# Maglite SSC P7. How to. A sort of guide.



## StefanFS

*UPDATE 2008-10-13*
The driver solutions discussed in this post that are based on AMC7135 chips are best suited to be used in conjunction with SSC P7 emitters that are D***I or C***I binned, I at the end means they are 3.25V to 3.5V in forward voltage. If used with D***J or C***J binned emitters regulation and even output may suffer from the higher forward voltage of that binning, 3.5V-3.75V. A better choice for D***J emitters are buck drivers, eg. the driver made by user Der Wichtel. 

_The output from the drivers in this post are ~3.7V and work best with D****I* or C****I* binned SSC P7. When matched with one big LiION cell, three good quality_
_D-size NiMH cells or four AA/C NiMH cells these drivers are a very good choice and have very high efficiency. _


*Update 2009-02-05*

The corresponding build with Cree MC-E can be found here:
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/212835
I particularly like the 2D Mag with 2S2P wired MC-E. That's a more versatile solution.
----------------------------------------​ 
I have been asked about how I modded my SSC P7 Maglites, especially the driver solution I'm using. The basis of the mod is the classic Maglite with heatsink insert from H22A/Litemania/The Sandwich Shoppe with an Luxeon/SSC/CREE on it and a driver somewhere below the heatsink. You cut the bulb holder pedestal off and solder the leads for the emitter directly to the contact points on the internal switch. 
Like this, link to basic Magmod: 
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/167866

The driver solution I use is conceived by user NetKidz, schematics can be found here:
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/192677

Pic taken from NetKidz thread:









The driver consists of one 16 mode 1A driver with a slave board that contribute ~1.4A. In total ~2.4A. I like it since the multimode driver have three user interface groups, one is low-med-high. This runs best on three or four big NiMH cells or one big LiION cell. 

What's needed, besides one Maglite and a heatsink. One C-bin SSC P7 emitter, drivers and some teflon wire:








Preparing the drivers, first pic is the multimode driver, wire going up left is led + and wire going down right is led -. Second pic is the slave board. The third pic shows how to connect them. Battery + connects to the + pad on the multimode drivers underside and battery - to the ring of the multimode driver:




















It's necessary to dremel the emitter guides from my H22A heatsink, I also drilled the holes larger with a 3 mm drill bit. Then I opened the drilled holes with my dremel to make space for the emitter legs & leads. I used a milling tip for this. *This guide was produced before dedicated SSC P7 heatsinks were available. Now several vendors sell heatsinks for P7 emitters so the dremel work is no longer necessary.*








Glueing the emitter to the heatsink with Arctic Alumina epoxy.








Soldering the teflon wires to the inside of the trimmed emitter legs. I used 26 gauge wire. Make sure that the emitter legs & bare wire ends don't touch the naked metal on the drilled/milled heatsink.








Connecting the battery leads to the multi mode driver. Drivers are glued to the heatsink with Arctic Alumina epoxy and Araldite epoxy. Almost finished. Some heatsink compound (not epoxy or glue) may ease heat transfer from the heatsink to the flashlight body, apply sparingly before inserting the heatsink into the flashlight body.








Here it is to the left with two of my other SSC P7 lights. This one is 1D running off one D-size LiION cell. Runtime should be more than two hours on high. 








*Links to the drivers and heatsink:*
Heatsink: https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/160483
Multimode driver, 16 mode: http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.7612
Multimode driver, 2 mode, my favourite: http://www.kaidomain.com/ProductDetails.aspx?ProductId=1802
AMC7135 1400 mA driver: http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.1886



Update 2008-04-27

*How to build a high quality, low cost, regulated 3 Ampere driver for your SSC P7 Maglite*

This is what you need. Two 1A simple AMC7135 drivers and one 1A AMC7135 multimode driver to control them. Some copper wire, teflon wire 24 or 26 gauge. Three connections are needed between the multimode and the slave sandwich, ~15 mm each. Two 5-7 mm pieces of copper wire to connect battery negative and battery positive between boards on the slave sandwich. One 10 mm piece of teflon wire to connect led negative between boards on the slave sandwich. Two pieces of 20-30 mm teflon wire for connection to the led from the multimode board.







Preparing the boards for the slave sandwich. Removing diodes and making sure connections are made between all AMC7135 chips with solder.







Soldering some copper wire jumpers in place of the diodes.







Making the sandwich. Battery negative is connnected on the edge with copper wire soldered between the boards, the ring around the boards. *Not seen is a similar piece of copper wire going from center positive to the other boards center postive *(if you miss this it will only give you 2.0A). A short piece of teflon wire going from led negative to led negative.







Preparing the multimode driver. 
1 will go to battery negative on the slave sandwich. 
2 will go to led negative on the slave sandwich.
3 will go to emitter negative.
4 will go to center positive on the top board of the slave sandwich.
5 is going to led positive.
Battery negative and positive connect to the underside of this driver,
negative to the ring and positive to the center.







To illustrate the connections.







This is mounted in a 2D Maglite, options are 3 C size NiMH with some modding or one D-szi LiION cell and one spacer. The difference between 2.4A drive current and 3A is a few thousand lux in throw, ~20 000 versus ~25 000 lux. The big drawback is shorter runtime and more heat. Going from 2.4A to 3A will cut runtime dramatically.


*Update 2008-05-03*

Today I ran a small unscientific experiment with two of my regulated Maglites, both are 1D using unprotected D LiION cells for power. One has an AMC7135 multimode driver set to 2.4A, the other one has an AMC7135 multimode driver set to 3A. Both have H22A heatsinks with some thermal compound between it and the body, short gold plated springs and UCL-lenses. Both Mags were just laying on the the table, no cooling or even holding in my hand. This test only about heat, not runtime. The runtimes are much longer than what is used here to test heat transfer and heat managment.

After 30 minutes the 2.4A Mag is 36.2 Celsius on the outer side of the head, battery voltage is down to 3.94 V from 4.05 V. Output was a steady 21 300 in throw at one metre, a flatline during the whole test.

After 30 minutes the 3.0A Mag is 39.1 degrees Celsius on the outer side of the head, battery voltage is down to 3.89 V from 4.05 V. Output was a steady 25 800 in throw at one metre, a flatline during the whole test.

So my unscientific feeling is that the drivers I use are top notch, that my lights have working thermal transfer, that the SCC P7 emitters in these two lights can handle heat very well and that they have respectable runtimes.







A word of caution. When using an SSC P7 with AMC7135 drivers and an in voltage exceeding 4.5Volt the temperatures will be considerably higher. These drivers are supposed to be used with max 4.5 Volt as they are the most efficient then. 




*Update 2008-07-12*

Beamshots with the lights discussed in this post.

*MRV SSC P7s. Lots of different SSC P7 beamshots! *
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/202014

*SSC P7 beamshots. Mag & Tiablo A8 SSC P7! *
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/198549

*SSC P7 Mag against OSRAM 64440 Mag & RaidFire Spear. 95-250 m beamshots! *
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/192740




*Update 2008-10-28*

I did a runtime test on one of my 1D Mags with the above multimode driver, an SSC P7 *DSWOI* (3.25-3.50V) emitter driven by one unprotected 5000 mAh D-size LiION cell. The unprotected cell is ok to use in this build because output dims noticeably when voltage comes near 3V, then you just change to a fresh cell. I think this driver is a big improvement over using direct drive in one cell LiION lights with C/D***I emitters.

Voltage at 45 min.: 3.78V. Voltage at 90 min.:3.66V. Voltage at 130 min.: 2.89V. At 130 min. the light is very dim.








*Update 2009-05-07*


*How to adapt the spring an tailcap to use 4 x C-size cells.*

I use a length of pvc pipe thats 32 mm OD and have an ID that accepts C NiMH cells, eg. 27 mm.

I cut the spring and deanodize the inner part of the tailcap. I use lye and hot water for this, lye is toxic and highly corrosive, it will burn skin and eyes and it stinks, so be careful. Lye (sodium hydroxide) can be found in drain cleaner other such products.






Cut the spring like this, one little piece at a time until it fits in the tailcap. It's trial and error.









*How to connect one of the newer variants of multimode driver*

Note that I have popualted an empty space for an additional AMC7135 chip to get 2.8A with just two boards. Even without the additional chip the soldering points are the same. There is at least one more variety of the multimode driver out there, just follow the general rule of connecting as seen here. The last in series AMC735 VDD leg (the one with a trace going to it) on the multimode connects to slave board positive center on all boards I have seen to so far.



























The 1A multimode really does give you 1.4A with an additional AMC7135 chip:







Stefan


----------



## Norm

Thanks for the tutorial Stefan.:thumbsup:
Norm


----------



## ambientmind

thanks! good work there! :thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup:


----------



## NA8

+1 :goodjob:


----------



## StefanFS

I love this emitter! It's spectacular compared to eg. SSC P4. When it comes to heat and runtime I think it's advisable to run it at slightly under it's rated max. The difference between 2.8-3A and 2.2-2.5A is minimal and not visible to the naked eye. But it's a world of difference with the heat.
Stefan


----------



## Tidra

P7 C-bin in the MagLite D on H22A heatsink + DD @ 4V/2.4A it is almost cold @ approximately 750Lum.

On the other hand in MagLite D + custom heatsink + 4xSSC P4 U-bin star + MaxFlex Vin 7.4V 2D Li-Ion and output 700mA on serial wired LED's @ approximately 750Lum gets much hotter.

Cheers,
Iztok


----------



## gojira54

Excellent guide, many thanks for the links and great photos!
Can't wait until my heatsinks turn up....


----------



## StefanFS

gojira54 said:


> Excellent guide, many thanks for the links and great photos!
> Can't wait until my heatsinks turn up....


 
Thank you,
I expect this will be updated with your data, please tell us about your modding experience.
Stefan


----------



## simple

Nice! Stefan you always have the time and energy!


----------



## AlexGT

Just want to add a little contribution to this tread on the part of "Make sure that the emitter legs & bare wire ends don't touch the naked metal on the drilled/milled heatsink." I used clear nail enamel to cover up the bare aluminum, just a light coat will prevent any electrical contact, the thickness is barely zero.

Cheers!
AlexGT


----------



## f22shift

when you cut the reflector, do you cut the cam and leave a little of it? or do you cut the cam and a bit of the reflector to fit the p7?


----------



## Supernam

I cut it flush with the reflector.


----------



## StefanFS

f22shift said:


> when you cut the reflector, do you cut the cam and leave a little of it? or do you cut the cam and a bit of the reflector to fit the p7?


 
The whole cam is cut on the one here, in post #1. If you carefully trim the legs on the emitter it fits in the original reflector opening, without messing with the reflector.
Stefan


----------



## Isthereanybodyoutthere

What reflector /mod would give the best throw with the P7 ??


----------



## StefanFS

Isthereanybodyoutthere said:


> What reflector /mod would give the best throw with the P7 ??


 
The original reflector is very good when it comes to throw, it throws like the better CREE throwers, but with a hotspot four times the size of those. Certainly there are bigger heads/reflector combos like the ones from fivemega, but I don't know about how they might function with an multi dice emitter like the SSC P7.
Stefan


----------



## AlexGT

I am waiting on my drivers to build a P7 Mag with a Throwmaster reflector, will post pics when complete, I think it will be a thrower.


----------



## StefanFS

AlexGT said:


> I am waiting on my drivers to build a P7 Mag with a Throwmaster reflector, will post pics when complete, I think it will be a thrower.


 
I'm very interested in the result of that, if it works I might have to get one.
Stefan


----------



## StefanFS

Post #1 updated with a tutorial for building a 3A regulated driver.


----------



## AlexGT

I tried it and the results look good.

http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=196283

Stefan can you tell me what settings did you use on your camera for the pics you took?

Thanks
AlexGT



StefanFS said:


> I'm very interested in the result of that, if it works I might have to get one.
> Stefan


----------



## StefanFS

AlexGT said:


> I tried it and the results look good.
> 
> http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=196283
> 
> Stefan can you tell me what settings did you use on your camera for the pics you took?
> 
> Thanks
> AlexGT


 
It looks good. What's the current? Aren't they just wonderful, the little P7 emitters?
For long range pics I use 8 sec exposures, WB on daylight, ISO 100, f/2.8 and manual focus are the most important for me. But keep in mind that different cameras require different settings. These settings work for the cameras I prefer to use for beamshots, my Canon G9 and my Sony W5. At shorter distances or in confined areas much shorter exposure times are required to get good results. Indoors it might be enough with half a second, and for 30 meters outside 4 sec exposures might be perfect. You have to experiment. You do need a camera with manual settings.
Stefan


----------



## AlexGT

Right now it is being direct driven from a 1C li-ion, I couldn't catch the mailman who is delivering me 2 SOB 1500 to be run in paralell for 3 amps to the led.

I will try your settings for beamshots tonight.

AlexGT


----------



## TranquillityBase

Awesome tutorial Stefan!

I just ordered some P7 emitters. That driver solution looks great. I'll have to order a few.

Is the small light an Aleph 3?


----------



## StefanFS

TranquillityBase said:


> Awesome tutorial Stefan!
> 
> I just ordered some P7 emitters. That driver solution looks great. I'll have to order a few.
> 
> Is the small light an Aleph 3?


 
Thanks, 
no it's my Tiablo A8 running at 2.4A. It's mostly spill, but it lights up a big warehouse/convention hall!
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/194753

Stefan


----------



## StefanFS

I think I did my most successful SSC P7 Mag mod this evening. One red 1.25D FM Mag with UCL-lens, a perfectly cut H22A heatsink (down to 1/10 of a mm), teflon wire, a hand picked stock Mag reflector (I have dozens), a perfectly soldered 3A 5 mode driver sandwich. A perfectly soldered low resistance tail cap mod. AND a hand picked SSC P7 premium C-bin emitter, saved because of it's very low vf and very matched dice (even with the ultra low current continuity test on my DMM the dice are matched). Throw is 28 000 lux at one metre at 3A. The hotspot from a SSC P7 Mag is four times the size of the best CREE throwers that produce 20-25 000 lux in throw. The spill is three times the area and two to three times the intensity compared to those top CREE throwers. This little monster should run on one protected LiION D cell for ~90 minutes at top flux.

















Stefan


----------



## uluapoundr

Stefan,
Nice lights! Your post has gotten me excited to do my own P7 Mag mods. I have 3 heatsinks ( 2 H22A and 1 Fenix), two P7 emitters and one on the way, 2 3D mags, Tenergy D cells on the way, Kai AMC boards on the way. I'll be sure to post some pics when I'm done. Thanks for sharing! Keep um commin! BTW, where did you get the mag reflectors from? I may need some spares too. I'm sure some of those Incan guys must have a bunch to give away. Aloha!


----------



## StefanFS

uluapoundr,
from www . flashlightking.com. But mostly as leftover reflectors from Mag mods. After a while you get piles of Mag parts laying around.
Stefan

Edit!

It's fun to build and you're going to love it when it's built!


----------



## f22shift

uluapoundr said:


> Stefan,
> Nice lights! Your post has gotten me excited to do my own P7 Mag mods. I have 3 heatsinks ( 2 H22A and 1 Fenix), two P7 emitters and one on the way, 2 3D mags, Tenergy D cells on the way, Kai AMC boards on the way. I'll be sure to post some pics when I'm done. Thanks for sharing! Keep um commin! BTW, where did you get the mag reflectors from? I may need some spares too. I'm sure some of those Incan guys must have a bunch to give away. Aloha!


 
let us know how the kai amc board works with the 3 cells. i know they mention 4 cells in the description so i was wondering if it still worked with 3 cells


----------



## StefanFS

Post #1 updated with a small unscientific heat test.


----------



## Northern Lights

StefanFS said:


> This is what you need. Two 1A simple AMC7135 drivers and one 1A AMC7135 multimode driver to control them.Stefan


 
I do not know enought about board electronics to get this.
What is the purpose of the controler board? That is to say I perfer only off and on, is the boards only purpose mode control or is it intrigal to the operation? The two simple boards provide the regulation, is that all that is necessary to operate the P7?


----------



## Cheesy

Northern Lights said:


> I do not know enought about board electronics to get this.
> What is the purpose of the controler board? That is to say I perfer only off and on, is the boards only purpose mode control or is it intrigal to the operation? The two simple boards provide the regulation, is that all that is necessary to operate the P7?


 
Each board is contributing 1A of drive to the total 3A. If you remove the multimode driver you will need to replace it with another 1A driver or you will only get 2A.


Kev.


----------



## Northern Lights

Got it, now the equations make more sense to me too. Thank you very much.


----------



## regor

This is my first time posting a question, so bare with me please.
I am also planning on using your method to control the SSC P7, but my concern is when soldering in the multi mode board. Will I be able to actually get multi modes from the P7? I like the idea of at least a LOW and HIGH mode. Any ideas???


----------



## StefanFS

regor,
if you do it like described and use those drivers you will get different levels.
Stefan


----------



## regor

Stefan, Thank you for responding to my question about multilevel driver. I will follow your diagram description in your article. Thanks again!


----------



## FireStik

Great info, thanks for sharing!

Maybe I missed it, but have you tried the 4338 driver from KD? I just got some and plan on trying one on my Mag P7.

Here's the link: http://www.kaidomain.com/WEBUI/ProductDetail.aspx?TranID=4338


----------



## StefanFS

FireStik said:


> Great info, thanks for sharing!
> 
> Maybe I missed it, but have you tried the 4338 driver from KD? I just got some and plan on trying one on my Mag P7.
> 
> Here's the link: http://www.kaidomain.com/WEBUI/ProductDetail.aspx?TranID=4338


 
No you didn't miss it because I haven't mentioned those here. They are made from two sandwiched 1400 mA drivers, the ones I use with the multimode drivers in this thread. That's what's so great with these drivers, you can combine them in a number of ways to get the drive current you want. Your drivers should work great with 3 x C or D NiMH or one large LiION cell, they also work with 3 x AA but with less flat regulation. They will be burning hot on 4 NiMH cells, as that will be to much voltage.
Good luck,
Stefan


----------



## Drewfus2101

Stefan, maybe I'm missing something about the AMC boards and hopefully you can clear up my questions. 

Right now I've running direct drive using 3 x NiMH, fresh at 3.6V, and at the tail cap the current is registering 2.1 amps. 

When I get the time, I'm going to put together 2 of my 1400mA AMCs to get the 2.8A drive current. 

This is where my question comes in: the AMCs are not boost boards, so how can I get more current using this board than when I was using DD without adding another battery? I've been planning on adding another battery, but I also know that 4.8V is pushing the boards thermal limits. 

So you are running 3 of the AMC boards making 3.0A off of 2 x D size NiMH batteries?? 

I started building my 2.8A driver but had some solder flow too far and form a short and didn't have any more time to work on it so I just went DD to get it running. Pretty good for 2.1A, but I've got to go regulated.


----------



## StefanFS

Drewfus2101,

It sounds strange with only 2.1A from three D? NiMH cells in direct drive. When I tried DD I got over 2.5-2.6 even with only three eneloop AA in adapters and slightly more with different D size NiMH cells, between 2.7 and ~3.2A depending on cell age and condition. You can get even more current from one C/D-size LiION. These drivers work with what current the cell/s can deliver to it. 

No, I'm running the 3A variety from one 5000mAh D-size LiION or three 9000 mAh D-size NiMH to get reasonable runtimes. 2 x D NiMH doesn't work with these drivers, voltage is too low.

Stefan


----------



## Supernam

Drewfus, 

Didn't your test results for the AMC boards show that you need about 4 volts or more to hit the boards' max current?


----------



## Drewfus2101

Supernam said:


> Drewfus,
> 
> Didn't your test results for the AMC boards show that you need about 4 volts or more to hit the boards' max current?



Yes, 4.0 to 4.2 seemed to be about best between the 1050mA board and the 1400mA board. BUT we are talking about running two of the 1400mA boards in parallel, which changes a lot. 

I actually had time last night to finish building my 2.8A driver but left my tools at another house so couldn't remove the Mag switch from my light so couldn't perform the same tests as I did with those AMC boards on this one. I'm curious to see what kind of efficiency numbers, input current and output current we will get with this setup. I'll be sure to post up when I get around to it. 

Like Stefan has said, the AMC boards seem best with 1 Lithium Ion battery fresh off the charger, but can work with 3 or 4 NiMH batteries, although 4, while fresh off the charger, will push the thermal management limits. I'm going to run on 4 NiMH batteries but I'll let them rest after charging.


----------



## Supernam

I can't wait to see your test. I've already done 5 P7's with 8xAMC. I haven't had any overheating issues with the boards running on 4 6Ah Titanium C's fresh off the charger at about 5.4-5.6v. They sag to 5.2 immediately after turning the light on. I have the boards arctic silvered chip side out to the Mag's tube which has the anodizing stripped off. I ran them from full charge until .9v per cell. The head was way hotter than the body right above the switch which was where I mounted them.


----------



## StefanFS

Two more pics of my last Mag SSC P7 3A 1D LiION build. The most wonderful light I own at the moment.


----------



## uluapoundr

Another nice light Stefan. I just bought a 1D, tribored from Mac. You think I should run a single li-ion D cell or take advantage of the tribore? What circuits you running on this light? Thanks for sharing, hope to share mine soon.


----------



## Northern Lights

StefanFS said:


> ...This is mounted in a 2D Maglite, options are 3 C size NiMH with some modding or one D-szi LiION cell and one spacer. The difference between 2.4A drive current and 3A is a few thousand lux in throw, ~20 000 versus ~25 000 lux. The big drawback is shorter runtime and more heat. Going from 2.4A to 3A will cut runtime dramatically...
> 
> Stefan


How does that translate to predicted lumens? I have a P7 that is at 2.20 amps amd uses a hop 26 or 28 mm reflector. I wonder for output and actual put-it-to-work light whether it is worth building the 3.0 A model. 
I probably will because I am a flashaholic but I was looking for a practical side answer.


----------



## StefanFS

uluapoundr said:


> Another nice light Stefan. I just bought a 1D, tribored from Mac. You think I should run a single li-ion D cell or take advantage of the tribore? What circuits you running on this light? Thanks for sharing, hope to share mine soon.


 
D-LiION works very well. Is the tribore intended for three 18650? If it is I guess it would work very well also. I use the driver in the end of post #1. Two simple 1050 mA and one multi mode 1050 mA, all based on AMC7135. That gives me ~3A with one big LiION.

----------------------------



Northern Lights said:


> How does that translate to predicted lumens? I have a P7 that is at 2.20 amps amd uses a hop 26 or 28 mm reflector. I wonder for output and actual put-it-to-work light whether it is worth building the 3.0 A model.
> I probably will because I am a flashaholic but I was looking for a practical side answer.


