# DEFT Review and Basic Comparisons



## Patriot (Mar 12, 2009)

*More beamshots on page 2*
*

Short review of the DEFT Q5 WC from Michael at OMG Lumens.*










Today I received my long awaited secret weapon from Michael at OMG Lumens and thought I'd share my impressions. 







First impressions:

The Bezel is amazing! The carbon weave is very cool and the polished finish has a deep luster. It looks like it could adorn the engine air intake tube on a Formula One car. It fits very nicely to the head of the light and there are no open seams or gaps around its circumference. Very impressive fit with regards to the bezel, lens and flashlight head.












It's smaller than I thought it would be. Although I saw many pictures of the DEFT before, I suppose I was expecting it to be longer than it was. Although not compact because of the bezel diameter you can easily tuck the battery tube into a front or back jean pocket should you need a free hand. 







The quality and feel of the switch was a big surprise. It's small enough to not be obtrusive while still large enough to quickly find in the dark while capturing my beamshots. It's firm enough that it wont be activated accidentally and protrudes enough from the body that makes it easy to find by touch. 

At first I was slightly worried about the threads because when I cleaned them with a cloth, loose silver bits of machined aluminum attached to the cloth. After a good cleaning and some fresh Nyogel, they work great and there's not much play to speak of. It does have a recessed and very functional lanyard attachment point in the center of the tailcap that's quite beefy. 

The exterior of the light itself is fairly average of something that we might see on some of the cheaper lights at DX. That is to say that it's not going to win any beauty prizes for most elaborate design or machining. The cuts are shallow and some, like the small ones around the tailcap or poorly defined. Actually they appear to be cast rather than machined. The square blocks designed into the handle provide slightly more friction than if the tube was smooth. In my opinion the light could really benefit from a spin on the lathe to clean up the strange designs and cut down past some of the small dents and metal imperfections that occurred prior to finishing. I'm probably making this sound much worse than it actually is because only tight macro shots would reveal what I'm talking about. I'm just trying to be objective in saying that this thing isn't machined like a Surefire, JetBeam or JilLite. For that matter it's probably not as cleanly cut as a Fenix, Olight or EagleTac, all of which are pretty good in my opinion. (More on this subject at the end of the review)


The finish or more specifically the anodizing is quite good. It appears to be thick, durable and uniform in pleasant satin black color. 

The battery holder is an average 4 x AA holder which utilizes small coil springs and tabs to firmly hold the cells in.








The battery contacts inside of the battery tube are long and skinny. The attachment point of each wire is small so it would be best to go easy on these things when dropping the loaded battery holder down into the tube. They seem durable enough as long as they're not snagged by anything or pushed down to hard. On a side note to having the tailcap off, care should be taken because small debris can fall past the switch and light engine directly onto the inside of the aspherical lens. Whatever you do don't spray any lubricant or deoxit down there with the head on because it will end up finding its way on the lens. (Murphys Law) In the picture below I placed a small LED button cell light near the front of the lens so that the gaps (bright spots) could be easily seen from the battery side. 








The aspheric itself is BIG. It's not as transparent or crystal clear as the glass PL-1072 on the Mac's but it doesn't seem to hurt the performance when compared to any other aspheric light. Yes, it would perform even better with high quality optical glass but at the DEFT's price point I'm not going to complain. I'm very impressed with it overall.









Beamshots:

First set was against a garage door at 36 yards.

Mac's Aspheric with Cree Q4






DEFT Q5 WC






Both together







Second set is aimed at a powerline tower 319 yards

Mac's Aspheric






DEFT







Sky shots

Mac's Aspheric






DEFT







Overall I'm utterly amazed by the performance of the DEFT. This is the first single LED light that's able to out throw my 10W JiL EzNite with Polarion reflector. The color of the beam on the garage door shots is pretty accurate while the powerline tower and sky shots are much bluer than actual. 

Regarding the quality of the light chassis itself it's good enough for me. If this light had a custom body and head on it I could easily see the price shooting well above $500 and possibly into the Elephant price range. I actually feel like I received more than my money's worth and the quality of Michael's build and assembly work is extraordinary. It's on par with any of the custom builders who's lights I already own. I want to thank Michael for exceeding my expectations for both build quality and performance. 


