# New Defiant ArmorMax Lights at Home Depot!



## mikekoz (Mar 2, 2013)

No, this thread is not about the 550 lumen 3C model that has been out for a while, or the 493 lumen 3C model with the larger head that came after it. I just got back from HD and they had 3 new Defiant lights. First and for most, a 3D model rated at 590 lumens, a 3C model rated at 224, and a 2AA that puts out 70. These are a bit different than than the other 3C models. All of them have three modes, high, low, and unfortunately, strobe, but they also come with rubber guards that you slip over the head and tail of the lights! They are called LED ArmorMax lights. I picked up the 3D and 2AA models and have just started playing with them. They are made like tanks, have better knurling than the "older" models, and the finish on them is a bit better than the others I have. I will try to post some photos a little later today!


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## StarHalo (Mar 2, 2013)

How's the mode switching/interface work?


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## EscapeVelocity (Mar 2, 2013)

Ive been looking for the larger head 3C model, but it never showed up. 

Ill look on Sunday, when I go by Home Depot, but wont be holding my breath that they will have any new Defiant's.

If these are anything like the Brinkmann Armormax models, then they should be pretty good.


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## mikekoz (Mar 2, 2013)

StarHalo said:


> How's the mode switching/interface work?



It is a reverse clicky and will go from high-low-strobe as you turn it off and on. You can also half press on the switch to change modes once on. The strobe can be avoided easily if you do not want it.


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## Lobstradomus (Mar 2, 2013)

I was asked picked up one of the Defiant 3D ArmorMax lights for a fellow flashaholic who really liked my 3C Super Thrower. I had no idea it would be such an ordeal since my 3C was sitting in a display box in the middle of the electrical supplies. Customer service was of no help despite their inventory showing they had 6 3D's in stock; they were just as helpful when I asked about getting another 3C -again despite supposedly having 35 in stock. I was wandering the tool section when one of the sales associates asked if I needed anything and he practically jumped at the chance to help, he started pulling down boxes and low and behold he found the 35 3C's in a box right in front of the box of 3D's. 

Side by side the 3D seems huge -especially with the rubber bumpers on, the reflector is just as wide as the one on the 3C but it is a good bit more shallow so it doesn't have as tight a hot spot. The switch seemed a little bit flaky on the 3D as well, but I haven't had a chance to really investigate that.


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## TEEJ (Mar 2, 2013)

I just tried a few out....they put out almost no LIGHT for their size compared to other options.

They seem to be a poor man's version of the poor man's version (Rayovac Indestructible) of a consumer LED light.

The feel and light from the Indestructibles was better, which, considering that the Indestructible wasn't a great light OTHER than its feel, also having **** poor light output, etc... the Defiants are not worth looking at, for me at least.

The Rayovacs seem to have potential as hosts for P60 drop-ins. If the Defiants work for that too, maybe they can find a niche.


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## mikekoz (Mar 2, 2013)

TEEJ said:


> I just tried a few out....they put out almost no LIGHT for their size compared to other options.
> 
> They seem to be a poor man's version of the poor man's version (Rayovac Indestructible) of a consumer LED light.
> 
> ...



The Rayovac D cell light puts out 140 lumens. The Defiant D cell is 590! It blows it off the map! The AA versions of the Rayovac and Defiant are 70 and 100 lumens respectfully and you cannot tell the difference by looking at the beams. I will agree that the AA version could have been made to put out more light (on both). Which two did you try?


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## StarHalo (Mar 3, 2013)

The evidence suggests the low mode is 50%; kind of disappointing given what kind of runtime you could get from 3 D cells and a rational low mode..


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## mikekoz (Mar 3, 2013)

StarHalo said:


> The evidence suggests the low mode is 50%; kind of disappointing given what kind of runtime you could get from 3 D cells and a rational low mode..



From what I can see, that is probably accurate. Could be better...could be worse! I have a few lights where you can hardly see a difference between high and low.


