# LiteFlux LF5XT - the ultimate AA light?



## LED Cool (May 19, 2008)

Introducing the new LiteFlux LF5XT!

the LF5XT is the first AA light to use an electronic tack switch with MCU controlled user interface.

here are some LF5XT 3D images.










a cutaway drawing.






various internal components making up the LF5XT.






real life photo shots of the actual tack switch, spring and LED driver/circuit with MCU.

this shot show one side of the circuit board.





this show show the other side of the same circuit board.





i have been told by LiteFlux that it was a great and difficult challenge to come up with a circuit to power up the MCU using an AA (1.0V - 1.5V) power source. i know nothing about LED circuit with MCU design, so i would appreciate if anyone can elaborate and enlighten us on LiteFlux claim.

the information that i am posting below are what i currently have from LiteFlux. these information may change without my knowledge.

Specifications
LED : CREE XR-E R2 bin
Approximate LED current at 100% output level : 
500ma when using alkaline & NIMH, 
800ma when using 14500.
Approximate LED current at 2% output level : 
9ma when using alkaline & NIMH, 
14ma when using Li-Ion 14500
Input voltage : 1.0V - 4.5V (AA/14500)
AA battery chemistry : Alkaline(1.5V), NIMH(1.2V), NICD(1.2V), Primary Lithium(1.7V) & rechargeable Li-Ion 14500(4.2V)
PWM Frequency 7800Hz.
Dimension = 101mm length. 20.5mm diameter.
Weight = 53 grams.
Material = 6061 T6 Aluminium Alloy.
Tail press button machined from 6061 T6 Aluminium Alloy and HA III finish.
AR Coated glass lens.
NATURAL and BLACK HA III finish.
O ring seal at lens, both end of battery tube and tack switch.
Tail cap provides 2 holes, 2 elongated holes and 2 slots. Stable tail stand.
All parts can be dismantle for cleaning and maintenance.
water resistant.
Lanyard, Spare O-rings, silicon lubricant, user manual and wooden gift box.

Operation Modes
the LF5XT has 5 operation modes. the factory default setting are.

Mode 1 = 50% brightness output
Mode 2 = 15% brightness output
Mode 3 = 2% brightness output
Mode 4 = 50% brightness double flash beacon
Mode 5 = 15% brightness SOS

1 click *(1xC)* turn on the light.
2 clicks *(2xC)* jump to next operation mode. Mode 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5 - Mode 1.
1 click *(1xC)* turn off the light.

Types of Output
there are 4 types/styles of output in LF5XT.

Constant brightness 
Strobe - 8 frequencies
Beacon - single flash & double flashes with 8 frequencies for both.
SOS 

the brightness of all 4 types of output is user adjustable from (was 8%) 2% to 100%. 

the output of all 5 operation modes can be change by user to the above mentioned 4 types/styles. for example, you can set all 5 operation modes to have

5 different % of constant brightness or
5 different frequency and brightness of strobes or
5 different frequency and brightness of beacon or
5 different brightness of SOS or

any combination of the 4 types/styles in ANY order you preferred.

Quick Access
in addition to the 5 operation modes, the LF5XT provides quick access to the following while in all 5 operation modes.

100% constant brightness - press and hold *(PH)*
Random strobe at 100% brightness - one click plus press and hold *(1C+PH)* 

Release the hold on the tack switch and the LF5XT reverts back to the previous operation mode.

Special Functions
the LF5XT also has the following functions.

* 1. Momentary-on function.*
factory default is OFF.

* 2. Rechargeable battery NIMH & Li-Ion over discharge protection.*
factory default is OFF.
*
3. Operation Mode setting.* 
That is right! the LF5XT allows the user to select the desired number of 
operation modes. your LF5XT can be a 1 mode light, or a 3 mode light or
a 5 mode light!

Minimum is 1 operation mode.
Maximum is 5 operation modes.
*
4. RESET*
Restore the EEPROM to factory default settings. 
Light default to Mode 1 = 50% brightness. 
Operation mode default to 5 modes.

*5. Last used mode memory on/off function.*
Users can decide if they want this memory function to operate.
Factory default is ON.

*Battery Voltage report* = 5 clicks *(5xC)* in any operation modes.
* Brightness % report* = 5 clicks *(5xC)* only while in output setting menu.

both reports use the same format.
1 flash = 1
3 flashes = 3
.
.
9 flashes = 9
2 quick flashes = 0

for example, 
0.9V is 2 quick flashes, blank one second, 9 flashes.
100% is 1 flash, blank one second, 2 quick flashes, blank one second, 2 quick flashes.

Logarithmic plus Linear Brightness Adjustment.
as many LiteFlux users have pointed out, the linear brightness adjustment of LF2X, LF2, LF3, LF4, LF5 caused some difficulty in setting the user desired brightness level. 

well, the LF5XT now has both logarithmic and linear adjustment for the brightness setting. Logarithmic adjustment to quickly jump to the level you want, and linear adjustment for macro adjustment to the exact output level % desired. 

the exact output level % can be determined using the brightness % report *(5xC)* while in the output setting menu.

each logarithmic increase steps raises the output by 50%.
eg. 10% -> 15% -> 22% -> 33% -> 50% -> 75%

each logarithmic decrease steps reduces the output by 33%.
eg. 75% -> 50% -> 33% -> 22% -> 15% -> 10%


that is all for now. i will add more info later.

please tell CPF members what do you think of the LF5XT.

thank you.
khoo


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## LED Cool (May 19, 2008)

reserved for more actual photos and LF5XT user manual.

there is still one more unrevealed function of the LF5XT which i think makes it the ultimate AA light.

Both black and natural HA III finish.














bezel head side shot.





5 sided crenelated bezel.





tail shot with the aluminium HA III button.





tail cap shot showing the checkering, keyring holes and slots.






Operation of LF5XT
the LF5XT operates on two types of switching commands.

*CLICK (C)* = Quickly press the button and release. the timing for pressing and releasing the button must be less than 0.4 seconds.

*PRESS & HOLD (PH)* = Press the button and hold it down for more than 1 second.

when there are multiples *CLICKS (C) *commands* (2xC, 3xC, 4xC, 5xC)*, the time interval between clicks must be less than 0.4 seconds.

when there are combination of multiples *CLICKS (C) plus* *PRESS & HOLD* *(P&H)* commands *(1xC+PH, 2xC+PH, 3xC+PH, 4xC+PH)*,
the time interval between clicks and press & hold must be less than 0.4 seconds.

the complete User Interface (UI) of LF5XT can be navigated by
a certain number of *CLICK (C)*
and
a certain combination of *CLICKS (C)* *PLUS PRESS & HOLD (PH)*

*1XC : Power on.* 
the LF5XT has last mode memory activated by default. it will turn on at the last used operation mode. with last mode memory turned off, it will always come on in operation mode 1.

*1xC : Power off.* 
with last mode memory turned on by default, the LF5XT will save the last used operation mode before turning off. with last mode memory turned OFF, it will NOT save the last used mode.

*2xC : Switching operation mode.* 
each *2xC* command will switch the LF5XT to the next operation mode.
Mode 1 -> Mode 2 -> Mode 3 -> Mode 4 -> Mode 5 -> Mode 1 -> Mode 2 ->...

*5xC : Battery Voltage report.*
same indication format as the LF2X, LF2, LF3, LF4.
1 flash = 1
3 flashes = 3
8 flashes = 8
two quick flashes = 0

for example, 
0.8V is indicated by two quick flashes, one second blank (which indicates a decimal point) and 8 flashes.

3.6V is indicated by 3 flashes, one second blank and 6 flashes.

*PH : 100% constant brightness output.*
While in any operation mode, a *PH* command will give the user 100% constant brightness output. releasing the button will bring the light back to previous operation mode.
*
1xC+PH : Random Strobe at 100% brightness.*
While in any operation mode, a *1xC+PH* command will give the user random strobe at 100% brightness. releasing the button will bring the light back the previous operation mode.
*
3xC+PH : Output setting Command.*
This command is use to enter the output setting menu to adjust the brightness % and strobe/beacon frequency of the relevant operation mode.
This same command is also used to enter the output setting menu to select the 4 different types of output for each operation mode.

there is no need to cycles through all 5 operation modes' output settings in order to adjust the brightness or frequency of one operation mode.

if the user is using operation *mode 3* and wants to adjust the brightness %, just *3xC+PH* will enter the output setting menu for *mode 3 only.* All other operation modes settings are unaffected.

if the user is using operation *mode 4* (Strobe) and wants to change the
output from Strobe to SOS, just *3xC+PH* will enter the output setting menu for *mode 4 only*.

in other words, the user can adjust the output of any operation modes directly. just select the operation mode you would like to change and do a *3xC+PH.*

*4xC+PH : Special Function setting Command.*
This command will enter the special function menu to

turn momentary-on function - ON/OFF

turn rechargeable battery over discharge protection - ON/OFF

RESET - reset all operation modes to factory default setting.

adjust the setting of one more special function which, if i may say so, is unprecedented in any flashlights that i know of.

YES! it is time to reveal the special function which i think may make the LF5XT the ultimate AA light. this function is unprecedented in any flashlight that i know of. 

it is called the *Operation Mode number setting*

as i have mentioned in post #1, the LF5XT has 5 operation modes. BUT now the user can select how many operation modes that he/she prefers for his/her LF5XT!

yes! 
you can select your LF5XT as a 1 operation mode light, or 
you can select your LF5XT to be a 2 operation modes light, or 
3 operation modes or 4 operation modes or 5 operation modes light!

minimum operation mode is one.
maximum operation mode is five.

isn't this function brilliant! 

now lets go into detail about how to adjust the 4 special functions.
while in any operation mode, performing the *4xC+PH *command will enter into the special function setting menu (SFM).

When the light enters into the SFM, it will be indicated by 
one flash, 2 seconds stop, one flash, 2 seconds stop, repeat.

the SFM has (was 4) 5 functions to set.
*1. Momentary-on.*
indicated by 1 flash, 2 seconds stop, repeat.

*2. Rechargeable battery over discharge protection.*
indicated by 2 flashes, 2 seconds stop. repeat.

*3. Operation mode number setting.*
indicated by 3 flashes, 2 seconds stop. repeat.

*4. RESET.*
indicated by 4 flashes, 2 seconds stop. repeat.

*5. Last mode memory setting.*

select any one of the 5 functions by performing *1xC *and note the indicated signal. keep performing *1xC* until the desired function is selected.

*1xC* : move to next function.

*2xC* : move to previous function.

*3xC* : exit SFM & go back to the last operation mode without saving any setting. acts like an ESC key on a keyboard.

*3xC+PH* : enters into the selected function. acts like an ENTER key on a keybaord. this command is also used to save setting and exit back to SFM.


*1. Momentary-on function setting.*
indicated by 1 flash, 2 seconds stop, repeat.

from SFM select this function setting using *1xC* and note the indicated signal. enters into this function setting by performing *3xC+PH.*
ON : indicated by a 2Hz flash signal. i.e. fast flash
OFF : indicated by a 1 Hz flash signal. i.e. slow flash

*1xC* : to toggle between ON & OFF.
*
3xC* : exit SFM & go back to the last operation mode without saving any setting.

*3xC+PH* : save setting and exit back to SFM.

to exit SFM, perform *3xC+PH* again will bring the light back to the last operation mode.

*2. Rechargeable battery over discharge protection function setting.*
indicated by 2 flashes, 2 seconds stop, repeat.

from SFM select this function setting using *1xC* and note the indicated signal. enters into this function setting by performing *3xC+PH.*
ON : indicated by a 2Hz flash signal. i.e. fast flash
OFF : indicated by a 1 Hz flash signal. i.e. slow flash

*1xC* : to toggle between ON & OFF.
*
3xC* : exit SFM & go back to the last operation mode without saving any setting.

*3xC+PH* : save setting and exit back to SFM.

to exit SFM, perform *3xC+PH* again will bring the light back to the last operation mode.

NIMH : low battery warning level - 1.0V
NIMH : shutdown level - 0.8V

14500 Li-Ion : low battery warning level - 3.0V
14500 Li-Ion : shutdown level - 2.8V

low battery warning signal : the light output will fluctuate high & low 3 times every 25 seconds.

fluctuating output is used as low battery warning signal in order to avoid confusion with strobe, beacon and SOS.

shutdown signal : the light will flash in 2Hz frequency for a few seconds and then shut down.

*3. Operation mode number setting.*
indicated by 3 flashes, 2 seconds stop, repeat.

from SFM select this function setting using *1xC* and note the indicated signal. enters into this function setting by performing *3xC+PH.

*the light will start flashing to indicate the operation mode number.

Mode no. = 1 : 1 flash, 1 second stop, repeat.
Mode no. = 2 : 2 flashes, 1 second stop, repeat.
Mode no. = 3 : 3 flashes, 1 second stop, repeat.
Mode no. = 4 : 4 flashes, 1 second stop, repeat.
Mode no. = 5 : 5 flashes, 1 second stop, repeat.

*1xC* : increase the mode number, 5 is maximum.
*2xC *: decrease the mode number, 1 is minimum.*

3xC* : exit SFM & go back to the last operation mode without saving any setting.

select the desired operation mode number using *1xC* & *2xC.

* *3xC+PH* : saved the setting and exit back to SFM.

to exit SFM, perform *3xC+PH* again will bring the light back to the last operation mode.

*4. RESET.*
indicated by 4 flashes, 2 seconds stop, repeat.

from SFM select RESET using *1xC* and note the indicated signal. enters into RESET by performing *3xC+PH.*

Once *3xC+PH* is performed, the light will

restore the EEPROM to the factory default setting.
exit SFM and go to operation mode 1 output at 50%.

*5. Last Memory Mode function setting.*
indicated by 5 flashes, 2 seconds stop, repeat.

from SFM select this function setting using *1xC* and note the indicated signal. enters into this function setting by performing *3xC+PH.*
ON : indicated by a 2Hz flash signal. i.e. fast flash
OFF : indicated by a 1 Hz flash signal. i.e. slow flash

*1xC* : to toggle between ON & OFF.
*
3xC* : exit SFM & go back to the last operation mode without saving any setting.

*3xC+PH* : save setting and exit back to SFM.

to exit SFM, perform *3xC+PH* again will bring the light back to the last operation mode.



ok.here is another photo showing all the components that make up the LF5XT. there are 5 pcs of copper parts, 6 aluminium parts, 4 O-rings, 1 AR coated glass lens, 4 PCB and one gold plated spring.









more to come tomorrow! gotta go to sleep!

thanks.
khoo


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## Crenshaw (May 19, 2008)

the switch sounds alot like the novatac switch....:thinking:

Crenshaw


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## Thujone (May 19, 2008)

Good lord... Can't wait!


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## patycake57 (May 19, 2008)

Looks interesting. How do you switch between modes? Is it a cycle, or is there direct access?


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## BabyDoc (May 19, 2008)

It sure looks great! It has more than a passing resemblence to the NDI, with a similar dark grey color and knurling pattern. I can't wait to see some beam shots. It certainly has a lot a features, but without the right beam and tint, it can't be the ultimate. When is it supposed to be released and is there a suggested list price?


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## nanotech17 (May 19, 2008)

this what i want - with Cree emitter :thumbsup:


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## Thujone (May 19, 2008)

nanotech17 said:


> this what i want - with Cree emitter :thumbsup:



*cough* LED : CREE XR-E R2 bin *cough*


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## Sharpy_swe (May 19, 2008)

Interesting! 


:wow:


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## matrixshaman (May 19, 2008)

It sounds like they have really nailed it on the switch and control circuit. This is great! An MCU controlled setup on AA is unique (other than Eternalights but they use 3x AA in series) so I imagine the challenge of getting it to work from a voltage as low as 1.0 volt was difficult in finding the right IC's to work with. This light's got my attention big time! Looking forward to more details and pricing.

Also :twothumbs to LiteFlux for finally coming out with a tailswitch version AND really doing it right! It would be great to see more MCU controlled switching lights as they can use a better quality switch which runs on lower current and that usually equates to a lighter and better feel to the switching.


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## nanotech17 (May 19, 2008)

Thujone said:


> *cough* LED : CREE XR-E R2 bin *cough*



*cough* and lumens rating *cough*


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## Thujone (May 19, 2008)

nanotech17 said:


> *cough* and lumens rating *cough*



All my point was is that it says clearly it will be a cree, so your post seemed unnecessary. And I am glad that there are not any lumen ratings posted along with rendering of a light. They would almost certainly be made up if they had listed them... I think waiting till they have a release candidate light would be prudent. Their in house test units may put out 180 lumens on an eneloop, but that doesn't mean much if the release version ends up being 135 lumens...


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## Nake (May 19, 2008)

I don't get it. I have no trouble programming a Novatac or FLuPIC, but when I read the intructions for a LiteFlux I go into brain lock.


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## nanotech17 (May 19, 2008)

matrixshaman said:


> It sounds like they have really nailed it on the switch and control circuit. This is great! An MCU controlled setup on AA is unique (other than Eternalights but they use 3x AA in series) so I imagine the challenge of getting it to work from a voltage as low as 1.0 volt was difficult in finding the right IC's to work with. This light's got my attention big time! Looking forward to more details and pricing.



Looks like a reverse clicky.


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## adnj (May 19, 2008)

This would be really interesting if it had a CR123 tube to go with it! That would be a fabulous option.

Judging from the head diameter, it wouldn't work though.


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## matrixshaman (May 19, 2008)

I really doubt it is a reverse clicky - or at least I've never seen one on a MCU controlled switching setup. It would be fairly contradictory to use one for such a setup anyway IMO.


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## BabyDoc (May 19, 2008)

OK, I need a refresher course, or to learn what I never knew before. What does MCU stand for? What is the advantage of an R2 over a Q5?


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## adnj (May 19, 2008)

micro controller unit
R2 is a bit more efficient than Q5 for Cree LEDs


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## BabyDoc (May 19, 2008)

Doesn't every light with adjustable output have a Micro Controller Unit? I have not seen this term thrown around the forum before, so is there something special about a MCU?

Does greater efficiency with the R2 mean just greater user time, or does it promise greater output as well over a Q5. Are there different tints available for an R2; how does its tint compare to a typical Q5, which in my experience is somehat cold with most lights.


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## Thujone (May 19, 2008)

nanotech17 said:


> Looks like a reverse clicky.




The description actually makes it sound like an electronic switch of the hds and novatac ilk...


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## Thujone (May 19, 2008)

BabyDoc said:


> Does greater efficiency with the R2 mean just greater user time, or does it promise greater output as well over a Q5.



Either or... If it puts out more light at the same current then it is brighter.. Or you if you dial down the current to match output to your needs it will result in better run time.


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## nanotech17 (May 19, 2008)

that's 
i love my 120-T switch.


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## Thujone (May 19, 2008)

nanotech17 said:


> that's
> i love my 120-T switch.



Ultimate switch imo.. You can make it do what ever you want through programming. Everything to everyone.


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## adnj (May 19, 2008)

The Liteflux all have MCU interfaces but the switching is by rotating the head and the signal is steady until you move the head. With a switch, you have to "latch" or hold the signal and differentiate between a latched signal and a manually held signal during full depression. Can be kinda complicated if you do it right. And it does seem to function very much like a HDA/Novatac.


BabyDoc said:


> Doesn't every light with adjustable output have a Micro Controller Unit? I have not seen this term thrown around the forum before, so is there something special about a MCU?


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## nanotech17 (May 19, 2008)

Thujone said:


> Ultimate switch imo.. You can make it do what ever you want through programming. Everything to everyone.



now i'm all over 
come on LEDCool spill more beans


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## matrixshaman (May 19, 2008)

BabyDoc said:


> Doesn't every light with adjustable output have a Micro Controller Unit? I have not seen this term thrown around the forum before, so is there something special about a MCU?
> 
> Does greater efficiency with the R2 mean just greater user time, or does it promise greater output as well over a Q5. Are there different tints available for an R2; how does its tint compare to a typical Q5, which in my experience is somehat cold with most lights.



Yes it is clearly different : "electronic tack switch with MCU controlled user interface" meaning the switch itself has an MCU - not the LED regulator circuit. Currently I can only think of a few lights that use this - HDS, Novatac and Eternalights. 
And to clarify R2 is just the next step up the ladder in the Cree bin rating. A few more lumens at the same power or a bit longer runtime. Common Cree bins have been P2, P4, Q2, Q4, Q5 and now R2. Each bin can have different tints and those are fairly independent of bin efficiency ratings.


