# Which is better? The Petzl or the Princeton Tec headlamps?



## itsonlyme (Dec 26, 2014)

I recently bought a Petzl TIKKA XP headlamp with 160 Lumens on max beam output. Which I think is amazing. 
Also looking and thinking about the Princeton Tec FRED lights as well to purchase. But looking among the below threads, I read so many issues about the PT models. Also, the PT Fred lights have low output around 45 lumens or so. That's very weak compared to 160 lumens from the Petzl.
Although this Petzl series is not really water or weather proof, the heck with it....I like it. 

But, should I also get the PT series lights? By reading the threads below, I am kind of hesitant....Please guide me here. 

Which is better? The Petzl or the Princeton Tec headlamps?

Post #2 / #4 and #5
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...nceton-Tec-Remix-Headlamp-or-Petzl-Tikka-XP-2
Post #3
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?294144-Are-the-Petzl-lights-very-good


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## jinya1004 (Dec 26, 2014)

Ford or Chevy?


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## Szemhazai (Dec 26, 2014)

You are trying to compare two different headlamps.
Petzl Tikka XP '14 is similar to PT Eos or Byte
Pt Fred is 3x5mm white led + 1 red and was similar to old Tikka Plus but Petzl have dropped 5mm technology so Tikkina or Tikka might be your choice.


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## itsonlyme (Dec 27, 2014)

I had been reading that PTs have issues with cracking battery door compartments and stuff like that. Maybe not every model. 
I do like the Petzl TIKKA XP which is 160 lumens. That's bright enough for a headlamp. 

PT Fred has 45 lumens....So I guess I stick with the Petzl.


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## mcnair55 (Dec 27, 2014)

The choice is down to you but serious sports people and professionals all use Petzl for a reason.


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## ForrestChump (Dec 28, 2014)

I am Made in USA biased.

That said, Petzl is hands down more reliable than PT.

Google check me.


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## ForrestChump (Dec 29, 2014)

mcnair55 said:


> The choice is down to you but serious sports people and professionals all use Petzl for a reason.



We are an odd couple. We don't usually agree that frequently, but like clockwork.... Petzl. Petzl. Petzl.......


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## jymbo72 (Dec 29, 2014)

I ended up going with a Princeton Tech for general purpose hunting / night fishing, I use it about 3 times a month and so far its held up pretty well. Batteries seem to go a bit fast for my taste but overall its got a good throw and I liked the green LED flood option. Friend of mine has a Petzl and I'm seriously considering investing in the Petzl after hearing about their warranty turn around. I believe if I had a problem with my PT i'd prolly just go ahead and can it


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## Tjin (Dec 30, 2014)

Both my first gen Petzl Tikka and XP cracked at the battery latch after some years of abuse. 

My Princeton tec APEX first gen is going for the 8-9 year mark I think. The little plastic thingy where the wire goes in to the light broke off a few months ago.

I think the Princeton tec has slighly thicker plastic, but less well designed. I guess the durability is highly depended on the modle and it's designed use. The Petzl PIXA lights are tough as nails, but the tikka's won't last for years when i use it. But same goes with other brands.

Last time I bought a light it was a black diamond.


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## k594 (Dec 30, 2014)

I have a Princeton tec Apex pro for years and it runs great. I own 2 Princeton tec Fred's , it's my most used headlamp at home for the fact that on first click it comes on in red led low, so I don't have to cycle through white and blow my retnas out. it's perfect for those get up and not wake my wife up scenarios , it runs on aaa cells and for what it is its a great little light.


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## Albinoni1967 (Jan 1, 2015)

ForrestChump said:


> I am Made in USA biased.
> 
> That said, Petzl is hands down more reliable than PT.
> 
> Google check me.



But isnt Petzl actually a French company and not USA


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## ForrestChump (Jan 1, 2015)

Albinoni1967 said:


> But isnt Petzl actually a French company and not USA




Correct, I was trying to articulate I would normally lean toward the American maker ( PT ). But as I said in a few other threads Im not brand loyal. I try hard to look ateach product on it's own merit rather than just picking one brand over another. Petzl has been in the headlamp business a long time, Im relatively sure longer than any other major headlamp producer and as far as I've experienced have consistently put out top notch products, ridiculously cheap. As soon as they don't I'll be the first to say so.What I was also saying is they are heavily rooted in the USA and have repair & distribution on site in Salt Lake City, Utah. I would imagine the USA would be there biggest buyer so it would make sense.



