# Review of SysMax/NiteCore Intellicharger i4 V2 Charger



## HKJ (Apr 22, 2012)

[size=+3]Charger SysMax/NiteCore Intellicharger i4 V2[/size]

This review is about the V2 version of the Sysmax/NiteCore/JetBeam i4 charger. To see the difference between V1 and V2 follow this link










SysMax is the parent company of NiteCore and JetBeam, i.e. they are behind some good products. This charger looks impressive when reading the specifications, it can charge nearly all types of round cells and do up to four cells at a time. The current version is an updated version of the i4 charger I first reviewed, where most of my issues is supposed to be fixed.












The charger comes in a cardboard box with a view to the charger and a feature list on the front. On the side is printed a list of supported batteries.






The charger is powered from either 110/220 VAC 50/60Hz or 12 VDC. Only a mains cable is included on the version I got.









The charger has 3 yellow leds for each battery, they will show the actual charge state when charging:
None: no battery detected
1 flashing, 1 steady + 1 flashing, 2 steady + 1 flashing: Charging, number of leds is a rough guide to actual charge level.
3 steady: Battery is full.
3 flashing: Fail.
The charger also has a blue led to show "power connected".






The cradles in the charger can handle from 16340 to 18700 size, but they do not slide completely smooth. When pressing at the top of the slider it may lock.






On the V2 charger the connection to the plus pole on the battery is longer, this makes the charger better for use with 26xx0 and C batteries, but not perfect (I have some C batteries with a small button top, they need a coin in front of them to connect).
Remember that with 26xx0 and C batteries, the charger has only space for max two at a time.

































The charger can handle 70 mm long batteries, including flat top cells. (See my 18650 LiIon comparison for length of different brands).

With 26650/26500/C cells there can be a problem, if they have a small button top, but the problem is much less than the V1 charger.

With 10440 LiIon cells the charge current is too high and Sysmax/NiteCore recommend always to charge two batteries together, to reduce the current. 



[size=+2]Measurements[/size]

The charger has two charger channels, one channel is handling slot #1 and #3, the other channel is handling slot #2 and #4. When charging cells in both slots for a channel, time division is used to distribute the charge (See scope traces). 

Below 0.74 volt the charger will report error (all 3 yellow leds are flashing), but a small current will flow (about 500uA), this is enough to reset a LiIon protection circuit.
Between 0.74 volt and 2.2 volt charger will use the NiMH charge algorithm (See curve below).
Between 2.2 volt and 4.2 volt the charger will use the LiIon charge algorithm (See curve below).
There is no trickle charging on either NiMH or LiIon. 
The charge stops LiIon charging when the current is below 44 mA, when the charger is finishes the current goes below 120uA (This is a nearly insignificant current). 
The charger will not restart charging when the cell voltage drops.
When a battery is put into the charger, it will start charging and first stop when final charge condition is reached.
When power is connected the charger will start charging and first stop when final charge condition is reached.
When charger is disconnected from power, but with a battery in, it will draw less than 220 uA from a LiIon battery and less than 50uA with NiMH, current draw from each battery will be reduced when there are more batteries in the charger.



[size=+1]Test with LiIon cells[/size]






The charge curve shows a very good CC/CV charge curve, the termination current is perfect for many 18650 at 44 mA and very useable for smaller batteries. The charge time is 6 hours.






My old 16340 IMR cell. Due to the high impedance of the old cell, the charger goes into CV phase nearly immediately.
This curve starts the CV phase at a lower voltage than above, this is strange and probably means that the CC/CV curve is computer controlled and not implemented as a current limited constant voltage generator.






Channel #2






Channel #3
Note: The oscillations in the average current is probably due to my measuring setup and not present on the charger.






Channel #4






All four slots at the same time. The charge time is longer because the two charge channels need to share current between the four slots. The charge time is 11 hours.
Notice the bump in charge current just before the charger stops. This is because the second slot for that charge channel finished first and the full current is directed to the first slot where the measuring equipment is connected.






Doing the same with a 115 VAC 50Hz supply does also work perfect.






I also tested with 105 VAC 50Hz and there the charger did reset a couple of times during the charge (The "average current" jumps up and down), but the end result was the same, i.e. a good CC/CV charge curve.
Note: 50Hz will provoke problems at higher voltage than 60Hz, i.e. at 60Hz it might have worked fine at 105 VAC.





M1: 35,7°C, M2: 37,3°C, M3: 37,6°C, M4: 36,5°C, HS1: 50,9°C

The batteries are heated by the charger, but not above the maximum allowable temperature.





M1:37,1°C, M2: 49,9°C, HS1: 76,8°C

Inside the charger there is some warm electronic, as long as the electronic and box is designed for this temperature, it is not a problem.






The full charge curve does not show how the charge current looks. For this a oscilloscope trace is needed, it shows a pulsing current. The charging circuits stops every two second to check the other slot. 
The charging current is off 10% of the time.






With a LiIon in two slots, shared by the same charging channel, the charging is two seconds for each slot.



[size=+1]Test with NiMH[/size]

For testing I uses eneloop AA cells, these are a very good quality NiMH batteries with about 1950 mAh in capacity from new, mine is probably lower because they are more than a year old.






The NiMH AA cell does charge with a constant current until the charger terminates. But the termination is not a -dv/dt terminations. The charge time is 2.8 hours.






Here is a close look at the last few minutes of the above trace. With a -dv/dt the voltage is supposed to stay constant or drop slightly, before the charger terminates. 






A new Eneloop XX cell.






This test was with a old non LSD NiMH battery.






Slot #2






With 4 eneloop the charge current goes down, but everything else works as before. The charge time is 5.4 hours.





M1: 48,4°C, M2: 37,7°C, M3: 38,9°C, M4: 39,0°C, M5: 38,1°C, HS1: 49,4°C

NiMH batteries gets warmer than LiIon.





M1: 50,8°C, M2: 38,4°C, HS1: 60,4°C

I did probably not hit the right angle to get the hottest part (See LiIon images), but it is still fairly warm.






Charging is with pulsing current (Exactly like LiIon). 






With a eneloop in all slots, the charging is two seconds for each slot.



[size=+1]Test with NiMH and LiIon and the same time[/size]

The specification says it can handle both types of batteries and does not include any limits on this.






First charge curve is measured on a LiIon with a NiMH in the other slot. This works perfectly, after 5½ hours the eneloop is finished and the LiIon battery gets the full charge current, until it is full after 8 hours.






This curve is measured on a eneloop with a LiIon in the other slot. This looks exactly like the 4xeneloop chart.

The problem in the V1 with charging different chemistries at the same time is completely solved.



[size=+2]Summary[/size]

A short list of the good and the bad things with the charger. I uses ++ for the really good things. things.
++ The charger uses a CC/CV algorithm.
++ The slots are long enough, all protected 18650 will fit.
+ The charger can be used on 12 volt.
+ Good indicator lights with estimation of charge in cells.
+ Can reset a LiIon protection circuit.
+ The slider has good connection with anything from 16340 to 18650 cells.
+ The charger is universal voltage, i.e. it can work on both 110/115/220/230 VAC.
- The charge current is too high for 10440 cells.
- The NiMH charge mode prevents correct handling of over discharged LiIon (This is unavoidable in a multi chemistry charger with automatic selection).
- The slider does not always move easily, when putting long cells in the charger.
- The NiMH charging algorithm does not use -dv/dt termination.



[size=+3]Conclusion[/size]

This charger uses a CC/CV charging profile, this is the recommended way to charge LiIon batteries. The charge current is a good compromise for handling many battery sizes with only one current setting. 
The charger also does a good job on NiMH batteries, but I wonder about the termination.
I will call it a good universal charger.



[size=+3]Notes[/size]

Thermo images has been added later and is not including in the general evaluation of the charger.

The charger was supplied by SysMax for a review.

All tests are done at 230 VAC mains supply, except when otherwise specified.

In the V1 review there was a pattern in the current, this was because my sample rate was exactly 1 second and made interference with the 2 second pulsing. In this test I have changed the sample rate to 0.9 second and mostly avoided the interference (It does show up in the "average current" as oscillations).

Here is an explanation on how I did the above charge curves: How do I test a charger


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## shelm (Apr 22, 2012)

first to say THANKS YOU!!

legendary the henrik!!!