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## bexamous (May 19, 2008)

Why is the lowest 8%? 7800hz PWM why can't we get a lower brightness level? 0.2% on LF2X is one reason its great.


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## Oddjob (May 19, 2008)

That bezel looks like it will eat right through my pocket. Cool looking light. I will probably wait for reviews on this one.


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## BabyDoc (May 19, 2008)

matrixshaman said:


> Yes it is clearly different : "electronic tack switch with MCU controlled user interface" meaning the switch itself has an MCU - not the LED regulator circuit. Currently I can only think of a few lights that use this - HDS, Novatac and Eternalights.
> And to clarify R2 is just the next step up the ladder in the Cree bin rating. A few more lumens at the same power or a bit longer runtime. Common Cree bins have been P2, P4, Q2, Q4, Q5 and now R2. Each bin can have different tints and those are fairly independent of bin efficiency ratings.


 
Well, forgive me, but I am still confused about what MCU really is. I have a $25 MTE Q5 Five Mode light which retains in memory the last light mode used. Aside from that the light has no programmability. I took the tailswitch apart and it appears that there is a circuit board there, separate from the circuit board at the business end of the light. By your definition, does that qualify its memory switch as a MCU?


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## Crenshaw (May 19, 2008)

that "circuit board" would just be the mount for the switch. 

Crenshaw


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## LED Cool (May 19, 2008)

nanotech17 said:


> Looks like a reverse clicky.



it is NOT a reverse clicky. you can see the switch from the last two photos in post #1. it is an electronic tack switch. there is no on or off status in a tack switch. just click it and a signal is passed through to the relevant circuit or MCU. it is a similar to Novatec & HDS switch concept.

also there is a copper/brass sleeve inside the battery tube. please see the fourth photo in post #1. i am not good in circuit design, but it is my understanding that this sleeve is necessary in order to connect the electronic switch to the circuit/MCU. 

khoo


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## Kilovolt (May 19, 2008)

*Simply beautiful....*



:twothumbs:twothumbs:twothumbs


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## nanotech17 (May 19, 2008)

PP locked & loaded


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## LED Cool (May 19, 2008)

bexamous said:


> Why is the lowest 8%? 7800hz PWM why can't we get a lower brightness level? 0.2% on LF2X is one reason its great.



yes! i agreed with you. i am sure there is an explanation on why the LF5XT has a lowest low of only 8%. i will find out more about this from LiteFlux and will post here ASAP.

oddjob,
the tip of the crenelated bezel is chamfered. it is similar to surefire L1 bezel except the cutaway is slightly deeper. i will post a photo of the bezel later.


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## Thujone (May 19, 2008)

I took the post to mean the out of the box low is set to 8%, I highly doubt that you would be unable to set it lower. That is the beauty of the LF lights..


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## momonbubu (May 19, 2008)

Waiting for this one, hehe
Paypal ready.


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## Kilovolt (May 19, 2008)

Presently my trusted and beloved NDI is trembling in my pocket. Any explanation? :thinking:


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## Raindog- (May 19, 2008)

Kilovolt said:


> Presently my trusted and beloved NDI is trembling in my pocket. Any explanation? :thinking:




Mine too. :sweat:


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## xcel730 (May 19, 2008)

Wow, nice. I want one. When is coming out? How Much?


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## Raindog- (May 19, 2008)

Just one request... Please make the reflector detachable to alow candle mode.


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## LED-holic (May 19, 2008)

Light seems exciting, but not as visually as nice as the NDI. Maybe actual photos will be more enticing.


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## LED Cool (May 19, 2008)

more actual photos posted.

and also partial description on the operation of the LF5XT User Interface (UI).

keeps your comments coming. 
thanks.
khoo


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## HKJ (May 19, 2008)

Look like I need a new flashlight.

But I do not like the 8% min light, it is way to high.

It would also be nice if the adjustment of the light levels was logarithmic, i.e. not like 10%, 11%, 12%, 13%, 14%, 15% but more like 10%, 14%, 20%, 28%, 40%. (I used a factor 1.4, but maybe lower factor would be better).
It gives fewer steps, but makes it faster to adjust the light level, because your do not have a lot of nearly equal levels.

Edit:
Now I see your have mode memory, I do not like that because then I do not known what level the light start in! (I hope the mode memory can be disable in the options).


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## juplin (May 19, 2008)

8% of lowest low will be the nightmare


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## LED-holic (May 19, 2008)

Nice actual photos. Thanks for posting them.

I like the HA III clickly. Only question is - does it affect water resistance?

The UI seems very interesting and useful. But a video / youtube link for the UI will be very useful in the place of a complex instruction manual.

I compared the body of the NDI to this light and still find the relative straight lines of the NDI to be "prettier". The two grooves / indentations don't appeal to me as much visually.


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## swxb12 (May 19, 2008)

If the 8% mode can be adjusted to .2%, goodbye NDI. :devil:


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## adnj (May 19, 2008)

I just noticed that the LF3 (cr123) and LF5 (AA) are both about 20 mm diameter heads. Any chance that these could have interchangeable bodies? They all use the same difusers. I would really enjoy a chance to use a CR2/CR123/AA/14500 at will. 

How about a CPF Special Offering with a bunch of options linke Lumapower did? Maybe with a lanyard, holster, OP and smooth reflector.


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## BabyDoc (May 19, 2008)

Do I really need another gadget AA light? In most discussions regarding the Novatac P120, most people just set the modes and forget it; some just use the defaults. Is this the ultimate AA light? Maybe, but in my limited experience here, not for long. 9 months ago, everyone just had to have a Novatac p120, 6 months ago the NDI. Unless the R2 is blindingly brighter or offers extremely long runtimes, or has a tint and beam to die for, I doubt this light, regardless of price, would interest me enough to give up my NDI as an EDC. But then again, I gave up the Novatac for the NDI when that didn't make sense. I sure wish I didn't have this problem.


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## Hogokansatsukan (May 19, 2008)

:bow:


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## flex76italy (May 19, 2008)

i don't know if i read well the instructions, but if i'm in the mode 2, and i want to return in mode 1...i need to go forward in steps? No other chances?

Thanks.


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## Gunner12 (May 19, 2008)

Nice! Looks really nice but sounds complicated, but then the Novatac and HDS sounded complicated too but many people say it's easy to use.

I'd love to be able to own one, how about sending me one for testing  ?

Any reviews yet?


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## 2xTrinity (May 19, 2008)

> Why is the lowest 8%? 7800hz PWM why can't we get a lower brightness level? 0.2% on LF2X is one reason its great.


Agreed. The 0.2% low on the LF2x is its single greatest feature IMO. It would be a shame to be limited to only 8% as a max.



> It would also be nice if the adjustment of the light levels was logarithmic, i.e. not like 10%, 11%, 12%, 13%, 14%, 15% but more like 10%, 14%, 20%, 28%, 40%. (I used a factor 1.4, but maybe lower factor would be better).
> It gives fewer steps, but makes it faster to adjust the light level, because your do not have a lot of nearly equal levels.


QFT. 

This is my #1 gripe with the liteflux lights, particularly the twisty based ones where programming involves leaving a twisty in a certain position for a set period of time to set the output.

With a linear sweep, the output changes way too rapidly on the low end, and way too slowly on the high end. A log sweep would be a major improvement. Preferably, this would be accomplished by still keeping the full 512 levels, and simply changing the time interval between them in the programming mode, but if it was necessary, I'd be willing to give up a fair number of "in beteween" levels to get log brightness increases in programming mode.



> i don't know if i read well the instructions, but if i'm in the mode 2, and i want to return in mode 1...i need to go forward in steps? No other chances?
> 
> Thanks.


Sounds like it. That would be a good thing to find out though. One of the things that is basically a requirement for me to buy a light from now on is direct access to the highest and lowest levels without haivng to "skip through" other levels. If the light doesn't allow that, I'd probably end up using it as a simple two-stage, ie, a moderately low output for the default setting, then simply using the momentary "press-and-hold" high as necessary. 

BTW -- that momentary press and hold for max output is a great idea, as generally I find I don't need constant high output anyway, and that would be a great way to conserve battery power.



> I would really enjoy a chance to use a CR2/CR123/AA/14500 at will.


Another interesting idea. An option to run a CR2 as opposed to a AA and enjoy a shorter overall package would be a nice feature. I believe the CR2 is roughly the same diameter as the AA, so that's probably the safest bet for interchangeability. But for that matter even selling something like a 2xAA tube would be pretty intersting, for people who wanted super runtime. As long as the head can accomodate the range of voltages, and tubes of varying length with the right threads on them are available, there's little reason that shouldn't work.

The only problem Ican think of with supporting 2xAA is the way that the logic works on the Liteflux series is that it detects whether the voltage is above 2v, then automatically assumes the user is running LiIons and sets the voltage cutoffs according, so that would probably not work.


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## russtang (May 19, 2008)

Looks interesting for sure.


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## simple (May 19, 2008)

Runtimes at 100%, 50% and 8%? With AA lights I always look at the efficiency first.


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## bexamous (May 19, 2008)

Argh! Someone else pointed out memory mode. PLEASE NO! LOL PLEASEEE... how about a way to disable? Low voltage cutoff on LF2-X for example... do like 20 clicks and be able to turn off memory mode?!

LF2-X is by far the most perfect light I have... LF5XT could be the same!!! 8% and memory mode almost ruin it for me... I'd almost be happier with current Jet1 IBS :/.

Not directly on topic but does anyone like memory mode in general? I've always been bugged by it. If I use the flashlight 99% of the time I don't remember the last mode I left it in... basically meaning I have no idea what mode it will be in when I turn it on. I don't get how this is a feature?

With no memory mode you always know mode1=1click mode2=2clicks mode3=3clicks... you can automatically go to the mode you want... with memory mode you have to turn it on and see the light to know what mode your in and then switch to whatver you want. The only way this can save you time is if you reuse the same mode over and over... and if this is the case then why not just set that mode as mode1?


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## NetKidz (May 19, 2008)

2xTrinity said:


> Agreed. The 0.2% low on the LF2x is its single greatest feature IMO. It would be a shame to be limited to only 8% as a max.


Seems not intended to limited at 8% min. LiteFlux changed the circuit, there's voltage regulation at the LED side (Output capacitor?) and make it couldn't go down to very low. I don't know much about the electronics, and couldn't figure why. 




> With a linear sweep, the output changes way too rapidly on the low end, and way too slowly on the high end. A log sweep would be a major improvement. Preferably, this would be accomplished by still keeping the full 512 levels, and simply changing the time interval between them in the programming mode, but if it was necessary, I'd be willing to give up a fair number of "in beteween" levels to get log brightness increases in programming mode.


There're 256 levels. LF5XT has both logarithmic and linear adjustment. You could use logarithmic adjustment to quickly jump to the level you want, and use linear adjustment to slight adjust the output level if needed.




> Sounds like it. That would be a good thing to find out though. One of the things that is basically a requirement for me to buy a light from now on is direct access to the highest and lowest levels without haivng to "skip through" other levels. If the light doesn't allow that, I'd probably end up using it as a simple two-stage, ie, a moderately low output for the default setting, then simply using the momentary "press-and-hold" high as necessary.


One feature Khoo didn't mention is LF5XT could configure how many mode you want to enable (max 5, of course). I like a two-mode light, I could enable only two modes and configure them like 15% and 50%. If I need max output, I could access 100% easily by press and hold. :twothumbs


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## 2xTrinity (May 19, 2008)

NetKidz said:


> Seems not intended to limited at 8% min. LiteFlux changed the circuit, there's voltage regulation at the LED side (Output capacitor?) and make it couldn't go down to very low. I don't know much about the electronics, and couldn't figure why.


If this is true then that's a reasonable tradeoff -- this graph will illustate the reason for the 8% cutoff:






At moderately low drive current,s constant current is much more efficient than PWM. Let's say the max setting on this light on a LiIon is 800mA -- that means at the lowest setting (30mA) the light would be 60% more efficient as a constant current light, than if it were PWM. However, at extremely low drive currents, LEDs get inherently less efficient, and begin to color shift so for these very low levels like 0.2%, PWM is more efficient. I'm guessing 8% corresponds to 30mA drive current, demonstrate to be the efficiency peak in the graph above. 

Ideally, one woudl design a light that would be CC down to 30mA, and then PWM AT 30mA for lower levels, but that would require some very complicated circuitry.

However, in the initial post the light is still advertizing 7800Hz PWM, NOT current regulation as I would expect based on this latest update.



> One feature Khoo didn't mention is LF5XT could configure how many mode you want to enable (max 5, of course). I like a two-mode light, I could enable only two modes and configure them like 15% and 50%. If I need max output, I could access 100% easily by press and hold.


Wow, that's pretty much ideal then. I personally would probably go for 8%/30%, with 100% burst. If the light is current regulated, those lower levels will be extremely efficient -- on a 14500 LiIon where there should be effectively no driver losses, the light should be producing well in excess of 100 torch lumens/watt, or 12-15 lumens for ~30 hours. On a AA Eneloop, with 75% efficient boost driver, I'd expect runtime of about 16 hours for the same amount of output.


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## LED Cool (May 19, 2008)

Netkidz is right!

the LF5XT has both logarithmic and linear adjustment for the brightness setting. Logarithmic to quickly jump to the level you want, and use linear adjustment for macro adjustment to the exact output level % desired.

YES! time to reveal the special function which i think may make the LF5XT the ultimate AA light. this function is unprecedented in any flashlight that i know of. 

as i have mentioned in post #1, the LF5XT has 5 operation modes. BUT, the user can select how many operation modes that he/she prefers for his/her LF5XT!

yes! you can have the LF5XT as a 1 operation mode light, with the output set to low. everytime you turn on your LF5XT, it is on low. no strobe or SOS to cycle through.

or you can select your LF5XT to have 2 operation modes, or 3 operation modes.

minimum operation mode is one.
maximum operation mode is five.

isn't this function brilliant! 
khoo


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## xcel730 (May 19, 2008)

Wow, this sounds awesome. It'll essentially replace all my AA lights. 

Any timeframe of when it's going to be for sale?


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## Nake (May 19, 2008)

Can all five modes be set for steady light levels of brightness or do two of them have to be SOS and beacon?


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## gadgetnerd (May 19, 2008)

Things are really looking up in the AA torch world! Hopefully an AA torch being manufactured to HDS/Novatac standard. I can't wait for this one to be released. If they can somehow nail a 0.2% low (and a nice beam profile) then this would relegate all of my AA torches to drawer purgatory.


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## LED-holic (May 19, 2008)

The special function sounds like a winner to me.


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## Gunner12 (May 19, 2008)

Do you know the price for this light?


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## Crenshaw (May 19, 2008)

so i am right, its the same as the novatac switch...interesting...more then a passing resemblence to the NDI, but also the ability to chose how many modes you want is interesting! liteflux seems to be cramming more programability into thier lights then any other brand, yet, keeping the UI simple after youve finished programming. bravo!

Crenshaw


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## 2xTrinity (May 19, 2008)

Nake said:


> Can all five modes be set for steady light levels of brightness or do two of them have to be SOS and beacon?


Yes, the initial post actually states that you can have 5 different brightnesses, or evne 5 different strobe modes if you really wanted to. The really cool feature of this though, IMO, if that you can actually choose to have less than 5 modes if you want to. You coudl even make your light a one-stage medium output, and then have the click-and-hold feature for a momentary burst of maximum output.

IMO a good next step for liteflux would be to make a compact 18650 light with this interface, and a SSC P7 emitter. There's a huge vacuum of good EDC-able 18650 lights.


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## xcel730 (May 19, 2008)

Crenshaw, sounds to me like you'll be changing the picture of your signature soon. 



Crenshaw said:


> so i am right, its the same as the novatac switch...interesting...more then a passing resemblence to the NDI, but also the ability to chose how many modes you want is interesting! liteflux seems to be cramming more programability into thier lights then any other brand, yet, keeping the UI simple after youve finished programming. bravo!
> 
> Crenshaw


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## TooManyGizmos (May 19, 2008)

..
:welcome: ..... But HIDE your wallet ............


THIS one has got MY attention

:wow::goodjob:


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## Crenshaw (May 19, 2008)

xcel730 said:


> Crenshaw, sounds to me like you'll be changing the picture of your signature soon.



its actually _already _outdated....carrying an AAA is so much easier on the pocket...guess which brand i carry now ... 



although, i do have to say one thing, i am not crazy about liteflux in general in terms of aesthetics....

Crenshaw


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## bob110011 (May 19, 2008)

LED Cool said:


> Netkidz is right!
> 
> YES! time to reveal the special function ....
> 
> ...


 
Absolutely brilliant is right, Khoo. Liteflux engineers have read my mind. All I personally need is a high and maybe a low, but mostly just a high. The LF5XT lets me choose. Outstanding.

I must have one.....


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## Crenshaw (May 19, 2008)

khoo, it just occured to me to ask, do you know if the electronics are in the head? as in, all the programming, or is it combined with the tail? cos if its in the head, and the head is lego-able...:huh:

Crenshaw


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## arty (May 19, 2008)

After reading all the good reviews about the LF2X - I sent a Paypal to LEd Cool for one yesterday afternoon. I liked the LF2 SSC I got, and wanted one of the new hot-rod models.
I haven't had any response yet to postings or an email.
Is this unusual, or is he often overloaded with orders?
Are these lights that popular right now?


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## bob110011 (May 19, 2008)

Don't worry arty, Khoo will get back to you.


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## Thujone (May 19, 2008)

arty said:


> After reading all the good reviews about the LF2X - I sent a Paypal to LEd Cool for one yesterday afternoon. I liked the LF2 SSC I got, and wanted one of the new hot-rod models.
> I haven't had any response yet to postings or an email.
> Is this unusual, or is he often overloaded with orders?
> Are these lights that popular right now?



Khoo updates his shipment and acknowledgment posts within a couple days, and remember he is on the other side of the marble. It is likely in the mail and he will update the thread when convenient.


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## WadeF (May 19, 2008)

Looks great! I want it.


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## jabe1 (May 19, 2008)

I'm new here, but this thing is on my want list. why doesn't someone use this switching in a larger light?


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## NetKidz (May 19, 2008)

Crenshaw said:


> khoo, it just occured to me to ask, do you know if the electronics are in the head? as in, all the programming, or is it combined with the tail? cos if its in the head, and the head is lego-able...:huh:
> 
> Crenshaw



The electronics are all in the head, and there's only one tact switch in the tail. But I think it may not be easy to transfer the head to other body. It needs two electric paths, one is for the actual driving current and another is for the signal (tact switch).

That's why LF5XT has additional inner brass tube. It's the main current path and the outer tube is for signal. The good news is the switch should stay long before failure since there's no "huge" current to pass through. 

BTW, you must load the battery from the head side.


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## gunga (May 19, 2008)

OMG, i need to get at least 1 or 2 of these. The anodizing/finish looks a bit smooth for my tastes (like the Lf2x) but the features are amazing. I think i will set to 3 or 4 modes.

Yep, Paypal ready to go on these!

WOW! I always wanted an AA Novatac that didn't cost so much. I think it's here!

:twothumbs


EDIT: DId not see the 8% low threshold. Hmmm, not perfect. Still I do like it overall, tho it lacks the low-low I expected...

:thinking:


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## adirondackdestroyer (May 19, 2008)

The UI looks perfect. My only complaint is that the bezel looks very sharp (like the NDI) and might make it uncomfortable to pocket carry.


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## Rat6P (May 19, 2008)

Looks Great. My version of the perfect EDC would be something that has some of the good points of a novatac...but in AA. This is looking pretty close.
One thing I would prefer is that it be tuned to run with Alks etc...not lithium rechargheables. ie a lower in put voltage than 1 would be perfect IMHO. But hey you cant have every thing.


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## frankr (May 20, 2008)

Anyone know how many lumen with a 14500 LiIon 100%?
How much does it cost?
And is there a link to the sales tread? (I see a link to the LF5, but not one to to a LF5XT)


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## TigerhawkT3 (May 20, 2008)

Higher bin AND a higher low... So, it'll be at least 10L? Ouch. Why is it that the previous programmable LF models (like my wonderful LF2) as well as the similar HDS and Novatac lights can go really low, while the LF5XT can't?

