# SureFire UDR Dominator - Review, Photos and discussion



## 880arm (Nov 12, 2014)

Well after several years of watching, waiting, and wishing it appears that the SureFire Dominator has finally become a reality outside of trade shows! It will probably be another week or so before I can wrap up a full review with runtime information, beamshots, etc. but, for the time being, I can share some photos and info.





The finished product looks pretty much like what was shown at the 2014 SHOT Show with the big Luminus CBT-90 emitter pumping out 2,400 lumens and more than 200,000 candela. An 11 position selector ring allows the selection of 9 distinct output modes, a strobe mode, and an OFF position. A trio of buttons on the body allow the user to select constant-on operation (at the level selected by the selector ring), momentary operation, and constant-on maximum output (regardless of selector ring position).

The Dominator comes with a universal AC charger, 12VDC car charger, rechargeable battery, backup primary battery carrier, rubber tail and bezel guards, lanyard/sling ring, nylon shoulder sling, a dozen SureFire CR123 primary batteries, and the usual paperwork.




The included Li-Ion rechargeable battery pack is rated at 7.5V and 2800mAh and is enclosed in an anodized aluminum casing. The backup primary battery carrier holds 12 CR123s and is wired in a ~12V configuration. All electrical contacts are at the head.




The listed output specs are 14 lumens in the lowest mode, 185 lumens in "medium" and the full 2400 lumens in the highest output mode. The remaining modes are spaced between these levels at a roughly 2:1 ratio.




Needless to say, this is a large light. Although I have never handled a Medieval mace, I have to think it would have felt something like this. The huge head is not just for show and accounts for a substantial portion of the light's 2.4 lb weight. It makes the M6LT look downright puny in comparison!




I would consider the included sling a must-have accessory if carrying the Dominator for an extended length of time!



That's all for now. I will update this thread as the review progresses :twothumbs


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## KITROBASKIN (Nov 12, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

Wow. Looks like SureFire has got it going on. Do you have one in hand?


CandlePowerForums App


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## 880arm (Nov 12, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

Literally, no. Figuratively, yes


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## PocketRocket (Nov 12, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

*Poof*


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## shrike2222 (Nov 12, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

Great!
But li-ion battery pack is too bad!

Anyway please upload more review.

Thanks
Kim.


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## kj2 (Nov 12, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

So Big, So Nice


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## 880arm (Nov 12, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*



PocketRocket said:


> Thank you kindly for this thread! Are you able to provide an extra picture or two showing the emitter and reflector up close?



My pictures of the reflector didn't come out very good. It is like photographing a huge mirror so most of them just showed reflections of me, my camera, and all the junk on my table :shrug: I will take some better ones in a day or two.






PocketRocket said:


> Looks similar to the prototype from 2011 as shown here; http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?333129-UDR-Dominator-a-new-throw-king
> 
> And I have to say that gap between the emitter and reflector has always bugged me a little.
> 
> Cheers!



The older prototype used a different emitter but, you are correct, the general design is about the same. The gap is still there although they have cleaned it up a little bit. I think it's kinda cool to see an emitter bolted into place like this.






shrike2222 said:


> Great!
> But li-ion battery pack is too bad!
> 
> Anyway please upload more review.
> ...



I will but I have a few other things to take care of over the next couple of days. It will be this weekend before I can do most of the work on this review.


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## PocketRocket (Nov 12, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

*Poof*


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## Robin24k (Nov 12, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*



880arm said:


> The older prototype used a different emitter but, you are correct, the general design is about the same. The gap is still there although they have cleaned it up a little bit. I think it's kinda cool to see an emitter bolted into place like this.


Looks like a Luminus CBT-90. :thumbsup:


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## 880arm (Nov 13, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*



Robin24k said:


> Looks like a Luminus CBT-90. :thumbsup:



Yes sir, you are correct :twothumbs


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## Mr. Tone (Nov 13, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

That bolted-down emitter pic is quite nice. That makes it look tough.


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## monkeyboy (Nov 13, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

Thanks for posting, 880. Interesting that they've gone for the domeless C*B*T-90 instead of the domed C*S*T-90 in the prototype at shot show. The CBT-90 gives you more throw but with reduced output and efficiency.

Any chance of getting 6 x 17670 or 16650 in the CR123 holder? This might be an acceptable configuration if the holder is wired for 4s3p CR123 cells.


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## tab665 (Nov 13, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

the battery pack seems rather lack luster. seems like youd get much better performance out of the "back up" cr123 battery pack. originally I figured that the rechagable pack had significantly less run time because it probably help better regulation, now im not so sure.


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## TurboBlaster (Nov 13, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

Any idea on beam distance?

Thanks


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## 880arm (Nov 13, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*



monkeyboy said:


> . . . Any chance of getting 6 x 17670 or 16650 in the CR123 holder? This might be an acceptable configuration if the holder is wired for 4s3p CR123 cells.



Great minds think alike :twothumbs

I can't confirm or deny anything but I did order a bunch of 16650s last night!



TurboBlaster said:


> Any idea on beam distance?
> 
> Thanks



The math works out to about 930 meters per the ANSI standard but, of course, actual effective range will be less.


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## Kaban (Nov 13, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

So how much is the actual price going to be? I know SF always inflated the heck out of prices on their site. Will it be under $1000?


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## bulbmogul (Nov 14, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

Are they on the market yet forsale ad if so, where can one be purchased..?


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## 880arm (Nov 14, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*



Kaban said:


> So how much is the actual price going to be? I know SF always inflated the heck out of prices on their site. Will it be under $1000?



A few months ago I would have expected retailers to be listing it at $960. Now that it looks like SureFire has changed their policy regarding advertised prices it may be more like $1233. That being said, the actual price will be whatever you can work out with a seller. As far as I know, they can sell it at any price they want.




bulbmogul said:


> Are they on the market yet forsale ad if so, where can one be purchased..?



Haven't seen anywhere that says they have them on hand yet but hopefully it will be soon.


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## eff (Nov 15, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

The UDR specs look promising. If anyone (who can afford the UDR) could review this light, I'd be really grateful 
However I'm wondering how they ended up with only 2800 mah, with a rechargeable battery of that size. I wonder how long the UDR will last on turbo mode with it.
Because there's no way, I'll be running that kind of light with 12 CR123!


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## kj2 (Nov 15, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*



eff said:


> However I'm wondering how they ended up with only 2800 mah, with a rechargeable battery of that size. I wonder how long the UDR will last on turbo mode with it.


Me too.


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## 880arm (Nov 15, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*



eff said:


> The UDR specs look promising. If anyone (who can afford the UDR) could review this light, I'd be really grateful
> However I'm wondering how they ended up with only 2800 mah, with a rechargeable battery of that size. I wonder how long the UDR will last on turbo mode with it.
> Because there's no way, I'll be running that kind of light with 12 CR123!



I can't afford to buy one but that won't keep me from doing a review! Unfortunately I have faced a couple of setbacks with my equipment and the weather but hopefully I can start making progress again in a few days.

Like you, I also expected a little more battery capacity. Aside from that I have to say the battery pack is extremely solid. The exterior is anodized aluminum and it's built like a tank.


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## KITROBASKIN (Nov 15, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*



880arm said:


> I can't afford to buy one but that won't keep me from doing a review! Unfortunately I have faced a couple of setbacks with my equipment and the weather but hopefully I can start making progress again in a few days.
> 
> Like you, I also expected a little more battery capacity. Aside from that I have to say the battery pack is extremely solid. The exterior is anodized aluminum and it's built like a tank.



I am hoping you can suss out more reasons the battery pack is the way it is; That it is not just a proprietary product to force customers to stay 'in the fold', but also a way to insure reliability of a product that may be used in harm's way.


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## 880arm (Nov 15, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

First post updated with pics of the battery options and the carry sling.



KITROBASKIN said:


> I am hoping you can suss out more reasons the battery pack is the way it is . . .



I'm trying to find out. I suspect it's at least partly related to reliability and/or the battery's behavior performance under load. I will update if I learn anything.


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## Echo63 (Nov 16, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

any chance of a pic next to some well known lights (standing up in a row) like a Magcharger or 3D Mag, M6, M4, 6P etc ? would really show how big this light is.

I probably won't be buying one (way to much money, and if i need something that throws further than my HDS if grab my Maxabeam) but it is still a very interesting light.


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## 880arm (Nov 16, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*



Echo63 said:


> any chance of a pic next to some well known lights (standing up in a row) like a Magcharger or 3D Mag, M6, M4, 6P etc ? would really show how big this light is . . .



I plan to do some kind of full lineup for the review, including a comparison to some Maglites. Right now that's on hold for a day or two while I finish up a couple of other projects but I do have a few teaser pics I took for social media.

For perspective, it's nearly a foot long, 3" diameter at the bezel (without the shroud) and the body is about the same as the M6/M6LT. That being said, it makes the M6LT look like a wimp :devil: (Click images for larger versions)



​
The 4.25" E1D LED Defender compared to the Dominator head (with rubber shroud) . . . 