 
I'm not going to guess lumen output in detail, but I think it's in the top few percent of the original binning. The lux output is about 25% higher than one of my 2.4A Maglite running the same type of cell. There's a difference between my two 2.4A Mags and the ones running at 3A. I'm going to convert my 2.4A 1D Mag to 3A since I tend not to use it anymore in it's present form... I'll keep one 2.4A 3D Mag for long runtime.

Stefan


----------



## farmall

Not to get off topic, but where do I get a SSC P7 C bin ?


----------



## fxstsb

*Large quote removed by moderator*
Please note that it is unnecessary to quote entire posts if they are very large.

I finished mine using a bare emitter. The center (reverse side) of the emitter is positve. There is continuity between the center and the positive input of the emitter. Well it should be obvious that the case of the flashlight is Negative.
There is no doubt your light works but how did you isolate your heat sink from the rest of the light? Mine is direct drive.


----------



## uluapoundr

I'll let Stefan answer for his light. On a P7 build I did, I spread a thin layer of artic alumina epoxy on the heatsink where the emitter would go. After that dried, I again applied epoxy and gently stuck on the emitter. The heatsinks I used were both anodized, but I still didn't want to take that risk. By doing this, no need to isolate the heatsink.


----------



## StefanFS

fxstsb said:


> I finished mine using a bare emitter. The center (reverse side) of the emitter is positve. There is continuity between the center and the positive input of the emitter. Well it should be obvious that the case of the flashlight is Negative.
> There is no doubt your light works but how did you isolate your heat sink from the rest of the light? Mine is direct drive.


 
1. By using an anodized heatsink. Yes the guides are milled off and the sides are milled for the leads, but the anodizing is thick.
2. By using Arctic Alumina epoxy. Other thermal glues/epoxies will work as well as long as they are non conductive.

I have modded several dozen lights with various SSC emitters and I have never had any problems with isolation. There is much drama about this fact that the slug is positive on SSC emitters. 

Just use some non conducting epoxy. Make sure nothing is left of parts you mill away, if you adapt an SSC P4 heatsink that is.

And please edit your post as it contains everything in the rather long first post you quoted. It messes up the thread.

Cheers,
Stefan


----------



## CampingLED

Is it worth it to do a P7 mod if I already have a Quad Cree Q5 mod? My feeling is that the light output should be fairly similar.


----------



## TorchBoy

farmall said:


> Not to get off topic, but where do I get a SSC P7 C bin ?


One of these things?


----------



## Northern Lights

CampingLED said:


> Is it worth it to do a P7 mod if I already have a Quad Cree Q5 mod? My feeling is that the light output should be fairly similar.


That is my very same question, here is the reply with pictures I got in another thread:
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/posts/2472371&postcount=106


----------



## fxstsb

StefanFS said:


> 1. By using an anodized heatsink. Yes the guides are milled off and the sides are milled for the leads, but the anodizing is thick.
> 2. By using Arctic Alumina epoxy. Other thermal glues/epoxies will work as well as long as they are non conductive.
> 
> I have modded several dozen lights with various SSC emitters and I have never had any problems with isolation. There is much drama about this fact that the slug is positive on SSC emitters.
> 
> Just use some non conducting epoxy. Make sure nothing is left of parts you mill away, if you adapt an SSC P4 heatsink that is.
> 
> And please edit your post as it contains everything in the rather long first post you quoted. It messes up the thread.
> 
> Cheers,
> Stefan


Thanks


----------



## CampingLED

Northern Lights said:


> That is my very same question, here is the reply with pictures I got in another thread:
> https://www.candlepowerforums.com/posts/2472371&postcount=106


 
Tks. Will rather wait for a next generation LED before I go for my next M-Mod. Here is my Quad M-Mod https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/194364 The Aspherical add-on gives great additional throw.


----------



## StefanFS

CampingLED said:


> Is it worth it to do a P7 mod if I already have a Quad Cree Q5 mod? My feeling is that the light output should be fairly similar.


 
I think it boils down to what ones preferences are. I always sneered at the 'fragile' and 'overly complex' multi emitter Mag mods, but now I'm thinking about doing one for myself. Your quad CREE Q5 monster should be enough unless you specifically want about the same output from a one emitter light. Economically it would be unwise.


----------



## CampingLED

StefanFS said:


> I think it boils down to what ones preferences are. I always sneered at the 'fragile' and 'overly complex' multi emitter Mag mods, but now I'm thinking about doing one for myself. Your quad CREE Q5 monster should be enough unless you specifically want about the same output from a one emitter light. Economically it would be unwise.


 
I was looking for an excuse to justify a P7 mod, but you guys did not help with the excuse. You did however help me with my budget and to like my Quad M=Mod even more - thanks for that.


----------



## StefanFS

CampingLED said:


> I was looking for an excuse to justify a P7 mod, but you guys did not help with the excuse. You did however help me with my budget and to like my Quad M=Mod even more - thanks for that.


 
Repeat after me: I need an SSC P7 Maglite... They are so lovely... I must have an SSC P7 Maglite... I can't live without an SSC P7 Maglite...


----------



## CampingLED

StefanFS said:


> Repeat after me: I need an SSC P7 Maglite... They are so lovely... I must have an SSC P7 Maglite... I can't live without an SSC P7 Maglite...


 
I need an SSC P7 Maglite... They are so lovely... I must have an SSC P7 Maglite... I can't live without an SSC P7 Maglite...
I need an SSC P7 Maglite... They are so lovely... I must have an SSC P7 Maglite... I can't live without an SSC P7 Maglite...
I need an SSC P7 Maglite... They are so lovely... I must have an SSC P7 Maglite... I can't live without an SSC P7 Maglite...:huh:


----------



## warlord

I would love to see a P7 vs multi cree beamshots.


I will have a SSC P7 Maglite in a FM host... They are so lovely... I must have a SSC P7 Maglite... my precious!


----------



## Northern Lights

warlord said:


> I would love to see a P7 vs multi cree beamshots.


The romisen 4X cree is above, post #52,
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/...&postcount=106 
I have two Shyguang Nuwai TM-800x3 lights. One is modifies to 3X SCC P4, the other modified to 3X Cree Q2. The Q2 is brighter than the P4 and has some donut on 1 and 2 LEDs on but that goes away with 3x on, both lights throw about the same.
To tri-build or not to tri-build a LED light 

My MTE P7 runs at 3.5 Amps on a fresh 18650. 
P7 900 lumens MTE DX first impression good info for comparisons in this thread, like why build if you can buy?

The MTE on *medium* is by eye sight comparison about *1/3 brighter than the Q2 running high* and therefore brighter than the P4, both Nuwai lights running all three LEDs. The throw is about the same. The P7 blows them away on high and has a very even beam, I would say the spill of the P7 is brighter than the hot spot of both modified Nuwai lights!

Now I wish I could show a beam shot of this, but the Romisen is better than the Nuwai mods and I gave you that link. 

None of these lights I mentioned have the throw I like, but are good household lights to about 50-60 yards, all are flood.


----------



## waTom

Hi,

First of all, thanks Stefan for the how to, it convinced me that I need a P7 Mag 

However, I want to use a different driver, namely this one:

http://www.kaidomain.com/WEBUI/ProductDetail.aspx?TranID=4660

It looks like it has exactly the same layout as your multimode driver just with only 2 modes.

Since there are 5 drivers in a pack, can I just wire 2 of them in parallel or does this affect the modes? 

If it is possible, would you or someone else tell me, where I need to solder them together? It's my first "complex" mod and I don't want to have all the little things to go up in smoke


----------



## CampingLED

waTom said:


> Hi,
> 
> First of all, thanks Stefan for the how to, it convinced me that I need a P7 Mag
> 
> However, I want to use a different driver, namely this one:
> 
> http://www.kaidomain.com/WEBUI/ProductDetail.aspx?TranID=4660
> 
> It looks like it has exactly the same layout as your multimode driver just with only 2 modes.
> 
> Since there are 5 drivers in a pack, can I just wire 2 of them in parallel or does this affect the modes?
> 
> If it is possible, would you or someone else tell me, where I need to solder them together? It's my first "complex" mod and I don't want to have all the little things to go up in smoke


 
I would not recommend using more than one multi-mode driver in a parallel array. My feeling is that they may go out of sync and it may be difficult to get them both on high mode again.


----------



## etc

Awesome pics, awesome lite


----------



## StefanFS

waTom said:


> Since there are 5 drivers in a pack, can I just wire 2 of them in parallel or does this affect the modes?
> 
> If it is possible, would you or someone else tell me, where I need to solder them together? It's my first "complex" mod and I don't want to have all the little things to go up in smoke


 
Sorry, not possible (I think). You need the multimode for the interface, the rest are just extra AMC7135 chips to increase the current. If you do it with several multimode drivers you have to remove the PIC microprocessor, solder on some connections and a zero Ohm resistor if my memory is correct. Then you can adapt the wiring to hook it up to the multimode driver.
Stefan


----------



## waTom

Well then... hello AMC chips, my dear friends 

And thank you very much for the clarification!


----------



## TorchBoy

CampingLED said:


> My feeling is that they may go out of sync and it may be difficult to get them both on high mode again.


:laughing: Yeah, which would probably be quite annoying for you, but quite funny for any nearby CPFers. If you put those boards in parallel you should really use just one mode controller chip for however many AMC7135s you use.


----------



## StefanFS

Beamshots with all the regulated Maglites in this thread are here:

https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/198549

Stefan


----------



## spencer

Could you please post links to the drivers you used for the 3A multimode? Also what would the input voltage need to be?


----------



## TorchBoy

StefanFS said:


> Beamshots with all the regulated Maglites in this thread are here:


Awesome! :twothumbs A friend recently asked me about brightening his 2D Maglite. I'll show him those pics to inspire him.


----------



## Joshatdot

*I need an SSC P7 Maglite... They are so lovely... I must have an SSC P7 Maglite... I can't live without an SSC P7 Maglite...*


----------



## StefanFS

spencer said:


> Could you please post links to the drivers you used for the 3A multimode? Also what would the input voltage need to be?


 
Here are two places that sell those driver:
DealExtreme: Multimode drivers, SKU:7612, 6190. 1400 mA driver, SKU:3178.
KaiDomain: Multimode drivers, SKU:3215, 4659, 3214, 2958. 1400 mA driver, SKU:1806.

I use the 1400 mA simple driver and remove the number of AMC chips to get the current I need, in this case I remove the last chip of the four. The 1050 mA driver uses the same pcb as the multimode variety and then you need to change the wiring some to the new layout. It works best if the voltage is between 3.6 and 4.5V. 
Stefan


----------



## sortafast

more questions. I have a P7 on its way from DX and am planning to mod a [email protected] for a friend of mine. But it needs to be a 3C [email protected], per his requirements. I do not know a ton about batteries, but will this be ok running it DD off of 3 alkaline C batteries from the store? This will probably be how he will run it, might put NiMH batts in it too. I just got the 3c [email protected] and its going to be a tight fit once I make the sink. I would like to try and get 3A out of it using 3 of the 1A boards I have, but not sure I will have the room with the heat sink in there. Anyone have thoughts on this? In my head I think it will be fine in DD, but I don't want the light to self destruct. He wants a light for shock value, not so much for run time.


----------



## StefanFS

sortafast said:


> more questions. I have a P7 on its way from DX and am planning to mod a [email protected] for a friend of mine. But it needs to be a 3C [email protected], per his requirements. I do not know a ton about batteries, but will this be ok running it DD off of 3 alkaline C batteries from the store? This will probably be how he will run it, might put NiMH batts in it too. I just got the 3c [email protected] and its going to be a tight fit once I make the sink. I would like to try and get 3A out of it using 3 of the 1A boards I have, but not sure I will have the room with the heat sink in there. Anyone have thoughts on this? In my head I think it will be fine in DD, but I don't want the light to self destruct. He wants a light for shock value, not so much for run time.


 
Direct drive should be no problems. But expect a rapid and steep decrease in output, especially on alkaline. I alkaline is going to be used you might want a lower current to the led, alkalines probably won't be able to supply 3A. The best choice would be 2A or even less than that with alkaline. With NiMH cells you could go up to 2.8A-3A and have 'shock value'.


----------



## milkyspit

Stefan, just wanted to offer some kudos on a great guide. Very, very nice work in collecting the info... and very much in the old-school CPF spirit! Hats off to you, bud. :thumbsup:  :thumbsup:


----------



## spencer

I second the thanks milkyspit just gave. I even printed some of the original post out.
Another question. The multimode driver does 100%, 35%, and 10%. Would that be percentages of the total output: 3100 mA, 1050mA, and 300mA or would it be the percentage of the current the one board delivers making the total output 3100mA, 2750mA, and 2200mA?
I don't know a whole lot about electronics and electricity but just looking at how it is wired, I think it's a percentage of the total output. Please correct me if I'm wrong.


----------



## Norm

Add me to the list of people that have found all of Stephans stuff very useful. It great to have all this experimentation and knowledge of something new to refer to when I've been doing my own mods.
Cheer Stephan.


----------



## StefanFS

Milkyspit, spencer and Norm. Thank you.

The PIC (very probably) uses pwm to control output so it's very likely percentages. They are off a bit because the current is dramatically different from what the programmer intended. So it's somewhere around 300-600 mA, 1A-1.4A and pretty much exactly 3A. It varies some with different versions of these AMC7135 based multimode 'drivers'. I only use these drivers because they provide a stable solution. I have tried some other drivers and they have all burned in short order when doing extended runtimes.

Stefan


----------



## Synergic

StefanFS said:


> Here are two places that sell those driver:
> DealExtreme: Multimode drivers, SKU:7612, 6190. 1400 mA driver, SKU:3178.
> KaiDomain: Multimode drivers, SKU:3215, 4659, 3214, 2958. 1400 mA driver, SKU:1806.
> 
> I use the 1400 mA simple driver and remove the number of AMC chips to get the current I need, in this case I remove the last chip of the four. The 1050 mA driver uses the same pcb as the multimode variety and then you need to change the wiring some to the new layout. It works best if the voltage is between 3.6 and 4.5V.
> Stefan


 
HI!
Only remove it? Nothing else like jumping any pad or so?
Thanks


----------



## Synergic

Where can i purchase a D size 3.6/3.7 lion battery as the one you use here?

Thanks


----------



## Norm

Synergic said:


> Where can i purchase a D size 3.6/3.7 lion battery as the one you use here?
> Thanks


Protected D Li-ion
Norm


----------



## Norm

I think after playing with various drivers and reflectors my P7 Maglite is finished. D Li-ion, Tri Flupic, modified heat sink, KD coated lens, DX P7 reflector (sanded down for minimal gap, could have sanded more but it looks fine to me), FM mag.
It started off direct drive and has gone through a number of incarnations and I think at last I'm finished. The DX reflector gives it a much more finished appearance, and the flupic is fantastic. Just have to wait till dark to see how the DX reflector performs.
Edit: just tried the new reflector and it seems to work better than my stippled mag reflector more hot spot and less spill.


----------



## uluapoundr

Norm,
Another beautiful build! Can you explain a litte about sanding the reflector. Did you have to open up the hole a little for the emitter to fit nicely? I just ordered the DX P7 reflector. Thanks for sharing!


----------



## Norm

uluapoundr the reflector fits the P7 perfectly but the top of the reflector has a much thicker ridge than the standard mag reflector, I filed the top of the reflector, I put the file in the vise and kept rotating the reflector as I filed to keep it nice and even.
Norm


----------



## uluapoundr

Thanks, I'll give it a try when my reflectors come in.


----------



## waTom

I just finished my my mag with p7 and the drivers wired according Stefan's guide. I used another multimode driver, namely this one: http://www.kaidomain.com/WEBUI/ProductDetail.aspx?TranID=4660
Its high/low with 1A and 150mA, so together this should be about 2.4A and 1.5A.

Unfortunately, the light behaves a bit strange now :duh2:

On 3 Eneloop AAs I measured at the tail a current of 1.75A on high and about 250mA on low. When I try 4 AAs it won't even light up :shrug:

I checked the switch and all the wires but everything seems to be ok.
Maybe I have messed up the AMC7something board while treating it with the soldering iron :devil: but I could not see any damage on the surface.

Does anyone have an idea what could be the reason?


----------



## StefanFS

Ok, with 3 eneloops you should see ~ 2.9A. Something must be wrong...
I have also had those drivers (2 mode) for a while. No problems so far.
Stefan


----------



## meuge

I've partially completed my 3-D P7 Mag mod, but I've ran into an issue - the DHS heatsink just won't fit into the mag barrel. I figure that I'd need to shave at least 0.5mm all around the perimeter, to have it fit!


----------



## DocD

Hi you could try this
remove the anodize coating from the inside using emery cloth placed in a split or staple to the end of a small length of 8mm dowel and a drill remove the switch and hone it out till the heat sink fit's


----------



## waTom

StefanFS said:


> Ok, with 3 eneloops you should see ~ 2.9A. Something must be wrong...
> I have also had those drivers (2 mode) for a while. No problems so far.
> Stefan




There was something wrong with the 2 mode driver, perhaps I damaged it. I run the light with two AMC7something drivers now ... works great at 2.8A :twothumbs
I will have to live without a "low" mode :candle:


----------



## Isthereanybodyoutthere

waTom said:


> There was something wrong with the 2 mode driver, perhaps I damaged it. I run the light with two AMC7something drivers now ... works great at 2.8A :twothumbs
> I will have to live without a "low" mode :candle:




can you Put in a second switch between the two drivers ??


----------



## IMSabbel

A stupid question:
Those drivers are linear bucks, right? So they just burn away the excess voltage?
Now i have a higher input voltage...
Could i just wire them in series on the primary side? For example, use 12V input, so each of the 3 boards gets 4V voltage drop?
Or would that mess up the regulation (feedback, ect?)


----------



## CampingLED

IMSabbel said:


> A stupid question:
> Those drivers are linear bucks, right? So they just burn away the excess voltage?
> Now i have a higher input voltage...
> Could i just wire them in series on the primary side? For example, use 12V input, so each of the 3 boards gets 4V voltage drop?
> Or would that mess up the regulation (feedback, ect?)


 
Always wanted to try that and my feeling is that theoretically it will work. Something else to think of is one board in series with 2 x DD LEDs. I.e. 3 x LEDs in total with the 7V voltage over the two DD LEDs and the rest of the voltage over the regulated board driving the 3rd LED. This should give high efficiency. The current drawn by the regulated circuit board therefore works as the current regulator for the other two LEDs. Disadvantage in this scenario is that one of the 3 LEDs will have a different brightness from the other two.


----------



## TorchBoy

CampingLED said:


> Disadvantage in this scenario is that one of the 3 LEDs will have a different brightness from the other two.


Since the AMC7135 uses just a few microamps as the set current, you won't notice any difference in brightness at all. The main problem with that setup is the variability of the supply voltage, so it wouldn't work in a car, for example.

There was another thread where we discussed putting several AMC7135s in series, but I really can't remember where it was. I think the conclusion was that they'd sort themselves out, instead of one trying to do all the voltage dropping.


----------



## K2-bk-bl-rd

I am planing to build a Seoul P7 mag. Will a 2C maglite work? can you use two liIon C batteries with the drivers Stefan has laid out?I would like to build the 3A version. Also Where do you get your LiION D-size batteries and spacers? Thanks


----------



## K2-bk-bl-rd

Also where can I get Arctic Alumina Thermal Adhesive and thermal paste?


----------



## DocD

Hii
you can get the info from the web site www.arcticsilver.com cheers DocD


----------



## StefanFS

K2-bk-bl-rd said:


> I am planing to build a Seoul P7 mag. Will a 2C maglite work? can you use two liIon C batteries with the drivers Stefan has laid out?I would like to build the 3A version. Also Where do you get your LiION D-size batteries and spacers? Thanks


 
Two LiION cells are too much voltage for the drivers I used. I recommend using max ~5V with these drivers. You need to find another driver if using two C LiION is your only choice.

The D LiION cells I got from KaiDomain. com. The spacers are easy to build with some wood and 2 mm copper wire. There are also D spacers available from Flashlightking, I think.


----------



## Isthereanybodyoutthere

Norm said:


> I think after playing with various drivers and reflectors my P7 Maglite is finished. D Li-ion, Tri Flupic, modified heat sink, KD coated lens, DX P7 reflector (sanded down for minimal gap, could have sanded more but it looks fine to me), FM mag.
> It started off direct drive and has gone through a number of incarnations and I think at last I'm finished. The DX reflector gives it a much more finished appearance, and the flupic is fantastic. Just have to wait till dark to see how the DX reflector performs.
> Edit: just tried the new reflector and it seems to work better than my stippled mag reflector more hot spot and less spill.



Is it the http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.12229





you use does it have a longer throw than the standard mag ??

Is it the same reflector they use in the http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.12809






If so then you should get the some throw and spill from the aurora than from a mag with this reflector (feeding it the same amps)


----------



## Northern Lights

looks lie a wf-500 reflector, is it?


----------



## Isthereanybodyoutthere

Northern Lights said:


> looks lie a wf-500 reflector, is it?



The bare reflector is (see the link) is ,so they say especially for the P7
And Norm is using one from DX


----------



## kurni

Awesome tutorial, I wish I had the soldering skill. Hopefully TaskLED will have one soon.


----------



## spencer

Can anyone recommend a P7 heatsink. I'm thinking about getting the DHS but I see it isn't hollow. Will I be able to fit the 3A driver between it and the switch. If not, what should I buy. I'm not really interested in buying a P4 heatsink and modifying it.


----------



## JamisonM

spencer said:


> Can anyone recommend a P7 heatsink. I'm thinking about getting the DHS but I see it isn't hollow. Will I be able to fit the 3A driver between it and the switch. If not, what should I buy. I'm not really interested in buying a P4 heatsink and modifying it.


I think H22A's solid style P7 heatsink is one of the best ones out there right now. Looking at the pictures, it doesn't look to be much taller/longer than his P4 heatsink. Once you cut the cam shaft off the maglites switch, I wonder if there would be enough space to fix the driver to the bottom of the heatsink with thermal epoxy. I can't say exactly if it would fit though.


----------



## JustinS

Great tutorial Stefan, thanks. 
Newbie to mag modding, I'm getting the parts to do my old 3D Mag, can I use my 3 "D" 1.2v 2150mAh NiMH rechargeables with this mod ok?
Cheers
Justin


----------



## StefanFS

JustinS said:


> Great tutorial Stefan, thanks.
> Newbie to mag modding, I'm getting the parts to do my old 3D Mag, can I use my 3 "D" 1.2v 2150mAh NiMH rechargeables with this mod ok?
> Cheers
> Justin


 
You can, but with shorter runtime and 'less regulation'.
Stefan


----------



## StefanFS

spencer said:


> Can anyone recommend a P7 heatsink. I'm thinking about getting the DHS but I see it isn't hollow. Will I be able to fit the 3A driver between it and the switch. If not, what should I buy. I'm not really interested in buying a P4 heatsink and modifying it.


