# What's REALLY the smallest LED light out there



## Cptnodegard (Aug 16, 2010)

I have a ITP A3 EOS upgrade editon, and a smaller button cell standard LED $2 light which are really rather small. However, I would like something smaller than both to put on the end of the paracord for my EDC SAK. Prereably something with a 5 or 3mm white LED and a very small button cell all mixed up in a ridiculously small package that really takes up not space at all. Does anyone know of such a thing? Out put isn't a concern, I have "real" lights for that.

To be clear, something smaller than this:
http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.20242

Thanks in advance


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## DoubleDutch (Aug 16, 2010)

Hi, cpt,

What you need is a FireFli!

https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/229843


Cheers, Kees


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## Cptnodegard (Aug 16, 2010)

$75? Sounds like a joke xD If I'd still been In that case I'd rather make my own, but there has to be something like this out there at a reasonable price?


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## wyager (Aug 16, 2010)

Cptnodegard said:


> $75? Sounds like a joke xD If I'd still been In that case I'd rather make my own, but there has to be something like this out there at a reasonable price?


price=quality.


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## mcnair55 (Aug 16, 2010)

Streamlight Nano is very small and reasonably priced,very bright as well.I wear mine around my neck.The Nano is the tiny one next to my blue EO1.


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## wyager (Aug 16, 2010)

If you REALLY want small, on small cells, the streamlight nano is great, my friend has one as they actually sell them in some stores.


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## F250XLT (Aug 16, 2010)

wyager said:


> price=quality.




That statement is definitely not always true.


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## wyager (Aug 16, 2010)

F250XLT said:


> That statement is definitely not always true.


I just meant in this particular example. Plus, in the flashlight industry this is true 99% of the time.


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## Cptnodegard (Aug 16, 2010)

I'd dare say that you can't fit $75 worth of quality into something that small without including diamonds, but maybe that's just me. I did actually manage to make a lanyard with the DX light though that doesn't take up THAT much space, so since there's no "perfect" solution out there I think I'll stick with the $1.5 version


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## rekd0514 (Aug 16, 2010)

Cptnodegard said:


> I'd dare say that you can't fit $75 worth of quality into something that small without including diamonds, but maybe that's just me. I did actually manage to make a lanyard with the DX light though that doesn't take up THAT much space, so since there's no "perfect" solution out there I think I'll stick with the $1.5 version



Agreed, even with quality that light shouldn't cost more than $20. It's a flashlight, it's not that complicated to make and the material cost is low. That is what companies like that live off of though, people willing to spend way more than what its worth. It cost us $5 to make and we'll charge you $75 for it. That is a 1500% markup, just as bad as movie theater popcorn and pop. 

As I always say there is a point of diminishing returns on everything you buy.


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## Cptnodegard (Aug 16, 2010)

I'm actually glad it was so horribly overpriced, as I really like the lanyard I came up with after X amount of tries:






My previous attempts were clumpier and longer. I removed the inner strands of the paracord and used thread and needle instead of burning the cord many places, hence shortening the length of the skull bead part and skipping the knot that made such chaos in the LED light end in favor of sewing the cords together.


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## mcnair55 (Aug 16, 2010)

rekd0514 said:


> Agreed, even with quality that light shouldn't cost more than $20. It's a flashlight, it's not that complicated to make and the material cost is low. That is what companies like that live off of though, people willing to spend way more than what its worth. It cost us $5 to make and we'll charge you $75 for it. That is a 1500% markup, just as bad as movie theater popcorn and pop.
> 
> As I always say there is a point of diminishing returns on everything you buy.



You are making an assumption when you have no idea,costs not only involve manufacture,your markup of 1500% is a pure guess on your behalf and quite honestly you are talking total poppycock.Until you know what other costs are involved to get to a selling figure for the maker to realize his return on monies invested pretty pointless statement.


