# best 18650 battery and charger



## kreisler (Nov 5, 2011)

Orion said:


> would the cheaper Ultrafire WF-188 charger be okay, or is it still better to spend more for the Pila? $23 vs. $47


i paid $16 for the WF-188 charger from some Hongkong site and am very happy with it. it was tested here:
http://lygte-info.dk/review/Review Charger UltraFire WF-188 UK.html

and also discussed on CPF somewhere. Cant report any problems with it!!


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## DisrupTer911 (Dec 31, 2011)

*Re: What is currently the best 18650 and charger setup?*

How does the new jet beam i4 intellicharger rank?

http://www.jet-beam.com/links/accessories/i4.aspx


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## Anders (Jan 1, 2012)

*Re: What is currently the best 18650 and charger setup?*

Hello.

I will do the search for you if you didnt have time for it:
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/search.php?searchid=83972


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## DisrupTer911 (Jan 1, 2012)

*Re: What is currently the best 18650 and charger setup?*

Your link goes to a search with 0 entries found. 

I did search jet beam i4 intellicharger & nothing relevant pops up & I'm not gonna spend all day reading every battery thread when I get the results.


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## Anders (Jan 1, 2012)

*Re: What is currently the best 18650 and charger setup?*

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?320968-JETBeam-Intellicharge-i4&highlight=ETBeam+Intellicharge+i4

[url]http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?324544-Review-of-Measurement-on-SysMax-i4-charger
[/URL]


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## Joe Talmadge (Jan 1, 2012)

*Re: What is currently the best 18650 and charger setup?*



DisrupTer911 said:


> How does the new jet beam i4 intellicharger rank?
> 
> http://www.jet-beam.com/links/accessories/i4.aspx



That charger should not be on a list of best of anything, to give you the short answer


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## BirdofPrey (Jan 1, 2012)

*Re: What is currently the best 18650 and charger setup?*

I was using the Pila with Eagletac cells. Then one day, after a very short while of charging, the charger had a serious melt down. I was told by a certain company to return the charger to them. After they got it, they told me I needed to have proof that I was using Pila batteries in it at the time it went kaboom.

Then, when I asked if I was just out of luck, they ceased speaking with me period. I was never rude, cussing, etc. Bad service from the importer, bad luck with the charger, bad information from the seller. Not sure a Pila will be the replacement for my Pila as much as I liked it when it was working properly.


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## 45/70 (Jan 2, 2012)

*Re: What is currently the best 18650 and charger setup?*

I don't know Bird. I had a friend that bought a new BMW 328i. He ended up having so many problems with it he had to "return" it, I believe under the "Lemon Law". That doesn't mean that BMW's are not good cars.

I'm not saying that the Pila charger is anywhere near the quality of a BMW, in fact, I'm sure it's not. It's just a good Chinese charger, compared to most of the rest of them anyway, and has for the most part an excellent reputation here on CPF.

There can be problems with any device. I've never owned a Pila, or a BMW, for that matter. From what I know from other's experiences though, I think both are quality products. I might very well own either of them in the future, however my "foreign" cars, have always been British.

Dave


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## SilverFox (Jan 2, 2012)

*Re: What is currently the best 18650 and charger setup?*

Hello BirdofPrey,

Pila customer "non-" service has always been an issue. It is fortunate that their charger has enough quality that problems with them are not common. Their seemingly combative stance on customer service and their premium price stand as offsets to their quality product.

Still, if my Pila charger ever dies, I would pick up another. Quality components and attention to detail translate to a safety margin when charging Li-Ion cells. That margin of safety gives me peace of mind when my wife goes to charge a cell.

Tom


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## David Sims (Mar 18, 2012)

The best 18650 battery that I know about is the AW 18650 LiCo battery of 3100 mAh capacity. You can buy it at Lighthound. One of them will keep a Romisen RC-T601 flashlight on the medium setting (initially ~650 lumens output) burning for about four hours, as the voltage goes from 4.23V to 2.73V.

I've found most Ultrafire batteries to be inferior, and some of them are generic cells of very low capacity (about half what is claimed on the false label), repackaged by dishonest Chinese merchants. However, I have found a spectacular exception to the rule.

One of my probably "fake" Ultrafire 18650 batteries, allegedly only 3000 mAh, has proved itself capable of keeping my Romisen RC-T601 flashlight going on the medium setting for 6h 30m, which suggests its capacity might be somewhere around 4500 to 5000 mAh. I'd had no idea that kind of performance was even possible, and I don't even know whether the Chinese manufacturer even knows how to replicate this level of quality. I've never had another 18650 battery that comes close to this kind of capacity.


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## 901-Memphis (Mar 18, 2012)

If i was buying protected 18650s right now i would be going with either AW 3100s or Callie's Kustoms 3100s and charging them on a Pila IBC. I already have a pila ibc and have already in the past bought a couple of AW 2900s, so i won't be upgrading until these cells stop working.


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## mauiblue (Mar 19, 2012)

RediLast 3100 cells were the ones I settled on for my power needs and the Pila IBC charger.


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## iron potato (Mar 19, 2012)

Not an expert, my 18650 ranging from Hi-Max 2600mAh, AW's 2900mAh & UN-protected Panasonic 3100mAh, charged up with Xtar WP2 II or WP6 II charger


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## photon1c (Aug 13, 2012)

Sorry to bring up a dead thread, but I have one flashlight which uses a 18650 battery, most of the rest are CR123A and normal alkalines (AA, AAA, C, D, etc). But I don't have a charger. I don't want to spend $50 on a charger for one battery (and I don't see myself getting more lights which use this battery). Can anyone recommend a decent charger that I can use? I don't mind putting it outside or on a non-flammable surface, if that is a problem. How long do these chargers usually take to charge an average-capacity battery?

Thanks


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## HKJ (Aug 13, 2012)

photon1c said:


> Sorry to bring up a dead thread, but I have one flashlight which uses a 18650 battery, most of the rest are CR123A and normal alkalines (AA, AAA, C, D, etc). But I don't have a charger. I don't want to spend $50 on a charger for one battery (and I don't see myself getting more lights which use this battery). Can anyone recommend a decent charger that I can use? I don't mind putting it outside or on a non-flammable surface, if that is a problem. How long do these chargers usually take to charge an average-capacity battery?
> 
> Thanks



Get a ML-102 from intl-outdoor, it is a cheap and good USB charger (i.e. you must supply a USB power supply). It uses about 5 hours to fully charge a 2600mAh battery.
Next step up is a Xtar WP2 II or maybe a Nitecore i4 V2 (This charger can also charge NiMH).


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## Sparky's Magic (Aug 13, 2012)

The current white wrapper EagleTac 3100mAh. are the best I have ever used and they fit all my 'lights!


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## HighlanderNorth (Aug 20, 2012)

http://compare.ebay.com/like/390315497951?var=lv&ltyp=AllFixedPriceItemTypes&var=sbar

No, seriously, get this:
[h=3]2 PCS Panasonic NCR18650A 3100mAh Protected Battery[/h]
and this: *SYSMAX/Nitecore Intellicharge i4 Li-Ion Ni-Cd Ni-MH 4-Channel ...*


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## Shadowww (Aug 20, 2012)

HighlanderNorth said:


> and this: *SYSMAX/Nitecore Intellicharge i4 Li-Ion Ni-Cd Ni-MH 4-Channel ...*


Erm no, unless he *needs* NiMH support, that's a bad choice. Xtar's both WP2 II and SP2 are much better.


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## HighlanderNorth (Aug 20, 2012)

Shadowww said:


> Erm no, unless he *needs* NiMH support, that's a bad choice. Xtar's both WP2 II and SP2 are much better.




I've had an I4 for months, and I've recharged countless NiMh and LiIon batts with it with zero problems. HKJ just recommended it as well.


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## Shadowww (Aug 21, 2012)

HighlanderNorth said:


> I've had an I4 for months, and I've recharged countless NiMh and LiIon batts with it with zero problems. HKJ just recommended it as well.



Just because you had zero problems with it doesn't means it's best (& best value) for his needs.


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## photon1c (Sep 7, 2012)

I ended up remembering that I had a charger that came with a laser I bought... duh me.

Thanks for the info though. If I get more devices that use these batteries I will look at those Xtar chargers more closely. PS When I googled those chargers, all the hits seemed to be about e-cigarettes? I guess they use similar batteries.


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## ZRXBILL (Sep 8, 2012)

Shadowww said:


> Erm no, unless he *needs* NiMH support, that's a bad choice. Xtar's both WP2 II and SP2 are much better.



What makes these better than the i4?


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## gopajti (Sep 8, 2012)

New XTAR chargers with voltage display coming in next 2-3 month


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## Shadowww (Sep 8, 2012)

ZRXBILL said:


> What makes these better than the i4?


WP2 II: better (and more appropriate) current options, USB output support.
SP2: perfect CC/CV, again, better and more appropriate current options.


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## photon1c (Sep 8, 2012)

Also cheaper (right?)


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## Shadowww (Sep 8, 2012)

photon1c said:


> Also cheaper (right?)



The WP2 II - yes.


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## Up All Night (Sep 8, 2012)

Consider the 4sevens charger, version 3, I believe. I've been using it since its release with zero issues, 14500's, 16340's and 18650's all come off at 4.16v and settle at 4.15v. Never gets warm, two charge rates and good construction. I own less than ten li-ion cells so the single bay doesn't hamper me at all. Backed by 4sevens c/s if you have an issue.
I'm looking to expand and may just buy another, but I am intrigued by some of the newcomers. I wonder if you may see a price drop on the Pila if enough cc/cv chargers prove worthy?


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## march.brown (Sep 8, 2012)

Up All Night said:


> Consider the 4sevens charger, version 3, I believe. I've been using it since its release with zero issues, 14500's, 16340's and 18650's all come off at 4.16v and settle at 4.15v. Never gets warm, two charge rates and good construction. I own less than ten li-ion cells so the single bay doesn't hamper me at all. Backed by 4sevens c/s if you have an issue.
> I'm looking to expand and may just buy another, but I am intrigued by some of the newcomers. I wonder if you may see a price drop on the Pila if enough cc/cv chargers prove worthy?


Why not just make up a couple of chargers with the cheap charger boards ... You can get four boards for about £5 including postage ... These are genuine CC/CV charger boards ... Solder a couple of leads on and put croc clips on the other end of the leads ... Clip the croc clips onto 6mm or 8mm diameter X 8mm long magnets ... Apply the magnets (correctly) with the leads clipped on , to the Li Ion 18650 battery making sure the polarity is correct ... You will need a USB male to mini-USB male lead , mine are very short ones about 12" ... Plug the USB lead into the USB power supply unit and the other mini-USB end of the cable into the charger board ... Switch on the USB PSU , and that's it ... There are only two soldered joints to make ... This is for 18650's only as it charges at one amp , assuming that the PSU will provide one amp ... Wait till the LED changes colour and it's done.

Some boards (like my 4) are Blue for charging and Red for charge complete , others are the other way round ... I am very pleased with my four cheap chargers and they work superbly and are so easy to make (and store) ... I started off using one amp USB PSU's that plug into the mains sockets and they worked perfectly ... Had to use one for each charger board.

I have now made a five volt four amp PSU fitted with four USB sockets , though I only usually charge two batteries at a time ... I was very sceptical about how these (dirt-cheap) charger boards would work , but am delighted with them ... When the LED's change colour , the charging current virtually stops (just a few milliamps) ... If you leave the battery on charge for a while after the LED's change colour , the battery voltage drops a few millivolts proving that the charging current has virtually stopped.

If you want to charge at a lower current than one amp for other batteries , then you will have to change a resistor ... I have not bothered with this as I only use these for Li-Ions of over 2400mAh and even these batteries are being replaced by Panasonic 3100mAh cells ... So no problem.
.


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## CamoNinja (Sep 8, 2012)

Get a charger from cottonpicker at CPFMP.


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## KingMonkey (Sep 8, 2012)

I am using the charger from larryDFW and it seems like it is pretty good for a cheap one but this is my first time working with 18650 cell's. Since my cells are unprotected I typically charge them once every 5 days the cells are down to 3volts or so. Take two to three hrs and they are back up to 4.17-4.2 range. Typically when I pull them straight off the charger they are 4.2 and then seem to hang around 4.17 but mind you it could be my meter since it is analog my readings my be a tad off. But when I go to work I tend to test them with our digital meters to verify.


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## anethema (Sep 10, 2012)

Ditto on 4sevens charger.
https://www.foursevens.com/product_info.php?products_id=3142

25 bucks, perfect 4.2v CC/CV, can charge any size from 16340 (rechargable 123A types) to huge 26650 without any mods/spacers. Has 1 amp and half amp charge rates. Has a 3.6 volt charge setting for lithium iron phosphate batteries if you ever get into those (the only real SAFE lithium chemistry). 

Really can't go wrong IMO.


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## Replay13 (Oct 24, 2012)

*Looking for 18650 batteries and charger suggestions*

Hello,

I am going to purchase a Sunwayman T20CS or similar flashlight that runs on one 18650 battery. Now I am looking for suggestions on batteries and chargers.

Any opinions or experience with this setup? It has all 5 star reviews. http://www.amazon.com/dp/B004AWE2L2/?tag=cpf0b6-20

Thanks for your time,
James


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## Shadowww (Oct 24, 2012)

Replay13 said:


> *Looking for 18650 batteries and charger suggestions*
> 
> Hello,
> 
> ...


Great charger & great batteries. Not much more to wish for.


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## varuscelli (Oct 25, 2012)

Replay13 said:


> Any opinions or experience with this setup? It has all 5 star reviews. http://www.amazon.com/dp/B004AWE2L2/?tag=cpf0b6-20



Damn. I like the looks/functionality of that charger.


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## Shadowww (Oct 25, 2012)

varuscelli said:


> Damn. I like the looks/functionality of that charger.



You can get one separately for ~$20.


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## varuscelli (Oct 25, 2012)

Shadowww said:


> You can get one separately for ~$20.



That price looks hard to beat. I've been using the Pila IBC charger for a number of years now, but I'd be tempted to get one of these XTAR WP2 II chargers (if I've got the name right) as well for that price.


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## snakyjake (Oct 25, 2012)

gopajti said:


> New XTAR chargers with voltage display coming in next 2-3 month



Where can I learn more about this upcoming charger?


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## Peter mport (Oct 28, 2012)

*2x 18650 battery's and charger recommendations (UK)*

As per title.

Im after 2x18650 battery's and a charger for my UltraFire WF-501B Cree R2-WC 250 lumen flashlight.


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## fivemega (Oct 28, 2012)

*Re: 2x 18650 battery's and charger recommendations (UK)*



Peter mport said:


> Im after 2x18650 battery's and a charger for my UltraFire WF-501B Cree R2-WC 250 lumen flashlight.



