# My first modified maglite - 2500 Lumens Goal



## cdrake261 (Aug 16, 2011)

Alrighty, here's my attempt at building my first mag-lite after doing a whole lot of reading from every corner of the internet. I'll keep on updating this first post with my lastest update as it may take a little while. My goal here is to try and get 2500 lumen by using three cree XM-L, TaskLED H6Flex, Sandwich Shoppe perfect tri-star heatsink, and my 4D grey mag-lite as a host. 

I was considering lithium ion 32600's x 4 in series to get me 17.2v at 5,000mAh depending what brand you are looking into. Three XM-L's equals out to 9v plus 2v to run the H6Flex, so I'll need 11v minimum. Or switch to a C cell mag-lite and beef up on the heatsink and use 26650's...

I should also note that I won't be using these XM-L's but I'm on the hunt for star shaped PCB with XM-L's. Please feel free to make a suggestion or comment, they are weclome'd as I progress with this project.

Some pictures thus far:


----------



## tx101 (Aug 16, 2011)

Will you be using reflectors or optics for your build ?


----------



## The_bad_Frag (Aug 16, 2011)

cdrake261 said:


> I should also note that I won't be using these XM-L's but I'm on the hunt for star shaped PCB with XM-L's. Please feel free to make a suggestion or comment, they are weclome'd as I progress with this project.



I don't know if I understood it right... You mean all XM-Ls on 1 star? Like this? Or each LED on its own star like this?


----------



## cdrake261 (Aug 17, 2011)

tx101 said:


> Will you be using reflectors or optics for your build ?



Reflectors...This one below just needs a little fitment:

http://www.dealextreme.com/p/3-cree-reflector-smooth-aluminium-18mm-x-50mm-11922



The_bad_Frag said:


> I don't know if I understood it right... You mean all XM-Ls on 1 star? Like this? Or each LED on its own star like this?



Three XM-L's on stars in series to reach 9v needed for the LEDs and another volt or two for the driver. I'll need at least 11volts to make sure I can reach full brightness but with 32600/32650 in a 4D maglite, I'll end up with between 14.8v and 17.2v, I'll be using this heatsink...


----------



## GulfCoastToad (Aug 17, 2011)

Looks good so far. What have you spent, and what's your budget?


----------



## tx101 (Aug 17, 2011)

Are you sure the PTS and DX reflector will
fit inside the Mag head ?


----------



## cdrake261 (Aug 17, 2011)

GulfCoastToad said:


> Looks good so far. What have you spent, and what's your budget?


 
I'll have to get back to the house and check on what I spent, budget around $300...preferably less.



tx101 said:


> Are you sure the PTS and DX reflector will
> fit inside the Mag head ?



Honestly, not sure... I have to find out what tolerance I have to work with. When I get free time, I'll look over dimensions again and double check. If I need to, I'll just have a new bezel machined to fit that that heatsink and reflector. I know that I need to turn down the reflector OD to fit the head, so this is a chance for a good fit(and additional mass to draw heat away. I'm also considering finning the head if it helps any...


----------



## moderator007 (Aug 17, 2011)

Finning the head does help. As this increase the aluminum's surface area. Just like heatsinks for pc's do.


----------



## tx101 (Aug 17, 2011)

Just got home from work and had a rummage thru my parts bin.
I think you may run into problems using the PTS and DX reflector

I have taken a photo to show you





PTS-C and DX reflector for XREs


The recesses for the stars will not allow the reflector to sit over the emitters
If you have access to a lathe you need to turn the PTS completely flat.

I more or less always use member Downloads "Multi-sinks" for multi-emitter
builds. They offer a range of adjustment to suit different height reflectors


----------



## cdrake261 (Aug 17, 2011)

moderator007 said:


> Finning the head does help. As this increase the aluminum's surface area. Just like heatsinks for pc's do.


 
Alrighty then, I'm going to make that a point to have done, I'm sure this flashlight will get hot very quickly.



tx101 said:


> Just got home from work and had a rummage thru my parts bin.
> I think you may run into problems using the PTS and DX reflector
> 
> I have taken a photo to show you
> ...


 
So "download" makes and sells heatsinks? I really like to use that reflector with the convenience of using a bolt to make a reflector, heatsink, LEDs sandwich.


----------



## hellokitty[hk] (Aug 17, 2011)

17.2/4 = 4.3v per battery?


----------



## cdrake261 (Aug 17, 2011)

hellokitty[hk] said:


> 17.2/4 = 4.3v per battery?


 
Absolutely max voltage... 4.2v is more realistic max though


----------



## cdrake261 (Aug 20, 2011)

Alrighty, I reworked the switch a little bit as the angles of the wires and shoddy soldering was bugging me but looks much better now my soldering skills are getting better. I also got the wires soldered to the driver and plans to use some small quick connects so should I need to detach the head, I can just pop those apart. I did forget to mention that I wanted this switch to be a little heavier gauge switch and used 18 gauge wires for the positive(red) and negative(black) wires, 26 gauge for the signal(green) wires... in theory, this switch should be able to handle 6amps but I'm planning to use either 3.6amps or 5amps as my max. I'm also considering using an low output blue led for the on board voltage monitor to alarm me that the voltage has dropped below a certain set value, kinda like this one:










...and a quick picture of my wired up H6Flex driver:






How is everything looking so far? Remember, questions/comments/suggestions are welcomed!!


----------



## cdrake261 (Sep 5, 2011)

Been busy for a little while, here's some updates I made on other forums about a week ago:

-----------------------------------------------------

The driver I'm using has an diameter of 33mm and the heatsink ID is 27mm and the OD is 34mm, if I tried to machine it down, I'd be left with a 1mm wall. So I'm going to cut the rear of the heatsink off so I can mount my driver to the heatsink and still be able to use thermal protection. I'll do some more thinking when I have everything in my hands, however I'll be working on voltage monitor led this week which will include a resistor, a small circuit board, and an led in the color of red, orange, blue, or green...which color do you guys think? 

