Love the beam profile. Dislike narrow spotlight in lights this size. Very happy. 

Beam tint is not warm not cool. I keep trying to find that annoying dominate tint and I can't. Happy.

Wish the adjustment ring had a different texture. It's grippy enough but would prefer something to distinguish itself from the rest of the light more. Emphasis on "more". So it's not traction it's feedback to the user. Eh, nerve damage in the finger. What cha' gonna do?

In all what's so special about this light is it's lack of specificity. Almost perfect for an EDC light. From "very low" to "as high as you can expect" and everything in between. Common batteries to the most popular rechargeables. 

Hmmm. Maybe I like this light more than I thought.


----------



## selfbuilt

In terms of what happens when the battery is dying, the light just drops in output gradually -like most lights. Check out the runtimes in the main review for more info on different battery types.


----------



## MRaymond

Thanks for this review. I have just ordered this from "the jungle". I see that there is an upgraded version now (XM-L2 or XM-L U3), I wonder if it possible that I will be getting one of those even though the XM-L U2 was listed. We will see in a few days I suppose. Again, thanks for the review and the recommendations, I feel confident that I picked a good first EDC light.


----------



## wyoben

Okay after reading this review I am going to have to get myself one of these. Thank You for the review.


----------



## Impulses

Hmm, I'm really tempted by the discount llumination Supply is currently running on the V11R. $15 for the extender tube is the only thing keeping my temptation in check, seems a touch steep for that. The magnetic control ring is just so intriguing... Just as well tho, in the last 48 hours I've bought a Zebralight SC52, a SWM D40A, an Olight i3s, two tritium keychains, a diffuser, a bike mount, a GITD AA caddy plus some other random stuff... And I'm still considering a DGQ AAA IV for my keychain and an Olight S15 for leaving in my car!

The madness, to think it all started when I simply lurked around for a while researching Eneloops, years ago probably, came back a few times to fact check a few times... Eventually stumbled upon a review of the SC52 and I realized just how woefully inadequate that $5 9 LED 3xAAA flashlight I had was, added the SC52 to my Amazon wishlist and resisted the urge for the better part of last year... Came back just to make sure I really wanted the SC52 over some 47s I had also wishlisted, ended up getting three lights (possibly more) and a buncha stuff. 

I guess at least it's cheaper than lusting after camera lenses, HiFi headphones, or the newest video card, phone, etc.  Still though, the geek/engineer in me is really intrigued by that control ring... But I better just save my monies for now and try out the stuff I've splurged on, maybe tip Selfbuilt since his reviews were invaluable in figuring out how to part with my money and ditch the crappy lights I've been using.


----------



## ozzie_c_cobblepot

I got one on eBay with the AA extender for $74.95 shipped, a great deal. I plan on running it with AA Eneloops, but I'm curious about the extra output. I have an Xtar charger for my 18650s, which will also accommodate 14500s or 16340/RCR.

*Here's my dilemma. What is the second-best RCR battery, after the AW protected?*

I'd like to buy one RCR, to ascertain whether I prefer to run it at the higher level. If I like it, I'll make the AW order.


----------



## shelm

nitcore rcr123


----------



## ozzie_c_cobblepot

I noticed the latency is highest at the low setting, and unnoticeable at max - could this be an indication of how the magnetic control ring is implemented?


----------



## Capolini

Does the holster accommodate the light when the AA extender is on?


----------



## Newguy2012

@Capolini
yes


----------



## Capolini

Newguy2012 said:


> @Capolini
> yes


 
Thanks!!! I was not sure if ~5/8" difference would affect fitting the light in the holster! *   *p.s. I got the "Vinh" version [V11Rvn!] on sale last night! 900 LED lumens!


----------



## Dave D

I like the V11R, the only thing that I wasn't happy with was the belt clip. It wasn't as secure as I wanted so I drilled and tapped the V11R to accept a Nitecore Titaniumclip.

Picture below also shows my ZL SC52W fitted with the same clip.


----------



## Capolini

Dave D said:


> I like the V11R, the only thing that I wasn't happy with was the belt clip. It wasn't as secure as I wanted so I drilled and tapped the V11R to accept a Nitecore Titaniumclip.
> 
> Picture below also shows my ZL SC52W fitted with the same clip.




Looks great,nice job!! 

Do you use the holster or just the belt clip?


----------



## Dave D

Capolini said:


> Looks great,nice job!!
> 
> Do you use the holster or just the belt clip?



I tend to pocket carry using the clip so I can find it quickly. It will still fit in the holster, so it gives me a few carry options.


----------



## rexet

I also have the SC52w and I am tempted to buy the V11R with the AA extend. How would you compare the two Dave  ? I love the Zebra so much I'm afraid the V11R performances could disappoint me.


----------



## ozzie_c_cobblepot

What is the lowest an RCR can go with this light, for resting voltage? I saw that the light itself had an operating voltage range of 0.9 - 4.2V, but this may not be the answer.


----------



## ven

I feed mine on an imr16340 cell and lowest is very low still


----------



## selfbuilt

ozzie_c_cobblepot said:


> What is the lowest an RCR can go with this light, for resting voltage? I saw that the light itself had an operating voltage range of 0.9 - 4.2V, but this may not be the answer.


It will activate at any cell resting voltage above the protection circuit cut-off.


----------



## ozzie_c_cobblepot

What is the protection circuit cut-off for an AW RCR?


----------



## Dave D

rexet said:


> I also have the SC52w and I am tempted to buy the V11R with the AA extend. How would you compare the two Dave  ? I love the Zebra so much I'm afraid the V11R performances could disappoint me.



Sorry for the late reply I only just noticed your question!

They are two entirely different lights, the SC52w is more compact, even when using a CR123 in the V11R it is still bigger than the SC52w. THE V11R has a deeper reflector than the SC52w. I bought the extender ring for the V11R but I don't tend to use it because it makes the V11R bigger than I am happy to EDC.

The output adjust-ability on the V11R is nice and the output with a RCR123 is very impressive, I don't think you will be disappointed. I didn't like the clip that was supplied with it as I prefer something more secure.

With a RCR123 in the V11R it should only be used on high for no more than 5 minutes, however it doesn't automatically step down like the SC52w does after a minute.


----------



## ozzie_c_cobblepot

My V11R is intermittently not working. Other than freshly charged battery, cleaning and lubing threads, what else could I do?


----------



## ven

Have you checked the tail cap,all secure inside?


----------



## ozzie_c_cobblepot

I'll do that when I get home from work tonight, thanks


----------



## Tapis

Thanks for the review! I see in some pictures the push button covered with rubber and some without, just metal. Does someone know where or how I could buy this flashlight with a push button covered with black rubber? Thanks.

EDIT: sorry, checked on Illumination, it seems to come with both options


----------



## ozzie_c_cobblepot

If an RCR lasts me about a month, how long should I expect a CR123A primary to last? Ranges welcome.

I'll put a 3-6 month range as a starting guess.


----------



## selfbuilt

ozzie_c_cobblepot said:


> If an RCR lasts me about a month, how long should I expect a CR123A primary to last? Ranges welcome. I'll put a 3-6 month range as a starting guess.


That would really depend on how high you are running it on RCR. If you only use med-ish levels (on RCR), I would probably only expect a few extra weeks by switching to CR123A (at the equivalent outputs). If you commonly run the light at the higher levels on RCR (which CR123A won't match), then yes, you may get a few extra months on CR123A (but at reduced output compared to what you are used to).


