# Should I mod my Surefire 6P or buy a new flashlight?



## lightbalb (May 21, 2017)

Hello guys,

I'm wanting to have an LED light that will have good performance and be rechargeable. It's main use will be urban exploration, and hiking at night. So maybe around ~4 hours of use? 


I've got a surefire 6P that I barely use because of the batteries being too expensive. It still has the original incandescent light in it. 
Is it possible to easily and cheaply mod my old 6P to do these things? Or am I better off just buying a new light at this point? I'd like to not have to waste any money if possible, and the 6P has an awesome body that I really like.


Any suggestions guys? 

Thanks!


----------



## scout24 (May 21, 2017)

Hello, and welcome. If you go to the Incandescent Flashlight subforum a few below where you are now, there is a 19 page thread titled "Why is the Surefire 6P so good" that reaches back about 10 years. Plenty of food for thought. Personally? Keep it, buy some 16650 cells, and a Malkoff M61L dropin module in your preferred tint, and enjoy. Not the cheapest, but probably one of the best choices. Happy reading!


----------



## vadimax (May 21, 2017)

My option is Sportac Nichia Triple P60. Beautiful tint and useful flood beam with some throw:







If your light has a standard battery tube you should use a 16650 cell for rechargeable power.


----------



## bykfixer (May 21, 2017)

X2 on the 16650 cell and Malkoff low drop in. 

You'll need a charger too and a Nitecore D2 (2 bay) or D4 (4 bay) charger will give you lots of safe battery charging options at a good price. 

Malkoff has N for neutral (not white, not yellow but a nice tint that's easy on the eyes); W for warm (similar to your light bulb tint) or a standard white. The L series gives you a very noticable increase in brightness while providing 5 hours of steady output with a nice long period of dimming so you should get the 4 hour excursion in with a charged cell. Slip a 2nd cell in your carry bag and you'd be good to go if things get hairy.


----------



## Str8stroke (May 21, 2017)

Keep it, and do exactly what byk suggested. You will likely be very satisfied.


----------



## peter yetman (May 21, 2017)

The 6P is a nice solid light. If anything goes wrong with it, it's easily fixed.
Use the 16650 cell, but keep a couple of primaries for emergencies.
The Malkoff drop ins are solid and reliable, you won't regret getting one.
Illumn.com also stock Malkoff drop ins, the stocks are low at the mo but they'll be back. They specialise in Nichia 219 drop ins which are very gentle on your eyes and show colours very well. Sorry Mike.
P


----------



## ven (May 21, 2017)

Another keep it and upgrade the engine here as well. 16650 cells offer 2500mah , drop in wise its almost endless................


----------



## Woods Walker (May 21, 2017)

I would get a Malkoff M61L or NL.


----------



## gsr (May 21, 2017)

Keep it, but go with a Malkoff M361 drop in, and upgrade your tail cap to a McClicky. You'll get three levels of light that you can rapidly access. Your run times on the lower levels will give you more than enough run time for all night use.


----------



## archimedes (May 21, 2017)

Yes, the P60 system does offer you a few choices for updates and upgrades ...

https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/217252

... and agree that Malkoff would be (actually is, in fact) my own choice, too


----------



## berryns (May 21, 2017)

+1

Except I would get the M61NLL or WLL. 




bykfixer said:


> X2 on the 16650 cell and Malkoff low drop in.
> 
> You'll need a charger too and a Nitecore D2 (2 bay) or D4 (4 bay) charger will give you lots of safe battery charging options at a good price.
> 
> Malkoff has N for neutral (not white, not yellow but a nice tint that's easy on the eyes); W for warm (similar to your light bulb tint) or a standard white. The L series gives you a very noticable increase in brightness while providing 5 hours of steady output with a nice long period of dimming so you should get the 4 hour excursion in with a charged cell. Slip a 2nd cell in your carry bag and you'd be good to go if things get hairy.


----------



## Timothybil (May 21, 2017)

One note: If you are going to carry extra cells, make sure that they are in a container of some sort that will guarantee that they will not short out against anything. One thing you never want to see is a lithium primary or Li-Ion cell self destructing due to a short. Many Li-Ion cells have protection circuits that are designed to cut off the output if the cell is shorted, but it takes some small amount of time for that to kick in, and one really doesn't want to place all their trust in it operating properly in a timely manner. It is better to make sure the situation never arises.


----------



## bykfixer (May 21, 2017)

berryns said:


> +1
> 
> Except I would get the M61NLL or WLL.



