# Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning - Poll added



## jhc37013 (Oct 3, 2011)

As is being discussed in a review thread of the TM11 there seems to be problems with the TM11 and thought it should have it's own thread so here goes.

Anyone who has a TM11 does your light cut off, blink and light up different emitters and other strange things after you run it on max, mine does? It started when I ran it on max for 7 minutes and then it started doing it only a few seconds after turn on.

I've now seen a few other members with the same issue and I'm not sure what the problem is, I tried several different 18650's and fresh primary's.

It got worse the more I ran it having this odd behavior on all modes plus only one of the three emitters would light up, the light would turn off for nearly a minute at a time and suddenly turn back on, lots of flickering and other strange behavior. I contacted my dealer and they was just awesome with communication and it's already on it's way back but I'm seriously worried about the replacement as well.


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## varuscelli (Oct 4, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

Well, here's a repeat of the relevant part of what I posted in the TM11f preview thread:



varuscelli said:


> I wasn't going to make much of a deal about getting one of these, but I took a chance, too. The one I received has a variation of the same behavior.
> 
> It's very random and takes place only when I turn the light on in turbo mode and only near the beginning of use in turbo mode (first couple of minutes). Mine will either flicker once (a quick flicker) or blink off for a second or blink off and stay that way several seconds before coming back on -- or randomly stay off for a long time once it blinks off. But this behavior is not when the light has been on turbo for a few minutes. Instead, it happens anywhere from 20 or 30 seconds on up to a minute or two from a cold start. And when it doesn't come back on of its own accord, it's not as if it goes into standby mode (the red lights don't blink as in standby mode). It seems to go into lockout mode (some of the times) when it stays off since pressing the switch does not always turn it back on again (sometimes it does, sometimes it doesn't). I've got a feeling a few bad ones made their way into distribution.
> 
> I'm using freshly charged AW 2200s, for what it's worth.





varuscelli said:


> Mine was purchased from LightJunction, too.
> 
> It seems to be all over the place as far as the flickering/blinking/cutting off completely. When it cuts off, it does so for anywhere from one second to several seconds then comes back on in most cases. I had a couple of instances where it cut off and stayed off for an extended time, as though in lockout mode (no blinking red power indicator).
> 
> ...



I also tested new Redilast 3100s and got the same results (flickering, blinking off and back on, shutting off for a few seconds at a time, etc.).


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## jhc37013 (Oct 4, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

Thanks varuscelli I'm going to email Nitecore this thread once we get a couple others to report in, hopefully it can be addressed swiftly because I really like the UI and size/feel of the light and the output was amazing.


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## varuscelli (Oct 4, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*



jhc37013 said:


> I contacted my dealer and they was just awesome with communication and it's already on it's way back but I'm seriously worried about the replacement as well.



Did the vendor have any ideas that they shared with you about the problem? And did you mention that there were others apparently having the same issues? 

Looks like I've got to go through the return process, too, so I guess I need to figure out if I need an official RMA, etc. I suppose I'll have to contact them tomorrow. Ugh, what a disappointing situation. It's a shame to be dealing with these issues, especially with such general excited anticipation associated with release of the TM11.

I wonder if Alex (276) will chime in with a bit more on his situation with the TM11 as mentioned in the TM11 preview thread.


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## jhc37013 (Oct 4, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

I got mine from LightJunction and they sent me a address to send it to, no RMA. In the original email I sent I did not mention that other members share the same problem because I didn't know that at the time but they have been great with communications and I just told them via PM on CPFM.

A+ to LightJunction for their good communications and they get theirs from the same place as other dealers so I hope no one assumes it's a bad place to order a TM11, it happens but it's just a bummer it happened with such a cool light and expensive one to ship back.


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## 2100 (Oct 4, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

All lights will have growing pains, no worries. Budget lights, branded lights, doesn't matter. Key is the level of support offered. With quite a few budget lights you don't even get spare parts to replace! LOL! The level of support offered for your return shipping (might not be outright coverage via monetary PP terms) that i leave it to the individual. The good thing in this round is that you definitely will be getting the support you need, from what I see. 

I can understand how you feel, because i experienced that before a few times and that's with the branded lights.


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## jhc37013 (Oct 4, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

Your right 2100 and that's why I'm not mad or anything, I have bought light's from just about every manufacturer and I can't think of one mass producing brand that I haven't had a major problem or a bug of some sort, and that goes for everything from a budget light to a $300 light. It's just simply the way it is and it's something you have to expect if you buy a lot of light's especially "just released" light's, no of course it should not be like that no matter the price but it is.

Before all the madness from my TM11 it was amazing and I have no problem waiting a little longer to get that one that will serve me for years to come, I just want to be certain me and the other members who have problems was just really unlucky and that this problem is not widespread, I know there has been lots of TM11's already sold and in people's hands so will see.

My advice is when you get your TM11 burn it on max output for a extended amount of time and see what happens and then do it again a couple more times, do the same thing for the 1100 lumen daily mode.


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## 2100 (Oct 4, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

I think some guys have not received their lights yets, because the shops (non-US) just received stock yesterday.


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## varuscelli (Oct 4, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

With some luck, it might be that there is an isolated batch of lights affected and not all of them that are shipping. It seems unlikely that something like this would go unnoticed if a large number of light was affected, but I guess you never know. It's not so much the hassle on the individual level as on the individual plus vendor level with all the returns, extra shipping, dealing with the manufacturer, etc. Kind of an ordeal for everyone involved, and the more lights affected the bigger the overall hassle to resolve to everyone's satisfaction. I guess we'll see how widespread the problem is once we start hearing from others (both buyers and sellers).


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## jhc37013 (Oct 4, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

varuscelli are you sending your back today and have you contacted your dealer?


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## varuscelli (Oct 4, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

I sent them an e-mail so I'm pretty sure I'll hear something at some point on Tuesday (Oct. 4). I've basically just boxed it back up and am waiting for instructions from the dealer.


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## roadkill1109 (Oct 4, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

*POOF* and just like that, I'm cancelling my order to buy a TM11 until this is sorted out. 

Thanks for the post guys!


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## jhc37013 (Oct 4, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*



roadkill1109 said:


> *POOF* and just like that, I'm cancelling my order to buy a TM11 until this is sorted out.
> 
> Thanks for the post guys!



You might to reconsider there has only been three or four of of us reported this and no telling how many sold, at least consider waiting until other owners report or ask your dealer if they mind testing your light.


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## roadkill1109 (Oct 4, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*



jhc37013 said:


> You might to reconsider there has only been three or four of of us reported this and no telling how many sold, at least consider waiting until other owners report or ask your dealer if they mind testing your light.



Yeah thanks. I'll have my supplier test the light and if he recommends getting it, then so be it.


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## Baddog (Oct 4, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*


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## Craig K (Oct 4, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

I was thinking about getting one of these but now I am nervous.


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## jhc37013 (Oct 4, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*



Craig K said:


> I was thinking about getting one of these but now I am nervous.



Not to long ago when the SC600 was released I was one of the first to get that as well and I had a switch that turned on if you just barely touched it, one day latter probably 5 or 6 others reported the same thing. Turned out it was a goof during assembly and it was addressed immediately and the problem dropped just as quick as it started, there was quite a few people (deservedly so) who considered cancelling there order but it seemed most stuck with it. 

Now out of those who stuck with it we only seen maybe two or three out of many many sold with the switch problem and after that initial batch was gone no one reported any more problems and now the SC600 is one of the very best EDC's you can buy. I think this is how the TM11 is going to play out, a few here and there with problems but we will see the problem just go away as quickly as it came.


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## Baddog (Oct 4, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

none should be shipped without quality control by the manufacturer and NOW by the retailer given everyone is aware of an issue.


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## roadkill1109 (Oct 4, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*



Baddog said:


> none should be shipped without quality control by the manufacturer and NOW by the retailer given everyone is aware of an issue.



i guess in their rush to get it out the gate, they 'forgot' to test it! haha....

but im sure the 2nd or 3rd batch of these will be sorted out. 

i guess its usual to see problems with the 1st batch of lights. even other brands suffer the same issues. ZL's, SWM's etc etc etc...

Does anybody have problems with first batches of Fenix or 4Sevens lights? How about the Jetbeams, are their 1st batch of new lights error free?

I'll probably get my TM11 by mid or later part of next year. Just in time for the end of the world 2012! LOLZ! hahaha


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## Hogokansatsukan (Oct 4, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

Mine arrived and I'm using primaries (Duracell). Ran it on turbo for about 4 minutes and no issues. Will run a longer test tonight. So far, this has got to be one of my favorite lights. Battery voltage has ranged from 6.0 to 5.9 depending on if the light was just run or not. UI is pretty slick. Light produced is quite nice and the tint is great. Compared it to my SR91 and S18 Maelstrom. The TM11 has a bigger hotspot so throw will not be as good, but the amount of light it kicks out is insane. I'll drain those primaries tonight and report what I find, but so far, so good.


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## 2100 (Oct 4, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*



Hogokansatsukan said:


> Mine arrived and I'm using primaries (Duracell). Ran it on turbo for about 4 minutes and no issues. Will run a longer test tonight. So far, this has got to be one of my favorite lights. Battery voltage has ranged from 6.0 to 5.9 depending on if the light was just run or not. UI is pretty slick. Light produced is quite nice and the tint is great. Compared it to my SR91 and S18 Maelstrom. The TM11 has a bigger hotspot so throw will not be as good, but the amount of light it kicks out is insane. I'll drain those primaries tonight and report what I find, but so far, so good.



Much appreciated! You do not have 18650s?


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## Johndrmr (Oct 4, 2011)

Drove over to light junction and picked up a TM-11 this past friday. Haven't had any problems with mine. Ran it for 15min on turbo today and it didn't flicker or turn off. I did notice the thermal protection kicking in and lowering output but then raising output once it cooled off. Hope the bad ones were just a bad batch. At least if I have problems I won't have to worry about shipping since I live 10min from light junction. Bad for my wallet :-/ 
It is an amazing light! The amount of output for the size is jaw dropping. It makes my m21x seem downright wimpy and the olight is no slouch. UI is also great. 

Sent from my SCH-I800 using Tapatalk


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## varuscelli (Oct 4, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*



Johndrmr said:


> I did notice the thermal protection kicking in and lowering output but then raising output once it cooled off.



Do you have an idea about how long it ran on turbo before the thermal protection kicked in? I realize that things like ambient temperature will likely affect the timing on that, but on mine I don't think I ever saw it kick in. I'm thinking that whatever problems were going on with mine it might have also inhibited the thermal protection mode. But I also don't think I ran mine for over seven minutes (I timed it every time trying to see when the cut-offs happened, so I know how long I ran it each time). I was somewhat apprehensive about running it longer in turbo mode given the glitchy behavior. After about 5 minutes, I know the light was getting pretty hot, so I'd always turn it off...but once again, I never noticed it lowering the output while I was running it.


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## Hogokansatsukan (Oct 4, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*



2100 said:


> Much appreciated! You do not have 18650s?



All mine are flat tops. I had just gotten some AW2900, and now find myself placing another order for 18650's for this light.
I'll most likely pick up some AW2600 just for this.
As it is, I keep about 150 CR123 primaries on hand, so burning through 8 is no big deal.


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## Johndrmr (Oct 4, 2011)

I didn't really time it but it was probably about 5-6min. It was about the time when the light got hot enough that I started thinking about looking for the oven mitt. Haha. I could definitely see an abrupt decrease in output(still extremely bright) and then an abrupt increase. This cycle would continue until I turned the light off. Honestly, I can't see myself using turbo mode for extended periods. 1100 lumens on high usually gets the job done  Definitely never cut off on me though.

Sent from my SCH-I800 using Tapatalk


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## varuscelli (Oct 4, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*



Johndrmr said:


> I didn't really time it but it was probably about 5-6min. It was about the time when the light got hot enough that I started thinking about looking for the oven mitt. Haha. I could definitely see an abrupt decrease in output(still extremely bright) and then an abrupt increase. This cycle would continue until I turned the light off. Honestly, I can't see myself using turbo mode for extended periods. 1100 lumens on high usually gets the job done  Definitely never cut off on me though.



Thanks, John. And I agree -- I think the turbo use on these things is intended for brief spurts at a time and not extended use, even with the thermal protection. When the TM11 hit the 5-minute-plus time frame, it definitely turned into a hot potato (warmest light I've ever held). And again, with the glitchiness of the one I received, I was worried that it wouldn't shift into thermal protection mode at all, so I'd just manually shut it off between 5 and 7 minutes when I was testing it.


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## duro (Oct 4, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

I wonder if the dry xml is a better overall value? http://cnqualitygoods.com/goods.php?id=1177


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## jhc37013 (Oct 5, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

Looking at this thread and others it seems there is now more good TM11's than bad so this is a really good sign, fingers crossed the bad ones are all reported and we can forget this thread eventually and move on to the good stuff.


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## candle lamp (Oct 5, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

I'm waiting to see the runtime graph by the reviewer.
Wish the problem to be settled soon.

KH


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## vinhnguyen54 (Oct 5, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

I ran my TM11 for about 5 minutes on turbo and the light constantly shift from turbo to High. Just back and forth. Extremely annoying. My batteries runs fine in other lights so I am unsure if it's the quality of my batteries or not....


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## jhc37013 (Oct 5, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*



vinhnguyen54 said:


> I ran my TM11 for about 5 minutes on turbo and the light constantly shift from turbo to High. Just back and forth. Extremely annoying. My batteries runs fine in other lights so I am unsure if it's the quality of my batteries or not....



Do you think that is how the thermal works I really never got a chance to see it, not to alarm you but now that I think about it that is the behavior I seen at about the 6-7 minute mark before it went down hill from there.

What battery's are you using I've seen that happen with other light's when I use lower quality cells like Ultrafire in high drain light's? Do you mind running it again possibly for a few minutes longer?


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## 2100 (Oct 5, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

Maybe you guys can use a fan or something to cool the light and see if it shifts at the same time.


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## varuscelli (Oct 5, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*



vinhnguyen54 said:


> I ran my TM11 for about 5 minutes on turbo and the light constantly shift from turbo to High. Just back and forth. Extremely annoying. My batteries runs fine in other lights so I am unsure if it's the quality of my batteries or not....



To clarify, can you tell us if you mean it did this _during _the first 5 minutes or _after _the first 5 minutes? 

On mine, I never saw a shift from turbo to a lower level, but I also never ran the light for more than about 7 minutes. 

If anyone who has a TM11 that's operating correctly could share their experiences, I'd be interested in hearing how long it generally takes for the thermal protection to kick in and output to drop in a setting with something along the lines of average indoor room temperature.