 
There's a lot of room between the bottom of the heatsink and the top of the switch assembly and I'm pretty sure that a driver will fit.
Stefan


----------



## forrest

I've modded ( all with p7's) a 2c mag with the 3 4/5 sub nimh c's, and a 3d mag with the 3 10,000 nimh's and a streamlight hp and all three are direct drive are doing wonderful with absolutely no issues at all, they all run at about 2.8 amps and the heads of all of them do get warm after about 5 min. of runtime so they are sinking well. I used the dhs sinks in the mags and a homemade sink for the streamlight. Runtimes are unbelievable in all the flashlights. Could'nt be happier just have the need for more lumens now! Funny how we get spoiled and need more! Probably go to a multi p7 set-up next.


----------



## jcvjcvjcvjcv

forrest, could you please specify wich bin exactly you are using?

The bin's that end with 'J' have a Vf of 3.50 - 3.75, what is just a little too low for a high-resistance 3x Ni-Mh Mag setup.

The bin's that end with 'I' have a Vf of 3.25 - 3.50 what comes a little closer.

A 2C with 3x 4/5C is a nice idea. I can suggest that option to a friend of mine. Not going that route myself btw. I like the D size more. Unfortunately there is no such thing as 4/5D :sigh:. Whatever, 2x Li-ion 'C' in parallel will work in 2D :naughty:


----------



## forrest

jcv, I used the I bin for all the mods, I believe the streamlight uses 3 sub c batteries also. anyways I thought of using regulation boards but then again why? I guess for a " low" option, but I have my romison. t5 that I modded with the shark rem bd. and that works great for optional settings and is also bright as h#ll!


----------



## JustinS

StefanFS said:


> You can, but with shorter runtime and 'less regulation'.
> Stefan


 
Ok will get some 10000mah D's then. Ordered all the parts, went with this board http://www.kaidomain.com/WEBUI/ProductDetail.aspx?TranID=4338.
Noticed in your pics of the emitter, do you only have to solder the wires to one + & - trimmed leg on the P7 emitter or should you solder across both?
Cheers
Justin


----------



## StefanFS

JustinS said:


> Ok will get some 10000mah D's then. Ordered all the parts, went with this board http://www.kaidomain.com/WEBUI/ProductDetail.aspx?TranID=4338.
> Noticed in your pics of the emitter, do you only have to solder the wires to one + & - trimmed leg on the P7 emitter or should you solder across both?
> Cheers
> Justin


 
Solder to one emitter leg, that's enough. And it looks better if you try to solder it on the inside.
Stefan


----------



## CaneZMD

This is a little off topic, but where do you purchase a 1 d cell m*g host?

About how much do they cost?


----------



## StefanFS

CaneZMD said:


> This is a little off topic, but where do you purchase a 1 d cell m*g host?
> 
> About how much do they cost?


 
Ask Jesus Hernandes in the Custom BST thread. Sometimes fivemega sell cutdown and reanodized Mags. I got one from user Ledean (not active) for ~$50 and a nicer one from fivemega for $80 (I think it was) with hard anodizing and finning.


----------



## headlight

OK, I'm totally new to modding the M*g. So heres the stupid question. If you're wiring direct, how are the wires connected to the switch? Where does the pos/neg wire connect?

Thanks 

Ed


----------



## StefanFS

headlight said:


> OK, I'm totally new to modding the M*g. So heres the stupid question. If you're wiring direct, how are the wires connected to the switch? Where does the pos/neg wire connect?
> 
> Thanks
> 
> Ed


 
Positive goes to the center of the switch assembly and the negative goes to the contact strip at the edge of the switch assembly. This is after you have removed the bulb post.


----------



## Synergic

Hi there!
Im using 2 AMC7135X4 driver boards and with 3 AA eneloops i only got 1A...and with 4 AA eneloops 2.2A....what happens? I should have 2.8A with 3 eneloops....i have tested they can give up to 7 A...

Thanks


----------



## StefanFS

Synergic said:


> Hi there!
> Im using 2 AMC7135X4 driver boards and with 3 AA eneloops i only got 1A...and with 4 AA eneloops 2.2A....what happens? I should have 2.8A with 3 eneloops....i have tested they can give up to 7 A...
> 
> Thanks


 
I just checked one of my builds with three eneloop. Battery draw is 2.2A and measured output indicates that the emitter see at least 2.6-2.7A. 
Something is wrong, wiring/driver, the emitter or your DMM. 

I assume you use an emitter with low vf, CS**I as opposed to CS**J?

Stefan


----------



## Cookie Monster

Hi everyone,

My question is, does the driver boards come with a diagram, detailing where the led positive/negative conections go etc...

If not, how did you find out what components to remove or bypass to get what you want?

I have not done a complex mod before. So what I really would like to start off with is a simple 2.8a output that has an on/off capability.

Any suggestions?


----------



## Synergic

Hi Stefan;
Yes, is a CS**I emitter.
I think the wiring is ok,becauseif not,the output would not be 2.2A when using 4 eneloops,im right?
I vave connected them in paralel,the only thing i didnt do is removing the diodes.


----------



## Synergic

I have tried it with another sandwich...
3 Eneloops, 1.4A
4 eneloops, 2.8A....so....what is wrong here?It seems to need more than 4V for runing...Evidentely both modules are working,or i would have 2.8A...:mecry:

Edit:
More meassures:
3 Eneloops V=3.8 but connected V drops to 3.3
4 Eneloops V=5.08 Connected drops to 4.16
Maybe that is the problem?
Ill charge them again and try tonight..


----------



## JamisonM

Synergic said:


> I have tried it with another sandwich...
> 3 Eneloops, 1.4A
> 4 eneloops, 2.8A....so....what is wrong here?It seems to need more than 4V for runing...Evidentely both modules are working,or i would have 2.8A...:mecry:
> 
> Edit:
> More meassures:
> 3 Eneloops V=3.8 but connected V drops to 3.3
> 4 Eneloops V=5.08 Connected drops to 4.16
> Maybe that is the problem?
> Ill charge them again and try tonight..


Not too surprising. There was a thread about this a couple of weeks ago. I believe it was in the LED forums. Most people direct driving with 3 NiMH won't get the full 2.8A. Instead, they get around 2A because of voltage sag. You'll have to have 4 NiMH to get maximum output.


----------



## Synergic

Yes,but im not using direct driving....


----------



## X_Marine

JamisonM said:


> Not too surprising. There was a thread about this a couple of weeks ago. I believe it was in the LED forums. Most people direct driving with 3 NiMH won't get the full 2.8A. Instead, they get around 2A because of voltage sag. You'll have to have 4 NiMH to get maximum output.


Is this true even with the newer NiMh with 6-10amp?. I was hoping to DD a P7 but am worried about over driving with 3 NiMh 6or10amp. Hoping I have time to build regulator for 2 or 3 mode. 

Great modding and tips.. :thumbsup:
Thanks
X..


----------



## StefanFS

X_Marine said:


> Is this true even with the newer NiMh with 6-10amp?. I was hoping to DD a P7 but am worried about over driving with 3 NiMh 6or10amp. Hoping I have time to build regulator for 2 or 3 mode.
> 
> Great modding and tips.. :thumbsup:
> Thanks
> X..


 
There has been endless speculation about this subject since people started to:

Direct drive SSC P7 in Maglites or other lights, eg. myself.
Use AMC7135 based drivers to drive SSC P7 emitters.
I can say after extensive experience with both the above that in my opinion it's enough with 3 good NiMH for direct driving an SSC P7 led, preferably *CS**I.* I-bin, vf = 3.25-3.50 V. Direct drive will give you not very good regulation on three cells. I do not think it's a good idea to direct drive on 4 NiMH .

I can also say that it works very well with three NiMH cells (good C or D's or eneloop) and the various AMC7135 based drivers. The lower the vf and the bigger the cells are, the flatter and longer will the discharge curve will be.... It's an especially bad idea to run the multi mode varieties on *four* NiMH as it will get hot and reduce the life of the IC on the multimode driver.


----------



## gunga

Any viable solutions for 2 nimh Stefan?


----------



## StefanFS

gunga said:


> Any viable solutions for 2 nimh Stefan?


 
Not that I'm aware of. You could experiment with low cost boost drivers like the one known as SKU 7882 on DX (or on KD SKU3150) in parallell maybe, with the one level mod. They can deliver up to ~1.3-1.4A each. I don't have wiring for it yet, but I'm experimenting with it. It would be nice since it's a high quality & very efficient driver.
Stefan


----------



## forrest

I've been driving a 3D mag P7 "I" with 3 Tenergy 10,000 nimh direct dr., dhs heatsink, for a month now and couldn't be happier! Quite a long run time and BRIGHT!!!


----------



## Synergic

Hi there!

I have here some final results, testing 3 sandwich made with 2 AMC7135X4 modules.

All the modules are soldered in the same way and working perfectly.I havent removed the diodes.

As i told before in other post,i cant get more than 1.4-1.5 A from 3 eneloops,but as soon as i put another more,4AA,then i get 2.8 A.

Today i have tried it with 3 D size Tenergy 10.000mAh cells,fully charged,and the same results,1.5A.

So this is what i really think:
3 nimh cells can provide an average V of 3.6, the voltage needed by the cxxi emitter for runinng at 2.8A.
The AMC7135X4 modules need a minimun voltage to work,to stay in regultation.I have been searching and i have read the need at least 0.12V to stay on regulation at 3.7V input.So if we apply 3.48V(3.6-0.12) to P7,the forward current will be between 1.5-1.7A,really nearlly to my results.

Im pretty sure that my emitter,modules and batteries(new) are working fine,so im really sure that if you want to achieve maximun power with these modules,you have to use 4 nimh cells.

Also i have read that AMC7135 drivers works fine with any voltage between 2.7 - 6 V,so 4 nimh cells are about 4.8V, pretty good,and that wont destroy the driver if it is well termically protected.
The extra heat comes because of the high current,2.8A.I have tested them with 4 cells are works really good.

So finally,i would say that the better way is using 4 nimh cells or a single lion cell to achieve maximun current on regultation.

Hope it helps.:twothumbs


----------



## X_Marine

forrest said:


> I've been driving a 3D mag P7 "I" with 3 Tenergy 10,000 nimh direct dr., dhs heatsink, for a month now and couldn't be happier! Quite a long run time and BRIGHT!!!


 Wow, I would have feared the 10amp would do damage to the p7. Your saying true DD?, no current limiting resistor at all?. This would be nice for the give aways until we have a proper board available.

Thanks
X..


----------



## TexLite

X_Marine said:


> Wow, I would have feared the 10amp would do damage to the p7. Your saying true DD?, no current limiting resistor at all?. This would be nice for the give aways until we have a proper board available.
> 
> Thanks
> X..


 
Hi X,
DD has worked great for some,while others have had problems with over-current.My suggestion would be to measure the current at the emitter,so you know exactly what is going on.

https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/199152

https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/196030

On the topic of low driver output,this has been discussed in a number of different threads of late,you simply will not get max output with only 3 NiMH cells.You will get more output with 4 NiMH than with 3NiMH,or with one 3.6v cell.This holds true for the Flupic's as well as the 7135 style drivers.
I re-loaded my notebook recently and lost all of my favorites or I would post some links,some threads were in relation to the Tri-Flupic,others were about the 7135 style drivers.I'll try to look later when I have more time.

Thanks,
Michael


----------



## MWClint

Synergic said:


> Hi there!
> 
> 
> As i told before in other post,i cant get more than 1.4-1.5 A from 3 eneloops,but as soon as i put another more,4AA,then i get 2.8 A.
> 
> Today i have tried it with 3 D size Tenergy 10.000mAh cells,fully charged,and the same results,1.5A.




i noticed on a DD w/d2dim+csxoi my current went from 2.2 to 
2.8(single 18650) and went from 1.75 to 2.3amps (3 energizer D nimh) after i modified the tailcap spring. 

basically sanded the top and bottom faces of the spring, coated the sanded faces with solder and then soldered flexible copper braided wire from the top ring to the bottom ring. this really helped to minimize the resistance in the circuit. A nice thing about the D2DIM is that the mag switch is not part
of the power circuit, it's used for mode changes only. you may also have excess resistance in your switch if the main power circuit is run through it.


----------



## RobertM

Stefan,

Thanks for the excellent writeup! I've never modded a flashlight before, but you have inspired me to build one of these. I'll probably need help along the way and have more questions, so please bear with me 

First up...
In looking online for all the parts, I came across this on KD:
 KD Super Output SSC P7 LED Driver Board (Low/High/Middle,5.5V~15V) SKU: S005296  
Would I be able to use it instead of the three boards in your write up?

Second...
Here is my shopping list so far; how does everything look:
P7 HAIII heatsink from H22A 
[email protected] 2D (already have)
SSC P7 CSXOI from KD
Arctic Alumina from 4sevens
24 gauge Teflon wiring

Final question (for now ):
With the above driver from KD, would I be able to just use 2 "D" Li-ion batteries or would I need to use one with a spacer? Also, where/what are good D Li-ion batteries and charger?

Thanks in advance,

Robert


----------



## Packhorse

Anyone know if you could run 2 or 3 P7's in series off one of those KD drivers?


----------



## Edwood

With the 3 board 3amp setup, is it OK to power them up without a load (no P7 LED connected) to test the output before connecting the P7? Would like to test the output with a DMM before so I don't fry the expensive LED.


----------



## StefanFS

Packhorse said:


> Anyone know if you could run 2 or 3 P7's in series off one of those KD drivers?


 
User download has figured out a nice solution to that:
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/201392


Edwood,
I suggest that you measure current in series with the emitter.

Stefan


----------



## StefanFS

RobertM said:


> Stefan,
> 
> Thanks for the excellent writeup! I've never modded a flashlight before, but you have inspired me to build one of these. I'll probably need help along the way and have more questions, so please bear with me
> 
> First up...
> In looking online for all the parts, I came across this on KD:
> KD Super Output SSC P7 LED Driver Board (Low/High/Middle,5.5V~15V) SKU: S005296
> Would I be able to use it instead of the three boards in your write up?
> 
> Second...
> Here is my shopping list so far; how does everything look:
> P7 HAIII heatsink from H22A
> [email protected] 2D (already have)
> SSC P7 CSXOI from KD
> Arctic Alumina from 4sevens
> 24 gauge Teflon wiring
> 
> Final question (for now ):
> With the above driver from KD, would I be able to just use 2 "D" Li-ion batteries or would I need to use one with a spacer? Also, where/what are good D Li-ion batteries and charger?
> 
> Thanks in advance,
> 
> Robert


 
In theory that driver would work very well with two D-size cells. I don't know yet, as soon as I get the drivers I'm waiting for I'll update this thread. 

I use unprotected (and some protected) + charger from KaiDomain, I think they are very good cells.


----------



## StefanFS

TexLite said:


> ......
> On the topic of low driver output,this has been discussed in a number of different threads of late,you simply will not get max output with only 3 NiMH cells.You will get more output with 4 NiMH than with 3NiMH,or with one 3.6v cell.This holds true for the Flupic's as well as the 7135 style drivers.
> ......


 
This is a very subjective subject as it involves a lot of factors! It's easy to say that one will not get 2.8A or 3A from using three NiMH. You certainly won't get full output with small cells like AA or AAA cells, with AA I usually get ~2.3A, but with big quality cells, eg. 8-10000 mAh D size NiMH, output will be up to spec if everything else has been done correctly. Efficiency will be abysmal with 4 big NiMH cells.


----------



## Packhorse

StefanFS said:


> User download has figured out a nice solution to that:
> https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/201392



Excellent, I missed that thread as I usually only look in the homemade and mod threads. 
Although I am still interested if you can run 3 P7s off the KD driver.


----------



## Synergic

Hi there!

Im using 2 modules of 4xAMC7135 to drive a P7.
Right now i have reach 2.85A using 4 eneloops,but Vf in emitter is 3.3V or so.Its that possible?

Thanks


----------



## TexLite

StefanFS said:


> This is a very subjective subject as it involves a lot of factors! It's easy to say that one will not get 2.8A or 3A from using three NiMH. You certainly won't get full output with small cells like AA or AAA cells, with AA I usually get ~2.3A, but with big quality cells, eg. 8-10000 mAh D size NiMH, output will be up to spec if everything else has been done correctly. Efficiency will be abysmal with 4 big NiMH cells.


 
Hi Stefan,
Here are a couple of the links I was speaking of.One is a link to Drewfus' thread testing the 7135 drivers,notice they dont get to rated output until above 4 volts:
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/192925
Notice the jump at 4v.At 3.6v they aren't at their rated output.

The Tri-Flupic is the same way:
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/174715&page=4

This was brought up in more threads,at least four places I know of,but I lost all of my marked threads,and I'm already tired of digging,sorry.

The use of a fourth cell is a compromise at best,without it you wont get full output....but with it,the effeciency is around 75%-80%,until the voltage falls,then it gets better.

I also would like to say this is a great thread,thank you for doing it,and congratulations on post count,over 11,000!

Thanks,
Michael


----------



## StefanFS

TexLite said:


> Hi Stefan,
> Here are a couple of the links I was speaking of.One is a link to Drewfus' thread testing the 7135 drivers,notice they dont get to rated output until above 4 volts:
> https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/192925
> Notice the jump at 4v.At 3.6v they aren't at their rated output.
> 
> The Tri-Flupic is the same way:
> https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/174715&page=4
> 
> This was brought up in more threads,at least four places I know of,but I lost all of my marked threads,and I'm already tired of digging,sorry.
> 
> The use of a fourth cell is a compromise at best,without it you wont get full output....but with it,the effeciency is around 75%-80%,until the voltage falls,then it gets better.
> 
> I also would like to say this is a great thread,thank you for doing it,and congratulations on post count,over 11,000!
> 
> Thanks,
> Michael


 


Michael, I get what you're saying. I don't agree, it's more complicated than that. I started using these drivers a little over a year ago and have used at least 100 drivers to date. Yes, that's one hundred drivers at least... I have been putting them in all kinds of lights with all kinds of batteries or power supplies. A lot of experimenting. I don't want to make this thread into an argument about the various AMC7135 drivers but there are some facts in this that irritates me, and have been irritating me for some time now. This is about the general situation, not the quoted post:
The argument that these are just glorified resistors. They are linear current regulators with exceptional efficiency. It just takes a bit of thought before chosing battery/cell configuration.
The argument that they only provide full output with four NiMH cells. That might be true for AA cells but not for bigger cells that can hold voltage better and supply enough current over time. So with AA four cells might be advisable, but not with C-D cells. I get full output with three D NiMH, for a long time, and I have gotten this in the four? SSC P7 3 D Mags I have built. I also get full output with a big D LiION cell. I get the full 2.4A to the emitter in my various 18650 size mods (Tiablos & MRV's) with outstanding regulation. Overall construction also play a role in this.
It has been obvious that sometimes some have taken a dump on these products for a reason; made in China; or to push other products made in other countries; beause of preconceptions about electronics in flashlights etc.
There has been arguing about these drivers based on AMC7135 for a long time.User TorchBoy has been a voice in the desert advocating these drivers for a long time, with a more technical standpoint that I'm not capable of. Cheers TorchBoy! I have very little knowledge of electronics but I do have experience with this type of driver, and I have a methodical mind.

I ask that this thread will be spared from becoming a battleground over the merits or flaws of the AMC7135 based drivers. Too much space has been taken with it already..

There's a new SSC P7 buck driver on the market from the same designer/factory making a lot of the good drivers from China, a three level pwm controlled 3A driver sold on KaiDomain. I have big hopes for this one, but I suspect it has a low pwm frequency. I'll add a section on them when I get them. They might be more popular since a lot of people seem to like buck drivers.

Stefan


----------



## neilp1

Packhorse said:


> Excellent, I missed that thread as I usually only look in the homemade and mod threads.
> Although I am still interested if you can run 3 P7s off the KD driver.




It looks like the schematics are for the 8 AMC7135 driver, or combinations thereof. From my limited knowledge, i wouldnt want to say a definite yes for that other driver, although i think it would work. Looking at the specs though, the amp tests make it appear its only putting out 2A, instead of the stated 3A. 

I just KNEW i should have bought 3 P7s and a couple more drivers... I havent even finished the single P7 yet and im thinking bigger

Imagine, a Tri-P7 running off a 11.1v 5000mAh Li-ion pack, with adjustable output. Im guessing thatll give an 18w HID a run for its money.


----------



## Packhorse

The specs listed are for the input current not the output current. This is a diffrent type of driver than the 7135 based ones and will not work the same in Downloads circuit.
What I am thinking it that the driver will accept 12v+ on the input so will it output 12v at 2.8 amp. eg 3 P7's in series.


----------



## Synergic

Synergic said:


> Hi there!
> 
> Im using 2 modules of 4xAMC7135 to drive a P7.
> Right now i have reach 2.85A using 4 eneloops,but Vf in emitter is 3.3V or so.Its that possible?
> 
> Thanks


 

Anyone can tell me something about?

Thanks.


----------



## RobertM

StefanFS said:


> In theory that driver would work very well with two D-size cells. I don't know yet, as soon as I get the drivers I'm waiting for I'll update this thread.
> 
> I use unprotected (and some protected) + charger from KaiDomain, I think they are very good cells.



I went ahead and ordered my list of parts. All that is left is to get some Teflon wire. Nobody has any locally; can you recommend an online retailer?

Thanks for all the help!

