# LiteFlux LF5XT Review: RUNTIMES, BEAMSHOTS, COMPARISONS, and more!



## selfbuilt (Jul 16, 2008)

_*Reviewer's Note: *This is a detailed comparison review of the new LiteFlux LF5XT, with beamshots, throw/output numbers, runtimes, etc. (warning: pic heavy!). The LF5XT was purchased from LED Cool - see his Dealer's thread in CPFM. _

*Part I: Build Overview*







The LF5XT is the latest in a series of 1AA lights produce by Taiwanese maker LiteFlux (earlier LF5 and original LF1 shown above). This latest version uses a Cree R2 emitter and a sophisticated circuit that allows you to exquisitely control all the lights features and settings. The LF5XT is really an evolution of the earlier twisty LF5 with significant improvements and MCU (microprocessor-controller unit) clicky interface. The closest overall UI comparable would be the 1xCR123A/RCR Novatac 120P (reviewed here), but with significant differences as I'll outline below.






The LiteFlux packaging is similar to older LF5 series, and comes in a nice wooden presentation box. Package contains a manual, wrist strap, spare o-rings, lube, split-ring, and what appears to be a plastic grip ring for the body. The wrist strap seems to be of fairly high quality, and is a nice addition.

Body design is longer than most 1xAA lights, due to the deep reflector and other design elements (scroll down for detailed pics). 

Weight: 53.9g
Length x Width: 110.6mm x 20.6mm










Fit and finish is outstanding on my sample - lettering is very clear and sharp, and natural gray type-III hard anodizing is flawless (also comes in black). For an amusing sidebar story of the anodizing quality, see post #2. My only minor quibble here is the stylized italic font looks a little cheesy, IMO. The knurling is extremely mild, even more so than most of the Chinese makers. 






The light uses the relatively hard-to-come-by Cree R2 emitter. These don't seem to be available in guaranteed tint bins at present, but Khoo (LED Cool) has offered to pre-select tints for those who are interested. My sample features the new "silver" backed version Cree that comes from the Asian Cree assembly plant. There is a small dark discoloration on my reflector near the emitter (bottom of the above pic), but it isn't noticeable in the beam. Reflector is deeper than most 1AA lights, and is textured to smooth out the Cree rings. 

Build of this light is somewhat unique. Since it uses a MCU in the head, a separate current path needs to be provided for the modes to work reliably. In the Novatac lights, this is done with a spring that runs around the battery. For the LF5XT, there is a brass sleeve that the battery sits inside, and connects the tailcap switch to the retaining ring in the head. See the detailed pics below:






















Although it may look similar to the NiteCore "Piston Drive", the LF5XT still uses an actual tailcap switch. But the switch is not your typical clicky - again, switching is actually controlled by the MCU in the head. The switch can actually be programmed by the user to function in a number of ways (e.g. momentary-on, or traditional "click" to remain on). Feel is similar to the Novatac series lights. A good way to describe it is like the on/off button press on your LCD monitor, as compared to the old switches on CRTs which are more like traditional clickies.

Note that the screw threads are anodized on both ends of the body tube, so tailcap lock-out is possible. :thumbsup:

*Features and User Interface*

This is where it gets a little complicated. 

The LF5XT is a fully customizable light that can be configured by the user in any of a number of ways. Some of the features include:

Wide input voltage (1.0V - 4.5V) and battery compatibility (i.e. alkaline, NiMH, NiCd, L91, 14500) 
Fully customizable set of output levels. Output is adjustable in programming mode only, through both a continuously-variable output ramp, and visually-linear step system.
Choice of 3- or 5- configurable set states that the user can program independently and access through button presses
Multiple strobe, SOS, and beacon modes of variable output the user can select (or avoid completely if they want)
Additional quick access modes
Momentary-on or standard click to lock on modes
Low NiMH/Li-ion voltage over-discharge protection and warning system
Ability to have it remember last mode used, or to proceed through the set states in sequence every time.
And the list goes on ...
It would take me too long to explain how to use everything here, so I suggest you visit LED Cool's Dealer thread for more background info. There is also a simplified manual available in this thread: LiteFlux LF5XT Manual - Simplified! 

One thing I should point out is that the interface should feel somewhat familiar to Novatac users (and to a lesser extent NiteCore D10/EX10) users, as all the lights use a series of "clicks" and "presses" to move through modes or activate features. *But there is one critical difference in how the LF5XT works: a "press" in this case mean a press-and-release, not a press-and-hold as it does on the Novatac/NiteCore terminology.* The difference between a click and press on the LF5XT is simply one of time - press and release with 0.4 secs and you have "clicked". Press and hold it for a bit longer before releasing, and you have "pressed". It's important you don't press-and-hold, or you won't be able to do much with your light.

As I mentioned, the UI is somewhat similar to the Novatacs, but with more features (and thus more complexity). Although the light is as easy to use in practice once programmed, I suspect you will find you need to refer to the manual frequently when you want to re-program any features. Unfortunately, the supplied manual has some language issues, so I suggest you check out that link above for a discussion of the simplified manual. Note also that the Novatac is capable of far lower low modes than the LF5XT.

This is also one of the main difference to the NiteCore and Novatac lines. On those lights, the variable output ramp can be accessed directly by a simple maneuver while using the light (although you will be setting a memory state by doing so). With the LF5XT, you have to go through the programming menus to access the ramp for a given set-able output.

I won't get into any further detail except to say I find the UI works well once you take the time to learn it (and keep the manual around for helping to figure out where you are!). If you don't like playing with these sorts of things, you might want to consider a simpler (and less customizable) light.

