# H6CC 6.7A LED driver



## georges80 (Mar 4, 2010)

Apr 23. Below is the original post. Since the prototype stage, the driver has evolved into the H6CC and can output up to 6.7A.
-------------------------------------------------------

Well, until I think of a better name - high five constant current...

5A buck converter prototype. This is actually a hyperbuck driver that I realized already had all the guts to deal with 5A output - if I just changed the inductor, sense resistors and increased the switching frequency a bit from the hyperbuck configuration.

Anyhow, here's a picture that should say it all:







Running just over 81% efficiency with 3.4V output and 14V input - which is not bad given the large voltage in / voltage out delta.

My load is 2 x P7 in parallel to deal with 5A output.

Been running for 30 minutes and totally stable. Given it's based on the proven hyperboost and hyperbuck architecture I'm pretty confident with the 5A output. Lots more tests to do to characterize efficiency over various input/output combinations.

I also need to re-lay the PCB into a round shape to make it CPF friendly 

cheers,
george.


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## Th232 (Mar 4, 2010)

*Re: H5CC driver*

Toasty!
This'll make a lot of SST-50 builds a lot easier.

Any thoughts on the price difference between this and the regular hyperbuck/hyperboost?



georges80 said:


> I also need to re-lay the PCB into a round shape to make it CPF friendly



Lol, just last night I was trying to figure how to fit a hyperboost into a Creebar (channel is 32 mm, you can see where this is going) and wishing it was rectangular instead!


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## Codiak (Mar 4, 2010)

*Re: H5CC driver*



georges80 said:


> Well, until I think of a better name - high five constant current...
> 
> 5A buck converter prototype. This is actually a hyperbuck driver that I realized already had all the guts to deal with 5A output - if I just changed the inductor, sense resistors and increased the switching frequency a bit from the hyperbuck configuration.
> 
> ...


 

Nice!

I'll start the chants.... production, production, production


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## darkzero (Mar 4, 2010)

*Re: H5CC driver*

:twothumbs

Can't wait for these! Keep up the great work George!


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## Greg G (Mar 4, 2010)

*Re: H5CC driver*

I need one of these (along with a new SST-50 emitter).


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## TorchBoy (Mar 5, 2010)

*Re: H5CC driver*


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## SUBjohan (Mar 5, 2010)

*Re: H5CC driver*

Will it be possible to put 2 of these in parallel to drive 1 or more SST90's ?

Greetz Johan

Or are you secetly building a dedicated SST90 driver??


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## Aircraft800 (Mar 5, 2010)

*Re: H5CC driver*

:twothumbs
Now to dream up another build! Thanks George!


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## wquiles (Mar 5, 2010)

*Re: H5CC driver*

Totally awesome George - nice work :twothumbs


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## Hill (Mar 5, 2010)

*Re: H5CC driver*

Congrats George!! Way to come through! Looking forward to getting one of these!

Hill


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## HarryN (Mar 5, 2010)

*Re: H5CC driver*

Hi George

I noticed that Vin for the hyperbuck is 8 volts. I assume this is not going to go down to 5 volts - right?

Thanks

Harry


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## georges80 (Mar 5, 2010)

*Re: H5CC driver*

2 drivers in parallel is not feasible due to the topology of the driver.

Price - it'll have to wait until I've finished the new layout to see where it ends up in terms of component choices. Certainly won't be more than a hyperbuck or hyperboost.

Tests of a sample size of 1 shows it remained in regulation down to about 6.5V driving 2 parallel P7's (total Vf around 3.4V). There's about 0.4V drop/loss across the polarity protection diode. I "may" replace the protection driode with a FET - we'll see.

The spec for the switcher controller IC is 8V when configured for wide input voltage range. Its minimum operating voltage is 6V, but only when wired for Vin always less than 7V which obviously would not be the case with 2 or more li-ion cells.

It's pretty clear if you want to drive a single LED that you really need to consider a minimum series stack of 3 li-ion/li-poly/lifepo4 cells or 8 nimh cells.

Harry - there is NO way that you'll find a current regulated switching driver IC that can run from 5V at substantial output amps with a LED load. The switching element (FET) needs a high enough gate drive to fully enhance the device for efficiency purposes. At 5V you may as well use a linear shunt regulator and just burn the extra VA.

cheers,
george.


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## Mettee (Mar 6, 2010)

*Re: H5CC driver*

wow George, great to see this...I knew you would come out with something for these new leds. Nice Work!


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## georges80 (Mar 7, 2010)

*Re: H5CC driver*

Ok, tested 2s2p P7's (total Vf around 6.6V or the equivalent of 2 SST-50's in series) at 5A and all looks good - driver is stable and running well thermally. Input voltage was 8.1V, below that it would go out of regulation.

This is with a schottky diode for polarity protection - so that's eating up 0.5V (4.6A input current). The H5CC driver will utilize a low Rdson FET that will drop less than 0.1V while providing reverse polarity protection to the driver.

