# D-Mag o-sink information



## sp5it (Dec 29, 2005)

Hello. I`m looking for technical plans of o-sink for my 3D mag. Of course I can buy one, but I will wait for delivery to Poland 6-8 weeks  Damn long time. I would like to do it by myself. Hour maybe two it will be ready. Can anyone PM me dimensions?
Mike


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## cmacclel (Jan 1, 2006)

Look at Modamags Post


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## yaesumofo (Jan 1, 2006)

You will find it easier to order one from flashlightlens.com.
It certainly will not take 6 to 8 weeks. Even the slowest mail will not take that long. 
I put a lot of work into redesigning the HotLips so that the the emitter is self centering. That is my biggest problem with the Hotlips design, I ruined many emitters because I couldn't get them dead center. So I started protyping O-sinks. I went through 5 or 6 versions before I was happy with the results. Since the first pubically available version they have been revised and refeined another 4 times. I do not have a PDF of the buleprint so it may be simpler for you to order one from flashlightlens.com
Most of europe has 1-2 week post delivery from the USA
Yaesumofo




sp5it said:


> Hello. I`m looking for technical plans of o-sink for my 3D mag. Of course I can buy one, but I will wait for delivery to Poland 6-8 weeks  Damn long time. I would like to do it by myself. Hour maybe two it will be ready. Can anyone PM me dimensions?
> Mike


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## modamag (Jan 1, 2006)

*hotbeam's hotlips* was a HUGE step forward from the legacy plate that they used in the Space Needle 2.
*yaesumofo's o-sink* was another step forward with the addition of emitter self centering. Now if only Lumileds could center their die.

Here's my own design (aka "PSS2") which is to be used with the latest generation emitter (round HS base instead of double D). The only additional improvement I made is the chamfer from the basin to the lips for the O-Sink-D and a 0.125mm chamfers around all the sharp edges. This improvement came at a GREAT cost due to the additional machining step. Note all the weird dimension, it's because most of it is based on hotlips which was metric.

If you need the 3D CAD drawing to import for CAM let me know. I don't plan to make any of these in the near future. I just designed it for fun one day at the airport.

I believe the hotlips (from Sandwich Shop) and O-sink (from flashlightlens.com) are extremely reasonable priced. If you leave it up to marketing these will be in the $20+/unit to account for the design and overhead. It much easier just to purchase one, at least that's what I've been doing.


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## yaesumofo (Jan 2, 2006)

I did a version with the edges cut and it added a step which I felt could be eliminated by simply tumbling the parts in order to soften the edges. My next batch of O-Sinks will be designed to accodimate the "new" emitters and old. (the "old" version of the O-Sink is easily modified to accept the New emitters with about will be 10 seconds with a dremel. The next batch (At least part of it) will also be made in copper to accodimate those who want to push the K2 emitters to their limits. The copper should help with thermal issues. 
The next batch is just weeks away.
Yaesumofo




modamag said:


> *hotbeam's hotlips* was a HUGE step forward from the legacy plate that they used in the Space Needle 2.
> *yaesumofo's o-sink* was another step forward with the addition of emitter self centering. Now if only Lumileds could center their die.
> 
> Here's my own design (aka "PSS2") which is to be used with the latest generation emitter (round HS base instead of double D). The only additional improvement I made is the chamfer from the basin to the lips for the O-Sink-D and a 0.125mm chamfers around all the sharp edges. This improvement came at a GREAT cost due to the additional machining step. Note all the weird dimension, it's because most of it is based on hotlips which was metric.
> ...


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## IsaacHayes (Jan 2, 2006)

Hmm. New o-sink sounds like just the ticket for my U-bin. I still dont feel comfortable dremeling my exsisting o-sink, I'm afraid I'll gouge the flat area that touches the slug.

EDIT: what kind of "bit" do you recommend to use with the dremel to modify exsisting ones?


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## yaesumofo (Jan 3, 2006)

A little teenie tiny one that whirls around at about 15000 rpm.
That is the one I used and it worked fine. Or just wait and we will have the copper units available through the regular channels some time in the near future. I can't commit to a specific date because My machine shop could get a contract to make 10000 titanium fasteners or something. You never know. But they are on the way.
Yaesumofo




Isaac Hayes said:


> Hmm. New o-sink sounds like just the ticket for my U-bin. I still don't feel comfortable dremeling my existing o-sink, I'm afraid I'll gouge the flat area that touches the slug.
> 
> EDIT: what kind of "bit" do you recommend to use with the dremel to modify existing ones?


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## modamag (Jan 3, 2006)

yaesumofo said:


> I did a version with the edges cut and it added a step which I felt could be eliminated by simply tumbling the parts in order to soften the edges. My next batch of O-Sinks will be designed to accodimate the "new" emitters and old. (the "old" version of the O-Sink is easily modified to accept the New emitters with about will be 10 seconds with a dremel. The next batch (At least part of it) will also be made in copper to accodimate those who want to push the K2 emitters to their limits. The copper should help with thermal issues.
> The next batch is just weeks away.
> Yaesumofo



Great job Yaes, I don't have access to a tumbler so that's why I chambers my parts.

On another production enhancement step, you could eliminate the 30 degrees chamfer lathe step (great cost reduction @ minimal performance loss) by using a couple stair case graduation. This will only add ~5-7sec/unit.






From my personal test, I found that copper might not be the best candidate for long run as a HS, the heat buildup is much higher than the Alumnimum version. It would be much better if we can have a thin copper to aluminum interconnect layer, but then I'm just still dreaming for Zalman or Thermaltake to make our HS.

Can't wait for the next rev O-sink to arrive. I'll be in for some.


