# Aspheric [email protected] against Tiablo A8 Q5, MRV Q5 & 2 MCP Spotlight!



## StefanFS (Aug 24, 2007)

CPF user BGater was kind enough to donate an aspheric lens, 50 mm & 35 mm focal length, to the cause. Since then I have been collecting parts and have been experimenting some to get a viable aspheric Mäg. I quickly found out that the SSC P4 + aspheric lens combination is less than optimal. The aspheric lens need the forward projecting CREE emitter to fully come to it's potential. 

This is the result. An aspheric Mäg with CREE Q2 WC, a premium emitter with low vf and max output in it's binning. I filed down the heatsink lip to get it down a bit into the body for correct focal length. No reflector in this light as I found that the reflector introduced horrible artifacts and strange colours in the beam. The driver is the AMC7135 1400 mA kind, with losses from solder points, cables etc. it delivers exactly 1300 mA to the CREE Q2. Output with this setup is an incredible 58 000 Lux in throw at one metre when focussed properly.







At maximum throw focus. 5 metres from the wall. 






I decided to compare it with some other flashlights. All are in the picture below: 
*Number one*, 3D Mäg with CREE Q2, aspheric lens, driven at 1300 mA. 58 000 Lux in throw at one metre with NiMH cells.
*Number two*, 3D Mäg with SSC P4 USOXH and five mode driver with max at 1000 mA. UCL lens. 19 000 Lux in throw at one metre with NiMH cells.
*Number three*, Tiablo A8 with CREE Q5, FluPic driver on burst 1200 mA. 27 000 Lux in throw at one metre. One 18650 LiION cell.
*Number four*, MRV with CREE Q5, FluPic driver on burst 1200 mA. 17 000 Lux in throw at one metre. One 18650 LiION cell.
*Number five*, MRV latest stock version with CREE Q2, stock driver 1190mA. 14 400 Lux in throw at one metre. Two RCR123 LiION cells.
*Number six*, 2 Million Candlepower spotlight. H3 55 Watt bulb driven by one 6 Volt lead battery.












All shots are 8 second exposures, f/2.8, fixed WB. 0 EV. 





































The aspherical Mäg has hysterical throw numbers, it's very focussed. All details have been considered in it's construction (that I can imagine at least). I find it unusable for anything practical since it doesn't have any sidespill/floody part of the beam. It's all throw, period. Please note that this is MY opinion, I'm sure others like their aspherical Mägs very much and use them for a variety of tasks. But it's a fun toy. Thankfully the parts can be reused for an SSC P4/UCL setup.

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*Update 2007-09-04*

*Round two*

On suggestion from user VidPro I decided to use the aspheric Mäg in more confined spaces in the woods with vegetation and trees. The idea is that the aspheric Mäg is more suited for spotting things and you avoid being blinded by spill light bouncing back from trees etc.

I found these two settings in my effort to show how the aspherical Mäg works in real life for me. This time against the 3D Mäg above and my new Tiablo A9 with a FluPic on burst, which had 26980 Lux in throw that evening. All shots are 4 second exposures at f/2.8, which in these settings were very close to what I could see with my bare eyes.












































The aspheric Mäg works well for shining through vegetation and between trees at closer distances. But I don't experience that I would be blinded by reflected spill light from the other lights. I'll keep the aspheric Mäg configuration and will continue trying to improve it. It's usable for distance spotting and careful use in the woods, as long as you don't hit birch trees right in front of you. Then you will be blinded momentarily.



Stefan


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## StefanFS (Aug 24, 2007)

Reserved for updates.


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## LukeA (Aug 24, 2007)

Well that ends that discussion. 

The SSC mag really holds its own better than I would have expected it to, especially considering that the other lights are overdriving their emitters. Building one of those is #3 on my list.


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## Nitro (Aug 24, 2007)

Nice shots Stefan, as usual! 

Imagine that aspherical lens with a Q5. 