Measured efficiency with the 2s2p P7's at 5A and 8.1V input was 88% (with the protection diode). If it was a FET the efficiency would have been around 93%.

Next test will be with 3p2p P7's to emulate 3 x SST-50 at 5A, that'll have to wait till tomorrow or Monday.

cheers,
george.


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## SUBjohan (Mar 7, 2010)

*Re: H5CC driver*



georges80 said:


> Next test will be with 3p2p P7's to emulate 3 x SST-50 at 5A, that'll have to wait till tomorrow or Monday.



That would be sweet!!
I have a lime green 3D mag 4x 26500 Li-ion and 3x SST50 just waiting here for a driver 

Greetz Johan


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## georges80 (Mar 7, 2010)

*Re: H5CC driver*



SUBjohan said:


> That would be sweet!!
> I have a lime green 3D mag 4x 26500 Li-ion and 3x SST50 just waiting here for a driver
> 
> Greetz Johan



Just tested 3p2s P7's (equivalent to 3 series connected SST50's) running at 5A. Ran the test for 20 minutes (fan on the poor P7 heatsink - 50Watts going to the LEDs) and the driver was very happy on its chunk of aluminium. Hottest area of the driver was about 20C hotter than the heatsink it is mounted to (thermal pad material).

With output at 10V (total Vf of my 3p2s P7 stack) input voltage at 11.7 kept the driver in regulation - again with the polarity protection schottky diode in place.

Measured efficiency was around 93% (with the schottky in place), so it'll actually be a couple or more % higher with a FET in place.

Looking good and the next step is some cleanup of the round 1.3" diameter layout (components all on one side) and then I'll order production boards. So, by the end of March I'll have H5CC drivers available.

cheers,
george.


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## ma_sha1 (Mar 7, 2010)

*Re: H5CC driver*

Can this be wired 2 in parallel to get 10 AMP?


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## georges80 (Mar 7, 2010)

*Re: H5CC driver*



ma_sha1 said:


> Can this be wired 2 in parallel to get 10 AMP?



See post #12...

cheers,
george.


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## ma_sha1 (Mar 7, 2010)

*Re: H5CC driver*

George, can you explain what you mean by "topology" here?

Thanks


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## georges80 (Mar 7, 2010)

*Re: H5CC driver*



ma_sha1 said:


> George, can you explain what you mean by "topology" here?
> 
> Thanks



The way the driver is implemented as a buck driver - i.e. connection of sense resistor, power FET, inductor, etc. It can not be paralleled.

cheers,
george.


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## dom (Mar 9, 2010)

*Re: H5CC driver*

Top stuff George
Just copied this from MTBR (as i wanted to know the control on it).

QUOTE:

"The driver has a multiturn trimpot (like hyperboost/hyperbuck) for setting the output current - max 5A. An external Pot or switch with resistors can be added to provide adjustable output or a few fixed levels. "

END QUOTE

Cheers
Dom


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## Bimmerboy (Mar 9, 2010)

*Re: H5CC driver*

Well, George... you've just ruined all efforts to convince myself that my MC-E Mag is bright enough, and I do NOT need to build an SST-50 light! 

Now, to start planning the rest of the mod. :laughing:


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## Fulgeo (Mar 10, 2010)

*Re: H5CC driver*

Looks great:thumbsup:. Can not wait to see the final result. Any chance of getting multiple modes like 1.7 amps low and 4.2-5 amp high controlled by one switch? If not, no worries. An efficient 5 amp driver powered by 3 Li-ion cells is a dream.


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## georges80 (Mar 26, 2010)

*Re: H5CC driver*

First prototype of the new h5cc layout. Even though it is based on the hyperbuck design, I decided to make some component changes to improve the usefulness for folk that are looking for a round driver that would fit a D mag.

The driver also has a very low Rdson FET for reverse polarity protection. I have put polarity protection into all my recent drivers (fatman is currently the only driver I make that doesn't have it) since too often the owner or someone that borrows the light puts batteries in backwards and destroys the driver.

The PCB is 1.2" in diameter, with all components on the top side to ease heatsink mounting requirements. Basically a piece of thermal pad material or thermal adhesive tape will allow it to mount down to a heatsink.

The precision multiturn trimpot is the same one used on the hyperboost/hyperbuck drivers and allows setting of the output current. There is a buffered PWM control input (high going signal will turn off the output). There's also 2 inputs that allow wiring to an external Pot (in parallel with the onboard trimpot) for continuous output current adjustment.

This driver could be directly connected and controlled by a d2Flex driver.

The following picture shows the prototype driver.







The following shows the driver connected to 6 P7's in (3s2p) to mimic 3 x SST50's in series.






The output current is adjusted to a very low level to allow capture of the picture. A US quarter for size comparison.

More testing to do before I run production boards.

cheers,
george.


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## TorchBoy (Mar 26, 2010)

*Re: H5CC driver*

It's a thing of beauty!