​
Another comparison showing the 3.25" T1A Titan alongside the Dominator head (without the rubber shroud). This one has become the new wallpaper on my computer :twothumbs




​


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## newbie66 (Nov 16, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

From the picture of the emitter, the screw on the right looks like it is about to rust, or does the metal just look that way?


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## 880arm (Nov 16, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*



newbie66 said:


> From the picture of the emitter, the screw on the right looks like it is about to rust, or does the metal just look that way?



It looks like it's just a discoloration of the screw finish. I don't believe it would be rust. I can't even see it without a zoom lens.


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## Str8stroke (Nov 16, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

Interesting light for sure. Hope the price ends up being sub 1K. That's still a pretty strong price! lol But nice looking rig for sure. Looks like I would go broke feeding it CR123's! Seems like they could drop the rechargeable pack option, Sell the light for $200 and make the profit on battery sales! lol 

Thanks for the pics & short write up.


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## newbie66 (Nov 16, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*



880arm said:


> It looks like it's just a discoloration of the screw finish. I don't believe it would be rust. I can't even see it without a zoom lens.



I suppose it is logical to assume that no way would Surefire install something that would be detrimental to reliability. More so at that price.


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## bulbmogul (Nov 16, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*



newbie66 said:


> From the picture of the emitter, the screw on the right looks like it is about to rust, or does the metal just look that way?


RUST..? On a brand new 1300.00 light..Um ok...Bet your not a player in buying one now are yah?


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## newbie66 (Nov 16, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*



bulbmogul said:


> RUST..? On a brand new 1300.00 light..Um ok...Bet your not a player in buying one now are yah?



Haha, no way am I gonna buy it since it is way out of my budget! 

As 880arm has said, it is probably a discoloration from anodizing that makes the screw look that way. Nothing to worry about.


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## Echo63 (Nov 17, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*



880arm said:


> I plan to do some kind of full lineup for the review, including a comparison to some Maglites. Right now that's on hold for a day or two while I finish up a couple of other projects but I do have a few teaser pics I took for social media.
> 
> For perspective, it's nearly a foot long, 3" diameter at the bezel (without the shroud) and the body is about the same as the M6/M6LT. That being said, it makes the M6LT look like a wimp :devil:


Thank You !

its a big light, but not ridiculously big, for the power it has.
I'm starting to get tempted, but i don't need a new light.


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## 880arm (Nov 20, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

Managed to get out and take a few short range beamshot photos tonight with the new Dominator. Unfortunately I don't have any other 2400 lumen, 200,000+ candela lights to compare it to so I just had to make do with what I had. :shrug:

Needless to say, the overall output and reach are very impressive and far exceed any other LED light available from SureFire. While it's easy to focus on the 2400 lumen max output, I was also very impressed by the amount of throw provided by the lower output levels. As a point of reference, when set at level 6 (around 340 lumens) the UDR has a similar amount of throw as my 900 lumen M6LT. Beam tint is cool, but not overly so, and the broad reflector provides a pretty substantial spill beam to go along with the great reach. 

I plan to take some longer range beamshots tomorrow night but in the meantime I can share these (approximately 40 yards to swing) . . .

Malkoff Hound Dog V3 (Cool White)







SureFire UDR Dominator Level 8 (about 1200 lumens, just to keep it fair) :devil:






SureFire M6LT Guardian (900 lumen version)




As I mentioned in an earlier post, the 9 output levels are spaced apart at a (roughly) 2:1 ratio. The lower output levels are slightly under represented in this animation but it should still give a good idea of the spacing.




Runtime test results with the rechargeable battery have been identical to the listed specs, literally down to the minute, for Max (Level 9) and Medium (Level 5) modes. I still have to finish up a few other modes and do some testing with 123A primary batteries this weekend. When operated in Max mode, there is a programmed step down to the next level after a couple of minutes. After that point, output is fairly stable for the remainder of the runtime although thermal regulation does adjust output to keep temperatures in check.

Hopefully I will have the review wrapped up after a productive weekend! :twothumbs


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## PocketRocket (Nov 21, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

*Poof*


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## tab665 (Nov 21, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

after the light has dropped in output does a quik off/on bring it back to top output?


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## eff (Nov 21, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*



880arm said:


> When operated in Max mode, there is a programmed step down to the next level after a couple of minutes. After that point, output is fairly stable for the remainder of the runtime although thermal regulation does adjust output to keep temperatures in check.
> 
> Hopefully I will have the review wrapped up after a productive weekend! :twothumbs



How hot is the light after the step down ? Is it possible to bring it back to turbo mode right after that ?


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## 880arm (Nov 21, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*



tab665 said:


> after the light has dropped in output does a quik off/on bring it back to top output?





eff said:


> How hot is the light after the step down ? Is it possible to bring it back to turbo mode right after that ?



Cycling off and back on again or moving the control ring down a level and back up will return to the Max output mode. I haven't tested whether or not the thermal regulation affects that output at that level.


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## tab665 (Nov 22, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*



880arm said:


> Cycling off and back on again or moving the control ring down a level and back up will return to the Max output mode. I haven't tested whether or not the thermal regulation affects that output at that level.



I imagine that if someone kept doing that with the rechargeable battery the runtime would be very poor. awesome beamshots though.


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## StandardBattery (Nov 22, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

Nice! It's too bad there is not more runtime on the rechargable pack. Tests of LiIon cells in the carrier will be very interesting. 

Thanks for the testing, looking forward to the updates.


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## monkeyboy (Nov 22, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

Thanks for updating this review, 880. I wouldn't have thought there would be a need for such a drastic step down with the massive heatsinking that this light has, especially as the CBT-90 has thermal protection built in to the emitter itself. I find that Surefire tends to be very conservative in this regard compared to Eagletac for example.


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## bennett4624 (Nov 23, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

Aint she a beaut? LOL Love it, want it.. cost.. a bit ludicrous considering what it cost to actually make that. I'm waiting for the perfect long running rechargeable batteries. Would love my surefires to run full blast for 4+ hour before peaking down !


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## 880arm (Nov 25, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

Really wanted to have the review finished today but just can't push through the rest of the way. It's almost finished and should be up tomorrow. In the meantime, I'll share a few more pics and stuff.

For those who asked for size comparisons to other lights . . . it pretty much dwarfs anything else offered by SureFire . . . (click image for full size version)



​
The beam from this light is just incredible. As expected, it has a ton of throw but it's not all narrowed down into a tiny pinprick of light. This photo was taken at a distance of 200 yards from the 24" x 24" archery target.





The long zoom distorts distance a little bit but the rock pile in the background is more than 300 yards out and is about the size of a pickup truck. I needed binoculars (or a zoom lens) to be able to really "see" how far this thing can reach.

And for now . . . some runtime results . . . 










At the highest output level (level 9) there is a programmed stepdown after 2 minutes of operation. After the light heats up, thermal regulation kicks in which further affects output. Runtimes for the High (Level 9) and Medium (Level 5) modes matched the SureFire specs perfectly, literally down to the minute, when powered by the lithium-ion rechargeable battery.

More to come tomorrow (I hope!) :twothumbs


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## KITROBASKIN (Nov 25, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

Very Interesting. This torch deserves a thorough workout. It would be great to hear experience using it on a job. Runtime graphs are only one part of the story. This looks very suitable for LEO and Security working locations that are a little more 'spread out'. And proof that SureFire is responding to the current flashlight market, I think. That emitter is getting pushed.


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## eff (Nov 26, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

Thanks for the pictures and the charts . Considering its length and weight, I understand now, why it's packaged with a shoulder strap 
In the 2nd pic, the beam seems to reach up to at least 400 yards, which was to be expected with 200000+ cd (imho the 0.25 lux specified by the Ansi standard, to illuminate something in the distance is just not enough).
A bit disapointed by the quick stepdown, after 2 mn on turbo, for a light of this size, and with that many cooling fins. 
The graphs do confirm the low capacity of the battery. Now, I'm even more curious as to how they managed to put only 2400 mAh in it. Considering it can take 12 CR123 in a battery carrier, I suppose it could have contained 6 P1R 2600 mAh cells. I'm really wondering if Surefire put a smaller 2400 mAh cell in a that bigger battery, like some manufacturer do for the D, C and 9v Nimh/Nicad cells.

With a bigger battery capacity and no stepdown, I'm sure it could run way longer on turbo


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## ven (Nov 26, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

Amazing info and insight to a special light,thank you for sharing and taking the time :thumbsup:Being honest i really do like it although it admittedly is out of my justifiable flashlight funds..........well on a single light anyway.

My only criticism/s would be the run time off the surefire battery pack and the step down. With such a "hefty" light i would have preferred a 10 to 20 minute run time then step down and a much longer run time on level 7. Reasons behind my opinion would be level 7 would possibly be a most used level for the 2hrs,but would this be enough in a S&R operation which the light appears to be designed around. The main weakness is the battery pack,if this could be improved(which should not be difficult unless i am missing something) it would make a huge difference(again personal opinion) to such a special light........

