# Surefire’s 2009 New Lights Discussion



## dcjs (Jan 14, 2009)

*New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

Just grabbed a SF tactical catalogue:

-aluminum CR123 "T1A Titan"

-seems like the Optimus is dead, no mention in the catalogue

-there's a P7 light that has the L6 body, a reflector head and a 2-stage tailcap called the M3L, loks like the L6 successor (350 lumens)

-M3TL has a TIR(!) turbo head (350)

-A2L and A2Z Aviator models with SSC P4 and extra leds for flood (120/10 and 120/25)

-V2L Vampire LED with two stage white or IR light (70/10 and 75mW/10mW)

-LX1 and LX2 to replace L1 and L2 (80/10 and 120/15)

No new models or protos were on display yet since they were just putting their booth together. Maybe I find time to stop by tomorrow and see what's actually in existence as prototypes.


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## Sgt. LED (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

I will have to try out:
M3TL 
A2L
V2L 

Thanks for the first report!

You have posted a thread that is going to get very large soon, I hope you can update it later for us junkies.


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## m16a (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

A2L, V2L, LX1, T1A, M3L all look pretty interesting. Wonder how they will be! Course we won't see these things til SHOT show 2011.. :nana:


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## Bruce B (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

When's the 2009 catalog going to be available for d/l on the Surefire site?


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## Arcteryx (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

About time they upgrade the Aviator. The previous model only had a max output of 60 torch lumens and was in no way close to having the ability to properly light up the tail on a large aircraft.


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## Bruce B (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

These new models sound exciting, hopefully they'll be released in 2009 :shakehead


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## FlashInThePan (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

I feel like this is the perfect place to insert a quote from Spaceballs ("they've gone plaid!"). They've gone LED!

Wow. 

The A2 - formerly a gorgeous combo of LED and incan - has gone totally LED. It actually sounds a lot like Don's LunaSol 27 now...

Even the M3 has a TIR head, which I assume means that the M3 is now an LED.

Surefire really looks like believes the incan's dead. Are the M4 and M6 still around?

- FITP


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## Shawn L (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

Don't forget about the UB3 INVICTUS 3 batteries max output 350 lumens.


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## DimmerD (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

Is the p601L that was supposed to come out last year in there?


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## Shawn L (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



DimmerD said:


> Is the p601L that was supposed to come out last year in there?



NO :shakehead


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## MSaxatilus (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



> -M3TL has a TIR(!)


 


Blach.

What the heck is the Vampire LED?!? Sounds interesting. Wish I was there with you guys. 

MSax


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## FLT MEDIC (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

Thanks for the update.


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## Bruce B (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



Shawn L said:


> Don't forget about the UB3 INVICTUS 3 batteries max output 350 lumens.



They haven't even released the UB2 with the 400 lumen max output, now there planning a UB3 with 350 lumen max output?


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## cree_buyer (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

dcjs thanks for the breaking news report!

can you post pics of the catalog? :bow: we will be forever grateful!


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## Shawn L (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



Bruce B said:


> They haven't even released the UB2 with the 400 lumen max output, now there planning a UB3 with 350 lumen max output?



The UB2 is not in my catalog. Only the UB3.


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## dcjs (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



MSaxatilus said:


> \
> What the heck is the Vampire LED?!?



Looks like a 2-die-led to me in the picture.

@cree-buyer: I'd like to respect SFs copyright on their catalogue. Also, as far as I know you're not allowed to take pics at the show with an exhibitor badge, you need a press badge.


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## 270winchester (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

M3TL sounds great at this point.


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## Sgt. LED (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



DimmerD said:


> Is the p601L that was supposed to come out last year in there?


 
HA!
They still can't make it work! :laughing:


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## FrogmanM (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

:huh:


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## Bruce B (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

Where's Al (*Size15's*) when we need him?


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## Sgt. LED (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

I tink it's time to start selling off lights and saving up money......

By the time they are released I can buy a few!


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## DM51 (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

Not sure I can get too excited yet - it's all just alphabet soup, so far. Let's have some _PICS!!!_


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## Federal LG (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

Damn! 
Where´s Optimus ?

This "Vampire" and the new LX1 looks good! Can´t wait for the pics and specs!

I hope they really release them in 2009... :shakehead


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## Kiessling (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

Where's my Invictus 2x123 version? They better not kill it ... 

Cool on the A2 and M3 though. 

Any word about a MiniBeast or the ARC lights?


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## 276 (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

I dont think they would just give up on the optimus it has to come out since the way they talked about it in there last catalog otherwise i pre-ordered it for nothing..


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## seale_navy (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

ohh wow.. interesting especially the replacement L1 and the Aviator series..

pictures please...


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## SureAddicted (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



FlashInThePan said:


> Surefire really looks like believes the incan's dead.




That's a bold statement, they wont die out anytime soon.
I really hope they still have some reflectored lights.


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## Sw1tch (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

I'm a huge fan of the original Aviator. Can't wait to see the LED version(s)!


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## flash_bang (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



SureAddicted said:


> That's a bold statement, they wont die out anytime soon.
> I really hope they still have some reflectored lights.


There's nothing holding LED's back except their color rendering, so I think if SF puts some good bins in there, Incan's will be pretty much done. I mean, figure that an LED has the same brightness with about 10-20x the runtime, there's just no contest.


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## WadeF (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

The new M3 sounds interesting:

-M3TL has a TIR(!) turbo head (350)

350 lumens? LED? TIR? Sounds like they'd be trying to put a TIR infront of a MC-E or P7 LED. Maybe they will be able to design a lens that gathers all that light and can throw a pretty tight beam. 

LX1 and LX2 to replace L1 and L2 (120/15 and 80/10)

So they are replacing the L1? I wonder if the body will be much different. The L1 Cree could easily do 120 lumens as is if they set their driver to deliver more current to the Cree. I guess the LX2 will be the new L1 (similar output and runtime) and the LX1 will be more like a E2DL in output, but L1 size. Can't wait to see pics.


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## Federal LG (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

*Pictures PLEASE!

And specs... 

*











I have the impression that this thread will be a loooooooong one!


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## Shawn L (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



Kiessling said:


> Where's my Invictus 2x123 version? They better not kill it ...
> 
> Cool on the A2 and M3 though.
> 
> Any word about a MiniBeast or the ARC lights?




They show the ARC-2 w/5000 lumens and its rechargeable


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## danpass (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



seale_navy said:


> ohh wow.. interesting especially the replacement L1 and the Aviator series..
> 
> pictures please...


 

+1.


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## mega_lumens (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

It's interesting that SF is focusing on TIR in their tactical lights. At 350 lumens is it necessary to have a TIR instead of a reflector in M3TL? I'm curious to know what soldiers in the field have to say about SF TIR lights in urban room clearing environments because we know TIR produces long range tight hotspots and semi balanced spill as apposed to reflectors.


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## Kiessling (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

But they have the reflector in addition to that: M3L, same luminous flux.

This is the same question as with the new L4 in another thread. We can only hope they don't foprget the beam diversity we all want 

But if they can get a tight beam out of that TIR with the P7, it will be a killer, a real killer.


ARC-2 ... rechargeable? :green:
Ack. 
But 5000lm sounds relatively bright.

bernie


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## DaFABRICATA (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

YES!! WE NEED PICS!!:twothumbs

I put in an order at SF today and asked for a catolog, they said none were available yet...:shakehead:sigh:

Hopefully they will actually release the lights shown and not get us all worked up for nothing.

*If anyone has an extra catalog, of either the "Consumer" or "Weaponlight" catalogs, I'd make it worth their while to send me one...hopefully one of each..:thumbsup: *


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## KDOG3 (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

Oh wow. I really want to see pics of that M3L - I was going to get an M3 and swap the light engine with a D36, but now I'm gonna wait till I see these! *If you go by their booth again, please ask them when we can expect to be able to purchase them....*


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## Kiessling (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



> *If you go by their booth again, please ask them when we can expect to be able to purchase them....*



 I am sure you do't wanna hear the answer. Because you already know it. :green:


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## bullfrog (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



mega_lumens said:


> I'm curious to know what soldiers in the field have to say about SF TIR lights in urban room clearing environments because we know TIR produces long range tight hotspots and semi balanced spill as apposed to reflectors.



I find that the TIRs produce MORE than enough flood indoors - the E2DL will light up an entire LARGE room easily. With all my TIR lights spill indoors has never been an issue.

I have been holding off on an M3 and M6... Maybe at this point I should just hold off altogether... That M3TL will be SICK!

I can't even fathom where we'll be in a year :devil:


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## SureAddicted (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



mega_lumens said:


> I'm curious to know what soldiers in the field have to say about SF TIR lights in urban room clearing environments because we know TIR produces long range tight hotspots and semi balanced spill as apposed to reflectors.



I was going to go into a detailed explanation, but that would be going OT.


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## KDOG3 (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



dcjs said:


> -LX1 and LX2 to replace L1 and L2 (120/15 and 80/10)




Do you know which model corresponds to which output levels? I'm assuming the LX1 is 80/10 and the LX2 is the 120/15. Just want to be sure. I just hope the LX2 is relatively small like the previous Gen L1 size. That would rock... And I really hope they put the an E1B style clip on the L1!!!


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## carrot (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

Wow, that's quite a big change in lineup. Almost a good excuse for why very little new things have come out of Surefire for 2008... they were too busy planning for 2009.

Real surprises to me are M3TL and A2L/A2Z. I have put my flashlight budget on a spending freeze for now but I am VERY interested to hear about these as the two are amongst my favorite Surefires. 

I am always surprised again and again to be told that 50 lumens is not enough but every time I take out my A2 I think it is plenty. Many people would be surprised how powerful these "old, obsolete" lights are.

Can you give us a little more detail about all of these? How do they differ from the older, existing models, etc.


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## StandardBattery (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



bullfrog said:


> ...
> I can't even fathom where we'll be in a year :devil:


Maybe looking at the 2010 catalog and saying the hey "The Inviticus and Optimus are Back!"? :devil:


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## Size15's (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



Bruce B said:


> Where's Al (*Size15's*) when we need him?


You're on your own guys - I've got other priorities at the moment :naughty:

Anyway, aren't you lot done with thrashing vaporware to death?
Why not wait until Dealers have new products in stock and available for purchase and basing discussion on the actual product?

Al :candle:


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## Kiessling (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

Come on Al ... it is 2am ... time to leave the computer. Don't disturb us discussing vapor and castles made of air


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## Size15's (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

Well it is late and I've plenty to do tomorrow


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## Bruce B (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



Size15's said:


> Well it is late and I've plenty to do tomorrow



Come on Al... not even a slight hint of what's coming from SF in 2009.


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## Size15's (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

The SHOT Show gives an indication of some of the things they've been working on and could take further. Whether they'll get around to releasing anything they show is another matter. Perhaps this year SureFire will surprise us with more timely releases. Of course there are three Friday 13th's this year so who knows...

Al


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## Federal LG (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



Size15's said:


> Why not wait until Dealers have new products in stock and available for purchase and basing discussion on the actual product?
> 
> Al :candle:



Teach me the "Art of Patience", Al... 

C´mon, don´t you know something "concrete" about all these new models? Give us some pills of SF secret knowledge!


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## Fooboy (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

tag for later


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## carrot (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

Guys... I think I'll wake up sometime in 2010 and buy myself the SHOT2009 lights. 

No offense Size15's but Surefire really is slow in getting products out the door. Well, better late and polished than early and buggy.


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## dcjs (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



KDOG3 said:


> Do you know which model corresponds to which output levels? I'm assuming the LX1 is 80/10 and the LX2 is the 120/15. Just want to be sure.




Yeah, I mixed that up, the LX2 is of course the higher output two cell model. :shakehead

Both are noticeably shorter than the previous generation, 5.4" for the LX2 and 4.1" for the LX1, which is seriously compact. Oh, and they both have a clip like the E1B (longer on the LX2), as does the A2L. The V2L has a Kroma/U2-style clip.

A lot of the new models (LX1, LX2, A2L, AZ2) have those milled flutes you've seen on the Invictus and optimus heads instead of knurling. 
The M3L is pictured with the P7, don't know about the M3LT. The TIR-Turbohead looks like a ******* of a KT4 and an M3 head (long and 2.5" dia.).

There are two LED headlamps, one of which can take _either_ 3xCR123 _or_ 2xAA _alkalines_. 

Various C- and M-series incans are still listed, but there seems to be an LED alternative for every one of the incans now (except for the HIDs of course).


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## Sgt. LED (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

:twothumbs 

Everything sounds really good! E1B clips abound?! YES That'll be sweet on the new A2.
I can't pass up something with the U2 clip especially with the name Vampire! 
2 Headlamps and the earth shattering news of SF's first AA capable light! 
A banner year to be sure!


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## Ty_Bower (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



flash_bang said:


> There's nothing holding LED's back except their color rendering



edited to remove inflammatory comment... sorry...

LED's have been always been reputed to have worse color rendering than incandescents. The point will be argued, but the incadenscent believers will hold firm. Although I don't even own an A2 Aviator, I admire it for the hybrid combination of long running LED and regulated incandescent.

I'll be sad if these new, fully LED powered Aviators kill off the original.


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## jzmtl (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



dcjs said:


> Yeah, I mixed that up, the LX2 is of course the higher output two cell model. :shakehead
> 
> Both are noticeably shorter than the previous generation, 5.4" for the LX2 and 4.1" for the LX1, which is seriously compact. Oh, and they both have a clip like the E1B (longer on the LX2), as does the A2L. The V2L has a Kroma/U2-style clip.



It's not that much smaller eh? Current cree L1 is 4.5" long, and if you manage to get an early gen head on cree body it's even smaller. And 5.4" is about the same as other lights like fenix tk, and eagletac t10c2 etc.

Hmm, I wonder if I should sell my L1 now before it's obsolete.


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## dcjs (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

Oh, totally forgot about the most important new product, the _*Surefire Pen II*_ which has a clickie instead of a twistie like the first model.


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## Hitthespot (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

I was just going to pull the trigger on a new L1 since I don't have one. I am definitely going to wait. Did I say wait, wait a minute I said that last year.......:mecry:


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## Sgt. LED (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

Is the new pen any cheaper?!


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## danpass (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

that's very strange .................. I don't see any pictures in that post


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## Bruce B (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

Okay, now I want to see their 2009 catalog... These new models sound awesome!


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## SureAddicted (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



Federal LG said:


> I have the impression that this thread will be a loooooooong one!




You could make some serious dollars..... as a clairvoyant.




Sgt. LED said:


> :twothumbs
> 
> Everything sounds really good! E1B clips abound?! YES That'll be sweet on the new A2.
> I can't pass up something with the U2 clip especially with the name Vampire!
> ...



It looks like it's going to be a great year for SF if they release all this gear.....sometime this year. Hold off on that PP.


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## kongfuchicken (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



dcjs said:


> -seems like the Optimus is dead, no mention in the catalogue



What a bummer!

Ah well, more for the maxabeam fund then...


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## greenLED (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

Could I bribe someone into grabbing a couple of catalogs (general and weapons) and mailing them my way, please?


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## Sgt. LED (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

SAME HERE! :huh: OK I'll settle for pictures of the catalog posted in this thread.


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## Hitthespot (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

I got a last years I'll sell ya. lol


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## Sgt. LED (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

OK but first let me hold a dollar.


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## dano (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



bullfrog said:


> I can't even fathom where we'll be in a year :devil:




Waiting for all these to be released?

Seriously, product announcement without delivery is getting too tiresome to even think about any type of pre-order for any new SF product. And, since I'm not a huge LED fan, nothing seems too exciting. Unfortunately, incan. light development doesn't have anywhere to go; i believe it has hit its peak.


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## js (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



Ty_Bower said:


> ...and there's nothing holding dog turds back, except for the smell and the texture. I hear they're going to fix that anytime now.



Ty_Bower,

This comment is *ahem* -- mildly inflammatory, don't you think?

Let's not go down this road, please.


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## Federal LG (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

Anxiously waiting for a noble soul that will gonna post some pics... or scan the catalogue.


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## dmz (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

Do any of these new lights have a 2 stage clicky or are all of them twisty switches?


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## carrot (Jan 14, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



dmz said:


> Do any of these new lights have a 2 stage clicky or are all of them twisty switches?


How would a 2-stage clicky work?


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## Ryanrpm (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



carrot said:


> How would a 2-stage clicky work?



Well, the RQ(Spear clone) has a 2 stage reverse clicky. You click it to turn it on high. Then make a half press so the light goes out-then release it and it goes to low mode. Do it again it goes back to high.

So that's one way.....


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## nosuchagency (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

a quick note; Dr. Lunde's site states he'll be updating it with show images before, during, and after. i can't imagine him disappointing. :twothumbs


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## Sgt. LED (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

Link please?


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## nosuchagency (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

my bad: lundestudio.com/2009SHOTShow


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## Sgt. LED (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

 :thumbsup:


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## milox (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

Thanks for the updates.


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## flash_bang (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



Ty_Bower said:


> ...and there's nothing holding dog turds back, except for the smell and the texture. I hear they're going to fix that anytime now.


I heard the same thing about people who run their mouths, but that's something that can be fixed, contrary to popular belief.

If you want to stick with your incans, fine by me, but if you would take care in not insulting and entire industry, I'm sure we'd all appreciate.

have a nice day.


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## dmz (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

Are any of these lights come with clickies?


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## carrot (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



Ryanrpm said:


> Well, the RQ(Spear clone) has a 2 stage reverse clicky. You click it to turn it on high. Then make a half press so the light goes out-then release it and it goes to low mode. Do it again it goes back to high.
> 
> So that's one way.....


No thanks. I like my Surefires because they are dumb simple to use I could hand them to my cat and he'd figure it out... not to say that my cat is dumb.