-Robert


----------



## TexLite

StefanFS said:


> Michael, I get what you're saying. I don't agree, it's more complicated than that. I started using these drivers a little over a year ago and have used at least 100 drivers to date. Yes, that's one hundred drivers at least... I have been putting them in all kinds of lights with all kinds of batteries or power supplies. A lot of experimenting. I don't want to make this thread into an argument about the various AMC7135 drivers but there are some facts in this that irritates me, and have been irritating me for some time now. This is about the general situation, not the quoted post:
> The argument that these are just glorified resistors. They are linear current regulators with exceptional efficiency. It just takes a bit of thought before chosing battery/cell configuration.
> The argument that they only provide full output with four NiMH cells. That might be true for AA cells but not for bigger cells that can hold voltage better and supply enough current over time. So with AA four cells might be advisable, but not with C-D cells. I get full output with three D NiMH, for a long time, and I have gotten this in the four? SSC P7 3 D Mags I have built. I also get full output with a big D LiION cell. I get the full 2.4A to the emitter in my various 18650 size mods (Tiablos & MRV's) with outstanding regulation. Overall construction also play a role in this.
> It has been obvious that sometimes some have taken a dump on these products for a reason; made in China; or to push other products made in other countries; beause of preconceptions about electronics in flashlights etc.
> There has been arguing about these drivers based on AMC7135 for a long time.User TorchBoy has been a voice in the desert advocating these drivers for a long time, with a more technical standpoint that I'm not capable of. Cheers TorchBoy! I have very little knowledge of electronics but I do have experience with this type of driver, and I have a methodical mind.
> 
> I ask that this thread will be spared from becoming a battleground over the merits or flaws of the AMC7135 based drivers. Too much space has been taken with it already..
> 
> There's a new SSC P7 buck driver on the market from the same designer/factory making a lot of the good drivers from China, a three level pwm controlled 3A driver sold on KaiDomain. I have big hopes for this one, but I suspect it has a low pwm frequency. I'll add a section on them when I get them. They might be more popular since a lot of people seem to like buck drivers.
> 
> Stefan


 
I didnt mean to upset you,

I was mearly trying to answer a question that had been asked in this thread with a factual/informative answer.You had not at that point expressed displeasure with the threads current topic of discussion,else I would have had the courtesy to refrain from not posting.

I must say I take offence to even being mentioned in context with this statement,whether it was in reference to my post or not.



StefanFS said:


> It has been obvious that sometimes some have taken a dump on these products for a reason; made in China; or to push other products made in other countries; beause of preconceptions about electronics in flashlights etc.


 
I wont post in your thread again.

Thanks,
Michael


----------



## StefanFS

TexLite said:


> I didnt mean to upset you,
> 
> I was mearly trying to answer a question that had been asked in this thread with a factual/informative answer.You had not at that point expressed displeasure with the threads current topic of discussion,else I would have had the courtesy to refrain from not posting.
> 
> I must say I take offence to even being mentioned in context with this statement,whether it was in reference to my post or not.
> 
> 
> 
> I wont post in your thread again.
> 
> Thanks,
> Michael


 

I'm not upset and I'm sorry that you took offence. It was not directed at you, it was my try to give my view of the actual function according to my experience as well as my observations of earlier events in other threads that deal with AMC7135 chips in some way.

I was afraid that the old AMC7135 war would take over the thread entirely.

You are very welcome to post in this thread whenever you like. 

Stefan


----------



## StefanFS

Synergic said:


> Hi there!
> 
> Im using 2 modules of 4xAMC7135 to drive a P7.
> Right now i have reach 2.85A using 4 eneloops,but Vf in emitter is 3.3V or so.Its that possible?
> 
> Thanks


 
In the datasheet I have seen SEOUL gives a typical vf of 3.3-3.6 Volt. But it sounds really low with your emitter.




RobertM said:


> I went ahead and ordered my list of parts. All that is left is to get some Teflon wire. Nobody has any locally; can you recommend an online retailer?
> 
> Thanks for all the help!
> 
> -Robert


 

I bought some here. 

There's also a shop on eBay, by someone that calls him or herself navships


----------



## Synergic

Hi there Stefan.

I have finished my first Mag P7 mod and im really sad and disappointed.
I have used this:

4D Mag.
4 D size Tenergy 10.000mAh.
2 AMC7135 1400 mA driver modules.
P7 Emitter CSXPI and heatsink from Litemania.

The problem is the runtime, only about 75 minutes,after that current goes to only 0.5A.

I have read that you get more than 2 hours runtime with only 1 D size lion cell of 5000mAh, so...whats going wrong with my mod? 

Hope you can help me.

Thanks in advance.


----------



## StefanFS

Synergic,

that sounds bad. Are you sure all batteries are ok? Are they really ~10 000 mAh? Otherwise I don't know, but it sounds like something is really wrong. If I remember correctly member NetKidz that figured this thing out to begin with got ~1 hour on four measly eneloop cells.

Stefan


----------



## Synergic

Yes,is really weird...

I think the problem is my old battery charger..its only time based...i think my batteries are not fully charged....maybe if i charge it 2 times...i dont know...Maybe is better buying a new charger.


----------



## StefanFS

I got the new SSC P7 drivers sold by KaiDomain:
http://www.cpfmarketplace.com/mp/showthread.php?t=180676

Initial impressions: It doesn't function with one LiION cell, no light. It works well on 6 AA eneloop in a Mag but it gets warm. On 8 AA eneloop cells it's scorching hot. So it might be wise to use it with ~6 Volt. There's no mode memory, next time you turn it on it comes on in the next output level. Output is about the same as the simple 8 x AMC7135 drivers KD sell. I haven't tested output current as I didn't want to risk burning the driver, it's my informed guess from output measurements in my lightbox and throw measurements.

Stefan
--------Edit 080813------------
It has memory, one of the circuits I got has no memory, the others have it, I don't know why. Effiececy is low on low-medium levels with short runtimes.


----------



## Scattergun

No memory sounds crappy... Any way of bypassing the mode-function to make it a one-mode buckcircuit?:shrug:


----------



## StefanFS

Scattergun said:


> No memory sounds crappy... Any way of bypassing the mode-function to make it a one-mode buckcircuit?:shrug:


 
Tjena,

it should be possible with some testing to bypass the pwm-microcontroller chip. But then you get another problem as the driver gets hot and it has thermal protection that relies on the driver being able to shift to a lower output level to avoid burning up. Does it just go out or does the thermal protection fail if the pwm chip is bypassed?

The pwm on the low level is really annoying, the medium level is noticeable but not annoying.


----------



## Scattergun

Tjena!!
Thats too bad.... gotta get another driver, possibly one from Der Wichtel, any thoughts on that one?


----------



## Mike Painter

> Originally Posted by forrest View Post
> I've been driving a 3D mag P7 "I" with 3 Tenergy 10,000 nimh direct dr., dhs heatsink, for a month now and couldn't be happier! Quite a long run time and BRIGHT!!!





X_Marine said:


> Wow, I would have feared the 10amp would do damage to the p7. Your saying true DD?, no current limiting resistor at all?. This would be nice for the give aways until we have a proper board available.
> 
> Thanks
> X..



It is almost a certainty that 10 amps would let the smoke out of a P7.

Direct drive will almost always be a potential problem with a LED, something that has been lost in the ancient halls of history (four years ago?)

I = E/R determines the amperage. R is the sum of the resistance of the source, the wires, the switch, contact points, and the battery. With an incan the source is so much higher than the rest that we can forget them. The smaller R is the higher the current is and at some point something is going to go poof.
A LED has very small resistance so the resistance of everything else must limit the current.

I suspect the thin wire found in some of the cheaper Chinese lights is is a key factor in their design.

So if R of the wires, the switch, contact points, and the battery is high enough you have a happy and long experience with direct drive. If you put together a really neat solution with big wire and good switches, your mileage may be measured in inches.


----------



## Drewfus2101

Those batteries have a capacity of 10,000mAh. Running 3 of them in series would not provide 10A current to the P7. The resistance in the switch and wiring has nothing to do with it. 

I have also run 3 D size NiMH batteries direct driving a P7. It runs great. It is not as consistant or good for the P7 as using a constant current board, but there is nothing wrong with doing it this way. The thing to do is make sure you pick a bin with the lowest Vf. I've dealt with the cheap P7 from DX, and they only run around 1.9A on 3.6V. But the good ones from Litemania run the full 3A at 3.6V.


----------



## Edwood

I'm all set to assemble a 3A P7 Mag now.

Going to make one on a 1C Mag powered by one AW C Li-Ion battery. 

Only thing is the new H22A P7 Heatsinks are flat bottomed, no cavity to be able to attach the boards to. I could make a pill stack out of the three boards, but if I put them flat against the bottom of the H22A heatsink it covers the holes for the wires for the LED. I guess I'll have to make a Spacer out of aluminum or something to give enough space for the wires.

-Ed


----------



## StefanFS

Edwood said:


> I'm all set to assemble a 3A P7 Mag now.
> 
> Going to make one on a 1C Mag powered by one AW C Li-Ion battery.
> 
> Only thing is the new H22A P7 Heatsinks are flat bottomed, no cavity to be able to attach the boards to. I could make a pill stack out of the three boards, but if I put them flat against the bottom of the H22A heatsink it covers the holes for the wires for the LED. I guess I'll have to make a Spacer out of aluminum or something to give enough space for the wires.
> 
> -Ed


 
You could use the version with a cavity and do some dremel work on the pedestal for the SSC P7 to fit. The 'old' heatsinks are more than capable of handling an SSC P7 as they are good at leading heat away to the body/head. Or if you already have the newer version you could drill a cavity if you have drills that big.

Stefan


----------



## Synergic

Synergic said:


> Yes,is really weird...
> 
> I think the problem is my old battery charger..its only time based...i think my batteries are not fully charged....maybe if i charge it 2 times...i dont know...Maybe is better buying a new charger.


 

Hi there again!
I have tried it again charging 3 times my Tenergy batteries with my crappy charger.
This time i got a runtime of 3 hours and 10 minutes at 2.5A.
I cant get 2.8A, i think its because of there is too much voltage in the driver (4 D size batteries)...what do you think Stefan? And is there too much difference between driving at 2.5 or at 2.8?

Thanks.


----------



## rayman

I need some help. I just bought the KD driver board for my Maglite P7 mod but I really don't like that it has no memory mode. Can I use one 5-Mode 1000mA 7135 Circuit Board and 2 AMC7135 1050mA Regulated Circuit Board with 4 Nimhs?

rayman


----------



## StefanFS

rayman said:


> I need some help. I just bought the KD driver board for my Maglite P7 mod but I really don't like that it has no memory mode. Can I use one 5-Mode 1000mA 7135 Circuit Board and 2 AMC7135 1050mA Regulated Circuit Board with 4 Nimhs?
> 
> rayman


 

It does have a memory mode. 
I just happened to get one driver that was damaged in transit. I rewired the others I received and they turned out to have a memory mode, they were wired a bit strange when I got them? Whatever, but now they work as intended. 

It works the other way around compared to the other drivers that are common;
you use it on a level and turn it OFF, after 5 seconds OFF you turn it on again and it's on the same level as before.

That driver works best with 6 AA NiMH or two LiION cells. It's a good and easy solution for driving an SSC P7 to spec in a small package. It has low efficiency on low and medium but it works well enough.

The other solution you mention works too, as long as you don't use cells larger than C-size.

Stefan


----------



## Mettee

stephan,

Thanks for alll your knowledge, I was motivatged enough to get everything needed to mod 4 lights.

I have been following all of this and I am looking for some good wire to use, you seem to know what to use. Can you point me to the right place to get just a small amount I dont need a big roll. There is no place here in arizona to find it....and online to ship it to me is like 10 bucks. maybe there is somebody that can send me a couple feet?

Drew


----------



## StefanFS

Mettee said:


> .......
> I have been following all of this and I am looking for some good wire to use, you seem to know what to use. Can you point me to the right place to get just a small amount I dont need a big roll. There is no place here in arizona to find it....and online to ship it to me is like 10 bucks. maybe there is somebody that can send me a couple feet?
> 
> Drew


 
Thanks,

This guy can sell you some really good teflon wire in smaller amounts and for very little money. He's also quick with shipping.
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/122273

Stefan


----------



## Changchung

Hi, you buy the AMC7135 from DX right? you have some to sell? I dont need 10 pieces...


----------



## Mettee

thanks Stephan,

I will post up some pictures of my final product  Just waiting on my heat sinks.

Oh, quick question....when I mod my mag switch I leave the click feature intact correct? I have seem some that are momentary, I want it to stay on.

And:O what would last longer as far as batteries with your driver/pwm solution...a tenergy rechargable 18650 li-on or 3 tenergy rechargable D size 10000maH ni-mh ? 

Drew


----------



## Changchung

Leave the switch intact...



Mettee said:


> thanks Stephan,
> 
> I will post up some pictures of my final product  Just waiting on my heat sinks.
> 
> Oh, quick question....when I mod my mag switch I leave the click feature intact correct? I have seem some that are momentary, I want it to stay on.
> 
> And:O what would last longer as far as batteries with your driver/pwm solution...a tenergy rechargable 18650 li-on or 3 tenergy rechargable D size 10000maH ni-mh ?
> 
> Drew


----------



## Changchung

_Somebody have two AMC7135??? I dont need 10 pieces..._


----------



## Norm

Changchung said:


> _Somebody have two AMC7135??? I dont need 10 pieces..._



http://kaidomain.com/ProductDetails.aspx?ProductId=1770


----------



## StefanFS

I made two home sputtered reflectors when I started using these SSP P7 Mags. Made from two old standard reflectors and some clear spray lacquer. I used the mildest and least corrosive I could find, one is done with clearcoat for use as a protective layer on DVD-r and CD-r discs and the other is done with Plastic Padding clear high gloss lacquer, cellulose based.

Both reflectors have yellowed and are generally deteriorated after three months of non use, they have been in a drawer all the time. Overall output is low compared to an alu OP reflector from Kai, when new these were comparable to an OP alu reflector.


----------



## Changchung

Norm said:


> http://kaidomain.com/ProductDetails.aspx?ProductId=1770



Thanks...


----------



## Norm

StefanFS said:


> Both reflectors have yellowed and are generally deteriorated after three months of non use, they have been in a drawer all the time. Overall output is low compared to an alu OP reflector from Kai, when new these were comparable to an OP alu reflector.


Just dug a few old reflectors out to check Stephan and they are as good as the day I sprayed them, (would have been around the same time you were doing yours) I used a cheap locally made spray Crystal Clear Acrylic http://www.whiteknightpaints.com.au/product/view/crystal-clear-acrylic
Norm


----------



## CM

Tag for later reading


----------



## rayman

Did anyone tried this reflector? Do you think the P7 will fit in the hole?

rayman


----------



## StefanFS

rayman said:


> Did anyone tried this reflector? Do you think the P7 will fit in the hole?
> 
> rayman


 
Since it's a reflector that works like the stock one it would need to be opened up/drilled and used with a heatsink that has a pillar for the led to work, get in focus that is.


----------



## Scattergun

I have used it together with a H22A heatsink. It needs to be opened to ensure space between reflector and wiring... I used a sharp knife and carved tho hole bigger, since I don´t like using a drill because of all the debris flying into the reflector that way.
This reflector creates a nice hotspot and quite a lot of spill... the hotspot is nearly perfect.


----------



## RobertM

As I type this, I almost have my first P7 Mag built. 

Here is my questions:
How do you tell the difference between the positive and negative terminals on the P7 LED?

Thanks everyone!


----------



## GSteg

Hopefully that helps


----------



## spencer

_The positive side has a small hole in one of the legs.

_EDIT: This is not accurate. The NEGATIVE side has the hole.


----------



## RobertM

GSteg said:


> Hopefully that helps



It helped tremendously! Thank you very much. Now back to playing with my first modded light


----------



## cd-card-biz

spencer said:


> The positive side has a small hole in one of the legs.



Are you sure about this??

I just last week wired up a P7 and I could have sworn the (-) neg was the one with the hole.

Also, as I am holding a P7 in-hand and look at the picture in the post by GSteg, the lead with the hole is (-) negative.

Hate to have anyone damage an expensive P7.....


----------



## spencer

Wow. I should really be more careful in what I type. I'm sorry for this little typo. The NEGATIVE side has the hole.


----------



## Mettee

the one with the hole is the negative yes.


----------



## claustro

I am copying here a pm I sent to Stephen , maybe someone will find this info usefull.Red parts are Sthepen's answer

Hi,
Thank you for you great tutorial !
Anyway I am a very beginner and I need some more help I hope you'll excuse me for bothering you
I modded a maglite 2d for underwater use.

So my setting will be:
2d or 3d Maglite
P7
Kd driver http://www.kaidomain.com/ProductDeta...ProductId=1866
HAIII heatsink
My questions are:

1)I would like to use it with 8 aa battery but I read on your messages that 6 aa will be better, can you estimate me the burning time with 2000-2400 mAh NiMh Battery,?
*About 90 minutes on high, 12 hours on low with 6AA eneloop.*

2) can you suggest me a reflector for a nice beam?
I saw too many on Dx and Kaidomain and I can't decide wich one will be fit better!!
*The best and easiest is the OP one for Maglites:*
http://www.kaidomain.com/ProductDeta...ProductId=1739

3) can you tell me how to wire the driver form kaidomain? 
*Battery negative to the dent in the drivers edge, battery positive to the brass post in the middle of the driver. Led negative to the leg on the P7 that has a hole in it.*

4)Do you think I'll be able to run it continuosly for 1 hour underwater without melting it?
*Yes, no problem.*

Thank you very much for all your help!


----------



## RobertM

spencer said:


> Wow. I should really be more careful in what I type. I'm sorry for this little typo. The NEGATIVE side has the hole.



Luckily, I got it all together from GSteg's diagram before you posted 


*Now I have a problem:*
Everything works great except for one small annoyance...
When running it on high, it only runs for around a minute before the driver gets too hot and it kicks down to medium and then down to low. My P7 heatsink doesn't have the hollowed out hole in the bottom to stick the driver in like the P4 heatsinks have.

Any ideas as to what I can do?

BTW, I'm using the KD Super Output SSC P7 LED Driver Board (Low/High/Middle,5.5V~15V).

Other than that, I love this light! It's freakin' bright and having high/med/low is pretty useful too.

Thanks,
Robert


----------



## StefanFS

RobertM said:


> *Now I have a problem:*
> Everything works great except for one small annoyance...
> When running it on high, it only runs for around a minute before the driver gets too hot and it kicks down to medium and then down to low. My P7 heatsink doesn't have the hollowed out hole in the bottom to stick the driver in like the P4 heatsinks have.
> 
> Any ideas as to what I can do?


 

What is the battery voltage? If used with more than 2 LiION cells or more than 6 AA NiMH this driver seem to get scorching hot really quick.

I have used a piece of leftover graphics card heatsink and cut a piece from that to thermal epoxy to the components that get hot. Then I epoxied that to the P7 heatsink. It runs for the duration on 6AA eneloop without overheating problems.

Something like this:
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/posts/2594847&postcount=57


----------



## vaughnsphotoart

I am inspired to do my own SCC P7 2d Mag conversion... using basically the same setup as Claustro:



claustro said:


> 2d Maglite
> P7
> Kd driver http://www.kaidomain.com/ProductDeta...ProductId=1866
> HAIII heatsink



What would be a good battery configuration to use in this form factor? Mind you, I don't have access to a lathe or mill, so I can't do extensive metal modifications. Should I be looking at 2*18650, or is there a better option?

Oh, and hello. I've been lurking here for several days, and have learned a lot already. You guys are nuts, with some of these mods. I can see I'm going to like this place.


----------



## StefanFS

vaughnsphotoart said:


> I am inspired to do my own SCC P7 2d Mag conversion... using basically the same setup as Claustro:
> 
> 
> 
> What would be a good battery configuration to use in this form factor? Mind you, I don't have access to a lathe or mill, so I can't do extensive metal modifications. Should I be looking at 2*18650, or is there a better option?
> 
> Oh, and hello. I've been lurking here for several days, and have learned a lot already. You guys are nuts, with some of these mods. I can see I'm going to like this place.


 
These drivers (KD super output for P7) are very inefficient and they get very hot even on two LiION or 6 AA NiMH. They work, but that's it.
It's a better solution to use the AMC7135 based sandwiches from the first post and run the 2D with one D-size LiION and one dummy D cell, or 4 AA eneloop in series. That way you will get long stable runtimes and way less heat from the driver. It's easy to make a dummy D cell from a piece of wood and some copper wire to go with the LiION cell, it's also fairly easy to make a plastic tube with 4 AA in series config. You could also run the AMC7135 based one on 3 high quality C NiMH cells with a tailcap mod (deanodized tailcap interior, with lye, and cutdown spring), but with less runtime and slightly less output.


----------



## Mettee

Stephan,

finally got my amc drivers. the ones I got are the 4x7135, i noticed in your pictures of the 3.0A version the drivers only have 3x7135 so I took the 4th one off of mine, is this the right thing to do? Could I have left them? why and why not?

My light is really bright but of course I want more now  Thanks for the awesome tutorial. And to think I only burned one finger soldering those tiny boards oo: ouch.


----------



## StefanFS

Mettee said:


> Stephan,
> 
> finally got my amc drivers. the ones I got are the 4x7135, i noticed in your pictures of the 3.0A version the drivers only have 3x7135 so I took the 4th one off of mine, is this the right thing to do? Could I have left them? why and why not?
> 
> My light is really bright but of course I want more now  Thanks for the awesome tutorial. And to think I only burned one finger soldering those tiny boards oo: ouch.


 
If you do it as I did in my tutorial you get a total of nine, 9, AMC7135 chips of 330-350 mA each. That gives you between ~2900 and ~3200 mA which is just right for the emitter. If you leave all 8 chips on the extension/slave boards you get 11 chips and 3600 to 3900 mA, then you are seriously overdriving the emitter. The output difference in real life will be really hard to see, but runtime will suffer dramatically and heat production will increase greatly. I ran one for a while with 10 AMC chips, it worked but it wasn't noticeably brighter. 

Using 9 AMC chips is just my compromise, output contra runtime and heat production.

/Stefan


----------



## Mettee

All I am going to say is that you rock :rock: I am going to try that out for myself. Thanks a bunch. You just gave me prefectly clear understanding. 


Say I have a J bin P7, I can add another chip since the *Vf bin J: 3.50 - 3.75V? *Is this correct?

Or is that way off, I suppose I can just try it out. I will solder up a few boards tonight.


----------



## claustro

StefanFS said:


> It's a better solution to use the AMC7135 based sandwiches from the first post and run the 2D with one D-size LiION and one dummy D cell, or 4 AA eneloop in series.



I need some clarification.
Can you tell me the differences in therm of Light output and burning time in this cases

- 4 AA sandwiches 2400 20.000 lux
- 4 AA sandwiches 3000 ( is it possible?) 25.000 lux
- 6 AA Kaidomain driver ???.lux

How much lux can produce a 50 W mr16 alogen?
Do you think I'll be able to use a reed contact behind a relè instead a regular switch with this type of drivers?.

Thank you 
Andrea


----------



## StefanFS

Mettee said:


> All I am going to say is that you rock :rock: I am going to try that out for myself. Thanks a bunch. You just gave me prefectly clear understanding.
> 
> 
> Say I have a J bin P7, I can add another chip since the *Vf bin J: 3.50 - 3.75V? *Is this correct?
> 
> Or is that way off, I suppose I can just try it out. I will solder up a few boards tonight.


