# Post your Nichia 219 4500k beamshots



## badtziscool (Apr 16, 2012)

I haven't been this excited about an led in quite some time. The thought of having an led that is around cct 4500k, good color rendition, and very similar characteristically and physically as an XP-G, the imagination goes wild. Hi-cri at 1.4A, triple, quad hi-cri dropins, malkoffs, etc. the imagination and expectations go wild! 

Or so that's the hope.

With the Nichia 219 made available to us led lovers, all of these things could possibly come true. However, we haven't seen any beamshots or output from this led. So in anticipation of the eventual pics and posts, I'll start this thread by requesting any pics of this led that you guys have. Beamshots, white wall, comparisons to hi-cri xpg, nichia 119, led swaps, etc would be awesome.

Who will be the first to post a quad nichia 219 p60 drop-in driven at 5.6A? :devil:


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## GeoBruin (Apr 16, 2012)

*Re: Post your Nichia 219 beamshots*



badtziscool said:


> ...a quad nichia 219 p60 drop-in driven at 5.6A



AKA: The Sun


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## S1LVA (Apr 16, 2012)

*Re: Post your Nichia 219 beamshots*

My nichia 219 is warm tinted and freakin awesome.

Compared to the famous McGizmo nichia 119...










These were taken with my Droid but the colors are near perfect to what my eye sees.

S1LVA
:wave:

***
Forgot to mention... The brightness is about the same on both lights on all 3 levels. Despite the fact that the 219 is A LOT warmer, it keeps up with the brightness of the cooler tint 119. I'd like to see the numbers from the both of these in a sphere! It would be more accurate than a ceiling bounce...


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## ICUDoc (Apr 16, 2012)

*Re: Post your Nichia 219 beamshots*

I agree, the most exciting LED available for some time. What optics are good for these?


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## diesel79 (Apr 16, 2012)

*Re: Post your Nichia 219 beamshots*

Looks great. I was thinking of having my HDS 120e modded with one of the nichias.


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## yifu (Apr 16, 2012)

*Re: Post your Nichia 219 beamshots*

Malkoff is making some M61 and M30 variants with this LED, look it up over at the dealer's corner at the MP. I might get one of those.


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## qwertyydude (Apr 16, 2012)

*Re: Post your Nichia 219 beamshots*

Well considering how impossible it is for mere mortals to get their hands on these, I'm happy enough that I can get a high CRI XP-G from people who support this site. I do wonder what Nichia's thinking is, they don't seem to advertise, promote, or do anything to take away marketshare currently dominated by Cree. They have these innovative ideas and good technology, but I haven't even seen any consumer products that even use their stuff. At most I only see a few very expensive specialty lights, nothing commercial, and certainly nothing affordable.


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## Th232 (Apr 16, 2012)

*Re: Post your Nichia 219 beamshots*



qwertyydude said:


> Well considering how impossible it is for mere mortals to get their hands on these



Not any more...

The original group buy
More!
Malkoffs!


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## badtziscool (Apr 16, 2012)

*Re: Post your Nichia 219 beamshots*

The tint seems pretty warm to be the claimed cct 4500k. Is it just me or maybe the camera? Or is the Nichia 119 just that much cooler? I've seen pics of the 119 comparison to a neutral xpg and the cct were almost the same.


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## csshih (Apr 16, 2012)

*Re: Post your Nichia 219 beamshots*

here is a quick pic of the nichia vs the cree high cri (90+) 3000K.







the nichia is mounted on a cpu heatsink and is using a carclo flood optic, and the cree is in a malkoff m61 dropin.
color balanced to my eyes.. these nichia emitters are wonderful.

Craig


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## chaoss (Apr 16, 2012)

*Re: Post your Nichia 219 beamshots*

Meh, too warm for my tint snobbery taste.
I am having a couple of my mint McLux III PD's modded with these and if they are this warm i will immediately sell them.
To me, NOTHING currently available even comes close to the perfection of Don's 119's.
Thanks for posting those pics S1LVA.


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## csshih (Apr 16, 2012)

*Re: Post your Nichia 219 beamshots*

wait, which 219s are we talking about? mine are the NVSL219AT-H1 which are 4500K 92 CRI.
Saying 219 is like saying Cree XP-G. there are a lot of tints and bins.

Craig


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## CarpentryHero (Apr 16, 2012)

*Re: Post your Nichia 219 beamshots*

4500k Nichia is perfect in my eyes :thumbsup: thanks for making these available  


Kendall


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## badtziscool (Apr 17, 2012)

*Re: Post your Nichia 219 beamshots*



csshih said:


> wait, which 219s are we talking about? mine are the NVSL219AT-H1 which are 4500K 92 CRI.
> Saying 219 is like saying Cree XP-G. there are a lot of tints and bins.
> 
> Craig



Thanks Craig. I edited the title to more closely specify what emitters I was talking about. I definitely was talking about the Nichia 219 4500k 92 cri that was part of a group buy that arek98 started a group buy for and also available on Illumination Supply. Your store front I believe 

Yeah. That tint is more like what I was expecting. From what I read somewhere, the range of emitted light is a bit wider than an XPG so I guess it's safe to say that whatever we put this emitter in, the beam pattern will be wider than an XPG's?


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## csshih (Apr 17, 2012)

*Re: Post your Nichia 219 beamshots*

Cree says the viewing angle of the XP-G is 125 deg, and Nichia's 219 is 120 deg. 

From the datasheets:

Cree XP-G





Nichia 219





well, the graphs aren't easy to compare, so I eyeballed and whipped this up:






the 219 is narrower (except for that splotch of light on the fringes) than the XP-G according to data. However, since the emitter base is thinner they will not focus as well in XP-G reflectors, so we're seeing them be floodier.

I hope I got the data right 

Craig

edit: ah, yes, more beamshots.






posting this before I trip on a wire and blow my room's circuit breaker.


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## Sgt. LED (Apr 17, 2012)

*Re: Post your Nichia 219 beamshots*

I will be ordering at least one.
Any special run Malkoff gets the nod from Sgt.

I will start with the 219 LLL and decide if I want to buy the entire 219 line.
I may swap out all my M61's for them


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## yifu (Apr 17, 2012)

*Re: Post your Nichia 219 beamshots*

Looks like vinhnyugen's making P60 drop ins with the 92 cri 219 LED as well, at half the price of the malkoffs.


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## wquiles (Apr 17, 2012)

*Re: Post your Nichia 219 beamshots*



yifu said:


> Looks like vinhnyugen's making P60 drop ins with the 92 cri 219 LED as well, at half the price of the malkoffs.


Where?


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## yifu (Apr 17, 2012)

*Re: Post your Nichia 219 beamshots*



wquiles said:


> Where?


Here! http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...-92-CRI-B10-Bin-P60-D26-PRE-ORDER-SALE-THREAD It's just over at the custom B/S/T.


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## wquiles (Apr 17, 2012)

*Re: Post your Nichia 219 beamshots*

Ahh, thanks 

Will


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## ^Gurthang (Apr 17, 2012)

*Re: Post your Nichia 219 beamshots*

Anyone got a LF HiCRI XPG drop-in? Love to see a comparison between it & the 219. I'm waiting for my order from Craig so I can build several 219 P60 mules [hint hint Craig!]


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## CarpentryHero (Apr 17, 2012)

*Re: Post your Nichia 219 beamshots*

Love the Mules, wish I had more than the one  
HDS hi cri is the warmer one in this pic






The McGismo Mule is really a beauty for tint 









Looking forward to seeing what this emitter can do for my Surefire's that are currently not in rotation.


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## Harry999 (Apr 17, 2012)

*Re: Post your Nichia 219 beamshots*



Sgt. LED said:


> I will be ordering at least one.
> Any special run Malkoff gets the nod from Sgt.
> 
> I will start with the 219 LLL and decide if I want to buy the entire 219 line.
> I may swap out all my M61's for them



I've gone for the M31 and M31L at the moment but once I have them and if they are as good as as my initial impression of them is then I will be contacting Craig to get the M61 219 and possible the other versions as well for my Surefires. 

I've also asked Vinh to build me a Solarforce host around this led based around the 18650 cell and a second Solarforce host based around the 2xAA battery format - I love the idea of a three mode 2xAA emergency light with a Nichia 219 led.


