# EX10 (1xCR123A) and D10 (1xAA) Part 5



## [email protected] (Jul 8, 2008)

Continuation of part 4


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## LargePig (Jul 8, 2008)

I will continue here 

Got my EX10 today. I'm very impressed by the build quality! Very sturdy little light. Seems to be working perfectly :twothumbs


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## djblank87 (Jul 8, 2008)

Still waiting on my D10 to arrive, hopefully today sometime..:shrug:


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## mighty82 (Jul 8, 2008)

alibaba said:


> EDIT: Just noticed, as well, that when you ramp in momentary mode there is no ramping memory.............in fact it doesn't seem to ramp down at all! When you get to max, let go and then try to ramp again it does nothing. Still, I keep it on momentary/min all the time and it's sweet that I can ramp it up quickly to a brighter level without twisting the head or going right to max. I wonder what else it can do!?


No... The ramping works both ways in momentary too. Both the ramping, memory and the shortcuts works exactly the same in momentary mode as they do with the head tight.

Either this light have been released in a lot of different versions, or a lot of people are doing a lot of things wrong :thinking:


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## Flintstone (Jul 8, 2008)

I got mine yesterday and can't say I'm THAT impressed. The click is way to firm - the UI a bit inconsistent and the high-pitched sound it makes drives me crazy.

I'm a bit disappointed especially about that sound it makes...


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## kenzo (Jul 8, 2008)

I get a high pitched sound as well! :0 (after testing it) I think it only happens when my nimh battery runs lowers. Lithium doesnt have sounds yet.


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## mighty82 (Jul 8, 2008)

Mine makes funny noises too with a 14500 battery. But it's low enough that I doesn't notice it most of the time.


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## jbviau (Jul 8, 2008)

Well ok, as long as we're talking about inductor hum, my EX10 is a hummer (running on a Titanium CR123A). I only hear it while ramping at certain points and in low mode.


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## LargePig (Jul 8, 2008)

I can only hear the various inductor noises if I stick it in my ear, but I generally hold lights with my hand so...

I like the firm feel of the piston :shrug:


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## TooSharp (Jul 8, 2008)

Just got my D10 yesterday. It's easily my favorite EDC so far. Can't wait for the clip. Great job Nitecore\4sevens!


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## m16a (Jul 8, 2008)

I just have to say... WOW 5 PART THREAD.... Thats amazing!


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## ruriimasu (Jul 8, 2008)

reach home.. still dont see any D10 waiting for me :mecry:


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## Jarl (Jul 8, 2008)

ruriimasu said:


> reach home.. still dont see any D10 waiting for me :mecry:



I know the feeling... post came this morning, there was a parcel. Turned out it was some brake pads, not a light


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## LargePig (Jul 8, 2008)

Sorry P3D, ebay for you...


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## LED-holic (Jul 8, 2008)

Am I sick? I will have three NiteCore D10's in my collection shortly!!!

:nana::nana:

Had to say goodbye to a few lights in my collection to make room, but the sacrifice is well worth it!!! :kiss::kiss:


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## Coop (Jul 8, 2008)

Received my EX10 (& Zebralight H30 ) today. I like the EX10 a lot! Good size, easy interface and it looks great. Haven't detected any hums so far, so either my hearing is gone or I'm lucky and got a silent unit. The only problem I had with it was that the return of the piston was so slow it made double 'clicking' impossible, but after taking it apart and wiping off most of the lube it was ok. 

Another great little light in my collection. I might just get the D10 too


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## FsTop (Jul 8, 2008)

Last night did a casual run-off between the D10 and a JetBeam Mk. I.B.S. I used both Eneloop and AW 14400.

The IBS' beam is a bit greener and has more color artifacts, while the D10 looks whiter to me. Warning - I'm not particularly good at color.

The hotspot on both is about the same size. The IBS hotspot is brighter and more sharply defined than the D10 - I prefer the fuzzier, less intense, more diffuse D10 hotspot, but the IBS is a bit better thrower.

The IBS beam is a lot ringier than the D10.

The D10 goes a LOT dimmer than the lowest beam on the IBS, even if the D10 is on 14400 and the IBS on Eneloops. This is a really nice feature.

Mine had a jammed-spring issue initially, but works OK after removing/replacing the spring, and cleaning out blue grease that made the button too draggy.

IMHO, the D10 is a high-quality build, a pleasingly smaller physical package and a "better" beam, but I prefer the IBS UI - it just seems more logical to me.

Perhaps I'll find the "perfect" light just before I no longer care...


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## AardvarkSagus (Jul 8, 2008)

LED-holic said:


> Am I sick? I will have three NiteCore D10's in my collection shortly!!!
> 
> :nana::nana:
> 
> Had to say goodbye to a few lights in my collection to make room, but the sacrifice is well worth it!!! :kiss::kiss:



OK for that one I am going to have to ask...Why? What purpose does 3 identical lights hold for you? I'm just curious because though the price point is amazing for such a nice light, one is more than enough to wipe out my pocketbook. I'd be more interested in a variety than identical ones unless I am missing something. :thinking:


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## LED-holic (Jul 8, 2008)

AardvarkSagus said:


> OK for that one I am going to have to ask...Why? What purpose does 3 identical lights hold for you? I'm just curious because though the price point is amazing for such a nice light, one is more than enough to wipe out my pocketbook. I'd be more interested in a variety than identical ones unless I am missing something. :thinking:


Well, just so you know, I've never bought multiple lights before, until the D10.

I bought 3 because of several reasons:

1. To keep a D10 in my travel bag, since I fly frequently, I never want to find myself leaving my EDC D10 at home accidentally and without a bright favorite light. 

2. To loan out the D10 to family or friends who need a super light, and I still have my D10 available to me to use. I don't feel right handing them the NDI or the Jet-1 IBS, because those are much harder to use and they'd get frustrated and not use the lights I loan them. The ND10 will be a no-brainer for them to use once I go over the UI with them.

3. In case I lose or break a D10, I don't want to have to keep waiting for Fenix-Store to get them back in stock. These lights are so popular I suspect it will be a hard item for Fenix-Store to keep in stock. The lights are relatively cheap so I can afford to buy ahead of time and always be ready!!

and finally 4: just cause I love these lights so darn much!! It's just about "the perfect light" for me, and when I find something that's perfect, I will buy several of that perfect thing because I use it and don't want to have to wait to buy it again or have to hunt for the lights if they're discontinued!!!

Yes, I'm a flashaholic and I need help!!!! :help::rock:


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## AardvarkSagus (Jul 8, 2008)

LED-holic said:


> Well, just so you know...



Fair enough. Makes sense, I was just wondering.


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## LED-holic (Jul 8, 2008)

AardvarkSagus said:


> Fair enough. Makes sense, I was just wondering.


You did ask a great question, and I had to rationalize it to myself before I bought multiple D10's.

That must be a sign of addition to flashlights - you rationalize as to why you need multiple lights... LOL...


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## 4EN[sic] (Jul 8, 2008)

*NiteCore EX10 & D10 Smart PD UI Video*

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=irqhuV8Xo_A

I have seen quite a few people with questions about the UI. I saw this youtube video a few days ago and based on the forums and this video, ordered an EX10. Sorry for the hundreds who have seen this, and probably ordered the light and have it already.


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## 9x23 (Jul 8, 2008)

LED-holic said:


> Am I sick? I will have three NiteCore D10's in my collection shortly!!!
> 
> :nana::nana:
> 
> Had to say goodbye to a few lights in my collection to make room, but the sacrifice is well worth it!!! :kiss::kiss:



Nope! Certainly not! 

But then...........I may be biased because I've already got three EX10s and one D10 in hand :lolsign: 

9x23


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## LED-holic (Jul 8, 2008)

9x23 said:


> Nope! Certainly not!
> 
> But then...........I may be biased because I've already got three EX10s and one D10 in hand :lolsign:
> 
> 9x23


Wow, you've got me beat!!!

Very nice!!!


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## 9x23 (Jul 8, 2008)

LED-holic said:


> Wow, you've got me beat!!!
> 
> Very nice!!!



Well, not for long! My intention is to keep an EX10 and D10 and give the rest away to family flashaholics. Who knows, I might even buy a few more when the tritium pistons and clips are released. I've been thinking a having one for modding purposes since there are a few CPF members that already showed how easy the EX10 comes apart.

9x23


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## FEATHERSTONE (Jul 8, 2008)

I have been gone a year, trying to keep from buying lights LOL, come here today, and placed a order for a EX10 LMAO....

I quote Dr Gonzo... I hate to say this, but this place is getting to me. I think I'm getting the fear. LMAO I was not here 10 minutes, 10 minutes and the addiction kicked right back in...


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## shadeone (Jul 8, 2008)

question for 4sevens regarding the tritium pistons...

what are they going to look like? all i keep imagining is a little round dot on the end. its not like there is any room for anything on the sides of the piston...


shade


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## zottel (Jul 8, 2008)

4sevens said:


> Theres a shipment on the way


 So did they get the ramping bug fixed in these?


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## WadeF (Jul 8, 2008)

shadeone said:


> question for 4sevens regarding the tritium pistons...
> 
> what are they going to look like? all i keep imagining is a little round dot on the end. its not like there is any room for anything on the sides of the piston...
> 
> ...


 
Normally you'd see a channel cut into the end of the piston (where your finger presses) and a trit vial expoxied into it so that it is flush with the rest of the button's surface. The vial is usually laid down length wise. So imagine a thin glowing cylinder embedded into the button.


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## mighty82 (Jul 8, 2008)

zottel said:


> So did they get the ramping bug fixed in these?


It's not really a bug. They were aware of it before they released it, and I don't think they are going to change it right away.


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## zottel (Jul 8, 2008)

mighty82 said:


> It's not really a bug. They were aware of it before they released it, and I don't think they are going to change it right away.


Them being aware of this problem doesn't mean it's not a bug. I realize there must have been some reason for shipping the light the way it is and describing the behavior in the manual, but we don't know whether they, e.g. ran out of memory in the microprocessor (in which case it's unlikely to be fixed until they design a new model with a different processor), or they just discovered it after completing the first production run, in which case I would expect the next batches to be fixed... that's why I keep asking about it...


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## LED-holic (Jul 8, 2008)

zottel said:


> Them being aware of this problem doesn't mean it's not a bug. I realize there must have been some reason for shipping the light the way it is and describing the behavior in the manual, but we don't know whether they, e.g. ran out of memory in the microprocessor (in which case it's unlikely to be fixed until they design a new model with a different processor), or they just discovered it after completing the first production run, in which case I would expect the next batches to be fixed... that's why I keep asking about it...


I don't consider it a bug, maybe a design flaw, but not a bug. A bug means it's unintended design.

In all honesty, it's not a deal breaker. I find at times I have to click twice. So what, I'm not that lazy...

Would be nice if they improve on it, but if they don't, no big deal...


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## mighty82 (Jul 8, 2008)

But if the fixed it I would have to buy another one


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## LED-holic (Jul 8, 2008)

mighty82 said:


> But if the fixed it I would have to buy another one


Even not fixed / addressed, I bought 3. 

These lights are *that great.* I find I am able to use my beloved L1D less and less. No disrespect to my L1D, but the ND10 is simply awesome!!!

The more I use the ND10, the more I fall in love with it. :naughty::twothumbs


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## f22shift (Jul 8, 2008)

LED-holic said:


> I don't consider it a bug, maybe a design flaw, but not a bug. ..


 
isn't that the same thing?

i would have to agree it's a bug because it's capable of being fixed(hope so) and it does not serve a function.
i'm sure the marketing dept can spin it as a safety feature. "are you sure you want to ramp" kind of thing  2 presses just in case.

the funny thing is if it didn't have the "shortcuts", it wouldnt have the ramping issue and i'm sure everyone wouldve bought it without the shortcuts and never missed it. good intentions for more bang for the buck for the consumer but no good deed going unpunished. maybe "ambitious but rubbish" as clarkson would say

i wonder if nitecore would recall the circuit or maybe pass the buck ala jetbeam pro style.
to be honest, documenting in the manual doesn't excuse it to me. it's like buying a product that has a feature that works intermittently. a tv remote with dying batteries, flip it around, give it a little shake, it'll work. documenting is more of a we know it has the problem but we're going to release it anyway in my opinion.


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## mighty82 (Jul 8, 2008)

The D10 have grown on me the last days. The only issues that bothers me right now is the icy cold tint and the ringy beam (i'm used to the perfect beam of the LF5XT and my rebel lights). And the ramping "bug" of course. My thumbs are starting to get used to the hard workout.


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## LED-holic (Jul 8, 2008)

f22shift said:


> isn't that the same thing?
> 
> i would have to agree it's a bug because it's capable of being fixed(hope so) and it does not serve a function.
> i'm sure the marketing dept can spin it as a safety feature. "are you sure you want to ramp" kind of thing  2 presses just in case.
> ...


To be honest I think too much is being made of this issue, and it's been beaten to death.

Like I said, it's not a big deal, totally liveable. To do a recall on this issue would be way beyond absurd.

Kind of like kicking a hot model out of your bed because she spilled some bottle water on your pillow. :naughty:


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## LED-holic (Jul 8, 2008)

mighty82 said:


> The D10 have grown on me the last days. The only issues that bothers me right now is the icy cold tint and the ringy beam (i'm used to the perfect beam of the LF5XT and my rebel lights). And the ramping "bug" of course. My thumbs are starting to get used to the hard workout.


I find the tint perfect. My previous L1D "warm" tint now look a sickly yellow compared to the D10. (although I still love you, L1D!!!)

And my thumbs don't hurt too much, unless I keep playing with it excessively. 

Like all wonderful and useful things, you discover the little flaws and you live with them, because the overall benefit is so great. :twothumbs

There will not be a light that is 100% perfect, I predict, ever.


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## mighty82 (Jul 8, 2008)

I'm used to the VERY warm tint of my L1D rebel 100, it's almost like an incan. Even the warm R2 in the LF5XT looked too cold to me first, but I got used to it. Then came the D10 that looks almost blue/purple compared to my L1D. I will have to change the emitter to something warmer. The cold Q5 simply doesn't have good enough colour rendition. Everything looks dull and grey.


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## LED-holic (Jul 8, 2008)

mighty82 said:


> I'm used to the VERY warm tint of my L1D rebel 100, it's almost like an incan. Even the warm R2 in the LF5XT looked too cold to me first, but I got used to it. Then came the D10 that looks almost blue/purple compared to my L1D. I will have to change the emitter to something warmer. The cold Q5 simply doesn't have good enough colour rendition. Everything looks dull and grey.


I find that very interesting. I find the D10's "cold" tint to be more desirable than the sickly yellow tint that the more common incans produce. Definitely a personal preference type of thing.

But that's why no light can ever be perfect.


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## f22shift (Jul 8, 2008)

LED-holic said:


> To be honest I think too much is being made of this issue, and it's been beaten to death.
> 
> Like I said, it's not a big deal, totally liveable. To do a recall on this issue would be way beyond absurd.
> 
> Kind of like kicking a hot model out of your bed because she spilled some bottle water on your pillow. :naughty:


 
yeah i know. based on the poll, the majority is satisfied or see it as a non-issue.


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## Burgess (Jul 9, 2008)

Eatin' more popcorn, whilst reading this new Part 5.



(gee, i'm gettin' kinda' thirsty)

_


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## primox1 (Jul 9, 2008)

Does anyone know if the P1 Fenix holster fits the EX10 nicely? Or can anyone recommend a good holster.

Thanks


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## Beamhead (Jul 9, 2008)

The EX10 fits my P1 holster pretty nicely.


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## Crenshaw (Jul 9, 2008)

i FINALLY paypaled for one, sure i had to sell my NDI, but i gues its worth it 

i might just shoot myself if the Clip and the Trit comes out in a few hours time...

Crenshaw


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## ruriimasu (Jul 9, 2008)

hopefully mine arrives today


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## LED-holic (Jul 9, 2008)

Crenshaw said:


> i FINALLY paypaled for one, sure i had to sell my NDI, but i gues its worth it
> 
> i might just shoot myself if the Clip and the Trit comes out in a few hours time...
> 
> Crenshaw


So what did you get, the ND10 or the EX10?


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## nanotech17 (Jul 9, 2008)

I have waited for 11 torturing days now it's in my hand.
EX10 it is


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## michelkenny (Jul 9, 2008)

I am still patiently waiting for my EX10 to arrive in Canada... It got shipped Monday June 30...


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## Jesseri (Jul 9, 2008)

I received mine EX10 today. I think it's great light, but in my taste the switch is too stiff. Jetbeam MK IBS is somewhat easier to operate. Yes i have cleaned the tube and o-ring and then added few drops deoxit to o-ring and the tube. Fresh out from the box, the light was almost unusable, but deoxit almost cured the problem. 

I haven't tried primaries yet (Now im using AW RCR), but maybe the battery spring is one of the culprits for excessive switch pressure. The switch ring itself doesn't feel stiff at all. 

Other than switch stiffness, it's great light. not maybe the best but great and it have nice quality/price value.


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## mighty82 (Jul 9, 2008)

The spring will get better over time. Either that or my thumbs are getting stronger


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## jbviau (Jul 9, 2008)

Both Nitecore lights seem to have gone MIA overnight...don't see either on Fenix-Store.com or 4sevens.com. Just temporary, I'm sure. Or did I miss the links?


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## 4sevens (Jul 9, 2008)

jbviau said:


> Both Nitecore lights seem to have gone MIA overnight...don't see either on Fenix-Store.com or 4sevens.com. Just temporary, I'm sure. Or did I miss the links?


We're working on the kinks of the new software. Hang in there


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## nitecore (Jul 9, 2008)




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## ruriimasu (Jul 9, 2008)

nanotech17 said:


> I have waited for 11 torturing days now it's in my hand.
> EX10 it is



i am still living in torture :hairpull::sigh:


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## mighty82 (Jul 9, 2008)

4sevens said:


> We're working on the kinks of the new software. Hang in there


Never mind.. :shrug:


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## AardvarkSagus (Jul 9, 2008)

mighty82 said:


> New software too?? I thought he said they just moved some components! And I just sent my LF5XT in for a replacement.. I'll never pre order again :sick2:


I thought he was referring to new software for the site, not the light.


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## mighty82 (Jul 9, 2008)

Ahhh.. My bad Now I see something is different at the "store".


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## Lobo (Jul 9, 2008)

f22shift said:


> yeah i know. based on the poll, the majority is satisfied or see it as a non-issue.


There is a poll?

IMHO it would be an improvement on an allready great light. Who wouldn't want an improvement?


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## THE_dAY (Jul 9, 2008)

4sevens said:


> We're working on the kinks of the new software. Hang in there



Is this the 2.0 software I've been hearing about, hope it has 3G and GPS as well.


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## nanotech17 (Jul 9, 2008)

AardvarkSagus said:


> I thought he was referring to new software for the site, not the light.


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## nanotech17 (Jul 9, 2008)

THE_dAY said:


> Is this the 2.0 software I've been hearing about, hope it has 3G and GPS as well.



:thinking: :laughing:


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## PurpleDrazi (Jul 9, 2008)

I have a question for those using EX10's running AW's protected RCR123's:

It seems when my battery runs down, the light just turns off without any warning. I've tried this a few times to make sure this was happening consistently.

Is this happening with the rest of the EX10/AW RCR123 users?

Does that mean the EX10 doesn't have a low voltage warning?

Should I be changing my batteries more often then?

Francis


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## lerdsu (Jul 9, 2008)

ruriimasu said:


> reach home.. still dont see any D10 waiting for me :mecry:


This happened to me last week. I just assumed that it would be there the next delivery day (Saturday the 5th instead of friday, because of the 4th) Didn't arrive then either. Logged into check only to find that the delivery confirmation said it was delivered on the third. Three days later, endless phone calls to USPS and asking around the apt complex, I'm pretty sure I'm out 60 bucks. 

Lesson learned, buy the insurance with USPS.


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## Crenshaw (Jul 9, 2008)

LED-holic said:


> So what did you get, the ND10 or the EX10?



Ex10..lol, its bigger then the P1D by about 5mm! now thats small...

Crenshaw


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## michelkenny (Jul 9, 2008)

PurpleDrazi said:


> I have a question for those using EX10's running AW's protected RCR123's:
> 
> It seems when my battery runs down, the light just turns off without any warning. I've tried this a few times to make sure this was happening consistently.
> 
> ...



Since you're using protected cells, the light is probably shutting off due to the protection circuit kicking in for the over discharge protection. I don't think this is anything to worry about since this is what the protection circuit is for.

An no, I don't think these lights have low voltage warning like the NDI.


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## StinkyTool (Jul 9, 2008)

Alright, I'm new to the forum! How you doing? Great?! Fantastic! Me? I'm a little aggravated and I'll let you know why if you keep reading.

I needed something to replace my Microlight that met its demise after falling 20ft to a concrete pad whilst it was connected to my keys. I always could appreciate a quality lilght, but I just have never forked out the money for one. So, I've been eavesdropping on this forum for some time now researching for a new EDC light. As everyone knows, it's been, 'EX10 this/ND10 that!' aannnnnnnnd I bit! Ordered on the 3rd. 

While I was reading these forums today I heard the mail lady walk up and cram a package in my mailbox. I knew it was here. I abandoned the forum to check out my first quality light. This is where I tell you that I hate you all. Thanks for the new addiction. I didn't need another hobby, but it's too late. 

I love my light.


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## m16a (Jul 9, 2008)

StinkyTool said:


> Alright, I'm new to the forum! How you doing? Great?! Fantastic! Me? I'm a little aggravated and I'll let you know why if you keep reading.
> 
> I needed something to replace my Microlight that met its demise after falling 20ft to a concrete pad whilst it was connected to my keys. I always could appreciate a quality lilght, but I just have never forked out the money for one. So, I've been eavesdropping on this forum for some time now researching for a new EDC light. As everyone knows, it's been, 'EX10 this/ND10 that!' aannnnnnnnd I bit! Ordered on the 3rd.
> 
> ...