*You may want to check here.*


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## Peter mport (Oct 29, 2012)

*Re: 2x 18650 battery's and charger recommendations (UK)*

Thanks for that even though i meant to start my own post and made it here instead


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## verysimple (Oct 29, 2012)

*Re: 2x 18650 battery's and charger recommendations (UK)*

How is Xtar WP2 II for a changer or should I wait on the new model?


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## Shadowww (Oct 29, 2012)

*Re: 2x 18650 battery's and charger recommendations (UK)*



verysimple said:


> How is Xtar WP2 II for a changer or should I wait on the new model?


WP2 II is great, it's most bang-for-the-buck I guess. Uses proper charging algorithm, terminates correctly, and also has some unique features (like USB output).


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## verysimple (Oct 29, 2012)

source and model please.



gopajti said:


> New XTAR chargers with voltage display coming in next 2-3 month


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## Norm (Oct 29, 2012)

*Re: 2x 18650 battery's and charger recommendations (UK)*



Peter mport said:


> Thanks for that even though i meant to start my own post and made it here instead


Grouping similar posts gives you access to answers you may not have found otherwise and saves repeating the same information ad infinitum. - Norm


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## neutralwhite (Oct 29, 2012)

*Re: 2x 18650 battery's and charger recommendations (UK)*

i now have the FENIX ARE C1 .


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## dudemar (Oct 30, 2012)

*Re: 2x 18650 battery's and charger recommendations (UK)*

I'll put in my vote for Pila batteries and the IBC charger. If you buy the batteries individually they aren't cheap, but they're reliable and work every time. AW also makes great cells.


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## 808Pants (Oct 30, 2012)

I'm circling Panasonic 3400mAh protected cells (NCR18650B). 

I thought I'd share pricing from Hong Kong (Shenzhen Fest Technology Co., Ltd.) on their "NCR18650B Protected 3400mAh Rechargeable Li-ion Battery" - see 
http://e-young.en.alibaba.com/produ...&edm_cta=read_msg&edm_time=realtime&edm_ver=e
Partial specs:

Place of OriginJapanBrand NameNCRModel NumberNCR18650B (P)TypeLi-IonNominal Voltage3.7VSize65mm(L)*18mm(D)Nominal Capacity3400mah

I was quoted USD8.37/pc. 

As to shipping (in my case, to USA):
"If you buy 4 pcs batery and the shipping cost $15.2 by HKPOST about 2-4 weeks
If you buy 100 pcs batery and the shipping cost $78.7 by DHL about 5-6 days"

Breaking it down, that's 
$12.17/cell delivered, in qty of four ea
$9.16/cell delivered, in qty of 100 ea.

Best pricing I see on ebay, for comparison, is $26.50/pair - but that's also from Hong Kong, so same shipping delay applies.

**I gotta ask: if the best cells are made in Japan, why aren't they being SOLD from Japan? Merely because the Chinese assemble & package the individual cells? Hard to imagine that being cost-effective - once the cells are made, since that seems like the bulk of the work.


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## Shadowww (Oct 30, 2012)

808Pants said:


> **I gotta ask: if the best cells are made in Japan, why aren't they being SOLD from Japan? Merely because the Chinese assemble & package the individual cells? Hard to imagine that being cost-effective - once the cells are made, since that seems like the bulk of the work.


For 2 reasons:
1. Shenzhen Fest Technology imports them in thousands to make protected versions (Efest 3400mAh, for example), and sell remaining stock in unprotected form to not overflow their warehouses (or for some other reasons).
2. Shipping small quantities of cells from China or Hong Kong is much cheaper than shipping them from Japan.


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## mccririck (Nov 2, 2012)

Is the Trustfire TR-003 a good charger?


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## photon1c (Nov 2, 2012)

march.brown said:


> Why not just make up a couple of chargers with the cheap charger boards ... You can get four boards for about £5 including postage ... These are genuine CC/CV charger boards ... Solder a couple of leads on and put croc clips on the other end of the leads ... Clip the croc clips onto 6mm or 8mm diameter X 8mm long magnets ... Apply the magnets (correctly) with the leads clipped on , to the Li Ion 18650 battery making sure the polarity is correct ... You will need a USB male to mini-USB male lead , mine are very short ones about 12" ... Plug the USB lead into the USB power supply unit and the other mini-USB end of the cable into the charger board ... Switch on the USB PSU , and that's it ... There are only two soldered joints to make ... This is for 18650's only as it charges at one amp , assuming that the PSU will provide one amp ... Wait till the LED changes colour and it's done.
> 
> Some boards (like my 4) are Blue for charging and Red for charge complete , others are the other way round ... I am very pleased with my four cheap chargers and they work superbly and are so easy to make (and store) ... I started off using one amp USB PSU's that plug into the mains sockets and they worked perfectly ... Had to use one for each charger board.
> 
> ...



I am handy at this stuff so this is interesting to me; what is a good source for the boards?

Thanks


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## Norm (Nov 2, 2012)

photon1c said:


> I am handy at this stuff so this is interesting to me; what is a good source for the boards?
> 
> Thanks



Threads relating to these boards Really cheap true cc/cv usb charging board 


And Review of / Measurement on Charger module with TP4056 controller 

Norm


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## mccririck (Nov 4, 2012)

*help me choose a charger and batteries*

There are two chargers I cannot choose between:

Trustfire TR-003
XTAR WP2 II

And for batteries I think I'm going for the 18650 Sanyo 2600mAh (I think they are unprotected - does this matter?)

Can anyone also recommend some 14500 batteries to try?


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## Shadowww (Nov 4, 2012)

*Re: help me choose a charger and batteries*



mccririck said:


> Trustfire TR-003
> XTAR WP2 II


Xtar WP2 II obviously, for few reasons:
1. made by reputable company (therefore better QC and less chances of getting a fake)
2. follows correct CC/CV with proper termination
3. has USB output functionality

For 14500 - Sanyo UR14500P cell is pretty much "top of the line".


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## THE_dAY (Nov 5, 2012)

gopajti said:


> New XTAR chargers with voltage display coming in next 2-3 month



Can someone explain please, 

Would this new voltage display feature mean it could replace using a DMM for checking cell voltage?


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## Norm (Nov 5, 2012)

Have a look at Soshine SC-S7 if you only need a single channel charger with Voltage readout.
I bought one to have a look, quite happy with it.

Norm


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## THE_dAY (Nov 5, 2012)

Thanks I'll check it out!


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## mccririck (Nov 6, 2012)

Norm said:


> Have a look at Soshine SC-S7 if you only need a single channel charger with Voltage readout.
> I bought one to have a look, quite happy with it.
> 
> Norm



That looks really good!


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## Maximus928 (Nov 28, 2012)

*best 18650 batteries?*

This is my second post..........I need some extra 18650 batteries, any suggestions pls?.............I have 3 AW IC Proctected Li-ion 18650 2600mAh at the moment..............are those ultrafire 18650 3000mAh 3.7v batteries any good?..........Tnx in adavance!


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## Shadowww (Nov 29, 2012)

*Re: best 18650 batteries?*



Maximus928 said:


> This is my second post..........I need some extra 18650 batteries, any suggestions pls?.............I have 3 AW IC Proctected Li-ion 18650 2600mAh at the moment..............are those ultrafire 18650 3000mAh 3.7v batteries any good?..........Tnx in adavance!


Nope they aren't.
Anything with "Fire" in name (except for SureFire) should generally be avoided, especially when it comes to dangerous stuff like batteries and chargers.
I'd recommend you getting Eagletac 3400mAh batteries, they're one of smallest protected batteries available.


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## Maximus928 (Nov 29, 2012)

*Re: best 18650 batteries?*



Shadowww said:


> Nope they aren't.
> Anything with "Fire" in name (except for SureFire) should generally be avoided, especially when it comes to dangerous stuff like batteries and chargers.
> I'd recommend you getting Eagletac 3400mAh batteries, they're one of smallest protected batteries available.



Thanks Shadowww! I really appreciate it.


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## TimVickroy (Nov 29, 2012)

*Re: best 18650 batteries?*

I am currently considering one of the following chargers for 18650 batteries:

NiteCore Intellicharge I4 v.2
XTAR WP2 II
Fenix ARE-C1

Is one of these chargers clearly better than the others? Is there another model that I should be considering instead? Thanks!


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## HKJ (Nov 29, 2012)

*Re: best 18650 batteries?*



TimVickroy said:


> I am currently considering one of the following chargers for 18650 batteries:
> 
> NiteCore Intellicharge I4 v.2
> XTAR WP2 II
> ...



You can read about the first two on my website.
I do have the Fenix in queue and will probably be finished with it in about two weeks.


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## neutralwhite (Nov 29, 2012)

*Re: best 18650 batteries?*

thanks from a fenix lover!. 


HKJ said:


> You can read about the first two on my website.
> I do have the Fenix in queue and will probably be finished with it in about two weeks.


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## Wacki (Dec 2, 2012)

Niconical said:


> To answer the question "Why do CPF members hold AW and his batteries in high regard?" my answer would be this. "It is because overall, and taking all things into consideration, and not focusing only on one aspect, fastest, highest, cheapest or whatever, AW and his batteries offer a very good option in terms of reliability, performance, service and price".
> 
> Note: The important parts of the answer are highlighted in red.
> 
> ...




I think I'm more confused on AW than ever. The guy asked the following:



> Would you be so kind to make a short and concise list of the factors? I'm serious. Thanks.





Can someone please list all the factors? This is what I imagine.

Cell capacity ( in mAh )
Cell lifespan (# of cycles)
Cell failure rate (ability to hold charge)
Protected circuit reliability


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## CJ00TA (Dec 3, 2012)

*New to rechargeables - Battery setup recomendations*

So, I've been reading this forum for the better part of a couple of hours now and I don't really have an idea as to "what's best for me". Halp? 

I just bought a TK35 u2 and looking for my first setup for rechargeable 18650's.

What's the going thought on the best (most powerful & longest lasting 3000+ mah? HKJ's post interests me at 3400 but most critical, safe) batteries for this specific light? I'll be using it primarily for camping and around the house duties. 

I'm also new to the protected vs non-protected batteries. I see that some are different lengths - again, just looking to use these specifically in this TK35 U2.

Also need a charger for them.

USA/ships to USA Specific Links/vendor links would be hugely appreciated. Likely going to buy 4 batteries and 1 charger.

Thanks a ton!

edit: yes, I did see this... but just wanting verification for my specific application - http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?178727-best-18650-battery-and-charger


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## CJ00TA (Dec 3, 2012)

*Re: New to rechargeables - Battery setup recomendations*

Thinking that these might work: 3400mah Eagletac Protected

http://goinggear.com/eagletac-protected-18650-3400-mah-rechargeable-3-7v-li-ion-battery.html


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## READYSETGO (Dec 3, 2012)

*Re: New to rechargeables - Battery setup recomendations*

Same question - I have several different flashlights that will take the 18650's. Need battery & charger advise. Looking at Xstar WPII for the charger.


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## ObserverJLin (Dec 5, 2012)

*Best 18650 battery and charger recommendation plz.*

I have found an AW 18650 that comes at £18 each. http://www.fenixtorch.co.uk/batteries/AW-18650-3100.html
And a charger Intellicharge i4 - Version 2 at £22.

What do you guys think of the two mentioned above.
Any good recommendations?
Thx in advance.


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## mr.snakeman (Dec 5, 2012)

*Re: Best 18650 battery and charger recommendation plz.*

You would probably have a better chance for an answer by posting this thread in the "Flashlight Electronics-Batteries Included" forum. Welcome to the CPF.


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## Thr3Evo (Dec 5, 2012)

*Re: Best 18650 battery and charger recommendation plz.*

Actually your best option would be to make use of the search option on this forum as one of these questions is posted just about every other day around here. 
Here this took me less than 5 seconds to pull up:
http://www.google.com/search?q=Best+18650&sitesearch=www.candlepowerforums.com


----------



## gotajeep (Dec 5, 2012)

*Re: Best 18650 battery and charger recommendation plz.*

I use a pila ibc charger and the aw3100 mah ptotected cells.they seem to work pretty well but i want to step up to the 3400 mah cells.

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## ObserverJLin (Dec 5, 2012)

*Re: What is currently the best 18650 and charger setup?*

Many of you are saying Pila is the best but it is also the most expensive. Has anyone heard of the NITECORE INTELLICHARGE I4 VERSION 2?

http://www.nitecore.co.uk/chargers/intellicharge-i4.html

It is half the price of the Pila.


----------



## Erzengel (Dec 5, 2012)

*Re: What is currently the best 18650 and charger setup?*

The European price of the Pila (usually 50€) is too high. I recommend the XTAR SP2, it is sold for 35€ in Germany and offers selectable charging current and fits all cells from 14500 to 26650.


----------



## Shadowww (Dec 5, 2012)

*Re: What is currently the best 18650 and charger setup?*



Erzengel said:


> The European price of the Pila (usually 50€) is too high. I recommend the XTAR SP2, it is sold for 35€ in Germany and offers selectable charging current and fits all cells from 14500 to 26650.


It's even cheaper on Aliexpress (25-30 EUR)


----------



## ObserverJLin (Dec 5, 2012)

*Re: What is currently the best 18650 and charger setup?*

What about NITECORE INTELLICHARGE I4 VERSION 2? No good?


----------



## Shadowww (Dec 5, 2012)

*Re: What is currently the best 18650 and charger setup?*



ObserverJLin said:


> What about NITECORE INTELLICHARGE I4 VERSION 2? No good?


For Li-Ion's, it's good enough for most purposes (but not very fast.. with all 4 bays loaded up with empty 18650's, it may take over 10 hours to charge them).


----------



## ObserverJLin (Dec 6, 2012)

*Re: What is currently the best 18650 and charger setup?*



Shadowww said:


> For Li-Ion's, it's good enough for most purposes (but not very fast.. with all 4 bays loaded up with empty 18650's, it may take over 10 hours to charge them).



whoa that long. Looks like Pila is the best then. But also the most expensive XD


----------



## Erzengel (Dec 6, 2012)

*Re: What is currently the best 18650 and charger setup?*

The Pila is also very slow with it's 500mA charging current. Therefore I swotched from the Pila to the XTAR SP2.


----------



## Norm (Dec 6, 2012)

*Re: What is currently the best 18650 and charger setup?*

An interesting thread: Pila IBC Charger Compendium 



Erzengel said:


> The Pila is also very slow with it's 500mA charging current. Therefore I swotched from the Pila to the XTAR SP2.



The charge current is 600mA not 500mA a small difference.

Norm


----------



## Shadowww (Dec 6, 2012)

*Re: What is currently the best 18650 and charger setup?*



ObserverJLin said:


> whoa that long. Looks like Pila is the best then. But also the most expensive XD


With just 2 cells (= same as Pila IBC supports), i4 is faster than Pila IBC (750mA for i4, 600mA for Pila IBC).


