# M-Zeppelin SF M6 LED mods



## LED Zeppelin

This project started out as a build for fellow member Griff, and evolved into a series of LED mods for the M6. 

The heart of the mod is a two-piece heatsink that features full contact with the back of the head, and the front taper of the tube. The LED heatsink is anodized and comes in four LED configurations:

- *MZOX-4*: Ostar w/ Fraen reflector and cosmetic trim ring, and (3) XRE w/ (2) McR17XR and a McR19XR
- *MZP7-3*: (3) SSC P7 w/ cut down McR27XRs
- *MZXR-5*: (5) XRE w/ McR19XRs
- *MZXR-7*: (7) XRE w/ McR19XRs

All LED sinks have built-in reflector centering seats and LED locating pockets.

The second part of the heatsink is the universal contact which works with any of the LED sinks. It bolts to the LED sink with either 2 or 3 black oxide finish SS Allen bolts depending on the LED pattern. The contact piece is chromate plated for corrosion resistance and conductivity. It has an internal cavity for a board, and completes the circuit with a ground screw for the board and through contact with the taper of the tube. There is a 0.55" contact board with an adjustable (+) terminal.

All the versions use the FM holder loaded with (6) CR123, (6) RCR123, or (3) 17670 depending on the board, LED configuration, and whether or not dimming is desired. The 5 Cree version can run on (6) RCR or CR123s in the stock MB20 holder.

The mod is completely reversible and the light can be returned to stock by removing the module. Parts that are replaced are the reflector, white bearing washer, foam shock cushion, and black cushion support ring. 

Alternately the sink can be epoxied into the head, and the reflectors of the Cree and P7 versions epoxied in their seats for a shock-proof mod. For max shock protection, the board can be potted in the cavity, along with potting the LED leads of the Cree and P7 versions in their wireways. 

Here are the parts that comprise the various sinks:






Special thanks go out to Griff for planting the MZ seed, petrev for motivating the MZP7-3 version, and my friend and CNC machinist extraordinaire John of Begell Tool for transforming my prints into these precision parts. 

I'll dedicate the following posts to each version as I build them up.

*Beamshots:*

Outdoor beamshots. ISO200, F4, 3sec, white balance sunshine. Both Cree versions, MZXR-5 and 7 taken on a different night.
L to R:
1) stock M6 HOLA running fully charged M6R
2) MZOX-4 running 6 X RCR123
3) MZP7-3 running 6 X RCR123
4) MZXR-5 running 3 X 17650
5) MZXR-7 running 3 X 17650













Indoor beamshots, ISO200, F4, white balance sunshine. Three exposures: 1/8 sec, 1/30 sec, 1/125 sec.
Same order as above:







< HOLA






< MZOX-4






< MZP7-3






< MZXR-5






< MZXR-7
*EDIT 4/30/09:* Adding beamshots of a triple MC-E, MZMC-3, with warm JE5 tint and cut McR27S:






< MZMC-3 warm

*Lux Readings* taken at 1.5m (at 1m my meter was overloaded by the M6 and MZXR-7):
- HOLA: 10,260
- MZOX-4: 5,420
- MZP7-3: 5,370
- MZXR-5: 6,860
- MZXR-7: 9,200


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## LED Zeppelin

This is Griff's light, the *MZOX-4*:






















*Hardware:*
- MZOX-4 heatsink: type II ano LED sink, chromate plated universal contact w/ 0.55" contact board
- Z bin Ostar w/ narrow beam Fraen and cosmetic trim ring
- (3) Cree XRE R2 WD
- (2) McR17XR
- (1) McR19XR
- Blue Shark set at max current - 900 mA
- FM 3 X 17670 holder

*Specs:*
- All LEDs in series, Vf = [email protected], [email protected]
- LED current 900 mA
- Light draws [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]

Light runs on 6 X CR123, or 6 X RCR123. With RCR123s, the over-current protection will likely kick in before low-voltage. I estimate the current protection to kick @ 1.5A when the cells are at approx 3.4V ea. Drive current can be dialed down for longer runtimes with the Shark trimpot, but is set to max brightness per Griff's original request.


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## LED Zeppelin

*MZXR-5 *










*Hardware:*- MZXR-5 heatsink: type II ano LED sink, chromate plated universal contact w/ 0.55" contact board
- (5) Cree XRE R2 WD
- (5) McR19XR
- Shark/Remora
- 3 X 17650 in FM holder, or 6 X CR or RCR123 in stockholder

*Specs:*
- All LEDs in series, Vf = [email protected], [email protected]
- Regulated drive currents: Lo 110mA, Med 310mA, Hi 850mA
- Light runs on 3 X 17650 in FM holder or 6 X RCR123 in stock holder
- Using 3 X 17650 in FM holder or 6 X 16340 in stock holder, 11.1V, light draws 1.43A on hi
- Using 6 X CR123 in stock holder, 9V, light draws 1.75A


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## LED Zeppelin

*MZXR-7* 










*Hardware:*
- MZXR-7 heatsink: type II ano LED sink, chromate plated universal contact w/ 0.55" contact board
- (7) Cree XRE R2 WD
- (7) McR19XR
- Blue Shark/Remora
- 3 X 17650 in FM holder

*Specs:*
- All LEDs in series, Vf = [email protected], [email protected]
- Regulated drive currents: Lo 110mA, Med 310mA, Hi 860mA
- Light runs on 3 X 17650 or 6 X CR123 (NOT RCR123) in FM holder
- Using 3 X 17650, 11.1V, light draws 2.05A on hi
- Using 6 X CR123s in FM holder, 18V, light draws 1.19A on hi


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## LED Zeppelin

*MZP7-3*










*Hardware:*
- MZP7-3 heatsink: type II ano LED sink, chromate plated universal contact w/ 0.55" contact board
- (3) SSC P7 DSXOJ
- (3) Modified McR27XR
- Shark Buck 3A/Remora
- 3 X 18650 Leef M tube

*Specs:*
- All LEDs in series, Vf = [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
- Regulated drive currents: Lo 400mA, Med 1A, Hi 2.64A
- Light runs on 3 X 17650 (FM holder), 3 X 18650 (Leef M tube), 6 X CR123 or RCR123 (FM holder). 
- With 3 X 17650 or 18650, hi level is not in regulation, approx 2.6A on full charge (12.6V) decreasing to 1.41A @ 11.1V, consider hi level DD.
- Using CR123s, 18V, light draws 1.81A on hi
- Using RCR123s, 22.2V, light draws 1.47A on hi


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## DaFABRICATA

AMAZING WORK!!

Simply Beautiful!!

I LOVE Griffs new light!!!
I like the offset of the different reflectors...something different.

Any chance of a run of these heatsinks?
I'd be interested in a MZXR-7 Heatsink


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## karlthev

Lordy, a new level of build!


Karl


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## LED Zeppelin

Tim, I do plan to run more of these sinks, and will eventually open an interest thread as I need to make at least 20 pcs for the ano/plating to be cost effective.

But right now the sinks have been made to such a perfect fit, that SF production tolerances might come into play and require some custom fitting for each light. Once I build up some more and get a feel for the M6 tolerances I can tweak the dimensions for a more universal hassle-free fit.

These are quite involved to produce, and not cheap. I'm estimating in the neighborhood of $125 for a complete sink kit. 

The MZP7-3 version uses modded McR27XRs which I will provide, but figure $18 ea. plus $5 modding fee, or $69 per set.


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## MorpheusT1

This is crazy and i love it !!


Will these heatsinks be available for sale anytime soon?





Regards,
Benny


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## donn_

Very cool!

Will that brass bell hanging out the back keep it from screwing onto another M-style body, like a Leef or M4?


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## Kiessling

Nice !!! :bow:

Is the whole thing epoxied in the head or is it held in place by the reflectors and the window?

Griff's light looks really ... differrent 
Nice idea !

bernie


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## LED Zeppelin

donn_ said:


> Very cool!
> 
> Will that brass bell hanging out the back keep it from screwing onto another M-style body, like a Leef or M4?



Good question Donn, I just checked and it fits like a glove on an M4 body. Not sure about the Leef, but if it has the identical mating cone-shape at the front of the tube it should work.



Kiessling said:


> Nice !!! :bow:
> 
> Is the whole thing epoxied in the head or is it held in place by the reflectors and the window?
> 
> Griff's light looks really ... differrent
> Nice idea !
> 
> bernie



Bernie, the module will drop out by removing the bezel and lens. I use a bit of compound in the head, but no epoxy. So it is completely reversible if you want to return your light to stock at any time.


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## donn_

LED Zeppelin said:


> ...I just checked and it fits like a glove on an M4 body. Not sure about the Leef, but if it has the identical mating cone-shape at the front of the tube it should work.



Excellent! It'll probably fit not only the Leef M tubes, but C, with a C2M adapter as well. That'll mean a 3x18650 tube is possible.


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## petrev

*WOW*

:twothumbs

Bee-Utiful D-Zines

Too too 

Can't Wait . . . Can NOT Wait

Pete


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## Icarus

Great job Dennis! :twothumbs
Any plans for a 3x MC-E sink?


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## LED Zeppelin

Icarus said:


> Great job Dennis! :twothumbs
> Any plans for a 3x MC-E sink?



Freddy, nothing on the drawing board but it sounds like a good idea. I haven't played around with the MC-Es yet, but I do have some coming. Perhaps by the time I make the next run of these sinks I'll have a design. If you have any suggestions for reflectors or design specifics please let me know.