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## Cptnodegard (Aug 16, 2010)

It's made by hand so I'm sure the price is for a reason, but just because the manufacturing reasons turn out a $75 price tag doesn't mean it's worth $75 to some people (while to others it is). Unfortunately it's the result of low quantity niche manufacturing.


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## boomhauer (Aug 16, 2010)

Yeah, I don't imagine there'll be a lot of takers for a $75 keychain light on this forum. On the other hand, like in the Acura commercial, perhaps such a premium light will emit pwm frequencies only dogs can hear...


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## applevision (Aug 16, 2010)

boomhauer said:


> Yeah, I don't imagine there'll be a lot of takers for a $75 keychain light on this forum...



Umm... I don't think so, fellas.

This was the _actual _sign-up list for just such a light here on CPF. You'll note that Peter Atwood himself is on this list!

Applevision
scout24
Londonlad
HKJ
RichK
Zeruel
wrencher
Lumenz
MKLight
coyote
Incidentalist
littlerm
PerArne
herrgurka
JeffT
Alpert
Sgt.LED
marcoc
jdriller
Teceng
sntangerbg
anch
Alex P.
Skeptic
Coop
jch79
Loveit
Mr.QQ
reptiles
jsmitty1967
netgear68
sjalbrec
tixx
strideredc
Stevevh
jpwelch
gbleeker
urso
Timothy Hunt
mcmc
Mokume (FancyFli)
Peter Atwood
nfetterly
LedZepellin
Uriah
sjalbrec
fiftycalibre

See it here.

And please remember, this was a hand-made customized, all-titanium light. I wear it every single day around my neck and haven't taken it off in over a year. It is both a work of art and a tool. And for $75 it was really quite reasonable. Anyway, just my 2 cents.

-Applevision


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## boomhauer (Aug 16, 2010)

By "forum", I meant the budget forum. No doubt there will be plenty of interest in the other forums, or even by some here.


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## rekd0514 (Aug 16, 2010)

mcnair55 said:


> You are making an assumption when you have no idea,costs not only involve manufacture,your markup of 1500% is a pure guess on your behalf and quite honestly you are talking total poppycock.Until you know what other costs are involved to get to a selling figure for the maker to realize his return on monies invested pretty pointless statement.



True, I don't know the actual value. This does happen in many cases though. I took a class like this for pricing manufactured/engineered products. It is a little different in this case though as it is a customized version made by one person. 



applevision said:


> Umm... I don't think so, fellas.
> 
> This was the _actual _sign-up list for just such a light here on CPF. You'll note that Peter Atwood himself is on this list!
> 
> ...



This doesn't surprise me from what people will spend for lights. Any ideas on lights I should make a business out of this!


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## Burgess (Aug 16, 2010)

rekd0514 said:


> This doesn't surprise me from what people will spend for lights.
> Any ideas on lights I should make a business out of this!


 

Yes, Lots and LOTS of ideas ! ! !


Just start READING !



_


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## rekd0514 (Aug 16, 2010)

PM me you can be the VP! haha


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## Burgess (Aug 17, 2010)

Just off the top of my (bald) head . . . .


Seems to be a rather significant group on CPF
who are interested in *Very* Long Run-time flashlights !


The Longer, the Better !

Brightness is NOT a concern.


:candle:
_


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## Cptnodegard (Aug 17, 2010)

Burgess said:


> Seems to be a rather significant group on CPF
> who are interested in *Very* Long Run-time flashlights !
> 
> _



Working on it


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## rekd0514 (Aug 17, 2010)

Romisen RC-N3 body genious! haha


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## JDest (Aug 17, 2010)

Just for the record. I am TiFli owner from that original run (cheers Apple for being a part of that and helping Chip to bring it to fruition) and I couldn't be happier with the $75 I spent on it. Machined titanium is far from cheap when it comes to flashlights and the cheapest light I know of is the IlluminaTi at $40. For its form and function the TiFli is brilliant. Is $75 a lot of money to spend on a tiny flashlight with limited brightness? Hell yes. Is it worth it? Ask all of the TiFli owners who gave Chip feedback after receiving theirs. Mine is still in the same place it was when I received it over a year ago. Around my neck. I can't say that about any other flashlight I own.


