# Best high capacity 18650?



## Cheeze1617 (Jul 24, 2014)

What 18650 battery do you usually use.


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## SM83 (Jul 24, 2014)

*Re: Favorite 18650 battery of your flashlight*

Will be watching this one


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## MBentz (Jul 24, 2014)

*Re: Favorite 18650 battery of your flashlight*

I don't have any high drain lights, so I just use NCR18650B cells. Nothing fancy.


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## harro (Jul 25, 2014)

*Re: Favorite 18650 battery of your flashlight*

The majority of my 18650's are Eagletac protected's. Mainly for the base cells they employ. 2500's would be in the majority, with 3100's next. I even have a few of the old original black and red 2400's that are still going strong. 99% of my charging is done with a 4 bay SoshineV3 and I also use a 2 bay Pila on the oddest of occasion's.

:tinfoil:


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## välineurheilija (Jul 25, 2014)

*Re: Favorite 18650 battery of your flashlight*

-Eagletac 2500(blue/white)protected
-Keeppower 2600/3100/3400protected
-Panasonic IMR 2200(dont remember the model)
-Lumilight 3400protected
-AW IMR 2000?



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## dazed1 (Jul 25, 2014)

*Re: Favorite 18650 battery of your flashlight*

NCR18650B Panas green

NCR18650PF Panas green


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## Rinspeed (Jul 25, 2014)

*Re: Favorite 18650 battery of your flashlight*

Orbtronics 3100s, great customer service from them and very high quality so I'm sure I will stick with them. Last order I placed was on a Saturday right after lunch and the package was delivered Monday afternoon. How many companies receive an order on a Saturday and get the damn thing out the same day. :thumbsup:


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## tyxxvxl (Jul 25, 2014)

*Re: Favorite 18650 battery of your flashlight*

I'm using the panny NCR18650B in my lights.
Since you're from utah too cheeze I know a place to get them in SLC for about $4 each.


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## Bob Damon (Jul 25, 2014)

*Re: Favorite 18650 battery of your flashlight*

Good question. I've been trying different brands to get a feel for what works,what doesn't.
i have some Panasonic NCR18650B, some Eagletac 3100 protected, some Olight 3400, and sone Nitecore 2600.
if I could find a reliable, cheap USA based source for the NCR18650B, I would probably standardize on thrm.


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## hiuintahs (Jul 26, 2014)

*Re: Favorite 18650 battery of your flashlight*



tyxxvxl said:


> I'm using the panny NCR18650B in my lights.
> Since you're from utah too cheeze I know a place to get them in SLC for about $4 each.



I'd also be interested in knowing where?


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## dazed1 (Jul 26, 2014)

*Re: Favorite 18650 battery of your flashlight*

There is 0 chance, you can get 4x NCR18650B for 16$


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## kj2 (Jul 26, 2014)

*Re: Favorite 18650 battery of your flashlight*

Eagletac 18650s. Do have a few unprotected Panasonic 2900, and two unbranded protected Panasonic 3100.


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## Shiftyk5 (Jul 26, 2014)

*Re: Favorite 18650 battery of your flashlight*

LG ICR18650D1 4.35v 3000mAh
Panasonic NCR18650PF 2900 mAh 
Panasonic NCR18650BD 3200 mAh
Sony US18650VTC5 2600 mAh

Thats what I'm using currently. The LG 4.35v seem to make my SRT6vn a tad brighter, but I could just be imaging things. It does make it get hotter a little faster though.


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## dazed1 (Jul 26, 2014)

*Re: Favorite 18650 battery of your flashlight*



Shiftyk5 said:


> Thats what I'm using currently. The LG 4.35v seem to make my SRT6vn a tad brighter, but I could just be imaging things. It does make it get hotter a little faster though.



Hotter then with the VTC5? that's really surprising....


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## Shiftyk5 (Jul 26, 2014)

*Re: Favorite 18650 battery of your flashlight*

Yeah, just seems like that too me. I have not run tests to prove it though. 

I'm hoping we will have some proof with good testing between the 2 in the next two weeks. So stay tuned!


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## ven (Jul 26, 2014)

*Re: Favorite 18650 battery of your flashlight*

Various from Samsung and LG 3.8v(4.35) and do notice a longer run time between charges. The KeepPower 18650 from 3100mah to IMR 30A 2100mah
Lots of sanyo 2800 and pany 3100/3400 protected and unprotected.Sony vtc5,efest 3400mah
All my lights are fed,usually down to the output to mah,example my tk61vn uses sanyo 2800,my tk75vn uses pany 3400,sr52vn uses KPs 3100 and miniVN 3400 efest.

Few spares




No fav cells,just what is best food for a specific light for value/runtime/performance 

I guess thess pany cells are one of my used be it protected or not



These efest 3400 are good value cells







Single cell i tend to go with unprotected,mutli protected cells,high A like vinh lights then IMR


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## Dr. Mario (Jul 26, 2014)

*Re: Favorite 18650 battery of your flashlight*

A123 3.2 Volts 18650 Lithium : Iron Phosphate cells (I have bought two, and they last surprisingly long in my handheld 520nm green direct diode laser, and might be used for SST-50 white LED flashlight or a 5 - 10 Watts 365nm blacklight flashlight eventually).

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## hoop762 (Jul 27, 2014)

*Re: Favorite 18650 battery of your flashlight*

I go with KeepPower 3400s mostly. I have some soshine 3400s that have preformed well too. 

And I have some tenergy 2600s. They work well, but lower capacity. 

The KeepPowers are my favorite. 

In my pd35vn I use unprotected AW 2000s. They hold up great.


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## amham (Jul 27, 2014)

*Re: Favorite 18650 battery of your flashlight*

Orbtronic and their Panasonic NCR18650B 3100/3400 cells. Great customer service and price for repeat customers.


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## tyxxvxl (Jul 27, 2014)

*Re: Favorite 18650 battery of your flashlight*

Utah guys, NPS store 1600 Empire Rd. Salt lake city Ut. Battery section. 3 pack wrapped in blue plastic. $12.93 for three. Take off blue plasic and you will find green NCR18650B's.
Believe it or not.


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## ChrisGarrett (Jul 27, 2014)

*Re: Favorite 18650 battery of your flashlight*

I'm running some naked LG ICR D1 3000mAh 4.35v cells and some LG ICR E1 3200mAh 4.35v cells and they seem to be working out well. I have the Xtar VP2 charger, so this handles the 4.35v (3.8v nominal) cells quite easily.

Chris


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## kyhunter1 (Jul 27, 2014)

*Re: Favorite 18650 battery of your flashlight*

AW 3100 mah 18650's in my bored Surefire's and Keeppower button top's 3400's in the rest. This eliminates any fitment or contact issues.


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## UnderPar (Jul 28, 2014)

*Re: Favorite 18650 battery of your flashlight*

I use the Panasonic 18650B in all my lights, protected and unprotected.


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## Str8stroke (Jul 28, 2014)

*Re: Favorite 18650 battery of your flashlight*

Efest brand for my "hot" lights. And Fenix for "normal" lights.


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## fivemega (Jul 28, 2014)

*Re: Favorite 18650 battery of your flashlight*

*For incandescent flashlights, I use protected Redilast 3400 and very happy with.*


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## hiuintahs (Jul 30, 2014)

*Re: Favorite 18650 battery of your flashlight*



tyxxvxl said:


> Utah guys, NPS store 1600 Empire Rd. Salt lake city Ut. Battery section. 3 pack wrapped in blue plastic. $12.93 for three. Take off blue plasic and you will find green NCR18650B's.
> Believe it or not.


Thanks for the tip. As far as I can tell they are genuine NCR18650B's. I looked them over close. I think the reason they are this cheap is because the label didn't make sense. The blue label had them as "NI MH 1000mAh 3.7V." Well the 3.7V is correct. NPS tends to sell lots of weird stuff and who knows where they got them. Obviously these wouldn't be sell-able as labeled in a normal retail store.


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## tyxxvxl (Jul 30, 2014)

*Re: Favorite 18650 battery of your flashlight*

Ha ha at least someone beliwved me.


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## dazed1 (Aug 1, 2014)

*Re: Favorite 18650 battery of your flashlight*

So why would anyone wrap amazing cells in junk model/wrapper?

12$ for 3pcs? that's epic price.


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## Wiggle (Aug 1, 2014)

*Re: Favorite 18650 battery of your flashlight*

Fasttech Panasonic 3400 in my Armytek Predator and P60 hosts. Fasttech Panasonic 3100 in my K50vn.


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## cland72 (Aug 1, 2014)

*Re: Favorite 18650 battery of your flashlight*

I have four Japan-made Panasonic protected 18650, 3400mah. Best bang for the buck, IMO.


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## Overclocker (Aug 1, 2014)

*Re: Favorite 18650 battery of your flashlight*



dazed1 said:


> So why would anyone wrap amazing cells in junk model/wrapper?
> 
> 12$ for 3pcs? that's epic price.




so they don't have to be declared in air cargo as "dangerous goods". crazy


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## tyxxvxl (Aug 1, 2014)

*Re: Favorite 18650 battery of your flashlight*

I have no idea why these batteries are so cheap, but I'm not complaining. I have ten of them now and haven't had a problem with any of them. The have all come ot of the bag at 3.66 v and charge up to about 4.22v right off the charger.


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## sillycelly (Nov 1, 2014)

*Looking for Reliable 18650 Batteries - Any Recommendations?*

I am trying to commute by bike more frequently. The days are getting shorter, though, so I need a reliable light source. I bought a Fenix BT20 back in February 2014. The light itself works great ... when the batteries work. 

When I purchased the light, I also purchased 4 UltraFire 18650 batteries. I also purchased a NiteCore Intellicharger i4. The Fenix is designed to run off of 2x 18650 batteries or 4x CR123 batteries. I don't have any CR123 batteries. 

I don't know what is wrong with the 18650 batteries that I have. When I first got them, they seemed to work just fine. Within a week (and after very minimal usage) one of them failed. My light went from full power (green indicator) to partial power (red indicator and beam won't go into any of the optional brightness states). The batteries weren't used long enough to drain them, but I put them on the recharger to see what's up. One of them read as full power, but the other indicated as bad. That's why light wasn't working - one of the batteries had failed. Replace with one of my other 18650 batteries - light worked again. Within a few months, another battery failed. Same way as before. By September, 3 of my 4 original batteries had failed. I wrote to the seller, who sent me 2 new batteries. Just today (November 1, 2014), the last of my original 4 batteries failed. I'm down to 2 batteries with no more back-ups. 

Questions for the Wisdom of the Forum:
1. Is this normal? I don't have any experience with 18650 batteries. I got them because they are supposed to be rechargeable. I understand that even rechargeable batteries have a usable lifespan. But 10 months? (Honestly, very minimal usage over the summer months when daylight was not an issue.)
2. Can you recommend any 18650 batteries that would be more reliable? I can't exactly run up to the grocery store to get more, so I'd like to keep 2 in my light and at least 2 (maybe 4) at home as a backup in case one fails.
3. Is there anyway to "fix" or "repair" a failed battery? What do I do with these? Just chuck 'em? 
4. I had read something about these batteries having some kind of protection circuit. Maybe the circuit has been tripped. I have no clue. Is there any way to test and or reset that? 

For what its worth, here is what I mean when I say my battery fails. My charger has 3 indicator lights on each battery charging slot. When you insert a battery, the indicators will blink a couple of times and then indicate the battery charge level. A "dead" battery will have 0 solid and 1 blinking indicator light. A little juice in - 1 solid and 1 blinking. More juice - 2 solid and 1 blinking. Fully charged - 3 solid indicator lights. When I have 3 blinking indicator lights - that means that the battery is not working. 

The batteries say:
UltraFire 
BRC18650 3000 mAh 3.7 V Li-ion
Low Discharge rate. No memory effect.
Low reoccurring operation cost. Short-circuit and overcurrent Protection.
Sheef-life (sic) around 10 years; Environmental friendly.
Rechargeable Battery With Re/Discharging Protection Circuit

Help! Any advice is appreciated. I don't like the idea of spending money on these expensive 18650 batteries if they are going to last less than a year. Are the CR123 batteries better? Supposedly, Fenix also makes a battery unit that takes 4 AA batteries (instead of the 2x 18650s). Am I better off just getting that?

Thanks in advance.


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## SubLGT (Nov 1, 2014)

*Re: Looking for Reliable 18650 Batteries - Any Recommendations?*

Don't buy any 18650 batteries with "fire" in their name
Don't buy your 18650 batteries on ebay or at Amazon
To avoid counterfeits, buy from reputable sources.
IMO, reliable brands would be KeepPower, Efest, AW, Orbtronics, etc


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## thedoc007 (Nov 1, 2014)

*Re: Looking for Reliable 18650 Batteries - Any Recommendations?*

1. It is normal for ****Fire cells, yes. Certainly not for any QUALITY brand. Keeppower, SoShine, Eagletac, Nitecore, Orbtronic, and many other brands make good quality cells based on the Panasonic 3400 mAh cell, and none of them will give you the problems that you have experienced.
2. My personal recommendation for the cheapest quality cell would be the SoShine 3400 from Illumination Supply. Only $8.50 each, or $17.00 per pair, if you use the standard discount code. I have ordered more than twenty of that exact cell, and have had no problems whatsoever. They are also shorter than many protected cells, thus more compatible with a variety of lights. I know some people don't yet trust the brand (SoShine has released some mediocre products in the past) so if you aren't comfortable with that, Keeppower 3400 would be my alternate recommendation. They are $14 each before discount, but they are known, excellent quality, consistent cells. They also have a lower internal resistance than most other protected cells (that is a good thing, you can do a search if you want more info). 
3. No, you cannot repair a failed lithium ion battery. (You can re-wrap them if the plastic wrap is damaged, but that is about all.) Nor would it be worth the effort, even if you could. They are likely crap to begin with (most ****Fire cells are) so you'd be throwing your time and money away.
4. A tripped protection circuit will reset in your charger, that is the normal way to reset it. So that is not likely to be the problem.

More reading about ****Fire cells:

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?316888-Fake-Ultrafire-18650-battery-warning
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...st-Review-of-UltraFire-TR18650-5000mAh-(Blue)
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?280909-Ultrafire-18650-3000mA-exploded
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZTzEHsJVZhA

This is not to scare you away...quality 18650s are pretty darn safe. But you do need to buy quality, and follow basic precautions for any lithium-ion cells.


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## SubLGT (Nov 1, 2014)

*Re: Looking for Reliable 18650 Batteries - Any Recommendations?*

I have bought several flashlights from Battery Junction, and I consider them to be a reputable vendor. But it perplexes me why they choose to sell the junk Ultrafire 18650 batteries in addition to quality batteries like Efest, Nitecore, and Xtar.

They also sell Tenergy, but I am not familiar with that brand. Is it junk?


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## thedoc007 (Nov 1, 2014)

*Re: Looking for Reliable 18650 Batteries - Any Recommendations?*



SubLGT said:


> They also sell Tenergy, but I am not familiar with that brand. Is it junk?



Tenergy seems to have mixed reviews...at least that is what I have found. Many of the cells seem to work fine, but they don't appear to be as consistent as most other quality brands. It is hard to know whether user error, or the cells themselves are at fault. People with little knowledge, who buy cheap cells, are also the most likely to be ignorant about basic precautions, like using mismatched cells in series. Even a quality cell can be dangerous if abuse is involved.

That said, they aren't junk in the way that *****Fire cells are. At least you can be pretty sure Tenergy doesn't have recycled, or mismatched cells underneath the wrapper.


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## oKtosiTe (Nov 2, 2014)

*Re: Looking for Reliable 18650 Batteries - Any Recommendations?*



sillycelly said:


> Just chuck 'em?


If by that you mean "dispose of them at an appropriate recycling station/facility", then yes, that would be your best course of action for these low-quality, high-risk cells.
If you meant "throw them in the garbage bin", then no, because you'd not only place a considerable burden on the environment, but you'd also run the risk of injuring and killing other humans by starting a fire.


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## StandardBattery (Nov 2, 2014)

*Re: Looking for Reliable 18650 Batteries - Any Recommendations?*



SubLGT said:


> Don't buy any 18650 batteries with "fire" in their name
> Don't buy your 18650 batteries on ebay or at Amazon
> To avoid counterfeits, buy from reputable sources.
> IMO, reliable brands would be KeepPower, Efest, AW, Orbtronics, etc


That's a little too general; *Mountain Electronics* sells on ebay, and I think they still sell some stuff on Amazon as well and they can be trusted.



thedoc007 said:


> ... 2. My personal recommendation for the cheapest quality cell would be the SoShine 3400 from Illumination Supply. Only $8.50 each, or $17.00 per pair, if you use the standard discount code. I have ordered more than twenty of that exact cell, and have had no problems whatsoever. They are also shorter than many protected cells, thus more compatible with a variety of lights. ....


I think SoShine protected 18650 3400mAh, are a good choice right now. I understand people avoiding them though if they have had trouble in the past, I do that for Tenergy. If KeepPower does not start rating their batteries correctly they will be on my bad list too ... just because I expect them to change their cells without proper documentation at some point. 

I bought some EVVA protected 18650 3400mAh cells from ebay and they look to be OK, but the protection circuit is still an unknown entity until there is a tear down or test. They appear to be a little longer than the KeepPower cells due to a thicker protection circuit.


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## InspectHerGadget (Nov 3, 2014)

*Re: Looking for Reliable 18650 Batteries - Any Recommendations?*

Are Ultrafire batteries really THAT BAD?

They are incredibly cheap, no doubt about that.

My brother has 2x 4000mAh Ultrafire which I presume is not possible, so they're mis-labeled for a start which isn't confidence inspiring.

So far they work fine in his Thrunite TN-12.

I've bought the green Panasonic 3400mAh off ebay and had them for six months now using them in my Eagletac MX25L3 with the MT-G2 emitter and they work fine. Initially I had two failed cells, one after the other but they replaced them and not a single problem since then. I use the light a lot, several hours a week at least so I think I can safely say that they're OK. They have Sanyo PCB attached for protection.

I also bought a Thrunite Catapult V3 for $99AUD about $90USD brand new and I found the Panasonics wouldn't fit so I bought the Thrunite batteries, 3400mAh. They look like good batteries and seem to run well.


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## thedoc007 (Nov 3, 2014)

*Re: Looking for Reliable 18650 Batteries - Any Recommendations?*



InspectHerGadget said:


> Are Ultrafire batteries really THAT BAD?
> 
> They are incredibly cheap, no doubt about that.



In my opinion (supported by the data), they ARE that bad. They are cheap for a reason. Check the links I provided back in post #3. 

It might be possible to get a decent *****Fire cell, but the problem is, you just can't know in advance what you are getting. The mAh claims are meaningless, you might get recycled or mismatched cells, some *****Fire cells claim protection even when there is none, etc. This is not only annoying, but potentially dangerous. When there are very consistent, much higher quality cells available for under $10 from reliable vendors, I don't see ANY reason to go with a brand fraught with so many potential problems.

