# simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS



## gadget_lover (Dec 30, 2003)

Hi Folks,

<font color="red"> THIS THREAD IS NO LONGER JUST FOR TWISTY TAILCAPS! </font> Instructions for constructing high/low spring assembleis for Kroll switches may be found in this thread too 

A newer design (type 2) is described here.

Do you have one of the LS series lights from ARC? Do you lust after the dual brightness mode of the Surefire L1 but prefer the size of the LS? Have I got a deal for YOU!

Here's a simple mod for the twisty cap AND the Tail Switch Packs.

CONCEPT; if you add 10-20 Ohms of resistance to the battery pack, the LS goes into moon mode (very dim). This will last a long time AND it's usable for up close work.

Why it works; The twisty pack is left partly unscrewed when off. You rotates it to turn it on. There's a little post in the bottom of the tailpack that makes contact with the bottom of the battery when it's turned on.

There's enough room between the bottom of the case and the bottom of the battery for a 1/4 watt resistor.

Execution (general); make a coil of the resistor leads and insulate them from each other with a springy material like foam two sided tape.

Execution; Wrap the leads of the resistor around a pencil so you end up with a spiral. Carefully cut a washer from two sided foam tape. Make the hole in the washer big enough to fit around the post in the battery case. Slide the washer between the two coils of wire to create the resistor pack. Make sure the wires don't touch each other. Drop the resistor pack over the post and insert battery.

USE: Unscrew the battery pack two turns for off. Tighten 1 turn for low and normal tightness for full.

The mod in place:






The resistor pack: (quick prototype, I had no wide tape /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/icon23.gif)





A very blurry side view (sorry, it wasn't worth it to re-shoot.)





I'm sure there are ways to improve this.

Daniel 

(Moderator edit: changed subject line as asked)


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## this_is_nascar (Dec 30, 2003)

*Re: simple high/low mod for Arc LS twisty caps*

I don't understand how the circuit is completed to allow the light to come on at all, let alone in full-mode.


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## tvodrd (Dec 30, 2003)

*Re: simple high/low mod for Arc LS twisty caps*

gadget_lover,

That is beautiful! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumbsup.gif I suspect that within a month or so, one of the "modders" out here will come up with a "drop-in" module. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Larry


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## EvilLithiumMan (Dec 30, 2003)

*Re: simple high/low mod for Arc LS twisty caps*

[ QUOTE ]
*this_is_nascar said:*
I don't understand how the circuit is completed to allow the light to come on at all, let alone in full-mode.


[/ QUOTE ]

Because of the head-on shot into the base of the tailcap, it is hard to tell that the center contact pin is actually sitting on a raised base. The area around the raised base is where the resistor sits. One resistor lead (not visible in the picture) contacts the base. The other lead will come into contact with the cell's negative terminal. This added resistance puts the LS into moon mode. As the tailcap is tightened further, the center pin will make contact with the cell's negative terminal (as intended), shorting out the resistor and resulting in full brightness mode.

Clever mod, but I guess it assumes every tailcap has the same amount of space machined into it and that one uses a correctly sized resistor. (Physical size)


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## moraino (Dec 30, 2003)

*Re: simple high/low mod for Arc LS twisty caps*

Wow, i tried it and it works.

Another why didn't I think of that!!! Thanks! Great mind.

Henry


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## gadget_lover (Dec 30, 2003)

*Re: simple high/low mod for Arc LS twisty caps*

Thanks for adding the explaination, EvilLithiumMan. Your clarification was very nicely done.

You are right about the physical dimensions. The center post has to be taller than the resistor. The wires plus tape have to be taller than the center post.

The current dropped by the resistor is very low, so 1/4 watt or 1/8 watt will work OK.

I find (on mine) that 10 ohms will give me about the same light as my Arc AA. 15 Ohms is almost exactly the same intensity as my Lumamax L1.

I'm glad you liked it, Henry (moraino). It was inspired by the Arc AAA's use of a foam donut to keep the battery away from the positive terminal. I'm hoping that, as Larry (tvodrd) said, there will be a properly made drop in available from Arc or one of our modders.

Daniel


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## tylerdurden (Dec 30, 2003)

*Re: simple high/low mod for Arc LS twisty caps*

Very clever. I'm impressed. It's one of those "so obvious that nobody thought of it" mods.


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## moraino (Dec 30, 2003)

*Re: simple high/low mod for Arc LS twisty caps*

I hope everyone will try it. It works just like my home made two speed LS light using battery holder with two switches.

I used 10 ohms and just like what gadget lover said, the same light level as Arc AAA. I tried 20 ohms and it's a bit dark to my like. So I'll stay with 10 ohms and I'll use it more often for the night time because I now have a dimmer choice.

Henry


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## gadget_lover (Dec 30, 2003)

*Re: simple high/low mod for Arc LS twisty caps*

By the way, the 1/4 watt 10 ohm resistors are available from Radio Shack, 5 for 99 cents. Other values and smaller wattages are available from electronic supply shops.

A proper design would include a foam collar to hold the battery off the resistor pack when it's turned off.

Daniel


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## Kiessling (Dec 31, 2003)

*Re: simple high/low mod for Arc LS twisty caps*

I am all in for the dropin !
bernhard


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## 83Venture (Dec 31, 2003)

*Re: simple high/low mod for Arc LS twisty caps*

Me To.