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## georges80 (Mar 26, 2010)

*Re: H5CC driver*

Setup running at full output (trimpot set for max current). Nominally 5A output and I ran it for 1 hour 20 minutes. 

The driver reached 58C at the hottest component (input FET) with the heatsink reaching 37C at the end of the test. The prototype PCB doesn't have thermal vias for the FETs or Inductor to the bottom surface of the board - I rushed the proto out with another batch of boards I was getting prototyped. I'm actually very please that even without a good thermal path for the 'hot' components on the PCB, that they only reached around 20C higher than the heatsink.

On the production boards I've already changed the layout to incorporate the thermal vias. Basically this board is not stressing at all to push out 45W+ to the 6 P7's.

Here's some pics of it running full output:






and with the 'shade' removed from the P7's 






cheers,
george.


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## wquiles (Mar 26, 2010)

*Re: H5CC driver*

That is freaking awesome George - good job!


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## Mettee (Mar 26, 2010)

*Re: H5CC driver*

I will take one George as soon as they are done!


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## Fulgeo (Mar 27, 2010)

*Re: H5CC driver*

I would also like one or two. Great job. :thumbsup: Let me quote your typical three year old and say "Gimmie Gimmie!"


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## Al Combs (Mar 27, 2010)

*Re: H5CC driver*

Will this board have a PWM port like the hipCC for the addition of a D2Flex? Will the production version have a pot that can be removed in preference to an external one? Thanks for making it fit in the Mag-D.:twothumbs

Dare I ask is there a H9CC or a H9Flex in the works? :naughty:


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## georges80 (Mar 27, 2010)

*Re: H5CC driver*



Al Combs said:


> Will this board have a PWM port like the hipCC for the addition of a D2Flex? Will the production version have a pot that can be removed in preference to an external one? Thanks for making it fit in the Mag-D.:twothumbs
> 
> Dare I ask is there a H9CC or a H9Flex in the works? :naughty:



Post #24 describes PWM...

Why remove the trimpot - all my drivers (with Pot inputs) are designed to retain the onboard trimpot to be used to trim up an external Pot. Given most pots are +/- 20% I use the onboard trimpot (that ends up in parallel with the external Pot) to adjust the external pot range. Removing on board trimpots would mean you have as bad as +/- 20% current control.

No 9A drivers in the works - that would require too many thermal/battery/contact issues that I don't want to have to deal with AND the inevitable questions from users.

Consider that power losses in any resistive elements goes up by the square of the current, i.e. I x I x R. So, 0.02 ohms in line with the current path for a 5A driver would be 5 x 5 x 0.02 = 0.5W, with 9A that would become 9 x 9 x 0.02 = 1.6W.

I already have a prototype of the H5Flex - I haven't had time to assemble and test it, but given it's the blending of the H5CC and my proven Flex uController/hardware module I'm extremely confident it will work well. The H5Flex is 1.3" in diameter, so still Mag D friendly and with components only on the top surface.

Given the component ratings and how well the thermal operation of this driver is performing it may likely become a H6CC and H6Flex in production...

cheers,
george.


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## SUBjohan (Mar 28, 2010)

*Re: H5CC driver*



georges80 said:


> H6Flex



I cant wait, gimmie gimmie gimmie 

Greetz Johan


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## georges80 (Mar 29, 2010)

*Re: H5CC driver*

Ok, I've tested the h5cc with a d2flex and made some minor changes to the firmware (new menu entry) to support the lower dimming capability of the h5cc design versus hipcc.

Output current on low is around 20mA (average of 5A/256) - I can see the individual die of the P7 LEDs, press to high and it goes up to 5A - you don't want to be looking into the LEDs when you do that 

Click the d2flex/h5cc combo off and standby current consumption drops to <100uA.

The nice thing with the h5cc is you adjust the desired maximum current with the trimpot and then d2flex will PWM dim from low up to the set maximum current. Obviously the h5cc can be run standalone with an external POT or a switch with a few resistor values to click through some fixed output current settings.

cheers,
george.


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## georges80 (Mar 29, 2010)

*Re: H6CC driver*

I decided to try out the 6A capability before I commit to run production boards. I calculated what the driver should be able to deal with (with safe operating margins) and came up with sense resistor values that will provide 6.67A (nominal) output.

All the components are still within spec - here's the same 6 P7's (2 parallel strings of 3 series LEDs) running at full output. The power to run the H6CC is being provided through the d2flex so I can test the dimming capability. For this picture the output is set on 'high'.

The solder spools are being used to hold down a sheet of paper (that singed...) to keep pressure on the P7's so they don't lift off the thermal pad during the test.

After 10 minutes the aluminium heatsink that the P7's are on was at 62C 

I measured 10V going to the LEDs and the current was nominal 6.7A - that's 67W hitting those poor LEDs.

I had just over 16V feeding into the H6CC (to keep input current to the driver under 5A - the limit of my power supply). Calculated efficiency is just over 93% for this test case - pretty decent!

