# Would a light like this cure Norland 61???



## jcompton (Sep 7, 2007)

See post #4.

Would a UV light like this cure Norland 61... http://cgi.ebay.com/UV-LAMP-ULTRAVI...ryZ53149QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

The Norland website states that:
"NOA 61 is cured by ultraviolet light with maximum absorption within the range of 320-380 nanometers with peak sensitivity around 365nm. The recommended energy required for full cure is 3 Joules/sq. cm in these wavelengths."


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## scott.cr (Sep 7, 2007)

How much surface area and depth are you trying to cure?

3 Joules/cm² is quite a bit of energy for a battery-powered device; you'd probably be better off using something powered by the mains.


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## jcompton (Sep 7, 2007)

scott.cr said:


> How much surface area and depth are you trying to cure?
> 
> 3 Joules/cm² is quite a bit of energy for a battery-powered device; you'd probably be better off using something powered by the mains.


 
Just enough surface area to fit a 1.5mm x 5mm trit vial into a bezel.


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## jcompton (Sep 21, 2007)

How about this one???

https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/174158

Someone please try this...


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## TxTroubleMaker (Sep 24, 2007)

I've been using Norland 61 to mount the same size trit vials as you and good ol' sunlight has worked like a charm. Direct light cures it nice and hard in about one and a half to two hours.


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## tino_ale (Oct 9, 2008)

Hi all,

I am desperately seeking a light to cure Norland 61. I've been looking for the Nichia 365nm high power LED but it just seem unobtainable, plus it would be very expensive (around $100 for the emitter if my information is correct?).

I don't have access to direct sunlight in my appartment, plus here at this time of the year the weather sucks and I don't want to wait a week for the sun to show up and cure my vials :shrug:

So, what can I do?

I have found this little device http://maxmax.com/aUVLedLights.htm
But I have no idea if it will be powerfull enough to cure Norland in less than a minute/couple of minute. So far it is the only affordable 365nm UV source I have found. It's not cheap though.

Anyone know if it will work?

Thanks!!


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## d1dd1 (Oct 9, 2008)

I use a simple & cheap UV curing lamp for fingernails (from my gf ).
Works great, N61 hardens in seconds with this.


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## tino_ale (Oct 9, 2008)

d1dd1 said:


> I use a simple & cheap UV curing lamp for fingernails (from my gf ).
> Works great, N61 hardens in seconds with this.


I NEED to know where can I get one?? 
Thanks!!


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## d1dd1 (Oct 9, 2008)

not sure, try ebay search for uv lamp or nail art or something like this :naughty:

edit: for example this not exactly what I have but works similar but I think a single 9W bulb instead of 4 would do the job, too


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## tino_ale (Oct 9, 2008)

d1dd1 said:


> not sure, try ebay search for uv lamp or nail art or something like this :naughty:
> 
> edit: for example this not exactly what I have but works similar but I think a single 9W bulb instead of 4 would do the job, too


the link doesn't work :shrug:

are these UV lamp have a fluorescent-tube-like look? Like the one usually sold as "dark light" to check money?


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## d1dd1 (Oct 9, 2008)

Sorry for the non-working link, it's ebay item number 350106521367 (put it in the ebay search)


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## tino_ale (Oct 9, 2008)

"Unfortunately, access to this particular item has been blocked due to legal restrictions in some countries." I still can't see it 
But I've found it with google. So, basically this is UV bulbs, right?

Strange because I have a UV lamp but it doesn't cure Norland properly. Basically it will cure most of it, but then a thin layer remains un-cured at the surface. That's a problem since the nice surface finish is exactly what I'm seeking by using Norland...

I guess I'll have to try another lamp and hope it has the proper wavelengh.

If anyone know if the UV lamp I've posted would work?

thanks!!


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## jch79 (Oct 9, 2008)

Alex,
You have to order the Nichia UV LED (#NCSU033A) directly from Nichia (they probably have a sales representative in France). I did without a problem - it's pricey, but effective. :thumbsup:
:wave: john


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## tino_ale (Oct 9, 2008)

jch79 said:


> Alex,
> You have to order the Nichia UV LED (#NCSU033A) directly from Nichia (they probably have a sales representative in France). I did without a problem - it's pricey, but effective. :thumbsup:
> :wave: john


May I ask you how much you paid for it? I've been browsing Nichia's website but I can't find any contact in France. I've sent an inquiry though, we'll see but I'm worried about the price.

