# Anyone here using windows 8 that acutally likes it?



## Frijid (Mar 19, 2013)

I played around with one today, was NOT impressed. felt to much like an apple product. When the time comes for me to buy a new computer, i'll instantly downgrade it back to 7. 

windows seems to leap frog with OS's. 
me-bad
xp- good
vista-bad
7-good
8-bad


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## rmteo (Mar 19, 2013)

I do.


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## Thr3Evo (Mar 20, 2013)

Like it? Nope, 
Loving it... Big YES
Best windows yet, by far

And pairing my Android with it for endless possibilities couldn't be easier...definitely nothing like apple.


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## mvyrmnd (Mar 20, 2013)

I'm using it part time - I'm not hating it. It certainly performs, being built to run well on tablets and whatnot.

It's slowly growing on me, once the initial learning curves and teething issues are dealt with.

And I agree - it's nothing like Apple - but which is "better" is very subjective.

They have the same end goal, with two very different approaches.

Apple are trying to tie your digital like together with iCloud. You have discrete devices that all share information via the Internet. The end result is all data on all devices all the time.

Microsoft are shooting for the same experience, but on LITERALLY the same device. You have your tablet that you take with you, then get home and dock it and it serves as your home PC too. The end result (all your data all the time) but the methods very different.

Which one works for you? That's the one you should buy.

As for the OP thinking it feels like an Apple product - I'm not sure which Apple products he's been using recently!

(Full disclosure, I own a Win7 desktop, MacBook dual booting MacOS and Win8, iPad, Galaxy Tab 2 10.1, iPhone and Galaxy Tab 7. I am not in any way biased to one platform, I acknowledge the pros and cons of each!)


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## Arm and Leg (Mar 20, 2013)

Well, it appears you're alone in this one Frigid.


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## PhotonBoy (Mar 20, 2013)

Desktop user here. Waiting for Windows 9.


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## bedazzLED (Mar 20, 2013)

Like it on the Tablet.
Hate it on the Desktop PC.


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## LEDAdd1ct (Mar 21, 2013)

I tried Windows Eight for four days in January 2013.

Got it home, and immediately applied a few tweaks:

1) Restored classic Desktop
2) Restored classic Explorer (GUI and shell)

Faster and smoother than Windows 7, if possible, and with the GUI and Desktop tweaks, simply flies.

The "Make Windows 8 Bearable" *Must Do* Tweaks

1) Classic Shell <--link

Cost: * Free *(really, truly...no adware, no spyware...the good stuff!)

2) This is a placeholder...I can't remember the second program I used but will edit/replace this once I remember

I still like Windows XP because I feel like I have more granular control...like the computer does not try to outsmart or outthink me and do ten million things in the background. I feel like it does what I want only when I want it to.

However, I truly enjoyed playing with Windows 8 _with Classic Shell_ and the other program I cannot now recall installed.


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## Biker Bear (Mar 21, 2013)

bedazzLED said:


> Like it on the Tablet.
> Hate it on the Desktop PC.


Spot on. I haven't used it on a "touch first" device, but on a regular desktop PC (well... in a virtual machine on a regular desktop PC) - it drove me crazy until I installed Classic Shell and enabled the Boot To Desktop function.

One small thing that annoyed me about it was discovering that in the Desktop - the user can no longer customize the fonts the OS uses - you can't even adjust the SIZE of a particular sort of UI text by itself; you can only increase or decrease the display size of all text everywhere. I have certain fonts I find particularly readable and/or pleasing to my eye that I prefer to use - and can't, under Win8. (I even tried copying over the relevant control panel from Win7 - but that doesn't work.)

I found it appalling how many control elements in "Metro" or whatever MS calls it now that were not clearly explained or documented; I had to go online and search for how to close a Metro application. (Grab the top of the screen and drag down until the screen minimizes, indicating you're about to "throw it away".) Would it have killed them to provide "training wheels" - a mode that shows those items ghosted that the user can turn off once they've gotten the hang of it?

So on anything that isn't touch-first, I'm with Frijid; not having tried it on a touch device, I can't say whether or not I would like interacting with it in that way.


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## gunga (Mar 21, 2013)

I use it with Start8 to restore the desktop ($5). Overall okay with it but don't like all the software incompatibilities.


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## alpg88 (Mar 21, 2013)

got a laptop with win8, can't complain in general, there is a small bug, when on this site, typing posts, can't use enter key to move cursor on next line, none of the keys moves cursor to the next line, neither does the mouse. other sites no problems.


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## franzdom (Mar 21, 2013)

I love it, whole family wanted to upgrade which I have done now. The major drag is our HP P1006 printer still won't work with it and I am losing hope that HP will ever release a driver, but otherwise I think it's awesome. Startup is super fast, love playing Wordament and some other games that came with it, find the start menu (screen) a lot nicer than the old way. I use W7 at work and it's ok but I adore W8.


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## TIMEBNDIT (Mar 21, 2013)

I am just now getting use to XP, why would I want to change


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## ABTOMAT (Mar 21, 2013)

I can't stand Windows 8. It's like they took Windows 7, replaced the Start menu with a tablet operating system, and tweaked the regular OS so it's less friendly to people who use a keyboard and mouse. They completely forgot that a computer with a large, high-res monitor (or two) and a keyboard and mouse doesn't work very well with software designed for a handheld device with a touchscreen. All the UI touches developed over the last 25 years of computer use are out the window for no good reason. Windows 8 should be an installable option for people who need it.