I have WLL's in my 6P's but it sounz like lightbalb wants brighter than the P60 he has now. 

10 hour runtime on a pair of primaries aint nuthin' to sneeze at.


----------



## Timothybil (May 21, 2017)

While I agree that Malkoff Devices are the gold standard, they are a little to expensive for my tastes and usage. I have a CUXM/CUXP drop in from Mountain Electronics that I really like. I chose the Nichia 219 emitter for the high CRI, and the standard three mode levels. One can also select several Cree options for the emitter/reflector, and any of several mode sets as well. One can't beat the price, and it works very will with the single 16650 cell in my 6P.

Note: You CAN NOT use it with two CR123 or RCR123 cells. The over voltage will let the magic blue smoke out, and we all know that once that smoke is gone the device in question will never work again.


----------



## Crazyeddiethefirst (May 21, 2017)

Another vote for keep it, go with a drop in and a McClicky. You can continue to upgrade the 6p every time something newer or better comes along for infinity. What I have found(and I have way more flashlights than I can ever justify) is that I do not need thousands of lumens for everyday stuff. In fact, I don't need several hundred lumens(my Caveat is except when I do search & rescue, then high lumens are needed). Almost everything I do actually requires nothing more than 100 lumens. My point being that the 6P is an excellent host and can be outfitted with batteries and drop ins to suite every need. Because they are affordable I have several, each set up to a different purpose...I love the Malkoff drop-ins, but also have the Sportrac Triple and a few custom made ones. I keep my Silver 6P in the original configuration knowing it can sit for 10 years and work as well as day 1(I love incandescent for some things), and I know what I am grabbing if I need it in a hurry. Please let us know what you decide, and after a couple months let us know how it is working out for you...


----------



## irongate (May 21, 2017)

In fact once you put a drop in it and you like that so much you will want another one and another, it is that bad!


----------



## ChrisGarrett (May 21, 2017)

I dumped $40 for a 3 mode Redilast XM-L2 U2 P60 running at 1.5A on high and a pair of Redilast 17670 protected cells that fit perfectly.

That's all I'm going to do with mine, for now.

Good luck, Chris


----------



## Modernflame (May 21, 2017)

Don't ever get rid of the 6P! It's one of the most versatile platforms available. I think you'll love the Malkoff M61NL.


----------



## lightbalb (May 22, 2017)

Oh don't worry guys, I had no plans of ever getting rid of this thing. I just recently heard that this model has been discontinued.

I'm exactly as invested in flashlights as you guys are, and I'm very inexperienced when it comes to these things. The reason I got the 6P was because I just like to buy quality products. If only I known the batteries were that expensive..  

Nevertheless, I was saddened to that they aren't making the 6P anymore.

I will definitely let you guys know what I choose, but so far I'm kinda overwhelmed as to which options I should take. I believe the battery is obvious. I will go with a 16650 rechargeable or two. I won't be going for the larger sized one (18xxx something?) because I don't want to bore my flashlight. Also, would I be okay just buying like a 15 dollar charger and any battery off Amazon?? Or are there brands out there that are noticeably better and worth buying? Whats the best bang for the buck? 

Especially when it is no longer on the market... I think if I ever wanted one of those, I would just opt for a cheap solarpower L2? If I'm not mistaken. 

So that leaves the drop in light, I'd like to go for a LED because I've heard they are superior. However I'm not sure which drop in does what really.. I hear malkoff is pretty much the best product in terms of quality, but I can't really tell the difference between them or whether its worth getting the other mentioned brands.


----------



## lightfooted (May 22, 2017)

lightbalb said:


> Oh don't worry guys, I had no plans of ever getting rid of this thing. I just recently heard that this model has been discontinued.
> 
> I'm exactly as invested in flashlights as you guys are, and I'm very inexperienced when it comes to these things. The reason I got the 6P was because I just like to buy quality products. If only I known the batteries were that expensive..
> 
> ...



Keeppower 16650s are what I use and are a newer, higher capacity battery. I recommend just finding a Nitecore charger, the Intellicharger i2 is good and simple to use. It can also charge NiMh batteries as well. 

I have a Mountain electronics and Solarforce in each of my Surefires and they both work great. At Mountain Electronics they have a pretty diverse selection of possibilities from the LED to the controller board. You can even custom order the driver to do what you want within the scope of the platform. Be careful though, you may soon find that 6P mods are a deeper rabbit hole than you first imagined.


