# Suggestions Waterproof Flashlight



## Alpha359 (Apr 27, 2009)

Hi all,

I'm looking for a durable, waterproof flashlight. When I say waterproof, I don't mean surviving in a rain. I'm talking about using it underwater for an extended period of time. I know there is the Nemo series from Surefire, but that isn't quite what I'm looking for. I need something that is small like the Maglite 2-AA flashlight and can take falls and hard hits.

There's the Fenix TA30 that states that it is waterproof to IPX-8 standards. Does anyone have one and can confirm it working for an extended time while in water?

Maglite also states that their flashlights are waterproof, but doesn't state much about just how 'waterproof' it is. Does anyone know anything about the Maglite flashlights' claim?

All I want is a flashlight that is roughly the size of the Maglite 2-AA (pocket fittable), solid metal body, waterproof or dunkable or diveable or how ever it's called. Any suggestions?


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## andrew123 (Apr 27, 2009)

I would have posted this in the diving section.


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## angelofwar (Apr 27, 2009)

First off, :welcome:...second, SF has no such thing as a nemo (I think Princeton Tec or Petzl has the Nemo???)...but, as for your question, check out Pelican lights, or Underwater Kinetics (UK). My Pelican Stealthlite has gone into many water filled caves with me, and still works like a charm! I can also state that my Coast (Coast Lights) 3X nichia submersible is indeed waterproof, tough, small, and has great runtime. Lemme know if you need links to any of these!


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## Alpha359 (Apr 28, 2009)

angelofwar said:


> First off, :welcome:...second, SF has no such thing as a nemo (I think Princeton Tec or Petzl has the Nemo???)...but, as for your question, check out Pelican lights, or Underwater Kinetics (UK). My Pelican Stealthlite has gone into many water filled caves with me, and still works like a charm! I can also state that my Coast (Coast Lights) 3X nichia submersible is indeed waterproof, tough, small, and has great runtime. Lemme know if you need links to any of these!



Whoops! I meant that Pelican has the Nemo Dive series lights. But I don't prefer those plastic yellow-colored lights. Can I get a link to the Coast Lights? I googled Coast Lights and came up with something about gulf coast lights. Thanks!

Does anyone else have any other suggestions?


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## angelofwar (Apr 28, 2009)

http://www.coastportland.com/. Pelican has some black submersible lights. 95% of "Dive Lights" will be plastic, due to the corrosive properties of salt water on aluminum/metallic finishes.


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## Flying Turtle (Apr 28, 2009)

Princeton Tec has some nice lights that will survive more than just a dunking. One that I've used in a pool is the Attitude. It uses 4 AAAs and has 3 LEDs. Not super bright, but it has good runtime, and since it is a twistie light is well sealed. Less than $20 at camping stores or online.

Geoff


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## carrot (Apr 28, 2009)

What are your usage needs? Are you a diver? Or are you a more general user who wants the toughest lights available? 

If you are a diver it is obvious that you should go for choices like Pelican, Underwater Kinetics, PrincetonTec, maybe even Barbolight, but if you are not... well a good deal of lights can be submerged and not take on water. 

Barbolight may be worth looking at even if you aren't a diver... but IMHO any metal Surefire will handle water just fine in shallow water, as well as Ra, Peak, Arc, McGizmo, and countless others.


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## DM51 (Apr 28, 2009)

Welcome to CPF, Alpha359.

Here are 3 guidelines for you to bear in mind:

1. The only lights that are guaranteed to stay watertight are Dive Lights

2. The IPX8 standard is completely worthless

3. Even a water-tight dive light needs careful maintenance or it will leak.

Good luck with your search.


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## Mjolnir (Apr 28, 2009)

I would suggest getting a light that is intended for diving. IPX-8 doesn't really mean that a light should be used underwater as a dive light. Even though my Eagletac T10L is IPX-8, I wouldn't actually dive with it. It is rated as waterproof at 2 feet of depth for "over 10 hours." Although Eagletac actually states this duration (unlike many other manufacturers), it still isn't a light that I would be comfortable using underwater for extended periods of time. 
many manufacturers simply state "IPX-8." While this isn't _completely_ worthless (it does indicate that it is at least dunkable, and is water resistant), many manufacturers don't make it easy to find the specific time that it can remain underwater.