If it seems too good to be true, than it is. *****Fire cells are cheap because they are garbage. Yes, if you go through garbage, you will sometimes find something of worth. But you can't rely on any particular cell doing what it is supposed to do. That, in my opinion, is reason enough to stay away.


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## InspectHerGadget (Nov 3, 2014)

*Re: Looking for Reliable 18650 Batteries - Any Recommendations?*



thedoc007 said:


> In my opinion (supported by the data), they ARE that bad. They are cheap for a reason. Check the links I provided back in post #3.
> 
> It might be possible to get a decent *****Fire cell, but the problem is, you just can't know in advance what you are getting. The mAh claims are meaningless, you might get recycled or mismatched cells, some *****Fire cells claim protection even when there is none, etc. This is not only annoying, but potentially dangerous. When there are very consistent, much higher quality cells available for under $10 from reliable vendors, I don't see ANY reason to go with a brand fraught with so many potential problems.
> 
> If it seems too good to be true, than it is. *****Fire cells are cheap because they are garbage. Yes, if you go through garbage, you will sometimes find something of worth. But you can't rely on any particular cell doing what it is supposed to do. That, in my opinion, is reason enough to stay away.



Fair enough. I did read the links last night too.

The problem here in Australia is getting hold of decent 18650 batteries at reasonable prices. I'll probably stick to Thrunite at $30AUD for two, only a few dollars more than the green panasonics.


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## Rafael Jimenez (Nov 7, 2014)

*Re: Looking for Reliable 18650 Batteries - Any Recommendations?*

Just get some AW 18650's and you will be ok.


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## gofastman (Nov 8, 2014)

*Re: Looking for Reliable 18650 Batteries - Any Recommendations?*

I like _these_ batteries from _these_ vendors
http://www.illumn.com/batteries-cha...panasonic-ncr18650b-protected-button-top.html

http://www.orbtronic.com/protected-3400mah-18650-li-ion-battery-panasonic-ncr18650B-orbtronic

The orbtronic 3600mah are probably even better, but they are new to the market, so I'm a bit leary of them even though I now they are a reputable vendor also they are expensive.


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## sillycelly (Nov 17, 2014)

*Re: Looking for Reliable 18650 Batteries - Any Recommendations?*



thedoc007 said:


> 2. My personal recommendation for the cheapest quality cell would be the SoShine 3400 from Illumination Supply. Only $8.50 each, or $17.00 per pair, if you use the standard discount code. I have ordered more than twenty of that exact cell, and have had no problems whatsoever. They are also shorter than many protected cells, thus more compatible with a variety of lights. I know some people don't yet trust the brand (SoShine has released some mediocre products in the past) so if you aren't comfortable with that, Keeppower 3400 would be my alternate recommendation. They are $14 each before discount, but they are known, excellent quality, consistent cells. They also have a lower internal resistance than most other protected cells (that is a good thing, you can do a search if you want more info).



The SoShine 3400 from Illumination Supply are now $20 per pair (before shipping). No discount code available. (I emailed them direct and asked for the CPF discount code. They said that the standard discount code does not apply to batteries.) The Keeppower 3400 are now $12 each ($24 per pair) (before shipping). Also no discount available. Please forgive my inexperience, but are battery prices that fluid that they are going to fluctuate by 15% over the course of two weeks? At this point, should I just wait until Black Friday / Cyber Monday to see what sales might happen?


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## SubLGT (Nov 17, 2014)

*Re: Looking for Reliable 18650 Batteries - Any Recommendations?*

Mountain Electronics has a good selection of protected and unprotected 18650 batteries. Coupon code 1YEAR6 will get you up to 60% off, but it expires tonight.


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## magellan (Nov 18, 2014)

*Re: Looking for Reliable 18650 Batteries - Any Recommendations?*

In in addition to those, I've also had good results with Nitecore, Voidhawk, Surefire, and NexTorch.



SubLGT said:


> Don't buy any 18650 batteries with "fire" in their name
> Don't buy your 18650 batteries on ebay or at Amazon
> To avoid counterfeits, buy from reputable sources.
> IMO, reliable brands would be KeepPower, Efest, AW, Orbtronics, etc


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## NeilP (Nov 18, 2014)

*Re: Looking for Reliable 18650 Batteries - Any Recommendations?*

just got too complicateI posted links to sales sites and pics on my own server .deleted


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## ven (Nov 18, 2014)

*Re: Looking for Reliable 18650 Batteries - Any Recommendations?*

^^^^^^^^^^^^ thats a good example of what to avoid like the plague ,5000mah dont exist for a start,3600mah right now is the highest but not many about. So best options really are 3100 and 3400mah cells for run time. Samsung/LG/Sanyo/Panasonic generic(green) are others to choose too.


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## sillycelly (Nov 18, 2014)

*Re: Looking for Reliable 18650 Batteries - Any Recommendations?*

Thank you for all of the feedback and recommendations! This forum is a wealth of information and experience. I'm learning a lot. I really appreciate it.

Is it possible to buy 18650's at a local brick and mortar store? I can't seem to find any at the local "Big Box" stores. I'm used to buying stuff online at Amazon or eBay or what-not. However, if quality (and labeling accuracy) are that much in question when it comes to batteries, perhaps I'd be better off buying local. I'm in KC, but if you know of any place in the Midwest (USA) that sells these things, I'd love to hear it.


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## ven (Nov 18, 2014)

*Re: Looking for Reliable 18650 Batteries - Any Recommendations?*

Have a look in "vape" shops(ecigs) these should stock 18650 cells,flat/button tops,Pany and IMR etc . Have a google in your area if not sure,amazon etc is fine,just research shop first,going gear is a good shop to name one. Mountain Electronics to name two.........


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## SubLGT (Nov 18, 2014)

*Re: Looking for Reliable 18650 Batteries - Any Recommendations?*



ven said:


> Have a look in "vape" shops(ecigs) these should stock 18650 cells,flat/button tops,Pany and IMR etc ..........



Don't vape shops stock only the high current, lower capacity batteries? (I have never visited a vape shop)


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## NeilP (Nov 18, 2014)

*Re: Looking for Reliable 18650 Batteries - Any Recommendations?*

If your need is not urgent, look out for laptop batteries / powertool battery packs, Dyson vacuum packs..they all often are built using 18650's 

I have about 30 of them, all pulled from such items. Just been testing them out with a Junsi iCharger 3010b...a hobby Remote control vehicle charger. Can charge most chemistries and does logging of capacity. Most of these cells still give 2.2-2.5 Ah.

The reason these complete packs usually fail is because one cell has died, caused by a faulty BMS ( battery management System) board.
Strip them out, dump the board and check the voltages of all cells. Any that are down below 2.5 volts..jsut dump[ them and then re charge the others with the likes of the icharger..cycle them and check their capacities.

Easily available and free most of the time


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## ven (Nov 18, 2014)

*Re: Looking for Reliable 18650 Batteries - Any Recommendations?*



SubLGT said:


> Don't vape shops stock only the high current, lower capacity batteries? (I have never visited a vape shop)




Depends on the shop tbh SubLGT,my local shop/s have samsung 2600,panasonic 3100 and 3400 as well as vt4 cells in 18650 size.


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## thedoc007 (Nov 18, 2014)

*Re: Looking for Reliable 18650 Batteries - Any Recommendations?*



sillycelly said:


> The SoShine 3400 from Illumination Supply are now $20 per pair (before shipping). No discount code available. (I emailed them direct and asked for the CPF discount code. They said that the standard discount code does not apply to batteries.) The Keeppower 3400 are now $12 each ($24 per pair) (before shipping). Also no discount available. Please forgive my inexperience, but are battery prices that fluid that they are going to fluctuate by 15% over the course of two weeks? At this point, should I just wait until Black Friday / Cyber Monday to see what sales might happen?



That is disappointing. But I guess I'm not too surprised...that was a great deal for a two-pack of quality cells. Even without the code, they are still cheaper than most. Battery prices aren't very fluid, in my experience, and when they do change it is typically because something better has come along, and the old ones get discounted. It seems to be a policy change at IS, not a price fluctuation.



sillycelly said:


> Is it possible to buy 18650's at a local brick and mortar store? I can't seem to find any at the local "Big Box" stores. I'm used to buying stuff online at Amazon or eBay or what-not. However, if quality (and labeling accuracy) are that much in question when it comes to batteries, perhaps I'd be better off buying local. I'm in KC, but if you know of any place in the Midwest (USA) that sells these things, I'd love to hear it.



REI, and other outdoor shops MIGHT have them. I'd call or check online first, though. Batteries Plus or Battery Giant are a couple chain stores that also might have them in stock. But without knowing what you have available in your area, it is hard to say. Some locations have more specialty shops than others. I don't think you are likely to find them at big box stores, though, at least for now. 

Another note: even if you do find them locally, you might have to pay an arm and a leg for them. I do have a store nearby that sells them, but they charge significantly more for 3100 mAh cells than I pay for 3400 mAh cells online.


----------



## StandardBattery (Nov 18, 2014)

*Re: Looking for Reliable 18650 Batteries - Any Recommendations?*

There is no problem buying 18650 from Amazon or ebay, you just have to buy from reputable sellers. Mountain Electronics sells on ebay and Amazon, or you can buy directly from their website. Selection varies from time to time on their different sales outlets. hk_equipment has also been a good ebay seller, and I'm sure there are others.


----------



## Big John arrows (Nov 20, 2014)

*Re: Looking for Reliable 18650 Batteries - Any Recommendations?*

I went thru the same issues as you are. Decided on which are "good" according to many on the internet.
Then the issue was trying to locate a dealer for them. Shipping those things seems to be an issue.
Since I'm in Canada, not being shipped from USA for sure, so looking for Canadian suppliers who have stock
of good quality 18650 batteries is a little difficult. I have found a couple, prices are high, but I am going to stay with
the higher priced, known brand, ones for now. So far Eagle Tac 3400mah, and now locating AW 3400mah ones.
Starting out with 6 Batteries and see where it leads! As I was told, lots of reading and learning to be had on this.
But I am staying with known quality brands until I get deeper into the fray! By the way I'm talking about up to $30 each Canadian. I found the battery test charts by HKJ on here extremely enlightening.


----------



## up2early (Nov 20, 2014)

*Jacob A60 Questions*

Do I need to get protected batteries for an A60 or does the light contain over-discharge protection?

After reading through several threads, it seems Panasonic 3400 mAh batteries have the edge. Can anyone provide the specific model number/description?

This will be my first 18650 light, which charger do I need to get?


----------



## repo4sale (Nov 23, 2014)

*Re: Favorite 18650 battery of your flashlight*

Anything I get from laptop batteries


----------



## searchlightmk2 (Nov 24, 2014)

*Best recommended rechargeable 18650*

Hi,

I'm tor between two torches, one of which (TN12) uses 18650 batteries. 

I know there are some that are a fire risk that I obviously want to avoid...

Can anyone tell me the best ones to go for?

Thanks


----------



## agr (Nov 25, 2014)

*what's the best 18650 for flashlight?*

hi
i have 7x cree l2 flashlight, using "trust"fire 3000mah batteries but the output is pretty weak
the seller of the flashlight told me i should get batteries with low internal resistance. is there anything else important? 
actually i prefer not to start comparing and reading the tech terms, and to get recommendation for the best 18650 at price up to 10$ per one, with decent capacity of at least 2000mah that will get the max output of the flashlight. i know that probably there is no "best" but would like to get a recommendation for a very good battery that will output the max lumens of the flashlight. samsung 20R? 25R? sony VTC5? other battery?
i appreciate any help
thanks


----------



## oKtosiTe (Nov 27, 2014)

*Re: what's the best 18650 for flashlight?*



agr said:


> hi
> i have 7x cree l2 flashlight, using "trust"fire 3000mah batteries but the output is pretty weak
> the seller of the flashlight told me i should get batteries with low internal resistance. is there anything else important?
> actually i prefer not to start comparing and reading the tech terms, and to get recommendation for the best 18650 at price up to 10$ per one, with decent capacity of at least 2000mah that will get the max output of the flashlight. i know that probably there is no "best" but would like to get a recommendation for a very good battery that will output the max lumens of the flashlight. samsung 20R? 25R? sony VTC5? other battery?
> ...


What flashlight? Odds are that no battery will get it to reach its claimed output, since a 7 LED light sold with TrustFire cells probably overstates its output as much or more than TrustFire and UltraFire overstate battery capacity.


----------



## Mutton (Nov 28, 2014)

*Best 18650 batteries*

I've been looking for a good set of 18650 batteries for a thrunite tn-12. I'm really new to 18650's and am not really sure the differences between them. I these: http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...iew-of-Intl-outdoor-NCR18650A-3100mAh-(Black) but I'm not sure if they are my best option. Any replies appreciated. Thanks
Mutton


----------



## chazz (Nov 28, 2014)

*Re: Best recommended rechargeable 18650*

Hi, for some good info on your question, start reading here:

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...-Using-Li-ion-cells-in-LED-flashlights-safely


----------



## ven (Nov 28, 2014)

*Re: Best recommended rechargeable 18650*

Any cells that have panasonic A (3100mah)or panasonic B(3400mah) in make a good choice imo, and go with protection to start with. From generic cells(green and black) to branded cells from KeepPower/Xtar/Efest/Eagletac etc etc etc(avoid cells that are ending in fire and 5000 made up mah) .I find some brands expensive for pretty much a different wrap and PCB. Eagtac are expensive but very good cells and also advantage of being a little shorter.

Last cells i have bought have been Efest 3400,i have Xtar,Sanyo,LG,Samsung,Pany generics,Nitecore,KeepPower,Sony, to name some off the top of my head. All been issue free:thumbsup:

If USA, look at going gear or illumination supply or mountain electronics to just name 3 reputable shops.


----------



## CelticCross74 (Nov 29, 2014)

*Re: Best recommended rechargeable 18650*

...or you can get the latest hard to find Panasonic 18650 technology in the new Orbtronic 3600mah(!!)18650 made in Japan. I have 6 of these and they are by far the longest lasting highest powered 18650's I have ever used. They are expensive and sell out almost instantly so keeping an eye on the Orbtronic website is needed as to when they have them in stock.


----------



## Navistar (Nov 30, 2014)

*Re: Looking for Reliable 18650 Batteries - Any Recommendations?*

My vote is for Orbtronic I use them and charge them daily at work and I'm very impressed. No need to pay the premium for the latest greatest 3600 just buy the 3400, you won't regret it. I replaced all my ultrafire cells so at this point I have 8 of them and zero failures.👍


Sent from my iPad using Candlepowerforums


----------



## SubLGT (Nov 30, 2014)

*Re: Looking for Reliable 18650 Batteries - Any Recommendations?*

Somebody mentioned here on CPF that the Panasonic 3600mAh may be replaced soon by a Panasonic 3900mAh 18650. Has anyone seen confirmation of this?


----------



## NeilP (Nov 30, 2014)

*Re: Looking for Reliable 18650 Batteries - Any Recommendations?*

What sort of continuous C rate do cells such as this have? 

My lithium battery experience up to now has been solely with LiPo cells where a 15C rate is considered low. 
I seem to remember reading typical figures for these Li Ion only being about 2 C.. 

Just wonder if these new cells are liable to be any better than that?


----------



## Buck (Nov 30, 2014)

*Re: Looking for Reliable 18650 Batteries - Any Recommendations?*

deleted to start new thread


----------



## joker_likes_flashlights (Dec 9, 2014)

*Default Re: Looking for Reliable 18650 Batteries - Any Recommendations?*

Are there certain 18650 batteries that create brighter light?


----------



## SilverFox (Dec 11, 2014)

*Re: Default Re: Looking for Reliable 18650 Batteries - Any Recommendations?*

Hello Joker likes flashlights,

Welcome to CPF.

No.

Tom


----------



## thedoc007 (Dec 11, 2014)

*Re: Looking for Reliable 18650 Batteries - Any Recommendations?*



SubLGT said:


> Somebody mentioned here on CPF that the Panasonic 3600mAh may be replaced soon by a Panasonic 3900mAh 18650. Has anyone seen confirmation of this?



I haven't. And frankly, the 3600 mAh cells have been in very short supply already...so I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for the next version. Even if they are in the pipeline, who knows when you'll be able to actually buy and use them?


----------



## incd (Dec 12, 2014)

*Re: Looking for Reliable 18650 Batteries - Any Recommendations?*

Hi guys, need your advice.

I want to buy 3400mAH with button top, which one between these i should choose, keeppower, olight, or soshine.

All price almost the same, is about us$ 29.


----------



## thedoc007 (Dec 12, 2014)

*Re: Looking for Reliable 18650 Batteries - Any Recommendations?*



incd said:


> I want to buy 3400mAH with button top, which one between these i should choose, keeppower, olight, or soshine.
> 
> All price almost the same, is about us$ 29.



If they are really the same price, I'd take the Keeppowers. They have the longest track record, and Keeppower cells often have lower internal resistance than others. That said, they are all based on the same high quality Japanese cell, so you really cannot go wrong. No need to obsess over the decision.


----------



## oKtosiTe (Dec 12, 2014)

*Re: Looking for Reliable 18650 Batteries - Any Recommendations?*



thedoc007 said:


> If they are really the same price, I'd take the Keeppowers. They have the longest track record, and Keeppower cells often have lower internal resistance than others. That said, they are all based on the same high quality Japanese cell, so you really cannot go wrong. No need to obsess over the decision.


While that is generally true, some cells are longer than others. For example, my Olight 3400's do not really fit in my G25C2-II; they're slightly too long. EagleTac 3400's (unsurprisingly) fit perfectly, because they're shorter.
So it can depend on the light.


----------



## incd (Dec 12, 2014)

*Re: Looking for Reliable 18650 Batteries - Any Recommendations?*



oKtosiTe said:


> While that is generally true, some cells are longer than others. For example, my Olight 3400's do not really fit in my G25C2-II; they're slightly too long. EagleTac 3400's (unsurprisingly) fit perfectly, because they're shorter.
> So it can depend on the light.



The light is able to take long battery, but the charger, i don't know.

I have old nitecore i2 2012, i don't know if it can handle long battery. 

I hope someone here could give info about this.


----------



## ClemsonSCJ (Dec 13, 2014)

*How to make sure your 18650 is a good battery?*

Hey guys I'm new to this particular forum but not forums in general, so I would like to preface this by saying that I tried looking around and have been by this forum for quite a while for this and that information. So I've tried finding the answer to this question by searching around but couldn't find anything.

I for for the local Sheriff's Office so when we're on night shifts I use flashlights quite regularly, so it's something I've invested a bit into to make sure I have good stuff. I have 4 flashlights that I keep with me while I'm on duty. First is my Maglite LED which I carry when I'm dealing with people at night, that way I've got something that I can defend myself with that's already in my hand, plus it's an awesome spot light for long distances. Next is my Streamlight Protac HL. I use this one for tromping through the woods, since it doesn't throw the beam as far as I thought it would, but it works great in the woods because it puts the beam as far as you would be able to see in the woods anyways. In my vest I have a 5.11 TMT L2 that I got for free with some pants I ordered, but it's quite bright and just a great all around flashlight. I use it for general purposes or in situations I'm afraid it might get dropped or lost since I don't have anything in it. Last is my house clearing light. It's a Coast light but I can't remember the model. But it's got the adjustable head on it, so it expands the beam to almost completely light up an entire room if I'm standing in the doorway. 

