# Flashaholics worst case: Incan needed to blow away a stock [email protected] 6D



## barnefko (Oct 16, 2009)

Hi Folks. Short story before i ask my questions.

Starring: 
Me, a self declared flashaholic with quite a lot of lights in every drawer,bag and pocket who plays surefire lego in his head at night instead of counting sheeps. 

My brother in law, who never cared much about flashlights but recently stumbled upon a stock [email protected] 6D that was on sale.

We were out this night for a hunting trip, we didn't shoot anything and on our way home we waited on the outskirts of our hunting area for our fellow hunting party members. We were waiting near the car and suddenly we heard something in the woods. "Wait, i'll get my flashlight" i told my b.i.l and got my stock SF 6P incan. I had this light with me because we don't shoot after dark and i mainly use it for searching if some deer gets wounded. I love my 6P btw - i use it for most tasks because this little precious got the form factor that turns me on and, until now, all the power i needed.

Anyway as i scan the wood with my beloved little 6P, my brother in law starts laughing and reciting the famous Crocodile dundee Movie: "Wait - you call THIS a flashlight? THIS is a flashlight:!!" And out of his backpack he produces his Ugly betty, the [email protected] 6d. No wonder it had more throw and obviously more power. The bloody grin on his face was so big that the 6D seemed a like a toothpick....

There i was now, holding on to my precious with somewhat low batteries that had no chance against ugly betty. No chance by explaning him the otherwise far superior 6P can't be compared to his 6D - especially not with half drained batteries. but it didn' help - he just kept on laughing " u-hu jaja". At that moment i just wished i had a Solar-fusion-nuclear meltdown-supernova-ueber-flashlight that could burn the damn grin out of his face!!!!

Note to self: back to CPF and ask for help.

Now to my question: 
I need an Incan that does precisely what i mentioned above. BUT as i am a practical guy and having read "The art of War" (actually didn't, but it sounds good) i know that winning the battle doesn't win the war: i don't need an over driven incan with 2 hours bulb life and max 10 min. bursts that's going to let me down on our next hunting trip ( just imagine his grin.....)

Options: 
[email protected] 85: good power but not really practical, how long will the bulbs last? I just can't imagine this is made for longer bursts than some minutes.

R.O.P high: same as above, i read that bulb life is relatively short

[email protected] with WA1111: will this still be able to burn his grin out of his face compared to a 6D?

or the totally other way: WF-500 with a bulb from lumens factory.


What i try to ask you guys is wich incan-mod will give me the power to blow away his awful 6D and on the other side be a reliable partner in my backpack?
If i wasn't such an incan lover i would go with a [email protected] P7 - but LED is not an option because i hate their tint. BTW Resources limited to somewhat 150$ so HID is no option either

Please guys, help me to make this flashaholics-worst case scenario becoming the return of the [email protected] Jedi!!


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## nzgunnie (Oct 16, 2009)

Well blowing away a 6D mag shouldn't be too hard....

Working with what you've got, if you get an A19 extender and a KT2 turbo head you should be just about there. With 2x 17500s you can run an MN15, although you can't run the MN16 with those cells. Even an MN15 should pretty well deal to a 6D mag.

If you were to take that a step further you could bore out your 6P (plus extender if you get one) and run either 18500s, or even IMRs, then you could run the EO-M3T or MN16.

Another option would be to get a 2x 18650 body.

Or simply get an M6, this would be the easiest (althogh most expensive) option.


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## Kestrel (Oct 16, 2009)

Since you already have a 6P, why not a lego-able companion? A FiveMega 6P-compatible 2x18650 tube and a Sunlite module holding a WA1111? Should be decent in runtime and still be small enough to carry (unlike that big honker of a Mag). One advantage is that every part of this new light would be interchangeable with your current 6P.

I'm no incan expert though, those will arrive shortly... :huh:

Edit: LOL, one already arrived. ;-)
I like the KT-2 turbohead idea of nzg, less carryable than my idea but will definitely out-throw a mag, rather than the narrow profile Sunline which will be far less focused.


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## fyrstormer (Oct 16, 2009)

Does Malkoff make an MC-E drop-in? That should come pretty close.


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## Nitroz (Oct 16, 2009)

You could always go with a Nailbender neutral or warm white 6p drop in that should squash the 6d fairly easy. The 6D is only like 160 lumens or so, even with the Xenon upgrade it's still only 233.

So one MC-E NW drop in and you still have your tiny light with more power.


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## buickid (Oct 16, 2009)

The Mag85 is actually decently practical (to me anyway) and looks like a plain jane 3D Mag. Sleeper lights ftw.


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## Kestrel (Oct 16, 2009)

buickid said:


> The Mag85 is actually decently practical (to me anyway) and looks like a plain jane 3D Mag. Sleeper lights ftw.


+1, but after trying the Mag85 and the ROP, I liked the ROP in a smaller, lighter, and more convenient Mag 2C a lot more, especially since you retain the PR-base bulb configuration.

Mag85 vs ROP:
:touche:
LOL.


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## lctorana (Oct 16, 2009)

Kestrel said:


> +1, but after trying the Mag85 and the ROP, I liked the ROP in a smaller, lighter, and more convenient Mag 2C a lot more, especially since you retain the PR-base bulb configuration.
> 
> Mag85 vs ROP:
> :touche:
> LOL.


or a 3C Mag85


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## outersquare (Oct 16, 2009)

6D mag even with magnum bulb is nothing special and carrying one for hunting seems backwards.

imho ROP is not suitable for heavy/hunting use, it gets hot fast and i've seen numerous posts about heat problems, such as the bulb contact/plastic post melting. 

When i had one, during use something would outgas a vapor and fog the reflector/lens.

it would suffer the same problem as an incan 6P with dimming and crappy battery life.

imo 6P is fine, just carry fresh batteries also.
you can try a P61 drop in or a warm tint MCE/P7 drop in, which could be regulated for constant brightness.


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## Outdoors Fanatic (Oct 16, 2009)

fyrstormer said:


> Does Malkoff make an MC-E drop-in? That should come pretty close.


Hello, this is the Incandescent Section and the title of this topic states: "*Incan needed"*.


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## Databyter (Oct 16, 2009)

A [email protected] 85 lasts quite a long time depending on form factor and battery configuration. And I don't think most people turn on a flashlight until it burns out. They turn it on for maybe a few minutes at a time. at an average of 35 minutes runtime for a 9aa configuration I have never had one go dimmer than a 6d mag even after they begin to run down. The light is still usable just a bit yellower as it goes down in voltage.(I recommend eneloop because unless you like to charge alot they will hold 85% nicely even when sitting on a shelf for a few weeks).

And as I said 35 minutes doesn't sound like much on paper but it is a helluva lot in your hand imho. I personally use my mag85 nightly at work (situationally) and charge it once a week whether it needs it or not. It has never let me down when I picked it up and has always had a beam that would blow away a 6d.

As far as bulb life Pfft. I forget what it is supposed to be, 30 hours or something? once again that is a LONG time and this bulb isn't that expensive for what you get. Buy them several (3) at a time and you won't worry about them for a long time. I think 30 hours is a conservative estimate depending on usage. Personally I made my first mag 85 about two months ago and use it alot and the same bulb is still going strong.