2xTrinity, I think that efficiency graph might only have data points down to 30mA, creating a false drop to 0 when a best-fit curve is applied. I'd bet that efficiency continues to increase as current drops below 30mA.

The 8% Low absolutely kills it for me. If I had to choose between the LF5XT and a Novatac, I'd go for the latter with no hesitation, even with the price difference.


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## 2xTrinity (May 20, 2008)

frankr said:


> Anyone know how many lumen with a 14500 LiIon 100%?
> How much does it cost?
> And is there a link to the sales tread? (I see a link to the LF5, but not one to to a LF5XT)


Looks like they're still in a release candidate phase and not ready to sell just yet. the first post shows "XXX" for the output current on both types of batteries, so the final outputs are yet to be determined. 

Since we know that the output voltage is going to be regulated, there is absolutely no harm in setting the output ot be as high as reasonably possible, especially on 14500 LiIon where no voltage boosting is necessary. In the case of a PWM light, setting a higher current draw on the max settings causes all the other lower settings to be less efficient because they still run that high current but at a reduced duty cycle. Not so with constant current output.

IMO, on the 14500 100% output should be one amp at the emitter with paper flat regulation - - this will mean drawing slighly under 1A from the cell to begin with, and slightly over 1A later on in the runtime. The cell can handle it, so the only limitation is the emitter, or possibly overheating issues. 

In the case of a NiMH input, I'd probalby pick the highest current at which the boost driver is still reasonably efficient -- since I have no idea how the driver performs, I can't give an suggestions here.

I can say at this time I will likely be purchasing this light when it becomes available, and I will update my LF2 comparison review to include if I get a hold of one.


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## LED Cool (May 20, 2008)

arty said:


> After reading all the good reviews about the LF2X - I sent a Paypal to LEd Cool for one yesterday afternoon. I liked the LF2 SSC I got, and wanted one of the new hot-rod models.
> I haven't had any response yet to postings or an email.
> Is this unusual, or is he often overloaded with orders?
> Are these lights that popular right now?



Hello arty,
received your PM, sorry for the late reply. your LF2X was shipped this morning because yesterday was a holiday. please see updated post in LF2X sales thread.

crenshaw,

the electronics is in the head just as what Netkidz said below

quote
"The electronics are all in the head, and there's only one tact switch in the tail. But I think it may not be easy to transfer the head to other body. It needs two electric paths, one is for the actual driving current and another is for the signal (tact switch).

That's why LF5XT has additional inner brass tube. It's the main current path and the outer tube is for signal. The good news is the switch should stay long before failure since there's no "huge" current to pass through. 

BTW, you must load the battery from the head side."


LiteFlux has informed me that the LED module is not sealed in the head, most, if not all, components of LF5XT can be disassemble by the user for cleaning and maintenance.


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## Kilovolt (May 20, 2008)

Khoo, when will this beauty be available for purchase? 

:wave:


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## LED Cool (May 20, 2008)

flex76italy said:


> i don't know if i read well the instructions, but if i'm in the mode 2, and i want to return in mode 1...i need to go forward in steps? No other chances?
> 
> Thanks.



yes, you have to go forward by performing 2xC to mode 3, then to mode 4, then to mode 5 then back to mode 1.

but remember, you can select the number of operation modes for your LF5XT!

If you selected 3 operation modes, then you just go, from mode 2, to mode 3 and then back to mode 1.

if you selected 2 operation modes, then performing 2xC will take you back to mode 1.

bexamous,
i see your point on the memory feature, lets see if LiteFlux can do anything about it.

nake,
all 5 operation modes can be set to steady light level with different brightness. no strobe or SOS or beacon if you do not want them at all! 
thank you 2xtrinity for answering on this question!

khoo


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## LED Cool (May 20, 2008)

and to cpf members who think the 8% low is too high (i know there are quite a few of you, myself included), LiteFlux explanation on the 8% low is because there is a different form of voltage regulation (like what Netkidz said) in the LED driver. i hope it is a better form of voltage regulation. finger crossed!

how this voltage regulation is different from previous LF series models' (LF2X, LF2, LF3, LF4, LF5) voltage regulation is still unclear to me.

LiteFlux did mentioned that if an oscilloscope is connected to both ends of the LED emitter, the scope screen will display a flat/flatter horizontal line. now i have yet to find out what this horizontal line represent. does it represent constant voltage or constant current or constant PWM frequency? anyone electronics expert here would like to chime in?

LiteFlux said, even when the display scale of the scope is enlarged, i.e. zoom in, the horizontal line would still remain flat, meaning one cannot see the step/wave of the PWM (the ON/OFF steps?). only at higher output will the horizontal line display the 7800Hz step/wave.

anyone can explain what this means?

anyway, LiteFlux said it is this form of voltage regulation that restrict the lowest low to 8%. any thing lower and the LED driver/MCU will shut off due to insufficient operating voltage for the MCU. (off topics, what is the minimum operating voltage of an MCU?)

in the mean time, i have communicated to LiteFlux about CPF members concern on the 8% lowest low. LiteFlux response is they will try their best to lower it by half to 4% if possible.

it is an undenying fact that HDS and Novatac can achieve a very low low. however, please bear in mind that they operate on CR123 power source which i think may have some contributing factors to their circuits' ability to go very low. 

I am not exactly sure what is the minimum input voltage of HDS and Novatac lights, (2.3V?) but the LF5XT must be able to operate on not only new AA battery (1.5v - 1.7V) but also on used AA battery (1.0V - 1.2V).

that is about half of the HDS/Novatac minimum input voltage. may be it is this low input voltage of the LF5XT that is causing trouble for the LED driver/MCU to achieve a lower low? I would appreciate if anyone can express their opinion on this speculation of mine.

thanks.
khoo


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## TooManyGizmos (May 20, 2008)

..
.. LED Cool ...........8% of what ?

What is the Max lumens rating on this light ?

I guess they mean 8% of the max it's capable of.
But what lumen value would that be for this light . Most folks would consider 2 to 4 lumens tolerable for LO-LO.:candle: Are they saying the lowest low will be somewhere around 10 to 18 lumens ?

Also , will the percieved maximum high output remain the same no-matter which battery type is used - or will 14500 battery make it visually brighter than alkaline ?

Thanks , TMG


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## StefanFS (May 20, 2008)

I think that this will replace my SSC P4 modded Liteflux LF1 as my 'always' light. I have tried a number of other AA lights, none have been able to replace my LF1 when it comes to reliability and quality. Especially reliability since they have all failed in operation fairly quickly.
Stefan


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## 2xTrinity (May 20, 2008)

> 2xTrinity, I think that efficiency graph might only have data points down to 30mA, creating a false drop to 0 when a best-fit curve is applied. I'd bet that efficiency continues to increase as current drops below 30mA.


Here is a link to the original thread I quoted from. The author repeatedly describes that those are true efficiency peaks, and even contains lengthy posts with comparisons between "efficiency peaks" on different emitters. .


Constant Current vs PWM Dimming 
This is another thread which confirms the phenomenon of PWM being more efficeint than Constant current for extremely low outputs. They indicate this explicitly with the following graph:







I belive this is for the old Luxeons, but a similar effect wil hold true for current Cree Emitters.

I was a bit skeptical about this myself, but actually tested this out myself with a DC power supply connected to an old Cree LED -- brightness definitely incerases disproportionately more than current when ramping up from 0-30mA.




> LiteFlux did mentioned that if an oscilloscope is connected to both ends of the LED emitter, the scope screen will display a flat/flatter horizontal line. now i have yet to find out what this horizontal line represent. does it represent constant voltage or constant current or constant PWM frequency? anyone electronics expert here would like to chime in


An oscilloscope measures voltage. A flat horizontal line will indicate a DC output, or a constant voltage across the LED. At reduced output the height of this line, or the voltage across the LED, will be lower.

This is unlike pulse width modluation, where at reduced output, you will actually see a square wave pattern on the oscilloscope as the light switches off and on rapidly, with longer "off" periods corresponding to lower light output.

Now, from an oscilloscope alone, you can't really tell if the LED is using constant-voltage, or constant-current regulation. Not all LEDs are equal, some run at inhernetly lower voltage than others, which mean if a light is voltage regulated, some LEDs will inerently run more current/more power than others, potenitally even overdriving them. Rrepots of wildly different runtimes among LF2 reviews suggests to me that the lights are voltage regulated. Current regulated would be better, as runtime and brightness will be consistent regardless of minor variations in the LEDs.



> LiteFlux said, even when the display scale of the scope is enlarged, i.e. zoom in, the horizontal line would still remain flat, meaning one cannot see the step/wave of the PWM (the ON/OFF steps?). only at higher output will the horizontal line display the 7800Hz step/wave.


This is to be expected. Basically the driver uses a filter to "flatten out" a pulse wave into constant DC voltage. At higher outputs, the capacitor isn't big enough to flatten this out completely, so there is some ripple in the. This ripple isn't significant for the performance of the light.



> anyway, LiteFlux said it is this form of voltage regulation that restrict the lowest low to 8%. any thing lower and the LED driver/MCU will shut off due to insufficient operating voltage for the MCU. (off topics, what is the minimum operating voltage of an MCU?)


This voltage likely has nothing to do with the input voltage, but the output voltage -- in the case of the PWM light, output voltage is alwas the same, it's just the on-off time that changes. In this light, the output voltage must go lower in order to reduce power. There's probably a minimum that the microcrontroller can handle.

The tradeoff here is that with constant current you lose the option of a low-low, but that the constant current light will be at least 60% more efficient on its low and medium settings. 



> it is an undenying fact that HDS and Novatac can achieve a very low low. however, please bear in mind that they operate on CR123 power source which i think may have some contributing factors to their circuits' ability to go very low.


The reason tht the HDS and Novatac (or other lights in the Liteflux series for that matter) can go so low is that they use unfiltered PWM, not filtered DC output.


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## NetKidz (May 20, 2008)

2xTrinity said:


> Looks like they're still in a release candidate phase and not ready to sell just yet. the first post shows "XXX" for the output current on both types of batteries, so the final outputs are yet to be determined.


The driving current for 14500 is 800mA and for other batteries is 500mA.




LED Cool said:


> and to cpf members who think the 8% low is too high (i know there are quite a few of you, myself included), LiteFlux explanation on the 8% low is because there is a different form of voltage regulation (like what Netkidz said) in the LED driver. i hope it is a better form of voltage regulation. finger crossed!
> 
> how this voltage regulation is different from previous LF series models' (LF2X, LF2, LF3, LF4, LF5) voltage regulation is still unclear to me.



Again, I don't know about electronics and couldn't explain why. 

There's a output capacitor (maybe also other components) at the LED side to keep the voltage to a steady value. The efficiency will be a little higher this way, but make the output couldn't go down to very low. If the capacitor was removed, the output could go down to very low like the old LF series, but lost a little efficiency. I think that's the trade-off.

LiteFlux is working on lowering the low by the programming way. I believe there'll be a solution. 



> (off topics, what is the minimum operating voltage of an MCU?)


The MCU is PIC12F683 if anyone is interested. It's same with other LF series.


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## whc (May 20, 2008)

This looks awesome, just what I have been waiting for, I definantly got to have one of these!


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## 2xTrinity (May 20, 2008)

NetKidz said:


> The driving current for 14500 is 800mA and for other batteries is 500mA.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



There is a way I thought about how lower output could be achieved. I'm not positivie it will work, but here's my idea:

dim the light in the normal by reducing the current to the lowest possible setting (say 8%). Then implement a software-based PWM at a much lower frequency than the main 7800Hz cycle, to reduce output further. Basically, think of it as a "strobe" mode that operates at a perhaps few hundred hertz, with a brightness of 8%. If you set _this_ PWM to say 5% duty cycle, that will correspond to a low of 0.4%.

The capacitor/filter is deisnged to smooth out high frequency 7800Hz pulses. Much lower frequency pulses will still pass right through. If you could implement this, it would allow lower dimming _while still preserving peak LED efficiency at the the lowest levels_ -- so you get both the benefits of the PWM (low-low) and the benefits of the filtered DC designs (higher efficiency overall). The only drwback is that there will be visible strobing when looking at moving objects on the very lowest settings. 

But hey, a somewhat flickery low-low is still better than NO low low, and the user can always choose not to program that setting in if they don't like it


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## paulr (May 20, 2008)

LED Cool said:


> the LF5XT is the first AA light to use an electronic tack switch with MCU controlled user interface.


 Nah, the Nitecore was like that too, tactical and computerized. The LRI Proton Pro wasn't tactically styled however it was also computerized. IMO these lights all have way too much digital crap in them and I don't like those silly, pants shredding tactical bezels. If this is the ultimate AA light then we're all doomed .


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## Crenshaw (May 20, 2008)

paulr said:


> Nah, the Nitecore was like that too, tactical and computerized. The LRI Proton Pro wasn't tactically styled however it was also computerized. IMO these lights all have way too much digital crap in them and I don't like those silly, pants shredding tactical bezels. If this is the ultimate AA light then we're all doomed .


actually no, the only other light to use that kind of swtich that i am aware of are the novatac lights.

Crenshaw


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## adnj (May 20, 2008)

I am NOT interested in memory mode... tough to train to use it that way.


bexamous said:


> Not directly on topic but does anyone like memory mode in general? I've always been bugged by it. If I use the flashlight 99% of the time I don't remember the last mode I left it in... basically meaning I have no idea what mode it will be in when I turn it on. I don't get how this is a feature?
> 
> With no memory mode you always know mode1=1click mode2=2clicks mode3=3clicks... you can automatically go to the mode you want... with memory mode you have to turn it on and see the light to know what mode your in and then switch to whatver you want.


----------



## this_is_nascar (May 20, 2008)

I have to agree with some of the others. I'd rather see this light just be an AA version of the LF2X. The LF2X low-mode in a 1 x AAA based light is the ONLY reason I even own, not to mention carry, the LF2X. If this new light can not achieve that level of low light, I have no need for it.


----------



## enLIGHTenment (May 20, 2008)

A few questions and comments:

What happens if the user presses and holds the switch when the light is off? Will it come on immediately (as if clicked) and then switch to full brightness after .4 seconds?

It would be nice if the click-and-hold brightness setting was programmable rather than fixed at full brightness.

Is the reflector easily removable/upgradeable? Some people might prefer a smooth reflector to orange peal. In my case I'd be interested in replacing the reflector with a TIR optic.


----------



## PhantomPhoton (May 20, 2008)

Overall it sounds pretty good to me. I'll probably end up buying one (at least). Hopefully we can get the output down a bit more 8% is a bit high. It could definitely be worse. Good to hear LF is trying to address our concerns.
I would also like to see a LF5X just like the LF2X. I never got an original LF5. 

Thanks for the expanations 2xTrinity. I think I almost understand now.


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## LED Cool (May 20, 2008)

paulr said:


> Nah, the Nitecore was like that too, tactical and computerized. The LRI Proton Pro wasn't tactically styled however it was also computerized. IMO these lights all have way too much digital crap in them and I don't like those silly, pants shredding tactical bezels. If this is the ultimate AA light then we're all doomed .



Hi paulr,

my statement "the LF5XT is the first AA light to use an electronic tack switch with MCU controlled user interface." was referring to the combination of an electronic tack switch and an MCU UI in an AA light. i have seen a Nitecore infinity AA and it does not have an electronic tack switch. i don't own and have not seen a LRI Photon Pro, so i do not know if it has an electronic tack switch.

the only lights that i know of that uses a tack switch are HDS & NOVATAC lights. may be the ARC 4 as well. and all of them uses CR123 or at least 2 pcs of AA.


enLIGHTenment,

with the momentary-on function turned OFF and the light off,
a click *(1xC)* will turn on the light at the last used operation mode.

a press & hold *(PH)* will give you 100% brightness. release the button and the light will go off.

a click + a press & hold *(1xC+PH)* will give you random strobe at 100% brightness. release the button and the light will go off.

with the momentary-on function turned ON and the light off,
a click *(1xC)* will turn on the light at the last used operation mode.

a press & hold *(PH)* will give you the last used operation mode. release the button and the light will go off.

*(PH)* is fixed to give you 100% brightness. it cannot be changed. reflector is removeable, but currently there is only OP reflector available.

hope that is clear.

and to confirm one more info already mentioned by Netkidz,

when using alkaline or NIMH, the LED current is approximately 500ma. and when using 14500 Li-Ion, the LED current is approximately 800ma.

khoo


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## simple (May 20, 2008)

2xTrinity said:


> If this is true then that's a reasonable tradeoff -- this graph will illustate the reason for the 8% cutoff:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
I've tried constant current drive as low as 4mA and the CREE worked better than PWMing at 1% of 400mA. I'm guessing in the graph 30mA seems to be the efficiency peak because the tester happened to start testing from 30mA and didn't test at lower currents.


----------



## Thujone (May 20, 2008)

LED Cool said:


> it is an undenying fact that HDS and Novatac can achieve a very low low. however, please bear in mind that they operate on CR123 power source which i think may have some contributing factors to their circuits' ability to go very low.



Fine, then allow .2% on 14500 cells, and 8% on aa cell. Have a similar cell detect process like the novatac. where you do a soft reset with a fresh cell and the light will learn what mode it is in. You have to understand that 8% low even 4% low will kill the major advantage that LF has in this market...


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## victor01 (May 20, 2008)

I'm stunned. This might be my next "high powered" light after LF2 XR-E I regularly carry


Edit
 
I've just spent my money on the Nitecore D10 pre-order
for not being able to resist such features AND price point.


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## cat (May 20, 2008)

The more I read about, the more I realise that the only solution for me is a Surefire with a Malkoff module and maybe a 2-stage circuit in the tailcap. I don't need .3 or 3 lumens low Low level, and I don't need complicated electronic switching. 
Otherwise, this sounds great, except for the mode memory.


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## LED Cool (May 20, 2008)

hello cat,

the LF5XT came be customize to become a single stage light. click on the light at 30%, press & hold will give you 100% output.

or it can be customize to become a 2 stage light. click on at 25%, double click to 50%, double click back to 25%. press & hold to get 100%.

once you have customized it, it is easy to operate.

your concern and other CPF members' opinion on the memory mode is noted. we will see if LiteFlux can do anything about it.

khoo


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## adnj (May 20, 2008)

I would like to be able to disable memory mode. I will never use it, but the ROM would need some possibly tricky programming: if MODE VARIABLE is OFF then LAST MODE = MODE 1 . Do you even have an available register to handle the value?


LED Cool said:


> hello cat,
> 
> the LF5XT came be customize to become a single stage light. click on the light at 30%, press & hold will give you 100% output.
> 
> ...


----------



## whc (May 20, 2008)

Any date for when it will be avalible?


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## BabyDoc (May 20, 2008)

I hope as much attention is being paid to the beam quality and emitter tint in the LiteFlux LF5xt as is being paid to the user interface. No matter how neat this user interface may be, it will be disappointing if the beam and tint aren't ahead of the other AA lights already out there. What made the Novatac so revolutionary in the CR123 format, wasn't just its programmability. It was also ahead of most of the competition with its more beautiful beam.


----------



## sclemin1 (May 20, 2008)

Memory mode ruins it for me, it will stop me from purchasing this.
Other than that, it looks great!


Edit 05/26/2008
Ok, now that memory mode can be switched off I will order 2 of these to start.

I hope they are available soon, good job!


----------



## regulator (May 20, 2008)

I like the inovative switch design of the new LF5 - nice job. Unfortunately I do not really care for the appearance. I do not like the sharp looking strike bezel and do not like all the different body dimensions. I prefer a more simple design with nice knurling. I really like my LF2X and would also like to have seen a "pocket" AA light similar to this but with maybe more knurling. IMO a small AA size light is more of a pocket light than a defense tool.

Anyways, it does have some interesting features.


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## LED-holic (May 20, 2008)

So far it seems like this is a great light, with the following features that could be improved:

1. No memory feature
2. lower low
3. more of a straighter body like the LF2X / NDI

Item 1 could be a deal breaker for me. Item 2 and 3 are things I could possibly live with.


