# LuxLuthor's Most Powerful Maglite Mods List



## LuxLuthor

This is my personal ranking, which I update from time to time. These do not yet include the Osram IRC 50W & 65W and other bulbs. I moved my post out of this topic location which was getting a bit long.

_*Please note:* Based upon my destructive bulb testing, these Lumen claims are using an outdated, innacurate AWR spreadsheet that does not reflect real, verified lumen numbers...so at best use these rankings as relative comparisons to each other. In other words, if I say the "MaxBlaster" puts out 4400 (bulb) Lumens, that is not turning out to be a "real" lumen number. It is a case of everyone agreeing upon the spreadsheet predictive values, akin to the "Emporor Has No Clothes" fable.

_

*1)**Sylathnie*'s* Sublimator* Osram 64663 36V 400W with *10s Emoli 18650 cells *in Elephant-II with FM 2.5" Turbo Head.




*2)* *Mrartillery's "Dominator" *Osram 64656 275W with 7s IMR 27500 cells in a Mag 6D with FM3-X Head. Should be around 13-14,000 Lumens.


*3)* LuxLuthor's *Vaporizer. *Using Osram 64657 250W & 8s Emoli 18650 in Elephant with 60mm extension tube. Has balance charging plugs. Destructive testing data here. 


*4)* LuxLuthor's *HyperBlaster*. This uses FiveMega's Chrome Elephant with extender body, and holds 3 stacks of the new Elite 1700mAh AA cells welded into a single pack. 10A side switch replaces stock Mag switch. Overdriving the Osram 250W 64655 bulb. 21 cells of Elite's new AA raw power....Oh yeah. It's bright.:naughty: 


*5) *Mac's 250w* Elephant* using 20 x 2/3A Elite NiMH Osram 24v 250w 64655 bulb at 10K L (?) 


*6)* Osram 150W *64633 at 16.8V* (ideally with new AlanB/JimmyM regulator). I just added this based solely upon my destructive testing, but have not made a working light with this due to the 50 Hr rated bulb life, and high liklihood of flashing the bulb with most battery combinations. If you can set a regulator to 16.8V, it should fit into this ranking. 
 


*7)* LuxLuthor's *"DeathBlaster" *. Uses 16 x 2/3A NiMH cells in a 3D light charged to 22V off the charger with a 90W Osram 64458-S that has a tubular filament, so with FM3H-2, it gives an exquisite hotspot. Jimmy talked about this bulb and said using AWR's re-rating formula it came out to 175-200W's 


*8)** "MaxBlaster"* which uses the same *Osram 64623 100w* bi-pin bulb as Mac's Torch, but has one added battery, giving it 15.6V to drive the bulb even further. It is slightly brighter and hotter than Mac's Torch, at about 4400 L. It is also more available from Mad MaxaBeam at the present time. 


*9)* *Mac's* legendary *Torch *which is of Uber-Quality, and has the switch in the tailcap. Uses the *Osram 64623 100w* bipin bulb, and 14.4V NiMH battery pack. About 4100 L. Sadly, he rarely makes these now. It is the subject of a YouTube paper burning video that has had 270,000 viewings to date!!! 


*10) **Ginseng*'s Legendary and beautiful *Aurora/Aurora 2*. One of the most beautifully made lights I have seen, made by one of the "Grandfather's of CPF" _(I put Newbie, js, bwaites and a few others in that rarified category)_. Reading his post reminds us of how much love and attention can be put into projects like this. He even worked on the finish by buffing and had wet-sanding before having it nickel plated. *This was made way back in 2003* using the 64623 & GP2000 4/5A cells, and a 10A rocker switch. It screams "custom made" but looks better than 95% of any lights out today. Likely puts out the same as Mac's Torch. 


*11) The USL mod* (search for it), and *Mad MaxaBeam's Maglite* like above MaxBlaster that uses a 13.2V battery pack with the *Osram 64625 or 62138 100W bulbs*. It is a whiter, and cleaner bulb than the 64623, but not as bright, not as hot, and not able to be driven with the higher voltage. 


*12)* The *64430 35W 6V* *bulb* overdriven to 9.8 or 9.9V gives about *1800 bulb lumens*. Best to have a regulated drive with soft starting. Wonderful solution to a smaller light. Because it needs about 9.5 to 10A of current you should look at powering this with either the new A123 or Emoli safe Lithium chemistries, or a NiMH high output pack using cells such as the Elite 2/3A or 1700mAh AA's. I have a large supply of the authentic Osram 64430 bulbs that are no longer made. 


*13)* *FiveMega's Carley 43W bulb *that they custom made for him and gives about *1500+ bulb lumens*. I power this with 2p4s of 14670 AW Li-Ion cells without regulation, and it is amazing. 


*14)* The legendary *Philips 5761 30W 6V bulb* overdriven to about 7.2V Many have used this bulb in C size Mags with 2 x AW C Li-Ion cells, but it requires about 5.5A, so it is close to tripping his protection circuit. Again ideal for a regulated driver with soft start. The Emoli 26700 or 18650 are alternate battery sources. Works out to about 1400+ lumens. 


*15)* the *1164 WA Bulb* being overdriven by FiveMega's Maglite mod to 9.6V. It is not as bright as the 43W bulb, despite it being promoted as 1500L on this GB thread. An excellent light, and clearly brighter than the 1185. To my comparison, this is also not as bright as the Philips 5761. Perhaps if it is used in a regulated scenario it would be a bit brighter. 


*16)* The legendary *WA-1185 Maglite*, that can be in any size as long as you have the Voltage in the 11-12.2V range. This link is using Li-Ions (11.1V) is about 1300 L. However this link is using 9 NiMH that gives 10.8V for about 1200 L. 


*17)* Adding the *SureFire M6* (with higher output MN21 bulb) in this position, but it is a more flood spot than focussed WA bulbs above and below this ranking. As a result, their small hotspots are brighter than the larger M6 spot. There are other mods using different bulb setups which can be compared in this thread. 


*18)* I think it is a tie at around 900 L between the *WA-1111* overdriven to 7.4V here, and the *WA-1166* overdriven to about 12.55 V shown here. My personal preference between these two because of the beautiful white beam, is the 1166. Killer light in a 1D regulated 4x14500 or 14670 Li-Ion cells, with Hotdriver set at 12.58V which gives a killer, very white 1166 hotspot. 


*19)* *ROP* using a potted *Pelican 3854-H* which is a 24W bulb (larger one that has pointed tip), powered by 2 x AW C Li-Ions in a 2C. Just tested this with freshly charged Li-Ions that measured 8.2V in bulb socket. No resistance fixes done. I did attach a lead to the tailcap spring and making contact with side gave me 4.1A. Recent *3853-H* was also tested in Destructive thread. 


*20) *The FiveMega custom Carley *CL-1794* 7V driven with 2 x 18650 Li-Ion cells in a D-26 small tube form factor. Shootout views here, and discussion in my Destructive Tests thread. 


*21) **The WA-1331* overdriven by 3xLi-Ions at 11.1V to give about 700 L. These are beautiful and very white bulbs in a nice, compact size. I have seven of these FiveMega lights in various models. Again this would be brighter with a soft starting regulated setup. 
*
Updated 3/1/13*


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## LuxLuthor

Reserved for bulb/voltage/current testing next week with Mastech HY3020D. AKA: Bulb Flashing For Fun


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## DM51

A bump for this very useful thread - good to have all the info here, away from the other thread. 

You show in your list:

Host configuration
Bulb type
Power pack type
Vbatt
Lumens (bulb & torch)
It would also be useful to show the current draw of these individual bulbs, to save people having to look this info up elsewhere or work it out with the hotrater etc.


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## LuxLuthor

Yeah, I agree. 

I am supposed to get the Mastech HY3020-D late this week, and I'm thinking of using AW's new D (unregulated) Driver as a platform (out of the Maglite--to try and give a standard bulb holder that people can compare to) which will tell me at a particular voltage exactly how many amps the bulb is drawing....so "weak" batteries or various resistance of mixed Maglite setups will not be an issue.

The problem with AWR's Hotrater is for the most part he uses the formulas that were taken from the WA website, with a little adjustment for various Ohm assumptions. 

My goal is to test the bulbs at what is supposed to be the ideal Voltage (this Mastech will supply however many Amps the bulb wants, and with its soft starter I should be able to get some useful real world readings. This is also important for specifying Voltages to set up once AW comes out with his REGULATED D Driver, for a given bulb.

Once I see how the bulb looks at the AWR Hotrater "Ideal" voltage, I am thinking of slowly climbing up the voltage until bulb flashes...which will be useful information. I may have my Meterman light meter in play at a fixed distance to get some objective comparison between bulbs in some sort of bounce reading.


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## DM51

That will be EXTREMELY useful info to add here. Lol I'm hopeless with the hotrater - it usually throws up weird results when I try to enter anything new. 

I have found Mdocod's formulas very useful too.

EDIT: The hotwire info in this old thread needs updating too, although it might better just to incorporate the results here.


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## ExZeRoEx

Just wondering, would I have better luck with some ROP bulbs or WA 1111s in a 2C mag with 2 18650s in them? Output and runtime wise, because I don't really know the voltages on AWs protected cells.


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## Pyzon

Thanks for the fine compilation of totally useful information, Lux !

I'm patiently waiting for AW's regulated switch for C hosts to see what the 5761 run time will be on 3 of his cells. What voltage setting would you suggest as a happy medium of bright and fair bulb life ?

Thanks again for your hard work that we all benefit from.


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## petrev

Pyzon said:


> Thanks for the fine compilation of totally useful information, Lux !
> 
> I'm patiently waiting for AW's regulated switch for C hosts to see what the 5761 run time will be on 3 of his cells. What voltage setting would you suggest as a happy medium of bright and fair bulb life ?
> 
> Thanks again for your hard work that we all benefit from.



Note: The AW regulated driver will be D Mag size ! ! !

Cheers Pete


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## cat

Another good Maglite mods thread. An interesting list. What would be _really_ good would be one or two of those links leading to a lists of components and _where to get them_, and if they're still available. 
I think I've been searching and reading for...well, I'm suffering from lack of sleep, so I don't really know, but it's about 10-14 days, and I still haven't got one organized.


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## Patriot

Ah...cool! Thanks Lux for making this a seperate thread. I could never find the other one. :thumbsup:


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## LuxLuthor

Got my 45 pound Mastech HY3020-D Linear PS....now just waiting on AW's new "4D" (Direct Drive D-Driver).


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## jimjones3630

LL that is quick delivery.


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## LuxLuthor

I was trying to figure out some version of QuickBeam's light box, but the wax coated milk carton won't cut it for these torch lights. _ (I mean "torch" in the American lexicon, since much of the world calls flashlights "torches.")_


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## LuxLuthor

I am going to try and find what I consider "the sweet spot" for a bulb which I believe means a life of 10-20 hrs. I want to clearly establish the flash point of various bulbs, so that is no longer a mystery, nor have it be related to initial spike current, from some level of overcharged batteries, or from a variable series of resistance setups, NTC, etc. 

I'm also planning on using the temp probe which came with my Fluke 179 to see actual temps inside of a FiveMega enclosed aluminum head with Borofloat lens. It tests up to 750° F, so I may need to drill a hole just large enough for the probe in a head to get accurate sampling. This would also allow me to see how much a layer of FiberFrax would insulate the KIU, wires, and hotdriver below the bulb.

I recognize this will likely involve sacrificing 3-4 bulbs of any particular bulb to get some accurate data points, and may subject AW's 4-D to more heat/current stress than he anticipates. To minimize that, I will start out with the lower 6V and WA bulbs before considering moving to the 50W and higher bulbs. 