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## Miciobigio (Dec 31, 2003)

*Re: simple high/low mod for Arc LS twisty caps*

Gadget Lover,

well done ! you make my day /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif
Here is my version, i used a "Thermo-sheath" i do not now if the name is correct ( in italian is "guaina termo-restringente /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif).





































And some beamshots, first level brightness





And full brightness , [email protected]_Fraen .


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## Mark_Paulus (Dec 31, 2003)

*Re: simple high/low mod for Arc LS twisty caps*

[ QUOTE ]
*Miciobigio said:*
Gadget Lover,

well done ! you make my day /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif
Here is my version, i used a "Thermo-sheath" i do not now if the name is correct ( in italian is "guaina termo-restringente /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif).



[/ QUOTE ]

I believe the term you want is "heat shrink tubing", and it is available at any/every Radio Shack over here.... 

"Viva la Bella Donna..."


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## BugLightGeek (Dec 31, 2003)

*Re: simple high/low mod for Arc LS twisty caps*

Will this work on my LSL?


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## gadget_lover (Dec 31, 2003)

*Re: simple high/low mod for Arc LS twisty caps*

Yes, it should work on all the ARC LS series without the tail switch. I'm trying to create a similar mod that will work with the tail switch.

Daniel.


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## Zelandeth (Dec 31, 2003)

*Re: simple high/low mod for Arc LS twisty caps*

I haven't got an ArcLS, but have to give credit where it's due, Excellent idea!


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## PaulW (Dec 31, 2003)

*Re: simple high/low mod for Arc LS twisty caps*

Daniel (gadget_lover),

I have been scratching my head to figure a way to do this with an SF L4. It would be nice to tone down the brightness every now and then.

So I wish you good luck on the mod you are considering, hoping that it's applicable in principle to the L4.

Paul


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## Likebright (Dec 31, 2003)

*Re: simple high/low mod for Arc LS twisty caps*

/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/ohgeez.gif Shoot, this is simple enough to do I might try it.
Thanks gadget lover
Mike


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## tvodrd (Jan 1, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low mod for Arc LS twisty caps*

A drop-in mod for some lights (firefly?) could include a neg extender in the midddle to make axial room for the resister. I've been able to sometimes accomplish the same with very careful turn-on torque, resulting in increased battery contact resistance. (Fine pitch threads help!) This design concept _needs_ to be exploited!

Larry


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## gadget_lover (Jan 1, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low mod for Arc LS twisty caps*

Muahhhhaaaaa!!! It's alive!!!!!
<font color="red">* Further research has shown that putting anything between the battery and the battery contacts is ill advised in the LS lights. The LS is machined to tight tolerances. Damage may happen if you tighten the battery pack with anything between the battery and the contacts. There is a spring replacement further down in this thread that is just as easy and is totally safe.*</font>

I've just finshed a version that goes on the bezel end of the LS, between the positive terminal and the battery. 

It works with a TSP (tail switch pack) as well as with a twisty and does not require any modifications to the light.

The end product is two metal disks connected by a resistor and held apart by the foam tape. The raw materials were purchased at the local Ace hardware store and at radio shack. It only took 20 minutes to create the drop-in.

The materials are....

1/64th inch thick brass stock, 1/2 inch wide
1/20th inch thick two sided foam tape
10 ohm resistor, 1/4 watt
nail polish

Tools:

center punch or nail
hammer
tin snips
scissors

Optional:

Solder and soldering gun

Real high tech, huh? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

1) Use the tin snips to create two disks about 3/8 to 1/2 inch across. They don't have to be perfect.

2) Snip a little bit of brass from the side of both disks, making a flat spot for the resistor. Use the center punch to make a dimple in the center of one of the disks. We'll call the one with the dimple the top disk. My top disk looks like:





3) bend the resistor leads to a ninety degree angle close to the body of the resistor. Cut them to a length of about 1/4 to 3/8 inch.

4) * NOTE* The two sided tape should leave the center of the disk clear.
Set the resistor lead across the bottom disk. Put a piece of the two sided tape OVER it, securing it against the disk. Put a second piece of two sided tape under the other lead, insulating it from the bottom disk. It should look like this:





5) Place the top disk on top of the bottom disk. The two sided tape should keep it in place. The dimple should be
up (the bump should be towards the other disk). Together, they look like this:





6) Use a bit of your favorite insulator to make sure the edges can't short against the sides of the battery compartment. It helps if you smooth the edges with a file so there are no stress points. You can use nail polish, insulating lacquer, liquid tape, epoxy, etc. Remember, If it shorts to the side, the battery will do many bad things!!!!

Here it is in place on mine:






That's it. Pop it into your LS and use your favorite battery pack. When the pack is snug you should get a low beam because the current will flow through the resistor.

When you screw it down tighter the foam should compress, allowing the bump to touch the other disk, bypassing the resistor. Tada! High beam!

<font color="red"> DO NOT TIGHTEN PAST THE POINT WHERE IT LIGHTS!</font>

Daniel


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## gadget_lover (Jan 1, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low mod for Arc LS twisty caps*

[ QUOTE ]
Zandeth wrote:
I haven't got an ArcLS, but have to give credit where it's due, Excellent idea! 