 
I'd keep to somewhere around spec, ~2.8A, with an emitter with higher forward voltage like a J bin. The more current you feed the emitter the higher forward voltage you tend to get.
--------------------



claustro said:


> I need some clarification.
> Can you tell me the differences in therm of Light output and burning time in this cases
> - 4 AA sandwiches 2400 20.000 lux
> - 4 AA sandwiches 3000 ( is it possible?) 25.000 lux
> - 6 AA Kaidomain driver ???.lux
> How much lux can produce a 50 W mr16 alogen?
> Do you think I'll be able to use a reed contact behind a relè instead a regular switch with this type of drivers?.
> Thank you
> Andrea


 
I'm not sure I fully understand here. The lux figures seem reasonable for throw at one metre with a P7 Maglite. The first runs for a little over one hour, the second 45-50 minutes. The output from the KD driver is a little bit less than from the 3A sandwich and runtime is only 55-60 minutes, I had a notion it would be longer but it's not. That's with C***I bin emitters, with C***J or D***J bin I don't think the numberss will apply.
What you get from a halogen bulb depends on the voltage you feed it. A 12V 50W IRC OSRAM can produce over 5000 bulb lumen if it's being run at 20V, but only 1200 lumen at 12V.
I don't know about the reed switch+relay (but maybe that would likely work best with a one level driver?)

Stefan


----------



## RobertM

StefanFS said:


> What is the battery voltage? If used with more than 2 LiION cells or more than 6 AA NiMH this driver seem to get scorching hot really quick.
> 
> I have used a piece of leftover graphics card heatsink and cut a piece from that to thermal epoxy to the components that get hot. Then I epoxied that to the P7 heatsink. It runs for the duration on 6AA eneloop without overheating problems.
> 
> Something like this:
> https://www.candlepowerforums.com/posts/2594847&postcount=57



I'm running it on 2 D Li-Ion cells from KD. I looked at the link you provided and it looks interesting. Would "attaching" the parts of the driver that get too hot to the bottom of the LED heatsink be a bad idea? I'm guessing that it needs it's own heatsink-of-sorts in the tube between the plastic switch housing and the LED heatsink?

Thanks,
Robert


----------



## Der Wichtel

It seems like the diode can't handle the current peaks on the KD driver.

You can try to replace it with a better diode like the MBRD835L.

It works on my driver pretty good. Maybe the heat and efficient problem can be fixed by replacing the diode :wave:


----------



## StefanFS

RobertM said:


> I'm running it on 2 D Li-Ion cells from KD. I looked at the link you provided and it looks interesting. Would "attaching" the parts of the driver that get too hot to the bottom of the LED heatsink be a bad idea? I'm guessing that it needs it's own heatsink-of-sorts in the tube between the plastic switch housing and the LED heatsink?
> 
> Thanks,
> Robert


 
I don't think so, the driver produces more heat than the emitter in any case. With a massive H22A heatsink....
If in doubt try to mount it on the wall of the tube. It's a better idea to find an efficient driver.

Der Wichtel,
It might improve some to exchange that part and get a better diode, but I'm afraid something or other will be affected in turn.


----------



## Der Wichtel

StefanFS said:


> Der Wichtel,
> It might improve some to exchange that part and get a better diode, but I'm afraid something or other will be affected in turn.



I don't think so. Have a look at this
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buck_converter

It explains pretty good how a buck converter works. So using a better diode with lower Vf will improve the driver. As I understand from the postings before the diode is the only thing that gets hot. 

The diode must be able to handle ~130% of the current that goes through the P7.

I've never seen a diode in that small package with a low Vf that can handle that much current. Only bigger ones in dpak or something similar.


----------



## StefanFS

Der Wichtel said:


> I don't think so. Have a look at this
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buck_converter
> 
> It explains pretty good how a buck converter works. So using a better diode with lower Vf will improve the driver. As I understand from the postings before the diode is the only thing that gets hot.
> 
> The diode must be able to handle ~130% of the current that goes through the P7.
> 
> I've never seen a diode in that small package with a low Vf that can handle that much current. Only bigger ones in dpak or something similar.


 
The driver might improve with a proper diode, what I'm concerned with are the two microcontrollers, especially the one controlling pwm (I know to little about electronics to analyze the driver layout and components though). Also, the inductor/transformer coil and one capacitor get really hot on my drivers. You and I might be able to solder a new diode in a slightly different package on to that driver, but the majority of people buying that driver might not be able to do so. I tried one with 6 AA eneloop and no particular heatsinking of the driver: Shuts down in a few minutes. Not good.

It's this driver we are discussing now:
http://www.cpfmarketplace.com/mp/showthread.php?t=180676

/Stefan


----------



## Der Wichtel

The pwm won't be effected by a better diode.

From everything I hear it seems like the components that were used are a little bit underdimensioned.

The inductor seems to be pretty small. I think the inductor will go into saturation when the current goes up.

So all in all there are 3 things that should be replaced.

The inductor, the diode and the mosfets.

I know that it is not that simple to solder different packages on the board but if there is enough space it is possible to connect them with short wires.

It's just food of thoughts for others that have a little bit more knowledge in soldering and electronics. Maybe KD is reading this and updates the driver :shrug:


----------



## Mettee

Stephan,

In you lights with the 3A driver solution do you notice a high pitch sound coming from the light when in low mode? Do you know if it should be doing that? I am guessing its just the sound the drivers make when they are regulating that much.

drew


----------



## StefanFS

Mettee said:


> Stephan,
> 
> In you lights with the 3A driver solution do you notice a high pitch sound coming from the light when in low mode? Do you know if it should be doing that? I am guessing its just the sound the drivers make when they are regulating that much.
> 
> drew


 
I have four of these. One is driven by 4 C-cells NiMH - no sound. One is driven by one D-size LiION - no sound. One is driven by one D-size LiION and it emits high frequency sound on low and medium. Another is driven by three D-size NiMH cells and no sound. 

So I guess it can emit sounds from the pwm-chip.


----------



## wildstar87

I'm looking at building one of these, and do have experience with the AMC7135 drivers already.

Given that I have 2-1400ma and 1-1000ma multimode, I was wondering if it would be ok to run this all together and get 3.8A? 

The threads that I read, seem to indicate while a maximum of 2.8A is what the manufacturer states, I know I saw testing and comments to say that the P7 seems to handle up to 4A quite happily with decent heatsinking.

Also being multi-mode, I could chose to turn it down as well, so I wanted to find out if anyone has done this setup, and how it has worked for you?

I wouldn't do this if I was building for someone else (I would just remove two of the chips), but I'm not, this one is for me...


----------



## StefanFS

wildstar87 said:


> I'm looking at building one of these, and do have experience with the AMC7135 drivers already.
> 
> Given that I have 2-1400ma and 1-1000ma multimode, I was wondering if it would be ok to run this all together and get 3.8A?
> 
> The threads that I read, seem to indicate while a maximum of 2.8A is what the manufacturer states, I know I saw testing and comments to say that the P7 seems to handle up to 4A quite happily with decent heatsinking.
> 
> Also being multi-mode, I could chose to turn it down as well, so I wanted to find out if anyone has done this setup, and how it has worked for you?
> 
> I wouldn't do this if I was building for someone else (I would just remove two of the chips), but I'm not, this one is for me...


 
Hopefully it can handle 3.8A, for a short while without damages from excessive heat. It'll be brighter but it's going to drastically cut runtime and the light will get really hot quick. There's a question mark on how well the microcontroller will handle it. I have done this with ten AMC7135 chips, and it worked. You are proposing to use eleven. Be prepared that the microcontroller might burn.
Stefan


----------



## Mettee

Thanks for your input stephan, always good. I thought is was funny when it made the sound. 

I think I am going to try a sandwich with one more amc chip, I am curious.

edit to add: I have been using the 3A version of the sandwich with pwm with the 9 amc chips and alkalines, they are still running strong to my surprise. I do plan on running a good ni mh D.


----------



## Changchung

I make that mod to my Trustfire single 18650 flashlight, but when I turn it on and change the driver levels I saw like a fast flash, that happen in all levels and option... That is normal? I replace the driver and circuirt board and the same happen...


----------



## Changchung

Sorry, double post...


----------



## StefanFS

Changchung said:


> I make that mod to my Trustfire single 18650 flashlight, but when I turn it on and change the driver levels I saw like a fast flash, that happen in all levels and option... That is normal? I replace the driver and circuirt board and the same happen...


 
Not normal. I haven't noticed such behaviour in any light I have been using this type of sandwiches in. I'd look for the solution in the switch of that particular light. Test it with another switch or with a piece of wire with the tailcap off. A lot of the budget lights have really lousy switches, few have really good switches.

To me it sounds like your switch will burn soon since it now has to cope with maybe three times the current.


----------



## motia

Hello!

I just built the 2.4 A driver sandwich. 
Well, the P7 gets 1.75 A maximum using one fresh cell (18650 Li-Io, 2400 mAh from DX). "Fresh" means 4.10 V.

If the cell voltage is around 3.95 V LED current is only 1.5 A.

Why don't I get the full 2.4 A? Should I use other cells? 

And - out of curiosity: What's the jump wire for? Why not leave the diodes?


cheers, Matthias


----------



## phantom23

Under such current battery voltage drops noticeably. AMC7135 will drive P7 at full power when battery voltage will be 0,1V higher than LED Vf. If you have P7 xxxxJ bin means it has high Vf and you won't get full 2,4A.


----------



## Changchung

StefanFS said:


> Not normal. I haven't noticed such behaviour in any light I have been using this type of sandwiches in. I'd look for the solution in the switch of that particular light. Test it with another switch or with a piece of wire with the tailcap off. A lot of the budget lights have really lousy switches, few have really good switches.
> 
> To me it sounds like your switch will burn soon since it now has to cope with maybe three times the current.



I do that test first... the same happen...


----------



## RobertM

Alright, I've decided that it's time to cut my losses and get this thing working. I'm willing to ditch the KD driver that keeps getting hot. If I go with the AMC drivers, it looks like I won't be able to use by KD 2D Li-Ion pack because the voltage will be too high (~8.4v). Yes, it's the 2D pack that other forum members have discovered that it's protection doesn't actually work :shakehead

Nonetheless, I've spent many late nights searching on the forums here to find an adequate solution. Since I'm using a 2D Mag, I'd really like to utilize the entire body for added capacity if I'm going to be lugging it around which I've found presents a problem. 1x D Li-ion only uses half the body, and 2x D NiMh doesn't provide enough voltage.

So, how does this sound...
- 3 1/2D NiMh batteries that I found here
- 2 1400mAh AMC1735 drivers found here
- Homemade 15mm D-diameter spacer

Does this seem like a viable solution? Will 3 1/2-D NiMh cells provide enough voltage or do I need to go with 4 1/2-D cells and cut down the spring? If this will work and I go with the 1/2 D NiMh route, who makes the best cells? Also, does anyone have any recommendations for a good quality charger for those? Anything else I might be overlooking?

Thanks tremendously for everyone's help so far (especially StefanFS!)! I'm determined to get my first modded light working reliably 

Thanks,
Robert


----------



## StefanFS

RobertM said:


> Alright, I've decided that it's time to cut my losses and get this thing working. I'm willing to ditch the KD driver that keeps getting hot. If I go with the AMC drivers, it looks like I won't be able to use by KD 2D Li-Ion pack because the voltage will be too high (~8.4v). Yes, it's the 2D pack that other forum members have discovered that it's protection doesn't actually work :shakehead
> 
> Nonetheless, I've spent many late nights searching on the forums here to find an adequate solution. Since I'm using a 2D Mag, I'd really like to utilize the entire body for added capacity if I'm going to be lugging it around which I've found presents a problem. 1x D Li-ion only uses half the body, and 2x D NiMh doesn't provide enough voltage.
> 
> So, how does this sound...
> - 3 1/2D NiMh batteries that I found here
> - 2 1400mAh AMC1735 drivers found here
> - Homemade 15mm D-diameter spacer
> 
> Does this seem like a viable solution? Will 3 1/2-D NiMh cells provide enough voltage or do I need to go with 4 1/2-D cells and cut down the spring? If this will work and I go with the 1/2 D NiMh route, who makes the best cells? Also, does anyone have any recommendations for a good quality charger for those? Anything else I might be overlooking?
> 
> Thanks tremendously for everyone's help so far (especially StefanFS!)! I'm determined to get my first modded light working reliably
> 
> Thanks,
> Robert


 
It's difficult with a 2D Mag if you want perfect regulation. If you are careful it's possible. Use a driver sandwich with either 2.4A or 2.8A and an SSC P7 emitter that has low vf (= C***I or D***I bin that is 3.25-3.50V). Then you do a tailcap mod and deanodize the tailcap interior (with lye solution) and use a cut down spring with three really high quality C-size NiMH cells that can take pretty high discharge, I use a piece of 32-34 mm OD and 26 mm ID PVC pipe as a battery sleeve. This will give you pretty decent regulation and in most cases it will run the led to spec (depends on cells, the led and the general quality of your build).

If you want it to be even better in the 2D form, then buy Der Wichtels buck driver with an additional dimmer of some sort for 'levels' and run it on 6 x Aa eneloop or 2 x D LiION. 

A third choice is to get a cut down 1D Mag, that is the best option in my opinion. I run my P7 1D Mags with either 1D LiION or 4 x AA eneloop in those that are bored out.

/Stefan


----------



## Mettee

stephan,

I have built a few lights now(3d's with 3 D batteries)....what I have is this

The C bin light is noticably brighter than the D bins(exact same set up with batteries and drivers), should this be? Why? I know the D bin has higher "vf" what does that mean to me in lamens turms? 

How can I get the full 8-900 lumens from this D bin? Its not as bright as the C bins at all. 

I mentioned a high pitch wine in one light in an earlier post. Could there be some kind of resistance with my soldering? Or a bad board? Anything you can think of?


----------



## StefanFS

Mettee said:


> stephan,
> 
> I have built a few lights now(3d's with 3 D batteries)....what I have is this
> 
> The C bin light is noticably brighter than the D bins(exact same set up with batteries and drivers), should this be? Why? I know the D bin has higher "vf" what does that mean to me in lamens turms?
> 
> How can I get the full 8-900 lumens from this D bin? Its not as bright as the C bins at all.
> 
> I mentioned a high pitch wine in one light in an earlier post. Could there be some kind of resistance with my soldering? Or a bad board? Anything you can think of?


 
D-bin SSC P7 that are D***J are not really suitable with this setup as they are 3.5-3.75V instead of C/D***I bin that are 3.25-3.5V in forward voltage over the diode.

But it's a bit disturbing what you say, at least initially even the D***J bin should be very bright. It might be another tint and sometimes that looks less bright when it's actually brighter. Maybe you got defective leds? Can you try it with 4 C NiMH and see if that will improve it?

Sometimes the pwm microcontroller emit a high pitched tone with these drivers, not that uncommon with flashlights that have regulation and drivers.


----------



## Mettee

The DxxxJ is very bright, but not at all as bright as the CxxxI....I really can tell a diff. I am going to try to add a 4th cell to my 3D cell light and see what it does.

As you stated before adding another amc chip or leaving one more on will do little to nothing and lesson run time. The DxxxJ wont benefit from the additional chip? 

I wont worry about the high pitch sound then


----------



## StefanFS

Mettee said:


> The DxxxJ is very bright, but not at all as bright as the CxxxI....I really can tell a diff. I am going to try to add a 4th cell to my 3D cell light and see what it does.
> 
> As you stated before adding another amc chip or leaving one more on will do little to nothing and lesson run time. The DxxxJ wont benefit from the additional chip?
> 
> I wont worry about the high pitch sound then


 
I have both CSWOI and CSXPI/CSXOI from the initial bin batch and the XP/XO always seem much brighter than the CSWOI. But with a lightmeter it is the opposite, the CSWOI is slightly brighter, in effect just some ten lumen or so, but it's brighter. So tint may play tricks on the eyes. I also have some D bin and they perform on the same level as my old binned 740-900 lumen C emitters do, no visible difference and about the same on the lightmeter.

/Stefan


----------



## Mettee

I added an additional battery last night just to see what it would do and it did get quite a bit brighter. Nothing seemed to heat up at all. That is one thing that confuses me, everyone talks about heat and my lights have barely ever warmed up. 

Not sure what solution would be to get it brighter permanently but I would like to. Maybe Li-on.

Oh and a bit of info, my LEDs are from phtonphanatic. So I know they are good stuff.


----------



## Mettee

dang double post :duh2:


----------



## StefanFS

Mettee said:


> I added an additional battery last night just to see what it would do and it did get quite a bit brighter. Nothing seemed to heat up at all. That is one thing that confuses me, everyone talks about heat and my lights have barely ever warmed up.
> 
> Not sure what solution would be to get it brighter permanently but I would like to. Maybe Li-on.
> 
> Oh and a bit of info, my LEDs are from phtonphanatic. So I know they are good stuff.


 
It doesn't get very hot because it's a very efficient driver solution, not much power get wasted as heat. I guess you were unlucky enough to get a P7 that had a maximum vf for it's bin, 3.75V. A 3D Mag with four high quality C-size NiMH is a very good solution. 

If you want a good 2D P7 Mag you can go for a buck driver from user Der Wichtel and two LiION D-size or 6 x AA NiMH in a holder from mdocod or fivemega.

Personally I like my 1D P7 Mags best, with one D-size LiION for hours of brilliant light.


----------



## Mettee

Stephan do you run a C or D lion? I was thinking of trying the AW C. I was hoping to try and avoid getting new charging hardware but if the light runs a long time on them and they are bright then why not.

maybe I will try 1/2 D size nimhs too.


----------



## StefanFS

Mettee said:


> Stephan do you run a C or D lion? I was thinking of trying the AW C. I was hoping to try and avoid getting new charging hardware but if the light runs a long time on them and they are bright then why not.
> 
> maybe I will try 1/2 D size nimhs too.


 
I run my 1D lights on D-size LiION (mostly from KD) and I charge them with an RC charger, I use a Bantam B6 clone, there are lots of different ones available and they are really good for my NiMH 4-12 AA battery holders.


----------



## Mettee

I think maybe I will try one of the AW c's or two  I am leaning towards derwichtels very sweet drivers. I think I did the conversion from euro to usd wrong at first so I thought they were way more $$$. My light with your driver solution runs for hours on alks as is. But I want it cut down, not as awkward, and not as heavy. I am understanding this more and more everyday.


----------



## wildstar87

I'm thinking of building a bike light, using an 6V Ni-Mh battery pack from another light system. It's 5 batteries run in series, so at your standard full Ni-MH charge of 1.4v per cell, looks like it would be around 7V.

I'm going to try to base this on a cutdown C Mag, so I guess I can't use Der Wichtel's driver.

I have had success with the AMC drivers, what I'm wondering is this, can I just use an inline resistor to drop the voltage to the driver? I know this isn't the most efficient, but I think it would work ok.

I think the cost/benefit ratio would be that running like a 1-2ohm resistor before the driver would be enough, and very little cost. Much cheaper than having to buy/make a new battery pack, at least until this one is dead.

Is this possible to do, or am I missing something about the electronics that would be affected by this? I have had success at running the AMC drivers at 6V if they are heatsinked, but I do think 7V would be too much.


----------



## StefanFS

wildstar87 said:


> I'm thinking of building a bike light, using an 6V Ni-Mh battery pack from another light system. It's 5 batteries run in series, so at your standard full Ni-MH charge of 1.4v per cell, looks like it would be around 7V.
> 
> I'm going to try to base this on a cutdown C Mag, so I guess I can't use Der Wichtel's driver.
> 
> I have had success with the AMC drivers, what I'm wondering is this, can I just use an inline resistor to drop the voltage to the driver? I know this isn't the most efficient, but I think it would work ok.
> 
> I think the cost/benefit ratio would be that running like a 1-2ohm resistor before the driver would be enough, and very little cost. Much cheaper than having to buy/make a new battery pack, at least until this one is dead.
> 
> Is this possible to do, or am I missing something about the electronics that would be affected by this? I have had success at running the AMC drivers at 6V if they are heatsinked, but I do think 7V would be too much.


 
If you go for a resistor solution you need a big resistor, ~7-8W and 1 Ohm before the driver to drop voltage to around 5V with a P7 that has a forward voltage of 3.25-3.7V driven by AMC7135. A less bulky resistor probably works as well, I'm no resistor 'expert'.


----------



## sactime

Does anyone have a couple 4 x AMC7135's they will sell me?

Using this with 3x D Ni-MH's, how long should I expect it to run until it falls out of regulation?


----------



## StefanFS

sactime said:


> Does anyone have a couple 4 x AMC7135's they will sell me?
> 
> Using this with 3x D Ni-MH's, how long should I expect it to run until it falls out of regulation?


 
Regarding D-cells; it depends on how well they can handle a ~3A load. My best cells give me almost two hours to 70%. NoName 9 Ah cells. A nice green heatshrink sleeve on them..


----------



## sactime

How about 3 Tenergy D cell 10,000MaH Ni-MH's?

http://www.batteryjunction.com/1dni10reba.html

Should I expect at least 2 hours of regulated power with 3 of those Ni-MH's?

Thanks


----------



## StefanFS

Post#1 updated with a runtime test with one D-size LiION cell and DSWOI emitter driven at 3A.


----------



## VegasF6

StefanFS said:


> Post#1 updated with a runtime test with one D-size LiION cell and DSWOI emitter driven at 3A.


 

My apoligies for not reading the entire thream, but where and when did DSWOI come from? That's what I get for snoozing


----------



## Anderssb

The multimode driver is now back ordered at DealExtreme. Is it possible to get it from somewhere else? Or is it possible to use an alternate multimode driver? Will this work: 5-Mode 1000mA 7135 Circuit Board for Cree and SSC Emitters?


----------



## mitch79

VegasF6 said:


> My apoligies for not reading the entire thream, but where and when did DSWOI come from? That's what I get for snoozing


You can get them from AmiLite.


----------



## spd4lifess/sc07

what would be the best driver to use if i wanted to run a 6v 3500mah battery from a magcharger in a 3d setup? should i run with a C***I or D***J led?


----------



## wildstar87

So one thing I've noticed on my multi-mode driver that I'm running with two 1.4A boards, it works just fine when cold, but after the light has been running for a while on the full 3.9A, and the head is HOT, even though the AMC chips seem to be ok with the heat (otherwise they should shut down) the switcher chip doesn't seem to want to switch modes. 

If I power down the light, after a while it will work again. Any one seen this issue at all with theirs?


----------



## wildstar87

They are essentially the same driver, the pic (mode chip) is just programmed differently. Either one will work.



Anderssb said:


> The multimode driver is now back ordered at DealExtreme. Is it possible to get it from somewhere else? Or is it possible to use an alternate multimode driver? Will this work: 5-Mode 1000mA 7135 Circuit Board for Cree and SSC Emitters?