How come just for one example ,a Fenix tk75 at 2900lm can run for 15mins(tk75 2600lm at 20 mins) before step down,then restarted on turbo again,yet the tk75 light is considerably smaller in overall size...... 
The 12x 123 cells would be a no goer in the UK too due to cost,and imo would be completely un-user friendly , so the pack for me would be the choice in fuel.

Its an awesome light,no denying,and an awesome price tag for the privilege of owning a light . You would be able to rely on in life/death situations!!! and can imagine it gives confidence in hand/feel. Not to mention the piece of mind from the Surefire customer service. I just feel its fallen short of what it could have been..............just better run times and longer times before step downs.
Again that is just my opinion on it,so by no means i am saying i am right,just my thoughts :thinking:
:thumbsup:


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## leon2245 (Nov 26, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*



880arm said:


> ​
> The beam from this light is just incredible. As expected, it has a ton of throw but it's not all narrowed down into a tiny pinprick of light. This photo was taken at a distance of 200 yards from the 24" x 24" archery target.
> 
> ​




The surefire chess set.


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## 880arm (Nov 26, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

The UDR Dominator Review is up! Now I've got to get some ZZZZZs :tired:


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## tab665 (Nov 28, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

did you every try to fit 16650's into the CR123 carrier? I think everyone can agree that the rechargeable battery is the Achilles heel of this light.


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## 880arm (Nov 28, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

16650s are barely too long to fit in the 123A battery carrier. I believe an enterprising individual could get them to fit with just a few "adjustments" to the carrier but that's not something I'm able to try.


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## KITROBASKIN (Nov 28, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*



tab665 said:


> ... I think everyone can agree that the rechargeable battery is the Achilles heel of this light.


 
We've heard that some lithium battery chemistry (with less capacity yet high discharge rates) are more reliable and more safe than other kinds. And it would be no surprise that SureFire wants a simple, reliable, safe system for users who aren't necessarily 'into' flashlights. I think everyone can agree that SureFire would not limit their flashlights in any way unless there was a good reason. To compare this light with custom hotrods sporting vaper batteries, where lux and lumen numbers are Very Much talked about but few can actually see a practical difference in real world use, is not really valid. (one opinion)

That said, I do question the three button interface on a tactical light, but only experience can answer that.


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## 880arm (Nov 28, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

Fair points about the battery. More capacity is always better, as long as there isn't a reliability penalty. 

I would consider the UDR Dominator to be a searchlight but not a tactical light, at least in the way that is usually discussed around here.


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## RobertM (Nov 29, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

880arm, thanks for excellent review, beamshots, and runtime graphs!


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## sledhead (Dec 1, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

I swore I was done with Surefire but this light keeps calling me.......Does anyone know of any great Cyber Monday deals on this light? Thanks.

Found one: Optics Planet


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## PocketRocket (Dec 10, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

*Poof*


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## PocketRocket (Dec 10, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

*Poof*


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## eff (Dec 10, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*



PocketRocket said:


> And I suppose I could take a quick moment to complain about Surefire being a little bit stingy in the lube and lube application department as of late. I have noticed that with many of my more recent Surefire lights Surefire applies less lube than it has in the past and it is also not uncommon to find manufacturing dust within the threads



That's kinda strange. On my P1R, there was so much lube, it was oozing out of the threads, and almost covered the whole light. The light was too sticky/greasy, so I had wash it up a bit after unpacking it.


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## PocketRocket (Dec 10, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

*Poof*


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## eff (Dec 11, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*



PocketRocket said:


>



No kidding really 
I think the guy who oiled the threads of my light was a little too generous. When I first unpacked it, my 1st thought was " Wow, now that's a crude looking light !"


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## Capolini (Dec 12, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

Out of curiosity I called them and had two Questions: [none of this info. was on their website]:

*1.What is the cost of a replacement battery pack?

Answer: He did not have any and did not know,will get back to me! *I would be VERY surprised if it was less than $300.

*2. What kind of standards do you use to measure your lights? *Same answer,he did not know and would get back to me!


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## 880arm (Dec 12, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*



Capolini said:


> Out of curiosity I called them and had two Questions: [none of this info. was on their website]:
> 
> *1.What is the cost of a replacement battery pack?
> 
> ...



Not surprised the CSR didn't have an answer. I will be interested to hear the reply.

For the battery pack, I wouldn't be surprised to hear it is crazy expensive. If (when?) I ever own the UDR I can pretty much guarantee that if the rechargeable battery dies, I will be fixing the CR123 carrier to accommodate 6x16650 cells.

As far as the testing standards are concerned, the printed materials that come with the light state, "*All measurements are per ANSI Standard*."

I think SureFire avoided labeling their specs as ANSI ratings, in the past, due to their preference for measuring runtime to 50 lumens. One condition of advertising ratings per the FL1 standard is that ALL metrics must be tested by that method. However, it appears that SureFire's stance has been changing for a while now. If you take a look at most of the flashlight listings on the SureFire site, you will see they are now listing ANSI runtime. That aside, it seems like they have been rating their lights that way for a while now, since the tactical lights began surpassing 500 lumens.

I hope this leads to more comprehensive metrics based upon the FL1 standard such as beam intensity and its derivative, beam distance.


----------



## PocketRocket (Dec 13, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

*Poof*


----------



## PocketRocket (Dec 13, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

*Poof*


----------



## Capolini (Dec 13, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

You have a lot of patience!

If I paid $300 for a light and it had problems I would be disappointed for sure. If I paid $1200 for a light and have yet to get a response about an issue w/ the light I would be disgusted!

All electronic devices can be defective,,,,,,,,,The lack of response is what would bother me more. 

How long have you been waiting for a response? 

Did you call them like I did last night just to find out some basic info. that could not be answered at the time?


----------



## LEDburn (Dec 13, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

So you're saying that their customer service and quality control aren't all that it's made out to be?

Remind me again why buying this overpriced, overhyped, underperforming paperweight will be better than some "cheap chinese" garbage? Oh that's right, for the reliability and amazing Surefire customer service. 

Maybe they should stick to single button, single mode, inefficient, low output lights which are built like tanks and leave the complex multi-button, multi-mode lights to the Chinese. They do a better job at it.


----------



## PocketRocket (Dec 13, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

*Poof*


----------



## Bullzeyebill (Dec 13, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

There is another UDR thread that is discussing the pricing of the light, please go there, because here it is off topic. Please, no more response to post 64.

Bill

Edit: corrected post number from 65 to 64....Bill


----------



## PocketRocket (Dec 13, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

*Poof*


----------



## PocketRocket (Dec 13, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

*Poof*


----------



## Bullzeyebill (Dec 13, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*



Bullzeyebill said:


> There is another UDR thread that is discussing the pricing of the light, please go there, because here it is off topic. Please, no more response to post 65.
> 
> Bill



Enough. No more responses to LEDburn's post.

Bill


----------



## sledhead (Dec 13, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

I've had it a week.......amazing light. Wish I had my Polarion 40 to compare but, from my memory, it throws as much if not farther. Built like a tank and balanced nicely. Been using it nightly. One LED.....amazing.


----------



## 880arm (Dec 13, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*



sledhead said:


> I've had it a week.......amazing light. Wish I had my Polarion 40 to compare but, from my memory, it throws as much if not farther. Built like a tank and balanced nicely. Been using it nightly. One LED.....amazing.



Congrats on the pickup. I really miss the review sample and with Christmas and SHOT coming up, I can't afford to even think about buying one for myself yet.


----------



## sledhead (Dec 13, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

It's your fault.....I was happy with my UB3T and swore off Surefire till I read your review! Very happy with it.





Green trits in the bumpers is my goal.

Understood about bad timing with Christmas and Shot. Kind of bought this for my Christmas and Birthday present. Wish I could attend SHOT or at least Greta's party! Have fun.


----------



## PocketRocket (Dec 13, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

*Poof*


----------



## sledhead (Dec 13, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

PM sent. Mine seems to be operating normally after a break-in period.


----------



## chipwillis (Dec 13, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

Where did you guy's pick them up from?


----------



## sledhead (Dec 13, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

Picked mine up from Optics Planet on Cyber Monday.....


----------



## shrike2222 (Dec 14, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*



880arm said:


> For the battery pack, I wouldn't be surprised to hear it is crazy expensive. If (when?) I ever own the UDR I can pretty much guarantee that if the rechargeable battery dies, I will be fixing the CR123 carrier to accommodate 6x16650 cells.



880arm, when will you start a runtime testing with six 16650 batteries? I wonder 16650's performance.

Kim.


----------



## 880arm (Dec 14, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*



sledhead said:


> It's your fault.....I was happy with my UB3T and swore off Surefire till I read your review! Very happy with it.
> 
> Green trits in the bumpers is my goal.
> 
> Understood about bad timing with Christmas and Shot. Kind of bought this for my Christmas and Birthday present. Wish I could attend SHOT or at least Greta's party! Have fun.