I'm thinking it would be good to do the run times in 30 - 120 min segments which would be a more realistic representation of how these bulbs would be used. Not to mention the fact that I am not going to want to sit, transfixed on a bulb and readings for 20 hours straight.

I want to try and standardize and control as many aspects as I can think of when setting this up, so it could be used in conjunction with AWR's Hotrater spreadsheet....perhaps leading to some adjustments, and ultimately becoming a reliable bulb reference, similar to the excellent work SilverFox has done with the battery run time curves.


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## petrev

Big Thanks to Lux for sacrificing his bulbs for the cause. Hard data is most appreciated for the upcoming Regulators and SoftStarters

:twothumbs


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## bxstylez

LuxLuthor:



> I have a large supply of the authentic Osram 64430 bulbs that are no longer made.


 

I sent you a PM a few days ago.

Care to sell any of your 'overstock' Osram 64430 bulbs?


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## KevinL

Awesome, I love your summary. 

I have been away for 18 months, so it's hard to catch up. Glad to see my ROP made the ranking at all. Thought it would have been too wimpy as you guys pushed the frontier back for all light-kind 

Not intending to compete for ranking position, but just to confirm - the six-SubC NiMH ROPs using Sanyo 3600 high-rate SCs is much brighter than the ROP on lithium. Eyeballing it shows a significant loss in output. Of course the ROP/LE is a much smaller 2C light compared to the 4D monster with the SC's. Instaflash risk is very real with the SCs, whereas the Li configuration seems to have virtually no instaflash risk due to significant voltage sag. My original ROPs have no resistance fixes or anything special. I've got a 4D/6xSC and 2C/2x18650 of my own. 

4.1 amp is around there. I've taken measurements around the 4.15A mark too, close enough. 

I'm considering building something in the 1.5K lumen range. What would you guys recommend? Planning to use A123 cells, soft start driver and preferably a very easy to obtain bulb. I hate my lights being disabled because of popped bulbs.


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## LuxLuthor

BxStylez, I just did reply to your PM. I was kind of hanging back because I wanted to test these for optimum voltage, and see what the Osram is actually doing.

Kevin, I'm sure higher voltage/amp NiMH cells would push the ROP higher....so it was definitely a great discovery for its simplicity.

I have yet to add the Osram IRC (Infrared Reflective Coating) bulbs, so I'll revise this list and what I think the best regulated voltage (& amps needed) for a number of lights.


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## petrev

LuxLuthor said:


> I was trying to figure out some version of QuickBeam's light box, but the wax coated milk carton won't cut it for these torch lights. _(I mean "torch" in the American lexicon, since much of the world calls flashlights "torches.")_


 
Hi Lux

Some thoughts on Light Metering ? and no cheap/expensive integrating spheres ?

Firstly some of the Light Meters generally available 

CEM DT-1309 with Backlight + USB graphing to boot.

CEM DT-1308 and here Backlight but no USB but cheaper and more like it for me.

Meterman LM631 / Tecpel 531 Lightmeter With Backlight (Google it for prices)​ 
My idea is that these and even the cheaper Chinese ones with no backlight LX1010B or DT1301 greater range could all be used to give fairly consistent readings for comparison purposes.

First Incan Bulb-Lumens - Take off the Torch head to reveal the naked bulb in Candle Mode - measure Lux at say 1metre - right angles to filament - horizontal separation (same level) same for axial filament lamps just avoid the return wire if external, although it probably won't change anything much. 

The filament acts a point source so the Lux meter reading is just a small part of the total 1m sphere surface

Lux level should be proportionate (?) to Bulb Lumens so take a known trusted value like the ones for the WA1185 from the WA re-rater page at a set Voltage or two and check the ratios - that is the first interesting experiment. Should be a simple ratio between Bulb Lumens and Lux at 1m ( I think :thinking: ) 
Might have to check how much the room, if not a Black-Box room contributes to the Lux value or experiment outdoors at night - but not as easy to use a constant Voltage supply outdoors !

Another value of Lux could be taken for all bulbs at 1m (or suitable distance) for Centre Spot value from say 3" FM MOP or other semi standardisable reflector of choice ( or lots of mirrors and heads ! ! ! ) using standard/optimum Voltages.

This method should be fairly standardised and repeatable by other members ? ? ?

I'm going to post these thoughts in the LuxLuthor Most Powerful Thread to see what everyone thinks and they can point out the glaring errors

 Let me know . . .

Cheers Pete


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## LuxLuthor

Pete, thanks for your information. I bought the Meterman LM631 a while back, so I'll use that one. I can position the Meterman at a distance of 1 meter, and enclose the sensor head inside a 15 inch black tube sealed around it to eliminate reflected light. With the tube horizontal to the table, and so the attached sensor is the same height as the bulb, I can line it up so it is aiming at the side of the bulb. I'll check first with brighter bulb like 64458 to see if that maxes out the meter, and move it back farther if it does.

Figuring out the head size and zoom will be a more variable issue....but it would be interesting to see how a particular voltage/amps/lux @ 1m translates to a farther distance spot from various Mag head beams.


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## petrev

:twothumbs

Sounds like you are one step ahead

Cheers
Pete


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## LuxLuthor

Pete, using the 12" black tube with 1" I.D., and a thin layer of black foam at meter end to seal sensor in end works great. LOL....I cannibalized an old vacuum cleaner extension tube, and abraded the inside so there was a diffuse pattern coming through other end, as previously the shiny inside surface reflected artifacts.

Only thing is my preliminary "spot" readings at 1 meter of 64623 with a charged 14.4V pack (not the power supply yet) only gave about 450 Lux. The FM special Carley 43W in a 2p4s x 14670 (stock mag parts), only gave about 150 Lux.

Seeing that this LM631 scale can go up to 20,000 Lux, I think I should put it closer than a meter. To see the effect of the tube, holding the sensor outside of the tube with Carley only bumped it up to about 170 Lux.

I'm thinking I should find a distance where the 64458 at about 22V gives a reading of about 10,000 Lux, unless I get way too close. Maybe 0.5 meter? That will still leave Lux room on the meter for measuring 250W setups. It seems the most useful thing is to get a relative proportional, but objectively controlled setup...which we can then compare to the Hotrater spreadsheet, bulb manufacturer BL ratings at a specific voltage, etc.

I was talking with AWR, and also think it may be best to do most of the "light point" testing in just a plain KIU bipin holder which is how he did some of his tests...and then see how volt/amp/lux compares at a couple points when the new AW D Driver is used (still waiting on mine).


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## petrev

Ah Yes . . .

LuxLuthor is being 

Very Creatively Destructive

:thumbsup:
Pete


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## LuxLuthor

List will be undergoing some shakeups as some new bulbs and setups are tested. :naughty: Meanwhile here is a random set of Torch & MaxBlasters.

(Thumbnail)


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## LuxLuthor

Getting close to updating my list with a number of new bulbs and setups. I was kind of stalling until AW came out with his regulated D Driver, but I believe that is a ways away.


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## nickz

LuxLuthor said:


> I am going to try and find what I consider "the sweet spot" for a bulb which I believe means a life of 10-20 hrs. I want to clearly establish the flash point of various bulbs, so that is no longer a mystery, nor have it be related to initial spike current, from some level of overcharged batteries, or from a variable series of resistance setups, NTC, etc.
> 
> I'm also planning on using the temp probe which came with my Fluke 179 to see actual temps inside of a FiveMega enclosed aluminum head with Borofloat lens. It tests up to 750° F, so I may need to drill a hole just large enough for the probe in a head to get accurate sampling. This would also allow me to see how much a layer of FiberFrax would insulate the KIU, wires, and hotdriver below the bulb.
> 
> I recognize this will likely involve sacrificing 3-4 bulbs of any particular bulb to get some accurate data points, and may subject AW's 4-D to more heat/current stress than he anticipates. To minimize that, I will start out with the lower 6V and WA bulbs before considering moving to the 50W and higher bulbs.
> 
> I'm thinking it would be good to do the run times in 30 - 120 min segments which would be a more realistic representation of how these bulbs would be used. Not to mention the fact that I am not going to want to sit, transfixed on a bulb and readings for 20 hours straight.
> 
> I want to try and standardize and control as many aspects as I can think of when setting this up, so it could be used in conjunction with AWR's Hotrater spreadsheet....perhaps leading to some adjustments, and ultimately becoming a reliable bulb reference, similar to the excellent work SilverFox has done with the battery run time curves.


 
Lux,

When establishing these numbers how long are you going to test a bulb at a given voltage? The reason I ask is that at one time I was convinced that you could run the ROP with 7 nimh cells and do just fine. What I ended up finding out is that after around 15 minutes of constant on time is bubl explosion. I have had this happen three times. The first time I thought it was maybe just a bad bulb. After the second time I was curious. After the third time, I was smart enough not to try it again. These bulbs completely shredded a nice reflector and chipped the inside of a UCL lense when they exploded so things were really moving when it came apart.


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## LuxLuthor

Nick, you should see the "burial ground" of dead bulbs I have now. Amazingly, none of them have exploded, but I faithfully wear my Mr. Wizard goggles when doing the tests in this thread. 

I start with the projected life that was taken from AWR's Hotrater spreadsheet to target a life of 10-15 hrs. Some bulbs are pretty close to what I have on those spreadsheets as "pending" on far right, others have little correlation.

Remember with my test platforms, I have virtually no resistance to blunt the voltage we use with various battery combinations that varies in the Mag setup. Remember that a fully charged NiMH cell will have a voltage of 1.4V, so your 7 x 1.4V=9.8V 

Then, depending on what parts you are using, resistance fixes, etc., you need to take that into account in your setup, as more resistance of a stock mag will decrease the current delivered to the bulb at a given battery voltage.


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## nickz

LuxLuthor said:


> Nick, you should see the "burial ground" of dead bulbs I have now. Amazingly, none of them have exploded, but I faithfully wear my Mr. Wizard goggles when doing the tests in this thread.
> 
> I start with the projected life that was taken from AWR's Hotrater spreadsheet to target a life of 10-15 hrs. Some bulbs are pretty close to what I have on those spreadsheets as "pending" on far right, others have little correlation.
> 
> Remember with my test platforms, I have virtually no resistance to blunt the voltage we use with various battery combinations that varies in the Mag setup. Remember that a fully charged NiMH cell will have a voltage of 1.4V, so your 7 x 1.4V=9.8V
> 
> Then, depending on what parts you are using, resistance fixes, etc., you need to take that into account in your setup, as more resistance of a stock mag will decrease the current delivered to the bulb at a given
> battery voltage.


 
Lux,

I am well aware that the voltage is actually a bit higher. I was just quoting the nominal voltage of the pack. As far as resistance fixes, I have the mag switch fixes done but I have not done the tail spring fix done as when I built that particular light I had not seen a post about that being a problem. These lights popped around 2 or three years ago when I first got into mag hotwires.

My main point of bringing it up was simply to find out if you were just testing the bulbs for their highest possible voltage so we can use a hotdriver and get the most from our lights. I wanted to be sure that the tests were running for a decent amount of time before the information is stated as good to go. As I said, each of three of my bulbs failed at around 15 minutes of constant run time. What happened was first a slight dimming followed by a spectacular show of colors that ended with a poof. Each time, the bulb completely failed and shredded a reflector. After the first one happened I tried again in the same damaged reflector as at the time I didnt have a spare and I was using the light for photography. The third time was simply to see if I could repeat the results and it happened again. That was when I decided that I would no longer use that setup. 