Total spent on this project thus far(rounded off of course):

$22 4D maglite
$67 4x 32650 lithium ion batteries
$14 2x UCL glass lens
18€ 3x reflector
17€ Aluminum heatsink
27€ Custom star pcb with three xm-l t6 LEDs 
3.45€ International shipping

So far around $200, budget is at $300

I may add glow in the dark o-rings like I have on my xm-l mini maglite, as well as a stainless steel bezel for looks and added durability.





-----------------------------------------------------

Been a couple days since my last update, hadn't done much but got my simple battery voltage monitor led put in. Didn't get good pictures and I'm honestly not 100% satisfied with the looks of the messy epoxy glob, but it does hold and it does works. If I can locate another maglite switch, I may make a version 2 mag switch without the messy epoxy and use plastic spacers and screws instead.

I'm also thinking about getting into the business of building custom maglites...err....another thread on that later.

It's been suggested to use clear plastic rods instead of fiber optic cables to transfer light from the voltage monitor led to just above the switch. I'm getting excited now!

I'm out of town now, but two of three packages should have arrived today or will arrive on Monday. I'm wondering if my package from germany has been delayed due to irene. Aside from making version 2 of my switch and drill the hole for my optical plug, I'll be at a standstill without my headsink...

-----------------------------------------------------
(6 days ago)

Just contacted my supplier in Germany that he shipped out on the 24th, so I'm expecting my order to be in around sept 2nd to 7th. My lithium ion cells and UCL glass should be arriving any minute now.

Going to Lowe's to look at drill presses, since I figured out my fiber optics problem thanks to a member on here(credit will be given when I find his/her screen name).

-----------------------------------------------------
(4 days ago)

Well, the messy white epoxy killed my original maglite switch so version two is in the works with a different wiring layout and the circuit board with the status led and resistor will be screwed on instead of epoxied like the last switch. Also note that this is the newer model maglite switch and not an older model like my original modified maglite switch. Here's some teaser pictures:











Amazing how much better quality switch one can make with a new drill press, perhaps I can upload pictures of that, but currently sitting in a hospital room. Maybe tomorrow....

-----------------------------------------------------
(3 days ago)

Some video updates:

d0faa4a8.mp4 video by cdrake261 - Photobucket

1d1d6140.mp4 video by cdrake261 - Photobucket

Also, I forgot to mention my 4 lithium ion batteries went AWOL but hopefully they will show up today, I'm also expecting my german shipment on Friday, so keep a look out for more updates.


----------



## cdrake261 (Sep 5, 2011)

I finally got my lithium ion batteries the other day after figuring out they were sent to my old address, but you don't really take in how much larger these batteries are to the alkaline D cell...






See? I told you so... These do not fit my 4D maglite, so either buy a 5D, extension tube, or custom tail cap. For the last two option, how much and where do you suppose I can get quality parts?

As I was saying earlier, my version mag switch got goobered up so I had to make a version 2 and let me tell you, it was a PITA! So much so I may never create another one unless I was offered lots of money or come up with a better solution to engineering it. The inconvenient gaps around the switch didn't give me the bite I really wanted to secure the PCB/LED so I had to go into the switch. If I were to offer this type of construction to somebody, it would after I got a lathe so I can make a solid piece with no gaps. Anyways, here's more pictures:


























In case anybody was wondering, the PCB with the LED and resistor is around 28.5mm...just small enough to clear the snap ring inside the maglite but large enough to give me some surface area to put some small bolts through. 






As you may notice in the above picture, I made a safe battery pack to test my driver and LED...all works well, getting used to the menu on the driver is funky at first but you will get the hang of it rather quickly.


----------



## The_bad_Frag (Sep 5, 2011)

Looks good so far. :wave:

Where did you got the 32650?

I wanna see your driver heatsink solution.


----------



## cdrake261 (Sep 5, 2011)

The_bad_Frag said:


> Looks good so far. :wave:
> 
> Where did you got the 32650?
> 
> I wanna see your driver heatsink solution.


 
http://m.novaeproducts.com/site/mob...sig_permission_level=0&fb_sig_network=fw#3220

The pictures shows them wrapped in blue, but mine came in green... 3.815v-3.825v range is what they measured at.

Still waiting for my heatsink, LEDs, reflectors to show up from Germany... No idea when it will show up since I do not know if the package got hung up by hurricane irene


----------



## The_bad_Frag (Sep 5, 2011)

You will use heatsink, led board and reflectors from DW now?  I see in your parts list above that you forgot to order the o-ring! 

Im also working on my triple Mag right now. :sick2: I would really love to see both lights side by side.


----------



## cdrake261 (Sep 5, 2011)

I'll order the glow in the dark o-rings at a later date, or reuse my maglite o-ring


----------



## cdrake261 (Sep 7, 2011)

It came in!! I am seeing the conflict between my switch tower, my driver, and the heatsink. I may use use a specially made heatsink to side the driver sideways and still be able to use an status led, but trade off will be thermal monitor(lack thereof).


----------



## cdrake261 (Sep 11, 2011)

Alrighty, been a while since I've updated...The part of the main heatsink that slides into the body is roughly 26mm long and and the space between the top of the tube and the switch cut completely flat is also roughly 40mm, so that gives me 14mm to work with if I don't cut the main heatsink back(ideal for XM-L's heat management) or if I trim the heatsink back by 13.5mm(not ideal for XM-L's heat management) and I would then have 27.5mm to play with. So I am considering angling the driver, which throws the driver heat monitor and cut off features out of the picture, status LED may not even make it in the picture either...

The h6flex is a hair bigger then 33mm and the maglite tube is 34.16mm and originally I was going to lay the driver horizonal but that wouldn't give me enough room for my 18ga. wires(diameter of about 1.88mm). This driver is just plain too large for this maglite without fancy heatsinks to angle it.

Another option is to not use this driver and find a smaller 2 or 3 mode driver that will fit inside the heatsink ID of 26.5mm or smaller....any idea's?