Anyways, the Streamlight and the 5.11 light both take 2 of the CR123 batteries so but they're getting to be quite expensive as much as I use them. So I was told that the 18650 will replace both of them. But how do you know if the 18650 battery you're buying is a good quality battery? Where is the best place online to buy this type of battery? My local Batteries Plus sells them, but not the charger, so I'd just rather order from somewhere that sells the charger with it.


----------



## frascati (Dec 15, 2014)

*Default Re: Looking for Reliable 18650 Batteries - Any Recommendations?*

Hello, please indulge a newcomer's question that 'cuts to the chase'. I've had a Trustfire TR-3T6 in my desk drawer for six months that I bought on impuse since it was dirt damn cheap... cheaper than ordering the three Cree cells within separately. But I never got around to ordering the 18650 cells and charger to go with it. 

Would someone please offer a quick suggestion as to best value 18650 cells, six of them at least per order, with charger, for this flashlight. 

Ultrafire 18650 3.7v 400mah li-ion seem ubiquitous on ebay but are not highly regarded here it seems. 
I'd like to keep the price somewhat within the 25 dollars that the flashlight itself cost if possible. 

Thanks so much.


----------



## coctailer (Dec 15, 2014)

*Re: Default Re: Looking for Reliable 18650 Batteries - Any Recommendations?*

How are the Olight 18650 cells for quality?

Is there a thread that reviews all available cells by brand name? I've seen some in the past, but they are always omitting the brands that I am looking at.


----------



## oKtosiTe (Dec 15, 2014)

*Re: Default Re: Looking for Reliable 18650 Batteries - Any Recommendations?*



coctailer said:


> How are the Olight 18650 cells for quality?
> 
> Is there a thread that reviews all available cells by brand name? I've seen some in the past, but they are always omitting the brands that I am looking at.


They're good, if a bit long for some lights. EagleTacs are a little shorter, but possibly too short for other lights. In most lights it shouldn't matter.

*Edit: *Oops, looks like I've said more or less the same thing just a few posts back.


----------



## oKtosiTe (Dec 15, 2014)

*Re: Looking for Reliable 18650 Batteries - Any Recommendations?*



incd said:


> The light is able to take long battery, but the charger, i don't know.
> 
> I have old nitecore i2 2012, i don't know if it can handle long battery.
> 
> I hope someone here could give info about this.



Since the i4 has no trouble with them, I would assume the i2 is fine with them too. Difference is usually within a few millimeters.


----------



## mikebosmans (Dec 15, 2014)

*Please recommend a 18650*

Newbie here looking for a dumbed down answer. I came to CPF to get info about 18650's. I've read and searched and read again and have pretty much run myself into circles about 18650's now.

Each time I think I've got a handle on it, I read something that either contradicts what I thought I've learned, or something new is introduced to the topic and I am left scratching my head again.

It's a basic question that I have.

What cell and charger would you recommend for the two lights that I have.

1. Olight M3X -two cells in series - purchased three years ago, I believe the new models are using a different led that what I have.

2. Olight M20 Crimson - sigle cell

I have been using, dare I say it "Ultrafires" they work, but runtimes suck, 1 out of 4 is dead after a few charge cycles and frankly, the more I read, the less I trust them. I'd appreciate it if someone could point me to a reliable, safe cell to use for my application and some dummy instructions about what I should or shouldn't do when charging them. 

Where to purchase them would be helpful, a link would be awesome. I would like to get 4 cells and a charger.

I apologize for asking such a basic question, but honestly, I'm tired of "researching" what seems to be something that should be so simple, I just am starting to feel like I am incredibly dense and there is way to much information for me to process.


----------



## ClemsonSCJ (Dec 15, 2014)

*Confused about 18650 batteries!*

I've got two lights that take 2 CR123 batteries each. I was under the impression that 18650 batteries could go in these lights. But the UltraFire 18650 battery that I have is too fat to fit in my lights. What gives?


----------



## Norm (Dec 15, 2014)

*Re: Confused about 18650 batteries!*



ClemsonSCJ said:


> I've got two lights that take 2 CR123 batteries each. I was under the impression that 18650 batteries could go in these lights.



18650s are 18mm in diameter, some lights use CR123 batteries only and the battery tube is not large enough to accommodate an 18650. 

Norm


----------



## StandardBattery (Dec 15, 2014)

*Re: Confused about 18650 batteries!*



ClemsonSCJ said:


> I've got two lights that take 2 CR123 batteries each. I was under the impression that 18650 batteries could go in these lights. But the UltraFire 18650 battery that I have is too fat to fit in my lights. What gives?


Saying you have two lights without mentioning what they are is not too helpful. However, you probably just have the wrong impression and your lights cannot take an 18650 instead of 2xCR123A cells. There is a chance the low quality 18650 you have is also a little wider than spec, not unusual for even quality batteries, and your light is just not very tolerant. 

Get at the definitive answer for your light and it's possible power sources.


----------



## StandardBattery (Dec 15, 2014)

*Re: Looking for Reliable 18650 Batteries - Any Recommendations?*



SubLGT said:


> Somebody mentioned here on CPF that the Panasonic 3600mAh may be replaced soon by a Panasonic 3900mAh 18650. Has anyone seen confirmation of this?





thedoc007 said:


> I haven't. And frankly, the 3600 mAh cells have been in very short supply already...so I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for the next version. Even if they are in the pipeline, who knows when you'll be able to actually buy and use them?



I heard a certain impressive car company is getting all the highest capacity cells right now and we are out of luck for a while.


----------



## StandardBattery (Dec 15, 2014)

*Re: Please recommend a 18650*



mikebosmans said:


> .......
> It's a basic question that I have.
> 
> What cell and charger would you recommend for the two lights that I have.
> ...


The charger is simple as you can see from various threads. Get the XTAR VP2 if you can. Since you may be happy with something just a bit simpler you could also look at the XTAR VP1. 

With the the above chargers the only thing you shouldn't do is put your batteries in the wrong charger. 

As for the batteries... Try to research your lights. Do they accept long batteries, fat batteries ? Find out if there are limits. 

Good batteries are from several manufacturers and resellers. Panasonic, LG, Sony, KeepPower, AW, Orbtronic, Soshine(some), RediLast,.... Several others. Even though there were some good Trustfire batteries in the past your best to stay away from anything with Fire in the name, after all Fire is the last thing you want coming from your flashlight or charger.


----------



## frascati (Dec 15, 2014)

*Re: Please recommend a 18650*

Well this is a bit irritating. The last page consists of pleas for someone, anyone, here to just offer the wisdom of their time spent at candlepowerforums.com to SIMPLY point to a good source of 18650, generally, based on some current state of the art. 

Can't be that tall an order for some member. Just a flashlight battery. Not a backup to the latest nasa mission to land on a fleeting comet. 



> As for the batteries... Try to research your lights. Do they accept long batteries, fat batteries ? Find out if there are limits.



Really? Do I misapprehend the quote? Are we saying that 18650 can be had in different lengths, widths, or other? Or does this quote merely suggesting that other batteries, not 18650 specifically, might fit the barrel of the flashlight? 

Is the 18650 nudging toward obsolescence? Is there not a sticky here, or elsewhere on the web that provides up-to-date current state of the art and best values/deals/sales on 18650 batteries and chargers?

With respect to 'Standardbattery', and the effort to provide a range of alternatives... is there not a favorite flavor of 18650 here at cp forums (don't google that) for general/universal flashlight use?

Where is that? Eliexpress? Amazon? Ebay? Newegg? Et Al? 

Please save me hours and hours of research if you're able and offer a link to the latest best value on 18650's for flashlight use.

Thank you very much, 
with belated thanksgiving, 
a merry christmas, 
an a happy new 2015!!!!


----------



## thedoc007 (Dec 15, 2014)

*Re: Please recommend a 18650*



frascati said:


> Well this is a bit irritating. The last page consists of pleas for someone, anyone, here to just offer the wisdom of their time spent at candlepowerforums.com to SIMPLY point to a good source of 18650, generally, based on some current state of the art.
> 
> Is the 18650 nudging toward obsolescence? Is there not a sticky here, or elsewhere on the web that provides up-to-date current state of the art and best values/deals/sales on 18650 batteries and chargers?



Hah, no, it certainly isn't approaching obsolescence. 

Two reliable websites, both with quick shipping and excellent service, are Illumination Supply (www.illumn.com) and Mountain Electronics (www.mtnelectronics.com). Every time I go looking for cells, those two sites are all I need. Unlike, say, Battery Junction, they don't sell crappy *****Fire cells. Any cells you order from them should be quality. My personal favorite for value/performance is the SoShine 3400 protected cell. A two-pack will run you $20. Keeppower 3400 is another great option, a little more expensive ($14 each), but with a longer track record if you are wary of SoShine, as some people are. For high drain cells, the Efest 2500 (purple) is my current favorite. 

Have you ever tried to maintain a thread/sticky for something that is updated frequently? It is a lot of work, even in the best case. And given that you have multiple types of 18650 (INR/IMR or ICR, protected or unprotected, high drain or high capacity, short or long cells, button top or flat top), it just isn't as simple as declaring one cell to be superior to all others. The best cell depends on your preference, and your application. And value is dependent on the customer...again, everyone has their own opinion on what are the most desirable features.

If you have a specific use in mind, you might find people more helpful. Most of us who have been around for a while get tired of answering the same questions for people who can't be bothered to do a little research, or use the search function on CPF. Not saying that you are one of those people, one way or the other.


----------



## ChrisGarrett (Dec 15, 2014)

*Re: Please recommend a 18650*



frascati said:


> Well this is a bit irritating. The last page consists of pleas for someone, anyone, here to just offer the wisdom of their time spent at candlepowerforums.com to SIMPLY point to a good source of 18650, generally, based on some current state of the art.
> 
> Can't be that tall an order for some member. Just a flashlight battery. Not a backup to the latest nasa mission to land on a fleeting comet.
> 
> Is the 18650 nudging toward obsolescence? Is there not a sticky here, or elsewhere on the web that provides up-to-date current state of the art and best values/deals/sales on 18650 batteries and chargers?



First of all, you don't provide your location and suggesting places that won't ship to your area, might be a waste of time for us.

Secondly, your budget of $25 for six 18650s and a charger is going to net you garbage, as in XXX-Fire cells and a charger and I still doubt that you can get even those for $25 shipped.

Since I'm a helpful kind of guy, I'm going to just come out and tell you what to buy.

Buy yourself a NiteCore i4 v2 charger, which should be under $20 shipped.

Buy yourself some Keepower, or Orbtronic 3400mAh protected cells. These will cost you about $15 from Orbtronic and if you go with the 3100mAh Panasonic NCR-As, you can get them for $12.55.

That light that you bought uses three 18650 cells in series, so you're going to need all of the help that you can get and protected cells are the first step.

You're probably at about $100 US.

Chris


----------



## SubLGT (Dec 16, 2014)

*Re: Please recommend a 18650*



frascati said:


> ………...Are we saying that 18650 can be had in different lengths, widths……………..?
> 
> …………...is there not a favorite flavor of 18650 here at cp forums (don't google that) for general/universal flashlight use?………….



YES 

NO


----------



## ClemsonSCJ (Dec 16, 2014)

*Looking for Reliable 18650 Batteries - Any Recommendations?*



StandardBattery said:


> Saying you have two lights without mentioning what they are is not too helpful. However, you probably just have the wrong impression and your lights cannot take an 18650 instead of 2xCR123A cells. There is a chance the low quality 18650 you have is also a little wider than spec, not unusual for even quality batteries, and your light is just not very tolerant.
> 
> Get at the definitive answer for your light and it's possible power sources.


I had gone at length to describe the lights a few posts back but, they are a Streamlight Protac HL and a 5.11 TMT L2.

The CR123's are quite snug in these lights so I'm guessing they just don't have the extra 2mm of tolerance.


----------



## sillycelly (Dec 16, 2014)

*Re: Looking for Reliable 18650 Batteries - Any Recommendations?*

I'm a newbee and I've been looking for a sale on 3400 mAh 18650s that are good quality brand. Unfortunately, I don't know enough to recommend a good quality brand, but I trust the posters who have made recommendations elsewhere in this thread. Earlier in the thread, someone indicated that I could get a pair of Soshine for $20, but when I looked, I couldn't find them that cheap. In my very limited experience, I think it is safe to expect to pay over $10 (probably closer to about $15 to $20 after you figure shipping) per battery. If you can find a high quality brand for under $10 (per each), jump on it. 

I've never heard of banggood, so I hope I'm not being taken. I ordered 3 pair. Total cost of $42, so it should work out to $7 per battery. (plus free shipping!)
Cross my fingers. 

EDIT: Whoopsie! Don't forget to read the product description! The batteries linked above are UNPROTECTED. If you are looking for protected cells, they are $19.50 per pair (volume discounts available, free shipping). 

I sure hope they let me cancel my first order.


----------



## SubLGT (Dec 16, 2014)

*Re: Looking for Reliable 18650 Batteries - Any Recommendations?*



sillycelly said:


> ………………….I've never heard of banggood, so I hope I'm not being taken. ……………..



I avoid Banggood, because too often I see them referred to as "BangBad".


----------



## Jvvjvv (Dec 16, 2014)

*Re: Looking for Reliable 18650 Batteries - Any Recommendations?*

I am new to this site and just read this entire thread. Trying to get some info on the 18650s. I have a tk45 with 8 lithium batteries. It has been in my motorcycle tank bag for some 3 to 4 years.I use it once in a while and it performs perfectly. What is the shelf life of the 18650's. Or, what's the best way to keep a backup set of batteries around, so they are always ready to go. I have aTk76 and 8 batteries on the way.

My NiCad's Rechargeables, for my photography flashes, sit in the charger for weeks at a time, always ready to go.


From the reading I've done, it seems you can do this with the 18650's.

thanks for your time, JVVjVV


----------



## ChrisGarrett (Dec 16, 2014)

*Re: Looking for Reliable 18650 Batteries - Any Recommendations?*



Jvvjvv said:


> I am new to this site and just read this entire thread. Trying to get some info on the 18650s. I have a tk45 with 8 lithium batteries. It has been in my motorcycle tank bag for some 3 to 4 years.I use it once in a while and it performs perfectly. What is the shelf life of the 18650's. Or, what's the best way to keep a backup set of batteries around, so they are always ready to go. I have aTk76 and 8 batteries on the way.
> 
> My NiCad's Rechargeables, for my photography flashes, sit in the charger for weeks at a time, always ready to go.
> 
> ...



Where did you read that you can leave your 18650s in the charger for 'weeks at a time?'

We don't leave li-ions in a charger much after the 'all charged' light goes green/red, in the event that your charger erroneously 'trickle charges,' which it shouldn't do.

Shelf life on lithium-ion 18650s depends on a few factors, such as temperature, how full you charge them, how much you deplete them, what type of load they might regularly see, stuff like that.

2-5 years, but I'm using some Sony 2000mAh 18650s pulled from a VAIO pack that are dated 2002, so who knows? They charge up to 4.17v and settle at 4.15v.

Chris


----------



## Jvvjvv (Dec 17, 2014)

*Re: Looking for Reliable 18650 Batteries - Any Recommendations?*

Chris.......thanks for the quick reply. Sorry about the miss spoke, meant to say you ....CAN'T... Leave the 18650's on the charger. I guess if they just sit unused for a month or two, you just put them back on the charger until full. 

I guess I am spoiled, my dog training collars sit in the chargers for months sometimes, before I get a client who needs them. Two of the collars are going on seven years old.

happy holidays, Jack


----------



## jwag73 (Dec 20, 2014)

*Re: Looking for Reliable 18650 Batteries - Any Recommendations?*

I have had excellent results with AW, Efest, and Sony VTC4/5 batteries. I have primarily used them in mechanical mods and they all have worked as I would expect them to.


----------



## polite4 (Dec 23, 2014)

*General question on 18650 batteries*

Hi, I'm new to the group don't know much about batteries still learning had a question on batteries. I'm using them in a flashlight with a T6 led . I recently bought 2 protected 3.7 v 18650 ultra fires 3000mah from batteryjunction.com The one battery stays at 2.8 v and will not charge at all, in fact the charger light never comes on for it. The second battery charges up to 3.6 v never to full voltage. I'm using a nitecore i2 charger if your wondering.

From reading different posts I realize now ultra fires aren't a very good choice.

My questions are does the battery charging only to 3.6 v effect the lumen output at all? 

Could you recommend some good batteries and were I might find them?

Thank you


----------



## ven (Dec 23, 2014)

*Re: General question on 18650 batteries*

:welcome: 3.6v is around 40% charge..............off a good 3400mah cell,it could be as little as 20% on a *****fire cell so yes it will effect output. Recycle the cells,get a couple of branded cells,many to choose from with protection. Not sure if the cells you have are actually protected(usually a small black disc on the neg end of cell).
KeepPower,Orbtronic,Panasonic ,sanyo,Samsung,Efest,Eagletac to name just some.


----------



## recDNA (Dec 23, 2014)

*Re: Looking for Reliable 18650 Batteries - Any Recommendations?*

Has anybody tried the 18650 batteries they sell at Radio Shack? I never heard of the brand but they look like Trustfires to me. I was surprised to see them selling kind of dangerous batteries. They also had the AA size and half AA size. I didn't see any RCR123 though.


----------



## opus360 (Dec 23, 2014)

*Re: General question on 18650 batteries*



ven said:


> :welcome: 3.6v is around 40% charge..............off a good 3400mah cell,it could be as little as 20% on a *****fire cell so yes it will effect output. Recycle the cells,get a couple of branded cells,many to choose from with protection. Not sure if the cells you have are actually protected(usually a small black disc on the neg end of cell).
> KeepPower,Orbtronic,Panasonic ,sanyo,Samsung,Efest,Eagletac to name just some.



Good to know.

I just got a bundle that included the Nitecore P12, an Olight charger, and an Olight 18650 3400mAH. Who makes the Olight battery?


----------



## ChrisGarrett (Dec 23, 2014)

*Re: Looking for Reliable 18650 Batteries - Any Recommendations?*



recDNA said:


> Has anybody tried the 18650 batteries they sell at Radio Shack? I never heard of the brand but they look like Trustfires to me. I was surprised to see them selling kind of dangerous batteries. They also had the AA size and half AA size. I didn't see any RCR123 though.



ENERCELL I think is their house brand for the primary types and Digital Energy is their li-ion stuff:

http://www.radioshack.com/rechargeable-batteries#start=120&sz=60

They seem to have 14500s, 18350s, 26650s, 16340s, etc.

It's like going to Bass Pro Shops, Cabelas, or Gander Mountain for a pound of gun powder:

If it's 7pm and all of your normal places are closed, at least you can spend $35 bucks and have something at 8:45pm--just bring the lube with you.