I'm also liking that A8-Q5 with 27,000 Lux. That deeper reflector really makes a difference.:thumbsup:


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## lexina (Aug 24, 2007)

Thanks, Stefan! This is the comparison I was waiting for. Interesting that the aspherical Mag has absolutely no spill!


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## Nitro (Aug 24, 2007)

lexina said:


> Thanks, Stefan! This is the comparison I was waiting for. Interesting that the aspherical Mag has absolutely no spill!



If the aspherical Mag had spill it wouldn't have that high of a Lux reading.


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## StefanFS (Aug 24, 2007)

LukeA said:


> Well that ends that discussion.
> 
> The SSC mag really holds its own better than I would have expected it to, especially considering that the other lights are overdriving their emitters. Building one of those is #3 on my list.


 
You got to pay attention to details when you build them. The SSC P4 build I did was meticulous. And also the fact that the Mag reflector is really compatible with SSC and Luxeon emitters. Doesn't hurt to use UCL lenses either. This is at 200 m, of course the aspherical throws farther, but you will have a hard time seeing anything at distances over 200 metres at night without image amplification. Regardless of how well it's lit.
Stefan


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## LukeA (Aug 24, 2007)

StefanFS said:


> All details have been considered in it's construction (that I can imagine at least). I find it unusable for anything practical since it doesn't have any sidespill/floody part of the beam. It's all throw, period. Please note that this is MY opinion, I'm sure others like their aspherical Mägs very much and use them for a variety of tasks. But it's a fun toy. Thankfully the parts can be reused for an SSC P4/UCL setup.
> 
> Stefan



Have you tried screwing the aspheric Mag head down the whole way for flood focus?


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## KrisP (Aug 25, 2007)

LukeA said:


> Have you tried screwing the aspheric Mag head down the whole way for flood focus?


That's what I do... I use my aspherical mainly defocused and it gives a nice even wide beam. Then just focus it up to show off the light sabre effect


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## LukeA (Aug 25, 2007)

KrisP said:


> That's what I do... I use my aspherical mainly defocused and it gives a nice even wide beam. Then just focus it up to show off the light sabre effect



The flood focus is just so much more useful. I mean, you can evenly light up _literally a whole tree_ from ~100ft.


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## StefanFS (Aug 25, 2007)

LukeA said:


> Have you tried screwing the aspheric Mag head down the whole way for flood focus?


 
Yes.


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## thezman (Aug 25, 2007)

In your second pic, the wall shot of the Cree, why is the projected image of the emitter round. I have a aspheric Cree Mag and when I focus it for max throw the projected image is square, just like the emitter itself.
I'm using the PL1072 lens, 52x37mm.


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## VidPro (Aug 25, 2007)

now walk up TO the trees, and shoot all them other lights through and past them.
the ones with the spill (reflectors), will blow light back into the camera so bad, you will have blooming.
the mag (all spot no spill) will shoot through the trees like a laser, lighting only what is in the path of the spot.

use the camera in Auto level, like the human eye is, and the spill will shut down the iris, just like the human eye.
that is where this all spot no spill is really usefull, when the spill gets all over everything your not trying to Spot.

and the mag aspherical, even if its in a lock down configuartion like with the hotlips sinc, still can defocus to a very smooth wide beam, with little doughnut holeing. Its just a PITA to unscrew/screw the head the 4 full turns to change it to flood.
so it IS all spot, when you have it focused that way, but the MAG aspherical defocused twards the led, is still usable as a path light, and when closer to the lens more of the leds light goes out the lens.
on flood the projected fairly smooth beam is covering about 400x more square area or 20X as wide.


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## StefanFS (Aug 25, 2007)

thezman said:


> In your second pic, the wall shot of the Cree, why is the projected image of the emitter round. I have a aspheric Cree Mag and when I focus it for max throw the projected image is square, just like the emitter itself.
> I'm using the PL1072 lens, 52x37mm.


 
The spot is actually a bit square, but you are correct it's close to a circle. I can focus it so the die is projected, but that is not the focus for max throw with my light. With the die shaped spot throw is about half.


