# QTC Infinitely Variable Titanium CR123 Clicky Torch



## Tofty (Dec 28, 2011)

Hi everyone,
I am in the design stages for a homemade 2xCR123 Titanium Torch using the Malkoff M61 engine and hopefully incorperating infinitely variable output using quantum tunnelling compound pills.

The components i have already purchased from Oveready are:
Malkoff M61
Ultra Clear Lens for Z44 head
Torchlab tritium SS Bezel for z44 head
McClicky switch.

I've also bought some qtc pills and a Tank007 E07 to test the pills operation (the E07 is suitable as it is a battery crusher type not sprung, as discussed on multitool.org).

The plan is to isolate both the springs on the Malkoff head and the McClicky switch with plastic and brass screw in plates. The qtc unit will sit in the tail section which will be connected to the main body using quite fine threads, allowing the variable output to be accurately controlled. The torch will be able to be turned off without releasing pressure on the qtc allowing the same output level to be returned to immediately with turning on.
The qtc will be sandwiched between two metal plates to reduce possible damage and eradicate pill movement.

The features i want to aim for are:
Waterproof to a depth of at least 40m (max PADI dive limit for all but professional divers),
Tail standing,
Tritium identifiers front and rear and perhaps along the sides,
Titanium main body and head, but i'm not going to be militant about everything being titanium (steel is still better for some applications)
Some anti role features, probably on the tail,
550 Paracord lanyard hole or holes,
Narrowed neck section to allow torch to be clipped into a tensioned spring mount like the ones you use on your workshop walls for tools.

Now for a few questions:

1. Will the internal regulator system in the m61 engine interfere with the desired function of the qtc and stop output adjustment being linear? 
If so this will pretty much kill that part of the design.

2. Are two o-rings enough to seal from high pressure even on dynamic (to be twisted while submerged) joints? or is there a better way of sealing joints?

3. Which side of the lens should the o-ring go? As i have seen them on either side on various torches. A bit of the clear UV cure Norland 61 arond the lens might help as well as loctite on all threaded parts that dont need to move.

4. Are the McClicky switches able to cope with depth? i haven't got hold of one yet so can't tell what seals are present.

Any help on these questions would be much appreciated.


Current Progress.....


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## cmacclel (Dec 28, 2011)

-McClicky has no seals and is no way water resistant in the least.

-Any Module with a driver board unless it is maybe an AMC current limiter style driver will not work correctly with a QTC Pill.


Mac


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## Tofty (Dec 28, 2011)

Thanks Mac,

I suppose the switch could be deeply recessed into the body and a sealed membrane between it and whatever is actually pushed, not a disaster but will require more work to achieve.

Shame about the incompatibility between the pills and the driver but it's not the end of the world, i'll do some experiments to make sure but i have no reason to doubt what you said.
I might try and incorporate some modularity to this torch so i can run it with or without a qtc unit depending on what engine i want to use.

Can anyone recommend an unregulated p60 drop-in?


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## dirtech (Dec 29, 2011)

I would think the qtc would work to a degree with the malkoff. After all, the high low ring is a resistor like the qtc.


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## cmacclel (Dec 29, 2011)

Actually the Malkoff M61 may work as it stated under 3.4v it will be direct drive so you may be good. I thought his drivers used Li-Ion protection but am wrong.

Mac


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## Tofty (Dec 29, 2011)

Thanks again,
Thinking about it a completely linear output control isn't really that important, it's the low light levels that you want control over, say you want to check your watch or diving gauges while not loosing too much of your night vision then a well set faint light is a must but when you want to see as much as possible during an ascent just whack it up to full, no need for 90%. So long as some difference is achieved it ought to be worth it.

I'll use this page as a build log so i'll give details of my findings. As well as lovely pictures.


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## borrower (Dec 30, 2011)

You'll find my trials and tribulations with qtc here: http://forums.mtbr.com/lights-diy-do-yourself/qtc-infinite-variability-730630.html

(While the experiment starts badly, it finally works in the end...)