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## GLOCK18

I dont have a M6 but after seeing these I just might get one.


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## Britelumens

Hi Dennis,


Nice work on the SF M6 :thumbsup:



With regards,
Jo @ Britelumens


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## nailbender

Hi Dennis

You can tell that a whole lot planning and work went into those. 

I know that Fraen has some new reflectors made just for the MC-E, I should have some samples on the way and I am working on a US supply for them since Cutter seems to be one of the only ones stocking them. Arrow may order them since they are stocking as good of selections of MC-E of anyone. I orders some M bin a couple of days ago and yet they still had some C, H, J, bin

After buying an M4 and M6 fairly recently you could count me in if you reproduce these again.

Super work.

Dave


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## brighterisbetter

Yes Dennis, beautiful work. I'm not quite sure what to derive of the first post's intentions. Are they simply to inform of some upcoming builds for current customers? Or are they to show off your creations that will ultimately end up remaining in your posession as part of a LZ collection?:sigh: Or perhaps they'll be sold off one at a time as they're completed?:naughty: Sorry if I'm rambling, just want to get a better handle on things. Again, I'm very impressed by all I've seen so far.....and congrats griff! :huh:


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## LED Zeppelin

nailbender said:


> Hi Dennis
> 
> You can tell that a whole lot planning and work went into those.
> 
> I know that Fraen has some new reflectors made just for the MC-E, I should have some samples on the way and I am working on a US supply for them since Cutter seems to be one of the only ones stocking them. Arrow may order them since they are stocking as good of selections of MC-E of anyone. I orders some M bin a couple of days ago and yet they still had some C, H, J, bin
> 
> After buying an M4 and M6 fairly recently you could count me in if you reproduce these again.
> 
> Super work.
> 
> Dave



Thanks Dave, please keep me posted with your findings on the Fraens.

I will be offerring sinks after I build up and fit some more modules into other M6s. First I will be offering the completed mods as time allows me to finish them.


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## LED Zeppelin

brighterisbetter said:


> Yes Dennis, beautiful work. I'm not quite sure what to derive of the first post's intentions. Are they simply to inform of some upcoming builds for current customers? Or are they to show off your creations that will ultimately end up remaining in your posession as part of a LZ collection?:sigh: Or perhaps they'll be sold off one at a time as they're completed?:naughty: Sorry if I'm rambling, just want to get a better handle on things. Again, I'm very impressed by all I've seen so far.....and congrats griff! :huh:



BiB, sorry for any confusion. Originally I planned on offerring the loose sinks right off the bat. But upon building Griff's, and test fitting in my M6s, I found the fit to be exacting to the point that M6 tolerances might cause fit issues. So I'm going to build up the various modules to install in member's lights and get a feel for dimensional tweaks that will be more forgiving. I don't want anyone to buy one of these high dollar sinks and have any issues at all.

That being said, as I complete modules I will put them up for sale in th B/S/T forum. Or if anyone want to reserve a particular version feel free to PM me. 

After building up several and determining if my concerns are warranted, I may sell some sinks from this initial run as well.

So far I have tested fit in 3 different M6s. All fit fine, but a 0.001" difference in the host could change that.


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## brighterisbetter

PM sent.


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## Kiessling

LED Zeppelin said:


> Bernie, the module will drop out by removing the bezel and lens. I use a bit of compound in the head, but no epoxy. So it is completely reversible if you want to return your light to stock at any time.




I am more interested in having it the least reversible as possible, meaning bomb proof. In case of a shock, the module should stay where it is and not shatter the window via the reflectors or loose contact etc.

The perfect M6L, if you like. This mod of yours looks sooo freaking great and I am all excited now  :bow:

bernie


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## brighterisbetter

Kiessling said:


> I am more interested in having it the least reversible as possible, meaning bomb proof. In case of a shock, the module should stay where it is and not shatter the window via the reflectors or loose contact etc.


I agree 100%, IMO the less moving parts the better.


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## JetskiMark

Simply stunning.

I am interested in a 3x MC-E version too. I would prefer 3 or 4 levels.


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## Long RunTime

Very nice work :goodjob:


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## LED Zeppelin

Kiessling said:


> I am more interested in having it the least reversible as possible, meaning bomb proof. In case of a shock, the module should stay where it is and not shatter the window via the reflectors or loose contact etc.
> 
> The perfect M6L, if you like. This mod of yours looks sooo freaking great and I am all excited now  :bow:
> 
> bernie



Bernie, the module could easily be epoxied into the head for a permanent mod. And with the Cree and the P7 versions, the reflectors have seats that they could be epoxied to making it more or less one-piece.

EDIT: I've added this info the the first post.


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## darkzero

"Holy sh!t!" Sorry those are the first words that came out of my mouth when seeing this.

Dennis is the heatsink God! :twothumbs

I don't think anyone can top this one or your other heatsink. Absolutely beautiful!


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## griff

darkzero said:


> "Holy sh!t!" Sorry those are the first words that came out of my mouth when seeing this.
> 
> Dennis is the heatsink God! :twothumbs
> 
> I don't think anyone can top this one or your other heatsink. Absolutely beautiful!



Will, 
That's funny! I PM'd Dennis today and said the exact 
same thing.. My post from CLF:
WOW

I'm VERY happy with the outcome of this project!
Like the Moby **** Trinity build, I ask Dennis to build
something unique and bright as possible. The only
restriction I had was for him to use the Ostar in the 
mod. Dennis came up with the design for the heatsink and 
from the looks of it he hit a homerun. Dennis is one of the
few builders/modders IMHO, that has mastered all phases
of the job with such attension to detail resulting in a "PACKAGE of PERFECTION".
He reminds me of the saying " a job worth doing, is a job worth right"
I will post a complete review when the Stork drops off my baby.

Thanks to Dennis aka LED Zeppelin


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## LED Zeppelin

Thanks guys, too kind.

Beamshots added. Griff, light will be heading back tomorrow. Hope you like it just as much in person.


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## toby_pra

OMG taht looks beautiful!!!

Nothing more to say, as a very great work LZ!!!


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## TranquillityBase

:bow::wow:


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## wquiles

Outstanding work Dennis - very impressive :thumbsup:

Will


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## Aircraft800

Unbelievable! I wish I had your knowledge and machining skills! You might as well design a Led_Zep light entirely from scratch. Awesome Work!


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## Icarus

Dennis, the new pictures you posted are very promissing. :twothumbs


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## KDOG3

HOLY CRAPOLA! I was thinking of getting the M3 and doing the D36 mod like donn did, (and I still might) but I've always wanted an M6 .... and an M4 .... and an M3 .... LOL! Now you've got my head spinning and I don't know what to get/do. Just freakin' INSANE!! Decisions, decisions!


Are these Cree XREs' in the small ones? I'm afraid to ask, but how much?


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## LED Zeppelin

KDOG3 said:


> HOLY CRAPOLA!
> 
> Are these Cree XREs' in the small ones? I'm afraid to ask, but how much?



KDOG3, the XRE are the single die ones, throw should be good. Sink kits should be about $125, and the completed mod in your light in the range of $375-425 depending on which version (host and FM holder not included).


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## cmacclel

SWEET!

Mac


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## Kiessling

Does this work with the MB20 battery holder of the M6 and the M3/L6 body?
bernie


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## Optik49

I don’t even have an M6 but I buy one for this mod. How crazy is that? Great job!


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## LED Zeppelin

Kiessling said:


> Does this work with the MB20 battery holder of the M6 and the M3/L6 body?
> bernie



Bernie, the 5 Cree version should work with the MB20 or M3 body loaded with primaries or Li-ions.


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## TDK-R

_*Unbelievable! :thumbsup: 
*_


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## LED Zeppelin

donn_ said:


> Excellent! It'll probably fit not only the Leef M tubes, but C, with a C2M adapter as well. That'll mean a 3x18650 tube is possible.



Donn, I saw a picture of the Leef tube, and it appears that the inner taper of the head end is anodized. The ano there would have to be removed as the ground is made by contact with the cone of the sink. SF tubes are conductive and not anodized there.


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## brighterisbetter

This thread just gets more exciting each time I revisit it!


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## tanasit

What else can I say, brilliantssssssss....(for both the bulider and the light)

Tanasit


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## sledhead

Just fantastic! Been waiting for something like this. Everyone who sold there M6's are having sellers remorse right about now. 

The future is here! M6L:thumbsup:


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## ming560

O...so sweet!
When will you start the interest thread?:twothumbs
I'd be interested in a MZXR-7 Heatsink.:naughty:


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## nanotech17

i think you come from UFO


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## LED Zeppelin

Thanks all for the generous support and kind words.



ming560 said:


> O...so sweet!
> When will you start the interest thread?:twothumbs
> I'd be interested in a MZXR-7 Heatsink.:naughty:



ming, I will be building up a few more modules over the next week, and assuming I don't find any issues I'll start an interest list after that. 

Some sinks from this run will be available, and orders for the next run will be taken. Once I reach about 20 for the next run, I can go ahead with the machining and ano/plating.


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## AaronM

I very much hope you consider a triple MC-E setup. It'll be just like the triple P7 sink, made to accept deeper reflectors.

Either way, I now must get an M6!


