# Surefire EB1 now 300 lumens...



## Coup de Grace (Jan 20, 2016)

I was just looking for a throwy, single cell flashlight with a simple UI.
I hope they keep or improve the optics and with the extra lumens, create a flashlight with even more throw than the previous model.


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## JohnSmith (Jan 20, 2016)

Good catch, thanks for the news. A nice alternative to the awesome (but way to sharp and jagged) E1D.


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## kyhunter1 (Jan 22, 2016)

The problem with the added lumens is that single primary cell lights cannot hold the max output for very long. It might be 300 lumens for the first 30 seconds, that's about all you would get before the output takes a nose dive. I would rather see a well regulated 200 lumen EB1 than a short burst pocket rocket. The EB1's do have a simple UI, and a bunch of throw on the ones I have personally handled. A surefire E1D led defender is another good option. It's already 300 lumens, and the output decline is not as bad as the EB1's.


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## 270winchester (Jan 22, 2016)

kyhunter1 said:


> The problem with the added lumens is that single primary cell lights cannot hold the max output for very long. It might be 300 lumens for the first 30 seconds, that's about all you would get before the output takes a nose dive. I would rather see a well regulated 200 lumen EB1 than a short burst pocket rocket. The EB1's do have a simple UI, and a bunch of throw on the ones I have personally handled. A surefire E1D led defender is another good option. It's already 300 lumens, and the output decline is not as bad as the EB1's.


Do you have a source of the output charts of both E1D and the 300 lumen EB1?


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## kyhunter1 (Jan 22, 2016)

Reviews of both the EB1 and E1D are on the flashlightguide.com website. The graph of the E1D shows better regulation than the EB1. The E1D holds above 80% for more than a half hour. Not bad. The EB1 is not far behind it. The EB1 graph is harder to interpret, but the E1D definitely has better regulation.


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## JohnSmith (Jan 22, 2016)

300 lumen version of the EB1 will likely be more similar to the E1D than the 200 lumen version (previous generation) of the EB1.


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## 270winchester (Jan 22, 2016)

kyhunter1 said:


> Reviews of both the EB1 and E1D are on the flashlightguide.com website. The graph of the E1D shows better regulation than the EB1. The E1D holds above 80% for more than a half hour. Not bad. The EB1 is not far behind it. The EB1 graph is harder to interpret, but the E1D definitely has better regulation.



They already reviewed the 300 lumen EB1?


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## Slumber (Jan 22, 2016)

270winchester said:


> They already reviewed the 300 lumen EB1?



No review, but it wouldn't surprise me if the 300 lumen EB1 is the exact led and driver of the current E1D. Just bumping it up for those that prefer the toothless EB1. It appears the Tactical tail cap option is gone as well as the Tan colored EB1.


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## 270winchester (Jan 22, 2016)

JohnSmith said:


> 300 lumen version of the EB1 will likely be more similar to the E1D than the 200 lumen version (previous generation) of the EB1.





Slumber Pass said:


> No review, but it wouldn't surprise me if the 300 lumen EB1 is the exact led and driver of the current E1D. Just bumping it up for those that prefer the toothless EB1. It appears the Tactical tail cap option is gone as well as the Tan colored EB1.



That sounds more likely. from kyhunter's tone I thought there has already been reviews of the new 300 lumen EB1 that showed a different output graph than the E1D, but he is most likely still thinking about the older EB1. Boy was that an exciting time on CPF when the old EB1 came out 

In any case I need to pick one up. I already run my 1st gen EB1 head on an E1B body and E2D tailcap so it should be a nice upgrade.


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## JohnSmith (Jan 22, 2016)

If anyone learns the ETA on these, please let us know. I sold my last E1D, but I like having at least one 1xCR123 Surefire in the stable, so I was considering buying another E1D because it's the top performer in the lineup. However, I can be talked into an EB1 that performs the same


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## recDNA (Jan 22, 2016)

Slumber Pass said:


> No review, but it wouldn't surprise me if the 300 lumen EB1 is the exact led and driver of the current E1D. Just bumping it up for those that prefer the toothless EB1. It appears the Tactical tail cap option is gone as well as the Tan colored EB1.


I hope not. That would mean less throw than current older eb1.


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## Coup de Grace (Jan 24, 2016)

recDNA said:


> I hope not. That would mean less throw than current older eb1.


Now for sale on Surefire's website.


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## recDNA (Jan 24, 2016)

Good. Waiting for sales and reviews.


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## JPA261 (Jan 25, 2016)

Slumber Pass said:


> No review, but it wouldn't surprise me if the 300 lumen EB1 is the exact led and driver of the current E1D. Just bumping it up for those that prefer the toothless EB1. It appears the Tactical tail cap option is gone as well as the Tan colored EB1.



I wonder why they are discontinuing the tactical tailcap and the tan color. I thought they were selling a lot of those. Well, I hope they decide to reproduce it.


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## Slumber (Jan 25, 2016)

JPA261 said:


> I wonder why they are discontinuing the tactical tailcap and the tan color. I thought they were selling a lot of those. Well, I hope they decide to reproduce it.



I agree. I've been meaning to get a tactical version in tan. The tan finish is not as slippery as the black.


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## hank_612 (Jan 25, 2016)

Can anyone give me an idea what the tint is like on the new e1b?


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## Coup de Grace (Jan 25, 2016)

hank_612 said:


> Can anyone give me an idea what the tint is like on the new e1b?


The flashlight just came out a couple of days ago and you can only purchase it on Surefire's website.

I want to see this new EB1 throw farther than the E1D.


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## JPA261 (Jan 26, 2016)

I would also like to see this new light throw , but I am also with kyhunter1 about a well regulated EB1. Don't want a light that can only produce max output for 20-30min


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## RobertMM (Jan 29, 2016)

Browsing the SF2016 Catalog the specs are the same as the E1D at 300 lumens for 1.5hrs, 5 lumens for 40hrs and 9000cd max. 

Safe to say, E1D performance in an EB1 toothless body.


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## recDNA (Feb 1, 2016)

The older model through further didn't it?


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## RobertMM (Feb 1, 2016)

Yep, 12,000 cd mentioned for the XP-E model. I'm still waiting for the newer one to appear in stores near me though.


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## Coup de Grace (Feb 2, 2016)

I want to see a review before deciding if I'm going to pull the trigger on this or not. 
Probably will not buy this if the throw is less.


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## RobertMM (Feb 3, 2016)

Coup de Grace said:


> I want to see a review before deciding if I'm going to pull the trigger on this or not.
> Probably will not buy this if the throw is less.



Throw will definitely be less, as specs show. From 11-12,000cd down to 9,000cd like the E1DL. 

Heck, probably the same output curve for both of them too.


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## Coup de Grace (Feb 3, 2016)

RobertMM said:


> Throw will definitely be less, as specs show. From 11-12,000cd down to 9,000cd like the E1DL.
> 
> Heck, probably the same output curve for both of them too.


Might have a different reflector/TIR.


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## JohnSmith (Feb 9, 2016)

Has anyone spotted one of these for sale yet?


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## Hudson456 (Feb 9, 2016)

JohnSmith said:


> Has anyone spotted one of these for sale yet?



I've looked around a lot - and have not found a dealer selling the 300 lumen model yet. Of course you can order direct from Surefire.com and pay MSRP. But it's probably very close, because Ebay has sellers blowing out the stock of 200 lumen EB1's at $109 shipped!


Tempting..... very tempting...


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## SVT-ROY (Feb 10, 2016)

If anyone wants to fund the new E1b feel free to sell me your old dusty,dinged up E1D....I lost mine at dinner with the inlaws! Have a heart!


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## recDNA (Feb 10, 2016)

Hudson456 said:


> I've looked around a lot - and have not found a dealer selling the 300 lumen model yet. Of course you can order direct from Surefire.com and pay MSRP. But it's probably very close, because Ebay has sellers blowing out the stock of 200 lumen EB1's at $109 shipped!
> 
> 
> Tempting..... very tempting...


Yes if you need the narrow high throw beam it is a better light.


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## Vox Clamatis in Deserto (Feb 10, 2016)

Hudson456 said:


> Ebay has sellers blowing out the stock of 200 lumen EB1's at $109 shipped!
> 
> 
> Tempting..... very tempting...



And Amazon has matched that price within less than a dollar for the black clicky EB1C-A-BK with the tail collar.


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## recDNA (Feb 11, 2016)

I like the tac button.


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## Inebriated (Feb 11, 2016)

kyhunter1 said:


> The problem with the added lumens is that single primary cell lights cannot hold the max output for very long. It might be 300 lumens for the first 30 seconds, that's about all you would get before the output takes a nose dive. I would rather see a well regulated 200 lumen EB1 than a short burst pocket rocket. The EB1's do have a simple UI, and a bunch of throw on the ones I have personally handled. A surefire E1D led defender is another good option. It's already 300 lumens, and the output decline is not as bad as the EB1's.


They're really defensive-oriented lights, though. Most folks, myself included, carry a defensive light and a utility light. Defensive light, like the gun, just doesn't get used unless it has to. If I get 30 seconds of full power, that's probably about as long as I'm going to need it.