Yeah, it's like a (very) grown up version of the UB3T. The addition of some trits would be cool to see :twothumbs

This will be my first time attending SHOT and I'm really excited about it. I just hope I'm able to pace myself reasonably well so I don't crash and burn after the 2nd day! 




shrike2222 said:


> 880arm, when will you start a runtime testing with six 16650 batteries? I wonder 16650's performance.
> 
> Kim.



I only had a review sample from SureFire which I have already returned. KeepPower 16650s were slightly too long to fit into the stock CR123 carrier so I was unable to do any testing with them. As mentioned before, I don't think it would take very much to modify the carrier to work with the 16650s but that's not something I could try with a review sample.


----------



## eff (Dec 14, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*



880arm said:


> I only had a review sample from SureFire which I have already returned. KeepPower 16650s were slightly too long to fit into the stock CR123 carrier so I was unable to do any testing with them.



I always thought the reviewers could keep the sample light after doing their tests and publishing the results. It looks like it's not the case


----------



## PocketRocket (Dec 14, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

*Poof*


----------



## pjandyho (Dec 14, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

Hi guys, I presume Maxblast is a feature which allows me to go straight to max output from any other outputs which I am on? Can you tell me if the UDR would return back to the last output used when I release the Maxblast button, or would it behave like the R1 Lawman and be switched off? I am real concerned about this. I love the R1 Lawman but hate it whenever it leaves me in total darkness after I released the tail cap from Maxblast.


----------



## 880arm (Dec 14, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*



eff said:


> I always thought the reviewers could keep the sample light after doing their tests and publishing the results. It looks like it's not the case



I think that depends upon the manufacturer and the reviewer. In my case, the SureFire samples all have to go back 



pjandyho said:


> Hi guys, I presume Maxblast is a feature which allows me to go straight to max output from any other outputs which I am on? Can you tell me if the UDR would return back to the last output used when I release the Maxblast button, or would it behave like the R1 Lawman and be switched off? . . . .



Actually it does neither of those two things. As long as the selector ring is in any position other than OFF, pressing the MaxBlast button triggers constant-on output at the max level. The button does not have to be held. 

While in this mode, pressing the MaxBlast button again will turn the light off. Alternatively, you could press the constant-on button or press and hold the momentary button and return to the output level chosen via the selector ring.


----------



## pjandyho (Dec 14, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*



880arm said:


> Actually it does neither of those two things. As long as the selector ring is in any position other than OFF, pressing the MaxBlast button triggers constant-on output at the max level. The button does not have to be held.
> 
> While in this mode, pressing the MaxBlast button again will turn the light off. Alternatively, you could press the constant-on button or press and hold the momentary button and return to the output level chosen via the selector ring.


Thanks! So that answers my question. It will still turn off instead of returning to the last output level, but thankfully the constant or momentary on button is located just beside which is easy to access in the event the light switches off. With the R1 Lawman, the way to access Maxblast is via the tail cap. When the tail cap is released, the R1 Lawman turns off. Trying to turn it back on again in the last used output is not so easy as the light is long and the switch is located on the head. I frequently needed my left hand to access the switch on the head whilst my right hand is still holding on to the tail end. Kind of dumb I think.


----------



## PocketRocket (Dec 16, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

*Poof*


----------



## Bullzeyebill (Dec 16, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

Are you overseas? Are you able to call Surefire, or did you call them and get an unsatisfactory response?

Bill


----------



## PocketRocket (Dec 16, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

*Poof*


----------



## Grizzman (Dec 16, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

Thanks for the review. I'm surprised Surefire's so cautious regarding the output step-down.

It's been stated repeatedly that Surefire's response to e-mail is lacking. The few times I've needed to contact them, I've used the phone and have been completely satisfied with the results.


----------



## pjandyho (Dec 17, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

Had the same problem with Surefire when emailing them. Sent two emails and waited two months with no reply. It was only when I started bitching about it on their FaceBook post did I get a reply. Does customers who have paid a premium price need to go through that to gain their attention and time?


----------



## PocketRocket (Dec 17, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

*Poof*


----------



## PocketRocket (Dec 17, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

*Poof*


----------



## WarriorOfLight (Dec 17, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

@880arm:
Do you have details about the LiIon pack? Could you do a detailed picture of the sticker with the data? Do you know how much cells are build in this pack. On one picture in your review I was able to read 7.xV / 2800mAh. For a battery pack of this size I was expecting a larger capacity. Are "normal" LiIon cells or IMR / LFP cells used in this pack. Than could be a reason for the low capacity.


----------



## eff (Dec 17, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*



PocketRocket said:


> As a soon-to-be-ex-owner of this light I can tell you for sure that it isn't cautious by any means. On MAX this light gets hotter faster than the Surefire B1R-BK Beast. Hell, it gets hotter faster than the old Surefire M6 on the 500 lumen HOLA.
> 
> The step-down isn't nearly as obvious as you'd think, however. It's extremely gradual over the course of two minutes. And because of the lack of sudden drop you don't really notice it _that_ easily.
> 
> It really does beg the question how other manufacturers are able to jam this LED into much smaller packages and drive them similarly.



Now that's a good question. I really thought that with all those fins, the UDR would cool down pretty easily. Maybe an issue with the heatsink ?
As for the other manufacturers, the only way to know how they make their light run longer on turbo, would be to open both their lights and the UDR, and compare. I guess someone like Vihn could answer your question.


----------



## PocketRocket (Dec 17, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

*Poof*


----------



## 880arm (Dec 17, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*



WarriorOfLight said:


> @880arm:
> Do you have details about the LiIon pack? Could you do a detailed picture of the sticker with the data? Do you know how much cells are build in this pack. On one picture in your review I was able to read 7.xV / 2800mAh. For a battery pack of this size I was expecting a larger capacity. Are "normal" LiIon cells or IMR / LFP cells used in this pack. Than could be a reason for the low capacity.



I don't know what chemistry is used for the battery. The specifications on the label state 7.5V, 2800mAh, and 21Wh.

The battery pack itself measures about 36.6 mm in diameter and is 157 mm long. Like someone else mentioned earlier, it looks like removing the retaining ring at the tail would allow access to the inside.



eff said:


> Now that's a good question. I really thought that with all those fins, the UDR would cool down pretty easily. Maybe an issue with the heatsink ?
> As for the other manufacturers, the only way to know how they make their light run longer on turbo, would be to open both their lights and the UDR, and compare. I guess someone like Vihn could answer your question.



The UDR heats up very quickly in the highest two output modes which seems to indicate the heatsinking is doing its job. After the timed stepdown, thermal regulation kicks in which keeps the exterior temperature at a very reasonable level, below 130F in my testing. By way of comparison, the exterior of the 500 lumen P2X Fury gets considerably hotter while producing only a fraction of the UDR's output. It's easy to recognize the efficiency of the cooling fins when operating the light at sub 1000 lumen levels as the exterior temperature barely rises above ambient.

As for other lights, it's easy to get longer "turbo" runtime by just programming it that way and living with (or ignoring) the heat. The UDR is certainly capable of providing longer "turbo" output and if the heatsinking were less effective, the light could run longer before the user would "feel the heat."


----------



## 880arm (Dec 17, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*



PocketRocket said:


> From Surefire;
> 
> So in other words... if you've received a light which is DOA don't waste your time contacting Surefire about it. Go straight back to your dealer.



I hate to hear about the issues you have experienced but that sounds like a mischaracterization. If you did receive a light that was non-functioning light, it reads like they would repair it (which is what you would expect from reading their warranty). If you instead would prefer a different light then you would need to return the one you have for a refund.


----------



## Capolini (Dec 17, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*



PocketRocket said:


> Tell me about it. I have *finally* received a reply from Surefire today stating that they had requested for engineering to try and reproduce my problems with another light and subsequently confirmed that the problems I have been experiencing are unique to my light. Having said that they requested that I send the light in for *repair* despite me asking twice whether or not I could be guaranteed a brand new replacement as I find it incredibly unreasonable to have to live with a repaired product which was purchased brand new and arrived DOA.
> 
> Anyhow enough is enough. I am now in possession of the RMA to return the light to my seller for a full refund.
> 
> ...



hmmmmm,,,,seems like your opinion about Surefire has changed.

In all sincerity it is a shame to spend that much money for a light and be given the run around. :shakehead

All my purchases are made in the USA where I live. Even though most of the lights are made in China.

Vinh has always had superior customer service and backs up his work. I had a TK61vn have a minor problem after it was already repaired prior. It was 7 months old and he gave me a FULL refund!


----------



## PocketRocket (Dec 17, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

*Poof*


----------



## eff (Dec 18, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*



880arm said:


> As for other lights, it's easy to get longer "turbo" runtime by just programming it that way and living with (or ignoring) the heat. The UDR is certainly capable of providing longer "turbo" output and if the heatsinking were less effective, the light could run longer before the user would "feel the heat."



