# Brightest production LED’ delivers 17,675 lumens



## jjziets (Mar 29, 2012)

O i can do so much with this. 17675 lumen out of one LED. What would be the power input? 150W? 

http://www.ecnmag.com/News/2012/03/‘Brightest-production-LED’-delivers--17,675-lumens/

I can't find the LED that there talking about on the manufactures site. :huh: so I am wondering if this is legit.

and is this true? 
_"Marl Optosource’s new range of Citizen LEDs is not only its most efficient ever, but also includes what it believes is the world’s brightest production LED__."_ 155L/Watt is impressive.


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## CKOD (Mar 29, 2012)

155 Lm/W is probably their smaller LED. They say 100Lm, to 17675 Lm, so if I'd most likely wager that the 155Lm/W is in the 100Lm LED, not the 17K Lm LED. Either way, seeing effiency numbers creep up for power LEDs is always a good thing.


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## Hoop (Mar 29, 2012)

They are on Citizens website here: http://ce.citizen.co.jp/lighting_led/en/products/COB_series.html

All of the 5000k LED's are 145 LM/W or better at their lowest drive currents according to their chart.

Edit: looking into the Data sheet of the CL0550, which is the brightest one, they have an operating voltage of between about 47 to 62 volts. At 62 volts it would be at about 3A. TaskLED's Hyperboost driver could run this sucker at 2A, which would provide between 10,900 to 12,850 lumens. The provided specs are for a Tj temp of 25*C though. Performance drops 20% with a Tj temp of 100*C.

The CL0550 led as far as I understand it is an arrangement of 18s25p so 450 dies crammed together. :devil:



> and is this true?
> _"Marl Optosource’s new range of Citizen LEDs is not only its most efficient ever, but also includes what it believes is the world’s brightest production LED__."_ 155L/Watt is impressive.


At 17,675 theoretical lumens, it is the brightest LED I've heard of yet. 155L/Watt is not the most efficient LED, but they are not claiming that, only that it is Citizens most efficient to date. At highest drive currents their efficiency is more towards 100L/Watt if not worse.


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## blasterman (Mar 30, 2012)

The problem with large array type LED packages is they become difficult to control light distribution, and they require greater design consideration when it comes to thermal management. In the 5,000-10,000 (or greater) lumen category virtually all the high performing LED fixtures I've seen are in the individual ~2watt category and are spread out with individual optics to help with with thermal management.

Matter of fact, other than Chinese flood lights sold on E-bay for cheap I don't think I've seen a mainstream commercial light using the really big arrays, Bridgelux or otherwise. You'd think it would be simple to just slap a big Bridgelux or one of these on a big heat-sink, and you've had a halide or T5 or high pressure sodium killer, but I'm not sure who's going to use them.


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## Kinnza (Mar 31, 2012)

blasterman said:


> The problem with large array type LED packages is they become difficult to control light distribution, and they require greater design consideration when it comes to thermal management. In the 5,000-10,000 (or greater) lumen category virtually all the high performing LED fixtures I've seen are in the individual ~2watt category and are spread out with individual optics to help with with thermal management.
> 
> Matter of fact, other than Chinese flood lights sold on E-bay for cheap I don't think I've seen a mainstream commercial light using the really big arrays, Bridgelux or otherwise. You'd think it would be simple to just slap a big Bridgelux or one of these on a big heat-sink, and you've had a halide or T5 or high pressure sodium killer, but I'm not sure who's going to use them.



It would depend of the final price, of course. With the highest power model being sold below $55 for 83W (1.5A) up to 180W (3A), it really allows to build point-like light sources for cheap, as the power requirements falls between low voltage category, below 60V and 3A. Replacements for 70-100W HIDs at competitive price, same form factor, larger lifetime, instant turn on, dimmable and providing some electric saving. I believe that if you offer that with a decent quality product, definitively there is a market for it. 

The Chip on Aluminium allows to get a thermal resistance of 0.3K/W, 25ºC over heatsink for 83W. If it is true in the practice so there is only a little higher increase on temp due the thermal interface heatsink-LED (not requiring insulation), then a well designed 60ºC working heatsink does the job. Not so demanding so it should impact final price at all.


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## blasterman (Mar 31, 2012)

> it really allows to build point-like light sources for cheap



On the surface you would think so, but the fact remains there is a near total absence of high lumen, commercial fixtures using high density arrays (other than the usual Ebay offerings with those terrible generic arrays.) Bridgelux has offered >100 lumen per watt arrays in the several thousand lumen range for awhile, and while you'd think we'd be seeing this kind of tech go up all over the place in high bay fixtures and street/parking lot lights there's an almost total void of them. The trend still seems to be ~2watt individual emitters spread out and using individual optics. That *has* to cost more than using a single monolithing array for obvious reasons, but the fixture engineers seem to have other concerns we just aren't seeing.

A large array does require some special consideration when dealing with the core thermal path because that's a significant amount of energy that has to be spread out quickly, but I'm not sure if that's the issue.


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## SemiMan (Apr 1, 2012)

blasterman said:


> On the surface you would think so, but the fact remains there is a near total absence of high lumen, commercial fixtures using high density arrays (other than the usual Ebay offerings with those terrible generic arrays.) Bridgelux has offered >100 lumen per watt arrays in the several thousand lumen range for awhile, and while you'd think we'd be seeing this kind of tech go up all over the place in high bay fixtures and street/parking lot lights there's an almost total void of them. The trend still seems to be ~2watt individual emitters spread out and using individual optics. That *has* to cost more than using a single monolithing array for obvious reasons, but the fixture engineers seem to have other concerns we just aren't seeing.
> 
> A large array does require some special consideration when dealing with the core thermal path because that's a significant amount of energy that has to be spread out quickly, but I'm not sure if that's the issue.



