# Surefire M4 Devastator Arrived...:):):)



## Protaeus (Apr 6, 2006)

The surefire M4 which I recently bought of JanCPF just arrived and damn it is impressive, especially with the MN61 installed....lights up a good portion of my backyard... I shudder to think what a m6 with HOLA or a mag85 would do.....
The beam is also absolutely awesome....Massive throw, big hotspot and useful flood.

This light feels great and its good to finally get some heavy artillery going in my torch arsenal  At the moment its 'only' been the A2, C2, E2E and E2L. 

My only real things that I have noticed is that the clicky swithc is a little less responsive than my e2l and a little too small. Not really a problem, just something I noticed.

Also this thing eats a lot of batteries! Im gona have to get my hands on some rechargeables ot use the lamp and spring that JanCPF so kindly provided with the torch.

Gotta love this torch

ps. just wondering, where can I get 2 Pila 168s and a charger which would work in Australia (240VAC 50hz)


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## mdocod (Apr 6, 2006)

congradulations on your new light!!!



my understanding is that the M4 is a 12V light... So if you switch to a pair of 168B (17670) cells, you will want to get a compatable 9V lamp from surefire (maybe someone can chime in, I think the M3(9V) lamps will fit the M4?, I was thinking the MN15 or MN16).... The MN61 would probably run on a pair of 168B type cells, but would be dimmer and yellower, and probably waste a lot of power while not providing incredable results...

AWs *new* 17670s, should light up a MN16 without any problems, and in theory, there might be a cell phone charger that is compatable with 240V, that might plug into the DSD charger (or could be adapted with a different plug to do so).. hopefully someone will chime in on this for ya, just an idea...

Another option, if you are willing, is to use 2 surefire compatable extenders that have an inner diameter large enough to support 17mm cells, and run your MN61 on 3 168B (or 17670) cells... the flashlight would be 2 cells longer, but would be rechargable, and still have your 350 lumens of goodness available, (in fact, those cells would probably drive the light even brighter, and longer than 4x123s)


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## Protaeus (Apr 6, 2006)

I think AW says that his cells only work with low output lamps. I believe that the M4 MN60 and MN61 lamps draw too much current to use his cells.

Oh, and I do have an M3 9V lamp and spring to use with rechargeables...


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## JanCPF (Apr 6, 2006)

Hey Protaeus :wave: glad you like it. 

Just on a note, I tried to run the MN16 on two of Lighthound's protected 17670 cells, but the protection circuit kicked in, and the bulb never lit up. My two Pila 168S however did light it up nicely. I don't know about AW's new cells.

Jan


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## Manzerick (Apr 6, 2006)

Mine also showed up today!!!!

As always... I'm gonna mess with it tonight and throw in my 2 cents LOL


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## samosaurus (Apr 6, 2006)

Nice score mate!  I am waiting for mine as well..  

Sam


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## scott.cr (Apr 7, 2006)

I've had my M4 for a number of months now... it does not cease to amaze. It is a very portable, and very packable light for its output. I brought mine overseas and had no problems with airport security (even though it's a CB model).

I got stuck in a boat on the Mekong river after dark... totally pitch black but the boat driver was able to easily navigate me back to my hotel with "Old Blue" hahaha.


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## Manzerick (Apr 7, 2006)

My 2 cents...


The momentary button on the bottom does not seem right. Kind of awkward in the hand. The Ultra stinger is much more useful with the button near the bezel. Mind you this is just preference. 


The throw and spill of the M4 is amazing! Pound for pound it KILLS the Ultra stinger. Case closed.


Overall a good, solid light for surefire. Just being nit picky on the tail cap J


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## LuxLuthor (Apr 7, 2006)

I use 3 Pila 600s (formerly 168s) in my SF M4 (MN60) which works perfectly. You need two of the A-19 spacers, which Surefire also sells, but doesn't have a picture like this site.


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## mdocod (Apr 7, 2006)

Protaeus said:


> I think AW says that his cells only work with low output lamps. I believe that the M4 MN60 and MN61 lamps draw too much current to use his cells.
> 
> Oh, and I do have an M3 9V lamp and spring to use with rechargeables...



his new cells drive higher current than his older ones. I have a pair of AW 17670s running a 2.7A load of a P91 lamp with no problems, no double clicking...



I just looked at the wallwart for my DSD charger from AW- it says "50-60hz, 100-240V" ... he might be able to ship you one with compatable plugs as well.