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## mikekoz (Mar 3, 2013)

Lobstradomus said:


> I was asked picked up one of the Defiant 3D ArmorMax lights for a fellow flashaholic who really liked my 3C Super Thrower. I had no idea it would be such an ordeal since my 3C was sitting in a display box in the middle of the electrical supplies. Customer service was of no help despite their inventory showing they had 6 3D's in stock; they were just as helpful when I asked about getting another 3C -again despite supposedly having 35 in stock. I was wandering the tool section when one of the sales associates asked if I needed anything and he practically jumped at the chance to help, he started pulling down boxes and low and behold he found the 35 3C's in a box right in front of the box of 3D's.
> 
> Side by side the 3D seems huge -especially with the rubber bumpers on, the reflector is just as wide as the one on the 3C but it is a good bit more shallow so it doesn't have as tight a hot spot. The switch seemed a little bit flaky on the 3D as well, but I haven't had a chance to really investigate that.



The switch on my 3D model is flakey also. If I cannot fix it, I am going to exchange it tomorrow.


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## Lobstradomus (Mar 3, 2013)

mikekoz said:


> The switch on my 3D model is flakey also. If I cannot fix it, I am going to exchange it tomorrow.



Rumor is it is a problem with the o-ring interfering with the tail cap connection, seems like if you really crank down on the tail cap it overcomes the issue but I still really haven't had a chance to tear it apart and investigate.


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## mikekoz (Mar 4, 2013)

Lobstradomus said:


> Rumor is it is a problem with the o-ring interfering with the tail cap connection, seems like if you really crank down on the tail cap it overcomes the issue but I still really haven't had a chance to tear it apart and investigate.



Apparently on mine, the problem was the assembly that the LED is on. After it did not come on using a piece of metal over the - end of the battery and the rear edge of the light, I screwed off the head. The metal assembly that the LED is on was loose and not screwed in all of the way. It has worked ever since.


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## EscapeVelocity (Mar 4, 2013)

Dont like Rear clickies on these larger lights. The 3C was boasting around 200 lumens and the 3D about 600 lumens. Also dont like the strobe mode. Ill probably pass. 

The Brinkmann Armormax are more interesting to me. And they have a 186500 model as well.


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## mikekoz (Mar 5, 2013)

I picked up one of the 3C's yesterday just to have the full collection! :naughty: After owning these for a few days I thought I would give a short rundown of what I like and dislike about them. I will start with the positives. First of all, they seem like they are built very solid and will put up with a lot of abuse. This makes them great lights for use in a car, truck, toolkit, etc. If accurate, the runtime on them is good. Three hours for the AA model, and 18 for the C and D's. This is the ratings on the package for the high mode. They give no runtime for low. I have no way of knowing if they are regulated, however. All three have a nice white tint and nice beams, although for some reason the C models beam is a bit ringy. The D model, my favorite, is very bright! All three have low modes which are decent, but could have been made a bit lower. Maximum lumen ratings on them are 590 for the D, 224 for the C, and 70 for the AA. Nothing is perfect, however, and there will always be things we do not like about lights we purchase. The three modes on the C and D models cannot be skipped. You turn them on and it comes up with the mode after the last that was used. All three are high-low-strobe, but the AA model allows you to skip the strobe. If you turn it off for over a few seconds, then turn it back on, it will start on high. I am not sure why just the AA model was designed this way. I also think they could have made the AA model with a bit more output, maybe 150 lumens and wonder why they did not use the same LED in the C model like the earlier models that were around before the holidays. We would have had a 500 lumen C cell ArmorMax. When the rubber cover is put over the tail, the switch is hard to activate with your thumb. All in all I think these are great brick and mortar lights and I am glad I added them to my collection!


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## Hooked on Fenix (Mar 5, 2013)

What is the cost for the 3D and the 3C lights? No one has mentioned the cost yet. I'd love to see the 3D light if it is around $25 or under. Otherwise, I can get a 2 pack of 3C lights that are 500 lumens from Costco for under $30. If the 3D light runs for 18 hours on high, then it is probably drawing about 1 amp an hour. If low is at 50%, that would be around 500 mAh.


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## mikekoz (Mar 5, 2013)

Hooked on Fenix said:


> What is the cost for the 3D and the 3C lights? No one has mentioned the cost yet. I'd love to see the 3D light if it is around $25 or under. Otherwise, I can get a 2 pack of 3C lights that are 500 lumens from Costco for under $30. If the 3D light runs for 18 hours on high, then it is probably drawing about 1 amp an hour. If low is at 50%, that would be around 500 mAh.


