# Is anyone using the "Pure Energy" battery?



## frankr (Jan 8, 2008)

Is anyone using the "Pure Energy" battery in their LED flashlights?
Rechargeable 1.5 volt alkaline batteries sounds great.
Would the aaa one work well in a Fenix LOD, and if so how would it compare to the using NiMH batteries?


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## Marduke (Jan 8, 2008)

It would be like any other alkaline battery, and perform horribly under load.


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## Oddjob (Jan 8, 2008)

I believe alkalines have a higher internal resistance than NiMH batteries and therefore are not as good for high drain devices such as some flashlights on their high settings. Because NiMH and Lithiums have lower internal resistance they will give you better runtimes and more consistent light output.


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## LEDninja (Jan 8, 2008)

Because they are rechargeable they stay around longer than regular alkalines. Which means they leak more. I have lost countless illuminated magnifiers and electric pencil sharpeners from the leakage.
1) Store the batteries outside the device.
2) Date them and throw them out 3 years after that date. Most of my leakages seem to be from batteries left in devices >~3 years.
3) Need Pure Energy smart charger. Do NOT use NiCD/NiMH chargers.
4) They supply less current than regular alkalines so use in low drain devices only.

Pure energy makes 3 kinds of rechargeabe alkalines:
1) Regular (yellow wrapper). Can be recharged up to 25 times (HA!). Each charge leaves them with less energy than the last time. New 10 days Sony Walkman 2x90 min tape/day. After 1st charge 9 days. After 2nd charge 8 days etc. I usually replace them long before the 25th charge.
2) XL (black wrapper). Can be recharged up to 50 times.
3) New type. (yellow wrapper with green ends). Claim up to 500 charges.
Pure Energy also sells:
4) Regular NiMH "digital" (dark green wrapper)
5) Low self discharge NiMH "pre-charged" (gray wrapper).
The last 2 cannot be charged in the rectangular Pure Energy chargers. Use the teardrop shaped Pure Energy charger. Or any NiMH charger.

EDIT
Here is Chevrofreak's runtime charts for the L0D CE. The Pure Energy alkalines are similar to the Coppertop. Terrible on high, tolerable on low. Note the 1.5V does NOT provide any more light even when fresh.
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/152223

I suggest using low self discharge NiMH - Eneloop, RayOvac Hybrids, #5 above, Duracell and Energizer also have them.
The RayOvac Hybrids and Pure Energy Pre-charged seem to have the best prices. The Eneloops, Duracells & Energizers seem to cost a lot more, at least around where I live.


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## Darkpower (Jan 8, 2008)

LEDninja said:


> Because they are rechargeable they stay around longer than regular alkalines. Which means they leak more. I have lost countless illuminated magnifiers and electric pencil sharpeners from the leakage.
> 1) Store the batteries outside the device.
> 2) Date them and throw them out 3 years after that date. Most of my leakages seem to be from batteries left in devices >~3 years.
> 3) Need Pure Energy smart charger. Do NOT use NiCD/NiMH chargers.
> ...


I bought 16 of the XL Pure Energy RAMs and I like them. I used to use the "renewals" from Rayovac back in the late 1990 and still have about 20 of the AA, 12 AAA and 3 D cells Renewals left and they all still hold charges. I had only 2 or 3 leak over the years.

I also bought about 24 of the "Juice RAMs" and the charger on Amazon.com. I believe both the Juice Batteries and Pure Energy are the same. Both made in Canada. I think Juice is just a brand and not a mfg.

Anyhow, they have very little self discharge. I found the AA Renewals in a 35 mm slide viewing light box and they were sitting in there for 6 years. They still had a charge (1.35 volts) and the light box lit up just fine after 6 years. None leaked. The only leaks I got were when I placed the old renewals in the Juice charger. They leaked because I believe the Juice charger uses higher current. Anyhow I bought the Rayovac PS3 charger and it is designed to charge all three chemistires, NiMh, NiCd, and RAMs. The Rayovac charges much more gently. I haven't had any leaks when matching chargers to the manufacturer of the batteries.