As a general note, each time the bulb failed the light was sitting on the tail cap pointing at the ceiling to bounce light back down on what I was photographing. I dont think this would have any bearing on the bulb failing but thought it was worth mentioning.

Don't take the first sentance the wrong way. I am not in any way insulting you or your intelligence. I admire the work you are doing for the better of the community. I have a great respect for that. I am just interested to find out if the same thing could happen at different voltages. Voltages higher than a nominal 7.2 but lower than nominal 8.4 might result in similar results in the same amount of time or a bit longer. 

Thanks again for the work you are putting into the bulb tests. This will come in real handy when we have a hotdriver setup. :twothumbs .


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## LuxLuthor

Nick, I just took readings and moved up to next reported voltage step. I didn't pause, as I did not want to put additional run time stresses as the voltage increased. The first stage was to detect the Lux, Amps, & heat at various voltage levels, as well as determine the REAL flash point with minimal run time having stressed out the bulb first.

Then next stage which I have been slowly doing is to run a bulb at what should be an ideal voltage using the Hotrater target of 10-15 hrs. I do the runs at a set voltage in stage two in various segments of 30 mins to 2 hrs. I have been checking to see how much the Lux drops off with run time, and the test is done when the bulb burns out at that fixed "ideal" voltage, or when the Lux drops so low the bulb might as well be dead. There is no other way to do the tests with any decent run time, other than to pick 1 or 2 estimated ideal voltages and see what happens. Suffice it to say that the drop off in Lux with some bulbs is shocking, as well as there not being ideal correlation with various bulbs to the Hotrater estimated run time at various voltages.

So the bottom line is you were running too much voltage (with the resistance fixes) for that bulb. There are many setups where the resistance fixes should NOT be done because you push the bulb too close to its flash point. I was not doing ideal voltage run time/Lux predictions with the ROP, since I only had the one bulb.


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## Ginseng

I'm saddened to see that the Aurora and Aurora2 are not on your list. The Aurora debuted in the winter of 2003 and was the first of the truly "super" Maglight mods. Beyond just bulb and battery upgrades, it rebuilt the concept of an incandescent hotwire from the ground up. I acknowledge the improvements in sophistication and power of the generations that came after, but wherever I am now, I would rest more peacefully knowing that these lights and the inspiration they fostered were not forgotten.

Wilkey


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## LuxLuthor

Hello Ginseng!

The only thing is I didn't want to mention lights/mods that I have not seen or owned....but I'm sure your expertise is right on the mark. Where would you put it in the ranking just for reference....and link to a thread about it?


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## Ginseng

A search on "Aurora" will turn up the relevant threads which are:

Aurora

Aurora2

The USL concept is closely related to the Aurora2. The original Aurora was of slightly lower output. 

Wilkey


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## LuxLuthor

Ginseng said:


> A search on "Aurora" will turn up the relevant threads which are:
> 
> Aurora
> 
> Aurora2
> 
> The USL concept is closely related to the Aurora2. The original Aurora was of slightly lower output.
> 
> Wilkey



Wilkey, I'm so happy you shared this. *What a beautiful work of art in that Aurora2*....just before my time here. I understand why you want it listed. I'll put it just ahead of the USL, for posterity. Thanks again!

Also, just saw your website page in your sig. More wonderful information and wisdom.


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## Ginseng

Luxlover, 

I apologize. I just realized that this thread was for lights you've had direct contact with. The other thread was just too long for me to dig into. You guys have done some wonderful work and I'm envious of the ingenuity of some of the modders here. Back in the early days, you could do a lot with a little but now it seems that the cutting edge is so much more demanding. I am glad that hotwires still get so much attention. 

And on another note, I've happy to see my friend Jim Sexton appointed as a moderator in this forum. That was certainly the right and best choice to have been made.

Wilkey


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## paulr

Wilkey, LTNS! Welcome back, I hope you'll stay.


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## kongfuchicken

So the rumors were right! Welcome back, Wilkey!


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## Icebreak

Wilkey! What is up, my brother?

Continued education went well I'm sure. How's your little cutie pie? Is she driving yet?

Remember when a lemlux 3 X CR123 + KPR112 was hot?

Remember when there wasn't an Incandescent forum? 

Well, good. Good that some of the newer guys can meet the fellow that blazed the trail for Mag85, USL and other super lights.

Guys -

The term "HotWire". Yep. That's Ginseng.



Ginseng said:


> And on another note, I've happy to see my friend Jim Sexton appointed as a moderator in this forum. That was certainly the right and best choice to have been made.



Good to see you've kept your sense of humor. Oh, Lawdy, it must have been a dark and stormy night when that decision was made. Ol' man Jim takes a lot of naps these days so I can get away with the jab, no problem.

Anyway, good to hear from you. Thanks for the nod and the word.


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## Hallis

It is indeed good to see Wilkey back on the forums.  And the Aurora / Aurora2 definately deserve a place on the list. They were the heavy hitters long before Torches, Blasters, Polaris TK's, and even USL's were in our hands. 

Shane


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## Spypro

A quick question here:
I wonder if it would be possible to power a 64655 bulb with 6 x 17670 cells (AW's ones: 2 stack of 3 cells) in a 3D [email protected] bored and with some kind of battery holder. Is it possible to use the 64655 with the stock head ? (I already got Boro lens and metal reflectors)
I know that I will have to drop the voltage of the batteries a little bit in order to not blow the bulb.
What about the stock switch ? Will it melt ?

I already build a nice [email protected] (4C body, AW softstart switch, 3 x 18650, 1185 bulb, boro lens and smooth reflector) and the result is awesome. The voltage getting to the bulb is 11.1v when I put fresh, out of the charger, batteries.

I want more


----------



## LuxLuthor

Spypro said:


> A quick question here:
> I wonder if it would be possible to power a 64655 bulb with 6 x 17670 cells (AW's ones: 2 stack of 3 cells) in a 3D [email protected] bored and with some kind of battery holder. Is it possible to use the 64655 with the stock head ? (I already got Boro lens and metal reflectors)
> I know that I will have to drop the voltage of the batteries a little bit in order to not blow the bulb.
> What about the stock switch ? Will it melt ?
> 
> I already build a nice [email protected] (4C body, AW softstart switch, 3 x 18650, 1185 bulb, boro lens and smooth reflector) and the result is awesome. The voltage getting to the bulb is 11.1v when I put fresh, out of the charger, batteries.
> 
> I want more



Spypro, the 64655 is a 24V bulb that really needs 28-30V to perform...and 11-12 Amps. All of AW's cells have a 5.5 (+/- 0.3) Amp protection shutoff circuit. You either need high current NiMH cells, or the new A123/Emoli safe chemistry (high current) Lithium cells.


----------



## Spypro

Thanks for the infos.

What is the maximum voltage I can apply to the 64655 without blowing it ?
Any suggestions for the high current NiMH ? If it is possible to use AA NiMH in a 6D body it would be really nice.

Thanks !


----------



## divine

I think Lux rigged this list. :nana:



(Kiiiiiding.)


----------



## LuxLuthor

Spypro said:


> Thanks for the infos.
> 
> What is the maximum voltage I can apply to the 64655 without blowing it ?
> Any suggestions for the high current NiMH ? If it is possible to use AA NiMH in a 6D body it would be really nice.
> 
> Thanks !



Good question. You have to be willing to waste a few bulbs, and likely have a 40V 20A power supply to find out. That is what I did with my destructive testing of all the bulbs here.


----------



## Spypro

Thanks for the link. 
I already took a look at it: awesome work ! 
The USL and Torch bulbs looks pretty nice too 
Have you done a test for the 64655 ?


----------



## LuxLuthor

No because I only have a 30V 20A power supply. That bulb will need higher voltage to test it.


----------



## JimmyM

LuxLuthor said:


> No because I only have a 30V 20A power supply. That bulb will need higher voltage to test it.


 
You can borrow my 50V 20A Mastech if you want?


----------



## Spypro

OK thank 
Is there other bulb options that gives ~5000+ lumen ?


----------



## LuxLuthor

JimmyM said:


> You can borrow my 50V 20A Mastech if you want?



So you got that sucker huh? Is it linear or switching?


----------



## Jenova

Are thier any links on the hyperblaster ?? searched everywhere and cant find anything ?

Thanks


----------



## LuxLuthor

Oh man....I posted a picture of it in some thread sitting on a chair....but not internal details. It's a chrome elephant with 120mm extension and FM3V-2 head. NTC & 10A switch, various thermal insulation methods.


----------



## JimmyM

LuxLuthor said:


> So you got that sucker huh? Is it linear or switching?


It's the switching model. I don't think they make it in a linear model.
Sitting on my bench at home right now.


----------



## Jenova

* Vaporizer hey 
when do we get to hear the details ?

*


----------



## dulridge

Jenova said:


> * Vaporizer hey
> when do we get to hear the details ?
> 
> *



Just what I was about to say!


----------



## JimmyM

Jenova said:


> * Vaporizer hey *
> *when do we get to hear the details ?*


Right before the details of the "*Incinerator*"


----------



## dulridge

JimmyM said:


> Right before the details of the "*Incinerator*"



And just after the "cremator"


----------



## JimmyM

dulridge said:


> And just after the "cremator"


But to coincide with the "conflagrator"


----------



## Spypro

I can't wait to hear the details !
This make me want to build more hotwire mods. The 64458 bulb looks nice.


----------



## dulridge

JimmyM said:


> But to coincide with the "conflagrator"


And the "Sublimator"
Long after the "Melter" and the "Smelter"


----------



## LuxLuthor

Let's just say I'm still sorting out 663, 664, & 665 with 9, 10, 11s Emoli 18650's.....lumens, and volts, and heat....oh my!


----------



## JimmyM

LuxLuthor said:


> Let's just say I'm still sorting out 663, 664, & 665 with 9, 10, 11s Emoli 18650's.....lumens, and volts, and heat....oh my!


You are a mad man.


----------



## Spypro

About 12000 lumen with the typical voltage... yeah it's mad but we all like that


----------



## JetskiMark

I had a feeling that the Vaporizer was going to use a 400W bulb such as the 64663. About 22000 bulb lumens when overdriven to 39.4V. That bulb rocks with the 9 inch Blitz reflector, but it really needs an even larger one. The filament is rather large. I wonder how floody the beam will be when using even an FM 3.5" reflector? It will be outrageous regardless.

I am really looking forward to seeing the end result.

Regards,
Mark


----------



## LuxLuthor

JetskiMark said:


> I had a feeling that the Vaporizer was going to use a 400W bulb such as the 64663. About 22000 bulb lumens when overdriven to 39.4V. That bulb rocks with the 9 inch Blitz reflector, but it really needs an even larger one. The filament is rather large. I wonder how floody the beam will be when using even an FM 3.5" reflector? It will be outrageous regardless.
> 
> I am really looking forward to seeing the end result.
> 
> Regards,
> Mark



Yeah, there's pro's and con's to all setups. Thanks for your PM information, as I separately have a Blitz coming with clear standard filter that will use the larger Emolis. In addition, a 3rd project....guess how many of these babies will fit in this U.S. Navy light?


----------



## JetskiMark

LuxLuthor said:


> Yeah, there's pro's and con's to all setups. Thanks for your PM information, as I separately have a Blitz coming with clear standard filter that will use the larger Emolis. In addition, a 3rd project....guess how many of these babies will fit in this U.S. Navy light?



I have that same light except the handle is yellow too. I give up, how many large Emolis will fit in there? What are your plans for the Navy light?