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## Lynx_Arc (Aug 17, 2010)

I have an led light that is 10mm diameter and 45mm long using tiny button cells (ag2 I think) and has a side momemtary switch on it. It is about the size of a AAA battery.


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## Cemoi (Aug 17, 2010)

Lynx_Arc said:


> I have an led light that is 10mm diameter and 45mm long using tiny button cells (ag2 I think) and has a side momemtary switch on it.


Link please?


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## applevision (Aug 17, 2010)

boomhauer said:


> By "forum", I meant the budget forum. No doubt there will be plenty of interest in the other forums, or even by some here.



Hee hee! Sorry, you're right. I didn't realize we were in Budget Lights! I came to this thread from the CPF home page... it was funny because I was surprised I missed this thread!


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## boomhauer (Aug 17, 2010)

applevision said:


> Hee hee! Sorry, you're right. I didn't realize we were in Budget Lights! I came to this thread from the CPF home page... it was funny because I was surprised I missed this thread!


Hey, no problemo! I have to say that $75 does not seem all that expensive for a dependable, rugged light that can always be with you.


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## LEDninja (Aug 17, 2010)

There are versions of the fauxton that uses 1220 instead of 2016 batteries and a 3 mm LED instead of a 5 mm LED.
I got a bunch from KevinL a looong time ago (like before 2005). Don't know if any retailer still carries them.


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## Gregozedobe (Aug 17, 2010)

If you want really, really small and can cope with a red led and throw away after 21 hours, then the "disc golf beacon" is the smallest light I've seen that is readily available from multiple suppliers (around $4.00 each). 

They are a cylinder approx 34mm long x 4mm diameter. 

They produce enough light to see thgings with night-adjusted eyes, but there small size is their best feature. They are also sold as a fishing accessory.


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## joe1512 (Aug 17, 2010)

OP, I am glad you came up with something that works for you.

As you found, you have to have some kindof power source attached to the LED which takes up a lot of the room. You cant get much smaller than the little battery lights, but they are coin-sized.

Really the only way to get something smaller would be to get a knife that has the LED built in. Unless you have some super high quality knife, you might consider getting a new one.

Something like these for example,

http://www.thinkgeek.com/gadgets/tools/c48b/
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B000EHUZBS/?tag=cpf0b6-20
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0039TC0NY/?tag=cpf0b6-20


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## Lynx_Arc (Aug 17, 2010)

Cemoi said:


> Link please?



similar to this one
http://cgi.ebay.com/Mini-LED-Flash-light-Flashlight-Torch-Keychain-LA1-/290457960279?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0


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## InHisName (Aug 18, 2010)

I found a site with real TINY lights, also UV & IR lights too.
maxmax.com but not for cheap budgets though.

Well, these super tiny lights aren't $75 but still not cheap for their size. $15-22 range. 
They're stick pen diameter to just over the ink core diameter.


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## Cemoi (Aug 18, 2010)

Lynx_Arc said:


> this one
> http://cgi.ebay.com/Mini-LED-Flash-light-Flashlight-Torch-Keychain-LA1-/290457960279?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0



Thanks, but unfortunately I get the following message when trying to view this page:
_Unfortunately, access to this particular item has been blocked due to legal restrictions in some countries. We are blocking your viewing in an effort to prevent restricted items from being displayed. Regrettably, in some cases, we may prevent users from accessing items that are not within the scope of said restrictions because of limitations of existing technology. Please accept our apologies for any inconvenience this may cause, and we hope you may find other items of interest on eBay._


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## divine (Aug 18, 2010)

I can't believe the Drake/Draco has not been mentioned yet.

You might want to check out this thread.

https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/229843


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## Toke (Aug 18, 2010)

My smallest light is buildt into the closing mechanism for a sleeping bag bag. It can also be used for the strings of a hood, or anything else that require you to tread two strings through it and have them pressed together when you let go of them. (What is the english name?)