----------



## pulstar

Hi all!


I almost finished reading this thread and i wonder why there is no magcharger p7 mods? Has anyone ever tried this? I have a terralux tle-300mr in my torch and i'm quite satsfied with it(really great output) but i miss stock MCG's focusing ability. is there a chance to quite simply modify this flashlight with 07 and still keep it's focusing ability? Should LED be direct-driven on 6v 3500mah nimh or it need to have a driver? What kind of heatsinking could be used?


----------



## Anderssb

wildstar87 said:


> They are essentially the same driver, the pic (mode chip) is just programmed differently. Either one will work.


Great. Thanks.


----------



## olav

pulstar said:


> Hi all!
> 
> 
> I almost finished reading this thread and i wonder why there is no magcharger p7 mods? Has anyone ever tried this? I have a terralux tle-300mr in my torch and i'm quite satsfied with it(really great output) but i miss stock MCG's focusing ability. is there a chance to quite simply modify this flashlight with 07 and still keep it's focusing ability? Should LED be direct-driven on 6v 3500mah nimh or it need to have a driver? What kind of heatsinking could be used?


 
Hi to you aswell!

And I would like to know if there is any original magcharger with P7 and possibility to use 1x batterypack 6V 5000 mAh Ni-MH? As this "original" I mean that the Magcharger is used rechargable with the way it is meant to be.


----------



## wildstar87

I have never had a Magcharger, but to use the drivers we are talking about, you would at least need to do a resistor drop, because 6V is the max that these drivers can deal with, and they get really hot at that and need to be heatsinked. With rechargeable setup you have, at full charge you are looking probably at 7V, so wouldn't be able to handle that.

Direct drive is not an option in this setup, as the voltage for the LED is anywhere from 3.2-3.7v, obviously 6v would fry this pretty quickly, especially with rechargeables.

No idea if the heatsinks that are available would work in a Magcharger either. Someone else who has both a normal Mag and a Magcharger will have to comment on that.



olav said:


> Hi to you aswell!
> 
> And I would like to know if there is any original magcharger with P7 and possibility to use 1x batterypack 6V 5000 mAh Ni-MH? As this "original" I mean that the Magcharger is used rechargable with the way it is meant to be.


----------



## StefanFS

There's a Mag Charger modding discussion going on here, it seems to be serious enough:

https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/207800

With that kind of power pack you need a buck driver to waste a suitable amount of energy before it reaches the emitter. That's not the point of this thread.

/Stefan


----------



## saphear01

Hi Stefanfs, 
second try now; I somehow killed my other post, at least I can't find it no more  
I've seen both your topics, the MRV SSC P7 and this one here. Comparing your beautiful pictures, it seems that the MRV SSC P7 is at least as strong as the Mag P7, if not stronger, but has a smaller angle? The area in the first few meters of the MRV is not as wide as with the Mag - is that impression correct? 

Which of both got the better energy efficiency? 
And last but not least: Is there any hope of being able to read something about a MC-E mod from you soon?


----------



## DM51

Welcome to CPF, saphear01. 

Your first 2 posts did not "disappear"; they were awaiting moderation. If you read this you will understand why. As they were essentially the same as the one above, I have removed them as double-posting.


----------



## StefanFS

saphear01 said:


> Hi Stefanfs,
> second try now; I somehow killed my other post, at least I can't find it no more
> I've seen both your topics, the MRV SSC P7 and this one here. Comparing your beautiful pictures, it seems that the MRV SSC P7 is at least as strong as the Mag P7, if not stronger, but has a smaller angle? The area in the first few meters of the MRV is not as wide as with the Mag - is that impression correct?
> 
> Which of both got the better energy efficiency?
> And last but not least: Is there any hope of being able to read something about a MC-E mod from you soon?


 
No, the Mag P7 is the stronger one. The MRV P7 has a more intense and smaller spill area, the P7 Mag throws light much better even with an OP reflector. The MRV is more of a 'wall of light type of flashlight' with an SSC P7 and OP reflector. Since the MRV is driven slightly less hard it's marginally more efficient.

I have some premium MC-E M-bin emitters coming and some ideas for both parallell and 2S-2P builds, it's basically a matter of too little time for me right now to do the work that a proper modding thread require.

/Stefan


Edit!












It's on the road! https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/212835


----------



## spd4lifess/sc07

:twothumbsnice...where can i get some of those emitters???


----------



## wildstar87

Well? How does it compare to the P7?


----------



## saphear01

I realized that a little later, thanks DM51  anyone from germany around, who knows wether it's a problem to order from dealextreme? I don't want to pay any other taxes or something, because it takes longer and ordering within germany might even be cheaper...


----------



## sinister

I finally read the whole thread. Great info from everyone esp. Stefan.

I got my P7 from DX. http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.12721 
and I remember someone saying they're not good of a quality as one from Litemania. They cost about the same price did I get ripped off for a lower quality emitter?

Also I am using the same setup and drivers as Stepfan but I'm running this on 9AA eneloops in 3P3S. What are the pros/cons of this configuration?

I will upgrade to a 1D finned mag when I get a job, but as of now I will work with what I have. Thanks in advance.


----------



## RobertM

So I just finished putting everything together. I'm now running 1 AW "C" cell in a 1D body to the P7 emitter via my new KD 2.8A driver.

I fully charged the Li-ion battery and tested the current draw with my multi-meter at the battery -ve and body threads... ~2050mA :sigh:

I've tested it multiple times now and I anywhere from ~1700mA to 2100mA.

Any ideas as to what is wrong? I'm I just overlooking something stupid?

Thanks everyone,
Robert


----------



## Der Wichtel

It's a linear regulator. You need more input voltage.


----------



## StefanFS

RobertM said:


> So I just finished putting everything together. I'm now running 1 AW "C" cell in a 1D body to the P7 emitter via my new KD 2.8A driver.
> 
> I fully charged the Li-ion battery and tested the current draw with my multi-meter at the battery -ve and body threads... ~2050mA :sigh:
> 
> I've tested it multiple times now and I anywhere from ~1700mA to 2100mA.
> 
> Any ideas as to what is wrong? I'm I just overlooking something stupid?
> 
> Thanks everyone,
> Robert


 
I just tested some of my Mag setups with 3A driver sandwiches made like I did in this thread. Battery draw is ~3.15A with one D-size LiION. ~2.75A with one AW 18650 in a 1D Mag. ~2.95A with one DX C-cell in a 1D Mag. ~3.40A with 4 x C NiMH in a 3D Mag. ~3A with 3 x 9000 mAh D NiMH.

I have not bought any of those 2 x 1400 ma drivers from KD, but I have made my own that are similar and they had battery draw that followed the same pattern as the 3A sandwiches I use in this thread.


----------



## adrian belew

I found a constant current source to buy, which looks, as if it was made of the 2 amc 7135 Circuit Boards, like you did this. 

Here is a link to that ccs. 

http://cgi.ebay.de/MINI-Konstantstr...14&_trkparms=72:1229|66:2|65:12|39:1|240:1318

My question: Will I need the third board, you connected, too, to control the constant current source or which is the function of the third board. 

Thank you very much.

adrian


----------



## StefanFS

That will work as it is. With one level only. It's a bit pricey though, compared to the other source. It's all in the number of AMC7135 chips, the one you link to has 8 chips that would give somewhere ~2.8A. What I do (in this thread) is using two single boards with 3 x AMC chips each and connect them to another board with three more chips (and one microcontroller for different levels). Then I get 9 chips and ~3-3.2A.

If you're ok with one level that's a convenient solution.



adrian belew said:


> I found a constant current source to buy, which looks, as if it was made of the 2 amc 7135 Circuit Boards, like you did this.
> 
> Here is a link to that ccs.
> 
> http://cgi.ebay.de/MINI-Konstantstr...14&_trkparms=72:1229|66:2|65:12|39:1|240:1318
> 
> My question: Will I need the third board, you connected, too, to control the constant current source or which is the function of the third board.
> 
> Thank you very much.
> 
> adrian


----------



## adrian belew

StefanFS said:


> That will work as it is. With one level only. It's a bit pricey though, compared to the other source. It's all in the number of AMC7135 chips, the one you link to has 8 chips that would give somewhere ~2.8A. What I do (in this thread) is using two single boards with 3 x AMC chips each and connect them to another board with three more chips (and one microcontroller for different levels). Then I get 9 chips and ~3-3.2A.
> 
> If you're ok with one level that's a convenient solution.




Thank you Stefan for your very fast answer. 

As I don ´t understand very much of electronics I have to ask you if it has any effect on the output of the led if I only have 2.8 A instead of 3 - 3.2A.


----------



## StefanFS

adrian belew said:


> Thank you Stefan for your very fast answer.
> 
> As I don ´t understand very much of electronics I have to ask you if it has any effect on the output of the led if I only have 2.8 A instead of 3 - 3.2A.


 
Not any visible difference, but it's a little less output. It's just a convenient solution using 9 chips, in actual use it's not of any consequence (except a slightly shorter runtime with over 3A).

/Stefan


----------



## Isthereanybodyoutthere

In the photo of the driver that adrian belew made a link to it is hard to see if the bridges are connected or you have to solder them yourself (no big deal )

If they aint the board will not give the full 2,8 amp


----------



## easteurocandler

Hello Stefan and all around this nice thread.
I purchased my first P7 in my life (be happy) and have a "newbie question" to you.
I have at disposal sub-C NiMH GP3300 cells. They can output 30 Amps without any problems in my RC aircraft model. 
The P7 is J-binned.
Is better solution use 3 of these cells DD, or the 2,4 A driver sandwich posted here with 3 (or4) cells?
Thank you and sorry...


----------



## JustinS

I have the same KD 2.8 driver & a D2DIM in my P7 Maglite with a 1 D Li-ion & get the same around 1.9 - 2.1 amps.






RobertM said:


> So I just finished putting everything together. I'm now running 1 AW "C" cell in a 1D body to the P7 emitter via my new KD 2.8A driver.
> 
> I fully charged the Li-ion battery and tested the current draw with my multi-meter at the battery -ve and body threads... ~2050mA :sigh:
> 
> I've tested it multiple times now and I anywhere from ~1700mA to 2100mA.
> 
> Any ideas as to what is wrong? I'm I just overlooking something stupid?
> 
> Thanks everyone,
> Robert


----------



## RobertM

JustinS said:


> I have the same KD 2.8 driver & a D2DIM in my P7 Maglite with a 1 D Li-ion & get the same around 1.9 - 2.1 amps.



Thanks for posting your findings...so it's not just mine. :shakehead This might be the last straw for me with ordering from KD. 

Robert


----------



## StefanFS

easteurocandler said:


> Hello Stefan and all around this nice thread.
> I purchased my first P7 in my life (be happy) and have a "newbie question" to you.
> I have at disposal sub-C NiMH GP3300 cells. They can output 30 Amps without any problems in my RC aircraft model.
> The P7 is J-binned.
> Is better solution use 3 of these cells DD, or the 2,4 A driver sandwich posted here with 3 (or4) cells?
> Thank you and sorry...


 
With four high capacity C-cells in my 3D Mag with the homemade 3A driver sandwich I use I get 3.2A to the emitter. With my 2.4A sandwich and four C-cells I get ~2.6A to emitter. With 4 cells it's overdriven a bit, which is no problem for the emitter. High cap NiMH cells in DD can sometimes deliver too much current.

I recommend to use some sort of driver that set a max current level to protect your expensive emitter. The AMC7135 builds I use are good for that and of good quality. There are a number of other driver solutions available too if you search CPF.

Three NiMH cells in DD on an SSC P7 J-bin will be a ski slope of a discharge curve. Super G...

Stefan


----------



## petfulton

Hey Stefan,

I’m new at this and have a question about your “How to build a high quality, low cost, regulated 3 Ampere driver for your SSC P7 Maglite” I think I understand the connections but not the battery/voltage requirements. I would like to use this driver setup on my 3D cell Maglite with a SSC P-7 running alkaline batteries if it would work. I guess I don’t understand your reference to the “single D” or “3 C cell” term. Please help.

Thanks,

Pete


----------



## StefanFS

petfulton said:


> Hey Stefan,
> 
> I’m new at this and have a question about your “How to build a high quality, low cost, regulated 3 Ampere driver for your SSC P7 Maglite” I think I understand the connections but not the battery/voltage requirements. I would like to use this driver setup on my 3D cell Maglite with a SSC P-7 running alkaline batteries if it would work. I guess I don’t understand your reference to the “single D” or “3 C cell” term. Please help.
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Pete


 
You will get best results from one 4.2V LiION D cell or 4 x 1.2V NiMH C-cells. 3 x 1.2V D-size NiMH cells also work pretty well with an emitter that is D***I bin = 3.25-3.5V.

Alkaline cells are not able to supply enough current to drive the P7 to spec for long, the cells will sag after a while. With Alkaline I recommend you go with a lower current to emitter to conserve power, maybe 2A if you consider using mainly alkaline.

In short, you can use alkaline (eg. 3 x D cells) but you won't be able to drive the P7 to the spec, 2.8A or higher. You get a little less output.


----------



## RobertM

So I decided to do a little experiment tonight. I wired the P7 on its headsink directly to my AW C Li-Ion in series with my Fluke DMM. Direct drive off the freshly charged C-cell, it only showed 1100-1200mA. What is wrong here? Why am I not seeing anywhere near 2.8A? 

Thanks in advance everyone,

Robert


----------



## RobertM

Anybody? :candle:


----------



## Der Wichtel

the forward voltage of your P7 seems to be higher and your dmm has an internal resistance.


----------



## Scattergun

When you remove the DMM the current will rise, but if your LED has a forward voltage of about 4V you will not see much more current even in DD.


----------



## StefanFS

RobertM,

have you considered the fact that the emitter might be faulty. From your description it sounds like that might be the case when you describe the behaviour with DD on an AW C-cell. Direct drivng on an C LiION should be over 3A, even direct driving on an 18650 cell is ~3A. Do you know the bin and origin of the emitter?

That said I have bought emitters from Fred (Photonfanatic), KaiD, Amilite, DX and others and every last emitter has been top notch. A sad fact is that these emitters are sensitive and it's easy to damage them in shipping or in soldering too hot and too long. Or maybe you somehow got a defective emitter with abnormal forward voltage.


----------



## javiole

Hi Stefan, thanks for sharing all the info with us. I've just finished a bike light using a C***I P7 direct drive to three 2200mah 18650 in parallel. The amount of light I get is amazing. So much that the cars flash the full beam lights at me, so I decided to put an on-off-on switch to switch direct driving to 1000ma using one triple acm7135 board. Very nice results. I didn't fancy more modes than two (fast an easy to change). It is pretty much as driving a car at night. Anyway, can you describe a similar graph posted in the first page Update (2008-10-28) using direct drive instead of the 9 acm7135? Would it be very different in term of amount of light and running times?

cheers


----------



## StefanFS

javiole said:


> Hi Stefan, thanks for sharing all the info with us. I've just finished a bike light using a C***I P7 direct drive to three 2200mah 18650 in parallel. The amount of light I get is amazing. So much that the cars flash the full beam lights at me, so I decided to put an on-off-on switch to switch direct driving to 1000ma using one triple acm7135 board. Very nice results. I didn't fancy more modes than two (fast an easy to change). It is pretty much as driving a car at night. Anyway, can you describe a similar graph posted in the first page Update (2008-10-28) using direct drive instead of the 9 acm7135? Would it be very different in term of amount of light and running times?
> 
> cheers


 
Sorry, I don't have such data. But you should see a long ( 1.5 hours?) and pretty flat output from three LiION in parallell on direct drive, after that a long ski slope of lower output as voltage decreases.


----------



## ForeverZ01

I am trying to modify my 4d maglite to use the ssc p7 LED. I am planning on using nimh rechargeables. How would i need to configure my driver boards, how many AMC7135 drivers would i need? Would i set them up like the guide on page 1 of this thread or how else? Would i need any resistors since this is going to be on a 4D platform? I would appreciate the help anyone could offer me.


----------



## StefanFS

ForeverZ01 said:


> I am trying to modify my 4d maglite to use the ssc p7 LED. I am planning on using nimh rechargeables. How would i need to configure my driver boards, how many AMC7135 drivers would i need? Would i set them up like the guide on page 1 of this thread or how else? Would i need any resistors since this is going to be on a 4D platform? I would appreciate the help anyone could offer me.


 
Last night I made two 3D Mags running on 4 x C NiMH and the lights are using the driver setup I call 'How to build a high quality, low cost, regulated 3 Ampere driver for your SSC P7 Maglite' in post no 1. I've been using 3D Mags with 4 x C NiMH for a long time with no ill effects, the driver heats upp some until voltage is down to ~5V. 
So 4 x D should be no problem. Only one way to be sure..


----------



## ForeverZ01

I have ordered my drivers as note in post #1 and i got the drivers with 4xAMC7135 on them. Should i use them like they are or should i remove one of the chips on them when i put them together. thanks.


----------



## StefanFS

ForeverZ01 said:


> I have ordered my drivers as note in post #1 and i got the drivers with 4xAMC7135 on them. Should i use them like they are or should i remove one of the chips on them when i put them together. thanks.


 
That depends on what current you want to the emitter. Without removing a chip you'd get up to 3.8A to emitter, that's a bit much. If you remove one chip on each board you'll get ~3A with four NiMH cells and ~2.8 with three cells.


----------



## ForeverZ01

OK, i see where you are coming from. One more question though, what if i wanted to go with around 2.8 amps to try and get a little more runtime, how would i go about doing that, would i just remove one more chip (removing the q2 and q4 on one board and just the q2 on the other chip) would that work. thanks.


----------



## VegasF6

Each 7135 is good for ~350mA current, so if you parallel 8 of them that should get you in the neighborhood. It doesn't matter how you populate the boards.


----------



## Xanatos

Hello, this is my first mod (and first post here) so please bear with me.

I'm looking to mod a maglite, I have a 2D, will that work for this or do I need a different host? I plan to purchase the P7 here: http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.12721 not wanting to buy the expensive 10pack of AMC7135's from dx, I'm considering a driver from kaidomain or dx. I am wondering what would serve me best, and of course what I would use to power said driver. Here's some I found: http://www.kaidomain.com/ProductDetails.aspx?ProductId=1770 http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.20329 http://www.kaidomain.com/ProductDetails.aspx?ProductId=1866

Also, would this be worth it http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.12229 , or should I modify the stock maglite reflector or what?

Thanks for all your assistance, I'm really excited to do this.


----------



## StefanFS

Of the drivers you list I'd go with the "Regulated CV/CC 5-Mode LED Driver" from DX in a 2D Mag. Power it with 2 x LiION cells, D-size or 18650 (requires spring mod) or a 6AA cellholder with NiMH AA cells from users fivemega or mdocod. The reflector you link to requires some sanding of the upper lip to fit in a Maglite.
You should also fix the head on the Mag as to not damage the dome of the led, head movements could cause damage with that reflector. Epoxy the threads when it's focused correctly.

The driver solution I use in post 1 is more suited for 3 D or 4 C NiMH cells.



Xanatos said:


> Hello, this is my first mod (and first post here) so please bear with me.
> 
> I'm looking to mod a maglite, I have a 2D, will that work for this or do I need a different host? I plan to purchase the P7 here: http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.12721 not wanting to buy the expensive 10pack of AMC7135's from dx, I'm considering a driver from kaidomain or dx. I am wondering what would serve me best, and of course what I would use to power said driver. Here's some I found: http://www.kaidomain.com/ProductDetails.aspx?ProductId=1770 http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.20329 http://www.kaidomain.com/ProductDetails.aspx?ProductId=1866
> 
> Also, would this be worth it http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.12229 , or should I modify the stock maglite reflector or what?
> 
> Thanks for all your assistance, I'm really excited to do this.


----------



## Xanatos

StefanFS said:


> Of the drivers you list I'd go with the "Regulated CV/CC 5-Mode LED Driver" from DX in a 2D Mag. Power it with 2 x LiION cells, D-size or 18650 (requires spring mod) or a 6AA cellholder with NiMH AA cells from users fivemega or mdocod. The reflector you link to requires some sanding of the upper lip to fit in a Maglite.
> You should also fix the head on the Mag as to not damage the dome of the led, head movements could cause damage with that reflector. Epoxy the threads when it's focused correctly.
> 
> The driver solution I use in post 1 is more suited for 3 D or 4 C NiMH cells.



Thank you for your advice and prompt reply. Of those power options you mentioned, which would you recommend and if possible what are the advantages and drawbacks for each.


----------



## StefanFS

Xanatos said:


> Thank you for your advice and prompt reply. Of those power options you mentioned, which would you recommend and if possible what are the advantages and drawbacks for each.


 
D-size LiION cells will give you a longer runtime than 6AA cells in holder. The AA's are easier to find and are safer than LiION cells. I prefer to use low self discharge NiMH AA-cells like eneloop or GP Recyko.


----------



## Justin Case

StefanFS said:


> The driver solution I use in post 1 is more suited for 3 D or 4 C NiMH cells.



Why 3D vs 4C NiMH when you use an AMC7135 sandwich? Less voltage drop under ~3A load for the D cells? Silverfox's tests of some Accupower Cs does suggest that they can hold 1.2V under 3A for about 30 min. Is that enough voltage for the AMC sandwich, assuming an I Vf bin P7? The Ds look like they can hold at least 1.25V for the same conditions.


----------



## StefanFS

Justin Case said:


> Why 3D vs 4C NiMH when you use an AMC7135 sandwich? Less voltage drop under ~3A load for the D cells? Silverfox's tests of some Accupower Cs does suggest that they can hold 1.2V under 3A for about 30 min. Is that enough voltage for the AMC sandwich, assuming an I Vf bin P7? The Ds look like they can hold at least 1.25V for the same conditions.


 
D size NiMH X 3 is OK with LSD cells and an I bin SSC P7. But keep in mind that most of this planet, me included, can't get D-size LSD cells. We can, but at outrageous prices, like buying a new bicycle for the price of three LSD D cells. So for us it's a better option to use 4 C-cells. 

Stefan


----------



## Justin Case

I'm not sure I understand the relevance of LSD cells for the D size. Do the LSD NiMH cells provide better performance/less voltage sag compared to regular NiMH D cells?

Otherwise, it would seem like the battery configuration criterion would be to stay above Vf for as long as possible for good run time, but not so much voltage as to make the AMC7135 sandwich run excessively hot.