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## 276 (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

I thought the E1B had a two stage clicky.


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## carrot (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



276 said:


> I thought the E1B had a two stage clicky.


And I don't own one. Let's keep this thread on track please? I'd like to hear more about these new ones.


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## 276 (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

I am sorry about that. 
Edit i really meant i was sorry.


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## flash_bang (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



276 said:


> OK.. I am sorry about that.


I'd suggest adding something useful in your comment in your apology.

As an example, and as an inquiry, I'd like to know if the Vampire light has two led's in one housing/reflector assembly, or if it has the option of White LED or UV ones. If the Vampire works out, would that be a new gen of Aviators?

Cheers


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## jimhoff (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



bullfrog said:


> That M3TL will be SICK!
> 
> I can't even fathom where we'll be in a year :devil:




We'll be waiting for the Optimus.

How big is the Optimus?


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## Henk_Lu (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

I loved the Invictus right of the 2008 catalogue. If it gets now one more cell and looses 50 lumens, my love for it will probably die...

Surefire disappointed me presenting lights in a catalogue that never came out. A serious company shouldn't build air-castles.

Though I'll give them a chance : Bring some new lights out and we'll see! Until the lights lie or hang in the store, discussions are of the same air as the products! :candle:


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## gsxrac (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

Hmmm... M3L and Vampire eh? Thank god for tax returns!
Edit: About how big is the Vampire?


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## Monocrom (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

A2L sounds sweet!

I'm trying not to get my hopes up though. Made that mistake in '08 when the UB2 was announced.


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## iapyx (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

Is that all there is?

My first reaction was one of utter disappointment.

My 2nd reaction was: now I'll stick to my good old U2. (no need to buy another light)

And my 3rd reaction is: Let's hear what the SF-guys will have to say today and tomorrow. 

I have to say that I focussed on the UA2 and/or UB2. The UA2 seems to be dead and the UB2 will be a UB3. Let's see what else they have in the bag that I never focussed at.


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## carrot (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



iapyx said:


> I have to say that I focussed on the UA2 and/or UB2. The UA2 seems to be dead and the UB2 will be a UB3. Let's see what else they have in the bag that I never focussed at.



Maybe they were tired of us harping on them for the UA2 and UB2 not being out. So maybe they took it out of the catalog to mess with us, and they'll release them sometime this year.


----------



## iapyx (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



carrot said:


> Maybe they were tired of us harping on them for the UA2 and UB2 not being out. So maybe they took it out of the catalog to mess with us, and they'll release them sometime this year.


 
hehehe, yea, that would be a nice surprise.
I was looking for excuses why the UA2 and UB2 are left out of this years (tactical) catalogue: They were already in the 2008 catalogue and will be released soon...

Guess it's just wishful thinking....


----------



## NoFair (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



Kiessling said:


> Where's my Invictus 2x123 version? They better not kill it ...
> 
> Cool on the A2 and M3 though.
> 
> Any word about a MiniBeast or the ARC lights?


 
+1 on the Invictus. 

The others look nice though, but I don't NEED them  

Sverre


----------



## seale_navy (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

im suprise to see there is no pics yet but the light are talk about here. We are not supposed to take pic at the SHOT show itself, but coming home and taking pics of the catalog is permitted under copyright law.

There are numerous case law supporting this which im too lazy to elaborate on.. so feel free to post up pics frm the catalog


----------



## Tempest UK (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

I too would handsomely reward any kind soul willing to send me a 2009 SureFire catalog or two :candle:

Regards,
Tempest


----------



## Federal LG (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

*Just a curiosity:* Is there a possibility to someone that had access to the SF 2009 Catalog scan it and post some pages here ?

Or is there some kind of prohibition to do that ? Copyright laws, maybe ?


----------



## danpass (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

...


----------



## iapyx (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



danpass said:


> ...


 
Maybe the OP works?

edit: hm, just as I was quoting you were editing your post in which you asked why the OP had still not scanned the catalogue for us.


----------



## ozner1991 (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

wow sounds interesting


----------



## danpass (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



iapyx said:


> Maybe the OP works?
> 
> edit: hm, just as I was quoting you were editing your post in which you asked why the OP had still not scanned the catalogue for us.



yeah lol. I did a username search to confirm some things


----------



## kelmo (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

A smaller version of the venerable L2 with improved performance sounds pretty good to me! I am still very satisfied with my "old school" L2 so maybe its time to get a LX1? Light performance and my taste in lights are at equillibrium. Higher performance is nice but at what cost?

I have plenty of pretty cool LED lights, but you know what is in my backpack? A 6P!

Do they still list all the incan models?


----------



## RobertM (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

I so hope that someone can post pics/scans of the catalog! 

Can someone please tell me if the current regulated incan/LED A2 Aviator is still in the catalog in addition to the new LED Aviators? I'm going to very sad if they are discontinuing my absolute favorite SF. If so, I might have to stock up now :mecry:

Robert


----------



## seale_navy (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

there is no infringement of copyright for scanning the surefire catalog or taking a picture of the catalog. so feel free to scan it or something...

i studied intellectual property law by the way..


----------



## bullterrier (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

-M3TL has a TIR(!) turbo head (350) sounds intresting 
But are we talking +300$ ore more:sigh:


----------



## Sgt. LED (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

I'm sure. :sigh:


----------



## matt0 (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



jzmtl said:


> Hmm, I wonder if I should sell my L1 now before it's obsolete.



Just because there's a newer model out doesn't mean the older model will become obsolete..


----------



## Shawn L (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



RobertM said:


> I so hope that someone can post pics/scans of the catalog!
> 
> Can someone please tell me if the current regulated incan/LED A2 Aviator is still in the catalog in addition to the new LED Aviators? I'm going to very sad if they are discontinuing my absolute favorite SF. If so, I might have to stock up now :mecry:
> 
> Robert



Only the A2L is in the catalog, but the A2 is still in the Technical Specifications area in the back.


----------



## RobertM (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



Shawn L said:


> Only the A2L is in the catalog, but the A2 is still in the Technical Specifications area in the back.



:sweat: Thanks for posting that it is still listed in the back. Now I can quit worrying and try to go about my day :laughing:

Robert


----------



## deranged_coder (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



Shawn L said:


> Only the A2L is in the catalog, but the A2 is still in the Technical Specifications area in the back.



Are the UA2 Optimus and UB2 Invictus still listed in the Tech Specs in the back? Or is there absolutely no mention of them anymore?


----------



## iapyx (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

Can I pre-order a UA2 or UB2 please?

Darn. Just thinking of those who have a UA2 / UB2 on pre-order (and pre-payed) for almost a year now.


----------



## MSaxatilus (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



> -A2L and A2Z Aviator models with SSC P4 and extra leds for flood (120/10 and 120/25)


 
I was never a big fan of the original A2, because I'm not a big fan of mixing incans. with LEDs. I think the difference between the color temperature is so dramatic its quite distracting/annoying. However, a A2L or A2Z could make me very interested in that model for the first time.:thumbsup:

MSax


----------



## Lightcrazycanuck (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*


----------



## nzbazza (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



dcjs said:


> There are two LED headlamps, one of which can take _either_ 3xCR123 _or_ 2xAA _alkalines_.



There has been plenty of information/threads on the Saint Headlamp (the 2CR123/2AA headlamp, IMO the 2AA option is there as a backup, not meant as the primary power source) look in the headlamps section of CPF, but there has been NOTHING about the second headlamp mentioned apart from a possible range of Surefire headlamps and the Saint being the mid-range model.

Please give us details of the other headlamp!!!!


----------



## edc3 (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

What is the difference between the A2L and A2Z, besides the difference in the low level output? Combat grip?


----------



## TMedina (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

A publicity photo of the Surefire Vampire.

-Trevor


----------



## Lightcrazycanuck (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



TMedina said:


> A publicity photo of the Surefire Vampire.
> 
> -Trevor


 

:twothumbs:twothumbs


----------



## RobertM (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



TMedina said:


> A publicity photo of the Surefire Vampire.
> 
> -Trevor



Thank you! :twothumbs
Let the pictures start trickling in


----------



## Shawn L (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



deranged_coder said:


> Are the UA2 Optimus and UB2 Invictus still listed in the Tech Specs in the back? Or is there absolutely no mention of them anymore?



No mention of the UA2 or the UB2 at all. Only the UB3.


----------



## shomie911 (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

Greaaatttt.

More money I HAVE to spend. 

Atleast they won't be released for a good long while. 

More pics!!

Oh, and the vampire looks pretty cool.


----------



## Az_Tibor (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



TMedina said:


> A publicity photo of the Surefire Vampire.
> 
> -Trevor


Yep, that's the same head as on the M952V white/IR weaponlight... as I posted about here with technical spec's as well.


----------



## kudu (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

I want to hear more about the A2L Aviator. I have always liked this light, but it has become a little too long in the tooth for my liking. Only 60 lumens, and not very efficient. An absolutely fantastic light in it's day though! It just needs a little updating and I will be looking to buy.:twothumbs


----------



## Sgt. LED (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

The Vampire looks to have an A2 tailcap? So it's what 2 level white and after a ring twist a 2 level IR?


----------



## dcjs (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



Sgt. LED said:


> The Vampire looks to have an A2 tailcap? So it's what 2 level white and after a ring twist a 2 level IR?



That's what the catalogue states, I think I posted the output values in the initial post.

I saw the LX2, AZ2 and M3L at the booth today, no Invictus to be seen.
The M3L is using a combination of a smooth reflector and a diffusion film on the inside of the lens to produce a fairly tightly focused, but not really pretty (I'm a picky ******* though) beam. No donut to be seen. 
LX2 had some serious throw, more than the AZ2 which was not even as bright as my PD-s. Remember though that these are protos and the production versions may differ.

Picked up a few sets of catalogues but no post office at the hotel and no time till I get home next tuesday.:shakehead


----------



## Federal LG (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

David

Any new model powered by just a single CR123 ?

1x CR123 ?


----------



## DaFABRICATA (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

*SOMEONE POST SOME PICS ALREADY!!!*

*A LINK...SOMETHING!!:hairpull:*


----------



## Federal LG (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*














Yeah... the wait is killing me too!


----------



## e2x2e (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

A2L sounds awesome...(I'm assuming that means A2 LED?)


----------



## Sw1tch (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



e2x2e said:


> A2L sounds awesome...(I'm assuming that means A2 LED?)



I'd assume that would be the LED version, going by Surefire's naming scheme. (G2 and G2L, etc). A2L is definitely at the top of my to-see list. I need some pics and detailed specs of this thing!


----------



## brighterisbetter (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



dcjs said:


> There are two LED headlamps, one of which can take _either_ 3xCR123 *or 2xAA alkalines. *


NOOOOO!!!!! PLEASE say it isn't so. Oh well, at least there's no mention of an alkaline handheld, IMO that would be disastrous.

I'm honestly a bit surprised that the L4 isn't receiving an update, or is the LX2 intended to phase it out? :thinking:


----------



## danpass (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



kudu said:


> I want to hear more about the A2L Aviator. I have always liked this light, but it has become a little too long in the tooth for my liking. Only 60 lumens, and not very efficient. An absolutely fantastic light in it's day though! It just needs a little updating and I will be looking to buy.:twothumbs


 
Well I'm no flashlight designer but making it a LED main with LED minis (if that is indeed the case) seems very odd considering the two stage LEDs (and the Kroma) that SF already has out. I'm looking forward to hearing more about it as well.


:shrug: :thinking:




Perhaps the OP can reveal the specs for the A2L that are 











_*IN THE CATALOG IN HIS HANDS*_





.


----------



## Kiessling (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

It is about the second beam shape, not the luminous flux. Low flood and high throw. Like the A2 or McGizmo's LunaSol.


----------



## Size15's (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



brighterisbetter said:


> NOOOOO!!!!! PLEASE say it isn't so. Oh well, at least there's no mention of an alkaline handheld, IMO that would be disastrous.
> 
> I'm honestly a bit surprised that the L4 isn't receiving an update, or is the LX2 intended to phase it out? :thinking:


We have a long thread on the Saint for ages and ages - primary power source intended to be three-SF123A batteries. Backup power source two-AA batteries.

No mention of an AA-powered handheld? :thinking:


The L4 has received an update. We have a thread on that as well.
Whether the LX2 or whatever is destined to replace the L4 (L4A) if SureFire release it is another matter.


----------



## brighterisbetter (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



Size15's said:


> The L4 has received an update. We have a thread on that as well.
> Whether the LX2 or whatever is destined to replace the L4 (L4A) if SureFire release it is another matter.


True, I had forgotten about that when making my post, thanks for the reminder. 

What I said about a AA Alkaline handheld is that I'm glad SF hasn't ventured there. My opinion is in line with this post taken from the "2008 Wishlist" thread:


kramer5150 said:


> Please.... PLEASE!! Paul Kim and the mighty powers at SF. Do not release any AA lights. You guys will be warranty replacing battery acid damaged parts in an on-going futile effort to maintain your customer support, and will have to pass the business expense on to customers by further raising prices (worst case scenario).


----------



## 276 (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

I never really took an interest in the A2 but i like the sound of an led version.


----------



## Size15's (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



brighterisbetter said:


> What I said about a AA Alkaline handheld is that I'm glad SF hasn't ventured there.


I believe SureFire's brand is based on the SF123A battery and there is no need for an AA-powered flashlight to have SureFire on it as SureFire have enough to be getting on with.

Al


----------



## roadie (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

#134 post still no pics?

we need pics
 
are the surefire booth there giving out the 2009 catalogue? or freebies?


----------



## Shawn L (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

Specs for the A2L 
Output: Hi: 120 lums Runtime 2hrs
Lo: 10 lums Runtime 15hrs

Weight: 4.3 oz w/batt
Length: 5.4"
Bezel: 1.13" diam
There is one big led and 4 small led's.

My photobucket is messed up.


----------



## Art Vandelay (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

When I saw a Chinese manufactured copy of the A2 that had an LED instead of an incan bulb, I thought that was kind of funny. If you want an LED with a high and low level, why not just get a multi level LED light? 

On the other hand, McGizmo has made some lights like this that are brilliant. He has a cooler higher powered LED with decent throw in the center, on the outside of the bezel he put multiple high CRI LED for pure flood. I like that he put them outside of the reflector so the LED beams don't distorted like they are with the A2.


----------



## danpass (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



> A2L: 120 lumens for 2hrs


 

wow


----------



## flash_bang (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



danpass said:


> wow


yeah, you'd think with all this time they could get more out of it.....


----------



## Mercaptan (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



Art Vandelay said:


> When I saw a Chinese manufactured copy of the A2 that had an LED instead of an incan bulb, I thought that was kind of funny. If you want an LED with a high and low level, why not just get a multi level LED light?
> 
> On the other hand, McGizmo has made some lights like this that are brilliant. He has a cooler higher powered LED with decent throw in the center, on the outside of the bezel he put multiple high CRI LED for pure flood. I like that he put them outside of the reflector so the LED beams don't distorted like they are with the A2.



Beam shape. With the reflector you get a tight beam for throw, but by using small 5mm (or smaller) LEDs you get pure flood. It makes sense for the purposes of the light, a close-in flood and a spot for distance.

I would love to see pictures of the A2L. I would also love to see it hit stores. I hope it arrives at dealers soon as the amount of innovation in this (relative to the UB2, UA2, etc.) is much less.


----------



## Bruce B (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



Shawn L said:


> ... My photobucket is messed up ...


 

Create a new photobucket account and post some pics for us, please!


----------



## danpass (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



flash_bang said:


> yeah, you'd think with all this time they could get more out of it.....


 
Actually I was thinking 'not bad at all' ......... if its regulated in some way to put out 120lumens for 2hrs

the way the current A2 is regulated to go full bore for 1hr (and still leave juice for the LEDs)


----------



## Jackal112203 (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

In the 2008 catalog there were no specs in the back for the E1e, is it the same for this catalog? I really hope they don't discontinue the E1e. Does anyone know if they are planning on this?


----------



## TMedina (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

Probably - as nice a package as the E1E is, the performance just doesn't match the E1L or E1B.

-Trevor


----------



## Shawn L (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



Jackal112203 said:


> In the 2008 catalog there were no specs in the back for the E1e, is it the same for this catalog? I really hope they don't discontinue the E1e. Does anyone know if they are planning on this?



I don't see the E1E in the catolog.


----------



## flash_bang (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



danpass said:


> Actually I was thinking 'not bad at all' ......... if its regulated in some way to put out 120lumens for 2hrs
> 
> the way the current A2 is regulated to go full bore for 1hr (and still leave juice for the LEDs)


is it 2 hrs regulated or 2 hrs to battery depletion? I was thinking it was depletion since that's how all their other lights are rated.


----------



## jchoo (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



flash_bang said:


> is it 2 hrs regulated or 2 hrs to battery depletion? I was thinking it was depletion since that's how all their other lights are rated.



Sounds like an E2DL with A2 style switching and a floody low. I can dig it.


----------



## SimpleIsGood229 (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



Sgt. LED said:


> DimmerD said:
> 
> 
> > Is the p601L that was supposed to come out last year in there?
> ...


Maybe Gene could lend them a hand.


----------



## Optik49 (Jan 15, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

q


DaFABRICATA said:


> *SOMEONE POST SOME PICS ALREADY!!!*
> 
> *A LINK...SOMETHING!!:hairpull:*


----------



## ugrey (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

If I remember correctly, we did not have even catalog photos until after the show last year. CPF ought to fund, or partially fund, someone to go to the show, get a catalog and then post photos. That would be their job.


----------



## Zeige (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



ugrey said:


> If I remember correctly, we did not have even catalog photos until after the show last year. CPF ought to fund, or partially fund, someone to go to the show, get a catalog and then post photos. That would be their job.