If you really want to blow your b.i.l. away though get something based on a 623 or a 458 bulb. Expensive to do right, but you won't only be vindicated but the competition might actually melt. Mag85 will win but not be a WOW victory. Yea it's bright but unless your out in the woods you can't really get the full effect of how bright, alot of the lumens are in the spill for instance. I like to open up my beam in a semi dark area and shine my light onto the bottom of a large tree, this usually will cause passersby to pee their pants at how night turned into day under that tree. And I just look innicently around.

When shopping for wow lights imho don't shop for 2 hour runtimes, thats what your backup light is for.


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## Larry237 (Oct 16, 2009)

Try a Lumens Factory EO-9, with a 9 volt body or extension. I sometimes run one in a Z3 and it is bright and throws well. Not a real super light, but maybe it's a cheap solution that works well enough.


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## mdhammack (Oct 16, 2009)

I say Mag85. It's my next build as well after seeing one in action recently. I have always liked my 2d ROP's for most of the work I do, but I gotta try one of these 3D mag85's.


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## Linger (Oct 16, 2009)

Well, if you're speaking of sun Tzu, lets discuss the theoretical point first. You might not do as well with any torch if it's 1/2 dead. That's like 'ironman beam shoots' stuff, where you want to win after using your torch full-out for 2 hours.

For bragging rights, I say if at all possible Keep the same torch, in this case your P60. You can't really claim victory on the field if you show up with a new army. Keep the SF P form factor. But do some work on it.

Some people speak highly of the P91. But FM sunlight can top it handily. You could pull it off with 2ximr16340's, but if you went 3 cells there's obviously more power.
Read EG's intro to incans,
for 2cells you're 1111 or 1274,
for 3 cells its 1331, 1185, 1166
I'd thought 1164 was good for 2 but its not on his guide.


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## Linger (Oct 16, 2009)

Larry237 said:


> Try a Lumens Factory EO-9, with a 9 volt body or extension.



+1 to that. Also consider the 3ximr options for even more light (iirc 500lumens vs 380), same run-time.
The Lumens Factor High Output H0-9 is regarded as 'hard to distinguish' from the Extreme output EO-9 but with more run-time.
Beauty of this is its easy to keep spare cells and alternate assemblies to swap-in.
It'd totally recommend a multi-die led emitter for emergency circumstances that require high output and long run-time (but, that is my bias - incans as nice toys and leds as workhorse: i'm not debating it, just letting you know where I come from)


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## alpg88 (Oct 17, 2009)

you can do all that, or just buy yourself solarforce L1200, i'm pretty sure it'll kill 6d mag


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## 325addict (Oct 17, 2009)

I would go for an all-Lumens Factory setup:

1. take a Seraph-setup for three cells and an 1.5 cell extender,
2. then take the D36 mini-turbo head,
3. finally add a 700 or 1,000 Lumens D36 EO-13 or IMR-13 lamp assembly.

*Remember: for the IMR-13 you need IMR-batteries!! 

*You'll need three 18500 sized batteries. In the three-cell Seraph flashlight, you'll be able to put in two of them, with the 1.5 cell extender, you can add another, which is needed to power these awesome lamps properly.
In the Seraph-system, one cell is meant to be one 16340. So three of them equals TWO 18500s in total length.

Either of these setups should _blow away_ the stock 6D. 

According to what I read multiple times, the EO-13 seems to throw _further_ than the IMR-13, which is more floody. I can't confirm this, but as I read it multiple times now, it might be true 

The Sun-module by FiveMega is sold out at the moment. I grabbed one of the last ones he had. Check back often to see if he did another run, as these are really, really AWESOME modules!! I run mine in a C2 Centurion (same size as your 6P) with two IMR 16340 batteries and WA1111 lamp. It is nearly as bright as a stock Surefire M6 with the MN20 installed :devil:
Only drawback is the very short runtime of about 5 minutes only....
This one however, has an enorrrrrmous WOW-factor :green:
SOOO small, and SOOOO much light?! YESSS!!!


Timmo.


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## Crenshaw (Oct 17, 2009)

The main problem here is that most lay-people equate throw to more light.

Anything with a 6P reflector size is going to seem "dimmer" because theres just no way a reflector that size can out do 200+ lumens thru a mag reflector.

So you NEED that turbo head. After that,almost any high powered incan replacement will be able to help you win...

i WOULD suggest a Mag85 3C, but isnt the point in this to prove that mag "aint the best" flashlight?

Crenshaw


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## barnefko (Oct 17, 2009)

Linger said:


> You can't really claim victory on the field if you show up with a new army.



ok - now you got my spirits up. I'm going to get an EO-9 and a 3 cell extender and turbo-head. This should do. But whats the runtime gonna be?
BUT: as i learned my lesson, the [email protected] will be my "backup" as i already have a stock 2D at home.

The FM sun is not really an option for me as 5 minutes runtime with a wa1111 is not really usable for me. If we're out in the woods searching i need minimum 30 minutes total runtime


Thx for your suggestions guys, i understand that that was as bad a situation as i could get in with half drained batteries and an ignorant b.i.l.


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## AlecGold (Oct 17, 2009)

The easy solution is to get a SF KT1 on your 6P. I've got one and it has a nicer beam than my SF M6 and reaches just as far.... the M6 just lights up the whole football field and the 6P+KT1 lights up just the tree on the otherside of the football field. 
But with the 500lumens M6, you'll have 20min of runtime and on the 6P+KT1 you'll have 60min of runtime. 
And what I like most of this combination is that it isn't a mod, it's just a "over the counter" product with spare lamps that are easy to get, it doesn't need some bizarre exotic Li-ion battery that I always forget to charge and unobtainable lamp assembly, it's just a basic surefire. 
And if I've got half of the life of the batteries, I get them out and use them in my buck/boost-driven led-lights.
Serious, the 6P+KT1 is an underestimated lamp combination. 
And it is noting larger than a 6P, just an inch orso wider at the bezel.

No go out, and get that b.i.l.


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## 325addict (Oct 17, 2009)

Wait a minute - that EO-9 is NOT going to fit that mini-turbohead! You need a D36 size instead of a D26 sized LA...
Take one of the two I proposed and you'll have no problems. Just have to go now, if you need more info on runtimes, suitability, compatibility of certain parts - just PM me, I'll return to you later.

Timmo.


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## Howecollc (Oct 17, 2009)

You’re never going to win any throw contests with the small reflector of your 6P. The bulb in the 6 D Mag is 6 watts, the P60 bulb in your 6P on fresh batteries is 7 watts and probably whiter in color, yet you got trounced. I don’t know how much your 1/2 depleted cells affected output, but you still would have lost even with fresh cells. I once tried one of the Lumens Factory IMR-9 lamps in the 6P, and even though it tested at 16-17 watts, both my Surefire E2DL and MagCharger blistered it on throw. A Surefire TurboHead certainly would certainly improve things, but seems destined to put you over budget, and still doesn’t offer the throw of the workhorse Mag reflector.