Regards,
Mark


----------



## divine

JimmyM said:


> Right before the details of the "*Incinerator*"


 


dulridge said:


> And just after the "cremator"


 


JimmyM said:


> But to coincide with the "conflagrator"


 


dulridge said:


> And the "Sublimator"
> Long after the "Melter" and the "Smelter"



hahaha 

Thanks, guys. 

Maybe Lux needs to take a couple minute break from blowing up lamps to think of some better names for his mods. :thinking:


----------



## JetskiMark

LuxLuthor said:


> .... In addition, a 3rd project....guess how many of these babies will fit in this U.S. Navy light?



Without having the cells to actually try in there, it looks like 24 might fit. If you could fit 27 (9s 3p) in there, you could overdrive a PAR36 (direct swap) GE 4596 to over 300 watts for about 55 minutes. That's what I will probably do to mine. What are your plans?

Regards,
Mark


----------



## LuxLuthor

For sure 18, maybe 20, maybe a couple more, depending on bulb size. I was looking through this list of Par36, including that one you mentioned.


----------



## cmacclel

For the Record

4/30/2006

21 cells driving the 24v 250w lamp in a FM host with Custom extended tailcap 

http://images17.fotki.com/v306/photos/1/141020/3830456/IMG_2233-vi.jpg


----------



## Hallis

Ginseng said:


> I'm saddened to see that the Aurora and Aurora2 are not on your list. The Aurora debuted in the winter of 2003 and was the first of the truly "super" Maglight mods. Beyond just bulb and battery upgrades, it rebuilt the concept of an incandescent hotwire from the ground up. I acknowledge the improvements in sophistication and power of the generations that came after, but wherever I am now, I would rest more peacefully knowing that these lights and the inspiration they fostered were not forgotten.
> 
> Wilkey




Might be good to mention that in the origonal Aurora thread the Aroura made over 4000 lumens.. I cant remember which bulb was used (wasnt a 623) but i'll go back through the thread tonight as ive got it bookmarked at home.

Shane


----------



## LuxLuthor

cmacclel said:


> For the Record
> 
> 4/30/2006
> 
> 21 cells driving the 24v 250w lamp in a FM host with Custom extended tailcap
> 
> http://images17.fotki.com/v306/photos/1/141020/3830456/IMG_2233-vi.jpg



Hey, that's not fair playing battery merry-go-round on me.  This thread you posted on FF's is clearly using what looks like a Mad MaxaBeam battery pack of 20 cells. :ironic: :huh:

This pix, in particular is where I counted the 20 cells: ====>>> http://images20.fotki.com/v380/photos/1/141020/3830456/IMG_0490-vi.jpg

PS) Knowing the demands of this light, I would not rely on an FM 21s pack like that in terms of resistance and contact.


----------



## adamlau

When is this ever going to posted in the Incandescent Forum - Threads of Interest sticky  ?


----------



## cmacclel

LuxLuthor said:


> Hey, that's not fair playing battery merry-go-round on me.  This thread you posted on FF's is clearly using what looks like a Mad MaxaBeam battery pack of 20 cells. :ironic: :huh:
> 
> This pix, in particular is where I counted the 20 cells: ====>>> http://images20.fotki.com/v380/photos/1/141020/3830456/IMG_0490-vi.jpg
> 
> PS) Knowing the demands of this light, I would not rely on an FM 21s pack like that in terms of resistance and contact.




I built the 21 cell light to show off at a CPF get together. After the get together the host was turned into an HID.

Resistance at 10 amps with 1/16th inch thick brass?


The other light with 20 cells was built for EricMack.


Mac


----------



## adamlau

Appears as if the 64663, or the 65665 (half the price of the 64663) would be the pinnacle of low voltage bulbs for tubular handheld lights. A nine, or ten cell 4S3P series wired Moli pack would do these bulbs portable justice  . I wonder in the FM3 reflectors would be able to handle the heat :thinking: . Now if only an appropriate host were available for purchase :mecry: ...


----------



## Jenova

Hows the Vaporizer coming along ??

Any details or pics ??


----------



## LuxLuthor

Jenova said:


> Hows the Vaporizer coming along ??
> 
> Any details or pics ??



Funny you should mention that. I just got in the parts I needed last week. :naughty:


----------



## Flashanator

Can't wait to see the Vaporizer Lux.



Lux, have you got pics & beamshots of the hyperblaster? 

thx


----------



## mr.squatch

Glad to see the list expanding to include more reasonable lights like the rop. Keep it going lux. :twothumbs I like it, even without a squatchablaster on there. lol. 


g


----------



## LuxLuthor

OK, I finally have the objective testing of my latest "Vaporizer" posted here, as I suspected it would go higher than the 64655 bulb since the 64657 has 300 hrs life. It is a smaller package than the "HyperBlaster," which also runs hotter than this newest creation.


----------



## Aircraft800

LuxLuthor said:


> *1) LuxLuthor's** Vaporizer. Using Osram 64657 250W & 8s x Emoli 18650 in Elephant with 60mm extension tube. *Has balance charging plugs. Destructive testing data here.


 
Yea, were going to need pics of the Vaporizer, it can't be on the list without verification . LOL..


----------



## Flashanator

Lux, ur the man with all the skills, & insane toys. You wouldn't happen to have a spare Vaporizer lying around for me? :naughty:

can't wait to see pics & beamshots.


----------



## LuxLuthor

Aircraft800 said:


> Yea, were going to need pics of the Vaporizer, it can't be on the list without verification . LOL..



I was trying to get a 400W bulb to work in an elephant, but settled (for now) on this 250W bulb. 

I still have to test the GE (Hungary) 275W, but the 400W has some unique challenges. I'll have to come up with some more new names. :devil:


----------



## jufam44

That's a great light, lux. Where does one get a 400w Bulb?


----------



## LuxLuthor

jufam44 said:


> That's a great light, lux. Where does one get a 400w Bulb?



 The Osram 64663 is a 36V 400W (11.2 Amps)....and as you might imagine getting that many volts is not easy to accomplish safely in a flashlight vs. lantern. Ideally, having 10s Emoli IMR-18650 should do the job....but....


----------



## Spypro

The more I'm looking at this forum the more I want to create a monster.
I really like the idea of a 64458 bulb in a Mag body.
I looked at a lot of threads about building a "Mag458" and I have some questions:

I know that I must have the bulb, the Borofloat lens, KIU bi-pin socket, metal reflector, but when I comes to battery I get confused.

My goal is to have the 64458 driven at ~20-21 volts.
I want to keep it simple so no dual, tri or quad bored Mag body. I do not own the necessary equipments to do so.

What would be the best battery option in regard of the voltage I want to apply ?

I saw people speaking of FET, MOSFET, tailcap 10A switch, Judco 10A switch. I'm not sure but I think those things are there to prevent the flashlight parts from melting. Am I right ?
Do I need one (or more) of those in a "Mag458" ?
Do I need to modify the stock switch ?
This is the only part where I get confused.
I think I can get the KIU socket on the stock switch without problems (yeah, I'm a newB modder, my only mod is my [email protected]) and the other parts together.

Thanks !


----------



## JimmyM

Spypro said:


> My goal is to have the 64458 driven at ~20-21 volts.
> I want to keep it simple so no dual, tri or quad bored Mag body. I do not own the necessary equipments to do so.
> 
> What would be the best battery option in regard of the voltage I want to apply ?
> 
> I saw people speaking of FET, MOSFET, tailcap 10A switch, Judco 10A switch. I'm not sure but I think those things are there to prevent the flashlight parts from melting. Am I right ?
> Do I need one (or more) of those in a "Mag458" ?
> Do I need to modify the stock switch ?
> This is the only part where I get confused.
> I think I can get the KIU socket on the stock switch without problems (yeah, I'm a newB modder, my only mod is my [email protected]) and the other parts together.
> 
> Thanks !


Without boring, your only real option is a 3x5 pack of Elite1700 AAs from LuxLuthor. That will give you 18V nominal. This will allow you to operate the 458 without any sort of soft-starting. If you want to get into the 20+V area, you're going to need a 3x6 pack of Elite1700 AAs AND some sort of soft-starting. You can start the 458 on 16 cells without soft-starting. I've done it with 17 cells. 18 will flash the bulb on startup. The Elite 1700s hold up really well under load so don't expect battery voltage sag to save your bulb. They hold over 1.2V until half their capacity is delivered.
FETs/MOSFETs are high current low voltage electronic switches. They can handle 10 times the current that would melt the Judco. A suped up 458 will draw 11+ Amps. The Judco should handle it but will get warm. A MOSFET will shrug off 11A like it's not there. Even the best modded Mag switch is on the edge at 11A. It won't last long. I would suggest the Judco or MOSFET switch. Personally, I like the MOSFET switch.


----------



## Spypro

The 3x6 pack of Elite1700 looks like the way to go. I already own an AW softstart switch (in my Mag 4xC). I could use is new softstart switch for D size Mag.

Thank you for the explanation about the MOSFET switch.

So I will have to put a MOSFET socket into the KIU socket ?

Thank again !


----------



## JimmyM

Spypro said:


> The 3x6 pack of Elite1700 looks like the way to go. I already own an AW softstart switch (in my Mag 4xC). I could use is new softstart switch for D size Mag.
> 
> Thank you for the explanation about the MOSFET switch.
> 
> So I will have to put a MOSFET socket into the KIU socket ?
> 
> Thank again !


The AW softstart has the bulb socket you need. You don't need to add anything. If you don't use the AW softstarter you will need a KIU socket and some sort of high current switch (Judco or MOSFET). Please read the specs of the AW soft start switch. The 458 pushed to 20+ volts is over 200W. I'd PM AW and see if he recommends his softstarter at 20V and 11 amps.


----------



## Spypro

If I understand correctly: I don't need a MOSFET if I use the softstart switch from AW ?


----------



## JimmyM

Spypro said:


> If I understand correctly: I don't need a MOSFET if I use the softstart switch from AW ?


That is correct.


----------



## Spypro

Ok thank 

Now I need to figure out how to put 18 AA in a 6D...
Is there an 18AA > D holder out there ?

There is a list of components I made tonight:

****** Battery ******
18 Elite1700 cells

****** Lens ******
52.1mm x 2mm Borofloat lens

****** Reflector ******
Smooth metal (aluminium) reflector

****** Bulb ******
Osram 64458-S bulb

****** Host ******
Maglite 6D

****** Modified switch ******
AW's Mag D Incan Driver

Maybe I'll need a new charger because I will never see the end with my Energizer charger (4 slots) with 18 cells.


----------



## JimmyM

Spypro said:


> Ok thank
> 
> Now I need to figure out how to put 18 AA in a 6D...
> Is there an 18AA > D holder out there ?
> 
> There is a list of components I made tonight:
> 
> ****** Battery ******
> 18 Elite1700 cells
> 
> ****** Lens ******
> 52.1mm x 2mm Borofloat lens
> 
> ****** Reflector ******
> Smooth metal (aluminium) reflector
> 
> ****** Bulb ******
> Osram 64458-S bulb
> 
> ****** Host ******
> Maglite 6D
> 
> ****** Modified switch ******
> AW's Mag D Incan Driver
> 
> Maybe I'll need a new charger because I will never see the end with my Energizer charger (4 slots) with 18 cells.