It has low, high, and strobe.
The strenght is not that impressive but it´s function means it will be there when you need it for that particular function.

I do not recall the name, got it in an large outdoors store in southern Berlin.


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## mcnair55 (Aug 18, 2010)

Toke said:


> My smallest light is buildt into the closing mechanism for a sleeping bag bag. It can also be used for the strings of a hood, or anything else that require you to tread two strings through it and have them pressed together when you let go of them. (What is the english name?)
> 
> It has low, high, and strobe.
> The strenght is not that impressive but it´s function means it will be there when you need it for that particular function.
> ...



Was it the big Obi by mcnair barracks by any chance? I use to live close hence my aka.


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## Toke (Aug 18, 2010)

mcnair55 said:


> Was it the big Obi by mcnair barracks by any chance? I use to live close hence my aka.


 
I did not notice any barracks, the shop were pretty much in the same building as the s-bahn station. Across the street were rotes rathaus or such.
I will not be home untill next week and cannot post a picture of the light.


ETA: I thought it was somewhere on the pink line, but the satelite pictures does not look like it.


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## mcnair55 (Aug 18, 2010)

Toke said:


> I did not notice any barracks, the shop were pretty much in the same building as the s-bahn station. Across the street were rotes rathaus or such.
> I will not be home untill next week and cannot post a picture of the light.
> 
> 
> ETA: I thought it was somewhere on the pink line, but the satelite pictures does not look like it.



That is not South Berlin,the rotes rathaus is in the district of Mitte,I lived way way south of that.If you are a former East Berliner I suppose you would class that as of South Berlin of the former DDR,I class Berlin as just one city both and east and west.


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## Toke (Aug 18, 2010)

> If you are a former East Berliner



No I am Danish, were there on vacation.
Guess I got the Berlin geography wrong.:sigh:


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## Lynx_Arc (Aug 18, 2010)

Cemoi said:


> Thanks, but unfortunately I get the following message when trying to view this page:
> _Unfortunately, access to this particular item has been blocked due to legal restrictions in some countries. We are blocking your viewing in an effort to prevent restricted items from being displayed. Regrettably, in some cases, we may prevent users from accessing items that are not within the scope of said restrictions because of limitations of existing technology. Please accept our apologies for any inconvenience this may cause, and we hope you may find other items of interest on eBay._



Not knowing what country you are from it makes a big difference on what is available to you. Most people in CF are from the states so if someone doesn't list their location we have to assume it till they put something in their location field.


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## mcnair55 (Aug 18, 2010)

Lynx_Arc said:


> Not knowing what country you are from it makes a big difference on what is available to you. Most people in CF are from the states so if someone doesn't list their location we have to assume it till they put something in their location field.



Well written point,it would be beneficial to all members knocking out a reply if the poster at least but his country in his/her profile.Some hobby boards will not allow you to post till you do so.


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## wyager (Aug 18, 2010)

What kind of place puts sale restrictions on a key light? Honestly....


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## Lynx_Arc (Aug 18, 2010)

wyager said:


> What kind of place puts sale restrictions on a key light? Honestly....



some countries filter/block internet access as they please. I have seen a few others that could not access ebay too.


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## guiri (Aug 18, 2010)

Cptnodegard said:


> Working on it



Keeping that in your pocket all day long, would that not make your nuts glow in the dark? Free GITD chestnuts so to speak...


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## Gregozedobe (Aug 19, 2010)

InHisName said:


> I found a site with real TINY lights, also UV & IR lights too.
> maxmax.com but not for cheap budgets though.
> 
> Well, these super tiny lights aren't $75 but still not cheap for their size. $15-22 range.
> They're stick pen diameter to just over the ink core diameter.


