# Run-Time Plot - Mini Mag LED 2xAA & 3xAA



## Roy (Sep 5, 2006)

These runtime plots are for the Mini Mag LED light using 2 and 3 AA batteries. 

Equipment used is a Extech Mdl 401021 Light Adapter into a Radio Shack 22-805 multimeter with a PC interface that is using Scopeview software (V 1.08).

The vertical axis is in VDC and is equivalent to [email protected] per 1 mVDC. The horizontal axas is in units of time.

Be aware that your actual battery milage may vary from that indicated by this runtime plot.


For the 2xAA Mini Mag LED the Runtime = 3h 45m







For the 3xAA Mini Mag LED the Runtime = 2h 52m






2xAA Mini Mag LED using Energizer Lithium batteries
Runtime to 50% Max brightness = 6h






3xAA Mini Mag LED using Energizer Lithium batteries
Runtime to 50% Max Brightness = 4h 46m


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## clipse (Sep 5, 2006)

I'm not seeing anything. The URL doesn't work either. 

Am I the only one that doesn't see it?

clipse


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## leeleefocus (Sep 5, 2006)

I can't see it either


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## clipse (Sep 5, 2006)

There it is. Awesome. Runtime on the 2xAA looks about what I figured. I got 4 1/2 hours but no biggie. I'm suprised about the 3xAA. Looks like no regulation at all. Strange. 

Thanks Roy. That answers some questions that I had. 

clipse


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## chimo (Sep 5, 2006)

Roy, thanks for the graphs! 

The 2xAA looks like a simple boost circuit.

Wow, pretty poor regulation for the 3xAAA model. Looks like resistored "regulation". Even a simple LDO regulator would have been a great improvement on this one.


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## ernsanada (Sep 5, 2006)

I am also surprised about the run times of the 3AA.


Thanks Roy!


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## nikon (Sep 5, 2006)

I measured a couple of things on the 3AA today. Between the + input on the module and the + terminal on the LED, there is zero resistance. But I get no reading between the LED - and ground, which seems to indicate that there is some sort of circuitry in there, even if the graph doesn't look like it. 

I also started a runtime measurement today on the 3AA, starting with nearly depleted alkaline batteries measuring 1v. each. The light has been running for six hours now and it's still producing enough light to navigate in a dark room or to read a map or newspaper. The batteries measure .9v. each at this point, and I'd judge the output to be around 1 lumen.

If Roy's runtime graphs were to be superimposed, it would show that the 3AA starts out at almost twice the level of the 2AA and stays well above the level of the 2AA at all times. It doesn't reach the 2AA's starting brightness until 2 1/2 hours into the test and takes another 2 1/2 hours to reach the 2AA's cutoff level, five hours total compared with the 2AA's 4 hours. The 3AA also has a long tail of usable light, which the 2AA doesn't have. The 3AA is a much better performer.


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## Roy (Sep 6, 2006)

Added a runtime plot for the 2xAA Mini Mag LED using the Energizer lithium batteries.


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## CM (Sep 6, 2006)

Thanks Roy. You confirmed my suspicion about the 3AA. The 2AA was already revealed to use the old Zetex circuit that we CPF'ers have been playing with 5 or 6 years ago.


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## chimo (Sep 7, 2006)

CM said:


> Thanks Roy. You confirmed my suspicion about the 3AA. The 2AA was already revealed to use the old Zetex circuit that we CPF'ers have been playing with 5 or 6 years ago.



CM, do you have the link about the Zetex in the 2AA? Thanks,

Paul


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## JohnK (Sep 7, 2006)

I like the fact that Lithium batteries turn an unregulated light into one that sure LOOKS like it is regulated. 

Plus double+ runtime.

I'm always looking for sales on AAA/AA Lithiums.


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## CM (Sep 7, 2006)

chimo said:


> CM, do you have the link about the Zetex in the 2AA? Thanks,
> 
> Paul



Here you go:

https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/131398


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## Raven (Sep 7, 2006)

Is it just me, or is the 3aa's regulation a disappointment?


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## CM (Sep 7, 2006)

Raven said:


> Is it just me, or does the 3aa a disappointment?



