# What lights are in your bug out bag?



## Tmack (Apr 10, 2014)

What lights would you guys bring in an extreme emergency? Include lights, supplies, survival gear etc. 
Just curious to see what people really value. 

I'm taking tk75vn killer throw / d40avn, d25cvn. 
42" Ronin katana, 12g shotgun, 9mm, machete, and several fixed blade knives, Crowbar. 

Magnesium rod and striker, multitool, 4" metal bowl/pot, 50' nylon rope, 100' paracord. 

Water, dried meals, condensed milk/ formula for my son. 

First aid kit, antiseptic, medical tape, bandages. 

This is all in a bag by my hallway just in case, minus the guns, and I have an empty bag to load up on food before leaving. After I had my son, I thought about all of this, and decided to be prepared for anything. 
Does anyone have a kit, or if not, what would you throw in it?


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## mcnair55 (Apr 10, 2014)

As a UK member i am not familiar with a Bug out Bag,could you explain what it is and what it is for please.


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## Tmack (Apr 10, 2014)

It's a bag full of supplies in case you need to leave home and possibly survive for any period of time. It would include anything you think would aid in short or long term survival. 
Your emergency supply bag.


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## ven (Apr 10, 2014)

WOW can i ask why you would need all that,is it in an earthquake zone or prone to any kind of natural disasters so to speak.


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## Tmack (Apr 10, 2014)

I live in the inner city of Baltimore, so nothing is out of the question. I have seen actual war between civilians and police on my back alley. You just never know if and when you'll need to be prepared for anything. These things may be the reason my family survives, and others won't. Be it natural disaster or whatever problem arrives. 
Better have it and not need it........ I just never want something serious to happen, and because of not being prepared, I let my family down, by not protecting, or meeting their needs.


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## TMedina (Apr 10, 2014)

Be mindful of topic drift.

A "Bug out Bag" also known as a "Bail Out Bag", more frequently referred to as a BOB. In some circles, similar to a "72-hour bag" or a "go bag". 

Basically, the concept is a pre-packaged bag that someone can "grab and go", and be prepared to live for three days - possibly more- away from home. The usual supplies can be found: toiletries, change of clothes, flashlight or three, and so on.

On point, I have: a Surefire E2L-AA, E1L, G2 w/ M61LLL HCRI-2 drop-in, Fenix E11, Fenix E01, and a Fenix headlamp - HL22. A little overkill, I grant, but I like the overlap between commonly available battery types (AAA, AA) and CR123s. And all of them are geared towards long runtimes and reliability of flashier, brighter "tactical" lights.


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## Hooked on Fenix (Apr 10, 2014)

Usually, I split up my gear into different containers or bags to adjust the bag depending on my needs and what I am allowed to carry in the area.
Survival Kit- One quart zip lock bag with: disposable handwarmers, Chlorine dioxide water purification tablets (can use quart bag as water container for purification in emergencies), Firesteel.com Gobspark Armageddon Firesteel, some bandaids and alcohol prep pads, 3 oz bottle of SPF 50 sunblock, 1 oz. spray bottle of near 100% DEET bug repellent, duct tape, chapstick, waterproof match case w/ 20 matches, backpacker's towel, handful of hard pepermints, coin cell flashlight, Storm whistle, and 2 Wetfire firestarters.
First Aid Kit- One quart bag full of first aid supplies (no designer kits).
Signaling Kit- One quart bag with Orion Aerial Flare, Road Flare, and Orange Smoke Signal.
Cooking Kit- Titanium pot with MSR Pocket Rocket Stove, MSR electric ignition, matches, Lexan spoon, and 2 Light My Fire Grandpa's Forks all nestled inside pot.
Butane canister for fuel.
Lighting kit- Fenix HL30 headlight, Quark QP2A XP-G2, Plenty of AA Eneloops, 4AA Powerfilm solar charger.
Shelter- Integral Designs Silponcho, 50+ feet of Kelty Striptease Guyline cord
Knife/Knives/Multitool- Usually a Light My Fire Fire Knife in the bag and a Victorinox One Hand Trekker and a Leatherman Core on my belt or in pockets. If I go off trails, I bring a 7 inch Kabar knife. Also carry a Pocket Pal knife sharpener.
Water purification- Sawyer Squeeze filter and/or Lifestraw (If I know in advance that this will be long term and will have to filter a lot of poor quality water, I'd bring a Katadyn Pocket filter with Carbon Cartridge and a Steripen as well).
Belt- Homemade 550 paracord belt- has 72 feet of cord, about 30 feet of Jute Twine sewn in for tinder and a firesteel toggle for lighting the Jute Twine.
Serious Firestarters- 3 inch cotton pads about 2/3 soaked with wax (can be lit with a spark and burn 6-10 minutes each)
2 1 liter Nalgene bottles filled with water.

This is the base kit excluding food (I bring food. I'm just not listing it.) It is kept light for a reason. If you need to get out of dodge, you don't want a heavy pack slowing you down and making you burn more calories. If I plan to be outside overnight, I'll add a sleeping bag, tent, extra clothes and food.


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## yearnslow (Apr 10, 2014)

Because of where I live, and it's reputation for political instability, I have such a bag.
Contents:
Glock 17, surefire E2L AA outdoorsman, surefire LX2, Fenix TK60.

High energy food bars, water filtration unit, Firesteel and tinder, small aluminium cooking pot.
Comprehensive medical kit including, dental tools, sutures and needle, canula and hypodermics.
Broad spectrum Anti-biotics, codeine, paracetamol, electrolyte powders etc...to many other items to name.

A machete, Two fixed blades, Leatherman and a sharpener.
A small canopy made from the fly sheet of an old tent, rope, string, duct tape.
Magnifying glass, A hip flask of Brandy, cable ties, four lightsticks, lots of other things to numerous to mention......
$2000 Us dollars.

Could go on, but you get the idea......


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## kj2 (Apr 10, 2014)

Fenix E11, HL30, Olight S15, Lumintop Tool AAA. But my bag has more of a EDC/ small emergency roll.


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## N_N_R (Apr 10, 2014)

Fenx E11 (just because I have two of them); Fenix E01 / Olight i3s (because of the long run times) [all of these because of the common battery type]

I thought the topic was about lights only, but if not, then...:

- cash
- a little gold & silver just in case
- a spare phone with a charger (though who knows if there's gonna be electricity)
- an empty pocket for my netbook and charger... 

Basically not much, but mine isn't a disaster - prone area... I mean, we did have a freaking strong earthquake here two years ago and it happened at 3 a.m. ... but even then all those prepper things weren't necessary. Didn't need even a single flashlight.. weird stuff.


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## dss_777 (Apr 10, 2014)

I wonder what the folks on the anvil collecting forum pack in their BOBs?

It'd be tough! You'd already have your EDC anvil, but would have to add your "big" anvil, just-in-case. Then, you'd need those "cheap" anvils to pass out to people who weren't smart enough to bring their own. And, of course, the "back-up" anvil... because "two is one, one is none".

Sometimes I envy the feather collectors...


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## Tmack (Apr 10, 2014)

Lol I just got an anvil too. My mailman now hates me  

Mines more of a home anvil. The travel edc ones are too pricey


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## reppans (Apr 10, 2014)

I'll admit to having a bizarre mentality/philosophy on preparedness. Nearly every sport/recreation/hobby I enjoy has significant secondary value in preparedness, however, I do next to nothing which has preparedness as a primary motive - eg, I have very little in food/fuel/water stores, and will not pack a BOB.

I'm a gearhead into camping (backpacking & RV), projectile target sports, motorcycles, and all forms of human-powered transport, with a weird fetish for folding/collapsable/portable stuff (like boats and bikes). It might take me a few of hours at home, but I could assemble some wicked good BOBs and BOVs for most situations, but otherwise, everything is "prepped" for recreational use only. 

With regard to flashlights, my SHTF priorities are same as for camping - low lumens, massive runtimes, durability, user-serviceability, and common cells w/broad battery versatility. A lego'd Quark QPA-X best meets my needs and will run common AA/AAAs/9Vs and anything between CR123s and 18650s with the piece of tinfoil I EDC in a wallet. Maybe add in a QB2A for S&R, backup, and parts redundancy .


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## mcnair55 (Apr 10, 2014)

TMedina said:


> Be mindful of topic drift.
> 
> A "Bug out Bag" also known as a "Bail Out Bag", more frequently referred to as a BOB. In some circles, similar to a "72-hour bag" or a "go bag".
> 
> ...



The op was kind enough to supply another member(s) with what a BOB is and no way was this topic drift far from it as he has given me an idea to consider for myself and i would think carefully what light i would put into mine.


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## Dr. Strangelove (Apr 10, 2014)

dss_777 said:


> I wonder what the folks on the anvil collecting forum pack in their BOBs?
> 
> It'd be tough! You'd already have your EDC anvil, but would have to add your "big" anvil, just-in-case. Then, you'd need those "cheap" anvils to pass out to people who weren't smart enough to bring their own. And, of course, the "back-up" anvil... because "two is one, one is none".
> 
> Sometimes I envy the feather collectors...



This has got to be one of the best responses I've ever read. Now we know what we sound like to non-flashaholics!

My BOB has a Maglite Mini Pro+ and a Safelight Handyman, plus some spare lithiums. May not sound like much, but if we don't shelter in place during a natural disaster we'll go by car (can't really walk anywhere because we'd be taking my mother-in-law). The car has a Foursevens Quark Turbo QB2A, a Rayovac Indestructible and a Spark SG5 headlamp, plus spare lithiums. My wife and I each EDC Quark QTAs and Peak Eigers, so we're well prepared with lighting.


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## buds224 (Apr 10, 2014)

D25C mini, PD32, Quark RGB, Eagletac D25LC2 Color, RRT0, and D20A. My Maxpedition Xantha has lots of little pockets to fill.


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## think2x (Apr 10, 2014)

The three things in this pic in my bag are the G23(right) the Kroma(also right) and the JK knife(front)


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## wjv (Apr 10, 2014)

No BoB but I do have a Get-Home bag

all the typical stuff.

Between my get Home bag and the car trunk
Food, water, heat sheets, meds, first-aid, knife, water filter straws, tea bags, metal cups, sugar, solid fuel stove, cord, tarp & tent stakes, compass, map of county, Razor A5 Lux scooter (see photo), a disease contamination kit.





Pistol & ammo (have a CCW permit)

Fenix E11 + a 12 pack of AA cells

I also always have my EagleTac D25A clicky with me.


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## Timothybil (Apr 10, 2014)

I am slowly building one. Right now I have a 10 Ah portable battery for recharging my phone & tablet, my EA4W, and some odds and ends. I plan on getting a 14 watt solar panel to recharge the battery. I'm also looking at some energy bars, some survival chocolate (gotta have my chocolate), some first aid stuff, fire starter, pocket knife, water purifier. I am fortunate in that I don't HAVE to have my meds, but most are pills so I can just grab and stuff on the way out the door. My coat and a couple of liter water bottles I keep filled in the fridge, and away I go. 

Oh, I EDC my Streamlight ProTac EMS, so that is always with me. I have a Photon II on the zipper of my coat, and my TM11 and Seraph 6 are on the way out the door.


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## Monocrom (Apr 11, 2014)

Other than my *Princeton Tec EOS* headlamp running off of 3AAAs, I've decided to standardize on AA batteries for the rest of the lights in my BOB.

*Maratac AA Stainless Steel model* (older version) from County Comm as my main light in my BOB. 

Next is a* 2AA Enercell LED model with side switch* from Radio Shack. Bought as an inexpensive light that can get the job done as an improvised Kubaton (carried in an open-top, outer, pouch in my BOB). And is cheap enough that I can hand it off to someone who might be traveling with me, and needs a good light. Simple click on and off U.I.

Also have one *glow-stick* as well as an *advanced "glow-stick."* Runs off of coin cells, has a button side switch. 3 LEDs at one end. Glow-stick body with a flasher mode. Very cheaply done, but works. (Not a fan of ordinary glow-sticks.) Yes, you can replace the coin cells in it. But not really worth doing so considering how cheap the advanced glow-sticks are.

Now that's not including my main light that I EDC. (Most of the time my Milky modded SureFire L1 that pumps out 40 lumens on "low," and 200+ on high mode. All out the front lumens numbers.) Plus my keychain light. (Usually a quality single-AAA model. Got a handful of those.) And usually a cheap single LED coin-cell light (squeeze type, promotional, variety [often Lighthound branded one]). The coin-cell light is to hand out to a stranger during an emergency if they need a decent light. (If there's a Blackout inside a subway car or loss of power, assuming it's not packed as Hell and a fight over the light won't break out, a tiny LED light puts out a useful level of output in such a situation.) 

So, I'm good.


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## Nightflash (Apr 11, 2014)

Assume that in whatever szenario the runaway would be with the car so open the trunk and throw in all that´s needed including ac-adaptor, laptop and notebook. Without the car a battery powered antenna pocketradio is fundamental besides warm clothing, blanket, cash and creditcards. Have no BOB but a 3-day travelbag with all the stuff within a civilized travel-szenario mainly bathroom/health aspirin, alcohol, eye-drops, ear-drops etc./change cloth kit plus spoon/instant coffee and coffee whitener, swiss army multitool-knife and triple outlet adapter, duct tape and WD40. Entertainment stuff like I-pod/headphones/books Focussing on lights: Tank 007 E09 plus 4xAAA versatile and ultrasmall
Olight Baton S10 plus 2x123 small and endless running moonlight mode/ magnetic tailcap and tailstanding abilities
Olight Baton S20 same as before in 18650 version/ magnetic tailcap and tailstanding abilities
Olight M20x Warrior because its rugged and indestructible
Klarus Professional P2Aplus 2 extra AA for having the AA option and for walking in the dark
Klarus XT11 plus extra18650 because it comes on on max
Thrunite Catapult V3 for long range and self-defense / protection because it looks mean/ to have something solid in the hand


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## ChrisGarrett (Apr 11, 2014)

Right now, I'm keeping a Klarus P2A and JetBeam BA20, both 2xAA lights in a plastic 50cal ammo can/BOB, along with an older Fenix P1D and spare cells. I've also got a small duffel bag with a little Icon Rogue 1 in it and a medium ALICE pack with some basic camping/survival get. I would add some other lights to the ALICE pack, when the time came. 

Those three items would be going with me if I needed to bug out fast. It's more of a car camping emergency set up for hurricane season that allows me to get by and not a 72 hour 'get home' bag, where I had to leave the house immediately.

I've got a 20#, 60w, SLA/AGM solar charging kit, that would be coming as well.

I've got a lot of lights, but those were the two I initially added, since I needed some AA lights at the time.

I could easily add some of my lights in my sig., but I prefer to play with them on a daily basis.

Chris


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## Tmack (Apr 11, 2014)

Very nice guys. This is working out great, as I was sure people had things in their bags that I didn't think of. This will make all of our packs a little more complete. 
Not just lights guys, anything you feel would be smart to bring. 
Hopefully this will inspire people who may have all these things, just not in one place, to put a little something together. 
Nothing doomsday preper style, just in case of a realistic emergency. (unless doomsday is realistic in your opinion)


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## cland72 (Apr 11, 2014)

Fenix LD15 and an Energizer headlamp I got at Walmart for $4.88. Spare CR123, spare AA, spare AAA batteries.

I car carry a Surefire Fury and EDC a FourSevens Mini123.

edited to add: I don't consider it a "bug out bag", I think of it as my EDC bag. It has doodads that I might need day to day, and even a couple of things that might come in handy in an emergency, but no way in hell would I be in any position to live out of it, and only it, for any duration.


