# The Gen4 TigerLight lamp assembly



## js (Nov 2, 2005)

As many of you already know, I own, or have had the priviledge of playing with, some really powerful and excellent big gun incandescent light, such as the SureFire M6, modded Tigerlights with Welch Allyn lamps and Carley relfectors, the 2200+ lumen 100 watt USL, and stock TigerLights, as well as more common incans, such as the SL-20X and MagCharger. And I've gone through some interesting changes in preferences with increasing experience.

At first, of course, I had the brightness disease. I wanted lumens, lots and lots of lumens. The more the better, throw and focus were of secondary importance. Total ouput and beam smoothness on a white wall were of primary importance. My favorite light for a long time was a Tiger85 with a heavy orange peel reflector--800 smooth, white lumens. Runtime only 17 minutes, and beam was mostly a flood. But man o man it was lots of light. And that's what I wanted. Next came the USL work I did with bwaites--a 100 watt axial filament in an OP reflector must top the list of beams with massive total output and pleasing white-wall shape!

But then something happened. The novelty of massive output wore-off, and as I continued to need my flashlights for daily use out in the fields and barn yard, I found myself drifting away from the sophomoric obsession with massive output, and back to reality where a 12 or 17 minute runtime is simply not very practical for most illumination needs.

And where did I end up but right back where I started this whole amazing hotwire journey: the stock TigerLight!

I can, and will in a future post, go on at length about why this light is so great and why I believe that it is simply one of the very best lights in its size class regardless of price, and why it is unquestionably the best large incan bang for the buck out there. For now, let me just hit the high points: this light has the highest quality components and build. The light has a hard anodized finish, gold plated connectors, sealed low-resistance switch, shock isolating gasket around the lamp assembly, direct connected components, NiMH battery pack, and halogen lamp with xenon fill gas.

More importantly, --and this is something that as flashaholics we all tend to forget or dismiss-- the OC TL is more than a light, it is a *weapons system*. What sets the TigerLight apart is the pepper spray capability, and the way in which that is implemented. A great deal of thought and design went into that. It was not some patched on component. From the ground up it was made to be a serious and useful force option tool for a law enforcement officer. Because despite what we flashaholics would like to think *a bright flashlight beam all by itself is useless for self-defense*. It may give you a few extra seconds to run away, but unless you have some force option to go with it, a bright light alone is shockingly inadequate as a self-defense tool. Even my landlord's benign dog is undeterred when facing 500 or even 800 lumens.

In any case I'm not an LEO and I'm not here to talk about the pepper spray part of the light. I prefer the shorter FBOP TL without pepper spray, myself, but I just didn't want people to forget what the TigerLight really is in its full OC TL incarnation: a weapons system.

So back to my story: I came full circle to the stock TigerLight and to an appreciation of the long runtime, small size, and long-throwing, bright white beam of the stock lamp assembly.

However, while all of the TL LA's put out the same beautiful white light and the same total lumens output, some are more tightly focused than others. The Gen1, for example, is the least tight of the TL LA's. And certainly, a wider beam has its uses, but I believe that for any given lamp and reflector combination, there is a "sweet spot" which yeilds the most useful beam for the same number of lumens.

I believe that TigerLight has absolutely NAILED that sweet spot with the Gen4 LA. Even with all of the options at my disposal, *the Gen4 TL LA is one of my very favorite flashlight beams*. This LA will throw like crazy. It will throw as far as any of the modded WA lights: Mag85, Mag11, Mag74, MC-1160. Whatever. Bring them on, because I have never seen throw like this from a 2 inch reflector.

Now, yes, quick aside, the MagCharger will throw as far as the TL Gen4 LA, but will only thow a pencil thin, laser-like beam out, which doesn't give you the *contextual information* you need in order to actually make sense of what you are seeing, or search and find someone. The reason is that the MC has a tight parabolic reflector with almost no degree of divergence off of parabolic. This is why de-focusing the beam any significant amount causes a hole in the center. And this is also why the beam has too many artifacts for my taste, no matter what the focus.

The TL reflector is also a fairly tight parabola, but this is combined with some divergence. Not as much as the SureFire orange peel reflectors have, but more than the MagCharger or Mag2D or 3D or etc. The result is a beam that throws very well, but is also relatively free of artifacts and which has a very nice amount of spill light to boot.

I find that the Gen4 TL LA is hands down one of the most useful beams I have ever experienced. When I was first out testing this LA, it was in rain and fog and cold, and I felt the exact same sense of command and capability as with MUCH more powerful lights, but with the wonderful security of knowing that I had a full 66+ minutes of runtime at my disposal. When shined out at distant objects, the light hitting the ground at my feet was just perfect for avoiding rocks and holes and other obstacles, and looking down did not temporarily blind me, as it would if I were using an 800 lumen 1185 based light. And while the beam doesn't look as pretty on a white wall as a SureFire M6 beam, for example, in use there are absolutely NO ARTIFACTS which impair illumination effectiveness.

Quite simply, this is one of the most useful and superlative beams out there, and it brings the TigerLight to near perfection, to the fullness of what it was meant to be.

And things get even better when you add the new premium battery pack to the package.

Now, don't get me wrong! If you have a TL already and you are happy with the throw of your current lamp assembly, then don't feel as if you have a second rate TigerLight. Not at all! You may even prefer the LA you already have for close up work around the house or indoors or for doing block searches, or what not. But if you appreciate a tight-beam and the best throw possbile, together with a big enough hot-spot for context and with a nice amount of spill light, then the Gen4 LA is for you.

They will be available very soon. I will post here with details when I have the appropriate info.

Again, as I mentioned in the thread on the premium battery pack, I want to say upfront that, yes, as a consultant for TigerLight I do get paid. I always try to be fair and unbaised and honest no matter what, and I feel that I am so in this situation. This is a really great light and a really great lamp assembly! But in case you have any doubts, I sent sample Gen4 LA's to SilverFox, bwaites, and Phaserburn, and they will be reporting on it as well. (As soon as they get a chance, of course). If you don't believe me, believe them. I will also be sending a complete TL equiped with a premium pack and Gen4 LA to Ginseng, but I don't have any packs at the moment, so that will happen a bit later.

OK! Thanks everyone!


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## JasonC8301 (Nov 2, 2005)

My Tigerlight FBOP with Gen3 lamp threw FAR. It is also very robust. Now you are saying an even tighter beam with sidespill! I want! *I WANT!*

I still love my SF M6 due to being able to swap out the primary batteries and having a good medium/short range capabilities. _*BUT*_ my Tigerlight needs some TLC. Its not a well treated light like my SF M6, this light has marks and gouges and has been dropped/thrown numerous times. A new pack and new lamp with a tighter beam and more run time!!! My TL has been neglected due to not having many long range applications (I live in the city) but when I go down to the boondocks, this is where the TL shines, and long, then people freak when the light gets shown some cold hearted love and still shines. 

If the lamp is under $25, put me on the list.

PS. Thanks for making all these improvements js! (plus I wasn't egging you to do the second run of M6R packs, was being sarcastic.)


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## SilverFox (Nov 2, 2005)

Hello Jim,

About the only thing I can add is that I have seen the light... and it is good. 

It seems to me that this lamp is focused for the mid to long range, whereas the other lamps seem to be more focused for the near range. The nice thing about this lamp is that for close work, you simply use the spill portion of the beam...

I took some light meter measurements. Please take these with a grain of salt as our light meter benchmarking is revealing that there "appears" to be some differences between the various meters.  

With the premium battery pack, hot off the charger, and the Gen 4 lamp, I am getting about 35000 lux. After a few minutes of running, the light settled down in the 31000 lux range.

With the stock battery pack, hot off the charger, and a Gen 2 lamp, I am getting about 20000 lux. After a few minutes of running, the light settled down in the 17000 lux range.