:welcome: stinkytool! Enjoy being addicted. Remember, flashaholism is a healthy addiction get used to visiting this site. Yay for . Its the best feeling a flashaholic can have! Enjoy the amazing flashlight:twothumbs

M16a


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## shadeone (Jul 9, 2008)

StinkyTool said:


> I needed something to replace my Microlight that met its demise after falling 20ft to a concrete pad whilst it was connected to my keys.



holy crap you must be tall. :laughing:

anyways, i know it was mentioned before in one of the hundreds of posts on this thing, but what size glo-rings fit on the D10?

shade


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## Paul6ppca (Jul 9, 2008)

lerdsu said:


> This happened to me last week. I just assumed that it would be there the next delivery day (Saturday the 5th instead of friday, because of the 4th) Didn't arrive then either. Logged into check only to find that the delivery confirmation said it was delivered on the third. Three days later, endless phone calls to USPS and asking around the apt complex, I'm pretty sure I'm out 60 bucks.
> 
> Lesson learned, buy the insurance with USPS.


 
Contact the fenix store.

I had the same thing happen to me,conf # said delivered,but not to my house,waited a few days ,asked neighbors ect.Anyway ,Matt at Fenix sent me another one,as it turns out ,he emailed me and said it is being returned to him, post office listed it as undeliverable address,dont know why my other mail always makes it(and it was listed as delivred) and #2 D10 had no problem finding its way to me.

I went to PO they told me they are way to busy/short staffed/vacations /etc to even try to help me.

Priority mail is worth the extra,Im told its sorted differently.


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## dracodoc (Jul 9, 2008)

I sent an email to Nitecore support yesterday, got response today. Their engineer told me the current software already used 98% of the MCU ROM, which is 1k. So there is little can be done on UI and ramping problem for D10/EX10. Maybe next product can have a bigger MCU. Besides, I heard Liteflux used a 3.5k MCU...


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## jbviau (Jul 9, 2008)

Very interesting, dracodoc. Thanks for taking the initiative.


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## liteMANIAC (Jul 9, 2008)

My NiteCore D10 just arrived:twothumbs (Thanks for the lightening quick delivery 4sevens!!). Overall I am very impressed. It feels like a quality flashlight. The knurling is perfect! I am very happy with the output. I am a bit biased though, my last AA was a fenix l1p. It absolutley blows it out of the water. The tint is complety white, compared to my l1p and lod. It makes them look slightly purple. There are a few minor things I would change, the main one being that it could remember the custom setting, but I must say this is an exceptional light and worth every penny and then some. I can only hope this will surpress my need to buy a new light for a while. Here are some size comparison pictures. I would take beamshots but I can never get them to look quite right. 








The glass lense of the L1p is very dirty. I just pulled it out of my winter jacket. Probably should of cleaned it off before taking the picture, but whatever. 

Patrick


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## 4sevens (Jul 9, 2008)

michelkenny said:


> Since you're using protected cells, the light is probably shutting off due to the protection circuit kicking in for the over discharge protection. I don't think this is anything to worry about since this is what the protection circuit is for.
> An no, I don't think these lights have low voltage warning like the NDI.


Thats exactly whats happening. The protection circuit is protecting the li-ion 
cell. Without it, your expensive li-ion will be like a one-time use primary, giving
you 2-3 cycles instead of the 300-500. 


AardvarkSagus said:


> I thought he was referring to new software for the site, not the light.


Yes, I'm sorry I wasn't clear  We moved all non-fenix lights to www.4sevens.com!
Now we just need a cool store banner. My graphic guy is bogged down with
too many other tasks :wave:


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## carl (Jul 9, 2008)

Is there a micro drain on the battery in OFF position?


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## 4sevens (Jul 9, 2008)

carl said:


> Is there a micro drain on the battery in OFF position?


If you twist the head off (in tactical mode) there is zero current draw.
When the head is twisted tight (in clicky mode) there is a very small current
draw just like all MCU controlled lights with a signal switch to turn on.
I'd suggest if you are planning to store the light for emergencies (i.e. with 10 year
shelf life lithiums) to store them in tactical mode


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## FsTop (Jul 9, 2008)

I must have missed something about the D10. I didn't see it mentioned in the "manual".

The issue is that the UI on this light is critically dependent on battery length. 

With the Eneloops and AW 14400 that I tried it with, there was no UI at all, aside from Off/On.

It wasn't until I randomly unscrewed the head part-way that I realized that to get two stages, there has to be some slack in there for the first stage partial press to work at all.

Unfortunately, that position was about 5/8-3/4 turn on my light, to be comfortable in use, and at that point, there was only about 3/4 of a turn left before head removal - not enough to make me feel secure.

Net is that his light isn't quite the right length internally, or it needs another thread on the barrel or something - it was maybe 1mm too short to work as designed with the two fairly-common-among-CPF brands I used in it.


----------



## mighty82 (Jul 9, 2008)

FsTop said:


> I must have missed something about the D10. I didn't see it mentioned in the "manual".
> 
> The issue is that the UI on this light is critically dependent on battery length.
> 
> ...


I'm using very long ultrafire batteries. I just had to "adjust" the spring a little. Now it works perfectly.


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## MikeG1P315 (Jul 9, 2008)

Hmmm...

Anyone know the size of the o-ring on the EX10 under the lens? I want to upgrade mine to a GID o-ring...

Thanks!


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## NetGod3Com (Jul 9, 2008)

I am new here... I have had my EX10 for about a week and think that it is just brilliant (no pun intended). For the next generation I would love to see an EX20 (2 x CR123a). In my hand, the barrel of the light is a bit short to clear the heel of my palm with my thumb on the piston. A 2 cell version would fix that issue and should nearly double the run time. As I said, I love this light.... just looking to the future.


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## ruriimasu (Jul 9, 2008)

lerdsu said:


> This happened to me last week. I just assumed that it would be there the next delivery day (Saturday the 5th instead of friday, because of the 4th) Didn't arrive then either. Logged into check only to find that the delivery confirmation said it was delivered on the third. Three days later, endless phone calls to USPS and asking around the apt complex, I'm pretty sure I'm out 60 bucks.
> 
> Lesson learned, buy the insurance with USPS.



how do u check whether its delivered? i logged into the fenix-store website but all i could see was it was shipped. no numbers to check :thinking:


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## nanotech17 (Jul 9, 2008)

lerdsu said:


> This happened to me last week. I just assumed that it would be there the next delivery day (Saturday the 5th instead of friday, because of the 4th) Didn't arrive then either. Logged into check only to find that the delivery confirmation said it was delivered on the third. Three days later, endless phone calls to USPS and asking around the apt complex, I'm pretty sure I'm out 60 bucks.
> 
> Lesson learned, buy the insurance with USPS.




sorry to hear that man


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## m16a (Jul 9, 2008)

ruriimasu said:


> how do u check whether its delivered? i logged into the fenix-store website but all i could see was it was shipped. no numbers to check :thinking:




Go to your email you registered at fenix-store with, you should find an email that says something about an order update. In that email, you should find a long string of numbers mentioning something about tracking. If you copy and paste this number, go to the USPS website, enter it into tracking package field, you should be able to track the package. :twothumbs


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## LA OZ (Jul 9, 2008)

Have any one noticed that at the min brightness, the D10 is using PWM. I am pretty sure it is the same with Ex10. Not that it is matter but interesting that current regulation could not go that low with D10. My VB-16 current regulates all the way down to very low brightness.


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## itch808 (Jul 9, 2008)

LA OZ said:


> Have any one noticed that at the min brightness, the D10 is using PWM. I am pretty sure it is the same with Ex10. Not that it is matter but interesting that current regulation could not go that low with D10. My VB-16 current regulates all the way down to very low brightness.



Can anyone confirm this?


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## bakemono 415 (Jul 9, 2008)

mighty82 said:


> I'm using very long ultrafire batteries. I just had to "adjust" the spring a little. Now it works perfectly.



how did you adjust yours? did you cut a coil off?


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## Vikas Sontakke (Jul 9, 2008)

I can not get the modes to work correctly if I leave the head in the "twisty" (momentary) mode. It will randomly go to full high or full low. It works when the head is tightened. On 14500 it only works as twisty. I am now wondering if I need to get it exchanged.

- Vikas


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## ruriimasu (Jul 9, 2008)

4sevens said:


> www.4sevens.com!
> Now we just need a cool store banner. My graphic guy is bogged down with
> too many other tasks :wave:



Hi 4sevens, i enjoyed your lights a lot and knowing you needed a new banner for your new website and how horrible your current banner looked :shakehead: , i took the liberty to create a banner for you. it adds another choice to your selection when your banner guy gives you his artwork 
i'd designed to texts "4sevens.com" with flaming fonts for the obvious reason, and the texts "flashlights and gears" in yellow and outlines only to give the looks of neon bulbs :devil:

hope u like it. its my way of saying thank you :nana:

stored at filefactory

edit: i finally got it uploaded


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## ruriimasu (Jul 9, 2008)

m16a said:


> Go to your email you registered at fenix-store with, you should find an email that says something about an order update. In that email, you should find a long string of numbers mentioning something about tracking. If you copy and paste this number, go to the USPS website, enter it into tracking package field, you should be able to track the package. :twothumbs



hi, the only long numbers i found were for device id and customs declaration. dont see anything about tracking :shrug:


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## weathermaker (Jul 9, 2008)

Just received my EX10 today. Anyone else in Canada get theirs yet? 

Very pleased with it so far...I can't stop playing with it since I found it in the mail earlier this afternoon! It's going to be dark in just over an hour...then the real test can begin!


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## itch808 (Jul 10, 2008)

I just ordered an EX10 :twothumbs

Just wondering if anyone knows if there any issues regarding length of the RCR123s used. For example with the Trustfires (http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.8683) that are 1mm longer than AWs & primaries cause any sort of issues?


----------



## AFAustin (Jul 10, 2008)

NetGod3Com said:


> I am new here... I have had my EX10 for about a week and think that it is just brilliant (no pun intended). For the next generation I would love to see an EX20 (2 x CR123a). In my hand, the barrel of the light is a bit short to clear the heel of my palm with my thumb on the piston. A 2 cell version would fix that issue and should nearly double the run time. As I said, I love this light.... just looking to the future.



Welcome, NetGod3Com. It seems in all the excitement over these nice new toys, we've forgotten to give you a welcome, along with the customary CPF new guy exhortation: "Hang on to your wallet!"

You picked a great light there with the EX10. I am likewise enjoying the heck out of mine (and its brother, a D10). Hope you have a great time here on CPF. :welcome:


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## Marc (Jul 10, 2008)

weathermaker said:


> Just received my EX10 today. Anyone else in Canada get theirs yet?



Still waiting, been shipped on June 27th. Probably on some customs agent's desk.


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## primox1 (Jul 10, 2008)

itch808 said:


> I just ordered an EX10 :twothumbs
> 
> Just wondering if anyone knows if there any issues regarding length of the RCR123s used. For example with the Trustfires (http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.8683) that are 1mm longer than AWs & primaries cause any sort of issues?


 
Based on a few users, it seems that Trustfires will not fit perfectly in the EX10, b/c they are a bit too long. You will only be allowed use it as a twisty.

https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/201861


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## Doug (Jul 10, 2008)

Can you swap the light engine from an EX10 with the one in a D10?


----------



## TooManyGizmos (Jul 10, 2008)

, 4sevens : speaking of *micro drain* .......

If we use too much *Deoxit liquid* in the head of the light for cleaning and lubrication ........( it comes out fast )

Is it possible to cause a *micro drain* of current across all components to drain the battery - or even cause a malfunction of the UI circuits on the circuit board ?




carl said:


> Is there a micro drain on the battery in OFF position?


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## LA OZ (Jul 10, 2008)

I was told that Deoxit liquid is not conductive. Their role is to deoxydising the connector.


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## nanotech17 (Jul 10, 2008)

HI 4sevens,
I like to know about the durability & reliability of the EX10 wrist lanyard clip.
Does it made of steel?
The reason i'm asking is becoz i don't wanna drop my EX10 somewhere else on the ground like what happened to my LF5XT with the SF lanyard with clip.
Lucky for me it drop on my pillow instead and i wonder how could it happened as i 100% sure i clipped it securely.
Some photos ( photobucket is on maintenance )


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## Grumpy (Jul 10, 2008)

I have had the EX10 for a couple of days now.


Does it still maintain the same waterproof standard with the stainless bezel?

Does the oring go directly between the stainless bezel and the lense? 

How long should it run on the newer AW RCR123 protected batteries? I am getting 1 hour on the highest setting. 

Is that what others are getting on the AW rechargeables?

I had the "afterglow" issue at first with mine. It is not doing it now. I read where 7777 said for someone to send their light back for a replacement. Since mine seems to be working correctly now, does it still need sent back?

I put mine in a cup of water and it got moisture inside.

I was doing a runtime test and did not want the light to get to hot.

It did not get enough water in it to hurt it. I simply took it apart and let it dry out.


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## itch808 (Jul 10, 2008)

primox1 said:


> Based on a few users, it seems that Trustfires will not fit perfectly in the EX10, b/c they are a bit too long. You will only be allowed use it as a twisty.
> 
> https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/201861



Thanks!


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## kaichu dento (Jul 10, 2008)

NetGod3Com said:


> I am new here... I have had my EX10 for about a week and think that it is just brilliant (no pun intended). For the next generation I would love to see an EX20 (2 x CR123a). In my hand, the barrel of the light is a bit short to clear the heel of my palm with my thumb on the piston. A 2 cell version would fix that issue and should nearly double the run time. As I said, I love this light.... just looking to the future.


:welcome:


Now go buy a D10; it's just perfect in your hand! :thumbsup:


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## AardvarkSagus (Jul 10, 2008)

4sevens said:


> If you twist the head off (in tactical mode) there is zero current draw.
> When the head is twisted tight (in clicky mode) there is a very small current
> draw just like all MCU controlled lights with a signal switch to turn on.
> I'd suggest if you are planning to store the light for emergencies (i.e. with 10 year
> shelf life lithiums) to store them in tactical mode


The weird thing is, I can actually hear the light ticking when in standby mode. It's an extremely quiet super-rapid ticking that's almost a buzz. I hope that doesn't mean that mine has more current draw than most since I am the only one who has mentioned this.


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## orcinus (Jul 10, 2008)

Grumpy said:


> I put mine in a cup of water and it got moisture inside.



Are you sure it's not condensation?
Was the water cold?


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## Tohuwabohu (Jul 10, 2008)

LA OZ said:


> Have any one noticed that at the min brightness, the D10 is using PWM. I am pretty sure it is the same with Ex10. Not that it is matter but interesting that current regulation could not go that low with D10. My VB-16 current regulates all the way down to very low brightness.



I did some measurements with my EX10, a photodiode and my USB-scope.
My EX10, and I think your D10 too, use PWM on ALL brightness levels.
The PWM frequency is 37kHz, it is not visisble to the naked eye.
What you see at minimum brightness is quite complicated to explain.
To me it looks like interaction/superimposition (sorry, I dont't know if these are the correct words) of PWM- and boost-circuit-signal.
With a fully charged LiIon-cell the driver works in direct mode and PWM is used for the brightness setting.
Could you test if you see the effect you mentioned with a fully charged 14500 in your D10?


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## LA OZ (Jul 10, 2008)

Very interesting. I put a fully charged 14500 (3.96V) and the pwm effect at lowest setting is not noticeable. I followed by replacing it with a partially used 14500 (3.72V) and the pwm is noticeable. I ramped up the brightness and the pwm effect is less noticeable but is still there.


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## amanichen (Jul 10, 2008)

Tohuwabohu said:


> I did some measurements with my EX10, a photodiode and my USB-scope.
> My EX10, and I think your D10 too, use PWM on ALL brightness levels.
> The PWM frequency is 37kHz, it is not visisble to the naked eye.
> What you see at minimum brightness is quite complicated to explain.
> ...


Are you sure it's truly a square wave with PWM and not just a triangle wave?

All boost circuits are essentially function generators, and will show a cycling light output. PWM goes to zero (completely off) but something like a triangle wave will hit a Vmin, and Vmax, but never get to zero. Under certain circumstances I've been able to detect the flicker in the driver on my L2P, even though it's a "current regulated" light, and doesn't use PWM.

PWM instead of triangle wave could have a significant impact on overall light efficiency at anything less than the max output level.


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## 4sevens (Jul 10, 2008)

Grumpy said:


> Does it still maintain the same waterproof standard with the stainless bezel?
> 
> Does the oring go directly between the stainless bezel and the lense?
> 
> ...


Yes, the IPX-8 standard is the same on both models. Even with the stainless bezel.

No, the oring doesn't no go between the bezel and lens. The oring goes between the lens
and reflector. This might be the reason why you're seeing moisture!

1 hour on RCR123A is about right. I know the spec says 80 minutes, but there are normal spec'd variations 
with both the LED and circuit components as well as battery variations. You may just be getting a 
brighter EX10. Just dialing it down slightly and you'll double the runtime.

If you get afterglow, then you'll need to contact us for RMA. Make sure you don't have moisture in
the light too because that could cause it too. If it's not glowing right now, don't worry about it.
If something comes up, just let us know. We're here for the long run and we're here to help 

If you put the light in the water while it's hot, that could be a cause (aside from the oring in the wrong
place). When you put a hot flashlight in water, it rapidly cools causing the air inside to decrease in volume
and cause a wicking action. That could be a possibility. I'm glad you opened it up and let it dry out.


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## Tohuwabohu (Jul 10, 2008)

amanichen said:


> Are you sure it's truly a square wave with PWM and not just a triangle wave?
> 
> All boost circuits are essentially function generators, and will show a cycling light output. PWM goes to zero (completely off) but something like a triangle wave will hit a Vmin, and Vmax, but never get to zero. Under certain circumstances I've been able to detect the flicker in the driver on my L2P, even though it's a "current regulated" light, and doesn't use PWM.
> 
> PWM instead of triangle wave could have a significant impact on overall light efficiency at anything less than the max output level.



It is definitely PWM what I am seeing with a fully charged LiIon cell when the boost converter is not working. It is not completley square, it looks like a capacitor beeing discharged followed by a flat part where the the LED is directly driven in the longer pulses.

I prepared some graphs.

With fully charged RCR123 (>4V)
on max. level, 10 microseconds/div






~90% brightness setting





~50%





~10%





minimum brightness






Maximum level at 100microseconds/div






When the voltage drops the boost converter starts working:
Maximum level





Maximum level some minutes later





Minimum level





Minimum level at 1ms/div







With a 3V LiIon cell (Soshine with diodes)
Maximum level at 100microseconds/div





~50%





Minimum level at 1ms/div


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## Flintstone (Jul 10, 2008)

Is there anyone who has a D10 which is silent? I have atleast 10 LED's here now, and none of them makes as much as a whisper when they're on. The noise is driving me nuts. I will probably get some other light to fill my need for a EDC/AA light that is a bit more reliable if this is a common problem. If it isn't, I will send mine in for a replacement.

On a sidenote I'm getting a bit fed up with all the one-sided wanking about this light (esp. from a few guys). It's not THAT good, it's not that smart (I don't get impressed with ramping lights like some others here - but for me it's like getting a car that has 50 gears when all you need is 5...) - but it is probably better that most of the junk that's been sold for ages (esp. when it comes to single AA lights) - I will agree to that. But everyone who even attempts to put a question across that hints in a negative way seem to get dissed fast by all the fanboys...


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## Beamhead (Jul 10, 2008)

Your tone and calling people fanboys probably won't prevent your getting dissed..........

If you don't like the light, sell it, return it. :shrug:

Oh and my D10 is quiet and my EX10 only beeps mildly when ramping from low.







Flintstone said:


> Is there anyone who has a D10 which is silent? I have atleast 10 LED's here now, and none of them makes as much as a whisper when they're on. The noise is driving me nuts. I will probably get some other light to fill my need for a EDC/AA light that is a bit more reliable if this is a common problem. If it isn't, I will send mine in for a replacement.
> 
> On a sidenote I'm getting a bit fed up with all the one-sided wanking about this light (esp. from a few guys). It's not THAT good, it's not that smart (I don't get impressed with ramping lights like some others here - but for me it's like getting a car that has 50 gears when all you need is 5...) - but it is probably better that most of the junk that's been sold for ages (esp. when it comes to single AA lights) - I will agree to that. But everyone who even attempts to put a question across that hints in a negative way seem to get dissed fast by all the fanboys...


----------



## mchlwise (Jul 10, 2008)

Flintstone said:


> I will probably get some other light to fill my need...



How much do you want for you D10? :naughty:


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## DM51 (Jul 10, 2008)

Flintstone, please take a week off and make a study of Rule #4. You will need to adjust your disrespectful attitude and language prior to your return.


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## primox1 (Jul 10, 2008)

Beamhead said:


> Your tone and calling people fanboys probably won't prevent your getting dissed..........
> 
> If you don't like the light, sell it, return it. :shrug:
> 
> Oh and my D10 is quiet and my EX10 only beeps mildly when ramping from low.


 
My EX10 also makes a low beep during ramping. I can only hear it if the lights next to my ear....so this isnt an issue at all. Wonder why in one model you hear it, and the other you dont.


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## BRAMEL (Jul 10, 2008)

How odd?.......both my D10 and EX10 are silent, not a peep from either.


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## amanichen (Jul 10, 2008)

Tohuwabohu said:


> It is definitely PWM what I am seeing with a fully charged LiIon cell when the boost converter is not working. It is not completley square, it looks like a capacitor beeing discharged followed by a flat part where the the LED is directly driven in the longer pulses.
> 
> I prepared some graphs.
> 
> *(lots of graphs)*


WOW! Thanks for the graphs, they're quite interesting .

What's interesting is that the 50% graph reaches a higher peak voltage than the 90% graph, but at a lower duty cycle. I guess that the capacitor is being charged when the PWM=0, and then discharged when PWM=1.

Perhaps the minimum mode is a very high duty cycle PWM, with the voltage boost turned down? Or maybe the low voltage seen at minimum is a side effect of the high PWM duty cycle not allowing much time for the capacitor to charge in between cycles. This behavior looks to be somewhat consistent with the graphs for 50% and 90% - lower peak voltage, but higher duty cycle.

I wonder what the efficiency map (efficiency vs output) looks like when it's in boost mode. Instead of being like a pure exponential curve, maybe it has a peak in the middle where the combination of the PWM duty cycle and LED efficiency curve create a "sweet spot."

I'm of the philosophy of there's never such a thing as too much light, but I can use a multi-level light to sacrifice brightness for extended runtime, therefore, partial output efficiency is important to me.


