# mag 2c with magcharger bulb and slug



## milkshake (Dec 29, 2009)

hello, i was wondering if anybody has any information about this setup. i put a magcharger bi pin slug and bulb in a mag 2c with 3 cr123a batteries and was wondering if this was a good setup or not. i also put the magcharger lens in as well. it's bright but i just dont know how well it will run on the cr123 batteries. thanks!


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## Conte (Dec 29, 2009)

Did you set this up already ? Or are you asking if you should before you try it ?

I would think that 3 Cr123s would overvolt the bulb and 

Otherwise if it works, then it works. You'll likely get less then an hour runtime tho. Also, overvolting a bulb will reduce its life. So if you were actually using this for something important, bring a spare bulb and plenty of batteries.

If the magcharger bulb works in a 3xCR123 configuration, I'd be tempted to try it in a 2x18650 Li-Ion configuration. 


If you HAVEN'T tried this yet . . . I would not recommend it.


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## USM0083 (Dec 29, 2009)

When I got into hotwires, one combination I tried was a Magcharger bulb in a 3C body with an AW softstart switch and 2 x AW 18650s. On high it was brighter than a ROP low bulb, but the bulb lasted less than 10 mins.


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## Conte (Dec 29, 2009)

Hah, yeah, that's what I was thinking. Bet without the softstart . . . 

The saving grace of his idea is that a CR123 primary might sag more under load then an 18650 lion cell. 

Either way, I'm thinking he's not getting much life out his bulb.


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## milkshake (Dec 30, 2009)

thanks for the input everyone! i already put the slug and bulb in the mag 2c and it is very bright. the bulb has yet to blow but i figured it would have a short life. i was hoping it wouldnt be too short though. i'm more worried about the stress on the batteries and their runtime though. i'm guessing their runtime will be short enough that its probably not worth it. i also thought about putting the bi pin in a mag 2d or 3d that i have and trying something with those instead. i just really liked the size of the 2c setup. thanks again!


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## Conte (Dec 30, 2009)

Well, I favorite setup of mine with the mag 2C is the Mag 11.

Put a WA1111 bulb in there, and you can fit 2x18650 Lion cells in there with an easy mod. 

Problem is, you get less then an hour runtime.

I want to scale down this hotwire, but I need a special bulb to do it.
WA makes a 1110 bulb that has identical specs to the 1111 but at half the wattage. So it should give you a good balance of runtime and output. It should be similar to what you are running now. 

I need to find a way to get me some more different bulbs.


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## rebelbayou (Dec 30, 2009)

Hi,

I have an old Mag 2C with a 4-cell Mag LED bulb that is running off of 6 alkaline AAA batteries with a new stock reflector and UCL glass lenses and it is bright with a very nice beam pattern. I have left it on for 30 minutes before and it didn't get hot or lose too much brightness. Is this a bad combination of parts or is there anything I should worry about? Granted, the 6 alkalines are not full 1.5 volts. Most are around 1.2-1.3. Thanks

Richard


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## Conte (Dec 30, 2009)

Hmm, that's a neat setup. First I've heard of cramming 6-AAA's in a 2C.

Once again if it works it works. If you can run it for a half hour without any problems you should be fine. Heck, I'm not even sure you need a UCL lens for that, but I'm sure it'll be more scratch resistant improving the quality of output. 

The MagLED should be able to take the mild overdrive, and alkaline batteries aren't known to be dangerous. Just don't leave them in the light if you don't plan using it for a long period of time. 

Sounds like your good to go, but if you upgrade it in the future with a much higher end led system, you'd likely need a different power source.

I bet the 4-cell MagLed could handle running off a pair of 18650 cells.


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## rebelbayou (Dec 30, 2009)

Thanks for the quick reply. The battery holders came out of those cheap, clicky switch, 9-LED type lights that sells for about $3 at HF. I substituted a smaller, fatter spring in the tail cap and it worked out to be the perfect length. If I'm not mistaken, I think the bulb may actually be one of the older Mag 2-cell C or D bulbs. I want to put 6 brand new AAAs' in it but I don't want to take a chance of blowing the bulb. Even with the old alkalines it is brighter and whiter than my brand new A1 EOS which is rated at 190lm on high.


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## Conte (Dec 30, 2009)

Well, what do you know. Hah, I'm to busy trying to cram li-ion cells into everything to pay attention to what I can to with some stock parts. 

I have 2 of those cheapy flashlights. I just tried. One holder is longer then the other, so it doesn't quite work for me. But if I had to of the smaller ones I could see how that works. Interesting. 

