# The different varieties of LSD cell



## Mr Happy (Jan 10, 2009)

From my observations so far, there seem to be four different "kinds" of low-self-discharge cell on the market, at least in the AA size.

Further sightings, especially with detailed photographs and measurements are invited, to catalog what is out there. What brands fit into the different categories? Are there any more kinds to add?

I identify the four kinds as follows:

Type I: Eneloop

Identifiable by a white top, a squarish button when viewed end-on with four "vent holes" around the edge, and a particular ridge diameter at the negative end.

As well as genuine Eneloops, other sources have been identified as white top Duracell Pre-Charged "Made in Japan" ("Duraloops"), and Sony CycleEnergy blue cells (at least some of the time). Also perhaps the UniRoss Hybrio in the red and green packaging as found in the US market ("Hybriloops").

Capacity given as nominal 2000 mAh, min 1900 mAh, charge retention 85% after 1 year.
*
A "Hybriloop"*







Type II: Rayovac Hybrid

Typically with a black top, a circular button with a squarish profile, three vents almost hidden at the base of the metal button, and a bare metal negative end having a smooth ridge (the shrink wrap does not usually wrap over the end but stops short at the side).

Many "generic" LSD cells probably come from the same source. The Titanium Power Enduro appears to be one such example.

Capacity given as 2100 mAh, charge retention 75% after 1 year.





(Picture by Black Rose)


Type III: Kodak Pre-Charged

Identifiable mainly by a much larger diameter than other cells. There are some AA devices these cells won't fit due to their large size. They generally have a black top with four vent holes next to the button, a slightly rounded profile to the button, a slightly perceptible ridge round the top, and a slightly different ridge diameter at the negative end.

May be the same cell as the GP Recyko. May also be the same as the AccuPower AccuLoop? (to be confirmed)

Capacity given as nominal 2100 mAh, min 2000 mAh.











Type IV: UltraLast Hybrio

A particular cell sometimes found bundled with UltraLast chargers in the US. Distinguishing features: a very small and rounded button on top, a white cap, and a very pronounced ridge around the top edge. 






A Maha Immedion pictured by Anders looks very similar to this and may perhaps be the same type.


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## Mr Happy (Jan 10, 2009)

I added some pictures. Anyone have a good picture of a Rayovac Hybrid?


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## Black Rose (Jan 10, 2009)

Mr Happy said:


> Type II: Rayovac Hybrid
> 
> Typically with a black top and a different identifiable design of the negative end.


The negative end design seems to be common to cells produced by one particular factory. I have 4 different generations of Rayovac NiMh cells and 3 of the generations have the common negative end.



> Many "generic" LSD cells probably come from the same source.


Seems to be the case, however the generic LSD cells do not seem to share the same performance characteristics as the Hybrids.



> Anyone have a good picture of a Rayovac Hybrid?


Give me a couple of minutes and I'll see what I can do...


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## Mr Happy (Jan 10, 2009)

I'll try to flesh out the first post with other parameters like size and electrical characteristics in due course. Capacity measurements can be a bit tricky as you can get different results from C9000, CBA II, BC900, etc. There is also variation between samples.

On looking at the negative end of a few different cells, they are very similar. I could only tell them apart by comparing side by side under magnification, or by measuring the ridge diameter with calipers. It is probably more helpful to look at the positive end when making cell identifications.


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## spencer (Jan 10, 2009)

What category would the Titanium LSD's fall under?


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## Black Rose (Jan 10, 2009)

spencer said:


> What category would the Titanium LSD's fall under?


Rayovac.


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## Mr Happy (Jan 10, 2009)

Rayovac picture added, courtesy of Black Rose.


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## shadowjk (Jan 11, 2009)

GP recyko:
Black top, vent holes.

Varta ready2use:
Black top, vent holes. The positive button is taller.

On the negative end, the shrinkwrap wraps around on the recyko but not on the Varta. 

The features on the negative end are much flatter on the recyko.


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## Mr Happy (Jan 11, 2009)

shadowjk said:


> GP recyko:
> Black top, vent holes.
> 
> Varta ready2use:
> ...


Thanks for the update. 

Since Varta is part of Spectrum Brands and a sister company to Rayovac, it is likely that the Varta Ready2use is similar to the Rayovac Hybrid. The shrink wrap design at the negative end (doesn't wrap around) is consistent with this. I wonder if the Rayovac also has vent holes? It is hard to tell from Black Rose's photo.


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## Anders (Jan 11, 2009)

Mr Happy said:


> I have not seen another cell looking like this. Has anyone else?



Hello Mr Happy.

Imedion:















Anders


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## Black Rose (Jan 11, 2009)

Mr Happy said:


> I wonder if the Rayovac also has vent holes? It is hard to tell from Black Rose's photo.


The Hybrid has 3 vent holes, not 4 as originally reported.

They are hard to see even with the cell in your hand. 

The black material around the positive tip sits pretty high. I had to press down on the black material to expose the vent holes.

EDIT: I tried to get a photo of the positive end of the battery showing the vent holes, but the macro setting on my camera won't focus in that close.


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## Mr Happy (Jan 11, 2009)

Thanks, Anders and Black Rose. I have updated the first post with your information.


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## StandardBattery (Jan 11, 2009)

===================
Duracell Black-Top LSD
------------------------
Made in: China
Model#: AA/HR6/DX1500 NiMH
Rated: 2100mAh
Std. Charge Spec: 200mAh for 16 hrs.
Diameter: 14.18mm (Top) / 14.15mm (Bottom)
Length: 49mm (not including nib) / 50.25mm (including nib)
Positive Nib: 5.44mm (Diameter)
Cosmetics: Black top, *3* vent holes on side of nib, outer wrap does not wrap around negative post, protrusion on negative terminal ~9.75mm in diameter

=====================
Imedion cells are spec'd to maintain 85% of their charge for 1 year.


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## shadowjk (Jan 11, 2009)

Panasonic infinium:

Black top, button same size and shape as Varta Ready2Use.
Vent holes hard to see. Hole in the black top, and hole in the button at its base. Similar to Ready2use.

Shrinkwrap wraps around at the bottom, unlike ready2use. The negative end is shaped much softer than Recyko or ready2use.

There's a ridge at the positive end, like Hybrio. Recyko and ready2use appear completely cylindrical.

Capacity quoted as "Up to 2100mAh", charge retention as "Up to 80%" after 365 days.
"Matsushita Electric Industrial Co., Ltd. Made in China"

There's a plain-english datestamp on the Cells, mine are "0711". I bought two cells for use in my wireless mouse when the old non-LSD ones became too crap. Capacity out of the retail packaging as measured by BC-900 was 1628 and 1560 mAh. I followed up with a Test cycle, and got 2140mAh and 2040mAh.