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## LawLight (Jul 10, 2008)

Flintstone said:


> Is there anyone who has a D10 which is silent? I have atleast 10 LED's here now, and none of them makes as much as a whisper when they're on. The noise is driving me nuts. I will probably get some other light to fill my need for a EDC/AA light that is a bit more reliable if this is a common problem. If it isn't, I will send mine in for a replacement.
> 
> On a sidenote I'm getting a bit fed up with all the one-sided wanking about this light (esp. from a few guys). It's not THAT good, it's not that smart (I don't get impressed with ramping lights like some others here - but for me it's like getting a car that has 50 gears when all you need is 5...) - but it is probably better that most of the junk that's been sold for ages (esp. when it comes to single AA lights) - I will agree to that. But everyone who even attempts to put a question across that hints in a negative way seem to get dissed fast by all the fanboys...


 
Yes, My D10 is absolutely quiet, and yeah, it is THAT good.

LawLight


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## kaichu dento (Jul 10, 2008)

Yesterday as I was thinking of contacting 7777's about my D10, it showed up!

I see what people are talking about with it requiring a lot of pressure to operate, especially if you want to play with it for a long period of time!


Flintstone said:


> Is there anyone who has a D10 which is silent? I have atleast 10 LED's here now, and none of them makes as much as a whisper when they're on. The noise is driving me nuts. I will probably get some other light to fill my need for a EDC/AA light that is a bit more reliable if this is a common problem. If it isn't, I will send mine in for a replacement.
> 
> On a sidenote I'm getting a bit fed up with all the one-sided wanking about this light (esp. from a few guys). It's not THAT good, it's not that smart (I don't get impressed with ramping lights like some others here - but for me it's like getting a car that has 50 gears when all you need is 5...) - but it is probably better that most of the junk that's been sold for ages (esp. when it comes to single AA lights) - I will agree to that. But everyone who even attempts to put a question across that hints in a negative way seem to get dissed fast by all the fanboys...


I just put mine up to my ear and tried different settings and am a little disappointed, because I can't hear a thing! :laughing:

While I agree about the fact that some posters don't seem to want to hear anything negative about these lights, isn't it a little counter productive to throw a comment like this into the hornet's nest, so to speak?

The only problems I've noticed is the effort it takes to push the button seems a little overkill (maybe there should be a script on the side saying "Strong Button":nana and the MCU seems a little unpredictable. 

I'm trying to get used to the options and it responds differently sometimes to my input, ie. going to min to max one time, then going to ramp mode the next time.

Anyway, I like my D10 and feel confident that if I have any problems with it that Four Sevens will take care of it!

The timing of these lights coming out is really something too. I was just getting ready to buy an NDI when the first rumours started to hit CPF, and now I have a D10 instead, with an EX10 on it's way! :wave:


----------



## liteMANIAC (Jul 10, 2008)

weathermaker said:


> Just received my EX10 today. Anyone else in Canada get theirs yet?


 
Got mine yesterday. It was shipped June 30 by 4sevens.


----------



## Tohuwabohu (Jul 10, 2008)

amanichen said:


> WOW! Thanks for the graphs, they're quite interesting .
> 
> What's interesting is that the 50% graph reaches a higher peak voltage than the 90% graph, but at a lower duty cycle. I guess that the capacitor is being charged when the PWM=0, and then discharged when PWM=1.


That is exactly what I am thinking.



> Perhaps the minimum mode is a very high duty cycle PWM, with the voltage boost turned down? Or maybe the low voltage seen at minimum is a side effect of the high PWM duty cycle not allowing much time for the capacitor to charge in between cycles. This behavior looks to be somewhat consistent with the graphs for 50% and 90% - lower peak voltage, but higher duty cycle.


In minimum setting the pulse is so short that it does not reach the maximum value (or the bandwidth of my photodiode and scope is to low to catch it).

minimum setting at 0.5 microseconds/div





3 of the next brightness levels















> I wonder what the efficiency map (efficiency vs output) looks like when it's in boost mode. Instead of being like a pure exponential curve, maybe it has a peak in the middle where the combination of the PWM duty cycle and LED efficiency curve create a "sweet spot."


Sorry, I can't do that.
I don't even think it't worth looking for that "sweet spot" as it probably is be dependant on the momentary battery voltage. And I see no way to adjust the brighness level to the correct value.


----------



## mighty82 (Jul 10, 2008)

Actually, the D10 DOES make sounds . At least with 14500's. Not with a fresh battery, but when the boost circuit is working. It plays a nice little song while ramping up and down, and sometimes i'm unlucky and stop at a high tone, so I have to ramp a little more to get rid of it. But it doesn't bother me really. It's only noticable in completely quiet surroundings. 

Got a suprise yesterday when I placed tha D10 on a plastic table though. "Bzzzzzzz" was heard by everyone in the room. I guess the surface acted like a speaker for the "vibration". It's the same with the L0D, place it against a wall or something and the sound get's a lot higher. So don't tell me it's completely quiet, cause I got witnesses :nana:

Btw, it suprises me that 4sevens didn't know what he was talking about when he said it didn't use pwm (not that it bothers me, it's just strange). And what's up with the 5 lumens low rating? That's WAY off target


----------



## amanichen (Jul 10, 2008)

Tohuwabohu said:


> Sorry, I can't do that.
> I don't even think it't worth looking for that "sweet spot" as it probably is be dependant on the momentary battery voltage. And I see no way to adjust the brighness level to the correct value.


Haha, no problem. I was mostly thinking out loud, but you make a good point about no way to make the adjustment consitently.

Thanks again for the graphs - they show much more information than we usually ever find out from the drivers in new LED lights.


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## mr.snakeman (Jul 10, 2008)

My D10 is silent with AW´s 14500`S. My EX10 is silent too (am I one of the "Lucky Ones"?)!


----------



## lightsandknives (Jul 10, 2008)

After reading the numerous posts about the newest lights on the block, I had to do the CPF thing and "order both"!

I'll have to say I'm happy with my purchase. Both lights seem to be very well made. The printing is nice, the anodizing is perfect, the knurling is excellent, and neither light makes a sound!! I took each light apart, wiped off any lube I found, and relubed with Radio Shack Lubricating pen. I finally tossed my Nyolube 759G, but have some 760G on the way.

They arrived today and I've been putting them through their paces for some time now....(thumb and forearm hurts). Both lights work just like they're supposed to and I can hit the level I'm looking for 90ish percent of the time. From low to max gets a little sketchy from time to time but other than that, I'm pretty happy. I really wish they had given just a tad more time to get the double click or click-hold done. I believe it's .3 seconds and maybe .4 or .5 would have been a little easier with the stiffness of the pistons.


There is a marked difference in the way the two pistons feel. The D10 piston (with Eneloop) has a relatively short throw, and a bit of a gritty feel to it. Even with the relube, it still feels that way. Not bad, but noticeable. The EX10 (with primary), on the other hand, is smooth as silk, but with a much longer throw. It also feels very snug, even to the point of almost feeling like it's so airtight, it creates a vacuum. It also makes a noise through the entire range of the piston moving. Hard to describe, kinda like metal on metal but very lightly. It works great, just feels totally different than the D10.

Like others (many) have mentioned, I wish the memory would hold your setting even after changing to low or max but it's not a deal breaker. I compared it to my Fenix L1D Q5 and seem to be very similar in performance. 

At this point, I'm still not sure which one is my favorite, so I'm glad I purchased both. I may have to opt for some of AWs 14500s at some time. I have a ton of Eneloops so I'm hoping to get by using those in the D10. I also have a lot of primary 123s I need to use up, as well as the 3 Battery Station RCR123s for the EX10. I'll be using both lights in the next few weeks to see how they really work but so far, I would do the same and order both if I had it to do over again. 

I'm a big fan of a floody lights, especially on low, so you don't get just one little hotspot. I love my CR2 ION on low for it's beautiful floody light for up close work. These lights even have a lower low than my CR2 ION, just not as floody. I really like a low low for night adapted vision and these lights really do have a low output.:thumbsup:

Excellent little lights. Are they perfect, no. Are they headed in the right direction? Yes.

Edit: Someone had posted about cutting the top of a water bottle cap for a diffuser for the D10. I cut one, which is a perfect fit for the D10, and then cut a thin piece of gaffers tape and wrapped it around the edges of the cap to cut the glare when the light is on. Talk about a LOW floody light! This will take over my nightstand spot from my EDC 42XR w/F04 beamshaper for those "get up in the middle of the night" times.


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## Oddjob (Jul 10, 2008)

Maybe I got lucky or maybe I am just accustomed to the PD because of my McGizmo but I find the pistons on my D10 and EX10 to be very smooth and easy to push. Both lights are great and I am not minding the lack of a set primary level as much as I thought I would. My only complaint is the lettering on them is a little bit curved but obviously this is a very minor flaw. Fit and finish are great and so far these are awesome bang for the buck lights. Hopefully these lights will stand up to the the tests we flashaholics will put them through.


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## edc3 (Jul 10, 2008)

lightsandknives said:


> There is a marked difference in the way the two pistons feel. The D10 piston (with Eneloop) has a relatively short throw, and a bit of a gritty feel to it. Even with the relube, it still feels that way. Not bad, but noticeable. The EX10 (with primary), on the other hand, is smooth as silk, but with a much longer throw. It also feels very snug, even to the point of almost feeling like it's so airtight, it creates a vacuum. It also makes a noise through the entire range of the piston moving. Hard to describe, kinda like metal on metal but very lightly. It works great, just feels totally different than the D10.



I've got both light also and I've made the same observations about the feel of the pistons. Mine D10 doesn't feel gritty, but it feels abrupt? I don't know if that's the best way to describe it. I think I like the longer, smoother travel of the EX10, but the D10 is not bad. Either I'm getting used to it, or it's getting broken in, but feels better than when I first got it. In any case, I love both lights. I can't wait to get some R-CR123 to try out in the EX10.


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## Grumpy (Jul 10, 2008)

4sevens said:


> Yes, the IPX-8 standard is the same on both models. Even with the stainless bezel.
> 
> No, the oring doesn't no go between the bezel and lens. The oring goes between the lens
> and reflector. This might be the reason why you're seeing moisture!
> ...




Thanks for the detailed answers to my questions. Very much appreciated.

I like the part where you said " We're here for the long run and we're here to help " 

I have cleaned and re-lubed, tweaked the retaining ring, tweaked the spring in the piston. I will now put the o-ring in the correct place. (That was my fault)

*I really like this light a lot now.*:rock:


I have a Novatac 120P which is a very nice light. But I like this one better because it is smaller and less noticeable in my front pocket. I could buy 3 of these for what the Novatac cost!


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## zossima (Jul 10, 2008)

just received my d10 and I love it.
the piston feels a little gritty though and when I opened up the light I noticed the anodizing has rubbed of at a couple point inside of the light where the piston slides through it. the most noticeable of these marks is about about a half centimeter long and a millimeter wide beginning at the opening of the bottom half of the light. it's pretty much a skid-mark.
is this a problem?


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## LA OZ (Jul 10, 2008)

Tohuwabohu, thank you for the graph but could you summarise it in non technical term ?

For those can't hear the high pitch noise on the D10 and Ex10 may need their hearing check - your high frequency hearing acuity may be the problem.


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## DM51 (Jul 10, 2008)

LA OZ said:


> ... your high frequency hearing acuity may be the problem.


I have exactly this problem with high frequency hearing, but Mrs. DM51 calls it something quite different and much less polite, lol.


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## Grumpy (Jul 10, 2008)

orcinus said:


> Are you sure it's not condensation?
> Was the water cold?



I am pretty sure it was my fault. I think I put the o-ring in wrong. I will put the o-ring in the correct position and recheck with the light off and no battery installed.


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## Oddjob (Jul 10, 2008)

I have pretty good hearing and neither of my lights have any high pitched humming.


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## JohnF (Jul 10, 2008)

OK, my turn for D10 comments...

There is one thing that will keep it from being in my pocket every day - the unpredictability of the ramping action. I cannot live with not knowing if it will take one press or two to change ramping directions, as I don't always remember if I forced low or high last. 
If it is all the way down, it should ramp up, and if all the way up, should ramp down. Or, like the Gladius, it should always change directions regardless of the level it is at. It should be predictable. Period.

That said, the D10 will always be with me camping or walking at night because of the beautiful tint, great beam by any standards - especially a cree, great combination of spot and spill, and rugged feel.

That is my only gripe with this light, othwise it is a brilliant concept and execution.

Mine makes no noise, BTW...

John F
LV, NV


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## litetube (Jul 10, 2008)

*Possible New issue with the NC Smart PD EX10*

I hope this hasnt been discussed already, I cant seem to find it so here is my latest discovery with the EX10

With the head twisted down for constant on and the lite on any level when in candle-mode tapping the butt of the lite, even lightly causes the light to blink off and then on again. BUT 3 times now the light has remained OFF and would not come back on with pressing the piston button. I had to loosen the head up and twist it down tight again and it would come back on in the level it was on before. 
Cant get it to duplicate this shutdown on command but it has happened 3 times now and it always blinks when you tap it on the but end regardless. 

Now is it something I can live with ? I guess but from my own experience with things when something starts happening sporadically it usually means it will continue to get worse and happen more frequently until total failure. I really dont know if I can rely on this light now which sucks because I got all excited about a light with a switching mechanism that was supposed to be more reliable than a clicky with similar operation . How do I know that one of these times after fumbling in the dark with it , it will just refuse to come back on at all? I am using a SF Primary 123 in the light. 
If some of you D10 and EX10 owners can check yours and see if it blinks when you tap the Butt and if you perchance get any failures in the process. 
I really want to like this light but it keeps getting harder and harder.


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## alibaba (Jul 11, 2008)

*Re: Possible New issue with the NC Smart PD EX10*



litetube said:


> I hope this hasnt been discussed already, I cant seem to find it so here is my latest discovery with the EX10
> 
> With the head twisted down for constant on and the lite on any level when in candle-mode tapping the butt of the lite, even lightly causes the light to blink off and then on again. BUT 3 times now the light has remained OFF and would not come back on with pressing the piston button. I had to loosen the head up and twist it down tight again and it would come back on in the level it was on before.
> Cant get it to duplicate this shutdown on command but it has happened 3 times now and it always blinks when you tap it on the but end regardless.
> ...


 



I'll admit to being a bit put off by the switching mechanism myself. As far as I can remember there was no mention of the switch being a two-stage unit prior to it's launch nor is there any info in the user manual to inform the user of the "contact ring"'s abilities. For instance, you can ramp the level and jump to max while in momentary mode by pushing a bit harder and engaging the contact ring's switch and while they do mention that while in momentary mode you can "depress the tailcap" for >.5 sec to go directly to max they don't mention that you have to press harder then you need to just to turn the light on in momentary. They make no mention of ramping in momentary. Part of it is bad translation from whatever eastern language it was written in but fact of the matter is the switch ended up being more complicated than what was advertised (or at least hinted at) before it's release. My D10 does work well and I actually like the extra features that the contact ring allows but I bought the light for a bulletproof switch..........period. Then I read a post quoting Mcgizmo (designer of the PD system) who expressed a concern that Nitecore relies only on the anodizing to electrically insulate the switching components and after repeated use it may begin to short or ground out. Overall, I love my D10 and it works as advertised (actually more than advertised feature wise) but I only hope that NC-4-7's didn't overstate the long-term toughness/reliability of the smart PD's switch design. I don't feel quite confident yet to remove my SF E1B/Z52 twisty from it's EDC place of honor yet............................................


EDIT: forgot the OP's question!  No, my D10 doesn't blink or go out when set down hard in candle mode..........................


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## alibaba (Jul 11, 2008)

sorry, dupe post


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## 4sevens (Jul 11, 2008)

alibaba said:


> ...I'm hoping 4-7's can comment on this because I love my D10 but now I'm just as afraid to turn it on as I am with any clicky...................I can just feel it's lifespan going down by one!


There is absolutely no issue here. If you ever have a specific issue with the
scenario described, I will replace your annodized body with a new part! :lolsign:
What was described required three surfaces to break down. Two of which
has no direct wear. Module to head (which never moves), head to body (yes
the threads wear but minimally with lube), and finally piston to body (which
is primarily contacted by the oring). All three need to break down in order for
this to happen.

An indication of this happen is the inability to twist off when it's on.
This will never happen. (again, if it does from normal wear, I'll set you
up with a new annodized body).

Now, I have some bare aluminum bod parts that I tried using - and essentially
it demostrates that scenario - and it's become an only-clicky light 

No need to worry


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## ruriimasu (Jul 11, 2008)

its still not here :mecry: does everyone have a tracking number for their orders? i checked the fenix-store website under my account and there was only a device id and customs declaration number. or are you guys referring to the order #?


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## primox1 (Jul 11, 2008)

*Re: Possible New issue with the NC Smart PD EX10*

My ex10 does blink when it's set down with some force on a hard surface. A light tap on the tail end doesnt cause anything blinking; its when it TAPS the table...not hard, but just a little force. However, it hasnt shut off on me, just blinks. Im using a Panasonic cr123.

hmmm....reliability of this light might not be as good as we expected.


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## Ritch (Jul 11, 2008)

sorry, wrong post.


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## DM51 (Jul 11, 2008)

*Re: Possible New issue with the NC Smart PD EX10*

litetube, there was no need to start a new thread for this. I'm merging it with the main one.


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## simple (Jul 11, 2008)

4sevens said:


> There is absolutely no issue here. If you ever have a specific issue with the
> scenario described, I will replace your annodized body with a new part! ...


 
Well explained. Excellent job 4Sevens!


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## AardvarkSagus (Jul 11, 2008)

*Re: Possible New issue with the NC Smart PD EX10*

If I'm not mistaken the blinking when tapped down is not a function of the switch at all, but rather a function of the battery weight compressing the spring and breaking contact with the head of the light. It appears to me that this isn't really a reliability issue at all, merely a quirk.


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## jbviau (Jul 11, 2008)

I just tried to get my EX10 to blink while in candle mode, and it wouldn't. Even a forceful tap on a soft or hard surface has no effect. 

litetube and primox1, this sounds like a contact issue. Have you tried adjusting the split ring a bit, i.e. widening the gap in it and/or rotating it 90 degrees? That seems to help in some other cases of irregular function.

EDIT: Ah, right, maybe lengthening the spring under the battery a little would help also.


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## ruriimasu (Jul 11, 2008)

ruriimasu said:


> its still not here :mecry: does everyone have a tracking number for their orders? i checked the fenix-store website under my account and there was only a device id and customs declaration number. or are you guys referring to the order #?



woots! i finally have it in my hand :devil:

i was quite disappointed when the ramping didnt work and the max n min settings gave me problems. the o-ring was not properly placed as well. then i remembered the post about removing the grease off the piston, took it out and it was bone dry!  luckily i bought a container of grease a few days ago. i lubricated the piston with a thin layer of grease, put it back, tried the min n max n rampings up n downs.. it worked great  i am now a proud n happy owner of a D10 (my new EDC) :nana:


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## Paul6ppca (Jul 11, 2008)

For those with ramping issues,I found inconsistencies if the head is loosesened,IE if the logos are lined up ,the button is easier to depress,but less consistent switching than if the head is all the way tightened down.
With it tight it seems to push the control ring more evenly.I am using Aw 14500 ,no nipple.Has anyone else tried to see if the tightness/looseness make a difference for those with switching glitches.
Please post here if it helps.


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## ruriimasu (Jul 11, 2008)

Paul6ppca said:


> For those with ramping issues,I found inconsistencies if the head is loosesened,IE if the logos are lined up ,the button is easier to depress,but less consistent switching than if the head is all the way tightened down.
> With it tight it seems to push the control ring more evenly.I am using Aw 14500 ,no nipple.Has anyone else tried to see if the tightness/looseness make a difference for those with switching glitches.
> Please post here if it helps.



if i lined the logos, i get only momentary light. anyway my light arrived with a dry piston (i'm guessing maybe because people had been complaining about how the grease interrupted with the piston flow and wiping them off, the guys at fenix-store decided not to coat it at all), i lubricated it and everything worked so nicely now. it doesnt have any sound as well :twothumbs


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## m16a (Jul 11, 2008)

The noise my D10 emitted must have been the cry of agony from the circuit at having to boost a wimpy 1.2 volt NiMH. I put my new, freshly charged AW's P14500 and it stopped making noise, and it also got noticeably brighter:twothumbs


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## alibaba (Jul 11, 2008)

4sevens said:


> There is absolutely no issue here. If you ever have a specific issue with the
> scenario described, I will replace your annodized body with a new part! What was described required three surfaces to break down. Two of which
> has no direct wear. Module to head (which never moves), head to body (yes
> the threads wear but minimally with lube), and finally piston to body (which
> ...


 


Thanks man, this light and I just get along so it's good to know that it's going to last and that the WORST case (and still extremely unlikely) is to only lose momentary. Great job on this light!


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## alibaba (Jul 11, 2008)

*Re: Possible New issue with the NC Smart PD EX10*



AardvarkSagus said:


> If I'm not mistaken the blinking when tapped down is not a function of the switch at all, but rather a function of the battery weight compressing the spring and breaking contact with the head of the light. It appears to me that this isn't really a reliability issue at all, merely a quirk.


 


That sounds right to me. I tried to get my D10 to blink by setting it "down" into my palm and if I give it a sharp rap I can get the quick blink effect but it always stays on. Definitely the spring and unless it's really easy to do on yours I wouldn't worry about it. Or like another said just take the spring out of the piston and stretch it just a bit.......................


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## tennisplyr3 (Jul 11, 2008)

light-reviews just posted their review of the d10 here: 

http://www.light-reviews.com/nitecore_d10/


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## Tohuwabohu (Jul 11, 2008)

LA OZ said:


> Tohuwabohu, thank you for the graph but could you summarise it in non technical term ?


That is far more difficult for me than just posting my observations. It is more than 25 years ago that I learned english at school and I dit not have much practice in the meantime.

And there are some other points that make it even more difficult

a) I don't know what boost converter is used in the driver and what boost technology it uses

b) I have only very limited experience with boost converters

c) I only measured the light output, not the current drawn from the battery

d) I did not yet find a secure way to attach wires to the driver board to connect it to my bench power supply. So all my measurements had to be done with a battery with a continuously dropping battery voltage. And because I have the EX10 I can not test the behavior of the driver below appriximately 3V. I know from a short test with my bench power supply that the driver of the EX10 works down to 0.2V and that the lamp can be switched on when the supply voltage is 0.8V or higher. But is very difficult to turn the light on or ramp brighness level by pressing the leads from the PSU against the contacts of the driver.

I am only sure about one point: the driver uses PWM at a frequency of 37kHz. With a fully charged 3.7V LiIon cell the boost circuit is not active and there should be no visible or audible effects.