They are wicked fast email / repair wise as well.


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## ForrestChump (Jan 1, 2015)

Tjin said:


> Both my first gen Petzl Tikka and XP cracked at the battery latch after some years of abuse.
> 
> *My Princeton tec APEX first gen is going for the 8-9 year mark I think.* The little plastic thingy where the wire goes in to the light broke off a few months ago.
> 
> ...




That ain't to shabby.


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## Albinoni1967 (Jan 1, 2015)

Bit out of topic here sorry but when was in the USA many years ago, met this guy and he was an American and he said to me that he would prefer a beautiful European car over an American one, I said ok fair enough.


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## ForrestChump (Jan 1, 2015)

Albinoni1967 said:


> Bit out of topic here sorry but when was in the USA many years ago, met this guy and he was an American and he said to me that he would prefer a beautiful European car over an American one, I said ok fair enough.






?


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## rpm00 (Jan 2, 2015)

I have a couple Petzls and they're nice. I have the Tikka XP and the Pixa1. The Pixa1 is for use in dangerous hazardous environments so built to withstand chemicals. It's extremely well build but not the brightest. The tikka XP is nicer in terms of features though, but I wouldn't say it's the best built lamp out there. It's extremely light and the plastic feels a little cheap. Although i like it I wouldn't be surprised if it breaks a few years from now.


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## ForrestChump (Jan 2, 2015)

rpm00 said:


> I have a couple Petzls and they're nice. I have the Tikka XP and the Pixa1. The Pixa1 is for use in dangerous hazardous environments so built to withstand chemicals. It's extremely well build but not the brightest. The tikka XP is nicer in terms of features though, but I wouldn't say it's the best built lamp out there. It's extremely light and the plastic feels a little cheap. Although i like it I wouldn't be surprised if it breaks a few years from now.




Yeah the Pixa series is often overlooked as if it's not there. As far as real world usage ( Drops, not running it over with a car ) they definitely appear more robust than there metal bodied 

peers. The "Sport" headlamp materials are lightweight first..... That said the quality of materials seems to rise with the price point.


Drop test @ 3:30

http://www.petzl.com/en/Professional/Compact-rugged-headlamps/PIXA-3?l=INT#.VKbPG2TF-cI


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## yellow (Jan 2, 2015)

I gew up using ANY Petzl (and a few other lights/makers mentionned here) lights, we even built our own ones sometimes
but when I got my 1st Zebralight, EVERY "typical" headlamp makers products got screwed.

the argument that "serious" outdoor ppl use this or that has no value at all, simply because "the typical" of them has less knowledge of lights than a newborn baby.
And the traditional makers have even less clue on *how to build a LED flashlight*, than the users who are still getting that overpriced plastic crap, running on silly energy sources.

--> get Zebralight, Armytrek, Fenix, ...
(...based on the batteries You use in Your other gear)


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## ForrestChump (Jan 2, 2015)

yellow said:


> I gew up using ANY Petzl (and a few other lights/makers mentionned here) lights, we even built our own ones sometimes
> but when I got my 1st Zebralight, EVERY "typical" headlamp makers products got screwed.
> 
> the argument that "serious" outdoor ppl use this or that has no value at all, simply because "the typical" of them has less knowledge of lights than a newborn baby.
> ...




Disagree.

Petzl has a longer track record of reliability for headlamps and has earned that rep over 40 years. 

Let me clarify, If they read up on ZL reliability vs Petzl they would go with Petzl hands down.

There's no comparison. So what if they don't know how to build a light? I don't know how to build a car but I can tell you what models are more reliable.

Google check me.


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## ForrestChump (Jan 2, 2015)

https://www.google.com/search?q=broken+petzl&sitesearch=www.candlepowerforums.com&gws_rd=ssl
https://www.google.com/search?q=dea...ken+zebralight+site:www.candlepowerforums.com


You can start here.

I don't see any other headlamp threads dedicated to QC / Repairs / Quality or reliability.

As I said before, Im not brand loyal. Im design loyal.


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## Tjin (Jan 2, 2015)

yellow said:


> I gew up using ANY Petzl (and a few other lights/makers mentionned here) lights, we even built our own ones sometimes
> but when I got my 1st Zebralight, EVERY "typical" headlamp makers products got screwed.
> 
> the argument that "serious" outdoor ppl use this or that has no value at all, simply because "the typical" of them has less knowledge of lights than a newborn baby.
> ...



