# Zebralight SC600w IV Plus



## TCY (Sep 22, 2017)

MSRP $99, XHP50.2, 4500K CCT 80+ CRI, tint variation within a 3-step MacAdam ellipse, 2460 lumens max output, complete with the all new programmable UI groups. Screw "I have too many already", I'm getting it.:twothumbs


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## shrike2222 (Sep 22, 2017)

Good news.
Please ZL make it compatible with normal 18650 battery. SC600 MK3 is too much restricted on battery length.


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## TCY (Sep 22, 2017)

shrike2222 said:


> Good news.
> Please ZL make it compatible with normal 18650 battery. SC600 MK3 is too much restricted on battery length.



While being compatible with all battery type would be nice I doubt they would do it. The 1500lm SC600Fd III plus draws 8A already on turbo and this one does almost 2500 lm. I suspect even the much beloved 18650GA wouldn't be able to handle that current draw.


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## Agpp (Sep 22, 2017)

Any link to that light? It's not on the Zebralight website...


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## moozooh (Sep 22, 2017)

It's only on the spreadsheet so far.







They've also corrected it to 2440 lm.


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## Nichia! (Sep 22, 2017)

better to start saving🤑 Please Stop Making new lights!


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## Nichia! (Sep 22, 2017)

Could it be Made in USA now?!


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## TCY (Sep 22, 2017)

No idea. ZL said that the C3 is supposedly to be manufactured in their Texas factory and the R&D part has been finished a long time ago. Given there aren't any news related to the C3 I suspect both new 1*18650 lights will still be made in China.


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## DIPSTIX (Sep 22, 2017)

Very exciting news!


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## Strintguy (Sep 22, 2017)

2440 lumens for how long? And the step-down to what?


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## moozooh (Sep 22, 2017)

ZL lights don't use timed stepdown anymore. They've all been temperature-controlled since a few years ago, so that question doesn't have a definite answer.


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## Swedpat (Sep 22, 2017)

shrike2222 said:


> Good news.
> Please ZL make it compatible with normal 18650 battery. SC600 MK3 is too much restricted on battery length.



While I really like my SC600MK III(and have no plan to replace it) I agree with that opinion. These few mm:s is in no way a difference I could see as a true advantage.


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## csice (Sep 22, 2017)

Wow, over 2k lumens? How will this compare to the old 600/63 models do you think? More of a spotlight than flood I assume? How are they getting all those extra lumens? Will it be the same size? I'm not used to seeing something small like the ZL have anywhere near that many lumens unless it's a modded triple which I'm not fond of since they last for like 5 seconds.


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## JDodd (Sep 22, 2017)

There is some news about the C3. In the Release Date column "2017" has been deleted and the cell is now blank.

I emailed ZebraLight a couple of weeks ago to ask about the C3's release and received this response: "No specific date yet."

I assume these two bits of information lead to the conclusion that the C3 won't be here in 2017.


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## marinemaster (Sep 22, 2017)

How long is this light ?


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## TCY (Sep 22, 2017)

96mm/3.8 inch


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## Overclocker (Sep 22, 2017)

finally a non-flood "plus" model


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## twistedraven (Sep 22, 2017)

Unprotected 18650s are just as normal as protected ones IMO. There's little reason to be scared of unprotected lithium ions when the light itself has low voltage protection. Any good chargers will have overcharge protection as well.

XHP50.2 is a high voltage emitter, and since one 18650 can only provide so much voltage, you need to boost the amps by a considerable amount to make the emitter work. Any protected 18650's circuit wouldn't allow for that kind of flow.

XHP50.2 doesn't have the separation of its 4 dies like the XHP50 has, so that's probably why Zebralight now offers a non-frosted version now. I'm curious as well as to how its efficiency is compared to something like the SC600 MK3 models with the XHP35s.


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## tonkem (Sep 22, 2017)

Now just need the Cw version


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## Connor (Sep 22, 2017)

Overclocker said:


> finally a non-flood "plus" model



Well, how non-floody can it be with a XHP50.2 emitter in the SC600 form factor ..


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## twistedraven (Sep 22, 2017)

What probably won't be so good as its tint transition from hotspot to corona to spill. The .2 versions of the XHP50 and 70 haven't been so good with this-- especially the neutral white verisons. Users on BLF have found out that shaving off the extra phosphorous outside the dome of the emitters helps with the issue, though.


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## TCY (Sep 22, 2017)

This is precisely what I'm afraid of. Many of Vinh's modded lights with 50.2 it has that distinct tint shift.


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## ven (Sep 22, 2017)

Damn ZL are on fire

I would love it even more in a 62/63 style body


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## Tixx (Sep 22, 2017)

ven said:


> Damn ZL are on fire
> 
> I would love it even more in a 62/63 style body


YES!


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## twistedraven (Sep 22, 2017)

Yeah the 50.2 are iirc 4 xpg3 dies, and xpg3 is known to be green.


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## ven (Sep 22, 2017)

twistedraven said:


> Yeah the 50.2 are iirc 4 xpg3 dies, and xpg3 is known to be green.



If thats correct, i will more than likely pass as the 50.2 has not impressed me so far..................nor has the xp-g3(of the ones i have HAVE had)

Guess i will wait on some reports before a decision.............


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## Nichia! (Sep 22, 2017)

Hey Zebralight I know you are here

Please this time do the following 

1. No PWM of any kind on all levels.

2. No Battery Rattle (bring back Springs).

3. Perfect anodizing.

4. Make 2 versions please one with smooth reflector (thrower) and the other (orange peel) for balanced beam.


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## TCY (Sep 22, 2017)

Some questions I asked ZL and some answers they replied: "_No plans for "c" or "d" variants of the SC600 IV Plus in the near future. We'll start to take pre-orders in 1-2 weeks. The Mk III Plus version was our first try in incorporating some new but critical components (a high performance inductor and some extremely low resistance MOSFETs) into our 18650 drivers, we wanted to keep it "low profile" at that time. Even in the Mk IV Plus, we are not over driving the LEDs at all.
A small pre-production batch has been produced recently in order to determine various aspects of the XHP50.2 LEDs. We believe that overall the beam is acceptable, and hence no need for frosted lens."

_So overall ZL thinks the tint shift is acceptable. I don't know if I can take it after the frosted SC600Fd Plus and H53Fc. I think eventually I'm going to get it though. I'd prefer a c or d flavour but they aren't doing it for some reason. Can't get them 2-step LEDs?


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## twistedraven (Sep 22, 2017)

They're most likely commenting on a lack of donut hole or cross pattern for the 50.2. 50.1 and 70.1 and 70.2 all have enough space between each die that you'll see the aforementioned beam patterns in a small non-frosted reflector.


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## TCY (Sep 22, 2017)

I bet they are using a fairly heavy orange peel reflector to smooth out the tint shift quite a bit. I'm pretty used to the floody beam profile for EDC now, don't know if the new one would be good.


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## iamlucky13 (Sep 22, 2017)

Rats.

I successfully fought off the temptation to buy an SC5c II, only to discover the Manker E14 II is available as one of the highest power high CRI lights on the market.

I fought off the temptation to buy the Manker, and now Zebralight comes out with a new high power, mid-CRI light.

So now I've got to fight off the temptation to buy that, but even worse, I know the SC600c IV is just around the corner.

I'm glad it appears the donut hole issue is gone. I'm much more likely to consider this light with at least modest throw available compared to with a frosted lens.

I'd happily accept a light 1/4" longer in exchange for having sufficient spring/pogo pin travel to avoid crushing batteries. I don't understand why Zebralight is so obsessed with minimizing length.


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## StarHalo (Sep 22, 2017)

I held off on the II because the ~200 lumen difference wasn't that great; I guess one way to make sure everybody upgrades is to make the light roughly twice as bright over the previous version..


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## vadimax (Sep 23, 2017)

Nichia! said:


> Hey Zebralight I know you are here
> 
> Please this time do the following
> 
> ...



With reflectors of that size they just have to apply OP to eliminate beam artifacts. And to make a real thrower they need to increase the reflector itself. I guess this is not their motto.


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## TCY (Sep 23, 2017)

iamlucky13 said:


> Rats.
> 
> I successfully fought off the temptation to buy an SC5c II, only to discover the Manker E14 II is available as one of the highest power high CRI lights on the market.
> 
> ...



Some bad(good) news for you: grab a D4vn for 60 bucks, 3700 lumens with 4*4000K R9050 219C:nana:


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## StorminMatt (Sep 23, 2017)

What I don't understand is why, for the past couple of years, the AA lights have gotten all the good emitters, while 18650 lights have to make due with low CRI garbage emitters. I mean, the SC5 got the Easywhite XM-L2's and now the XP-L2. But the 28650 lights never got these. The SC600Fw did get the high CRI XHP50, which admittedly isn't bad. But even this emitter is not 'cherry picked' in the same way as the SC5 Easywhites (ie three vs two point Macadam). And, of course, the SC63 got totally hosed when it came to emitters, with NO high CRI option whatsoever. What gives?


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## terjee (Sep 23, 2017)

StorminMatt said:


> And, of course, the SC63 got totally hosed when it came to emitters, with NO high CRI option whatsoever. What gives?



Did you see the upcoming SC64c?

Sounds like a good candidate. Will likely get one myself.

Other than that, I'm guessing it's just a matter of production capacity vs. lumen chasing and what actually sells.


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## twistedraven (Sep 23, 2017)

tighter binning with easywhite isn't really a good thing for these emitters at 4000k and above, because it means you'll have less of a chance of getting an emitter that tends towards rosy instead of greenish. The same is true for the high CRI emitters, since they all follow the 2-step easywhite selection.


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## maukka (Sep 23, 2017)

The Macadams steps for Cree emitters don't matter at all in flashlight use, because the emitters are binned integrated i.e. averaged throughout the radiated light. Any tint shift (which is very apparent on all modern Crees) makes the tint binning useless. It only guarantees that the variation between lights is smaller.


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## TCY (Sep 23, 2017)

maukka said:


> The Macadams steps for Cree emitters don't matter at all in flashlight use, because the emitters are binned integrated i.e. averaged throughout the radiated light. Any tint shift (which is very apparent on all modern Crees) makes the tint binning useless. It only guarantees that the variation between lights is smaller.



The Plus and H53Fc have frosted lens to smooth things out so they worked great for me, not so sure about this one with a clear lens. Maybe I'll wait for someone to post a review first, I wish I'm not that much of a tint snob but can't help it:shrug:


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## Keitho (Sep 24, 2017)

I was looking at the 50.2 datasheet, and ZL is going to have to pull of some magic to get 2400 OTF lumens from a single 50.2 on a single 18650. If it is a single LED like other ZL's, they'll be boosting up over 6.0V, gotta be well over 4A (maybe 6A even), and over-driving the emitter quite a bit. This light will have to be the hottest ZL ever made, and might even drive some changes in the body shape/weight to handle the heat.

Alternatively, I'm wondering if ZL has a multi-50.2 design that they're about to roll out. They don't like over-driving emitters too much, it seems. I'd say not likely, but possible.... Even with a multi-emitter design, the driver will still have to be pretty slick.


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## Connor (Sep 24, 2017)

Keitho said:


> I was looking at the 50.2 datasheet, and ZL is going to have to pull of some magic to get 2400 OTF lumens from a single 50.2 on a single 18650. If it is a single LED like other ZL's, they'll be boosting up over 6.0V, gotta be well over 4A (maybe 6A even), and over-driving the emitter quite a bit. This light will have to be the hottest ZL ever made, and might even drive some changes in the body shape/weight to handle the heat.



As per information from ZL emails posted here recently, ZL is not overdriving their LEDs at all, ever. The SC600fd III Plus is already draining up to 8 amps, so no biggy. ;-) Yes it will get hot quickly and step down, probably comparable to the SC600fd III Plus (after ~45 seconds).


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## moozooh (Sep 24, 2017)

Yeah, PCT suggests 2400–2500 LED lumen for XHP50.2 at 3A, so depending on the temperature this is very plausible. But since it's a 6V LED, the driver has to pull some 18W from the battery as expected. That being said, PCT also suggests that XHP50.2 has a bit lower forward voltage compared to the original XHP50, so perhaps this won't be the hottest ZL light to date (at least no hotter than the SC600F III Plus).


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## twistedraven (Sep 24, 2017)

50.2 has very low forward voltage. It won't need to be driven heavily at all.


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## iamlucky13 (Sep 25, 2017)

TCY said:


> Some bad(good) news for you: grab a D4vn for 60 bucks, 3700 lumens with 4*4000K R9050 219C:nana:



I'd forgotten about the D4. Crazy little hotrod. I'm not sure it's what I'm looking for, but still will be one I consider.


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## TCY (Sep 25, 2017)

iamlucky13 said:


> I'd forgotten about the D4. Crazy little hotrod. I'm not sure it's what I'm looking for, but still will be one I consider.



I used it over the weekends. With thermal setting clocked to 55 degrees C the D4 219C can sustain ~500 lumens with ambient temp of about 27 C and no air flow. Occasional bursts of turbo are fine too. I'm liking it so far.


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## holygeez03 (Sep 26, 2017)

This might finally be the SC600 that I purchase... never could justify adding any of the other iterations to the collection.


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## radellaf (Oct 5, 2017)

Strintguy said:


> 2440 lumens for how long? And the step-down to what?



If it's in the Mk III body running twice the watts (minus the lower Vf) it's going to step down pretty darn soon. I have my temperature set point down a few degrees to their minimum so I can actually hold it for a few minutes on max, and it starts ramping down within 10-20 seconds.

So, really impressive, but probably not on my list. The MkIII HI I did get was an amazing boost from the SC63 or SC600 in several ways. Anything pulling more watts I'd want more thermal mass (or, in some years, 2400lm at <15W.

Now if you're using it in a cold climate with gloves, the extra cooling and higher temp setting you could use would make a big difference.


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## markr6 (Oct 6, 2017)

tonkem said:


> Now just need the Cw version



Said no one, ever!


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## Overclocker (Oct 7, 2017)

radellaf said:


> If it's in the Mk III body running twice the watts (minus the lower Vf) it's going to step down pretty darn soon. I have my temperature set point down a few degrees to their minimum so I can actually hold it for a few minutes on max, and it starts ramping down within 10-20 seconds.
> 
> So, really impressive, but probably not on my list. The MkIII HI I did get was an amazing boost from the SC63 or SC600 in several ways. Anything pulling more watts I'd want more thermal mass (or, in some years, 2400lm at <15W.
> 
> Now if you're using it in a cold climate with gloves, the extra cooling and higher temp setting you could use would make a big difference.





yes this won't be the replacement for the 600 mk3 HI

it was a similar situation w/ the sc62 and sc63. the latter had more lumens but upon turn on their throw were about the same, with the 63 having a bigger hotspot. post stepdown their lumens were about the same which is expected since both are thermally-limited and both had similar bodies, so there

it's going to be the same thing all over again w/ the mk4


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## carl (Oct 7, 2017)

I hope it comes with a bigger reflector than the current version so it has a good mix of flood and throw. An XHP50.2 with a too small reflector = too much flood.


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## vadimax (Oct 7, 2017)

I am entirely satisfied with my SC600w Mk3 HI. And this one looks like an overkill to me. Is there any sense in replacing minor thermal issues to several seconds of a twice brighter beam with huge thermal issues? I guess not. Unless you live in a polar area and need an instant hand warmer


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## ven (Oct 7, 2017)

Yes vad, always push the boundaries...............eventually we may have 2500lm for several minutes...................stranger things have happened. Not too long back, to even think of having a little flashlight with 500lm was just crazy, never mind 2500 or 4000(D4).

Besides, the 30s or so of crazy makes  

I am pretty impressed with my sc63w(not sure output but over 1100lm), the step downs during actual uses are hard to notice . So smooth and effortless, temp gets warm but never hot..............very clever driver . Even most of my sc62d uses are on 145lm(not even the high 320lm!)...............but its nice to have when i need to see that bit more.

Its all fun! I probably only need 200lm, but i will always take more


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## Cobraman502 (Oct 7, 2017)

ven said:


> Yes vad, always push the boundaries...............eventually we may have 2500lm for several minutes...................stranger things have happened. Not too long back, to even think of having a little flashlight with 500lm was just crazy, never mind 2500 or 4000(D4).
> 
> Besides, the 30s or so of crazy makes
> 
> ...




I’m waiting on the sc64. Interested to know max output. 93-95 cri.


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## TCY (Oct 7, 2017)

Given it's XP-L2 and high CRI, I'd say ~1100 lumens max.


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## Cobraman502 (Oct 7, 2017)

TCY said:


> Given it's XP-L2 and high CRI, I'd say ~1100 lumens max.



Oh nice might have to purchase this one too.


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## Cobraman502 (Oct 7, 2017)

TCY said:


> Given it's XP-L2 and high CRI, I'd say ~1100 lumens max.



Oh nice might have to purchase this one too.


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## Cobraman502 (Oct 7, 2017)

Deleted


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## benhar (Oct 8, 2017)

I'm just in for the new UI. Was all set to get a MK III till y'all wised me up to this, so now I'm impatiently waiting a bit longer for my first Zebralight.


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## kramnor (Oct 9, 2017)

Also waiting. Is the sc600wmkiii hi pocketable does it bulge that much compared to sc63?


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## terjee (Oct 9, 2017)

kramnor said:


> Is the sc600wmkiii hi pocketable does it bulge that much compared to sc63?



Depends on the pocket, and the person wearing it. ;-)

For me, even a bare 18650 would be a bit much for jeans pockets for example, but personally I find the SC600w Mk III HI to be very jacket pocketable, for most definitions of jacket pocket.


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## Fireclaw18 (Oct 9, 2017)

TCY said:


> While being compatible with all battery type would be nice I doubt they would do it. The 1500lm SC600Fd III plus draws 8A already on turbo and this one does almost 2500 lm. I suspect even the much beloved 18650GA wouldn't be able to handle that current draw.


Yup. Time to stock up on Sony VTC5 and Samsung 30Q. Like the much brighter Emisar D4, these new Zebras will need high-drain cells to really shine.


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## Ruso (Oct 9, 2017)

What are the differences in UI compared to previous gen?


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## benhar (Oct 9, 2017)

Ruso said:


> What are the differences in UI compared to previous gen?


In short, you can set it to go to something other than High at 1-click. 

The old functionality is there, but you have the option to go to more customized modes. This is taken from the SC53c AA, which I'm told is the new UI:

Basic Operation

One short-click turns on the light to High or turns off the light.

Two short-click turns on the light to Medium.

Three short-click turns on the light to the beacon-strobe mode.

Press and hold (for over 0.6 seconds) turns on the light to Low and then Medium and High. Release at the desired level. 
Advanced Operation and Configuration 


Press and hold to cycle from Low, Medium and High, release at the desired level to set. When press and hold, the light always cycle from Low to High regardless which level you are currently in.
Double click to toggle and select between the two sub-levels for that main level. Sub-level selections for the 3 main levels are memorized after the light is turned off and through battery changes.

The second sub-level (H2, M2 and L2) of each main levels can be further programmed to different brightness levels. At a main level, double-click 6 times to start configuration. On subsequent double-clicks the light will cycle through different brightness levels. Short click to turn off the light when finishing configurations. The selections for the second sub-levels are memorized after the light is turned off and through battery changes.

This light uses the main LED (flashing 1 to 4 times) to indicate the estimated remaining capacity of the battery. To start the battery indicator, (from Off) short-click 4 times without pause. 

Beacon-strobe mode can be accessed from 3 short-clicks when the light is Off. Once in the beacon-strobe mode, you can double-click to cycle through different types of beacons and strobes. Beacon-strobe settings are memorized when the light is turned off and through battery changes. 
Multiple Mode Groups



This light comes with three mode groups, G5, G6 and G7. The G5, set as the factory default, can be selected with 5-click from OFF, while G6 and G7 can be selected with 6-click and 7-click from OFF respectively. Mode group selections are memorized after the light is turned off and through battery changes. 

In all three mode groups

H can be either H1 or H2; M can be either M1 or M2; L can be either L1 or L2

from OFF: 1-click to H; 2-click to M; press and hold to cycle from L, M to H

In G5

H1 is fixed at 285Lm, H2 can be 238, 171, or 106Lm

M1 is fixed at 56Lm, M2 can be 26, 10.3, or 3.5Lm

L1 is fixed at 1.0Lm, L2 can be 0.26, 0.06 or 0.01Lm

In G6 and G7

H1, H2, M1, M2, L1 and L2 can be programmed to any of the 12 available brightness levels

Double-click 6 times at the H1, H2, ... L2 to enter the programming mode for that level. Once in the programming mode, use double-click to go up one level and triple-click to go down one level. Use 1-click to exit the programming mode

Three consecutive 5-click (or 6-click, 7-click) to reset the G5 (or G6, G7) back to the factory default settings


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## roger-roger (Oct 10, 2017)

No pictures yet, right? With the increase in max light intensity, anyone else half expecting a change to a slightly larger form factor for greater heat sink ability?


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## markr6 (Oct 10, 2017)

roger-roger said:


> No pictures yet, right? With the increase in max light intensity, anyone else half expecting a change to a slightly larger form factor for greater heat sink ability?



I'm betting it will be the same format...just a really quick step-down. Either way I'm not looking for it to be practical, just a "look what I can do" mode. But with the UI, it won't really matter since the other high modes will be more useful and easily accessed. Looking forward to this!


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## moozooh (Oct 10, 2017)

I made some back-of-the-envelope calculations with the help of Cree's PCT, and it turned out the SC600F III Plus didn't normally drive the LED to its maximum specified current, which is 3A, but rather stopped at around 2.2A, which suggests the 1800 lm figure quoted by ZL was achieved at ~13.2W LED input (merely 3W above the 2nd gen SC600). This one, however, seems to be driven at the full range of the specified input current, thus pulling some ~17.7W (not counting electric losses), which is roughly a third higher than the previous gen. This doesn't mean the light itself will become _hotter_—its thermal envelope is believed to be the same—but rather that it will become hotter _sooner_. But, at the same time, it will produce more light at the same temperature, as well as having a higher maximum. So it's still a win, but there's no sense upgrading from the III Plus otherwise... unless you really want that programmable UI, I guess.


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## kramnor (Oct 10, 2017)

Any news when will this monster be available?


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## recDNA (Oct 10, 2017)

I prefer a smaller led


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## PocketLight88 (Oct 10, 2017)

My wallet is ready for this bad boy


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## Overclocker (Oct 11, 2017)




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## markr6 (Oct 11, 2017)

PocketLight88 said:


> My wallet is ready for this bad boy



Same here!

As usual, just when I say "I'm done" buying flashlights.


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## markr6 (Oct 11, 2017)

Overclocker said:


>



If you're a dealer


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## Cobraman502 (Oct 11, 2017)

When will the sc64C be ready for individual sale?


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## Mattz68 (Oct 11, 2017)

Lol Mark6 on not buying anymore flashlights...my heard has been "thinned" down to 3 (1 flashlight and 2 headlamps) -but here I am! Anyway, since there's a picture of a 64C, I'll pass on some info I acquired yesterday: Z.L. informed me that the tint would be "very similar" to SC5C. That could be good to some and bad news to others that didn't care for the 5c's tint/color rendering...


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## Tixx (Oct 11, 2017)

Damn! Went to their site and not there. That is just wrong to do! Never saw me type so fast!


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## Cobraman502 (Oct 11, 2017)

Tixx said:


> Damn! Went to their site and not there. That is just wrong to do! Never saw me type so fast!



I did exactly the same thing.


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## Tixx (Oct 11, 2017)

Cobraman502 said:


> I did exactly the same thing.


Very excited to see them. So I'll be there 3 times a day now checking.


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## markr6 (Oct 13, 2017)

THREE more new models on the product sheet!

SC600 IV

SC600w IV

SC600w IV HI - TAKE MY MONEY!!

ps. make that FIVE (SC64 and SC64w)


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## carl (Oct 13, 2017)

The XHP50.2 model will output 2400 lumens while the XHP35HI model will output 1400 lumens - which means a 1000 lumen difference? This difference seems a bit large , I expected maybe a 500 lumen difference.


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## tompen41 (Nov 1, 2017)

I have the SC600w Mklll Hi now and am thinking about the new SC600w MK IV Plus with the XHP50.2 Emitter. My question is with the XHP50.2 emmiter what do you think the run times max on high could be! I assume this emitter is more efficient than the XHP35 but we are still using the same 18650 3500 mah 10 watt batteries so what is your guess that the max run time could be with this emitter pumping out 2300 lumens on HI 1. I am ready to pull the trigger but just want some opinions from those in the know about possible run times before I pre order.


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## StarHalo (Nov 1, 2017)

tompen41 said:


> we are still using the same 18650 3500 mah 10 watt batteries



I'm using 2500 mah 80 watt batteries..


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## Tachead (Nov 1, 2017)

StarHalo said:


> I'm using 2500 mah 80 watt batteries..


Those are probably overkill for this light. A GA, MJ1, or 35E, should be fine and give considerably better runtimes on most modes. And, if you want to use a high discharge cell, I would go with the Samsung 30Q or Sony VTC6 as they have much better performance.


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## Tachead (Nov 1, 2017)

tompen41 said:


> I have the SC600w Mklll Hi now and am thinking about the new SC600w MK IV Plus with the XHP50.2 Emitter. My question is with the XHP50.2 emmiter what do you think the run times max on high could be! I assume this emitter is more efficient than the XHP35 but we are still using the same 18650 3500 mah 10 watt batteries so what is your guess that the max run time could be with this emitter pumping out 2300 lumens on HI 1. I am ready to pull the trigger but just want some opinions from those in the know about possible run times before I pre order.


The 2300 lumen mode is thermal regulated so runtimes will vary based on conditions(ambient temperature, passive/active cooling, etc.). But, in average conditions, it will not run long at full output before being greatly reduced due to temperature. I would guess it will run less then 60 seconds before output is significantly reduced. It just isn't possible to run these kinds of outputs out of a light this small with current technology. The good thing with ZL's though is they will constantly adjust output to give you the max output that conditions(temperature) permit unlike many lights that just use a timed step-down. They also do this "throttling" very smoothly so there isn't harsh changes in brightness.


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## ven (Nov 1, 2017)

Thats one thing with ZL's it quite possibly has the most elegant step downs or ramp downs i have ever seen. The sc63w on H1 is super bright, maybe 1100+ lumens, i can focus on it and i can not for the life actually see it ramp down the brightness. I can tell after a little while with the overall light not being as bright, more so when stepped back up. But the way ZL does it is art!!! 

2300lm is crazy, maybe 30s or 60s if outside and cold. Run time is n/a on this level as it will drop and run a lot lower output(in comparison anyway, still obviously be bright!). Its a bonus wow mode, used for short blasts of lighting up a large area. The little sc63w gets toasty fast(not D4 fast) but it gets hot, with twice the output.............well it will be a hand warmer, all be it a very cool(looking)useful one


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## TCY (Nov 1, 2017)

ven said:


> Thats one thing with ZL's it quite possibly has the most elegant step downs or ramp downs i have ever seen. The sc63w on H1 is super bright, maybe 1100+ lumens, i can focus on it and i can not for the life actually see it ramp down the brightness. I can tell after a little while with the overall light not being as bright, more so when stepped back up. But the way ZL does it is art!!!
> 
> 2300lm is crazy, maybe 30s or 60s if outside and cold. Run time is n/a on this level as it will drop and run a lot lower output(in comparison anyway, still obviously be bright!). Its a bonus wow mode, used for short blasts of lighting up a large area. The little sc63w gets toasty fast(not D4 fast) but it gets hot, with twice the output.............well it will be a hand warmer, all be it a very cool(looking)useful one



That's one of the "hidden" good stuff about Zebralight. ZL's PID steps down with a whopping 384 brightness levels (and surprise, ZL's main brightness levels are picked from *768* internal levels, that sounds even more impressive), over 2.5 times than that of the D4 which is 150. If the R&D folks at ZL decides to put a ramping mode into their lights it would be a smoother experience.


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## Tachead (Nov 1, 2017)

TCY said:


> That's one of the "hidden" good stuff about Zebralight. ZL's PID steps down with a whopping 384 brightness levels (and surprise, ZL's main brightness levels are picked from *768* internal levels, that sounds even more impressive), over 2.5 times than that of the D4 which is 150. If the R&D folks at ZL decides to put a ramping mode into their lights it would be a smoother experience.



The problem with ramping UI though is that there is no way to tell really what output you are at and what runtime you can expect. It's easy to use a higher level then you need and drain the battery quicker then you wanted to. It is also much faster and more convenient to be able to go immediately to a desired level instead of having to ramp every time. A combination of the two might be nice but, personally I would always want access to at least a few levels immediately without ramping and know what the runtimes for those levels will be.


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## moozooh (Nov 2, 2017)

tompen41 said:


> I have the SC600w Mklll Hi now and am thinking about the new SC600w MK IV Plus with the XHP50.2 Emitter. My question is with the XHP50.2 emmiter what do you think the run times max on high could be! I assume this emitter is more efficient than the XHP35 but we are still using the same 18650 3500 mah 10 watt batteries so what is your guess that the max run time could be with this emitter pumping out 2300 lumens on HI 1. I am ready to pull the trigger but just want some opinions from those in the know about possible run times before I pre order.