A few observations: qtc does dim a lux-rc driver. I don't have the technical depth to describe the nature of the driver, but I'm sure you can figure it out. My build won't go to full brightness -- maybe 80-90%. Given the erratic nature of qtc, I'd build in a failsafe that bypasses the qtc, just in case.

Good luck!

edit: turns out you need to be logged in to the mtbr forums to see pictures... the signup is pretty painless and they don't spam you.


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## Tofty (Dec 30, 2011)

Cheers Borrower,
There's lots of useful infomation, but i can't see any of the pictures, any chance of a link to them?


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## Essexman (Dec 30, 2011)

I've no idea about any of your questions, just wanted to say hi and welcome to CPF :wave: [I'm not stalking you, were just on the same forums!]

Really looking forward to seeing how this build comes along.


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## Tofty (Dec 30, 2011)

This was all your fault! Well not entirely but you know what i mean. Ta anyway


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## borrower (Dec 30, 2011)

I didn't realise it, but if you aren't logged in, it doesn't show you pictures. Send a PM if you want me to pass along pics, or just sign up. (Easy process.)


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## Essexman (Dec 30, 2011)

Tofty said:


> This was all your fault! Well not entirely but you know what i mean. Ta anyway



HE HE HE HE HE HE HE snigger snigger, I did warn you about playing with lights. I knew you would end up making something, it's just what happens. Good to have you here. I guess TX101 will be along soon to say Hi.


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## Tofty (Dec 30, 2011)

Thanks borrower i joined the other forum as this way i can see the pictures in context, thats exactly the kind of system i'm aiming for, if perhaps a little more waterproof. The equally spread out pills arranged in a circle is exactly how i suspected it should be done. I was thinking of using two slightly thicker brass plates with an override being achieved by the middle of one of the plates protruding out so that when the plates are forced together as hard as possible it will make contact bypassing the pills. This will take a lot of fettling but i plan on using the whole of the tail cap as the adjuster so i just have to cut a very fine thread to give a great deal of control over the adjustment.


Yes Mark you did, but i suppose it's the logical progression of lathe working, it's really just cylinder pimping with stuff put in to stop it from seeming like a waste of time, or is that blasphemy?
Anyway it's nice to have something with a firm measure of fuctionality: watches are accurate, knives are sharp, torches are bright. The brighter the better.
I hope Wai's still happy with her M1, i really liked it and now i want one, but it would have to have all the same mods. Something to go on the dream list along with a lummi which thanks to reading this forum i wouldn't dare be stupid enough to try and buy now.


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## tx101 (Dec 31, 2011)

Hello Peter, good to see that you have decided to join us. We will soon convert you to being a full time Jamie (and his Magic torch) 

The Surefire M1 you added the bezel to is one of my prized Surefire "Frankenstein" torches :thumbsup:

Now best get back on topic, I have just tried a QTC with my Malkoff M61 + MD2 host, it works.
All I have done is place a QTC on the bare rim of the body and screwed the head on top of it.
Ramps up and down as it should.

From my own experience mucking about with QTC, is it really worth the effort ? 
Like you I also brought a Tank007 E07 and tried it out with a piece of QTC and as posted by
others found that it was prone to flickering and just too unpredictable.

If I had your skills on a lathe, I would pick up a second hand Sunwayman v10r (see CPFmarketplace.com  )
remove the reflector, LED and electronics and build a torch around that. The magnetic variable control ring
on the Sunwayman works a lot better than QTC ..... just my 2 cents


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## Tofty (Jan 1, 2012)

Cheers Wai,
Since i'm planning on integrating the qtc in the tail cap along with the clicky switch it means only the tail cap will need to be remade if or probably when the qtc pills don't live up to expectations.
I'll give it a go anyway as i like the simplicity of the concept and it's a chance to be creative but thankyou for the alternative recommendation, i just had a look at the v10r and it does look like a very nice torch, i might just get one for the sake of it.


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## Tofty (Jan 9, 2012)

Well i've finished the preliminary design work for this torch so here are a few renders showing the basic layout:
















These models are not completely finished and i'm not really happy with the appearance of the tail, it looks to bulky and the cut-outs look too plain.