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## Patriot (Apr 28, 2009)

The only requirement that you listed was size. 2 x AA size will limit your search quite a bit but AE light make a tough as nails 3 x AA light that might fit your needs. It's pressure rated to 600 feet,


http://www.aelight.com/product.php?category=3&id=158


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## Alpha359 (Apr 28, 2009)

angelofwar said:


> http://www.coastportland.com/. Pelican has some black submersible lights. 95% of "Dive Lights" will be plastic, due to the corrosive properties of salt water on aluminum/metallic finishes.



Yea, I can see why they're made of plastic. But I don't mean to be diving into water constantly year round. It just happens that I go into the water with everything on, usually during the summer when my friends are free to do something crazy. My trusty Maglite has crapped out. So, now I'm looking for an upgrade that would turn on and work even underwater in addition to being rugged. Hence, my wish for a solid metal body light.



carrot said:


> What are your usage needs? Are you a diver? Or are you a more general user who wants the toughest lights available?



I'm by no means a diver, I just go into the water a lot and still wearing my clothes and all other stuff, including the flashlight I carry with me in my pocket. During the summer, my friends and I usually pick a random location and go camping and backpacking. Crazy things happening usually mean I go into the water, anything on me that isn't waterproof usually ends up destroyed. I also have one of those large 4-D cell Maglites I carry around as my main light during the night, but I always keep a pocket one on me as a backup. So, I'm probably looking for a rugged, toughest light, but I also want to find one with the added bonus of using it underwater. Bottom line, it has to be able to handle water, hard drops, large drops like over the side of a mountain, and possibly scratch resistant lens. That's my ideal, but I can probably guess that there doesn't exist such a device.



DM51 said:


> Welcome to CPF, Alpha359.
> 
> Here are 3 guidelines for you to bear in mind:
> 
> ...



Thanks! I might just have to buy a bunch of lights and try them out at the local pool.



Patriot said:


> The only requirement that you listed was size. 2 x AA size will limit your search quite a bit but AE light make a tough as nails 3 x AA light that might fit your needs. It's pressure rated to 600 feet,
> http://www.aelight.com/product.php?category=3&id=158



Yes, pocket size is my preference. It doesn't strickly have to be 2-AA. I want to be able to hold the flashlight in my mouth and keep my hands free if need be. I'm sure I could grip my 4-D cell Maglite with my mouth, but the torque would probably rip out my teeth. I need something of quality and the features I listed, size just has to be sensible.


More suggestions please!! I don't mind what they are!! I may just end up getting a whole bunch that was recommended to me and testing them out.

Thanks a bunch everyone!!


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## Gunner12 (Apr 28, 2009)

How deep do you usually go?

Most good lights around here should work underwater for a bit as long as you don't go too far and keep the light well maintained.

What's your price range?
Prefered batteries?
Multimode?

:welcome:


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## groo01 (Apr 29, 2009)

Groo here
Get a Streamlight like a 4AA led.
It is plastic but yellow or black with a base switch .
I have one that dive weight belts have only ruffed up a little,..


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## berry580 (Apr 30, 2009)

I have an iTP C7 and took it for a dive for a few mins down to abt 2-3 metres. Absolutely no problems before, during and even after the dive.
Its built quality is excellent, the walls are quite thick.

Output/runtime is good, in line with its competitors, good bang for buck.


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## Ubi (May 7, 2009)

You could always look at the diving equipment manufacturers for waterproof lights. Look out for backup lights in particular. Few examples:

Salvo RAT series
OMS Vega
Hollis 3 x 3
Diverite
Halcyon Scout
Photon Torpedo

Though some of those listed use C or D cells and plastic bodies.


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## 6speed (May 8, 2009)

For $25.-- Streamlight 2 AA led .5 watt 25 lumens, poly tough, drop rated, safety light.


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## Muskett (May 17, 2009)

Not sure if I'm understanding your post correctly, it sounds like you just need a light that will survive if dunked, not necessarly on or functioning in water? I think many flashlights will qualify for this... Even the EX10 with its rating of IPX8 can handle 10ft of water


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## Burgess (May 18, 2009)

Just so you know . . . .



