# NovaTac EDC T and E Models CRACKED! Back Door/Easter egg found!



## LLCoolBeans (Nov 18, 2008)

The "pre-programmed" NovaTac EDC T and E models *are *fully programmable, just like the P model.
_(P model owners, this procedure is useful for you too, see the "What the manual left out" section below)_

I bought a T model many months ago at a local retail shop. This was before I knew of the P model, the local shop only had Ts, and at that time I was not really a flashlight enthusiast. After buying the light I looked online and read about the programmable model. Something made me think that it must be possible to somehow unlock customization. I was not around for the original HDS series lights, but read here on CPF that the HDS basic models had a back door that could be accessed by clicking the light 250 times, this inspired me to find out if this was also possible with the NovaTac EDC. As it turns out... It is.


The procedure to enter the options menu via the "back door" and enable "customization mode", is as follows...

1. Turn the light on to Primary brightness with a single click.

2. Click the button 250 *or more* times. (These clicks must be in rapid succession. The light should stay on Primary brightness during the 250 clicks.)

3. After you have completed 250 or more clicks, hold the button down for one second (press). You have now entered the options menu. Your light should now be flashing to indicate Option 1 (emergency strobe).

4. Click through the menu options until you get to the last option (Option 9: Ramping/Options Menu). This option, turns the ability to program the light on and off. This "customization mode" is turned OFF by default on the T and E models and ON by default on the P model.

5. Select this option by holding the button down. (light will ramp up in brightness to indicate that you are selecting the option)

6. Turn the light off. (single click)

7. Done. You can now access the options menu with a Click-Click-Click-Press (as per P model), all options, brightness levels and strobes are now available to you. In fact, the light now behaves exactly as the NovaTac users manual for the P model describes.


*What the manual left out:* _(P model owners, you have not been forgotten)_
It would appear that the "back door" and Option 9 are a "customization mode". By default the P model ships with customization mode enabled, while the T and E models ship with customization mode disabled. So, this is useful for all NovaTac EDC owners, NOT just T and E owners. You can now set your options and brightness levels how you like them, then disable Option 9 to prevent your settings from being changed inadvertently. If you want to re-program your light in the future, simply enter the "back door" and re-enable Option 9.

Here's a quote from the manual concerning Option 9, with my comments in bold:


Flashlight User Guide EDC- 85P or 120P said:


> "The Ramping/Options Menu option is used to disable _(*or enable, as it turns out*) _the Brightness Ramping and Options menu, preventing further configuration changes _(*i.e. exit customization mode. Re-enable it to re-enter customization mode*). _Perform a factory reset to re-enable the Brightness Ramping and Options menu. _(*Yes, it's true a factory reset will return your flashlight to it's default settings. For a P model this WILL enable customization mode, but you WILL LOSE ALL OF YOUR SETTINGS. Why not just enter the back door and re-enable customization mode?*)_"




*Having problems? *
If you are having trouble programming your brightness levels, check to make sure option 4 is *enabled*. Also, some members are reporting that sometimes setting a certain brightness level will set another brightness level at the same time. This happened to me too. In my case I did a factory reset, then re-enabled customization mode and it stopped happening. Another member reported the factory reset did not cure the problem. The cause and/or absolute cure for this have not yet come to light, but try a factory reset as it did work for me.

*Reversal: *
At any time you can perform a factory reset and go back to your original default settings. 


DISCLAIMER: Use this procedure at YOUR OWN RISK. I am not responsible for voiding your warranty or making your flashlight do something you consider to be undesirable.


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## tebore (Nov 18, 2008)

And now you're famous(or infamous to Novatac).

I wonder if this will force Novatac to hire someone to redo the firmware to remove the backdoor.

Looks like it was just a variation of the old 250 clicks trick, this time do it from on not off.


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## Kid9P (Nov 18, 2008)

LLCoolBeans said:


> The "pre-programmed" NovaTac EDC T and E models can easily be made to function as fully programmable P models.
> 
> I did some work on this months ago, but lost interest. I should have pressed on, as I was so close. We could have had this crack 6 months ago.
> 
> ...


 



:bow::bow::bow::bow::bow::bow:

DUDE !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

GREAT JOB !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :twothumbs

OK, I've saved a copy of this. 
Novatac may want this info removed if they find out.


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## Kid9P (Nov 18, 2008)

I wonder in an EDC 85 will become an 85P or a 120P....hmmmm:thinking:


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## SnWnMe (Nov 18, 2008)

LOL. I gotta try this hehe. My Es just went up a few $$ in value.


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## Polar Light (Nov 18, 2008)

Stupid question, but is this modding reversible?

I suppose I manage to mess something up. :thinking:


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## LLCoolBeans (Nov 18, 2008)

Polar Light said:


> Stupid question, but is this modding reversible?
> 
> I suppose I manage to mess something up. :thinking:



I haven't tried it yet, but I'm assuming that you can do it in one of two ways.

a. Do a factory reset. 

b. Set the options however you like them (perhaps the original settings for a T or E model), then enter the options menu and turn option 9 off.


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## 04orgZx6r (Nov 18, 2008)

Your a hero!:laughing:


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## Lumenous (Nov 18, 2008)

You haven't noticed any reduction in output (Ala 85P), correct ?

Re: https://www.candlepowerforums.com/posts/2703578&postcount=11


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## streetmaster (Nov 18, 2008)

You are awesome!! Thank you so much! :rock:

But I too want to know if you still have the full 120 lumens. I want the programmability bad, but I won't sacrifice full brightness.


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## derfyled (Nov 18, 2008)

Great find!

:twothumbs

:thumbsup:


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## StandardBattery (Nov 18, 2008)

:twothumbs:twothumbs:twothumbs



:grouphug::grouphug::grouphug:
:goodjob::goodjob::goodjob:


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## litetube (Nov 18, 2008)

I am impressed!!!!!!!!!!!:twothumbs


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## brucec (Nov 18, 2008)

This is probably the best Christmas present for many on this forum! Great job! Makes me want to buy a T or E just to hack into it...


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## m16a (Nov 18, 2008)

Flashlight hacking. Who would have ever thunk it. 

Good job :thumbsup:


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## nanotech17 (Nov 18, 2008)

you just never give up


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## LLCoolBeans (Nov 18, 2008)

I just noticed something else. At first I thought I was loosing my mind or that the flashlight had gone schizophrenic. Neither is the case.

It would seem that not only are the menus and ramping (option 9) disabled by default but so is Force Setting (option 4). YOU WILL WANT TO ENABLE OPTION 4, IN ADDITION TO OPTION 9. If option 4 is disabled, the light wants to return to whatever brightness level it was at when you turned the light off. This makes programming a bit tricky.

I'm going to add this to my original post.


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## LLCoolBeans (Nov 18, 2008)

Lumenous said:


> You haven't noticed any reduction in output (Ala 85P), correct ?
> 
> Re: https://www.candlepowerforums.com/posts/2703578&postcount=11



All brightness levels appear to be there. I did not notice a reduction in output and I think I'm counting all 22 levels. Somone want to verify this?

I have no idea what happened to the guy who said he inadvertently turned his 120T into an 85P.


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## LLCoolBeans (Nov 18, 2008)

Also I forgot to mention...

Use this at YOUR OWN RISK. I am not responsible for voiding your warranty or making your flashlight do something you consider to be undesirable.


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## orbital (Nov 18, 2008)

+

WOW!! 

I don't even own a 120E/T and I just printed this off...


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## Rat6P (Nov 18, 2008)

:bow:


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## LED_Thrift (Nov 18, 2008)

Great job! My boss used to use the expression "cool beans" whenever he saw something *really* nice. You have lived up to your name Cool Beans. I'm sure you have just made many many CPF'ers very happy, and added something truly useful to this already great community. Thank you, sir.


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## LLCoolBeans (Nov 18, 2008)

I should also note that this *seems *to be working. I have not fully tested every function.


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## BabyDoc (Nov 18, 2008)

Nice job, Cool! If anybody else has tried this and has been successful, it would be nice to hear if this is easy or not. 

I am a bit confused about the 250 clicks and how quickly or slowly you need to do this. It sounds like it could be real frustrating if you didn't get into the menu or you did get into the menu and didn't get to option 9 quick enough before the light went back to its default mode. You better be an expert with the p120 instructions before getting started on this adventure.


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## LLCoolBeans (Nov 18, 2008)

BabyDoc said:


> I am a bit confused about the 250 clicks and how quickly or slowly you need to do this. It sounds like it could be real frustrating if you didn't get into the menu or you did get into the menu and didn't get to option 9 quick enough before the light went back to its default mode. You better be an expert with the p120 instructions before getting started on this adventure.



Well, just from using the flashlight normally, you know how to do a double click and you know how to do a triple click. Basically, you need to do a 250+ click-press. So from on, click-click-click(at least 250 times)-press. It's not that hard, especially if your arm isn't already dead tired from clicking for half an evening.


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## matrixshaman (Nov 18, 2008)

Hacking at it's best!! Great job! And amazing timing - I just bought my first 120T from wacbzz a couple days ago. I've got several 120P's but for the price I got the 120T I couldn't pass it up. Now I learn it's going to be a P - wahoooo! :bow: :bow: :bow:
:twothumbs :twothumbs :twothumbs


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## mossyoak (Nov 18, 2008)

I hate to rain on your parade but this isn't breaking news. It's been known for a while that 250 clicks takes you to programming


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## BabyDoc (Nov 18, 2008)

mossyoak said:


> I hate to rain on your parade but this isn't breaking news. It's been known for a while that 250 clicks takes you to programming


 
It was rumored in another thread but never confirmed. I suspect there is a trick to doing it just right. People have tried before without success.


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## Lightguy27 (Nov 18, 2008)

Sweet. And sorry to thread hijack but is anybody else excited for the Novatac Storm? I already pre-ordered one in Pewter.


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## LLCoolBeans (Nov 18, 2008)

mossyoak said:


> I hate to rain on your parade but this isn't breaking news. It's been known for a while that 250 clicks takes you to programming



Do you have a link? That would be great. It would take some of the heat off of me.

There is no parade. People are happy, and that makes me happy, but I don't gain anything from this, except a programmable flashlight.


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## Imworking (Nov 18, 2008)

Awesome. That's all I can say. Except that 250 clicks was one hellacious feat given my coordination!


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## matrixshaman (Nov 18, 2008)

mossyoak said:


> I hate to rain on your parade but this isn't breaking news. It's been known for a while that 250 clicks takes you to programming



Are you sure you are not remembering the 250 click Easter egg for the HDS Basic models? It would turn them into an Ultimate. That has been around a while but this is the first real instructions I've seen for the Novatac.


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## orcinus (Nov 18, 2008)

Wait a sec... wasn't that the EXACT way you entered the options menu in the old HDS models? :thinking:

Edit: damn, matrixshaman beat me to it...


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## kromeke (Nov 18, 2008)

> Are you sure you are not remembering the 250 click Easter egg for the HDS Basic models? It would turn them into an Ultimate.



Well, it doesn't "turn them into an Ultimate" but it would allow programming.

Ultimate models would allow programming with 10 clicks, Basic models allow programming with 250 clicks (or was it 200 clicks, I can't recall). 

I know, because I've re-programmed my B42 a while back.


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## LLCoolBeans (Nov 18, 2008)

orcinus said:


> Wait a sec... wasn't that the EXACT way you entered the options menu in the old HDS models? :thinking:



As I understand it, you did 250 clicks from off on the EDC Basic. So, definitely very similar, but not exact.

Also, with the old HDS models, there was no option 9 to turn on. So in order to access the menu, you had to do 250 clicks every time. On the NovaTac you simply turn option 9 on and you no longer have to do the 250 clicks.


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## LLCoolBeans (Nov 18, 2008)

Also, this procedure does not make a T or E into a P, per say. A more accurate description would be it simply turns a T or E into a programmable T or E.

I still have not done a factory reset. If the factory reset brings you back to default T or E settings, the above description would be accurate. If it returns you to P default settings, then it does become a P.


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## LLCoolBeans (Nov 18, 2008)

Imworking said:


> Awesome. That's all I can say. Except that 250 clicks was one hellacious feat given my coordination!



So you were able to access the menu?

Has any one else verified this? I have a 120T, it would be helpful to hear from someone with a 120E or one of the 85 series.


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## Imworking (Nov 18, 2008)

I did in fact get the menu and set up my 120E like my 85P. Everything works greats and I did a battery change just to verify that the setting held.... they did! As long as I never need to do a factory reset my 120E for all intents and purposes is a 120P. Awesome! Now to order some bezels...


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## Imworking (Nov 18, 2008)

Did I also mention that Botach Tactical has 120E's for only $89.95. That's where I got mine from 2 weeks ago. The seem like a real good deal now!


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## streetmaster (Nov 18, 2008)

Lightguy27 said:


> Sweet. And sorry to thread hijack but is anybody else excited for the Novatac Storm? I already pre-ordered one in Pewter.


Yep! I have a black Storm on pre-order. Got it for $60! How can you go wrong for that price!? The only thing I will be lacking is the flat tailcap switch.

And to stay on topic, I am going to try the crack on my 120E today. I will report my results here.


> Did I also mention that Botach Tactical has 120E's for only $89.95. That's where I got mine from 2 weeks ago. The seem like a real good deal now!



That's where I got my 120E, awesome deal.


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## Oink (Nov 18, 2008)

Thanks... love de-crippling stuff like this, no love for manufacturers that go the extra distance to dump down their products...


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## SaturnNyne (Nov 18, 2008)

Wow, I can't believe it. After all this time and so many wondering if there's a way, it finally turns out that the backdoor for these is the same one we already knew about. Thanks for figuring this out, Cool Beans. This is a cool achievement, even if it does seem like we should have gotten it long ago.



orcinus said:


> Wait a sec... wasn't that the EXACT way you entered the options menu in the old HDS models?





LLCoolBeans said:


> As I understand it, you did 250 clicks from off on the EDC Basic. So, definitely very similar, but not exact.


Actually, the method of accessing the menu is indeed exactly the same in that in both cases you simply access the menu in the normal way but use 250 clicks instead of 10 or 3. The difference is in the way the different versions work, not in the method.


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## Dadof6 (Nov 18, 2008)

My black 120t is now a 120P with a tactical cap. I just programed it.

Awesome.


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## Towelie (Nov 18, 2008)

anyone try an 85 yet?


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## streetmaster (Nov 18, 2008)

I was able to crack my 120E successfully. I also was able to restore it back to 120E with a factory reset. Then I cracked it again. So the crack is definitely reversible. 

The easiest way I found to perform the 250 clicks is to put the light bezel down on the desk, hold the light steady with one hand, and do the clicking with the middle finger of the other hand. I didn't have to count clicks. It takes roughly 50 to 70 seconds to get to the 250 clicks, depending on how fast you're doing it. The light will start flashing when you get to the 250. Then do the "press" and your in the options menu.

After playing with my programmable 120E and getting it programmed the way I want, :thumbsup: I now see why so many people bought the 120P. Very nice.

I especially like the fact that it has memory now.


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## Imworking (Nov 18, 2008)

streetmaster said:


> I was able to crack my 120E successfully. I also was able to restore it back to 120E with a factory reset. Then I cracked it again. So the crack is definitely reversible.



Awesome news. Hey streetmaster, you'll never guess which RPM Bezel I ordered?


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## streetmaster (Nov 18, 2008)

Imworking said:


> Awesome news. Hey streetmaster, you'll never guess which RPM Bezel I ordered?


lol, it's a beauty ain't it? :naughty:


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## LLCoolBeans (Nov 18, 2008)

Ok, I just did a factory reset, and returned to T defaults.

Entered the menu and enabled option 9.

Option 4 was enabled by default. So, I don't know how my option 4 got set to disabled last time.


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## matrixshaman (Nov 18, 2008)

Now that it can be reliably reset to the default light can anyone verify whether the programming currently known lowers the highest level to 85 Lumens instead of 120? This may be a small enough difference to require a light meter to be sure. For most purposes I'd give up the extra lumens to have all the 'P' functions in this light if I had to. But of course it will be nice to see full power if we can.


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## chaoss (Nov 18, 2008)

Very nice job LL Cool, I shall begin to transform my 120E at once.


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## streetmaster (Nov 18, 2008)

matrixshaman said:


> Now that it can be reliably reset to the default light can anyone verify whether the programming currently known lowers the highest level to 85 Lumens instead of 120? This may be a small enough difference to require a light meter to be sure. For most purposes I'd give up the extra lumens to have all the 'P' functions in this light if I had to. But of course it will be nice to see full power if we can.


I'm pretty sure I would notice the difference betweem 85 and 120 lumens. I have not lost any brightness.

The more I look at it, the less I trust my eyes. Dammit, how can I find out for sure??


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## HitecDrftr (Nov 18, 2008)

Imworking said:


> Did I also mention that Botach Tactical has 120E's for only $89.95. That's where I got mine from 2 weeks ago. The seem like a real good deal now!



Hey, you can get an extra 8.25% off using the code "catax" on their site. (As of right now, 11/18/08) 

So, it breaks down like this

Novatac EDC 120E = $89.95
UPS Ground $10.61 (to PA)
Tax $0.00
Apply code "catax" -$7.43
Total Shipped $93.14

Hitec


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## Saranic (Nov 18, 2008)

Thanks for the info


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## streetmaster (Nov 18, 2008)

HitecDrftr said:


> Hey, you can get an extra 8.25% off using the code "catax" on their site. (As of right now, 11/18/08)
> 
> So, it breaks down like this
> 
> ...


When I bought mine there was a 10% off code(can't remember) and I ended up paying $80.96 plus shipping.


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## matrixshaman (Nov 18, 2008)

For the newer people here you might want to check the Jeers section before buying from Botach. They have quite a history. I won't get into it here so as to stay on topic but since some people here are obviously looking to get a deal on a Novatac to reprogram you might look elsewhere. Check the 'Good deals' section on CPF Marketplace and you'll find some better alternatives. 

As far as not needing a light meter to tell the difference between 85 and 120 Lumens I would say that most people would need it. First you have your memory of an exact brightness to deal with. Then you have some simple physics and a general rule I think most have found to hold true here that it takes a doubling of output lumens to be very noticeable difference. I recently got a light that reads over 4000 Lux on a light meter I have. I thought when I first got it that it was less bright than another light. I then checked the other light on the meter and found it was just barely 2000 Lux. Even trying one and then the other a few seconds later it was hard to tell a difference in brightness until they were side by side at the same time. So while I'd like to believe there is no difference I'd like to see the actual measurements. If no one can do this in the next couple days I should be able to do so as I'll probably have a 120T in hand in the next day or two and I'll verify this on my light meter. Either way I'm thrilled to have the option of reprogramming much thanks to LLCoolBeans!


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## streetmaster (Nov 18, 2008)

matrixshaman said:


> For the newer people here you might want to check the Jeers section before buying from Botach. They have quite a history. I won't get into it here so as to stay on topic but since some people here are obviously looking to get a deal on a Novatac to reprogram you might look elsewhere. Check the 'Good deals' section on CPF Marketplace and you'll find some better alternatives.
> 
> As far as not needing a light meter to tell the difference between 85 and 120 Lumens I would say that most people would need it. First you have your memory of an exact brightness to deal with. Then you have some simple physics and a general rule I think most have found to hold true here that it takes a doubling of output lumens to be very noticeable difference. I recently got a light that reads over 4000 Lux on a light meter I have. I thought when I first got it that it was less bright than another light. I then checked the other light on the meter and found it was just barely 2000 Lux. Even trying one and then the other a few seconds later it was hard to tell a difference in brightness until they were side by side at the same time. So while I'd like to believe there is no difference I'd like to see the actual measurements. If no one can do this in the next couple days I should be able to do so as I'll probably have a 120T in hand in the next day or two and I'll verify this on my light meter. Either way I'm thrilled to have the option of reprogramming much thanks to LLCoolBeans!


If you or someone could check with a light meter, I would really appreciate it. The more I look at it on high, the more I'm doubting my ability to tell the difference. But I'm gonna stick with my first impression that it's still 120lm on high. I hope I'm right.


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## kromeke (Nov 18, 2008)

Count the number of levels. The 85 has one less level than the 120, if memory serves. 

Check the documentation to be sure.


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## streetmaster (Nov 18, 2008)

Thanks! The 85 has 21 and the 120 has 22. I'll see if I can count them.

Edit: I'm pretty sure there's still 22 levels.


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## 1dash1 (Nov 18, 2008)

streetmaster said:


> The more I look at it, the less I trust my eyes. Dammit, how can I find out for sure??


 
If you don't have access to a lightmeter, the next best thing is a side-by-side comparison with a known source with a similar beam pattern and brightness. Use whatever you have in your inventory that's 100+ lumens. (Personally, I'd use an EX10 GD+ on max.)


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## cslinger (Nov 18, 2008)

Definitely works on the 120T and the 85T.

I have switched both of mine over to program mode. I basically got rid of the strobe on the high mode and kept level 21/22 for both primary and high modes so I can use the lights as tactical momentary lights or be on a low mode and hold to move back to high mode instead of defaulting to strobe mode.

Wicked cool find. Thanks as defaulting the strobe was one of my very minor complaints about this light.

As was said above easiest way to do this is to turn the light on. Place it bezel down on a table. Once you have the light on and bezel down use your index finger or palm of your hand to start clicking. You DO NOT have to count 250 exact clicks. Once you reach the 250 or whatever point is necessary the light will start to flash (do this is a darker room and pay attention to the light escaping from the bezel) Once the light starts to flash click one more time and hold. This puts you into program mode. 

So basically in order to set up an 85T or 120T to be a programmable tactical light, removing the strobe as I have done follow the steps below.

1-Turn light on to primary setting using a single click
2-Place light (powered on primary setting) bezel down on a hard flat surface (table)
3-Using your palm or finger begin clicking the light (250 times) Must be done reasonably quickly but not onerously so
4-Continue clicking until you see the light begin to blink at this point continue to click one more time and HOLD the last click. NOTE THIS IS NOT A STOP CLICKING THING IT MUST BE A SMOOTH TRANSITION JUST DO ONE MORE CLICK AND HOLD BASICALLY 251 AND HOLD.
5-Light will begin to flash indicating it is in the program menu
6-Click through the menu settings until you get to number 9 (9 clicks)
7-Once on menu setting 9 (dim to bright indicates this) click and hold to turn this setting on. Hold the click for 2ish seconds until the light turns off.
8-Light will now act as a normal 85P or 120P model.