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## jhc37013 (Oct 5, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*



varuscelli said:


> If anyone who has a TM11 that's operating correctly could share their experiences, I'd be interested in hearing how long it generally takes for the thermal protection to kick in and output to drop in a setting with something along the lines of average indoor room temperature.



I tell ya I expected more member experiences with the TM11 by now, I know it's still early but there was apparently a lot sold and shipped. Surely over the next day or two we'll get more input.


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## varuscelli (Oct 5, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*



jhc37013 said:


> Looking at this thread and others it seems there is now more good TM11's than bad so this is a really good sign, fingers crossed the bad ones are all reported and we can forget this thread eventually and move on to the good stuff.



So...did you ask for a replacement or a refund on your return? 

I'm sending mine back today and they've given me the option to specify replacement or refund, pending (I believe) their inspection and verification of the problem(s).


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## utlgoa (Oct 5, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

My TM 11 is sitting at the Post Office. I Emailed lightjunction and asked them if I should try the light or just send it back.


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## varuscelli (Oct 5, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*



jhc37013 said:


> I tell ya I expected more member experiences with the TM11 by now, I know it's still early but there was apparently a lot sold and shipped. Surely over the next day or two we'll get more input.



There's also the possibility that only a small percentage of the TM11s were affected with perhaps a bad part or some glitch in the production process (maybe a remote possibility, but still...). It will be interesting to see how widespread the problems are. I think so far we've seen...how many? Four users among initial recipients reporting problems on the forum? On the surface, that doesn't look good, but maybe we were just unlucky. I guess we'll see as more time passes and more people provide feedback here and elsewhere.


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## varuscelli (Oct 5, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*



utlgoa said:


> My TM 11 is sitting at the Post Office. I Emailed lightjunction and asked them if I should try the light or just send it back.



I bet member opinion here will be that you should at least test it and see. I don't think there has been anything like a recall issued, so I'd give it a go and see if it works. If there are any problems, you can still send it back.


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## Hogokansatsukan (Oct 5, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

OK. So ran a test on mine last night and timed it. 
I'm using Duracell CR123 primaries. Light stated the voltage was 6.1 when I started.
Put the TM11 on max. 
After about 10 seconds, the battery indicator started flashing.
After two minutes, the light was starting to get very warm and continued until seven minutes when I shut the light off. At 7 minutes, you are looking for an oven mit. There was no odd behavior and no thermal step down. I have no idea how hot the light was, but much longer and it would be difficult to hold without a glove.
Tested the batteris after the 7 minutes and the light read them at 5.7. After sitting for two minutes, the batteries when back up to 6.0.
I don't think I would run this light for extended periods on high even with the thermal shut down, at least not without gloves on or I move back to MN in February and do the test outside.
I can say it is not behaving oddly at all, and it has become one of my favorite lights.
The tint is better than my S18 or SR91 (in fact the TM11 makes the tints on my other high output lights look sick). The SR91 has the tightest hotspot, followed by the S18, with the TM11 having the biggest hotspot.
I have to say, using the light at night gives me that evil grin I've been looking for. 
I hope you guys get yours sorted out.
I think the issue with one LED cutting out and back on would have to do with the voltage regulator, as the light has one for each LED. Just a guess.


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## varuscelli (Oct 5, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

Hogokansatsukan: Since you've already tested with primaries, do you also have any 18650 batteries on hand to test? I'm curious if there's perhaps a difference in performance between primaries and rechargeables in one that performs fine on primaries.


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## xed888 (Oct 5, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*



Hogokansatsukan said:


> OK. So ran a test on mine last night and timed it.
> I'm using Duracell CR123 primaries. Light stated the voltage was 6.1 when I started.
> Put the TM11 on max.
> After about 10 seconds, the battery indicator started flashing.
> ...



I believe the primaries are unable to cope with the current draw of the LEDs. I tried 2 primaries once with a Nailbender drop-in and the batts got really hot!

Still doesnt explain the weird behaviour of the lights though.


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## varuscelli (Oct 5, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

I did a couple of roughly 4-minute videos just to document the problems I'm having with the TM11 in turbo mode. I'm not making them a public posting on YouTube or anything, but I do have them posted as unlisted videos (viewable by link only via YouTube). 

I'm posting both videos here since they're relevant to the thread, although I might remove them later. These don't represent a rant about a bad light or anything -- just an attempt to show what I'm seeing. 

The first video shows random flickering, blinks and brief light cut-offs. The second video shows a example of not being able to switch the light on and an extended light cut-off (more than 30 seconds). 

Note: I got similar behavior testing with SureFire CR123A primaries and rechargeable 18650 batteries (AW 2200 and Redilast 3100).


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## Hogokansatsukan (Oct 5, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*



varuscelli said:


> Hogokansatsukan: Since you've already tested with primaries, do you also have any 18650 batteries on hand to test? I'm curious if there's perhaps a difference in performance between primaries and rechargeables in one that performs fine on primaries.



I ordered 8 AW 2200 18650's from Lighthound this morning. I have the AW2900, but they are flat tops and don't work in the light (I tried). Should have those in by Friday (fingers crossed), so I can test this weekend.




xed888 said:


> I believe the primaries are unable to cope with the current draw of the LEDs. I tried 2 primaries once with a Nailbender drop-in and the batts got really hot!
> 
> Still doesnt explain the weird behaviour of the lights though.



So far, mine on primaries is fine and the Duracells seem to handle the current draw. Once the AW's arrive, we'll see how it does on those.


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## Johndrmr (Oct 5, 2011)

Mine definitely doesn't have the problem shown in the video. I think an exchange would be the best thing for you.
Sent from my SCH-I800 using Tapatalk


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## gsteve (Oct 5, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

mine should be here any day. I cancelled my order for 2 JB rtt 3xmls. Hope i dont regret it


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## varuscelli (Oct 5, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*



Hogokansatsukan said:


> I ordered 8 AW 2200 18650's from Lighthound this morning. I have the AW2900, but they are flat tops and don't work in the light (I tried). Should have those in by Friday (fingers crossed), so I can test this weekend.
> 
> So far, mine on primaries is fine and the Duracells seem to handle the current draw. Once the AW's arrive, we'll see how it does on those.



As a new note, I found that I had enough new SureFire CR123As that I was able to test briefly with those. 

I didn't want to run those down since they were the only ones I had, but left them in long enough to see the light blink off for about 2 seconds at something like the 10 second mark from switching it on. 

So my TM11 has been tested with AW 2200s, Redilast 3100s, and SureFire CR123A primaries and the light continued the glitchy behavior with all. 

To me, for those of us unlucky enough to have received a malfunctioning TM11, it looks like it's probably going to misbehave no matter which batteries are used.


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## Hogokansatsukan (Oct 5, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*



varuscelli said:


> As a new note, I found that I had enough new SureFire CR123As that I was able to test briefly with those.
> 
> I didn't want to run those down since they were the only ones I had, but left them in long enough to see the light blink off for about 2 seconds at something like the 10 second mark from switching it on.
> 
> ...



It doesn't sound like a battery issue. I don't know how many of these went out, but at least we know that some are working as they should. It's always a risk getting getting a just released anything and does not seem to matter what, car, firearm, flashlight... there are always a few in the first run with some "issues".
I'm by no means a Nitecore fanboy, or any specific flashlight fanboy, but I have loved the NDI and SR3. The TM11 just passed my SC600, S18, and ST6-460NW for my newest, coolest light. Hope the issues are limited and your replacements run like they should.


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## utlgoa (Oct 5, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

*Hey Lightjunction!*

Kudos to your Customer Service Department regarding the TM-11, and its first production run. I didn't even pick up my light at the post office yet, but after receiving your email addressing my concerns about this flashlight, and knowing that I can return it for a refund or replacement has earned you "My Most Trusted Website".


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## 276 (Oct 5, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

My issues are different from the video, Yesterday when i got my fourth Redilast 2600 i test this light on low, medium, and High. Onl low and medium i tested the light for ten minutes and had no issues what so ever then later after the light was cold i ran the light on High (110 lumens) for 20 mins. In the first 16 minutes had very little flickering then between 16-20 minutes there was 4 big flickers. 

Now i don't know if that thermal management kicking in but it doesn't seem normal to me. Then today i ran it on Turbo for ten minutes within the first minute it went from Turbo to low then back to turbo, followed by more flickering. then later about 8 minutes in it went from turbo to low again, stayed in low for about 15 seconds then back to turbo. I have tried email nitecore about all this and its been four days since i sent then two emails and i got nothing. I am unsure whether i should send this in for a replacement but i think i will.

Alex


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## jhc37013 (Oct 5, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

Good video varuscelli and great commentary I felt I was watching a weatherman during bad storms. I'll have to say mine was worse, blinking more, turning off for longer periods and emitters cutting off and on usually two of the emitters would go out. I told Lightjunction I want a replacement because I still have faith in the model just not the one I had, LJ was great and vowed to send me a working model or offer refund if I want, I can't say enough how well they have treated me throughout.


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## varuscelli (Oct 5, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*



276 said:


> My issues are different from the video, Yesterday when i got my fourth Redilast 2600 i test this light on low, medium, and High. Onl low and medium i tested the light for ten minutes and had no issues what so ever then later after the light was cold i ran the light on High (110 lumens) for 20 mins. In the first 16 minutes had very little flickering then between 16-20 minutes there was 4 big flickers.
> 
> Now i don't know if that thermal management kicking in but it doesn't seem normal to me. Then today i ran it on Turbo for ten minutes within the first minute it went from Turbo to low then back to turbo, followed by more flickering. then later about 8 minutes in it went from turbo to low again, stayed in low for about 15 seconds then back to turbo. I have tried email nitecore about all this and its been four days since i sent then two emails and i got nothing. I am unsure whether i should send this in for a replacement but i think i will.
> 
> Alex



I think you should probably go ahead and contact the vendor (I mean, if you haven't already). It might be doubtful whether you'll hear back from NiteCore directly, but I could be wrong. 

You know, the more ways these glitches manifest themselves, in some ways the scarier it is. That is, one buyer can say, "Well, my TM11 is good because it's not doing what that other guy's TM11 is doing." Then, like with yours, it does something equally bad but different from what the other guy's is doing. Mine's doing one strange set of things, yours is doing another, jch37013 has one that has a slightly different set of symptoms -- it's all pretty bizarre -- but hopefully isolated to a few lights. 

I'd definitely say that anyone who gets one should put it through its paces early on. You'd hate to sit on it for a month or two using it perhaps lightly then have something come up somewhere down the line. Then again, I sure didn't have to run mine much before I started seeing the unusual behavior.


----------



## varuscelli (Oct 6, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*



jhc37013 said:


> Good video varuscelli and great commentary I felt I was watching a weatherman during bad storms. I'll have to say mine was worse, blinking more, turning off for longer periods and emitters cutting off and on usually two of the emitters would go out. I told Lightjunction I want a replacement because I still have faith in the model just not the one I had, LJ was great and vowed to send me a working model or offer refund if I want, I can't say enough how well they have treated me throughout.



Hey, thanks. I don't think I've ever done a video with active narration, so I was a bit out of my element and had to wing it as I went along. Some of my comments were probably a bit foolish from a technical standpoint, but at I at least gave it a shot. 

Isn't the variety of symptoms we're getting kind of strange? There seems to be some crossover, but you're seeing some things that I'm not seeing, Alex is seeing a couple of different things...(very odd). 

I'm not sending mine back until tomorrow, but I'm a bit torn over whether to ask for an immediate replacement or to get a refund and wait. This is really a cool light, but I'm getting those feelings of "once bitten, twice shy" in terms of having them send out an immediate replacement. It's kind of a bummer to get a good deal on price and shipping only to have that go away with return shipping and the possibility of maybe having to do the same thing again. It's probably doubtful it would happen second time, but Murphy's Law could always kick in. 

And I agree completely -- the vendor is being as courteous and accommodating as they can be in this. There are reasons they have such a good reputation (it's well deserved). None of this is the fault of the vendor, of course, although it's possible that the NiteCore folks may not have been as conscientious as they should have been with quality checks. But still, stuff gets by at times so it might have even been difficult for the manufacturer to catch whatever is going on with these. With the complexity of many of the flashlights these days -- man...there's just more that can potentially go wrong than there's ever been. Ahh, well.


----------



## Hogokansatsukan (Oct 6, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

Will be interesting to find out what the issue is. I'm going to be running mine a lot this weekend on a camping trip so we'll see what happens. Will have the S18 on standby just in case. I hope this is a limited thing as the light I have seems to work just fine, and I'm liking it more and more. I think there is a serial number on the side. I've got mine wrapped in plastic right now molding a holster for it so I can't check at the moment, but it would be interesting to see the S/N's of those that are having issues vs. those that are not.


----------



## 276 (Oct 6, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

I will be sending light junction an email tonight asking for an exchange, i already told them of the issues i have had but really wanted to hear from nitecore on this but i can no longer wait.

Alex


----------



## varuscelli (Oct 6, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*



Hogokansatsukan said:


> Will be interesting to find out what the issue is. I'm going to be running mine a lot this weekend on a camping trip so we'll see what happens. Will have the S18 on standby just in case. I hope this is a limited thing as the light I have seems to work just fine, and I'm liking it more and more. I think there is a serial number on the side. I've got mine wrapped in plastic right now molding a holster for it so I can't check at the moment, but it would be interesting to see the S/N's of those that are having issues vs. those that are not.



Yeah, it would definitely be good if this could be eventually isolated to a specific range of serial numbers. The numbers on the flat surfaces of the TM11 seem to be patent numbers (I was trying to decipher those myself). It looks like on the head about a half inch below the bezel is a 14-digit serial number. On the warranty card that's in the box, there's a space for a Model Number, Date of Purchase, and Serial Number to be filled in...so I guess it's that number below the bezel. I think I'll record the one on mine before I send it back, just out of curiosity. 

Hey, I hope you're going to show that holster to us after you have it ready. :thumbsup:


----------



## Bass (Oct 6, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

Don't know if the issues are more wide spread than a few rogue lights but I noticed today that HK Equipment have pulled the Nitecore TM11 from sale on E-Bay. It was there yesterday....


----------



## Hogokansatsukan (Oct 6, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*



varuscelli said:


> Hey, I hope you're going to show that holster to us after you have it ready. :thumbsup:




Well, here it is. The light is wide enough that I used two spring steel clips on the back.


----------



## varuscelli (Oct 6, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

Fantastic looking leather work! Very cool... :thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup:


----------



## jhc37013 (Oct 7, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*



Bass said:


> Don't know if the issues are more wide spread than a few rogue lights but I noticed today that HK Equipment have pulled the Nitecore TM11 from sale on E-Bay. It was there yesterday....



