# Help with dive light mod to LED...



## CBR-runner (Jan 19, 2009)

Ok so this is my second post on the forum. Hopefully this is posted in the correct place the post covers a number of spots form the forum. 

I have been reading about making flashlights for few weeks now. I am currently building a high power LED Dive light and got the great idea to modify an existing light of mine. 

The light is a Pelican Nemo 4300, it uses 8 C cell batteries (I use 8 rechargeable NiMh C cells 1.2V) and powers a Xenon bulb to about 270 lumins. I want about 500 lumins out of the light when all is done. (http://www.opticsplanet.net/pelican-nemo-flashlight-4300b-black.html)

I was thinking of modifying it to have a 3x Cree XRE R2 Led's but the voltage of rechargeable batteries is a little lacking. I am assumng i will need a boost kit, but i do not know what that will do to battery life and light output. 

I think this kit will do http://www.cutter.com.au/proddetail.php?prod=cut756

With this reflector http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.11922


What do you guys think I should get for light output and battery life?

Thanks Brian


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## Packhorse (Jan 20, 2009)

My buddy has the light and he is very disappointed with it. He has only ever used it with primarys and I think they may not supply the needed current. Have you noticed a difference between primarys and NiMhs?

The light has quite a large reflector and it would be a shame to not make use of it. I would look at a P7 (or MC-E) with the stock reflector although this may not work to well.
If you go for 4 LEDs instead of 3 you could wire them 2P2S with a Vf of about 7.4v so your stock battery configuration will be close enough to use with a Kai Domain P7 driver. I use this set up in my cannister light.

Heat will be your biggest worry. With no thermal escape the inside may get quite toasty. Perhaps run 3 or 4 LEDs in parallel from a P7 driver with the biggest heat sink you can fit inside.


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## CBR-runner (Jan 20, 2009)

Everything i put NiMh's in has worked a little better. These lights are not an exception. 

I'm not to worried about not using the reflector, and I am only going to use 3 LED's with Cree's heat sink. Being in the water hopefully heat sinking through the ABS plastic will be better than in air. 

Will the boost driver hurt my battery life that much?


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## gav6280 (Jan 20, 2009)

I have this light too. And i use it a lot. I have thought about giving it an upgrade but the more i think about it the more i think its no possible.

The problems are that every single part is plastic or rubber, the reflector is only good for a single Led and the bulb is currently mounted directly on the batter pack with no space for anything else.

If you figure it all out though the Osram Ostar might be a good choice, and please let me know how you do it...


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## Packhorse (Jan 20, 2009)

CBR-runner said:


> Everything i put NiMh's in has worked a little better. These lights are not an exception.
> 
> I'm not to worried about not using the reflector, and I am only going to use 3 LED's with Cree's heat sink. Being in the water hopefully heat sinking through the ABS plastic will be better than in air.
> 
> Will the boost driver hurt my battery life that much?



I think you will find that the heat sinking will be much worse as it is trapped inside the plastic and will have no flow and plastic is a very bad conductor of heat. My guess is that heat sink will work for shot runs but the LEDs will soon over heat and die. I'd go with 4 LEDs and under drive them with a much larger heatsink. Also that LED package is MR11 style (35mm) where the reflector is MR16 (50mm) so will probably not work together.
As long as you use a efficent boost driver you shouldnt have a problem.


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## CBR-runner (Jan 20, 2009)

I understand that heat sinking maybe a problem. That is something I will have to come up with a solution for. I will use the 50mm set up so the larger reflector will work. 

As far as everything being molded that maybe helpful for mounting the electronics and a larger heatsink. Just apply a dremmel and JB weld until it works. 

I'll let you know how things go. 

I am just trying to get the battery and driver setup before I go hacking up a $50 light. Will that setup give me at least 2 hours of battery life and better than 400 lumins?


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## Packhorse (Jan 20, 2009)

Yeah I think 2 hours and 400 lumen is a reasonable goal. Mind you I still think you should consider a P7 with the stock reflector and if that does not work then get the 50mm P7 reflector. The P7 is good for up to 900 lumen but if you under drive it you will get longer batter life and less heat build up.