The hottest area of the driver reached 62C (input polarity FET) and the heatsink was at 32C (again after 10 minutes). The production board will run cooler, since all the 'hot' components will have thermal paths in place to the bottom of the PCB - the proto only has thermal vias under the switcher controller IC. The inductor, switcher controller, switcher power FET and sense resistors were under 50C.






cheers,
george.


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## greencardigan (Mar 29, 2010)

*Re: H6CC driver*



georges80 said:


> I decided to try out the 6A capability before I commit to run production boards. I calculated what the driver should be able to deal with (with safe operating margins) and came up with sense resistor values that will provide 6.67A (nominal) output.


 
Can you squeeze another 35% current out of it? 

Actually, 6.67A is probably a good compromise for a SST-90.


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## georges80 (Mar 30, 2010)

*Re: H6CC driver*



greencardigan said:


> Can you squeeze another 35% current out of it?
> 
> Actually, 6.67A is probably a good compromise for a SST-90.



9A => 9 x 9 = 81
6.67A => 6.67 x 6.67 = 45

So, you can see that your mere 35% 'squeeze' leads to close to 100% higher I^2 resistive power losses...

Higher current output would require a larger inductor (or run it much hotter) or increase in switching frequency for lower inductance, but then higher switching losses. It would need thicker traces, higher dissipation in the sense resistors etc etc.

Anyhow, I aimed for a 5A driver, but decided that given the component specs I could run it up at 6.67A. The multiturn trimpot will allow setting the drive current lower if needed so that will cover SST50 requirements and conservative sst90 implementations. Of course you could run multiple LEDs if needed - my test case above is essentially 3 series SST50's worth of load.

By aiming for a more conservative 6.67A output, the board fits nicely in its 1.2" diameter envelope, has a high quality multiturn trimpot for user current adjustment and also has all components on a single side, simplifying the attachment via thermal pad or thermal adhesive material to a heatsink.

cheers,
george.


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## cocoro1967 (Mar 30, 2010)

*Re: H6CC driver*

:wave:
This item is on sale in time or what?
Very interested.

I own light, SST-90 to 6A I want to drive.
A diameter of 20mm is ideal.


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## wquiles (Mar 30, 2010)

*Re: H5CC driver*

Awesome - I will take the 6.67 Amps !!!


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## netprince (Mar 30, 2010)

*Re: H5CC driver*



georges80 said:


> Output current on low is around 20mA (average of 5A/256) - I can see the individual die of the P7 LEDs, press to high and it goes up to 5A - you don't want to be looking into the LEDs when you do that



I'm looking forward to having such a large output range, 20ma on low is impressive.


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## videoman (Mar 30, 2010)

*Re: H5CC driver*

What is the minimum and maximum input voltage range and how much volts does it have to be above led vin to stay in regulation ? Also what temp will thermal shutdown occur? Will it be fine to drive from 7.2v source to power 24 xpg's in 12 strings of series ( alll strings paralleled) ?


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## georges80 (Mar 30, 2010)

*Re: H5CC driver*



videoman said:


> What is the minimum and maximum input voltage range and how much volts does it have to be above led vin to stay in regulation ? Also what temp will thermal shutdown occur? Will it be fine to drive from 7.2v source to power 24 xpg's in 12 strings of series ( alll strings paralleled) ?



Minimum input is 8V (as per previous info in this thread). Max input voltage will be 24V.

Headroom depends on output current, some info in this thread already. More testing to do before I release production boards late April.
Ok, at 5A output (max my power supply can provide on the input) and 9.82V Vf the driver needed 10.82V at the input to be in regulation, below 10.82V the output current would drop - basically direct drive. So, at 5A the driver requires 1V of headroom (this is with the low Rdson reverse polarity protection FET in place).

There is no thermal protection on the 'dumb' driver. h6flex will have all the 'good' stuff like thermal monitoring and input voltage monitoring etc etc.

The h6cc with a d2flex would have thermal protection by utilizing the d2flex monitoring and PWM rollback.

cheers,
george.


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## georges80 (Mar 30, 2010)

*Re: H6CC driver*



cocoro1967 said:


> :wave:
> This item is on sale in time or what?
> Very interested.
> 
> ...



20mm diameter - ha ha ha ha - very ideal, but not realistic. Just the inductor is 13mm square. Board diameter is listed in this thread.

I expect production boards to be available late April.

cheers,
george.


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## TorchBoy (Mar 30, 2010)

*Re: H6CC driver*



georges80 said:


> Max input voltage will be 24V.


That's a big step up from the 14 V I'd seen earlier. Does that mean it can power up to 6ish LEDs? At full current? Does the thread title need changing?


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## georges80 (Mar 30, 2010)

*Re: H6CC driver*



TorchBoy said:


> That's a big step up from the 14 V I'd seen earlier. Does that mean it can power up to 6ish LEDs? At full current? Does the thread title need changing?



The 14V at the start of the thread was the input conditions for that test - it was never the max input voltage rating.