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## jorn (Apr 11, 2014)

Dont have a bug out bag. If i had to evacuate for days in the cold part of the year. I would first freeze to death. Then i would freeze to death again, and again and again, long before i starve to death  I guess the lighters in my pockets and grabbing some good clothing will be keeping me alive. Dont like flint strike rods etc. A lighter lasts forever. And it can be hard to make a fire with frozen wood even with a good working lighter. 

I love hunting and fishing and know where the game hides. I value the skill set of a hunter/gatherer. I think the gear is not that important. Carry as many tacticool guns and knives you like, but if you dont know about tha nature around you, you wont last long in it. Maby someone even targets you for all your 2000$ fancy gear.. 
Once there was this old human race than survived with just a stick, a rock and some fur hides. Most humans on earth live in a bubble called civilication. Pepole forget where we really live because the bubble keeps nature out. 

I would like to have my smallest tent, sleeping bag. Basic shelter and heat. That would be my first worry. Hunting gun, a old brno 205. Simple, rugged, incredible accurate and fast. No moving parts to freeze shut or gets jammed with snow. And im used to use this lump of iron. 
My shimano exage is tiny so i would like that, and a knife. Fill the rest of the room in the backpack with food and socks. and pot to coock food in. Clear freshwater is no issue here. Socks are important to me hehe. Nothing in this world feels like brand new soft wool socks on a beaten and tired foot after a long long walk  And cold wet feets are misrable feets. 

If i had a anvil in the backpack, I could fix some fishing lures when they break. And i can think of more than one way to use it to dry my socks and shoes. Haha love the anvil with backup suggestion.


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## Tmack (Apr 11, 2014)

True without knowledge you'll run out of supplies. But if I have resources, I'm using them. That's part of having knowledge. Use what's around you. And if what's on my bag substantially aids my survival, why not take advantage. 
It's funny you say socks, I have a brand new pack of long wool socks as well. 
I'm surprised a hunter doesn't know the advantages not to just a flint, but magnesium rod. Magnesium burns at a couple thousand degrees and will lights wet wood easily. Kindling is not too much of an issue with this tool. I guarantee on the wind and rain, you'll be flicking your lighter, and I'll have a flame. I'd prefer a magnesium rod over even a butane lighter. Get it wet no problem, drop/ damage it no problem, and it will last long after the fuel of a lighter runs out. 
Yeah, humans survived with a stick long ago, but if they had a nice sleeping bag, pot to cook in, and guns, they would be resourceful enough to use them just like us


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## Poppy (Apr 11, 2014)

dss_777 said:


> I wonder what the folks on the anvil collecting forum pack in their BOBs?
> 
> It'd be tough! You'd already have your EDC anvil, but would have to add your "big" anvil, just-in-case. Then, you'd need those "cheap" anvils to pass out to people who weren't smart enough to bring their own. And, of course, the "back-up" anvil... because "two is one, one is none".
> 
> *Sometimes I envy the feather collectors..*.



When I read THIS *Sometimes I envy the feather collectors.. , *I almost spewed my coffee all over my desk, laughing so hard. :thumbsup:

I hate to admit it, but I don't really have a bug out bag, but I could put one together and be out the door in fifteen minutes.

After 9/11, here in the US there were constant reminders scrolling across the bottom of the television screen... yellow alert... orange alert... red alert... that it made my wife nervous. I calmed her by putting together 3 20 gallon containers of food, clothing, camping equipment, quality filter masks, with spare filters, and an extra 5 cases of water. If we needed to evac, we could grab the containers, throw bicycles on the roof of the van and ...

Well it struck me that the escape routes would get so clogged with vehicles that ran out of gas, we would end up walking, therefore the need for bicycles. Oh yeah... I might be able to pedal to the next state, but my wife wouldn't be able to, and I am not in the condition to be able to tow her. I bought a mini-bike, as a tow vehicle. Oh... shucks, Now do I have to carry a gun? This is getting out of hand.

The most likely scenario that would require me to get out of Dodge quickly would be a dirty bomb. Sheltering in place may be the best protection in that event.

Also having to rotate the food in and out of the BOB and different clothing for different climates depending upon the time of year, just didn't work for me.

In my car, I do have a full set of gortex rain gear, extra fleece jackets, plastic bags, and four pairs of clean white socks in a gallon zip lock bag. If my shoes get wet, I can put on dry socks, put a plastic bag on each foot, and slip into the wet shoe. Wet feet are a bummer. 

I also have a decent first aid kit, traffic cones, road flares, reflective triangles, traffic safety wands, two headlamps, and a number of flashlights with spare batteries.
I also have 12-24 bottles of water, toiletries, (including a urinal), fleece blankets, a few space blankets, and a couple cheap plastic or vinyl rain ponchos. 

Of course I have a phone charger. I actually have a spare battery for my phone in the ashtray.
I have a ML102 single cell 18650 charger, that has a USB charge port, and a mini USB output port for charging other toys.
I also keep in the car a little 2 cell AA, or AAA NiMH charger.
If I was bugging out from home, I might grab my two 6 cell chargers, one for 18650's the other for NiMH.

Flashlights are LOW on the list for survival equipment.
If you ever watch any of those survival programs.
The three most important things are:
Shelter, fire and water, and perhaps the next two are cordage, and a cutting tool.


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## Poppy (Apr 11, 2014)

You might find this thread interesting.
Boiling water in a mylar bag
I successfully boiled water in a doritos bag.

I EDC a small pocket knife as a money clip, and a small AAA keychain light.

I put together one of those survival altoid tins
It has three was to sanitize water.

*Altoids Tin Survival*

Cutting edge (Utility knife Blade)

Water purification

Fire - Flashlight - Compass

Cordage... (Wire and Dental floss)


Missing a whistle, and mylar/space
blanket 


*Fire:*

Cut down Magnesium bar with flint bar
and hacksaw blade striker

Small Bic lighter

Three sealed plastic straws of
vaselined cotton balls mixed with Mg dust.


*Water:*
coffee filter (to be used as a prefilter) (SHTF dust mask)
folded aluminum 16-24oz. container (made from aluminum (approximately 7"x9") cut from throw-away aluminum roasting pan)
folded 2 qt mylar bag marked at 16 and 24 oz.
2 spring clips to hold bag over fire
22 ga wire wrapped around lighter
12 iodine tablets in 3 sealed straws

instructions for pasteurize temp and iodine use

candle to melt at 145F and 160F as a pasturization thermometer

gumball size plumber's putty to repair alum container (I unfolded one that I made and found that the corner developed a hole in it)

*Additional items*

Utility knife blade taped to cover

12 lumin 4 button cell Browning bore-scope flashlight 8 hours runtime

compass

six feet minted dental floss.
six feet 22 guage wire wrapped around lighter 
<HR> __________________________________________________ _____________________</hr>

The standard magnesium bar with mesh metal flint glued to the side takes up WAY too much room. I cut off about 80% of it and put some of the shavings into a straw with the vaseline coated cotton balls. I left some of the Magnesium to give the mesh metal support, it would be a bad situation if it snapped on me.


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## RobertMM (Apr 11, 2014)

I always have a Tana E1e, LX2 and QTA with me, so the BOB has just a Minimag Pro+, G2LED(KX4 head) and another G2 with a P60 modded with an LED from a dead Blackberry. That puts out around 25 lumens with crazy runtime from a single cr123.


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## DanWulff (Apr 11, 2014)

yearnslow said:


> Because of where I live, and it's reputation for political instability, I have such a bag.
> Contents:
> Glock 17, surefire E2L AA outdoorsman, surefire LX2, Fenix TK60.
> 
> ...


I assume you live in Arusha, Tanzania. With all respect -> why do you consider Tanzania or more specifically the Arusha region for being politically unstable?


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## yearnslow (Apr 12, 2014)

DanWulff said:


> I assume you live in Arusha, Tanzania. With all respect -> why do you consider Tanzania or more specifically the Arusha region for being politically unstable?



I do live in Arusha, yes. It's more of a local thing really, there are two main parties here in Tz, and there is a great deal of competition between them, two years ago there were local elections in my district, and in an attempt to win, one of the candidates promised to give tracts of land belonging to 'foreigners' back to local villages.
He actually won, and there then followed a series of land invasions, some of which turned out to be rather ugly.

There are national elections in 2015, so I figure I have to be prepared just in case I have to make a fast exit.


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## Monocrom (Apr 12, 2014)

Poppy said:


> Flashlights are LOW on the list for survival equipment.
> If you ever watch any of those survival programs.
> The three most important things are:
> Shelter, fire and water, and perhaps the next two are cordage, and a cutting tool.



That's what I hate about those shows. Often, they only get it _*mostly*_ right.

An absolute bare minimum survival kit needs to have items designed to cover the basic three.

1) Shelter
2) Fire making
3) Navigation/signaling

#1 can be covered by waxed dental floss for helping to construct a lean-to.
#2 with a couple of waterproof matches, flint & steel and a cotton ball soaked in Vasoline.
#3 Button or keychain compass, a whistle, a small signal mirror.

The problem with the shows is that #3 is ignored because if the "host" finds his way out too quickly, they don't have enough footage to air on TV. So that vital aspect is either greatly downplayed or completely ignored. 

Even with the 3 essentials covered in an absolute minimalist kit, yeah; you're going to have room inside for a flat coin-cell light.


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## DanWulff (Apr 12, 2014)

yearnslow said:


> I do live in Arusha, yes. It's more of a local thing really, there are two main parties here in Tz, and there is a great deal of competition between them, two years ago there were local elections in my district, and in an attempt to win, one of the candidates promised to give tracts of land belonging to 'foreigners' back to local villages.
> He actually won, and there then followed a series of land invasions, some of which turned out to be rather ugly.
> 
> There are national elections in 2015, so I figure I have to be prepared just in case I have to make a fast exit.


Poa! I will visit KCMC, Moshi 21-28 April. I used to live in Tanga but is now back in CPH, Denmark. See you outthere! ;-)

Ahsante sana! 

Ni mimi,
Dan


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## yearnslow (Apr 12, 2014)

DanWulff said:


> Poa! I will visit KCMC, Moshi 21-28 April. I used to live in Tanga but is now back in CPH, Denmark. See you outthere! ;-)
> 
> Ahsante sana!
> 
> ...



Karibu sana Bwana.


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## Poppy (Apr 12, 2014)

Monocrom said:


> That's what I hate about those shows. Often, they only get it _*mostly*_ right.
> 
> An absolute bare minimum survival kit needs to have items designed to cover the basic three.
> 
> ...



Yes, not long ago on a cub scouting camping trip, a parent/leader was struggling to get the campfire started. I offered some cotton balls with Vaseline... the struggle was over. 



> The problem with the shows is that #3 is ignored because if the "host" finds his way out too quickly, they don't have enough footage to air on TV. So that vital aspect is either greatly downplayed or completely ignored.


LOL... that's what they call .. "Made for T.V."
In one episode, it became a bit unsafe, so the "host" walked 100 yards down the path to the safety of a nearby village. 



> Even with the 3 essentials covered in an absolute minimalist kit, yeah; you're going to have room inside for a flat coin-cell light.



The light I have in there is similar in size to a Streamlight Nano. I imagine that it might come into play as panic sets in and I realize that I am lost and will not find my way out of the woods in the dark and will have to hunker down for the night.


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## Stockhouse13 (Apr 12, 2014)

A Nitrolon G2 w/ a Malkoff M61LW drop in. With a dozen fresh Surefire CR123's and a spare tailcap-


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## RobertMM (Apr 13, 2014)

I'd like such a light as well, Stockhouse13. Dead simple and durable. Alas, no credit card/paypal so I have only a M60.


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## Str8stroke (Apr 13, 2014)

Well, I noticed several folks were listing items in their bags. I think I have a variation of each aforementioned items, so no need to revisit that. Also, I don't think I have time to list it all and actually remember everything. But, I actually have several light rigs that I can deploy depending on conditions. I will try to focus this post on the topic of lights & my set up for their extended operation in various operational theater conditions. I did try and opt for some "standardization" if you will, on my lights and other "gear". As for light rigs, I have a Camping set up, a Shelter in place set up, Truck set up, and lastly boat set up. So.....The topic here is Bug Out Bag. I will only focus on that. 

All Bug out lights use some CR123, AA's & AAA's or the rechargeable variants. Such as Surefire Outdoorsman 1 & 2, I have a light for max portable lumen & signaling. For that, I chose one I have seen some of our local PD carry it at those, highly questionable, random "DUI" check points. Its the Surefire UNR Commander. It is a dual fuel rig, can run on primaries or rechargeable pack. My bug out bag now has a Cottonpicker solar set up. I also custom made Battery recharging set up that will allow solar recharging or recharging from any 12 volt or 110 volt source. It is comprised of a Venom pro hobby charger and battery holder. I also have 2 AAA to AA plastic adapters. So I can use AAA's if that is all I can find. 

I do carry a small pelican case 1120 that has all the charging & battery stuff in it. NOT THE UNR COMMANDER or the Surefire lights fit in the pelican. But, I was able to fit spare cells, cell holder for charging, Venom pro, Nitecore I2 (which can run on 12 or 110 volts) adapters and various connectors and extra 12 feet of 12 AWG silicon wire and some electrical tape. I also keep a few spare lights inside this case. I have 3 of the button cell lights, white, blue & red taped to the top of the inside of the lid. If I pack it with great care, I can include my Sunwayman Dolphin C15A and Fenix LD01.

So basically to sum up my Bug out bag FLASHLIGHT rig.
3 Surefires: Outdoorsman 2 cell and single cell. 1 UNR commander
3 button cell led keychain lights. I think they are Nite Ize Inova lights. 

Four Functions - High Power, Variable Dim, Low Power, and Strobe
Sunwayman Dolphin
Fenix LD01
Batteries: Surefire CR123A & Surefire 3 volt rechargeables. Energizer AA & AAA lithium primaries. Eneloop AA & AAA's. And lastly I have about a dozen 2032 batteries gorilla taped to the underside of the lid of my pelican case. 
Two chargers Nitecore I2 and Venom Pro Charger (hobby charger)
Misc wires, connectors, electrical tape, heat shrink tube and a micro bic lighter, few wraps of heavy duty aluminium foil. 

Yes it all can fit in a Pelican 1120. I use the thin foam on the bottom and some of the pick & pluck to make some compartments. Oh, the only thing that won't fit is the solar panel from Cottonpicker. So, I came up with a rig that sorta works. I took apart a solar pathway light and harvested the solar panel from it and did a velcro jig up to the top of Pelican case. I haven't tested it much and have no idea what the charge rate is, but after a few hours in the sun, it will put some juice back in a Eneloop. I have it as a Just in case back up to the back up. 

Well about sums up my rig with out looking at it. I may have missed a few items, but this gives one a idea. If anyone has any suggestions please feel free to chime in. I have used it in a few trial runs camping and I have been able to operate well over a week with no issues. 

Good thread.


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## 300WSM (Apr 13, 2014)

I could talk about the ESEE 5 or SYKCO 7 in my Maxpedition pack but that is just talking about some of the knives and tools that I carry (actually, the ESEE is now in my wife's bag). It would take a lot of time and space to list particulars of the contents of my bag. And because I live downwind from an H2S processing facility the need to vacate my home immediately in the event of a catastrophic accident at this plant is very real (H2S: 800 ppm for 5-10 minutes exposure and you're a corpse). However, the question here is light source. Because a BOB or a go bag is really essentially for 3 to 4 days max, power source for your lights is somewhat inconsequential IMO. In a SHTF or EOTWAWKI (end of the world as we know it) scenario development a go bag is not your answer, but that is another subject NOT for this forum. 