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## griff

LED Zeppelin said:


> This is Griff's light, the *MZOX-4*:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Hardware:*
> - MZOX-4 heatsink: type II ano LED sink, chromate plated universal contact w/ 0.55" contact board
> - Z bin Ostar w/ narrow beam Fraen and cosmetic trim ring
> - (3) Cree XRE R2 WD
> - (2) McR17XR
> - (1) McR19XR
> - Blue Shark set at max current - 900 mA
> - FM 3 X 17670 holder
> 
> *Specs:*
> - All LEDs in series, Vf = [email protected], [email protected]
> - LED current 900 mA
> - Light draws [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
> 
> Light runs on 6 X CR123, or 6 X RCR123. With RCR123s, the over-current protection will likely kick in before low-voltage. I estimate the current protection to kick @ 1.5A when the cells are at approx 3.4V ea. Drive current can be dialed down for longer runtimes with the Shark trimpot, but is set to max brightness per Griff's original request.
> 
> *Beamshots:*
> Camera settings: ISO200, F4, 3.5 sec, white balance sunshine
> 
> First up is a M6 HOLA running a freshly charged M6R pack, followed by the subject light on 6 X RCR123. Trees in the far distance are at about 450'. Throw is reduced from misty/light drizzle conditions.



Wow!!!
Dennis .....Homerun.....AGAIN!
First Moby **** TRINITY........
Now "M-Zeppelin" I'm not sure where to start. The concept sounded simple, 
Hey Dennis...Can you put an Ostar and something else in the Surefire M6 ? " We'll let me think about it" he said... Tada...Presto...The M-ZEPPLEIN * MZOX-4* This is a Marvel , Surefire's best incan improved by Dennis. He transformed the incan to a very useable multi-LED TORCH .Not only did he take care of my request but Dennis has come up with several different heatsinks soulitions to cover anyones needs. 
Once again the machineing and annodizeing of the heat sink is perfect. Fit and finnish also perfect. I wish everyone could check this beauty out! 
Thank You Dennis for taking this project on and finnishing is so fast! 
This light is everything that I could have imagined and more.
I look forward to seeing the rest of this series and maybe owning one of them.:goodjob::thanks:


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## LED Zeppelin

griff said:


> Thank You Dennis for taking this project on and finnishing is so fast!



Griff, you're welcome.


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## brighterisbetter

Though I doubt it I'll ask anyway. Are these heatsinks capable of being installed in a KT1/KT2? If not, would the sink design have to be completely reconfigured for an application using either of those heads?


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## Delghi

Wow, fantastic work!


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## LED Zeppelin

brighterisbetter said:


> Though I doubt it I'll ask anyway. Are these heatsinks capable of being installed in a KT1/KT2? If not, would the sink design have to be completely reconfigured for an application using either of those heads?



This heatsink would not work in a KT1/KT2. The one-piece head/reflector would require something totally different, perhaps a matching bowl-shaped sink. Also the KT1 is rather shallow limiting the depth of reflectors used especially around the perimeter.


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## LED Zeppelin

*Update:*

I received a Leef 3 X 18650 M tube from brighterisbetter that will eventually host the tri-P7 module.

I found the tapered bore of the Leef tube to be larger than the Surefire. The fit of the male/female taper is critical and the contact cone must bottom out into the tube just before the head bottoms.

My one-off solution for this light was to construct the medieval-looking sleeve pictured from copper braid and lots of solder. The vertical strips were filed until the desired fit. 

I also stripped the ano from inside the taper as the Leef tube was anodized in there.










If there is demand for this setup I'll have a sleeve machined; making this one was an evening in itself. A wider contact piece could be made, but I'd rather have the modules be adaptable to any tube and not dedicated.

Another issue I discovered is the difference in battery/holder terminal positions. The FM holder has a pronounced nipple, the stock MB20 is recessed, and the 18650s in the Leef tube sit lower than the FM nipple as well.

A spring could be used for the (+) terminal on the module, but with the domed FM holder I am concerned the spring could be compressed off-center and possibly short to the tube. This is bad. Instead, I am going to replace the brass screw in the center of the blue contact board with a rivet nut. Used with the FM holder, the rivet nut alone is the contact. With the MB20 or the 18650s in the Leef M tube, a brass #6-32 screw will be threaded into the rivet nut, and the head will give the needed height for contact.

This isn't an issue with the modules that need high voltage as they will always require the FM holder. But with the 5 Cree and the tri-P7 which can run off several cell configurations, tubes, and holders, the contact needs to be adaptable.

Lastly, 6 X 123 cells in the FM holder is a somewhat loose fit in the M6 tube. It's not a problem, but to center the holder and prevent rattle, I've ordered some square section O-rings that will install at both ends of the FM holder.


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## JohnTz

This is awesome. I have a 3x18650 leef tube and am in the hunt for a M6 head for this mod with a 3xp7 setup. I finally found a use for my tube! Please let me know when you will be able to do more of these or have the production version ready.


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## brighterisbetter

Very ingenious use of the copper braid. Put it on my tab!  I'm curious if the braid itself still retains the flex/spongyness after the solder is applied.


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## LED Zeppelin

JohnTz said:


> This is awesome. I have a 3x18650 leef tube and am in the hunt for a M6 head for this mod with a 3xp7 setup. I finally found a use for my tube! Please let me know when you will be able to do more of these or have the production version ready.



John, I'll post an interest thread once I finish the tweaks and am ready with the design for another run.



brighterisbetter said:


> Very ingenious use of the copper braid. Put it on my tab!  I'm curious if the braid itself still retains the flex/spongyness after the solder is applied.



It was very flexible when it was only tacked together, but I flowed it full of silver solder and it's quite rigid now. The vertical strips have been filed to about 1/2 thickness, and they appear solid. 

Sleeve's on me, I'm just glad I was the one to discover the fit issue with the Leef M tube.


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## Metatron

Griff, LZ, that is one serious 'working' flashlight u guys have come up with. For all the disgruntled M6 owners out there, this is a 'heads up'. It doesn't get any better!


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## AaronM

Is there enough interest yet? I'd like the ostar setup and the MZP7-3...purdy please.


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## LED Zeppelin

I've built up a the MZP7-3 version using a Shark Buck and Remora on a Leef M tube. I'll post full details soon with specs and beamshots.

Here are some pics:











Note the rivet nut at the center of the blue contact board. A bolt will nest in there flush, or can be adjusted out to make contact with different cells/tubes. 

I should be able to build up the MZXR-5 and 7 over the next week and post all the beamshots and specs. This will allow anyone interested to make a more informed decision when I subsequently post the interest thread.

In the meantime I dropped off the revisions today at the shop, and gave the go-ahead for a run of contact pieces. I'll get those made in anticipation.


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## DaFABRICATA

OH MAN!!!

I can't wait!!oo:

Lookin AWESOME LED Zeppelin!!....:naughty::thumbsup:

I might have to get the MZP7-3 too....considering I have most of the other parts.:thinking::twothumbs


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## brighterisbetter




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## JohnTz

I can't wait either. When you get it please post allot of pictures and beamshots. I am after the same setup. I have a 3x18650 leef tube and a M6 head ready to go for the 3xP7 setup.


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## LED Zeppelin

MZP7-3 build specs added to post #5, indoor/outdoor beamshots of lights built so far added to post #1.


----------



## DaFABRICATA

WHOW!!!! Those Beamshots RULE

I KNOW I need on of the MZP7-3 heatsink/reflector set-ups!!!
_______________________________________________________________ 
*Not to get off topic here but, any Chance you might be able to make it to this get-together? *
*Link: **http://*www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=220228

*I see you are in Michigan?*
*It would be great to finally meet you and see some of your INSANE LIGHTS!!*




PERFECT I TELL YOU!!:thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup:


----------



## nailbender

Hi

They really are awesome Dennis, these are not home runs they are all grand slams. I come here and just admire the lights and realize how much time had to go into just designing these parts for the builds.

Thanks 

Dave


----------



## JohnTz

Thanks for posting the specs on the 3xp7 build. Can the light be setup with a single speed boost driver so the light is in regulation with the 3x18650 at a very high level. I know that may not be the most efficient setup but who will ever use med or low on these wow lights and 3 batteries without a holder in a leef tube are much easier to deal.


----------



## toby_pra

Hey LZ!

These are the nicest mods i have ever seen!!!:thumbsup:


----------



## petrev

Hi LZ

Finished a 6x17500 carrier for my M6 M-ZEP3P7 
(requires Short Tail-Cup part)



.

.

.

.


.

.

.



All ready to go

M6 
Bucking Shark - 3A
Remora (3-levels?)
3x P7 DSWOJ
6x AW 17500
Carrier
Tail-Cup
.
.

Cheers
Pete
:thumbsup:


----------



## cue003

These bad boys are awesome. 

i can't decide which one I want.... Internal struggle for OMG bright but at the same time want the Energizer "Still going" piece.

Are these dual-output?


----------



## griff

Anyone seriously thinking about buying this light but is on the fence for one reason or another. I would be glad t offer mine for your inspection. We must come up with a reasonable way to protect both parties involved ....... but I think once you turn this light on you'll be moving quick to get one.
PM me if your interested. I would expect that you would cover cost for your test run .


----------



## DaFABRICATA

griff said:


> Anyone seriously thinking about buying this light but is on the fence for one reason or another. I would be glad t offer mine for your inspection. We must come up with a reasonable way to protect both parties involved ....... but I think once you turn this light on you'll be moving quick to get one.
> PM me if your interested. I would expect that you would cover cost for your test run .


