# Why is the SureFire C2 so good?



## bykfixer (Dec 5, 2019)

As a Non-C2 owner I've gotta ask……
What makes the C2 so sought after?


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## bykfixer (Dec 5, 2019)

Oops. Double post.


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## kamagong (Dec 5, 2019)

Honestly...it looks awesome.


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## badtziscool (Dec 5, 2019)

For me. Everything! Looks. How it fits in the hand. P60 format. Twisty/Momentary operation. Or clicky if you mod the tail. It's one of those lights you just have to have in your hand to appreciate.


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## ven (Dec 5, 2019)

Exactly the same as what makes the 6p so good . Except in my opinion, I prefer the design more. I also love the natural HA as well(can get black all be them a little more scarce). Comes with a clip.....heck what’s not to like


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## archimedes (Dec 5, 2019)

bykfixer said:


> As a Non-C2 owner I've gotta ask……
> What makes the C2 so sought after?



I know that you have experience with other SureFires, but can you remind me which ones specifically ?

I think I can explain better, based on those you already know.


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## ampdude (Dec 5, 2019)

I can't believe bykfixer you are not a C2 owner.. That really surprises me. With your bulb stash and all. :twothumbs


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## scout24 (Dec 5, 2019)

Grip ring, square body, long pocket clip. The way it fits in the hand. And it looks cool... 😁


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## thermal guy (Dec 5, 2019)

I just got my first C2 today. If you like the feel of a Z2 you are going to LOVE the C2. It’s blocky which is out of the norm for a flashlight. It’s very comfortable in the hand. And to me feels way more solid then the 6P and that’s saying something.


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## bykfixer (Dec 5, 2019)

archimedes said:


> I know that you have experience with other SureFires, but can you remind me which ones specifically ?
> 
> I think I can explain better, based on those you already know.



Incan-wise I have E-2's (E's and D's in twisty and clicky) several G2's and 6P's. Oh, and an old tear drop E-1. 
LED-wise a few more E-2's of various flavors, G2x Pro's, G2L's, several A2 aviators with incan bulbs, and my favorite the U2 ultra. 

Just curious why members prefer the C2 over 6P I suppose.

Edit: I forgot about the E1b lights and the AZ2(?) head on an EDCL-2T body with clicky tailcap. I put my EDCL-2T gas pedal on an E1b and the clicky on the 2T body. The 2T head collects dust because I just don't like how hot it gets. Another E2D has a Tana singLED set to run at about 25 lumens. It has a Scout clicky. 
End edit.


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## id30209 (Dec 5, 2019)

I like the look of HA and feel in the hand. Clip, did anyone said clip...?
Oh, but you could be easily fooled with early models...[emoji48]


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## badtziscool (Dec 5, 2019)

bykfixer said:


> Just curious why members prefer the C2 over 6P I suppose.



Cigar grip. The flat sides and the rubber grip ring makes the cigar grip comfortable and secure. But I still prefer the 6P for the tactical grip.


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## archimedes (Dec 5, 2019)

bykfixer said:


> .... Just curious why members prefer the C2 over 6P I suppose.



Ok, yes, a couple of reasons. I much prefer the natural HA finish of the C2, especially the older vintage "olive / bronze / greenish" version. Also, it seems stouter built and easier to hold securely.

And I find the overall design simply more visually appealing, too :shrug:


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## kamagong (Dec 5, 2019)

bykfixer said:


> Just curious why members prefer the C2 over 6P I suppose.



It's the square body and type-III HA finish. Perhaps it's the pocket clip, though the short-lived D2 Defender had a pocket clip as well.

Truth be told I think I like the old round body 6Ps most of all, with the Z2 coming in second. Perhaps I should go hunting for a 6Z, that might be the best of both. :thinking:


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## lightfooted (Dec 5, 2019)

The rubber grip is placed better on the C2, they obviously were thinking when they decided where to place it unlike practically everyone else nowadays who is copying it. It allows two average sized fingers on either side of it as opposed to most copies where only one finger can be placed on the tail side. This sets it in most hands so that your thumb easily operates the tail switch. Nitecore's P20 is the only one I've come across that gets close. It really does feel sturdier even more so than the 6P I have. 

I love the way it feels in my hand but I need to find a proper upgrade for it to carry it more often.


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## badtziscool (Dec 6, 2019)

Adding to the thread. I mean, seriously, just look at it! I've been in this hobby for a long time and this light still to this day invokes a feeling I just can't describe.


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## scout24 (Dec 6, 2019)

This one's a permanent part of my collection. Surefire was kind enough to provide me with replacement lens, bezel ring, o-rings, combat grip ring, and the plastic tab for the pocket clip. I added an Oveready McClicky kit as the collector value was no longer a concern. A lot of scraping, scrubbing, and cleaning later, it functions flawlwssly and has a nice mottled smoke/flame patina. Some missing and bubbling ano, but it just adds character to a light that already has a story. Crosshairs A00498. Mr.Fixer- I'm going to put a C2 in the mail to you, call it an extended test drive. See what all the fuss is about and all.


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## ven (Dec 6, 2019)

lovecpf


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## ven (Dec 6, 2019)

Some c2 and an m2, another fav! I think surefire hit home runs with all their p60 lights.


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## jabe1 (Dec 6, 2019)

Like the other p60 lights; the C2 is easily modded.
it also just feels right, the size and weight. It’s a proper tool, not just a flashlight.


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## Eric242 (Dec 6, 2019)

The C2 is THE Surefire light for me. I´ll always have one of these. Once I had more than 20! but sold them all one after another because I though it was a bit over the top (was it really :nana:?). A few month later I had to get another one.... somehow felt naked without a C2


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## badtziscool (Dec 6, 2019)

Eric242 said:


> The C2 is THE Surefire light for me. I´ll always have one of these. Once I had more than 20! but sold them all one after another because I though it was a bit over the top (was it really :nana:?). A few month later I had to get another one.... somehow felt naked without a C2



WOW!!!!


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## peter yetman (Dec 6, 2019)

"Mad in Germany" seems an appropriate soubriquet.