You don’t seem to be biased against the size and heft of the 3D Mag platform, therefore, I’m going to suggest the MagCharger. Forget what inconsistent specs Mag gives on their web-site; the 8.4-10.25 watt MagCharger blows away the 6 watt Mag 6D. Just read the praises on this current thread. The beauty of this light is that they give these things away for $90.00 on-line. Many a cop, wrecker driver, and old school CPF member used to gladly walk into the uniform supply/guns and ammo store and shell out $140.00 and up for one of these; and they were still worth every penny (God bless the Internet). It runs for 75 minutes with a hardly noticeable change in brightness, then turns dull orange fast. It charges in a cradle, and a second battery to have on hand in the woods costs $20.00. The bulb is rated for 50 hours, but seems to last longer. You can drop a Welch Allyn 1160 bulb into it with no further modification to reflector or bulb-holder and get 23 watts of overdriven output with an ultra reliable 65plus hours of bulb life; runtime is about 34 minutes. It’s not a Mag85 or even a Mag11, but I think maybe a more suitable everyday working flashlight that still kicks serious ***.

Now for a smaller suggestion. Since decent runtime and ability to use the light continuously for long periods without concerns of frequent bulb burnout seem to be priorities, how about a 2C Mag (same great reflector as the D models) running AW 2.6Ah 18650s and a WA 1274 in a bi-pin adaptor? Much less weight and volume to carry around, yet almost as much output as the 1160 MC. 20 watts of output with 40 hours bulb life for 50 minutes runtime. The job of stuffing the 18650s in the 2C is made very easy with this FM product. The WA 1274 won’t be overdriven with the Li-Ions, but it runs very hard and white at spec voltage, and will be much more reliable and longer-lived than an overdriven 1111 or 1185. This will cost more to put together than a MagCharger, but will still be well under your $150.00 limit.

And hey, with all these options being rechargeable, there’s no reason to get caught with 1/2 depleted cells anymore.


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## KiwiMark (Oct 17, 2009)

barnefko said:


> THIS is a flashlight:!!" And out of his backpack he produces his Ugly betty, the [email protected] 6d.




Man, I wish someone would do that to me! I would say - oh you have a Maglite, so do I. Then I would pull out a 2D Maglite and see how it compares to his 6D. What does he have - 6 Watts? My 2D has about 14 Watts and runs for 2 hours. It would be a little embarrassing for a 6D to be trounced by a little ol' 2D.

My recipe:
Mag 2D
3854-L bulb (ROP Low)
2 x Kaidomain protected Li-ion D cells
Glass lens
Aluminium Reflector

Optional for more throw:
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/239973


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## jirik_cz (Oct 17, 2009)

Solarforce L1200 - more than 1000 lumens and 50k lux... Runtime is roughly 40 minutes with three 18650 li-ion.


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## Databyter (Oct 17, 2009)

Keep in mind that you can build a high end hotwire with an AW switch that will still give you plenty of runtime at the lower power levels, and if you hear any snickering just pump it up to 100% for a few minutes!


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## AlecGold (Oct 17, 2009)

Databyter said:


> Keep in mind that you can build a high end hotwire with an AW switch that will still give you plenty of runtime at the lower power levels, and if you hear any snickering just pump it up to 100% for a few minutes!



Are all you guys telling me that it takes a super-state-of-the-art-modded flashlight to beat a 6D Mag?
Common, that can't be true, just a normal M3 will make mincemeat of a 6D, a M4 will make it forget what to do and it will melt away at the sight of an M6. No need to build a high end hotwire....?!


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## SureAddicted (Oct 17, 2009)

If you can find a Aspheric lens for your 6P your in luck, I saw a pic here on CPF, cant remember if it was the P series or C series, but it had an aspheric on there. Couple that with a P90 and 2 RCR123s and your in business. A turbohead will also work as others have suggested. A 9P with a P91 and an aspheric would end the war pretty quick.

I personally wouldn't go the Mag route. You could easily trounce a standard 6D with a ROP, but then your b.i.l might get interested and ask you for the recipe, then you would have to come back with something bigger and better.
What I would do is look over at BST for a M3T.


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## nzgunnie (Oct 17, 2009)

barnefko said:


> ok - now you got my spirits up. I'm going to get an EO-9 and a 3 cell extender and turbo-head. This should do. But whats the runtime gonna be?



The EO-9 wont fit the turbo head. For a KT-1 turbo head and a 3 cell configuration you need an MN-15.

Or one of the LF T series lamps, depending on battery configuration.


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## Illum (Oct 17, 2009)

Kestrel said:


> +1, but after trying the Mag85 and the ROP, I liked the ROP in a smaller, lighter, and more convenient Mag 2C a lot more, especially since you retain the PR-base bulb configuration.



You lose a little bit of output with the ROP but its way more "pocketable" than the Mag85
the Mag85 still has its place though, next time someone pull out their 5mm showerhead and declare "1000 lumens" in your face all you need to do is to pull out your Mag85 and say "well My flashlight is only ~100 more lumens than yours" and check this out *points to the cell tower/building/parking garage/or treeline beside you and observe his/er expression:nana:


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## Linger (Oct 17, 2009)

AlecGold said:


> No need to build a high end hotwire....?!



Yes, I agree.

Being out in the woods, you also don't need uber throw. In my experience, in a clearing in a forest (say 30 feet wide) total output will win out over throw.
An 11w 6v spotlight that throws a white donut (smooth reflector) clear across the lake was trunced in a clearing. The thrower made a bright spot on a tree, my 8aa [email protected] lit the whole area up.

barnefko> I understand you want usable run-time. But pick 2 of the three:
small - bright - runtime
You can't have it all. Get small and bright and retake your place on the thrown. Carry another lamp assembly (or multi-die led drop-in:twothumbs) with batteries to swap out for longer use. No-one need even know you've reached into your pocket and changed out the LA + batteries.
You do rechargables right? Change batteries often, no point returning home with 3 sets fully charged. I have a few battery cases and drop-in canisters. Change things up for what will be coming up to next. When you can do it with mostly one handed by touch it'll start happening on its own.


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## MrGman (Oct 17, 2009)

I don't normally wander into the incan section but last night I was playing with several incans along with my friends and well the video camera just happened to be on. Here are some incans. The Lumens factory unit mentioned is in the new Seraph model light its an extreme output 13 along with Surefire P91 lamps (one I measured at 350 lumens using 2 AW 18650 batteries and another I measured over 400 lumens running with 2 IMR 18650's, and a SF M3. hopes this help your search. 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oEU2gGSDYxU

I should mention that the video seems much darker than what we could see probably because its not zoomed in enough and doesn't do the flashlights justice (as is typical) compared to what the human eyes can see. 


Not a fan of the Seraph model light after handling it. You could put an extension on your 6P, but I would convert that over to an LED and get youself something bigger, maybe a Solarforce L2 that takes the 18650 and 1 long extension run 2X18650's and the Surefire P91 lamp for a relatively low budget Maglite 6D killer.