*Part II: Comparison Review*

To compare it to other members of its 1AA class, I've chosen (from left to right): the earlier LiteFlux LF5 (SSC), NiteCore D10 (Q5), Fenix L1D (Q5), JetBeam Jet-I MK IBS (Q5), and Jet-I PRO (R2).






*Comparison Beamshots*

All lights are on 100% on 2650mAh NiMH (Duracell), about 0.5 meters from a white wall. 




























As you can see, the beam profile is very distinctive on the LF5XT - you have a much narrower (but brighter) spillbeam than most lights, thanks to the deeper reflector. Cree rings are greatly reduced, and the hotspot is a little broader on mine than most lights. Tint is quite warm, which I personally like, but there are no guarantees (unless you asked Khoo to select one for your preference).

*Testing Method:* All my output numbers are relative for my home-made light box setup, a la Quickbeam's flashlightreviews.com method. You can directly compare all my relative output values from different reviews - i.e. an output value of "10" in one graph is the same as "10" in another. All runtimes are done under a cooling fan, except for the extended run Lo/Min modes which are done without cooling.

Throw values are the square-root of lux measurements taken at 1 meter from the lens, using a light meter.

*Throw/Output Summary Chart:*






On the surface, max overall output and throw of the LF5XT seems similar to the NiteCore NDI and D10. The LF5XT doesn't go as low as the new D10, though. Note that this is based on initial brightness though - scroll down to runtimes for a more thorough investigation. 

*Variable Output Ramping*






The LF5XT has two ways to adjust brightness through the settings menu - a continuously variable ramp similar to the original LF5 (orange trace above) and a step-by-step adjustment done "logarithmically" (that is to say, visually-linear) by repeated button presses (the dotted brown trace above). I've left the step-by-step trace as a dotted line, since it's not automatic and you have to advance manually at each step. Note that you can go up or down through either method easily.

As you'll see, the ramp is virtually identical to the LF5, only takes even longer to each its max or min (about 38 secs instead 20 secs). This is considerably longer than the other continuously-variable lights on the market. :shrug:

The step-by-step visually-linear method has about ~15 or so steps that I could see.

*Output/Runtime Comparison:*


















































*Output/Runtime Comments:*

First off, I would say that the output and overall output/runtime efficiency are roughly similar to the NiteCore NDI and D10. With the exception of the 14500 runtime on max (where the LF5XT does poorly), the NDI/D10 typically only has a small runtime advantage, at best. The output of the LF5XT on standard cells seems a little lower (closer to the Fenix L1D).
There is a peculiarity of the LF5XT circuit in regards to low voltage - see my discussion of the low-voltage shut-off issue below (note that the over-discharge protection is off in the above traces). :thinking:
Nice to see the efficiency problems of the original LF5 on alkalines have been fixed.

*Part III: Preliminary Discussion*

*General Observations*

The LF5XT is the most customizable and feature-rich 1AA in my collection at present. Although complicated to program, the user interface is quite easy to use in practice - once you have configured it to your satisfaction. Build quality and overall hand-feel are both excellent. I have to admit, I was a bit dubious of the original CAD drawings of the body design (I found it looked a little over-built ), but it's actually quite comfortable in the hand. 
There are few design quirks however, which I will discuss below. 

*Low-voltage Shut-off Issue*

I was originally a bit puzzled about the over-discharge protection feature seemingly being locked in the ON state in my light. Regardless of whether or not I set it ON or OFF in the functions menu, the NiMH cells all abruptly terminated at ~1V (i.e. about 20 on my relative output scale). 

*What I have come to realize is that I can only turn ON or OFF the low battery warning flash - the light will always shut-down when the cell reaches ~1V.*. To see what I mean, look at the two Sanyo Eneloop runs below with the feature turned ON and OFF:






As you can see, the traces are exactly the same, except for the low-voltage warning flash shortly before shut-down. Rather than drop into a long moon mode of reduced output until the cell is exhausted, _the light abruptly shuts-off at exactly the same point whether the over-discharge protection feature is engaged or not._

But then I noticed the same shut-down occurs on alkaline cells at the exact same relative output level (scroll back up to my alkaline runtimes to see what I mean). The over-discharge protection is not supposed to work on alkalines (Li-ion and NiMH only). 

What seems to be happening is the light shuts off once a certain minimum circuit input voltage is reached, regardless of the cell type inside. While this is actually a very useful feature for NiMH in my view (i.e. no more risk of potentially ruined cells from over-discharging), it isn't very helpful when using alkaline cells. If all you had was an alkaline cell, you would want to be able to run it until it was dry - there's no need to terminate early. :duh2:

_As it turns out, there is a work-around for this issue:_ after shut-down, let the depleted cell rest for a few secs/mins and the voltage will rise and you will be able to re-activate the light. Then switch to a lower output mode, and you should be able to run the light for a much longer period of time. I've just done this after one of the alkaline runs terminated, and the light ran continuously on its lowest mode with the "depleted" alkaline for _over 20 hours_ before shutting off again. oo: 

Whether or not this is a big deal depends on you - personally, I'd rather have the NiMH protection, even if it means a few other quirks. But it seems to me this issue should be resolvable for future editions.

*Output and runtime efficiency*

In terms of output/runtime efficiency, the LF5XT seems to be pretty well matched to the NiteCore NDI/D10s (except for max on 14500). Although maximum output on NiMH seems a little lower on my sample, and there were a few instances where the NiteCore runtimes pulled ahead, I don't know if this is significant. I have noticed a fair degree of variability among NiteCore lights, so I can't make any definite conclusions on a single LiteFlux sample. As with my Jet-I PRO (also an R2), there doesn't seem to be any clear increase in output/runtime efficiency with this particular emitter/circuit combo. But it is good to see the alkaline issues on the LF5 have been resolved in the new LF5XT. I just wish the LF5XT could go as low as the new NiteCore D10.