With the amount of current flowing during use, you really need to have a pack MADE. LuxLuthor makes custom packs. He welds the cells together and shrink wraps them. Comments by those that have purchased them say they're very well made. A cell holder has too many contact points. Each one represents resistance that turns into lost voltage and heat.
Also, a pack of AAs that's 6 cells long is only 290mm that's 4.8 D cells long. You don't need a 6D, you need a 5D. When you order your pack, tell Lux that it's going into a 5D Mag and he may be able to build a spacer into the pack to make it fit perfectly into the 5D. If you use a 6D, you'll end up with 70mm of empty space.
you're definitely going to need a new charger. Once the cells are assembled into a pack there's no separating them. This one should work nicely...
http://www.all-battery.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=837


----------



## Spypro

Thank you very much for the infos !
I'll PM LuxLuthor regarding a custom pack.
Only a 5D, that's great. I'll look for a red body one.

Thank again


----------



## DM51

... and if you _really_ want to do the bulb proper justice, you could consider one of these for it - I think there's still 1 red one left...


----------



## Spypro

Those turbo heads by Fivemega are works of art. They are expensive but they looks like worth every $ spent.
I take a look at them


----------



## Patriot

I wish this thread was a sticky....:mecry: It's too valuable to get lost.


----------



## JetskiMark

Patriot36 said:


> I wish this thread was a sticky....:mecry: It's too valuable to get lost.



Extremely valuable thread indeed. 


It is listed in the incandescent forum - threads of interest sticky. Which is perfect; easy to find the thread without too many stickies at the top of the forum to go through.

Regards,
Mark


----------



## chimneycheck

Wow LuxLuthor

This has a great amount of information that might not be available anywhere else.

Helps me to really make my decisions on what mod to and not to attempt.

Thanks


----------



## LuxLuthor

One of these days, I really need to update this list. I have a number of new mods to add.


----------



## smokelaw1

LuxLuthor said:


> One of these days, I really need to update this list. I have a number of new mods to add.



Has the envelope been pushed even further?


----------



## Tarlach

LuxLuthor said:


> One of these days, I really need to update this list. I have a number of new mods to add.



Plese do! 

I would like to know where the electrolumens (or other) p7 mod sits on the list.

I would be great to see a led get up with the 'big boys'


----------



## resistance1

LuxLuthor said:


> One of these days, I really need to update this list. I have a number of new mods to add.



maybe update the post with pictures and beam shots of the big guns. :nana:


----------



## jcvjcvjcvjcv

JimmyM said:


> With the amount of current flowing during use, you really need to have a pack MADE. LuxLuthor makes custom packs. He welds the cells together and shrink wraps them. Comments by those that have purchased them say they're very well made. A cell holder has too many contact points. Each one represents resistance that turns into lost voltage and heat.
> Also, a pack of AAs that's 6 cells long is only 290mm that's 4.8 D cells long. You don't need a 6D, you need a 5D. When you order your pack, tell Lux that it's going into a 5D Mag and he may be able to build a spacer into the pack to make it fit perfectly into the 5D. If you use a 6D, you'll end up with 70mm of empty space.
> you're definitely going to need a new charger. Once the cells are assembled into a pack there's no separating them. This one should work nicely...
> http://www.all-battery.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=837


 
Wait a minute...

6x Elite 1700 only 290mm? On http://www.cheapbatterypacks.com/?sid=1136499&pgid=loosecells the Elite 1700 is listed as being 50.8 mm long. Take that six times and you get 304.8mm .. not counting the extra space needed for the contacts...

If I'm right Mag calculates with 60,0mm per D cell, so the 5D batterycompartment is designed for something 300mm long. Offcourse you can drill out 2mm from the stockswitch and press the tailcap spring a little harder, but it's a shame those Elite 1700's are 50.8mm and not 50.0. Does me thinking of the GP AA consumer cells; with every capacity increase they get bigger... GP 2600 mAh AA cells don't fit in AA MagLites... , and 1300 and 1600 is rattling.. 

7x3 Elite 1700's in a 6D with a Osram 64655 or 64657 should be easier.

@Lux: driving those 250W Osram's with 17 Elite 1700's.. that's only 20.4 Volts, right? Shouldn't you use something like 24 cells (28.8V nominal), or will that instaflash when used hot off the charger?

Just wondering. I want to build something with a 250W lamp in a Mag 6D (not bored out!). The AA's fit in sets of three, but 12x2=24x 2/3A also fits in a 6D :devil:


----------



## TKO

I was looking at old threads and ran on to this one. 

When I started plugging voltages into the bulb spec charts on Lux's Destructive Ican Bulb Tests thread, I found that my 5 x A123 Osram 64633 mod bumped the Deathblaster out of the number 4 position with the highest non-Elephant based lumen output. 

I then realized that my mod lacked a "name", so I will call it "The Sleeper", because when you look at it there is nothing to give away that 7000+ lumens lurk within.


----------



## LuxLuthor

I put the SF-M6 with MN21 bulb into the ranking since asked about it several times. Again, a reminder that this list is just to 'hang your hat on' to get some ideas of more powerful incans.


----------



## sylathnie

I would like to submit this to the list. I think it fits your requirements. (Although it does need a name. "Subliminator" maybe? )


----------



## LuxLuthor

I have not had the guts to put together some of the 400w bulbs I also got, so hats off to your accomplishment and sliding into the #1 spot.


----------



## Nanomiser

I'm a little late on the scene, but beautiful work on the bulb testing. You really got some great data here! I've been considering modamag's *Colossus *for a Osram 64657 250W ROP mod and now I have this very comprehensive and helpful run data thanks to you.

:thumbsup:


----------



## LuxLuthor

Thanks for the note. I figured if I was going to start learning all this from scratch, I might as well try to capture the info along the way for others. Certainly, many have done the same with other topics before and after me. 

Next project I'm putting together with photos is finally sorting out all the various reflectors. There are different outside diameter sizes, shapes, coating surfaces, and bulb bore hole sizes, made by a number of sources. So this will be another challenge to control all variables except the reflector.


----------



## Bullet Bob

LuxLuthor said:


> Next project I'm putting together with photos is finally sorting out all the various reflectors. There are different outside diameter sizes, shapes, coating surfaces, and bulb bore hole sizes, made by a number of sources. So this will be another challenge to control all variables except the reflector.


 
Your info has always been a great resource for me and my light projects. I look forward to the reflector information as that will also be super useful. I was more intrigued by reflectors after having seen a PH40 with a 3 inch reflector and the useful throw and spill that the light offered over the extreme throw of the POB Hid light with its 6 inch reflector. I have seen other benefits among reflectors but have never been 100% clear on choosing the right reflector for a particular application.


----------



## Nanomiser

Bullet Bob said:


> LuxLuthor said:
> 
> 
> 
> Next project I'm putting together with photos is finally sorting out all the various reflectors. There are different outside diameter sizes, shapes, coating surfaces, and bulb bore hole sizes, made by a number of sources. So this will be another challenge to control all variables except the reflector.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Your info has always been a great resource for me and my light projects. I look forward to the reflector information as that will also be super useful. I was more intrigued by reflectors after having seen a PH40 with a 3 inch reflector and the useful throw and spill that the light offered over the extreme throw of the POB Hid light with its 6 inch reflector. I have seen other benefits among reflectors but have never been 100% clear on choosing the right reflector for a particular application.
Click to expand...

 
Thanks Bullet Bob; my sediments as well.


----------



## wayne21

I am using the ROP -H bulb with 8-AA and it is very bright, the battery holder will not fit newer maglites ,this 2 cell flashlight is over 25 years old. In my newer maglite I can only run 6 AA batteries,which I am not very happy with . I bought a battery holder to hold 6- 14500's but for some reason it only will put out 9 volts. I can not figure this out. will a protected lithium ion cell be the cause ? In the same holder I installed 6 AA NiMH and I got 9 volts. what is going on? IF you know why I can not get more then 9 volts with this battery holder and 6 14500's please tell me . I can be reached at [email protected] I will be greatfull for your input. Fivemega makes some of the finest products I have ever seen . this is driving me crazy. after what I already have into the flashlight I will send you $10.00 for a few minutes of your time to help me find the problem. could it be that the cells are protected?From what I have been reading if you can not figure out the problem no one can.and that leaves me wasting almost $40.00 on a useless battery holder.. P.S thank you for all the info on the bulbs wayne 21


----------



## LuxLuthor

wayne21 said:


> I am using the ROP -H bulb with 8-AA and it is very bright, the battery holder will not fit newer maglites ,this 2 cell flashlight is over 25 years old. In my newer maglite I can only run 6 AA batteries,which I am not very happy with . I bought a battery holder to hold 6- 14500's but for some reason it only will put out 9 volts. I can not figure this out. will a protected lithium ion cell be the cause ? In the same holder I installed 6 AA NiMH and I got 9 volts. what is going on? IF you know why I can not get more then 9 volts with this battery holder and 6 14500's please tell me . I can be reached at [email protected] I will be greatfull for your input. Fivemega makes some of the finest products I have ever seen . this is driving me crazy. after what I already have into the flashlight I will send you $10.00 for a few minutes of your time to help me find the problem. could it be that the cells are protected?From what I have been reading if you can not figure out the problem no one can.and that leaves me wasting almost $40.00 on a useless battery holder.. P.S thank you for all the info on the bulbs wayne 21



Wayne, this is a little off topic, but let me see if I can at least get you started. Feel free to PM me. Welcome to CPF, by the way.

There are different diameters of Mag D's, especially older vs. newer ones. Generally to fit 4 wide AA's (or 14500 Li-Ion which are AA size), you should be using a "Quad Bored" Mag D (has 4 grooves ground out inside the tube), otherwise there are some AA's that can just fit if labels are turned so overlap faces inside.

I don't know what holder you are using for the 6 & 8 cell scenarios, but the first thing to do is measure voltages of all individual cells, then double check the holder's +/- connection design to make sure you have all the cells put in correctly. Check your total pack voltage again once they are all inserted. It should work properly, and unless one of the Li-Ion cells has a zero volts from a tripped protection circuit (or shorted battery), there is no logical reason to have a 6 cell Li-Ion putting out 9V. That holder is likely 3s2p (2 parallel sets of 3 in series).

You should be using 6 x AA's for your ROP-Hi bulb in a stock Mag, as it will burn out very quickly with 8 freshly charged AA's. Freshly charged AA's will usually be at about 1.45V, so 6 x AA's can give you 8.7V, but not 9V.


----------



## SafetyBob

Lux, I for one will add that I cannot wait to see a final, authoritative analysis of the reflectors we can use. 

The problem is that while an 1185 would be useful for a control bulb, it may be two small for some of the reflectors you would review. So perhaps using "industry" standard 1185 and 623 bulbs you could adequately cover the "small" bulbs and still have some sanity with the big ones too. 

Looks like another test stand, eh? 

Bob E.


----------



## LuxLuthor

Yeah, I have worked out the test platforms. I have all the reflectors numbered. The most important step IMHO is to use a regulated driver, so the lamp output stays constant. There will still be some variability in terms of my focussing the bulb in reflector, but I have a pretty good sense of getting the optimal output. I have my site picked out, but don't want to do it when snow is covering, due to reflection effect.

I was going to use the 1185 for the WA bulb...as there are some smaller bore (& 2" Deep) reflectors that will only fit WA bulbs. I may also do a 1166 which is a sweet looking bulb. Then I'm planning on doing regulated ROP & 5761. 

Have not decided on the larger bulb, but getting regulator from Alan's project should be ideal. I'm debating between 1 or more of 64625, 623, 64458, & IRC-50.

I'm trying to think of how to display & organize it so it is not overwhelming.


----------



## mesa232323

I just noticed that the 64633 isnt on the list. Isnt it suppose to be brighter than the 64623?


----------



## LuxLuthor

mesa232323 said:


> I just noticed that the 64633 isnt on the list. Isnt it suppose to be brighter than the 64623?