----------



## Cappys29 (Dec 16, 2012)

*Looking for a good 18650's.*

I know this topic comes up all the time and I did search but a lot of links are old and don't work. I am looking for about 4 good 18650's preferably panasonics, and I was wondering where was a good place to buy them because I know there is a lot of fakes floating around. There is a lot of good deals on Ebay, but I am kind of skeptical to buy them.


----------



## FlashKat (Dec 16, 2012)

*Re: Looking for a good 18650's.*

Go to the CPF Marketplace and look for AW, Redilast, etc.


----------



## awyeah (Dec 16, 2012)

*Re: best 18650 batteries?*



Shadowww said:


> I'd recommend you getting Eagletac 3400mAh batteries, they're one of smallest protected batteries available.



Is EagleTac a brand we trust? I'm sure it's not regarded the same as AW, Callie's Kustoms, and Readilast, but I have a local dealer around here who sells a variety of EagleTac batteries.


----------



## Shadowww (Dec 16, 2012)

*Re: best 18650 batteries?*



awyeah said:


> Is EagleTac a brand we trust? I'm sure it's not regarded the same as AW, Callie's Kustoms, and Readilast, but I have a local dealer around here who sells a variety of EagleTac batteries.


Why would AW, CK and RL be regarded more than EagleTac? At least EagleTac have flashlight manufacturing behind them, unlike AW, Redilast and CK.


----------



## braddy (Dec 16, 2012)

*Re: best 18650 batteries?*



Shadowww said:


> Nope they aren't.
> Anything with "Fire" in name (except for SureFire) should generally be avoided, especially when it comes to dangerous stuff like batteries and chargers.
> I'd recommend you getting Eagletac 3400mAh batteries, they're one of smallest protected batteries available.



Someone made an argument that the Trustfire 3000 was the best match up with the XinTD C8 because of it's discharge numbers at 2.8A (something about the (?) and orange portion on the graphs), was that valid?

What about matching the battery to the light, is that the way to find a bargain for those of us trying to avoid investing so much in the most expensive batteries?


----------



## Shadowww (Dec 16, 2012)

*Re: best 18650 batteries?*



braddy said:


> Someone made an argument that the Trustfire 3000 was the best match up with the XinTD C8 because of it's discharge numbers at 2.8A (something about the (?) and orange portion on the graphs), was that valid?


Genuine Trustfire 3000mAh batteries are very good for their price, but there's too high chance of getting fake ones. Rather just spend couple bucks more on batteries that have Sanyo 2600mAh cell inside.


----------



## awyeah (Dec 16, 2012)

*Re: best 18650 batteries?*



Shadowww said:


> Why would AW, CK and RL be regarded more than EagleTac? At least EagleTac have flashlight manufacturing behind them, unlike AW, Redilast and CK.



I'm not sure - that's why I'm asking - I'm just getting into secondary cells. It seems that those guys are recommended more than anyone else.


----------



## Shadowww (Dec 16, 2012)

*Re: best 18650 batteries?*



awyeah said:


> I'm not sure - that's why I'm asking - I'm just getting into secondary cells. It seems that those guys are recommended more than anyone else.


That's because they appeared many years ago, while Eagletac got into business just recently (year or two ago). Their batteries are as good as AW's in some aspects, and in some aspects they're actually even better (button top instead of flat top; and better protection).


----------



## awyeah (Dec 16, 2012)

*Re: best 18650 batteries?*

Better protection, you say? That's excellent to hear. If you have seen my previous posts on this area of the forum, you'll know that I've largely stayed away from these types of cells because I'm nervous about them. Thanks!


----------



## Fate0n3 (Dec 16, 2012)

I gave the eagletech 18650 3100mah a try and love them they are great batteries for the cost. I also picked up the i4 v2, I was a little worried I am not usually a fan of devices that don't give the user options but my major selling point was the ability to charge all different kinds of batteries at once. It def does exactly what they say it does, mine when charging enloop XXX aa tho does get pretty warm.


----------



## oKtosiTe (Dec 17, 2012)

*Re: What is currently the best 18650 and charger setup?*



DisrupTer911 said:


> Your link goes to a search with 0 entries found.
> 
> I did search jet beam i4 intellicharger & nothing relevant pops up & I'm not gonna spend all day reading every battery thread when I get the results.



The Intellicharger is very often incorrectly referred to as the Intellicharge (hence searching for Intellicharger will give limited results) and it is produced by SYSMAX, which produces Jet-Beam's products, as well as NITECORE's, perhaps among others.
Searching for SYSMAX Intellicharge may give better results.

I'm quite happy with mine as a Li-ion charger, and satisfied with it as a NiMH charger, although I don't use it for that very often.


----------



## Changchung (Dec 17, 2012)

ObserverJLin said:


> What about NITECORE INTELLICHARGE I4 VERSION 2? No good?



I have mine for last five months and I like it, work perfect, I can charge all my batteries in the same charger, no at the same time, I recomend it.



Shadowww said:


> Why would AW, CK and RL be regarded more than EagleTac? At least EagleTac have flashlight manufacturing behind them, unlike AW, Redilast and CK.



I think the same, I think that the peoples just follow that the other follow without even wanting to try something else, not knowing that there are better options


Sent from my phone with camera with flash and internet on it...


----------



## P7rancher (Dec 18, 2012)

*My first custom, thanks to Mac: will be used in Puerto Vallarta to tame the night!!*

Just ordered a copper Tri EDC with clip, glow, crenelated bezel and XPG2's, my first custom light. Mac was very patient with my many questions.

Also, thanks to all of you for the informative threads and to nbp for the suggestions.

My next question: What is the *best charger *and* battery's *for my new toy/work tool? I want a really safe charger!!!!! This my first rechargeable battery set-up.

Thanks in advance,
Steve


----------



## KuanR (Dec 18, 2012)

*Re: My first custom, thanks to Mac: will be used in Puerto Vallarta to tame the night*

The light performs best with AW 18350 IMR cell. I recommend Cottonpickers Nona Charger.


----------



## mvyrmnd (Dec 18, 2012)

*Re: My first custom, thanks to Mac: will be used in Puerto Vallarta to tame the night*



KuanR said:


> The light performs best with AW 18350 IMR cell. I recommend Cottonpickers Nona Charger.



Not much to argue with there 

+1


----------



## neutralwhite (Dec 21, 2012)

*Re: My first custom, thanks to Mac: will be used in Puerto Vallarta to tame the night*

well im using the FENIX ARE C1, but after HKJ's report, im not still so sure. contacted fenix on this. 

am I safe?.


http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...E-C1-Charger&p=4094864&highlight=#post4094864


----------



## Tulip bush (Dec 22, 2012)

*Battery charger and battery advice for newbie*

Hi all....hope I've posted in the right section.

I previously owned a led lenser m14, but I sold due to problems. I am getting a fenix tk41 off Father Christmas soon and I have recently treated myself to a thrunite ti.....which I really like.

Now I have read a bit about eneloop rechargable AA batteries been quite good, so I'm considering getting 8 of these, but I also need a reputable charger to go with these, been new to all this I'm not sure which one to get. I think in time I may buy a light that needs those 18650 batteries or those small 3 volt ones (cr123?), so I was thinking of one charger that can master all these types of batteries.

I came across this one (sysmax-intellicharge-i4) on a uk flash light site......... Can anybody tell me if this is a good charger, suitable for my needs.

Also, if anybody can advise me on how to look after/use etc 18650, as I hear they can be dangerous. I would buy some quality ones, but is there any routine checks/procedures I need to follow.

i am used to using 14/36v lithium hand tool batteries , but all I need to do with those is charge and use, trying to avoid complete discharge because I think this can damage them.

Thank you in advance.


----------



## Changchung (Dec 22, 2012)

neutralwhite said:


> well im using the FENIX ARE C1, but after HKJ's report, im not still so sure. contacted fenix on this.
> 
> am I safe?.
> 
> ...



Charger not recomended...

The nona is a good option for a single battery, small, easy to carry and reliable.


Sent from my phone with camera with flash and internet on it...


----------



## CyberCT (Dec 22, 2012)

I just bought 10 of the KeepPower 18650s (more like 18700) batteries based off the Panasonic 3400mah cells. They probably won't arrive for 2 weeks. I have a Pila IBC which I have used for my AW 2900mah cells and it worked great. These new batteries are a little larger. So I want a QUALITY charger that WILL fit the 3400mah batteries, and charge hopefully 4 at one time. What is the recommendation from people that have the 3400mah cells?


----------



## JerryM (Dec 22, 2012)

*Re: Battery charger and battery advice for newbie*

I just received a sysmax-intellicharge-i4. I also wanted one to replace a couple of chargers. However, I read that it will shorten the life of 16430, or whatever the number is for the rechargeable 123 size. I also wonder if it will work well with eneloops? I have an eneloop charger so if not it won't be too bad.

I hope someone will help us.

Jerry


----------



## HKJ (Dec 22, 2012)

CyberCT said:


> I just bought 10 of the KeepPower 18650s (more like 18700) batteries based off the Panasonic 3400mah cells. They probably won't arrive for 2 weeks. I have a Pila IBC which I have used for my AW 2900mah cells and it worked great. These new batteries are a little larger. So I want a QUALITY charger that WILL fit the 3400mah batteries, and charge hopefully 4 at one time. What is the recommendation from people that have the 3400mah cells?



One of the best chargers you can get is the Xtar SP2, but it will only charger two batteries at a time and it is not recommended to run it at full current with the 3400mAh batteries (Keep it at 1A setting).


----------



## neutralwhite (Dec 22, 2012)

thanks HKJ, and what will the new out soon XTAR charger be able to charge?. two as well?, and whats the differences with this new charger and the old SP2, really ?
cheers again.


----------



## HKJ (Dec 22, 2012)

neutralwhite said:


> thanks HKJ, and what will the new out soon XTAR charger be able to charge?. two as well?, and whats the differences with this new charger and the old SP2, really ?
> cheers again.



I cannot say anything about the new charger. I do hope Xtar will send on to me for testing, they do that sometimes.


----------



## mccririck (Dec 22, 2012)

neutralwhite said:


> thanks HKJ, and what will the new out soon XTAR charger be able to charge?. two as well?, and whats the differences with this new charger and the old SP2, really ?
> cheers again.



I was hoping the new Xtar with the display will replace the WP2 and have a USB output.


----------



## neutralwhite (Dec 22, 2012)

will wait and see. 
thank you.


HKJ said:


> I cannot say anything about the new charger. I do hope Xtar will send on to me for testing, they do that sometimes.


----------



## cognitivefun (Dec 31, 2012)

http://www.fasttech.com/products/14...onic-ncr18650b-protected-rechargeable-3400mah

Are these any good? They say "Panasonic" but the photos of the product don't say that. How do we know what we are really getting?


----------



## Changchung (Dec 31, 2012)

cognitivefun said:


> http://www.fasttech.com/products/14...onic-ncr18650b-protected-rechargeable-3400mah
> 
> Are these any good? They say "Panasonic" but the photos of the product don't say that. How do we know what we are really getting?



If you check the good deal section you will found that some others and my buy some of this, we will see what we get, look genuine for me...


Sent from my phone with camera with flash and internet on it...


----------



## Shadowww (Dec 31, 2012)

cognitivefun said:


> http://www.fasttech.com/products/14...onic-ncr18650b-protected-rechargeable-3400mah
> 
> Are these any good? They say "Panasonic" but the photos of the product don't say that. How do we know what we are really getting?


Genuine Panasonic cells aren't labelled "Panasonic" anywhere, that's just how they are.
That's because they aren't sold in retail normally, so Panasonic doesn't really needs to waste their time and money printing good looking logos and stuff.

*See Rule #3 Do not Hot Link images. Please host on an image site, Imageshack or similar and repost – Thanks Norm*

This is how those cells look in bulk packaging.


----------



## cognitivefun (Dec 31, 2012)

Shadowww said:


> Genuine Panasonic cells aren't labelled "Panasonic" anywhere, that's just how they are.
> That's because they aren't sold in retail normally, so Panasonic doesn't really needs to waste their time and money printing good looking logos and stuff.
> 
> *See Rule #3 Do not Hot Link images. Please host on an image site, Imageshack or similar and repost – Thanks Norm*
> ...



What's confusing is that these are labeled Made In Japan, but they often come from Chinese suppliers. ARe the Chinese just putting on the outside jacket then? Is there a way to know these are genuine Panasonics and not cheap knockoffs?


----------



## Shadowww (Dec 31, 2012)

There weren't any fake Panasonic NCR series cells seen out in the wild.


----------



## CyberCT (Dec 31, 2012)

I ended up buying the Nitecore Intellicharger i4 V2, two of them. The price is great along with their functionality so I bought more than one. So I will be charging my Keeppower 3400 mah batteries with these chargers.


----------



## CyberCT (Dec 31, 2012)

HKJ said:


> One of the best chargers you can get is the Xtar SP2, but it will only charger two batteries at a time and it is not recommended to run it at full current with the 3400mAh batteries (Keep it at 1A setting).



Just curious, why is it the 3400 mah batteries can't take full current like the other 18650s, specifically?


----------



## Changchung (Dec 31, 2012)

CyberCT said:


> I ended up buying the Nitecore Intellicharger i4 V2, two of them. The price is great along with their functionality so I bought more than one. So I will be charging my Keeppower 3400 mah batteries with these chargers.



Good choice... Mine work just fine...


Sent from my phone with camera with flash and internet on it...


----------



## Shadowww (Dec 31, 2012)

CyberCT said:


> Just curious, why is it the 3400 mah batteries can't take full current like the other 18650s, specifically?


Because for Panasonic NCR series cells, max. charging current specified in datasheet is 0.3C (which is 870mA for 2900mAh, 930mA for 3100mAh and 1020mA for 3400mAh).
2900mAh/3100mAh will obviously have no problem with 1A charging rate, though, as that's just few % more.


----------



## shadowjk (Dec 31, 2012)

> ARe the Chinese just putting on the outside jacket then?



Panasonic (and other manufacturers) do not permit sales of loose cells to consumers, only battery packs. We need the third party in between that convincingly promises panasonic the batteries will be used for constructing battery packs, and not sold to consumers.


----------



## "J" man (Jan 6, 2013)

*Recommend rechargeables for my torches?*

Hi guys,

Money is tight these days and I would like to invest in some rechargeable batteries for my Olight M20S-X (XM-L, 2xCR123A or 1x18650), and a Fenix PD32UE (XM-L, 2xCR123A or 1x18650).

Should I go with a bunch of 16340s, or a few 18650s? Should I get them with a PCB or go IMR? I have already invested in a WPAII 2 charger, it can charge both sizes. 