*Interface*

Although I have generally EDCed a NiteCore NDI, I have been strongly attracted to the multiple set-able states of my Novatac 120P and JetBeam IBS lights. This LiteFlux light reminds me a lot of the Novatac, although with greater programmability (and complexity). But once you've set the LF5XT the way you like, that shouldn't be an issue. It is certainly one of the most versatile lights I've come across.

*Potential Issues/Recommendations*

An addition to low voltage termination issue discussed above, I've noticed a few other minor issues. All PWM lights are prone to some degree of inductor whine in low modes, and this one is among the noisiest in my collection. Oddly, it is even quite noticeable on max, which is a bit uncommon. While not a big deal for me, you should be aware of it in case it's an issue for you. The PWM freq is high enough that I can't detect it by eye or instrument. :thumbsup:

A second issue is the sensitivity of the tailcap button. It's certainly a lot easier to activate than the new NiteCore piston drive, which is a point in the LF5XT's favour. However, when setting down in candle-mode, the force is usually enough to turn it off. My sample needs to be put down very gingerly to avoid this - I'd recommend LiteFlux build up the tailcap ring a little more to help prevent accidental contact.

Also, be advised that there is a 0.4 sec delay when you hit to the button before the light turns on or off. I presume the circuit is waiting to see if you are doing a press or click. Not a big deal for me (I got so used to it that I forgot the mention it in my review initially! :nana, but it is a sticking point for some.

An area for improvement would be the manual (with an advanced interface like this one, you need to make the instructions as clear as possible). At least the font size has increased from the original LF5 manual, so it's readable now. Fortunately, there is a thread simplifying the instruction available here.

The last potential point for me is the spillbeam width, which is quite narrow because of the deep reflector. Usually, deep reflectors are used to enhance throw - but throw is really not that much greater than the NiteCore NDI/D10 in this case. It is true that the infamous Cree rings are almost completely gone - as others have commented, this almost looks like a SSC beam pattern! Scroll down to my update below to see a discussion of why this hasn't actually been an issue for me in practice.

*Final (Preliminary) Word*

Aside from the points above, the light has worked flawless in my testing - no mysterious mode shifts, no missed clicks, no surprises. The anodized screw threads really help with smoothness when changing batteries (something I do a lot of when testing!), and this light leaves you with a very good feeling in regards to its long-term stability. Nice solid feel with high quality parts. 

*EDC UPDATE:*

After EDCing this light for almost a week now, I can report that I am actually really enjoying the beam. I was originally concerned about the narrow spillbeam, but haven't found it to be a major issue in practice. In fact, I was puzzled until last night as to why I didn't find it to be more of an issue (note that my major nocturnal activity these days is patrolling my house before going to bed to make sure everything is secured :huh. 

But I've just noticed that I've been holding the LF5XT higher up, closer to my face, compared to the more general in-front-of-my-body carry that I usually do. This obviously helps casts a wider beam - funny that I didn't realize I was doing this until last night. Score one for unconscious adaptation! :laughing:

In terms of beam quality, I really like the brighter spill relative to the hotspot. As much as I liked the JetBeam Jet-I MK IBS and my Novatac 120P, I kept going back to my NDI because it had a brighter relative spill (and less defined hotspot than the Jet-I). The LF5XT is even better than the NDI/D10 in this regard - due to the narrower spillbeam.

Not sure yet which I will settle on for long-term EDC, so I think I'll keep rotating back and forth between them (i.e. week on, week off, grasshopper - if you'll pardon the mixed metaphors ). The LF5XT doesn't go as low as the D10, so that's another factor to consider. I'll keep you posted ...


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## selfbuilt (Jul 16, 2008)

Due to the delay in getting sufficient inventory, Khoo (LED Cool) agreed to send me my light by EMS at no extra charge, to help expedite my review.

Unfortunately, it turns out EMS shipping from Malaysia to Canada is prohibitly expensive, but Khoo followed through on his promise anyway. The reason for the extra cost became apparent when the package arrvied - it was delivered by FedEx and not Canada Post!

Below is a pic of of what the light looked like when it arrived. Apparently, customs had un-done Khoo's careful packaging, and tossed everything loose into a larger FedEx bag.






This is what I found when I opened it up - everything scattered and banging around loosely inside the larger bag (inclduding all of Khoo's original packaging material). Nice to know you get such excellent mail delivery for the exhorbitant FedEx fees! 

Despite this, the light was in perfect shape without a strach. If that's not a testament to the anodizing quality, I don't know what is. 

FYI, Khoo will not be sending any more packages to North America by EMS. 

Cheers!


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## AFAustin (Jul 17, 2008)

Another great review, selfbuilt---thank you again for all your detailed and professional work. As a pretty strong fan of the EX10 and D10, I read the comparisons with interest. Although the LF5XT is obviously a fine light, particularly for those who enjoy the complex and versatile UI, I believe I'll stick with my EX10 and D10 for now.

Once again, your review told me what I need to know! :thumbsup:

Best wishes and thanks again.

Andrew


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## Kilovolt (Jul 17, 2008)

Another super review, many thanks for sharing. :twothumbs


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## 04orgZx6r (Jul 17, 2008)

Great review! Can't wait for mine to show up.


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## LED-holic (Jul 17, 2008)

Thanks very much for the review. The LF5XT is growing on me, but my EDC will still remain the D10. 

Even with momentary on, the .4 second delay in response to turn off the light, change to other modes, is still a bit annoying. Also, double clicking to move from one mode to the next mode is more work than I'd like.