I believe that if you powered the stock lamp with the premium battery pack, the readings would be higher, but I was interested in the total package improvement.

I am really impressed with this new lamp. My only concern has to do with the variability from lamp to lamp. I believe Brightnorm or This is Nascar commented that there was a wide variation in the Gen 2 lamps. It took several to find one that was really good. I guess my question for you, Jim, is have you been successful in influencing the lamp to lamp consistency with this new lamp?

The lamp you sent me is great and I hope consistency is a non issue.

Tom


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## js (Nov 2, 2005)

Tom,

The lamp to lamp consistency is one of the very issues that we addressed with the Gen4 lamp assembly. We have established different and far more precise parameters for the potting of the lamps into the reflectors, and I am confident that the lamp to lamp consistency will be quite good. Nailing this LA down has been the work of many months (Is there a "headache" graemlin?  ) but it was worth it. I think people will be quite pleased with it.

Jason,

Wow! I forgot to mention the price. This is the really great part! Cost of a Gen4 LA is exactly the same as the cost of the previous Gen3 LA. Isn't it like $15 or $16? I can't remember off the top of my head. It's a steal, in my opinion. I have 5 samples left, and they are like gold to me. I really hope that Michael Teig doesn't ask for them back. hehe. :devil:


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## bwaites (Nov 2, 2005)

I'll get the easy stuff out of the way. 

Tigerlight has a home run with this lamp assembly! It's bright, it's white, and for a semismooth reflector, it looks really good! 

This is the best LA yet from any maker besides Surefire. 

It has great throw, decent spill, and really matches up well with any stock assembly out there. 

There is definitely a difference in the amount of light produced by the MC and the TL, and with this assembly and it's good throw, that difference becomes more apparent. Before it was hard to compare the two, because the spill seemed to be the most important aspect of the Tigerlight, while the MagCharger was all about throw. This assembly gives a great blend of both.

While I don't think it throws as well as the MagMods, (Jim is being a little hyperbolic there!), it certainly throws as far as the stock MagCharger and compares pretty favorably with the 1160 MagCharger Mod. I run an 1160 in a MOP in my MC and though I like the beam of the MC a little better, in outside use there is minimal difference in throw and beam quality. On a white wall, I like the MC better, but in the real world, there are minimal differences to choose from. 

Jim won't like this, but if you push it to 8.4 volts, it is REALLY awesome!! (I only did it for a minute, Jim, but it is awesome!!) 

I think a regulated version of this lamp, running at 8.0 volts with soft start might be THE ticket to easily replaceable and affordable LA's in a regulated system. (But hey, that's me and I'm a hotwire nut!)

Because of my burglary yesterday, I spent about 40 minutes checking one of my friends houses who was out of town. The TL was the perfect light for it! After checking it with one of the stock white packs, mine is now running off of one of Jim's KAN packs, and if the new pack is better than the KAN, WOW!!

I have it on the charger right now, and I'll run a check on it tonite while I'm working on USL's and see how my numbers match up with SilverFox's.

Bill


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## Phaserburn (Nov 2, 2005)

Ok, a little different opinion on the Gen4 LA.

I did an hour burn in real world use the other night. Well, other world use, anyway; it was Halloween! My children and I did 60 minutes of trick or treating, and I kept my TL with Gen4 LA burning the entire time.

Well, it performed very, very well! The tight beam of this LA was just right as there was considerable ambient light from decorative displays, streetlights, headlights, etc. I used the TL to light the path for my son; over curbs, lawns, around rocks and trees, etc. He is 7 yrs old, and wanted to go to the door himself without Dad. I could light his way each time no matter how far the house was from the street (where I was standing) because of the Gen4. I got the expected oohs and aahs from passersby with flashlight envy (they were toting plastic 2 cell lights predominantly). It's funny, in a CPF kind of way, how a guy can be happy with his Neveready 2D until he gets blown away by 275 lumens! Really; it's only 12-15x brighter! Even a couple of police officers took note of my light with it's very visible, very smooth and tight beam and asked me what it was. 

My parent's neighborhood where I grew up is great for trick or treating. Lots of participating homes, all decorated and in close proximity. Lots of costumes, too, which I nicely illuminated with my TL when they were at a reasonable distance so as not to blind the owners. With the Gen4, that means half way down the street. I could hear people comment from down the street about the bright flashlight that was illuminating them at distance. I heard kids say stuff like, "that guy must have a spotlight!". 

I never realized it before, but the TL OC is considerably lighter than the SL-20X and definitely the MC. Made carrying it for that length of time quite easy and very enjoyable.

I was going to go for longer, but my son was getting tired, and already had a plastic pumpkin swollen with loot. Sigh. Ok, I guess we can go home now... (even though I was eager to continue the test burn.)

BTW, for a stock LA that isn’t being overdriven, the Gen4 is nicely white. Well done and well met, Jim and Tigerlight! (I don’t work for TL either, unfortunately. I’m one of you!)

I will disagree a bit with bwaites by saying I like the TL Gen4 beam a better than the MC. I happen to be a fan of fixed focus, but that's just me. Then again, he is using a MOP modded reflector, not the stocker. The stock MC reflector produces major artifacts. I will agree though that the MC will ultimately at long range outthrow the TL. The TL beam is fatter, and as it travels, must open up more than the MC does. But, I judge lights on what they let me see, not what the beam itself looks like. To Jim's point, true vision is established in context to an objects surroundings. So, a super thin but incredibly long throwing beam isn't the best to me. Ever try to navigate a path or identify objects at distance with a laser?

Having said that, let me make clear this point: you will be happy with the Gen4 LA. If you're going to be disappointed about something (which I doubt), it won't be it's lack of throw!

Between Streamlight, Tigerlight and Magcharger (the big 3 of rechargeables), the Gen4 is easily the best available stock lamp of them all. No comparison in my book. Brighter and better beam than the Mag or SL, not counting mods of bulb or reflectors.


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## bwaites (Nov 2, 2005)

Phaserburn and SilverFox, 

Nicely done guys.

I agree with everything they say!

I should point out that when I say I like the MC beam better, it is my MODDED MC with MOP and WA 1160 that I am speaking of. My stock MC is nowhere near as close to the Gen4 lamp as it should be, and makes me wonder why Mag hasn't gotten around to an orange peeled reflector for their lights.

Mr. Maglica obviously is a throw fan, not a "useable" beam fan!!

As I stated early in my review:

This is the best lamp assembly I have seen outside of Surefire.

It whoops up on the SL20 and SL35, though the '35 MIGHT put out a little more light, it is nowhere near the thrower that the Gen4 is.

One thing to note:

You could run the Gen 4 in a Bipin configured Maglite with HO AA or SubC cells as well!

Bill


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## cue003 (Nov 2, 2005)

Very good writeup indeed. I gave up my JS modded tigerlight in anticipation of the USL. I ended up never getting the USL and regretted my sale of the TL. I have purchased 2 700L 1D 3x168s MagMod from fivemega. I am extremely curious to know how the TL will compare to that light in output/throw/runtime etc before I go and put the light up for sale and then purchase the TL combo with Gen4 again.

Any feedback will be helpful.

Curtis


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## js (Nov 2, 2005)

Bill and Phaserburn,

Thanks so much for your comments! I appreciate the time and effort you took to test and post!

Bill, as for the throw issue, I was quite honestly NOT being hyperbolic in the sense of exaggerating. In my outdoor testing, my TL Gen4 LA with premium pack did indeed throw as far as, or farther than, any of the Welch Allyn halogen lamps and Carley 1940 based lights I have tested (the 1160 on 5 cells, 1111 on 6 cells, 1274 on 6 cells, and 1185 on 9 cells, in smooth and OP 1940's). Those are my findings out in the field. I'm not trying to doubt your findings, though, Bill. Only to insist that I am NOT--I repeat NOT exaggerating. As they say, "your mileage may vary". Were these mag mods of yours using 1940's, or a reflector with tighter geometry?