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## SVT-ROY (Feb 11, 2016)

Inebriated said:


> They're really defensive-oriented lights, though. Most folks, myself included, carry a defensive light and a utility light. Defensive light, like the gun, just doesn't get used unless it has to. If I get 30 seconds of full power, that's probably about as long as I'm going to need it.



Exactly


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## RobertMM (Feb 17, 2016)

SVT-ROY said:


> Exactly



What may be good with the new 300 lumen version is that if it's true that it shares the same internals as the E1DL, users get essentially stable output for an hour.

That way, it's not really a high burst for a short time but relatively flat regulation compared to the 200 lumen EB1.


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## recDNA (Feb 17, 2016)

Personally I prefer throw. Perfect regulation isn't important to me.


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## 270winchester (Feb 17, 2016)

recDNA said:


> Personally I prefer throw. Perfect regulation isn't important to me.



heck I prefer to use a 2 cell light like the E2DL-U if I want tons of output for long periods of time. There is only that much you can get with a 1 primary CR123 TIR light.

It's been so long since the original EB1 came out, that I figured someone else would have made a far superior 1-CR123 TIR light with flat regulation at 200 lumens, like so many of its critics had suggested existed but couldn't find an example of.


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## recDNA (Feb 17, 2016)

Malkoff has one but eb1 out throws it.


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## 270winchester (Feb 17, 2016)

recDNA said:


> Malkoff has one but eb1 out throws it.



which one? I must have missed it(totally possible), I thought all his modules since the M60/M30 have been reflector based?


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## recDNA (Feb 17, 2016)

It's called throw head for mdc


Based on the Malkoff MDC Head, this is the Malkoff Devices 1 CR123 Throw*Head to fit Surefire E series lights and Incandescent M300 Scout lights.* The head is constructed of 6061 T6 aluminum and Type III Hard Black Anodized.* This design utilizes a*tightly focused*TIR Optic for maximum reach.*The Lux at 1 meter is approximately 9,000.* It is an outstanding medium to long range spotter.**The output is approximately*300 measured out the front lumens.*

This head was designed for rugged service from the ground up. *It is fully potted to stand up to rough service and recoil.* This item is Covered by Our Lifetime Warranty.

The input voltage is 2 to 3.2 volts.* It was designed for use with*a single primary 3v CR123 battery.**This will not support standard RCR123 (rechargeable Li-ion) batteries, however LiFePO4 rechargeables will work in this flashlight.* The runtime on one CR123 battery is approximately 45-60 minutes.*It will easily illuminate objects at 350+ feet and will blind opponents within a 150 foot radius. The LED is a Cree XP-L HI.*


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## 270winchester (Feb 17, 2016)

Oh cool, I have been in and out of the forum, didn't see that. Son of a....now I gotta go buy one, I've been waiting for a new 1 cell TIR head from Gene for a while....is this the one you are talking about?

http://malkoffdevices.com/products/e1t-scout-m300-1cr123-head


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## Sean (Feb 17, 2016)

270winchester said:


> Oh cool, I have been in and out of the forum, didn't see that. Son of a....now I gotta go buy one, I've been waiting for a new 1 cell TIR head from Gene for a while....is this the one you are talking about?
> 
> http://malkoffdevices.com/products/e1t-scout-m300-1cr123-head



That is a cool option but I wish it also worked with a standard rechargeable 3.7v cell.


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## RobertMM (Feb 17, 2016)

Maybe that Malkoff head works with the resistored two-stage tailcap in the EB1T to create a two mode light?


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## BigBluefish (Feb 18, 2016)

RobertMM said:


> Maybe that Malkoff head works with the resistored two-stage tailcap in the EB1T to create a two mode light?



I don't know about the throw head, but an M31 / MDC head doesn't really work. You get two levels, but they are so close the difference is just barely perceptible. I think the tactical tailcap on the EB1 only works with a dedicated 2 level head. 

Maybe and M31L or LL would work? Don't know.


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## RobertMM (Feb 20, 2016)

There appears to be one seller on Ebay with the 300 lumen model, with two free extra cells. 

Pic of the box looks like the "300 lumen" label is a sticker on top of the old 200 lumen label,can't tell because of the crappy resolution.

Specs are similar to the SF website though, 300 for 1.3hr, 5 for 40hrs(also similar to the E1DL). 

Hmmmmmm.....


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## Heck (Feb 24, 2016)

Anyone find them besides on SF's website? I couldn't find them on the Bay either.


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## Sean (Feb 24, 2016)

Heck said:


> Anyone find them besides on SF's website? I couldn't find them on the Bay either.



There is one seller on eBay that has them.


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## tonkem (Feb 24, 2016)

Bhphoto has them but appear to be on back order. They updated their information to include the 300 lumen model.


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## JohnSmith (Feb 25, 2016)

It now has appeared on Amazon. Appears to be the same seller as the one on eBay.


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## tonkem (Mar 4, 2016)

Now BHphoto only shows 200 lumen model and is 7-14 day order time. I guess Surefire has not stocked the new EB1 at any dealers that I can see. Anyone have the light? How does it compare to the e1D and older EB1?


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## RobertMM (Mar 4, 2016)

Flashlightguide warned me off that ebay seller with that suspect photo of a "300" sticker on the original box, so still no EB1 for me, 200 or 300 lumen. 
Waiting for the new model is killing me. Hope it's just the same asthe E1DL internally, so I can use both primaries and Liions.


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## tonkem (Mar 4, 2016)

I have the 200 lumen EB1 Tactical. Good throw from such a small light  



RobertMM said:


> Flashlightguide warned me off that ebay seller with that suspect photo of a "300" sticker on the original box, so still no EB1 for me, 200 or 300 lumen.
> Waiting for the new model is killing me. Hope it's just the same asthe E1DL internally, so I can use both primaries and Liions.


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## JohnSmith (Mar 4, 2016)

RobertMM said:


> Flashlightguide warned me off that ebay seller with that suspect photo of a "300" sticker on the original box, so still no EB1 for me, 200 or 300 lumen.
> Waiting for the new model is killing me. Hope it's just the same asthe E1DL internally, so I can use both primaries and Liions.



Good point, the sticker in the picture looks sketchy...


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## Hudson456 (Mar 4, 2016)

*Reality Check?*

First off let me say that I am a big fan of Surefire and single CR123 lights. With that said I have absolutely no interest in the EB1 given that it is 4.5" in length, which negates the entire purpose of a single CR123 choice. For a measly 1" more I can get the EB2, E2DL, MDC or another 2XCR123 sized light which gives me not only double the battery capacity, but also allows me to use 2500 mah 16650 lithium ion cells. With this 16650 option I more than double my watt-hours from 4,500 wh to 9,250 wh AND I get higher draw capacity AND the ability to recharge. It just seems crazy to me to sacrifice all of that for 1 inch.

Anyone else share this view? I have plenty of single CR123 lights, and I like them WHEN THEY ARE SIZE-EFFICIENT. For example, the Streamlight 1L is 3.4" long. With that length you could make the argument that the sacrifice is worth it.


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## Slumber (Mar 4, 2016)

I prefer a light that is grip efficient, so the size doesn't bother me. The name "Back Up" suggests it's targeted for police or security types, so the light would have to be large enough to "fight" with.


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## Sean (Mar 4, 2016)

Hudson456 said:


> First off let me say that I am a big fan of Surefire and single CR123 lights. With that said I have absolutely no interest in the EB1 given that it is 4.5" in length, which negates the entire purpose of a single CR123 choice. For a measly 1" more I can get the EB2, E2DL, MDC or another 2XCR123 sized light which gives me not only double the battery capacity, but also allows me to use 2500 mah 16650 lithium ion cells. With this 16650 option I more than double my watt-hours from 4,500 wh to 9,250 wh AND I get higher draw capacity AND the ability to recharge. It just seems crazy to me to sacrifice all of that for 1 inch.
> 
> Anyone else share this view? I have plenty of single CR123 lights, and I like them WHEN THEY ARE SIZE-EFFICIENT. For example, the Streamlight 1L is 3.4" long. With that length you could make the argument that the sacrifice is worth it.



I completely understand. I have a Surefire E1DL and have replaced the single cell body with an E2DL body that I use a 16650 in. This gives me much better capacity than a single lifepo4 cell in the stock body.

This combo only adds about an inch to the overall length but greatly increased capacity.


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## Vox Clamatis in Deserto (Mar 4, 2016)

*Re: Reality Check?*



Hudson456 said:


> For a measly 1" more I can get the EB2, E2DL, MDC or another 2XCR123 sized light which gives me not only double the battery capacity, but also allows me to use 2500 mah 16650 lithium ion cells. With this 16650 option I more than double my watt-hours from 4,500 wh to 9,250 wh AND I get higher draw capacity AND the ability to recharge. It just seems crazy to me to sacrifice all of that for 1 inch.