VidPro,
And yes, I do know how to turn the head to defocus it for a bigger spot. And the blowback from a focussed narrow throw beam like this doesn't blind you when THAT hits a tree? It sure blinds me just pointing it to the ground.

Stefan


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## VidPro (Aug 25, 2007)

when your trying to see stuff out in the woods, or even across the park here with the trees, the item your trying to SPOT you can see, so you can get the beam to travel THROUGH the bushes or trees to the item, the same path your eyes are using.
but with spill reflectors the whole trees and bushes light up around you.

so ya sure, if you shoot it into the tree, you still get blowback, but if your trying to spot something through the trees with ALL spot, you dont get blowback all around you.

you can even see the effect some in your pictures, see how the ground is all light up like that? yet your way far away spot is barely visable, if everything is really dark, and you dont blow your iris closed with the spill, you can focus your eyes on where the light is hitting, and actually see it. move all that spill up onto the first set of trees, then try and spot something 50+ feet back into the forest, and all that ground light your pic shows (the spill) will be all over the place.
now look at the first pic, the mag asperical, where is the iris closing ambient spill light? hmmmmm.

i donno works for me when we tested all this stuff out in the woods, the mag asperical blew everything away except the Incadescent, because the incadescent actually lights up Nature  and brown trees and deer, and even the green renders better. but the incadecent was out of battery in 28 minutes :-( the mag aspherical still had 6-8 hours to go


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## StefanFS (Aug 25, 2007)

If it's possible I'll try to get some shots tomorrow in among the trees. As you say the aspherical Mag blows everything away when it comes to raw throw, even 2 MCP spotlights.
Stefan


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## VidPro (Aug 25, 2007)

the ???million candlepower lights are great, but they weigh 8 LBS, the mag aspherical even with its clunkey large heavy lens comes in under 2lbs with li-ion cells.
how long is someone going to haul a tank light around :sigh:

and they do have spill, instead of nothing but spot. but when it comes to "nature" the incadescent won even with the spill. it was very dimentional light, not flat and ugly colors like the led. the coloration difference with the incadescent , made things contrasty, gave colors , which provides contrast and all that. but incan suck batteries down, is hard to have levels with it, no runtime, to much weight, cant slow it down easily.

Incadescent in the woods sees in 3D, really, the light reflects off of stuff and the color contrast seperates things, there is no Blue food  and there aint much blue in nature.

and by the way, that Tiablo thing looks great too, i was wondering about that, because if its exceptionally tight spot, and wizz bang newest led.


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## Nitro (Aug 25, 2007)

VidPro said:


> the ???million candlepower lights are great, but they weigh 8 LBS, the mag aspherical even with its clunkey large heavy lens comes in under 2lbs with li-ion cells.
> how long is someone going to haul a tank light around :sigh:
> 
> and they do have spill, instead of nothing but spot. but when it comes to "nature" the incadescent won even with the spill. it was very dimentional light, not flat and ugly colors like the led. the coloration difference with the incadescent , made things contrasty, gave colors , which provides contrast and all that. but incan suck batteries down, is hard to have levels with it, no runtime, to much weight, cant slow it down easily.
> ...


+1



> and by the way, that Tiablo thing looks great too, i was wondering about that, because if its exceptionally tight spot, and wizz bang newest led.


Tiablo A9


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## BGater (Aug 26, 2007)

Wow, I really didnt expect that lens to put out that lux number. I need to get busy and mod my 3D mag with a cree, im a gear head for throw lights. Stefan is right about a reflector causing strange colors and shapes in the beam, its really horrible. Nice work on the Mag mod, glad to see the lens performing well. 

