# Why no Duracell or Rayovac lithium AA's?



## Big_Ed (Sep 13, 2009)

Why hasn't Duracell, Rayovac, or other battery makers jumped on the lithium AA or AAA band wagon? They already make (or probably more correctly market and sell) lithium 123's, so why not give Energizer some competition? I'm in no way unhappy with Energizer Lithiums, just curious as to why they're sitting on the sidelines in the lithium AA/AAA game.


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## Black Rose (Sep 13, 2009)

Energizer had (still has?) a patent that prevented other companies from marketing and selling Lithium AA & AAA cells in North America.

Rayovac attempted to bring some into the NA market last year and was promptly taken to court by Energizer.

Apparently some of Energizer's lithium patents have expired.

Some have speculated that the Advanced lithium AA & AAA cells that showed up in the market this year were introduced to help fend off incoming competition.


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## damn_hammer (Dec 4, 2009)

i'd like to see a lithium aa come out with the everyready black cat logo on it. however, just about any competition regardless of logo to energizer ultimate lithiums would be good if it brings the price lower ... from my perspective.


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## ltiu (Dec 4, 2009)

damn_hammer said:


> i'd like to see a lithium aa come out with the everyready black cat logo on it.



Isn't Eveready and Energizer owned by the same company?




> however, just about any competition regardless of logo to energizer ultimate lithiums would be good if it brings the price lower ... from my perspective.


I wonder if it will bring quality and SAFETY down as well?

I have never heard of Energizer Lithium AA/AAA explode. I hear of CR123 and rechargeable Li-on explode, but never have I heard of Energizer Lithiums explode.


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## damn_hammer (Dec 4, 2009)

reading further about it, i think you're correct. would have been nice if they used the cat/eveready logo for their avanced lithium, and kept the energizer brand for the ultimate lithium. just me being nostalgic i guess, thinking the cat w/lightening bolt tail and 9 lives would bring some kick buttness




to it.

reading an article about the patent infringement claim made by energizer against rayovac it sounded like a major retailer in the US was carrying the rayovac lithium aa for some period of time before they were stopped. wonder how they were? i noticed a rayovac 9v lithium battery at one of the big box home stores the other day ... interestingly.


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## LEDninja (Dec 4, 2009)

ltiu said:


> I wonder if it will bring quality and SAFETY down as well?
> 
> I have never heard of Lithium AA/AAA explode. I hear of CR123 and rechargeable Li-on explode, but never have I heard of Energizer Lithiums explode.





damn_hammer said:


> eading an article about the patent infringement claim made by energizer against rayovac it sounded like a major retailer in the US was carrying the rayovac lithium aa for some period of time before they were stopped. wonder how they were?


Search "AA lithium battery explode" google CPF only. I got 149 hits. The retailer that was carrying the precursor to the ROV was named. And their batteries do explode!


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## ltiu (Dec 4, 2009)

LEDninja said:


> Search "AA lithium battery explode" google CPF only. I got 149 hits. The retailer that was carrying the precursor to the ROV was named. And their batteries do explode!



I meant I have never heard of Energizer branded AA/AAA Lithiums explode.

The fact that the ROV branded AA Lithiums exploded means my assumption is true - quality and safety WILL go DOWN!


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## ltiu (Dec 4, 2009)

damn_hammer said:


> i noticed a rayovac 9v lithium battery at one of the big box home stores the other day ... interestingly.



9v Lithium chemistry is not part of Energizers patents.


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## damn_hammer (Dec 4, 2009)

ltiu said:


> I meant I have never heard of Energizer branded AA/AAA Lithiums explode.
> 
> The fact that the ROV branded AA Lithiums exploded means my assumption is true - quality and safety WILL go DOWN!



well, i'll admit to not reading 100+ threads that were returned when searching exploding aa batteries. of the several i read none were regarding the rayovac that i was curios about, but instead a private label made in china lithium aa.


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## ltiu (Dec 4, 2009)

damn_hammer said:


> well, i'll admit to not reading 100+ threads that were returned when searching exploding aa batteries. of the several i read none were regarding the rayovac that i was curios about, but instead a private label made in china lithium aa.



The other thing I "heard" (read) from CPF about a year ago is that ROV branded lithiums are made in China ...


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## damn_hammer (Dec 5, 2009)

like these:


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## Morelite (Dec 5, 2009)

ltiu said:


> 9v Lithium chemistry is not part of Energizers patents.


IIRC Ultralife has the patent rights on the 9v lithium battery.
Ultralife Corp. is a Newark NY based company and the batteries are made in the USA.


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## Benson (Dec 5, 2009)

ltiu said:


> I have never heard of Energizer Lithium AA/AAA explode. I hear of CR123 and rechargeable Li-on explode, but never have I heard of Energizer Lithiums explode.


OK, CR123 are a different chemistry, and Li-ion are a different chemistry; neither of those have any relevance.

There _were_ some issues with cheap Chinese 1.5V Li AAs a few years back, but it's unclear whether they were actually using the same chemistry as Energizer -- if so, then obviously crappy QC can mean exploding batteries. But I don't know why the big brands would go for crappy QC when their name is on the line, so I guess I still don't see a reason to anticipate exploding AAs.




Morelite said:


> IIRC Ultralife has the patent rights on the 9v lithium battery.
> Ultralife Corp. is a Newark NY based company and the batteries are made in the USA.



I can't imagine how there could be a patent protecting 9V Li batteries -- since 3V lithiums aren't patent protected, and throwing 3 of them together is obvious. (Or is there a patentable invention I'm not thinking of required?) Besides, I remember putting 9V lithiums in the smoke detectors (new house) last century, so if there is a patent, it can't have long left till it expires.


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## Black Rose (Dec 5, 2009)

damn_hammer said:


> like these:


Nope. 

Energizer owns Eveready. Same company, different label.


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## GarageBoy (Dec 5, 2009)

damn_hammer is that a real pack? Thats AWESOME


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## Black Rose (Dec 5, 2009)

GarageBoy said:


> damn_hammer is that a real pack? Thats AWESOME


Yep, it's real.

Available in Australia, New Zealand, etc.


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## HiltiHome (Dec 7, 2009)

Duracell Lithium AA's are already available in Austria at €uro 9,99.
Thats about USD 15.-

http://www.duracell.com/power/at/products-detail-lithium.aspx


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## damn_hammer (Dec 7, 2009)

wow, that pic is bizzaro world. duracell lithium primary aa's with a rocket bunny mascot! do you have an opinion you can share on how the duracell lithiums compare to energizers? thanks


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## HiltiHome (Dec 7, 2009)

damn_hammer said:


> ... do you have an opinion you can share on how the duracell lithiums compare to energizers?...



I do not own any Duracell Lithium AA's, but lots of Energizers, lasting for a couple of years...

The real world pic was taken by a forums fellow at a food discounter in Austria.

At this time Austria is the only European country, where Duracell sells them.


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## Paul_in_Maryland (Dec 8, 2009)

I'm surprised no one has mentioned the CPF sponsor--Battery-something--whose thriving AA lithium sales were stopped cold by Eveready about four years ago.


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## Black Rose (Dec 8, 2009)

Paul_in_Maryland said:


> I'm surprised no one has mentioned the CPF sponsor--Battery-something--whose thriving AA lithium sales were stopped cold by Eveready about four years ago.


If you are referring to the Battery Station AA lithiums, I believe that was partly the result of the evil Energizer corporation and partly because those cells had the nasty habit of going


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