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## fonzerelli (Apr 22, 2012)

Thanks for the great review!

How is it this thing is 1/4 the price of a Pila IBC? I know, it's only half, but you would need two Pila's to charge four batteries/cells at once.


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## HKJ (Apr 22, 2012)

fonzerelli said:


> How is it this thing is 1/4 the price of a Pila IBC? I know, it's only half, but you would need two Pila's to charge four batteries/cells at once.



You can not really compare it this way, doubling the number of charge slots does not double the cost, especially not when sharing charge circuit between slots.

I believe much of the price difference has to do with the target market. The i4 will be sold in much greater numbers than the Pila and the designers has probably worked hard to make it as cheap as possible to manufacturer. 
With the Pila they have probably more tried to make a good charger, without looking at manufacturing cost.


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## RI Chevy (Apr 22, 2012)

Excellent review. Thank you for doing this for us. :thumbsup:


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## hazna (Apr 23, 2012)

interesting... if it doesn't terminate by -delta V, I wonder how it detects termination?


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## selfbuilt (Apr 23, 2012)

Excellent review as always HKJ! :twothumbs

Glad to see your results match so closely to mine, and I appreciate all your additional testing (especially the oscilloscope traces).

FYI, a couple of your NiMH graphs aren't showing up at the moment (missing the "/" in the closing IMG tag). Interesting observation of the non-standard dV/dT termination. Do you have idea as to what exactly is going on?


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## HKJ (Apr 23, 2012)

hazna said:


> interesting... if it doesn't terminate by -delta V, I wonder how it detects termination?



Me too, probably only voltage.



selfbuilt said:


> Glad to see your results match so closely to mine, and I appreciate all your additional testing (especially the oscilloscope traces).



Yes, the results do look close to each other.




selfbuilt said:


> FYI, a couple of your NiMH graphs aren't showing up at the moment (missing the "/" in the closing IMG tag).



Thanks, I have fixed it.



selfbuilt said:


> Interesting observation of the non-standard dV/dT termination. Do you have idea as to what exactly is going on?



I did some fast comparison with the MH-C9000 and it did look like the batteries was fully charged or very close to. I would have like to do some more tests using my battery test stations, but they are busy and I did not have time for it either.


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## Draven451 (Apr 23, 2012)

HKJ,

Another fine review! Thanks for your time and efforts testing this much anticipated new charger. Looks like it is a capable charger.


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## infinus (Apr 23, 2012)

From http://www.powerstream.com/NiMH.htm

----------------------
However, modern algorithms have been developed to enable accurate charging without using a thermistor. These chargers are similar to the -delta V chargers, but have special measurement techniques to detect a full charge, usually involving some kind of pulse cycle where the voltage is measured during the pulse and between pulses. For multicell packs, if the cells are not all at the same state of charge, and if they are not balanced in capacity, the cells may fill up one at a time, bluring out the end-of-charge signal. In order to balance the cells it may take several charge-discharge cycles. Luckily, NiMH does not mind being overcharged at C/10 or less, which allows the charger to balance the cells during the trickle charge. 
-------------------------

We can definitely agree this is a pulse charger, so I would suspect it's doing something similar to what that page talks about, where it measures during the pulse and in between pulses. At the charge rate on this guy any -dv/dt pulse would be VERY small, so I would suspect they'd have to use something a bit more advanced for accurate termination.


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## selfbuilt (Apr 23, 2012)

HKJ said:


> I did some fast comparison with the MH-C9000 and it did look like the batteries was fully charged or very close to. I would have like to do some more tests using my battery test stations, but they are busy and I did not have time for it either.


Yes, I did a quick discharge capacity comparison on the my MH-C9000 too, and found the i4-charged cell was nearly fully charged as well (~20mAh less than my C9000 normally charges that same cell).


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## infinus (Apr 23, 2012)

I picked one of these up to play around with since they are so cheap. What temps are you seeing? The back of mine has read as high ad 127 while charging 4x18650. The batteries are around 86-88. I think all their heat though is coming from the charger, not the charge being given them.


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## HighlanderNorth (Apr 23, 2012)

Thanks for the review! I had to choose my 1st ever 18650 battery and a decent charger for it, so I chose this charger and an Ultrafire 2000mah unprotected battery! Just kidding, I did NOT buy an Ultrafire battery, I bought the Eagletac 3100mah 18650...Mainly due to reviews here too.


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## Draven451 (Apr 24, 2012)

HighlanderNorth said:


> Thanks for the review! I had to choose my 1st ever 18650 battery and a decent charger for it, *so I chose this charger and an Ultrafire 2000mah unprotected battery! *Just kidding, I did NOT buy an Ultrafire battery, I bought the Eagletac 3100mah 18650...Mainly due to reviews here too.



You almost gave me a heart attack with the Ultrafire batteries statement! 

Glad to hear you picked up the Eagletac cells


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## Changchung (Apr 24, 2012)

Thanks for this great review... Always doing a great job to help us...

Btw; you state that it is not good to charge 10440? What if I charge another li-ion to reduce the current going to the cell?


SFMI4UT


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## HKJ (Apr 24, 2012)

infinus said:


> What temps are you seeing? The back of mine has read as high ad 127 while charging 4x18650. The batteries are around 86-88. I think all their heat though is coming from the charger, not the charge being given them.



I did not measure temperature, but it got warm. 



Changchung said:


> Btw; you state that it is not good to charge 10440? What if I charge another li-ion to reduce the current going to the cell?



If they are both discharged and placed in slot #1 and #3, you will get a good charge current.


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## sspc (Apr 24, 2012)

HighlanderNorth said:


> ...I chose this charger and...I bought the Eagletac 3100mah 18650


I ordered the exact same thing yesterday. I've been using 2400 mah 18650 cells for over a year so excited to see the increased runtime I'll get in my single cell light with a 3100 mah battery. And I'm very excited about the charger.


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## LiteTheWay (Apr 24, 2012)

Another great review which we have come to rely on here. Thankyou.


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## 12smile (Apr 24, 2012)

Not a battery geek but I bought 2 of these... the fit and finish and quality of materials and assembly is Grade A...even the smooth running of the negative contact that is spring loaded and runs in a channel...it's travels smoothly and I'm not worried about it crapping out.
I've bought some 'Crap from China' and this is not 'Crap from China' 

there are 3 flashing leds for each of the 4 independent charging channels and they will give you a 1-3 level of charge indication and glow steady when done.

There are 4 independent channels but there seems to be TWO INDEPENDENT CHARGE CHANNELS....

SLOT 1 AND 3 AND SLOT 2 AND 4 ARE 'LINKED'

I charged 4 batteries in 2 chargers on one charger I placed the batteries in slots 1 and 3 (slots 2 and 4 would have given the same result) and these cells charged SLOWER THAN THE CELLS IN THE SECOND CHARGER WHICH WERE PLACED IN SLOTS 1 AND 4.

THE CELLS IN SLOTS 1 AND 4 WERE DONE CHARGING SIGNIFICANTLY FASTER THAN THE CELLS IN THE FIRST CHARGER (1/3 OR 2/4)

note you can't place the 26650 cells in slot 2 AND slot 3 because of the diameter of the cells.

So .....you have 4 independent charging channels AND 2 'CHARGING CHANNELS' 

For a slower charge use 1/3 or 2/4

For a faster charge use slots 1 and 4

For $25 W free shipping this charger IS A STEAL.


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## BIG45-70 (Apr 24, 2012)

Just ordered from going gear. This charger is going to replace my Trustfire TR-001


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## candle lamp (Apr 26, 2012)

Excellent review as always. HKJ! Thanks for your time & effort in test review. :thumbsup:

You've mentioned the NiMH charge mode prevents correct handling of over discharged LiIon. Could you explain in more detail?


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## infinus (Apr 26, 2012)

It uses voltage detection to identify cells. So below say 2 volts is nimh. Above li-ion. There is no other mechanism. So if the cell voltage is low it may get incorrectly identified as nimh and terminate as a nimh.


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## HKJ (Apr 26, 2012)

candle lamp said:


> You've mentioned the NiMH charge mode prevents correct handling of over discharged LiIon. Could you explain in more detail?