 


griff,

VERY NICE GESTURE!!

I sent ya a PM!!

I've gotta see that monkey!!

Never seen an Osram LED before.


----------



## ShortArc

My MZOX-4 should be here on Monday :twothumbs.

DaFABRICATA, I send Dennis two of my Osrams. One will be left over. If you want I can send it to you when it gets back? Not as good as the whole light however...


----------



## DaFABRICATA

ShortArc said:


> My MZOX-4 should be here on Monday :twothumbs.
> 
> DaFABRICATA, I send Dennis two of my Osrams. One will be left over. If you want I can send it to you when it gets back? Not as good as the whole light however...


 


ShortArc, That would be GREAT!!:thumbsup:

Please post pics when you get the light too!!:wave:

Please PM me with any details!
Thank you!!!


----------



## toby_pra

I really wqould love to see more beamshots...:devil:


----------



## black bolt

Griff, What is the run time on high on your MZOX-4 since its dailed at "max current"? Did you try using any of the "safe chemistry" 16340 cells in it already?:thinking: I really like the way Dennis set this model up. :thumbsup:


----------



## brighterisbetter

On the MZXR-5 model, would there be any benefit from placing a reflectorless P7 smack-dab in the middle of the sink to give the beam pattern more balance between throw/flood, or is the output from the 5 McR19XR's sufficient for lots of flood up close? If so, how much more difficult would it be to configure wiring this setup with the P7 addition?


----------



## LED Zeppelin

JohnTz said:


> Thanks for posting the specs on the 3xp7 build. Can the light be setup with a single speed boost driver so the light is in regulation with the 3x18650 at a very high level. I know that may not be the most efficient setup but who will ever use med or low on these wow lights and 3 batteries without a holder in a leef tube are much easier to deal.



John, the problem is the current demand from P7s. The input current will be higher than the drive current with a boost converter, and you'd exceed the IC current limit. 



petrev said:


> Hi LZ
> 
> Finished a 6x17500 carrier for my M6 M-ZEP3P7
> 
> Pete
> :thumbsup:



That's an great pack Pete! Your contact should work perfectly with the module.



cue003 said:


> These bad boys are awesome.
> 
> i can't decide which one I want.... Internal struggle for OMG bright but at the same time want the Energizer "Still going" piece.
> 
> Are these dual-output?



One thing to consider is practicality. The Ostar generates much heat, and can't be run continuously on hi without monitoring. It gets very warm after 5 minutes and hot by 10. It's a show light on hi, but with a Remora can be used continuously at lower levels.

The P7 gets warm as well, but runs cooler than the Ostar. At least running 3 X 18650 the heat is surprisingly manageable even after 10 minutes straight.

I'm pretty much finished building the 5 and 7 Cree modules, and will post some preliminary pics momentarily. I have a feeling they will manage heat well, offer good runtime, and have the most throw.

If a Remora is used with the Shark, the light is 3 preset levels. If just the Shark is used the light is single level, but the LED current can be dialed in using the trimpot. 



toby_pra said:


> I really wqould love to see more beamshots...:devil:



Toby, the specs of all versions as well as beamshots will be up within a couple days.



brighterisbetter said:


> On the MZXR-5 model, would there be any benefit from placing a reflectorless P7 smack-dab in the middle of the sink to give the beam pattern more balance between throw/flood, or is the output from the 5 McR19XR's sufficient for lots of flood up close? If so, how much more difficult would it be to configure wiring this setup with the P7 addition?



Bruce, the Cree versions are likely very bright up close. They focus well and the low level with a Remora is relatively hi at 110mA. 

A P7 could be placed on a pedestal in the center, but if wired in series with the Crees would only see 900 mA. Another option is to use 2 drivers, one dedicated to the P7. Fitting both in there would be a feat though. 

Either way there will still be a bright spot, just more spill. 

Actually none of these are good for up close use. Wayne is working on code to allow a much lower level with the Remora but hasn't tested it yet.


----------



## LED Zeppelin

Pics of MZXR-5, MZXR-7 completed modules posted.


----------



## JohnTz

LED Zeppelin said:


> John, the problem is the current demand from P7s. The input current will be higher than the drive current with a boost converter, and you'd exceed the IC current limit.


 
Gotcha. Is there room in there to wire two sharks for the 3xp7 build?


----------



## Kiessling

I think the best combos are the Cree combos as they will have a tight and bright spill and a good throwing yet generous hotspot. I am very seriously considering giving in to the craving 
bernie


----------



## LED Zeppelin

JohnTz said:


> Gotcha. Is there room in there to wire two sharks for the 3xp7 build?



John, two Sharks and even a Remora physically fit in the cavity. With some flexible wire, planning, and patience it could be done. You could run a pair of 1.5A Sharks in series.

Using 6s CR or RCR123s in the FM holder with one Shark Buck it also runs in regulation on hi.


----------



## JohnTz

LED Zeppelin said:


> John, two Sharks and even a Remora physically fit in the cavity. With some flexible wire, planning, and patience it could be done. You could run a pair of 1.5A Sharks in series.
> 
> Using 6s CR or RCR123s in the FM holder with one Shark Buck it also runs in regulation on hi.


 
Dennis thank you for answering what are probably very trivial questions ( I am a beginner). What I am trying to accomplish is the best combination to run in regulation with a 3s setup (3x18650) since I really want to use my 3s Leaf tube and incorporate a P7 in there somewhere. 

So maybe the best choice for this would be what brighterisbetter mentioned. A 5 XRE setup with a p7 on a pedestal in the middle and two drivers. Real nice throw and the p7 would just add a huge amount of light to the spill for the first 10-20 yards. This is what is so cool about these your heat sinks. Many options and possibilities. Do you think there is room on the 5 XRE sink for the P7 in the middle? Or even a highly modified small reflector for the p7 just to get the p7 lumens out the front?


----------



## LED Zeppelin

*All versions built and tested, yea!*
I finished the remaining Cree versions and have added the specs and beamshots to the first posts. Not surprisingly, none out-throw the HOLA, though the MZXR-7 comes within 10% of the lux. Overall lumens goes to the LEDs.



Kiessling said:


> I think the best combos are the Cree combos as they will have a tight and bright spill and a good throwing yet generous hotspot.
> bernie



Bernie, the Cree beams are as nice as you predicted.



JohnTz said:


> Do you think there is room on the 5 XRE sink for the P7 in the middle? Or even a highly modified small reflector for the p7 just to get the p7 lumens out the front?



John, there appears to be room enough for a P7 in the center of the MZXR-5, but probably not much of a reflector (13.5mm).


----------



## DaFABRICATA

Hello LZ,

I am absolutely blown away by ALL of these!!

Any idea of when the heatsinks will be available?

I have several empty KT4's waiting for your exceptional heatsinks.


----------



## black bolt

Which one between the MZOX-4 and the MZP7-3, puts out the most lumens? How much more is this difference between the two?:thinking:


----------



## petrev

LZ

_BEEP_ - _The Eagle Has Landed_ - _BEEP_
__ 
:thumbsup:


----------



## petrev

LED Zeppelin said:


> *MZXR-7*
> 
> 
> 
> *Hardware:*- MZXR-7 heatsink: type II ano LED sink, chromate plated universal contact w/ 0.55" contact board
> - (7) Cree XRE R2 WD
> - (7) McR19XR
> - Blue Shark/Remora
> - 3 X 17650 in FM holder
> 
> *Specs:*
> - All LEDs in series, Vf = [email protected], [email protected]
> - Regulated drive currents: Lo 110mA, Med 310mA, Hi 860mA
> - Light runs on 3 X 17650 or 6 X CR123 *(NOT RCR123)* in FM holder
> - Using 3 X 17650, 11.1V, light draws 2.05A on hi
> - Using 6 X CR123s, 18V, light draws 1.19A on hi


 
Hi LZ

Why *(NOT RCR123)* ?
and presumably NOT 6x17500

Specs say 

3-7 Lux3s/Cree XRE/Seoul P4s can be driven with this configuration as long as the boost input current does not exceed 3-4A. etc.
Input voltage range: 2.7V - ~25V (Vin < Vout)

I'm sure there must be something I'm missing ? ! ?

Brilliant work by the way :thumbsup:

Pete


----------



## LED Zeppelin

DaFABRICATA said:


> Hello LZ,
> 
> I am absolutely blown away by ALL of these!!
> 
> Any idea of when the heatsinks will be available?
> 
> I have several empty KT4's waiting for your exceptional heatsinks.



Tim, thanks. I'll be posting an interest/order thread for sink kits and builds within a day.



black bolt said:


> Which one between the MZOX-4 and the MZP7-3, puts out the most lumens? How much more is this difference between the two?:thinking:



black bolt, MZP7-3 puts out the most lumens, over 2000. MZOX-4 perhaps 1700. MZOX-4 has marginally better throw, and more heat.



petrev said:


> Hi LZ
> 
> Why *(NOT RCR123)* ?
> and presumably NOT 6x17500
> 
> 
> Pete



Pete, glad your sink finally showed up. 

Regarding the MZXR-7, with the Shark boost, Vin needs to be less than Vf or you'll overdrive the LEDs in DD. If higher Vf LEDs were used (about 3.7V @ 900 mA) you could use 6 X Li-ions, but not with this particular light. The problem is when the cells are fully charged, Vin could be as high as 25.2V. Also, with a Remora, the lo and med levels would not be accessible until the cell voltage dropped to under 20V. Using 6 X CR123s, all levels are regulated from the start.