What are some good choices/brands to look for with these lights? I'm looking for good value, but also a very high cycle life. 

Thanks in advance.


----------



## Shadowww (Jan 6, 2013)

*Re: Recommend rechargeables for my torches?*

You'd be best off getting Intl-Outdoor 3400mAh protected batteries.
They're $29 for a pair, but they're well worth it - highest available capacity, best quality protection, and great cell inside (Panasonic NCR18650B).


----------



## Dubois (Jan 6, 2013)

*Re: Recommend rechargeables for my torches?*

I'd definitely stick to protected 18650 rather than use multiple 16340 cells. Fasttech have a good price on the Panasonic cells - both 3100mAh and the newer 3400mAh.


----------



## eusty (Jan 6, 2013)

*Re: Recommend rechargeables for my torches?*

As above 18650's, although check if the 3400 will fit as it appears that they don't fit in all lights due to being slightly fatter.

Sent using Tapatalk 2.


----------



## peterscm (Jan 6, 2013)

*Re: Recommend rechargeables for my torches?*

Intl-Outdoor 18650 3400mAh protected batteries is a bit tight (as it is fatter) when inserting into PD32UE. If force in then the battery wrapper may get scratch/damage. AW and EagleTac 3400mAh has no problem inserting into PD32UE.


----------



## "J" man (Jan 6, 2013)

*Re: Recommend rechargeables for my torches?*

After doing some more research, I've read that my XM-L lights will draw 3A of current (http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?330236-2012-Battery-test-review-summary). Interestingly, there are 18650s with lesser capacities that seem to perform better on 3A than some newer batteries that have higher capacities. From the "discharge capacity down to 3.6V" graph in that review, it looks like the Fenix 2600mah ARB-L2 and the Trustfire 3000mah have the best 3A performance for a good price. Anything matching their 3A performance is significantly more expensive or harder to find.

I can get 2 Trustfire 3000mah batteries for the price of 1 Fenix 2600mah ARB-L2, but I'm leaning towards the Fenix because of the name behind the battery. Are the ARB-L2s worth the price? Does anyone have experience with the Fenix brand 18650s, such as cycle life? They seem to be using a mystery cell. For all I know, it could be the same cell that the Trustfire brand uses.


----------



## oKtosiTe (Jan 7, 2013)

*Re: Recommend rechargeables for my torches?*

When it comes to Lithium-ion batteries, you don't want to skimp on battery quality. Ultrafire isn't exactly a forum favorite. I can't say anything about the Fenix cells, but the EagleTacs have a good reputation and dimensions that fit many lights and are quite close to 18650 specifications. I use their 3100mAhs happily in my TM11, which is known for being fairly picky with batteries.


----------



## CyberCT (Jan 7, 2013)

*Re: Recommend rechargeables for my torches?*

The Keeppower 3400mah batteries are a great price if you buy a lot of 10. I have charged them numerous times on my Nitecore Intellicharger V2 a few times now, and the voltage off the charger for ALL these Keeppowers (and AW 2900s I have) is 4.18-4.19 consistently. I don't have a hobby charger so I ended up just using the Fenix TK75 I just bought on high mode with 2 batteries instead of 4. Should last roughly 2 hours according to Fenix. I have found that all the batteries ran for 2 hours, + 5 - 7 minutes consistently. Great cells!


----------



## birdman3131 (Jan 8, 2013)

*decent 18650's with fast shipping?*

I am loooking for some decent 18650's with fast shipping in the usa. I usually buy off DX but I do not feel like waiting a month. Somehow lost all mine and want some fairly quickly while still being cheap.

Protected and at least 2400mah would be nice.


----------



## Changchung (Jan 8, 2013)

*decent 18650's with fast shipping?*

I just can recomend it from asia. Check the CPF market place, dealer section, you can find there some USA sellers.

You can also check the Good Deal section. Maybe you find a USA seller


Sent from my phone with camera with flash and internet on it...


----------



## Shadowww (Jan 8, 2013)

*Re: decent 18650's with fast shipping?*

https://www.orbtronic.com/ have decent cells and quick shipping CONUS.


----------



## FlaMtnBkr (Jan 9, 2013)

*Re: Recommend rechargeables for my torches?*



CyberCT said:


> The *Keeppower 3400mah batteries* are a great price if you buy a lot of 10. I have charged them numerous times on my Nitecore Intellicharger V2 a few times now, and the voltage off the charger for ALL these Keeppowers (and AW 2900s I have) is 4.18-4.19 consistently. I don't have a hobby charger so I ended up just using the Fenix TK75 I just bought on high mode with 2 batteries instead of 4. Should last roughly 2 hours according to Fenix. I have found that all the batteries ran for 2 hours, + 5 - 7 minutes consistently. Great cells!



Can someone point me towards a place to buy these batteries? 

I'm looking for good batteries at a decent price. I don't need the very best or the most capacity. If someone has a suggestion please let me know. They will be going into an EagleTac D25LC2 XP-G2 if that matters (anyone know difference between cool white and neutral white?). Yes, I am new to all this.


----------



## CyberCT (Jan 9, 2013)

*Re: Recommend rechargeables for my torches?*



FlaMtnBkr said:


> Can someone point me towards a place to buy these batteries?
> 
> I'm looking for good batteries at a decent price. I don't need the very best or the most capacity. If someone has a suggestion please let me know. They will be going into an EagleTac D25LC2 XP-G2 if that matters (anyone know difference between cool white and neutral white?). Yes, I am new to all this.



If I'm allowed to mention it, CNQualityGoods.COM. I took the expedited shipping route, it took a little less than 2 weeks for delivery.


----------



## march.brown (Jan 10, 2013)

*Re: Recommend rechargeables for my torches?*



Shadowww said:


> You'd be best off getting Intl-Outdoor 3400mAh protected batteries.
> They're $29 for a pair, but they're well worth it - highest available capacity, best quality protection, and great cell inside (Panasonic NCR18650B).



I use the 3100mAh protected Panasonics ... The price is much better than the 3400mAh cells ... I am not worried about the extra 300mAh capacity of the more expensive cells.
.


----------



## ArcticHighlander (Jan 10, 2013)

*Re: Recommend rechargeables for my torches?*



march.brown said:


> I use the 3100mAh protected Panasonics ... The price is much better than the 3400mAh cells ... I am not worried about the extra 300mAh capacity of the more expensive cells.
> .



CPFmarketplace lists FastTech 3400mAh 18650 protected for $19ish pair w/free ship - they are the panasonic 3400mAh. Cheapest I've seen plus 10% off w/code LAUNCH. 
http://www.cpfmarketplace.com/mp/showthread.php?281736-FastTech-3400mAh-18650-protected-19ish-pair


----------



## oeL (Jan 10, 2013)

*Re: Recommend rechargeables for my torches?*



"J" man said:


> After doing some more research, I've read that my XM-L lights will draw 3A of current (http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?330236-2012-Battery-test-review-summary). Interestingly, there are 18650s with lesser capacities that seem to perform better on 3A than some newer batteries that have higher capacities. From the "discharge capacity down to 3.6V" graph in that review...



Simple single-18650-lights do not perform very well with the common 4,2 V Liions. Their brightness drops quite early. After a long night studiing HKJs graphs I ordered some 4,35 V LG ICR18650D1 (ebay) and a 4,35 V charger (cottonpickers, cpfmarketplace). It's a pleasure how much runtime at full brightness I'm getting now from my three 18650 lights!

Of course, running unprotected Liions require special attention.

And of course, the 4,35V Liions are only a workaround for a limitation of many single-Liion-lights. Better have a close look at the runtime graphs and get a light that does not have such a voltage-brightness-isue. Thats the reason why I'm having a SC600W now... runs perfect with any of the high capacity / high current Liions.


----------



## gopajti (Jan 10, 2013)

*Re: Recommend rechargeables for my torches?*



> I can get 2 Trustfire 3000mah batteries for the price of 1 Fenix 2600mah ARB-L2, but I'm leaning towards the Fenix because of the name behind the battery. Are the ARB-L2s worth the price? Does anyone have experience with the Fenix brand 18650s, such as cycle life? *They seem to be using a mystery cell*. For all I know, it could be the same cell that the Trustfire brand uses.



*Fenix ARB-L2 use China BAK cell*.
http://www.bak.com.cn/main.aspx


----------



## MasterOnion (Jan 16, 2013)

*Will these batteries work with this flashlight?*

Hi, and sorry if i posted this is the wrong place, this is the very first post of mine on this forum.

I have a Nitecore mh2c flashlight that I just received as a gift and I would like to get some backup batteries for it. It came with a Nitecore brand 2300 mAH 3.7V 8.5Wh 18650 battery and I was looking to buy some protected AW 18650 batteries for backups. Would these batteries work with my flashlight, or would they have any problems?

http://www.lighthound.com/AW-18650-Protected-3400-mAh-Rechargeable-Lithium-Battery-_p_4149.html

http://www.lighthound.com/AW-18650-Protected-3100-mAh-Rechargeable-Lithium-Battery-_p_3954.html

If they work fine, which one would you recommend me to buy?

If they don't work, what battery should i get instead?


----------



## VidPro (Jan 16, 2013)

*Re: Will these batteries work with this flashlight?*

Master Onion, either will work, electrically speaking (that light does not have a huge current draw even in turbo). 
The only issue I could see you might have is, the cells used in those AWs are a bit fatter than the nightcore 2200 probably.
so if there is some slop in the battery hole, or if you Measure it, and it can take ~18.7mm diameter battery in there, then it should fit.

If you cant measure it , you might find more threads talking about the light, and other users choices and get info there.

:welcome: They moved your post (donno bout that). the Post could have a better title on it, a title with the specific light in it , and you would get a user of that light seeing your post.
If i had just purchaced or been gifted that light, I would search for threads on it, because at CPF there probably is people happily discussing and reviewing it.


----------



## THE_dAY (Jan 16, 2013)

*Re: Will these batteries work with this flashlight?*

MasterOnion, 
:welcome:

VidPro has some good concern about fit but the AW are some of the smallest (diameter, length) protected 18650s around so I don't think fit should be a problem. The AW 3100 are 18.4mm diameter.
My only concern would have been the AW are flat top but I see that the MH2C has springs on both ends so no problem there either. 
Go for the 3400 as they are the newer ones with more capacity.


----------



## neutralwhite (Jan 17, 2013)

*Re: Will these batteries work with this flashlight?*

hi - using the FENIX ARB L2's with my PD32UE, are these the best in power brightness?. not really looking for that much runtime batteries, just what can output the most brightness for some while. these seem good enough.

i did go on HKJ's comparator site, and it seemed they were best?.
was I right or wrong?.


AW2600's and 3100's were just below on the chart, but I thought AW's were top best!. 
can't see anything on there which performs better in terms of power output brightness. 

thanks.


----------



## MasterOnion (Jan 17, 2013)

VidPro said:


> Master Onion, either will work, electrically speaking (that light does not have a huge current draw even in turbo).
> The only issue I could see you might have is, the cells used in those AWs are a bit fatter than the nightcore 2200 probably.
> so if there is some slop in the battery hole, or if you Measure it, and it can take ~18.7mm diameter battery in there, then it should fit.
> 
> ...





THE_dAY said:


> MasterOnion,
> :welcome:
> 
> VidPro has some good concern about fit but the AW are some of the smallest (diameter, length) protected 18650s around so I don't think fit should be a problem. The AW 3100 are 18.4mm diameter.
> ...



Thank you both very much for your help. I will look for threads about new flashlights in the future, and right now I'm going to buy the 3400


----------



## garys02 (Jan 19, 2013)

*Re: Fenix PD32 Ultimate Edition (XM-L T6 NW, 1x18650, 2xCR123A) Review*

Can someone tell me if the pila charger is compatible with the 18650 3,6v battery ?????????


----------



## Mattylav (Jan 19, 2013)

*Best CR123 and 18650 Brands*

Hello, I'm pretty new to flashlights. Before I looked at jetbeams and nitecores and stuff like that, I had never heard of CR123's and 18650's. So what are the best brands to buy from?


----------



## johnjr (Jan 19, 2013)

*Re: Best CR123 and 18650 Brands*

I.m ne at this also but i'm interested in finding the best CR123 batteries and i'm just not sure about anyone of them besides the nitecore brands, this should get informative.


----------



## ArcticHighlander (Jan 20, 2013)

*Re: Best CR123 and 18650 Brands*



johnjr said:


> I.m ne at this also but i'm interested in finding the best CR123 batteries and i'm just not sure about anyone of them besides the nitecore brands, this should get informative.



Surefire has been very reliable for me.


----------



## ArcticHighlander (Jan 20, 2013)

*Re: Recommend rechargeables for my torches?*



ArcticHighlander said:


> CPFmarketplace lists FastTech 3400mAh 18650 protected for $19ish pair w/free ship - they are the panasonic 3400mAh. Cheapest I've seen plus 10% off w/code LAUNCH.
> http://www.cpfmarketplace.com/mp/showthread.php?281736-FastTech-3400mAh-18650-protected-19ish-pair



I ordered 2 from Int Outdoor and 2 from FastTech - both are in Hong Kong. Batteries from both are protected Panasonic NCR18650B 3400mAh. The FastTech cost $19.01 (less with coupon code) with free shipping and free tracking. They emailed an order confirmation right after I placed the order and shipped after 1 day of placing the order. The same day they shipped they emailed a shipping confirmation and a tracking number. It arrived in 12 days in good shape with a nice battery box. The day after it arrived they emailed saying they saw it was delivered and asked if everything was okay and if I was happy with their service and to get in touch if there was any problem and to leave feedback. I checked the voltage out of the box and it was 3.5v for both batteries and fit perfectly and worked fine in my Fenix TK35 U2. 

My order from Int-Outdoor cost $29.64 w/free ship and took 3 days to process before shipping. It shipped w/o tracking; if you want tracking on orders <$80 you have to pay them an additional $2. They emailed an order confirmation but did not email when it shipped. I had to continually check their web site to see when it shipped. It has been 21 days now since they shipped and the batteries still have not arrived and I just emailed their customer service that they are overdue and I'm waiting to hear back.

FastTech also had a way to cancel an order on their web site before it shipped in case you changed your mind or wanted to modify your order. Int-Outdoor had no way to cancel or modify an order once placed as far as I could tell. I discovered FastTech two days after placing my order with Int-Outdoor and would have canceled my order with them if I could have done so. I'll update further on my Int-Outdoor order as things progress. Overall I'm deeply impressed with FastTech's price, products and service but not so much with Int-Outdoor. 

I still need a charger and I'm waiting through the end of January to see if Xtar comes out with their new 18650 charger with LED display. If not I'll probably just pick up an Xtar SPII.