9-Turn the light back on and do the click clickhold to latch the light into the highest mode or strobe for the T models
10-While light is on / strobing click click clickhold (Continue to hold) to begin the various light level ramp up routine. Light will strobe, flash etc. and then go into a serious of incremental ramp up changes of successively brighter light.
11-Once it has reached the level you wish, with the highest level being indicated by two flashes simply release the button you have been holding. 
12-Turn off light
13-When light comes back on the high mode that used to be strobe will now be set to whatever you set it to, in my case another highest level setting that allows me to use momentary high in a tactical manner or do the click and hold from other lower settings to give me maximum light as well.

Hope this helps those trying to do this. I am going to change the battery in my 120T to double check that it holds the P mode settings.

The 120P/85P manual found below will work as it states once you have finished steps 1-8.

http://www.novatac.com/downloads/Novatac-EDC-P-UserGuide.pdf

Chris


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## cslinger (Nov 18, 2008)

I just did a battery change and can confirm that the light stays in the programmable mode. Basically if you have a T model like I do you create a P model with the extended button. I now technically have a true 85P and now an 85T-P and 120T-P. I do not have a basic model to empirically test if it works the same way.

I have not done a hard reset as I don't feel like clicking 250+ times to put this back the way I want it.

My T models are now 100% my perfect lights.
High beam momentary when I want it.
High beam constant if I want it.
General purpose and low low beams with instant access back to high when I want it

To the OP you rock.

For those familiar with the previous HDS EDC series of lights this is similar in nature to the 250 click routine for those but you would need to do that every time you wanted to program them. Doing this for the Novatacs quite literally makes them a P model and allows very easy access to the programmable functions just as the manual for the P model states.

Chris


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## SnWnMe (Nov 18, 2008)

Okay this is what I noticed with my 120E.

It is not exactly a 120P. Someone said it becomes a programmable E and this is correct IME with my 20K SN 120E. There seems to be inconsistencies with the way click press behaves.

120P allows four settings.

Click: Setting 1
Click x 2 : Setting 2
Click x 3 : Setting 3
Click Press: Setting 4


With the cracked E

Click: Setting 1
Click x 2: Setting 2
Click X 3: Setting 3
Click press: This seems to copy whatever setting 1 is on. Then 1 becomes a medium high setting (maybe 50 to 60 lm) when I revisit it after the initial power up. Turning the light off and then again repeats this swapping and changing pattern.


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## cslinger (Nov 18, 2008)

Interesting. The T's most certainly can be set up exactly like you want and have 4 distinct slots for use. The T's become P's with extended buttons.

Chris


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## streetmaster (Nov 18, 2008)

My 120E w/serial in the 14XXX has all 4 programmable slots. SnWnMe, maybe the last used memory feature is what's messing you up?


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## LLCoolBeans (Nov 18, 2008)

SnWnMe said:


> Click: Setting 1
> Click x 2: Setting 2
> Click X 3: Setting 3
> Click press: This seems to copy whatever setting 1 is on. Then 1 becomes a medium high setting (maybe 50 to 60 lm) when I revisit it after the initial power up. Turning the light off and then again repeats this swapping and changing pattern.



I had this same problem at first. I did a factory reset, then re-enabled customization. Problem went away.


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## Yapo (Nov 18, 2008)

Cool i never knew you could do it for the old HDS Basic...just so happen to have a Basic 42 GT lying around...although i find it's UI pretty close to perfect already.

I wonder if it'll work on their new lights...


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## Burgess (Nov 18, 2008)

Great work, LLCoolBeans !

:thumbsup::twothumbs:wow::goodjob:
_


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## streetmaster (Nov 18, 2008)

LLCoolBeans, While you're here, I just want to thank you again for your discovery. It's like Christmas came early for me this year.


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## SnWnMe (Nov 18, 2008)

@ SM Nope. I have Option 4 enabled so it always reverts to setting 1 regardless of the setting the light was on when I turned it off.

LL I'll try that. Tnx


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## streetmaster (Nov 18, 2008)

SnWnMe said:


> Nope. I have Option 4 enabled so it always reverts to setting 1 regardless of the setting the light was on when I turned it off.


Ok, sorry. I'm still new to these programmable lights. I just know it was screwing me up at first until I disabled it.


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## SnWnMe (Nov 18, 2008)

No worries SM. I'm having fun with this :twothumbs

I have a real P, so I'll set one of my Es as a T and leave the other one be :twothumbs


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## SnWnMe (Nov 19, 2008)

Did a factory reset and reprogram. It's still doing it @ Setting 1 and Click Press.

Actually, now Setting 3 gets copied to Setting 1 :sick2:


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## LLCoolBeans (Nov 19, 2008)

SnWnMe said:


> Did a factory reset and reprogram. It's still doing it @ Setting 1 and Click Press.
> 
> Actually, now Setting 3 gets copied to Setting 1 :sick2:



Did you double check to make sure option 4 was enabled?


----------



## SnWnMe (Nov 19, 2008)

Yet another factory reset. This time I did not mess with the click press slot and it seems to be behaving. Click press was left at max setting.

So now it's 42 lm, 0.47 lm (just enough to stop the flicker), epileptic strobe, and max (click press). Whew my hands are sore despite that raised tailcap.

Oh and I didn't have to disable/enable Option 4 either.


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## LLCoolBeans (Nov 19, 2008)

Wow, almost 1,700 views in 24hrs.


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## streetmaster (Nov 19, 2008)

LLCoolBeans said:


> Wow, almost 1,700 views in 24hrs.


Yeah, just imagine how many views it'll be up to in a month! I'm predicting it will be one of the most viewed threads in quite some time.


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## tx101 (Nov 19, 2008)

AAAARGGGG .... I have cramp in my fingers now 
Lost count of the number of times I have tried this
Got into the Options Menu three times and messed up
and had to start over again ....
I can get into the Options Menu but my fingers are so tried
by then, I mess up going into Option 9 
I'll wait until the Mrs gets home and ask her to try ....


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## jojobos (Nov 19, 2008)

LL, thanks for the info. Any hacks for 120P?
I am jealous of Henry's *RA170*. I want to make my 120p to 180P!!


:twothumbs


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## RichS (Nov 19, 2008)

Awesome info LL - thanks for finding this for us!! Now I'll have a pewter 120P and a black 120E-P!

You 'Da Man!! Thanks again!! :twothumbs:twothumbs:twothumbs


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## streetmaster (Nov 19, 2008)

jojobos said:


> LL, thanks for the info. Any hacks for 120P?
> I am jealous of Henry's *RA170*. I want to make my 120p to 180P!!
> 
> 
> :twothumbs


Haha, me too! But I think that would have to be the _front door_ hack.  

My favorite light has just been transformed into the "ultimate" light, and now I want it to be brighter.:candle: Isn't that a _sure-fire_ sign of flashaholism? (pun intended):laughing:

But seriously, 180 lumens would be nice. I guess my ba-zillions of 2x123 lights will have to fill that... _spot. _

Wow, sleep deprivation has caused me to think I have a sense of humor. Sorry guys.


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## LLCoolBeans (Nov 19, 2008)

jojobos said:


> LL, thanks for the info. Any hacks for 120P?
> I am jealous of Henry's *RA170*. I want to make my 120p to 180P!!



Regrettably, I have no magical powers.

I merely invested the 2 hours, and clicked the living nightlights out of my NovaTac. I appreciate all of your praise, but I didn't do anything magical.

My suggestion to you, is to buy a Ra-Clicky. It may seem expensive, but once you have it, you won't regret spending the extra money. The Ra may be $80 more than the NT, but it's much more than $80 better.


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## JJV (Nov 19, 2008)

I just tried this with my 120E and it appears to have worked. The programming is somewhat confusing and I am at work now, so the bulk of it will have to wait. But I've set it up to 1 click is min and 2 is max. The rest I still have to figure out.

Thanks LL! Might have to get the endcap with the flush button now...


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## streetmaster (Nov 19, 2008)

JJV said:


> I just tried this with my 120E and it appears to have worked. The programming is somewhat confusing and I am at work now, so the bulk of it will have to wait. But I've set it up to 1 click is min and 2 is max. The rest I still have to figure out.
> 
> Thanks LL! Might have to get the endcap with the flush button now...


After you mess around with it for a while it becomes much easier to program. It seems really complicated at first, but it doesn't take too long to learn. After one evening of tinkering, I don't need the instructions anymore.


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## tx101 (Nov 19, 2008)

Finally, the got the blasted thing to work :naughty:

Mr Bean .... you are a legend


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## kaichu dento (Nov 19, 2008)

1dash1 said:


> If you don't have access to a lightmeter, the next best thing is a side-by-side comparison with a known source with a similar beam pattern and brightness.





SnWnMe said:


> I have a real P, so I'll set one of my Es as a T and leave the other one be :twothumbs


SnWnMe, could you do a side-by-side and verify the brightness levels are still the same?


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## gottawearshades (Nov 19, 2008)

This is great, LLCB!

NT 120P: $120.
NT 120E: $90.
Hacking your flashlight and feeling really smart: Priceless.


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## streetmaster (Nov 19, 2008)

gottawearshades said:


> This is great, LLCB!
> 
> NT 120P: $100.
> NT 120E: $90.
> Hacking your flashlight and feeling really smart: Priceless.


Where did you find a 120P for 100 bucks?


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## Sgt. LED (Nov 19, 2008)

*Be carefull!*

This is just to warn you all that on click 328 it will _*explode*_.


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## JJV (Nov 19, 2008)

streetmaster said:


> After you mess around with it for a while it becomes much easier to program. It seems really complicated at first, but it doesn't take too long to learn. After one evening of tinkering, I don't need the instructions anymore.


 
Of course I have not been able to leave well enough alone today and I think I am getting the hang of at least setting the levels...the options will be another time. 

Funny how such a little thing like this can totally captivate you.


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## RichS (Nov 19, 2008)

I just successfully (after about 3 attempts) turned my NovaTac 120E into a 120E-P! I kept forgetting to press and hold after it started flashing at 250 clicks and I had to start over...

This is awesome - I now have 2 fully programmable NovaTacs that come on at < 1 lumen! 

Several folks posted concerns regarding the max output possibly changing after making this modification. So I compared my newly programmable 120E to my 120P on max. Let me put your minds at ease. There's no question, the 120E retained it's 120 lumen output on max. I took a beamshot to hopefully demonstrate the output comparison between the two after I set up the 120E to be programmable. 

My 120P has a slightly warmer tint to it than my 120E, so the beam looks just slightly different in the photo, but I can assure you they both have the same level of output on max.

*Black 120E-P (Left) / Pewter 120P (Right)*






*Black 120E-P (Left) / Pewter 120P (Right)*





Thanks LL!! Your gonna get many folks' vote for "Most Valuable Thread in 2008" for this one!!:twothumbs


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## The Sun (Nov 19, 2008)

brightness levels stay the same 120 stays 120. i have two 120T's did one first then compared the beams, the one that i cracked was the brighter of the two to begin with, and it still is (barely, but i can tell, a lot to do with the difference of tint in the two, one cool white, one more warm). the only difference is...now i have two 120P's one black one olive, the black serial is 20K, and the olive is the 30K series. no problems with either of them. THIS IS SO COOL!!!! THANK YOU LLCOOLBEANS...YOU ARE IN FACT...COOL!!!! whats really cool is that with this hack is i can now take the brightness to the lowest level, and now that i have, i've found i have no PWM flicker issues!!!!! Right On!!!!! everything works perfect, i'm so stoked!!! also, when i got the lights i got them with flat tailcaps, and they said 120P on them instead of "T" and now you would never know +1 to BEANS, and +1 to me!!!!!!!!!! mwwwaaaahhhhhh haaa haaa haaa!!!!!


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## StandardBattery (Nov 19, 2008)

I must say this is very cool, and if I had a E or a T model I'd be clicking away with the biggest grin . I though about getting an E just to hack, but that makes little sense since I already have an 85P, a 120P and a dead 120P. So I'll spend the money towards an Ra Clicky and support Henry and his great lights. 

When production ramps up we might see a price drop on the Ra Clickys and they will be alot closer to the cost of any of thre current NT like what happened with the Twisty... *or better yet the 170 model could finally be released.*

To those doing the clicking... welcome to the P Universe... it's bigger and a lot more fun!


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## matrixshaman (Nov 19, 2008)

Yep I'm still getting a Ra Clicky for sure but in the meantime this is way cool. I'm still waiting on the 120E to arrive but when it does I'll put it on the light meter before and after reprogramming and report here just for the book. It sounds like it may be retaining full power from what I'm reading but I should be able to verify that for sure with the light meter.

I see since I started this message a couple people have confirmed the output as being the same. Thanks RichS! And Thanks TheSun.


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## SnWnMe (Nov 19, 2008)

kaichu dento said:


> SnWnMe, could you do a side-by-side and verify the brightness levels are still the same?



:huh: Ugh, it's hard to stare down 120 lm. I can't see crap right now. LOL.

But yeah, @ max setting, the E was just as bright as the P. I have no reason to believe that the various settings will be any different.


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## streetmaster (Nov 19, 2008)

@*RichS*, Thanks for setting my mind at ease. It was driving me nuts not knowing for sure. I was pretty sure at first, then people planted seeds of doubt in my head.

:rock:+1 for the most valuable thread of 2008! :buddies:

Oh yeah, forgot to mention mine has no flicker whatsoever at any of the lower settings!! I use the absolute low every night when going to bed. It's the only light I have that goes low enough to not wake up the wife. :candle:


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## Everett (Nov 19, 2008)

In case anyone is curious, I tried it on my 120P. After ~250 clicks it starts flashing as reported for E or T, and you can press to enter the menu. The menu is just the same though. I had the tiniest glimmer of hope that there would be some secret 10th option in there, but no. 
Of course, you can end with a press at any point to enter the menu--3 click press, 10 click press, 100 click press, etc., all go to the menu but at 250 something is definitely triggered that makes it start to flash. Apparently it does nothing different though.


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## matrixshaman (Nov 19, 2008)

Sorry if I planted seeds of doubt there streetmaster - just sounded like others had some varied results at first. 

Everett - don't give up so easy - you might be on to something there. Maybe a 170 Lumen burst mode :naughty:

I'm wondering at this point if the new Ra Clicky doesn't have a backdoor like this too. I thought about this even before seeing this thread. I thought it might be there waiting for someone to discover how to unleash the 170 Lumen mode that was originally planned in this light. Just speculating or more like dreaming of course....


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## LLCoolBeans (Nov 19, 2008)

Everett said:


> In case anyone is curious, I tried it on my 120P. After ~250 clicks it starts flashing as reported for E or T, and you can press to enter the menu.



It would make sense that the back door would be there on the P model as well. After all, they are all the same light with the same software. That would seem to be all too clear at this point.

I'm going to update my original post to make note of this.




matrixshaman said:


> I'm wondering at this point if the new Ra Clicky doesn't have a backdoor like this too.



Well, in a way it does. "Customization mode" can be turned on and off, just like with the NovaTac. Only with the Clicky it's 20 clicks to enter, instead of 250.




matrixshaman said:


> I thought about this even before seeing this thread. I thought it might be there waiting for someone to discover how to unleash the 170 Lumen mode that was originally planned in this light. Just speculating or more like dreaming of course....



Hmmm... Definitely possible, but unlikely. If it did exist, it would be a nightmare to find as it would be difficult to tell if you successfully enabled it. There is not much difference between 140 and 170 lumens.


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## SnWnMe (Nov 19, 2008)

This is really cool. I have locator flash enabled on all three NTs I have. Having four programmable lights sort of pushed the Clicky from a must have to a nice to have on my list. 
These NTs and my Twisty will tide me over until Clicky production picks up and the pre orders and inevitable backorders are filled. Hopefully the prices will go down as well like the Tw.


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## LLCoolBeans (Nov 20, 2008)

Alright, I have cleaned up, revamped and beefed up my original post. Those of you that were copying it and saving it for their personal records may want to copy the new and improved version.

I'm wondering if I shouldn't change the title as well. Is that a bad idea?


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## Lumenous (Nov 20, 2008)

LLCoolBeans said:


> Alright, I have cleaned up, revamped and beefed up my original post. Those of you that were copying it and saving it for their personal records may want to copy the new and improved version.
> 
> I'm wondering if I shouldn't change the title as well. Is that a bad idea?



Personally I think it's a good idea :thumbsup: One of the problems I often encounter when searching forums is the ability to search using related keywords. In this case a short and sweet title would go along way toward helping future 'searchers'. 

How about _Enable 120P Programing Functions in Novatac 120T and 120E_?


Anyway, it's just an idea. :shrug:


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## streetmaster (Nov 20, 2008)

I would suggest removing the word "CRACKED" from the title.


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## LLCoolBeans (Nov 20, 2008)

Lumenous said:


> Personally I think it's a good idea :thumbsup: One of the problems I often encounter when searching forums is the ability to search using related keywords. In this case a short and sweet title would go along way toward helping future 'searchers'.
> 
> How about _Enable 120P Programing Functions in Novatac 120T and 120E_?
> 
> ...



The only reason I hesitate to rename it, is that I don't want people who have read it before to have trouble re-finding it.

I agree that your title is better than my original one, but since this is also valuable information for P model owners, I wanted to come up with something more generic rather than singling out the T and E models. I'm concerned that if I make the title specific to T and E models that perhaps P model owners won't even bother reading it.

I was thinking maybe something like this:

NovaTac EDC - Undocumented Features Discovered
or
NovaTac EDC - The Missing Manual

Opinions? Ideas?

Thanks


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## LLCoolBeans (Nov 20, 2008)

streetmaster said:


> I would suggest removing the word "CRACKED" from the title.



I agree, as it turns out, it's not really a Crack at all. We simply discovered, presumably, how the flashlight UI was actually intended to work. (i.e. turn on customization mode, set your settings, turn off customization mode to prevent your settings from being changed inadvertently, re-enable customization mode to made further changes, and so on)

It is unclear whether NovaTac was dishonest with it's customers and tried to hide this functionality or whether they just didn't know it existed. I'm leaning toward ignorance as if they had known about it, I presume they could have just removed it. Who knows.

It's unfortunate that it took such a long time for NovaTac EDC owners to get the real scoop on how the light they paid for actually works.


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## The Sun (Nov 20, 2008)

THANKS AGAIN!!!


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## kaichu dento (Nov 20, 2008)

LLCoolBeans said:


> I was thinking maybe something like this:
> 
> NovaTac EDC - Undocumented Features Discovered
> or
> ...


How about condensing them both into the title?
NovaTac EDC - Undocumented Features Discovered - The Missing Manual


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## The Sun (Nov 20, 2008)

Level 1... hehehehe


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## streetmaster (Nov 20, 2008)

Isn't it amazing how many things your light can do? 

Words can't express how much I love my NovaTac 120E/P. 

Now I'm even MORE anxious to get my Storm. 

It's MY light and I want it NOW!


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## matrixshaman (Nov 20, 2008)

Here is some info on the brightness issue discussed earlier. At this point there is probably not much doubt about that issue. That is after reprogramming an E or T model they do not lose the highest level. But for anyone who had any nagging doubts I think this will make it certain. I got my E or EDC model today (with a tactical tail switch). It was not programmable like a P model until I did the 250 click LLCoolBeans found. I first compared it side by side with my P model Novatac on high and noted it was just a little brighter. I got out the Light Meter and measured it at an exact distance of 33" and at 20" from the light meter. I measured the battery voltage also. I recorded the numbers. I then did the reprogramming to a P model. I made sure I had the exact same battery voltage to within 0.01 volts. It was identical. I checked again on the light meter with the reprogrammed light and I got identical numbers at 33" and 20" so I will say it conclusively does NOT lose the high level or resort to an 85 lumen light. Woohoo! I also put it side by side with my P model again and noted it was still just a little brighter looking. Nice tint too. I didn't know when I bought this light a few days ago I was going to get a P model  
Thanks again LLCoolBeans !


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## streetmaster (Nov 20, 2008)

Thanks for taking the time to confirm that information. :twothumbs


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## matrixshaman (Nov 21, 2008)

Just a quick note on option 4 - I've usually preferred to have force settings turned off. It seems in some cases having it off has caused problems with reprogramming the E and T models but with the light I've got I haven't had any problem with it off. I've changed everything from the original EDC model settings and everything is working as it should for a P model. 

BTW - streetmaster thanks for the suggestion of setting the light bezel down on a desk to try the ~ 250 clicks - that was easier that way.


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## streetmaster (Nov 21, 2008)

matrixshaman said:


> BTW - streetmaster thanks for the suggestion of setting the light bezel down on a desk to try the ~ 250 clicks - that was easier that way.



 You're very welcome. That's the ONLY way I could do it. I tried so many times the "normal" way, my thumb/hand kept cramping up by 130 clicks! I was so ready to give up. But this way I can get to the 250 the first try almost every time.

I also have force mode disabled. I enjoy the light much better this way. I haven't had any problems with mine either, and I've tinkered with just about everything. 

I really like the simple momentary too. I love it... this light does *everything* (well, almost :devil

The only thing better than a NovaTac is... TWO NovaTacs!! And I have a black Storm on pre-order.


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## Kamakazikev24 (Nov 21, 2008)

So do you the 4 levels of the 120p or just able to programe the 3 levels of the E and T version?
Also can you get a flat tail switch for the E And T versions so that they will tail stand?


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## tx101 (Nov 21, 2008)

Kamakazikev24 said:


> So do you the 4 levels of the 120p or just able to programe the 3 levels of the E and T version?
> Also can you get a flat tail switch for the E And T versions so that they will tail stand?



You can get the flat tail switch from Lighthound


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## streetmaster (Nov 21, 2008)

Kamakazikev24 said:


> So do you the 4 levels of the 120p or just able to programe the 3 levels of the E and T version?
> Also can you get a flat tail switch for the E And T versions so that they will tail stand?



You get all the 4 slots on both the T and E. Last I remember, the T and E had 4 modes. Three brightness settings and Tactical or Emergency strobe. 

And like tx101 said, LightHound sells the flat tail caps. I gotta get me one of those. I like the accessibility if the extended button, but you gotta love a "do-all" light that can tailstand too.