[/ QUOTE ]

Thanks Zelandeth. Now you have a reason to rush out and buy an LS /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

[ QUOTE ]
PaulW wrote:
hoping that it's applicable in principle to the L4.


[/ QUOTE ]
I don't know if it would work on the L4. Does the L4 have a 'moon mode'? If the L4 keeps going until the battery is drained it would be tough to fool it without burning up the resistor. If it's constructed like my L1, there is no room for a resistor pack at the positive terminal, so you'd have to emulate the end of the 123 cell. It's worth a try.
<font color="blue">
To everyone who've expressed thanks.... You're welcome, but it's my pleasure. I LIKE tinkering and sharing.
</font>

Daniel


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## TCG (Jan 1, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low mod for Arc LS twisty caps*

very nice. simple and cheep. 

The downside, as you so rightly point out, of this mod on the positive side of the battery is the potential for a short. Damage to the light, if not the user is possible.
Be careful if you choose to do this! 

The resistor on the ground side would seem to be a better option. 

I have been thinking along the lines of replacing the kroll battery contact spring. A pair of concentric springs, the center spring connected to the resistor and extending from the kroll slightly further than the outer spring. 

I may fool with the idea next week when I return from vacation. Thanks for the ideas.

You have a gift for turning bits of nothing into something very useful. (a poormans ls4 upgrade /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/broke.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif)

Todd


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## tylerdurden (Jan 1, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low mod for Arc LS twisty caps*

Is there any possibility this could damage the circuit? How about differences in the rev 1 and rev 2 circuits? Would a different resistor (or a different technique altogether) be needed to reproduce this? 


Thanks.


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## gadget_lover (Jan 1, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low mod for Arc LS twisty caps*

As I understand the circuit, it would cause no damage. The voltage is reduced so the LS circuits act like the battery is dying. This is a normal function of the battery and the LS circuit.

The biggest danger is over tightening the battey,forcing it into the positive contact of the circuit board. <font color="red">The spring in the TSP should prevent this from being a problem, but does not. The outside bottom of the battery contacts the bevel on the end of the TSP when tightened.</font> When using a twisty, you'd stop turning when the desired light level was achieved. The resistor does not go between the battery and the post of the twisty, so that should be OK. 


As TCG observed, the other danger lies in the possibility of shorting the battery to ground and having the battery overheat. In my moonwafer's most current incarnation the diameter has been reduced to about 3/8s of an inch and an oversized piece of foam tape donut (1/2 inch) centers it far away from the walls of the body.

A short to the body while in moon mode would result in about .9 watts of draw, so the 1/4 watt resistor should simply fry itself, becoming an open circuit. The magic smoke would warn you that something was wrong. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif


Daniel


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## TCG (Jan 1, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low mod for Arc LS twisty caps*

By damage I was refering to the possibility of the copper disk shoring across the battery. This could potentially get hot enough to hurt the circuit. Melt things etc.

As far as it working for the other revisions, or even other lights with a moon mode, why wouldn't it? To the circuit in the light this should simply look like a nearly dead battery.


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## gadget_lover (Jan 1, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low mod for Arc LS twisty caps*

[ QUOTE ]
*TCG said:*
By damage I was refering to the possibility of the copper disk shoring across the battery. This could potentially get hot enough to hurt the circuit. Melt things etc.

As far as it working for the other revisions, or even other lights with a moon mode, why wouldn't it? To the circuit in the light this should simply look like a nearly dead battery. 

[/ QUOTE ]

As TCG noted, the insulation of the edges is important, as is making the disks smaller than the camfered edge of the body near the positive terminal. It's possible to move the moonwafer to the other end of the battery, but you may need a way to hold it in place and a nub of some sort so that it contacts the bottom of the cell.

My concern about other lights is that they may be trying to boost the voltage even after the voltage is reduced by the resistor. If this happens, the current may increase to the point where the resistor will fail. An appropriate resistor value should be possible for the L4. I would hope so. Testing should be done with a resistor in place of the tailcap.

Daniel


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## gadget_lover (Jan 1, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low mod for Arc LS twisty caps*

Good news for the Surefire L4 folks. I'm assuming that the L4 has circuitry similar to the L1. The Surefire page says the L4 will produce 2 hours of "usable light" after it falls out of regulation.

I just tried the resistor trick with my L1, and it worked as expected, reducing the brightness. Probing the tailcap with an ohm-meter shows that there are multiple sets of contacts. The lower set of contacts has no resistance, and the higher set has about 12 ohms.

So the L1 does it's trick by putting a resistor in the tailcap. The threads of the tail cap do NOT conduct the electricity to the body of the light. The first contacts to touch the body of the light are the high resistance ones. The no resistance contacts touch after screwing it down another turn or two.

An L4 mod will likely use a larger resistor (both wattage and resistance) due to the higher voltage. I don't know the voltage at which it falls out of regulation so I can't guestimate the appropriate values. You may have some luck 
by starting with a 1 watt 20 ohm and working from there.

Daniel


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## gadget_lover (Jan 1, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low mod for Arc LS twisty caps *DELETED**

Post deleted by gadget_lover


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## Alan Hsu (Jan 2, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low mod for Arc LS twisty caps*

I think there's a market for the mod on Kroll since a number of mod and stock lights use the switch. Wayne, are you listening?


