# TIG Reccomendations?



## StrikerDown (May 3, 2011)

Looking to get a TIG rig! I'm tired of paying someone to screw up my stuff when I can do it myself.

Anyone have a box they are happy with or maybe as or more important is there any to shy/run away from?

Mainly I want to be able to weld smaller items, flashlight or handgun sizes. Aluminum, carbon and stainless steels with more precision I can't get with the MIG, or Ox/Ace.

Thanks for your help:wave:


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## sakurama (May 3, 2011)

I'm not a pro by any stretch but I wanted a machine that could do aluminum as well as steel and could travel if need be and run off 110v in a pinch. My Dynasty 200DX did all that and, despite our shop having several other larger tigs and a couple migs it's become the go to machine for aluminum or fine detail work because it's square wave is so nice. Small, compact and pretty sophisticated and since I don't do big stuff it more than covers anything I need. Love it. 

Here it it on the cart it made (with the cooler which is nice for aluminum):


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## DaFABRICATA (May 3, 2011)

Sakurama, Thats a damn nice set-up!!!oo::naughty:

I have a Miller syncrowave 200 and it'd done what I've needed it to do.
Doesn't get used as much as I'd like...but DAMN is it nice to have when I need!:thumbsup:


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## StrikerDown (May 3, 2011)

Very nice! Thanks for the info.


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## precisionworks (May 3, 2011)

The Dynasty 200DX is a very nice machine - about $4500 with water cooler. I went with a HTP Invertig 200 with water cooler for $2895 & it has been flawless: http://www.htpweld.com/products/tig_welders/tig201.html

You'll need to choose either hand control or foot control - I went with the CK Rotary Amp Control years ago & have never looked back: http://www.ckworldwide.com/amperage_controls.htm

Miller, Lincoln, HTP, etc. all make excellent inverter TIG's. Try them & see which one you like. Whichever way you go, get the water cooler & water cooled torch - much smaller, lighter, easier to handle & cooler.


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## precisionworks (May 4, 2011)

> to shy/run away from?



Anything Chinese, anything with no name or no support. One eBay ad reads "TIG Inventor Welder" ... maybe that should be inverter :nana:

FWIW, there are still many transformer machines available, like the Miller Synchrowave. The technology is older, the units are large, power consumption is high, and the ability to control & shape the arc is limited (as all AC welding, like aluminum, is done at 60 Hz).

Inverters, like the Dynasty & the Invertig 201, give much more arc control. The Dynasty is an advanced inverter design that will do everything except cook your dinner to order 

Europeans invented welding inverter technology & both Lincoln & HTP have Euro factories that build their machines. In a Lincoln machine, look at the Invertec 205. Like the Miller Dynasty, the Lincoln inverters are very small & super light weight.

With all the emphasis on inverters, one can sometimes find a nice, used transformer machine (like a Synchrowave 200/250/300) at a bargain price. Or a Lincoln Precision TIG 225/275/375. If you decide to buy a transformer TIG, especially a bigger one, make sure you have an outlet that can supply the machine. They are physically large, pretty heavy, need a lot of juice, but produce a nice weld & they last forever.


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## StrikerDown (May 5, 2011)

Thanks Barry. I need to do some research, looks like a lot to learn before I make a decision... I hate buying something then finding it isn't suited for what I need, Or has expensive features I will never use. Looks like lots of different options to choose from with a TIG.


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## precisionworks (May 5, 2011)

> Looks like lots of different options to choose from with a TIG.


You can break it down to this ...

Transformer or inverter?

If you choose inverter, simple (HTP201) or fancy (Dynasty 200DX)

I choose the HTP201 as it does what I need and doesn't cost a ton. Lots of users like the D200DX for the many available settings.


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## StrikerDown (May 6, 2011)

Thanks again Barry, Your machine looks like the best way to go, especially cost wise. Most everything I plan on using it for will be small parts probably low power requirements so the water cooler option would not be a necessity, and could be added at a later date if it became necessary... I think!