----------



## ozzie_c_cobblepot

Is the mAh relevant? RCR at 650 and CR123 primary at 1500?


----------



## selfbuilt

ozzie_c_cobblepot said:


> Is the mAh relevant? RCR at 650 and CR123 primary at 1500?


That's part of it. What matters in terms of a cells ability to do work (i.e. power) is charge density by voltage. For for nominal 3.7V RCR at 650mAh that would be ~2400 capacity, compared to 3.0V CR123A at 1500mAh for ~4500. Of course, that depends if you trust those stated charge densities. But that does give you a rough guide if you plan to run the cells at the same drive levels (i.e., same outputs).


----------



## ozzie_c_cobblepot

I wonder if the next version of this light will have an off setting on the control ring. I agree that is a tick better of a UI.


----------



## Dave D

I have had my V11R for less than 12 months and have been pleased with it, however I dropped accidentally from about 18" onto a hard floor and it doesn't work at all now.

I've changed batteries, checked the switch and checked the PCB and wiring connections, nothing is loose.

I've emailed Sunwayman about getting it repaired but have heard nothing from them.

I'm disappointed that such a small drop has finished off what was a nice light!

Given the fragility of this light is makes me apprehensive about buying any more Sunwayman products.


----------



## Tapis

Sorry to hear that. I just received the V11R I ordered a few weeks ago with and extension tube and some Keeppower 14500 batteries. But the KP batteries happen to be too long and prevent the head from closing properly. Now I have to order from AW or Eagletac. These Keeppower batteries, although quite good in all tests I have read, have given me only headache so far.


----------



## Dave D

Tapis said:


> Sorry to hear that. I just received the V11R I ordered a few weeks ago with and extension tube and some Keeppower 14500 batteries. But the KP batteries happen to be too long and prevent the head from closing properly. Now I have to order from AW or Eagletac. These Keeppower batteries, although quite good in all tests I have read, have given me only headache so far.



I have the extension tube and found that the O ring fitted as standard was too big to allow the parts to screw together enough for the light to work, I fitted a thinner O ring and it all worked perfectly before the drop.


----------



## ven

Tapis said:


> Sorry to hear that. I just received the V11R I ordered a few weeks ago with and extension tube and some Keeppower 14500 batteries. But the KP batteries happen to be too long and prevent the head from closing properly. Now I have to order from AW or Eagletac. These Keeppower batteries, although quite good in all tests I have read, have given me only headache so far.




Iirc there are 2 14500 KeepPower cells,some 800mah and others 840mah,the latter are slightly longer. I have the 800mah and fit the v11r issue free when tested with extension(its only by luck and being a tight *beep* :laughing: as the 800mah were cheaper and thought no point in paying more for an extra 40mah).


----------



## Tapis

Wait a minute Ven, I'm stingy too and got the 800mah for exactly the same reason. But I cannot fit them in the V11R and its extension tube. When I tighten the ligh to the point that the inside electronic risk being crushed, a gap small still remains that renders the light unfunctional. How come yours work?

@ Dave - Thanks. Looking for a thinner O ring now, I wonder where... Still confused by Ven's comment though. Maybe he has forgotten he changed his O ring as well.

EDIT: No way! I took the two O rings off and the battery does not fit the light. Now I'm really confused




Or I'm just too chicken to tighten it until the end and risk damaging the light. Would love to hear from another user.


----------



## Newguy2012

You should tight it to the end. The tail uses a spring so I don't it'll get damage when you tighten it.


----------



## Tapis

Maybe the spring is all flatten at this point because it gets really really hard to tighten the light more. Also now I'm worrying that the Keeppower 16340 700mAh I ordered to use with this light without its extension will not fit as well.


----------



## Newguy2012

I use AW batteries. It seem the Keeppower 800mAh is 0.6mm longer than my AW. Did you try it with a regular AA to know is doesn't fit like your Keeppower? I wanted to get that battery too. Did you make sure the head is fully tighten to the extender before putting the extender to the body?


----------



## Tapis

The rechargeable Energizer I have fits in just fine. The Keeppower 800mAh is definitely longer than the Energizer, I would say about 1.5-2mm longer. I tried again, it's impossible to screw the parts fully with this battery. Waiting for some more confirmations.


----------



## ven

Hi there Tapis,a pic says a 1000 words so here is a few for you to show,its normal EDC form factor is 16340 for me,so pics with ext




14500 KeepPower 800mah cell in the v11r with ext now fitted




Thats how much it sticks out,around 1mm or 2mm more over the 16340

Together,no more resistance tightening head up,just the usual when nipping with O ring resistance.




On to show working with cell in




Hope of some help

To go one step further i got an efest 14500 IMR 700mah cell which is shorter than the KeepPower 14500 800mah

KP 800mah



Efest 700mah IMR




Cells side by side




A clear difference in length but both work fine,maybe an option using an efest cell :thumbsup: I know its not a perfect solution for you,just a thought :thumbsup:


----------



## Tapis

Thanks Ven, I appreciated you took time to send some photos. KP 14500 batteries definitely don't fit in my light. But I realized I have three packs of CR123 Surefire batteries left from an old 6PL I barely use anymore. They are valid until 2018 so I'd better use them before they go bad. Although I prefer the form factor of the V11R with the extension than without, I'm at least happy to know that these Surefire batteries won't be wasted. Now I need to shop for a new flashlight to feed the KP 14500 to, so they don't go wasted


----------



## ven

No problem at all i would invest in a couple of efest 14500 cells as they will fit for sure being a couple of mm shorter. Cheaper than buying another light...............no hang on that does not sound right!!! buy another anyway and some efest :laughing: after all we are flashaholics

ebay No 231241593777 and 261652242713 of course could buy the 1 for around $6 ish.


----------



## ozzie_c_cobblepot

I've dropped my V11R a couple of times, and it's none the worse for wear.


----------



## Taz80

I have a Keeppower 16340 700mah, while it is 2mm longer than my AW it fits without any problem. I have had trouble with the length of Keeppower batteries before though. I bought a pair of 18500's and 18350's that were to thick and long to fit my lights. I took off the outer wrap and removed the protection circuit. Then re-wrapped them with a much thinner wrap.


----------



## Tapis

I have been using this light for the past few days. The lowest 1 lumen is very useful when waking up in the middle of the night to go to the bathroom or check something in a drawer without disturbing anybody. My big frustration with this light is over the tailcap switch which is way too stiff for my liking. In the CR123 configuration (without the extender) you need to hold the light very firmly to be able to press the switch with your thumb, so firmly actually that you make a conscience effort to activate the light, and many times my other hand just comes to the rescue. My 3 year old cannot switch the light on, no matter how hard she tries.


----------



## Taz80

The switch on mine seems to be about the same as most of my other lights, maybe just a little stiffer. I don't have a three year old to test it on, but it doesn't feel that stiff. I have small hands though so its probably easier for me than someone with large hands.


----------



## Tapis

The switch in mine is actually so stiff that I had to find a new way to turn on the light, by pressing the bezel against the palm of my hand and using either my index or my middle finger to press it. I wonder if the other switch, the one without rubber cover, that came with the light is softer. Anybody knows how to dismantle the switch? Is it done from the inside or the outside?