Everything else can only be something between guesstimate and educated guess.

When the voltage drops or a battery with lower voltage is used the boost circuit is active. The part making the noise is most likely the inductor of the boost circuit. With a NiMH battery the voltage is very much lower than with a LiIon cell. This means that the current drawn from the battery must be very much higher. A higher pulsed current through the inductor could lead to louder audible effects. 

The boost circuit seems to be one of the PFM-type.
The PWM circuit for the brighness setting working at a fixed frequency and the boost converter working at a varying frequency depending on battery voltage and brightness setting can lead to visible or audible effects most likely to be noticed when ramping the brightness.



> For those can't hear the high pitch noise on the D10 and Ex10 may need their hearing check - your high frequency hearing acuity may be the problem.


Or they use a fully charged 3.7 LiIon cell in their light.


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## michelkenny (Jul 11, 2008)

Still waiting for my poor light to make it's way to my address in Canada


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## LED-holic (Jul 11, 2008)

michelkenny said:


> Still waiting for my poor light to make it's way to my address in Canada


hope you get it soon!

It's over a week later since I got my light (D10), and I'm loving it and using it more and more every day still!!

Looking foward to my LF5XT which could be hung up in customs.


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## primox1 (Jul 11, 2008)

AardvarkSagus said:


> If I'm not mistaken the blinking when tapped down is not a function of the switch at all, but rather a function of the battery weight compressing the spring and breaking contact with the head of the light. It appears to me that this isn't really a reliability issue at all, merely a quirk.


 


jbviau said:


> I just tried to get my EX10 to blink while in candle mode, and it wouldn't. Even a forceful tap on a soft or hard surface has no effect.
> 
> litetube and primox1, this sounds like a contact issue. Have you tried adjusting the split ring a bit, i.e. widening the gap in it and/or rotating it 90 degrees? That seems to help in some other cases of irregular function.
> 
> EDIT: Ah, right, maybe lengthening the spring under the battery a little would help also.


 
Good point. The spring did not even occur to me. The head and split ring area is adjusted already, and runs quite smooth. I'll trying lengthening the spring. However, this would make depressing more stiff no?

Thanks BTW


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## Gatsby (Jul 11, 2008)

My LF5 and LF2 both will blink if you set them down to tailstand on a hard surface - loses contact it seems - but has never been a huge issue for me.

As for the D10 ... sigh .... it is so close to the HDS/Novatac in a AA/14500 format that I've been looking for. Very close. It has only one "flaw" in the system and that is the user settable level is forgotten if you click to max or min. Inexplicable. The direct to min = thumbs up. The direct to max = thumbs up. But boy do I wish you could click 2x to go back to the user adjustable mode or click press to go back to the user adjustable mode and have it remember it. Basically just reverse the switch from user to max, back to user. Please please please add this and I'm buying it forthwith!


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## 4sevens (Jul 11, 2008)

Gatsby said:


> My LF5 and LF2 both will blink if you set them down to tailstand on a hard surface - loses contact it seems - but has never been a huge issue for me.
> 
> As for the D10 ... sigh .... it is so close to the HDS/Novatac in a AA/14500 format that I've been looking for. Very close. It has only one "flaw" in the system and that is the user settable level is forgotten if you click to max or min. Inexplicable. The direct to min = thumbs up. The direct to max = thumbs up. But boy do I wish you could click 2x to go back to the user adjustable mode or click press to go back to the user adjustable mode and have it remember it. Basically just reverse the switch from user to max, back to user. Please please please add this and I'm buying it forthwith!


Keep in mind that HDS/Novatac doesn't run on a plain 1xAA.

Also, the SmartPD line are really SINGLE mode lights - with that single mode 
being adjustable. If you view it that way then your'e fine. The SmartPD was
never intended or claimed to replace the arc4/hds/novatacs.

Simplicity is the core design of the SmartPD's from the get go.

View it this way... It's a single mode light that can have it's output adjusted.
However it's 3 lights in one.

1) Clicky
2) Twisty
3) Tactical

There is no other light like it.


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## Dead_Nuts (Jul 11, 2008)

The "lost" program setting is the only complaint I have with my EX10. It is so easy to program a setting that, at first, it seems like it will be no big deal. But I find that I want to go to min or max quite often -- thus losing my "medium" setting altogether. I got my light the first day they were delivered to the public and have EDCed it almost every day since. I still find this loss of setting annoying, but can work around it without even thinking about it. I guess no light is perfect for everyone.


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## Gatsby (Jul 11, 2008)

Thanks 47s! It is helpful to know the design goals behind a light ... I may still pick one up as I really like the design features. I just know that for my EDC in particular I use minimum or low low settings a lot and a medium setting a lot, with max being less critical for me, so it would just be nice to be able to ratchet from low back to something in between. Obviously you can ramp up but the direct leap is awfully practical.

Perhaps another light can feature this? Just keep with the D10 design features rather than the Defender Infinity's tactical bezel look. I LOVE how the D10 looks and the style of it is spot on.


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## Jarl (Jul 11, 2008)

Mine finally arrived today after I wrote it off as lost in the post (pre-ordered and I'm in the UK o.o). First impressions are very positive. I find mine works best with the head snug and little piston travel. Momentary is a bit iffy because I haven't touched the piston with some new lube, so the piston tends to stick leaving the light on for a second or so after I let go of the button. A very impressive light, and has the lowest low of any light I own, so it's going to be the light I grab in the night. Mine makes no noise and I'm only going to run it on ni-mh. Anodizing matches and the knurling is perfect 

Criticisms are that high could be higher, ramping could be faster and the ramping glitch could be sorted. It won't be my EDC because my raw al can disappear far better in my pocket, unlike the D10 which I still notice- I fear I've been spoilt by the raw al in terms of what size an EDC should be!! Definitely a great camping light. Not sure if it's good enough to knock the raw al off the "favourite light" podium. Time will tell


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## jbviau (Jul 11, 2008)

Miscellaneous cosmetic point: After messing with my EX10 for a week or so, the button is now more of a bronze/gold color, unlike the rest of the piston, which is your standard shiny silver color. In other words, the button is now noticeably darker than the rest of the piston. I'm almost 100% positive that it wasn't like this when I got it (just confirmed by looking at some pics in other threads). And no, it doesn't seem to wash or wipe off. Must be some kind of tarnish caused by my caustic skin secretions (eew)! Anyway, what metal is the piston made of? Knowing that would help me figure out how to clean it eventually if I decide I need to.

EDIT: I think 7777 said something about the button being nickel-plated.


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## Jarl (Jul 11, 2008)

In one of the earlier parts, 7777's talks about the how the piston on his sample is (IIRC) al, and will be nickel coated in production lights.


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## BlueBirdTS (Jul 11, 2008)

tennisplyr3 said:


> light-reviews just posted their review of the d10 here:
> 
> http://www.light-reviews.com/nitecore_d10/


Thanks for the link!


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## jbviau (Jul 11, 2008)

Jarl said:


> In one of the earlier parts, 7777's talks about the how the piston on his sample is (IIRC) al, and will be nickel coated in production lights.



Right, but is the whole piston nickel-plated or just the button part? Not too sure. Anyway, I still wonder what's causing the button part to tarnish.


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## litetube (Jul 11, 2008)

Though I have made a cpl "comments" and "observations" on my particular EX10 that may or may not apply to all Ex10s or D10s , let me just say for the price this is a very well made light even with some of the "issues" it has. It is quite obvious there was an effort to bring a new and affordable and quality product to the market here. And 4-7s is definitley one of the 2 BEST dealers I have found on the net for sure and his efforts to bring us the latest greatest in lighting tech is absolutley awesome.

But it still amazes me with the flashlight industry how the same things occur time and again. why is it so consistantly required that we are required to tweak and "fine tune" flashlights to get them to function properly? Stretch the springs,shorten the springs,stick a screwdriver in it and widen the gap,use multiple lubes on different components,tighten the head to this exact point,loosen the head etc. etc. . 
Dont get me wrong , this light is a GREAT deal for the $ the best I have seen and these types of things are often required of lights 3-4 times the price of these lights , Novatac comes to mind but it does amaze me still. 
Can you imagine if you bought an Ipod Touch or a new cell phone and you had to adjust the buttons with a small screwdriver ,open the baterry compartment and bend the contacts just so to get it to turn on reliably and then adjust the hinge of the flip phone so it didnt bind during use?

It seems that if maybe 20-30 of the preproduction units were given to some people to be used for a cpl weeks most if not all of these "issues" could have been avoided from the get go before full production begins?

Oh yeah, Boy do I wish this thing had a pocket clip on it. Cool that one may become available as a retro fit but there is another $10 I would have gladly paid to have it inthe original design in the first place. And I am gonna attempt to find a slightly smaller o-ring for the head cause I have much difficulty using this as a twisty with the stock o-ring it is too big. good for water resistance but impossible to utilize the twisty action single handed and i always seem to need a light when I have only one hand. 

STILL a GREAT value for the dough and I will continue EDCing it


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## Onepotato (Jul 12, 2008)

Rumors are that the next versions will not hum but will sing, and you will be able to select from songs like "You light up my life", "That's the night that the lights went out in Georgia", and "Flashlight".

Have you thought that perhaps the flashlight is afraid of the dark and as the power goes down in the battery or the flashlight is ramped down that the little flashlight hums to itself to ward of the fear of darkness? At least it doesn't start sniveling or wimpering as that would probably serve to unhinge me too.


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## Mostly (Jul 12, 2008)

Onepotato said:


> Rumors are that the next versions will not hum but will sing, and you will be able to select from songs like "You light up my life", "That's the night that the lights went out in Georgia", and "Flashlight".
> 
> Have you thought that perhaps the flashlight is afraid of the dark and as the power goes down in the battery or the flashlight is ramped down that the little flashlight hums to itself to ward of the fear of darkness? At least it doesn't start sniveling or whimpering as that would probably serve to unhinge me too.



You're either a very funny individual or you're delirious from reading all five parts of this thread. Either way, :welcome:


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## HunkaBurninLove (Jul 12, 2008)

Onepotato said:


> Rumors are that the next versions will not hum but will sing, and you will be able to select from songs like "You light up my life", "That's the night that the lights went out in Georgia", and "Flashlight".



Don't forget "Turn on your Heartlight".


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## ruriimasu (Jul 12, 2008)

I cant help but keep playing with my D10 loaded with a half dead alkie AA 
After playing around with it for a day, I agree with guys here that the unpredictable ramping at the min or max could be sorted out. But I do not agree on complaining about the lack of predefined/saved preference settings, reason because the light was design with the goal of NOT having it. So if it was designed not to have it, and us knowing it does not have it but yet buy it, there really should not be poor feedbacks that it lacks the feature. It just is not fair to the D10 and EX10. Thats just what I think.


----------



## SaturnNyne (Jul 12, 2008)

litetube said:


> And I am gonna attempt to find a slightly smaller o-ring for the head cause I have much difficulty using this as a twisty with the stock o-ring it is too big. good for water resistance but impossible to utilize the twisty action single handed and i always seem to need a light when I have only one hand.


I've found with my D10 lubed with nyogel that it's fairly stiff when it's been sitting a while but if I quickly twist it back and forth for a few seconds it loosens up and can be twisted one handed quite easily, at least until it cools off or the lube develops "stiction" again. Hope that helps you a little, at least temporarily.


----------



## AFAustin (Jul 12, 2008)

litetube said:


> And I am gonna attempt to find a slightly smaller o-ring for the head cause I have much difficulty using this as a twisty with the stock o-ring it is too big. good for water resistance but impossible to utilize the twisty action single handed and i always seem to need a light when I have only one hand.



You might also want to try some different lube. I used Nanolube on the heads of my EX10 and D10, and they are both easy and smooth to twist one-handed.


----------



## Philbee (Jul 12, 2008)

AFAustin said:


> You might also want to try some different lube. I used Nanolube on the heads of my EX10 and D10, and they are both easy and smooth to twist one-handed.


 
Same here and yes it does make a big difference, I also used Nanolube on the piston O-ring, the body O-ring, a light coating on the piston and worked in a drop on the brass ring in the head as well as a very light coat on the inside of the head where the brass ring slides. (EX10)
It's now as smooth as silk to operate both the piston and twisty.
Also Nanolubed my NDI which for the first time is now easier to twist but it's still a 2handed effort on that one.


----------



## swxb12 (Jul 12, 2008)

My D10 alongside its new family.


----------



## AFAustin (Jul 12, 2008)

Nice family photo. I hadn't realized how closely the new NCs resemble the JBs in body style till you posted that. And, the EX10 would be even more similar.


----------



## 4sevens (Jul 12, 2008)

AFAustin said:


> Nice family photo. I hadn't realized how closely the new NCs resemble the JBs in body style till you posted that. And, the EX10 would be even more similar.


Also note the improvement in knurling 
One of the objectives in the SPD was knurling improvement. I think that was 
one of the biggest pluses to me 

Theres nothing worse than dropping a new light on concrete. One one hand, 
theres no-one to blame but you, but on the other hand you simply wish there was more grip  

When I use the SPD's in my mouth I use my teeth to grip the tail end where 
there is not knurling which works good, but when my lips wrap around the 
knurling it's a bit uncomfortable but at least it's secure between my teeth


----------



## harada77 (Jul 12, 2008)

Finally I got D10 and EX10... :laughing:
It's really nice!!!
But I have some questions~






This pic from http://www.light-reviews.com






This is mine... 
PCB is different... How about Your's? 






And D10's inside is not clean as EX10... 
Is it normal?


----------



## alibaba (Jul 12, 2008)

4sevens said:


> Also note the improvement in knurling
> One of the objectives in the SPD was knurling improvement. I think that was one of the biggest pluses to me
> Theres nothing worse than dropping a new light on concrete. One one hand,
> theres no-one to blame but you, but on the other hand you simply wish there was more grip


 



I've already dropped my D10 onto concrete from around 6'. The light landed on the tail at aprox. 45' angle and suffered this:
http://img204.imageshack.us/img204/5724/dscf0992xt3.jpg

The light still works fine (as I'd expect it to!) and has suffered it's first of many scars in what will, hopefully, be a long and eventful life!


----------



## mr.snakeman (Jul 12, 2008)

The grooves at the bottom of both the EX10 and the D10 just look like they were put there to give a place to mount pocket clips (hint, hint) (in a good quality hardened Stainless Steel please).


----------



## Beamhead (Jul 12, 2008)

harada77 said:


> Finally I got D10 and EX10... :laughing:
> It's really nice!!!
> But I have some questions~
> 
> ...


 
Where did you purchase yours?


----------



## hubbytuby (Jul 12, 2008)

*NiteCore D10*

Does this light have an on/off clickie or is it just momentary on?


----------



## mr.snakeman (Jul 12, 2008)

Beamhead said:


> Where did you purchase yours?


Yes, please tell us, mine are of the first type and I´ve only had them a week (from FenixStore).


----------



## HKJ (Jul 12, 2008)

*Re: NiteCore D10*



hubbytuby said:


> Does this light have an on/off clickie or is it just momentary on?



That depens .

If your have twisted it off, your has a momentary on push button.

If your twist it on, the button is a click on/off button and when hold down it will change the brightness.


----------



## 4sevens (Jul 12, 2008)

*Re: NiteCore D10*



hubbytuby said:


> Does this light have an on/off clickie or is it just momentary on?


both


----------



## StandardBattery (Jul 12, 2008)

*Re: NiteCore D10*



hubbytuby said:


> Does this light have an on/off clickie or is it just momentary on?


The physical switch is momentary (in both modes). The electronic switch, that is signaled by the physical momentary switch, controls the light and latches-on in 'constant mode' with the downward press of the button as a physical 'forward clicky' would. In momentary mode, the electronic switch/light-output follows the physical switch position (well... mostly... but maybe your've read all that 1/2 press stuff).

Hope that clarifies it.


----------



## AFAustin (Jul 12, 2008)

SS on SS....


----------



## carl (Jul 13, 2008)

this question was brought up before but i couldn't find the answer so:

1) Why does the EX10 have a SS bezel and the D10 doesn't? 
2) Will the D10 eventually have one too?

thanks and sorry if this has already been answered.


----------



## momonbubu (Jul 13, 2008)

carl said:


> this question was brought up before but i couldn't find the answer so:
> 
> 1) Why does the EX10 have a SS bezel and the D10 doesn't?
> 2) Will the D10 eventually have one too?
> ...



Hi Carl.

1. Both ex10 and d10 are using the same AA size reflector (also in NDI), ex 10's body is wider due to the diameter size of cr 123 battery, there is a gap between the diameter of reflector and the body diameter that have to be covered with the ss bezel.


giandi


----------



## harada77 (Jul 13, 2008)

Beamhead said:


> Where did you purchase yours?


I've got mine from 'litemania' south Korean dealer.
It does't have any problem just I want know it's normal~


----------



## Beamhead (Jul 13, 2008)

harada77 said:


> I've got mine from 'litemania' south Korean dealer.
> It does't have any problem just I want know it's normal~


 
You might ask "litemania". :shrug:


----------



## ruriimasu (Jul 13, 2008)

hi.. does AW's unprotected 14500 fit in the D10?


----------



## Jarl (Jul 13, 2008)

Yes.

FWIW my circuit board is the same as the one on lightreviews, and I pre-ordered from fenixstore.


----------



## ruriimasu (Jul 14, 2008)

actually i have a silly question here. will AW's unprotected 14500 cell retain its charge for a long time? or is it like normal NiMH that requires frequent charging, or more like LSD eg eneloops which retains their charge for a long time? would like to clear my doubts before deciding to get eneloops or 14500s for my D10. Thanks


----------



## DM51 (Jul 14, 2008)

ruriimasu said:


> actually i have a silly question here. will AW's unprotected 14500 cell retain its charge for a long time? or is it like normal NiMH that requires frequent charging, or more like LSD eg eneloops which retains their charge for a long time? would like to clear my doubts before deciding to get eneloops or 14500s for my D10. Thanks


Not a silly question at all - it's a good one, and I think quite a few people would like to know.

Li-Ion cells are actually pretty good at retaining their charge. For best results, don't leave them for extended periods at maximum charge (4.20V), or you may experience some loss of capacity. An extended period at minimum charge (less than 3.7V) can damage the cell. 

If you leave them somewhere between 3.8V - 4.1V (40% - 90%) they should hold the charge very well for a year or longer. This means you could charge a Li-Ion cell to say 4.1V and leave it in your light for quite a long time, and still have a very useful amount of charge in it ready for immediate use.

Normally a question like this would best be asked in the Batteries section. More information can be found there, but it was worth answering this one here as it is directly relevant to what people may decide to use in these lights.


----------



## ruriimasu (Jul 14, 2008)

DM51 said:


> Not a silly question at all - it's a good one, and I think quite a few people would like to know.
> 
> Li-Ion cells are actually pretty good at retaining their charge. For best results, don't leave them for extended periods at maximum charge (4.20V), or you may experience some loss of capacity. An extended period at minimum charge (less than 3.7V) can damage the cell.
> 
> ...



hi DM51, thanks for your explanations. it seems quite a hassle to have to keep the li-ion at between 3.8-4.1V. i think i will go with my regular NiMHs 1st while deciding. thanks again


----------



## DM51 (Jul 14, 2008)

It's not really a hassle... just charge the Li-Ion cell, then run the light for a few minutes to take it off maximum capacity.


----------



## Blindasabat (Jul 14, 2008)

It may seem like a hassle, but I have found it a much bigger hassle constantly finding my NiMh are dead from self discharge. Again.

Low self discharge (LSD) NiMh like Eneloops are much better than old NiMh, but Li-Ion are still better, and all batteries have some idiosyncrasies; it is better to go with the ones you know than to not know what is harming your battery life. Ignorance is not bliss.


ruriimasu said:


> hi DM51, thanks for your explanations. it seems quite a hassle to have to keep the li-ion at between 3.8-4.1V. i think i will go with my regular NiMHs 1st while deciding. thanks again


----------



## LED-holic (Jul 14, 2008)

4sevens said:


> Also note the improvement in knurling
> One of the objectives in the SPD was knurling improvement. I think that was
> one of the biggest pluses to me
> ...


The knurling on this light is the best of all the lights I have ever used.

I am now spoiled and find the knurling on my other (non-SPD) lights very disappointing, with the exception of the E01, which also has decent knurling.


----------



## LED-holic (Jul 14, 2008)

alibaba said:


> I've already dropped my D10 onto concrete from around 6'. The light landed on the tail at aprox. 45' angle and suffered this:
> http://img204.imageshack.us/img204/5724/dscf0992xt3.jpg
> 
> The light still works fine (as I'd expect it to!) and has suffered it's first of many scars in what will, hopefully, be a long and eventful life!


Ditto, I dropped mine but it was all my fault - I left it on my lap as I was getting out of the car and it fell to the hard ground and bounced around.

Light still works perfect, but the scars remind me to be a bit more careful if I want to retain the finish. I can't love these lights enough. :thumbsup:


----------



## manoloco (Jul 14, 2008)

good choice on 7075 Al, not only because its harder but because its brittler than 6061, maleability would be a higher weakness for a PD flashlight than a clicky, better for a little piece to be broken than the roundness of the body section beign compromised.


----------



## m16a (Jul 14, 2008)

Attention owners of the Nitecore Smart PD system lights!!

LED-holic and I have started a registry of the lights. Please feel free to post your 5 digit serial code found on the warranty card in the registry found here

Thanks a lot,

M16a


----------



## Aaron (Jul 14, 2008)

*Is the Nitecore D10 as bright as the L2D Q5?*

Does anyone have both the D10 and L2D Q5? I'm tempted by the D10, and if it is as bright or brighter than the L2D Q5, I think I might get it. 

Also, does the D10 have reverse polarity protection?


----------



## carl (Jul 15, 2008)

Giandi
thanks for the info. carl


----------



## JamisonM (Jul 15, 2008)

*Re: Is the Nitecore D10 as bright as the L2D Q5?*

The L2D Q5 is rated at 180lm in turbo and the D10 at 130lm on maximum. I don't have a L2D with a Q5 emitter, but I'll take a wild guess that it's at least as bright as the D10 and will give you twice the runtime, but If size is important the D10 is more appealing. I don't think either light has reverse polarity protection.


----------



## Sir Lightalot (Jul 15, 2008)

*Re: Is the Nitecore D10 as bright as the L2D Q5?*



JamisonM said:


> I don't think either light has reverse polarity protection.