 

This is "news" to us! Our members should get Press passes imo


----------



## FrogmanM (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

I don't know about the rest of you, but I'm getting my hands on this updated A2...


----------



## Federal LG (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

Ken, from Lundestudio.com told me that he´ll go to Surefire booth tomorrow! 

http://lundestudio.com/2009SHOTShow/


:devil:


----------



## SimpleIsGood229 (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



Federal LG said:


> Ken, from Lundestudio.com told me that he´ll go to Surefire booth tomorrow!
> 
> http://lundestudio.com/2009SHOTShow/
> 
> ...


Expect a boatload of rediculously high quality photography. The...suspense...is..._killing me!_


----------



## Splunk_Au (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

If people weren't suppose to take pics then how come that dude did?


----------



## KDOG3 (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

I just can't believe there are no pics yet. I really want to see the M3L and M3TL. I wonder if they did anything to the M4, like an M4L....

Maybe this thread should be stickied, at least temporarily.


----------



## 270winchester (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

go play with your lights....You have my permission.



SimpleIsGood229 said:


> Expect a boatload of rediculously high quality photography. The...suspense...is..._killing me!_


----------



## Qoose (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

So much news and info, or at least potential info in the air... and I will be out of town and disconnected?!? 

Why... I'm going to die from information starvation. Or it will be like overfeeding a starving man.


----------



## Blindasabat (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



> Sounds like an E2DL with A2 style switching and a floody low. I can dig it.


That's what I was thinking, but maybe also that it has less efficient Neutral or warm SSC's since it is replacing the nearly iconic A2 incan. Might be another reason for separate LEDs.



> If I remember correctly, we did not have even catalog photos until after the show last year. CPF ought to fund, or partially fund, someone to go to the show, get a catalog and then post photos. That would be their job.


It seemed like weeks waiting for photos last year.


----------



## Long RunTime (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*


----------



## lightfet (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*


----------



## Bruce B (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

Pics...


----------



## Lightcrazycanuck (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*


----------



## munchs (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*


----------



## Monocrom (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



Shawn L said:


> No mention of the UA2 or the UB2 at all. Only the UB3.


 
Safe to say, more than a few CPFers could be called *U B P*ssed.*


----------



## curlyfry562 (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



ugrey said:


> If I remember correctly, we did not have even catalog photos until after the show last year. CPF ought to fund, or partially fund, someone to go to the show, get a catalog and then post photos. That would be their job.


I agree completely, wow we are really an inpatient bunch.

I too never completely understood what was so special about the A2, but this new A2L sounds very nice, especially if that 2hr. posted runtime is regulated.


----------



## CLHC (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

Waiting and munching on  Hurricane Popcorn


----------



## ElGreco (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



> That's what I was thinking, but maybe also that it has less efficient Neutral or warm SSC's since it is replacing the nearly iconic A2 incan. Might be another reason for separate LEDs.



Aren't some the warmer tinted P4s U-Bin as well? (Thanks to SSC binning, but nonetheless) Are the warm tint bins at efficency levels to match the kind of lumens and runtime ratings that Surefire is aiming for in their new LED lines?


----------



## Federal LG (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

Relax guys... 

At least, Ken Lunde told me (by e-mail) that he´ll gonna be in Surefire booth today, shooting some pics.

We just have to wait... and pray!


----------



## TMedina (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

Apparently you have to attend as "media" to be able to take photos.

-Trevor


----------



## TMedina (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

-Trevor

edit 3: oops, my bad.


----------



## Size15's (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

There are other threads discussing SS2009 in general and new Inova products specifically. Please keep this thread on topic (SureFire)


----------



## Blindasabat (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

The warmest U-bin is SV0, which is not far from SW0. SUN & SUM, the warmest 'cool' bin SSC are so far unobtanium, and may have a lower CCT than SV0, but no higher CRI since SSC spec says all 'cool' tint bins are lower CRI than Neutral and Warm tint bins. 
The SSC Neutral Bins are only available so far in S1 & S2 bins, which are (..S..T..U..) two full bins below U-bin at only 60-70 lumens at 350mA. But they are also limited to 700mA, so 120 emitter lumens is possible, but not 120 SureFire OTF lumens. Maybe they are anticipating T-bin Neutral SSC's? 
- again, purely hopeful speculation on my part, because I would not replace my A2 with a cool bin LED.


ElGreco said:


> Aren't some the warmer tinted P4s U-Bin as well? (Thanks to SSC binning, but nonetheless) Are the warm tint bins at efficency levels to match the kind of lumens and runtime ratings that Surefire is aiming for in their new LED lines?


----------



## KDOG3 (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



ugrey said:


> If I remember correctly, we did not have even catalog photos until after the show last year. CPF ought to fund, or partially fund, someone to go to the show, get a catalog and then post photos. That would be their job.



YES. Call it a CPF Photographer. I don't know why we can't have a CPF'er be able to get a press pass. I mean, CPF is kind of a news outlet isn't it? I nominate Size15s' since he and PK chat and he could take pics that would keep us in good graces with Surefire.


----------



## Sgt. LED (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

Is 15 going to be able to attend every SHOT? If not we need someone else.


----------



## KROMATICS (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

We just need someone with the 2009 catalog to take pictures of the new lights in it. That will do for now. Most people have digital cameras, cameraphones, etc. Are the people going to Shot Show all luddites or something?


----------



## KROMATICS (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



Bruce B said:


> Create a new photobucket account and post some pics for us, please!



 You could email them to someone else here to post them for you.


----------



## KROMATICS (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



dcjs said:


> That's what the catalogue states, I think I posted the output values in the initial post.
> 
> I saw the LX2, AZ2 and M3L at the booth today, no Invictus to be seen.
> The M3L is using a combination of a smooth reflector and a diffusion film on the inside of the lens to produce a fairly tightly focused, but not really pretty (I'm a picky ******* though) beam. No donut to be seen.
> ...



What did they say about the Invictus/Optimus? As I recall they said they would have information for us at Shot Show.


----------



## Chrontius (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

http://lundestudio.com/2009SHOTShow/

Yo, guys - bottom of the page. Two of the AZ2 Combatlight, one of the LX2 Lumamax, and one of the A2L Aviator as of 12:45.

Oh god, look at the clips. I'm calling as soon as I'm out of class to request one for my A2.

... there's no knurling on any of them.


----------



## KROMATICS (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



Size15's said:


> You're on your own guys - I've got other priorities at the moment :naughty:
> 
> Anyway, aren't you lot done with thrashing vaporware to death?
> Why not wait until Dealers have new products in stock and available for purchase and basing discussion on the actual product?
> ...



Because knowing Surefire it will be well into 2010? Might as well shut the forum down if we are not allowed to discuss new lights.


----------



## carrot (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

Photos of the AZ2, A2L, LX2 are up on Lunde's site.


----------



## brighterisbetter (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



Chrontius said:


> http://lundestudio.com/2009SHOTShow/


The AZ2 is definitely a keeper! Looks to be a SSC P4.


----------



## gsxrac (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

These are from the Lunde Studio website and the pics were not encrypted in any way so I hope im not doing anything wrong by the whole copy paste thing lol. Ive I get sued yall owe me for "rehosting" or whatever you wanna call it. But once again not my pictures all credit goes to Lunde Studio
http://lundestudio.com/2009SHOTShow/


----------



## Sgt. LED (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

Finally!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## gsxrac (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

Forgot the LX2


----------



## brighterisbetter (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

Call me crazy, but are we now seeing the first Z2 in HA-BK? :huh:


----------



## flash_bang (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

I love the HA-BK, but I think the tried and true knurling would be better. The parts they cut out don't even hold the hand well  They do look sweet tho


----------



## Chrontius (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

I'm kind of sad they didn't have a one-cell A1L, come to think of it; with my income, I'll never but never be able to afford a LunaSol 20.


----------



## tsask (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

For a few years I've been dreaming of my "ideal EDC" light. A light that I can EDC for leisure activities as well as for work.
I have EDC'd my A2 with green LEDs. I love that "vanilla ice cream beautiful beam" regulated incan power that pilots use to check for ice on wings!To have the beautiful green glow available makes it excellent for many more tasks, and is beautiful to see! As much as I love my A2 I have been craving an LED version with a single HI POWERED or HB LED (Q5, R2, "warm neutral Q2?" or even a P-7) surrounded by 3 or more 3,5 mm GREEN LEDS.
So here is the question...... as my bank acount cringes at the thought of a $200+ LED purchase so soon after recent holiday excesses

Will the A2L be made with GREEN LEDs??????
I almost hope not  j/k


----------



## kelmo (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

They've got the improved pocket clip! Very cool.


----------



## gsxrac (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

No Z2 in HA-BK thats an AZ2


----------



## Chrontius (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

Close enough for me... or rather, better still!


----------



## brighterisbetter (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



ricehaterboi said:


> No Z2 in HA-BK thats an AZ2


Right I agree, I'm just saying that the body contouring resembles the older Z2-BK, and that body style has long been on my wishlist in an HA finish.


----------



## Sgt. LED (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

AZ2 doesn't look very throwy does it............


----------



## gsxrac (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

And to make this all inclusive for pics ill post a pic of the VL-2 Vampire that another member gave the link for on www.militarytimes.com


----------



## Sgt. LED (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

I want to mod the Vampire so I can have snow LED's in it instead of IR.

SCOTT!


----------



## edc3 (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

Federal LG,

Please thank Ken Lunde for the pics. Too bad he couldn't get these back to his studio. I'm a big fan of his gun and knife wallpapers.


----------



## gsxrac (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

Definantly thank Ken Lunde. All I did was post them here so we all the pics we have been given so far are in one place


----------



## GarageBoy (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

I don't think you can mod the Vampire as both LEDs are supposedly sharing one chip. 

I love the new molten look of the Surefires


----------



## Lightingguy321 (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

Thats it, I am going to sell my wallets contents on an LX1 or A2L when I get the $$. These lights look awesome.


----------



## KDOG3 (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

GREAT PICS! That LX2 looks great. I would love to see some business end pics though...

BTW, I don't see anything on Ken Lundes' site....


We need pics of the M3L and M3TL....


----------



## KDOG3 (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



Sgt. LED said:


> I want to mod the Vampire so I can have snow LED's in it instead of IR.
> 
> SCOTT!




YES, Or even red, yellow green, blue, etc...


----------



## HKJ (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



KROMATICS said:


> We just need someone with the 2009 catalog to take pictures of the new lights in it. That will do for now. Most people have digital cameras, cameraphones, etc. Are the people going to Shot Show all luddites or something?



I would be satisfied if Surefire put up a PDF file with the new catalog. I hope they do that very soon.


----------



## brighterisbetter (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



HKJ said:


> I would be satisfied if Surefire put up a PDF file with the new catalog. I hope they do that very soon.


I just spoke with SF CS and was told that the PDF catalog link will be updated once paper catalogs begin shipping to customers/dealers sometime in early February.


----------



## HKJ (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



brighterisbetter said:


> I just spoke with SF CS and was told that the PDF catalog link will be updated once paper catalogs begin shipping to customers/dealers sometime in early February.



That is a long time to wait, where is a scan of the catalog?


----------



## Lightcrazycanuck (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*


----------



## manoloco (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

no LX1 pics?


----------



## TMedina (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

Interesting - the new A2s are using the clip design from the E1B.

I have to admit, I like the knurling of the E-series. How will the grip be for this new run of the Aviator?

-Trevor

Edit: For clarification


----------



## Shawn L (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

The A2L will have green, blue, red, and white LED's.


----------



## Brizzler (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

Is it just me who thinks the styling of these new SF lights is reminiscent of the Inova Inforce series??


----------



## TMedina (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

Not particularly, no - at least, I don't see it.

-Trevor


----------



## iapyx (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

Like someone said before I too like to hear an official SF word why the UA2 and UB2 are left out. What happened to these fantastic lights, at least on paper. Did is appear to be too dificult to make them? I can imagine this for the UA2, but for the UB2....


----------



## Federal LG (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



edc3 said:


> Federal LG,
> 
> Please thank Ken Lunde for the pics. Too bad he couldn't get these back to his studio. I'm a big fan of his gun and knife wallpapers.



I will. :wave:

I didn´t like these new models. 
I mean, I always loved Surefire "x-tra crispy" knurling... and it´s gone! :shakehead

Now I´m waiting for the LX1 too. I´m a huge fan of 1xCR123 lights!


----------



## TITAN1833 (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

If the UB2 is now UB3 is the change 2 to 3 the only difference? :shrug:


----------



## manoloco (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

someone said this arent production models, so the knurling can be back (i hope so), its a very important part of the ergonomics, and reliability of use of the light.

the shape of the AZ2 seems like it would do ok without knurling (like the Z2), but for the rest i hope they put it on the final production models.


----------



## edc3 (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

I definitely prefer the styling of the old A2 to the new one. We'll have to see what it looks like when it's actually released. I've wanted an A2 for years. I guess I'll wait on the A2L now...


----------



## tango44 (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

ANY SPECS AND PRICES????


----------



## MSaxatilus (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



> Photos of the AZ2, A2L, LX2


 
Those photos have an interesting bezel that looks like the focusable Invictus or Optimus (can't remember which). Are these things focusable?:thinking:

...probably wishful thinking, but had to ask.

MSax


----------



## Chrontius (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

Not likely. AZ2 has a reflectored SSC, so you can't really focus that without the rings-and-holes we all know and hate.


----------



## copperfox (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



edc3 said:


> I definitely prefer the styling of the old A2 to the new one. We'll have to see what it looks like when it's actually released. I've wanted an A2 for years. I guess I'll wait on the A2L now...



Agreed. IMHO the A2 is one of the best looking lights in the world. The new A2L is more "blah" looking, and I doubt it has the throw of the incan version.


----------



## Bullzeyebill (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



Chrontius said:


> Not likely. AZ2 has a reflectored SSC, so you can't really focus that without the rings-and-holes we all know and hate.



We know little or nothing about the AZ2. An SSC with a reflector can put out a beautiful beam, much better than a Cree XR-E.

Bill


----------



## Lightguy27 (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

Personally, I will be looking at the M3TL, LX2, and A2L. And holding my breath for the UA2...


----------



## phantom23 (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



Bullzeyebill said:


> We know little or nothing about the AZ2. An SSC with a reflector can put out a beautiful beam, much better than a Cree XR-E.
> Bill



But probably not much throw. Reflector could be a little bit deeper - there are still 5mm LED's for flood.


----------



## MSaxatilus (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



> Not likely. AZ2 has a reflectored SSC, so you can't really focus that without the rings-and-holes we all know and hate.


 
Yeah, I figured that would be the case, I was just trying to be hopeful.

MSax


----------



## flash_bang (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

I do hope they come out with the heads separately, I gotta say, I'm not really a fan of this melted style, I'd kinda prefer something grooved...

that being said, they look pretty sweet, and it looks like this will be a landmark year with surefire!


----------



## Fooboy (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

Why is there not a catalog up yet? This is freaking pathetic.

:shakehead:

*AND NO SPECS?!* All you got to do is type them in.


----------



## Shawn L (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

That would be cool is if the heads from the A2L and the AZ2 can lego on to the other bodies.


----------



## TMedina (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

I'm sure they can be, unless SF re-worked the threads for an entirely different standard.

And what are the odds of that happening? 

-Trevor


----------



## Shawn L (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

I'm talking about putting the A2L head on the AZ2 body.


----------



## flash_bang (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



Shawn L said:


> I'm talking about putting the A2L head on the AZ2 body.


well, seeing as the A2's walls are already really thin, I think the AZ2 is a C series body with an AZ2 head, and the A2L is just an all LED A2.

Cliffs:
A2L = E series; AZ2 = C series
not compatible A2L to AZ2
yes compatible AZ2 to A2L (if E to C adapter is used)


Again, I'm just guessing on the series, but looking at the thickness of the A2Z, I think it's a c series.


----------



## KDOG3 (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

I hope the A2L has 4-6 leds that can be aftermarket upgrades to have like 2 different colors.


----------



## flash_bang (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



KDOG3 said:


> I hope the A2L has 4-6 leds that can be aftermarket upgrades to have like 2 different colors.


you mean like a mini kroma? I thought the A2L just had a two die led...


----------



## FrogmanM (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



FrogmanM said:


> I don't know about the rest of you, but I'm getting my hands on this updated A2...



I am going to have to retract my previous statement, as lack of classic SF style Knurling is deeply disturbing!

Mayo


----------



## Size15's (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

SureFire has a design patent for their new approach to grip ergonomics. It's taken PK quite a long time to get a design that can be easy to grip in one direction and not get snagged etc in the other.
I got to try out the UA2 proto-type and the styling allows for easy, secure rotation of the TailCap (and in the case of the UA2, the bezel too) and yet it didn't get caught in clothing or pockets etc. This is important for quickly being able to draw and stow the flashlight.
These new designs, particularly the AZ2 are maintaining the overall silhouette of classic SureFire styles (6Z/Z2 in the example of the new AZ2) but updating the features, switching and ergonomics.


----------



## UnderTheWeepingMoon (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

I'm excited about the A2L and LX2. They look like they'll be very pocket friendly with the E1B clip. I'm disappointed about the lack of knurling though. SureFire's knurling is one thing that sets their lights apart from those of other manufacturers. 

The new sleek styling, while good to look at, looks like it could be slippery in wet conditions. I know from experience that McGizmo's lights are grippy despite their lack of knurling. I hope the new SureFires will be similar in that respect.

Edit: Is it just me, or does the AZ2 look like it could have four low-beam LEDs in Ken Lunde's photograph. I'm guessing the A2L will retain the original A2's three LEDs, while the AZ2 will have four to account for its brighter low-level specs.


