# List of sub-CR2 size lights



## magellan (Apr 27, 2015)

By this I mean small lights taking 10180, 10220, 10280, 14250, etc., batteries.

I collect these lights and have compiled the following list. I'm interested in any I might have missed, or any corrections to my list.

The lights are listed in order of battery size.

Here it is:

10180 Steve Ku 38DD Ti

10180 Steve Ku 40DD BB

10180 Steve Ku 40DD Da

10180 Steve Ku Dogbone

10180 DQG Fairy

10180 DQG Spy

10180 DQG Hobi

10180 Lummi Wee (in Al, NS, SS, etc.)

10180 Veleno Designs Quantum D2 SS

10180 Veleno Helix Zi

10180 Modamag Drake

10220 Steve Ku 44DD Ti

10250 Peak Eiger (in Al, brass, stainless, etc.)

10280 Black Ti Draco

10280 Chrome Draco

10280 MBI-HF

10280 MBI HF-R

10250/10440 MBI HF-R Ti 

10280 TnC Nano Lux (in Al, brass, copper, stainless)

10280 TnC Micro-Lux (in Al, brass, copper, stainless, titanium)

10280 Tain Ottavino Damascus

10280 Tain Ottavino Ti

14250 Lummi Raw (in NS, Al, SS, Da)


Any additions, corrections, etc. would be appreciated.


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## Thud1023 (Apr 27, 2015)

Hi Magellan, maybe the DQG Hobi to fit in there with spy and fairy.
Regards,
Todd


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## magellan (Apr 27, 2015)

Great, I didn't recall that one. Thanks, Todd!

I seem to have a very vague memory of the name, but that's it. Will put it on the list.


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## nfetterly (Apr 27, 2015)

magellan said:


> By this I mean small lights taking 10180, 10220, 10280, 14250, etc., batteries.
> 
> I collect these lights and have compiled the following list. I'm interested in any I might have missed, or any corrections to my list.



Out of curiosity - do you have all of these!?!

I've had alot of them, (really only having elected to not do the Nano-lux, but may end up picking one up, would love to hear someone's opinion over PM) but currently only have;

10220 Steve Ku 44DD Ti - on my key chain since it arrived. Fantastic.
10180 Steve Ku 40DD BB - gifted one to Matt of AOTH, still have one
Chrome Draco - second custom light, currently MIA somewhere in my house. I'll put it up for sale when I find it. Great light, just prefer the other two.


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## Dirty wage guy (Apr 27, 2015)

Sorry to pollute your thread with my illiterate BS and stupid questions Mr. Magellan Sir, but I know you are the expert in regards to lights this size. So with that being said, is the 14250 battery close to the same size as a CR2? If so, will the 14250 work in a CR2 size light?
Thank you for your time Sir. Your knowledge and expertise is definitely appreciated.


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## magellan (Apr 27, 2015)

nfetterly said:


> Out of curiosity - do you have all of these!?!
> 
> I've had alot of them, (really only having elected to not do the Nano-lux, but may end up picking one up, would love to hear someone's opinion over PM) but currently only have;
> 
> ...



I have most of them but am still missing a few. Altogether I have 22 of these lights. The ones I'm missing are:

DQG Hobi (intend to order soon--only problem is the website is hard to figure out)
Drake
Peak Eiger
All the MBI models

I'm also missing some of the metals variations offered for the Lummi Wee and the same for the TnC lights, since they're offered in so many metals, but I hope to fill in those gaps eventually.


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## magellan (Apr 27, 2015)

Dirty wage guy said:


> Sorry to pollute your thread with my illiterate BS and stupid questions Mr. Magellan Sir, but I know you are the expert in regards to lights this size. So with that being said, is the 14250 battery close to the same size as a CR2? If so, will the 14250 work in a CR2 size light?
> Thank you for your time Sir. Your knowledge and expertise is definitely appreciated.



Not at all. It's actually a very good question. It's really a very confusing issue, especially for the neophyte flashlight user and I've seen other threads here discussing it. I'm still learning myself so if I say anything wrong the experts here can feel free to correct me.

The 14250 is slightly smaller in width and length than a CR2 battery, which is technically a 15270 in size. A 14250 is actually a 1/2 length AA size battery, but is 3.7V and not 1.4V like an AA alkaline or a 1.2V AA NiMH.

Similarly, a 3.0V CR2 battery is actually a different chemistry from a 3.7V 15270, although they're the same size. The 15270 is a lithium cobalt oxide battery at 3.7 volts and is rechargeable. The CR2 is a primary battery at 3.0V and is not rechargeable. You will often see these sold in drugstores by Energizer or Duracell, and are typically used in modern point and shoot cameras.