Sorry, I'm watching something with Stephen Fry in.
P


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## scout24 (Dec 6, 2019)

Now that's a lifetime supply of C2's right there! Wow!

Ven- Is that an M2 to the left? Do you run it incan, or modded?


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## bykfixer (Dec 6, 2019)

scout24 said:


> Mr.Fixer- I'm going to put a C2 in the mail to you, call it an extended test drive. See what all the fuss is about and all.



Well dress me up and call me Sally! I'd be pleased as punch to test drive one. I have some NIP P60's around somewhere so it'll be returned with a new bulb.


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## Bullzeyebill (Dec 6, 2019)

That is sooo cool.

Bill


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## ven (Dec 7, 2019)

Eric.............:rock::rock::bow::bow::twothumbs:twothumbs that is just incredible, wow



scout24 said:


> Now that's a lifetime supply of C2's right there! Wow!
> 
> Ven- Is that an M2 to the left? Do you run it incan, or modded?



Hi there, yes it is an m2, another fav(well we are allowed to have more than 10 haha)
It has a quad p60vn xpl HI 5000k in it at the moment, but it does get changed sometimes. Yes i have run the bulb in it what really the head is designed for(shock absorber). I have left it in anyway , even though its not needed with the quad.





Few pics





m2/c2









With 6p and z2









My pimped c2 triad and m32 cryos with xhp70 shaved dome p60









Love them all


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## Mr. LED (Dec 8, 2019)

If anyone in Europe has a spare and wants to part with, hit me a DM!


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## Lumen83 (Dec 9, 2019)

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. I do not behold the beauty of this light. I think it is butt ugly. Its too bad because what a great light it is. 6Ps are my favorite light and this is like a 6P with a tail cap. Even better. I just wish I could get used to the looks.


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## thermal guy (Dec 11, 2019)

I have been using mine in the house with a M61WLL an absolutely love it. The only thing I don’t like about it is that it can’t tail stand. And don’t really want to add anything on the tail as I love the way it is now.


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## scout24 (Dec 11, 2019)

If you're inclined, a WTB for an Oveready Zero Res tailcap insert would solve that for you... 🙂


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## thermal guy (Dec 11, 2019)

Might be something to consider. Thank you my friend. Didn’t think of that.


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## bykfixer (Dec 11, 2019)

So a gem of a C2 was in my mailbox after work today. Sleeper version that has been bored and overready clicky'd. 

I'll spend a few nights playing with it side by side with a 6P. Initial thoughts were that being so used to the feel of a 6P, the C2 will take some getting used to feel-wise. Operation-wise they're pretty close. I don't have any 6P clickys so a Malkoff tailcap may be swapped on or from a G2x Pro.


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## lion504 (Dec 11, 2019)

Lumen83 said:


> I do not behold the beauty of this light. ... I just wish I could get used to the looks.



I hear ya. Personally, I prefer the symmetry of the Z2 or 6P.


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## kamagong (Dec 11, 2019)

Lumen83 said:


> Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. I do not behold the beauty of this light. I think it is butt ugly. Its too bad because what a great light it is. 6Ps are my favorite light and this is like a 6P with a tail cap. Even better. I just wish I could get used to the looks.





lion504 said:


> I hear ya. Personally, I prefer the symmetry of the Z2 or 6P.



Consider yourself lucky. 6Ps and Z2s are both cheaper than the C2.


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## ven (Dec 12, 2019)

It’s cool how we all like different designs(world would be a boring place otherwise). But for me, the c2 is one of surefires better looking lights. Granted it’s just the body that differs from the 6p and z2 as examples , but it’s the flats , grip and clip. For comfort the z2 wins for me personally(maybe the 6p to). But I find the c2 more grippy in general(well the 6p is pretty much round anyway). 
Also the c2 is a little more rare compared to the 6p. It’s the HA that signs the deal!


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## Coppet (Dec 12, 2019)

I also like the C2 best of all Surefire models, got my first one recently and still have two 6Ps. I think it will be more soon, but C2, M2 and Z2 models are quite hard to get in Europe at normal prices.


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## thermal guy (Dec 12, 2019)

My go to light around the house has always been either a MD3 or a 6-9P. Love the way they feel. But been using my C2 for a few days now and am really liking it. Better in the hand “at least to me” them my Z2’s.Kinda liking the Blockiness of it.You ain’t going to drop it that’s for sure.

I also think it’s the natural HA finish. All my lights being black is getting real old.


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## ven (Dec 12, 2019)

Very nice coppet There is a nice black c2 on a certain auction sit for £120, nearly bought it several times! It is getting harder and harder to not bite!(hint hint)

Good stuff thermal guy, get some pics up


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## Coppet (Dec 12, 2019)

£120 is a proud price for a black C2 and I personally like the HA III coating better than the black one. And my C2 cost me only half as much and also has a clicky tailcap (Z58?) which I like very much, especially with multimode DropIns. But I think the prices for C2, C3 and Z2 will go up rather than down in the future but I guess that doesn't stop real fans from buying it


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## archimedes (Dec 12, 2019)

Since the topic of HA finish has been mentioned in a few posts, it is worth noting that there have been a few (pretty rare) special-edition versions of the C2 in HA-BK


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## Coppet (Dec 12, 2019)

Is there an overview of the different C2/M2 versions somewhere in the wide world of the internet? I have seen other colors besides grey and black, including C2 Surefires in camouflage and I'm not sure if these are additional coatings.


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## archimedes (Dec 12, 2019)

Most of them have been in the threads I've linked up below .... Well, they were until photo host sites broke all the pictures :mecry:

https://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?192419-Show-your-Rare-Unusual-SureFires-Part-1

https://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?230251-Show-your-Rare-Unusual-SureFires-Part-2

https://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?438957-Show-your-Rare-Unusual-SureFires-Part-3

:candle:


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## ven (Dec 12, 2019)

Coppet said:


> £120 is a proud price for a black C2 and I personally like the HA III coating better than the black one. And my C2 cost me only half as much and also has a clicky tailcap (Z58?) which I like very much, especially with multimode DropIns. But I think the prices for C2, C3 and Z2 will go up rather than down in the future but I guess that doesn't stop real fans from buying it



Its not actually a bad price IMO, black c2's are harder to find than(my actual preferred) HA flavours. I dont need, nor will i use it and have 3 x c2's already. So i am doing ok resisting so far haha. It might be the 1st black c2 i have seen in the UK, maybe 1 of 3 total on ebay over the years. 

