# Surefire KL4 XP-G



## DaFABRICATA (Oct 22, 2009)

I had an extra KL4 sitting around that wasn't getting used, SOOOOO...:devil:

A copper shim was made to fill the cavity from the old LUX V emitter and an XP-G on the 10mm board was installed. It seems to focus perfectly with the stock reflector and the uses the stock driver....for now. I have a few drivers on order and will likely replace the KL4 driver as I'm sure its a bit much for the XP-G.
The backside of the reflector area needs a little triming, but nothing major.

This thing is bright as hell!
Blows the doors off the original..

Not nearly as floody and it throws pretty damn well

*Beamshots below show a stock LUX V KL4, P7 KL4, & XP-G KL4*...:naughty::twothumbs

Now to order more XP-G's













*LUX V---------------------P7------------------------XP-G*





*LUX V*





*P7*





*XP-G*


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## Bullzeyebill (Oct 22, 2009)

DaFab, would you check the battery draw at the tailcap? Also, will it run on a 17670? If so current draw from battery?

Bill


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## DaFABRICATA (Oct 22, 2009)

Bill,

Multimeter is out at the moment.
As soon as I get it back I will update


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## ICUDoc (Oct 22, 2009)

Love the beamshot- really does out-do the Lux V. Is the spill much dimmer / smaller or just by comparison to the hotspot?


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## DaFABRICATA (Oct 22, 2009)

ICUDoc said:


> Love the beamshot- really does out-do the Lux V. Is the spill much dimmer / smaller or just by comparison to the hotspot?


 


The spill reaches out the same but is brighter too!

It finally got dark out. I tried it outside and what a difference!
It out-throws the Kl4 with a P7.
I will get some beamshot in the dark when I get a night when it isn't raining.* Beamshots in the rain never look as impressive*.


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## DaFABRICATA (Oct 22, 2009)

Ok...I gave in and posted beamshots comparing 3 different KL4's..


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## ROK (Oct 22, 2009)

HAHA I already did mine.
I prefer keep original form factor. So I didn't touch the head and filed down a MCPCB.
I'm satisfied with beam quality.
I'll add some glowing epoxy or reflective sheet to cover the urgly face.


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## DaFABRICATA (Oct 22, 2009)

ROK,

NICE JOB!!!...Very clean! 
It is a very nice beam and output isn't it?


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## Bullzeyebill (Oct 22, 2009)

ROK, nice shots, and great beam. Do not worry about the "ugly face". Beauty is in the eye of the beholder; it does not bother me.

Bill


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## smokelaw1 (Oct 22, 2009)

Nice work! Who wants to do mine?


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## ROK (Oct 22, 2009)

DaFABRICATA said:


> ROK,
> 
> NICE JOB!!!...Very clean!
> It is a very nice beam and output isn't it?



YEAH! I love the beam quality and output.
In my study, XPG is compatible with Lux & SSC P4 than XR-E.
I think 2mm*20mm MCPCB with diagonal +/- pattern of pcb is the better for KL4 mod.

I have searched buck/boost convert for 1 cell & 2 cell use but no luck.
Anyone knows this kind of converter?


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## Bullzeyebill (Oct 22, 2009)

ROK said:


> YEAH! I love the beam quality and output.
> In my study, XPG is compatible with Lux & SSC P4 than XR-E.
> I think 2mm*20mm MCPCB with diagonal +/- pattern of pcb is the better for KL4 mod.
> 
> ...



The SF KL1, buck/boost.

Bill


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## ROK (Oct 23, 2009)

Bullzeyebill said:


> The SF KL1, buck/boost.
> 
> Bill



I have modded many Surefires.
The parts layout of KL1 circuit is larger than KL4. So it is not fit to KL4 heatsink.


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## toby_pra (Oct 23, 2009)

Very very awesome mod!:thumbsup:


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## Blindasabat (Oct 23, 2009)

I'll let you borrow mine. And while I'm there you can help me solder some LEDs!


DaFABRICATA said:


> Bill,
> 
> Multimeter is out at the moment.
> As soon as I get it back I will update


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## DaFABRICATA (Oct 23, 2009)

Blindasabat said:


> I'll let you borrow mine. And while I'm there you can help me solder some LEDs!