I believe the newer L2ds do.


----------



## youreacrab (Jul 15, 2008)

*Re: Is the Nitecore D10 as bright as the L2D Q5?*

take a look at the new review on light-reviews.com the max lux reading for the D10 on eneloops (1630) is lower than the L2D Q5 (3030) or L1D Q5 (1920) running the same. on eneloops or l91s, the d10 is visibly less bright than the L1D on turbo. it is about the same perceived brightness as the L1DQ5. 

i'm completely happy with my d10 as a total package and don't care if its not the brightest light on the block.




Aaron said:


> Does anyone have both the D10 and L2D Q5? I'm tempted by the D10, and if it is as bright or brighter than the L2D Q5, I think I might get it.
> 
> Also, does the D10 have reverse polarity protection?


----------



## Jarl (Jul 15, 2008)

*Re: Is the Nitecore D10 as bright as the L2D Q5?*

D10 on max is pretty much equivalent to the L2D on high. On turbo, the L2D is brighter.

However, the L2D does have an extra AA, so it's not a completely fair test.


----------



## Zenster (Jul 15, 2008)

*Re: Is the Nitecore D10 as bright as the L2D Q5?*



Jarl said:


> D10 on max is pretty much equivalent to the L2D on high. On turbo, the L2D is brighter.
> 
> However, the L2D does have an extra AA, so it's not a completely fair test.


 
I'll back you up on that. I have my D10 and L2D/Q5 sitting in the same drawer at the desk I'm sitting at, and the D10 on high is visually the same as the L2D on high, while the L2D on Turbo is brighter.

But that's saying a lot for the D10 using just one AA battery, plus, I have only an Alkaline in my D10 and it would be brighter if it were stuffed with a 14500.

But don't let that stop you. The D10, for it's size and simple yet capable UI is a gem. While I won't be letting my L2D go anytime soon, it's the D10 that travels with me as an EDC more often due to it's performance and size.
When I let my dog out in the back yard after dark, I find that the D10 easily lights up the whole back yard. Works for me.


----------



## f22shift (Jul 15, 2008)

*Re: Is the Nitecore D10 as bright as the L2D Q5?*

tested against my l2d q5
it's slightly less than high, more than med
both on nimh


----------



## tpchan (Jul 15, 2008)

Are any other CPF'ers having a problem with their EX10 while trying to use RCR123's ? Some of the RCR123's I have laying around here are slightly taller than a primary 123 and the EX10 is VERY picky about being tightened down to the correct depth. All the way tight when the battery is a little taller and the light refuses to shut off, i.e. it only works as a twisty. Leave the head too loose and the PD only works as a momentary, it will not latch on. I have to play with how far to tighten the head down to get this EX10 to work correctly with some RCR123's. I'm not a very happy camper about this problem.


----------



## 4sevens (Jul 15, 2008)

tpchan said:


> Are any other CPF'ers having a problem with their EX10 while trying to use RCR123's ? Some of the RCR123's I have laying around here are slightly taller than a primary 123 and the EX10 is VERY picky about being tightened down to the correct depth. All the way tight when the battery is a little taller and the light refuses to shut off, i.e. it only works as a twisty. Leave the head too loose and the PD only works as a momentary, it will not latch on. I have to play with how far to tighten the head down to get this EX10 to work correctly with some RCR123's. I'm not a very happy camper about this problem.


Which rcr's are you using? The EX10 was designed around primary cr123a
which have a set size. The rcr's are not standard consumer items and many
have wildly varying tolerances. We've tested them with AW123's and at
least the AW's are within primary cr123a spec dimensions.


----------



## Jarl (Jul 15, 2008)

*Re: Is the Nitecore D10 as bright as the L2D Q5?*



f22shift said:


> tested against my l2d q5
> it's slightly less than high, more than med
> both on nimh



How did you test? ceiling bounce and throw are both are exactly the same (by eye) with my D10 on max and L2D on high, both on NiMH.

Probably LED differences- you got a D10 with a lower bin LED, and an L2D with a higher bin LED.


----------



## Jarl (Jul 15, 2008)

tpchan said:


> I have to play with how far to tighten the head down to get this EX10 to work correctly with some RCR123's. I'm not a very happy camper about this problem.




If there was an international size for RCR's, there wouldn't be a problem. However, there isn't, so to get the most capacity, companies make their RCR's slightly larger. The manufacturer designs around a CR123A because they're all the same size, meaning that some lights (fenix TK10, EX10, etc) won't work with oversized RCR's, like the ones you have. AW RCR's will solve this problem because they're the same size as the CR123A's the light is designed around.

And don't say "well, they should have designed it around an RCR" because then RCR's would get even bigger and before you know it it's nigh identical to a 18650 (which have an OD closer to 19mm, BTW)


----------



## Taboot (Jul 15, 2008)

I couldn't resist. I ordered an EX10 from 4sevens today. Hard to choose between the D10 and the EX10. I have a big box of Duracell 123s, so I opted that way. But a AA light makes a lot of sense too. I'll probably buy both.


----------



## Illumination (Jul 15, 2008)

Taboot said:


> I couldn't resist. I ordered an EX10 from 4sevens today. Hard to choose between the D10 and the EX10. I have a big box of Duracell 123s, so I opted that way. But a AA light makes a lot of sense too. I'll probably buy both.



I went with the D10 because I had a lot of 123 lights. I like the EX10 also - especially the stainless ring. I'll probably buy both also...


----------



## Taboot (Jul 15, 2008)

Illumination said:


> I went with the D10 because I had a lot of 123 lights. I like the EX10 also - especially the stainless ring. I'll probably buy both also...



Yeah, the idea of easy-to-find, cheap batteries is appealing. Also, I think I might like the additional length of the D10. I'll have to see. It's a perfect pair of offerings, because they have enough differences that if you like the one you pick, you will probably buy the other. 

In that way, it reminds me of the upcoming UA2 and UB2.


----------



## Haz (Jul 15, 2008)

very tough choice to choose between the 2. I was hoping the EX10 will be significantly brighter than the D10, even if it meant 30 minute runtime.


----------



## ruriimasu (Jul 15, 2008)

hi 4sevens,

will it be possible to purchase the tool to open up the head of the D10? Would like to change the o-ring to a GITD type


----------



## 4sevens (Jul 15, 2008)

ruriimasu said:


> hi 4sevens,
> will it be possible to purchase the tool to open up the head of the D10? Would like to change the o-ring to a GITD type


I actually haven't done it yet but I saw a thread on it. I don't there there will
be a specific tool for it.


----------



## ruriimasu (Jul 15, 2008)

:mecry:


----------



## michelkenny (Jul 15, 2008)

Anyone from Canada not receive their lights? Mine got shipped June 30, still no sign  I think it might be lost, or someone at the Canada Border Agency is enjoying their new light


----------



## Illumination (Jul 15, 2008)

Taboot said:


> Yeah, the idea of easy-to-find, cheap batteries is appealing. Also, I think I might like the additional length of the D10. I'll have to see. It's a perfect pair of offerings, because they have enough differences that if you like the one you pick, you will probably buy the other.
> 
> In that way, it reminds me of the upcoming UA2 and UB2.



Yep. Buy Both!



Haz said:


> very tough choice to choose between the 2. I was hoping the EX10 will be significantly brighter than the D10, even if it meant 30 minute runtime.



Sorry, but the two are supposed to use the same emitter and regulation...pretty much the same output.


----------



## GregWormald (Jul 16, 2008)

michelkenny said:


> Anyone from Canada not receive their lights? Mine got shipped June 30, still no sign  I think it might be lost, or someone at the Canada Border Agency is enjoying their new light



Mine shipped on the 30th to Australia, and I'm still waiting too. A knife I ordered on July 3rd has already arrived, so I'm hoping the EX10 is still on it's way and not 'lost'.
Greg


----------



## orcinus (Jul 16, 2008)

Mine's stuck somewhere too. Sent on 28th, still not here.
The LF5XT i've ordered shortly after the D10 (sent out on 3rd) has arrived yesterday.

According to USPS, it takes 7-21 days (1-3 weeks) for a 1st class int. shipment to arrive at a destination, so it's still within specs.


----------



## jasonvk77 (Jul 16, 2008)

I'm in Melbourne an i got mine last week.


----------



## kenzo (Jul 16, 2008)

Brisbane. Received 7 July :0


----------



## Saranic (Jul 16, 2008)

Any Chance of a 2 cell CR 123 in the future

Like an EX20


----------



## 4sevens (Jul 16, 2008)

Saranic said:


> Any Chance of a 2 cell CR 123 in the future
> Like an EX20


:naughty:


----------



## DM51 (Jul 16, 2008)

4sevens said:


> :naughty:


Oho!!


----------



## m16a (Jul 16, 2008)

4sevens said:


> :naughty:



Oh come on!!! My wallet doesn't need this!!!:twothumbs


----------



## olrac (Jul 16, 2008)

Howa bout an AX10 (AAA,10440) now that's what I'm talkin bout boooy!:rock::thumbsup:


----------



## olrac (Jul 16, 2008)

Seriously a AAA version would sell like there is no tomorrow. I would be buying them by the boxful as gifts as well


----------



## AardvarkSagus (Jul 16, 2008)

4sevens said:


> :naughty:


Dang! The news keeps coming! This is going to get bumpy people.


----------



## ruriimasu (Jul 16, 2008)

olrac said:


> Howa bout an AX10 (AAA,10440) now that's what I'm talkin bout boooy!:rock::thumbsup:



hmm.. is the PD gonna be pushed down with the pinkie? :thinking:  seriously, stop hurting my wallet!


----------



## 4sevens (Jul 16, 2008)

olrac said:


> Seriously a AAA version would sell like there is no tomorrow. I would be buying them by the boxful as gifts as well


Not true. Would you even hold the AAA light to access the piston?
At that size, it would be mostly used as a twisty. Besides, the AAA doesn't
hold enough energy to make it worth while. We've talked about this and
it's not going to happen


----------



## olrac (Jul 16, 2008)

4sevens said:


> Not true. Would you even hold the AAA light to access the piston?
> At that size, it would be mostly used as a twisty. Besides, the AAA doesn't
> hold enough energy to make it worth while. We've talked about this and
> it's not going to happen



Awww you're no fun at all! :nana:


----------



## Centropolis (Jul 16, 2008)

4sevens said:


> :naughty:



Oh...new product is coming. For me, the one cell version has good enough runtime in most situations. I like it nice and compact.

Now I am just waiting for the clips to be done so that I can order the D10 with a clip!


----------



## Saranic (Jul 16, 2008)

well while I'm on a roll. 

how about an EX20 in Olive Drab, Ti crenlated bezel and Trit in the PD


----------



## olrac (Jul 16, 2008)

Saranic said:


> Any Chance of a 2 cell CR 123 in the future
> 
> Like an EX20



with 18650 capability as well


----------



## kaichu dento (Jul 16, 2008)

Taboot said:


> In that way, it reminds me of the upcoming UA2 and UB2.


What lights are these?


----------



## Saranic (Jul 16, 2008)

kaichu dento said:


> What lights are these?


 
New From SureFire that are in there 2008 catalog

optimus and Invictus


----------



## TooManyGizmos (Jul 16, 2008)

.
I'll take an 18650 style , please.
.


----------



## foxtrot29 (Jul 16, 2008)

Bit the bullet today -- ordered the D10, an AW 14500 and some deoxit. 

Decided on the shipping insurance too... Just for piece of mind -- since I'll already be losing it waiting for this package to arrive. It's addressed to my new home which I move into in exactly one week from the order date. Should be a nice housewarming gift to myself arriving about a week after I move in! 

<sigh> I'm sure I'll love the UI, and will likely end up ordering the EX10 as well... 4 sevens, should I wait for the EX10 with a trit in the piston to come out? Will it be a long wait?! lol...


----------



## josiah (Jul 16, 2008)

Centropolis said:


> Now I am just waiting for the clips to be done so that I can order the D10 with a clip!


 
+1. I don't have an EDC yet besides a DX Fauxton. I'm dearly hoping for a head down pocket clip on the D10, I think it would be my perfect EDC. 

Has 4sevens promised a clip, and if so, ETA? I've searched CPF but there are so many posts on these lights that I haven't found a definitive answer.


----------



## Centropolis (Jul 16, 2008)

josiah said:


> +1. I don't have an EDC yet besides a DX Fauxton. I'm dearly hoping for a head down pocket clip on the D10, I think it would be my perfect EDC.
> 
> Has 4sevens promised a clip, and if so, ETA? I've searched CPF but there are so many posts on these lights that I haven't found a definitive answer.



I think it's soon. Like within a week or two.

I am definitely buying the D10...unless I can find a good used NDI for around the same price which I doubt.


----------



## TooManyGizmos (Jul 16, 2008)

.
I hope Foxtrot29 has a proper charger for that AW 14500 ordered ......

And it may not take 2 weeks to get there.

could be just 5 or 6 days
.


----------



## foxtrot29 (Jul 16, 2008)

TooManyGizmos said:


> .
> I hope Foxtrot29 has a proper charger for that AW 14500 ordered ......
> 
> And it may not take 2 weeks to get there.
> ...



UF(WF/AW/WTF)-139 on order.... If that doesn't work, I can always use a spacer in my DSD... (ie. paper clip, lol)

I've never had anything ship from the USA take less than 10 days... Even if so, the real estate agent lives 2 doors down from the new house and is already checking the mail... :thumbsup:


----------



## 4sevens (Jul 16, 2008)

olrac said:


> Awww you're no fun at all! :nana:


Oh the fun starts at 300pcs minimum plus tooling expenses. If you can get
a list commitment at that level, sure I'll get one done  1000pcs is ideal.
I just don't 1) the practicality of PD AAA light 2) the market demand for it.


josiah said:


> I'm dearly hoping for a head down pocket clip on the D10, I think it would be my perfect EDC.
> 
> Has 4sevens promised a clip, and if so, ETA? I've searched CPF but there are so many posts on these lights that I haven't found a definitive answer.


In the next few weeks 


foxtrot29 said:


> Decided on the shipping insurance too... Just for piece of mind -- since I'll already be losing it waiting for this package to arrive. It's addressed to my new home which I move into in exactly one week from the order date. Should be a nice housewarming gift to myself arriving about a week after I move in!
> 
> <sigh> I'm sure I'll love the UI, and will likely end up ordering the EX10 as well... 4 sevens, should I wait for the EX10 with a trit in the piston to come out? Will it be a long wait?! lol...


Insurance is always a good idea.

The piston with slots will be available in about a month separately as an
accessory.


----------



## foxtrot29 (Jul 16, 2008)

Where's my light? Oh yeah, I just ordered it today. <sigh>


----------



## sappyg (Jul 16, 2008)

no question about it. i'll have a d10 coming my way tomorrow! me likey!


----------



## ruriimasu (Jul 16, 2008)

still deciding whether to get eneloops or li-ions for my D10. with eneloop, can i run the battery flat and not cause any damage to it? with protected li-ion, it will just shut itself down when its voltage gets to around 3.xV right, so i can't make use of the whole capacity (will the usage capacity provide an comparable runtime to eneloop?)? with unprotected li-ion, i can risk damaging the battery if it discharges too much but will have extra runtime if i ever find myself in a situation that needed that extra light? :hairpull: i want lots of runtime, which should i choose?


----------



## Zeige (Jul 17, 2008)

ruriimasu said:


> still deciding whether to get eneloops or li-ions for my D10. with eneloop, can i run the battery flat and not cause any damage to it? with protected li-ion, it will just shut itself down when its voltage gets to around 3.xV right, so i can't make use of the whole capacity (will the usage capacity provide an comparable runtime to eneloop?)? with unprotected li-ion, i can risk damaging the battery if it discharges too much but will have extra runtime if i ever find myself in a situation that needed that extra light? :hairpull: i want lots of runtime, which should i choose?


 
In the spirit of these forums "Buy Both!"
Use the eneloops for every day and put the li-ion in to impress
the eneloops are what i keep in mine and its plenty bright enough with no worries. Oh and the piston is comfortable to work, unlike the unprotected ultrafires i have(need to pick up the AW's). Hope that helped....


----------



## ruriimasu (Jul 17, 2008)

Zeige said:


> In the spirit of these forums "Buy Both!"
> Use the eneloops for every day and put the li-ion in to impress
> the eneloops are what i keep in mine and its plenty bright enough with no worries. Oh and the piston is comfortable to work, unlike the unprotected ultrafires i have(need to pick up the AW's). Hope that helped....



hi Zeige, do you mean the unprotected ultrafires are too long? do you have those unprotected ones by AW and do they fit?


----------



## Stromberg (Jul 17, 2008)

ruriimasu said:


> with eneloop, can i run the battery flat and not cause any damage to it?



I asked basically same questions in this thread:
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/202631

..and the consensus was that in single cell lights like D10 NiMH's shouldn't be very easily overdischarged. Of course if you leave your D10 on @min brightness for several days and leave the cell depleted for long periods you will eventually damage the cell. Just change the cell when you see that the high is not so bright anymore and it should be just fine for the cell.



ruriimasu said:


> i want lots of runtime, which should i choose?



I had this same "dilemma" with my D10 and I decided simply to use my existing Eneloops and ReCyko's (GP's LSD cell). Why? Two reasons: no need to buy yet another charger and cell(s) that can't be used in any other applications. And lots of useful light and no need to worry about light just going out because of protected 14500. And even the "impress influence" is there because not many non-flashaholics have ever seen so much light out of so small package.


----------



## TooManyGizmos (Jul 17, 2008)

..
 ... If trying to choose a battery type  just remember 1 thing....

NiMh rechargeables , and YES ~ even the LSD Eneloops , loose some of their charge each day.

Where-as , Li Ion rechargeables (14500) loose very little after being charged. After 6 months , Li Ion's will have lost nothing in comparison to self discharge of NiMh types.
14500's will also make it a little brighter.

Study the battery forum - and look in the review forum about these lights to see many run-time charts using the diff. battery types.
.


----------



## Stromberg (Jul 17, 2008)

TooManyGizmos said:


> NiMh rechargeables , and YES ~ even the LSD Eneloops , loose some of their charge each day.



This is a fact especially in emergency kit lights but if you use eneloops in EDC light this is hardly an issue. Especially when "some" flashaholics seek the opportunities to use their lights as much as possible.:candle:


----------



## ruriimasu (Jul 17, 2008)

ok.. i will go with eneloop or recyko.. thanks a lot for all your suggestions


----------



## orcinus (Jul 17, 2008)

orcinus said:


> Mine's stuck somewhere too. Sent on 28th, still not here.
> The LF5XT i've ordered shortly after the D10 (sent out on 3rd) has arrived yesterday.
> 
> According to USPS, it takes 7-21 days (1-3 weeks) for a 1st class int. shipment to arrive at a destination, so it's still within specs.



Still nothing...


----------



## ruriimasu (Jul 17, 2008)

orcinus.. i ordered mine on 30th june and got it 11th july.. and i stayed in singapore, so im sure your are receiving yours in these 2 days. hang in there, its definitely worth all the wait


----------



## Zeige (Jul 17, 2008)

ruriimasu said:


> hi Zeige, do you mean the unprotected ultrafires are too long? do you have those unprotected ones by AW and do they fit?


 

Yes, the ultrafires are slighly longer, making it more difficult to operate the piston on mine. I dont have any AW's 14500s to try sorry. The Aw's in my EX10 work great though.


----------



## Taboot (Jul 17, 2008)

I ordered my EX-10 from 4sevens on Tuesday afternoon and got it Thursday afternoon. Works great (once I wiped a bunch of the grease off and removed the rear o-ring). Thanks 4sevens, nice work all around. 

>>Sometimes I do have to perform commands twice to get the desired effect. But it is still a sweet light.


----------



## skyline_man (Jul 17, 2008)

*Nitecore EX10 - such an overhyped light!*

So after reading all the posts regarding the new EX10 and seeing all the wonderful complements people are giving this light, i decided to get myself one. What a disappointment! Why? 
1) It's too short and too thin. Very hard to operate if you have medium to big hands
2) Cannot use the cigar hold technique on it because the body is just straight with no curves or protrusions for your fingers to hook onto and the button is so fricken firm to press, even after i have cleaned it!
3) Did i mention that the button is too firm?
4) My thumb is sore after pressing the button for like 30 or so times.
5) Beam is too ringy, but then that's what happens when you've been using the Novatac 120P for a while and come back to using a cree LED light.
6) Feels too light....Maybe cos im used to the solid feel of my 120P
7) You're saved output is lost when you change to low or high.

Overall, a disappointment. This light is a joke compared with my 120P. Fenix store priced it correctly. Anymore, and it would be a ripp off.
120P is still the best EDC.


----------



## stitch_paradox (Jul 17, 2008)

*Re: Nitecore EX10 - such an overhyped light!*

wow this is a first time you're disappointed with a light not made in the US. Send it to me that I may be disappointed too. :nana:


----------



## skyline_man (Jul 17, 2008)

*Re: Nitecore EX10 - such an overhyped light!*

Sure, i'll sell it to you for 50 bucks


----------



## LED-holic (Jul 17, 2008)

*Re: Nitecore EX10 - such an overhyped light!*

When did you get the light? How long have you been using it?

If it's not for you, too bad. 

I can guarantee there will never be a light that will satisfy 100% of the people 100% of the time.




skyline_man said:


> So after reading all the posts regarding the new EX10 and seeing all the wonderful complements people are giving this light, i decided to get myself one. What a disappointment! Why?
> 1) It's too short and too thin. Very hard to operate if you have medium to big hands


did you not know the dimensions of the light before you bought it, or seen the pictures of it?




> 2) Cannot use the cigar hold technique on it because the body is just straight with no curves or protrusions for your fingers to hook onto and the button is so fricken firm to press, even after i have cleaned it!


I can't speak for the EX10, but the D10 cigar hold technique is perfect. Even better than most other lights I've tried this on. The knurling helps the hold perfectly, and the button is not too firm. If the button is too firm for you, try to clean it and re-lube to see if helps.




> 3) Did i mention that the button is too firm?


have you seen the other 50 posts about button being too firm out of the box, and the suggestions to clean and re-lube, which helped almost everyone who had this complaint? For the record I have not had to touch my D10, whose button is perfect. Some people might not like it, but that's to be expected. You can't satisfy 100% of the people.



> 4) My thumb is sore after pressing the button for like 30 or so times.


the spring softens and the pressure gets much easier after using it for a while. It's a break-in type of thing. My button was firm in the beginning, but still very usable. Now it's perfect. Like a pair of shoes, sometimes a break-in will help very much.