----------



## cyclesport

Tapis said:


> The switch in mine is actually so stiff that I had to find a new way to turn on the light, by pressing the bezel against the palm of my hand and using either my index or my middle finger to press it. I wonder if the other switch, the one without rubber cover, that came with the light is softer. Anybody knows how to dismantle the switch? Is it done from the inside or the outside?



One of the nice things about the V11r is it's easily serviced and replaced switch assb. A pair of snap ring, or needle nose pliers removes the retaining ring making a switch swap simple. (*SWM uses a couple of diff size R. rings so make sure your replacement switch fits through ring) Also, haven't kept current w/this thread but it sounds like you're using the metal cap button cover? If so, they're notoriously hard to actuate since the cap catches the ring...ditch the cap for the rubber one for a much easier actuation.


----------



## Tapis

cyclesport said:


> Also, haven't kept current w/this thread but it sounds like you're using the metal cap button cover? If so, they're notoriously hard to actuate since the cap catches the ring...


I'm using the rubber cap button actually. I wanted to try the metal one see if it's any softer. Perhaps I should contact Sunwayman, they might send me a new rubber switch for me to compare.


----------



## cyclesport

Tapis said:


> I'm using the rubber cap button actually. I wanted to try the metal one see if it's any softer. Perhaps I should contact Sunwayman, they might send me a new rubber switch for me to compare.



If you haven't done so, try changing out the switch itself. (*Sunwayman used to ship the V11r with *two switches*, and one metal cap, and one rubber switch cap).


----------



## Dave D

Sunwayman replied to my email and have offered to repair my V11R FOC so It's currently on route to China. :twothumbs


----------



## ozzie_c_cobblepot

Revisiting the mAh question I posed, how do the runtimes compare for an AW RCR (750 mAh), Energizer CR123A Li primary (1500 mAh), Eneloop AA (1900 mAh), and Energizer L91 AA (3000 mAh)? I suppose the starting point for L91 runtime would be 2x the CR123a primary, which has been going almost 3 months and is at 2.85V.


----------



## selfbuilt

ozzie_c_cobblepot said:


> Revisiting the mAh question I posed, how do the runtimes compare for an AW RCR (750 mAh), Energizer CR123A Li primary (1500 mAh), Eneloop AA (1900 mAh), and Energizer L91 AA (3000 mAh)? I suppose the starting point for L91 runtime would be 2x the CR123a primary, which has been going almost 3 months and is at 2.85V.


Well, you can check out the review for actual runtimes on a number of sources.

But to estimate true capacity of a cell, you need to figure out work-hours, not just amp-hours. Easy enough to do - just multiple mAh ratings by nominal voltage for that cell type (W=VA). That will tell you what you need to know in cases where runtimes are not available.


----------



## ozzie_c_cobblepot

The CR123a Energizer primary went just a couple of days over 3 months - compared with about 1 month (give or take) for the RCRs. Now I've got the L91 in there with the extender, and with a lower voltage by half and double the mAh, my initial guesstimate is about 1 year, though this is probably a case where the math likely doesn't add up and it'll be more like 6 months.



selfbuilt said:


> Well, you can check out the review for actual runtimes on a number of sources.
> 
> But to estimate true capacity of a cell, you need to figure out work-hours, not just amp-hours. Easy enough to do - just multiple mAh ratings by nominal voltage for that cell type (W=VA). That will tell you what you need to know in cases where runtimes are not available.


----------



## Dave D

Well despite following the return instructions, supplied by Sunwayman, to the letter for my V11R to be repaired, the delivery man couldn't find their address!!

Apparently it's on it's way back to me undelivered.

So to sum up, 1 drop and it stopped working, Sunwayman's repairs address is so difficult to find that it couldn't be delivered, I'm down one flashlight and international recorded delivery to China!!

That's the first and last Sunwayman product I'll be buying!


----------



## Tapis

Dave D said:


> That's the first and last Sunwayman product I'll be buying!


Sunwayman makes great flashlights. Buy from a US or European dealer, not directly from China.


----------



## Dave D

Tapis said:


> Sunwayman makes great flashlights. Buy from a US or European dealer, not directly from China.



The point is that I buy a flashlight to use it, others have had similar issues, a one drop = dead is no good to me whether I have to send it to the US or Europe or anywhere else for repair. It shouldn't stop working after a small drop!!!

If I wanted a shelf queen then SWM fit the bill. I'm just glad that I didn't pay in excess of $100 for the Mirage version to have that die!


----------



## selfbuilt

Dave D said:


> The point is that I buy a flashlight to use it, others have had similar issues, a one drop = dead is no good to me whether I have to send it to the US or Europe or anywhere else for repair. It shouldn't stop working after a small drop!!!


Agreed - although that can happen to just about any flashlight without potted electronics. I've seen lots of failures from small drops across most manufacturers. And for what it is worth, this particular V11R has been on my EDC almost exclusively since the time of this review, without incident (and it has had a lot of drops). Again, n=1 is not a good indication either way, but I don't see any evidence of a systemic problem unique to this model.

I also know from experience that returning lights to China for repair can be haphazard, even when printing out the return address label. I have had a couple return to me unopened by the post office, with an undeliverable notice. Certainly frustrating, given the high cost of shipping from here.


----------



## Tapis

I made the huge mistake to buy Keeppower batteries for this light, 16340 and 14500 to use with the extension module. None of them fits. I feel cheated. From now on, I will stay away from this brand of batteries and choose AW or Eagletac instead.


----------



## recDNA

I agree. They are larger than AW and don't hold charge as well. My safefire 17670 is narrower than Keeppower 16660.


----------



## ozzie_c_cobblepot

Would love to see a V12R with no delay on the lower modes, and re-introducing the off setting on the selector switch. The delay only affects functionality to the extent that it makes signaling harder the lower the level (to being impossible at the lowest), where a traditional forward clicky would usually have signaling in its list of pluses.


----------



## Dave D

Just an update on my V11R that stopped working after one drop and was returned to Sunwayman for repair only for the post man to be unable to find their address, it was finally returned to me after 4 months on it's travels to China and back to Spain.

Sunwayman offered a new light at a discount if it didn't arrive back with me and they have offered to repair it if I again send it to them.

To my surprise, when I opened the package I found that my V11R now works, perhaps it just needed a holiday!!!


----------



## Phlogiston

Could be a loose connection or something, jarred back into place by rough handling in transit. I'd be leery of trusting that light too much. Do you carry a backup light, just in case?


----------



## ozzie_c_cobblepot

Doesn't everybody carry a backup? The question is what's your backup to that.


----------



## Dave D

Phlogiston said:


> Could be a loose connection or something, jarred back into place by rough handling in transit. I'd be leery of trusting that light too much. Do you carry a backup light, just in case?



I've always got a Tank007 E09 on me, with a Lithium Primary, which has proved to be a very reliable back up.


----------



## recDNA

Will the v11r work safely with a flat top battery? I have an extension tube that is bored out and I would like to try an efest 16500 imr battery but I can't tell by looking if it will work in the v11r. Has anyone tried any type of flat top battery in it? I don't want to waste money buying the efest if it won't work. Thanks


----------



## selfbuilt

recDNA said:


> Will the v11r work safely with a flat top battery? I have an extension tube that is bored out and I would like to try an efest 16500 imr battery but I can't tell by looking if it will work in the v11r. Has anyone tried any type of flat top battery in it? I don't want to waste money buying the efest if it won't work. Thanks


Sorry, I haven't tried that cell, but it should work. The positive button is raised from both the black surround (plastic disc) as well as outer metal ring in the head (at least on both of my samples). Would be good if someone with explicit testing can confirm with that battery, though.