When flashlights are described as " Virtually Waterproof ",


that *actually* means: 


" as long as you don't do anything silly, like get it Wet ! "







( i wish i were exaggerating, but i'm not )

_


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## Zdenka (May 18, 2009)

*'IPX Rated'* reminds me of those* "98% fat free" *labels on food products. There's a million way for manufacturers to loop hole around it. Take it with a grain of salt! 



Alpha359 said:


> Hi all,
> 
> I'm looking for a durable, waterproof flashlight. When I say waterproof, I don't mean surviving in a rain. I'm talking about using it underwater for an extended period of time.



Then, Surefire is your answer. _"Surefire has affirmed that all current Surefire lights should be waterproof to about 33 feet/10 meters. Some reviews were posted before Surefire made the affirmation that their lights were watertight to 1 atmosphere depth. Any new Surefire lights you purchase now should be considered waterproof to 33 feet/10 meters" _- Flashlightreviews.com

That's one of the major reason for my recent purchase of a Surefire L4. If am spending over $50 for ANY light, then I DEMAND that it's *waterproof *(not water-resistant). I don't know any other brands that make waterproof lights, all Chinese lights are IPX-8 certified at most (which in my opinion, means nothing since it's merely rain proof):nana:


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## HKJ (May 18, 2009)

Zdenka said:


> Then, Surefire is your answer. _"Surefire has affirmed that all current Surefire lights should be waterproof to about 33 feet/10 meters. Some reviews were posted before Surefire made the affirmation that their lights were watertight to 1 atmosphere depth. Any new Surefire lights you purchase now should be considered waterproof to 33 feet/10 meters" _- Flashlightreviews.com
> 
> That's one of the major reason for my recent purchase of a Surefire L4. If am spending over $50 for ANY light, then I DEMAND that it's *waterproof *(not water-resistant). I don't know any other brands that make waterproof lights, all Chinese lights are IPX-8 certified at most (which in my opinion, means nothing since it's merely rain proof):nana:



That statement is some sort of misunderstanding, Surefire lights are not waterproof, except some special versions. The rest is just weatherproof.
If you need really waterproof lights, take a look at barbolights, they also have a subforum here.


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## Zdenka (May 18, 2009)

hmmm... well I hope mine is a 'special version' Surefire :naughty: Anyway I think I might give SF an email and ask them for an opinion on this.. I do however expect it to be more than IPX-8 rating. :twothumbs


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## kts (May 18, 2009)

Any Fenix light would fit ur need, for pocket carry I suggest the LD10. :thumbsup:

Its not a dive light, but I have never heard of a Fenix leaking.


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## Zdenka (May 18, 2009)

kts said:


> Any Fenix light would fit ur need, for pocket carry I suggest the LD10. :thumbsup:



No, I would not recommend any Fenix light for the OP, since they're only IPX-8 rated, according to the claim. 
Even the manufacturer does not recommend submersing the light for an extended time period..


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## Marduke (May 18, 2009)

Zdenka said:


> No, I would not recommend any Fenix light for the OP, since they're only IPX-8 rated, according to the claim.
> Even the manufacturer does not recommend submersing the light for an extended time period..



IPX8 is meaningless. Using common sense and real world experience, they should be fine.

IPX8 is not a "limiting" rating, it's a "minimum" rating.


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## Zdenka (May 18, 2009)

Slightly off topic - What I don't understand is that if a mass-market digital camera can be made waterproof to 10m (33ft), then why are the majority of flashlights merely dunkproof? Seriously, the flashlight industry needs to learn something, in this regard. 

A Waterproof digital Camera: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oyVzGk2xm_k&feature=related


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## Marduke (May 18, 2009)

Zdenka said:


> Slightly off topic - What I don't understand is that if a mass-market digital camera can be made waterproof to 10m (33ft), then why are the majority of flashlights merely dunkproof? Seriously, the flashlight industry needs to learn something, in this regard.
> 
> A Waterproof digital Camera: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oyVzGk2xm_k&feature=related




You can easily buy "waterproof" flashlights also. They are a specialty item, same as a "waterproof" camera. Most flashlights are a hell of a lot more weather resistant than most digital cameras I know of.

I would venture that there are actually far more dive rated lights than there are dive rated cameras. They are also an order of magnitude cheaper.