I ran an EB2 off a 16650 for a while but realized that I wasn't getting full brightness. It really has a kick with two Tenergy 3.0 volt rechargeables.

I've got a couple of EB1's, I agree that for just a little more length you get twice the battery power in the EB2.


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## Heck (Mar 5, 2016)

*Re: Reality Check?*

For what it's worth, I've seen SF use old packaging with stickers for the upgraded models. Furthermore, the same seller on Amazon has other SFs for sale and one question on Amazon confirm he got the X300U-B in old packaging and sticker on box, but is confirmed upgraded model as it is etched the "B" version.


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## Vox Clamatis in Deserto (Mar 5, 2016)

*Re: Reality Check?*

Do you mean the 'B' is in the serial number on the upgraded EB1's head?

But wait, I now see the later 200 lumen EB1's seem to have the serial number on the body...


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## blanex1 (Mar 5, 2016)

sorry to but in! but can you change the front head or tail cap for with other surefire's lights! like 6P/9P.


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## Heck (Mar 5, 2016)

The "B" for the X300. I do not know for the EB1.


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## Vox Clamatis in Deserto (Mar 5, 2016)

Heck said:


> The "B" for the X300. I do not know for the EB1.



Thanks, I missed that. I wonder if the new EB1 will have serial numbers starting with 'B' to signify the upgraded output? That scheme has often been used by SF in the past to denote an improved model, I believe the U2 was another example.


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## Inebriated (Mar 6, 2016)

*Re: Reality Check?*



Hudson456 said:


> First off let me say that I am a big fan of Surefire and single CR123 lights. With that said I have absolutely no interest in the EB1 given that it is 4.5" in length, which negates the entire purpose of a single CR123 choice. For a measly 1" more I can get the EB2, E2DL, MDC or another 2XCR123 sized light which gives me not only double the battery capacity, but also allows me to use 2500 mah 16650 lithium ion cells. With this 16650 option I more than double my watt-hours from 4,500 wh to 9,250 wh AND I get higher draw capacity AND the ability to recharge. It just seems crazy to me to sacrifice all of that for 1 inch.
> 
> Anyone else share this view? I have plenty of single CR123 lights, and I like them WHEN THEY ARE SIZE-EFFICIENT. For example, the Streamlight 1L is 3.4" long. With that length you could make the argument that the sacrifice is worth it.


It's not all about ultimate run time or brightness. The EB1/E1D lights are largely used as defensive use.

Try modern handgun/handheld light techniques with a light that's the bare minimum in size for a 1xCR123, and it's not going to work well. Same goes for use with gloves, as is a real possibility for the LE side. Their 1xCR123 lights fill most hands with reasonable efficiency. Additionally, a light the size of the EB2/E2D/LX2 is large enough for many people on the civilian side to leave at home, which of course does them no good.


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## tonkem (Mar 16, 2016)

Anyone have this light?


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## Heck (Mar 17, 2016)

I ordered one from that particular seller on Amazon and will have it by next week when I head down to the US. My postal receiver took a pic of the box I received and it has the round white sticker with 300 written on it.


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## tonkem (Mar 17, 2016)

That sounds fairly strange to me, that they (surefire) would put a sticker on the box stating it had 300 lumens... Let us know what you find out, once you receive it. 



Heck said:


> I ordered one from that particular seller on Amazon and will have it by next week when I head down to the US. My postal receiver took a pic of the box I received and it has the round white sticker with 300 written on it.


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## Heck (Mar 18, 2016)

Although I don't recognize the SF as of late, it's not strange at all in the sense that SF has a history of doing that and/or upgrading the specs but using the old boxes. The latest example of upgraded specs with old boxes would be the X300U-B (B model indicates 600 lumens), with a white round sticker indicating 600 over the X300U-A box with 500 lumens printed underneath.


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## RobertMM (Mar 18, 2016)

Heck said:


> Although I don't recognize the SF as of late, it's not strange at all in the sense that SF has a history of doing that and/or upgrading the specs but using the old boxes. The latest example of upgraded specs with old boxes would be the X300U-B (B model indicates 600 lumens), with a white round sticker indicating 600 over the X300U-A box with 500 lumens printed underneath.



Hope yours arrives soon. You can probably instantly tell if it has been bumped to 300 by the same silver board around the LED like the E1DL, as opposed to green for 200 lumens. 

I am assuming that both 300 lumen lights use the same LED here.


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## RobertMM (Mar 18, 2016)

123457


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## IsaacL (Mar 18, 2016)

RobertMM said:


> Hope yours arrives soon. You can probably instantly tell if it has been bumped to 300 by the same silver board around the LED like the E1DL, as opposed to green for 200 lumens.
> 
> I am assuming that both 300 lumen lights use the same LED here.



Probably an XP-G2 like the E1D instead of the older XP-E, which always failed to impress.


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## Sean (Mar 19, 2016)

Still hoping someone gets one of these soon and tells us all about it!


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## Heck (Mar 19, 2016)

I finally received it. The led and optics seems the same or is very similar to my E1D. I'm away from home so I don't have a RCR123 to try it with. I have no other lights with me to compare it with, but it seems pretty bright with a small hotspot geared more towards throw.

This EB1 has no serial number under the Surefire logo like previous EB1, other side says Backup, underneath it says US Pat 6547415, RE40125.

On the head it has the QR code with the serial number underneath that writes A104##-C. I'm assuming the -C denotes the newer version.

It also seems to switch between high and low as fast as the E1D, so I would not be surprised if they had exactly the same internals


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## RobertMM (Mar 19, 2016)

Heck said:


> I finally received it. The led and optics seems the same or is very similar to my E1D. I'm away from home so I don't have a RCR123 to try it with. I have no other lights with me to compare it with, but it seems pretty bright with a small hotspot geared more towards throw.
> 
> This EB1 has no serial number under the Surefire logo like previous EB1, other side says Backup, underneath it says US Pat 6547415, RE40125.
> 
> ...



Finally! Someone with a new version. So, XP-G2 with silver board, eh?
Very nice. 
Hotspot and beam should be similar to the E1D too.

Sorry to the seller for doubting.


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## Heck (Mar 20, 2016)

Yes it's a silverboard and not green.


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## RobertMM (Mar 21, 2016)

Thanks. Maybe you have beamshots to compare?


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## Vox Clamatis in Deserto (Mar 21, 2016)

RobertMM said:


> Finally! Someone with a new version. So, XP-G2 with silver board, eh?
> Very nice.



It is indeed exciting to see a new SureFire light version released with that brand new XP-G2 emitter (which was introduced in 2012). :twothumbs

I've been carrying an EB2 for a while now but this and a couple of other recent CPF threads have got me interested again in my L1's and EB1's.

I'm curious how the tint is in the latest upgrade to the EB1. The best tint I have on a single cell SureFire (including some E1B's) is on a Gen 6 L1. Most of my other SureFire's tend toward the greenish yellow region to my eyes.


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## Vox Clamatis in Deserto (Mar 21, 2016)

Heck said:


> This EB1 has no serial number under the Surefire logo like previous EB1, other side says Backup, underneath it says US Pat 6547415, RE40125.
> 
> On the head it has the QR code with the serial number underneath that writes A104##-C. I'm assuming the -C denotes the newer version.



Oddly enough, an EB2 bought last year has the (ersatz) QR code and a serial A07XXX-C on the head. Is it possible that the new EB1 uses a reprogrammed EB2 head? I have run my EB2 on a 16650 but it doesn't seem to put out the full 500 lumens. Does it put out 300 lumens on one cell perhaps? :thinking:

Or, more likely, maybe the -C is the clicky version of both heads since both lights had a now discontinued tactical variant. But, I have two 200 lumen EB1 clickies that don't have the -C in the serial...


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## RobertMM (Mar 22, 2016)

How's the tint on your sample, Heck?

Von Clamatis, IIRC the EB2 doesn't use XPG2. 
Or maybe the EB1 uses the same Oslon Square as the EB2 now?
Hmmmmmm....


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## Vox Clamatis in Deserto (Mar 22, 2016)

RobertMM said:


> Von Clamatis, IIRC the EB2 doesn't use XPG2.



Yep, that's what I was thinking. Maybe just a coincidence that the EB2 and new EB1 serials have that dash C suffix...

Still, even years later it's good to know about these minor detail differences in serials, labeling, packaging and finish. I've enjoyed reading the old thread about the taxonomy of the L1. I seem to have four of the six CPF identified generations of this light. And I found an old SF U2 new in the box in a drawer recently. From the serial number starting with a B I can see that it's the later version.

Anybody recognize the QR code on the recent SureFire's? I said 'ersatz' earlier because I didn't think it was in a real ISO 18004 format but I don't really know. Some of these codes, like the ones on many shipped packages, are proprietary, but others are in a format that can be read by a cellphone app.


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## Heck (Mar 22, 2016)

Tint to me looks leaning slightly towards green/yellow. But it's not as bad as I have seen for some SFs. Beam profile is not perfect if you are white wall hunting as you can see slight faint rings.

I don't know how a Osram looks like, but the led just seems to be the same as the E1D.