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## LLCoolBeans (Nov 21, 2008)

matrixshaman said:


> Just a quick note on option 4 - I've usually preferred to have force settings turned off. It seems in some cases having it off has caused problems with reprogramming the E and T models but with the light I've got I haven't had any problem with it off. I've changed everything from the original EDC model settings and everything is working as it should for a P model.



I guess I should have been clearer about this, I apologize for any confusion.

Having Option 4 disabled does not cause problems with programming, per say. Just that if you are not used to Option 4 being disabled, you are likely to get confused when programming your light (like me). If you are used to a disabled Option 4, by all means leave it disabled.

When I entered the back door for the first time and enabled Option 9, somehow Option 4 got disabled inadvertently. So, when I went to try and program the light, I thought something really strange was happening. As it turns out, it was just that Option 4 was disabled.

So, the reason I have the note about Option 4, is just in case it got inadvertently turned off for anyone else.


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## LLCoolBeans (Nov 21, 2008)

No one has any more thoughts on improving the title of this thread?


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## streetmaster (Nov 21, 2008)

LLCoolBeans said:


> No one has any more thoughts on improving the title of this thread?



Something like: NovaTac 120E/120T Fully Programmable, BackDoor/Easter Egg Discovered

lol, I don't know, thread titles aren't my strongest ability. :thinking: :candle:


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## matrixshaman (Nov 21, 2008)

Wow CoolBeans made the CNN news ! Link


Okay way off topic except it just struck me funny that CoolBeans was on the CNN home page this morning in a roundabout way.... A dog drove a car into CoolBeans coffee shop  

streetmaster - do you know for sure the new NT's like the Storm are using the same control circuit? I'm wondering if they will also be reprogrammable? I see some have only 2 modes don't they? However I see they also mention that they can be 'customized' from the NT web site.


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## streetmaster (Nov 21, 2008)

matrixshaman said:


> streetmaster - do you know for sure the new NT's like the Storm are using the same control circuit? I'm wondering if they will also be reprogrammable? I see some have only 2 modes don't they? However I see they also mention that they can be 'customized' from the NT web site.



I'm hoping that they haven't changed anything. I've tried several times to get any bit of info from NovaTac about the new lights, by they won't tell. And no, I haven't mentioned the backdoor, that would be stupid. They just say that their new site will be up some time in January, and will have all the details about the new models. I started a thread about the new site a few days ago hoping that someone might know something and come forward, but no luck so far. I hope they don't notice that we're unlocking our E's and T's and decide to disable this on the new ones.


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## The Sun (Nov 21, 2008)

and one thing to add about the tailcaps; if you have a newer model (30K serial +) without the model engraving on the body you can get a flat tailcap from lighthound that says 120P on it, (i guess one cool thing about the newer runs hehehe). only you would know the truth mmmwwwaaaahhhhh hahaha!!!:devil::laughing:




streetmaster said:


> You get all the 4 slots on both the T and E. Last I remember, the T and E had 4 modes. Three brightness settings and Tactical or Emergency strobe.
> 
> And like tx101 said, LightHound sells the flat tail caps. I gotta get me one of those. I like the accessibility if the extended button, but you gotta love a "do-all" light that can tailstand too.


----------



## JJV (Nov 22, 2008)

OK update on my attempt-last night my battery died in my 120E. I changed the battery and couldn't even turn the light on. :shakehead After much futzing around, I got it to turn on but it was as a 120E (still not bad but now that I've had it the other way I want it back!). So I tried for and HOUR last night to get it to go back and it would not work! I probably clicked well over 3000 times trying to get this to work again. I get up to the options menu and then once I hit the ramping, I wind up turning the light off. I was getting really mad (and sore) so I gave up. Ih honestly think I may have fried the switch, because it's not terribly responsive anymore.  Maybe I will give it another go today :sigh:


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## streetmaster (Nov 22, 2008)

JJV said:


> OK update on my attempt-last night my battery died in my 120E. I changed the battery and couldn't even turn the light on. :shakehead After much futzing around, I got it to turn on but it was as a 120E (still not bad but now that I've had it the other way I want it back!). So I tried for and HOUR last night to get it to go back and it would not work! I probably clicked well over 3000 times trying to get this to work again. I get up to the options menu and then once I hit the ramping, I wind up turning the light off. I was getting really mad (and sore) so I gave up. Ih honestly think I may have fried the switch, because it's not terribly responsive anymore.  Maybe I will give it another go today :sigh:



Man, that really sucks. Especially since you got a taste of the P.

But you know what? They make new switches every day.:naughty: 

Keep trying, you'll be glad you did. You just need a break from all the clicking. 

Do a factory reset, then start over.


----------



## JJV (Nov 22, 2008)

streetmaster said:


> Man, that really sucks. Especially since you got a taste of the P.
> 
> But you know what? They make new switches every day.:naughty:
> 
> ...



After my wife got done laughing and rolling her eyes at me getting more and more frustrated, that's what she said-knock it off and try again tomorrow. 

I've been wanting a flat switch anyway :twothumbs


----------



## streetmaster (Nov 22, 2008)

JJV said:


> I've been wanting a flat switch anyway :twothumbs


Speaking of switches, is there any place that sells them cheaper than the $19.99 at LightHound?


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## SnWnMe (Nov 22, 2008)

Send it in to Novatac for warranty and tell them that the switch broke.


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## The Sun (Nov 22, 2008)

streetmaster said:


> Speaking of switches, is there any place that sells them cheaper than the $19.99 at LightHound?


 

yes www.yourcornerstore.com sells them for like $12.99 i saw them there yesterday when i pre-ordered my Storm, and 120M!!!:twothumbs

here's the link: http://yourcornerstore.com/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=3717_3952 and...i'm sorry it's $12.08:twothumbs


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## streetmaster (Nov 22, 2008)

The Sun said:


> yes www.yourcornerstore.com sells them for like $12.99 i saw them there yesterday when i pre-ordered my Storm, and 120M!!!:twothumbs



Thank you!!

I wish we could find out if the new models can be "unlocked" too. I sure hope so!


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## The Sun (Nov 22, 2008)

a rare moment caught in the wild; we see one male and one female Novatac 120T performing their secretive mating ritual that will transform theri lives forever, forming..... the Flat-tailed Novatac 120T/P!!!! ohgeez :naughty:


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## maroast (Nov 22, 2008)

Great job on cracking the light...I tip my hat to you! But I have to say, after programing the light in all different configurations, I found that I really like the way my tactical is programed from the factory...its cool to now have the option though.


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## Lumenous (Nov 22, 2008)

The Sun said:


>



The Sun, 

Where did you get that nice pocket clip? It looks like stainless steel. :thumbsup:


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## streetmaster (Nov 22, 2008)

Looks like he polished the OEM spring steel clip. Better watch out for rust 

*The Sun*, I believe that picture would be considered flashlight porn. Naughty, naughty :naughty:


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## JJV (Nov 22, 2008)

Further update: I got it to work again!! I still think I fried the switch though, as it sometimes does not react to a click (even on or off).

Thanks for that link, The Sun!


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## streetmaster (Nov 22, 2008)

JJV said:


> Further update: I got it to work again!! I still think I fried the switch though, as it sometimes does not react to a click (even on or off).
> 
> Thanks for that link, The Sun!



I knew you could do it. :twothumbs


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## The Sun (Nov 22, 2008)

no prob. for the link, and yes it's the SS clip polished with a small amount of brasso for protection. i put a little silicon on it once every week or two, just to make sure it doesn't start to pit. i don't think it will be a problem. if you polish it to the point where it looks like it has a coating on it, it will take a lot to stain, or start the rusting process. 350, 400, 600, 1500 grit works perfect with little effort (with a little shot o' oil on the last 1500 step), the coating on all the SS (bezel included) doesn't take much to get off. it looks awesome on the black models, i like the the black clip on the NA HA better though. i'm about to get some Ti, or stainless bezels from RPM soon. i was thinkin of taking a trip to the machine shop next weekend and having some bezels made, something different, but i haven't come up with the design yet. something that has the same profile as the tall RPM bezels, but maybe with different crenallations??? who knows!!!

-streetmaster- the first thing i'm doing when i get the new models, is slapping them suckers bezels down on a table and havin me a click fest to see!!!


heres a good pic of the clip (i just like puttin' pic's on here hehehe)


----------



## The Sun (Nov 22, 2008)

spiderman doesn't look like he feels too well back there.


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## The Sun (Nov 22, 2008)

streetmaster said:


> Looks like he polished the OEM spring steel clip. Better watch out for rust
> 
> *The Sun*, I believe that picture would be considered flashlight porn. Naughty, naughty :naughty:


 
 thats what my wife says i'm doing when im on CPF, "looking at flashlight porn." i'm the larry flint of the flashlight world!!!


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## streetmaster (Nov 22, 2008)

The Sun said:


> thats what my wife says i'm doing when im on CPF, "looking at flashlight porn." i'm the larry flint of the flashlight world!!!



Looking at it and "producing" it are two different things my friend. You took a picture of the NovaTacs "doing it". What's that make you? Shame...:tsk:


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## The Sun (Nov 22, 2008)

streetmaster said:


> Looking at it and "producing" it are two different things my friend. You took a picture of the NovaTacs "doing it". What's that make you? Shame...:tsk:


 
hey, LLCoolBeans found out how 120T/P's are made, i'm just the photographer!!! and hey that's nature...it's a beautiful thing!!!:laughing:


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## streetmaster (Nov 22, 2008)

The Sun said:


> hey, LLCoolBeans found out how 120T/P's are made, i'm just the photographer!!! and hey that's nature...it's a beautiful thing!!!:laughing:



Haha! :laughing: Ok, just wanted to make sure you weren't forcing them to "do it". Flashlights have rights too ya know.

Hey, maybe you could get a NovaTac and a SureFire together and see what happens? :devil:

A little wine, candlelight...


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## The Sun (Nov 22, 2008)

streetmaster said:


> Haha! :laughing: Ok, just wanted to make sure you weren't forcing them to "do it". Flashlights have rights too ya know.
> 
> Hey, maybe you could get a NovaTac and a SureFire together and see what happens? :devil:
> 
> A little wine, candlelight...


 
barry white is already playin my friend!!! that would be awesome!!! then we could have some little ShnovaFire E120PB's ...nice

*OMG!!! its a monster, those are some ugly babies!!! *


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## LLCoolBeans (Nov 22, 2008)

streetmaster said:


> Haha! :laughing: Ok, just wanted to make sure you weren't forcing them to "do it". Flashlights have rights too ya know.


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## The Sun (Nov 22, 2008)

:eeew:i think i'm gonna:green: i think they would look better if they came out backwards!!! i'll have to play the barry white in reverse next time.


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## streetmaster (Nov 22, 2008)

The Sun said:


> :eeew:i think i'm gonna:green: i think it would they would look better if they came out backwards!!! i'll have to play the barry white in reverse next time.



Eew. :sick2: I'd put that one up for adoption. Maybe cross-breeding was a bad idea... :shrug:


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## The Sun (Nov 22, 2008)

streetmaster said:


> Eew. :sick2: I'd put that one up for adoption. Maybe cross-breeding was a bad idea... :shrug:


 

i don't know? kinda looks like an EagleTac T10C they're ugly in a good way


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## matrixshaman (Nov 23, 2008)

I came across something I did not know before on the Novatac. I had taken my 120P and 120E (reprogrammed) out to a white wall location where I could compare beams at a distance. I put both on high and to my surprise the 120E looked a lot dimmer. After reporting here with the light meter they were both the same I couldn't understand this situation. I checked batteries and they were okay so I started checking programming in the 120E. What I had previously thought was that a click-press would always take you the the highest level your light has (level 22 or what is labeled 'Max' in the Novatac manual). But apparently that is not the case. It turned out my click press was taking me to level 21 or 20. By doing a click-click-press I readjusted the highest level to level 22. I'm not sure how it got bumped down a notch or two - probably and inadvertent set of clicks. Now the 120E is back to being the same as or a tiny bit brighter than my 120P.


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## tequilathursday (Nov 23, 2008)

Hey guys. Haven't posted in a couple years, but this novatac thing piqued my interest. I've tried for days to get it to work. Maybe I'm stupid. When Henry gave us our easter present I could never get my edc b42gt to reprogram either. 

I'll have to order a new switch for my 120e since I think I wore it out trying lol.

I can enter the program mode, then I click, press. Then as I try to get to option 9 I get the error flash. I can get to it ramping once in a while but then nothing. I must have tried it 100 times so far. Guys at work thought I was from a different planet. 
btw: The bezel down clicking trick does make it much easier.

Would someone please dumb down the procedure a little for me. I'm either dumb as a rock or I'm missing something. ( probably both) 

Thanks


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## LLCoolBeans (Nov 23, 2008)

tequilathursday said:


> Hey guys. Haven't posted in a couple years, but this novatac thing piqued my interest. I've tried for days to get it to work. Maybe I'm stupid. When Henry gave us our easter present I could never get my edc b42gt to reprogram either.
> 
> I'll have to order a new switch for my 120e since I think I wore it out trying lol.
> 
> ...



I think I may have the answer to this one. Try a fresh battery. Here is a quote from the manual:

_"If there is insufficient power to remember the setting, the light will
flash rapidly for 2 seconds then turn off. The selected changes will
take effect temporarily but be deleted at the next battery change or
soft reset."_


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## tequilathursday (Nov 23, 2008)

Hey LL! Thanks for the reply. I just got 5 boxes of surefires and I have tried a new battery once I noticed the max setting step down. Still nothing. 

I always thought being an auto mechanic would give me early arthritis in my fingers but now I can tell my children it was LLCoolBeans. 

I will keep trying. 

I've read all the posts and the user manual for the P model. I really feel dumb


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## LLCoolBeans (Nov 23, 2008)

I just re-read your post. I think I might have noticed the problem.



tequilathursday said:


> I can enter the program mode, *then I click, press.* Then as I try to get to option 9 I get the error flash. I can get to it ramping once in a while but then nothing. I must have tried it 100 times so far. Guys at work thought I was from a different planet.



It's not 250 clicks then a click-press, it's a 250 * click then press. Does that make sense? Do not click-press after you have already entered the options menu.

Once you are in the options menu, single click to cycle through the options. You can also double click to reverse cycle through the options.

Try that and let me know if you are successful or not.


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## tequilathursday (Nov 23, 2008)

10 more tries and nothing. after 250 it flashes. Is that correct? then I click - press. then I click 9 times for option nine then press? sometimes i can watch it ramp through 5 or six brightnesses then the light shuts off. Other times I get nothing. i can tell its not enabled since i get no response from the click click click press from on to enter programming mode. What the heck am I doing wrong? 

Btw, Thanks for your patience


Rich


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## LLCoolBeans (Nov 23, 2008)

tequilathursday said:


> 10 more tries and nothing. after 250 it flashes. Is that correct? then I click - press. then I click 9 times for option nine then press? sometimes i can watch it ramp through 5 or six brightnesses then the light shuts off. Other times I get nothing. i can tell its not enabled since i get no response from the click click click press from on to enter programming mode. What the heck am I doing wrong?
> 
> Btw, Thanks for your patience
> 
> ...



Rich,

Sounds like you are enabling option 9 if you see the ramping up. So, I'm not sure what's going wrong.

You are doing the click-click-click-press from on and not off, right? And it should really be a click-click-click-press-hold-release, are you not doing the hold-release maybe?

Have you tried adjusting one of your brightness levels? After you have enabled option 9, *from on*, do a click-click-press and hold. Keep holding and you should see the light start ramping up in brightness and or blinking as it cycles through the Strobes. Release when you are at the desired brightness level. Does that work?


----------



## tequilathursday (Nov 23, 2008)

My switch is getting more and more funky to the point I have to use excessive force at times. I will order a new switch and try again. my hands could use a rest anyway. This is very frustrating.

Thanks for your help. I'll keep ya posted.


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## streetmaster (Nov 23, 2008)

Is there any way of taking the switch apart and cleaning it? There has to be a way to fix it rather than replace it.


----------



## LLCoolBeans (Nov 23, 2008)

tequilathursday said:


> My switch is getting more and more funky to the point I have to use excessive force at times. I will order a new switch and try again. my hands could use a rest anyway. This is very frustrating.
> 
> Thanks for your help. I'll keep ya posted.



Well, that's a bummer. Good luck.


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## LLCoolBeans (Nov 23, 2008)

streetmaster said:


> Is there any way of taking the switch apart and cleaning it? There has to be a way to fix it rather than replace it.



If you could make a tool to remove the retaining ring without destroying anything in the process, you might be able to do something. I doubt it's dirty though, probably just a warn out spring. I don't know enough about how those switches work to say.


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## JJV (Nov 23, 2008)

tequilathursday said:


> My switch is getting more and more funky to the point I have to use excessive force at times. I will order a new switch and try again. my hands could use a rest anyway. This is very frustrating.
> 
> Thanks for your help. I'll keep ya posted.



TT- I had the same problem as you. I'm not even sure how I got it to work after all the problems I had with it, but it did. And I definitely agree with you that all this playing around with the switch burns it out after time-mine is still acting a little crazy. But I'll take that as an excuse to order a new switch


----------



## litetube (Nov 23, 2008)

You can open up the switch to a certain extent. The retaining ring is removable with a set of snap ring pliers being careful not to gouge the threads. . The design of these switches should be able to take hundreds of clicks and still function normally . They are not like normal "clickie" switches but more like cell phone buttons or the like .


----------



## matrixshaman (Nov 23, 2008)

tequilathursday said:


> 10 more tries and nothing. after 250 it flashes. Is that correct? then I click - press. then I click 9 times for option nine then press? sometimes i can watch it ramp through 5 or six brightnesses then the light shuts off. Other times I get nothing. i can tell its not enabled since i get no response from the click click click press from on to enter programming mode. What the heck am I doing wrong?
> 
> Btw, Thanks for your patience
> 
> ...



I'm wondering if you are turning off the light after changing option 9? To save an option you have to turn off the light before it times out (10 seconds). If it times out it will flash 6 times I think. And if it times out it saves nothing so you are back to square one.


----------



## streetmaster (Nov 23, 2008)

litetube said:


> You can open up the switch to a certain extent. The retaining ring is removable with a set of snap ring pliers being careful not to gouge the threads. . The design of these switches should be able to take hundreds of clicks and still function normally . They are not like normal "clickie" switches but more like cell phone buttons or the like .



I don't understand why these guys' switches are "wearing out". My light has easily endured 1000 clicks in the last 3 days (that's not counting God knows how many during the months before that) and is showing no signs of any problems. Of course I shouldn't have said that, I'm sure I just jinxed myself.


----------



## Lumenous (Nov 23, 2008)

The Sun said:


> no prob. for the link, and yes it's the SS clip polished with a small amount of brasso for protection. i put a little silicon on it once every week or two, just to make sure it doesn't start to pit. i don't think it will be a problem. if you polish it to the point where it looks like it has a coating on it, it will take a lot to stain, or start the rusting process. 350, 400, 600, 1500 grit works perfect with little effort (with a little shot o' oil on the last 1500 step), the coating on all the SS (bezel included) doesn't take much to get off. it looks awesome on the black models, i like the the black clip on the NA HA better though. i'm about to get some Ti, or stainless bezels from RPM soon. i was thinkin of taking a trip to the machine shop next weekend and having some bezels made, something different, but i haven't come up with the design yet. something that has the same profile as the tall RPM bezels, but maybe with different crenallations??? who knows!!!




I've been away for a few days. Thanks for the thorough explanation. I'm going to try that out. The contrast between the SS and the black body makes the flashlight look real nice.


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## tx101 (Nov 24, 2008)

I dont think its a good idea to keep trying the 250 click thing repeatly in one
go. Try it, if you fail leave it for 30 minutes and then come back and try again.
Your arm/finger gets tried and when frustration sets in you press too hard.

Thats my 2 cents


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## cdosrun (Nov 24, 2008)

streetmaster said:


> Is there any way of taking the switch apart and cleaning it? There has to be a way to fix it rather than replace it.



I haven't played around with mine too much because I have the 120P but my switch was playing up at one point in that it wasn't working reliably with every press. By removing the retaining ring behind the switch, you can remove the PCB which has a low profile momentary contact switch on it, covered by some clear tape. All I did was to squirt some switch cleaner through the holes on the reverse of the PCB, under the switch and work it a bit by clicking, mine has been fine since.

Andrew


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## streetmaster (Nov 24, 2008)

tx101 said:


> I dont think its a good idea to keep trying the 250 click thing repeatly in one
> go. Try it, if you fail leave it for 30 minutes and then come back and try again.
> Your arm/finger gets tried and when frustration sets in you press too hard.
> 
> Thats my 2 cents



Too true! I can speak from experience.  

I got so frustrated I nearly threw my NovaTac. Then I would have REALLY been mad. :devil:

But I took a break, and that's when I figured out the "bezel down on the desk" trick to make the clicking easier. If you hold your thumb against your middle finger for stability, and use your middle finger for the clicking, it's your best chance at getting it right.

And don't think about click-hold once you get the 250. Just hold for a sec and release once you see it start to flash. Then you're in the options menu. Don't try to get that last click in there before you hold. If you do, it causes you to pause and that'll mess you up. You should have the manual in front of you opened to the page that shows the menu options so you can go right to where you need to at a glance. Otherwise, you won't know what to do once you get there and it will reset itself.


*cdosrun wrote:*


> I haven't played around with mine too much because I have the 120P but my switch was playing up at one point in that it wasn't working reliably with every press. By removing the retaining ring behind the switch, you can remove the PCB which has a low profile momentary contact switch on it, covered by some clear tape. All I did was to squirt some switch cleaner through the holes on the reverse of the PCB, under the switch and work it a bit by clicking, mine has been fine since.



Thanks for that info. I knew there had to be something you could do. Because the switch isn't wearing out, it's just getting dirty.

I just don't want people to think they have to buy a $20 tailcap if their switch is acting up. I realize some folks won't want to bother with taking it apart, but some will.


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## tequilathursday (Nov 24, 2008)

Hey guys. Thanks for the help. I finally got it to program, screwed it up by enabling tactical momentary or something. Did another factory reset, re read the manual twice, reprogrammed to my liking and works like a charm. I should have read the last couple posts about the switches because first thing this morning I ordered a new switch. oh well... At least I got plenty of finger exercising lol

Anyway.... Thanks again for your assistance



TT


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## LLCoolBeans (Nov 24, 2008)

I'm going to change the title of this thread today. If you have an objection, please speak up.


