# Underdog flashlights



## papershredder (Jun 9, 2013)

What are some of the flashlights that people consider "underdogs?" Those flashlights that when you look at the specifications online, they are usually handsomly beat. However, once you get your hands on that light, you find that it fulfils a role for you very well? How does the light work for you? This is about your needs and how the light fits into them. Please limit the discussion to specific models, not brands.


For me, the Fenix E25 is a prime example. It's got an incredibly tight hotspot for such a small reflector. So, for me this light is good for looking through forrested area. I could use a high power floody light to brute-force my way into seeing things at a distance, but the spill impacts my night vision. It's great for urban settings to, and is a little more discreet. It gets the light where you want it, and nowhere else. 
A less bright, more concentrated beam is the key here. I get better runtimes, a smaller light, and get to use AA batteries, which is different from your typical thrower. It won't illuminate as much area at a distance, but it'll make a pretty good distance for its size. You would not expect what is considered a budget light to fulfil a role so well. That's why it's an underdog.


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## AnAppleSnail (Jun 9, 2013)

Surefire, Streamlight, Pelican, and HDS. The lights have a lot more going for them than output measurements.


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## Echo63 (Jun 9, 2013)

Muyshondt Aeon (mine is a 2 stage TI Neutral led)
Its a rather expensive, not overly bright light, and most CPFers wouldn't look at it twice.

however it is the perfect 23/7/365 carry light (mine isn't on me when I'm swimming or showering, mainly because the lanyard takes to long to dry, so it's carried 23.5 hrs a day)

the runtime on low is ridiculous - 40hrs at Approx 10 lumens (enough for most tasks) and 90 mins on high (100 lumens) (and this is in a CR2 cell, which has less capacity than a 123)

The machining is perfect, it's like a little jewel, and has a sapphire lens, and the twisty action of the brass heat sink on the TI shell is very smooth, it feels like a properly built tool, all function, but built to the best of the manufacturers abilities
the kind of tool your are just looking after before you pass it on to your kids.

Heres mine when it arrived, with an SF T1A, a CR2, CR123 and a Novatac 120P







It fits me perfectly, it's light around my neck, feels nice to use, doesn't have any pokey bits, and has a nice simple "duh" twist for low, twist more for high interface that fits my "backup" needs perfectly - I change the battery once a year whether it needs it or not too (and I do use it a fair bit, as it's quite frequently my only carry light while I'm at home)



The RA Twisty is a similar light, in a bigger beefier shell with three programmable levels - it's pretty new to my EDC Rotation, but I have carried it every day since it arrived. It also has that bullet proof "pass it down to your kids" feeling to it - it's no longer in production, and the specs are nothing spectacular (100 lumens from my version) but i do like its interface and build quality - and really, you don't need more than 100 lumens from a day to day EDC light (but damn it's fun to fling a silly amount of lumens at stuff) I wouldn't be surprised to find a lot of the RA Twistys made still living in their owners pocket, or stashed away with a fresh cell ready to light up the night in an emergency.

Both manufacturers are great to deal with too.



The SF 3 cell P60 lights (9P, Z3, G3, C3 D3) get overlooked a bit too 
I have a Bored 9P - and it is a very versatile size
i can fit 2x18500, 2x17500 or 3X123 in it - and they all run at 9V - so will happily run a bulb, or Led dropin designed for 9V - no messing around switching Bulbs when your rechargeables run flat and you have to dump primaries in it !

In a pinch i can also run 2xAA or an 18650+Spacer (yea 2xAA fit in a 3x123 light, it works great with those P60 dropins that can handle a wide voltage range - it won't work for as long as 3X123, but may give you enough light in an emergency)


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## DMitchell (Jun 11, 2013)

Eagletac P100 C2 XP-G S2 
I stop by all sorts of local stores looking at their flashlights very close to same price range, and I just laugh. Perfect cool white tint, screaming throw to size ratio, considering the reflector size, all with adequate spill for 39 bucks. The light is also a blessing to hold in your hand with all that knurling, and one of the most responsive forward clicky switches I have ever used. Oh, did I mention the 10 year warranty?

Fenix E35
I remember in my twenties how my parents didn't get along with the next door neighbors. I remember how badly they treated my father when my mother died, and vowed to never be that type of neighbor to anyone. This is where the Fenix E35, and Pila GL4 come into play in my life.
I have elderly neighbors across the street where I live, and I do everything I can to use a light with a narrow beam profile to control spill, and not intrude, or disrespect them before 11PM when I know they are in bed. For a single compact 18650 light with no turbo head the E35 does and admiral job of controlling the spill with superior runtime to most incandescent lights available. This light can be locked out, because the threads are anodized, and changing modes is easier than any flashlight I have ever owned. 