----------



## LED Cool (May 20, 2008)

:thinking: hmm... i am puzzled as to why there are significant resistance to the memory feature..

from my reading of CPF members posts and threads all these years, it is my understanding that CPF members prefer memory feature in their multi-mode flashlight. if there is no memory feature in a multi-mode flashlight, most CPF members would complain about it.

most of the flashlight launched in 2007 and 2008 has memory feature and i do not recall there were any complains against the memory feature in those flashlights. why the sudden turn around now? :shrug:

has memory feature become a negative feature of multi-mode flashlight? 

your input would be appreciated.

thanks.
khoo


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## regulator (May 20, 2008)

I am one who prefers to have a memory mode. I like being able to set the mode I want the light to come on in and also change it when desired. I thought most like the memory feature and am suprised some do not like it.


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## Crenshaw (May 20, 2008)

khoo, dont worry too much about it, theres too many of us to satisfy everyone anyway.  as you can see, some people have already stated they want the light as is. Its just our nature to suggest alot of things for a new light.

Crenshaw


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## jabe1 (May 20, 2008)

*WHAT DOES IT COST!!??
*when and where can this be purchased?


----------



## Burgess (May 20, 2008)

Sounds Great !


Waiting for more details, *and CPF reviews* of this fine flashlight.


:twothumbs

_


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## NetKidz (May 21, 2008)

LED Cool said:


> :thinking: hmm... i am puzzled as to why there are significant resistance to the memory feature..



Khoo, no need to worry now. 

Kudos to the designer at LiteFlux. He re-wrote the codes, squeezed the space and inserted a new configuration setting to switch the memory feature on/off. (Function Setting Mode No.5)

:twothumbs


----------



## TooManyGizmos (May 21, 2008)

NetKidz said:


> Khoo, no need to worry now.
> 
> Kudos to the designer at LiteFlux. He re-wrote the codes, squeezed the space and inserted a new configuration setting to switch the memory feature on/off. (Function Setting Mode No.5)
> 
> :twothumbs



WOW NetKidz ,

Is that for real ????

If so , it's great news for all. If the bugs are worked out.

Now it does everything - and could make everyone happy !

* I volunteer to take the first one in natural color !

Just tell me where to send the PayPal and it's done.* 

Why can't we be told when these will be avail. for order ?

You got our attention .... now let's "get-er-done'.
.


----------



## 2xTrinity (May 21, 2008)

LED Cool said:


> :thinking: hmm... i am puzzled as to why there are significant resistance to the memory feature..


Because of memory mode, when you go to turn a light on, you most likely won't know what the current "remembered" setting is. I wouldn't want to reach for a light, expecting it to start up at its minimum setting, and instead have it come on at full blast (because that was the level I last used) and wipe out my night vision. On lights that did have memory, I usually found myself actually taking extra time to switch the light back to low BEFORE turning it off so that it would always predictably begin at the same point in the sequence. That extra step can be a nuisance.



> from my reading of CPF members posts and threads all these years, it is my understanding that CPF members prefer memory feature in their multi-mode flashlight. if there is no memory feature in a multi-mode flashlight, most CPF members would complain about it.


With all the other features of this light, memory is even less attractive than it would be in a "purely" sequential UI. I think most of the people who wanted it in the past were those who wanted to be able to choose where the starting position on the sequence was. But in a programmable light, where the user can customize every position to their likink, they can do that already in a much more elegant way! There are very few cases where I'd want to go to a medium setting immediately. Most of the time I would want to start on high, OR on low. With the LF5XT I can start on low by setting that to my default setting 1, and access high using the click-and-hold feature.


----------



## Lumenz (May 21, 2008)

I would definitely want a lower low as well. 8% of a 150 lumen light is 12 lumens, which is brighter than the brightest Arc-AAA available right now. 

I cannot understand why anybody would want a flashlight that remembers the last setting that was used. Even though the flashlight might remember what brightness I used last, I certainly won't. Plus, I might not want the last setting I used last unless I am always in the same environment at the same time whenever I use the flashlight. If that were the case, I wouldn't need a programmable flashlight.

I already have an LF2X and a Novatac. In order to purchase this light, there would have to be two changes:

1. Lower low
2. No memory


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## LED Cool (May 21, 2008)

NetKidz said:


> Khoo, no need to worry now.
> 
> Kudos to the designer at LiteFlux. He re-wrote the codes, squeezed the space and inserted a new configuration setting to switch the memory feature on/off. (Function Setting Mode No.5)
> 
> :twothumbs



:wow: that is indeed good news! yeah! thank you Netkidz. :wave:

and thank you LiteFlux for accommodating almost every CPF'er wishes! :grouphug: :thanks: :twothumbs
LiteFlux designer really deserve a pat on the back.:goodjob: it must have required some intense brain storming to squeeze in the new codes into the limited storage inside the MCU. well done!  cheers!

it is also my understanding that the lowest low has been revised to 2%, not 8%. again :goodjob: :thumbsup: :bow:

well, looks like the UI of LF5XT is 99% perfect! 
time to party!  :buddies:and celebrate the birth of the ultimate AA light.

 got a little carried away here. 

khoo


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## xcel730 (May 21, 2008)

I like the memory mode. I usually find myself using the same mode most of the time. 

However, if will be nice to have an option for "force setting", which is one of the neat features in my Novatac 120P. I could select which output I want to start everytime I turn my flashlight on, or have it with memory mode. I'm not sure if you could incorporate that or not.


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## TooManyGizmos (May 21, 2008)

..
:twothumbs .. khoo ,

Time to UP-date the details of the OP with the NEW changes.

That's also great news about the low being dropped to 2% too. 

Since you won't let us order these yet or give a clue - I have to assume these are still in the R&D design-testing stages and won't be ready for months.

I hope you make the first run in the Natural color rather than Black.

How many months is it gonna be ...... khoo ?

Thanks


----------



## xcel730 (May 21, 2008)

Pretty funny, on the general discussion board, it just so happens that there's a discussion of why Fenix doesn't have memory mode. Here's a lot of other member's opinion. https://www.candlepowerforums.com/posts/2486415#post2486415


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## marcdilnutt (May 21, 2008)

This is sounding good, i hope the 2 percent low stays and i just want to add a +1 to losing the memory mode. That would really annoy me. I want to know what mode my light will be in when i pick it up, and to be able to set that mode to very very low.


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## 2xTrinity (May 21, 2008)

LED Cool said:


> ...
> 
> well, looks like the UI of LF5XT is 99% perfect!
> time to party!  :buddies:and celebrate the birth of the ultimate AA light.



Yeah, excellent job on the part of the Liteflux team. This sounds like a great light. I love to see the responsiveness adn willingness to take suggestions. Liteflux is definitely one of my favorite manufacturers 

Now that this UI is nearly perfected, IMO sometime in the future Liteflux should consider using it in a new light with the following features:

1) Use LF5XT driver board/UI
2) Compact 18650 or not much larger than the size of the battery
3) SSC P7 Emitter.
4) Optional tube for 18500 -- this is the same size as a AA/14500, but 4mm fatter, and with more than double the energy capacity. With this tube the light should be no longer than the LF5XT, only "fatter".

This woudl totally unlike any product that I know of right now, and I can imagine a large number of CPFers would be willing to shell out a fair amount of cash for one. There's a huge absence of small 18650 lights, and a lot of people on these forums have wanted them. 

Light output woudl be a wide flood, similar to the LF2-SSC. Lumens could exceed 600 on high, or the light coudl be made to produce ~10 lumens for a week continuously, or anywhere in between -- user's choice.


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## gunga (May 21, 2008)

Oh wow, turning off memory and lower low?!

Sweet. Yep, I need to get one of each colour to see what I like, and likely keep BOTH!

This is sweet. I always thought the LF# series had really cool features but was not a big fan of the 2 main modes only and twisty programming interface. I also found a lot of battery bounce in the CR123 and AA models. Hopefully they beefed up the springs a bit.

This, is wicked! Still not a big fan of the crenulated bezel and need more agressive knurling with less slippery finish (the LF2x is like a wet bar of soap) but I can live with it.

:devil:


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## bexamous (May 21, 2008)

no memory mode, lower low? still one problem though, no pre-order link... i'd get that one fixed.


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## LED-holic (May 21, 2008)

Wow, SWEET!! We can have our pie and eat it too!!!!!

Oh so looking forward to owning this light now.


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## 7Freeman (May 21, 2008)

*"WHAT DOES IT COST!!??
*when and where can this be purchased?"
+1


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## TigerhawkT3 (May 21, 2008)

Thanks for the link, 2xTrinity. Good stuff. 

Great job on cutting down the Low to 2%! :thumbsup: Um... can you get it any lower? 2% is still ten times higher than the previous series' 0.2%.

I agree, 18650 and P7 (properly driven, of course) would be sweeeeeeeet. Of course, Low would have to be an even smaller percentage, like 0.02% or something crazy like that.


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## gadgetnerd (May 21, 2008)

BabyDoc said:


> I hope as much attention is being paid to the beam quality and emitter tint in the LiteFlux LF5xt as is being paid to the user interface. No matter how neat this user interface may be, it will be disappointing if the beam and tint aren't ahead of the other AA lights already out there. What made the Novatac so revolutionary in the CR123 format, wasn't just its programmability. It was also ahead of most of the competition with its more beautiful beam.



+1

With all of the work going on to bring a low low, programmability, memory on/off etc, a perfect beam the LF would definitely just about make this an AA Novatac/HDS (which incidentally predates the Novatac for beam perfection and pragrammability).


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## adnj (May 21, 2008)

Memory was a great feature when there was no reprogrammable level functionality. Liteflux (and others) changed that. Now I can set the levels that I want. Reprogamming the levels makes the memory mode kind of redundant. 

Before user selectable levels (because of the memory feature), I kind of did the same thing by just letting the light stay on for two seconds so it would power-on in the mode that I wanted most.

I think that some will really like it but we may as well have the option to turn it off. I would insist on that option for my three lights. 

BTW I just read post #166 - Count me in for a purchase. 
And kudos to 2xTrinity: I believe that we said the same thing.

But don't forget the OP and smooth relector along with a CR123 body as a CPF special package. I'll open a vein and send a pint of blood for that!



LED Cool said:


> :thinking: hmm... i am puzzled as to why there are significant resistance to the memory feature..
> 
> from my reading of CPF members posts and threads all these years, it is my understanding that CPF members prefer memory feature in their multi-mode flashlight. if there is no memory feature in a multi-mode flashlight, most CPF members would complain about it.
> 
> ...


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## cat (May 21, 2008)

Thanks, LED Cool. 

The option on the memory feature is great, although Crenshaw is right, and you're right - some like it and some don't. But having it as an option is good. 



BabyDoc said:


> I hope as much attention is being paid to the beam quality and emitter tint in the LiteFlux LF5xt as is being paid to the user interface. No matter how neat this user interface may be, it will be disappointing if the beam and tint aren't ahead of the other AA lights already out there.



At least no "LED lottery" like SF. I don't mind if it's not better than everything else. There don't seem to be many - or any - complaints about Fenix beam patterns and tints. Then again, I got the Rebel P3D with the warmer tint, that so many prefer.


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## adnj (May 21, 2008)

Fenix isn't programmable. Memory mode is a poor man's version of level programming, IMHO.


xcel730 said:


> Pretty funny, on the general discussion board, it just so happens that there's a discussion of why Fenix doesn't have memory mode. Here's a lot of other member's opinion. https://www.candlepowerforums.com/posts/2486415#post2486415


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## Crenshaw (May 21, 2008)

cat said:


> Then again, I got the Rebel P3D with the warmer tint, that so many prefer.


what an atrocity! you should send it to me straight away..:nana:

Crenshaw


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## clintb (May 21, 2008)

Wow!

- selectable memory mode
- configure it for how many presets *I* want
- 2% low

Someone wake me, I must be dreaming. Sign me up for one of each color.


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## 83Venture (May 21, 2008)

My Proton Pro does everything I really need in an AA light, but this is just so user configurable I may have to get it anyway. Plus my LF2 has been so useful I have a good opinion of the LiteFlux line. :twothumbs


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## momonbubu (May 21, 2008)

Khoo,...

When.? When.? When.? .............................

ETA please.? 


Giandi


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## HKJ (May 21, 2008)

I would like to:

I believe this could be my favorite AA flashlight!


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## flex76italy (May 21, 2008)

This light need still something :thinking:...oh yes, a temperature sensor...otherwise it is not the ultimate AA light! :devil:


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## Rogerg (May 21, 2008)

This looks very good as it can be programed to please almost anyone.
I will be saving to purchase your LF5XT to go with my trusty HDS and LF2.
Thank you for all your effort.
Roger


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## BabyDoc (May 21, 2008)

flex76italy said:


> This light need still something :thinking:...oh yes, a temperature sensor...otherwise it is not the ultimate AA light! :devil:


 
Now why couldn't Novatac just put their interface and features into a AA light? It sounds like LiteFlux is reinventing the wheel that Novatac already designed for the CR123s. Almost every feature people are asking for is already included in the Novatac p120, including a thermal sensor, on/off memory feature, reset for different battery types, forced modes, etc. IMO, the ultimate programmable light has been made already; Novatac just needs to resize it for AA. Besides, Novatac already knows how to get it right with the beam, something LiteFlux will probably need to learn to do.


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## gadgetnerd (May 21, 2008)

BabyDoc said:


> Now why couldn't Novatac just put their interface and features into a AA light? It sounds like LiteFlux is reinventing the wheel that Novatac already designed for the CR123s. Almost every feature people are asking for is already included in the Novatac p120, including a thermal sensor, on/off memory feature, reset for different battery types, forced modes, etc. IMO, the ultimate programmable light has been made already; Novatac just needs to resize it for AA. Besides, Novatac already knows how to get it right with the beam, something LiteFlux will probably need to learn to do.



You're not alone with this observation believe me! I've asked Henry from HDS this question, and apparently he has no plans to design a 1xAA torch. And neither do Novatac. What a terrible shame. To me that would simply be the ultimate illumination device. 

If this LF is as good as its promises then we might have a worthy contender for 1xAA Novatac replacement.


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## 2xTrinity (May 21, 2008)

flex76italy said:


> This light need still something :thinking:...oh yes, a temperature sensor...otherwise it is not the ultimate AA light! :devil:


This is actually a very GOOD idea. Anyone who's inadvertently turned on a high-powered LED light, and let it run indefinitely inside an insulated pocket for example knows what I mean -- with no way to remove the heat, the light can get EXTREMELY hot. Implementing a thermistor as part of the feedback pathway for the regulator to prevent overheating is something that could be useful. In fact that necesarry if Liteflux were to make the P7 light I suggested earlier, which consumes almost 4x as much power...


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## enLIGHTenment (May 21, 2008)

Call me jaded, but I'm hoping LiteFlux will follow up the UI with equally good beam quality, construction quality, and QC. It's really frustrating when vendors build up hype for a new light on the basis of innovative features but the light turns out to be crippled by sloppy engineering or bad design choices in other areas. This happens far too frequently for comfort.



On an unrelated note, an optional add-on to upgrade the reflector with an optic would be very good. LF could easily grab a monopoly on high quality 1xAA optic lights if the market is big enough to be worth grabbing.


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## jasonsmaglites (May 21, 2008)

we really need 1.5% low! 
tell this "engineer" to go back to the drawing board. 

lol, but tell the salesman to sign me up for one in the meantime. 
lemme know when it comes out.


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## Tubor (May 22, 2008)

:bow:Wow, been reading this for a few days. What an incredable interface, especially the ability to change how many modes it has got. 

BUT..

The thing that made me use my LF series lights more than any of the others is the 0.2% low. Sometimes I even wish it was lower, maybe 0.1%. So PLEASE make it _at least_ as low as before!

Another thing that bothers me is is 800Ma to the LED (max) enough? A 14500 is rated around 500Mah so 2C would be 1A, so why not this higher value? 

But I would much rather have a lower-low than a higher-high. The Liteflux series lights I've used before weren't as bright as some of my other torches, but I used them much more for their programmable low-low. Please make it at least 0.2%! :twothumbs:twothumbs:twothumbs

EDIT: I was thinking... maybe a "burst mode" of 1A and a "low-low" mode of 0.2%? You could have them seperate from the "programmable range" if that made it possible. :thinking:


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## 04orgZx6r (May 22, 2008)

TooManyGizmos said:


> ..
> :twothumbs .. khoo ,
> 
> Time to UP-date the details of the OP with the NEW changes.
> ...



Ya, just give us a time/price estimate.....please


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## xcel730 (May 22, 2008)

I wish there was a AA version of Novatac/HDS, but this is as close as I could find . I hope it will be a month or two and not six before it comes. I only have one AA flashlight in my collection.


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## Burgess (May 22, 2008)

Sounds good to me, also.


But, i fear it will be much closer to 6 months,

rather than a month or two.


:candle:



( Hope i'm wrong )


_*Edited to Add*_:

Well, THAT sure didn't take long, did it ? :devil:

What i MEANT to say was: 
" Should be shipping within 30 days " 


Sometimes i actually* enjoy* being wrong ! 


*EndEdit*
_


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## LED Cool (May 22, 2008)

estimated shipping time 6th June.

estimated price below US$88.00 shipped worldwide via registered airmail.

i will start a sales thread in the CPFM dealers section on next Monday.

thanks.
khoo


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## xcel730 (May 22, 2008)

I was about to comment that it's terrible to having us CPFers drooling for six months


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## Burgess (May 22, 2008)

_


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## Yapo (May 22, 2008)

oh man i just got a jet-1 IBS as my programmable low low light with bright high on nimh AA use.Although the circuit isnt very efficient on the medium levels. But even the 2 lumen rated lowest level still seems a tad too bright for indoor pitch black use. Its funny how we all want lower low level now that we can go so much higher
I reckon the lowest level should be less than 1 lumen and also 3 programmable modes seem to be enough for me or maybe 4 if hardpress/hold is another mode.

But the this AA light sound like it'll be a great light tho...maybe i should of held out on getting the jetbeam...


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## Sir Lightalot (May 22, 2008)

LED Cool said:


> estimated shipping time 6th June.
> khoo



If by June 6th you mean 2 weeks from now......


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## TooManyGizmos (May 22, 2008)

..
:huh:


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## LED Cool (May 22, 2008)

Sir Lightalot said:


> If by June 6th you mean 2 weeks from now......



yes! it is Friday the 6th June 2008.

LiteFlux LF5XT is in its final stage of laser engraving and awaits the arrival of the user manual and lanyard. once the bodies and heads are back, assembly can start and then proceed to quality control on each LF5XT.
I am told that the natural HA III colour will have a lighter shade than a LF2X.

the 2% low is the lowest that LF5XT can go. estimated current to the LED is
NIMH - LED current approximately 9ma.
Li-Ion - LED current approximately 14ma.

as for the lumens output at the above mentioned low current, i will leave it to the more enlightened CPF members to give us an estimated.

thanks.
khoo

updated the spec in post #1 and more operating instructions and photos added in post#2.


----------



## LED-holic (May 23, 2008)

Wow, simply amazing.

I can't wait to see some reviews by some of the popular reviewers here!

Quite a buzz this light is generating!!


----------



## merlocka (May 23, 2008)

Whoa... how did I not catch this. This light looks promising. Sorry I didn't read all pages, any chance to get a smooth bezel?


----------



## xcel730 (May 23, 2008)

No indication of that. I personally prefer non crenalated bezel as well, but apparently, that's the latest trend. I need sturdier pants.



merlocka said:


> Whoa... how did I not catch this. This light looks promising. Sorry I didn't read all pages, any chance to get a smooth bezel?


----------



## PhantomPhoton (May 23, 2008)

It all sounds great to me Khoo. If Liteflux keep the great quality of their previous lights we're looking at a winner for sure. Hopefully it will be priced competitively.
Looks like I get to add another LiteFlux to my collection. Hopefully the beam quality with the Cree is decent. I really liked the SSC LightFlux models for their great floody beam.
Question: Will the LF5XT come with a diffuser cap? I love that about my other ones. And I like the shape of the LF ones (especially compared to the Fenix diffuser caps :hahaha


----------



## ingokl (May 23, 2008)

The specs say "water resistant". How reliable will the light be in wet environments or when dropped into water?


----------



## guiri (May 23, 2008)

I would like a regular bezel too. Any chance to find out the output without having to read all six pages?