----------



## ruf997tt (Jan 20, 2013)

*Re: decent 18650's with fast shipping?*



Shadowww said:


> https://www.orbtronic.com/ have decent cells and quick shipping CONUS.



+1 on Orbtronic. Fast shipping, good pricing, excellent customer service.


----------



## RIX TUX (Jan 20, 2013)

Sparky's Magic said:


> The current white wrapper EagleTac 3100mAh. are the best I have ever used and they fit all my 'lights!


are eagletac batts made by aw?


----------



## HKJ (Jan 20, 2013)

RIX TUX said:


> are eagletac batts made by aw?



No, both EagleTac and AW uses Panasonic cell in their 2900/3100/3400mAh batteries, just like everybody else. Then they uses some factory to add a protection circuit to the cell, before they sell the battery.


----------



## Mattylav (Jan 20, 2013)

What happens if a CR123 or Rcr123 is not protected? what does it mean for a battery to be protected?


----------



## djdawg (Jan 20, 2013)

This thread is giving me a headache .........LOL Iam very new too and Iam just going into rechargable batts.
I havent bought anything yet , I dont care how much it cost , basically .........
I know Iam gonna get a Pila charger ......
But on the 18650,s .....Iam unclear on weather or not to get 3400 MAH or what ?? Is 3400 better to use ??? Meaning last a little longer ??


----------



## HKJ (Jan 21, 2013)

Mattylav said:


> What happens if a CR123 or Rcr123 is not protected? what does it mean for a battery to be protected?



Protection is a small circuit that is mounted on the battery, it will protect against over current, over discharge and over charge.
Most of the time only over discharge is relevant, because it can easily happen in a light and it will damage the battery. When using two batteries in series you risk polarity reversal (This is very bad), but again the protection will prevent it.




djdawg said:


> But on the 18650,s .....Iam unclear on weather or not to get 3400 MAH or what ?? Is 3400 better to use ??? Meaning last a little longer ??



In many cases the 3400mAh will give the longest runtime.


----------



## djdawg (Jan 21, 2013)

Thanks ............theres so much to learn.


----------



## ArcticHighlander (Jan 24, 2013)

*Re: Recommend rechargeables for my torches?*






Originally Posted by *ArcticHighlander*


CPFmarketplacelists FastTech 3400mAh 18650 protected for $19ish pair w/free ship - they arethe Panasonic 3400mAh. Cheapest I've seen plus 10% off w/code LAUNCH. 
http://www.cpfmarketplace.com/mp/sho...ted-19ish-pair
_I ordered 2 from Int Outdoor and 2from FastTech - both are in Hong Kong. Batteriesfrom both are protected Panasonic NCR18650B 3400mAh. The FastTech cost $19.01(less with coupon code) with free shipping and free tracking. They emailed anorder confirmation right after I placed the order and shipped after 1 day ofplacing the order. The same day they shipped they emailed a shippingconfirmation and a tracking number. It arrived in 12 days in good shape with anice battery box. The day after it arrived they emailed saying they saw it wasdelivered and asked if everything was okay and if I was happy with theirservice and to get in touch if there was any problem and to leave feedback. Ichecked the voltage out of the box and it was 3.5v for both batteries and fitperfectly and worked fine in my Fenix TK35 U2. 

My order from Int-Outdoor cost $29.64 w/free ship and took 3 days to processbefore shipping. It shipped w/o tracking; if you want tracking on orders<$80 you have to pay them an additional $2. They emailed an orderconfirmation but did not email when it shipped. I had to continually checktheir web site to see when it shipped. It has been 21 days now since theyshipped and the batteries still have not arrived and I just emailed theircustomer service that they are overdue and I'm waiting to hear back.

FastTech also had a way to cancel an order on their web site before it shippedin case you changed your mind or wanted to modify your order. Int-Outdoor hadno way to cancel or modify an order once placed as far as I could tell. Idiscovered FastTech two days after placing my order with Int-Outdoor and wouldhave canceled my order with them if I could have done so. I'll update furtheron my Int-Outdoor order as things progress. Overall I'm deeply impressed withFastTech's price, products and service but not so much with Int-Outdoor. 

I still need a charger and I'm waiting through the end of January to see ifXtar comes out with their new 18650 charger with LED display. If not I'llprobably just pick up an Xtar SPII."_

*Update:* Int-Outdoor customer service responded the day following my order inquiry stating that I needed to allow more time. The Int-Outdoor batteries finally arrived today, on the 24th day after shipment. It was ordered from Hong Kong but shipped from Singapore which may account for the longer processing and shipping time compared to FastTech. The customs form on the FastTech order had listed the envelope as containing electronic parts while the envelope from Int-Outdoors listed the contents simply as a "gift" (I assume to evade potential customs duties - no customs duties were incurred on either shipment). On arrival, after allowing several hours to warm up to room temperature both Int-Outdoor batteries read exactly 3.4v (3.5v on the FastTech - no significant difference). Unlike the FastTech which was branded Panasonic and had a visible protection circuit these were covered with Int-Outdoors own brand label and I couldn't independently verify they were the Panasonic NRC18650B 3400mAh or that they had a protection circuit. Others on this site I understood have removed the cover and verified both in the past. The Int-Outdoors were slightly thicker than the FastTech, I assume because of the additional wrapper, but still fit well in my Fenix TK35 . Int-Outdoor lists size as 68.9mm (length) * 18.5mm (diameter). FastTech lists their size as 69.4mm(length) * 18.1mm (diameter). The FastTech is slightly longer, apparentlybecause it has a slightly longer button (narrower also) plus side and because it has an additional steel colored panel covering the bottom negative side.

Overall I'm much happier with myFastTech order. Not only was it much cheaper for the same great basic Panasonic 3400mAh battery, it had free tracking, a nice free case, faster shipping, a more customer friendly web site, and much better customer concern and service.

*Also, the new Xtar charger has now been released with the LED display and it is called the VP1:
http://www.xtarlight.com/en/05-chanpin/p-001-1.asp?styleid=232
It sounds like this will be the best Li charger out there - but I'll probably wait until HKJ does a review before ordering, just to be sure.*


----------



## djdawg (Jan 24, 2013)

*Re: Recommend rechargeables for my torches?*

I thought the Pila charger was suppose to be one of the best ????????????
I also thought AW batts. were good ..........now Iam hearing different ????


----------



## HKJ (Jan 24, 2013)

*Re: Recommend rechargeables for my torches?*



djdawg said:


> I thought the Pila charger was suppose to be one of the best ????????????
> I also thought AW batts. were good ..........now Iam hearing different ????



No. The Pila is supposed to be good (I have never checked it and cannot say if its corret).
The AW batteries are good, but not always the best.

There are, of course, a couple of other brands that are good too.


----------



## djdawg (Jan 24, 2013)

*Re: Recommend rechargeables for my torches?*

The Pila has been one of the most talked about chargers on this and other forums , I have found.
I find it hard to believe you havent tested this one yet , but I suppose you cant test them all.
What in your opinion is the better battery charger and better brand of batteries ??
Its too late for me now though .......Ive already got the Pila coming and some AW batts.
I still like to know peoples thoughts , especially those highly thought of on this forum.
Thanks dj


----------



## HKJ (Jan 24, 2013)

*Re: Recommend rechargeables for my torches?*



djdawg said:


> The Pila has been one of the most talked about chargers on this and other forums , I have found.
> I find it hard to believe you havent tested this one yet , but I suppose you cant test them all.



It was already assumed to be a very good charger, before I started testing chargers and with the price of the Pila, I prefer to use the money for new chargers.




djdawg said:


> What in your opinion is the better battery charger and better brand of batteries ??



For chargers: 
At the current time the Xtar SP2 is one of the best (The new VP1 might be better, but I have not tested it yet). 
The ML-102 is also a good charger and very cheap.
There is also other good chargers.

For batteries:
There are many brands, instead you have to look at the cell used for the battery and the size of the battery. Last I needed batteries I bought 10 protected 18650 with 3100mAh from intl-outdoor, if you live the USA you can also find batteries locally.


----------



## djdawg (Jan 24, 2013)

*Re: Recommend rechargeables for my torches?*

Thanks ..........I appreciate your help , your opinion is / seems to be highly thought of on this forum .........yes Iam new to the light thing as you can tell ....LOL
I like quality ........I dont wanna skimp on this .........if its better , I want to have the safest and the best.


----------



## djdawg (Jan 25, 2013)

*Re: Recommend rechargeables for my torches?*

If anyone is out there .......I have one more question please.
Once and 18650 AW batt. is charged ............. How long will it hold its charge if its not used ??


----------



## HKJ (Jan 25, 2013)

*Re: Recommend rechargeables for my torches?*



djdawg said:


> If anyone is out there .......I have one more question please.
> Once and 18650 AW batt. is charged ............. How long will it hold its charge if its not used ??



A couple of years, before being completely discharged.

Note: This is very temperature depend.


----------



## djdawg (Jan 25, 2013)

*Re: Recommend rechargeables for my torches?*

Thank you ........ this is a kool forum with good people.
I recieved my Pila and Iam chargeing my batts as I type this .........


----------



## djdawg (Jan 25, 2013)

On another note .........I was hoping they had a 10 year shelve life
to , like SF regular 123,s.
Even if its not needed ........


----------



## HKJ (Jan 25, 2013)

djdawg said:


> On another note .........I was hoping they had a 10 year shelve lift to , like SF regular 123,s.



Usual LiIon is assume to last between 3 and 5 years (the newer cells may last longer, but it is not known yet).

Primary batteries is very different from rechargeables, i.e. you cannot assume abilities are the same from one to another, even though they are both called something with lithium. Even with LiIon there are many types with different abilities.


----------



## djdawg (Jan 25, 2013)

Another bit of a problem ..... after chargeing my 18650 .......... my EagleTac D25LC2 (which says it takes 18650) mine wont work in it.
It works in my PD32 but not this light .......it seems its not makeing proper contact with the front post. any ideas ?


----------



## x2o (Jan 25, 2013)

djdawg said:


> Another bit of a problem ..... after chargeing my 18650 .......... my EagleTac D25LC2 (which says it takes 18650) mine wont work in it.
> It works in my PD32 but not this light .......it seems its not makeing proper contact with the front post. any ideas ?



Is it a button top or flat-top cell? Some flashlights do not make contact with flat-topped positive sides on some batteries. I don't have personal experience with the D25LC2 but a quick search seems to return that they do not make contact with flat-tops.

I've heard of people using either small magnet spacers or making a small bump with solder to remedy the situation.


----------



## djdawg (Jan 25, 2013)

The Batts are flat top  .......... there AW brand , I guess I didnt investigate enough before I bought them.
I,ll see if theres a button top 18650 Rechargable out there. Unless you know of one already (different brand)?
I want to buy protected and good batterys.
Thanks for helping.


----------



## THE_dAY (Jan 25, 2013)

djdawg said:


> The Batts are flat top  .......... there AW brand , I guess I didnt investigate enough before I bought them.
> I,ll see if theres a button top 18650 Rechargable out there. Unless you know of one already (different brand)?
> I want to buy protected and good batterys.
> Thanks for helping.


The Eagletac 3400 are button tops and protected, they use the same Panasonic cell as AW 3400.
Or I've also read that you could add a small solder blob to the positive end as a workaround but make sure not to heat up the battery too much.


----------



## djdawg (Jan 25, 2013)

I,ll try to find a place that has EagleTacs in stock ..............thanks dj


----------



## CyberCT (Jan 26, 2013)

djdawg said:


> I,ll try to find a place that has EagleTacs in stock ..............thanks dj





Keeppower cells are good too. They are what I'm using.


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## Changchung (Jan 26, 2013)

I just receive my pair of 3400 panasonic protected from fasttech, shipped in 14 days from china to venezuela, the faster shippment so far, their are big but no to much... 

Just 19$ shipped plus 5% less using a coupon code... Imposible to even no try it...

Sent from my phone with camera with flash and internet on it...


----------



## weegidy (Jan 29, 2013)

*Re: So who makes the best cr123 and 18650 batteries*

Where can I buy legitimate Panasonic cells? I'm pretty sketched out with the ones on eBay because (i am guessing) most of them are counterfeit. In the photos they have different color shrink wrapping (wth?>>. I am looking for the ICR cells (not the IMR) - are there legit ebay sellers selling these, or other websites?


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## domx (Jan 30, 2013)

David Sims said:


> The best 18650 battery that I know about is the AW 18650 LiCo battery of 3100 mAh capacity. You can buy it at Lighthound. One of them will keep a Romisen RC-T601 flashlight on the medium setting (initially ~650 lumens output) burning for about four hours, as the voltage goes from 4.23V to 2.73V.
> 
> I've found most Ultrafire batteries to be inferior, and some of them are generic cells of very low capacity (about half what is claimed on the false label), repackaged by dishonest Chinese merchants. However, I have found a spectacular exception to the rule.
> 
> One of my probably "fake" Ultrafire 18650 batteries, allegedly only 3000 mAh, has proved itself capable of keeping my Romisen RC-T601 flashlight going on the medium setting for 6h 30m, which suggests its capacity might be somewhere around 4500 to 5000 mAh. I'd had no idea that kind of performance was even possible, and I don't even know whether the Chinese manufacturer even knows how to replicate this level of quality. I've never had another 18650 battery that comes close to this kind of capacity.



I have spent thousands of UK pounds on 18650 and RCR 123 batteries. I always thought AW 18650 proteced 3100 mah were the best until I got the Jetbeam DDR30. These batteries (brand new) died extremely quickly. I purchased 6 EagleTac 18650 3400 mah batteries from a certain supplier and these last 4 times longer! However, 2 of them overheated in charger (Pila) and 1 never fully charged. 3 were perfect. It seems hit and miss with batteries but I have lost respect for AW. I have just ordered more EagleTac and Enerpower 18650 batteries.
I have yet to find a great charger but the best seems to be the Pila and seems to be the only one I can rely on to fully charge batteries.

I would love someone to tell me what are the 'best' batteries and charger available.


----------



## alexandrul (Jan 30, 2013)

domx said:


> I would love someone to tell me what are the 'best' batteries and charger available.



I really like the reviews from here: http://www.lygte-info.dk/info/indexBatteriesAndChargers UK.html
(enough to base my purchasing decisions on them)


----------



## domx (Jan 30, 2013)

Thanks alexandrul. I will take a look.


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## alexandrul (Jan 30, 2013)

The amount of information contained in the 18650 test is huge, at the first reading I have simply overlooked the individual tests page and the battery selection guide.


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## domx (Jan 31, 2013)

I have lost faith in AW after getting Jetbeam DDR30 Flashlight. I found it impossible to get the DDR30 to show full charge with the AW batteries and I tries 3 new sets (9 batteries in total). I also use Pila IBC charger and I have found EagleTac 3400Mah 18650 batteries are much better than the AWs. It is possible that I had a batch batch of AWs.