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## DUQ (Jan 9, 2006)

Mmmmm copper goodness :twothumbs


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## LEDcandle (Jan 11, 2006)

Anyone making a heatsink out of diamond? 
Heard its thermal conductivity is 2 to 6 times more than copper


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## IsaacHayes (Jan 11, 2006)

modamag: The heat build up is greater with copper? I don't quite understand. Copper will "give up" it's heat just as well as aluminum to the outside air. Perhaps it got saturated and stabalized quicker than aluminum as it conducts heat better?

Also, was it PURE copper? An alloy will always conduct heat worse than the pure metal....
(like 6061 aluminum conducts worse than just pure aluminum.)


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## sp5it (Jan 11, 2006)

Thanks for all replays. It is almost ready 
Mike


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## modamag (Feb 23, 2006)

Issac: I don't know about "pure 100%" copper but the stuff I was looking at is UNS C11000 (99.9% Cu & O & Cd).

These Copper are ~400 W/m-K compared to Aluminum ~180 W/m-K.

The problem is as follows. The convection surface is the Mag body themself. If the heatsink is embedded to the Mag body and makes a perfect contact to the body then yes the copper will do a better job at dissapating the heat from the LED.

But if the contact point is not so perfect. Then there is a higher temperature gradient between the heatsink and the Mag body. So more heat is "retained" at the heatsink.

I'll try to post the thermal model video once I get some time.


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## IsaacHayes (Feb 23, 2006)

A test of the same bin led and power to it (regulated current) with one aluminum and one copper would be interesting. Perhaps a thermal diode on the heatsink itself and one on the outside of the mag.


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## CNC Dan (Feb 24, 2006)

modamag said:


> The problem is as follows. The convection surface is the Mag body themself. If the heatsink is embedded to the Mag body and makes a perfect contact to the body then yes the copper will do a better job at dissapating the heat from the LED.
> 
> But if the contact point is not so perfect. Then there is a higher temperature gradient between the heatsink and the Mag body. So more heat is "retained" at the heatsink.
> 
> I'll try to post the thermal model video once I get some time.



So what you are saying is that copper is too good at conducting heat, and the mag body can't get rid of it fast enough? But aluminium is better because it coducts heat less, so that the mag body isn't overwhelmed?

I think a little knowledge is a dangerous thing.


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## IsaacHayes (Feb 24, 2006)

I would think that the copper would help, even if it gets hotter faster than aluminum mag can disapate heat. There is a greater surface area of the o-sink to the mag, than there is emitter to HS.

I don't believe that by having a Al HS will be cooler than having a Copper one, even if they are both limited by the mag's body to radiate heat. Even if the copper gets "saturated" inside hotter than the AL HS would, as if the AL doesn't get as hot, that means the emitter is hot and not getting the heat drawn out as fast as the copper.

Remember the luxeon slug is copper too, not AL. You want to pull that heat out fast as possible from the emitter, so go with copper. Next problem is HS to mag interface, but even if the mag was plastic, you have a greater surface area with the HS touching the mag, so it's less critical than the emitter-heatsink material..

I hope I made sense..


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## Oracle (May 31, 2006)

Sorry to revive an old thread, but does anyone know where I can get an O-Sink for a mag 3-D now? www.flashlightlens.com no longer stocks one. I contacted them and they said they don't know if they'll get more.

The emitter I'm planning to use is not a luxeon but a 3W RGB prolight: http://www.led-bulbs.com/html/prolight/3WRGB.pdf

Given the talk of self-centering and hot lips, I'm not sure if the O-Sinks you're referring to will work with this emitter anyway.


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## yaesumofo (Jun 5, 2006)

A fresh batch of O-Sinks for the D cell THE WORKS.
Just a bit more time. The idea is to make them compatable with the K2 emitter.
Lumileds has not sent me promised samples. so I wait until I get a few in order to make it all come together. Anybody who wants to send me a few K2's to work with will be rewarded.
PM me if you are feeling generous.
Thanks
Yaesumofo


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## IsaacHayes (Jun 5, 2006)

I can't belive still no one has sent you a k2 so you can get these rolling out to people. We need them not only for k2 but revised for the new round slug luxeons!!!

Come on CPF step up and help your selfs out!!!


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## Kryosphinx (Jun 5, 2006)

If I had any K2s, I'd send you one, but alas, I have none. I don't think many people on CPF have K2s. 
I know Wayne (Elektrolumens) has 100 of 'em. You might try contacting him.

I sure hope they come in soon.


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## Oracle (Jun 11, 2006)

yaesumofo said:


> A fresh batch of O-Sinks for the D cell THE WORKS.



That's very good to hear. 

Do you know if the O-Sink will work the the RGB emitter?


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## DFiorentino (Jun 12, 2006)

yaesumofo said:


> ...we will have the copper units available through the regular channels some time in the near future. ...
> Yaesumofo




Just wondering if these wonderful copper O-Sinks are still a possability?

 
-DF

(...or did I miss them already :thinking: .)


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## yaesumofo (Jun 14, 2006)

Download sent me three emitters!! THANKS DOWNLOAD!!
He was very grnerous!!!
I will be working on the new pedistal design this week!!!
Results soon. 
Cooper is a real posibikity. Price on copper O-Sink will be quite a bit higher than aluminum.
like over 6 times the cost in material. anybody out there willing to pay $30.00 for an o-sink?
I doubt it. Maybe I will tack on 10 units onto an aluminum run.
It is just too dog gone expensive.
Yaesumodo


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## DFiorentino (Jun 14, 2006)

yaesumofo said:


> anybody out there willing to pay $30.00 for an o-sink?
> I doubt it. Maybe I will tack on 10 units onto an aluminum run.



Since I don't have the ability to machine my own, I'd be willing to buy a couple/few.  Overdrive just calls out for copper! :naughty: 

-DF


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