Thanks

george


----------



## Yapo (May 23, 2008)

guiri said:


> Any chance to find out the output without having to read all six pages?
> 
> Thanks
> 
> george


 
I was wondering that as well...but my guess would be that it's similar to the other popular AA lights.


----------



## adnj (May 23, 2008)

other than 9 ma for Alkaline/14 ma for rechargeable LiIon, no indications on brightness. And that was for the 2% rating. So I am guessing 450 ma/700 ma at the high setting pushing a Cree R2.


----------



## LED Cool (May 23, 2008)

http://www.cree.com/products/pdf/XLamp7090XR-E_B&L.pdf

this CREE documents shows Q5 emitter output (@350ma) to be
min 107 lumens
max 114 lumens

LF5XT uses R2 bin which is one step higher than Q5. so the min output for R2 would be at least 115 lumens at 350ma.

at 500ma LED current when using alkaline or NIMH, LED lumens would be in the range of 150 lumens.

at 800ma LED current when using Li-Ion 14500, LED lumens would be in the range of 200 lumens.

those are my personal guesstimate values.

please feel free to chime in.
khoo


----------



## ingokl (May 23, 2008)

Will the ligth be equipped with a certain colour bin e.g. WC?


----------



## adnj (May 23, 2008)

Still waiting on the specs.


----------



## Thujone (May 23, 2008)

LED Cool said:


> the 2% low is the lowest that LF5XT can go. estimated current to the LED is
> NIMH - LED current approximately 9ma.
> Li-Ion - LED current approximately 14ma.
> 
> ...



That sounds much better. I want to thank you for responding so quickly to our comments on the light. It is truly remarkable. Can not wait to order a natural version.


----------



## LED Cool (May 23, 2008)

adnj said:


> Still waiting on the specs.



it is all in post #1 and post #2

khoo


----------



## LED-holic (May 23, 2008)

Thank you again khoo for taking the time to post all the details.

I didn't see an answer to a question I asked, so I'll ask again - does the aluminium HA III clicky provide the same waterproof capabilities as a rubber clicke?

I don't have any experience with aluminum / metal clickies so I'm curious in that regard.


----------



## Gunner12 (May 23, 2008)

Going by this post, I'd say low output should be around 3-6 lumen and high should be around 140 lumen at the emitter for NiMh and 200 lumen at the emitter for 14500.


----------



## bexamous (May 23, 2008)

"other than 9 ma for Alkaline/14 ma for rechargeable LiIon, no indications on brightness. And that was for the 2% rating. So I am guessing 450 ma/700 ma at the high setting pushing a Cree R2."

I believe it was said to give 500ma/800ma to the led at max... I'm guessing there is a little energy loss due to filtering of PWM signal on low-low levels... which would explain why 2%=14ma and 100%=800ma.

Just a guess... or they did in fact change high to only 700ma.


----------



## Dreamer (May 23, 2008)

Khoo, any idea whether the new LF5XT will come with the snap-on diffuser and colored filter like the old LF5?


----------



## gadgetnerd (May 23, 2008)

LED Cool said:


> estimated shipping time 6th June.
> estimated price below US$88.00 shipped worldwide via registered airmail.
> i will start a sales thread in the CPFM dealers section on next Monday.
> thanks.
> khoo



I will be all over that thread like a cheap suit come Monday


----------



## Retral (May 23, 2008)

I'll keep my eye on this.. I've been looking to get a higher end light to upgrade from my current favorite (Ultrafire C3 (p4)), and this fits the bill (AA & major customization options (lack of memory or memory on/off, super low brightness for extremely long battery life, decent strobe modes.. etc).

My biggest concern is water proofed-ness/resistance. I don't want to spend $80+ on a flashlight only to have it destroyed if dropped in a puddle. At the same time; I don't really care for the crown.. I'd much rather have a smooth 'bezel' or whatever it's called.

I'm looking forward to seeing some reviews up.. anxious to see how this light compares to others & how long it'll last in various brightness modes.


----------



## beeboy02 (May 23, 2008)

Dreamer said:


> Khoo, any idea whether the new LF5XT will come with the snap-on diffuser and colored filter like the old LF5?


 
+1


----------



## NetKidz (May 24, 2008)

LED-holic said:


> I didn't see an answer to a question I asked, so I'll ask again - does the aluminium HA III clicky provide the same waterproof capabilities as a rubber clicke?
> 
> I don't have any experience with aluminum / metal clickies so I'm curious in that regard.



It's o-ring protected. Should be ok in basin or bathtub but probably not good for dunking under several meters.



Dreamer said:


> Khoo, any idea whether the new LF5XT will come with the snap-on diffuser and colored filter like the old LF5?



No.


----------



## adnj (May 24, 2008)

Will there be a pocket clip (screw on hopefully)?
Will there be a CR123 body available?


----------



## LED Cool (May 25, 2008)

adnj said:


> Will there be a pocket clip (screw on hopefully)?
> Will there be a CR123 body available?



at this point in time, the LF5XT does NOT come with the following accessories.
pocket clip, CR123 body, snap-on diffuser and colored filters.

i am not aware if LiteFlux has any plans to develop these accessories in future. will post here when there are new accessories available.

the aluminium HA III clicky is sealed by an O-ring. the water resistant capabilities of LF5XT is such that it provides protection against water encountered in daily normal use. the LF5XT is not suitable for diving or swimming.

khoo


----------



## kaichu dento (May 25, 2008)

LED Cool said:


> at this point in time, the LF5XT does NOT come with the following accessories.
> pocket clip, CR123 body, snap-on diffuser and colored filters.


Bummer, I really think a good clip is a given when it comes to accessories.


----------



## adnj (May 25, 2008)

LED Cool said:


> at this point in time, the LF5XT does NOT come with the following accessories.
> pocket clip, CR123 body, snap-on diffuser and colored filters.


 
Ouch! I guess that I have an extra $88 in my pocket for me to go pick up a new set of golf clubs today.


----------



## lengendcpf (May 25, 2008)

Overall, this light looks good. Just find that the strike bezel/head is not pocket friendly..


----------



## cave dave (May 25, 2008)

Can the light be "locked out" by untwisting bezel or tail?

-dj


----------



## Tubor (May 25, 2008)

It's good but what makes it excellent, design-wise, is the switching mechanism. The strobe programming is also good as is the fine-tune brightness with log/lin adjustment (this _would_ have been excellent with an ultra-low level where it would have really made a visible difference, *sigh*). I don't particularily like the look of the physical design and pointy bezel just makes it longer and more annoying to carry, and I'm sure will it will scratch faster. Not that bright either (but maybe more useful runtimes). And it's nearly $90, phew, for 1-5 levels and a clicky switch. We'll have to see if I've got it spare... I might wait for a different version of this light with the features I want though and just make do with my other excellent Liteflux models.


----------



## LED Cool (May 26, 2008)

cave dave said:


> Can the light be "locked out" by untwisting bezel or tail?
> 
> -dj



i cannot confirm the availability of this "lock out" feature until i have a LF5XT in my hand. 

my understanding of how the switching mechanism works is that, the internal copper tube is used to conduct the negative terminal of the battery to the circuit board and the flashlight body is used to conduct the signal from the electronic tack switch.

from the cross section drawing, i would think it could be possible to lock out the LF5XT by untwisting the bezel from the body, so that signals generated by pressing the electronic tack switch signal does not reach the circuit board in the head.

that is just my personal opinion.
khoo


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## PhantomPhoton (May 26, 2008)

LED Cool said:


> at this point in time, the LF5XT does NOT come with ...
> ... snap-on diffuser ...










That is too bad. A pocket clip would be great as well as long as it can go bezel down. Please pass on my love of diffuser caps to LiteFlux.


----------



## clintb (May 27, 2008)

So, where's that CPFM pre-order thread?


----------



## xcel730 (May 27, 2008)

I was wondering the same thing. I thought the pre-order was going up yesterday (Monday). :thinking:



clintb said:


> So, where's that CPFM pre-order thread?


----------



## LED Cool (May 27, 2008)

ah! yes, the pre-order thread is supposed to be up on Monday but i have decided to postpone it to this Friday (30th May) because i wanted to make sure there are enough LF5XT assembled, tested and packaged by LiteFlux before i start the pre-order thread.

LiteFlux is in the final stages of assembling the LF5XT, then they will need some time to test and check each unit to make sure everything is operating as it should be.

all LF5XT accessories are in and ready to be packaged together with the LF5XT.

the 6th June is still confirmed as the shipping date from my end out to CPF members.

thanks.
khoo


----------



## LED Cool (May 27, 2008)

cave dave said:


> Can the light be "locked out" by untwisting bezel or tail?
> -dj



LiteFlux confirms that the LF5XT can be lock out by untwisting the tail cap by half a turn.

here is some more photos of the LF5XT.
















khoo


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## Kilovolt (May 27, 2008)

Both nice but the black one is my choice. 

:twothumbs


----------



## Tubor (May 27, 2008)

Ya, looks better in real life. What accessories, I thought it wasn't coming with any? Any chance of a low-low 0.1% version with a burst mode to 1.5A?  That would have been so cool. :nana:

Are there any other versions (CR123,etc) in the works?


----------



## flex76italy (May 27, 2008)

Hi Khoo, can you ask to LiteFlux, why the HA3 is so lighter than the LF2X?

I would have preferred this light more dark for the HA3, like the LF2X.


----------



## Norm (May 27, 2008)

Looks like a great EDC. I'll watch with interest for the sales thread to open.
Norm


----------



## 2xTrinity (May 27, 2008)

> I believe it was said to give 500ma/800ma to the led at max... I'm guessing there is a little energy loss due to filtering of PWM signal on low-low levels... which would explain why 2%=14ma and 100%=800ma.


The opposite effect should be happening with a filter -- if you feed a filter a 2% duty cycle PWM, you'll end up with MORE than 2% output current, compared to 100% duty cycle, due to the fact that the capacitor in parallel with the load will draw more current than a load by itself during the "on" porton of the cycle, then dispense it back out during the "off" portion of the cycle, thus creating a level DC output. This is the reason why a super low low isn't possible using a filtered output, unless they were to go with the idea I suggested a few pages ago:

once the minimum level is reached, reduce output even further by switching the 2% brightness level off and on at a LOWER PWM frequency. They might be able to program it in as a "strobe" at 200Hz or something. If the period of this "secondary" PWM is longer than the time-constant on the capacitor, the filter won't affect it, as the filter is designed to smooth out 8kHz PWM.


----------



## clintb (May 27, 2008)

PayPal locked and loaded for a black one. If it turns out half as good as the info in this thread indicates, I'll be purchasing a natural very soon afterwards.


----------



## bexamous (May 27, 2008)

2xTrinity, thanks for correction, I wasn't really thinking that one out... I used to actually use caps to filter PWM signals from fan controllers to eliminate clicking noises.. and yeah low strengths got destroyed depending on capacitor size / PWM frequency.. 

Still not sure how to explain this one then... unless one is wrong:
2%=14ma and 100%=800ma


--edit--

wait I remember what I couldn't figure out at the time... 

"due to the fact that the capacitor in parallel with the load will draw more current than a load by itself during the "on" porton of the cycle,"

I understand that... generally when you add the capacitor the total current draw is increased in 'on' phase... where I got lost was isn't the flashlight current limited? With or without the capacitor the current should be equal... if if this is correct, then the effieincy must go down as there is simply a more complex circuit and some energy must be loss in charging capacitor... or while it holds its charge...

My problem was I'm not sure how perfectly current limited a flashlight is... nor if a measurable amount of energy could be lost by using an imperfect capacitor.


----------



## Tubor (May 28, 2008)

Personally I'd be happy with the old circuit, except with a lower low, and fine-tune low-level brightness adjustment that's _even slower_ than Linear ramping, with diffusers (all my previous Liteflux series make great temporary area lights for mood lighting or night lamps, and I don't have to worry about runtimes or PWM frequency), burst mode at maximum brightness, optional 5 modes (like that) and it automatically defaults to low mode if the battery is too weak for high. And no tactical bezzel, I mean how many tactical lights can you have? This is a gadget light. Long live the gadgets!


----------



## Splunk_Au (May 29, 2008)

hi everyone! have been reading these forums for sometime. i really first for interested in these lights since reading about the novatac 120pnever got it though, mainly because it uses cr123 batteries, this light seems to be like an aa battery equivalent of the novatac? can anyone give feedback on this?when will we be able to get these? on another forum someone seemed to have already had the lights few days back. there are even videos here http://light-reviews.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=86 -chris


----------



## Sir Lightalot (May 29, 2008)

Only 1500 lux on Nimh? Must be a pretty floody light. Thanks for the link! I might have to be start saving up for this thing.


----------



## nanotech17 (May 29, 2008)

this light is gonna be a big hit


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## xcel730 (May 29, 2008)

Splunk_Au,

:welcome:

The Liteflux LF5XT is not out yet. Khoo mentioned that it will be available to for this coming friday over at the marketplace dealer's corner. At the moment, only reviewers have this light. So none of us could give any feedback at the moment.



Splunk_Au said:


> hi everyone! have been reading these forums for sometime. i really first for interested in these lights since reading about the novatac 120pnever got it though, mainly because it uses cr123 batteries, this light seems to be like an aa battery equivalent of the novatac? can anyone give feedback on this?when will we be able to get these? on another forum someone seemed to have already had the lights few days back. there are even videos here http://light-reviews.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=86 -chris


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## qip (May 29, 2008)

watching the videos just makes you think ,is there a core 2 duo processor in that thing , metal tailcap should be interesting feel


----------



## adnj (May 29, 2008)

I was looking at the video and thinking that I didn't like the 400 msec wait for the switch mechanism to start working.


----------



## Splunk_Au (May 29, 2008)

with the release date only a day away, i just have one more question. i visited the official liteflux.com website and see that they actually sell their lights from their web store as well. so my question is, what\'s the difference from buying on the marketplace and buying directly from their website?i think the 0.4 second delay is only when momentary setting is disabled from what i gather from the comments. anyway with it costing about half that of the novatac p, i\'m willing to looks past that kink. -chris


----------



## Kilovolt (May 29, 2008)

Splunk_Au said:


> with the release date only a day away, i just have one more question. i visited the official liteflux.com website and see that they actually sell their lights from their web store as well. so my question is, what\'s the difference from buying on the marketplace and buying directly from their website?


 
As several of us have verified there is a somewhat poor communication with LiteFlux while LEDCool is extremely good at this. You place your order directly with LF and sometimes you don't get a confirmation or they don't tell you that your light has been shipped...
With LEDCool you always know what is happening to your order.
This is the only difference.


BTW: :welcome:


----------



## Tubor (May 29, 2008)

OK, well it would make a poor night light but looks pretty good. Charging Paypal. . . . .


----------



## BabyDoc (May 29, 2008)

Kilovolt said:


> As several of us have verified there is a somewhat poor communication with LiteFlux while LEDCool is extremely good at this. You place your order directly with LF and sometimes you don't get a confirmation or they don't tell you that your light has been shipped...
> With LEDCool you always know what is happening to your order.
> This is the only difference.
> 
> ...


 
Maybe LEDCool could comment on this. Where is he located; how do we get in touch with him (? PM); how long does it generally take for shipments to arrive in the US?; how are service issues handled? Perhaps all of this is answered in the MarketPlace. Forgive me if it is. Then a link would be helpful.


----------



## HKJ (May 29, 2008)

BabyDoc said:


> Maybe LEDCool could comment on this. Where is he located; how do we get in touch with him (? PM); how long does it generally take for shipments to arrive in the US?; how are service issues handled? Perhaps all of this is answered in the MarketPlace. Forgive me if it is. Then a link would be helpful.




Check some of his sales threads, that will give your a good idea about how he handles it.

Here is his thread for LF2X:
http://www.cpfmarketplace.com/mp/showthread.php?t=175263


----------



## vincebdx (May 29, 2008)

LF5xt:





Lux readings at 100%
NiMH
Spot: 1500
Spill: 140
14500
Spot: 2540

Nitecore defender:




1x 14500 750mAh AW Protected
Max Spot 2580 Lux
Max Spill 153 Lux
Min Spot 51 Lux
Min Spill 3 Lux
1x AA 2000mAh Eneloop
Max Spot 2030 Lux
Max Spill 121 Lux
Min Spot 40 Lux
Min Spill 2 Lux
Spill: 209 

Is it strange :thinking:


----------



## LED Cool (May 29, 2008)

here is the beam shot of LF5XT.

cannot access imageshack.us. will post the beam shot later.

khoo


----------



## TooManyGizmos (May 29, 2008)

..
.. LED Cool , your LINKS are not working for me.

Might wanna double check em .....

Thanks


----------



## qip (May 29, 2008)

[URL=http://imageshack.us]



[/URL]


----------



## LED Cool (May 29, 2008)

thanks qip. :thumbsup:

TMG, 

imageshack.us is very slow.


----------



## enLIGHTenment (May 29, 2008)

adnj said:


> I was looking at the video and thinking that I didn't like the 400 msec wait for the switch mechanism to start working.



You're not the only one. A noticeable delay between hitting the switch and getting light is a deal breaker for an EDC pocket light. Any perceptible switch latency is unacceptable in a light that will be switched regularly and frequently used for very short periods.

I'm going to repeat what I said in post #145: *"It's really frustrating when vendors build up hype for a new light on the basis of innovative features but the light turns out to be crippled by sloppy engineering or bad design choices in other areas. This happens far too frequently for comfort."*


----------



## flex76italy (May 29, 2008)

enLIGHTenment said:


> You're not the only one. A noticeable delay between hitting the switch and getting light is a deal breaker for an EDC pocket light. Any perceptible switch latency is unacceptable in a light that will be switched regularly and frequently used for very short periods.
> 
> I'm going to repeat what I said in post #145: *"It's really frustrating when vendors build up hype for a new light on the basis of innovative features but the light turns out to be crippled by sloppy engineering or bad design choices in other areas. This happens far too frequently for comfort."*



I agree 100% with you!


----------



## Splunk_Au (May 29, 2008)

maybe you guys missed this in the first post but this was written under the momentary enabled notes.

"From off, *PH *turns on the light immediately at the default or previously used level (depending on weather Memory Mode is enabled). Immediately turns off after button release."


----------



## PhantomPhoton (May 30, 2008)

Hey that beamshot doesn't look too bad for a cree. I'd like to see more though. :nana:

An alternative to image shack is tinypic.
I use them often as they assign a nice small link address, hence the tiny part of the name. Again I'm pretty sure it is hosted in the US so it'll still likely be slow bouncing half way around the globe form Malaysia. But maybe it'll work better? :thinking:


----------



## bexamous (May 30, 2008)

Wow at 400ms delays all over... seems very excessive.

As for brightness seems like it'll be brighter with li-ion but less bright with NiMH (compared to nitecore).. also more floody beam.... and beam shot looks good.... so thats all good, unless you planned to use NiMH.

The 400ms delays are ugly however :/


----------



## LED Cool (May 30, 2008)

sales thread is up!

thanks.
khoo


----------



## qip (May 30, 2008)

here read the last post that has video on eliminating DELAY ...the video shows you the steps to go through menu and at the end it will show you from off to on VID LINK


----------



## adnj (May 30, 2008)

Seems like you can go immediately to 100%. 400 msec to get to anything else. That's like pushing buttons on a DVD player to me. Not to mention that the video shows the light rolling off the desk. And please don't suggest using a lanyard. That's my main beef with my Fenix lights.


----------



## Splunk_Au (May 30, 2008)

I don't think the instant on is only for 100%. If you read the text above the video it says this.

Note that with Momentary Function enabled, a *PH *immediately turns the light on without the 0.4 second delay on the last used brightness level (assuming Memory Function enabled, as per default). With Momentary Function disabled a PH will always result in 100% brightness. However there is a quick flash when clicked-on.


----------



## LED Cool (May 30, 2008)

latest update!

after many hours at fine tuning the codes, LiteFlux has managed to reduced the lowest low, from 2%, to 1% !

so now the LED current is *approximately*
4ma using NIMH (down from 9ma)
7ma using 14500 Li-Ion (down from 14ma)

kudos to LiteFlux! :twothumbs

khoo


----------



## clintb (May 30, 2008)

LED Cool said:


> latest update!
> 
> after many hours at fine tuning the codes, LiteFlux has managed to reduced the lowest low, from 2%, to 1% !
> 
> ...