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## Black Rose (Jan 12, 2009)

shadowjk said:


> Panasonic infinium:


These may be the same as the Panasonic R2 batteries available in North America.

They most likely fall under the Rayovac cell type, as Panasonic developed their version of LSD with the company that manufactures the Hybrids and probably the Varta cells (Rayovac and Varta are under the same corporate umbrella).


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## was.lost.but.now.found (Jan 12, 2009)

Where do Tenergy 2300 mAh LSD fall?


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## Face (Jan 13, 2009)

I just bought 2 x 4AA of the Uniross Hybrio based on the fact that they look identical to Eneloops but the packaging says Made in China and they have 2100mah capacity.

First 4 now on a 500mah discharge in the C9000.

I wonder if they really are Eneloops?!


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## Black Rose (Jan 13, 2009)

Since they are Made In China, they are not Eneloops.
Eneloops and their relabeled versions are Made In Japan.

Are they white or black around the positive tip?


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## Mr Happy (Jan 13, 2009)

Face said:


> I just bought 2 x 4AA of the Uniross Hybrio based on the fact that they look identical to Eneloops but the packaging says Made in China and they have 2100mah capacity.
> 
> I wonder if they really are Eneloops?!





Black Rose said:


> Since they are Made In China, they are not Eneloops.
> Eneloops and their relabeled versions are Made In Japan.



Although the "Made in China" and "2100 mAh" details seem to contradict the Eneloop hypothesis, the preponderance of other evidence suggests otherwise. See this thread for full details.

From my experience of using them, I have no problem considering them Eneloops in everything but name.


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## Black Rose (Jan 13, 2009)

Mr Happy said:


> Although the "Made in China" and "2100 mAh" details seem to contradict the Eneloop hypothesis, the preponderance of other evidence suggests otherwise. See this thread for full details.


I forgot about that thread. Interesting and perplexing stuff.


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## Mr Happy (Jan 13, 2009)

Black Rose said:


> I forgot about that thread. Interesting and perplexing stuff.


From what has been posted in this thread already, there are all sorts of subtle variations between brands of LSD NiMH that muddy the picture of what the origin of any given cell actually is. Perplexing indeed.

When I get a moment I am going to measure the dimensions of the various cells I have, like StandardBattery did above, and then update the first post with those details.


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## Black Rose (Jan 13, 2009)

Rayovac Hybrid
Made in: China
Model#: LD715
Rated: 2100mAh
Diameter: 14.17mm (Top) / 14.12mm (Bottom)
Length: 50.21mm (including nib)
Positive Nib: 5.42mm (Diameter)

Titanium Enduro LSD
Made in: China
Model#: TPEH-TAA2100-ENDURO (Battery Junction)
Rated: 2100mAh
Diameter: 14.13mm (Top) / 14.10mm (Bottom)
Length: 50.24mm (including nib)
Positive Nib: 5.42mm (Diameter)


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## Bones (Jan 13, 2009)

Mr Happy said:


> Although the "Made in China" and "2100 mAh" details seem to contradict the Eneloop hypothesis, the preponderance of other evidence suggests otherwise. See this thread for full details.
> 
> From my experience of using them, I have no problem considering them Eneloops in everything but name.



Having regard to Mr Happy's findings, we speculated in a prior thread that 'Made in China' might very well refer to the wrapper rather than the cell. 

It has since occurred to me that the cells could even have been delivered in bulk to China, and then labelled and exported from there to further legitimize their supposed origin and gain a monetary advantage compared to exporting directly from Japan.

Regardless, if a manufacturer in China was capable of duplicating the Eneloop, prior experience dictates that it would surely have evidenced itself in the performance of a cell other than the Eneloop by now.


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## UnknownVT (Jan 14, 2009)

here's a good comparison pic of the eneloop, RoV Hybrid and Kodak Pre-Charged that's been around for a while - from NLee the Engineer on Amazon







and I just found another by him that may help us with a hint on the Duracell Pre-Charged made in China black tops -






see those 4 vent holes in the black top surround? they look similar to Kodak Pre-Charged and GP ReCyko -






The Wikipedia entry on Low self-discharge NiMH battery currently says:

" _actually manufactured by five companies: __Sanyo__, __Gold Peak__, __Yuasa__, __Vapex__ and __Uniross__.[2]__[6]_ "

So maybe there are 5 types?


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## KowShak (Jan 14, 2009)

UnknownVT said:


> The Wikipedia entry on Low self-discharge NiMH battery currently says:
> 
> " _actually manufactured by five companies: __Sanyo__, __Gold Peak__, __Yuasa__, __Vapex__ and __Uniross__.[2]__[6]_ "
> 
> So maybe there are 5 types?



Wikipedia is not famed for it's accuracy. 

Given the information on this forum and the fact that Uniross is a relatively small player I'd doubt that they're selling enough batteries to justify their own production plant.


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## UnknownVT (Jan 14, 2009)

KowShak said:


> Wikipedia is not famed for it's accuracy.


 
Can't argue with that - 
except Wikipedia is open to input from almost anyone, like this forum, only much, much wider - so yes, there are bound to be some mistakes/misinformation - but just like this forum, those are usually picked up and corrected pretty quickly. 
*EDIT to ADD -*
*----------------*
I did a bit of looking on the Wikipedia entry edit history page and found that the edit for Uniross was added -
(cur) (prev) 14:14, 14 June 2008 220.253.147.187 (Talk) (6,880 bytes) _(→Brand names)_ 
so it's been there since June/14/2008. 
-----------------

Uniross Corporate homepage - claims to manufacture rechargeable batteries, but that may not mean they have their own manufacturing plant.

" _Uniross has been the rechargeable specialist since 1968. We design, manufacture and distribute dedicated rechargeable batteries and battery chargers for digital cameras, digital video, mp3 players, electronic toys and a host of other devices. Today, Uniross is one of the world leaders and currently holds the n°1 position in Europe, India and South Africa and n°2 in China and the overall Far Eastern market. With a worldwide presence in more than 70 countries, Uniross is the rechargeable power specialists._ "

on the Uniross Corporate Editorial page 

" _For the last 35 years, Uniross has been working in a sector that has important consequences for the future of our planet. We design and distribute rechargeable batteries and chargers, which are a viable economic and ecological alternative to the throw away batteries. We are entirely committed to the protection of the environment and have set up associations to collect and re-cycle used batteries. We are also cofounders of RECHARGE, the European association for the promotion and management of rechargeable batteries throughout their lifespan._ "

So perhaps they are a little more than just a marketing re-badger of rechargeable batteries?