Solarforce P1D w/Nailbender Nichia NVSL219 4500 92CRI
Why not? Why not take two of the greatest accessories per dollar you have ever witnessed within the P60 format at put them together in one package. I know, I know, there's going to be thousands of you telling me how you can purchase a light so much brighter for the price. My comment to all of you is while I am busy experiencing one of the greatest L.E.D. emitters ever created you can go impress the 14 year old down the street with how bright your flashlight is. This emitter's tint, and CRI is reminiscent of many incandescent lights driven correctly, and easily makes my top 3 list of greatest emitters ever created. 


Customlite Sunlight XM-L2 Warm White 90CRI


Of all the lights I have listed this one is my personal/biased favorite. The only type of light that could possible supersede this for me would be a custom made warm MC-E, and I could just imagine what that would cost in comparison to this. Literally, a powerhouse of light performance while at the same time combining the throw, and spill of some of the best general purpose lights I have ever personally seen. With a build like this I would of paid a C-note, and the tint is so easy to look at it's almost relaxing.


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## JJohn (Jun 11, 2013)

+1 on the Fenix E25. This is a real nice small thrower. We use it to spot critters in our back yard. It also is great for dog walking trips in the park.


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## kelmo (Jun 12, 2013)

The Surefire U2. Those 100 lumens really punch above its weight!


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## Echo63 (Jun 12, 2013)

kelmo said:


> The Surefire U2. Those 100 lumens really punch above its weight!


+1 - it's a pretty impressive light (my old LuxV version was used hard for a few years - I have probably had it 8 years or so now, paid a fortune for it when I bought it, still works like new)


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## cland72 (Jun 12, 2013)

The Malkoff "L" versions of their M61 series. Very useable light in the range of 125-175 lumens depending on the bin/tint/type of LED, with a 5 hour regulated runtime and long taper after voltage drops. This has become my favorite over the M61 and M61LL. It's a nice balance of runtime and output.


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## archimedes (Jun 12, 2013)

SureFire A2 ... is awesome in so many ways, but "on paper" might not sound too special. Lamp, 50 lumens, 1 hour ... plus LEDs, 5-ish lumens, 15(+) hours ... meh, right ?

But the lamp is incandescent, has 100 CRI, outstanding "throw", and plenty of lumens for most purposes. And the "soft-start" helps preserve the bulbs. And it's _ regulated_ !

The LEDs are efficient, with lots of runtime, floody pattern, are available in different colors (and mods!), and of low enough output for many purposes. And keep on working long after the batteries are too weak to fire the main lamp.

And all this in torch that is not too big, nor too small, looks great, and has the "perfect" UI ... 2-stage, low-to-high, flood-to-throw, press-for-momentary, twist-to-hold.

 :bow: :twothumbs


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## Torpedo (Jun 12, 2013)

The fenix e40 is a strong thrower for 220 lumens.


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## Jonnor (Jun 12, 2013)

For me I can't see how Malkoff, HDS an Surefire can be underdogs - I must have to little in light budget 

My underdog light must be the Proton Pro from LRI. It's old, cheap and just over 100 lumens on max.

But what it lacks on paper it gains in use. It has dual white/red output which both are fulle adjustable from high to low (white) and low to high (red) with instant access to high white and low low red from off. There are "hidden" beacon/SOS mode as well.

The light uses AA batteries with quite good run times. The build quality is great, at the same time as it uses very thin aluminum so it's very light. 

It comes with a good holster and a GREAT clip. The clip is bezel down and long so you can clip it in your pocket without to much of the tail protruding. 

I have used the light at work almost daily for three years and it has not failed me once! I need a light which can be used to light up entire rooms at some point, and at the next time I need to use it inside a electrical cabinet on a ships bridge during in shore night sailing without ruining the nightvision of the navigator. This light does both.

So for me the Proton Pro is definitely my underdog.


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## Z-Tab (Jun 12, 2013)

I think the incan Surefire G2 is a bit of an underdog. Nobody ever recommends a G2, but you can frequently find them for $30 or less and they are just about as indestructible as you could hope for. Plus, they take P60 drop-ins if you want to switch to LED (though you probably don't want one that runs too hot).