It's not you. I quote:

"Now, after years of research & development, testing and refinement, Mag Instrument is committed to introducing, in early 2006, a line of MAG-LED™ flashlights." 

So the best they have is what appears to be resistor drive (or it might as well be) on the 3AA, and a circuit that appeared on Zetex's data sheet five years ago. However, it is good that Mag finally came out to introduce high brightness LED's to the general masses. That part is good.


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## NewBie (Sep 7, 2006)

Related threads to the Zetex I dug up for folks over the weekend, with help from Google:

https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/96037
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/posts/1576620#post1576620
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/76065&page=3

Enjoy!


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## chimo (Sep 7, 2006)

CM said:


> Here you go:
> 
> https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/131398



CM, I must be blind. I still can't find the Zetex reference in that thread. I had done a Google search as well, and couldn't find it. Perhaps it was edited out? Thanks,

Paul


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## mchlwise (Sep 7, 2006)

nikon said:


> If Roy's runtime graphs were to be superimposed, it would show that the 3AA starts out at almost twice the level of the 2AA and stays well above the level of the 2AA at all times. It doesn't reach the 2AA's starting brightness until 2 1/2 hours into the test and takes another 2 1/2 hours to reach the 2AA's cutoff level, five hours total compared with the 2AA's 4 hours. The 3AA also has a long tail of usable light, which the 2AA doesn't have. The 3AA is a much better performer.



Thanks for putting it in perspective. Helps a lot!

I'm still disappointed the 3AA doesn't have a flatter curve, but that still helps.


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## Bmccue1964 (Sep 7, 2006)

I just bought the 2AA version. I can't wait to try it out. My thought was that the 3AA version looked ergonomically terrible - too long. However, it reminded me of a marshal arts weapon I trained with.


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## Roy (Sep 7, 2006)

Added a runtime plot for the 3xAA Mini Mag LED using Energizer Lithium batteries. Notice that while the 2xAA has a longer runtime (6h), the 3xAA has a shorter runtime (4h 46m) but chugs along at about TWICE the output of the 2xAA.!


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## Phaserburn (Sep 7, 2006)

Wow. The 2AA not only has longer runtime on lithiums, but is significantly brighter all the way, not to mention the flatter output curve. I'm loading lithiums in mine!


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## ElektroLumens (Sep 7, 2006)

Roy said:


> Added a runtime plot for the 2xAA Mini Mag LED using the Energizer lithium batteries.



Can you do a run time test using NIMH rechargables?

Wayne


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## Roy (Sep 7, 2006)

Wayne....short answer...no on the rechargeaables.


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## JohnK (Sep 7, 2006)

What did I tell you.

Lithiums RULE.


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## nikon (Sep 8, 2006)

nikon said:


> I measured a couple of things on the 3AA today. Between the + input on the module and the + terminal on the LED, there is zero resistance. But I get no reading between the LED - and ground, which seems to indicate that there is some sort of circuitry in there, even if the graph doesn't look like it.


I just took a 3AA module apart and there is indeed circuitry inside. Here are couple of pics....


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## Haz (Sep 8, 2006)

What is the purpose of the circuit in the 3AA module?


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## nikon (Sep 8, 2006)

Haz said:


> What is the purpose of the circuit in the 3AA module?


It lowers the power to the LED to keep it from burning out.


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## ps56k (Sep 8, 2006)

CM said:


> It's not you. I quote:
> 
> "Now, after years of research & development, testing and refinement, Mag Instrument is committed to introducing, in early 2006, a line of MAG-LED™ flashlights."
> 
> So the best they have is what appears to be resistor drive (or it might as well be) on the 3AA, and a circuit that appeared on Zetex's data sheet five years ago. However, it is good that Mag finally came out to introduce high brightness LED's to the general masses. That part is good.



yeah - it must be really important to them 
as they don't even list the products on their own webpage - 
http://www.maglite.com/productline.asp


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## bullinchinashop (Sep 8, 2006)

That 2AA runtime is just downright *** U G L Y *** It stats dropping from the second it's turned on! What's the point of this light?? If I get on e of these things it'll be the 3AA or one of the D models.


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## geepondy (Sep 8, 2006)

So can anybody look at those nice pictures and recognize the circuitry for sure? The 617 must be either a diode, FET or transister but it would be nice to see what the lettering of the six leg IC is.