----------



## ShineOnYouCrazyDiamond

I've used flat top eFest 18350 IMR Purple cells on my V10R with no problems. Basically the same design as the V11R so I would think it would work.


----------



## recDNA

Ok, I was thinking of trying an efest flat top imr 16500 but if the flat top touches the metal in middle and in ring it would short circuit at about 10 amps right? The middle button of the head doesn't seem to protrude on mine.


----------



## selfbuilt

recDNA said:


> if the flat top touches the metal in middle and in ring it would short circuit at about 10 amps right?


That would be the main concern, indeed. Depends on how much of the metal is exposed on that efest battery. The inner diameter of that outer metal ring on the V11R is >12.3mm on my samples. Every flat-top 14500 I've seen has been <8.0mm of exposed metal. But I agree, it's not something you really want to take a chance on unless you are sure.


----------



## recDNA

It's a shame. I have a bored extender and 16500 would give me much better run time but I'm afraid to take the chance. If the battery rattles around at all and touches that outer ring I would have a grenade in my hand. I could just add a second extender and go with a button top 16650 but then it is a little large. Too bad nobody makes 16500 with button. Thanks for your input!


----------



## Crazyeddiethefirst

recDNA said:


> Will the v11r work safely with a flat top battery? I have an extension tube that is bored out and I would like to try an efest 16500 imr battery but I can't tell by looking if it will work in the v11r. Has anyone tried any type of flat top battery in it? I don't want to waste money buying the efest if it won't work. Thanks



I am currently using an Efest 700mah flat top in my V11 without any problems. I have EDC it with flat top Efest for a few months without any problem. The center post is actually protruding enough to make contact, even though by visual inspection it looks flush. BTW, this is a V11rVN, but none of the mods have any bearing on the positive terminal connection. Just to be sure, I tried a flat top on my stock V11r Mirage-worked just fine.


----------



## recDNA

Crazyeddiethefirst said:


> I am currently using an Efest 700mah flat top in my V11 without any problems. I have EDC it with flat top Efest for a few months without any problem. The center post is actually protruding enough to make contact, even though by visual inspection it looks flush. BTW, this is a V11rVN, but none of the mods have any bearing on the positive terminal connection. Just to be sure, I tried a flat top on my stock V11r Mirage-worked just fine.



Good info. Now to find a 16500 in stock. I have stock & rvn models.

The funny thing is batteryjunction said "not recommended" but I got no answer from swm when I asked them.


----------



## Woods Walker

I noticed the stated low was 1 lumen for 35 hours. That seems really really bad in terms of efficiency, granted it's different electronics than a light with set modes. Am I miss reading something in the specs?

*Max: 216 Lumens (1.5hrs)
Min: 1 Lumen (35hrs)*


----------



## selfbuilt

I wouldn't put a lot of faith in min specs - for either output or runtime. Both can be pretty variable. But in general, circuit overhead can be high on lights with control rings. I would certainly consider SWM above average in that regard.


----------



## ozzie_c_cobblepot

I do not understand how to reconcile the following values for the V11R runtime on max output (to 50%):

1. 1xCR123a (1500 mAh, 3.0V) ==> 1:18
2. 1xEneloop (2000 mAh, 1.2V) ==> 0:50
3. 1xEnergizer L91 (3000 mAh, 1.5V) ==> 1:25

I cannot wrap my head around how the Eneloop has more mAh, a lower operating voltage, and yet somehow has a lower max runtime compared with the CR123a primary.


----------



## selfbuilt

ozzie_c_cobblepot said:


> I do not understand how to reconcile the following values for the V11R runtime on max output (to 50%):
> 
> 1. 1xCR123a (1500 mAh, 3.0V) ==> 1:18
> 2. 1xEneloop (2000 mAh, 1.2V) ==> 0:50
> 3. 1xEnergizer L91 (3000 mAh, 1.5V) ==> 1:25
> 
> I cannot wrap my head around how the Eneloop has more mAh, a lower operating voltage, and yet somehow has a lower max runtime compared with the CR123a primary.


Yes, that is what you would expect. Work = Voltage * Capacity. So the CR123A has a higher ability to do work than a NiMH (4500 vs 2400, in the example above). The only reason the runtime isn't even lower on NiMH is because output drops off over time (as shown in the graphs).


----------



## ozzie_c_cobblepot

Hmm, not sure about that. Energy = voltage * current. Power = energy/time, or VI/t. But VI*t, which is voltage * capacity, is something else.

At first I thought the LED was lit via current, constant current. A higher voltage cell would need an increased resistance to achieve the same current as a lower voltage cell. But that doesn't really make sense - the loss to the resister would be brutal.

So I think the answer lies in the formula for energy (and power, for that matter). Energy = VI, which explains the inverse relationship between V and I. The LED is not lit by current, but by current x voltage! So this explains that doubling the voltage halves the current outflow.

And mAh remains a measure of juice capacity, the area under the current curve.


----------



## selfbuilt

ozzie_c_cobblepot said:


> Hmm, not sure about that. Energy = voltage * current. Power = energy/time, or VI/t. But VI*t, which is voltage * capacity, is something else.


No, Power = Voltage * Current (i.e., the Power Law equation). And since Power = Energy/Time as you point out, solving for Energy (aka Work) = Voltage * Current * Time.


----------



## ozzie_c_cobblepot

Thank you for the correction! I think the remaining stuff is correct though, if superfluous.

When thinking about the brightness of the LED, I was thinking more about just a simple bulb. Fixed resistance, I would expect it brighter as either voltage or current increase, I think.


----------



## selfbuilt

ozzie_c_cobblepot said:


> When thinking about the brightness of the LED, I was thinking more about just a simple bulb. Fixed resistance, I would expect it brighter as either voltage or current increase, I think.


Yes, it is not like for LEDs - efficiency decreases as you increase output (current) to the emitter. Also, if the voltage source is too low to drive the LED directly (e.g. AA), you need to use a voltage boost circuit (which further saps efficiency somewhat). Beyond that, it comes down to the specifics of how the circuit manages all power needs of the LED (e.g. PWM vs current-control, multi-power source requirements, etc).


----------



## mattodio

Thanks for the detailed review as always. After reading this and your m11r review I think this is the light I want to purchase. It seems like it would be a little easier to operate with one hand. I only wish it came in the tan anodizing like the m11r but the black will have to do.  I'm also hoping the diffuser for my nitecore ec1 can be easily made to fit the 0.1 inch smaller head. . .


----------



## selfbuilt

mattodio said:


> Thanks for the detailed review as always.


:welcome:


----------



## Nighted

Wow, what a fantastic review!

I've been looking hard at this light for a while now. Really want to try one of these variably adjustable lights and this is the best one I've seen that could comfortably replace my Fenix PD20. Love the size of the PD20, perfect for pocket carry and fits my hand beautifully.

Also considering the EagleTac D25C clicky to replace my PD20. Argh....decisions. I think I'll likely just end up getting them both. 

Now to find a replacement for my beloved Fenix TK12. Thinking Klarus XT12 V2 or EagleTac T25C2. Oh man, such a saturated market and so many excellent lights. What a wonderfully ambivalent conundrum!


----------



## ozzie_c_cobblepot

Is there any way to increase tactile resistance of the control ring? After 2 years of EDC, it swims compared to a new model.