----------



## greenLED (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



tsask said:


> Will the A2L be made with GREEN LEDs??????
> I almost hope not  j/k


What?? Why not? Us Greensters are cool!


----------



## TMedina (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

I will, of course, be happy to grope one and be pleasantly surprised.

-Trevor


----------



## Splunk_Au (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

The new lights look ugly, kinda like the old Nuwai products around the head area.

And SureFire added the shallow horizontal lines running along the battery tube like the Jetbeams (ironic since there was another thread about how the new Jetbeam looks like a SureFire M4).


----------



## Bruce B (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

Currently I am not too impressed with the overall designs of the new Surefire lights. They look too rough in design and look like they'd need some finishing touches and body reworking before hitting the shelves. I, however, am digging the UB3. It looks awesome.


----------



## Shawn L (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



UnderTheWeepingMoon said:


> Edit: Is it just me, or does the AZ2 look like it could have four low-beam LEDs in Ken Lunde's photograph. I'm guessing the A2L will retain the original A2's three LEDs, while the AZ2 will have four to account for its brighter low-level specs.



The AZ2 and the A2L both have 4 small LED's.


----------



## Kiessling (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

The important question ... 5mm or 3mm?

And ... any pic of the UB3 ?
And the HID ?

And ... everything else? 

bk


----------



## Mercaptan (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



Bruce B said:


> Currently I am not too impressed with the overall designs of the new Surefire lights. They look too rough in design and look like they'd need some finishing touches and body reworking before hitting the shelves. I, however, am digging the UB3. It looks awesome.



You have seen (or have a picture of?) the UB3? I don't recall seeing one in this thread (or any source from SHOT for that matter).


----------



## Federal LG (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

Sorry, but I´m lost!

Which one of those new Surefires is powered by just 1 x CR123 ?


----------



## ja10 (Jan 16, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

I would assume the LX1. I'd really like the online catalog to show up!

I do like the E1B style clip on the new A2's. Very nice addition.


----------



## RyanA (Jan 17, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

I hope they have UV as an option on the new A2.


----------



## KDOG3 (Jan 17, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

I don't see anything on Ken Lundes' site. Am I the only one? I just can't believe there aren't more pics.

EDIT: Nevermind, I see them using Firefox, they weren't showing up in Chrome. That A2Z looks sweet. But we need specs...


----------



## curlyfry562 (Jan 17, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



KDOG3 said:


> EDIT: Nevermind, I see them using Firefox, they weren't showing up in Chrome. That A2Z looks sweet. But we need specs...



Same here, although now they are showing up w/ Chrome


----------



## 276 (Jan 17, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

The aviator looks really cool!


----------



## 270winchester (Jan 17, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

I hope they continue or improve on the optics they had for the current L1/KX_x/E2D/E1B lights and efficiently use the light from the small lights.


----------



## AA6TZ (Jan 17, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



270winchester said:


> I hope they continue or improve on the optics they had for the current L1/KX_x/E2D/E1B lights and efficiently use the light from the small lights.


 

+1 Any future improvement SureFire makes to the optics currently used in the E2DL would _really_ be an accomplishment, IMHO. And a most welcomed one, too. As it stands now, it's arguably one of _the_ top performers for its size.



-Clive


----------



## Sgt. LED (Jan 17, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

Wish I could just buy some of those long E1B style clips......
I hope we can get some more emitter shots up soon.

That's where the fun is. :thumbsup:


----------



## flash_bang (Jan 17, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

Agreed, Sgt. LED! If someone could direct me to a link about these multi-die LED's, I'd really appreciate it. All I know is I love brightness, and I love runtime, but my knowledge on the inner workings of LED's is kind of limited. 

Also, are these new surefire's going to have flat line regulation? What makes most custom lights have awesome regulation, but the surefires don't (to my knowledge).

Thanks!
Flash


----------



## Tempest UK (Jan 17, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

SureFire's catalog page now includes a "Law Enforcement Guide" PDF. It mentions a couple of new products - a Z2L Kit in line with the G3L-BK-KIT01 and the X400 WeaponLight. 

I'd much rather see the 2009 Illumination Tools up there, of course...

Regards,
Tempest


----------



## KROMATICS (Jan 17, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

No pictures of the UB3, M3L or M3TL yet?


----------



## TMedina (Jan 17, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

Errk - Law Enforcement Catalog hosted on the SF site. I'm glad I looked - I thought Tempest meant in the now-mythical 2009 catalog.

Without detouring too much from the topic - Multi-die LED.

-Trevor


----------



## SunStar (Jan 17, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

Guys... just returned from SHOT and IMO the new Surefires are awesome. I'll post a few highlights below. Please excuse me if I'm redundant as I haven't went through all 9 pages. Also, I didn't go over every new light - just the lights that interested me - as weapons were my primary goal.

LED's are definitely the focus and its easy to see why. Overall output, multi-level output and runtime easily beat the incandescents of yesterday in functionality, versatility and ergonmics (this coming from an incanscent guy). It's easy to see that the near future is going to bring some interesting products and the technology seems to be moving now at the pace of electronics. Also, the old 60 lumen base for SF lights is now 120 lumens for the LED models with some exception.

Anyway a few of my favorites:

AZ2 @ 25/120 l for 6/2 hrs (current rating);
L2X @ 15/120 l for 30/2 hrs;
A2L @ 10/120 l for 15/2 hours
E1B now offered in natural aluminum or silver color in addition to black.

I was told that the AZ2 will most likely be bumped up in output rating (mid 100's). 

The A2L is a must-have for the A2 lovers. Side by side with the hybrid A2, the A2L is about a .25" shorter (or about the height of the protruding push button) and the A2L has the bezel down / up pocket clip similar to the E1B. The knurling has been replaced with "ridges" (a minus in my book for function but is asthetically pleasing). The 4 smaller low level LED"s are simply awesome. The model I tested showed a very smooth flood with no rings and produced a very generous output. The smaller LED's seemed to interfere less with the beam quality of the main beam as compared to the original hybrid A2 (or could be a function of both smaller led's and diode output for the main beam in contrast to wire). Of course the 120 l rating at over twice the run time is an easy winner as 50l was always a little anemic for my needs.

There are 2 replacement heads for the M3 in lieu of the KL9 - the M3L and M3LT (LU10L / LU10LT). Both are currently rated at 350 lumens but I was assured that a new rating will be forthcoming for the modules in the mid to high 400's - most likely 480 lumens. The M3L reminded me of the U2 reflector on steroids and is dual level - low being 60 lumens for 12 hours. The M3LT has a TIR similar to the lastest revision of the KL3. Please know, output wise... these heads will NOT disappoint. I'll be acquiring both for handheld and carbine play. Very nice indeed!

I won't speak for SF manufacturing but was told by a SF rep at the show that the delay in release of the new U2's was a direct result of supplier inconsistencies with the current state of technology. Surefire can make one or small quantities of the units but mass producing units of equivalent / consistent performance was a real issue at the time being.

There were other cool products specifically for weapons like multi level switching for the weapon rail and the KM3 / V2L units. Overall, I was impressed with the new products - many of which will find their way into my SF collection. BTW... the M6 and M4 still sat proudly on display on the new products table.


----------



## matt0 (Jan 17, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



SunStar said:


> Guys... just returned from SHOT and IMO the new Surefires are awesome. I'll post a few highlights below....



Thank you for all the detail!


----------



## KDOG3 (Jan 17, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



SunStar said:


> AZ2 @ 25/120 l for 6/2 hrs (current rating);
> L2X @ 15/120 l for 30/2 hrs;
> A2L @ 10/120 l for 15/2 hours
> E1B now offered in natural aluminum or silver color in addition to black.
> ...



Wait a minute. How is the the L2X able to pump out 15 lumens for 30hrs, but the A2L only able to pump out 10 lumens for 15hrs? Seems like the specs aren't finalized yet. 

I'm still waiting for a pic of the new M3s'.....


----------



## Tempest UK (Jan 17, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



SunStar said:


> Guys... just returned from SHOT...



Excellent post, thanks for sharing 

Regards,
Tempest


----------



## SunStar (Jan 17, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



KDOG3 said:


> Wait a minute. How is the the L2X able to pump out 15 lumens for 30hrs, but the A2L only able to pump out 10 lumens for 15hrs? Seems like the specs aren't finalized yet.
> 
> I'm still waiting for a pic of the new M3s'.....



Regarding the M3... the M3L and M3LT bezels are different in appearance.

The M3L reminded me of the old KL6 from the outside or basically an extended U2 Ultra bezel with machined notches similar to the A2L about its perimeter and mild crenelations at the front. The M3LT sort of reminded me of a mini turbohead because it's flared to accommodate the TIR. 

The specs I have are:

Bezel: 1.9" diameter;
OAL: 8.25"'
Weight: 11 oz w/ batteries.
Dual Output: 350 / 60 lumens @ 1.5 / 12 hours. (subject to change).

I know... not as good as a picture... but maybe it helps some.


----------



## depusm12 (Jan 17, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

SunStar

Are those the specs for the M3L?


----------



## SunStar (Jan 17, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



depusm12 said:


> SunStar
> 
> Are those the specs for the M3L?



Yes...M3L.


----------



## 270winchester (Jan 17, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



KDOG3 said:


> Wait a minute. How is the the L2X able to pump out 15 lumens for 30hrs, but the A2L only able to pump out 10 lumens for 15hrs? Seems like the specs aren't finalized yet. .




Looks like the A2L uses 5mm LEDs for low which tend to have lower runtime than the same lumens cost from a Cree or SSC LED. That's the price one pays for the floody low beam I suppose.


----------



## Kiessling (Jan 17, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

SunStar ... thanx for the post. :thumbsup:


----------



## edc3 (Jan 17, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

Thank you SunStar! I'm dreaming of an A2L now. What was your impression of the tint from the 5mm LEDs?


----------



## AA6TZ (Jan 17, 2009)

*Thank You, SunStar!*

Thank you very much *SunStar* for your superbly detailed, very well written post!!! :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:




SunStar said:


> Guys... just returned from SHOT and IMO the new Surefires are awesome.
> 
> There are 2 replacement heads for the M3 in lieu of the KL9 - the *M3L* and *M3LT* (LU10L / LU10LT). Both are currently rated at 350 lumens but I was assured that a new rating will be forthcoming for the modules in the mid to high 400's - most likely 480 lumens. The M3L reminded me of the U2 reflector on steroids and is dual level - low being 60 lumens for 12 hours. The M3LT has a TIR similar to the lastest revision of the KL3. Please know, output wise... these heads will NOT disappoint. I'll be acquiring both for handheld and carbine play. Very nice indeed!


 
Man . . . I'm already sold and haven't even seen the darned things! The M3L or M3LT would be _most_ welcomed in this Flashaholic's collection.

Best Regards,

-Clive


----------



## Optik49 (Jan 17, 2009)

_*Surefire’s 2009 New Lights Discussion:*_

*Some of SureFire's new offerings, specifically the AZ2 CombatLight, the LX2 LumaMax, and the A2 LED Aviator: 
*
[URL="http://lundestudio.com/2009SHOTShow/Day2Lo/2009shotshow-01162009-032.jpg"]http://lundestudio.com/2009SHOTShow/...162009-032.jpg[/URL] [URL="http://lundestudio.com/2009SHOTShow/Day2Lo/2009shotshow-01162009-033.jpg"]http://lundestudio.com/2009SHOTShow/...162009-033.jpg[/URL] [URL="http://lundestudio.com/2009SHOTShow/Day2Lo/2009shotshow-01162009-034.jpg"]http://lundestudio.com/2009SHOTShow/...162009-034.jpg[/URL] [URL="http://lundestudio.com/2009SHOTShow/Day2Lo/2009shotshow-01162009-035.jpg"]http://lundestudio.com/2009SHOTShow/...162009-035.jpg[/URL]


----------



## Federal LG (Jan 17, 2009)

Here, my friend: https://www.candlepowerforums.com/posts/2791638#post2791638


----------



## Gary007 (Jan 17, 2009)

will this thread continue from the (lengthy)one already started here?
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/posts/2791638#post2791638


Anyways....can't wait to get ahold of some of the new lights!


----------



## trailblazer (Jan 17, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

Please excuse my ignorance but AZ2, L2X, and A2L sound like 3 versions of a re-packaged E2DL with exception of minor variations on the low end, doesn't sound that exciting to me...


----------



## yazkaz (Jan 17, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

Glad to hear these new projects, hopefully they will offset the departure of the UA2/UB2.

Last thing I know, the UA2/UB2 project was been scrapped some weeks ago due to electronics problem. Don't think a UB3 would be likely. Anyway, I could be wrong.


----------



## tsask (Jan 17, 2009)

I've been dreaming of green/white HB LED light for years. nothing quite fits the bill. I own a couple led lensers v2 etc that have green and white but they are nothing like a Surefire! Green/White LED A2L for me!


----------



## SunStar (Jan 17, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



edc3 said:


> Thank you SunStar! I'm dreaming of an A2L now. What was your impression of the tint from the 5mm LEDs?



I fondled 2 A2L specimens... one with white and the other with red low output. The white was very "white" for both high and low output LED's. In color, it was very similar to the E1B. It did not strike me as being cold although I would not prefer it any "whiter". It was a very soft, diffused beam that would be very useful for most close-up work and in-door navigation. The beam profile and output was actually very similar to my own E2DL with F04 on low - only whiter. (My E2DL tends to slightly "green" up on low - something I didn't notice with my limited play time of the A2L. Of course, I wasn't in a dark room either.)

The diffused red actually mirrored the white. It's very soft and I didn't notice any rings unless I held it very close to a white surface - similar to what one would experience with the Kroma. Even still, the rings overlap very evenly and do not distract as would the original A2. As one pulls away from the surface, the beam is beautifully diffused with very useful output for close-up tasking, in-door navigation, and stealthy outdoor use. I can't really comment on throw of the low level LED's as compared to the A2, but the usefulness of the floody beam and increased output is far improved over the original A2 - especially in the (darker) red color. (I think there is probably less to gain in white than there is with red - my opinion.)

I don't know if it's obvious from the pictures or catalog, but the LED's are much smaller (perhaps set-back further in the reflector?) than the original A2. I speculate this does 2 things - 1. minimizes interference with the primary beam profile and 2. directs the beam of the low level LEDs - almost like having four individual reflectors inside of one larger reflector. "Reflector" may be a slightly exaggerated description of what's taking place here, but I believe the magic of the beam is a little more than adding a 4th LED.

I have been a big fan of the Kroma for low level use and I believe the A2L may very well replace the primary use of my personal Kroma offering great low level flood and superb high beam output packaged in a smaller, more pocketable profile.


----------



## ja10 (Jan 17, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



trailblazer said:


> Please excuse my ignorance but AZ2, L2X, and A2L sound like 3 versions of a re-packaged E2DL with exception of minor variations on the low end, doesn't sound that exciting to me...



The L2X might be close, but without crenelations. That will be a welcomed addition for a lot of people.

The new A2s are likely quite different from the E2DL. The 5mm LEDs integrated into the reflector will allow for not only different beam shapes, but different colors as well. Many people would love a yellow-green or red for up close work, and then a strong main beam for checking out what is in the distance.

The E1B, L1 (current), E2DL, E1L, and E2L are all pretty similar. The new A2s will be in a totally different category in my opinion.

... not to mention the new M3s ...


----------



## Greg G (Jan 17, 2009)

I'm interested in the new Vampire. I wonder if anyone will be able to do some beamshots through their nightvision gear, like a PVS-14?


----------



## SunStar (Jan 17, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



trailblazer said:


> Please excuse my ignorance but AZ2, L2X, and A2L sound like 3 versions of a re-packaged E2DL with exception of minor variations on the low end, doesn't sound that exciting to me...



Perhaps partially correct, but a few things to consider....

The AZ2, L2X and A2L go from low to high rather than high to low. The A2L offers varied colors in the low level and the AZ2 / A2L provide a more diffused low level beam. High beam characteristics will also vary based on reflector size and specific optics.

So... output, beam profile, operator interface, pocket profile, Surefire / Rogers body and color do vary... simply... "choices" for one's use. This is something that Surefire has always done - even when incandescents were the only thing to offer. Choices...


----------



## Federal LG (Jan 17, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

Sunstar...

Did you see some 1xCR123 new Surefire lights ? Do you know the specs ?

Thanks!


----------



## edc3 (Jan 17, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



SunStar said:


> I don't know if it's obvious from the pictures or catalog, but the LED's are much smaller (perhaps set-back further in the reflector?) than the original A2. I speculate this does 2 things - 1. minimizes interference with the primary beam profile and 2. directs the beam of the low level LEDs - almost like having four individual reflectors inside of one larger reflector. "Reflector" may be a slightly exaggerated description of what's taking place here, but I believe the magic of the beam is a little more than adding a 4th LED.



Very informative posts. Are the LEDs definitely 5mm or could they be 3mm?


----------



## TMedina (Jan 17, 2009)

I'm pretty sure this thread will be collapsed into the 2009 Surefire SHOT thread.

-Trevor


----------



## Size15's (Jan 17, 2009)

TMedina said:


> I'm pretty sure this thread will be collapsed into the 2009 Surefire SHOT thread.
> 
> -Trevor


Indeed it has been!


----------



## baterija (Jan 17, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



Size15's said:


> SureFire has a design patent for their new approach to grip ergonomics. It's taken PK quite a long time to get a design that can be easy to grip in one direction and not get snagged etc in the other.



That's very interesting. Innovation, not just cosmetic differences, in the body. :twothumbs


----------



## KDOG3 (Jan 17, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*

For the love of Pete, where are the pics of the M3 lights? Its day 3 already! C'mon I'm practically hemorraging here!