Also the pdf Download of a UK Daily Telegraph article (from Oct/2005) says Uniross was the leading market leader for rechargeable batteries on the UK over Duracell and Energizer.


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## Mr Happy (Jan 14, 2009)

Uniross is a little complicated. Originally a European company, it may well be that they manufacture and sell their own branded products in Europe. In the US, Uniross acquired NABC (UltraLast brand), and Uniross/Ultralast in North America appear to sell different products from different sources compared to Europe. For instance several people have observed that the Hybrio sold in the UK market is different from the Hybrio sold in the US market. Only the US Hybrio appears to be similar to Eneloop.

There have been reports here on CPF that in Australia the story is different again, and that there be other products sold under the Uniross brand in the Australian market.


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## UnknownVT (Jan 14, 2009)

Mr Happy said:


> In the US, Uniross acquired NABC (UltraLast brand), and Uniross/Ultralast in North America appear to sell different products from different sources compared to Europe. For instance several people have observed that the Hybrio sold in the UK market is different from the Hybrio sold in the US market. Only the US Hybrio appears to be similar to Eneloop.


 
Thank you for that input -
Wikipedia entry on Uniross says:
" _*Uniross* is a Paris based international company, that started in 1968 in the __United Kingdom__. It makes and sells __rechargeable batteries__ and __battery rechargers__ under the names Encore, UltraLast and Uniross._
_In 2006, Uniross purchased NABC, North American Battery Company, which has offices in San Diego, CA and a factory in Tijuana, Mexico._ "

However the reports of Uniross Hybrios doing well in the very battery fussy Pentax K100D over on PentaxForums.com (link to search "Hybrio") appear to be from the UK (and USA) (there was one negative report from the UK too).

Since _anecdotally_ I have found that only eneloops seem to claim and actually maintain higher operating voltage under-load (over any other LSD or NiMH) (eneloop.info Voltage page) could those UK Uniross Hybrios possibly be eneloop "clones" too?


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## KowShak (Jan 14, 2009)

UnknownVT said:


> Also the pdf Download of a UK Daily Telegraph article (from Oct/2005) says Uniross was the leading market leader for rechargeable batteries on the UK over Duracell and Energizer.



I've been looking for rechargeable AAs recently, the only ones I can find in quantity are energizer. Many places stock energizer and they're expensive (£15 for 4 of their highest capacity AAs), the few places I've been able to find Hybrios have been selling the last of their stock off cheaply (£2 for 4AAs or £5 for 4AA with a dumb charger). Cheap Hybrios good for me in the short term, but in the long term if people are stopping selling them, where am I going to get decent batteries in the future?



UnknownVT said:


> Since _anecdotally_ I have found that only eneloops seem to claim and actually maintain higher operating voltage under-load (over any other LSD or NiMH) (eneloop.info Voltage page) could those UK Uniross Hybrios possibly be eneloop "clones" too?



The Hybrios I've bought in ther UK look just like Eneloops, if they had the same wrappers on I'd not be able to tell them apart.


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## UnknownVT (Jan 14, 2009)

KowShak said:


> Cheap Hybrios good for me in the short term, but in the long term if people are stopping selling them, where am I going to get decent batteries in the future?


 
Unfortunately that's the way of the world.

Hopefully LSD batteries are here to stay, and in the mainstream - 
so LSD will now be reasonably readily available - as for Uniross they seem pretty well established globally.



KowShak said:


> The Hybrios I've bought in ther UK look just like Eneloops, if they had the same wrappers on I'd not be able to tell them apart.


 
Cool! thanks for that input - 
so UK Uniross Hybrios do look like eneloops :thumbsup:.

Did you test them to see if they were electrically similar to eneloops as well, please?

Thanks


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## UnknownVT (Jan 14, 2009)

UnknownVT said:


> and I just found another by him that may help us with a hint on the Duracell Pre-Charged made in China black tops -
> ...
> see those 4 vent holes in the black top surround? they look similar to Kodak Pre-Charged and GP ReCyko


 
I posted a comment about this over at Amazon and got a reply -
" _NLee the Engineer says: _
_The made-in-China "Duracell Pre Charged" AA cell is definitely NOT the same as Kodak Pre-Charged AA cell. You can tell that from the bottom scan of those cells (I just upload a new customer image). Those so-called 'vent holes' you see in the top scan are just cut-outs from the black spacer. Furthermore, the Kodak AA cell is a bit fatter than Rayovac and Duracell AA cell._ "

and that new photo by NLee the Engineer:


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## crofty (Jan 15, 2009)

KowShak said:


> The Hybrios I've bought in ther UK look just like Eneloops, if they had the same wrappers on I'd not be able to tell them apart./QUOTE]
> 
> 
> UnknownVT said:
> ...


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## KowShak (Jan 15, 2009)

crofty said:


> Out of the 12 hybrio`s I`ve bought in the UK, 8 of them look like eneloops.
> 
> I`ll try to get a picture of the odd one`s out when I get my camera back next week.



Hybrios seem to come in (at least) three different styles of packaging, green, red and orange. Which style of Hybrios did you buy, and which are Eneloops and which aren't?


The ones I bought came in "green" packaging, they are marked prominently as "Hybrio". 





Then there are the "red" variety, which on paper have similar specifications.






And finally the "orange" variety which have a lower capacity (1600mah uf memory serves).


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## was.lost.but.now.found (Jan 15, 2009)

I've seen here at CPF that it has been confirmed the Duracell Pre-charged are re-badged eneloops, however I believe I read a recent review somewhere on the web where someone mentioned that while this was the case, the newer versions found in stores have a different appearance (not that of eneloops) and say made in China. Does any have current info on this?


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## Bones (Jan 15, 2009)

was.lost.but.now.found said:


> I've seen here at CPF that it has been confirmed the Duracell Pre-charged are re-badged eneloops, however I believe I read a recent review somewhere on the web where someone mentioned that while this was the case, the newer versions found in stores have a different appearance (not that of eneloops) and say made in China. Does any have current info on this?



You can find additional details here was.lost.but.now.found:

http://www.candlepowerforums.com ... post2373443
-


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## was.lost.but.now.found (Jan 15, 2009)

Bones said:


> You can find additional details here was.lost.but.now.found:
> 
> http://www.candlepowerforums.com ... post2373443
> -


 
Thank you Bones!!