Is there one type shielding gas that will work for aluminum, SS and carbon steel, or is there a benefit to using different mixes?

Also above Sakurama mentions that "it's become the go to machine for aluminum or fine detail work because it's square wave is so nice". Is this a feature on the HTP201? If not would it be handy to have when welding up, say a 1911 thumb safety lug?


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## precisionworks (May 6, 2011)

Square wave doesn't get a lot of press today, as that technology was invented about 25 years ago (by Miller). Not sure if the HTP201 has it or not.

Argon works for most every metal, and lots of welders use only argon for TIG. I've found (as have many other people) that 75% Helium/25% Argon is an awesome mix for aluminum, especially with a mid sized (200A) machine. The puddle forms much more quickly & wets out fast - but, the puddle is more fluid and can be more difficult to control if out of position.

A good review on the HTP201: http://hre.com/HTPInvertigreview.html



> Most everything I plan on using it for will be small parts probably low power requirements so the water cooler option would not be a necessity,


The air cooled torch will get you started, but I'm betting it will grow old fast. In addition to the discomfort (heat) of the air cooled torch, it is huge compared to the water cooled version. The water cooled torch can get into tight areas that will be a challenge with the air cooled.


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## cmacclel (May 8, 2011)

I still give myself a smack in the head every once in a while  I typically check the local craigslist daily. The one day I didn't a Dynasty listed for $1200 and I missed it! I'm happy with my Lincoln 175 Pro that I picked up locally for $600. The unit had never been used and was sitting in a body shop. I know have a bigger argon tank on the machine, it was upgraded for free after the first one I purchased had the wrong or contaminated gas. New Welder + New to Welding + Bad Gas = Rip all hair out!!!! Thanks god my buddy is the local welding instructer and had a spare tank to try!


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## PEU (May 8, 2011)

I sell welding alloys, a week ago I made this demo video for a customer to be: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vrX6Dq-4Zw8 subtitles are in spanish, but the image speak for itself. 
Its for oxy-acetilene but at my office I can only use small torches, so I used MAPP


Pablo


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## StrikerDown (May 9, 2011)

I will probably be using it for steel primarily. That is all I weld currently with MIG and/or Oxy/Ace so It sounds like Straight Argon is best. Is the H/75%-A25% mix usable for steels or just AL?

Mac, I remember when you posted getting the Lincoln... I was so jealous! Found this one on craigs: http://sacramento.craigslist.org/tls/2357859327.html

Pablo, Very cool. Looks like a very strong joint. Is that actually welding the Aluminum or is it more like a solder/brazing process?


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## PEU (May 9, 2011)

StrikerDown said:


> Pablo, Very cool. Looks like a very strong joint. Is that actually welding the Aluminum or is it more like a solder/brazing process?


 
welding, if you cut the piece with a saw you dont see any joint, it works really well


Pablo


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## precisionworks (May 9, 2011)

> Is the H/75%-A25% mix usable for steels or just AL?


You can use it on everything ... but:

It costs more than argon

Arc starts are harder as they require higher voltage to establish the arc

The puddle is hot, fluid, and more challenging to control than an argon puddle

The helium is lighter than air, requiring more CFH flow when welding in most positons (flat & horizontal being the most common). When welding overhead or vertical, the gas rises to the joint & less can be used.

If you only want to use one gas, get argon.


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## StrikerDown (May 10, 2011)

Thanks B, 
Very good info. I would hate to get started with the wrong gas... not enough hair left as it is!

Going to start hitting Ebay and Craigs!


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## RBR (May 14, 2011)

.....


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## StrikerDown (May 10, 2012)

I started this thread about a year ago and I have been saving my pennies (and bigger) ever since. When Gold hit $1800 an ounce a while back I dug out a bunch of old stuff and went to the gold guys to get almost there! 

I was able to pull the trigger today and she should be here in about a week!

http://www.usaweld.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=70221-12.5

I ordered on the phone so I could specify the #9 (Small) torch because most of what I plan on welding will be smallish parts, Also when I save up a little more I can get the water cooler and a #20 torch that uses the same cups, collets, etc. and it will be able to handle the full power of the 221 and stay cool too!