Regular users are not flashoholics and have other priorities. Weight, runtime, helmet compatibility and running on the same 'silly energy source' batteries as other gear like GPS and avalanch beacons. Rarely do I need a lot of lumens. Why would anybody _need _150+ lumens?

Petzl, PT, black diamond make lights for regular users and they do it well. Sure Fenix, Armytrek and Zebras look nice and have nice specs. But actually outdoor use? Those alluminium headlights like the zebra are not suitable for users in the serieus outdoors. Aluminium conducts to well in the cold and are not very glove friendly. It's either flood, spot or a add on defuser which outdoor people probably loose quickly. All regular outdoor brands offer lights which combines flood and spot options in one headlight. 

I have never had one of these regular brands fail on me with giving light. Just the plastic battery latch cracks after years of abuse because i use them so much. And i never understood the 'durabilbity' issue with flashoholics. Somehow durability is so importent, but flasoholic's buy a new light every other few weeks. 

There is a market for all kinds of type of headlights. If it aint your type of market, it does not mean it's no good.


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## ForrestChump (Jan 2, 2015)

Tjin said:


> Regular users are not flashoholics and have other priorities. Weight, runtime, helmet compatibility and running on the same 'silly energy source' batteries as other gear like GPS and avalanch beacons. Rarely do I need a lot of lumens. Why would anybody _need _150+ lumens?
> 
> Petzl, PT, black diamond make lights for regular users and they do it well. Sure Fenix, Armytrek and Zebras look nice and have nice specs. But actually outdoor use? Those alluminium headlights like the zebra are not suitable for users in the serieus outdoors. Aluminium conducts to well in the cold and are not very glove friendly. It's either flood, spot or a add on defuser which outdoor people probably loose quickly. All regular outdoor brands offer lights which combines flood and spot options in one headlight.
> 
> ...


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## Aperture (Jan 3, 2015)

Here in the Netherlands the majority of the hiking community uses Petzl or Black Diamond headlamps because those are the only brands sold in the outdoor shops. Most common are the smaller triple AAA models like the Tikka because they are compact and lightweight which is a bonus when hiking with a backpack plus the €20-40 price range tends to be the maximum non-flashoholics are willing to pay for a light.


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## Charles L. (Jan 3, 2015)

Quite a lot of opinions in this thread. As someone who owns a variety of Petzl, Black Diamond, Zebralight and Armytek headlamps, my opinion is... Armytek or Zebralight. Petzl is fine, but you give up one heck of a lot for a supposed improvement in durability. 

Aluminum not conducive to outdoor use??? Whaaat?? You're telling me that all the major flashlight producers have it wrong, and we should revert to plastic? Seriously, try to work the fiddly little buttons on a Petzl with gloves on. You can do it, but it is so much easier on the A or Z lights. And aluminum likes cold a lot more than plastic. It's easy to see the little plastic latches breaking on a Petzl, Black Diamond, or any other -- and it's more likely to do that in the cold.

Using threads on a forum as an accurate statistical indication of reliability is, in a word, wrong. Google the word anecdote.

The "spot" and "flood" options of the plastic lights produce nothing more than an imperfect beam. Not only do the floody beams of the A and Z lights look much better (and come in warm tints to boot), they throw as far as the others simply by virtue of their greater power. They go much lower, much higher, and have more options in between.

Totally agree with the statement that if it ain't your type of market, that doesn't mean it's no good. But that sentiment goes both ways.

Also realize that not everyone has access to all the headlamps mentioned in this thread. I have no experience with Princeton Tek, but my Petzl lamps (I have a Tactikka RGB and a Tikka RXP) work just fine.


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## davidt1 (Jan 3, 2015)

Thanks Charles L for posting. I value and appreciate inputs from actual owners.


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## Tjin (Jan 4, 2015)

Charles L. said:


> Aluminum not conducive to outdoor use??? Whaaat?? You're telling me that all the major flashlight producers have it wrong, and we should revert to plastic?



News for you. Armytec, Fenix, Zebra are niche market brands. The Petzl, BD and Princeton tec are the major brands. 



Charles L. said:


> Seriously, try to work the fiddly little buttons on a Petzl with gloves on. You can do it, but it is so much easier on the A or Z lights. And aluminum likes cold a lot more than plastic. It's easy to see the little plastic latches breaking on a Petzl, Black Diamond, or any other -- and it's more likely to do that in the cold.