It's not just Microsoft that's guilty of this. Starting a couple years ago, companies making software for desktop computers saw how popular tablets were getting and decided to model their UIs after them. And websites are going along with this and starting to resembled the Japanese web (a majority of people over there use cell phones for their internet access) more and more, which isn't a good thing.


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## subwoofer (Mar 21, 2013)

You should try using Windows Server 2012! I thought the server software might be safe from this interface, but NO, you have to fight with the touch oriented interface on a server. AARRGH!

As for the desktop version, it grates, but then again so did Vista and I love Windows 7 which is really a grown up Vista. At this point I'm not sure if I just need to adjust and get used to it, or if I want Windows 9 to come out.

First impressions on non-touch device are very poor and requires a lot of re-learning how to get to things. If you have a 'Surface' and only browse the internet it is probably great.

It should have a big warning sticker saying 'NOT FOR BUSINESS USE'.


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## LittleBill (Mar 21, 2013)

bought new laptop for friend was forced to buy 8, played with it for 8 hours, 5 of which was making it so that stupid metro screen never rears its face again,

classic shell and a couple other tweaks pretty much make it run like 7, she didn't even know it was 8 till i showed her the metro screen which i hid

great for tablets absolutely horrible for power users

even looked on toshiba's site there is no win 7 drivers, thus no down grade


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## Yoda4561 (Mar 21, 2013)

Arm and Leg said:


> Well, it appears you're alone in this one Frigid.



His topic asked for people who liked it, not people who think it's the least intuitive OS short of a command line interface, which completely fails to improve upon windows 7 as a desktop operating system gui.


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## TIMEBNDIT (Mar 21, 2013)

My Computer Guy wanted me to upgrade, says he loves 8, but as I said I just now got comfortable with the old stuff. When one gets old we don't want change... I purchased a small notebook to play around with and it has 7 and I get so mad at it sometimes.


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## fyrstormer (Mar 21, 2013)

Windows 8 is passable with the addition of the Start8 program by StarDock. They also make a program that allows Windows 8 Apps to run in windows instead of full-screen. But while those workarounds are good, the simple fact is, Microsoft shouldn't have thrown away the user interface that made their product so successful in the first place. All those pretty colored tiles on the Windows 8 Start Panel are very pretty, but they also waste a ton of space and reduce the usability of the product.


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## Frijid (Mar 21, 2013)

LittleBill said:


> even looked on toshiba's site there is no win 7 drivers, thus no down grade



i'll just buy a disk of 7 and start from scratch, no way will ANYONE see me using an 8. i looked around the stores here and some stores here are still selling laptops and desktops with 7


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## degarb (Mar 21, 2013)

ABTOMAT said:


> All the UI touches developed over the last 25 years of computer use are out the window for no good reason. Windows 8 should be an installable option for people who need it.
> 
> It's not just Microsoft that's guilty of this. Starting a couple years ago, companies making software for desktop computers saw how popular tablets were getting and decided to model their UIs after them. And websites are going along with this and starting to resembled the Japanese web (a majority of people over there use cell phones for their internet access) more and more, which isn't a good thing.




Yes, how can you forget 25 years of focus testing to find the ideal UI? Just to make a desktop like popular tablets. There are certain key elements hit on in 25 years of UI testing that just work best, and are logically a necessity. (Let us all forget how much we spent on software in the past in search of the perfect software, on backward compatibility.)

To me, the OS looks like a Fisher Price Operating System. Which is basically what Android is. Fisher Price.


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## LEDAdd1ct (Mar 21, 2013)

I seriously advise anyone bashing the Metro GUI to try Classic Shell before permanently ditching Windows 8.

The GUI is just that.

There are many tweaks/improvements under the hood, and with the classic shell, or an excellent facsimile applied, things are much improved...


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## HarryN (Mar 27, 2013)

I use vista 64 bit, and it actually is not that bad, in spite of the bad press. My plan was to change to win 7 on my next laptop, which is actually in the budget for this year.

After several attempts to learn win8, I finally was shown that you can get past the ugly squares on the front by clicking on the left bottom one and it takes you to a new page of somewhat normal looking icons, etc. I am not an artist, and don't usually care that much about aesthetics, but those tiles are truly ugly shapes and colors.

After 5 trips to the store for testing and trying to convince myself that I can learn to like it, I took my daughter, a long time mac / iphone user with me. She was able to use win 8, no problem, which is exactly what I suspected - win8's interface was made for mac users, by mac users, and really don't understand how a business user operates a laptop.

For several years I have used Opera for email and LibreOffice for the office functions, so I am 90% OS independent (and nearly kicked out by MS with win8). I had not really expected to switch to Linux at this point, but it seems that I am being shown the door. It feels really strange to feel like MS cannot meet my simple needs, when I have been using their products since DOS 1, and nearly everything in between.


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## mvyrmnd (Mar 27, 2013)

HarryN said:


> After 5 trips to the store for testing and trying to convince myself that I can learn to like it, I took my daughter, a long time mac / iphone user with me. She was able to use win 8, no problem, which is exactly what I suspected - win8's interface was made for mac users, by mac users, and really don't understand how a business user operates a laptop.



That is a horrendous false dichotomy.

Your daughter having no issues with Windows 8 has no relationship with her being a Mac user. Intelligence/age/lack of fear is more likely the issue.

Windows 8's interface was made for tablets and touch interaction.


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## degarb (Mar 27, 2013)

I think the latestest ubuntu screwed the ui. But lxde version, with about 20 essential tweaks restores essential ui components needed for real word use.


