# how many lumens was them old red plastic 2d everyready lights?



## raggie33 (Aug 14, 2019)

im just trying to see how far we came


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## alpg88 (Aug 14, 2019)

depends on a lamp installed, but normally they are very similar in 2D lights, maglite says their 2d classic is between 50 and 99, depending how fresh cells are


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## raggie33 (Aug 14, 2019)

wow so crazy and now i have a 2 inch light at 700 lumens lol and boy did i love maglights back in the day i saved and saved to get my first one


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## alpg88 (Aug 14, 2019)

back then maglite was pretty much the coolest light. especially mag charger, streamlight ultrastinger was another one. but not as popular as mag. 
mag used to be on top, now it barely keeps up,


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## archimedes (Aug 14, 2019)

I think the SureFire 6P originally advertised "four times the light of a 2D-cell flashlight" and came stock with a P60 lamp assembly rated at 65 lumens.

So, that would mean maybe 15 lumens or so for a "typical" 2D light at that time ?


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## raggie33 (Aug 14, 2019)

alpg88 said:


> back then maglite was pretty much the coolest light. especially mag charger, streamlight ultrastinger was another one. but not as popular as mag.
> mag used to be on top, now it barely keeps up,



i hate streamlight i drove very very far to get one at a miltary store and it had the greenest tint i have ever seen. i was so sad. im sure it was a fluke but so green


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## raggie33 (Aug 14, 2019)

archimedes said:


> I think the SureFire 6P originally advertised "four times the light of a 2D-cell flashlight" and came stock with a P60 lamp assembly rated at 65 lumens.
> 
> So, that would mean maybe 15 lumens or so for a "typical" 2D light at that time ?



are they the ones that ran on 2 cr123?


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## alpg88 (Aug 14, 2019)

in that case sf marketing lied, maybe it was 4x when mag was almost dead and sf with fresh cells, maglite says 50-99.
2aa minimag is 15lm, and it is much much dimmer than 2d


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## archimedes (Aug 14, 2019)

archimedes said:


> I think the SureFire 6P originally advertised "four times the light of a 2D-cell flashlight" and came stock with a P60 lamp assembly rated at 65 lumens.
> 
> So, that would mean maybe 15 lumens or so for a "typical" 2D light at that time ?





raggie33 said:


> are they the ones that ran on 2 cr123?



Yes, the SureFire 6P was powered by 2x CR123A



alpg88 said:


> in that case sf marketing lied, maybe it was 4x when mag was almost dead and sf with fresh cells, maglite says 50-99.
> 2aa minimag is 15lm, and it is much much dimmer than 2d



I don't recall them (or me) saying "Maglite" ... in fact, I doubt they would have done so.

The (measured and advertised) output of various Maglites have been discussed on CPF before, as you might imagine. I'll post some of those links below, without further comment.

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...s-magically-double-or-almost-triple-overnight

https://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?317814-How-many-lumens-is-a-standard-Maglite

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?196107-standard-maglite-how-many-lumens


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## raggie33 (Aug 14, 2019)

archimedes said:


> Yes, the SureFire 6P was powered by 2x CR123A
> 
> 
> 
> ...


i disliked them cr123 batts so much back in the day becuase they was hard to find and cost so much


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## alpg88 (Aug 14, 2019)

archimedes said:


> I don't recall them (or me) saying "Maglite" ... in fact, I doubt they would have done so.
> 
> The (measured and advertised) output of various Maglites have been discussed on CPF before, as you might imagine. I'll post some of those links below, without further comment.
> 
> ...



wow, i was wrong big time, the label on the package says 27lm. i'm not sure where gringer site took their info,  i also wrongly assumed it was ML site. my bad.

but even then, 65lm is not 4x of 27.


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## archimedes (Aug 14, 2019)

alpg88 said:


> wow, i was wrong big time, they label on the package says 27lm. i'm not sure where gringer site took their info, i also wrongly assumed it was ML site. my bad.
> 
> but even then, 65lm is not 4x of 27.



You appear to have linked to a 4D cell torch above.

I also think it is difficult to compare "output" (curves) of an alkaline powered torch vs a lithium powered torch, without being much more precise ... are you talking about initial output, output after ?? minutes, output after ?? percentage of runtime, average output over the entire curve, etc, etc.

And that is before even getting into the difference between advertising "lamp lumens" vs "out-the-front" or "torch" lumens :shrug:


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## xxo (Aug 14, 2019)

The old vacuum bulbs for cheap 2D lights were typically 3-6 lumens, depending on the bulb. 

The 2D Mag Krypton PR bulbs were 19 lumens.


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## alpg88 (Aug 14, 2019)

archimedes said:


> You appear to have linked to a 4D cell torch above.
> 
> I also think it is difficult to compare "output" (curves) of an alkaline powered torch vs a lithium powered torch, without being much more precise ... are you talking about initial output, output after ?? minutes, output after ?? percentage of runtime, average output over the entire curve, etc, etc.
> 
> And that is before even getting into the difference between advertising "lamp lumens" vs "out-the-front" or "torch" lumens :shrug:



again you are right, they have 2d pic and 4d specs, lol, 

yes, it is difficult, but i think best way is to compare both with fresh cells. also, i'm not 100% sure, but doesn't SF ratings are otf, not bulb lumens like maglite rates


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## archimedes (Aug 14, 2019)

alpg88 said:


> again you are right, they have 2d pic and 4d specs, lol....