Almost every so called expert that I have read says to carry some lumen sticks (shake or break) for a long term light source. They can last for hours with a self contained power source. A headlamp of some kind is a must if you need to use your hands for something else. A thrower always comes in handy if you have to look for something or someone farther away and ditto for signaling. I have the break sticks, a Princeton Tec headlamp on AAs and my Nitecore MT21A for a thrower. I carry enough spare batteries to last several weeks of normal use if necessary. I also carry a Convoy M1 and an S3 flashlights (this is really what I bought them for Ven!) with three spare 18650 Pany cells per flashlight. And this is what's in my Maxpedition! In my Patriot Performance Materials large patrol bag, I have the sticks, a Remington headlamp (made by Petzl I think) and a Streamlight Scorpion on CR123s. I am about to upgrade the Scorpion with a Convoy or two, probably another M1 or another MT21A. Yes I have two bags, completely equipped. One at home and one in my vehicle. Both bags contain food and the means to cook it, water and the means to purify more, shelter and extra clothes to keep me warm and cozy for three days and if I stretched it four and a first aid kit. I live in Montana. I almost died from hypothermia in the Little Belt Mountains on an excursion there once. I have to be prepared for anything. And remember, if you are not always prepared you are never prepared!


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## Treeguy (Apr 16, 2014)

If I ever had to bug out, I`d just grab my work bag with knives, a small axe, some basic tools, gloves, quick ties, all kinds of fun stuff. Probably a week`s worth of fosillized granola bars in there, too.

Flashlight: a AA Rayovac Indestructable of course. 

Might be fun to build a dedicated BOB. I`m sure for $50 to $100 you could put together something pretty decent.


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## Monocrom (Apr 16, 2014)

Treeguy said:


> If I ever had to bug out, I`d just grab my work bag with knives, a small axe, some basic tools, gloves, quick ties, all kinds of fun stuff. Probably a week`s worth of fosillized granola bars in there, too.
> 
> Flashlight: a AA Rayovac Indestructable of course.
> 
> Might be fun to build a dedicated BOB. I`m sure for $50 to $100 you could put together something pretty decent.



You'd be amazed how many useful items you can find appropriate for a BOB, at the Dollar Store.


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## 300WSM (Apr 16, 2014)

Monocrom said:


> You'd be amazed how many useful items you can find appropriate for a BOB, at the Dollar Store.



:twothumbs Exactly right! Most of what's in mine are things found around the house or bought cheap (I didn't scrimp on my knives or bags as you can see). My heat source is Sterno and I use a liter uncolored plastic soda container to purify water (it's a Swedish military trick and it works). Coffee filters make great water prefilters and you can use them for a dust mask in a pinch. I even built a FAK (first aid kit) from band aids and safety pins and an oversized bandana, etc. Throw in ibuprofen, imodium, benadryl and a little aspirin (things found in the average medicine cabinet) and it starts to come together. I won't discuss what I use for trauma pads (the gals could guess). I have already told all about my inexpensive Convoy flashlights. Well, you get the drift. I also agree with Treeguy. What he has is better than most. And if it gets you through the crisis, then that is what works for you!


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## Monocrom (Apr 16, 2014)

300WSM said:


> :twothumbs Exactly right! Most of what's in mine are things found around the house or bought cheap (I didn't scrimp on my knives or bags as you can see). My heat source is Sterno and I use a liter uncolored plastic soda container to purify water (it's a Swedish military trick and it works). Coffee filters make great water prefilters and you can use them for a dust mask in a pinch. I even built a FAK (first aid kit) from band aids and safety pins and an oversized bandana, etc. Throw in ibuprofen, imodium, benadryl and a little aspirin (things found in the average medicine cabinet) and it starts to come together. *I won't discuss what I use for trauma pads (the gals could guess).* I have already told all about my inexpensive Convoy flashlights. Well, you get the drift. I also agree with Treeguy. What he has is better than most. And if it gets you through the crisis, then that is what works for you!



Gee, I wonder what would be specifically designed to absorb a whole helluva lot of blood from an "opening."


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## 300WSM (Apr 16, 2014)

:thinking: Yea, you guessed it! It really works if you need to treat major trauma and you don't happen to have an Israeli battle dressing compression bandage (they're supposed to be one of the best) on you when your buddy accidentally slips and drives his ax into his leg while chopping firewood. My father-in-law was field dressing a buck when the deer gave one of those after death muscle spasms with its hind leg. It drove his Puma Prince knife back into the meaty part of his thumb. Could of been really dicey but with a number of 4 X 4 gauze pads pressing the wound to stop blood flow and a number of stitches later he was right as rain. A well equipped FAK is not a bad idea.


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## Monocrom (Apr 16, 2014)

300WSM said:


> :thinking: Yea, you guessed it! It really works if you need to treat major trauma and you don't happen to have an Israeli battle dressing compression bandage (they're supposed to be one of the best) on you when your buddy accidentally slips and drives his ax into his leg while chopping firewood. My father-in-law was field dressing a buck when the deer gave one of those after death muscle spasms with its hind leg. It drove his Puma Prince knife back into the meaty part of his thumb. Could of been really dicey but with a number of 4 X 4 gauze pads pressing the wound to stop blood flow and a number of stitches later he was right as rain. A well equipped FAK is not a bad idea.



Yeah, most of the commercial ones I've seen are not designed for some of the worst injuries. I put together my own.


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## Tmack (Apr 17, 2014)

Just in case  
One of these will be on my leather obi. Likely the Ronin Hagakure (white saya) 

Never know right!


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## Poppy (Apr 17, 2014)

Tmack said:


> Just in case
> One of these will be on my leather obi. Likely the Ronin Hagakure (white saya)
> 
> Never know right!



Always loaded, and you never run out of ammo.


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## Poppy (Apr 17, 2014)

I wonder, when people put together a BOB, HOW do they think they will be bugging out? (By what means, I.E. on foot, in a car, by way of bicycle)? And how FAR do they plan to travel?

Is their bag a bag? OR a back-pack? Does the back pack have a water bladder? What does the BOB weigh, after it is filled with it's contents? How much consideration has been given to the weight? Five pounds carried in a bag becomes torture, and more than 30 pounds in a properly fitting weight distribution pack for a healthy male, can also be considered excessive. Certainly the weights mentioned above will vary with the individual, but ounces add up to pounds, and pounds become impossible to manage.

How much does your BOB weigh?
Do you intend to carry it?

How much do your lights weigh including batteries, spare batteries, and chargers?

Is anyone carrying a spare anvil? :devil:


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## Tmack (Apr 17, 2014)

My bag is about 20lbs. That's with machete hanging on the side. 
Not including what's on my belt. 

My girl has an essentials pack. About 7lbs. Has just the bare minimum. If we get separated, she can have fire, water, space blanket, first aid, knife, and a bunch of very small supplies. 
That's also the drop everything and run pack.

I plan to first be in the car if possible. But everything is arranged for on foot, in case that's not an option.


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## Treeguy (Apr 17, 2014)

300WSM said:


> I also agree with Treeguy. What he has is better than most.



Why thank you. 

Some of the junk that`s always in my work bag. 










300WSM said:


> And if it gets you through the crisis, then that is what works for you!



Between what I have and what my partners have, I admit we`re probably luckier than most if things got "bug out-ty". Heading out as quickly as possible after a major storm is a big money maker for us, so we`re pretty much always prepared to bug out. 

Then again, around here, being able to bug in is of far greater importance than being able to bug out. Keep calm, and stay put, stay warm, and stay fed.


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## Treeguy (Apr 17, 2014)

300WSM said:


> I have to be prepared for anything. And remember, if you are not always prepared you are never prepared!



Good post.


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## Poppy (Apr 17, 2014)

Treeguy said:


> Between *what I have and what my partners have*, I admit we`re probably luckier than most if things got "bug out-ty". Heading out as quickly as possible after a major storm is a big money maker for us, so we`re pretty much always prepared to bug out.
> 
> Then again, around here, *being able to bug in is of far greater importance than being able to bug out. Keep calm, and stay put, stay warm, and stay fed.*



Your logic is inescapable.

My greatest asset in a disaster, bug out situation is my son.

Teamwork, dual-survival !!! In a larger... longer setting, I want my brothers with me too. Maybe bring along whiteoakjoe if he is available.


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## Tmack (Apr 17, 2014)

Yes, well said. My little family all have their skills in a emergency situation. My girl always wants to learn everything possible for my son's sake. We both will do anything humanly possible to keep my son healthy, even if it mean one of us has to sacrifice everything for the good of my son.


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## Treeguy (Apr 17, 2014)

I don`t mean to go too far off topic, but as we are in the tech-age, I think this is a crucial thing to have:

6000mAh device battery. About $50. Will charge a pod or phone several times over. Since communication and/or relief from mind numbing boredom can be a big part of any emergency situation, it`s a good thing to have. 

Would charge a USB flashlight, too.


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## Poppy (Apr 17, 2014)

I suspect that my son, and yours are separated by 20 years or more. Mine is a section hiker of the Appalachian Trail, and has many mental and physical qualities that make him an excellent partner, especially in tough environmental situations. Together we would do well to provide for and protect the rest of the family.

I'm glad to hear that you and your girl think about shared responsibilities and how to work as a team. In real SHTF scenarios, teamwork is the only way to be successful. I imagine.


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## Tmack (Apr 17, 2014)

Treeguy said:


> I don`t mean to go too far off topic, but as we are in the tech-age, I think this is a crucial thing to have:
> 
> 6000mAh device battery. About $50. Will charge a pod or phone several times over. Since communication and/or relief from mind numbing boredom can be a big part of any emergency situation, it`s a good thing to have.
> 
> Would charge a USB flashlight, too.



Couldn't agree more. I actually have two of them. And I plan to order the solar charge kit from cottonpickers in the next day or so. That's charged batteries for everything, even the vehicle.


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## Poppy (Apr 17, 2014)

Treeguy said:


> I don`t mean to go too far off topic, but as we are in the tech-age, I think this is a crucial thing to have:
> 
> 6000mAh device battery. About $50. Will charge a pod or phone several times over. Since communication and/or relief from mind numbing boredom can be a big part of any emergency situation, it`s a good thing to have.
> 
> Would charge a USB flashlight, too.



I agree.

I realize that my post #27 may have been too long and boring to read, but I also mentioned that in my car ...


> I have a phone charger. I actually have a spare battery for my phone in the ashtray.
> I have a ML102 single cell 18650 charger, that has a USB charge port, and a mini USB output port for charging other toys.
> I also keep in the car a little 2 cell AA, or AAA NiMH charger.
> If I was bugging out from home, I might grab my two 6 cell chargers, one for 18650's the other for NiMH.



That miller ML102 is so small that it is always in my glove compartment. It can be used to charge an 18650, and once the battery is charged, it can be used to charge other toys. I think it was only about $5. There are others that take 2-4 batteries and therefore have a much greater reserve.


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## Treeguy (Apr 17, 2014)

Poppy said:


> I agree.
> 
> I realize that my post #27 may have been too long and boring to read, but I also mentioned that in my car ...



Not at all. I missed it in your post.

Sorry about that.


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## Poppy (Apr 17, 2014)

Treeguy said:


> Not at all. I missed it in your post.
> 
> Sorry about that.


lol... ok I'll forgive you THIS time. 

Hey I didn't notice any indestructibles in your pack, no lights?


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## Treeguy (Apr 17, 2014)

Poppy said:


> lol... ok I'll forgive you THIS time.
> 
> Hey I didn't notice any indestructibles in your pack, no lights?



Not so much now that it`s light out later. And anyway I keep stealing it out of my bag when I can`t find another light. (Don`t want to use my 123 Surefire) Now that it`s almost warm the freaking ants are coming in the house and I was Indestructable-izing them the last couple of days. They pop out of the wall an hour after sunset. Spot them and hit the entrance with Raid. _"Bang!"_


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## Treeguy (Apr 17, 2014)

Poppy said:


> Hey I didn't notice any indestructibles in your pack, no lights?



Here ya go. A nice manly flashlight and axe shot.


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## Treeguy (Apr 17, 2014)

You know, the more I look at that picture, the more I think I should duck tape the light to the axe and make a poor man`s nightime home defense implement.


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## Poppy (Apr 17, 2014)

Treeguy said:


> You know, the more I look at that picture, the more I think I should duck tape the light to the axe and make a poor man`s nightime home defense implement.



Ahhh... now I feel better!

Yes.. duct tape, another manly tool.


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## Poppy (Apr 17, 2014)

I finally did get one of those 2AA indestructibles, they were on sale in green camo. My son's first reaction and comment was... "Oh great, in camo, so when you drop it in the woods you can't find it!"

I guess they weren't a big seller in camo, because later, home depot had them on a closeout sale for a mere $3.88. When I saw them at that price, I tried to pick up a few, I was a day late, and none were available. You are right, they would make decent power failure lights. Good for loaners too.


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## Treeguy (Apr 17, 2014)

Poppy said:


> I finally did get one of those 2AA indestructibles, they were on sale in green camo. My son's first reaction and comment was... "Oh great, in camo, so when you drop it in the woods you can't find it!"



I remember thinking the same thing when I saw camo wallets. 

_"Look, you can keep everything you can`t afford to lose in one convenient package that you`ll never find if you drop it."_



Poppy said:


> I guess they weren't a big seller in camo, because later, home depot had them on a closeout sale for a mere $3.88. When I saw them at that price, I tried to pick up a few, I was a day late, and none were available. You are right, they would make decent power failure lights. Good for loaners too.



$3.88... I would have cleared the shelf.

I`m a broken record on this, but for me it`s the perfect flashlight.


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## TMedina (Apr 17, 2014)

I love those lights as beaters and loaners. And let's be fair - if you drop a black flashlight in the dark, it's just as bad as a green camo pattern in the woods. 

Wrap some fluorescent, or reflective, tape around the handle and call it good.


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## Poppy (Apr 18, 2014)

Hooked on Fenix said:


> Usually, I split up my gear into different containers or bags to adjust the bag depending on my needs and what I am allowed to carry in the area.
> Survival Kit- One quart zip lock bag with: disposable handwarmers, Chlorine dioxide water purification tablets (can use quart bag as water container for purification in emergencies), Firesteel.com Gobspark Armageddon Firesteel, some bandaids and alcohol prep pads, 3 oz bottle of SPF 50 sunblock, 1 oz. spray bottle of near 100% DEET bug repellent, duct tape, chapstick, waterproof match case w/ 20 matches, backpacker's towel, handful of hard pepermints, coin cell flashlight, Storm whistle, and 2 Wetfire firestarters.
> First Aid Kit- One quart bag full of first aid supplies (no designer kits).
> Signaling Kit- One quart bag with Orion Aerial Flare, Road Flare, and Orange Smoke Signal.
> ...



You put a lot of thought into this pack. I need to build myself a paracord belt with firestarter... some day.
I'd like to suggest aluminum instead of Nalgene, it is easier to boil water in AL should you need to.
Also a platypus or similar hydration bladder.


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## Tmack (Apr 18, 2014)

Just got a cottonpickers quad panel to add to the party


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## Treeguy (Apr 18, 2014)

Poppy said:


> You put a lot of thought into this pack. I need to build myself a paracord belt with firestarter... some day.



I think we're all going to go to his house if things get weird. He's got good kit. 