Here's my thoughts on the driver heatsink if I decided to go with the TaskLED driver...


----------



## cdrake261 (Sep 14, 2011)

Got hole drilled for the plug, and plug installed...works better than expected!


----------



## cdrake261 (Sep 14, 2011)




----------



## Rando (Sep 16, 2011)

Looking good, can't wait to see it fired up! Is the voltage monitor a function of the H6Flex or is it something separately installed?


----------



## cdrake261 (Sep 16, 2011)

Rando said:


> Looking good, can't wait to see it fired up! Is the voltage monitor a function of the H6Flex or is it something separately installed?


 
Yes... Voltage monitor and cut off, as well thermal cut off and status led(green light) are part of the h6flex. 

Heatsink will hopefully be done getting a trim job at my uncles shop, if so, I'll be mounting the driver this weekend. Send my maglite head out to Jesus today, or that's the plan anyways. I think I'm gonna get either an accurcell-8 or icharger equivalent. Ichargers are nice, but money is tight....


----------



## cdrake261 (Sep 16, 2011)

Scored a mitutoyo caliper at a pawn shop for $25 bucks...good deal?


----------



## cdrake261 (Sep 16, 2011)

Here's my heatsink machined down, this weekend I'm going to drill some holes to route power and ground to the led...


----------



## cdrake261 (Sep 17, 2011)

more pictures!!!






heatsink after being cut down, before heading to drill press...






Pictures after drill press...






















You know the drill(like the pun?



), feel free to ask questions and make suggestions.


----------



## Broker (Sep 17, 2011)

cdrake261 said:


> Scored a mitutoyo caliper at a pawn shop for $25 bucks...good deal?


 
That's a micrometer, not a caliper, & yes, that was a great deal!


----------



## cdrake261 (Sep 17, 2011)

Broker said:


> That's a micrometer, not a caliper, & yes, that was a great deal!


 
Oops...tehe....

Anyways, flashlight build is on hold for now because power has been cut so the roofers won't kill themselves...


----------



## cdrake261 (Sep 17, 2011)

I'm not going to fin the head as I originally planned, so chance of beam shots tonight pending if curing of arctic adhesive.


----------



## cdrake261 (Sep 18, 2011)

awesomeness....its pretty bright!


----------



## moderator007 (Sep 18, 2011)

Waiting to see those beam shots cdrake261. :thumbsup:


----------



## cdrake261 (Sep 18, 2011)

moderator007 said:


> Waiting to see those beam shots cdrake261. :thumbsup:


 
Unfortunately the build took a turn for the worse...one of my cells dropped to 1.35v and my driver won't light up a single xm-l with a 6v power source let alone the triple xm-l and 16.8v

Dead driver and a dead cell? I'm not the happiest camper at the moment.


----------



## The_bad_Frag (Sep 18, 2011)

You can try to connect your driver to your car battery. It must light up a single or triple XM-L with that... Maybe you have a broken power supply...


----------



## cdrake261 (Sep 18, 2011)

good news is that the one cell was tripped...putting it on the charger elevated that. If the driver isnt dead, it probably just shorted out. testing driver with a simple cell/led setup to check functionality now


----------



## cdrake261 (Sep 18, 2011)

Driver works with simple setup....now just have to remove arctic alumina and reseat driver onto the heatsink... But first I'm going to modify the heat sink to help prevent grounding out the wires that passes through the heatsink


----------



## cdrake261 (Sep 18, 2011)

Alright...everything tested and everything works!! Phew!! Going to grab me some liquid electrical tape to make sure there's no grounds anywhere....beam shots tonight, unless another failure...


----------



## moderator007 (Sep 18, 2011)

Glad to hear she's alright. Looking forward to seeing the beam shots. You have put alot of effort it in to this build I was hoping you had not killed it.


----------



## cdrake261 (Sep 19, 2011)

turned my flashlight on for 5 secs then shut off


----------



## cdrake261 (Sep 19, 2011)

may have fried the board...caught the slightly frayed positive battery cable shorting out to either a chip or small resistor. This build hasn't gone as planned.


----------



## Mattaus (Sep 27, 2011)

cdrake261 said:


> may have fried the board...caught the slightly frayed positive battery cable shorting out to either a chip or small resistor. This build hasn't gone as planned.



It's your first modified Maglite - pretty damn impressive attempt working or not. As long as you learn from your mistakes then your onto a winner irrespective of the initial result. Plus I'm sure you'll get it going reliably. Though the added cost of a new driver would suck lol.


----------



## cdrake261 (Sep 27, 2011)

Mattaus said:


> It's your first modified Maglite - pretty damn impressive attempt working or not. As long as you learn from your mistakes then your onto a winner irrespective of the initial result. Plus I'm sure you'll get it going reliably. Though the added cost of a new driver would suck lol.


 
Thank you for the kind words... Yes the additional board purchase does make my project a little more expensive, price of experience I guess. I have the new board sitting on my desk. Gotta pay for my finned head and my stainless steel bezel should be on it's way from download. Yep, can't wait!


----------



## cdrake261 (Oct 1, 2011)

My head came in, gotta grind the old epoxy off the heatsink, get more epoxy, solder up the new driver, and assemble...

Couple pictures...












Good job Jesus Hernandez


----------



## The_bad_Frag (Oct 1, 2011)

Nice! 

How much % more surface area do you get with this?


----------



## cdrake261 (Oct 1, 2011)

The_bad_Frag said:


> Nice!
> 
> How much % more surface area do you get with this?


 
A bunch...not sure scienctifically though. I can see how it would make a huge difference and since I'm going for 3k lumens, it can only help.


----------



## moderator007 (Oct 1, 2011)

Glad to see you are about to get her going again. I just wanted to ask if you had put any thermal paste on the surfaces of where the heatsink contacts the mag. Such as heatsink compound made for cpu's not the epoxy thermal compound. I use Artic silver thermal compound. Without the compound you want get as much heat trasfer to the head so that it can give off the heat. It will for the most part just stay in the heatsink.