And BTW this isn't a case of lamp to lamp difference, either, because I field tested all the lamps I sent out to the testers.

So, I guess the question is what differs in our testing? What makes you say that the Gen4 TL LA won't throw as far as the Mag mods? Is it meter readings? Or is it field testing? And at what distances? Because the Gen4 LA will surpise you. You compare two beams at 50 feet, say, and you might think that the other light will throw farther. But take your test out to the ultimate limits of throw, and for whatever reasons, that Gen4 LA beam just reaches out there and stays together. It's almost uncanny. I have one throw test location that is about 750 feet away, and the Gen4 LA will hit it.

Anyway, Bill, let me know what your test conditions were. I'm curious about this. I would call you but I know your cell phone got stolen.  Sorry about that again, and again, thanks so much for taking the time to post in the midst of all the stuff I know you have to do.


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## Lurveleven (Nov 2, 2005)

A shoot-out between the Fivemega mod running a WA1306 bulb and the Tigerlight with Gen4 LA would be very interesting. Do you need another field tester JS? 
I think they will be very equal in output and runtime. Curtis, I think you will have to ask yourself what other parts of the lights matter the most to you. At least I would not sell one before getting the other, hard to do a side by side comparision that way 

Sigbjoern


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## js (Nov 2, 2005)

Curtis,

I have no experience with the FM light you are talking about so I can't comment on how the two compare, but what I CAN do at some point is send you a TL with Gen4 LA and premium pack to field test, and you can compare them for yourself.

Runtime should be easy to compare though: 66 minutes for the TL and whatever it is for the FM mod. Total output should also be a simple comparison. The TL with premium pack is probably about 275 lumens. But it does a LOT with those 275 lumens.

In any case, PM me if you're interested.

And that can go for everyone else, actually. Perhaps we could do a group passaround. Let me consider that possibility. Any interest?


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## cue003 (Nov 2, 2005)

Jim, PM sent. 

Curtis


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## bwaites (Nov 2, 2005)

Jim,

I have a tree that I can light from my back yard that is lasered at 168 yards. It is my gold standard distance measurement.

The MagCharger60 with MOP will put a spot on it with some spill around the spot. It is a faint spot, but identifiable as such. A stock MC will put a tiny, faint spot with virtually NO spill.

The Gen4 will throw a light on the the tree, but it is evenly spread and about the same density as the spill from the MC60 with MOP, no spot at all.

The Mag11, Mag74, and Mag85 will all put a definite spot, progressively larger, on the tree with the Carley MOP. 

But look at the light output differences. 275 lumens from the TL Gen4, and lots more as you go up the scale with the WA lamps.

You can make the argument that they throw further than the Gen4 because they put out more light, but that is the point, they DO put out more light.

Bill


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## js (Nov 2, 2005)

Thanks Bill. Got it. I think the main difference here is simply a semantic one. When I say "throw" I am mainly thinking of the maximum distance at which one can light up an object enough to see it just well enough to identify it. This is why I qualified my statement that the stock MC will throw as far as the TL by pointing out exactly the sort of thing you pointed out above: amount of light and size of hot spot and so on.

I prefer to use this concept of throw, because it seems strange to me to say that a light throws farther because it puts more light around an object. So what I am saying is that if you stand back another 100 yards from your tree, for a total distance of 268 yards, what happens then? And if you just keep backing up until none of the lights can make the distance, what was the situation just before that point?

Obviously a Mag85 will put a larger spot on a tree than a stock TL! But will it THROW farther?

In fact, as I recall, I heard you use this same language once when comparing the M6 LOLA and HOLA beams. You said that the LOLA will "throw just as far as the HOLA" but that the HOLA just makes the hotspot bigger. The same can be said of the SF P60 and P61 LA's.

Of course, using the word "throw" in this way is a narrower definition, but it is more precise and less subjective than one that combines average intensity and hotspot size together.

But semantics and academic discussions are not my concern here. I have only been trying to convey the experience I had out in the field using this LA over 5 or 6 hours. I was astounded by how useful and long throwing it was considering its total output. I went all around my usual route and testing places (and then some) and it kept getting the job done. I could see whatever I wanted with relative ease, although it didn't light up massive areas like an 1185 or 1111 based light would have.

And that brings me to another thought I have recently had on the subject of throw: if the light you are using puts out massive spill and near field light, I think that the eye adjusts and that the pupil contracts so that even though a light meter at a far distance away might report the same intensity as a tighter beam light, the subjective experience would be that the tighter beam light was "throwing farther" because the eye doesn't need to adjust to the greater brightness near to it. So in some ways, massive total output could actually be *counter-productive* if throw is what is desired. Or such was the thought I had, and I suspect that there is some merit to it.

More importantly, though, if you can get the job done with less power consumption, then you have a longer running light for the given size.

***

OK. Enough of that. New subject.

I want to *stress* that if you are looking for a light that will put out the same amount of light as one of the Welch Allyn "super-light" mods, don't bother getting the Gen4 LA. You will be disappointed. It is not a brute force lamp. If you are looking for a lamp assembly that will look really great on a white wall, this is not the LA for you.

This LA in a TL makes a long-throwing, long-running light with decent spill and a tight but non-narrow beam, and its virtues over other flashlight beams may not be immediately apparent. All I can tell you is that it is one of my favorite beams, one of my favorite lights, for the reasons I have already discussed.

For anyone who has never experienced a really high powered incandescent, though, the TigerLight with ANY of the various TL lamp assemblies will blow you away. It's bright. Very bright. It will make your average 2 or 3 D cell light look like a convalescent glow worm.


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## Alin10123 (Nov 2, 2005)

js said:


> Curtis,
> 
> I have no experience with the FM light you are talking about so I can't comment on how the two compare, but what I CAN do at some point is send you a TL with Gen4 LA and premium pack to field test, and you can compare them for yourself.
> 
> ...




Hmm... a group passaround sounds great to me.
Now this 4Gen TL LA. Do all of the new TL's sold have these already on them? As well as the extended battery pack? Or is the standard going to remain standard while these things remain exclusively an upgrade? 

But at any rate, i would love to test this one at as well.


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## jeffb (Nov 2, 2005)

Have orderd the new combo; I have an FBOP that I bought B/S/T that is as new, but I believe several years old.

How do you determine Gen 1 to 4, please?

Thank You,

jeffb


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## js (Nov 2, 2005)

Alin10123,

I will have to check with TigerLight on exactly how they plan to do this, but I suspect that at some point all new TL's will have the Gen4 LA in them, and that between then and now that you could specify that you want a Gen4 LA in your TL when you order it. Keep in mind, though, that at this very moment, 2 Nov 05, we only have a handful of sample Gen4 LA, but we expect to get the first installment from the production run very soon. I will post details as I get them.

The premium pack will always be an option, but one which you can get in place of the standard pack rather than in addition to it. In other words, you won't have to pay for two packs in order to get the premium pack.


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## js (Nov 2, 2005)

Jeff,

It's easy to tell the difference between a Gen1 and all others. The Gen1 LA has no lip around the rim, and the nub on the rear end is 7/16" in diameter instead of 1/2". But the Gen2, 3 and 4 are only distinguishable by their different focuses. Gen2 is tighter than Gen3 but not as tight as Gen4. Total output is the same for all (for a given voltage) as they all use the same lamp.


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## 270winchester (Nov 2, 2005)

That's good to hear Jim. The reason why I have a TL is the same as yours, the combinaton of output, throw, runtime, and the Pepperspray function. I can't wait to get my hands on the 4th generation model....

Nick


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## jeffb (Nov 2, 2005)

Interesting! Apparently my TL is a Gen1 (7/16 nub and no rim) serial 001009107.