Paracord is something I don't have. I have lots of good rope, but very little good cord.


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## Tmack (Apr 18, 2014)

I wouldn't mind hanging one of these from the pack. 
I use just under 300' of 550 cord to make these. 
Plus a shot loaded core for weight, if I needed to disassemble it.


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## Treeguy (Apr 18, 2014)

Ouch! :sick2:

But neat.


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## Tmack (Apr 18, 2014)

Good for signaling, cordage, intimidation. It's too easy to carry to leave behind now that I think about it.


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## Treeguy (Apr 18, 2014)

Been having some mental fun building a future BOB. And I cannot get past the idea that the best BOB flashlight would be a well made, single cell AA with a high/low setting with a lithium battery stuffed in it. 

Lightweight, durable, inexpensive (buy two!), long lasting, suitable to realistic needs, easy spares, single cell, etc, etc.

Was looking at the Fenix E12. 130 lumens high, 50 medium, and 8 lumens low for 40 hours. Seal it in a ziplock bag with a few spare AAs. Not very sexy, but just about perfect.


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## Tmack (Apr 18, 2014)

Let's get some pictures guys. I'll send pictures of my one bags contents when I get home. 
I'd love to SEE some of your ideas. 

If anymore has a solar charger from cottonpickers , about how long did you have to wait for delivery?


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## 300WSM (Apr 18, 2014)

Treeguy said:


> Here ya go. A nice manly flashlight and axe shot.



Nice Gransfors ax! I have that size and a smaller sized camp ax in S.A. Wetterlings. I have the larger splitting ax and the diminutive Mini in the Gransfors Bruks brand. Love these high end Swedish forged steel axes. I think they're the best. :rock: By the way, that Gransfors Mini is a neat little tool to slip into your go bag. You won't believe how much firewood and kindling you can chop with it!


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## Treeguy (Apr 18, 2014)

300WSM said:


> Nice Gransfors ax! I have that size and a smaller sized camp ax in S.A. Wetterlings. I have the larger splitting ax and the diminutive Mini in the Gransfors Bruks brand. Love these high end Swedish forged steel axes. I think they're the best. :rock: By the way, that Gransfors Mini is a neat little tool to slip into your go bag. You won't believe how much firewood and kindling you can chop with it!



The Gransfors really are nice aren`t they? Takes about two whole minutes to form a _"Never-leave-me!"_ personal bond with nice steel like that. And the Wetterrlings are gorgeous. I`ve seen them but never owned one. I have buddies who build log houses and they have all kinds of sweet specialty axes. Hard not to drool.

The Mini is really nice, no question. But the way I use and abuse the Gerber the guys at Gransfors would probably repo a Mini from me if they found out what I was doing with it. Still like to have one, though. But lots of gear to buy before that I`m afraid.


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## 300WSM (Apr 18, 2014)

Treeguy, 
I bought the Mini after about two weeks of overtime and at the time it was the only toy I had in my sights. I was amazed at how that little jewel could cut wood. The key is to keep it very sharp. I ran a test against my buddy with his Wetterlings wilderness hatchet while on a camping trip just north of Yellowstone Park along the Gallatin river. We took a couple of 6 inch logs and at the signal went at it. It took me about half again as many strokes but I stayed with him all the way through. The trouble with the bigger ax was it was heavier and at the end of the contest his arm and hand was tired, especially when he saw me really carving through my log. His ax was also a lot less sharp than my Mini (I honed it till I could shave with it) and when you get that cross chop rhythm goin, the chips were flying! It made a believer out of both of us!

I also have the Wetterlings #118 Outdoor ax and the #108 Buddy ax. I use the last for hunting to chop through the pelvic bone and the sternum. Makes mighty short work of field dressing, especially elk. And to keep with our lights theme, that is when you will really appreciate a headlamp. Especially if your field dressing something you shot or arrowed about ten minutes before the end of legal light. Full use of both hands and plenty of light is a must. That Outdoor ax is probably my favorite. I stippled the handle like the Gransfors Hunter for a better grip. Awesome ax. You can do just about everything but fell (too small) with it. Great limbing tool. 

Your comment about the personal bond is right on the money. They're like old friends that you would surely miss if they weren't where you keep them. Just like my 372XP!


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## Treeguy (Apr 18, 2014)

300WSM said:


> Just like my 372XP!



A Husky? 

_And just when I thought we could be friends..._

460Magnum.


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## 300WSM (Apr 19, 2014)

Treeguy said:


> A Husky?
> 
> _And just when I thought we could be friends..._
> 
> 460Magnum.



:naughty: Treeguy, 

We stihl can be friends!  (I couldn't help myself!) 

I had a 50/50 chance that you liked Husky/Jonsered! The truth is I really like the German saws and both my brothers-in-law (who live nearby) have the Stihls. I have two close friends in the logging business who recommended the 372 when I bought it new two years ago for a relatively small amount of money. Got it with a 28 inch bar and because I am 6 ft 3 inches, it's easy on my aching back. I just cut firewood up here and heat my entire house with a Blaze King stove. I heated my house for 8 years for $100 and a Jonsered 2050 Turbo. That's what the fuel cost for my logging buddy to bring me a load of logs (which he gave me) on his truck! Course I had to cut it and split it (by hand!) The Jonsered was my first saw I bought when I moved to Montana. Still have it and it runs good!

Try as you can, you can't shove a Husky or a Stihl into a go bag! Be mighty handy. I will try to post some pics of my BOB gear after I join photobucket or something like it. I will include my lighting gear to keep the forum boys happy  Say, Treeguy, can you use a headlamp and cut logs at night? I have never asked my logging friends that question! Sounds like it could have its moments!


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## Treeguy (Apr 19, 2014)

300WSM said:


> :naughty: Treeguy,
> 
> We stihl can be friends!  (I couldn't help myself!)



Oooookay, we`re buds.

Actually, the 372 is a helluva saw. For a Husky. 




300WSM said:


> Say, Treeguy, can you use a headlamp and cut logs at night? I have never asked my logging friends that question! Sounds like it could have its moments!



You could, but I wouldn`t unless I had too. Odds are you`re going to have shadows and areas of no visibility next to areas of high visibility and it doesn`t sound like a good idea. And having eaten the saw and knowing lots of other people who have eaten saws, accidents tends to happen very quickly and out of the blue. So cutting in any situation where visibility is limited is less than ideal.

*Here ya go, "The Real Man`s Bug Out Bag":*


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## Poppy (Apr 19, 2014)

300WSM said:


> :naughty: Treeguy,
> 
> We stihl can be friends!  (I couldn't help myself!)
> *
> Try as you can, you can't shove a Husky or a Stihl into a go bag! Be mighty handy.* I will try to post some pics of my BOB gear after I join photobucket or something like it. I will include my lighting gear to keep the forum boys happy  Say, Treeguy, can you use a headlamp and cut logs at night? I have never asked my logging friends that question! Sounds like it could have its moments!



I was wondering if your bug out bag is a carried bag where you'll be doing some hiking, OR is it a throw it in the car or truck?

If it is a throw in the truck BOB then a Stihl could work. OTOH, if it is pack it in and out on your back, I wouldn't want to carry a 1 1/2 pound axe, but would carry a 
Fiskars 10 inch Carabiner Sliding Saw - 92586985 it only weighs a couple of ounces.


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## Poppy (Apr 19, 2014)

Treeguy said:


> Oooookay, we`re buds.
> 
> *Here ya go, "The Real Man`s Bug Out Bag":*




Be sure to have plenty of water to go with all that protein. And... what? No Ritz crackers!?


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## yearnslow (Apr 19, 2014)

Ritz crackers and peanut butter........ Mmmmmm.......


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## Treeguy (Apr 19, 2014)

Poppy;4420624 And... what? No Ritz crackers!?[/QUOTE said:


> Good call.
> 
> NJ FTW!


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## Treeguy (Apr 19, 2014)

Poppy said:


> I was wondering if your bug out bag is a carried bag where you'll be doing some hiking, OR is it a throw it in the car or truck?
> 
> If it is a throw in the truck BOB then a Stihl could work. OTOH, if it is pack it in and out on your back, I wouldn't want to carry a 1 1/2 pound axe, but would carry a
> Fiskars 10 inch Carabiner Sliding Saw - 92586985 it only weighs a couple of ounces.



Not sure what saw you are speaking of exactly, but I will, without hesitation, recommend this model of folding saw: http://images.alanwadkinstoolstore.co.uk/images/products/zoom/1340010483-41981600.jpg

Forget the axes and knives and chainsaws, this $20 folding saw is the feline`s tuckus of what-you-really-need-to-have gear. I`ve used handsaws at five-times the price but this one is my favorite. I`ve gone though at least a half-dozen over the years and I`ll be happy to buy a half-dozen more. Lightweight, compact, tough, and you can do more, faster, easier, safer with this thing than almost anything else.


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## Poppy (Apr 19, 2014)

Treeguy said:


> Not sure what saw you are speaking of exactly, but I will, without hesitation, recommend this model of folding saw: http://images.alanwadkinstoolstore.co.uk/images/products/zoom/1340010483-41981600.jpg
> 
> Forget the axes and knives and chainsaws, this $20 folding saw is the feline`s tuckus of what-you-really-need-to-have gear. I`ve used handsaws at five-times the price but this one is my favorite. I`ve gone though at least a half-dozen over the years and I`ll be happy to buy a half-dozen more. Lightweight, compact, tough, and you can do more, faster, easier, safer with this thing than almost anything else.



Yeah... same thing essentially, the blade doesn't fold out, but rather slides in and out of the handle, it's just a LITTLE more compact. 
Google Fiskars 92586985 and you'll get dozens of hits.

Either style would be in my bag...


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## SoCalDep (Apr 21, 2014)

I like this thread! My bag is more of a Get Home Bag (GHB) because I work about 40 miles and down-hill from home. Between myself and home is the flood path from two dams and a little further is the San Andreas fault. This same fault happens to run about 75 yards from my home. When I worked patrol my area was on and around the San Andreas, and through my work I have been part of an incident team and received training through my department, FEMA, Homeland Security, etc., regarding disaster management and potential disaster effects. In addition, I'm aware of the training (and lack thereof) emergency personnel receive regarding disaster response... In short, I'm not preparing for the end of the world or the US, but I'm aware that in my area, my family and I might be on our own for a week or more before meaningful assistance arrives after a large earthquake. Add in any other potential disaster (wild-fires, riots, long-term power-outages, etc.) and having the ability to provide for the family for at least two weeks is something I find very comforting. Therefore I have lots of supplies at home and most of them are portable enough to load in cars if we needed to leave due to fires, etc.

If something like "the big one" earthquake hits, I may not be able to drive the whole way home. In fact, I may not be able to drive very far at all. With that in mind, my GHB is set up to help me with 40 miles of uphill hiking. I've done around 72 miles before over 11 days, so I'm aware of some of the issues. My bag isn't my ideal hiking bag, and I might switch it out for my Gregory hiking pack...But my current Spec-Ops bag is a bit more compact. In addition to the pack I have a duffel bag that contains clothing kits for various conditions, such as summer, winter, etc, and specialized items I may want to bring in certain situations but not others. In summer, the summer stuff is in the pack but the winter stuff is still in the duffel in the car. Right now the pack has six MREs, water, and some snack-type food, but I'm experimenting and comparing various freeze-dried camping food with the MREs to find out what provides the best weight/size/ease of use/etc.

Since this is a flashlight forum, I will go into a bit of detail about my lighting, though that is also still a bit of a work-in-progress (it always is). I have a couple light-sticks in the plastic military light-stick holders clipped to the outside of the pack. I also have a Fenix HL10 headlamp and a Fenix E11 as my main flashlight in the pack. I EDC a Surefire EB1 or E1B depending on mood, so I'll likely have that too. My other main battery-user is a small AM/FM/SW radio which takes AA batteries, so it is consistent with the E11. Since AAA batteries are small, throwing a few spare eneloops for the HL10 isn't a big bother. I'm trying to stay as light as possible, so I don't want to go any bigger than a single-battery light...In fact, I'd be tempted to reduce weight by kicking one of the lights out, but I can think of too many uses for one over the other in different circumstances to pick just one. I almost used my Proton Pro since it has a very low red LED and widely variable primary white LED, but while it's my main hiking light, I just don't trust it as much as my Fenix. If Surefire came out with a single AA "hiking" light, I'd be on it like a fly on...well...you know. 

A few months ago a local grocery store was going out of business and they clearanced all the Energizer AA blue-box lithium batteries, so I bought like five 8-packs for around five dollars each...So the light and spares will all be lithium. The head-lamp gets used frequently so I rotate eneloops, but I might pick up some lithiums for it to keep in the pack.

I agree with some previous posters that flashlights aren't high on the list of "survival" items such as shelter, fire, water, and food, but they facilitate efficiency, can minimize the potential for injury - particularly if moving at night, and provide a very important sense of security. 

My pack is by no means an "expert" example, but for the sake of fun, I'll try to post some pictures later this week.


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## reppans (Apr 21, 2014)

SoCalDep said:


> If something like "the big one" earthquake hits, I may not be able to drive the whole way home. In fact, I may not be able to drive very far at all. With that in mind, my GHB is set up to help me with 40 miles of uphill hiking.



Ouch! that's a tough GH commute... I used to be 30 mile train commuter into NYC that I kept rollerblades in the office for, but that's flat ground run. Maybe a folding bicycle?


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## SoCalDep (Apr 21, 2014)

reppans said:


> Ouch! that's a tough GH commute... I used to be 30 mile train commuter into NYC that I kept rollerblades in the office for, but that's flat ground run. Maybe a folding bicycle?



I thought about the folding bike idea but biking uphill would be a royal pain. Add to that issues involving being able to stay on the road... I remember driving around after the Northridge quake and traffic was crazy. If there are hundreds or thousands of vehicles stuck on the freeway in the middle of nowhere, probably with no supplies, the last thing I'll want to do is ride through the middle of them. I have a couple routes that will keep me off the freeway but would make a bike a bit less practical. I like the razor scooter idea but that would have even more issues on the uneven uphill ground. 

It's definitely something to consider though, and maybe I should investigate some alternate routes that may be more bike friendly. I know of a couple but they add considerable mileage to the trip.


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## Tmack (Apr 21, 2014)

Make it something your not going to mind ditching. Because when things get tough, you will ditch it. 
Too cumbersome to travel with when the conditions aren't perfect for it. Walking has served many well. While it would be ideal on road, those benefits would not outweigh the fact that you will need to carry this thing when your not on pavement. And in a survival situation, pavement may not be the best place to be.


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## Poppy (Apr 21, 2014)

reppans said:


> Ouch! that's a tough GH commute... I used to be 30 mile train commuter into NYC that I kept rollerblades in the office for, but that's flat ground run. Maybe a folding bicycle?


If you do go the bicycle route, rig it so that IT can CARRY your pack.
Consider that tons and tons of equipment was carried by way of bicycle on the Ho Chi Minh trail.

Did you consider river crossings? 

A five gallon Spackle bucket with a water tight lid can serve many purposes.


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## Treeguy (Apr 21, 2014)

SoCalDep said:


> If there are hundreds or thousands of vehicles stuck on the freeway in the middle of nowhere, probably with no supplies, the last thing I'll want to do is ride through the middle of them.



As soon as I read that I got a Far Side cartoon image of a guy on a bike in the grass between the two sides of the freeway trying to peddle along as nonchalantly as possible while the eyes of twenty-thousand immobile drivers are fixed on him like crocodiles on a baby deer.