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## IsaacL (Mar 22, 2016)

Oslon Square


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## RobertMM (Mar 22, 2016)

IsaacL said:


> Oslon Square



Looks kind of, different


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## Heck (Mar 22, 2016)

Doesn't look like that at all.


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## tonkem (Mar 22, 2016)

Can you take a pic of the LED?


----------



## Heck (Mar 23, 2016)

I tried the EB1 with AW RCR123 and got about 45 minutes before shutting off. Everything performance wise matches E1D.

The slight green tint of the EB1 on low matches the tint of my QSL Smart. On high, with the much tighter hotspot of the EB1, the tint looks more cream-ish white vs. the reflector broad beam of the QSL Smart.


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## RobertMM (Mar 23, 2016)

Heck said:


> I tried the EB1 with AW RCR123 and got about 45 minutes before shutting off. Everything performance wise matches E1D.
> 
> The slight green tint of the EB1 on low matches the tint of my QSL Smart. On high, with the much tighter hotspot of the EB1, the tint looks more cream-ish white vs. the reflector broad beam of the QSL Smart.



Thanks for your information!

Great to know the EB1 300 lumen can handle lithium ion cells.


----------



## Heck (Mar 23, 2016)

I got about 37 minutes this time with the RCR123 as I held it in the hand a few times.


----------



## Sean (Mar 23, 2016)

Vox Clamatis in Deserto said:


> Oddly enough, an EB2 bought last year has the (ersatz) QR code and a serial A07XXX-C on the head. Is it possible that the new EB1 uses a reprogrammed EB2 head? I have run my EB2 on a 16650 but it doesn't seem to put out the full 500 lumens. Does it put out 300 lumens on one cell perhaps? :thinking:
> 
> Or, more likely, maybe the -C is the clicky version of both heads since both lights had a now discontinued tactical variant. But, I have two 200 lumen EB1 clickies that don't have the -C in the serial...



The -C stands for clicky and the -T stands for tactical.


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## recDNA (Mar 23, 2016)

For the Surefire list price I think I would prefer the HDS 325. I really should grab an old one for the throw though. I have a lot of pocket floods. I could use a pocket thrower.


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## RobertMM (Mar 24, 2016)

Heck got a very good deal here, from the looks of it.


----------



## RobertMM (Mar 26, 2016)

Just notified by a local B&M dealer of 3week ETA for the 300 lumen EB1. 

It's gonne be a looong 3 weeks.


----------



## JPA261 (Apr 16, 2016)

Anyone have the new 300 lumen EB1 yet?


----------



## RobertMM (Apr 16, 2016)

I got so tired of waiting for it that I just got an E1DL full retail price.


----------



## JPA261 (Apr 16, 2016)

Well dang, I want to see if the UI is the same as the E1D. Started carrying my old E1B and just hate that I have o wait 3sec before it goes back on high.


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## Heck (Apr 16, 2016)

The new version bounces back to high as fast as the E1D


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## RobertMM (Apr 16, 2016)

That's good to know. I managed to inspect an older EB1 200 lumen clicky at the store where I bought mine, and when I "strobed" both that and the E1DL the E1DL always returned instantly to high with repeated presses while it took some timing for the EB1. 

The difference in brighter spill and wider hotspot was noticeable though. The EB1 wins in the Lux department.

I suspect the new 300 lumen EB1 really has the E1DL's guts, like many here do.


----------



## RobertMM (Apr 16, 2016)

I take back my suspicion, as website lists 1.3hrs down to 50 lumens for the E1D, while EB1 is 1.3hrs to 10%. 
Low mode runtimes also vary between the two, with 47 versus 40 hours.


----------



## JPA261 (Apr 17, 2016)

Heck said:


> The new version bounces back to high as fast as the E1D



Well that's good to hear. That will definitely help me make my decision on getting this light. That is whenever it comes out


----------



## JPA261 (Apr 22, 2016)

I am so tempted to just go ahead and order off Surefire's website, but must keep waiting till they are out at dealers


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## RobertMM (Apr 26, 2016)

JPA261 said:


> I am so tempted to just go ahead and order off Surefire's website, but must keep waiting till they are out at dealers



The ebay dealer for 300 lumen model is back with new stock!!!

IIRC member Heck got his from that seller. 
Shame they don't ship outside CONUS.


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## SVT-ROY (Apr 26, 2016)

Heck said:


> I tried the EB1 with AW RCR123 and got about 45 minutes before shutting off. Everything performance wise matches E1D.
> 
> The slight green tint of the EB1 on low matches the tint of my QSL Smart. On high, with the much tighter hotspot of the EB1, the tint looks more cream-ish white vs. the reflector broad beam of the QSL Smart.


Oh this is very exciting. So it's looking like a deal toothed E1D with a tighter hotspot than even the 200 lumen EB1 ehh?


----------



## Heck (Apr 26, 2016)

RobertMM said:


> The ebay dealer for 300 lumen model is back with new stock!!!
> 
> IIRC member Heck got his from that seller.
> Shame they don't ship outside CONUS.



I bought it on Amazon which I believe is the same guy as eBay.

SVT-ROY: the beam is tighter than the QSL Smart, I don't believe it's any tighter than the E1D/EB1. 

I bought some new Fenix ARB-L16 and now get consistently 40-45minutes of runtime before cut off in semi-ventilated environment. The body itself, hot to hold at the mid-point of constant on, but warmish-hot towards the end.


----------



## RobertMM (Apr 26, 2016)

Heck said:


> I bought it on Amazon which I believe is the same guy as eBay.
> 
> SVT-ROY: the beam is tighter than the QSL Smart, I don't believe it's any tighter than the E1D/EB1.
> 
> I bought some new Fenix ARB-L16 and now get consistently 40-45minutes of runtime before cut off in semi-ventilated environment. The body itself, hot to hold at the mid-point of constant on, but warmish-hot towards the end.



That seems great for a 16340. Wonder what actual capacity is.


----------



## recDNA (Apr 26, 2016)

SVT-ROY said:


> Oh this is very exciting. So it's looking like a deal toothed E1D with a tighter hotspot than even the 200 lumen EB1 ehh?


Where can I read about the tighter hotspot? I thought it was identical with E1D?


----------



## RobertMM (Apr 26, 2016)

recDNA said:


> Where can I read about the tighter hotspot? I thought it was identical with E1D?


Website says the 300 lumen EB1 is 9000cd, like the E1DL. Old 200 lumen ones were 12,000cd.


----------



## recDNA (Apr 27, 2016)

That's what I thought. I thought about buying the old one for the throw but prices never dropped enough to make it worthwhile. Thanks.


----------



## RobertMM (Apr 27, 2016)

recDNA said:


> That's what I thought. I thought about buying the old one for the throw but prices never dropped enough to make it worthwhile. Thanks.



Prices may drop more once the newer models become widely available.

On a side note, I wonder how it would have been it SF stuck an XPE2 on the newer model instead of XPG2. More lumens with the same or slightly more throw would have been really interesting.


----------



## JPA261 (Apr 28, 2016)

$170 on Amazon, still pretty expensive but much better than MSRP $220. Want someone to get it already and do a review.


----------



## Monocrom (Apr 28, 2016)

Anyone else kinda really unhappy with the **** poor runtime of the SF EB1? I know I am after having owned this light for a handful of months. I mean, the runtime on my Milky modded SF L1 Xtreme has excellent runtime on one CR123. Sure, output out the front is lower. But the different isn't gigantic. Sadly, I can no longer recommend going the Milky route. But still, Scott made me a light for about $175 months before SureFire found a way to push impressive lumens numbers out of a single CR123 based light. And, with a helluva lot better runtime too.


----------



## RobertMM (Apr 29, 2016)

Monocrom said:


> Anyone else kinda really unhappy with the **** poor runtime of the SF EB1? I know I am after having owned this light for a handful of months. I mean, the runtime on my Milky modded SF L1 Xtreme has excellent runtime on one CR123. Sure, output out the front is lower. But the different isn't gigantic. Sadly, I can no longer recommend going the Milky route. But still, Scott made me a light for about $175 months before SureFire found a way to push impressive lumens numbers out of a single CR123 based light. And, with a helluva lot better runtime too.



Count me in. I admit though that the EB1 and E1DL are for defensive use, with an included tasklight/navigation mode, and there are E1L and E2L models for extended flat runtimes if the user needs such.
Still, if SF had stuck to 200 lumens and just extended runtime on the "updated" EB1 to over two hours flat, I'd be happy. At the risk of sounding like (former?) member Brianna, if I pay premium, I want regulation to be flat. If speculation turns out to be true though, and the 300 lumen EB1 has the same guts as the E1DL, the runtime plot would be flatter than the old model's. Not tabletop flat, but not a cliffdive either. 

I'm quite happy with my E1DL, and when the 300 lumen EB1 shows up at my favorite dealer I may just get one too. Shame the two stage switch is gone.