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## Bones (Jan 15, 2009)

Images by Wildchild of the RayOvac Hybrid, the Eneloop and the Duraloop:


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## Mr Happy (Jan 15, 2009)

KowShak said:


> Hybrios seem to come in (at least) three different styles of packaging, green, red and orange. Which style of Hybrios did you buy, and which are Eneloops and which aren't?


Only the ones that say "Hybrio" on the package are Hybrios. The ones that do not say "Hybrio" on the package (like the second two shown) are not Hybrios, they are just plain rechargeable NiMH batteries.


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## UnknownVT (Jan 15, 2009)

Mr Happy said:


> Only the ones that say "Hybrio" on the package are Hybrios. The ones that do not say "Hybrio" on the package (like the second two shown) are not Hybrios, they are just plain rechargeable NiMH batteries.


 
Not too sure about that - I did an image google on "Hybrio" and both those packaging came up - going to the source, the vendors do list them as Hybrios - of course there is the possibility that those were mistakes - but both the packaging do have this logo - 





*EDIT to ADD* -
Doing minimally more looking I found a vendor's listings of both the latter packaging variations -

orange variety are listed as 4 x AA Hybrio Batteries (standard life)
_Specifications:
Manufacturer: Uniross _
_Packaging: recycled _
_% of capacity left after 6 months: 80% _
_% of capacity left after 12 months: 70% _
_No of recharges: 1000 _
_Technology: NiMH HYBRIO _
_Capacity: 1600mAh _
_Voltage: 1.2V _
_Size: AA_

"red" variety = 4 x AA Hybrio Batteries (long-life)
_Specifications:
Manufacturer: Uniross _
_Packaging: recycled _
_% of capacity left after 6 months: 80% _
_% of capacity left after 12 months: 70% _
_No of recharges: 1000 _
_Technology: NiMH HYBRIO _
_Capacity: 2100mAh _
_Voltage: 1.2V _
_Size: AA_

Perhaps our UK members can please help confirm or refute these variations?


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## Mr Happy (Jan 15, 2009)

Mr Happy said:


> Only the ones that say "Hybrio" on the package are Hybrios. The ones that do not say "Hybrio" on the package (like the second two shown) are not Hybrios, they are just plain rechargeable NiMH batteries.





UnknownVT said:


> Not too sure about that - I did an image google on "Hybrio" and both those packaging came up - going to the source, the vendors do list them as Hybrios - of course there is the possibility that those were mistakes - but both the packaging do have this logo -



Oops, I was mistaken, sorry. 

I didn't notice the little Hybrio logos in the green circle. 

However, I note with interest that the latter two that "use Hybrio technology" match in capacity with the varieties of Varta Ready2use AA cells, also 2100 mAh and 1600 mAh: http://www.en.varta-consumer.com/1522_1192697702.html 

Coupled with the "using similar technology" words, it suggests that these cells might be the same thing in different packaging.

Only the ones in the green packaging with the prominent word "HYBRIO" on the side are the ones that I recognize as being like Eneloops.


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## UnknownVT (Jan 15, 2009)

"go to the source..."

I went to the Uniross homepage and clicked on the Europe link and then did their product search under rechargeable batteries -
(clicking on the AA size, then the "-" (dash) on capacity between 2700 and 2300 - we get the packagings listed for 2xAA and 4xAA)
(note: I disabled the link for rechargeable batteries - as that is very dependent on which area/zone is chosen - for these searches one _MUST_ start from the Europe site, 
additional note: to choose another area/zone one has to got back to the Uniross opening homepage at http://www.uniross.com/consumer_html/index.php )

Found these -
"orange" packaging
http://www.uniross.com/consumer_html/display_product.php?type=3&ref=U0149761
_*Name: *4 AA Multi-Usage_
_*Reference: *U0149761_
_*Capacity: *-_
_*Size: *AA / R6_
_*Technology: *Ni-MH_
_*Output voltage: *1,2 V_
_*Ideal for: *Ideal for your remote controls, radios, clocks, toys, PC mouse... Come charged and stay charged for a long time thanks to the HYBRIO technology - Replace up to 1000 disposable batteries_
_*Batteries per blister: *4_

"red" packaging
http://www.uniross.com/consumer_html/display_product.php?type=3&ref=U0150170
_*Name: *4 AA Multi Usage +_
_*Reference: *U0150170_
_*Capacity: *-_
_*Size: *AA / R6_
_*Technology: *Ni-MH_
_*Output voltage: *1,2 V_
_*Ideal for: *Ideal in your camera, radio, CD player, torch, MP3 player, Mini Disc... Come charged and stay charged for a long time thanks to the HYBRIO technology - Replace up to 1000 disposable batteries_
_*Batteries per blister: *4_

Notice they did not explicitly call them "Hybrio" - 
but the specifications do say quite clearly they use "Hybrio Technology"

FWIW - on my cursory search I could not find the original "green" Hybrio packaging on the Uniross Europe site,
and "Hybrio" in their search box returned 0 results!


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## Mr Happy (Jan 15, 2009)

UnknownVT said:


> FWIW - on my cursory search I could not find the original "green" Hybrio packaging on the Uniross Europe site,
> and "Hybrio" in their search box returned 0 results!


I would guess the green packaging was original stock which is being cleared out, and the other packaging is new lines that replace the old. Putting my cynical hat on, I would say the original Eneloop technology batteries have been substituted with cheaper, but "just as good" batteries from another source.


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## UnknownVT (Jan 15, 2009)

Mr Happy said:


> I would guess the green packaging was original stock which is being cleared out, and the other packaging is new lines that replace the old. Putting my cynical hat on, I would say the original Eneloop technology batteries have been substituted with cheaper, but "just as good" batteries from another source.


 
That's what I would guess too 
and yes, I would also be cynical - until told otherwise/corrected 

However if one started at the Uniross homepage and selected North America and did the similar product search Uniross North America does list Hybrio
_*Name: *AA HYBRIO_
_*Reference: *4ULAAHYB_
_*Capacity: *2100 mAh_
_*Size: *AA / R6_
_*Technology: *Ni-MH_
_*Output voltage: *1,2 V_
_*Ideal for: *All usages_
_*Batteries per blister: *4_

But the packaging is different too - 
it is now "blue" 





can't say for sure - but are those white topped?
or just a cynical hat 
that looks white?


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## Mr Happy (Jan 15, 2009)

UnknownVT said:


> However if one started at the Uniross homepage and selected North America and did the similar product search Uniross North America does list Hybrio
> _*Name: *AA HYBRIO_
> _*Reference: *4ULAAHYB_
> _*Capacity: *2100 mAh_
> ...



That blue package is what I can buy in Fry's at $9.99/4. The cells inside are Hybriloops, like the one pictured in my first post. :thumbsup:

Happily, Fry's still seem to have a large stock of them.