I wish I new the best websites to look at the Asian forums and see if there having any problems, I've looked but didn't come up with anything.


----------



## juplin (Oct 7, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*



jhc37013 said:


> I wish I new the best websites to look at the Asian forums and see if there having any problems, I've looked but didn't come up with anything.


Flickering issues and solutions are also being discussed in this thread:
http://www.shoudian.com/thread-214168-1-1.html
(Registration is required to view the pictures)

Cleaning up the stains such as residual influx or silicone oil on the outer negative copper ring of the head will solve the flickering problem of turbo mode (at least for the original poster). After cleaning, burn-in under turbo mode is suggested to confirm this solution.
Two key pictures of the linked thread:


----------



## jhc37013 (Oct 7, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*



juplin said:


> Flickering issues and solutions are also being discussed in this thread:
> http://www.shoudian.com/thread-214168-1-1.html
> (Registration is required to view the pictures)
> 
> Cleaning up the stains such as residual influx or silicone oil on the outer negative copper ring of the head will solve the flickering problem of turbo mode (at least for the original poster). After cleaning, burn-in under turbo mode is suggested to confirm this solution.



Sending PM.


----------



## candle lamp (Oct 7, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*



juplin said:


> Flickering issues and solutions are also being discussed in this thread:
> http://www.shoudian.com/thread-214168-1-1.html
> (Registration is required to view the pictures)
> 
> Cleaning up the stains such as residual influx or silicone oil on the outer negative copper ring of the head will solve the flickering problem of turbo mode (at least for the original poster). After cleaning, burn-in under turbo mode is suggested to confirm this solution.



That's good information for those who are wondering about the reason of the flickering problem.


----------



## jhc37013 (Oct 7, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*



candle lamp said:


> That's good information for those who are wondering about the reason of the flickering problem.



Yes it is, I tried cleaning mine vigorously and it did not help but my problems was much worse than just flickering so maybe it will help some owners who experience that particular problem.


----------



## candle lamp (Oct 7, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*



jhc37013 said:


> Yes it is, I tried cleaning mine vigorously and it did not help but my problems was much worse than just flickering so maybe it will help some owners who experience that particular problem.



It's too bad that it didn't help you. I think you will do better to receive replacement.
In Korea, TM11 is just released today. Maybe I can survey a situation here.


----------



## jhc37013 (Oct 7, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*



candle lamp said:


> It's too bad that it didn't help you. I think you will do better to receive replacement.
> In Korea, TM11 is just released today. Maybe I can survey a situation here.



Oh I have a replacement already on it's way back to me thanks, when I found the light was faulty one of the first things I did was thoroughly clean the inside of the head. A survey of the Korean release will be interesting hopefully they have no problems.


----------



## varuscelli (Oct 7, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*



juplin said:


> Flickering issues and solutions are also being discussed in this thread:
> http://www.shoudian.com/thread-214168-1-1.html
> (Registration is required to view the pictures)
> 
> Cleaning up the stains such as residual influx or silicone oil on the outer negative copper ring of the head will solve the flickering problem of turbo mode (at least for the original poster). After cleaning, burn-in under turbo mode is suggested to confirm this solution.



That's a good suggestion. Unfortunately, on the one I have clean-up didn't seem to help. I used some DeoxIT Gold contact cleaner and it took a bunch of gunk off (as in the photo). 

Initially, after cleanup with DeoxIT (hard as this might seem to believe) the light started behaving even worse, doing multiple flickering (sort of machine-gun style) that it had not been doing before. 

But I went ahead and ran it through a couple of more heat-up/cool-down cycles to see if I'd get any change in behavior of the light. 

I ran it one time and it didn't flicker at all in the first three minutes before cutting off for a few seconds. Then on subsequent tries I had a difficult time getting the light to turn on at all no matter how many times or in what manner I pressed the switch. I could still see the red standby light blinking, but the light wouldn't come on. I eventually got it to start turning on again, but it still continued the occasional flicker/cut-off behavior. 

I guess the bottom line is that in my case the cleaning didn't help. It's still a good recommendation, though.


----------



## tomwoh (Oct 7, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

I received mine yesterday so I've not used it it a lot, I did put it on Turbo and after about 6 minutes it was to hot to hold, this was inside my house. But it didn't flicker dim or cut out. For what I have planned for this, checking on my 5 acreage 6 minutes on turbo works for me. Last night in the rain I tried it as compared to my TK35 (which I really like) and have been using for this task. While I know it's not a fair comparison I will be using the TM11 from now on. I really like the form factor and expect based on the form factor that I won't be running it on Turbo for more than 5 minutes. I wouldn't use 2000 lumens for a lantern. I have a lot of power outages and even 200 lumens is more than I need for most tasks I do inside. I am going to keep an eye out for the issues reported.


----------



## Hogokansatsukan (Oct 7, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

My AW2200 18650's arrived today and I popped them in the TM11 without even putting them on the charger first. Light read them at 4.2 volts and I kicked on high. I let it run a good 5 minutes and got no issues at all.


----------



## utlgoa (Oct 8, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

Picked up my TM-11 at the Post Office and charged up the Jetbeam 18650's, and I Love this Light!

Lights up everything !

Regarding the "Flickering" issue, not happening with my light.

Very happy with this purchase!

The flashing on/off switch is very cool !


----------



## jhc37013 (Oct 8, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

I got my replacement from LightJuntion today and this light functions exactly like it should so far, when it gets really hot on 2000lmn it cuts down to 1100 for a minute and then back up to 2000. Thanks to LJ for helping so quickly, I'll continue to test it.


----------



## varuscelli (Oct 8, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*



jhc37013 said:


> I got my replacement from LightJuntion today and this light functions exactly like it should so far, when it gets really hot on 2000lmn it cuts down to 1100 for a minute and then back up to 2000. Thanks to LJ for helping so quickly, I'll continue to test it.



Excellent news! 

I won't get my replacement until sometime next week, but I have to admit I came really close to taking the refund rather than the replacement and waiting a little while to get the TM11. In the end, my gut feeling was that LightJunction would make sure that there wouldn't be any more bad ones go out, so I feel confident the replacement will be fine. Looks to me as though a few of us were just unlucky in what we received. 

I might have to check with Hogokansatsukan when he's back from his camping trip and see what it would take to get one of those custom holsters...


----------



## jhc37013 (Oct 8, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

I'm really glad I went with the exchange and Lightjunction told me in a email they have checked all there remaining light's and out of 12 there was 1 faulty light, so I think you can exchange with confidence.


----------



## candle lamp (Oct 9, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

That's good news. Hope you enjoy your time with it.


----------



## jhc37013 (Oct 9, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*



candle lamp said:


> That's good news. Hope you enjoy your time with it.



Thanks and believe me I already am, it's fun trying different battery's and seeing how the thermal works and playing with the unique UI. This light gets very hot on max and at about the 8-9 minute mark is when my 2000lmn drops to 1100, that's a mixture of holding in hand and tailstand. Even with the thermal changing between 2000 and 1100 it gets way to hot to hold around 10mins in room temp.

I ran the 1100lmn mode for 30mins straight it was just then beginning to get hot, most of that time on 1100lmn the light was mostly warm, I like that because that is the output I'll use most of the time.


----------



## 2100 (Oct 9, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

2000L extended usage is really for "outdoors" usage, when it is gonna be dark so you need the lumens, plus it's cooler+windy. The wind makes a big difference.


----------



## roadkill1109 (Oct 9, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

wow, glad to see the problems sorted out. now its time to shell out the dough! ouch! haha.... expensive little light!


----------



## Nanomiser (Oct 10, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

Thank you to all who have spent the time to document and share these issues as it has been very informative and helpful.:thumbsup: Now that I have a better understanding of how a properly working TM11 performs, I'm not so sure I like the idea of a $250 light getting so hot after 6-7min that it has to dim. 

Even though I like pushing lights to the edge of their limits it sounds like Nitecore is driving this one a little too hard for its size. Unfortunately, the form factor and features of this light is what has my interest. Not sure it is the right light for me now especially with the issues discussed here. Although the Fenix TK70 is a much larger light maybe it’s a better fit for my needs. 

Any thoughts?


----------



## jhc37013 (Oct 10, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*



Nanomiser said:


> Thank you to all who have spent the time to document and share these issues as it has been very informative and helpful.:thumbsup: Now that I have a better understanding of how a properly working TM11 performs, *I'm not so sure I like the idea of a $250 light getting so hot after 6-7min that it has to dim. **Even though I like pushing lights to the edge of their limits it sounds like Nitecore is driving this one a little too hard for its size.* Unfortunately, the form factor and features of this light is what has my interest. Not sure it is the right light for me now especially with the issues discussed here. Although the Fenix TK70 is a much larger light maybe it’s a better fit for my needs.
> 
> Any thoughts?



Yes you can run it on 1100lmn and it doesn't get that hot, I ran mine for 30 minutes straight on 1100 and it was only warm most of the time and only beginning to get hot and keep in mind it was 50/50 of me holding it and tailstanding at room temp, very good heat sinking.


----------



## utlgoa (Oct 11, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

This is a great light for walking the dog in the park at night. In the past I was sometimes asked by other walkers if I really needed such a big light (referring to either my SR90 or X21). I don't think this will happen with the TM 11.


----------



## Hogokansatsukan (Oct 11, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

Well, back from my camping trip. I took the SR91, the S18, and the TM11. I ran the TM11 on the AW2200 18650's. Had no issues at all with the light. The beam pattern has the largest hot spot of the three lights, but I also found it to be the most useful. The size/output is also perfect. 
I also ended up picking up a new friend this weekend.

I named her Lumen, or Lu for short.


----------



## jbdan (Oct 11, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*



Hogokansatsukan said:


> Well, back from my camping trip. I took the SR91, the S18, and the TM11. I ran the TM11 on the AW2200 18650's. Had no issues at all with the light. The beam pattern has the largest hot spot of the three lights, but I also found it to be the most useful. The size/output is also perfect.
> I also ended up picking up a new friend this weekend.
> 
> I named her Lumen, or Lu for short.



Adorable awesome!!


----------



## varuscelli (Oct 11, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

I'm assuming the TM11 was probably a little too big for her. 

Creative use of a bikeblock, though... :thumbsup:


----------



## candle lamp (Oct 12, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*



varuscelli said:


> I'm assuming the TM11 was probably a little too big for her.
> 
> Creative use of a bikeblock, though... :thumbsup:



Haha. Perfect! :twothumbs


----------



## varuscelli (Oct 12, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

Well, LightJunction e-mailed me and let me know my replacement TM11 is on the way. Now if I can figure out a way to attach it to my bike handlebar...(or to my dog's head)...I'll be happy. 
Actually, I'll be happy just to have a normally functioning version in hand.


----------



## varuscelli (Oct 12, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*



candle lamp said:


> Haha. Perfect! :twothumbs



Well...just one more tidbit to add...


----------



## candle lamp (Oct 12, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*



varuscelli said:


> Well...just one more tidbit to add...



Thanks again for one more tidbit, and TM11 is too big for her. :shakehead
Hope you will find a way to attach it to your bike well. 

By the way, I've seen only one user in Korea with the same issue that you & jhc37013 mentioned.
His light was sent to a local dealer to be checked and may be replaced.

KH


----------



## roadkill1109 (Oct 12, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*



Hogokansatsukan said:


> Well, back from my camping trip. I took the SR91, the S18, and the TM11. I ran the TM11 on the AW2200 18650's. Had no issues at all with the light. The beam pattern has the largest hot spot of the three lights, but I also found it to be the most useful. The size/output is also perfect.
> I also ended up picking up a new friend this weekend.
> 
> I named her Lumen, or Lu for short.



That's one lumen right there!  Cute dog! Adorable!


----------



## varuscelli (Oct 14, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

Got my replacement TM11 today and all looks good. 

After brief testing, I see no flickering, blinking, cutoffs, etc. 

Just following up.


----------



## gsteve (Oct 14, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

Totally unimpressed ! 2 TM11's arrived today. One acts like like all the other faultly units. The other wont even turn on. Im in canada so I suppose the return shipping will be expensive. What a total pain. Not happy with nitecore at all !


----------



## varuscelli (Oct 14, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*



gsteve said:


> Totally unimpressed ! 2 TM11's arrived today. One acts like like all the other faultly units. The other wont even turn on. Im in canada so I suppose the return shipping will be expensive. What a total pain. Not happy with nitecore at all !



Well, crap. A double whammy. I feel for you, having had to deal with just one. But two? Yikes. 

If you don't mind me asking, how long ago did you order these?


----------



## gsteve (Oct 14, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

About 3 weeks ago. Thats how long it takes to get thru customs... oh the joy. Anyone else have one that didnt even turn on?


----------



## gsteve (Oct 14, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

Oh and maybe its because the one light that did work , didnt work well but i wasnt impressed with the button functions. Im almost leaning back to the jetbeam rrt 3 xml


----------



## varuscelli (Oct 14, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

Yeah, the timing is about the same as the initial orders like the rest of us who had problems. Man, that does suck being in international order. Returning mine even in the same country negated about half the original discount, so sweet as the discount was it wasn't nearly so sweet after having to pay return costs, insurance, etc. I feel bad for you having to deal with that same thing from Canada. 

If there's any bright side, I haven't heard of one person who did a return and didn't get back a properly functioning light. And of course there's always a return for a refund (minus your return shipping charges). I wonder if in your case the seller might be willing to do some kind of RMA where they take care of return postage...although I'd guess that's a long shot.


----------



## gsteve (Oct 14, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

I emailed them... guess we will see what they say. It was lightjunction


----------



## varuscelli (Oct 14, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

Ironic that LightJunction was lucky enough to be among the first vendors to get the TM11 from the manufacturer but unlucky enough to get some of the bad ones. Just luck of the draw, I guess (same as those of us who bought first being hit-or-miss lucky or unlucky).


----------



## gsteve (Oct 17, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

In the email from LJ they are telling me the AW 2900 1860s i bought wont work. Good to know after buying four new ones. I will try 123s and report.


----------



## Hogokansatsukan (Oct 17, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*



gsteve said:


> In the email from LJ they are telling me the AW 2900 1860s i bought wont work. Good to know after buying four new ones. I will try 123s and report.



The 18650's will need nipples on them. I picked up some AW 2200 and they work great. It's probably the reason for the light not coming on. I tried my 2900 AW's and they are a "no go".

I've been quite happy with my TM11, also ordered from Lightjunction. I also just ordered the Jetbeam RRT3 XML and that should be in later this week. I'll try to do a comparison of the two lights.

Does suck having issues when you have to order internationally.


