# Need your thoughts on a "kit knife"



## jusval (Mar 17, 2009)

So, I've made model sailboats, model trains, furniture, gun stocks, now flashlights. I would like to do a knife.

I don't have the stuff to make a blade from scratch, but I can buy a blade or blade kit and do the rest myself. What I don't know about knife blades is only surpassed by what I don't know about women...... 

So, just doing some searching, it appears that there are two or three sites that make the majority of "kits" out there, but I don't want to use a junk blade. What I see are two basic materials, 440C and AUS8. What the heck are they and will they make a good blade or a junk blade? I know how to fashion handles, guards, bolsters, sheaths, etc..... but I don't want to make it out of a blade that later on no one will want, including me....

Thanks in advance for your thoughts and comments. 

Justin


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## PetaBread (Mar 17, 2009)

440c and aus 8 aint the best steels, their not even close. Aus 8 and 440c are 

softer steels that hold a edge decently and are easy to sharpen. They wont make a great blade and they wont make a 

junk blade, they'll make a "decent" blade if not, alitte less.


154cm, VG-10, S30v, S90v, D2 would make good choices.


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## HoopleHead (Mar 17, 2009)

Here are some Fallkniven VG10 blanks - http://www.knifecenter.com/kc_new/store_store.html?ttl=Fallkniven%20Knives&srch=eqCATE%20CODEdatarq%3Dfal%26eqWWWCAT_1datarq%3Dblade


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## carrot (Mar 18, 2009)

440C and AUS8 are pretty good. Once upon a time they were considered premium but the knife industry has moved on to more expensive and exotic materials. They are still great steels and I like 'em a lot but they aren't really popular except in the lower end knives now. 

Properly heat treated 440c and AUS-8 will take a wicked edge. Still a good steel.

Try Knifekits.com?


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## jusval (Mar 18, 2009)

carrot said:


> 440C and AUS8 are pretty good. Once upon a time they were considered premium but the knife industry has moved on to more expensive and exotic materials. They are still great steels and I like 'em a lot but they aren't really popular except in the lower end knives now.
> 
> Properly heat treated 440c and AUS-8 will take a wicked edge. Still a good steel.
> 
> Try Knifekits.com?


 
I'm old enough to remember 440C being the "greatest".

Actually that was the first place I went. Then to Texas knifemakers supply. Most all of the "kit" places I found use 440c and AUS8, but after finding the "other steels", I see why they make the cheaper steels. If they made good steel their kits would be a couple hundred dollars and they wouldn't sell near as many. 

I think that it's like all other hobbys, there's the cheap way and the best way.....

Thanks for the comments guys..............

I would go back to reading books for a hobby, but it's So Boring......:laughing:


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## RA40 (Mar 19, 2009)

http://www.knifeandgun.com/SearchResults.asp?Cat=33

This reminds me back when Bob Engnath was with us. His "kit" knives were great learning exercises, he did custom profiles as well.


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## jusval (Mar 19, 2009)

Actually, I downloaded the PDF catalog from *Jantz* and they do have a couple of Kits in VG-10. I like their El Verde VG-10/Damascus (SS750) even though it's out of my price range, or their Harvest Moon Locker (VG103)..... One of these days, I might just try one. I would like to do a set of scales with inlays or maybe basket weave done on them. I don't have the equipment to make a blade, but I can do the wood and finishing work.


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## Dirty Bob (Mar 20, 2009)

You can also buy an inexpensive Swedish (Frost or Eriksson) knife or two from Ragnar at Ragweed Forge (Google it), split the handle off with a screwdriver and mallet, and have a high-quality but inexpensive blade to use in knifemaking. I'd rather have a plain carbon steel Eriksson blade than something in 440C or AUS-8, although I can vouch for the "generic" stainless in Swedish knives. It's good stuff. In the price you pay for a simple Scandinavian knife, probably 80% goes into the blade and 20% into the handle/sheath. Scandinavian knives take and hold a wicked edge.

Welcome to the world of knifemaking. Once you master making guards and handles from pieces of plain ol' brass and wood, you can save a heckuva lot of money and have a knife that's unique and fits your hand perfectly.

All my best,
Dirty Bob


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## jusval (Mar 20, 2009)

Dirty Bob,

Thank you Very much. A very interesting site and I can see it will be one that I bookmark and use often. I will definitely try one of those blades!

Justin


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## guyg (Mar 21, 2009)

I'm not very handy, but many years ago I did a Rigid brand kit knife. Ya gotta do it once! Had a blast! I also made a paring knife from a hacksaw blade.


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## jusval (Mar 22, 2009)

Well I went ahead and bought a first kit. It's something I had never seen, so I got it because it looked different, to me. 

It's a Laguiole, French Damascus Folder (with Bee). Blade length 4 inches. It has what looks like brass forged bolsters and it comes with Amboyna Burl scales. I liked the looks of it and it should be a good first kit, since I basically just have to do the wood handles and finish work.

Anyhow I just thought it looked different. When I get it, I will do a "build" thread, like I do with my lights.


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## Monocrom (Mar 23, 2009)

440C and AUS8 don't get much respect nowadays.