Although useless for practical purposes, optimal performance isn't hard to calculate. 2440lm is the maximum OTF brightness achievable without overdriving the LED, minus optical losses. The light will pull ~19W from the battery. Assuming you use a top of the line ~13Wh battery which keeps the mode up until 10–15% of its nominal capacity, your runtime at maximum brightness will be <35 minutes.

The actual runtime, however, will almost always be a lot longer as there are no practical means of controlling the light's temperature, so power consumption will drop accordingly, thus increasing runtime.


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## tompen41 (Nov 2, 2017)

moozooh said:


> Although useless for practical purposes, optimal performance isn't hard to calculate. 2440lm is the maximum OTF brightness achievable without overdriving the LED, minus optical losses. The light will pull ~19W from the battery. Assuming you use a top of the line ~13Wh battery which keeps the mode up until 10–15% of its nominal capacity, your runtime at maximum brightness will be <35 minutes.
> 
> The actual runtime, however, will almost always be a lot longer as there are no practical means of controlling the light's temperature, so power consumption will drop accordingly, thus increasing runtime.



The battery Zebra sells is 10 watt. Are there 13 watt unprotected flat top batteries available?


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## twistedraven (Nov 2, 2017)

Ordered 3! Will only keep one.


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## JoeRodge (Nov 2, 2017)

We can pre-order now! Wohoooo!
http://www.zebralight.com/SC600w-Mk-IV-Plus-18650-XHP502-Neutral-White-Flashlight_p_225.html


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## iamlucky13 (Nov 2, 2017)

tompen41 said:


> The battery Zebra sells is 10 watt. Are there 13 watt unprotected flat top batteries available?



A couple electrical terms are getting mixed up. 10 Watt or 19W is a power level. 13 Wh is an energy capacity level, equivalent to a 3500 mAh battery. The standard unprotected battery that Zebralight sells, the Panasonic NCR18650GA, is rated for 10 Amps, which is the current draw. That's equivalent to a power level of 30 Watts when the battery is nearly depleted, and over 40 Watts when freshly charged.

So the NCR18650GA should be a good battery for this light.


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## Tachead (Nov 2, 2017)

twistedraven said:


> Ordered 3! Will only keep one.



I am surprised you went with the "c". I thought you were a "d" guy?


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## moozooh (Nov 2, 2017)

tompen41 said:


> The battery Zebra sells is 10 watt. Are there 13 watt unprotected flat top batteries available?


You're confusing watts (W) and watt-hours (Wh).

Watt-hours—ampere-hours (Ah or mAh) multiplied by nominal voltage (3.6~3.7V)—reflect energy capacity of a battery, i.e. how much energy it can store. Watts reflect power draw, i.e. how quickly the light can pump that energy out of the battery and into the LED. So in order to approximate runtime, you need to divide energy of a freshly charged battery by the maximum power (13Wh / 19W = 0.68hrs).


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## twistedraven (Nov 3, 2017)

Tachead said:


> I am surprised you went with the "c". I thought you were a "d" guy?



Over time I've grown to like the warmer lights more and more.


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## EDness (Nov 3, 2017)

I pre-ordered it. I love my sc600w and 2300 lumens in the same form factor...I have to get one.


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## tompen41 (Nov 3, 2017)

moozooh said:


> You're confusing watts (W) and watt-hours (Wh).
> 
> I meant to type amps but used watts instead! Thanks for the detailed explanation though.
> 
> Watt-hours—ampere-hours (Ah or mAh) multiplied by nominal voltage (3.6~3.7V)—reflect energy capacity of a battery, i.e. how much energy it can store. Watts reflect power draw, i.e. how quickly the light can pump that energy out of the battery and into the LED. So in order to approximate runtime, you need to divide energy of a freshly charged battery by the maximum power (13Wh / 19W = 0.68hrs).


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## Tachead (Nov 3, 2017)

twistedraven said:


> Over time I've grown to like the warmer lights more and more.



I find that is the evolution for most flashaholics. Warm CCT's are much nicer, imo, for indoor and outdoor night time use because they closer match the ambient lighting and aren't harsh. But, I still like around 5000K for daytime use. I use my H600Fc MKIII at night and my H600Fd MKIII for supplemental lighting during the day. Because most of my flashlight/headlamp use is at night, 3500-4500K has become my favorite CCT range with 4000K being the sweet spot.


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## twistedraven (Nov 3, 2017)

I tend to like a wide range of CCT, but it needs to have a beam quality with no tint shift within it, and no trace of green. That's why I either go floody beam with no hotspot to spill transition, or I go with a shaved dome or flat dome emitter for no tint transition.


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## ma tumba (Nov 3, 2017)

twistedraven said:


> I tend to like a wide range of CCT, but it needs to have a beam quality with no tint shift within it, and no trace of green. That's why I either go floody beam with no hotspot to spill transition, or I go with a shaved dome or flat dome emitter for no tint transition.



^this!


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## JoeRodge (Nov 10, 2017)

What are some good 18650s to use with this flashlight? Whany specific brand/model in mind? I guess it might be a bit off topic: what are good vendors? Know of any non shady Amazon dealers?


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## terjee (Nov 10, 2017)

JoeRodge said:


> What are some good 18650s to use with this flashlight? Whany specific brand/model in mind? I guess it might be a bit off topic: what are good vendors? Know of any non shady Amazon dealers?



30Q and VTC6 are popular for Zebralights.

Direct is a good option for Zebralights, NKON is also good for Europe. I’ve usually been ordering from NKON with the exception of preorders. They offer a good selection of batteries as well.


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## TCY (Nov 10, 2017)

What terjee said, LG HG2 and and Panasonic/Sanyo NCR18650GA. Watch out for button top cells as some ZL lights only accept unprotected flat top cells.


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## roger-roger (Nov 11, 2017)

Are we expecting the SC600w IV Plus to have more or less the same beam profile, in terms of flood-to-throw as the SC600w MKIII?


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## Tachead (Nov 11, 2017)

roger-roger said:


> Are we expecting the SC600w IV Plus to have more or less the same beam profile, in terms of flood-to-throw as the SC600w MKIII?



It will be a bit different. It uses a larger emitter and has a 14 degree hotspot vs 10 degree for the SC600w MKIII. In addition to the larger hotspot, it has a significantly higher output(2300 vs 1126 lumens). In terms of throw, it's hard to say whether the much higher output will make up for the tighter hotspot on the SC600 MKIII. I would guess it will.


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## holygeez03 (Nov 11, 2017)

Has someone confirmed that the Sanyo NCR18650GA will provide the required amperage for the MK IV Plus?

And if so, where is the best place to get those in a small quantity these days? It's been a while since I have needed any 18650's...


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## terjee (Nov 11, 2017)

holygeez03 said:


> And if so, where is the best place to get those in a small quantity these days? It's been a while since I have needed any 18650's...



These days, the “where?” depends heavily on “where to?”


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## holygeez03 (Nov 11, 2017)

Ohio... and it seems like ZL's $7 sale price is pretty decent to just order 1 or 2 along-side the light... assuming it will power it without any issue.


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## Tachead (Nov 11, 2017)

Illumn is where I get my cells. They have a huge selection and are great guys to deal with.


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## roger-roger (Nov 11, 2017)

Tachead said:


> It will be a bit different. It uses a larger emitter and has a 14 degree hotspot vs 10 degree for the SC600w MKIII. In addition to the larger hotspot, it has a significantly higher output(2300 vs 1126 lumens). In terms of throw, it's hard to say whether the much higher output will make up for the tighter hotspot on the SC600 MKIII. I would guess it will.




Thanks. After viewing the discussion at the new Hi/Plus thread, I'll probably stay with my earlier plan to go with the MK IV Hi. I'm not looking for a thrower per se, but compared to the base MK III beam, the MK IV Hi should suit my purposes well.


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## Tachead (Nov 12, 2017)

roger-roger said:


> Thanks. After viewing the discussion at the new Hi/Plus thread, I'll probably stay with my earlier plan to go with the MK IV Hi. I'm not looking for a thrower per se, but compared to the base MK III beam, the MK IV Hi should suit my purposes well.



No problem:thumbsup:. Just keep in mind that the tighter defined hotspot of the HI is not well suited to up close tasks. I have heard more then one person complain about this with the HI. But, this can be advantage with longer range stuff.


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## Flashlight Junkie (Nov 15, 2017)

I pre-ordered the SC600w Mk IV (XHP35) and SC600w Mk IV Plus (XHP50.2). Can't wait. Thought about the Mk IV HI, but I already have a MkIII HI and I'm more of a wide hot spot kinda guy anyway. The new mode groups should be interesting.


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## Derek Dean (Nov 16, 2017)

I'm looking forward to this light, but I do have one reservation. Of course, the big draws are the programmable UI and the new 50.2 emitter giving us up to 2300 lumens..... but one of the big things about ZL, at least for me, has also been the uber low levels, and I wonder if anybody else is concerned about the lowest low on this light being .2, rather than the .01 or .06 that we've seen in previous lights?

I know that folks in the 64c thread are concerned because ZL raised the lowest level to .12, and the SC600w IV Plus' low is much higher than that. I notice the the new HC600 IVc/d (which also have the 50.2 emitter), both have lows listed as .08, so it doesn't seem to be a limitation of the emitter. I think I'll check in with ZL and see what they have to say.


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## CM2010 (Nov 16, 2017)

No cool white version of the SC600w Mk IV Plus 18650 XHP50.2?


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## Derek Dean (Nov 16, 2017)

CM2010 said:


> No cool white version of the SC600w Mk IV Plus 18650 XHP50.2?


The cool white version was up on the ZL website briefly, but got removed for some reason. If you're interested in it, you might consider contacting ZL to see what's up.


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## typevii (Nov 17, 2017)

Derek Dean said:


> I'm looking forward to this light, but I do have one reservation. Of course, the big draws are the programmable UI and the new 50.2 emitter giving us up to 2300 lumens..... but one of the big things about ZL, at least for me, has also been the uber low levels, and I wonder if anybody else is concerned about the lowest low on this light being .2, rather than the .01 or .06 that we've seen in previous lights?
> 
> I know that folks in the 64c thread are concerned because ZL raised the lowest level to .12, and the SC600w IV Plus' low is much higher than that. I notice the the new HC600 IVc/d (which also have the 50.2 emitter), both have lows listed as .08, so it doesn't seem to be a limitation of the emitter. I think I'll check in with ZL and see what they have to say.




Yes, very concerned. The H604 lows are higher too. Just posted this in the headlamp forum.

I’m still worried about the low modes. I found the 0.01 lumen on my 602w was perfect as a moonlight mode. However my SC600fd III plus has a lowest low of 0.18 which is too bright. Really hoping Zebralight keep a true moonlight ultra low for the new 604c. Its kind of a dealbreaker for me. I have plenty of super bright flashlights, but not so many with a really low moonlight as well. Still looking for that one flashlght to do it all.


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## twistedraven (Nov 17, 2017)

Even in pitch black I never saw a use for .01 lumen, it wasn't enough light to light up much of anything at all. However, .1 lumen I have found to be rather useful.


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## Tachead (Nov 17, 2017)

twistedraven said:


> Even in pitch black I never saw a use for .01 lumen, it wasn't enough light to light up much of anything at all. However, .1 lumen I have found to be rather useful.


I disagree. When you wake up at night in the tent or at home with fully dark adapted eyes the 0.01 lumen mode is actually quite bright and plenty enough to find your way around. It is nice too as it tends not to disturb your significant other while they're still sleeping. 0.1+ is too bright for these uses and is only good if your eyes aren't fully dark adapted. Having this really low moonlight mode is one of the biggest selling features of ZL for me and several others as you can see. ZL has been giving us a variety of moonlight modes to chose from to serve all preferences and uses. Taking that away is a big mistake imo.


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## holygeez03 (Nov 17, 2017)

I have used the super low modes on ZL's for many years... in fact, there is a H502c on my night-stand that gets 99.9% of its use on the 0.04 lm mode... but I am guessing that something has to give on a rather small, handheld light with a large emitter capable of pushing out 2,300 lumens. Personally, I am fine with losing the super-low modes on this particular light in order to push the performance on the high end...

Also, due to the size of the emitter and beam profile, isn't it possible that the lowest 0.2 lm mode on the Plus will have a lux that is similar to a much lower mode on other ZL lights? Which would help since it is the lux that hurts your night-adjusted eyes?

I am not estimating that will be anywhere close to the 0.01 mode, but it might appear like a lot less than the 0.2 from other lights.


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## Keitho (Nov 17, 2017)

The loss of the .01 lumen mode on the 18650's is fantastic for true flashaholics...its the perfect excuse to buy more flashlights! I'd recommend a full set of SC53's, SC5's, and H502's. Even with a AA, the runtime on those is over 3 months at .01 lumens, which should be sufficient for most night-light uses, even if accidentally left on during the day, every day...just swap in a recharged cell every time there is an equinox or solstice.


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## Derek Dean (Nov 17, 2017)

Hmmmmm........ I got a very nice and thoughtful reply from Zebralight regarding my question about why the lowest levels seem to be creeping upwards. Unfortunately, I didn't ask for permission to post their reply, but here is the gist of it, which I found quite interesting. 

Maybe you'all already knew this, but apparently the SC600Fd III, and all 18650 lights released after that one, have a driver that has 2048 sublevels, many which are much lower than the ones published on the ZL website. Their choice of .2 for the SC600w IV Plus lowest level has nothing to do with limitations imposed by the LED or driver, but is a conscious choice on the their part to set the 12 allotted user levels so that they are spaced "perfectly to the human eyes". 

Evidently, as the output of the LED increases, it becomes increasingly difficult to maintain that optimum spacing, requiring them to increase the lowest levels a bit to fit in with that model. 

I find this fascinating, and also hopeful. It seems clear that if enough folks ask them to reduce the loweset output levels, at least a bit, then they might be willing to do that. Well, I've done my part (hint hint nudge nudge). 

In any case, I'm continually impressed with ZL and their thoughtful approach to portable lighting, and will look forward to getting this newest version for my small, but potent collection.


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## insanefred (Nov 17, 2017)

twistedraven said:


> Even in pitch black I never saw a use for .01 lumen, it wasn't enough light to light up much of anything at all. However, .1 lumen I have found to be rather useful.




Take off your sunglasses. 


Seriously,though,thatiswhyzebralightsareprogrammable.


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## terjee (Nov 18, 2017)

Derek Dean said:


> Maybe you'all already knew this, but apparently the SC600Fd III, and all 18650 lights released after that one, have a driver that has 2048 sublevels, many which are much lower than the ones published on the ZL website. Their choice of .2 for the SC600w IV Plus lowest level has nothing to do with limitations imposed by the LED or driver, but is a conscious choice on the their part to set the 12 allotted user levels so that they are spaced "perfectly to the human eyes".



Just to clarify:

When you’re in one of the new mode groups where everything is fully configurable, would you be able to select a lower mode group from those 2048, or would you be limited to choosing among the original 12?

If the internal sublevels are only relevant for factory programming or PID, it doesn’t change much.

If they’re available for programming for the user, so you could set 0.01 even if the lowest listed L2 is 0.12, then it solves everything.


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## holygeez03 (Nov 18, 2017)

That's weird that it was an actual decision that ZL made to not have a single mode below 0.1 lumen... I understand the desire to have "perfect spacing" but there is is a point where it is acceptable IMO to have a "jump"... and that's when going from moonlight/firefly modes into the general use levels.

With all of the programmable options on ZL's, you would think they could keep some way for a user to set-up one group of super low modes.


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## terjee (Nov 18, 2017)

I think the spacing is solid enough reasoning for the pre-set H1 through L2, but I’m not sure it holds up as well for the alternative second levels. There’s still a bit of a point though.


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## holygeez03 (Nov 18, 2017)

Yeah... is there any reason L2 can't be 1.8/0.6/0.2/0.1/0.05?


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## typevii (Nov 18, 2017)

holygeez03 said:


> Yeah... is there any reason L2 can't be 1.8/0.6/0.2/0.1/0.05?



Or even better, for all the new Zebralights, headlights as well (the new 604c looks great but for the lack of a true low low), just have the lowest low as 0.01. Keep the others as a nice even spread; whatever. But at least give those who want a really low low the option to select it. Isn’t that the point of the programmable UI, to give us the option to use these modes in the way that really suites us. If you don’t think 0.01 is useful, then just set your L2 to 0.5, but don’t remove it for those who do want it.

I personally prefer my h1 to be a super bright outlier, and my L2 as a super low outlier. With all the rest set for a nice even spread.


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## holygeez03 (Nov 18, 2017)

That doesn't work, because I find 0.01 to be useless... I would want ~0.05... which is why we need all the options.


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## Derek Dean (Nov 18, 2017)

terjee said:


> Just to clarify:
> 
> When you’re in one of the new mode groups where everything is fully configurable, would you be able to select a lower mode group from those 2048, or would you be limited to choosing among the original 12?
> 
> ...


My understanding is that those 2048 sublevels are not available for end user programming, only for factory programming, so we are only able to program the originally included 12 levels, but now, or course, we can put them in any order we want in the UI. 

I tend to feel that the very stable and extremely efficient low light levels, available for years on previous models, are kind of a ZL hallmark, and I'd like to see them continue that tradition. In fact, that, to me, would be what could make this into a nearly perfect light, being able to rock & sock it with 2300 lumens, but also have the ability to use super low moonlight levels as well, with a good selection of useful in between levels to boot. 

The guys in the SC64c thread were able to persuade ZL to change their planned low for that light from .12 back down to .05, so I see no reason we can't do the same thing with the SC600w IV Plus. Contact ZL and let them know your thoughts.


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## Derek Dean (Nov 18, 2017)

terjee said:


> I think the spacing is solid enough reasoning for the pre-set H1 through L2, but I’m not sure it holds up as well for the alternative second levels. There’s still a bit of a point though.


Yes, I can see their point, but for my uses, I'd rather see the extreme lows and have less than perfect spacing.

Of course, this brings up the point that maybe it's time for a new driver that has more than 12 levels. Keep the same 3 main levels, but add the required number of sublevels in order to keep that perfect spacing. Maybe easier said than done, but ZL has continually raised the bar, and I see no reason why they would stop now.


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## typevii (Nov 19, 2017)

Derek Dean said:


> Yes, I can see their point, but for my uses, I'd rather see the extreme lows and have less than perfect spacing.



Yes. My point exactly. For the extremes I can forego perfect spacing if we get an extreme low.


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## Flashlight Junkie (Nov 28, 2017)

Received an email from Zebralight. My SC600w Mk IV (XHP35) and SC600w Mk IV Plus (XHP50.2) have shipped!!!


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## holygeez03 (Nov 28, 2017)

Please post beamshots ASAP...


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## Flashlight Junkie (Nov 28, 2017)

holygeez03 said:


> Please post beamshots ASAP...



No problem. Might even do a YouTube video.


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## Tachead (Nov 29, 2017)

Flashlight Junkie said:


> Received an email from Zebralight. My SC600w Mk IV (XHP35) and SC600w Mk IV Plus (XHP50.2) have shipped!!!



Nice. What was your order number if you don't mind me asking? Hopefully mine gets shipped soon too. It's good to see another Canadian order being shipped as I wasn't sure if just the US orders were shipping so far.


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## Nichia! (Nov 29, 2017)

orbtronic is the best place ever for li-ion 
And Sal is my best friend and orbtronic Customer support is the best on the planet!


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## Tachead (Nov 29, 2017)

Nichia! said:


> orbtronic is the best place ever for li-ion
> And Sal is my best friend and orbtronic Customer support is the best on the planet!


Ah... I think you may have posted in the wrong thread? Or was that a reply to someone way earlier?

Orbtronic is just a re-wrapper not a manufacturer so, I don't see any benefit using their cells since these lights only take unprotected flat tops. Unless of course you like the look of their wrapper lol.

I do agree though, Orbtronic is supposed to be a good company to deal with.


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## Nichia! (Nov 29, 2017)

They have unprotected flat top and they are the best source for li-ion batteries


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## Tachead (Nov 29, 2017)

Nichia! said:


> They have unprotected flat top and they are the best source for li-ion batteries


Yes I know they do but, they are just re-wrapped OEM cells with Orbtronic labels on them. And, you pay extra for that label. Orbtronic doesn't make them and they are the same cells that any other retailer sells. There are a number of other great sources for li-ion including Illumn, IMR Batteries, Li-ion Wholesale, etc. But yes, Orbtronic are supposed to be good too, as is KeepPower, if fancy wrappers are your thing.

Now let's get back on track here. This thread is about the Zebralight SC600w IV Plus not batteries.


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## Nichia! (Nov 29, 2017)

No that's not true. They have Naked ones and for the same price as any cheap source. But the reason I mentioned them because they are a reliable source for most li-ion batteries


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## Tachead (Nov 29, 2017)

Nichia! said:


> No that's not true. They have Naked ones and for the same price as any cheap source. But the reason I mentioned the because they are a reliable source for most li-ion batteries


Yes, I see they also have some naked cells. And, I agreed with you, they are a reliable source but so are many others like the ones I listed. Now, can we please get back to Zebralight's.


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## Tachead (Dec 2, 2017)

Well, did anyone get their SC600w MKIV Plus(XHP50.2) yet? I am dying to hear some reports about it.


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## Derek Dean (Dec 3, 2017)

Mine was scheduled to arrive today, but no show : (

It probably got caught in the cyber Monday shipping crunch. I'd like to hear some reports too, while I'm waiting : )


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## insanefred (Dec 3, 2017)

I ordered mine on 11/17 but still no shipping notice. Also, when it does ship to me, I anticipate that it will get stuck in Hodgkins, Tx for week too.


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## Keitho (Dec 3, 2017)

Every hour in hodgkins seems like a week, I feel sorry for your light!


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## markr6 (Dec 3, 2017)

Derek Dean said:


> Mine was scheduled to arrive today, but no show : (


Same here, rescheduled for tomorrow. I'll let it slide since they're getting hammered. My local UPS even got delayed which never happens...5 trailers sat there unopened for a day.


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## Outdoorsman5 (Dec 4, 2017)

***EDIT - 12/18/17 - See my below comments. I wanted to update this post with this - I fixed the problem I was having. The threads on my new SC600w IV HI were very gritty. This grit was not allowing the tailcap to tighten enough to make contact with all of my batteries. After cleaning the threads, the problem went away completely. All 6 of my red zebralight 18650's fit just fine now. I REALLY LOVE THIS LIGHT AND THE NEW UI!!! It's perfect when backpacking at night along with a floody headlight. The throw is very very impressive and has plenty of spill. It is not at all like my annoying throw monsters that just have a small bright light with no spill. The SC600w IV HI is an excellent balance of both but with an emphasis on throw.

***Here is my original post:

Just got my SC600w IV HI but it is a FAIL. --- (PLEASE SEE ABOVE EDIT)

I have 6 red 18650's, all purchased from Zebralight. Only the 2 newest one's that arrived today are long enough to work in the SC600w MKIV HI. The other 4 batteries are too short to fit, and I have to tighten the cap down as hard as possible with the two new batteries to make the connection. Putting some folded up tin foil at the end of the battery makes the connection with the other 4 batteries I have, but that is not a good long-term solution. I guess the two newest batteries are either a hair longer or just not mashed in yet from constant use. What sucks is that I also had to return my SC600w Mk III HI for the SECOND time for a different defect (just shut off unexpectedly & wouldn't come back on for a few seconds.) I returned it in May, but the problem persisted, so I just returned it again asking Zebralight to just replace it instead of fixing it. They said ok to that request and apologized. 

After using the SC600w Mk III HI for most of this year, I see it as the GREATEST flashlight ever made, but DANG, I can't get one that works!! I own 16 Zebralights (between my wife, 3 kids, & me), so I'm not losing my liking for the brand. I am disappointed though! 

Anyone else seeing these problems?


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## insanefred (Dec 4, 2017)

Outdoorsman5 said:


> Just got my SC600w IV HI but it is a FAIL.
> 
> I have 6 red 18650's, all purchased from Zebralight. Only the 2 newest one's that arrived today are long enough to work in the SC600w MKIV HI. The other 4 batteries are too short to fit, and I have to tighten the cap down as hard as possible with the two new batteries to make the connection. Putting some folded up tin foil at the end of the battery makes the connection with the other 4 batteries I have, but that is not a good long-term solution. I guess the two newest batteries are either a hair longer or just not mashed in yet from constant use. What sucks is that I also had to return my SC600w Mk III HI for the SECOND time for a different defect (just shut off unexpectedly & wouldn't come back on for a few seconds.) I returned it in May, but the problem persisted, so I just returned it again asking Zebralight to just replace it instead of fixing it. They said ok to that request and apologized.
> 
> ...



When you say "red cells", which ones are those?


----------



## Outdoorsman5 (Dec 4, 2017)

Go to Zebralight’s Website. They’re the red 18650s. The “Panasonic/Sanyo NCR18650GA 3500mah 18650”. These are the recommended batteries for this light.


----------



## Tachead (Dec 4, 2017)

insanefred said:


> When you say "red cells", which ones are those?




Panasonic/Sanyo NCR18650GA. They are the only bare cells ZL sells.


----------



## insanefred (Dec 4, 2017)

Outdoorsman5 said:


> Go to Zebralight’s Website. They’re the red 18650s. The “Panasonic/Sanyo NCR18650GA 3500mah 18650”. These are the recommended batteries for this light.




ThatiswhatIassumed,butjustmakingsure.


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## EDness (Dec 4, 2017)

I just got mine today.


----------



## ieslei (Dec 4, 2017)

Great pics! Is it just the picture or the plus is smaller? Whats your first impression, throw, tint, etc..? I want to buy it but i need to know a few things first, hehe...


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## holygeez03 (Dec 4, 2017)

EDness.. any chance you have a SC62 or SC63 to compare beams?


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## Tachead (Dec 4, 2017)

EDness said:


> I just got mine today.


Nice. Thanks for the pics[emoji106] . Any chance you could post a beamshot of just the Plus? Also can you give us your impressions of it? What is the tint and beam profile like? How does it throw? How quickly does it get hot and step down? Do you like it overall? Thanks.


----------



## Derek Dean (Dec 4, 2017)

Ooooohhhh, I love that big broad hotspot, just what I was hoping for. Mine is still "Out for delivery", but these first images are encouraging. Thanks for posting them : )


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## Tachead (Dec 4, 2017)

Derek Dean said:


> Ooooohhhh, I love that big broad hotspot, just what I was hoping for. Mine is still "Out for delivery", but these first images are encouraging. Thanks for posting them : )


Yeah, it looks nice aside from a bit of colour shift but, that is to be expected with these new generation of Cree's with the full phosphor coating. Looks like his sample anyways is a bit warmer then the HI. Hopefully he will give us some more info and maybe another beamshot of just the Plus.


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## jb509 (Dec 4, 2017)

Tachead said:


> Well, did anyone get their SC600w MKIV Plus(XHP50.2) yet? I am dying to hear some reports about it.



Got it today. The tint shift toward red/pink as compare to my SC600w Mk III Hi and SC600Fd Mk III Plus but not as red/pink as my reference EagTac MX30L3-C with Nichia 219B. It has both 6 pogo pins on the positive and negative side. I don't have any equipment to measure the actual lumen but the brightness is comparable to my Olight R50 which is rated at 2,500 lumens.

Would like to hear from someone that can do the measurement?


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## Tachead (Dec 4, 2017)

jb509 said:


> Got it today. The tint shift toward red/pink as compare to my SC600w Mk III Hi and SC600Fd Mk III Plus but not as red/pink as my reference EagTac MX30L3-C with Nichia 219B. It has both 6 pogo pins on the positive and negative side. I don't have any equipment to measure the actual lumen but the brightness is comparable to my Olight R50 which is rated at 2,500 lumens.
> 
> Would like to hear from someone that can do the measurement?



Nice. Thanks for the report[emoji106]. Any chance you could post a beamshot?


----------



## lampeDépêche (Dec 4, 2017)

jb509 said:


> ... the brightness is comparable to my Olight R50 which is rated at 2,500 lumens....



yeah, I look forward to getting that confirmed.

Looking at the beamshots that EDness posted above, I have to say that the increase in the *size* of the hotspot does not look like it makes up for the decrease in *intensity* that the Mk III HI has. 

I mean--of course a single pair of beamshots does not prove how it will perform in person, and maybe the bigger wall of light will be super impressive. But I'm not yet sold on the 2300 lumens being a sufficient compensation for the lack of throw.

More measurements, please! More beamshots, and outdoor shots, and gifs that flip between modes, please!


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## NPL (Dec 4, 2017)

The HI model has an 8 degree beam, and Plus has 14 degree beam. If my math can be applied to light, you would need 1.75x the lumens on the 14 degree plus to equal the throw of the 8 degree HI. Might not be exact, but a good indication.


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## tompen41 (Dec 4, 2017)

Got mine today. I also have the SC600w MKlll Hi. The plus has a great hot spot with a wall of spill! Tint is very good. In comparing the two in throw the Hi does throw slightly further but not enough to make a difference! The total output of the Plus creates a lot of throw also. Overall I think the Plus is great I like the wall of light and throw is almost as far as the Hi, best of both worlds. I also ordered the SC64w and have the SC63w so I expect less difference there but I think I will like the increase in all levels output. Also I let the plus run 5 minutes on high and it was still hold-able by holding the back, seems to manage heat very well.