Chris


----------



## recDNA (Dec 23, 2014)

*Re: Looking for Reliable 18650 Batteries - Any Recommendations?*



ChrisGarrett said:


> ENERCELL I think is their house brand for the primary types and Digital Energy is their li-ion stuff:
> 
> http://www.radioshack.com/rechargeable-batteries#start=120&sz=60
> 
> ...


What I wonder is if they contain Panasonic cells or random Chinese brand?


----------



## ChrisGarrett (Dec 23, 2014)

*Re: Looking for Reliable 18650 Batteries - Any Recommendations?*

If I had to guess, they're of Chinese origin. If it's an emergency situation and you need something right there and then, sure, otherwise, I'll pass.

They just closed a Rat Shack at the nice outdoor mall that the GF and I hit up a lot for dinner and I don't think that they're too long for this world.

Chris


----------



## Boghog1 (Dec 26, 2014)

*18650s driving me crazy*

So some years back my bride bought me a Fenix TK11 I have been using it with CR123 since I was frightened away from 18650s. I have been reading through this thread
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?330236-2012-Battery-test-review-summary
and I am a bit lost, these are the current lineup of lights I own that use the 18650


*Nitecore HC50 565 Lumens CREE XM-L2 LED headlamp*

Please do not post links to websites. Post images, or describe the flashlights. ..Bill


I am looking to get 6 to 8 18650s but I am lost after reading the thread above I figure I need protected cells since I am a rechargeable newb Should I do AW 3100mah or is there something new that has come out since 2012?

Enlope, Panasonic, LG? High Discharge, protected IMR???? I know to avoid DX and Trust Fire brand as well as most stuff on Amazon


----------



## SubLGT (Dec 26, 2014)

*Re: 18650s driving me crazy*

Buy some KeepPower protected 3400mAh 18650. Illumn.com is one good source.


----------



## fivemega (Dec 26, 2014)

*Re: Looking for Reliable 18650 Batteries - Any Recommendations?*



sillycelly said:


> Looking for Reliable 18650 Batteries - Any Recommendations?


*Spend little more and buy brand name, reputable and real high capacity cells.*



sillycelly said:


> I also purchased 4 UltraFire 18650 batteries.


*That's the main problem and stay away from cheap cells.*


----------



## Albinoni1967 (Dec 26, 2014)

*Re: Looking for Reliable 18650 Batteries - Any Recommendations?*



SubLGT said:


> Don't buy any 18650 batteries with "fire" in their name
> Don't buy your 18650 batteries on ebay or at Amazon
> To avoid counterfeits, buy from reputable sources.
> IMO, reliable brands would be KeepPower, Efest, AW, Orbtronics, etc



Sorry but i completely disagree with you re buying from Ebay, I am from Australia and have bought my KeepPowers from Ebay Aust and have never ever had probs with them been as good as gold.

I do agree with you re the ending with Fire one, like Ultrafire etc, sorry I wont either.


----------



## RIX TUX (Dec 26, 2014)

*Re: Looking for Reliable 18650 Batteries - Any Recommendations?*

I have bought many on ebay with no problems. I only us U.S. sellers with a lot of feedback. I used seller r-lsales and have purchased the newest top of the line 18650 Panasonics, 16550 efest (in place of two 123a's) plus others. They currently have over 600 auctions going now with many different types.


----------



## RIX TUX (Dec 26, 2014)

*Re: Looking for Reliable 18650 Batteries - Any Recommendations?*

double post


----------



## HotWire (Dec 30, 2014)

*Re: Favorite 18650 battery of your flashlight*

My favorite 18650 is the Panasonic green protected batteries. I also use Keepower, Nitecore & AW. Don't like ****Fire batteries --- they don't work well for me in high draw applications....


----------



## ven (Dec 30, 2014)

*Re: Favorite 18650 battery of your flashlight*

At the moment i have a thing for Samsung 25R cells,be it for my lights or VV mods..............just a great cell


----------



## -BOosted- (Dec 30, 2014)

*Just bought Trunite TN12 What 18650 recommended?*

Hi all,
new to the forums.just bought me a Trunite tn12. I tried to see what length 18650 is recommended and didn't find anything.looking for what mm sized 18650 should be used,was looking at the Panisonic flat top:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00DHXY72O/?tag=cpf0b6-20


Also these Orbtronics with button
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00BJ8W3KC/?tag=cpf0b6-20

if anyone here has experience with this torch can help me out thanks.


----------



## Aperture (Dec 30, 2014)

*Re: Favorite 18650 battery of your flashlight*

All cells made by Panasonic:
12 x 18650B ICR 3400mAh with Eagletac wrapper and PCB, used to be my main cells but didn't like them, kept 5 for the Nitecore TM15, gave away or sold the rest
04 x 18650B ICR 3400mAh, used inside a 5-13V batterypack
10 x 18650BD NMC 3200mAh with Keeppower wrapper and button top, for me these Hybrid IMRs are the perfect balance between capacity, power, size and safety

Edit:
I do like the 18650B's btw but just not the Eagletac version as the button's are very soft and inconsistent in profile, some have a smallish button and others have none at all. Also the wrapper is very sensitive to tear, some where damaged at the ends and lost one completely when I pulled it from the charger.


----------



## Albinoni1967 (Dec 30, 2014)

*Re: Favorite 18650 battery of your flashlight*

I use KeepPower have excellent run time out of them and;ast for ages, use them in the followint torches:

1. Olight S20
2. SunwayMan C20C Tomahawk
3. JetBeam RRT (cant recall the model sorry)

And another two for backup.

I use a XTAR VP1 for my charger.

I believe that all my KeepPowers 18650 use Panasonic cells and all are protected too.


----------



## CelticCross74 (Dec 30, 2014)

*Re: Favorite 18650 battery of your flashlight*

The 3400mah SoShines I run my TK75 on have been excellent so far...


----------



## UnderPar (Dec 30, 2014)

*Re: Favorite 18650 battery of your flashlight*

Mostly, I use the Panasonic 18650B protected cells. But I also have a few KeepPower and Nicore cells.


----------



## Mutton (Dec 31, 2014)

*Reliable 18650 Rechargeable Cell*

Hey,
I have been looking for a reliable 18650 battery for a Fenix PD35, 
and haven't been able to find anything spot on such as the Panasonic Eneloop rechargeables made for AA/AAA.
If you know of any 18650's that I can count on, please share your knowledge.
I have heard these are very good http://www.mtnelectronics.com/index.php?route=product/product&product_id=55, and they are a decent price but am not sure if these will be authentic cells as,
I have seen many horrible reviews on these batteries that were purchased from other sources saying they were fake.
Thanks
Mutton
P.S: I would like to keep it a protected cell


----------



## Albinoni1967 (Dec 31, 2014)

*Re: Favorite 18650 battery of your flashlight*

Question here but do Panasonic make the best cells


----------



## ven (Dec 31, 2014)

*Re: Favorite 18650 battery of your flashlight*



Albinoni1967 said:


> Question here but do Panasonic make the best cells



IMO Certainly up there and would say yes, their 3400mah being the most used and now 3600mah(still not as freely available)............but Samsung/Sony/LG/Sanyo also make good cells too. Just Panasonic find themselves in many branded cells being more established,like KeepPower to Eagletac to Nitecore to Fenix...............etc.

It depends on your flashlight use really,run times and in general use then yes 3100/3400 pany cells would make an excellent choice. In more demanding lights the pany PFs(to name one) are a popular cell. Then for really high demanding uses,be it modded lights to ecig mods,Sony vtc4/vtc5 ,Efest 35a and Samsung 25R seem to be the better choice............


----------



## markr6 (Dec 31, 2014)

*Re: Looking for Reliable 18650 Batteries - Any Recommendations?*



SubLGT said:


> I avoid Banggood, because too often I see them referred to as "BangBad".



Who doesn't like a good bang now and then?

For 18650s, I don't think I'll ever use anything than an NCR18650B unprotected. Low cost, time tested, fits many lights (sometimes use button tops), all around excellent cell. Progress into 3600mAh was slow, and that extra capacity doesn't matter to me. When there is a big jump, like 4000mAh, I'll start considering a switch.


----------



## Albinoni1967 (Dec 31, 2014)

*Re: Favorite 18650 battery of your flashlight*

Does Nite core use Panasonic cells didnt know that


----------



## Mr. Nobody (Dec 31, 2014)

*Re: Favorite 18650 battery of your flashlight*

Efest IMR 2000mAH. There for vape mod but work fine in my lights. The other million collection of 18650s is the ultrafire brand batteries with the engraving on the - side ranging from 1000-4000mAH.


----------



## ven (Dec 31, 2014)

*Re: Favorite 18650 battery of your flashlight*



Albinoni1967 said:


> Does Nite core use Panasonic cells didnt know that




Yes,3100 and 3400mah

Not sure on the 2300/2600mah though but sure others can confirm


----------



## adam-victor (Jan 1, 2015)

*Re: Favorite 18650 battery of your flashlight*

Hi guys, I am new to this awesome forum and would like to start off with a, hopefully straight forward, question regarding the best 18650 batteries for my, soon to be new purchase, 'Nitecore p25' flashlight. I have been reading copious amounts of reviews surrounding the topic but have been yet to find the true, or significant difference between the Eagletac 18650's and the Nitecore 18650's? 

Admittedly I have seen only fantastic reviews with regards to the Eagletac brand, along with their ability to fit a wider market of torches when compared with Nitecore batterier, however, I am yet to discover the explanation as to why the Eagletac 18650's are so popular with regards to my recent purchase (Nitecore p25) and why I'm seeing less boastful claims surrounding their own branded batteries? 

Is it a simple case of the Eagletacs being cheaper and more universally accepted amongst 18650 powered flashlights? Or are the run times a factor to consider? 

I ask this because I am about to complete an order for a batch of 3400mAh batteries from nitecore, however, if there is no significant difference between the two brands, except the eagletacs being 1/3 cheaper, then I will be able to save a good bit of cash. 

Many thanks, 
Adam (your newest member).


----------



## ven (Jan 1, 2015)

*Re: Favorite 18650 battery of your flashlight*

Hi Adam :welcome: I also have a p25 ,I have an Xtar 3400 in it which is also a Panasonic. Usually ET cells are on the more expensive side,however if cheaper and presume both 3400mah then they will both be Panasonic inside. The difference is the PCB fitted and manufacturers wrap. The ET cell iirc may have a higher A rating before the PCB trips but would need to check up on HKJ site . This should not be a problem with the p25 anyway.....

With the ET being a little shorter,it makes them less flashlight fussy ,not to mention a good brand too so a popular choice.


----------



## Tachead (Jan 3, 2015)

Hey guys, just wondering what the best options are for high quality/high capacity 18650 batteries? 

I posted this in the led section by accident and cant change it because I am new and the mods havent unlocked me yet(hopefully they will soon as I need answers before I order). If you read this mods, please delete the other thread in the LED section and sorry for my mistake. Thanks guy:thumbsup:


----------



## ChrisGarrett (Jan 3, 2015)

Tachead said:


> Hey guys, just wondering what the best options are for high quality/high capacity 18650 batteries?
> 
> I posted this in the led section by accident and cant change it because I am new and the mods havent unlocked me yet(hopefully they will soon as I need answers before I order). If you read this mods, please delete the other thread in the LED section and sorry for my mistake. Thanks guy:thumbsup:



Well, if you, like me in the beginning, care only about capacity and nothing else, then any cell using the Panasonic NCR18650B 3400mAh 3.7v cell will be up there at the top.

If you care about voltage sag and a mix of performance issues, then there are other cells that work well, although they might not be at the top of the 'capacity' scale.

Finally, if you have a light that requires higher current demands, there might be better options out there, as in unprotected cells of IMR or hybrid chemistries.

I guess my point is is that there is no 'best' cell, only cells that work better for any given application, than other cells.

Chris


----------



## Tachead (Jan 3, 2015)

Thanks for the reply man, I appreciate it. The 18650's will be for my first high powered 1x18650 LED flashlight. I havent decided fully on what it will be yet but, I am leaning towards the Zebralight SC600w MKII or one of the Eagletac models. It will likely be a small 1000+ lumen EDC light with a NW LED. I have no experience with 18650 but, have plenty of Li battery knowledge from one of my other hobbies. I purchased a XTAR VP2 for ease of charging as I didnt feel like sourcing high quality battery holders for my Revolectrix Powerlab 8 which I am sure is a much better charger. So, I am gonna order a couple 18650's with the new light, any suggestions for this application? I am looking for the best performance first and high capacity as a fringe benefit. Thanks again man:thumbsup:


----------



## Quoddy (Jan 3, 2015)

I've been using AW18650 Black for awhile. 3400mAh and I've never had a complaint with them.


Sent from my iPhone 6 using Candlepowerforums


----------



## ChrisGarrett (Jan 3, 2015)

Tachead said:


> Thanks for the reply man, I appreciate it. The 18650's will be for my first high powered 1x18650 LED flashlight. I havent decided fully on what it will be yet but, I am leaning towards the Zebralight SC600w MKII or one of the Eagletac models. It will likely be a small 1000+ lumen EDC light with a NW LED. I have no experience with 18650 but, have plenty of Li battery knowledge from one of my other hobbies. I purchased a XTAR VP2 for ease of charging as I didnt feel like sourcing high quality battery holders for my Revolectrix Powerlab 8 which I am sure is a much better charger. So, I am gonna order a couple 18650's with the new light, any suggestions for this application? I am looking for the best performance first and high capacity as a fringe benefit. Thanks again man:thumbsup:



Well...the good news is that with the VP2, you can charge up 4.35v cells and run them in your ZL SC600 mkII. I use the LG D1 3000mAh 4.35v cells and their E1 3200mAh 4.35v cells in some of my lights.

You'll get a better discharge curve with the D1s vs. the E1s, but lose a tad of capacity. The 4.35v cells hold a higher voltage than 'some' of the 4.20v cells, but it's up to you.

They are generally unprotected cells, but the ZL lights have a low voltage disconnect, so you don't have to really worry about running unprotected cells.

I have a ZL SC600 MkI and I run either the D1s, or the E1s in it, for a balance between voltage sag and capacity.

LG D1 3000mAh cells are about $6-$8 depending on who you go with.

With naked cells, you don't have to worry about the cell 'fitting' in your light, but there are other very capable cells out there to choose from.

Chris


----------



## Tachead (Jan 3, 2015)

Thanks again man. So, whats the bad news lol.


----------



## thedoc007 (Jan 3, 2015)

Since you already have an Xtar VP2, I'd suggest the 4.35 volt LG E1. Mountain Electronics has a button top version (though out of stock at this moment). If you look at the discharge graphs, you'll find it holds a higher voltage than the NCR18650B right up until 3.2 volts or so, and you don't want to regularly discharge much below that level anyway.

Edit: I see that Chris recommended the same cell as I was typing, with a better explanation.


----------



## Tachead (Jan 3, 2015)

Was there a better charger option? I considered the Nitecore D2/4 as well but, the Xtar seemed to get better reviews and has fast charging options as well as the higher voltage. Did I make the right decision? Was there another better option I wasnt aware of?


----------



## Tachead (Jan 3, 2015)

I dont have the Xtar yet and can still cancel if there is a better option?


----------



## thedoc007 (Jan 3, 2015)

Tachead said:


> Was there a better charger option? I considered the Nitecore D2/4 as well but, the Xtar seemed to get better reviews and has fast charging options as well as the higher voltage. Did I make the right decision? Was there another better option I wasnt aware of?



Nope. If you want a lithium-ion charger, the Xtar VP2 is one of the best. If you want multiple-chemistry support, or need more slots, the Nitecore D4 is solid. But for charging a couple 18650s, the VP2 is an excellent choice.


----------



## ChrisGarrett (Jan 3, 2015)

Tachead said:


> I dont have the Xtar yet and can still cancel if there is a better option?



Don't bother, all of the cool kids run the VP2.

It's a very flexible charger that will future proof you, as long as you don't need 4 bays and you don't need to do NiMH batteries in this charger.

Chris


----------



## Tachead (Jan 3, 2015)

k, thanks a bunch guys. VP2 it is, it just shipped. And, ill look for Panasonic and IMR for the batts. Can you guys help me with telling me a few brands that use the Panasonic cells? I see that HID Canada does in their Dark Matter series but, they are out of stock. What other brands relabel them? I want to stick to protected cells to start with. also, what about Fenix, Nitecore, Eagletac? Who makes their cells? I ask because they are all easily available to me being in Canada. Thanks again:thumbsup:


----------



## thedoc007 (Jan 3, 2015)

Tachead said:


> k, thanks a bunch guys. VP2 it is, it just shipped. And, ill look for Panasonic and IMR for the batts. Can you guys help me with telling me a few brands that use the Panasonic cells? I see that HID Canada does in their Dark Matter series but, they are out of stock. What other brands relabel them? I want to stick to protected cells to start with. also, what about Fenix, Nitecore, Eagletac? Who makes their cells? I ask because they are all easily available to me being in Canada. Thanks again:thumbsup:



If you buy a 3400 mAh cell, it is probably Panasonic. The NCR18650B is the standard cell used in all the brands you mention. Redilast, Thrunite, SoShine, Keeppower, Olight, AW, and many others also use that same cell.


----------



## ven (Jan 3, 2015)

ChrisGarrett said:


> Don't bother, all of the cool kids run the VP2.
> 
> 
> Chris is correct...........
> ...


----------



## Chicken Drumstick (Jan 3, 2015)

Tachead said:


> Hey guys, just wondering what the best options are for high quality/high capacity 18650 batteries?
> 
> I posted this in the led section by accident and cant change it because I am new and the mods havent unlocked me yet(hopefully they will soon as I need answers before I order). If you read this mods, please delete the other thread in the LED section and sorry for my mistake. Thanks guy:thumbsup:


Best depends what you want to use it for and your expectations. 

So how important is runtime?

As in, will you need to depend on the light and need to extract every second of runtime from it, or will you have access to spares and chargers without issue?

Next up, what sort of use? As in will you want max output or will you use lower outputs mostly?

The reason for asking is something like a high capacity 3400mah battery can offer the longest runtimes but not the highest output of the longest sustained output at high lumens.

The flip side a 2500 IMR has less capacity but can deliver higher currents so higher max output. And should not suffer as much voltage sag as a 3400 ICR does. So will be able to maintain higher outputs for longer. 

As as an example. My Qlite XP-G2 C8 will pull about 2.0-2.11 amps on either a Sanyo or Panasonic ICR. But with a good IMR (Samsung 25R) will pull 2.99amps. It is significantly brighter with the IMR and stays brighter for longer.

However on a light that you only use low mode on, ie only pull low amps anyhow. A high capacity ICR will offer the same performance but longer runtimes. 

So it depends on use but also the specific torch. And some torches won't make many odds either way.


----------



## A.marquardt (Jan 3, 2015)

I'm partial to Panasonic greens myself.


----------



## battery_bro (Jan 4, 2015)

*Re: Favorite 18650 battery of your flashlight*

For capacity - yes. Panasonic is by far the market leader for 18650 production. TESLA has leased almost all production of the NCR18650B, and Panasonic is likewise heavily invested in the Gigafactory.