Anyhow, these RAMs, the rechargeable alkaline manganese have a distinct niche where neither the eneloops or any of the low self discharge NiMh will work. They are at 1.6 volts off the charger and settle to about 1.55 volts and they hold their charge much longer than the eneloops. I use them in portable radios because I used to use NiMh in that and the batteries would self discharge faster then the device would drain them in actual use. I use a portable radio perhaps a few hours a week to catch some Radio Talk shows. One set of alkalines would provide months of play time, sometimes as long as 6 months with primaries. The NiMh literally were good for just a few weeks and were below 1.3 volts before I even had the radio on for much more than a few hours cummulative over a period of a few weeks. Most radios also need full voltage for best "Q" selectivity. Once the batteries run down to 1.3 volts, it becomes harder to tune into a distance station.

I personally look forward to use the XL Pure Energy in more devices because the shelf-life of the charge beats the eneloops any day of the week. They literally pay for themselves in about 6 charges if you really must have alkalines. The cost about $1.80 each (AA) compared to regular alkalines in bulk which I can get for about 30 cents each. The beauty of them is that they like being "topped off", so that if I keep a set in a (car) flashlight, I get the full voltage, shelf life in extreme heat, and if I use it intermittenly, I can always top off the batteries and always be sure that the alkalines in my emergency flashlights are always fresh. But I do agree that they may be more prone to leakage then regular alkalines so that you may not want to use them in a $65 Fenix, but perhaps in a $20 Garrity or Dorcey.


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## bp044 (Jan 8, 2008)

Darkpower said:


> I bought 16 of the XL Pure Energy RAMs and I like them. I used to use the "renewals" from Rayovac back in the late 1990 and still have about 20 of the AA, 12 AAA and 3 D cells Renewals left and they all still hold charges. I had only 2 or 3 leak over the years.
> 
> I also bought about 24 of the "Juice RAMs" and the charger on Amazon.com. I believe both the Juice Batteries and Pure Energy are the same. Both made in Canada. I think Juice is just a brand and not a mfg.
> 
> ...


Can they be charged in the old rayovac ps2 charger ?


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## Darkpower (Jan 8, 2008)

bp044 said:


> Can they be charged in the old rayovac ps2 charger ?


I would imagine yes but I would recommend buying the specific charger for the specific battery. That way if they leak, you can make a warranty claim because they state specifically that you are to use only their chargers with their batteries and they warrant their batteries for 2 years.

The Pure Energy rechargers charge at 375 mA.


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## LEDninja (Jan 8, 2008)

bp044 said:


> Can they be charged in the old rayovac ps2 charger ?


I have been charging my RayOvac Renewals in my Pure Energy charger and Pure Energy alkalines in my old PS3 charger as well as in the proper charger. 
If your RayOvac PS2 charger works with Renewels it will work with Pure Energy alkalines.
However my new PS16 charger will not charge them - goes to error mode (all LEDs blinking red). So the newer RayOvac chargers no longer support rechargeable alkalines.


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## norman$ (Dec 7, 2008)

bp044 said:


> Can they be charged in the old rayovac ps2 charger ?




FWIW, I've been using the old rayovac P2 charger for over a decade, charging both the rayovac anf the Pure Energy XL rechargeable alkalines. Looking at getting a pure energy fancy smart charger, though- I understand the pulse charging will actually make their cells last longer w/ better performance.

Which may or may not be true.

I'll just say that I like them, alsways have, never had any problems that made me say "The h#ll with this..." as I have with NiCds. No more NiCd for me. weak, low capacity, really toxic chemistry (they do leak sometimes!) Never really used NiMH or rechargeable Li batteries.

I give the Pure Energy "XL RAM" products a solid B+, and the old rayovac cells a C+. The new PE products really do recharge many more times than the 1st gen rayovacs, and work just fine in my $65 fenix L2D (some special ed'n or another). And I carry extra cells- no biggie if they don't last too long (but they do last long enough for all my uses)- I don't use the light on mega-high for more than 15 min or so at a time anyhow.

Just my opinion. They work well enough for me. The old rayovac charger works fine, ut may not be best.

Ciao.


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## torpeau (Dec 13, 2008)

Just saw a "How It's Made" show on the Science Channel that dealt with the manufacture of these batteries -- very interesting. Rechargeable alkaline and NiMHs.

http://pureenergybattery.com/


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## bob_ninja (Dec 15, 2008)

Darkpower said:


> ...
> I personally look forward to use the XL Pure Energy in more devices because the shelf-life of the charge beats the eneloops any day of the week. They literally pay for themselves in about 6 charges if you really must have alkalines. The cost about $1.80 each (AA) compared to regular alkalines in bulk which I can get for about 30 cents each. The beauty of them is that they like being "topped off", so that if I keep a set in a (car) flashlight, I get the full voltage, shelf life in extreme heat, and if I use it intermittenly, I can always top off the batteries and always be sure that the alkalines in my emergency flashlights are always fresh. But I do agree that they may be more prone to leakage then regular alkalines so that you may not want to use them in a $65 Fenix, but perhaps in a $20 Garrity or Dorcey.