It's hard to tell, but I'm not convinced the other lights are just ignoring the heat, because the led efficiency would suffer too much, and that would mean continuously increasing the current to maintain the lumen output, as the temperature would keep on rising. The batteries would be depleted real fast, and there's a limit to the current output of LiIon or Nimh batteries.
I'm sure there's a good explanation, if someone with a UDR could open the beast so that we can check the guts


----------



## sledhead (Dec 25, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

Took the Dominator out in in foul weather to look for Santa........my son took this pic with his iPhone.
This light still amazes me....


----------



## 880arm (Dec 26, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

Awesome pic.

Hope everyone had a great Christmas and is set for a Happy New Year.


----------



## PocketRocket (Dec 27, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

*Poof*


----------



## Robin24k (Dec 27, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*



PocketRocket said:


> If anyone is attempting to buy this light from the eBay Seller "intertwined.shopping" avoid at all costs.
> 
> They originally agreed to a refund as their eBay listing clearly states that they accept refunds within 14 days of the buyer receiving the item.
> 
> ...


Where are you? Not sure why it costs so much, and why you would ship to the PO instead of directly to the seller...


----------



## chipwillis (Dec 27, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

I just got mine and its a powerhouse. I'm liking it a lot. Picked it up at a good price also.


----------



## PocketRocket (Dec 27, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

*Poof*


----------



## ForrestChump (Dec 27, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*



PocketRocket said:


> I shipped it to the seller directly. They refused to accept the item. As such it's now sitting at their local Post Office (since Wednesday) waiting for them to pick it up.
> 
> All this information is provided in the tracking report as the item was shipped via EMS. And they have the nerve to ask me if I know where the item is?
> 
> This entire experience really is nothing short of a catastrophic joke. From Surefire's failed QA to an absolutely uncooperative seller now.




You bought this on ebay? Why? Its a first run $1000+ light. ebay is not the place.

I feel for you though. You laid out a lot of change and got a bad deal. Knowing where you got it from though, I think SF offer to repair is completely fair.

Im not saying it missed QC, but when it comes to ebay all bets are off.

Either way I do hope it works out for you.


----------



## PocketRocket (Dec 28, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

*Poof*


----------



## 880arm (Dec 28, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*



ForrestChump said:


> . . . Either way I do hope it works out for you.



Me too. Hopefully it's just a case of the eBay seller taking a long weekend over the holiday and things will get straightened out tomorrow.


----------



## PocketRocket (Dec 28, 2014)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

*Poof*


----------



## Bullzeyebill (Dec 28, 2014)

PocketRocket, if you want to continue such discussions regarding your displeasure of a seller and manufacturer, please start your own thread. Your posts have completely dominated this thread recently, and have gone beyond the scope of this thread. If you want to discuss my action, please feel free to PM me. Thanks,

Bill


----------



## PocketRocket (Dec 31, 2014)

*Poof*


----------



## Albert56 (Jan 5, 2015)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

Sorry to be the iconoclast, but If anyone can explain how this thing worth anything _near_ the $1200+ street price it's going for, I'm all ears.

This is why I've never been a fan of Surefire - They play on their "Made in USA" rep and grossly over-charge for almost all of their products.


----------



## L84CABO (Jan 8, 2015)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*



Albert56 said:


> Sorry to be the iconoclast, but If anyone can explain how this thing worth anything _near_ the $1200+ street price it's going for, I'm all ears.
> 
> This is why I've never been a fan of Surefire - They play on their "Made in USA" rep and grossly over-charge for almost all of their products.



I'd like to understand this too. I mean that sincerely. I really want to understand what makes this light so expensive compared to similar products on the market.


----------



## newbie66 (Jan 9, 2015)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*



L84CABO said:


> I'd like to understand this too. I mean that sincerely. I really want to understand what makes this light so expensive compared to similar products on the market.



I believe that the high pay for the workforce and capitalism contributes greatly to the high price.


----------



## chipwillis (Jan 9, 2015)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

I think this is a great product. It works and throws to the moon. Most everything is more expensive if built in the US. I think it's worth it based on the proper salaries that the employees make. There not copying anyone's product, so they have a lot of $$ tied up in development and research. I know there's a lot of things that can't be made in the US because the machines were moved over sea's. I have always tried buying things from a place where their salary fits the job. I have seen gun's that look and work the same. One from Russia and the other a Walther. After looking at the quality and machining, I would not trust the copy to save my life. I like this light and I think it's worth it. I have almost all custom light's and this is my only Surefire. I know I can buy hundreds of Chinese light for one of CoolFall's creations. I like that fact that CoolFall is made here and the time and effort to create his light's are second to none. I think they are the best in the world......... I'm a man with a regular salary, but choose to spend my extra $$ on cool light's. Most people think I'm nuts but I look at hunter's the same way

The UDR Dominator rocks and I'll be using it at work all the time.


----------



## ForrestChump (Jan 9, 2015)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*



newbie66 said:


> I believe that the high pay for the workforce and capitalism contributes greatly to the high price.



Capitalism Rocks, just like the Dominator.

The stiff switches on the Dominator were to meet waterproofing standards. It is actually designed like this and should "break in". This doesn't apply to op directly as his light malfunctions but I thought it was worth a mention.


----------



## sledhead (Jan 16, 2015)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

Mr. Big gets new pants! My wife is a wonderful woman.....made a pouch for my new Dominator! Double felt, handle, velcro closure....works like a dream. I'll feel better throwing it in the truck now. She also thought it was a custom light...it has my initials on the tailcap!


----------



## ForrestChump (Jan 16, 2015)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*



sledhead said:


> Mr. Big gets new pants! My wife is a wonderful woman.....made a pouch for my new Dominator! Double felt, handle, velcro closure....works like a dream. I'll feel better throwing it in the truck now. She also thought it was a custom light...it has my initials on the tailcap!




Nice work! Maybe start a little side business...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q-1rnv3lkhM


----------



## sledhead (Apr 18, 2015)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

Here's the new Titan AAA on the Dominator.........












Still loving the Dominator. Buttons loosened up nicely with use.


----------



## dc38 (Apr 18, 2015)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

Like a mouse on a lion's head


----------



## 880arm (Apr 19, 2015)

*Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*

Great pics. Love the contrast between the largest and smallest LED SureFires.


----------



## kj2 (Apr 19, 2015)

Nice photos Sled


----------



## PocketRocket (May 3, 2015)

*Poof*


----------



## tab665 (Aug 4, 2015)

it looks like optics planet is selling these under a 20% off promo. making me look at this light a little harder now.


----------



## GMUGNIER (Aug 28, 2015)

Has anyone disassembled the battery pack to determine what the cells are? Or has anyone experimented with the battery carrier to get some off the shelf replacement batteries that are rechargeable to replace the 123's?


----------



## GMUGNIER (Aug 28, 2015)

Any one find them cheaper yet? i read reports of the 40% discount coupon floating around.


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## tab665 (Aug 28, 2015)

GMUGNIER said:


> Any one find them cheaper yet? i read reports of the 40% discount coupon floating around.



40%!!!!! dude, I got to know where that's at.


----------



## GMUGNIER (Aug 28, 2015)

tab665 said:


> 40%!!!!! dude, I got to know where that's at.



There are quite a few of them from what I understand. Here is a link to one that is not available anymore, but i am quite sure they are still available.

https://www.ar15.com/archive/topic.html?b=7&f=148&t=1222444

any info would be appreciated.


----------



## djjoonie (Feb 28, 2018)

Just received the UDR Dominator from B&H in NY I just wanted to confirm that keeppower 2500mah 16650 fits and works, but the flashlight thinks the battery is low so it blinks red. didn't try how long it works with these batteries but ill update soon.


----------



## xdayv (Feb 28, 2018)

djjoonie said:


> Just received the UDR Dominator from B&H in NY I just wanted to confirm that keeppower 2500mah 16650 fits and works, but the flashlight thinks the battery is low so it blinks red. didn't try how long it works with these batteries but ill update soon.



Interesting. Please update us your findings.


----------



## djjoonie (Feb 28, 2018)

UPDATE: I tried one more time, and it worked for 30 sec @ max blast = 3 dead keeppower 16650s...I probably fried the protection circuit board of the battery or not sure what happened. the voltage reads 1v.. haven't tried with unprotected 16650s they are probably too short to fit, might need lil adaptor.:fail:







for the size comparison: 





UPDATE 2: I peeled off the protection circuit off the battery and the battery voltage is reading 4.2v. 
I tried fitting the batteries without the protection circuit, it is too short. need piece of copper or adaptor. :thumbsdow

Update 3: I used a washer as a spacer between the negative contact, the light works at stepdown mode since it thinks I have low battery. 
Fuel gage reads Orange led on lvl 1-6, red led from 7 to lvl9 and max burst for 2 sec, red led blinks once and step down lvl 8. I had it on for good 1 hour @ lvl8 and individual batteries tested at 4v.
The PCB probably got damaged by shoving it in the adaptor in the beginning and I realized I can loosen up the 3 top screws and make that extra 1mm space. I will buy 6 more 16650s to test them out again.

Conclusion: 16650s can be used as back up with just no max blast mode.