I like the beam and seem to use it often, have been carrying it in the car, lately.................

so it will be very interesting to see, which I prefer, when I get the new Gen4!?

jeffb


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## Bullzeyebill (Nov 2, 2005)

Jim, is the premium pack something like your Sanyo 2100mAh pack? 4/5A cells? I use the SL20X LA in my Tigerlight with six of the Sanyo cells, and it is a wonderful thrower, and puts out, I am sure well over 300 lumens. I say this after comparison of different lights using my LM631 and bounce tests. This is a little push for the SL20X LA, which is setup to run off of 5 cells, but the 20X LA seems to tolerate the 1.2 volt overdrive well. I will admit that I have never done a runtime test of this setup. If the gen 4 is as bright, and will go the 60+minutes, the I would gladly upgrade to this LA.

Bill


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## Bullzeyebill (Nov 2, 2005)

OK, I found the premium TL pack thread and sort of figured out the answer. It looks like the Sanyo cells, but I understand why you will not mention the name of these cells.

Bill


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## bwaites (Nov 3, 2005)

Jim,

Now that you say that about the M6 you are, as usual correct.

 

It may be that the phenomenon you suggest IS dilating my pupils with the spill from the TL and that is why I see what I see, that is an interesting point!

 

I just went out and checked again, M6 vs TL, LOLA vs Gen 4 and added the stock MC with 3.5 Mah Nimh stick....
 
And....I picked a very interesting night. We have a very light fog, not enough to make it look foggy, but enough to very easily distinguish the individual beams. 
 
Throw is dimished, but the MC at tightest focus is very slightly tighter than the Gen4 which is significantly tighter, at least twice as tight as the M6 LOLA. 
 
It is actually quite entertaining to go in and out of focus with the MC and watch the donut appear and disappear!
 
As for throw, well, the M6 throws so much more light, that it appears to win. The MC and Tiger are very close, with the Tigers greater output giving it the advantage. I don't have my MC60 tonite, as I loaned it to a friend to evaluate, but my guess is that it would fall slightly above the Tiger and below the M6.
 
More evaluation after vacation if I can.
 
Bill


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## Phaserburn (Nov 3, 2005)

js said:


> It will make your average 2 or 3 D cell light look like a convalescent glow worm.


 
Of all the disparaging remarks we come up with for drugstore plastic incan lights, this is a new one to me.

:laughing:


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## js (Nov 3, 2005)

Bullzeyebill,

The premium pack will indeed overdrive the 6.0 volt StreamLight SL-20X and SL-35X lamp assemblies to 7.0 to 7.2 volts, and you will get LOTS of light from the SL-35X LA. It's pretty darn touchy at 7+ volts, though. So be careful when turning on hot off the charger. I've never overdriven the SL-20X LA, but I'll try it out soon. I'm guessing that the Gen4 TL LA will be on a par with the overdriven SL-20X LA, but will not be prone to instaflashing hot off the charger. Plus, I'm willing to bet that its simply a better, more efficient lamp. Not many incands are xenon/halogen lamps. But in any case, the Gen4 TL LA may be lower in terms of total output than the overdriven 20X LA. I don't know. But just compare it against a Gen1, 2 or 3 TL LA with a ceiling bounce test. The Gen4 won't be any different in terms of total output.

I repeat: THE GEN4 LA IS NOT PUTTING OUT MORE LUMENS THAN THE EARLIER TL LA's. It is only a tighter focus lamp assembly.



bwaites said:


> As for throw, well, the M6 throws so much more light, that it appears to win. The MC and Tiger are very close, with the Tigers greater output giving it the advantage. I don't have my MC60 tonite, as I loaned it to a friend to evaluate, but my guess is that it would fall slightly above the Tiger and below the M6.
> 
> More evaluation after vacation if I can.



Thanks for this, Bill! Good stuff, and is on a par with my observations. The Gen4 LA, as tight as it is, is not as tight as the MC beam at its tightest focus --which, in my opinion, is a very good thing. I think the Gen4 LA focus is the sweet spot for that particular lamp and reflector combination, and I prefer its beam to the MC beam.

As for the M6, it's pretty darned impressive that the stock TigerLight can keep up with it. We're talking about a $400 light with a 2.5" reflector that eats 6 CR123's in an hour (LOLA). The M6 LOLA is putting out a lot more light, and has a perfectly smooth and round beam with no artifacts, and it still throws very well. Very impressive, no doubt. But I feel just as happy with the throw of the TigerLight with the Gen4 LA and premium pack as I do with the throw of the SF M6 LOLA or HOLA, despite the large differences in total outputs. 275 lumens vs. 400 or 630 (with fresh batteries).


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## Phaserburn (Nov 4, 2005)

Hmm. How about a Gen4 reflector with a WA 1274...?


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## bald1 (Nov 6, 2005)

js said:


> I want to *stress* that if you are looking for a light that will put out the same amount of light as one of the Welch Allyn "super-light" mods, don't bother getting the Gen4 LA. You will be disappointed. It is not a brute force lamp. If you are looking for a lamp assembly that will look really great on a white wall, this is not the LA for you.
> 
> This LA in a TL makes a long-throwing, long-running light with decent spill and a tight but non-narrow beam, and its virtues over other flashlight beams may not be immediately apparent. All I can tell you is that it is one of my favorite beams, one of my favorite lights, for the reasons I have already discussed.



Jim, as you may recall I started out with a 1274 and stock battery pack. Later I added your KAN pack and the 1111 bulbs to gve me both TL-74 and TL-11 configurations in my FBOP TL. I've commented in the past that both the TL-74 and TL-11 have their applications with my basically splitting my use between the two configurations. And while I appreciate your caveats expressed above I have ordered the Gen4 bulb with the new premium battery pack. I figure it can't hurt to try this out too as it sounds like it has definitely addressed the issues of the Gen2 LA I have and could serve well in applications where "brute force" either isn't needed or max run time is 

I know all of us are very appreciative for the work you've done these past couple years with the TL and are happy to see you gain some additional "payback" as a consultant now. It's a classic win-win situation for all concerned: you, Tigerlight, and the flashaholic community  Again a BIG thank you!

--Bob

PS I've found that I lean towards the regular use of just a few of the lights in my arsenal listed below and the TL is high on that list. I probably should list some of the others for sale....


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## js (Nov 7, 2005)

Bob,

Thanks! and good to hear from you.

I think you will be pleased with the Gen4 LA and premium pack. The premium pack will run longer than the KAN pack which you have, and will power your 1274 and 1111 LA's, and the Gen4 LA will amaze you with its throw and beam profile.


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## Mark2 (Nov 9, 2005)

I bought a Tigerlight from another CPFer recently for a throw shootout of big (mostly rechargeable) production lights, and I was pretty dissappointed by the Tigerlight, it couldn't even beat the Ultrastinger both at 100 and 200 meters, let alone the MagCharger or the Firebox, the Surefire M6 smoked it, too. I didn't know there were different lamp assemblies. It looks like I have a Gen1 assembly. I've ordered a Gen4 + new premium battery pack, hope the Tigerlight will do better after the upgrade! My order still says "pending fulfillment", do the Gen4 lamps and the premium battery packs ship yet?


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## Dukester (Nov 9, 2005)

I think on their website it says 6 to 8 weeks.


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## js (Nov 9, 2005)

The Gen4 LA will be available very soon I hope, but the Premium battery packs will be available about a month from now, give or take.

Mark2,

You will definitely notice a difference with a Gen4 LA. That is the majority of the problem with the poor throw you experienced. The premium pack will also help things out by giving you more voltage and thus more lumens, but mostly it will be the Gen4 LA which will make your TL throw like it should.