Based on that and the NiMH C and D data from Silverfox, it would seem that 3xC NiMH would give about 3.6V under 3A load for at least 30 min, while 3xD NiMH would give about 3.75V under 3A load (perhaps for a little longer than 30 min, and maybe about 50 min to hold 3.6V). I Vf bin is 3.25V-3.50V, so it would seem that either 3xC or 3xD should be fine. Four C or D cells also look fine, but if the extra cell is not necessary, then I'd probably go with 3 cells.

Is the voltage recovery different between C and D NiMH, which might be important for real-world usage where you turn the flashlight on and off frequently during use?

Regarding price, at least in the US, I see plenty of Internet sources for Accupower and other brands of NiMH C and D cells at about $5-$10 per cell.


----------



## Xanatos

Unfortunately I ordered some 18650's before your reply. You mentioned something about a spring mod to make them work, can you elaborate?


----------



## 737mech

Hi Stefan, Thanks for this write up. This is going to be my first DIY flashlight mod. I ordered those driver boards from DX, 3 P7 emmitters, 3 heat sinks, wire, and have 3 3D mag hosts. Once everything arrives I will get started. One question I have is on connectiong th drivers together. Do I need to remove the diode on the slave and replace it with a jumper? I am just a bit confused on all those connections and making sure I get them right.


----------



## StefanFS

Xanatos said:


> Unfortunately I ordered some 18650's before your reply. You mentioned something about a spring mod to make them work, can you elaborate?


 
Deanodize the interior of the tailcap with lye solution (drain cleaner/sodium hydroxide and hot water. Careful as it's toxic and dangerous to get on skin or in eyes) or sand the anodizing until you get bare metal. Cut and shape the spring so it fits in the bottom of the tailcap, I'll try to get a pic up.

--------------------------
Justin Case, 
I have noticed that three D-size NiMH manage to hold up under load much better than three C-size, that's where the 4 x C idea comes from, to stay in regulation longer. A contributing factor is also the arguing and bickering that's been going on at times about these drivers and how to use them correctly. You also need to factor in real world losses in wiring-switch-drivers-solder points etc. A standard GP 9000 mAh D cell (not LSD) would set me back ~$22 per cell here. Sure I can order from eg. the US but shipping and fees make it about as expensive, D cells are heavy. The goal is as you say to keep above the emitter vf, at a reasonable cost for the cells.
---------------------------
737mech,
not really necessary. I remove all diodes to get that last 0.15V or whatever it is, there are some different figures on what the diode really do to the setup. If you remove all the diodes you lose the reverse voltage protection. But the multimode driver board also have the protection diode if you do a multimode setup, so why leave the diodes on the attached board/s with the extra AMC chips?


----------



## Justin Case

Originally, it appears you had to modify (grind away some centering ribs, enlarging the holes for the wires, etc) an existing P4 heat sink to use for the P7 since dedicated P7 sinks didn't exist at the time.

When I look at the various sinks now available (e.g., LiteMania) for both P4 and P7 emitters, it seems that the pedestals for the P7 heatsinks are taller than for the P4 sinks. Did you find this to be any problem when you modified your P4 heatsink?


----------



## StefanFS

Justin Case said:


> Originally, it appears you had to modify (grind away some centering ribs, enlarging the holes for the wires, etc) an existing P4 heat sink to use for the P7 since dedicated P7 sinks didn't exist at the time.
> 
> When I look at the various sinks now available (e.g., LiteMania) for both P4 and P7 emitters, it seems that the pedestals for the P7 heatsinks are taller than for the P4 sinks. Did you find this to be any problem when you modified your P4 heatsink?


 
No that's never been a problem. They seem to be about the same height, all of them (or rather high enough). The only problem have been when I adapt P7 heatsinks to use MC-E by taking off material from the pedestal. I mainly use heatsinks sold by H22A, but I've used a few others as well.


----------



## Justin Case

Thanks. I went ahead and filed off the centering ridge on my 4sevens P4 CMag heat sink and glued on a DSW0I-bin P7 using Arctic Alumina epoxy (I would have considered Arctic Silver, but removing the centering ridge exposed bare aluminum).

4sevens P4 CMag heat sink on the right, P7 DMag heat sink on the left.






P7 glued onto the P4 heat sink. I used 24 gauge wire, which barely fits past the P7.










The result.


----------



## ashrakki

Hi,

Need some help with the drivercombos, I cant get more than 1.5-1.6A from fresh 18650 (blue trustfire). I tried the first page 1A driver + 1400mah driver sanwitch, no more than the 1.6A. Then I tried 2x 1400mah drivers in parallel (diodes removed), again 1.6A max. Is it even possible to get more than 1.6A from single 18650 lion cell? thanks

Driver is DX's 5mode 7135 driver, the "new model" (check thread https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/228939)
1400mah chips, are also new, but I think that exactly same than the old blue ones.
Led is from KD P7 "CSXOI"

Is only option to buy some D lions?


----------



## StefanFS

ashrakki said:


> Hi,
> 
> Need some help with the drivercombos, I cant get more than 1.5-1.6A from fresh 18650 (blue trustfire). I tried the first page 1A driver + 1400mah driver sanwitch, no more than the 1.6A. Then I tried 2x 1400mah drivers in parallel (diodes removed), again 1.6A max. Is it even possible to get more than 1.6A from single 18650 lion cell? thanks
> 
> Driver is DX's 5mode 7135 driver, the "new model" (check thread https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/228939)
> 1400mah chips, are also new, but I think that exactly same than the old blue ones.
> Led is from KD P7 "CSXOI"
> 
> Is only option to buy some D lions?


 
You need better cells. I tested one of my 1D with 3.2A driver with the following cells:

AW 18650 new: 2.3A
Grey Trustfire 18650: 1.94A
KD D LiION unprotected: 3.2A
4 x eneloop in fm holder: 3.14A
3 x eneloop in holder 2.5A

So with an 18650 cell that works best with lower current draw applications your numbers are reasonable. 

The new multi mode drivers work the same way, they're only somewhat redesigned, I use the 2 level variety (sold by KD).

Other options that should take a high current draw are IMR and emoli cells. The SSC P7 and MC E emitters are demanding.


----------



## ashrakki

StefanFS said:


> You need better cells. I tested one of my 1D with 3.2A driver with the following cells:
> 
> AW 18650 new: 2.3A
> Grey Trustfire 18650: 1.94A
> KD D LiION unprotected: 3.2A
> 4 x eneloop in fm holder: 3.14A
> 3 x eneloop in holder 2.5A
> 
> So with an 18650 cell that works best with lower current draw applications your numbers are reasonable.
> 
> The new multi mode drivers work the same way, they're only somewhat redesigned, I use the 2 level variety (sold by KD).
> 
> Other options that should take a high current draw are IMR and emoli cells. The SSC P7 and MC E emitters are demanding.



So, can we make some conclusions that grey trustfires are better than blue ones? Just thinking, that just under 2A could be enough for ultrafire C2 P7 mod. Or AW's for that mod.:candle:

But anyways, thanks a lot Stefan. The problem is the battery, not my solderings etc. :thinking:


----------



## ForeverZ01

I FINALLY got my drivers in and set everthing up and had it all working and then i think i touched the aluminum reflector on both contacts of the led and then there was smoke. It burned a wire that went from the battery negative on the multimode driver to the battery negative on the slave sandwich. I replaced the wire and now all i get is low power, the different modes arent working anymore. Should i just forget the multimode and set up a sandwich running 2.8 amps and just run with that or should i order another multimode driver and wait another two weeks for it to come from hong kong, Please Help. thanks


----------



## StefanFS

ForeverZ01,

That depends on what you plan to do with your light, but a one level light works well enough... About multimode check my pm.


----------



## ashrakki

StefanFS said:


> You need better cells. I tested one of my 1D with 3.2A driver with the following cells:
> 
> AW 18650 new: 2.3A
> Grey Trustfire 18650: 1.94A
> KD D LiION unprotected: 3.2A
> 4 x eneloop in fm holder: 3.14A
> 3 x eneloop in holder 2.5A
> 
> So with an 18650 cell that works best with lower current draw applications your numbers are reasonable.
> 
> The new multi mode drivers work the same way, they're only somewhat redesigned, I use the 2 level variety (sold by KD).
> 
> Other options that should take a high current draw are IMR and emoli cells. The SSC P7 and MC E emitters are demanding.




Ok, I tryed with KD protected D lion (3.98V). Mesured only 1.35A at tailcap. :thinking: I think that is time to check my solderings, can someone mark the solderin points for the 2.4A config with new 5 mode driver board? thanks!

Like this:






And here is with new board. Someone please complete this. Thanks! 





Edit: Is this right?

I just tested with fullycharged (4.23V) D lion and only 1.7A. :/


----------



## 737mech

Just got done making this light with the 16 mode driver board in the link. The board was laid out a bit differently than the one originally posted but I was able to figure out the connections by looking at the pictures here. My light works but not like the instructions. The instructions for the driver are "*To switch mode*, stay in any mode for no more than 2 seconds then switch off. The next time the light is turned on it will enter the next mode." My light will not switch modes like this. I have to repeatedly press the switch on and off a few times to get to the mode I want (low, med, or high). I can get it to change mode groups no problem. It works just like its supposed to if I dont press the switch all the way in before it clicks. Any thoughts?


----------



## 737mech

Nobody has any suggestions?


----------



## StefanFS

ashrakki,

your connections look good. It should not matter, but just to rule it out, switch the connection from + on the slave board to the AMC chip marked 35E on your multimode driver.
---------------------------------------------------------------​ 
737mech,

not sure what you mean, sounds like how my drivers work. Steps through the levels. Does it remember the level if you have it on for more than 2 sec?


----------



## 737mech

No it does not remember the level. Thats just it, I never know what level its going to be on.Here is the results of my light turned on waiting 6-7 seconds then turned off then back on 20 times.
1.low
2.low
3.med
4.med
5.high
6.med
7.high
8.med
9.med
10.low
11.low
12.high
13.low
14.low
15.med
16.high
17.low
18.med
19.high
20.low

see what I mean? It's just random. Any help would be great.


----------



## StefanFS

737mech,
nothing to do. Contact the seller for replacement. Strange, I never had any problems with the AMC based drivers. I think the programming is off in your specimen.


----------



## ashrakki

StefanFS said:


> ashrakki,
> 
> your connections look good. It should not matter, but just to rule it out, switch the connection from + on the slave board to the AMC chip marked 35E on your multimode driver.
> ---------------------------------------------------------------​



I did that and there was no difference. Again 1.7A max with D lion and even TR18650 I get about 1.6A. * Can Emitter Bin do something like that if its "J"?* Although I ordered CxxxI bins from Kai... 

Here is pic, but I really think that the problem isnt my solderings, because I tested with 2x1400mah boards parallel and same 1.7A. 
wtf. Has anybody seen anything like that? :duh2: Help Needed. 





And there isn't any bridges, checked that...


----------



## 737mech

StefanFS said:


> 737mech,
> nothing to do. Contact the seller for replacement. Strange, I never had any problems with the AMC based drivers. I think the programming is off in your specimen.


Thanks for your help. I have 4 of these 16 mode drivers and I just tried another one with the same results. Like I said they are a bit different in layout. Here is a picture. Maybe someone can help me with how to wire the newer style driver since its different than the ones in post #1.


----------



## Xanatos

Still waiting on DX for my emitter and driver (they are being even slower than usual, 4 weeks and still haven't even shipped).

When I get my stuff though I'll try to post pics.

I'm still not sure about how exactly I should do the spring mod.


----------



## ashrakki

ashrakki said:


> * Can Emitter Bin do something like that if its "J"?* Although I ordered CxxxI bins from Kai...


Plz, someone?

Or then My the protected D lion is piece of crap. Cant imagine anything else. Stefan, what KD D lions you have? Protected or unprotected?

E: ah, new page.


----------



## StefanFS

Xanatos said:


> Still waiting on DX for my emitter and driver (they are being even slower than usual, 4 weeks and still haven't even shipped).
> 
> When I get my stuff though I'll try to post pics.
> 
> I'm still not sure about how exactly I should do the spring mod.


 
For the spring/tailcap mod, see post #1 as I added this to the end of that post.

----------------------------------------​ 
ashrakki and others here,

I'm checking the apparent driver problem, I have some of the new varieties with the Atmel PIC. Please keep cool, it may take a few days. Could be programming.

----------------------------------------​ 
ashrakki,

I have all kinds and colours that they have sold. I don't think this is about your cells. And it's not about the binning either, that would be really strange. The C bins you ordered are from the first binning so they tend to perform as the current D bin, at least the ones I got from that source are good for D bin performance.


----------



## sn0wBLiND

Those black protected D-cells seem to either work or die completely, one protection circuit on the two cells I have would not accept charge at all after a few charges, after removing the PCM it works just fine.
I just have to be really careful when using them 

And thanks for the great tutorial, StefanFS.


----------



## StefanFS

Ok,

I have tested all the new varieties of multimode drivers I have. 2 mode with one unpopulated AMC7135 position and Atmel PIC, new 16 mode with Atmel chip, new 5 mode with Atmel PIC. They all check out, up to spec.

Here's a pic of one of my 1A drivers with Atmel PIC and one extra AMC7135 chip to make it 1.4A. It even outperforms it's own spec considering the extra resistance of the multimeter:








*Update. New wiring pics with one of the new driver variations in end of post #1.*


----------



## ashrakki

Hmm, I tried DD the Led, got little more amperage, about 1.7A. Again I used the D lion (4.18V). What hell can be wrong. :duh2:


----------



## sn0wBLiND

Do all the dies get lit? A welding mask is very useful if you need to look directly into the p7.


----------



## ergotelis

ashrakki said:


> Hmm, I tried DD the Led, got little more amperage, about 1.7A. Again I used the D lion (4.18V). What hell can be wrong. :duh2:



I had the same problem, even though i had a DSWOI bin P7. I saw that the problem was the small cables,they had enough resistance.


----------



## StefanFS

ergotelis said:


> I had the same problem, even though i had a DSWOI bin P7. I saw that the problem was the small cables,they had enough resistance.


 
I always presume that people use adequate wire. With good silver coated teflon wire or other high quality wire it's possible to use very thin gauges with the currents used in these P7 Mag mods. For resistance from even medioker wire to have an impact I think very long pieces would have to be used, not a few decimeter in total. However, this problem isn't new as there have been difficulties reported now and then with these builds. I have helped some to resolve it, others never got it right and gave up. I have used several hundred of these driver boards in about ten or twelwe different builds and configurations without incident, mostly with 24 or 26 gauge wire and with currents up to 8-9A in total. 
About this particular case of ashrakki's build I just don't know why it's not working. I'd have to see it/measure it physically to give an opinion.


----------



## ergotelis

If it isn't made clear, when i say small cables, i mean small in diameter!I used some fatter cables and now it works better!


----------



## T_A_X

Hey there everyone, Im new to modding, infact havent done one yet but i have a 3C and 3D mag that i would love to put together. Reading Stefan's stuff is amazing! If i can get some info as to where i can purchase the P7 SSC and heatsinks as well as the reflectors (if i need to buy a new reflector?im not sure?) that would be awesome. Stefan do you have a step by step post that i could read? Thanks in advance! PS: i seen that i can purchase the LED on litemania.com (but its korean). I also seen it in extremedeal.com . any suggestions would be appreciated!
I'm chris by the way.


----------



## 737mech

Welcome! Hope this helps, all these are US sellers...
user photonfanatic has P7 leds
http://www.photonfanatic.com/ComponentsFS.html
user FiveMega has aluminum reflectors
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/207494
4sevens.com has heatsinks and P7's
https://www.4sevens.com/index.php?cPath=25&osCsid=2072bc2699f8f78915de4760ae183442


----------



## Justin Case

For other heat sinks besides the 4sevens.com product, do a CPF search for H22A and britelumens. You've apparently already found LITEmania. For English, search the CPF Marketplace Dealer's Corner for his ads.

LITEmania also sells P7 emitters.

If you plan to use AA NiMH cells in your 3D Mags, check out the AA to D holders from FiveMega and mdocod on CPF.

Kaidomain sells both a smooth and an orange peel finish metal reflector for the Mag (get the 15mm opening reflector, not the 8.3mm opening).

However, the stock smooth Maglite reflector provides an adequate beam quality with the P7 when you focus the beam to its optimum. It won't be perfect on a white wall, but against any real-world background, you will never notice any defects. If you get the Kaidomain orange peel reflector to clean up the minor defects, the beam will look excellent when focused, but you will sacrifice beam intensity in the hot spot when compared to the smooth Mag reflector. If you defocus the beam thinking you will get more of a flood, you will get a donut hole in the center of the beam.

Kaidomain also sells a pack of glass windows for the Mag for a very low price. Alternatively, flashlightlens.com sells glass windows for about $6 and change. You have a choice of borosilicate or ultraclear float glass.


----------



## ashrakki

StefanFS said:


> I always presume that people use adequate wire. With good silver coated teflon wire or other high quality wire it's possible to use very thin gauges with the currents used in these P7 Mag mods. For resistance from even medioker wire to have an impact I think very long pieces would have to be used, not a few decimeter in total. However, this problem isn't new as there have been difficulties reported now and then with these builds. I have helped some to resolve it, others never got it right and gave up. I have used several hundred of these driver boards in about ten or twelwe different builds and configurations without incident, mostly with 24 or 26 gauge wire and with currents up to 8-9A in total.
> About this particular case of ashrakki's build I just don't know why it's not working. I'd have to see it/measure it physically to give an opinion.



I used wire from DX's jst cables set, (http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.15234) That could be the reason indeed. Just ordered some teflonwire (gauges 20&26), lets see how it works. 
Anyways, thanks a lot stefan for all the help and the awesome thread. :candle:


----------



## fxstsb

I have built one 3D maglite with a P7. It has no regulator and seems to work fine. I am getting ready to build another 3c P7. Has anyone had a problem running the P7 (D coding) with 3 c batteries?


----------



## sami_voodoo

fxstsb said:


> I have built one 3D maglite with a P7. It has no regulator and seems to work fine. I am getting ready to build another 3c P7. Has anyone had a problem running the P7 (D coding) with 3 c batteries?



There was a bit of a discussion on direct drive P7 Mags in this thread:

https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/227077

You might find something of interest. On a side note, It's the last character of the LED bin that you're looking for. If I'm not mistaken, J-bins are 3.5 to 3.75 Vf while I-bins are 3.25 to 3.5 Vf. The first character, which will be C or D will give you the lumen output range.

I hope this helps!
Sami


----------



## Eirik

hi.
where can i get the AMC7135 VDD leg?


----------



## StefanFS

Eirik said:


> hi.
> where can i get the AMC7135 VDD leg?


 
Here is the pdf data sheet:
http://www.micro-bridge.com/data/ADD/AMC7135.pdf


----------



## Eirik

:thumbsup: thx


----------



## powerup93

I have a question about the amc7135 chips that I couldn't quite get an answer for.

I wanted to see how hot my mag would be on full power in my setup:
1xP7
Shiningbeam's MCE/P7 board sku#1217 (8xamc7135 and an atmel pic)
4xC NIMH

And after about ~25min it started to blink the led moderately like on/off/on/off/etc.... then seemed to drop to a lower brightness/output.

Is that thermal heat protection or low battery warning? Another cpf thread said it was too much voltage???


----------



## StefanFS

powerup93 said:


> I have a question about the amc7135 chips that I couldn't quite get an answer for.
> 
> I wanted to see how hot my mag would be on full power in my setup:
> 1xP7
> Shiningbeam's MCE/P7 board sku#1217 (8xamc7135 and an atmel pic)
> 4xC NIMH
> 
> And after about ~25min it started to blink the led moderately like on/off/on/off/etc.... then seemed to drop to a lower brightness/output.
> 
> Is that thermal heat protection or low battery warning? Another cpf thread said it was too much voltage???


 
With the builds I use (I have no experience of the specific driver you mention, although I have used AMC7135 based multimode drivers with an Atmel PIC to build sandwiches) there have been no oscillations from overheating or too high voltage. 4 NiMH cells should be OK.


----------



## Sig32

I would like to try this mod with my 2D maglite and I have some newbie (first mod ever) questions, so please bare with me. 

1. How do you specify the bin "D or C" that you want? 
2. I saw for power options that I can do 1D LiIon or 4C NiMH. Are 
they regular size C batteries?
3. If I opted for the 1D version I noticed that both wires from the 
battery get soldered. How does one recharge the battery?

Thanks for the assistance as I am sure I will need additional.


----------



## wildstar87

Others have had different experience, but in my experience with you are running 6v to these, they get HOT quickly, and they will start flickering, my guess is it's the shutdown circuit tripping possibly. If you heatsink them it goes away. However doing a heatsink with that driver would be a little bit harder, because of the dual-sided nature of it. You could probably do it if you unsoldered the spring on the battery side.

When running around 4.5-3.7 volts, I haven't seen them flicker, because they are more efficient and the forward voltage is much closer and they don't have to burn away as much through heat.



powerup93 said:


> I have a question about the amc7135 chips that I couldn't quite get an answer for.
> 
> I wanted to see how hot my mag would be on full power in my setup:
> 1xP7
> Shiningbeam's MCE/P7 board sku#1217 (8xamc7135 and an atmel pic)
> 4xC NIMH
> 
> And after about ~25min it started to blink the led moderately like on/off/on/off/etc.... then seemed to drop to a lower brightness/output.
> 
> Is that thermal heat protection or low battery warning? Another cpf thread said it was too much voltage???


----------



## StefanFS

I have no experience with the driver sold by Shiningbeam and others, the 8 x AMC7135 on one board. But I have read somewhere that it is limited to 2.5A output.

The different AMC7135 based drivers I have used so far can handle 4 x C NiMH cells, that's 5.6V hot off the charger and considerably less under load. But over 6V there will be problems after a while.

Sig32,

The drivers will work pretty ok with 3 x C NiMH in a 2D (36 mm pvc pipe + tailcap and spring mod) and a low vf emitter. It even works ok with 3 x C alkalines in a 2D with reduced output. Or it will give you an hour on 4 x AA in a 2D (homemade batteryholder/pack), 90 minutes plus with one D LiION and a spacer. Or get another type of driver and run it on two LiION cells. The variations are limitless...

I have good experience from Photonfanatic in the "Marketplace" and Amilite.co.kr for D***I emitters. Personally I like DSWOI for it's very pure white output and low forward voltage, the I on the end. Photonfanatic sell DSVNI emitters, a good alternative for a warmer tint. C bin, eg. C***I, sold now have lower output.


----------



## Sig32

Stefan, Thanks for the reply. I am interested in a multimode light 3 modes max using the 3xC NiMH. Would I use the AMC7135 sandwich setup or just a driver and slave setup? Again sorry if these are obvious questions I really am a newbie and I am still trying to understand all of this. Thanks again, can't wait to start shopping.