 



Mark, 

Works for me!
Send me a PM if you want to get together to do some modding!:thumbsup:
Soldering with this new Hakko is sooo nice..:naughty:


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## boznet (Oct 23, 2009)

Hello, thanks for the nice mod, i'm a newbie in soldering, which hakko do you use?


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## ROK (Oct 23, 2009)

boznet said:


> Hello, thanks for the nice mod, i'm a newbie in soldering, which hakko do you use?



Good soldering iron is helpful but not requisite.
I have used cheap HAKKO 980 with fine tip. Most important factor is experience.

Another mod with XP-G


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## DaFABRICATA (Oct 23, 2009)

ROK said:


> Good soldering iron is helpful but not requisite.
> I have used cheap HAKKO 980 with fine tip. Most important factor is experience.
> 
> Another mod with XP-G


 


Nice one!!

Ya beat me to it..:laughing:

BEAMSHOT PLEASE!!

How does it do in the KT1/KT2/KT4?



BTW...I use a Hakko 936:twothumbs


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## Justin Case (Oct 23, 2009)

Looks like you filed down a 10mm round. I have some 8mm rounds on order (but not in stock right now) to avoid that hassle. I also have some 10mm rounds on order if I can't wait that long for the 8mm.

What focus height is your tower? Seoul? Lux? What's your driver?

Can you measure the total height of the XP-G package from bottom of the MCPCB to the top of the square ceramic substrate. I would assume that it is close to 2mm + 0.58mm. Does it look like the XP-G die sits at the same level as the top of the ceramic substrate? I'm trying to estimate the XP-G die height to see how close it is to a Seoul focus.

My plan is to mount the XP-G on a Seoul focus tower, driving it with an SOB1185 (that's what I happen to have in my parts drawer, would have preferred an SOB1000). I plan to test the XP-G tower in an SRTH, T-62, KT1/2, and KT4 and compare it to P4 and MC-E towers.


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## darkzero (Oct 23, 2009)

DaFABRICATA said:


> Nice one!!
> 
> Ya beat me to it..:laughing:


 
PM sent


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## ROK (Oct 23, 2009)

Justin Case said:


> Looks like you filed down a 10mm round. I have some 8mm rounds on order (but not in stock right now) to avoid that hassle. I also have some 10mm rounds on order if I can't wait that long for the 8mm.
> 
> What focus height is your tower? Seoul? Lux? What's your driver?
> 
> ...



I built this for my friend and used Lux Tower Module, SOB1000 and Cutter's 10mm MCPCB (2mm thickness).
It looks XP-G die is same level as the top of the ceramic base.
The total height from bottom to the top of the ceramic is about 2.8mm.
In my calculation, mine is slightly lower than Lux5.

You have to know the quality of reflow soldering is not good. LED is not flat and inclined.
So, I had to fix it. :hairpull: :whoopin:

Now I cannot test it with turbo head because I sold all mine. 
But I believe this will shows good result.


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## octaf (Oct 24, 2009)

very nice, ROK ! :thumbsup:


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## Justin Case (Oct 24, 2009)

ROK said:


> I built this for my friend and used Lux Tower Module, SOB1000 and Cutter's 10mm MCPCB (2mm thickness).
> It looks XP-G die is same level as the top of the ceramic base.
> The total height from bottom to the top of the ceramic is about 2.8mm.
> In my calculation, mine is slightly lower than Lux5.
> ...



Thank you. That is very helpful. If you still have the assembled tower (or an empty one), can you also measure the length of the stem from the top face of the large flange to the top of the tower (or for the assembled unit, to the interface between the tower and the XP-G MCPCB)? For my Seoul focus AW tower, that length is 20.47mm (0.806"). For a Netkidz tower, it is 20.015mm (0.788"). The difference is 0.46mm, which is just about the same as the difference between your 2.8mm measurement and the case height of a Seoul P4 (2.38mm from the datasheet). Thus, it would seem that the Netkidz tower could put the XP-G/MCPCB at the correct focus height.

If the AW Lux focus tower is say about 0.4mm shorter than the Seoul focus tower, then perhaps the XP-G/MCPCB is also close enough to the right focus height.