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## fyrstormer (Oct 17, 2009)

Outdoors Fanatic said:


> Hello, this is the Incandescent Section and the title of this topic states: "*Incan needed"*.


Could've been because his light is currently incandescent and he didn't know LED conversions are as easy as they are. I noticed he said he didn't like the tint of LEDs, but they make them pretty warm these days. I was just bringing it to his attention, that's all.


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## barnefko (Oct 18, 2009)

Hi
Thanx for you input.
Yes, my light i currently a 6p stock incan, but i also have some led-lights (an eagletac p10A2) but the thing is that i just like incans better. 
i will however buy a backup/working horse LED dropin but i will mainly use incan.

OK back to pimpin my 6p: get a LF turbo, get the 1,5 cell extension, get two 18500 IMR and NOT the EO-9 but the HO-9L or EO-9L am i right?

As to sacrifice small-bright or runtime.
Keeping my pimped 6P i got small and bright. Having spare cells will do for runtime. Second: having the [email protected] 85 in my car will backup for future "my light's better than yours" contests.

Don't get me wrong guy's, i'm not the rich teenager thats competing with his friends in the woods for the "more throw" award. Just the opposite, i'm a hard working flashaholic with an expensive hobby and a family to feed. But it was just that i love my hobby and got somewhat angry at an ignorant Mag-owner. 

thank you


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## 325addict (Oct 18, 2009)

"OK back to pimpin my 6p: get a LF turbo, get the 1,5 cell extension, get two 18500 IMR and NOT the EO-9 but the HO-9L or EO-9L am i right?"

partially. You should have a total of "4.5 cell" length. Screwing that 1.5 cell extender onto your 6P will give you a 3.5 cell length. You should START with a 3-cell flashlight, like a 9P or the Seraph with 3 cells. This one won't break the bank, with a bit over $40,- for the Xenon-version.

Then, you need the HO-13 or the EO-13 and THREE 18500s. Three times a "1.5 cell" length cell = 4.5 cells in total.
Each 18500 has 1.5 times the length of what is referred to as 1 cell, that is, a CR123A, which is about 34mm in length.

Starting with a 9P or a 3-cell Seraph AND a 1.5 cell extension will just be good for three 18500s. This way, you need the "13" lamps and not the "9" as these will instaflash with three cells. 9V lamps are designed to work with TWO Li-ion cells.

Indeed, you still need that mini turbo-head.

The HO-13 will give you just an hour of runtime, as you wished. The EO-13 will be far less, not even 40 minutes. But it's WAY brighter, with 700 Lumens instead of 400.... it's up to you which one you want 

EDIT: I just saw TWO things: you require a runtime of only half an hour. The 700 Lumen lamp will fit the bill, AND is the only one that's available still :-(

So, in order to prevent ANY mishap, I will sum the parts up you need:

1. one Seraph SP-9 Xenon 3-cell flashlight, $41,- (and look what's included for that price! Whow!)
2. one EX-R1.5 1.5 cell extender tube $15,-
3. one seraph D36 mini turbo-head $24,-
4. one EO-13 Lamp Assembly $24.99
5. three AW black protected 18500s 1500mAh total $32.97 ($10.99 each)

TOTAL AMOUNT: $137.96 (add shipping costs)

and this also still fits the bill nicely for around $150,- ....

*TAKE CARE when choosing the switch: ONLY the twisty can handle the 2.2A of this lamp!!*

Timmo.


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## Databyter (Oct 19, 2009)

> Are all you guys telling me that it takes a super-state-of-the-art-modded flashlight to beat a 6D Mag?
> Common, that can't be true, just a normal M3 will make mincemeat of a 6D, a M4 will make it forget what to do and it will melt away at the sight of an M6. No need to build a high end hotwire....?!



I guess that's true enough.

But we are contributing to the delinquency of a Flash-o-holics billfold.

And why just beat when you can *BEAT**!*


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## Chrontius (Oct 20, 2009)

I know we're discussing incans, but Elektrolumens builds some real beasts - the Blaster NG should provide a nice D-cell trouncing, and the EDC series are 6P sized, and sling 600 lumens or so.

Don't get me started on the Kong-12, or the FireSword IV.

Don't underestimate the good old ROP for sheer usability. I've gotten close -30 minutes out of my Eneloops on high, though I'll caution against those Kai D li-ions and the ROP-hi. I may have damaged some protection circuits with that.


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## barnefko (Oct 20, 2009)

325addict said:


> So, in order to prevent ANY mishap, I will sum the parts up you need:
> 
> 1. one Seraph SP-9 Xenon 3-cell flashlight, $41,- (and look what's included for that price! Whow!)
> 2. one EX-R1.5 1.5 cell extender tube $15,-
> ...



Thank you very much for this summary.
But as i've decided to keep and pimp my 6P(not bored!) it will be as follows:
1. one seraph D36 mini turbo head
2. one 1 cell extender tube
3. one EO-13 lamp assembly
4. Three IMR 123 (cuts runtime but fits my 6P)

As for the swith i will use the stock 6p switch and twist-on.
Please correct me if i'm wrong.


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## Outdoors Fanatic (Oct 20, 2009)

barnefko said:


> Thank you very much for this summary.
> But as i've decided to keep and pimp my 6P(not bored!) it will be as follows:
> 1. one seraph D36 mini turbo head
> 2. one 1 cell extender tube
> ...


Yes, you can use the stock 6P tailcap with that. You also can run the *IMR-13* lamp assembly for insane output.


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## Juggernaut (Oct 20, 2009)

Outdoors Fanatic said:


> Yes, you can use the stock 6P tailcap with that. You also can run the *IMR-13* lamp assembly for insane output.


 
But it’s possible that the IMR will not out throw a stock Maglite, 16340 cells under drive the IMR lamp because of voltage sag and the IMR version of the EO-13 does not throw as far. Remember The IMR bulb is extremely bright but it is all flood compared to a Maglite’s focused bulb. Could you imagine if this guy shows back up with is dull puny outputting Maglite and it still barely out throws barnefko’s super 9P! Granted he super 9P is way better, the other guy wont care and will still think his light is better. Also max runtime for a the IMR setup is only 6 minuets:green:!


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## Outdoors Fanatic (Oct 20, 2009)

Juggernaut said:


> But it’s possible that the IMR will not out throw a stock Maglite, 16340 cells under drive the IMR lamp because of voltage sag and the IMR version of the EO-13 does not throw as far. Remember The IMR bulb is extremely bright but it is all flood compared to a Maglite’s focused bulb. Could you imagine if this guy shows back up with is dull puny outputting Maglite and it still barely out throws barnefko’s super 9P! Granted he super 9P is way better, the other guy wont care and will still think his light is better. Also max runtime for a the IMR setup is only 6 minuets:green:!


I think that any high-output lamp assembly in a D36mm reflector, is able to out-throw a stock Mag. It would be a different story with if he used the stock 9P bezel, though.