Speaking of throw, I ordered a Tiablo A9 with Q5 today. Now to find a driver that will regulate a single 18650 like the A8. :thumbsup:


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## Nitro (Aug 26, 2007)

BGater said:


> Wow, I really didnt expect that lens to put out that lux number. I need to get busy and mod my 3D mag with a cree, im a gear head for throw lights. Stefan is right about a reflector causing strange colors and shapes in the beam, its really horrible. Nice work on the Mag mod, glad to see the lens performing well.
> 
> Speaking of throw, I ordered a Tiablo A9 with Q5 today. Now to find a driver that will regulate a single 18650 like the A8. :thumbsup:



Tiablo is comming out with an A8 with Q5. It will be shipping in Sep. I would PM Tiablo and tell him you want the A8 with Q5 instead of the A9.


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## AlexGT (Aug 26, 2007)

Thanks for the pics Stefan, nice work! 

Yesterday I finished modding my SSC 1C Li-ion aspherical Mag to use a Q5 emmiter and a flupic, and whoa! does it throw! blows all led and some incandescents away! But I like to defocus it so I have some spill to walk safely, I can't wait until the R's and hopefully the S bins start to show, then I might get rid of my custom incans, aspheric kicks major butt!

AlexGT


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## StefanFS (Sep 4, 2007)

Post # 1 is updated with beamshots in among the trees and ferns.

On suggestion from user VidPro I decided to use the aspheric Mäg in more confined spaces in the woods with vegetation and trees. The idea is that the aspheric Mäg is more suited for spotting things and you avoid being blinded by spill light bouncing back from trees etc. Results are in post # 1.

Stefan


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## Outdoors Fanatic (Sep 4, 2007)

Yet again, we get to see how Aspherical lenses are damn near useless.

Thanks for taking all the time to provide us these awesome beamshots. Great job! That Tiablo A8-Q5 is super sweet. 

Cheers.


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## StefanFS (Sep 4, 2007)

Outdoors Fanatic said:


> Yet again, we get to see how Aspherical lenses are damn near useless.
> 
> Thanks for taking all the time to provide us these awesome beamshots. Great job! That Tiablo A8-Q5 is super sweet.
> 
> Cheers.


 
I love my modded pewter 3D with SSC P4 and UCL lens, it's a photon cannon. And my new Tiablo A9 is lovely, nothing in it's size and class can beat it to my knowledge. The aspherical Mäg is simply amazing when it comes to throw, it's fun to use for long range spotting. But I wouldn't carry only that one in the woods, I'd bring either the Tiablo A8 or my new A9 for the more practical tasks.
Stefan


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## Nitro (Sep 4, 2007)

Great new shots Stefan.

My A8-Q5 shipped today. It will be my new EDT (Everyday Thrower) 

I also have an Aspherical 1C comming. I think the best use for it will be blinding my neighbors. :devil:


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## VidPro (Sep 5, 2007)

thanks Stephan


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## KingGlamis (Sep 5, 2007)

Great shots, thanks. I love outdoor beam shots. A million times better than a white wall.


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## nutz_about_lights (Sep 5, 2007)

KingGlamis said:


> Great shots, thanks. I love outdoor beam shots. A million times better than a white wall.


 
+1 on that. Thanks stephen for those great shots. I like ''real-world'' shots. Looks like the Tiablo and MRV have great spill too.


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## nanotech17 (Sep 12, 2007)

Stefan,which 5 modes 1A driver you use?
Is it from the same alternative vendor?
Can you share us some photo on how you hook up the lead wires or s it presoldered?
I have return all my drivers ( 5 modes 1A) to them because i burned 3 tailcaps !:shakehead


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## Bushman5 (Sep 12, 2007)

maaaan, i would love to blind a junkie on my beat with that setup.....

can i simply put a aspheric lens on a Magcharger?


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## LukeA (Sep 13, 2007)

Bushman5 said:


> maaaan, i would love to blind a junkie on my beat with that setup.....
> 
> can i simply put a aspheric lens on a Magcharger?



Physically yes, functionally no. Not with an incan.


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## Bushman5 (Sep 13, 2007)

LukeA said:


> Physically yes, functionally no. Not with an incan.



got it, someone else PM'ed me and said it only works with a led setup... thanks!


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## Gaffle (Sep 13, 2007)

StefanFS said:


>



Don't cross the streams!!!


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