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## Derek Dean (Dec 4, 2017)

Okie dokie, my new ZL SC600w Plus IV arrived, and my first impression is "OMG, it's SO tiny". I'm honestly astonished at how they've managed to shrink this light compared to my original Mark I versions. Heck, it even compares favorably to my SC62w, with the only light really smaller being my SC52w. 




[/URL]Zebralights-800x600 , on Flickr[/IMG]

As you can see from the first photo, I'm spending this evening getting ready for a colonoscopy tomorrow, so doing a few flashlight tests will provide a nice diversion from other necessary activity : )

First off, the anodizing is perfect. Not a flaw to been seen. Perfectly centered emitter. Just a beautifully crafted little light. The switch is a bit softer than I'm used to, but not mushy, with firm contact and good feedback, just a bit less resistance that my earlier lights.. 

The color of light from this new LED is about what I've come to expect from Cree LEDs, a bit on the greeish side, which shows up mostly in the lower levels, but not objectionable, although I'll probably add some type of magenta filter to get it where it matches my other lights. 

I did a quick test with one of the two batteries I purchased with the light, while the other battery is charging to full. Remember, the light was still cold from being on a USPS vehicle all day, but I turned it on turbo (bright indoors), held it in my hand, fully covering it to cool it, and it ran for 3 minutes with out any noticeable drop in output. 

At the 3 minute mark, just as it was becoming uncomfortable to hold, it dropped down to the high level. Quite amazing. I don't know if PID was working that whole time, but if it was, I couldn't see it, and I didn't take my eyes off the beam. I suspect the drop in output was because of a low battery, as this was one of the new, not fully charged batteries that came with the light. 

By the way, I don't know if it's been mentioned, but my light has 6 pins in both the tailcap and up inside for the positive side as well. Nice. 

I was also interested to see what the lowest level looked like, and it was quite low, however, when compared to the low that I use on my SC62w for my nightly wanderings, it's quite a bit brighter than that, so it won't be doing that duty. It's too bad, because I know those levels are in the flashlight's driver, they just can't be accessed..... arrrrgh.

Ok, so how's the beam. Well, here we go:

Control, no flashlight (approx 70 feet to the stairs):



[/URL]ZL-Front-Contro, on Flickr[/IMG]

This was taken with the light on HIGH, not turbo!



[/URL]ZL-Front-High on Flickr[/IMG]

Next, in the parking area (approx 75 feet to the garage door) Control, no flashlight:



[/URL]ZL-Back---Side-Control on Flickr[/IMG]

On turbo:



[/URL]ZL-Back-Side-Turbo on Flickr[/IMG]

Finally, a look down the driveway. Approxx 125' to the end of the driveway. Control, no flashlight:



[/URL]ZL-Driveway-Control on Flickr[/IMG]

On Turbo:



[/URL]ZL-Driveway-Turbo on Flickr[/IMG]

So, that's it for now. I'm quite pleased with the light. I think it will be an excellent addition to my small ZL herd. It's still a bit perplexing as to how they've managed to shrink the light and yet make it SO bright, although I imagine the POGO pins had something to do with that.

The only thing that would make it "perfect", would be if it had retained the super low levels of my previous ZL models. 

Ok, time to........ run : )


----------



## holygeez03 (Dec 5, 2017)

Derek... can you make a comparison between the Plus and the SC62w in terms of beam profile and distance (throw)?


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## Derek Dean (Dec 5, 2017)

holygeez03, I'll get to that throw comparison tonight, but my quick overall impression between the two is that the hotspot is about 1/3 bigger on the IV Plus, with similar corona and spill characteristics, and of course the IV Plus is *at least* twice as bright. 

The IV Plus is my first light that is simply too bright to be used indoors or in close range on it's highest level.


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## holygeez03 (Dec 5, 2017)

Thanks Derek... I have been using my SC62w for some yard duties for years... have always wanted to replace it with a SC600w, but I need the replacement to throw at least a little further and have a very noticeable increase in overall output. The Plus seems like it may fit the bill...


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## markr6 (Dec 5, 2017)

Stupid bright! This is going on my wish list...the top.


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## Hondo (Dec 5, 2017)

NPL said:


> The HI model has an 8 degree beam, and Plus has 14 degree beam. If my math can be applied to light, you would need 1.75x the lumens on the 14 degree plus to equal the throw of the 8 degree HI. Might not be exact, but a good indication.



Actually, your math is not quite in two dimensions yet. The intensity will be proportional to the area of the beam, not the width. So you need to square your 1.75 for a little over 3x the lumens to give the same throw.


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## StarHalo (Dec 5, 2017)

Derek Dean said:


> Ok, time to........ run : )



As indicated by the bowel prep kit..

You're saying the moonlight mode is not quite moonlight?


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## NPL (Dec 5, 2017)

Hondo said:


> Actually, your math is not quite in two dimensions yet. The intensity will be proportional to the area of the beam, not the width. So you need to square your 1.75 for a little over 3x the lumens to give the same throw.


Thanks Hondo! I was thinking that the relationship is not linear so you input to square it makes sense. So that means the Plus will not throw as much as the Hi version right?


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## K2-bk-bl-rd (Dec 5, 2017)

I'm very interested in this light. I got my first Zebralight flashlight yesterday! (S6330vn!) 
Anyone get the SC600fc or SC600fd version? I'm trying to decide if the 500 less lumens would be worth the 93-95 CRI? 

https://imgur.com/a/csOEJ


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## Flashlight Junkie (Dec 5, 2017)

Tachead said:


> Nice. What was your order number if you don't mind me asking? Hopefully mine gets shipped soon too. It's good to see another Canadian order being shipped as I wasn't sure if just the US orders were shipping so far.



My light will be delivered today. Order number is 10376453. Yes, we Canadians need to stick together.



Nichia! said:


> orbtronic is the best place ever for li-ion
> And Sal is my best friend and orbtronic Customer support is the best on the planet!



Orbtronic does make nice rewraps with protection and also sells non-rewrapped cells. Sal is awesome!


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## Nichia! (Dec 5, 2017)

Flashlight Junkie said:


> My light will be delivered today. Order number is 10376453. Yes, we Canadians need to stick together.
> 
> 
> 
> Orbtronic does make nice rewraps with protection and also sells non-rewrapped cells. Sal is awesome!



[emoji106]


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## Derek Dean (Dec 5, 2017)

StarHalo said:


> You're saying the moonlight mode is not quite moonlight?


Well, 'moonlight' is a subjective term. We knew from the specs that it wasn't going to be as low as previous lights, and we know they did this consciously as a way to keep the spacing relatively even. 

Many other manufacturers have "moonlight" modes that are not nearly as low as the one on the IV Plus, but compared to previous ZL lights, it's quite a bit brighter, however, I can still look at the LED when it's lit, so it's still pretty low. I'll try to shoot a side by side tonight with the SC62w to show what I mean.


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## ven (Dec 5, 2017)

Derek, the PID is witchcraft! I have the sc63w which is over 1000lm less and i can not see the step downs. Its like magic................I can only tell after its done its step downs(presume lots of mini ramps down as i dont see an actual step down.............this is deliberately looking for it against a wall, or outside against a bush). So after a minute or two(never timed) i just can see the beam is not as bright as it was!. So i would not be surprised that its started stepping down as soon as it feels quite warm in the hand.

Congrats, this may be my next ZL.


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## lampeDépêche (Dec 5, 2017)

NPL said:


> Thanks Hondo! I was thinking that the relationship is not linear so you input to square it makes sense. So that means the Plus will not throw as much as the Hi version right?



Almost certainly, yes. 

Think of the hotspot as a circle on a flat surface, perpendicular to the throw of the light. If we take the same amount of light and pack it into a smaller circle, we get a brighter (more lux) hotspot that throws further. A bigger circle dilutes the light, makes it dimmer.

You calculate the circle from the angle by cutting the angle in half and taking the sine, then multiplying that times the distance from the light to the wall. That's the radius of the circle. If you are comparing two hotspots, then you can ignore the distance since that will be constant for both. So to compare two angles (e.g. 8 and 14), you take sin of 4 and sin of 7, and divide them to get the ratio of the radiuses. The square of that ratio will give you the ratio of the areas of the two circles.

(We are assuming one factor in all of this: that both lights direct the same *proportion* of their total output into the hotspot. I.e., we are assuming that if the light with the 8-degree beam puts 85% (let's say) of its total output into the hotspot, then the light with the 14-degree beam also puts 85% of its total output into the hotspot. I think that is a fairly safe assumption in this case, or at least within 10% or so.)

The ratio of the radiuses is about 1.75, so as Hondo said, the ratio of the circles will be (1.75)^2 or a bit over 3. That means that the PLUS would need 3 times the output in order to have a hotspot that was just as intense but 3 times as big. Since the PLUS offers 2300 and the Mk III HI offers about 1100, that means it is putting out only 2 times as much. The hotspot intensity of the PLUS will be about 2/3s of the intensity of the HI.


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## Tachead (Dec 5, 2017)

Could someone post a white wall shot of the Plus by itself please so we can see the beam profile? Thanks:thumbsup:


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## NPL (Dec 5, 2017)

lampeDépêche said:


> Almost certainly, yes.
> 
> Think of the hotspot as a circle on a flat surface, perpendicular to the throw of the light. If we take the same amount of light and pack it into a smaller circle, we get a brighter (more lux) hotspot that throws further. A bigger circle dilutes the light, makes it dimmer.
> 
> ...


Awesome! The key here is that the Plus spot will still be significantly larger, despite less bright at equal distances. One could easily justify buying both lights depending on end use.


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## lampeDépêche (Dec 5, 2017)

NPL said:


> Awesome! The key here is that the Plus spot will still be significantly larger, despite less bright at equal distances. One could easily justify buying both lights depending on end use.



Oh, absolutely. Throw is not the only important thing in a flashlight. And for some uses, a flooder is much better than a thrower.

But I am used to the profile of the Mk III HI, so that is what I am comparing this to.


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## Derek Dean (Dec 5, 2017)

Just a few more photos for those of you who are awaiting your lights, or trying to decide if this is the light for you : )

First up, the pogo pins in the tailcap of the ZL SC600w Plus IV:



[/URL]ZL-IV-PLus-Pogo-Pins-Tailcap on Flickr[/IMG]

Pogo pins in the head of the ZL SC600w Plus IV:



[/URL]ZL-IV-Plus-Pogo-Pins-Head on Flickr[/IMG]

ZL SC600w Plus IV (filtered with minus 3/8 green) on TURBO (both comparison images with camera exposure locked):



[/URL]ZL-IV-Plus-Turbo on Flickr[/IMG]

ZL SC62w (filtered with minus 1/4 green) TURBO:



[/URL]ZL-SC62w-Turbo on Flickr[/IMG]

This next image is to compare the low levels between the SC52w on the left and the SC600 Plus IV on the right. It's important to note that in real life, the SC600w Plus IV's lowest level does NOT appear that bright, but the SC52w's low couldn't be seen if I showed the image any darker. 



[/URL]ZL-SC52w-Low-vs-ZL-SC600-IV-Plus-Low on Flickr[/IMG]

Next up, a couple of beamshot comparison images (remember, all these lights have magenta filters of varying degrees to correct the inherent green tint): 

L to R: 1. SC600 with Triple Nichia -- 2. SC600w -- 3. SC600w Plus IV -- 4. SC62w -- 5. SC52w *All Lights ON TURBO*



[/URL]ZL-Lineup-TURBO on Flickr[/IMG]

L to R: 1. SC600 with Triple Nichia -- 2. SC600w -- 3. SC600w Plus IV -- 4. SC62w -- 5. SC52w *ALL LIGHTS ON MEDIUM*



[/URL]ZL-Linup-Medium on Flickr[/IMG]


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## StarHalo (Dec 5, 2017)

Great shots; I've always said that you can't see a difference in lumens until it reaches 10%, but 0.1 to 0.2 lumens is a 100% difference, can't really miss it..


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## TCY (Dec 6, 2017)

Thanks Derek, good comparison:thumbsup:

I'll pass on this one, I have the D4vn and it feels redundant to own two lights with similar purposes. I did pre-order the H600Fc MKIV so am looking forward to it.


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## vadimax (Dec 6, 2017)

ven said:


> Derek, the PID is witchcraft! I have the sc63w which is over 1000lm less and i can not see the step downs. Its like magic................I can only tell after its done its step downs(presume lots of mini ramps down as i dont see an actual step down.............this is deliberately looking for it against a wall, or outside against a bush). So after a minute or two(never timed) i just can see the beam is not as bright as it was!. So i would not be surprised that its started stepping down as soon as it feels quite warm in the hand.
> 
> Congrats, this may be my next ZL.



May it be that a step down is gradual and you cannot visually detect it?


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## Flashlight Junkie (Dec 6, 2017)

Derek Dean said:


> Just a few more photos for those of you who are awaiting your lights, or trying to decide if this is the light for you : )
> 
> Next up, a couple of beamshot comparison images (remember, all these lights have magenta filters of varying degrees to correct the inherent green tint):
> 
> L to R: 1. SC600 with Triple Nichia -- 2. SC600w -- 3. SC600w Plus IV -- 4. SC62w -- 5. SC52w *All Lights ON TURBO*



SC600 with Triple Nichia???? Where did you get that?


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## insanefred (Dec 6, 2017)

Flashlight Junkie said:


> SC600 with Triple Nichia???? Where did you get that?




Iwonderedthatmyself.


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## markr6 (Dec 6, 2017)

The guy that mods stuff from Canada I believe...can't remember who


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## ingokl (Dec 6, 2017)

StarHalo said:


> Great shots; I've always said that you can't see a difference in lumens until it reaches 10%, but 0.1 to 0.2 lumens is a 100% difference, can't really miss it..



The SC52w has a minimum output of 0.01 lumen. That's 2000% of the SC600w IV Plus minimum output.


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## ven (Dec 6, 2017)

vadimax said:


> May it be that a step down is gradual and you cannot visually detect it?




Not sure, i can only see the reduction after its happened or towards the end when i start to see it look a little dimmer compared to the full output. I have tested it out several times, i can see no steps so presume many tiny steps that are pretty much next to impossible to detect by eye individually. So instead of maybe an obvious jump/step down, then maybe another one. It does many tiny steps, each that small it takes many of them to notice the end of them, which of course is the lower output(i do see). Hard to explain..............


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## tompen41 (Dec 6, 2017)

Well mine is a keeper for sure now. I just dropped it on a gravel driveway and it got it's first ding. Very minor behind the bezel, hard to see. But that's ok I was planning on keeping it anyway. I like everything about it. I will still keep the SC600w MK lll Hi too but my EDC now will be the SC600w IV Plus.


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## markr6 (Dec 6, 2017)

tompen41 said:


> Well mine is a keeper for sure now. I just dropped it on a gravel driveway and it got it's first ding. Very minor behind the bezel, hard to see.


----------



## tompen41 (Dec 6, 2017)

markr6 said:


>




I would have kept this light anyway, I like everything about it. This is my 7th ZL and have no fault with any of them. I have the SC600w MK lll Hi also and comparing them side by side outside in total darkness I like them both. The Hi is a narrower beam but I also like the wide flood of the Plus. In throw at 100 yards they are about the same because of the higher lumen output of the Plus and If I were searching the Hi would be my choice but for overall use and indoors I like the Plus much better. Tint looks very much the same even though they are different emitters.


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## Derek Dean (Dec 6, 2017)

Flashlight Junkie said:


> SC600 with Triple Nichia???? Where did you get that?


Here is the thread that talks about my journey to ZL nirvana:
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...dded-with-Triple-Nichia-219-and-Carlco-Optics

I believe it's post #35 where you first see "My Precious" : )

The triple Nichia modded ZL is not as bright as my new SC600w Plus IV (probably around 900 lumens), but it's got a much larger hot spot, which I really enjoy.

All-in-all, I'm fortunate to have such a fine herd of ZL lights, each with it's own use. I will say though, I'm really diggin this new Plus IV, it's one sweet light. I got to take it for a walk tonight, and it's quite bodacious..... I feel like a Jedi Knight when I flip it on : )


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## tompen41 (Dec 7, 2017)

Derek Dean said:


> Here is the thread that talks about my journey to ZL nirvana:
> http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...dded-with-Triple-Nichia-219-and-Carlco-Optics
> 
> I believe it's post #35 where you first see "My Precious" : )
> ...



I was carrying mine last night at work when I spotted a strange pickup truck parked. When I approached the driver stepped out and I hit him with the light from about 25 feet. He was blinded immediately and commented what a bright light! He was legit but very impressed by my SC600w lV Plus!


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## recDNA (Dec 7, 2017)

Diameter is more important for pocket carry comfort than length. Still too "fat" for me to comfortably carry. Maybe sc64 will offer something I can use.


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## tompen41 (Dec 7, 2017)

recDNA said:


> Diameter is more important for pocket carry comfort than length. Still too "fat" for me to comfortably carry. Maybe sc64 will offer something I can use.



If you carry the SC600 like I do in a belt holster clipped to a belt clip you don't even realize you are carrying it.


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## WebHobbit (Dec 7, 2017)

These are now listed as BACK-ORDER.


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## tompen41 (Dec 7, 2017)

Buy directly from ZL that way you can return it to them if you don't like it or something is wrong. http://www.zebralight.com/SC600w-Mk-IV-Plus-18650-XHP502-Neutral-White-Flashlight_p_225.html


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## WebHobbit (Dec 7, 2017)

That's what I did....but did you notice it says BACK-ORDER now?


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## JoeRodge (Dec 7, 2017)

WebHobbit said:


> That's what I did....but did you notice it says BACK-ORDER now?



I pre-ordered mine on Nov 17th and was told yesterday that it won't ship for another 2-3 weeks. Pretty disappointed to be honest. I'm dying to get my hands on it.


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## tompen41 (Dec 7, 2017)

tompen41 said:


> Buy directly from ZL that way you can return it to them if you don't like it or something is wrong. http://www.zebralight.com/SC600w-Mk-IV-Plus-18650-XHP502-Neutral-White-Flashlight_p_225.html



Sorry I missed that. I can understand why, it is such a great light, I have a nitecore EC4SW that is 2000 lumens and I like it a lot but this ZL puts out more in a much smaller package!


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## insanefred (Dec 8, 2017)

JoeRodge said:


> I pre-ordered mine on Nov 17th and was told yesterday that it won't ship for another 2-3 weeks. Pretty disappointed to be honest. I'm dying to get my hands on it.




Same here.


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## recDNA (Dec 8, 2017)

tompen41 said:


> If you carry the SC600 like I do in a belt holster clipped to a belt clip you don't even realize you are carrying it.


A holster wouldn't look appropriate in my workplace. I really prefer pocket carry. sc62 is just the right size for me. My HDS is only slightly thicker yet I sometimes find it annoying. In a floody light the smaller head works fine. I prefer 400 lumens that don't drop down too fast to 2500 anyway. Still the new 600 is a great tech achievement & it does temp me for coat pocket carry but I usually reserve that for a thrower.


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## Flashlight Junkie (Dec 9, 2017)

JoeRodge said:


> I pre-ordered mine on Nov 17th and was told yesterday that it won't ship for another 2-3 weeks. Pretty disappointed to be honest. I'm dying to get my hands on it.



I ordered mine on Nov. 14 and it shipped on Nov. 29. Already on my kitchen table, just have to crack open the package and play around with it. So glad I didn't delay my order. I'm sure they'll be back in stock soon.


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## markr6 (Dec 9, 2017)

recDNA said:


> A holster wouldn't look appropriate in my workplace.



Same here. Or anywhere for that matter. I would get tired of telling people "no, I'm not a retired cop"


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## SuperCals (Dec 9, 2017)

I ordered a Zebralight SC600 IV Plus on Nov 5th, and still have not received the light. 
I contacted customer service to ask why they have not shipped the light yet.
They said that they will not ship for 2 to 3 weeks!
I am very disappointed with Zebra light.


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## noboneshotdog (Dec 9, 2017)

Is there a headlamp version of this light with neutral/warm tint, clear lens and 2300 lumens in the lV version?


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## Tachead (Dec 9, 2017)

noboneshotdog said:


> Is there a headlamp version of this light with neutral/warm tint, clear lens and 2300 lumens in the lV version?


No. 

The MKIV clear lens, neutral white, headlamp is the H600w MKIV. It uses the XHP35 and is 1400 lumens on H1. 

Remember the headlamps are way smaller and lighter then the SC600 and are more like the SC64. They already get hot fast and step down quickly at 1100-1400 lumens so, it would be kind of silly to try and push 2300 lumens out of one imo.


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## noboneshotdog (Dec 9, 2017)

Tachead said:


> No.
> 
> The MKIV clear lens, neutral white, headlamp is the H600w MKIV. It uses the XHP35 and is 1400 lumens on H1.
> 
> Remember the headlamps are way smaller and lighter then the SC600 and are more like the SC64. They already get hot fast and step down quickly at 1100-1400 lumens so, it would be kind of silly to try and push 2300 lumens out of one imo.



Gotcha. Thanks for the reply!


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## Tachead (Dec 9, 2017)

noboneshotdog said:


> Gotcha. Thanks for the reply!




No problem:thumbsup:.


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## Flashlight Junkie (Dec 9, 2017)

SuperCals said:


> I ordered a Zebralight SC600 IV Plus on Nov 5th, and still have not received the light.
> I contacted customer service to ask why they have not shipped the light yet.
> They said that they will not ship for 2 to 3 weeks!
> I am very disappointed with Zebra light.



Hmm... strange. Have you ordered from Zebralight before? I would think it would be first come-first served, not start with repeat customers.


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## NPL (Dec 9, 2017)

Tachead said:


> No.
> 
> The MKIV clear lens, neutral white, headlamp is the H600w MKIV. It uses the XHP35 and is 1400 lumens on H1.
> 
> Remember the headlamps are way smaller and lighter then the SC600 and are more like the SC64. They already get hot fast and step down quickly at 1100-1400 lumens so, it would be kind of silly to try and push 2300 lumens out of one imo.


They did release the h600fc mk4 with xhp50 led that puts out about 1500 lumens at high cri. If heat is not an issue for that one, then I don't see why they can't do it with a clear lens.


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## Tachead (Dec 9, 2017)

NPL said:


> They did release the h600fc mk4 with xhp50 led that puts out about 1500 lumens at high cri. If heat is not an issue for that one, then I don't see why they can't do it with a clear lens.



Heat is an issue on all these small Zebras. And, that is only 100 lumens more then the H600w MKIV. 

I'm sure they could put out a clear lens version of the H600w with the XHP50.2(not the XHP50 as it would have beam artifacts) with a 2300 lumen H1 if they wanted to. But, what's the point if it steps down to the same level anyway after a few seconds. A light that weighs 39 grams can only dissipate so much heat no matter which emitter or how efficient of a driver they are using is. There comes a point when it just gets silly to play the lumen race game in lights this small imo.


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## NPL (Dec 9, 2017)

I do agree, no need for a lumens game, but the xhp50.2 seems to be very efficient and at lower lumens without PID it seems it can deliver 350 lumens for 5 hours which is impressive. Looking forward to see the runtimes announced to see how like for like models compare.


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## Flashlight Junkie (Dec 9, 2017)

I just finished playing outside with my new SC600w Mk IV and Mk IV Plus with charged LG HE2 cells. First, I tested the Mk IV against my old and beloved SC600w Mk II L2. Gotta say, I'm a bit disappointed. Even though the Mk IV outputs 40% more lumens (1400 vs 1028), it doesn't look that much brighter. The Mk IV Plus has a beautiful, wide beam and a bit more throw than the Fd Mk III Plus (frosted lens). I definitely like it better than the III Plus. I'll probably send the IV back for a refund and keep the IV Plus. At any rate, at $89-$99 US a pop, I'm done with the lumens race. Unless Zebralight rolls out a Mk V at 3,000 lumens, I'm out for a bit. Peace!


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## SuperCals (Dec 10, 2017)

Flashlight Junkie said:


> Hmm... strange. Have you ordered from Zebralight before? I would think it would be first come-first served, not start with repeat customers.



Yes I have ordered from Zebralight before. I own 8 Zebralights. Customer service told me sorry you can cancel your order. This will be the last light I order from Zebralight for awhile. I'm not satisfied with there response.


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## sp5it (Dec 10, 2017)

Can someone post beam shot compare between mk4 plus and mk3 hi?
Thanks, Mike


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## geokite (Dec 10, 2017)

SuperCals said:


> Yes I have ordered from Zebralight before. I own 8 Zebralights. Customer service told me sorry you can cancel your order. This will be the last light I order from Zebralight for awhile. I'm not satisfied with there response.


What response would have been satisfactory?


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## SuperCals (Dec 10, 2017)

geokite said:


> What response would have been satisfactory?


 
I would like them to explain way orders placed after I placed my order Where shipped first.
But they responded with you can cancel your order. That sounds like maybe they don't want my business.


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## noboneshotdog (Dec 10, 2017)

SuperCals said:


> I would like them to explain way orders placed after I placed my order Where shipped first.
> But they responded with you can cancel your order. That sounds like maybe they don't want my business.



The other thing to keep in mind is some paid an extra $4 for expedited shipping which may have put them ahead as well.


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## Tachead (Dec 10, 2017)

sp5it said:


> Can someone post beam shot compare between mk4 plus and mk3 hi?
> Thanks, Mike


Post #151👍.


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## Derek Dean (Dec 10, 2017)

SuperCals said:


> I would like them to explain way orders placed after I placed my order Where shipped first.
> But they responded with you can cancel your order. That sounds like maybe they don't want my business.


I wouldn't take it like that...... they are a small company and they're in the process of releasing a ton of lights, and I imagine it's pretty crazy there now. 

We seem to have gotten used to the "instant gratification" afforded by large internet giants, but ZL is a small niche company, and I'm sure it's not an easy balancing act to figure out which lights to produce in which quantities, and probably even more difficult trying to please all the folks who pre-ordered the lights. 

Anyway, just a thought : )


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## SuperCals (Dec 10, 2017)

noboneshotdog said:


> The other thing to keep in mind is some paid an extra $4 for expedited shipping which may have put them ahead as well.


 
If that's the case I would like to know. If I wanted the light shipped on Nov 30th I would have paid the extra $4. As it stands now the light may not come until after Christmas.


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## noboneshotdog (Dec 10, 2017)

SuperCals said:


> If that's the case I would like to know. If I wanted the light shipped on Nov 30th I would have paid the extra $4. As it stands now the light may not come until after Christmas.



To be honest, I paid the extra $4 and it was shipped two days early and actually arrived in my mailbox the 30th. Not bad. So I have to believe the extra $ paid for expedited shipping this time around actually worked


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## Flashlight Junkie (Dec 10, 2017)

SuperCals said:


> If that's the case I would like to know. If I wanted the light shipped on Nov 30th I would have paid the extra $4. As it stands now the light may not come until after Christmas.



You have every right to expect your light to be shipped in the order it was received. This isn't the first time I've heard Zebralight say to people that they're free to cancel their order. I think it's just the way they say it and I don't think they mean to be rude. However, it's not the best way to respond to your valued customers.


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## Keitho (Dec 10, 2017)

Flashlight Junkie said:


> I just finished playing outside with my new SC600w Mk IV and Mk IV Plus with charged LG HE2 cells. First, I tested the Mk IV against my old and beloved SC600w Mk II L2. Gotta say, I'm a bit disappointed. Even though the Mk IV outputs 40% more lumens (1400 vs 1028), it doesn't look that much brighter. The Mk IV Plus has a beautiful, wide beam and a bit more throw than the Fd Mk III Plus (frosted lens). I definitely like it better than the III Plus. I'll probably send the IV back for a refund and keep the IV Plus. At any rate, at $89-$99 US a pop, I'm done with the lumens race. Unless Zebralight rolls out a Mk V at 3,000 lumens, I'm out for a bit. Peace!



I'm always surprised every time I re-prove to myself the logarithmic nature of my eyes. 7400 lm M43 to a 21,000 X7vn...surprisingly "meh". 1500 lm H1 down to 665 lm H2a on my SC600Fd...surprisingly little perceived drop in brightness. It happens to me often enough that I think I might have a learning disability. At least I've taught the part of my brain that buys lights on impulse to stick to high CRI and good tint rather than just lumens!


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## Flashlight Junkie (Dec 10, 2017)

Keitho said:


> I'm always surprised every time I re-prove to myself the logarithmic nature of my eyes. 7400 lm M43 to a 21,000 X7vn...surprisingly "meh". 1500 lm H1 down to 665 lm H2a on my SC600Fd...surprisingly little perceived drop in brightness. It happens to me often enough that I think I might have a learning disability. At least I've taught the part of my brain that buys lights on impulse to stick to high CRI and good tint rather than just lumens!



Couldn't agree more. I love the beam of the new Mk IV Plus. It's wide, but not too wide like the III Fd. It has a beautiful, warmish tint that's a lot like my Mk II L2. Also, the CRI (80+) looks the same as the III Fd (93-95). I couldn't be happier with this purchase. Still undecided if I'll return the regular Mk IV; need more play time. I also need to compare the IV Plus against the Mk III HI. The people in my neighbourhood probably think I have "issues". LOL.