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## HarryN (Jan 21, 2009)

Think in terms of what you can do with 5 watts. If that is not enough light, consider an incan bulb upgrade.


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## CBR-runner (Jan 21, 2009)

Where can I get a P7 and a driver for it? This may actually be the way to go with the setup of the light internals.


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## gav6280 (Jan 22, 2009)

Dealextreme should do most of the parts you need, a P7 would be great with the stock Nemo reflector.

If you pull this off, i would like to know exactly how you did it, so i can do it to. Cheers.


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## CBR-runner (Jan 22, 2009)

gav6280 said:


> Dealextreme should do most of the parts you need, a P7 would be great with the stock Nemo reflector.
> 
> If you pull this off, i would like to know exactly how you did it, so i can do it to. Cheers.




I'm working on the heat sink right now. I'm thinking it needs distance and surface area for this to be successful. I have some sheet aluminum so we will see. 

Gonna get this p7 (http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.12721)

I was thinking about this driver (http://theledguy.chainreactionweb.com/product_info.php?cPath=48_49_61&products_id=1006) will that do the trick?


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## CBR-runner (Jan 24, 2009)

Does anyone know how to make this a one mode driver, or how to switch between modes with a magnetic switch? :candle:

http://www.kaidomain.com/ProductDetails.aspx?ProductId=6282

-or- i guess i could just uses this driver

http://www.kaidomain.com/ProductDetails.aspx?ProductId=1770


One of these should be the answer to the driver problem. Next time to get parts and rebuild the flashlight. :twothumbs


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## gillestugan (Jan 24, 2009)

I would go for the cheap 7135 based driver as many people have reported overheating issues with the other one.
The driver will work great if you wire your batteries parallel in pairs and place 4 pairs in series. (or 2 strings of 4) so you get about 4,8V fully charged.

Cant you use the switch already in the flashlight? You change mode by quickly turning the light off and on.


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## CBR-runner (Jan 24, 2009)

thanks for the heads up in the drivers:wave:

The battery is wired in series I'm going to have to rewire it. 

The flashlight has a magnetic switch already built in to maintain water tight integrity. Not sure how it works yet.


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## CBR-runner (Jan 30, 2009)

Well I have some pics and measurements for my Nemo C8 dive light to Led conversion. 

The depth of the reflector is going to make it impossable to heatsink the P7 and keep the stock reflector. I ordered this one form dx (http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.12229) hopefully it works well. 


















This is the battery holder and lamp holder. It looks like I need an aluminum plate about 62mm in diameter by about 3 or 4 mm thick for a heat sink. plus a small relief for the old bulb holder. 











Reed Switch


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## rufusbduck (Feb 8, 2009)

"I wish I didn't have to take everything apart"

But that's what this forum is all about! However, the "oops" is probably the most accurate prediction. I have just begun a similar mod of a Pelican King Lite 8D and have similar feelings of trepidation. I will be converting to nimh sub-c cells as I have a pile of them as well as several chargers. I can fit at least 4 possibly even 5- 5cell packs in the body. The main switch has two on positions so I might set it up as two lights in one housing(one spot, one flood). Cutter has a nice 6-up pcb will fit easily or I can go for the cram-job(I favor the cram -job). I never liked the spot on any of the Pelican lights I have especiallly as in diving most times I'm pointing it at something only a few feet away so my optics will favor spill rather than throw. Good luck.


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## Fluor (Feb 8, 2009)

What about this complete set from DX. I used this for my first mod with a good result. Complete P7 with reflector and heat sink. Very easy to install if it fits?
http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.14413

My mod:
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/posts/2724888


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## CBR-runner (Feb 8, 2009)

thanks for the input. 

the premade unit is to big for the light. i think the light with 1 P7 is better than the 270 lm it makes now. Latter i may do a 3 p7 mag canister light.