----------



## petrev

LED Zeppelin said:


> Pete, glad your sink finally showed up.
> 
> Regarding the MZXR-7, with the Shark boost, Vin needs to be less than Vf or you'll overdrive the LEDs in DD. If higher Vf LEDs were used (about 3.7V @ 900 mA) you could use 6 X Li-ions, but not with this particular light. The problem is when the cells are fully charged, Vin could be as high as 25.2V. Also, with a Remora, the lo and med levels would not be accessible until the cell voltage dropped to under 20V. Using 6 X CR123s, all levels are regulated from the start.


 
Hi LZ

Ah-ah ! Got it, knew I was missing something (obvious) so maybe 5x17500 and a dummy would be OK ?

Touchdown was a real joy - and now that I have adapted a 7/64 Allen key bit to fit the head I am well away. 

Would have been easier to just go and buy a 7/64th key but I just couldn't wait 

Second attempt at attaching the Buck-Shark (first one had too little epoxy) I like to use some Arctic Silver and a couple of spots of epoxy to attach things as this is just about disassembleable (hopefully not as easily as the first attempt !)

P7s fitted :thumbsup:

. . .

Cheers 
Pete


----------



## brighterisbetter




----------



## LED Zeppelin

petrev said:


> Hi LZ
> 
> Ah-ah ! Got it, knew I was missing something (obvious) so maybe 5x17500 and a dummy would be OK ?
> 
> Touchdown was a real joy - and now that I have adapted a 7/64 Allen key bit to fit the head I am well away.
> 
> Would have been easier to just go and buy a 7/64th key but I just couldn't wait
> 
> Cheers
> Pete



Pete, 5 X 17500 and a dummy is a good solution.

I've ordered hex keys for both sink and contact bolts to include with the sink kits so nobody else needs to make their own tools. I sent yours out before I had the keys.

Hope it builds up easily for you. 



brighterisbetter said:


>



Bruce, thanks, light's in tomorrow's mail.


----------



## LED Zeppelin

Order thread posted here.


----------



## KDOG3

Will any of these run off of 2x17670s'? I have an M4 body....


----------



## LED Zeppelin

KDOG3, the 5 Cree version will work with 2 X 17670.


----------



## LEDmodMan

WOW!!!
That is fantastic work!!! :bow::bow::bow: Those drop-ins are INSANE! :duh2:

I've been away for quite some time, but have checked in every now and then. LED tech has now reached a point where I don't think I can stay away anymore! The modding bug has bitten once again! :devil:

I have something similar to these in mind - likely something using 3 Cree MC-E's, and maybe 4 Cree XR-E's if I can squeeze them in. Getting the money together will be a challenge though. That's the MAIN reason I had to stop doing this, it has just gotten too expensive to keep up. 

Don't let js see these!  Again, great work!




petrev said:


> LZ
> 
> _BEEP_ - _The Eagle Has Landed_ - _BEEP_
> __
> :thumbsup:


That is awesome! LMAO!  I can really appreciate that comment, given what I'm working on (see the bottom of my sig)


----------



## petrev

LEDmodMan said:


> [PIC]
> 
> That is awesome! LMAO!  I can really appreciate that comment, given what I'm working on (see the bottom of my sig)


 
Way Cool

Orion Project - Crew Exploration Vehicle does look similar 

Nice Job ! !! !!!


----------



## KDOG3

LED Zeppelin said:


> KDOG3, the 5 Cree version will work with 2 X 17670.




Ok great! Now just to sell a kidney....


----------



## PhantomZ

just wondering if there is anything on the runtimes for each light and possibly lumen ratings instead of lux because i'm more familiar with lumens. thx


----------



## LED Zeppelin

PhantomZ,

I have no way to accurately measure lumens, but here's a guess:
- MZP7-3: 2300-2400
- MZOX-4: 1500-1800
- MZXR-7: 1500-1750
- MZXR-5: 1100-1200

Runtimes can be roughly figured from the current draw I've measured and the cell capacity. 

For instance this is the spec I listed for the MZXR-7:

_- Using 3 X 17650, 11.1V, light draws 2.05A on hi_

Given 1600 mAH cells, the light would run for 1600/2050=0.78 hr, or 45 minutes on hi. Cell ratings aren't always accurate, and the current changes with cell voltage, but that's a good guess.


----------



## LED Zeppelin

I've found a small issue with using the FM holder and (6) CR123 that petrev has pointed out.

The contacts on the holder do not protrude enough to extend beyond the shrink wrap of the cells. I didn't have this problem with AW RCR123s or 17650s, but with Surefire CR123s. 

My remedy was to install small magnets at the (-) end of each cell stack. There isn't a risk of them shifting and shorting since the shrinkwrap becomes a boundary.


----------



## TonyTDMD

I'm interested in getting on a list for the p7-3 for my M6. Looks great!


----------



## brighterisbetter

TonyTDMD said:


> I'm interested in getting on a list for the p7-3 for my M6. Looks great!


Sales thread is here


----------



## DaFABRICATA

OH MAN!!!

Look what came in the mail today!!

Griff was kind enough to let me check out his new light!! 
The MZOX-4!

This is just one beautiful work of flashlight art! 
Housed in one of my favorite hosts..The Surefire M6.

This thing is Bright and I can't wait for it to get dark out! 

The 3 P7 light pictured is one I made a few months ago. 
Mine is using a standard Shark..Not the Shark Buck, so it is way underdriven.

The tight beam of the MZOX-4 is Awesome!
SUPER BRIGHT!

Heres some pics to hold everyone over until tonight when I can get some good Beamshots!

I'm sure the MZP7-3 will have a better beam than mine and the build quality will put mine to shame, but it's about the only semi-fair comparison I have against the MZOX-4

*LED Zeppelin is truly a MASTER!!*
*Thank you again for making these available!:twothumbs*
*Thank you, GRIFF for allowing me to borrow your light!*








*MZOX-4*





*Dafabricata 3 X P7 M6*


----------



## brighterisbetter

You're welcome to borrow my MZP7-3 also Tim if requested.


----------



## DaFABRICATA

brighterisbetter said:


> You're welcome to borrow my MZP7-3 also Tim if requested.


 

THANK YOU SO MUCH!!:wave:

When you get time, I will surely take you up on that offer!

PM incoming...:twothumbs


----------



## DaFABRICATA

As Promised....outdoor beamshots!

Yes the difference is really that noticable!
I thought my 3 X P7 light was bright..

The MZOX-4 is just amazing!!

*MZOX-4*






*Dafabricata 3 X P7 KT4*


----------



## KDOG3

Wow, thats' insane! I'll just feel lucky to get my D36 mod done without screwing things up!


----------



## griff

Excellent Photography Tim!!!
Your P7x3 look's Kick A**!
I know that a "M-ZEP" of any combo would make anyone happy !!
+++111 to your review




DaFABRICATA said:


> As Promised....outdoor beamshots!
> 
> Yes the difference is really that noticable!
> I thought my 3 X P7 light was bright..
> 
> The MZOX-4 is just amazing!!
> 
> *MZOX-4*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Dafabricata 3 X P7 KT4*


----------



## LED Zeppelin

griff said:


> Excellent Photography Tim!!!
> Your P7x3 look's Kick A**!



+1, Thanks Tim!


----------



## petrev

DaFABRICATA said:


> OH MAN!!!
> 
> . . .
> 
> *LED Zeppelin is truly a MASTER!!*
> *Thank you again for making these available!:twothumbs*
> *Thank you, GRIFF for allowing me to borrow your light!*


 

Hi DeFab

Qudos Maximus on getting 3x McR27XR to fit in the CB Head - I had previously seen you had used the easier to fit-in original flat head. Nice work. Nice Black M6 precursor/prototype body with the Surefire logo :thumbsup:

Thanks for the beamshots too.

I have just posted some info on the output of the 3xP7 M-Zep head when driven in regulation by 6S LiIOn over HERE

The M-Zep Osram has a better hot spot and the M-Zep 3xP7 has more total output especially when driven fully regulated . . .

These M-Zep mods are amazing pieces of kit and can deliver similar output to the much larger 4xP7 builds in a nicely pocketable form !

Cheers
Pete


----------



## brighterisbetter

petrev said:


> These M-Zep mods are amazing pieces of kit and *can deliver similar output to the much larger 4xP7 builds in a nicely pocketable form* !


+1 That is precisely the reason I made my purchase. That, and for the SF LEGO'bility


----------



## petrev

Hi

Finished the V1.1 carrier for use with 6x17500 protected cells and Short Tail-Cupola. Thinner copper clad PCB arrived and works great.

Gives 40+ min. Regulated Runtime (Total runtime as tested with AW Protected 17500) - see graph below. 






M6 Loaded with V1.1 Carrier - "Lift Off, We have Lift Off"










Short Tail-Cup is a fully reversible mod.

More info HERE

Cheers
Pete


----------



## LED Zeppelin

Pete, that's a great setup!

I and I'm sure others would be interested in the carrier and tailcup if you can offer them as a set. It's a perfect extended runtime solution for the MZOX-4 and MZP7-3 (too much voltage for the MZXR-5 and 7).

It's great that the stock length is retained, and there are no external clues to the extra capacity.