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## HarryN (Mar 27, 2013)

mvyrmnd said:


> That is a horrendous false dichotomy.
> 
> Your daughter having no issues with Windows 8 has no relationship with her being a Mac user. Intelligence/age/lack of fear is more likely the issue.
> 
> Windows 8's interface was made for tablets and touch interaction.



The issue for me, is that I start my day by opening the following:
- windows explorer - so I can rapidly organize and find files by categories and sub categories.
- Libreoffice (or MS office if you like to buy it) - typically 3 different spreadsheets and a text document
- Opera - for email
- 2 versions of an internet browser - so I can look up different items
- If I am away from a plug, I change the power settings - on the fly, depending on the need
- Depending on the situation, sometimes I am using a photo program or an FTP program.
- Sometimes I also open the sync program for my phone to access some info (as I don't use the low security approach of synching on-line to the cloud)

This is for work, not play. You will notice that I didn't talk about being on facebook or playing video games in my discussion. Obiously, having a facebook apl tile is not all that important to me, even though, yes, I do use social media and internet hobby forums sometimes.

Now - try to do that on a Mac or Win 8. It isn't all that easy to rapidly move back and forth between these items on a normal laptop / no touch screen compared to Win7 or Vista.

BTW - My daughter told me that in fact she was able to easily use win 8, "because it is just like a mac / iphone." 

Who knows though - maybe you are right that I am an old, incompetent user who spends his day just browsing the internet, but maybe there really is a good ergonomic reason for the type of user interface used by win7 and many linux distributions. (example Suse)


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## mvyrmnd (Mar 27, 2013)

I use many operating systems in my day-to-day work. Mac OS and Windows 7 and 8 included.

I can promise you I can do everything on my Mac that you just listed, and I'd even bet in less time, too.

You write it off as a kids toy a little too easily.

Three-finger swiping on my multi-touch trackpad is quicker for switching between programs than any other method I've ever used.

Being able to organise files? That's OS 101 - a bit of a lame example, I must say.

Three whole spreadsheets?!?!

Power settings? Again OS 101.


Ultimately, you are correct that these things are more difficult in Windows 8 - but your comparison to MacOS is desperately incorrect.


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## AnAppleSnail (Mar 27, 2013)

I swear that there must (Or should be) a word for:

"The developers of a project decide to make sweeping changes on the advice of highly-paid design experts and this annoys the people." I'm sure technical and expletive-laden German would be adequate to coin this term.


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## mvyrmnd (Mar 27, 2013)

AnAppleSnail said:


> I swear that there must (Or should be) a word for:
> 
> "The developers of a project decide to make sweeping changes on the advice of highly-paid design experts and this annoys the people." I'm sure technical and expletive-laden German would be adequate to coin this term.



Windows 8 was developed with a clear goal in mind - to be a single unified OS for all hardware platforms. This is a lofty goal that some will argue is impossible.

A tablet and a desktop PC are two very different devices, and to try and force both to use the same interface is either misguided or riddled with compromises. As everyone knows, a compromise is when both sides lose.

Windows 8 is one giant compromise. They've broken many interface 'standards' in order to achieve their primary goal. As far as they're concerned I guess they were responsible for those 'standards' and they've every right to break them if they choose.

AnAppleSnail is right though, there should be a very long swear word to describe it.


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## kaichu dento (Mar 28, 2013)

Arm and Leg said:


> Well, it appears you're alone in this one Frigid.


Actually he's not, and your post appears to serve no purpose other than to instill a troll-like atmosphere. Try to post something more useful next time and quit making antagonistic posts of this type.

Like others, I tried Windows 8 a few times in the stores before deciding that I'd stick with the 7 format, but if I do find myself switching in the future, some of the posts here at least seem to offer some help for those who don't care for its stock presentation.


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## degarb (Mar 28, 2013)

HarryN said:


> The issue for me, is that I start my day by opening the following:
> - windows explorer - so I can rapidly organize and find files by categories and sub categories.
> - Libreoffice (or MS office if you like to buy it) - typically 3 different spreadsheets and a text document
> - Opera - for email
> ...



One reason I stick with xp, over 7 or linux, is the macro program standard. There needs to have a basic like command line that can reach into the OS, to string together many programs to do what you need. Need a macro to pay all bills at end of month, write it in an hour. Need to bill someone with compound interest and print for you, write it. Need to pull a pixel off a radar and text it to your self, write it. Need to make a non human interacting cd ripper for your books on cds, write it. don't like any podcast clients, write it. Need to record spotify and finger print the songs, write it. Need a better UI for handbrake to rip your movies, write it. Need auto backup your way, write it. Need to convert audio and video, write it. make your own radars and upload them to web site, write it . Got a bummy router that needs manual reconnecting every two days, write it. Got a browser that is missing hotkeys for frequently toggled settings, write it. All with no training, just a well written chm, and non obfuscating language.

Try doing this on a mac or linux. Don't get me started on the power of a good voice recognition, playon, playlater, and other plugins. Computers seem to be limited by the limited imagination of the users. So, ya'll just don't miss things that are taken away with "upgrades".

However, there are many useful command line 16 bit programs that can make the above useful. You MUST have backward compatibility, which is nearly always more useful than the "Upgrades".


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## degarb (Mar 28, 2013)

mvyrmnd said:


> They've broken many interface 'standards' in order to achieve their primary goal. As far as they're concerned I guess they were responsible for those 'standards' and they've every right to break them if they choose.