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## Klaus (Jan 2, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low mod for Arc LS twisty caps*

/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumbsup.gif & /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/bowdown.gif

Klaus


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## gadget_lover (Jan 2, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low mod for Arc LS twisty caps*

I really started out to modify the Kroll switch. I was not able to do it cleanly due to the clearances involved and the inability to disassemble the switch itself. The best I managed was momentary low beam with everything else normal.

The mod I'd really like to see on the Kroll would result in two 'clicks' per stroke. The first click would latch at low power. The second click would latch at high power. Partial travel would provide momentary on.

I'll be running to the local (18 mile) electronic superstore today to see if they have the component parts for dome style circuit board mounted buttons. Those are the ones that are often hidden under plastic membranes and make a slight 'snick' sound when pressed. They are little spring steel domes that pop up when released. I think I might be able to make one into a nice, long lasting and professional looking wafer.

Daniel


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## Klaus (Jan 2, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low mod for Arc LS twisty caps*

I think for next years Lummies the "Mod of the Year" would be well deserved for this - I think this category lacks anyway /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Klaus


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## Klaus (Jan 2, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low mod for Arc LS twisty caps*

Daniel,

inside the L4 tailswitch there are two little legs making the contact - we had been discussing this earlier this year how to possible bent those around a little to have one make contact first with some added resistance to get a two stage switch - we might have someone sent you a spare Z57 to work it over - any volunteers ? There should be some pic somewhere of the Z57s inside to give you an idea .... looking .. found here on page two 

Klaus


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## gadget_lover (Jan 2, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low mod for Arc LS twisty caps*

[ QUOTE ]
*Klaus said:*
Daniel,

inside the L4 tailswitch there are two little legs making the contact - we had been discussing this earlier this year how to possible bent those around a little to have one make contact first with some added resistance to get a two stage switch - we might have someone sent you a spare Z57 to work it over - any volunteers ? There should be some pic somewhere of the Z57s inside to give you an idea .... looking .. found here on page two 

Klaus 

[/ QUOTE ]

Does the Z57 fit the L1 too? I'd be happy to try the mod, but I don't have the L4, so unless it fits the L1, I'd have to borrow the L4 too.

(PM SENT)

Daniel


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## Klaus (Jan 2, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low mod for Arc LS twisty caps*

Daniel,

the Z52 LOTC and Z57 clickie are for the E-series of SF lights including the L4, which actually is a E2e body, KL4 5W head and Z57 clickie tail switch - so no - those aren´t interchangable with the A2 or L2 two switch tailcaps - if they would be you would have seen floods of WTBs for the two-switch caps to be put on L4´s to create DIY L2s aka a two or multi switch 5W LED Surefire like the ones hopefully released officially on SHOT 2004.

With a Z57 on hand and ANY E series light I think one could do some trials to see if it works - even with the incandescents I suppose - just less light OTF.

I would volunteer to sent one (non-spare) Z57 over to US if no US CPF member is brave enough to do so - I would be hesitant to sent my single complete L4 as I´m using it quite often and it is my single 5W LED flashlight I have to admit.

Klaus


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## Klaus (Jan 2, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low mod for Arc LS twisty caps*

Double post


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## McGizmo (Jan 2, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low mod for Arc LS twisty caps*

Cool Gadget_lover! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

The juices are flowing! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif The E series LOTC has a fair amount of volume and space to work with. The two part metal inner actuator could easily be replaced with some type of shelled construct that housed a resistor as well I suspect. This could be a fun project!

One side note based on speculation: When the battery(s) near depletion, the resistored "low" beam might fail to work and yet the "high" beam may still either function or provide a moon mode itself.


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## gadget_lover (Jan 2, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low mod for Arc LS twisty caps*

McGizmo, That's a good point. We can advertise it as a battery tester /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif 

Which brings evil thoughts of a voltage indicator led built into the tailcap....


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## The_LED_Museum (Jan 2, 2004)

Just a posting to get the correct thread title going for future posts. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif


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## gadget_lover (Jan 3, 2004)

Does anyone want one of these moon wafers but can't figure out how to do it? I'm refining the original concept and have some leftover usable (but ugly) wafers. I can't give a guaranty, but I'm confident that it will not burn anything out /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

There are two designs, one goes in the battery pack and works only on the 123 packs. The other design goes on the other end of the battery and allows both 123 and 2AA TSPs. The one in the battery pack is more failsafe, but it's a hassle if you want to use an AA TSP.

One of the things I'm trying to figure out is how long it will last before the foam spacer collapses leaving you with high only. My other question is how long before the contact points foul, if ever.

I've only a few at the moment, but plan to build more as my experiments continue. The postage is on me if you don't care that it's in a first class envelope.

Daniel


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## Likebright (Jan 3, 2004)

gadget lover,
I would like a couple of taylor made wafer mods for the LS with the tail switch. Would be willing pay fair price for same. Let me know when you've got the kinks worked out. I will be watching this thread. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/popcorn.gif I do hope the thread stays on topic ARC LS! Not the Surfire product. Or does the same thing work on both?
Thanks, Mike


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## this_is_nascar (Jan 3, 2004)

I would like one of each type (one for twisty and one for clicky), however I'd like to make sure you have as many as the kinks worked out as possible. Once you've considered your design to be production ready, give me a yell. Let me know the price for your efforts.