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## GarageBoy (Oct 20, 2009)

Since his brother is rocking a mag, anything that is NOT should do the trick


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## Juggernaut (Oct 20, 2009)

Ok, heres the deal I went out to my car and dusted off the old 6D for this test. I put the 6D “with magnum star output” VS. My Wolf Eyes M90X running an EO-13 off of 3x 18650 cells “fully charges and they sag way less then 16340s”. I set them both up behind my two pairs of 80% tint aviator glasses. One my current EDC, the other has retired from 3 years of survive “worn lens finish”. At 15 feet the clear winner in throw goes to the Maglite:duck:. As surprising as that is, it shouldn’t be. The Mag is going to have just as much surface brightness, a smaller filament, and a larger reflector to catch the light. So we would all rather have the EO-13, but his friend my still parade with the knowledge that he has a farther throwing light. 

EO-13 on left, Mag 6D on right.


 

However it’s not that simple:naughty:………Because I found something that even the most unenlightened fool would drop their jaw for. Let my retired aviator glasses do the talking:







The output on the EO-13 is so mind numbingly intense, that after only 30 seconds of picture taking it had melted the lens on my glasses! So you be the judge, what’s more impressive 20% more throw……or a flashlight that can melt transparent plastic an inch away in under one minuet:devil:!


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## barnefko (Oct 21, 2009)

WOW! Thanx to juggernaut!

As impressive as the EO-13 setup is, your results put me back to the start. Because as mentioned above my b.i.l. will surely state that throw=power, and when he hears how much money i spend on this setup he will just laugh.
I'm just surprised that you can't get more throw with the big reflector of the D36 modules.

Gonna order some IMR-9 and two IMR123 just for fun, the 6P package then looks the same but rocks a good bit more.

Anyway, it seems like i keep my 6p as it is and just have to pack that R.O.P or [email protected] (haven't decided yet) next time we're hunting. The [email protected] 85 is out of question as the 3D setup is way too big, i figured.

Greetings


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## Kestrel (Oct 21, 2009)

Again (as someone has posted earlier I think), the SureFire KT1/KT2 2.5" Turboheads make for awesome throwers, and lego great with most SureFires such as the P-series or C-series. Check the link in my sig for some (LED) beamshots comparing the turbohead to the (smaller) P60-dropin-sized Malkoff M60 & M30. And this is ~200 lumens, if you go incan you can have ~1000 lumens in the same sized package. :devil:

Edit: The walls for those beamshots are only 6-7 feet away, further (outdoor) distances will give much more of an advantage to the turboheads, as there is considerably less beam divergence from the large reflectors.


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## Juggernaut (Oct 21, 2009)

Ok, did a bit more research and if you want to really out throw that 6D Maglite this is what you need. IMR-9 you want to get should out throw you standard SF setup with 10,500 Lux. While the EO-13 will shatter that number with 21,000 Lux “2x more throw”. However as be know that’s still not enough power. Well the HO-M6R “for the M6 and M3 / M4 in the turbo head should smother that 6D Maglite with 39,000 Lux:laughing:! From my comparisons outdoors, it was only slightly noticeable that the Maglite beat out the 21,000 Lux of the EO-13, while 39,000 Lux should demolish it. However I have never owned a Sure Fire So I have know idea how the aftermarket reflectors work for it. I would assume that this bulb would fit them since the (M6, M4, M3) all use the turbo head and it works, but your going to have to check with other people because I have no idea:thinking:.


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## Yavox (Oct 21, 2009)

325addict said:


> So, in order to prevent ANY mishap, I will sum the parts up you need:
> 
> 1. one Seraph SP-9 Xenon 3-cell flashlight, $41,- (and look what's included for that price! Whow!)
> 2. one EX-R1.5 1.5 cell extender tube $15,-
> ...



Could you please estimate the runtime of above setup? Is it regulated or will get dimmer over time? If not regulated - is there any place I can find a review with a chart showing how the output decreases over time?

Adam


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## barnefko (Oct 21, 2009)

Hi
The KT1/KT2 turbohead option is all good and well but it exeeds my budget by far. Inkl tax and shipping to sweden the cheapest KT1 i found was 150€ ! Plus imr-batteries and bulb it gets pretty expensive.

This doesn't look so good to me. 

BTW, is the ultraf*** WF-500 head lego-able? i could otherwise consider the WF-500 host and go the HO-R5 route with two IMR 18650.


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## Outdoors Fanatic (Oct 21, 2009)

Get a KT2 and a HO-M6R, it will completely annihilate your brother's Mag|!


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## Outdoors Fanatic (Oct 21, 2009)

Yavox said:


> Could you please estimate the runtime of above setup? Is it regulated or will get dimmer over time? If not regulated - is there any place I can find a review with a chart showing how the output decreases over time?
> 
> Adam


About solid 40 minutes of pure bright incan goodness.


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## Linger (Oct 21, 2009)

SureFire P91 with 2x AW IMR 16340's is hella bright.
(I just received the SF P91 yesterday, wanted to try it out. Not the same as a WA1111, but, significantly better throw.) So if the Lumensfactory IMR (d26) are comperable to SF lamps, your 9v 500 lumens lumensfactory will win your battle handedly.
(just rember what I said about extra drop-ins + cells on your person. Runtime on IMR set-ups is low, ~10minutes, use another set or a few sets for other situations)


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## ruriimasu (Oct 21, 2009)

OP, i share how you feel. refer to my previous post on why i prefer warm tint.

you can still use led but maybe warm tint. nowadays, i carry a fenix tk20 if i had to go into the woods or any place where throw may be needed.


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## ruriimasu (Oct 21, 2009)

Linger said:


> For bragging rights, I say if at all possible Keep the same torch, in this case your P60. You can't really claim victory on the field if you show up with a new army. Keep the SF P form factor. But do some work on it.



yeah Linger is right. try to stick to smallish lights that out-throw, out-run and out-power his huge stick. :devil: this method of revenge will be sweet. but sorry, i cant advise on any suitable lights that fit this criteria :shrug:


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## GarageBoy (Oct 22, 2009)

SF91 is not the P91 is it?


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## TRDmatrix (Oct 22, 2009)

I haven't tried this item from Fivemega but I think this might be something that can help you out
Fivemega's turbo "c" head
If anybody has one of these bad boys I would like to know more aboit them too


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## Juggernaut (Oct 22, 2009)

GarageBoy said:


> SF91 is not the P91 is it?


 
Same thing, SF just means Sure Fire:thumbsup:.


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## Josey (Oct 23, 2009)

I am shocked. You guys have this all wrong. The problem has nothing to do with runtime or practicality. This is purely about who can pee the farthest. And are you kidding me, a Mag 6D? 160 lumens? What's the issue? 

In that situation -- which as a loyal PETA member I never would be in -- I'd have JS's TigerLight 11Rechargeable, fully regulated 700 or so lumens for a long runtime. I'd also pepper him with it, but lucky for him mine's the prison version.

But you already have a practical light, and that's not what we want.

Here's what you do: Work yourself into a similar situation, making sure your P6 cells are heavily drained. Then let your B-I-L haul out his 6D honker and dazzle you with its crappy beam of 160 lumens.

Then you say, "Wait, that's not quite enough." And you pull your Mag623 (or 458) out of your pack and light up the night with 4000 (or 8,000) lumens. Then you light a cigarette with it and enjoy a satisfying smoke -- unless you want to use it to start a campfire first. You might even want to shine it on his butt when he's not looking. I would.