----------



## cdrake261 (Oct 2, 2011)

moderator007 said:


> Glad to see you are about to get her going again. I just wanted to ask if you had put any thermal paste on the surfaces of where the heatsink contacts the mag. Such as heatsink compound made for cpu's not the epoxy thermal compound. I use Artic silver thermal compound. Without the compound you want get as much heat trasfer to the head so that it can give off the heat. It will for the most part just stay in the heatsink.


 
Thank you...yes, already thought of AS5 in between head and heatsink...tricky as there's about a mm of clearance which can get AS5 on the board if it oozes out.


----------



## cdrake261 (Oct 5, 2011)

Meh... got the new board wired up, but the light stays on. I checked for continuity and it works as it should, but when I put the batteries in, I'm getting a small voltage across the two lead wires ranging from .0001 to .06 volts and if I unsolder them from the driver and use a paper clip to short the two signal ports, the driver turns on and off as it should. Where could this small voltage leak be coming from?


----------



## The_bad_Frag (Oct 5, 2011)

Can you post a pic which show how your driver is mounted on the heatsink?


----------



## cdrake261 (Oct 5, 2011)

The_bad_Frag said:


> Can you post a pic which show how your driver is mounted on the heatsink?



Driver is currently unmounted, chilling out in the air


----------



## The_bad_Frag (Oct 5, 2011)

Did you used a thermal pad to mount it?


----------



## cdrake261 (Oct 5, 2011)

The_bad_Frag said:


> Did you used a thermal pad to mount it?



Not mounted...normally i use thermal epoxy. I'm almost sure my problem is in the switch as my flashlight works when I disconnect the switch...


----------



## The_bad_Frag (Oct 5, 2011)

And how do you prevent all these tiny pins on the back side from shorting out on the heatsink? :huh:


----------



## cdrake261 (Oct 5, 2011)

The_bad_Frag said:


> And how do you prevent all these tiny pins on the back side from shorting out on the heatsink? :huh:



The driver isn't touching the heatsink right now...suspended in air at the moment.


----------



## The_bad_Frag (Oct 5, 2011)

Yeah I know. But when its on the heatsink how do you know that there is enough epoxy under it that those contacts doesnt come in contact with it?

Hopefully you dont kill another driver because of that. :sweat:


----------



## Al Combs (Oct 5, 2011)

Sorry to hear about your bad luck with the first board. Perhaps George can repair it? Better than just throwing it away. I like the way you drilled new holes in the heat sink for the LED output wires. It gives a full size mounting surface as well as taking advantage of the H6Flex's ability to monitor temperature. That's a nice solution to a difficult problem.:thumbsup: I had imagined using something like an H6Flex by putting a very thin layer of Arctic Alumina epoxy on the back of the board with an old credit card and let it harden. A second layer after light sanding would safely glue it in place without danger of a short. Perhaps like The_bad_Frag said, the Bond-Ply pad that comes with the H6Flex if not as effective might be safer than thermal epoxy.


----------



## cdrake261 (Oct 5, 2011)

The_bad_Frag said:


> Yeah I know. But when its on the heatsink how do you know that there is enough epoxy under it that those contacts doesnt come in contact with it?
> 
> Hopefully you dont kill another driver because of that. :sweat:


 


Al Combs said:


> Sorry to hear about your bad luck with the first board. Perhaps George can repair it? Better than just throwing it away. I like the way you drilled new holes in the heat sink for the LED output wires. It gives a full size mounting surface as well as taking advantage of the H6Flex's ability to monitor temperature. That's a nice solution to a difficult problem.:thumbsup: I had imagined using something like an H6Flex by putting a very thin layer of Arctic Alumina epoxy on the back of the board with an old credit card and let it harden. A second layer after light sanding would safely glue it in place without danger of a short. Perhaps like The_bad_Frag said, the Bond-Ply pad that comes with the H6Flex if not as effective might be safer than thermal epoxy.



It wasn't the underside that shorted out on the other board, it was +in that shorted straight to a chip. The driver is useless now as the thermal epoxy from the last driver set, peeled off a layer of the driver and exposing the copper core. I'll sell the driver for $5 plus shipping if anybody want to use any of the good chips on it.

I thought about coating a thin layer of superglue or fingernail polish to the exposed solder and electrical points before thermal epoxying this driver down. But I need to get the switch situated first. Might rebuild the switch to make sure I did it right.

Also, anybody know where to find m2 screws? I lost two of three, they hold the led board down...


----------



## Al Combs (Oct 5, 2011)

You should be able to get M2-0.4 at the local hardware store. A good way to make sure it's a regular 0.4mm pitch thread. Home Depot also sells metric screws. But you'll probably have to get a pack of more than you need. Google has a ton of hits on M2's if you don't have any hardware stores nearby.


----------



## cdrake261 (Oct 5, 2011)

Al Combs said:


> You should be able to get M2-0.4 at the local hardware store. A good way to make sure it's a regular 0.4mm pitch thread. Home Depot also sells metric screws. But you'll probably have to get a pack of more than you need. Google has a ton of hits on M2's if you don't have any hardware stores nearby.



Good to hear that they are common... There's probably 11 big chain hardware stores within 50 miles, not counting all the little ones. I miss the ace hardware store we used to have, awesome hardware nuts and bolts selections!

Anyways, anybody have any ideas on the switch problem? I just need to know where to start looking.


----------



## Mettee (Oct 5, 2011)

Cant wait to see some beam shots


----------



## cdrake261 (Oct 6, 2011)

Mettee said:


> Cant wait to see some beam shots



Me too... Should have taken some when I had the chance.

ATTENTION: My wife and I are scheduled for an induction at 7:30am on Thursday morning, so our newest addition may just be a flashaholic just like daddy...we'll see! I expect to resume flashlight build towards this weekend or the next couple days after!