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## fyrstormer (Jun 12, 2013)

There aren't really any underdog flashlights. There are flashlights that work well, and flashlights with one or more significant flaws. Everything else is personal preference.


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## Backpacker Light (Jun 12, 2013)

fyrstormer said:


> There aren't really any underdog flashlights. There are flashlights that work well, and flashlights with one or more significant flaws. Everything else is personal preference.



Well said.

I love all my flashlights. And sometimes almost cannot wait for the Sun to set.

Which light to play with tonight?


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## papershredder (Jun 12, 2013)

fyrstormer said:


> There aren't really any underdog flashlights. There are flashlights that work well, and flashlights with one or more significant flaws. Everything else is personal preference.



We're looking for flashlights that work well, but are not well recognized.


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## DMitchell (Jun 21, 2013)

papershredder said:


> We're looking for flashlights that work well, but are not well recognized.





This is what I got from your original post. The comments, "work well", and "significant flaws" should most likely be considered from the specific user. Last time I checked no one agrees on what the single best flashlight should be, and every flashlight regardless of how much it costs, or whether it is in the top one percent will be beaten in a specific area to something cheaper. This is the name of the game, and it's wise to keep an open mind.


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## papershredder (Jun 21, 2013)

fyrstormer said:


> There are flashlights that work well, and flashlights with one or more significant flaws. Everything else is personal preference.



Do you mean to say that it's because of personal preference there are lights that work well and others have significant flaws?

There is some degree of objectivity to what's a good light...


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## fyrstormer (Jun 28, 2013)

papershredder said:


> Do you mean to say that it's because of personal preference there are lights that work well and others have significant flaws?
> 
> There is some degree of objectivity to what's a good light...





fyrstormer said:


> There aren't really any underdog flashlights. There are flashlights that work well, and flashlights with one or more significant flaws. _*EVERYTHING ELSE*_ is personal preference.


Emphasis added to improve clarity.


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## fyrstormer (Jun 28, 2013)

papershredder said:


> We're looking for flashlights that work well, but are not well recognized.


I don't think there are any. There are lights that sell very well because they work very well for a lot of people, and there are lights that don't sell very well, because their design limits their use to specific situations that only a few people deal with on a regular basis. A flashlight that is well-designed for a specific use may have a small following, but it will nonetheless be a dedicated and vocal following, and the flashlight will still be well-recognized even if only a few people own it. If a flashlight is not well recognized on an enthusiast forum like CPF, it's because it's not a very good flashlight in the first place.

Now, if you ask Joe Schmoe on the street about underdog flashlights, assuming they know anything about flashlights at all, they'd probably say "everything except Maglites, those things are everywhere." Fortunately, the people around here are much better informed, and even the most niche product is popular with its target audience so long as it's well-made.


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## alaskabushman (Jul 1, 2013)

I have two Nebo lights that I have been happy with. They are pretty affordable but seem fairly okay quality. My Nebo Redline has a focusing beam, 3 brightness levels, strobe and SOS. I think it was in the $20 range. The other lives in the cigarette lighter plug in my car, poised for those moments when I need to hand a light to someone other than me (since I always have my EDC). Surfire quality? Nope...but they turn on when I need them.


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## edpmis02 (Jul 1, 2013)

Mag 2xD "Cree" versions. Great thrower light I keep in the car door to quickly grab and use to see unlit house numbers and street signs. I keep it in the car over the winter, but don't want alkalines baking in the summer heat. :shakehead (I got it for $14 during Black Friday sales)

I recently had a "Quick Lube" technician remove a (Neutral white) Eagletac T100c2 from my car, but he left the Maglight..


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## Kokopelli (Jul 1, 2013)

My underdog is a Fenix E21. I have and older 150 lumen one. Like the comments on E25, it is throwy and looks much brighter than lights with twice the lumens. The forward clicky is a nice plus against the newer E25. Very strongly built also. Has a nice grip. 

I also keep a SureFire G2 Nitrolon with a custom single mode XPE dropin. It runs for 7-8 hours, give out a throwy beam and still keeps the SureFire quality. When I need high CRI I just install the standard incandescent bulb.


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## Stress_Test (Jul 4, 2013)

The SolarForce L2P lineup. Tons of drop-in options from the same company (no compatibility worries), mix and match ability, big enough for an 18650, good machining and quality... I've bought several of these and I've been impressed by what you get for the price.