There's a number of bulbs I tested in my destructive bulb thread that are not on this list. Mainly I put the ones here that I either built or was certain have been made and demonstrated. 

Although I just added this to the #5 position, the biggest problem with this bulb is its short life at default spec...and nearly impossible to optimally direct drive without flashing. 

However, with AlanB & JimmyM nearing the end of making regulated drivers, if this is set to 16.5 to 16.8V, it clearly should outperform the 64458, and deserves recognition.


----------



## mesa232323

I was wondering because I was going to make a mag623 with a 2d host and use the 15.6 pack that someone makes on here. I discovered that the 64633 is a tad brighter with the same voltage. I wanted to make a light that is bright enough to be satisfied, but it probably wont work. When will the flashlight madness end? :shrug:


----------



## LuxLuthor

mesa232323 said:


> When will the flashlight madness end? :shrug:



I'm relatively sure--but not certain that it ends when you die. I'm not certain because you hear those stories about people "going into the light" during near-death experiences.


----------



## sylathnie

You will be very happy with the 64633 and the 15.6V pack. It's a heck of a light and will fit in the stock mag form. It was my first truely bright hotwire. It still sits on my workbench and is my "loaner" crazy light for people to show their friends.

My madness reached it's peak with the Sublimator. Being able to make just about anything burst into flame instantly creates that kind of giggleing that only occures with true madness. Of course it hasn't tapered off or anything since then. I've just not found a way to top that light yet. I've now branched into other areas of madness. Since then I've build a nice 14W HID 1D MAG (expensive but worth it) and wedged an aspheric into a 1xAAA light (pointless but fun). I also just recently discovered the joy of headlamps (H30 and then H60). I don't think there is anything more "mad" that strapping a small pipe-bomb to your forehead just because it's crazy bright.
I have also recently begun staring at an old set of headlights for my wife's car. I'm thinking her car needs a new "higher beam" setting. Imagine the light that could be produced with the amperage a car battery can crank out. I want people to think the God is driving up behind them to pass....

I'm curious how the HID mag mod would sit on the list. It doesn't have the lumens force that the other mods do but it does have a huge throw advantage. Maybe it deserves an honorable mention.



(DISCLAIMER: Yes I know the headlight thing is dangerous and probably illegal in all 50 states. If ever asked just say you don't know me and aren't associated with me in any way.)


----------



## wayne21

Luxluthor, Fm's 9-AA to 3-D battery holder using NiMH, will it put out 10.8 vo;ts? using this in a 3-D maglite will it push the 1185 or any other bulbs good enough to get goog results? My old 2-D maglite using a cheap battery holder is putting out 9.6 volts with rechargeable NiMH ans with the ROP-H- it is impressive to me. I never fried a bulb with it. FM clames his 8-AA will not fit this maglite, the 8-AA setup from sandwich Shopp fit well, but is made cheap. If I get the 9-AA battery holder from FM in a 3-D maglite will I be able to use the ROP and other bulbs and be able to push then some to get a higher lumen output then the 7.4 set-ups ? You have been so help ful and I do thank you. please when your time permits ,I would like to hear from you. weather on this forum or direct e-mail or call My e-mail addres is win734440 [at] aol.com If you have the time I will be greatful. I already owe you very muck. And you have my best wishes,keep up the goog work.. I guess I should get back to pyro experiments, that I am good at. again thank you wayne21


----------



## wayne21

Hello Luxluthor,What do you think of a 35 watt HID rated 2800+ lumens? After what you told me ,I had to slow down. This HID shoud work fine for my shooting, and give me time to save and learn. All possable because of you and Modocod. when I get back on my feet , iis it possable to build a maglite that is dependable and put out 3ooo lumens / or is that just a dream/ Thank you for all your help and advice. wayne21 GOOD LUCK TO YOU and your mod's & test.


----------



## wayne21

*[long quote removed - DM51]*

Hello again LuxLuthor. What ar the CPB 1650 batteries ? are they just another name brand NiMH battery ? I just picked up some Sanyo 2700 maH batteries and some Enloopes. You were rite,I have a better battery tester and I am putting out 7.2volts with 6-AA and they work great with the WA1111. The 8-AA are putting out 9.6 volts and the ROP-H is real bright,I only blew one bulb,and the batteries just came out of the charger,now I run it with one low battery and I get good results. I also took your advice and went out and got a 3-D maglite and ordered FM's 9-AA battery holder for it. I have a problem with bulbs, they will not fit through the reflector,The ROP and all the WA's should be O.K Rite? The 1111, 1164 and 1185 should work fine with out having to regulate or change the switch on the maglite? I just want something dependable. From what I have been reading ,you are Kryptonite to the bulbs as Luxluthor is to superman. AGAIN THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR YOUR TIME AND GOOD ADVICE Wayne 21


----------



## nfetterly

Interest Thread – Need 250 bulbs for this to happen

I started this over in the Group Buy section - but wanted exposure over here.... looks like a bunch of bulb folks...

I’ve got a FiveMega M*g that runs the FM Carley 43W bulb. I’ve only got 4 bulbs (I bought this from another forum member).

The bulbs were custom made to FiveMega specifications by Carley – and there are none available. I’ve had some PMs with FiveMega and he’s open to having another run of bulbs, but the minimum order is 250 with the cost being around $12 per bulb. FiveMega (reasonably) also will require pre-pay for the run of bulbs to happen.

I’ve seen people posting that they want to buy the bulb, its #12 on LuxLuthor's list of most powerful MAG Mods (see above). *1500 Bulb Lumens* It is really incredible – it’s the light I use to “wow” people in the office – pull out a fancy looking M*g and shine a hot spot on a wall 100 yards away.


If you are interested - please post over on my thread in the Market Place Group Buys. I'm up for 20 bulbs. Total is ~75 right now.

Neale


----------



## Roland

nfetterly said:


> it’s the light I use to “wow” people in the office – pull out a fancy looking M*g and shine a hot spot on a wall 100 yards away.


100 Yards. You work in a big office then.


----------



## corndog815

Will all of these work with a 2d Mag?


----------



## sylathnie

Most of these require at least a 3D Mag but some will fit in a 2D or smaller. The batteries required for the high items on the list simply take up too much space.


----------



## wayne21

Hello LuxLuthor. You have given me a lot of good advice in the recent past,I hope another question is not asking to much. Here goe's Doe's the cheap battery pack site's 1700 Mah batteries work any better then Sanyos 2700Mah batteries? doe's the ROP mod need a high drain battery as sold on the cheap battery pack site?I am getting ready to order batteries and wanted your advice before doing so. I respect Your advice very much. also thank you again for your past help and very good advice . Some how I wish I could talk to you. I have already learned quite a bit from reading your threads along with modocods threads who also was of great help. you were rite . There a lot of good people out there on this forum. you have a good weekend CPF wayne 21 wayne Farrar


----------



## LuxLuthor

wayne21 said:


> Hello LuxLuthor. You have given me a lot of good advice in the recent past,I hope another question is not asking to much. Here goe's Doe's the cheap battery pack site's 1700 Mah batteries work any better then Sanyos 2700Mah batteries? doe's the ROP mod need a high drain battery as sold on the cheap battery pack site?I am getting ready to order batteries and wanted your advice before doing so. I respect Your advice very much. also thank you again for your past help and very good advice . Some how I wish I could talk to you. I have already learned quite a bit from reading your threads along with modocods threads who also was of great help. you were rite . There a lot of good people out there on this forum. you have a good weekend CPF wayne 21 wayne Farrar



In general, with AA NiMH cells, once you go up to 2500mAh or higher, their performance under moderate loads is lacking. The ROP needs about 4.5 Amps which I put in that moderate category.

I would recommend the Sanyo Eneloops (2,000mAH) for applications up to about 5.5 Amps sustained. Above that, I would go with the CBP Elite 1700 AA cells.

So I would recommend the Eneloops for this ROP application.


----------



## wayne21

using potted 1185's and some other bulbs { Bi-Pin } I seem to be having a hard time to get a tight focus on them. on some the head has to be so far out ,it almost falls off. any info or ideas on how to get a tight focus for the max,throw will be welcome.the Reflectors are FM dual purpose deep reflectors. on m,y 2-D with a cam less reflector all I did was put a lock washer over the bulb before replacing the head and it worked perfect. I can not get results like that on my other 2-D or 3-D with cammed reflectors. using the ROP -H- according to my voltage tester 9.3 volts at the socket pushes it hard ,but it will not flash the bulb and I do get a fair amount of use out of the bulb.your note's help me quite a bit. I already fried almost $100.00 in bulbs trying to get a bright ,tight spot light. thank you for all your help and information. any replys on getting a better focus will be very welcome. again thank you,your past support, and you have already helped more then you can know. wayne 21 P.s Some time I sure would like to talk to you if and when you have the time.


----------



## KiwiMark

Spypro said:


> The more I'm looking at this forum the more I want to create a monster.
> I really like the idea of a 64458 bulb in a Mag body.
> 
> What would be the best battery option in regard of the voltage I want to apply ?



I have my 64458 up and running in a Mag 4D body. I am using the standard body, head & tailcap.
I am using an AW softstarter, OP Aluminium reflector, glass lens and 5 x AW IMR 26500 cells.

Since I am using the standard Mag head with a large bulb I am not getting much of a hotspot, but the torch still throws a long way with an incredible wall of light. This is a real hand held floodlight! I have managed to get flame from newspaper within a couple of seconds, there is plenty of light & heat coming out the front of this torch!

After playing around a bit I measured the amps at 9.70A, I'll have to test again with the cells fresh off the charger.

I would say that this build is pretty easy to do and apart from the expense of the AW Soft Starter and IMR Cells it wouldn't be hard for anyone to replicate it.


----------



## zehnmm

KiwiMark said:


> I have my 64458 up and running in a Mag 4D body. I am using the standard body, head & tailcap.
> I am using an AW softstarter, OP Aluminium reflector, glass lens and 5 x AW IMR 26500 cells.
> 
> Since I am using the standard Mag head with a large bulb I am not getting much of a hotspot, but the torch still throws a long way with an incredible wall of light. This is a real hand held floodlight! I have managed to get flame from newspaper within a couple of seconds, there is plenty of light & heat coming out the front of this torch!
> 
> After playing around a bit I measured the amps at 9.70A, I'll have to test again with the cells fresh off the charger.
> 
> I would say that this build is pretty easy to do and apart from the expense of the AW Soft Starter and IMR Cells it wouldn't be hard for anyone to replicate it.


 
This is great news! Have you tried any of the other Osram IRC bulbs with your setup, like the 64440 IRC 50W? 

Also, did the 5x 26500's fit ok in your 4D? Or did you have to do something, like mess with the tailcap spring?


Thanks!

Steve


----------



## Turbo Guy

Hi LuxLuther,

I hate to clutter up your thread with this but would you please send me a PM either here on CP or RC groups.

Looking for the simpliest / cheapest way to upgrade MagLite switch , lower resistence.

Yes I used the search but not much luck as not interested in a whole new switch or addin a mofet.

Thanks Charles AKA Everydaflyer


----------



## LuxLuthor

Turbo Guy said:


> Hi LuxLuther,
> 
> I hate to clutter up your thread with this but would you please send me a PM either here on CP or RC groups.
> 
> Looking for the simpliest / cheapest way to upgrade MagLite switch , lower resistence.
> 
> Yes I used the search but not much luck as not interested in a whole new switch or addin a mofet.
> 
> Thanks Charles AKA Everydaflyer



PM sent. For reference, AWR's lower resistance fixes are still online here:


Magswitch Fix
PR Switch Fix
Tailcap Fix


----------



## KiwiMark

zehnmm said:


> This is great news! Have you tried any of the other Osram IRC bulbs with your setup, like the 64440 IRC 50W?
> 
> Also, did the 5x 26500's fit ok in your 4D? Or did you have to do something, like mess with the tailcap spring?