----------



## CamoNinja (Oct 6, 2011)

Congrats and good luck


----------



## cdrake261 (Oct 7, 2011)

Amelia Rae Kekona Drake







...a flashaholic in the making?






...seriously the best baby ever! Only cries when she's cold or her aunt poking at her chin. Amelia likes to just lay there in my arms and watch me. Making daddy's heart melt yet again!!


----------



## Al Combs (Oct 7, 2011)

Congrats.


----------



## Al Combs (Oct 7, 2011)

cdrake261 said:


> Meh... got the new board wired up, but the light stays on. I checked for continuity and it works as it should, but when I put the batteries in, I'm getting a small voltage across the two lead wires ranging from .0001 to .06 volts and if I unsolder them from the driver and use a paper clip to short the two signal ports, the driver turns on and off as it should. Where could this small voltage leak be coming from?


Perhaps the wires are too long and act like an antenna? There was a switch wire length question over in the TaskLED forum. George mentioned adding a 0.01uF capacitor across SWA/SWB as a fix for long switch wires. A max recommended length of 8" is mentioned over in H6Flex-Tech.



cdrake261 said:


> Anyways, anybody have any ideas on the switch problem? I just need to know where to start looking.



How exactly do you have the switch wired? The picture in post #1 looks like one of the thin green wires (switch?) is soldered to the ground wire. You would then only need a single green switch wire to pin SWA on the H6Flex. But the picture of the H6Flex in post #13 and #28 has green wires soldered to both SWA and SWB. With the switch out of the circuit, you shouldn't be able to measure continuity between the two green leads of the switch. Also no continuity between either green and the plus or minus wires. Unless of course one of the greens is soldered to ground.

You might have better luck posting your question over in the TaskLED forum. Or sending a PM to George.


----------



## cdrake261 (Oct 7, 2011)

Al Combs said:


> Congrats.


 
Thank you!



Al Combs said:


> Perhaps the wires are too long and act like an antenna? There was a switch wire length question over in the TaskLED forum. George mentioned adding a 0.01uF capacitor across SWA/SWB as a fix for long switch wires. A max recommended length of 8" is mentioned over in H6Flex-Tech.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I made absolutely sure that the wires are well under 8" long, like 4-6 inch range. I thought that both SWA and SWB had to be used, one to ground and the other to switch that sends a small voltage when the momentary switch is pressed. It worked before right at the time I shorted my driver out. Everything indicates that the problem lies within the switch.


----------



## Al Combs (Oct 7, 2011)

cdrake261 said:


> I thought that both SWA and SWB had to be used, one to ground and the other to switch that sends a small voltage when the momentary switch is pressed. It worked before right at the time I shorted my driver out. Everything indicates that the problem lies within the switch.


Referring to H6Flex-Tech page, "The other side of the switch must be wired to SWB (which is electrically the same as IN-)". If you look at the Mag-C switch mod, Will just soldered the other switch lead directly to ground. That way only need 3 wires going from the switch to the regulator instead of 4.

Did you try checking the switch with your DMM? It doesn't seem likely it was damaged when the 1st board blew. But you never know until you check. I think the only lead you have to check is SWA between IN- and IN+. After you unsolder SWA that is. If you have a separate wire to SWB or not shouldn't matter.


----------



## cdrake261 (Oct 7, 2011)

Al Combs said:


> Referring to H6Flex-Tech page, "The other side of the switch must be wired to SWB (which is electrically the same as IN-)". If you look at the Mag-C switch mod, Will just soldered the other switch lead directly to ground. That way only need 3 wires going from the switch to the regulator instead of 4.
> 
> Did you try checking the switch with your DMM? It doesn't seem likely it was damaged when the 1st board blew. But you never know until you check. I think the only lead you have to check is SWA between IN- and IN+. After you unsolder SWA that is. If you have a separate wire to SWB or not shouldn't matter.



The lead going to -in and the other lead going to the grounded side of the switch both come from the same grounded point on the switch...with the switch completely disconnected, the driver works 100% if you short out SWA and SWB. This in theory leaves the switch to blame for the flashlight malfunction. 

But I'm trying to figure out with the switch having zero continuity, how the switch can have a voltage leak coming the battery...


----------



## Al Combs (Oct 7, 2011)

cdrake261 said:


> The lead going to -in and the other lead going to the grounded side of the switch both come from the same grounded point on the switch...with the switch completely disconnected, the driver works 100% if you short out SWA and SWB. This in theory leaves the switch to blame for the flashlight malfunction.


Sounds right, it has to be the switch.



> But I'm trying to figure out with the switch having zero continuity, how the switch can have a voltage leak coming the battery...


Just for clarity's sake, zero continuity means infinite resistance? And you measured the resistance with your DMM? Did you take it apart and clean it? It only needs micro amps to switch, so a little flux/oil contamination might be all it takes.


----------



## cdrake261 (Oct 7, 2011)

Al Combs said:


> Sounds right, it has to be the switch.
> 
> Just for clarity's sake, zero continuity means infinite resistance? And you measured the resistance with your DMM? Did you take it apart and clean it? It only needs micro amps to switch, so a little flux/oil contamination might be all it takes.



Zero meaning there's not enough resistance for my multimeter to measure, so... *scratches head*

Interesting thing about contamination, I'll have to take my switch apart and clean everything with alcohol and make sure there's no connectivity going on.

Also, would a thin layer of superglue or fingernail polish conduct electricity? I was thinking of putting a thin layer on on the underside of the driver that may send or receive electrical current...


----------



## Al Combs (Oct 7, 2011)

cdrake261 said:


> Also, would a thin layer of superglue or fingernail polish conduct electricity? I was thinking of putting a thin layer on on the underside of the driver that may send or receive electrical current...


I honestly have no idea. Is that so if you need to take it apart again, you won't tear off the board's coating? Why not use the Bond-Ply TIM that comes with the board? As a second best idea, the Arctic Silver site used to recommend mixing their epoxy with 25% per volume of the same type compound as a means of making a semi permanent bond. That would have to be better than nail polish.