----------



## djjoonie (Mar 2, 2018)

More info: Called surefire and asked about additional rechargeable battery pack :$290.00


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## djjoonie (Mar 3, 2018)

here is the modified battery carrier for protected 16650 batteries










will update when the new keeppower 16650s arrive.


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## chartmarker (Mar 3, 2018)

thanks for your efforts and testing, its of great help to us who want to get more use from this fine light.


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## djjoonie (Mar 3, 2018)

chartmarker said:


> thanks for your efforts and testing, its of great help to us who want to get more use from this fine light.



My pleasure chartmaker


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## fivemega (Mar 6, 2018)

*Anybody can measure total voltage of battery holder loaded with 12 fresh primary 123A ?

Also voltage of original rechargeable battery pack (hot off the charger) ?

Thank you.*


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## sledhead (Mar 7, 2018)

I just bought a fresh pack of Surefire 123's and I'll charge my light tonight. I should be able to get the info. PM me if I don't post it in a day or two to remind me.


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## djjoonie (Mar 7, 2018)

just did a voltage check from fresh sf cr123 and came out 13.03volts from two outside rings, and 12.61 from center to second ring.




Center to second outer ring





second ring to third ring


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## djjoonie (Mar 7, 2018)

8.34volts from oem rechargeable battery (outer ring to second ring and outer ring to center ring same voltage) it reads 0v from center to second ring on oem rechargeable battery.

6x keeppower: ​8.14v from center to second ring, 8.4v from outer ring to second ring, 0v from outer to center.





I tried putting a little electrical tape on the center with the keeppowers loaded, surprisingly the fuelgage led is now green all the way through lvl8 and orange on lvl9 max blast. the best part is it doesn't step down to lvl8 after 2 sec like how it used to without the electrical tape!
So im guessing this trick makes the light somewhat thinks it has the oem battery installed.


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## sledhead (Mar 7, 2018)

I just got the same readings with a fresh pack of SF 123's. My light is still charging presently...update when I can.


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## djjoonie (Mar 7, 2018)

what ill try next is while the center is masked with electrical tape, I will put a piece of metal on top of the tape and bridge it to the second ring and see what happens. bad idea? the battery carrier is wired weird so that the center contact becomes negative on the carrier wiring system, its probably because it is designed for 12-13v. outer ring to second rings voltage was 8.4 so that would make the light same as oem rechargeable batteries voltage (8.34~8.4v) instead of 8.14v(center to second ring voltage. please let me know what you guys think.​


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## fivemega (Mar 7, 2018)

*I don't have this flashlight or either battery magazine but based on your tests and your statements, my understanding is:
1- Original primary battery holder is 4S/3P and nominally 12 volt, 4500mAh
2- Original rechargeable pack is (most likely) 2S/3P 16650 Lithium Cobalt or tiny chance of 2S/6P 16340.
3- Both #1 and #2 above wired differently and flashlight work and act differently using each battery magazine. 
4- Flashlight input voltage range is about 6~14 volt and very high current at turbo mode.
5- Total length of each magazine is about 156mm with diameter of 36.6mm

Am I correct? If so, it is possible to make following types of battery holders:
A- 2 serial IMR 26650 (I don't think protected cells will work)
B- 2S/2P 18650 (8.4 volt, 6800mAh) assuming each cell is 3400mAh
C- 2S/3P 16650 (8.4 volt, 7500mAh) assuming each cell is 2500mAh
D- 3S/2P 16650 (12.6 volt, 5000mAh) assuming each cell is 2500mAh
------------
A will be easier to make.
B will look similar to this but longer and connected 2S/2P
C will be similar to this picture.
D will look similar to this  but longer and connected 3S,2P. This will cost too high and not worth to go with.

What do you guys think?*



880arm said:


> I don't know what chemistry is used for the battery. The specifications on the label state 7.5V, 2800mAh, and 21Wh.
> The battery pack itself measures about 36.6 mm in diameter and is 157 mm long.



*Edit: Sorry, I missed post #94
My estimate for battery magazine length was about 1mm off but I still don't know battery chemistry, size and configuration.
Why they claim original rechargeable battery for 7.5 volt and not 8.4 or 7.4? Why total capacity is so low for that bulky size pack?*


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## djjoonie (Mar 8, 2018)

fivemega said:


> *
> What do you guys think?*



I think you are awesome lol, I think you are correct on everything except I don't have a ruler handy for #5
I will take a, b, and c if you make them, put me down #1 on the list please.
btw, is there any reason why you think the protected cells wont work? I'm just confused how I messed up my protected 16650 cells, if its because I forced them in the holder and damaged the pcb, or something to do with led drawing too much power from the battery? I ordered 1 more set of protected 16650s to try them out on my modified battery holder but I might have to return them b4 trying them if its the power drawing issue.


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## fivemega (Mar 8, 2018)

djjoonie said:


> is there any reason why you think the protected cells wont work?


*Since I don't have this flashlight to measure current draw of turbo mode, I think total load will be too much for protected 26650 but for B, C and D each protected cell will carry 50% or 33% of total load therefore protected 18650 and protected 16650 will work.*


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## desert.snake (Mar 8, 2018)

I wonder what all ended?
There are good unprotected batteries Sanyo 16650,
if there is not enough length, then you can install small
neodymium magnets instead of a nipple.
And someone tried instead of 123 to insert the Tenergy lifepo4 rcr123a?


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## griff (Mar 8, 2018)

i have this light, would you like to use it for testing?


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## djjoonie (Mar 8, 2018)

fivemega said:


> *Since I don't have this flashlight to measure current draw of turbo mode, I think total load will be too much for protected 26650 but for B, C and D each protected cell will carry 50% or 33% of total load therefore protected 18650 and protected 16650 will work.*



Learning something new everyday! thanks FM.


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## WarriorOfLight (Mar 9, 2018)

The primary problem using in the battery carrier 16600 cells is the Dominator detects this battery carrier as battery carrier that must have 12V (since there are 4S3P CR123 expected). The carrier will only have ~8.4V if there are 16650 cells inserted. Even if the LiIon cells are full and coming fresh from the charger the Indicatior LED of the Dominator is red. The light will not be as bright on Maxblast as if there are CR123 cells are use or the original rechargable pack.

The Dominator is capable to detect if the battery carrier is in use or the original rechargable pack. For this reason a self made battery carrier with 2S3P does not make sense to me. A aftermarket battery carrier should try to reach the 12V as good as possible and this may only work with 3S2P. Or a aftermarket battery carrier behaves like the original rechargable pack that has a lower output voltage that the battery pack with 12 CR123 cells.

Someone should open the original rechargable pack to see how it works to make it possible creating an aftermarket rechargable pack / carrier that behaves like the original pack.


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## djjoonie (Mar 9, 2018)

WarriorOfLight said:


> The primary problem using in the battery carrier 16600 cells is the Dominator detects this battery carrier as battery carrier that must have 12V (since there are 4S3P CR123 expected). The carrier will only have ~8.4V if there are 16650 cells inserted. Even if the LiIon cells are full and coming fresh from the charger the Indicatior LED of the Dominator is red. The light will not be as bright on Maxblast as if there are CR123 cells are use or the original rechargable pack.



Exactly, that's why I put a electric tape on the center contact on the oem battery holder to trick the flashlight that it thinks it has the oem rechargeable pack installed but not quite since it still reads it has low battery on maxblast only. so far the fuelgage led is green all the way to lvl8 and orange on maxblast with full charge, instead of thinking low battery through all levels.
I'm still waiting on the new 16650 keeppowers to test them out on my modified battery carrier and I will place a copper piece on top of the masked contact and bridge it to the second ring contact and see whats up. the reason I placed a electric tape to mask off the center contact is because the center contact on the battery holder is negative instead of positive unlike the rechargeable pack. (rechargeable packs center contact and second contact are both positive, and negative center contact on the holder)
I also tried to unclip the battery pack with no success, it is on very tight!
I need a "right tool" to actually disassemble it. :fail:


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## fivemega (Mar 9, 2018)

WarriorOfLight said:


> The Dominator is capable to detect if the battery carrier is in use or the original rechargable pack. For this reason a self made battery carrier with 2S3P does not make sense to me. A aftermarket battery carrier should try to reach the 12V as good as possible and this may only work with 3S2P. Or a aftermarket battery carrier behaves like the original rechargable pack that has a lower output voltage that the battery pack with 12 CR123 cells.



*The reason for differently arrange terminals on both, rechargeable and primary carrier is to detect it can be recharged first one and not to charge second one. Therefore when using primary carrier which supposed to be nominal 12 volt but measured only 8.4 volt. That's why flashlight detects as low battery and not to be recharged in flashlight.
So custom made rechargeable battery carrier should have terminals arranged like original rechargeable pack and same voltage. Therefore when using primary carrier with 2S/3P 16650, connection also must be rewired exactly like original rechargeable pack.
Another choice is 3 16340 and one dummy on each row of primary carrier 3S/3P (12.8 volt nominal) but you will need to remove batteries and charge them on Li-Ion charger. I don't like this set up because capacity will be very little and 9 cell to deal with.*


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## WarriorOfLight (Mar 10, 2018)

djjoonie said:


> Exactly, that's why I put a electric tape on the center contact on the oem battery holder to trick the flashlight that it thinks it has the oem rechargeable pack installed but not quite since it still reads it has low battery on maxblast only. so far the fuelgage led is green all the way to lvl8 and orange on maxblast with full charge, instead of thinking low battery through all levels.