This gets confusing because you will see RCR2 batteries offered that are rechargeable and are 3.0V. I have some Orbtronic and Ultrafire cells like this. Both come in exactly the same color green wrapper, so it's easy to mistake the Ultrafire batteries for the Orbtronic. (Ultrafire, Trustfire, etc., batteries are not exactly considered high quality on this forum). I believe these are lithium iron phosphate chemistry. I have also read that some 3.0V RCR2 rechargeables are actually lithium cobalt 3.7V types with an internal resister to lower the output voltage. I'd like to confirm that as I've only seen it discussed here once.

So the bottom line is that, if a battery is labelled a CR2, it should always be 3.0V. An RCR2 rechargeable, from what I've seen, is also 3.0V, which they get using a different chemistry. A 15270 such as the ones from AW, a quality maker, is 3.7V. It basically all starts with the chemistry. If you know the chemistry associated with a particular voltage you can often figure it out. But often you don't know what chemistry a battery is using unless they say so.

The situation isn't helped by the fact that you will see CR2/15270 batteries sold on the web. 

It's the same for AAA/10440 size batteries, except the AAA is going is going to be an alkaline or NiMH at 1.2 or 1.5V and the 10440 is going to be a lithium cobalt oxide at 3.7V. Some flashlights, like the Peak Eiger, are able to use both. Some of the Peak and TnC lights do require the higher voltage of a 10440.

My impression is that most consumers who use CR2 batteries are using them in their cameras. If someone has a real CR2 or sub-CR2 size flashlight, this implies a more savvy flashlight user who is likely to have some knowledge of the issues relating to lithium ion batteries. For example, you knew enough to ask a question because you understood it's a somewhat complicated issue. Again, even knowing the right question to ask in this case implies a more knowledgeable user, one who is already learning about this potentially problematic but fascinating area. 

As this post is already getting rather long I'll have something to say about whether the 14250s can be used in a 15270 light in my next post.


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## magellan (Apr 27, 2015)

Hi DirtyWageGuy,

On your question about whether a 14250 will work in a CR2 size light, yes, sometimes they will work, mainly if the light has a tailcap with a spring like my 4Sevens Quark Mini MLR2, my Nitecore Sens Mini, and my Nitecore EZ. This is because the 14250 is a couple of millimeters shorter than the CR2/15270, but it still makes contact with the spring; it just doesn't compress it as much. There may be other lights where it will work that I don't know about. I think it will work in my Lummi Orb CR2 light, but I don't have one in front of me right now, but I'm looking at the 14250 version which does have a tail spring and it works fine in that.

However, since the 14250 battery is 3.7V and not 3.0V, you have to make sure the light is rated to take the higher voltage. Officially my Quark Mini isn't so rated but I and other members on the forum have tried them without disastrous results. There's still concern though that the emitter and driver circuit board are being pushed too hard, which might shorten longevity. Me, I usually run 3.0V batteries but if I do put a 3.7V in I just don't run it on high for too long because of the heat buildup which you can easily feel.

In so-called "battery crusher" type lights without a spring a battery that's not exactly the right length might not work because there's no spring. But you could put in a small washer or spacer if you really needed it to work.

Those were really good questions. Hope this helps!


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## Dirty wage guy (Apr 27, 2015)

Thank you for the info Sir! Exactly what I was looking for and some! You broke it down like a damn scientist for sure, talkin about the different molecular structures of batteries and what not, man I'm impressed how much you know about the subject and I can't thank you enough!
You rock!:rock:


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## magellan (Apr 27, 2015)

You're welcome DWG! And much of that knowledge came from hanging out here and reading all the posts by the many expert CPF members. Three cheers for the CPF!


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## archimedes (Apr 27, 2015)

I'll add to this post, as I think of more ...

Peak Shasta

Peak Baltic

Peak 2xLR44

Peak 10180

Peak 10250

Peak 10280

Peak 14250

PhotonFanatic LPK

Photon ( & "Fauxton" )

Photon ReX

Lummi/Orb Fliklite

TnC Keylux

TnC Micro-Flex

Nitecore Tube

ThruNite TiKey

TiFli

Pelican 1810

Pelican 1830 L4

Pelican 1990 MityLite 3N

Tekna Micro Lite

eGear PICO

Streamlight Nano

TranquillityBase 2/3AA custom

Klarus Mi X5

LED Lenser V10

Streamlight Stylus

Aunoc AAAA

... note that these are not in order of size, though


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## magellan (Apr 27, 2015)

Thanks, Archimedes, that's exactly what I was looking for. I'll add those to my list.


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## archimedes (Apr 27, 2015)

magellan said:


> Thanks, Archimedes, that's exactly what I was looking for. I'll add those to my list.


I like these challenges ...


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## magellan (Apr 27, 2015)

Glad you enjoyed it. That was quite a list. 

Now I need to get to work finding them!

Plus I'll have another thread soon that I'm going to post, which is for CR2 size lights.