----------



## cdrake261 (Oct 7, 2011)

Al Combs said:


> I honestly have no idea. Is that so if you need to take it apart again, you won't tear off the board's coating? Why not use the Bond-Ply TIM that comes with the board? As a second best idea, the Arctic Silver site used to recommend mixing their epoxy with 25% per volume of the same type compound as a means of making a semi permanent bond. That would have to be better than nail polish.



I would do it not to make it semi permenant, but rather isolate all the exposed electrical points


----------



## moderator007 (Oct 7, 2011)

Congratulations on the new Flashaholic cdrake261! Looks like a new member there. :thumbsup:


----------



## cdrake261 (Oct 9, 2011)

moderator007 said:


> Congratulations on the new Flashaholic cdrake261! Looks like a new member there. :thumbsup:



Thanks...

Anyways, got to working on my light last night... Cleaned the switch, now it works. Great! Went ahead and epoxy the driver on and let it set overnight. I tested the driver and switch last night, everything works fine...however I just about have it put together and now it's not working!!

Greer!! I'm just about to throw this flashlight through a window.

Anyways, I tested for power to and from driver, 16+ volts, looking good but I can't get power to the LEDs. I did find almost 3 volts passing through SWA and SWB, does that sound right to you?


----------



## Al Combs (Oct 9, 2011)

cdrake261 said:


> Thanks...
> 
> Anyways, got to working on my light last night... Cleaned the switch, now it works. Great! Went ahead and epoxy the driver on and let it set overnight. I tested the driver and switch last night, everything works fine...however I just about have it put together and now it's not working!!
> 
> ...


Sorry, I have no idea if 3 volts at the switch points is normal. The fact that it doesn't work seems to argue it might not be. Bummer.:sick2:

While you're thinking about what to do, if you decide to rip it off with the likelihood of destroying a 2nd h6Flex... Try putting it in the toaster over for 10 or 15 minutes at about 250°F. As a test, put a blob of Arctic Alumina epoxy on a piece of metal and let it harden overnight to see how it reacts to heat when you remove it. Better than waiting overnight, even a 24 hour epoxy after 15 minutes in the toaster oven at 200°F is enough to harden it thoroughly. It feels kind of rubbery when you first remove it, but when it cools it's as hard as a stone. In fact epoxy never gets as hard with time as it is after curing with heat for a short interval. Maybe glue a penny to a piece of metal and see if after heating you can slide a blade underneath it as a test for the H6Flex.

Normally 250°F is way to hot for electronics. But that's an operational or storage limitation. The ovens they reflow circuit boards in are about about 215°C (419°F) for leaded solder. The 63/37 solder paste itself melts at 183°C (361.4°F). Of course time in the peak zone is usually only 10 to 30 seconds. It's going to take longer than that to heat up that big hunk of aluminum. But I think it stands a better chance of surviving the moderate temperature of 250°F for 15 minutes than being pried off cold without damage. If temperature wasn't a consideration, epoxies break down more readily at about 300°F. Higher than that generates toxic smoke. If you do decide to cook it, remember the laminate of the board is also an epoxy, so it's a moderation kind of thing. Also the epoxy tends to re-harden as it cools even if it is degraded slightly, so use a potholder or folded over paper towels while it's still hot.

I realize it's a little late now, but maybe next time you could try the Bond-Ply TIM? Several layers of corrugated cardboard will protect the components while you clamp it lightly for 24 hours with a ratchet bar clamp. The TIM's seat better with slight pressure. A soda bottle cap or a socket from your wrench set will prevent damage to the wires. If it makes you feel any better, I would have used the Arctic Alumina epoxy to because I think it's better. The only thing I would have done different is instead of soldering the LED leads to the bottom of the board, I would have filed a notch in the side of the board in a spot clear of the circuit traces. All the wires could then be mounted on the top side. Then after using the flush cutters, use either a razor blade or even fine sandpaper to get the back of the board as flat as possible. Then apply a thin insulating layer of Arctic Alumina epoxy with a credit card and allow it to harden. The final attachment layer would be both better than the TIM and with no danger of short circuits.

Come to think of it, if you can manage to safely remove the H6Flex from the heatsink with mild heat, you already have an intermediate insulating layer of Arctic Alumina epoxy. At lower temperatures the epoxy isn't destroyed with heat, so just leave it there and glue it on again without cleaning off the old glue. Trying to completely remove the old glue would more likely damage the board than just leaving it alone. If you see any shinny metal spots poking through the epoxy, just shave them down with an X-Acto knife.


----------



## cdrake261 (Oct 9, 2011)

I have successfully removed the h6flex from the heatsink and all glue that was holding them together...without damaging the board that is. I dislike the poly pad stuff because it takes too long to set and I run two wires from the back and through the heatsink, so I'd have to make holes for wires to pass but not so much it could short out.

I did create an insulating layer of epoxy, I think that's why I was able to pull the driver off without damage, but I'm still baffled why it's at this point my flashlight doesn't work.


----------



## Al Combs (Oct 9, 2011)

I'm posting this over here so I don't hijack seven11's thread. At least not more than I already have.



cdrake261 said:


> Which would work fine if all my wires came out the same side, but otherwise to use that, I'd have to cut holes


What's wrong with cutting holes in the TIM? Actually it can't really be a hole since the wires are already attached to the board. Make a 'V' notch with a scissors. You only need to make contact with the board where the red squares are (shown on the H6Flex-Tech page). The slight loss of material won't affect the TIM's ability to dissipate the heat. I did notice that the giant hole in the center of Der Wichtel's heatsink encroaches on the red area corresponding to the thermal vias for the inductor. So if that's not a problem, and I don't believe that it is, then the wires holes won't be either. 



cdrake261 said:


> Got the driver off without any problems or signs of physical damage...next thing to do is check and see if driver works right as it's suppose to. I don't understand why it always works until I go to put it together.


