# SF 9Z (pics inside)



## bestcounsel (Jun 29, 2009)

Hey guys/gals...

I just got a hold of a SF 9Z....and think its the bees knees...

It came with original bulb. I swapped it out with a WE bulb and 2 17500's. 

I was thinking about getting rid of it but it is sure pretty.......i am not sure if i can now....

Enjoy....









Update: 

added M60, 6P hexagon bezel (to better fit my comptac holster) and SF lanyard ring....still running on 17500's. 

This light has to be my favorite of all time...i have had many sf's but this is my favorite..


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## USM0083 (Jun 29, 2009)

Very nice! I have a 6Z from about the same era.


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## maxspeeds (Jun 29, 2009)

I like my 9Z as well. I feel it is a bit smaller than a Z3 and M3


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## ugrey (Jun 29, 2009)

I have a Z3 that I would never give up. I can not believe SF quit making these lights. They still make the Z2, so why not the Z3?


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## maxspeeds (Jun 29, 2009)

ugrey said:


> I have a Z3 that I would never give up. I can not believe SF quit making these lights. They still make the Z2, so why not the Z3?


 
I have a feeling it would be close competition for the M3 (although it does use P90 drop-ins) in form factor. I agree with you, and love my Z3. 3-cell bodies are the perfect length for me.


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## Kestrel (Jun 29, 2009)

Looks like some Z-series fans here. I very much like my 3-cell C3 & G3, but I cannot see the appeal of the Z2 or Z3. It seems like the same form factor, but the feel of those C-series flats is perfect in my hand, plus that shape also seems superior with a few other grips such as the cigar-type grip. In addition, you can get an HA finish in the C-series but not the Z-series, from what I know. I also think the C-series is the best-looking.  

I'm writing this not to bash the Z-series here (I sincerely believe: *to each his own*, however if you like SF's you're already :thumbsup: in my book ), I would really like to read why folks here think the Z-series is competitive or superior to the C-series (my faves). Thanks,


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## ElectronGuru (Jun 30, 2009)

I'd also like to see/read a comparison, but my guess on discontinuation is demand. The primary market for Z's (police/military), prefer a shorter barrel. So either the extra length is not (or no longer) worth it or was cumbersome in use (with pistol grip). 

As for 6Z vs 9Z. For owners, do you you find it at all nose heavy with pistol grip hold?


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## JNewell (Jun 30, 2009)

In a nutshell, the C-series body style requires some degree of orientation in the hand. The round profile of the Z body comes out "right" and secure no matter how it is gripped.


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## SG688 (Jul 1, 2009)

Yep, for me the 9Z is muzzle heavy with the Rogers pistol technique.

Mine is a 9Z conversion kit. It came with a 6Z body, a P90 .. and one battery. Add your own 6P bezel, tailcap and batteries. Later decided that it was silly to have an unused 6P body lying empty, so bought an extra bezel and tailcap.

Never found the additional lumens to be worth the extra length and third battery - and the Z rings didn't work for me. Finally found a niche when I removed the Z rings and instead put on a section of innertube. Then did the same with my 6Z.


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## Kestrel (Jul 1, 2009)

SG688 said:


> Never found the additional lumens to be worth the extra length and third battery


Actually, here's a different perspective - Using a three-cell body with a regulated module such as the Malkoff M60 (sorry, briefly going LED to illustrate the example) gives you 'free' energy from each cell, by obtaining lower drain rates from each cell:

Malkoff M60 w/ 2xCR123 (~5v total): 0.9 amps current draw to obtain the rated ~240 lumens. A SureFire cell can deliver 3.22 watt-hours at that drain rate (Calculated by interpolating data from SilverFox.)
Malkoff M60 w/ 3xCR123 (~7.5v total): 0.6 amps current draw to obtain the same rated ~240 lumens, a SF cell can deliver 3.53 watt-hours (10% more) at that lower drain rate. (Again by interpolation of existing data)
So 10% more watt-hours per cell = free energy, therefore instead of getting ~50% more runtime by adding a third cell, you actually get ~65% more runtime using the M60 with three cells. Very few free things in life these days, but this is one of them.

Applying this back to incan, *js* has explored & documented the same behavior in his SureFire M6 X-LOLA thread using the MN15. He is obtaining something like ~30% more energy from each cell by using 6 CR123's (obtaining a very low drain rate from each cell) rather than obtaining comparable lumens from 2 CR123's (at a higher drain rate from each cell) from a smaller two-cell incan light.

In addition, 325addict had a recent custom-production run made of 'x-lola' (I'm using js's terminology here though) P60-type lamp assemblies, configured for something like a P60-level of output, but for 3xCR123 / 2xLiIon voltages. This would obtain lower drain rates from 3xCR123 (compared to the P60 on 2xCR123), resulting in the same effect. Apparently they have a nice small hotspot and a good white beam, neat stuff.


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## sween1911 (Jul 1, 2009)

Wow! I'm a huge Z3 fan, and now I realize I NEED a Malkoff M60! Thanks for that info.