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## Alin10123 (Nov 10, 2005)

Mark2 said:


> I bought a Tigerlight from another CPFer recently for a throw shootout of big (mostly rechargeable) production lights, and I was pretty dissappointed by the Tigerlight, it couldn't even beat the Ultrastinger both at 100 and 200 meters, let alone the MagCharger or the Firebox, the Surefire M6 smoked it, too. I didn't know there were different lamp assemblies. It looks like I have a Gen1 assembly. I've ordered a Gen4 + new premium battery pack, hope the Tigerlight will do better after the upgrade! My order still says "pending fulfillment", do the Gen4 lamps and the premium battery packs ship yet?



Are you sure?
I was under the impression that the tigerlight pretty much tops most of the stock lights in output. According to flashlight reviews chart, this thing is at the top underneath only a surefire 10x dominator that lasts a few minutes on a set of brand new CR123 batteries.


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## makar (Nov 10, 2005)

Mark2: i think you should check the battery pack you use. i can't imagine the only reason is a gen1 reflector. i would consider also buyin the new smart charger.
marc


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## cue003 (Nov 10, 2005)

js said:


> Bob,
> 
> Thanks! and good to hear from you.
> 
> I think you will be pleased with the Gen4 LA and premium pack. The premium pack will run longer than the KAN pack which you have, and will power your 1274 and 1111 LA's, and the Gen4 LA will amaze you with its throw and beam profile.




Good to hear that the 1274 and the 1111 LA's would work with the new batt pack. Can you comment on how these 2 LA's compare to the output of the Gen4 LA in output, throw and runtime?

thanks.

Curtis


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## Mark2 (Nov 10, 2005)

makar: thanks for the tip, I actually did order the international smart charger along with the gen4 bulb + premium battery pack. Just measured the voltage of the battery. It is *not* fresh of the charger, but has less than 5 minutes of runtime since I charged it on Monday. The voltage is exactly 8.00V.

Alin10123: The 10x is a rechargeable, I don't think it runs on 123 cells without modification. Anyway, we had an M6 with MN21 HOLA in the throw battle, its output is comparable to the 10x, I think it even throws a bit better than the 10x thanks to a slightly more focused beam. Also, throw and output are different things. I don't think the total output of the Tigerlight is bad, it just didn't throw as well as I had expected. You can clearly see that it has more sidespill than the top throwers in the 10m-picture.

Here's the link to the throw battle: Throw Battle


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## Lurveleven (Nov 10, 2005)

Mark, looking at you beam shot it looks like most of the light is lost in the side spill. To me it looks like the bulb is way out of focus and that you have been unlucky with your LA. Maybe JS can look at the beam shot and tell us if this is normal for Gen1 LA.
I'm looking forward to you redoing the test with Gen4 LA.

Sigbjoern


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## makar (Nov 10, 2005)

IMHO the gen1 must have a defect. although the following generations are brighter this is very dim even for a gen1.
I think you'll be surprised when the new assembly arrives 
MArc


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## js (Nov 10, 2005)

I took a look at the throw battle thread on PF, and while it is very hard to judge spill light on beamshot photos due to the lack of dynamic range of cameras, I am going to weigh in on this and say that (1) this is definitely a Gen1 LA and (2) the total output is in the ballpark, although a premium pack will certainly increase this, and (3) a Gen4 LA will have throw comparable to the MC, but with a larger hotspot.

Alin10123,

The TL will certainly NOT top the brighter SureFires in terms of total output. A TL with a Gen4 LA will, however, acquit itself very well in terms of throw.

Mark2,

Open circuit battery voltage really means almost nothing. I mean, yes, if it's low even when the pack is fully charged, you DEFINITELY know the pack is bad. But what you really need to measure is the voltage under load. Charge your TL, remove it from the charger, turn it on, let it run for a few minutes, then measure the *voltage of the pack under load*. If it is less than 6.0 volts, you've got at least one bad cell. If it is between 6.0 and 6.6, your pack is sick and is in need of replacement at some point in the near future, and if it is better than 6.8, then it is within spec. Note that these voltages pertain to a fully charged pack with a few minutes of runtime (just enough to take it off the start of cycle peak voltages--3 minutes or more is sufficient).



cue003 said:


> Good to hear that the 1274 and the 1111 LA's would work with the new batt pack. Can you comment on how these 2 LA's compare to the output of the Gen4 LA in output, throw and runtime?



cue, well, the 1111 and 1274 are just lamps, right? So I will assume that you mean a ring potted 1111 or 1274 in a Carley RF1940 reflector. If that is the case, then the Gen4 will equal or exceed the 1111 and 1274 in terms of throw, and certainly in terms of runtime. The output, however, is another story. The 1111 against the premium pack will be putting out 500+ lumens even at the mid run point, so that's not quite double the lumens of the Gen4 LA (275), but almost. The 1274 will be putting out about 360 lumens, which will be a noticeable, but not large increase in output. The 1111 will run for about 35 minutes, and the 1274 about 45 minutes.


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## Mark2 (Nov 10, 2005)

Jim: Voltage under load is 7.22V


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## js (Nov 10, 2005)

Mark2,

Excellent. Your pack is fine. I guess my statement (2) above is justified.

The Gen1 LA really is NOT focused for throw, and is much more slanted towards flood. Some people actually prefer the Gen1 for this reason. I myself prefer the Gen4 by a landslide. And I'm guessing that so will you.


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## Dukester (Nov 10, 2005)

So after 5 minutes of runtime my pack under load reads 6.58v, sounds like a sick one to me?

Dave


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## js (Nov 10, 2005)

Dave,

Yeah. That's not great. Although if it just maintains that throughout the run, it's not as bad. But if it continues to fall with time, that's not good at all. Either way, the premium pack is a good idea and will make your TL significantly brighter.


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## Dukester (Nov 10, 2005)

js said:


> Dave,
> 
> Yeah. That's not great. Although if it just maintains that throughout the run, it's not as bad. But if it continues to fall with time, that's not good at all. Either way, the premium pack is a good idea and will make your TL significantly brighter.



Yes, the voltage does continue to drop. However, once the voltage falls below 6v it holds pretty steady. The voltage does fall but very slowly observing my DMM...

Nonetheless, you are correct. Something I had suspected all a long that the pack was infact in need of replacement...

Dave


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## Wave (Nov 12, 2005)

OK, I carry my TL all the time at work(I'm on midnight shift) and I love it. It's good I have my name engraved on it otherwise one of my fellow co-workers would have "permanantly borrowed" it by now.

I got the e-mail about the Gen4 lamp upgrade....I have no idea what Gen I have but I found my original receipt dated December 4, 2003(Invoice #678). 

I just ordered the upgraded battery pack and Gen4 LA but have a question, do I need to get the upgraded charger too or can I still use my original charger? 

TIA

"Wave"
NYPD


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## SilverFox (Nov 12, 2005)

Hello Wave,

I believe your stock charger will work just fine.

Tom


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## cernobila (Nov 19, 2005)

js said:


> Alin10123,
> 
> I will have to check with TigerLight on exactly how they plan to do this, but I suspect that at some point all new TL's will have the Gen4 LA in them, and that between then and now that you could specify that you want a Gen4 LA in your TL when you order it. Keep in mind, though, that at this very moment, 2 Nov 05, we only have a handful of sample Gen4 LA, but we expect to get the first installment from the production run very soon. I will post details as I get them.
> 
> The premium pack will always be an option, but one which you can get in place of the standard pack rather than in addition to it. In other words, you won't have to pay for two packs in order to get the premium pack.




Jim,

I do not have a Tigerlight but am seriously thinking of getting one. How can I order one with all the Gen 4 components (bulb and battery) instead of the Gen 3 bits?.....BTW S/F L2 is top choice, my most used light.


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## js (Nov 19, 2005)

cernobila,

Just put a line in the special instructions part of your order that you want a Gen4 LA. As for the premium pack, you will have to wait until they are available. Drop TigerLight an email and ask how you can order the package you want. I don't know--mechanically speaking--how they would want you to place that order, because you want the whole package, but you don't want both a regular and a premium pack. Right now you can pre-order the premium pack all by itself, but I don't know about how to place an order for a light with the premium pack installed.