Pics to follow when I get them.

Thanks again to all for the info, you guys are the best.


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## precisionworks (May 10, 2012)

Christmas in May 

You'll really enjoy that machine. I spoke with Steve Holzer (tech support/sales/repairs) & he said the 221 has many of the features of the Miller Dynasty. At only 41# (about 19 kg) it is easily portable AND it will run on standard 120 volt service. That means you can do portable TIG repairs without having to worry about hooking up to 240 volts. 

The water cooler is a must if you weld thicker aluminum/stainless/cast iron/etc. & the WC torch is tiny compared to the air cooled models. I purchased the Rotary Amp Control that mounts on the torch handle (also available from HTP) & haven't used the foot pedal in years - probably never again will. 

Some owners have good success on aluminum with 100% Argon but I used 75% Helium-25% Argon. The arc is much hotter & will make your 221 perform like a 275 amp machine when you need the extra heat input. 

My Invertig 201 is already starting to feel inadequate :devil:


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## StrikerDown (May 10, 2012)

No Christmas but my birthday was the 9th! :nana:

I didn't order the dual voltage model it's another 500 plus, That plus the WC puts it real close to the Dynasty. 

The WC may happen if it gets too hot with the little stuff I have planned for it... Looking at lots of practice before I do anything serious though so it will be a while.

I was mig welding something the other night and my flow meter started acting up, blowing Co2 out the vent hole, so I ordered a Co2 only meter at the same time as the TIG. First problem with my Miller MIG in 25 years of (very) light use. 

Getting anxious... again! :naughty:


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## gt40 (May 16, 2012)

StrikerDown said:


> I started this thread about a year ago and I have been saving my pennies (and bigger) ever since. When Gold hit $1800 an ounce a while back I dug out a bunch of old stuff and went to the gold guys to get almost there!
> 
> I was able to pull the trigger today and she should be here in about a week!
> 
> ...



Congrats!

I have an htp plasma cutter and had really great service when I melted my torch with some spray back. Seem to be a solid company based upon how they took care of me.


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## StrikerDown (May 16, 2012)

Haha... Not even a minute into my first attempt at running a bead and I dipped the tungsten! The arc turned a funny color!

This machine appears to be good quality, very nice fit and finish. The torch, amp peddle and ground lead all seem to be solid well built parts, the flow meter has a certain Chinese quality about it but seems to work well.


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## precisionworks (May 18, 2012)

> the flow meter has a certain Chinese quality about it but seems to work well.


The image shows a regulator, which is OK & will work if flow isn't critical. At some point you'll want one of these.


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## StrikerDown (May 18, 2012)

That is the Flow Meter/Regulator that came with the TIG. Sorry for the bad iPhone pic, look close you can see the sight glass part of the flow meter as it disappears out the top of the pic. I also got the same Flow Meter/Regulator (CO2 version) to replace the gone bad part on my MIG.

Barry, I'm wondering if it's important to bleed off the pressure in the regulator after turning off the tank for the day... or more?


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## precisionworks (May 19, 2012)

Ray,
I always close the tank valve & trigger the torch to bleed pressure. But I do this on everything with a regulator (O-A, CO2, Helium mix, etc.). Probably won't hurt it if you don't bleed it but be sure to close the tank valve.


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## StrikerDown (May 19, 2012)

Thanks Barry. I have always closed the valve and bled off the reg on my oxy/ace, and MIG (Co2), But was curious if it would hurt. Got called for dinner the other night, closed the valve and shut it down for the night but forgot to bleed of the regulator. Next evening it still showed tank pressure with the valve closed... good news, no leaks!

TIG is tough though!, I have only had about 45 minutes of practice so far but I keep getting the tungsten contaminated in the puddle or hitting it with filler! I just started trying the filler rod after mostly trying to get just a bead going without filler. I can see I need to get a full pack of tungsten sharpened up so I don't have to keep stopping to grind off the contamination! :sick2: :hairpull:

I better get it soon I'm running out of hair!