Wow! LiteFlux really listens to the suggestions made here, or ones passed on by yourself. Either way, kudos to them and you, Khoo.


----------



## Rat6P (May 30, 2008)

Splunk_Au said:


> maybe you guys missed this in the first post but this was written under the momentary enabled notes.
> 
> "From off, *PH *turns on the light immediately at the default or previously used level (depending on weather Memory Mode is enabled). Immediately turns off after button release."




What about those who don't like memory mode??
That delay is a real turn off....no pun intended.


----------



## Splunk_Au (May 30, 2008)

those who dont like memory mode should turn it off then. what does it have to do with momentary? from what i understand from the manual, they're separate settings.


----------



## juplin (May 30, 2008)

Rat6P said:


> What about those who don't like memory mode??
> That delay is a real turn off....no pun intended.


It seems you mingle memory mode with momentary function.


----------



## qip (May 30, 2008)

revised numbers from lightreview

AA spot/spill
100%: 1880, 152
50%: 1180, 89
1%: 45, 4

14500 spot/spill
100%: 3190, 250
50%: 1310, 106
1%: 68, 6


----------



## HKJ (May 30, 2008)

Rat6P said:


> What about those who don't like memory mode??
> That delay is a real turn off....no pun intended.



Memory mode can be turned off! I am going to do that

I am very curious about the delay, I do not know if it is a problem, but I will see it when I get the flashlight.


----------



## Gatsby (May 30, 2008)

Wow - I tune out for a few weeks and look what happens! Work is terribly inconvenient to my hobbies. Anyway - some time ago I stated that my ideal light would be an HDS/Novatac/Arc4 type function in a AA/14500/CR2 form factor. What made me sell my HDS was the size - it just was too fat for EDC for me. I've grown to prefer the AA/14500/CR2 form a lot more.

The new LF5XT looks pretty much like what I've wished for. I continue to use my LF5 and LF2 daily, along with spot us of my Jil JCR2 IT and Dereelight CL1H for high power use. But the LF5XT goes a LONG way toward my ideal pocket EDC light. If I'm going to bother with electronic controls, etc... I like the ability to program my levels. I like the ability to set it to whatever modes I want. I slightly prefer the HDS interface due to the ability to go from any mode directly to the other three and do wish a 3 click option to go to lowest setting was in the mix, but that is a small thing and I can certainly set this the way I want it. I'm not wild about the looks (bezel really) but don't hate them. I personally like memory and seem to recall that being a significant preference here - maybe someone should do a poll as any new light that either does, or does not, have memory seems to elicit a ton of comments about how they don't want that feature.

The one thing that would make it a real home run for me at least would be a CR2 body. AA and CR2 are the same diameter (in fact the LF5 and LF4 were the same head with a different body from what Khoo said way back in the day but they didn't sell the bodies separately). Gives you a lot of options including a really small pocket format. since the head and tailcap appear to be separate parts, shouldn't be too hard for the machinists to make up a shorter CR2 length body ... hint hint!!!


----------



## bexamous (May 30, 2008)

revised numbers look even better... wonder how its so much brighter than defender.... 1% is low enough for me... 

The ONE problem now is that delay... 400ms!?  ... 

The delay should be equal to the longest time between two clicks to register as a double click and not two single clicks, correct? Increasing this delay makes it easier to double click. Does the delay affect anything else?

If not 400ms is VERY cautious.... 200ms would still be fine for 99.999% of people. I cannot imagine anyone trying to do a double click and needing 400ms to do it.

Anyone know delays in other lights for something to compare to?


----------



## juplin (May 30, 2008)

qip said:


> revised numbers from lightreview
> 
> AA spot/spill
> 100%: 1880, 152
> ...


Any of 45/1880 4/152 68/3190 6/250 is still above 2%.

IMO, the red filter for Fenix L1D/P2D might be a good option for those who want to reduce from 2% to 0.5%


----------



## Sir Lightalot (May 30, 2008)

juplin said:


> Any of 45/1880 4/152 68/3190 6/250 is still above 2%.



As i understand it, it's 1% drive current not total output. Leds get more efficient at lower drive currents.


----------



## Alexi* (May 30, 2008)

I like to place my self on pre-order for one black, but the market page is closed for us newbies since we dont get any confimation mail, we cant post


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## Sir Lightalot (May 30, 2008)

Same here. I don't know why i waited so long to register for the marketplace  Now its come back to haunt me.


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## smg (May 30, 2008)

Here's how I HOPE the UI works, as it relates to the delay...
With momentary ON, PH will turn the light on at the first level. When released, the light turns OFF.

With momentary OFF, PH will turn the light on at the first level until the necessary time has passed (.4 seconds, if that's what has been determined). After the .4 seconds, the light goes to full brightness. If the user releases the button before the .4 seconds, a click is recognized and the light remains at the first level setting.



> The delay should be equal to the longest time between two clicks to register as a double click and not two single clicks, correct?


Why does the time for the button to be held down to recognize a PH need to be the same as the delay between clicks??? Why live with that restriction?
I think the .4 second delay is a little long (maybe .3 sec is better), but maybe I'm splitting hairs there. The recognition of a button press time limit (rather than PH) should be less, like .2 seconds.

IMO.


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## Rat6P (May 30, 2008)

No. I dont believe I have mingled anything.
My point is;
Why is the memory seemingly linked to the 400ms delay?
If memory is enabled, fair enough, there is no delay when coming back on.
Correct?
Now if memory is disabled, all your above posts would seem to indicate that there is going to be a 400ms delay for everything except 100%.
Correct?
For those who do not like a memory mode.....then the only level that can be accessed without the delay (when memory mode is disabled) is 100%.

If this is the case, then this is what i was refering to. And this is what I dont like!

Please correct me if I'm wrong


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## enLIGHTenment (May 30, 2008)

smg said:


> Here's how I HOPE the UI works, as it relates to the delay...



There's no need to guess how the UI works. Look at the review and video links posted upthread: http://light-reviews.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=86

With momentary mode OFF, the light will wait 400ms before producing any light at all through either C or PH. It will also wait 400ms before turning off.

With momentary mode ON, PH will turn the light on immediately. Releasing PH will turn the light off immediately. However, the 400ms response latency for C commands remains.

The 400ms delay appears to be related to how the light distinguishes clicks vs press-and-hold operations. There is no good reason for the filter interval to be this high as the typical user will be fast enough to press-and-release a C in 100ms or less. Since some people have faster muscles than others, the ideal solution would be to make the C-to-PH detection delay user programmable on a logarithmic scale from 50ms to 200ms. Some recovery mode to reset the PH delay would be needed in case someone accidentally set PH to faster than they could click.

Regardless of the C-to-PH delay the light _should_ come on immediately after the switch makes contact and go to high power (or the last used mode, or the default, or strobe, depending on the momentary and memory settings) after the switch is held down for the PH delay. Producing no light while the PH delay elapses is a deal breaker for an EDC light.


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## Splunk_Au (May 30, 2008)

Rat6P i think you're now confused about two things. One is about when a PH comes on to 100% which depends on the momentary function setting. Next thing is about the memory function setting which is totally unrelated to the momentary function settings. I think the best is that you read the instructions again to clear it up.


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## TooManyGizmos (May 31, 2008)

enLIGHTenment said:


> You're not the only one. A noticeable delay between hitting the switch and getting light is a deal breaker for an EDC pocket light. Any perceptible switch latency is unacceptable in a light that will be switched regularly and frequently used for very short periods.
> 
> I'm going to repeat what I said in post #145: *"It's really frustrating when vendors build up hype for a new light on the basis of innovative features but the light turns out to be crippled by sloppy engineering or bad design choices in other areas. This happens far too frequently for comfort."*


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## Rat6P (May 31, 2008)

Ok so maybe I am confused about the momentary and memory functions.
I am surely now confused as to whether I am confused or not.

What is the deal with the 400ms delay?
That is, can it be disabled, changed, etc? and under what circumstances?
From what I have read of the manual, and also from post #240(which i think is the same as my understanding), there are still going to be a whole bunch of times when the 400ms delay is present, no matter how you program the light.


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## TranceAddict (May 31, 2008)

please hold your purchase at this moment as some bugs were found within some users already got their lights
http://my3c.com/D5/viewthread.php?tid=7767&extra=page=1&page=12

the fatal problem is, it happens to just some lights, once you run with 14500 and it becomes dead if later you decide to change to AA NIMH
.

mountech is addressing the problem now but he is having hard time to duplicate the bugs with the lights in his hands.

I am sure he will make it perfect in short time, Liteflux brand itself is equivalent to quality and reputation, i just don't wish to see if any of you get pissed because of some early stage production quirks.


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## clintb (May 31, 2008)

Ok, this whole splitting hairs over 400ms is kinda ridiculous. Seriously, LiteFlux has come out with a light that has at least as many programming options as a Novatac P series, but in a package that costs quite a bit less. They've also listened to us on at least a few key points; memory (y/n), low level (down to 1% from 8% at the beginning), and selectable number of user defined modes. 400ms, less than half a second; is it going to kill ya?

Who knows, maybe LiteFlux will be able to lessen the delay. Either way, I'll be happy with it.


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## Rat6P (May 31, 2008)

Dont get me wrong..this light is sweet! Regardless of whether the Delay is fixed/changed I think many people will buy and enjoy this light.

As to whether 400ms is splitting hairs...well thats your perception and opinion!

the Novatac 85P was only US$99.......is that such a huge difference in price.....I certainly dont think so.......*AND just so you know I'm not complaining about the price!* I just dont agree with some people stating that it costs almost half the price.


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## Tubor (May 31, 2008)

Sounding better and better... and any lower would of course be appreciated.


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## NetKidz (May 31, 2008)

Just a thought about the 0.4s. (It's 1s for LF2/3/4/5/LF2X )

LF5XT is a MCU controlled flashlight with a soft switch to operate/configure. The command click sequences are different, like 1xC, 2xC, etc. Everyone's click speed, click intervals aren't the same, thus it needs an "event" to know the end of command sequence. Just like RS232 serial communication, the stop-bits is mandatory. 

The "event" is a 0.4s blank period and it's the delay mentioned in previous posts. It's needed at the end of command sequence. For example, battery voltage report, 5xC. You could finish all the 5 clicks within 0.5s or do it slowly about 0.3s interval per click. You could do it faster or slower, but one click must follows another within 0.4s.

If the momentary function is ON and the light is turned OFF, Press-and-hold will turn on the light immediately and turn off when released. If the momentary function is OFF and the light is turned OFF, one click, the light will turn on after 0.4s. It's not that bad, I didn't feel any inconvenience when actually use it but YMMV. 

Another great thing seems not mentioned is "You don't need to turn off the light to operate/configure it!" I don't have Novatec lights and I don't know how they operate. But I hate some flashlights' UI, you must turn off the light, wait within x seconds and turn it on to switch mode. Or you must stop at specific mode, turn off, wait for x seconds and not longer than y seconds, turn on. Oops, tired. 

When LF5XT is turned on, the light is steady ON when you're doing the command clicks. It will not response to bad click sequences if you do something wrong and the output won't be affected. I think this a great feel. :nana:


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## TooManyGizmos (May 31, 2008)

Hi ..... LED Cool And NetKidz , 

Who is TranceAddict ..... does he work with you ? (post 244)
Is his post an official announcement to delay ordering ?

There is NO mention of trouble in the *Ordering-Sale thread* about what he says .

Could you guys please make some comment about his post ........ is it valid info. ?

Should there be mention of this in the *Order thread* ..... ?

What can you tell us about this: 




TranceAddict said:


> please hold your purchase at this moment as some bugs were found within some users already got their lights
> http://my3c.com/D5/viewthread.php?tid=7767&extra=page=1&page=12
> 
> the fatal problem is, it happens to just some lights, once you run with 14500 and it becomes dead if later you decide to change to AA NIMH
> ...


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## NetKidz (May 31, 2008)

Hi TooManyGizmos,

I don't know him and I don't work with anyone. 

Yes, there're some users reported problem with first batch. (300 units manufactured?) I also have one failed. LiteFlux has a good record, I think they'll address the problem and fix it before further shipping.


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## qip (May 31, 2008)

they may have to doublecheck some things


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## Thujone (May 31, 2008)

I really hope that the version with 1% low is the version expected to be shipped to those in the sales thread. Looks like a worthwhile difference...


----------



## Burgess (May 31, 2008)

Hope these aforementioned bugs/flaws are *corrected before shipping.*


No matter HOW LONG that may take.




_


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## TooManyGizmos (May 31, 2008)

..
..Thank You for responding ... NetKidz


Good to know this.
.


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## TranceAddict (Jun 1, 2008)

I am just a flashlight addict and does not affiliate to anyone or any company. Because you guys couldn't read chinese so I just bridged the thread to you.

My only motif is to inform you guys not to buy the lights until problems have all been resolved, avoid ended up with displeasure and bad experience of such a good quality brand.

hope this helps


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## LED-holic (Jun 1, 2008)

welcome to CPF TranceAddict.

it's interesting with the other forum talking about firmware.

Are these things getting to be like Windows, with constant patching and rebooting?


----------



## Burgess (Jun 2, 2008)

Looking forward to my first



*Blue Screen of Death !*



:devil:
_


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## TooManyGizmos (Jun 2, 2008)

..
:thumbsup:..TranceAddict .. :welcome:

Thanks for letting us know about that.

We can use all the translation help we can get.

If you had not brought it to our attention ......

We would NOT have known.


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## Alexi* (Jun 2, 2008)

4 days to go and more and more talks about bugs 

Why would you want the over discharge protection (OP) for NIMH & 14500 turnd off? 
Is over discharging a big problem?


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## 2xTrinity (Jun 2, 2008)

Alexi* said:


> 4 days to go and more and more talks about bugs
> 
> Why would you want the over discharge protection (OP) for NIMH & 14500 turnd off?
> Is over discharging a big problem?


The only reason I can think of is if you're using a different chemistry than NiMH or 14500... such as Lithium primary (1.7V), or LiFePO4 (3.2v), in which cases the cutoffs would not occur at appropriate times. For example, in hte case of the LiFe cell, it would think that you're running a nearly-spent LiIon as soon as you drop it in. Or if you were able to jury-rig a 2xAA tube onto the light, then instead of 2xNiMH the light would think you are running a "dead" LiIon and fail to work.

If one is actually USING a LiIon or NiMh, then yes, protection should be on.


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## LED-holic (Jun 2, 2008)

Is there a way to turn the protection on or off ourselves? It seems right now only Khoo is able to do it before shipping?


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## Thujone (Jun 2, 2008)

LED-holic said:


> Is there a way to turn the protection on or off ourselves? It seems right now only Khoo is able to do it before shipping?



Since some find the LF interface hard to learn, or dont care to learn it he offers this as a service. If you look at the manual you will see you can easily toggle the setting yourself.


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## LED-holic (Jun 2, 2008)

Thujone said:


> Since some find the LF interface hard to learn, or dont care to learn it he offers this as a service. If you look at the manual you will see you can easily toggle the setting yourself.


Thanks. Do you know if there's a LF5X manual floating around yet by chance?


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## Kilovolt (Jun 2, 2008)

LED-holic said:


> Thanks. Do you know if there's a LF5X manual floating around yet by chance?


 
You can find it HERE


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## LED-holic (Jun 2, 2008)

Kilovolt said:


> You can find it HERE


Thank you!!!


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## clintb (Jun 2, 2008)

Hey all,

Sounds like LiteFlux has fixed the problem mentioned earlier. Mev, from light-reviews.com contacted them and they've already found the source of the problem.

LiteFlux sounds like one heck of a great bunch of people. Very responsive to customer input, to say the least.



> Good news, LiteFlux has identified the issue which caused the problems experienced by some users.
> They've also managed to resolve a solution for this, so lights produced from now will be remedied.
> 
> As quoted from the email:
> "There is a spark when install 14500 Li-Ion battery and let the DC-DC IC to switch 1~3 times ( less than 10uS ) that has a chance to near the limite of IC's rating voltage ( a percentage of error rate , not all the IC be damaged )"


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## Thujone (Jun 2, 2008)

clintb said:


> LiteFlux sounds like one heck of a great bunch of people. Very responsive to customer input, to say the least.



+1


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## Alexi* (Jun 2, 2008)

The ultimate AA light? I think so for now at least, and so good loking. I have orderd one and hopefully it will be the only light i will ever need.


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## Alexi* (Jun 2, 2008)

So whats the best 4.5V 14500 batery for this one?
And where to buy for the lowest cost?


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## kageneko (Jun 2, 2008)

how can those of us who tried to register for the marketplace, only to be screwed by the malfunctioning email system from verifying our accounts, be able to order this holy grail of lights?


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## mighty82 (Jun 2, 2008)

kageneko said:


> how can those of us who tried to register for the marketplace, only to be screwed by the malfunctioning email system from verifying our accounts, be able to order this holy grail of lights?


What he said! :mecry:

I can't believe how cheap this light is, I was expecting something like this to be at least $100.


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## Sir Lightalot (Jun 2, 2008)

there's a thread about posting in the marketplace in the Questions/problems/suggestions part of the administrative forum and they kindly activated my account.


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## TranceAddict (Jun 3, 2008)

seem like the death on 14500 battery problem has been fixed. According to what mountech the light maker said. when 14500 is about to be contacted to the terminal, it produces a spark and cause 1-3 times oscillations which lasts about 10 micro second at DC-DC step up IC. The voltage spike will destroy some IC with lower tolerance however some could survive if lucky enough to have the IC at rated +% tolerance range.

mountech solved this problem by implementing a reverse biased zener diode parallel to the source I reckoned, to clamp the transient voltage from being feed into DC-DC boost up IC.

Original thread: http://my3c.com/D5/viewthread.php?tid=7767&page=18#pid47503


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## Alexi* (Jun 3, 2008)

mighty82 said:


> What he said! :mecry:
> 
> I can't believe how cheap this light is, I was expecting something like this to be at least $100.


I sent Mr Khoo a PM.


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## gunga (Jun 3, 2008)

TranceAddict said:


> seem like the death on 14500 battery problem has been fixed. According to what mountech the light maker said. when 14500 is about to be contacted to the terminal, it produces a spark and cause 1-3 times oscillations which lasts about 10 micro second at DC-DC step up IC. The voltage spike will destroy some IC with lower tolerance however some could survive if lucky enough to have the IC at rated +% tolerance range.
> 
> mountech solved this problem by implementing a reverse biased zener diode parallel to the source I reckoned, to clamp the transient voltage from being feed into DC-DC boost up IC.
> 
> Original thread: http://my3c.com/D5/viewthread.php?tid=7767&page=18#pid47503


 

That's cool, so what happens to the first batch, released before fixes?


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## Burgess (Jun 3, 2008)

to TranceAddict --


Thank you for your information and input. :thumbsup:



Oh, and Welcome to CandlePowerForums !

:welcome:
_


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## Alexi* (Jun 3, 2008)

gunga said:


> That's cool, so what happens to the first batch, released before fixes?


Wasn't that a test batch to find this kind of bugs?


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## TooManyGizmos (Jun 3, 2008)

Alexi* said:


> Wasn't that a test batch to find this kind of bugs?



.....:huh:...... NO .... We are not beta testers :shakehead


.... We are PAYing customers .... :nana:

:devil:
.


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## gunga (Jun 3, 2008)

TranceAddict said:


> mountech solved this problem by implementing a reverse biased zener diode parallel to the source I reckoned, to clamp the transient voltage from being feed into DC-DC boost up IC.
> 
> Original thread: http://my3c.com/D5/viewthread.php?tid=7767&page=18#pid47503


 
Does anyone have a good translation for this page? I'd like to read up on what is going on...


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## mighty82 (Jun 3, 2008)

gunga said:


> Does anyone have a good translation for this page? I'd like to read up on what is going on...


I think THIS is as good as it gets.


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## mighty82 (Jun 3, 2008)

I want to buy one now, but i'm worried that I will get one of those from the "first batch", with the problem concerning the 14500's. It would be hell for me having to send it back, since I live in norway. Are the "non-fixed" lights still being sold? :shrug:


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## gunga (Jun 3, 2008)

No, LED Cool is only selling the fixed lights, so if you buy from him, you are fine.


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## LED-holic (Jun 3, 2008)

Just curious, does LiteFlux not have any U.S. distributors?