----------



## RobertMM (May 13, 2016)

Heck said:


> I bought it on Amazon which I believe is the same guy as eBay.
> 
> SVT-ROY: the beam is tighter than the QSL Smart, I don't believe it's any tighter than the E1D/EB1.
> 
> I bought some new Fenix ARB-L16 and now get consistently 40-45minutes of runtime before cut off in semi-ventilated environment. The body itself, hot to hold at the mid-point of constant on, but warmish-hot towards the end.




How's your EB1 now, with the Fenix batteries? Nothing burned out or broken? 
Your 40-45minute high runtime results are promising.


----------



## Heck (May 13, 2016)

Still going strong seeing daily usage. I haven't done runtime tests again as I top up the charge everyday now.


----------



## RobertMM (May 13, 2016)

Heck said:


> Still going strong seeing daily usage. I haven't done runtime tests again as I top up the charge everyday now.



Many thanks!


----------



## Monocrom (May 13, 2016)

I stopped carrying mine. Yeah, it's a tactical light. But its runtime for an LED tactical light is just way too poor. (And that's going by LED tactical light standards.) Even compared to other lights in the same category. It's just not cutting it.


----------



## RobertMM (May 14, 2016)

Monocrom said:


> I stopped carrying mine. Yeah, it's a tactical light. But its runtime for an LED tactical light is just way too poor. (And that's going by LED tactical light standards.) Even compared to other lights in the same category. It's just not cutting it.



Just curious, what do you carry nowadays, Monocrom? 
I was a lurker here since 2007 before joining and rarely see you now.


----------



## Monocrom (May 14, 2016)

RobertMM said:


> Just curious, what do you carry nowadays, Monocrom?
> I was a lurker here since 2007 before joining and rarely see you now.



I'm definitely still around. But mainly in the older topics from a handful of years back. Some of which, ironically, are still active. I do post in newer topics, but not as often since I see many that are very repetitive. When the show is on the air, you can catch me in CPF's official The Walking Dead topic. And, I'm always checking my most popular topic about Knife & Lights. Slowed down some, but never left CPF. :twothumbs

To be honest, lately I've been EDCing and experimenting with less expensive AA and AAA lights. For a direct CR123 replacement, I have to give the nod to my Milky-modded SureFire L1 Xtreme. Output is less, but not perceivably so. Runtime on one CR123 is easily longer than my EB1. Perhaps as much as twice as much. Tailcap is better, with also two output levels. Sadly for reasons we all know.... It's not a viable alternative option for other CPFers. I came up with the idea behind it, along with using a third generation SF L1 as the host. Scott did the rest. Perfect execution of my idea. 

I wanted to Christen it "Gemini" since it was the merging of two light types in one. A general-use light with the lower setting and the tailcap twisted for constant-on. And a true tactical light in the higher setting with the tailcap switch used in momentary-on. Scott decided on the "Xtreme" moniker though. He did such a great job, that other CPFers wanted one. This was just before the issues with Scott came up. I think there's only a handful or maybe a bit more L1 Xtremes floating around.

Though if I didn't have mine, I'd go with Gene Malkoff's offering that has a deep carry bezel down clip. Smooth black body, single-CR123 LED light. Right now.... I just honestly can't remember what Gene named it. Sorry.


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## RobertMM (May 14, 2016)

Monocrom said:


> I'm definitely still around. But mainly in the older topics from a handful of years back. Some of which, ironically, are still active. I do post in newer topics, but not as often since I see many that are very repetitive. When the show is on the air, you can catch me in CPF's official The Walking Dead topic. And, I'm always checking my most popular topic about Knife & Lights. Slowed down some, but never left CPF. :twothumbs
> 
> To be honest, lately I've been EDCing and experimenting with less expensive AA and AAA lights. For a direct CR123 replacement, I have to give the nod to my Milky-modded SureFire L1 Xtreme. Output is less, but not perceivably so. Runtime on one CR123 is easily longer than my EB1. Perhaps as much as twice as much. Tailcap is better, with also two output levels. Sadly for reasons we all know.... It's not a viable alternative option for other CPFers. I came up with the idea behind it, along with using a third generation SF L1 as the host. Scott did the rest. Perfect execution of my idea.
> 
> ...



Oooh that would be the Malkoff MDC. I like it too, but shipping and taxes/customs fees to my country kills.

Any idea as to OTF output values for the Gemini? 

The only reason I got interested in the EB1 here, is that my 6th agen L1, in which I swapped a XPG2 5000K color temp LED on copper board, got stolen. Output on high with an IMR16340 is definitely above 300 lumens, compared to my stock LX2(32 lux vs 24 lux in my "integrating shower").
Much like you say, a general purpose low of about 40 lumens and a 300 plus lumen tactical setting, with a two stage tail. Shame it got stolen. In my dismay I turn to the EB1 but got tired of waiting for the new release and got the E1DL which is okay, but I still yearn for the two stage tail.

Nice talking with one of the old timers.  made my day.


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## RobertMM (May 14, 2016)

I also still wish for the EB1 SF just stuck to 200 lumens and got more runtime with a more efficient emitter, plus a bit higher low of maybe 15 lumens to be a more reasonable general purpose light. 

Then again, lumens sell,and SF's choices can be head scratchers sometimes. 

Maybe I should get an E1L-A.... 90/5 lumens, 6/40 hours.


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## Monocrom (May 15, 2016)

Sorry to hear your light was stolen. I asked Scott for the low mode on my Gemini to be geared a bit more for runtime, with output that many would consider to be medium mode. I recall specifically that Scott mentioned it was 40 lumens out the front. With the new high mode, sad to say but Scott had started to become a bit forgetful. Definitely 200+ OTF lumens, easily! Months before SureFire broke the 200 lumens OTF barrier on one CR123 cell with runtime that wasn't a gimmick. The Gemini could be anything in the 200+ lumens range. I'd say realistically, perhaps as much as 240 on the upper end. No doubt Scott had the magic touch. (It's just a shame I had to use the word "had.")

Still trying to figure out why this happens all the time. With the exception of those members who cross over into opening up actual businesses that cater to not just the CPF community..... Everyone who offers modding services seems to eventually screw over and cheat their loyal customers. No clue why it happens. Just been on CPF long enough to know it does. It's like going to your favorite fast food place. Every time you go, you end up in line with junkies, working girls, pimps, pushers, and lunatics. Gets to the point where you start hoping it'll only be the pimps and their ladies in line with you. But only because they're the ones who are the most civil and courteous out of the bunch. They're just there to grab something to eat. Gets to the point you refuse to hang out with your friends at that White Castle over in Hempstead NY. Refuse to drive them there. No clue why drama happens. But you just know it does. Same with modders and CPF. 

Thankfully Gene is one of the guys making a formal business out of his talents. Thanks for reminding me what that model is called. Sorry that it's so expensive to get one where you are.


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## RobertMM (May 15, 2016)

Well, XPG3 is now out, I know it's a very long shot, but SF should stick this into the EB1, and all their single cell compact lights, not for output, but to increase runtime. 
A 3rd Gen EB1 with 300 lumens for a solid 2hours would be really nice, and the E1L-a would benefit even more as well.

Dang,so that's what happened to Milky. I had a chance to score a L1 (4 flats?) that he worked on, 200 lumens on high for was it 2hrs?and 3 lumens on low for crazy runtime, on one CR123. That was over 2 years ago but I'm still kicking myself for letting it pass.

Sad to see how it is with modders here, hopefully we'll see less of that? I know a few on facebook but they have business outside CPF. 

Yup, Malkoff MDC is a sweet little light, for what I paid for my E1DL I could've gotten two MDCs shipped to me, but them again I'm a SF TIR fan, hence my longing for the EB1 and an optimized version running a very efficient emitter. Maybe next time.


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## Monocrom (May 15, 2016)

Hopefully that next time will be soon. I can live with the slippery body of the SF EB1. But that runtime is killing me! Normally I don't feel the need to carry spare CR123 cells with me. Haven't felt the need in over a decade of being addicted to lights.... until I started carrying the EB1. :sigh:


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## JPA261 (May 17, 2016)

Well, I was wanting to pick one up but don't think so now. Don't like the low runtime. Maybe I'll just wait to see if surefire will correct it.


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## RobertMM (May 17, 2016)

Putting in a XPG3 and dropping current drive to match the 300 lumens of the XPG2 may make wonders for both runtime and flatter output over time.


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## JPA261 (May 17, 2016)

I like to keep things stocked though for warranty purposes


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## RobertMM (May 18, 2016)

JPA261 said:


> I like to keep things stocked though for warranty purposes



I meant for Surefire to do that from the factory, it would do wonders. Very long shot, though. The E1L would benefit from the same thing, too. Same output, but longer runtime through a more efficient emitter. I'd choose that over a brightness upgrade.


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## Monocrom (May 19, 2016)

JPA261 said:


> Well, I was wanting to pick one up but don't think so now. Don't like the low runtime. Maybe I'll just wait to see if surefire will correct it.




Also, if you want plenty of spill, this isn't the light for you.


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## JPA261 (May 19, 2016)

The spill doesn't bother me so much as runtime. Don't mind the throw. Still on the fence about getting one.