I do not agree. Stevie Nicks of Fleetwood Mac, once said in an interview that she had no right to change a song during a concert, since the Hits belonged to the people. This is the original intention of patent law, making all breakthroughs public domain, eventually.

Breaking things, also, is a clever way to make money. You quitely break things and remove things with an Upgrade, focusing the dupe on new learning curves; then, reintroduce those very missing and broken items in a future upgrade-wowing the customer with this new handy invention.--This was a complaint I read about MS in 1997.


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## kaichu dento (Mar 28, 2013)

degarb said:


> I do not agree. Stevie Nicks of Fleetwood Mac, once said in an interview that she had no right to change a song during a concert, since the Hits belonged to the people. This is the original intention of patent law, making all breakthroughs public domain, eventually.
> 
> Breaking things, also, is a clever way to make money. You quietly break things and remove things with an Upgrade, focusing the dupe on new learning curves; then, reintroduce those very missing and broken items in a future upgrade-wowing the customer with this new handy invention.--This was a complaint I read about MS in 1997.


Very cynical synopsis, but unfortunately accurate. Hopefully they make corrections and turn it into a more user-friendly platform as they are wont to do, but for the time being, Windows 7 is working well for me.


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## mvyrmnd (Mar 28, 2013)

degarb said:


> One reason I stick with xp, over 7 or linux, is the macro program standard. There needs to have a basic like command line that can reach into the OS, to string together many programs to do what you need. Need a macro to pay all bills at end of month, write it in an hour. Need to bill someone with compound interest and print for you, write it. Need to pull a pixel off a radar and text it to your self, write it. Need to make a non human interacting cd ripper for your books on cds, write it. don't like any podcast clients, write it. Need to record spotify and finger print the songs, write it. Need a better UI for handbrake to rip your movies, write it. Need auto backup your way, write it. Need to convert audio and video, write it. make your own radars and upload them to web site, write it . Got a bummy router that needs manual reconnecting every two days, write it. Got a browser that is missing hotkeys for frequently toggled settings, write it. All with no training, just a well written chm, and non obfuscating language.
> 
> Try doing this on a mac or linux. Don't get me started on the power of a good voice recognition, playon, playlater, and other plugins. Computers seem to be limited by the limited imagination of the users. So, ya'll just don't miss things that are taken away with "upgrades".
> 
> However, there are many useful command line 16 bit programs that can make the above useful. You MUST have backward compatibility, which is nearly always more useful than the "Upgrades".



Just because you don't know how to do those things on other OS'es doesn't mean they're not possible.

The entire Linux community is built on that way of thinking. In fact, that's why Linux even exists in the first place!

And I disagree about backwards compatibility. It's been proven time and again that it is far from a "must".


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## HarryN (Mar 28, 2013)

I don't have a problem with buying a new laptop with win 7. The problem is finding one I can buy. I usually buy HP with AMD processors, for business use, and it isn't that easy to find.

Also - are you serious that you think I should be forced to buy all new hardware (scanners / printers ) and new software just because I want to buy a new laptop and the old OS is not available ? A $ 1000 purchase should result in $ 2 K of extras to buy ?

Linux has a lot of s/w, etc, but I will admit it lacks some key programs that I routinely use:
- Dragon naturally speaking
- Nokia symbian sync
- Cardscan
- Carbonite back up
- MS Project
- Canon scanner software (although I admit that even the win version is hard to use)
- Quicken, although I assume there is something similar for linux 
- Act - although I use this less and less now, it can do things that are hard to find in other sw.

Mac is missing many of these as well, so it isn't like that is a solution.


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## mvyrmnd (Mar 29, 2013)

Ahh legacy software. The bane of my existence.

If I had a dollar for each time I've had to jump backwards through a flaming hoop of obsolete, unsupported software that someone must have at all costs, I'd be able to retire tomorrow.


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## degarb (Mar 29, 2013)

HarryN said:


> A $ 1000 purchase should result in $ 2 K of extras to buy ?
> 
> Linux has a lot of s/w, etc, but I will admit it lacks some key programs that I routinely use:
> - Dragon naturally speaking
> ...




This is the rub: Commercial giant MS wants you to rebuy your stuff (though not to **** you off enough to drop the OS; while linux lacks a large enough community/userbase to justify writing nitch sw necessary for someone that want the most out of their computer. 

To my horror, my attempts to use xp in virtual machine, had two downsides. Firstly, Linux forces regular upgrades and bricks older machines (apart from most things being harder to do in linux and days more tweaking time to get a useable OS-which is more forever debatable). And video trancoding took too much a hit when done in the virtual machine. So, I really don't see any reason to install linux on my newest destop.


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## holylight (Mar 31, 2013)

PhotonBoy said:


> Desktop user here. Waiting for Windows 9.



+1. Till my hardware fail me, I stay with window 7.But I am sure window 8 is good upgrade.


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## N10 (Apr 30, 2013)

i have solidworks 2011 and no it doesn't work on win8...i was willing to give it a try but there are still compatibility issues here.. anyone noticed if win 8 was really significantly faster than 7


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## ledmitter_nli (Apr 30, 2013)

Windows 8 = I'll pass.

Windows 7 is superior for a desktop and getting real work done.


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## sidecross (Apr 30, 2013)

TIMEBNDIT said:


> I am just now getting use to XP, why would I want to change



XP was very good and Windows 7 was good too, but windows 8 is not for me.

I have no smart phone or tablet and do not want them either; I will stay with Windows 7.