My most expensive c2 was the precisionworks one, 2x tritium, bored . Cant remember cost now with shipping, but $250 ish. Then cryos bezel, that was around $80 for the larger z32. Triad tail maybe $60 ish, then shipping. Prob not far off $400 before the p60 inside. But its a keeper

I have a beater z2 what i use on work, trust me for it to be a low serial no as well. So for work, a 6p sportac 219 triple, EDC+ xp-g2 triple and G2 with a 219b 5700k iirc. Then the tidy/mint ones are at home , used but kind of babied as well.


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## stuart (Dec 12, 2019)

To me the C2 and E2e in OD green are what I think of when I think of Surefire. Had a C2 for years, sold it because I loved it so much that I never used it. Don't mind beating up the 6p. The C2 was just too beautiful to use.


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## Coppet (Dec 12, 2019)

I wasn't aware that a C2 in black is rather rare, I got my first Surefire just a few weeks ago, so good to know:thumbsup:
Starting with P60 I started with Solarforce hosts but since my first Surefire 6P I have been a fan of these flashlights because the quality and feel convinced me. 
The 6P is already my favorite and outperforms my Solarforce flashlights. But the C2 is for me personally the most beautiful and as you already say, the flats , grip and clip are ingenious.


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## Coppet (Dec 12, 2019)

stuart said:


> Don't mind beating up the 6p. The C2 was just too beautiful to use.


I can understand that, it's the same with me


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## ampdude (Dec 13, 2019)

Coppet said:


> I wasn't aware that a C2 in black is rather rare, I got my first Surefire just a few weeks ago, so good to know:thumbsup:
> Starting with P60 I started with Solarforce hosts but since my first Surefire 6P I have been a fan of these flashlights because the quality and feel convinced me.
> The 6P is already my favorite and outperforms my Solarforce flashlights. But the C2 is for me personally the most beautiful and as you already say, the flats , grip and clip are ingenious.



The C2-BK in type II is not rare, but fairly uncommon. The C2-HA (my favorite) is the more common of the two.


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## ampdude (Dec 13, 2019)

archimedes said:


> Since the topic of HA finish has been mentioned in a few posts, it is worth noting that there have been a few (pretty rare) special-edition versions of the C2 in HA-BK



The only Surefire factory C2-BK in hard anodize (type III) that I'm aware of that you could buy is the Emerson model, the C2-EM that came with the knife. I have a numbered light/knife set. These were out around 2003.

I vaguely remember there being others though. Surefire did all kinds of random one off things in those years. Or a few for certain companies, or awards. I've seen S&W versions, and all kinds of different lights that weren't advertised or generally sold to the public.

I think Oveready may have done a custom run of C2's and HA type III black at one time. Not sure.. don't remember.


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## archimedes (Dec 13, 2019)

ampdude said:


> The C2-BK in type II is not rare, but fairly uncommon. The C2-HA (my favorite) is the more common of the two.



I would be interested to see comparative production numbers on those. I do think more C2-HA were produced than C2-BK, but maybe not so lopsided as we often speculate ?

My guess is that the C2-BK have *recently* gotten much harder to find, possibly due to higher collecting demand.

I remember when I was looking for another C*3* a few years ago, that the C3-BK was rather more plentiful than the C3-HA. Anyway, it is interesting, to me at least.


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## ampdude (Dec 13, 2019)

archimedes said:


> I would be interested to see comparative production numbers on those. I do think more C2-HA were produced than C2-BK, but maybe not so lopsided as we often speculate ?
> 
> My guess is that the C2-BK have *recently* gotten much harder to find, possibly due to higher collecting demand.
> 
> I remember when I was looking for another C*3* a few years ago, that the C3-BK was rather more plentiful than the C3-HA. Anyway, it is interesting, to me at least.



Yes, I was going to mention this. The C3-BK almost always seemed more common than the C3-HA for some reason. I don't think it's that lopsided with the C2-BK/C2-HA either, but I just never remember seeing that many C2-BK lights around compared to C2-HA, going from the gray box all the way up to the clamshell packaging days when most incans were discontinued. My preference has always been for the HA lights, so in general I have always gotten rid of the BK lights unless they were special editions, or VERY rare lights, light my round body C2-BK with press fit lexan bezel.


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## bykfixer (Dec 13, 2019)

^^ pix please……


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## ven (Dec 14, 2019)

Originally Posted by *stuart* 


_Don't mind beating up the 6p. The C2 was just too beautiful to use._


Coppet said:


> I can understand that, it's the same with me



Easy solution guys, keep the mint ones for best, get beaters to.......beat! Thats what i have done, i love my SF's and if i need to use a torch, i want it to be a surefire.
Work G2(still mint)older pic before swapping bezel back to OE.





Others(the C2 from Peter and has had new bezel,tail cap and McClicky. This is in the glove box now,
Glove box lights




the 6p/z2 and g2 are work lights. The c2 bezel off the g2 now lives on the c2(glove box one)


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## ampdude (Dec 14, 2019)

bykfixer said:


> ^^ pix please……



I'm not really in the digging stuff out and taking pics mood tonight, but I found some old pictures I took of the round body Surefire C2-BK (Burger King) edition.


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## ampdude (Dec 14, 2019)

And here's a couple of C2-HA (High Accuracy) edition crosshairs logos.


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## Bullzeyebill (Dec 14, 2019)

I have a C2 HA LED. Same body as incan models. I seldom use it . Don't want to abuse it. I do use my Z2's. C2''s are just beautiful to me. 

Bill


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## ven (Dec 14, 2019)

:wowampdude


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## ampdude (Dec 14, 2019)

ven said:


> Originally Posted by *stuart*
> 
> 
> _Don't mind beating up the 6p. The C2 was just too beautiful to use._
> ...