----------



## VidPro (Jan 31, 2013)

domx.
The cells used in the "new" 3400 batts, hold a higher voltage, under a load. and the higher capacity will take longer to finish up in a CC/CV type charger, which could put them at a slightly higher voltage on a similar (rate) charger. Any new cell might work better anyways.
Aw is wrapping some of the same panasonic cells too.

this *However, 2 of them overheated in charger (Pila) and 1 never fully charged *is completly unacceptable for li-ion, a li-ion should not even get hot when charging. 
IMO not even "warm" either. some heat is contributed by the chargers. But most of the power should be "accepted" by the battery. 
If the cells doing that are newer, then you got some goofy stuff going on. I would think that goofy stuff is beyond just the charger? Clone batts, Old batch, High heat hitting them, too high of current usage for the battery, something were missing? Or the charger isnt working right.

Drop back to the "specs" and data sheet, panasonic does not recommend the (cough cough) way we are using them  Although they can handle some of the high discharges people are putting them through, the specs say no :-(

if Newbie was here, he would be extrapolating on how wrong it all is, the ghost of newbie would say "its no wonder" 

You have used li-ion for long enough, and used enough cells to know what to do and what not to, What Changed? How hard and how hot are you now using them? 
Plop a voltmeter on the charger, use a IR thermometer (cheap now) on the lights. there has to be something you can see is different. Do a test of the current load on the battery via the lights, at both turn on, and when the voltage is lower on the battery.

For higher current devices, use a battery that is rated for that current, that means the actual cell that was manufactured, not ratings seen when selling it re-wrapped. Some of the new lights would have been better off with a car battery than a flashlight/laptop battery  Rockets always go really fast then die, they are still fun.


----------



## domx (Feb 1, 2013)

I have just charged 3 brand new AW 18650 3100 mah batteries with a Pila IBC charger and cmeasured their voltage to each be 4.1V. When inserted into Jetbeam DDR30 the flashlight shows that the battery power level is 6, out of 9.
When I do the same with EagleTac 3400 mah batteries the DDR30 shows 9 out 9.

Can anyone explain this?


----------



## SilverFox (Feb 2, 2013)

Hello Domx,

Here is my guess...

The light places a load on the cells to give you a rating under load. In your case the 3100 mAh cells drop to a lower voltage under load than the 3400 mAh cells do.

To verify this you may be able to find some battery test curves for these cells and see if that is the case.

Tom


----------



## djdawg (Feb 2, 2013)

Ive ask this before I think but have forgotten the answer (Iam old) LOL
But will any light that takes a regular 123 batt. , be able to use a RCR123 ???


----------



## x2o (Feb 2, 2013)

djdawg said:


> Ive ask this before I think but have forgotten the answer (Iam old) LOL
> But will any light that takes a regular 123 batt. , be able to use a RCR123 ???



In short, no. Your average Li-ion RCR123a will have a nominal voltage of 3.7v (4.2v fully charged) while a regular cr123 has a nominal voltage of 3.0V

You have to read the specifications of the light and see its operating voltage range. For example, there are lots of (2) cr123 lights that have a maximum driver voltage of 6V, popping in two RCR123's will quickly fry these types of lights (8.4V fresh off the charger!!)

Hope this helps

edit : Forgot to mention, there are also LiFePO4 cells, though I do not have personal usage experience with them. These charge to a voltage of 3.2V, which I *think* is the same voltage a brand new out-of-the-package primary CR123 has. You will need a specific charger for the LiFePO4 chemistry though, maybe someone else can chime in with more info on them.


----------



## djdawg (Feb 2, 2013)

Thank you ......... I know some of my lights take RCR , but others like the 4-7,s and and S10 Batons I was unsure of.
Thanks for responding.


----------



## x2o (Feb 2, 2013)

djdawg said:


> Thank you ......... I know some of my lights take RCR , but others like the 4-7,s and and S10 Batons I was unsure of.
> Thanks for responding.



The olight s10 can take an RCR123 no problem, as well as any of the new 4-7 CR123 models. I'm not familiar with any older 4-7 models so cannot speak on those for sure. If you check the driver specs on the Four Sevens, the single cells will support up to 4.2v and the 2x cr123 will handle up to 9V, perfect for RCR :thumbsup:


----------



## MIKES250R (Feb 4, 2013)

I have searched the net and can only find one 18650 charger that can measure voltage and capacity, and that is the Soshine. Is there not a multi-cell charger that measures voltage and capacity? Any help would be greatly appreciated.


----------



## oosek (Feb 8, 2013)

I ordered the Jetbeam pro also.


----------



## neutralwhite (Feb 16, 2013)

so what 'better' 3100 protected cell is there which competes with the AW 3100's?.
i thought AW were the best!, really.
was about to order some from cpfmp!.
not so sure just yet now!. 


it will be for the new Zebralight SC600wMkII if that helps.


thanks.


----------



## ggroyal1117 (Feb 16, 2013)

I have been using the Xtar SP2 for about one year without any problems. I purchased the Xtar VP1 last month. The LED display is a little small, but it shows the status of both batteries.

http://s8.beta.photobucket.com/user/madecov/media/Flashlight/VP1-9_zpsa841a120.gif.html


----------



## kmorar556 (Feb 18, 2013)

*18650 2600 Mah or higher for under $10*

Hello, 

Im look for a 18650 2600Mah or higher with a button top under $10? Fasttech has Nitecore 18650 for $8.48 but I'm looking for something local, any suggestions? Thanks


----------



## awenta (Feb 18, 2013)

*Re: 18650 2600 Mah or higher for under $10*

Callies 3400 are 15 or 16. Excellent cells.


----------



## lknbigfish (Feb 19, 2013)

*Need a quality charger to charge both 18650's and rech. cr123's*

can someone recommend a charger that can charge both 18560's and rechargeable cr123's?
when i did a search, it seems like the pila IBC seems to be the best bang for the buck, but it looks like it works with 18650's.
some cheap chargers on amazon state that they work with both via spacers, but i am not wanting junk. i think a hobby charger would probably work, but would prefer something ready to go out of the box.


----------



## HKJ (Feb 19, 2013)

*Re: Need a quality charger to charge both 18650's and rech. cr123's*



lknbigfish said:


> can someone recommend a charger that can charge both 18560's and rechargeable cr123's?
> when i did a search, it seems like the pila IBC seems to be the best bang for the buck, but it looks like it works with 18650's.
> some cheap chargers on amazon state that they work with both via spacers, but i am not wanting junk. i think a hobby charger would probably work, but would prefer something ready to go out of the box.



A very good and universal charger for 4.2 volt LiIon batteries is the Xtar VP1.


----------



## itguy07 (Feb 19, 2013)

*Re: Need a quality charger to charge both 18650's and rech. cr123's*



lknbigfish said:


> can someone recommend a charger that can charge both 18560's and rechargeable cr123's?



Intellicharge i4 or i2


----------



## jamesmtl514 (Feb 24, 2013)

*3X 18650, which ones?*

There are many versions of this cell available. I have had excellent experience with AW IMR.
I'm thinking of getting the Black protected highest capacity ones.

That ensures long runtime correct? 

Since i have a leef 3X 18650 on its way i need batteries, also, what do you suggest i run in this light? 
I'm aiming for a KT head and SW01 fatty or
Z32 and SW01 slim.
Malkoff M91A? 
M61 219 SHO? 

Or am i just better getting a wildcat?


----------



## yoyoman (Feb 24, 2013)

*Re: 3X 18650, which ones?*

No easy answer or at least no single answer. HKJ does great reviews on this forum.

The new 3400 mAh seem to be an improvement over the 3100 mAh cells. I'm not a techie, but better voltage under high loads. Size can also be an issue. The extra capacity generally means bigger and the protection also adds to the size. AWs generally work. Look for a fitment guide on the forum or google it.

I don't know if you will have issues with the USPS - they may think Canada is a state rather than an international shipment. I have good experience with AW. I saw a mention of a site in Europe that carrys Keeppower - HKJ had a favorable review and I placed an order. Haven't received them but I hope the size and performance are good. If you've had good experience with AW and can get the 3400 mAh, then go for it.


----------



## Hntbambi (Feb 24, 2013)

*Best bang for the buck*

I have been searching and reading this site for a week or so now and there is a whole bunch of data. Thank you for that. My question is what is the best capacity 18650 for the cost. The good quality 3400 mAh versions are fairly expensive. The 3100 mAh dont seem too far behind in price. I have been looking at Amazon and DealX mainly. Any recos out there?


----------



## VidPro (Feb 24, 2013)

*Re: Best bang for the buck*

You really want reconditioned cells? I never knew there was a real market for them  all that garbage from china, and now somebody actually wants it. 
Check out HKJs tests, many of them are rescent. In protected, you should be able to get trustfire "flames" (the ones with the flame pic on the wrapper) or tenergy type cells of normal capacity for reasonable prices, and they will hold up for time. Just make sure that you get them from a reliable dealer. As of feb 2013, if your reading this later, they probably already cloned them too 

And the reconditioned cells thing was just a joke, they are not worth 50cents, nothing but trouble, and even possibly dangerous, especially if you dont know or have the stuff to test with.

http://lygte-info.dk/review/batteries2012/Common18650Summary UK.html
there are a lot of cells tested, again though you might not be able to just hop on e-day or amazone and buy some of the same LOOKING ones from bad sellers, and get the same thing. it can be a minefield out there. seems like Everybody has to walk on a few mines , before they get to a good seller, and pay the piper  so have fun.


----------



## weekend warrior (Feb 26, 2013)

*Re: Best bang for the buck*

What's the likelihood of these cells being any good?

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00AR95LT4/?tag=cpf0b6-20

3.7v, 4000 mAh, 2-pack for *$1.79*. Best of all they're sold by a place called "Crazy Cart"!


----------



## tallyram (Feb 26, 2013)

*Re: Best bang for the buck*

Seriously? You probably already know the answer. Don't waste your pocket change, lol. Get some quality cells from one of the trusted brands discussed all through this forum. I would recommend cells that use the Panasonic platform.


----------



## Jim Fairbairn (Feb 28, 2013)

*Li ion questions from a newbie*

I’ve been doing a lot of reading on the forums regarding Li ion batteries. I’m trying to determine if they are something I should pursue or just stick to primaries. To help me make an informed decision I wanted to throw a few questions out there. For now I’m considering purchasing 2 protected 18650’s for use with a Malkoff Hound Dog with an MD4 body. Using a smart charger it seems charging to 4.2 volts is easy enough. The part that I’m unclear on is over-discharging the batteries. From what I’ve read the protected batteries will cease to function when they reach a certain voltage. So I think that sounds easy too. But then I read that when the batteries turn off automatically that they are already over discharged and can’t be safely recharged after that. Is that correct? And if so how do I know when to recharge without overly discharging the batteries? I also read that Li ion batteries in series could be dangerous if the voltages aren’t the same between batteries. What is the tolerance in volts between the batteries before they become dangerous? If batteries are left unused what is the shelf life before I should recharge? How do Li ions tolerate temperature extremes? Where I live can be 0 degrees in the winter and over 90 degrees in the summer. Can I leave a flashlight with Li ions in my car in these temperature extremes? 
Am I over thinking this? Should I stick with primaries? Thanks in advance for your help. I appreciate all of the knowledge that this forum possesses.
Jim


----------



## Yorgi (Feb 28, 2013)

*Re: Li ion questions from a newbie*

I'll try to answer as many of those questions as I can:
Cut-off voltage varies between the manufacturers. Even on better batteries like the AW the cut-off should be used as a last resort only. You want to re-charge before voltage drops anywhere near the cut off to prevent damage. You need to monitor Li-ion batteries with a volt meter to determine when they need recharging.
Shelf life will vary so it's always best to monitor voltages every few months or so if the batteries are not being used. Fresh Li-ions discharge very slowly, about 10% to 20% per year so you can leave them in your car with no problems. Just recharge the batteries once per season. Some flashlights will put a drain on batteries (no disconnect) so you need to keep that in mind.
Li-ions work fine when frozen. Just don't charge them when they are cold.
Do not know off hand how much voltage differential is safe for series Li-ions. Should not be an issue if both batteries are the same model and age.

If you want to be safe grab a Pila IBC charger and some AW 3100s, keep them charged and you will be fine.

Personally I use AA-based flashlights in my car. There is always the chance you could be far from home with dead batteries and in this case AAs can be found everywhere.

Lots of info can be found here at the battery university.


----------



## djdawg (Feb 28, 2013)

*Re: Li ion questions from a newbie*



> [You want to re-charge before voltage drops anywhere near the cut off to prevent damage./QUOTE]
> WOW ! I wish I would of known this before spending all this cash on 18650 and RCR,s.
> So if I run a batt down to cut off .........Ive ruined it ?? or threw away 18 to 20.00 ?
> This info sucks. ........... I wish I would of heard of this before.


----------



## Yorgi (Feb 28, 2013)

*Re: Li ion questions from a newbie*



djdawg said:


> ...So if I run a batt down to cut off .........Ive ruined it ?? or threw away 18 to 20.00 ?
> This info sucks. ........... I wish I would of heard of this before.


You will not kill a protected 18650 if it hits the cut-off but you can damage it slightly. If you are putting a low drain on the battery (eg storage) and let it drop down to the cut-off point you might run down below 2.5V which will shorten the battery life. If you are putting a high drain on the 18650 (running the flashlight) and the cut-off kicks in (say 2.5V) the battery will quickly recover to about 3V which is fine. This is why you want protected cells.

If you have no protection and you let a 18650 drain down below 2.4V in storage then you will kill the cell.


----------



## djdawg (Feb 28, 2013)

*Re: Li ion questions from a newbie*



> This is why you want protected cells.



Ive listened to folks on this Forum and have bought a Pila charger and all my Batts are protected cells. Some are EagleTacs and some AW,s.
Either way , this is good to know that I wont ruin the batt if its gets too low .......... that would be a bummer.
Iam saving my SF batts for rainny days and using RCR and 18650 for use now.
Thanks for responding on this ........dj


----------



## tallyram (Mar 1, 2013)

*Re: Li ion questions from a newbie*

The protection is a last resort to prevent catastrophic damage to the cell and possibly you! A good rule of thumb is to recharge the cell(s) when it(they) are around nominal voltage(3.6-3.7v) resting. You will enjoy the lithium chemistries if you stick to this rule. Definitely get a multimeter and check the voltage periodically. Some may disagree with me on how low to discharge before charging, but 3.6-3.7v resting should always be safe on good condition cells.


----------



## martinaee (Apr 12, 2013)

*18650 for a TK11 R5?*

Hey guys and gals,

I just got a TK11 R5 in the mail and realized I need a new 18650 or two because I forgot it doesn't have a spring in the head and my current 18650's are the flat-top fenix brand. I was at BrightGuy and they had some of the Tenergy cells with the newest wrappers, but those were ever so slightly too thick so it wouldn't go in the light properly.