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## NPL (Dec 10, 2017)

Flashlight Junkie said:


> Couldn't agree more. I love the beam of the new Mk IV Plus. It's wide, but not too wide like the III Fd. It has a beautiful, warmish tint that's a lot like my Mk II L2. Also, the CRI (80+) looks the same as the III Fd (93-95). I couldn't be happier with this purchase. Still undecided if I'll return the regular Mk IV; need more play time. I also need to compare the IV Plus against the Mk III HI. The people in my neighbourhood probably think I have "issues". LOL.


I'd love to hear your input between the Plus and the Hi once you have played around with them a little longer.


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## Flashlight Junkie (Dec 10, 2017)

NPL said:


> I'd love to hear your input between the Plus and the Hi once you have played around with them a little longer.



Just did it and the III HI still wins for distance. Hard to give a number, but I guess the HI is about 50% brighter than the IV Plus. Much narrower hot spot of course (8 degrees vs 14 degrees) and very little tint shift on the HI. The corona on the IV Plus is yellow/greenish.


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## NPL (Dec 10, 2017)

Flashlight Junkie said:


> Just did it and the III HI still wins for distance. Hard to give a number, but I guess the HI is about 50% brighter than the IV Plus. Much narrower hot spot of course (8 degrees vs 14 degrees) and very little tint shift on the HI. The corona on the IV Plus is yellow/greenish.


Thank you! So sounds like it's worthwhile owning both, or the regular sc600w for in between compromise.


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## carl (Dec 10, 2017)

I would love for ZL to make an SC600 Mk IV XHP50.2 with a mini-turbo head for increased throw while maintaining the huge lumen output from such a small light.


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## Tachead (Dec 11, 2017)

carl said:


> I would love for ZL to make an SC600 Mk IV XHP50.2 with a mini-turbo head for increased throw while maintaining the huge lumen output from such a small light.


The XHP50.2 is a poor choice for any throw applications. It just has too large of a footprint and is not available in a HI model. If they did make such a model, it would likely use the XHP35 HI like all the other newest throwers on the market. It or the XP-L HI are the best choices for this type of light right now.


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## Flashlight Junkie (Dec 11, 2017)

NPL said:


> Thank you! So sounds like it's worthwhile owning both, or the regular sc600w for in between compromise.



Yes, the SC600w Mk IV would be a good compromise. I did note that the width of the hotspot + corona on my SC600w Mk IV was a bit wider than my Mk II L2. Not sure if it's because of the extra lumens or it's just a bit wider. Specs say they're both 10 degrees. I'm not complaining. Let me figure out how to post pics here and I'll do a comparison between all my ZebraLights.


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## holygeez03 (Dec 11, 2017)

I finally decided to go for it and had my wife order a SC600w MKIV Plus as a xmas gift... I asked ZL for a shipping estimate and they said 3 to 4 weeks. 

Just FYI...


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## holygeez03 (Dec 11, 2017)

I have wondered... if ZL went back to something like the original SC600 form factor... could they use a bigger reflector and get a tighter beam profile with the XHP50 emitter? That would be an acceptable trade-off for me.


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## Fireclaw18 (Dec 11, 2017)

holygeez03 said:


> I have wondered... if ZL went back to something like the original SC600 form factor... could they use a bigger reflector and get a tighter beam profile with the XHP50 emitter? That would be an acceptable trade-off for me.



Original SC600 was longer, but not really any wider.

The primary determining factor for throw is width of the reflector or optic. Since the reflectors would be virtually the same switching back to the old body would not increase throw.

For an example of a wider reflector giving a lot more throw see the Emisar D1S. The smaller head D1 has maybe 45k lux. The bigger head D1S has maybe 125k lux.


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## Tachead (Dec 11, 2017)

holygeez03 said:


> I have wondered... if ZL went back to something like the original SC600 form factor... could they use a bigger reflector and get a tighter beam profile with the XHP50 emitter? That would be an acceptable trade-off for me.





Fireclaw18 said:


> Original SC600 was longer, but not really any wider.
> 
> The primary determining factor for throw is width of the reflector or optic. Since the reflectors would be virtually the same switching back to the old body would not increase throw.
> 
> For an example of a wider reflector giving a lot more throw see the Emisar D1S. The smaller head D1 has maybe 45k lux. The bigger head D1S has maybe 125k lux.



Not to mention, if you want a tighter beam then why not just buy the regular SC600 or better yet the SC600w MKIV HI? The XHP50 and 50.2 are just not good emitters for a throw application. They have too big of a footprint and aren't offered in a HI version.


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## holygeez03 (Dec 11, 2017)

I assumed the old SC600 could house a somewhat wider reflector... I wonder how much wider it would need to be to get a significant throw boost with the XHP50 emitter?


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## CelticCross74 (Dec 11, 2017)

Ordered my Mk IV on 11/27 and it still has not shipped yet. Not really a complaint as I have been around here awhile and know full well that Zebras sell literally as fast as they can be made. Going by my stellar experience with three SC600 lights thus far I jumped on the Mk IV when the ZL site announced it. Oh well I am sure it will show up eventually.


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## snowlover91 (Dec 11, 2017)

SuperCals said:


> I would like them to explain way orders placed after I placed my order Where shipped first.
> But they responded with you can cancel your order. That sounds like maybe they don't want my business.



From my experience with preordering Zebralights the past few years it seems like they ship based on two factors: order in which the order was placed AND type of shipping paid for. I always pay the $4-6 extra for the priority shipping as that gets you a much faster shipping window and delivery time. If you go the free route you’re going to wait a little longer usually, after all it is free shipping. 

I’ve seen Zebralight give the same response over the years to customers, I don’t see it as a sign they don’t want someone’s business but simply that if you aren’t willing to wait you can cancel without any issues/hassle. With how busy they are I highly doubt they have time to explain the reason yours hasn’t shipped yet and the logistics behind it... jmho.


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## markr6 (Dec 12, 2017)

I started skipping the priority mail and just sticking with 1st class. Still getting mine shipped early and only 1 day later than usual. This last time they seemed to "lose" it for a day, blamed on holiday volume. I'll probably go back to priority next time.


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## paojerokid (Dec 13, 2017)

Received mine here in Manila Ph [emoji759] (pre-order at ZL website)


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## lampeDépêche (Dec 13, 2017)

paojerokid said:


> Received mine here in Manila Ph [emoji759] (pre-order at ZL website



Thanks for those beam-shots, paojerokid! Those are really interesting. The PLUS actually looks like it has a *brighter* hotspot. But that may be the result of different exposure conditions between shots. Could you show us a single shot with both beams side-by-side?


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## holygeez03 (Dec 13, 2017)

I'm very surprised to see the size of the hotspots so similar in those beamshots... is the Plus being held closer to the wall? That would also explain the similar apparent brightness.


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## paojerokid (Dec 14, 2017)

Here's a side by side beamshot. Both should be around same distance from wall.


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## holygeez03 (Dec 14, 2017)

Thanks.... that makes more sense... Patiently waiting for my Plus to arrive.

Any chance you can provide an outdoor beamshot comparison?


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## lampeDépêche (Dec 14, 2017)

Wow! In the side-by-side shot, that PLUS still looks very, very bright. Every part of the beam looks at least as bright as the corresponding part of the HI beam, and it is also bigger. 

The size of the hotspot is about what I imagined given the difference between 8 degrees and 14 degrees. But I see *very* little drop-off in intensity when I go from the HI's hotspot to the PLUS's hotspot. By the numbers, it should be putting out something like 2/3rds of the luminous flux per square whats-it in area. But it *looks* about equal. (This may just show, once again, that eyeballs are not light-meters.)

Very cool--I am tipping towards getting the PLUS, and seeing if it will displace my Mk III HI from its place in my pocket.


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## terjee (Dec 14, 2017)

lampeDépêche said:


> Wow! In the side-by-side shot, that PLUS still looks very, very bright. Every part of the beam looks at least as bright as the corresponding part of the HI beam, and it is also bigger.



Just keep in mind that when the image is all white, you don’t really know bright it is, you just know it’s bright enough to saturate the sensor or image. In two saturated images, one can easily be 3 times brighter than the other for example.

Not saying that’s the case here, just mentioning. 

Oh, and same applies to how even the hotspot is. If the whole thing is saturated, you don’t really know if it’s even or not.


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## lampeDépêche (Dec 14, 2017)

terjee said:


> Just keep in mind that when the image is all white, you don’t really know bright it is, you just know it’s bright enough to saturate the sensor or image. In two saturated images, one can easily be 3 times brighter than the other for example.
> 
> Not saying that’s the case here, just mentioning.
> 
> Oh, and same applies to how even the hotspot is. If the whole thing is saturated, you don’t really know if it’s even or not.



Agreed, good points. 

I think I assume that with a lot of new cameras. it will self-adjust so that the highest-intensity part of the field is assigned the maximum value, and then other parts are assigned lower values.

But if this camera is working the way that you describe, then the relative intensities in the image do not indicate relative intensities in real life. Very true, and a good caution to keep in mind.


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## terjee (Dec 14, 2017)

lampeDépêche said:


> Agreed, good points.
> 
> I think I assume that with a lot of new cameras. it will self-adjust so that the highest-intensity part of the field is assigned the maximum value, and then other parts are assigned lower values.



This is a good point, but it all depends really. Not just on camera, but on settings and so on.


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## evil_twin (Dec 15, 2017)

Hello. Has anyone checked the sc600 mk IV to be protected from water?


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## tonystuart (Dec 15, 2017)

I'm waiting eagerly for my two SC600w IV Plus lights. Hoping their small enough to pocket carry. Thanks to everyone who posted. I think ZL makes exceptional products, but I am feeling a little mislead. Placed my order (#10376173) on 11-4-17 and have not received them yet. Not my first order, but haven't the experience to know to request expedited shipping on preorders... I'm waiting patiently, but after being told it would be another 2-4 weeks from now.... Hmm...


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## ntalbot (Dec 15, 2017)

How's the action on the switch? Is it nice and positive? Unlike all my other Zebralights, my SC600 mkII had a very soft switch, so soft it was easy to turn it on accidentally. I just want to make sure these new Zebralights don't have that problem.


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## noboneshotdog (Dec 15, 2017)

ntalbot said:


> How's the action on the switch? Is it nice and positive? Unlike all my other Zebralights, my SC600 mkII had a very soft switch, so soft it was easy to turn it on accidentally. I just want to make sure these new Zebralights don't have that problem.



I carry my SC600IV HI in a holster for the last 2 weeks 8 hours a day for work.

It goes in and out probably 50 times a day and haven't had a single accidental activation. The switch is perfect IMO.


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## SuperCals (Dec 15, 2017)

tonystuart said:


> I'm waiting eagerly for my two SC600w IV Plus lights. Hoping their small enough to pocket carry. Thanks to everyone who posted. I think ZL makes exceptional products, but I am feeling a little mislead. Placed my order (#10376173) on 11-4-17 and have not received them yet. Not my first order, but haven't the experience to know to request expedited shipping on preorders... I'm waiting patiently, but after being told it would be another 2-4 weeks from now.... Hmm...



I agree with you Zebralight totally dropped the ball.


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## Flashlight Junkie (Dec 15, 2017)

noboneshotdog said:


> I carry my SC600IV HI in a holster for the last 2 weeks 8 hours a day for work.



Just wondering if you have both the Mk III HI and Mk IV HI. I'm interested in the differences, other than the bump in brightness.


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## noboneshotdog (Dec 15, 2017)

Flashlight Junkie said:


> Just wondering if you have both the Mk III HI and Mk IV HI. I'm interested in the differences, other than the bump in brightness.



Sorry I don't have them both. It seems very few have received the IV's. Hopefully more people will get there hands on them soon and report back. :thumbsup:

Edit: I will say I'm loving the new programmable UI. It's so nice being able to assign any of the 12 levels to whatever mode I want. That's is probably the biggest plus of the MKIV.


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## Tachead (Dec 15, 2017)

evil_twin said:


> Hello. Has anyone checked the sc600 mk IV to be protected from water?


All Zebralight's are waterproof(at least IPX7). The newest models like the Plus are IPX8 rated(2 meter submersion for 30min).


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## TCY (Dec 16, 2017)

Tachead said:


> All Zebralight's are waterproof(at least IPX7). The newest models like the Plus are IPX8 rated(2 meter submersion for 30min).



From ZL over a year ago: "_We actually believe that the waterproofness of all of our lights are better than any other popular brands. The three possible ingress points (glass, switch cover, and tail cap) are all designed and verified thoroughly and manufactured to high standards._"

Apparently they just stopped being overly conservative.. hence the IPX8 rating on newer models.:thumbsup:


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## TCY (Dec 16, 2017)

evil_twin said:


> Hello. Has anyone checked the sc600 mk IV to be protected from water?



You can toss it into a pool and play with it for a while, no problem. Remember to thoroughly lubricate the threads with decent product (Nyogel 760G is a good option and is what ZL uses) for some extra waterproofness.


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## evil_twin (Dec 16, 2017)

TCY said:


> From ZL over a year ago: "_We actually believe that the waterproofness of all of our lights are better than any other popular brands. The three possible ingress points (glass, switch cover, and tail cap) are all designed and verified thoroughly and manufactured to high standards._"
> 
> Apparently they just stopped being overly conservative.. hence the IPX8 rating on newer models.:thumbsup:


Thank you, although it's scary to check. I installed the modes L1 and L2 instead of H1 and Н2 and now there is no flash when the middle mode is turned on. The G7 interface is just wonderful!


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## lampeDépêche (Dec 16, 2017)

The Mk IV PLUS is the same size as the Mk III HI, and I have pocket-carried that every day for the last year. 

I work in an office, wear pleated front khakis (e.g. Dockers, or the like), and it never feels like it is bulky or in the way.

Tastes in EDC vary a lot. Some people are comfortable wearing several pounds of hardware; some feel weighed down by a wallet and phone.

I'm probably towards the heavy end of things; I used to EDC a BM 710, but have downsized to a Spyderco UK Penknife.

Anyhow--I find the SC600 format very easy to EDC in a pocket, no holster needed. Your mileage, as they say, may vary.


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## tsask (Dec 16, 2017)

Flashlight Junkie said:


> Just wondering if you have both the Mk III HI and Mk IV HI. I'm interested in the differences, other than the bump in brightness.



good question ,but those pics showed me enough to make the move to the IV!


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## radellaf (Dec 17, 2017)

Flashlight Junkie said:


> Just wondering if you have both the Mk III HI and Mk IV HI. I'm interested in the differences, other than the bump in brightness.



The IV is a tiny bump in efficiency: 56lm for 36h vs 61 for 33; and, there's an extra 300lm (~25%) output on max. So I wouldn't replace a III for performance reasons. The new UI is the big difference. Now the Plus is a huge max output increase, but the III already pushes batteries as hard as I care to, and I'd bet the difference after 10 min of uncooled runtime isn't going to be much. It does 77lm for 26h, which is the same lumen/hours as the III HI, so I don't see a medium power efficiency gain. You get 358lm for 5.1h vs 312 for 4.3, so the sustainable high power level is 36% more efficient if my math is right.

So if you want the new UI, double the short-duration turbo output (with the right batt), and about 1/3 more high power efficiency, it's worth the upgrade.

Personally, my last "c" light was a SC51, so I'm gonna upgrade my SC52 to the SC53c to get more lumens, more efficiency, better quality light, AND the new UI. The SC64c is tempting, too, but I really love the smaller size, and I have the MkIII HI and a SC62w for lots of light and efficiency off 18650s, and a Jaxman E2 for more than 300lm of the best quality light. The Mk IV HI or Plus just don't upgrade from the MkIII HI in ways that grab me. Except the UI. Which I can play with on the SC53 for about half the price on a light that will be with me more often.

Still, that plus is one amazing bit of tech. If I didn't get the III HI, I have no doubt I'd get it as an upgrade to my SC62w or original SC600w.


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## Outdoorsman5 (Dec 17, 2017)

Earlier in this thread I posted a problem I was having with my new SC600w mk IV HI. For anyone who remembers or cared, I fixed it. The threads just needed to be cleaned and then the tail cap was able to tighten down enough to make contact with the battery. I now LOVE the light and LOVE the new UI!!


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## Derek Dean (Dec 19, 2017)

Outdoorsman5 said:


> Earlier in this thread I posted a problem I was having with my new SC600w mk IV HI. For anyone who remembers or cared, I fixed it. The threads just needed to be cleaned and then the tail cap was able to tighten down enough to make contact with the battery. I now LOVE the light and LOVE the new UI!!


Thanks for the update. I'm glad it was such an easy fix, and your post might help somebody else in the same situation. Enjoy your new light : )


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## Outdoorsman5 (Dec 19, 2017)

Derek Dean said:


> Thanks for the update. I'm glad it was such an easy fix, and your post might help somebody else in the same situation. Enjoy your new light : )



Thanks Derek! I also updated my original post to save confusion. 

This SC600w Mk IV HI is the most amazing light I've ever owned!!! And I've bought a ton of lights over the past 10 years. The throw in this little thing is awesome, and the spill is great too. This new UI is an unexpected bonus, and very usable for me. On my SC600w Mk III HI, I kept programming & reprogramming H2 to toggle back & forth between the two lower high settings. Now I have G6 & G7 programmed the way I want for quick access. 

Every time I wonder how Zebralight could improve their lights, they just do it. They keep coming up with awesome improvements making them the most interesting & impressive flashlight/headlight company in the business. Glad I'm not competing with someone like them in my industry!!


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## markr6 (Dec 19, 2017)

Outdoorsman5 said:


> This SC600w Mk IV HI is the most amazing light I've ever owned!!!



I love it. Need to clean mine like you mentioned and hopefully it's fixed. Otherwise, backpacking at night and

POW!!! Way more light than I need, but it's fun. Spill, throw, small and light.


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## holygeez03 (Dec 19, 2017)

Mark... do you have a MKIV Plus as well? I can't remember... but still looking for a good outdoor beamshot comparison.


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## markr6 (Dec 19, 2017)

holygeez03 said:


> Mark... do you have a MKIV Plus as well? I can't remember... but still looking for a good outdoor beamshot comparison.


No sorry I don't. I had the older one but it was way too floody for me. But that was the frosted lens. The new one looks pretty impressive! I think a better comparison would be with the standard MK IV, which is a balance between flood/throw.


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## holygeez03 (Dec 19, 2017)

I have a Plus on order... but still curious to see how the beam compares with the IV HI to be certain I made the correct decision.


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## Tachead (Dec 19, 2017)

Well, I have had my SC600w MKIV Plus for a day now. Here are my first impressions...

It is way smaller then I thought. It has great in hand feel with plenty of grip. It's anodizing is flawless and is darker and more shiny then previous models. The clip is strong and is a little bit harder to clip on to a pocket then the SC64c(with new style black clip) but, still great. The emitter is perfectly centered and it has a nice heavy orange peel reflector. Beam shape is great and near perfect for EDC imo. It has a huge hotspot and a very bright spill. Everything works well UI wise(haven't tried G6&7 yet). It's crazy bright on H1. It's pretty amazing to get this much light from a light this small. It gets hot on H1 but not crazy hot and it takes way longer to heat up then I expected. The lowest moonlight is quite a bit brighter then past lights with the 0.01 low but, is still a nice usable moonlight mode. Colour rendition is better then average. Hotspot tint on my sample is fairly good and gets rosier the brighter you turn it. On H1 it is quite rosey. Now, the bad... As expected, due to Cree's new full phosphor coating it has very prominent tint shift across the beam(similar to the XP-L2 used in the c models). On H1 the hotspot is quite rosey and has a very slight rosier artifact in the center due to the quad die design, the corona is yellow with maybe just a very slight hint of green(depending on ambient lighting), and the spill is rosey/magenta(again pretty standard for reflector lights that use AR coated glass). The corona is the worst part of the beam and is fairly consistent across modes(it is again, much like the XP-L2). If you are looking for a light with an even tint across the beam this is not the light for you. But, in actual use it doesn't matter much imo and it only really sticks out against snow or a white wall.

Overall, I really like the light. It is amazingly bright for its size and has great efficiency(5.1 hours at 358 lumens by the specs). I used it a lot on H1, and of course the other modes, over the last 24 hours and am still on the same cell. I checked the voltage on the VTC6 I am using and it was still at 3.86V. This may not be the light for tint snobs(I am one but, still like it) but, its overall attributes make it a pretty amazing light and you just can't get this combination of efficiency, output, beam shape, build quality, size, and weight in any other light that I am aware of. The closest thing to it would be the Emisar D4. It will give you better tint(depending on emitter choice of course), better tint consistency across the beam(due to the quad optic), and slightly more output but, the Plus is way more efficient, has no PWM, is fully regulated, offers the traditional reflector based beam shape many prefer, has a much higher build quality, and is more advanced in almost every way. If you want bright, small, and light these are the two lights you should own imo. I plan to eventually get the D4 and do a comparison.

Here is a beamshot. It is extremely hard to capture an accurate rendition. This was shot at 4100K. It is not quite right but, will give you an idea of shape at least. The ringyness is not present and it is less brownish and more yellowy in real life(especially the corona).






Here is a quick 5 minute runtime/output test to show the PID thermal management in action. I will likely do a longer test at a later time.

The first graph shows the point where the light hits max output(dotted line) and the second graph shows the point where the PID kicks in. The timestamps are at the top next to the @ symbol. The light runs on H1 for exactly 58 seconds before stepping down with no passive cooling(your hand) or active cooling(wind, a fan, water, snow, etc.). With passive or active cooling, it will likely run considerably longer.

Test was run on a nearly fully charged brand new Sony VTC6.

Ambient temperature - 22.6C

No cooling of any kind was used and the light was simply tailstanding in an improvised lightbox.

Lights head temperature at startup - 26.4C

Lights head temperature at test completion - 43.6C

Runtime/output graph and measurements provided by an Extech HD450 Data logging Light Meter.

Temperatures provided by IR Temperature gun.













I hope this helps guys. I will try and do some longer and more detailed measurements as time allows but, my brother gets into town for the holidays tomorrow so I won't have any time for the next 10 days or so. Happy holidays[emoji106].


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## NPL (Dec 19, 2017)

Thanks for the initial impressions. 350+ regulated lumens for over 5 hours sounds amazing. How does the beam compare to sc64c? Is it noticeably wider at medium distances? Both lights sound like fantastic edc's.


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## Flashlight Junkie (Dec 19, 2017)

Tachead said:


> Well, I have had my SC600w MKIV Plus for a day now. Here are my first impressions...
> 
> Now, the bad... As expected, due to Cree's new full phosphor coating it has very prominent tint shift across the beam(similar to the XP-L2 used in the c models). On H1 the hotspot is quite rosey and has a very slight rosier artifact in the center due to the quad die design, the corona is yellow with maybe just a very slight hint of green(depending on ambient lighting), and the spill is rosey/magenta(again pretty standard for reflector lights that use AR coated glass). The corona is the worst part of the beam and is fairly consistent across modes(it is again, much like the XP-L2). If you are looking for a light with an even tint across the beam this is not the light for you. But, in actual use it doesn't matter much imo and it only really sticks out against snow or a white wall



Agreed, the tint shift in the corona is very noticeable. I'm sending my SC600w Mk IV Plus back to ZebraLight for a refund and keeping the SC600w Mk IV. The regular Mk IV is a worthy successor to my SC600w Mk II L2, despite its slightly wider hotspot. The only other light I'm interested is the Mk IV HI. If someone has the III HI and IV HI, how different are the beams? I read somewhere (maybe this thread) that the OP in the IV's reflector is a bit more aggressive than on the III. Can anyone confirm?


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## ven (Dec 19, 2017)

Thanks for the thoughts Tachead, very cool:thumbsup:


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## neutralwhite (Dec 20, 2017)

I see zl has a frosted lens cool white mkIV plus which is xhp50, but the w version says xhp50.2 .
is there a cool white xhp50.2 or is this Frosty one the latest ?. 
What's the .2 mean anyway?.
thanks


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## twistedraven (Dec 20, 2017)

The OP aggressiveness in both the MK3 and MK4 versions of the HI is the same. It's only the first batches of the MK3 that have a less OP reflector. The change doesn't really affect the beam that much if it all.

HI would be the Zebralight to get if you want a beam profile with no tint shifts. Flat emitters interact with the reflector differently.


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## Flashlight Junkie (Dec 20, 2017)

neutralwhite said:


> I see zl has a frosted lens cool white mkIV plus which is xhp50, but the w version says xhp50.2 .
> is there a cool white xhp50.2 or is this Frosty one the latest ?.
> What's the .2 mean anyway?. thanks



The gaps between the dies have been minimized, so much less of a cross in the beam.



twistedraven said:


> The OP aggressiveness in both the MK3 and MK4 versions of the HI is the same. It's only the first batches of the MK3 that have a less OP reflector. The change doesn't really affect the beam that much if it all.
> 
> HI would be the Zebralight to get if you want a beam profile with no tint shifts. Flat emitters interact with the reflector differently.



Thanks for the feedback. I saw this Mk IV HI review on ZebraLight's website.

_"The SC600w III HI was great, but I didn't like the large gap between medium and high. This MK IV with the updated UI really makes it perfect. I noticed the orange peel texture on the reflector is higher on the IV, making the beam throw LESS than the III. But not much so I'm OK with that. Very nice tint, anodizing, quieter switch than the MK III, and 5 pogo pins holding the battery vs. just 3. Well done!"

_My Mk III HI was probably not in the first batch. So the only difference is the IV HI is a bit brighter? I'm hoping the spill on the IV HI is brighter than the III HI.


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## neutralwhite (Dec 20, 2017)

thanks , so what is the latest CW 18650 for throw?... MkiV frosted ?


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## Flashlight Junkie (Dec 20, 2017)

neutralwhite said:


> thanks , so what is the latest CW 18650 for throw?... MkiV frosted ?



If you're not into the neutral white HI, then, at 1,616 lumens and 10-degree hot spot, I'd say you want the SC600 Mk IV (cool white).


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## WalkIntoTheLight (Dec 20, 2017)

Thanks tachead for the impressions. I'm really trying to decide between the 600w IV Plus, the HI, and the 64w. Has anyone done lux/throw measurements on those lights? While the Plus sounds great with its high output, my concern is that it might be too floody. Ideally, I'd like something with at least 20k cd. Does the Plus have some throw, or is it mostly flood?

I presume the HI would have the most throw, but probably the least output and efficiency. Trade-offs....


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## WalkIntoTheLight (Dec 20, 2017)

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Thanks tachead for the impressions. I'm really trying to decide between the 600w IV Plus, the HI, and the 64w. Has anyone done lux/throw measurements on those lights? While the Plus sounds great with its high output, my concern is that it might be too floody. Ideally, I'd like something with at least 20k cd. Does the Plus have some throw, or is it mostly flood?
> 
> I presume the HI would have the most throw, but probably the least output and efficiency. Trade-offs....



Okay, since the Mk IV (regular) and Mk IV HI are the only ones in stock, I guess I'll choose between one of those two.

However, do they really have identical output and run-time specs? The only thing listed as different is the hot-spot size (10 degrees vs. 8 degrees). I thought the HI would have less output.

I prefer the 10 degree hot-spot of my SC5w, vs the 12 degrees on my other Zebralights. But I've never bought a Zebralight with a HI emitter before. 8 degrees may be getting too small for EDC, though I plan to use this outdoors too so maybe the 1.5x higher lux I'd get with a 8 degree hot spot would be better.

Comments from people that have tried both?


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## tompen41 (Dec 20, 2017)

my concern is that it might be too floody. Ideally, I'd like something with at least 20k cd. Does the Plus have some throw, or is it mostly flood?

I have the SC600w lV Plus and it does have some throw due to the increased lumens. It also has a great spill that I like to call a wall of light but it throws also. You will not be disappointed with this light! It is the best of both worlds. I have the SC600w MK lll also and it has more throw due to a different reflector and LED, but the Plus will light an object a long way away because of the amount of lumens.


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## holygeez03 (Dec 20, 2017)

WalkIntoTheLight... in my opinion, if you're going to be using the light outside, I would try the HI for the increased distance... If you're not concerned about throw, I would probably consider the SC64 over the regular SC600 due to the much smaller size. The HI seems like an awesome light for a tight beam and the Plus for its overall output... but the regular SC600 doesn't seem to differentiate itself enough from the SC64 for me.

All of this opinion is based on reports/beamshots/info from others... I don't have any of the above mentioned lights... but I am waiting on a Plus (and may need to give the HI a go someday).


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## paojerokid (Dec 20, 2017)

Some clearer pics of my mk4 plus side by side mk3 hi


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## sp5it (Dec 21, 2017)

Can you make a beamshot outside co compare both, 50m range please?
Mike


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## WalkIntoTheLight (Dec 21, 2017)

holygeez03 said:


> WalkIntoTheLight... in my opinion, if you're going to be using the light outside, I would try the HI for the increased distance... If you're not concerned about throw, I would probably consider the SC64 over the regular SC600 due to the much smaller size. The HI seems like an awesome light for a tight beam and the Plus for its overall output... but the regular SC600 doesn't seem to differentiate itself enough from the SC64 for me.