----------



## jhc37013 (Oct 17, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*



gsteve said:


> In the email from LJ they are telling me the AW 2900 1860s i bought wont work. Good to know after buying four new ones. I will try 123s and report.



So have you tried both with something else besides AW?


----------



## varuscelli (Oct 17, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

I'm using the AW 2200 and Redilast 3100 in the TM11. Now I'm glad I didn't go for the AW 2900s when I decided to get the Redilast 3100s. I got those for a different light initially (not specifically for the TM11). 

I haven't kept up with the AW sales thread or anything, but I wonder why the higher capacity AW batteries like AW 2900 were developed without the more protruding button top...(?)


----------



## gsteve (Oct 17, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*



jhc37013 said:


> So have you tried both with something else besides AW?



not yet , figured the 2900 were the ticket as they worked great in my fenix lights.


----------



## gsteve (Oct 17, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*



Hogokansatsukan said:


> The 18650's will need nipples on them. I picked up some AW 2200 and they work great. It's probably the reason for the light not coming on. I tried my 2900 AW's and they are a "no go".
> 
> I've been quite happy with my TM11, also ordered from Lightjunction. I also just ordered the Jetbeam RRT3 XML and that should be in later this week. I'll try to do a comparison of the two lights.
> 
> Does suck having issues when you have to order internationally.



Looking forward to seeing your review.


----------



## jhc37013 (Oct 17, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*



gsteve said:


> not yet , figured the 2900 were the ticket as they worked great in my fenix lights.



Oh yeh both the 3100mah and 2900 fit nicely in the TM11 but I was curious if you have tried primarys or button top 18650's to see if that corrects the problems your having with both light's. I know you said one would not light up presumably because you used flat tops but what did you use in the the other light that had the same odd behavior that some of us has had with our faulty TM11?


----------



## varuscelli (Oct 17, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

It might be kind of off topic here (I suppose, but maybe not), but I wonder if anyone is working on a full review of the TM11 yet? 

Rob Bond did his "preview" of the TM11 (which many kept referring to as a review even though he accurately called it a preview). But I'd sure like to see someone's full-out review on the TM11. Or have I missed one that's already been posted?


----------



## gsteve (Oct 17, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

I used the aw 2900 in both. Ill be trying 123s in both tonight


----------



## gsteve (Oct 17, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

Hmmmm appears the battery is the prob. One light clicked out at 6 mins and the other at 4. What times to click down are the rest of you guys seeing?


----------



## varuscelli (Oct 17, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

You can see what mine was doing by looking at the two videos on the first page of this thread. It was very random though, and never repeated exactly the same way.


----------



## jhc37013 (Oct 17, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*



gsteve said:


> Hmmmm appears the battery is the prob. One light clicked out at 6 mins and the other at 4. What times to click down are the rest of you guys seeing?



In my hand in room temp it goes from 2000lmn to 1100lm somewhere between 6-8 minutes from a cold start, you said clicked off do you mean a drop in output or turn off, if you see a drop in output only and no turn off it would seem yours are doing the normal thing from what I've seen.


----------



## varuscelli (Oct 17, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*



jhc37013 said:


> In my hand in room temp it goes from 2000lmn to 1100lm somewhere between 6-8 minutes from a cold start, you said clicked off do you mean a drop in output or turn off, if you see a drop in output only and no turn off it would seem yours are doing the normal thing from what I've seen.



And as an added note, the replacement that I got does the output drop at somewhere between 6 and 6.5 minutes (tailstanding on a table, ambient room temp of about 78 deg F). I haven't tested it many times that way, but the couple of times I did that was the time frame.


----------



## gsteve (Oct 17, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

Interesting.. in a quick yard and across the street test against a SF defender at 200 lums and a scorpion I was a bit under impressed. I may have to take it out to a completely dark road for a good test. But lighting up roofs 5 houses away the tm11 on turbo was a bit better than the scorp.


----------



## gsteve (Oct 18, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

Ok cancel that test. Was going from one light to another and found that one has only 2 leds working ! Redid the test. TM11 with 3 working leds faired much better! I was shocked at the spill , see im already a flight nerd, from the 2nd storey of my house straight down onto the grass the 11 is at least double as wide as the scorp , prob more.


----------



## varuscelli (Oct 18, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

I was wondering what you were saying, gsteve, since I was having a hard time making sense of the TM11 not faring well against a SureFire Defender. Not to disrespect the Defender, but...  

But on the downside, two out of three LEDs working is not what anyone would want to see.  

And yes, I'm absolutely impressed by the width of the useful spill of the TM11. It seems very, very good that way and does light things up with a broad swath of light in the spill zone.


----------



## gsteve (Oct 18, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

Yea I didnt even want to mention that the 500 setting on the 11 barely outdid the 200 of the exec defender. Figured you guys would think i was goofy. Funny , i always thought the exec def was bright. Till now !


----------



## ChocolateLab33 (Oct 20, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

Mine is being returned for a replacement. I'm having the same problems as everyone else. :thumbsdow


----------



## Crazy Swede (Oct 20, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

I like the size and output of this light but it looks like its not safe to buy it, if I don´t want problem. I hope nitecore has sorted this problem out soon...


----------



## lightliker (Oct 20, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*



varuscelli said:


> Well...just one more tidbit to add...


definately beats the "walking fridge" advertisement of Heiniken .
Am looking at the TM11 too but a bit worried about temperature since I don't wear stove-gloves daily.


----------



## dckemper (Oct 20, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

I purchased a TM11 from BJ and it arrived yesterday 10/19 after much anticipation. While waiting for the ultrafire 3000's to charge, I used 123A primaries. The 123A's seemed a bit loose as they we not sleeved but managed to stay appropriately aligned. After screwing the head down, I pushed the button and whaala...light. After about 15 seconds I noticed flickering and then one of the emitters dropped offline. While the light was still emitting on the other two emitters, I opened the head a quarter turn and retightened - the dropped emitter came back online, albeit brief.

I put the light through its paces while burning through the capacity of the primaries. Some quirkiness continued with one of the three emitters falling offline intermittently, and occasionally two dropping offline. I tried various scenarios including several cold starts, several warm starts, and several hot starts. During thermal shutdown, all 3 emitter outputs are reduced equally (it did not take one or more emitters offline). My sense is that there is an issue with seated and alignment of the primaries, but that won't be validated until I run through the 18650s.

This morning I tried the light with freshly charged 18650 /3000mAh and have not experienced any emitter fallout yet. I'll conduct a more thorough test this afternoon and will report back my findings. 

Bottom line: hugely disappointed with the primary results. As others have said, if the quirks are resolved( and I too suspect they will be) this light will get an A rating..!

DC


----------



## Crazy Swede (Oct 20, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*



lightliker said:


> definately beats the "walking fridge" advertisement of Heiniken .
> Am looking at the TM11 too but a bit worried about temperature since I don't wear stove-gloves daily.



It could be nice to have a warm flashlight if it gets as cold as last winter here in Sweden. We had a snowstorm at Christmas Eve and the roof at my work caved in:thumbsdow


----------



## bigjoe25ss (Oct 20, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

i got my tm11 yesterday i ran it on 18650s with out a problem it did start to dim when it got hot but nothing else out of the ordinary happened


----------



## SkyPup (Oct 20, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

I've had mine for almost two weeks now and have used it every night including one coyote hunt when it was on 500 lumens for 4 hours nonstop. 

It has worked perfectly for me using 4 UltraFire 3000mah batteries and the battery voltage indicator shows the batteries are down to 3.8 volts from their initial charge. 

I am going to take it out again tonight to check my game cameras and it will get allot more use this weekend too.

It is not as powerful as my Fenix TK70 which has a much stronger throw, even my TK35's almost have the same throw, but it is totally awesome as a flood, covering a huge area out at about 250 yards where my coyote decoys are.

So far I really like it, the UI took some getting use to as it is quite sensitive. Also, I put a drop of plastic goop on the handle for tactile feel at night so I could find the on-off button in the dark by touch. Other than that, it is a great torch!

Thanks BJ!


----------



## Msingewald (Oct 25, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

Just to add to the pile, I picked mine up today at Battery Junction, and after making the hour ride back home, I found that one emitter would shut off after 30 seconds on Turbo. After 10 seconds or so it would flicker and sometimes come back on, but then shut off again.

Ann at BJ was very kind to cross ship me a replacement, even though I paid cash and she had no credit card info. I should have it tomorrow and I will be checking the emitters immediately!

With the fantastic service from Ann, I will be sure to purchase as much as I can from BJ going forward. I know they don't sell the AW batteries which seem so popular, but I will buy the Ultrafires from them unless I hear something really bad about them.


----------



## Chongker (Oct 25, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

Just got myself a TM11 from a UK dealer today. Just charged my set of 18650s and popped them in. No dead emitters which is a good start, and impressive output, though I am noticing some flickering, especially when the light starts to get hot. Could it possibly have something to do with the temperature sensor in the thing? No straight cut-offs yet, but the flickering is quite noticable and slightly annoying, though I might just be able to live with it. If any other problems pop up I'll likely return it. Anything else that I should be looking out for?

EDIT: Will try out the solution on shoudian soon after initial testing is done


----------



## Hogokansatsukan (Oct 25, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

Thought maybe it would be a good idea to have the OP jhc37013 maybe add a poll to this thread just to see what the percentage is that have gotten one of these and it works fine or if there are issues.
Can a poll be started after the thread is going?


----------



## varuscelli (Oct 25, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*



Msingewald said:


> Just to add to the pile, I picked mine up today at Battery Junction, and after making the hour ride back home, I found that one emitter would shut off after 30 seconds on Turbo. After 10 seconds or so it would flicker and sometimes come back on, but then shut off again.



Well, that's not very good news at this point in time.


----------



## varuscelli (Oct 25, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*



Chongker said:


> Just got myself a TM11 from a UK dealer today. Just charged my set of 18650s and popped them in. No dead emitters which is a good start, and impressive output, though I am noticing some flickering, especially when the light starts to get hot. Could it possibly have something to do with the temperature sensor in the thing? No straight cut-offs yet, but the flickering is quite noticable and slightly annoying, though I might just be able to live with it. If any other problems pop up I'll likely return it. Anything else that I should be looking out for?
> 
> EDIT: Will try out the solution on shoudian soon after initial testing is done



It shouldn't be flickering. The thermal protection should cause it to drop in level from Turbo to High (maybe what could be described as one "flicker" as it drops in output), but that drop in output should be easily distinguishable from random flickering. In part, though, it might depend on how each of us interprets "flickering." But I know the drop in output I see with the replacement I got is a lot different from the random flickering I was getting in the first one.


----------



## Msingewald (Oct 25, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

So, BJ said to return the light tomorrow, so I have been playing with this one some more. When the emitter would turn off, I shut off the light and then turned it back on in high day mode. The emitter always came back on. Then I would go right back to Turbo and the emitter would start on but then turn off. After a few times doing this, the emitter started to stay on even in Turbo mode. I let it run for about 3 minutes and it never flickered. Tried this a few times and it keeps working. I am headed out for a long walk so I will give it a longer test. But, I guess I will still return it since it doesn't give me a warm, fuzzy feeling as is. i will report back.


----------



## gsteve (Oct 25, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

Are you batterys the type with a lil knob on the top like 123s? If not that maybe your problem. My aw 2900s didnt work. 123s did.


----------



## Msingewald (Oct 25, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

My 18650's have the knob on top. Looking at how the batteries all touch a common rail, I don't see how the batteries could make a difference. Even if a battery had a bad connection, wouldn't that cause all the emitters to be affected, not just one? It seems more likely there is a problem with a bad LED, or a bad solder joint or trace. I just came back from a one hour walk with the light spending the whole time on Day High, or Turbo. The same emitter would shut off and on whenever I was in Turbo mode. No problems in the Day modes. Looking forward to testing the replacement tomorrow.


----------



## gsteve (Oct 25, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

i have 2 tm11s. Using flat 18650s one would not work at all and the other got very hot and flickered bad. I put in 123s and the hot one worked perfect and the worked fine but ine emitted does not , its going back


----------



## jefft (Oct 26, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

Another flickering TM11 here. Awaiting replacement from batteryjunction, too.


----------



## 276 (Oct 26, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

I forgot to post this a week or so ago but i got my replacement and tested it on the high setting for 15 minutes and and had no problems. I also ran it on Turbo for five minutes with a small amount of flickering a lot less then what i had before.


----------



## Baddog (Oct 26, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

let me add to the pile, mine arrived a while back and is pretty much useless, i wont be RMA'ing it as i work away from home and the nearest post office is around a thousand clicks from me. i also wont be buying again from battery junction as they saw fit to ignore my request for them to check my light before posting it out. Caveat emptor!


----------



## jhc37013 (Oct 26, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*



Hogokansatsukan said:


> Thought maybe it would be a good idea to have the OP jhc37013 maybe add a poll to this thread just to see what the percentage is that have gotten one of these and it works fine or if there are issues.
> Can a poll be started after the thread is going?



Poll added.


----------



## Hogokansatsukan (Oct 26, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

Cool. Added poll. Thanks jhc37013.
Now, just to get everyone to weigh in.
Mine is still working just fine. It's my go to big gun, though I also quite like my RRT3 XML. The form factor on the TM11 is just so... cool.


----------



## Chongker (Oct 26, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*



Hogokansatsukan said:


> Cool. Added poll. Thanks jhc37013.
> Now, just to get everyone to weigh in.
> Mine is still working just fine. It's my go to big gun, though I also quite like my RRT3 XML. The form factor on the TM11 is just so... cool.



+1

Love how compact the light is for the amount of sheer output it has. My real go to big light is my TK70, but it is disproportionately larger in size for the gain in output (throw is another story though).

Like the fresh new UI, something a little different but after some getting used to, is actually pretty nice to use. The only thing I would ask for is for more travel in the "first stage" of the switch and a little more tactile feel to it.

Light is boxed up and going to be shipped back tomorrow. Hopefully the replacement is fine, or at least not any worse.


----------



## Jash (Oct 27, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

Nitecores suck! I had three out of four with issues. Two died, and not from overuse. There's much better lights for less money.


----------



## varuscelli (Oct 27, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

The only problem with a malfunctions poll is that more people who are having problems will look for a thread like this than those who are not having problems. I think we're more likely to get responses from people who are having problems than those who are not, which probably won't be reflective of the actual percentages of bad versus good lights received.


----------



## texbaz (Oct 28, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

Wow, I was planning to purchase one of these, seems like it might be a "roll of the dice" with regards to the poll information. Seems Nitecore bit off more than it could chew. I went to their web page read about the design team and all obstacles they had to overcome etc. Looks like they got some more to overcome they didn't realize they had. I really like the Coke Can form factor.