Der Wichtel's heatsink has clear anodizing on it that acts like an insulator. Actually all type 2 anodizing is clear. You have to add a dye in a separate process if you want color. Making the back surface of the heatsink flat exposed the bare metal and caused a short.


----------



## Al Combs (Oct 9, 2011)

cdrake261 said:


> I have successfully removed the h6flex from the heatsink and all glue that was holding them together...without damaging the board that is. I dislike the poly pad stuff because it takes too long to set and I run two wires from the back and through the heatsink, so I'd have to make holes for wires to pass but not so much it could short out.


Yeah that's true. You have to wait at least 24 hours for it to set up.



> I did create an insulating layer of epoxy, I think that's why I was able to pull the driver off without damage, but I'm still baffled why it's at this point my flashlight doesn't work.


It doesn't work after removing it from the heatsink and it did before mounting? That doesn't sound promising.:shakehead


----------



## cdrake261 (Oct 9, 2011)

Al Combs said:


> Yeah that's true. You have to wait at least 24 hours for it to set up.
> 
> It doesn't work after removing it from the heatsink and it did before mounting? That doesn't sound promising.:shakehead



It worked before I mounted, but not after...I'm almost sure there's a short somewhere preventing this from working. But where??


----------



## Al Combs (Oct 9, 2011)

cdrake261 said:


> It worked before I mounted, but not after...I'm almost sure there's a short somewhere preventing this from working. But where??


I have no way of knowing for sure and I hope I'm wrong, but my thought was a small piece of solder poked through the epoxy and shorted the H6Flex against the heatsink when it was mounted. Which means the reason it's not working now is because the 2nd board is blown. Like I said, here's hoping I'm wrong. Did you clamp the board while the epoxy was hardening to get as thin a layer of glue as possible? That's the way I would have done it. Which is the reason I would have prepped the board by sanding or scraping with an X-Acto knife first. To get rid of all the little solder peaks or wires poking through. Do you see anything shinny with a loupe sticking through the epoxy? It would have to be at the edge of the board where the anodizing was removed. Really you'd have to have two points of contact. Since both the outer edge of the heatsink and the battery tube are anodized, it probably didn't pick up the ground from there. The board was probably shorted even without being inserted into the battery tube.

Did you try your paperclip trick from SWA to SWB? Batteries are all OK? Damage to the wires/solder joints from all that moving around? Keep us posted and good luck.


----------



## cdrake261 (Oct 9, 2011)

Al Combs said:


> I have no way of knowing for sure and I hope I'm wrong, but my thought was a small piece of solder poked through the epoxy and shorted the H6Flex against the heatsink when it was mounted. Which means the reason it's not working now is because the 2nd board is blown. Like I said, here's hoping I'm wrong. Did you clamp the board while the epoxy was hardening to get as thin a layer of glue as possible? That's the way I would have done it. Which is the reason I would have prepped the board by sanding or scraping with an X-Acto knife first. To get rid of all the little solder peaks or wires poking through. Do you see anything shinny with a loupe sticking through the epoxy? It would have to be at the edge of the board where the anodizing was removed. Really you'd have to have two points of contact. Since both the outer edge of the heatsink and the battery tube are anodized, it probably didn't pick up the ground from there. The board was probably shorted even without being inserted into the battery tube.
> 
> Did you try your paperclip trick from SWA to SWB? Batteries are all OK? Damage to the wires/solder joints from all that moving around? Keep us posted and good luck.



Now that I think more on it, the driver worked fine even after mounting driver to the heatsink. When I put the second board on, I made sure that I was starting with a completely clean and fresh surface, then proceed to put a thin layer(enough to not show any metal) and let it set for 20 mins. Then enough for second layer and pressed the driver down by hand with moderate force for 5 mins. Tested functionality and all worked well with some 3mm LEDs and resistors...I let it set overnight to cure. I put liquid electrical tape on any exposed contact points(two) on switch, and most of the h6flex board in attempt to prevent shorting out.

Put heatsink and driver into head/battery tube and soldered XML LEDs in.

What I found was one battery tripped, the ground contact point liquid electrical tape was worn off by something and positive lead going to +in on driver has worked loose. Tonight I'm going to rig up the driver to a 3mm led and resistor, along with switch to test the driver for functionality.

Maybe I should take up donations for another h6flex if I need one. I may have to come up with a electrical non-conductive layer of plastic to create a barrier.

*sighs*


----------



## cdrake261 (Oct 9, 2011)

Just tested my driver, it works as it should... So....I'm confused on what's going on here. My only guess is that tolerance is too tight that the wires just shorts out via flashlight body. Any thoughts?


----------



## Al Combs (Oct 10, 2011)

Sounds like maybe IN+ was a cold solder joint. Glad to hear you got it working.


----------



## cdrake261 (Oct 10, 2011)

Al Combs said:


> Sounds like maybe IN+ was a cold solder joint. Glad to hear you got it working.



Being a welder I am, I made sure all my joints are solid. I began to have the same problem as earlier, so I started to rethink my setup and came to the conclusion that the switch would work better if it were connected directly to the switch instead of passing through a common ground point.

I tested this by of course shorting out SWA and SWB, the driver function normally. The driver also function normally when you short one of the switch ports to any common ground while the other comes directly from the switch, however, setting it up this way won't work with the switch as it won't be able to interrupt the current flow. My solution? Connect the positive and negative side of the blue part of the switch to SWA and SWB respectfully.

I hope to get this light working soon!


----------



## cdrake261 (Oct 21, 2011)

After letting my frustration pass on, I now have the driver mounted and driver/heatsink in the head/body... If I can just solder the LEDs and still make it work, I'll be done!!!!


----------



## cdrake261 (Oct 21, 2011)

got it working....sort of. I think the reflectors are causing me problems as them sitting in a certain wait will cause the light or one or two leds to stop working until I adjust the reflectors. Also, light flashes on low power and high power stays on a couple of seconds. my batteries are ranging 4.02v-4.03v


----------



## The_bad_Frag (Oct 22, 2011)

I think the reflectors are shorting out on the leds. You need to put them on a lathe and make the hole bigger OR reduce the depth of the inside ring.