To the original thread creator, EXCELLENT light! The 9Z is one of my favorites in form and function. I have the Z3, the slightly updated version, but the 3-cell combatlight bodies are very cool. I can't believe they inexplicably kept the C3 and phased out the Z3. That was right in the sweet-spot of output, form, and utility between the Standard 6P/Z2 and the M2/M3 Millenium lights.


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## SG688 (Jul 1, 2009)

Whatever you say on the math ... 

The other thing that helped my 9Z find its niche _was_ adding an LED -- although not a Malkoff. It's replaced a Mag-Charger as my briefcase light.


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## SG688 (Jul 2, 2009)

As to the C v Z question -- the C didn't exist when I bought mine!

I've been spoiled by my E2. I like the smaller diameter body on the 6Z and 9Z. (Yeah, it's been a while since I bought a new one.)


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## bestcounsel (Jul 2, 2009)

nice....

I think i might just keep my 9z....might give to my boy....


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## ugrey (Jul 4, 2009)

I have a Malkoff in my Z3. I could have never imagined 3 hours of 200 plus lumens a few short years ago. That is a real comfort when I go out at night. My Z3 rides vertically in a cargo pants pocket usually.


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## bestcounsel (Aug 17, 2009)

updated pics....

does any one know if the older 9z's like can take 18650's....my 17500's seem to have space and fit loose....i would like to try a P91 and 18650's


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## Kestrel (Aug 17, 2009)

bestcounsel said:


> does any one know if the older 9z's like can take 18650's....my 17500's seem to have space and fit loose....i would like to try a P91 and 18650's


That was my initial thought as well, looking at my early-production C3 - and what seemed to be lot of room around my 17500's when they were in the light. However, 17500's tend to be ~16.9-17.0mm OD, while 18500/18650's are ~18.4mm OD. I seem to recall that my C3 had an ID of ~17.5mm, and I imagine that your 9Z would have the same ID. Just a guess for your light, but for my old C3, even though it looks like it has plenty of extra room, it's not even close to 18500-capable.


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## Superdave (Aug 18, 2009)

by far my favorite light...







I love my Z2 as well but the Z3 gets used alot more.


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## jp2515 (Aug 18, 2009)

Superdave said:


> by far my favorite light...
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Great setup. What kind of bulb and batteries do you have in there?


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## Superdave (Aug 18, 2009)

Thanks. 

MN16 and primaries.


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## Monocrom (Aug 19, 2009)

Nice pics, guys.

Thanks for sharing.


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## [email protected] (Aug 20, 2009)

:scowl:This is the incan forum where LED's are burnt for fun... Like this :nana:

You need this and this and this.:devil: Puny 235 Lumens....

Edit: Just had some fun with photoshop.


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## Monocrom (Aug 21, 2009)

[email protected] said:


> Edit: Just had some fun with photoshop.


 
Poor Al... Looks like he finally snapped. Saw it coming when he started stuttering in his posts.


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## RWT1405 (Aug 21, 2009)

Just curious as to how many of you use the Z & C series lights for their intended use, with a firearm. 

The only time I carry my Z2's/C2's/G2L's is when I'm carrying a firearm. My Z/C's have M60's in them, while my G2L's have M60L's in them. 

If I have no firearm on me, then I usually have a 6P (M60L), G2 (M60LL) or a Novatac 120E; with a Fenix L1T in my pocket, almost always. 

My .02 FWIW YMMV


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## RWT1405 (Aug 31, 2009)

Yeah, about what I thought.


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## bestcounsel (Aug 31, 2009)

RWT1405, 

I read your post and thought about answering what you have said but this post is not about that...its just a simple post about a classic light. Not a p***ing match. 

If you are concerened about tactics, make a post about it. 

By the way, i do carry my light 9z when i carry concealed....if fact i really like my9z despite its size when i am in a suit...if you read my post, it states that i added a 6P head to carry in my comptac holster....

Be Safe

Robert


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## Raoul_Duke (Sep 1, 2009)

I can't have a handgun, and missing part of my 9Z ATM, So it doesn't get to see its intended use, on two fronts...but its a nice looking light.

Shame it looks like it can't be bored for 18500 cells. ( somebody please tell me if they know/ think different & it could)


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## RWT1405 (Sep 1, 2009)

Thanks bestcouncel, but I don't remember saying or asking anything about tactics, I didn't even mention the type/ etc. of firearm I carry. I just asked if anyone carried them with a firearm & what other lights they might carry with them, at the time. 

Not sure how that makes a p***ing match, but so be it if that's what you want to think. And I'm sorry if anyone else took it that way. 

My .02 FWIW YMMV


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## angelofwar (Sep 1, 2009)

I want one......now that I have most of there current line-up, I'm really taking a liking to there older models, especially after getting a 6Z...


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## Monocrom (Sep 2, 2009)

Raoul_Duke said:


> I can't have a handgun, and missing part of my 9Z ATM, So it doesn't get to see its intended use, on two fronts...but its a nice looking light.
> 
> Shame it looks like it can't be bored for 18500 cells. ( somebody please tell me if they know/ think different & it could)


 
Surefire's Z-series models just don't have enough material at the thinnest section of their bodies. Don't do it. Especially if you have a vintage 9Z.

Just use 17500 cells.