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## streetmaster (Nov 24, 2008)

LLCoolBeans said:


> I'm going to change the title of this thread today. If you have an objection, please speak up.



No objections here. Did you decide on the title?


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## LLCoolBeans (Nov 24, 2008)

I'm thinking:

NovaTac EDC - The Missing Manual (Undocumented Features Discovered!)


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## streetmaster (Nov 24, 2008)

Sounds good.


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## The Sun (Nov 24, 2008)

LLCoolBeans said:


> I'm thinking:
> 
> NovaTac EDC - The Missing Manual (Undocumented Features Discovered!)


 
sounds awesome!!! and BTW, thank you for also activating my new "hord Novatac's" phase, i am in the process of buying any and all Novatacs in the free world. i think i have like three more coming tomorrow my OCD kicked in thanks a million :drunk::sleepy::santa:


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## LLCoolBeans (Nov 24, 2008)

To all of you who have thanked me, you are quite welcome. I appreciate your praise, but I could not have done it without the help and support of the flashlight community, especially the resources available to me, here at CPF. So, please thank yourselves.


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## streetmaster (Nov 24, 2008)

The Sun said:


> sounds awesome!!! and BTW, thank you for also activating my new "hord Novatac's" phase, i am in the process of buying any and all Novatacs in the free world. i think i have like three more coming tomorrow my OCD kicked in thanks a million :drunk::sleepy::santa:



Hey The Sun, if you accidentally end up with one too many, I would give it a nice home. :laughing: I only have one, with one black Storm on preorder. But like yourself, I am in love with NovaTac at the moment. :buddies:


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## The Sun (Nov 24, 2008)

LLCoolBeans said:


> To all of you who have thanked me, you are quite welcome. I appreciate your praise, but I could not have done it without the help and support of the flashlight community, especially the resources available to me, here at CPF. So, please thank yourselves.


 
no really thank you i just took the pictures JK!


-streetmaster- i just don't get it, i'm tradin' lights, sellin' them on CPFM and the sort just to feed my Novatac hunger. i'll probably regret it later, but i love these little things. i can't wait til the pre-orders come in so we can see if the clicky-tricky works on them. i have two low serial 120T's on hold for me at botach right now that i'm gonna seal the deal on tomorrow. they have some still left if anyone else is still interested in them. i emailed them to make sure and they were very helpful locating them for me.


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## Imworking (Nov 25, 2008)

In keeping with the current 250 click fever, I went back and reprogrammed my girlfriends HDS B42, worked like a charm. She looked at me like a special needs child when I told her that I hacked her light (it was mine but I lost control of it) so it remembered her last setting. She uses it as a nightlight on the .3 setting but does not seem to be able to master the triple click action. This way it just stays on ultra low for her. The nice thing is it retains the settings after battery replacement. This has been one very useful thread.


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## streetmaster (Nov 25, 2008)

The Sun said:


> -streetmaster- i just don't get it, i'm tradin' lights, sellin' them on CPFM and the sort just to feed my Novatac hunger. i'll probably regret it later, but i love these little things. i can't wait til the pre-orders come in so we can see if the clicky-tricky works on them. i have two low serial 120T's on hold for me at botach right now that i'm gonna seal the deal on tomorrow. they have some still left if anyone else is still interested in them. i emailed them to make sure and they were very helpful locating them for me.



I wish I could afford to get another one from Botach. That's where I got mine, and I'm pretty sure they may be the only people that still have the low-serial ones in stock. I guess I'll just have to wait (seems like forever:mecry for the Storms to come in at YourCornerStore.


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## Daniel_sk (Nov 25, 2008)

What is considered a low serial number? So I can email botach and asked them if they have any left (and a shipping quote to Slovakia).

So I can just buy the E model and transform it into the more expensive P model?


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## streetmaster (Nov 25, 2008)

Daniel_sk said:


> What is considered a low serial number? So I can email botach and asked them if they have any left (and a shipping quote to Slovakia).
> 
> So I can just buy the E model and transform it into the more expensive P model?



Anything in the 1XXXX and 2XXXX runs are considered better. The ones in the recent batch 3XXXX have been updated and have slight differences in build.


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## Daniel_sk (Nov 25, 2008)

Thanks. Anyway, I've just found out that Botach is not "international-shipping friendly", they take only bank wire transfers from non-US customers, which is too expensive, slow, not safe. I'll have to find a similar deal somewhere else.


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## LLCoolBeans (Nov 25, 2008)

Daniel_sk said:


> So I can just buy the E model and transform it into the more expensive P model?



Well, yes and no. A better way to describe it would be that they are the same light only with different default settings.

Nothing will transform an E into a P, but the E can do everything that the P can do.


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## prime77 (Nov 27, 2008)

Guys I need help. I'm trying to do this to my 120E. I do the 250 ckicks, it starts to flash and then I click and hold. Then I click nine times and I keep getting what I think is the error message. It flashes 5 or six times and stays on what I think is primary. What am I doing wrong?


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## SaturnNyne (Nov 27, 2008)

prime77: It sounds like you're getting into the options menu and then just clicking the button 9 times as fast as you can. This results in what you're describing, I tested it on my 120P. What you need to do is get into the menu with the 250+hold, then let off when it starts flashing. At that point, you can relax, you have about ten seconds before it kicks you back out due to inactivity. At that point, you just need to slowly click, from one item to the next, to step through the various menu items until you get to the one with the light ramping up from dim to bright, which happens to be 8 clicks into the menu since it's the 9th option. When you get to that, just hold down the button until the light turns off and you're done.


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## streetmaster (Nov 27, 2008)

Do you have the "P" owners' manual? If not, download the EDC P UserGuide from the NovaTac site. You need to have the manual open to the page that shows the options menu, page 5. I think you may be going past option 9. You must identify the different indicators of each level as you're on your way to option 9. Don't just click 9 times. Be sure to pause just long enough after each of the 9 clicks to see the blink that the light is doing, to be sure you're at the right place in the menu. Once you get to option 9 and the light goes from dim to bright, press and hold the button, the light will display dim to bright again and then turn off to indicate that option being turned on . If you see that, you've got it. The best advice I can give anyone: * Read the manual at least twice, especially the programming section.*.

Below is a screen-grab of the options menu indicators.






Edit: Sorry, I was too slow making my post, SaturnNyne said it well.


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## prime77 (Nov 27, 2008)

> prime77: It sounds like you're getting into the options menu and then just clicking the button 9 times as fast as you can.


That is what I was doing. I got so excited that I made it through the 250 clicks that I just clicked fast to get to option 9 because I thought I didn't have enough time. I'm at work now so I'll have to wait until I get home to try it out. How much time do you have between the different option menus before the light goes back to normal? 



> Do you have the "P" owners' manual? If not, download the EDC P UserGuide from the NovaTac site. You need to have the manual open to the page that shows the options menu, page 5.


Yea, I printed out the manual and had it opened to that exact page. If I do get to option 9 how fast does the light go from dim to bright? and do I have to hold the button down before it gets to full bright? 

I can't wait to try again.


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## LLCoolBeans (Nov 27, 2008)

prime77 said:


> That is what I was doing. I got so excited that I made it through the 250 clicks that I just clicked fast to get to option 9 because I thought I didn't have enough time.



Oh, sorry bro. I guess I should have been more verbose in that respect.




prime77 said:


> I'm at work now so I'll have to wait until I get home to try it out. How much time do you have between the different option menus before the light goes back to normal?



You have approximately 10 seconds from your last click until the options menu goes away, so there is absolutely no rush. So, for instance, click once to get from option 1 to option 2, now you have another 10 seconds before the options menu times out.




prime77 said:


> Yea, I printed out the manual and had it opened to that exact page. If I do get to option 9 how fast does the light go from dim to bright? and do I have to hold the button down before it gets to full bright?



Each option has it's own unique behavior, those behaviors are just there to differentiate them from each other. You do not have to hold the button down before it gets to full bright. It will just do that over and over again until the 10 seconds has elapsed. The ramping is just to signify the option. Once you get to option 9, hold hold down the button to enable it.


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## prime77 (Nov 27, 2008)

I did it. :twothumbs Thanks for the help guys. I made it much harder than it actually was.


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## SnWnMe (Nov 28, 2008)

Coincidence that nobody's put Novatacs up for sale in CPFM since two days after this thread started? They were for sale just about every week before then.


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## streetmaster (Nov 28, 2008)

prime77 said:


> I did it. :twothumbs Thanks for the help guys. I made it much harder than it actually was.


Yeah, I think it has something to do with the mad 250 clicks. Tends to get a person a little stressed out. 



SnWnMe said:


> Coincidence that nobody's put Novatacs up for sale in CPFM since two days after this thread started? They were for sale just about every week before then.


The T's and E's just became more desirable, and the P's just lost about 40 bucks in value.


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## ecallahan (Dec 1, 2008)

Alright, I need help! I just received my 120-E today, serial number 20xxx. Reading this thread prompted my to buy it.

I have been following this thread, have studied the 120P manual for two weeks now waiting for my light to arrive, everything. If I could get the light to the programming stage, I'm pretty sure I know how to go up through the menu and program the light. BUT, I've tried about 5 times, and can't get the light to flash (enter programming).

I turn the light on to the Primary level. I set it down and follow your directions on/off, on/off in fairly rapid clicks until I get to 250. I've tried 250, 251, 253, but when I do my final click and press, the light just turns on to the maximum setting. 

Frustrating. What am I doing wrong?

By the way, I can see why all the fuss over the NovaTac lights. Even if I don't get it to program, I will still like the light.

BUT, I'd rather be able to program. Thanks for any help you can offer.


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## Everett (Dec 1, 2008)

> I've tried 250, 251, 253, but when I do my final click and press, the light just turns on to the maximum setting.


Don't count clicks. I suspect that it actually takes 255 (overflow an 8-bit variable). Regardless of the actual number, just keep going until the light flashes. Only then should you transition to a press.


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## chaoss (Dec 1, 2008)

I am having trouble as well with my 120E sn. 20xxx. I can reach the options menu and i am able to get to #9 (dim to bright) at which point i do a press/hold and the light does a dim/bright-off. I then release the button after a few seconds and the light comes on to primary.

I also tried enabling the force setting (#4) and did the 250+ sequence again and still no luck .

*Nevermind-i'm in!!!*


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## ecallahan (Dec 1, 2008)

Everett said:


> Don't count clicks. I suspect that it actually takes 255 (overflow an 8-bit variable). Regardless of the actual number, just keep going until the light flashes. Only then should you transition to a press.


 
Thanks, I will give that a try.


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## waddup (Dec 1, 2008)

can i get the 'disorienting strobe' on my 120E?


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## streetmaster (Dec 1, 2008)

waddup said:


> can i get the 'disorienting strobe' on my 120E?


Yes. Once you unlock it, it can do all functions.



ecallahan said:


> I turn the light on to the Primary level. I set it down and follow your directions on/off, on/off in fairly rapid clicks until I get to 250. I've tried 250, 251, 253, but when I do my final click and press, the light just turns on to the maximum setting.
> 
> Frustrating. What am I doing wrong?



You should NOT be clicking "on/off". You are not clicking fast enough. The light will go off after the first click and STAY off until you hit the 250-ish flashing point. If the light comes on before that, you've messed up and you must start over. There's no need to count clicks. Hope this helps.


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## Badger_Girl (Dec 5, 2008)

this may explain something odd...

i recently bought a 120T from botach. it came in the package unopened. the body was engraved with 120P but the tail said 120T. and it functions like a 120T...

has anyone else experienced this? now we know they are all the same, so the 120P engraving really doesnt mean much....right?


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## jlyrgr (Dec 5, 2008)

The next natural question: Best price / source for a 120e? 
Does anybody know of any "deals" right now? I have used the search function and have looked at the standard list of "CPF Discounts" but don;t see any that have Novatacs. Just thought I would ask for a little help. This will be my first flashlight purchase.


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## Fallingwater (Dec 11, 2008)

I don't own a Novatac, but I read this anyway and I'm finding it interesting. I dunno if it's already been mentioned, but if you have a sensitive thumb like I do there's no way you'll be able to do the same quick motion 250 times without feeling incredibly sore. In this case something like an electric reciprocating saw, set at the appropriate distance and with a rubber ball stuck at the end of the blade, would do the trick.


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## chaoss (Dec 11, 2008)

Fallingwater said:


> I don't own a Novatac, but I read this anyway and I'm finding it interesting. I dunno if it's already been mentioned, but if you have a sensitive thumb like I do there's no way you'll be able to do the same quick motion 250 times without feeling incredibly sore. In this case something like an electric reciprocating saw, set at the appropriate distance and with a rubber ball stuck at the end of the blade, would do the trick.


 
How about using a sewing machine? Seriously.


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## chaoss (Dec 11, 2008)

jlyrgr said:


> The next natural question: Best price / source for a 120e?
> Does anybody know of any "deals" right now? I have used the search function and have looked at the standard list of "CPF Discounts" but don;t see any that have Novatacs. Just thought I would ask for a little help. This will be my first flashlight purchase.


 
Go to the good deals section on C.P.F. marketplace and look at the Novatac 85T thread, it has quickly evolved into a veritable giveaway thread.


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## Magnus1959 (Dec 11, 2008)

SnWnMe said:


> Coincidence that nobody's put Novatacs up for sale in CPFM since two days after this thread started? They were for sale just about every week before then.


 Imagine that. Think I'll hold off from buying one for now. The novelty will wear off some in time.


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## Fallingwater (Dec 11, 2008)

chaoss said:


> How about using a sewing machine? Seriously.


I'm not familiar with sewing machines. I know there's a part that goes up-down, but isn't that where the needle is?


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## matrixshaman (Dec 11, 2008)

Fallingwater said:


> I'm not familiar with sewing machines. I know there's a part that goes up-down, but isn't that where the needle is?



Yes but the needles are removable on nearly all of them. Still I wouldn't want to try it that way as it sounds like a way to possibly damage the light.
If anyone has sore or arthritic fingers just find a friend or kid with two minutes to spare and they'll get it done for you. Other ideas - find a small rubber ball or similar and put it on top of the switch with the light standing on a table and cup the palm of your hand over the ball possibly aided by your other hand on top to push it up and down quickly. Or just hold your thumb on top and push with the palm of your other hand?


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## chaoss (Dec 11, 2008)

Fallingwater said:


> I'm not familiar with sewing machines. I know there's a part that goes up-down, but isn't that where the needle is?


 
In theory: rotate the arm/head of the machine, add a pencil eraser to the needle, adjust speed and needle travel, begin the 250 click process. Should take about 20 seconds and with no finger fatigue. 

My wife is doing a Christmas sewing project so i will investigate this further :thinking:.


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## sappyg (Dec 13, 2008)

Badger_Girl said:


> this may explain something odd...
> 
> i recently bought a 120T from botach. it came in the package unopened. the body was engraved with 120P but the tail said 120T. and it functions like a 120T...
> 
> has anyone else experienced this? now we know they are all the same, so the 120P engraving really doesnt mean much....right?


 
my 120T came botach exactly the same way. at 1st i was going to send it back. the engraved body is in the 11000 serial # range and marked as an EDC P. the tailcap is marked T and the battery tube and tailcap clearly show 30.000 series knurling. i think novatac is assembling some old stock inventory to make way for newer offerings.
once i turned it on though i knew it was a keeper.


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## LLCoolBeans (Dec 13, 2008)

matrixshaman said:


> Yes but the needles are removable on nearly all of them.



Not nearly all, all. A needle only lasts for a couple of projects, then it must be replaced.




chaoss said:


> In theory: rotate the arm/head of the machine, add a pencil eraser to the needle, adjust speed and needle travel, begin the 250 click process.



And on the first stroke, the needle will pierce the eraser and the switch boot. 


Don't put your flashlight in a sewing machine or anywhere near a reciprocating saw. If you are having difficulty pressing the button 250 times with your thumb, use the other method where you put the flashlight button up against something.


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## streetmaster (Dec 13, 2008)

sappyg said:


> my 120T came botach exactly the same way. at 1st i was going to send it back. the engraved body is in the 11000 serial # range and marked as an EDC P. the tailcap is marked T and the battery tube and tailcap clearly show 30.000 series knurling. i think novatac is assembling some old stock inventory to make way for newer offerings.
> once i turned it on though i knew it was a keeper.



Hmmm, that's very interesting. I wonder if it's only the T's that are being pieced together like that. I ordered an E and got one with a 14000 serial. The body says "NovaTac EDC 120" and has "Made in USA" and "www.NovaTac.com" on the tailcap. All the knurling and anno was "matching". 

Anybody order _other_ than a T and get the "lego" build? Personally, if this happened to me I would keep the light, but it would **** me off a little. I think it would get to me after a day or two and I'd end up calling NovaTac to see what's up. I'd end up making them replace it with a "proper" 30000 series model.


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## kaichu dento (Dec 13, 2008)

LLCoolBeans said:


> Don't put your flashlight in a sewing machine or anywhere near a reciprocating saw. If you are having difficulty pressing the button 250 times with your thumb, use the other method where you put the flashlight button up against something.


Either mechanical method can work safely if you don't have the light against anything solid. Take the needle off the sewing machine and double-sided tape a hard, thin piece of rubber onto the switch and hold the flashlight by hand so that it can move, then start the sewing machine and hand control the contact pressure so that you're getting activation with causing the light to hit the sewing machine base.

You should be able to do the same thing with the saw, but again using it without a blade and mounting it in a vice.


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## streetmaster (Dec 13, 2008)

I don't suggest trying *anything* mechanical, you're just _begging_ to ruin the switch or scratch the anno.


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## tx101 (Dec 13, 2008)

streetmaster said:


> I don't suggest trying *anything* mechanical, you're just _begging_ to ruin the switch or scratch the anno.



+1 ...... really bad idea
Your better off paying a teenager a couple of $$$ to do it for you


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## Griz (Dec 13, 2008)

Great info...My 120T is now fully programable.


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## kaichu dento (Dec 13, 2008)

streetmaster said:


> I don't suggest trying *anything* mechanical, you're just _begging_ to ruin the switch or scratch the anno.


My assumption, possibly mistaken, is that anyone undertaking working on their flashlight in this fashion would know whether or not they have the capability to do what they intended. I have no confidence in my ability to change an emitter, which is deemed by many members here to be something quite simple, but I can guarantee that I, and many others here, could do the above described operation with no trouble.

So, anyone caring to try, just remember it's the same as when you open up a light; you're on your own responsibility, even in the basics.


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## sappyg (Dec 14, 2008)

streetmaster said:


> Hmmm, that's very interesting. I wonder if it's only the T's that are being pieced together like that. I ordered an E and got one with a 14000 serial. The body says "NovaTac EDC 120" and has "Made in USA" and "www.NovaTac.com" on the tailcap. All the knurling and anno was "matching".
> 
> Anybody order _other_ than a T and get the "lego" build? Personally, if this happened to me I would keep the light, but it would **** me off a little. I think it would get to me after a day or two and I'd end up calling NovaTac to see what's up. I'd end up making them replace it with a "proper" 30000 series model.


 
it does seem a little cheesey getting a brand new light from a reputable manufacture completely mismatched. the light was advertised as a T, packed as a T. the only T on it is the 30000 series tailcap.kind of a let down. :sigh: nothing on the package says "mismatched light assembled in the dark by a blind guy". 
you would think they would want to keep a few parts around for service repair. i think i will drop novatac a line and see whet gives. i will post results here


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## streetmaster (Dec 14, 2008)

Yeah, I really can't believe they don't think people will notice a lego from the factory. I'm quite upset at the fact that NovaTac would do such a thing. And the really sad thing is that this is not an isolated case, it's been reported by other CPFers. wtf NovaTac?


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## Fallingwater (Dec 14, 2008)

The needle idea doesn't look very smart to me, either. It'd pierce through all the rubber in no time.
What saw blades I've seen, however, have no penetrating capabilities on their tips; all the teeth are on the side. You also need to put the light in such a position that the ball at the end of the blade only just touches the button; in this situation there can be no breakage because the blade doesn't go out enough to go through the ball and switch.


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## kaichu dento (Dec 14, 2008)

Fallingwater said:


> The needle idea doesn't look very smart to me, either. It'd pierce through all the rubber in no time.
> What saw blades I've seen, however, have no penetrating capabilities on their tips; all the teeth are on the side. You also need to put the light in such a position that the ball at the end of the blade only just touches the button; in this situation there can be no breakage because the blade doesn't go out enough to go through the ball and switch.


I wouldn't hesitate to use either implement, but I would also remove the needle/blade and use the housing itself as the actuator.


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## sappyg (Dec 16, 2008)

it has been 2 days now and no reply from NT about the mismatched lego light i got. i sent the e-mail to the support address.... no worries i guess. holidays are here and i am happy with my P/ T/ lego. the anno is a lot better than some i have seen that's for sure.
i have several observations re: cracking the egg.
done it several times.... failed many times....
1st time i had the thing get so hokie i had to do a reset.
2nd crack i started setting it to my prefference. battery change = default reset. 
3rd time i was afraid to mess with the settings (see 1st time).... funky flickers... what the hey. switched to AW rcr's = default reset... DANG!
4th crack attempt i starting to realize that each time i was successful i had enabled setting #4 . this seams to be necessary for this light. 
somehow i have encountered other possible doorways i think. the light freaks before i get to the backdoor and i was able to move through menues but somehow menu 9 would not show up until severl cycles of the menu. this has happened twice now i'm sure but i just am not familar enough with the NT to say for sure what is happening or exactly how. but, i think it happens when i get out of rythem while clicking.
also, the switch did get "funky" on me and became unreliable. i applied some rubbing alchohal with a toothpick in the tiny holes in the tailpiece and clicked it in real good. works like a charm. you do not have to disassemble the spring assembly to do this. the switch may well have gone through a lifetime of clicks and is still kickin'
i gotta say, this is the funnest flashlight i have. it has become a puzzle, a game, a tool, a complete torture, and a constant annoyance. i like my lego'd missfit.


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## streetmaster (Dec 16, 2008)

LOL, you know a flashlight is great when you can spend the better part of a day playing with it.


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## sappyg (Dec 16, 2008)

a day??? a day???? this sucker is like a ruebix cube on roids and i'm not that smart. i'm having fun though. :twothumbs


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## The Sun (Dec 16, 2008)

sappyg said:


> it has been 2 days now and no reply from NT about the mismatched lego light i got. i sent the e-mail to the support address.... no worries i guess.