----------



## Hogokansatsukan (Oct 28, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*



varuscelli said:


> The only problem with a malfunctions poll is that more people who are having problems will look for a thread like this than those who are not having problems. I think we're more likely to get responses from people who are having problems than those who are not, which probably won't be reflective of the actual percentages of bad versus good lights received.



This is true that it should be slanted more toward "failure", and folks should keep that in mind when contemplating the purchase of a TM11. It does show that Nitecore does have an issue with this light, and it does appear to be a pretty common problem that they need to fix. I guess I got lucky with the dice roll. We'll have to see what Nitecore comes up with to fix the problem as I would think they should be very concerned about fixing it.


----------



## Msingewald (Oct 28, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

I just got my replacement today and I ran it in Turbo for 20 minutes with no problems. At least the exchange was painless and a success. Love this light.


----------



## varuscelli (Oct 29, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*



Hogokansatsukan said:


> This is true that it should be slanted more toward "failure", and folks should keep that in mind when contemplating the purchase of a TM11. It does show that Nitecore does have an issue with this light, and it does appear to be a pretty common problem that they need to fix. I guess I got lucky with the dice roll. We'll have to see what Nitecore comes up with to fix the problem as I would think they should be very concerned about fixing it.



Agreed. It will also be interesting if, at some point, we learn specifically what has been causing the problems. Hopefully it will be of a nature that any given light either has the problem or doesn't -- and not that the problem might crop up with any given light at after that light initially performs as it should. I think the second scenario is much less likely, but still...how can we know?


----------



## philsyson (Oct 29, 2011)

No malfunctioning on my 2 tm11's but a couple of pin head size chips in the ano which is a bit annoying


----------



## texbaz (Oct 29, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*



varuscelli said:


> Agreed. It will also be interesting if, at some point, we learn specifically what has been causing the problems. Hopefully it will be of a nature that any given light either has the problem or doesn't -- and not that the problem might crop up with any given light at after that light initially performs as it should. I think the second scenario is much less likely, but still...how can we know?



I sure hope so, the light is pretty unique and it would be great to have but, if it is not 100% free of operational defects it not worth the price point and even at it's current price quality, performance, longevity are paramount. were not talkin about a disposable light, this should be a light that can last a lifetime with normal use. Only time will tell now, if they really want this product to sell Nitecore will do what it takes to reassure prospective buyers.


----------



## brightnorm (Oct 29, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

I've had mine for about 4 hours and it is fine so far. Unfortunately, I see 
a significant design problem. The otherwise excellent switch requires so little pressure that is nearly hair trigger. This would have been less of a problem if it had been recessed but it is very exposed. In normal use this isn't a problem, but when holstered it can be accidently turned on quite easily if there is even modest pressure on the case directly over the button. 

There are four solutions that I can think of. You can lock it out and then unlock it when you draw the light from the case. This involves a minor hassle, but a hassle NTL. 

You can rotate the light so the button faces the inner side of the holster, making accidental ignition very unlikely, though you must remember to turn it before insertion, and also hope that the light doesn't rotate while you're carrying it. 

The third solution is what Nitecore should have done in the first place: put raised ridges around or to the sides of the button. I've tried this with tiny pieces of stick-on foam which is fairly effective but it looks dreadful and is only temporary. It can even make the problem worse if any foam piece slips and touches the button, making it more prominent. I also tried to find a washer small enough to fit within the slighly recessed square that surrounds the button, but any washer that fit had a hole that is too small.

The fourth solution is to have a 1" wide band of stiff material sewn or glued to the top inside of the holster running all the way from one side to the other
(but not necessary for the back of the holster). I may do this because it is probably the best home-grown solution, aside from lockout.

Lockout would be the preferred setting if you keep it out of the holster.

One small point: when I switch from High to Turbo (H-off-, full push Turbo), I don't see much difference in brightness, even though the lumens are nearly double. Perhaps when I test the light outdoors I'll see more of a diffrerence.

Summing up - a great light, beautifully made with IMO an unprotected button "design flaw". Plus, not enough difference between high and turbo - subject to reevaluation after outdoor tests

Brightnorm


----------



## jhc37013 (Oct 29, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*



brightnorm said:


> I've had mine for about 4 hours and it is fine so far. Unfortunately, I see a significant design problem. The otherwise excellent switch requires so little pressure that is nearly hair trigger. This would have been less of a problem if it had been recessed but it is very exposed. In normal use this isn't a problem, but when holstered it can be accidently turned on quite easily if there is even modest pressure on the case directly over the button.
> 
> There are three solutions. You can lock it out and then unlock it when you draw the light from the case. This involves a minor hassle, but a hassle NTL especially considering that it isn't alway easy to fit the three superfast unlocking presses within one second.
> 
> ...



Yes I've learned I have to think of this light as a lock out light when I put it away, whether that is in a coat pocket or the holster, because of the parasitic drain with standby I also lock it out when I put it back on the shelf. I'm not a fan of doing any type of lockout but like you mention it's easy to put this light in lockout and then it's nearly just as easy to unlock.


----------



## brightnorm (Oct 29, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

I'll probably end up doing the same, but I may first give my "fourth solution" a try. I would hope that Nitecore addresses this problem in a future upgrade.

Brightnorm


----------



## rlorion (Oct 29, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

I wanted to get this light for myself as a X-mas present....now I am not sure after hearing about the issues that seem to be showing up. I am a little hesitant to get one until I know this is either a first run oops or the issue has been resolved. I don't want to spend the $260 and have it be flaking out....that being said, is the light worth it? I would like something to use along with my TK70....ahhh crap, I can't stop buying Flashlights.... WTF....is there something wrong with me?


----------



## ChocolateLab33 (Oct 30, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

I received my replacement light a couple of days ago and I've been testing it out as much as possible with no problems so far but it took many days for the first light to start acting crazy so I'm not convinced yet that this one is ok. I'm hoping it is because with the 4 new batteries and the shipping cost to send the first one back I have roughly $340 invested.


----------



## varuscelli (Oct 30, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*



ChocolateLab33 said:


> I received my replacement light a couple of days ago and I've been testing it out as much as possible with no problems so far but it took many days for the first light to start acting crazy so I'm not convinced yet that this one is ok. I'm hoping it is because with the 4 new batteries and the shipping cost to send the first one back I have roughly $340 invested.



Ahh, I was wondering if anyone had received a TM11 that took a while to start showing any problems. Seems like most folks see odd behavior right off the bat. If you don't mind me asking, how much run time do you think you had on the first one before it started acting up?


----------



## brightnorm (Oct 30, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

Got my light earlier Saturday. It seems fine but I can't see any difference between high and turbo (fully charged AW 2600's) Anyone else experience this?

Brightnorm


----------



## varuscelli (Oct 30, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

Brightnorm: I see a big (very noticeable) difference between high and turbo, even indoors during the day just shining it on the wall or across a room. There's really no mistaking the difference between the two when one level is tested right after the other. I'm using AW 2200s and Redilast 3100s.


----------



## varuscelli (Oct 30, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

Sorry, double post.


----------



## philsyson (Oct 30, 2011)

Mine still going strong 2 days in. Still annoyed about the small chip in the ano at the base of the light


----------



## brightnorm (Oct 30, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*



varuscelli said:


> Brightnorm: I see a big (very noticeable) difference between high and turbo, even indoors during the day just shining it on the wall or across a room. There's really no mistaking the difference between the two when one level is tested right after the other. I'm using AW 2200s and Redilast 3100s.


I found the problem, which was really my own ignorance about the TM11's inability to take flattops. For some reason my AW 2600 flattops actually worked (sometimes) but would not permit turbo mode. After some searching I realized my error and I'm temporarily using 8x cr123's until my AW 2200's get here.

Brightnorm


----------



## jefft (Oct 31, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

ok, second TM11 flickering. Going to reurn this one, too. Maybe I'll give up on the TM11. Ironically, no issues at all with the cheap, Dry triple.


----------



## varuscelli (Oct 31, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

If you've had two bad ones, you should get to add two to the poll (but I guess it can't work that way).


----------



## Kletsou (Nov 4, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

Whoopi ! Got mine, the batteries are all charged up and I will be testing tonight! So far the playing looks like it will impress


----------



## mishu.daniel (Nov 9, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

Hi guys,
Is there any conclusion about this torch malfunction?
Did Nitecore published any explanation?
I really love this flashlight but I keep myself from buying one to avoid returning it.

Thanks.


----------



## varuscelli (Nov 9, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

mishu.daniel: I've seen no explanation of the problem relayed from the manufacturer. I bet at this point that those with the most insight into this would be the vendors who are having the replace bad units. Perhaps we should ask this question in one of the existing TM11 threads in the CPF Marketplace forums to see what the vendors might have heard. Certainly enough time has gone by for the vendors to have had some level of discussions with the manufacturer about this.


----------



## mishu.daniel (Nov 9, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

Yes, that's the point... because the vendors already have samples from this faulty batch and they will replace them again and again. But is there any action from Nitecore to recall all of them or they rely on customer claims till they will clean them up? It's bad there is no similar torch on the market (yet) to have other choice. 

Regards.


----------



## varuscelli (Nov 9, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

Again, I think the vendors will have more insight into this. If this same question were asked in one of the existing CPF Marketplace open threads on the TM11, we might get some current feedback from the vendors (with the vendors being closer to the source and theoretically more knowledgeable in their communications with the manufacturer than the average CPF member).


----------



## hookworm (Nov 9, 2011)

*Re: Nitecore TM11 malfunctioning*

I've been following the thread(s) about the TM11 for a bit, and I'm still not convinced I should give it a try before the discussed glitches are ironed out. Correct me if I'm wrong, but there doesn't appear to be a NiteCore forum here on CPF. I'd really be interested in what they have to say.

That aside, I'm still strongly convinced that once they are sorted out, the light really has great potential - primaries vs. rechargeables, very bright, and decent throw, as far as I can tell from some of the reviews.


----------



## excfenix (Nov 12, 2011)

Something tells me that many of those supposedly having problems with the TM11 are using the wrong batteries. Having read through this entire thread it seems that primaries and flat cells do not work-- or do not work well.

Please state whether you are using primaries, rechargeables, flat/button, etc. Maybe it would help to state the voltage of each battery before running it as well; I read something (post "#1") that the parallel configuration and slight voltage differences between the batteries might even cause a problem.

Or I might just be starting rumors =D cause I'm a flashlight newb. No bad intentions here-- I'm just interested in this light and would like to zero in on the problem before I pull the trigger.


----------



## peterharvey73 (Nov 12, 2011)

I just paid and ordered for the TM11 and 4x Redilast 3100 mAH button tops - will let you know if any malfunctions once they arrive...


----------



## tre (Nov 12, 2011)

Wow, stunning results. Do you think the failure rate is really over 50% or (more likely) are happy people with functioning lights not posting?


----------



## peterharvey73 (Nov 12, 2011)

tre said:


> Wow, stunning results. Do you think the failure rate is really over 50% or (more likely) are happy people with functioning lights not posting?



After receiving my new floody SC600, I'm really beginning to forget about throw, [my throwers are taking the back seat now], and concentrate on short distance flooding which seems to be so much more practical.
My SC600 is presently playing up after a minute or so on Turbo by shutting off permanently till the tail cap is untwisted, probably because of the Ultrafire 2400 Protected?
I'm waiting for a bunch of Redilast 3100 Button Tops to arrive.

Tre, that is a disgusting poll result for the TM11, however Varuscelli said that his replacement unit works fine, so I will take my chances and see what happens when my new TM11 arrives.
I will have quality Redilasts for the TM11, so let's see what happens.

Furthermore $260 is a lot of money for the metal; an oversized TK70 could give me far more metal for less money, but hopefully the TM11 is well finished like a Jetbeam, and the innovative electronic side switch works well.
For example, my latest SC600 only costs $95, but the annodising is noticeably second rate compared to a typical Jetbeam or even a HDS Rotary 200, and there is no bundled lanyard; I'd say the greatest weakness of the SC600 is the finish and feel - apart from that, a very good light.
I suspect that the finish of the SC is a true dull matt finish, whereas the Nitecores, Jetbeams, and HDS have a semi-matt finish? Or partial gloss finish? It is matt, but it's smoother and shinier.
The Nitecores, Jetbeams and HDS also use a chrome plated stainless steel bezel to give their flashlights a touch of upmarketness, and the chrome also breaks the monotone annodising of the SC600.

I'd say that the SC600 is a very good concept, and that the design of the TM11 used the same concept as the SC600 in making the flashlight compact, ergonomic with a side switch, floody, and all these three factors complement one another coherently...


----------



## Sky (Nov 12, 2011)

Where can I find the Redilast 3100 button top batteries that people are talking about in this thread? I would like to try them. Thanks


----------



## peterharvey73 (Nov 13, 2011)

Sky said:


> Where can I find the Redilast 3100 button top batteries that people are talking about in this thread? I would like to try them. Thanks



www.redilast.com

Or http://www.cpfmarketplace.com/mp/showthread.php?235778-Redilast-Li-ion-Battery-sales!-High-quality-Made-in-Japan-Korea!
Make sure you log in with a different password. Can use same cpf username. If you want to make a post...


----------



## varuscelli (Nov 13, 2011)

Deleted (already answered).


----------



## gsteve (Nov 13, 2011)

Sent mine back for refund , going with the scorpion.


----------



## varuscelli (Nov 13, 2011)

gsteve said:


> Sent mine back for refund , going with the scorpion.



You know, I don't think any buyer could be criticized for going another route if they received a bad first TM11. I'm sticking with my replacement TM11, which is doing just fine, but I admit to initially being tempted to go for the refund (and writing off the return shipping) rather than the replacement. 

On another note, I posted in the LightJunction CPF Marketplace TM11 thread on Nov. 9 asking if they had any news from SYSMAX/NiteCore about the nature of the problem. LightJunction has not replied to my question yet, but I hope they take the time and effort to provide us a little feedback one way or the other.


----------



## peterharvey73 (Nov 13, 2011)

Is there a possibility that some cpf users had problems with their TM11 because they were mixing new and old batteries of the same make and model, or recharging two on one brand of charger, and the other two on another brand of charger?
Rather than getting four brand new batteries, and recharging on the same charger?


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## njet212 (Nov 13, 2011)

currently i got TM11 loan for review from Indonesia dealer, i found flickering issue on Turbo and High mode. Battery i use is Trusfire 3000 Mah Flame. First time i thought it caused by the battery. But i tried with fresh primary CR123 it is still flickering. I do love the UI that TM11 has, but what a shame, i found Nitecore products lalety has QC problem.