I think you're right. I'm ordering the HI version. It should make it a bit more useful outdoors. I find that when I go for a walk, I'm always carrying two lights: a flooder and a thrower. Maybe the HI version of the Zebralight will make it a good compromise.

I really like the floody Zebralights for indoor use, but I've always found them weak outdoors (except for close up, of course).

Now, if I could have a big hotspot + great throw + long battery life + small size + no stepdown, well that would be perfect!


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## twistedraven (Dec 21, 2017)

Can somebody with both lights on max output (MK3 HI, MK4 Plus) post a lower exposure shot of their beams to compare the intensity of their spots? 

Example, T21vn vs L2vn on max outputs (1/80 sec shutter speed, f22 aperture, 320 iso)






When the picture is taken at a lower exposure, we'll get to see the hotspots when they aren't washed out, that way we can see which one throws further. Outdoor beamshots welcome too.


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## mudcamper (Dec 22, 2017)

For those still wondering about ordering times, I'll share my experience.

I ordered an SC600w IV Plus back on November 11th. I just received it today December 22nd.

The delay was not a problem for me, as I have continued to carry my trusty old SC62 as I waited.

I'm a little sad, actually, to take that scratched up, banged up, trusty old light out of my pocket for the last time. It has served me very well for over three years. Best damn light I ever owned.


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## holygeez03 (Dec 22, 2017)

Mudamper... can you post a comparative outdoor beamshot between the SC62 and MKIV Plus?


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## scs (Dec 24, 2017)

Anyone with the SC64C and/or SC64W AND the SC600w MK4 Plus. Who's got a more even beam across the entire width of the beam, IOW, who floods better? Thanks.
A Zebralight that can flood like the Acebeam EC50 Gen 2 would be a dream light.


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## dofty (Dec 25, 2017)

I finally got my sc600w IV plus, and did a runtime test for H1.
the white spot is for reference, and the yellow spot is from the sc600w IV plus.
During the test, the sc600w IV plus was cooled by a fan.


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## mudcamper (Dec 27, 2017)

holygeez03 said:


> Mudamper... can you post a comparative outdoor beamshot between the SC62 and MKIV Plus?



Sorry, I'm not a photographer. The beam from the SC600w is a bit wider, warmer, and brighter. And despite being a slightly larger light, the clip lets it ride deeper in my pocket.


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## Hardpack26 (Dec 27, 2017)

Have had the IV Plus for about a week now, and here's my take.

Other Zebralights I own are the sc600 III HI Plus, the sc600Fd III Plus and the sc5. The majority of use these lights get for me is when I'm at work. I work on a drilling rig, and often at night, so a good, high powered, compact flashlight is useful, because there is a lot of ambient lighting, but with spots that still need to be lit up to see properly. I've used all of these light for work, but this week I got called out to help out on a well control situation for 3 nights straight, and got to put it to use. 

Before this light, I would carry both the HI and Fd plus for my needs out there. The Fd was wonderfull for working close to light up a work area and avoiding reflection of hotspots back in your eyes. I would however have to run it with pretty high power to be able to see well enough, therefore reducing runtime. Color rendition obviously is great. Lighting up distances, or down in pits it struggled. In these areas, the III HI excelled, but of course for close up didn't light up as wide an area and thenreflective hot spot will blind you. Even with it's narrow hot spot, and ability to run it a little lower, I'd find its run time would still sometimes come up a little short. Not terrible by any means, but for my uses, the IV plus seemed to outrun them both.

First of all, I set the G6 with quick click for lows, and long hold for highs. Double click is still mediums. I actually think this is even better than the standard zebralight setup. To get to medium you avoid the bright flash, and at any brightness you are on, you simply hold for brighter. Easier to explain to people if they should need to use it. I used it quite extensively for the three nights, alternating between the medium at 170 lumens and high at 350 lumens, and played with H1 at 2300 several times because its new of course. The difference between 170 amd 350 isnt hugely significant, but the 350 can offer just a hair better light up and avoid the PID. For most uses, the 170 works perfect, and even though it's significantly floodier than the HI, it still offers plenty enough throw to light up in a well lit place. With all that use, and messing around with H1, I came home and voltage was still 3.93 after 3 nights. Extremely satisfied with that efficiency. This is with a Sony VT6, so should even do better with the Panasonic at 3500 mah. 

As far as white walling it, yes the corona shift is noticeable indoors, and its got a hint of yellow to it. Not near as nice a color as the Fd plus, but it works, amd outdoors, this becomes less noticeable. On a side note, when comparing to the sc5 for tint and hot spot, it reminded me how nice the tint and beam quality is on the sc5. Clean transition from hot spot to spill consistent beam color, and a beautiful rosy slight magenta tint. For a non high CRI light, the sc5 is awesome. Run times for my uses, just don't cut it. For the house though, it is the perfect light.

All in all I love the IV plus. For me its two lights in one. The HI and Fd plus. Both of which I'll keep though, because they excel at their given purpose. Throw and beautiful high CRI flood.

Satisfied again by Zebralight.


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## ven (Dec 27, 2017)

Awesome feedback Hardpack, thanks for sharing


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## Tachead (Dec 27, 2017)

Thanks for the feedback Hardpack👍. I love my IV Plus as well, great light and crazy efficient.


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## paojerokid (Dec 31, 2017)

sc600w mk4 plus and sc600w mk3 hi
https://youtu.be/EwMGCogCCCo


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## R2RO (Dec 31, 2017)

paojerokid said:


> sc600w mk4 plus and sc600w mk3 hi
> https://youtu.be/EwMGCogCCCo



Cool. Finally someone can post a video! Would really like to see them outside though. Wondering what the throw is like on the plus compared to the HI as well as spill.


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## Outdoorsman5 (Jan 2, 2018)

dofty said:


> I finally got my sc600w IV plus, and did a runtime test for H1.
> the white spot is for reference, and the yellow spot is from the sc600w IV plus.
> During the test, the sc600w IV plus was cooled by a fan.




Hey dofty,

Thanks for posting your runtime video! It looks like you only got about 25 minutes of runtime in H1. Is that correct? If so, was the battery fully charged? I'm asking because 25 minutes is very very different than the advertised 1.8 hours. Thank you!!


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## Connor (Jan 2, 2018)

Outdoorsman5 said:


> It looks like you only got about 25 minutes of runtime in H1. Is that correct? If so, was the battery fully charged? I'm asking because 25 minutes is very very different than the advertised 1.8 hours.



Note: _During the test, the sc600w IV plus was cooled by a fan.

_If the light is sufficiently cooled and thus able to run nearly on max, 20-30 mins is what you will get from a good cell.


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## Outdoorsman5 (Jan 2, 2018)

Connor said:


> Note: _During the test, the sc600w IV plus was cooled by a fan.
> 
> _If the light is sufficiently cooled and thus able to run nearly on max, 20-30 mins is what you will get from a good cell.



I figured, but wanted to know for sure. I guess Zebralight's 1.8 hours is without a fan and just left to fluctuate according to temp. So holding the light in your hand would change things quite a bit since your hand cools it, not to mention the surrounding temperature/conditions. I wonder what a "real-world" use runtime would be??


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## Connor (Jan 2, 2018)

Depends on the air temperature and your skin temperature and how strongly you grip it. It's always regulated by the PID to the as bright as possible while being at the set temperature limit (51°C +-5°C, I think).


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## evgeniy (Jan 2, 2018)

Anyone received SC600FC/FD plus IV ?


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## Tachead (Jan 2, 2018)

evgeniy said:


> Anyone received SC600FC/FD plus IV ?


Wrong thread sir. This thread is for the SC600w MKIV Plus XHP50.2 specifically. I would post in the Official Zebralight Thread for the most traffic or start a new thread about the Fc&d Plus's.


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## foopluto (Jan 4, 2018)

Hello!

If you set a level controlled by the PID (H1, H2 or H3) on the M or L zone, will the PID continue to work properly?

I remember that the SC5 II, under these conditions, lost the 3-minute timing on H1 ... (it's a bug).


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## Dio (Jan 5, 2018)

foopluto said:


> Hello!
> 
> If you set a level controlled by the PID (H1, H2 or H3) on the M or L zone, will the PID continue to work properly?
> 
> I remember that the SC5 II, under these conditions, lost the 3-minute timing on H1 ... (it's a bug).



I don't consider it a bug when ZL confirmed it was designed to work in this manner... (a design feature for those smart enough to know when to manually step it down - i.e. it gets hot... - it will still step down according to battery voltage so I'm not worried)


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## CelticCross74 (Jan 5, 2018)

I finally got my SC600w IV Plus! I believe it has been over 7 weeks since I ordered it but thus far it is awesome! What an adventure it took to get this light to me! I hope the pics I post of it next to the XHP35 HI Mk III actually show up.






Yikes! Boy am I phone cam illiterate. I will get a couple good images up after I very carefully go over all the rules and guidelines thus completion of removal of my head from my own rear. 

That is a LOT of pins in this thing. Freshly charged unprotected GA cell off ZL's site fits very well. I have never seen a non custom light this small put out THIS much light! Wow!


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## Fireclaw18 (Jan 5, 2018)

CelticCross74 said:


> I finally got my SC600w IV Plus! I believe it has been over 7 weeks since I ordered it but thus far it is awesome! What an adventure it took to get this light to me! I hope the pics I post of it next to the XHP35 HI Mk III actually show up.



Unfortunately, your picture did not show up. To post a picture you will need to upload it to an image hosting site like Imgur and then link from there.


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## CelticCross74 (Jan 5, 2018)

Thank you!




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## Tachead (Jan 5, 2018)

CelticCross74 said:


> Thank you! I hope this hosting site is free?


It is. Imgur:thumbsup:.

Glad you like it so far. I like mine too, it's a great light and super bright and efficient.


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## snowlover91 (Jan 7, 2018)

How is the tint on this model? I might be selling my old MK3 and upgrading to this for the extra brightness and new UI.


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## Tachead (Jan 7, 2018)

snowlover91 said:


> How is the tint on this model? I might be selling my old MK3 and upgrading to this for the extra brightness and new UI.


See post #270 for my initial impressions.

Keep in mind though, this is a 3-step emitter so it will still have a fair amount of variation in tint between samples. But, the yellow corona will not change as it is a product of the full phosphor coating on Cree's new emitters(XP-L2, XP-G3, XHP50.2, XHP70.2).


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## paojerokid (Jan 7, 2018)

Zebralight SC600w mk3 HI (1126lm) and SC600w mk4 Plus (2300lm) Beamshots Comparison [emoji363]

All photos taken @ f/2.4 s.3 iso600 wb4500k (except for controls, enhanced brightness a bit to have more idea of the environment)


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## paojerokid (Jan 7, 2018)

Zebralight SC600w mk3 HI (1126lm) and SC600w mk4 Plus (2300lm) Beamshots Comparison [emoji363]
All photos taken @ f/2.4 s.3 iso600 wb4500k (except for controls, enhanced brightness a bit to have more idea of the environment)


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## paojerokid (Jan 7, 2018)

Zebralight SC600w mk3 HI (1126lm) and SC600w mk4 Plus (2300lm) Beamshots Comparison [emoji363]

All photos taken @ f/2.4 s.3 iso600 wb4500k (except for controls, enhanced brightness a bit to have more idea of the environment)


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## paojerokid (Jan 7, 2018)

Zebralight SC600w mk3 HI (1126lm) and SC600w mk4 Plus (2300lm) Beamshots Comparison [emoji363]

All photos taken @ f/2.4 s.3 iso600 wb4500k (except for controls, enhanced brightness a bit to have more idea of the environment)


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## NPL (Jan 7, 2018)

These are great comparison shots, thank you for sharing. If you could only keep 1 of the two lights, which would it be?


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## Tachead (Jan 7, 2018)

Yeah, thanks a lot man those are some great comparison shots.

I am still tempted to get a HI.


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## sp5it (Jan 8, 2018)

Thanks for beamshots. Tint shift on mk4 is terrible. I stay with mk3 hi. Mike


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## WalkIntoTheLight (Jan 8, 2018)

Tachead said:


> Yeah, thanks a lot man those are some great comparison shots.
> 
> I am still tempted to get a HI.



I considered a bunch of choices, but eventually ordered a 600w MkIV HI. I don't regret it. I was concerned it might be too throwy for a general-purpose light, but it's not. It has a large, bright spill, and the hot spot is not too small. The corona is very gradual, so you don't get any tunnel effect.

Outdoors, the extra throw (compared to the usual very floody Zebralights) really helps. I used to carry an additional C8 for throw, but I think I won't bother most of the time, now. The HI is not nearly as throwy as a C8, of course, but it throws well-enough for most purposes.


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## dofty (Jan 8, 2018)

It was 35 minutes, and the flashlight was cooled by a fan. 
I think the advertised runtime was tested under normal room temperature without cooling.


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## recDNA (Jan 8, 2018)

The MKIV HI scares me since user measurements show output much lower than spec


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## Tachead (Jan 8, 2018)

recDNA said:


> The MKIV HI scares me since user measurements show output much lower than spec



Keep in mind that home built light boxes accuracy can be all over the place. Not to mention throwier HI lights often are harder to accurately measure. Also, notice not a single person that I have seen on any forum has sent one back due to output and everyone loves them:thinking:.


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## recDNA (Jan 8, 2018)

Tachead said:


> Keep in mind that home built light boxes accuracy can be all over the place. Not to mention throwier HI lights often are harder to accurately measure. Also, notice not a single person that I have seen on any forum has sent one back due to output and everyone loves them:thinking:.


I'm certain my eyes can't tell 1100 from 1400 lumens but if I am paying for 1400 I want 1400.


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## Tachead (Jan 8, 2018)

recDNA said:


> I'm certain my eyes can't tell 1100 from 1400 lumens but if I am paying for 1400 I want 1400.



Oh I agree but, you can't take random home built light boxes measurements as gospel. The only persons I know to be proven very accurate is Selfbuilt. Remember, these are not professionally calibrated intergrating spheres we are talking about here.


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## Tachead (Jan 9, 2018)

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> I considered a bunch of choices, but eventually ordered a 600w MkIV HI. I don't regret it. I was concerned it might be too throwy for a general-purpose light, but it's not. It has a large, bright spill, and the hot spot is not too small. The corona is very gradual, so you don't get any tunnel effect.
> 
> Outdoors, the extra throw (compared to the usual very floody Zebralights) really helps. I used to carry an additional C8 for throw, but I think I won't bother most of the time, now. The HI is not nearly as throwy as a C8, of course, but it throws well-enough for most purposes.




Thanks for the insight:thumbsup:.

I am probably going to get one eventually but, will use it for an outdoor light to add a little throw(when needed) to my H600Fc&d MKIII headlamps. I already have the SC64c and SC64w for general purpose lights. I am going to sell my SC600w MKIV Plus(XHP50.2) as although it is a lot brighter and has a larger hotspot, it doesn't offer enough of a difference in beam profile over the 64's and I prefer their size for EDC.


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## zengaya (Jan 9, 2018)

Hello all! Jus mesured current in Hi mode. Its 6,4 Amps(!). Yesterday while walking the flashs light worked on Hi mode ~25 minutes, then step down. 3500 Sanyo 18650 battery full charged. The weather was -5C and wind. Flashlight was warm, but not hot. I think, ~ 35-45 C. Hard to tell, but i think, it was not pid power down. So the flashlight can be used full time in Hi mode, if the temperature outside 0c or lower  And runtime is short. Powerfull light.


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## JStraus (Jan 9, 2018)

Tachead said:


> Thanks for the insight:thumbsup:.
> 
> I am probably going to get one eventually but, will use it for an outdoor light to add a little throw(when needed) to my H600Fc&d MKIII headlamps. I already have the SC64c and SC64w for general purpose lights. I am going to sell my SC600w MKIV Plus(XHP50.2) as although it is a lot brighter and has a larger hotspot, it doesn't offer enough of a difference in beam profile over the 64's and I prefer their size for EDC.



I's love to hear your impressions between the 64c and 64w. I sold a 63w and got the 64c. I never got to mess with the 63w and 64c side by side but the temp seemed about the same. I like the beam pattern of the 64c better than the 63. And of course the programmability.

If you have time, it would be nice to hear a quick comparison between the 64c and 64w for output, beam, and tint!


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## Tachead (Jan 9, 2018)

JStraus said:


> I's love to hear your impressions between the 64c and 64w. I sold a 63w and got the 64c. I never got to mess with the 63w and 64c side by side but the temp seemed about the same. I like the beam pattern of the 64c better than the 63. And of course the programmability.
> 
> If you have time, it would be nice to hear a quick comparison between the 64c and 64w for output, beam, and tint!



Sure man, just give me a day or two more to test the 64w as I just got it yesterday.


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## SmeepyBeeper (Jan 9, 2018)

Tachead said:


> Sure man, just give me a day or two more to test the 64w as I just got it yesterday.



I'm also really interested, I'm going to be choosing between these two shortly as my first real light.


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## Derek Dean (Jan 10, 2018)

zengaya said:


> Hello all! Jus mesured current in Hi mode. Its 6,4 Amps(!). Yesterday while walking the flashs light worked on Hi mode ~25 minutes, then step down. 3500 Sanyo 18650 battery full charged. The weather was -5C and wind. Flashlight was warm, but not hot. I think, ~ 35-45 C. Hard to tell, but i think, it was not pid power down. So the flashlight can be used full time in Hi mode, if the temperature outside 0c or lower  And runtime is short. Powerfull light.


zengaya, welcome to the forum : )


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## holygeez03 (Jan 12, 2018)

For those interested... I ordered my MKIV Plus on December 10th and according to USPS tracking, it should arrive today.


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## dmsoule (Jan 13, 2018)

holygeez03 said:


> For those interested... I ordered my MKIV Plus on December 10th and according to USPS tracking, it should arrive today.



Yes, interested. I ordered January 10th, so I will not expect my mk iv plus until mid-February, unfortunately. Enjoy yours and share your impressions if you wish.


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## WalkIntoTheLight (Jan 14, 2018)

dmsoule said:


> Yes, interested. I ordered January 10th, so I will not expect my mk iv plus until mid-February, unfortunately. Enjoy yours and share your impressions if you wish.



When I emailed Zebralight about wait times, I was told there was a 3-4 week backlog until units were shipped out. That was end of Dec. Maybe they've caught up with stock a bit since then.


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## Keitho (Jan 14, 2018)

JStraus said:


> I's love to hear your impressions between the 64c and 64w. I sold a 63w and got the 64c. I never got to mess with the 63w and 64c side by side but the temp seemed about the same. I like the beam pattern of the 64c better than the 63. And of course the programmability.
> 
> If you have time, it would be nice to hear a quick comparison between the 64c and 64w for output, beam, and tint!


Not exactly what you asked for, but I have the SC63w, and jumped at the SC64c when it was announced. I'll start by saying that, by themselves, both are great; if you gave me one or the other by themselves and asked me to guess which you gave me, it would be very hard for me to tell. Beam patterns are identical. 

Side by side, the SC64c is a little dimmer and warmer. Due to the color temp and CRI, reds, browns, and greens look less washed out and more pleasing to my eyes. Again, differences are subtle, and only really noticable when side by side. 

For me, the more I use flashlights, the more I find myself ignoring lumen numbers, and selecting lights only with the exact color temp and CRI that I want. Fwiw, YMMV, yadda yadda--best of luck!


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## Tachead (Jan 14, 2018)

JStraus said:


> I's love to hear your impressions between the 64c and 64w. I sold a 63w and got the 64c. I never got to mess with the 63w and 64c side by side but the temp seemed about the same. I like the beam pattern of the 64c better than the 63. And of course the programmability.
> 
> If you have time, it would be nice to hear a quick comparison between the 64c and 64w for output, beam, and tint!


Sorry, I forgot to tell you I gave a comparison in the Official Zebralight Thread. Post #1540.


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## scs (Jan 16, 2018)

I just found these beamshots of the D4 and am extremely impressed.
http://www.taschenlampen-forum.de/threads/2-emisar-d1-und-5-emisar-d4.58828/
http://www.taschenlampen-forum.de/t...ld-3x-emisar-d4-zebras-eagtac-nitecore.58515/ Post #4

The D4 beam is what I hoped the SC600 MK 4 Plus would have, but it is not to be. Its wild tint shift across its beam is another disappointment.
Perhaps ZL would look into TIR optics and multiple emitters in single 18650 lights in the future.


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## Tachead (Jan 16, 2018)

scs said:


> I just found these beamshots of the D4 and am extremely impressed.
> http://www.taschenlampen-forum.de/threads/2-emisar-d1-und-5-emisar-d4.58828/
> http://www.taschenlampen-forum.de/t...ld-3x-emisar-d4-zebras-eagtac-nitecore.58515/ Post #4
> 
> ...



Those beamshots don't show the SC600w MKIV Plus or am I missing something? 

Of course the Plus would have different beam profile as it is a reflector mounted Cree and one of the new fully phosphor coated ones to boot(which are widely know to have a more off coloured corona). The Plus's tint shift across the beam is only slightly worse then your average Cree's and doesnt really matter much in actual use(especially outdoors). Quads are hugely inefficient and so are TIR optics so, I doubt you will ever see ZL do a similar light as efficiency is one of their things. It is a trade off really, the D4 gets hot and steps down crazy fast(less then 15 seconds) and gets terrible runtimes due to its quad emitter design and inefficient driver. The TIR optic is also stealing around 15% of its output and has very little throw. The Plus on the other hand heats up slowly comparatively and will run for minutes in use even on H1. It also gets crazy long runtimes(5.1 hours at 358 lumens) and outputs 98-99% of its light due to the efficient reflector and AR coated glass design. You just have to decide if tint consistency across the beam alone is worth giving up all the benefits a ZL offers(there are many in addition to the much better thermal performance and efficiency).

Honestly, if ZL was going to try and improve their beam quality, I would just like to see them throw a single high CRI Nichia 144A in one of these.


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## NPL (Jan 16, 2018)

Tachead said:


> Those beamshots don't show the SC600w MKIV Plus or am I missing something?
> 
> Of course the Plus would have different beam profile as it is a reflector mounted Cree and one of the new fully phosphor coated ones to boot(which are widely know to have a more off coloured corona). The Plus's tint shift across the beam is only slightly worse then your average Cree's and doesnt really matter much in actual use(especially outdoors). Quads are hugely inefficient and so are TIR optics so, I doubt you will ever see ZL do a similar light as efficiency is one of their things. It is a trade off really, the D4 gets hot and steps down crazy fast(less then 15 seconds) and gets terrible runtimes due to its quad emitter design and inefficient driver. The TIR optic is also stealing around 15% of its output and has very little throw. The Plus on the other hand heats up slowly comparatively and will run for minutes in use even on H1. It also gets crazy long runtimes(5.1 hours at 358 lumens) and outputs 98-99% of its light due to the efficient reflector and AR coated glass design. You just have to decide if tint consistency across the beam alone is worth giving up all the benefits a ZL offers(there are many in addition to the much better thermal performance and efficiency).
> 
> Honestly, if ZL was going to try and improve their beam quality, I would just like to see them throw a single high CRI Nichia 144A in one of these.


How are quads ineficient? I thought running more LEDs make a light more efficient because the lumen efficiency is better at lower outputs. So running four LEDs at 1/4 output per LED is more efficient than running a single LED at equivalent total output.


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## WalkIntoTheLight (Jan 16, 2018)

NPL said:


> How are quads ineficient? I thought running more LEDs make a light more efficient because the lumen efficiency is better at lower outputs. So running four LEDs at 1/4 output per LED is more efficient than running a single LED at equivalent total output.



The quads I have use FET drivers, and so does the D4 I think. Maybe that's what he meant by saying they're inefficient.

But yeah, I don't see why you couldn't use a better driver in a quad to get good efficiency.


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## holygeez03 (Jan 16, 2018)

Unfortunately the MKIV Plus isn't as amazing as I hoped thus far, relative to my SC62w that it's replacing for "yard duty"... the temp/tint is not overly "colored", but the shift between hotspot, corona, and spill is more annoying than I expected based on the beamshots... it's probably worse for me right now due to the snow on the ground.

The much bigger hotspot certainly makes it better for yard duty and after using it for a long time, going back to the SC62w will probably be more notable, but I'm not as surprised/impressed as I hoped I would be.

Despite all of the comparison photos, I was still surprised by how small the light is... that being said, I wish Zebralight would let the SC600 be a little bigger and use a head/reflector that better suits the XHP50 emitter.

I have considered trying the HI and deciding which I like better, but I am pretty sure the narrow beam profile will annoy me even more for my planned usage. The regular SC600w MKIV might be what I am looking for, but that is getting even closer to my SC62w specs...


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## scs (Jan 16, 2018)

Tachead said:


> Those beamshots don't show the SC600w MKIV Plus or am I missing something?
> 
> Of course the Plus would have different beam profile as it is a reflector mounted Cree and one of the new fully phosphor coated ones to boot(which are widely know to have a more off coloured corona). The Plus's tint shift across the beam is only slightly worse then your average Cree's and doesnt really matter much in actual use(especially outdoors). Quads are hugely inefficient and so are TIR optics so, I doubt you will ever see ZL do a similar light as efficiency is one of their things. It is a trade off really, the D4 gets hot and steps down crazy fast(less then 15 seconds) and gets terrible runtimes due to its quad emitter design and inefficient driver. The TIR optic is also stealing around 15% of its output and has very little throw. The Plus on the other hand heats up slowly comparatively and will run for minutes in use even on H1. It also gets crazy long runtimes(5.1 hours at 358 lumens) and outputs 98-99% of its light due to the efficient reflector and AR coated glass design. You just have to decide if tint consistency across the beam alone is worth giving up all the benefits a ZL offers(there are many in addition to the much better thermal performance and efficiency).
> 
> Honestly, if ZL was going to try and improve their beam quality, I would just like to see them throw a single high CRI Nichia 144A in one of these.



Firstly, beamshots of the plus by itself and in direct comparison with other lights and other ZL models have been floating around. Secondly, that huge beamshot collection over at TLF includes many ZLs with new emitters, so I have a very good idea of what the plus's beam pattern looks like relative to the others.

Of course TIRs produce a different beam pattern than a reflector; that's elementary and obvious. However, with the right combination of reflector and emitter, a beam very close if not almost identical to that of the D4 can be had. Just look at the Acebeam EC50 Gen 2. Before you state the obvious again, yes I know that uses the 70 series emitter as opposed to the 50 series in the ZLs.

When the plus was first introduced, and I saw that it paired a relatively large emitter in a small reflector, I hoped that it would have a beam similar to that of the Acebeam. Turns out It doesn't. And like you say, the plus's beam isn't markedly different from the 63 and 64s.

BTW, I'm not saying the D4 is "better" than the plus. I know the inherent inefficiency of the D4's driver. I wouldn't choose the D4 either for that reason.


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## Tachead (Jan 16, 2018)

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> The quads I have use FET drivers, and so does the D4 I think. Maybe that's what he meant by saying they're inefficient.
> 
> But yeah, I don't see why you couldn't use a better driver in a quad to get good efficiency.



Yes, I was speaking in a general sense. Every quad I have ever used or seen tested was pretty inefficient and got hot extremely fast. With a ZL designed driver they would be likely be better however. 

He is right though that emitters are generally more efficient at lower drive levels but, we have to keep in mind that it is not a huge difference, especially at higher outputs. Also, the D4 uses older generation Crees and Nichias which are all less efficient then the brand new XHP50.2 to start with. 

The other issue is when using quad emitters in a tiny light like the SC600, a quad optic is really the only option and these optics offer little to no throw and reduce light output by about 13-14% when compared to reflector designs which further lowers efficiency and generates more heat.


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## Tachead (Jan 16, 2018)

scs said:


> Firstly, beamshots of the plus by itself and in direct comparison with other lights and other ZL models have been floating around. Secondly, that huge beamshot collection over at TLF includes many ZLs with new emitters, so I have a very good idea of what the plus's beam pattern looks like relative to the others.
> 
> Of course TIRs produce a different beam pattern than a reflector; that's elementary and obvious. However, with the right combination of reflector and emitter, a beam very close if not almost identical to that of the D4 can be had. Just look at the Acebeam EC50 Gen 2. Before you state the obvious again, yes I know that uses the 70 series emitter as opposed to the 50 series in the ZLs.
> 
> ...



I can tell you, because I have owned both, that the Plus's beam is similar to the SC63/64 but has a slightly larger hotspot and spill. Other then that, beam wise the only difference is it's corona has a slightly stronger tint shift(but, not a crazy amount stronger).

Not really. A reflector will always give a less even beam unless a frosted lens is used. The reason the EC50 Gen 2's beam is different is because it has a much larger reflector and uses the XHP70 which doesnt have the full phosphor coating. Cree's new full phosphor coating used on the XHP50.2, XHP70.2, XP-G3, and XP-L2 causes a more off coloured corona due to the phosphor that is not over the dies being less excited.

The Plus's beam isn't markedly different(just a bit larger hotspot and brighter spill) but, it is a lot brighter and gets hot *way *slower then the SC63/64 on H1. So, it still offers some advantages.

Yeah, the only thing the D4 really has going for it over the Plus is a better emitter selection and a more even beam.


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## Fireclaw18 (Jan 16, 2018)

Tachead said:


> ...Yeah, the only thing the D4 really has going for it over the Plus is a better emitter selection and a more even beam.