Exactly, but I find it hard to make any Surefire a beater, even a G2 or 6P. My carry, nightstand and glovebox Surefires are still taken care of. I don't worry about scrapes or scratches on them, but I don't try and put any on either.


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## ven (Dec 14, 2019)

ampdude said:


> Exactly, but I find it hard to make any Surefire a beater, even a G2 or 6P. My carry, nightstand and glovebox Surefires are still taken care of. I don't worry about scrapes or scratches on them, but I don't try and put any on either.



I have cheated on that ampdude, i have bought the odd one with a little wear on it. It takes away the 1st ding/dent/scrape misery . I am just continuing the surefires history, building a more battered future

I dont go out of my way though, i always look after my gear/tools regardless. But the ones at home, although some have been to work here and there, do get babied and extra looking after. By that, if i need to get under the car, it wont be a mint surefire in hand. Camping, dog walks , use around house, good to go!


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## ampdude (Dec 14, 2019)

ven said:


> I have cheated on that ampdude, i have bought the odd one with a little wear on it. It takes away the 1st ding/dent/scrape misery . I am just continuing the surefires history, building a more battered future
> 
> I dont go out of my way though, i always look after my gear/tools regardless. But the ones at home, although some have been to work here and there, do get babied and extra looking after. By that, if i need to get under the car, it wont be a mint surefire in hand. Camping, dog walks , use around house, good to go!



Yes, for sure. But I realize if I put a nice crack in the glass of a user KT head for example, it's not gonna be easy to find replacement glass. So I look at it that way. Or certain replacement bulbs if I get low on them. I'm probably one of the weirdest C series fans out there though. I prefer the round body C3 over the flat body C3, but I prefer the flat body C2 over the round body C2. Something about the grip angle I don't know what it is. Or maybe I just got so used to the round body C3's back in the day and never used the C2's all that much. For smaller lights I was usually using the G2 when I wasn't using an E2/E2e. The C3's were my "serious" light. My magnum!


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## ampdude (Dec 14, 2019)

archimedes said:


> My guess is that the C2-BK have *recently* gotten much harder to find, possibly due to higher collecting demand.



I forget to mention this. At the time, I always thought that since the C2 is an expensive light, why would you opt for the far less durable finish? I think a lot of people probably thought the same way I did as the C2-BK MSRP was only a few dollars less than the C2-HA. I think it was like $119 vs. $124. It is basically a 6P-BK head and tailcap screwed onto a C2-BK body. Maybe Surefire just made less of them as well for this reason. And the C2-BK might not meet milspec contract standards. Not that I haven't seen plenty of SF type II lights in military cages, like 6P's especially. But, you know what I'm getting at.


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## Coppet (Dec 14, 2019)

Well, I'm still pretty new about Surefire, I joined via the entry level drug Solarforce. Both my 6P and the C2 are in absolute new condition and although I often use them only in the house or around the house, for car repairs for example the Solarforce models have to be used, practically as a stunt double 





And I have to join Ampdude, I always thought the C2-HA and other HA Surefire were the more expensive "Magnum" models
But what interests me still, in the pictures of the C2 models in this thread I see almost exclusively C2 with the twisty tailcap as with the 6P? My C2 has the clicky tailcap, did it come later or is this a retrofitted C2 I have?


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## scout24 (Dec 14, 2019)

I'm sure someone more knowledgeable will come along, but every C2 that has passed through my hands has come stock with the twisty tailcap. I've added clicky tails to most of mine, some Surefire and some McClicky conversion kits, some of which were added to aftermarket tailcaps...


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## ven (Dec 14, 2019)

All my c2, 6p , z2 came to me with twist tail caps . 6p from vinh had his 10a switch. So i got a few Mcclicky, replaced a few with the intention of keeping 1 or 2 original.............never happened. So most are mcClicky, others are 10a, just makes changing or programming modes easier than the twisty for me. As most of my drivers are programable. Not a deal killer with a tiwsty, as have programmed them , just find clicky more user friendly.

I would hazard a guess someone has changed the innards to a clicky prior to you.
What is the inside of the tail like? that would make it easier to tell.
Usually copper or brass retainer, looks like this if a McClicky


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## badtziscool (Dec 14, 2019)

Coppet said:


> Well, I'm still pretty new about Surefire, I joined via the entry level drug Solarforce. Both my 6P and the C2 are in absolute new condition and although I often use them only in the house or around the house, for car repairs for example the Solarforce models have to be used, practically as a stunt double
> 
> 
> 
> ...



The tailcap you have on your C2 is a Z58 tailcap. Definitely not stock hardware for a C2. Stock is z41. Someone must have replaced it before you took possession. Nothing wrong with it. It works just fine.


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## archimedes (Dec 14, 2019)

ampdude said:


> .... I'm probably one of the weirdest C series fans out there though. I prefer the round body C3 over the flat body C3, but I prefer the flat body C2 over the round body C2....



No, I'm the same


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## Coppet (Dec 14, 2019)

badtziscool said:


> The tailcap you have on your C2 is a Z58 tailcap.



You're right, I just googled it, it's really a Z58 tailcap. So the C2 was never delivered with a Z58 but always with a Z41 tailcap? 
Now of course I would like to have a Z41 in HAIII but I think it won't be easy to find
A McClicky is definitely not built in, I would have noticed that because I already had McClickys in my hand. But I'm very satisfied with the Z58 tailcap, especially with programmable drop-ins it's a bit easier.


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## archimedes (Dec 14, 2019)

Coppet said:


> You're right, I just googled it, it's really a Z58 tailcap. So the C2 was never delivered with a Z58 but always with a Z41 tailcap?



Not "normally" , but with SureFire there have been lots of unusual / rare special-editions, one-offs, prototypes, promo releases, etc. So hard to say with certainty, but I can't easily recall an example off the top of my head.



Coppet said:


> Now of course I would like to have a Z41 in HAIII but I think it won't be easy to find



Ehh, a fair number of C2-HA owners have "upgraded" to clicky tailcaps over the years, so a WTB (and/or auction sites) might have a pretty reasonable chance of success.