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## tankahn (Apr 7, 2006)

Have anyone tried that? I got all the parts C3+2A19+KT2+M61+li-ions (unregulated). Earlier I tried 3 li-ions with digilite 12v lamp and got instant flash. 
For now I am sticking with primaries for my M61 bulb.



mdocod said:


> congradulations on your new light!!!
> 
> Another option, if you are willing, is to use 2 surefire compatable extenders that have an inner diameter large enough to support 17mm cells, and run your MN61 on 3 168B (or 17670) cells... the flashlight would be 2 cells longer, but would be rechargable, and still have your 350 lumens of goodness available, (in fact, those cells would probably drive the light even brighter, and longer than 4x123s)


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## mdocod (Apr 7, 2006)

> Have anyone tried that? I got all the parts C3+2A19+KT2+M61+li-ions (unregulated). Earlier I tried 3 li-ions with digilite 12v lamp and got instant flash.
> For now I am sticking with primaries for my M61 bulb.





> I use 3 Pila 600s (formerly 168s) in my SF M4 (MN60) which works perfectly. You need two of the A-19 spacers, which Surefire also sells, but doesn't have a picture like this site.


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## jdriller (Apr 7, 2006)

I have also instaflashed M4 lamps with Lith ions. YMMV, but I do not like expensive flash bulbs.


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## mdocod (Apr 8, 2006)

me thinks the trick to running 12V lamps on li-ions, is to only charge up the li-ions to maybe 4.0V (or less) per cell. instead of 4.2V... or to put a low value resistor in the path to eat up a small amount of juice...


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## Topper (Apr 8, 2006)

Never had a problem using 3 168s Pila's in a M4 with 2 A19's. I do not have any new 600s cells so not sure about that . Just saw mdocod's post, I guess by adding 2 A19's you are adding resistance.
Topper


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## LuxLuthor (Apr 8, 2006)

In fact, I think Topper is the one who told me about doing this with the two A19 spacers. The only down side is the spacers are black, and the M4 is that standard anodized pewter color....so it looks lame, but works great. I just can't stand paying SF $1.75 x 4 for a relatively short duration of light.


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## Topper (Apr 8, 2006)

Guilty as charged..but mine are HAIII you must have missed that group buy.
Thats how I got a HAIII 6P and a A14 while I was at it.
Topper


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## Ray_of_Light (Apr 8, 2006)

Great light. I Installed a SW02 tailcap on the M4, and is much more grippable and nice looking.

Two 168B Li-Ion with the MN15 bulb will work in the M4, but the light output will not be so good.

The reflector and the bulb, in Surefire lights, is "matched" to maximize the ability of distance spotting. Other lights with higher lumen output, like the Mag 85, will not produce the same quality results of the M4 for distance recognition purposes.

Anthony


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## DreamScape (Apr 8, 2006)

Ray_of_Light said:


> The reflector and the bulb, in Surefire lights, is "matched" to maximize the ability of distance spotting. Other lights with higher lumen output, like the Mag 85, will not produce the same quality results of the M4 for distance recognition purposes.
> 
> Anthony



Interesting Quote Ray Of Light.
I had my M3T (MN16 - 225 Lumens, I know MN61 is 350 Lumens) out comparing to my 3D Mag85 (About 850 Lumens) and I wasn't surprised that my Mag85 with MOP hammered/cained/thrashed/beat the M3T for distance recogition.
You sure your not mixing your M4 for a beast


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## Delvance (Apr 8, 2006)

I thought with SF, they prefer to have their lights put forth a very smooth spot of light followed by sidespill...with no artifiacts, hence explaining the "bumpiness" on their reflectors (Like a stippled reflector). This bumpiness/texturing eliminates artifacts and creates a smooth spot of light but also decreases the light's ability to throw.

Maybe Ray of light was talking about a turbohead though ? M4 with a turbohead should throw pretty well, although i doubt it'd beat a [email protected]. Alot of users easily get 50,000lux on their [email protected].


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## Sixpointone (Apr 8, 2006)

Last night I quickly had the chance to see Manzerick's M4 Flashlight. It is, to no surprise, so well machined and has such a great beam.

I am truly impressed by it.


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## tankahn (Apr 8, 2006)

Ray_of_Light said:


> Two 168B Li-Ion with the MN15 bulb will work in the M4, but the light output will not be so good.