----------



## ven (May 22, 2017)

Charger wise, xtar do some cheap/decent chargers as well as the opus btc100(this can charge 4.35v). If you buy standard(naked) 16650 cells, so not wrapped by keepPower etc etc(protected), then you can charge them to 4.35v and squeeze a bit more run time out.

Malkoff speak for them selves, another good value alternative would be sportac(triple). Have a look on illumination gear, have some nice 219b and 219c 4000k triple options. I prefer the 2 mode (20%/100%)over the single mode drop ins(100%), simply because the 20% is ample for most tasks at around 160-180lm. The triples are like a large hot spot, so floody biased with moderate reach. Topped with 3x nichia's makes for a nice useful hi cri beam for under $40.

Also(works well on the 219c 4000k but not so well on my 219b triple) you can pop out the optics and have a mule(just a little wall of flood light)


----------



## Timothybil (May 22, 2017)

When choosing LEDs there are a couple different things to decide upon. One is tint, or color temperature expressed as degrees Kelvin (K). Tint is usually broken down into Cool White (around 6000K and up), Neutral White (4000K to 6000K), and Warm White (less than 4000K). The other major variable is Color Rendition Index (CRI). A CRI of 100 has been described as afternoon sunlight, and is the benchmark all artificial lights are measured against. Almost all incandescent lamps are considered to be close to or at 100 CRI. Current LEDs range from around 70 CRI to 90+ CRI. Since higher CRIs are created in LEDs by adding additional phosphors to the mix to produce a more even spectrum of light, and thus the higher CRI, as the CRI increases, the total available lumens decreases. An example would be that for a currently popular LED, the highest output version is Cool White, with a CRI in the low 70s, and an output of about 1200 lumens. The same LED formulated to produce 90+ CRI would fall between Warm White and Neutral White, and have an output around 700 to 800 lumens. Many purchasers want the maximum output possible regardless of CRI, while others want the improved color rendition of the higher CRI and are willing to accept the lower output to get it.. If you Google Color Rendition Index, you should be able to find examples of how the different CRI levels affect the visibility of colors.

One other point to keep in mind when choosing lumen levels is that the human eye's response to increases in light is not linear. It takes a four-fold increase in light level to appear to be twice as bright to the eye. Thus differences of a couple hundred lumens between various lights don't really translate to easily visible differences in visibility.


----------



## peter yetman (May 22, 2017)

Nice explanation Tim. I read so many posts from people looking forward to upgrading their lumens by 10% or so. They ain't gonna see nuffin' different.
P


----------



## Timothybil (May 23, 2017)

I know. So many times I see someone post that they are going to take the Cree option because the Nichia is so much dimmer. In the example I used, yes, the Nichia emitter has a 40% lower lumens output, but that really translates into about a 10% or so lessening in perception. Or they are trying to decide between two lights, and decide to go with the one that has 200 more lumens output, even if it has fewer of the features they want. Oh well.


----------



## peter yetman (May 23, 2017)

There's an emoticon for banging your head on a wall, that'd do.
P


----------



## archimedes (May 23, 2017)

Gotta learn one way or other ...


----------



## cp2315 (May 23, 2017)

I would highly recommend drop ins from PFlexPro. Just google PflexPro and it will come up. Randy (owner) makes brilliant P60 drop ins, possibly as reliable as Malkoff but way brighter and has UI options.
There are some testimonies on this forum too.


Disclaimer: I have both malkoff and PflexPro. They are both my favorites. Which one is on me for the day is random. I just want to give OP another option.


----------



## lightbalb (May 23, 2017)

Hey guys, I ended up ordering a Nitecore D2 charger and two KeepPower 16650 batteries.

Still scratching my head on the drop in though, I may use the stock incandescent for now while I learn more about the LED drop ins!

Thanks.


----------



## bykfixer (May 23, 2017)

^^ Good move X3.
Charger, battery and the learning thing. 

Bravo


----------



## Timothybil (May 23, 2017)

lightbalb said:


> Still scratching my head on the drop in though, I may use the stock incandescent for now while I learn more about the LED drop ins!
> Thanks.


Be prepared. Due to the voltage difference between two CR123 cells and one 16650, you will probably not get full brightness out of that incan P60.


----------



## fyrstormer (May 24, 2017)

Should you mod your Surefire or buy a new flashlight? Which one do you like better? This is a hobby, do whatever you feel like doing. Maybe do both and sell the one you don't like as much.


----------



## cp2315 (May 24, 2017)

If you use 2x16340 and a 9V incan drop in, it will be brighter than before.

If you use 1x16650 and a 6V or 9V drop in, it will be dimmer.


----------