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## Poppy (Apr 21, 2014)

Treeguy said:


> As soon as I read that I got a Far Side cartoon image of a guy on a bike in the grass between the two sides of the freeway trying to peddle along as nonchalantly as possible while the eyes of twenty-thousand immobile drivers are fixed on him like crocodiles on a baby deer.



Too funny :thumbsup:

Just for giggles, I did some quick checking.
The first "folding bike" I looked at weighed about 30 lbs.
Water weighs about 8.3 lbs.
The buoyancy of an object is the weight of water it displaces, meaning that a five gallon bucket could displace 5 gallons *8 lbs/gallon or about 40 lbs.
That means to me that two buckets could carry the bike and another 30 lbs of gear across some stretch of water. I certainly wouldn't cross a raging river


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## reppans (Apr 21, 2014)

Poppy said:


> If you do go the bicycle route, rig it so that IT can CARRY your pack.
> Consider that tons and tons of equipment was carried by way of bicycle on the Ho Chi Minh trail.
> 
> Did you consider river crossings?
> ...



hehe... Poppy, you got me again. I just got into packrafting, so yeah, for ~ 8 extra lbs, I guess can take my folding bike down a class IV rapids (well after a I learn how that is ). I'm also a water rat and usually do swim/snorkel with bucket, if you can believe that - a Sea to Summit 10L collapsable bucket. My son and I swim with it folded and tucked into the waistband of our swimsuits, and then we deploy them to rest (flip it upside down, fill with air, and stick a leg through the handle) - we can stay out in the water for hours that way. Not bad for a little "pocket raft" .


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## Poppy (Apr 22, 2014)

reppans said:


> hehe... Poppy, you got me again. I just got into packrafting, so yeah, for ~ 8 extra lbs, I guess can take my folding bike down a class IV rapids (well after a I learn how that is ). I'm also a water rat and usually do swim/snorkel with bucket, if you can believe that - a Sea to Summit 10L collapsable bucket. My son and I swim with it folded and tucked into the waistband of our swimsuits, and then we deploy them to rest (flip it upside down, fill with air, and stick a leg through the handle) - we can stay out in the water for hours that way. Not bad for a little "pocket raft" .



reppans my friend,
You ARE a clever one!


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## 300WSM (Apr 24, 2014)

Poppy said:


> I was wondering if your bug out bag is a carried bag where you'll be doing some hiking, OR is it a throw it in the car or truck?
> 
> If it is a throw in the truck BOB then a Stihl could work. OTOH, if it is pack it in and out on your back, I wouldn't want to carry a 1 1/2 pound ax, but would carry a
> Fiskars 10 inch Carabiner Sliding Saw - 92586985 it only weighs a couple of ounces.



Poppy, my apologies for numbing it on answering your question. Both of my bags are the kind you can carry on your back. You don't have to have it with pack straps but if you need to lug it any distance at all it sure helps. I try to keep my bag down to 25 pounds or so. I used to hike in Sequoia National Park sometimes up to 10,000 feet. I carried a 70 lb. pack and would stay for a week. But I was also 24 years old and a few pounds lighter (well, maybe more than a few!).

I like to carry a knife to chop and split wood (baton) as well as kitchen/camp duties if need be. I have the SYKCO 711 7 inch knife. It is a very nice dual purpose chopper/camp knife. My wife has the ESEE 5. I think a small saw is handy as well. Doesn't take up much room and it is usually light weight. You can cut a lot of wood with them if they are sharp. Your Fiskars sounds like the ticket.


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## CaptainPicard (Apr 24, 2014)

300WSM said:


> I like to carry a knife to chop and split wood (baton) as well as kitchen/camp duties if need be. I have the SYKCO 711 7 inch knife.



That's a great knife choice! I have one and it rocks! I second the saw idea. I don't have one at the moment, but I've seen and read of people using it to great effect.


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## Tmack (Apr 24, 2014)

I just ordered an esee 5 & isula 2 both with matching g10 scales. 
I hear great things about the esee 5. 

These are the first knives I've bought since getting my forge.


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## 300WSM (Apr 24, 2014)

Welcome to the forum Captain. There are a lot of fine and highly knowledgeable chaps here that can help you solve your lighting questions and fill your needs. I bought the SYKCO a few years ago. My children bought the 511 for their bags and they really like that version. I own a number of knives (I used to be a meat cutter) including the Swamprat Battle Rat and the Hairy Carry. I also latched onto an original Becker BK9, an Ontario RTAK 2 and a Fallkniven A2. These are all great pieces of cutlery and will work really well if you spend a lot of time in the bush. My favorite is a toss up between the 711 and the ESEE 5.


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## Tmack (Apr 24, 2014)

My esee 5 & isula haven't arrived yet. 

Does the 1/4 thickness of the blade hinder it's handling? 

I'm hoping I like it as much as others I've read about.


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## 300WSM (Apr 24, 2014)

Tmack said:


> I just ordered an esee 5 & isula 2 both with matching g10 scales.
> I hear great things about the esee 5.
> 
> These are the first knives I've bought since getting my forge.



Great looking blade, Tmack! Those scales ROCK! :rock: I really like this knife (I took it out of my wife's go bag and gave her the Swamp Rat)  I wonder where I can use it? :thinking: I have the IZULA 2. It's my EDC with my EagleTac D25A2. Obviously a knife blade a quarter of an inch thick is not your first choice for delicate work! But for all around carry and use it will work. Are there better? Yes... if you want to carry two knives! But this bad boy will hack through a six inch log like butter. It is an excellent choice IMHO.


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## Tmack (Apr 24, 2014)

Thanks! Should be here tomorrow 






I have a matching isula 2 coming along with it.


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## Blueskies123 (Apr 24, 2014)

Treeguy said:


> As soon as I read that I got a Far Side cartoon image of a guy on a bike in the grass between the two sides of the freeway trying to peddle along as nonchalantly as possible while the eyes of twenty-thousand immobile drivers are fixed on him like crocodiles on a baby deer.



I live 50 miles from home. I thought about a small fold up bike but reading this is see your point. I cannot think of any other option other than walking can you? I supposed if you have a bike you better peddle real fast but that will only you get you the assassin with a gun.


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## Tmack (Apr 24, 2014)

300WSM said:


> Great looking blade, Tmack! Those scales ROCK! :rock: I really like this knife (I took it out of my wife's go bag and gave her the Swamp Rat)  I wonder where I can use it? :thinking: I have the IZULA 2. It's my EDC with my EagleTac D25A2. Obviously a knife blade a quarter of an inch thick is not your first choice for delicate work! But for all around carry and use it will work. Are there better? Yes... if you want to carry two knives! But this bad boy will hack through a six inch log like butter. It is an excellent choice IMHO.



Awesome. Sounds like we have similar taste. I have the d25cvn ti that I EDC. Soon with the IZULA 

Well delicate can be taken care of by the IZULA 2, but really, the esee 5 is for just about everything BUT delicate.


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## 300WSM (Apr 24, 2014)

Here is my EDC package. Fits really neat into my pocket. I use both the knife and light a lot at my work. The IZULA 2 is a great little knife and it's tough as nails. Takes a scary edge, too.


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## Tmack (Apr 24, 2014)

Here's my rotation. 

V25cvn/ vintage cold steel tanto

C20cvn / Damascus & elk antler (blade and antler shaped by me) 

V11rvn / completely forge made by me from raw materials 1095 steel & California burl

D25cvn/ Gerber 

Each with spare cell container. 

Love the combo sheath!


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## Treeguy (Apr 24, 2014)

Blueskies123 said:


> I live 50 miles from home. I thought about a small fold up bike but reading this is see your point. I cannot think of any other option other than walking can you? I supposed if you have a bike you better peddle real fast but that will only you get you the assassin with a gun.



I'm sure a bike would be an excellent thing to have unless some specific condition made it not so. In that case it's hitchhiking or walking.

If being inconspicuous is paramount, then sacrifices might have to be made, and we get into the old military adage that very difficult terrain can be less dangerous to confront them even slight human opposition. And difficult terrain is, of course, difficult.

How all this works in any given situation is of course unique to that situation.


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## Poppy (Apr 24, 2014)

300WSM said:


> Poppy, my apologies for numbing it on answering your question. Both of my bags are the kind you can carry on your back. You don't have to have it with pack straps but if you need to lug it any distance at all it sure helps. I try to keep my bag down to 25 pounds or so. I used to hike in Sequoia National Park sometimes up to 10,000 feet. I carried a 70 lb. pack and would stay for a week. But I was also 24 years old and a few pounds lighter (well, maybe more than a few!).
> 
> I like to carry a knife to chop and split wood (baton) as well as kitchen/camp duties if need be. I have the SYKCO 711 7 inch knife. It is a very nice dual purpose chopper/camp knife. My wife has the ESEE 5. I think a small saw is handy as well. Doesn't take up much room and it is usually light weight. You can cut a lot of wood with them if they are sharp. *Your Fiskars sounds like the ticket.*




All smiles... no apologies needed :thumbsup:

I'd throw that Fiskars in my bag because that is the one that I have, otherwise it might be a sheet rock hole saw. Those pruning saws though are sweet. 

A properly fitted backpack with a waistbelt makes carrying a load MUCH easier than a duffel bag. IMO, the older we get, the more limitations we start to show.



300WSM said:


> Here is my EDC package. Fits really neat into my pocket. I use both the knife and light a lot at my work. The IZULA 2 is a great little knife and it's tough as nails. Takes a scary edge, too.



That is a really nice looking pocket holster! :thumbsup:


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## 300WSM (Apr 24, 2014)

[/QUOTE] If being inconspicuous is paramount, then sacrifices might have to be made, and we get into the old military adage that very difficult terrain can be less dangerous to confront them even slight human opposition. And difficult terrain is, of course, difficult.

How all this works in any given situation is of course unique to that situation.[/QUOTE]

Well put, Treeguy, every situation can be different. You try to prepare but I say Murphy was an optimist!

Here is some of my equipment including one of my go bags. I chose the tan color because it tends to make average citizens less uneasy than camo (my other bag is black). I 'll tear the patches off as well if I ever use it.








Here is the front side, of course I'll stow the knife and sheath in the pack when I am moving through populated areas.








Here are some of my edged tools.










The top is the SYKCO 711, the next is the ESSE 5 and the last is the diminutive IZULA 2. Next picture is the ESEE 5 with attached gear and the last pic is the 711 in a custom kydex sheath.
I will post pics of my lights next. :thumbsup:

Tmack, those are gorgeous knives and lights. Well done! I am jealous as hel... well you get the picture. I wanted to take a whack at making knives. I was talking to D' Holder when I lived in Phoenix. He was going to teach me the craft but I was working twelve hour days and couldn't take advantage. One of my biggest regrets!

Thanks Poppy, I really like the sheath and it works as well as it looks.


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## Tmack (Apr 24, 2014)

I need to get some nice bags like yours 300WSM. Very nice. 

I have my saw machete attached to the strap, plus a secondary essential bag if I need to drop and run.

Buying a forge was a great investment. Tons of fun, and very rewarding when your carrying your own work.


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## 300WSM (Apr 24, 2014)

Tmack, you said you needed to get nicer bags. Well, I kinda went a little apey on my BOB stuff. The Patriot Performance Materials Lrge Patrol bag I have retailed for $400 (it was used extensively by Special Forces in Iraq and Afghanistan). Its built like a tank. Everything on it is extra heavy duty. I was able to get it for a fraction of the original cost. In fact my family bought four of the PPM small patrol packs in desert 3 color camo for $53 each. The site ran out of them. My Maxpedition pack (the one in the pics) wasn't cheap but it works really well. I set it up in modular form. The FAK (bag with the crosses) attaches with velcro and straps so I can quick detach and take it with me instead of hauling the whole bag. The Max pack will hold gear and grub for three to four days.

I like your machete. Machetes are tough and have many uses.


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## Treeguy (Apr 25, 2014)

_(Sorry, I wasn`t able to use the quote function properly for some reason.)_*

300WSM: Here is some of my equipment including one of my go bags. I chose the tan color because it tends to make average citizens less uneasy than camo (my other bag is black). I 'll tear the patches off as well if I ever use it.
*

Good idea. Little things like that can make a big difference. Dressing in battle gear and looking like you`re off to the Apocalypse is a giant red flag. Yeah, you look badass - or you just look like an idiot but you feel badass - but you have people looking at you, and if cops are around you will be the very center of their attention, and not for good reasons.

As far as appearance goes, moderation is the rule.


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## Tmack (Apr 25, 2014)

300WSM said:


> Tmack, you said you needed to get nicer bags. Well, I kinda went a little apey on my BOB stuff. The Patriot Performance Materials Lrge Patrol bag I have retailed for $400 (it was used extensively by Special Forces in Iraq and Afghanistan). Its built like a tank. Everything on it is extra heavy duty. I was able to get it for a fraction of the original cost. In fact my family bought four of the PPM small patrol packs in desert 3 color camo for $53 each. The site ran out of them. My Maxpedition pack (the one in the pics) wasn't cheap but it works really well. I set it up in modular form. The FAK (bag with the crosses) attaches with velcro and straps so I can quick detach and take it with me instead of hauling the whole bag. The Max pack will hold gear and grub for three to four days.
> 
> I like your machete. Machetes are tough and have many uses.



Very nice. I'm off to find something better than what I have. 

What do you think of the esee junglas performance ? I'm thinking about adding one to the set. Same pattern scales but just a thinner design, maybe sell black on black....


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## thedoc007 (Apr 25, 2014)

I'm going to stick the the narrow question posed by the thread title...listing every item in my bag would take forever, and it is always being modified and updated anyway.

I have a single 18650 headlamp...Nitecore HC50. 

I have a single 18650 thrower...Armytek Predator.

I have at least ten Fauxtons, some on zippers, and others in a pouch with my other illumination gear. The expectation is that those will be given away, should others need lights. And I can say from experience, although they aren't much, just a few lumens can make all the difference.

I have two UVGloStiks (reusable indefinitely, can charge with sunlight or flashlight and have dim glow all night).

I carry two 18650s in the lights, two more as spares (easy access on outside of bag), and four CR123s in a PowerPax in a LokSak.

When I am hiking at night, I also carry a couple big lights...usually a TM26/K40vn or a TM11/TK75vn. And I often have a single 18650 EDC on me anyway. And a FourSevens Penlight in my pocket, and a MBI HF on my keys. 

Obviously this is far more than necessary...and I realize that. But unlike some of my other gear, some of which doesn't normally get used, I can enjoy my lights every time I go out.


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## 300WSM (Apr 25, 2014)

Tmack said:


> Very nice. I'm off to find something better than what I have.
> 
> What do you think of the esee junglas performance ? I'm thinking about adding one to the set. Same pattern scales but just a thinner design, maybe sell black on black....



It is similar to the RTAK II. Great chopper and doubles for a very useful machete, one of the best IMHO. ESEE heat treat (it's done for them by Rowan) on 1095 steel is second to none. Now, pair that with a nice headlamp like the Nitecore that thedoc007 has in his post (this is so you have both hands free) and you are right as rain. :thumbsup:


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## Tmack (Apr 25, 2014)

Thank you. Your making it
easy to spend money  

I'm going to check out some bags in the next few minutes. 

I have a military supply store bigger than a Walmart in my area. ( downtown Baltimore if you can believe it)


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## 300WSM (Apr 25, 2014)

Tmack said:


> Thank you. Your making it
> easy to spend money
> 
> I'm going to check out some bags in the next few minutes.
> ...