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## Kestrel (Oct 23, 2009)

IMO folks aren't focusing (if you'll pardon the pun) on the real issue, a high degree of throw is needed (especially for the 'great outdoors'), not just high output. Also, what's the point of burying his Mag with another Mag? Much more effective to stomp a big Mag with a 'little' light:

SureFire Turbohead on a little 9P
aspheric lens on same
Edit:
Sorry, posted in a rush & included a reference to a SF LX2 w/ TIR.
Edited to keep the focus on incan...


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## Kestrel (Oct 23, 2009)

(double post)


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## Juggernaut (Oct 23, 2009)

Kestrel said:


> IMO folks aren't focusing (if you'll pardon the pun) on the real issue, a high degree of throw is needed, not just high output. Also, what's the point of burying his mag with another Mag? Much more dramatic to stomp a big Mag with a 'little' light:
> 
> SureFire turbohead on a little 9P
> aspheric lens on same
> ...


 
I don’t think a TIR optic Sure Fire would have a chance, the Task Force has a similar “except larger and more focused version” and it can’t touch a 6D Maglite. As people are stating what I was stating earlier: Throw is more important then power here, and as sad as it is to say; CPFers are just underestimating the 6D Maglite:green:. Yah it’s performance isn’t that great but it is a throw monster. Something like a P7 just won’t cut it. My Tiablo A9 can’t even out throw it “with the aspheric lens it will easily”. You need at least 25,000 Lux. Which makes any standard size reflector light impractical, even if you have it packed with IMR cells and 1185 bulbs! I wouldn’t beat his Mag with another Mag, just buy a super LED thrower like the Raptor or A10.


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## Linger (Oct 23, 2009)

Throw eh? I got the impression they were in the woods, not much distance available. Eitherway K, you might want to focus on the title of the OP's thread and draw some inspiration from the notation between 'case:' and 'needed.'

Sure its a smaller reflector, but I put a spot on an electrical substation 200f away with [email protected]'s.


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## Juggernaut (Oct 23, 2009)

Double


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## Juggernaut (Oct 23, 2009)

Linger said:


> Throw eh? I got the impression they were in the woods, not much distance available. Eitherway K, you might want to focus on the title of the OP's thread and draw some inspiration from the notation between 'case:' and 'needed.'
> 
> Sure its a smaller reflector, but I put a spot on an electrical substation 200f away with [email protected]'s.


 
We all know that throw isn’t going to be the most useful thing in the woods but as the OP stated: the light must out throw his buddies Mag or his friend will think his light is superior:shakehead. 



> As impressive as the EO-13 setup is, your results put me back to the start. Because as mentioned above my b.i.l. will surely state that throw=power, and when he hears how much money i spend on this setup he will just laugh.


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## Kestrel (Oct 23, 2009)

Sorry, my bad, posted in a rush & forgot where I was... 
Edited previous post.

I still stand by the SureFire KT-series Turbohead, just read DM51's fantastic rechargeable SureFire M6 thread (with all those amazing beamshots). There is no way that any bulb in a P60-sized drop-in can compare with essentially the same maximum outputs in that much larger 2.5" reflector in the TH. I also respectfully defer to Juggernaut on this, he has done a heck of a lot with high outputs and/or large reflector configurations and knows their strengths and limitations.


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## Kestrel (Oct 23, 2009)

Linger said:


> Some people speak highly of the P91. But FM sunlight can top it handily. You could pull it off with 2ximr16340's, but if you went 3 cells there's obviously more power.





Linger said:


> Sure its a smaller reflector, but I put a spot on an electrical substation 200f away with [email protected]'s.


So if the Sunlight with a WA1185 (for example) tops the P91 handily as you state above, why not put that same WA1185 in a 2.5" SF Turbohead and create a throw monster that will defeat the throw of the "stock" Mag 6D? (BTW, are we talking about the stock Whitestar bulb or the Xenon MagnumStar bulb upgrade?)

Jug, your opinions on this matchup for maximum lux?




Linger said:


> It'd totally recommend a multi-die *led* emitter for emergency circumstances that require high output and long run-time





Linger said:


> Carry another lamp assembly (or multi-die *led* drop-in:twothumbs)





Linger said:


> Eitherway K, you might want to focus on the title of the OP's thread and draw some inspiration from the notation between 'case:' and 'needed.'


(emphasis added)

A big +1 here to you contradicting yourself. 
Sheesh, at least 10 minutes after I posted (& left) I made a mental note to myself that I needed to drop the LED / TIR reference from my earlier post.... :shakehead


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## Juggernaut (Oct 23, 2009)

Kestrel said:


> So if the Sunlight with a WA1185 (for example) tops the P91 handily as you state above, why not put that same WA1185 in a 2.5" SF Turbohead and create a throw monster that will defeat the throw of the "stock" Mag 6D? (BTW, are we talking about the stock Whitestar bulb or the Xenon MagnumStar bulb upgrade?)
> 
> Jug, your opinions on this matchup for maximum lux?


 
Honestly the EO-13 was quite close to the 6D Maglite output, and I only have the higher outputting “xenon type bulb” output available, so it is possible for the EO-13 to beat out his “stock” light, but they would be pretty close. As for as your suggestion for something like a 1185 in a S.F. Turbo head, well that should smoke him, however I have no experience with it. By rights the 1185 should perform similar “not the exact same” but about the same as in a Maglite head so it would by commonsense beat out the OP’s friends light. But The OP could just use one of the LF lamp assemblies I posted previously for a easier build, however the 1185 would be much brighter:thumbsup:.


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## ampdude (Oct 24, 2009)

Also, I guess nobody has mentioned, but a $15 12V 2mcp spotlight will blow away a $30 6D Mag and it will be a lot smaller.

The Mag will have the runtime advantage though unless the spotlight is corded.

Also, when you're in the big outdoors, reflector size is everything. And smooth reflectors perform better than sputtered ones.

I have a lot of Surefire lights, but I don't try to use them as spotlights, because that is not their purpose or what they were made for. When there is something I want to see in the middle of the parking lot across the intersection, I'm reaching for my $9.97 Vector 1mcp spotlight I bought at Lowe's a few years ago, not my trusty old Surefire C3.


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## Linger (Oct 26, 2009)

Well, I didn't use your full name, just thought a little  might help.



Kestrel said:


> So if the Sunlight with a WA1185 (for example) tops the P91 handily as you state above, why not put that same WA1185 in a 2.5" SF Turbohead and create a throw monster that will defeat the throw of the "stock" Mag 6D?


Sure, seems so to me. I'm the rookie on this though, right?



Kestrel said:


> A big +1 here to you contradicting yourself.


Hrm, re-read that, I hold to my comments. I did emphasize the incan options, I made several incan recommendations that I believe will satisfy OP's request. Yup, I had a few other comments in there, but I believe they are justified given the nature of the OP's situation - needing a high power option yet faced with real world constraints of possibly needing high output/long run-time to find group members or return to camp if they over-stay their time in the forest.
So if I've offended you or appear to have contradicted myself, I request you re-read it. I feel I have properly balanced several incan suggestions in an incan forum with additional emergency / practicality guidance that I am compelled to include with telling someone to go for a walk in the woods with a set-up that only has one mode and 10 minutes run-time.