I was already using a golden shorty spring from KD but I think a normal spring would work (I like the shorty spring even with standard batteries as it is easier to get the tail cap on without pushing so hard). Other than that I just used some PVC tubing from a plumbing supply shop to convert the width. The length of 4 x D cells is 4 x 60mm = 240mm, the length of 5 x C cells is 5 x 50mm = 250mm, it shouldn't be too hard to fit them in. Obviously protected C cells would be harder as the protection circuit adds a little more to the length.

I haven't tried a 64440, but I do have Several Osram 12V bulbs (64623, 64440, 64447 &64458). From Lux's destructive bulb tests I would say that the 64447 (65W) would be pushing it for the voltage as it handles 1V less than the 64458, the 64623 would instaflash, but the 64440 should work fine as it can handle 1V more than the 64458. But at 18.5V (5x3.7V) the 64440 should be outputing just over 4000 Lumen and the 64458 just under 6000 Lumen according to Lux's tests - so the 64458 is the shizzle!


----------



## zehnmm

KiwiMark said:


> I was already using a golden shorty spring from KD but I think a normal spring would work (I like the shorty spring even with standard batteries as it is easier to get the tail cap on without pushing so hard). Other than that I just used some PVC tubing from a plumbing supply shop to convert the width. The length of 4 x D cells is 4 x 60mm = 240mm, the length of 5 x C cells is 5 x 50mm = 250mm, it shouldn't be too hard to fit them in. Obviously protected C cells would be harder as the protection circuit adds a little more to the length.
> 
> I haven't tried a 64440, but I do have Several Osram 12V bulbs (64623, 64440, 64447 &64458). From Lux's destructive bulb tests I would say that the 64447 (65W) would be pushing it for the voltage as it handles 1V less than the 64458, the 64623 would instaflash, but the 64440 should work fine as it can handle 1V more than the 64458. But at 18.5V (5x3.7V) the 64440 should be outputing just over 4000 Lumen and the 64458 just under 6000 Lumen according to Lux's tests - so the 64458 is the shizzle!


 

Thanks KiwiMark! And also congratulations on a great hotwire!

Steve


----------



## Nite

I saw that video on youtube!! ( a long long time ago)

WHich one of these do I start out with first Lux?

I want one that will at least start fires with its beam!


----------



## vestureofblood

Nite said:


> I want one that will at least start fires with its beam!


 

Just MHO, but M*g 623 (osram 64623 bulb) is a great way to go for a guaranteed fire starter. WA1185 and Philips 5761 can do it but its no guarantee and you will need a bit of patients. A 623 on a dry piece of paper is about a 1.2.3  .......

Although run time is not good with these lights. Depending on how you choose to power it most 623s only run about 8-10 min. Where as a M*g85 or M*g61 will run long enough to make it a usable light 20-30 on the 5761 30-45 minute ish on average for the 1185.


----------



## LuxLuthor

Yeah, I agree most have done the "torch" with the 64623, and it's pretty resilient of voltage abuse.


----------



## KiwiMark

I have a few Osram bulbs including the 64623 and I really prefer the 64458 if it is possible to up the voltage enough. The 64458 has a better shaped filament for a better shaped hotspot and it can take more volts and output more light.

The 64623 is a 100W bulb that can be pushed to about 175W before 
The 64648 is a 90W bulb that can be pushed to about 225W before 

But of course the voltage available is a factor - at the same voltage the 64623 will be brighter. If you can push it past 19V then the 64458 is the bees knees! I use 5 x IMR 26500 to give me 19+ Volts fresh off the charger.


----------



## LuxLuthor

I added the tiny CL-1794 running on 2 x 18650 cells. It is very close to the 1331 bulb in the shootout I just did here. Overall visibilty when moving lights around at different objects give slight edge to the 1794. In any case it is pretty damn amazing to have such a tiny 21W bulb be able to perform at this level.


----------



## [email protected]

I think the databank 70 should be included on this list as it keeps about as much of the mag as the current no.1.


----------



## LuxLuthor

[email protected] said:


> I think the databank 70 should be included on this list as it keeps about as much of the mag as the current no.1.



I'm not discounting the  magnificence of the Data Bank 70, but it is not at all related to a hand held Maglite Mod which this topic list is about. It belongs in the spotlight/searchlight/HID type category.


----------



## DM51

[email protected] said:


> I think the databank 70 should be included on this list as it keeps about as much of the mag as the current no.1.


There's a thread called The BIG Lights which lists most of the ground-breaking and spectacular innovations made by CPFers. The DataBank 70 is there, as are LuxLuthor's magnificently lethal contributions and many others...


----------



## [email protected]

DM51 said:


> There's a thread called The BIG Lights which lists most of the ground-breaking and spectacular innovations made by CPFers. The DataBank 70 is there, as are LuxLuthor's magnificently lethal contributions and many others...


----------



## Outdoors Fanatic

Does the *Osram 64430* fit in a SureFire Turbohead? Where I can get the G6,35 socket for SF Turboheads?

Thanks in advance.


----------



## Josey

JimmyM deserves to be on LuxLuthor's list for his monster Mag -- a 458 bulb driven by 17 1/2D NiMH cells. I put a FM 3" head on it, and JimmyM later built a MossFET switch for it. That's more than 20 volts with serious resistance fixes, and the bulb didn't blow. 

The massive battery -- the light was about 3 feet long -- gave it really decent runtime. JimmyM sold it to me, and -- after a ton of fun -- I sold it to someone in Germany. I don't know where it is now. I stored it by setting it upright on its head, reverse candle mode. It's early, experimental switch came on by itself one day. Fortunately, I was home. What I smelled was a hole being burned through my floor.

Total lumens are tough to figure, but it put my old X990 to shame. I put it on a poacher who sneaked up to my cabin one night. Lit up the inside of his cab like he was on the sun. I thought his upholstery might spontaneously combust, but he peeled out in a hurry. There was either a cigarette in his mouth or his plaid shirt was smoking.

Here's the photo: From left to right: Mag 6C ROP; Mag 623; JS's regulated TL 11; Mag 85; JimmyM's Monster; X990


----------



## Mjolnir

Wow, that thing is a monster. Have you hit any home runs with it?

How much did it weigh?


----------



## LuxLuthor

Josey, I have the 64458 in the #6 spot with 1 less cell, so it gives that bulb a good public awareness exposure. No doubt the 17th cell pushes it even further.

However, in general I tried to list mods that were relatively accessible to build, and mostly with ones that I own, and can do a side-by-side to verify their status. The length of your light makes it relatively obscure.

In reality, with AlanB and JimmyM's drivers being able to push existing bulbs to a higher, regulated output (rather than direct drive)...many of my guestimates in first post can push an existing bulb voltage higher.

One of these days, I'll add some worthy updated models, like FM's CL-1909. I'm distracted with just getting into new Knives hobby.


----------



## Josey

Hey Lux:

Not only does the 17th cell push the bulb a lot harder, but the 1/2D high-current cells at 4Ah don't sag much under load. You're right that it's too big a light for most people, but dang it sure put out a lot of light.

But I'll leave you to do the list organizing. I appreciate your list a lot. Thanks.


----------



## Josey

Mjolnir said:


> Wow, that thing is a monster. Have you hit any home runs with it?
> 
> How much did it weigh?



It's the only flashlight I know that is suitable for jousting. That ought to be worth something.


----------



## cernobila

LuxLuthor said:


> One of these days, I'll add some worthy updated models, like FM's CL-1909. I'm distracted with just getting into new Knives hobby.



I have a couple of the FM1909's on order, will try it out in the 3xD Maglite, hoping that it will replace the 1185 that is in it now.........btw in my case, the knives came first than I saw the light, so to speak....


----------



## cernobila

cernobila said:


> I have a couple of the FM1909's on order, will try it out in the 3xD Maglite, hoping that it will replace the 1185 that is in it now.........btw in my case, the knives came first than I saw the light, so to speak....



Got the bulbs today and yep the light is brighter with this in it, compared to the same light with 1185.

I wonder if someone could work out the approximate lumens coming out of this thing.......just for the record the light is as follows.

2xD Maglite with 65 mm extension tube, shortened spring and original tailcap.
Boro lens and alloy reflector.
AW soft start/three level switch.
3x D Kaidomain protected cells.
1x FM1909 bulb.

And that is it.

It feels as if these items are made for each other.......


----------



## fivemega

cernobila said:


> 2xD Maglite with 65 mm extension tube, shortened spring and original tailcap.
> Boro lens and alloy reflector.
> AW soft start/three level switch.
> 3x D Kaidomain protected cells.
> 1x FM1909 bulb



*Replace the batteries with three of 26650
Use braid copper wire instead of tail spring.
Your batteries never hold the voltage under heavy load like IMRs do.*


----------



## LuxLuthor

fivemega said:


> *Replace the batteries with three of 26650
> Use braid copper wire instead of tail spring.
> Your batteries never hold the voltage under heavy load like IMRs do.*



Sounds great!

This incredible FM-1909 bulb is going to make me update my list on page one soon. :thumbsup: When I get the perfect setup for it, I'm gonna name it "*The Varooj*." About time he got some credit around here!


----------



## Mjolnir

It seems like 3 of those 26650s would fit pretty well in a 3D maglite with a very low profile spring. It seems like you wouldn't even need to de-anodize the tailcap. A spring that is virtually flat should work in the normal position. 

One of these bulbs with 3 IMR 26650s in a 3D maglite would make a very inexpensive 2000+ lumen light with a good half hour of runtime...


----------



## cernobila

Even with my "not recommended" 3xD Kai protected cells, this is now my brightest light that I have (not even fully charged) without a doubt. It beats my 1185 as well as the WE 24W HID lights. The only issue is that with the standard Mag head/bezel, you can not get a narrow beam......I need some advice on which of the FM custom heads/reflectors I should get to make this a thrower, I am looking for one of the smaller cheaper versions if possible.......


----------



## Fulgeo

cernobila said:


> Even with my "not recommended" 3xD Kai protected cells, this is now my brightest light that I have (not even fully charged) without a doubt. It beats my 1185 as well as the WE 24W HID lights. The only issue is that with the standard Mag head/bezel, you can not get a narrow beam......I need some advice on which of the FM custom heads/reflectors I should get to make this a thrower, I am looking for one of the smaller cheaper versions if possible.......



Hey Cernobila,

Go snatch yourself on of the "Ver2 Deep M*g Reflectors" by FM. It will give you the thrower you want. I have four of them and they work well with this bulb and all the WA bulbs I have tried it on. I love the FM1909. It is almost magical. Even with a normal FM MOP metal reflector it has such a nice split of good useable flood and great throw.

Happy Mods!


----------



## Outdoors Fanatic

Mjolnir said:


> It seems like 3 of those 26650s would fit pretty well in a 3D maglite with a very low profile spring. It seems like you wouldn't even need to de-anodize the tailcap. A spring that is virtually flat should work in the normal position.
> 
> One of these bulbs with 3 IMR 26650s in a 3D maglite would make a very inexpensive 2000+ lumen light with a good half hour of runtime...


I think 3 of those in a Mag 4C would be an even better form factor.