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## JPA261 (May 19, 2016)

So I checked Amazon for the 300lumen model and looks like it's no longer on there. I also checked the other EB1 options there too but all read 200lumen model.


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## Monocrom (May 19, 2016)

It's possible SureFire came to the same conclusions quite a few of us did, regarding runtime.


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## JPA261 (May 19, 2016)

You think they pulled it out of their line then for now until they figure it out?


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## Monocrom (May 19, 2016)

SureFire has a reputation for quietly upgrading its lights with no fanfare at all. Wouldn't be surprising if they fixed their lights the same way.


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## JPA261 (May 19, 2016)

Well then it's a good thing I waited then. Hopefully, they will have fixed ASAP


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## RobertMM (May 19, 2016)

Monocrom said:


> SureFire has a reputation for quietly upgrading its lights with no fanfare at all. Wouldn't be surprising if they fixed their lights the same way.



XPG3 please, Surefire.  i wouldn't mind too if they made it like the E1L-a, with maybe 300 lumens for a few minutes then flat 200 for two hours. That will still let it do its intended duty as a backup light for LEO with full brightness on turn on, but with longer runtime for extended critical tasks if you are left with no other light. Low mode runtime would be bumped up too with that upgrade.


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## Monocrom (May 20, 2016)

Carrying spare cells is a good idea. But shouldn't be an absolute necessity with an EDC light.


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## JPA261 (May 25, 2016)

Anyone know if Surefire is def upgrading the LED and internals to have the runtime increased? I want to call or email but I feel like it will take forever to get a response. So surprised that it's not out to dealers yet


----------



## RobertMM (May 26, 2016)

JPA261 said:


> Anyone know if Surefire is def upgrading the LED and internals to have the runtime increased? I want to call or email but I feel like it will take forever to get a response. So surprised that it's not out to dealers yet



Probably not, they just put a new LED(xpg2) in it and it will take time before another upgrade comes out. The internals seem to be from the E1DL, a bit flatter and longer runtime plot than the old EB1 with XPE LED.


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## JPA261 (May 26, 2016)

Well if they arent planning on increasing the run time, then whats taking them so long to release it out to dealers. LA Police Gear, Optics Planet, Amazon, etc...still have the older 200 lumen version. I am glad though they changed the internals to the E1D, like the 2 second change on it compared to the older E1B


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## RobertMM (May 26, 2016)

Maybe a few tweaks? With SF, we never know until they hit the shelves. 
Whatever they do with it, I still hope they bring back the two stage switch.


----------



## JPA261 (May 26, 2016)

Well, I emailed Surefire so hopefully I hear something from them soon about what is going on with their EB1


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## MaxStatic (May 28, 2016)

Gadzooks!!!! Amazon has 200lm E1B's w/tail cover for $80 right now. I ordered a pair more to go along with my others.


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## Vox Clamatis in Deserto (May 28, 2016)

MaxStatic said:


> Gadzooks!!!! Amazon has 200lm E1B's w/tail cover for $80 right now. I ordered a pair more to go along with my others.



Ouch. I wish you hadn't mentioned that one. And same day shipping where I live too. :shakehead

Oh my aching wallet...


----------



## RobertMM (May 28, 2016)

Vox Clamatis in Deserto said:


> Ouch. I wish you hadn't mentioned that one. And same day shipping where I live too. :shakehead
> 
> Oh my aching wallet...




You lucky dudes. :mecry:


----------



## MaxStatic (May 28, 2016)

And I meant EB1's but you all know what I meant. Cracking light for a pre MAP craze price. I remember buying my original Incan E2D and E1E for this sort of price not the near $200 they get for them now a days.


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## SoCalDep (May 28, 2016)

I just picked up one of the $80 EB1's... Hoping to put a Malkoff front end on it for a one-mode shielded clicky, but if that doesn't work it's still too good a deal to pass up!


----------



## Vox Clamatis in Deserto (May 29, 2016)

After taking a deep breath, I'm going to try to exercise some restraint... and see if the unshrouded 200 lumen EB1 drops to a similar level as the 300 lumen models go into the retail channel.

I gave the SF E1B's as gifts years ago to friends and family members but the CR123A battery price of over US$10 at the grocery store is a show stopper for most folks. I've given extra batteries but they get misplaced and the light ends up in a drawer next time I visit. The discontinued EB1's are at an appealing price point for gifts but have the same battery problem when given to non-flashaholics.



RobertMM said:


> You lucky dudes. :mecry:



We are indeed blessed. :thumbsup:



SoCalDep said:


> I just picked up one of the $80 EB1's... Hoping to put a Malkoff front end on it for a one-mode shielded clicky, but if that doesn't work it's still too good a deal to pass up!



I know that this Lego has been tried but I can't remember the result.

I really need to get away from the keyboard. Of course, if I decide to order by noon tomorrow, the EB1 will come the same day (on a Sunday on a holiday weekend :huh.


----------



## Vox Clamatis in Deserto (May 29, 2016)

SoCalDep said:


> I just picked up one of the $80 EB1's... Hoping to put a Malkoff front end on it for a one-mode shielded clicky, but if that doesn't work it's still too good a deal to pass up!





Vox Clamatis in Deserto said:


> I know that this Lego has been tried but I can't remember the result.



I just put a Malkoff MDC 3.7-5v head on an early (three digit serial number) EB1 shrouded clicky body and it works fine with an RCR123A, all three modes. :thumbsup: The early EB1 with the SF head doesn't do well with RCR's but a later unshrouded EB1 clicky does.

My biggest problem with the shrouded EB1 is that it does a very wobbly tail stand unlike, say, an E1B with a Z68 tailcap.
Anyway, some good bargains to be had with the EB1 model change to 300 lumens!


----------



## Sebastian2691 (May 30, 2016)

Hello!

A few days ago I received a EB1 Backup 300 lumens version from my local dealer in germany.
Just notice that the low mode used PWM and when the battery voltage drops under about 2.50 volts the light starts to flicker only on low mode.
After the battery reaches about 2.40 volts the flicker is gone and the low also don`t use PWM anymore until the battery is empty.

Anyone else have a EB1 300 lumens version and notice this flicker?


Greetings from Germany

Sebastian


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## MaxStatic (May 30, 2016)

Vox Clamatis in Deserto said:


> After taking a deep breath, I'm going to try to exercise some restraint... and see if the unshrouded 200 lumen EB1 drops to a similar level as the 300 lumen models go into the retail channel.



ummm...so I don't want to be an enabler or anythin but the silver unshrouded switch version is only a few bucks more....


----------



## RobertMM (May 30, 2016)

Sebastian2691 said:


> Hello!
> 
> A few days ago I received a EB1 Backup 300 lumens version from my local dealer in germany.
> Just notice that the low mode used PWM and when the battery voltage drops under about 2.50 volts the light starts to flicker only on low mode.
> ...




This behavior is really reinforcing my suspicion that the 300 lumen EB1 has the same guts as the E1DL I have. 

My E1DL acts the same way on a nearly depleted battery, IMHO it is not PWM but the driver sucking juice from the battery that is barely able to provide power, getting drained then recovering rapidly then getting drained again, and so on. 
Same mode switching, same Lux, same LED and same runtime specs for E1DL and 300 lumen EB1, so why in the world would SF use a different driver for them and drive up cost, right?


----------



## JPA261 (May 31, 2016)

Was very close to getting the $80 EB1, but resisted the temptation. Must hold off for the 300 lumen[emoji47]


----------



## RobertMM (May 31, 2016)

JPA261 said:


> Was very close to getting the $80 EB1, but resisted the temptation. Must hold off for the 300 lumen[emoji47]



You guys have such restraint/willpower! 

At that price I would have gotten two, one to keep stock and one to put a XPG2 on copper pad I have laying around.


----------



## JPA261 (May 31, 2016)

RobertMM said:


> You guys have such restraint/willpower!
> 
> At that price I would have gotten two, one to keep stock and one to put a XPG2 on copper pad I have laying around.



Oh believe me, it was tough. I too was going to buy 2, but had to give my card to my wife just to stop myself. Ha


----------



## Vox Clamatis in Deserto (May 31, 2016)

MaxStatic said:


> ummm...so I don't want to be an enabler or anythin but the silver unshrouded switch version is only a few bucks more....



I see a silver shrouded version for about $17 more but the silver unshrouded EB1 lists as $40 more when I call it up. Of course, this famous retailer is known to show different prices even on machines in the same household (online airline tickets are similar in my experience).



Heck said:


> I finally received it. The led and optics seems the same or is very similar to my E1D. I'm away from home so I don't have a RCR123 to try it with. I have no other lights with me to compare it with, but it seems pretty bright with a small hotspot geared more towards throw.
> 
> This EB1 has no serial number under the Surefire logo like previous EB1, other side says Backup, underneath it says US Pat 6547415, RE40125.
> 
> ...