It's fantastic that Khoo is providing great service with these lights, but just wondering if LiteFlux has a US distributor to help facilitate shipping / service, etc.


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## Thujone (Jun 3, 2008)

gunga said:


> No, LED Cool is only selling the fixed lights, so if you buy from him, you are fine.



Is there confirmation of this somewhere?


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## gunga (Jun 3, 2008)

It's in his sales thread in the marketplace.


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## LED Cool (Jun 3, 2008)

mighty82 said:


> I want to buy one now, but i'm worried that I will get one of those from the "first batch", with the problem concerning the 14500's. It would be hell for me having to send it back, since I live in norway. Are the "non-fixed" lights still being sold? :shrug:



no, the "non fixed" lights are not being sold to anyone and will be fixed/modified to solve the 14500 problems.

the LF5XT that i will be getting are the improved LF5XT that should not have any problems with 14500 Li-Ion. the so called " first batch" are solely confined within Taiwan and if there are problems with those units, LiteFlux could easily get them fixed/repaired within Taiwan. 

for CPF members, i would not like/want to ship out any LF5XT that has potential issues which could cause a dent to LiteFlux reputation in CPF. and it does not make sense to ship out any units from the "first batch" to CPF members as it would only invited more flak.

of all the LiteFlux products sold in CPF, the LF1, LF2, LF3, LF4, LF5 & LF2X, there are very very few units which has results in a warranty claim and there are rarely any complain threads about LiteFlux products.

please rest assure that i will only ship out LiteFlux products that i know has passed LiteFlux QC. my conscious would not let me do otherwise.

thank you.
khoo


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## mighty82 (Jun 4, 2008)

What about all the problems described in the first post on THIS page? Doesn't look like they have any fix for this yet? No way they can be sold in 2 days with this not being fixed?


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## TranceAddict (Jun 4, 2008)

I think mountech is working hard on that issue. Besides many lights were reported having strange noise (at PWM freq) generated from inductor. Some light do not have constant increment/decrement in brightness regardless logarithmic or linear.

in my personal experience, this kind of light involving complex coding on MCU need lot of time to fine tune and debugging. Please give it time, nothing man made is perfect at early stage.


I really looking forward to seeing liteflux will come out something similiar to LF5XT but with CREE MC-E and optional 2xAA, 18650 battery tube, it will then be my final AA light.


----------



## Alexi* (Jun 4, 2008)

mighty82 said:


> What about all the problems described in the first post on THIS page? Doesn't look like they have any fix for this yet? No way they can be sold in 2 days with this not being fixed?


Al those problems could be related to the issue that is now fixed. A spike to the motherbord shortening som of the components could cause all cind of semingly random problems. Since not the same component has to be the one failing every time.


----------



## juplin (Jun 4, 2008)

mighty82 said:


> What about all the problems described in the first post on THIS page? Doesn't look like they have any fix for this yet? No way they can be sold in 2 days with this not being fixed?


Issue 1 may be directly linked to the major issue already solved by mountech. It seems that some step up converters without the protection of zener diode will be damaged when Li-ion is loaded, and will be dead in a few minutes after the flashlights are turned on.

Issue 2 should be related to the size of the loaded battery. Longer battery will result in the phenomenon stated by Mev based on my testing. If issue 2 does happen, just change to a shorter battery.

I have no idea about the issue 3, since no one in Taiwan reported this issue.


----------



## mighty82 (Jun 4, 2008)

Alexi* said:


> Al those problems could be related to the issue that is now fixed. A spike to the motherbord shortening som of the components could cause all cind of semingly random problems. Since not the same component has to be the one failing every time.


I don't think so. Look at the last post in that same thread. "No word of an actual fixed sample at this time." It says further up in the thread that the 14500 problem is fixed, so I don't think the 2 problems are related. :sigh: And I just ordered one..


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## Splunk_Au (Jun 4, 2008)

juplin said:


> Issue 2 should be related to the size of the loaded battery. Longer battery will result in the phenomenon stated by Mev based on my testing. If issue 2 does happen, just change to a shorter battery.


 
i don't understand how this would be since the difference between the first version and second version is the revised firmware programmed into the ic? he used the same 14500 type of battery there wasn't any problems like this with the first version.

and wouldn't a slightly longer battery make the light not turn on instead of turn on? cos the the light can be locked out when loosening either the tail or head.


----------



## juplin (Jun 5, 2008)

Splunk_Au said:


> i don't understand how this would be since the difference between the first version and second version is the revised firmware programmed into the ic? he used the same 14500 type of battery there wasn't any problems like this with the first version.
> 
> and wouldn't a slightly longer battery make the light not turn on instead of turn on? cos the the light can be locked out when loosening either the tail or head.


My LF5XT, once loaded with longer battery whether it's 14500 or NiMH, will repoduce the phenomenon of the isuue 2 mentioned by Mev.

I don't know the exact mechanism to cause this issue.
If I can guess, a longer/tighter (but still within the tolerance of component) spring fitted on the bottom of copper sleeve in combination with the longer battery might unduly press the nipple of battery against the positive terminal of the circuit board, and might induce some improper signal.
However, I also wait for LiteFlux to explain the exact mechanism to cause this issue.


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## Alexi* (Jun 5, 2008)

mighty82 said:


> I don't think so. Look at the last post in that same thread. "No word of an actual fixed sample at this time." It says further up in the thread that the 14500 problem is fixed, so I don't think the 2 problems are related. :sigh: And I just ordered one..


Me to, but I'm not worried. The last post I think is about that he dosn't know what date he will get a new test sample. No one will know until then if all the problems are solved, but I hope and think so.


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## mighty82 (Jun 6, 2008)

http://light-reviews.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=86&st=0&sk=t&sd=a&start=20
Seems like they have a fixed version now  looks like it's even brighter on 14500's too  (last post)


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## Retral (Jun 6, 2008)

Any word on how long it lasts on 1%?


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## Doug (Jun 7, 2008)

Any of theses lights still left for sale?


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## Splunk_Au (Jun 7, 2008)

cool, the review is also up here http://www.light-reviews.com/liteflux_lf5xt/review.html


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## mighty82 (Jun 7, 2008)

Splunk_Au said:


> cool, the review is also up here http://www.light-reviews.com/liteflux_lf5xt/review.html


I hope he is planning to do a runtime test on low too. That's what i'm excited about.


----------



## Alexi* (Jun 7, 2008)

theres an error in the review. The 14500 100% Spill isn't 118 Lux but 233 Lux.


----------



## Sir Lightalot (Jun 7, 2008)

mighty82 said:


> I hope he is planning to do a runtime test on low too. That's what i'm excited about.


 Lets hope he's still running it :devil:


----------



## Sir Lightalot (Jun 7, 2008)

I just noticed that in the forum he said the calculated run time on 1% is 110 hours


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## Alexi* (Jun 7, 2008)

Just noticed that it got a 8.5, the highest rating ever given out by Light-Review! :wow:


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## Alexi* (Jun 7, 2008)

It´s just 40 Lux weaker then the Fenix P2D 100% spot, so should be some where around 150 real lumens! :twothumbs

Thats amazing from a single 14500!


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## mighty82 (Jun 7, 2008)

I'm a little disappointed over the runtimes on high.. On a eneloop battery at 100% it looks to be about the same brightness as the Fenix L1D. But the L1D has 90-100 minutes on high while the LF5XT only has 53 minutes. That's almost half the runtime. :shakehead Is it really that inefficient?


----------



## juplin (Jun 7, 2008)

mighty82 said:


> I'm a little disappointed over the runtimes on high.. On a eneloop battery at 100% it looks to be about the same brightness as the Fenix L1D. But the L1D has 90-100 minutes on high while the LF5XT only has 53 minutes. That's almost half the runtime. :shakehead Is it really that inefficient?


This is what I read from light-reviews:
LiteFlux LF5 XT 
1x AA 2000mAh Eneloop 
100% Spot 1900 Lux 
100% Spill 118 Lux 

Fenix L1D CE Q5
1x AA 2000mAh Eneloop 
Turbo Spot 1920 Lux 
Turbo Spill 68 Lux

LiteFlux LF5 XT is almost double in the spill.


----------



## mighty82 (Jun 7, 2008)

juplin said:


> This is what I read from light-reviews:
> LiteFlux LF5 XT
> 1x AA 2000mAh Eneloop
> 100% Spot 1900 Lux
> ...


Yes, almost double the spill means almost double the output, but why does the reflector focus so little of it into the hotspot? Spill is nice, but I like to have MOST of the light in the hotspot. I think the spill of the fenix is more than enough.


----------



## 2xTrinity (Jun 7, 2008)

mighty82 said:


> Yes, almost double the spill means almost double the output, but why does the reflector focus so little of it into the hotspot? Spill is nice, but I like to have MOST of the light in the hotspot.


The fact that the lux number is lower doesn't necessarily mean it has less light in the hotspot. That simply means the brightest point in the hotspot is less intense.

The LF2x has lower lux in the hotspot than the L0D-CE, but more lumens in the hotspot. It has a more textured reflector (hotspot is wider angle) that is also deeper (more lumens captured as part of the beam, less spill). If the depth to width ratio of the reflector is the biggest determining factor of how many lumens are captured as part of the hotspot. 

If you compare the LF5XT reflector to the L1D and find that the reason for the difference in center lux is texturing, the best option would be fore liteflux to offer a smooth reflector.


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## mighty82 (Jun 7, 2008)

The op reflector in the L1D produces a very even hotspot. No "brighter areas" in the hotspot. So for the hotspot in the LF5XT to have more lumens in the hotspot at the same lux reading, it must have a bigger hotspot. Bigger hotspot doesn't help me much. What I need the hotspot for is throw.

Looks like the hotspot kind of blends into the spill more on the LF5XT, I guess much of the light goes there.


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## Norm (Jun 7, 2008)

mighty82 said:


> Bigger hotspot doesn't help me much. What I need the hotspot for is throw.
> Looks like the hotspot kind of blends into the spill more on the LF5XT, I guess much of the light goes there.


To me this is exactly what this light is about, it is not meant to be a throwy light it will be used as a general purpose light and the beam profile seems perfect.
Norm


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## Yapo (Jun 8, 2008)

Well from looking at the spillshot from light-reviews.com, it looks like theres a rather wide bright corona around the hotspot, which should make the beam more useful and easier on the eyes for closer range use than some other lights.

Also this shot only shows the ratio of the hotspot to spill at the distance it was from the wall so the actual diameter of the spill would probably be different for each light as the photo is cropped to just fit the beam in(or maybe i'm wrong). So another reason the spill brighter could be may be that the spill isnt as wide...not that i'm sayin it is. 

But from looking at the other beamshots it shows the hotspot actually looks rather floody...which is what some people love and others hate. 

I have a Jet-I IBS and it has a rather big distinct cree dark ring but most of the beamshots from others i've seen dont seem to have much of one... So even the beam pattern may vary slightly between each light.


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## qip (Jun 8, 2008)

its got spill like the L2D actually a little more


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## 04orgZx6r (Jun 8, 2008)

*LF5 XT*​1x 14500 750mAh AW Protected 
100% 00:35 to 50% 
50% 02:11 to 50%

1x AA 2000mAh Eneloop 
100% 00:53 to 50% 5
0% 02:12 to 50%


*Jet 1 MK IBS*​1x 14500 750mAh AW Protected
100% 00:24 to 50% 
50% 00:35 to 50% 
Default High 00:43 to 50% 
Default Low 07:55 to 50% 

1x AA 2000mAh Eneloop 
100% 00:56 to 50% 
50% 00:52 to 50% 
Default High 00:49 to 50% 
Default Low 03:24 to 50%
*
This is from lightreviews.com and is what has me really excited.
Comparing the two the LF5 is almost as bright or brighter than the Jet has a slightly better runtime on high and way,way,way better runtime on 50%. Really, Really cool, so i sold my jet and bought one of these , can't wait for them to ship.
*


----------



## Yapo (Jun 8, 2008)

Yeah i dont use my Jet-I IBS on 50% due to the inefficiency at the medium levels. I use (minimium > default low > Max) for my modes. I missed this thread till after i had bought the Jet-I IBS  
I dont want to spend any more money on another light(as i also bought a new charger and set of LSD AA) but this light is looking very tempting


----------



## 04orgZx6r (Jun 8, 2008)

Don't get me wrong the Jet is still a really good light, the best of what was out there Pre-LF5 XT IMHO. It's just that the LF5 XT is way more advanced in terms of efficiency, has a better beam profile for everyday use, and maintains the programmability that I want, so I just couldn't resist. However I don't have the light in my hands yet, so I am not sure that I will even like it, I just have a sneaking suspicion. :nana:

But hey, this is CPF. wait for a few of us to receive ours, then if you want sell your Jet at the Marketplace, and get most of your money back:thumbsup:


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## Doug (Jun 8, 2008)

Ok, sending lights out on Tuesday, what day would I likely get one here in CA?


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## mighty82 (Jun 9, 2008)

The fact that the LF5XT use almost twice the energy of a L2D/P2D/L1D at the same hotspot intensity (lux), must mean that this is a pretty floody light. The description and beamshot in the review backs that up. So for this light to reach a hotspot intensity of 3570lux, it must have a pretty amazing total output. Looking forward to some comparison reviews to similar lights like the NDI and the L1D. I think we are in for a suprise when it comes to total output here. :naughty:

I hope selfbuilt reviews it and puts it into the "Multi-stage 1AA Review" thread. Would be great to compare it to all those 1AA lights".


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## Alexi* (Jun 9, 2008)

Doug said:


> Ok, sending lights out on Tuesday, what day would I likely get one here in CA?


I expect to have my Friday morning at the latest here in Sweden. (A shipment of batteries sent out from HK on Friday arrived this morning.)


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## mighty82 (Jun 9, 2008)

Alexi* said:


> I expect to have my Friday morning at the latest here in Sweden. (A shipment of batteries sent out from HK on Friday arrived this morning.)


I hope I get mine about the same time here in norway. I have ordered a lot from both US and Hong Kong, and the shipping times are all over the place. Anything from 5 to 20 days. I have gotten used to ordering and just forgetting about it. Suddenly it's in the mailbox.


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## Yapo (Jun 9, 2008)

mighty82 said:


> I have ordered a lot from both US and Hong Kong, and the shipping times are all over the place. Anything from 5 to 20 days. I have gotten used to ordering and just forgetting about it. Suddenly it's in the mailbox.


 likewise lol...its kinda better that way if you forget about it!

I noticed the low battery cut off/protection kicks in at 0.8V for nimh...is 0.8V as low as you should use nimh? 
i ask this because ive noticed from using my Jet-I IBS with 1.5V+ fresh of the charger 2500mah Energizers, the output at 100% has noticeably dropped by 1.3V and by 1.2V the output is little better than/the same as the minimum output of 5%. 
Is that normal with all single AA lights running on nimh? Maybe someone could confirm this when they get theres?


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## Doug (Jun 9, 2008)

Does seem like a Novatac/HDS but using AA's to me also... But, it is missing the Beacon feature that my 120p and U60GT are set to use right now 

Maybe someone will find a place to put trits on this new light, eh?



BabyDoc said:


> Now why couldn't Novatac just put their interface and features into a AA light? It sounds like LiteFlux is reinventing the wheel that Novatac already designed for the CR123s. Almost every feature people are asking for is already included in the Novatac p120, including a thermal sensor, on/off memory feature, reset for different battery types, forced modes, etc. IMO, the ultimate programmable light has been made already; Novatac just needs to resize it for AA. Besides, Novatac already knows how to get it right with the beam, something LiteFlux will probably need to learn to do.


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## qip (Jun 9, 2008)

mighty82 said:


> The fact that the LF5XT use almost twice the energy of a L2D/P2D/L1D at the same hotspot intensity (lux), must mean that this is a pretty floody light. The description and beamshot in the review backs that up. So for this light to reach a hotspot intensity of 3570lux, it must have a pretty amazing total output. Looking forward to some comparison reviews to similar lights like the NDI and the L1D. I think we are in for a suprise when it comes to total output here. :naughty:
> 
> I hope selfbuilt reviews it and puts it into the "Multi-stage 1AA Review" thread. Would be great to compare it to all those 1AA lights".




i would think LFX5T would kill in the output but the runtime sacrificed a little but more than good enough to get by..

ok all things being equal , based on eneloops the hotspot actually should be nearly the same as ndi and fenix but the spill the LFX5T just owns all...i actually thought the the Lfxt5t wouldnt match the hotspot of the 2 other lights from other preliminary numbers it looked like a complete flooder, but based on these numbers it seems it should be a nice wall of light still but will have a decent hotspot...you will notice for the extra 30-50 lux in spill the fenix has 40 minutes extra runtime so theres the trade off and its worth it ..you figure nimh or L91 would give a lot more added runtime and bump it over an hour so its all good

on a side note selfbuilt showed a 20 minute difference on L91 with fenix vs NDI ..eneloops show 45minute gap ...the LFX5T may have same effect and considering its close on runtime with NDI 49 & 53 ..you might get 2 hours+ on fenix and 1:50+ for LFX5T on L91


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## Doug (Jun 9, 2008)

Ok, what is that larger light... can not quite read it....



LED Cool said:


> LiteFlux confirms that the LF5XT can be lock out by untwisting the tail cap by half a turn.
> 
> here is some more photos of the LF5XT.
> 
> ...


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## Doug (Jun 9, 2008)

So, how does the circuit in this light from the one in the Novatac/HSD?


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## Doug (Jun 9, 2008)

I have not seen this info yet, I assume if you have the light on 100%, and the battery gets to the point where it can not supply enough power for 100% the light will step down to the next brightness level, correct? Now, this next brightness level, is it the one you define? So, if 1=100% for example, and you have 2 set to 50%, is that how it works?



Tubor said:


> ....and it automatically defaults to low mode if the battery is too weak for high....


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## Doug (Jun 9, 2008)

What is LEDcool's relationship with LF?



Kilovolt said:


> As several of us have verified there is a somewhat poor communication with LiteFlux while LEDCool is extremely good at this. You place your order directly with LF and sometimes you don't get a confirmation or they don't tell you that your light has been shipped...
> With LEDCool you always know what is happening to your order.
> This is the only difference.
> 
> ...


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## selfbuilt (Jun 9, 2008)

mighty82 said:


> The fact that the LF5XT use almost twice the energy of a L2D/P2D/L1D at the same hotspot intensity (lux), must mean that this is a pretty floody light. ... I hope selfbuilt reviews it and puts it into the "Multi-stage 1AA Review" thread. Would be great to compare it to all those 1AA lights".


I will indeed be doing a dedicated review of this light, and adding it to my 1AA round-up. 

I've ordered it from Khoo, but note that it usually takes a few days longer for packages to get to me here in Canada than it does for most of the US. And it will take a few days to do all the runtimes ... 

As for the output discussion here, something to keep in mind is the overall width of the spillbeam. As you'll notice in my 1AA round-up, the original LF5 had a narrower spillbeam overall compared to the NDI and L1D. Of course, that was a SSC and the reflector was presumably different. But if the overall spillbeam width of the LF5XT is again narrower than the other lights, then the brighter spill will not translate into as great an output difference as some might expect. 

Of course, once I get the light, overall output measures will be done in my lightbox and standard ceiling bounce method. FYI, I'm working on a Novatac 120P review right now - which has nicely demonstrated that my lightbox correlates very well with expect lumen output on the 120P. 

:wave:


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## Kilovolt (Jun 10, 2008)

Doug said:


> What is LEDcool's relationship with LF?


 
LEDCool is a Liteflux dealer located in Malaysia.


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## Doug (Jun 10, 2008)

Kilovolt said:


> LEDCool is a Liteflux dealer located in Malaysia.




Ahh! Thanks....


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## juplin (Jun 10, 2008)

Doug said:


> Ok, what is that larger light... can not quite read it....


The larger flashlight is SUPER FLASHLIGHT III designed and made by M. JORDAN.


----------



## Burgess (Jun 10, 2008)

M. Jordan (Michael Jordan)

is also known as ARCmania.



He is indeed a very knowledgeable and talented man.


:thumbsup:
_


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## Kilovolt (Jun 10, 2008)

*Shipping today !!*

:twothumbs


*Yes!*


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## Alexi* (Jun 10, 2008)

Well I don't think he will have time to test and ship all the lights he has about 3minutes/light.