> 5) Beam is too ringy, but then that's what happens when you've been using the Novatac 120P for a while and come back to using a cree LED light.


Did you not see the beam shots prior to buying this light? It is what it is. No better or worse than most other lights I've used, like the Fenix L1D / L2D, Jet-1 IBS, etc.


> 6) Feels too light....Maybe cos im used to the solid feel of my 120P


um...okay, add some lead tape or something to it, I guess....


> 7) You're saved output is lost when you change to low or high.


again, this was noted since the beginning, and this is a surprise to you, because....?????? :shrug: As stated by 4Sevens several times, this is intended this way intentionally. I find it to be no problem because ramping is so easy.



> Overall, a disappointment. This light is a joke compared with my 120P. Fenix store priced it correctly. Anymore, and it would be a ripp off.
> 120P is still the best EDC.


um... so you don't like it, too bad. But to call it a joke is trolling... 

Come on now, was there a need to really bash the light based upon unfounded complaints like this?? :thinking:


----------



## Thujone (Jul 17, 2008)

*Re: Nitecore EX10 - such an overhyped light!*



> 1) It's too short and too thin. Very hard to operate if you have medium to big hands



*I can palm a mens basketball, I do not have any difficulties operating this torch.
*


> 2) Cannot use the cigar hold technique on it because the body is just straight with no curves or protrusions for your fingers to hook onto and the button is so fricken firm to press, even after i have cleaned it!


*

Funny, cigar grip is the only way I use this light while in momentary mode. The deep knurling makes it very easy to do so imo. Also remove the piston and lube the o-ring, this will cut the pressure required in half or more with a decent lube.*



> 3) Did i mention that the button is too firm?



*Yes, see comment above.*



> 4) My thumb is sore after pressing the button for like 30 or so times.



*Sometimes working a muscle group in the first time for along time will result in fatigue. I recommend a respit until you heal.. lol*



> 5) Beam is too ringy, but then that's what happens when you've been using the Novatac 120P for a while and come back to using a cree LED light.



*My EX10 is perfectly ringless from all distances except approximately 3-7' where there is a hint of a dark cree ring. Guess I got lucky.*



> 6) Feels too light....Maybe cos im used to the solid feel of my 120P


*
I love the feel of my 120p as well. But I do not feel that the mass of the EX10 is alarmingly low.*



> 7) You're saved output is lost when you change to low or high.



*Try thinking of this light as a single level light, where the level is programmable and there are shortcuts to min and max.*



> Overall, a disappointment. This light is a joke compared with my 120P. Fenix store priced it correctly. Anymore, and it would be a ripp off.
> 120P is still the best EDC.



*Harsh in a serious way. Between the two I feel they are both great values. Meaning I do feel the 120P is worth 3 times the cost of the EX10, but I also feel the EX10 is a great value at $55.... I would also have been ok with paying up to about $70 for it. As for the 120P for EDC it simply depends on how ok you are with the additional volume and mass... For me I always pocket carry and some pants the 120p simply does not work in.*


----------



## Bullzeyebill (Jul 17, 2008)

*Re: Nitecore EX10 - such an overhyped light!*

I drive myself crazy researching a light before I buy it. Hours of study, but worth it.

Bill


----------



## LED-holic (Jul 17, 2008)

*Re: Nitecore EX10 - such an overhyped light!*



Bullzeyebill said:


> I drive myself crazy researching a light before I buy it. Hours of study, but worth it.
> 
> Bill


Yep, tons of data available about these lights. No reason for anyone to be surprised like the OP like he appears to be in this negative thread.

It's like me buying a AAA light and complaining that it doesn't last as long as a 18650 light.


----------



## LED-holic (Jul 17, 2008)

Taboot said:


> I ordered my EX-10 from 4sevens on Tuesday afternoon and got it Thursday afternoon. Works great (once I wiped a bunch of the grease off and removed the rear o-ring). Thanks 4sevens, nice work all around.
> 
> >>Sometimes I do have to perform commands twice to get the desired effect. But it is still a sweet light.


Congrats. You'll find within time you'll be able to get the desired effect virtually every time once you get used to it.

I love these lights. Worth far more than what I paid for.


----------



## adamlau (Jul 17, 2008)

*Re: Nitecore EX10 - such an overhyped light!*

I am likely the opposite. If a light fits my needs, I will buy it w/o much thought and give it away if it does not meet expectations.


----------



## Oddjob (Jul 17, 2008)

*Re: Nitecore EX10 - such an overhyped light!*

Hype should not be heeded. I like to look at the objective and I take the subjective with a grain of salt. Both my D10 and EX10 have shortcomings but I expected them and even though they are not as good as some of my other lights I was not expecting them to be.


----------



## gunga (Jul 17, 2008)

*Re: Nitecore EX10 - such an overhyped light!*

I agree with many of the posts here. I thought the light was too stiff etc at the beginning. After re-lubing and "testing" for an extended period, the button has softened andfeels excellent. I like the shorter travel D10 even more.

Cigar grip is not bad due to the great knurling. It's one of few lights I feel confortable using with o-rings for grip. It would be nice to have a cut out somewhere, but I'm not unhappy the way it is.

The light IS overhyped, but it is also a pretty nice light. I've grown to like it a lot after tinkering for a while. Like the SS bezel too.

I also like the smaller size for EDC, much smaller than a Novatac (which I also own).

TO each his own, but the tone of the first post is almost trollish...


----------



## LED-holic (Jul 17, 2008)

*Re: Nitecore EX10 - such an overhyped light!*



Oddjob said:


> Hype should not be heeded. I like to look at the objective and I take the subjective with a grain of salt. Both my D10 and EX10 have shortcomings but I expected them and even though they are not as good as some of my other lights I was not expecting them to be.


I'm curious what other lights you consider superior to the D10/EX10. I think this is a valid discussion, but then one also needs to take in account the cost of the other lights, etc.

Personally, for me, the D10 is superior to most other lights I've used, which all fall under less than $100. I ordered the D10 with very little expectations, and dis-regarded the hype. But the light blew me away with the feel, UI, and size. I loved it out of the box, and it's grown on me even more as I use it each day.


----------



## LED-holic (Jul 17, 2008)

*Re: Nitecore EX10 - such an overhyped light!*



gunga said:


> I agree with many of the posts here. I thought the light was too stiff etc at the beginning. After re-lubing and "testing" for an extended period, the button has softened andfeels excellent. I like the shorter travel D10 even more.
> 
> Cigar grip is not bad due to the great knurling. It's one of few lights I feel confortable using with o-rings for grip. It would be nice to have a cut out somewhere, but I'm not unhappy the way it is.
> 
> ...


No doubt about it, the post is trollish and unfair. He called the light a joke and a rip-off. What a disgraceful behavior. This light definitely does not deserve this type of trashing.

The OP is comparing a $189 light to a $55 light. What kind of fairness / objectivity was displayed in his post, really? None, imho.


----------



## gunga (Jul 17, 2008)

*Re: Nitecore EX10 - such an overhyped light!*

Edited since I'm off topic...

:devil:


----------



## tennisplyr3 (Jul 17, 2008)

*Re: Nitecore EX10 - such an overhyped light!*

Edited. Topics were combined with larger topic, and comment no longer pertains.


----------



## LED-holic (Jul 17, 2008)

*Re: Nitecore EX10 - such an overhyped light!*



tennisplyr3 said:


> Can a mod lock this thread? OP is trolling, and it's getting off-topic.


+1


----------



## rizky_p (Jul 17, 2008)

*Re: Nitecore EX10 - such an overhyped light!*



adamlau said:


> I am likely the opposite. If a light fits my needs, I will buy it w/o much thought and give it away if it does not meet expectations.



does your PH50 meet your expectation?   i am happy to find a home for it if it doesnt


----------



## half-watt (Jul 17, 2008)

*Re: Nitecore EX10 - such an overhyped light!*

i re-lubed my EX10 w/o too much success. tried a NyoGel on the o-ring w/o much success. then added some NanoLube to the piston. none to very little improvement. 

just as an experiment, i removed the piston o-ring (yeah, i know, fluid ingress danger - it was an experiment to try to isolate the primary cause of the piston sticking). much, much better once the piston begins to move. however, the initial press is still tough. apparently the portion of the piston protruding through the body of the light binds up in some fashion on the opening of the light and requires, relatively speaking, a lot of force to free it, after which the piston moves much more easily. the "binding" is still there w/o a battery in the piston, hence the spring is not the primary cause of the resistance to movement.

when the o-ring is replaced and a cell is installed, the main downside to this "binding" is that a very rapid double-click gesture for MIN, or the click-press(and hold) gesture for MAX is a bit difficult to perform.

i like the EX10 a lot, and so am willing to live w/it. besides, it gives me the opportunity build up some thumb strength!!


----------



## Jarl (Jul 17, 2008)

*Re: Nitecore EX10 - such an overhyped light!*

You're complaining because it's too small and light.

First for everything....


----------



## Thujone (Jul 17, 2008)

*Re: Nitecore EX10 - such an overhyped light!*

It is a bit more involved but you can also remove the LE and clean/lube with deoxit


----------



## Flintstone (Jul 17, 2008)

*Re: Nitecore EX10 - such an overhyped light!*

I've found that removing the inner O-ring, as well as ignoring the "instant low" and "instant high" modes exist, my D10 is a great deal more usable. Still use my E01 and RC-N3 a bit more though, due to the fantastic size of the E01 and great tactical switch on the RC-N3.

The D10 costing really small change (less than a pizza) is still good value though.


(edit: E10 = D10 - sorry!)


----------



## Jarl (Jul 17, 2008)

*Re: Nitecore EX10 - such an overhyped light!*

D10, not E10, unless you're trying to confuse everyone, in which case, carry on


----------



## jag-engr (Jul 17, 2008)

4sevens said:


> The piston with slots will be available in about a month separately as an
> accessory.


 
A month?!

Just kidding - I'd say that's pretty good time considering that you've just launched two new, original flashlights.

Do you have an estimated cost on the tritium slot pistons? Will they include the tritium vial, or will that have to be added seperately?

Please let us know - I'm really enjoying my EX10.

Any chance that the EX10 will come out with a different kind of emitter (I'd love a Rebel if they ever get their QC issues straightened out)?


----------



## kaichu dento (Jul 17, 2008)

LED-holic said:


> Congrats. You'll find within time you'll be able to get the desired effect virtually every time once you get used to it.
> 
> I love these lights. Worth far more than what I paid for.


+1

I had problems getting my D10 to operate consistently when I first got it but it didn't take long to realize I needed to push just a little faster and to make sure I pushed down far enough to ensure contact.

It's been a week since I got mine and I have to admit... I still play with it every chance I get! :twothumbs


----------



## half-watt (Jul 17, 2008)

*Re: Nitecore EX10 - such an overhyped light!*



Jarl said:


> You're complaining because it's too small and light.
> 
> First for everything....



i'm sorry; you have me confused now. are you intending to reply to me? b/c that is what you've done (just check in Hybrid or Threaded mode and you'll see that you replied to my Post and not OP's Post). i never made any complaint about the EX10 being too small and light. you must have me confused w/someone else (like maybe the OP?). 

no problem is you just messed up in your possible rush to reply. however, if you intended your reply to be for me, i truly have no clue what you're intending. care to explain, please?


----------



## half-watt (Jul 17, 2008)

*Re: Nitecore EX10 - such an overhyped light!*



Thujone said:


> It is a bit more involved but you can also remove the LE and clean/lube with deoxit



since you replied to me, i assume that you're trying to tell me that by cleaning and removing the light emitter that the piston base will no longer bind in the opening of the body through which it protrudes. i really can't understand how that would help. could you please elaborate and enlighten this ignorant old man, please? many thanks. pj aka half-watt


----------



## LED-holic (Jul 17, 2008)

*Re: Nitecore EX10 - such an overhyped light!*



half-watt said:


> i'm sorry; you have me confused now. are you intending to reply to me? b/c that is what you've done (just check in Hybrid or Threaded mode and you'll see that you replied to my Post and not OP's Post). i never made any complaint about the EX10 being too small and light. you must have me confused w/someone else (like maybe the OP?).
> 
> no problem is you just messed up in your possible rush to reply. however, if you intended your reply to be for me, i truly have no clue what you're intending. care to explain, please?


No he was not replying to you. He was replying to skyline_man, who was the original thread starter which has since been merged to this thread. Hope this helps.


----------



## Taboot (Jul 17, 2008)

*Re: Nitecore EX10 - such an overhyped light!*



half-watt said:


> i re-lubed my EX10 w/o too much success. tried a NyoGel on the o-ring w/o much success. then added some NanoLube to the piston. none to very little improvement.
> 
> just as an experiment, i removed the piston o-ring (yeah, i know, fluid ingress danger - it was an experiment to try to isolate the primary cause of the piston sticking). much, much better once the piston begins to move. however, the initial press is still tough. apparently the portion of the piston protruding through the body of the light binds up in some fashion on the opening of the light and requires, relatively speaking, a lot of force to free it, after which the piston moves much more easily. the "binding" is still there w/o a battery in the piston, hence the spring is not the primary cause of the resistance to movement.
> 
> ...



I found that it was "binding" for a while after I removed the rear o-ring. Then it stopped. Perhaps the remaining grease on the top flat of the piston, coupled with the flat-to-flat contact in the top(back of the light, was causing it. Imagine picking up a wet CD off of a glass table top. 

Maybe after repeated presses, the remaining grease "gooshed" out. Now it works great with the o-ring removed. I'm not too worried about water intrusion as I'm not the type to take most of these lights out in the rain any way. That's what my G3 and M90 Rattlesnake are for.


----------



## half-watt (Jul 17, 2008)

*Re: Nitecore EX10 - such an overhyped light!*



Taboot said:


> ...Perhaps the remaining grease on the top flat of the piston, coupled with the flat-to-flat contact in the top(back of the light, was causing it...



good for you. i too had considered this as well, that the shear forces required to tear the highly viscous grease apart could come into play and need to be overcome. so, i made sure that the piston top (bottom??? ok, top it is - just like in an piston engine) was clean and then tried to clean out the body bottom which contacts the piston top as much as i could.

however, even after cleaning, the piston still binds. if i press hard and overcome this binding, and then gradually release the piston, it doesn't bind again until it is almost back out to its initial position - so it binds both ways (before piston-top-to-body-bottom contact would be made on the return). of course, in this case, it is easier to depress the next time. but if i release it quickly and the compressed spring inside the piston rapidly forces the piston back, it again becomes difficult to initiate the press. definitely seems some mechanical piston-to-body-opening binding going on.

even w/this, the EX10 has rapidly become my #6 favorite EDC light behind the Muyshondt Aeon, Muyshondt Nautilus, Bitz, Ra Twisty-100-Tw, and NovaTac 120P.


----------



## orcinus (Jul 17, 2008)

*Re: Nitecore EX10 - such an overhyped light!*



Flintstone said:


> The E10 costing really small change (less than a pizza) is still good value though.





Jarl said:


> D10, not E10, unless you're trying to confuse everyone, in which case, carry on



I think he meant E01. Unless he eats some REALLY expensive pizzas


----------



## Flintstone (Jul 17, 2008)

*Re: Nitecore EX10 - such an overhyped light!*



orcinus said:


> I think he meant E01. Unless he eats some REALLY expensive pizzas



I meant D10. The pizza I ordered today (with a soda) cost about $58 (300,- NOK) including delivery. Norway is quite expensive.


----------



## orcinus (Jul 17, 2008)

Holey guacamoley! :duh2:
A pizza costs about $8 (35-40 HRK) over here...

Sorry for the confusion.


----------



## Flintstone (Jul 17, 2008)

orcinus said:


> Holey guacamoley! :duh2:
> A pizza costs about $8 (35-40 HRK) over here...
> 
> Sorry for the confusion.



Not to get to off topic here, but I guess this is a source of a lot of strange debates here - and why some say "get both" in discussions and others save up to get flashlights. Add age differences into the mix and the purchasing power varies to an extreme degree.

This is fun - according to this, Norway is 154% more expensive than the US, and about 200% more than China.

http://www.oanda.com/products/bigmac/bigmac.shtml

When a small glass of beer here easy costs $12 at the pub, it's not a hard to imagine that a $60 flashlight can be considered cheap here but extremly expensive in ie. China...


----------



## Thujone (Jul 17, 2008)

*Re: Nitecore EX10 - such an overhyped light!*



LED-holic said:


> No he was not replying to you. He was replying to skyline_man, who was the original thread starter which has since been merged to this thread. Hope this helps.



I think you are right, the threads got slammed together. On my light I was getting a lot of friction from the spring and ring on the LE. Cleaning it up nice made things a bit smoother. Not sure what is going on with yours half-wit, sorry man.


----------



## ruriimasu (Jul 17, 2008)

i like my D10. i was getting ready to wipe the grease off the piston as it was too stiff, then i removed it and found came without lubrication on the piston  luckily i got myself a small container of grease a week before my D10 came, and applied a thin coat to it. worked great ever since. i like my light to be as dim as possible when i start it up so D10 is perfect for me. when i need more light, i will just ramp it up. ramp if down after i am done using it so the next time i turn it on, it doesnt blind/wake up the people (or myself) around me.

btw, for those of you who dont like your lights, you are most welcome to throw them my way since i am just starting out :lolsign:


----------



## kaichu dento (Jul 17, 2008)

ruriimasu said:


> i like my D10. i was getting ready to wipe the grease off the piston as it was too stiff, then i removed it and found came without lubrication on the piston  luckily i got myself a small container of grease a week before my D10 came, and applied a thin coat to it. worked great ever since. i like my light to be as dim as possible when i start it up so D10 is perfect for me. when i need more light, i will just ramp it up. ramp if down after i am done using it so the next time i turn it on, it doesnt blind/wake up the people (or myself) around me.
> 
> btw, for those of you who dont like your lights, you are most welcome to throw them my way since i am just starting out :lolsign:


What a shameless attempt at cutting in line ahead of those of us who deserve them most!! :scowl: 



:nana: :devil: :nana:


No, really, send them this way!! :thumbsup:


----------



## ruriimasu (Jul 17, 2008)

kaichu dento said:


> What a shameless attempt at cutting in line ahead of those of us who deserve them most!! :scowl:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



:devil::nana:


----------



## Oddjob (Jul 17, 2008)

*Re: Nitecore EX10 - such an overhyped light!*



LED-holic said:


> I'm curious what other lights you consider superior to the D10/EX10. I think this is a valid discussion, but then one also needs to take in account the cost of the other lights, etc.
> 
> Personally, for me, the D10 is superior to most other lights I've used, which all fall under less than $100. I ordered the D10 with very little expectations, and dis-regarded the hype. But the light blew me away with the feel, UI, and size. I loved it out of the box, and it's grown on me even more as I use it each day.



Ironically enough I came to this thread to report a problem I have with my EX10. I was using it just now while watering my garden and I dropped it from about 4 feet onto a stone path. I picked it up and despite there being a dent in the bezel I just kept on using it. Later when going to twist it on, it would not stay on. After fiddling with it I discovered that the contact ring is sticking. It feels like there are fragments or particles that were loosened or dislodged from the fall that are causing the ring to stick. I think a light that is supposed to be an EDC light should be able to withstand a fall from a short distance. I use all my lights and they have all been dropped and they all continue to work fine. 

Many of my lights I regard as better than the D10 and EX10. As you said the cost of the lights is a consideration but to answer your question as to what lights I consider superior I would say my RaTwisty, HDS EDC U60, McLux III PD-S and Novatac 85p are all better that the EX10. What makes them better? Well in light of what happened tonight they all still work fine after being dropped numerous times. They all have nicer beam quality and are just more robust. I dropped my PD-S last week and you can see only tiny chips in the anodizing-and it still works. Look at the Ra Twisty on their website that was dropped 20 time from over 20 feet and still functions properly. There was also an HDS EDC that was thrown onto concrete over 200 times at a SHOT show that still functioned. I was not expecting this kind of durability from the Nitecore but an EDC has to be able to take short fall. The bezel and the bezel ring on my EX10 have quite a dent which I consider larger than what the force exerted during the fall should have caused. I am not badmouthing the Nitecore because what you get for the money is pretty good and the other lights I have mentioned are 2 and 3 times the cost. Does anyone think I have unreasonable expectations?


----------



## ruriimasu (Jul 17, 2008)

i think maybe you got a lemon.. why not send a message to 4sevens. im sure he can help you with it. i dont have any problem with mine except it came un-lube.


----------



## Oddjob (Jul 17, 2008)

ruriimasu said:


> i think maybe you got a lemon.. why not send a message to 4sevens. im sure he can help you with it. i dont have any problem with mine except it came un-lube.



I already sent David an e-mail. It was working perfectly fine before I dropped it. The piston was easy to press, it had no high pitched buzzing or any afterglow.


----------



## 4sevens (Jul 17, 2008)

Oddjob said:


> I already sent David an e-mail. It was working perfectly fine before I dropped it. The piston was easy to press, it had no high pitched buzzing or any afterglow.


Sounds like the LE inside just needs to be reseated. Email us. Mention to matt
that I cleared him to send you a replacement bezel.


----------



## lightsandknives (Jul 17, 2008)

4sevens said:


> Sounds like the LE inside just needs to be reseated. Email us. Mention to matt
> that I cleared him to send you a replacement bezel.



Excellent customer service as always! That's the reason I like to buy from Fenix-Store or 4sevens.com now!


----------



## Oddjob (Jul 17, 2008)

4sevens said:


> Sounds like the LE inside just needs to be reseated. Email us. Mention to matt
> that I cleared him to send you a replacement bezel.



Thanks for the reply David you are always on top of things. The bezel probably won't come off because both the SS and the aluminum underneath are dented together i.e. the SS bezel will not unscrew.:shrug:


----------



## 4sevens (Jul 17, 2008)

Oddjob said:


> Thanks for the reply David you are always on top of things. The bezel probably won't come off because both the SS and the aluminum underneath are dented together i.e. the SS bezel will not unscrew.:shrug:


Rubber backs of mouse pads and leather gloves work great. If you don't want to mess with it, just send it back and it'll come back
to you in good working order 

Keep in mind that the 7000 series aluminum alloy is structurally stronger than
6000 series. This is observed by how 6000's will deform much easier than 7000's 
- which will rather chip off than deform. This also implies that when it's
dropped on a hard surface such as concrete, the rate of deceleration is greater
in the 7000's thus the shock to the entire unit is every greater. When the 
6000's deform, in a sense they take a bit of the impact. Someone correct me
if this is not right


----------



## Oddjob (Jul 18, 2008)

4sevens said:


> Rubber backs of mouse pads and leather gloves work great. If you don't want to mess with it, just send it back and it'll come back
> to you in good working order ...