It's all about optical control.

A 1mm die will require say a 10mm *20mm * 10mm optic with a volume of say 2 cubic-cm.

A 10mm * 10mm die will require an optic that is 100mm * 200mm * 100mm with a volume of 2,000 cubic cm versus the 200 of 100 individual optics.

Moulding a precision optical component that large is not trivial and material costs could come into play, not to mention the thickness of the resulting unit.

Then you can consider failure mechanisms, etc.

Single large dies are great for overlapped, lighting, i.e. high-bays where optical control is not as critical. For street lights and technical high-bays (i.e. row lighting), it becomes unwieldy.

Semiman


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## degarb (Apr 1, 2012)

I am looking forward to led work-lights. I wonder when I should start reading the fixed lighting section.:naughty:


I think I paid about $150 in 1990 for my first 10,000 lumen halogen, when they first hit the stores. It paid for it's self many times over.

Over the years, I have had cheap yellow dual head lights break after one use. I have had, working on a single house, where I went through $200 in bulbs from Lowes. -- Lesson learned: keep light small (less to break, more flexible usage) with standard 500 watt bulb (buy bulbs cheap as possible beforehand in bulk).

Now, in 2012, the price would need to compete with $15 halogens. So a good price for complete light would be $50 to $100 in 2012. But there are selling points: less bulb breakage (cold weather, knocking light over, power surge, touching bulb), 50k bulb hours v 2000 , possibly smaller lights with same or more power, less heat, more light on single breaker, less breaker tripping.


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## Lon (Apr 1, 2012)

Thanks for the info, I am lookin at getting a couple to try. Here is the newest bridgelux RS arrays, based on current draw, It should be about 14000 lumens and about 125w, manuf claims 115 L/watt.


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## blasterman (Apr 2, 2012)

I think Lon's got it 

From personal experience; if you're willing to mess with active cooling and just need floody light, these large arrays are an absurdly superior solution to halides and T5's. Once you add a 12volt, low RPM 120mm fan to a basic heatsink you can easily get into the 5,000-10,000 lumen range and stay above the 50,000 hour range in a package smaller than a halide housing. It's active cooling that generally scares off commercial customers. For personal design though go for it because it reduces your heat-sink mass by several orders.

Re: optics - Fresnels might be the solution here.


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## Optical Inferno (Apr 2, 2012)

Fresnels would definitely help but would still keep the overall light very floody. Like you guys said the thermal characteristics of these LED's mean that sure they output 17K lumens but for how long without proper heatsinking.


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## Lon (Apr 2, 2012)

Thanks blasterman, your help was very, well, helpful 
I ended up will all copper big heavy sinks, and am using a fan that moves 230 cubic feet of air/minute so I can run them hard.
I would think finding a driver for the citizens 60 volts would be tough. No?


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## blasterman (Apr 3, 2012)

In a low voltage environment bumping up to 60volts would be very awkward. Do-able with custom boost design I would guess.


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## Lon (Apr 3, 2012)

Yea, just not an easy set of specs to work with.
And Id say the thermal factor of such high wattage in such a small area is what limits real use of these big arrays.
Bridgelux sent me some info, had a pic of a guy who built highbays with them, to replace 400w metal halide. They needed a 8" star 4" solid middle about 12" long for passive sinking. Thats a chunk.
Watch how quick we will start to see these high wattage chinese ebay floods burn up. Just dont see those fixtures as enough heat sink, not for 30,000+ hours.


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## SemiMan (Apr 3, 2012)

Getting castings in China is relatively inexpensive. I don't see the heat sink being the issue. It will be everything between the LED and the heatsink that will be ... and the power supply.


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## bose301s (Apr 5, 2012)

This is not an LED, it is an array or module, LED means 1 chip.


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## Hoop (Apr 5, 2012)

"Issues" are simply designed around.

As mentioned in post #3, TaskLED's HyperBoost driver can power these LED's up to 2A for flashlight use. At 2A the CLL0550 would need about 57 volts and would output between 10,900 to 12,850 lumens. (@25*C Tj) As blasterman mentioned, active cooling would be ideal to cool it. A waterproof (IP55 rated) 12v pc fan could be powered with a DC-DC converter fairly efficiently. The whole light would consume around 130 watts. 

...Aluminum heatsinks are better off extruded than Cast.


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## Lon (Apr 8, 2012)

True, but then at those amperages its not the brightest production array


Hoop said:


> "Issues" are simply designed around.
> 
> As mentioned in post #3, TaskLED's HyperBoost driver can power these LED's up to 2A for flashlight use. At 2A the CLL0550 would need about 57 volts and would output between 10,900 to 12,850 lumens. (@25*C Tj) As blasterman mentioned, active cooling would be ideal to cool it. A waterproof (IP55 rated) 12v pc fan could be powered with a DC-DC converter fairly efficiently. The whole light would consume around 130 watts.
> 
> ...Aluminum heatsinks are better off extruded than Cast.


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## Hoop (Apr 8, 2012)

Lon said:


> True, but then at those amperages its not the brightest production array



Which are brighter?


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## Lon (Apr 9, 2012)

Just off manuf. specs, Im pushing the bridgelux brxa-9000 to about 13-14000 lumens, says 15000 at max amp.


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## degarb (Apr 10, 2012)

Heat sink: Could just have garden hose hookup, to make an ideal yard light.


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