# CSI Miami- Plane crash from green flash



## wolfblue (Mar 4, 2005)

Saw a Ad for CSI Miami where a little jet (Lear ?) crashed . The investigators are talking to the pilot in the hospital. The pilot says he saw a flash. The investigator say's" an explosion". The pilot answer's " no , a green flash".

This happens in daylight.

I wonder what this is gonna be about ?

This is to run Monday, March 7 at 10PM on CBS. Thats eastern (USA) time for me.

Check your local listings......... :


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## MaxaBaker (Mar 4, 2005)

That's interesting. I used to watch that show avidly but have learned to think it is /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smoker5.gif

I'll make sure to check in this Monday though.


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## Sub_Umbra (Mar 4, 2005)

The *Green Flash,* aka *Emerald Flash* is a naturally occuring product of refraction which occurs for .7 seconds during sunsets and sunrises at sea (with only the sea at the horizon right where the sun rises/sets) The green image is the last to drop below the horizon at sunset, only very rarely followed by a brief _violet_ image (hidiously rare). Green would also be the first color seen at sunrise, _if_ it is there to be seen on a given day.

It cannot be observed at every sunrise/set but a tenacious viewer may see it if he knows _precisely_ where to look and keeps at it. (I've seen it three times, all on the Gulf of Mexico in Mexican waters.)

It is much easier to see at sundown, since it is far easier to guess _exactly_ where the sun will set than it is to guess _exactly_ where it is about to rise.

Many claim that the *Green Flash* is only a myth -- not so. I am lucky enough to have a recent copy of _American Practical Navigator: An Epitome of Navigation_ by *Nathaniel Bowditch* (1773-1838). In VOL 1 there is a very good blurb on the *Green Flash*. At this point it's hard to tell exactly what Nat wrote and what has been added over the years by the *Defense Mapping Agency Hydrographic Center,* who continues to update and publish Bowditch's mammoth work.


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## naromtap (Mar 4, 2005)

..probably just a Martian exploding as he entered the earths atmospere flying in on the Martian equivalent of a a Wright Bros flyer!


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## Lasernerd (Mar 4, 2005)

Sub Umbra thank you for posting that!
I learned some years ago about that,I have continued to search for the last remaining beam of sunlight to be green!


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## wolfblue (Mar 4, 2005)

I am familiar with Green Flash. I have seen video of this someplace. Also, I know a pilot who has seen it one time over the gulf at sunset. Since then he watches for it every time he can. And has not seen it again in 15 years.

And on the CSI commercial, it is broad daylight. Even so, I dont see how anybody could blame a plane crash on green flash at sunset.

I think this episode will deal with green pointers. Probably in a unrealistic manner. My fear is, that they will catch the bad guy with a modified or high power pointer.


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## MaxaBaker (Mar 4, 2005)

If you google it it seems to be that quite a few people see green flashes. There are quite a few pics out there too.

http://www.icstars.com/Mad/Astro/GreenFlashW.jpg


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## wolfblue (Mar 4, 2005)

Nice pic Max. I always wanted to see one in person. But I live on the other side of Florida. I have looked in the morning, but seen nothing.
But I too have seen people to say it does not exist, like Sub_Umbra said.


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## greenLED (Mar 4, 2005)

Sub_Umbra, I've tried many times, and have only seen it once, in the Pacific coast of Costa Rica. Verne has a book where he narrates the adventures of a group looking for the ray. I must say, it is the most pure and beautiful shade of green I have seen. Of course I'm biased 'cuz I like green /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif


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## SuperBert (Mar 4, 2005)

im willing to bet though that since this is a murder show, they will use lasers as the weapon... we may see one of our first televised showings of laser knowledge and terms.... maybe more people will see what we all see in lasers after watching this episode! CSI does a great job of going into detail about things, so we may see some laser discussion on tv! when is it supposed to air?


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## Sub_Umbra (Mar 4, 2005)

BTW, it should be easier to see from a plane than a ship. If the jet pilot was 'chasing the sun' on a westerly course as it set at say, 400 mph, one would expect the duration of the flash to be 40% longer than the 7/10s of a second for a stationary observation mentioned in the Bowditch book. (example set at equator where Earth spins at ~1000 mph). 