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## Klaus (Jan 3, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS - SF L4 too*

Gadgetlover -

preliminary results shows the moon-washer works fine in the L4 too /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumbsup.gif - I´m using 12 Ohm (just had that value at hand) and one Li-Ion in the L4 - CM once tested 47 Ohm to be a good value for the higher voltage 2x123 L4 setup though.

Mike - sorry for not obeying - but yes - it seems the same concept works in both light - Daniel once again /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/bowdown.gif

Preliminary means its not 110% yet - I do get two stages from twisting in and out like with the ARC LS - the clicky is working as before in the full twist in position. More testing needs to be done in this setup but it looks VERY promissing.

WE DO NEED ONE GUINEA PIG L4 TO BE LOANED TO DANIEL PLEASE

Klaus

Oh and I think this is the MEGA MOD of the YEAR - easiely modding the ARC LS and the SF L4 to two stage mode is something a lot of sweat has been poured over already and both companies have yet to come up with such products and probably will on SHOT 2004 and its January 2004 and both are avaiable almost for free from CPF related efforts /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crazy.gif


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## gadget_lover (Jan 3, 2004)

Hi folks,


I've got a dynamite design worked out that I'll be testing over the course of the next week. The challenge is in keeping it thin and yet robust. The bigger challenge is making it pretty.

The ugly prototypes are free. If you PM me with a mailing address I'll probably get one in the mail monday or tuesday.

I'm pretty sure that it will work for the Surefire L4, but I don't have one to test. I'm working with Klaus to see if I can borrow an L4 and spare clicky tailcap to modify so it works like the L1 LOTC.

Just for grins, I turned my LSH on this morning at 4:30. It's set to low beam. It's still running 10 hours later with about the same brightness. The battery had been used for about 30 minutes at full power over the last week. I'm checking the brightness with a voltmeter connected to a simple CDS cell pointed at the same wall as the light, so it's not real accurate but better than the naked eye.

If I decide to make them pretty and sell them, what would be a fair price? $5, $10 $????

Daniel.


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## gadget_lover (Jan 3, 2004)

Klaus,

Good work! Can you determine what the current draw is with 12 ohms with the Li-Ion? Is it around 30 ma?


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## Klaus (Jan 3, 2004)

Wait a sec - where´s my DMM - might be off slightly - might need to wire in my 0,1 Ohm sense resistor for a really accurate reading - standing by - 88ma - which actually is pretty close to 30/40ma through the LED I suppose. The brightness I think is quite usefull in this setup. I will do some more testing with some variable resistor and see what readings I get with whoch values. Any target current ? What current are you getting through the ARC with 10 Ohms ? I´m getting around 50ma using the 12 Ohm washer but using a possibly eroneous measurement setup with in-series DMM.

Klaus


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## gadget_lover (Jan 3, 2004)

Klaus, I wasn't too concerned about a target current. I was more concerned about the wattage of the resistor. I bought some surface mount 1/8 watt 10 ohm resistors yesterday that might be just perfect.

My LS is still busy doing the runtime test. It is still working well, producing AAA comperable light after 13 hours. For fun, I put on the high beam for a few seconds and it worked. When the test is done I'll put in a fresh battery, grab my good meter and check the ampherage again. I seem to recall it came out to around 30 ma on a CR123a.

Daniel


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## Likebright (Jan 4, 2004)

Daniel,
$10 Fer a robust, pretty one? I'd take two.

/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif Mike


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## JollyRoger (Jan 4, 2004)

Great idea, gadget_lover! Nice, cheap, and simple.

If I recall correctly, this idea has been discussed before, but with the use of conductive foam. Have you tried this?

I suppose that one difference of the resistor disc is that you get two distinct brightness levels (like the L1), whereas the conductive foam can give varying brightness levels.

I like this idea, though. It's "cleaner" in concept to me.
/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif


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## gadget_lover (Jan 4, 2004)

Well, I'm back to prototyping the construction techniques needed for this project. I just finished the runtime test for the LSH in moon mode.

My LSH ran in moon mode for about 15 hours at substantially the same light output. At 22 hours it fell off to a dim glow that was enough to read by, or walk around the dark house with.

At 28 hours I stopped test. As I picked up the light I twisted the tail to put it in full mode. Bam! It was back to moon mode again! As noted before, the battery was used for about 1/2 hour in full mode before I started the test.

Mike, noted and logged. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif I'm finding stainless steel real difficult to solder without first silver soldering it. That makes a mess and discolors the steel. The basic design I've settled on works nicely, though I'm not having luck with soldering a surface mount resistor between the two contact plates. My hands are just not steady enough in a cold garage after drinking coffee all afternoon.

Daniel


----------



## gadget_lover (Jan 4, 2004)

I hadn't thought of conducting foam. I like the idea. The conductive foam I've seen is fairly high resistance. Does anyone know of a source of low resistance foam? We'd want a 1/8 inch thickness to range from about 40 ohms down to less than 10 when fully compressed.