 

call the customer service phone number!!! they will have to answer:thumbsup: i just called them a couple days ago with success.


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## sappyg (Dec 16, 2008)

The Sun said:


> call the customer service phone number!!! they will have to answer:thumbsup: i just called them a couple days ago with success.


 
i'm sure NT would hit a homerun. i don't know what to say ... "hey you sold me a chrystler/ camrey/ ford/ tacomah that does everything you said it would"... oh, by the way, i've been doing burnouts and drag racing my chrystler/ camrey/ ford/ tacomah like a man posessed by the devil":devil:
worse still, i would have to send it back and waite for a replacement that does the same thing and may not come near the anno match... dewd, i've seen some lousey anno from NT on this board. 
i think NT should be aware of their product and know what their customer receives. i agree that my light should have never left their hands the way it was assembled. it is bizzare in every way you can imagine. inside the main tube looks like it has the 30000 series spring instead of the 3 nipple contact. the serial # is 11668
in the end, my light could be the best that NT has to offer. i know that it is a lego but, it has been lego'd with their best effort.
if they sent me a nice P series switch i would'nt complain


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## Badger_Girl (Dec 18, 2008)

sappyg,

I have not inspected my light as closely as you have on yours...but I will tonight. After I got my odd ball 120L(ego) from botach, I called botach, and they could not answer any questions for me about the lego configuration.

Then I sent an email to NT, and asked all about the lego configuration of my light. They responded, but none of the questions were answered...not even an attempt. They totally ignored the questions. Their response simply said that they would send me a new 120T along with a prepaid UPS sticker to send mine back. The new one they sent me is a 30000 series and black (my original is pewter). The new 30000 series had grit and grime and smudges all over the emitter dome...obviously, I am keeping my original lego. 

I might try to call their customer service number and ask a real person about it.

Let me know if you get any further with your investigations...


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## sappyg (Dec 18, 2008)

hey BG,
today is the 4th day with no reply from my e-mail to Nt support. i have been too busy to remember to call. 
the fact that they sent you a new light and a return sticker for the other without you sending the light 1st is a real stand up gesture i think. honestly i would'nt expect answers from them as to why you got a light from them the way you received it. the person you dealt with probably does'nt know the answer anyway. i think that person and NT just want you to be happy. i would HAPPY with a P switch. 
botach would'nt know that they are selling mismatched lights and if they did they would'nt be able to fix the problem. they are distributors of a lot of products and they rely on the manufacture they buy from to deliver the goods they contract for.
i'm guessing that there are a LOT of lego'd NTs floating around that no one really knows about. i would wager that your T/ P thingy probably has the 30,000 series springy and not the 3 nipples of the older series. i believe this is an improvement in design. really, i think our lights are the best of NT to date and they even could be considered rare. also, it's obvious from your post that the lego'd NT is head and shoulders a better light than the 2nd 30,000 series in build quality. i'm not sure whether these two examples warrant an spin off thread. it's odd that ours both came frm botach, both T's... both same color
back on topic. have you cracked the egg on either or both of the lights? i wonder if your menu 4 has to be activated like mine in order to crack. this has caused me the most frustration.


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## Badger_Girl (Dec 19, 2008)

Yes, my lego light is a 16xxx serial number and it has the spring, not the nipples. And I have also been too busy to call NT....but I will eventually. 

I bought a P tailcap from LH, but it has the rubber bumper, which is not compatible with the "springed" lights....if you force it on, you will disfigure the spring in the head. If you get your P tail cap, be sure it does not have the rubber bumper. 

Yes, I agree that our situations are bizarre to say the least and very worthy of discussion.

I did crack the egg on the new black 30xxx light, but not on the original lego light... I will try that later tonight. On the 30xxx light, my option 4 was enabled by default, and I had absolutely no problems with the egg cracking and subsequent customization. Let me try the lego light...maybe they all have issues like yours.


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## sigsour (Dec 22, 2008)

Thanks LLCoolBeans!!!

I received my first Novatac 120T in the mail today and 3 minutes later; it is a 120P....I love this light so far.


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## StandardBattery (Dec 22, 2008)

I broke down and got another NovaTac 120T, just to hack... and then convert to 18650 I think. I have not done it yet because I'm saving it for Christmas. It's Lighthound's fault with their sale prices and twitter coupon deals.

Now I have 2x85P, 2x120P (1 dead), and 1x120T (soon to be 120P/18650 I hope). I wonder if when I finally bight the bullet on the Clicky if there will be a couple NovaTac on BST.


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## Pabs D (Dec 22, 2008)

Thanks to the OP for this! :twothumbs

I hacked one 85T but decided to keep the other at default as I don't mind the factory settings.


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## waddup (Dec 27, 2008)

im half way there but need guidance.

i have completed the 251 click-hold (wasn't easy thumb got real numb after 130+)

with a 3 x click - hold i can enter the programming mode.

but i dont know how to allocate levels and features to slots

id like

1.very low
2.medium
3.highest possible
4.(3 clicks hold?) tactical strobe.

any simple tips?

all im doing is switching options and features without knowing how to get em in the right place
:mecry:


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## waddup (Dec 27, 2008)

i seem to have turned my 120 into a momentary on 'low' only flashlight.

help


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## prime77 (Dec 27, 2008)

waddup said:


> im half way there but need guidance.
> 
> i have completed the 251 click-hold (wasn't easy thumb got real numb after 130+)
> 
> ...


You finished the hard part with the 250+ clicks. The rest is easy. Select the mode you want to adjust. For example you want the the first click to be very low. So click once to turn the light on. Then do 2 clicks and hold the button down and the light will start to go through the ramping levels. Wait until you get the desired level you want and then release the button. That level is stored.


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## waddup (Dec 27, 2008)

prime77 said:


> You finished the hard part with the 250+ clicks. The rest is easy. Select the mode you want to adjust. For example you want the the first click to be very low. So click once to turn the light on. Then do 2 clicks and hold the button down and the light will start to go through the ramping levels. Wait until you get the desired level you want and then release the button. That level is stored.



cool


how do i get it out of single mode low momentary only


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## waddup (Dec 27, 2008)

factory reset worked,

im good:candle::candle:

1.v-low
2.low-med
3.full 
4.tactical sr.

might have to sell all my other lights.?

(joking)


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## LLCoolBeans (Dec 27, 2008)

waddup said:


> cool
> 
> 
> how do i get it out of single mode low momentary only


 

You seem to have enabled tactical momentary. Re-enter the customization menu and turn it off.


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## litetube (Dec 27, 2008)

I cant seem to find this in this thread, Can you turn a 85 version into a 120 with higher output at 120lumens? or is 85 it regardless of the backdoor being opened?


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## sappyg (Dec 27, 2008)

that is definately a consideration litube. i would be willing to bet that you can. i'm thinking that both the hardware and software are generic to the point that the 85 has the same option 22 and the 120.


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## litetube (Dec 27, 2008)

Is level 22 on an 85 the 85lumen level? I havnt read of anyone doing the backdoor on an 85 yet? anybody??............


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## medieval (Dec 28, 2008)

Thanks to the OP for figuring this out. I now have an 85p, and I also know who to put the blame on when the two 120e's show up.


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## NVBoy (Jan 2, 2009)

I just picked up my E model today and uncracked it. Thanks for this info! This seems to be a great light.


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## Trace Rinaldi (Jan 2, 2009)

Im trying to do this and its driving me up a wall..Ha!! I have a 120E and want to unlock it.. I think I am getting passed the 250 clicks to unlock, but then how do you program it from there? Is there a link to the 120T's intructions? Either Im not getting to unlock or I dont know wha the hell to do when it is.. It just keeps acting like a 120E..

I know I know Ima lame ***


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## streetmaster (Jan 2, 2009)

NovaTac 120P Manual I'm pretty sure it's posted earlier in this thread as well.

Google is your friend...


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## The Sun (Jan 2, 2009)

just droppin in for a follow-up "this is awesome" :thumbsup:


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## cabindriver (Jan 11, 2009)

I'm late to the party but I have to add my thanks as well. It seemed much harder than doing my B42. My switch got touchy as well. Now with a new switch I got in just fine.


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## EEG (Jan 12, 2009)

I had always like the Novatac lights but found it hard to get by the 1/2 hour runtime on high. That is until I read about the back door and Botach sale prices.

I ended up getting a 120T with flat button tailcap. I was counting on this thread to convert it to a "P" and after some initial runs at the 250 clicks and a couple of the alcohol treatment for the tailcap I got it right. 

I think I have hit the following settings: Primary-60
Secondary-30
Min-.94 (I think)
Max-120 

This has worked out very well for me and I have put a fresh battery in after a week and a half with these settings. 

I have used it as my primary light during that whole time so along with the normal comparisons with some other lights and playing with it some during the day at the office as well as every night while feeding the animals. I don't normaly have very heavy use like some others but this working out great for me. 

I am waiting for the new lights to be released and see how the on-line tutorial will work for programing. It would be funny if it is essentially the same as this.

Thanks LLCOOLBEANS


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## kz1000s1 (Jan 13, 2009)

litetube said:


> Is level 22 on an 85 the 85lumen level? I havnt read of anyone doing the backdoor on an 85 yet? anybody??............



There is no level 22 on an 85P. It only goes to level 21, which always made me think the 120 was brighter because it had an extra level, not because the LED was better. Now that this back door was found, it reinforces that belief.

Now if I can just figure out what button to push to get the elevator on my 85P to go to the top floor!


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## jagr (Jan 16, 2009)

LLCoolBeans said:


> You seem to have enabled tactical momentary. Re-enter the customization menu and turn it off.


 Is it a possible way really? We can't turn the flashlight on while in tactical momentary mode. :thinking:


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## xevious (Jan 16, 2009)

Thanks, LLCOOLBEANS! Simple, yet effective.  And I wonder... if the new NovaTac models coming out in February will have the same programming--so an E or T model can still be activated for full programming. What do you think?

The 2xAA and 2xCR123 means that they've changed a few things, to enable the power plant variation, but hopefully they didn't touch the programming.


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## CobraMan (Jan 24, 2009)

Okay - I need some help here. For the last 2 days I have been trying to enable the P mode on the 120E I just purchased and have not yet got it to work. Like others that have posted - I think my switch is getting a bit flaky from the thousands of rapid clicks performed.

If I understand correctly the light must stay in the initial mode during the 250+ clicks - if it cycles into one of the other modes then I need to start over - correct?

I think I have gotten to the options menu on 3 occasions but then messed up enabling the ramping mode. I have tried taking extended breaks to give my fingers and the light a rest - yet I fail again. If nothing else I am persistent.

Any suggestions or ideas would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks,
Tim


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## LLCoolBeans (Jan 24, 2009)

jagr said:


> Is it a possible way really? We can't turn the flashlight on while in tactical momentary mode. :thinking:



Ok, do a factory reset.


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## LLCoolBeans (Jan 24, 2009)

xevious said:


> Thanks, LLCOOLBEANS! Simple, yet effective.  And I wonder... if the new NovaTac models coming out in February will have the same programming--so an E or T model can still be activated for full programming. What do you think?



Who cares? Ra Clicky is only $99 now.
http://www.ralights.com/?id=EdcExecutive


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## LLCoolBeans (Jan 24, 2009)

CobraMan said:


> I think I have gotten to the options menu on 3 occasions but then messed up enabling the ramping mode. I have tried taking extended breaks to give my fingers and the light a rest - yet I fail again. If nothing else I am persistent.
> 
> Any suggestions or ideas would be greatly appreciated.



Tim, I'll do my best to help.

You say you "think" you have entered the options menu on 3 occasions. What does that mean exactly?

Here is the procedure in brief...

From off, Click on

Click 250+ times rapidly, you don't need to count the clicks, light will start blinking when you've hit the right number of clicks. When you see that blink press and hold, then release.

You are now in the options menu, get yourself to option 9. Press and hold the button and you will see the light ramping up in brightness to indicate that the option is being enabled, continue to hold the button until primary brightness is restored.

Click light off. You have now enabled customization.

Let me know how you make out and if you have any more questions.


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## CobraMan (Jan 24, 2009)

Let's see if I can clarify a little. Since my switch appears to be breaking down - usually when I am in the middle of doing the 250+ clicks it will break out of the primary brightness mode and start flashing or step to another brightness, or even off - I believe when this happens I need to start over - correct?

I do see one bit of info I had not seen or tried - once getting to the ramping mode option to hold until returning to the primary brightness followed by click off. Previously I did a hold for a few seconds then release and click off - probably why it did not take.

After I get this unlocked I am going to contact NT about a new tailcap - as others have stated the switch should last for many thousands of cycles or more.

Thanks for the help - now I am off to try again.

Cheers,
Tim


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## LLCoolBeans (Jan 24, 2009)

CobraMan said:


> After I get this unlocked I am going to contact NT about a new tailcap - as others have stated the switch should last for many thousands of cycles or more.



No need to contact NT. Most NovaTac parts are availible for purchase here...
http://www.lighthound.com/search.asp?keyword=novatac&search=GO

Not sure you really need a new one though. Doing the 250 clicks is definitely not easy so I'm not sure the tailcap switch is at fault, it's just plain hard to do the 250 clicks required to enter the options menu.


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## cabindriver (Jan 25, 2009)

LLCoolBeans said:


> No need to contact NT. Most NovaTac parts are availible for purchase here...
> http://www.lighthound.com/search.asp?keyword=novatac&search=GO
> 
> Not sure you really need a new one though. Doing the 250 clicks is definitely not easy so I'm not sure the tailcap switch is at fault, it's just plain hard to do the 250 clicks required to enter the options menu.



In my case, the switch was the problem. A replaced under warranty switch made the 250 clicks a breeze.


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## CobraMan (Jan 25, 2009)

I think that is going to be the only way to get mine working correctly as well - new tailcap. From what I have read NT customer service is supposed to be very good - hopefully they will just send me a new cap like Surefire did when my U2 started acting up - no questions asked.

I did manage to get into the options menu but due to the problems I could not enable the ramping.

I guess I will be calling NT tomorrow.

Cheers,
Tim


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## streetmaster (Jan 25, 2009)

You should try cleaning the switch with alcohol first. The contacts in the switch are probably just dirty. It has reportedly fixed flakey switches that acted up after the repeated clicking. It's worth a try to unscrew the tailcap, drizzle some rubbing alcohol into the cap, swish it around a bit, and then dump it out and blow out the rest with compressed air or let it dry.


CobraMan said:


> I think that is going to be the only way to get mine working correctly as well - new tailcap. From what I have read NT customer service is supposed to be very good - hopefully they will just send me a new cap like Surefire did when my U2 started acting up - no questions asked.
> 
> I did manage to get into the options menu but due to the problems I could not enable the ramping.
> 
> ...


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## CobraMan (Jan 26, 2009)

Well - streetmaster you hit the nail on the head! I figured I would give a try at taking the tailcap apart and after a little arguing with the retaining nut I was able to remove it with my snap-ring pliers.

One thing that struck me is the simple, almost cheapish, design of the switch that I did not expect in a light of this caliber. It is made of a little 4 winged piece of what appears to be stainless steel resting on an outer ring and when depressed in the center it completes the connection to the battery - it is held in place with a piece of clear packing tape and nothing more. So I peeled the tape back and cleaned all the surfaces that come in contact with alchohol then centered the little winged piece as good as I could and stuck the tape back down. Reassembled the tailcap - switch works like new.

First attempt to unlock post cleaning and bingo - I have joined the rest of you with a 120XP

Man - I think I have a new favorite utility light - may need to order another one of these beauties!

Thanks to all the advice and especially to LLCoolBeans for discovering this.

Cheers,
Tim


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## streetmaster (Jan 26, 2009)

CobraMan said:


> Well - streetmaster you hit the nail on the head! I figured I would give a try at taking the tailcap apart and after a little arguing with the retaining nut I was able to remove it with my snap-ring pliers.
> 
> One thing that struck me is the simple, almost cheapish, design of the switch that I did not expect in a light of this caliber. It is made of a little 4 winged piece of what appears to be stainless steel resting on an outer ring and when depressed in the center it completes the connection to the battery - it is held in place with a piece of clear packing tape and nothing more. So I peeled the tape back and cleaned all the surfaces that come in contact with alchohol then centered the little winged piece as good as I could and stuck the tape back down. Reassembled the tailcap - switch works like new.
> 
> ...


Hey Tim, I'm glad you saved 20 bucks, or at least saved the hassle of waiting for a new switch from NovaTac. It was worth a shot! Good job.:thumbsup: I hate to see people replace perfectly good clicky's only to find out it's just dirty.


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## streetmaster (Jan 26, 2009)

LLCoolBeans said:


> Who cares? Ra Clicky is only $99 now.
> http://www.ralights.com/?id=EdcExecutive



Thank you so much for bringing this to my attention. I had a NovaTac Storm on pre-order, canceled that and putting the money towards an Ra EDC Executive Clicky!  
I always wanted a real HDS light. I love the NovaTacs, don't get me wrong. And I will *never* get rid of my 120E(P), it's my most used light, so far.


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## matrixshaman (Feb 20, 2009)

I think I've read all the messages in this thread but I don't recall seeing anything about this situation. It seems to be unique to the only non-P model Novatac I have and it's the EDC model which I reprogrammed to a P. I've been using it for a while but only noticed just now that when I do a click and PH while it's on or just a PH while on that it goes to a brighter setting - However it is *NOT* the highest setting the light can reach. Normally unless I've forgotten how things work with these the PH or click PH while on takes it to Maximum brightness. But now it's hitting what appears to be a step or two at least below maximum. I discovered this when changing a brightness setting and accidentally shut it off at the top of the brightness scale - thus saving that setting to one of the secondary settings. So after that I did a PH while on and it got *DIMMER*! It was at least a step or two down from the high setting I just saved. So is this all just common knowledge, do I have fuzzy memory or is this a bug in this particular light and possibly it has a higher high? Does anyone know what might be going on with this? Maybe an EDC model reprogrammed opens up a higher high or it just causes this somewhat odd behavior. I don't consider it a problem but just unusual as far as I know.


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## mbassoc2003 (Mar 7, 2009)

LLCoolBeans said:


> Tim, I'll do my best to help.
> 
> You say you "think" you have entered the options menu on 3 occasions. What does that mean exactly?
> 
> ...


Is that 9 clicks away from the PH after the blinking?
Giving serious consideration to buying myself a Novatac EDC 120E on the back of this thread.
Finding it hard to justify on the back of just shelling out for two Ra Clicky Tacticals (140 & 170), but the shorter form factor, chap price of the E, and the easter egg are quite a draw.
Argh! Just noticed the possible release of the Storm. Anyone see a difference between the Storm and the EDC 120 range? Seems like an identical light to me?

>EDIT< Just gave in to temptation and ordered me an EDC 120-E. Hope there isn't much difference between a reprogrammed EDC 120 and the Storm when it comes out.


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## mbassoc2003 (Mar 10, 2009)

Anyone know where I can buy a flush tail button for an EDC 120, in black? Lighthound seem to be out, and say they don't know if they'll be getting more stock in, and YourCornerStore say they don't intend to continue carry spares for the current EDC line once their new stock is in.


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## mbassoc2003 (Mar 10, 2009)

streetmaster said:


> You should NOT be clicking "on/off". You are not clicking fast enough. The light will go off after the first click and STAY off until you hit the 250-ish flashing point. If the light comes on before that, you've messed up and you must start over. There's no need to count clicks. Hope this helps.


I can't get mine to act in this way at all. I turn it on to primary, then begin rapid clicking. The light flicks off momentarily at the first click and then stays on as I continue my rapid clicks. I've not managed to get to the programming menu yet. Is the light meant to stay off until I get there?

Incidentally, it's an EDC 120-E, serial 21XXXX, but has no EDC designation on the barrel, just the five digit number on one side and the word Novatac on the other. Both engraved a little too high and not centrally on the engraving surface.


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## streetmaster (Mar 10, 2009)

mbassoc2003 said:


> I can't get mine to act in this way at all. I turn it on to primary, then begin rapid clicking. The light flicks off momentarily at the first click and then stays on as I continue my rapid clicks. I've not managed to get to the programming menu yet. Is the light meant to stay off until I get there?



I honestly can't remember. I would swear that mine stayed off during the 250 clicks, but according to step 2 of the instructions in post#1:

"2. Click the button 250 or more times. (These clicks must be in rapid succession. *The light should stay on Primary brightness during the 250 clicks*.)"

If it starts flashing during the 250, you've messed up and need to start over.


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## LLCoolBeans (Mar 10, 2009)

Light should stay on primary brightness during the click sequence, like streetmaster said. You don't need to count the clicks, light will start blinking when you have reached 250+. When that happens press and hold. You have now entered the options menu.


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## streetmaster (Mar 10, 2009)

Depending on how fast you're doing your clicks, it should only take 1 1/2 to 2 minutes to complete the 250 clicks. Two clicks per second gets you to about two minutes, and three clicks per second comes to around maybe a minute and a half. That just gives you a general idea as to how long it should take. If your light turns off at say one minute or sooner, then you probably need to start over. That's how I did it anyway, worked out good for me. Good luck.:thumbsup:


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## mbassoc2003 (Mar 10, 2009)

I'm sure I'll get it tomorrow. My fingers or wrist slow down at about 140 clicks and I need to start over. I'm a desk jockey. I just need to build my stamina.
WTB a flat bezel and tailcap. Any ideas? The usual suspects no longer stock them.

Gotta say, first impressions are that the new Ra Clickys are better manufactured than the NT. I got both light within the last 7 days. The NT has minor alignment issued with the battery body and the tail cap, and also between the bezel and the housing, such that you can feel the misalignments with your fingers. Loosening the bezel and carefully tightening selves one problem, but the tolerance of play there is rediculous. There's a good millimetre in leteral movement before the final half turn. The tail cap seems to be an issue of the battery tube being threaded slightly off centre. The Ra Clicky is manufactured to much closer tolerances, and while I like the shorter form factor of the NV, I prefer the weight of the Ra Clicky in the hand.


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## mbassoc2003 (Mar 10, 2009)

Okay. Same problem as a lot of folks. My button is starting to fail to recognise clicks. These light really aren't designed for long term use, are they? Must have clicked it a shade over 1000 times or so, and we're reaching the natural lifespan of the tail switch. EDC means 'Carry', not 'Use'. I wonder if the warranty is good for the rest of the world, or only in the US? Anyone overseas ever have a new tail swich mailed out to them under warranty?