----------



## louie

ozzie_c_cobblepot said:


> Is there any way to increase tactile resistance of the control ring? After 2 years of EDC, it swims compared to a new model.


I rebuilt mine after the ring went totally loose after a year or so. I am using Nyogel 767A, a damping grease, and it's working well after nearly a year. I don't know how long this damping grease will last. It is a little stiff when cold, and loosens up a bit when warm. But, it is much better than the OEM grease, which turned to hardened solid.

I got my grease from Microtools in Vacaville CA USA. It's supposed to be used in lens rings.


----------



## ShineOnYouCrazyDiamond

I use 1500 weight helical grease. It has both sticky and damping properties. That means it helps slow the movement of the ring and at the same time helps it stay put at the setting you put it at.


----------



## recDNA

The worst part for me would be taking it apart to put in the grease.


----------



## ShineOnYouCrazyDiamond

A PITA if you don't have the right tools. If you do have the right tools to crack it, it's a breeze and will always be cracked for future touch ups.


----------



## apisdorf

Can you tell me what the right tools are? I am considering getting two strap wrenches to try to not mar the finish but if there's something better, I'd like to know. Thanks!


----------



## louie

apisdorf said:


> Can you tell me what the right tools are? I am considering getting two strap wrenches to try to not mar the finish but if there's something better, I'd like to know. Thanks!


My general method to undo light parts is to use ordinary rubber strap wrenches, a couple of sets so I have 2 small, 2 large, or a combination available. Also a soft cover tubing vise (AKA a bicycle workstand clamp), an electric hot air gun, and some bits of rubber strap from a broken strap wrench. V11Rs I've seen are not hard to undo, so I try just strap wrenches first. If that fails, I wrap the part in some extra rubber strap and clamp it into the vise, then try a strap wrench. If that fails, the next step is to heat the part until "smoking hot" as Loctite weakens at 450F. According to Loctite specs, boiling a part in water should not have high enough temperature to have an effect. 450F can damage internal plastic parts, harden grease and melt plastic lenses, reflectors, and solder, so caution is advised. If the manufacturer did not use Loctite (used epoxy or something), heat won't have any effect. Often, quite a bit of torque must be used to loosen a head. Often the light slips in the vise, and/or the straps slip, and I just retighten and keep yanking. I try to do this with the battery tube installed in hopes that it will be harder to crush.

V11Rs have sloppy Loctite that should be scraped off; I use a dental pick, mini screwdrivers, toothbrush, etc. When reassembling with Loctite, note that it does not work on aluminum, anodized aluminum, and other non-ferrous metals, so you have to use an activator.


----------



## ShineOnYouCrazyDiamond

One of the machinists here on CPF made me a special set of wrenches to crack the V10R heads. They fit over the head parts and can be tightened down with a bolt to lock them in place. Then it's just a matter of brute force.

Prior to that I used the strap wrenches, leather straps, heat, etc. It worked but it was really hard and tedious and sometimes left marks.


----------



## apisdorf

Thank you both for the insights. I'll start with the strap wrenches and see how it goes. By the way the light with the issue is a V11R Ti in case that changes any of your advice.


----------



## louie

apisdorf said:


> Thank you both for the insights. I'll start with the strap wrenches and see how it goes. By the way the light with the issue is a V11R Ti in case that changes any of your advice.



A tubing vise, or V-blocks in a vise, with rubber padding, helps tremendously in conjunction with the strap wrenches. I doubt I could get many lights apart without the vise, and just strap wrenches.


----------



## apisdorf

Okay; thank you for the advice!


----------



## gunga

Where does one get the helicoil grease?


----------



## gunga

Sorry. Double post.


----------



## recDNA

ShineOnYouCrazyDiamond said:


> A PITA if you don't have the right tools. If you do have the right tools to crack it, it's a breeze and will always be cracked for future touch ups.


The right tools AND the knowledge and you have more than 99.9% of members here and 100% more than I do! LOL
Next time you do one it would be cool if you get a chance to video it to youtube.


----------



## recDNA

ShineOnYouCrazyDiamond said:


> One of the machinists here on CPF made me a special set of wrenches to crack the V10R heads. They fit over the head parts and can be tightened down with a bolt to lock them in place. Then it's just a matter of brute force.
> 
> Prior to that I used the strap wrenches, leather straps, heat, etc. It worked but it was really hard and tedious and sometimes left marks.


Oh god I'm totally out of luck then. I lack brute strength as well!


----------



## gunga

Note. I have had great success using v-jaw slip joint pliers (by Irwin) with pieces of strap wrench. Very effective on many lights including sunwayman.


----------



## louie

gunga said:


> Where does one get the helicoil grease?


Micro-tools.com has many lens repair greases, but I can't tell which one is best for a given purpose. Also, there are comments that Micro-tools' prices are too high and you can try eBay etc. 

I took a guess and bought Nyogel 767A from them and find it to my liking for these rings, but pretty stiff. It also worked great in an old turntable cueing device. Ordinary greases don't have the sticky damping action.

The #1500 helical grease is here:

http://www.micro-tools.com/store/P-HG-1500/Helical-Grease-1500-15ml.aspx

$32.52USD for 15ml!


----------



## gunga

Woah. Would nyogel 760 work?


----------



## ShineOnYouCrazyDiamond

I think that's the same helical grease that I got, but I got it from Amazon for a similar price. The cost has paid for itself since I've probably redone about 30-40 V10Rs if not more between mods and upgrades. I also used it on the HDS Rotary tailcap to tighten it up a bit. There's still enough for a lifetime supply, probably, but I'm trying to find other uses for it.


----------



## apisdorf

Okay; I managed to crack the loctite -- and I didn't even scratch the finish. All with the two strap wrenches that were delivered 30 minutes ago. I must be stronger than I thought. Now I just have to wait for the #1500 helical grease I ordered from Japan on eBay ($25). :-(


----------



## recDNA

It's funny - my v11r ring is not that loose but when I pull it from my pocket it has always moved from the mid-way point I leave it on to max. What the heck makes it turn? It never turns down to min. Always max. Weird.


----------



## ShineOnYouCrazyDiamond

recDNA said:


> It's funny - my v11r ring is not that loose but when I pull it from my pocket it has always moved from the mid-way point I leave it on to max. What the heck makes it turn? It never turns down to min. Always max. Weird.



I know this sounds odd - but put it in the other pocket clipped the same way and see if it turns in the other direction. My thought is that your walking/rubbing motion is causing the turn.


----------



## louie

gunga said:


> Woah. Would nyogel 760 work?


Nyogel 760G isn't a damping grease, and will give minimal resistance in the friction ring.


----------



## gunga

Ah thanks. I don't know nyogel.


----------



## apisdorf

apisdorf said:


> Okay; I managed to crack the loctite -- and I didn't even scratch the finish. All with the two strap wrenches that were delivered 30 minutes ago. I must be stronger than I thought. Now I just have to wait for the #1500 helical grease I ordered from Japan on eBay ($25). :-(


My $25 #1500 helical grease finally arrived from Japan. I greased the ring and it's working great! Now I just have to find a use for $24.50 worth of Japanese helical grease...


----------



## ven

apisdorf said:


> My $25 #1500 helical grease finally arrived from Japan. I greased the ring and it's working great! Now I just have to find a use for $24.50 worth of Japanese helical grease...




Thats easy.............just buy another 49 v11r's


----------



## ShineOnYouCrazyDiamond

Or re-lube the ring once a month for the rest of your life.