Well, that's one way to do it :laughing:


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## bykfixer (Aug 14, 2019)

xxo said:


> The old vacuum bulbs for cheap 2D lights were typically 3-6 lumens, depending on the bulb.
> 
> The 2D Mag Krypton PR bulbs were 19 lumens.



Thank you. 
The PR4 in that old red 1970's Eveready _might_ have peaked out as much as 10-12 when alkaline batteries were brand new. The parts that thing were made of were not very electrical efficient so resistance from the get-go robbed it some. Switch parts, and other contact points were made of junk metal because it was cheap to produce. 

One of the things Tony Maglica did was to use more effiecient parts to conduct electricity from fuel source to beam. He kinda went back in time and used what flashlights had used before all the junk metal parts were used. That alone boosted the output. 
Krypton gas also boosted output. A 5 cell D Mag might have put out about as much as a SureFire 6P but SureFire used a secret combination of krypton and xenon for a brighter beam that did not soot the globe of the bulb. PK said it over drove the filament enough to cause the filament to fail before soot developed. 

Another Maglite inovation was the shape of the reflector versus previous lights that used a triangle shape and Maglite reflectors had a curve that helped cast the light like none before had done. So they appeared to be a lot brighter. Again going back in time and revamping an old idea from when a flashlight reflector was nickel plated, batteries were weak, and lenses were cloudy. Really early baby lights like a Franco 2C or a Daylo 2C had curved reflectors and fish eye lenses to cast light about as well as possible at the time. The Daylo 2C tried white reflectors back in the 1920's.

Speaking of 20's, it was the advent of xenon gas that allowed a 2D Maglite to put out lumens in the low to mid 20's.


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## lightfooted (Aug 14, 2019)

Yeah I don't think the old Evereadys were throwing out more than 10 lumens if even that. Maglites were such a huge improvement over those that I would never compare the two even though they could be from the same year. I do recall some 2D flashlights that could get relatively bright, as in brighter than my AA Minimag but I don't recall which one it was.


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## xxo (Aug 14, 2019)

It seems like most of the old 2D PR based bulb lights used either a PR9 (3.14 lumen rating) bulb or the PR6 (about 5.7 lumens). The PR9 was used in the military TL122 flashlights and the PR6 in the MX991. 

I think the early 2D Mag used a PR2 (10.06 lumen rated) vacuum bulbs. Later Mag offered krypton bulbs as an upgrade until they came out with the PR xenon bulbs as a upgrade and the krypton bulbs became standard. The Mag's focus and reflector are big advantages over the cheap fixed focus lights giving them much more throw and perceived brightness (lux is much more important to perceived brightness than lumens).


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## scout24 (Aug 14, 2019)

raggie33 said:


> wow so crazy and now i have a 2 inch light at 700 lumens lol and boy did i love maglights back in the day i saved and saved to get my first one



The FW3A is 3 5/8" long and rated at 2800 lumens. It's a crazy world...


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## raggie33 (Aug 14, 2019)

scout24 said:


> The FW3A is 3 5/8" long and rated at 2800 lumens. It's a crazy world...



friday ill see for sure lol i love small lights there my favs


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## raggie33 (Aug 15, 2019)

anyone recall the runtime on them relics? i loved mine as a kid i only liked them batts that had a cat on the label


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## AVService (Aug 15, 2019)

alpg88 said:


> back then maglite was pretty much the coolest light. especially mag charger, streamlight ultrastinger was another one. but not as popular as mag.
> mag used to be on top, now it barely keeps up,



I do not agree here at all.

I think we are a rare breed when it comes to judging and determining what is available in the world of handheld light and that most of the "Normal" folks still see the Maglite in all versions as a Benchmark of quality and performance as they know nothing about the world that we are in here with lights.

There is rarely a time when I wield a mighty tiny light still where someone does not compare it blindly to the Mag that they have and they are content "knowing" that their light is the King!

Ignorance is indeed bliss for them.


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## bykfixer (Aug 15, 2019)

I know plenty of people who only trust Maglites. 

Now, us flashaholics know how to make an ordinary flashlight…… 





That once put out oh, 6-12 lumens……





Put out a whole heckuva lot more.

2D now uses a pair of 18500 LifePo4's and a 4 cell Mag bulb.


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## snakebite (Aug 19, 2019)

the specs i remember were 
vacuum bulb about 10 lm on fresh batts.with a steep decline after about 15 min.
kypton around 15lm
xenon/halogen about 20lm.
even with alkalines the falloff was rather soon and steep.
these were 2 d cell and pr2 type lamp.
there were a few pr lamps that could do around 40lm on nicads.
like a kpr141.
i got some 3 cell "xenon plus" around 2006.
claimed 45lm.
that seemed to be the time improvements on pr bulbs hit the wall.
no sense doing r&d on something whos days were numbered.
i will say that one of those bulbs in a cheap 2d with a 3d printed 18650 adapter works well.
i did one up and stuck it on the shed wall.
a neighbor grabbed it while we were working on his truck.
and was surprised how well it worked since it was so light he thought there were no batteries.


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## StarHalo (Aug 19, 2019)

The problem with providing a single output number for a direct drive light is that it doesn't give you the whole picture; Quickbeam's simple runtime plot for the original Krypton 3D Maglite shows you what to expect - full brightness when you first install the batteries, half of which is already gone in the first hour, then leveling to a steadily declining sickly orange ~quarter of initial output. This is why the light seems great when you put in new batteries, then the next time you turn it on it's not as bright as you remember..


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