More to come later, I just wanted to get my main thoughts down. 

Enjoy the pics


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## Patriot (Mar 12, 2009)

*More beamshots on page 2*

Ok, time for some more pictures.


For starters let's looks at the lens a bit more closely. As this pictures shows it's clear while looking straight through. At an angle or when the light is on is does appear opaque.






This picture through lens shows the anomalies in the optical plastic but to see this the light has to be just right. You'd never see it at first glance and it isn't a weakness. Many thickly cast optical plastics have this characteristic. 






Here are some close-ups of the light host:


















Here is the tailcap with lanyard attachment point. Upon closer inspection it appears to be molded plastic which is then secured to the aluminum cap. Still, it looks like it's tough and shouldn't pull off depending on how it's attached. I'm guessing it's hot pressed or glued.






Here is the emitter and heat sink. Observational note: Mine appears to be a departure from the larger copper heatsink with four screws. The Glow powder is cleanly applied. The after glow of the glowpowder was a big surprise. It's so bright that when the light is shut off it reminds me of my Maxabeam shutting down with its bright afterglow. It stays glowing pretty well for about 20 minutes after it's turned off. 






Here is an interesting shot with Michael's company name and serial number stuck inside of the head.






One additional small thing that I noticed was that the LED was aligned with the switch so that when the switch is facing straight up at 12 O'clock, the LED die image (square with a foot) is projected with the foot at the bottom. In the past when I've used aspherical LED lights I always intuatively turn the light body until the projection is square and with the foot at the bottom (as in my beamshots) With the DEFT I don't have to turn the body at all since it was already thoughtfully planned to appear that way. Very Cool!!!


Beamshots are still coming but I'm waiting for it to get dark at the moment.


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## applevision (Mar 12, 2009)

Wow!

Gorgeous light and insane power!

Color me impressed.

Thanks for the nice review and beautiful beamshots.


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## toby_pra (Mar 12, 2009)

A very nice review with even more nice beamshots! 

Its incredible how these DEFT throws...


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## PhantomPhoton (Mar 12, 2009)

Good beamshots I've wondered how it compared to a [email protected] aspheric and your wall shot comparing the projected die size tells me just what I've been curious about. Domo arigato.
I agree that the workmanship on the light is high quality. There is a lot of attention to detail put into all of the electrical components. Definitely worth the price tag.


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## Patriot (Mar 12, 2009)

PhantomPhoton said:


> Good beamshots I've wondered how it compared to a [email protected] aspheric and your wall shot comparing the projected die size tells me just what I've been curious about.




It makes the best 52mm aspheric look pretty weak by comparison.

Lux Luthor posted a very detailed review, much more extensive than this which, you'd also be interested in if you haven't seen it before.
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/211519


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## ehallspqr (Mar 12, 2009)

Yes thanks for the great review Patriot36. I agree with the price point vs quality of the host housing. I figure your buying the overall design and if a person likes the performance you could probably have a custom housing made. I read where Michael may be making his own custom housings in the future? Now the only problem is I'm at the end of the waiting list and it's going to be long while before I get my new toy. Hopefully more owner's review their Deft's.


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## Zeruel (Mar 12, 2009)

Patriot36 said:


>



This is the new light to replace the ones looking for Godzilla. Amazing!


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## StarHalo (Mar 12, 2009)

Can you cloud bounce it?


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## Patriot (Mar 12, 2009)

StarHalo said:


> Can you cloud bounce it?




If the clouds were 1000 feet or less above ground level I suspect it would be possible. We rarely get low clouds here but when we do I always like trying to hit them with lasers or the Maxabeam. I'll have to give the DEFT a try next time.


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## ANDREAS FERRARI (Mar 12, 2009)

Great photos Patriot36.The one with the DEFT lighting up the tower reminds me of a photo on the Polarion website.How do you think it would fair against a PH50?


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## saabluster (Mar 12, 2009)

ANDREAS FERRARI said:


> Great photos Patriot36.The one with the DEFT lighting up the tower reminds me of a photo on the Polarion website.How do you think it would fair against a PH50?


Hate to say it but the Polarion would blow the DEFT away. Then again the price points are waaaay different. The tower shots are a bit overexposed and makes it seem a bit brighter than it is in real life. 