Can somebody recommend a good 18650 that will go into the TK11 R5 (relatively thin diameter for an 18650) and that also I can charge in my Fenix ARE-C1 18650 charger? And will the ARE-C1 even work with button top cells? I've only used it with the Fenix ARBL2 flat tops.

Also if possible I would like it to be 3000mAh or more, but if it's 2600mAh like the Fenix 18650's I have that's perfectly fine.

Thanks All!


----------



## nohcho (Apr 12, 2013)

*18650 for a TK11 R5?*

I have eagletac 3100 protected ones and they work perfectly in my tk 11. I would recommend those.


----------



## Up All Night (Apr 12, 2013)

*Re: 18650 for a TK11 R5?*

martinaee,
Did you try your flat tops? For the brief time I had a TK11 it ran fine on AW 3100 flats. The TK11 lacks any kind of physical polarity protection, flat tops should not be a problem.
As nohcho has stated, the Eagletac 3100's fit & work fine.


----------



## martinaee (Apr 13, 2013)

*Re: 18650 for a TK11 R5?*

LOL I'm a dummy -- you are right the Fenix flat top 2600mAh cells work fine. I just got a nw E21 today too and I think I had glanced at the head on that one and saw it had polarity protection so I just mixed it up in my mind even though I had also checked out the head on the TK11.

Nice. I'll probably either get more of the Fenix cells or maybe some of the eagletac 3100's so I can tell which batts go in which light  Thanks.


----------



## Solid Lifters (Apr 14, 2013)

I've decided to purchase the following 18650 battery: Panasonic 3400mAh 18650 Li-ion Rechargeable Battery NCR18650B - See more at: http://www.orbtronic.com/batteries-...n-battery-cell-ncr18650b#sthash.oZ2SveBY.dpuf

I've read some performance tests and these seem to be one of the best. Anything wrong with these, as far as anybody knows? Should I consider a different battery? Where's the best place to buy these so I don't get a 'recycled' one and a low price? 

It will going in a Fenix TK22.

Thanks.


----------



## Vortus (Apr 15, 2013)

*Best 4+ Cell 18560 options*

As I've ventured into the realm of 3+ cell lights, the number of 18650's I have has grown exponentially. I have three wf-139's that are functional, but I've decided to break down and do better. Looked at the I4 and WP6. Are these the only options? Or would I be better served by a few newer 2 cell chargers?


----------



## the badger (Apr 15, 2013)

*Pila Charger or Xtar VP1 (or another better charger)? *safety first*

I am currently running 123A batteries in all my lights for both convenience and safety, but have no choice but to switch to rechargeable cells as I have a few Prometheus Alpha Blue-Label lights and Mac's Customs on their way. I am absolutely paranoid of burning down my place, so I've avoided rechargeable cells...until now.

So, what is the BEST charger for the following batteries (price is not a factor here)?:
17670, 1800 18350 and 16650

My title mentions the Pila Charger and the Xtar VP1 because from what I've read here they are the best. If there is anything better or safer, please let me know.

Someone made a comment here along the lines of "rechargeable cells are like gasoline - safe when handled properly." 
This concerns me and makes me think there is something I need to know about these cells before playing with them. I understand it's best to not drain them fully, and to charge them ASAP after being used, but is there anything else I must know to be safe?

**Note, I am new with rechargeable batteries so technical talk will only confuse me as I'll be spending my night Googling what you are talking about. 

Thanks for all the help!


----------



## InspectorJon (Apr 16, 2013)

Solid Lifters said:


> I've decided to purchase the following 18650 battery: Panasonic 3400mAh 18650 Li-ion Rechargeable Battery NCR18650B - See more at: http://www.orbtronic.com/batteries-...n-battery-cell-ncr18650b#sthash.oZ2SveBY.dpuf
> 
> I've read some performance tests and these seem to be one of the best. Anything wrong with these, as far as anybody knows? Should I consider a different battery? Where's the best place to buy these so I don't get a 'recycled' one and a low price?
> 
> ...



Search the forums for info on the green label NCR18650B batteries. If you get the protected ones they are longer than most 18650s and won't fit in some lights. I got a pair recently and they will not fit in my UltraFire WF-139 charger because they are too long so I am looking for another charger they will fit in. Other than the size issue they are apparently a good quality battery. FastTech has the unprotected cells for $18/pair or $19/pair for protected.


----------



## neutralwhite (Apr 17, 2013)

*Re: Li ion questions from a newbie*

thanks, what is resting?. 
when mine run low, i stick them on charge usually straight after .
thanks.




tallyram said:


> The protection is a last resort to prevent catastrophic damage to the cell and possibly you! A good rule of thumb is to recharge the cell(s) when it(they) are around nominal voltage(3.6-3.7v) resting. You will enjoy the lithium chemistries if you stick to this rule. Definitely get a multimeter and check the voltage periodically. Some may disagree with me on how low to discharge before charging, but 3.6-3.7v resting should always be safe on good condition cells.


----------



## awenta (Apr 20, 2013)

neutralwhite said:


> thanks, what is resting?.
> when mine run low, i stick them on charge usually straight after .
> thanks.



It's the voltage of the batteries with no load. IE on the counter.


----------



## Outdoorsman (Apr 24, 2013)

*TN 30 - batteries/charger*

Hey everyone, 

Im getting a thrunite tn 30 and needed help on which batteries to buy. I did a lot of looking around and i hear there are fake batteries, poorly advertised performance, and ones that are unsafe. I am looking for at least 4 batteries (one for another flashlight) that are protected and give great performance and long lasting. Im willing to spend the extra dollar or 2 to ensure good quality. Also looking for a good charger as well. Only needs to hold 2 batteries but more is nice. This needs to be safe also and independently charge each battery. 

Thanks for your help.


----------



## KILLER_K (Apr 25, 2013)

*Re: TN 30 - batteries/charger*

Not sure where you shop at. I'm just going to do some amazon links and you can take those and do a search where you shop to keep it simple.

*Batteries: EagleTac 3400mAh Protected Li-ion 18650 Rechargeable Battery 
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00AYLA5UU/?tag=cpf0b6-20

* Charger: JETBeam IntelliCharger i4 PRO Charger V3 - 3rd Generation - 2013 Enhanced Version 
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00BC4J5O0/?tag=cpf0b6-20




Outdoorsman said:


> Hey everyone,
> 
> Im getting a thrunite tn 30 and needed help on which batteries to buy. I did a lot of looking around and i hear there are fake batteries, poorly advertised performance, and ones that are unsafe. I am looking for at least 4 batteries (one for another flashlight) that are protected and give great performance and long lasting. Im willing to spend the extra dollar or 2 to ensure good quality. Also looking for a good charger as well. Only needs to hold 2 batteries but more is nice. This needs to be safe also and independently charge each battery.
> 
> Thanks for your help.


----------



## Lumens_kid3331 (Apr 25, 2013)

*Re: TN 30 - batteries/charger*

Hi everybody, I'm wondering if I can get 2 decent 18650s and a charger for $50 or less? Thanks.


----------



## HKJ (Apr 25, 2013)

*Re: TN 30 - batteries/charger*



Lumens_kid3331 said:


> Hi everybody, I'm wondering if I can get 2 decent 18650s and a charger for $50 or less? Thanks.



Yes:
2xNCR18650A (i.e. 3100mAh) protected batteries (About $15 each)
Xtar WP2 II (Dual bay, about $20) or ML102 charger (Single bay, below $10)


----------



## emmashi (Apr 26, 2013)

*Re: Li ion questions from a newbie*

[h=1]FANDYFIRE 18650 3600mAh 3.7V Li-ion Protected Rechargeable Battery is good[/h]


----------



## Gun (Apr 26, 2013)

*Re: Li ion questions from a newbie*

I've heard the Panasonic Protected NCR18650A Rechargeable 3100mAh are pretty good batteries.


----------



## srmd22 (Apr 26, 2013)

*18650 recommendations for TN30 and EC2 please*

My search fu must be off. I am having a devil of a time finding this info. I have these 2 lights on order, and so I need 4 18650’s. I see that AW is recommended, so I am looking at the various versions at light hound: 2200, 2600, 2900, 3100 and 3400 mAh. I realize that the run times improve with increasing mAh (err...right?), but so does the diameter, apparently? Which will fit these lights? I am planning on expanding the 18650 powered part of my collection further, so a universally useable battery would be ideal, if that is possible. Atm, the only 18650 torch I have is a 3 yr old Jetbeam Jet-III ST, with is sporting the 2200 mAh version.

is there a better (or equal quality but less expensive) alternative to AW? I read that the panasonics are great, but too fat for some lights?

Thanks!


----------



## Knight_Light (Apr 26, 2013)

*Re: Pila Charger or Xtar VP1 (or another better charger)? *safety first*



the badger said:


> So, what is the BEST charger for the following batteries (price is not a factor here)?:
> 17670, 1800 18350 and 16650Thanks for all the help!


 In my opinion if you have the capability and the know-how to use a hobby charger they are the best for lithium’s. And for the money you cannot get a better charger. They start as low as $20 and I have seen them as high as several hundred dollars. See the following link as an example, not necessarily an endorsement.

*IMAX B6 Charger/Discharger 1-6 Cells*
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__5548__IMAX_B6_Charger_Discharger_1_6_Cells_GENUINE_.html


----------



## srmd22 (Apr 26, 2013)

*Re: 18650 recommendations for TN30 and EC2 please*



srmd22 said:


> My search fu must be off. I am having a devil of a time finding this info. I have these 2 lights on order, and so I need 4 18650’s. I see that AW is recommended, so I am looking at the various versions at light hound: 2200, 2600, 2900, 3100 and 3400 mAh. I realize that the run times improve with increasing mAh (err...right?), but so does the diameter, apparently? Which will fit these lights? I am planning on expanding the 18650 powered part of my collection further, so a universally useable battery would be ideal, if that is possible. Atm, the only 18650 torch I have is a 3 yr old Jetbeam Jet-III ST, with is sporting the 2200 mAh version.
> 
> is there a better (or equal quality but less expensive) alternative to AW? I read that the panasonics are great, but too fat for some lights?
> 
> Thanks!



Moved and buried in a sticky...great. I already read this thread, and I don't think it addresses my specific question-- so if anyone can help, that would be great!


----------



## 501 sea (Apr 26, 2013)

*Re: Li ion questions from a newbie*



emmashi said:


> *FANDYFIRE 18650 3600mAh 3.7V Li-ion Protected Rechargeable Battery is good*



From what I have read, I understand only 3400mAh is the maximum capacity of a 18650, and that only Panasonic make them.

I doubt the Fandyfire battery holds 3600mAh, however, it obviously works OK for you.


----------



## 501 sea (Apr 26, 2013)

*Re: Li ion questions from a newbie*



Gun said:


> I've heard the Panasonic Protected NCR18650A Rechargeable 3100mAh are pretty good batteries.




I'm using them now, the Intl-outdoors black version, because I'm worried about fires and "venting with flame" and so on, and because HJK said in his review the NCR18650A was a safe battery. I would have got AWs which seem to be even safer, but I didn't know how to get them.

EDIT: As per HJK's post a little below, AWs are not safer, because they are the same battery, (Panasonic NCR18650A protected).


----------



## srmd22 (Apr 26, 2013)

*Re: Li ion questions from a newbie*



501 sea said:


> I'm using them now, the Intl-outdoors black version, because I'm worried about fires and "venting with flame" and so on, and because HJK said in his review the NCR18650A was a safe battery. I would have got AWs which seem to be even safer, but I didn't know how to get them.



Lighthound sells the AW's.


----------



## 501 sea (Apr 26, 2013)

*Re: TN 30 - batteries/charger*



Outdoorsman said:


> Hey everyone,
> 
> Im getting a thrunite tn 30 and needed help on which batteries to buy. I did a lot of looking around and i hear there are fake batteries, poorly advertised performance, and ones that are unsafe. I am looking for at least 4 batteries (one for another flashlight) that are protected and give great performance and long lasting. Im willing to spend the extra dollar or 2 to ensure good quality. Also looking for a good charger as well. Only needs to hold 2 batteries but more is nice. This needs to be safe also and independently charge each battery.
> 
> Thanks for your help.




One important thing is that you will need a cheap Digital MultiMeter (DMM) to check your batteries voltages are all the same.

As for recommending batteries and charges, you may wish to browse through

http://www.lygte-info.dk/info/indexBatteriesAndChargers UK.html

for recommendations, though it will take some time.

AW's 18650s seem very good, see:

http://www.cpfmarketplace.com/mp/showthread.php?230876-AW-s-LiIon-Batteries-Sales-Thread-*Part-12*

"The 3100 also features a new ultra thin pcb connecting flexi strip that is heat resistant to 500F ( instead of a bare metal strip ).
The new flexi strip will protect the battery from a direct short in case the outer plastic wrapper of the battery is torn / damaged"

"Heat Resistance Layer (HRL) technology that forms an insulating metal oxide layer between the positive and negative electrodes. The layer prevents the battery from overheating even if a short circuit occurs."

Another thing you need to be wary of is that the batteries will fit your flashlight....some 18650s are too big or too small....I don't know if this will be an issue with the TN30.


----------



## 501 sea (Apr 26, 2013)

*Re: Li ion questions from a newbie*



srmd22 said:


> Lighthound sells the AW's.




Thanks for that.


----------



## djdawg (Apr 26, 2013)

*Re: Li ion questions from a newbie*

My two cents is ..................Iam using a Pila charger and EagleTac batts and AW batts .
all are protected .........upon advise from this forum.


----------



## HKJ (Apr 27, 2013)

*Re: Li ion questions from a newbie*



501 sea said:


> I would have got AWs which seem to be even safer, but I didn't know how to get them.



AW is not safer, they uses the same Panasonic cell for the 2900/3100/3400mAh batteries.


----------



## Lumens_kid3331 (Apr 27, 2013)

*Re: TN 30 - batteries/charger*

Thanks HKJ, I will definitely look into those.


----------



## 501 sea (Apr 27, 2013)

*Re: TN 30 - batteries/charger*



srmd22 said:


> My search fu must be off. I am having a devil of a time finding this info. I have these 2
> lights on order, and so I need 4 18650’s. I see that AW is recommended, so I am looking at the various versions at
> light hound: 2200, 2600, 2900, 3100 and 3400 mAh. I realize that the run times improve with increasing mAh
> (err...right?), but so does the diameter, apparently? Which will fit these lights? I am planning on expanding the
> ...