Far less C2 have been parted out than 6P, though, so it is certainly much easier to find stock Z41 in BK finish.

Oveready also do a replica of the Z41 in HA-natural, and I believe you can order it with "twisty" internals, if you don't care that it wouldn't be SureFire OEM.



Coppet said:


> A McClicky is definitely not built in, I would have noticed that because I already had McClickys in my hand. But I'm very satisfied with the Z58 tailcap, especially with programmable drop-ins it's a bit easier.



Be aware that the McClickie internals are higher amperage rated than the stock SF Z58. Otherwise, they are pretty similar.


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## archimedes (Dec 14, 2019)

There are other good SF tail options for the C-series, beyond only the Z41 and Z58, too ...


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## thermal guy (Dec 14, 2019)

I wouldn’t mine putting a McClicky in in Z41.Is there anyone that sells just the brass ring? I already have a bunch of McClicky


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## ven (Dec 14, 2019)

archimedes said:


> There are other good SF tail options for the C-series, beyond only the Z41 and Z58, too ...





:rock::rock::bow::bow::wow:


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## Coppet (Dec 14, 2019)

These two tailcaps certainly don't exist in the shop around the corner, very nice :wow::wow:


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## archimedes (Dec 14, 2019)

thermal guy said:


> I wouldn’t mine putting a McClicky in in Z41.Is there anyone that sells just the brass ring? I already have a bunch of McClicky


Yes, Oveready does (or did)



ven said:


> :rock::rock::bow::bow::wow:





Coppet said:


> These two tailcaps certainly don't exist in the shop around the corner, very nice :wow::wow:



Thank you both


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## lightsdog (Dec 15, 2019)

I read all of this thread and I'm happy that I'm not alone in my fondness for Surefire lights,especially the M/C 2 series.

I have three C2's one still NIP and the other two with upgraded click tailcaps and LED's.

My M2 has a Surefire clicky with a rubber ring at the base and an LED.


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## ven (Dec 15, 2019)

Your far from alone lightsdog, there are many many more. Facebook has a couple of closed groups with many members. Not to mention the other threads here, E and 6p etc.

The surefires have kept my interest for years, that is never going away. Although i dont add that many, i still keep an eye out. My latest being the m6. I have been wanting one for a while, both the 250 and 500lm bulbs which make for an amazing beam. For day to day(or night to night) it has a lumens factory 319a in








Love the smaller surefires 2








6p's





c2's




m2




g2z




z2's








work use surefires, g2/6p and z2





These are my fav ones, all run 16650 which keeps the body standard(much prefer). I have maybe 3 bored surefires in total. I have no plans for any more, 16650 is enough for my wants,needs and uses.


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## lightsdog (Dec 15, 2019)

Nice group of lights ven.I see different heads on some.

I've never owned an M6 although I do own two M4 Devastators.Last night I placed two 165650's in one M4 and was surprised it worked.


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## Kestrel (Dec 15, 2019)

lightsdog said:


> [...] Last night I placed two 165650's in one M4 and was surprised it worked.


I'm just suprised you could get those cells to fit - not sure of their form factor, but they sound way larger than the typical 16650's.


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## peter yetman (Dec 15, 2019)

You had me going there, for a bit.
O


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## scout24 (Dec 15, 2019)

M400 handheld? 😁


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## lightsdog (Dec 15, 2019)

Kestrel said:


> I'm just suprised you could get those cells to fit - not sure of their form factor, but they sound way larger than the typical 16650's.




You don't know me well.My wife said I could shrink anything.I just had to put it into the dryer.LOL

All my fellow Microholics know this.


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## Woods Walker (Dec 15, 2019)

Fits my hands perfectly for that cigar hold.


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## scout24 (Jan 4, 2020)

Got my C2 back from Bykfixer today, as pristine as when it left. He even threw in a new P60 bulb and a sweet little 2xAA host for a Yuji led! It worked great, took 30 seconds, and now has a place of honor on the "flashlight shelf". Thanks, and I hope the test drive swayed you one way or the other. 😁


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## bykfixer (Jan 4, 2020)

I'll keep one eye fixed on the used market for one Scout. Now one thing it did cause was to dust off my first 6P with an M61WLL and dig out a Z-59 and Elzetta lanyard ring for it. Your clickied C2 is pretty sweet. 

That old Bright Star minimag clone is my favorite Yuji host.


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## thermal guy (Jan 7, 2020)

I was lucky enough to score one of them cooling heads but can’t get it to work with the clip on. Maybe a bigger spacer is needed. I’d be left with a gap but think it would work.


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## thermal guy (Jan 19, 2020)

Ano mismatch is pretty bad on my new to me Z32 but it’s a user not a shelf queen and god do I love in on there! I may very well have to buy another. Can’t stand only having one of something I like.


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## archimedes (Jan 19, 2020)

thermal guy said:


> .... Ano mismatch is pretty bad on my new to me Z32 but it’s a user not a shelf queen and god do I love in on there! I may very well have to buy another. Can’t stand only having one of something I like.



For your next one, maybe try to get the earlier gen version ? Both are cool, but I think the vintage version brings the old school style


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## thermal guy (Jan 19, 2020)

The old version is the one that’s completely round?


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## archimedes (Jan 19, 2020)

thermal guy said:


> The old version is the one that’s completely round?


There are a few different generations, and SF changed their naming terminology along the way (as usual, lol)

More details here ...

https://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?199699-New-SF-Z32


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## thermal guy (Jan 19, 2020)

Ya that’s what I was thinking. The old “round” version doesn’t really appeal to me. The new one looks and I believe it is much tougher.


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## ven (Jan 19, 2020)

thermal guy said:


> Ano mismatch is pretty bad on my new to me Z32 but it’s a user not a shelf queen and god do I love in on there! I may very well have to buy another. Can’t stand only having one of something I like.