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## TONY M (Jan 15, 2009)

Ignore.


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## TONY M (Jan 15, 2009)

I bought hybrios last week (4xAA) and the packet they came in was the first packet KowShak shows in his post above. 
I do believe that they are eneloops (or a darn fine copy at least!



). 

I ran them through a few cycles on the C9000, I then discharged at 400mA and the results were as follows.

Discharge at 400mA.
Batt 1 1908mAh (slot no 4)
Batt 2 1911mAh (slot no 3)
Batt 3 1918mAh (slot no 2)
Batt 4 1884mAh (slot no 1)

Notice that batt 4 is lower than the others and it was charged on the first slot on the C9000. I had purposely chosen to put them in opposing slots as there has been talk of the C9000 reading low on the first slot.

Next time I put them in this way around and discharged.

Batt 1 1925mAh (slot no 1)
Batt 2 1956mAh (slot no 2)
Batt 3 1919mAh (slot no 3)
Batt 4 1919mAh (slot no 4)

These Hybrios have not been put through a break in cycle.



Now for two of my latest eneloops that are about 5 months old and were put through a break in cycle only a few weeks ago. They were last charged 10 days before discharging at 400mAh earlier today. I avoided slot 1.

Batt 1 1808mAh (slot 4)
Batt 2 1836mAh (slot 2)

Note that the first eneloop battery has always read slightly lower than the second battery (and my other eneloops).

I have not got any results of the capacity of the other eneloops but going by memory they are close to identical to the Hybrio's figures and in appearance they are also identical so I think they are probably the same batteries. Lets hope so as on this side of the pond at least they are cheaper than Eneloops!


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## UnknownVT (Jan 15, 2009)

TONY M said:


> I ran them through a few cycles on the C9000, I then discharged at 400mA and the results were as follows.
> ........
> Now for two of my latest eneloops that are about 5 months old and were put through a break in cycle only a few weeks ago.


 

Thank you so much TONY M for those measurements - that's just the ticket.

Please take a look at the thread I just started -

LSD Capacities 

where I am trying to collect capacity measurements for LSD batteries -
if you are so inclined, perhaps you would be kind enough to please add some of your measurements to that thread?

Thanks,


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## Hoggy (Jan 15, 2009)

Call me crazy, but on the Rayovac Hybrids I'm only seeing 3 vent holes.

I used to think 4 too, but upon closer inspection there only seems to be 3 in a triangle-like formation.


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## Bones (Jan 15, 2009)

As long as Uniross/UltraLast/Varta doesn't further fudge the facts, there may be a fairly reliable way to determine which of their plethora of low self-discharge cells is most likely to be a re-badged Eneloop.

If you look closely as the package backers depicted below, you will note that the Uniross package claims a self-discharge rate typical of other cells made in China, whereas the UltraLast package claims a self-discharge rate typical of the Eneloop. Both also claim to be made in China with a capacity of 2100mAh though.

Incidentally, if all the claims respecting the UltaLast are true, then it's the first cell made in China to achieve the same self-discharge rate as the Eneloop insofar as I'm aware.

However, I suspect that either the self-discharge claim or the made is China claim is a falsehood, and I'm leaning strongly towards the falsehood being the claim that the UltraLast cell is made in China.











Please note these down-sized images are hyperlinked to their originals, which are somewhat easier to read.


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## Mr Happy (Jan 15, 2009)

Hoggy said:


> Call me crazy, but on the Rayovac Hybrids I'm only seeing 3 vent holes.
> 
> I used to think 4 too, but upon closer inspection there only seems to be 3 in a triangle-like formation.


You're not crazy. Look at the picture of the Duracell Pre-Charged Made in China in post #24 -- only three vent holes there too.

I think we might start connecting the Duracell Pre-Charged "Made in China" with the Rayovac Hybrid.


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## was.lost.but.now.found (Jan 16, 2009)

It looks like there are still some Duraloops out there. I found some at Target today and picked up two packs on sale for 9.99 each. Packaging date is 2007 so it will be interesting to run a test and see how much power is left out of the package.


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## Egsise (Jan 16, 2009)

Hoggy said:


> Call me crazy, but on the Rayovac Hybrids I'm only seeing 3 vent holes.
> 
> I used to think 4 too, but upon closer inspection there only seems to be 3 in a triangle-like formation.


Same thing what i found from(european) Sony Cycle Energy Blue.












Three vent holes around the + button.


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## Black Rose (Jan 16, 2009)

Hoggy said:


> Call me crazy, but on the Rayovac Hybrids I'm only seeing 3 vent holes.
> 
> I used to think 4 too, but upon closer inspection there only seems to be 3 in a triangle-like formation.


I just checked them again, and there *are* only 3 vent holes. 
This time I marked each one with a sharpie so I wouldn't double count any.

I could've sworn there were 4 when I checked previously.

I've updated my original post where I said there were 4 so that it indicates that there are 3 now, not 4 as originally reported.


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## StandardBattery (Jan 17, 2009)

Black Rose said:


> I just checked them again, and there *are* only 3 vent holes.
> This time I marked each one with a sharpie so I wouldn't double count any.
> 
> I could've sworn there were 4 when I checked previously.
> ...


Oops me too, I could have sworn I counted 4.


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## Egsise (Jan 17, 2009)

Phew, i am so relieved. When i bought my cells i counted only 3 vent holes, i was like _"WTF, 3 vent holes, there are no LSD cells that has only 3 vent holes around the + button what are these cells that i just bought a truckload to myself and my friends helpmehelpmeomg!?"_


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## UnknownVT (Jan 17, 2009)

Egsise said:


> Same thing what i found from(european) Sony Cycle Energy Blue.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
Hmmm.... maybe it's me or my monitor, but I really cannot see the 3 vent holes surrounding the +ve button.

It's really interesting that these European Sony CycleEnergy are marked made in China both on the battery and packaging -

Although the clear plastic covering looks similar to the eneloop/DuraLoop - 
that white surround seems to look a bit more textured - like it's some kind of fiber-board(?), in comparison to what looks a smoother finish on the eneloops.





>> Would you mind looking for the date code on those European Sony CycleEnergy, please? 
- lightly embossed along the spine clear covering of the battery 
- probably feeling for it helps to locate it, 
then look with a magnifying glass under good lighting - 
even then one may have to vary the lighting angle.


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## Egsise (Jan 17, 2009)

UnknownVT said:


> Hmmm.... maybe it's me or my monitor, but I really cannot see the 3 vent holes surrounding the +ve button.