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## maxspeeds (Sep 2, 2009)

Raoul_Duke said:


> Shame it looks like it can't be bored for 18500 cells. ( somebody please tell me if they know/ think different & it could)


 
I've bored out my 9Z and L6 bodies for 18500 IMR cells. This allows me to use high current LED's (MCE) and Incans (LF eo-m3t, IMR m3t, etc) not to mention to standardize my current cell supply to all LiMN.


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## Raoul_Duke (Sep 2, 2009)

Monocrom said:


> Surefire's Z-series models just don't have enough material at the thinnest section of their bodies. Don't do it. Especially if you have a vintage 9Z.
> 
> Just use 17500 cells.




How thin are we talking?

Thanks (to all) for the info


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## Monocrom (Sep 2, 2009)

Raoul_Duke said:


> How thin are we talking?
> 
> Thanks (to all) for the info


 
Thin enough that you could realistically bore completely through the body. 

Although it seems maxspeeds pulled off a small miracle, and met with success.


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## maxspeeds (Sep 3, 2009)

I currently have no access to a lathe, so I did it the old fashioned way (by hand). I started with a circular file and worked my way around the body for a few hours (literally) while watching tv . Then I finished the bore with a copper tube that was lined with 240 grit sandpaper. the boring was just enough to fit IMR cells. I'm almost positive that protected cells won't fit (this is fine as I have almost completely eliminated protected cells from my battery inventory as I have gone through so many headaches with their damn pcb protection circuit. I'm glad to now be able to use safe chemistry cells with no protection circuits.


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## Raoul_Duke (Sep 4, 2009)

maxspeeds said:


> I currently have no access to a lathe, so I did it the old fashioned way (by hand). I started with a circular file and worked my way around the body for a few hours (literally) while watching tv . Then I finished the bore with a copper tube that was lined with 240 grit sandpaper. the boring was just enough to fit IMR cells. I'm almost positive that protected cells won't fit (this is fine as I have almost completely eliminated protected cells from my battery inventory as I have gone through so many headaches with their damn pcb protection circuit. I'm glad to now be able to use safe chemistry cells with no protection circuits.



Could you measure the diameter of your cells (18500's I assume) (I also assume they are realy a realy snug fit in the 9Z) and then the outside diameter of the thinest section of the 9Z please.

I think a simple way to do this if you dont have the tools would be to use a thin strip of paper and mark with a pen when wrapped round once, and then lay out the strip flat out on a ruler. (if you could do it in mm also that would help me) 

Thanks.


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## Chrontius (Sep 5, 2009)

RWT1405 said:


> Just curious as to how many of you use the Z & C series lights for their intended use, with a firearm.
> 
> The only time I carry my Z2's/C2's/G2L's is when I'm carrying a firearm. My Z/C's have M60's in them, while my G2L's have M60L's in them.
> 
> ...



I've practiced the technique, but don't carry mine with a firearm. It's on bedside-table duty.


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## angelofwar (Sep 5, 2009)

Chrontius said:


> I've practiced the technique, but don't carry mine with a firearm. It's on bedside-table duty.


 
Ditto...my job only requires me to carry long-rifles...but when I go to bed, I always bring a bright combat light with me to use with my S&W .40, should the need arise. So, yes, I have them with the intent of using them for there intended purpose, but hope I never have to.


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## sween1911 (Sep 11, 2009)

Thanks for sharing the pics of the 9Z!! Classic SF combatlight! 

The M60 must be awesome in that light. I really need to get one for my Z3!

I've had visions of scoring an SRTH for it, but Gene's M60 is just too awesome to resist.

The 3-cell P/C/D/Z body Surefires always appealed to me as an awesome lightsource in 
a relatively small package, so it's nice to see that people aren't abandoning them for the
newest pocket edc wonder-lights.


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## angelofwar (Sep 12, 2009)

sween1911 said:


> Thanks for sharing the pics of the 9Z!! Classic SF combatlight!
> 
> The M60 must be awesome in that light. I really need to get one for my Z3!
> 
> ...


 
3 Cell SF's for life!!!:twothumbs


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## Monocrom (Sep 12, 2009)

angelofwar said:


> 3 Cell SF's for life!!!:twothumbs


 
I just got a 9Z body from donn. But I had to buy the z49 and Milky Snake Eyes KL3 head that were attached to it.

Oh well, it's not like 9Z bodies are common as dirt. lovecpf


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## bestcounsel (Sep 15, 2009)

you know, i carry my e2L (Kl1) with long clip more than my 9z. My old E2l has been just aswesome....i run it with rcr123's and its good to go.....most of my security details lately have been real low profile with not much light needed and the e2l has been more than enough....

However, i have had lots of lights go through my hands and nothing feels as good as my 9z.....i do use it for late night work and residential details.

Sween1911, the m60 is awesome in the 9z with 2 17500's. I used it the other day for a detail and one of guys said "thats just too much light"!


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## angelofwar (Sep 16, 2009)

Not too much off topic I hope, but My 6Z is easier to balance with my pistol than my C2, hence the "agility" part...but the C2 is easier on the fingers for extened use...so I carry both!


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