Nice C2 or is that M2


I do love the larger z32 bezel of the M2 , as the body is pretty much the same as a C2, you really have an M2 now


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## archimedes (Jan 19, 2020)

thermal guy said:


> Ya that’s what I was thinking. The old “round” version doesn’t really appeal to me. The new one looks and I believe it is much tougher.



I was actually thinking of the bezel piece from the LU60A assembly, which apparently didn't have its own P/N. That one is just as strong, possibly even moreso.

But yeah, the other (earliest gen) version wouldn't look as good (subjectively) or be as tough (objectively)


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## ampdude (Jan 20, 2020)

thermal guy said:


> Ya that’s what I was thinking. The old “round” version doesn’t really appeal to me. The new one looks and I believe it is much tougher.



I prefer the finned look of the version before the newest one. The oldest version and the newest version never really did appeal to me. To me the finned version is the only M2 head.


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## thermal guy (Jan 28, 2020)

Been using mine for awhile with my new diffused lens and M361N. Got to say it’s just perfect with 3 levels of brightness and the ability to go from a soft beam to a spot at will. Feels more solid in the hand then any other SF I have.


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## ven (Jan 28, 2020)

my fav c2


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## thermal guy (Jan 28, 2020)

Ven. How do I get my cooling head to fit on my C2? It hits the clip.


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## ven (Jan 28, 2020)

thermal guy said:


> Ven. How do I get my cooling head to fit on my C2? It hits the clip.



Tough call, it is a variable depending on what drop in. So for example, malkoff/sportac/EDC+ types of p60 will allow the bezel to touch up. Broader walled shells leave a gap. All i do is just gently run the z32 up to(no need to lock up super tight). Just nip gently to not mark the head.


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## thermal guy (Jan 28, 2020)

Got ya. Thanks. Think I saw somewhere of a mod to the clip but can’t seem to find it now.


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## ampdude (Jan 31, 2020)

I believe that post you may be referring to said something about shaving some material off of the top of the clip.


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## thermal guy (Jan 31, 2020)

Ya something like that or a special bend. Can’t recall. I got my Z32 on there now and like it much better.


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## sidfishez (Feb 1, 2020)

ven said:


> Tough call, it is a variable depending on what drop in. So for example, malkoff/sportac/EDC+ types of p60 will allow the bezel to touch up. Broader walled shells leave a gap. All i do is just gently run the z32 up to(no need to lock up super tight). Just nip gently to not mark the head.



If you wish, you could replace your existing clip with Surefire's newer long reversible clip. I've done that on mine and the new clips fits underneath the cooling head till its fully seated against the body.


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## ven (Feb 2, 2020)

Cool info, thanks for that sldfishez


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## yazkaz (Feb 4, 2020)

ven said:


> Nice C2 or is that M2
> I do love the larger z32 bezel of the M2 , as the body is pretty much the same as a C2, you really have an M2 now


That's a makeshift M2 (ie. C2 with Z32), the only difference being the body marking (C2 instead of M2).
I have at least two of such setups, plus a native M2. All nice setups but requires special holster designs for the Z32......


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## yazkaz (Feb 4, 2020)

bykfixer said:


> As a Non-C2 owner I've gotta ask……
> What makes the C2 so sought after?


My take:
a. 6P style config but with available HAIII ano;
b. Guaranteed Pyrex-lensed Z44;
c. Makeshift M2 config (by adding a matching Z32)

The caveat:
a. Original rubber parts are hard to source. If the locking tab on the ring is broken then there's no way to source a replacement from SF (under current situations).
Luckily LF has HQ cloned silicone replacements available (as of 2020) so this is now a non-issue.....


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## yazkaz (Feb 4, 2020)

archimedes said:


> I was actually thinking of the bezel piece from the LU60A assembly, which apparently didn't have its own P/N. That one is just as strong, possibly even moreso.
> But yeah, the other (earliest gen) version wouldn't look as good (subjectively) or be as tough (objectively)


That's the Z32 on the LU60a...

The earliest-gen Z32 however is another story and didn't even come with Pyrex (only press-fit Lexan) or HAIII treatment. It is to be forgotten for good......


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## thermal guy (Feb 5, 2020)

The C2 just feels better in the hand. That square body is perfect to hold on to and compared to like a6P. To me it feels much more solid. I’m sure it weighs more as well.


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## bykfixer (Feb 9, 2020)

Lumens Factory just released replacement grip rings. Also available in glow in the dark and blaze orange.


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## Buck91 (Feb 9, 2020)

bykfixer said:


> Lumens Factory just released replacement grip rings. Also available in glow in the dark and blaze orange.



Did they? I only noticed the g2/6P grip rings on their website.


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## ven (Feb 9, 2020)

Yes seen them on FB, look pretty cool to be honest, orange, GITD and black. Tempted.........but i am good to go for now.


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## thermal guy (Feb 9, 2020)

Oh you know you’re not 😁


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## peter yetman (Feb 9, 2020)

Panto season is over otherwise I'd say,
"Oh yes he is!"
P


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## ven (Feb 9, 2020)

:laughing:


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## yazkaz (Feb 10, 2020)

Buck91 said:


> Did they? I only noticed the g2/6P grip rings on their website.


Terminal grip ring for the Z2/Z3/M3/etc. and dedicated grip ring for C2/C3/M2 are all available.
These are 100% clones ("faithful reproduction") made of high quality silicone.


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## thermal guy (Feb 15, 2020)

My finished “for now” C2. Z32 shock bezel SW02 tail and loaded with a Malkoff M61N.


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## archimedes (Feb 15, 2020)

Looks great, thanks for sharing it here with us.


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## thermal guy (Feb 15, 2020)

Thanks arch. That SW02 is one hell of a tail! Looks, feel,shape. Love everything about it.


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## ven (Feb 16, 2020)

Very nice...........the background isn't too shabby either


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## thermal guy (Feb 16, 2020)

😁 thanks Ven.


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## F250XLT (Mar 29, 2020)

The C2 is one of the lights I kept when I sold off the majority of my collection. I love the proportion, square body, and it’s one of the most aesthetically pleasing lights in history IMO. The stock Incan bulb is pretty solid, but it’s really brought to life with a drop in mod (I’ve got a triple in mine). Oh, and clickie switch mod is mandatory IMO.