I really like the Fenix L1D's single tap to move to the next mode. The double click here makes it more cumbersome to use.

Still, a great light for the collection.


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## TooManyGizmos (Jul 17, 2008)

:thumbsup: ... Selfbuilt ,



> The LF5XT is a fully customizable light that can be configured by the user in any of a number of ways. Some of the features include:
> Wide input voltage (1.0V - 4.5V) and battery compatibility (i.e. alkaline, NiMH, NiCd, L91, 14500)
> Fully customizable set of output levels, *with a continuously-variable output ramp*, and visually-linear step system
> Choice of 3- or 5- configurable set states that the user can program independently and access through button presses
> ...


The part I changed to *bold* ... confuses me .

Are you saying that I can program one of the 5 programable output operation modes , so that while in normal operation - (push the button - comes on) - then I can push/hold the button again and have the brightness RAMP up and down ? (during normal use - not in programing)

Thats the way the D10 works. Can I program my LF5XT to ramp up/down in normal operation ? I don't know a way to do that . Am I misreading your explanation , and not understanding ?

Could you clarify , please ?
.


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## gadgetnerd (Jul 17, 2008)

Thanks for a fantastic and thorough review as usual selfbuilt.


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## LED-holic (Jul 17, 2008)

TooManyGizmos said:


> :thumbsup: ... Selfbuilt ,
> 
> The part I changed to *bold* ... confuses me .
> 
> ...


The LF5XT does not work the same way as the NiteCore D10. The variable ramping refers to ramping during programming only.


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## TooManyGizmos (Jul 17, 2008)

.. That part of Selfbuilt's review led me to believe it was possible - and that I had just missed something in the programing possibilities.

So I'm just wondering if he could re-phrase that part ........ or if I'm the only one that reads it that way to think ramping is possible ?

I didn't think it was before - but he made me question myself.

I just wanted his opinion on it .
.


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## Tubor (Jul 17, 2008)

Great review thanks! Although I have been a long term Liteflux fan I think I'd need some "spare" funds for this one as it doesn't provide the low-low (and variable output) of the original LF5. Something a bit more like the original LF5 with the button, multiple memory modes and more varied output would have been ideal. I think I'm saying it needs to be MORE complicated, but that's just my opinion. Like it's got most of the way there but not quite. Can't wait for the LF5XTS.


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## selfbuilt (Jul 17, 2008)

Thanks for the positive comments everyone. FYI, just checked on my light (currently on in low-mode with a "depleted" alkaline that I restarted after Hi mode low-voltage shut-down occurred). Light is now at 15 hours and still going strong. 



LED-holic said:


> Even with momentary on, the .4 second delay in response to turn off the light, change to other modes, is still a bit annoying. Also, double clicking to move from one mode to the next mode is more work than I'd like.


Thanks for the reminder - meant to mention that 0.4sec delay. Just added it to the review text. 



TooManyGizmos said:


> So I'm just wondering if he could re-phrase that part ........ or if I'm the only one that reads it that way to think ramping is possible ?


Sorry for the confusion - just clarified the text. 



Tubor said:


> Although I have been a long term Liteflux fan I think I'd need some "spare" funds for this one as it doesn't provide the low-low (and variable output) of the original LF5.


It's true that it doesn't go as low as the original LF5, but it does provide a similar output ramp for the remaing levels - but you can only access it during programming modes. In addition to the clarification I made in response above, I've also added a paragraph to the review to point that out. It is different from the earlier light and from the Novatac/NiteCores.


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## LA OZ (Jul 17, 2008)

Your review is getting better. Thank you very much. I enjoy reading it. It is interesting that the Q5 is performing very well comparing it with the R2.


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## mchlwise (Jul 17, 2008)

*EXCELLENT* review, Selfbuilt (as usual). :thumbsup:

I have both the Nitecore D10 and the LF5XT and was interested in the comparison between these two. Your review confirmed my observations that brightness and throw are very close. 

The one thing that surprised and disappointed me about the LF5XT was the runtime (or lack thereof) on 14500. It's right at 1/2 that of the D10. oo:


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## StefanFS (Jul 17, 2008)

A very good review. It almost made me regret my decision to pass on this light. It's visually really appealing and seem to have exceptional bulid quality and finish, but it's UI doesn't suit me and runtimes are disappointing.


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## selfbuilt (Jul 17, 2008)

StefanFS said:


> It's visually really appealing and seem to have exceptional bulid quality and finish, but it's UI doesn't suit me and runtimes are disappointing.





mchlwise said:


> The one thing that surprised and disappointed me about the LF5XT was the runtime (or lack thereof) on 14500. It's right at 1/2 that of the D10. oo:


Runtimes are disappointing on max on 14500, but keep in mind it is a little brighter than my D10 over the course of the run. Surprisingly, runtimes are pretty comparable between the lights at the lower outputs.

I suspect one possible issue is the light's low-voltage cut-off is kicking in a little early (i.e. before my protected AW circuit trips). Note that I don't have any unprotected 14500 cells to compare with the over-discharge protection feature. I'll have to test one my AW protected 14500s in this and another light and quickly measure the voltage after shut-down. I'll keep you posted.

_*EDIT:* Scratch that - the 14500 is not terminating early. Took the 14500 out immediately after shut-down in the LF5XT, and voltage read ~3.15V and was climbing fast. Put into my D10 right away, and got only ~15secs max output before the battery protection circuit shut-down the light, with my DMM gave me no reading (climbed back up to ~3.0V within a few secs). So it looks like the LF5XT is draining the 14500 to the level of the built-in battery protection circuit._

FYI, the low-mode alkaline test (using a "depleted" cell that the light had shut-down already) just went off at ~20 hours of continuous use! Seems a lot of low-drain juice is still in the alkaline cell once the low-voltage threshold is hit.