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## peterharvey73 (Nov 13, 2011)

njet212 said:


> currently i got TM11 loan for review from Indonesia dealer, i found flickering issue on Turbo and High mode. Battery i use is Trusfire 3000 Mah Flame. First time i thought it caused by the battery. But i tried with fresh primary CR123 it is still flickering. I do love the UI that TM11 has, but what a shame, i found Nitecore products lalety has QC problem.



The TM11 has 3x XM-L LED's, and apparently Nitecore says that it draw the maximum recommended current by Cree of something like 9 amps!
A Trustfire Flame 3000 mAH is not a hi quality battery, so it may not have a fast enough discharge rate.
I know that an Ultrafire Protected 2400 shuts off after a minute or so on my Zebralight SC600; others have reported that once we use good batteries like AW and Redilasts, the problem is cured.
Have you access to any AW's or Redilasts?

The problem with primary disposable CR123's is that they have a slower maximum discharge rate than rechargeables, thus the new Jetbeam RRT-0 XM-L only outputs 260 lumens on disposables, but will output 550 lumens or so on rechargeable 3.7 volts.
What make and model were your primary batteries? Panasonic or Surefire, or a reputable brand?
Have you access to any quality rechargeables like AW's or Redilasts?
I wonder if it's a battery issue, especially because there are 4x18650's or 8xCR123's, and a triple XM-L drawing a huge fast current.
In the past, I myself have been guilty of mismatching a hi quality light with a cheap battery.


Also, a few months ago, I did have a brand new RRT-0 S2 in June, and it flashed once everytime we turned it on - called a preflash.
I exchanged it immediately - problem gone.
Have you considered exchanging it like Varuscelli? Apparently his second example works fine...


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## gsteve (Nov 14, 2011)

I didnt love the ui , the size isnt all that handy and the power not really needed. When i went out and compared to the scorp the difference wasnt that drastic , compared to the size difference. Dont get me wrong its bright! But the scorpion drops into a pocket easy.


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## varuscelli (Nov 14, 2011)

gsteve said:


> I didnt love the ui , the size isnt all that handy and the power not really needed. When i went out and compared to the scorp the difference wasnt that drastic , compared to the size difference. Dont get me wrong its bright! But the scorpion drops into a pocket easy.



Well...in the Scorpion, aren't we talking about a 1x18650 (or 2xCR123A) flashlight? If I'm thinking of the right light (and maybe I'm not), I think we're really talking about two very different categories of flashlights. I'm pretty sure there would be a huge difference in output and significant runtime differences at comparable output levels. But maybe I'm picturing the wrong light...


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## Glenn7 (Nov 14, 2011)

Well I did get a dud one from LJ but sent it back asking them nicely to double check before sending another back and hey presto the second one is perfect - well the only thing I would change is the make the every day setting not quite so touchy, other than that its a very nice light a keeper IMO.


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## njet212 (Nov 14, 2011)

peterharvey73 said:


> The TM11 has 3x XM-L LED's, and apparently Nitecore says that it draw the maximum recommended current by Cree of something like 9 amps!
> A Trustfire Flame 3000 mAH is not a hi quality battery, so it may not have a fast enough discharge rate.
> I know that an Ultrafire Protected 2400 shuts off after a minute or so on my Zebralight SC600; others have reported that once we use good batteries like AW and Redilasts, the problem is cured.
> Have you access to any AW's or Redilasts?
> ...



I dont have enough AW 18650's to feed into TM11. At first, i thought exactly like you the problem was the battery. But i asked 2 TM11 user here about the flickering problem, they're using blue ultrafire 2400 Mah blue 18650's and 2600 Mah TF Flame 18650's just doing fine on their TM11 without flickering issue. So it's definetely the driver issue on my TM11 sample. The primary i used on TM11 are surefire.

No i dont think im going to exchange it because it just a loan for the review purpose and i will shipped back to Indonesian dealer aftet i finish the review.


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## excfenix (Nov 14, 2011)

njet212 said:


> I dont have enough AW 18650's to feed into TM11. At first, i thought exactly like you the problem was the battery. But i asked 2 TM11 user here about the flickering problem, they're using blue ultrafire 2400 Mah blue 18650's and 2600 Mah TF Flame 18650's just doing fine on their TM11 without flickering issue. So it's definetely the driver issue on my TM11 sample. The primary i used on TM11 are surefire.
> 
> No i dont think im going to ezchange it because it just a loan for the review purpose and i will shipped back to Indonesian dealer aftet i finish the review.



Selfbuilt's review should be out in the 'next day or two.'


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## peterharvey73 (Nov 14, 2011)

Njet, sounds like you may have a dud one like Varuscelli and Glenn7.
Selfbuilt says he's been working on the review the TM11 for a while - maybe he's had some problems too with his TM..


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## gsteve (Nov 14, 2011)

varuscelli said:


> Well...in the Scorpion, aren't we talking about a 1x18650 (or 2xCR123A) flashlight? If I'm thinking of the right light (and maybe I'm not), I think we're really talking about two very different categories of flashlights. I'm pretty sure there would be a huge difference in output and significant runtime differences at comparable output levels. But maybe I'm picturing the wrong light...



I think you have the right scorpion. And Yes i think you are right about the differences. I went out one night and used them both for what they are intended. No doubt the the tm11 was superior in everyway. But not enuff to justify the size.


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## varuscelli (Nov 14, 2011)

gsteve said:


> I think you have the right scorpion. And Yes i think you are right about the differences. I went out one night and used them both for what they are intended. No doubt the the tm11 was superior in everyway. But not enuff to justify the size.



Don't worry, I'm not trying to convince anyone that the TM11 is superior to any other particular flashlight. That all depends on needs and uses. My point was that the two lights (NiteCore TM11 and ThruNite Scorpion) are in what I'd have to call different categories (output, runtimes, size, weight, number of batteries, etc.), which makes a direct comparison kind of difficult. I don't think that in most cases the reasoning behind getting a TM11 would be the same as getting a Scorpion (as one way to put it).


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## Pandorum (Nov 14, 2011)

excfenix said:


> Selfbuilt's review should be out in the 'next day or two.'




If Nitecore can pinpoint and fix the bugs on this light, they have a real winner here. The light output to size factor is amazing.


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## selfbuilt (Nov 14, 2011)

excfenix said:


> Selfbuilt's review should be out in the 'next day or two.'


Still finishing up a few details - should be up by tomorrow night. :wave:


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## excfenix (Nov 15, 2011)

peterharvey73 said:


> I just paid and ordered for the TM11 and 4x Redilast 3100 mAH button tops - will let you know if any malfunctions once they arrive...



Did you get yours yet? And where did you get it?



selfbuilt said:


> Still finishing up a few details - should be up by tomorrow night. :wave:



It wouldn't be the same without emoticons, lol.


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## peterharvey73 (Nov 15, 2011)

I got TM11 at hkequipment.net. Should be here early next week, coz I live in Australia.

5x Redilast 3100 mAH from redilast.com for both TM11 4x18650 triple XM-L flooder, and Zebralight SC600 1x18650 single XM-L flooder should be here by the end of this week.
Traditionally, I buy AW's, esp 16340's, however this TM11 needs button tops, and only Redilast makes button tops; furthermore the Redilasts are 3100 mAH versus the AW's which max out at 2900 mAH flat top. Both are Panasonic batteries...


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## Glenn7 (Nov 15, 2011)

I'm using Callie's Kustoms 18650's (I think they are the same as readilast's anyway but cheaper) and they are working really well in all my lights - one thing I have noticed that they seem to charge back to full around the same time as each other, my other brands are all over the place.


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## varuscelli (Nov 15, 2011)

peterharvey73 said:


> I got TM11 at hkequipment.net. Should be here early next week, coz I live in Australia.
> 
> 5x Redilast 3100 mAH from redilast.com for both TM11 4x18650 triple XM-L flooder, and Zebralight SC600 1x18650 single XM-L flooder should be here by the end of this week.



Remind me of when Christmas is in Australia. Oh wait -- it looks like it's in about a week... :thumbsup:


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## excfenix (Nov 15, 2011)

Glenn7 said:


> I'm using Callie's Kustoms 18650's (I think they are the same as readilast's anyway but cheaper) and they are working really well in all my lights - one thing I have noticed that they seem to charge back to full around the same time as each other, my other brands are all over the place.



Was looking at those batteries. Reviews look pretty good. On better or on par with AW and Redilast. Yup and cheaper!


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## Glenn7 (Nov 17, 2011)

excfenix said:


> Was looking at those batteries. Reviews look pretty good. On better or on par with AW and Redilast. Yup and cheaper!


Yes you almost get the forth battery free....


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## Baddog (Nov 17, 2011)

Glenn7 said:


> I'm using Callie's Kustoms 18650's (I think they are the same as readilast's anyway but cheaper) and they are working really well in all my lights - one thing I have noticed that they seem to charge back to full around the same time as each other, my other brands are all over the place.


hello meester Glen, can you confirm that ur callies that fit ur tm11 are 3100's please, as my redilasts dont fit...i try to a calla u but a lady ona the uther side a she say u cant a talka as a u watching essa bee ess.


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## Glenn7 (Nov 17, 2011)

Baddog said:


> hello meester Glen, can you confirm that ur callies that fit ur tm11 are 3100's please, as my redilasts dont fit...i try to a calla u but a lady ona the uther side a she say u cant a talka as a u watching essa bee ess.


I must have been out of range but they fit like a glove no probs.


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## varuscelli (Nov 17, 2011)

Baddog said:


> hello meester Glen, can you confirm that ur callies that fit ur tm11 are 3100's please, as my redilasts dont fit...



Hey, Baddog. Question for you: On your Redilasts that don't fit the TM11, are you talking about Redilast 3100s or one of the lower capacity versions? I've got Redilast 3100s and they work just fine in my TM11.


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## Baddog (Nov 18, 2011)

varuscelli said:


> Hey, Baddog. Question for you: On your Redilasts that don't fit the TM11, are you talking about Redilast 3100s or one of the lower capacity versions? I've got Redilast 3100s and they work just fine in my TM11.


will let u know as soon as my replacement tm11 arrives, but on the initial tm11 i received the redilast 3100's didnt fit , were way too long...


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## varuscelli (Nov 18, 2011)

Baddog said:


> will let u know as soon as my replacement tm11 arrives, but on the initial tm11 i received the redilast 3100's didnt fit , were way too long...



Man, that is strange. I wonder what would account for it -- the batteries or the TM11? In any case, I hope the replacement works out for you.


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## Lightups (Jan 10, 2012)

Just got mine last week. Today when I turned it on on low mode only two out of three emitters came on. On the other modes they all lit up. After pressing the button a few time it's back to normal. Has this happen to anyone else? Does anyone have a possible explanation of why it only did that on low mode? I am using eight Titanium CR123s.

Thanks.


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## varuscelli (Jan 10, 2012)

Lightups said:


> Just got mine last week. Today when I turned it on on low mode only two out of three emitters came on. On the other modes they all lit up. After pressing the button a few time it's back to normal. Has this happen to anyone else? Does anyone have a possible explanation of why it only did that on low mode? I am using eight Titanium CR123s.
> 
> Thanks.



Interesting...and I don't think a good sign (obviously). I wonder if you might have gotten one of the older versions. Care to pass along the version information as shown on the interior head of the TM11? It's right under the word SYSMAX inside the contact rings of the head. It will show something along the lines of 3XML-V1.10-1108 (that's the version on mine).


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## Lightups (Jan 10, 2012)

varuscelli said:


> Interesting...and I don't think a good sign (obviously). I wonder if you might have gotten one of the older versions. Care to pass along the version information as shown on the interior head of the TM11? It's right under the word SYSMAX inside the contact rings of the head. It will show something along the lines of 3XML-V1.10-1108 (that's the version on mine).



It is V1.11-1110.


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## varuscelli (Jan 10, 2012)

Lightups said:


> It is V1.11-1110.



Hmm...well, I thought that version was supposed to have had previous issues addressed. Then again, this could just be an anomaly. I'm trying to recall if I've seen anyone having written about problems with that version, but I haven't been watching that closely lately. Maybe someone else will chime in.


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## peterharvey73 (Jan 10, 2012)

Lightups said:


> It is V1.11-1110.



You should contact your dealer, or Nitecore for warranty.
I have the same version. Mine has worked fine the last 2 months.
I run it hard on turbo for 20 minutes continuously...


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## Lightups (Jan 11, 2012)

Thanks for the replies. I made a short video showing the malfunction.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TLOEvDUUIDg


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## varuscelli (Jan 11, 2012)

Lightups: I'd definitely either return it to the seller for replacement or refund. I had to have my initial TM11 replaced, too (although not for the same reason as yours) and the replacement has worked flawlessly. I do recall a couple of other users mentioning problems similar to yours, but I thought they were all earlier versions than yours.


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## varuscelli (Jan 11, 2012)

Wow, I haven't really looked at the poll results for the TM11 malfunctions in a while. I have to say that I'm very surprised by there being more reports of malfunctions than not. I figured numbers would be skewed a bit toward malfunctions (those who have problems with theirs are more likely to seek out a thread like this than those who have no problems), but I'm still surprised. 

I wish the poll had been set up to show names of members who have voted.


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## Dillo0 (Jan 11, 2012)

I got my TM11 early in 2012, and mine is working as it is supposed to. I used it on turbo for a while today to find something in a large, dark storage room. Nothing odd to report. I'm using Redilast 3100mAh cells and have V1.11-1110.


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## HIDblue (Jan 12, 2012)

varuscelli said:


> Wow, I haven't really looked at the poll results for the TM11 malfunctions in a while. I have to say that I'm very surprised by there being more reports of malfunctions than not. I figured numbers would be skewed a bit toward malfunctions (those who have problems with theirs are more likely to seek out a thread like this than those who have no problems), but I'm still surprised.
> 
> I wish the poll had been set up to show names of members who have voted.



+1. That is surprising. Now, I'm glad I held off on buying it during the Christmas sales.


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## Dillo0 (Jan 12, 2012)

It would also be useful if people who had troublesome ones comment about how their situation has been handled and if it has been resolved. Also, it would be interesting if people tell what version they had.


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## varuscelli (Jan 12, 2012)

I hope an unhappy buyer didn't create multiple logins just to vote in the "malfunctions" choice serveral times under different e-mails/member names. I've seen stuff like that happen on other forums, and even though it might be unlikely, it seems to me that the percentage of malfunctions is suspiciously high (thus my wish for seeing who actually voted in each of these categories). I'm not saying it's true...just that it could be a possibility.