Daniel


----------



## tvodrd (Jan 4, 2004)

If anybody has, they're keeping it a secret. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif I've tried the black IC antistatic stuff with no luck- resistance is just way to high. I think I remember one member using it sucessfully in that mode as a circuit element to control the power electronics.

Larry


----------



## JollyRoger (Jan 4, 2004)

hmmm....maybe some kind of foam with a very small center cutout that has a piece of highly conductive metal--a small disc of the foam with a short small metal cylinder (much shorter in height than the height of the foam disc) glued in the center.

That way, the conductive foam could act as the compression rattle- reducing foam *and* the resistor, but when you crank down all the way, the battery will contact the metal in the center of the disc and you won't have the conductive foam reducing efficiency.

I have a small amount of conductive rubber from an old cracked vistalite (they use this in their switches)...maybe I should try to play with this...

Just a thought...
/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif


----------



## 1581zebra (Jan 4, 2004)

how about rubber (an o ring?) in place of the foam?


----------



## alanhuth (Jan 5, 2004)

Price it high enough so that you don't feel like you're being taken advantage of if you get lots and lots of orders. I would happily pay $15 for a nice reliable unit.


----------



## gadget_lover (Jan 5, 2004)

Zebra wrote:
[ QUOTE ]
how about rubber (an o ring?) in place of the foam? 

[/ QUOTE ]

Thats what I am using in my current prototype. I've made about 10 using o-rings. Each uncovered a different mechanical flaw. The foam technique works, but reliability will vary depending on what materials are used, how it's installed, if it's overtightened, etc. That's OK if you build it yourself. You know how to fix it. It's not OK if you got it from somewhere else and didn't understand why it works or why it stopped working.

I'm trying to make one that's bulletproof without requiring a machine shop or a jewlers workbench. I think the current design may be that good, but I just finished it and need to put it through it's paces. This version is 2/10 of an inch thick (including the .030 required for the negative contact) but that's too thick. The TSP's O-ring barely enters the shell of the bezel. I should be able to get that down to .124 inches using different material. One made to go between the positive terminal and the battery should be just under 1/10 inch.

Tomorrow I may visit a machine shop to have them pop out some contact disks in the size and thickness that I need. That should shave about .045 inch from the current package. Sigh, I don't have a punch press, much less the more exotic metalworking tools.

I'll report the progress tomorrow after the machine shop field trip.

Daniel


----------



## gadget_lover (Jan 5, 2004)

Alanhuth wrote:
[ QUOTE ]
Price it high enough so that you don't feel like you're being taken advantage of... 

[/ QUOTE ]

Actually, I'm not worried about the price too much. The best reason to ask for some money is to make sure people really want it.

I've learned that the 80/20 rule can be applied to to everything. I want to make a professional quality working model for my self. I'll spend 80% of the task making prototypes, and 20% making one that looks good once the details are worked out. Wnen it comes time to make them, 80% of the time will be setting things up, and 20% actually throwing the hardware together.

And, per Mr Murphy, I'll finally get really good at making them quickly and correctly just as I finish making the last one. I figure if I get that good, I should make some extras for those that can't do it themselves. I should also publish how they are constructed so someone else can take over who does want to charge for it.

That way I get what I want, to my standards and in my timeframe. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif By sharing the design I get ideas from other folks that may make it significantly better.

Daniel


----------



## Klaus (Jan 5, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Update on the mooon-washer in the L4:

Actually this approach isn´t feasible I think - it DID work but more by accident - for the L4 tailswitch to work it needs to be compressed almost all the way in to have the negative contact ring meet the body edge - at that point the moon-washer will be compressed already. What made it work during my initial testing was some "secondary" accidential current path set up earlier when the compressing spring was moving the washer slightly making contact to the body side and closing the current path without going through the tail switch at all.

This brought up some new idea - after dis-assembling the switch I soldered some 10 Ohm SMD resistor to the outside of one of the little legs which are slightly bent outwards when the switch is pressed. This worked as expected - I had a DIY L4+ with 2 stage switch for probably 30 minutes after which my akward solder connection broke off. During this time it worked probably exactly as the L2 - you could still use the clickie and depending how far the switch was turned in it was either off / low / or high beam mode. Voila !

Now the queston is only how to get some reliable resistored secondary current path soldered to that little leg /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crazy.gif

My ugly little moon-washer wannna-be in the ARC LS is still going strong but I very much like Daniels approach of making it even better and fool proof.

Klaus


----------



## Ratdog (Jan 5, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Just browsing and a thought hit me! How about a membrane switch? You know, those flat plastic dome switches like you find on cheap calculators or remote controls. I seem to recall seeing them as single units. Install the resistor across the normally open contacts of the switch and when the battery tube is cranked down, first the resistor would make contact for dim then the switch would close shorting the resistor and providing full brightness. Might have to give this a try myself!


----------



## TheFire (Jan 5, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

That's a very interesting thought! I'm going to go see if I can find a switch with the appropriate switching power. I think www.ittcannon.com would be a good place to look for switches, provided you could find somewhere else to get them (digikey, maybe?).