Very good review Patriot36. I thought it was balanced and honest. Thanks for the comparison shots too. It helps to give perspective.:thumbsup:


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## Patriot (Mar 12, 2009)

Yes, what Saabluster said with regards to the PH50. The DEFT is king of LED throwers but HID is a whole different rhelm. The Xenide 25W and AE24 both out throw the DEFT fairly easily in my preliminary comparisons which I haven't posted yet.

As Michael stated the tower and sky shots are both overexposed. In fact, they're way over exposed by a factor of 3x. The intention was only to show the difference between the Mac's and the DEFT which is better done by big, bright, blown out images rather than faint ones. In my extended review I'll be taking some shots that replicate as closely as possible what the eyes see.




Michael, I can't seem to stop shining the DEFT around at things or even set it down for that matter...lol. This is quite the creation!

Thanks again


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## makapuu (Mar 12, 2009)

Thanks for the review Patriot36.
I have ordered quite a few lights since I got into this hobby (or craze as some may put it ).
But I can honestly say that I have never been so anxious to receive a light as much as this one.
I work with a fellow CPF'r, and not a day goes by without us talking about it ( he will receive his a little before me ).
We were planning to have a light saber fight in the sky on a half mile stretch of beach where we live.


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## DM51 (Mar 12, 2009)

Excellent review, and superb beamshots! Fascinating light, and performance that fully lives up to its great reputation. 

I didn't know the lens was very slightly opaque like that. It makes you wonder what the throw would be like it it was completely clear...

I'll move this to the Reviews section.


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## Patriot (Mar 12, 2009)

makapuu said:


> Thanks for the review Patriot36.
> 
> I work with a fellow CPF'r, and not a day goes by without us talking about it ( he will receive his a little before me ).
> We were planning to have a light saber fight in the sky on a half mile stretch of beach where we live.




lol that's funny! Remember that my photos are very over exposed in order to see the difference in detail between the two beams. The actual beam shaft isn't anywhere near than vivid in the sky. I'll be taking some pictures tonight that closely replicate what the eyes see. 






> *DM51*
> Excellent review, and superb beamshots! Fascinating light, and performance that fully lives up to its great reputation.
> 
> I didn't know the lens was very slightly opaque like that. It makes you wonder what the throw would be like it it was completely clear...




Thanks DM51,
The lens does have a slight cloudiness to it and the pictures seem to amplify that appearance some. When looking straight through it at the LED is doesn't really look opaque at all though. I'll take some more pictures later to try and show that.


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## HanzoTheFlashlight (Mar 12, 2009)

Great review! Thanks for taking the time to do so:twothumbs


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## addictedmatt (Mar 12, 2009)

Mine is clear, but does look cloudy when the light shines through it.:thinking:


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## Patriot (Mar 12, 2009)

*
addictedmatt*, could you tell me how to remove the lens. It looks like it just unscrews but I didn't want to force anything. Then I was going ask saabluster today but forgot.

:thanks:


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## Patriot (Mar 12, 2009)

Some Part Two review pictures in post two now.

Beamshots will be added there later this evening.

:wave:


EDIT: Four more beamshots posted.


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## saabluster (Mar 13, 2009)

Patriot36 said:


> *
> addictedmatt*, could you tell me how to remove the lens. It looks like it just unscrews but I didn't want to force anything. Then I was going ask saabluster today but forgot.
> 
> :thanks:


http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...ms/v482/saabluster/th_bezel-1.jpg[/IMG][/URL]




You should always unscrew the bezel with the head face down. That way the lens will not fall out onto the ground. 

The slight cloudiness of the lenses just have to do with the properties of the plastic. There is very little little difference in efficiency as compared to glass. You will notice that it does not have a discernible color. Some of the optical glass that I have seen is less efficient than the plastic I use even though it did not have any cloudiness because the slight coloring of the glass filters out some of the light. The main thing is it works and it works well.


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## seattlite (Mar 13, 2009)

How does it perform against the SF M6?


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## Patriot (Mar 13, 2009)

seattlite said:


> How does it perform against the SF M6?




The DEFT would fall well short in the department of overall output...275 lumens compared with 750-ish lumens. From a standpoint of throw though I think the DEFT would beat it out. I can compare them next time I take beamshots this weekend. 