RobertMM said:


> This behavior is really reinforcing my suspicion that the 300 lumen EB1 has the same guts as the E1DL I have.
> 
> My E1DL acts the same way on a nearly depleted battery, IMHO it is not PWM but the driver sucking juice from the battery that is barely able to provide power, getting drained then recovering rapidly then getting drained again, and so on.
> Same mode switching, same Lux, same LED and same runtime specs for E1DL and 300 lumen EB1, so why in the world would SF use a different driver for them and drive up cost, right?



So, did a few new 300 lumen EB1's get into the retail channel before something shut down production? Right now B&H has what is claimed to be a '5/300 Lumens Output' EB-1 for a very good price in the cart. It is listed as 'Special Order, Ship Time: 7-14 business days'. The product is listed as 'MFR # EB1C-B-BK'. I wonder if this is indeed the new light or just some online vaporware from an earlier product release announcement?


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## the0dore3524 (May 31, 2016)

Amazon is selling Surefire EB1s (200 lm) for $80 currently...that's a bargain price, considering they're normally around ~$130. I would hop on it now


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## MaxStatic (Jun 1, 2016)

Honestly, the 200lm EB1 seems brighter than my 300lm E1D. It's more tightly focused and the tint is more white vs the greenish of the E1D. 

For $79...these are a cracking deal right now.


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## Sean (Jun 1, 2016)

Has anyone tested this batch of EB1s from Amazon to see if they will run on a single (standard) 3.7v rechargeable? The older ones would not but the E1Ds will.


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## Vox Clamatis in Deserto (Jun 1, 2016)

Sean said:


> Has anyone tested this batch of EB1s from Amazon to see if they will run on a single (standard) 3.7v rechargeable? The older ones would not but the E1Ds will.



And the later 200 lumen unshrouded EB1 that I have runs fine on a 3.7 volt RCR123A as mentioned above, hopefully it is the same head as the Amazon 200 lumen EB1's on sale.

But I agree, it would be nice to make sure that the sale batch of EB1's weren't new old stock from an early run.


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## Jose Marin (Jun 3, 2016)

Vox Clamatis in Deserto said:


> And the later 200 lumen unshrouded EB1 that I have runs fine on a 3.7 volt RCR123A as mentioned above, hopefully it is the same head as the Amazon 200 lumen EB1's on sale.
> 
> But I agree, it would be nice to make sure that the sale batch of EB1's weren't new old stock from an early run.



Is there a way to tell besides just putting in a lion and crossing your fingers? I have one of those $80 amazon eb1 on the way and was wondering the same. Thanks


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## Vox Clamatis in Deserto (Jun 3, 2016)

Jose Marin said:


> Is there a way to tell besides just putting in a lion and crossing your fingers? I have one of those $80 amazon eb1 on the way and was wondering the same. Thanks



Good question. My early EB1 with the shroud has a brief flash and then goes to low mode with a freshly charged RCR123A. On this light, the serial number is on the body and there is no little QR code visible.

On my shroudless EB1 clicky the serial is on the head below a little square QR (or similar) code. This light works fine with the RCR123A.

I'd say check the $80 sale light to see if it has the QR code and serial on the head, it might indicate that it is the newer design that takes rechargeables.

And, even if it has the earlier electronics, it appears that no harm will be done by popping in an RCR123A and seeing what it does.

I don't think a lot of the original design EB1's were made. I speculated here previously that this early version was designed to incorporate a PC programmability feature advertised in the 2012 SF catalog that was never successfully implemented.


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## Jose Marin (Jun 3, 2016)

Thanks for the info! As soon as i get it ill let everyone know.


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## Jose Marin (Jun 5, 2016)

Happy to report it is running just fine on my aw 16340 and longer efest protected 16340 :twothumbs box reads eb1c-a-bk


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## Vox Clamatis in Deserto (Jun 5, 2016)

Jose Marin said:


> Happy to report it is running just fine on my aw 16340 and longer efest protected 16340 :twothumbs box reads eb1c-a-bk



Thanks Jose, great news. :thumbsup:

Does it have the serial number on the head with the little QR code?

My newer EB1 clicky really puts out a tight beam and is great for spotting wildlife in the distance.

I had some old AW 16340's but replaced them with some new Fenix and Olight cells and they handle the high setting much longer before shutting down.


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## JPA261 (Jun 5, 2016)

Vox Clamatis in Deserto said:


> Thanks Jose, great news. :thumbsup:
> 
> Does it have the serial number on the head with the little QR code?
> 
> My newer EB1 clicky really puts out a tight beam and is great for spotting wildlife in the distance.



Are you talking about the newer 300 lumen model?


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## Jose Marin (Jun 5, 2016)

Vox Clamatis in Deserto said:


> Thanks Jose, great news. :thumbsup:
> 
> Does it have the serial number on the head with the little QR code.



No serial number on head yes it has a qr code on body, you expose it when loosening the tail cap


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## Jose Marin (Jun 5, 2016)

JPA261 said:


> Are you talking about the newer 300 lumen model?



This is the 200 lumen $80 eb1 on amazon


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## Jose Marin (Jun 5, 2016)

Vox Clamatis in Deserto said:


> I had some old AW 16340's but replaced them with some new Fenix and Olight cells and they handle the high setting much longer before shutting down.



I did a runtime test today too on an aw 16340 and it ran 29 mins regulated then dropped off very fast


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## Vox Clamatis in Deserto (Jun 5, 2016)

Jose Marin said:


> No serial number on head yes it has a qr code on body, you expose it when loosening the tail cap



So, it appears to be the same body and tailcap as my early shrouded EB1 but with newer electronics in the head. I did a teardown on the light a couple of years ago and was amazed at the high parts count for a two mode flashlight. I forgot about the QR code hidden in the tailcap since the batteries come in from the other side.



Jose Marin said:


> I did a runtime test today too on an aw 16340 and it ran 29 mins regulated then dropped off very fast



I get about 45 minutes on my latest 200 lumen EB1 clicky in high mode with the newer Fenix and Olight cells. It seems that I can let the AW's sit for a couple of minutes and they will turn back on for a little longer in the EB1 while the Fenix and Olight cells will not revive unless recharged.

I'm wondering if the AW's shut down quickly for heat under the high load and maybe the other cells can take the heat and shut down for low voltage. Or, they might just have different types of protection circuits.


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## RobertMM (Jun 6, 2016)

45 minutes sounds good!!!

Time to hunt down some Fenix ARB-L16-700 cells. Were you using those, VoiceinWilderness?


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## KBobAries (Jun 6, 2016)

MaxStatic said:


> Gadzooks!!!! Amazon has 200lm E1B's w/tail cover for $80 right now...



Thanks for the heads up. I ordered one to have modded. First thing to go will be the clicky tailcap as I'd rather have one like the LX2 twisty.


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## msim (Jun 6, 2016)

Sigh... in for one.


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## Vox Clamatis in Deserto (Jun 6, 2016)

RobertMM said:


> 45 minutes sounds good!!!
> 
> Time to hunt down some Fenix ARB-L16-700 cells. Were you using those, VoiceinWilderness?



Yes, that is the Fenix battery that I used.

My AW's were getting old so perhaps they weren't still putting out full power. But, I got a very similar AW 16340 runtime number (less than 30 minutes) to the one that Jose posted above in the 200 lumen EB1.

The new Fenix battery seems to be a good match for this 200 lumen EB1 clicky, I got about the same runtime in high mode on this cell on PK's new PR1 light.



KBobAries said:


> Thanks for the heads up. I ordered one to have modded. First thing to go will be the clicky tailcap as I'd rather have one like the LX2 twisty.



If you want a stock light, there are still some EB1T's for sale on Amazon and other places. They are discounted but not as much as the shrouded clicky. Also, due to the threading and tailcap specs on the EB1, a lot of lego combinations with earlier SureFire parts don't work as expected in my limited experience.


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## KBobAries (Jun 6, 2016)

Vox Clamatis in Deserto said:


> ...If you want a stock light, there are still some EB1T's for sale on Amazon and other places. They are discounted but not as much as the shrouded clicky. Also, due to the threading and tailcap specs on the EB1, a lot of lego combinations with earlier SureFire parts don't work as expected in my limited experience.



Thanks for the heads up about possible lego issues. :thumbsup: I have a couple surefire tailcaps that aren't being used and was going to see what I could cobble together. In general, I like clickies but the 2 stage twisty of my LX2 is very handy. If things don't come together then I'll send the EB1 to Tana. It's a good price for a host light.

Dan


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## Vox Clamatis in Deserto (Jun 7, 2016)

B&H is now showing the 300 lumen EB1 clicky in stock and shipping with a discounted price in the cart.


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## RobertMM (Jun 8, 2016)

Vox Clamatis in Deserto said:


> B&H is now showing the 300 lumen EB1 clicky in stock and shipping with a discounted price in the cart.



Very nice! I'll be happy to pay 159 for that.


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## JPA261 (Jun 8, 2016)

RobertMM said:


> Very nice! I'll be happy to pay 159 for that.



Not a bad deal for the newer version. I may have to pick one up also.


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## msim (Jun 8, 2016)

To those who run a 16340 in theirs: What's cell voltage like once regulation/light drop off? Wondering if I can somewhat safely use a unprotected cell in mine when it arrives.