Send TL an email.


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## cernobila (Nov 19, 2005)

Jim, I have already sent an email to Eric from customer service 11-18-05, awaiting a reply in the next few day (I hope).


"Eric,

I am thinking of purchasing the Tigerlight Gold 8" flashlight, can you please let me know what generation model I would receive. Would it be Generation 3 or the new Generation 4 lamp and battery components in the flashlight. As you can imagine I would like to have the latest version of this flashlight if possible.

Best regards,"


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## Illuminated (Nov 20, 2005)

Hi Jim,

I know you've put a heap of dedicated time/money/effort into the hotwire research, and I just wanted to say "thanks" for sharing all your knowledge and offerings.

Funny thing is - that my TL FBOP is the *only* flashlight I own that is completely stock (except for the UCL), Gen-1 LA and all! I've always had an appreciation for the overall design and functionality of this package and specifically its ability to consistently "perform as its designer(s) intended".

Thanks to you, I believe it's time for me to invest in the new LA and Premium battery pack and continue my appreciation for the TL.

Nice work!

John


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## Illuminated (Dec 10, 2005)

Hello again Guys,

I haven't been around much lately because of my job travelling demands, but Jim Sexton graciously sent me a GEN4 LA and Premium Battery pack to review (Thanks again Jim!), so I thought I'd put my comments here.

I was fortunate enough to have received an exellent example of the GEN1 LA with my TL FBOP purchased several years ago. I agree with Jim's earlier posts regarding what a great light the stock TL is - and how well it does what it was designed to do, right out of the box. This is why it remains the only "unmodded" production light I still own and use - period, and it's exactly the very criteria every design should be evaluated by, IMO. After all, is it fair to say that the old VW Beetle is no good just because it doesn't pack a lot of horsepower?...

While my time at home is extremely limited these days, I wanted to do a couple of beamshots to compare my original stock GEN1 FBOP with the GEN4 LA and Premium battery pack. The following is what I came up with.

These shots are the original GEN1 stock setup, followed by the GEN4/Premium Battery Pack. Both setups utilize the UCL lens from Flashlightlens.com.

The target field is the semi-wooded area across the road from my property, and the fire hydrant has been measured at 85 yards, with the background trees at well beyond 100 yards from the camera's point of view. There are no more trees beyond that, just a gradual hillside. One must consider that this "testing field" is not optimum for this kind of test - but it is the most convenient one for me, and it is the same field I use to compare all of my lights. It's really pretty much of a "black hole" for light since there's not much there to reflect light back to the source. It does, however, seem to work well for evaluating how much "contextual" information is revealed by a given light's beam pattern and intensity.

The camera used was a Canon A80, with manual settings at 1.3-sec. exposure, F4.9 aperture, ISO 400, no flash, manual focus at one step below infinity, and also using Canon's 1.75x Teleconverter.

GEN1 FBOP with orig battery and UCL lens:







GEN4 FBOP with Premium Battery Pack and UCL lens:






I elected not to perform battery voltage or runtime comparison tests, as I believe that this information has been previously covered extensively in earlier posts.

In summary of my abbreviated review, I must conclude that the Premium Battery Pack with its reduced voltage sag under load is likely the main contributor to the differences in the beamshots above. My exceptional GEN1 LA seems to already have that well-focused super-bright nucleus with bright surround, and I must also mention that the though "white wall" comparisons between the two revealed some visible differences, they are definitely less distinguishable in actual use. I'm kinda sorry I didn't have a "more typical" sample of the GEN1 LA to use for this comparison. If you have a GEN1/2/3 LA that just doesn't seem like an exceptional one, then by all means try the GEN4...AND the Premium battery Pack.

Thanks again Jim, and keep up the excellent work!

John


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## js (Dec 10, 2005)

Nice pictures, John! Thanks so much for taking the trouble to take them and post them. There is very little difference bewteen them, isn't there? I think I notice more light on the near field tree branch with the Gen4, but other than that, I'd be hard pressed to pick out anything else. I'd say your Gen1 is a pretty tight focus. Are you sure it isn't a Gen2? Does it have a lip on the rim, or not? If not it is a Gen1. Also, if the rear nubs of these two are the same diameter then that is another clue that it is a Gen2 and not a Gen1. It looks like one of the tighter focused Gen2 LA's to me. But anything is possible. Either way, it's a nice beam.

One of the issues with the earlier Generation LA's was consistency of focus, at least compared to the Gen4's. I tested a random sampling of the first 300 Gen4 LA's and they were almost identicle and very close to the initial 10 samples which I received. So all is well! Anyone who gets a Gen4 LA will get a tightly focused beam, as advertised. As I said before, I'm quite pleased with this LA.


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## Illuminated (Dec 10, 2005)

Hi Jim,

The first photo is definitely a Gen1 LA (no lip). I have only seen two other Gen1 lamps (besides the textured factory seconds from Flashlightlens.com), and neither of the other two could compare to this one. I've also seen one Gen2 replacement LA, but it was only slightly better than the other Gen1's. As I said - I believe my Gen1 LA to be "exceptional".

Unfortunately, I don't have a "more typical" non-Gen4 LA sample to compare with, so my beamshot comparisons are undoubtedly less convincing than they should be. As I said above, if one has a less than exceptional GEN1/2/3 LA - then a new GEN4 is definitely in order.

Your observations of the two photos are correct. While showing only a little difference in throw (considering the "black hole" background...), there is clearly more overall light. Look at the areas nearer the edges of the photos. More illumination in the nearfield, as well as in the periphery - to the sides and above. I attribute most of this to the Premium Battery pack.

Thanks again - John


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## CroMAGnet (Dec 10, 2005)

Deleted post


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## DaveT (Dec 11, 2005)

Wow.
I've been totally out of the loop on this, and never a huge hotwire guy. But I have to say, this is really sounding like a good deal. 
I take it this is the promotion everyone's talking about, right?

http://shopping.netsuite.com/s.nl/c.ACCT29212/sc.2/category.1/it.A/id.280/.f

I'm teetering on the fence about this, but I think I may fall quickly. A couple questions - is there also an option for an FBOP version? I'm not seeing that offered with this special.
And second, if you were going to get the pepper spray version, which pepper spray would you choose? 

Thanks guys
Dave


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## JasonC8301 (Dec 11, 2005)

DaveT - 

I just ordered one (along with extra lamp for my FBOP version), training canisters, and a holster (the solid leather plain one.)

For $199.99 its a deal if you are into the OC model.

$195 for the 8" system http://shopping.netsuite.com/s.nl/c.ACCT29212/sc.2/category.39/it.A/id.275/.f

I paid ~$130 for my FBOP version 2+ years ago and it has served me well. So its only $55 more for the premium battery and charger and haveing a shorter light due to no pepper spray.

I prefer Fox labs for OC but I choose the Bodyguard one (will purchase fox labs at a later date.)


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## js (Dec 11, 2005)

Here is a link to Lights with the Super Premium Pack & Gen4 LA but without the fast charger. It's a great light, and the premium pack is a top notch battery pack.


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## JasonC8301 (Dec 12, 2005)

http://shopping.netsuite.com/tigerlight

Straying a off topic but, that above special for $199.99 includes both the stock battery pack and the new premium battery pack? (and also a lamp (possibly Gen3?) in the light, and the Gen4 lamp?

If so, that means I can put two Tigerlights to the test and see what improvements are in the beam compared to the old lamp and the old vs. new battery pack.

Thanks,
Jason


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## TigerLight Pro (Dec 13, 2005)

DaveT said:


> Wow.
> I've been totally out of the loop on this, and never a huge hotwire guy. But I have to say, this is really sounding like a good deal.
> I take it this is the promotion everyone's talking about, right?
> 
> ...