----------



## petrev

LED Zeppelin said:


> Pete, that's a great setup!
> 
> I and I'm sure others would be interested in the carrier and tailcup if you can offer them as a set. It's a perfect extended runtime solution for the MZOX-4 and MZP7-3 (too much voltage for the MZXR-5 and 7).
> 
> It's great that the stock length is retained, and there are no external clues to the extra capacity.


 
Hi LZ

I have started an Interest Thread for the Tail-Cupette (+Carrier?) and looks like I will have to work out a way to make the carriers in a more time efficient way ! ! ! so that they can be supplied in a set.

MZXR-7 works with a dummy cell you say ! not sure about the XR-5 ? Let me know your thoughts.

Cheers
Pete


----------



## DaFABRICATA

Thanks to brighterisbetter for lending me his light, I am able to post some beamshots of the MZP7-3 compared to my KT4-Tri-P7 light.
The camera settings were locked.

As you can see from the pics, The MZP7-3 has a nice hotspot and plenty of spill. 

The triple P7-KT4 that I built has a lot of flood and not as much throw.

Both use the same McR27XR reflectors, but LED Zeppelin was able to have his focus better than mine resulting in better throw.
Again, I am using my light to do the comparison, simply because it is the only semi-comparable light I have.

As with the MZOX-4 light that Griff let me borrow, the build quality is second to none and is absolutely perfect!

*MZP7-3*







*DaFABRICATA Tri-P7 KT4*


----------



## brighterisbetter

Nice job on the beamshots Tim! At first glance they're kind of difficult for me to distinguish, so I created an animated gif to see how they are overlayed (hopefully it works):






And here's one of the original beamshots by Dennis:


----------



## LED Zeppelin

Tim, thanks for the beamshots. Your light seems to stack up very well from the pictures. Is either one noticeably brighter in hand or with a bounce test?

Bruce, that's an awsome animation, thanks! Would it be possible to add in the stock M6?



petrev said:


> Hi LZ
> 
> I have started an Interest Thread for the Tail-Cupette (+Carrier?) and looks like I will have to work out a way to make the carriers in a more time efficient way ! ! ! so that they can be supplied in a set.
> 
> MZXR-7 works with a dummy cell you say ! not sure about the XR-5 ? Let me know your thoughts.
> 
> Cheers
> Pete



Pete, hope you can find a way to offer at least a few of your 6 X 17500 carriers and tailcups. 

The MZXR-5 I built had R2s with a Vf of [email protected] With a Shark boost 4 li-ion cells in series would be the limit, so 2 dummies would work. The low level might not be accessible on fully charged cells. You could also use a Shark Buck 1A with 5 or 6 cells.


----------



## brighterisbetter

LED Zeppelin said:


> Would it be possible to add in the stock M6?


----------



## DaFABRICATA

Dennis, I can really only see a difference in the beam profiles as opposed to brightness from the MZP7-3 and the TriP7 KT4 I made..:thinking:
Either way I like them both. I don't know why mine wouldn't be noticably dimmer considering I am running a "standard shark" as opposed to "shark buck"



More Beamshots coming later tonight comparing the MZP7-3, the MZXR-7, and my Tri-P7 KT4...

I recieved the McR19XRs from the Shoppe today and have the MZXR-7 up and running!!
Even on a bright sunny day this thing is BRIGHT!!!


----------



## DaFABRICATA

*BEAMSHOTS:*


*Surefire M6 with MN21- 500 lumen bulb*






*MZXR-7*








*MZP7-3*







*Dafabricata Tri-P7 KT4*


----------



## brighterisbetter




----------



## LED Zeppelin

Tim, Bruce, thanks again for your work on the beamshots!

Nice job on the XR-7 build Tim, that was fast.


----------



## nailbender

Hi Dennis

I couple shots of MZXR5 R2 C bin. I think it came out right nice.

Thanks for getting everything together for us.

Dave


----------



## LED Zeppelin

Dave, great job on the MZXR-5, that was fast!

It's the baby of the bunch but can't be beat for runtime, efficiency, and practicality, and still pumps out more lumens than the stock HOLA.

I haven't tried it yet, but it should run on 6 X RCR123 in the stock holder as well as 3 X 17670 in the FM holder.


----------



## nailbender

Hi Dennis

I just used 6 AW 16340 in the stock holder and it is much brighter than the other. Even though there is just five of the R2 Cbin ( I like white light) it gets hot fairly quick with the 6X16340, I am sure 7 is a scorcher. 

I will have the neighbors talking again tonight  

Dave


----------



## black bolt

Can someone post a beamshot of the stock M6 using a WA 1185 bulb and the 3x17670 FM holder? I would love to see it along sides the MZ line photos.


----------



## LED Zeppelin

black bolt said:


> Can someone post a beamshot of the stock M6 using a WA 1185 bulb and the 3x17670 FM holder? I would love to see it along sides the MZ line photos.



Can't help here, but I'd like to see that too.


----------



## DaFABRICATA

I'll get on it in tomorrow or the next night.....

I can only compare the W1185 to the MZXR-7 as that all I have for comparison right now.

BTW...LZ, I forgot to PM back...
If you send the cell, I will report back with results.:thumbsup:


----------



## LED Zeppelin

Thanks Tim.

I got a hold of another Leef M tube, a 2 X 18650, and installed an MZXR-5 head. The MZXR-5 runs well on this tube/cell configuration. The Z58 clickie does make cycling the Remora a bit easier.






I found that the inner taper on this tube is different than on Bruce's 3 X 18650. The same adapter sleeve I made up for Bruce's light was too thick and left the O-ring exposed between the head and tube. Some folded alum foil was all it took to make contact between the module and the tube taper on this light.

So for use with the Leef M tubes, it may be required to custom fit the modules to the tubes with sleeves of differing thickness. 

The upcoming run of sinks has a slight revision in that the contact piece protrudes an additional 0.020" from the head, which for this tube may be enough to eliminate the foil. I made this revision to avoid a situation where the head bottomed out on the M6 tube before the contact piece does in the taper (as the Leef tubes do). Some SF lights were very close, but all worked. This will leave a corresponding slight gap between the head and tube, but should not be noticeable.


----------



## DaFABRICATA

The MZXR-7 works just fine on 6 X RCR123's

I like this light more and more!!

Couldn't do beamshots due to fog.
I'll do my best to follow up in a day or two.


----------



## LED Zeppelin

DaFABRICATA said:


> The MZXR-7 works just fine on 6 X RCR123's



Tim, just wanted to clarify the 6 X RCR123s were loaded in the stock M6 holder, not the FM right? Depending on the Vf of the LEDs, 6 in the FM holder might be too much.

Thanks for the feedback.


----------



## DaFABRICATA

Yes, they were loaded in the Surefire MB20 battery carrier.


----------



## Patriot

I finally got around to reading this whole thread. Awesome!

Great beam shots DaFAB! :twothumbs


----------



## black bolt

DaFABRICATA said:


> I'll get on it in tomorrow or the next night.....
> 
> I can only compare the W1185 to the MZXR-7 as that all I have for comparison right now.
> 
> BTW...LZ, I forgot to PM back...
> If you send the cell, I will report back with results.:thumbsup:


 
 needs some H2O, been eating too much popcorn.


----------



## LED Zeppelin

I had some sinks made for a tri-MCE light using cut McR27S. Sinks are similar to the MZP7-3 but cut for proper focus with the MC-E.

This is a mugshot of black bolt's light:










Beamshots of this light have been added to the first post.


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## LED Zeppelin

Here are some beamshots of various combinations of reflectors/aspherics using aspheric holders that have been anodized black. 

All beamshots are at ISO200, F4, white balance sunshine. Indoor shots progress from 1/8 to 1/30 then 1/125 sec. Outdoor shots exposure is 3 sec.


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## FrogmanM

Awesome beamshots Dennis! I hope you will still be making these by the time I have enough money saved up...:candle:

-Mayo


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## Sgt. LED

That is what I want. Especially if I can have it with R2 WH!
I have a head standing by. I think it's time to bite the bullet and send it in. You got the time Zep?


----------



## LED Zeppelin

Thanks Mayo.



Sgt. LED said:


> That is what I want. Especially if I can have it with R2 WH!
> I have a head standing by. I think it's time to bite the bullet and send it in. You got the time?



Sarge, I have 4 pcs of R2 WH, and plenty of R2 WD and WC. I also have Q3 5A warm tint. I do have the MZXR-7 sinks, but am down to 2 pcs.

Shoot me a PM if you want to proceed. I should be able to build one up soon and ship back your head in a day or two.


----------



## Sgt. LED

I'll take the 4 WH in the reflectors and 3 of the WD behind the aspherics.
PM incoming.

*PM SENT!! I'm finally going to get a monster light.* 
If anyone feels like helping fund my addiction there is a link in my sig. Donations always accepted!


----------



## bigchelis

Here are the real out the front lumen readings. 

DATA below is in MrGmans LED sticky. He was the person who took the readings. 

*1714.5 out the front lumens* w/3 P7's.................