I have a 2-cell magled, I'll run it witha li-ion cell @3.7-4.2v and it does not  If yours is a 2 cell you could be running the regulator pretty hard. 

If it's a 4-cell it should be fine. They have a part number on them.
Mine says: 2R1G06. Check yours part number. I bet the 3 and 4 cells ones will be 3Rxxxx and 4Rxxxx. 

If its a 2R and you like the rig, I'd think about picking up a 4cell version. 
Also, have you considered using rechargables ?Mag C/D High Temp Socket kits‏


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## rebelbayou (Dec 30, 2009)

The number on the bulb is 3R1H06, so I guess it must be for a 3-cell. I also have 2 other mag bulbs. The number on 1 is 2R1C07. I have "bad" written on it because I think it blew after about a week of running 4 brand new "C" cells in my 3-D. The number on the other 1 is 4R2H06. I'm not sure where I got it but it appears to be bad also. 

Do you think it would blow the bulb if I put 6 brand new AAAs' in it?

I haven't ever considered a high temp socket before. What would that allow me to do? 

Also, I wanted to note that the 2 battery carriers I am using do not have a spring on either end of them. They are just flat.


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## Conte (Dec 30, 2009)

Damn, you're really hard on the things aren't you ?

Have you tried the 4R ?

Sometimes the driver is just blown and if you can figure out how to dismantle the little capsule you can remove the driver board, bypass it, and just run the LED straight up. But then you have to be extra sure you run it with the correct voltage. Its most likely 3.7 volts. 

Might be something interesting to try with the dead units.

This happend to me, I was running a newer 3D LED Maglite of a single Lifepo4 cell, and I ed the driver. So I just removed and bypassed it works great now running off a lifepo4 cell, but when I try to run it off a li-ion if looked like it wants to . Eitherway, you're going to fry the driver before you fry the LED, so you probably have some perfectly good LED emitters to play with if you can figure out how to power them. 

Honestly, if I were you, I'd invest in some 18650 Li-ion cells. 
Get a couple the 26's off AW and you can power that Magled for a fair amount to time. Probably close to 3 hours each battery. Hell, unless you use it for more then 3 hours between charges. Even one battery will do you good. Use those techniques for building battery adapters in my other thread. 

Yeah, one of my battery carriers have no spring, the other does. 

"Mag C/D High Temp Socket kits‏ " ?
I was researching them around the same time I was writing up that last post. It seems I accidentally hit copy (I have hot buttons on my mouse) before I hit send. 
They are upgrades for running high output Incan bulbs. Like if you wanted to build the 100 watt Mag623.


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## rebelbayou (Dec 30, 2009)

This is very interesting to me. I haven't taken the plunge so to speak as far as any emitter swapping goes, but it's only because I didn't think I had any bare emitters or ordered any. I read all I can every day, but it's so much information here, it's hard to keep it all organized in my head. But to give you some details, I had put the Mag bulb that is working in a friends 3D. His grandson dropped it and it went out so he replaced it with a regular incan. He gave the LED back to me and I stuck it in my pocket. When I got home and pulled it out, the very top of the bulb had seperated from the module? and I was able to pull the "emitter"..I guess?? up off the module. It had 2 tiny prongs on each side of it. I could see the board? driver? down in the module. I just stuck the emitter back on as far as I could until it was flush and it fired up! Hang with me as I'm new to this, I don't know what kind of compound that was between emitter and top of module. It was hard and crusty and I scraped it off. I have some "silicone based" heat sink compound but I'm not sure if that goes between the 2 or not. I have a lot to learn!

The 4-cell LED is dead, for now.....BUT, I can pull the emitter off of it as well. Now, if I could find some instructions on how to bypass the driver board I might be back in business.

I plan on ordering some 18650s' and a charger tomorrow when I order some RCR123s' and a charger for my new A1 EOS.


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## Conte (Dec 31, 2009)

Yeah, I find the Incan info easy to follow, but the LED info gets to me sometimes. Not sure where to start, but I'm piecing it together.
I'm not a fan of LED's anyway, so I dont' play with them much. 
I recently ordered a SSC P4 emitter in attempts to try and upgrade one of my magleds. 

The Magled units will have all the same emitters. The diff is, the 2C will have a booster regulator, the 4C will have a buck regulator, and the 3C will have more a neutral regulator. (c as in cell)

Dont' quote me on this, I don't know for sure. Just my best guess based on how I understand drivers operation. Ether way, both are innately design to make sure only the right amount of voltage and current hits the emitter.