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## mighty82 (Jun 10, 2008)

Alexi* said:


> Well I don't think he will have time to test and ship all the lights he has about 3minutes/light.


Well, I don't think he's going to test all modes and functions on every light, that would take weeks. Probably just turn it on, check beam/tint and click through the levels on both aa and 14500 battery. Should take less than 2 minutes.


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## Alexi* (Jun 10, 2008)

mighty82 said:


> Well, I don't think he's going to test all modes and functions on every light, that would take weeks. Probably just turn it on, check beam/tint and click through the levels on both aa and 14500 battery. Should take less than 2 minutes.


 You're forgetting packing, labeling and re-programming for those that asked for the battery safety to be turned on.


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## e0603 (Jun 11, 2008)

I've been following this thread with interest as this light really has some interesting features and a very nice beam pattern (IMO). I know this has already been said, but :twothumbs to LiteFlux for the pre-release changes based on the feedback in this thread!

I have a few questions about the interface after reading this thread, the Light-Review review, and the manual.

(1) The manual says a click is a press and release within 0.4 seconds and press-hold is recognized after holding for 1 second. If this is correct, what happens if you hold for between 0.4 seconds and 1 second and release, is this ignored? I expected a press-hold to start right after 0.4 seconds, as soon as it knows the action is not a click.

(2) I understand why it takes 0.4 seconds after clicking twice for it to apply the new mode, because it has to wait to see if you're going to do something else like a third click + press-hold to go into the settings menu. However, since there is not an action listed for 4xC, 6xC, 8xC, and so on, can you advance two modes by clicking four times, or do you need to click twice, wait 0.4 seconds, click twice again, and wait another 0.4 seconds? If you can't do the 4xC, 6xC, etc., it seems it could take a long time to go from mode 5 to mode 4, since every mode in between would need to be activated for at least 0.4 seconds This could be frustrating if one of those in-between modes is a strobe or high brightness level that you really don't want to pause on.

(3) Is there any chance that when the light is off, clicking twice will advance it to the second mode before turning the light on? (Or clicking three times, if it needs the first click to wake up.) This could be a great feature especially for someone who might want mode 1 to be 100% and mode 2 to be 5% -- you may not want to see 100% for 0.4 seconds before you can change to mode 2. Of course, even better if it supported the 4xC, 6xC, ... mentioned above!

Thanks in advance to anyone who can answer these questions!

Edit: thought of another question...

(4) Say you configure all 5 modes, then change the total number of modes to 3, are the settings for modes 4 and 5 saved, so they will be available if at a later time you change back to using all 5 modes? Or would modes 4 and 5 revert to the factory default settings?

It's funny, with most lights, I just accept what they can and can't do without thinking too hard about it...often accepting quickly that while it may not be perfect, it's still useful. With this one though, it's so flexible that I think everyone (myself included!) wants it to be just perfect for them. It's easy to forget how much it does do while thinking about the "what if's". Just a random thought... :thinking:


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## mighty82 (Jun 11, 2008)

Very good questions e0603.. I'm thinking about most of that stuff too. I'm most worried about not being able to choose what level to start at like I can with my fenixes, without having to start it up and reprogram the modes first. I will probably configure it like 50%-10%-2%, because I will be using the "medium" mode the most, and if I need 100% in bursts I just press and hold. 

But.. If i'm going at a camping trip I will have to reconfigure it to start at a low mode like 2%, cause I don't want to wait for it to turn on to 50% then double click and wait for 0.4 seconds, and then repeat. I will be blind by the time I get to the right level . If I could jump through the modes quickly, like with the L1D by just tapping 1 time for medium, 2 times for high, it would be okay to always start at low, but with this light it takes forever to get to the mode you want if it's not the first one. :ironic:

Also I really think this light should have the possibility to go backwards through the modes. Some click sequence to get back to the last mode, not having to cycle through all of the modes to get back to the one "behind" the one you are in. Especially in a light that you have to wait between every mode change. 

Another great function would be to be able to save different setups or "groups" for different usages. One with low modes for camping etc. and one for home/work.  Or better yet. Just make a flashlight I can hook up to my computer and configure everything just the way I want it to be. That's my dream flashlight. :thumbsup:


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## Alexi* (Jun 12, 2008)

Turning the light of and then on again most be the fastest way to go back.


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## Alexi* (Jun 13, 2008)

Didn't arrive today  will have to wait until Monday.


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## LED Cool (Jun 15, 2008)

e0603 said:


> (1) The manual says a click is a press and release within 0.4 seconds and press-hold is recognized after holding for 1 second. If this is correct, what happens if you hold for between 0.4 seconds and 1 second and release, is this ignored? I expected a press-hold to start right after 0.4 seconds, as soon as it knows the action is not a click.
> 
> nothing happens if you press for longer than 0.4 seconds but less than 1 second. press & hold (PH) required a time period of exactly 1 second, once that 1 second is up the light immediately reacts and gives you 100% output.
> 
> ...




khoo


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## Alexi* (Jun 16, 2008)

Wohooo flashlight in my hand :thanks:


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## momonbubu (Jun 16, 2008)

Alexi* said:


> Wohooo flashlight in my hand :thanks:



Beamshot please,


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## Alexi* (Jun 16, 2008)

There are som beamshots here: https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/200448

My first impresions are a bit mixed. I love the size an shape wery comfortable and ergonomical. My two midle fingers goes perfectly into the indents. And the lengt is just right so I don't need to cramp my hand to not get any of my fingers in front of the lins. Th tumb ends just at the end of the light. (Hm hard to explane, hope u all understund.)

The light was set to memory function on  
So I'a tring now to learn to program it so I can put it to off.

There is a sound in all modes, stongest in the 15% setting.

The light flickers for the first few seconds after turning it on. Not a stobe effect but like a 50Hz TV flicker.


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## Alexi* (Jun 16, 2008)

There seems to be a miss print in the manual or something wrong whit my light. Because I just tried changing the modes from 5 to 3. And saving and exiting whit 3xC+PH didn't do anything, it didn't even jump out of the mode setting "mode". But 3xC. Worked on my second try and changed the modes to 3.


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## e0603 (Jun 16, 2008)

Khoo, thanks for taking the time to answer each of my questions. It is very good news that it remembers the settings of "inactive" modes, I think that's a great feature!


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## rotototo (Jun 16, 2008)

just got mine - that's 5 day shipping to the UK, if Khoo's keeping track. Probably would have arrived yesterday if they still did Sunday deliveries here.

Two observations - no sounds on NiMH in all modes except 100%, which is fine by me.

Second observation is slightly more serious. If the LF5XT is hit hard enough, the battery and sleeve breaks contact with the head for a split second, which the MCU interprets as a 1xC. What does that mean? Drop the light hard enough, and it turns off...


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## Alexi* (Jun 16, 2008)

rotototo said:


> Second observation is slightly more serious. If the LF5XT is hit hard enough, the battery and sleeve breaks contact with the head for a split second, which the MCU interprets as a 1xC. What does that mean? Drop the light hard enough, and it turns off...


 How did you test that?


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## rotototo (Jun 16, 2008)

Just smack the back of the light when it's on. Or, drop it from about two meters onto carpet.


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## Alexi* (Jun 16, 2008)

rotototo said:


> Just smack the back of the light when it's on. Or, drop it from about two meters onto carpet.


Ok, I tried now and managed to hit it so hard that I could here the batteri bottoming out in there. Had to hit it REALY hard to manage that, but no change in light at all!


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## Sir Lightalot (Jun 16, 2008)

That shouldn't happen because the battery and switch use two different signal paths remember?


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## Alexi* (Jun 17, 2008)

Ok after some night testing I have noticed some problems.
It whines in all modes and 1% is blindingly bright if pointed at the white paper of a book. Pointing the light so only the spill hits the pages works. But night reading is difficult.

The light flickers constantly in some modes, like 15% 

But on a more positive note the tint looks super white 

It's super easy to program! In bed when I noticed the flickering at 15% i just re programed the brightness slightly to stop the flickering, only took like 2sek.


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## mighty82 (Jun 17, 2008)

Alexi* said:


> The light flickers constantly in some modes, like 15%


That sucks  I really thought liteflux was better than this. Everyone is rushing out products without testing everything.


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## h.g.trunnion (Jun 18, 2008)

Hi,

did anybody who has already received the lamp notice any flickering in whatever mode?

Or notice any sort of audible sound in whatever mode?

As a matter of fact, I'm extremely sensitive on both technical faults and have already sold or given away flashlights for one of these faults.

I really hope, this doesn't have to be the case here...

Your feedback is welcome, though.

Regards,

Norbert


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## Thujone (Jun 18, 2008)

You should see no flicker, however inductor whine has been reported.


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## juplin (Jun 18, 2008)

Thujone said:


> You should see no flicker, however inductor whine has been reported.


Basically agree with that.
Few Li-ion's might tend to produce flicker, but most Li-ion's will not. LF5XT is somewhat battery-sensitive IMO.

Inductor whine will mostly be heard at 100% output. Reasonably reducing the highest output level, for example from 100% to 90%, will eliminate or at least lower the inductor whine.
The 100% output can still be accessed by press & hold of the button if needed.


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## 45/70 (Jun 18, 2008)

Just a wild guess, possibly the 14500 fix is causing the switching diode to "hunt" for the proper voltage, causing the flicker. Then again, what do I know. :shrug:

Dave


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## Alexi* (Jun 18, 2008)

The whine is noticeable even at 1% output. I have a plan to try and film the flickering but I think it will be hard as it has to be of frequency whit the fps of the camera. But I will try next week.


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## gunga (Jun 25, 2008)

Just a question.

I notice that with memory mode set to off and momentary set to on, momentary always defaults to memory mode.

IE. If you last had it on strobe, the momentary will be strobe. When you turn the light on, it will go back to mode 1, but momentary does not.

:shakehead

Does anyone else notice this?


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## mighty82 (Jun 25, 2008)

Yup.. But I kind of like it..


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## smg (Jun 25, 2008)

gunga said:


> Just a question.
> 
> I notice that with memory mode set to off and momentary set to on, momentary always defaults to memory mode.
> 
> ...


Does that mean you can't have momentary on with memory off? Or, do you just need to go back and turn memory off?


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## mighty82 (Jun 25, 2008)

smg said:


> Does that mean you can't have momentary on with memory off? Or, do you just need to go back and turn memory off?


It just means that momentary will come on at the last used level, even if memory is turned off. If you turn it on completely it will start at the first mode.


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## smg (Jun 25, 2008)

Oh. I don't like that.

Your last point was not clear to me:


mighty82 said:


> ... If you turn it on completely it will start at the first mode.


Did you mean that, if you turn the light on for a certain period of time, it will later start at that setting? It won't start at the first mode, right? Or maybe I didn't understand the first part


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## mighty82 (Jun 25, 2008)

When you turn it on (not momentary) it will start from the first mode if memory is off, or from the last used mode if memory is on.

Momentary will always be at the level the light was in the last time you turned it off. Doesn't matter if memory is on or off.

Momentary and memory are 2 different things, and are independent from each other.

I hope you understand


----------



## gunga (Jun 25, 2008)

The light has 1 - 5 modes.

If you turn memory off, the light will always start in mode 1 whenever you turn it off, then on again (doesn't matter what the momentary setting is).

BUT, this does not apply to the momentary mode. Momentary always defaults to last mode used. If you had it on strobe last (say mode 4), it will turn on strobe when used as momentary. When you turn it back on though (not momentary) it goes to mode 1, tho it may flash for a brief second first (it goes into momentary for say 0.4 seconds, then switches to mode 1).


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## smg (Jun 25, 2008)

Thanks mighty82. I understand now.



gunga said:


> The light has 1 - 5 modes.
> 
> If you turn memory off, the light will always start in mode 1 whenever you turn it off, then on again (doesn't matter what the momentary setting is).
> 
> BUT, this does not apply to the momentary mode. Momentary always defaults to last mode used. If you had it on strobe last (say mode 4), it will turn on strobe when used as momentary. When you turn it back on though (not momentary) it goes to mode 1, tho it may flash for a brief second first (it goes into momentary for say 0.4 seconds, then switches to mode 1).


So, if you last used 100% in momentary, turning momentary off will still show that last mode (for 0.4 sec) before going to mode 1. ...just the first time, as I understand it.

The more I learn about this light, the more things I don't really like. Don't get me wrong, it's still a great achievement, but... When momentary is off, I want to be able to click 3 times, each click within 0.4 sec of that last click, and move straight into the third level.

I also really do not like this:


> Originally Posted by *e0603*
> 
> 
> _
> ...



_I don't understand the logic behind some of the design decisions. There does not seem to be a reason why the light cannot react to the PH after 0.4 sec instead of 1 second._


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## mighty82 (Jun 25, 2008)

This I don't understand:


smg said:


> So, if you last used 100% in momentary, turning momentary off will still show that last mode (for 0.4 sec) before going to mode 1. ...just the first time, as I understand it.



This I agree with:


smg said:


> _I don't understand the logic behind some of the design decisions. There does not seem to be a reason why the light cannot react to the PH after 0.4 sec instead of 1 second._


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## gunga (Jun 25, 2008)

smg said:


> So, if you last used 100% in momentary, turning momentary off will still show that last mode (for 0.4 sec) before going to mode 1. ...just the first time, as I understand it.


 
Actually no. If momentary is off, there is a 0.4 second delay between pushing the button and the light turning on.

The strange behaviour of last mode flash is only if momentary is on.
It's a bit quirky, but I really do like this light. Wish the low was lower tho (looks like 4-5 lumens, not super low).

I like the interface a lot better than the twisty versions and I like the flexibility of the programmable interface. A bit complicated but very powerful.


----------



## naturelle (Jun 26, 2008)

h.g.trunnion said:


> did anybody who has already received the lamp notice any flickering in whatever mode?
> 
> Or notice any sort of audible sound in whatever mode?



Yes:thumbsdow
My light arrived today and I can confirm both, flickering¹ and humming. The flickering is only sometimes (I noticed it first time when I used AW14500), when I shut off and on again the light mostly the flickering is away. Perhaps it is possible that flickering is caused by bad soldering: while flickering the humming is better hearable. Grmbl.


naturelle
¹: it´s NO PWM-flickering, it´s a little bit like contact-problem-flickering. But when the problem starts, it only visible in one mode, clicking into the next mode shows no more flickering. An example: Turning the light on on the 15%-level (mode-2) shows me flickering. Turning to mode-3: no flickering; mode-4: no flickering; mode-5: flickering!?. Turning the light off and then on again, and there´s no flickering, neither in mode-2 nor in mode-5.
So: no contact-problem, no cleaning-problem (I´ve cleaned the light, shurely).

Another CON: in my opinion it would be better to take the double-click for turning on and off, and to take the simple click to switch between the modes. A double click also is a "smarter" turn-on-protection then loosening the threads.
And another one: it´s my first light with notches on the bezel. My opinion: never ever again! If wearing in my trousers these awful notches will destroy all pockets.

PRO: the UI is simple to understand in programming, too; much more simple than the programming-UI from the LF2/3/4.
And a BIG PRO: a nearly perfect machining and finish. The machining from Liteflux is MUCH better than Jetbeam or Fenix in my eyes.

Update: The flickering seems to appear in all modes with a level over 50% (but not on 100%) on 14500 OR with 100%-level on AA-primary.


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## mighty82 (Jun 26, 2008)

I have experienced flickering in 5% with 14500, but only with one specific battery. No change if I turned it on/off.

100% flickers always at startup if the li-ion is below 3.6V, and in 100% on li-ion it always screams like a dying....something.. Have not seen any flickering in any mode with nimh. I only use 100% in bursts, so it's not a big problem for me.


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## Thujone (Jun 26, 2008)

naturelle said:


> And another one: it´s my first light with notches on the bezel. My opinion: never ever again! If wearing in my trousers these awful notches will destroy all pockets.



I think you are worrying prematurely. I have many crenelated bezels and pocket carry them all, not a single pair of pants have been ruined and this is very minor crenelation compared to other lights I have.


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## naturelle (Jun 26, 2008)

May be. It´s my first one and - I don`t like it. So it is the last pocket-light with crenelated bezel.


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## LED-holic (Jun 28, 2008)

Guys, where are reviews for this light?

What are the max lumens and min lumens?

Run times, etc?

Wondering why this light doesn't have as much activity any more...


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## 45/70 (Jun 28, 2008)

I think the main problem is there are only a handful of them in peoples hands, so far. I have one on order, but there has been short supply.

Dave


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## Lobo (Jun 28, 2008)

LED-holic said:


> Guys, where are reviews for this light?
> 
> What are the max lumens and min lumens?
> 
> ...



The're is a review over at http://light-reviews.com/


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## gadgetnerd (Jun 28, 2008)

LED-holic said:


> Guys, where are reviews for this light?
> 
> What are the max lumens and min lumens?
> 
> ...



Pobably not much activity since so few people actually received them due to Cree shortages at LiteFlux. The D10/EX10 hype also probably diverted a few people's attention 

I'm absolutely loving on the light, and wrote a review a week or so ago with a few beamshots.


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## LED-holic (Jun 28, 2008)

gadgetnerd said:


> Pobably not much activity since so few people actually received them due to Cree shortages at LiteFlux. The D10/EX10 hype also probably diverted a few people's attention
> 
> I'm absolutely loving on the light, and wrote a review a week or so ago with a few beamshots.


Thanks a lot for your info. I was hoping a few others would also be as enthusiastic and give their feedback as well. I was also hoping Selfbuilt would do his thorough runtime reviews as well...


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## WadeF (Jun 28, 2008)

gadgetnerd said:


> Pobably not much activity since so few people actually received them due to Cree shortages at LiteFlux.


 
+1

Mine has yet to ship. The 1st batch that went out from LED_Cool weren't all that many and that is all that he has been able to send out so far. He will be getting another batch and shipping them Monday/Tuesday, but I have no idea how many of us this next batch will cover.


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## LED-holic (Jun 28, 2008)

WadeF said:


> +1
> 
> Mine has yet to ship. The 1st batch that went out from LED_Cool weren't all that many and that is all that he has been able to send out so far. He will be getting another batch and shipping them Monday/Tuesday, but I have no idea how many of us this next batch will cover.


WadeF - I hope you will do a video review of this and the NiteCore D10 when you get them... as well as lots of flashlight p0rn photos and hands on feedback!!


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## Tubor (Jun 28, 2008)

What's the low like with NiMh?


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## gadgetnerd (Jun 28, 2008)

Tubor said:


> What's the low like with NiMh?



1-2lm at a guess. About the same as the NDI minimum.


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## Yapo (Jun 29, 2008)

Post removed.


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## Burgess (Jun 29, 2008)

to Yapo --


This is a *Sales Thread*, started by Khoo ( LED Cool ).


It is *not appropriate* to mention Other Dealers here.


Thank you.


:shakehead
_


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## Yapo (Jun 29, 2008)

sorry!
just thought people who missed out on the pre orders might want a heads up if theyre desperate enough...
i meant no offence/disrespect.


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## TooManyGizmos (Jun 29, 2008)

..
:shakehead .. My comment removed .........

Due to Steve L 's observation in next post.


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## Steve L (Jun 29, 2008)

I believe this is a LF5XT informational thread started by Khoo, not his sales thread. Khoo's sales thread is in the CPF Marketplace in the Dealers Corner. Sales threads are not allowed on CPF proper.


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## TooManyGizmos (Jun 29, 2008)

..
 .. Guess you're right ...... Steve L



but it still wasn't very nice

....... I removed my previous comment
.


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## Yapo (Jun 29, 2008)

I had a look at the sales thread in the market place and the "issue" has been mentioned already so i'll remove it out of this thread then...


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## TooManyGizmos (Jun 29, 2008)

..
.. Sorry Yapo , I should not have gotten involved . My mistake.



...... but I do think it was kind of you to remove it .


Respectfully ............. TooManyGizmos 
.


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## Burgess (Jun 30, 2008)

Oops, *sorry to all*.

My mistake. 



Seems this IS an information thread. 


I got *confused *between this one, and the *actual*
sales thread in the Marketplace.


Sorry for any confusion i may have caused.


Never Mind ! ! !


_


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## Smile (Jun 30, 2008)

:twothumbswonderful stuff!


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## Sigman (Jul 1, 2008)

Closing part 1 & continuing here.


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