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## CBR-runner (Feb 8, 2009)

Well I went with the P7 Driver from Dr Wichtel (A CPF member). it looks good. My P7 is still in china at DX maybe i'll get it some day. 

Once the heat sink and P7 get here it should be an easy build. :twothumbs

Pics of SSC P7 Buck driver. Nice craftsmanship (Gets yours here: https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/201981)


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## CBR-runner (Feb 10, 2009)

Got my P7 in the mail today  . Heat sink should be here this weekend!:green:


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## gav6280 (Feb 11, 2009)

Looks like it's all coming together then, cant wait to see the assembly pictures...


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## CBR-runner (Feb 12, 2009)

The custom heat sink will be here in the next few days. Then I get to break out the soldering iron and go to town!!:thumbsup:


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## CBR-runner (Feb 20, 2009)

Ok i got my heat sink in and i'm waiting for the reflector.

This is the top of the heat sink and the stock bulb holder with the spare bulb holder removed and the electrical connections isolated with tape. 







Bottom of reflector with hole cut in to allow it to center on the old bulb holder






Trying to get it all to fit in the space I have.


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## wes_wall (Mar 2, 2009)

Regarding the magnetic switch, I have drilled it down to a simple build on a homebrew PCB. I will share it if anyone is interested. The electronics is fairly straightforward (I am quite electronically challenged) The trick becomes moving the magnet on the outside of the container properly with some "click." If not, the light can come on and off at will; not a good thing.


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## heffay (Mar 2, 2009)

I'd be interested in seeing the PCB, if you don't mind


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## CBR-runner (Mar 2, 2009)

You can keep everything the same and just wire a driver to the light bulb connection. That way your not cutting everything up. I was planning on using a peace of plastic and some blade terminals to build a plug. 

I had it up and running but broke the led when I tried to get everything back into the canister. I blame my hangover . 

I will post some pics latter. It was bright as hell. The headsink will be the limiting thing. I'm getting a driver that has thermal protection which should take care of that problem. 

I will also post final build cost and some better instructions when it is all together. It is one bright little light!!!


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## CBR-runner (Mar 2, 2009)

pic of all the parts






testing 










beam shot in the daytime with windows open






Its to bad i broke it before i could get in all together. I'll have it together again before too long.

What do you guys think so far?


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## CBR-runner (Mar 16, 2009)

well new P7's are on the way and this thing should be up and running soon. :twothumbs

Hopefully I can refine it to make it a quick and easy mod for all the divers out there. :candle:

It is definitely a bright mod for this light hopefully the thermals stay in check.


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## HarryN (Mar 17, 2009)

It certainly is a nice light, and the big reflector is handy for a big throw beam. With one power LED running, it might work with no heat path to ambient, especially if you turn it down a little - perhaps 400 - 500ma per die.

If you need another LED, Cree has their factory in Durham, NC, less than 100 miles from you. :shrug:


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## CBR-runner (Mar 17, 2009)

CREE IS IN NC!!!

WHY THE HECK DO I HAVE TO BUY THEM FORM JAPAN!!!



Maybe i will use a multi-level driver, kinda the best of both worlds.


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## HarryN (Mar 18, 2009)

CBR-runner said:


> CREE IS IN NC!!!
> 
> WHY THE HECK DO I HAVE TO BUY THEM FORM JAPAN!!!
> 
> ...



I figured maybe you would like to save on postage and buy more locally. 

Here is the link to Cree's official distributors:

http://www.cree.com/products/xlamp_dist.asp

Just keep clicking on the map until you get to your area. The last time I purchased Cree LEDs, it was from ETG in LA - great service - but that was also several years ago. Still, that is a bit closer than two trips across the Pacific (Cree to Japan, then back to you)

Also, I think cpf photonfanatic sells some of the LED parts, but I am not sure which ones. (over in the marketplace). He also has a web site, but for some reason, I couldn't find the page with parts tonight: http://photonfanatic.com/


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## CBR-runner (Mar 18, 2009)

thanks for the info.

lovecpf Hopefully that can help me cut the cost of my new hobby.