I did not recognized this tape :shakehead Sorry for this.

I also tried my 6 efest 16650 cells with the stock battery holder. It is correct the Dominator detects the stock batteryholder with 6 efest cells as "rechargable pack". Also on Maxblast my dominator is on green. In my particular case the efest cells are very Little bit too short. Sometimes the fuel guge LED was on red/orange and sometimes green. When I was shaking my dominator in on state the gauge LED changed between green and red/orange. Therefore I assume the springs are not pressing the cells strong enough togeter. 

When I use CR123 cells the cells are very tight in the battery holder.


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## desert.snake (Mar 10, 2018)

> When I was shaking my dominator in on state the gauge LED changed between green and red/orange. Therefore I assume the springs are not pressing the cells strong enough togeter.
> 
> When I use CR123 cells the cells are very tight in the battery holder.



Try to buy small neodymium magnets and insert them between 16650 batteries.
As far as I know, they are round and have different thicknesses - 1, 1.5, 2, 3 mm,
you can choose the appropriate thickness. I use them in the fire of MD2, so that the battery
with a flat end does not stagger






And for short batteries in EB2 - иatteries with protection died, the current broke through the protection,
I had to remove the electronic board. To restore the length I added 2 magnets of 3 mm thickness,
wrapped them with electrical tape on the side.


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## WarriorOfLight (Mar 10, 2018)

desert.snake said:


> Try to buy small neodymium magnets and insert them between 16650 batteries.


I Need to check my "junk box". I have a lot different Neodym Magnets. The disadvantage is the Magnets with a very small height will break very fast. But I will search for my Magnets and try it


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## djjoonie (Mar 11, 2018)

update: finally new 16650 keeppowers arrived, it fits nice and snugly perfect fit on modified oem battery carrier spaced out 1mm with high-temp o-ring which was laying around (had metal washers previously, but wanted some cushion, i so replaced them)







Masked off the center negative terminal to trick that it has oem rechargeable installed.  (center contact is negative on battery carrier only, rechargeable pack is both positive except for the last outer ring.) The ​fuel gage is now all green through max blast with new undamaged keeppowers, WOrking Beautifully now!






Tried putting a copper wrap on top of the masked off electric tape and bridged with the second ring making both contact positive, but still failed to charge the 16650 batteries with oem charger. red light blinks when I try to charge it. :fail: 





:twothumbs


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## WarriorOfLight (Mar 11, 2018)

I would not use the Dominator build in charger crcuit charging a "self made" battery pack. At all I would not Charge two cells in series.

But the idea with the tape to pretend the 12xCR123 battery holder is the rechargable pack is great :thumbup:


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## djjoonie (Mar 11, 2018)

WarriorOfLight said:


> I would not use the Dominator build in charger crcuit charging a "self made" battery pack. At all I would not Charge two cells in series.


Good to know, I never knew it is bad idea to charge two cells in series! learning something new everyday!

​


WarriorOfLight said:


> But the idea with the tape to pretend the 12xCR123 battery holder is the rechargable pack is great :thumbup:​


​
Thank you! glad I found that out too! :thumbsup:​


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## desert.snake (Mar 12, 2018)

Thank you very much, it turned out very well!

In place of the 16650 can fit 18650, or they are too thick?

When I buy myself Dominator, and this will be in the autumn, I will try to make a power supply on lithium-polymer batteries.


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## fivemega (Mar 12, 2018)

desert.snake said:


> In place of the 16650 can fit 18650, or they are too thick?



http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...d-discussion&p=5190570&viewfull=1#post5190570


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## tab665 (Mar 12, 2018)

fivemega said:


> *I don't have this flashlight or either battery magazine but based on your tests and your statements, my understanding is:
> 1- Original primary battery holder is 4S/3P and nominally 12 volt, 4500mAh
> 2- Original rechargeable pack is (most likely) 2S/3P 16650 Lithium Cobalt or tiny chance of 2S/6P 16340.
> 3- Both #1 and #2 above wired differently and flashlight work and act differently using each battery magazine.
> ...


considering the capacity of the the stock rechargable pack, any of these options would be a major upgrade.


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## desert.snake (Dec 7, 2019)

Here 2 * 26700, funny working time.
Can install removable IMR 26650 at 5000 mAh and get ~2 times more capacity.
But these batteries have a current of up to 40 A
https://www.walz.com/downloads/support/shipment/DATA_sheets/R19032_000051201402.pdf

Any ideas what high-current 26650/26700 cells above 5000 mAh apply here?

On the other hand, the CBT-90 should consume about between 9 and 18 amperes
in order to produce 2400 lm, depending on bin
https://download.luminus.com/datasheets/Luminus_CBT-90-W_Datasheet.pdf

Based on this, we can put any batteries with a continuous current above 20 A

update:
we will not change the original battery, we will make a new 2*26650 battery


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## desert.snake (Dec 10, 2019)

Some thoughts on why SFs delivered such low capacity batteries with so much current - maybe it's in the inscription UHR.
Something powerful based on an electric arc lamp that requires a lot of current. But I did not find in their catalogs
something with the name UHR. Maybe there was some prototype? Then the desire to unify the batteries is understandable.
But if he not go into the series, then it would be possible to make batteries for UDR more capacious.


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## sledhead (May 16, 2020)

In case someone with a Dominator is looking for a soft case....... I have been using the Maxpedition 12” Bottle bag. Works great!


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## GMUGNIER (Apr 26, 2021)

Any more progress with other battery chemistries or sizes to get the "oem" charger functionality working again? My battery pack seems to have randomly stop working all of a sudden - (very odd) was working great and just out of the blue - the red blinks of death that don't stop until i remove the battery pack - (or) Has anyone been successful in taking apart the OEM rechargeable as of yet?


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## GMUGNIER (May 2, 2021)

Beuller.... Beuller.... Beuller....


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## desert.snake (May 3, 2021)

GMUGNIER said:


> Any more progress with other battery chemistries or sizes to get the "oem" charger functionality working again? My battery pack seems to have randomly stop working all of a sudden - (very odd) was working great and just out of the blue - the red blinks of death that don't stop until i remove the battery pack - (or) Has anyone been successful in taking apart the OEM rechargeable as of yet?



It can be both problems with the old age of the cells themselves, and problems with the charge control board inside the battery. It should be taken to an electronics repair shop to check all the elements on this board. If something goes wrong, it's easy to replace. If everything is fine, then you need to put new 26700 or something of good capacity with a current of at least 20 amperes.





It can be easily disassembled, there is a retaining ring on one side, which must be turned with a retaining ring puller. You just have to turn it in a circle, I don't remember which way anymore.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lx2iD5N0xjk


If the battery pack research shows that the control board is in order and the batteries are in order, then you need to contact the support of the SF, perhaps something has deteriorated in the guts of the flashlight due old age. The battery pack seems to have a 2-year limited warranty, and the flashlight itself has a lifetime warranty, if I remember correctly.


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## GMUGNIER (May 3, 2021)

Nice! - Thanks @Desert.Snake - What is the battery chemistry? there was much debate on what it was - any ideas? Should i use protected cells or non-protected cells? What is the largest Mah available in this size?

Much thanks again!!! 

Regards


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## GMUGNIER (May 7, 2021)

ok guys and gals - I did some homework after i opened my SF battery housing (thanks to @Desert.Snake - but what a complete PITA it was to get those dam rings out- WOW!) - It seems that a company in Canada was the original maker of the battery - they have since moved away from this size. These batteries were a "blended" (IBR) chemistry and Moli discovered that if this chemistry was not maintained (sitting on the shelf) they had a tendency to degrade and in some extreme cases the cells would short out internally (catch fire) due to lack of use and/or charge. These cells were originally designed for use in the Milwaukee power tools (24v) - Moli suggested that a high nickel chemistry was far more stable, and that they were not aware of any companies that are making the "INR" instead of the "IBR" in the 26700 size - I also found some new lithium ion cells in the 26700 - but i also read that charging the lithium battery in series was NOT recommended - Moli mentioned that a company in China named Lee Shin had reverse engineered the Moli 26700 cells and does indeed sell a direct replacement - but that puts me back at square one with possible unstable cells, and who know what conditions the cells are made in. I went further to call and speak with SureFire directly on this subject and they were not aware of the issues that Moli pointed out - so they are going to do some homework of their own and get back with me on what is a suitable replacement cell - Does anyone here have suggestions?