I am partial to Guardian PD or Bodyguard. these are the spray I have used on duty and they work good. Cone spray is the only way to go.


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## Bob_G (Dec 13, 2005)

> I'm teetering on the fence about this, but I think I may fall quickly. A couple questions - is there also an option for an FBOP version? I'm not seeing that offered with this special.


Their site is pretty confusing to me, but this is probably what you want - amounts to the same thing pretty much. 

I ordered it several weeks ago, and it didn't mention the Gen4 LA then, so I hope it means I'm getting one


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## aedavis (Dec 20, 2005)

I received my 'Super Premium' battery pack and Gen 4 lamp assembly today. It is on the charger for 24 hours per the instructions, but I couldn't resist turning it on a couple times to check it out.

The beam, unfortunately, doesn't appear any nicer than the batwing one I had already, but it is very bright after just 3 hours on the charger. It is overpowering my stock TL-3 quite handily. I'll report back after it has a full charge.

I just wanted to let anyone who's interested know that they are shipping.

Allan


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## js (Dec 20, 2005)

Allan,

As I stated before, the white wall beam profile of the Gen4 LA will not win any awards. The smooth surfaced reflector and tight focus position of the filament do not lend themselves to nice round or oval spots.

However, after you wait for 24 hours--and please DO wait for the sake of the battery pack's longevity and health--take your TL w/ premium pack and Gen4 LA outside and check out the beam in action, particularly the throw. I'm betting it will impress you.


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## dano (Dec 20, 2005)

I'm a bit confused about this whole generational lamp thingy.

I have three TL lamp modules. All have NO rim, and the rear terminals are the same size/diameter...Are these G.1 or G.2?

All of them throw like crazy, with a minimum amount of "sidespill." They're all about three years old...If that helps...

--dan


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## js (Dec 20, 2005)

Dan,

If they have no rim, they are Gen1's. The Gen1 I have doesn't throw like crazy, but mine could not be representative of all of them. The Gen2,3,4 LA's have a 1/2 inch rear nub, IIRC, and the Gen1 3/8", again, if I'm remembering that correctly. However, even the worst throwing Gen1 still throws fairly well. So keep that in mind. Still, given Illuminated's posts above it is obvious that at least some of the Gen1's are tightly focused, so I am at a loss. Perhaps Randy or Michael could weigh in on this at some point.

In any case, sorry, I know that my post doesn't clear things up very well.


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## Bullzeyebill (Dec 21, 2005)

js, is the gen 4 lamp available seperately? I already have a pretty strong battery pack in my TL.

Bill


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## JasonC8301 (Dec 21, 2005)

Bill, I'm not js, but the Gen4 lamp is on sale at www.tigerlight.net $13.95 for the lamp, but I wasn't about to pay ~$9 shipping on a featherweight item. So I went ahead and ordered the Christmas special, LOL.


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## vontech (Dec 22, 2005)

I *TOO* ordered and received the "Ultimate Tigerlight" package today, and the light is on the charger for the requisite 24 hours. In case no one has mentioned it, for $199.99 you get a lot of stuff:

TigerLight® Non-Lethal Defense System flashlight (Reg. 159.95)
•Super Throwing Generation 4 Lamp Module (Reg. $13.95)
•Super Premium Rechargeable Battery Pack (Reg. $69.95)
•International Smart/Fast Charger (Reg. $73.48)
•BodyGuard LE-10 or Guardian PD or Sabre Red (Reg. $10.78)
•2 Lines Personalized Engraving (Reg. $12.00)

Total ordered separately would cost $340.11 (plus S&H)

Looks to be a fantastic package! Can't wait to try it!

Tom


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## aedavis (Dec 22, 2005)

I took the Tigerlight out with the Super Premium pack (fully charged) and three different lamp assemblies - an SL20X that I textured with high temp enamel, a Generation 3 Tigerlight LA that I textured, and the Generation 4. 

The SL is not impressive - the texturing turned it into a floodlight. I'll keep it for a spare but I never liked it much anyway.

The Generation 3 and the Generation 4 were both very impressive. The Generation 4 is a batwing beam (like the Generation 3), but the throw and spill are stunning. I decided to run the Gen 4 through an Acrylite lens to clean it up and am satisfied with that setup. If the batwing thing doesn't bother you, the Generation 4 should satisfy.

Allan


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## js (Dec 22, 2005)

I learned today that BOTH the Gen1 *and* Gen2 LA are lacking the rim. It was only with the Gen3 that the reflectors started having the rim/lip to them.

So if you have a rimless TL LA that throws well it is almost certainly a Gen2, because the Gen1's were focused for more of a compromise bewteen throw and flood.


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## Wave (Dec 24, 2005)

Got mine today. VERY VERY VERY NICE!


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## bald1 (Jan 15, 2006)

Jim,

Just a quick note of thanks for what you've worked out with Micheal. I received my Gen 4 LA and premium battery pack but had to wait for my TL to get fixed. Seems I hold a record. Mine was the odd one that had the head stuck on the body so I couldn't get to the battery pack.... that was a year ago and the anomoly was the only Michael had ever seen. This time my push-button switch failed. That was one of no more than 4 or 5 Micheal has ever seen period  As usual great customer support from the folks in Utah.

The Gen 4 LA is indeed a vast improvement over the old Gen1 I had. Of course I have your mods too so this one light serves as a base for three solid configuration options. Gotta love it!

Frankly I should downsize my collection to the TL-11/84/Gen4, LiOnHeart, G2Z, LB Micra & Mini, and X5T-HA. They have become my core torches despite having some other outstanding customized numbers in my locker.

--Bob


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## js (Jan 16, 2006)

Bob,

Thanks so much! I'm really proud of the Gen 4 LA and the premium packs. We did a great job with them. Despite all of my mods and SureFires one of my most used and loved lights is still my TigerLight FBOP gold series light with stock LA (Gen 4) and premium pack. Just last night I went for a walk with it and kept it burning the whole time. The long runtime and long throwing beam make it so useful in so many situations.


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## Mark2 (Jan 16, 2006)

I agree, it's a very nice light, much better than with the Gen1 lamp assembly! :thumbsup: However, you should work on the connectors of the new battery pack. When I took mine out of the box and pulled of the plastic protection cap, one of the metal connectors of the battery was on the plastic protector... :shrug: I managed to solder it back to the battery and it holds so far, but you should really look at this issue. Otherwise, great update of a solid light!


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## js (Jan 16, 2006)

Mark2,

You should not have had to solder the connector back on! This is unacceptable!

1. *I will look into this immediatly.*

2. You should call TigerLight and talk to someone and get a replacement pack as soon as the next run of them is finished. This should be in a couple weeks, IIRC.

I'm very sorry that this happened to you. It should definitely NOT have happened. I'll post back here when I know more.


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## Lurveleven (Jan 16, 2006)

I also have a pack where the largest connector fell off (I'm going to send a picture to TL). The 4 other packs were ok. I have run the packs on my CBA and they are great, an incredible improvement compared to the old packs. The packs are also very consistent in their output.

Sigbjoern


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## TigerLight Pro (Jan 17, 2006)

js said:


> Dan,
> 
> If they have no rim, they are Gen1's. The Gen1 I have doesn't throw like crazy, but mine could not be representative of all of them. The Gen2,3,4 LA's have a 1/2 inch rear nub, IIRC, and the Gen1 3/8", again, if I'm remembering that correctly. However, even the worst throwing Gen1 still throws fairly well. So keep that in mind. Still, given Illuminated's posts above it is obvious that at least some of the Gen1's are tightly focused, so I am at a loss. Perhaps Randy or Michael could weigh in on this at some point.
> 
> In any case, sorry, I know that my post doesn't clear things up very well.