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## selfbuilt (Jul 18, 2008)

Made a few minor updates to the main text, and am now beginning my EDC rotation with this light (configured to my personal liking ).

The quality of the beam is certainly gorgeous (I like the bright spill and smooth transition from the hotspot), but I'm not sure about the narrow overall spillbeam width. Time will tell ...


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## rotototo (Jul 18, 2008)

selfbuilt said:


> *Low-voltage Shut-off Issue*
> 
> I was originally a bit puzzled about the over-discharge protection feature seemingly being locked in the ON state in my light. Regardless of whether or not I set it ON or OFF in the functions menu, the NiMH cells all abruptly terminated at ~1V (i.e. about 20 on my relative output scale).
> 
> *What I have come to realize is that I can only turn ON or OFF the low battery warning flash - the light will always shut-down when the cell reaches ~1V.*.



A theory about this: the light uses a microprocessor, and the minimum voltage for it to run is 1V. I think that when the voltage drops below that, the designers at LiteFlux thought that although it would still work, it would become unpredictable and might even randomly rewrite the EEPROM etc. So they made the light turn off at 1V, and allowed the user as a compromise to use the light again by doing the "rest the cell for a while" trick.

It's not really battery protection, but microprocessor protection with a nice side benefit.

One way to confirm this is to pull the light apart and see what processor it uses. Anybody up for it?

Also, I've heard reports that the "battery" protection doesn't work for 14500s, as in it only cuts off at 1V, which by then the cell is damaged. Can you confirm this?


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## Burgess (Jul 19, 2008)

Wonderful review, as always. :thumbsup:


Great work, Selfbuilt ! ! !


:twothumbs:goodjob::thanks:
_


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## geek4christ (Jul 19, 2008)

Great review as always, selfbuilt.



selfbuilt said:


> ...but I'm not sure about the narrow overall spillbeam width. Time will tell ...



I'm anxious to hear your thoughts on that aspect of the light. I like the idea of a much brighter spill, even at the expense of spill width. In actual usage though, I'm not so sure. I'll be waiting for your report :thumbsup:


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## gadgetnerd (Jul 19, 2008)

rotototo said:


> A theory about this: the light uses a microprocessor, and the minimum voltage for it to run is 1V. I think that when the voltage drops below that, the designers at LiteFlux thought that although it would still work, it would become unpredictable and might even randomly rewrite the EEPROM etc. So they made the light turn off at 1V, and allowed the user as a compromise to use the light again by doing the "rest the cell for a while" trick.
> 
> It's not really battery protection, but microprocessor protection with a nice side benefit.
> 
> ...




Very interesting theory rotototo. I'd love to hear from Khoo or LiteFlux to confirm/deny. Recalling earlier threads in which the challenge of reliably running a MCU torch off 1.5V power source, I think that the microprocessor runs at much more than 1V, but below that the step up can't reliably supply the voltage it needs. But then again, I'm not a torch engineer!


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## jackcselab (Jul 21, 2008)

rotototo said:


> A theory about this: the light uses a microprocessor, and the minimum voltage for it to run is 1V. I think that when the voltage drops below that, the designers at LiteFlux thought that although it would still work, it would become unpredictable and might even randomly rewrite the EEPROM etc. So they made the light turn off at 1V, and allowed the user as a compromise to use the light again by doing the "rest the cell for a while" trick.
> 
> It's not really battery protection, but microprocessor protection with a nice side benefit.
> 
> One way to confirm this is to pull the light apart and see what processor it uses. Anybody up for it?


Liteflux's designer answered this question at my3c forum in Taiwan.
LF5XT's boost circuit design has something different from traditional design. It will shutdown at about 0.7V~0.8V.

PS:My english is very poor and I am not a engineer. So I can't explain here.



> Also, I've heard reports that the "battery" protection doesn't work for 14500s, as in it only cuts off at 1V, which by then the cell is damaged. Can you confirm this?


 
I have heard two cases including mine. It is happened only at 14500 100% setting. At other brightness setting, the battery protection work correctly.

I don't know it is special cases or general cases. I need more report to confirm it or not.


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## jackcselab (Jul 21, 2008)

rotototo said:


> A theory about this: the light uses a microprocessor, and the minimum voltage for it to run is 1V. I think that when the voltage drops below that, the designers at LiteFlux thought that although it would still work, it would become unpredictable and might even randomly rewrite the EEPROM etc. So they made the light turn off at 1V, and allowed the user as a compromise to use the light again by doing the "rest the cell for a while" trick.
> 
> It's not really battery protection, but microprocessor protection with a nice side benefit.
> 
> One way to confirm this is to pull the light apart and see what processor it uses. Anybody up for it?


Liteflux's designer answered this question at my3c forum in Taiwan.
LF5XT's boost circuit design has something different from traditional design. It will shutdown at about 0.7V~0.8V.

PS:My english is very poor and I am not a engineer. So I can't explain here.



> Also, I've heard reports that the "battery" protection doesn't work for 14500s, as in it only cuts off at 1V, which by then the cell is damaged. Can you confirm this?


 
I have heard two cases including mine. It is happened only at 14500 100% setting. At other brightness setting, the battery protection work correctly.

I don't know it is special cases or general cases. I need more report to confirm it or not.


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## gadgetnerd (Jul 21, 2008)

jackcselab said:


> Liteflux's designer answered this question at my3c forum in Taiwan.
> LF5XT's boost circuit design has something different from traditional design. It will shutdown at about 0.7V~0.8V.
> 
> PS:My english is very poor and I am not a engineer. So I can't explain here.
> ...