Thanks a lot David. As always you take care of your customers. I'll send it once I get an RMA number.


----------



## half-watt (Jul 18, 2008)

*Re: Nitecore EX10 - such an overhyped light!*



LED-holic said:


> No he was not replying to you. He was replying to skyline_man, who was the original thread starter which has since been merged to this thread. Hope this helps.



many thanks for the confirmation. thought that was most likely the case, but i don't like to assume, and would prefer to give someone a chance to more clearly explain oneself.

i think that sometimes (i've done it too & only noticed afterwards), especially when someone is only using Linear Mode to view a Thread, that they click the WRONG reply button & end up replying to the Last Post in the Thread instead of an earlier Post in the Thread that they really want to reply to.


----------



## TooManyGizmos (Jul 18, 2008)

.. Please state who you are replying to .........

when merged threads cause you confusion.


----------



## rayman (Jul 18, 2008)

One question:

Where can I get 'glow in the dark'-O-rings for the bezel of the EX10?

rayman


----------



## Thujone (Jul 18, 2008)

*Re: Nitecore EX10 - such an overhyped light!*



half-watt said:


> when someone is only using Linear Mode to view a Thread, that they click the WRONG reply button & end up replying to the Last Post in the Thread instead of an earlier Post in the Thread that they really want to reply to.




I always click whichever reply is handy, sorry for any trouble this causes.. If you could just type a reply without hanging it off another post then this would not be an issue. But since they 'make you' click a quick reply, i do so on the nearest possible button. Hope you get things working smoothly half-watt


----------



## ruriimasu (Jul 18, 2008)

rayman said:


> One question:
> 
> Where can I get 'glow in the dark'-O-rings for the bezel of the EX10?
> 
> rayman



DX carries an 18mm GITD ring but i heard it glows only 80secs. I just got myself some ultra green paint and am painting on my D10. Made quote a mess from white coating, hopefully can i clean it up later. As i am typing, the second coating is drying. I will probably be posting a horrendously done up D10 when the paintwork is completed.


----------



## orcinus (Jul 18, 2008)

orcinus said:


> Still nothing...



Aaaand, still nothing. Third week expires on saturday, so if it doesn't arrive on monday, it's officially MIA.


----------



## HKJ (Jul 18, 2008)

orcinus said:


> Aaaand, still nothing. Third week expires on saturday, so if it doesn't arrive on monday, it's officially MIA.



The longest I have waited for mail form USA was 36 days, so do not give up yet.


----------



## LED-holic (Jul 18, 2008)

*Re: Nitecore EX10 - such an overhyped light!*



Oddjob said:


> Ironically enough I came to this thread to report a problem I have with my EX10. I was using it just now while watering my garden and I dropped it from about 4 feet onto a stone path. I picked it up and despite there being a dent in the bezel I just kept on using it. Later when going to twist it on, it would not stay on. After fiddling with it I discovered that the contact ring is sticking. It feels like there are fragments or particles that were loosened or dislodged from the fall that are causing the ring to stick. I think a light that is supposed to be an EDC light should be able to withstand a fall from a short distance. I use all my lights and they have all been dropped and they all continue to work fine.
> 
> Many of my lights I regard as better than the D10 and EX10. As you said the cost of the lights is a consideration but to answer your question as to what lights I consider superior I would say my RaTwisty, HDS EDC U60, McLux III PD-S and Novatac 85p are all better that the EX10. What makes them better? Well in light of what happened tonight they all still work fine after being dropped numerous times. They all have nicer beam quality and are just more robust. I dropped my PD-S last week and you can see only tiny chips in the anodizing-and it still works. Look at the Ra Twisty on their website that was dropped 20 time from over 20 feet and still functions properly. There was also an HDS EDC that was thrown onto concrete over 200 times at a SHOT show that still functioned. I was not expecting this kind of durability from the Nitecore but an EDC has to be able to take short fall. The bezel and the bezel ring on my EX10 have quite a dent which I consider larger than what the force exerted during the fall should have caused. I am not badmouthing the Nitecore because what you get for the money is pretty good and the other lights I have mentioned are 2 and 3 times the cost. Does anyone think I have unreasonable expectations?


Point taken. I've already dropped my D10 onto hard concrete surface as well as onto other surfaces. Whereas the same type of fall disabled a Coast LED Lenser, my D10 still performs as new, flawlessly.

Sorry your EX10 stopped working. Sounds like you'll be taken care of.


----------



## orcinus (Jul 18, 2008)

HKJ said:


> The longest I have waited for mail form USA was 36 days, so do not give up yet.



The problem is, i'm going away on a trip in a little less than a week.


----------



## foxtrot29 (Jul 18, 2008)

jag-engr said:


> A month?!
> 
> Just kidding - I'd say that's pretty good time considering that you've just launched two new, original flashlights.
> 
> ...



+1. That is great timing...


----------



## Jarl (Jul 18, 2008)

*Re: Nitecore EX10 - such an overhyped light!*



half-watt said:


> many thanks for the confirmation. thought that was most likely the case, but i don't like to assume, and would prefer to give someone a chance to more clearly explain oneself.
> 
> i think that sometimes (i've done it too & only noticed afterwards), especially when someone is only using Linear Mode to view a Thread, that they click the WRONG reply button & end up replying to the Last Post in the Thread instead of an earlier Post in the Thread that they really want to reply to.



Yup, LED-holic got it. I just hit whichever reply button is closest- linear view only for me.


----------



## Ayeaux (Jul 18, 2008)

I'd love a D10 with a rebel in it as well. As long as its ready before Xmas, I'll be fine since I can't convince the wife to let me spend a tankful of gas on another light.


----------



## Oddjob (Jul 18, 2008)

*Re: Nitecore EX10 - such an overhyped light!*



LED-holic said:


> Point taken. I've already dropped my D10 onto hard concrete surface as well as onto other surfaces. Whereas the same type of fall disabled a Coast LED Lenser, my D10 still performs as new, flawlessly.
> 
> Sorry your EX10 stopped working. Sounds like you'll be taken care of.


 
Hey thanks LED-holic. I might have gotten a bum unit. I think the majority of them are more than durable for EDC. David and his staff are great, no doubt about it.


----------



## half-watt (Jul 18, 2008)

rcv'd my D10 today. totally different in the "feel" of the operation of this light.

lubed up the threads on the head & the o-ring.

w/o removing any o-rings, or lubing up the piston, this light is so very smooth and MUCH, MUCH easier to operate cp. to my EX10 as regards the amt. of force req'd to actuate the piston. plus, there is NO BINDING of the piston protruding through the body of the light.

the reduction in force req'd to operate it is largely (or entirely???) due to the lack of binding/sticking when trying to get the piston to begin moving fr/its resting position. i do NOT believe that it is an issue of o-ring diameter and surface area related to that diameter.

the head is also easier to turn than my EX10 which was a "bear" also (a two-hand job as cp. to this D10 which is oh, so easy with just thumb and forefinger; but NOT too easy so as to accidentally turn ON) which might be o-ring related. my thoughts are more toward o-ring & head I.D. (inner diameter) tolerances in my particular light than o-ring diameter cp. to the larger diameter EX10 o-ring since torque differences based upon the head diameter makes this seem less likely to my way of thinking - which could be wrong; wouldn't be the first time!.

the differences b/t my EX10 and D10 are so great in both head twisting force and the force req'd to initiate the piston travel, that there is definitely something amiss w/my EX10. as stated earlier, it is binding (and i forgot to mention "clicking" when it first starts to move, as well as when it returns to its resting position) where the piston top protrudes through the light's body. FWIW, my NE head is also very, very tight and even after lubing, if the o-ring is left in place, is a two-hand twist operation.


just thought i would update my experiences w/the latest NiteCore offerings.


----------



## Jarl (Jul 18, 2008)

FWIW my D10 is a 2 handed twisty.


----------



## edc3 (Jul 18, 2008)

Even after some liberal lubing (is that the name of a segment on Fox News?) the head of my D10 is still a LOT harder to turn than the head of my EX10, which is almost too easy to turn. My D10 exhibited the same sticking and clicking that half-watt described on his EX10 until today when I took it apart and cleaned the bottom of the piston and the inside of the tail repeatedly, until I saw no more blue gunk on the cotton swab. I think the blue gunk (and, ahem...a little too much PTFE on the o-ring) were making the piston stick to the bottom of the tube and making the "clicking" sound when the suction was broken. The piston action on my D10 feels like night and day now. :thumbsup:


----------



## 4sevens (Jul 18, 2008)

edc3 said:


> Even after some liberal lubing (is that the name of a segment on Fox News?) the head of my D10 is still a LOT harder to turn than the head of my EX10, which is almost too easy to turn. My D10 exhibited the same sticking and clicking that half-watt described on his EX10 until today when I took it apart and cleaned the bottom of the piston and the inside of the tail repeatedly, until I saw no more blue gunk on the cotton swab. I think the blue gunk (and, ahem...a little too much PTFE on the o-ring) were making the piston stick to the bottom of the tube and making the "clicking" sound when the suction was broken. The piston action on my D10 feels like night and day now. :thumbsup:


Actually I did that last night on my EX10 and it really loosened up the
piston. You're right the lube at the top shoulder of the piston is sticking to the
end of the back of the body. I actually just used a paper towel and a bic pen
and ran it on the inside of the body near the back "corner" :twothumbs


----------



## alibaba (Jul 19, 2008)

half-watt said:


> the head is also easier to turn than my EX10 which was a "bear" also (a two-hand job as cp. to this D10 which is oh, so easy with just thumb and forefinger; but NOT too easy so as to accidentally turn ON) which might be o-ring related.
> the differences b/t my EX10 and D10 are so great in both head twisting force and the force req'd to initiate the piston travel, that there is definitely something amiss w/my EX10. as stated earlier, it is binding (and i forgot to mention "clicking" when it first starts to move, as well as when it returns to its resting position) where the piston top protrudes through the light's body. FWIW, my NE head is also very, very tight and even after lubing, if the o-ring is left in place, is a two-hand twist operation.


Actually, that is one of the only issues that I have with my D10 is the lack of sufficient threading on the batt. tube. Once in momentary mode, on my unit, it's only one full turn 'till the head comes off!  Since I carry mine in momentary nearly all the time, this has caused some lost sleep but I just don't lube the threads much so it's nice and sticky. Still, does anyone else think that the D10 could use one more round of threads?
Did I get a bad body? Are the rest of yours like this?


----------



## GregWormald (Jul 19, 2008)

orcinus said:


> Aaaand, still nothing. Third week expires on saturday, so if it doesn't arrive on monday, it's officially MIA.



I hope yours shows up soon. Mine arrived--June 30th to July 16 to Australia. 
This is a really nice light despite having only one level. The ramping us easy to initiate and is becoming very useful, rather than trying to remember the click sequence that gets a particular brightness.
Greg


----------



## GregWormald (Jul 19, 2008)

*Re-lubing for easier use.*

Here is what I've found works for easing the piston.
I disassembled and cleaned everything, including O-rings, in alcohol to get all the blue grease off. Dried well.
I put *ONE-HALF DROP* of Militec-1 on my finger and lubed all moving parts, including O-rings with a just a smear, avoiding the bottom of the body and the mating part of the piston/battery tube. Reassembled.
Result--much lighter switch pressure, no binding, and the momentary function now has a distinct 2-stage feel. First stage is current setting, second stage is ramping up, back to first stage and return to second stage ramps down.
This is much better!
Greg


----------



## Jarl (Jul 19, 2008)

alibaba said:


> Actually, that is one of the only issues that I have with my D10 is the lack of sufficient threading on the batt. tube. Once in momentary mode, on my unit, it's only one full turn 'till the head comes off!  Since I carry mine in momentary nearly all the time, this has caused some lost sleep but I just don't lube the threads much so it's nice and sticky. Still, does anyone else think that the D10 could use one more round of threads?
> Did I get a bad body? Are the rest of yours like this?



I quite like the short threads, though don't keep mine in momentary. FWIW, it has just under 2 turns (i.e, complete rotations) from the momentary/constant point, though the last turn is really easy to do because there's no O ring friction.


----------



## half-watt (Jul 19, 2008)

alibaba said:


> ...Once in momentary mode, on my unit, it's only one full turn 'till the head comes off!...Are the rest of yours like this?



upon JUST ENTERING momentary mode, such that applying a little pressure axially downward on the bezel will cause the LED to light, TWO full turns of the head (totally 720 deg), *PLUS* exactly (or as close as i can tell) ONE-HALF of a full turn (another 180 deg, that is), is what it takes to reach the point that the head on my particular D10 will come off.

just rcv'd mine yesterday (s/n 00626). perhaps a desing change was made after the first nnn (500 or so) units were made??? or, a different run of bodies fr/a diff. machine???


----------



## half-watt (Jul 19, 2008)

Originally Posted by edc3 said:


> ...My D10 exhibited the same sticking and clicking that half-watt described on his EX10 until today when I took it apart and cleaned the bottom of the piston and the inside of the tail repeatedly, until I saw no more blue gunk on the cotton swab. I think the blue gunk (and, ahem...a little too much PTFE on the o-ring) were making the piston stick to the bottom of the tube and making the "clicking" sound when the suction was broken. The piston action on my D10 feels like night and day now.





4sevens said:


> Actually I did that last night on my EX10 and it really loosened up the
> piston. You're right the lube at the top shoulder of the piston is sticking to the
> end of the back of the body. I actually just used a paper towel and a bic pen
> and ran it on the inside of the body near the back "corner" :twothumbs




glad that worked for others. wish it had worked for me (tried it b/f first Posting on this subject). the clicking on mine is clearly metal-2-metal contact - not what i would call a fluid "snapping" apart due to shear forces tearing the viscous fluid (i.e., the lube) apart. i'm familiar w/this phenomenon in viscous fluids fr/work.

i may take a Dremel to the opening in the body where the piston top/button protrudes through the body and see if that resolves the matter in my particular EX10.


----------



## 42 (Jul 19, 2008)

i've had the D10 for a bit over a week and all my other lights have been knocked down a peg. The Smart PD system is fantastic! From the crisp feel of the piston to the simple UI to the output and runtime (not to mention the price), no other light I own comes close. My P2D and CR2 Ion have been retired as my usual EDCs. Frankly, I can't find a single fault with this little masterpiece.

Did I mention I like this light?

I just hope that there are two cell versions of the D10 and EX10 in the works. 4Sevens? 

Mark


----------



## Lite_me (Jul 19, 2008)

half-watt said:


> glad that worked for others. wish it had worked for me (tried it b/f first Posting on this subject). the clicking on mine is clearly metal-2-metal contact - not what i would call a fluid "snapping" apart due to shear forces tearing the viscous fluid (i.e., the lube) apart. i'm familiar w/this phenomenon in viscous fluids fr/work.
> 
> * i may take a Dremel to the opening in the body where the piston top/button protrudes through the body* and see if that resolves the matter in my particular EX10.


I doubt if this is necessary or will help. If you're getting a metal clicking sound when the switch 'hangs' a bit when trying to activate it, sounds more like the brass ring in the head is catching on something. Does the brass ring move freely up and down by hand? I'm sure you've seem suggestions to cure this.

I apologize if you've already covered this in another post as I've read your struggles with your EX10, but can't remember everything you've said and tried. 

I've had 5 of these pass through my hands and have had to "tweak" every one of them. One, (an EX10) was particularly stubborn to get working smoothly & without issues.

Just to clarify, I feel these are great lights. Once you get the piston working smoothly, they are a delight to use. Now, when I grab one of my clicky lights, they feel sort of cheep & antiquated in comparison. 

....Darn it! I'm not sure I can go back!  My light collection somehow seems smaller. :mecry:


----------



## ruriimasu (Jul 20, 2008)

ruriimasu said:


> DX carries an 18mm GITD ring but i heard it glows only 80secs. I just got myself some ultra green paint and am painting on my D10. Made quote a mess from white coating, hopefully can i clean it up later. As i am typing, the second coating is drying. I will probably be posting a horrendously done up D10 when the paintwork is completed.



my D10 turned out to be a mess. :sick2: i was told the paint needed a white base, having no white paint, i did a stupid act of using correction fluid as the base. the white fluid ran into the knurlings and i could not remove them. the GITD paint was not exactly very bright and was not uniformed, so i see only speckles of glow in the dark. i am waiting for my ultra green powder from glowinc now, hopefully it will do better with an epoxy mix. does anyone here know whether white base is needed for this powder/epoxy mix?


----------



## jupello (Jul 20, 2008)

I'we been little tempted to buy D10.. but while I'we been lurking these forums for related posts, I'we seen posts here and there about people struggling to make their Piston Drive to perform well.
So what do you think.. is the PD system on D10 more rugged&reliable than the clicky switches and does it need much maintenance like lubing/adjusting to work properly?

Oh.. and if I decide to get the D10, does the Fenix Store's CPF8 coupon code work in 4sevens.com too? I'm a bit confused on the relationship of those two sites since they seem to be kinda merged together or something..


----------



## michelkenny (Jul 21, 2008)

Just got my EX10 today in Canada. Shipped June 30, received July 21. This was the longest 3 weeks ever! Next time I will have to get a shipping upgrade. Can't wait to play with it after supper!


----------



## Jarl (Jul 21, 2008)

I think the PD aspect itself needs a bit more work initially, but is more reliable overall.


----------



## mandrake (Jul 21, 2008)

I have both an EX10 and a D10. I have played around with the EX10 quite a bit trying to make the switch "feel" better. The thing is, it has never faled to work properly, to turn on and off, which is what the piston is supposed to do. I just have not thought that it "feels" good. Maybe a little too stiff, or having inconsistent travel but it has always functioned to swith the light just fine. I have been carrying the EX10 around in my pocket the last few weeks and it has always worked just fine.My D10 felt fine right out of the box. It has a lighter feel to it and a bit more travel. All I did was clean the old lube off, relubed it, put it back together and am using it. Can't get much simpler than that.

Theoretically the PD should be reliable for lots longer than any clicky. There is nothing much to fail mechanically. Worst case the contact ring may get dirty, but that is easily fixed.

Both of the shops are Four Sevens operations. I think he started the second store to sell non-Fenix lights (Nitecore). I used the CPF8 discount code to buy my D10 from 4sevens.com and it worked.

Phil 



jupello said:


> I'we been little tempted to buy D10.. but while I'we been lurking these forums for related posts, I'we seen posts here and there about people struggling to make their Piston Drive to perform well.
> So what do you think.. is the PD system on D10 more rugged&reliable than the clicky switches and does it need much maintenance like lubing/adjusting to work properly?
> 
> Oh.. and if I decide to get the D10, does the Fenix Store's CPF8 coupon code work in 4sevens.com too? I'm a bit confused on the relationship of those two sites since they seem to be kinda merged together or something..


----------



## itch808 (Jul 21, 2008)

I received my EX10, here are my thoughts:

After hearing all the rave reviews I was thinking about purchasing both a D10 and EX10. But instead took a wait and see approach once I had received my EX10.

First off, I thought the PD design would offer a MUCH smoother feel/push. YES, I did clean off all the excess lube from BOTH the inner piston and the tailcap end. It did smoothen out a bit, but still not quite how I imagined it.

Second, this light sucks as a twisty. The twisty motion is horribly tight and stiff. I own twisty lights, and this has got to be the stiffest one I've ever felt. I'd describe the action as just slightly better than what a cross-threaded bolt feels like (if you've ever felt one before). And NO, the head/body are not cross-threaded.

Lastly, the UI seems buggy at times to me. It's not quite as simple as 4-7's made it out to be on youtube. I will try to ramp, and sometimes it does nothing. Other times I try to shortcut to MAX brightness and then the light turns off after. It seems finicky. This is all using a AW RCR straight from 4-7's himself, so battery length isn't an issue either.

Would I buy it again? Maybe.
Is it perfect? Definitely not!

I can easily say I will not be purchasing any more D10/EX10s. If the light was as good as everyone made it out to be I was planning on purchasing another D10 for myself and one for my girlfriend. Instead, I will be waiting for something else I know she'll be happy with in a AA format (the Lightflux LF5XT would confuse the hell out of her).

My $0.02


----------



## lightsandknives (Jul 21, 2008)

itch808 said:


> I received my EX10, here are my thoughts:
> 
> After hearing all the rave reviews I was thinking about purchasing both a D10 and EX10. But instead took a wait and see approach once I had received my EX10.
> 
> ...



The light will switch ramping directions each time you ramp. So, if you last ramped up, then double click to go to low and try to ramp, the ramping will be trying to go from high to low since you last ramped from low to high. Consequently, nothing will happen. You'll have to pursh and hold a second time to reverse the direction again. This has been discussed multiple times in the threads. I wish it was different, but I'm used to it now. That would be one of the first fixes if I was redesiging the light.

Don't give up on it yet. The first day I got mine, I had trouble hitting all the double clicks, click holds, etc. Now, I'm right on every time. Just keep practicing and it will come!


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## LED-holic (Jul 22, 2008)

itch808 said:


> I received my EX10, here are my thoughts:
> 
> After hearing all the rave reviews I was thinking about purchasing both a D10 and EX10. But instead took a wait and see approach once I had received my EX10.
> 
> First off, I thought the PD design would offer a MUCH smoother feel/push. YES, I did clean off all the excess lube from BOTH the inner piston and the tailcap end. It did smoothen out a bit, but still not quite how I imagined it.


The clicky will get easier over time. The spring gets a bit looser, and the button a bit easier to push. Like wearing in a new pair of shoes.



> Second, this light sucks as a twisty. The twisty motion is horribly tight and stiff. I own twisty lights, and this has got to be the stiffest one I've ever felt. I'd describe the action as just slightly better than what a cross-threaded bolt feels like (if you've ever felt one before). And NO, the head/body are not cross-threaded.


Again, this will get easier over time. If it's too stiff, you can take the O-ring out and sand it down a bit, which will make it easier to twist as some have noted. It's better that this is too tight than too lose, as it's easier to sand down the O-ring, since you can't build it back up.