The reflectors sitting on the inside ring on the leds and not on the 2x 1/4 ring segment on the outside.


----------



## cdrake261 (Oct 22, 2011)

The_bad_Frag said:


> I think the reflectors are shorting out on the leds. You need to put them on a lathe and make the hole bigger OR reduce the depth of the inside ring.
> 
> The reflectors sitting on the inside ring on the leds and not on the 2x 1/4 ring segment on the outside.



Some liquid electrical tape fixed that, but now onto the light cutting on high settings and light flashing on low and med settings....any ideas?

Could my batteries be under stress by the driver trying to pull 5 amps from batteries with a claimed 3.3 amp max discharge?

If so, maybe 26650 aw IMR's with a battery sleeve would fix this problem. Anybody know where to get a battery sleeve for a 5D?


----------



## The_bad_Frag (Oct 22, 2011)

Connect it to a car battery and see if it works with it.

...5 amps? On what current do you drive the XM-Ls? :huh:


----------



## cdrake261 (Oct 22, 2011)

The_bad_Frag said:


> Connect it to a car battery and see if it works with it.
> 
> ...5 amps? On what current do you drive the XM-Ls? :huh:



5 amps on high


----------



## The_bad_Frag (Oct 22, 2011)

And you are using 3x 32650?


----------



## cdrake261 (Oct 22, 2011)

The_bad_Frag said:


> And you are using 3x 32650?



Four


----------



## The_bad_Frag (Oct 22, 2011)

Then the 32650s only need to handle ~3A when the leds running on 5A.

I would try to connect a long screwdriver to the + of a car battery and put it inside the mag. (touching the + at the switch) Then hold another cable connected to - to the end of the mag tube. 3 xm-l should easily run on a 12V car battery.


----------



## cdrake261 (Oct 22, 2011)

The_bad_Frag said:


> Then the 32650s only need to handle ~3A when the leds running on 5A.
> 
> I would try to connect a long screwdriver to the + of a car battery and put it inside the mag. (touching the + at the switch) Then hold another cable connected to - to the end of the mag tube. 3 xm-l should easily run on a 12V car battery.



This to test fault of battery? Could I use a 12v jumper pack instead of car battery?


----------



## The_bad_Frag (Oct 23, 2011)

Yeah sure. If it runs good with the jumper pack your 32650s are some kind of damaged. Make sure that jumper pack is charged because most of them lay in the basement for years without usage. ...you dont have a car?:thinking:


----------



## cdrake261 (Oct 23, 2011)

The_bad_Frag said:


> Yeah sure. If it runs good with the jumper pack your 32650s are some kind of damaged. Make sure that jumper pack is charged because most of them lay in the basement for years without usage. ...you dont have a car?:thinking:



Yes I have a car, it is easier to set the flashlight and power pack on the table since, you know, it's getting cold outside


----------



## Tidra (Jan 26, 2012)

One stupid question,....
Why you use thermal epoxy to glue the driver to the heat-sink? Why don't you use self-adhesive thermal pad you get with H6Flex?

Cheers
Iztok


----------



## cdrake261 (Jan 26, 2012)

Tidra said:


> One stupid question,....
> Why you use thermal epoxy to glue the driver to the heat-sink? Why don't you use self-adhesive thermal pad you get with H6Flex?
> 
> Cheers
> Iztok



No question is stupid...The thermal pad can be difficult to set up and takes a while to be adhesive, I tried several times but with no success. Thermal compound is both a quick setting adhesive and and a decently good thermal conductive compound.

Btw, I have my flashlight for sale...
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...umens-5D-maglite-w-32650-s-charger-and-cradle.


----------



## The_bad_Frag (Jan 26, 2012)

Why do you sell it? 

You put so much work into it and then you give it away? What happend?


----------



## cdrake261 (Jan 26, 2012)

The_bad_Frag said:


> Why do you sell it?
> 
> You put so much work into it and then you give it away? What happend?



Flashlight works fine, figured out that they really don't like 5 amps but works fine at 3 amps. I needed to sell because my car ate my HID ballast...so I have to fix that.


----------



## Tidra (Jan 27, 2012)

cdrake261 said:


> No question is stupid...The thermal pad can be difficult to set up and takes a while to be adhesive, I tried several times but with no success. Thermal compound is both a quick setting adhesive and and a decently good thermal conductive compound.



Should I be scared now? Because I use this thermal adhesive pad all the time, so far so good.

Really bad to see you are selling light after so much work you done. What is the Mini Mag setup you are showing beside the large beast?

Thank you
Iztok


----------



## cdrake261 (Jan 27, 2012)

Tidra said:


> Should I be scared now? Because I use this thermal adhesive pad all the time, so far so good.
> 
> Really bad to see you are selling light after so much work you done. What is the Mini Mag setup you are showing beside the large beast?
> 
> ...



If you have the patience to do it right, then there's nothing to be afraid of. I'm selling my maglite so I can replace my HID's in my car, around $300 dollars. My micro mag I am keeping, JonnyMac made it for me. It's my little powerful workhorse that has proved itself over and over.


----------



## mathias (Jun 29, 2013)

Hey im trying to get a stock Maglite and up the lumens on it. I have a fenix tk21 and its too much floodlight for me im looking for more beam


----------



## simplec6 (Jul 5, 2013)

cdrake261 said:


> Flashlight works fine, figured out that they really don't like 5 amps but works fine at 3 amps. I needed to sell because my car ate my HID ballast...so I have to fix that.


cdrake261, were you referring to the 32650's not liking a 5amps current draw? Or did you mean the XMLs?


----------



## cdrake261 (Mar 3, 2016)

Excuse the messy desk...


----------



## cdrake261 (Mar 3, 2016)

Sorry, wrong thread


----------