It's frustrating, but most of us are guys in houses or offices, with these torches on a desk. If they can't take what an average office worker can throw at it, can you imagine haw bad they'll perform in a military situation? No-one should be able to break a tail switch in a day. Do you think they lifecycle tested their products?


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## LLCoolBeans (Mar 10, 2009)

mbassoc2003 said:


> Okay. Same problem as a lot of folks. My button is starting to fail to recognise clicks. These light really aren't designed for long term use, are they? Must have clicked it a shade over 1000 times or so, and we're reaching the natural lifespan of the tail switch. EDC means 'Carry', not 'Use'. I wonder if the warranty is good for the rest of the world, or only in the US? Anyone overseas ever have a new tail swich mailed out to them under warranty?
> 
> It's frustrating, but most of us are guys in houses or offices, with these torches on a desk. If they can't take what an average office worker can throw at it, can you imagine haw bad they'll perform in a military situation? No-one should be able to break a tail switch in a day. Do you think they lifecycle tested their products?



Some guys have had success reviving their switches by squirting a little contact cleaner into the switch.


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## mbassoc2003 (Mar 10, 2009)

Is there a way of performing the 250 click press without screwing the button? I can see that you can hack the light and then get a new button, but these things don't seem to be built for many operations.

I tried both the desk and hand methods. Can't seem to get it to go into programming mode. Also, my light is undesignated. There is nothing on the light tube daying what type of light it is. Just a 5 digit number. But it's pre-programmed as an EDC-E.

What about removing the tail cap and electronically controling the circuit between spring and battery? That wouldn't stress the tail switch.


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## litetube (Mar 10, 2009)

mbassoc, the NT switch is a very simple mechanism. If you have a pair of snap ring pliers or even needle nose pliers you can unscrew the retaining ring inside the Tailcap. The retaining ring has notches in it for this purpose. Once you get that off take the switch out. It is basically a little contact pad that gets depressed and makes contact with another surface. I dont even know if it can be called mechanical. Other than dirt fouling it up , I dont know what could make a switch like this fail. There is a little piece of tape covering it underneath the switch rubber boot. It's very similar to a cell phone button or the likes. If you have contact cleaner and not just alcohol use some of that on the internals. 

Sounds as if you have a bit of a sloppy representation of this light though with the machining issues and alignment sloppiness. I would really consider contacting Novatac directly. I guarantee they will take care of you and get it all straightened out to your satisfaction. They have excellent Customer Service


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## mbassoc2003 (Mar 11, 2009)

Have e-mailed NT. Have read a lot of threads though. I am wondering if NT decided in the fall to move to the Storm, and stopped manufacture of the EDCs. Those on the market being built up from spares and component parts from whatever line suppliers can find. Would go a long way to explaining the discrepancies in the designation of light, and the Botach Lego builds.


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## litetube (Mar 11, 2009)

I think that is exactly what is happening . I figure they will keep the 120p going and ditch the rest and fill in thegaps with the Storm line and Military

You should get results from them very soon so hang in there. It is a good light for the money . You will like it once you get things straightened out


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## streetmaster (Mar 11, 2009)

mbassoc2003 said:


> Have e-mailed NT. Have read a lot of threads though. I am wondering if NT decided in the fall to move to the Storm, and stopped manufacture of the EDCs. Those on the market being built up from spares and component parts from whatever line suppliers can find. Would go a long way to explaining the discrepancies in the designation of light, and the Botach Lego builds.



Yep, the new line of lights are supposed to be out this "spring". NovaTac told me in an email that they were going to launch a new site along with the new lights. It was planned to happen in January '09 but got pushed back to spring. I believe it was discovered that the new ones are being made overseas, except for maybe the Military Ops and Tactical models, which HAS to be USA made for the US military buy them. I still plan on buying a Storm why they are available, because I love my EDC 120E(P), and the new prices are great. YourCornerStore.com has really cheap prices listed for them. Here's some pics of some of the new models: NovaTac New Models *New(er) Pics*


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## mbassoc2003 (Mar 11, 2009)

A bit pissed that I seem to have screwed a tail switch and still not achieved a 250 click press. I'm used to the Ra Clicky and I'm pretty sure if I can get into the options menu I can activate ramping. The system seems to be the same.

Tried the desk. Tried it by hand. Tried this too....
Place a book or box of equal height adjacent to the light on a desk.
Stand light approx 3" away, button up.
Place ruller between book and light with about 4-5" of ruler projecting beyond the light.
Hold ruler firmly on top of book and tap free end of ruler so that ruler depressed button.
It's a lot less stress on the wrist.
Thinking a remote tail switch might make light work of the 250, but for that expence you're better just buying a 120-P

Anyways, can't confirm it works, 'cos I can't get to 250 click press yet. And obviously, now the button is partially f"cked it's even harder.

Any tips from anyone who's managed to get to 250 with a f"cked tail switch?
Anyone managed to get there one handed with the thumb?

The EDC 120-E really has shite default settings, hasn't it?
Still, up to the highlands this weekend with my NT and Ra Clicky. Will keep trying to get to 250 with all the free time away from work.


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## mbassoc2003 (Mar 11, 2009)

streetmaster said:


> Yep, the new line of lights are supposed to be out this "spring". NovaTac told me in an email that they were going to launch a new site along with the new lights. It was planned to happen in January '09 but got pushed back to spring. I believe it was discovered that the new ones are being made overseas, except for maybe the Military Ops and Tactical models, which HAS to be USA made for the US military buy them. I still plan on buying a Storm why they are available, because I love my EDC 120E(P), and the new prices are great. YourCornerStore.com has really cheap prices listed for them. Here's some pics of some of the new models: NovaTac New Models *New(er) Pics*


I gotta say, I see no advances or product development here at all. It's almost as if the company cannot develop their product any further with the current technology (probably on account of the brains behind the light no longer being involved with them). After all, we all know there are advances on the market that NT are not following. Instead they've decided to milk the product, farm it out to cheaper mass production factories to increase product margin, and diversify into AA batteries because they don't see that that form factor is going to go the way of the cassette tape.

Based on their current product strategy, we may be witnessing a company in decline. We are cetainly witnessing a company under major economic pressure. If they wish to increase their market position, it should have been by inovating and maintaining quality, not dumbing down and producing cheaper products at the expence of quality. They seem to be aiming for mass market, and they're simply not gonna get it. That market is saturated as it is with cheap crap. They don't need to try to add to it.


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## matrixshaman (Mar 11, 2009)

I've noticed the supposed arrival time of the new models at one online seller have been repeatedly moved forward - I think 4 times now. Every time a shipping date comes close it gets bumped into the future another month or so. I'm beginning to wonder if they even have any new models or if they are just game playing to stifle competition.


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## mbassoc2003 (Mar 11, 2009)

matrixshaman said:


> I've noticed the supposed arrival time of the new models at one online seller have been repeatedly moved forward - I think 4 times now. Every time a shipping date comes close it gets bumped into the future another month or so. I'm beginning to wonder if they even have any new models or if they are just game playing to stifle competition.


'New models'? You use that term loosely I presume. There is nothing 'new' about the 2009 series of flashlights. The Storm is a cheap Chinese rip-off of the EDC-120T, and the 'classic' is the same cheap rip-off, only bigger (AA) for those people who haven't developed beyond the Maglite era yet. The only 'new' product is the 'M' which is just an 'T' with tan paint on. Tan paint. Now there's an evolutionary step forward for Novatac. Maybe they'll go down to Radio Shack and discover new LEDs for 2012! I am not American, I'm a Brit. But I'd buy US engineering over Asia Pacific copies anyday.


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## streetmaster (Mar 12, 2009)

mbassoc2003 said:


> 'New models'? You use that term loosely I presume. There is nothing 'new' about the 2009 series of flashlights. The Storm is a cheap Chinese rip-off of the EDC-120T, and the 'classic' is the same cheap rip-off, only bigger (AA) for those people who haven't developed beyond the Maglite era yet. The only 'new' product is the 'M' which is just an 'T' with tan paint on. Tan paint. Now there's an evolutionary step forward for Novatac. Maybe they'll go down to Radio Shack and discover new LEDs for 2012! I am not American, I'm a Brit. But I'd buy US engineering over Asia Pacific copies anyday.


Who said they were copies?? They're still NovaTac design, just manufactured overseas. There are some really well made lights coming from China these days. I think it all depends on who will be doing the manufacturing. I'm not too thrilled about them going overseas, but I'm holding judgment until we see the product. I really like my NT and I hope the new ones are just as good.

By the way, it's not "Tan Paint", it's type III anodizing. Huge difference.


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## LLCoolBeans (Mar 12, 2009)

streetmaster said:


> By the way, it's not "Tan Paint", it's type III anodizing. Huge difference.



I hate to burst your bubble, but I don't think it's type III. Type III cannot be made in those colors. This is regular old run of the mill type II anodizing, which will scratch easily.


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## litetube (Mar 12, 2009)

HA cant be done in clors like this? Why?

I could of sowrn I have seen everything from blue to pink to red to gold to black to olive?


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## LLCoolBeans (Mar 12, 2009)

As far as I know HA III can be dark gray or black, that's it.

There is an easy way to find out though, first member to get one should attempt to scratch the finish in an inconspicuous place, if it can be scratched easily, that ain't no type III.


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## streetmaster (Mar 12, 2009)

LLCoolBeans said:


> I hate to burst your bubble, but I don't think it's type III. Type III cannot be made in those colors. This is regular old run of the mill type II anodizing, which will scratch easily.



Then must be this ad is a lie...






And this one as well...


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## LLCoolBeans (Mar 12, 2009)

streetmaster said:


> Then must be this ad is a lie...



That's my educated guess, but like I said, there's one way to find out for sure. 

That advertisement also says they are Made in USA. That has never been true. If you actually look at the legal requirements for making that claim, all parts that go into a product must also be Made in USA, ALL PARTS. That is impossible if you are using a Korean emitter.

This is why a lot of other manufacturers, like Henry for example, don't dare claim Made in USA, even though for all intensive purposes, they are. It's not worth the legal risk.


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## EEG (Mar 12, 2009)

Any tips from anyone who's managed to get to 250 with a f"cked tail switch?
Anyone managed to get there one handed with the thumb?

The EDC 120-E really has shite default settings, hasn't it?
Still, up to the highlands this weekend with my NT and Ra Clicky. Will keep trying to get to 250 with all the free time away from work.[/quote]

Have you tried some drops of alcohol into the little holes inside the tailcap? I had to do it a couple times before I got the 250 clicks.

I got a "T" at Botach with the flat tail cap included or I would have gotten the regular EDC. It saved buying the flat tail cap or getting the "P" version for say $30 more. I had also read this thread and planned to crack it anyway and so far it's worked out very well.

I do plan to get a Clicky Executive however (already have the TI clip on order) and the NT will do some back up duty.


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## streetmaster (Mar 12, 2009)

EEG said:


> Have you tried some drops of alcohol into the little holes inside the tailcap? I had to do it a couple times before I got the 250 clicks.



Very good advice. This has been suggested before, probably in this thread. If anyone has read this entire thread, they would know that the switches sometimes get dirty from the heavy repeated clicks we are doing to reach the 250 "crack". Just drip some alcohol into the holes inside the tailcap, swish it around and if you have a can of compressed air, blow it out(keep it away from your face/eyes).


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## streetmaster (Mar 12, 2009)

LLCoolBeans said:


> That's my educated guess, but like I said, there's one way to find out for sure.
> 
> That advertisement also says they are Made in USA. That has never been true. If you actually look at the legal requirements for making that claim, all parts that go into a product must also be Made in USA, ALL PARTS. That is impossible if you are using a Korean emitter.
> 
> This is why a lot of other manufacturers, like Henry for example, don't dare claim Made in USA, even though for all intensive purposes, they are. It's not worth the legal risk.



It is my understanding that the Military Ops and Tactical models are still going to be made in the US in order to be sold to the US Military. I don't know what the US government requires in order for the product to be considered USA made. The ad for the other "new" models(Classic, Storm, and Special Ops) does not state made in USA, and a while back another CPF member was told in an email by NT customer service that the new ones were going to be made overseas.

Bean, I'm sorry for taking your thread off topic, I'm trying to find out as much as I can about these new NT's.

There is a thread discussing the new NovaTacs here NovaTac New Models *New(er) Pics* and any further posts on that topic should be directed there. 

Bob


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## dilbert (Mar 12, 2009)

LLCoolBeans said:


> As far as I know HA III can be dark gray or black, that's it.


 
Surefire has HAIII in silver. Fenix has it in blue, purple, and orange/gold.


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## LLCoolBeans (Mar 12, 2009)

dilbert said:


> Surefire has HAIII in silver. Fenix has it in blue, purple, and orange/gold.



As I understand it, any HA III color must be darker than the natural dark gray color. So I have actually seen blue hardcoat, but it was so dark that it was almost black.

Are you sure SureFire and Fenix have hardcoat in those colors, or are they just claiming it? Or maybe, they offer both type II and type III?

Once again, easy to check, type II will scratch easily, type III will be difficult to scratch even with a hardened steel tool. Try it. (In a location you are not concerned with there being a scratch)


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## LLCoolBeans (Mar 12, 2009)

I have started a thread for discussion on what is or is not possible with HAIII. I'm sure one or more of our members will be an expert on this and be able to give us the real dope.

https://www.candlepowerforums.com/posts/2874901#post2874901


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## LLCoolBeans (Mar 12, 2009)

A member with experience has just chimed in on the HAIII colors thread. As it turns out this is at least possible.

It would still be interesting to see who's colored "HAIII" passes the scratch test and who's doesn't.


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## matrixshaman (Mar 13, 2009)

Not to sidetrack the somewhat off-topic HAIII stuff   but I'm still trying to understand why my reprogrammed 120E has a higher brightness in the secondary (a double click) than the PH (press hold from on) or click PH. The PH or click PH is noticeably lower in brightness than the level I have programmed for a secondary position. How can that be?


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## LLCoolBeans (Mar 13, 2009)

matrixshaman said:


> Not to sidetrack the somewhat off-topic HAIII stuff   but I'm still trying to understand why my reprogrammed 120E has a higher brightness in the secondary (a double click) than the PH (press hold from on) or click PH. The PH or click PH is noticeably lower in brightness than the level I have programmed for a secondary position. How can that be?



Do you have forced setting enabled? If so, what setting is it forcing?


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## matrixshaman (Mar 13, 2009)

LLCoolBeans said:


> Do you have forced setting enabled? If so, what setting is it forcing?



Nope - forced setting is disabled. I like it to remember to come on the last used setting rather than always one particular setting.


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## LLCoolBeans (Mar 13, 2009)

matrixshaman said:


> Nope - forced setting is disabled. I like it to remember to come on the last used setting rather than always one particular setting.



:thinking: Hmmm...

So you didn't set maximum brightness to maximum brightness? Dang these names are confusing. I wish instead of Maximum, Primary, Secondary and Minimum, we could refer to them as something more easily discernible, like 1,2,3 and 4.

What happens if you press-hold from on to lock maximum (1), then set that brightness to something brighter? Does that not work? Am I misunderstanding?


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## matrixshaman (Mar 13, 2009)

I guess I've gotten rusty on the NT's. I've been so busy with a big project the last year I barely get time to use my lights other than basic 'as needed' situations. For some reason I forgot you can actually program the 'Maximum' setting also. I just thought the click PH always took you to Maximum and that Maximum was Maximum - rather than anything you want to set that 'Maximum' slot to be. Fortunately it _*can*_ be set to anything making Henry's programming more versatile than I had remembered. I should have remembered this as I've got one of my HDS lights triple click minimum set several levels brighter than the secondary which is set at the lowest level. Thanks for the help!


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## CobraMan (Mar 13, 2009)

Okay - let me preface this post with the statement that I am no expert here. However, I had no end of problems trying to "crack" my 120E - and it was all due to a the tailcap switch being jacked up.

So the way I solved the problem was to disassemble the tailcap using snap ring pliers on the retaining ring. Once you have the switch out you will see that there is a 4 winged metal disc that is held in place with a piece of what appears to be clear packing tape. I carefully lifted the tape and then cleaned all surfaces of the metal disc and corresponding contact areas on the circuit board with rubbing alcohol and let it dry for a few minutes. Now do your best to locate the 4 winged disc on the circuit board with as equal an overlap as you can for each wing and stick the tape back down. Reassemble and try to crack that bad boy - worked for me on the first try after countless prior attempts.

Now as a side note, make sure you have cleaned the contact surfaces of the springs at each end and the outer spring as well as the circuit board areas in the head and tailcap and the ends of the removable battery tube. This will ensure a good electrical path.

One last suggestion - the easiest method of performing the 250 click for me was bezel down on a desk with me in a standing position. Support the light with one hand and with your thumb of your other hand actuate the switch in nice rythmic pace - does not need to be ultra fast, just consistently for about a minute or minute and a half. Now just follow prior instructions in this thread.

I realize much of what I state above is repeated - just thought it might be helpful for the few recent folks posting with problems.

Good Luck and Cheers,
Tim


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## mbassoc2003 (Mar 16, 2009)

Nope, still can't get it.
Tried to get the tail cap appars, but you need special tools. My leatherman just ain't up to it.

The button on my tail cap isn't sensetive enough anymore to do the 250 click press. It mis-interprets some very solid clicks as not having been pressed, and cancels the sequence half way through. Cant seem to get much beyond 140.

For the sake of $50, I should probably have just bought a 120P.
Unfortunately, I have an E, and as you all know, the defaults are shite.


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## streetmaster (Mar 16, 2009)

mbassoc2003 said:


> Nope, still can't get it.
> Tried to get the tail cap appars, but you need special tools. My leatherman just ain't up to it.
> 
> The button on my tail cap isn't sensetive enough anymore to do the 250 click press. It mis-interprets some very solid clicks as not having been pressed, and cancels the sequence half way through. Cant seem to get much beyond 140.
> ...


Did you try cleaning the switch with alcohol _without_ taking it apart? People have fixed theirs that way too. It just has dirty contacts, once you get that cleaned the crack will be easy.


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## mbassoc2003 (Mar 16, 2009)

Okay. What's 'rubbing alcohol'. I'm a newbie. Don't know what I'm looking for when I go to the hardware store. I try to dribble a little inside from around the button, and inside the tailcap and hope it feeds through?


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## streetmaster (Mar 16, 2009)

mbassoc2003 said:


> Okay. What's 'rubbing alcohol'. I'm a newbie. Don't know what I'm looking for when I go to the hardware store. I try to dribble a little inside from around the button, and inside the tailcap and hope it feeds through?



Isopropyl Alcohol may not be at the hardware store. More likely to be at the drugstore/pharmacy.

Do some clicks before the aclohol dries out. Make sure it's dry before you put the light back together. *FLAMMABLE*


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## LLCoolBeans (Mar 16, 2009)

streetmaster said:


> Isopropyl Alcohol may not be at the hardware store. More likely to be at the drugstore/pharmacy.
> 
> Do some clicks before the aclohol dries out. Make sure it's dry before you put the light back together. *FLAMMABLE*



They should have it at the hardware store too.

It's best to get it at the electronics supply. The electronics supply sells it in a 99% dilution. You will be lucky to find 90% at the drug or hardware store, most of what is sold there is around a 70% dilution. 70% dilution meaning 30% water.


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## streetmaster (Mar 16, 2009)

LLCoolBeans said:


> They should have it at the hardware store too.
> 
> It's best to get it at the electronics supply. The electronics supply sells it in a 99% dilution. You will be lucky to find 90% at the drug or hardware store, most of what is sold there is around a 70% dilution. 70% dilution meaning 30% water.



I have always used 99%. I have no use for 70%. I guess I should have mentioned that. Why would anyone water down alcohol? :buddies: Such a waste...:devil:

BTW, I got my 99% at Wal-Mart.


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## mbassoc2003 (Mar 18, 2009)

Got it.
A new button from NT and I'm into the options menu and activated ramping first time. Woohoo.
As a bonus, NT didn't know which switch to send me, so they sent a raised switch and a flush switch, both marked 120E.
So, no passing this off as a P then.

All in, this is a pretty good backup light to my EDC which is a Ra Clicky Tactical 170.


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## streetmaster (Mar 18, 2009)

mbassoc2003 said:


> Got it.
> A new button from NT and I'm into the options menu and activated ramping first time. Woohoo.
> As a bonus, NT didn't know which switch to send me, so they sent a raised switch and a flush switch, both marked 120E.
> So, no passing this off as a P then.
> ...



Must be nice. I paid 20 bucks for my flat switch. 

Now what are ya gonna do? Do you have 3 switches?


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## mbassoc2003 (Mar 18, 2009)

One of the switches is f'cked. Pretty well screwed. Might take it appart and see if I can fit a glow in the dark rubber boot onto it.

The other two (one of each) I'm trying to decide which I like best. ATM I have the extended cap with rubber covers for the front and back from Flashlightlens.com, and you can pull the back one off a little and use it to tailstand the NT with the extended button. So I'm still playing around to find out what's my best configuration and bext programming. It'll probably live on my desk for the next few months.

Either way, it's not as good as the Ra Clicky. The Ra Clicky just feels better built (subtly) and I prefer the weightiness of it. So my Clicky will remain my EDC.


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## mbassoc2003 (Apr 24, 2009)

I gotta say, having lived with the NT and three Ra Clickies over the past moth or so, the NT is to me a much better light in the hand. The size fits better with my hand, being almost exactly the same as the width as my palm, and the NT clip is unobtrusive, sits in the correct position along the length of the light, and is low enough in profile to fit into the bowl of the hand. Operationally, I find the flush tailcap to be a far better performer than it's Clicky counterpart. There is a thicker feel to the rubber. I didn't like the fact that you could actually feel the contacts through the rubber of the flush Clicky cap. So, all in, I now EDC my hacked NT EDC 120E with flush tailcap.

All that said, my site light (I'm in construction) is an Ra Clicky Tactical which is a solid performer, and the light in my BoB is also an Ra Clicky Tactical, because I know it'll work when I need it to be there. And as I say, I have three Clickies, and only one NT (although I am in the market for another), and they're all designed by the same guy, and manufactured (as far as I am aware) in America, so I suppose the important things that matter are pedegree and not the label on the cover.