 
The 3D is $29.99 and 3C $24.99. In my opinion, the D model is a better value.


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## Phaserburn (Mar 5, 2013)

Anyone have pics of these lights?


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## mikekoz (Mar 5, 2013)

Phaserburn said:


> Anyone have pics of these lights?





Uploaded with ImageShack.us



Uploaded with ImageShack.us


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## [email protected] (Mar 11, 2013)

mikekoz said:


> I picked up one of the 3C's yesterday just to have the full collection! :naughty: After owning these for a few days I thought I would give a short rundown of what I like and dislike about them. I will start with the positives. First of all, they seem like they are built very solid and will put up with a lot of abuse. This makes them great lights for use in a car, truck, toolkit, etc. If accurate, the runtime on them is good. Three hours for the AA model, and 18 for the C and D's. This is the ratings on the package for the high mode. They give no runtime for low. I have no way of knowing if they are regulated, however. All three have a nice white tint and nice beams, although for some reason the C models beam is a bit ringy. The D model, my favorite, is very bright! All three have low modes which are decent, but could have been made a bit lower. Maximum lumen ratings on them are 590 for the D, 224 for the C, and 70 for the AA. Nothing is perfect, however, and there will always be things we do not like about lights we purchase. The three modes on the C and D models cannot be skipped. You turn them on and it comes up with the mode after the last that was used. All three are high-low-strobe, but the AA model allows you to skip the strobe. If you turn it off for over a few seconds, then turn it back on, it will start on high. I am not sure why just the AA model was designed this way. I also think they could have made the AA model with a bit more output, maybe 150 lumens and wonder why they did not use the same LED in the C model like the earlier models that were around before the holidays. We would have had a 500 lumen C cell ArmorMax. When the rubber cover is put over the tail, the switch is hard to activate with your thumb. All in all I think these are great brick and mortar lights and I am glad I added them to my collection!



Mikekoz,
Does the Defiant ArmorMax 3d cell have a better throw than the Defiant 493 3c cell?
Thanks.
Ted


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## gradio (Mar 11, 2013)

I wonder how the 2AA compares to the Rayovac Indestructible 2AA that HD carries.
I recently bought 3 of the Rayovac's, was pressing on time so didn't get to check out other HD lights.


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## gearhead1972 (Mar 12, 2013)

Hooked on Fenix said:


> What is the cost for the 3D and the 3C lights? No one has mentioned the cost yet. I'd love to see the 3D light if it is around $25 or under. Otherwise, I can get a 2 pack of 3C lights that are 500 lumens from Costco for under $30. If the 3D light runs for 18 hours on high, then it is probably drawing about 1 amp an hour. If low is at 50%, that would be around 500 mAh.


Just got one yesterday, blows by Malkoff modified mag that has 2 imr's out of the water. Mine was drawing 2.89 amps on high and about .70 on low so I would say less than 50%.


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## mikekoz (Mar 12, 2013)

[email protected] said:


> Mikekoz,
> Does the Defiant ArmorMax 3d cell have a better throw than the Defiant 493 3c cell?
> Thanks.
> Ted



Other than shining them side by side on a wall, I have not tested them side by side, sorry! The Armormax appears to be a little brighter and has a warmer tint. I was thinking about exchanging my 3C 493 model as it seems to be a little bit on the purple side, tint wise.


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## StorminMatt (Mar 18, 2013)

gearhead1972 said:


> Just got one yesterday, blows by Malkoff modified mag that has 2 imr's out of the water. Mine was drawing 2.89 amps on high and about .70 on low so I would say less than 50%.



What kind of Malkoff drop-in does it seem to be outpeforming? XP-G2 or XM-L2? Based on my observations, it might be about equal to my Mag XM-L2 drop-in. As far as the output, I believe it's rated at 180 lumens on low. So it's a little less than a third of the output. But keep in mind that the LED is quite a bit more efficient at low output vs high output. So even though output is about a third at low vs high, current will be LESS than a third.