 
I was going to buy a couple of the really small lights red led lights from www.maxmax.com They were only $9.25 each, so I thought they would be worth trying out. BUT international shipping costs a minimum of $60.00 (UPS express) + $17.00 handling costs (because they have to fill in a couple of lines on a small form ?). I don't think so :thumbsdow


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## Cemoi (Aug 19, 2010)

Lynx_Arc said:


> Not knowing what country you are from it makes a big difference on what is available to you.



Sorry, I've updated my profile.


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## Cemoi (Aug 19, 2010)

divine said:


> I can't believe the Drake/Draco has not been mentioned yet.



May I remind you that this thread is supposed to be in the "*Budget* lights" section?


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## sed6 (Aug 19, 2010)

Nite Ize makes a cool new light designed to go on a zipper pull. The pictures make it look huge, but it's the same diameter as a dime.

http://www.niteize.com/collections/led/products/ziplit


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## Toke (Aug 19, 2010)

That one looks really convenient to carry. 
Just a shame that the postage will likely be more than the light.


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## mcnair55 (Aug 19, 2010)

sed6 said:


> Nite Ize makes a cool new light designed to go on a zipper pull. The pictures make it look huge, but it's the same diameter as a dime.
> 
> http://www.niteize.com/collections/led/products/ziplit




Cheap as chips as well,bet they will sell 1000,s of them.


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## petergunn (Aug 19, 2010)

The twisty LR41 powered flashlight on the "6-in-1 Multi-tool Stainless Steel Pocket Plier with Bright LED Light" is 35mm x 9.7mm and smaller than a fauxton. Its made of aluminium and is the shape of a traditional flashlight (once detached from the tool - you'll need a dremel) and it has a nice big hole for a lanyard/cord. Its bright for its size but doesn't compare with the 22k mcd DX keyrings.

The stainless steel tool is actually pretty cool - the micro Philips screwdriver fits the screws on the DX fauxtons, the knife blade is relatively sharp, and the pliers seemed pretty well put together for the price. The nylon holder is also a pretty good match for carrying a couple of AAs on your belt.

You can find them for <$4 (or ~$2 on sale). Dont expect miracles though.

-PG


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## applevision (Aug 20, 2010)

mcnair55 said:


> Cheap as chips as well,bet they will sell 1000,s of them.



Yep. Just ordered two from Amazon.

Very cool idea can't wait to get mine... I might try it as a 24/7/365 neck light...

I love this form factor since it is so pendant-like!


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## boomhauer (Aug 20, 2010)

sed6 said:


> Nite Ize makes a cool new light designed to go on a zipper pull. The pictures make it look huge, but it's the same diameter as a dime.
> 
> http://www.niteize.com/collections/led/products/ziplit


 I'm guessing the led projects light from the center of its face, lighting what's in front of you as it hangs hands-free? That would be neat. I'm also just guessing it's a Nichia 5mm led.


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## ama230 (Aug 21, 2010)

its actually a 3mm and its maybe a cree as niteize hasnt picked up on nichia yet. They have a weird selection of leds...

you can also pick these up at frys electronics for cheap as shipping is going to be more than the lights themselves.

hope this helps....

Also might have to pick up a couple packs as you cant beat the price and quality.


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## applevision (Aug 24, 2010)

sed6 said:


> Nite Ize makes a cool new light designed to go on a zipper pull. The pictures make it look huge, but it's the same diameter as a dime.
> 
> http://www.niteize.com/collections/led/products/ziplit



Thanks again, *sed6*! Got 'em today and posted a full review here.


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## FlashPilot (Aug 24, 2010)

These and these have been getting excellent reviews. Its hard to beat the value when you can just toss them when the battery dies. You can also buy the batteries in bulk for next to nothing at dx and replace them.


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## Cptnodegard (Aug 28, 2010)

Found these at a local store (didnt buy them). They are fishing lures, so I think they flash instead of having a steady light. Use some sort of special battery(the small pieces above and to the left of the lights themselves) and you can basically judge the size knowing the LED on the front is a 3mm LED


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## Lynx_Arc (Aug 28, 2010)

those probably use AG1-AG4 batteries that are around the size of a pencil eraser and range in thickness around a quarter or more.