Any heatsink compound would work, problem is, some are glues, some aren't, I lost the emitter one of my magleds, playing around with snap on opticals. I used some computer heatsink compound and then epoxies in on around the edges. And yes, a "non electrically conductive" heatsink compound goes under the emitter between in and its little capsule, that double as a heatsink. And yes, that little PC board you saw is the driver. 

To bypass the driver, you need to pull apart the capsule. the black plastic piece on the other end should pop off somehow. once off, there will be a little PC board, the driver. It designed to pop apart so everything inside should just unplug, you can just pull the driver out.
Then its a case of taking a little piece of metal and wedging it in there in such a way that it will bridge the gap between the positive contact on the inside of the black plastic cap, and the emitters positive terminal. 

Now, I've only done this mod with a newer rebel led capsule from the newer led maglites. I can't explain in any more detail then that how to do it at this point. 

Once you've bypassed it, you have to feed it a specific voltage.
So no more 6 AA mods  But a single 18650 will be gravy.


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## rebelbayou (Dec 31, 2009)

Hey, thanks for the advice. This will give me something to play around with today. I may have to invest in some heat sink compound though. In your post you stated it should be non-conductive heat sink between emitter and heatsink and mine says "increases thermal conductivity." I'll have to do a little research to find out which I need. I did order some 18650s' this morning and a charger, so I'm anxious to get started. Good thing is, I have 3 Mag LED bulbs to experiment with!


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## Conte (Dec 31, 2009)

Non "Electrically" conductive.

Which means you dont' want to use some . . . aluminum based compound that can conduct electricity. I've used Arctic Silver 5 before. 
You do want something that "increases thermal conductivity." That's the point of heatsink goo.

Hah, once you fire up those 18650's, you aren't going to be playing with AA's anymore, that's for sure :twothumbs


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## rebelbayou (Jan 1, 2010)

Sorry for my lack of understanding about this compound stuff, but I'm having trouble grasping this concept. I have 2 tubes in my hand. One is Rat Shak silicone based heat sink compound, and the other is Acme Products conductive grease. So if you could be so kind as to tell me again which one of these I should use between the emitter and the metal underneath , I would be most appreciative. Or, if niether one of these, do I need to order some Arctic Silver? Thanks for your patience.


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## Conte (Jan 1, 2010)

Oh, Don't sweat it, bro. 

You ever notice how much colder it is in wet clothes ? 
Like a rainy day at camp ?

Well, heatsink goo works the same way. Get its wet so its cooler.

Technically how it works is, at a microscopic level, neither the surface of the heaksink nor the surface of the LED are perfectly flat. The goo fills in the gaps to eliminate any microscopic air barriers that would otherwise act as an insulator. Not sure if I'm explaining it well. 

My gut says you should be good with the Rat Shak Silicone, simply cause silicone it like rubber and could not possibly conduct electricity. 
Heck, maybe it's even one of those adhesive goos and will serve to glue the led back onto the capsule.


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## rebelbayou (Jan 1, 2010)

Conte,

Thanks for clearing that up for me. You explained it in a way that I can comprehend. I used some of the Rat Shak silicone based heat sink compound and stuck the emitter back on and it's working fine. Thanks again!


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## Conte (Jan 1, 2010)

Wicked. Which one did it repair ?

As I recall you had a 2h, 3h and 4h. The 2 and 4 were "dead" and the 3 is the one you've been using.


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## rebelbayou (Jan 2, 2010)

I put it on the one that is working, between the emitter and the heat sink because I had scraped all the old crusty original glue/compound off. I still have the other 2, and I was able to actually seperate those also. But I don't know what to do with them or how to check them. So, I have 2 bare emitters, 2 heat sinks and 2 driver boards staring at me. Is it any way to determine what kind of drivers or emitters they are just by looking at them?


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## Conte (Jan 2, 2010)

Well the emitters are going to be the same. They are an early Luxeon. 
Probably one of the first 3watt emitters on the market. 

The driver boards, are only really distinguishable by the amount of cells they are rated for. According to some review information on this forum, they aren't even that good a driver. And, from the sounds of it, you've long fried them. 

First thing I'd do is try to test the emitters. 
Do you have any, alligator clip wires ?
Maybe some magnets ?

Get about 3 volts together, apply it to the emitters and see how they respond. If they don't light up at first, reverse the polarity.
(the positive and negative)

If they both work, then you know your drivers are gone.
If only one of them work, maybe work on testing the drivers with the working emitter. I'm sure its your drivers that are done. 