When i've got the models finished and cleaned up i'll take some clearer renders.


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## Tofty (Feb 26, 2012)

Well after far too long i finally got round to making the first section of this torch; the battery tube.
It's not quite finished as the centre needs to be bored out to 17mm and a counterbore of 19mm needs to be added to one end, but apart from that it's pretty much done.
I don't have enough o-rings of either type right now but i think i'll go with the GITD ones when it's all finished as they will complement the green tritium vials.
















Some parts including the tail unit have undergone some redesign since i made the original renders.

Hopefully progress on new parts will be a little more frequent over the next month.


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## davyro (Feb 27, 2012)

I'm another from England who's interested in seeing your final product,its looking fine up until now Tofty,so best of luck with the rest of your project.


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## Tofty (Mar 20, 2012)

A bit more progress......






More pictures to follow tomorrow


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## Tofty (Mar 21, 2012)

Only the tail cap and qtc system to do now.

THe full text around the head:


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## tx101 (Mar 21, 2012)

LOL ..... Peter, the bug has hit you hard 

Titanium + all those Tritium slots 

The body looks great but the head IMHO looks a bit too busy


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## Tofty (Mar 22, 2012)

Cheers davyro, do stay tuned.

Thanks Wai, this isn't the only custom torch i've got in the pipeline either, check my brass torch thread on MT.O

I must admit that the text on the head is just me being frivolous, without it the head would look cleaner.
The knurling or whatever it's called is there so that the head can be opened or more importantly closed tightly, as the double o-rings make things quite stiff, without requiring a vice and perhaps while wearing gloves.
I don't think it looks too busy compared to some of the heavily finned heads i've seen, perhaps the pictures don't help.
Well i'm sure you'll get a chance to see it for real at the next London meet and see what you think then.


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## borrower (Mar 23, 2012)

tx101 is just jealous! I like the head design... looking forward to hearing how the QTC goes.


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## chipwillis (Mar 23, 2012)

I like that One, and I want....


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## Essexman (Mar 24, 2012)

Tofty said:


> Well i'm sure you'll get a chance to see it for real at the* next London meet and see what you think then*.



just as long as there's no snow!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Looking good, what optic did you go for in the end?


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## fyrstormer (Mar 24, 2012)

That's a great looking host. I dig the raw-machined look. It would go very well with the Hope hydraulic disc brakes on my new bike.


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## Tofty (Mar 25, 2012)

Hope do make some damn fine braking systems. The finish is sanded where possible to 1000 grit but not too thoroughly, i don't think titanium needs any more than that.

The optic is just the standard malkoff m61 drop-in, i tried my torchlabs triple xpg drop-in but it's a little bit wider so it wouldn't fit. I could obviously just widen the head but that would mean poorer thermal contact when using the malkoff.
Since the body is only 17mm in diameter, running the triple with the batteries that would fit (2x16340s) would give a runtime on high of only about 20 minutes which would be go good while diving so i'll stick with the malkoff in this torch.

I had a look in the events forum and the london meeting before this last one was in 2010. I don't mind snow that much so long as the next meeting isn't in two years time.

The qtc will need the tightest tolerances possible to make it work consistantly well (i hope) so there may well be a fair amount of trial and error but i'm confident....ish.

I'm still worried about making sure the boot is pressure sealed, i think i may have to change things. I'm considering changing the design from a hollow boot to a posted type.


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## davyro (Mar 25, 2012)

I've just read up on your progress & i've got to say i admire your determination as well as your great machining to get this beauty up & running.:bow:
:bow:


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## fyrstormer (Mar 25, 2012)

If you can make this design work well enough to sell, consider me interested. I've looked at Malkoff drop-ins before and I've always held off because they were single mode. If I could get an infinitely-variable host to use an M60F in, that would be outstanding.

As with all my lights, the option to attach a clip would be greatly appreciated, because it means I'll actually use the thing.


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## Tofty (Mar 27, 2012)

I highly doubt i could ever sell this torch design, at least not as it is at the moment and almost certainly not in titanium.