----------



## jac2001 (Jan 17, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



KDOG3 said:


> For the love of Pete, where are the pics of the M3 lights? Its day 3 already! C'mon I'm practically hemorraging here!


 

++++1


----------



## AA6TZ (Jan 17, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



KDOG3 said:


> C'mon I'm practically *hemorraging* here!


 
  :lolsign:
-Clive


----------



## dcjs (Jan 17, 2009)

Oh boy, that M3TL is quite something. I was quite sceptical about a giant TIR optic, but that thing has a nicer beam than any reflectored P7 I've ever seen. Tight and BIG hotspot with lots of punch and good spill, no donuts, rings or anything nasty like that. The M3L seems kind of redundant in comparison, same output but not nearly as nice a beam profile. 

Sorry, I'm at SHOT for work, not for copy-typing flashlight catalog specs.


----------



## Hitthespot (Jan 17, 2009)

Has there been anymore information on the LX1. Data....Pictures....anything. Did I miss it somewhere in the thread? I am extremely interested in an updated version of the L1. I hope the new version has optics and is pushing at least 120 SureFire Lumens. Ok, maybe I'm hoping for too much.

LX1. Now when I do a CPF search I will actually get something. lol :thumbsup:

Bill


----------



## dcjs (Jan 17, 2009)

LX1 output data is in the first post. It uses an optic (same as E-series I guess), and I was told the electronics have been moved to the head with a resistored tailcap that is supposed to just provide a signal to the electronics (?) to create a regulated low level, not drop it out of regulation.

The selector ring on the Vampire actually creates an excentric rotation of the heatsink, which puts either die of the two-die-led in the center of the optic. White light is plenty bright, IR is invisible to the eye.  Very unique design.

A2L seems to be using 3mm LEDs, AZ2 5mm, noticeable difference in the catalogue pictures.


----------



## Edog006 (Jan 17, 2009)

Wow I am dissapointed.. Surefire has scrapped the UB2 Invictus slated for 400 lumens on two CR123s and 3 Cree Q5's. Now the UB3 is is 3 CR123's and 350 lumens.. bigger light less power = totally bummed. If anyone hears anything else let us know


----------



## Edog006 (Jan 17, 2009)

I agree these new SF lights seem to be identical in performance to the E2DL with modified body styles.. I want my UB2 invictus.. sadly I dont think thats going to happen


----------



## carrot (Jan 17, 2009)

Please, repeat after me.

A light is not the sum of its specs.

I will not compare lights by their specs and specs alone.

I will not try to compare lights across brands based on manufacturer-provided specs.


----------



## SunStar (Jan 17, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



Federal LG said:


> Sunstar...
> 
> Did you see some 1xCR123 new Surefire lights ? Do you know the specs ?
> 
> Thanks!



I only played with the silver E1B because it caught me off guard. From the catalog, here's the line up of single cells.

T1A: 70 / 1 lumen; 4 / 60 hours;
Saint Headlamp: 100 / 10 / 1; 6/48/144 hours on 3 CR123's (capable of running on 1, 2, or 3 CR123's or Two AA's.)
Saint Minimus: 100 / 10 / 1 lumen; 1.5/15/50 hours on a single CR123
E1L: 45 / 3 lumen; 8.5 / 48 hours;
LX1: 80 / 10 lumen; 1.5/15 hours;
E1B: 80 / 5 lumen; 1.3 / 37 hours;
Hellfighter: 3000 lumens; 4 hours on a single cell(BA-5590 not a CR123)

Again, these are catalog numbers so take it for what its worth.


----------



## SunStar (Jan 17, 2009)

carrot said:


> Please, repeat after me.
> 
> A light is not the sum of its specs.
> 
> ...



Good point Carrot!! and very true!


----------



## SunStar (Jan 17, 2009)

Edog006 said:


> Wow I am dissapointed.. Surefire has scrapped the UB2 Invictus slated for 400 lumens on two CR123s and 3 Cree Q5's. Now the UB3 is is 3 CR123's and 350 lumens.. bigger light less power = totally bummed. If anyone hears anything else let us know



So did SF make an official statement regarding scrapping the UB2 / UB3? I missed it if they did. 

I had specific discussions with SF rep's at SHOT regarding both. They mentioned delay and regret for introducing the model last year and mentioned that supply production technology had to catch up a little to help them mass produce consistent performing lights. Maybe I just wasn't hearing it... I walked away with the feeling that the UB2 / UB3 were still concepts that SF was interested in developing but the supply side had to catch up or move forward a bit before it was practical for them to produce in mass.


----------



## flash_bang (Jan 17, 2009)

carrot said:


> Please, repeat after me.
> 
> A light is not the sum of its specs.
> 
> ...


True, if you applied this to incans, the M2 would be the exact same as a G2, because the body doesn't matter.


----------



## KDOG3 (Jan 17, 2009)

And someone please remember to ask Surefire reps when they expect the new lights - like the M3's - to be available!


----------



## shomie911 (Jan 18, 2009)

*Re: Surefire’s 2009 New Lights Discussion*

Wow, Surefire is certainly coming out with some really impressive lights. :twothumbs

I can't wait to grab a few!


----------



## bondr006 (Jan 18, 2009)

I've been on the SF pre-order list for a T1A Titan and a UA2 Optimus for a year now. I'm not holding my breath for anything from SF at this point.


----------



## zx7dave (Jan 18, 2009)

This thread seems a little light on pictures from what I have seen..here are a few from a website I found that is covering the SHOT Show...
http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u110/zx7dave/A2LEDAviator.jpg
http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u110/zx7dave/AZ2CombatLight2.jpg
http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u110/zx7dave/AZ2CombatLight.jpg
http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u110/zx7dave/LX2Lumamax.jpg




Over sized images change to links


----------



## claren (Jan 18, 2009)

Woooo, I need a few of those long, 2-way Backup-style clips. Really, really bad.


----------



## Monocrom (Jan 18, 2009)

zx7dave said:


> This thread seems a little light on pictures from what I have seen..here are a few from a website I found that is covering the SHOT Show...


 
Someone stole the checkering.

I'm thinking these are just prototypes, and that SF will bring back one of the best features that the company is known for.


----------



## zx7dave (Jan 18, 2009)

No idea if they are prototypes or not...would be nice if a CPF member at the show would be willing to upload some pic's.


----------



## woodrow (Jan 18, 2009)

I keep reading the threads... like everyone else... and I would be happy if SF simply made a 200+ lumen L5 or C2 type light with thier quality and erganomics. I do not need a bunch of fancy features. Just a good solid light with good erganomics and decent output. I can't believe that all of 2008 could not produce such a simple product!

I am (somewhat) excited by the hopes of a new M3 though. But I will not believe any hype until I actually see one.


----------



## iapyx (Jan 18, 2009)

woodrow said:


> I keep reading the threads... like everyone else... and I would be happy if SF simply made a 200+ lumen L5 or C2 type light with thier quality and erganomics. I do not need a bunch of fancy features. Just a good solid light with good erganomics and decent output. I can't believe that all of 2008 could not produce such a simple product!
> 
> I am (somewhat) excited by the hopes of a new M3 though. But I will not believe any hype until I actually see one.


 

I agree. 

In addition, a lot of SF lights have around 100 lumen as max output. A lot of us would be very happy with a 200 lumen light with 2 Cr123 (UA2) or 400 lumen(UB2). But a 350 lumen UB3 with 3xCr123 is just too big to EDC. For me, at the moment, there is no need for another 100+ lumen light next to the one I already have. 

So, when is Show Shot 2010? 
;0

i keep having good hopes that SF is still working on the UA2/UB2.


----------



## Mercaptan (Jan 18, 2009)

iapyx said:


> A lot of us would be very happy with a 200 lumen light with 2 Cr123 (UA2)




It already exists. It's called the E2DL. 

Just because SureFire doesn't say it isn't 200 lumens doesn't mean it isn't... many reports have said it is as powerful (if not more so) than the Fenix TK11 and definitely comparable to the Malkoff M60.


----------



## iapyx (Jan 18, 2009)

Mercaptan said:


> It already exists. It's called the E2DL.
> 
> Just because SureFire doesn't say it isn't 200 lumens doesn't mean it isn't... many reports have said it is as powerful (if not more so) than the Fenix TK11 and definitely comparable to the Malkoff M60.


 
Thanks for the info!
Although I like the U2 style more I will certainly have a look at the E2DL too.


----------



## carrot (Jan 18, 2009)

Personally, I like the new look. Count me in, although I haven't figured out what exactly I want. The M3TL sounds tempting but so does the Saint and A2L and AZ2. Maybe the LX2 even if it is as floody as the old model.


----------



## KDOG3 (Jan 18, 2009)

claren said:


> Woooo, I need a few of those long, 2-way Backup-style clips. Really, really bad.




YES. One of those on an E2DL would rock, with the tailcap it would be easy to yank it out of your pocket, or off your belt for immediate retina blasting usage.....


----------



## :)> (Jan 18, 2009)

Catalog pictures are moments away. I am uploading them now.

Carrot, 

You and JS can get ready to fall in love with the A2 all over again. It looks to have (4) 3mm LED's surrounding the Seoul main LED. Just what I wanted from Surefire! Now, if only they could figure out a way to put a metal button on it, JS would be in hog's heaven.


----------



## :)> (Jan 18, 2009)

You asked for pictures. Thanks to RadarGreg, I have a catalog and now you have pictures

[Oversize pics remove by Goatee]

I really like that they went with a lugged tail on the T1A! That was a fantastic choice in my opinion... and you know that my opinion is the correct opinion; there should be no further discussion on that subject:devil::nana:


----------



## Gary007 (Jan 18, 2009)

I'll take the LX1 and the Aviator for starters! 

(thanks for posting these pics)


----------



## KDOG3 (Jan 18, 2009)

YES. Finally! The L1 looks pretty good actually. I just don't like the high "low"setting with the short runtime. I'll probably end up buying one though! The M3 head really doesn't look that great but I'd have to see some real world pics to make a final decision on whether I want one or not. The M3TL looks really good though...


----------



## DM51 (Jan 18, 2009)

Interesting that they have combined some of the features of both the prototype Optimus and Invictus into the new UB3, giving it 8 selectable light levels (+ strobe + SOS).

Presumably there's a good possibility that the 3x CR123A body might take 2x 17500 cells, for a rechargeable option...


----------



## matt0 (Jan 18, 2009)

:)> said:


> You asked for pictures. Thanks to RadarGreg, I have a catalog and now you have pictures



THANK YOU!!


----------



## KDOG3 (Jan 18, 2009)

I can't tell from the pictures but is the UB3 an optic or reflector? That might be what I get instead of the M3 lights....


----------



## Monocrom (Jan 18, 2009)

:bow: : ) >

Hey, Surefire came out with another pen design.... reminds me of Rotring's "Core" line.


----------



## jac2001 (Jan 18, 2009)

Mercaptan said:


> It already exists. It's called the E2DL.
> 
> Just because SureFire doesn't say it isn't 200 lumens doesn't mean it isn't... many reports have said it is as powerful (if not more so) than the Fenix TK11 and definitely comparable to the Malkoff M60.


 
I took these last night for the other E2DL thread, https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/218750&page=3
thought they might be pertinant here as well.

Surefire E2DL 40yds...






Malkoff M60 40yds...





The main difference in the beams, other than the slight brightness difference of the Malkoff over the E2DL, is the spill. 

I really like the beam of my E2DL, so I can't wait to see the M3TL in action!!!

Thank you for the pics! I can quit hemorraging now!!!


----------



## KDOG3 (Jan 18, 2009)

Any idea what the T1A titan will cost?


----------



## Daniel_sk (Jan 18, 2009)

I will either get the M3LT or the UB3 if it can be run on rechargeables (2x17500 as DM51 already posted). I have a 2x18650 Leef body which should hopefully work with the M3LT. Now the waiting begins :shakehead (we will see them probably in mid-2009)


----------



## Gary007 (Jan 18, 2009)

i kinda like that knife also (bottom image)



Monocrom said:


> :bow: : ) >
> 
> Hey, Surefire came out with another pen design.... reminds me of Rotring's "Core" line.


----------



## iapyx (Jan 18, 2009)

DM51 said:


> Interesting that they have combined some of the features of both the prototype Optimus and Invictus into the new UB3, giving it 8 selectable light levels (+ strobe + SOS).
> 
> Presumably there's a good possibility that the 3x CR123A body might take 2x 17500 cells, for a rechargeable option...


 

I will be looking at this light, but darn it's long. Over 9 inches. Can't help thinking that skipping the UB2 (and UA2) is more a commercial choice than a technical one.


----------



## :)> (Jan 18, 2009)

I didn't get to attend the show, just the party afterword so I can't tell you first hand but I believe that the M3T LED will have an optic and that the M3 will have a reflector.

AWTYD saw the M3T and said it was mind blowing!


----------



## Size15's (Jan 18, 2009)

Goatee,
You're going to have to reduce the size of the images you're posted. Our rules are for images to be no larger that 800x800.
Whilst some people may enjoy the large images, not everybody has the luxury of a large monitor, or the connection speed to download such heavy content in a timely fashion.
You may like to link to each large image though but please reduce the image size so each dimension is less that 800 pixels.

Thanks
Al


----------



## DM51 (Jan 18, 2009)

Size15's said:


> You're going to have to reduce the size of the images you're posted. Our rules are for images to be no larger that 800x800.


Ahem.


----------



## Badbeams3 (Jan 18, 2009)

Looking at the UB3...say`s its finally HERE. I wonder what that means?


----------



## bondr006 (Jan 18, 2009)

Why has SF removed the knurling from its lights? I liked that Velcro grip feeling.


----------



## Hitthespot (Jan 18, 2009)

Thanks for the photo's of the new catalog. 

Interesting, the M3L is a smidge under one inch shorter than the UB3 yet both have 350 lumens. Plus the M3L has a simpler UI in my opinion. SureFire sure has made things much for difficult. Another thing is all of the new 2 cell replacements have 120 lumens, though I realize there are other differences between them. I will definitely need some hard reports on these new lights before I purchase. I won't be the first to own any of the new lights. I am also dissapointed they didn't give the LX1 more lumens. I was wanting something a little brighter than the Backup with the old L1 clip.

DM51, I hope your right about the UB3 taking two 17500's, wouldn't that be nice. Bernie will be happy if the new UB3 has all those rechargable options. 

Bill


----------



## Federal LG (Jan 18, 2009)

DM51 said:


> Ahem.






*Goatee*, thank you so much for uploading the pics! 
I just can´t believe that it wasn´t already uploaded! 
C´mon, we´re all flashaholics here!

Goatee, you are the man! :thumbsup:


----------



## Novaflash (Jan 18, 2009)

If I want to convert my M3/T body to one of the new 4 die led heads how will I access the different levels? Is it safe to assume the new tailcaps operate the same as the current L1/A2 tailcaps? 

Just wondering because I already have an M3 and would simply like to buy a replacement head. 

T1A and the UB3 are gonna be must haves for me. I just hope they come through with the UB3 this year. (fingers crossed)


----------



## KDOG3 (Jan 18, 2009)

Now we just need prices....I can feel the pain already....


----------



## Optik49 (Jan 18, 2009)

_AZ2 Combatlight _
_UB3 Invictus _
_M3LT combatlight _
_A2L white _


----------



## KDOG3 (Jan 18, 2009)

I wonder if the 3mm LED ring is accessible for mods, like that ring another CPF'er made that had different modes you could access. It would rock to have 2 of them be white (with longer low runtime of course!) and the other 2 be another color....


----------



## tsask (Jan 18, 2009)

KDOG3 said:


> Now we just need prices....I can feel the pain already....


 
I'll GUESS that A2LED to be around $225-$250 :shrug:USDollars.


----------



## Federal LG (Jan 18, 2009)

Hey... I´m particularly attracted by the new LX1. 

In the catalog they said:

_"We took the high output L1, put it in a smaller, smoother body, and made it even more powerful by updating the microprocessor *and the LED*."_



Anyone risk what new LED is there??

I just felt sorry with the lack of the "x-tra crispy" SF knurling.
And I hope it has the same tailcap of the regular L1. That´s genius, with the press for momentary, or twist for constant ON.


----------



## davidt (Jan 18, 2009)

*Re: Surefire’s 2009 New Lights Discussion*

Whats up with the lack of knurling?


----------



## houtex (Jan 18, 2009)

I'm posting this link to some pics of SS2009. There are some Surefire products about halfway down the page.
http://www.gunshowreview.com/SHOT_2009/SHOT_Show_2009_Day_Three.php


----------



## :)> (Jan 18, 2009)

Size15's said:


> Goatee,
> You're going to have to reduce the size of the images you're posted. Our rules are for images to be no larger that 800x800.
> Whilst some people may enjoy the large images, not everybody has the luxury of a large monitor, or the connection speed to download such heavy content in a timely fashion.
> You may like to link to each large image though but please reduce the image size so each dimension is less that 800 pixels.
> ...


 
I am working to do this right now and trying to keep from uploading all of the images again cause it took a long time. I just tried to resize the files in www.photobucket.com but it didn't work. 

If it becomes too problematic, can you please delete them and I will re-post them with the smaller sizes at some time later this evening?

Sorry for the sizes.


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## Size15's (Jan 18, 2009)

Can you convert the


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## Gary007 (Jan 18, 2009)

*photos provided by Goatee*, hosted by me.

for larger photos, click here
























































*I hope this is okay -- 600 x 800 *



:)> said:


> I am working to do this right now and trying to keep from uploading all of the images again cause it took a long time. I just tried to resize the files in www.photobucket.com but it didn't work.
> 
> If it becomes too problematic, can you please delete them and I will re-post them with the smaller sizes at some time later this evening?
> 
> Sorry for the sizes.