The input rating (at least my design goal) was always 24V input (25V abs max)

Yes, it could drive more leds - the test is 3 series LEDs (2 P7's parallel), so Vf of around 10V total. Nothing stops you running more series LEDs as long as the input voltage is below 24V and you have at least 1V of headroom.

cheers,
george.


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## Th232 (Apr 5, 2010)

*Re: H5CC driver*

Hi George, short question. How high are these boards?

Looking forward to when they're released, I may be buying 8 of them...


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## georges80 (Apr 5, 2010)

*Re: H5CC driver*



Th232 said:


> Hi George, short question. How high are these boards?
> 
> Looking forward to when they're released, I may be buying 8 of them...



Same height as the hipcc/hipflex/hyperboost etc etc - basically just a hair under 9mm (PCB 1.6mm thickness + height of inductor).

I'm expecting production boards sometime next week - but I'll be out of town. So, the week after I'll be able to get a few assembled and some pictures of the finished units.

cheers,
george.


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## vestureofblood (Apr 5, 2010)

*Re: H5CC driver*

What is that black stuff that looks like rubber you have between your leds and the heat sink?


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## georges80 (Apr 6, 2010)

*Re: H5CC driver*



vestureofblood said:


> What is that black stuff that looks like rubber you have between your leds and the heat sink?



Thermal pad material TGF120K (you can search for it on www.mouser.com if you want more info) - works great to provide a good thermal path while testing LEDs, drivers etc since it is 'tacky' but not adhesive. It's the same material I supply with some of my drivers.

cheers,
george.


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## pepko (Apr 6, 2010)

*Re: H5CC driver*

Can I use this driver with Luminus CSM-360 or CBM-360 ?


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## georges80 (Apr 6, 2010)

*Re: H5CC driver*



pepko said:


> Can I use this driver with Luminus CSM-360 or CBM-360 ?



Can't see why not - basically looks to me like 4 series connected SST-50's from an electrical standpoint. You would need to run input voltage at least 1V higher than the highest Vf to keep the driver in regulation.

cheers,
george.


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## vestureofblood (Apr 6, 2010)

*Re: H5CC driver*



georges80 said:


> Thermal pad material TGF120K (you can search for it on www.mouser.com if you want more info) - works great to provide a good thermal path while testing LEDs, drivers etc since it is 'tacky' but not adhesive. It's the same material I supply with some of my drivers.
> 
> cheers,
> george.


 
Thanks George, I suspected it was something like that, but I had never even heard of such a thing. I've been having to grease up the leds with AS, which works ok but it sure gets messy.


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## georges80 (Apr 18, 2010)

*Re: H6CC driver*

Here's a picture of a production board - still missing one resistor that I didn't have on hand. Resistors will be ordered Monday so I can finish up a few boards on Wed/Thurs to test and make sure the production boards are ready to ramp up.







cheers,
george.


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## greencardigan (Apr 18, 2010)

*Re: H5CC driver*



Thanks for the update.

Will the H6Flex follow soonish?


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## georges80 (Apr 18, 2010)

*Re: H6CC driver*



greencardigan said:


> Thanks for the update.
> 
> Will the H6Flex follow soonish?



Probably about 1 month after the h6cc is released later this week. That gives me time to assembly a prototype up (about 1/2 done) and test it out and get the appropriate current regulation tables in place.

cheers,
george.


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## wquiles (Apr 18, 2010)

*Re: H5CC driver*

Great update George - board looks really nice :thumbsup:


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## flashfiend (Apr 21, 2010)

*Re: H5CC driver*

Hi, I'm wondering if this driver can be used to run 3 ssr-90's in series with 4 Li-Ion batteries in series at the maximum current for the driver? Additionally, does the Flex version of this driver just add levels and will it need to use a momentary switch like the D2Flex? Finally, what are the heatsinking solutions to dissipate the heat of this driver?


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## georges80 (Apr 21, 2010)

*Re: H5CC driver*



flashfiend said:


> Hi, I'm wondering if this driver can be used to run 3 ssr-90's in series with 4 Li-Ion batteries in series at the maximum current for the driver? Additionally, does the Flex version of this driver just add levels and will it need to use a momentary switch like the D2Flex? Finally, what are the heatsinking solutions to dissipate the heat of this driver?



If you look back through this thread you'll see it has been tested with the equivalent of 3 series connected LEDs running at 6.7A (doesn't matter if it's a -50 or -90 they have the same effective Vf). The driver can easily handle the load and run well from 4 li-ion cells.

Heatsink path is addressed in the thread, the driver has components on the top side only, so the bottom side would mount with thermal pad or thermal tape material to the heatsink. All the 'hot' components have a direct thermal path using multiple vias to the bottom of the PCB. Basically the same well proven heatsink path that I use with hipCC/hipFlex/hyperboost and hyperbuck works well and is used with the H6CC.

The Flex version will add the same features as all my other flex drivers since it will use the same firmware source code base.