I suppose I could give a try to the UV pen I've linked above but if it's not powerfull enough to cure Norland it'll be $60 waited.


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## jch79 (Oct 9, 2008)

Alex-
$125 oo:
john

EDIT: If it helps, I dealt with Heather Irvin at Nicha US - you could try dropping her an email. heather(DOT)irvin(AT)nichia(DOT)com


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## tx101 (Oct 9, 2008)

I left my vial/piston on my window sill and left it there for two days.
It was not in direct sunlight .... I guess it just takes a little longer without direct sunlight


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## TranquillityBase (Oct 9, 2008)

Price per LED for the Nichia UV drops considerably, if you purchase 5 or more...Maybe gets some peeps together for a 'group purchase'


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## jch79 (Oct 9, 2008)

That TB fella - always thinking. :tinfoil:
:wave: john


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## TranquillityBase (Oct 9, 2008)

> jch79 said:
> 
> 
> > That TB fella - always thinking. :tinfoil:
> > :wave: john


 
Correction...That TB fella - always thinking about vacation. :tinfoil: Work is overrated:green:


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## jch79 (Oct 9, 2008)

:devil:


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## RocketTomato (Oct 9, 2008)

jcompton said:


> How about this one???
> 
> https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/174158
> 
> Someone please try this...




I just noticed the date of the original post. Jcompton eventually found the answer in November 2007.


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## cheetokhan (Oct 9, 2008)

I have an UltraFire WF502B UV light from DX. I don't have any way of measuring the wavelength, but I can tell you it is very powerfull and easily lights up UV reactive items from across the room. 
Costs less than $20.


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## GLOCK18 (Oct 9, 2008)

*The best LED for what you want to do.*

*Nichia 365 nm LED UV-LED has an output power of 100 mW at a drive current of 500 mA at 4.6 V.*
*NCCU033E 365nm 100mw*

*I am planing on building a light with 3 NCCU033E.*


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## GLOCK18 (Oct 9, 2008)

*The best LED for what you want to do.*

*Nichia 365 nm LED UV-LED has an output power of 100 mW at a drive current of 500 mA at 4.6 V.*
*NCCU033E 365nm 100mw*

*I am planing on building a light with 3 NCCU033E.*


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## darkzero (Oct 9, 2008)

Purchasing a proper UV light seems costly for what it will be used for. Why not just purchase a Mercury vapor bulb? I purchased one from bulborama for $20 + shipping & it is self ballasted so it would work in a standard incandescent lamp. HID mecury lamp not needed.

Or try your local reptile store. There's bulbs for reptiles that give off UV that should work too.


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## JohnnyDeep (Oct 9, 2008)

If you plan to do a lot of UV curing, this is an excellent choice.
http://uvp.com/handheldlamps.html. I use the UVL-56 from UVP in Upland, CA.
365 nm, 6 W. Cures the Norland 61 in a few minutes.


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## tino_ale (Oct 10, 2008)

Thanks everyone for the ideas. :grouphug:

I need to correct my previous post : the UV handheld tube lamp I have does cure norland 61, it just takes a long time. I tried on a small drop, and tested hardness and timed the process. It took about 1 hour to make it as hard as it can get. The drop becomes solid quite rapidly (a few minutes is enough) but the surface takes *much* longer to become non-tacky or wet.

I've installed orange vials in my SPY 007  and I LOVE it!!
I couldn't believe how easy it is to work with Norland. Viscosity is ideal and it has a great ability to "wet" and fill any gap betweel the vial and the pocket. Didn't coat the vials first, I just poured the Norland in and drop after drop it filled the pocket nicely, leveled itself in seconds. I took all the time I needed to precisely center vials. I used a 1ml seringue to do this. Then double checked everythink was perfect and started the curing process.

Some pics later on 
The vials now look like they were in a small thub, full of water :thumbsup:

So : I can cure norland, but what I've got is not ideal at all. Too long to cure.

I may buy the Arc-AAA UV flashlight but it seems it is sold out :shrug:

I've given up with Nichia's high power LED, it's too expensive, a pain to find and it's surface mounted emitter, not the easiest to work with.