It'll be tricky, but the idea is to install the emitter back onto the capsule, then find a way to rig it internally so it can work without the driver. 
The emitters will have a specific positive and negative. It'd try setting it up so the negative, touches the inside of the capsule somehow. Then fashion some piece of metal to bridge the gap from the positive terminal on the emitter to the positive contact on the capsules plastic end.


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## rebelbayou (Jan 3, 2010)

I have some alligator clips, wire, and magnets. I'm thinking I could also use a rechargeable battery pack from an R/C airplane. It was originally 7.2 volts but I had run it down to about 4.2 volts or something like that. I also have one of the square 6 volt batteries that is real weak. I'm fixing to give it a whirl. Hopefully, 3 or 4 volts won't blow the emitters. I'll post back with the results.


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## rebelbayou (Jan 3, 2010)

Well, I applied 2 volts to each bare emitter both ways and no luck. Then I bumped the volts up to 5 and what do you know, 1 of them about blinded me when it lit up.:twothumbs So now I have to figure out a way to bypass the driver board or use it in some other way. I think I'll try the way you suggested by grounding negative contact to base and somehow attach posotive terminal from emitter to posotive contact on module. I assume this would be "direct drive?" If I can get it to work that way, how can I determine how many volts it can handle? ie: 3D = 4.5 volts
4C = 6.0 volts


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## Conte (Jan 3, 2010)

So only one led works ? Maybe that means one of the driver boards is still good.

Do you remember which unit the blow emitter came from ?

Yes, it would be direct drive. You'd want to run it at about 3.6 - 4.5v.

I've run the Rebel emitter in the new magled off 3D cells without a problem. So yeah, you'd be putting that unit into the 3D. Otherwise, when you score those 18650 cells you can rig one of your lights to run the direct drive led of ONE of those cells.


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## rebelbayou (Jan 19, 2010)

Conte,

What do you use as a spacer when you run one 18650 in a 2C mag? Or is it possible to use 2 18650s in a 2C mag?


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## swampgator (Jan 19, 2010)

rebelbayou said:


> Or is it possible to use 2 18650s in a 2C mag?


 
It's possible to run 2 unprotected 18650s in a 2C Mag. However you'll need to deanodize the tailcap and find something to act as a spacer. I used the the tailspring from a Mini Mag. I'm currently using unprotected Panasonic & LG 18650s. However Mag changed their C tailcaps at sometime. My '81 non-C serial numbered Mag has a much shorter tailcap than current production that is not able to handle the length of 2 18650s.


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## rebelbayou (Jan 19, 2010)

The serial number on my 2C is 23412174. So I guess I have an early version also. I have deanodized the tailcap completely on the inside. So if I'm reading correctly, I can put 2 18650s' end to end with a mini mag spring between the tailcap and end of last 18650? With of course pvc pipe around the batteries. Or did I get off track? I'd like to also try just one 18650 but I'm not sure what to use to take up the space between the tailcap and end of battery. Any suggestions? Thanks in advance.


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## Conte (Jan 20, 2010)

They 2x18650 in a 2C is classic. Yeah it can be done.
I have a bit of a tutorial about it HERE.

What do you plan to run with 2x18650.

I've made quite a few spacers in my time. Not sure how to explain it cause I used parts that were kind of oddball and probably not up to hotwire standard.

First thing that pops into my mind that I've been meaning to try it to get a piece of copper pipe. Like water pipe. I know my local hardware store would custom cut me whatever length I wanted. Not sure about yours. 
I'd get a piece of copper pipe, and a pair of copper end caps, sizing it so that together they are the right size I need as a spacer. 

Like I said I've been meaning to try it, but haven't really needed any spacers lately. A piece of copper pipe, man, probably be good for 100 amps at least 

The other thing you could try if you're not expecting alot of current.
Which, if you are trying to rig the magleds, this should do fine.
Maybe check the hardware store for a wooden dowel. I've seen them at my stores about the same width as an 18650. Get that, cut it to length, then wrap it in some foil tape. You know what I mean, you can get this self adhesive tinfoil tape. I've used that for low current spacer applications. Works great.

PS, I managed to upgrade one of my magleds. I replaced the stock emitter with an SSC P4. It defiantly brighter and with a nicer quality of light.