Sabbluster, thank you for the lens removal info! :thumbsup:


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## skalomax (Mar 13, 2009)

First beamshots are awesome!


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## saabluster (Mar 13, 2009)

Patriot36 said:


> The DEFT would fall well short in the department of overall output...275 lumens compared with 750-ish lumens. From a standpoint of throw though I think the DEFT would beat it out. I can compare them next time I take beamshots this weekend.


The emitter lumens of the DEFT is actually about 330-350.






Patriot36 said:


> Sabbluster, thank you for the lens removal info! :thumbsup:


No problem. I worked that up after one of the other owners couldn't figure out how to get it off. He even tried heating the carbon fiber and tried to use a strap wrench. He thought it separated at the carbon fiber. I guess I should start providing each light with a written set of instructions.


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## Patriot (Mar 13, 2009)

saabluster said:


> The emitter lumens of the DEFT is actually about 330-350.





oh, I was just winging some rough out the front lumens  I figured emitter lumens were well over 300 because of the current your sending to it. 



> *Saabluster*
> No problem. I worked that up after one of the other owners couldn't figure out how to get it off. He even tried heating the carbon fiber and tried to use a strap wrench. He thought it separated at the carbon fiber. I guess I should start providing each light with a written set of instructions.


At least I restrained myself from the strap wrench...lol. A agree that instructions would be a good idea since it is possible for debris to make it's way onto the lens when the tailcap or head are off the body.


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## LuxLuthor (Mar 14, 2009)

Always good to see more promotion of the DEFT! Nice review, Patriot36, except the beamshots in post #2 are not of much use until corrected. It is important to stress that this is intentionally a cost savings light, so you can't match the workmanship to the higher quality production or custom modder lights. If a light like this were made to SF or Data/McGizmo type standards with optical glass, I would expect to pay $1,000+

I put the Pachmayr "Pac-Skin" grip on the handle so it is a secure grip and confortable to use in the coldest of winter nights. Other thing I replaced was the lanyard with a nice strong Sony camcorder brand string strap (got a dozen cheaply on EBay). Now I swing it confidently with this similarly designed strap.

Yeah, make sure you grip the metal bezel segment below carbon fiber, and it unscrews pretty easily. IMHO, the lens is not opaque at all. Your one view is picking up internal reflections. It is as clear as *addictedmatt *shows in his window view. I was expecting it to be much lower quality in optical clarity than it actually has. Of course it cannot compare to quality optical glass. The few minor imperfections that can be seen with selective tilting and close inspection have no effect what-so-ever on the projected image.

Now you see what I meant saying this is like a Pocket Maxabeam.


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## saabluster (Mar 16, 2009)

Sorry to bug you but I really am curious to see the comparison shots with the HID and M6. With fresh batteries in the DEFT of course. You've got me on the edge of my seat.


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## Patriot (Mar 16, 2009)

saabluster said:


> Sorry to bug you but I really am curious to see the comparison shots with the HID and M6. With fresh batteries in the DEFT of course. You've got me on the edge of my seat.




Ah yes. I've been busy with RC airplane stuff and never got back to the park. If the old powerline tower down the street will suffice I might be able to post them by the morning. Never a bother either. If there is anything else you'd like to see the DEFT compared to there's a fair chance I might have it.


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## saabluster (Mar 16, 2009)

Patriot36 said:


> If there is anything else you'd like to see the DEFT compared to there's a fair chance I might have it.


Surprise me.


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## saabluster (Mar 16, 2009)

Patriot36 said:


> If the old powerline tower down the street will suffice I might be able to post them by the morning.


Even if you can't do it tonight I would rather see shots at the other location due to the reduced ambient light. Helps to see what the beams really look like. Thanks for all your effort thus far.:thumbsup:


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## Patriot (Mar 16, 2009)

Old pictures removed and new ones added to post #40


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## StarHalo (Mar 16, 2009)

A single LED throwing a thousand feet, amazing. Great pics too.

And it's nice that you have kind neighbors, who would let you irradiate the entire street without a complaint, I'm still afraid to try it myself..