Now looking for an Arc AAA UV flashlight


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## tino_ale (Oct 13, 2008)




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## tpchan (Nov 19, 2008)

I've been following your search with some interest as I'm about to install some trits with Norland 61 and I'm trying to find a UV light sources as well, without breaking the bank. I've ordered from ebay, a "375nm UV Ultraviolet LED Flashlight Pocket size 1 AAA" for $10 US, shipped. The dealer there has multiple listings with that text so it shouldn't be too hard to find. I'll post back here after mine arrives to let everyone else know whether it works or not. There is also available from Amazon.com the "Streamlight 51010 Twin-Task 3C 9 inch UV Flashlight" that has 3 UV leds at 375nm and another 3 UV leds at 390nm plus a Xenon bulb for white light, but it costs $43. I'll try the $10 single led UV light first. 375nm should still be in the range to cure the Norland 61.


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## Anglepoise (Nov 19, 2008)

I see the Arc UV light is still out of stock. This is the one I want as we know for sure it has the correct wavelength to cure Norland 61.

Am going to email them today to find out when they anticipate stock.


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## tpchan (Nov 19, 2008)

The Arc UV light is listed on their web page as a 375nm led, one AAA battery light. Feel free to keep waiting for a $40 light to come back in stock, while several other alternatives with the same 375nm UV led(s) are available right now. The Norland 61 web page (http://www.norlandprod.com/adhesives/NOA 61.html) also says it cures with UV in the range of 320 to 380 nm with peak sensitivity at 365nm, so 375nm is good but still not ideal.


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## Ray1968 (Nov 19, 2008)

I used a good old fashion 70's style black light to cure Norland 61. Takes about 30 minutes. This was at the advice of a Norland tech I spoke with several days ago when I had the same question. I had one stashed away in my closet for years.


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## tino_ale (Nov 19, 2008)

Anglepoise said:


> I see the Arc UV light is still out of stock. This is the one I want as we know for sure it has the correct wavelength to cure Norland 61.
> 
> Am going to email them today to find out when they anticipate stock.



Please keep us posted on that. Be carefull there has been 3 different type of emitters in the ARC UV in the past, be sure to double check what wevelenght they would have in stock.


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## Anglepoise (Nov 19, 2008)

tino_ale said:


> Please keep us posted on that. Be carefull there has been 3 different type of emitters in the ARC UV in the past, be sure to double check what wevelenght they would have in stock.



Good point,.....the next batch could have a different emitter. I will check.


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## qwertyydude (Nov 20, 2008)

I think the 502b uv led 3w from DX would work. It may not be the perfect spectrum, but I know that it is a very wide spectrum UV and when direct driven at 800 ma it is powerful enough to feel the heat of the uv. I don't have norland adhesive but I did have a uv windshield chip repair glue. It dried that stuff in about 5 minutes. at a distance of 1". It's about twice as fast as direct sunlight and that's here in sunny sunny southern california where every day is a dangerous uv day, so much so that the news doesn't even report it anymore.


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## kitelights (Nov 21, 2008)

The best for curing are florescent UV bulbs. The higher the wattage (larger bulbs) the better. 

Here in the states, the best source is WalMart for the cheapest highly usable fixture and bulb for $10. 

You can also use the thinner shorter UV tubes (4, 6, & 12 inches) in battery powered fixtures also available in WalMart, Lowes, etc. The UV tubes used in bug zappers are generally the proper wavelength, too.

Sunlight at it's height in the summer is great, but low and in the winter can be an 80% difference in UV.

I've used UV to cure resins in my business for 19 years and I've tried a lot of different lights. I'm not familiar with the Norland (except that 365 is the proper wave length to cure it), but with my resins, it is important for a good cure that the UV source be fairly intense, especially for the initial cure. 

Most resins have inhibitors built in so that they stop curing after a period of time. With a mickey mouse UV source, you may get what appears to be a good cure, particularly on the outside to the touch, but it isn't completely cured and after a short while, it won't finish curing. Your curing lamp is important. A 5mm LED will not do a proper job.


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## tino_ale (Nov 21, 2008)

kitelights said:


> Most resins have inhibitors built in so that they stop curing after a period of time. With a mickey mouse UV source, you may get what appears to be a good cure, particularly on the outside to the touch, but it isn't completely cured and after a short while, it won't finish curing. Your curing lamp is important. A 5mm LED will not do a proper job.


Any idea what is the maximum duration one should not exceed to be sure the curing is complete?

Some here have reported the Arc UV (5mm led) curing norland in just a matter of minutes. But I don't know which version they were using. One of the versions was exactly 365nm.


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## RocketTomato (Nov 21, 2008)

Every UV sensitive compound is different due to the different polymer chemistries involved. Norland will continue to cure while exposed to UV light until it is fully cross-linked so there is no harm in overexposing it. Norland will cure fine with lower power LED UV lights, but it will just take longer.