As for the Armor Max Lights, I picked up one earlier today. And I have to say it's a pretty good light. I feel like, compared to the 3C lights available around the holidays, they are MUCH better built. In fact, I would say they are getting close to being of Maglite quality. I also really like the rubber bumpers. These will definitely keep the light from getting all scratched up like other lights if dropped. However, I see the change from 550 to around 200 lumens with the 3C as a MAJOR downgrade. Since I already have the older XM-L 3C light, I got the 3D. I would not consider buying the 3C unless brightness is not important to you.


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## slapdookie (Mar 18, 2013)

I am by no means an expert on flashlights but i just picked up the ArmorMax 3D and i have to say i am pleasantly surprised. I think for the money it is an excellent value. It has good output(590 lumens on high with a reported runtime of 18hrs or 12 hrs as per the homedepot website), nice combination of throw and spill ( in my opinion ) to make it a good all around torch. Also this flashlight is built like a bricks#$% weighing in at 1.4 lbs making it not the most ideal light for tight spots but then again i'm not sure that it was meant for that. As far as the interface i agree with another member in that i prefer a side button interface on these larger torches but I have not had any issues with the rear clicky as some people have reported. I keep mine in my truck for an added measured of security as this torch would be a solid self defense item if needed


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## StorminMatt (Mar 18, 2013)

Agreed that this is one BIG, HEAVY light. In fact, it's big and heavy even compared to a 3D Mag.


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## gradio (Mar 18, 2013)

StorminMatt said:


> Agreed that this is one BIG, HEAVY light. In fact, it's big and heavy even compared to a 3D Mag.


If that's the case then I don't need one unless I need another affordable fish head bonker.


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## StorminMatt (Mar 22, 2013)

gradio said:


> If that's the case then I don't need one unless I need another affordable fish head bonker.



I guess I probably made this light sound worse than it is. But if you like bigger lights, it's really not a bad way to go. For $30, it's probably the best combination of brightness, long runtime, and quality construction you are going to find. And although 1x18650 pocket rockets are considered more hip by most flashoholics, unlike those lights, this one does NOT have to power down from its highest setting in order to prevent the light from baking itself alive.


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## thedoc007 (Mar 22, 2013)

StorminMatt said:


> And although 1x18650 pocket rockets are considered more hip by most flashoholics, unlike those lights, this one does NOT have to power down from its highest setting in order to prevent the light from baking itself alive.




There is a reason 18650 lights are valued here...take the RS11 as an example. 600+ lumens, no step down, and maybe 1/10th of the size of the 3D. Even the Nitecore TM26 is much smaller and lighter than the 3D, and it can put out 1700 lumens for 3 hours, or 540 lumens for 10 hours, and stepdown won't be an issue. The only reason to get a light like this is to use it as a club, or because you can't afford anything better. If your budget won't go to 18650, though, nothing wrong with these...just saying by comparison these lights are pretty weak, especially for the size.


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## TEEJ (Mar 22, 2013)

StorminMatt said:


> I guess I probably made this light sound worse than it is. But if you like bigger lights, it's really not a bad way to go. For $30, it's probably the best combination of brightness, long runtime, and quality construction you are going to find. And although 1x18650 pocket rockets are considered more hip by most flashoholics, unlike those lights, this one does NOT have to power down from its highest setting in order to prevent the light from baking itself alive.



LOL

Correct, if it STARTS out dim for its size, it really doesn't need to get dimmer to avoid problems.

I will say that I finally tried the 3D version, and its at least putting out enough light to be useful...its just ENORMOUS for the amount of light it gives off.

On a lumens per dollar basis though, its not too bad as a purchase, and if using Nimh's instead of Alka-Leaks, the cost of using it would not be too bad.

So, if you don't need to carry it around/EDC it...say it sits in a boat or by the door, etc....and you want an el cheapo light to fill the duty, I think its not bad really.


If you want to go hiking/carry a light with you of that lumen output, well, its a freakin anchor compared to the li-ion alternatives...but 600 L in your front pant pocket means spending ~ $45 much for the light, but that light will weigh closer to the weight of one of the three giant D Cells in the Defiant....than it will to the weight of a loaded 3-D Defiant. For the weight and size of the 3D Defiant, a li-ion powered light could be pumping out a few THOUSAND lumens instead of a few hundred.