For maximum amp discharge, Samsung has the winner with the 25R. But applications for capacity Panasonic is by far the market winner.


----------



## thedoc007 (Jan 4, 2015)

*Re: Favorite 18650 battery of your flashlight*



battery_bro said:


> For maximum amp discharge, Samsung has the winner with the 25R. But applications for capacity Panasonic is by far the market winner.



That may have been true at one time, but there is more competition now. The Sony VTC5 has both higher current rating AND slightly more capacity, and according to JMPaul's testing, often results in slightly higher lumen/lux readings compared to the 25R. The purple Efest 2500 mAh cell is also a very good high drain cell.


----------



## idleprocess (Jan 4, 2015)

*Re: Favorite 18650 battery of your flashlight*

Took a chance on Batteries Plus house brand Nuon protected 18650's and will be returning them. They charged fine in my cheap Tenergy charger. They manage all modes in my BC30 OK fresh off the charger. But in the PD35 they cut off after ~1/2 second in turbo, leaving the light a tad useless until I swap some cells in that can handle the draw and toggle it back to a lower mode. I'm guessing that either the protection PCB is cutting out at ~3A or the cell chemistry is so trrbl that is just can't deliver much more than 1C current. I'm also concerned that once they drop down to their 3.6V nominal (as opposed to the 3.7V that all other makes quote), they'll be trouble in the BC30 as well.


----------



## thedoc007 (Jan 4, 2015)

*Re: Favorite 18650 battery of your flashlight*



idleprocess said:


> Took a chance on Batteries Plus house brand Nuon protected 18650's and will be returning them. They charged fine in my cheap Tenergy charger. They manage all modes in my BC30 OK fresh off the charger. But in the PD35 they cut off after ~1/2 second in turbo, leaving the light a tad useless until I swap some cells in that can handle the draw and toggle it back to a lower mode. I'm guessing that either the protection PCB is cutting out at ~3A or the cell chemistry is so trrbl that is just can't deliver much more than 1C current. I'm also concerned that once they drop down to their 3.6V nominal (as opposed to the 3.7V that all other makes quote), they'll be trouble in the BC30 as well.



Lots of battery re-labelers (they don't actually manufacture the cell, just the PCB and wrapping) claim 3.6, others claim 3.7. Some even have BOTH claims depending on where you look. Olight, for example, had their 18650s listed as both 3.6 and 3.7 volts. Doesn't really mean anything. 

It does sound like those were lousy batteries, glad you caught it early. Just letting you know that 3.6 and 3.7 volt cells are the same thing. After all, that is nominal voltage...the range is actually from about 2.5 to 4.2 volts (that can vary a bit also).


----------



## Boss Hoss (Jan 4, 2015)

*Re: Favorite 18650 battery of your flashlight*



thedoc007 said:


> That may have been true at one time, but there is more competition now. The Sony VTC5 has both higher current rating AND slightly more capacity, and according to JMPaul's testing, often results in slightly higher lumen/lux readings compared to the 25R. The purple Efest 2500 mAh cell is also a very good high drain cell.



The VTC5 is made from "unobtanium" none left anywhere. Wish Sony still offered them! I need some 30A draw cells...


----------



## idleprocess (Jan 4, 2015)

*Re: Favorite 18650 battery of your flashlight*



thedoc007 said:


> Lots of battery re-labelers (they don't actually manufacture the cell, just the PCB and wrapping) claim 3.6, others claim 3.7. Some even have BOTH claims depending on where you look. Olight, for example, had their 18650s listed as both 3.6 and 3.7 volts. Doesn't really mean anything.
> 
> It does sound like those were lousy batteries, glad you caught it early. Just letting you know that 3.6 and 3.7 volt cells are the same thing. After all, that is nominal voltage...the range is actually from about 2.5 to 4.2 volts (that can vary a bit also).


They took them back without complaint so there's a bright side to the whole deal. Just wish they stocked decent protected li-ion cells - their prices are better than I remember and they're local.


----------



## T-Freak (Jan 8, 2015)

My experience with Keeppower 3.400 mAh based on Panasonic cells are very good. I use the batteries in Nitecore TM26 or Acebeam X40 for example and I'm very happy with it.


----------



## loimpact (Jan 19, 2015)

*Noob looking for best/proper 18650 cells for Fenix BC30........*

Howdy folks.

I'm a noob. (well, old but new here) 

I'm crossing my recent interests in all this light stuff with cycling. I've graduated from unmentionable bike head light to single Cree Q5-T6 and now to my wonderful new Fenix BC30 dual XML-L2 unit. I love this light. However I have a couple questions.....

#1.) The Panasonic nomenclature confuses the @%# outta me. NCR18650b, a, , pf, fm, e, be, lmnop. I'm gonna lose my mind

#2.) Along those lines, I'd like to get the best cell for *my* light. (while possibly learning the best for whatever uses call for) And, I'm specifically trying to keep the cells as short as possible.

My Fenix BC30 came w/ a couple of protected Ultra Fires (black & gold) which were definitely better than my older Ultra Fires (unprotected) that didn't last long in the light.

I could probably search this board forever but MUCH appreciate any quick & dirty specific to my questions!


TIA!! (P.S. Just in case any info needed on the light --->


----------



## loimpact (Jan 19, 2015)

Ok, so I think the mod(s) may have misdirected my thread.

I'm trying to find a "proper" (best suited) cell for the Fenix BC30 which runs 2 emitters and 2 batteries. In series? I'm not sure. I think so, but not sure.

Or maybe each emitter gets its own cell? I do know that there's special attention paid to lights running more than 1 cell in series.

Is the Fenix BC30 a "high drain" device? Or can it be depending on settings? (If not or if so, how much or how little so?)

I hear some folks here say that 2600mah cells do their Cree-based light more justice than a 3400mah. In that case, I'm definitely not looking for just a "best high capacity 18650".

If the mod(s) would be so kind as to replace my thread where people in the know of this light and some overview cell talk can direct me toward the right kind of cell for a BC30, it would be much appreciated!

:twothumbs P.S. ----> the link to fenix BC30 I missed before ----> http://www.fenix-store.com/fenix-bc30-led-bike-light/


----------



## tandem (Jan 20, 2015)

*Re: Noob looking for best/proper 18650 cells for Fenix BC30........*



loimpact said:


> My Fenix BC30 came w/ a couple of protected Ultra Fires (black & gold) which were definitely better than my older Ultra Fires (unprotected) that didn't last long in the light.



Hopefully your "Ultra Fires" aren't made in the PantsOnFire Factory.

Are they these 4000mAh (the claim is laughable) cells?

See my sig:


----------



## ChrisGarrett (Jan 20, 2015)

*Re: Noob looking for best/proper 18650 cells for Fenix BC30........*

NM.

Chris


----------



## loimpact (Jan 20, 2015)

*Re: Noob looking for best/proper 18650 cells for Fenix BC30........*



tandem said:


> Hopefully your "Ultra Fires" aren't made in the PantsOnFire Factory.
> 
> Are they these 4000mAh (the claim is laughable) cells?
> 
> See my sig:



On that page of multiple cells, they are the black/gold ones toward the bottom. While I certainly don't give any credence to UltraFire, they did work much better than the unprotected Ultra Fires that I put in initially which didn't hold out much more than 30 minutes. I got 30 minutes on the black/gold at the full 1200 lumens setting without any hiccups & more to burn.

That said.....I think I've discovered that the Fenix ARB-L2S batteries are truly just NCR18650B's but they're definitely flat-top. If that's the case, why can't I find 18650B's *with* protection (like the ARB-L2S's claim to be) on fleabay?

I find button-top B's, protected
I find flat-top A's, E's, PF's, etc
But trying to find B's w/ flat top *and* protected seems hard.

(It's late, I'm tired, I could just be missing 'em)

Thanks!


----------



## tandem (Jan 20, 2015)

*Re: Noob looking for best/proper 18650 cells for Fenix BC30........*

I don't shop for lithium ion cells on eBay. Ever. 

Many frauds / fakes show up there. See my sig and watch the videos. But it's not just UltraFire and TrustFire "brands" that are the subject of counterfeiting. Legitimately good brands are subject to counterfeiting by criminals all the time. I've not kept up with all the frauds of late but even years ago there were reports of AW lithium ion cell's being counterfeited and sold on eBay as well as SureFire CR123A primary cells. New examples show up _all the time_. 

If a Panasonic NCR18650B cell with protection is priced absurdly cheaply relative to the good sources out there, it should be viewed with extreme scepticism. Personally I'd rather reward the good, reliable, sources and be sure I'm getting the real deal.


----------



## loimpact (Jan 20, 2015)

Thanks for the warning! I will watch those videos for sure. I have heard plenty of stories so I know they're true.

I'm thinking I'll just order some Fenix cells just cuz there's enough paranoia about the rest out there, I can't think of anything safer.

BUT.....I'd still like to know......What would be the best cell (if not Fenix's newest cell....aka rebadged NCR18650b protected flat-top) for the BC30???

Again, 2 cells, side-by-side (I'm assuming they run in series, though there's 2 emitters) and I'd most likely run on the "high" setting most of the time.

And does there even exist a place to get NCR18650b's with flat-top *and* protection?

*(I really wish MOD(S) would've left my thread alone, but apparently there's no move to restore it)*


----------



## chazz (Jan 20, 2015)

loimpact said:


> Ok, so I think the mod(s) may have misdirected my thread.
> 
> I'm trying to find a "proper" (best suited) cell for the Fenix BC30 which runs 2 emitters and 2 batteries. In series? I'm not sure. I think so, but not sure.
> 
> ...



While I can't answer all your questions, to know the current draw on your light on high/burst you would need to either find a review that measures it, or measure it yourself with a DMM. I am guessing that a standard GOOD QUALITY Panasonic based 3400 mAH protected cell, would be sufficient. If you go with a high current cell and do not need it you are potentially at higher risk if something goes wrong with your light (the cell will give out much more current before protection trips) and you are also missing out on longer runtime. Just my opinion.  

As far as I know the super high amp draw cells are usually only needed for modded flashlights , and or some e-cig/vapor rigs. 

Check out Orbtronic, that is the brand I trust for all my 18650 stuff, I use Keeppower for my 2500 mAH 16650 cells. (I know there are other good brands also) But I would stick with cells made in Japan and from a reputable dealer.

I don't think I would use a ultrafire/trustfire battery even if someone gave them to me... but thats me, to each their own.


----------



## tandem (Jan 20, 2015)

Keeppower 18650 3400mAh (black) cells purchased from legit sources are real Panasonic cells with protection and are a solid choice for price and performance, as are any reputable and reviewed "maker" of such cells based on the same Panasonic cell.


----------



## loimpact (Jan 22, 2015)

tandem said:


> Keeppower 18650 3400mAh (black) cells purchased from legit sources are real Panasonic cells with protection and are a solid choice for price and performance, as are any reputable and reviewed "maker" of such cells based on the same Panasonic cell.



Just curious....is there a reason(s) why one would go with the Keeppowers over the actual Panasonics themselves? (I see them within a buck or so of eachother & just assumed Panasonic does their own cells best, no??)


----------



## HKJ (Jan 22, 2015)

loimpact said:


> Just curious....is there a reason(s) why one would go with the Keeppowers over the actual Panasonics themselves? (I see them within a buck or so of eachother & just assumed Panasonic does their own cells best, no??)



Panasonic do not make protected cells.
Cells with a clear wrapper and protection are assembled by a factory that will not reveal their name.


----------



## thedoc007 (Jan 22, 2015)

loimpact said:


> Just curious....is there a reason(s) why one would go with the Keeppowers over the actual Panasonics themselves? (I see them within a buck or so of eachother & just assumed Panasonic does their own cells best, no??)



See what HKJ said. Also, the green (unbranded) cells are among the longest/fattest cells in existence. They are many lights which will not physically accommodate the extra length/girth of those cells. The Keeppowers are slightly smaller, and fit in almost every 18650 light I have.


----------



## loimpact (Jan 22, 2015)

thedoc007 said:


> See what HKJ said. Also, the green (unbranded) cells are among the longest/fattest cells in existence. They are many lights which will not physically accommodate the extra length/girth of those cells. The Keeppowers are slightly smaller, and fit in almost every 18650 light I have.



Thank you, that helps a lot! I've seen HKJ's chart & I can see the length differences.

Actually, if somebody could recommend a top 3 which would give me a choice my criteria would be:

Short
Flat top
Protected

When I look at the charts & then look on ebay I seem to have a problem find all of that in one and from a good seller. I don't mind spending an extra buck or two, just want my above criteria met in a quality cell. (I wonder how long the new Fenix 3400 cells measure......even though they are still an NCR18650b)

Thanks again for all the feedback, gang, much appreciated in this insane world of lights & cells!! :sick2:


----------



## Danielcool (Jan 26, 2015)

*Bast 18650 battery*

What is the best 18650 battery?


----------



## 5S8Zh5 (Jan 26, 2015)

*Re: Bast 18650 battery*



Danielcool said:


> What is the best 18650 battery?



[URL="http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?388210-Best-high-capacity-18650"]Best 18650?[/url]


----------



## Hef (Jan 29, 2015)

*Tenergy 18650 battery- any good?*

Looking for spare batteries for a Surefire P1R Peacekeeper, the place I am going to buy the light from sell Tenergy batteries. I want to make sure to get a qaulity battery for this light.


----------



## ChrisGarrett (Jan 29, 2015)

*Re: Tenergy 18650 battery- any good?*



Hef said:


> Looking for spare batteries for a Surefire P1R Peacekeeper, the place I am going to buy the light from sell Tenergy batteries. I want to make sure to get a qaulity battery for this light.



I'd pass.

Panasonic/Sanyo, Sony, LG and Samsung are all top quality cells. Whether you want a protection circuit added to the naked/base cells above, is up to you.

With so much quality floating around, don't waste your time with any others.

Keeppower, AW, Redilast, Callies Kustom, Orbtronic, et al., all use quality cells in their rebranded and protected offerings.

Same with most of the top flashlight makers, like Fenix, Olight, NiteCore, EagleTac, et al..

You'll pay a bit more for the latter, but they generally use quality cells.

Chris


----------



## alpg88 (Jan 29, 2015)

*Re: Tenergy 18650 battery- any good?*

i use them for years, went thru prbly around hundred of them, not once i had any problem with them, i use protected 2600mah cells.


----------



## tandem (Jan 29, 2015)

*Re: Tenergy 18650 battery- any good?*



ChrisGarrett said:


> With so much quality floating around, don't waste your time with any others.



Agreed. 

What I like about the better brands you've mentioned is that the underlying cell *is* identified. With some brands, like Tenergy, we've no idea what the cell is, where it was made, and whether the cell used is constant batch to batch.

The better brands know publicizing the make of the cell _is a good thing _especially since the better brands use better cells from reliable sources.

For someone asking the question, the uncontroversial choice for a light like the one you are getting would be to buy from a reputable domestic seller one of the well regarded 18650's talked about here that incorporate the Panasonic NCR18650B 3400mAh cell. Chris listed a number of names that do just that. The underlying Panasonic cells have had a very good safety record and performance is excellent for your use case.

You can get a great protected 3400mAh 18650 cell utilizing the Panasonic cell for $12 from trustworthy domestic suppliers, so price isn't even an issue.


----------



## a1mu1e (Jan 31, 2015)

Sanyo 2800 protected button top, and a few XTARs


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----------



## nofon (Feb 1, 2015)

*18650BD vs 18650BE*

Is there any benefits of 18650BE cells over 18650BD cells? If so what are they?


----------



## NoNotAgain (Feb 1, 2015)

*Re: 18650BD vs 18650BE*



nofon said:


> Is there any benefits of 18650BE cells over 18650BD cells? If so what are they?



Per the chart over on http://best18650battery.com/, the 18650BD is rated at 10 amp discharge while the 18650BE is only rated at 3.63 amps.


----------



## nofon (Feb 1, 2015)

*Re: 18650BD vs 18650BE*

Thank you for the link.


----------



## spock (Feb 1, 2015)

*Re: 18650BD vs 18650BE*

hello, recent purchase of orbtronic 3400mah cells for use in tk35 and klarus xt11. very pleased so far.


----------



## lumen aeternum (Feb 2, 2015)

*Re: 18650BD vs 18650BE*

Bought an Eagletac 3400 and the first time I recharged it, it stopped working.


----------



## okashira (Feb 2, 2015)

*Re: 18650BD vs 18650BE*

I've tested the NCR18650BE and they run fairly well at 10A continuous. In fact, they perform similar to the NCR18650PF's which are well-known for 10A.
I have NCR18650BD's on the way.
Here is a chart I made to compare the BE to the PF.
I ran them with the same parameters that HKJ uses so you can compare to his graphs.
Yeah, 73°C is toasty, but like I said, the cell took no measurable damage. And 10A = 35W for 20 minutes.... overkill for any flashlight.
These cells definitely kill the NCR18650B's because of much better current capability.

I feel okay running the BE at 10A. I ran them again at 3A after two 10A runs and NO lost capacity.

The cells I want to get my hands on are Tesla Model S cells.... soon ;-)


----------



## smooth2o (Feb 2, 2015)

Used to be KeepPower but I switched to Orbtronic bc of the extra security features. See my thread on this topic. Not only that but they FIT! Well KeepPowers do too. 


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----------



## tandem (Feb 2, 2015)

smooth2o said:


> Used to be KeepPower but I switched to Orbtronic bc of the extra security features.



Keeppower also uses Seiko chips in the protection circuit. Use either.


----------



## SteveCA (Feb 3, 2015)

AW cells have always had a great reputation on this forum but the prices seem to be very high compared to many of the cells mentioned here that use the panasonic 18650B cell. Is there any advantage that the AW cells have that justify the premium pricing? The AW 3400mah protected 18650 is over $20 each from reputable suppliers.


----------



## Chicken Drumstick (Feb 3, 2015)

SteveCA said:


> AW cells have always had a great reputation on this forum but the prices seem to be very high compared to many of the cells mentioned here that use the panasonic 18650B cell. Is there any advantage that the AW cells have that justify the premium pricing? The AW 3400mah protected 18650 is over $20 each from reputable suppliers.


Like all markets, there is always a premium, budget and somewhere in the middle.

If you become an informed purchaser, you'll be able to know what you are buying and why.

Some premium items will have higher quality and/or ability, but sometimes it's perceived quality. There isn't really a right or wrong on this. If you want to buy AW's, then do so (I have some) and you are less likely to be unhappy with them.

If you don't want to pay the premium, do some research and buy something else. (which I also do).

If it's a single cell light that has low voltage warning/protection built in, then personally I think you'll struggle to really better the Efest 3100mAh 20A battery. And in the UK they are a lot cheaper than AW's.

Not the AW 3400, but a good example of why highest mAh doesn't mean the best:


----------



## psychbeat (Feb 3, 2015)

*Re: 18650BD vs 18650BE*



okashira said:


> I've tested the NCR18650BE and they run fairly well at 10A continuous. In fact, they perform similar to the NCR18650PF's which are well-known for 10A.
> I have NCR18650BD's on the way.
> Here is a chart I made to compare the BE to the PF.
> I ran them with the same parameters that HKJ uses so you can compare to his graphs.
> ...