However, the polymer (and more likely, you yourself) can be damaged by the ozone generated by the UV lights, especially the high power ones, so it is best to use the UV lights in a well ventilated area.

The cure time can vary based on the UV light wavelength, intensity, how far the light is from the Norland, and the amount of Norland that you are trying to cure.

Straight from the Norland website:



> *Heat Aging*
> 
> Glass doublets bonded with NOA 60 and NOA 61 were placed in an oven @ 50°C for 3 years and judged for deterioration and discoloration. During this time no separations or voids appeared in the doublets and no discoloration was visible. If we assume that for every 10° rise in temperature, the effect of aging doubles, then this would be equal to 24 years of room temperature aging.
> 
> ...



Overall, the Norland optical adhesives really have some great properties, including their impressive clarity and transparency.


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## RocketTomato (Nov 21, 2008)

Anglepoise said:


> Good point,.....the next batch could have a different emitter. I will check.



I emailed Arc about 10 days ago, asking when the Arc AAA-UV would be back in stock. Maria responded saying they were unsure as to when or *if* they would have them in stock again and to keep checking the website.


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## tino_ale (Nov 22, 2008)

RocketTomato said:


> I emailed Arc about 10 days ago, asking when the Arc AAA-UV would be back in stock. Maria responded saying they were unsure as to when or *if* they would have them in stock again and to keep checking the website.



That's a bad news for us :sigh:

I have found these. I sent an email asking if the light was regulated, answer is they are direct drivent through a resistor :shrug: I guess the 4x365nm version is still a good option as a curing UV source.


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## Splat_NJ (Dec 8, 2008)

Would this light be sufficient for Norland 61 for gid on small areas for most small tactical lights?: http://www.blacklightworld.com/6_inch_pocket_blacklite.htm


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## nailbender (Dec 9, 2008)

Wayne at the Sandwich Shoppe has these cree UV emitters on a board I don't know the wave length but the price is not bad. Would not be hard to drop in a small light.


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## Splat_NJ (Dec 9, 2008)

www.Mcmaster.com has 365nm bulbs and complete fixtures. They have a portable 365nm unit, 6760T11, that runs off four AA batteries for around $25. Since they're about 1 hour drive away I may take a run down there and pick one up to try.


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## photorob (Dec 9, 2008)

lucky number 777


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## barouk (Jan 9, 2009)

tpchan said:


> I've been following your search with some interest as I'm about to install some trits with Norland 61 and I'm trying to find a UV light sources as well, without breaking the bank. I've ordered from ebay, a "375nm UV Ultraviolet LED Flashlight Pocket size 1 AAA" for $10 US, shipped. The dealer there has multiple listings with that text so it shouldn't be too hard to find. I'll post back here after mine arrives to let everyone else know whether it works or not. There is also available from Amazon.com the "Streamlight 51010 Twin-Task 3C 9 inch UV Flashlight" that has 3 UV leds at 375nm and another 3 UV leds at 390nm plus a Xenon bulb for white light, but it costs $43. I'll try the $10 single led UV light first. 375nm should still be in the range to cure the Norland 61.


 How did it work and did you find anything better? thanks


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## dat2zip (Jan 11, 2009)

I found a source for UV inks of different colors and react to different wavelengths here.

I bought a couple of the UV 4W tube lights there. One is totally invisible light.

I have an old EPROM eraser from way back when. I think it's a uncoated clear lamp. It uses a standard florescent ballast and switch to start the light. If you search EBAY you can still find EPROM erasers. You might have to do some modifications to the box to make it work for your application.

I know the EPROM eraser is powerful as erasing EPROMs would not erase in direct sunlight.

The 4W UV lamps are what I got. I picked up two different models out of the four available. 

http://www.maxmax.com/aFlashUV4Watt.htm

The 365nm is only $25.00.

Wayne


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## tino_ale (Jan 13, 2009)

A snip from my post in another thread :



tino_ale said:


> For those who are still trying to cure Norland 61 with a 365nm light UV source, I will be getting a few Nichia NSHU590B soon (5mm, 365nm, 10° beam, 1.4mW).
> 
> I will try to cure Norland 61 and report here afterwards.
> 
> With a right-on-spot wavelenght and a tight beam angle, I suspect they will cure Norland very efficiently at a reasonnable cost (used with no optic, no reflector, just next to the area to cure). Actually, at no cost since I got free samples that I'll power up using a bench power supply.