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## mzil (Aug 28, 2010)

The Photons and their rip offs, "Fauxtons", are the smallest _practical_ LED flashlights in my opinion. Yes, there are ones that are even smaller still, but they have no degree of real throw like the Photons do or they use batteries that are hard to find and often cost more than the product itself when you do find them! I consider them more like illuminated pendants, fishing lures, or keychain markers (assuming you left the product on before you drop it in the tall grass) than "flashlights".

Just my 2 cents.


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## petergunn (Aug 29, 2010)

Lynx_Arc said:


> those probably use AG1-AG4 batteries that are around the size of a pencil eraser and range in thickness around a quarter or more.



The spare batteries beside the lures are lithium BR435 batteries - the same as used in Coast technicians flashlights (i.e. TT7530CP)

-PG


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## Lynx_Arc (Aug 30, 2010)

petergunn said:


> The spare batteries beside the lures are lithium BR435 batteries - the same as used in Coast technicians flashlights (i.e. TT7530CP)
> 
> -PG


those can cost a bit to replace for sure


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## Cptnodegard (Sep 17, 2010)

Think I just broke the record for smallest flashlight 

http://andreasodegard.com/2010/09/address-container-flashlight-mod/


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## applevision (Sep 17, 2010)

Cptnodegard said:


> Think I just broke the record for smallest flashlight
> 
> http://andreasodegard.com/2010/09/address-container-flashlight-mod/



VERY cool!

I like!


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## Kindle (Sep 18, 2010)

mcnair55 said:


> Streamlight Nano is very small and reasonably priced,very bright as well.I wear mine around my neck.The Nano is the tiny one next to my blue EO1.



I actually like eGear's pico light a tiny bit better....






The twisty is at the bezel so it's easier to to turn on one handed and seems to be far less prone to working itself apart in a pocket.



Cptnodegard said:


> It's made by hand so I'm sure the price is for a reason, but just because the manufacturing reasons turn out a $75 price tag doesn't mean it's worth $75 to some people (while to others it is). Unfortunately it's the result of low quantity niche manufacturing.



This absolutely. 

Hand made boutique products are very different than mass produced ones when it comes to pricing.



Lynx_Arc said:


> I have an led light that is 10mm diameter and 45mm long using tiny button cells (ag2 I think) and has a side momemtary switch on it. It is about the size of a AAA battery.



Lowes has something similar under their Task Force house brand...






It's in the $2-3 range. 

I carried one for a while on my keychain and found that placing a clip stolen from a pen works perfectly to cover the button to prevent it accidentally turning on in the pocket and can also be used to slide down over the button holding it on (otherwise it's just a momentary switch).



applevision said:


> VERY cool!



Yes it is. Hopefully somebody runs with the idea.


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## Tuikku (Sep 18, 2010)

Cptnodegard said:


> Think I just broke the record for smallest flashlight
> 
> http://andreasodegard.com/2010/09/address-container-flashlight-mod/



Very nice & small


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## mzil (Sep 18, 2010)

It may slightly compromise quality and functionality, however if "what's the smallest LED light" is the _only_ goal, Andreas Odegard's design, above, could have the keyring and attachment post sawed off and the front of the LED shaved down (with a file). The front of the actual LED's clear plastic helps focus the beam, but it is not necessary for it to work. This would save almost 50% of the overall body length, by my estimate.


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## coyote (Oct 7, 2010)

there are a number of Picos out there. half the size of a Photon.

pixs and review here


(note: if you check the above list you'll see that i was one of "those" folks who signed up for the $75 Fire-Fli. i also own a Draco. budget is fun, but you do get what you pay for if you're a careful buyer... )

.


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## applevision (Oct 8, 2010)

coyote said:


> there are a number of Picos out there. half the size of a Photon.
> 
> pixs and review here
> 
> ...



I have one of these thanks to a kind fellow CPFer! It's very cute and decently bright!


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