Yep, you are right you can't. I see those three vent holes only when i push that white surround a bit.



UnknownVT said:


> >> Would you mind looking for the date code on those European Sony CycleEnergy, please?



Sure, it's 0807.

These cells look a lot like Rayovac Hybrids, three vent holes and similar negative end.


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## Face (Jan 18, 2009)

The Uniross cells that I bought are the same as Kowshak's second picture and they certainly do seem to be very similar to Eneloops in appearance.

I have put 8 through a break-in charge on a C9000 and these are the capacities.

1 - 2165
2 - 2162
3 - 2171
4 - 2187

5 - 2111
6 - 2137
7 - 2120
8 - 2104

I'm now putting another 8 through a break-in cycle as well.


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## UnknownVT (Jan 18, 2009)

Egsise said:


> Sure, it's 0807.


 
Thanks, is the date code embossed on the clear plastic covering - hard to see?
Sorry for my "persistence" - although the actual date is of relevance, I was trying to determine if it was similar in format and appearance as eneloops and DuraLoops (eneloop Date code, DuraLoop Date code) - thanks.



Egsise said:


> These cells look a lot like Rayovac Hybrids, three vent holes and similar negative end.


 
Interesting .... the white top surround are "closer" to eneloop appearance though - 
but the more significant is the wrapping - they seem to have the paper under relatively thick slightly textrured clear plastic covering like the eneloops?


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## Egsise (Jan 18, 2009)

Np, the date code is actually quite easy to see.

Sorry but i have not ever seen Eneloops anywhere else than pictures, so can't tell the difference.


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## Mr Happy (Jan 18, 2009)

Egsise said:


> Sorry but i have not ever seen Eneloops anywhere else than pictures, so can't tell the difference.


Eneloops have a very distinctive square shape to the positive button, with open slots at each corner. Once you have seen it you will never fail to recognize it. No other battery has anything similar.


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## Egsise (Jan 18, 2009)

UnknownVT said:


> Interesting .... the white top surround are "closer" to eneloop appearance though -
> but the more significant is the wrapping - they seem to have the paper under relatively thick slightly textrured clear plastic covering like the eneloops?



Mr Happy, i meant i cannot tell the difference of the covering and stuff.
I have seen pictures of Eneloops positive button, thats why i took similar pictures of those cycle energy cells, they are different.


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## UnknownVT (Jan 18, 2009)

Egsise said:


> Np, the date code is actually quite easy to see.


 
So is it actually printed (in different color to its surroundings)? 
or still embossed on the clear plastic covering?

Is it along the seam of the plastic covering or elsewhere, and orientation, are there any other characters to the code?

My apologies for seeming pedantic - 
but I am still trying to determine if the date code is done in a similar way to the eneloops.......



Egsise said:


> Sorry but i have not ever seen Eneloops anywhere else than pictures, so can't tell the difference.


 
OK, your picture of the ends of the Sony EnergyCycle seems to show that the wrapping is some paper under a clear plastic covering - is that right?

Thanks,


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## Egsise (Jan 18, 2009)

UnknownVT said:


> So is it actually printed (in different color to its surroundings)?
> or still embossed on the clear plastic covering?
> 
> Is it along the seam of the plastic covering or elsewhere, and orientation, are there any other characters to the code?
> ...


Not printed, 2mm high numbers embossed along the seam of plastic covering which is not clear, there is no paper under the plastic, or at least i can't find any without taking the plastic away.


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## UnknownVT (Jan 18, 2009)

Egsise said:


> Not printed, 2mm high numbers embossed along the seam of plastic covering which is not clear, there is no paper under the plastic, or at least i can't find any without taking the plastic away.


 
hmmm.... the embossing date code along the seam is similar to the eneloop scheme - I do not recall any other LSD that uses the same scheme (other than DuraLoops which are confirmed re-badged eneloops)

OK, this is what made me think there was some paper or other material under a clear plastic wrapping -

Your pic highlighted -






in the *Red* circle the joint/seam seems to be over some other material underneath?
in the *Blue* circle there seems to be two layers?

Compared to -




in the *Red* circle a similar joint/seam over some other material beneath,
the tops definitely show another material underneath the clear covering....


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## crofty (Jan 22, 2009)

KowShak said:


> ...Which style of Hybrios did you buy...


Their the one`s in the green package, same as in the first pic you posted.


Camera`s back..

All batteries were bought near the end of 2007. First got 4 plus a Uniross X-Press 300 charger which included another 4, few months later when I realised the charger was dumb I bought 4 more and a BC700. Both purchases were from different sites.

The 4 odd one`s out may of come with the uniross charger, unfortunately did`t pay much attention back then so can`t say for definite.

See if you can spot em 


 



Here the Hybrio is on the left, Hybriloop on the right and Eneloop on the bottom. The niple on the odd hybrio is completely round, it doesn`t have the slight square shape like the eneloop, there are only 3 holes in the side and the top is completely smooth and shiny (apart from the scratches).
The white disc is also whiter, smoother and shinyer. I`m fairly sure it`s plastic.




Close up of negative end (not in same order, obviously).


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## crofty (Jan 25, 2009)

BTW you can click those images I posted above for larger versions.


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## Mr Happy (Jan 25, 2009)

crofty said:


> BTW you can click those images I posted above for larger versions.


Yes, those are nice pictures. I think the lower right cell in the close up of the negative end shows very clearly what the base of a Rayovac Hybrid or clone looks like. I think that is a very good identifying feature for any cell which is of Type II in my list of categories in post #1.

(BTW, those cells look like they have had a rough life -- dented and scratched and wrappers torn. What is it you do to them?)


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## Bones (Jan 25, 2009)

There may be some good news here for owners of the cells Mr Happy has designated as Type II.

As documented by Egsise and others in this thread, these cells are all made in China and further typified by three vents around the positive post and a smaller negative protudence with a fairly gradual rise:



Egsise said:


> ...
> Sony Cycle Energy Blue.
> 
> 
> ...



Anyway, it appears to me that at least four global brands including Uniross, Rayovac, Duracell and Sony have now chosen this type for inclusion in their respective pre-charged line-ups.

Presuming they all did at least some prior diligence, I think it's reasonable to derive some assurance from their choice that these are a viable alternative when the Eneloop either isn't available or its pricing is cost prohibitive.


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## Black Rose (Jan 25, 2009)

Bones said:


> Anyway, it appears to me that at least four global brands including Uniross, Rayovac, Duracell and Sony have now chosen this type for inclusion in their respective pre-charged line-ups.
> 
> Presuming they all did at least some prior diligence, I think it's reasonable to derive some assurance from their choice that these are a viable alternative when the Eneloop either isn't available or its pricing is cost prohibitive.