Well I have received the leds. It works. Running 20mA through the led, you need some kind of fixture to hold it pointed at the area you want to cure. For a 1.5x5mm tritium vial, you're less than an inch away.

My test conclude that the Norland will become hard and non-tacky after about 30min. That is using a single Nichia NSHU590B.

The LED doesn't seem to heat-up at all. No need for any heatsinking.

So... using 4 or 5 of them pointed towards a target, these will cure Norland in very reasonnable time


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## tino_ale (Jan 14, 2009)

More about a DIY inexpensive Norland curing device HERE


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## iconoclast (Jan 14, 2009)

From the above, it sounds like is was mostly dumb luck that I happen to get an Arc-UV that works as well as it does. I haven't used it for anything much larger than a tritium vial, so the comments about incomplete curing are probably quite valid if you're intending to work with a non-trivial quantity. Fortunately for me, the entire tritium vial fits within the beam pattern of that little 5mm led. Whatever combination of dumb luck and circumstance, it does work really well for the one thing I need it for. Significantly faster than direct sunlight, at least for this particular application. I've also tried a Cree UV of unknown wavelength that I've installed into an Aleph, and it's mostly useless (at best) for curing the norland. I also tried a couple of old florescent tube style UV lights I have around, and one will cure the norland but notably slower than the Arc, while a couple others don't seem to have any more effect than the Cree did. 
I like the idea of the old eeprom eraser. I'll have to keep an eye out for one of those.


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## WadeF (May 8, 2009)

Does anyone know how long Norland takes to cure in sunlight? I have mine out in late afternoon sun, wish I got it out at high noon. I don't know how long I should leave it sit, I'm afraid to touch the stuff if it hasn't cured.  The sun is still fairly high in the sky, at least when I put it out.


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## Kid9P (Aug 19, 2009)

Just ordered this, hope it works!

http://www.batteryjunction.com/inx1uvx1.html


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## tino_ale (Aug 19, 2009)

395nm may not work very well or even not work at all :green:


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## Kid9P (Aug 19, 2009)

It was worth a shot, I'll try it on a dab of Norland when it arrives.

If not, I can always use it at work


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## Kid9P (Aug 23, 2009)

Hmmm,

There is one on Ebay from Nichia.

It is listed at 365 nm using 5 led's.

What do you guys think about this for curing Norland.


http://cgi.ebay.com/Nichia-365-NM-P...lashlight_W0QQitemZ200240146663QQcmdZViewItem


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## dom (Aug 24, 2009)

The one Dat2zip linked to looks like the best, most powerful, cheapest option.

I've been looking myself for the last few weeks
and another guy linked to this,which looks great as well,though a bit pricier.
http://www.powerledlighting.com/SlimUV365.html

So -looking at the one you linked to -you have 7mW of power.

The one from powerled site is 60mW.

The one Dat2zip shows is 120mW( not positive but it says 4W -so double the 2W powerled one.) Though the beam isn't directional.

I'm going to get the 2W one as soon as i have a few spare bucks.

Cheers
Dom


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## dom (Sep 20, 2009)

Well -finally purchased the 2W Sunlite.
Transaction was smooth,communication great,shipping fast and lite well packed -what more could you ask? A lite that worked well?

Totally happy with this lite -seem to zap the Norland 61 to stone in seconds.

I'd first used it on my Spy 005 for a couple of trits but couldn't tell how quick 
it hardened the Norland -so i did a small experiment on a fairly large dollop of
the Norland and a worn out trit.

The lite is well made,came with 3 AAA's installed and has a forward clicky.

















http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2438/3936840372_8cf955c82b_o.jpg





You can see the mould i used in the background -put the trit in there and 
filled it with Norland,blasted it with the lite for about a minute,then knocked it out of the mould.

Seemed solid all the way thru as i had to squash the mould a bit with pliers.

Cheers
Dom


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## tino_ale (Sep 20, 2009)

Good info thanks!

I'm wondering what emitter they've fit in this little light.


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## Ryanrpm (Sep 22, 2009)

Sunlite uses their own Power LED's. That is one way they can make all their flashlights application specific. 

Good purchase dom! I plan to get the 2w UV someday.....when I have the extra cash...


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## dom (Sep 23, 2009)

Hi Ryan - i think i have you to thank for the link to the Sunlite from 
one of your posts when i was searching.

So -- thanks! 

Excellent product.
BTW - i know i said about a minute cure on that
blob of Norland but it was more like 30secs and i couldn't dint it with a screwdriver.

Cheers
Dom


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