So who's gonna buy a Storm? Are you really gonna trust NT to make their lights on the cheap? I for one will looh for old NT EDCs and HDS lights.

PS. Have spare raised tail caps, but can't for the life of me get the sales section of the site to work. Also can't get the site to respond to e-mails. So if you're interested PM me, and if you're a moderator, maybe you could look into getting yopur site fixed, and getting the appropriate individuals to respond to e-mails.


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## streetmaster (Apr 24, 2009)

Spare raised tailcaps for the NT, or the Ra?

I still can't say which I like better. My NT 120E(cracked), or my Clicky EDCE120. I like them both for different reasons. :shrug:


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## mbassoc2003 (Apr 26, 2009)

streetmaster said:


> Spare raised tailcaps for the NT, or the Ra?
> 
> I still can't say which I like better. My NT 120E(cracked), or my Clicky EDCE120. I like them both for different reasons. :shrug:


NT Tailcaps. I'm in the UK, so there're probably better sources for tailcaps in the US if that's where you are.

I do really like the Ra Clickies too. Better runtime. More efficient use of the emitter. But the NT feels better in my hand, and that's probably a combination of the shorter body and the smaller clip. I'd put the NT chop into a Ra Clicky, but the ideal place to put it cannot be achieved, and anywhere else is just a compromise.


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## StandardBattery (Apr 27, 2009)

mbassoc2003 said:


> *....* PS. Have spare raised tail caps, but can't for the life of me get the sales section of the site to work. Also can't get the site to respond to e-mails. *....*


Strange, but do you know you have to register with cpfmarketplace separately? You can use the same alias or a different one. If that's not the issue, you'll have to contact someone.


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## mbassoc2003 (Apr 30, 2009)

StandardBattery said:


> Strange, but do you know you have to register with cpfmarketplace separately? You can use the same alias or a different one. If that's not the issue, you'll have to contact someone.


You know, I've already tried that. And not received any e-mails in response to my questions from the moderators. It appears that my e-mail address is blocked so I can't register, which is funny, seeing as I only ever found this website six weeks ago, and have owned the same e-mail address and domain name now for twelve years. They are very selective about who they let in. I presume seeing as I'm a newbie I don't qualify for membership. But seeing as they don't publish any membership criteria or allow anyone to ask them questions who knows.

And of course there is no means of enquiring or asking for the problem to be addressed. The only option they permit is to raise the issue in open forum. So please, will a moderator explain either by PM or e-mail, or here in open forum, how long a new member has to wait until you lift the block on them joining the Marketplace?

In the meantime, I still have two raised tailcaps for the Novatac EDC range for sale. PM me if you're interested.


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## Disciple002 (Apr 30, 2009)

Ok, obviously I'm the dumbest NT owner on the planet (or at least on CP Forums). I LOST my beloved NT EDC 120T about a month ago and have felt naked ever since. I read this post, that you can crack a 120E, didn't want to spend the extra money to get another 120T, so I decided to get a 120E and crack it. I just received it today, brand new, SN 20XXX. I've tried to crack this thing 20+ times in every position I could imagine. I tried cleaning the tailcap with alcohol, it has a brand new battery. NOTHING! I hate the factory menus on this thing. I really miss my 120T. PLEASE HELP!


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## Disciple002 (Apr 30, 2009)

This is so frustrating! I have a brand new 120E. I found a "easy" and comfortable position to get to what I think is 250 clicks. I start from "off" by one click to turn it on, then start clicking. I've been careful to make sure (after many attempts) to stay consistant and make sure the light stays on at the same level throughout the "clicking" process. Somewhere around 250 it starts strobing about once per second. Am I in program mode? I've tried 9 clicks to get into the brightness ramping, and it just stays on at the highest setting. I've tried the click x 3, press. Nothing. Still acts like a crappy 120E! 

Man I miss my 120T!!!!


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## matrixshaman (May 1, 2009)

I doubt you are being blocked from the marketplace - probably just a bug in something you've done or in the registration process. I'd try again with a different email - just grab one of the free ones from Yahoo, Gmail or wherever and try it and once your reg'd you can change your email to your old one I'm sure.


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## mbassoc2003 (May 1, 2009)

Disciple002 said:


> Ok, obviously I'm the dumbest NT owner on the planet (or at least on CP Forums). I LOST my beloved NT EDC 120T about a month ago and have felt naked ever since. I read this post, that you can crack a 120E, didn't want to spend the extra money to get another 120T, so I decided to get a 120E and crack it. I just received it today, brand new, SN 20XXX. I've tried to crack this thing 20+ times in every position I could imagine. I tried cleaning the tailcap with alcohol, it has a brand new battery. NOTHING! I hate the factory menus on this thing. I really miss my 120T. PLEASE HELP!


It took me four days to crack it. It was very frustrating, but I got there eventually. Here's what I have to contribute....

1. Stay calm and don't keep trying over and over again. The light isn't going anywhere. They've not changed the program and your's can be cracked just like everyone elses. Slow down. Take big breaks between attempts (I mean like watch a movie or something). The button will get stressed just as much as you will, so for the sake of you both, take a break.

2. Seriously. Put down the flashlight and go do something else.

3. The best position I found, thanks to someone else here, is stand beside a desk, stand the torch so that it is button up on top, grip the torch with one hand, and begin to press the button slowly and regularily with your other thumb, keeping your shoulder and arm above the flashlight. As your thumb tires, keep the rhythm going, but use the weight of your arm and your forearm muscles to help you.

4. When you reach the point where the light begins to flash, press and hold the button for a second or two. You have got yourself into the options menu.

5. Now, pick up the flashlight and click once, the light will flash to indicate it is in the next option. Take your time. You have ten seconds after each click to decide what to do. Click again and you go to the next option. Click again and you go to the next. Cycle through until the light respons with a dim to bright signal. Then press and hold. The light will slowly ramp from dim to bright to indicate that it has activated ramping (that it is now programmable). And don't worry if you miss it, or think you've missed it. You can keep clicking through the options menu over and over again.

6. If you get ther eand you fail (we all do), give it a break. It's not going anywhere. Go and do something else. Come back later.

Seriously, if you look back through the thread, I was pulling my hair out over this. Now I look like Jean Luke.


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## streetmaster (May 1, 2009)

VERY good advice indeed. :thumbsup:

The more frustrated you get, the less likely you'll succeed. Don't worry, you'll get it.


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## Disciple002 (May 2, 2009)

IT WORKED! Thanks guys! Very much appreciated. Now I'm having another problem though. I've read through the manual for the P and I'm just not sure what I did. Here's what's happening. From off, 1 click or press and it goes right into emergency strobe. From emergency strobe, 1 press and it goes into momentary full brightness, until I release. Here's what I think I did, I think I enabled option 4 without enabling 9. Sound right? If so, do I need to do the whole 250 clicks again to get back into option 9?

Here's how I would like to program it, if someone would be kind enough to walk me through it, that would be great. 

From off: 1 click = full bright
1 click, press = disorienting strobe until released, then goes back to full bright until clicked off or entered another option.

From on: 2 clicks = about half-bright
3 clicks = emergency signal strobe.

Is this do-able? Thanks again guys, you don't know how relieved I am to even get this far.


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## bltkmt (May 8, 2009)

This may have been asked previously, but I am not going to read this entire thread to look...does this cracking methodology work on the HDS models too?


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## matrixshaman (May 8, 2009)

There is a similar but not identical way to hack the HDS basic models to make them like the Ultimate models. There's a message thread around here somewhere that will tell you how. Just looked around and it may be hard to find. I think it was the same as getting into the Ultimate menu except you did 250 clicks instead of 10 clicks. After that it's the same to program as an Ultimate. If you want to change anything though you always have to do the 250 click routine.


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## mbassoc2003 (May 23, 2009)

I have received my second NT, this one a 120T, and the easter egg works exactly the same as my other one. Reason I'm posting is that there seems to be differences in the build between the two flashlights. So maybe I have one of the original design NTs and one of the new post-Storm NTs. Who knows. Here are the differences....

1. My new NT has a slightly darker and slightly more glossy black finish to the aluminium.
2. My new NT has a double spring, akin to the design introduced in Henry's Ra Clicky range, only without the plates on the end of the springs. My older Nt (2 months old) has a spring in the tail cap, and a plate with nipples in the head of the light.
3. My new NT has softer springs, and those springs are stainless steel. My old NT has a brass/copper coloured spring.
4. My new NT has a raised tail cap with a button that offers greater resistence, and has a much more audible 'tinny' click.
5. The clip on my new NT (and my old clip because I've tries swapping them) spins freely around the light (which is really annoying!). But both clips are relatively stiff on the old NT. From this I deduce that the new NT has a slightly narrower shank about the thread. Also the tailcap is very easily unscrewed (to the extent that this is the default for inserting the battery), so I would speculate that this may be the introduction of greater allowance for tolerance in manufacture, which also may be an indicator of manufacture by a company unable to meet the previous levels of manufacturing tolerance (read manufactured abroad).

That is my summary of the purchase and comparison of two Novatac EDCs, both purchased from the same UK supplier, two months appart. The first prior to all UK stock drying up, the second from the new batch of stock arriving in the UK. Incidentally, both lights appear to have the same emitter, and both emitters exhibit low level flicker on the lowest two settings. The older of the two has a faint blue/purple tint when compared side by side with the new NT, which has a faint green tint.


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## streetmaster (May 23, 2009)

Easy way to tell, what's the serial number? First two digits at least...

Sounds to me like a 30XXX series, which has 90% of the features that you mentioned. The latest run of NovaTacs (30XXX) have the new spring on the head contact.


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## mbassoc2003 (May 24, 2009)

Curiously, both lights have a 21XXX serial number, and both are so remarkably different in the feel of the quality. The older of the two (what I term pre-Storm), has a better feel about the build. The newer model feels cheaper in the way it was built, the components fit looser and the moving parts make a greater amount of noise. The paintwork gives the impression that they just stuck on an extra layer or a varnish. Kinda like Maglite were doing copies. But the emitter, reflector, lens, etc all have no decernable difference, and the program is virtually identical. Having jailbroken it, I don't want to reset and probe around to see if I can get firmware indicators. I know you can do that with Clickies, so I imagine you might be able to do that with Novatacs. But I'm not gonna go looking. Maybe Novatac are reconditioning lights and repackaging them as new? That would explain the new parts in old bodies issue, and the mis-match between finer tolerance bodies and wider tolerance barrels and caps. The only thing we do know is for certain is that something is fishy; and there's no way in hell Novatac will tell us.


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## sween1911 (Sep 17, 2009)

Coming in on the backside of all this, but I got my Black 85T last week from Lighthound and FINALLY went through the 250-click process. After messing it up a few times, after setting it on Tactical Momentary in the options menu before realizing that there's no way to get it back without a factory reset, which un-does the 250 click toggle, I'm finally setup in programming mode, very happy with it and can get through the options fairly easily. 

I know this is already on top of many others, but THANKS! for sharing this with us. Very, very cool.


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## jayb79 (Sep 20, 2009)

Here is the original post that got the reprogramming bug started. Henry got it going himself with a challenge in post #8.


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## bansuri (Sep 21, 2009)

Works like a charm, but I want to stress that you should read the "P" manual first and understand the time limit when you get in to the options mode or you'll be clicking 250 again.
Also, the difference between battery-detect-reset and factory-reset are _very subtle_, memorizing the differences ahead of time will save you the additional clicking.
And, to beat a dead horse, if you disable ramping/options you'll need to click250 again, however it's not a bad thing if you get your settings dialed in and want to keep them that way.
Nice little light.


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## Helmut.G (Oct 2, 2009)

I just did this to my new 85T.
The lowest setting looks very nice :twothumbs
Thank you for this cool thread!


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## troller_cpf (Dec 17, 2009)

Will this mod also work on the Novatac/SPA Defense SPL120 AWKL WeaponLight?

thanks!


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## matrixshaman (Dec 17, 2009)

troller_cpf said:


> Will this mod also work on the Novatac/SPA Defense SPL120 AWKL WeaponLight?
> 
> thanks!



Never heard of that model but I'd bet money it's just a special label someone put on the standard 120T. So YES I'd say there's an extremely good chance it will work as Novatac so far has only had models that are either a P or T or E and the E and T can both be turned into the P (programmable model) with this Crack.


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## troller_cpf (Dec 18, 2009)

Thanks.
Another questio: 

how can you perform the *factory reset* to go back to the standard settings?

thanks!


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## matrixshaman (Dec 18, 2009)

Instructions for a reset are in the User's guide. Here's where you can download a copy: Novatac web site click here for user manual


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## asfaltpiloot (Dec 19, 2009)

troller_cpf said:


> Will this mod also work on the Novatac/SPA Defense SPL120 AWKL WeaponLight?
> 
> thanks!


 
If you read the "product overview" it sounds a lot like a 120P.
http://www.spa-defense.com/spl_120.htm

Robert.


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## Daniel_sk (Dec 20, 2009)

I tried this at least 4 times and still no success, my fingers hurt . My 120E will start flashing too soon, it seems I have to click 250 times without a 0.5 second delay... I will try it once more but I am afraid of breaking the tailcap.


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## matrixshaman (Jan 3, 2010)

Daniel_SK, did you ever get this? If you've read this thread you'll probably have seen the best technique I found was setting it bezel down on a table and positioning yourself comfortably. 

Bumping this thread to include the new Novatac Storm and probably all the other new models. I'll try to post others as they get reported.


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## Fichtenelch (Jan 24, 2010)

Daniel_sk said:


> I tried this at least 4 times and still no success, my fingers hurt . My 120E will start flashing too soon, it seems I have to click 250 times without a 0.5 second delay... I will try it once more but I am afraid of breaking the tailcap.



I'm also trying and trying and all the time again, before reaching 100 clicks my arm falls off^^

Does anyone know where to get a flush switch for my olive 120e with intl shipping? No 50$ shipping pls^^ ;-) Already found 1 site, but 16.95 for the switch and over 30 bucks for shipping isn't senseful in my eyes...


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## AILL (Jan 24, 2010)

Fichtenelch said:


> Does anyone know where to get a flush switch for my olive 120e with intl shipping? No 50$ shipping pls^^ ;-) Already found 1 site, but 16.95 for the switch and over 30 bucks for shipping isn't senseful in my eyes...



https://www.lighthound.com/NovaTac-EDC-Flat-Switch-HA-III-Gray-Pewter-Finish_p_1320.html

Shipping is cheap there and the dealer is very reliable.

Greetings from Austria,

Andreas


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## rtryland (Feb 15, 2010)

I can confirm this still works on newer 120Ts... Mine is less than 3 months old and this crack although slightly irritating until you get the hang of it is effective.

The key in my experience was ONCE you've made the clicks and the light starts flashing and you press HOLD to get a slow beacon flash indicating the first option mode, you must click about once every 2-5 seconds to cycle through the modes. 

I experienced if you click to slowly you get the 6 error flashes and have to start all over and the same was true if you clicked to fast. As mentioned in an earlier post, if at first you don't succeed... Take a break. Getting frustrated like I did for 3-4 hours doesn't help at all. 

I put it down over night and picked it up this morning and presto second try.

Outstanding Discovery!!! Thanks again!

RTRYLAND


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## e-ville (Feb 15, 2010)

i searched and can not find a list of the options and what exactly every mode and option does or how to select and program them. but i was playing with my light anyways and screwed it all up lol. i only had a strobe and a low mod for a while, thank god for the reset its back to normal now but does anyone have a list or a link to a list of all these options and programming procedures?


*EDIT: sorry, i finally found it*


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## flashlight nut (Mar 21, 2010)

Hello everyone. New to the forum but immediately found it useful since I have just purchased the Novatac 120T. After a couple of tries I was able to complete the crack. Awesome. I was just wondering if this will work on the 120M since this model comes preprogrammed with only 2 light settings plus the strobe. Thanks.


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## Masque (Mar 21, 2010)

It should. I think you'll find that it's actually four levels, but two are the same....


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## flashlight nut (Mar 21, 2010)

Thanks. I will have to give it a try when I get it. I will post when I do.


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## Lost Hawaiian (Mar 21, 2010)

It will work with the 120M 

https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/255359

Rich


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## flashlight nut (Mar 22, 2010)

Thanks Rich. Very nice thread w/ pics. The more I read about these Novatacs I know I've made the right decision. I've read alot about the Ra's but I really prefer bezel down carry and like the shorter length, even though it is only less than 1/2 inch. This forum is great. I have already spent hours just browsing and learning.

Paul


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## merlocka (Apr 7, 2010)

Just picked up the 85T on sale at Lighthound for $59, worked like a charm.

Was originally going to drop a K2 right into this one, but I like it's tint better than my old one. So I guess my old one is getting the K2.

One thing I notice with the new 3xxxx series light (compared to my 1xxxx), click->hold to lock the light to the "Maximum" setting is a little flakey. Sometimes it locks, sometimes not. Might be that I'm just used to a "worn-in" button on my 1xxxx, but it happens alot. Just thought I'd mention.


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## sween1911 (Apr 8, 2010)

NNNNOOOOO!!! My trusty 85T that I 250-clicked to customizable goodness back when I first got it just got jacked. I was messing with it, changing a level (I had programmed the light to replace strobe with plain old High output) and inadvertantly entered the programming menu with 4 clicks instead of 3, then I accidentally set it on full-on tactical momentary, which (I remember from my trials messing with this light) requires factory reset to get out of, which puts me back in regulat 85T default mode. *sigh*

I really don't feel like doing the 250 clicks again. Maybe my OCD will let me sleep instead of re-doing it all night.


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## AILL (Apr 9, 2010)

sween1911 said:


> [...]
> I really don't feel like doing the 250 clicks again [...]



I am really sure you will.

:nana:

Andreas


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## Beacon of Light (Apr 12, 2010)

Rec'd my 85T last Fri. Been trying all weekend to get into the backdoor hack. I got there once and let the light go through the options until it dimmed and started ramping. I press and hold until light goes off, and then when I turn it back on it flashes 3 times quickly and turns itself off. Only way of having it work is unscrewing the light for a second or two and then it comes on in primary mode. Once light is turned off for a while it will repeat the same problem. Even still when I try to enter programming mode I just get the emergency strobe without progressing to the next options.

EDIT: Just to add, is it easier with the Tactical tailswitch or the Flat tailswitch to do the 250 clicks? I've only been able to get there once and I have tried at least 50 times over the weekend. I will usually fail after about 50-100 clicks with me usually pausing too long unintentionally. Even if I am clicking fast my thumb will shut down for a split second and then I get the strobe or dim.... RATS!!!!!!! I tried the bezel down and holding with one hand and clicking with the other. If it is worth it for the flat tailswitch to hack this thing I may buy one.


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## Lost Hawaiian (Apr 12, 2010)

Beacon of Light said:


> ...and then when I turn it back on it flashes 3 times quickly and turns itself off....


 
It sounds like you might have set the button lock-out feature by accident. When the light is off, try clicking 3 times rapidly. If this feature is set, that will unlock it and the light should come on in primary mode. I just tested on my locked 120P and it acts just like you said (if I unscrew it for a second it comes on in primary, bypassing the button lock).

This is one of my favorite features of these lights, to keep it from turning on by accident. 

Note: If you have this feature turned on, it will automatically engage after the light has been off for 5 minutes and will require the 3 rapid clicks to unlock. You can also manually lock the button with 3 rapid clicks right after you turn it off (if you don't want to wait the 5 min. for it to auto-lock).

As far as the 250 clicks, I cracked my 120M and SPL-120 fairly quickly using the method described previously of setting it bezel down on a tabletop and using my index finger. I advise not trying to go as fast as you can, but just kind of keep a steady rhythm. I also counted as I went so I'd have a little warning when it was about to go into program mode.

Good Luck and hope this helps,

Rich


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## Beacon of Light (Apr 12, 2010)

The one time I got it into programming mode I consciously DIDN'T count. I was clicking pretty fast so I was not able to count in my head as fast as I was clicking. It seemed much easier to not have to actively count as long as it gets to 250 or more clicks it will enter that mode. I just have to keep trying. 

Has anyone worn out the battery before getting into programming mode? I bought 2 RCR-123s but wanted to turn this into a 85P BEFORE trying rechargeable C123s as they sound a bit scary like I could fry the light or something if I don't do the battery reset thing before putting in a rechargeable.

Also is it advisable to disable (or is it enable) option 4 FIRST, before option 9? I didn't know if option 9 is enabled that once it turns off and then you turn it on, you can get to programming mode with a click click click press or if option 4 needs to be changed before this will occur.


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## Beacon of Light (Apr 13, 2010)

ok I finally got the option 9 enabled? so I can get into programming mode with the click click click press. For some reason option 1 (Emergency Strobe) 2 (SOS) seem like they are always being enabled as it always goes from dim to bright. Not sure if this is affecting the brightness ramping up/down as when I try to set brightness I get one of the strobe/flashing modes instead. What I mean is I cannot adjust the brightness for any preset it seems and I do have forced lock disabled.


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## Beacon of Light (Apr 13, 2010)

Well I did a factory reset after reading here it can correct some problems/glitches with programming. I then did the 250 clicks and enabled option 9. Got into program mode and the darned emergency and SOS are both enabled and the press and hold only allowed enabling not disabling. If I am doing something wrong then I'm an idiot, but save from reasing every thread here it seems like maybe mine isn't as programmable?


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## Lost Hawaiian (Apr 13, 2010)

Unless there is a problem with your particular light, I believe the Easter egg worked with all models. The only 2 I've had to use it on were the 120 models listed above. I do have another 120 and 2 85's, but they were P's to start. 

When you do the "press-hold" to toggle the options, are you holding until the light turns off?


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## Beacon of Light (Apr 13, 2010)

Lost Hawaiian said:


> When you do the "press-hold" to toggle the options, are you holding until the light turns off?



Yes on option 3, I am able to toggle on and off alternating back and forth but for some reason option 1 (emergency strobe) and option 2 (sos) I cannot seem to disable.

I did try the brightness/ramping just now and am for some reason seeing if go through signal modes and then the brightness ramping sequence. Weird as last night it went through about 4 different signal strobes/flashes and then kept repeating that loop without ever ramping solid light.

I did get all 4 modes set up:

1 click .08 lumen

2 click .23 lumen

3 click .66 lumen

click hold 3.8 lumen

PERFECT!!! 