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## ven (Mar 29, 2020)

Pics pics pics, we need more pics

Its too close to call for me now, my 1st love the c2, but the z2 is up there now. 

For now, a little line up pic





My fav c2





xhp70 shaved dome, fed on a 2x18350 diet


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## thermal guy (Mar 29, 2020)

My modest C2 collection.6-9 month ago never even held one. Absolutely love them now.


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## ven (Mar 30, 2020)

3 is the magic number

Yes an awesome piece of lighting equipment. These surefires have saved me money, nothing comes close in design and anodising.........nothing for me. So i am not tempted to buy other flashlights right now=save money.

They dont make em like the use to ,springs to mind


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## F250XLT (Mar 30, 2020)

The lone C2 in my very modest collection, I feel so in adequate. [emoji51]


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## thermal guy (Mar 30, 2020)

Oh no my friend I think this is an exception to the rule. One is one😁


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## F250XLT (Mar 30, 2020)

thermal guy said:


> Oh no my friend I think this is an exception to the rule. One is one



Why thank you, I am quite fond of it, even it it does have a somewhat outdated triple (EDC+ X60L3 XP-G2)


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## ven (Mar 30, 2020)

I have the edc+ 4000k xp-g2 also, love the warm beam. Shame the high is so close to medium (to the eyes). They make nicely made good value drop ins. I am also a fan of the sportac triples (maybe 6 of those,mainly Nichia)


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## F250XLT (Mar 30, 2020)

ven said:


> I have the edc+ 4000k xp-g2 also, love the warm beam. Shame the high is so close to medium (to the eyes). They make nicely made good value drop ins. I am also a fan of the sportac triples (maybe 6 of those,mainly Nichia)



I agree, the med to high are too similar, wish it was programmable. 

Then again, my Hyperion is, and I can't get that one figured out.


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## Bullzeyebill (Mar 30, 2020)

Does the C2 LED model count? Same body.

Bill


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## ven (Mar 31, 2020)

It must, as i would hazard a guess Bill, most would use LEDs in their C2's. Occasionally i use the bulb, but all mine either have xhp70, triple, quad inside mostly.


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## Baldmonkey22 (Feb 8, 2021)

Who can tell me how old these are? The lighter one came from ebay no package but never used. They said it was about 18yrs old. and the plum colored c2 is a bored out 18650 from oveready back in 2013 im just wondering if they were buying nos.


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## ampdude (Feb 11, 2021)

The one on the left would be 2011-12 production or newer. It seemed back then like they fully switched over to the new logo in 2012. If you say you got it in 2013 that makes sense. The anodizing was all over the place on those from plum to light gray. The one on the right is likely 2010 or older. Just from the photo I would guess 2006-08ish. It seemed to me like the light gray natural type III HA on those type of lights was most prevalent from 2003-2010. It might be easier to pin down a date on that one with a serial.


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## DRoc (Dec 19, 2021)

I recently put a HO4 in my C2 and used one of those rechargeable 18650 batteries with the port directly on the positive end. 
I never would thought twenty years ago when I received my first C2 I’d be able to have usb compatible Incan on a Surefire. Wow.


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## Megalamuffin (Jan 6, 2022)

Finally got my hands on a C2! It was new in the package but I didn’t leave it in there. The head is mismatched anyways so I may as well bang it up. 






I swapped a few parts. I have several malkoff’s to use in it depending on my needs, all 3000k. I think this will quickly become one of my very favorite lights. It also looks so dang cool!


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## ampdude (Jan 26, 2022)

They're often mismatched parts like many Surefires. Part of the charm of the type III natural finish.

That and it's generally tougher than type III black HA.


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## yazkaz (Jan 26, 2022)

ampdude said:


> They're often mismatched parts like many Surefires. Part of the charm of the type III natural finish.
> That and it's generally tougher than type III black HA.


We all know that the exact Type 3 Hard Clear shading cannot be controlled with ease, which depends on a lot of factors during the ano process. Do also be reminded that SF did not actually undergo Type 3 Hard Clear (OD) anodize but instead colored Type 3 to mimic the OD feel, in many cases.

But why did you say that Type 3 HC is tougher than Type 3 Hard Black? Maybe you were referring to Type 2 Black (not exactly considered HA)? Or maybe the substrate used in Type 2 and Type 3 are of different grades (eg. 6020 vs. 6061)? More clarification appreciated.


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## ampdude (Jan 26, 2022)

Yea, it's known Surefire did use dye with some of their "natural" lights. The ones they did such as the black type III ones would be using dye, which would make the finish weaker than a true type III.


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## yazkaz (Jan 26, 2022)

ampdude said:


> Yea, it's known Surefire did use dye with some of their "natural" lights. The ones they did such as the black type III ones would be using dye, which would make the finish weaker than a true type III.


I think SF turned to a lot of green dye on later light batches to mimic the Olive Drab/Tactical Green effect. Like I said, true Type 3 Hard Clear (Natural) anodizing shade is very hard to control, and depends on the quality of the metal substrate.

If, for example, the aluminum (alloy) substrate has a lot of tin content in it, then the Type 3 Hard Clear finish will be rendered very pale (say, very light grey) to a very unacceptable level. Perhaps that's why SF used green dye to bring back the OD look to certain degree. Otherwise, the only other option is the Type 3 Hard Black anodize which (of course) involves black anodizing dye.

Regardless of color, the Type 3 anodize in Hard Clear or Hard Black should be the same, as long as the correct thickness is carried out. For fresh metal surfaces such thickness will be 2 mils; for reanodized surface the thickness will have to be increased to 3 mil level (with a range of 0.0028-0.0033").


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## bykfixer (Jan 26, 2022)

Many of the SureFire lights were aimed at military applications, hence the dull olive drab coloring. Perhaps the gray colored C2 was developed with Navy in mind? And black for law enforcement?

I think I can say with some certainty they were not thinking of "sex appeal" for those flashlight junkies back then but more about appeasing majors and generals who decided what brand of flashlight to purchase by the truck load.