----------



## ozzie_c_cobblepot

Are there any videos on how to do this? I'm not gonna buy tools just for this when a new V11R is 40$. Can it be done with just a wrench?


----------



## apisdorf

I used two strap wrenches, some elbow grease, and some helical grease. Cost: About $44. Also, I did this for a V11R Ti which cost more than $40. 

This link helped me (along with this thread): http://www.theoutdoornerd.com/2013/09/how-to-re-pack-control-ring-for.html?m=1


----------



## louie

ozzie_c_cobblepot said:


> Are there any videos on how to do this? I'm not gonna buy tools just for this when a new V11R is 40$. Can it be done with just a wrench?



You'll go crazy if you try to cost justify all your flashlight related expenses here. You are investing in the tools for future light work!

Really, you can start with rubber strap wrenches, $5USD. Sometimes, you need extra clamping power, like some pliers used with rubber or leather protection pads (scraps) or a vise system. You need to unscrew the head, but not mar or damage it. You need to keep track of all the little parts. The grease is expensive, as we've noted.

A video won't really show the variation in difficulty in unscrewing some heads. IMO, this is where experience and skill comes in.


----------



## ozzie_c_cobblepot

I'm curious now, and might forget by the time I'm home... What is the beam profile of the V11R compared with the SC600 and/or the SC62?


----------



## srvctec

I'm not sure why expensive helical grease is being used in these lights when this damping grease is absolutely perfect. 

http://www.dx.com/p/excellent-performance-damping-grease-50g-112202#.VpKog8tMHqA

My V10R stock grease dried up within a few months of purchase and I got a container of the above grease which is the same stuff used in binoculars and telescopes and will never dry up. I re-lubed my V10R a couple years ago and it's like I did it yesterday. I no longer EDC the light as I've moved on to a Zebralight SC62w.


----------



## recDNA

apisdorf said:


> My $25 #1500 helical grease finally arrived from Japan. I greased the ring and it's working great! Now I just have to find a use for $24.50 worth of Japanese helical grease...


Offer to do it for members for five bucks and we pay shipping. Everything after the first 5 is gravy and you'll get real good at it.


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## Vedran

Hi all,

I am new here on this forum, and I have question about flashlite V11R.

I buy flashlite V11R before 2 days and I notice that on my v11r don't have serial number on body of flashlite, second notice is that tail cap is not same like on picture (with sunwayman logo), tail cap is rubber with lots of dots, and spare metal tail cap also don't have sunwayman logo, it is that normal or it is fake?!

I buy this from ebay, it is in original box, with holster, spare rubber cap, spare metal cap, second switch, 2x spare O-ring, lanyard, warranty card, and user manual.

Sorry for my bed english.

Regard


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## Tejasandre

Newer v11r's were shipped with rubber tail boot $ & spare metal button. Not sure about the serial number.


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## selfbuilt

Vedran said:


> I buy flashlite V11R before 2 days and I notice that on my v11r don't have serial number on body of flashlite, second notice is that tail cap is not same like on picture (with sunwayman logo), tail cap is rubber with lots of dots, and spare metal tail cap also don't have sunwayman logo, it is that normal or it is fake?!


I've noticed that newer V11R ship with the rubber tailcap installed, and the spare metal one is missing the logo. And the serial number isn't there any more either. So it looks like you are fine, this is the new normal.
:welcome:


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## Vedran

OK, tnx for reply, I can now send positive feedback to seller on ebay.

I watch many reviews and in all this reviews is tailcap with logo (rubber or metal), and every flashlite have serial number, but if you say that is normal, i will belive you! 


Sorry for my bed english!!


Regard


Here is what it looks like http://www.canadianwildernesssurvival.com/index.php/reviews/391-sunwayman-v11r-with-aa-extender-review?hitcount=0


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## cityofthesouth

Olight 14500s seem to be too long with the AA extender for me. Anyone else have this issue? Seller told me to start the return process (USA) but I'm thinking if the Olight cells just don't work I'm not going to bother. The light closes up perfectly without a battery in it, then closes with a noticeable gap with the 14500 in it. Works great with an RCR123 (w/o the extender obviously) and the Olight 14500s work perfectly in my Crelant V11A.




Vedran said:


> OK, tnx for reply, I can now send positive feedback to seller on ebay.
> 
> I watch many reviews and in all this reviews is tailcap with logo (rubber or metal), and every flashlite have serial number, but if you say that is normal, i will belive you!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sorry for my bed english!!
> 
> 
> Regard
> 
> 
> Here is what it looks like http://www.canadianwildernesssurvival.com/index.php/reviews/391-sunwayman-v11r-with-aa-extender-review?hitcount=0



For what it's worth, mine is the same way - no SN and no logo on the titanium button. Didn't bother with the titanium tail cap because to me it's another case where a material was used due to its prestige rather than its appropriateness in the application.


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## jon_slider

_The purpose of my post is to ask if anyone here owns both a V11R AND a light meter. If so, could you PM me so we can discuss a test?

__thanks!_

backstory:
I had a chance to experiment with a V11R on my light meter, and discovered it is very sensitive to its position in the earths magnetic field. If I rotate it 180 degrees, it changes brightness… here is a video (Im not touching the control ring, just rotating the whole light. The piece of paper taped to the tail is just to make it obvious the light is being turned)

Having seen this actual behavior on a light meter, I put a lot more weight in the comments that selfbuilt originally made in post #1, when he noticed the unstable brightness of the V11R. In my video you will see *the V11R goes up to 122 lumens and down to 62 lumens, depending on orientation*: (this is on 16340)


here are the comments selbuilt made in post #1 (he underplays them and says it does not matter to him that the light is unstable, and that most people without a light meter, would not be aware of the instability)



selfbuilt said:


> The circuit glitch of *not maintaining the initial set output* level on 3.7V Li-ion sources is a bit strange
> 
> The initial sub-maximal *output levels set by the ring are not full stable on Li-ion batteries, but rapidly rise and slowly drop-off over time*, eventually settling at a much lower stabilized level.
> 
> (On 16340):
> One oddity however – on all levels below Max levels, *the light doesn't hold its initial output*. Rather, it drops off over time, eventually stabilizing at a level <60% lower than the initial output.
> 
> This may be a quirk of my one sample, but on 1xRCR it actually rises in output slightly over the first 1-2 mins, before starting off on its descending trajectory
> 
> (On 14500):
> But the same pattern of shifting output over time (with a *delayed stabilization*) is observed here. Indeed, it was even more pronounced on all my 14500 cells – there was a clear *increase in output over the first 3+ mins, sometimes rising by as much as 30%*, before descending into a gradual drop-off. As before with 1xRCR, *the light eventually leveled off somewhere <40% of its initial output level*.
> 
> Note I observed this on a number of 14500 and RCR cells (including different brands), and the effect seemed to be consistently greater on 14500. Interestingly, if you scroll back up the standard AA runtimes, you'll note something similar (but far less pronounced) seemed to be occurring there too.


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## Crazyeddiethefirst

I have 6 V11r's, and just ordered a light meter-upon receiving it, I will pm you(3-4 weeks estimated till delivery). I also have quite a few other lights with control rings-have you notes this behavior on any other lights?


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## gunga

I think it's defective. I never noticed that before.


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## jon_slider

gunga said:


> I think it's defective. I never noticed that before.


A light meter is required to show the lumen changes Im talking about.