Aluminium is a terrible material in the cold. It’s too conductive in really freezing conditions to touch bare handed. Try to replace the batteries in the proper cold. Yes plastic is more fragile, but at least you don't have to pee on your hands to unstuck things from your hands. Most people probably won't go outside when it's that cold, but just an illustration of what I mean. 



Charles L. said:


> The "spot" and "flood" options of the plastic lights produce nothing more than an imperfect beam. Not only do the floody beams of the A and Z lights look much better (and come in warm tints to boot), they throw as far as the others simply by virtue of their greater power. They go much lower, much higher, and have more options in between.



FYI, most people don't care about 'perfect' beams. No artefacts/shadows is the only thing I care about. I actually don't like a round beam. I used to carry a Fenix outdoors, but they just don't work for me. I also don't like to have to many modes. Too many things to mess with while I’m doing other things. I’m a climber (alpine, trad, sport). Trust me, you don’t want to have to many options, when you just want to turn on the light while balancing, on two finger, a big toe and the other feet placed on a flat vertical surface for balance. 
The things i wrote where a response to: 


> the argument that "serious" outdoor ppl use this or that has no value at all, simply because "the typical" of them has less knowledge of lights than a newborn baby.
> And the traditional makers have even less clue on *how to build a LED flashlight, than the users who are still getting that overpriced plastic crap, running on silly energy sources.*


 I understand why people like certain aluminium lights. I have been carrying lights for a decade on my belt. Mainly Fenix lights. Just trying to balancing out, above mentioned quote.


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## Charles L. (Jan 4, 2015)

Tjin said:


> News for you. Armytec, Fenix, Zebra are niche market brands. The Petzl, BD and Princeton tec are the major brands.



In the headlamp realm, yes. But in the larger flashlight market, metal has ruled for decades.




Tjin said:


> is a terrible material in the cold. It’s too conductive in really freezing conditions to touch bare handed. Try to replace the batteries in the proper cold. Yes plastic is more fragile, but at least you don't have to pee on your hands to unstuck things from your hands. Most people probably won't go outside when it's that cold, but just an illustration of what I mean.



Most people have gloves on when it is this cold. Do you not when climbing?




Tjin said:


> most people don't care about 'perfect' beams. No artefacts/shadows is the only thing I care about. I actually don't like a round beam. I used to carry a Fenix outdoors, but they just don't work for me. I also don't like to have to many modes. Too many things to mess with while I’m doing other things. I’m a climber (alpine, trad, sport). Trust me, you don’t want to have to many options, when you just want to turn on the light while balancing, on two finger, a big toe and the other feet placed on a flat vertical surface for balance.



Cool. But climbing is a niche. I suspect most people would like a nicer beam. And greater output options.



Tjin said:


> i wrote where a response to:
> I understand why people like certain aluminium lights. I have been carrying lights for a decade on my belt. Mainly Fenix lights. Just trying to balancing out, above mentioned quote.



OK. Balance is good. Especially if you're a climber


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## Aperture (Jan 4, 2015)

Charles L. said:


> I suspect most people would like a nicer beam. And greater output options.


I think the majority of the headlamp usage is in the outdoor community where everybody owns at least one but 99% of the owners doesn't know anything about beam patterns, color, Kelvin, Hi CRI, etc but they do care how their headlamp performs in rough weather, ease of operation, is small and compact, that it can take a drop or two and the occasional dunk in the water, uses easy to source batteries which are also used in the GPS (egg AA or AAA), can be operated with gloves on, etc.

As for output, 100 lumen is more than sufficient for navigating through the woods and to do camp chores (pitching tents, cooking, eating, reading a book), more power is only needed when the speed of travel increases like running or biking to see further ahead.

Like specialised photography forums CPF does NOT represent the majority of the userbase, only those interested in the latest, greatest and coolest gear around.


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## Tjin (Jan 4, 2015)

Charles L. said:


> Most people have gloves on when it is this cold. Do you not when climbing?



Climbers don't plan to change batteries during climbs. We do that in base camp (which can be pretty cold in an alpine situation) and with bare hands or thin gloves, you get way better grip for doing things like battery changes. Not always a good idea, lots of people get cold injuries from touching liquid fuel canisters or spilling liquid fuels and not wearing gloves. 