D4 can do many things a Zebralight SC600 can't, such as:

* *Can run on different cell types*: 18350, 18500 or 18650 cells, by using the appropriate battery tube.
* *Twice the lumen output.* At 4200 lumens, has nearly twice the maximum lumen output of a Zebralight SC600 IV plus.
* *Has an excellent ramping UI* that seemless ramps between 150 brightness steps over 2.5 seconds. It feels a lot like an infinitely variable ring light.
* *Is easily modded*. When better emitters come out you can easily swap them in. In contrast, Zebralights are notoriously difficult to mod.
* *Is much cheaper* ($40 for the cheapest D4 compared to about $100 for an SC600 IV)
* *Is available in Titanium/copper* for those who like Bling.


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## Tachead (Jan 16, 2018)

Fireclaw18 said:


> D4 can do many things a Zebralight SC600 can't, such as:
> 
> * *Can run on different cell types*: 18350, 18500 or 18650 cells, by using the appropriate battery tube.
> * *Twice the lumen output.* At 4200 lumens, has nearly twice the maximum lumen output of a Zebralight SC600 IV plus.
> ...



It also uses cheap Chinese aluminum, has much lower quality anodizing, has less refined machining, is not potted, uses a PWM riddled inefficient driver that possesses no where near the level of sophistication the ZL driver does, has less advanced/accurate thermal regulation, is less weather proof, uses a non-recessed button that allows wear on the rubber boot and accidental activation, and has basically no warranty.

It should also be pointed out that that 4200 lumens is only with the more expensive HI emitters(the others are much lower). And, that is only about a 20% increase in perceived brightness(not very significant at all in actual use) and it can only hold that for about 15 seconds. The Plus can hold it's 2300 lumens for minutes. Even with no passive or active cooling it will hold a near perfectly flat regulated 2300 lumens for 60+ seconds at room temperature. 

Although they both have their pluses and minuses the D4 is still just a "budget light" and is not in the same class a ZL. That is why it is less money.

This is a ZL thread so lets get back on topic.


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## R2RO (Jan 17, 2018)

Nicely put. Also a ramping UI is useless. You can never gage the runtimes by "eyeballing" the output. ZL is definitely in different league.

Anyone have more input into the SC600 plus vs Hi?


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## Tachead (Jan 18, 2018)

R2RO said:


> Nicely put. Also a ramping UI is useless. You can never gage the runtimes by "eyeballing" the output. ZL is definitely in different league.
> 
> Anyone have more input into the SC600 plus vs Hi?


I can give a comparison as soon as my HI gets here(should be early next week)and I have a bit of time to put it though it's paces.


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## Fireclaw18 (Jan 18, 2018)

NPL said:


> How are quads ineficient? I thought running more LEDs make a light more efficient because the lumen efficiency is better at lower outputs. So running four LEDs at 1/4 output per LED is more efficient than running a single LED at equivalent total output.


*Regarding quad efficiency*: Actually a quad should be more efficient to make the same amount of light. LEDs get less efficient the higher the power you run them. With 4 LEDs you should be able to run a D4 at fewer amps to get the same amount of light as a single LED emitter.

The XHP 50.2 is a 4-die emitter, however its component dies are all smaller than XPL HI dies. Note that this disregards driver inefficiency. The D4 uses PWM so isn't as efficient as the Zebralight's current controlled driver except at 100% power (which pulls more amps than a Zebralight) and at the 1x7135 level (350 mAh current). On the upside the advantage of a PWM driver is zero tint shift at any brightness. Many Zebralights with current-controlled drivers see their tint shift to ugly green when run at low power.

*Regarding optics*: My understanding is TIR optics, such as that used in the D4, are universally _MORE_ efficient than traditional reflector/lens optics. An AR coated lens on a Zebralight might be 99% efficient, but the aluminum coating on the reflector is probably only 70-85% efficient. More light is absorbed by the metallic reflector than is absorbed through the back of a TIR optic, which can be up to 90% efficient. The main advantage of using a traditional reflector and lens combo is to get the familiar spot/spill beam pattern, not for efficiency.

Check this thread for some interesting source material on optics and reflectors used in flashlights http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?151836-Reflector-vs-Optics-Light-Loss


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## WalkIntoTheLight (Jan 18, 2018)

Fireclaw18 said:


> The D4 uses PWM so isn't as efficient as the Zebralight's current controlled driver except at 100% power (which pulls more amps than a Zebralight) and at the 1x7135 level (350 mAh current).



I disagree that a 7135 chip is as efficient as a proper boost-driver. The 7135 is a linear driver that will convert excess voltage into heat. The excess voltage is voltage that is higher than is required by the LED at 350mA, usually around 3v. It's kind of like putting a resistor in series with an LED; the resistor consumes some voltage and turns it into heat. The 7135 is only efficient when the battery voltage is approximately what the forward voltage of the LED is + a bit extra for running the chip.


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## Fireclaw18 (Jan 18, 2018)

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> I disagree that a 7135 chip is as efficient as a proper boost-driver. The 7135 is a linear driver that will convert excess voltage into heat. The excess voltage is voltage that is higher than is required by the LED at 350mA, usually around 3v. It's kind of like putting a resistor in series with an LED; the resistor consumes some voltage and turns it into heat. The 7135 is only efficient when the battery voltage is approximately what the forward voltage of the LED is + a bit extra for running the chip.



Good point. Bottom line is the Zebralight should considerably more runtime than a D4, and more runtime at max brightness than a D4. However, the D4 will considerably higher max brightness, more brightness options, and less tint shift.


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## 18650 (Jan 19, 2018)

Tachead said:


> The other issue is when using quad emitters in a tiny light like the SC600, a quad optic is really the only option and these optics offer little to no throw and reduce light output by about 13-14% when compared to reflector designs which further lowers efficiency and generates more heat.


 Is that 13-14% on top of reflector and lens designs?


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## Tachead (Jan 19, 2018)

18650 said:


> Is that 13-14% on top of reflector and lens designs?


As Fireclaw pointed out we don't really know how much the reflector is lowering transmission. It depends on a number of factors including coating type, level of OP, geometry, etc. But, the lens itself is stealing far less then an acrylic optic.

Now let's get back on topic guys. We can start a new thread if we want to further discuss optics, quads, or the D4. This thread is about the ZL SC600w MKIV Plus XHP50.2.


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## Fireclaw18 (Jan 19, 2018)

I wonder if I should order now while its on backorder and wait 2 months for it to arrive, or wait till they have it in stock and hopefully one wait a few weeks.


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## Tachead (Jan 19, 2018)

Fireclaw18 said:


> I wonder if I should order now while its on backorder and wait 2 months for it to arrive, or wait till they have it in stock and hopefully one wait a few weeks.


You will likely get it faster if you just order and wait. That way at least you are in line so to speak. But, if you aren't in a rush then I guess it doesn't really matter either way.


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## ieslei (Jan 19, 2018)

Hi, guys. I just ordered mine. It took 3 days to be shipped, it was fast considering it was backordered. I have one doubt i have an unprotect panasonic 2900mah 18650, will it work? I live in Brazil, there is no online store that ships the 18650ga to me.


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## WalkIntoTheLight (Jan 20, 2018)

ieslei said:


> I live in Brazil, there is no online store that ships the 18650ga to me.



Try aliexpress, and search for the Sunway Store. I recently ordered some Sony VT6 from there. I can PM you the link if you want (I don't think CPF allows me to post it). They also have Samsung 30Q's, which definitely fits in the Zebralight. Free shipping, prices are okay if ordering more than 1, and they seem to be one of the last places what will ship worldwide (they use Turkey post which still allows lithium-ion batteries). I can't vouch for them, but based on the reviews they seem legit, and my tracking number is in the system. I'm assuming slow, though, so I don't expect I'll get the batteries for at least a month.


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## ieslei (Jan 20, 2018)

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Try aliexpress, and search for the Sunway Store. I recently ordered some Sony VT6 from there. I can PM you the link if you want (I don't think CPF allows me to post it). They also have Samsung 30Q's, which definitely fits in the Zebralight. Free shipping, prices are okay if ordering more than 1, and they seem to be one of the last places what will ship worldwide (they use Turkey post which still allows lithium-ion batteries). I can't vouch for them, but based on the reviews they seem legit, and my tracking number is in the system. I'm assuming slow, though, so I don't expect I'll get the batteries for at least a month.


Thanks for the answer.  Sunway store doesnt have the 18650GA for sale, only samsung's.  The ones that i have are not up for the task? I read the specification is 9A max discharge current for the 2900, is it possible, at least for while?


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## WalkIntoTheLight (Jan 21, 2018)

ieslei said:


> Thanks for the answer.  Sunway store doesnt have the 18650GA for sale, only samsung's.  The ones that i have are not up for the task? I read the specification is 9A max discharge current for the 2900, is it possible, at least for while?



You don't have to use the GA for the Zebralight. It will give you a little more run-time, but not much compared to a 30Q or VT6. The latter two cells maintain a higher voltage during the discharge, so will allow a Zebralight to run a little longer than if you based it just on mAh. In other words, the watt-hours of a GA and VT6 at high-current are not very different. At low current, the GA will perform longer, but you get very long run-times from any battery at low currents.

Anyway, getting your second or third choice battery is better than getting no battery at all.


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## holygeez03 (Jan 21, 2018)

How many amps max does the Plus pull at its highest setting?


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## Tachead (Jan 21, 2018)

holygeez03 said:


> How many amps max does the Plus pull at its highest setting?


I don't think anyone has measured it but, I would guess 8 or less(probably less) and only on H1 with a almost depleted cell.


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## holygeez03 (Jan 21, 2018)

I am having a really hard time getting over the completely purple ring at the very outer edge of my Plus beam... I assume this is normal? 

It doesn't even seem to be from tint-shift, it appears to be the light bouncing off the steel bezel and picking up the purple tint from the AR coating?


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## markr6 (Jan 22, 2018)

holygeez03 said:


> I am having a really hard time getting over the completely purple ring at the very outer edge of my Plus beam... I assume this is normal?
> 
> It doesn't even seem to be from tint-shift, it appears to be the light bouncing off the steel bezel and picking up the purple tint from the AR coating?



I'm not sure that's it. I had an Eagletac light with a very defined purple ring. After taking off the stainless bezel and lens, it was still there, so I assumed it was just the LED.

Edit: I was wrong. After checking some old pics I found that the purple went away completely after removing them.


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## WalkIntoTheLight (Jan 22, 2018)

markr6 said:


> I'm not sure that's it. I had an Eagletac light with a very defined purple ring. After taking off the stainless bezel and lens, it was still there, so I assumed it was just the LED.



Yeah, from what I've read, the XHP 50.2 has a problem with tint-shift across the beam, which is what the SC600 MkIV Plus uses.


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## Tachead (Jan 22, 2018)

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Yeah, from what I've read, the XHP 50.2 has a problem with tint-shift across the beam, which is what the SC600 MkIV Plus uses.


When people talk about the stronger tint shift on the XHP50.2 they are talking about the corona not a purple ring on the outside of the beam. The stronger yellowish corona on these emitters is caused by the phosphor covering the outer parts of the emitter, that aren't on the dies, not being as excited as much as the phosphor directly over the dies. The ring he is talking about is likely caused by the AR coating ZL uses which is pink/magenta in colour or just the standard purple spill that is a characteristic of reflector based Cree lights. 

I don't recall my Plus being any worse then any other average reflector based Cree light I have had other then the corona which had a stronger tint shift towards yellow. It did have a pinkish cast outside the spill caused by the AR coating though if you put it up against a wall.


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## WalkIntoTheLight (Jan 22, 2018)

Tachead said:


> When people talk about the stronger tint shift on the XHP50.2 they are talking about the corona not a purple ring on the outside of the beam. The stronger yellowish corona on these emitters is caused by the phosphor covering the outer parts of the emitter, that aren't on the dies, not being as excited as much as the phosphor directly over the dies. The ring he is talking about is likely caused by the AR coating ZL uses which is pink/magenta in colour or just the standard purple spill that is a characteristic of reflector based Cree lights.



I notice that all my Zebralights with regular Cree emitters have a purplish spill. But, my SC600w MkIV HI, with the XHP35 HI emitter, does not have this. I assumed it was because HI emitters have better tint consistency across the whole beam.


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## Tachead (Jan 22, 2018)

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> I notice that all my Zebralights with regular Cree emitters have a purplish spill. But, my SC600w MkIV HI, with the XHP35 HI emitter, does not have this. I assumed it was because HI emitters have better tint consistency across the whole beam.


Yep, it is a product of the way the dome on high density(HD) emitters interacts with the reflector. On mule models(with an HD emitter) without a reflector you will notice that the colour shift is reversed and the purplish colour is in the center of the beam because it is not being reflected. High intensity(HI) emitters don't use a dome so, they don't have this effect. So, if less tint shift across the beam is a desired quality then HI emitters are the better choice. Unfortunately they also produce I very tight and concentrated hotspot, unlike HD emitters, which is not ideal for many uses.


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## easilyled (Jan 22, 2018)

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> I notice that all my Zebralights with regular Cree emitters have a purplish spill. But, my SC600w MkIV HI, with the XHP35 HI emitter, does not have this. I assumed it was because HI emitters have better tint consistency across the whole beam.



I think that this is the case. I've noticed the same thing. The XHP35 Hi is a hell-of-a-good emitter in my opinion allowing a great throw and a reliably even tint.


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## holygeez03 (Jan 22, 2018)

What I am referring to is not a "purplish spill"... it is a distinct and very purple ring around the very outside of the beam.


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## markr6 (Jan 22, 2018)

Does it look like this? This is from my Eagletac T25C2.


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## Tachead (Jan 22, 2018)

markr6 said:


> Does it look like this? This is from my Eagletac T25C2.


That is a common trait of early Eagletac's. It is caused by the AR coating they used to use which is blueish. They now use a multi spectrum coating that is supposed to be better.

It should be noted that AR coated glass will almost always cause some type/colour cast.

ZL uses a pinkish AR coating on the Plus. Mine had a bit of a pinkish cast(similar to Mark's picture but, pinkish instead of blueish). It wasn't purple like holygeez03 is describing from what I remember(I sold it).


----------



## dmsoule (Jan 24, 2018)

Perhaps Zebralight is getting caught up with its inventory, because I received my SC600w mk4 Plus this week, only 10 days after ordering. Could be a return, but certainly doesn't look like one.

What a gem, I love nearly everything about it. Not as floody as I expected, which is a good thing. Very similar beam profile to my SC63w, but significantly brighter (almost appears twice as bright), slightly warmer, and better tint (less green). I estimated about 2400 lumens, using ceiling bounce, a lux meter, and several known lights.

Some tint shift, but no obvious purple. I like warm lights, so I consider the corona just a bit warmer than the middle of the beam. My only complaint is that the low is not dim enough, as others have said. I use the 0.01 lumen low of my SC600 mk3 HI during the middle of the night, and find it very useful.

Overall, $99 is a bargain for a light of this quality.


----------



## Misthailin (Jan 27, 2018)

I am loving mine! Very bright, very small, perfect tint. Great value in a light. I’ve been carrying mine everywhere since a got it a few weeks ago.


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## leggera16 (Jan 28, 2018)

I too noticed a hint of purple in the spill and green in the middle but doesnt really affect me using it and is mainly on lower modes. I love the quality and wider beam for walking.

Im guessing the 4 leds are mixed as on low they illuminate slightly differently and if i rotate the torch I can see a slight shift in color each turn.

Pulled the button tops off my 30q's and they are nice and snug. My ga is slightly dented after use but i cant remember if it was before.

I also got mine in ten days just recently but think its listed as back ordered last time I looked. Very happy.

The pictures look worse than what i see

Daytime 





https://screenshot.net/42nl6fy






https://screenshot.net/e01loiy

https://screenshot.net/dzpxliq

https://screenshot.net/1y14vak

Couldnt get pics to link and display


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## Fireclaw18 (Feb 23, 2018)

Got my SC600 IV Plus today.
*
My initial impressions*:

*OK tint*. Somewhat white-yellow. Not as warm or rosy as my 4000K XPL HI 5D tint Emisar D4. The Zebralight's tint isn't bad, but the D4's rosier tint is just better.

*Excellent thermal management*. When turned on side-by-side with the D4 with both lights on a fresh cell on turbo, the Zebralight barely looks like its on medium. The Emisar with twice the output appears enormously brighter with both a wider flood and more throw. However, after 15-20 seconds or so, the Emisar's driver has dimmed its output so much to prevent overheating the Zebralight pulls ahead in output. The Zebralight's current-controlled driver should also offer better runtimes at the expense of tint shift at lower power.

*Hand feel is excellent*. Exactly the same body as on the SC 600 III series lights. The Zebralight is slightly longer and wider than the Emisar D4 in 18650 configuration.

*Anodizing is perfect*. No blemishes or slightly discolored areas that I've occasionally experienced with Zebralight.


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## Capn (Mar 8, 2018)

I’ve read this complete thread two times. I hate to see it die ...

1. My EDCs for the past several years have been the SC52 L2 and SC32w. Excellent for my pocket purposes, but I’d like to move up to a ZL 18650 for more outdoor use. NOTE: My brightest light is a NiteCore P12 (1K lumen) but it’s kept on the nightstand for bumps in the night.

2. Two days ago, ZL told me more SC600w Mk IV Plus(es) would be available in three weeks. Hope so. (Forgot to ask about the SC600w Mk IV HI. Nuts.)

3. I’m still torn between the SC600w IV Plus and the IV HI. There have been outdoor photo comparisons of the IV Plus and the Mk III HI but none with the Mk IV HI. Can anyone remedy that with photos or dialog of experience comparing the two newer units?

I plan to order this week. Lacking any new information, I will probably go on the crazy lumen race with the Plus model hoping that gives me enough throw (100-150 yards) plus I like the design’s battery efficiency vs the IV HI.


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## holygeez03 (Mar 8, 2018)

If you are looking for 100-150 yard throw, I would definitely lean towards the HI.

I have a different thread that I started a while back discussing my dilemma trying to decide between the IV HI and Plus when they were first announced... I was looking for an upgrade to my SC62w. I went with the Plus and I wasn't blown away overall and the tint shift does annoy me. Honestly, it makes me even more impressed with my SC62w in comparison.

I'm sure the throw of the HI is impressive, but I wasn't sure if I could handle the narrow beam profile for my purposes. I probably should have ordered one to compare myself.

The "regular" SC600w MKIV might also be a good in-between choice.

If size is important, you may want to consider the SC64w...


----------



## Capn (Mar 8, 2018)

Thanks for your input, holygeez03.


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## Red One (Mar 8, 2018)

I ordered the SC600W plus and I was not thrilled with it. It is very floody. To floody for my taste, although the amount of light it puts out is enormous. 

I then ordered the SC 600 hi and I have been thrilled with it. Throws great and has a great balance of spill. It is the light that I have been searching for for a long time. If you like a throw light this is the one to carry.


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## Capn (Mar 9, 2018)

I may find myself in the same situation, Red One. I have ordered the Plus 2300-lumen model. Hopefully, I won’t need to sell / replace it with the HI model.

(I’m weak ... I just c-o-u-l-d-n’-t pass up all those lumens. Crazy, I know. 😀)


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## WalkIntoTheLight (Mar 15, 2018)

I have the HI version, and I don't find its beam too narrow for outdoors. The extra throw is very useful. It's not so great an indoor light, but I prefer one of my floody SC52's for indoors or EDC.

I also perfer my SC5w as a night-light. The moonlight on the SC600 is too bright for middle-of-the-night.

But for a general-purpose outdoor light, the SC600w MkIV HI is definitely my favorite.


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## SKV89 (Mar 15, 2018)

Fireclaw18 said:


> Got my SC600 IV Plus today.
> *
> My initial impressions*:
> 
> *OK tint*. Somewhat white-yellow. Not as warm or rosy as my 4000K XPL HI 5D tint Emisar D4. The Zebralight's tint isn't bad, but the D4's rosier tint is just better.



I own over several thousand dollars (over 50 flashlights) and the Emisar D4 XPL HI 4000k 5D has the best looking tint by FAAARR. I just hope it was hi CRI and that the D4 doesn't dim so quickly. Still debating whether to get the SC600 IV Plus right now...


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## StandardBattery (Mar 15, 2018)

SKV89 said:


> I own over several thousand dollars (over 50 flashlights) ...


Just a young whipper-snapper yeah.


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## markr6 (Mar 16, 2018)

Red One said:


> I ordered the SC600W plus and I was not thrilled with it. It is very floody. To floody for my taste, although the amount of light it puts out is enormous.
> 
> I then ordered the SC 600 hi and I have been thrilled with it. Throws great and has a great balance of spill. It is the light that I have been searching for for a long time. If you like a throw light this is the one to carry.



I was always more of a flood person, but surprisingly I found the HI to be a pretty good general use light too. And great as a mini thrower outdoors. I liked it so much I never re-purchased the standard SC600III/IV (I had the III and it was nice, but didn't feel the need for both).

A throwier light _can _make do up close, but a floody light can't make do for distance after a certain point even on H1.


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## Fireclaw18 (Mar 16, 2018)

I have an SC600w III HI. Great light, but I found it unpleasant for up-close use. The spotlight was too narrow and too distracting. Great light for medium distance, but not great for short range.

I find the SC600w IV Plus to be much superior for close up. Both the spot and spill are much brighter and it seems to have plenty of runtime in turbo before heat causes any noticeable stepdown. I'm very impressed with this light.


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## holygeez03 (Mar 16, 2018)

These past few posts would be better off in the "Plus vs. HI" thread...

I went ahead and ordered a MKIV HI to compare with my Plus.


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## jflip (Mar 16, 2018)

Any SC600w IV Plus owners happen to have a Thrunite T10?

The T10 is my ideal spill+spot beam and am wondering if the IV Plus' 14° hot spot is floody enough.


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## SergiT (Mar 17, 2018)

Hi. 
In my sc600 IV Plus, in H1 after 15 or 20 seconds, it changes to M1.
Should not lower the intensity alone instead of changing the mode?
Is it normal or is it some kind of failure?
Thanks and sorry for my english.


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## Connor (Mar 18, 2018)

@SergiT
Most likely you are using a battery that's not able to deliver enough amps and that drops in voltage so much that your Zebralight steps down. 
Use a Sanyo NCR18650GA or Sony VTC6.


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## SergiT (Mar 18, 2018)

Connor said:


> @SergiT
> Most likely you are using a battery that's not able to deliver enough amps and that drops in voltage so much that your Zebralight steps down.
> Use a Sanyo NCR18650GA or Sony VTC6.


I already use only Sony VTC6 and Samsung 30Q.


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## Connor (Mar 18, 2018)

If these batteries work OK in other lights something may be wrong with your Zebralight.  It shouldn't step down like that with good batteries.


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## SergiT (Mar 18, 2018)

Connor said:


> If these batteries work OK in other lights something may be wrong with your Zebralight.  It shouldn't step down like that with good batteries.


Ok. Thanks. I will check these batteries on other light.


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## markr6 (Mar 19, 2018)

holygeez03 said:


> These past few posts would be better off in the "Plus vs. HI" thread...



With 1942.2 Zebralight threads, I've pretty much given up. Relevant enough I guess. If SC5x format talk pops up, then we're clearly off track...maybe.


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## Hondo (Mar 19, 2018)

SKV89 said:


> I own over several thousand dollars (over 50 flashlights)




'round here that's called a "starter kit", pilgrim.


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## ven (Mar 19, 2018)

:laughing:


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## ieslei (Apr 5, 2018)

Hi, guys! My sc600 mk4 plus just arrived, its very bright, bigger than my sc63w but its worth it IMHO!
I think i am having a problem with it. On the highest the head gets very hot, impossible to hold. I afraid this amount heat can harm the LED... Its weird because i have sc63w and the head doesnt get that hot, only very warm(but holdable) on the +5C setting... on the sc600 iv plus i tried to decrease 5C degrees, the PID kicks in after a few seconds but its very hard to hold the flashlight. That happens to everyone? Considering that the body reaches that temperature i am wondering the LED... 

Tks


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## WalkIntoTheLight (Apr 6, 2018)

ieslei said:


> Hi, guys! My sc600 mk4 plus just arrived, its very bright, bigger than my sc63w but its worth it IMHO!
> I think i am having a problem with it. On the highest the head gets very hot, impossible to hold. I afraid this amount heat can harm the LED... Its weird because i have sc63w and the head doesnt get that hot, only very warm(but holdable) on the +5C setting... on the sc600 iv plus i tried to decrease 5C degrees, the PID kicks in after a few seconds but its very hard to hold the flashlight. That happens to everyone? Considering that the body reaches that temperature i am wondering the LED...



It's normal for it to get pretty hot. If you say the PID is kicking in, then it's probably working properly. If the PID is doing its job, it should eventually drop down to about 600 lumens if you leave it tail-standing by itself. It's going to be about 50C-60C, which is hot. You should be able to touch it, but it will be uncomfortable.


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## ieslei (Apr 7, 2018)

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> It's normal for it to get pretty hot. If you say the PID is kicking in, then it's probably working properly. If the PID is doing its job, it should eventually drop down to about 600 lumens if you leave it tail-standing by itself. It's going to be about 50C-60C, which is hot. You should be able to touch it, but it will be uncomfortable.


I see... thank you! I will make a test with my brother's IR thermometer next week and try to change the PID settings to see if there is any difference and post it here... I just found it weird cuz my sc63w doesnt get that hot.

Thanks man.


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## easilyled (Apr 7, 2018)

ieslei said:


> I see... thank you! I will make a test with my brother's IR thermometer next week and try to change the PID settings to see if there is any difference and post it here... I just found it weird cuz my sc63w doesnt get that hot.
> 
> Thanks man.



Not that weird surely? The SC600w IV Plus outputs far more light than the sc63w at the highest level and therefore the heat build up would be expected to be far more and much quicker.


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## ieslei (Apr 7, 2018)

easilyled said:


> Not that weird surely? The SC600w IV Plus outputs far more light than the sc63w at the highest level and therefore the heat build up would be expected to be far more and much quicker.


But even considering that, the PID kicks in only when the pre determined (factory setting) temperature is reached, right? Comparing the point when PID kicks in on both flashlight i supose both "have" to be in the same temperature range.... but i can understand what you are saying, when the output is highers it produces more heat, even considering a bigger head(better dissipation)... the difference feeling on my hands is huge though....


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## easilyled (Apr 7, 2018)

ieslei said:


> But even considering that, the PID kicks in only when the pre determined (factory setting) temperature is reached, right? Comparing the point when PID kicks in on both flashlight i supose both "have" to be in the same temperature range.... but i can understand what you are saying, when the output is highers it produces more heat, even considering a bigger head(better dissipation)... the difference feeling on my hands is huge though....



I understand what you're saying too, but as good as the PID is, shedding heat in a comparatively small light like the SC600 is a mammoth task when it initially reaches an output of 2500 lumens. In order to satisfy the manufacturer's claims, the light has to reach 2500 lumens and then maintain an output of that range for at least a few seconds. Even when the PID kicks in, the heat build-up in those few seconds will be enormous. Small lights are simply not built to withstand such high ouptut levels but the manufacturers know that the users are in love with seeing these huge numbers. Its the same for my Emisar D4Ti which outputs even more lumens at the maximum level. It can't possibly sustain that amount for more than a miniscule amount of time and the output drops like a stone while shedding a huge amount of heat in the process.


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## Romanko (Apr 7, 2018)

ieslei said:


> On the highest the head gets very hot, impossible to hold. I afraid this amount heat can harm the LED... Its weird because i have sc63w and the head doesnt get that hot, only very warm(but holdable) on the +5C setting... on the sc600 iv plus i tried to decrease 5C degrees, the PID kicks in after a few seconds but its very hard to hold the flashlight. That happens to everyone? Considering that the body reaches that temperature i am wondering the LED...
> 
> Tks


Hi. How many minutes does it take before step down on H2 1311 Lm ? Does it heat on 1311 lm?


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## holygeez03 (Apr 10, 2018)

Took my Plus with me into the Grand Canyon a couple weeks ago... I didn't do any serious night hiking, but when I did use it after dark and early morning, it was a fantastic trail light... no "tunnel vision" from a pronounced hotspot and it lit up the distance and the ground right in front of me really well.

I used my trusty H52Fw a LOT inside the cabin, but occasionally I used the Plus indoors on super low modes and it performed admirably there as well.


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## EricJames (Apr 13, 2018)

Was the highest output of the IV Plus always 2300 lumens?

I could have sworn it was a different value a few months ago. But when I ordered mine today I noticed the number rounded to 2300. Anybody have a clue?


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## holygeez03 (Apr 13, 2018)

The first post in this thread mentions 2460 lumens, but that was when it was very first announced... the ZL spreadsheet in an early post shows 2440 I believe... I feel like the website may have stated 2400 during the pre-order, but I could be wrong... If so, they must fee that 2300 is a more accurate measurement... it's all negligible anyway.


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## 18650 (Apr 13, 2018)

holygeez03 said:


> The first post in this thread mentions 2460 lumens, but that was when it was very first announced... the ZL spreadsheet in an early post shows 2440 I believe... I feel like the website may have stated 2400 during the pre-order, but I could be wrong... If so, they must fee that 2300 is a more accurate measurement... it's all negligible anyway.