Selfbuilt says his V11R has the “quirk” too, and that most people wont notice the brightness changes by eye. The quirk did not make him stop carrying the light. Like most people, he does not care about things he cannot notice in use, even if its detectable with a meter:

From post 1:


selfbuilt said:


> This may be a quirk of my one sample
> ...
> this drop-off was still gradual enough that *you will not notice it happening by eye*.
> ...
> I don't know if this was a quirk of my one sample, but it is not a problem in practice – the change in output is gradual enough for you* not to notice by eye*
> ...
> The circuit glitch of not maintaining the initial set output level on 3.7V Li-ion sources is a bit strange, but *not really a problem in use*



here is a test on low, with a Maratac as a control:


In my V11R test at 1.7 lumens, the change was +0.8 lumens, to 2.5 lumens
On medium of 62 lumens, the change was +60 lumens, to 122 lumens

A 0.7 lumen change is not noticeable, a 60 lumen change, Might be noticeable, IF you look for it, but a meter makes it really obvious.

here is another selfbuilt comment about a magnetic ring light with brightness instability:http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?380359-Sunwayman-V25C



selfbuilt said:


> It is not uncommon for continuously-variable lights controlled by a magnetic ring to show some change in output over time.
> ...
> in the case of the V25C, it seems like any medium-to-high level setting (i.e., anything >50% max output) gradually increases in output over a few minutes to max output.
> ...
> at the lower level, the V25C manages to keep a fairly constant output (with a *slight output oscillation that is not visible to the eye*)
> ...
> My sample wouldn't maintain flat regulation at Med-Hi levels, and would instead slowly increase in output back up to Max


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## gunga

Actually I did some more testing and noted fairly minor variance visually when slowly turning the light. This shows up in a few v11r samples. I had never noticed before because I don't slowly rotate my light when I'm using it. I've never noticed an issue so it obviously never bothered me.


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## jon_slider

thanks for the visual confirmation
fwiw, turning the rotary dial from min to medium and letting go, produces the same result as rotating the whole light. After I stop turning the rotary dial, the brightness continues to climb.

Same going down, if I turn the rotary from max to medium and let go, in actual use, it again does the same thing as rotating the light in the video. After letting go of the adjuster ring, the lumens are not stable, they continue to drop by themselves.

The videos I posted were just an example of how unstable the brightness is, from any change in brightness, either turning the magnetic ring, or turning the whole light.

Im glad you never noticed visually, selfbuilt and I noticed on a light meter, which makes the instability really obvious. Its a shame, cause I guess I had hoped the ring would be accurate, and stable. Instead its inconsistent and changes, even after stopping movement of the adjuster ring.

As far as moving the light itself, I often reposition my light to shine from different angles. On a V11R, this changes the brightness in ways that are obvious with a meter, and not so obvious to you by eye.

all good, interesting learning. Thanks for the feedback.


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## gunga

Keep in mind, some lights show more than others. Also, I've been using these lights for years and never noticed. I don't consider it a defect or a problem. The advantages of the rotary interface far outweigh the instability. If you want to see real instability, I suggest you try and peak light with qtc. That I couldn't live with.

The only reason I noticed is because I pointed it at a white wall and slowly rotated it looking for any fluctuation. 

I don't do that in use nor do I carry a light meter when I'm using a flashlight. 

Please keep that in mind. Some things matter in use. Some don't.

If it matters that much to you, buy an hds rotary and measure it. It will likely not fluctuate. Or just avoid rotary control lights.


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## jon_slider

gunga said:


> Some things matter in use. Some don't.


yes, I care about things that I can measure, not just things I can notice in use. 
For me, this conversation is not about whether you notice with your eyes, its about whether I can measure it on a light meter. That is why I posted asking if anyone owns a V11R AND a light meter.

Im just reporting that my light meter shows the V11R is unstable. I don't want to argue whether people should care about it, that's up to the individual. Most people don't realize the V11R is unstable, and they don't care. Thats all good.

I own a light meter and enjoy testing the lights I use. You don't own a meter, and enjoy using your lights without testing them.
We both get to do what makes us happy


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## gunga

I still think you should buy an hds rotary. Measure it. And report about it. I would like to know.


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## Crazyeddiethefirst

I received my light meter, and have to preface all my comments by saying I find the meter a bit quirky and will need to spend several more hours before I am reasonably sure of my accuracy. Having said that, my lights appear to mimic Selfbuilt's and your findings astoundingly close. I will pm you so we can send videos back & forth but also wanted to share my findings on this thread. I tested 4 of my 6 V11r's (one stock, one Mirage and two modded by Vinh(no difference-all 4 had the same lack of ability to maintain consistent output). I tested four other Sunwayman lights M11r's, V10r,TiV10+Vn, and they held readings without the loss of output consistency. When I have time, I will test other lights with control rings as well. One key point: as obvious as these changes are on the lux meter, in real life use they are not noticeable at all to me(your experience may differ). To be consistent all my testing was done on fresh fully charged 14500 cells.


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## Crazyeddiethefirst

gunga said:


> I still think you should buy an hds rotary. Measure it. And report about it. I would like to know.



And then send the HDS to me for confirmation and a trial period of no less than a few years...[emoji1]


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## gunga

So v10r don't vary like v11r? I can back that up with visual confirmation. Things get a bit confusing because one of my ti v10r may have a v11r driver (I was customizing it).


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## recDNA

Does SWM still make v11r?


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## gunga

Still seems to be current on the USA site. Still sold.


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## recDNA

gunga said:


> Still seems to be current on the USA site. Still sold.


Thanks. It would be nice if they ever do neutral again. I have a Vinh modded neutral. V10 and V11 are nice lights.


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## jon_slider

recDNA said:


> It would be nice if they ever do neutral again.



on the site gunga suggested you can buy:
*SUNWAYMAN V11R Flashlight NEUTRAL Cree XML T6 3C LED*

however, that neutral is not High CRI

you can also get a warm or neutral white V11R from gunga, he does excellent work and has some really nice High CRI options

On the left is gunga's 90+CRI N219c 3000k, it is absolutely gorgeous, imo. The middle is 4500k N219b 90+CRI, right is 6000k XP-G2 70CRI


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## recDNA

jon_slider said:


> on the site gunga suggested you can buy:
> *SUNWAYMAN V11R Flashlight NEUTRAL Cree XML T6 3C LED*
> 
> however, that neutral is not High CRI
> 
> you can also get a warm or neutral white V11R from gunga, he does excellent work and has some really nice High CRI options
> 
> On the left is gunga's 90+CRI N219c 3000k, it is absolutely gorgeous, imo. The middle is 4500k N219b 90+CRI, right is 6000k XP-G2 70CRI


Neat! $77 is a little pricy though. I know. I'm a pita. My Vinh model didn't cost much more than that. I will think about it but I expected it to be like $40

What are the triples?


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## Nichia!

What is the light on the left?


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## gunga

Modded v11r. 3000K Nichia 219C. You want it?


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## Nichia!

What the tint look like on the Neutral v11r?


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## jon_slider

recDNA said:


> My Vinh model didn't cost much more than [$77]. I will think about it but I expected it to be like $40
> ...
> What are the triples?



The stock Neutral is LOW CRI. I agree that is not the best deal.

You Can get Cool White LOW CRI V11R for <$40 if you look.