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## ICUDoc (Apr 17, 2012)

*Re: Post your Nichia 219 beamshots*

An amazing difference seems apparent between beamshots in posts #3, #10 and #22- the Nichia 219 looks dramatically warmer than the 119 (surprising), but much LESS warm than the Hi-CRI XP-G (less surprising). So the119 must make the Hi-CRI XP-G look very very yellow/orange indeed. 
EDIT: I was wrong, a sample of Don's 119s were measured at about 5000CCT (http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?298253-Nichia-High-CRI-119-LED) so maybe they are from a different bin...


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## arek98 (Apr 17, 2012)

*Re: Post your Nichia 219 beamshots*



ICUDoc said:


> An amazing difference seems apparent between beamshots in posts #3, #10 and #22- the Nichia 219 looks dramatically warmer than the 119 (surprising), but much LESS warm than the Hi-CRI XP-G (less surprising). So the119 must make the Hi-CRI XP-G look very very yellow/orange indeed.
> EDIT: I was wrong, a sample of Don's 119s were measured at about 5000CCT (http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?298253-Nichia-High-CRI-119-LED) so maybe they are from a different bin...



Hmm, post #22 shows only HDS hi CRI and Mule, no 219 4500K there.
Post #3 has warm tinted 219 (may be as low as 3000K) and McGizmo (presumably 4500k)
Post #10, Nichia 219 4500K is the “white” one in the picture.
I don’t think you can get 119 in 5500K. I believe Nichia high CRI go only up to 4500K, but I may be wrong.


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## Th232 (Apr 17, 2012)

*Re: Post your Nichia 219 beamshots*

Don's label says his are sw45, but given the size of Nichia's tint bins (500K increments), I think it's quite possible that he got LEDs on the higher side of that, so around 5000K sounds believable. 5500K, less so.


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## ICUDoc (Apr 18, 2012)

*Re: Post your Nichia 219 beamshots*



arek98 said:


> Hmm, post #22 shows only HDS hi CRI and Mule, no 219 4500K there.
> Post #3 has warm tinted 219 (may be as low as 3000K) and McGizmo (presumably 4500k)
> Post #10, Nichia 219 4500K is the “white” one in the picture.
> I don’t think you can get 119 in 5500K. I believe Nichia high CRI go only up to 4500K, but I may be wrong.


Thanks arek98- I was wrong(-er!) again! So in fact, whilst the thread is titled "post your 419 4500K beamshots", most of them aren't! My bad...


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## calipsoii (Apr 18, 2012)

*Re: Post your Nichia 219 beamshots*

This beamshot thread has a disturbing lack of beamshots!

Click this picture to watch me mod my beloved D10 Tribute with a Nichia 219:




Or if you're just here for the results:

D10 Cool White -- D10 219 -- Haiku 119 -- Cree 85CRI XPG





Control shot (flourescent lighting)





Cool White D10





85CRI Cree XP-G





Haiku HCRI Nichia 119





D10 HCRI Nichia 219


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## Derek Dean (Apr 18, 2012)

*Re: Post your Nichia 219 beamshots*

Okie dokie, I was fortunate to have one of the new Nichia NVSL 219 HiCRI LEDs (from the recent group buy) put into my NovaTac 120P. Up till now I've been using filters from the Lee Filter Swatch Book to get the tint right on my lights, but I thought it was time to see what all the hubbub was about with these HiCRI LEDs, and with a color temp of 4500K I felt these might have a chance of meeting my picky standards. 

All photos shot with my Canon G10 in manual mode with the color balance locked to DAYLIGHT. 


























It's important to note that these we all shot with the NovaTac 120P on MAX output. I've noticed that at lower levels there is a bit of a yellow/green tint, not horrible by any means, but I tend to like a bit more of a rosy tint, and since I rarely use max output I've got a feeling I'm going to end up using a slight magenta filter to clean up the tint at lower levels and live with a slightly pink tint when using full output.

In any case, I'm happy to see manufacturers stepping up to the plate and beginning to provide high quality LEDs. It's a big step in the right direction.


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## recDNA (Apr 18, 2012)

*Re: Post your Nichia 219 beamshots*



Derek Dean said:


> Okie dokie, I was fortunate to have one of the new Nichia NVSL 219 HiCRI LEDs (from the recent group buy) put into my NovaTac 120P. Up till now I've been using filters from the Lee Filter Swatch Book to get the tint right on my lights, but I thought it was time to see what all the hubbub was about with these HiCRI LEDs, and with a color temp of 4500K I felt these might have a chance of meeting my picky standards.
> 
> All photos shot with my Canon G10 in manual mode with the color balance locked to DAYLIGHT.
> 
> ...



I was really anxious to try one of these in a Vinhnyugen drop in however the poor tint at levels I'd actually use (low and medium) and the absense of reflectors designed to focus the throw of these emitters due to the narrow boards kind of ruins it for me. It's too bad because these should throw better than XP-G and give daylight-like reflections.

More for you guys!


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## wquiles (Apr 18, 2012)

*Re: Post your Nichia 219 beamshots*



calipsoii said:


> This beamshot thread has a disturbing lack of beamshots!
> 
> Click this picture to watch me mod my beloved D10 Tribute with a Nichia 219:
> 
> ...


THANK you so much for the well done comparison - excellent!





Derek Dean said:


> Okie dokie, I was fortunate to have one of the new Nichia NVSL 219 HiCRI LEDs (from the recent group buy) put into my NovaTac 120P. Up till now I've been using filters from the Lee Filter Swatch Book to get the tint right on my lights, but I thought it was time to see what all the hubbub was about with these HiCRI LEDs, and with a color temp of 4500K I felt these might have a chance of meeting my picky standards.
> 
> All photos shot with my Canon G10 in manual mode with the color balance locked to DAYLIGHT.
> 
> ...


Same to you - great work. Thanks much 

Will


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## badtziscool (Apr 18, 2012)

*Re: Post your Nichia 219 beamshots*



calipsoii said:


> Control shot (flourescent lighting)
> 
> 
> 
> ...



These are awesome pics! Thanks calipsoii. And great writeup on the D10 mod. 

I can't tell, but it looks like the 119 has an ever so slightly better color rendition of oranges and yellows. Or is that because the 119 is in a haiku and has a stronger hotspot and is illuminating books 6, 7, and 8 more thus bringing its color out more. Either way, the 219 emitters are pretty awesome!


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## calipsoii (Apr 18, 2012)

*Re: Post your Nichia 219 beamshots*



badtziscool said:


> I can't tell, but it looks like the 119 has an ever so slightly better color rendition of oranges and yellows. Or is that because the 119 is in a haiku and has a stronger hotspot and is illuminating books 6, 7, and 8 more thus bringing its color out more. Either way, the 219 emitters are pretty awesome!



It doesn't help that after taking the pictures I realized the Eneloop in my D10 was dying and reducing output. A fresh one helped a lot. I'll try to post a Haiku/D10 comparison shot tonight with fresh batteries.

In terms of sheer color rendering, I'd say the Haiku 119 has a slight edge. The Haiku also has a much tighter hotspot than the D10. That's probably because the reflector is deeper and wider. The 219 die _looks _bigger to my eyes than the 119 die, but that could be an optical illusion caused by the gelatin on top. Either way the D10 is floodier than the Haiku by a good margin.

As for tint, in my samples, the 219 is noticeably cooler in temperature than the 119 in my Haiku. Side-by-side, it makes my Haiku beam look yellow. Fresh batteries made the tint difference even more pronounced. If I had to hazard a guess as to color temperatures, I'd say:
- Haiku 119: ~4350k
- D10 219: ~4800k

Overall I'm very happy with it. Nice even beam with good color rendering. A little floodier than I'd like. Surprisingly bright (even in a 1xAA light). Generates a lot of heat.


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## Derek Dean (Apr 18, 2012)

*Re: Post your Nichia 219 beamshots*



recDNA said:


> I was really anxious to try one of these in a Vinhnyugen drop in however the poor tint at levels I'd actually use (low and medium) and the absense of reflectors designed to focus the throw of these emitters due to the narrow boards kind of ruins it for me. It's too bad because these should throw better than XP-G and give daylight-like reflections.
> 
> More for you guys!