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## Patriot (Mar 16, 2009)

StarHalo said:


> A single LED throwing a thousand feet, amazing. Great pics too.
> 
> And it's nice that you have kind neighbors, who would let you irradiate the entire street without a complaint, I'm still afraid to try it myself..





Yes, the DEFT is just bazaar to switch on. I've never seen anything like it before. 

Most of the neighbors are probably asleep but the PH50 did have me nervous which is part of the reason that I turned it on and took the picture really fast. I was rushing that shot and scrambling to take the picture. 






Saabluster, I still plan on getting out and testing these in a dark area. As you stated it's much easier to see the exact shape of the beam when the surroundings are nice and black. The park where I took those crappy beamshots isn't ideal because the ground it too flat. I only went there because it's a half mile from the house. Soon I'll head out to the other park where I can shoot down into a slight bowl. It's a much better location.


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## saabluster (Mar 16, 2009)

Excellent job. I just can't stop looking at these pictures. The output of the PH50 is just breathtaking.


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## Patriot (Mar 16, 2009)

saabluster said:


> The output of the PH50 is just breathtaking.



It's kinda like a Chihuahua.....it thinks it's much bigger than it really is.


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## Patriot (Mar 17, 2009)

Moved to post #40


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## saabluster (Mar 17, 2009)

Patriot36 said:


> Waiting for Photobucket to work....................................................................................



Is there something wrong with photobucket? None of the pictures are showing now. Not even addictedmatt's.


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## Patriot (Mar 17, 2009)

saabluster said:


> Is there something wrong with photobucket? None of the pictures are showing now. Not even addictedmatt's.



Yes, it hasn't let me log in for over an hour and the page would time out. Not at least is says "down for maintenance." I've got everything ready to post except access to my pictures. 

In any case, these will be the best of my pics yet once they're posted.


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## Patriot (Mar 17, 2009)

Dissatisfied with my pictures from the other night I retook them and added the a 24W HID to the mix.

*Camera settings:
10" @ F5.0 ISO 100 Auto WB Manual Focus

Camera set-up:
Two tripods were used. One is supporting the various lights while the other supports the camera. The distance between camera and lights was about 2 feet. 

Target:
Range is 322 yards to the powerline tower.*



*Lights used from left to right: Maxabeam, Polarion PH-50, AE Light AE24/S, DEFT, Surefire M6 MN21*







Control





M6 MN21 on brand new Energizer cells





DEFT on L91's





AE Light AE24/S





Maxabeam on high





Polarion PH-50







*Zoomed Shots:*

M6 MN21 with fresh Energizer batteries





DEFT





AE Light AE24/S





Maxabeam on high





Polarion PH-50






*Shoot notes:*

The most impressive thing that unfolded tonight was to witness the DEFT produce higher lux than a 24W HID! That's simply astonishing

I installed fresh new Energizer cells in the M6 tonight and it seemed to be performing slightly better. I thought it did well considering it uses an OP reflector.

I let the PH-50 warm up for a good 25 seconds just to insure that it was producing max output. Having done that, I think it was even more impressive tonight. 

Next time I'll compare the Xenide 25W to see if it can beat the DEFT at range but it will probably be close.

All shots were about 1-2 stops over exposed to show detail.


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## LuxLuthor (Mar 17, 2009)

Ahhhh, now you're shooting with lead! Them thar are some rootin' tootin' beamshots! Shows all the variations, pro's and con's between them. *Very nice job, Patriot!*

My next shootout will be with my new SX110.


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## Patriot (Mar 17, 2009)

LuxLuthor said:


> Ahhhh, now you're shooting with lead! Them thar are some rootin' tootin' beamshots! Shows all the variations, pro's and con's between them. *Very nice job, Patriot!*
> 
> My next shootout will be with my new SX110.





Thanks Lux!

Every time is hear or see the phrase "rootin' tootin" it reminds me of The Schofield Kid from the movie Unforgiven. He's got some classic lines which can't be repeated in a public forum...lol.

SX110...wow! I think I have megapixel envy..:candle:


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## saabluster (Mar 19, 2009)

Patriot36 said:


> The most impressive thing that I saw tonight was that the DEFT was producing higher lux than the 24W HID! That's simply amazing feat for and LED!