However, for a tint and CRI snob, the best deal is to get a High CRI Nichia mod, you choice of Warm or Neutral, by sending a PM to gunga.
...
The ripples are Mecarmy PT18 with 4500k N219b swaps, modes are 5-50-200-1000 on 18650, and stock PT16 XP-G2 6000k modes 10-100-300-1000 on 18350 IMR. 





The Mecarmy pictured are NoPWM lights. The V11R is also a NoPWM light, here is a short test of that with the Warm High CRI Nichia.


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## recDNA

Great info Jon. Thanks!


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## jon_slider

*How Our Eyes Work
*Our eyes can be quite insensitive to some types of brightness changes.

Below is an excellent explanation from HDS, how it works, that people do not notice PWM, fluctuations in brightness, constant current ripple, regulated current with a feedback loop, circuit noise, and other circuitry that do not provide fully regulated output. A light meter, and sometimes other instruments such as oscilloscopes and cameras are Required to “notice” some changes in brightness, such as really fast ones, or gradual ones, or small lumen amounts.

Most people would Not notice the fluctuations in the V11R in use. Even selfbuilt, who Knows its there, does not care.

quote from HDS Systems in _italics_:
_Your eyes have a non-linear (logarithmic) response to light, much like a camera. In order to notice a significant increase in brightness, you must double the amount of light. In photography, this doubling is referred to as an f-stop. For our purposes, the f-stop is a convenient unit of measure and we will use it when referencing relative brightness. To put this in perspective, if you suddenly change the brightness by 20%, you will notice just a slight change in brightness. In fact, if the change takes place over a couple of seconds, you may not even notice._

In my case, Im interested in Light Meter readings, because it informs me about potential battery life, among other things. I don’t want a light that increases its brightness beyond where I set the dial, because that drains my battery faster than I want it to.

This is not to say the V11R is not a fascinating light, for many reasons, and Im not in any way criticizing or judging anyone that enjoys theirs. I do believe that ALL V11R, and ALL magnetic ring lights would probably exhibit similar unregulated flux as the V11R. This is not a single defective light. The Light Meter response I am discussing IS universal to the design. I invite anyone that would speculate otherwise, to put a Light Meter in play before repeating a phrase like "I don't notice in actual use" 

I posted in this thread to discuss Light Meter readings of the V11R, because I discovered a fascinating flux in brightness.
“I don’t notice it in actual use” misses my point, that the V11R does not have regulated output, that the brightness continues to drift in the direction of the last dial turn, and that even rotating the light in the Earth Magnetic field, will produce similar results as rotating the magnetic ring around the light. 

On a light meter, the V11R changes brightness, at times by more than 30%. I think its worthy of a science class show and tell, about how the earths magnetic field effect can be seen with an LED!

fwiw, the Earth Magnetic field also pulses, within a narrow range, it has PWM, fluctuations, not fully regulated, hence the beauty of the V11R as a natural candle with fully entrained synchronization. 

< begin marketing hype> Imagine a Warm nightstand candle that glows with the Rhythms of the Earth. Imagine the movement of your lover illuminated by the warm rhythmic glow. ;l-) < end hype>


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## ozzie_c_cobblepot

Question on the V11R: does it behave differently with RCR compared with CR123a when getting low on juice? I thought generally that RCRs "just go out" with little to no warning whereas primaries go out gradually, which itself is a type of warning. So first, is that true in general, and second is it true specifically for the V11R?

Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk


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## ChrisGarrett

ozzie_c_cobblepot said:


> Question on the V11R: does it behave differently with RCR compared with CR123a when getting low on juice? I thought generally that RCRs "just go out" with little to no warning whereas primaries go out gradually, which itself is a type of warning. So first, is that true in general, and second is it true specifically for the V11R?
> 
> Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk



No...output is about the same but a CR-123A has roughly three times the capacity at approximately the same voltage.

Now, a 16340 li-ion at 4.2v will almost double the V11R’s output.

Chris


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## chillinn

I thought these were gone, but saw one in stock at Amazon and bought it. Seller has already restocked.

Does the V11r have current regulation? Could that be what jon_slider's brightness variability video above is actually showing, the driver trying to maintain constant brightness?

Does the V11r tail stand?

Rather than use the OEM clipped-on clip, I'd like a clip screwed on. Tail shroud has a big hole in it, can't tell from pics, but it might be too big for an acceptable clip screw. And one screw won't get it done... maybe the hole is big enough for two screws at either end? Anyone know of someone who can drill clip screw holes and screw a clip onto mine for me?

Edit: someone has done it, so here is the proof of concept:






I can't do this myself. I'll need someone with tools and skilled hands to contact me about this.

This is what I hope to get on there:





Edit2: I was reading about Vapcell INR14500 L10 1050mAh 3A cells at vapcelltech.com, did a search and saw them for sale at Vapcell's AliExpress store, just went to look at the prices, and I saw that the shipping notice for Li-ion changed from "No shipping to United States" to "Free Shipping to United States via Seller's Shipping Method. Delivered before 11/21 or full refund." So I searched for Vapecell INR14500 H10 1000mAh 10A cells in Vapcells AliExpress store, and it had the same shipping notice. I immediately ordered 8x INR14500 H10 1000mAh 10A button tops. Paid about $7.30/cell after the AliExpress PayPal charge, which is a lot more than Liion Wholesale was selling them. Watch, in a week Liion Wholesale will get them back in stock for $4.29 before shipping, and you'll get yours a lot cheaper and long before I get mine. :/


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## Dave D

chillinn said:


> Rather than use the OEM clipped-on clip, I'd like a clip screwed on. Tail shroud has a big hole in it, can't tell from pics, but it might be too big for an acceptable clip screw. And one screw won't get it done... maybe the hole is big enough for two screws at either end? Anyone know of someone who can drill clip screw holes and screw a clip onto mine for me?



I fitted a screw on clip to my V11R, as it aluminium so it's easy to drill and tap the holes, I bought the matching drill, taps and screw separately on the auction site.







I have recently fitted a deep pocket clip to another of my flashlights but it wont go as deep into my jeans pocket as expected because of the screw heads.


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## burntoshine

I just had my limited edition "High CRI" v11r just start working again after it mysteriously stopped working several years ago.

I was playing with my new Jetbeam RRT01 (2020 nichia version) and I was reminded of how my v11r had stopped working. So I went and dug up the v11r, put a primary in it, clicked it on and off, smacked it a few times, and then it came on when I started rotating the ring.

Has anyone else ever had their v11r malfunction like this.

I remember trying different batteries in the past when it had failed. I'm very perplexed here.

It's really cool that it's working, because I love this light.

It has a very warm XML led, I think.



cheers and Happy 2021!


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## Dave D

burntoshine said:


> Has anyone else ever had their v11r malfunction like this.



Yes, mine stopped working, after a short fall, it went back to China twice (the first time the Post Office couldn't find the address) and it came back working but I no longer trust it therefore it doesn't get carried.

When it was returned the first time, after not being delivered, it worked but I haven't bought another Sunwayman product since.


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## BrightestBulb

I don’t have that exact light but I do have an older D40. Had some problems with it and reached out to the company to buy parts. Well lo and behold they had no parts so now all I have is an expensive battery holder. I will no longer buy anything from them. There are too many other companies that are better and have parts if needed. Just my two cents.


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## burntoshine

Thanks for the responses!

I don't think I will be buying another Sunwayman, either.

I'll keep it around the house for whatever, but at home it will stay. I won't let unreliable things take up space & weight on my travels.


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