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## kaichu dento (Apr 30, 2013)

Seems like Microsoft is dependable in alternating cycles; XP = Good, Vista = Not, 7 = Good, 8 = Not.


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## gadget_lover (Apr 30, 2013)

degarb said:


> This is the rub: Commercial giant MS wants you to rebuy your stuff (though not to **** you off enough to drop the OS; while linux lacks a large enough community/userbase to justify writing nitch sw necessary for someone that want the most out of their computer.



I think that hits the nail on the head. Of course, just about every piece of hardware and software has some OS where it's totally supported and others where it is not. My printer works better under Linux than it does under widows on my wife's machine.



degarb said:


> To my horror, my attempts to use xp in virtual machine, had two downsides. Firstly, Linux forces regular upgrades and bricks older machines (apart from most things being harder to do in linux and days more tweaking time to get a useable OS-which is more forever debatable). And video trancoding took too much a hit when done in the virtual machine. So, I really don't see any reason to install linux on my newest destop.



That's an interesting point of view. Updates are not always forced. For instance I have linux running on a small laptop 24x7x365. Current uptime 389 days. It's a monster with 64mb ram, 40gb HD. . Linux was installed in the mid 1990s. The kernel has been updated a few times and programs have been patched as appropriate. I've been using linux since the early 1990s. 

The laptop I'm typing this on was built in 2007, and is running the current Ubuntu Linux release. Ubuntu has a version that updates every six months and a version that should be supported for several years. Both work on some of my older hardware. If I wanted, I could install any previous version of linux that I want.

In my experience it's MS that creates OSes that REQUIRE ever more powerful hardware, but they take the extra step of denying you a license to use the older version.

I've only used Windows 8 during a few demos during MS hosted rollouts. The MS sales folk could not find a single advantage of win8 over Win XP in a desktop business setting, other than 'It runs better'. Ironically, on one demo the PC locked up as she made that statement. 

I have no love for making wide gestures on a large touch screen such as a surface tablet when a small mouse movement would do. There is a very good reason that programs that do similar things tend to look the same. Sometimes there is only one really good way to do it. 

Daniel


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## degarb (May 1, 2013)

gadget_lover said:


> The laptop I'm typing this on was built in 2007, and is running the current Ubuntu Linux release. Ubuntu has a version that updates every six months and a version that should be supported for several years. Both work on some of my older hardware. If I wanted, I could install any previous version of linux that I want.
> 
> In my experience it's MS that creates OSes that REQUIRE ever more powerful hardware, but they take the extra step of denying you a license to use the older version.
> 
> Daniel




OS creep is like legislative creep. Legislative creep, just tromp our rights and constitution, because laws are not written by people, rather by lobbyists who all wish their product would be mandated by government so they can raise demand, and so their prices. Almost like hardware vendors write the OS, making it need more and more memory, while doing no more than the old OS.

2007 laptop. I am stuggling to keep a 2003 laptop on Ubuntu 9, however Opera and other software stopped working after updates. I also need to constantly purge kernels to keep free space above a few hundred megs. Thought I turned off updates, the machine constantly freezes on boot for 2 minutes while the updater struggles to tell me I am missing updates. Ultimately, I will need to ditch it for an android--though I think laptops can be more productive.


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## PhotonBoy (May 2, 2013)

One hundred percent!


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## degarb (May 13, 2013)

http://www.zdnet.com/with-windows-b...-right-thing-7000015237/?s_cid=e539&ttag=e539


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## fisk-king (May 20, 2013)

Like a few others have stated, the look and feel of Win 8 seems to be geared towards a *tablet* and not a desktop, imo. I'm satisfied with Windows 7 until I decide (pretty soon) to make the jump in installing Arch (or arch#) on my laptop instead of running it in VirtualBox.


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## Frijid (May 21, 2013)

which reminds me, i need to check places like best buy and staples later in the week and see if they still sell computers with 7 installed. or i can place a call to dell (which is where the laptop i'm using now) came from, and pretend like i want to buy a new computer, but it's mandatory that it has to be 7, and see what they say. 

because if the only option i have is to buy 8, then you guys will no longer see me around cause i HATE 8. unless i buy 8 and downgrade back to 7, which i am sure many people have already done.


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## Steve K (May 22, 2013)

hey Frijid, that's what I did 4 or 5 months ago... shopped online to find a laptop with Win7 installed. I was happy to find a decent Lenovo with Win7 and the other details that I wanted! Didn't want to think about trying to deal with Win8 at all! 

I'd say that you should start your shopping ASAP, because more and more machines are going to be sold with Win8.


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## sidecross (May 22, 2013)

Steve K said:


> hey Frijid, that's what I did 4 or 5 months ago... shopped online to find a laptop with Win7 installed. I was happy to find a decent Lenovo with Win7 and the other details that I wanted! Didn't want to think about trying to deal with Win8 at all!
> 
> I'd say that you should start your shopping ASAP, because more and more machines are going to be sold with Win8.



I agree with you, for my computer needs Windows 7 or even Windows XP works just fine for my limited needs of a computer; I am old school 'if its not broke don't fix it'. :thumbsup:


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## Frijid (May 22, 2013)

UPDATE

i called dell, and asked if they still sold computers with 7 instead of 8,and they said they did, but told me it would cost EXTRA for them to make me one with 7 installed. go figure!


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## Lampas (May 23, 2013)

Of course it's easy to install something afterwards, but out of the box, I couldn't even play a DVD! In 2013 with a system wich supposedly is made for all my media, as microsoft says..