Theoretically, on just the right equatorial track at the right time, flying at ~1000 mph you should be able to see the flash indefinately, barring weather, etc.

I used binoculars to look for it at the end of every sunset -- very carefully. I was on a ship with very little stimuli and I would look for the flash at _every_ sunset while we were under contract in Mexico, week in, week out...month in...

I wouldn't even try at sunrise. Too many calculations involved.

EDIT: 

I should add that aside from the sheer boredom I was facing on that job, I had made a concious decision to put some effort into seeing the flash while I was there. The Gulf of Mexico has such wonderful weather so consistantly that I felt that it would be a good place to mount the effort without getting too frustrated by rain, clouds, etc.

I would imagine that you might live at sea a whole lifetime and never see the flash if you were confined to an area with much poorer weather, like the North Sea or the Gulf of Alaska.

That's probably why most sailors haven't seen it.


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## MaxaBaker (Mar 4, 2005)

[ QUOTE ]
*SuperBert said:*
maybe more people will see what we all see in lasers after watching this episode! CSI does a great job of going into detail about things, so we may see some laser discussion on tv! when is it supposed to air? 

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm not sure that it is going to be a good to have CSI goin' on about lasers. If more people get them, more people are going to be dumb @$$es with them and get them all banned. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/jpshakehead.gif


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## 14C (Mar 4, 2005)

WARNING *** SPOLIER! *** WARNING

























Series: 'CSI: Miami'
Episode Title: 'Money Plane'
Episode Number: 317
Synopsis: "Someone uses a laser light to blind a pilot and bring down a jet, which carries over one billion dollars in checks to be delivered to banks on the eastern seaboard. The crime scene evidence reveals a victim, a young fundraising socialite, who was inside the plane but killed prior to the crash. Now, although the team has little to work with since the victim's wealthy family is opposing an autopsy, Horatio must follow the money trail. Meanwhile, Calleigh works on a case with her ex-boyfriend, Det. Hagen, and their romantic history could cause problems for both of them."


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## Sub_Umbra (Mar 4, 2005)

14C,

Do you have a link to where you got that nice episode listing?
TIA


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## senecaripple (Mar 4, 2005)

seldom watch t.v., but will be sure to watch this one, thanks. this could be the beginning of the end of a good hobby.


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## 14C (Mar 4, 2005)

Sure SU, here you go:

LINK


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## BVH (Mar 4, 2005)

Been lucky enough to see one green flash from Princeville resort Friday night fish buffet - near Hanalei, Kauai, HI.


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## 14C (Mar 4, 2005)

FYI if you follow the above link you will find a "promo" link on the WWW page that will take to to CBS.com where you can view the promo video - high speed connection recommended for this. If you watch it, after Horatio says "Explosion?" and the pilot says "Everything went green" there is a flashback scene that looks like it shows the cockpit of the plane illuminated with green from the outside................


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## sharkeeper (Mar 4, 2005)

Hmmm I'm on a ship and the only thing I saw yesterday was green clouds. No waterspouts but it got windy and rained hard enough to keep people from playing shuffleboard. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

According to CSI Files sources, the episode opens in Coral Gables Estate, a high priced estate area, where one of the property owners is hosting a party. The celebrations are disrupted, however, when the roar of an engine booms across the skies. Partygoers look up in time to see the sight of a lifetime: an Air-Now Learjet 35 soars overhead and crashes into the ground. Things go from chaotic to weird when suddenly it starts raining... hundred dollar bills.

Horatio and his team arrive at the scene of the wreckage. The pilot, Mike Rider, doesn't know what could have happened, all he remembers is a green flash and next thing he knows the plane is going down. Delko examines Mike's eyes to discover a disturbing sight: corneal scarring. But what could cause corneal damage to a pilot's eyes so high above the ground? Horatio has a theory – a laser pointer.