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## rebelbayou (Jan 20, 2010)

Hey thanks for the tips and the link. I think I've read that link 10 or 15 times in the last week. LOL Here's what I have before me, so give me some guidance. A 2C mag, 2 mag LED bulbs; a 2-cell & 3-cell, a PR20 bulb, 10 or 15 18650s' extracted from laptop. Most are around 2.6-2.8 volts BUT I did find 2 "good" ones. 1 is 3.77 volts and the other is 3.79 volts. A lot of misc. flashlight bits and pieces, etc. I also made a spacer like you suggested but out of a piece of thick, flat copper strip. So, should I go for 1 or 2 18650s'? I guess the bottom line is, what would be the safest?:help:


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## USM0083 (Jan 20, 2010)

I run a ROP low in a 2C with two 18650s using Downloads tailcap mod, which I believe he is out of stock on. 

You could pick up an AW C body adapter, but you might have to stretch your tailcap spring. http://www.lighthound.com/AW-C-Cell-37-volt-Lithium-Battery-Adapter-for-Mag-C-Flashlight_p_109.html


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## Conte (Jan 21, 2010)

Well, I certainly would not try running more then one 18650 with those Magleds. I run a 2cell magled of a single 18650 all the time. Works great.
I haven't torture tested it tho.

If you can rig your Mag2C for run 1x18650, then do that, try both the 2 and 3 cell magleds. If the 3-cell magled runs as bright as the 2cell, then prefer the 3cell cause its rated for the voltage of the 18650. 

So, match 1x18650 with the 3 cell Magled.


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## rebelbayou (Jan 22, 2010)

I have the Mag 3-cell bulb running off one 18650 and it's doing fine so far. I also took the Mag 2-cell bulb out of my 2-D modded with 3 C-cell light and put it in the 2C with the one 18650 and it started real bright but seemed to start to dim very quickly so I swapped it back out.

Something else I noticed, is that with the 2 cell Mag bulb in the 2 D(with 3 C's) I noticed a very faint whine when I first turn it on sometimes. I think I read somewhere that means it has a current regulator or voltage regulator or something like that? Not sure though..

Lastly, what are some bulb suggestions for running two 18650s?


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## Conte (Jan 22, 2010)

You shouldn't have any problems running the 3cell with an 18650.

I've noticed that whine too, has not given me any problems. 
I imagine it is the sound of the circuit working. But now that you mention it, I have never noticed it running at stock voltages.

The last time I saw an leg quickly dim after turning it on, I had blown the driver. Does it still work properly ?

Bulb recommendations for 2x18650s ? Sounds like it's time to build a hotwire, like a ROP or a Mag11. These are Incans.

Aside from the Magleds, I know nothing else really about Leds. The Magleds are all I've really worked with. I'm an Incan guy. So I've built most all the popular hotwires. 

What bodies do you have to work with, the 2C and the 2D ? Which do you want to worth with. You can fit 2x18650s in ether of those. 
You want conservative usable output, or high output?


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## rebelbayou (Jan 22, 2010)

The LED bulb still works fine. I put it back into my 2D(running 3Cs'). Maybe I should have said bluer or cooler earlier when I said dimmer. 

I am planning on building my first hot wire. That's why the bulb question. I've been an incand. lover myself ever since I bought one of the first original Stingers way back when 15,000cp was like a mini hand-held spotlight. I have a 2C body with the 18650 and LED. I have a couple of 2Ds, and 3Ds. I'm more geared toward high output and LONG throw. Would like to keep the stock mag reflectors if possible because the ones I have are almost flawless.


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## Conte (Jan 22, 2010)

Bluer is bad. Leds will do that when they are being driven too hard and about to die. The unit that turned bluer, is that one you bypassed ?
I would inspect that unit, knowing that you've taken your magleds apart, I'd double check to make sure its making good thermal contact where you put fresh goo on.


As far as incan hotwires, I'm afraid that the reflector is the first to go when making one. Well, after the lens. 

With the stock reflector you are limited to about 10-12 watts.
Even so, prolonged use will start to warp the reflector. 
And, they aren't even that good. Get a good reflector, like a Five Mega Ver2 Deep, and you won't see your stock ones the same way anymore.
They really aren't that good. 
For best bang for buck long throw you need a Throwmaster.
They don't call them that for nothing. They can even throw a stock mag bulb much farther. 


With 2D's and 3D's you could built almost any hotwire.
With 18650s, you could build a Mag11 in your 2D or a Mag85 in your 3D. 

The Mag11, is the best place to start. I plan on writing a tutorial on it soon. 

you could also go ROP, you could run a ROP-Low bulb in your stock reflector till you finally get an upgrade then run the ROP-Hi. 

Either way, you'll need to upgrade your Lens first.


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