Cool test - thanks!!!
Seems like the PF BE & BD are all pretty close performance-wise. 
I thought the model S uses BD?


----------



## Whalenard (Feb 8, 2015)

*18650 FOR LONGEST RUNTIME ON HIGH?*

Greetings fellow light lovers,
I have a ZL H600 MKII (with frosted lens) that I love. I currently run it on KEEPPOWER protected 2600 mah (black with silver label made in Korea) . I want to buy 2 new batteries that will give me the longest possible runtime on high. I realize the light bumps down output when to hot, but I am a little disappointed with how much runtime I can get on high before the battery is to low.

Using these graphs http://lygte-info.dk/review/batteries2012/Common18650Summary UK.html it seems the KEEPPOWER 2800 mah is my best bet?

Question
1. will I notice much more runtime on high with KEEPPOWER 2600mah vs 2800mah?
2. is there a better choice not covered in that graph like a Samsung 25R?


Also I've been toying with the idea of getting an Armytek wizard pro v2. Anyone care to comment If I would get a longer run time on high between that or my zebralight?


----------



## tandem (Feb 8, 2015)

*Re: 18650 FOR LONGEST RUNTIME ON HIGH?*

I run Keeppower 3400mAh cells in my SC600MkIIL2.

I don't run on H1 for all that long, preferring more runtime on one of the H2 levels.


----------



## Cpack0990 (Feb 9, 2015)

Hi newbie here I recently purchased a Fenix PD35 and am trying to figure out what 18650 batteries to go with the light. I also have a makita 3ah battery that I tore apart and it has 10 18650 cells 8 of them have 3.6 volts and 2 are flat. I believe they are sony if I have been reading right US SE18650v I was wondering if they will are safe to use in the light and if they are worth a dang period. I have tried finding a defiant answer to no avail if someone could help out I'd greatly appreciate it thank you.


----------



## tandem (Feb 9, 2015)

Cpack0990, welcome to CPF!

Your question probably deserves its own thread since you are asking specifically about reclaimed cells from power tools. 

If you simply want to buy an appropriate off the shelf product with a good track record, I'd recommend you pick up one of the commonly marketed high capacity protected cells that utilize the Panasonic NCR18650B such as the brands AW or Keeppower or Redilast or Orbtronic etc. CPF member HJK maintains an extensive cell and charger review site here. The Panasonic cells have a solid track record for safety, excellent performance characteristics suitable for many lights (including the PD35), high capacity, and are available at reasonable prices from a variety of vendors. 

With respect to using reclaimed cells... the question *are XYZ cells suitable for use in ABC light* seems like a simple one but when it comes to lithium ion power the details matter a lot. I hope you'll bear with me here as we work through the issues:

First of all, *you need to positively identify the cells* because not all lithium ion cells are the same when it comes to charging requirements and discharge characteristics. 

Power tools often use cells of different chemistry than the more common lithium-cobalt formulations that are found in laptops and in many, but not all, cells marketed to flash light users. If the Sony cells are Lithium-manganese construction (*IMR*) they can be charged in a "standard" lithium ion charger such as would also be usable for cells like the AW, Keeppower, etc, Panasonic NCR18650B lithium-cobalt (*ICR*) based cells.

However if the Sony cells are lithium-phosphate (LiFePO4 or *IFR*) based cells, they cannot be charged in many "standard" lithium ion chargers - you'll need to shop carefully and follow charger instructions carefully particularly if you are using a mix of new or reclaimed IFR cells and IMR/ICR cells. Again HJK's site provides detailed information on charger capabilities. 

Once you cross the cell-identification hurdle and know, for certain, what cells they are, then it's possible to answer the suitability question.

If those cells are in fact LiFEPO4 based Sony IFR cells (see this: http://www.sony.net/SonyInfo/News/Press/200908/09-083E/ ) then they are _IFR cells of fairly low capacity_. That doesn't make them useless, quite the contrary, because while LiFePO4 offers lower energy density than other formulations it provides greater ability to tolerate high charge rates and high discharge rates, making them perfect for use in some portable power tool packs. Tool makers get around low capacity by using cells in parallel or series-parallel configuration to provide the right voltage and capacity profile needed for the tool.

But the PD-35 is a single cell flashlight so there's no potential for cells wired in parallel to increase capacity. A 1,100 mAh IFR 18650 cell (when new) is something of a step backwards, capacity wise, given the currently available ICR based cells. Roughly speaking you'll get three times the runtime out of a $12 Keeppower cell using the ICR Panasonic NCR18650B cell which offers 3,400mAh capacity and can handle 3A draw just fine. 

That said if you have proper carry cases for spare cells maybe "free" cells with only 1/3 the runtime will be ok for your purpose. Just carry them safely, i.e. not loose in a pocket full of coins. 

In summary:



the cells will not have any over charge or over discharge protection; they were never designed to be sold individually to consumers as loose cells. Your light however will have built into it some over discharge protection.
the cells, if they are of type IFR, cannot be charged in most lithium-ion cell chargers. Be careful in your selection, and be careful in use.
the cells, if they are of type IFR, have a lower nominal voltage of 3.2V and are considered fully charged at ~3.6V (varies by cell model)
the cells, if they are of type IFR, offer only 1/3 the capacity of today's protected ICR cells
the cells, if they are of type IFR or IMR, _can _be used in the PD-35. The PD35 is said to draw ~ 2.9A on Turbo; about 1A on high, well within the range of capabilities for IFR/IMR cells, but run times in your light will be roughly 1/3 of what can be obtained from current-day ICR cells.


----------



## thedoc007 (Feb 9, 2015)

Another great synopsis, tandem. You are on a roll!

I will add one thing. Because the forward voltage of an XM-L2 emitter is fairly near the MAX voltage of a LiFePO4 cell, you may find that the picture is even worse than tandem described. Lower runtime is guaranteed, but it may not be able to sustain the higher modes at all. The PD35 driver is designed to work with a certain type of cell, at a nominal 3.7 volts. Using a cell that has significantly lower voltage is not recommended, and may trigger automatic stepdowns when the driver realizes voltage is below a certain threshold.


----------



## tandem (Feb 9, 2015)

Thanks thedoc007 for the feedback but more importantly for raising the issue of voltage suitability for this particular light. If the cells are IFR as suspected then they'd definitely not be a good fit.

So, Cpack0990, have we helped you here?

Mike


----------



## Ace12 (Feb 10, 2015)

*I Need 18650 battery and charger reccomendation.*

I want to buy a set of 18650 batteries and a charger for my zebralight H600. What is the top of the line brands and models to choose from? Must be able to charge in a vehicle from the 12V power outlet. TIA


----------



## NotSoBrightBob (Feb 10, 2015)

*Re: I Need 18650 battery and charger reccomendation.*

I'm not qualified to say what is the best but a protected 18650 based on a Panasonic cell is really good and well thought of and a nitecore D4 is a great charger


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----------



## Ace12 (Feb 10, 2015)

*Re: I Need 18650 battery and charger reccomendation.*

What about the *EagleTac 18650 3400mAh Li-Ion Rechargeable? *It says it uses the newest Panasonic 3400mAh*LiNiCoAlO2* cells, made in Japan. - 

*This is the shortest ultra high capacity 18650 ever made **WITH protrude top button!*
- Measures only 68mm in height (+/-0.1mm) and 18.5mm in width
- IC protected for a) over-charge, b) over-discharge, c) short circuit, d) current overflow of 5A+
- *True protrude/BUTTON top design*, fits all flashlights
- High discharge rate 5A+
- Nominal voltage: 3.6v, charge up to 4.2V, use CC/CV charger to charge
- Reinforced steel plate bottom, highly efficient protective PCB design


----------



## thedoc007 (Feb 10, 2015)

*Re: I Need 18650 battery and charger reccomendation.*



Ace12 said:


> What about the *EagleTac 18650 3400mAh Li-Ion Rechargeable?*



They are perfectly good, but they are often DOUBLE the cost of other cells that use the same base Panasonic cell. Not good value. 

If you really need a short 18650, they might be worth the money, but there are many other brands that give the same performance at a lower cost.


----------



## Ace12 (Feb 10, 2015)

*Re: I Need 18650 battery and charger reccomendation.*



thedoc007 said:


> They are perfectly good, but they are often DOUBLE the cost of other cells that use the same base Panasonic cell. Not good value.
> 
> If you really need a short 18650, they might be worth the money, but there are many other brands that give the same performance at a lower cost.



Will other brands fit into a Zebralight H600Fw MKII?


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----------



## Cpack0990 (Feb 10, 2015)

Thank you very much I sure am glad I just didn't get a charger that wouldn't work for those. I look forward to learning more about these batteries and lights. In my short time of finding out about these I'm starting to get addicted!


----------



## thedoc007 (Feb 10, 2015)

*Re: I Need 18650 battery and charger reccomendation.*



Ace12 said:


> Will other brands fit into a Zebralight H600Fw MKII?



Most likely, but I don't own that particular light. Every 18650 I have fits fine in my SC600, but the H600 tube may be a little bit shorter or narrower...no guarantees.


----------



## tandem (Feb 10, 2015)

*Re: I Need 18650 battery and charger reccomendation.*



Ace12 said:


> Will other brands fit into a Zebralight H600Fw MKII?



I believe the Mk II 600 series lights had some tube adjustments that are common to all, but you can get a sure fire answer by asking H600Mk II owners in the Zebralight thread. 

IF the H600Fw MkII tube and cap detail is similar to the SC600 Mk II, then almost any cell should fit.

I'm running AW 2600, 2900, 3100 and Keeppower 18650 3400mAh cells in my SC600 Mk II. I generally use the Keeppower cells in there. No fit issues with any of these cells; also all of the above fit every other 1x and 2x 18650 light I own.

Have a look at the cap and inside the tube of your H600 Mk II - if there are springs on both the cap and at the head, as there are with the SC600 Mk II, then length will tend not to be a problem.


----------



## tandem (Feb 10, 2015)

Cpack0990 said:


> Thank you very much I sure am glad I just didn't get a charger that wouldn't work for those. I look forward to learning more about these batteries and lights. In my short time of finding out about these I'm starting to get addicted!



We love making sure people are on the right track here!


----------



## lumen aeternum (Feb 11, 2015)

*Re: I Need 18650 battery and charger reccomendation.*



Ace12 said:


> What about the *EagleTac 18650 3400mAh Li-Ion Rechargeable? *It says it uses the newest Panasonic 3400mAh*LiNiCoAlO2* cells, made in Japan. -
> 
> *This is the shortest ultra high capacity 18650 ever made **WITH protrude top button!*
> - Measures only 68mm in height (+/-0.1mm) and 18.5mm in width
> ...



Wish I could figure out why the one I bought won't recharge, after being run down exactly once.


----------



## thedoc007 (Feb 11, 2015)

*Re: I Need 18650 battery and charger reccomendation.*



lumen aeternum said:


> Wish I could figure out why the one I bought won't recharge, after being run down exactly once.



Have you checked the voltage with a multimeter? In your last post you said it stopped working after the first charge, in this post it sounds like you may have fully discharged it, and now it won't take a charge. Which is it? What charger are you using?


----------



## NoNotAgain (Feb 11, 2015)

*Re: I Need 18650 battery and charger reccomendation.*

After doing some looking around on a few of the vape sites for batteries rated for 10 amp draw, I found a dealer that had Panasonic 18650BE cells at a real good price. He happens to have an eBay store, so I placed an order for 12 batteries. I like using extended the Fenix extended run-time kits with the larger Fenix lights, I thought I'd give it a go.

Received 12 cells, delivered for $65 and some change. All measured 3.66 volts before charging. Using a couple of Nitecore D4 chargers and will use the hobby charger to run capacity once fully charged. Provided they pan out as being good, if interested, I'll pass the dealers name along.


----------



## rommelrommel (Feb 12, 2015)

*Re: I Need 18650 battery and charger reccomendation.*

Does anyone have a trusted Canadian vendor for cells? Between shipping and our dollar tanking ordering from the us seems like a pretty expensive option.


----------



## ChrisGarrett (Feb 12, 2015)

*Re: I Need 18650 battery and charger reccomendation.*



rommelrommel said:


> Does anyone have a trusted Canadian vendor for cells? Between shipping and our dollar tanking ordering from the us seems like a pretty expensive option.



ArmyTek sells only a couple of li-ions and then there's this place:

https://www.canvape.com/SearchResults.asp?Cat=1927

Look for Canadian e-cig sites and then do your research.

Chris


----------



## tokyo (Feb 13, 2015)

I just bought a Nitecore MH10 and it comes with a 2300mah 18650, so I'm looking for a 3400mah 18650 but I'm not sure where to start. Should I just buy a Nitecore 3400mah or can I do better for $19? I'd prefer to spend less on a single battery.


----------



## NoNotAgain (Feb 13, 2015)

tokyo said:


> I just bought a Nitecore MH10 and it comes with a 2300mah 18650, so I'm looking for a 3400mah 18650 but I'm not sure where to start. Should I just buy a Nitecore 3400mah or can I do better for $19? I'd prefer to spend less on a single battery.



Depending on the light you're going to use the cell in, you can purchase Panasonic 18650B cells with protection and button top which are rated @ 3400mAh. Be warned that the Panasonic "B" protected cells are long, measuring over 70mm in length.

Other options are the KeepPower 3400mAh protected button top cells thru Illumination Supply for $12 each.


----------



## tandem (Feb 13, 2015)

In the budget range, Keeppower 3400mAh 18650's are good (~ $12 US) and contain the same Panasonic NCR18650B cell. Also Intl-Outdoor.com version of the same. And Enerpower+. Also Efest, although they seem to use a different protection circuit - not necessarily better nor worse.

Be wary of providers offering to sell protected Panasonic 18650B cells for too few dollars. You might not be getting what you need. 

Also consider checking with MH10 users here on CPF for fit issues. Some cells are a little longer or fatter than others and may have issues in some lights. 

HJK, a long time CPF member, maintains a very useful resource with reviews and measurements here: http://lygte-info.dk/


----------



## tokyo (Feb 13, 2015)

Thanks, I'll try to find out if the keeppower ones will fit. Illumination supply is actually near where I am so I might just drop by.


----------



## NoNotAgain (Feb 13, 2015)

tokyo said:


> Thanks, the I'll try to find out if the keeppower ones will fit. Illumination supply is actually near where I am so I might just drop by.



The KeepPower cells are the shortest cells in a protected button top battery you can purchase. Length typically isn't a problem with single cell lights. Where you run int problems is when cells are in a series mounted on top of each other.

Lights like the Nitecore Tiny Monsters require short cells or when the battery tube is screwed on can't make contact with the grounding ring.


----------



## tokyo (Feb 13, 2015)

are these legit?
http://www.fasttech.com/products/1141104

Panasonic protected 3400mah 2-pack - $8.74 each seems cheap compared to the rest of the branded ones??


----------



## thedoc007 (Feb 13, 2015)

tokyo said:


> are these legit?
> http://www.fasttech.com/products/1141104
> 
> Panasonic protected 3400mah 2-pack - $8.74 each seems cheap compared to the rest of the branded ones??



Yes, they are probably legit...but not THAT much cheaper than other cells, longer than most 18650s, you'll have to wait a while, and they are unbranded. Honestly I'd go elsewhere for cells...but if you need to save a few bucks, and don't mind the wait, they are quality.


----------



## thedoc007 (Feb 13, 2015)

NoNotAgain said:


> The KeepPower cells are the shortest cells in a protected button top battery you can purchase. Length typically isn't a problem with single cell lights. Where you run int problems is when cells are in a series mounted on top of each other.
> 
> Lights like the Nitecore Tiny Monsters require short cells or when the battery tube is screwed on can't make contact with the grounding ring.



Keeppowers are DEFINITELY not the shortest. Eagletac is one of the shortest...68.3 millimeters listed, versus 68.9 millimeters for the Keeppowers. I agree the length is totally reasonable, though, and my Keeppowers fit in virtually every light I have...fitment is not a big concern.

The Tiny Monsters, at least the TM11/15/26, actually require fairly long cells, not short ones. I tried to use an unprotected cell, just for grins, and it wouldn't work at all due to length...it was rattling around because it was too SHORT. Nitecore recommends the longer protected cells for a reason...they make much better contact. Even some of the long unbranded green cells work...although they do compress the springs a bit more than ideal, and some versions may not work at all.


----------



## NoNotAgain (Feb 14, 2015)

Doc, say what you want, but I've got more than a dozen Panasonic protected button topped cells that are too long for either the TM15 or TM26 to screw the battery magazine down to make a ground contact. All of the green Panasonic's measured more than 70 mm. In a stacked cell light, the Olight M3, the tail cap wouldn't screw on at all.

The KeepPower 3400mAh cells measured 68.5-68.6mm in length. Just checked 4 of the again.

All of my measuring tools are calibrated due to contract work I perform.

I tried some of the Eagletac cells and found them longer than the KeepPower 3400mAh button tops with protection. I have since given them away to people that I gave lights to as Christmas presents.

Your flat top cells wouldn't work because Nitecore uses a flat contact plate inside the light. That's why they have this statement in the TM15 owners manual:
6. This product does not support 18650 rechargeable Li-ion batteries
without a protection circuit board as these batteries are too short for
the TM15’s battery compartment.

The TM26 has this statement:
7. This product does not support unprotected 18650 Li-ion batteries. Please
also ensure that all the 18650 batteries used in the TM26 have a button top
configuration or they will not make contact with terminals in the battery
compartment. We recommend Nitecore 18650 batteries for the best
performance and reliability.


----------



## tandem (Feb 14, 2015)

My Keeppower ICR 3400's are slightly longer than my AW 2900's but fit in all my 1x18650 and 2x18650 lights -- not a surprise since all have springs in head and tail cap making them rather easy to fit a variety of cells.

I kinda wish the cells had another bottom plate added to protect the circuit board bottom, but honestly I don't expect wear to be an issue as I'm not popping out cells every day to charge. If I was, probably I would seek out a cell with another layer on the bottom. (AW?)

~12$ US for a solid protected Panasonic li-ion cell -- that's pretty good value. I bought mine from Illum too.


----------



## thedoc007 (Feb 14, 2015)

NoNotAgain said:


> The KeepPower 3400mAh cells measured 68.5-68.6mm in length. Just checked 4 of the again.
> 
> I tried some of the Eagletac cells and found them longer than the KeepPower 3400mAh button tops with protection. I have since given them away to people that I gave lights to as Christmas presents.



I likewise gave my Eagletacs away...for other reasons...otherwise I would just show you. I had two Eagletacs, and they were both shorter than any other protected cell I have. You can find plenty of other examples on this forum, with measurements. I'm not saying it because someone once told me that...I am saying it because I KNOW it, from personal experience.

This page has a list of cells, and lengths. Thanks HKJ! It clearly shows the Eagletac 3400 as shorter than the Keeppower 3400. Other cells, with lower capacity, are even shorter. Your claim that "The KeepPower cells are the shortest cells in a protected button top battery you can purchase" is demonstrably false.