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## Kestrel (Oct 26, 2009)

Hey there, not a problem. Just wanted to tease you for your LED references since you teased me for my mentioning it by accident. 

I totally agree with you BTW, a 5-10 minute flamethrower does not make for a 'walk in the woods' flashlight:

In the grand CPF tradition, carry two. :huh:


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## KiwiMark (Oct 26, 2009)

Kestrel said:


> In the grand CPF tradition, carry two. :huh:



Only two?


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## Kestrel (Oct 26, 2009)

KiwiMark said:


> Only two?


Well, to begin with, I mean... :naughty:


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## turbodog (Oct 26, 2009)

Most people here on CPF underestimate the mag series of lights.

It's funny how hard you are having to try to find something to "blow away" a common alkaline-fuelled light that I can buy at wal-mart/etc.

Even finding something to do it at all is fairly hard. Then when light cost, battery cost, and runtime are figured in..... it's pretty clear the mag can't be beat. Hehe...

If the 6d is around 200 lumens, you will need at least 400 lumens to really make a statement. Remember, light intensity to your eye is logarithmic... dimishing returns....

Your best bet might be to mod another 6d model. Then you can make him think he got a crummy one. Tell him it's been ported, balanced, blueprinted, and has custom headers.


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## KiwiMark (Oct 26, 2009)

turbodog said:


> Your best bet might be to mod another 6d model. Then you can make him think he got a crummy one. Tell him it's been ported, balanced, blueprinted, and has custom headers.



I don't think that there is a great need to mod a 6D - if you mod a 2D and use 2 x Li-ion cells then you can match the voltage easily and you can run brighter bulbs (ROP low or high, bi-pin hotwires).

He gets out his 6D so you get out your 2D. 
Start with: "Awww, yours is bigger - how much brighter is it?" 
Followed by: "Oh, mine is brighter - are your batteries OK?" :devil:
Then next time: "You've got fresh batteries now . . . hmmm, mine still seems much brighter - maybe your bulb is failing?" 
.
.
.
"Mine's still brighter - did you get one of those cheap Krypton bulbs or one of the good Xenon ones?"
.
.
.
"Hmmm, it still doesn't match mine - maybe alkaline batteries just don't deliver enough power, I'm using rechargeables in mine!"
.
.
.

I don't know how long you could keep it up, but why have a brother if you can't wind him up? And every time you are just using a little 2D to blow away his enormous 6D. 
Of course if you really want to blow his 6D away you could try building a 3D like mine: https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/246499


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## lctorana (Oct 26, 2009)

KiwiMark said:


> I don't think that there is a great need to mod a 6D - if you mod a 2D and use 2 x Li-ion cells then you can match the voltage easily and you can run brighter bulbs (ROP low or high, bi-pin hotwires).


Ah, but with a 6D you don't have to limit yourself to 8V.

I have two 6D Mags. One is completely stock, with MagStar Xenon bulb and D NiCads. I love it. It's a fabulous piece of kit, and I enjoy it as its maker intended.

The other has a 21AA battery carrier with high current cells and an Osram 64640 150W bulb. With well over 2,700 out-the-front torch lumens, I love that, too.

But back on topic for a suggestion - how about 6 x NiMH cells powering a 5761?

That will give well over 1000 bulb lumens and still give well over an hour's runtime, provided you do your heatsinking homework.


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## barnefko (Oct 27, 2009)

Hi
i got lots of input here, had several change of minds but i think i finally decided.
To see it the tactical way i will do as follows:
You can't charge a fully machine-gun fortified guerrila position (cheap but effective) with only well trained infantry that just have regular assault rifles without suffering high losses, or high costs in my case.

Sure, you could buy the most expensive assault rifles, give them hand grenades, get a sniper involved, etc etc etc. But the effect/losses factor won't be the best

But honestly, why not call for backup and ask the artillery to smoke 'em out. After the mess is done you go in with your infantry. 
I wouldn't consider this changing the army as postet above, lets say changing your tacticts - and hey, isn't that what its all about? 


Translation: i ordered all stuff for a backup R.O.P (Artillery) which is to keep in my backpack, and continue with my bombproof P6 on my belt. Of course i also ordered 4 IMR123 and one LF HO-9 bulb. That way i got mobility,durability and throw if needed.


thank you all


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## Kestrel (Oct 27, 2009)

Kestrel said:


> In the grand CPF tradition, carry two. :huh:





barnefko said:


> a backup R.O.P (Artillery) which is to keep in my backpack, and continue with my bombproof P6 on my belt.


:thumbsup:
The 2D ROP will bury his 6-D, and is far lighter to boot, with very adequate runtime.


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## TRDmatrix (Oct 27, 2009)

barnefko said:


> Hi
> Translation: i ordered all stuff for a backup R.O.P (Artillery) which is to keep in my backpack, and continue with my bombproof P6 on my belt. Of course i also ordered 4 IMR123 and one LF HO-9 bulb. That way i got mobility,durability and throw if needed.



I like the decision you came to. I love my ROP and I'm pretty sure you will too.

I would play it just like KiwiMark's scenario and when you brother in law finally catches up, you can just throw on a version 2 deep reflector by fivemega. The deep reflector alters the look of a stock mag a little bit but increases the throw quite a bit.

If you don't mind altering the look of a stock mag, you might even want to consider FM's 2.5" throwmaster or his 3" turbo heads.


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## Outdoors Fanatic (Oct 27, 2009)

Any type of ROP will put a stock Mag 6D to total shame.


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## barnefko (Nov 11, 2009)

Hi

I just want to share my personal 2happy end" with you. We, my brother in law and i, were out for a hunting trip last weekend.

Just let me say it like this:

- [email protected] R.O.P: 80$
- Some items from lumensfactory for my 6P: 50$
- several flashlights i purchased because of endless nights lurking around the forums: 170$
- the look on his face oo: ......... priceless

by the way: hes out now searching for a 2D and a krypton bulb (just told him mine's a 2d with a different bulb  )

Thanx for alll your recommendations - my R.O.P is my absolute favorite!!!


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## KiwiMark (Nov 11, 2009)

barnefko said:


> by the way: hes out now searching for a 2D and a krypton bulb (just told him mine's a 2d with a different bulb  )



Let us know how round 3 goes when he tries to take a 2D with krypton* bulb against your ROP!


* Or do you mean Xenon - the krypton bulb is the standard one and the xenon one is the brighter mag bulb.


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## Kestrel (Nov 11, 2009)

barnefko said:


> by the way: hes out now searching for a 2D and a krypton bulb (just told him mine's a 2d with a different bulb  )
> 
> Thanx for alll your recommendations - my R.O.P is my absolute favorite!!!





KiwiMark said:


> Let us know how round 3 goes when he tries to take a 2D with krypton* bulb against your ROP!
> * Or do you mean Xenon - the krypton bulb is the standard one and the xenon one is the brighter mag bulb.