I don't have any experience with this, but from what I see on HJK's graph of battery widths, most 18650s are 
between 18.0 and 18.5 mm in diameter. The Panasonics do not seem to be out of line. I'd suspect that if there are 
so many 18650s in the 18.0 to 18.5 width range, they can't all be wrong, they must fit most flashlights.

http://lygte-info.dk/review/batteries2012/Common18650Summary UK.html

(scroll down to the 2nd chart).

Maybe you could get access to a printer, print the graph out, use a ruler and pencil and draw lines to clarify the 
narrower (and shorter) batteries?
Also, don't forget about the difference between flat-top, button-top, and nipple-top cells. 

The button-top Intl-Outdoor (Black) Panasonic NCR18650A 3100mAh batteries I have will work in my Xeno (Farka) F7 
Tiger and in a 501B I have, because they have spring contacts at the front end of the torch, but they won't work in 
a G&R XG01 flashlight I have, because it has just a "stud" contact at the front end behind the LED. Nipple-tops 
will work with the G&R XG01, though.

Some torches rely on mechanical means rather than digital means for reversed-
polarity protection, and the ones that rely on mechanical protection rely on nippletops (the same tops you get on 
Duracell / Energizer AAs) to fit properly.

I'd say the elements of your question are not easy to answer.

As regards the battery capacity in mAh, yes, technically a battery with more mAh should give longer runtimes, but 
from what I've read somewhere, there can be complications, such that a lower capacity battery with a higher **
sustained** voltage can give longer high-output runtime than a higher capacity battery whose voltage droops 
early. And I didn't bookmark where I read this....sorry.

I'm something of a newbie, and I've also been trying aim at what you are trying to do, but I think maybe there's no 
"one size that fits all". Maybe you'll just have to choose a battery that works with most flashlights, and 
sacrifice maximum runtime; and buy other rechargeables for the lights that what you have don't suit.

Also, I would not worry about the cost of rechargables, because you can re-use them so many times before you have 
to dispose of them (50 times? 100? 500? They really cost just a fraction of what you spend on them).


----------



## aus_sparky (Apr 27, 2013)

*Re: TN 30 - batteries/charger*



501 sea said:


> One important thing is that you will need a cheap Digital MultiMeter (DMM) to check your batteries voltages are all the same.
> 
> As for recommending batteries and charges, you may wish to browse through
> 
> ...



Thanks for the links, very helpful and a lot to take in for a newby.


----------



## srmd22 (Apr 27, 2013)

*Re: TN 30 - batteries/charger*

I just went ahead and ordered a bunch of the Orbtronics 3400mAh, because they have the button top, and Sal at Orbtronic is pretty confident they will fit in my lights (I'm now at the TN30, ec2, SC600 MKII and I am probably going to pull the trigger on the TN26. So I'll need a lot of 18750s, and the Orbtronics look like the best price for the quality. I also have an older Jetbeam Jet-III ST which has an AW 2200mAh, which has served me very well. 


I also ordered a DMM and the Intellicharger i4. So we have a tidy bundle into flashlights and accessories


----------



## gatorgrabber (Apr 28, 2013)

*Battery suggestions for the Tiny Monster*

Wow, you don't hang out here for a few months and you're totally behind! I'm looking for high quality batteries for the TM-15. I'm not a big fan of the latest, greatest fad; more a believer in the "anvil in a sand pile" approach (tough and durable). I'm leaning towards EagleTac 18650's but really don't have much/any data to base that on. Any suggestions?? Wow, this site is addictive! :twothumbs


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## Solid Lifters (Jun 13, 2013)

That's for the tip. I still haven't purchased any batteries yet. I'll check those out.


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## weegidy (Dec 26, 2013)

*Re: Recommend rechargeables for my torches?*



gopajti said:


> *Fenix ARB-L2 use China BAK cell*.
> http://www.bak.com.cn/main.aspx



Can anyone enlighten us on how these cells are? Do they compare to the Panasonic 3.4Ah cells?


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## neutralwhite (Dec 27, 2013)

*Re: Recommend rechargeables for my torches?*

see on here drop down lists; they are pretty good cells according to HKJ.
...good on the brightness side of things. 

http://lygte-info.dk/review/batteries2012/Common18650comparator.php




weegidy said:


> Can anyone enlighten us on how these cells are? Do they compare to the Panasonic 3.4Ah cells?


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## gopajti (Dec 27, 2013)

*Re: Recommend rechargeables for my torches?*



weegidy said:


> Can anyone enlighten us on how these cells are? Do they compare to the Panasonic 3.4Ah cells?



http://www.dampfakkus.de/akku_auswahl.php


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## weegidy (Dec 27, 2013)

*Re: Recommend rechargeables for my torches?*

Does anyone have experience using the Fenix ARB-L2S batteries? That's what I originally thought gopajti was referring to, and that's why I asked for the comparison to the Panasonic cells. I realize now, that I was mistaken, but I would still like to know how the Fenix 3400mAh batteries are. Do they use Panasonic cells?


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## N54 (Jan 4, 2014)

*Re: Recommend rechargeables for my torches?*

I just recently got into led lights. I've got a fenix tk15 s2 and pd35. Bought orbtronic 3400's and an xstar vp1. Since they're single 18650 lights I'm wondering if I'd be better off with a 2600mah battery. Is there a noticeable difference in high lumen output with 2600 vs 3400?


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## MFMIYP (Jan 5, 2014)

*Re: Recommend rechargeables for my torches?*



weegidy said:


> Does anyone have experience using the Fenix ARB-L2S batteries? That's what I originally thought gopajti was referring to, and that's why I asked for the comparison to the Panasonic cells. I realize now, that I was mistaken, but I would still like to know how the Fenix 3400mAh batteries are. Do they use Panasonic cells?



I have a number of the ARB-L2S batteries. I do not know what cells they use, but felt it was important to say that the ARB-L2S have flat tops. Button top batteries are my choice as they will (as far as I know) work in ALL my light gear, not just some. My money goes toward Nitecore NL189's which are 3400's with button tops. Fenix products (IMO) are very nice, but the flat tops are something I pass on. If you don't know what I'm referring to, I can elaborate.


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## MFMIYP (Jan 5, 2014)

*Re: Recommend rechargeables for my torches?*



N54 said:


> I just recently got into led lights. I've got a fenix tk15 s2 and pd35. Bought orbtronic 3400's and an xstar vp1. Since they're single 18650 lights I'm wondering if I'd be better off with a 2600mah battery. Is there a noticeable difference in high lumen output with 2600 vs 3400?



IMO, those are good lights to start with - especially the PD35. You could end your quest there but more power to you if you don't. Anyway, the two batteries (2600 vs 3400) in terms of your question will effectually provide the same lumen output with your lights. The practical difference is certain between the two batteries, but is limited to the run time. I am assuming you're looking at the price difference of the two and wondering why spend more. I contemplated that myself anyway, but always come to the same conclusion; I will ALWAYS be grateful that I went for longer run time every time over saving some money once. If there is a REALLY big savings, I'll go for it just to have the extra batteries around kind of thing, but I'd go for the biggest amp hours available.


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## N54 (Jan 5, 2014)

*Re: Recommend rechargeables for my torches?*



MFMIYP said:


> IMO, those are good lights to start with - especially the PD35. You could end your quest there but more power to you if you don't. Anyway, the two batteries (2600 vs 3400) in terms of your question will effectually provide the same lumen output with your lights. The practical difference is certain between the two batteries, but is limited to the run time. I am assuming you're looking at the price difference of the two and wondering why spend more. I contemplated that myself anyway, but always come to the same conclusion; I will ALWAYS be grateful that I went for longer run time every time over saving some money once. If there is a REALLY big savings, I'll go for it just to have the extra batteries around kind of thing, but I'd go for the biggest amp hours available.



Thanks I actually forgot to mention the pd 22, which is what I carry mostly. 
Im actually looking into getting the zebralight sc600 MK II L2 when they start stocking them.....as my next light to add to the collection. My concern is the capability to support the higher lumen outputs. My understanding was that (with single 18650 lights) the 2600 was better for those looking to get highest lumen output at the expense of runtime and that the 3400 provided longer runtime at the expense of lower lumen output. FYI I have read HKJ's reviews and charts. But in real world how much perceivable difference is that lumen output? Would it be worth to get some fenix 2600's as well? Or will I not really notice a difference running my orbtronics 3400.


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## FlashKat (Jan 5, 2014)

*Re: Recommend rechargeables for my torches?*

It gets complicated to explain how every battery works.
You have both the Fenix 2600 and Orbtronic 3400 which will give basically the same lumen output.
The Orbtronic 3400 vs. the Fenix 2600 is the mAh capacity difference where the Orbtronic is a higher capacity battery that will give you longer runtime. *(Higher capacity batteries are usually larger in diameter. Just make sure the battery fits properly in your light)*
Higher lumen output is usually achieved by a higher amp discharge rate which IMR batteries are used but they have a much lower mAh capacity that gives a shorter runtime.
*So to answer your question.... No need to buy the Fenix 2600 battery*.


N54 said:


> Thanks I actually forgot to mention the pd 22, which is what I carry mostly.
> Im actually looking into getting the zebralight sc600 MK II L2 when they start stocking them.....as my next light to add to the collection. My concern is the capability to support the higher lumen outputs. My understanding was that (with single 18650 lights) the 2600 was better for those looking to get highest lumen output at the expense of runtime and that the 3400 provided longer runtime at the expense of lower lumen output. FYI I have read HKJ's reviews and charts. But in real world how much perceivable difference is that lumen output? Would it be worth to get some fenix 2600's as well? Or will I not really notice a difference running my orbtronics 3400.


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## djdawg (Jan 5, 2014)

*Re: Recommend rechargeables for my torches?*

Very informitive post above ........ thats why I come here 
I also believe you get what you pay for most of the time........
I use Eagletacs 3400 mahs and I have a few AW brand 3400


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## MFMIYP (Jan 5, 2014)

*Re: Recommend rechargeables for my torches?*



N54 said:


> Thanks I actually forgot to mention the pd 22, which is what I carry mostly.
> Im actually looking into getting the zebralight sc600 MK II L2 when they start stocking them.....as my next light to add to the collection. My concern is the capability to support the higher lumen outputs. My understanding was that (with single 18650 lights) the 2600 was better for those looking to get highest lumen output at the expense of runtime and that the 3400 provided longer runtime at the expense of lower lumen output. FYI I have read HKJ's reviews and charts. But in real world how much perceivable difference is that lumen output? Would it be worth to get some fenix 2600's as well? Or will I not really notice a difference running my orbtronics 3400.



I haven't read the reviews and charts you're referring to. Thanks; I'll consider it a good tip. Sounds like I could be missing something - though it seems very unlikely to me. My background would tell me that more available current (a 3400 over a 2600) would _if anything_, actually equate (possibly - depending on the characteristics of the lights electronics I suppose) to higher lumens (but certainly _not _less), and definitely more runtime than anything _less _than 3400. The only thing I can guess just sitting here right now is that someone sat down and actually said OK, we're going to take the 2600 and build some internal circuits that _in effect_ would provide a light more current to get some more lumens, but it sounds far-fetched. Leaning on my background again, current or amperage is pretty straightforward as far as a battery is concerned. The larger capacity batteries have more power in reserve so-to-speak than a smaller capacity of the same voltage. If there was some kind of current limiting circuit built into the 3400, well that's something all together different and I'd be mystified about why.... basically... especially if that put a lesser performance on the battery over smaller (capacity not physical size) ones. Another thing I am finding strange to hear is that a 3400 would be physically larger than a 2600, considering they share the same battery type designation number which _includes _size, I would be surprised if there was a difference in size. Maybe I'll get a caliper out someday, but it seems unnecessary (LOL and almost dangerous if you're checking length _carelessly_ if it became possible to short it out I mean) So you're looking forward to a Zebra eh? Me too. Actually a H602 XM-L2 flood headlamp cool white is on its way to me, and it'll be my first of that make. I see many models are hard to find right now, and I just couldn't wait to figure out if what I ordered was not what I'd be happy with. I have a Nitecore HC50, and I think it's a bad *** light! Very nice, I am impressed with it and all but my interest in Zebra got me just as bad as something else is sure to just a short time from now I am sure. Or maybe I am just impulsive.


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## N54 (Jan 5, 2014)

*Re: Recommend rechargeables for my torches?*



MFMIYP said:


> I haven't read the reviews and charts you're referring to. Thanks; I'll consider it a good tip. Sounds like I could be missing something - though it seems very unlikely to me. My background would tell me that more available current (a 3400 over a 2600) would _if anything_, actually equate (possibly - depending on the characteristics of the lights electronics I suppose) to higher lumens (but certainly _not _less), and definitely more runtime than anything _less _than 3400. The only thing I can guess just sitting here right now is that someone sat down and actually said OK, we're going to take the 2600 and build some internal circuits that _in effect_ would provide a light more current to get some more lumens, but it sounds far-fetched. Leaning on my background again, current or amperage is pretty straightforward as far as a battery is concerned. The larger capacity batteries have more power in reserve so-to-speak than a smaller capacity of the same voltage. If there was some kind of current limiting circuit built into the 3400, well that's something all together different and I'd be mystified about why.... basically... especially if that put a lesser performance on the battery over smaller (capacity not physical size) ones. Another thing I am finding strange to hear is that a 3400 would be physically larger than a 2600, considering they share the same battery type designation number which _includes _size, I would be surprised if there was a difference in size. Maybe I'll get a caliper out someday, but it seems unnecessary (LOL and almost dangerous if you're checking length _carelessly_ if it became possible to short it out I mean) So you're looking forward to a Zebra eh? Me too. Actually a H602 XM-L2 flood headlamp cool white is on its way to me, and it'll be my first of that make. I see many models are hard to find right now, and I just couldn't wait to figure out if what I ordered was not what I'd be happy with. I have a Nitecore HC50, and I think it's a bad *** light! Very nice, I am impressed with it and all but my interest in Zebra got me just as bad as something else is sure to just a short time from now I am sure. Or maybe I am just impulsive.



Here are the charts from his tests/reviews. 

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?330236-2012-Battery-test-review-summary

Read the section on single cell lights. But in a nutshell. Most single cell lights probably draw 1.5-3A on their high/burst modes. 2600mah cells like the fenix 2600 will hold voltage at those higher currents longer than the higher capacity cells. Hence the longer blue/cyan/yellow bars with the fenix 2600 vs Panasonic 3400....as seen on the 3.6v discharge graph. So in theory the lower capacity cells will actually provide longer high lumen run times....but lower overall mid/low lumen run times as compared to the higher capacity cells.


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## MFMIYP (Jan 5, 2014)

*Re: Recommend rechargeables for my torches?*

Nice trick! You were trying to hurt my eyes, right?


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## oKtosiTe (Jan 6, 2014)

*Re: Recommend rechargeables for my torches?*



MFMIYP said:


> Nice trick! You were trying to hurt my eyes, right?


Constructive criticism goes a long way.


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