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## flashlight chronic (Jul 6, 2013)

The E series line of Fenix flashlights.


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## RIX TUX (Jul 6, 2013)

yes on that^
sweet light - I am very happy with mine, no bells and whistles, just a bright white tight beam.


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## RIX TUX (Jul 6, 2013)

Torpedo said:


> The fenix e40 is a strong thrower for 220 lumens.



yes on that^
sweet light - I am very happy with mine, no bells and whistles, just a bright white tight beam


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## Monocrom (Jul 6, 2013)

Around here ... Can't think of a bigger underdog than Streamlight.

I would put Pelican on there too. But they need to step up the overall quality of their lights.


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## Kokopelli (Jul 6, 2013)

I believe nobody has a Fenix E10? It was a real limited edition, sold only in Europe. It has a 55 lm rating, a Rebel led, but I've always found it more than enough for almost everything. Has a useful beam, a great higher than usual CRI beam and a strong body. Sold my second one thinking I could buy one later, but it seems I is discontinued completely.


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## novice (Jul 7, 2013)

Gerber Infinity Ultra. Most of the first-time flashlights I give to non-flashlight-people tend to be single-cell lights (wherein I don't have to worry about them forgetting my safety lecture, mismatching lithium cells and setting things on fire) that maximize run-time at the expense of output. They are not perfect (by Jove, why didn't they polish out the reflector after anodization?), but I bought 3 of these several years ago when someone was clearing them out at $4.99 each, off of 'good deals'. That was one of the best 'bang-for-the-buck' purchases, ever. I didn't want to get greedy, and wanted to give members here with limited funds a chance to buy in. I gave 2 of them to NFP friends who now love them.

I have also given away quite a few Fenix E01 lights for people who couldn't be bothered to carry anything larger, to put on their keychain. They don't have any throw, but they are fairly tough, simple to use, maximize runtime (it's relative, I know) for a single AAA, and come in different colors. Personally, I think the purple is fab!


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## mesa232323 (Jul 7, 2013)

It's funny how people mentioned flashlights that are all over CPF like SF and Fenix. 

My underdog is the Sunlite Eagle turbo which I've owned 3!. My prefered light over my HDS rotary, and SF G2 P91. While mounted to my firearm.


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## DMitchell (Jul 7, 2013)

mesa232323 said:


> It's funny how people mentioned flashlights that are all over CPF like SF and Fenix.
> 
> My underdog is the Sunlite Eagle turbo which I've owned 3!. My prefered light over my HDS rotary, and SF G2 P91. While mounted to my firearm.



You're probably correct. A better choice for me than the Fenix E35 could of been the Pila GL2, or GL3 for P60 dropins with removable larger springs.


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## Nyctophiliac (Jul 7, 2013)

At the risk of becoming repetitive, whenever a thread turns up about unsung lights, I sift through the many lights that have been used and abused in my ungainly but not entirely small collection. In many ways I love them all, for all their expense and other foibles. The ARCs, Surefires, RAs, Peaks and others. All great in their own way and all much celebrated on this forum over the years.

But I find myself coming back to a couple of lights I've had for a while. Not very popular on here. Impossible to get in the UK without the usual Customs bills etc. Anyway, here they are:







My Firstlight Tomahawk MC and LE.

They have a close focused white beam, three levels (The LE has a hidden tactical strobe as well) I think rated at 120 Lumens max. And two outer LED colours as well - I have the MC with red/blue and the LE with red/green.

Heres the MC with both colours on.






Again the LE has a multi coloured beacon mode, very good for attracting attention.

I've opted for the extra task-light battery cap - basically a cap with an led and a couple of coin cells - blue or UV.

Here's blue - you can also see the robust belt clip on the side.






So all in all a good light - takes two CR123A or on occasion I employ one 17670 if I'm feeling poor.

Unique UI - takes a bit of getting used to but very easy to use and kinda intuitive.

I am indebted to Solscud007 for bringing his Tomahawk to the Wimbledon CPF meet several years ago, where I had my first sight of this gem of a light.


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## Nyctophiliac (Aug 6, 2013)

No other underdogs??????


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## Perfectionist (Aug 6, 2013)

Jonnor said:


> For me I can't see how Malkoff, HDS an Surefire can be underdogs - I must have to little in light budget
> 
> *My underdog light must be the Proton Pro from LRI.* It's old, cheap and just over 100 lumens on max.
> 
> ...