Zep-5R2-SF M6 Host____,__3X_AW17670________5 Aspheric R2's_474.8______3 sec_______,
Zep-5R2-SF M6 Host____,__3X_AW17670________5 Cree R2's____863.6______3 sec_______,
Zep-5R2-SF M6 Host____,__3X_AW17670________5 Cree R2's____856.1_____15 sec_______,
Zep-5R2-SF M6 Host____,__3X_AW17670________5 Cree R2's____854.2_____30 sec_______,
Zep-5R2-SF M6 Host____,__3X_AW17670________5 Cree R2's____852.3_____45 sec_______,
Zep-5R2-SF M6 Host____,__3X_AW17670________5 Cree R2's____850.5_____60 sec_______,
Zep-5R2-SF M6 Host____,__3X_AW17670________5 Cree R2's____848.6_____90 sec_______,
Zep-5R2-SF M6 Host____,__3X_AW17670________5 Cree R2's____846.7____120 sec_______,
M6/Triple P7____LED Zeppelin___3XAW17670_____3x_P7______1714.5______instant peak_:bow:
M6/Triple P7____LED Zeppelin___3XAW17670_____3x_P7______1698.2______2 sec_:wow:
M6/Triple P7____LED Zeppelin___3XAW17670_____3x_P7______1606.5_____30 sec_
M6/Triple P7____LED Zeppelin___3XAW17670_____3x_P7______1565.1_____60 sec_
M6/Triple P7____LED Zeppelin___3XAW17670_____3x_P7______1523.7____120 sec_:mecry:
M6/Triple P7____LED Zeppelin___3XAW17670_____3x_P7______1498.5____240 sec_


----------



## LED Zeppelin

Jose, thanks to you and MrGman for you efforts testing the lights.

As I expected, the black aspheric holders (first figure) cut the OTF lumens by reducing the ringy spill. The bare alum holders pass more, 608 I think was the measurement. Both increase throw ~30% measured by my lux meter.


----------



## bigchelis

LED Zeppelin said:


> Jose, thanks to you and MrGman for you efforts testing the lights.
> 
> As I expected, the black aspheric holders (first figure) cut the OTF lumens by reducing the ringy spill. The bare alum holders pass more, 608 I think was the measurement. Both increase throw ~30% measured by my lux meter.


 

Dennis,
You are 100% correct. The chrome aspheric holders did 608 out the front, but the black ones did under 500 lumens. The throw gained appears to my eyes at least double, but that might be due to the contrast playing thricks on me. I think your 30% increase in throw is more realistic. Now, how can I test a 7 R2 M6 drop-in...:devil:


----------



## Sgt. LED

Been playing with my super light all this week and I really like it!
It took a bit to get the Megalooneum body to play nice but now all is great. The EagleTac 18650 cells seem to do better than the AW cells as far as getting a good negative contact.

It is retardedly bright.  In the house I won't take it off of low or I go blind from the bounce back off the walls! I have yet to take the light out to an area where I can see the limits of it's reach. Around the house there's not enough open area. 
Waiting the extra time to get all of the R2's in WH was really worth it. I enjoy the quality of the light outdoors much more with warmer tints. Sure Q4 5B would of been better color wise but I knew that would of cut down on the sheer number of lumens and this light is all about the output and throw.

It was also very nice to get a multi emitter build that was really clean inside. :twothumbs

When the XP-G emitters are in ready supply I will be sending this one back for an upgrade so be prepared! It's worth it.


----------



## bigchelis

Sgt. LED said:


> Been playing with my super light all this week and I really like it!
> It took a bit to get the Megalooneum body to play nice but now all is great. The EagleTac 18650 cells seem to do better than the AW cells as far as getting a good negative contact.
> 
> It is retardedly bright.  In the house I won't take it off of low or I go blind from the bounce back off the walls! I have yet to take the light out to an area where I can see the limits of it's reach. Around the house there's not enough open area.
> Waiting the extra time to get all of the R2's in WH was really worth it. I enjoy the quality of the light outdoors much more with warmer tints. Sure Q4 5B would of been better color wise but I knew that would of cut down on the sheer number of lumens and this light is all about the output and throw.
> 
> It was also very nice to get a multi emitter build that was really clean inside. :twothumbs
> 
> When the XP-G emitters are in ready supply I will be sending this one back for an upgrade so be prepared! It's worth it.


 


+1
Im ready for the XP-G upgrade too. Since my 5 R2 drop-in is the very same one that got tested, it would be great to see how much real life difference the new R2's make.

I have a camping and light river rafting trip on June 26~28 and I can hardly wait to blind everyone there. From 50 yards of course.:devil:


----------



## LED Zeppelin

Sgt. LED said:


> Been playing with my super light all this week and I really like it!
> It took a bit to get the Megalooneum body to play nice but now all is great. The EagleTac 18650 cells seem to do better than the AW cells as far as getting a good negative contact.



Sgt, I have noticed the negative batery plate of the Megalennium is very sensitive as well. The contacts do not protrude very much, just enough to clear the shrink wrap of the cells. So if the cell end is slightly dished or deformed at all, contact is not made.

You can use thin contact magnets on each cell (-) end to make it work, but it's best to use cells with perfectly flat ends.


----------



## bigchelis

LED Zeppelin said:


> Sgt, I have noticed the negative batery plate of the Megalennium is very sensitive as well. The contacts do not protrude very much, just enough to clear the shrink wrap of the cells. So if the cell end is slightly dished or deformed at all, contact is not made.
> 
> You can use thin contact magnets on each cell (-) end to make it work, but it's best to use cells with perfectly flat ends.


 
The new AW 18650's 2600mAh have flast ends or at least from the pictures it appears to be.


----------



## GunSmoke16610

I added one aspheric w anodized black holder to replace the center McR19XR on my MZOX-4. The added throw was worth the money, I am blown away at the change in the beam.


----------



## FrogmanM

Looks very nice GS16610,

I have a MZXR-7 w/ a black aspheric in place of the middle reflector, it greatly adds to the throw factor. I also installed a FM24 diffuser, really adds to the overall versatility of my first "big" torch. (hmm, I wonder how well the FM24 would diffuse a beam coming from 7 black aspheric...:naughty

-Mayo


----------



## junmae

*jaws dropped* ...just beautiful work there. great job!


----------



## Sgt. LED

Got a chance to take mine out again for a longer distance showing of brute force. The family was quite impressed and the throw is truly sweet! 

I have been thinking of replacing the black aspherics with the regular silver ones and putting another aspheric in the center. That would give me 4 aspherics and 3 reflectors, should still have plenty of spill. Not made up my mind yet but the throw would go up and the lumen count would increase too with the shiny aspheric holders. The downside is a less pretty beam, a less attractive view through the lens, and having to send it back to you Zep. The downside seems pretty small at the moment!


----------



## Lunal_Tic

FrogmanM said:


> Looks very nice GS16610,
> 
> I have a MZXR-7 w/ a black aspheric in place of the middle reflector, it greatly adds to the throw factor. I also installed a FM24 diffuser, really adds to the overall versatility of my first "big" torch. (hmm, I wonder how well the FM24 would diffuse a beam coming from 7 black aspheric...:naughty
> 
> -Mayo



How much effect do you think FM24 has on thermal dissipation? For short bursts I don't imagine that it matters but on lengthy runs I'm wondering if it will hold too much heat in. I've been thinking about getting an FM24 but I'm concerned about over heating the LEDs or batteries if the heat can't escape.

-LT


----------



## smopoim86

Would it be possibe to take the 7 Cree version and run a mce in the center and tir optics on the other 6 xre. Is there a driver that will run 10 in a series? If I did it I would want the mce to be 5a.


----------



## LED Zeppelin

smopoim86 said:


> Would it be possibe to take the 7 Cree version and run a mce in the center and tir optics on the other 6 xre. Is there a driver that will run 10 in a series? If I did it I would want the mce to be 5a.


The Blue Shark is only rated for 32V max, so to drive the LEDs at spec, you will likely need 2 drivers, perhaps a boost for the 6 Crees and a buck for the MC-E depending on the cell solution. Fitting 2 Sharks may be possible, but I haven't tried it yet.

Another challenge would be to find a reflector that worked with the MC-E in a package that is dimensionally compatible with the McR19XR. I haven't tried the MC-E in the 19XR.

In short it is probably possible, but the level of difficulty, custom work, and cost may not be outweighed by the end result.


----------



## curtispdx

*MZP7-3*

Dumb questions alert: So, I can run six RCR123s or three 17670s in the MZP7-3? (Will running four RCRs be considerably less bright than running six?) Any difference between the standard black label AWs or IMRs?

Thanks in advance!


----------



## DaFABRICATA

*Re: MZP7-3*



curtispdx said:


> Dumb questions alert: So, I can run six RCR123s or three 17670s in the MZP7-3? (Will running four RCRs be considerably less bright than running six?) Any difference between the standard black label AWs or IMRs?
> 
> Thanks in advance!


 


Hi curtispdx,

I think it should be just as bright using 4 RCRs. 
As far as the differences in cells...I really don't know..runtime maybe?:thinking:


----------



## curtispdx

*Re: MZP7-3*



DaFABRICATA said:


> Hi curtispdx,
> 
> I think it should be just as bright using 4 RCRs.
> As far as the differences in cells...I really don't know..runtime maybe?:thinking:





Thanks! I've got it on an M4 with 4 RCRs and it's REALLY bright but I didn't know if I was missing anything by not running 6.