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## archimedes (Apr 27, 2015)

magellan said:


> Glad you enjoyed it. That was quite a list.
> 
> Now I need to get to work finding them!
> ....



Some of those I listed may be difficult or near-impossible to acquire.

I've been looking for a TiKey and TiFli for years ... 

... and the Peak 2xLR44 is mythical :shrug:


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## magellan (Apr 28, 2015)

archimedes said:


> Some of those I listed may be difficult or near-impossible to acquire.
> 
> I've been looking for a TiKey and TiFli for years ...
> 
> ... and the Peak 2xLR44 is mythical :shrug:



Yes. I'm not expecting to ever own many of those. But if it were too easy I might get bored.


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## magellan (Jun 15, 2015)

Just an update, I recently picked up a Drake, two stainless steel Peak Eigers, one with the original narrow optic and the other with the mule head, a brass Peak Eiger, a MBI HF-R in titanium, and an HF-R red anodized aluminum model, which plugs a few more gaps in my collection. I also picked up a real oddity because of the battery it uses, a Coast V-16 Penlight, which uses the tiny BR435 3V battery. I include it here because it's a cylindrucal battery, not a coin type. It's a very thin, maybe 2 mm wide cylinder with about a 1/4 inch pin at the top (sorry about mixing measurements ). This brings my total to 28 different models and variations in the sub-CR2 size class. :naughty:

Dang, still 2 short of 30!


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## Thud1023 (Jun 15, 2015)

Awesome Magellan! May be time for a family pic.. : )


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## archimedes (Jun 15, 2015)

magellan said:


> ....I also picked up a real oddity because of the battery it uses, a Coast V-16 Penlight, which uses the tiny BR435 3V battery. I include it here because it's a cylindrucal battery, not a coin type. It's a very thin, maybe 2 mm wide cylinder with about a 1/4 inch pin at the top (sorry about mixing measurements )....



Interesting battery, a whole fifty milliamp-hours ...


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## magellan (Jun 15, 2015)

LOL

Yes, this is probably the wimpiest light I have. I think a Mag Solitaire is bright by comparison.


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## apisdorf (Jun 16, 2015)

How about the CQG S3? It uses a 1/2 AAA battery. Link included for reference (but available elsewhere as well): http://www.cnqualitygoods.com/goods.php?id=2205. 

Really small clicky. Very well machined.


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## magellan (Jun 16, 2015)

Many thanks! I didn't know that one. I'm going to order a couple. They're only $12.

The battery might be a 10220, instead of a 10180 or 10280.


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## apisdorf (Jun 16, 2015)

Definitely not a 10180. The battery is taller than a 10180. The only markings are: "Ni-MH 1/2AAA 250mAh 1.2V". The light came with a spacer which is used to allow the battery to be charged like a regular Ni-MH AAA battery. Coolest thing about the light is that I could not figure out at first how to remove the battery. The stainless steel body is so well machined that I thought it was one solid cylinder.


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## magellan (Jun 16, 2015)

Very cool about the machining.

Yeah, I should know this as I really like these small lights, but the half AAA is even rarer than the 10180 which is the 1/3 AAA and the 10280 or N size or 2/3 AAA, but these are rarer I believe.

Okay, looking at my collection of "fractional" AAA batteries I have just two that are 10220. But these are 3.7V, not 1.2V NiMH. I have lots of the 10180 and 10280, which are also 3.7V cells, but only two of these. Comparing them to my black Eneloop X they are indeed 1/2 AAA size, but they are lithium ion, not NiMH. 

It says 120 mAh on the side, in between the 180 mAh of the 10280 and the 70 mAh of the 10180, which makes sense. It's interesting that your 1/2 AAA NiMH is 250 mAh hours and yet the same size 10220 is only 120 mAh, since lithium ion is supposed to have 2 to 3 times the energy density of NiMH. I'm no expert though, am still learning this stuff, so maybe one of the experts here will comment on our observations.

This might help. I just found this chart at the powerstream.com website:

http://www.powerstream.com/Size.htm


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## apisdorf (Jun 17, 2015)

Timing is everything: My brother came by this morning with a battery for a tiny flashlight he and I used to have on our keychains. The battery is a BR435 3V and the flashlight is similar to one I just found here: https://www.maxmax.com/aFlashLED_SubMini.htm

About as small as you can get with a cylinder battery.


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## magellan (Jun 17, 2015)

Right. I have the Coast version of that light. Not really very bright but thinner than a straw.


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## WarRaven (Jun 17, 2015)

magellan said:


> Right. I have the Coast version of that light. Not really very bright but thinner than a straw.


Same here.
Was thrown in on a deal iirc.
In my battery box somewhere.


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## glow-monkey (Jun 29, 2015)

I would love to see comparative photos of all (or even some) of these! -?