Happy shopping, Tmack! You are probably already aware of the BOB bag axiom. Buy a bag just big enough. That way you won't be tempted to over pack for a 3-4 day experience. My PPM pack is more of a 4-5 day patrol bag. It is one big compartment that can hold more than you can carry just about. And yes, I stuffed the heck out of it at first. The Maxpedition bag was much more reasonable. I ended up adding modular attachment (MOLLE) pouches and pockets to handle all I wanted. It actually works out great because my gear is organized for me!


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## thedoc007 (Apr 25, 2014)

300WSM said:


> Buy a bag just big enough..._snip_...It is one big compartment that can hold more than you can carry just about.



The second part is critical. At least one compartment should be large in all dimensions. I made the mistake of buying a Maxpedition Xantha...I really wanted to love it, it has ALL of the features I want, but I just couldn't make it work. The main compartment is only about fives inches deep...so if you have ANY bulky items, it is a problem. You can expand it a bit, cram it in, but then you lose more space in other compartments. Not well designed in my opinion. The exterior dimensions seem generous...but be sure to check the interior dimensions also. Learn from my mistake!


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## Tmack (Apr 25, 2014)

One big compartment you say  

Huge waterproof sinch up bag, with modular sidebags. 
Nice and comfortable.


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## 300WSM (Apr 25, 2014)

Treeguy said:


> _(Sorry, I wasn`t able to use the quote function properly for some reason.)_*
> 
> 300WSM: Here is some of my equipment including one of my go bags. I chose the tan color because it tends to make average citizens less uneasy than camo (my other bag is black). I 'll tear the patches off as well if I ever use it.
> *
> ...




The one thing that you do not want to do is call attention to yourself. If you get into a confrontation, even if you win, everyone can lose! Stay as low key as possible. Try not to challenge anyone. Back away slowly if possible. Stay in one piece! If something happens to you or a critical member of your party, it may cost the whole group dearly. Don't be a hero, be a survivor. But if you have no choice, well.... that is a different story for discussion at another time. Treeguy, you make a lot of sense! 

Tmack, that looks like a good choice. I couldn't see if it has MOLLE webbing. I like the color! If it fits well and can haul a load well for you then it's all good. :thumbsup::thumbsup:


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## thedoc007 (Apr 25, 2014)

Tmack said:


> One big compartment you say
> 
> Huge waterproof sinch up bag, with modular sidebags.



I'm now looking at the Rush 72. Appears to have a lot more usable space, main compartment is much deeper, and more organization (more smaller pouches and pockets also). I'll miss a few features on the Xantha, but overall it looks like a much better design for my needs. If anyone has personal experience with it, please do let me know.


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## 300WSM (Apr 25, 2014)

Before I bought my Maxpedition Vulture II I had purchased the Rush 72. I so much wanted to love that pack. It is one of the best laid out designs I have seen. But two things stopped me. One, when I loaded it down with the weight that I would be carrying, it did not "feel" right carrying the load to me personally (this is a very subjective thing by the way) and two, the zipper on the compartment against your back came undone (pretty much for no reason) and would not self repair. It was not "heavy duty" like the zippers on the Vulture II. The Maxpedition bag is bomb proof IMHO. The zipper problem could have been redesigned or it could have been just that bag. Other than that, I would take the Rush 72 over the Vulture II, design and feature wise. And it looks cool as can be. The Vulture II is just a little small as well, but as you can see, I added modular pouches for what extra room I needed but this was for additional cost as well. Hope this helps!


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## thedoc007 (Apr 25, 2014)

300WSM said:


> Before I bought my Maxpedition Vulture II I had purchased the Rush 72. I so much wanted to love that pack. It is one of the best laid out designs I have seen. But two things stopped me. One, when I loaded it down with the weight that I would be carrying, it did not "feel" right carrying the load to me personally (this is a very subjective thing by the way) and two, the zipper on the compartment against your back came undone (pretty much for no reason) and would not self repair. It was not "heavy duty" like the zippers on the Vulture II. The Maxpedition bag is bomb proof IMHO. The zipper problem could have been redesigned or it could have been just that bag. Other than that, I would take the Rush 72 over the Vulture II, design and feature wise. And it looks cool as can be. The Vulture II is just a little small as well, but as you can see, I added modular pouches for what extra room I needed but this was for additional cost as well. Hope this helps!



It does...thanks for the input! At this point, I'm thinking I may order the Rush 72 in a month or so. Gives me more time to research. I definitely like the sheer toughness of Maxpedition, I have an Operator Attache for work and I freakin' love it, and for that use, it is literally perfect. I also have an Fatty EDC organizer, and that also feels top notch.

Unfortunately, it is hard to find either Maxpedition or 5.11 gear within easy driving distance...so I might have to just take a chance on the fitment issue. As you say, it is specific to the wearer, so no one else can help much on that score.

I think it is likely you just got a bad example...have seen a lot of reviews and videos, and no one else mentioned zipper problems with the Rush 72. So I'm optimistic that particular problem won't be an issue for me.

Thanks again for sharing your experience...if I do get one, I'll be sure to do the same.


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## 300WSM (Apr 26, 2014)

I agree. I am pretty sure that 5.11 changed the yoke on their new Rush 72 packs (the old style yoke where the straps attach to the pack would account for the pack not fitting me, I am a pretty big guy). The zipper was YKK which is the top of the heap in zippers. It must have been an anomaly. If this bag works for you, that would be great :twothumbs because like I said it is laid out the best I have seen so far... except for one other. 

I found a pack for my wife that ties or is a close second. It is called the SDS Conflict pack. I got her one in tan. Great pack with a large main area. It also has a lot of smaller organizing pouches strategically placed so that you can access gear while you wear it. The hip belt has MOLLE webbing (the pack has MOLLE all over it) so you can attach knife, side arm, etc. It has a zippered compartment at the top of each padded hip belt strap to carry your sunblock, lip balm, *FLASHLIGHT*, etc. It's a great pack layout. It 's even made from a light weight nylon pack cloth reinforced with aramid fibers. Tough and very functional. Here is the bad part... _SDS doesn't make it any more!_ :huh: :shakehead :ironic:


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## Tmack (Apr 26, 2014)

Where's a good place to get these bags online? I'd like to have one for the vehicles too.


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## 300WSM (Apr 26, 2014)

Tmack said:


> Where's a good place to get these bags online? I'd like to have one for the vehicles too.


 
Best price I've seen on the RUSH 72 is on Luggage Pros or the Bay. Free shipping is a factor. As I said in my earlier post the SDS (Protec) Conflict is out of production. You might find one for sale if you get lucky on a google search (you can find pictures of it by googling SDS Conflict pack). I saw one earlier for $279 (sometimes these vendors claim its in stock but it doesn't pan out). I bought the wife one for $79 on a clearance sale. It's a heck of a good pack though. You might find it is worth it. Good Luck!


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## Tmack (Apr 26, 2014)

Thanks again. You've been a great help. 

Hopefully esee 5 & IZULA 2 will be here Monday.


----------



## Illum (Apr 26, 2014)

Just lights?

Fenix E01 (2)
Surefire G2 (1) with EDC Plus / IS X60L3 Triple LED P60
Surefire L4 (2) with MC-E mod
Quark Mini ML High CRI

Two packs of energizer lithium 4xAAA
Three wally match tubes holding 2xCR123A each


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## Tmack (Apr 26, 2014)

Illum said:


> Just lights?
> 
> Fenix E01 (2)
> Surefire G2 (1) with EDC Plus / IS X60L3 Triple LED P60
> ...



Everything! Lights was just the title for forum purposes.


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## Tmack (Apr 26, 2014)

Early delivery  

Esee 5 g10 scales / Mx25l3vn 
Esee IZULA 2 g10 scales / C20cvn


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## 300WSM (Apr 26, 2014)

Tmack said:


> Early delivery
> 
> Esee 5 g10 scales / Mx25l3vn
> Esee IZULA 2 g10 scales / C20cvn



Like I said Tmack.... those scales Rock the House! :twothumbs:twothumbs:twothumbs 
But I am so poor this month after all my Nitecore, EagleTac and Convoy purchases there ain't no way!  
I suppose I could wait till next month. Hmmm... :thinking: Must not stir up the wife... stay low profile!   :naughty:

Anyway, those are some great looking ESEE knives. And lights, too!


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## Tmack (Apr 26, 2014)

Lol I know the feeling! 

Mm15vn, x60vn , tcr10vn, V11rvn, V25cvn, C20cvn, s200cvn, and I got a convoy m1 & c8 too! All in the last month............ I have problems  thank goodness I build lasers for the forum or I'd never be able to afford any of them.


I'm really loving this IZULA 2 a lot more than I thought I would. It fits my hand perfectly. The 5 is a complete monster too! The pictures show it no justice at all. I feel like I'm holding an axe. 

Ps. I have about 25 percent of my hair left on my arms. 
I brought out the Arkansas stones to refine the edges a bit. Absolutely no need. These are razor sharp already. Might give them a few passes on the hard ark to really get the best edge possible, but really it would be overkill.


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## 300WSM (Apr 26, 2014)

Tmack said:


> Lol I know the feeling!
> 
> Mm15vn, x60vn , tcr10vn, V11rvn, V25cvn, C20cvn, s200cvn, and I got a convoy m1 & c8 too! All in the last month............ I have problems  thank goodness I build lasers for the forum or I'd never be able to afford any of them.
> 
> ...



The ESEE 5 is a beast of a blade! :rock: It is a no nonsense, 16 oz., 1/4 inch thick piece of tempered 1095 "you won't need a bigger knife" cutting tool. It's like a pit bull with a sharp edge. It does take a little getting used to but take it out on a camping trip and use it. It works for just about anything. You can baton a pretty good sized log and then slice tomatoes for your chef's salad. And when you need to touch up the edge, you won't need a diamond sharpening kit to do it. A crock stick will get it shaving hair in no time. And if you ever need to escape a vehicle that little number on the butt of the knife will take out a window so fast you won't believe it.

The IZULA II is one of my favorite knives. It is small but mighty. I've seen folks baton firewood logs with this little jewel. I can field dress an elk with it (I haven't used it to do that yet but after field dressing more ungulates than I can remember, I know this knife would work). Yes , and it is my EDC. 

I have a clean shaven left arm for all of hunting season after sharpening knives for myself and others. It's called BAS or Bare Arm Syndrome. It happens every time I get around my crock stick and paper wheel. I have yet to see an ESEE that's needed sharpened new. They do a commendable job of edging their tools.


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## Tmack (Apr 26, 2014)

This ad was brought to you by, ESEE and associates. Haha. Only kidding. I too have nothing but good things to say as well. 

After seeing first hand the size of the 5, I'm questioning getting the junglas. I have my machete for anything bigger than the 5 can handle. 







I have complete sharpening ocd. 
If I touch the blade with anything, I'm sharpening it on my mist recent stone of the month lol. 
Last month was a soft and hard Arkansas. Beautiful stones.
And some Japanese water stones for my katanas 






Just a few.


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## CaptainPicard (Apr 26, 2014)

300WSM said:


> Welcome to the forum Captain. There are a lot of fine and highly knowledgeable chaps here that can help you solve your lighting questions and fill your needs.



I know. I love it here. Believe it or not I actually lurked for over two years before finally joining, so I have a decent idea of what goes on (I'm sure I'll get an even better idea now)


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## 300WSM (Apr 26, 2014)

Tmack, I can see that you are a fellow Brother of the Hone. Well, I guess I could pull out my Shaptons. I have a 2000, 4000, 8000 and a 16,0000. I use them on my straight razors mainly. I have everything from washita (ouachita) course medium and fine to carborundum stones. I have a paper wheel and a complete set of butcher steels. I used to be a butcher so I have more knives than I can count. I will be posting my *flashlights* with corresponding knives this weekend. And yes I have a katana (of course). It's 1060 folded steel with hamon, genuine stingray same, silk ito and twin mekugi.

Captain, you are very welcome and we are glad you joined the fray. Lots of good folks here who know a whole lot more about all things lighting than I do and they are very happy to share their extensive expertise.

:welcome:


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## YBCold (Apr 27, 2014)

Inova T3 and still undecided between SL sidewinder compact or my inova 24/7


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## Tmack (Apr 27, 2014)

300WSM. 

No hamon here..... Yet. 
Mine are monotempered dojo katana for kenjistsu. Been training for four years now. 
With a tanto style blade, I've been under instruction for 21 years now. 
I have yet to get a show sword though. I like the cutting power and durability of the monotempered steel. 
Cold steel warrior 
Ronin Hagakure. 
Both have served in training well, but my favorite is the Ronin. 1060 no bo-hi, and is still lighter than the cold steel. Much more maneuverable. 

One day I'll have one folded for me, when I've mastered the art. So in 30 years or so


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## 300WSM (Apr 27, 2014)

Tmack said:


> 300WSM.
> 
> No hamon here..... Yet.
> Mine are monotempered dojo katana for kenjistsu. Been training for four years now.
> ...



My sword is a wall hanger (I don't think it has been clay tempered but it looks real). It is definitely folded and not too shabby. It is not bad but I would hesitate to use it for a live discipline for long. I wanted a Ronin. A very sturdy sword for the money. I had a Cheness Tenchi 9260 forged blade but I gave it to my daughter (she loves all things samurai). I, like you, will save my shekels and pop for a good blade some day. A friend at work bought a Cold Steel O Katana. It's a monster but he is 6' 4'' so it doesn't look too big for him but he would have to strap it to his back!. That is one tough blade.


----------



## Tixx (Apr 28, 2014)

Zebralight H31 neutrals, Photon Freedoms and Olight S10s.


----------



## Tech-Com (Apr 28, 2014)

I like to put a small keychain led light in each of the compartments for ease of searching.

My favorite is the quark 123 tactical.


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## Tmack (Apr 30, 2014)

Junglas came today. 

Goodness it's huge!


----------



## Tmack (Apr 30, 2014)




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## 300WSM (Apr 30, 2014)

Tmack said:


> Junglas came today.
> 
> Goodness it's huge!



That Junglas is a duece of a piece of steel, not for the faint of heart. But the things you can do with that beautiful chunk of 1095 high carbon steel. It will chop like nothing else. It will baton a large diameter log. And when you go to treating it like a machete, it will act like one of those, too! I carried my RTAK II (basically the same knife with a different heat treat) lashed to my pack like a sword. And the best part is it looks so bad to the bone! :rock:

Congats, Tmack! You have scored a prime trio of cutting goodness. I need to score some of those scales. Patience my son! Patience!


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## Tmack (May 1, 2014)

Gotta remember the misses. 
She calls me ant


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## LanthanumK (May 2, 2014)

I originally decided to go cheap for a BOB backpack. During a trial run, the backpack broke, and its materials are scattered all around the house & truck. When I can stop buying flashlights for a month or two, I will get a Condor 3 day pack. As a rather lightweight individual I will try to tend toward minimalist with my BOB. I cannot say that I am prepared for a real emergency in my current state of skills & gear, but it is improving.

Flashlights will be very minimalistic. Foursevens Mini MA (for runtime and light weight) with L91 (for long shelf life, reliability, and temperature tolerance). Good for a BOB that deals with 20 F to 130 F throughout the year. Fenix E01 (for reliability and runtime) with L92. Petzl Tikkina 2 (for runtime and dorkiness) with EA92. PowerPax Storacell will hold several spares for each light in plastic bag. Of course, in all cases, I will have my SureFire G2X Pro (for reliability and brightness) with SF123A and Photon Freedom (for moonlight mode) with CR2016 on or near myself, extra batteries included.