NoNotAgain said:


> Your flat top cells wouldn't work because Nitecore uses a flat contact plate inside the light. That's why they have this statement in the TM15 owners manual:
> 6. This product does not support 18650 rechargeable Li-ion batteries
> without a protection circuit board *as these batteries are too short* for
> the TM15’s battery compartment.



I never said they were flat-tops, and I'm not a newbie here...I am familiar with the difference, and I tried it with button-top unprotected cells - they simply were not long enough. Even your own quote demonstrates my point...Nitecore's own documentation acknowledges that unprotected cells are TOO SHORT to be used in those lights.

And I know the unbranded green cells are iffy...they compress the springs too much, and may make other, shorter cells unusable. Perhaps you got some that were even longer than typical...there are several different versions out there, and the lengths vary. I've amended my earlier post to acknowledge that excessively long cells can be a problem as well.


----------



## Norm (Feb 14, 2015)

NoNotAgain said:


> Doc, say what you want, but I've got more than a dozen Panasonic protected button topped cells that are too long for either the TM15 or TM26 to screw the battery magazine down to make a ground contact. All of the green Panasonic's measured more than 70 mm. In a stacked cell light, the Olight M3, the tail cap wouldn't screw on at all.


It's not the Panasonic cells that are too long, Panasonic do not sell protected cells. It's whatever protection board the distributor chooses to add. The circuit boards do vary and that affects the length of the overall package.

Norm


----------



## Norm (Feb 14, 2015)

*Back to the topic please folks - Norm*


----------



## Ace12 (Feb 14, 2015)

thedoc007 said:


> I likewise gave my Eagletacs away...for other reasons...otherwise I would just show you. I had two Eagletacs, and they were both shorter than any other protected cell I have. You can find plenty of other examples on this forum, with measurements. I'm not saying it because someone once told me that...I am saying it because i KNOW it, from personal experience.
> 
> This page has a list of cells, and lengths. Thanks HKJ! It clearly shows the Eagletac 3400 as shorter than the Keeppower 3400. Other cells, with lower capacity, are even shorter. Your claim that "The KeepPower cells are the shortest cells in a protected button top battery you can purchase" is demonstrably false.
> 
> ...



Why did you get rid of the ET's?


Sent from my iPhone using Candlepowerforums


----------



## Ace12 (Feb 14, 2015)

So what would the average life expectancy be of an18650 be if only charged once a month? The light I intend to get will run 30 hours on medium. And I average about an hour a day usage for work. 


Sent from my iPhone using Candlepowerforums


----------



## thedoc007 (Feb 14, 2015)

Ace12 said:


> So what would the average life expectancy be of an18650 be if only charged once a month? The light I intend to get will run 30 hours on medium. And I average about an hour a day usage for work.



It depends on how much time it spends fully charged, and fully depleted, and on temperature. I personally would top off at least a couple times a month, in that scenario...li-ions do NOT like being fully discharged. You should get years out of a cell, if you are willing to put up with some capacity loss.


----------



## Paully_B (Feb 14, 2015)

While I may be a noobie, I've had a lot of luck with AMAZON ordering pana 3400mah 18650s. In thinterest of full disclosure, I don't have a meter and cannot measure voltage. But they work well in my ZL sc600 II.


----------



## tandem (Feb 14, 2015)

Ace12 said:


> So what would the average life expectancy be of an18650 be if only charged once a month? The light I intend to get will run 30 hours on medium. And I average about an hour a day usage for work.



Based on studies done by the military (and others) if you want to extract the maximum life span out of your cells, don't fully charge them. Charging to 80% gives you most of the utility (for your usage pattern) and will basically double their cycle life.

I do this with some of my cells but the few that get used most, I pop into a simple meter-less charger (Pila IBC) and let them charge fully. Cells aren't that expensive and even my five year old cells are still going strong.


----------



## Keisari (Feb 15, 2015)

tandem said:


> Based on studies done by the military (and others) if you want to extract the maximum life span out of your cells, don't fully charge them. Charging to 80% gives you most of the utility (for your usage pattern) and will basically double their cycle life.
> 
> I do this with some of my cells but the few that get used most, I pop into a simple meter-less charger (Pila IBC) and let them charge fully. Cells aren't that expensive and even my five year old cells are still going strong.


Very true. The number of cycles will not be important if the batteries are really to be recharged only once(or twice) every month, but the lower charge will slow down their aging over time, just as a lower storage temperature. I would still just do a standard 4.2 volt charge and even that long before necessary to always have lots of reserve capacity available.

Life expectancy will probably be most affected by temperature. I believe that a couple of my laptop battery packs that died in less than 2 years did that just because of their warm environment(immediately under hot components). They were not being cycled much, but the machines were running sometimes 24/7 on external power. That makes it hard for the batteries, being topped up all the time and staying at maybe 30 degrees C. Any charger or charging circuit should be made with an option to force a maximum charge of 80%.

High capacity batteries might not be a good investment if the application is a device that runs for 30 hours on one charge(with what capacity, 2200 or 3400 mAh?) and is only used one hour daily. Any quality brand 18650 with standard capacity would be about as good IMO.

Now I realize we are wandering into off topic and will shut up.


----------



## Ace12 (Feb 15, 2015)

Anyone tried the Zebralight batteries or heard any reviews on them?

http://www.zebralight.com/ZL634-340...-Battery-ship-to-US-customers-only_p_125.html


Sent from my iPhone using Candlepowerforums


----------



## tokyo (Feb 18, 2015)

The Olight protected 3400 18650 is a little cheaper than the Keeppower 3400s, is there any reason to go with the Keeppowers?


----------



## thedoc007 (Feb 18, 2015)

tokyo said:


> The Olight protected 3400 18650 is a little cheaper than the Keeppower 3400s, is there any reason to go with the Keeppowers?



Where are you located? Here in the USA Keeppowers are generally substantially cheaper. $12 or so for Keeppowers, $14-18 for Olight cells.

The Olight cells are longer than the Keeppowers, so that is one good reason to avoid them. Both of them are based on quality cells, though, so as long as they fit in all your lights, it doesn't matter much either way.


----------



## tokyo (Feb 18, 2015)

thedoc007 said:


> Where are you located? Here in the USA Keeppowers are generally substantially cheaper. $12 or so for Keeppowers, $14-18 for Olight cells.
> 
> The Olight cells are longer than the Keeppowers, so that is one good reason to avoid them. Both of them are based on quality cells, though, so as long as they fit in all your lights, it doesn't matter much either way.



I'm in California. The cheapest I can find the Keeppowers is $27 for two on Ebay, They're available at Illumination supply (which is an hour away from me) for $12/per cell + 9% tax plus gas or shipping. A seller on Amazon has two Olight cells for $25 shipped (no tax and free ship with prime).


----------



## thedoc007 (Feb 18, 2015)

tokyo said:


> I'm in California. The cheapest I can find the Keeppowers is $27 for two on Ebay, They're available at Illumination supply (which is an hour away from me) for $12/per cell + 9% tax plus gas or shipping. A seller on Amazon has two Olight cells for $25 shipped (no tax and free ship with prime).



Fair enough. I usually buy them either several at a time, or with other items. Not a good deal if you buy just two of them, and nothing else.


----------



## tandem (Feb 19, 2015)

Ace12 said:


> Anyone tried the Zebralight batteries or heard any reviews on them?



Nope, but again they have the Panasonic 3400mAh cell under the wrapper so they'll be fine. 

FWIW the $12 Keeppower 3400mAh (also Panasonic under the wrap) fit just fine in my Zebralight SC600 Mk II L2; my understanding is the latest SC62 version like the SC600 Mk II has springs at both ends; this certainly helps accommodate a wider (longer) range of cells.


----------



## Chicken Drumstick (Feb 19, 2015)

Paully_B said:


> While I may be a noobie, I've had a lot of luck with AMAZON ordering pana 3400mah 18650s. In thinterest of full disclosure, I don't have a meter and cannot measure voltage. *But they work well in my ZL sc600 II.*


How do you know? Without measuring, or some kind of benchmark, they could be performing terribly. Not saying they are, but far too many people on here post unsubstantiated opinions as something factual.


----------



## 5S8Zh5 (Feb 19, 2015)

I noticed my Efest Purple IMR18650 V2 2500mAh charged much quicker (2 hours) than my other 18650, a Panasonic NCR18650B 3400mAh (3 hours) - XTAR VP2, 1A. Is it because it's a high drain Li-Lion? This was the first charge after receiving these nib 18650s. Efest started at 3.72V and Panasonic at 3.69.


----------



## Tobias Bossert (Feb 19, 2015)

It depends, which battery will be best for a application. For example at up to 3A discharge current:

In case capacity is of most interest and voltage is not critical: Panasonic NCR18650B will be the winner
In case voltage is critical: LG ICR18650D1 will be the winner

Unfortunately some already optimized things get overoptimized too.
LG has "improved" ICR18650D1 in the wrong direction: Higher capacity (good) and lower voltage under load (bad)!

Read my explanation at my new thread LG 18650 D1 changed?


----------



## [email protected] (Feb 26, 2015)

*Need input and recommendations on Cree and Defiant flashlights*

I recently purchased several Cree flashlights of varying strenghts, from 1500 lumens to 18,000 lumens. They did not come with batteries so I am looking for appropriate 18650's for them. I have read a couple of reviews and found one pretty easy to decipher the other was over my head. But a couple of mAh strenghts were not tested; like the Ultrafire 5000 mAh. Please bear with me here... is the mAh mean a greater capacity and therefore a longer run time? Can you ruin a flashlight using a higher mAh than it's rated for? I also purchased the Defiant flashlights being sold now at Home Depot. I got a 350 lumen 500 lumen and a 1000 lumen, with hi/lo/strobe functions. Not a lot of features but they seem a pretty good bang for your buck.


----------



## SubLGT (Feb 27, 2015)

*Re: Need input and recommendations on Cree and Defiant flashlights*

There are no legitimate 18650 batteries with capacity higher than 3600 mAh. Stay away from Ultrafire, and other batteries with "fire" in their name.


----------



## SubLGT (Feb 27, 2015)

*Re: Need input and recommendations on Cree and Defiant flashlights*



[email protected] said:


> ………………. is the mAh mean a greater capacity and therefore a longer run time? Can you ruin a flashlight using a higher mAh than it's rated for?…...



Yes
No


----------



## Keisari (Feb 28, 2015)

*Re: Need input and recommendations on Cree and Defiant flashlights*



5S8Zh5 said:


> I noticed my Efest Purple IMR18650 V2 2500mAh charged much quicker (2 hours) than my other 18650, a Panasonic NCR18650B 3400mAh (3 hours) - XTAR VP2, 1A. *Is it because it's a high drain Li-Lion*? This was the first charge after receiving these nib 18650s. Efest started at 3.72V and Panasonic at 3.69.


As far is I know, it's exactly because of that. Well, during the CC phase it is capacity that counts(and the IMR has slightly less capacity), but this makes very little difference when your charger has such a high charging current. The CV phase might be substantially shorter because the cells draw higher amperage at CV, leading to them finishing faster. This might even stress the cells in extreme cases, but is not probably important in 18650s that have quite a large capacity.



[email protected] said:


> I recently purchased several Cree flashlights of varying strenghts, from 1500 lumens to 18,000 lumens.


Keep in mind these "Cree flashlights" or actually generic flashlights that probably have Cree LEDs are probably nowhere close to those ratings. More like 60% or 15% of the stated Chinalumens.


> Ultrafire 5000 mAh.


Those could have an actual capacity of 1100 or 2200 mAh. Probably nothing close to 3000, and certainly not 5000. Five ampere hour 18650's do not exist.


> is the mAh mean a greater capacity and therefore a longer run time?


Capacity, yes. Longer runtime, typically but not necessarily. Comparison depends on the comparison, obviously.

"5000 mAh" Householdfires will most likely have a shorter runtime than any legitimate 2200 mAh or 3400 mAh batteries.


> Can you ruin a flashlight using a higher mAh than it's rated for?


Flashlights are not generally rated for a battery capacity. At least they should not be. The important thing is the battery is the correct type, size and voltage, and can supply enough current. Capacity just means how long the device will run, I mean mostly capacity. If it's very high drain, actual capacity in that specific application might be way less than the battery's nominal capacity, even when the nominal capacity is not exaggerated.


----------



## thedoc007 (Feb 28, 2015)

*Re: Need input and recommendations on Cree and Defiant flashlights*



Keisari said:


> As far is I know, it's exactly because of that. Well, during the CC phase it is capacity that counts(and the IMR has slightly less capacity), but this makes very little difference when your charger has such a high charging current. The CV phase might be substantially shorter because the cells draw higher amperage at CV, leading to them finishing faster. This might even stress the cells in extreme cases, but is not probably important in 18650s that have quite a large capacity.



One cell has less total capacity, and starts at a higher voltage. Of course it will take less time! It needs less energy to "fill the tank", so to speak.

The charge current is set entirely by the charger. Whether you have an IMR or ICR makes ABSOLUTELY no difference to the charge rate, as far as I know. 

One amp is NOT "such a high charging current", either. For a 3400 mAh 18650, it is around .3C, within manufacturer specs.


----------



## Kbreese (Mar 12, 2015)

*Re: Need input and recommendations on Cree and Defiant flashlights*

I notice with the Panasonic cells everyone says they buy the 18650B's. Recently I just purchased these 18650A's:

https://www.fasttech.com/products/1420/10001980/1141103-panasonic-protected-ncr18650a-rechargeable

Anything wrong with them? They are to be used in a couple of SupFire F3-L2's, and possibly a ThorFire VG10


----------



## thedoc007 (Mar 12, 2015)

*Re: Need input and recommendations on Cree and Defiant flashlights*



Kbreese said:


> Anything wrong with them?



Absolutely not. They are made to the same high-quality standard...they just offer slightly less capacity compared to the NCR18650B. I've heard that they MIGHT have slightly more voltage sag under load as well, but it is not likely something that you would ever notice with casual use. And they are often a better value per milli-amp hour...you pay a large premium for that last ten percent of performance, as with most things.


----------



## ven (Mar 13, 2015)

*Re: Need input and recommendations on Cree and Defiant flashlights*

As the doc says,just remember pany A=3100mah and pany B=3400mah .Well thats whats on the wrapper,certain testing does reveal a slight discrepancy in actual mah to split hairs. I have a good few of both,unless you use your light to the maximum time(maybe flashes,maybe not turn on,maybe will not sustain certain modes to indicate charge time). You would be hard pushed to notice the difference between 3100mah /3400mah, or so i have found in my use. Example,my light may get used for 1hr-2hrs,usually on a medium mode of 200-400lm in a day. I will top the cell back up which suits my use/practice and long term better on the cell. Deep charge cycles ,maybe from 3.1v to 4.2v take a good while,mine tend to be from around 3.6/3.7v back to 4.2v. Also topping off the cell from 3.7v up to 4.2 is not a full cycle,could be 2 or 3" top ups" for a cycle dependent on the original V before charge begins.

Now my IMR use on my vaporshark(VS) rDNA40(ecig mod) really does use the IMR or INR cell harder than my lights. Often at least 6A ,sometimes 9A dependent on what sub ohm coil(less than 1.0ohm). My VS when battery warning flashes ,cell is removed,voltage can be 3.2v give/take 0.1v. The cells be them efest 2500mah/25r 2500mah/LG 2500mah are placed in the vp2,within 2hrs they are charged via the 1A setting. This is daily,sometimes used more than once in a day........heavy use compared to my flashlight cell use!

Being happy with these cells,how they performed in a harsher environment(in my case anyway)i purchased more for high draw lights(modified). The latest have been either 25r INR or the new LG IMR..........

Just a little warning,sometimes the wait can be substancial,not too long back delivery was around 2 weeks,last 6+ months up to 5 weeks. Now i pay a little more and by local(same country) just a thought if need quick. Not saying they WILL take that long,just a possibility and what i have experienced(of course this differs per country). Reputable shop in same country wins for me,even if a few more $,however if no rush then some good savings can be had!! more so if bought in bulk(so to speak)
From my findings ven ,sorry for waffle...........as always


----------



## Kbreese (Mar 13, 2015)

*Re: Need input and recommendations on Cree and Defiant flashlights*



thedoc007 said:


> Absolutely not. They are made to the same high-quality standard...they just offer slightly less capacity compared to the NCR18650B. I've heard that they MIGHT have slightly more voltage sag under load as well, but it is not likely something that you would ever notice with casual use. And they are often a better value per milli-amp hour...you pay a large premium for that last ten percent of performance, as with most things.



Thanks for the response. One other thing I wasn’t sure about was one reviewer said, to quote him: “old batteries. has a protection that you don't need anymore. the "IMR" technology is the protection nowadays”

Any truth to that? 

Also, are these Made in China or Made in Japan batteries. The Fasttech description did not specify. I've heard the ones made in Japan are much better.


----------



## thedoc007 (Mar 13, 2015)

*Re: Need input and recommendations on Cree and Defiant flashlights*



Kbreese said:


> Thanks for the response. One other thing I wasn’t sure about was one reviewer said, to quote him: “old batteries. has a protection that you don't need anymore. the "IMR" technology is the protection nowadays”
> 
> Any truth to that?
> 
> Also, are these Made in China or Made in Japan batteries. The Fasttech description did not specify. I've heard the ones made in Japan are much better.



No, that is bad information. IMR chemistry is safer in some specific situations, but a protection circuit is still a good idea when possible. If you treat lithium-ion carefully, either type can be pretty darn safe...but the protection circuit offers additional safety features, either way. Commonly they protect against overcharging, over-discharging, over current (short circuit), and sometimes excessive temperature. IMR chemistry doesn't do any of that...it is just somewhat less likely to go  if mistreated.

As far as I know, all NCR18650A and NCR18650B are made in Japan. Protection circuits may be added elsewhere, but the most important thing is to start with a high-quality cell that delivers on specifications.


----------



## ven (Mar 13, 2015)

*Re: Need input and recommendations on Cree and Defiant flashlights*

I have a simple rule of thumb(helps being simple) be what ever the chemistry ICR/IMR/INR ,protected or not,just treat the same.................with respect. Of course used in different applications which are best suited ,but regarding discharging(be it a flashlight or an ecig etc) and charging(reputable brand so terminates and does not carry on charging or left unattended for long periods............no matter if protected cell/s,no matter if charger terminates..............only takes the one in a million fail.Even if there is 0.00001% of a chance.........its still a chance of failure).

Regardless of PCB or a more stable chemistry ,never over discharge /charge simply put.

If cells after a specific amount of time(huge variable dependent on charge cycles ,be it full or partial and time)if they dont hold charge the same,time to recycle/replace

Over the years i have had issue free use of lithium 18650 unprotected cells,i dont take it for granted ............

Just my general opinion
Roll on LG 3500 mah 10a cells..........