Here are a few shots showing what I'm talking about (Canon G10 locked to DAYLIGHT, NovaTac 120P Max level about 150 lumens, Low level about 30 lumens):











Of course if you're using a PWM based light you shouldn't notice any difference. As you can see, it's not a huge tint shift, but it is noticeable if you're looking for it. 

In any case, I'm finding that adding a 3/8 magenta filter is giving me a happy medium result:


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## recDNA (Apr 19, 2012)

But if you have to use a filter it kind of defeats the purpose.

Will someone design a reflector especially fir this board and emitter to produce max throw?


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## Brasso (Apr 19, 2012)

So are we to understand that the tint gets cooler as it gets brighter? That's unusual.


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## Erzengel (Apr 19, 2012)

This is very common, if the light is fully current regulated. Many users report that the tint of the Zebralight SC600 gets more yellow on the lower levels, which is the inverted description of the same effect. Derek already wrote that You shouldn't experience this effect with a current controlled light.
The reason is, that the LED creates "white" light by mixing the blue light of the LED with the yellow phosphor. When You dim the light higher or lower You just change the blue amount of the light, it still has to travel through the same amount of yellow phosphor.


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## wquiles (Apr 19, 2012)

Just finished converting my Sunwayman V10R Ti+ from the factory XM-L to a new Nichia 219. Time consuming, plus in order for things to align properly I had to made a custom centering ring for the LED - however, well worth the effort as I LOVE this beam/tint:
















EDIT: Full conversion details here in this thread.


Will


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## bansuri (Apr 21, 2012)

Just got my 4500K Nichia 219s from csshih, dropped one in my V10 ti. 
Wow. Just beautiful. Got my work cut out for me re-modding my lights.


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## tolkaze (Apr 22, 2012)

Going back to the shifting tint, i'm guessing it will be noticeable between say... a M61 and a M61LLL? I really want a good LED since I am getting sick of CREE tint shift at lower current


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## Erzengel (Apr 22, 2012)

The Datasheets also provide information on the tint shift:
Nichia 219 Datasheet (page 13)
XP-G datasheet (page 7)
Then You come to the conclusion, that the coordiantes of the XP-G will increase about 0.007 on both axis. The coordinates of the Nichia 219 will increase on the x-axis and decrease on the y-axis.
If You look at the colored image of the coordiantes in this thread on binnings (just use colors and coordinates, ignore the bin codes on the image) You see that the x-axis ranges from blue (low) to yellow (high), while the y-axis ranges from red (low) to green (high).
If You combine all of this information You arrive at the conclusion, that the XP-G shifts to yellow/green at low currents, while the 219 shifts to yellow/red at lower currents.
On this charts You also see, that the tint of the XP-G shifts rather linear and parallel in both directions, while the tint of the Nichia shifts less on the red/green y-axis.


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## jabe1 (Apr 22, 2012)

No beamshots yet, but I just completed an emitter swap into a 1AA Quark Ti. The tint is fantastic, and the hotspot is slightly smaller.

To my old eyes it appears to be about 10% lower output, which the tint more than makes up for.

The swap was rudimentary once I was able to crack through the Loctite!

This LED is what these lights needed from the get-go. It'll now get alot more pocket time.
I'll try to get some decent shots later tonight, although my crap point and shoot rarely is cooperative.


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## RI Chevy (Apr 22, 2012)

tolkaze said:


> Going back to the shifting tint, i'm guessing it will be noticeable between say... a M61 and a M61LLL? I really want a good LED since I am getting sick of CREE tint shift at lower current



Funny you mentioned this. I just compared my Lumens Factory Warm XP-G HCRI 3 mode (3.6-13v) drop ins in 2 different lights. I use one with 3 CR-123's in a 9P, and the other in a single 18650 host. On high, the 3-CR123's put out a much brighter and "whiter" light output than the single 18650 light. The drop in states that it is a (3.6V-13V Regulated Input, Constant Output) LED. I am a little confused by this. The drop in with the single 18650 battery puts out a very, very warm tinted (peachy/orangy) light output. The 3-CR123 9P puts out a much whiter, brighter (only a slight bit of yellow) light output.


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## wquiles (Apr 22, 2012)

RI Chevy said:


> Funny you mentioned this. I just compared my Lumens Factory Warm XP-G HCRI 3 mode (3.6-13v) drop ins in 2 different lights. I use one with 3 CR-123's in a 9P, and the other in a single 18650 host. On high, the 3-CR123's put out a much brighter and "whiter" light output than the single 18650 light. The drop in states that it is a (3.6V-13V Regulated Input, Constant Output) LED. I am a little confused by this. The drop in with the single 18650 battery puts out a very, very warm tinted (peachy/orangy) light output. The 3-CR123 9P puts out a much whiter, brighter (only a slight bit of yellow) light output.


The driver might be current regulated in a *portion* of that voltage range, but clearly the driver is NOT a constant current driver through the *whole* voltage range.


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## tolkaze (Apr 22, 2012)

Thanks Erzengel, that is excellent information. I have been putting off an order until now, and now that I want to buy, a lot of the bits and pieces I wanted are now unavailable... arrgh. Will get LED's first and worry about current levels later


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## ShineOnYouCrazyDiamond (Apr 22, 2012)

I just received a bunch of the Nichias this weekend and couldn't wait to mod up a few lights. I am a neutral lover and I have to admit that at first I was really turned off by the tint of the beam - until I spent a bunch more time with it. I slowly began to realize that the LED really illuminates the entire RGB spectrum nearly as well as a neutral XP-G without making everything creamy looking. It really appears to me like the illumination that comes from the sun through the window. Whites are so white while the colors are accurate.

This is a truly great LED and I look forward to modding a few more lights with this LED. So far I only did a few small low power lights, but I am interested to see how it does in a light with a bit more Ooomph.


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## Sgt. LED (Apr 23, 2012)

These should be in the Ra


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## bansuri (Apr 23, 2012)

Sgt. LED said:


> These should be in the Ra


Going in my Twisty and Basic60 tomorrow night! Will post beamshots.


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## THE_dAY (Apr 23, 2012)

Here are beamshots of an oil painting, the NVSL 219 is very close to McGizmo's NCSL 119.
In my sample you'll notice the 219 is a little whiter in tint than the 119, regardless both LEDs do an amazing job at color rendering:







Here is an XRE Q5 for reference:


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## Sgt. LED (Apr 23, 2012)

Excellent 
I have two to work on based on your report.


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## HighLumens (Apr 23, 2012)

Sgt. LED said:


> These should be in the Ra


 I agree with you. Not only it would be whiter (less yellow) than the xp-g hi cri, it would be even about 15% brighter. What about a thread to gather everyone who is interested in a nichia 219 hds? Maybe we could show henry how welcomed would such a light be.


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## Sgt. LED (Apr 23, 2012)

That's a great idea! Start it up, and link this thread for pics.

If he can source the bin Craig has and not the cheesy ones it'll be a clear winner. 
Who knows, maybe he could ship them faster lol!


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## ShineOnYouCrazyDiamond (Apr 23, 2012)

Well, I just finished two more mods and I am still impressed. I upgraded my HDS Rotary and Haiku. One thing I am noticing is that the apparent warmth of the LED is VERY dependent on the reflector in which is sits. The in the four lights I've modded (Preon, LF2XT, Haiku, HDS Rotary) the tint goes from very white (and I say white, not cool, because cool tints make me think of angry blue and barf green hues and this LED really is pure white) to a slight neutral. The Preon is a real flood light and the beam appears very white. The Haiku and HDS have the most concentrated spot beams and they appear more neutral - but more like 3x neutral (on the Cree chart) rather than a 5B/5C neutral.

I've done some comparisons of all beams against my defacto standard 5B/5C1 XP-G LED and I am definitely a fan. I would say that the light quality is well worth the loss of the ~30 lumens @350mA especially since I probably use 50 lumens or less most of the time. I would love to see some triples or quads made up with these LEDs.


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## damn_hammer (Apr 23, 2012)

ShineOnYouCrazyDiamond said:


> ... I've modded (Preon, LF2XT, Haiku, HDS Rotary) the tint goes from very white (and I say white, not cool, because cool tints make me think of angry blue and barf green hues and this LED really is pure white) to a slight neutral. The Preon is a real flood light and the beam appears very white. The Haiku and HDS have the most concentrated spot beams and they appear more neutral - but more like 3x neutral (on the Cree chart) rather than a 5B/5C neutral. ...