The missing resistors were also delivered today, so I should be able to finish a batch of H6CC drivers tomorrow and have them available for purchase by Saturday. Pricing will appear on the order info page of my website (link below) on Saturday.

cheers,
george.


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## PM01 (Apr 22, 2010)

*Re: H6CC driver*



greencardigan said:


> Can you squeeze another 35% current out of it?
> 
> Actually, 6.67A is probably a good compromise for a SST-90.



Slightly north of 2000 lumens for an N bin sounds good to me. :thumbsup:


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## flashfiend (Apr 22, 2010)

*Re: H5CC driver*

Thanks George, that clarifies quite a bit. Being new to a lot of this I am still trying to visualize how the driver would attach to a host/heatsink combo such as Der Wichtel's triple LED heatsink for a Mag D host. Will a custom heatsink have to be made for the driver? I looked at your product info for the hipCC on your site and I see the thermal path you describe and now I'm just trying to figure out where I would attach it to in the build.


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## wquiles (Apr 22, 2010)

*Re: H5CC driver*



flashfiend said:


> Thanks George, that clarifies quite a bit. Being new to a lot of this I am still trying to visualize how the driver would attach to a host/heatsink combo such as Der Wichtel's triple LED heatsink for a Mag D host. Will a custom heatsink have to be made for the driver? I looked at your product info for the hipCC on your site and I see the thermal path you describe and now I'm just trying to figure out where I would attach it to in the build.



Many ways to skin that cat, but here are two examples of how I "mounted" the hipCC (2.8 Amp) LED driver from George while providing a thermal path to the driver:

1) https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/244664

2) https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/258545


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## georges80 (Apr 23, 2010)

*Re: H6CC driver*

Thanks for posting up the links Will.

Given that this driver only has components on the top side, it should be pretty easy to provide a large/wide thermal path versus drivers with components on both sides...

AND..... I have drivers ready to ship - this first batch has a 20V max input voltage, but I doubt that will affect too many folk.

The next run (after this first 20 or so) will have the full 24V input rating.

I will be posting up tech data on my website over the weekend as I perform more tests and take pictures etc. Tech info and pricing can be found via the URL in my sigline.

I have characterized the trimpot resistance versus output current information and that will be going into the tech section so folk can adjust the trimpot for their desired output current.

I will ship the drivers with the trimpot initially set for nominal 2.8A (P7 or 4p MC-E) current output.

cheers,
george.


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## flashfiend (Apr 23, 2010)

*Re: H5CC driver*

Thanks for the links Will. George, I think this driver is going to be a real winner and its max current may be a sweet spot for many lights.


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## wquiles (Apr 23, 2010)

*Re: H6CC driver*



georges80 said:


> Thanks for posting up the links Will.
> 
> Given that this driver only has components on the top side, it should be pretty easy to provide a large/wide thermal path versus drivers with components on both sides...
> 
> ...



You are welcome George - Payment sent for my first of many of these new drivers


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## Th232 (Apr 25, 2010)

I'm guessing that for a given Vin and load, the Hyperbuck will be more efficient than the H6CC, if it could you say by how much? Also, will the Hyperbuck now be disco'd?


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## georges80 (Apr 25, 2010)

Th232 said:


> I'm guessing that for a given Vin and load, the Hyperbuck will be more efficient than the H6CC, if it could you say by how much? Also, will the Hyperbuck now be disco'd?



The hyperbuck is a different beast - it can drive up to 50V from up to 80V input and there's no reason to discontinue it.

cheers,
george.


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## Th232 (Apr 25, 2010)

Ahh, thanks for the reminder on that. Completely forgot about the Vin range.


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## ti-force (Apr 26, 2010)

Hey George,

My driver arrived today safe and sound. Talk about fast shipping! WOW!:twothumbs. Thank you very much.

Casey


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## wquiles (Apr 26, 2010)

George - got my H6CC driver today - it is a beauty !!!


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## PM01 (Apr 26, 2010)

Got mine also! 

These are a work of art...the pictures on the website don't do them justice.

Now to start testing!


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## Fulgeo (Apr 28, 2010)

I received my H6CC also. Very fast turnaround. Thanks George!


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## Hill (Apr 28, 2010)

*Re: H5CC driver*



flashfiend said:


> Thanks George, that clarifies quite a bit. Being new to a lot of this I am still trying to visualize how the driver would attach to a host/heatsink combo such as Der Wichtel's triple LED heatsink for a Mag D host. Will a custom heatsink have to be made for the driver? I looked at your product info for the hipCC on your site and I see the thermal path you describe and now I'm just trying to figure out where I would attach it to in the build.



Will did a very nice job on that BL heatsink. I am not so fortunate to have a lathe, so I mounted the "massive" hipflex driver on its side with a separate hand cut Al heatsink in this triple MCE build. Hipflex is slightly larger I think than the H6CC, so had to carefully shave off two sides and part of the large black component to fit in the D-cell tube.