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## CBR-runner (Apr 26, 2009)

well after much waiting and other stuff i thought i had this thing working... 

But the current must have been to much for the reed switch and i cant turn the light off anymore. this may be a better mod for the 4c... oh well. 

the final driver was a http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.20329 form DX...

any advice?


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## Packhorse (Apr 27, 2009)

use a reed to drive a mosfet or relay.

For the record I have ran that driver from a 12v input with a 7.4v output at 2.8amp and it went fine. But that was with the mode board removed.


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## steve6690 (Apr 27, 2009)

I'd just bite the bullet and spring for a HipFlex driver. It's got all the features you need. I have used a MaxFlex with a reed switch and it's fine in normal use but a bit tricky to program the UI with..


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## CBR-runner (Apr 27, 2009)

The driver worked fine it was the reed switch or circuit that broke. it looked real promising for the first 20min of the run test. The heat from the LED was not bad at all. The driver seemed to be working fine too. 

The funny thing is that I can not turn the light off. it is on full time now. 



What are the hipflex and Max Flex drivers, and where do i get them?


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## steve6690 (Apr 27, 2009)

With the HipFlex you could use the reed switch but it won't be passing the drive current so you shouldn't get a problem with the contacts welding together which is probably why your reed switch has failed closed.

http://taskled.com/hipflex.html


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## CBR-runner (Apr 27, 2009)

It does not look like the reed switch has fused together. :shrug:

Where can i find other reed switches? :candle:


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## 4Ever (Apr 27, 2009)

I had the same issue with reed swiches, when it turns on the current is too big and it keeps the reed closed even when you remove the magnet, the only way to stop is to disconnect the battery.
Like Packhorse said, you need to use a mosfet, that way the reed will only see a marginal amount of current and it will work fine.

Here is an a link to an example:
http://brunningsoftware.co.uk/FET.htm

You do not need R2 that will be the driver.

Best Regards


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## steve6690 (Apr 28, 2009)

CBR-runner said:


> It does not look like the reed switch has fused together. :shrug:
> 
> Where can i find other reed switches? :candle:



You can't usually tell with the naked eye. I know this from bitter experience. If you are going to use your existing driver you will need to pass the led drive current through a relay or mosfet which is actuated by the reed switch, as suggested above. It's fairly simple to wire up that configuration.
There's no need to change the driver but if you want to take advantage of the UI and temp sensing of the Hipflex then all you need to do wire your reed switch across the terminal of the driver board's momentary switch.
Reed switches are available from any electronics shop and over here in the UK they cost the equivalent of around $1. This one might be suitable. Be very careful when bending the wires as the glass can shatter quite easily..

http://parts.digikey.co.uk/1/1/431008-reed-switch-mag-spst-12-18at-mlrr-3-12-18.html


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## CBR-runner (Apr 29, 2009)

I posted a pic of the circuit with the reed switch. I'm not sure what else is on that board. i figured it already had a setup to limit current through the reed switch.


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## steve6690 (Apr 29, 2009)

I'm not familiar with that driver (or any drivers from DX or KD), but it looks like there is no in-built switching facility so your reed switch would be acting purely as a means of connecting the battery supply to the driver. This means it's probably going to be passing up to 2.8 amps. According to user comments on DX this driver supplies around 2 amps though, and that's with a freshly charged 7.4 li-ion pack. At this point it's drawing around 1.2 amps from the batteries but as the batteries discharge the current drawn from the battery will increase. You can buy reed switches that will handle that sort of current but you'll need to do your homework before buying.

http://search.digikey.com/scripts/DkSearch/dksus.dll?Detail&name=HE509-ND

If you're set on using a reed switch I'd try something like the one I've linked to which is rated to 3A, or add a relay that can handle the current. Personally, although it's adding another potential failure point, I'd go with a relay for peace of mind because the current involved here is close to the maximum the reed will handle..


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## CBR-runner (Apr 29, 2009)

thanks for the heads up on those reed switches. The light is originally equipped with a reed switch and a circuit. 

Does the reed look like it activates a relay of is it inline with the battery. 