The full LiIon charging specification is like this (Voltage varies with actual chemistry, the numbers I uses has not been checked with any datasheet):

 Below 2 volt: Do not charge.
Between 2 and 3 volt: Slow charge
Over 3 volt: Full charge current
At 4.2 volt: Use constant voltage, until current is below termination threshold.
It is 1. that is the problem, it is designed to avoid charging over discharged batteries.


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## candle lamp (Apr 26, 2012)

HKJ said:


> The full LiIon charging specification is like this (Voltage varies with actual chemistry, the numbers I uses has not been checked with any datasheet):
> Below 2 volt: Do not charge.
> Between 2 and 3 volt: Slow charge
> Over 3 volt: Full charge current
> ...



Oh, I get it. Thanks a lot for your kind reply. 

One more question. HKJ! Does that problem happen when Li-ion charging only or when both Li-ion & Ni-Mh charging?


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## HKJ (Apr 26, 2012)

candle lamp said:


> One more question. HKJ! Does that problem happen when Li-ion charging only or when both Li-ion & Ni-Mh charging?



It happens every time you but a over discharged LiIon cell into the charger, it does not really matter what is in the other positions.

Note: This problem is common on most LiIon chargers, except hobby chargers.


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## infinus (Apr 26, 2012)

I've been a big time skeptic of this charger for a long time. When V1 came out and all the problems started happening I just took a "see, told you so" kind of approach. After seeing some of the reports on V2 I decided..... maybe at 25 bucks I should just see for myself....... so I bought it from Going Gear with some lube since I already read on the slider issue and them jamming up.

I was very skeptical. But I have to say, the more I use it, the more I'm swayed. It's just........ easy. Put everything in, it charges, it terminates, every li-ion comes off at 4.2 volts (even my slightly older cells which came off my hobby charger at 4.14). All my nimh charge and terminate fine.

It's easier than dinking around with the hobby charger, and being able to do 4 cells at once, despite the slow charge rate, simply makes it faster and less hassle.

I guess I'm sold on this little hunk of plastic. I wish they'd properly lube it, and I think it's heat generation is a bit high, but for $25 it's really not bad.


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## cactus man (Apr 26, 2012)

I appreciate the detailed product review but I do notice one parameter missing!
RFI ..Radio Frequency Interference!
As an Amateur Radio operator we are plagued with consumer electronic devices and the 
radio interference noise they generate!


As an example:
Ridgid tools [Home Depot] offer battery operated devices and battery chargers. Their single bay charger is now in it's
fourth generation of design and production. Each generation does indeed have a different circuit board and
most likely a different OEM!

The first three generations were terribly noisy...as well as Ryobi and DeWalt chargers!
Ridgid's newest X4 designed charger is quiet.

Well let me be the one here to tell you the Intellicharger i4 is QUIET!
I was operating my Amateur Radio station with the charger less than 12 inches from an
Icom IC7700 Transceiver [A high end state of the art radio]
On the radio scope I did not see any RFI or hear anything odd.

I was charging two protected 18650 batteries. I also noted no heat issues.
The charging time was around 4 hours so my batteries were not "used up".

I test all my batteries using the ZTS model MBT1 pulse load multi-battery tester,
and it's made in USA!!!!


Cactus Man


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## tandem (Apr 26, 2012)

infinus said:


> Put everything in, it charges, it terminates, every li-ion comes off at 4.2 volts (even my slightly older cells which came off my hobby charger at 4.14).



Have you checked the voltage of these older cells a few hours later? Next day? I'm curious to know what they fall to afterwards.

Personally I would prefer a charger not force every cell to 4.2V.


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## infinus (Apr 26, 2012)

Next day they were still 4.2.

I was honestly a little bit surprised by that. I get no fall off from my off the charger voltage with this charger. I don't think it's over charging though, just getting much closer to 100% than my hobby charger. My hobby charger I usually set to 1 amp charge rate for 2500mah+ 18650's so it terminates at 100ma. That's what usually leaves cells at 4.14.

I know that not fully charging gives you more cycles but honestly by the time I hit enough cycles for that to matter my cells will be years old anyways and due for replacement. I have a number of cells that I cycle through so they only get charged maybe once a week or so. So I have no problem going right to 100%.


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## Divine_Madcat (Apr 26, 2012)

Well, just like a few others, i picked up one of these, and two Eagletac 18650's. This charger really appealed to me, since i am in bad need on an NiMH charger as well. Certainly cant wait to see how they work out on my TK15!


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## tandem (Apr 26, 2012)

Those slightly older cells of yours are still in pristine shape. Maybe that's partly due to your use of a hobby charger and the parameters you've set which result in a ~ 4.14 termination voltage. Or maybe they just haven't been used all that much. Or perhaps they are in good shape because they were good cells to begin with and/or all of the above.

As I said earlier, I'm not that keen on consumer style cradle chargers which attempt to stuff every last milliamp-hour of capacity back into a li-ion cell. The first objection I have you picked up on, in that bringing a cell to full charge every cycle is thought to reduce cycle life.

The other reason I don't care for such chargers is they spend far too much time shoving those last few milliamp-hours of capacity back into a cell. In the case of HKJ's 1x18650 charging chart, 4.15V is achieved somewhere around the 4 hour mark. There is very little capacity gain from that point to 4.2V as you can see in the far right hand scale of the chart - inconsequential capacity is forgone if the cell terminates early. Bringing the cell all the way to 4.2V takes another 2 hours. 

Two hours for very little gain - honestly I can't see any reason to push the cell there except for bragging rights.

More importantly, the longer the charge process takes, the less likely it is to be supervised properly. This becomes an even more serious problem when the device is fully stuffed with cells and requires 11 hours plus before the done light comes on.

So there's three reasons why I'm personally not in favour of adding 50% more charge time: very little capacity gain to show for significantly extended charge time; reduced cell life span; and, more chance the charge process will go unsupervised.


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## HKJ (Apr 26, 2012)

tandem said:


> The other reason I don't care for such chargers is they spend far too much time shoving those last few milliamp-hours of capacity back into a cell. In the case of HKJ's 1x18650 charging chart, 4.15V is achieved somewhere around the 4 hour mark. There is very little capacity gain from that point to 4.2V as you can see in the far right hand scale of the chart - inconsequential capacity is forgone if the cell terminates early. Bringing the cell all the way to 4.2V takes another 2 hours.
> 
> Two hours for very little gain - honestly I can't see any reason to push the cell there except for bragging rights.



It does take a lot of time for the last few mAh, but not that much. You have to look at the current not the voltage, for a single cell it looks more like 20 minutes.


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## infinus (Apr 26, 2012)

Some good points. 

To clarify one thing. Cells on my hobby charger come off at 4.17 and settle to 4.14. I'm still would have expected some settling on the I4. 

The primary advantage as I see it is the ability to charge 4 cells vs 1 at a time on my hobby charger. 1 at a time I can usually charge 2 in an evening where as on the I4 I can do 4. I usually don't put my cells on the charger until I need them (unless they've been fully depleted in which case they go on ASAP). So if I cycle through 4 cells it's nice to be able to throw all of them on at once. 

If I need to speed things up I can always remove them from the charger anytime once the last LED starts blinking and know they are mostly full. 

I attribute my cells to being good cells (AW's). They've been used in high amperage lights to depletion and charged on some lesser chargers in their time. They have lost around 10-15% of their capacity so far.


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## infinus (Apr 26, 2012)

I also wonder how much the pulse charging of the I4 comes into play. I've seen papers on the Internet talk about the affect of pulse charging vs true CC/CV charging. Benefits include a more saturated (full) charge and less long term cell damage (capacity decay) vs a straight CC charge.


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## infinus (Apr 26, 2012)

Can someone take some temperature measurements of their charger while charging 4x18650 (front and back) using an IR gun or something? I'm just curious what others are seeing as normal temps.


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## TinderBox (UK) (Apr 27, 2012)

I have only really charged nimh, and a couple of Lin-ions, I did not notice an heat problems, if you are having a problem, maybe buy a few stick on feet from ebay, to give some air-flow underneath as their is zero now as it virtually flat to the bench.

John.



infinus said:


> Can someone take some temperature measurements of their charger while charging 4x18650 (front and back) using an IR gun or something? I'm just curious what others are seeing as normal temps.