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## DM51 (May 18, 2009)

Most flashlight manufacturers cater for the mass-market, not for specialist users like the military, or nuts like us.

Most people don't want to go swimming with a flashlight, and they don't need one that is waterproof to 10m. Those who do need such a light will buy one that is dive-rated, if they have any sense.

Most people just need a light that is likely to keep working if it is raining, or if they accidentally drop it in a puddle of water. The majority of the good makes discussed in this forum will stand up well to such treatment.

If you need a light that is sufficiently waterproof to be *guaranteed* to work underwater at any depth, get a dive light - and be sure to maintain it properly.


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## Zdenka (May 18, 2009)

Fair enough, but I personally think 99% of flashlights *should* be waterproof to at least 10m. They're the kind of tool that gets a rough treatment, and waterproofing (at least 10m) should be the rule, not the exception.  I hope in 5 years time, all flashlights will be waterproof to at least 30m... just like expensive watches.


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## Marduke (May 18, 2009)

Zdenka said:


> Fair enough, but I personally think 99% of flashlights should be waterproof to at least 10m. They're the kind of tool that gets a rough treatment, and waterproofing (at least 10m) should be the rule, not the exception. * I hope in 5 years time, all flashlights will be waterproof to at least 30m... just like expensive watches.*



*ALL* 30m watches are good for nothing more than washing your hands, a moderate rainstorm, or perhaps a shower. 30m rated watches are not even recommended to go swiming in a pool, let alone go to actual 30m depth.

You don't go near a pool with less than a 50m watch at MINIMUM.


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## Nightwatch (May 18, 2009)

Rugged and tough you say? I'd say the Fenix Tk-20 might fit your needs. Uses AAs, has a nice throw, and is built like a tank.


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## Gary123 (May 18, 2009)

Don't know if I missed a price limitation. But Packhorse makes a nice upgrade to an existing, quality dive lite. I have one of his upgrades with the aspheric, thought the aspheric will not take great depths because a thinner front lens is used due to the thickness of the aspheric lens underneath.

His thread is at:
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/217317 

I've used a Tektite, Trek 4 (about $40), that I have used for years with the kids in swimming pools. Not too bright. Ck out their website, they have led lights up to 220 lumens.


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## Zdenka (May 19, 2009)

I'd recommend the OP buy any light that is *BETTER* than simply an 'IPX-8' rating. If one accidentally submerge their light, it'd be unwise to get a mere 'IPX light' and hope it may or may not work. :twothumbs


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## ResQTech (May 19, 2009)

Zdenka said:


> I'd recommend the OP buy any light that is *BETTER* than simply an 'IPX-8' rating. If one accidentally submerge their light, it'd be unwise to get a mere 'IPX light' and hope it may or may not work. :twothumbs



Umm... Did you not see the vid in this post (EX10, IPX-8, 10 feet of water):


Muskett said:


> Not sure if I'm understanding your post correctly, it sounds like you just need a light that will survive if dunked, not necessarly on or functioning in water? I think many flashlights will qualify for this... Even the EX10 with its rating of IPX8 can handle 10ft of water



I don't think the OP wanted a dive light (although that's the only way to truly guarantee it's waterproof), according to his post, he wants something that can be dunked and used underwater (I am assuming waist deep max). IMHO "IPX-8" should be fine.


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## Zdenka (May 19, 2009)

Here's some extra information for the OP from this thread: https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/177366

Quote *DM51*: _"The IPX8 standard is of little use where flashlights are concerned, unless you are just worried about whether yours will survive being taken out in the rain or dropped in a puddle.

The problem is that it is a static test, not a dynamic one. A light is not required to be operated underwater (or even moved around at all) to pass the test. Waterproofing is most likely to fail during actual operation" _ 

IPX-8 is not a strict standard, especially when the light manufacturer does not set any criteria for underwater functioning, such as water depth, duration of immersion, current speed, water temp, etc. Even if they do, I'd personally take their claims with a grain of salt unless it can be verified repeatedly by third party evaluations.


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## Marduke (May 19, 2009)

Zdenka said:


> IPX-8 is not a strict standard, especially when the light manufacturer *does not set any criteria for underwater functioning, such as water depth, duration of immersion, current speed, water temp*, etc. Even if they do, I'd personally take their claims with a grain of salt unless it can be verified repeatedly by third party evaluations.