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## Size15's (Jan 18, 2009)

davidt said:


> Whats up with the lack of knurling?


SureFire appears to be trying a new approach to grip ergonomics. This styling allows rotational grip and I found when I tried out a UA2 proto-type, surprising level of retention grip in hand, without having the 'abrasive' knurling which can slow down the drawing and stowing of the flashlight in pockets and holsters etc.


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## Kiessling (Jan 18, 2009)

Goatee ... I love you ... thanx so much :kiss:


The difference between the A2L and the AZ2 is the size of the 4 additional LEDs and the brightness and runtime on low besides the difference in size?

Any more info about the ARC light? Does this one have a low level option? Rechargeable only?

bernie


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## TITAN1833 (Jan 18, 2009)

I noticed the T1A TITAN has high 70 lumens and low 1 lumen output,did the Ti version go lower than 1 lumen? :thinking:

Also I see the UB3 now has reflector can anyone confirm this?

BTW they have some very nice lights to consider this year :twothumbs


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## :)> (Jan 18, 2009)

Gary007,

Thank you for re-sizing and hosting the pics!


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## gsxrac (Jan 18, 2009)

Okay Ive allways liked Surefire but I must say ALOT of those lights appeal to me =) And thank you for posting pics guys!


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## davidt (Jan 18, 2009)

*Re: Surefire’s 2009 New Lights Discussion*



Size15's said:


> SureFire appears to be trying a new approach to grip ergonomics. This styling allows rotational grip and I found when I tried out a UA2 proto-type, surprising level of retention grip in hand, without having the 'abrasive' knurling which can slow down the drawing and stowing of the flashlight in pockets and holsters etc.



I guess I'll have to try out the new models to see how the new style compares to knurled models.


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## AA6TZ (Jan 18, 2009)

*Gary007* -- Thank you so very much for posting the new 2009 scanned images. Now I'm "stuck" having to choose between the M3LT and the Invictus (_both_ you say?).

-Clive


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## 276 (Jan 18, 2009)

Seeing those pics just made my day:twothumbs


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## Optik49 (Jan 18, 2009)

_I hate to ask but any idea of when any of these new models will be released._


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## Kiessling (Jan 18, 2009)

:hahaha:



Optik49 said:


> _I hate to ask but any idea of when any of these new models will be released._



:nana:


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## TBrogden (Jan 18, 2009)

For anyone who has seen the beam from the M3LT, does the optic completely eliminate the Phillips screwdriver-shaped dark spot caused by the multi-LED package?

Thanks!


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## gsxrac (Jan 18, 2009)

Yea now we just need an MSRP and and an actual release date and I might sleep a little better :ironic:


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## nosuchagency (Jan 18, 2009)

props to you gents for catolog images. :thumbsup:


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## jchoo (Jan 18, 2009)

I'm actually rather disappointed with the new offerings other than the A2L and V2L. I am a huge fan of the aggressive knurling, but I will reserve judgment on the new grips until I hold one for myself. I am quite disappointed that the UB was changed to a 3 cell light. I have a feeling that SF _could_ have gotten this light into the 500+ lumen range, but chose not to so they wouldn't compete with their own incandescent and HID offerings.


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## manoloco (Jan 18, 2009)

hmmm i dont like the way the clip obstructs the path of the twisty in the LX1, in fact in my actual L1 the clip is just below the lip of the tailcap, and i can feel the tip of the clip everytime i use the twisty, a bigger one is guaranteed to get in the way, and specially with less grip. possibly its because the short clip on the current L1 doesnt work as good as on the E1L, because of the weight and lenght, but if i had to choose a clipped L1 vs one without obtrusive clip, i would got for the latter, and i guess everyone can have that option if the clip is removable.

nice to see they went for the bezel up/down clip like the E1B.

i think the compromise between drawing speed and grip on the new design could be ok but like many said, it will have to be a try for yourself thing (as always)

how about an L1 that has the A2z concept head made for 1x123 cell?


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## jzmtl (Jan 18, 2009)

So basically what's the difference between az2 and a2l? They seem to have the same basic construction with 1 main led and 4 secondary led, and similar output.


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## Numbers (Jan 18, 2009)

The knurling, sadly, is gone, (it was beautiful and was a part of what made a SF a SF). Surely it was done for no other reason than to lower manufacturing cost. However, I guess that does not mean that the alternative cannot be as effective/functional.


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## cankster (Jan 18, 2009)

I sold my M6 immediately when I heard they were coming out with the invictus in 2008. LOL. It seemed like it had no place in a world where there was a 6.9", 8oz, 1-1.6" diameter, 400 lumem, output adjustable, led flashlight. Again LOL. I have a Novatac 120T for my single cell light, I wish it had the tailcap of a surefire where either by pushing or screwing in it would go from a low setting to the highest setting but besides that it is great. I have a Wolf Eyes Storm for my photon cannon, it was rated at 580 lumens and I thought the 400 lumen rating on the Surefire would have put it in competition. It is way to fat and heavy for my taste, and I hate its switch, but works well.

I have been dying to upgrade and by some new flashlights. I wouldnt have cared if the 2008 Invictus was $500-$600, I would have bought it. A new single cell light from surefire that took things up to the next level would have been bought immediatley. For personal use IMO Surefire has not come out with a noteworthy upgrade in the last 2 years. I had a L2 3-4 years ago that was 100 lumen. Now they are 120 lumen! Who cares. The new invictus at over 9" and almost 13oz makes me wish I had not sold my M6 at the beginning of this incompetent sleigh ride. I don't mean to be overly negetive but I am in a 2 year long fit of dissapointment topped off by the irritiation of my dream flashlight being replaced (if it ever comes out) by a 40% longer, 50% heavier, 13% dimmer stupid version of itself.

Just my 2 cents about what Surefire is doing.


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## edc3 (Jan 18, 2009)

:thanks::thanks: Gary007 and Goatee!


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## Size15's (Jan 18, 2009)

Numbers said:


> The knurling, sadly, is gone, (it was beautiful and was a part of what made a SF a SF). Surely it was done for no other reason than to lower manufacturing cost. However, I guess that does not mean that the alternative cannot be as effective/functional.


And people wonder why PK doesn't feel the need to throw a party of CPF members at SHOT Show this year 
The design has nothing to do with cost. Can you even support your opinion with evidence that the new design is cheaper than knurling?

Yes its different. Its innovative. SureFire have had well over a year to field-test the new concept and they've decided to use it on these high-profile new concepts.

I don't think it's possible to judge the change until you've tried it for yourself.


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## Federal LG (Jan 18, 2009)

Size15's said:


> SureFire appears to be trying a new approach to grip ergonomics. This styling allows rotational grip and I found when I tried out a UA2 proto-type, surprising level of retention grip in hand, without having the 'abrasive' knurling which can slow down the drawing and stowing of the flashlight in pockets and holsters etc.



I remember all the critics over Fenix lights, due to it´s lack of knurling to. 

Anyway, probably gonna get a *LX1*, if they release it this year... Do you know what kind of LED does it use, Al ?


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## Size15's (Jan 18, 2009)

jzmtl said:


> So basically what's the difference between az2 and a2l? They seem to have the same basic construction with 1 main led and 4 secondary led, and similar output.


The AZ2 is the addition of the A to the Z2[L].
The A2L is the addition of the L to the A2.

The bodies are different diameters with the AZ2 being standard (like the Z2) and the A2L being A-Series (like the A2). The bezels are different dimensions and the TailCaps are different. Of course the A2L as a PocketClip whereas the Z2 is a more pure CombatLight.
It's all about selecting the right tool for the job which is why SureFire offers a variety of models


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## Size15's (Jan 18, 2009)

Federal LG said:


> Anyway, probably gonna get a *LX1*, if they release it this year... Do you know what kind of LED does it use, Al ?


Sorry, I'm not interested in the kind of LED.


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## SPECTER6 (Jan 18, 2009)

I'm actually glad that the UB2 is now the UB3. It was never going to be an EDC for me so the extra length doesn't matter and I would imagine that 400 Lumens off of two cells would have probably only last 30 minutes at best. The extra cell plus knocking it down to 350 (like anyone can see the difference between 400 and 350 anyway) should really extended the high output run time. 

Now I have to decide if I want the M3TL instead. Is it resonable to assume that the TIR in the M3TL would be more efficient and have a longer regulated runtime?


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## Kiessling (Jan 18, 2009)

Aren't the LEDs in the A2L 3mm while they look like 5mm in the AZ2?

I really dig the AZ2. 

Again about that HID ... any more info?

bernie


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## Size15's (Jan 18, 2009)

Kiessling said:


> Aren't the LEDs in the A2L 3mm while they look like 5mm in the AZ2?


That would make sense in that the A2L bezel is smaller diameter.


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## Federal LG (Jan 18, 2009)

Size15's said:


> And people wonder why PK doesn't feel the need to throw a party of CPF members at SHOT Show this year



What´s the problem with critics ? They can´t handle them ?

I guess that´s the primary goal of a Flashlight Forum: talk about the "pros" and "cons" of yours beloved flashlights...


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## Federal LG (Jan 18, 2009)

Size15's said:


> Sorry, I'm not interested in the kind of LED.



Sorry to ask...

I didn´t asked if you were (or not) interested in it... 

I asked if you KNOW what kind of LED does it use, because you always knows a lot about Surefire, even about the non-released models.

Anyway, please forget that I asked that to you. :shakehead


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## Size15's (Jan 18, 2009)

Federal LG said:


> What´s the problem with critics ? They can´t handle them ?
> 
> I guess that´s the primary goal of a Flashlight Forum: talk about the "pros" and "cons" of yours beloved flashlights...


To be a critic of something; wouldn't it be better to try to understand it first before passing judgement?

I believe the primary goal of a discussion forum is for the community to develop and advance in understanding, knowledge, appreciation and fellowship.


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## pwx234 (Jan 18, 2009)

did anyone notice that all new sf models all have clip bezel down

its awesome 

can't wait to buy a one


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## Size15's (Jan 18, 2009)

Federal LG said:


> Sorry to ask...
> 
> I didn´t asked if you were (or not) interested in it...
> 
> ...


Trying to know too much about these proto-type concepts will just get us into the same mess we do every year when SureFire show off at SHOT Show.
SureFire use SSC LEDs in reflectors and Cree LEDs behind TIR optics. That's the general rule. 
Whether SureFire are still using the same LED when a product is actually released when there could be months and months gone by. SureFire have never given out the sort of LED detail many people here care about so asking such things of a proto-type concept light is unrealistic IMHO.


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## kongfuchicken (Jan 18, 2009)

Federal LG said:


> What´s the problem with critics ? They can´t handle them ?
> 
> I guess that´s the primary goal of a Flashlight Forum: talk about the "pros" and "cons" of yours beloved flashlights...



The theoretical advantage is that they provide fresh/different points of view which is often beneficial to manufacturers in weighing in their priorities when designing new products from the experience of providing old ones for a long time.

The real life problem is they are often uninformed/misinformed and not often enough genuinely interested in being informed rather than just wanting to get their opinions in without doing prior research which makes a formal interaction with them more of a waste of time than anything worthwhile.

It is perfectly reasonable for PK to feel that he doesn't need criticism this year since *most of his products are new and therefore no one really has any experience with them to possibly have any worthwhile criticism to offer* him.


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## Size15's (Jan 18, 2009)

My point wasn't about whether or not PK could take crictism. It was about whether CPF members respect him enough actually take a moment to actually listen to him. The vibe I had from the last couple SHOT Shows was that people attending PK's party were there for free beer, free food, and free SureFires.
CPF members haven't even seemed to notice the whole new range of flashlights he has designed and are being released.


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## Numbers (Jan 18, 2009)

Getting far afield now.
It's just my opinion that knurling costs more to produce than the new machining and that is at least in part why it is gone. No more no less.
I have no clue what that opinion might have to do with any party PK may or may not have. 

Perhaps we have a machinist here who could opine on the relative costs of producing the two types of machining.


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## cankster (Jan 18, 2009)

Somebody help me out here. What is the real upgrade from a 3-4 year old L2 to the 2009 (Prototype)? What is the upgrade for my Novatac I bought 2 years ago? I have money and want to upgrade bad, but in these two catagories of lights, I see no upgrade here. At least not with Surefire which is where I would rather spend my money.


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## txgp17 (Jan 18, 2009)

I walked through their booth at the Shot Show. I made sure to take my M60 equipped 6P. With the exception of the lights running a SSC P7, nothing they offered beat the beam quality of Gene's creations. Keep in mind I'm speaking strictly about the light output, not selectable stages or other features.

I stopped by the 4seven's booth and was blown away by the Tiablo A10. I really hoping Fenix, Malkoff, and NiteCore start offering a MC-E emitter real soon.


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## marinemaster (Jan 18, 2009)

I like the Vampire looks. From the pics it shows 2x123 and pocket clip and not much else.....any idea what else is there. 2 stages I am guessing....if u have any other specs let me know....


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## leon2245 (Jan 18, 2009)

Numbers said:


> Getting far afield now.
> It's just my opinion that knurling costs more to produce than the new machining and that is at least in part why it is gone. No more no less.
> I have no clue what that opinion might have to do with any party PK may or may not have.
> 
> Perhaps we have a machinist here who could opine on the relative costs of producing the two types of machining.


 

This was my thought when they changed from flats to rounded, that the latter is cheaper. I was informed the opposite is true, but both (round bodies/no knurling) look cheaper anyways. J.M.O.

I can do w.o knurling I guess. These new designs look pretty good. I'd replace my A2 with an A2L if it maintained a 3 lumen low like the original. Otherwise, disappointed with no INVICTUS after all this waiting!  I.D.K. about the three cell version(s).


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## baterija (Jan 18, 2009)

Size15's said:


> CPF members haven't even seemed to notice the whole new range of flashlights he has designed and are being released.



Whether he pops in here to read it...or maybe word gets to him :naughty: l want to say that I am impressed.

Frankly before this a lot of the SF catalog didn't excite me. Warranty and reliability were great but some of the designs seemed to be getting a bit long in the tooth. Then this news came out. My first thought was "WOW!"

There are huge changes coming in the utillity of their lineup to me. Lights that genuinely interest me for professional use. The Vampire series take direct aim at the issue of losing an effective IR illuminator with a filter/incan when switching to LED. It's also the only dual IR/white LED light I know of that doesn't rely on 3mm IR LED's for close range flood. The A2L and A2Z are great options that show more attention to functional detail than just ramming an LED into the A2. Redesigned bodies not for marketing and aesthetics but for improved ergonomics. A long list of changes overall that seem to be right on target for their core market (which is not a flashaholic walking the dog. ) Even the simple changes take work to make sure they can maintain reliability and effective production. It's been a busy year at SureFire it seems. Whether we like the changes or hate them, it's an impressive body of work to present for the new year.

Given that my mail yesterday makes me think an extended, all expenses paid business trip is in the near future, I am even more pleased. Before the new announcements the only SF that was probably going with me was my weapon light. Depending on the nature of my trip and when these lights come to market that may change.

Good work PK. :twothumbs


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## Sgt. LED (Jan 18, 2009)

On further examination the LX1 is a maybe, the A2L is a probably, the head of the M3TL is a sure thing. Surefire will get more of my money.

Federal LG, Size 15 is cranky most of the time IME.


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## gsxrac (Jan 18, 2009)

And really I know a LOT of people are dissappointed about the invictus and optimus not being out/released yet but at least now we all know why. This is a LOT of new stuff for Surefire to put into design at once ESPECIALLY if maaaaybe theyre planning on releasing it soonish. I really am impressed with all of the new designs and hey keep your heads up ppl, all that money you saved for the UA2 and UB2 you might be able to afford one or two (if your lucky) of these new lights:thumbsup:

And does it seem like the M3L and the UB3 share a lot of characteristics? Not saying that theyre twins by any means btu yea ya know lol


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## AlecGold (Jan 18, 2009)

Perhaps I didn't plan on any other lights than a UA2 just because it was a perfect match for my needs. 
And if SureFire did need such a lot of time designing other products than the UA2 and UB2 I would recommend them to stick to the plan and finnish first products first. 
I don't think SureFire works that way, but you do suggest something like that. 

The 2008 catalogue was promising so much usuable lights. 
Now the make some other lights with leds, like the M3TL and some aviators, that are no big deal to me. 
I don't use a light tactical, I want a do-everything-perfect-in-my-daily-life-light
and none of the lights shown at this shot show do such a thing. 

A lot of people can come out now and tell me we are no big market share, we don't make the cash-machine for SF make the ka-ching sound,
but I just don't like being told porkies as the summer 2008 orso, somewhere Q1 2009, just wait what the Shot Show 2009 will bring and all the other stories about when it could possibly arrive. 
Don't misunderstand me, if they make a concept, a prototype or something just to show off, I wouldn't mind it, i would be drewling all over it, respect the lead they have in technology and development
and "happily but impatiently" wait another year or so to see it emerging on the market. 
But if you state it in your catalogue as a product that's not smart to say the least. And after waiting year it would be good manners to tell you have a delay in production/development/etc.etc.etc. 
I'm not insane and I can understand if you are not perfect happy with one of your products that you don't want to release it yet. 
Just tell me, don't treat me as a 5 year old kid. 

I know, I'm being grumpy, but I'm really disappointed.


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## GarageBoy (Jan 18, 2009)

Real curious if the LX1 and LX2 heads are still E series compatible (well, semi compatible)


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## Size15's (Jan 18, 2009)

Sgt. LED said:


> Federal LG, Size 15 is cranky most of the time IME.