> Lastly, the UI seems buggy at times to me. It's not quite as simple as 4-7's made it out to be on youtube. I will try to ramp, and sometimes it does nothing. Other times I try to shortcut to MAX brightness and then the light turns off after. It seems finicky. This is all using a AW RCR straight from 4-7's himself, so battery length isn't an issue either.


As noted above in the excellent post by *lightsandknives *it gets easier over time as you learn how the clicky responds to your control. The ramping is very simple logic - if you're in low already, and it tries to ramp lower, the light will do nothing. You need to release and press again to ramp up. A minor annoyance but not a big deal imho.



> Would I buy it again? Maybe.
> Is it perfect? Definitely not!
> 
> I can easily say I will not be purchasing any more D10/EX10s. If the light was as good as everyone made it out to be I was planning on purchasing another D10 for myself and one for my girlfriend. Instead, I will be waiting for something else I know she'll be happy with in a AA format (the Lightflux LF5XT would confuse the hell out of her).
> ...


I think the light will grow on you in a big way over time. There is no other similar light I can think of at this price I'd rather have. Heck, there are no other lights at double the price that I'd rather have. These lights are simply awesome.

I've been using my D10 a lot since I got it, and I carry it everywhere I go. Tonight I took a flight and was so glad when I landed that I had my D10 with me. It's definitely the best light I've ever used, and I've had some pretty nice lights, relatively speaking.

I am very thankful 4sevens and NiteCore gave us these brilliant lights. Enjoy them!! :thumbsup:


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## Taboot (Jul 22, 2008)

I really like my EX10 and would recommend one. However, it definitely has some quirks beyond getting used to the UI. Mine has problems staying on or off. I have cleaned, lubed, etc. The piston feels fine. My main troubles are:

Sometimes, not always, I can shake it and it will turn on (or off). 
Sometimes, I will turn it off and set it down, and it will turn back on. Sometimes, I will turn it on and aim it at something then it blinks off. Sometimes, I have to perform commands more than once to get them to "take". (not just ramping) 

Some will say "You'll get used to the UI" I get it, but I am 100% sure I'm doing it right.

It seems to help somewhat if I take it apart and put it back together. 

With all this said, I still really like the light, especially for the price and my uses don't require it to be perfect. I'll probably even get a D10. 

I'll bet version 2.0 will be even better.

Regards,

Mike


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## itch808 (Jul 22, 2008)

LED-holic said:


> The clicky will get easier over time. The spring gets a bit looser, and the button a bit easier to push. Like wearing in a new pair of shoes.



I hope so, but at the sametime I'd like to think a little closer look at machining and size choice of o-rings wouldn't be that hard. I never need to break in my traditional clickies.



> Again, this will get easier over time. If it's too stiff, you can take the O-ring out and sand it down a bit, which will make it easier to twist as some have noted. It's better that this is too tight than too lose, as it's easier to sand down the O-ring, since you can't build it back up.


 
I've bought cheaper twisties that didn't require me to sand down the o-ring. I'd like to think this shouldn't be an issue. 4-7's called it designed to be a "tool", how many tools do you own that require another tool to fix it? Why not choose the proper size o-ring in the 1st place???



> As noted above in the excellent post by *lightsandknives *it gets easier over time as you learn how the clicky responds to your control. The ramping is very simple logic - if you're in low already, and it tries to ramp lower, the light will do nothing. You need to release and press again to ramp up. A minor annoyance but not a big deal imho.



Ok, while he might've covered the ramping issue, the UI is still buggy. I wouldn't exactly place myself below average in manual dexterity. But I specifically tried to shortcut to max brightness three times in a row. 3x it didn't do it despite doing the click-click/hold easily within the <~0.5s. Then on the 4th try it started ramping up (was on min brightness), then the light blinked and shutoff all the while holding the button and not letting go. Buggy UI? Yes.



> I think the light will grow on you in a big way over time. There is no other similar light I can think of at this price I'd rather have. Heck, there are no other lights at double the price that I'd rather have. These lights are simply awesome.



I wouldn't call it awesome. I used it tonight to go looking for some punk kids that ran away after kicking something into my car. Thankfully I already had it set to max brightness or I would've spent more time trying to set it while they ran away.

I REALLY hope my EX10 doesn't remain this tight to twist and hard to push on. At this point I will be avoiding NC's offering in the future. IMO, too much *HYPE*. I will however say that the knurling is perfect. Too bad there are so many other flaws.


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## Kilovolt (Jul 22, 2008)

I received my EX10 one hour ago. The operation of both the switch and the head is smoother than what I expected after reading several posts here. For the time being I don't see any reason for changing the factory lube.
The beam is sufficiently clean even if typically CREE and rather powerful. I could easily perform all the functions without any glitch.

There is one problem though: the light has a terrible smell which became apparent upon opening the box. I think it could be a fluid used in machining the parts. I have washed the outside with warm water and soap and the inside with alcohol but some smell still remains. :sigh:

Any thought? :thinking:


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## AardvarkSagus (Jul 22, 2008)

Kilovolt said:


> I received my EX10 one hour ago. The operation of both the switch and the head is smoother than what I expected after reading several posts here. For the time being I don't see any reason for changing the factory lube.
> The beam is sufficiently clean even if typically CREE and rather powerful. I could easily perform all the functions without any glitch.
> 
> There is one problem though: the light has a terrible smell which became apparent upon opening the box. I think it could be a fluid used in machining the parts. I have washed the outside with warm water and soap and the inside with alcohol but some smell still remains. :sigh:
> ...


I was under the impression that the smell came from the vacuum formed plastic in the box. That's where the smell was strongest for me.

I'm not having nearly the issues with the UI as some people are. Mine will occasionally do something I wasn't trying to do, but well over 98% of the time it does exactly what I ask with the possible exception of attempting to ramp the wrong way. I have more issues when trying to use it in momentary mode, but not in clicky mode.


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## HeadCSO (Jul 22, 2008)

I'm a bit of a latecomer to all of this though I have been monitoring this thread with interest. The other day, I was about to order a L2D Q5, but suddenly changed my mind and have now placed an order for a D10. Unfortunately, I am in the UK so I may have a bit of a wait before I can play. :mecry:


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## lightsandknives (Jul 22, 2008)

itch808 said:


> I hope so, but at the sametime I'd like to think a little closer look at machining and size choice of o-rings wouldn't be that hard. I never need to break in my traditional clickies.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



That might be part of your problem. The shortcut to max isn't click-click-hold, it's click-hold, assuming the light is already on. (and it think it's around .3 seconds)

Give that a try and see how it works.


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## mighty82 (Jul 22, 2008)

lightsandknives said:


> That might be part of your problem. The shortcut to max isn't click-click-hold, it's click-hold, assuming the light is already on. (and it think it's around .3 seconds)
> 
> Give that a try and see how it works.


Well, he didn't write click-click-hold. He wrote klick-click/hold. So first a click and then a click/hold (click with hold). That's the way I understand it.


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## lightsandknives (Jul 22, 2008)

mighty82 said:


> Well, he didn't write click-click-hold. He wrote klick-click/hold. So first a click and then a click/hold (click with hold). That's the way I understand it.



You may be right. I guess click/hold is one action. Maybe it's just not happening quickly enough???


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## Blindasabat (Jul 22, 2008)

As much as I like my NC PD, it still has a switch, it is just not at the tail. It is in the head. 
I hope it is reliable as I want to use my EX10 for a long time. I think it's real advantages are that it is ostensibly smaller and lower profile, and it has the ability to use two circuits for the UI operation. 


mandrake said:


> Theoretically the PD should be reliable for lots longer than any clicky. There is nothing much to fail mechanically. Worst case the contact ring may get dirty, but that is easily fixed.


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## mighty82 (Jul 22, 2008)

Has anyone done any runtime testing on the lowest level yet? I know someone estimated the lowest level to be 0.3 lumens, which is way less than the claimed 3-5 lumens. The runtime should be a LOT more than 60 hours.


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## ruriimasu (Jul 22, 2008)

itch808 said:


> Ok, while he might've covered the ramping issue, the UI is still buggy. I wouldn't exactly place myself below average in manual dexterity. But I specifically tried to shortcut to max brightness three times in a row. 3x it didn't do it despite doing the click-click/hold easily within the <~0.5s. Then on the 4th try it started ramping up (was on min brightness), then the light blinked and shutoff all the while holding the button and not letting go. Buggy UI? Yes.



i thought there was a problem with the ramping too when it blinked and shutoff. then i realised that occurred because i did not maintain the pressure required to hold the piston down. it is easy to think that you are maintaining the pressure but you are not.


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## NetGod3Com (Jul 22, 2008)

I have experienced no problems with the shortcuts or ramping, I can hear my EX10 if I hold it up to my ear, sounds kind of cool when ramping.:twothumbs


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## 1dash1 (Jul 22, 2008)

*Re: Ramping bug.*

I did a quick search of the CPF Forum and found the following discussion:

Inh's comments from *EX10 (1xCR123A) and D10 (1xAA) Part 4 *

While I believe Inh's ideas are correct, let me present a simpler explanation:

*Basic Principles*
*===========*

*1. The D10 always remembers the last ramping sequence. *


*2. The D10 will always ramp in the opposite direction from its last ramping sequence. *

That's it. 

_You knew that the D10 retains its memory of the last mode. Well, the D10 additionally remembers what the last ramping sequence was._

_It doesn't matter how many times you click back and forth between max and low. It doesn't matter whether you turn the light off and then back on. It doesn't matter how long your light was turned off. Apply these two rules and you can predict whether your ramping will work or "get stuck at the extremes" every time._

Simple, eh? :shrug:

Try it a few times and you'll see that it always ramps in the opposite direction. 

If you cleanly execute all commands, you'll quickly catch on to how it works. 

On the other hand, if you misexecute some commands, then it becomes a game of following the pea in the shell. 
For example, suppose the last ramp was increasing and you're at the lowest setting. You miss the quick "click-release-hold" shortcut to get to the max brightness, but do it correctly on the second try. Your flashlight is then sitting at max output. When you press/hold to start the ramp sequence, what do you predict?

The answer is that the light will sit there doing nothing. 

(The UI interpreted your last *hold* of the missed "click-release-*hold*" shortcut as a ramp command. So, it was ramping down, even though you didn't realize it at the time because it was already on low. With the current ramp command, the U.I. will reverse the ramp sequence and attempt to ramp upward. Since it is already sitting on max, it has nowhere to go.)​From a practical standpoint, this tip is of little consequence to most owners. It's easier to simply let go of the button and re-start the ramp sequence than to try to keep track of the ramp sequences. :thinking:

But for me, it is somehow comforting to know that the bug isn't truly random (misoperating). Instead, it is just doing its job the way that it was designed.


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## DavidD (Jul 22, 2008)

mighty82 said:


> Has anyone done any runtime testing on the lowest level yet? I know someone estimated the lowest level to be 0.3 lumens, which is way less than the claimed 3-5 lumens. The runtime should be a LOT more than 60 hours.



I have not. But, in selfbuilt's review thread, post #79 HKJ says regarding current draw on the lowest setting,

"I checked the current drain from the battery:
NiMH: 24 mA
LiIon: 7.2 mA"

For a NiMH that is rated between 2000 & 2700, that would give between 83hrs & 112hrs, would it not?

I don't have any 14500s, but they are rated at 750 IIRC, which would also give right around 100hrs.

NOTE: HKJ didn't specify if the current drain was from a fully charged cell, or half depleted. So, if he measured 24 mA from a fully charged cell (with higher voltage), the current drain would increase as the cell voltage decreased with use and the above hours estimated would be too high. 

If he measured 24 mA from a half-used cell, then it would approximate an average current drain and the estimated hours of runtime listed above could be fairly accurate.


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## 276 (Jul 22, 2008)

Taboot said:


> I really like my EX10 and would recommend one. However, it definitely has some quirks beyond getting used to the UI. Mine has problems staying on or off. I have cleaned, lubed, etc. The piston feels fine. My main troubles are:
> 
> Sometimes, not always, I can shake it and it will turn on (or off).
> Sometimes, I will turn it off and set it down, and it will turn back on. Sometimes, I will turn it on and aim it at something then it blinks off. Sometimes, I have to perform commands more than once to get them to "take". (not just ramping)
> ...


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## edc3 (Jul 23, 2008)

Kilovolt said:


> There is one problem though: the light has a terrible smell which became apparent upon opening the box. I think it could be a fluid used in machining the parts. I have washed the outside with warm water and soap and the inside with alcohol but some smell still remains. :sigh:
> 
> Any thought? :thinking:



The packaging that both of my lights were shipped in smelled really bad, but the lights are fine. I think I'm a little sensitive to chemical smells, so as soon as I got the lights out, the boxes went bye bye.


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## itch808 (Jul 23, 2008)

mighty82 said:


> Well, he didn't write click-click-hold. He wrote klick-click/hold. So first a click and then a click/hold (click with hold). That's the way I understand it.



Correct, I meant two actions. I didn't click-hold because then someone would figure I just pushed the button once. And trust I didnt let go. On the hold I'm keeping the button pushed down quite firmly since my PD is so stiff. I suppose I should've probably just opted for a Novatec 120P and be done with it.


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## Taboot (Jul 23, 2008)

276 said:


> Taboot said:
> 
> 
> > I really like my EX10 and would recommend one. However, it definitely has some quirks beyond getting used to the UI. Mine has problems staying on or off. I have cleaned, lubed, etc. The piston feels fine. My main troubles are:
> ...


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## mikel81 (Jul 23, 2008)

Kilovolt said:


> There is one problem though: the light has a terrible smell which became apparent upon opening the box. I think it could be a fluid used in machining the parts. I have washed the outside with warm water and soap and the inside with alcohol but some smell still remains. :sigh:
> 
> Any thought? :thinking:


 

Mine had a very strong electronic odor at first too. I imagine it's what China probably smells like.
:shrug:


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## mikel81 (Jul 23, 2008)

NetGod3Com said:


> I have experienced no problems with the shortcuts or ramping, I can hear my EX10 if I hold it up to my ear, sounds kind of cool when ramping.:twothumbs


 


I noticed this when I first got it (whining noise), and didn't think much of it until now I see everyone talking about it. Just wanted to point out, mine only makes the noise while holding the button down. No matter if it's in momentary or regular, it's only audible if I am holding the switch in.


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## LED-holic (Jul 23, 2008)

mikel81 said:


> Mine had a very strong electronic odor at first too. I imagine it's what China probably smells like.
> :shrug:


What a strange comment. :thinking:

A country doesn't have a smell. A factory might have a smell, a house might have a smell, a building might have a smell. But to imagine an entire country smelling the same way is just silly.


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## Illumination (Jul 24, 2008)

Received my D10 today. Nice UI (but still not as smooth as Photon Proton Pro), nice fit & finish, AWFUL CREE RING (as bad as DI and almost as bad as Photon Proton). 

Why can't someone design a good cree reflector?

The output from my Fenix L1D CE is MUCH cleaner...almost no visible cree rings.

I'd pay an extra $20 for this light if it had a better reflector.


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## Kilovolt (Jul 24, 2008)

Illumination said:


> Why can't someone design a good cree reflector?


 
Have you tried a LiteFlux LF5XT? :naughty:


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## LED-holic (Jul 24, 2008)

Illumination said:


> Received my D10 today. Nice UI (but still not as smooth as Photon Proton Pro), nice fit & finish, AWFUL CREE RING (as bad as DI and almost as bad as Photon Proton).
> 
> Why can't someone design a good cree reflector?
> 
> ...


Interesting observation. To me the output on whitewall comparisons from the D10 is not vastly different from my other Q5 / Q4 lights. The only one significantly different is my LF5XT R2, which as has been noted by others has a good smooth spill but smaller overall beam.

It's virtually identical to my L1D Q5 in terms of output on the white wall, which I do not find to be an issue at all. 

Maybe your L1D CE is using a rebel LED? Do you have any beam shots to illustrate your observations?


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## Illumination (Jul 24, 2008)

Kilovolt said:


> Have you tried a LiteFlux LF5XT? :naughty:



No, but based on what I've read, I've started to seriously consider one... I'm concerned about the complexity of the UI...I'm not crazy about anything very complex.


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## Illumination (Jul 24, 2008)

LED-holic said:


> Interesting observation. To me the output on whitewall comparisons from the D10 is not vastly different from my other Q5 / Q4 lights. The only one significantly different is my LF5XT R2, which as has been noted by others has a good smooth spill but smaller overall beam.
> 
> It's virtually identical to my L1D Q5 in terms of output on the white wall, which I do not find to be an issue at all.
> 
> Maybe your L1D CE is using a rebel LED? Do you have any beam shots to illustrate your observations?



I think "vastly" different is an overstatement, but the cree rings are noticeably apparent on my D10, and are hardly visibly on my L1D. I doubt that it has a Rebel...my guess is that small differences in LED construction, reflector positioning, etc. make a big difference on a white wall. I don't have beamshots...maybe I can take some.


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## Kilovolt (Jul 24, 2008)

Illumination said:


> No, but based on what I've read, I've started to seriously consider one... I'm concerned about the complexity of the UI...I'm not crazy about anything very complex.


 
You can also keep the LF5 as it is delivered at least initially: three levels (50% - 15% - 2% or something similar) or 100% by keeping the button pressed and learn to use it fully with time.


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## loanshark (Jul 24, 2008)

I love this light... couldn't be better as far as I'm concerned. My L1D Q5 still gets used a bit, but not near as much as the ND10...

4Sevens in one of the many D10 threads made mention of some destructive testing. I'd be very interested to hear some details!! Forgive me if they are posted somewhere and I've missed them.


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## LED-holic (Jul 24, 2008)

loanshark said:


> I love this light... couldn't be better as far as I'm concerned. My L1D Q5 still gets used a bit, but not near as much as the ND10...
> 
> 4Sevens in one of the many D10 threads made mention of some destructive testing. I'd be very interested to hear some details!! Forgive me if they are posted somewhere and I've missed them.


I would love to see some D10 / EX10 destructive testing. But I love my D10s too much to intentionally destroy them. Based upon my use so far they're pretty dang durable. :thumbsup:


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## jag-engr (Jul 24, 2008)

_I originally posted this on EDCF, but I thought it might be of interest to some here:_

Like many here, I found the piston switch on my EX10 to be too stiff initially. I removed the factory adhesive/lube and replaced it with the Radio Shack lube in the "Precision Applicator". It was better, but still stiff. Following some "less is more" lubing advice from CPF, I tried to remove some of the lube, and it got a little better.

I decided that one of the problems that I was having was the length of travel of the piston. I think that this would be less of an issue if the switch weren't so stiff, but as it is it just feels clunky to depress the switch. I drew up a pattern for some paper washers and put three paper washers behind the the piston around the thumb button and reassembled the light. The light worked, but just barely - it didn't have enough travel to really feel the switch. I removed one of the paper washers (leaving two), and the light functions better now. They may prove unnecessary after the spring softens a little, but for now, they work well.

I suspect that there may be slight differences in the lenght of travel just due to the tolerances (slight as they may be) of machining the parts.


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## Illumination (Jul 24, 2008)

Kilovolt said:


> You can also keep the LF5 as it is delivered at least initially: three levels (50% - 15% - 2% or something similar) or 100% by keeping the button pressed and learn to use it fully with time.



the more I use this light, the more I realize I would prefer a light with several levels...perhaps 4 ... with a super clean artifact-free output

hmm...isn't that my novatac?

The lightflux sounds pretty good...but I would want to program it rt start at low then step up. It sounds like Lightflux designed a great reflector, though I much prefer the D10's smaller size.


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## Illumination (Jul 25, 2008)

LED-holic said:


> Interesting observation. To me the output on whitewall comparisons from the D10 is not vastly different from my other Q5 / Q4 lights. The only one significantly different is my LF5XT R2, which as has been noted by others has a good smooth spill but smaller overall beam.
> 
> It's virtually identical to my L1D Q5 in terms of output on the white wall, which I do not find to be an issue at all.
> 
> Maybe your L1D CE is using a rebel LED? Do you have any beam shots to illustrate your observations?



My L1D is definitely not a Rebel (I do have a Rebel P2D).

Here is a beamshot of my D10. Is the heavy cree ring normal?









Thanks.


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## LED-holic (Jul 25, 2008)

Illumination said:


> My L1D is definitely not a Rebel (I do have a Rebel P2D).
> 
> Here is a beamshot of my D10. Is the heavy cree ring normal?
> 
> ...


How far away was the D10 from the wall when the photo was taken? No matter how far or close I move my D10, I can't replicate your beam, it's not even close. I wonder if camera exposure/white balance has changed the beam from how it really looks in real life.

My D10 does have rings, but it's not any more or less noticeable than my L2D / L1D.


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## Illumination (Jul 25, 2008)

LED-holic said:


> How far away was the D10 from the wall when the photo was taken? No matter how far or close I move my D10, I can't replicate your beam, it's not even close. I wonder if camera exposure/white balance has changed the beam from how it really looks in real life.
> 
> My D10 does have rings, but it's not any more or less noticeable than my L2D / L1D.



The rings are visible from up close to further away. In this case the picture was taken with the light about two feet from the wall. Even at 10+ feet, the rings are pronounced. I guess I may have gotten a bum unit .


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## Thujone (Jul 25, 2008)

Illumination said:


> The lightflux sounds pretty good...but I would want to program it rt start at low then step up.



You simply disable memory mode then...


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## Grumpy (Jul 25, 2008)

When I first got my E10, I compared it to some of my other lights which have smooth beams. I was a little concerned when shining on a white wall. I took it fishing and the ring does not hurt it for real world use at all. I don't notice it when using my light outdoors. I really like the throw that this little light has (for such a small reflector). It also has good sidespill.


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## nanotech17 (Jul 25, 2008)

orcinus said:


> Aaaand, still nothing. Third week expires on saturday, so if it doesn't arrive on monday, it's officially MIA.



so you still have not received yours?
but you received your Dosun from Fenix-Store?


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## srvctec (Jul 26, 2008)

Grumpy said:


> *snip*I was a little concerned when shining on a white wall. I took it fishing and the ring does not hurt it for real world use at all.*snip*



*EXACTLY!* That is why I take white wall hunting with a grain salt. My NDI has the crappiest beam (for a CREE and a OP reflector) I've seen when shining it on a white wall, but I don't even notice it when using it all day long every single day at work, because I'm looking at what the light is illuminating, NOT at the beam shape/quality. These CREE rings everyone keeps bringing up are really a non issue in real world use.


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## [email protected] (Jul 26, 2008)

Please continue here.


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