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## Lit Up (Sep 8, 2006)

bullinchinashop said:


> That 2AA runtime is just downright *** U G L Y *** It stats dropping from the second it's turned on! What's the point of this light?? If I get on e of these things it'll be the 3AA or one of the D models.



If you don't own any of the MagLEDs and are planning to only get one, get the D size.

I have the 2AA, 3AA and the 4D. If I could keep only one, it would be my D cell hands down.


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## chimo (Sep 8, 2006)

geepondy said:


> So can anybody look at those nice pictures and recognize the circuitry for sure? The 617 must be either a diode, FET or transister but it would be nice to see what the lettering of the six leg IC is.



Check out the links Newbie has posted above. It's a Zetex circuit. BTW, the IC has 5 legs.  

Paul


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## geepondy (Sep 8, 2006)

Oh Ok, I thought it was just speculation.


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## NewBie (Sep 9, 2006)

geepondy said:


> So can anybody look at those nice pictures and recognize the circuitry for sure? The 617 must be either a diode, FET or transister but it would be nice to see what the lettering of the six leg IC is.



Zetex brand FMMT617 Silicon switching transistor that folks were utilizing back in 2001 with the Zetex circuit:
http://www.zetex.com/3.0/pdf/FMMT617.pdf


Keep posting guys, at this rate, by 2009, they might make it up to some of the old Maxim chips that Dat2zip was using in in BadBoy in 2002.


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## chevrofreak (Sep 9, 2006)

Roy, did you fan cool the light during the runtime? I got quite a different curve on the 3AA than you did.


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## eebowler (Sep 9, 2006)

ROY is BACK!  Hey Roy, it's good to see you posting again. :twothumbs:


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## nikon (Sep 10, 2006)

chevrofreak said:


> Roy, did you fan cool the light during the runtime? I got quite a different curve on the 3AA than you did.


What sort of curve did you get? Inquiring minds want to know.


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## Roy (Sep 10, 2006)

The only fan in use is a 48 inch ceiling fan. The lights sit in the open and get cooled by a VERY gentle air movement.


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## Erasmus (Sep 10, 2006)

Great job Roy!


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## chevrofreak (Sep 10, 2006)

I directly fan cooled the lights when I ran them, using a 14" fan on high from about a foot away.







Here's a closeup of the first hour.






I think the thermal throttling may have had something to do with it.


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## InfidelCastro (Sep 10, 2006)

So you can't use rechargeables in either light?


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## CM (Sep 10, 2006)

InfidelCastro said:


> So you can't use rechargeables in either light?



They work on the 2AA, should also work with the 3AA model.


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## InfidelCastro (Sep 11, 2006)

Are their any runtime graphs out there? I'm interested in the 3AA, but it's pretty long. I was wondering what the output and runtime is compared to other AA lights out there.


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## nikon (Sep 11, 2006)

InfidelCastro said:


> Are their any runtime graphs out there? I'm interested in the 3AA, but it's pretty long. I was wondering what the output and runtime is compared to other AA lights out there.


Just out of curiosity...did you happen to notice the first post in this thread?


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## woodrow (Sep 19, 2006)

Roy,

Thanks for the runtime plots for the 3AA. I bought one and a pack of Energizer Lithiums for it. I am verry happy. Lithium batts make the light. Thanks again.


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## InfidelCastro (Sep 20, 2006)

nikon said:


> Just out of curiosity...did you happen to notice the first post in this thread?




Guess I wasn't clear enough, I was looking for a NIMH runtime graph for the 2AA or 3AA model.


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## Flame (Sep 20, 2006)

InfidelCastro said:


> Guess I wasn't clear enough, I was looking for a NIMH runtime graph for the 2AA or 3AA model.


 
Try here...

http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showpost.php?p=1600817&postcount=1


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## InfidelCastro (Sep 20, 2006)

Flame said:


> Try here...
> 
> http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showpost.php?p=1600817&postcount=1





Thank you!!


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## chevrofreak (Sep 20, 2006)

Flame said:


> Try here...
> 
> http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showpost.php?p=1600817&postcount=1


 
here also https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/132640

the runtimes from light to light seem to be pretty inconsistent


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