That's the first I've heard of anyone being able to open the head on a Preon, and mod it. Congrats! Was it a Preon 0,1, or 2? Have a Preon 1 Ti that could definitely use this high CRI Nichia.


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## eh4 (Apr 23, 2012)

tolkaze said:


> Going back to the shifting tint, i'm guessing it will be noticeable between say... a M61 and a M61LLL? I really want a good LED since I am getting sick of CREE tint shift at lower current



Can't you just use a "true current regulated" driver? 
My eyes were swimming going over all of the drivers available. illuminationsupply has a variety.


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## calipsoii (Apr 23, 2012)

eh4 said:


> Can't you just use a "true current regulated" driver?
> My eyes were swimming going over all of the drivers available. illuminationsupply has a variety.



Tint shift happens when the current to the LED is fluctuated. 

Using a current-controlled driver (as is so popular nowadays) will increase runtime slightly due the increased efficiency, but will cause tint shift at the low output levels.
Using a PWM controlled driver, which flashes the LED rapidly at 100% current, does not cause tint shift but may cause a nauseating flashing if the frequency is not set high enough.

McGizmo chose to use a "constant color" PWM driver in his HCRI offerings for precisely this reason. For an LED like the 219, it is my suggestion that anyone hoping to retain it's gorgeous color rendering and tint chooses a PWM driver with a very high frequency (1000hz+) over a current controlled one. The slight loss in runtime is worth it when purchasing an emitter solely for it's unique output properties.


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## F250XLT (Apr 23, 2012)

bansuri said:


> Going in my Twisty and Basic60 tomorrow night! Will post beamshots.




Would love it if someone could put one of these in by B60LE


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## csshih (Apr 23, 2012)

Sgt. LED said:


> That's a great idea! Start it up, and link this thread for pics.
> 
> If he can source the bin Craig has and not the cheesy ones it'll be a clear winner.
> Who knows, maybe he could ship them faster lol!



LOL, speaking of which. I spoke with Henry today.
He's still having production issues, but I'm thinking of a custom run in a month or so 

Craig


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## Sgt. LED (Apr 23, 2012)

Ahhhh Your current batch of emitters right!?

Make sure I'm on the list to get one. Couple of months is fine, longer and I'll forget I wanted one lol


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## diesel79 (Apr 23, 2012)

Nichia HDS sounds saweet. Thats no good that there are more production problems.


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## HighLumens (Apr 24, 2012)

Sgt. LED said:


> That's a great idea! Start it up, and link this thread for pics.
> 
> If he can source the bin Craig has and not the cheesy ones it'll be a clear winner.
> Who knows, maybe he could ship them faster lol!



I created the new thread


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## ShineOnYouCrazyDiamond (Apr 24, 2012)

damn_hammer said:


> That's the first I've heard of anyone being able to open the head on a Preon, and mod it. Congrats! Was it a Preon 0,1, or 2? Have a Preon 1 Ti that could definitely use this high CRI Nichia.



It was a Preon Revo SS that I modded. Getting the head open cleanly was not too bad although I did end up getting some wrench marks on the threads (but those are usually hidden so no big deal on this one). Once open reflowing the led is very easy.

On another note I am noticing that in lights that have tight focus with the XP-G the Nichia seems to appear to be a much warmer LED than with the floodier LF2XT and the Preon. So if I compare a HDS rotary with a neutral 5B XP-G against a HDS rotary with the Nichia, the difference is much less significant.


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## THE_dAY (Apr 24, 2012)

ShineOnYouCrazyDiamond said:


> It was a Preon Revo SS that I modded. Getting the head open cleanly was not too bad although I did end up getting some wrench marks on the threads (but those are usually hidden so no big deal on this one). Once open reflowing the led is very easy.
> 
> On another note I am noticing that in lights that have tight focus with the XP-G the Nichia seems to appear to be a much warmer LED than with the floodier LF2XT and the Preon. So if I compare a HDS rotary with a neutral 5B XP-G against a HDS rotary with the Nichia, the difference is much less significant.



Long ago I was playing with different reflectors in a Firefly II (cr123 light). I had noticed that one of the reflectors had a slightly warmer metallic coating which showed up as a slightly warmer beam tint.

Do you notice any color difference in the actual reflectors of your lights that might be causing the tints to differ?
Or maybe the LEDs were different tints to begin with?


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## diesel79 (Apr 24, 2012)

Anyone have any outdoor beamshots or anything from a little distance? Id like to see what the beam looks like when its opened up a little bit.


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## bansuri (Apr 24, 2012)

No distance shots yet. 
Here's a shot of an SC600 with stock cool emitter, HDS Basic60 with Nichia219 4500k, and a V10R with Nichia219 4500k.
None of the lights were on 100%, tried to get them balanced for a group shot. 
The output from the 219 is really a perfect white to my eye. Adds nothing. 
Still need to get around to my Twisty, EDC 120, and Ti MiNi AA.


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## THE_dAY (Apr 24, 2012)

bansuri said:


> ...Still need to get around to my Twisty, EDC 120, and Ti MiNi AA.


Make sure you leave at least one light with cool white, you know just incase you start taking the 219's tint and CRI for granted you can always blast the cool white by it's side for instant apprectiation of the Nichia.

Besides having perfect tint (or no tint), the color rendering is what amazes me the most.
This LED can bring out the reds much more than a warmer tinted LED and still be whiter.


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## calipsoii (Apr 24, 2012)

diesel79 said:


> Anyone have any outdoor beamshots or anything from a little distance? Id like to see what the beam looks like when its opened up a little bit.



Settings locked at:
----------------------
White Balance: Daylight
Exposure: 2 seconds


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## badtziscool (Apr 25, 2012)

calipsoii said:


>



Which of these three do you think renders the color of your deck the most closely, calipsoii?

It looks like the 119 renders brown and earth tones more vividly than the 219 but that could just be the beam profile, but regardless, the 219 definitely has good color rendition. I like how the brown and orange from the stems of the two trees in the foreground contrast so vividly from the green.


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## calipsoii (Apr 25, 2012)

badtziscool said:


> Which of these three do you think renders the color of your deck the most closely, calipsoii?
> 
> It looks like the 119 renders brown and earth tones more vividly than the 219 but that could just be the beam profile, but regardless, the 219 definitely has good color rendition. I like how the brown and orange from the stems of the two trees in the foreground contrast so vividly from the green.



For sheer color rendering, I think the 119 does a better job. It makes objects appear more colorful and less lifeless.

After modding a couple lights with this LED, I'd be hesitant to call it a dedicated High CRI emitter.
It's more like a compromise between the color rendering you get using an incan and the cool temperatures you get using an LED.

What's exciting about this LED is that it's the first I've used that I'd actually call neutral. It has almost no tint - it's like you took the "hard white" tint of a cool LED and softened it just a bit (stripping out the blue without adding a bunch of yellow in it's place). The fact that it does a good job rendering color is almost secondary to that.

There's always been the "well, what _is _neutral?" argument - I'd like to see this become the standard for neutral white light. I don't think it's too much of a stretch to say that future NW emitters will be compared to this one.


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## ShineOnYouCrazyDiamond (Apr 25, 2012)

In the pictures above I do see a possible point of contention in comparing the beams. The 119 is in a Haiku with a hot spot and less flood. The 219 is in a D10 with a much larger spot and flood.

As I have found comparing the lights I've modded, the tighter you make the spot with this LED the more neutral it appears. In a floody light the beam appears as a true white with color rendering, but when you through it in a tight spot light (I've done Haiku and HDS) the beam appears to be more neutral.

The more time I am spending with this LED I am finding that in some applications, like the floodier AAA lights, this LED impresses me. But in other applications with tight spots I feel the benefits of the HiCRI and tint are lost with the warming color tint shift. Comparing these tight spot lights side to side with my old standard neutral LED, the XP-G R4-5C1, I am hard pressed to tell the difference. The 219 appears to be just a touch whiter while the neutral XP-G warms the color with just a touch of over emphasis on the yellow/red colors. (These comparisons done at 750-1000mA drive levels so as to remove lower current tint shift from the equation)

At the end of the day my overall conclusion is that the 219 will fit well in some applications, but in general I am not willing to sacrifice the almost 25% loss ([email protected] vs. [email protected]), even more for higher binned XM-Ls, in lumens for the small gains achieved.