----------



## StefanFS

Sig32 said:


> Stefan, Thanks for the reply. I am interested in a multimode light 3 modes max using the 3xC NiMH. Would I use the AMC7135 sandwich setup or just a driver and slave setup? Again sorry if these are obvious questions I really am a newbie and I am still trying to understand all of this. Thanks again, can't wait to start shopping.


 
For a full 2.8A drive I recommend a 2 level board with an extension board or boards depending on version shipped. Kai has them. That requires top quality cells and a low vf emitter.


----------



## Sig32

Stefan, Thanks again for the info. If time allows, could you PM or email me as I have some more specific questions? I sure could use your guidance with my mod.


----------



## 9x23

Stefan,

Thanks for all of the information you've provided. It has been a great source of information in the build of my P7s. I have a few questions for you related to heatsinking of these drivers. 

Do you heatsink these drivers and if so, what do you do for heatsinking? I planned to epoxy my driver to the inside body of the light but decided to test in "free air" before final assembly of the light. I am running a 2-mode @1400 + a 1400 slave for a total of 2.8a. I wired everything together but left the driver boards (mounted back-to-back with chips out & potted with artic alumina on chips) and P7/heatsink on my desk and powered up with 4AA Eneloops to see how hot the driver board gets. After about 15 seconds on high, parts of the driver board already reached approximately 53C and still rising so I turned it off. I am now considering using a heatsink such as the Sharksink from the Shoppe in order to maximize removal of heat from the drivers, but would like to hear your thoughts and experience related to this. 

Thanks!

9x23


----------



## StefanFS

9x23 said:


> Stefan,
> 
> Thanks for all of the information you've provided. It has been a great source of information in the build of my P7s. I have a few questions for you related to heatsinking of these drivers.
> 
> Do you heatsink these drivers and if so, what do you do for heatsinking? I planned to epoxy my driver to the inside body of the light but decided to test in "free air" before final assembly of the light. I am running a 2-mode @1400 + a 1400 slave for a total of 2.8a. I wired everything together but left the driver boards (mounted back-to-back with chips out & potted with artic alumina on chips) and P7/heatsink on my desk and powered up with 4AA Eneloops to see how hot the driver board gets. After about 15 seconds on high, parts of the driver board already reached approximately 53C and still rising so I turned it off. I am now considering using a heatsink such as the Sharksink from the Shoppe in order to maximize removal of heat from the drivers, but would like to hear your thoughts and experience related to this.
> 
> Thanks!
> 
> 9x23


 
Somtetimes I use a simple U-shaped piece of metal plate that I bend so the driver fits and glue it to the emitter heatsink or the tube. Other times I just attach the drivers with glue to the emitter heatsink if it is the hollow type. You could also use leftover heatsinks from old computer parts and cut to shape. I have used AA, but mostly softer thermal glue products, eg. Fujik thermal glue, with very good results.


----------



## ti-force

Okay guys, is this the right way to wire my multi-mode driver to my sandwich? I plan to wire for the 3A version, using 1- multi-mode driver and 2- AMC7135 drivers. Here's a pic:


----------



## Fulgeo

Just purchased a Fluke 179 multimeter and was playing around with it and wanted to share my P7 results. My first P7 built about a year ago is a 3D Teal Mag, H22A P7 heatsink, 8 x AMC7135 driver, CSXOI P7 and driven with 3 AccuEvolution LSD 10,000 mAh NiMH D cells. I used Arctic Alumina thermal adhesive to attach the emitter to the heatsink and the heatsink to the body of the flashlight. For wire I used scavenged wire from old RS232 serial computer cable. With rested fully charged cells which together measure 4.0 volts I get a 2.75 amp draw on my build. After running for about 45 minutes the cells measure 3.8v and I get a 2.4 amp draw. After a 45 minute run the flashlight head is slightly warm but not uncomfortable to hold. I think these results pretty much mirror your results StefanFS thanks for your efforts in sharing your technical information on these builds. 

I have 20 4 x AMC7135 driver boards and 6 SSC P7 DSWOI Emitters on hand. Going to be putting together some presents for the family in the near future. Might even make a few 3.0 amp drivers:thumbsup:.

Happy Mods!


----------



## StefanFS

Thanks Fulgeo!

You picked one of the two sweet spot configs with this build. You'll get a nice ski slope after 50 minutes/one hour until the cells are down below 3V. The other sweet spot is with one big (D?) LiION.

I'm looking for a boost driver to (affordably) drive an SSC P7 or parallell wired MC E emitter at about 2A from two quality D NiMH. That should be possible with existing tech. Anybody?


----------



## Fulgeo

StefanFS said:


> I'm looking for a boost driver to (affordably) drive an SSC P7 or parallell wired MC E emitter at about 2A from two quality D NiMH. That should be possible with existing tech. Anybody?


 
Hey not to say the obvious as if it is inspirational but could you just repeat your multiple P7 driver theme buy connecting two or more 1AA boost drivers in parallel. I know dealexteme has affordable single NiMH boost drivers boards available. I have one of them myself. I had read somewhere that they are not as reliable or as robust as the AMC7135 buck regulators thou. Not sure if I informed you of something you did not already know.


----------



## Justin Case

StefanFS said:


> I'm looking for a boost driver to (affordably) drive an SSC P7 or parallell wired MC E emitter at about 2A from two quality D NiMH. That should be possible with existing tech. Anybody?



Don't know if you consider this affordable, but you can wire two GD1000 boost-buck drivers in parallel to create a GD2000. I don't know if anyone has tried this with the BBNG, but you can ask Wayne on the Sandwich Shoppe forum if it will work.


----------



## ti-force

Well, I spent all day working on my [email protected] to convert it to a 3amp ssc p7 light. My troubles started when my Kaidomain "professional charger" ha.. wouldn't charge my protected 32600 battery. So I wiggled the connections a little and it started charging. The voltage got to 3.95 and I decided to test the drivers to see if they would work before I soldered the p7 in. Low and behold I get 0.03 volts when the switch is turned on. I do have the multi-mode driver (16 mode), so I thought maybe that could possibly be one of the lowest settings.

So I turned the switch on and back off in less than 2 seconds per the directions and then turned the switch back on only to see 0.03 volts on meter once again. I understand it's really hard to diagnose something like this over a computer but if anybody has any ideas please let me know. I'm rather dissapointed because I just spent all day soldering and working on this light and as of right now, I don't have anything to show for it but a wasted day.


----------



## 9x23

ti-force said:


> Well, I spent all day working on my [email protected] to convert it to a 3amp ssc p7 light. My troubles started when my Kaidomain "professional charger" ha.. wouldn't charge my protected 32600 battery. So I wiggled the connections a little and it started charging. The voltage got to 3.95 and I decided to test the drivers to see if they would work before I soldered the p7 in. Low and behold I get 0.03 volts when the switch is turned on. I do have the multi-mode driver (16 mode), so I thought maybe that could possibly be one of the lowest settings.
> 
> So I turned the switch on and back off in less than 2 seconds per the directions and then turned the switch back on only to see 0.03 volts on meter once again. I understand it's really hard to diagnose something like this over a computer but if anybody has any ideas please let me know. I'm rather dissapointed because I just spent all day soldering and working on this light and as of right now, I don't have anything to show for it but a wasted day.
> 
> If I can't get this thing figured out, I guess I'll have some p7 mod parts for sell in the marketplace forum. Or in the trash can, one or the other.




Where and how are you taking the voltage measurement? Did you connect up the emitter for the test? I think these drivers vary the amperage to the led to get different light levels, but the the voltage to the emitter should be the same. Regardless, hang in there! Double check your wiring/soldering to make sure you've connected to the right locations and that the solder joints aren't shorting over to the adjacent metal. The soldering is very fine so it takes a fairly steady hand and some patience. I just finished up two P7 Mags and it took me a long time wiring up the drivers because I checked the circuit continuity after each solder joint to verify that the wire was connected properly board-to-board, and I checked the solder joint against the metal objects around the joint to verify the solder wasn't bleeding over and connecting something which I didn't want. In the end I was fortunate mine worked, and I really like these P7 lights....super bright! If you can post a clear picture of your wired circuit boards we should be able to look and see if the connections are wired properly. Keep at it....you'll be pleased once it works properly.

9x23


----------



## ti-force

9x23 said:


> Where and how are you taking the voltage measurement? Did you connect up the emitter for the test? I think these drivers vary the amperage to the led to get different light levels, but the the voltage to the emitter should be the same. Regardless, hang in there! Double check your wiring/soldering to make sure you've connected to the right locations and that the solder joints aren't shorting over to the adjacent metal. The soldering is very fine so it takes a fairly steady hand and some patience. I just finished up two P7 Mags and it took me a long time wiring up the drivers because I checked the circuit continuity after each solder joint to verify that the wire was connected properly board-to-board, and I checked the solder joint against the metal objects around the joint to verify the solder wasn't bleeding over and connecting something which I didn't want. In the end I was fortunate mine worked, and I really like these P7 lights....super bright! If you can post a clear picture of your wired circuit boards we should be able to look and see if the connections are wired properly. Keep at it....you'll be pleased once it works properly.
> 
> 9x23



I'm taking the voltage measurement with a meter set to dc, I'm taking the measurement from the positive led wire and the negative led wire coming from the multi-mode driver. I basically clipped the bare end of the negative wire onto my lead from the meter with an alligator clip. I did the same with the positive wire.

Then I put the 32600 cell with one spacer and a shorty spring in the light and then clicked the switch as though I were turning it on. I didn't solder the wires to the emitter yet because I wanted to make sure everything was working correctly before soldering. This was my first time soldering, maybe I did this correctly.

Thanks for your help I really appreciate it. Maybe you can see if I did something wrong in these pics.

Here is the multi-mode driver:










Here is the top of the driver sandwich:












Here's another one of the sandwich with one of the wires moved out of the way so you can see the solder:














Here is a side view of the sandwich. You can see the copper wire going from negative to negative as well as the copper wire going from center positive to center positive:













Here is the bottom of the sandwich. I'm assuming this is where power is supposed to come in from the battery. I couldn't find anything on this so this is how I soldered it:


----------



## 9x23

I'm not sure if you can take a reading at the emitter lead wires without any load resistance like what you'd find with an LED wired. When I test my boards I already have my P7 mounted on the sink with the wire leads soldered to it and with 3" of extra wire coming out the back of the sink. I then temporarily connect the lead wires from LED to the wires from the sink and secure with electrical tape. Then, I power up with the battery to see if it works. When I am ready to install the sink/led I trim off the extra wire before installing to keep the wire lengths short.

Some boards have no open load protection so if you run current through the board without any resistance you risk frying the board, but I'm not sure if it applies to this board. Your wiring looks like it is connected properly so I suggest doing what I described above to see if it works. 

9x23


----------



## ti-force

Okay, I just soldered the leads to the emitter. Still no dice:mecry:. The battery I used had a voltage of 3.78, I checked voltage at the emitter and it read from.02 to .06, no light what so ever.

Now, when I soldered the wires to the emitter, I soldered to one leg on the negative side (with whole in it) and I soldered the positive wire to one leg catty cornered from the neagative leg. This shouldn't matter should it?

Example:


----------



## ti-force

Okay, I just did some more voltage testing and I'm beginning to think the multi-mode driver is bad. I'm getting 3.77 volts all the way through the sandwich and to the positive center wire at the multi-mode driver. But the same low voltage going to the emitter. Maybe I should remove the multi-mode driver and replace it with another 1 amp driver board and just have one mode instead of the 16 modes. This is the only multi-mode driver I have, so I can't replace it with another one to see if its faulty.


----------



## 9x23

I'm not sure if this matters or not, but in my builds the battery positive and negative is wired to the multimode driver, not the slave.


----------



## ti-force

I got it to work. I did away with the multi-mode driver and hooked up another 1 amp driver in place of it. I'm not sure if I wired it correctly though, because it isn't all that impressive to me. I think something's still wrong somewhere. Here's a picture of how I wired the 1 amp driver in place of the multi-mode driver:


----------



## ti-force

My light flickers when it's turned on and off. Is this normal? I just ordered a csxpi p7 to do another mod. I'm thinking I might like the white tint better than my csxoi p7.


----------



## StefanFS

ti-force said:


> My light flickers when it's turned on and off. Is this normal?


 
No, it should not flicker. Check your solder points and the switch.

When you connect several boards you simply just create a bigger chain of AMC7135 chips to increase the current in 350 mA steps per extra chip, it's easy to trace that on the boards.


----------



## ti-force

StefanFS said:


> No, it should not flicker. Check your solder points and the switch.
> 
> When you connect several boards you simply just create a bigger chain of AMC7135 chips to increase the current in 350 mA steps per extra chip, it's easy to trace that on the boards.


 

How should I check the switch and solder points? Should I check them visually or with a meter? Could this problem be limiting the output of the light?

Thanks for your time and I'm sorry about all the ??'s. I'm trying to learn though.


----------



## StefanFS

Check all solder points for shorts or cold joints visually, if that doesn't do it you could disassemble the switch and straighten all contact strips/springs and check for oxidized surfaces etc. Or go at it again and try another build. It's almost impossible to tell what's wrong here without examining the light.


----------



## ti-force

Yeah, maybe I'll just start over. I understand it's almost impossible for you to diagnose this over the internet, that would be similar to trying to diagnose a rough idling car, from 4500 miles away.


----------



## Spypro

Hi !

I bought 4 x D Energizer nimh for my lantern and I'm wondering if I can do something nice with them... like powering a P7 in a 4D Mag. How can I achieve maximum brightness with 4xD nimh without killing the LED and the battery ?

Thanks !


----------



## StefanFS

Spypro said:


> Hi !
> 
> I bought 4 x D Energizer nimh for my lantern and I'm wondering if I can do something nice with them... like powering a P7 in a 4D Mag. How can I achieve maximum brightness with 4xD nimh without killing the LED and the battery ?
> 
> Thanks !


 
I recommend that you use some sort of regulating circuit with your light to get the most out of your expensive emitter.

For a straight direct drive use the appropriate resistor.


----------



## HallDk

It seems there are numerous configurations in terms of batteries, emitter and drivers, I have decided to go for a two or three mode driver to be able to control the output.

My question is therefore what configurations you, based on your experience, would recommend.

Would you use C or D as the host and would you use the 2, 3 or 4 cell?
In terms of drivers it seems there are two options, the “sandwich” and the option with only one driver, it seems the “sandwich” is necessary to maximize the output, is this correct?
Given your choice of “host” and driver configuration what battery option would you recommend? (X*AA in a holder, X*C/D, D-size LiION or another option)

It would be great if you could make links to your recommendations since I am new in this.

Thanks


----------



## StefanFS

HallDk said:


> It seems there are numerous configurations in terms of batteries, emitter and drivers, I have decided to go for a two or three mode driver to be able to control the output.
> 
> My question is therefore what configurations you, based on your experience, would recommend.
> 
> Would you use C or D as the host and would you use the 2, 3 or 4 cell?
> In terms of drivers it seems there are two options, the “sandwich” and the option with only one driver, it seems the “sandwich” is necessary to maximize the output, is this correct?
> Given your choice of “host” and driver configuration what battery option would you recommend? (X*AA in a holder, X*C/D, D-size LiION or another option)
> 
> It would be great if you could make links to your recommendations since I am new in this.
> 
> Thanks


 
With the drivers discussed here there are three configs I really like. 
1. A 1D Mag with one D-LiION or the fivemega 4xAA holder with eneloop.
2. A 3D Mag with three high capacity D NiMH cells.
3. A 2D Mag with three high capacity C NiMH cells for a little bit lower output in a standard format. In this case you need to mod the spring down into the tailcap and use some kind of tube to support the C-cells.

Heatsink:
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/203235

Led, eg. one more neutral:
http://www.cpfmarketplace.com/mp/showthread.php?t=196189

Lens:
http://www.flashlightlens.com/str/index.php

Lens & reflectors:
http://www.kaidomain.com/CategoryPage.aspx?CategoryId=44

D-size LiION:
http://www.kaidomain.com/ProductDetails.aspx?ProductId=2751
http://www.kaidomain.com/ProductDetails.aspx?ProductId=2708

fm cell holders:
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/198633
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/231553

Drivers, one source among others:
http://www.kaidomain.com/ProductDetails.aspx?ProductId=1801
http://www.kaidomain.com/ProductDetails.aspx?ProductId=6653

You need to search some to find additional sources. Eg. for 1D hosts, several make these.


----------



## saphear01

hm, it's been a while since i ordered the parts and put the together the first time...i needed the light for my bicyle and i just designed a little "custom" maglite. i didn't use it for a long time, since in summer i usually don't need the light, i'm a daytime biker  a few days ago i did my first night ride and ran into problems right away: i used this driver https://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.7612 + the slave board. the modes are changed, when it's not turned on for more than two seconds, right? with my last right, i had some "shock" issues (mountain biking..) and it changed the mode once or twice...now my question is: is there any way to turn of the mode change option in general? it would actually be kind of interesting to use only high and mid, but the rest is not needed at all. any easy solution to use only these two modes? *edit* Additional question: how can i check, wether my p7 is actually running at 2.4A? i have a stock led maglite here and with focusing at a spot it seems a lot brighter..


----------



## CBR-runner

The 16 mode driver has a high, med, low only setting. If it is changing modes while mountain biking check your solder points and battery connections to make sure everything is tight. 

All the bouncing around may cause a momentary break which will cause the thing to change modes. I had a similar problem with a dive light.


----------



## saphear01

well, I can at least asure that the driver has a high, mid, low setting + 2 different types of strobe/sos...but I will check the solder points to make sure! btw: how come you're bouncing around while diving?


----------



## las3r

stefanfs could u make me a set up using the drivers u did on ur p7 build ?

like taking the drivers and hooking them up to each other and ill pay for the coast/time ? email me ur answer here [email protected] thanks


----------



## StefanFS

las3r said:


> stefanfs could u make me a set up using the drivers u did on ur p7 build ?
> 
> like taking the drivers and hooking them up to each other and ill pay for the coast/time ? email me ur answer here [email protected] thanks


 
Sorry. No can do.

You need to to do that yourself.


----------



## las3r

can anyone build me this driver ? if so pm me thanks


----------



## las3r

can anyone build me this driver ? if so pm me thanks


----------



## JamisonM

las3r said:


> can anyone build me this driver ? if so pm me thanks


If you're looking to drive a P7, there are several good drivers on the marketnow. The hipcc and shark buck 3A are two of them.


----------



## Anto

Stefan,

Just to be sure, 3 NiMH D cells such as the Accupower LSDs will have enough power to run a P7 @ 2.8A with good regulation (using an 8x 7135 sandwich)?


----------



## StefanFS

Anto said:


> Stefan,
> 
> Just to be sure, 3 NiMH D cells such as the Accupower LSDs will have enough power to run a P7 @ 2.8A with good regulation (using an 8x 7135 sandwich)?


 
That depends on your definition of good regulation. With good cells like that combined with a low vf emitter, eg. DSVNI/DSWOI or Cree MC E, you should get at least 90 minutes of decently flat output, that is my experience (others may have different experiences). After that period a ski slope for quite some time.


----------



## Fulgeo

StefanFS said:


> That depends on your definition of good regulation. With good cells like that combined with a low vf emitter, eg. DSVNI/DSWOI or Cree MC E, you should get at least 90 minutes of decently flat output, that is my experience (others may have different experiences). After that period a ski slope for quite some time.


 
I have a P7 mod driven by 3 NiMH Accupower Evolution D cells. I do long run test with this thing on my night stand making the beam hit the wall behind my bead. I read by this light for long hours. I get about 3.5+ hours of usable light. What I think allot of people forget about the P7 is you still get 60% of its lumen output at 1.4 amps. I love incandescent lights mind you for my nightly long walks. But when it comes to run time the P7 is the goto flashlight. Case in point I had to replace my kitchen sink faucet 2 weeks ago and I am glad I had the P7 mod. 700-600 lumens for the 2 hours I used it and it delivered.


----------



## Anto

Initially I wanted to build a 3xC setup, but I hear that regulation drops off almost immediately, resulting in a ski slope until the batteries run down. I think I might just go with a 2xD Li-ion setup and a DW driver..


----------



## Chevy_Lumina

I'm a newbe to flashlight building and need some advise. Using a 3D Mag host, Stephan's 2.4 amp driver as shown at start of thread, H22a's P7 heatsink, SSC P7 DSWOI emitter, Titanium D Size 12000mAh NiMH. My questions are:
1) How do I mount the drivers when using H22a's flat bottom heatsink?
2) Do I have to worry about heatsinking the driver boards?

Thanks!!


----------



## jonas911

How dangerous is it to use this Sandwichdriver with a D***J P7? (Yes, ive read the first post) Or is there any other driver or another option instead of buying a buck driver like that one from "der wichtel"?


----------



## net_men

Hi! Tell me please how to connect SSC P7 in the car's headlight.
http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.11809
+
LED driver (where and what to buy?).

I need 2 mod: hi, lo.

I planing use 2 or 4 SSC P7 instead of H4 bulbs.


tks!


---------------------------
sorry my poor English :tinfoil:


----------



## ti-force

net_men said:


> Hi! Tell me please how to connect SSC P7 in the car's headlight.
> http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.11809
> +
> LED driver (where and what to buy?).
> 
> I need 2 mod: hi, lo.
> 
> I planing use 2 or 4 SSC P7 instead of H4 bulbs.
> 
> 
> tks!
> 
> ---------------------------
> sorry my poor English :tinfoil:



This is off topic from this thread. I would advise you to start a new thread asking these questions. You will probably get more answers if you take this advice.

Anyway, I'm not sure how well multiple P7 emitters will work in a headlight housing that was never designed for one P7 emitter, much less for multiple emitters, and you will probably need custom heat sinks to fit multiple emitters if you decide to follow through with this project. I'm not sure if you will find a driver with only high and low modes, but CPF member Torchboy put together a very useful page with just about every driver ever produced right here. If this headlight is an automobile headlight, you will probably find that the voltage will be over 14 volts, so you need a driver that's compatible with that voltage. Good luck, and BTW, :welcome:


----------



## rmateus

Hi Guys,

Some time ago I bought this driver from KD http://www.kaidomain.com/product/details.S005025 to replace the driver that came on the lantern Ultrafire 501B. 
I did the measurements, the maximum current is 1.25A in 18,650 fresh batteries. 
So think of using a slave board as http://www.dealextreme.com/p/amc7135-1400ma-regulated-circuit-board-for-diy-flashlights-15-pack-1886.

Is it possible to connect it the same way as other drivers that use the chip from Atmel?
Has anyone used a driver like that? I found it weird because he has no 7135...

Tks.


----------