I am currently in the progress of creating a BOB detailed checklist based on past experiences and online advice. It is already 18 pages of information, and will probably be 50 pages when I am finished. I have most of the stuff already.

I am (frankly) not prepared for a WROL situation. Fortunately there was no issues during the 5 day Hurricane Sandy blackout, but it was a close call. After SHTF, I will try to leave early, stay under the radar and escape to a less crowded location. My move to rural NC in the next few months will definitely help. NJ is so restrictive, it is illegal to carry a 1 oz. can of pepper spray. Living with a family who hates guns and thinks preparing is paranoia does not help either.


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## Poppy (May 2, 2014)

LanthanumK said:


> I originally decided to go cheap for a BOB backpack. *During a trial run*, the backpack broke, and its materials are scattered all around the house & truck. When I can stop buying flashlights for a month or two, *I will get a Condor 3 day pack*. As a rather lightweight individual I will try to tend toward minimalist with my BOB.
> 
> 
> I am currently in the progress of creating a BOB detailed checklist based on past experiences and online advice. It is already 18 pages of information, and will probably be 50 pages when I am finished. I have most of the stuff already.



I commend you for doing a trial run. After a few days on the trail, you get a better feel for what you NEED, and what is extraneous. Minimalist is the way to go. Everything you carry should have two or more uses, (at least that should be the goal). I found reading Cody Lundin's book "98.6 degrees, The art of keeping your *** alive" an entertaining and interesting read. 

That Condor 3 day pack is a nice sized pack. Just short of 4 liters. If you get something larger, you're likely to fill it up with more stuff and make it too heavy to carry for more than a day or two. And, if you have to hit the trail, with a BOB, 30 miles probably won't be far enough away.


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## LanthanumK (May 2, 2014)

I have yet to actually do a full run (3 day trip out of a pack). With my trial runs, I have learned 1) never store alkalines in a BOB 2) avoid cheap crank chargers like a plague 3) water bottles leak when in the bottom of a pack for long periods of time 4) keep everything in a Ziploc bag 5) keep away from polyester backpacks 6) don't pack too much sugary food 7) boots stay wet a long time 8) do not bring a toolbox with you 9) rain pants are great 10) all EDC items should be rain proof 11) get flashlights with long runtime and common batteries over high brightness and rare cells, and much more.

Remember, a BOB must be used for urban/suburban survival too. In NJ you cannot have shotgun sticking out the top of your pack or a big sheath knife or a 6-D Maglite without drawing attention. I have taken my backpack through downtown city centers, North Camden (daytime of course), graffiti alleys, and suburban streets. Even with 4 nylon belt holsters (phone, flashlight, multitool, extra batteries), I haven't drawn undue attention from law enforcement, soccer moms, hipster students, or hoodlums.


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## Treeguy (May 2, 2014)

LanthanumK said:


> 9) rain pants are great



I keep having this idea that possibly the most useful BOB would be an excellent raincoat with pockets full of power bars and the ability to sit somewhere with the patience of Job.


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## Poppy (May 2, 2014)

Treeguy said:


> I keep having this idea that possibly the most useful BOB would be an excellent raincoat with pockets full of power bars and the ability to sit somewhere with the patience of Job.



The raincoat could be considered minimalist shelter, it would also offer some insulation, but water is more important than food. 

About a year ago I put together a 24 hour bag, including most of the items in the NASAR National Association for Search And Rescue 24 hour bag. http://www.nasar.org/page/61/Pack-List-and-FAQ

My first BOB didn't include a sleeping bag, but it did include polyester long underwear, and a thick thinsulate set of long underwear, tops and bottoms, and gortex rain pants. For the last 30 years or so, all of my three season parkers are gortex lined.
I did include one of those Adventure Medical Kit SOL bivey sacks.


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## Treeguy (May 3, 2014)

Poppy said:


> The raincoat could be considered minimalist shelter, it would also offer some insulation, but water is more important than food.



True. Around here, though, water isn't really an issue. Obviously this is not the case from everyone. And the easy availability of it does colour my perceptions of what is required.

Doesn't Katadyne, or someone, make a straw water purifier? That would be perfect.


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## Tmack (May 3, 2014)

I like the water bottles/bags. Dirty in, clean out. Larger than a straw, but a needed container.


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## Tmack (May 3, 2014)

Tomorrow the new junglas, esee 5, and IZULA are officially going to get their *** beat. I'm off to my father in law farm to clear some brush/trees. 

Can't wait to wear some love into those pretty new blades! 

They are way too pristine. Time for some character. A pristine esee is just wrong.


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## Treeguy (May 3, 2014)

Chainsaws is fasterer. :devil:


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## Poppy (May 4, 2014)

How about those "pocket chain saws"? They are essentially a chain saw blade with strap handles. They are a serious upgrade to the cheap emergency cable saws.

Are they easy to use? OR do they have a tendency to bind, OR do they bite in so much with each stroke that they take too much energy to use?


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## Treeguy (May 4, 2014)

Never seen or used one in real life. (Though I have a crap load of old chains, so maybe I could make one.) I'm sure for some limited tasks it might be perfect, but for most things it would be a pain in the azz.

The hand saws we discussed a short while back, from my experience, will handle any job that chain thing could, and all kinds of jobs it can't.

Again, I've used all kinds of hand saws, and treated them badly indeed. This one is far and away my favorite: http://images.alanwadkinstoolstore.co.uk/images/products/zoom/1340010483-41981600.jpg

Cheap, tough, cuts like crazy, and only cuts on the pull, which I much prefer. If I was stuck in the woods, forget the axes and knives, give me one of these things and I could build a cabin, harvest my firewood, and cut my dinner. Not fancy, not cool, but probably the smartest tool a person could have.


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## 300WSM (May 4, 2014)

Treeguy said:


> Never seen or used one in real life. (Though I have a crap load of old chains, so maybe I could make one.) I'm sure for some limited tasks it might be perfect, but for most things it would be a pain in the azz.
> 
> The hand saws we discussed a short while back, from my experience, will handle any job that chain thing could, and all kinds of jobs it can't.
> 
> ...



Treeguy,
You have described for me the nuts and bolts of how these little saws work and I think that you are on to something. With one of these you could cut quite a bit of wood and having it cut on the draw eliminates the saw folding up on you. I have a saw already (not the Sthil version you show) but I have used it to quarter large game (elk and such) when field dressing in the boonies. I will try using it for wood cutting to see how that works or I will pickup one of the folding kind you show in your pic. Yes, Treeguy, you are definitely on to something good here.:thinking:


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## Tmack (May 4, 2014)

They do look very useful. But If i need to baton a log, slice a trail, dress game, I think I'd want a regular blade. While the saw would be great for falling the tree, splitting, not so much. So I don't think it's the "cool" factor, that determines ones tools. Just efficiency. But don't get me wrong, for many things, that saw would be extremely effective, and sometimes safer, but I would always choose a "cool" straight blade if I'm in a survival situation.
However, because of treeguy, I think ill be picking one up too  
It sounds too useful to pass up.


----------



## gravelmonkey (May 4, 2014)

Tmack said:


> They do look very useful. But If i need to baton a log, slice a trail, dress game, I think I'd want a regular blade. While the saw would be great for falling the tree, splitting, not so much. So I don't think it's the "cool" factor, that determines ones tools. Just efficiency. But don't get me wrong, for many things, that saw would be extremely effective, and sometimes safer, but I would always choose a "cool" straight blade if I'm in a survival situation.
> However, because of treeguy, I think ill be picking one up too
> It sounds too useful to pass up.



Good plan, don't write off splitting wood with a saw completely: Ray Mears Splitting wood with a saw. 

I spend most of my life in the car with the current job, the 'kit' is more for day to day survival than Armageddon. 

Glove box kit: ZL SC600 with film canister diffuser, hand sanitiser, spare cigarette socket to USB charger, ML103 charger, thin PU coated gloves for all things engine/greasy/muddy, couple of cereal bars.

"BOB" is waterproof rucksack with waterproofs, thick fleece, beanie hat, thermal gloves, neck warmer, folding saw, Leatherman, couple more cereal bars, Fenix LD20.

Also have a pair of boots, have you ever tried walking any kind of distance in formal shoes!? :duh2:


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## Treeguy (May 4, 2014)

Tmack said:


> So I don't think it's the "cool" factor, that determines ones tools. Just efficiency. But don't get me wrong, for many things, that saw would be extremely effective, and sometimes safer, but I would always choose a "cool" straight blade if I'm in a survival situation.



I`m sorry, I didn`t mean that in a nasty way. But boys will be boys and we all like cool toys. Myself included. Sometimes it takes a bit of effort and teeth gnashing to pass up the James Bond stuff when the Fred Flintstone tools will do the same job at a fraction of the price. 

For my part, given the way I see things, if I was in the woods I would take the saw over the knife. Given that small softwood trees would be my primary resource for materials and firewood, a small folding saw would handle the situation perfectly. But my bias lies in that I have used small folding saws as tools for years and am accustomed to them. But I well understand that others have differing viewpoints, and valid ones at that.

Makes for a vibrant debate, doesn`t it?


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## Tmack (May 4, 2014)

Maybe I sounded a bit more harsh than I intended too. 

I can absolutely see the benefits of the folding saw, and because of that, I'm probably going to pick up the very saw you recommended  

Obviously we'd like to have both, but I'm on the knife side if only one was an option.

It is a great topic for debate. 

And go! Lol.


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## Tmack (May 4, 2014)

Courtesy of ven, a small hydration pack containing tk75vn killerthrow, mm15vn, loads of backup cells, spare V11rvn and esee junglas with magnesium rod hidden. By far a survival bag, but nice if just taking a trip to the woods at night.

Could remove tk75vn to make room for the real essentials


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## 300WSM (May 4, 2014)

Tmack said:


> They do look very useful. But If i need to baton a log, slice a trail, dress game, I think I'd want a regular blade. While the saw would be great for falling the tree, splitting, not so much. So I don't think it's the "cool" factor, that determines ones tools. Just efficiency. But don't get me wrong, for many things, that saw would be extremely effective, and sometimes safer, but I would always choose a "cool" straight blade if I'm in a survival situation.
> However, because of treeguy, I think ill be picking one up too
> It sounds too useful to pass up.



I was thinking about the baton aspect as well, but I guess the idea of sawing through the log instead of grabbing my trusty Wetterlings ax and chopping away had somehow escaped my mind even though I was quite possibly carrying in my hunt pack the tool to do just that! It took a true lumberjack like Treeguy to cause the light bulb to go on. I used to when I was young saw wood with a crosscut with two people. The first thing you learn is you cannot push cut (or least not very effectively) a crosscut. It is pull only and you and the guy on the other end of the saw soon learned a timing sort of teamwork thing if you wanted to cut anything. Thanks for the input as well Tmack. I think I will get the Stihl saw. That way it is freshly sharp and good to go.

Tmack, I like the small pack with the Junglas... I think that it will work well for what you will use it for. The thing we have to watch for here in Montana is critters that can hurt you (cougar, rabid coyote, wolves, in some areas bears). Nice to have the Junglas. It's not my 12ga with slugs or my 300 mag but it's better than trying to beat them away with a stick you picked up off the ground!


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## Tmack (May 4, 2014)

12g is definitely on critter patrol


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## Poppy (May 4, 2014)

Treeguy said:


> Never seen or used one in real life. (Though I have a crap load of old chains, so maybe I could make one.) I'm sure for some limited tasks it might be perfect, but for most things it would be a pain in the azz.
> 
> The hand saws we discussed a short while back, from my experience, will handle any job that chain thing could, and all kinds of jobs it can't.
> 
> ...



I've seen those chainsaw blades in "upscale" survival kits, and wondered about their utility. As I mentioned, the Fiskars pruning saw is in my SAR pack and like your folding saw, it is PULL only. Back in the day.. I used one of those cheap cable saws, and it didn't take long to break it. They are probably better snare traps than they are saws. I suppose that the advantage of one of those chain saw blade pocket saws would be to cut down higher limbs if you found yourself in a scenario with three feet of snow on the ground, and high dead wood. You could tie some paracord to each handle, and with a monkey's fist toss one over the limb you want to cut down.


----------



## Treeguy (May 4, 2014)

Poppy said:


> I've seen those chainsaw blades in "upscale" survival kits, and wondered about their utility. As I mentioned, the Fiskars pruning saw is in my SAR pack and like your folding saw, it is PULL only. Back in the day.. I used one of those cheap cable saws, and it didn't take long to break it. They are probably better snare traps than they are saws. I suppose that the advantage of one of those chain saw blade pocket saws would be to cut down higher limbs if you found yourself in a scenario with three feet of snow on the ground, and high dead wood. You could tie some paracord to each handle, and with a monkey's fist toss one over the limb you want to cut down.



I was thinking the same thing because, to be honest, that`s one of the precious few jobs I could see for that thing. The problem, though, is this: if the branch has any weight to it, it will crack and bend once the top cut get deep enough into the wood, and when the branch bends, there is a very good chance it will pinch the chain in the cut with as much as half the cut still left to get through. This happens all the time. The way to avoid it is to make a shallow undercut on the branch a bit closer to the trunk than your top cut. This will make the branch snap off more cleanly instead of just bending down and ripping until it falls. We call it a "climber`s cut". The chain-doo-thingy won`t allow you to do that, so there is a real possibility that in short order the chain will be stuck in the branch over your head. And at that point you start swearing. 

This is a climber`s cut. It also helps avoid the branch ripping down and pulling the bark off the tree. That`s bad for the tree and it looks terrible: http://scni.media.clients.ellington....jpg?8aff03de2423e912a2467e97388a07f5331c05b6


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## Poppy (May 4, 2014)

Treeguy said:


> <SNIP> there is a real possibility that in short order the chain will be stuck in the branch over your head. *And at that point you start swearing.
> *



LOL... you don't know me well enough.

I'd have been swearing *a long time before* the saw got stuck. 


I was thinking that it might get stuck, but having no experience with it, I really didn't know. I guess you would have to stick to smaller branches.


----------



## Treeguy (May 5, 2014)

Fun time. 

Picked up a new handsaw today. ($27) My old ones are dead. Anyway, went out back, found a dead balsam, maybe 16`, and attacked with the Stihl handsaw.

Less than ten-minutes from first to last cut. I think that puts the efficiency question to bed.


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## dss_777 (May 6, 2014)

Folding saws aren't as sexy as a big blade, but they sure do work well. The Bahco Laplander is one really, really nice version: http://www.bahco.com/english/products/laplander_1.html

I use mine for landscaping work mainly. Cuts smooth as buttah...


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## Illum (May 17, 2014)

Tmack said:


> Everything! Lights was just the title for forum purposes.



My bail out bag...theres for main parts all stuffed in a black CamelBak HAWG. Decided to take inventory today


Maxpedition edc pocket organizer
+Personal identifications, passports, medicial documents, etc in a ziploc.
+1 Zipties
+1 Bic Lighter
+1 BernzOMatic micro torch [I forgot why this is here, but it probably has a reason beyond s'mores and shish kabobs]
+1 County comm CR123A Delrin battery holder [currently holding antihistamines]
+1 "Rite in the rain" notebook
+1 Ultra fine and chisel tip sharpies
+6 Grocery bags. Folded. [The kind that's clear/transparent and found beside the onions and greens in any grocery store, I use these to hold water as well as makeshift sanitation bags]
+6 EZ Compressed Towel pills.