I am rather confused now, so help me out understand this.
We like these because of a low SD making them suitable for low drain devices. Say I get these for my remotes and charger them say 2x per year.
The choice is single rechargable AA @$1.80 as opposed to regular one @0.30, or 1 rechargable vs 6 regular ones. Of course, there is also additional charger cost but for now I'll just set it aside.

Regular alkies may last about 1 year in a remote.
6 regular alkies = 6 years
Or this rechargable being charged 12 times, which should be fine I assume.
Also in 6 years odds are this technology will improve a lot in which case I would want to upgrade.

So I guess my questions are:
Exactly how mature is this technology? Are there more big improvements coming?
How many recharge cycles can be expected? (using Tom's definition of 80% original capacity thereafter cell is dead)

Does it make sense to start using these now, or use Eneloops until further improvements are made?

thanks


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## bob_ninja (Dec 15, 2008)

In Canada our local store has a "Blue Planet" brand. I can't find any info on it at all.

Charger

Cells

Would anyone happen to know who makese these? What is their real maker/brand? Specs?

thanks

P.S.: If it asks for postal code just enter "K0A 2P0"


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## Black Rose (Dec 15, 2008)

I wondered the same thing when those Blue Planet batteries showed up. There aren't too many companies that make rechargeable alkaline cells now. 

There is one big giveaway in the description of the Blue Planet cells which makes me believe that these are rebranded Pure Energy cells.

When you look on the Pure Energy battery page, they state their rechargeable alkalines are the only batteries in North America to be awarded the EcoLogo designation.

The Blue Planet batteries also have the Environment Canada EcoLogo certification.


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## bob_ninja (Dec 15, 2008)

Sure, makes sense. Still I would like to know which model it is so that I can find the spec sheet, or just get some info from web, etc.
As it is there is virtually no information on them. It is really annoying when CT tries to sell stuff without offering any real information.

Still thanks for the tip


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## Black Rose (Dec 15, 2008)

Yeah, that charger does not look like any of the Pure Energy chargers I see around here.


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## bob_ninja (Dec 15, 2008)

For Canadians I found Pure Energy at Dell.ca:

http://accessories.dell.com/sna/pro...l.aspx?c=ca&l=en&s=dhs&cs=cadhs1&sku=A1629604

This page has some info:


> Rechargeable 100 to 500 times, cycle life extended with frequent charging



Is this true? Even 100x would be great.
Also why is there not more buzz about them????
These would be great for remotes and similar low drain apps.

Also found this review:
http://aphnetworks.com/reviews/pure_energy_xl

Mentions 2000 mAh, just like Eneloop (again talking about low drain uses.
Seems to imply that the more expensive charger is needed for pulse charging:

http://accessories.dell.com/sna/pro...l.aspx?c=ca&l=en&s=dhs&cs=cadhs1&sku=A1629609

Anyway I am curious.


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## Mr Happy (Dec 15, 2008)

Here's a data sheet for the Pure Energy XL AA cells. I'm linking it here since I don't see it linked previously in this thread.

You can see from the data sheet that these cells share a characteristic in common with regular alkaline cells: they do best at low discharge rates, with intermittent discharge. In contrast, they fall flat with high discharge rates, especially high, continuous discharge rates.

It seems like the application for these cells would be where high voltage and low discharge current is needed. The rechargeable alkaline manganese chemistry delivers a significantly higher voltage at full charge than NiMH, and also does best with frequent top-ups.

So if you have an application where your device draws fairly low current (like remotes?) and works best with higher battery voltages, then these Pure Energy cells may just be the best rechargeable option.


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## bob_ninja (Dec 16, 2008)

thanks 
Much appreciated


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## bp044 (Dec 16, 2008)

I still am using 6 AA's of the original 24 Rayovac renewal batteries I bought over 10 years ago. They are used 3 at a time in a portable radio which is played about 10 hours during a weeks time. Were I diligent about charging them more often I suspect the ones that failed would still be in service.Rayovac claimed they were good for 25 charges. I'm sure I got more than that. I might try the Pure energy version and use them in my Rayovac PS 2 charger.


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