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## infinus (Apr 27, 2012)

Knowing others temps would help me to determine if what I see is normal.


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## Divine_Madcat (Apr 27, 2012)

I can only comment on 2x 18650's , the batteries didn't get warm, but the charger did.. though not so much you couldn't hold it in your hand.

Speaking of which.. both batteries arrived with ~3.7v charge, so i slapped em in. Confirmed the charger stopped charging both at 4.2v, and both batteries settled overnight to ~4.18-4.19v (my DMM bounces between said volts). Seems like a great little charger so far; can't wait to slap my Duraloops in to see how they go.


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## jcw122 (Apr 27, 2012)

Very interesting charger, thanks for the review.


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## loquutis79 (Apr 27, 2012)

Anyone want to change a very slightly used Pila for one of these?

O.K. Even I am not sure if I am joking or not....but this charger looks very good. If it was out before I bought the Pila just a while ago, I would have gone with this one.

But on the serious side, does anyone see this replacing the Pila brand?


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## fonzerelli (Apr 28, 2012)

loquutis79 said:


> Anyone want to change a very slightly used Pila for one of these?
> 
> O.K. Even I am not sure if I am joking or not....but this charger looks very good. If it was out before I bought the Pila just a while ago, I would have gone with this one.
> 
> But on the serious side, does anyone see this replacing the Pila brand?



I'd be more than happy to buy an i4 and get it shipped to you in exchange for that pila ibc!


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## sspc (Apr 28, 2012)

Just received mine today and I love the simplicity of it. Currently have it charging a new Eagletac 3100 mah 18650 in bay 1 and an older 2400 mah 18650 in bay 4.

I'm curious though, could a single NIMH batt be charged in slot 1 with a lion batt being charged in slot 3? With slots 1&3 (and 2&4) being on the same channel, would this work for the single NIMH?


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## HKJ (Apr 28, 2012)

sspc said:


> Just received mine today and I love the simplicity of it. Currently have it charging a new Eagletac 3100 mah 18650 in bay 1 and an older 2400 mah 18650 in bay 4.
> 
> I'm curious though, could a single NIMH batt be charged in slot 1 with a lion batt being charged in slot 3? With slots 1&3 (and 2&4) being on the same channel, would this work for the single NIMH?



That is exactly what I do in the chapter "Test with NiMH and LiIon and the same time", i.e. it works fine.


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## tandem (Apr 28, 2012)

loquutis79 said:


> But on the serious side, does anyone see this replacing the Pila brand?



If the SysMax holds up longer term I could see sales of this unit taking some market share within the flashlight community. It probably is a reasonable charger for those with a smallish collection of cells of either type; if you have a lot of NiMH *and* Li-Ion cells, maybe a dedicated 2 or 4 bay Li-ion charger and a better NiMH charger (something with additional features to exercise NiMH cells) would be a better buy.

As open-mindedly as I can approach your question, if I were buying new chargers today I think I would largely still go down the route I've already gone down:

1) A dedicated advanced NiMH charger; the Maha/Powerex C9000 is a very good charger that helps me manage the ~ 100 NiMH AA and AAA cells we use. The SysMax doesn't offer the scope of features the C9000 has.

2) Would I purchase the Pila again? Yes or probably yes. The only thing that has me hesitating is the number of bays - would I reach for a 4 bay charger from someone else? I think not and I'll explain:

I find the Pila convenient when I want to charge cells with a minimum of effort. In most of my lights I run either one or two cells but most often an 18650. A couple of lights I run 2x18500 or 2x16340 or 2x18350. During peak riding season I sometimes discharge 2 or 4 18650's in a single night, but that doesn't happen often. In short, a 2 bay li-ion charger meets a large part of my needs. If need be can charge 4 large capacity cells during my work day and then they are supervised for the duration.

I also prefer that my charger not try to max out the charge capacity because I am convinced through research that I'm going to achieve much longer cycle life. All this points to a Pila or something like it that treats cells more gently even if we can't really quantify that.

3) When I need to to charge a large batch of cells, which admittedly does not happen often, I prefer to use my hobby charger. As I use this gear for much more than just supporting my flashlight needs, certainly I'd buy another one. I could even drop the Pila and use the hobby charger - it is, almost, as convenient as using the Pila. The hobby charger also allows me to run cell discharge tests and charge or discharge cells as need be to a "storage charge" level when they aren't in use. My extra 18650's I use for cycling are a case in point - I only use them about half of the year.

My usage isn't horribly advanced but does go beyond simply placing cells in a charger and accepting whatever the charger will do to them. For the reasons outlined this charger wouldn't appeal to me.

In short the SysMax tries to appeal to li-ion users who judge the success of a charger by whether it always achieves 4.2V at charge completion (this isn't my preference), and it provides a simple but probably useful capability to charge NiMH cells (which doesn't describe my need). 

Provided it holds up a good safety record over the longer term it looks like it is an ideal charger for those with straightforward requirements including having to manage only a moderate number of cells of mixed chemistries. I must say that probably does describe the needs of a great many folks so yes, perhaps it will indeed eat into Pila sales, as may others.

Personally I believe a hobby charger for li-ion cells is, all-in-all, the best investment (better than Pila or SysMax) for li-ion flashlight enthusiasts if they have a wide mix of capacity types especially much smaller capacity and much larger capacity cells. Likewise a hobby charger might be the better investment for those who are finding they need to regularly charge 4 big capacity li-ion cells. The SysMax takes too long IMO in that overly long charge times could be a safety issue.

For those who only need/want, or only should use, a consumer style cradle charger, SysMax V2 is a contender


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## sspc (Apr 28, 2012)

HKJ said:


> That is exactly what I do in the chapter "Test with NiMH and LiIon and the same time", i.e. it works fine.


I actually read that the other the day and proceeded to forget it (wow I'm getting old). Thank you for taking the time to answer a question you already answered.


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## Gryffin (Apr 28, 2012)

HKJ said:


> That is exactly what I do in the chapter "Test with NiMH and LiIon and the same time", i.e. it works fine.



So, even though both slots on the same "channel" share a supply of current, they're still independently controlled as far as voltage? I'm glad to hear that. 

I need another charger like I need a hole in my head, but this one looks like it could replace at least a couple three...


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## sspc (Apr 28, 2012)

This charger will become very popular over time.


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## HKJ (Apr 29, 2012)

Gryffin said:


> So, even though both slots on the same "channel" share a supply of current, they're still independently controlled as far as voltage?



The V2 charger can easily handle two different batteries from the same charging circuit with independent control, but the V1 charger could not.


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## Theatre Booth Guy (Apr 29, 2012)

I ordered a second of these to leave in my luggage for traveling. I now use a mix of enelope AA and AAA along with lithium rechargeable batteries so, only 1 charger needed! It seems like an unbeatable product with V2 and the price


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## Sensination (Apr 29, 2012)

Hi all,

I,m new to the community and I got "the sickness" 

Part of it was buying Intellicharger i4, therfore I have a question:

When one battery is charged, do I have to wait for the others to finish charging or can I remove just one??


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## sspc (Apr 29, 2012)

Sensination said:


> Hi all,
> 
> I,m new to the community and I got "the sickness"
> 
> ...


Really good question. I believe (someone with more knowledge will confirm or correct) in instances where you charging batts on the same channel so that they do not receive full charging power (NIMH AAA, 10440s) then you would have to leave the finished charging batt in the charger so that the power going to the remaining charging batt will not increase.

I do have a follow up question (hopefully HKJ or someone else can answer). I noticed that the led lights cut off after a short time on a batt that's fully charged...has it been confirmed that the charger still reads that this fully charged batt is still in the slot (say slot 1) so that full power is not being received by the remaining batt still charging (in slot 3)? Apologies if this had been asked.


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## HKJ (Apr 29, 2012)

Sensination said:


> When one battery is charged, do I have to wait for the others to finish charging or can I remove just one??



No, when a battery is full the charger will deliver full power to the other slot, removing the battery will not change this.


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## sspc (Apr 29, 2012)

HKJ said:


> No, when a battery is full the charger will deliver full power to the other slot, removing the battery will not change this.