Tin can
+1 Small Bic lighter
+1 Fenix E01 with extra Lithium L92 battery
+10" worth of Twist ties
+2 Latex gloves
+1 Whistle
+4 sting relief pads, 6 antispetic towelettes, 6 alcohol prep pads. 4 2"x2" sterile gauze pads, 1 3M Micropore adhesive tape
+6 "Wet ones" Antibacterial wipes
+$100 in $20s rolled up and tucked in a homemade battery carrier.
+1 Superglue [mostly for shoe repair]
+1 Sewing kit
+1 Tweezer


Tools
+1 Walmart "Winchester" multitool [mostly for the pliers, this is a spare, there is usually one on me]
+1 Coghlans folding scissors [this is a spare, there is usually one on me]
+1 14" Condor "Eco-Survivor" machete [Currently has the 18" but eventually for the BOB I'll get the shorter. this is a spare, there is usually a 18" on the car]
+1 SAK Champion multitool
+1 two 50ft roll of 550 paracord, florescent green and florescent orange
+1 Divemaster xenon strobe light. [Made to run on a single C battery, currently runs on a energizer L91 in a carrier to save weight and increase shelf life, this is a spare, there is usually one on the car]
+10 "Sandwich" Ziploc bags
+1 Regular sized hand towel
+3 Pairs of white shoelaces
+1 Pair of rubbergloves
+1 Roll of gorilla duct tape
+1 homemade sheet of phrases inspired by Fodor's manual of BASIC SPANISH PHRASES
+2 75 gallon trashbags [they are pretty well suited to sleep in. Its going to feel muggy all night, but at least you won't die of hypothermia, and it doesn't attract any attention while keeping everything try]
+2 Repel 1oz Insect Repellent

Food [honestly the only thing I need is water and a fighting direction for the first two days]
+6 Nature valley Grain bars: Cinnamon and Honey Oat 
+3 packs of Quaker granola [The kind thats designed to mix into milk, but cold water works fine]
+2 Earl Grey tea bags
+1 vial of sea salt/pepper [remember 35mm film cans?, works well]
+1 2L bladder for water]
+1 Stainless Steel Mess Kit
+4 sets of plastic silverware, doubles as tinder 

Lights
+1 Fenix E01 Top zip pocket of the backpack, its a last ditch light
+1 Surefire G2 with EDC Plus / IS X60L3 Triple LED P60
+1 Surefire L4 with MC-E mod [Just a spare, I usually have one on me, its been my EDC of choice for years]
+1 Quark Mini ML High CRI
+1 PT aurora 3LED


Underwear drawer [Basically a small tupperwear case on the bottom of my backpak]
+2 Pairs of Socks
+1 Extra pair of whities
+$300 in $20s stuffed in an envelope
+1 Glock 19G2 [Again, its a spare, theres another Glock 19G2 in the car and a Keltec PF9 on me]
+2 extra 9mm 15rd mags [Nothing fancy, 147gr FMJ] 


Em-Comm [Nothing yet]
+1 Iphone 4S Cellphone
+1 homemade battery pack/converter that can charge my iphone twice from 10% to 100%.


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## LanthanumK (May 17, 2014)

My EDC Swiss Army knife has a saw similar to the Stihl handsaw mentioned earlier. It cuts through wood very well for its size.

I use an Aquamira filter straw in my BOB. It is a backup to the chlorine dioxide treatment drops, though.


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## Poppy (May 17, 2014)

I'd like to suggest that you may have added the mini torch as another means of starting a fire, perhaps in the wind.

You might add a pencil to go with your write in the rain.

The crazy glue may also be a part of your first aid kit for laceration type wounds. You may want to add some "blood clot".


The thin quart sized bags that are a part of your kit, can be used outside of a clean pair of socks, but inside a pair of wet shoes to keep your feet warm and dry.

Wet feet are NOT fun.



Illum said:


> My bail out bag...theres for main parts all stuffed in a black CamelBak HAWG. Decided to take inventory today
> 
> 
> Maxpedition edc pocket organizer
> ...


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## Poppy (May 17, 2014)

Illum said:


> My bail out bag...
> +1 Iphone 4S Cellphone
> +1 homemade battery pack/converter that can charge my iphone twice from 10% to 100%.



Here's something I know VERY LITTLE about.
But when my son does some multiple day hiking, he leaves his power thirsty smart phone home, and brings his blackberry instead. 

Let's assume that we'll all have our EDC cell phones, I think that it would be a great idea to be able to recharge it at least once, from a battery pack, but what do you think? Would it be feasible to carry a not so smart phone in your bug-out-bag? Do they typically give longer run-times, or require less energy? 
Just a thought.


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## Tmack (May 17, 2014)

Absolutely. I remember before touchscreen, Internet etc, my phone would last for well over a day. Now my smartphone is dead in a few hours. 
I have 3 external batteries. 2x5000mah and 1 14000mah, and I always can rely on my solar pack. 
But yeah, if you can, that would be a good idea. Most companies don't offer a sim card anymore, so you can't interchange phones, but if you can, or have a little prepaid, it would be helpful.


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## Illum (May 17, 2014)

Poppy said:


> I'd like to suggest that you may have added the mini torch as another means of starting a fire, perhaps in the wind.
> 
> You might add a pencil to go with your write in the rain.
> 
> ...



Heh, nope. The mini torch isn't capable of self ignition, there's no piezo element in it, nor will it stay lit in the wind. It somehow found its way in there probably from the last camping trip, which did perform well for s'mores.

Good idea on the pencil, there's a ton at the house, but never made it into the backpack. Crazy glue stings like crazy for laceration wounds, I typically use iodine around the cut and apply a non-stick gauze pad over the wound, bound with duct tape. Wading through water on a hike with a wound on your feet is not fun, but iodine and frequent change of dressings saved my butt plenty of times. Someone suggested a Disposable Sterile Skin Stapler, between a suture kit and that... sure, I'm not there yet 

There's no end to the uses of plastic bags, I'm surprised to have not seen more people use them in their BOBs, they weigh nothing, takes up no space, and anything improvised to block out water could use it, from water containment to improvised waders. 

Oh no, wet feet are not fun. Learned that the hard way.



Poppy said:


> Let's assume that we'll all have our EDC cell phones, I think that it would be a great idea to be able to recharge it at least once, from a battery pack, but what do you think? Would it be feasible to carry a not so smart phone in your bug-out-bag? Do they typically give longer run-times, or require less energy?
> Just a thought.



heh, funny you mention that. My old samsung flip phone could last 2 weeks on one charge, but the family decided to migrate to these fancy doodads and I've considered buying a prepaid phone for the BOB, but the need to take it out for its intended purpose is few and far between. For my purposes anyway, I assume the disorder is localized, and that cell reception at minimum is stable enough to receive feeds, navigation by cellphone is not compromised, and I can check the weather to stay one step ahead. All this burns power, but 72 hours is only 3 days. 

While it is not part of my BOB at the start, everything on me would become an integral component the moment I grab the bag and go. Its meant to be compensated by my BOV [bail out vehicle] so power is not an extraordinarily huge concern. An SUV, even when disabled, makes one heck of a nice shelter.


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## Treeguy (May 18, 2014)

Poppy said:


> Here's something I know VERY LITTLE about.
> But when my son does some multiple day hiking, he leaves his power thirsty smart phone home, and brings his blackberry instead.
> 
> Let's assume that we'll all have our EDC cell phones, I think that it would be a great idea to be able to recharge it at least once, from a battery pack, but what do you think? Would it be feasible to carry a not so smart phone in your bug-out-bag? Do they typically give longer run-times, or require less energy?
> Just a thought.



Good point.

I use a years-old cheapest-in-the-store POS Nokia that pretty much just rings and dials. But... with a full charge it will run for a loooong time. No USB adapter though, just off the wall socket.

Problem with the smart phones is all your power is being used to light the fancy screen, and not going to its primary function of just being a tele-o-phone.


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## Poppy (May 18, 2014)

Treeguy,
I'd strongly suggest that you get a car charger for your cell phone. You can ebay one for just a couple of dollars. You are more likely to need it stranded in a dead vehicle than at home, but even at home in a power failure, you can recharge it from your car/truck.


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## Treeguy (May 18, 2014)

Good idea. I have a car charger and a battery pack for USB devices, but nothing for my POS flip phone. I guess I could charge it off the generator while running the fridge or a heater, but a car charger would be a smart thing to have. And/or a USB thingamadoober to charge my POS phone off a the car or battery pack.


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## Poppy (May 18, 2014)

Oh... another point. I know, that I am NOT the ONLY person, who doesn't know/remember the phone numbers of many people that are saved in my phone. A card with phone numbers land/and cell numbers, made water-proof by covering it with clear tape on both sides, will help you get in contact with family members, etc., with a borrowed phone, or "back-up" phone.

Hmmm,  I'm not quite as prepared as I could be. BUT... that's no reason why YOU shouldn't be!


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## Poppy (May 18, 2014)

Treeguy said:


> Good idea. I have a car charger and a battery pack for USB devices, but nothing for my POS flip phone. I guess I could charge it off the generator while running the fridge or a heater, but a car charger would be a smart thing to have. And/or a USB thingamadoober to charge my POS phone off a the car or battery pack.



In the aftermath of SuperStorm Sandy, I couldn't reach my dad. He lost power AND the car charger I sent him a year earlier for his POS phone that needed to be charged daily. As a kid, he often yelled at me for not calling "WHAT... Do I Need TO Give you a DIME!!!" SO yeah... three days later, I was preparing to take the two hour ride to his house to see if he was there, I finally got a call from him. He relocated to a friend's house where they still had power.


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## SwissJim (May 18, 2014)

Flashlights with little recharge possibilities are rather useless. And if we are in trouble, the grid will go down quickly. So I have two sets of solar panels, roughly 12" by 18", with USB outlets, 12v, and inverters for 110V. That keeps my Nitecore TM26 fully charged, my Shortwave and CB handhelds charged, and five 16000 mAh batteries to share with others. Med are another easy one to forget. I have antibiotic creams, Ibuprofin and aspirin, and alcohol. Add a few cheapo lights, my three Swiss Army knives, and I'm ready to rock!!


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## Tmack (May 18, 2014)

There we go. Another solar guy. 
I just got one recently. 
Seriously overkill, but it's great. 
About the size of a flat binder, 4 panels, and I can run my i4 charger while I charge another usb device. It can combine the four usb to one powerful one, or a 12v car adapter. I recommend we all should have one. As much as we use out batteries.


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## BloodLust (May 19, 2014)

Just lights. Don't want to elaborate too much on the whole BOB as it will be a long post and the BOB is currently being restocked and reassessed.

EDC:
Fenix LD10 R5 on belt.
Klarus XT11 Upgrade 820 lumens in EDC bag.
Inova Microlight clipped to wallet.
Nite-Ize Key-Lit for car keys.
Dart Vader Lego light keychain clipped to EDC bag on the front zipper.
USB power bank with LED light to charge electronics in the bag.

BUG OUT BAG: Streamlining all my Bug Out and EDC gear to run off mostly AAs.
Energizer LED cliplight/headlamp clipped to shoulder strap (uses 2032 but it's just an immediately accessible light that's small)
Inova X1 (my old EDC light) paired with a Victorinox Work Champ Swiss Army Knife
Fenix HL21 headlamp with a Princeton Tec Pilot on the headband.
Goal Zero Nomad 7 solar panels and Guide 10 Plus AA/AAA charger/power bank.


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## BloodLust (May 19, 2014)

Sorry, double post.
Posting from mobile with buggy data.


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## Treeguy (May 19, 2014)

BloodLust said:


> BUG OUT BAG: Streamlining all my Bug Out and EDC gear to run off mostly AAs.



Wisdom. :thumbsup:


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## Tmack (Jun 12, 2014)

Found this great little bag. Carries all my big lights, my baton, a few dozen 12g shells, and back up cells. Loving it.


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## Jash (Jun 15, 2014)

Tmack said:


> What lights would you guys bring in an extreme emergency? Include lights, supplies, survival gear etc.
> Just curious to see what people really value.
> 
> I'm taking tk75vn killer throw / d40avn, d25cvn.
> ...



You really want to go have a look at survivalistboards.com for some serious BOB options. They've got tons of threads about the subject. As for light, as much as you can reasonably carry running on AA's. Single AA lights with very low modes are a must, as well as a decent headlamp or two.

I don't have a BOB, but rather a GHB as my BOB is actually a BOV (wife and three young kids aren't hiking nowhere). In my GHB I've got a Fenix E21 with L91's and an HL21 headlamp, plus an eight pack of L91's as backup. I've always got a single AA and a 2AA light in my EDC bag, plus another HL21 and a spare set of lithium cells for every light I carry.

There's also a couple of lights in the car and spare cells as well. These are mostly loaner lights that cost under $20, so it's no big deal if you don't get them back.


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## Tmack (Jun 15, 2014)

I just picked up two headlamps and love them. They are ready to go with the rest of my gear. 

I will have to check that out, thanks 





I carry this one every day. Minus the headgear


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## YBCold (Jun 16, 2014)

im swapping out the inova 24/7 out for a stream light sidewinder compact 2 and keeping my LED 2AA maglite in the 72 hr bag


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## 300WSM (Jun 20, 2014)

Tmack said:


> I just picked up two headlamps and love them. They are ready to go with the rest of my gear.
> 
> I will have to check that out, thanks
> 
> ...



I just dropped a headlamp into my home BOB. It is one of the Singfire Cree XM-L2 throwers. It will light up the night. Kinda heavy but, wow, does it make night into day! I have some smaller headlamps in my hunting daypack (you need two hands to field dress a deer at night) and in my car BOB. They work well but not close to the lumens of Singfire.

Who is the little Batman?


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## hanzo (Jun 21, 2014)

Don't forget shelter, Tmack.



Tmack said:


> What lights would you guys bring in an extreme emergency? Include lights, supplies, survival gear etc.
> Just curious to see what people really value.
> 
> I'm taking tk75vn killer throw / d40avn, d25cvn.
> ...


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## Tmack (Jun 21, 2014)

Funny you should say that. 
I've been looking at some 4 season tents that'll just fit my family of three. Eureka seems to have some decent ones for a reasonable price.
And very light weight


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## Monocrom (Jul 12, 2014)

Not a BOB, but I'm putting my old single-output 2AA LED [email protected] model into my Work Bag/Get Home Bag. 

For me, my BOB and GHB are two different creatures. I'll have plenty of lights on me. The Mini is for loaning out to someone I might meet or someone I'm working with at the campus if there's an Emergency.


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## RobertMM (Jul 13, 2014)

My Minimag Pro+ just got "appropriated" by my girl(it's the fourth: Inova 2AA, Fenix EO5, and Eagletac D25a Ti), now I don't have a loaner. She doesn't touch my CR123 lights so my Surefires are safe. 
I'm thinking of buying another two Minimag Pro+ or two Streamlight Propolymer 2AA LED for loaners. Hmmmm...

I am also thinking of getting a HL50 for the bag, I need a headlamp, for now I use a headband for my small lights.

Any one have those inflatable solar lanterns branded "Luci" btw? They look like they are quite cheap and provide enough illumination for a whole night without worrying about depleting your primary stash.


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## Tmack (Jul 13, 2014)

May I recommend the hc90vn for a headlamp. 

1200lm, infinitely variable, with color leds. I wasn't a color led fan until this headlamp. Super useful if you don't want to attract attention. Ideal for some bug out situations. 

The sd6vn is also very nice. Mule. 700lm, pocket clip ( awesome) and magnetic mount (awesome too)


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