That _is_ amazing. I knew it could beat 10-15W HIDs but that is the first time I have seen it put up against a 24W. Thanks for the updated pics.




Patriot36 said:


> Next time I'll compare the Xenide 25W to see if it can beat the DEFT at range but it will probably be close.


Can't wait.


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## Nitro (Mar 20, 2009)

Excellent Thread! :thumbsup:

Me likey that DEFT.


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## karlthev (Apr 4, 2009)

Yeah, where have I been? Very nice review Paul!



Karl


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## DM51 (Apr 4, 2009)

Excellent 2nd batch of pics. It's just astonishing that the DEFT beats the 24W HID.


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## 300winmag (Apr 4, 2009)

Cant wait.... Wonder how the DEFT would fair with it's new additional optic.


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## 300winmag (Apr 4, 2009)

Or does yours have the additional optic?


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## Patriot (Apr 5, 2009)

300winmag said:


> Or does yours have the additional optic?




300WM, Mine does not have the additional optic. Evidently it's brighter even though the projection size is larger. It looks very interesting but doesn't seem to be an available retro mod to the earlier lights.


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## BlueBeam22 (Apr 5, 2009)

Excellent review and I am blown away by your beamshots Patriot! That is extremely impressive to me that the DEFT generates such noticeably higher lux than the AE24W HID, considering the fact that the HID has many times the lumen output of the DEFT and should have a much higher surface brightness. I am so glad you are happy with it and it is a phenomenal light in all ways. The body work is beautiful and I like your picture of the aspheric dome itself.

Does the N30 out throw the DEFT very easily? I would love to see a beamshot of your perfectly focused Costco shining at that tower if you get a chance.

Great job, and congrats on your new light.:thumbsup:


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## Bullzeyebill (Apr 5, 2009)

The long skinny springs in the battery pack could be modified for less resistance, I would think. Would help those NiMh's breath more fire into the Deft, or at least help run time in regulation. 

Bill


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## Patriot (Apr 5, 2009)

Bullzeyebill said:


> The long skinny springs in the battery pack could be modified for less resistance, I would think. Would help those NiMh's breath more fire into the Deft, or at least help run time in regulation.
> 
> Bill





Maybe, but I was running 4 x L91 lithiums....about 1.65 volts each. I'm going to guess that it was getting good voltage but perhaps Saabluster can comment about that.


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## saabluster (Apr 6, 2009)

Bullzeyebill said:


> The long skinny springs in the battery pack could be modified for less resistance, I would think. Would help those NiMh's breath more fire into the Deft, or at least help run time in regulation.
> 
> Bill


It does not seem to make a difference at the current drive levels. However something will need to change when I start making the upgraded MC-E drivers.


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## Search (Apr 6, 2009)

I found my next purchase :O


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## PhantomPhoton (Apr 6, 2009)

saabluster said:


> However something will need to change when I start making the upgraded MC-E drivers.



:devil: (need I say any more?)


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## 300winmag (Apr 6, 2009)

I just hope it will be compatible with my DEFT when I get it :nana:


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## Ryanrpm (Apr 6, 2009)

Did that PH50 set off any car alarms!? Yikes.

And it's always amazing to see the DEFT in action. Thanks for the photos.


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## Patriot (Apr 11, 2009)

lol......no car alarms but I'm always nervous firing that thing up in the neighborhood. I feel like if I turn it on too early in the evening people who are active and out walking or sitting on their porches might be alarmed. Too late at night I'm afraid of reflected light seeping through every minute hole in their window blinds and waking someone up out of their sleep and then calling the police.  I have a quiet street so I really try to be sensible when I get out lights like the Polarion.


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## 300winmag (Apr 11, 2009)

Any word on how it does against the Xenide?


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## troller_cpf (Jun 7, 2009)

Is it brighter/more thrower with a Q5 or with the R2


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## Patriot (Jun 7, 2009)

Of the ones that I had seen compared, the Q5 seemed to throw a bit better but I somehow doubt that's always going to be the case. After reading Lux Luthor's excellent aspheric shootout thread, I opted for the one which appealed to me most at the time which was the Q5.

You might post this question with Lux Luthor in his shoot out thread
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/211519

......or ask Michael (the maker of the DEFT) here:
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/211519


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