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## precisionworks (May 20, 2012)

HTP has an excellent "how to TIG" video & it's well worth the cost. 

Most welding shops figure they can take someone off the street (zero welding experience) & have that person producing acceptable MIG welds with about 20 hours instruction. For stick welding figure 100 hours as this is the length of many stick welding certification courses. Double that number for TIG. 

For someone who already does code quality stick welds it's a pretty fast transition to TIG. Stick teaches the very fine motor control needed for manipulation of the electrode. TIG uses the same motion to feed the filler & adds another level of difficulty - holding the tungsten about 1mm above the weld pool. 

If your age is north of 40 years you may benefit from a magnifying lens mounted inside the helmet. When the tungsten can be clearly seen it's a lot easier to position it correctly.


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## StrikerDown (May 20, 2012)

The video came with the the welder, it is good but I need the hands on experience. So I guess I have 190 hours to go! 

It would be nice if the video were updated to the 221 welder instead of the 201 as the control panel is completely different. The basic info is the same though so its still good.

I have a cheater lens I'm my helmet and it's a lifesaver cause I could never get the window in the helmet in the right position to see through the bottom/reading part of my glasses.


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## precisionworks (May 21, 2012)

Silicon bronze filler will shorten the learning curve.


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## Thatspec (May 21, 2012)

The Chinese are doing more welding than any nation on the planet currently. Some of the brands are very comparable in quality to Miller and Lincoln. I couldn't be happier with my Everlast tig unit. Airgas is now carrying the brand. Google around a little and you'll find plenty of info/video of all these machines running back to back.


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## cmacclel (May 21, 2012)

Thatspec said:


> The Chinese are doing more welding than any nation on the planet currently. Some of the brands are very comparable in quality to Miller and Lincoln. I couldn't be happier with my Everlast tig unit. Airgas is now carrying the brand. Google around a little and you'll find plenty of info/video of all these machines running back to back.



I would never buy one.......read this guy's experience

http://hildstrom.com/projects/super250p/index.html


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## StrikerDown (May 22, 2012)

It is starting to come together. Ran a bunch of beads tonight and they have the stack of dimes look... sort of! Now to get the travel speed consistent, I think it will help with bead width.

Ditto on not buying Chinese, I have bought too much Chicrap.


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## precisionworks (May 29, 2012)

http://www.cimindustry.com/article/welding/5-tips-for-improving-gtaw-efficiency


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## StrikerDown (Jun 1, 2012)

Barry, Thanks for posting that, I've been on a little vacation but will be reading it shortly.

Edit: Very good info... Thanks again.


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## StrikerDown (Jun 10, 2012)

Sorry for the poor iPhone pic. So far I have run less than 2 feet of bead and it is starting to come together! 
Not a real pretty bead here but it got good penetration and I bent the hell out of the two plates and it didn't fail.


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## precisionworks (Jun 11, 2012)

You may want to run the heat a little higher Or slightly slow down the speed of travel. Watch the toes of the bead to make sure that the toes start to melt in. That will give you a flatter bead profile with better penetration.


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## StrikerDown (Jun 11, 2012)

By toes do you mean the top and bottom edges of the bead (in this pic orientation)?
I wonder if it could be too much filler? 
Much more penetration and it would be dripping on the floor  which it did as I got to the edge, I need to back off the peddle a little more/sooner at the edges, I think. 
I should have taken a pic of the back before I beat it to death with vise and hammer... as hard as I tried the weld would not come apart.

Thank you for your input.


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## precisionworks (Jun 11, 2012)

The image above shows a cross section of two pieces of plate welded in the flat position. There should always be a root gap (open root) and each edge of the plate is beveled at 22.5° so there is a 45° included angle. On thin material only one pass may be needed. On thicker material a root pass is done first, then fill passes & finally a cap pass. The toes are where the edges of the bead melt into the parent metal.


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## StrikerDown (Jun 11, 2012)

Thanks Barry.


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