Thanks very much for that information. It's great having chinese speakers able to provide technical data from some of the other forums.


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## rotototo (Jul 21, 2008)

jackcselab said:


> Liteflux's designer answered this question at my3c forum in Taiwan.
> LF5XT's boost circuit design has something different from traditional design. It will shutdown at about 0.7V~0.8V.
> 
> PS:My english is very poor and I am not a engineer. So I can't explain here.
> ...



Could you provide a link to his post? I could translate.


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## jackcselab (Jul 21, 2008)

rotototo said:


> Could you provide a link to his post? I could translate.



this is the link:
http://my3c.com/D5/viewthread.php?tid=7898&extra=page=1&page=2

mountech is the designer of LiteFlux's product.


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## selfbuilt (Jul 22, 2008)

geek4christ said:


> I'm anxious to hear your thoughts on that aspect of the light. I like the idea of a much brighter spill, even at the expense of spill width. In actual usage though, I'm not so sure. I'll be waiting for your report :thumbsup:


Just added some EDC comments to the very end of the first post. I'm actually rather surprised that I hadn't found the narrower beam to be an issue in practice - until I realized the involuntary adaptation that I've been doing (i.e. holding the light higher up than I normally do, casting a wider spill).

It's funny how your unconscious plays tricks on you - despite my conscious attempt to gauge differences in the beams, I had quickly adapted to normalize out the differences! Goes to show you the hazards in trying to over-analyze some these subjective impressions ...


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## Fooboy (Jul 22, 2008)

seriously - you're reviews are stinking awesome.

keep it up!


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## TITAN1833 (Jul 22, 2008)

selfbuilt great review,can you "roughly" tell me where the low comes on the Novatac scale in lumens,thanks :twothumbs


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## selfbuilt (Jul 22, 2008)

TITAN1833 said:


> selfbuilt great review,can you "roughly" tell me where the low comes on the Novatac scale in lumens,thanks


Actually, I can tell you pretty exactly. According to my lightbox, my LF5XT min has almost identical output to my Novatac level #10, which is rated at 1.9 lumens.

My original NDI min was a good match to level #9, 1.3 lumens. 

And my D10 min is a good match to level #5, 0.33 lumens.



Fooboy said:


> seriously - you're reviews are stinking awesome


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## TITAN1833 (Jul 22, 2008)

Thanks selfbuilt 1.9 lumens,thats a low I can live with :twothumbs


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## selfbuilt (Aug 2, 2008)

Just an update, but Khoo has presented some possible solutions from Liteflux for dealing with the issue of the light turning itself off when placing down in candle mode. 

Personally, I can live with the issue in mine, but the options are there if you want them.

:wave:


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## Rob187 (Aug 21, 2008)

What settings did everyone go with on the LF5XT?

Importantly for my settings, I figured out that the percentage 'brightness' report the LF5XT gives you is a power figure not an output figure. Like all LEDS and as shown by selfbuilts graphs, the LED efficiency decreases as power is increased. After much experimentation with different settings and reviewing I have settled on the following:

Momentary: off
Memory on:
No. of Modes: 5
Mode 1: 42% (~50% brightness)
Mode 2: 18% (~25% brightness)
Mode 3: 6% (~11% brightness)
Mode 4: 1% (~ 3% brightness)
Mode 5: Single beacon flash/4s at 1% power
Overdischarge warning: off

Don't hold me too closely to my brightness estimated outputs - they are just my best estimates and are not scientifically measured...

The only drawback with these settings is that 100% power cannot be latched on - it can only be accessed with PH from on or off.

How is your LF5XT set up?


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## gadgetnerd (Aug 23, 2008)

Rob187 said:


> How is your LF5XT set up?



Similar to yours:

Momentary off
Memory off
Overdischarge protection on
Mode 1: 1%
Mode 2: 8%
Mode 3: 30%
Mode 4: 100%
Mode 5: locator beacon at 1%

So mine always comes on at lowest mode, which makes it useful around the house at night.


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## selfbuilt (Aug 23, 2008)

gadgetnerd said:


> gMomentary off
> Memory off
> Overdischarge protection on
> Mode 1: 1%
> ...


That's pretty much exactly how I run mine as well. I also like having it always come on at the lowest mode, then step up in brightness.


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## Rob187 (Aug 24, 2008)

It's interesting that we have each set our lights up in a quite similar way.

I know there are a few of these lights out there with other CPFers so let's hear what your setups are please.


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## BabyDoc (Aug 24, 2008)

This is how I run mine:

Mode 1: 1 percent
Mode 2: 15 percent
Mode 3: 33 percent
Mode 4: 50 percent
Mode 5: 75 percent
Memory: On
Momentary: On
Battery Protection:OFF

The reason I left momentary on is it gives me instant momentary on in any mode with a PH (there isn't a 0.4 sec delay). In addition, with momentary on, the brief flash before going constant with Cx1 is a visual guide to pressing the switch just long enough before release to get consistent constant turn on. ( As many have reported, on cold starup, if Cx1 is too brief, the light fails to go constant.) I leave memory on in order to preset light for any mode. In that way, when with PH, I can get an instant momentary on, in any mode, not just mode 1.

I set my highest mode setting at 75% , which is close to Max instead of Max, because I don't want to accidentally leave it constantly on Max and eat up my runtime. Yet if I really want max, I can do a PH and get Max on momentary.


Incidentally, I discovered that it is easier to program the light with memory off. In that way you are always starting with mode 1. Count modes from there, and you can easily tell which mode you are in that you may want to change. Once all 5 modes were programmed, I then turned memory back on. 