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## flashfiend (Apr 28, 2010)

Thank you for the post.


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## georges80 (Apr 30, 2010)

Yes, the h6cc is 1.2" in diameter (versus 1.4" for hipflex), so it will fit in a D mag tube without any issues.

I still have characterization to do of the driver, but for folk that need a reasonable starting point for adjusting the current setting trimpot the following graph should help.

I'm hoping to get some efficiency curves up over the w/end and a more accurate trimpot adjusting curve up on my website.

Once the trimpot is adjusted higher than about 22.5K (the trimpot is nominally 50K) the current will level at 6.7A (the design limit), so you don't need to worry about adjusting it too high...






cheers,
george.


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## irv_usc (Apr 30, 2010)

love it. are you going to start a separate thread for the H6flex?


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## georges80 (May 6, 2010)

Finally got some time to run some efficiency measurements. 4 multimeters (2 measuring voltage and 2 measuring current). I swept input voltage from a low end (keeping my powersupply from hitting its 5A current limit) up to about 18.5V (max of my power supply).

I ran 1, 2 and 3 LED tests (Vf around 3.5V, 7V and 10.5V total).

I ran a 2.88A test (P7 type LED load) a 5.00A test (SST-50 at spec) and a 6.6A test (over driven SST-50 type LED load).

First graph (efficiency versus input voltage) is for the 2.88A test:






Second graph (efficiency versus input voltage) is for 5.0A test:






Third graph (efficiency versus input voltage) is for 6.6A test:






As for a typical buck converter, you can see efficiency is higher when input voltage is closer to output voltage. Also, efficiency is higher for 3 LEDs versus 2 LEDs versus 1 LED.

The tests were performed with a production H6CC chosen at random. Note, H6CC drivers include reverse polarity protection (low Rdson FET), so realize that the efficiency numbers reflect the complete input/output performance of a production board, not a hypothetical best case driver with no reverse polarity protection.

cheers,
george.


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## nailbender (May 7, 2010)

Hi George

I just had to comment on how well this new driver worked. I finished a triple SST 50 built on a DW heat sink and used your new H6CC with a D2flex for dimming and it worked flawlessly. The member that wanted the light will actually use the light so I set the pot at 4.94 amps and all worked perfect. 
The D2flex is easy to wire in and I was able to heat sink the driver and get all in a maglite no problem 

I just wanted to say thank you for such a great product, works exactly as described with the same great quality as all of your offerings. It was much easier than wiring a bunch of drivers together to achieve the desired amperage.


Thanks again George for another great product. 

Dave


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## tva (May 7, 2010)

Hi George,

I am modding a dive torch to use a P90 led. Since the batteries and switches are going to be reused, I am stuck with the 12V the batteries provide.

I already tried a set of linear drivers in parallel, but they get too hot seen the big step-down in voltage. Let alone the efficiency which will be below any usable level. 

Also looked at this chip : http://www.linear.com/pc/productDetail.jsp?navId=H0,C1,C1768,P89897 , which will support 20A within workable voltage limits.

It is actually looking very promising, but I doubt if I can build the whole setup, all components included, small enough to fit into the dive torch...

Therefor I would be very interested to work with the H6CC driver this thread is about. At 6A the P90 is not at his max. but probably more than enough for use.

Could you give me some instructions around price and where to order ?
(I presume here you are still selling ready2use items...)

Thanks in advance,

T.


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## ti-force (May 7, 2010)

tva said:


> Hi George,
> 
> I am modding a dive torch to use a P90 led. Since the batteries and switches are going to be reused, I am stuck with the 12V the batteries provide.
> 
> ...


 Click below:
H6CC Driver


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## clint357 (May 7, 2010)

The web page shows that you can pot these things as long as the potting compound is not conductive. I just wanted to make sure that these will not get too hot. Thermal potting compounds DO conduct heat, but not that well. Have you tried potting these yet? I just don't want to buy one and have it overheat. Thanks.


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## georges80 (May 7, 2010)

clint357 said:


> The web page shows that you can pot these things as long as the potting compound is not conductive. I just wanted to make sure that these will not get too hot. Thermal potting compounds DO conduct heat, but not that well. Have you tried potting these yet? I just don't want to buy one and have it overheat. Thanks.



My general comments on potting and heatsinking of ANY of these new high current drivers (we're talking >2A here). I'm just choosing your email question to start off my discussion below:


The potting reference in the H6CC tech section is to the top of the board - for water proofing etc. I'll have to clarify that on my website.

It is the user's responsibility to calculate the heat dissipation in the driver - since you now have some efficiency curves to base your calculation on. You need to determine the watts be dissipated in your system and determine if the level of heat being generated in the driver and LED can be handled.

Just potting it into a brick and letting sit in a housing will obviously not be able to dissipate enough heat. That would be no better than using thermal epoxy to mount the driver to a small heatsink. e.g. if the driver is dissipating 2W, then whatever it is mounted on has to be able to dissipate that 2W AND maintain a stable temperature.