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## kaichu dento (May 23, 2013)

Steve K said:


> hey Frijid, that's what I did 4 or 5 months ago... shopped online to find a laptop with Win7 installed. I was happy to find a decent Lenovo with Win7 and the other details that I wanted! Didn't want to think about trying to deal with Win8 at all!
> 
> I'd say that you should start your shopping ASAP, because more and more machines are going to be sold with Win8.


There are so many excellent used machines out there now - I replaced my computer back in December with a used one that had Windows7 on it.

I said it earlier, and I figure that at the rate they update these and screw up, the one following 8 should probably be a good one.


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## mvyrmnd (May 23, 2013)

Which laptops to buy 

http://cnet.co/17XMNvr


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## Vortus (May 23, 2013)

If had a touch screen, it might be ok. But I do not, and will not use WN8. Its pretty crappy on a desktop.


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## rmteo (May 23, 2013)

Vortus said:


> If had a touch screen, it might be ok. But I do not, and will not use WN8. Its pretty crappy on a desktop.


I currently have 2 laptops with (ASUS Ultrabook) and without touchscreens, Win8 works great on both of them - just as Win7 did on my last 2 laptops. Of course, with the touchscreen, it is much nicer.


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## MikeSalt (May 24, 2013)

kaichu dento said:


> Seems like Microsoft is dependable in alternating cycles; XP = Good, Vista = Not, 7 = Good, 8 = Not.



It goes back deeper than that:
3.1 = Good, 95 = Bad, 98 = Good, ME = Bad, XP = Good etc...

I tried '8' for a week but it wasn't for me on a non-touch laptop. I cannot understand why there are not different configurations on installation, like we used to have the choice between a 'desktop PC' and 'portable PC' in XP installation, where the useful features such as power management were installed for the portable option. Automatically ditching Metro and adding a Start Menu for non-touch devices at installation seems truly trivial to me.


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## kaichu dento (May 26, 2013)

MikeSalt said:


> It goes back deeper than that:
> 3.1 = Good, 95 = Bad, 98 = Good, ME = Bad, XP = Good etc...
> 
> I tried '8' for a week but it wasn't for me on a non-touch laptop. I cannot understand why there are not different configurations on installation, like we used to have the choice between a 'desktop PC' and 'portable PC' in XP installation, where the useful features such as power management were installed for the portable option. Automatically ditching Metro and adding a Start Menu for non-touch devices at installation seems truly trivial to me.


Yeah, that was my point, every other version ever other version intended to work well, with the remainder designed to antagonize their purchasers.

You idea makes so much sense that Microsoft will have to research the applicability of those options in comparison to the assumption of frustration with Windows which we have come to expect - I mean, they can't go changing the ballgame in midstream and let us all down now, can they.


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## LEDAdd1ct (Jul 10, 2013)

LEDAdd1ct said:


> I tried Windows Eight for four days in January 2013.
> 
> Got it home, and immediately applied a few tweaks:
> 
> ...



I can't remember if this was the second program I used, but, it is also free:

Skip Metro Suite

I believe Classic Shell now integrates the ability to skip the silly tiles, but I think this is the second program I was originally thinking of.


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## fyrstormer (Jul 12, 2013)

AnAppleSnail said:


> I swear that there must (Or should be) a word for:
> 
> "The developers of a project decide to make sweeping changes on the advice of highly-paid design experts and this annoys the people." I'm sure technical and expletive-laden German would be adequate to coin this term.


I think it's just called "Schadenfreude".

Seriously though, a lot of times, users don't really know what they want until they have something to react to. I understand why Microsoft decided to try something different, but they ought to damn well admit it didn't work and revert to the previous UI. I've had to do that on projects before, there's no shame in it.


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## Empath (Jul 12, 2013)

Efforts to turn the discussion into an Apple versus PC argument has resulted in some posts being removed, including the expected follow-up rebuttal.


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## StarHalo (Jun 2, 2014)

The Start menu is returning in mid-2015, either as 8.1-build-2 or the new Win 9.


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## mcnair55 (Jun 2, 2014)

It is absolute dross and worst waste of money i have ever spent.I am sticking to Chromebook and the W8 device can rot here for all i care.


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## mvyrmnd (Jun 3, 2014)

I've actualy come to like Windows 8.1 Update 1. It's the line in the sand for me, it finally feels like a finished product.


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## fyrstormer (Jun 5, 2014)

Not surprising. A product as complex as a modern operating system is impossible to finish without enormous amounts of user feedback. The easiest way to get that feedback is to deliver the product in a stable-but-unpolished state.


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## ericjohn (Jun 8, 2014)

I almost bought a Nokia Lumia last December (they were on sale.) The deal breaker for me was the fact that it uses Windows 8. I avoid Windows at ALL costs. I needed a new phone, so I bought the Alacatel 871A, which I am please with for the most part. The other day; I tried programming a scanner (Uniden BC75xlt) with a Windows 7 computer and eventually gave up. All of this foolishness with having the right driver really irks me. Why can't there be any plug and play features with Microsoft? If I ever buy a computer with Windows on it again, I will simply format the hard drive and install one of the current Ubuntu flavors on there.