----------



## cernobila

Fulgeo said:


> Hey Cernobila,
> 
> Go snatch yourself on of the "Ver2 Deep M*g Reflectors" by FM. It will give you the thrower you want. I have four of them and they work well with this bulb and all the WA bulbs I have tried it on. I love the FM1909. It is almost magical. Even with a normal FM MOP metal reflector it has such a nice split of good useable flood and great throw.
> 
> Happy Mods!



Thanks for that, I also have the FM MOP in the light now but I think that this bulb should be allowed to go for a good sprint, so I will get it a better pair of running shoes.


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## Mjolnir

Outdoors Fanatic said:


> I think 3 of those in a Mag 4C would be an even better form factor.



It would be, but they are too wide to fit in a stock C maglite.


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## bk737

The 26650's will fit in a 3d with a tail spring mod:devil:


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## bk737

Cernobila,
The 1909 is AWESOME with the 2.5 Throwmaster!


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## cernobila

bk737 said:


> Cernobila,
> The 1909 is AWESOME with the 2.5 Throwmaster!



Well, I decided to try out a couple of FM's "Bi-Focal M*g Reflectors", one for the 3xD and one for the 3xC Maglite, I am trying to avoid the extra size and keep the cost down. If I can achieve a reasonably good throw beam than I will be a happy camper.


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## Techjunkie

I have a Mag 2D with de-anod'd tail cap and shortened spring that's currently running a Philips 5761 in a Kiu socket from 2 Sony 26650VT batteries (carfully charged to 3.9V each to avoid ). I've played with a few different OP reflectors and found that a reamed DX P7 reflector actually gives a nicer hotspot than a reamed WF-500 reflector (which works surprisingly well for larger bulbs) or either of the two KD Mag reflectors I have.

I'm thinking of upgrading it to a FM1909 and 3 AW IMR 26500 cells. According to Lux's chart, I could also potentially run the FM1909 in a different host on 4xLiFePO4 18650, considering sag and resistance would keep Vbatt under load at 12.8v or lower.

My question is, how does the filament size of the FM1909 compare to the 5761? I really don't want to go any larger, like 623 territory, and start losing tight focus. If a $105 Throwmaster is necessary to give as tight a spot with the FM1909 as the 5761 in a conventional 2" reflector, then I think I'll take a pass.

Can anyone provide a comparison of the two filaments? (I've never seen an actual photo of the FM1909 bulb for reference.) Thanks.


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## LuxLuthor

Techjunkie said:


> I have a Mag 2D with de-anod'd tail cap and shortened spring that's currently running a Philips 5761 in a Kiu socket from 2 Sony 26650VT batteries (carfully charged to 3.9V each to avoid ). I've played with a few different OP reflectors and found that a reamed DX P7 reflector actually gives a nicer hotspot than a reamed WF-500 reflector (which works surprisingly well for larger bulbs) or either of the two KD Mag reflectors I have.
> 
> I'm thinking of upgrading it to a FM1909 and 3 AW IMR 26500 cells. According to Lux's chart, I could also potentially run the FM1909 in a different host on 4xLiFePO4 18650, considering sag and resistance would keep Vbatt under load at 12.8v or lower.
> 
> My question is, how does the filament size of the FM1909 compare to the 5761? I really don't want to go any larger, like 623 territory, and start losing tight focus. If a $105 Throwmaster is necessary to give as tight a spot with the FM1909 as the 5761 in a conventional 2" reflector, then I think I'll take a pass.
> 
> Can anyone provide a comparison of the two filaments? (I've never seen an actual photo of the FM1909 bulb for reference.) Thanks.



I discussed and photographed it in this thread and post.


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## Techjunkie

LuxLuthor said:


> I discussed and photographed it in this thread and post.


 
Thanks. I searched before posting but I should have realized that I can't see most photobucket pics from work. (Corp. proxy blocks all "online storage" sites.) It's wierd, some images show up and others don't. (Your's don't.) I'll look again when I get home.

Sounds like good news though. Now to get a bulb...


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## donn_

> *5)* Osram 150W *64633 at 16.8V* (ideally with new AlanB/JimmyM regulator). I just added this based solely upon my destructive testing, but have not made a working light with this due to the 50 Hr rated bulb life, and high liklihood of flashing the bulb with most battery combinations. If you can set a regulator to 16.8V, it should fit into this ranking.



I'm running this combination in a stretched 6D with 6x26650 Emoli cells, and AlanB's sled set at 16.5V. Very bright with FM's 3" head.

I just got around to swapping in FM's 3.5" head, and it makes quite a difference.

I look forward to trying Jonathan's 4" head as soon as the Exotic Coating Service is over.


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## Benson

LuxLuthor said:


> Sounds great!
> 
> This incredible FM-1909 bulb is going to make me update my list on page one soon. :thumbsup: When I get the perfect setup for it, I'm gonna name it "*The Varooj*." About time he got some credit around here!



Speaking of updating... when ya gonna get the IRCs in there? 

Just finished a 6D/5x26700 build running a 64440 IRC at 19.0V (measured at the bulb after only a couple minutes of shining it around being impressed, so it shouldn't be _much_ more on fresh cells), and came over here to see where it stacked up. Since that bulb gets hotrated at 4963 lm, would that fall between the Maxblaster and the Deathblaster?

Still gotta recharge the batteries and monitor the initial voltage with the 50W bulb before I decide if I want to try my 64447 IRC -- it's gotta be close to an instaflash, if not over. Any idea whether this (with slightly discharged battery, if needed) would be under or over the Deathblaster?


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## lctorana

Benson said:


> Speaking of updating... when ya gonna get the IRCs in there?


When you send him some to test.


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## Benson

lctorana said:


> When you send him some to test.



 He's already tested the IRC bulbs over in the destructive testing thread, and this is a relative ranking using (wrong) lumen figures from the old hotrater anyway -- you mean send him a flashlight, or what?


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## LuxLuthor

Ictorana was staring into a 64623 too long, and has not fully recovered his faculties. He thought this was the destructive testing thread, which as you noted has already done the IRC bulbs.

Eventually I'll update this ranking, but I was holding out until I got JimmyM's and/or AlanB's regulated drivers set up for various bulbs so as to drive them to the screaming edge before ranking. Most all the bulbs already in this list are direct drive setups, which in some cases are not really being pushed to their proper limits....so it's one of those more involved re-review/testings that's on my list.


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## LEDAdd1ct

Been a lurker since 2004/2005, and joined in 2007, and never explored hotwires until now.

Thank you for the truly excellent guide, Lux—I look forward to many hours of enjoyment by the fruits of your labors and the other contributors.


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## LuxLuthor

My pleasure.


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## LuxLuthor

I resurrected this thread after someone sent me a PM asking about mrartillery's light, so I put it in position #2.


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## DBCstm

Right up front I admit to not reading the entire thread. But, as some time has passed between most of the thread and now, this may be very relevant. I recently got a Triple XM-L2 from ElektroLumens in a hockey-puck style drop in that is completely reversible. I modded the tail spring with a copper wire, replaced the positive spring at the base of the switch assembly with a spiral of 12ga copper soldered in place, used a copper wire in the sliding cam stack and wrapped the drop-in with strips cut from a coke can to make it a press fit. It's running in a 3D Mag with Imedion Low Self Discharge NiMH cells and pulling 9A in direct drive, for some 3000 lumens of output. In a 10 minute test with an outdoor thermometer probe taped to the side of the stock head, it reached 120º. I've since replaced the stock head with a finned head but haven't run heat tests since I did this. 

This drop-in should have a run-time around 1 hour with the 9500mAh capacity of the cells. The Tri Diffuse TIR optics put out a wall of light, illuminating everything in a 50 yd long by 30 yd wide area quite nicely. Pretty neat mod for a 3D Maglite, relatively economical.

My brightest light so far, but then, I'm a noob! 

Dale


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## LuxLuthor

Dale, looks interesting. Where did you find the TIR optics? If you used the last item on his page here, that looks to just be a diffuser lens over the top. It looks like it would be a flood monster at the expense of throw. Anyone have actual beam shots of it?


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## DBCstm

That's the one I got. The diffuser lens is part of the Triple Optics. Found that out by disassembling the drop-in and modifying it. Edit: Forgot to mention, the red oil drum is 50 yds away. The little building to left is 8x16 and 25 yds away with the tree to right 15 yds. Same place and position as the comparison shots below where all camera settings were the same, including for the below shot, on manual at 1/6 sec f2.8 800ISO



DBC_May 11, 2013_211137 v2 by genie in a black box, on Flickr

And some comparison



L2PM3 vs HD2010 Vs 3DMagElktlum by genie in a black box, on Flickr


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## DBCstm

After some modification, I'm pulling 9A from the Imedion NiMH cells on 3 XM-L2 emitters. Should be up towards 3000 lumens. And yes, it's a floody beast. I'd like to find a Triple optic without the diffuser lens to get a little more punch out of it.


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## climberkid

DBCstm said:


> After some modification, I'm pulling 9A from the Imedion NiMH cells on 3 XM-L2 emitters. Should be up towards 3000 lumens. And yes, it's a floody beast. I'd like to find a Triple optic without the diffuser lens to get a little more punch out of it.



That would be a nice even combination of both. I think its important for a light the size of the mag to have a decent amount of throw, but not too much that you sacrafics your foot light. I'd like to make some modifications to my triple xpg puck.


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## mrartillery

LuxLuthor said:


> I resurrected this thread after someone sent me a PM asking about mrartillery's light, so I put it in position #2.



Thanks Lux, it's an honor!


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## Hallis

I'm surprised this thread isn't a sticky, honestly. I come back to it all the time for ideas for my next build. It's a great reference.


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## vestureofblood

I agree. There was a day when threads like this and the destructive incan bulb test were cornerstones of the forum.


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## LuxLuthor

It's a secret thread only for the cool guys.


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## Norm

LuxLuthor said:


> It's a secret thread only for the cool guys.


There is a  Incandescent Forum - Threads of Interest  instead of multiple stckied threads and you'll find this thread right at the top of the list. 

Norm


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## LuxLuthor

Norm said:


> There is a  Incandescent Forum - Threads of Interest  instead of multiple stckied threads and you'll find this thread right at the top of the list.
> 
> Norm



See like I said, Norm is one of the cool guys and not only knows about these type of things but had it covered before we even thought about it. :thumbsup:


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## Hallis

LuxLuthor said:


> See like I said, Norm is one of the cool guys and not only knows about these type of things but had it covered before we even thought about it. :thumbsup:



Excellent. Now respond to the PM I sent you a few weeks ago


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## Poohgyrr

Wow. I think I love this forum. Just skimming through this thread has me smiling. I have to return later and look stuff up so I know what to get for our old Maglites. Some of those pics show a lot of light - just the thing for outdoors at night. :thumbsup:


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## Hallis

Poohgyrr said:


> Wow. I think I love this forum. Just skimming through this thread has me smiling. I have to return later and look stuff up so I know what to get for our old Maglites. Some of those pics show a lot of light - just the thing for outdoors at night. :thumbsup:



If you can get your hands on the right parts. Which can be a little difficult these days but not impossible. You can do a LOT with old Mag hosts, especially D-cell size. Mag mods comprise the bulk of my collection.


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## fivemega

NEW2LED said:


> Are there still LED modifications available through vendors for the Maglite D cell flashlights?



*You will get better result if you Google search (top left of this page) for 3XML M*g C & D drop in by Fivemega  or any other drop in M*g which are available in CPF's Custom & Modified Flashlights - Buy/Sell/Trade*


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## Poohgyrr

Theseold modded mags still put out some light.


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## Bullzeyebill

Two off topic posts removed. This is an incan thread.

Bill


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