Anyway, great mod, wonderful idea! I've had something like this floating around in my head for a while, but cheers go out to gadget_lover who actually implemented it. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

Paul


----------



## gadget_lover (Jan 5, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Klaus said... 
[ QUOTE ]
This brought up some new idea - after dis-assembling the switch I soldered some 10 Ohm SMD resistor to the outside of one of the little legs

[/ QUOTE ]


I think you could mount the SMD on the INSIDE of the tailcap, then run a wire made from spring steel down through a hole drilled in the housing similar to the way the existing contacts go through. The wire would have to be epoxied in place... The SMD will not tolerate <font color="red">any </font>stress at all. The rotational forces between the battery and the tailcap are rather high.


Ratdog said...
[ QUOTE ]
How about a membrane switch? You know, those flat plastic dome switches

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree that that should be just about perfect. The plastic usually covers a little metal dome. I looked for them last week, but could not find one rated avove 100 ma. The LS will pull a lot more than that, especially as the battery level decreases. If you find a source of these that are rated at 1.5 amps or more I'd love to hear about it.

Daniel


----------



## 1581zebra (Jan 6, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

who says the disc with the nipple has to be a disc? why not a leaf spring? harden it and its bulletproof (well, temper it too)


----------



## gadget_lover (Jan 6, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Hi folks,

I did a lot of measuring today in preparation for a visit to the machine shop. I didn't go to the shop. I did come to some conclusions I'd like to share. First for twisty' tailcaps, then for TSP.

*Twisty:* The twisty caps are machined so that the battery is exactly the same size as the cavity when it's screwed down all the way. If you put anything between the battery and the battery contacts and screw it down all the way you can put a lot of force on the circuitry. This will probably break it.

A safe way to do this drop-in for the twisty is to create a donut shaped wafer that encircles the post in the tailcap. When fully compressed the battery should be touching the post in the tailcap. The original mods (tape + resistor in a coil or shrink wrap + resistor) work fine and are safe.

*TSP:* The TSP is also machined so that the battery is exactly the same size as the cavity when it's screwed down all the way. The spring in the TSP puts around 2 to 3 pounds of pressure on the battery. When fully screwed down, the spring is pretty much collapsed. Anything you put between the spring and the battery will add to that pressure and will subtract from how far you can screw the tailcap in without damage.

A safe way to do this drop-in for the TSP is to remove the spring from the kroll and put your mod there. You have about .2 inches of room. Make sure the mod does not put more than 3 pound of pressure on the battery.

*BOTH:* I thought the 2 pound spring was excessive, but find that it helps ensure a good connection between the TSP and the head of the light. With a 6 ounce spring pressure, the head of the light wiggled easily and would sometimes flicker. I put two thin 0-rings in the gap that shows between the TSP and the head when it was partially unscrewed. It put enough pressure on the threads to maintain good contact.

<font color="red">If you do create a mod that fits between the battery and the end of the battery pack you will not be able to screw the pack all the way in without damage.</font> Adding an O-ring that is the thickness of your mod to the groove between the head and the TSP may stop you from over-tightening.

1 turn of the tailpack backs it out .055 to .60 thousandths of an inch.

I'll go back and correct / modify my earlier posts where I advocated the use of discs for the mods. I don't want anyone to screw up their lights.

Oh, /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif BTW, I did replace my Kroll spring with a pair of nested springs. The springs are epoxied to a flat brass washer that fits the 3/8 inch hole in the bottom of the Krool. The inner spring is longer (.3 inches) and connected to the washer by way of a 1/8 watt resistor. The outer is shorter (.2 inches) and soldered to the washer. I used weak springs (about 6 ounces or pressure each)
and have had no problems so far. The washer snapped into the kroll just like the spring does. The compressed springs are no longer than the original Kroll spring.

I'd like to hear any other suggestions or ideas. If this design proves trouble free over the next week I'll make some up next week with stronger springs. It's easy to do once you do get the dimensions and techniques figured out.

Daniel


----------



## Klaus (Jan 6, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

This nested spring idea sounds really good to me - looking forward heasring / seeing more - this could also be some nice and easy to install add-on I think.

/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/popcorn.gif

Klaus


----------



## TCG (Jan 6, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Glad you tried the concentric springs idea. How do you keep the springs from touching. Pictures? The epoxy isulates the inner spring from the disk?


----------



## gadget_lover (Jan 6, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

The springs don't touch so far. The 1/8 inch seperation seems to be adequate. The springs are cylindrical and compress in a straight line. They do not collapse in this application.

The resistor is soldered to the inside of the hole in the washer. It is coated in epoxy after attaching the spring.

The center spring is soldered to the resistor. The epoxy that supports it also insulates it from the washer and protects the resistor from bending. A 1/8 inch tall section of clear drinking soda straw was used as a form when applying the epoxy. 

The outer spring is soldered directly to the washer.

Pictures? You want pictures? Here's a quick one.






You don't see the resistor because I used a surface mount unit. They are pain to use, so I will use conventional 1/8 watt units in the future.

Daniel


----------



## TheFire (Jan 6, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Once you get these all figured out, I expect that you could do a fairly brisk business in parts kits. They would be easy and cheap for you to provide (take the time to throw 3 parts in a bag), and end up costing those of us who wouldn't mind actually doing the mod less as well. I would certainly pay a few bucks to avoid going out and finding a set of springs and washers that were the appropriate size and compression strength.