Wow. Thanks for this. I had no idea that the charger delivers full power to 1 battery when the second battery is fully charged. That's an important fact and with that in mind, I will generally not use this charger for AAA batts.


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## HKJ (Apr 30, 2012)

sspc said:


> I do have a follow up question (hopefully HKJ or someone else can answer). I noticed that the led lights cut off after a short time on a batt that's fully charged...has it been confirmed that the charger still reads that this fully charged batt is still in the slot (say slot 1) so that full power is not being received by the remaining batt still charging (in slot 3)? Apologies if this had been asked.



I have not seen the lights cut off on a fully charged battery.




sspc said:


> Wow. Thanks for this. I had no idea that the charger delivers full power to 1 battery when the second battery is fully charged. That's an important fact and with that in mind, I will generally not use this charger for AAA batts.



It is no problem with a NiMH AAA battery, it can take the current.


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## Sensination (Apr 30, 2012)

Thanks HKJ, that's really helpful!

I loooove this charger BTW  Probably best on I ever had from the cheapo's


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## oKtosiTe (Aug 12, 2012)

Should I ever be careless enough to over-discharge my protected 18650s, what would be the recommended approach to "revive" them as the owner of only this charger?


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## HKJ (Aug 12, 2012)

oKtosiTe said:


> Should I ever be careless enough to over-discharge my protected 18650s, what would be the recommended approach to "revive" them as the owner of only this charger?



The i4 will automatic reset the protection, for chargers that do not reset the protection you can do this:






You only need to touch the batteries for 1 second or less.


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## oKtosiTe (Aug 12, 2012)

HKJ said:


> The i4 will automatic reset the protection, for chargers that do not reset the protection you can do this:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



That is very good to know. Thanks for the quick, clear reply and the very informative review. I ordered one of these a few days ago with four protected Eagletac 3100s.
And greetings from Sweden.


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## alex21 (Aug 13, 2012)

This or Xtar WP6 II (for slight more $) if I don't need to charge any NiMH?


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## Shadowww (Aug 13, 2012)

alex21 said:


> This or Xtar WP6 II (for slight more $) if I don't need to charge any NiMH?


Uh.. is pair of WP2 II's an option?  That'd be best choice for you, albeit a tiny bit more expensive than i4.


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## 45/70 (Aug 13, 2012)

HKJ said:


> ......for chargers that do not reset the protection you can do this:



HKJ, this cracks me up! It's rare that I parallel two cells for any purpose other than charging or discharging, usually NiCD/NiMH cells so the charger will accept them, but in the years that I've done it, I never thought about doing it this way. I have always paralleled cells like rungs in a ladder. Old dog, new tricks, I guess. At least I've never used two hands to operate a twisty.

Dave


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## HKJ (Aug 13, 2012)

45/70 said:


> HKJ, this cracks me up! It's rare that I parallel two cells for any purpose other than charging or discharging, usually NiCD/NiMH cells so the charger will accept them, but in the years that I've done it, I never thought about doing it this way. I have always paralleled cells like rungs in a ladder. Old dog, new tricks, I guess. At least I've never used two hands to operate a twisty.



I had to do it a way that was easy to see on a photo and easy to copy. It was not that easy to hold the wire and batteries, I only had 10 seconds to get it in position from I pressed the trigger on the camera


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## lwknight (Aug 13, 2012)

FYI Tip: I had trouble getting the little sliders to move when inserting a battery. They tend to bind up unless you pull them back then try to slip the cell in.
Solution: A small shot of WD-40 made them work like they had roller bearings.


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## Teobaldo (Aug 13, 2012)

HKJ said:


> The i4 will automatic reset the protection, for chargers that do not reset the protection you can do this:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Thanks for the info! It is good to know a trick to reset the protection, time ago that was asking me if could be done. 

Greetings from Chile.


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## NetSkipper (Aug 19, 2012)

Hello, and thank you for the review.

How about charging 18500 batteries? They are not mentioned in the manual..


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## Norm (Aug 19, 2012)

NetSkipper said:


> Hello, and thank you for the review.
> 
> How about charging 18500 batteries? They are not mentioned in the manual..


See the table from post #1


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## NetSkipper (Aug 20, 2012)

Norm said:


> See the table from post #1


Oh, I've probably passed it over. Thank you.:thumbsup:


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## Korgath (Aug 24, 2012)

Awesome review HKG and thanks for the time for this write up.

I have a question for you or any other member who could be of help...

What do you mean by "- The NiMH charging algorithm does not use -dv/dt termination."

How big of an issue is this? Thanks again!


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## HKJ (Aug 24, 2012)

Korgath said:


> What do you mean by "- The NiMH charging algorithm does not use -dv/dt termination.



If you read manufacturer specifications for NiMH batteries, they describe a couple of ways to end a charger, the main one is -dv/dt. With this termination method the charger waits until the voltage stops raising and maybe drops a little, then the charge is finish. As backup it is recommended to have a maximum voltage check, a temperature check and a timer.
If you read the specifications for the best NiMH chargers you will usual see all 4 termination included.

When looking at the charge curve for NiMH the charge terminates while the voltage is still raising.

Here is a curve from the i4 V1, it sometimes does a better job of -dv/dt termination:





You can see the red curve stops raising and then drops a bit, before the charger stops, this is a -dv/dt termination (But the V1 charger get confused when charging multiple NiMH and do not terminate correctly).





Korgath said:


> How big of an issue is this? Thanks again!



I do not know it, my test did not show any problems, but I only tested a very limited number of NiMH batteries.


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## KuanR (Oct 10, 2012)

I bought this charger a while ago and just gave it a try right now. I charged 2 16340's and 2 18350's and they came off the charger at 4.22v-4.23v. It's overcharging a little and I'm wondering if that is safe or not.

Is it ok to be over charged by .2-.3v?


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## mattheww50 (Oct 10, 2012)

The first question is how accurate your meter is. The difference between 4.20 and 4.23 volts is less than 1%, and unless you are working with a meter that is subject to regular metrology and calibrated to
an NIST traceable standard, it is unlikely that your meter is accurate to better than 1% to begin with. Just because the meter reads to 3 places is no guarantee that is accurate to 3 places! It is not likely that
an apparent overcharging of less than 1% is material to either safety or life of the cell.


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## KuanR (Oct 10, 2012)

I used 3 cotton pickers Nona chargers to check again and they all read 4.21 to 4.23. 

But having read your explanation I guess that 1% really isn't a problem in the big picture, thanks!


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## royjohnson77 (Oct 10, 2012)

Anybody tried charging four 18650 3100 mah batteries in this charger? How long would it take to get fully charged for these four 18650s,thanks!


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## HKJ (Oct 10, 2012)

royjohnson77 said:


> Anybody tried charging four 18650 3100 mah batteries in this charger? How long would it take to get fully charged for these four 18650s,thanks!



If you check the first post in this thread (The review), you will see a test with four 3100 mAh batteries, it took 650 minutes to charge them (i.e. just below 11 hours).


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## easytim (Nov 21, 2012)

Do you think its OK to leave AAA and AA NiMH batteries in the NiteCore Intellichargerr all the time 24/7 to insure the battery will be 100% charged when I need it? 

It says it shuts off when charged , I just wonder if its ok to leave them in the charger 24/7.


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## HKJ (Nov 21, 2012)

easytim said:


> Do you think its OK to leave AAA and AA NiMH batteries in the NiteCore Intellichargerr all the time 24/7 to insure the battery will be 100% charged when I need it?
> 
> It says it shuts off when charged , I just wonder if its ok to leave them in the charger 24/7.



There is no reason to do that, because the charger will not recharge the batteries if the voltage drops.
if you use eneloop AA/AAA batteries, you do not need to worry about self discharge in the batteries.


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## hb-light (Nov 26, 2012)

About charging an AAA: In the same channel, does the second battery have to be another AAA? Or can it be any other battery i.e. Lithium, nicd? 

It says the charger charges at 375mA with 4 batts or 750mA with 2 batts? Does it charge at the same respective rates with 1 and 3 batteries?

So just to clarify about what HKJ said earlier, if an AAA batt. is charging with another batt. (AAA or not) and the other batt. is finished charging, the output current will go from 375mA to 750mA for the remaining AAA batt.? this isn't recommended from the product instruction. 