I'm English after all! :nana:


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## Bullzeyebill (Jan 18, 2009)

Size15's said:


> My point wasn't about whether or not PK could take crictism. It was about whether CPF members respect him enough actually take a moment to actually listen to him. The vibe I had from the last couple SHOT Shows was that people attending PK's party were there for free beer, free food, and free SureFires.
> CPF members haven't even seemed to notice the whole new range of flashlights he has designed and are being released.



Not the vibes I picked up last year, or in 2005. People there were serious flashaholics, interested in PK's demonstration, and having good fun. It was an honor for me to be there. Wonderful people to meet, who share a lot on CPF, including some of our great builders and modders. Don't think I saw any SF naysayers. I must add that I noticed that nobody has more fun at PK's parties than you, and I mean no disrespect. 

I hope that PK realizes that there are only a few disrespectul critics of SF here on CPF, compared to the many thousands of CPF'ers who do not present themselves in such a distastful manner.

Bill


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## Size15's (Jan 18, 2009)

Bullzeyebill said:


> Not the vibes I picked up last year, or in 2005... I must add that I noticed that nobody has more fun at PK's parties than you, and I mean no disrespect.
> Bill


None taken Bill - In fact it's a compliment. I'm British after all!  :drunk:


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## flash_bang (Jan 18, 2009)

Bullzeyebill said:


> Not the vibes I picked up last year, or in 2005. People there were serious flashaholics, interested in PK's demonstration, and having good fun. It was an honor for me to be there. Wonderful people to meet, who share a lot on CPF, including some of our great builders and modders. Don't think I saw any SF naysayers. I must add that I noticed that nobody has more fun at PK's parties than you, and I mean no disrespect.
> 
> I hope that PK realizes that there are only a few disrespectul critics of SF here on CPF, compared to the many thousands of CPF'ers who do not present themselves in such a distastful manner.
> 
> Bill


I feel kinda bad now  I didn't mean any harm, and I can see if SF decided that the UA/B2 isn't gonna work out. Stuff happens, so, while somewhat disappointing, there is gonna be other stuff. AND LOOK AT THE OTHER STUFF. The M3LT is basically amazing, and I REALLY hope they release just the head assembly. 

as for the stuff like the lack of knurling, I'm sure if I hold one of em it's gonna be practically baby-inducing, so I kinda doubt there will be much of a problem there  

Also, keep up the good work PK! We're rooting for you! (not that there's much competition...).

Cheers,
Flash


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## gsxrac (Jan 18, 2009)

Hold on lol I have no idea of how SF operates I was just offering my opinion on what they might have done. Although I would LOVE to know how SF operates


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## curlyfry562 (Jan 18, 2009)

These new lights from Surefire look an awful lot like the lights I just got from Milkysplit:

U2by2 ~ UB3
MX-813 ~ M3L

So I am sadly not as tempted by as many of these new offerings, but the A2L does look very nice. I will be interested to how the new grips work.


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## Long RunTime (Jan 18, 2009)

Great! SF has the M3TL upgrade for the M3T incan, I'm wondering if it also works wit the M6


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## StandardBattery (Jan 18, 2009)

I have no idea why PK would be upset by anything on CPF, it has a wide variety of members, with a wide variety of opinions. In the end SF only need look at sales. Since their two most exciting lights never even made it to market it's quite understandable many people would be less than positive about the company. I suspect their investors feel the same way. 

He got good feedback, the E1B and E2DL are good lights, people like them.

If you increase the price of your most popular products by 50% with no explanations you're not going to make your customers, who are also dealing with economic conditions, very happy. 

CPF??? He's probably more concerned about reduced defense spending, and investor sentiment. 

People here seem to credit SF for what they do well, but see no reason for them not to keep up with technology or to deliver what they promise. This is no different for any other company that pre-announces a product. I can think of hundreds of companies that have been treated exactly the same when they did not meet their customer expectations, when they were the ones who set those expectations. 

If they wanted to improve CPF relations (which is questionable), a Party would have been a pretty good way to do it, right after they explained what went wrong. A few beers and people forgive and forget a lot.

The truth is, the changing economic environment, the increased competition, and their own operational issues are their biggest challenges (or should be), and CPF is so far down the scale that it is likely they are focusing their priorities.

_All the above is MPO._ :shrug:


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## Size15's (Jan 18, 2009)

Long RunTime said:


> Great! SF has the M3TL upgrade for the M3T incan, I'm wondering if it also works wit the M6


That's a very good question. It would be a great shame if it couldn't be used on the M4 and M6 bodies. Time will tell I guess.


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## curlyfry562 (Jan 18, 2009)

Long RunTime said:


> Great! SF has the M3TL upgrade for the M3T incan, I'm wondering if it also works wit the M6



I don't see why it wouldn't work they are both 9v. As long as they didn't change the threads it should work.


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## Chris H (Jan 18, 2009)

Please excuse my ignorance here but could somebody kindly please explain the difference between the M3L and the M3TL as they appear different but have the same specs?

Thanks
Chris (Also British!)


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## Superdave (Jan 18, 2009)

that UB3 is Hot.. :huh: :twothumbs


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## Size15's (Jan 18, 2009)

Chris H said:


> Please excuse my ignorance here but could somebody kindly please explain the difference between the M3L and the M3TL as they appear different but have the same specs?
> 
> Thanks
> Chris (Also British!)


The M3 and M3T have the same output and runtime specs. The M3T has a TurboHead bezel (that's the "T" in the model number). The TurboHead bezel concentrates the light into a tighter beam for longer range illumination.

In this regard the proto-type concept LED bezels are no different.

Al


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## Jackal112203 (Jan 18, 2009)

I am actually looking forward to the E1B in natural HA...


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## Illumination (Jan 18, 2009)

Size15's said:


> None taken Bill - In fact it's a compliment. I'm British after all!  :drunk:



Sorry for the tangent, but your new Avatar is a variant of the logo of a new flashlight brand, Icon, isn't it? What happened to your Surefire loyalty?


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## Kiessling (Jan 18, 2009)

Illumination said:


> Sorry for the tangent, but your new Avatar is a variant of the logo of a new flashlight brand, Icon, isn't it? What happened to your Surefire loyalty?




Now that is a question worth exploring I guess ...


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## Size15's (Jan 18, 2009)

Illumination said:


> Sorry for the tangent, but your new Avatar is a variant of the logo of a new flashlight brand, Icon, isn't it? What happened to your Surefire loyalty?


Interesting... you tell me...


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## AzGB (Jan 18, 2009)

Size15's said:


> Interesting... you tell me...



Why? You could've just answered the question... :nana:


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## Lightguy27 (Jan 18, 2009)

276 said:


> Seeing those pics just made my day:twothumbs


 

:twothumbs Me too

A2L= Mine

LX2= Mine

T1A= Mine

UB3 or UA2 (whichever comes first)= Mine

This is going to be a good year...


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## Wick (Jan 18, 2009)

The M3L looks to have an L1 type tail switch. That is, push and get the low beam, push a little more and get the high beam. Does this means that if we just want to purchase the replacement bezel to update an old M3 we are going to need to purchase a new tail switch as well? Or will the old momentray switch from an M3 work with this new light?


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## jzmtl (Jan 18, 2009)

Wick said:


> The M3L looks to have an L1 type tail switch. That is, push and get the low beam, push a little more and get the high beam. Does this means that if we just want to purchase the replacement bezel to update an old M3 we are going to need to purchase a new tail switch as well? Or will the old momentray switch from an M3 work with this new light?


If it's the same mechanism L1 use then you'll just get high only instead.


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## bullfrog (Jan 18, 2009)

The offerings remind me of Rolls Royce's updated take on the classic phantom - its almost Frank Lloyd Wrightish. I love it.

I was scanning the posts but didn't see this asked:

Should we assume the 6Ps and C2s will be overhauled?

Sorry if this was already covered but I could not find it....


----------



## Tim B (Jan 18, 2009)

I noticed in the catalog pics that the 6P LED model was missing. I'm sure you didn't copy the whole catalog but does anyone know if the 6P LED model will still be offered this year or is discontinued?


----------



## Illumination (Jan 18, 2009)

Size15's said:


> Interesting... you tell me...



New British-owned company making cool lights?


----------



## Illumination (Jan 18, 2009)

Lightguy27 said:


> :twothumbs Me too
> 
> A2L= Mine
> 
> ...



I agree 100%; these are the ones I want. I thought the UA2 wasn't being made, though.


----------



## :)> (Jan 18, 2009)

The 6PLED will still be produced. I just took photos of the most interesting (to me at least) pages.


----------



## Size15's (Jan 18, 2009)

Illumination said:


> New British-owned company making cool lights?


There is no other possible explanation


----------



## carrot (Jan 18, 2009)

I think Size15's is so upset about the lack of the UA2 and UB2 from this year's show that he has switched his loyalties. :lolsign:


----------



## Bruce B (Jan 18, 2009)

Size15's said:


> There is no other possible explanation



I believe this might be a new light from Surefire...


----------



## Armed_Forces (Jan 18, 2009)

I don't know about the rest of you lugnutz, but this *by far* is the best lookin' thing I've seen presented from SHOT '09 so far...














​


----------



## Moka (Jan 18, 2009)

Careful how you hit that... Looks like she returns fire...


----------



## kongfuchicken (Jan 18, 2009)

Moka said:


> Careful how you hit that... Looks like she returns fire...



Sssnnnkkk... bahaahaha!


----------



## Armed_Forces (Jan 18, 2009)

Moka said:


> Careful how you hit that... Looks like she returns fire...




That's just the way I like it!! :devil:


:nana:


----------



## gsxrac (Jan 18, 2009)

I dont like a woman that carries more firepower than I do! Now back to flashlights before we get in trouble!!!


----------



## danpass (Jan 18, 2009)

Gary007 said:


> *photos provided by Goatee*, hosted by me.
> 
> for larger photos, click here
> 
> ...


 
Awesome, thanks


----------



## Armed_Forces (Jan 18, 2009)

ricehaterboi said:


> I dont like a woman that carries more firepower than I do! Now back to flashlights before we get in trouble!!!








​



There you go, FIXED to be "topical".


----------



## Illumination (Jan 18, 2009)

Size15's said:


> There is no other possible explanation



Nice. I've been checking their site every once in a while since someone leaked their new site somewhere on CPF. They have an interesting product....looks like it will do well. Am I imagining it, or is there a reflection of an eye on the logo?

But I digress from the purpose of this thread: Surefire lights. Did Surefire provide estimated launch dates at the booth? They probably have a better feel than last year; I can't imagine they want a repeat of last year's vaporware offering....


----------



## Mercaptan (Jan 18, 2009)

Illumination said:


> But I digress from the purpose of this thread: Surefire lights. Did Surefire provide estimated launch dates at the booth? They probably have a better feel than last year; I can't imagine they want a repeat of last year's vaporware offering....



At last year's show did they even have a fully working UA2 or UB2? I thought the UB2 was unfinished (poor reflector, etc.). I can only assume this bodes well as the A2L and AZ2 (which I personally have my eye on) look relatively complete and ready for production.

Also, how long can it really take for the production of the differently anodized E1Bs to occur?


----------



## gsxrac (Jan 18, 2009)

HAHAHAHA now THATS how ya do it. If only she were holding a Barret with a hellfire mounted or something of the sort:thinking:
p.s. Do you really think anybody will notice the light in the corner? theyll be too busy looking at other things in that picture... like the AK of course


----------



## txgp17 (Jan 18, 2009)

Long RunTime said:


> Great! SF has the M3TL upgrade for the M3T incan, I'm wondering if it also works wit the M6


At the Shot Show booth I overheard a Surefire rep say that it would. Correct me if I'm wrong but the M6 is a 9 volt light right? In that sense it's no different than an M3, except it can provide twice the amps.

I specifically asked about the M4, and the rep gave me an honest "I dunno" rather than trying to BS me.

My KL2 head operates to at least 14.8 volts (4 RCR123A's in series).


----------



## Taboot (Jan 18, 2009)

ricehaterboi said:


> I dont like a woman that carries more firepower than I do! Now back to flashlights before we get in trouble!!!



She's carrying an empty rifle and it looks like she couldn't find the trigger if it had a folded dollar bill taped to it. She's not carrying more firepower than anyone. She does look pretty nutty though, so best not to mess with.:nana:


----------



## kongfuchicken (Jan 18, 2009)

@mercaptain
Yeah they had working prototypes for the u2a but not u2b. I wouldn't be too disappointed if they did decide to go back to the drawing boards though; you would be royally ticked off if you bought one and found it to be subpar.


----------



## Fooboy (Jan 18, 2009)

Any idea on prices for these lights?

Mainly thinking:

LX1
LX2
UB3

Actually ... mainly interested in the LX2.


----------



## jzmtl (Jan 19, 2009)

*Re: Surefire’s 2009 New Lights Discussion*



Fooboy said:


> Any idea on prices for these lights?
> 
> Mainly thinking:
> 
> ...



Arm
Leg
First born baby

:sigh:


----------



## carrot (Jan 19, 2009)

*Re: Surefire’s 2009 New Lights Discussion*



jzmtl said:


> Arm
> Leg
> First born baby
> 
> :sigh:


:lolsign:

I could not help but crack up at that.


----------



## gsxrac (Jan 19, 2009)

Did anybody else notice in the AZ2 description the mention of a V85A holster?


----------



## Chrontius (Jan 19, 2009)

ricehaterboi said:


> Did anybody else notice in the AZ2 description the mention of a V85A holster?


yes - they may be upgrading their speedholster, I guess. 

The Vampire's neat, but I'm really hoping for something that can use the heterogeneous multi-die technology to give us RGBPhosphor or RGBAmber white. The A2Z looks really genuinely interesting, and would likely have been my first and only Surefire had it been out a couple years ago. That said, my feelings are mixed on upping the wide-beam output - I find myself reaching with depressing regularity for an Inova X5 with really dead batteries, or a 1xAAA Dorcy LED because the stock white Aviator is just too bright. Anyone done integrating sphere tests on that?


----------



## kromeke (Jan 19, 2009)

Not much to add, but as a machinist, I don't think knurling was jettisoned as a cost saving measure. If anything, Surefire seems more hellbent on showing off the capability of their CNC machine tools. They go for more complexity (machining wise) than less. I won't say this is good or bad, but it does make it difficult for companies with lesser resources from making look-alike copies.


----------



## dmz (Jan 19, 2009)

Pics of black T1A, saint headlamp here:

http://www.gunshowreview.com/SHOT_2009/Day_Three/images/00-01-17-09-0133.jpg


----------



## mega_lumens (Jan 19, 2009)

Would anyone know if AZ2 was inspired by law enforcement requests like the E1B was? Z2 was standard for the feds and wonder if they approached SF and asked for upgrades seeing all the LED technology available to light manufactures these days.


----------



## outersquare (Jan 19, 2009)

well hopefully SF releases actual products for sale soon at not too insane prices

last year their catalog was basically vaporware


----------



## Monocrom (Jan 19, 2009)

Size15's said:


> SureFire appears to be trying a new approach to grip ergonomics. This styling allows rotational grip and I found when I tried out a UA2 proto-type, surprising level of retention grip in hand, without having the 'abrasive' knurling which can slow down the drawing and stowing of the flashlight in pockets and holsters etc.


 
It still amazes me.... Apparently I'm the only one in the entire world who never had a single negaitive issue with Surefire's knurling.

In low-light scenarios, especially in conjuction with a handgun, the knurling doesn't affect the draw-stroke of an E-series light one bit. There's no slow-down at all. (Mainly due to the E-series clip making contact with one of the smooth portions of the body). 

Never had a single issue re-clipping the light, one handed, back into a pants pocket. I've also never experienced Surefires destroying my pants-pockets due to having real checkering, as opposed to tiny bumps that some other brands like to pass off as checkering.


----------



## Chris H (Jan 19, 2009)

Thanks Al for answer and explanation to my previous question.


----------



## Size15's (Jan 19, 2009)

kromeke said:


> Not much to add, but as a machinist, I don't think knurling was jettisoned as a cost saving measure. If anything, Surefire seems more hellbent on showing off the capability of their CNC machine tools. They go for more complexity (machining wise) than less. I won't say this is good or bad, but it does make it difficult for companies with lesser resources from making look-alike copies.


Creating and protecting your own style with design patents is one way to try to ensure that your brand remains distinctive in the plethora of imitations.

SureFire have never been one to shy away from using complex machining and showing of their CNC capability.


----------



## Federal LG (Jan 19, 2009)

Monocrom said:


> It still amazes me.... Apparently I'm the only one in the entire world who never had a single negaitive issue with Surefire's knurling.
> 
> In low-light scenarios, especially in conjuction with a handgun, the knurling doesn't affect the draw-stroke of an E-series light one bit. There's no slow-down at all. (Mainly due to the E-series clip making contact with one of the smooth portions of the body).
> 
> Never had a single issue re-clipping the light, one handed, back into a pants pocket. I've also never experienced Surefires destroying my pants-pockets due to having real checkering, as opposed to tiny bumps that some other brands like to pass off as checkering.



Agreed. 
The "x-tra crispy" knurling is one of the things that made a Surefire looks like a Surefire for me...


----------



## KDOG3 (Jan 19, 2009)

I can't tell by the pics if the T1A has a reflector or optic. Does it have a SSC or Cree? That black HA looks awesome. That may be my new one-cell EDC.....depending on the price of course....


----------



## Size15's (Jan 19, 2009)

KDOG3 said:


> I can't tell by the pics if the T1A has a reflector or optic. Does it have a SSC or Cree? That black HA looks awesome. That may be my new one-cell EDC.....depending on the price of course....


The T1A's I've seen have reflectors and SSC LEDs


----------



## KDOG3 (Jan 19, 2009)

Size15's said:


> The T1A's I've seen have reflectors and SSC LEDs




Excellent. I imagine the high setting at 70 Lumens is similar to the E1B and such.....