Jim you are correct for the most part, as identified in an earlier post consitancy was also a problem and that was a function of the person potting as much as the reflector. Generation 1 lamps were designed to provide less throw and more spread. The Gen two looks like the Gen1 but the focus was altered and the throw increased, Gen three starts with the rimmed reflector and a focus that was similar to the gen two, but the rimmed reflector gave us less inconsistancy and we changed the diameter slightly to increase the suspension in the dampener. the Gen 4 you know.


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## js (Jan 17, 2006)

Thanks Randy. Yeah, I had a few details wrong. I had thought that the Gen2 and 3 (and 4) all used the same reflectors, and that only the Gen 1 had the rimless reflector.

Mark2 and Lurveleven,

I am looking into this pack connector problem. From the picture, I'd say that the rivet is perhaps undersized, but that is just a guess. I will get to the bottom of this and all packs that have this problem will be repaired or replaced. I promise.


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## js (Jan 17, 2006)

OK. The loose snap-connector situation is being looked into and I should have an update tomorrow or the next day. For sure, this will be warranteed. And for sure, this will be addressed for the next run of premium packs--it will be part of the QC process, in fact.

It should not have happened and is unacceptable. If anyone else has had this happen please call TigerLight and let them know ASAP.

Mark2, if you want to continue using your pack with re-soldered connector, that's fine, but I suggest that you call TigerLight and arrange to have your pack warranteed.

OK. Sorry about that happening, Mark2 and Lurveleven!


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## js (Feb 18, 2006)

We still do not know exactly why the connectors fell off of two of the premium packs, but a pull-test has been added to the QC process, so all of the premium packs currently for sale have been tested and should be proof against this failure mode.

I should have put this in the premium pack thread, but since the discussion has been here, I posted to this thread instead.

Also, for those who are interested, I will be organizing a pass around of a Gen 4 LA / premium pack TL FBOP so that people can try this combo out and see if they life it and how it performs. cue003 will be first on the list (unless he has changed his mind) and I will post the passaround signup thread in the GB forum and put a link here and in the premium pack thread as well. Stay tuned.


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## brightnorm (Feb 18, 2006)

Jim,

Apologies if you already answered this: I ordered the superpremium battery , gen 4 lamp and fast charger back in late December and was told they are back ordered to 2/06. Do you have any informationm on when to expect them?

Brightnorm


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## js (Feb 19, 2006)

BN,

The premium packs and Gen4 LA are in stock. Not sure about the International FC, though. That may be what is holding things up. Give TL a call or drop them an email and they will give you the exact info. But I think what I said is correct as of this weekend.


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## citizenal (Feb 19, 2006)

That is correct, I received a email saying that the FC are supposed to be shipped by Feb 13. Whatever that means.. To them or to the consumer, I have no idea. 

Al


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## js (Mar 27, 2006)

OK. I just post the passaround thread. Check it out and sign up promptly if you are interested and meet the qualifications.

Because as time goes by I appreciate the Gen4 LA more and more. It's a superb combination of different attributes: throw, spill, brightness, and runtime. And I think people will agree with me when they check it out for themselves.


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## Moorcroft (Mar 29, 2006)

JS

My Gen4 Tigerlight with premium battery pack arrived a few days ago and it measures up to your description exactly. It is one sweet light and I love it.


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## sygyzy (Apr 4, 2006)

I assume by looking at the website that Gen4 is out in full force? What is the best (bang for your buck and performance) package currently available? Any sales or specials coming up that I should wait for?

Also, are there any TL's that are less or more modable? For example, are there any particular models or iterations that, due to their design, cannot be easily modded? Should I 'stay away' from anything?


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## bwaites (Apr 4, 2006)

There is no difference in "modability" between the standard Tigerlight with spray and the FBOP model without.

The best current version has the "premium" pack and the Gen 4 lamp assembly, but a newer lamp assembly is coming out in the future. It will have less runtime than the Gen 4, though.

You're only real decision is "with or without" the spray.

Bill


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## js (Apr 4, 2006)

sygyzy,

Go for the TL FBOP (or OC if you want pepper spray) with premium pack, and Gen 4 LA (it would come with a Gen4 LA no matter whether you asked for it or not--it IS out in force right now). Personally I'd stick with the stock slow charger right now and wait for the new fast charger in preference to the international fast charger, but the IFC is a nice unit nonetheless--it just can't fast charge in the car.

As for modding potential, all the Gold System rechargeable lights are equally moddable. But the 2 x 123 light they have probably isn't as moddable, although I haven't yet gotten my hands on one to play with it. I should probably do that sometime, huh?


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## bwaites (Apr 4, 2006)

beat ya, Jim!!

Bill


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## sygyzy (Apr 6, 2006)

js said:


> sygyzy,
> 
> Go for the TL FBOP (or OC if you want pepper spray) with premium pack, and Gen 4 LA (it would come with a Gen4 LA no matter whether you asked for it or not--it IS out in force right now). Personally I'd stick with the stock slow charger right now and wait for the new fast charger in preference to the international fast charger, but the IFC is a nice unit nonetheless--it just can't fast charge in the car.
> 
> As for modding potential, all the Gold System rechargeable lights are equally moddable. But the 2 x 123 light they have probably isn't as moddable, although I haven't yet gotten my hands on one to play with it. I should probably do that sometime, huh?



When do you think the new fastcharger will be coming out?


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## kstump98 (Apr 6, 2006)

They have the fastchargers in stock. If you get the TigerLight Racing light, it comes with one. You guys may not think the fastcharger is very important, but when that 500 lumen module comes out, you are going to be wanting one. That, and if you are going to spend the money for a quality light like this, might as well get the pepper spray version. You don't have to use it, but it is there in case you do decide to go on that late night walk. It may save your life.

Kris Stump 
TigerLight Racing
www.TigerLight.net
www.KrisStump.com


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## js (Apr 6, 2006)

The *new* fastcharger--not the current one (that IS in stock)--will be coming out in the near future. 3 months or less is my guess.


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## sygyzy (Apr 6, 2006)

Wow, it's Kris Stump.

Kris, what is so special about the package that bears your name?



kstump98 said:


> They have the fastchargers in stock. If you get the TigerLight Racing light, it comes with one. You guys may not think the fastcharger is very important, but when that 500 lumen module comes out, you are going to be wanting one. That, and if you are going to spend the money for a quality light like this, might as well get the pepper spray version. You don't have to use it, but it is there in case you do decide to go on that late night walk. It may save your life.
> 
> Kris Stump
> TigerLight Racing
> ...


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## kstump98 (Apr 19, 2006)

Sygyzy,
Basically it is the exact same thing as a normal TigerLight with the super premium battery pack and Gen4 module with the fastcharger. The only difference is it has my signature on the side of it, and part of the proceeds go to the Ronald McDonald House. I visit the house on a regular basis, as there is no other charity I have worked with that provides the type of service that it does to the community. If you would like to upgrade the Gen4 module to the 375 lumen lamp, give Michael Teig a call and he'll work out something with you or anyone else. Michael and I talked about adding this option to the light package. I will tell you what, its a dream for any CPF'er to have a flashlight with their name on it, and there is no other company I would rather be associated with. The TigerLight Chevrolet has had a pretty good start to the season, as we finished 2nd in our last race in San Antonio Texas. Its neat to see non-flashoholics reactions to the light at the track, and I have told many about the CPF community.

Thanks,
Kris Stump
www.TigerLight.net
www.KrisStump.com


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## sunspot (Jan 25, 2008)

kstump98 said:


> You guys may not think the fastcharger is very important, but when that 500 lumen module comes out, you are going to be wanting one.


Is there a 500 module? :twothumbs
Anyway, a bump for a great flashlight.


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## js (Jan 25, 2008)

sunspot,

No 500 lumen module yet, but it's a definite possibility.


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## sunspot (Jan 25, 2008)

Oh well.
I'm going to get the super duper upgrade anyway.


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