If the qtc system works as well as i hope then perhaps some kind of custom tail cap of Z41 type (to fit the surefire P/Z/G, malkoff M2/3/4 etc) would be a sensible option.
It could work with any single mode p60 drop-in, not just the malkoff and would require no modification to the original torch.

I do plan to release the drawings of the torch when i'm done in case anyone is interested.

I hadn't really thought about a clip for this torch as it will be clipped onto a retaining frame for stowing while diving and with a permanent bungee attachment on the tail to secure it during use.


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## Tofty (Apr 9, 2012)

A bit more progress on the torch, all the titanium parts are now finished.
The torch should now be water-tight although the switch and qtc system are still missing.


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## Tofty (Apr 21, 2012)

Just finished making the QTC system and i'm happy to say it works well, although there is still some fine adjustment to be made. After that it just leaves the installation of the tritium vials and then this torch will finally be done.

The tail assembly.







The QTC pill carrier made from brass and macor ceramic.
















The pills are isolated, by the pins, from any rotation force which could damage them and are only subjected to compression between the two plates.
The grub screw in the middle of the assembly allows the qtc to be bypassed to achieve full beam, it also allows adjustment to be made to the point when full beam will occur as qtc pills age and become less firm over time.


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## emu124 (Apr 22, 2012)

Very clean work and a awesome looking piece of Ti :devil:


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## fyrstormer (Apr 22, 2012)

That pill design looks awesome. I'm impressed that you have the tools necessary to cut ceramic.

You could definitely sell a few of these lights, especially in titanium. This is the sort of light that nobody would want to risk damaging by dropping, and titanium is perfect for that.


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## Tofty (May 8, 2012)

Finished, and i know you guys like abit of tritium so...
















The ceramic can be cut with standard metal working tools, the same ones i use for cuting aluminium, brass, steel, titanium etc.
It doesn't technically cut, but rather chips so a slow feed rate is needed to keep the chips small to give a smooth...ish surface.
Expensive stuff though, costs more than titanium for the same size stock.


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## PhotonFanatic (May 8, 2012)

That's a great light and a wonderful display of design and machining!


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## Essexman (May 8, 2012)

Just caught up with this thread, fantastic work, well done indeed. 

Love the Tritium in the font and rear, you won't have trouble finding that in the dark!


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## easilyled (May 8, 2012)

Such a clever concept so well executed. :thumbsup:


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## fyrstormer (May 8, 2012)

Let's see a demo video on Youtube. :devil:


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## borrower (May 11, 2012)

All around beautiful! I particularly like the elegance of your qtc crusher. Thanks for sharing.


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## xevious (Mar 24, 2013)

I really like this design--nicely done! Would definitely like to see a video, and a follow-up on long term use.


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## octaf (Mar 25, 2013)

Wonderful work you did !
I would love this light in 18350.


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## Tofty (Mar 30, 2013)

Thanks guys,
Since my last post i've tested this light at depth (12m) successfully and completely resigned the QTC system to stop there being any battery crush.
I'll elaborate on this soon and hopefully do a video too as the QTC function is pretty smooth and has been for many months.


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## easilyled (Mar 30, 2013)

Peter, you should patent your QTC module and then sell the design to the leading flashlight manufacturing brands.
To my knowledge, none of them have succeeded in making the QTC have a smooth function.


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## Megatrowned (Mar 30, 2013)

Wow, that's a beautiful light! And the mechanics of it make it so much cooler! Nice job :thumbsup:

And add me to the "I'll take one" list


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## xevious (Mar 30, 2013)

Very sensible design, too. It does indeed look like ZERO shearing effect on the QTC, while also minimizing battery crush. Outstanding, Tofty.


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## gunga (Mar 30, 2013)

This is an awesome design! Very interested, you can actually make qtc live up to its potential.


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## chipwillis (Apr 9, 2014)

I really like this light, it's due for a bump..


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## fyrstormer (Apr 11, 2014)

I sure do wish Tofty would make a run of these. They would sell in no time. Nobody before or since has made a QTC adjustable flashlight this good.


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