So, again, the 3D version at least can be worth it I think, for some uses/cost benefit scenarios.


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## StorminMatt (Mar 22, 2013)

TEEJ said:


> If you want to go hiking/carry a light with you of that lumen output, well, its a freakin anchor compared to the li-ion alternatives...but 600 L in your front pant pocket means spending ~ $45 much for the light, but that light will weigh closer to the weight of one of the three giant D Cells in the Defiant....than it will to the weight of a loaded 3-D Defiant. For the weight and size of the 3D Defiant, a li-ion powered light could be pumping out a few THOUSAND lumens instead of a few hundred.



Then again, how long before thermal protection kicks in on a pocket rocket to prevent it from cooking itself on Turbo? Five minutes? Maybe 15 minutes? Then you're at 50-100 lumens. When I take a light hiking, I want something that I can potentially use at full brightness for at least a couple of hours without worrying about it. And a 1x18650 light won't give me this. They're just not made for SUSTAINED high power operation. As far as a light the size and weight of this one putting out THOUSANDS of lumens on NiMH, such a light exists. It's called the Fenix TK70.


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## mikekoz (Mar 22, 2013)

Too heavy!! PFFFFFFFFFFFFT!!!! You guys are wimps!! I am using my 3D defiant as a keychain light!!!! :nana:


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## StorminMatt (Mar 22, 2013)

mikekoz said:


> Too heavy!! PFFFFFFFFFFFFT!!!! You guys are wimps!! I am using my 3D defiant as a keychain light!!!! :nana:



I have to admit that I actually LIKE a light on the long and heavy side. They're just more comfortable for me to carry. Small lights have to be clenched in a fist, which can get uncomfortable after a while. But larger lights can be loosely cradled in your hand at the center of mass. My hand gets ALOT less tired. And even a pound or two really isn't tiring for me to carry.


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## Canuke (May 23, 2013)

The Defiant beat goes on 

Today I saw two more variants on this theme. First, there is now a 5C (not a typo, FIVE C cells) "clue bat" style light, rated 625 lumens from an XM-L. Ot has the smaller head comparable to the original from late last year. $24.95. I didn't buy one, I'm tapped out on the 500-1000 lumen lights with my 3C thrower, Coast HP7 and Stanley spot.

There were also some 2AA lights in a 2-pack, rated 120 lumens. These were of interest because of the emitters; they are the all-yellow ones (XB-D?) like those we see in the Defiant headlamps and 3AAA lights, but bigger - between the XP-G and XM-L in size. For a moment I thought they might actually be XM-L's.

Pics:











Hotspot comparo below, with my Quark AA neutral white XP-G light as seen above (on top, Defiant is below. Shot on an Iphone so take the apparent tints with that grain of salt). The Quark is on Max, not High, which suggests that the Defiants are overdelivering by at least 50 lumens. The Quark is on nearly fresh Eneloops, the Defiant on the supplied alkalines; switching the batteries around had no effect on this comparison, which suggests regulation to me.





The Defiants have the usual High-Low-Strobe settings. One odd thing: the Low mode PWM (about 150-200 Hz -ish to me, readily visible) and Strobe modes don't shut off completely during the putative "off" part of their duty cycle, and it's flat rather than the trailing-off fading pattern of a capacitor discharging.


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## Canuke (May 23, 2013)

Almost forgot to mention, $14.95 for the two-pack.


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## JNieporte (May 23, 2013)

I _really_​ want one of those two-packs. Not in my Home Depot yet...


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## mikekoz (May 25, 2013)

Saw the 5C light at my Home Depot today but passed on it. Probably a nice light, but it is not that much brighter than the older 3C model. You probably would notice little to no difference. As a matter of fact, it looks just like the old 3C version, but longer, of course! They did not have the 2 pack of the AA models.


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## AnAppleSnail (May 25, 2013)

I saw the 2 packs up front. The 3xAAA set has mushy tail clickies.


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## Canuke (Jun 17, 2013)

The 2AA lights seem to be built for NiMH's. I just ran one of these on the almost new alkalines that came with it; by one hour, after running whole-body warm (being used as a bike headlamp, not handheld) it fell off a cliff to 15% output. Batteries were at 1.1V a few minutes after removal.