However, I can tell you from experience that 440C can easily keep up with many of the exotics in use today. I've used knives in various steels. While some of the exotics do a bit better than 440C in one area or another, they don't blow 440C out of the water. 440C has been around a long time. It's a proven steel. And, it generally does better with regards to rust-resistance than the exotics out there... at a lower price.

With regards to AUS8, it's my favorite blade steel. An excellent combination of rust-resistance (better than ATS-34), ease of sharpening, price, and overall maintenance. Here's another reason why it's an underrated steel... Its identical twin is 440B. (440B is the American version of AUS8, which comes from Japan). If you buy a stainless steel Randall Made knife, you're buying 440B. If AUS8's identical twin sister is good enough for that legendary company... Well, you know where I'm going with this. 

Both 440C and AUS8 deserve a lot more respect than they get.


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## 2manybikes (Mar 23, 2009)

The heat treating, or the hardness of any one steel can completely change the blade. As much or more than the exact alloy.
440c takes a good edge when it is up in the high 50s rockwell, but is hard to sharpen. The way to sharpen a hard 440c blade is with a fine grit daimond round sharpening steel. Then you can easily sharpen a 440c blade even at 60 rockwell.
There really is no way just by looking at a blade to tell how it will sharpen and hold an edge. 440c is known for being hard to sharpen. But it is still used a lot. I'm old enough to remember when it was "best" too.
Also a polished finish resists rust much better than a flat or bead blasted finish.


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## jusval (Mar 23, 2009)

I guess it's just like anything else, if you ask a hundred people what they like, you get a hunders different answers. I have read some of the knife forums out there and some of it is very opinionated. If you don't have X,Y or Z, you don't have S**t. 

To me it does not really matter. I don't use knives myself (except one in the kitchen), so I really don't have any preference. I don't know how to sharpen, or any of that stuff. I just thought I might try my hand at finishing a knife or two, with hand tool work that I can do. It's something to kill time mostly, but with the money issue, I have to be able to sell it when I'm done, so the only requirement for me, is to do something someone else will want to buy.

It's like this, I like the old "Texas Toothpick" style knife and I see some on ebay (440C) or so ad says and states it's US made, but I'm wary of that. I could do some really nice handles on something like that. Mother of Pearl, Bone, Synthetics, Inlays and all, but will anyone want it, since the blade is not made by "Joe the Knife Guy"?

I see several knife blanks that I would like to do, including the Swedish (Frost or Eriksson) knives and a few others. None of which are "better" than 440C or AUS-8. So that's why I really haven't done much yet. 

I bought the Laguiole, because it was $35 with the Burl Scales, so I figured no matter what, I could always get that much back for it. My worst problem is that I was never any good selling my stuff. I mean it might take me a week worth's of work and I don't count any labor into it, so I sell it for little of nothing most of the time. I know I shouldn't so that, especially if it comes out great.

Anyhow, I'm rambling on again, for no good reason............ Thanks for the info y'all have given me so far. Very good of you to do that.....

Justin


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## jzmtl (Mar 24, 2009)

HoopleHead said:


> Here are some Fallkniven VG10 blanks - http://www.knifecenter.com/kc_new/store_store.html?ttl=Fallkniven%20Knives&srch=eqCATE%20CODEdatarq%3Dfal%26eqWWWCAT_1datarq%3Dblade


Geez, the blanks are the same price as fully made knives. :thinking:


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## revs (Mar 29, 2009)

I have made several of the knives from both Jantz and North Coast Knives. I find they are decent knives and fun to make. I have actually made a couple for coworkers and made a little money on them. I did two hatchets for a guy at work for Christmas gifts to his son and dad. They turned out great. One was Birdseye maple handles the other was red Corian.

I have a small fixed blade with yellow Corian handles I love. Need to make a Kydex sheath for it next. The easiest blade to do, in my opinion, is the Bear Claw from North Coast. http://www.northcoastknives.com/Blades_BearClaw.gif I think I have made 4 or 5 of these and they are just fun to make.

North Coast also has some tutorials to help you out along the way. Very nice guy to deal with.


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## locutus_of_borg (Apr 11, 2009)

Monocrom said:


> 440C and AUS8 don't get much respect nowadays.
> 
> However, I can tell you from experience that 440C can easily keep up with many of the exotics in use today. I've used knives in various steels. While some of the exotics do a bit better than 440C in one area or another, they don't blow 440C out of the water. 440C has been around a long time. It's a proven steel. And, it generally does better with regards to rust-resistance than the exotics out there... at a lower price.
> 
> ...


 
...................
...................
440C is not bad at all. he said EDC that means usage. so for a real working knife 440C is good. even 440A is not bad. 440A will take a good edge but won't hold it as long. many people will tell how easy a knife is to sharpen but not tell how long it will hold an edge.

there is also other points to consider. 440A can be stamped. 440C has to wire cut or cnc'ed. so the cheaper way to make a knife is use a steel that can cookie cutter cut instead of a steel that has to be machined or wire edm cut.

but as one other man said its a knife that means use it to cut things not as a hammer or as a tool such as a screwdriver or pry bar. would you use your 600 buck tit led as a hammer? why use a knife as one?


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