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## magellan (Jul 2, 2015)

I should do an updated group photo since I now have 37 different sub-CR2 lights. I'll get on that this weekend so stay tuned.

In fact I just received three DQG Hobi's in brass, stainless, and titanium. So I now have the DQG Spy, Fairy, and Hobi 10180 lights. Am I missing any DQG lights?

Welcome to the forum!


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## StandardBattery (Jan 7, 2017)

I'd like to add the 10180 based *CooYoo Fermion* light to the list. This is a very cool little light. The Stainless Steel version (not sure if there are any others) it really nice and the housing seems very well built. Very nice square threads and good o-rings, much better than the little 10180 neck lights in terms of robustness. I'm impressed with the build of this light.


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## LightObsession (May 24, 2017)

StandardBattery said:


> I'd like to add the 10180 based *CooYoo Fermion* light to the list. This is a very cool little light. The Stainless Steel version (not sure if there are any others) it really nice and the housing seems very well built. Very nice square threads and good o-rings, much better than the little 10180 neck lights in terms of robustness. I'm impressed with the build of this light.



That Fermion looks almost to cute not to buy. I could find only one review of it and there were only two posts The 6000 to 7000 color temperature is what concerns me is it blue looking or more white? The features and form factor would seem to be quite useful. 

What is the mode sequence and UI?


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## Cemoi (Jan 7, 2019)

Hi all,

I've only found out this very interesting list today, thanks.

Magellan, you might add a 10220 DQG XP-G2 Stainless Steel, currently sold by Banggood.

I wonder which, among all these flashlights, can still be currently purchased and where.

Also, the DQG charger doesn't seem to be on sale with the chinese websites. Any suggestion for an alternate charger for these tiny Li-Ion batteries?

Thanks in advance


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## Cemoi (Jan 12, 2019)

Cemoi said:


> the DQG charger doesn't seem to be on sale with the chinese websites


Sorry, I was wrong: it is still available at Fasttech.


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## magellan (Jan 12, 2019)

Thanks for updating that.

Nice to see some action on this interesting, old thread.


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## The Freak (Sep 25, 2020)

There seems to be a new 10180 flashlight on aliexpress, a red/black/grey aluminium or bare stainless one (or so they say). Seems to be a generic thingy, some brand names: wasaga, wasafire, meetoo, atcomm, aacom etc. It looks like it has insides as an astrolux M01/M02/M03. Not all that notable other then the interesting price: I just ordered one for €8.75 including shipping, so it might be great for cheap modding.


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## mcbrat (Sep 25, 2020)

> 14250 Lummi Raw (in NS, Al, SS, Da)



Need to ad Ag (.925 Silver) to the list for 14250 Lummi Raw.


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## night.hoodie (Sep 25, 2020)

Hello 2015, when there were few enough tiny lights to list. 

Browsing Fasttech, I noticed Fenix has, or had at least, some 10180 lights, the Fenix UC02, in at least a few ano colors, and the UC02SS in stainless. Also seen at Fasttech in 10180: Blackwater Kite in a few ano colors and stainless, TrustFire MINI2, TrustFire MINI07, MecArmy FM11 right angle, MecArmy X2S in various colors, MecArmy X4S in various colors, MecArmy illumineX-1 , MecArmy illumineX-2, MecArmy illumineX-3Y in various colors, MecArmy illumineX-4 in 5 colors, MecArmy BL47 bullet light, Wuben G341, Wuben G342, Wuben G343, Sunwayman COMET in Al or Ti, Klarus Mini One, Astrolux M2, and JetBeam NITEYE MINI-1 in silver or copper colors. A few of these listed were discontinued and no longer available.

Also notable, George7806 sells some nice custom 10180 lights, and RPM has a couple different Ti CR2 bodies for E Series :rock:


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## lightknot (Sep 25, 2022)

TranquillityBase 2/3AA custom = Unobtanium


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## Jean-Luc Descarte (Sep 25, 2022)

Since we're necro-ing, the list cannot be without the Lumintop Frog and GT Nano models. They've essentially made 10180 mainstream knowledge.


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## ampdude (Oct 13, 2022)

Haha, I used to have an incan pen light that used a BR435 3V. I also remember it making a Maglite Solitaire look like a pocket rocket.


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## Jay R (Oct 20, 2022)

apisdorf said:


> Timing is everything: My brother came by this morning with a battery for a tiny flashlight he and I used to have on our keychains. The battery is a BR435 3V and the flashlight is similar to one I just found here: https://www.maxmax.com/aFlashLED_SubMini.htm
> 
> About as small as you can get with a cylinder battery.


That's huge compared to an Olight X9R Cell.


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## DaveTheDude (Oct 22, 2022)

To add to the list of sub-CR2 lights, didn't CountyComm sell a brass "Peanut" light that used a 10180 cell? Also MecArmy, and JetBeam, and Lumintop?


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