This may be obvious to everyone who has the LF5XT, but when doing a mode adjustment, Cx1, and Cx2, lets you change up and down in larger brightness increments than doing Cx1+PH or Cx2+PH which ramp the light up and down quite slowly. Once I set the level to my approximate desired level with Cx1 or Cx2, I then ramped up and down to fine tune it to exact desired settings. Using Cx5, repeatedly, lets you see exactly what your last adjustment did. Get it exactly where you want it, then 3xC+PH to save it.


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## baterija (Aug 24, 2008)

Rob187 said:


> It's interesting that we have each set our lights up in a quite similar way.



A slightly less similar way. 

Mode 1: 85 percent
Mode 2: 1 percent
Mode 3: 8 percent
Mode 4: 33 percent
Mode 5: default SOS
Memory: Off
Momentary: On
Battery Protection:OFF


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## Burgess (Sep 17, 2008)

Thank you to SelfBuilt for another fine review.

:thumbsup:
_


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## Mr. Blue (Sep 17, 2008)

great review!

no where are you guys getting 5 modes and eliminating SOS etc?


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## Dreamer (Sep 17, 2008)

Mine was setup as:

Mode 1: 1%
Mode 2: 40 %
Mode 3: 100 %
Mode 4: Fast strobe
Mode 5: fast 2hz blink. 
Memory: On
Momentary: On
Battery Protection: On

LF5XT is my fav light now..


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## pedrosa (Sep 19, 2008)

Hi all
I'm a bit of a noob here so please forgive the ignorance, but could anyone tell me if the memory retains what you programmed even after a battery change? 
Thanks


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## Norm (Sep 19, 2008)

pedrosa said:


> Hi all
> I'm a bit of a noob here so please forgive the ignorance, but could anyone tell me if the memory retains what you programmed even after a battery change?
> Thanks


Yes
Norm


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## zifnab69 (Sep 28, 2008)

Hello.
Somebody know how many lumens on high with primary, NIMH and LI IOn ?
(real or calculated)
Thank you


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## Rob187 (Sep 29, 2008)

I can't give you primary or NiMH but some calculations against other known outputs suggest that the LF5XT puts around 130 lumens OTF on Li ion.

For example, it is both measurably and perceptively brighter than my Novatac 120P (120 lumens), brighter than my Arc6 on primary 123A (100 lumens) & Ra Twisty 100 (100 lumens) but not as bright as Arc6 on RCR123A (around 150ish) or Gatlight Ti.

The R2 used in the LF5XT is about as good a bin as you can get commercially.

All this aside, lumens aren't the only thing to judge a light by.


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## zifnab69 (Oct 19, 2008)

is the LF5XT have FUI and CUI like the LF3XT ?
thank you


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## Cemoi (Dec 29, 2008)

Any idea why the "old" L1D has a much better runtime than all other models, although there is not much difference in brightness?


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## selfbuilt (Dec 29, 2008)

Cemoi said:


> Any idea why the "old" L1D has a much better runtime than all other models, although there is not much difference in brightness?


Well, Fenix has arguably the most efficient AA circuit in terms of output/runtime efficiency. This is thanks to its current-controlled interface and optimization for a limited range of specific pre-set outputs.

As to why my "old" L1D-Q5 does so well, this is likely due to simply a well-matched emitter for the Fenix circuit. AFAIK, Fenix doesn't use defined Vf bins, so there is bound to be some variability in runtime from one sample to another. 

Although the L1D-Q5 used in my testing may seem like a good peformer relative to other Q5 lights, it's runtime is less than the earlier P4-Q2 L1D lights I've tested (see my Fenix round-up reviews from my master list).


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## chadvone (Jan 27, 2009)

Great review. I have the Lf5xt and a D10.

Bye your throw numbers are you getting more throw out of the Lf5xt ?

My D10 out throws my LF5xt.

Is your tale switch Natural or silver finished ? 
Wondering if I have a R2 Or Q5. Can you tell by looking at them ?


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## selfbuilt (Jan 31, 2009)

chadvone said:


> Bye your throw numbers are you getting more throw out of the Lf5xt ? My D10 out throws my LF5xt. Is your tale switch Natural or silver finished ? Wondering if I have a R2 Or Q5. Can you tell by looking at them ?


My LF5XT is the R2 version (which I believe is no longer available - only Q5s from now on). You can't tell output bin by looking at the emitter, unfortunately.

As for throw, my LF5XT on NiMH is roughly equivalent to my D10-Q5 samples, but overall output is slightly less on the LF5XT on max. On 14500, my LF5XT out-throws my D10 - and overall output is also slightly more. Based on my one LiteFlux sample, this would suggest that the LF5XT reflector may be better focused for throw than the D10 (i.e. if matched for same overall output, my LF5XT will slightly out-throw the D10).


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## PlayboyJoeShmoe (Mar 23, 2009)

Hmmm.

The ability to program a low to high sequence with no memory is a lot like my P2D edc...

The ability to do it with 14500 makes it better than my P2D as an L1D....

MAY just have to order one of these if I can get the ok....

Thank you EVER SO MUCH for this review!!!


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## selfbuilt (Mar 23, 2009)

PlayboyJoeShmoe said:


> The ability to program a low to high sequence with no memory is a lot like my P2D edc...
> 
> The ability to do it with 14500 makes it better than my P2D as an L1D....


If you plan to use it on Li-ion, you might want to check out the LF3XT.

It has a number of nice upgrades to the LF5XT circuit, including a much lower low mode and the ability to switch between the fully-programmable LF5XT-like interface and a NiteCore D10/EX10-style interface.