Absolutely! As far as being a practical tool (as opposed to a collectable) the Proton is pretty close to perfect. It's a real shame that LRI don't invest more resources in marketing this little beauty, and on improving and developing it further...


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## KeyGrip (Aug 8, 2013)

The old single-level Inova X5 is what first came to mind. It doesn't really place in the top of any one category, and yet in true underdog fashion it proved popular amongst us merciless flashaholics. Very well built, dead simple, and produces useable light for a very long time on batteries which won't power other lights.


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## Clikzio (Aug 8, 2013)

I've become fond of a Maglite Solitaire LED, compact with a decent output and cheap at under $10. A good give away light


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## FPSRelic (Aug 9, 2013)

Nyctophiliac said:


> At the risk of becoming repetitive, whenever a thread turns up about unsung lights, I sift through the many lights that have been used and abused in my ungainly but not entirely small collection. In many ways I love them all, for all their expense and other foibles. The ARCs, Surefires, RAs, Peaks and others. All great in their own way and all much celebrated on this forum over the years.
> 
> But I find myself coming back to a couple of lights I've had for a while. Not very popular on here. Impossible to get in the UK without the usual Customs bills etc. Anyway, here they are:
> 
> ...



Seconded! I have the Same LE version but with the TRS mount with belt clip, and have the magnetic mount as well. I attached the magnet mount onto the metal part of the bedhead, and can use it like a reading light, and since it's always exactly where I expect it to be, It's my go to light for things that go bump in the night. Although I have many lights that are brighter specced than this light, the SSC P4's beam pattern is the best I have at giving both flood and throw at the same time.


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## Nyctophiliac (Aug 9, 2013)

FPSRelic said:


> Seconded! I have the Same LE version but with the TRS mount with belt clip, and have the magnetic mount as well. I attached the magnet mount onto the metal part of the bedhead, and can use it like a reading light, and since it's always exactly where I expect it to be, It's my go to light for things that go bump in the night. Although I have many lights that are brighter specced than this light, the SSC P4's beam pattern is the best I have at giving both flood and throw at the same time.



I have the TRS but I've never seen the magnetic mount. And besides, our bedhead is wood!

These really are great lights and I'm glad that I now know of three CPFers who like them.

(Other splendid flashlights are available...)


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## GarageBoy (Aug 12, 2013)

+1 Photon Pro
Back in the day, my vote would have been the Underwater Kinetics flashlights
Arc 6, to me is kinda underrated- it's an Arc/McLux product, why didn't it sell any better?


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## Monocrom (Aug 12, 2013)

GarageBoy said:


> +1 Photon Pro
> Back in the day, my vote would have been the Underwater Kinetics flashlights
> Arc 6, to me is kinda underrated- it's an Arc/McLux product, why didn't it sell any better?



Hey! Good to see you back.

UK still gets my overall vote for underrated flashlight brand.


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## SoldMyHat (Aug 13, 2013)

Streamlight microstream. Seems everyone that has one loves it. But I can't seem to find mention of it anywhere around here.


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## GarageBoy (Aug 22, 2013)

Haha, Monocrom, glad to be back too
I was totally happy with what I was using until I played with Carrot's lights

Not sure if I'm being nostalgic, but the whole minimag Sandwich combo gave way to many awesome mods that have been out


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## Monocrom (Aug 22, 2013)

GarageBoy said:


> Haha, Monocrom, glad to be back too
> I was totally happy with what I was using until I played with Carrot's lights



A guaranteed way to re-ignite any flashaholic's addiction. :thumbsup:


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## AardvarkSagus (Aug 23, 2013)

archimedes said:


> SureFire A2 ... is awesome in so many ways, but "on paper" might not sound too special. Lamp, 50 lumens, 1 hour ... plus LEDs, 5-ish lumens, 15(+) hours ... meh, right ?
> 
> But the lamp is incandescent, has 100 CRI, outstanding "throw", and plenty of lumens for most purposes. And the "soft-start" helps preserve the bulbs. And it's _ regulated_ !
> 
> ...


I have to heartily second this one. I love my Aviator for exactly these reasons. It's a fantastic light and currently my only remaining incan.


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## buds224 (Aug 23, 2013)

My Fenix TA21 is my underdog light. On paper, not very impressive. But it throws like a mother. Very tight beam with lots of useable spill. I've even used the beacon mode in times of bad weather, low visibility hikes as it's holstered to my backpack pointed down. Lots of modes that can be preset before firing it up.


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