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## BigBluefish (Apr 25, 2012)

Count me in on the HDS w/Nichia 219! 

I had a legacy Hi CRI with the SSC P4, and it was just a bit too yellow, and the SSC P4 is a bit short on throw. And I fear the Cree XP-Gs (which I think Henry is using for the current Hi CRI Clickies might be just a tad too warm, though I'm happy with my Quark HI-CRI and LF Hi-CRI drop ins). 

I'll have to pick up a Malkoff M61L or -LL 219 and plunk it in my 6P to see how I like it. From what I've seen here, I think it will be just right.


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## kaichu dento (Apr 25, 2012)

calipsoii said:


> What's exciting about this LED is that it's the first I've used that I'd actually call neutral. It has almost no tint - it's like you took the "hard white" tint of a cool LED and softened it just a bit (stripping out the blue without adding a bunch of yellow in it's place). The fact that it does a good job rendering color is almost secondary to that. There's always been the "well, what _is _neutral?" argument - I'd like to see this become the standard for neutral white light. I don't think it's too much of a stretch to say that future NW emitters will be compared to this one.


This is what I've been saying ever since getting my 119 Haiku back in November - this is true neutral. When you light something up with it, you only notice light, all colors are simply what is already there.


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## Zendude (Apr 26, 2012)

Hey bansuri, How does the Nichia compare to the XP-G R3 3A's you had a while back? Those are still my favorite tint.


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## bodhran (Apr 26, 2012)

Now that I have mine I know what kaichu dento means by white. Seeing is believing...*s*


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## jabe1 (Apr 26, 2012)

I now have 2 lights with these, a Quark Ti I modded, and a Nailbender drop-in. I think these are better suited to a floodier light.
Although the drop-in is great, and color rendering is better than most everything I own, it isn't that much better than an XP-G or XM-L with a 5B tint.

In the Quark, on the other hand, it really "shines", this light will now get lots of pocket time. In a smaller reflector, especially one as good as the 4Sevens, the floodiness makes it. without such a defined hotspot, you can note more of a difference in light quality. As Kaichu said, you just get light, no blue, red, or yellow (or puke green).

I need to build something into a Mule now....


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## CarpentryHero (Apr 26, 2012)

I'm still waiting by my mailbox for my first Nichia with a reflector. I've got a couple dropins on order  

Thanks for posting beam shots :thumbsup:


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## bansuri (Apr 27, 2012)

Zendude said:


> Hey bansuri, How does the Nichia compare to the XP-G R3 3A's you had a while back? Those are still my favorite tint.


What I see, (and I only speak for myself), is not a tint that can be compared to another tint. It just looks white to me. I love the 3A as a coolish neutral, and the 5C1 is my favorite neutral, but this is just white.
As ShineOn stated, there IS an output loss that is visible so it may not be the perfect emitter for every application. 
Eventually I'll have a light for each season with specific tints, maybe cool for winter, warm for summer, etc. 
Honestly, I'm just sick when it comes to emitter swapping, I can't stop. So much cheaper than buying new lights. Thanks to CPF I can keep up with the latest and greatest!


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## bansuri (Apr 28, 2012)

From left to right:
Mini AA with Nichia (70 mA at tail) and diffusion film, Preon 1 (105 mA) with neutral XP-G, and ReVo (25 mA) with XP-G s2. 
All the lights are on low, the Preon1 has levels spaced too closely, 105, 125, 150.
The ReVo is the best bet to keychain carry as the S2 gives me the most bang for my buck, but the MiNi AA Nichia is just beautiful to behold. The reduced output makes the LOW level a little lower, every little bit helps.
Took the diffusion film off the AA and exposed a fantastic beam pattern.
This is taken with iPhone, but it shows the tints OK, the Nichia is pretty much just white in person. And yes, the ReVo S2 is greenish.


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## jabe1 (Apr 28, 2012)

not meant as a thread hijack, but 

bansuri, what did it take to get the Minis head cracked?


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## bansuri (Apr 28, 2012)

jabe1 said:


> not meant as a thread hijack, but
> 
> bansuri, what did it take to get the Minis head cracked?


Tweezers and a little heat. Not a lot of heat. Good amount of torque. Out of 6 crackings I lost one to too much heat, won't happen again!


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## morelightnow (Apr 30, 2012)

calipsoii said:


> Settings locked at:
> ----------------------
> White Balance: Daylight
> Exposure: 2 seconds
> ...


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## bansuri (May 9, 2012)

Couldn't bring my real camera to work so this phone pic will have to do. 
Zebralight H31 on the left, HDS Basic 60 with Nichia 219, (from Illuminationsupply batch), on the right. Both on full.
The Basic 60 holds up well to the H31. 
In person the Nichia looked more white than the picture conveys, however, the walls are really that color from 40+ years of airborn coolant and oil. It's a dirty old machine shop. It's as if in person I was seeing the light from the light but the camera captured the color of the wall. 
Anyway, the tint of this thing is ruining me, probably mod all my moddable lights with this eventually.


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## GeoBruin (May 9, 2012)

I've just received a couple of Malkoff Modules with the 219 (M61 219 and M61 219LLL) and I'll reiterate what others have said. I was blown away how white the beam looks. Not blue, not pink, not yellow, just white. It's kind of strange because it has made me aware of how much "color" all my other lights have. I'm getting more output from this than I am from my M61w as well. It's a great emitter, it just needs to be in the right reflector. As seen from the dark ring near the outside of the spill on my Malkoff, it's not a drop in replacement for the XP-G.


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## Ti²C (May 9, 2012)

nichia 219 from Craig vs Cree xp-g q2 Ae7 90cri 3000k  in the same host (left reflector is smo while the other is lop)


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## tobrien (May 14, 2012)

so will a Nichia 219 will fit just fine in place of where an XP-G used to be?

i have a Quark Titanium 123 (with serial number) and I'd like to have a 219 in place of it. are they (XP-G and the Nichia 219) about the same size so the reflector won't need to be widened or anything?


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## wquiles (May 14, 2012)

tobrien said:


> so will a Nichia 219 will fit just fine in place of where an XP-G used to be?
> 
> i have a Quark Titanium 123 (with serial number) and I'd like to have a 219 in place of it. are they (XP-G and the Nichia 219) about the same size so the reflector won't need to be widened or anything?



The 219 shares the same surface mount pad, and it is about the same size as the Cree XP-G, so no reflector changes needed


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## tobrien (May 14, 2012)

wquiles said:


> The 219 shares the same surface mount pad, and it is about the same size as the Cree XP-G, so no reflector changes needed


perfect, thank you! 

so i assume the Quark won't need any changes in driver? does the 219 use about the same current?


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## wquiles (May 14, 2012)

tobrien said:


> perfect, thank you!
> 
> so i assume the Quark won't need any changes in driver? does the 219 use about the same current?


Per the data sheet for the 219, yes, about the same. Max current for the 219 is 1.5Amps.


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## tobrien (May 14, 2012)

wquiles said:


> Per the data sheet for the 219, yes, about the same. Max current for the 219 is 1.5Amps.


thanks!

i'll be posting a Quark Mini 123 with Nichia 219 beamshot once I get mine modded.


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## Ti²C (May 15, 2012)

tobrien said:


> so will a Nichia 219 will fit just fine in place of where an XP-G used to be?
> 
> i have a Quark Titanium 123 (with serial number) and I'd like to have a 219 in place of it. are they (XP-G and the Nichia 219) about the same size so the reflector won't need to be widened or anything?



The nichia works fine in my quark Turbo with no other mods than reflowing the led on the stock pcb, but it's not guaranteed to have the exact beamshape of the xp-g due to the slight differences in size of the 219 : thinner case, and higher dome may result in different focusing.
With my smo reflector (turbo) it reduces the donut hole effect of the xp-g at the cost of a square shaped corona around the hotspot when shinned on a white wall at close distance, appart that it's a perfect upgrade with less greens in lower modes !

try it you won't regret !