Meanwhile, Calleigh and Ryan are walking through the wreckage. Hundred dollar bills are scattered all over the ground, and as they take pictures and notes they notice a man gathering canvas bags of money off the plane. The man introduces himself as Sean Walsh, Air-Now Freight Systems and owner of the plane. As it turns out, the plane was on its way to Savannah, Georgia, to transport 1.2 billion dollars to local banks, and plane crash or no plane crash they are still on a deadline. As Sean tries to make his case, Ryan notices something suspicious hidden under the canvas bags. His curiosity pays off when, after a little light digging, they find something Sean Walsh cannot explain: the body of a young girl. Looks like money isn't the only thing Air-Now was transporting to Savannah.

Horatio and Yelina visit Andrew Stern, a disgruntled denizen of Coral Gables Estate, who has complained on numerous occasions about planes flying overhead when they are not supposed to. But Horatio and Yelina are not there to tend to his allegations. Horatio is more interested in the wooden case sitting on Stern's counter, and the laser pointer he discovers inside of it. Andrew caves in without much persuasion and tries to convince Horatio it was a prank, but a plane crash doesn't sound funny to Horatio, and Andrew Stern is placed under arrest.

Back at the lab, Alexx has good news and bad news. The good news is she has identified the body as that of 20-year-old's Caitlyn Townsend; the bad news is Caitlyn's mother has filed an injunction to prevent any coroner from performing an autopsy on her daughter. Without her permission, Alexx cannot determine the cause of death, which is much needed in order for the investigation to go forward. But to Horatio Caine there's no such thing as a dead end road. He's determined to get this autopsy underway, even if the family's grieving process must be disrupted.

Horatio and Ryan visit the Townsend home, but arrive to an unexpected scene: looks like the Townsends are hosting a party. Heidi Dillon, the Townsends' maid, explains Caitlyn was co-chair of a charity that helps troubled girls turn their lives around, and they are preparing for their annual fundraiser's weekend. Much to the CSIs dismay, the show must go on, with or without Caitlyn.

Horatio is soon after in the presence of Sophie Townsend, who is quick to lavish the memory of her daughter. But looks can be deceiving, as Sophie also reveals Caitlyn was a recovering heroin addict. Sophie fears an autopsy will do nothing but create controversy and taint Caitlyn's memory. But after Horatio figures out a way to perform a non-invasive autopsy, the pieces of the puzzle quickly begin to unfold and the CSIs soon discover Sophie Townsend may not get her wish after all – looks like controversy was already a part of Caitlyn's life and the lives of those around her. 

OOPSIE!


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## Lumens (Mar 5, 2005)

I witnessed a green flash from Norman's Cay in the Bahamas about 25 years ago. The "flash" was perhaps more subtle than the word implies - the last tiny segment of sunlight from the sun setting over the ocean turned bright green for a few seconds before disappearing. The bright green color caught me by surprise.


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## Raccoon (Mar 5, 2005)

I want a nice wooden box for my pointer.
Hazelnut.


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## Pellidon (Mar 5, 2005)

Ansel Adams, the photographer, wrote about he and his friends sitting on the deck watching for the flash every chance they got. It seems he saw quite a few if I rember correctly. Carmel by the sea. Must have had the correct position above the waterline to see it repeatedly.


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## Bengal (Mar 5, 2005)

Hmm solar radiation as pump source, atmospheric density as lasing medium... 
Nice plot for an end of the world sci-fi movie /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/popcorn.gif


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## TheQase (Mar 7, 2005)

Is everyone watching CSI tonight? Just reminding you all, I almost forgot.


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## ddaadd (Mar 7, 2005)

Cant believe I altered my normal routine to watch this 
hokey show. I know better, I really do...


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## Raccoon (Mar 8, 2005)

Holycrap that episode sucked! I had high hopes of geeky details and technical jargon like they normally whip out. We all feared an investigation into laser hobbyists and an expose of these internet forums. I suppose we're lucky in that aspect.

I am disappointed they changed the script. There was no such "wooden case sitting on Stern's counter, and the laser pointer [discovered] inside of it". I was hoping they'd give me ideas of a nice wooden display case for my PGL-III when I get one.