I have been running the MN16 bulb with unprotected li-ions.


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## Manzerick (Apr 9, 2006)

will the MN61 (350 lumen) in an M4 with 2 600s's be ok?


Just ordred them... I prob should have asked first LOL


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## JanCPF (Apr 9, 2006)

Manzerick,
That won't work very well. The MN61 is a 12 volt LA, and even if the protection circuit in the Pila cells doesn't cut off, the bulb will only receive 8.2-7.4 volts resulting in quite a yellow beam. The fact that the bulb is seriously underdriven will also degrade the LA earlier because it won't reach the normal working temperature, enabling it to properly vaporize all salts in the halogen (or something to that effect).

You should use MN16 instead which is also very nice.

An alternative would perhaps be to use two 123 cell extenders and run it with 3x Pila600s, but I'm not sure if the protection circuit will allow it.

Jan


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## Manzerick (Apr 9, 2006)

i've seen some posts about that. 


Does any know if the extender and extra 600s is safe?


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## Manzerick (Apr 9, 2006)

Update

I added my U2 clickie to the M4 and now it feels right






Manzerick said:


> My 2 cents...
> 
> 
> The momentary button on the bottom does not seem right. Kind of awkward in the hand. The Ultra stinger is much more useful with the button near the bezel. Mind you this is just preference.
> ...


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## LuxLuthor (Apr 9, 2006)

JanCPF said:


> Manzerick,
> That won't work very well. The MN61 is a 12 volt LA, and even if the protection circuit in the Pila cells doesn't cut off, the bulb will only receive 8.2-7.4 volts resulting in quite a yellow beam. The fact that the bulb is seriously underdriven will also degrade the LA earlier because it won't reach the normal working temperature, enabling it to properly vaporize all salts in the halogen (or something to that effect).
> 
> You should use MN16 instead which is also very nice.
> ...


 
I guess you missed my post with A19 image where Topper and I do exactly that, and it works fine.


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## Manzerick (Apr 10, 2006)

i just ordered 2 A19's


i'll keep feeding it 123a's unitil they come in. Once I try 'em i'll post the results of 3 600S's and the 2 A19's


Thank You folks!


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## JanCPF (Apr 10, 2006)

LuxLuthor said:


> I guess you missed my post with A19 image where Topper and I do exactly that, and it works fine.


Oops sorry LuxLuther.


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## LuxLuthor (Apr 10, 2006)

No Prob....also be aware that Burly's site is backordered on the Pilas. Not sure when they are coming in, but I imagine soon since I've had an order pending for 3-4 weeks.


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## Manzerick (Apr 10, 2006)

Excellent! THank You!


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## Manzerick (Apr 10, 2006)

Ohh ya... another side effect of ordering 4 600s's in total is I'll be able to power my U2...


One last question: Who doe you reccoment for a RCR123a?


Many thanks again!


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## Manzerick (Apr 10, 2006)

I hope they come in soon. Free lumens are good lumens


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## Manzerick (May 8, 2006)

okie...I failed 


I put the lighthound extenders (not A19, HA3 M123 extender) and the stock switch and it doesn't light up...


Any suggestions?


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## Manzerick (May 8, 2006)

Just to the above....I have 3 600's in there


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## Protaeus (May 8, 2006)

perhaps your batteries arent making proper contact? If your using protected cells, perhaps the current draw is too high?

As soon as my MN21 HOLA LA comes in Im going to try it on my new and improved M4, with a bored out, mirror finished, tube which accepts the unprotected LG 18650 2400mah cells. 

500lumens of guilt free brightness 

So far the M3T MN16 LA thats in there is great...A lot whiter than the standard M4 LAs.


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## Manzerick (May 8, 2006)

ahhh...figured it out

I had the MN61 not the MN60 in there... DUH!!!!


All is good on planet Kenny now with the M4 doing exactly what I wanted it to do: Be a "jacked" up ultrastinger 


Thanx to all that helped!


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## trailblazer (May 9, 2006)

Get the Surefire N62 500 lumen lamp assy and you will be even more impressed!


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## Manzerick (May 11, 2006)

what would I use to fuel it?


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## Size15's (May 11, 2006)

Use only SF123A or DL123A batteries with the N62 lamp.


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## Manzerick (May 11, 2006)

thank you Al!! 

the Pila's can barley handle the MN60 and flickers with the MN61..


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