Makes me wonder if perhaps the costs of rebranding Eneloops has become cost prohibitive and they've all gone to the next best thing.

EDIT: The conspiracy theorist in me notes that Panasonic developed the cells labeled as Type II with Yuasa, and Panasonic will soon own Sanyo.
Could this be a sign of things to come....


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## Bones (Jan 25, 2009)

Black Rose said:


> Makes me wonder if perhaps the costs of rebranding Eneloops has become cost prohibitive and they've all gone to the next best thing.
> 
> EDIT: The conspiracy theorist in me notes it's interesting that Panasonic developed the cells labeled as Type II with Yuasa, and Panasonic will soon own Sanyo.
> 
> Could this be a sign of things to come....



Considering how decidedly superior the Eneloop continues to prove itself to be, the merger with Sanyo makes absolute sense for Panasonic.

I would also bet there now exists a legal brief by some of the brightest minds that could be brought to bear that Panasonic doesn't have to share the Eneloop technology with the partnership formed to develop the 'other' low self-discharge technology.

In fact, right now Panasonic is probably feeling like a corporate Hannah Montana with the 'best of both worlds'.


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## crofty (Jan 26, 2009)

Mr Happy said:


> (BTW, those cells look like they have had a rough life -- dented and scratched and wrappers torn. What is it you do to them?)


 nothing extreme I`m affraid. Torn wrappers are mainly caused buy me managing to drop them shortly after purchase, it split the wrapper around the edge and put a few dents in. Over time the splits got bigger and bits fell off or I pulled them off because they were hanging loose.

Scratches look worse than they are in the pictures, the bigger one`s are from rotating the cells in chargers/devices.

The big dents in the middle of the negative end are caused by the battery holder in my cooker.

So no big exciting reason for the haggled look I`m affraid.

The eneloops pictured are my 2006 one`s which have had the same use (bar being dropped) for the same amount of time and as you can see are in excellent condition still. :twothumbs sanyo.


If you want a better photo of the Type II to use in the OP I`d be happy to try and get one.

BTW, great thread.


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## KowShak (Jan 26, 2009)

crofty said:


> If you want a better photo of the Type II to use in the OP I`d be happy to try and get one.


 
A side on picture showing the three different positive button shapes would be useful I think.


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## geek4christ (Feb 11, 2009)

Is it just me or does the Nexcell EnergyOn look an awful lot like an Eneloop?

http://www.nexcellglobal.com/images/energyON.JPG

Does anyone have any lying around they could examine and possibly take photos of?


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## geek4christ (Feb 11, 2009)

geek4christ said:


> Is it just me or does the Nexcell EnergyOn look an awful lot like an Eneloop?
> 
> http://www.nexcellglobal.com/images/energyON.JPG
> 
> Does anyone have any lying around they could examine and possibly take photos of?



Perhaps not an Eneloop.

They appear to manufacture their own cells (in China): http://www.nexcellglobal.com/manufacturer.htm

In that case, it is more likely they are the Type IV: UltraLast Hybrio listed in the OP.


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## bshanahan14rulz (Mar 16, 2009)

So, I'm still not sure how you all figure out what is an eneloop and what isn't. The rules of thumb seem to be look for white tops, a squarish +button with 4 holes, and Japanese origin? Are there any brands that I can look for that might make it easier? On my last trip to Walmart, I just looked for "eneloop" but apparently that's not very common, and cells wrapped with different labels is much more common.


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## Mr Happy (Mar 16, 2009)

bshanahan14rulz said:


> So, I'm still not sure how you all figure out what is an eneloop and what isn't. The rules of thumb seem to be look for white tops, a squarish +button with 4 holes, and Japanese origin? Are there any brands that I can look for that might make it easier? On my last trip to Walmart, I just looked for "eneloop" but apparently that's not very common, and cells wrapped with different labels is much more common.


The ones I know of are some kinds of Duracell PreCharged, some kinds of Sony CycleEnergy and some kinds of Uniross Hybrio (even though they say "made in China"). The Duracells might be found anywhere, the Sony and the Hybrio I have only seen in Fry's. Genuine eneloops might be found in Ritz Camera outlets.


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## CdBoy (Jun 9, 2009)

*Uniross Hybrio 1900mAh NEW VERSION*

======================
Uniross Hybrio LSD 1900mAh
----------------------------
Made in: China
Model#: AA/R6/Mignon *1900 mAh NiMH*
Rated: 1900mAh
Std. Charge Spec: 380mAh for 7 hrs.
Diameter: 14mm (Top) / 14.2mm (Bottom)
Length: 48.2mm (not including nib) / 50mm (including nib)
Positive Nib: 4.77mm (Diameter)
Cosmetics: White top, *NO vent holes* on side of nib, outer wrap does not wrap around negative post, protrusion on negative terminal ~9mm in diameter

found the abovementioned item in my local hardware depot.

I thought that Hybrio AA comes only in the 2100mAh flavor until now.


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## UnknownVT (Jun 11, 2009)

*Re: Uniross Hybrio 1900mAh NEW VERSION*



CdBoy said:


> ======================
> Uniross Hybrio LSD 1900mAh
> ----------------------------
> Made in: China
> ...


 
Interesting find, thank you.

Do you by any chance have a pic of the battery and packaging, please - as that would help a lot.

Earlier in this thread - in Post #*39* (link) - European dealers had 1600mAh "Hybrios", as well as the more commonly known 2100mAh Hybrios (which had a "Long Life" qualifier) - but both claim to use "Hybrio" technology.

The 1600mAh came in "orange" packaging, and the 2100mAh came in "red" - there are direct links to the Uniross Europe pages on these in Post #*41* (link) above.

_*EDIT to Add*_ -

Doing a quick google for 1900mAh Hybrio got several pages for these with chargers mostly from India. (eg: search on Hybrio 1900mAh on eBay India )

There was one page from Malaysia (link) that had a pic of just the batteries and packaging - 
I cannot see anything that designate the pic as 1900mAh - only that linked page say they are (but the date on the pic is recent) ....


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## VidPro (Jul 22, 2009)

bshanahan14rulz said:


> So, I'm still not sure how you all figure out what is an eneloop and what isn't. The rules of thumb seem to be look for white tops, a squarish +button with 4 holes, and Japanese origin? Are there any brands that I can look for that might make it easier? On my last trip to Walmart, I just looked for "eneloop" but apparently that's not very common, and cells wrapped with different labels is much more common.


 
i have been noticing, besides the obvious base type and top type and the white thing.
the Texture of the metal, there is something about that texture that stands out like a sore thumb. And it looks like it might be a good way of making a connection when there is metal oxidation.
not only do i see that texture in every enloop like batt that tested out as being similar, but i see that texture on mine at home. 
its special  its the metal.