And finally, the triple flashing leds means that the battery is under a voltage of 0.75. Does that mean the battery is useless? 

Thanks.


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## HKJ (Nov 27, 2012)

light zebra said:


> About charging an AAA: In the same channel, does the second battery have to be another AAA? Or can it be any other battery i.e. Lithium, nicd?



You can charge a single AAA, they can take the full charge current.
Using batteries both connected slots will reduce the current, it does not matter if you use 2xNiMH or NiMH+LiIon.




light zebra said:


> It says the charger charges at 375mA with 4 batts or 750mA with 2 batts? Does it charge at the same respective rates with 1 and 3 batteries?



It depends on the slots used, using 1 & 3 will reduce the current for 1 & 3, using 1 & 2 & 3 will also reduce the current for 1 & 3, but 2 will charge with full current.



light zebra said:


> So just to clarify about what HKJ said earlier, if an AAA batt. is charging with another batt. (AAA or not) and the other batt. is finished charging, the output current will go from 375mA to 750mA for the remaining AAA batt.? this isn't recommended from the product instruction.



Yes, this is exactly what I shows with this curve:





At 326 minutes the first battery is fully charged and all the current is used to charge the second battery (The battery shown in the chart).




light zebra said:


> And finally, the triple flashing leds means that the battery is under a voltage of 0.75. Does that mean the battery is useless?



This depends on chemistry, a LiIon will be useless (Except if it is the protection), a NiMH can be saved.


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## MTHED (Dec 6, 2012)

Received an i4 charger and 4 Eagletac 18650 3100mAh from goinggear today. Charged all 4 batteries at the same time. Battery 1-4.20v, 2-4.19v, 3-4.19v, 4-4.18v immediately off charger. Charge took a while but no issues with heat.


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## awyeah (Dec 10, 2012)

Has anyone tested the reverse polarity protection on this charger? I tried putting an eneloop in backwards, but it started to flash like it was charging - one bar flashing, not all 3 bars flashing rapidly like the manual states. I didn't have the guts to leave it in there for very long, maybe 15 seconds...


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## NiOOH (Jan 3, 2013)

Looking at the charging curves for NiMH cells on the V2 charger, it appears that it terminates on maximum voltage @ 1.53 V or something. This is indeed not a proper termination method for Ni-based cells, but works most of the time, with slight undercharging. One should be careful with new HSD cells, that hasn't been properly formed. It happens, especially at lower currents that such cells peak at lower voltages (around and even lower than 1.50 V), that may lead to dangerous overcharging.


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## VBAjedi (Jan 4, 2013)

I'm new here and I'm pretty much a flashlight greenhorn. I hope it's not bad forum etiquette to ask for a quick recommendation in the comments of a review thread...

I'm looking for a good *value *(i.e. don't need top of the line) in a travellable (110-240VAC and 12VDC) "all-in-one" charger that can do a better job of maintaining my little collection of 20 Eneloops (all I have now is the standard 2-cells-at-a-time Eneloop charger) *AND *charge a couple of 14500 lithium cells (not purchased yet, gotta do some searching here in the forum to see what's recommended) for my new Trustfire R5-A3 light.

Would this Intellicharger i4 V2charger be a good option for that, or are there others I should be considering? I know chargers like the Maha C9000 have more features to offer for my Eneloops, but anything's a step up from the Eneloop charger I currently use and I want the simplicity of an "all-in-one" charger.

Thanks!


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## Changchung (Jan 5, 2013)

VBAjedi said:


> I'm new here and I'm pretty much a flashlight greenhorn. I hope it's not bad forum etiquette to ask for a quick recommendation in the comments of a review thread...
> 
> I'm looking for a good *value *(i.e. don't need top of the line) in a travellable (110-240VAC and 12VDC) "all-in-one" charger that can do a better job of maintaining my little collection of 20 Eneloops (all I have now is the standard 2-cells-at-a-time Eneloop charger) *AND *charge a couple of 14500 lithium cells (not purchased yet, gotta do some searching here in the forum to see what's recommended) for my new Trustfire R5-A3 light.
> 
> ...



I am pretty sure that this charger can do a good job, for both chemistry, 110/220volts and 12volts DC as well...



awyeah said:


> Has anyone tested the reverse polarity protection on this charger? I tried putting an eneloop in backwards, but it started to flash like it was charging - one bar flashing, not all 3 bars flashing rapidly like the manual states. I didn't have the guts to leave it in there for very long, maybe 15 seconds...



Same happen to me last night with a AA sony the three lights go on flashing when I see that I take a look to battery and I say WHAAAATTTT take the battery off and put it back in the right position and charge just fine...

Sent from my phone with camera with flash and internet on it...


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## redorblack (Jan 13, 2013)

HKJ said:


> If you check the first post in this thread (The review), you will see a test with four 3100 mAh batteries, it took 650 minutes to charge them (i.e. just below 11 hours).


Ok, I just got 3 Zebralight 3100mah 18650 cells and have a Pila IBC 2 bay charger. With my old Trustfire flame 2400mah cells it only takes a few hours, with my fresh cells I was wondering because the cells got warm on the first charge and it took about 5-6 hours to turn the lights green. As I have a bunch of old 2400mah cells, and am used to swapping one or two our a day at work, I'm not so sure with my new flashlight that takes 3 3100mah cells how long I'd be down doing 2 then 1 in the Pila vs. all 3 in the Intellicharger. Anyone have a clue what the difference in charge rates is?


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## PCC (Feb 2, 2013)

I got my i4 the other day and so far have charged three 18650s. I live the convenience of this compared to using my old hobby charger. 

I just threw in a pair of NiMH Sub-C cells and a pair of half A cells with spacers and they're charging away as I type this. The Sub-C cells cannot be loaded four across as they don't quite sit right and the cells sitting next to each other causes one to sit over and up preventing another from sitting in the next available slot. A third one can be placed in the fourth slot, though. I just filled the two empty slots with half A cells.


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## UrbanLegend (Feb 16, 2013)

Thanks for all the helpful info and test data!

Based on reviews here, I ordered a Jetbeam Intellicharger on Amazon, under the product heading, "JETBeam IntelliCharger i4 Charger - 2nd Generation - for charging 18650, 16340(RCR123), 14500, etc."

It arrived after a little over three weeks, much later than several other items ordered the same day. It finally arrived yesterday.

Anxious to try it out, I opened the package, only to find it has a European style wall plug, which of course does not work where I live in the USA.  The product description did not specify a plug type on the charger cord.

I did discover that the charger cord on my Nikon battery charger seems to work. Several other battery charger cords that I had, including single and two-bay 18650 chargers, did not work. I am ordering a generic charger cord from Amazon under the heading, "Standard Replacement AC Cord for Most Battery Chargers" from Nikon.

I plan to use the charger for 3400mAh Orbtronics 18650 batteries for my TK75 and other smaller lights using 18650 batteries.

Disappointing service from this company, but pleased that no one else seems to have had the same issue. Hoping the charger cord I will buy delivers correct power to the charger.

Thanks again for all the reviews and tests!

*Update*: I contacted the seller through Amazon (it was actually East Face Sci & Tech). They responded, on a weekend, within a couple of hours and have already shipped a replacement USA compatible charger cord. Very quick, friendly response and I am now a happy camper. Meanwhile I am using the charger with a cord from a Nikon charger and it works beautifully! Have charged about 16 18650 batteries and could not be more pleased with the result. BTW in doing follow-up research I noticed one seller of the I4 refer to it as "Ver. 3", as opposed to "Ver. 2". They indicated in the ad that v. 3 replaces the plastic spring slides with metal ones, eliminating the one common complaint with this charger. My charger was advertised as V. 2 b ut does have the metal slides, which are solid and smooth.


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## skytop (Apr 17, 2013)

Really excellent review of the new i4 charger. Know I know the facts about the new version of which I just received to replace my original version original intellicharger. BTW, the old model served me wonderfully and I expect this new one to continue top trouble free service.

Thanks for the wonderful review!