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## desert.snake (May 7, 2021)

Sorry, sometimes I don't read the forum quickly))


I think it’s not chemistry that matters, but power and current. The voltage has not changed - the cells are 3.7 volts, that is, any modern 26650 with good current and capacity will give a good result. Unprotected ones are needed, since this battery pack has its own control board. Although, if you put 2 protected ones, then it will be mega-protection, but sudden shutdowns are possible, I don't even know, I never tried.

Wow, you found some very interesting information on this chemistry, thanks! 

About capacity

I don’t know about the maximum current and capacity, I don’t follow it very closely, but this man has an excellent base that is replenishing, you can view and select the most suitable of the available, e.g. 26650 high-current IMR

https://lygte-info.dk/review/batteries2012/Common26650IndividualTest UK.html


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## GMUGNIER (May 7, 2021)

@Desert.Snake - I would tend to agree with your thoughts as they relate to general reference to "power and current" however when looking for a "drop-in" replacement cell there are many things to consider - the biggest one for me is charging the lithium battery in series (as it is definitely not a good idea) and i am not sure what to do about that. I want a cell for turn-key so that i can still use the internal recharge of the UDR. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.


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## GMUGNIER (May 8, 2021)

@Desert.Snake - Thanks for the link to the battery page - I read that it is not recommended to charge the lithium ion in series - can anyone explain why this is, and by looking at the internals of the SF battery pack - "if" i were to put unprotected (or protected) lithium ion cells instead of the "IBR" cells is that configuration with the cells spot welded together - is that considered series?


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## desert.snake (May 8, 2021)

It’s a pity that I don’t have this flashlight anymore, I would be do a test. If I remember correctly, there is a voltage output and from the point between the batteries, with the help of this, brains of flashlight understand that in front of them is a lithium rechargeable body, and not a set of primary batteries.

and in this regard, I would like to ask you for help - to measure the voltage between all the pads on the battery body






At all they can be charged sequentially and in parallel, or whatever, if the correct controller is installed)) The same batteries in screwdrivers and electric cars, they are connected in series and in parallel, and charge perfectly.


But when replacing these IBR with new 26650 it is imperative to pick up identical copies of batteries - the same internal resistance, the same capacity, and the same production time (in an idel from the same batch), then it will work well.


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## GMUGNIER (May 14, 2021)

Thanks for the help @Desert.Snake - Values are as follows: U1=5.39 U2=5.40 U3=0.0









desert.snake said:


> It’s a pity that I don’t have this flashlight anymore, I would be do a test. If I remember correctly, there is a voltage output and from the point between the batteries, with the help of this, brains of flashlight understand that in front of them is a lithium rechargeable body, and not a set of primary batteries.
> 
> and in this regard, I would like to ask you for help - to measure the voltage between all the pads on the battery body
> 
> ...


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## usdiver (May 16, 2021)

Any other news on the possible fires caused by these? Mine has been sitting in a safe deposit box along with my other valuables since I came back to England last year (Feb 2020). I forgot to take the battery out of the light


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## GMUGNIER (May 16, 2021)

Sure Fire was not even aware of this issue until i brought it to their attention. It was a Moli engineer that explained it to me (they stopped using this chemistry entirely because of this problem) Sure Fire has stated that they are looking into this and will get back to me with more info when they have a resolution.


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## desert.snake (May 16, 2021)

GMUGNIER said:


> Sure Fire was not even aware of this issue until i brought it to their attention. It was a Moli engineer that explained it to me (they stopped using this chemistry entirely because of this problem) Sure Fire has stated that they are looking into this and will get back to me with more info when they have a resolution.



It is unlikely that they will help, but hope for the best



GMUGNIER said:


> U1=5.39 U2=5.40 U3=0.0



Thanks for the measurements, very interesting))


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## The_Driver (Feb 3, 2022)

GMUGNIER said:


> Sure Fire was not even aware of this issue until i brought it to their attention. It was a Moli engineer that explained it to me (they stopped using this chemistry entirely because of this problem) Sure Fire has stated that they are looking into this and will get back to me with more info when they have a resolution.


Did they get back to you yet?


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## GMUGNIER (Jul 4, 2022)

The_Driver said:


> Did they get back to you yet?


No - but i will contact them again


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## LED1982 (Oct 30, 2022)

monkeyboy said:


> *Re: SureFire UDR Dominator - Photos, discussion, and review in progress*
> 
> Thanks for updating this review, 880. I wouldn't have thought there would be a need for such a drastic step down with the massive heatsinking that this light has


This is exactly what I thought to myself. Wow with a head this massive for it to not hold turbo mode indefinitely is a deal breaker for me. 

I’m not sure if I was seriously entertaining buying this light, but I never owned a Surefire, and all the Surefire praise in here had me checking out their website, and this light in particular. But no way for that price, and with turbo step down. Can’t believe it can’t indefinitely handle 2400 lumens.


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## GMUGNIER (Oct 31, 2022)

GMUGNIER said:


> No - but i will contact them again


They did get the situation resolved - they also changed their battery pack (capacity and definitely chemistry) - upgraded a bit also - now 5000mah/36WH/7.2V I have not taken it apart to see the new cells - i will get around to it eventually - anybody else get the new battery and take her apart yet? I have a feeling it is probably the new SureFire rechargeable 18650 - anyone else care to chime in here?


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## GMUGNIER (Oct 31, 2022)

LED1982 said:


> This is exactly what I thought to myself. Wow with a head this massive for it to not hold turbo mode indefinitely is a deal breaker for me.
> 
> I’m not sure if I was seriously entertaining buying this light, but I never owned a Surefire, and all the Surefire praise in here had me checking out their website, and this light in particular. But no way for that price, and with turbo step down. Can’t believe it can’t indefinitely handle 2400 lumens.



I have no idea what you are talking about - there is no throttling - where did you get that impression - this light is an absolute BEAST - and worth every penny - You might need to consider a cheaper alternative - I can certainly understand that - but don't bad mouth an exceptionally engineered device cause you can't justify cost to mommy - lol


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## LED1982 (Oct 31, 2022)

GMUGNIER said:


> I have no idea what you are talking about - there is no throttling - where did you get that impression - this light is an absolute BEAST - and worth every penny - You might need to consider a cheaper alternative - I can certainly understand that - but don't bad mouth an exceptionally engineered device cause you can't justify cost to mommy - lol


How about from the exact person that I quoted, and from this exact thread where it was discussed if turning the turbo off and then back on really fast AFTER THE STEP DOWN would that immediately bring the max output back. Hence a discussion about its turbo step down.

So to reference something that was discussed in a review thread about a flashlight is to bad mouth that flashlight lol? And I said nothing about wanting a cheaper alternative, I said that for me that price isn’t worth it if it can’t hold max output indefinitely.


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## jon_slider (Nov 1, 2022)

LED1982 said:


> it won’t maintain max output


true... Sustainable Output is usually much lower than Maximum Output

In this case Sustainable Output seems to be about 30% of Maximum. This is normal.


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## desert.snake (Nov 1, 2022)

The fact that they changed the battery to a more capacious one is great, I hope there is 21700 from MoliCel, they have good test results.

More interested in whether the LED was changed there? If it's the same one as it was when you exited, then it sucks. Seems CBT 90? I wrote a letter to them a long time ago and offered to put something more effective, at least Luminus SBT 90.2


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## GMUGNIER (Nov 4, 2022)

SBT 90 is not made anymore - so the latest version should have the 90.2


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## desert.snake (Nov 5, 2022)

GMUGNIER said:


> SBT 90 is not made anymore - so the latest version should have the 90.2



SBT 90 is produced and commercially available. At the time of writing the review, CBT 90 was in Dominator, it is also produced now, but it is slightly less effective than SBT 90.2


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## GMUGNIER (Nov 5, 2022)

desert.snake said:


> SBT 90 is produced and commercially available. At the time of writing the review, CBT 90 was in Dominator, it is also produced now, but it is slightly less effective than SBT 90.2
> 
> View attachment 34356


Hmm - Interesting - I wonder if it is "nos" - I thought they stopped production a few years back. Idk - my UDR is awesome.


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## desert.snake (Nov 5, 2022)

GMUGNIER said:


> Hmm - Interesting - I wonder if it is "nos" - I thought they stopped production a few years back. Idk - my UDR is awesome.


I also remember that the CBT 90 was marked as discontinued on this chart a few years ago. Apparently there was some reason to produce them again, although all the others on the list (except for high CRI) have a higher efficiency with the same radiation area of 3 * 3 mm and the same housing

Happy for you, I sold mine a long time ago. You still haven't opened the battery to see what they put in now?

Has runtime changed for the better with the new batteries?


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## GMUGNIER (Nov 5, 2022)

I am only on the second cycle of the rechargable pack - the first charge felt less - but next cycle i will do a timed test (unofficial and no fancy graphs)


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## desert.snake (Nov 5, 2022)

GMUGNIER said:


> I am only on the second cycle of the rechargable pack - the first charge felt less - but next cycle i will do a timed test (unofficial and no fancy graphs)


Thank you, this will be interesting


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## desert.snake (Nov 10, 2022)

Funny name coincidence, 1986 movie


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