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## Baddog (Jan 12, 2012)

varuscelli said:


> I hope an unhappy buyer didn't create multiple logins just to vote in the "malfunctions" choice serveral times under different e-mails/member names. I've seen stuff like that happen on other forums, and even though it might be unlikely, it seems to me that the percentage of malfunctions is suspiciously high (thus my wish for seeing who actually voted in each of these categories). I'm not saying it's true...just that it could be a possibility.


i would say that the ones who voted that they received a good one may be the ones with multiple logins, as i personally know of no one in my part of the world who received one in good shape. In all fairness as well, my issues were fixed by BJ in the end.


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## Rokron (Jan 13, 2012)

My name is Ron Hammond, and I AM a flashaholic. # 100
This one light that I would like to have. But I wish that Nitecore would finally get these problems resolved. $260.00 is a lot of cash for a flashlight and I expect perfection when I get in my hands. I too wish to see who actually voted ya or na.


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## mishu.daniel (Jan 13, 2012)

I have mine for one month already. It's working perfect. Before buying it I discussed to some dealers here in Germany. They told me Nitecore is releasing a batch at the beginning of December with this issue solved. As soon as they received the batch I took one. Now, looking at mine, I see on the bottom of the head (unscrew first): 3XML-V1.11-1110. This means imo the manufacturing date. There was a post somewhere with a picture and this date seemed to point August and version 1.00 or 1.10, don't remember exactly. 
I had to decide between TM11 and RRT3. What can I say? Definitely I'm happy with TM11.


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## Dillo0 (Jan 14, 2012)

I used mine for quite some time, and am quite pleased with it. I have run it on all of its modes from turbo to low, and it has never failed me.


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## varuscelli (Jan 16, 2012)

Baddog said:


> i would say that the ones who voted that they received a good one may be the ones with multiple logins, as i personally know of no one in my part of the world who received one in good shape. In all fairness as well, my issues were fixed by BJ in the end.



My logic is that the units prone to malfunction seem to be associated with the early release. Mine was one of those, and I voted in the "yes, malfunction" category. But the numbers of good ones should have far surpassed the number of bad ones with the newly released versions by now. Yet the malfunctions numbers shown in this poll seem high as the "no malfunction" numbers, which has to be misleading in terms of the real percentage of units with no problems (which must be much lower than this poll seems to indicate percentage-wise). That, to me, seems strange...unless some malcontent had perhaps decided to take it upon himself to cast multiple votes (something that just comes to mind as a possibility). Seems much more likely than someone casting a bunch of "no malfunction" votes. But also, as I said WAY earlier in this thread, those with legitimate reason to complain (who received bad lights) will more likely seek out a thread like this and vote in it than those who have a light with no problems and who are not seeking information on bad units.


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## Noobiwan (Jan 16, 2012)

Hey guys,

I received my TM11 a couple of days ago(thanks LightJunction), but my flat top AW 3100's don't work. I won't be able to share my input until I get some "button tops" this week, so I will report back as soon as I am able to contribute. *Subscribed*


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## Sigmasailor (Jan 31, 2012)

Sorry to report that my TM11 (received 24th January) proved defective. It lasted for about 5 minutes at turbi power after which I decided to fully charge the batteries. It doesn't seem to like full batteries; it started to flicker and died. It is returned to the dealer who is now out of stock. I just hope the replacement is any better. Seems to be a 50/50 change of getting a good one?
How about some QC you guys at Nitecore....


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## F250XLT (Feb 1, 2012)

That is so disappointing, I want one of these really badly...


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## Noobiwan (Feb 1, 2012)

I apologize for not getting back to this thread as I originally planned. I received my TM11 from LightJunction about two weeks ago. It's a beautiful looking light, I was a little pessimistic about turning it on. With Redilast 3100mah 18650 cells, the light powered up in an instant and my entire living room was lit up like day. Unreal output from such a small package. I left it on for 12 minutes straight on full output, staring at the beam for any hint of flickering. There was none. And if I missed a flicker, it was infinitesimal, almost imperceptible to the naked eye. The next evening, I ran the light for 10 minutes on high output, again without issue. 

I have run the TM11 everyday for 2 weeks, averaging 7 to 10 minutes on turbo, another 10 minutes on high, and 15-20 minutes of EDC use(walking the dog), the light has performed without any defect. I am happy to report that I have received a functional Nitecore TM11 from LightJunction!

Earl


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## Sigmasailor (Feb 2, 2012)

So, there is hope? I guess I will just wait a couple of weeks and hope for the best. There simply isn't a real alternative (size wise) for the TM11.


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## gravelrash (Feb 8, 2012)

Glad to hear it Noobiwan - I really want one of these lights. Did you get the neutral white or "regular" flavor?


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## JudasD (Feb 8, 2012)

Received a TM11 a few days ago. Cool White version with VL11-1110 under the head. So far no flickering/blinking or cutt-offs. I have brand new Redilast 3,100's in there. After about 6 minutes the light will kick down from turbo to high. The head is only 120 degrees when this happens. Then runs in high for about 30 seconds and goes back to turbo. Rinse and repeat. At this point it's a thumbs up :thumbsup:

I do have one question though, it is with the o-ring. I noticed that the head is taking slices out of the o-ring when the head is geting tightened down. It is almost like the o-ring is being pinched. Has anyone else seen this? I applied some extra lube to the o-ring just incase things were dry, but it is still doing it. Any thoughts?

Thanks,
JD


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## peterharvey73 (Feb 9, 2012)

My o-ring still in perfect condition.
Try the spare o-ring the came in the box?

How is your battery carrier lock-out with the Redilast 3100's?
Still takes 1.25 turns anti-clockwise of the battery case to lock-out your TM11???
Mine locks-out after only 1/4 turn...


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## varuscelli (Feb 9, 2012)

JudasD said:


> I do have one question though, it is with the o-ring. I noticed that the head is taking slices out of the o-ring when the head is geting tightened down. It is almost like the o-ring is being pinched. Has anyone else seen this? I applied some extra lube to the o-ring just incase things were dry, but it is still doing it. Any thoughts?
> 
> Thanks,
> JD



When I received my replacement TM11 (I was one of those who initially received a malfunctioning one), I noticed that two or three times when I tried to tighten the head onto the body, the o-ring would start to bulge out of the gap between the body and head. 

It seemed to me as though the o-ring was behaving as if it had been stretched somehow and was actually a bit too large (or too loose) to grip the body tightly when the head was being tightened. After lubing and sort of "pressing" the o-ring back into place, and being careful each time I attach the head to the body, I'm not seeing the o-ring "pinch" going on any more. I still have the spare if I need it, but I'm very careful each time I attach the head to the body knowing that the o-ring might get pinched again (perhaps with the risk of severing it). 

I have the feeling that someone (either at the factory during assembly or at at the vendor while checking for "bad" units) actually severely pinched the o-ring in mine before I got it. But I still haven't had to resort to the spare.

This doesn't sound like exactly the same thing you're experiencing, but it's my version of an o-ring anomaly that I've experienced.


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## JudasD (Feb 9, 2012)

@peterharvey73: i still have to turn the body quite a bit in order to break the connection. No worries i suppose.
@varuscelli: the o-ring does seem to be a bit large in diameter. I tried to push the o-ring into the groove more, but it still pinches in a few spots. Ill try the spare o-ring. If that solves the issue then i'll call the vendor and see if they have any extras so i can have a true spare.

JD


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## Noobiwan (Feb 9, 2012)

gravelrash said:


> Glad to hear it Noobiwan - I really want one of these lights. Did you get the neutral white or "regular" flavor?



It's supposed to be the CW version, but it really seems more towards NW, imho. As you ramp up in brightness however, the beam seems to get a lot whiter. I have no problem with it either way. The beam profile is nice and so is the tint. For a handheld light the size of a small cup, you can light up a whole city block. 

I did pinch the O-ring once, so I applied a little Nyogel and its been fine since. I'm just slow and careful when I put the head back on.


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## Sigmasailor (Feb 9, 2012)

I'm due to get a new one today; will keep you posted.
How can you tell which color you have?

So, just got it; this time with flat top batteries (first batch had a small button).
Id didn't stop working within 10 minutes but I'm now charging the (Eden 3100) batteries.
I also managed to wiggle the strap in without breaking the thin line this time; for now: all is well.

My revision/serial number is: 3XML-V1(L?).11-1110


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## peterharvey73 (Feb 9, 2012)

You have the latest version.

However, just be careful.
HKJ and Selfbuilt says that using Flat Top batteries in the TM11 is a "hit and miss" affair.
Even though the light is turning on, it may only be operating on: one, two, or three batteries only, and not on all four batteries simultaneously.
I use Redilast 3100 mAH Button Tops, and I have no problems whatsoever.

Strange.
The Eden 3100 Flat Top is called a flat top.
However on photo it seems to have a raised positive contact above the black plastic wrapping material?
But then AW 3100 Flat Tops look like they have a raised positive contact too, but they are in fact flush fitting flat tops.
Be careful; if it has a truly flat top, not all four batteries may be making contact simultaneously...


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## Sigmasailor (Feb 9, 2012)

Thanks for the tip. Just (impatient and batteries not full) did a second test. It starts cycling between turbo and high after some 10 minutes.
Decided to first fully charge them to test charger.
I'm happy report all 4 dropped in voltage so they were all used in parallel. On my first batch of batteries (with buttons: http://www.knivesandtools.nl/nl/pt/-eden-quality-18650-batterij-3100-mah-button-top.htm) I noted that light didn't fully close but did work (until it died). KATO sent me flat tops with new light.

So, now waiting for the charger to finish.


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## Sigmasailor (Feb 9, 2012)

Thanks for the tip. Just (impatient and batteries not full) did a second test. It starts cycling between turbo and high after some 10 minutes.
Decided to first fully charge them to test charger.
I'm happy report all 4 dropped in voltage so they were all used in parallel. On my first batch of batteries (with buttons: http://www.knivesandtools.nl/nl/pt/-eden-quality-18650-batterij-3100-mah-button-top.htm) I noted that light didn't fully close but did work (until it died). KATO sent me flat tops with new light.

So, now waiting for the charger to finish.


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## JudasD (Feb 9, 2012)

Sigmasailor said:


> Thanks for the tip. Just (impatient and batteries not full) did a second test. It starts cycling between turbo and high after some 10 minutes.
> Decided to first fully charge them to test charger.
> I'm happy report all 4 dropped in voltage so they were all used in parallel. On my first batch of batteries (with buttons: http://www.knivesandtools.nl/nl/pt/-eden-quality-18650-batterij-3100-mah-button-top.htm) I noted that light didn't fully close but did work (until it died). KATO sent me flat tops with new light.
> 
> So, now waiting for the charger to finish.



10 minutes is great! I was only able to get a litle over 6 minutes. It is about 60 degrees F here, so if it is colder where you are then that could be how you got 10.

JD


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## Sigmasailor (Feb 9, 2012)

10 minutes was an estimate. My new charger is now perfect and charges the batteries up to 4.21V.
The new batteries fit perfectly and I can fully close the light (not so with the button top ones). After the 15 minute duration of the below test they were all at 4.05 V; they all share the load perfectly.

So I did a second test and looked at my watch this time: a real test, ahum......
It worked on turbo perfectly for 6 minutes, then one of the 3 LED's shows some flickering (lasted a couple of seconds each time).
Between 7 and 8 minutes it started to cycle between Turbo and High (30-60 second periods). One of the LED's (the same all the time) continued to flicker every now and than.
I continued my test for 15 minutes. Using my DMM temp sensor it reached a max of 48 C or 118 F; nice and warm but not hot. Test started at room temp (19C or 69F).

So, quite a lot of progress made after a two week wait: proper charger, 4 proper batteries and 2 out of 3 non flickering LEDS. Pity about the third one. To be continued....

O, no; after writing this mail and cool down the third LED is now completely kaput....It cycles between flickering and dead.

I let it cool again and good news: the third LED recovered.... for 20 seconds. Now it is off and flashes every now and than.

I informed my supplier and hope to get my third light soon. I also pointed the Nitecore people to this forum (but I suppose they know of it).


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## JudasD (Feb 9, 2012)

Sigmasailor said:


> O, no after writing this mail and cool down the third LED is now completely kaput....It cycles between flickering and dead.



This is very sad to hear. I am sorry you are having so much trouble with this light. It is a new version of the light as well. A single LED failure appears to be happening quite often.

JD


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## Sigmasailor (Feb 9, 2012)

Oh, well I'm pretty sure I will get another one. This one is a lot better than the first one. If this progress continues my next light will have 4 LED's with an output of 2700 lumen.....
I'll settle for 3 LED's at 2000 though.


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## varuscelli (Feb 9, 2012)

Sigmasailor, I think it absolutely sucks that you've received two TM11 units that are both defective, ESPECIALLY if the second one is a part of the batch from which problems were supposedly eliminated. I'm not sure what to say...or THINK...about that.


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## Phanatic (Feb 9, 2012)

I know what to think. This light is not ready for prime time.


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## JudasD (Feb 10, 2012)

Phanatic said:


> I know what to think. This light is not ready for prime time.



I think the light is ready for primetime. It's the assembly line that isnt.


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## peterharvey73 (Feb 10, 2012)

You know, the dealers aren't God.
Sometimes, it can be the dealers too.
For example, one customer returns the TM, and the dealer esp sales staff, [without checking the TM thoroughly] - re-stocks it, rather than posting it back to Nitecore; [to save money too].
That same TM is then resold to another customer as a brand new TM.
Thus we have these problems...


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## Sigmasailor (Feb 10, 2012)

I can't believe dealers are that irresponsible. They have to pay 20 or 30 USD for shipping back and fort and are also loosing money.
I got a response from Nitecore (thanks for the quick and positive response): they stand behind their product and are convinced that sometime I will get a good one. 
I don't understand why Nitecore doesn't properly test (for an hour at least) these lights before shipping them out. I'm not the only one having problems. This affair is costing Nitecore money and their good name if they are not careful.

Eric

PS, as always my supplier also reacted quickly; they are as surprised as I am, but out of stock with the next batch due to arrive in two weeks. I'm not blaming my supplier; there is not much they can do about this. Maybe Nitecore feels the need to do something extra?

OK, nothing left to do than being patient again; we have a Dutch saying: 'driemaal is scheepsrecht' (try to Google that if you do not understand Dutch); I hope that will apply. I also hope to get some sort of real assurance from Nitecore; it's them that need to get their act together.

Eric


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## JudasD (Feb 10, 2012)

Sigmasailor said:


> OK, nothing left to do than being patient again; we have a Dutch saying: 'driemaal is scheepsrecht' (try to Google that if you do not understand Dutch); I hope that will apply. I also hope to get some sort of real assurance from Nitecore; it's them that need to get their act together.
> 
> Eric



We have the same kind of saying in the USA: the third time's a charm. However, sometimes the fourth time is the charm, or the fifth time, or sixth.....:lolsign:


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## Sigmasailor (Feb 10, 2012)

Yep, that's it. Isn't Google nice? Just gave the boys and girls at Nitecore a good challenge. My supplier (again) has to wait for two weeks before new stock arrives.