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## RIX TUX (Jun 8, 2014)

I have 8 on a backup laptop-not very excited about it, my desktop has 7 and I like it but some websites think its 10 years old, so I have to use google browser for them. I hope the one after 8 is more friendly


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## recDNA (Jun 8, 2014)

I can't tell you how often I have some problem in Windows 8.1 in which I get an answer like, "yes, you could easily address that in Windows 7 settings but it is no longer accessible without using the command bar" followed by instructions I fear to even try. It's nice I don't HAVE to see the metro screen on startup but I don't want it to even exist. I also do not want to be forced to have in account in the windows store. Windows 8.x is a phone/tablet ui jammed down the throat of computer users.


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## Canuke (Jun 8, 2014)

Speaking for myself, I spend very little computer time actually dealing with the OS; I'm in a game, a web browser, or in professional graphics software. As long as those run, I'm not worked up about what OS it is, *except* that I restrict all "sensitive" work (like banking) to the ubuntu boxes.


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## degarb (Jun 8, 2014)

recDNA said:


> I can't tell you how often I have some problem in Windows 8.1 in which I get an answer like, "yes, you could easily address that in Windows 7 settings but it is no longer accessible without using the command bar" followed by instructions I fear to even try. It's nice I don't HAVE to see the metro screen on startup but I don't want it to even exist. I also do not want to be forced to have in account in the windows store. Windows 8.x is a phone/tablet ui jammed down the throat of computer users.




This is a common designer metal disease, thinking cleaner is better. Like they never heard of advanced>basic mode toggle, to save users hours of time to do simple things that should be part of a gui. I detest upgrades anymore, since they usually rip out features long awaited in earlier versions. My bet is, if they barred young designers from the mix, things would be far more feature rich, with simpler ease of use.

I am tired of "Fisher Price" Operating systems and software, that the young "get" because, on first glance, they are not intimidated. I am old enough to pre-date the gui, see the rise of the gui to something useful and standard, and fall of the gui to a race to simplicity and non functionality.


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## braddy (Jun 8, 2014)

I went from XP to 8.1 and like it fine.

Make sure you update to 8.1 and then google any tweaks that you want to make.


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## CamoNinja (Jun 8, 2014)

Liking it so far. It's been a piece of cake.


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## NY09C6 (Jun 8, 2014)

A friend recently bought a Win 8 computer and hated it. We installed Unbuntu Linux and he loves it.


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## recDNA (Jun 9, 2014)

NY09C6 said:


> A friend recently bought a Win 8 computer and hated it. We installed Unbuntu Linux and he loves it.



too hard to find all the drivers


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## fyrstormer (Jun 9, 2014)

NY09C6 said:


> A friend recently bought a Win 8 computer and hated it. We installed Unbuntu Linux and he loves it.


Good luck running any other software on it. I like being able to download and install any program that I think might solve some little problem I have, without wondering whether I'll be able to get it to work on my distro. The purpose of an operating system is to enable the use of multiple other software at once, and Windows wins that competition hands-down because of the size of its compatible software library.


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## braddy (Jun 9, 2014)

NY09C6 said:


> A friend recently bought a Win 8 computer and hated it. We installed Unbuntu Linux and he loves it.




That is a favor that I don't understand, I would have updated him to 8.1.

I downloaded Linux on my back-up XP computer, and don't like it all, I sure wouldn't have simply replaced 8.1 on someone's new computer, I would have shown him how to quickly tweak his 8.1 to his liking.


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## Speedfreakz (Jun 10, 2014)

I have 8.1 on a laptop added classic shell and disabled all the stupid tiles and also run modern mix to allow apps to run in a Window. 
I don't have a touch screen. So far it's been tolerable but I much prefer 7


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## degarb (Jun 11, 2014)

braddy said:


> That is a favor that I don't understand, I would have updated him to 8.1.
> 
> I downloaded Linux on my back-up XP computer, and don't like it all, I sure wouldn't have simply replaced 8.1 on someone's new computer, I would have shown him how to quickly tweak his 8.1 to his liking.



Is there a tweak to allow 16 bit console apps to run on 8.1?

I do too much scripting to give up my 16 bit apps, or cripple myself with linux (which lacks ahk, drivers, dragon, parts of the gui, control of where apps/temp/os install,). Though, linux with xp in a virtual machine in seamless mode may work, and really should be a standard linux distro; however, I rely on the windows only playon.tv for a good part of my free cable tv. and the cpu hit is too much to comfortably do this.


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## mcnair55 (Jun 11, 2014)

braddy said:


> That is a favor that I don't understand, I would have updated him to 8.1.
> 
> I downloaded Linux on my back-up XP computer, and don't like it all, I sure wouldn't have simply replaced 8.1 on someone's new computer, I would have shown him how to quickly tweak his 8.1 to his liking.



But no one likes 8.1 it is complete rubbish and suffers from the normal Windows policy avoid the next generation after the one you like.


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## mvyrmnd (Jun 11, 2014)

mcnair55 said:


> But no one likes 8.1 it is complete rubbish and suffers from the normal Windows policy avoid the next generation after the one you like.



Didn't I just say I liked it? That would render your first point invalid.


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## mcnair55 (Jun 11, 2014)

mcnair55 said:


> But no one likes 8.1 it is complete rubbish and suffers from the normal Windows policy avoid the next generation after the one you like.



Ok you do but in general here and on many forums regardless of hobby most do not like it,is that better for you.


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## braddy (Jun 11, 2014)

mcnair55 said:


> But no one likes 8.1 it is complete rubbish and suffers from the normal Windows policy avoid the next generation after the one you like.




Many of us like 8.1, for me, going from XP to 8.1 was a huge improvement.