_EDIT: Still not sure no one makes a dedicated light like this for people that like low low and never need a stupid bright light. I have been saying ever since owning a Quark AA why no one makes a dedicated light with a lower low than the moon mode, like .02 lumens (Dark Side of the Moon Mode), .2 lumens (Moon Mode), .5 lumens (Low Mode) and 1 or 2 lumens (Medium or High Mode depending on if you could call 1 lumen high). I've been waiting for a light like this for years and it really shouldn't only be available to people that have to buy a programmable light. I guess since this is PERFECT for what I want, then this moves to #1 EDC. Now to find a headlamp JUST LIKE THIS._

Still no clue why Options 1 can't be disabled, but set up like this I guess it doesn't matter.


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## Beacon of Light (Apr 13, 2010)

Lastly, can someone confirm if the Emergency and SOS strobes are disabled, whether they still appear in the dimming/ramping sequence?


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## Lost Hawaiian (Apr 13, 2010)

:thumbsup: on getting your light set up.

...and yes, the ramping will include all 21 levels (22 on 120P) and 3 different strobes (I just checked on both my 85 and 120) no matter how you have the options set.


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## Beacon of Light (Apr 14, 2010)

Bought 4 880mAh RCR123 batteries and for some reason even after a full charge I can't do a Battery-Detect Reset. I turn light on with old battery unscrew tailcap, then insert new RCR123 and then when I screw it back together I quickly hold button in when light comes on but it does not get brighter it just goes out. Light never turns on after this.


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## Beacon of Light (Apr 14, 2010)

Lost Hawaiian said:


> :thumbsup: on getting your light set up.
> 
> ...and yes, the ramping will include all 21 levels (22 on 120P) and 3 different strobes (I just checked on both my 85 and 120) no matter how you have the options set.



The manual states during the ramping process first it goes low to high and then high to low. I never see it go high to low.


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## Lost Hawaiian (Apr 14, 2010)

I don't have my manual in front of me, but I believe a double click during the ramping will reverse the direction.


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## Beacon of Light (Apr 14, 2010)

^ I think they mean it reverses the direction or sequence the modes go in.

not 

dim to bright <double click> bright to dim.


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## Lost Hawaiian (Apr 14, 2010)

hmm...we might not be talking about the same thing I guess. 

From on, when I "click-click-press and hold" it begins cycling, starting at whatever level I had it set at. When it reaches level 22 (brightest), it flashes to indicate the highest level, then cycles through the different strobes. Then it flashes again to let me know it's about to start ramping up from the lowest level. It will continue to cycle like this as long as I keep the button pressed. 

If I want to reverse the order of the cycle, I release and "click-click-press and hold" and it will immediately start going through the cycle backwards until I release again.

Is this what you were originally asking about?


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## Beacon of Light (Apr 14, 2010)

Yes but it never ramps from bright to dim. I usually start the ramping but never get the lowest level before it goes up 2 levels. Then I have to wait till it gets to the brightest and then the 4 signal modes before I can try again to get the lowest brightness setting.


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## Lost Hawaiian (Apr 14, 2010)

I have my 4th mode set to the lowest level. I found that it was easier for me to have the ramping going up so I'd get the flash after the strobes to tell me that the next one was the lowest level. When I tried setting it as it went high to low, I couldn't tell when it hit the lowest level.

After it cycles through the strobes, look for it to flash twice, then release as soon as it goes solid and it should be set at the lowest level.


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## Beacon of Light (Apr 14, 2010)

Well I just redid the 250 clicks as I wanted to try it again. My problem is maybe just the UI then. Primary (click on) I wanted set to lowest .08 lumens, but it may have gotten to level 3. How to lower that back down to .08 I have to keep button pressed and ramp up to the brightest setting, and then wait through the 4 signal modes before it returns to the lowest brightness setting. Unless there is another way I am just wondering if it is necessary to wait through all that just to lower a brightness level?

Another nitpick is say I was on Primary and then clicked to secondary or 3 clicks, there is no way to directly get to primary other than turning the light off and back on?


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## Lost Hawaiian (Apr 14, 2010)

Beacon of Light said:


> Another nitpick is say I was on Primary and then clicked to secondary or 3 clicks, there is no way to directly get to primary other than turning the light off and back on?


 
Two clicks will return you immediately to either the primary or secondary level. It will return to whichever of these two levels was last used.

For example, I have mine set as follows:

Primary: level 15 (10lm)
Secondary: level 19 (42lm)
Minimum: level 1 (.08lm)
Maximum: level 22 (120lm)

This is how it will behave from primary:

3 clicks -> minimum
Click-Press -> maximum

I can go back and forth between min and max as much as I want, but a double click will take me back to primary.

If I do the same thing, but start on the secondary level, a double click will take me back to secondary.

BTW, I tried resetting my minimum level with the ramping going up, then with it going down. It was definitely easier to do when it was ramping up since I had the 2 flashes after the strobes to guide me. When I tried it while ramping down, I kept overshooting the level and going to the strobes.


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## Beacon of Light (Apr 14, 2010)

cool thanks I was wondering why double clicking from the minimum setting (3 clicks) sometimes went to primary and sometimes went to secondary. Still not 100% sure but at least I can get to primary without having to turn off light.

I can also see how going from ramping up to be easier to get the level 1 setting. I still don't see how you are able to get it to ramp down. When you are in the brightness (click click press) setting, aren't you continually holding (pressing) the button until you find where you want the light set to that particular setting and then turning it off to save it?

EDIT: I just figured it out. If you're in brightness mode it first ramps up but then if you do another click click press it will ramp down. I don't remember it stating this in the manual but this is how to ramp down. Much better than having to cycle through all the flashing modes if you goof the first time having to wait until the ramping sequence cycles around again. 

Thanks Lost Hawaiian I think conversing with you has helped me figure most of this stuff out! It helped me from getting frustrated, thanks again!


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## Lost Hawaiian (Apr 14, 2010)

:thumbsup: yer welcome!


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## Beacon of Light (May 27, 2010)

Just got my new Novatac Classic AA today and set it up like all my others .08 (primary 1 click), .33 (secondary 2 click), .94 (minimum 3 click), 2.7 (maximum click press). Everything is fine there but something strange regarding the momentary maximum setting as it seems like it's accessing the primary setting as it is .08 lumens, and on my other lights it will do the maximum setting of 2.7 lumens only with momentary. 

Does the light redefine which level is primary/secondary/minimum/maximum depending on which mode you are in WHEN you enable or disable the forced setting or not?

Also what exactly is the difference between simple momentary and tactical momentary? The description doesn't sound all that different.

EDIT: I guess I figured out the difference between momentary modes. Simple momentary is when the light is on and then it DOES act as I expected with the hold it goes to maximum. When the light is off and holding the button, momentary is on at primary setting. I am guessing this is tactical momentary? Is there a way to program which mode tactical momentary comes on in?


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## kevinm (Jun 3, 2010)

Anybody have a copy of the Novatac EDC-P user manual? I did the 250 clicks and set option 9 to "on", but the 10 clicks from off to get the options menu does not work. 

Thanks,
Kevin


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## tolkaze (Jun 3, 2010)

Once you crack it, isn't it three clicks and hold from on? Thats what it is on my 120M after the crack


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## kevinm (Jun 3, 2010)

Yep; got it. Thanks! I'd still like the manual; it's not the same as the EDC Ultimate.

Kevin


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## GAReed (Jun 3, 2010)

Kevin, check out bluecrow76's most excellent flowchart here: https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/217963
I did find a pdf copy of the Flashlight User Guide, EDC- 85P or 120P "Novatac-EDC-P-UserGuide.pdf" Copyright 2007 by NovaTac, Inc. July 2007. That was after googling/following hundreds of links (broken) back to NovaTac.com... almost like somebody was making it esp difficult :shakehead to find one on the worlie.wide.webbie... I hesitate to post the link...  I haven't read ALL the forum rules  but I seem to recall there was something about posting links... and I don't have a place to "put" the pdf... I could maybe email you a copy... 



kevinm said:


> Anybody have a copy of the Novatac EDC-P user manual? I did the 250 clicks and set option 9 to "on", but the 10 clicks from off to get the options menu does not work.
> 
> Thanks,
> Kevin


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## kevinm (Jun 3, 2010)

Yes, please send the email. Also, that flow chart is great!lovecpf

Thanks,
Kevin


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## GAReed (Jun 3, 2010)

PM sent.


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## Petersen (Jul 11, 2010)

Kevinm, did you get that manual?
- otherwise I also have all the NT manuals stored on my PC....

Just had to use it myself, as I accidently made a fac. reset of my 120T..silly me

had to try several times before I made the 250 clicks work - usually get to around 180-200 clicks, and my finger cramps...


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## selfbuilt (May 15, 2011)

FYI, just posted a mini-review of the Novatac Classic here, directly comparing it to my 2008-edition 120P.

The 250-click trick worked fine for me on the Classic (although automatic turn-off also got toggled on initially somehow). But note the input voltage range of the Classic is lower than the Storm or older 120-series.

Thanks again to LLCoolBeams and all the other contributors to this thread. :wave:


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## 127.0.0.1 (Feb 13, 2012)

Thread from the dead.

I just scored a new Gold Novatac Storm. and sure enough, after chewing my arm off after 4 failed 250 sessions (failed because
I thought about something other than press-press-press-press and introduced a small pause) all this programming mumbo-jumbo
does work and is easy to figure out as long as you do not disable option 4 right away (force 1 click to be primary). it does make playing with 
the modes and learning all 9 options difficult if 4 is disabled. disable option 4 at the end when your light is setup as you want it.


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## sween1911 (Oct 22, 2012)

Back to one of my favorite threads on CPF... I had cracked my 85T awhile back, but it reset back to factory specs and I left it that way for awhile. I now keep this light in the top outside compartment of my EDC bag, a Maxpedition Sitka. After opening it to find the Novatac on a few times (grrr...) I just did the 250-click again and enabled auto-button-lock. It's not a big deal to triple-click and it keeps the light from turning on by itself. 

To assist in doing the hack, I actually wrote out and numbered 25 squares on a piece of paper, hitting the button 10 times as I looked from square to square. It actually made the process pretty simple and easier to keep track of counting the clicks.


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## 127.0.0.1 (Oct 22, 2012)

oh man I did 5 failed 250-runs once and was about to hit myself with a brick. I would stutter-click
around 110-140 about every time. grrrrrrrrrrRRRRRRRRR*RRRR*


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## sween1911 (Nov 2, 2012)

I tell ya, write out 25 blocks on a piece of paper numbered 1 to 25. Look at #1, click ten times, look at #2, click ten times, etc. After almost permanently injuring my hand a few times going nuts, this helped me relax and keep track of which one I was on.


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## silver_bacon (Nov 2, 2012)

This thread brings back some memories. 250 was a lot of presses. I guess they must have figured no one would bother pressing it that many times.

What finally did Novatac in? Was it the Emissive Energy lawsuit?


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## speedsix (Nov 3, 2012)

Thanks, now I have carpel tunnel and need surgery. Thinking about suing! Also, my flashlight has a virus. It keeps flashing ads for boner pills in Moris code!


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## sween1911 (Dec 29, 2014)

Just snagged a Novatac Classic from Amazon. 250 clicks still works like a champ!


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## Lithium466 (Dec 29, 2014)

Thread digging but What a coincidence, yesterday I bought a Wichita on ebay, can't wait to receive it!
I always loved the wichita, with 17650 tube from HDS...feel like the poor man's HDS lol

Quick question, is your classic able to maintain the highest level for a long time with Eneloop?


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## sween1911 (Dec 30, 2014)

That's a great question. It's running on Eneloops now, but I haven't run it down enough to get a good feel for how long it lasts. I threw out the batts that came with it and first used a pair of Duracells and it seemed to go through those pretty quickly before it started blinking on high. Considering making the first mode at turn-on a lower level and the press-hold button (originally strobe) the highest output. 

There's a great review by our own "selfbuilt" here with lots of good info: 
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...123A)-Mini-review-comparisons-to-Novatac-120P


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## Lithium466 (Dec 30, 2014)

That's how I programmed mine, a bit like the "Executive" HDS clicky.
Other than that, it seems mine has trouble maintaining highest output more than a few minutes with freshly charged Eneloop...maybe my Eneloop are too old? 
It has no problem with a CR123A. With a RCR, it seems it's putting a lot more amps to the emitter, like ~2A. I didn't dare trying for more than a few seconds, doesn't want to fry my Classic!


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## jon_slider (Aug 21, 2018)

SnWnMe said:


> Okay this is what I noticed with my 120E.
> 
> It is not exactly a 120P. Someone said it becomes a programmable E and this is correct IME with my 20K SN 120E. There seems to be inconsistencies with the way click press behaves.
> 
> ...



thanks for the hint on how to access the level that Press gives from ON! I was able to customize my SpaDefense 120T to my liking (instead of maximum I chose Strobe for the Press from ON and click Press from Off). I am using 16340 cells (I did a battery reset by uscrewing the tail a little, then screw tight and hold button for 5 seconds only, then release.. do NOT hold for 10 seconds or you lose the 250 click hack and have to start over)

===todays programming

4 is ON, last mode memory
7 is ON, momentary last mode used, from off
Do NOT enable option 8! or you will stuck with a light that has to be factory reset (unscrew tail slightly, retighten, hold button for 10 seconds until light turns off), since the button wont click, and the light will only be ON when holding the button.
9 is ON

here are my presets:
click is ON (memorizes high, low, and moon)
double click is High 65 lumen
double click is Low 5 lumen
tripple click is moonlight 0.14

press from off gives the memorized mode
click from off gives the memorized mode

How to program what happens from a Press while ON:
from ON I did click press, release, to access the press option.. Then I programmed the level that press produces:
I did double click hold until I got the mode I wanted, I chose strobe, then turned off.

now from ON, hold gives strobe, from any mode
from OFF, click hold gives strobe,
in both cases releasing the button stops strobe and returns to previous mode, ON at whatever level, or Off if done from Off

Im kind of happy with this setup, for now 
===

Novatac resets, from the Manual:
_*Soft-Reset* – fix an unresponsive state or part of a higher level reset. If your light is working normally, turn your light on and unscrew the battery case until the light goes out, count to three and then screw the battery case back together. If your light is in an unresponsive state, remove the batteries for 2 minutes and then reinstall them. Identified by 1 second of dim light. Does not change your settings. 

*Battery-Detect-Reset* – required to detect battery configuration changes. Perform a soft-reset but while the dim light is on, press and hold the button for 5 seconds until your light dims. Release the button when your light dims. Identified by 5 seconds of bright light followed by dim light. Does not change your settings. 

If you release the button during the brighter period, your light displays the error flash sequence consisting of 6 rapid flashes and your light will not detect the battery configuration. 

If there is insufficient power to run your light at full power there is also insufficient power to safely remember the detected battery configuration. When there is insufficient power to remember the detected battery configuration, you will see two seconds of very rapid flashing. This also indicates that the battery configuration has not been properly detected and damage may occur to rechargeable batteries. Only fully charged rechargeable battery configurations can be properly detected. 

*Factory-Reset* - restores your light to factory settings, including disabling Tactical Momentary, enabling brightness level ramping, enabling the Option menu and detecting the type of batteries installed. Perform a soft-reset but while the dim light is on, press and hold the button for 10 seconds until your light turns off. Identified by 5 seconds of bright light, 3 seconds of dim light and 2 more seconds of bright light. The settings are now restored to the factory defaults. _


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## Lithium466 (Aug 21, 2018)

Glad to hear you have it set up as you like !
Like I told you earlier, you just need 18650 battery tube now^^


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## jon_slider (Aug 21, 2018)

LOL.. Im fully entertained writing notes about the differences between the setup for the P vs T models
work in progress:

=====
*stock 120 T configuration*:
click = 120 (maximum) lumens
double click = 10 lumens
tripple click = .33
from ON, press = Strobe
from OFF, press = maximum lumens (press uses the Primary mode and momentary)
from OFF, click press = Momentary Strobe
from ON, click press release = Strobe
Momentary, mode 7, ON 
Ramping, Mode9, OFF

*stock 120 P modes*
click = 11 lumens (set by using double click hold, to ramp up, cycles through strobe and SOS and minimum)
double click = 30 lumens (set by using double click hold, to ramp up, cycles through strobe and SOS and minimum)
tripple click = .33 (set by using double click hold, to ramp up, cycles through strobe and SOS and minimum)
from ON, press = 120 maximum (this is set from click press from on, then double clic hold rising ramp until maximum, indicated by double flash. release at desired level, click turn off.. press level is saved)
from OFF, press = 11 lumens (this is set by Primary mode)
click press = maximum (set by using double click hold, to ramp up, cycles through strobe and SOS and minimum)
Momentary, mode 7, OFF (triple click hold to get to the 9 step option menu, release, click 6 times, hold till light turns off to toggle setting)
Ramping, Mode9, ON (triple click hold to get to the 9 step option menu, release, click 6 times, hold till light turns off to toggle setting)


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## thermal guy (Jan 11, 2019)

I have been playing with my novatac classic AA. Funny thing is I forgot how bad these things are compared to a real hds but for what it is it’s not bad. But check this out after it started acting funny something I knew it was going to do I did a factory reset and did not lose the options menu. 3 clicks press. If memory serves I think I should have 🤔


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## Lithium466 (Jan 11, 2019)

Interesting ! I didn't dare trying, I dread the 250 clicks^^
Are you sure you did a factory reset and nit just a battery detect reset ?


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## thermal guy (Jan 11, 2019)

Had no choice it started acting all nova Taki 😂😂


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## bigburly912 (Jan 11, 2019)

My 2xaa Novatac has the same style spring in it as the troubled one that I sold to jon_slider. I haven’t tried playing with it. I’ll end up selling it I’m sure. It’s nice as is.


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## Nitroz (Jan 11, 2019)

Bigburly912 said:


> My 2xaa Novatac has the same style spring in it as the troubled one that I sold to jon_slider. I haven’t tried playing with it. I’ll end up selling it I’m sure. It’s nice as is.



Love the form factor and its beauty, even the way the modes worked but dang that stupid spring and the fact that without it you could use an 18350.


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## bigburly912 (Jan 11, 2019)

Apparently there are different styles of springs in these lights and some are more problematic than others. I’ve bought 5 of them in different iterations over the past 6 months and sold all but the 2xaa. It’ll be gone soon I’m sure. They don’t fill and niche for me I just like trying them out for awhile. [emoji16] My HDS lights and some of the others I have just get used more. I like them, I just don’t love them like I do my hds


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## jon_slider (Jan 12, 2019)

Nitroz said:


> Love the form factor and its beauty, even the way the modes worked but dang that stupid spring and the fact that without it you could use an 18350.



yes, the spring can be problematic
and yes, the signal spring can be eliminated and you can use 18350, with the stock driver:
NovaTac 120T Triple Nichia 219C - H17Fx - 18350 - Tail Clicky

l-r Pewter Novatac SPA Defense w N219b 4500k 9080 90+ CRI and 0.1 to 270 max lumens, Novatac Storm w N219b 4500k 9080 90+ CRI w 0.2 to 110 max lumens, HDS w XP-G 6200k 72 CRI w 0.08 to 200 lumens







All three lights share HDS DNA, including low battery step downs, and low battery shut offs.
They also share the same multi click operation, and programming options, thanks to the 250 click Unlocking instructions in this thread.

The Novatacs have visibe flicker when the battery gets low. The HDS has practically no visible flicker, I can only spot HDS flicker visually, when I intentionally wave the light quickly up and down.

They all share similar beam patterns, with a small tight hotspot. This makes the lights brighter in that small area, than other lights with similar lumen levels that are spread out onto a larger area.

My HDS has one outstanding feature the Novatacs will never have, a Rotary Dial, that makes multi clicking practically obsolete, unless I want to access strobe.


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## jon_slider (Aug 18, 2021)

thanks for the unlock tutorial

I just did the 250 click unlock on this Gen 1 Novatac 120T..




I then set it up as a 120P

fun little light


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## JimIslander (Aug 18, 2021)

It's 2009 all over again.


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## Helmut.G (Aug 19, 2021)

jon_slider said:


> thanks for the unlock tutorial
> 
> I just did the 250 click unlock on this Gen 1 Novatac 120T..
> View attachment 15231
> ...


Interesting that you would bump this thread right now.
I reactivated my old Novatacs just a couple of hours before you posted, after not really using them for a couple of years. All of them are unlocked to the full functionality, of course.
The black 85T and the "Classic" (2xAA) work fine (if you accept the typical trouble with the springs as fine, that is), but the HA/natural 120T is very unreliable. It's probably a driver issue.
I stored the "Classic" near a window for a while, and the black ano has started to lighten a bit and go brownish on the side that was facing the light. Cheap chinese glossy black ano for the win


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## jon_slider (Aug 19, 2021)

Helmut.G said:


> the HA/natural 120T is very unreliable. It's probably a driver issue.


glad you got some working well

for the unreliable one,
1. try exchanging the signal spring from one of your working lights..

2. If the 120T is still unreliable, next I would try cleaning off all oil inside the head and ends of body tube and inside the tail. also clean any oil off the signal spring.

did the 120T become reliable after either of those steps? if so, then relubricate threads and O ring, and celebrate


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## badtziscool (Aug 19, 2021)

Helmut.G said:


> Interesting that you would bump this thread right now.
> I reactivated my old Novatacs just a couple of hours before you posted, after not really using them for a couple of years. All of them are unlocked to the full functionality, of course.
> The black 85T and the "Classic" (2xAA) work fine (if you accept the typical trouble with the springs as fine, that is), but the HA/natural 120T is very unreliable. It's probably a driver issue.
> I stored the "Classic" near a window for a while, and the black ano has started to lighten a bit and go brownish on the side that was facing the light. Cheap chinese glossy black ano for the win


Whaaaa?? I didn't realize anodizing can fade under UV exposure. Maybe paint?


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## Helmut.G (Aug 19, 2021)

badtziscool said:


> Whaaaa?? I didn't realize anodizing can fade under UV exposure. Maybe paint?


The anodization layer itself is probably fine, I guess it's the black pigment embedded in it that breaks down.
I have observed this with a couple of lights with black ano. By far the most extreme is an Ultrafire WF-600 which used to be black. I's now mostly a burnt red on the side facing the window, dark brown on the side facing from the window. The tailcap and extension tube section were in a different anodizing bath and are now a bright sand color on the side facing the window and a burnt red on the other side.


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