Edit: From things like Blackhawk Gladius mods, I now recall that one needs to raise a Seoul P4 up by 0.03" to put its die at the same focus height as a Lux die. Thus, I would assume that an AW Lux focus stem's height is 0.03" (0.76mm) shorter than for an AW Seoul focus stem. So, if you get an AW Lux focus tower, you need to raise up the XP-G/MCPCB by about 0.3mm, or 0.01". I've found that some Amerimax brand 5"x7" aluminum step flashing from Home Depot measures 0.011" thick. The stuff cuts easily with a regular pair of scissors, so you can cut a little 8mm disc for a shim (or even punch out a disc using a paper hole punch).


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## kz1000s1 (Oct 27, 2009)

Justin Case said:


> Looks like you filed down a 10mm round. I have some 8mm rounds on order (but not in stock right now) to avoid that hassle. I also have some 10mm rounds on order if I can't wait that long for the 8mm.



Are these bare 8mm boards or with emitters? I'd like to get some with emitters for Seoul upgrades. Where did you get them?


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## toby_pra (Oct 27, 2009)

You need to sell me this head.....wuuuuussssssaaaaaaa


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## js-lots (Oct 27, 2009)

ROK said:


> HAHA I already did mine.
> I prefer keep original form factor. So I didn't touch the head and filed down a MCPCB.
> I'm satisfied with beam quality.
> I'll add some glowing epoxy or reflective sheet to cover the urgly face.



where do you buy the reflective sheet and glow epoxy? Is the reflective sheet electrically conductive? Thanks, Kenny


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## Justin Case (Oct 30, 2009)

kz1000s1 said:


> Are these bare 8mm boards or with emitters? I'd like to get some with emitters for Seoul upgrades. Where did you get them?



CPF B/S/T forum has various posts selling bare XP-G emitters. You can get empty 8mm XP-E/XP-G MCPCBs from The Sandwich Shoppe.

The 10mm MCPCBs use a very soft aluminum. They are easily trimmed using small diagonal wire cutters and then filed down to the final size.


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## rlowe (Nov 3, 2009)

I believe I'm going to try this for my first Mod. I have a couple of questions though. I haven't taken the KL4 apart yet so I don't understand why you used an emitter on a PCB can the Lux not be removed and replaced with a bare XPG? Also, can I run the Battery Junction 3.6 volt RCR123A cells in this mod or in a stock KL4 or will the higher voltage blow the driver?

Thanks,
Richard


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## DaFABRICATA (Nov 3, 2009)

rlowe said:


> I believe I'm going to try this for my first Mod. I have a couple of questions though. I haven't taken the KL4 apart yet so I don't understand why you used an emitter on a PCB can the Lux not be removed and replaced with a bare XPG? Also, can I run the Battery Junction 3.6 volt RCR123A cells in this mod or in a stock KL4 or will the higher voltage blow the driver?
> 
> Thanks,
> Richard


 

Hello Richard,
The reason the XP-G on the 10mm X 2mm thick board is used is to raise the emitter up into the reflector making it focus correctly. A shim will also need to be made to fill the cavity where the old Lux V was and make it even with the rest of the heatsink. You can use a bare XP-G if you want but a thick shim will need to be made to raise it to focus properly.
Unless you replace the driver, you can only use a single RCR123, 16430, 17670 or 18650 for rechargable options. I suggest using 2 x primaries. 
*DO NOT USE 2 X 3.6V Rechargables! You will blow the driver!*

The easiest way to do this mod, is the way I explained above.
Two oposing sides of the 10mm board need to be filed flat so it can sit up into the pocket where the Lux V used to be. 

*Take the head apart and it will all become clear.*
Good luck!:wave:


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## rlowe (Nov 4, 2009)

Thanks DaFab:

I ordered an emitter on a PCB from cutter.


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## Justin Case (Nov 4, 2009)

Running the KL4 driver with a 3.xV load like the XP-G probably means that the driver is effectively running in direct drive, not boost mode. It would be interesting if you put the light in front of a lux meter and tallied the lux data vs time. Although not definitive, since heat and the ability of the battery to hold its voltage under load can confuse the data interpretation, that might help to confirm DD behavior.

Did you ever get a chance to measure the tail current draw?


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