 It's embarrassing for nearly half a year to pass since the release date with the runtime specs remaining blank on their web site.


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## brightnorm (Apr 29, 2018)

I have several recent Zebralights but I'm passing on this one because I prefer the "brighter" cool whites. I'm willing to sacrifice truer CRI for brightness. Call me troglodyte!

Brightnorm


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## Keitho (Apr 29, 2018)

18650 said:


> It's embarrassing for nearly half a year to pass since the release date with the runtime specs remaining blank on their web site.



I agree. It feels like ZL might have had some turnover in a couple of positions, and some tasks that used to get done are just not being done anymore. It is too bad.


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## WalkIntoTheLight (May 21, 2018)

Okay, so I broke down and ordered a SC600w MkIV Plus. It should make a good compliment to my MkIV HI.

Anyway, I was looking at the specs, and it claims 2300 lumens. Assuming that is accurate (is it?), is that over-driving the LED? From the specsheet of the XHP50.2, it seems like the max output is about 1800 LED lumens at a current of 1.5A or 3A (depending on whether you use it 12v or 6v).

I thought Zebralight never over-drives their lights. Is this the first one to do that? Or am I wrong about it over-driving?

I'm used to over-driving in budget lights, so I'm not too concerned. But this appears to be a departure for Zebralight. Factoring in some loss in the lens and reflector, this is probably around 50% brighter than the 50.2 has for its spec.

I must be missing something....


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## twistedraven (May 21, 2018)

50.2 can put out way more lumens than that. It's not being driven that, that hard.


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## WalkIntoTheLight (May 21, 2018)

twistedraven said:


> 50.2 can put out way more lumens than that. It's not being driven that, that hard.



I must be reading the 50.2 Cree specs wrong. They list a J2 bin (the highest for a 80 CRI emitter) at 700mA (12v) produces 1040-1151 lumens (depending on junction temp). If you look at the output graph, it tops out at 1500mA (Cree lists this as maximum current) where the LED puts out 180% of nominal. That is, 1872-2072 lumens.

Okay, my rough guess was a bit wrong before, but that's still less than the 2300 lumens Zebralight claims, and it doesn't take into account lens and reflector losses.

I have no doubt that the 50.2 can be pushed a lot higher, but that appears to be over-driving it out of spec.

Am I reading an out-of-date specsheet? Is the bin Zebralight is using higher than the J2?


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## twistedraven (May 21, 2018)

No you're most likely reading it right, but Cree always rates their LEDs output real low.


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## WalkIntoTheLight (May 30, 2018)

I just received my SC600w MkIV Plus, and here are my initial reactions.

Very bright! I measure about 2700 lumens on max, right after turning it on with a fresh Sony VTC6 cell. This is higher than the 2300 lumens listed in the specs, so I'm rather surprised. I didn't measure it at 30 seconds, but perhaps it dims to 2300 lumens at that point? Has anyone done a proper output measurement of this light?

It gets hot on max quite quickly, and noticeably starts to decrease in output after about a minute. However, it didn't drop as much as I expected. I haven't measured what it stabilizes at, but it seems much brighter than what the SC600w MkIV HI stabilizes at. Good to know, because I intend to use it as a bicycle light on the H2b setting (which I measure at 730 lumens), and it should be well regulated considering the breeze it will get.

The outputs I measure on other modes are closer to spec: H1 is 2700, H2a is 1200, H2b is 730, H2c is 290, M1 is 150, M2a is 75.

CCT is 4400K. I might measure this slightly warmer than reality, but for reference I measure it 200K cooler than my SC600w MkIV HI. It's a decent neutral tint.

Beam is fine for real-world use, but it's not very pretty for white-wall hunters. Traditional domed Cree emitter look: white hot-spot, yellowish/greenish corona, and cool/purplish spill. By contrast, the SC600w MkIV HI has a fantastic even tint. I don't think the uneven tint will be an issue for outdoor use, as it's pretty common in all Cree emitters except for the HI variant. It's not bad, it's just not a Nichia 219 kind of beam.

It's about as floody as I expected. A bit more floody than traditional Zebralights (SC62/64, SC52/53, etc). Which is good, since I wanted a floody light with good regulation and efficiency to use as a bicycle light. I'm tired of replacing the battery every hour on my current light because it has dimmed too much (BLF A6).

When it's dark, I'll give it a good workout. Damn these long summer days!

Oh, for shipping time to Canada via EMS, it took 8 days to arrive. Zebralight took a couple of days after ordering before shipping, so I think it was 10 or 11 days total. No duty, taxes, or brokerage fees; same as every other light I've bought directly from Zebralight.


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## NPL (Aug 25, 2018)

Are people still happy with their sc600w plus? For high CRI lovers, does the light leave you longing for better CRI?


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## WalkIntoTheLight (Aug 25, 2018)

NPL said:


> Are people still happy with their sc600w plus? For high CRI lovers, does the light leave you longing for better CRI?



I'm still very happy with mine. I use it several times a week, as a bike light. High CRI really isn't my concern as a bike light; output and efficiency are what I'm after. It exceeds at that.

I don't think the tint is bad, but just about anything less than 90 CRI is going to bother people demanding Nichia 219 tints.


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## NPL (Aug 25, 2018)

Thanks WalkIntoTheLight.

I am very tempted by an Emisar D4S and the Zebralight SC600W Plus seems like a great contender with better efficiency. They are both very different lights, but if I am not mistaken, the XHP50 die is about the same size as 4 XP-L Hi/219C.


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## GadgetGeek (Aug 26, 2018)

Hi all. Been out of the loop for a while but received an SC600w IV Plus today. Very happy with it so far. 

Can anyone recommend a holster/case for it? Thanks


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## Lou Minescence (Aug 26, 2018)

GadgetGeek said:


> Hi all. Been out of the loop for a while but received an SC600w IV Plus today. Very happy with it so far.
> 
> Can anyone recommend a holster/case for it? Thanks



What are you doing posting at 2:40 AM ? did your SC600w keep you awake ? 

I am using the Jetbeam Mini holster for my SC600.


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## GadgetGeek (Aug 26, 2018)

Lou Minescence said:


> What are you doing posting at 2:40 AM ? did your SC600w keep you awake ?
> 
> I am using the Jetbeam Mini holster for my SC600.



I'm a night owl. Thanks for the suggestion. I have a start now.


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## Q732 (Aug 26, 2018)

GadgetGeek said:


> Hi all. Been out of the loop for a while but received an SC600w IV Plus today. Very happy with it so far.
> 
> Can anyone recommend a holster/case for it? Thanks



I use a Raine horizontal knife sheath for mine. Model # is 004H. It fits perfect in that. Pretty much forget you are even carrying it.


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## GadgetGeek (Aug 26, 2018)

Q732 said:


> I use a Raine horizontal knife sheath for mine. Model # is 004H. It fits perfect in that. Pretty much forget you are even carrying it.



Thanks. Will check it out as well.


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## Hondo (Aug 26, 2018)

Check out what this guy can make you:

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?449018-HDS-Systems-EDC-Holsters-1

He can fit any light, knife, gun, phone.... you get the idea. Mine's plain black, but if multi-color with a skull with glowing tritium eyes is your thing, he is your man.


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## markr6 (Aug 27, 2018)

One of life's biggest mysteries is, _why did I just now order one of these? _Seriously! I guess the 600 HI was plenty and didn't seem like a "thrower-only" kind of light. But, I need another Zebralight and this is it!

I paid $4 for the priority so I get it before the long weekend. And I added a fresh 18650GA cell since the others I have were crushed by my mk III Zebralights


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## WalkIntoTheLight (Aug 28, 2018)

markr6 said:


> One of life's biggest mysteries is, _why did I just now order one of these? _Seriously! I guess the 600 HI was plenty and didn't seem like a "thrower-only" kind of light. But, I need another Zebralight and this is it!



It's a great complimentary light to the 600w HI. Very different lights, and the Plus definitely gives you a nice "wall" of light for moderate distances. The HI is much better at longer distances. I suppose you could always just use a diffuser on the HI for a similar effect, but where's the fun in that?


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## Mr. LED (Aug 28, 2018)

Is the HI that much throwier than the Plus or the regular SC600 IV? I’m thinking about getting one.


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## WalkIntoTheLight (Aug 28, 2018)

Mr. LED said:


> Is the HI that much throwier than the Plus or the regular SC600 IV? I’m thinking about getting one.



Yes.


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## Mr. LED (Aug 28, 2018)

Just ordered one


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## WalkIntoTheLight (Aug 28, 2018)

I think you'll be happy with the HI. IMO, the best part is the almost perfect tint. Don't expect it to throw like a C8, but it is a very good general-purpose outdoor light because it has useful throw without a tunnel effect.

By the specs, the Plus looks like it has some reasonable throw due to its sheer brightness. But in practice, I find it very poor for seeing in the distance. That is because the bright flood up close completely ruins any night vision, so everything further away than about 50 meters looks pretty dark. It might actually be lit up okay, but you can't see it due to all the light in the foreground.

The HI avoids that effect, while still giving a big enough hot spot to light up a lot of the scene in the distance. But for further than 100-200 meters, you'll probably want a dedicated thrower.


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## markr6 (Aug 28, 2018)

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> I think you'll be happy with the HI. IMO, the best part is the almost perfect tint. Don't expect it to throw like a C8, but it is a very good general-purpose outdoor light because it has useful throw without a tunnel effect.
> 
> By the specs, the Plus looks like it has some reasonable throw due to its sheer brightness. But in practice, I find it very poor for seeing in the distance. That is because the bright flood up close completely ruins any night vision, so everything further away than about 50 meters looks pretty dark. It might actually be lit up okay, but you can't see it due to all the light in the foreground.
> 
> The HI avoids that effect, while still giving a big enough hot spot to light up a lot of the scene in the distance. But for further than 100-200 meters, you'll probably want a dedicated thrower.



You said it all perfect. The HI really punches thru spots in the woods; I usually take it with me backpacking.


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## Mr. LED (Aug 29, 2018)

I was in the woods the other day with my SC64w and I just didn’t feel confident lighting anything beyond 40 meters, it was just too floody. It’s my EDC light and perfect for other tasks. I had my C8+ with me to light up distant things when needed. I need something in the middle of both, not too floody, not too throwy. Thanks guys!


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## Cobraman502 (Aug 29, 2018)

Mr. LED said:


> I was in the woods the other day with my SC64w and I just didn’t feel confident lighting anything beyond 40 meters, it was just too floody. It’s my EDC light and perfect for other tasks. I had my C8+ with me to light up distant things when needed. I need something in the middle of both, not too floody, not too throwy. Thanks guys!



Olight M2T is very nice.


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## CreeCrazy (Aug 29, 2018)

markr6 said:


> One of life's biggest mysteries is, _why did I just now order one of these? _Seriously! I guess the 600 HI was plenty and didn't seem like a "thrower-only" kind of light. But, I need another Zebralight and this is it!
> 
> I paid $4 for the priority so I get it before the long weekend. And I added a fresh 18650GA cell since the others I have were crushed by my mk III Zebralights



The 600 HI MK III was my favorite production light for a long time until I got the Plus. Now I can’t decide which one I like better so they both stay in my backpack and go wherever I go. I went camping last weekend and actually used both. I started out with the Plus most of the night but we have a high coyote population in close proximity so I switched over to the HI for a little more reach through the woods and more peace of mind.


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## markr6 (Aug 31, 2018)

markr6 said:


> ...I paid $4 for the priority so I get it before the long weekend...



So much for that. They decided to sit on it for 2 days in Texas, and now 2 more days in Georgia. I doubt I'll even get it Saturday (4 days), so that means Tuesday because of Labor Day. What a joke.


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## WalkIntoTheLight (Aug 31, 2018)

markr6 said:


> So much for that. They decided to sit on it for 2 days in Texas, and now 2 more days in Georgia. I doubt I'll even get it Saturday (4 days), so that means Tuesday because of Labor Day. What a joke.



Heh, when I order Zebras from China, they only take about a week. Sounds like yours takes just as long inside the same country!??


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## markr6 (Aug 31, 2018)

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Heh, when I order Zebras from China, they only take about a week. Sounds like yours takes just as long inside the same country!??



And it's every time with Zebralight. I don't know why...I don't think they're doing anything wrong. USPS just screws it up every time. Even when I sold one it got lost and came back a month later; until it did I thought the buyer was just trying to cheat me.

Update: I waded thru a massive sea of 1-star reviews for this GA facility on google. Here's one review that pretty much sets the stage for my light:

_...I ordered two things online through a third party on amazon. Two different products that shipped from two different states are going through this distribution center and have seemed to drop off the face of the earth... it has been a week since they were supposed to be delivered and both packages are still sitting somewhere in their distribution center...
_
That's just great.


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## Mr. LED (Aug 31, 2018)

My SC600w IV HI arrived today and I’m absolutely stunned. The hotspot is defined and throws better than I anticipated. My SC64w is pure flood in comparison. Will go out to test later tonight.


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## markr6 (Sep 3, 2018)

Good news, my SC600w IV Plus finally arrives, on a Sunday.

Bad news, the clip was not included and the tint is easily the second worst I've ever seen. The worst ever? One of the SC62w I ordered. It was completely yellow. This Plus is almost as bad. Right into the box it goes. No comparison needed. No eye adjustments necessary. Just pitiful.


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## Hugh Johnson (Sep 3, 2018)

NPL said:


> Thanks WalkIntoTheLight.
> 
> I am very tempted by an Emisar D4S and the Zebralight SC600W Plus seems like a great contender with better efficiency. They are both very different lights, but if I am not mistaken, the XHP50 die is about the same size as 4 XP-L Hi/219C.



XHP50 is the same size as four xp-g. 

XHP70 is four xp-l.


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## NPL (Sep 3, 2018)

Hugh Johnson said:


> XHP50 is the same size as four xp-g.
> 
> XHP70 is four xp-l.


Thanks!


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## Mr. LED (Sep 4, 2018)

markr6 said:


> Good news, my SC600w IV Plus finally arrives, on a Sunday.
> 
> Bad news, the clip was not included and the tint is easily the second worst I've ever seen. The worst ever? One of the SC62w I ordered. It was completely yellow. This Plus is almost as bad. Right into the box it goes. No comparison needed. No eye adjustments necessary. Just pitiful.



My SC600w IV HI that arrived last week was also missing the clip.

If you still have this SC62w with “bad” tint, I want to buy it!


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## ven (Sep 4, 2018)

markr6 said:


> Good news, my SC600w IV Plus finally arrives, on a Sunday.
> 
> Bad news, the clip was not included and the tint is easily the second worst I've ever seen. The worst ever? One of the SC62w I ordered. It was completely yellow. This Plus is almost as bad. Right into the box it goes. No comparison needed. No eye adjustments necessary. Just pitiful.




Sorry to hear, but not surprised . That’s still a reason why I have not got the IV plus , nor will I. There are a few exceptions , with a nice tint though. The III plus is very nice, 5000k and a nice tint! 1800lm of old or 2300lm of new, I honestly don’t care and for my uses unimportant anyway. Only draw back for me, is not having the fine tuning ability of the latest driver, but I can easily cope with that, a bad tint I can’t!


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## WalkIntoTheLight (Sep 4, 2018)

My 600w MkIV Plus tint is pretty good. Well, at least for what I was expecting. The domed Cree emitters always have a yellow/green cast in the corona, and a purplish spill. That's just the way it is.

But unless I'm white-wall testing the light, it's not at all noticeable.

Did you give the light a real-world test in the dark?

Here's my white-wall beam shot. Auto-exposure, auto white-balance:


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## ven (Sep 4, 2018)

That looks nice on your sample walkintothelight, in fact it looks quite close to my xhp50(no .2) on my mk III plus. Kind of a creamy side to the white, mine does have a little touch of yellow which is no problem for me.


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## JoeRodge (Sep 4, 2018)

I must of got lucky mine is just a touch of a Rosey pink.


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## markr6 (Sep 5, 2018)

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Did you give the light a real-world test in the dark?
> 
> Here's my white-wall beam shot. Auto-exposure, auto white-balance:



Yes, I'm to the point where I don't even need a white wall or anything. One click on and I know immediately. The floor, walls, anything of color...a nasty yellow tinge. With auto white balance, mine would looks good like yours, but in real life it's just nasty. Just put it in the mail


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## WalkIntoTheLight (Sep 5, 2018)

markr6 said:


> Yes, I'm to the point where I don't even need a white wall or anything. One click on and I know immediately. The floor, walls, anything of color...a nasty yellow tinge. With auto white balance, mine would looks good like yours, but in real life it's just nasty. Just put it in the mail



Have you considered that your corneas may be colored green?


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## markr6 (Sep 5, 2018)

I'm to the point where 90% of my lights are white, either slightly cool or warm is fine. But the green/yellow stuff doesn't stay.


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## likethevegetable (Oct 23, 2018)

Having a serious internal debate if I should wait for the SC700d or just get an SC600w IV Plus, or maybe the HI right now instead!

Obviously, the ideal answer in an ideal world is to get both, but my funds are limited. With a new cell or two, I'd be looking at 35-45 CAD and an 8 mm wider bezel extra for the SC700d, so it boils down to: is that extra 700 lumens and the allure of a light that uses the cell of the future worth it? 

My primary use case would be walks in the woods and a bike light that I would pocket after. This would be my first straight angle ZL. I currently use my BLF A6 for cycling, and although it's great, it does get pretty hot and it's just not a ZL. My GF is in need of a higher powered bike light so I would give it to her pending the upgrade.

It seems like ZL offers free shipping to Canada again.. is this correct?

If anyone here has an SC600w IV Plus and is considering an SC700d and would kindly share their 2¢, your opinions are appreciated.


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## ven (Oct 23, 2018)

Wait mr vegatable, seriously................See when a few arrive, maybe odd review, pics impressions etc. We all want lights yesterday , but sometimes(and imho ZL especially) waiting is worth doing. Once you see it side by side, you may think too big for intended use or ??? 

I will wait anyway and see, but i am behind the times. I have the mkIII HI and plus and very happy with both.


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## WalkIntoTheLight (Oct 23, 2018)

likethevegetable said:


> Having a serious internal debate if I should wait for the SC700d or just get an SC600w IV Plus, or maybe the HI right now instead!
> 
> Obviously, the ideal answer in an ideal world is to get both, but my funds are limited. With a new cell or two, I'd be looking at 35-45 CAD and an 8 mm wider bezel extra for the SC700d, so it boils down to: is that extra 700 lumens and the allure of a light that uses the cell of the future worth it?
> 
> My primary use case would be walks in the woods and a bike light that I would pocket after. This would be my first straight angle ZL. I currently use my BLF A6 for cycling, and although it's great, it does get pretty hot and it's just not a ZL. My GF is in need of a higher powered bike light so I would give it to her pending the upgrade.



Okay, so I used a BLF A6 for cycling last year, and this year I got the SC600w MkIV Plus for cycling. IMO, it is a huge improvement. For your intended use (cycling and walks in woods), a floody light is more important than throw. So, I would definitely recommend the SC600 Plus over the SC600 HI. Though I love my HI, it is for walking in open areas where the throw and narrow beam is useful.

I can't tell you if the SC700d will be better or worse than the SC600w Plus. It will likely be similar, with more run time but a less-friendly pocket size. You'll have to decide which is more important to you.



> It seems like ZL offers free shipping to Canada again.. is this correct?



I've ordered a couple of Zebras to Canada this year, and even though it says free shipping, it's not. You can only ship with EMS or DHL. Go with EMS. It's $15, but you get the light in a little over a week. Well, assuming Canada Post isn't on strike.


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## likethevegetable (Oct 23, 2018)

Thanks for the input folks. 

Ven, you make a great point: side-by-side comparisons are the most valuable. I don't even need the light as cycling season is over, ZLs are just so damn compelling!

WITL, I'm definitely partial to floody. I was hoping for something that would easily outshine my H600Fc and BLF-A6 and offer a beam in between the two as I think that would be ideal for biking.


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## markr6 (Oct 23, 2018)

likethevegetable said:


> I was hoping for something that would easily outshine my H600Fc and BLF-A6 and offer a beam in between the two as I think that would be ideal for biking.



Just a guess, but would the SC600 IV satisfy this? I purchased one in both NW and CW, and the beam was plain vanilla...not throwy or floody. A little of both. I eventually sold them, but only because I went with the HI.


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## likethevegetable (Oct 23, 2018)

The kid wants > 2000 lm. 

Haha.


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## WalkIntoTheLight (Oct 23, 2018)

likethevegetable said:


> WITL, I'm definitely partial to floody. I was hoping for something that would easily outshine my H600Fc and BLF-A6 and offer a beam in between the two as I think that would be ideal for biking.



The SC600w Plus is more floody than the BLF A6. It's not much more, but enough that it gives good visibility to the sides of a path when cycling. I usually use it at the 700 lumen setting, which gives me almost 3 hours run-time from a Sanyo GA cell. And, unlike the BLF A6, the Zebralight is regulated, so I get a constant 700 lumens the entire time. The biggest problem I had with the BLF A6 was that by the time the battery is only half-drained, its output was getting too low for good visibility when cycling. Regulated output, good run-time, and a bit more flood is why I chose the Zebralight.

That won't help you decide between the 600w Plus and the 700d. Especially since Zebralight hasn't published the hot spot angles of the new light. The Plus is listed as a 14 degree hot spot. I suspect the 700d will be about the same, but we don't know that yet.


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## likethevegetable (Oct 25, 2018)

Two questions: 

Would anyone be able to measure the length of the head part of the flashlight? (I'm drawing something so I can roughly compare the size of this and the SC700d).

Are higher discharge cells recommended (15 A, ex. 30Q, VTC6), or would I be fine with my 10A NCR18650GA? My H600Fc IV trips on H1 when the cell is 3.8ish V or lower.

Thank you!


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## WalkIntoTheLight (Oct 25, 2018)

likethevegetable said:


> Two questions:
> 
> Would anyone be able to measure the length of the head part of the flashlight? (I'm drawing something so I can roughly compare the size of this and the SC700d).



The head length is 30mm.



> Are higher discharge cells recommended (15 A, ex. 30Q, VTC6), or would I be fine with my 10A NCR18650GA? My H600Fc IV trips on H1 when the cell is 3.8ish V or lower.



It works fine on the Sanyo GA cell, down to around 3.0v. I get 17% longer run-time (regulated modes) with a GA cell, compared to the Sony VTC6. Even longer compared to a 30Q. However, I suspect it's closer if you run the light on max a lot. Not that you can do that, because on max it will get too hot, except perhaps outside in winter.


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## likethevegetable (Nov 17, 2018)

Ended up ordering one of these pups from NKON (fantastic suppliers, fully recommended) and it shipped Nov. 1.. historically my orders from them have arrived in under three weeks, but with this Canada Post strike, who knows how long I'll wait!  

I hope no other Canadians are impacted by this! My previous orders from ZL direct through EMS all went through Canada Post, and I've read that CP asked China to stop sending mail for the time being.


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## WalkIntoTheLight (Nov 17, 2018)

Heh, I have a SC64w HI on order. Every day, I just get this same new update from Canada Post's tracking site: "Delivery may be delayed due to labour disruption."

Well, at least it's in the country... somewhere.


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## likethevegetable (Nov 19, 2018)

What a pleasant surprise, Canada Post pulled through with a delivery! Luckily I had the day off to open the box right away. 

I tried to resize the images on the editor here but had no luck...

Here are my first impressions:










*

Why I got it:
*
Before I purchased this, I printed out some closely-scaled pictures and outlines of the SC64, SC600, and to-be-released SC700, and felt that the SC700 head was gonna be too big at 8 mm wider. I believe my choice will offer the best balance between runtime on high outputs, comfort/feel in hand, and pocket ability. Pretty pumped about it, this is my first SC Zebra and should make for an excellent companion while walking and cycling in the woods.

*What I'm excited about:
*
-Blazing 2300 lumens out of a tiny little light, and the thermal regulation is awesome. This is definitely brighter than my BLF A6 and H600Fc IV, but I expected it to be brighter than it appears side-by-side (even considering logarithmic perception of brightness). When it comes to sustaining brightness, this light destroys my others.

-Beam profile is awesome. I love the powerful spill with a solid punch in the middle. Perfect blend for general use IMO.

-Love the size and feel in hand, it is much much smaller than I expected (everyone says that about the SC600s). Even with the printout I made, I was still shocked at the size, especially the length. The knurling is nice and grippy without feeling rough. I can’t imagine how tiny the SC64’s are for an 18650 light.

-Love the aesthetic. Reminds me of a traditional flashlight more so than the SC64 (which was somewhat a superficial factor in my choice). It feels like I'm holding a little photon-cannon.

-Nice CCT and overall tint. My c ZL's are very nice for camping, but often feel dimmer compared to neutral and cooler lights. I feel that my BLF-A6 3D at 5000k is a bit cool for my liking, and this CCT is a great in-between. It seems warm for a neutral white with no hint of being cool. I asked the seller to compare 3 lights and pick the best.

-When using the light outdoors, even on snow the tint shift is negligible.


*Ambivalent About:
*
-Tint-shift is noticeable indoors with a pretty muddy corona.

-The CRI is no slouch but not quite as nice as my c ZL's. This trade-off is worth it for those extra lumens for me in a light like this.

-The anodizing is overall clean and nice, despite a few minor blemishes. The colour is not as dark my H53c and H600Fc, but will probably darken a bit as it collects oil from my hands.

*Wishes:
*
-Wish for a lower moonlight. 0.2 lumens ain't bad, but I love my 0.01 lm on my H53Fc. Not terribly inconvenient for my main uses with this light though.

-The main reason I wanted the SC700d in the first place was that it uses the hottest new cell. It would've been awesome for me if ZL kept the head of the SC600 and extended the body to fit a 2170. Oh well. Maybe in a year or two my next ZL will be their eventual SC700x HI - it could make for a sweet thrower.

I made a lanyard out of shock cord and a toggle for backup retainment when using as a bike light, and bought two holsters from AliExpress to try.








*Mode spacing: *for everyday use, I like to take advantage of the full range (0.2, 5, 33, 171, 705, 2300). For cycling, I like using the middle modes (1.8, 55, 171, 358, 705, 1311).


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## Derek Dean (Nov 20, 2018)

Nice quick review of your new light, and I agree with your conclusions, it's probably one of the best balances between size, runtime, and brightness, but like you, I only wish that the moonlight mode went lower than .2 lumens....... as it would then be nearly perfect. 

I've been using my SC600w IV+ nightly on my job since it came out last year. I hope you enjoy yours as much as I've enjoyed mine.


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## WalkIntoTheLight (Nov 20, 2018)

Yes, this is a great light. I use mine exclusively as a bike light, because of its wide beam and great efficiency. Which is a pity, since it would make a good light for other uses, especially now that the nights are so long. Too lazy to take it out of the bike holder, I suppose.


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## wimmer21 (Nov 20, 2018)

Question for Zebralight owners: Can you reach the highest level with one click... or is the brightest level considered turbo, requiring a double click?


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## Hondo (Nov 20, 2018)

likethevegetable said:


> I tried to resize the images on the editor here but had no luck...




Not sure, but sounds like you might have tried to size the photos on the forum editor. If so, I wanted to point out that you need to do it on the host (IMGUR or whatever you use). Edit size, save, and I usually delete the original larger copy. Then grab the link and post here.

Regardless, that is an awesome light and I'm glad you like it. I have never replaced my original SC600w, but actually find myself using the SC60w most. I got an SC62w, but besides going a tad lower and having a tad higher high, it does not do anything the SC60w can't.


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## WalkIntoTheLight (Nov 20, 2018)

wimmer21 said:


> Question for Zebralight owners: Can you reach the highest level with one click... or is the brightest level considered turbo, requiring a double click?



Yes, all Zebralights have single-click to max. (Or a different high mode, if you set it up that way.)

The newer Zebralights (anything in the past year or so) have fully programmable levels. So, you can set up any mode you want to be single-click. For example, you might want a moonlight mode to be your single-click function, which some people prefer. In that case, they may choose a long-click to be max, or a double-click.

I have made different programming groups for indoor use and outdoor use. Indoors, I prefer lower output levels. Outdoors, I prefer a wider range of levels, and from each of those levels I have set to be double-click to max so I have that ready fast if I want it.


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## wimmer21 (Nov 20, 2018)

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Yes, all Zebralights have single-click to max. (Or a different high mode, if you set it up that way.)
> 
> The newer Zebralights (anything in the past year or so) have fully programmable levels. So, you can set up any mode you want to be single-click. For example, you might want a moonlight mode to be your single-click function, which some people prefer. In that case, they may choose a long-click to be max, or a double-click.
> 
> I have made different programming groups for indoor use and outdoor use. Indoors, I prefer lower output levels. Outdoors, I prefer a wider range of levels, and from each of those levels I have set to be double-click to max so I have that ready fast if I want it.



Great info... exactly what I needed to know. Thank you, sir!


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## Rockjunkie15 (Nov 23, 2018)

I picked up one of these Zebralight SC600w IV + to replace my beat to death E14 EDC and now that I’ve drank the koolaid I can see what all the fuss is about. I have previously owned the battery denting xhp35 HI version but it was just blah, but this xhp50.2 version has a fantastic beam pattern and wonderful tint for my edc needs. 