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## Tain (May 15, 2012)

Beam shots of XPG High CRI and Nichia 219 High CRI








*Color rendering comparison. *
WHITE BALANCE: 4350K


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## RI Chevy (May 15, 2012)

Nice shots. Thanks for sharing.


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## ^Gurthang (May 15, 2012)

Tain,

Thanks for those pics, very informative. Can hardly wait for the 219 delivery...


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## ergotelis (May 15, 2012)

I successfully modded my nitecore IFE2 and quark mini123 Ti with this emitter. The tint color etc is awesome, but you get quite a big performance loss(i got almost half lumen output switching from the good xp-g S2 2T from cutter). BTW beam profile is excellent the emitter works excellent with these two reflectors.


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## mohanjude (May 15, 2012)

Tain

Very helpful to see the comparisons.

I am using one of my lights to look at peoples throats and skin (rashes) etc during my work as a family doctor. I was initially under the mistaken impression years ago that a cold light source would be better than a warm light source. The very yellow warm incandescent lights used in the medical torches were not the same as natural sunlight. Certainly the poor light sources with small bulbs were very expensive for what they were and guzzled up the batteries. When the LED torch came out I was quick to use it but found that the although cold light source intially appeared to be very 'bright' and lasted ages on a set of batteries it did very little to show faint red rashes on the skin. I think the Nichia 219 4500K will be excellent as it will be a good balance of 'Neutral' between too cold and too warm.


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## Tain (May 16, 2012)

Mohanjude,

Nichia 219 high CRI should be a great emitter for your diagnosis use. In real world use, I can distinguish colors better with 219 high CRI than with XPG high CRI.


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## mohanjude (May 16, 2012)

Thanks Tain.

I hope I will be able to mod some of my existing lights such as SVM v10r Ti and Jetbeam TCR1 by simply swapping the LED.

Mohan


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## Tain (May 16, 2012)

Mohan,

You will have better chance with V10R. TCR1 has a funny shaped PCB.


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## easilyled (May 16, 2012)

Excellent beamshots, Tain. Thank you.

The Nichia 219 4500k seems to be the real deal - better color rendition than the High CRI-Cree XPG, yet with a much higher color temperature.

Interestingly the color rendition from the neutral XM-L seemed quite good even though it doesn't claim to have a high CRI


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## tjswarbrick (May 16, 2012)

Awesome beamshots, Tain.
That's exactly what I see with mine.
I know the XM-L is Neutral, but it isn't nearly as white as the 219. It's not yellow, but doesn't really lean toward green. What is that? Just a little gray?
My neutral XM-L NB drop-in is more white than that, but my Quark X neutral is almost identical, while my Xeno neutral XM-L adds a touch of brown But they are all really close.
Through I never saw it as white, I really liked it until my first 219 showed up...

Mohan, the only LED likely to be better than the 4500k Hi CRI Nichia 219 for skin tone is the 4000K Hi CRI Nichia 119.
My Hi CRI XP-G's are pretty amber (3000k or so) - and, though better than the cool-whites I've tried, they do tend to color-shift everything a bit.


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## mohanjude (May 16, 2012)

tjswarbrick said:


> Mohan, the only LED likely to be better than the 4500k Hi CRI Nichia 219 for skin tone is the 4000K Hi CRI Nichia 119.
> My Hi CRI XP-G's are pretty amber (3000k or so) - and, though better than the cool-whites I've tried, they do tend to color-shift everything a bit.



thanks for the advice. learning a lot of useful info from you all.


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## mohanjude (May 16, 2012)

Tain said:


> Mohan,
> 
> You will have better chance with V10R. TCR1 has a funny shaped PCB.



Yep.. I took my TCR1 off having looked at your pictures. Was thinking of shaping the star shaped board to similar shape...

I nearly had a disaster - I broke the negative wire close to the PCB. I had to desolder the board off the main board to repair the wire. I thought I ruined but once I soldered the 5 pins back on it worked.


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## easilyled (May 16, 2012)

mohanjude said:


> Tain
> 
> Very helpful to see the comparisons.
> 
> I am using one of my lights to look at peoples throats and skin (rashes) etc during my work as a family doctor. I was initially under the mistaken impression years ago that a cold light source would be better than a warm light source. The very yellow warm incandescent lights used in the medical torches were not the same as natural sunlight. Certainly the poor light sources with small bulbs were very expensive for what they were and guzzled up the batteries. When the LED torch came out I was quick to use it but found that the although cold light source intially appeared to be very 'bright' and lasted ages on a set of batteries it did very little to show faint red rashes on the skin. I think the Nichia 219 4500K will be excellent as it will be a good balance of 'Neutral' between too cold and too warm.



Mohanjude, if you ever tired of staring down people's throats (as I tired of staring at their mouths - I was a dentist), a whole new career beckons in providing ideal lighting equipment for general practitioners/ENT specialists/gynaecologists etc.

Knowing what your colleagues need and having the knowledge to provide it puts you in an ideal position.


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## kaichu dento (May 16, 2012)

mohanjude said:


> I am using one of my lights to look at peoples throats and skin (rashes) etc during my work as a family doctor. I was initially under the mistaken impression years ago that a cold light source would be better than a warm light source. The very yellow warm incandescent lights used in the medical torches were not the same as natural sunlight. Certainly the poor light sources with small bulbs were very expensive for what they were and guzzled up the batteries. When the LED torch came out I was quick to use it but found that the although cold light source intially appeared to be very 'bright' and lasted ages on a set of batteries it did very little to show faint red rashes on the skin. I think the Nichia 219 4500K will be excellent as it will be a good balance of 'Neutral' between too cold and too warm.


Have not seen a 219 yet, but the 119 is about as perfect a light source as I've ever seen for critical situations regarding color recognition. I'm sure that I can't be the only one, but my first test for tints is my hand - I know what it's supposed to look like and the 119 delivers daylight color in spades, much as I'm expecting from my first 219, which should be in my hands the next week or so.


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## calipsoii (May 16, 2012)

kaichu dento said:


> Have not seen a 210 yet, but the 119 is about as perfect a light source as I've ever seen for critical situations regarding color recognition. I'm sure that I can't be the only one, but my first test for tints is my hand - I know what it's supposed to look like and the 119 delivers daylight color in spades, much as I'm expecting from my first 219, which should be in my hands the next week or so.



I think you'll like it KD. It's a different emitter than the 119 - you'll see what I mean when you receive it. It's not really a "119 killer", it's more of a complimentary LED. They both excel at different things and I wouldn't try to replace one with the other. 

In my opinion, it doesn't render colors as vividly as the 119, but it makes up for that with an absolutely pure white tint that makes the 119 look yellowish. It's a good emitter and I hope to see more lights offer it (especially since it's almost a drop-in replacement for most, save for the reflector)


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## mohanjude (May 16, 2012)

easilyled said:


> Mohanjude, if you ever tired of staring down people's throats (as I tired of staring at their mouths - I was a dentist), a whole new career beckons in providing ideal lighting equipment for general practitioners/ENT specialists/gynaecologists etc.
> 
> Knowing what your colleagues need and having the knowledge to provide it puts you in an ideal position.



Yes you are right. Looking at the amounts the companies charge for technology that is old is shocking. I think medics and managers go for the established brands as they are 'tried and tested'.


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## blasterman (May 19, 2012)

> I was initially under the mistaken impression years ago that a cold light source would be better than a warm light source.



For general color evaluation 5000-6000k would be, but *only* at a high CRI level. At present I don't think high CRI, high CCT solo LED's exist with most maxing at about 70-75 CRI. High CRI fluorescent tubes and metal halides > 90 CRI exist in this range, and that's where the 'impression' comes from. However, a typical 70 CRI cool-white emitter is going to have anemic amounts of red and amber and this will make visual observations involving blood somewhat difficult because your light source doesn't have much of this color to begin with.

The Rebel lxw8-pw80 comes at a 5000k flavor with a CRI rating of 85, which I find rather astonishing, but nobody seems to like Rebels here. Otherwise, you'll need to stick to lower CCT emitters to get enough red spectrum to work accurately.


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## netprince (May 20, 2012)

I thought this was an interesting shot, host is a maratac AAA stainless steel...