Maybe something like this but in hazelnut. www.wooden-boxes.com has some nice options. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

Anyone want to CAD the exact dimensions needed, including little stands to prop the PGL inside the box? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif


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## kongfuchicken (Mar 8, 2005)

curiosity abounds!
Can anyone make a little summary for those who can't watch tv?


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## 14C (Mar 8, 2005)

Raccoon, agreed. But they did "prove" to millions of viewers you can "take down" an airplane with a 5mW green laser. Be glad no techies were consulting or it woould have been a "5 mW laser illegaly modified to 100 mW".

KFC, I posted a quick synopsis and a link to the CSI Files site earlier. They basically "proved" it was a laser when Horatio had an EMT examine the pilot and find "corneal scarring". Then they used the flight path and a computer to narrow the point of origin to a six block radius and then went directly to someone who had filed complaints and made a threatening phone call over noise. They found the laser in plain sight and told him he was going to jail for bringing down a plane. Bogus and not the main focus of the episode.

I suppose there are both good and bad points there.


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## sniper (Mar 8, 2005)

A disgruntled resident objected to the airplanes violating "noise regulations" and wanted to make a statement. 

This closely parallels one of Clancy's novels where Mr. Clark and his faithful sidekick Domingo Chavez take out a Japanese AWACS plane by disorienting (blinding?) the pilots as it is on final approach. They use some sort of a narrowly focused coherent(?)light,(that sounds like a laser to me) which could be disguised to look like photographer's equipment of some sort. Earlier in the book, it is used to cause unconsciousness in a whole group of bad guys. 

In CSI, it was a little laser pointer that disoriented both pilots. They were "a quarter of a mile up": 1320 feet, and the aircraft was shown in wild attitude--fine if you are evading surface to air missiles, but highly unlikely for a cargo jet. But that's Hollywood, right?

It was a forgettable episode. I was collecting accident scene photos for an investigation, and the police officer I was dealing with said "I wanna see gory pictures!" I told him mine weren't, but if he liked that sort of stuff, he should watch CSI. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/jpshakehead.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/jpshakehead.gif


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## gecko991 (Mar 8, 2005)

Good one sniper. IMO that show CSI Miami is completely brown.


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## PhotonWrangler (Mar 8, 2005)

Turns out they only really used the laser story as a hook to introduce an otherwise forgettable episode, and they did a poor job of making it factual from the laser standpoint. Corneal scarring? Wouldn't that be more like retinal scarring? I would imagine that the light would pass right through the cornea (being transparent and everything) and strike the retina where it would generate heat. But only if it was a lot more than 5mw, was held still in relation to the target, the windshield didn't present significant scattering (which in their portrayal, it DID), and we could negate the pilot's blink/aversion response.

Other than that it was right on... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumbsdown.gif


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## DaFiend (Mar 8, 2005)

bah. its just going to encourage idiots........ /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/jpshakehead.gif


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## PhotonWrangler (Mar 9, 2005)

Another goof - the Caruso character referred to the laser as a "green _diode_"... um.... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/jpshakehead.gif


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## fordag (Mar 12, 2005)

I need to make sure I hit the show all button in forums


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## MaxaBaker (Mar 12, 2005)

Ummm, it was bad. I stopped watching it about half way through the show. CSI: Miami = /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumbsdown.gif

You didn't miss anything except for all the hollywood/fake things they were talking about.


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## gadget_lover (Mar 12, 2005)

I didn't think it was that bad. The science sucked, and the CSI crew was super lucky (as always) but I enjoy the show anyway.

When they showed the cockpit illuminated by green light, and the scarring of the pilot's eye, I started wondering how powerful a laser would have to be to be blinding once it was that disperse? The beam was at least 3 feet across to fill the whole cabin. Would not the intensity levels have dropped to less than a minimag at that point? 
/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

Daniel


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## PhotonWrangler (Mar 12, 2005)

I agree, the total optical power delivered to an eye at that distance with that much dispersion would be quite small. While I could almost believe the "distraction" angle, there's no way that I can believe that there could be "corneal scarring" under those circumstances.

There's another thread here where somebody actually did the math on the power density in a cockpit at an altitide of a thousand feet or so, and it was miniscule to say the least!


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