Here’s a beam shot from last nights walk, nice smooth beam.

https://i.postimg.cc/prnVmfZg/29-C66-D36-D653-46-FA-9484-674066-E4191-C.jpg

https://i.postimg.cc/RFYVCsc7/40282-BEF-EA95-4276-AEEB-76-E69-AD037-A5.jpg


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## likethevegetable (Nov 23, 2018)

Nice pics! I really enjoy the wide and powerful spill. I'm definitely a floody -biased guy.

Just curious, what about the HI was blah to you (besides battery denting)? Seems like if you're after some throw it is an excellent choice.


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## T4R06 (Dec 18, 2018)

looks like a hot item. im lucky i got the last one over amazon. cant wait to get mine in a couple of days.


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## NPL (Jan 11, 2019)

Just got one of these and overall very impressed. Much better and more useful beam pattern for close to mid range compared to my sc600w HI.
The two will complement each other very well.


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## likethevegetable (Jan 11, 2019)

How's the tint on your sample, NPL?

I'm aware that the HI is generally nicer, but in actual use and not on a white wall, do you notice a difference between the HI and Plus?

P.S. I love the beam shape of the Plus, combined with 2,300 lumens it produces an impressive wall of light.


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## NPL (Jan 11, 2019)

Tint on mine sounds consistent with other reports. A touch yellow, with tint shift around the Corona. Indoors on a white wall its noticeable, but it's functionality and usefulness supercedes that in actual use. Outdoors or on objects not noticeable. Might slap a minus green filter and see if it makes it a little rosier. Hi is clinically clean in comparison.


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## holygeez03 (Jan 11, 2019)

When used outdoors the tint of this light is completely acceptable considering the size/output ratio... EXCEPT for the very, very outer ring that is completely purple.... we're about to get snow here and it's going to be even more noticeable to me on the white ground.

I'm pretty sure the purple ring is from light reflecting off the super shiny stainless bezel and then getting tinted from the AR coating... I'm going to try to paint the bezel matte black or cover it with black tape to see if it goes away.


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## Alex64 (Jan 20, 2019)

I received mine a few days ago and for the moment I'm enjoying it a lot. The only thing is the button has a bit dead travel compared to the H600. It's normal in this model?


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## likethevegetable (Jan 20, 2019)

Alex64 said:


> I received mine a few days ago and for the moment I'm enjoying it a lot. The only thing is the button has a bit dead travel compared to the H600. It's normal in this model?



All 4 of ZLs switches have a very similar feel, they immediately click on or off with no discernible travel time. A very "digital" feeling. 

Some of mine are more clicky than the others, for ex. my H53Fc feels the most clicky and loudest, with my SC600w IV Plus being the softest and quietest.

By travel do you mean a bit of squishiness before the click is engaged?

I must admit, the thing I'm most insecure about with my ZLs are the switches. I don't like the idea of constant friction (especially from winter gloves) or a fingernail digging on the rubber. I obviously don't drive my nail in the switch and tell my GF not to when she uses it. Two of mine also leak light, but that allegedly is not an issue for durability, but lack of dye in the boot. I've only seen one failure on the internet though. I wonder what the challenges are in using a metal switch? Perhaps waterproofing?


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## Alex64 (Jan 20, 2019)

likethevegetable said:


> By travel do you mean a bit of squishiness before the click is engaged?
> 
> I must admit, the thing I'm most insecure about with my ZLs are the switches. I don't like the idea of constant friction (especially from winter gloves) or a fingernail digging on the rubber. I obviously don't drive my nail in the switch and tell my GF not to when she uses it. Two of mine also leak light, but that allegedly is not an issue for durability, but lack of dye in the boot. I've only seen one failure on the internet though. I wonder what the challenges are in using a metal switch? Perhaps waterproofing?


Hi, with my H600 MK II when press the rubber immediately touches pushes the switch. With the SC600 Plus you have to push the rubber 1 mm until it starts to touch the switch, which makes the touch a bit worse.


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## Fireclaw18 (Jan 21, 2019)

Alex64 said:


> Hi, with my H600 MK II when press the rubber immediately touches pushes the switch. With the SC600 Plus you have to push the rubber 1 mm until it starts to touch the switch, which makes the touch a bit worse.



When Zebralight switched from the big switches (SC51) to the small recessed switch (starting the original SC600), they used a switch that required a firm press and didn't feel squishy at all.

Unfortunately, those nice firm switches stopped being available. Zebralight had to switch suppliers. The newer switches (found in all models from the last few years) are slightly squishier.


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## JoeRodge (Jan 22, 2019)

Half of my emitter just went dark and is slightly lit with a fuzzy light. It's a month and 3 days outside of its 1 year warranty. It's eaten batteries on getting slightest of drops. I have made so many excuses for this light. I love everything about it except a few flaws. This kills me....


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## Cpl S (Jan 23, 2019)

It's unfortunate that you received one of very few duds from Zebralight. Dont lose faith in the brand. 

Have you emailed them to see what they can do?


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## JoeRodge (Jan 25, 2019)

They are having me send it in. 6-8 week turn around but it's worth it. I'm pretty excited.


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## CC268 (Jan 30, 2019)

What is the recommended battery for the Plus? 30Q or VTC6?


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## ven (Jan 30, 2019)

Either is fine, also vtc5 and vtc5a are other options. I tend to use both, 30Q and vtc6 in my plus and HI. As long as flat top, your good to go.


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## WalkIntoTheLight (Jan 30, 2019)

I use both the 30Q and VTC6 in the 600w IV+, both work great. I also use the Sanyo GA, which gives a bit more run time on most levels. If you run on full output a lot (which you probably won't due to heat), then the GA likely doesn't give any benefit.

Basically, use any cell with a 10A or better discharge rating, and you're good to go.


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## pappajohan (Feb 2, 2019)

Got my light the other day and I don't know.

Having a hard time to decide if I like it or not.
The light output compared to my SC64 or Olight S2R2 doesn't convince me to choose this over any of the other two. 

Think it's more like a output vs pocket bulk kind of debate.
Also, I really have a hard time with this kind of warn light, I prefer cooler tints apparently.


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## Rockjunkie15 (Feb 2, 2019)

pappajohan said:


> Got my light the other day and I don't know.
> 
> Having a hard time to decide if I like it or not.
> The light output compared to my SC64 or Olight S2R2 doesn't convince me to choose this over any of the other two.
> ...



I really like this light but the main draw for me is the nice warm tint and Great cri. If your a cooler tint guy this is probably not the light for you. You should play with it for awhile and if you really don’t like it you can certainly sell it on the forums.


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## xevious (Feb 2, 2019)

pappajohan said:


> Got my light the other day and I don't know.
> 
> Having a hard time to decide if I like it or not.
> The light output compared to my SC64 or Olight S2R2 doesn't convince me to choose this over any of the other two.
> ...


Take your time in evaluating it. While direct beam comparisons on a white wall can "color" expectations, what it comes down to is the usability of the beam. Also, remember that the Zebralight is in a very different class than an Olight. It's made in a much more rugged fashion. Real Gorilla glass lens. Tough anodizing on the body. Potted electronics. I find Olight bodies tend to scratch easily.


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## pappajohan (Feb 2, 2019)

xevious said:


> Take your time in evaluating it. While direct beam comparisons on a white wall can "color" expectations, what it comes down to is the usability of the beam. Also, remember that the Zebralight is in a very different class than an Olight. It's made in a much more rugged fashion. Real Gorilla glass lens. Tough anodizing on the body. Potted electronics. I find Olight bodies tend to scratch easily.


I know. 

Just returned from parking my car in the garage and the lights went out. 

It became very obvious that the ZL is a more versatile and potent light.[emoji16]


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## NPL (Feb 2, 2019)

pappajohan said:


> Got my light the other day and I don't know.
> 
> Having a hard time to decide if I like it or not.
> The light output compared to my SC64 or Olight S2R2 doesn't convince me to choose this over any of the other two.
> ...


Remember that the sc64 series is smaller and will drop in output much faster than the sc600 series. If you are using the light on high for more than a few minutes at a time, the sc600 will be a much better performer.


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## Hugh Johnson (Feb 5, 2019)

For the SC64, what can be expected for sustained thermal output on a cold day, maybe a little above freezing?


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## WalkIntoTheLight (Feb 5, 2019)

Hugh Johnson said:


> For the SC64, what can be expected for sustained thermal output on a cold day, maybe a little above freezing?



You mean on max? It's a couple of minutes at those kinds of temperatures. The light is really too small to shed all the heat, even in cool temps. But in colder conditions (below -10C for example), I have found that it will maintain max output much longer (maybe permanently?). Perhaps that's not unexpected.

I haven't tried the 600w Plus in cold conditions. It heats up pretty fast, so I wouldn't be surprised if it ramped down sooner than the SC64.


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## Hugh Johnson (Feb 5, 2019)

Yes, either on max, or a lower PID output. I was originally interested in either the SC64w or SC600 Mk 4 plus. Now, I’m looking most closely at the SC64c LE. 

My most frequent use for this light would be outside, hiking and walking, from 2-10C, 35-50F on higher output. 

For comparison, my TN12 can maintain turbo setting for longer than 10 minutes without problem and claimed 435 lumens indefinitely. However, that’s not similarly regulated and I’m using a protected Panny B, so there will be a significant drop.


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## likethevegetable (Feb 5, 2019)

Hugh Johnson said:


> Yes, either on max, or a lower PID output. I was originally interested in either the SC64w or SC600 Mk 4 plus. Now, I’m looking most closely at the SC64c LE.
> 
> My most frequent use for this light would be outside, hiking and walking, from 2-10C, 35-50F on higher output.
> 
> For comparison, my TN12 can maintain turbo setting for longer than 10 minutes without problem and claimed 435 lumens indefinitely. However, that’s not similarly regulated and I’m using a protected Panny B, so there will be a significant drop.



Do you value light-weightedness or feel in hand more? I think the SC64's are better suited for comfort in pocket as an EDC or if you wanna keep things as light as possible. When wearing gloves, the 600 I have seems too small to hold.

I don't own an SC64 variant (but I own similar sized lights) and find that the SC600w IV Plus I have is about as small as I like for feel in hand. The 600s will last much longer (about twice as much mass) than the 64's. I have an H600Fc which is about the same size as the 64s and it steps down in about 1 minute at around 1000 lumens, my SC600w Plus takes about 3-5 minutes at a similar output. 

You might also want to consider the HI, or Fc or Fd Plus, or even the 700d


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## WalkIntoTheLight (Feb 5, 2019)

Hugh Johnson said:


> Yes, either on max, or a lower PID output. I was originally interested in either the SC64w or SC600 Mk 4 plus. Now, I’m looking most closely at the SC64c LE.



On the lowest PID mode, about 500 lumens, it lasts pretty much indefinitely in cool weather, as far as I've seen. Should be no issue at all running it at that output, for your use. If you want, you can permanently increase the PID temperature threshold by 5 degrees, if you find it does eventually start to ramp down.

Even at warmer temperatures, gripping it more tightly in your hand will ramp it back up as the heat is drawn away from the light more efficiently than just the air.

But if you really want the highest output without PID kicking in, the 600w Plus is the best light for that. (Or the 700d.) The Plus will run at 700 lumens without ramping down quite easily, with a bit of breeze or cool air.


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## Hugh Johnson (Feb 6, 2019)

Thanks everyone for the input. I’d have specific uses for both the 64 and 600 but I’m only looking for 1. I’ll need to think about my priorities


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## WalkIntoTheLight (Feb 6, 2019)

Hugh Johnson said:


> Thanks everyone for the input. I’d have specific uses for both the 64 and 600 but I’m only looking for 1. I’ll need to think about my priorities



If you want just one, get the SC64w HI. You'll find more general-purpose use for it. Running on max output is not something you'll likely be doing a lot anyway, even if the light could do it without ramping down.


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## Tachead (Feb 6, 2019)

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> If you want just one, get the SC64w HI.


I second this and for new models I have owned the SC64w, SC64c, SC64w HI, SC600w MKIV Plus, and SC600w MKIV HI. I now only own the SC64w HI headlamps aside.


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## WalkIntoTheLight (Feb 6, 2019)

In order of Zebralight I'd get (and have got), not including headlamps:

SC64w HI
SC600w IV HI
SC600w IV Plus (or SC700d)
SC53w
SC5w II

Although I list the SC5w as last, it's one of my most-used lights. However, now it's strictly used for a bedside light, which it is great at due to its really stable tail-standing. I love it's 500 lumen output on a AA cell, but it's a little thick for comfortable pocket carry. The SC53 is the smallest for pocket-carry. But the SC64 HI is the best all-'round light.


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## Hugh Johnson (Feb 6, 2019)

With the Hi I’m concerned about too much focus. I tend to like floodier lights. Not sure how it compares to my current lights.


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## WalkIntoTheLight (Feb 6, 2019)

Hugh Johnson said:


> With the Hi I’m concerned about too much focus. I tend to like floodier lights. Not sure how it compares to my current lights.



Yeah, the SC600w HI is really only good outdoors if you want a bit of throw. It's great for that, though.

The SC64w HI isn't really very focused. Its reflector is small, so it's not much more focused than the regular SC64. You probably couldn't tell the difference side-by-side unless you are really looking for it. The main benefit of the HI is the nice, even tint.


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## Tachead (Feb 6, 2019)

I wouldn't say you wouldn't notice the difference. The hotspot on the HI is definitely a bit smaller and more focused. But, it is still quite floody and works well in an all around EDC role imo. Actually, I find the slightly more intense hotspot more useful overall. And yes, I agree the lower tint shift across the beam, comparatively, is definitely an upgrade over the XHP35 HD used in the regular SC64's. 

Personally, I prefer the SC64w HI over the SC64w. But, beam preference, as with most flashlight characteristics, is quite subjective. Hugh, maybe you could let us know a couple of lights you have that have the beam profile you prefer? It's possible one of us has/had the same light and can compare. It is too bad that I already sold my SC64w or I would post a comparative beamshots for you.


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## Hugh Johnson (Feb 7, 2019)

I love the profile of my Thrunite TN12 (the tint not so much). Smooth transition to spill. I also like the Q8 - more defined hotspot but it’s a nice ratio.


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## NPL (Feb 10, 2019)

Just installed a Lee Zircon 802 filter on top of my sc600w plus. The difference is phenomenal. Went from a yellow green tint to super neutral. Probably increased R9 value as well. Very impressed and recommend it to other owners.


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## xevious (Feb 10, 2019)

NPL said:


> Just installed a Lee Zircon 802 filter on top of my sc600w plus. The difference is phenomenal. Went from a yellow green tint to super neutral. Probably increased R9 value as well. Very impressed and recommend it to other owners.


Where did you pick yours up? There are a number of sources on-line, but all the ones I've seen so far are quite pricey, for just a small amount of filter.


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## NPL (Feb 10, 2019)

BH photo. Was around 8$ for a large sheet.


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## WalkIntoTheLight (Feb 10, 2019)

NPL said:


> BH photo. Was around 8$ for a large sheet.



Nice, but according to B&H you lose 25% of the light output. I'd really have to hate the tint to lose that much output.


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## NPL (Feb 10, 2019)

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Nice, but according to B&H you lose 25% of the light output. I'd really have to hate the tint to lose that much output.


In a side by side comparison, you notice a very small output drop. To me the tint improvement is far better than the loss in output, but I agree with you. If you don't mind the stock tint, why compromise in output.


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## NPL (Feb 10, 2019)

The Lee Zircon 804 minus green seems to be the most popular, and that one reduces light output by 15%, which I believe is perceived more closely to 7.5% decrease to the humain brain.


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## AndyS (Mar 14, 2019)

Mine has recently started flashing at about 2 Hz - 4 Hz on what should be H1. I have not purposely changed from the default settings, but I thought I may have accidentally done some other number of clicks when I meant to do a quadruple click to check the battery level. I seldom turn it on high.

I can double click down to H2, and that's on solid, but of course not as bright.

I've tried five clicks to make sure I'm in G5.
I've tried fifteen clicks to reset G5 to default.
The cell is fully charged. It's an unprotected red one I bought from Zebralight with the flashlight "NCR18650GA Panasonic/Sanyo."
I've carried this daily since late December 2017. I doubt I've had to charge the cell even a dozen times.

Anything I could be missing?


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## Derek Dean (Mar 14, 2019)

Andy, have you tried cleaning all the electrical contact points? it seems that with these higher power lights it's even more important to keep the electrical pathway clean. Besides the obvious points where the light has direct contact with the battery, be sure and clean the end of the battery tube and where it makes contact down inside the tailcap. 

A Q-tip with a bit of electrical contact cleaner on it is best, but putting rubbing alcohol on the Q-tip will do in a pinch, and don't forget to clean both ends of the battery as well.


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## Fireclaw18 (Mar 14, 2019)

Does H1 work at full power in G6 and G7? or does it not work in all mode groups.

If it works in one mode group, but not the others you might want to check your mode programming. Or maybe you just have a bad driver.

If you aren't getting max output in any mode group, the problem could be your battery or it could be a bad ground connection.  Try cleaning the contacts at both ends of the battery compartment and the back edge of the tube where it meets the tailcap. I use Deoxit Gold. If that doesn't fix it maybe try a different battery, preferably a high-current draw one from a reputable seller. 

If neither of those fix the problem you may have a bad ground connection between the driver and the body of the light. Best way to fix it is to send the light to Zebralight for repair.


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## AndyS (Mar 15, 2019)

Thanks both of you. I had a second identical cell, never used, so I charged it last night and put it in this morning. Same problem. I then clicked six times to get into G6. It still blinks on H1.

I timed the blinking, it's right around 4 Hz. I'll try some contact cleaner next.


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## AndyS (Mar 15, 2019)

No dice. Everything looks really clean, too.


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## WalkIntoTheLight (Mar 15, 2019)

AndyS said:


> I timed the blinking, it's right around 4 Hz. I'll try some contact cleaner next.



That's one of the strobe modes. Something sounds screwed up with the driver.


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## NPL (Mar 15, 2019)

Have you tried reprogramming H1?


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## AndyS (Mar 15, 2019)

I tried last night, but I'll try again tonight. My colleagues are starting to notice the bright flashes under my desk.


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## holygeez03 (Mar 15, 2019)

Hold your hand over it?


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## WalkIntoTheLight (Mar 15, 2019)

Try resetting everything to default:

15 quick clicks (G5)
18 quick clicks (G6)
21 quick clicks (G7)

Put the light into H1, then turn off. Click to turn on again in H1. Press and hold until the light cycles through low-medium-high at least 6 times, then let go of the button when the light cycles to medium. (This resets thermal PID, which shouldn't matter, but it's worth a long-shot.)

I'm not aware of any other tricks to return to defaults. So, after that, if you still can't get H1 to work properly, you'll have to return the light for repair. Or perhaps send Zebralight a message to see if they have any other tricks.


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## AndyS (Mar 16, 2019)

Thanks. Tried all of the above, and 5 clicks to ensure in G5, still blinks at 4 Hz. I'll contact Zebralight. It's over 12 months, but maybe they'll be nice to me as I've spent about $750 there over the years.


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## likethevegetable (Mar 16, 2019)

They probably will be nice... they _should_, it's their newest model.

Yikes, a few mishaps have been reported lately. Please don't slip Zebra, we _need_ you!

Good luck!


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## AndyS (May 20, 2019)

Update: I received the repaired flashlight back Saturday, and it's working great. I was not asked to pay anything. It was returned to me in a bubble envelope with no paperwork at all.

It has the same scratches as the one I sent in, so I know it was repaired, not replaced.


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## Derek Dean (May 20, 2019)

Thanks for the update. Glad to hear that your light is back in good working order. Enjoy~


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## MKayze (May 29, 2019)

Before reading this thread I wanted a SC600W but after reading this thread, I'm not looking at the SC64W. But can't decide if I want the HI version or not.


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## MKayze (May 29, 2019)

MKayze said:


> Before reading this thread I wanted a SC600W but after reading this thread, I'm not looking at the SC64W. But can't decide if I want the HI version or not.



After further reading, I think either the SC600W MK IV Plus or the SC600Fd.

Looking for something to replace my current D4. I love the D4 but it just heats up too fast and not a big fan of the 4000k tint that I got.


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## WalkIntoTheLight (May 29, 2019)

MKayze said:


> After further reading, I think either the SC600W MK IV Plus or the SC600Fd.
> 
> Looking for something to replace my current D4. I love the D4 but it just heats up too fast and not a big fan of the 4000k tint that I got.



If you want something comparable to the D4, the SC600w MkIV Plus is probably the closest. It does get hot on max, but you'll get 1-2 minutes before the thermal controls start to ramp it down. If you grip it tightly, you might get more time, since the heat-sinking is excellent.

I use it as a bike light, and I can run it on max indefinitely if it's a cool night. The breeze I generate keeps it from ramping down.


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## MKayze (May 29, 2019)

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> If you want something comparable to the D4, the SC600w MkIV Plus is probably the closest. It does get hot on max, but you'll get 1-2 minutes before the thermal controls start to ramp it down. If you grip it tightly, you might get more time, since the heat-sinking is excellent.
> 
> I use it as a bike light, and I can run it on max indefinitely if it's a cool night. The breeze I generate keeps it from ramping down.



How's the flood compare to a D4 with the frosted optic? Thats awesome that It'll last that long on max. What about around 500 lumens?


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## WalkIntoTheLight (May 29, 2019)

MKayze said:


> How's the flood compare to a D4 with the frosted optic? Thats awesome that It'll last that long on max. What about around 500 lumens?



The 600w Plus is quite floody (it has a 16 degree hot spot, and lots of spill), with the frosted lens it would be very floody. It's not really useful for throw, but it's great for a wall of light out to modest distances.

I find that at 700 lumens (and below), thermal regulation does not kick in. So it's constant output at that level. BTW, it uses a boost driver, so it maintains constant output over the entire battery run, at all output levels. I suppose if you're tail-standing it in a warm room, the thermal regulation may eventually kick in at 700 lumens, but in normal use it doesn't.


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## [email protected] (Apr 23, 2020)

*Re: Zebralight SC600w IV Plus - Unwanted brightness stepdown*

I’ve had this light for a couple of years now and recently it has consistently (by that I mean every time) automatically stepped down in brightness after a second or two at the top setting. This is regardless of the battery or its charge (behaves the same with two different, fully-charged batteries), Never did this before, but it’s every time now. It has gotten daily but usually quite short use, but I’m wondering if it has reached the end of its service life, although I was expecting to get a few more years out of it.

Any ideas? Up until now, it’s been my all-time favorite light.


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## Connor (Apr 23, 2020)

*Re: Zebralight SC600w IV Plus - Unwanted brightness stepdown*

First thing I would try would be cleaning ALL the electrical connection points.


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## Derek Dean (Apr 25, 2020)

*Re: Zebralight SC600w IV Plus - Unwanted brightness stepdown*



[email protected] said:


> I’ve had this light for a couple of years now and recently it has consistently (by that I mean every time) automatically stepped down in brightness after a second or two at the top setting. This is regardless of the battery or its charge (behaves the same with two different, fully-charged batteries), Never did this before, but it’s every time now. It has gotten daily but usually quite short use, but I’m wondering if it has reached the end of its service life, although I was expecting to get a few more years out of it.
> 
> Any ideas? Up until now, it’s been my all-time favorite light.




Yes, what Connor suggested. Clean ALL the electrical contact points. Electrical Contact Cleaner is best, but rubbing alcohol and a Q-tip will work in a pinch. 

Never spray the cleaner directly into the flashlight, always apply a small amount to the Q-tip, then use that to clean the contact. When cleaning the contact up inside the batter tube at the head of the light, be sure and hold the light UP with the opening of the tube facing down, so you don't have any cleaner running down into the driver area of the light. 

Next clean the contact bumps in the battery tube cap, and while there, see that metal ring around the outside of the contact bumps? That's where the end of the battery tube makes contact with the cap (when it's all screwed together), so clean that too. And finally, clean the end of the battery tube. That is what fits down inside the cap and makes contact with that silver ring, and since it is close to the battery tube threads, sometimes a bit of lube gets on there. Oh, and don't forget to clean both ends of each battery. 

After you've thoroughly cleaned all those points, if you're still having an issue, I'd probably check your batteries. What brand are they, are they protected, and how old are they? Do you let them run all the way down before charging? These lights demand a LOT from a battery when used at the highest level, so the battery needs to be in primo condition. 

The thing is, this light should have a service life of many, many years. I got one of the first ones they sent out, and I've been using it nightly at work ever since, so some pretty hard use, and not only does it still look new, but it operates perfectly, so I'd consider all other options before thinking it's an issue with the light. 

However, if it does turn out to be an issue with the light, Zebralight will fix any of their out of warranty lights for $15. You simply contact them to let them know of the problem, then send your light in (with tracking), and it usually takes about a month before you get it back, although it might be a bit longer with the current world virus situation.


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## WalkIntoTheLight (Apr 26, 2020)

*Re: Zebralight SC600w IV Plus - Unwanted brightness stepdown*

Yeah, that sounds like a battery issue. Though, cleaning all contacts is certainly worth a try. The 600w IV Plus requires up to 8 amps (depending on battery voltage sag) on the H1 max setting. Older batteries, even when fully charged, may not be able to deliver the required current without sagging to a voltage level that causes the light to step down. Even new batteries, if they are not high drain, may not be able to supply enough current. Use brand-new Samsung 30Q's, or Sony VTC6, for the best combination of current and capacity. They'll work well.

You can try playing with your programming mode of the M1 or M2 medium modes, to narrow down the problem. The way Zebralight does step-downs, is they go from whatever your High mode is (H1 or H2, whatever you're using), to your medium mode (M1 or M2, whatever it is set at), then down to low (L1 or L2).

So, try setting your M1 mode to the 1400 lumen setting, using the G6 or G7 group. Then, see if the light will step-down from 2300 to 1400 lumens, or if it will then quickly go to the low mode setting. Repeat the experiment with a half-drain battery. It might give you some idea of how good your battery is. Anyway, you probably get the idea.


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## Fireclaw18 (Apr 30, 2020)

*Re: Zebralight SC600w IV Plus - Unwanted brightness stepdown*

It's not the battery and not a cleaning issue.

I've had this problem occur on several Zebralights. I cleaned all contacts with Deoxit Gold and applied new batteries that worked fine in other lights (including other Zebralights).

The unwanted stepdown appears to be inside the light in a non-user-serviceable area. Perhaps the contact from the driver to the body tube. The fix is to send the light in to Zebralight for repair.


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## ZebraCraig (Mar 31, 2021)

I recently received a new SC600w IV Plus and have been comparing it to my SC600w II L2. 

I live close to a park with hiking trails through the woods which go around a lake so it's a pretty good place to compare flashlights. 

This is how I programmed G6: H1=1,311/H2=705, M1=171/M2=77, L1=5.0/L2=1.8

I compared G6 against the SC600w II L2 and visually this gives about the same comparable results. The SC600w II L2 has more throw but he SC600w IV Plus lights up a larger area in front of you with its brighter spill. On M and L modes the SC600w IV Plus uses about twice the lumens to create similar perceived brightness to that of the SC600w II L2 so it has reduced runtimes. On L mode the IV gives more of a wall of light whereas II gives a bit more throw. Both are very nice and frankly I'm impressed with how well the II did in this comparison! For walking on trails I like the IV. For looking at things that are farther away the II is better. 

The IV is smaller and lighter with an easier to press button which clicks louder. It's almost too small for my hands but I'm getting used to it


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## Derek Dean (Apr 2, 2021)

Hey ZebraCraig, welcome to the forum!!! I've got both of those lights and use both for different purposes as well. If the SC600w IV Plus feels a bit small, you'll have to try the SC700d, which is the light I keep on my bed stand. It feels really nice in the hand. Enjoy your Zebras : )


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## Kuroyuki (Jun 25, 2021)

Upgraded my floody light carry to SC600w IV Plus. Really liking it so far with the nice floody beam. My initial edc carry for flood was the SC64 (really liked the size) but since I wanted to have longer run times for the higher output opt to get the sc600w IV Plus as well.


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## Oboe (Dec 19, 2021)

Flashlight Junkie said:


> I just finished playing outside with my new SC600w Mk IV and Mk IV Plus with charged LG HE2 cells. First, I tested the Mk IV against my old and beloved SC600w Mk II L2. Gotta say, I'm a bit disappointed. Even though the Mk IV outputs 40% more lumens (1400 vs 1028), it doesn't look that much brighter. The Mk IV Plus has a beautiful, wide beam and a bit more throw than the Fd Mk III Plus (frosted lens). I definitely like it better than the III Plus. I'll probably send the IV back for a refund and keep the IV Plus. At any rate, at $89-$99 US a pop, I'm done with the lumens race. Unless Zebralight rolls out a Mk V at 3,000 lumens, I'm out for a bit. Peace!


In audio, the lowest readily detectable increase in loudness is stated to be 3db. I've read that the same applies to light. 3db represents a two fold increase, 1/2, 50/100, 350/700, and so forth. Forty percent falls short. Of course, some eyes (along with their associated brains) work better than others.


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