As you can imagine, I can't recommend whether potting would work or not - way too many variables including what kind of potting material, what shape you make the 'brick' (distance from the surface of the potting edge to the various devices on the H6CC board) and then how is the 'brick' mounted to the body of the light. What current you've set the output to? How many LEDs? What battery source? etc etc....

In summary, I HIGHLY recommend that you use the thermal pad (which I supply) or thermal adhesive tape to attach the bottom of the H6CC driver to your heatsink. That's the specific reason the H6CC was designed with components only on the top surface. This same scheme was used with the hipcc/hipflex/hyperboost and hyperbuck drivers (all high power drivers) very successfully.

Designing a high power driver that does not deal with how to cool the devices is only providing 1/2 the solution to the customer. All the high power drivers I've designed since the maxflex have had to address the thermal path. Most of the new high power IC's, FETs etc utilize the PCB to remove heat - the switcher controller on the H6CC has a thermal pad UNDER the IC (same as per maxflex) that you can't see after the part has been soldered down to the PCB. Same with the FETs on H6CC. There are multiple vias under the switcher IC and FETs (and inductor and power resistors) to transfer heat from these devices to the bottom side of the PCB. You can see some of those thermal areas in this picture:






and it is those thermal areas that need the thermal pad to heatsink interface to transfer the heat from the devices. 

With folk wanting drivers that can handle 30W to close to 100W you will have many watts being dissipated in the drivers - the cooling of the drivers is as important as the cooling effort being placed on the LED heatsink design.

Simple calculation here of a rather 'stressful' light). Assume you have 6.7A going to your 3 x SST-50/90's. That means 6.7 x 3.5 x 3 = 70W going to the LEDs. Assume you're powering this from 14.4V. From the efficiency curves in this thread, you have around 92% efficiency in the driver which is pretty decent. You will still have 70W x 8% = 5.6W being dissipated in the driver that needs to be removed from the driver. Potting the driver is not going to work.

Anyhow, in summary... I know a lot of folk (just read some of the somewhat recent SST50/90 threads) are all excited to get a driver for these new LEDs so they can build the meanest light out there... Great, but it's not quite the same as taking an XP-G and a 3W driver and making a pill for an xyz donor body. Even a single SST-50 driven at 5A is around 20W of system 'heat' that needs to be managed efficiently or you've just tossed a bunch of $$$ into the fire pit. That management requires attention to the LED heatsink AND attention to how the driver is going to be mounted to a heatsink AND the thermal paths from the heatsink to the body of the light.

Take care of the heat dissipation issues and the lights we build will work great and for more than a couple of minutes...

cheers,
george.


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## clint357 (May 9, 2010)

Thanks for the great response. Thermal tape onto an aluminum plate will work well for my application. Great work BTW.


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## morelightnow (Oct 11, 2010)

How many turns is the trimpot? I keep turning it clockwise and it never stops and is slowing gaining current. My goal is to set it to max and leave it.


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## georges80 (Oct 11, 2010)

morelightnow said:


> How many turns is the trimpot? I keep turning it clockwise and it never stops and is slowing gaining current. My goal is to set it to max and leave it.



The trimpot has nominally 11 turns. Wide open it should be around 50k ohms - if you use a multimeter you should be able to verify you have it adjusted fully.

cheers,
george.


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## morelightnow (Oct 14, 2010)

The problem is I figured since I didn't add any resistors that it would run wide open. After 30 minutes of use the light was barely warm and that threw a red flag for me, so I knew it was not at full power.

When I try to measure the resistance I get a reading for .1 seconds then it goes open as if the circuit breaks as soon as it sees voltage. My meter reads .3 ohms when touching leads so I know it works. This is done with regulator installed but no batteries.

I just turned the pot until it felt like it was giving me resistance and now it is much brighter and gets hotter. I think it is maximum but I can't measure current. I'm happy with it for now.


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## georges80 (Oct 14, 2010)

morelightnow said:


> The problem is I figured since I didn't add any resistors that it would run wide open. After 30 minutes of use the light was barely warm and that threw a red flag for me, so I knew it was not at full power.
> 
> When I try to measure the resistance I get a reading for .1 seconds then it goes open as if the circuit breaks as soon as it sees voltage. My meter reads .3 ohms when touching leads so I know it works. This is done with regulator installed but no batteries.
> 
> I just turned the pot until it felt like it was giving me resistance and now it is much brighter and gets hotter. I think it is maximum but I can't measure current. I'm happy with it for now.



Some "cheap" meters can't read resistance in-circuit - not that you can generally read it accurately depending on other components around the part you are measuring. The tables I have on my website reflect what my Fluke meter reads in-circuit with the driver not powered up.

In the case of the h6CC, removing the trimpot completely will also let it run at full 6.7A output.

I pre-set the trimpot to a nominal 2.8A output when I test the drivers, so that is the default output current when you first receive a new h6CC.

cheers,
george.


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