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## Sean (Jun 8, 2016)

Jose Marin said:


> This is the 200 lumen $80 eb1 on amazon



Was your order sold by a company called Woot & fulfilled by Amazon or was it sold & fulfilled by Amazon?


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## msim (Jun 8, 2016)

Sean said:


> Was your order sold by a company called Woot & fulfilled by Amazon or was it sold & fulfilled by Amazon?



Woot & Fulfilled by Amazon... which is really just Amazon because Woot is owned by Amazon. Edit: Source.


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## Jose Marin (Jun 8, 2016)

msim said:


> To those who run a 16340 in theirs: What's cell voltage like once regulation/light drop off? Wondering if I can somewhat safely use a unprotected cell in mine when it arrives.



Im pretty sure it was 2.5v when out put on high went down fast during my test. Was using aw unprotected


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## Jose Marin (Jun 8, 2016)

Sean said:


> Was your order sold by a company called Woot & fulfilled by Amazon or was it sold & fulfilled by Amazon?



Yes, shipped fast


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## JPA261 (Jun 11, 2016)

Anyone get the surefire eb1 from BH Photo yet?

Very tempting


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## RobertMM (Jun 11, 2016)

JPA261 said:


> Anyone get the surefire eb1 from BH Photo yet?
> 
> Very tempting



I'd have gotten it if I lived in CONUS, but I do not.


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## JPA261 (Jun 11, 2016)

RobertMM said:


> I'd have gotten it if I lived in CONUS, but I do not.



Well that's good. Easy on your wallet[emoji12]


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## RobertMM (Jun 12, 2016)

JPA261 said:


> Well that's good. Easy on your wallet[emoji12]



It IS hard on my wallet when they do arrive on stores here. 
I paid 80$ for my Titan-A and 270 for my E1DL. P1R close to 300$. 
I'm putting aside money for when the 300 lumen EB1 gets here.


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## JPA261 (Jun 22, 2016)

So, anyone order yet from BH Photo? Is it truly the 300 lumen version or people still getting the older 200 lumen model.

Only reason I ask is because this has happened once. Not through BH Photo but another company. Ordered an updated lumen surefire light on their website, and when it came in it was the older version.


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## SapperStyle (Jun 23, 2016)

I looked at one at Smokey Mountain Knife Works a few weeks ago. It did have a generic looking "300" sticker over the 200 lumens on the box. I compared it to my edc E1D and the hotspot size and tint appear similar.


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## JPA261 (Jun 23, 2016)

Hmm, I thought they changed the internals to have the switch time similar to the E1D. That wouldn't work if they just put a sticker on there. They did that for the 80 to 110 lumen E1B version but nothing changed except lumen output


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## SapperStyle (Jun 23, 2016)

I didnt think to check the switch time. I will check next time I am out that way. Take a pic or two.


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## JPA261 (Jun 24, 2016)

No worries... I just went ahead and purchased it. It's on special order so they said 7-14 days. We shall see if it truly is the 300 lumens which I assume it is since it's a special order


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## JPA261 (Jun 24, 2016)

Delete....Double post


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## RobertMM (Jun 26, 2016)

BH Photo shows it at $140. Damn.


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## JPA261 (Jun 27, 2016)

Sounds too good to be true but we will see if it's the 300 lumen. 

Yup, just bought one now have to wait for it. Ugh, going to be a long 7-14 days


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## PatriotUnknown (Jun 28, 2016)

A one cell light at 300 lm will take a nose dive quickly I bet


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## RobertMM (Jun 29, 2016)

PatriotUnknown said:


> A one cell light at 300 lm will take a nose dive quickly I bet



Same LED as the E1D Defender, maybe the same electronics as well so we can expect gradual taper to 70% by 45min and 50% by 1hour, then a steeper decline to 10% by 1.5hr.

Not a problem for defensive use where short bursts are used, as the light seems to put out full output once the battery recovers some voltage after use.
For tasks, the low mode throws surprisingly far and is quite useful.


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## JPA261 (Jul 6, 2016)

The runtime seems to look the same as the Elzetta Alpha when you look at Flashlightguide's review.


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## Vox Clamatis in Deserto (Jul 12, 2016)

JPA261 said:


> So, anyone order yet from BH Photo? Is it truly the 300 lumen version or people still getting the older 200 lumen model.
> 
> Only reason I ask is because this has happened once. Not through BH Photo but another company. Ordered an updated lumen surefire light on their website, and when it came in it was the older version.





JPA261 said:


> Yup, just bought one now have to wait for it. Ugh, going to be a long 7-14 days



Any news? I'm beginning to wonder if the B&H online listing is more SureFire vaporware. It seems odd to me that a few 300 lumen EB1's were sold on eBay and overseas and now they seem to be unavailable domestically.


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## JPA261 (Jul 12, 2016)

I got mine last week and really like it. Definitely like the new short timer between low and high. Used mine a lot and still haven't noticed any dimming on high. Def will rotate it out with my upgraded Alpha


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## Vox Clamatis in Deserto (Jul 12, 2016)

JPA261 said:


> I got mine last week and really like it. Definitely like the new short timer between low and high. Used mine a lot and still haven't noticed any dimming on high. Def will rotate it out with my upgraded Alpha



Thanks for the update! I've already got two EB1's and am trying to make excuses to myself why I shouldn't get the 300 lumen model at the good price from B&H.


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## tonkem (Jul 13, 2016)

JPA261, any discernible difference between the 300 lumen model and the 200 lumen EB1? I have a tactical 200 Lumen model, and am considering getting the clicky 300 lumen model, but want to keep the throw of the 200 lumen model. I know the 300 lumen model is not supposed to throw as well. Any comments or beamshots would be appreciated.


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## JPA261 (Jul 13, 2016)

tonkem said:


> JPA261, any discernible difference between the 300 lumen model and the 200 lumen EB1? I have a tactical 200 Lumen model, and am considering getting the clicky 300 lumen model, but want to keep the throw of the 200 lumen model. I know the 300 lumen model is not supposed to throw as well. Any comments or beamshots would be appreciated.




You can def tell the difference out of the box. When I turned on the 200 lumen it was def a tight hotspot, and thought WOW! This new one def didn't do that and could tell. Unfortunately, I do not have the 200 lumen version anymore but would be happy to take beam shots later tonight. 

Hope this helps.


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## RobertMM (Jul 15, 2016)

So BH Photo really has the 300 lumen? Nice.

EB1 300 and E1D at 9000cd are equal to LX2, so they are ni slouch when it comes to throw, with the advantage of a larger hotspot and brighter spill.
EB1 200 has more intensity but smaller hotspot. I managed to compare the EB1 200 and E1D at a store once.


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## N/Apower (Dec 15, 2016)

I am so confused. This is 2016. I've had an E1D (300 lumen tactical 1-cell Surefire clicky...all these number designations confuse me) for years by now, or would have, if I had not given it away to a very good friend (zero regrets) about 2.5 years ago. Are they really this hard to get right now for some reason?

That said, I really like the light, I am going to be running the weapon mount version on a new carbine of mine.


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## RobertMM (Dec 16, 2016)

N/Apower said:


> I am so confused. This is 2016. I've had an E1D (300 lumen tactical 1-cell Surefire clicky...all these number designations confuse me) for years by now, or would have, if I had not given it away to a very good friend (zero regrets) about 2.5 years ago. Are they really this hard to get right now for some reason?
> 
> That said, I really like the light, I am going to be running the weapon mount version on a new carbine of mine.



Outside the US, yes. 
It still is not available in my country.


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## DAN92 (Feb 8, 2017)

I don't see it for sale on Ebay, this light does not interest a lot of people.:shrug:


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## the0dore3524 (Feb 8, 2017)

DAN92 said:


> I don't see it for sale on Ebay, this light does not interest a lot of people.:shrug:



You can get them for ~$100 on eBay right now lol


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## Agile54 (Feb 8, 2017)

Slight lane veer but as a 10yr+ EB1 EDC fella, am I the only one here interested in the new E1B Maxvision?


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## DAN92 (Feb 8, 2017)

the0dore3524 said:


> You can get them for ~$100 on eBay right now lol


This is the 200 Lumens model and not 300 Lumens.


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## RobertMM (Feb 8, 2017)

Agile54 said:


> Slight lane veer but as a 10yr+ EB1 EDC fella, am I the only one here interested in the new E1B Maxvision?



There's a relatively new thread here about the EB1 Maxvision.


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## Agile54 (Feb 8, 2017)

RobertMM said:


> There's a relatively new thread here about the EB1 Maxvision.



Been following that one Robert since it's inception, just thought I would check the folks pulse here in this thread.


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## vadimax (Mar 21, 2018)

If anyone still cares: with a Li-Ion cell the light starts to blink at high when the voltage drops. With check the battery at home how much charge does it have.

P.S.: Sorry, that turned out to be Olight cell protection stepping in. The voltage was ~3.55V and the mentioned crappy protection finally disabled the battery.


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