----------



## LED Zeppelin

curtispdx said:


> Dumb questions alert: So, I can run six RCR123s or three 17670s in the MZP7-3? (Will running four RCRs be considerably less bright than running six?) Any difference between the standard black label AWs or IMRs?
> 
> Thanks in advance!



curtis, 

With 3 X 17670 hi level is not in regulation, approx 2.6A gets to the LEDs on fully charged cells. Using (6) RCR123s, hi level will be in regulation for the life of the cells at about 2.8A to the LEDs. 

Using (6) RCR123s, 22.2V, the light draws 1.47A on hi which is right at the recommended limit for protected cells.If you only use only (4) RCR123s, 14.8V, the current will exceed the limit and the protection circuit could trip.

Using IMR cells, you could run it on 4 cells, but you would not have low voltage protection and runtime would be short. DaFAB is right, it should run in regulation on hi with 4 cells or 6, and runtime will be longer with 6.

Considering everything - cell handling, runtime, heat, brightness, etc., I personally like the 3 X 17670. The hi level is still plenty bright and it's a more convenient package. And for continuous use on hi, the heat is limiting so the reduced current will run cooler longer.



curtispdx said:


> Thanks! I've got it on an M4 with 4 RCRs and it's REALLY bright but I didn't know if I was missing anything by not running 6.



curtis, you posted this as I was composing the above. The cell protection might not be tripping at 2C for your cells. You might take them out and see how hot they get after using use on hi. IMR cells would work in your M4, but runtime on hi might only be 15 minutes or so.


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## curtispdx

Thanks for the responses, it's exactly what I needed to know. :thumbsup: I picked up your light on a trade and, I must say, I'M NOT WORTHY!  (I feel like a kid who just got his license and was given the keys to a Ferrari F40...)

You've been told this already but I'll say it too: Your work is simply amazing. Even a non-techie like me can recognize that. I'm pretty sure that this is the light that lets me walk away from incans once and for all.


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## black bolt

Hey Dennis are you whipping up any of your MZ line modules to use the SST leds? :devil:


----------



## LED Zeppelin

Thanks curtis.



black bolt said:


> Hey Dennis are you whipping up any of your MZ line modules to use the SST leds? :devil:


George, I just made a last run of the MZ sinks in the same patterns as before.

I don't have plans for more at the moment, but I imagine a tri-SST configuration using stars might work and be realtively easy to make.


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## Sgt. LED

Still loving mine!

I have 4 silver aspherical and 3 reflectors going now. It is awesome. :thumbsup:
You know it's a great light when I get blown away every time I turn it on high.


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## curtispdx

Your light is getting a lot of attention at the morning roll call; today a buddy picked it up, turned it on, then announced, loudly, "Whoa, it's like a small nuclear explosion!" 

(Yesterday, someone else picked it up and was shining it in everyone's eyes...)


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## DecemberHeat

I'm late for this but lucky enough LZ willing to build one for me. Now I just have to sit calm and wait for the baby to arrive. Thanks Dennis for the brilliant work...


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## FrogmanM

Congrats DH, LED Zep's Dropins are amazing. 

-Mayo


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## DaFABRICATA

FrogmanM said:


> Congrats DH, LED Zep's Dropins are amazing.
> 
> -Mayo


 


*A BIG +1 to that!!!*

I use my MZXR-7 a lot and its just nuts how bright and how far it throws!!

Dennis' work is top notch and I have no doubt you'll be happy with it.:wave:


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## autogiro

OH YEAH! :twothumbs:
My MZP7-3 showed up today and I can't believe how nice this thing is, I too am not worthy of this spectacle of light:bow:
Dennis went out of his way to make this light happen for me and I can't say enough good things about him!
This light is making me consider going back to night shift just so I can use it more!
Auto


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## DecemberHeat

Just got mine MZOX-4 this morning and can't wait for the sky to turn dark!!!

Loving it!! 

Dennis, you're the man!!!


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## DaFABRICATA

DecemberHeat said:


> Just got mine MZOX-4 this morning and can't wait for the sky to turn dark!!!
> 
> Loving it!!
> 
> Dennis, you're the man!!!


 


Then you can just light the nights sky back up with artificial sunlight!!!

I had a chance to check out griffs and was totally impressed!

+1 to Dennis being the Man!!:wave:


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## FrogmanM

Indeed, Dennis is the Man!!!

Post some beamshots if you can, they always bring a smile to my face. 

-Mayo


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## guiri

Guys, I am looking for some powerful lights and I would be very interested in trying someones lights where I of course pay shipping both way insured and I would be willing to pay some kind of deposit if needed. I would only need a day or so to try them out.

Here's also a thread that I just posted and which directed me back here..https://www.candlepowerforums.com/posts/3355368#post3355368

Thanks

GEorge


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## LED Zeppelin

George, I have a few sinks left and have been building them per order, but don't have any finished lights on the shelf. 

I will eventually build some for myself but don't have any loaners at the moment.

Thanks for the interest.


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## guiri

THanks and thanks for the PM

George


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## petrev

My Fave

*MZXR-7 -* IT IS SO GOOD

:thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup:

Pete


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## shuen

petrev said:


> My Fave
> 
> *MZXR-7 -* IT IS SO GOOD
> 
> :thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup:
> 
> Pete



Mine is MZXR-7 Black dog (FM host version):thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup:

Wilson


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## rault18

i knwo this is an old thread but i just aquired an m6 and def want this led conversion kit!


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## ICUDoc

Yes, rault18, I'm interested too. LED Zeppelin, do you have any of the tapered pieces left to sell? I can make up the LED base myself...


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## LED Zeppelin

ICUDoc, PM sent.


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## cmacclel

LED Zeppelin said:


> ICUDoc, PM sent.




He's ALIVE!!! Good to see you Dennis.

Mac


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## LED Zeppelin

cmacclel said:


> He's ALIVE!!! Good to see you Dennis.
> 
> Mac



Thanks Mac, indeed I am alive and well but still in flashlight hibernation.


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## Icarus

LED Zeppelin said:


> Thanks Mac, indeed I am alive and well but still in flashlight hibernation.



Hi Dennis, good to see you're still around my friend. :buddies:


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## LED Zeppelin

Icarus said:


> Hi Dennis, good to see you're still around my friend. :buddies:



Thanks Freddy!


----------



## petrev

:buddies:

Ditto . . .

G-SHK RAF OK ?

:thumbsup:


----------



## desmondpun

Hi Dennis, just to let you know, all 3 MZXR-5 are as good as new. I still use them every single day.


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## LED Zeppelin

petrev said:


> :buddies:
> 
> Ditto . . .
> 
> G-SHK RAF OK ?
> 
> :thumbsup:



Very well, thank you again Pete!



desmondpun said:


> Hi Dennis, just to let you know, all 3 MZXR-5 are as good as new. I still use them every single day.


Great, thanks Desmond!


----------



## DUQ

Double post.


----------



## DUQ

Icarus said:


> Hi Dennis, good to see you're still around my friend. :buddies:



Nice to see you back to CPF Freddy.


----------



## Icarus

DUQ said:


> Nice to see you back to CPF Freddy.



Thanks Dan! Well at least not all old friends disappeared! :buddies:


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## elenore

very crazy work.:thumbsup:


----------



## tx101

Hey LZ, how about an updated version with multiple XPGs or XMLs ??? :naughty: :naughty: :naughty:


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## Xmldriver

Now here's a blast from the past and someone who makes lights I have drooled over for years. Now I have the money to actually buy one I can't, oh well that's life I suppose!


----------



## Edwood

Was just playing with my MZXR-7, love that massive throw. And the fact that I can run it off of 3x IMR16340's in an M3 body.

An XPG version would be interesting. Can you say *MZXPG-15*? Or Maybe even *MZXPG-21*?! Mwahaha. (using triple or Quad optics grouped together).

I'm picturing the pic below but with 3 or 4 tiny glows inside where each reflector used to be. 







-Ed


----------



## Echo63

Edwood said:


> Was just playing with my MZXR-7, love that massive throw. And the fact that I can run it off of 3x IMR16340's in an M3 body.
> 
> An XPG version would be interesting. Can you say *MZXPG-15*? Or Maybe even *MZXPG-21*?! Mwahaha. (using triple or Quad optics grouped together).
> 
> I'm picturing the pic below but with 3 or 4 tiny glows inside where each reflector used to be.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -Ed


What would be even better is having just the centre one replaced with a floody triple, and the outer ones staying as high surface brightness LEDs,in a bigger reflector for throw.
best of both worlds, a nice foreground illuminating spill, and a long throwing beam to reach out and touch stuff with.

Hmm, I have 2x Millenium turboheads, maybe I can sacrifice one to the Led cause


----------



## Dioni

tx101 said:


> Hey LZ, how about an updated version with multiple XPGs or XMLs ??? :naughty: :naughty: :naughty:



Or maybe some XM-L2 (triple!!!) :devil::devil::devil: 

I can't imagine it!


----------



## tx101

7 x Nichia LEDs of neutral goodness


----------



## LED Zeppelin

Thanks for the interest guys, but flashlights have been rather dormant for me lately. One of these days I'll get back to it.


----------



## tobrien

your stuff is amazing


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## Dioni

LED Zeppelin said:


> Thanks for the interest guys, but flashlights have been rather dormant for me lately. One of these days I'll get back to it.



We hope so!


----------



## Greenbean

Dioni said:


> We hope so!



*Me too, 

I am looking for something/someone to replace a P7 LED for me....

*


----------



## python

I love this post :twothumbs


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## Icarus

I made a few too and I love them! Here is the link.


----------