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## heelsthrow (Oct 2, 2014)

I do not hate it and I do not love it either. It is just good enough.Better compared to vista.


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## nasa779 (Oct 2, 2014)

Im using it but its modded to act like 7. 

Boots to login screen then goes straight to desktop, also using Start8 to get a usable start menu back. 
Its much, MUCH faster than 7.


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## kaichu dento (Oct 2, 2014)

nasa779 said:


> Im using it but its modded to act like 7.
> 
> Boots to login screen then goes straight to desktop, also using Start8 to get a usable start menu back.
> Its much, MUCH faster than 7.


Is it easy enough that you'd suggest for everyone to make the change from 7 to 8?

Been mostly happy with 7 for the last couple years, but your statement regarding speed and the Start8 option has me wondering if I should be ready to make the change or not.


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## nasa779 (Oct 2, 2014)

kaichu dento said:


> Is it easy enough that you'd suggest for everyone to make the change from 7 to 8?
> 
> Been mostly happy with 7 for the last couple years, but your statement regarding speed and the Start8 option has me wondering if I should be ready to make the change or not.



I made one or two registry tweaks using an online guide and that was about it. But I'd wait until windows 10 comes out at this point. Just downloaded the preview and it looks promising


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## kaichu dento (Oct 3, 2014)

nasa779 said:


> I made one or two registry tweaks using an online guide and that was about it. But I'd wait until windows 10 comes out at this point. Just downloaded the preview and it looks promising


I might go for windows 10 if it was already available but after doing a little reading it sounds like going to windows 8.1 might be a good immediate plan.

Funny that they decided to skip windows 9 and just go with 10, like they thought we wouldn't notice?!?


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## mvyrmnd (Oct 3, 2014)

Windows 8.1 Update 1 is completely solid in my experience. Any complaints are purely aesthetic and subjective.


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## kaichu dento (Oct 3, 2014)

mvyrmnd said:


> Windows 8.1 Update 1 is completely solid in my experience. Any complaints are purely aesthetic and subjective.


How much of a learning curve would you predict for someone going from Windows 7?


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## mvyrmnd (Oct 3, 2014)

kaichu dento said:


> How much of a learning curve would you predict for someone going from Windows 7?



On a scale of 1-10... 0.5

It's really the same except for the start screen, and it'll take you about 45 seconds to get used to that.


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## kaichu dento (Oct 4, 2014)

mvyrmnd said:


> On a scale of 1-10... 0.5


LOL!

That may just prove to be too much for me!


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## gunga (Oct 4, 2014)

Windows 10? WTH? Weird. I too am using Windows 8 with start 8 to make it look like windows 7. I like it. Seems quite a bit faster, tho I am not comparing using the same hardware so it may not be fair. 


Sent from my iPhone using Candlepowerforums


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## kaichu dento (Oct 4, 2014)

gunga said:


> Windows 10? WTH? Weird. I too am using Windows 8 with start 8 to make it look like windows 7. I like it. Seems quite a bit faster, tho I am not comparing using the same hardware so it may not be fair.


Well it's sounding more compelling to make the change now with all the new input from you guys.

At present I thinking I'll probably go for Windows 8 and get the Start 8 as well.


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## gunga (Oct 4, 2014)

Costs $5. Worth it. 


Sent from my iPhone using Candlepowerforums


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## recDNA (Oct 4, 2014)

mvyrmnd said:


> Windows 8.1 Update 1 is completely solid in my experience. Any complaints are purely aesthetic and subjective.


Not really. Windows 8.x requires establishing a Microsoft account for store etc like Google forces same for Android. I find that unnecessary and invasive. Also, if you shut off UAC you cannot USE the stupid Windows store nor update 8.0 to 8.1. Windows 8.x is a mobile platform forced into a computer.


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## recDNA (Oct 4, 2014)

gunga said:


> Costs $5. Worth it.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Candlepowerforums


What costs $5?


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## gunga (Oct 4, 2014)

Start 8 is $5. 


Sent from my iPhone using Candlepowerforums


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## mvyrmnd (Oct 4, 2014)

recDNA said:


> Not really. Windows 8.x requires establishing a Microsoft account for store etc like Google forces same for Android. I find that unnecessary and invasive. Also, if you shut off UAC you cannot USE the stupid Windows store nor update 8.0 to 8.1. Windows 8.x is a mobile platform forced into a computer.




Apart from the fact the Microsoft store is full of crap and useless, there is no requirement to sign up a Microsoft account. You don't need one to have a user account on the computer, you don't need one to get windows updates. You don't NEED one at all. A lot of people already have Microsoft accounts anyway - got a Hotmail address? A store account is not "unnecessary and invasive" it's a store account. Every online store needs an account. You'd better get used to the idea 

These days, apart from trying to remove the occasional prompt, I find no reason to disable UAC. You may have some small-time software that doesn't like it, and that's a valid reason to kill it, but for the most part, just leave it alone.


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## recDNA (Oct 4, 2014)

You cannot update from 8.0 to 8.1 without an account I tried and it kept telling me to sign in to windows store. I need UAC shut off for home security software I use and find UAC utterly useless anyway. I do agree Windows store is crap but that helps prove my point. Windows store does not even screen malware.


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## mvyrmnd (Oct 4, 2014)

I update customers systems from 8 to 8.1 on a daily basis without having a store account. I have no idea why you're being asked for one.


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## mcnair55 (Oct 5, 2014)

Get the new Windows 10 as the W8 computers are going for far lower prices in some stores here in UK.


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