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## ash7503 (Aug 28, 2013)

Hi, has the "JETBeam IntelliCharger i4 PRO Charger V3 - 3rd Generation - 2013 Enhanced Version" been tested for eneloop yet?
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00BC4J5O0/?tag=cpf0b6-20


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## Changchung (Aug 31, 2013)

ash7503 said:


> Hi, has the "JETBeam IntelliCharger i4 PRO Charger V3 - 3rd Generation - 2013 Enhanced Version" been tested for eneloop yet?
> http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00BC4J5O0/?tag=cpf0b6-20



Checking the reviews look like this one is worst than the second version...


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## Elwin (Sep 22, 2013)

Yeah, I'm late to the party, but thanks for the review.
It helped me decide to buy one.


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## tbenedict (Oct 1, 2013)

So I've been reading about this model, and I'm still not sure. I mainly use Eneloops and occasionally charge a few 18650, 14500, and such. Both my BC-700 and cheap li-ion chargers are crapping out on me. I'm mainly concerned about the nimh performance since that is where most of the use is.


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## HKJ (Oct 13, 2013)

I have added thermal images to review.


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## boki (Jan 13, 2014)

Sorry to dig this thread up but my Intellicharger i4 v2 just crapped out a bit - I was trying to revive some over discharged laptop cells and after it started charging them slot 4 went completely dark and now it won't charge any battery and slot 3 starts charging but then gets only bottom led lit steady and nothing happens. Slots 1 and 2 still work. Did I damage my charger? Thanks.


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## oKtosiTe (Jan 14, 2014)

boki said:


> Sorry to dig this thread up but my Intellicharger i4 v2 just crapped out a bit - I was trying to revive some over discharged laptop cells and after it started charging them slot 4 went completely dark and now it won't charge any battery and slot 3 starts charging but then gets only bottom led lit steady and nothing happens. Slots 1 and 2 still work. Did I damage my charger? Thanks.


Did you unplug and replug it?


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## Goredoth (Mar 19, 2014)

So this is a good charger, does that mean I should save some money and grab it over the Pila or does the Pila still have benefits over this. I don't mind paying more if it will be better for my batteries but if it's just because Pila didn't design theirs to be manufactured affordable like someone suggested in this thread then perhaps this is better if I handle it delicately?

Thanks for the review HKJ.


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## HKJ (Mar 19, 2014)

Goredoth said:


> So this is a good charger, does that mean I should save some money and grab it over the Pila or does the Pila still have benefits over this. I don't mind paying more if it will be better for my batteries but if it's just because Pila didn't design theirs to be manufactured affordable like someone suggested in this thread then perhaps this is better if I handle it delicately?



It is a good universal charger, i.e. one that can both charge LiIon and NiMH, but it is not perfect for either.

The Pila works and looks like a very solid construction, but it is very limited in functionality.
Xtar does charge the correct way for LiIon and with multiple current settings (And now also voltage settings), they are very good LiIon chargers.
Some Xtars to check (VP2), VP1, WP2s, SP1. This is not all the Xtar charges, but the best ones I have tested (Except VP2, that I have not tested yet).


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## Goredoth (Mar 19, 2014)

Thanks! I have been interested in some Xtars but unfortunately my choices are limited to either the Nitecore Intellicharger i2 or the Pila IBC as I'm ordering from EDC+ Seeing as that's where I'm getting a couple Redilast P18650-3400mAh from for a Fenix TK35 or similar.

Is the extra $30 worth it for the Pila?

Thanks for all the reviews by the way, before I discovered my limited options I spent the better part of this morning going through reviews on your site!


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## HKJ (Mar 19, 2014)

Goredoth said:


> Thanks! I have been interested in some Xtars but unfortunately my choices are limited to either the Nitecore Intellicharger i2 or the Pila IBC as I'm ordering from EDC+ Seeing as that's where I'm getting a couple Redilast P18650-3400mAh from for a Fenix TK35 or similar.



Why not order from another dealer that has good batteries and Xtar chargers?




Goredoth said:


> Is the extra $30 worth it for the Pila?



I believe that the Pila is too expensive, but it is better than the i2 or i4 for charging LiIon.


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## cland72 (Mar 19, 2014)

Goredoth said:


> Is the extra $30 worth it for the Pila?



In my opinion, no. I'll admit I've never used a Pila, but I have owned a i4 Intellicharger for the past couple of years and it's worked very well for me with no issues. I think you're getting diminishing returns on your money by spending more on a Pila vs. what you could get a i4 for.


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## Goredoth (Mar 19, 2014)

I suppose I could do that haha. I got my heart set on Redilast as the reviews I read showed them often as just slightly better than AW and seeing as AW's reputation on this forum I was pretty stoked to find Redilast slightly cheaper on EDC and I haven't found any other sites that sell Xtar and Redilast. Any suggestions?

Yeah I wouldn't mind if the Pila was a little cheaper it seems a lot to ask.

Thank you.



cland72 said:


> In my opinion, no. I'll admit I've never used a Pila, but I have owned a i4 Intellicharger for the past couple of years and it's worked very well for me with no issues. I think you're getting diminishing returns on your money by spending more on a Pila vs. what you could get a i4 for.


Thanks Chris, if I have trouble finding an Xtar charger & quality 18650 seller for the right price & that will ship to Aus I think I'll have a good thought about getting the i2 as HKJ says it is better but how much better I suppose we're not sure. Not looking like people think it's $30 worth better.


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## ChrisGarrett (Mar 19, 2014)

Goredoth said:


> I suppose I could do that haha. I got my heart set on Redilast as the reviews I read showed them often as just slightly better than AW and seeing as AW's reputation on this forum I was pretty stoked to find Redilast slightly cheaper on EDC and I haven't found any other sites that sell Xtar and Redilast. Any suggestions?
> 
> Yeah I wouldn't mind if the Pila was a little cheaper it seems a lot to ask.
> 
> Thank you.



I like EDC+ and bought two of their 17670s and their 3 mode P60 XM-L2 U2 drop in back in November, for a fair price, but they're expensive on that NiteCore i4 v2, just so you know.

You can find them on Ebay for $17-$20 shipped, from authorized NC dealers.

If you have to, buy the batteries from them and get something like an Xtar charger...maybe the now discounted VP1 with volt meter, for ~$40 shipped. With what you'd save on it and shipping, over the slower Pila, you'd almost get the cells for free.

You need to look around. EDC+ is good people, no doubt, but they, AW and CalliesKustom all got passed by in 2012, due to their inflexible pricing stance.

Chris


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## HKJ (Mar 19, 2014)

Goredoth said:


> I suppose I could do that haha. I got my heart set on Redilast as the reviews I read showed them often as just slightly better than AW and seeing as AW's reputation on this forum I was pretty stoked to find Redilast slightly cheaper on EDC and I haven't found any other sites that sell Xtar and Redilast. Any suggestions?



There are many good brands, many of them get batteries manufactured (Protection and button top added) at Keeppower. You can buy Keeppower marked batteries at some dealers other sells the ones with their own label.

One brand I can remember is Orbtronic.
Xtar does also sell the 3400 battery, i.e. any dealer that has Xtar, might also have their batteries.


Small differences in capacity between brands is most likely due to different age of the batteries, i.e. when a dealer get a new batch they will have slightly higher capacity than a ½ year old stock.


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## Goredoth (Mar 19, 2014)

ChrisGarrett said:


> You need to look around. EDC+ is good people, no doubt, but they, AW and CalliesKustom all got passed by in 2012, due to their inflexible pricing stance.
> 
> Chris



Cheers Chris, I'll keep what you've said in mind.. Especially the quoted part. Didn't realise that before but after having a look at Orbtronic and a few other good brands found in HKJ's compare batteries tool I see I can get 3600mAh for what I was going to pay for 3.4!



HKJ said:


> One brand I can remember is Orbtronic.
> Xtar does also sell the 3400 battery, i.e. any dealer that has Xtar, might also have their batteries.
> 
> Small differences in capacity between brands is most likely due to different age of the batteries, i.e. when a dealer get a new batch they will have slightly higher capacity than a ½ year old stock.



Thanks again, I think I was pretty sceptical of most brands because I have read so much about the false mAh ratings but it's starting to look like it's not nearly as many as I thought.. Mainly UltraFire haha.


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## TomasVarnik (May 6, 2014)

Hi, noob question...

Is there any difference between putting the batteries in the the charger and then plug it into the outlet, and doing it the other way around (ie first plug it, then insert the batteries)?