----------



## RogerRabbit (Jan 19, 2009)

Hello all,
I've got a stupid question.

The *LX2* description in the cataloque says... 

"*Two-stage switching: *Press for momentary on low beam, press further for momentary on high beam, twist for constant on low beam, twist further for constant on high beam."

Does that mean, that it goes to momentary high beam when I press the switch all in, or does that mean that I have to click thrue the modes like on a Fenix? :thinking: :shrug:

Thank you all!
Tom


----------



## KDOG3 (Jan 19, 2009)

There is no clicking with the LX1 or LX2. Its just a 2 stage pressure switch, probably the best switch Surefire ever came out with....


----------



## Petersen (Jan 19, 2009)

KDOG3 said:


> There is no clicking with the LX1 or LX2. Its just a 2 stage pressure switch, probably the best switch Surefire ever came out with....


 
+1 ... simply Brilliant, love the L1/L2/A2/K2 way of switching...


----------



## Kiessling (Jan 19, 2009)

Petersen said:


> +1 ... simply Brilliant, love the L1/L2/A2/K2 way of switching...




Dito. Thi sinterface is one of those inventions that really stand out. Brilliant covers it almost 
I hope they'll do more lights with this switch. Or the U2 collar. 

bk


----------



## jonesy (Jan 19, 2009)

I think the new A2L looks like the perfect new EDC (for me), especially after reading about the Lunasol 20, which also features a low flood and a high beam that can throw a bit. Count me in, I've got a birthday coming up, which sounds like a good reason to buy. Love the looks of the new lights as well. 

Here's to hoping that they actually release what they advertise this year. :laughing:


----------



## Outdoors Fanatic (Jan 19, 2009)

This is going to be a VERY expensive year to us Flashaholics.


----------



## trailblazer (Jan 19, 2009)

Per phone call to SF the UB3 will be available mid July no price set so it may be another year of looking at catalogs.


----------



## iapyx (Jan 19, 2009)

Outdoors Fanatic said:


> This is going to be a VERY expensive year to us Flashaholics.


 
not for me


----------



## TITAN1833 (Jan 19, 2009)

trailblazer said:


> Per phone call to SF the UB3 will be available mid July no price set so it may be another year of looking at catalogs.


ye who have little faith,I'll mark July 15th on my calender  oh wait!! did they confirm the year 2009?


----------



## RogerRabbit (Jan 19, 2009)

Thanks all,

I guess my old E2E and 6P will have to stay in service unthil the LX2 hits the market in 6 to 12 months or so. 
I definitely have to have one of those.


----------



## RobertM (Jan 19, 2009)

*Re: New Surefire LED lights at SHOT*



Shawn L said:


> Only the A2L is in the catalog, but the A2 is still in the Technical Specifications area in the back.



Out of curiosity, does the normal A2 that is in the tech specs still look like the current one, or does it look like it is being updated to the new non-knurling body?

Thanks,
Robert


----------



## AlecGold (Jan 19, 2009)

Outdoors Fanatic said:


> This is going to be a VERY expensive year to us Flashaholics.



Not for this one, although I might take a stroll to McGizmo for a nice Ti light.
Had one once, but still regret that I sold it.


----------



## KDOG3 (Jan 19, 2009)

RogerRabbit said:


> Thanks all,
> 
> I guess my old E2E and 6P will have to stay in service unthil the LX2 hits the market in 6 to 12 months or so.
> I definitely have to have one of those.





Nah, I don't think the LX1 and LX2 will take that long to hit the market, followed by the A2L, A2Z shortly after....now the UB3 and M3 LEDs' on the other hand, I'm not holding my breath on....


----------



## gsxrac (Jan 19, 2009)

Outdoors Fanatic said:


> This is going to be a VERY expensive year to us Flashaholics.




LOL my thoughts EXACTLY I had cleared only buying 2 flashlights a month as my new years resolution and the gf had agreed but now that 5 of the new lights I want are SF's with my income it might be a little closer 1 a month or maybe 1 every 2 months lol


----------



## Optik49 (Jan 19, 2009)

_Plenty of time, they probably won’t be out until December 2009 and then they will say, they decided not to release them. LOL_


----------



## marinemaster (Jan 19, 2009)

I say SF better deliver on these lights, they failed miserably on the lights they showed last year. I need to justify the price increase I had to pay for the E2L, they better be using that money for R&D


----------



## manoloco (Jan 19, 2009)

After looking at the LX1 with the clip in the way of the twisty, i think they must have improved the twisty operation, requiring less turning making it possible to use the twist without being bothered by the clip. 
This would be on the same path of thinking on how they chose the fluting instead of knurling, fast to draw AND operate.

The current L1 has to be turned about 1/4 of a circle to go from low to high, translated this is twisting with your fingers TWICE, too much to be quickly operated, if they can reduce it to a comfortable short single twist without making it prone to accidental mode change it will be very good.


----------



## Brizzler (Jan 19, 2009)

Intensive analysis of the catalogue...
I have noticed with interest that both the LX1 and LX2 are shorter than their predecessor models, certainly a good thing for the 2-cell light :twothumbs, not so sure in the case of the 1-cell 

Apparently the LX1 is a little heavier than the current Cree L1 :shrug:


----------



## Kiessling (Jan 19, 2009)

While intensively studying the catalog ... could you have a look at the HID and tell us a bit more? 
Thanx!
bernie


----------



## cankster (Jan 19, 2009)

iapyx said:


> I agree.
> 
> In addition, a lot of SF lights have around 100 lumen as max output. A lot of us would be very happy with a 200 lumen light with 2 Cr123 (UA2) or 400 lumen(UB2). But a 350 lumen UB3 with 3xCr123 is just too big to EDC. For me, at the moment, there is no need for another 100+ lumen light next to the one I already have.
> 
> ...



Agreed, maybe they will produce something worth upgrading to by 2011-12. Perhaps even increase the brightness of a flashlight or something. Crossing my fingers.


----------



## Brizzler (Jan 19, 2009)

Kiessling said:


> While intensively studying the catalog ... could you have a look at the HID and tell us a bit more?
> Thanx!
> bernie



I'm only using the link I found above! 

Regarding HIDs, the Arc series is mentioned but no details are shown in the scanned pages.


----------



## Outdoors Fanatic (Jan 19, 2009)

Kiessling said:


> While intensively studying the catalog ... could you have a look at the HID and tell us a bit more?
> Thanx!
> bernie


*+1!*

That Arc Light is by far my most desired piece of illumination gear, ever.


----------



## KDOG3 (Jan 19, 2009)

Anyone have any info on that new smaller Surefire knife and pen? That smaller knife looks to have a seatbelt cutter blade on it.


----------



## Outdoors Fanatic (Jan 19, 2009)

KDOG3 said:


> Anyone have any info on that new smaller Surefire knife and pen? That smaller knife looks to have a seatbelt cutter blade on it.


+1

I'm extremely interested in that knife as well.


----------



## bigfoot (Jan 19, 2009)

Thanks for the photos of the new catalog!

Oh man, here I was, I thought I had pretty much all the lights I needed. That A2L looks pretty good!!


----------



## litetube (Jan 19, 2009)

So.....even though these were shown at Shot and they are in the '09 catalogue we may not see anything for quite sometime? as in weeks/months? or could they be on their way as we speak to dealers?
It seems as if lights are the opposite of cars and other products. With cars the next year modles come out while we are still in the current year but with lights the newest models come out closer to the end of the year or at least halfway thru


----------



## Gary007 (Jan 19, 2009)

I'm a newbie when it comes to the releasing of Surefire lights. Which dealer is most likely to carry them first? Or will the fastest way be to order from SF direct? What's been the trend?


----------



## nzbazza (Jan 19, 2009)

Can someone please post a pic from the '09 catalogue of the new Minimus/Minima 1xCR123 headlamp.


----------



## Outdoors Fanatic (Jan 19, 2009)

Gary007 said:


> I'm a newbie when it comes to the releasing of Surefire lights. Which dealer is most likely to carry them first? Or will the fastest way be to order from SF direct? What's been the trend?


Battery Junction and Optics HQ are usually pretty darn fast in offering the latest gear from SF.


----------



## Federal LG (Jan 19, 2009)

*Battery Junction* dot com! :thumbsup:


----------



## a99raptors (Jan 19, 2009)

Can't wait to get my hands on some of these great new Surefire lights myself! The lineup looks really good! Now I can dream of carrying 350 lumens around with me


----------



## Loomy (Jan 19, 2009)

Outdoors Fanatic said:


> This is going to be a VERY expensive year to us Flashaholics.



lol give me a break. probably hundreds of people were expecting 2008 to be an expensive year. lets hope they can get their UA2 and UB2 "pre-order" money back without a hassle.


----------



## Centropolis (Jan 19, 2009)

Wow I am very excited about the new SF offerings. I am going to open my financial budget spreadsheet now and revise it "just a little". 

I am definitely interested in the LX1 and the new M3L and M3LT.


----------



## Moka (Jan 19, 2009)

nzbazza said:


> Can someone please post a pic from the '09 catalogue of the new Minimus/Minima 1xCR123 headlamp.


 
+1


----------



## munchs (Jan 19, 2009)

Centropolis said:


> I am definitely interested in the LX1 and the new M3L and M3LT.


 
+1:thumbsup:


----------



## Outdoors Fanatic (Jan 19, 2009)

Loomy said:


> lol give me a break. probably hundreds of people were expecting 2008 to be an expensive year. lets hope they can get their UA2 and UB2 "pre-order" money back without a hassle.


You do know that SureFire wasn't the only company selling flashlights back in 2008, right? It doesn't matter that lots of products weren't released though, given the fact that I still do not own every SureFire available, I still have a lot of "oldies" to buy for many years ahead... Having said that, I have no doubts that 2009 is going to be a painfully expensive year to me and to a lot of other Flashaholics as well.


----------



## Outdoors Fanatic (Jan 19, 2009)

munchs said:


> +1:thumbsup:


*+2*

The M3TL is already locked on my radar.


----------



## Monocrom (Jan 19, 2009)

a99raptors said:


> Can't wait to get my hands on some of these great new Surefire lights myself! The lineup looks really good! Now I can dream of carrying 350 lumens around with me


 
If Surefire would bother to make a holster for the M6, your dream (along with 150 more lumens) would become a reality.


----------



## Outdoors Fanatic (Jan 19, 2009)

Monocrom said:


> If Surefire would bother to make a holster for the M6, your dream (along with 150 more lumens) would become a reality.


Hey! Who said you need a holster to carry a flashlight!?


----------



## :)> (Jan 19, 2009)

There are 2 models of new HID lights and both have rechargeable LiIon battery packs. It looks like one of the models is 2800 lumens and runs off of 12 CR123's or the longer LiIon battery pack. The other model looks to have 2 levels of output and a selector ring to switch levels. The levels are 2800 or 5000 lumens and it only runs off of a rechargeable LiIon battery pack.


----------



## Monocrom (Jan 19, 2009)

Outdoors Fanatic said:


> Hey! Who said you need a holster to carry a flashlight!?


 
I'm trying to find a pocket-carry clip for my M6.... No luck so far.


----------



## 276 (Jan 19, 2009)

Monocrom said:


> I'm trying to find a pocket-carry clip for my M6.... No luck so far.




 Let me know if you find one!


----------



## Art Vandelay (Jan 19, 2009)

Monocrom said:


> I'm trying to find a pocket-carry clip for my M6.... No luck so far.


A place to attach your keychain would be handy too.


----------



## rtt (Jan 20, 2009)

Some 2009 SureFire lights (????) are available on ebay.

http://stores.shop.ebay.com/hobbies-store__W0QQ_armrsZ1QQ_fsubZ600002010

I do not know if SureFire owns this off shore company or not. If anyone knows for sure, please post.


----------



## Bruce B (Jan 20, 2009)

I have a thread regarding the Surefire (?) Icon Flashlights here.

https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/219946


----------



## Art Vandelay (Jan 20, 2009)

rtt said:


> Some 2009 SureFire lights (????) are available on ebay.
> 
> http://stores.shop.ebay.com/hobbies-store__W0QQ_armrsZ1QQ_fsubZ600002010
> 
> I do not know if SureFire owns this off shore company or not. If anyone knows for sure, please post.


I doubt anything you find on Ebay at this point will be real.

Edit - It might be real. See later posts in this thread.


----------



## onenate (Jan 20, 2009)

I just tried to look at surefire.com and the site is off line for "updates". Does this mean we might see some official content about the new line of light?
nate  or not :mecry:


----------



## Art Vandelay (Jan 20, 2009)

Bruce B said:


> I have a thread regarding the Surefire (?) Icon Flashlights here.
> 
> https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/219946


Cool. I learn something new everyday here.


----------



## gsxrac (Jan 20, 2009)

Im thinking the same way as onenate


----------



## 276 (Jan 20, 2009)

onenate said:


> I just tried to look at surefire.com and the site is off line for "updates". Does this mean we might see some official content about the new line of light?
> nate  or not :mecry:



Yeah your right i hope they put some some of the new lights on there.


----------



## Moka (Jan 20, 2009)

276 said:


> Yeah your right i hope they put some some of the new lights on there.


 
I haven't been here that long... How long does it normally take after SHOT for the catalogue to be uploaded onto their site and/or the products window updated??


----------



## Chrontius (Jan 20, 2009)

KDOG3 said:


> And someone please remember to ask Surefire reps when they expect the new lights - like the M3's - to be available!



A2L is due out May 31, as I called to request a new clip today


----------



## ja10 (Jan 20, 2009)

I wonder if this means that new lights are being added ...


----------



## DaFABRICATA (Jan 20, 2009)

Chrontius said:


> A2L is due out May 31, as I called to request a new clip today


 

They didn't specify the year did they


----------



## Bruce B (Jan 20, 2009)




----------



## Bruce B (Jan 20, 2009)

Ok... now Surefire needs to bring back their website... I'm getting excited just waiting...


----------



## gsxrac (Jan 20, 2009)

I was ready to go to bed till I saw the Surefire website was "down" then I went to Battery Junction and noticed the Optimus is still slated for spring 09 and was $260ish I think but the Invictus has no info, no due date, no preorder and a price set at $99,999 lol (dont know if this is old news im slowly catching onto?)


----------



## gsxrac (Jan 20, 2009)

ITS BACK!!!


----------



## Monocrom (Jan 20, 2009)

ja10 said:


> I wonder if this means that new lights are being added ...


 
Oh look, Surefire still lists an email address. That's hilarious!


----------



## 276 (Jan 20, 2009)

I guess this means no one is going to sleep tonight while waiting to see if there adding lights to the site or just regular updates.


----------



## gsxrac (Jan 20, 2009)

No new lights, no new pens, no new knives, but the X400 is there (has it been there all along?)


----------



## Bruce B (Jan 20, 2009)

ricehaterboi said:


> No new lights, no new pens, no new knives, but the X400 is there (has it been there all along?)



There's 2 new colors for the pens. There's a Blue pen and a Tan pen.

Now come on Surefire... Post some new lights.


----------



## gsxrac (Jan 20, 2009)

Yea but from the catalog pics it looks like they actually have a new model of pen also.


----------



## Bruce B (Jan 20, 2009)

Sad thing is they haven't updated their True Stories contest winners in a long time either.


----------



## 276 (Jan 20, 2009)

In the catalog pictures posted it looks like they have two new knives.


----------



## gsxrac (Jan 20, 2009)

Hey they did update the stories! thats the first thing I noticed. When the site opened it said "one winner used his U2 to silence a disruptive moviegoer!" (thought it was friggin hilarious but dont know if it really is new?)


----------



## carrot (Jan 20, 2009)

Moka said:


> I haven't been here that long... How long does it normally take after SHOT for the catalogue to be uploaded onto their site and/or the products window updated??


Until their dealers have them in stock.


----------



## ja10 (Jan 20, 2009)

ricehaterboi said:


> Hey they did update the stories! thats the first thing I noticed. When the site opened it said "one winner used his U2 to silence a disruptive moviegoer!" (thought it was friggin hilarious but dont know if it really is new?)



It's old.


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## 276 (Jan 20, 2009)

Dang nothing new on the site.


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## gsxrac (Jan 20, 2009)

Still hilarious though I wanna see some lights! Im completly broke right now and have no money for more lights this week but id love to see some beamshots =)


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## Armed_Forces (Jan 20, 2009)

276 said:


> Dang nothing new on the site.




..the most exciting thing Surefire has released so far is over HERE 

:devil:


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## 276 (Jan 20, 2009)

thanks anyway, I already spotted that that does look neat though.


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## Bruce B (Jan 20, 2009)

Armed_Forces said:


> ..the most exciting thing Surefire has released so far is over HERE
> 
> :devil:



I'd prefer to see some REAL SUREFIRE BLING though... _Surefire_


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## woodrow (Jan 20, 2009)

My M3 timeline

Hear about it: (rumers...pics...more rumers...delays etc.
Now - August or more likely November.

Read a a couple of reviews...and wait to see them instock so I can buy one--- December - January

Have one in my hands...January - February 2010.

I guess I understand why I feel less excitment than I was hoping to feel.


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## Armed_Forces (Jan 20, 2009)

Bruce B said:


> I'd prefer to see some REAL SUREFIRE BLING though... _Surefire_



*+1* 

Me too!!!


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## outersquare (Jan 20, 2009)

the surefire website is back and it looks the same


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## Monocrom (Jan 20, 2009)

outersquare said:


> the surefire website is back and it looks the same


 
I'm hope to buy an A2L, M3L, or UB3 before my Birthday rolls around.... in 364 days. 

But that's up to Surefire.


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## DM51 (Jan 20, 2009)

This thread is now very long, so we'll continue in Part II here...


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