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## kaichu dento (May 25, 2012)

calipsoii said:


> I think you'll like it KD. It's a different emitter than the 119 - you'll see what I mean when you receive it. It's not really a "119 killer", it's more of a complimentary LED. They both excel at different things and I wouldn't try to replace one with the other.
> 
> In my opinion, it doesn't render colors as vividly as the 119, but it makes up for that with an absolutely pure white tint that makes the 119 look yellowish. It's a good emitter and I hope to see more lights offer it (especially since it's almost a drop-in replacement for most, save for the reflector)


I thought they were the same emitter with a different footprint and that any differences in tint would be attributed to which bin the particular emitter came from. The way you're describing the two sounds like the two 119 Haiku's I have. My first one seems so purely white, except in direct comparison to Haiku #2.

I should have my first 219 by next week and will weigh in after I get a chance to play with it for a bit.


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## guardpost3 (May 25, 2012)

I swapped one into a Nitecore EX11.2 v2 last week (my first mod by the way) and have carried nothing but it since. I have tried several high CRI lights in the past and just could not bring myself to like how warm they were. This is one of my favorite tints and to be high CRI to boot is about as good as it gets. Cant wait to get my HDS back from Jake Royston with its new 219 in it.


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## netprince (May 30, 2012)

This is such a great LED, I cant resist installing it into my previously XPG modded lights. This is a sunwayman v10a...


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## guardpost3 (Jun 1, 2012)

My HDS 170T with its new 219 thanks to Jake Royston.






Outside.





Compared to its unmodded GDP brother.





Fire Hydrant in the rain.





Office with the lights off. (and a mouse on the floor)


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## HighLumens (Jun 2, 2012)

Hi guardpost3!
Thanks for these pics. May you take the same pictures with the hds using the gdp? If you manually set some parameters of the camera, please, be sure to use the same settings. Thanks.


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## run4jc (Jun 2, 2012)

Have a few OVER HERE along with other lights...


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## guardpost3 (Jun 3, 2012)

HighLumens said:


> Hi guardpost3!
> Thanks for these pics. May you take the same pictures with the hds using the gdp? If you manually set some parameters of the camera, please, be sure to use the same settings. Thanks.



I actually thought about taking some with the gdp but had forgot to bring it with me. Except for the wall shot these pics were taken at my work after hours, I will snap some with the gdp next time I have the chance.


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## BudK (Jun 16, 2012)

Pitch dark outbuilding. Illumination by Nichia 219


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## RI Chevy (Jun 16, 2012)

Cool photo of the wood spider.


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## davyro (Jun 18, 2012)

first up HDS 120E with nichia 219 second HDS Rotary with stock XP-G third Haiku 6V with nichia 219 last HDS 170T with stock LED

I don't know if these let us know the true story as i just used my phone for speed,next time ill get my camera out.


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## tobrien (Jul 14, 2012)

i've got a dual 219 P60 drop-in coming soon from Nailbender. I noticed no one's got dual-Nichia 219 beamshots, so I can *try* but I'm not guaranteeing perfect results of my beamshots if y'all are interested. if you guys want to see em, i'll take some photos when all the stuff is in (FiveMega Cooly 26650, 26650 cells, and, of course, the Nailbender dual-Nichia 219 drop-in)

for what it's worth, the drop-in will be at 2.8 amps afaik


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## The_Driver (Jul 15, 2012)

In these shots the difference between the 219 and standard cool white leds is very visible.


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## andrewnewman (Sep 7, 2012)

I'm really looking forward to the eventual delivery of my new M61L 219. Most people are skeptical when I explain the benefits of high CRI. Even a demo comparing the light to a lower CRI neutral isn't convincing. What usually gets them is when I hand them a cool white led flashlight after dark when we are grilling. I'll cut into a chop or steak and ask them if they think it's sufficiently well done. They'll shine the light at the meat, sometimes adjust the brightness and finally admit that they can't really tell. I then hand them a light with a 90+ CRI led in it and ask them the same question. Then they get it.


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## cland72 (Sep 11, 2012)

Lets say I wanted to use a light to check on a steak on the grill -- would this be the ticket for proper color rendition? Or would I be better off looking for a HCRI XPG?


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## ti-force (Sep 11, 2012)

cland72 said:


> Lets say I wanted to use a light to check on a steak on the grill -- would this be the ticket for proper color rendition? Or would I be better off looking for a HCRI XPG?



The Nichia works very well. Just used mine to check a ribeye this past Saturday night. Red shows very well with my sample.


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## anethema (Sep 11, 2012)

A nichia would be better for checking steak since warm lights like the XP-G render colors very well relative to its orange output, but relative to sun white you will have definite red-orange shift on all colors.

So your steak may look more rare than it is if your eyes are not adjusted like if you just came in from the house. Nichia FTW! Plus it has a slightly higher CRI


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## el_Pablo (Nov 12, 2012)

does someone knows about the efficiency difference of the nichia nvsl219t-h1 4500k b10 bin VS the  xp-g q2 Ae7 90cri 3000k ?

thanks


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## The_Driver (Nov 12, 2012)

el_Pablo said:


> does someone knows about the efficiency difference of the nichia nvsl219t-h1 4500k b10 bin VS the  xp-g q2 Ae7 90cri 3000k ?
> 
> thanks



It depends on the current you wil use them at, but at the maximum 1.5A the Nichias are tiny bit better (I think). CHeck the datasheets (searach with google for nicha 219 h1 datasheet and for cree xp-g datasheet)


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## el_Pablo (Nov 12, 2012)

The_Driver said:


> It depends on the current you wil use them at, but at the maximum 1.5A the Nichias are tiny bit better (I think). CHeck the datasheets (searach with google for nicha 219 h1 datasheet and for cree xp-g datasheet)



that's sounds great, better color temperatur, CRI, and efficiency at I max!!!!


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## neutralwhite (Jan 28, 2013)

so for an outdoor light the 4500k Nichia 219 right?.
would warm be better?.
thanks.


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## RI Chevy (Jan 28, 2013)

I would go with the M61 219. There is no tint at all, just powerful light.


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## saypat (Mar 27, 2014)

hope that's not a Brown Recluse!


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## radiopej (Aug 7, 2014)

I just got my first one in a P60 dropin from Nailbender. Not very thrilled so far.

No problem at all with his work, that is great.

It just feels dim. The hotspot is too small but without great throw. The colour is pretty cool, though I think it's not significantly greater than my neutral XM-L2. I think if I buy a triple emitter dropin I'd like it more.


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## badtziscool (Aug 7, 2014)

radiopej said:


> I just got my first one in a P60 dropin from Nailbender. Not very thrilled so far.
> 
> No problem at all with his work, that is great.
> 
> It just feels dim. The hotspot is too small but without great throw. The colour is pretty cool, though I think it's not significantly greater than my neutral XM-L2. I think if I buy a triple emitter dropin I'd like it more.



Yeah. Nichia 219 is actually very unimpressive at first, because when you compare it to other leds, you immediately compare output. But once you're in a situation where you're actually using it, it's a really nice light. My eyes get tired pretty fast when I use a cool white led for stuff like close up inspection or in complete darkness (camping, backpacking, etc), but when I use the nichia, I can use it for prolonged periods of time and never get fatigued and that, for me, is where this led really shines.


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## WalkIntoTheLight (Aug 7, 2014)

Yes, you're not going to get more than about 200 lumens from a Nichia 219A light, whereas you can get 1000 lumens from a neutral XML2 light. The colour difference isn't very apparent at first, but the Nichia does provide slightly better colour rendition. I use the Nichia for close-up work where colour is important, and the neutral XML2 as a EDC light.


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## reppans (Aug 7, 2014)

Left to Right (~3 lm modes): QPA-X, El Cap, D25A XML, D25A N219, L3 L10 N219, QPA-N219, SC52


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## RI Chevy (Aug 7, 2014)

Nice shot!


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## alvnfrds (Nov 12, 2014)

Kamboja flowers.






Bougenville Flowers.


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## Bullzeyebill (Nov 12, 2014)

Are you running both lights at about the same power level. The Thrunite seems to have a brighter hot spot which can affect the color rendering somewhat. The Malkoff has a wider profile beam. Subtle differences in color rending between the two lights.

Bill


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## kaichu dento (Nov 12, 2014)

Very subtle difference in these pics shows how far we've come in the past couple of years and even with my preference going towards the 219, the XP-G2 looks pretty damn good too.