Also i am using 8x C batteries. not sure what the current draw is.


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## steve6690 (Apr 30, 2009)

It's difficult to say whether there is already a relay in the light. You'd need to have a close look at the pcb thats in there already. Either way, you don't know what other circuitry is on the pcb so it is easier to bypass it completely.
By the way, how are you going to limit the drive current to around 1400ma with that driver ?


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## Z-Max (Apr 30, 2009)

Last years I did mod Pelican 4200 (4 C). I use unprotected C 25500 (very bed bettery), 3 Q5 and bFlex (from taskled.com).

My mod still work, but it have problem - overheart. Plastic body cant transfer heart to outside. But on 700 mA it work.

For drive driver  I modded magnetic switch (very good switch) to momentary switch.

























In this year I start new mod of 4200. I go to most famous compaines way.
I place diodes vertilaly on aluminium tube. one side of tube look to outside, and water can cirlul in tube.










I think this heartsink will work.


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## steve6690 (Apr 30, 2009)

That's very clever, watercooling the led sink. How did you seal around the tube ?


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## CBR-runner (Apr 30, 2009)

wow that is a really good idea. Thanks for the info. 

I bet my heat sink would fit in a 4c pelican! 

Also I have no idea how I'm going to limit current. I do most of this by T&A. trial and error that is :twothumbs.


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## Z-Max (May 1, 2009)

Now I use silicon sealant Soudal SILIRUB AQ. 
In furute I want to do heatsink tube with carving and nut from both sides and rubber seal.
In reed switch in pelican transistor inbuild already.
But for driving of bFlex or hipFlex "nude" reed switch may be used too (driving current is very very small).


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## CBR-runner (May 8, 2009)

thanks for the info! i mat trysomething like that with my light. if i use stainless steal or copper i could increase cooling and get the most of the light.

or use it as a cheap battery for a canister light


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## jrolin1 (May 13, 2009)

CBR-runner said:


> thanks for the info! i mat trysomething like that with my light. if i use stainless steal or copper i could increase cooling and get the most of the light.
> 
> or use it as a cheap battery for a canister light



I came across this thread looking to do something similar for a dive light. I notice where you are located, is it for diving the Cooper? I dove the Cooper earlier this week and had light issues which is why I was looking for a good dive solution. I also have a Pelican 4300 which the primary bulb went out and the backup flickered a few times after I changed to it. It is disconcerting at 30+ feet to have the light go out. In the Cooper no light penetrates at that depth. I had a backup light but more light would be better. Keep us updated! I am still trying to figure out what the best solution for me would be for a bright LED dive solution.


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## CBR-runner (May 14, 2009)

yes it is for diving the cooper. 

there is a spot that is 80foot. so you have no amb light for almost 50 foot on the way up. 

hopefully i get my lights up and running soon.


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## CBR-runner (Aug 5, 2009)

well this project has been a horrible failure. 

Now the electronics for the switch don't work, the driver does not fit and I burned myself on the heat sink. :mecry:

BUT... I think I have found a manageable way to get this done otherwise. :candle:

I'm going to use the heat sink and the SSC P7 and a cheap P7 driver form DX (which i bought 5 of on accident sku. 20329 (multi mode) and/or 20330) and 4 or 8 li-ion batteries in a series parallel config to keep the battery voltage <8.4v. 

the test i did on the work bench last night worked pretty well. hopefully it will work in the light when I get the reed switch thing figured out.


EDIT... 

Sooo I had some extra 7135 drivers laying around so I got busy with the soldering iron and made one of those $8 P7 drivers. It works great!!! Now all thats left to do is make a battery pack with some 18650's or some of those 14500's i have laying around, then get the damn reed switch and i'm in business.  

pics to come tomorrow...


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## CBR-runner (Aug 6, 2009)

Well... I lost my camera. :sick2:


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## gcbryan (Oct 28, 2009)

Is there an update?


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## mastou (Mar 29, 2010)

Old thread I know - but I would also like to know if is there an update 

/Magnus


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