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## minimig (Jul 24, 2009)

I found another variety of LSD cell.
It is made by Sanyo, made in Japan.

Half the capacity of Eneloops, only 1000mah for AA.
Probably made for low power items like remotes, wireless mouse, etc.
Price here converts to about US$7.45 for the 4 pack.












I wonder how popular this cells will be?

Miguel


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## minimig (Jul 24, 2009)

Here's some more pics.






















Miguel


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## Sugarboy (Jul 25, 2009)

Hi there,

i'm pretty sure Uniross Hybrios are just relabeled Yuasa LSDs.

i remember there's an official sticker on the package saying it uses the new Yuasa LSD technology ..

Ultralast is just another name of Uniross.


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## Sugarboy (Jul 25, 2009)

Hybrios are NOT Eneloops, should be OEM of Yuasa.

Ultralast is just another name of Uniross ..:laughing:


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## Mr Happy (Jul 25, 2009)

Sugarboy said:


> Hybrios are NOT Eneloops, should be OEM of Yuasa.


This is not true. At least three different kinds of cell have been seen wearing the Hybrio label, maybe four. One of those kinds is indeed indistinguishable from the eneloop, but the others are different.

As far as I can tell, Uniross/Ultralast is willing to source cells from any convenient manufacturer to wear the Hybrio label, which unfortunately devalues the Hybrio brand since you can't tell what you are getting.


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## davidt1 (Jul 25, 2009)

Man, those Rayovac Hybrids are crap. I had them for about six months. They were OK for a few months. Now they need to be recharged every 2 weeks. Bought some Eneloops. They are much better.


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## Black Rose (Jul 25, 2009)

davidt1 said:


> Man, those Rayovac Hybrids are crap. I had them for about six months. They were OK for a few months. Now they need to be recharged every 2 weeks.


Interesting....of the 38 Hybrids I have, only 2 cells (both AAAs) have lost thier LSD capability after 16 months of use.


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## snakebite (Jan 7, 2010)

funny you mention your hybrids dieing off.
every one of mine that died got dented on the - end from dropping the light.
another obsevation on the rayovac type lsd cells is that the wrapper is fragile.i have several hybrids and radioshack cells with ragged wrappers.i made packs for phones with some so they would be safe.another possibility on your cells is you have a battery cooker.


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## Bimmerboy (Feb 13, 2010)

Perhaps I'm missing something, stretching things, or just bored, but why did no one take note of Minimig's posts? I find it a bit eyebrow raising that the Sanyo "Harmolattice" LSD cells appear physically identical in every way to Eneloops, and Japanese Duraloops down to the overlay patterns in the clear wrapper, yet they're only rated for 1000mAh.

What's at play here (seperator thickness, or other possibilities), and does this give legs to the barely contested notion that there *absolutely cannot be any difference* between the Eneloop, Duraloop, or any other "true" clone? I can't help but wonder if there are any _patented_ internal variations, no matter how slight.

Anyone see any fresh data on this stuff, or shootouts if you will? Most pertinent info seems to not have been updated in a while. Assuming that people who have tested the various "loop" clones still have the same sets hanging around, do they still perform equally now that they've aged more?


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## Mr Happy (Feb 13, 2010)

I recall some discussion of Harmolattice cells when they first came out. It seems they probably have less "battery stuff" inside them, meaning they have a lower capacity and can be sold at a lower price. I do not remember anyone actually having any in their hands and testing them, so we do not know all the details of weight, actual capacity, voltage characteristics, and so on.


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## Bones (Feb 14, 2010)

Bimmerboy said:


> ...
> What's at play here (seperator thickness, or other possibilities), and does this give legs to the barely contested notion that there *absolutely cannot be any difference* between the Eneloop, Duraloop, or any other "true" clone? I can't help but wonder if there are any _patented_ internal variations, no matter how slight.
> ...



No legs here.

A quick check of the specifications reveals that the Harmolattice AAA cell is approximately 15% lighter than the Eneloop AAA and the AA is about 30% lighter than its Eneloop counterpart:



Bones said:


> I've been digging around for a little more information on this cell, and determined that Sanyo has also released an 600mAh AAA version.
> 
> As shown on this chart from Sanyo.com, it bears the model number HR-4UQ, whereas the AA cell bears the model number HR-3UQ:
> 
> ...



Hyperlinks to more Harmolattice data:

http://www.candlepowerforums.com ... post3026689
.


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## Bones (Feb 14, 2010)

Bimmerboy said:


> ...
> What's at play here (seperator thickness, or other possibilities), and does this give legs to the barely contested notion that there *absolutely cannot be any difference* between the Eneloop, Duraloop, or any other "true" clone? I can't help but wonder if there are any _patented_ internal variations, no matter how slight.
> ...



Perhaps it's worth mentioning that the Duraloop and other such cells are not clones, per se. A clone infers a copy of an original. In actuality, it's believed they're original Eneloops wrapped in a different jacket, with the only difference between the two being the jackets themselves.


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## gr8divas (Aug 8, 2010)

This forum looks great, so much information on LSD batteries... 

Sorry for OT 

I was trying to find details about different LSD batteries and this is only 2nd site I found with good information after searching for 4 hours 


Anyway Anybody can provide more info about where I can buy "Eneloop Lite"


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## march.brown (Aug 9, 2010)

Black Rose said:


> EDIT: I tried to get a photo of the positive end of the battery showing the vent holes, but the macro setting on my camera won't focus in that close.


 I use a Panasonic DMC-TZ1 camera which has a macro position on the mode selection switch , but the camera won't allow the zoom to be used in the macro mode.

I bought a set of +1 , +2 , +3 and +4 dioptre lenses and I simply hold a lens in front of the camera lens for ultra close-ups ... It means that I can use the zoom too ... Not very pretty to look at , but it works well.

The +4 dioptre close-up lens means that the subject has to be closer than 25cm from the lens ... Just zoom in till you get the image size that you need ... If your camera has a filter thread , then get a screw-in close-up lens ... Unfortunately my camera doesn't have a filter thread so I just have to hold the close-up lens in place.

Good luck for your future macro pictures.


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## was.lost.but.now.found (Aug 9, 2010)

gr8divas said:


> Anyway Anybody can provide more info about where I can buy "Eneloop Lite"



maybe I'm missing something, but half the capacity at a greater cost? I'll take the full calorie version.


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