The last picture is the one that shows the best what I like about the newer emitters with the way it shows the color accuracy on the leaves.


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## easilyled (Nov 13, 2014)

@alvnfrds, what color temperature is the XP-G2 in the Thrunite Ti2? 

I would assume that its definitely not a cool-white from the evidence of your pictures which show that the color rendering from the XP-G2 is pretty good and gives the Nichia a 219 a run for its money - even though its not really supposed to.


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## alvnfrds (Nov 13, 2014)

easilyled said:


> @alvnfrds, what color temperature is the XP-G2 in the Thrunite Ti2?
> 
> I would assume that its definitely not a cool-white from the evidence of your pictures which show that the color rendering from the XP-G2 is pretty good and gives the Nichia a 219 a run for its money - even though its not really supposed to.



5000K.


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## alvnfrds (Nov 13, 2014)

Bullzeyebill said:


> Are you running both lights at about the same power level. The Thrunite seems to have a brighter hot spot which can affect the color rendering somewhat. The Malkoff has a wider profile beam. Subtle differences in color rending between the two lights.
> 
> Bill



Ti2 80 lm, M61LL 76 lm.


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## kaichu dento (Nov 13, 2014)

alvnfrds said:


> 5000K.


I suppose that's about what I would have guessed, as my preferences lie more in the 4000k range, and my last favorite hCRI XP-G was probably somewhere between 3200-3700k.


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## badtziscool (Nov 13, 2014)

Very nice. The color rendering is pretty close to the Nichia 219. The richness is still not as high but that's picking at straws though. The browns, however, are still not as good. Given though that the xpg2 are much more efficient, to get the increase in output but still be at 95% color rendering of the Nichia 219, I would say that's a very good tradeoff.


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## tobrien (Nov 13, 2014)

badtziscool said:


> Very nice. The color rendering is pretty close to the Nichia 219. The richness is still not as high but that's picking at straws though. The browns, however, are still not as good. Given though that the xpg2 are much more efficient, to get the increase in output but still be at 95% color rendering of the Nichia 219, I would say that's a very good tradeoff.



I agree with you. It's awesome how similar they seem (IMO)


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## kaichu dento (Nov 14, 2014)

alvnfrds said:


>


I agree that they both look good but this is the picture that really matters and shows how much important difference there actually is.

The tint showing on the left is not bad at all, but on the right, for those of us who prefer a bit more neutrality, there it is.

Look at how purple the flowers on the left are, while actually pink, as shown on the right.


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## radiopej (Nov 17, 2014)

Nailbender 219 p60 dropin at 4500K. On the highest mode, I think that's 1.4 A, ~200 lumens.


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## neutralwhite (Dec 31, 2014)

So does the nichia A have just that more hcri than the nichia b?.
I have a beta QR and can't figure out what nichia it has.
bought in the last weeks. 
Thanks.


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## WalkIntoTheLight (Dec 31, 2014)

neutralwhite said:


> So does the nichia A have just that more hcri than the nichia b?.
> I have a beta QR and can't figure out what nichia it has.
> bought in the last weeks.
> Thanks.



From what I understand, the Nichia 219B is brighter than the 219A, but has a cooler tint. So, the Nichia 219A will show off warm tones better than the 219B. They both have very high CRI.

If you look at the spec sheets for each LED, the 219A seems a bit smoother, which should result in better CRI. But it's probably negligible.


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## radiopej (Dec 31, 2014)

Single mode Sportac triple Nichia drop in. Great beam


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## Newguy2012 (Dec 31, 2014)

neutralwhite said:


> So does the nichia A have just that more hcri than the nichia b?.
> I have a beta QR and can't figure out what nichia it has.
> bought in the last weeks.
> Thanks.


Beta QR uses Nichia A


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## Zanders (Jan 2, 2015)

[/IMG]

Nichia NVSL219BT R85 D220 S3 host left, Zebralight SC62w right.


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## VishiSingh (Apr 6, 2015)

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> From what I understand, the Nichia 219B is brighter than the 219A, but has a cooler tint. So, the Nichia 219A will show off warm tones better than the 219B. They both have very high CRI.
> 
> If you look at the spec sheets for each LED, the 219A seems a bit smoother, which should result in better CRI. But it's probably negligible.



I'm into light painting and night landscapes and have ordered an Eagletac MX25L3C with "*6 Nichia 219 D220 (CRI-92) 4500K*" - as per the Eagletac spec sheet. I've also ordered an Eagletac D25LC2 Clicky with a "*Nichia 219 CRI-92 LED*" (also as per the Eagletac website spec sheet). Not sure if they are Nichia 219A or 219B or something else entirely?

After seeing the photos on this thread, I am certain that I have made the right decision going with Nichia, but am confused (worried?) about the lack of clarity in nomenclature. Could someone please help me understand that better?:sweat:

Many thanks!


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## markr6 (Apr 6, 2015)

VishiSingh said:


> I'm into light painting and night landscapes and have ordered an Eagletac MX25L3C with "*6 Nichia 219 D220 (CRI-92) 4500K*" - as per the Eagletac spec sheet. I've also ordered an Eagletac D25LC2 Clicky with a "*Nichia 219 CRI-92 LED*" (also as per the Eagletac website spec sheet). Not sure if they are Nichia 219A or 219B or something else entirely?
> 
> After seeing the photos on this thread, I am certain that I have made the right decision going with Nichia, but am confused (worried?) about the lack of clarity in nomenclature. Could someone please help me understand that better?:sweat:
> 
> Many thanks!



I used to have the D25LC2 with Nichia. It was the Nichia 219A. Man, was that a nice tint!!! Probably the best I've ever seen but I sold it since I just didn't like the UI. It's hard to describe, but it was "warm" without being warm. 4500K is perfect. The 219B @ 5000K is a little cooler than I'd like. but I'm fine with it due to the high CRI.


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## badtziscool (Apr 6, 2015)

Which nomenclature are you referring to? There's A LOT in the world of LED and flashlights. 

If you're referring to "*6 Nichia 219 D220 (CRI-92) 4500K*" then I guess we can start there:

6 is referring to the number of leds used in the light. 
Nichia is the manufacturer of the led. There are many led manufacturers out there, but the main players in the flashlight world is Cree, Nichia, and (at one point in time but not so much as of recent) Luminous.
D220 - Not really sure what this is.
CRI-92 refers to the Color Rendering Index of the led and the light it produces. 92 refers to what level it reaches within that index with 100 being the highest. There is A LOT of discussion on what CRI really means and how important it is (or isn't). Some of it I still don't understand. It's definitely worth a read if you want to understand the light output.
4500k refers to the color temperature of the light. Lower number means the "warmer" the light is (more of a yellow or orange hue vs a cooler light with more of a blue hue).





VishiSingh said:


> I'm into light painting and night landscapes and have ordered an Eagletac MX25L3C with "*6 Nichia 219 D220 (CRI-92) 4500K*" - as per the Eagletac spec sheet. I've also ordered an Eagletac D25LC2 Clicky with a "*Nichia 219 CRI-92 LED*" (also as per the Eagletac website spec sheet). Not sure if they are Nichia 219A or 219B or something else entirely?
> 
> After seeing the photos on this thread, I am certain that I have made the right decision going with Nichia, but am confused (worried?) about the lack of clarity in nomenclature. Could someone please help me understand that better?:sweat:
> 
> Many thanks!


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## recDNA (Apr 6, 2015)

219A has a distinctly rosy tint. More pink than yellow.


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## markr6 (Apr 6, 2015)

recDNA said:


> 219A has a distinctly rosy tint. More pink than yellow.



Good way to put it right there


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## KITROBASKIN (Apr 6, 2015)

My Nailbender P60 dropin; a triple Nichia 219B 5000K running at a reported 3.8 Amps makes a snow bank look completely normal- the way it looks during the day, but the kind of soil we have here looks just a little bit darker, richer than daylight, when lit up with this light. It, however, is not distracting. The warmer Nichia are a little distracting to me, but still miles better than the Cree XML2's that I have.

Based on what I have seen here on CPF, and the few videos of beamshots that I have made, there are just too many variabilities to really pin down what the tint of any given flashlight is. Plus, the way we perceive light can be quite different... And so on.


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