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## rwolfenstein (Mar 6, 2022)

Lets see, well the second "tactical" flashlight I bought after having much success with my Surefire G2 was actually the C2. I got it at a local sporting goods place that is long out of business. I guess the C2 had check marked all of the items I was looking for, it has good throw and hotspot (I know its the lamp design). It also had a comfy grip for use with a good for night shooting. I think the only thing I upgraded on mine over the years was, I added a McClicky tailcap and replaced my broken pocket clip with a two way deep carry clip.


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## yazkaz (Mar 10, 2022)

rwolfenstein said:


> Lets see, well the second "tactical" flashlight I bought after having much success with my Surefire G2 was actually the C2. I got it at a local sporting goods place that is long out of business. I guess the C2 had check marked all of the items I was looking for, it has good throw and hotspot (I know its the lamp design). It also had a comfy grip for use with a good for night shooting. I think the only thing I upgraded on mine over the years was, I added a McClicky tailcap and replaced my broken pocket clip with a two way deep carry clip.


With the stock C2 there are two major things to upgrade, which I deem compulsory: the Z41 McClicky chassis (esp. if you lean towards to the LED route) and the Z44 bezel ring upgrade (either flat or six-cren). Not a fan of pocket clips though, but still think the two-way clip substitute is the right choice due to its lower profile. Otherwise, without the clip I'd use LF's void fill piece to fill up that empty clip socket.

The other thing to invest on are spare grip rings, since they break after prolonged use (esp. with that little nub). SF stopped supplying spares after 2017 so your other alternative would be LF's cloned variant (made of higher quality silicone than SF's and available in three colors).


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## rwolfenstein (Mar 10, 2022)

yazkaz said:


> With the stock C2 there are two major things to upgrade, which I deem compulsory: the Z41 McClicky chassis (esp. if you lean towards to the LED route) and the Z44 bezel ring upgrade (either flat or six-cren). Not a fan of pocket clips though, but still think the two-way clip substitute is the right choice due to its lower profile. Otherwise, without the clip I'd use LF's void fill piece to fill up that empty clip socket.
> 
> The other thing to invest on are spare grip rings, since they break after prolonged use (esp. with that little nub). SF stopped supplying spares after 2017 so your other alternative would be LF's cloned variant (made of higher quality silicone than SF's and available in three colors).



Ironically now and days the C2 sits in a drawer. I usually carry a surefire/haley strategic branded light that is called the DFT or a surefire E2E with a lumens factory 110 lumen bulb in it. I like comfort and big 6P sized lights seem like they are good for belt holsters not pocket carry.


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## yazkaz (Mar 11, 2022)

rwolfenstein said:


> Ironically now and days the C2 sits in a drawer. I usually carry a surefire/haley strategic branded light that is called the DFT or a surefire E2E with a lumens factory 110 lumen bulb in it. I like comfort and big 6P sized lights seem like they are good for belt holsters not pocket carry.


6P-style lights are always holster-carried AFAIK. They may seem bulky these days but are still better in grip and more potential in terms of bulb upgrades and such. E-series are more for compact carry/concealment but that doesn't mean it cannot be holster-carried.

For the record I carry all my E-lights in (custom-made) holsters only, never bare in trouser pockets. Bare-carrying a light inside a trouser pocket will inflict severe surface wear/damage to the flashlight in the long run. I've been there (with a modded cheapskate Chinese light) so I won't repeat the same mistake with more premium lights like the C-series, E-series etc. etc.


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## rwolfenstein (Mar 11, 2022)

yazkaz said:


> 6P-style lights are always holster-carried AFAIK. They may seem bulky these days but are still better in grip and more potential in terms of bulb upgrades and such. E-series are more for compact carry/concealment but that doesn't mean it cannot be holster-carried.
> 
> For the record I carry all my E-lights in (custom-made) holsters only, never bare in trouser pockets. Bare-carrying a light inside a trouser pocket will inflict severe surface wear/damage to the flashlight in the long run. I've been there (with a modded cheapskate Chinese light) so I won't repeat the same mistake with more premium lights like the C-series, E-series etc. etc.



Oh I get that pocket carry and general use can destroy flashlights. This 6P Defender I used at my work since 2011 clearing buildings and dealing with general turds of society. Only the tailcap went but the rest of it is solid.


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## yazkaz (Mar 12, 2022)

rwolfenstein said:


> Oh I get that pocket carry and general use can destroy flashlights. This 6P Defender I used at my work since 2011 clearing buildings and dealing with general turds of society. Only the tailcap went but the rest of it is solid.


I've looked at the pics; that's how my Chinese light mod has ended up in. What was similar to you case is that the tailcap boot broke and rendered the switch chassis unusable, only that the tailcap chassis could not be disassembled for user maintenance.

So what exactly went wrong with the original Z41 tailcap, how did it get busted? Unless the tailcap host gets dented badly the rest of the chassis can be replaced easily with the McClicky upgrade.

As for your 6PD, a full strip-and-reanodize (in HAIII) should give it new life (minus the white lettering).


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## rwolfenstein (Mar 12, 2022)

yazkaz said:


> I've looked at the pics; that's how my Chinese light mod has ended up in. What was similar to you case is that the tailcap boot broke and rendered the switch chassis unusable, only that the tailcap chassis could not be disassembled for user maintenance.
> 
> So what exactly went wrong with the original Z41 tailcap, how did it get busted? Unless the tailcap host gets dented badly the rest of the chassis can be replaced easily with the McClicky upgrade.
> 
> As for your 6PD, a full strip-and-reanodize (in HAIII) should give it new life (minus the white lettering).


Well the 6PD did come originally with a z59 tailcap not a z41. It's nice to have the clicks but the rubber boot always goes our first and then the guts shortly after.


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## bykfixer (Mar 12, 2022)

You can get a new rubber boot at Lumens Factory rwolf. Or a clicky Z41 style there. I did not see a Z59 style there though. 
The owner is big on keeping classic SureFire products going or if one chooses they can obtain reproduction type of classic SureFire products.


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