Is one of the ways better than the other?

And then... when the job is done, is it better to take out the batteries and then unplug it, or vice versa?

Sorry for the silly question


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## SilverFox (May 6, 2014)

Hello TomasVarnik,

Welcome to CPF.

Keep in mind that the only "silly" question is the one that is not asked...

Usually there is no difference. However, there are some exceptions. Try it both ways and see how things work out.

Tom


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## TomasVarnik (May 6, 2014)

Thank you Tom.

I was asking because I read that I should always power up the charger first before inserting batteries unless stated otherwise in the instructions, but I can't figure out why...

OK, I will try it both ways and see how things work out


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## HKJ (May 6, 2014)

TomasVarnik said:


> Thank you Tom.
> 
> I was asking because I read that I should always power up the charger first before inserting batteries unless stated otherwise in the instructions, but I can't figure out why...
> 
> OK, I will try it both ways and see how things work out



Generally when I test chargers, I put the battery in before I power up the charger. I do it this way, because it is easier to connect my sense wires with the power off.
The only time it failed was with the MCC-4 charger, because due to a "problem" with its automatic current select.
When I use chargers, I usual do it the other way round, i.e. the charger stays powered when I replace the batteries.


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## Scarface26 (May 6, 2014)

Has anyone here ever used the Revolectrix CellPro 6 battery charger? It is mostly used for charging batteries for Remote Control planes and Helicopters (mostly LiPo , although it will do others including NiMH, Li-Ion, LiFeP04, and Nicd). I have one and am researching to find out if it is suitable for use with my Fenix 18650 batteries. It is a really good charger, and can be connected to a laptop to display graphs while charging and discharging.


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## Bullzeyebill (May 6, 2014)

Scarface26, welcome to CPF. It would be good if you started your own thread re your question, which is off topic. 

Bill


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## Scarface26 (May 7, 2014)

OK, Sorry.


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## Frankiarmz (Jul 7, 2014)

my i4 Intellicharger died after I put four AA nimh and then plugged it the wall. Would not power up from the AC cord but did power up from the car cord, unfortunately that also malfunctioned. No repair facility in the USA, so I have another paperweight. Very disappointed in the return or repair policy, mailing back to chinais not an option I care to exercise. I did not misuse or abuse the charge, it failed prematurely.


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## Gauss163 (Jul 12, 2014)

TomasVarnik said:


> Is there any difference between putting the batteries in the the charger and then plug it into the outlet, and doing it the other way around (ie first plug it, then insert the batteries)? Is one of the ways better than the other? I was asking because I read that I should always power up the charger first before inserting batteries unless stated otherwise in the instructions, but I can't figure out why...



I vaguely recall that some hobby charger manuals warn to power on the unit _before _connecting the batteries, since otherwise the reverse polarity protection will not work. So it is conceivable that other chargers may behave similarly.


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## awyeah (Jul 13, 2014)

I always power up the charger first. 

That said, it seems like chargers should handle this situation. What happens when the power goes out?


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## lwknight (Jul 13, 2014)

awyeah said:


> I always power up the charger first.
> 
> That said, it seems like chargers should handle this situation. What happens when the power goes out?


Just don't put batteries in backwards.


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## Gauss163 (Jul 13, 2014)

awyeah said:


> I always power up the charger first.
> That said, it seems like chargers should handle this situation. What happens when the power goes out?



All is well as long as the power does not fail during the tiny percentage of time when the batteries are installed with reverse-polarity.

But I don't know if this applies to the i4 since I don't own one. Does it even have reverse polarity protection?


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## espresso (Sep 8, 2014)

*Intellicharger v2 - IMR compatibility questionable*

Since many of us still have v2 of this charger I suppose this thread isn't dead yet. I sent an email to the manufacturer asking whether Intellicharger v2 can safely charge IMR li-ions and this is their answer:


> Thank you for your interest in Nitecore's product, only the 2014 model is capable of charging IMR batteries, the previous models are not compatible with these batteries.




User experience with v2 says that it can successfully charge IMRs. But we don't actually know what is going on at the end of the charge, do we? Maybe the terminating current is to big, maybe there's a slight overcharge every time.... 
HKJ tested this charger with an old IMR with high resistance. But what about new IMRs?


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## HKJ (Sep 8, 2014)

*Re: Intellicharger v2 - IMR compatibility questionable*



espresso said:


> User experience with v2 says that it can successfully charge IMRs. But we don't actually know what is going on at the end of the charge, do we? Maybe the terminating current is to big, maybe there's a slight overcharge every time....
> HKJ tested this charger with an old IMR with high resistance. But what about new IMRs?



IMR has same charge requirements as other LiIon batteries, i.e. there is no problem charging them.


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## espresso (Sep 8, 2014)

*Re: Intellicharger v2 - IMR compatibility questionable*

I was under the impression that some chargers might not react properly when charging cells with very low internal resistance and in result, supply higher current than needed during CV method. So the chemistry is the same, but the low resistance of the cell has an impact on charge control. 

I'm also wondering what's behind the answer support provided.
It could be that they just didn't test this charger in specific cases with IMRs so they can't be absolutely sure it's safe. Or maybe the charger needs to be designed to monitor changes in current more accurately.


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## HKJ (Sep 8, 2014)

*Re: Intellicharger v2 - IMR compatibility questionable*



espresso said:


> I was under the impression that some chargers might not react properly when charging cells with very low internal resistance and in result, supply higher current than needed during CV method. So the chemistry is the same, but the low resistance of the cell has an impact on charge control.



If the charge current is oscillating a bit it does not really matter.



espresso said:


> I'm also wondering what's behind the answer support provided.
> It could be that they just didn't test this charger in specific cases with IMRs so they can't be absolutely sure it's safe. Or maybe the charger needs to be designed to monitor changes in current more accurately.



It might be support person that tries to sell the new charger model


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## cobalt327 (Dec 22, 2014)

First, apologies for opening this thread after it being idle for so long. I didn't feel my post warranted a new thread but if this is wrong I'll be happy to do so.

Has there been, or will there be a review of the 'updated' *2014* NITECORE i4 V2 Universal Intelligent Charger? It's advertised as having "optimized charging design for IMR Batteries". It also has steel "rails" for the moveable contacts to ride on so is much smoother than it was when it was metal on plastic. But it's mainly the potential difference in how it charges and terminates that interests me.

Thanks.


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## StandardBattery (Dec 22, 2014)

cobalt327 said:


> First, apologies for opening this thread after it being idle for so long. I didn't feel my post warranted a new thread but if this is wrong I'll be happy to do so.
> 
> Has there been, or will there be a review of the 'updated' *2014* NITECORE i4 V2 Universal Intelligent Charger? It's advertised as having "optimized charging design for IMR Batteries". It also has steel "rails" for the moveable contacts to ride on so is much smoother than it was when it was metal on plastic. But it's mainly the potential difference in how it charges and terminates that interests me.
> 
> Thanks.


I think this is what you are looking for:

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?387785


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## radionman1 (Oct 16, 2016)

My sample behaves differently.

It generates massive RFI on 80M and 40M. Cameron Conover posted a video complaining about the same problem:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oQs1BA4GsB8

One posting there suggests that using a 12V wall wart instead of a power cord could solve the problem. That did not work for me.

I have confiscated my son's Nitecore i4 and I will replace it with one that is actually tested and FCC approved. This one just says "Made in China by SYSMAX Ind" with no indication that it has received FCC approval.

Now if I could just get the other million of these things crushed with a sledge hammer, the air waves would thank me.

Thanks for listening!


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## hatman (Oct 19, 2016)

Is the "Nitecore New i4 2016 Intellicharger" an updated version of these models?


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## HKJ (Oct 19, 2016)

hatman said:


> Is the "Nitecore New i4 2016 Intellicharger" an updated version of these models?



More like a completely new model and the i2 was not that good.


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## hatman (Oct 19, 2016)

HKJ said:


> More like a completely new model and the i2 was not that good.



Thanks. I'm trying this new model and it seems also "not that good."

Longer batteries are a difficult fit to make a good contact.

And both lithium ion and Eneloops don't seem to charge fully, according to what happens after I transfer supposedly fully-charged batteries to either my old Pila or Maha chargers.


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