A 2xAA battery tube is also expected soon for the LF3XT (not the LF5XT). Just food for thought ...


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## BabyDoc (Mar 24, 2009)

selfbuilt said:


> If you plan to use it on Li-ion, you might want to check out the LF3XT.
> 
> It has a number of nice upgrades to the LF5XT circuit, including a much lower low mode and the ability to switch between the fully-programmable LF5XT-like interface and a NiteCore D10/EX10-style interface.
> 
> A 2xAA battery tube is also expected soon for the LF3XT (not the LF5XT). Just food for thought ...


 

+1. The LF3XT circuit has other improvements. In addition to the ones that Selfbuilt mentioned, the most significant is the no delay when switching on the light, although there is still a 0.3 sec delay when switching levels or turning off the light. There is an additional instant command with the LF3XT that allows you to toggle momentary on or off.
With the LF5XT, you need to do this by entering a function menu, which involves a few more switch presses. When the 2xAA tube becomes available, there is supposed to be a clip with it, something that both lights currently lack. BTW, if you still want an R2 LF5XT, EliteLED.COM still has a few available in natural finish only.


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## PlayboyJoeShmoe (Mar 24, 2009)

Thanks for the info gents!

I gotta get another P2D before it ain't possible. Then I can see about an LF*XT.


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## JJohn (Mar 24, 2009)

Is the inductor whine still a problem with these lights? It is mentioned that they can be a bit noisy. Also, can you point me to where they can be purchased? Thanks!


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## sardian (Mar 24, 2009)

JJohn said:


> Is the inductor whine still a problem with these lights? It is mentioned that they can be a bit noisy. Also, can you point me to where they can be purchased? Thanks!


 
Check the marketplace here at CPF and eliteled.com sells them.

I'd like to know about the whine also. I'm ordering one after the 8th of next month and today is the first I have heard about the "whine".


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## DavesKam (Mar 25, 2009)

Sorry for I'm a new comer and don't know the technical terms about
Throw, Lightbox (max and Min), Ceiling Bounce etc. Is there any information I can learn about this?


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## selfbuilt (Mar 25, 2009)

DavesKam said:


> Sorry for I'm a new comer and don't know the technical terms about
> Throw, Lightbox (max and Min), Ceiling Bounce etc. Is there any information I can learn about this?


In addition to the Welcome Mat here at CPF, these flashlightreviews.com links will help explain the method I use:

http://www.flashlightreviews.com/features/lux.htm
http://www.flashlightreviews.com/features/lightbox_output.htm

The main difference is that I mount the sensor near the base of the long axis of the milk carton, and make the opening for the flashlight at the "bottom" of the carton (so I can lay the flashlight down for runtimes, which are done under a cooling fan).

Ceiling bounce refers to putting the lightmeter on the floor of a small windowless room (like a closet or bathroom), and measuring lux while point the flashlight at the ceiling. This is of course relative for the room in question, but allows you to roughly compare overall outputs.


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## JJohn (Mar 28, 2009)

I'll answer my own question here:

I got an R2 version of the LF5XT from EliteLED and in this sample of one, the whine is not an issue. It is just barely perceptible at some levels. It is significantly quieter than my HDS. 

Nice light once you get it setup the way you want it. I went with 8% - 22% - 35% - 50% - 1%, no memory. I use the 8% for checking on the kids at night so I put it first. Nice soft light when bounced from the ceiling at this level. The 22 through 50 are great for camping and dog walks at night with the Press to 100% to check out things if needed.

My copy has a nice neutral tint and very nice beam. I also really appreciate being able to loosen the tailcap a half turn so it doesn't turn on while in my pocket ( tailcap lockout?).

Thanks for the great review Selfbuilt, it helped me decide to go with this one.


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## stangri (Apr 11, 2009)

Thanks for a great review, but I'm just very curious, why the package destined to Canada has been opened by the US Customs (as it says on the tape)?


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## selfbuilt (Apr 11, 2009)

stangri said:


> Thanks for a great review, but I'm just very curious, why the package destined to Canada has been opened by the US Customs (as it says on the tape)?


Because it was shipped through FedEx.  I've noticed that all FedEx, UPS and DHL shipments from overseas go through their US distribution centres en route to Canada, where they can sometimes be opened by US customs.

It's relatively rare for Canada Customs to open a package.


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## xevious (Sep 30, 2009)

selfbuilt said:


> Not sure yet which I will settle on for long-term EDC, so I think I'll keep rotating back and forth between them (i.e. week on, week off, grasshopper - if you'll pardon the mixed metaphors ). The LF5XT doesn't go as low as the D10, so that's another factor to consider. I'll keep you posted ...


Still using the LF5XT as your long term EDC?


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## selfbuilt (Sep 30, 2009)

xevious said:


> Still using the LF5XT as your long term EDC?


Actually, I've settled on the LF3XT as EDC for the longest time now. Similar to the LF5XT, but with the extra compact user interface that I quite like for EDC use.

I found I was typically running my NiteCore D10 or LF5XT on 14500 anyway, so the switch to the LF3XT on RCR just seemed natural when it came out.


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## Burgess (Sep 30, 2009)

As much as i *love* my LF5XT,

which i have EDC'd for the past 15 months,

i'm eagerly awaiting a *new version*, with XP-G R5 emitter.

(and, of course, the updated software)


_


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## pobox1475 (Oct 6, 2009)

Has this light been made with a warm tint? I'm hooked on them now...


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## LED Cool (Oct 9, 2009)

nope.

only in R2 & Q5 LED.

the R2 version were sold out fast. only Q5 version is available.

khoo


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