Ran another half hour on Eneloops, output same as fresh alks, cooler body only slightly warm. I rather suspect that the heat came straight off the alkalines, not the driver/emitter.

I plan another test with fresh Eneloops tomorrow night.


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## gearhead1972 (Nov 11, 2013)

StorminMatt said:


> What kind of Malkoff drop-in does it seem to be outpeforming? XP-G2 or XM-L2? Based on my observations, it might be about equal to my Mag XM-L2 drop-in. As far as the output, I believe it's rated at 180 lumens on low. So it's a little less than a third of the output. But keep in mind that the LED is quite a bit more efficient at low output vs high output. So even though output is about a third at low vs high, current will be LESS than a third.
> 
> As for the Armor Max Lights, I picked up one earlier today. And I have to say it's a pretty good light. I feel like, compared to the 3C lights available around the holidays, they are MUCH better built. In fact, I would say they are getting close to being of Maglite quality. I also really like the rubber bumpers. These will definitely keep the light from getting all scratched up like other lights if dropped. However, I see the change from 550 to around 200 lumens with the 3C as a MAJOR downgrade. Since I already have the older XM-L 3C light, I got the 3D. I would not consider buying the 3C unless brightness is not important to you.



Wow don't check these boards much and didn't remember seeing a reply Email. I have the 3-6 cell[FONT=verdana, arial, helvetica, sans-serif] XP-G2 drop in
[/FONT]
Anyone with the 3D one try some more voltage yet? I have an extra 5 cell 1/2D pack that I was thinking about throwing in mine, don't want to pop the led though. I am pretty sure these packs come out of the charger around 6.5v or so.


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## cruzzer (Nov 17, 2013)

I just picked up the armormax 1000 lumen 3d for $29.95 as for that price I just couldn't pass it up. It was in the clearance area with all the odd ball tools and real cheap flashlights. Like the 8 flashlights for $10 pack, all 8 lumen or something, the wife actually wanted those. This thing isn't as heavy as my 4d mag and I doubt seriously it really has 1k lumens but it lights up my yard. I have a 1 acre property with an elevated ranch house with woods surrounding us. My neighbor on one side is a good 6-700 feet away through woods. This lit up the entire side of their house and the shed which on the far side of their property was visible. While not daylight at the shed it was clear that it was the shed. This was all from my back porch. We have deer in the yard all the time, fox, bobcat and sometimes black bears. I don't mind the bears as long as they don't come too close. They are too curious around here and have no fear of people due to all the tourists and transplants from the city feeding them. This light should work good for a house light. I have a pd35 on its way for a new EDC.


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## Skimo (Dec 3, 2013)

Originally Posted by StarHalo

There's more than one Defiant light, a bunch really; the larger 3 cell and above models that advertise roughly 500 lumens are roughly 500 lumens, the thousand lumen one is somewhere just north of 500 lumens. That is indeed brighter than the current comparable Maglite, the 2D PRO, at 274 lumens. But the Mag has focusing ability, and a lifetime warranty.



I tested all of mine and compared them with other known flashlights. My post shows that the new 3D 1,000 model is over 1,000 lumens with fresh cells. Here were my readings:

<font color="#333333">I just took some readings with my homemade lightbox. I've found that dividing the number by 5 gives a rough estimate to the overall lumens. I took some readings with some other popular flashlights for comparison:



<font color="#333333">Maglite XL 50 610 (120 lumens)



Maglite XL200 810 (162 lumens)



Minimag 2AA Pro 910 (182 lumens) 



Defiant 5C 625 lumen 3090 at startup, sabilized to 2600 (618 lumens startup, 520 stabilized) 



Defiant 3D 1,000 lumen 230(low) 5050(high) at startup stabilized at 4600 (46 lumens low, 1,010 lumens startup 920 lumens stabilized)







Keep in mind that these are rough estimates, but you can see how much brighter the new 3D 1,000 lumen model is compared to the 5C model, which is brighter than the 3C superthrower.
/end quote

Unfortunately there are a few threads and info doesn't always get to them all, the 1,000 lumen isn't a high power thrower, it's a good mix of throw and flood with a wide hot spot, I guess more as a result of having three LEDs instead of a single LED.


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