That's going to be great when he brings out his 'upgraded' Mag and is still stomped by your 2D. Good job.


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## Outdoors Fanatic (Nov 11, 2009)

barnefko said:


> Hi
> 
> I just want to share my personal 2happy end" with you. We, my brother in law and i, were out for a hunting trip last weekend.
> 
> ...


Did you use a ROP High or ROP Low against his light?


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## barnefko (Nov 12, 2009)

We were in the woods and i had the high bulb installed, not so much throw but man, woods just were "on fire" - so cool and really useful to work with!


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## SFG2Lman (Nov 12, 2009)

convert to LED its cheap long burning pure white lumens...white always looks bright in comparison...you know you want to...


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## UnderTheWeepingMoon (Nov 12, 2009)

Congrats to the OP. Nice to hear your prank was successful. :devil:



SFG2Lman said:


> convert to LED its cheap long burning pure white lumens...white always looks bright in comparison...you know you want to...



I think that incan's still have plenty of life left in them. The surface brightness of LEDs doesn't yet match good hotwires so they won't throw as far in a given reflector. The cool white tint of standard (non high-CRI) LED light is also washed out by full-spectrum incan light at similar brightness levels. High-CRI LEDs are improving but they still have a fair way to go in terms of efficiency and surface brightness.


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## fyrstormer (Nov 12, 2009)

barnefko said:


> ...


Hey barn, I noticed your location and I felt the need to point out: it's dark EVERYWHERE six months out of the year! 

(just not all at once :devil


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## 325addict (Nov 12, 2009)

I remember, when I just joined CPF, I started a thread, "there's nothing wrong with a Maglite" or something like that.
People here argued that they:
1. suffer from beam irregularities
2. yes, have 10 hours runtime, but after 1 hour output is only 50%
3. etc etc

I argued, that throw of a Magcharger couldn't be topped by my C3 Centurion, not just by a little bit difference, and those beam artifacts, well, is it a problem in real life, other than shining on a wall, and that if you used rechargeables, the diminishing output is really tolerable (far less).

Then some people accused me of trolling and baiting, others said: "he clearly likes his Maglites!" 
And that's it... I like them for their good all-day properties. When I need a small, bright light with perfect beam well.... none of my Mags come into mind. When I go into the woods, one of the FIRST that comes to my mind is my MagCharger (and a second one as a backup)
Yes, they're heavy, but... they make up with very good performance indeed 

Overviewing this thread, I now see how difficult it is to buy a _standard_ light other than those 50W 5-minutes-runtime monsters that outshines a Mag 6D.... so they still have a reason that they exist 

Timmo (owning no Mag larger than 3D)


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## KiwiMark (Nov 12, 2009)

325addict said:


> When I go into the woods, one of the FIRST that comes to my mind is my MagCharger



For me it would be my Maglite 2D ROP low - 2 hours of runtime and all the output and throw that you need for going into the woods at night. With the good colour rendition of the incan - especially with all the greens & browns, it actually seems brighter than what you would get from an LED with the same Lumen output.

Maglites seriously kick butt!


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## 325addict (Nov 12, 2009)

@ Kiwimark:

I think it's time for me to order a 2D -> 6AA adapter from Mdocod.

I've heard soooo many good things about the ROP, either low or high, that I really should try it. I already have the necessary 2D host....

As you already built one: what ROP lamp should I use? Is the HIGH not too hot for the standard reflector and lens and switch? If so, is the LOW compatible with the standard Mag reflector/lens?

I also have more than enough good quality Varta 2700mAh professional AA NiMH batteries... so all I need is that adapter and the lamps... I hope 

Indeed, Mags seriously kick... even the standard AA minimag has it's purposes... ever tried to turn on a C3 Centurion at night in your tent?

 and blind as a bat you are 

Better use the AA minimag here :thumbsup:

Timmo.


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## KiwiMark (Nov 12, 2009)

325addict said:


> As you already built one: what ROP lamp should I use? Is the HIGH not too hot for the standard reflector and lens and switch? If so, is the LOW compatible with the standard Mag reflector/lens?



The low will work with the standard reflector & lens, but only in short bursts. The high will generate too much heat and would not be safe with the plastic. The switch will be fine with either.

A glass lens is only a few dollars - well under $10
An Aluminium reflector is under $15, or you could get a really good one: https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/247685

The low will give a little over twice the run time, the high will give a little over twice the Lumen output. The low is really good for most tasks, the high is good for wowing others.


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## mdocod (Nov 12, 2009)

ROP should be fun and make the point 

I would have suggested a 3x18650 powered build with a D36 head. It would have been a bit long, but still much smaller than the 6D mag it would be competing with. You could run the HO-13 and blow away the mag with ~double the lumens, and when your bro tries to pull the "mine throws further" game you just wash the 6D completely out of the picture with the EO-13 or IMR-13. In that setup you have a low output lamp that would run for ~90+ minutes on the 3x18650. 

Regardless, this discussion has been an interesting read and certainly reminds us that there are challenges that aren't as easy to overcome as they would seem at first thought..

Reminds me of a quote that a friend of mine likes to use, I think it is very applicable to the large 6D with large reflector vs something "small and brighter.":

"The only replacement for cubic inches is rectangular dollars" -someone

-Eric


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## mvyrmnd (Nov 13, 2009)

I just put my Ultrafire WF500 

http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.1317

up against a friends stock 6D mag.

Cheap, smallish, blows the hell out of the Mag.


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## poormanq45 (Nov 14, 2009)

I'm going to laugh when you B.I.L discovers a ROP and realizes that he can just change the lens, reflector, and bulb and he'll match you... LOL


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## mdocod (Nov 15, 2009)

poormanq45 said:


> I'm going to laugh when you B.I.L discovers a ROP and realizes that he can just change the lens, reflector, and bulb and he'll match you... LOL



He'll have to invest in about $100-$150 worth of NIMH D cells and a charger also. Not quite that simple 

Ask anyone who has tried driving an ROP bulb on alks just how well that worked out. 

-Eric


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## poormanq45 (Nov 15, 2009)

Is that due to voltage sag?

If so, would two sets of 3S2P carriers for a total start of 9v support it? That would double your theoretical load capacity


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## 325addict (Nov 20, 2009)

@ Kiwimark: what if I took the LOW-lamp and replaced the lens with the glass one from the MagCharger? I have several at hand... will the stock reflector not melt under longer use?

Thanks,


Timmo.


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## KiwiMark (Nov 20, 2009)

325addict said:


> @ Kiwimark: what if I took the LOW-lamp and replaced the lens with the glass one from the MagCharger? I have several at hand... will the stock reflector not melt under longer use?



For 2 or 3 minute bursts it would probably be OK. But for longer use it would be better to get an aluminium reflector.


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## 325addict (Nov 20, 2009)

and who sells them?

Timmo.


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## KiwiMark (Nov 20, 2009)

325addict said:


> and who sells them?



Fivemega does specialty ones:
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/247685

There are also cheaper basic ones at kaidomain.com


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