Actually IPxx is VERY strict, controlling criteria for underwater functioning, depth, duration, current speed, and water temp.

The problem is with uninformed consumers who misinterpret the meaning of the standard itself, and what it does and does not mean.


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## Zdenka (May 19, 2009)

Marduke said:


> Actually IPxx is VERY strict, controlling criteria for underwater functioning, depth, duration, current speed, and water temp.



Yes, but it's always a frustration for the consumer when light manufacturers don't adhere to the standard, strictly. I think companies wanting credibility should clearly layout and define the conditions under which their light is 'waterproof', because part of the IP-XX standard requires the conditions be specified by the manufacturer. Then, the claims must also be repeatedly verified by many independent reviews.


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## Marduke (May 19, 2009)

Zdenka said:


> Yes, but it's always a frustration for the consumer when light manufacturers don't adhere to the standard, strictly. I think companies wanting credibility should clearly layout and define the conditions under which their light is 'waterproof', because part of the IP-XX standard requires the conditions be specified by the manufacturer. Then, the claims must also be repeatedly verified by many independent reviews.



When quoting "IPX8" the only two variables are depth and duration. As a minimum, both must exceed IPX7. A quick email to the manufacturer will tell you exactly how much IPX7 is surpassed. 

Most people use common sense and correctly view the product as weather resistant/dunkable.

Also, I am fairly certain the standard does NOT require multiple reviews, as such would be highly impracticable with some components. If you know of such a clause in the standard, please cite it directly.


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## Zdenka (May 19, 2009)

hmm.. fair enough then. But I was under the impression that the OP wanted something beyond dunkable but less than diveable. 

Quote Alpha359: https://www.candlepowerforums.com/posts/2934902&postcount=1 _"I'm talking about using it underwater for an extended period of time" 

_Now as I understand, an IP8 or any IPXX rating would be _unsuitable _for this condition because the IPXX standard pertains to a static test, not a dynamic one. Please correct me if I am wrong on that. 
There is no requirement to move the light when it is submerged, or to use it (activate on/off). The fact that a light falling into a body of water constitues a dynamic action, and will invalidate any makers claim regarding 'waterproofness'.


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## Marduke (May 19, 2009)

Zdenka said:


> hmm.. fair enough then. But I was under the impression that the OP wanted something beyond dunkable but less than diveable.
> 
> Quote Alpha359: https://www.candlepowerforums.com/posts/2934902&postcount=1 _"I'm talking about using it underwater for an extended period of time"
> 
> ...



Here's a clue for ya:

Nearly all submersion ratings are static. Even for dive watches. That's why you use a large derating factor somewhere in the neighborhood of a factor of 10 (order of magnitude).

BTW, IPxx is sometimes used for dive rated components if the conditions are stringent enough. Barbolight dive lights for example....

ie. you could have
IP68 @ 1.5m for 1hr
and
IP68 @ 300m for 24hr

just as easily using the same standard.

Also, the standard can require operation of the component when submerged with the "M" suffix.


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## Zdenka (May 19, 2009)

Thanks for the nifty info, Marduke! :twothumbs
IPXX ratings are like "98% fat free" claims. There are a million loopholes for manufacturers to slither around it. 



Marduke said:


> Here's a clue for ya:
> 
> Nearly all submersion ratings are static. Even for dive watches. That's why you use a large derating factor somewhere in the neighborhood of a factor of 10 (order of magnitude).



That's probably true. An IP8 rated flashlight when applied with a 'derating factor of 10' becomes a < IP1 light. :nana:


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## Marduke (May 19, 2009)

Zdenka said:


> That's probably true. An IP8 rated flashlight when applied with a 'derating factor of 10' becomes a < IP1 light. :nana:



Except the IP ratings are paired, not linear in increasing severity.

They are paired in 1/2, 3/4, 5/6, 7/8.

I would personally prefer lights come with an IP66 ratings for non-dive use, as it is MUCH more severe than IP67/IP68. It is also much more difficult to test however.

Applying a _real world_ derating factor to IP67/IP68 for example gives you your typical "dunkable/splashproof" rating.


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