Here is the challenge I mailed to Nitecore:
So, if you really want to impress me: I challenge you to *express* mail me (DHL has 24 hours service) a replacement at once, don’t just think about it but just do it. 

Sooo, let's see what they do.


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## peterharvey73 (Feb 10, 2012)

Sigmasailor said:


> I can't believe dealers are that irresponsible. They have to pay 20 or 30 USD for shipping back and fort and are also loosing money.
> I got a response from Nitecore (thanks for the quick and positive response): they stand behind their product and are convinced that sometime I will get a good one.
> I don't understand why Nitecore doesn't properly test (for an hour at least) these lights before shipping them out. I'm not the only one having problems. This affair is costing Nitecore money and their good name if they are not careful.
> 
> ...



One reason why I suspect the dealers also play a role is as follows.
Last year, I received a faulty Jetbeam RRT-0 S2 with a "pre-flash".
A pre-flash meaning that on a lower lumen setting, the RRT-0 would do a single camera-like flash at full output, before switching onto the lower lumen mode.
I telephoned the dealer, staff answered, then staff spoke to the owner, and got back to me.
The staff said that the pre-flash in my RRT-0 is an absolutely normal occurrence with many flashlight brands including 4Sevens etc, and that there is no fault in the flashlight.
They further said that if I'm not satisfied, I was to post the flashlight back to them for an exchange or refund.
I emailed Jetbeam myself, and Jetbeam replied that there was a fault in the electronics, and that I could either return it to Jetbeam in China, or contact the dealer.
Because of this owner and staff attitude that a pre-flash is normal, it is _possible _that on return to the dealer, this pre-flashing RRT-0 was re-stocked, and onsold to an unsuspecting customer, rather than returned to the factory.
Thus, I say that the dealers are human too; they're no God.
It is theoretically possible that some of these faulty TM11's have been quickly inspected, where no fault was found, re-stocked, and then re-sold.
If we quickly inspect a returned TM11, we may not find any fault in it.
If we run the TM11 for 10 minutes, then things may be different, but many sales staff are too lazy to do this.
They'll only turn the flashlight on for 30 to 60 seconds, and conclude that it's fine, re-stock, and re-sell.
Hence, it's not just the engineers and factory, but the dealer also plays a role in quality control...


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## JudasD (Feb 10, 2012)

There is also the grey area of greed and employee training (or lack thereof) . Remember, these vendors are businesses just like McDonalds, Taco Bell, etc. At 5pm they want to go home too. I am not saying they are absolved of the wrong doing. Im simply saying that all of us at some point in our lives have done some corner cutting when beer:30 was closing in 

JD


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## Sigmasailor (Feb 13, 2012)

Well, Nitecore is not going to fulfill my little challenge. They claim to be out of stock too? Also they found my mail after the weekend so they claim.
They are always answering mails in a positive way; doesn't solve my problem but is a nice touch.

So, as stated earlier; nothing left to do but patently wait for the third TM11 to arrive.

About KATO: I am sure this dealer takes matters seriously and would not willingly ship broken lights. I've done business with them before and never had any problems. Even now they take care of me without any fuss. It is just a pity the stock seems to have run out.


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## PhatPhil (Feb 13, 2012)

Hopefully the new stock will be an updated build revision to resolve these issue.

Waiting till current issues are resolved before pressing the buy button


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## Wizman (Feb 18, 2012)

I received my new TM11 a couple of days ago and started testing last night. I'm using brand new Redilast 3100's which fit and work perfectly. TM11 model under the head is *V1.11-1110*. 

So far no flickering, no blinking, no cut-offs, no drama. Seems to be working fine. Light is amazingly bright and easy to control once you get use to the multi-stage button switch. Craftsmanship appears to be excellent...a very well-made light. :thumbsup:

The TM11's "standby mode / lockout and unlock functions" is really nice to have and easy to control. A simple 1/4 turn of the head (might be a bit less) disconnects the power for storage if needed. 

The TM11 feels nice to hold (I have normal size man-hands) and its size is smaller then I expected...even after seeing all of the photos in various reviews. Weight distribution contributes to the nice way the TM11 feels in hand (well balanced).

I also purchased the diffuser from the Eagletac M3C4...which screws down and fits the TM11 exactly. Just unscrew the chrome bezel and replace it with the Eagletac diffuser. Changes an already floody light into an even more floody light. The diffuser may not work for your application, but it is sure worth the $10US I paid for it.

I will continue to test my new TM11 over the next few days and report back if any problem arise. But so far it is fully operational, looks and works great, and is easy to use considering all of the neat features it has controlled by a single button switch.


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## Sigmasailor (Feb 18, 2012)

Wizman said:


> I received my new TM11 a couple of days ago and started testing last night. I'm using brand new Redilast 3100's which fit and work perfectly. TM11 model under the head is *V1.11-1110*.



OK, some good news. That is the same version number I had on my second TM11 (where one of the LEDs died within half an hour); I was under the impression Nitecore made some more improvements after 20/1/2012. Maybe the version number doesn't say it all. I hope to get the third TM11 (fresh from China) next week; I wonder what the version will be of that one.


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## Sigmasailor (Feb 23, 2012)

Later than I hoped; but I just got my third TM11. Version number *3XML-V1.12-1111* (a third series).
Putting it through a 'stress test' right now.
One minute and counting (3 working LED's and cold white)......

Just to keep you all informed: it lasts 10 minutes at Turbo and than starts switching between high and turbo in (nice) 1-2 minute intervals. It is really nice and warm now; I didn't check the temperature this time, want to make sure this is a keeper first.

Soooo, 20 minutes and still going strong......

Curiosity got the better of me. Attached PT-100: temperature rises till 56 C or 134 F (higher than previous one) before going back to high. Guess it's a keeper. It's been running for 40 minutes. KATO also tested this one for an hour.

There remains a simple conclusion: when you want one of these lights make sure you get one with version *3XML-V1.12-1111 *and you will get a good one. There is no denying the output is simply fantastic.

After 2:30 hours runtime I decided to recharge the batteries (all were at 3.30V started at 4.20V). Finally I will be able to test it in the dark.

Eric


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## varuscelli (Feb 23, 2012)

Sigmasailor said:


> There remains a simple conclusion: when you want one of these lights make sure you get one with version *3XML-V1.12-1111 *and you will get a good one. There is no denying the output is simply fantastic.



Glad you finally got one that functions normally! Your patience seems to have paid off. :thumbsup:

But just as a cautionary bit of input, most of us thought the second release of the TM11 represented one in which the glitches had been addressed, but apparently there were a few of those that malfunctioned, too. I think we need a bit more time and more tested units (or at least time with no reported glitches) to come to the conclusion that delivered units from this latest iteration will all be trouble free. I'm not trying to be pessimistic about that -- just cautious based on past evidence (and I sincerely hope that all the malfunction issues have been successfully addressed). 

As a repeat note on earlier versions, when I had to have my originally purchased TM11 replaced (one of the earliest released versions), I got a replacement from the that same released version (V1.10-1108) and the replacement has performed without any detectable problems. I don't use it heavily (in fact, it's seen only very light overall use), but it has never shown me any indication of performing other than it should.


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## JudasD (Feb 23, 2012)

varuscelli said:


> Glad you finally got one that functions normally! Your patience seems to have paid off. :thumbsup:
> 
> But just as a cautionary bit of input, most of us thought the second release of the TM11 represented one in which the glitches had been addressed, but apparently there were a few of those that malfunctioned, too. I think we need a bit more time and more tested units (or at least time with no reported glitches) to come to the conclusion that delivered units from this latest iteration will all be trouble free. I'm not trying to be pessimistic about that -- just cautious based on past evidence (and I sincerely hope that all the malfunction issues have been successfully addressed).
> 
> As a repeat note on earlier versions, when I had to have my originally purchased TM11 replaced (one of the earliest released versions), I got a replacement from the that same released version (V1.10-1108) and the replacement has performed without any detectable problems. I don't use it heavily (in fact, it's seen only very light overall use), but it has never shown me any indication of performing other than it should.



There is also a chance that the new model number might not represent a difference in the light, but a difference in the manufacturing process. Where i work we put an LP# (line production number) at the end of serial numbers when we change the production process but not the product itself. So the serial number wont change, but the digit after LP would change. This is how we keep track of production defects vs. design defects. Just a though.

JD


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## Sigmasailor (Feb 24, 2012)

Some more good news. I've really put the third TM11 through it's paces. No problems; it performs flawless.

I've just completed a third 'stress test'. The first two I stopped every now and then to allow it to cool for a couple of times.

Just completing the third test where I switched it on and just left it in Turbo. It took three whole hours to completely drain the batteries. It is not running on Turbo all the time but it switches to high regularly (less so in the third hour).

I've just taken the batteries out (light was still on but very dim); they were all at 2.6V which raises a new question. Should batteries (these are protected ones) drain below 2.8V?

The're now slowly recovering to just above 2.7V towards 2.8V. When they cool down I will recharge them.

Hurray for V1.12-1111!


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## Patriot (Feb 28, 2012)

Sigmasailor said:


> I've just taken the batteries out (light was still on but very dim); they were all at 2.6V which raises a new question. Should batteries (these are protected ones) drain below 2.8V?




2.6V is awfully low for those cells. I'm not sure I'd let my own cells drop that low but appreciate the run time test that you provided. 3 hours is impressive.


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## Patriot (Feb 28, 2012)

Duplicate post..


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## knowledge (Feb 28, 2012)

i will be receiving mine soon and will test it out,hopefully its good


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## msink (Mar 3, 2012)

If I buy an older TM11, will I be able to have it "upgraded" by Nitecore? How would that take place and would I need to show it had an issue? It's an October model. Is it possible to get it to the 1111 specs w/o charge?


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## peterharvey73 (Mar 4, 2012)

You should email them, and ask them...


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## boofy (Mar 4, 2012)

mine is currently in transit. it is version 1.12-1111. i will try it out when it arrives and put up some results.


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## maunaloa (Mar 14, 2012)

Panasonic NCR18650A 3100 mAh batteries (more accurately 19670 size) do NOT work in the TM11 ... the + button is too short. I know ... I could build up the button with solder, but I have plenty of other lights in which to use the Pannies.


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## Dillo0 (Mar 14, 2012)

They say to use protected cells. After all, it is using four cells in parallel. You need all the protection you can get.


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## maunaloa (Mar 14, 2012)

I think Panasonic NCR18650A are protected, even though they aren't 67 mm long (trying to clarify this point). The Panasonic NCR18650A does not have as tall a + button as Sanyo, Soshine, etc., thus the problem.


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## boofy (Mar 14, 2012)

i have read that the blazer 18650 cells (panasonic ncr) work in the tm11. it seems not all batteries are the same even though the donor cells might be.


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## maunaloa (Mar 15, 2012)

I think the issue is the + button on the NCR18650A is only a _fraction _of one mm above the wrap, and the annular design of the TM11's + connection. The Pannies don't rattle inside the TM11, so I don't think length is an issue.


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## Dillo0 (Mar 20, 2012)

Are you using a cell that uses Panasonic NCR18650A cells or just Panasonic NCR18650A cells by themselves? If they are just the cells, they are unprotected. The Redilast, EagleTac, AW, etc. are all Panasonic NCR18650A cells with an additional circuit.


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## luvbelly (Apr 2, 2012)

I just ordered up one of these and was relieved to confirm mine will be the V 1.12-1111 version. I have 4 Eagletac 3100s on the way which I am told will fit and work with this light. Hopefully it won't take to long to arrive and will give me years of trouble free service.


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## BullsEyeLantern (Apr 8, 2012)

Good to hear that the V 1.12-1111 seems to be holding its own. I was planning on an M3C4 Triple, but this one might be my cup of tea!


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## MSlight (Oct 24, 2012)

Hi, I just got mine couple of hours ago, and when I turned it on, only 2 LEDs were lit, I tried turn on turbo mode, still 2 LEDs lit instead of 3.
So I'm guessing it's DOA maybe? I'm using 4 Orbtronic 18650 3100mAh batteries.


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## peterharvey73 (Oct 25, 2012)

Contact the dealer for authority to exchange.
You pay return postage, but you shouldn't have to pay for re-postage...


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## kirby (Dec 21, 2012)

MSlight said:


> Hi, I just got mine couple of hours ago, and when I turned it on, only 2 LEDs were lit, I tried turn on turbo mode, still 2 LEDs lit instead of 3.
> So I'm guessing it's DOA maybe? I'm using 4 Orbtronic 18650 3100mAh batteries.



I bought one in May this year from Lumen Tactical LLC (optics_outlet) and it is a Version 3: V1.12-1111

Total run time was probably 45 min in total. Rarely ran it on turbo and if I did that it would only be a few seconds long. Then suddenly two weeks ago when I turned it on only two out of the three LEDs light up!!!

I am in Australia. The US seller wants me to pay for the postage BOTH ways. Each way would be around $25-30. * Not impressed !!!! * This is totally not my fault. Why do I have to pay for the postage to have a replacement sent back to me? Most vendors don't charge that. Some vendors even cover all postages.

I am now contacting Nitecore in China.


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## HighlanderNorth (Dec 21, 2012)

This is the first time I have ran into this thread, Didnt realize there were so many problems with the TM11. According to the poll, almost 40% of people who bought the light had problems with it!

I hope the EA4 from Nitecore doesnt have similar issues. I havent yet ordered one, but was considering it.


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## Nekolf (Apr 10, 2014)

I received new TM11 XM-L2 2500lm version from Japanese dealer last week. It has a bit yellowish tint but completely works without defects.


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## RoBeacon (Dec 4, 2014)

I have had mine for 2 years now with light use. I started having issues with the switch a couple months ago. The softpress works fine, however the full press either doesnt' turn the light off, randomly activates strobe or wont turn on to turbo. This should be covered under warranty. I'm working on warranty process now. I'll update later with how well that's handled.


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## RoBeacon (Apr 7, 2015)

I have an RMA number but have been too lazy to send it in. I have another Nitecore light that is also having trouble. My SRT-7's main emitter has gone on the fritz. I noticed if I thump it against my hand relatively hard the emitter will blink but that is the only time it will come on. I was considering trying to fix it myself but I don't see any non-destructive ways to disassemble. I think I may be done buying nitecore / jetbeam =( . I really like some of there lights and ideas but it just seems that the quality really isn't there IMO. I baby these lights and have problems. I have beat the crap out of my 7777's and they are still operating great.


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