A good rule to thumb is to always take fresh batteries before a trip and the spare batteries are in the spare light. A light is considerd a critical item and having a super heavy duty reliable one does not help, when you just dropped it from a cliff. 

btw, nothing beats the grip of bare hands. So if its not too cold; glove on during belay, glove off during climbing. 
If it's really cold; Mittens. hmm... mittens with handwarmers.


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## whothedonk (Jan 5, 2015)

Hi,

Just a quick feedback as I have the Petzl Tikka xp.

It never let me down after regular use during 2 years and dropping it 2 times in the water.
Petzl is a quality brand and even if the Tikka is not the high range, the quality is there.

Personal comments:
I really liked the beam, not too wide, not too polarized, quite good throw for the "few" lumens.
Normal AAA batteries lasted significantly longer than rechargeable AAA (Enerloop Pro 2nd generation) for me.


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## bearbreeder (Jan 6, 2015)

I use the tikka rxp and fenix hl55 jus fine for night climbing

either one will work, aluminum body or not

The tikka however is easier to do battery changes as ita faster and you dont risk dropping the cap ... The hl55 however lasts longer ... With petzls you also dont risk getting moisture in the innards with a bat change

the hl55 will work just fine in whatever temperature, the aluminum body gets warmed up by the light at higher settings regardless ... Not to mention that with cr123a bats it works better at lower temps in theory than li-on bats of 18650 or some petzls

as to cold temps if you can do stuff like open locking carabiners, boiling a cup of joe on your jetboil, etc ... You can change your bats

And if you climb all night (8 hours+) youll likely change yr bats at some point

for more normal hiking, etc ... Aluminum lamps work fine with the same cavaets

Petzl is well known for reliability ...

This november on a squamish multi ... We used both petzl and fenix

http://i.imgur.com/84AGL3Jl.jpg


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## Monocrom (Jan 6, 2015)

Bit surprised at some of the negative comments regarding PT. My EOS has been trouble free for years now.


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## Charles L. (Jan 6, 2015)

bearbreeder, that is a great photo. I will bow out of any discussion about headlamps for such a task, because I never intend to find myself in that position... at least not intentionally


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## magicstone12 (Jan 7, 2015)

I think each one has its own advantage,running or climbing,you need different headlamp.


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## Illum (Jan 7, 2015)

Your question is like asking Tropicana or Dole? Well what kind of juice do you drink? PT headlamps seems to be good for all around work, but often overkill for low light level work even at the lowest setting. Petzl works great for very low light applications, and generally seem more lightweight and longer running than PT.


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## Taz steer (Jan 26, 2015)

Agreed. The Petzl is an item that can be relied on over and over. Thanks


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## rotncore (Jan 26, 2015)

Not a hard user of my outdoor brand headlamps, but I've owned several Petzl, and a few Princeton Tec ones, and the Petzls haven't failed, while I had a PT fail. Good warranty service, but it was concerning that one day out of my light storage the PT Remix just didn't turn on (stored empty of batteries). I didn't have proof of purchase, and told them it was at least a few years old, and they mailed me a new one, all I needed to do was email a photo of the dead one.

Their customer service is great, but my faith in their reliability is higher with Petzl.


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## smooth2o (Jan 26, 2015)

Have you looked at the Nitecore headlamps. 600-1000 lumens.


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## Taz steer (Jan 26, 2015)

There are so many lights out there. And the level of power on each of these heads vary. I think if your relying on these lights to save your life or maneuver in the dark then you need a light that always comes on even after hanging on a closet door over and over. As stated that is the Petzl. And just to add if you want a tank of a flashlight the older sure fires never stop. I have had a light in my car for 12 years an E1E. Without fail it always turns on. Thanks and take care.


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## Tjin (Jan 27, 2015)

smooth2o said:


> Have you looked at the Nitecore headlamps. 600-1000 lumens.



Don't know why you would want that many lumens on your head.

Just look down for a second and you just blinded yourself from the reflective light, blind your self by just breathing in the cold, blind your self inside a tent/building/room, get smacked in the face when you look at somebody. 

Never used a nitecore, might be super durable, but thats not a issue if somebody just tossed it of a cliff, because your blinding everybody and ruinings everybodies night vision.


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## carrot (Jan 27, 2015)

Petzl is by far the superior manufacturer of headlamps excepting perhaps specialist lamps like cavers' and such.

Do you know why?

It's not output. It's not durability. It's not runtime. It's not price.

It's ergonomics.

The Petzl Reactive Lighting headlamps are so good it feels like having SPACE AGE technology on your head.