----------



## Kbreese (Mar 13, 2015)

*Re: Need input and recommendations on Cree and Defiant flashlights*

Just bought one of these protected Panasonic 18650B's, made in Japan with the Seiko IC and AO8814 MOSFETs protection circuit. At $11.43 shipped it was the best price I could find on this particular battery:

http://www.mtnelectronics.com/index.php?route=product/product&product_id=55&search=NCR18650B-PROT

Placed the order last night and got shipping confirmation early this afternoon. 

It's the same Battery that Orbtronic sells for about $3 more on their site. If anyone knows where to get them cheaper, chime in!


----------



## KITROBASKIN (Mar 13, 2015)

*Re: Need input and recommendations on Cree and Defiant flashlights*



Kbreese said:


> Just bought one of these protected Panasonic 18650B's, made in Japan with the Seiko IC and AO8814 MOSFETs protection circuit. At $11.43 shipped it was the best price I could find on this particular battery:
> 
> http://www.mtnelectronics.com/index.php?route=product/product&product_id=55&search=NCR18650B-PROT
> 
> ...



I don't know about Orbtronic but the mtnelectronics protected 18650B and BD that I got, do not fit in my Oveready lights (too wide) but do fit in the Chinese flashlights I have.


----------



## Kbreese (Mar 13, 2015)

*Re: Need input and recommendations on Cree and Defiant flashlights*



KITROBASKIN said:


> I don't know about Orbtronic but the mtnelectronics protected 18650B and BD that I got, do not fit in my Oveready lights (too wide) but do fit in the Chinese flashlights I have.



I think all my lights are made in china. I'm mostly a budget light guy, But I do have a Fenix TK45 and a Xeno E03 V3, and few other lights that weren't all that cheap, but still I've probably purchased at least 100 different flashlights and I think they all were made in China. As far as the lights I will be using 18650's for it's two SupFire F3-L2's and a ThorFire VG10. I think they both are ok with the bigger protected 18650's...but I guess I'll find out when they arrive!


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## Rinspeed (Mar 13, 2015)

*Re: Need input and recommendations on Cree and Defiant flashlights*



KITROBASKIN said:


> I don't know about Orbtronic.







I do, great cells and awesome customer service.


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## magcharger101 (Mar 15, 2015)

*Looking for 18650s with the longest runtime.*

Im looking for the best 18650 batteries for long runtime for frog gigging. I have nitecore 2300 now. Any suggestions?


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## NoNotAgain (Mar 15, 2015)

*Re: Looking for 18650s with the longest runtime.*



magcharger101 said:


> Im looking for the best 18650 batteries for long runtime for frog gigging. I have nitecore 2300 now. Any suggestions?



Depending on the light you have, you may be able to use Orbtronics 3600 mAh cells, ohterwise the Nitecore NL189 battery is 3400mAh rated. Most of the 3400mAh batteries use the Panasonic cell. 

A budget priced 3400 protected button topped battery like your Nitecore ones are made by Keeppower. Illumination Supply has them for $12-13 a battery.


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## CelticCross74 (Mar 16, 2015)

*Re: Looking for 18650s with the longest runtime.*

Frog gigging? Ooookay....anyways technically that would be either the Orbtronic or Keeppower 3600mah 18650. These are still pretty new and sell out at vendors as soon as they get them. The difference between 3400mah and 3600mah when it comes to run times is not huge but it is there. I have 6 of the Orbtronic 3600mah 18650's which I consider myself lucky to have as Orbtronic sells out of them as soon as they get them now.


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## magcharger101 (Mar 17, 2015)

*Re: Looking for 18650s with the longest runtime.*

Thanks for the info. Ive been looking at the unprotected batteries also but unsure of the safty of them being that i use a head light that has the battery's on the back of my head.


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## RobEU (Mar 21, 2015)

*18650/LED torch battery question*

Guys,

I bought this LED torch:
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/131444445928?_trksid=p2059210.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK:MEBIDX:IT

Now I need 18650 batteries, but there are so many different, which ones I need/would be best for my torch? So far I have found out I need 3.7v.Protected/unprotected? How many amps? There are 10/20/30/33amp.

I have been checking eBay.co.uk and so far have found such models for Samsung, hence I can`t make a choice

30B
2E11


26F M
SDIEM
TD01


26F
2D34


26F
2CB3


25R
2DA3


30B
2DC5


30B
2E94


30B
2D81


28A
2D72


22P
1C91


26FM
TDS4


26F
2DB2

I would prefer something from LG/Sony/Sanyo/Samsung or any other known brand which I stand a chance getting genuine in UK, no more than £7 per battery, 2800-3100mAh. Please advise guys, thank you.


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## eric1565 (Apr 19, 2015)

*Re: 18650/LED torch battery question*

I bought a few tesla model s cells from a guy. I checked them on my icharger and they were putting out about 3125 mah. So I think they were 3200 from the factory. They are NCA chemistry. From what I have read these cells will last a long time both calendar life and cycle life. Do so reading on the tesla fourm and you can read on the capacity vs miles. These seem to be good batteries.


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## eric1565 (Apr 19, 2015)

Forgot to mention. Gave them to my vapor buddies t play with. There main comments were this. Had good capacity but would not burn as hot at the vtc4 or 5s. But if using on 15a or less draw the tesla cells were as good as any other quality battery. I bought the batts for 6.50 each so I would say it is good deal since other batts from orbtroincs cost about 9 a cell


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## magellan (Apr 20, 2015)

I've had good performance from my Orbtronic, Panasonic BD's, and Voidhawk 18650's. The Voidhawks though are sometimes too fat for my Tain lights but fit in my Nitecore, Jetbeam, EagleTac, Olight, and Niwalker.


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## 1c3d0g (Jun 11, 2015)

*Re: Need input and recommendations on Cree and Defiant flashlights*



Rinspeed said:


> I do, great cells and awesome customer service.


Agreed 100%. You cannot go wrong with OrbTronic. I've used their batteries for a long time, they just don't quit!:twothumbs


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## CelticCross74 (Jun 12, 2015)

*Re: Need input and recommendations on Cree and Defiant flashlights*

Ive lost track. What light are we trying to find the best cell for again? TN12 2014?


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## Overclocker (Jun 12, 2015)

*Re: 18650/LED torch battery question*



eric1565 said:


> I bought a few tesla model s cells from a guy. I checked them on my icharger and they were putting out about 3125 mah. So I think they were 3200 from the factory. They are NCA chemistry. From what I have read these cells will last a long time both calendar life and cycle life. Do so reading on the tesla fourm and you can read on the capacity vs miles. These seem to be good batteries.




they're claimed to be NCR18650BE cells which are 3200mah 10A cells. of course Panny/Tesla wouldn't confirm/deny.

so yes they don't put out as much amps as a VTC5


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## CelticCross74 (Jun 12, 2015)

*Re: 18650/LED torch battery question*

...totally lost. Thought we were trying to come up with suggestions for the best cell for the TN12 2014 which pulls 3 amps. Guess I missed the post where that changed lol


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## ChrisGarrett (Jun 12, 2015)

*Re: 18650/LED torch battery question*



CelticCross74 said:


> ...totally lost. Thought we were trying to come up with suggestions for the best cell for the TN12 2014 which pulls 3 amps. Guess I missed the post where that changed lol



There is no 'best,' only a handful, or two, of qualified cells.

For a 3A light, I'm throwing out the LG 3000mAh 4.35v D1s, or 3200mAh E1s.

Chris


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## idleprocess (Jun 13, 2015)

*Re: 18650/LED torch battery question*



CelticCross74 said:


> ...totally lost. Thought we were trying to come up with suggestions for the best cell for the TN12 2014 which pulls 3 amps. Guess I missed the post where that changed lol


Judging by the wildly varying subject lines on individual posts, I would speculate that a number of threads have been merged by the admins.


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## pnx087 (Jun 18, 2015)

*Re: 18650/LED torch battery question*

I am using the AW 3400 mAh 18650 ICR. I am guessing that there is probably a new generation since I purchased them about a year ago. I have one in my PD32UE, and a spare. Before that I was using the 2600 mAh AW ICR when it was testing better than the old 3100 mAh model due to the improved chemistry. I have two of them as well, one in a PD35 and one as a spare. I also have a few of the 2000 mAh 18650 AW IMRs for vaping, but they could go in either Fenix should I need them. Then I have some 123s should I ever hit a point in which those six batteries of massive capacity aren't enough to hold me over with a power outage (and it would need to be a pretty serious outage given how long one 3400 mAh ICR will run the PD32UE on a lower setting.)


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## Rinspeed (Jul 1, 2015)

*Re: Need input and recommendations on Cree and Defiant flashlights*



1c3d0g said:


> Agreed 100%. You cannot go wrong with OrbTronic. I've used their batteries for a long time, they just don't quit!:twothumbs





Placed another with Orbtronics last Friday and had my package delivered on Monday. Great service and their cells hold a charge as long as any I have tried so far. There might be slightly better cells out there but for me Orbtronics is first rate and they will continue to be my first choice.


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## newbiebiker (Aug 27, 2015)

still 5000 mAh is the highest capacity in 18650 ? or non-fake are there, because 6000 mAh ultrafire are actually not able to hold that much.


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## markr6 (Aug 27, 2015)

newbiebiker said:


> still 5000 mAh is the highest capacity in 18650 ? or non-fake are there, because 6000 mAh ultrafire are actually not able to hold that much.



Lots of fakes out there. 3600mAh is currently the highest REAL cell you'll find. Panasonic NCR18650G comes to mind.


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## WarRaven (Aug 27, 2015)

Seems all over the place so this should feel right at home.

Anyone here using Keeppower IMR 3200s?
Happy with them, fit most things you had intended?
Any issues with charging them to 4.23?

Have a pair coming I used points on, misread data an thought they'd be not bad in cold, no better or worse then what I have currently in hindsight. 

If you're using these, in what?
Thanks.


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## markr6 (Aug 27, 2015)

WarRaven said:


> Seems all over the place so this should feel right at home.
> 
> Anyone here using Keeppower IMR 3200s?
> Happy with them, fit most things you had intended?
> ...



I think I mentioned it in another thread, but I have 3 of those in my MX25L3C Nichia. No problems at all. My Opus 3100 charger seems to stop around 4.17v or 4.18 on any cell. I'm OK with that. 4.23v seems a little high and I wouldn't do that often if I could avoid it. Mine are unprotected WITH button top, so they fit EVERYTHING. I don't think there's a light where it wouldn't fit.


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## WarRaven (Aug 27, 2015)

Right on Mark, thanks.

You've no issues in multiples either.
Yeah, little high on charge, I have another that tops around what yours is. I'm torn on that, selfish reasons mainly ☺

I grabbed button tops too, was thinking of using these in MH20, one for back up. Maybe Olight idk yet an now working on their direction instead of buying another light to put them in.
I got to get me behind back to work lol, I'm getting poor.

I don't have any modded lights that pull crazy amps, just wanted better cold temp performance, but I read it wrong lol.
So now where to use these little blasting electron caps.


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## pabcor (Dec 5, 2015)

Does anyone know when 18650 will be launch with more capacity of real 3600 mAh? will Panasonic? LG? Other?


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## Phlogiston (Dec 6, 2015)

Panasonic have been "working towards" producing a 4000mAh Li-Ion 18650 for a couple of years now, but it hasn't appeared yet. I suspect that they may be having trouble cramming that much capacity into the 18650 form factor. 

I haven't seen any aspirational press releases (or even rumours) relating to the other cell manufacturers' targets.


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## pabcor (Dec 7, 2015)

Thank you


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## checkerfred (Dec 9, 2015)

So currently, what's the best bang for your buck 18650 protected battery out there? (from a reputable U.S. dealer) I've been looking at 3400mAh Panasonics and the cheapest I've found has bee right under $10 each.


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## markr6 (Dec 9, 2015)

checkerfred said:


> So currently, what's the best bang for your buck 18650 protected battery out there? (from a reputable U.S. dealer) I've been looking at 3400mAh Panasonics and the cheapest I've found has bee right under $10 each.



I don't buy protected cells, but I think the 3500mAH $9.95 cells at mtn electronics are the best value. Out of stock ATM though.


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## Bretcoe (Dec 9, 2015)

So, I'm the new guy here and wanted to see what kind of unprotected cells you guys like. I am going to be getting an 18650 flashlight, its just a matter of when my OCD allows me to pull the trigger instead of continually diving deeper and deeper into every little detail of these lights (thinking Fenix PD-35, or Zebralight SC600 but still have a lot to learn).

I've never used a protected cell, but have a fair amount of experience with unprotected, high drain, 18650's. I recently quit tobacco (chewed my whole life), and began "vaping". 


Here are a couple questions I have:

What are the advantages of using a protected cell?

Those that like unprotected cells, are you using high drain (some say discharge)... do you really need the available amp draw for these flashlights?


I imagine that there is little need for 20-30A current draw on the smaller 1x flashlights. So, if I used one of my unpaired 18650h high drain "vape" batteries I would just be sacrificing a couple hundred mAh.

Sorry for the lengthy post, but I'm thinking/learning about this as I'm typing (I have way too many tabs open right now).

Thanks



PS. Be aware that there are VERY MANY clone, fake, re-wrapped batteries out there right now as the "vaping" industry is growing and there is money to be made in batteries. As far as I am aware there are really only 3 or 4 actual battery manufacturers out there, Panasonic, Sony, and Samsung for sure, and possibly Sanyo. Every other battery is just one of these with someone else's name on it. Be wary of cheap, high mAh batteries. The current limit on mAh is right around 3400mAh.


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## ChrisGarrett (Dec 9, 2015)

Bretcoe said:


> So, I'm the new guy here and wanted to see what kind of unprotected cells you guys like. I am going to be getting an 18650 flashlight, its just a matter of when my OCD allows me to pull the trigger instead of continually diving deeper and deeper into every little detail of these lights (thinking Fenix PD-35, or Zebralight SC600 but still have a lot to learn).
> 
> I've never used a protected cell, but have a fair amount of experience with unprotected, high drain, 18650's. I recently quit tobacco (chewed my whole life), and began "vaping".
> 
> ...



It all depends.

I use unprotected cells because I'm checking voltages often and I really don't use my lights for very long periods on any given day.

Some people want the added over-charge, under-charge and current limiting safeguards offered by protected cells.

Some people run monster lights and can't use protected cells without tripping the PCBs in protected cells.

Some people do 'sub ohm' vaping mechs and need 20A+ cells like the Sony VTC-5, or Samsung 25Rs.

Some people just need a cell that does 3-4A and want capacity, not really needing high current cells.

Some people own lights that protected cells DO NOT fit, so they're stuck.

I got into the 4.35v cells just because I could with my then new Xtar VP2 charger. They hold a bit higher voltage, but are still low drain cells.

I have a modified SupFire M6 from Mountain Electronics and it pulls about 7A in stock form, so I bought some Samsung 25Rs to run in it. I don't really fret over lower capacity, since I don't use the light all that much.

We have the Big 5: Japan: Sony, Panasonic and Sanyo. South Korea: LG and Samsung. There are other Chinese makers MNKE, but the above are quality cells.

Life's too short to muck with XXX-Fire and some of the other 'off-brands,' IMO.

Chris


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## KeepingItLight (Dec 10, 2015)

If you go with the latest ZebraLight offering, the *ZebraLight SC600w Mk. III*—which I think is a good idea—then your decision is made for you. Flat-top, unprotected batteries are mandatory. The ZebraLight has its own protection circuits, including a low-voltage cutoff that completely shuts off the flashlight if the voltage falls below 2.7 volts. ZebraLight has been a little hazy in describing exactly which batteries are best. I would probably use a high-draw battery such as the *Samsung 30Q*.

For other flashlights, my philosophy is to be cautious. If a light can operate using a protected battery such as the *EVVA Sanyo-Panasonic NCR18650GA Protected 3500mAh*, then that is what I use. I am, for instance, using protected batteries in my *ZebraLight SC62* and my *Nitecore P36*. 

On the other hand, for a burner like the *BLF A6 Special Edition*, which can be operated using protected batteries, but performs better with high-draw, unprotected batteries, I go with the latter.

Chris made some excellent points above. He probably knows more about batteries than I do.


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## Bretcoe (Dec 10, 2015)

Not you derail the thread too much, but I have x10 18650 Sony VTC-5's currently for my girlfriend and my box mods which drive 0.3 and 0.5 Ohm coils. I have built subohm coils for my 26650 mech mod (efest rewraps) as well as a 18650 mech mod I have, but don't like the hassle building brings so we use variable voltage/variable current controlled box mods with pre-built, factory coils. This offers some built in protection and convenience, as well as allows for the use of tank style atomizers. These box mods allow for x2 18650 cells for longer use between battery changes. I'm currently using a 0.5 Ohm coil at 30W, about 4 V and 7 amps. With x2 VTC-5's I get very nice time between battery changes. It's far less hassle than dripping on a mech mod that is drawing 20-30 Amps and draining batteries every 30 minutes. Lol, especially when driving.

Those Samsung 30Q's are probably the next batteries I'll get. I've been eye'ing them for a while but just don't need them currently... until I get a new flashlight (I have a post in the recommend me a new flashlight forum).

I'm a firm believer in quality when it comes to things that go boom.

Not to beat the horse, but I increasingly hear about fake/clone/rewrapped knockoff batteries from people in the vaping community. They are out there, and there's more and more of them as the demand increases. It's so easy to do and most people know so little about them, that foreign companies are selling them cheap with ridiculous "specs".

Thanks for the replies guys.


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## hauer (Dec 15, 2015)

*Re: Favorite 18650 battery of your flashlight*



hiuintahs said:


> NPS tends to sell lots of weird stuff and who knows where the Thanks for the tip. As far as I can tell they are genuine NCR18650B's battery. I looked them over close. I think the reason they are this cheap is because the label didn't make sense. The blue label had them as "NI MH 1000mAh 3.7V." Well the 3.7V is correct. y got them. Obviously these wouldn't be sell-able as labeled in a normal retail store.



It look like many other brands re-wrap Panasonic NCR18650 battery as a new their brand.


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## Bretcoe (Dec 15, 2015)

I think they buy the batteries that get put in the "less than optimum" or whatever the bin is called that has the batteries that are "ok", but fail some aspect of Panasonic's testing. Than they wrap em and sell them as theirs.

I assume Panasonic keeps the class A batteries and sells the class B batteries to whomever.

There must be some grading at the factory or wherever.

This would account for the cheaper prices at least.


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## staticaz (Dec 17, 2015)

LG INR18650 MJ1


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## ChrisGarrett (Dec 17, 2015)

staticaz said:


> LG INR18650 MJ1



Yeah, for 10A or less, the MJ1, the S/P NCR18650GA and perhaps the 15A Samsung 30Q are going to be three that I would buy.

For the super high drains, the Sony VTC-5 and Samsung 25Rs are worthy, although they're about an Ah less in capacity than the above.

It's a good time to have our cake and eat it too, when it comes to good quality 18650s.

Chris


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## Ace12 (Jan 24, 2016)

Are the keeppower and zebralight 18650's pretty much the same battery with different wrapper?


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## Matt Jarima (Sep 20, 2016)

I get 2 Sony VTC5 18650 from vaporsolo, 2600mAh, the performance is always stable, I like it.


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