That's right. After you spend a week with a Petzl Reactive Lighting product you will be over the moon for this headlamp. It's out of this world.

You can look at things far away. You can look at things close up. You can light the trail, read a map, look at your hands, jam your fingers in a crack in the rock, throw your ropes down and see if they're touching the ground. It doesn't matter what you look at, it will ALWAYS be bright enough and it will NEVER blind you. It's a revelation. It amazes me that any other headlamp manufacturer hasn't tried to copy this product. They are all dead in the water. They're doomed to the bargain bin.

After you get used to your headlamp doing the work for you, there's no turning back. Any other headlamp is just a dumb light on your head. A dumblamp. Checking a map is blinding, it kills your night vision. Looking up the rock face, your hands grasping a tiny ledge, trying to figure out the routefinding for this last damn pitch so you can get up and then rap down and go home to your family, you squint- the dumblamp is just not bright enough, you'd blinded yourself moments earlier looking down to find the right SLCD to slam into the rock. You let go of your axe with one hand, balancing it over your shoulder while you dangle desperately to adjust your headlamp's settings. What was it again? A double-click? Triple-click hold tap-tap long-press click? You're cold. You're numb. And you don't remember how to access that emergency bright mode.

Contrast to the Petzl NAO and the Petzl Tikka RXP. This is the future. You set it at home on your computer to define the kind of outputs and runtimes you expect and desire. From there, the little chip inside the light figures out the rest. Don't care to fiddle? Petzl ships them with sane defaults out of the box. I used my Tikka RXP with no computer interaction straight out of the package, eight days in the backcountry of Montana. Between these two, I must have had a hundred hours of use. They're good.

After you turn it on, you don't need to touch the headlamp at all. It knows. It sees when you're looking far away. It sees when you're reading a map or a book or working on the car. The Eye sees everything. It knows when it's not bright enough. It knows when its too bright. You're never blinded. You never squint. With one throw LED and one flood LED the Petzl captures the entire gamut, every range you could use your headlamp for.

Most of the time, you don't need to touch the thing. Really. Keep your hands off it, it has better judgement than you. Better than 95% of the time. For that other 5%, for the times when you're trying to look deep inside something shiny and bright, or trying to impress your mates, or really, that's it, you can just press the override button on the side. I can't describe exactly how it's set up, I use it so rarely. You press that override button and it lets you cycle through a few maximum outputs. It works. 

Forget the 1000 lumen headlamps. Forget the 30-day runtimes. Forget the shiny, perfectly CNC-milled object, that hard-anodized little tube. Forget gimmicky glow-in-the-dark reflectors and feature lists the length of a short story. These are the features of manufacturers clawing their way, desperately, to relevancy, hoping you won't notice what they lack in ergonomics. 

It's all about the ergonomics, the user interface, the Reactive Lighting. It's just one feature, but the greatest feature ever invented for a headlamp.


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## bearbreeder (Jan 27, 2015)

The reactive lighting while useful is not the end all

The interface on the RXP is complex and the buttons are small

The reactive lighting on the RXP can also be fooled by snow, fog, and your own breath sometimes

And the transition between spot and flood can be insufficient for tehnical night climbing where your head is very close to the wall ... So we keep it mostly on constant flood for that

When i lend out headlamps for technical night climbing my partners get the fenix hl55, simply because the UI is dead simple ... 

I own and use the RXP extensively for climbing, as well as the fenix 




Sent from my iPhone using Candlepowerforums


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## rpm00 (Jan 27, 2015)

Carrot, tell us what you really think. 

Seriously I think I'm going to have to check out this rxp



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## faucon (Jan 31, 2015)

I have a Petzl Tikka and Tikka Plus---never owned a PT. The Petzls are lightweight, of course, and still work fine. But they're a number of years old now, and I found myself getting frustrated with them because of their dimness and annoying battery change procedures. I'm sure the newer Petzl models are much brighter, but the ones I own are pretty feeble even on 'high' and never put out enough lumens when I was outdoors or trying to do some household repair job. I was blown away when I got my first more modern headlamps: Fenix HP01 and HL50, a Zebralight H52w, and a Nitecore HC90. I keep one in the car and the others in various easily accessible places where I can grab one and go. Heavier for sure (especially the Nitecore), but also rugged, much brighter with a range of levels, and with superior water resistance. But I'm sure the new Petzls and PTs are a big improvement over my old models.


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