----------



## PaulW (Jan 6, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

[ QUOTE ]
*TheFire said:*
. . . I expect that you could do a fairly brisk business in parts kits. . . . 

[/ QUOTE ]

Oh yes! I would be in for a couple of kits for the Arc and a kit for the L4, if that turns out to be possible. 

You're doing some nice work there, Gadget Lover. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumbsup.gif

Paul


----------



## gadget_lover (Jan 6, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Yea, the parts are simple to find once you know exactly what you are looking for. Here's what I used:





The springs were in a "spring kit" from harbor freight tools, trimmed to size, the resistor from my local electronics store and the washer from the local 'true value' hardware store.

I wonder how many LS owners there are?

Daniel


----------



## darkgear.com (Jan 6, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

At least 500 (lights not owners) are registered in the LS roll call thread /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif


----------



## TCG (Jan 6, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Thanks for the pictures. This looks great. Replacing the kroll spring is the way to go. The concentric springs should run many cycles more than the wafer and foam pad mod. 

Great Job. 

Todd


----------



## gadget_lover (Jan 7, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Well, I'm finally done with my R&D for the Kroll Spring replacement. It does not require changes to the light. It does not put more pressure on the circuitry than the original spring. It should prove to be as robust as the Kroll itself. It allows the battery pack to be screwed in fully. It works in the TSP-123 as well as the TSP-2AA. 

/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif *In short, it does what I wanted.*

EDIT: R&D is never really done. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif You can see version 2 for another solution to the same problem.


The parts list:
5 minute epoxy. Kwik JB-Weld works well.
solder
3/8 inch brass washer (for #6 screw)
3/8 x 3/4 x 032 compression spring (part C-566)
7/32 x 1 x 020 compression spring (part C-530)
1/8 watt 10 ohm resistor
2 inch piece of 26 ga insulated wire.

The springs are from Century Spring Company, sold by a local True Value Hardware. The springs are cut to size, so longer or a touch shorter are OK. The washer and epoxy was also from the same store.

It's difficult to solder to a part that's epoxied because of the low melting temperature of the epoxy. Just as you get it hot enought to solder the glue breaks free. JB-Weld has a higher heat tolerance (500 degrees). The "Marine JB-Weld" sets in 5 minutes, cures in hours and will withstand 500 degrees. "Kwik JB-Weld" sets and cures as quickly as the Marine variety, but can start to break down over 300 degrees. Kwik seems to do fine with short periods of soldering.


I used the 7/32 inch (lighter spring) for high beam contact. It was soldered directly to the center of the washer. It's not a strong spring, but does not have to be. This spring was cut down to about 2/10 of an inch.

The outer (heavier) spring is the low beam contact as well as the source of pressure needed to keep the threads in good contact. The outer spring was potted in epoxy with no direct electrical contact to the washer. It was cut to about 3/8 of an inch and the end was bent so it would not catch on the battery or dig in.

The resistor was soldered to the inside of the washer and the lead was snaked through a coil of the inner spring and soldered to the outer spring. A piece of insulation from another wire was slipped over the resistor lead before soldering to keep it from contacting the inner coil.

The washer is a press fit into the Kroll's spring recess.

The springs are light enough that they can be cut while in the switch using simple wire cutters. As a matter of fact each assembly should be tailored to the specific light to adjust for manufacturing tollerances in the Kroll.

After it's fully assembled you should carefully cut the center spring down just enough that it makes contact during the last turn of the battery pack. This will maximize the thread contact when you use moon mode (unscrewed 1 turn).

You should also ensure that the springs are not too long when fully compressed. Test procedure: 1) remove the tailpack. 2) screw the modified kroll in all the way 3)put the battery in and compress it all the way. 4) unscrew the Kroll. You should feel the pressure go down but should not feel the battery move.

Construction process:

1) Clean the washer surfaces and the springs to remove any oils. Sanding may be required to remove plating or coatings where they will contact or be soldered.
2) Cut the springs to length with wire cutters or metal snips, bending the ends so that they don't snag
3) Tin the surface of the washer (light coat of solder on the surface). do the same for the bottom of the inner spring, then solder the inner spring to the center of the washer.
4) Spread a thin coat of epoxy on the washer bewteen the edge of the washer to the edge of the inner spring. Wait a few minutes and then place the outer spring in place without a lot of pressure. Go play with your other flashlights for a couple hours.
5) Cut one lead of the resistor real short (1/4 inch) and curl it. Tin it, then solder it into the hole in the washer so that the resister stands up inside the inner spring.
6) Strip a small piece of insulation from a small guage wire (26 guage works for me) and place that insulation over the resistor's free lead. Poke the lead through the lowest coil of the inner spring.
7) Cut the insulation as short as possible while still making sure that the free lead will not contact the inner spring. Solder the lead to the outer spring as close to the washer as possible, then trim the excess. Be careful, as the outer spring may not be very secure.
8) Check all work with an ohm meter. If all is OK, you'll see no resistance between the center spring and the washer and about 10 ohms between the the outer spring and the washer.
9) Put a second coat of epoxy on the bottom coil of the outer spring to re-inforce it a bit.

If all is OK, clean up any excess glue or solder that is on the edge or bottom of the washer.

Pulll the conical center spring from the kroll switch. Push the spring assembly into it's place. The washer must cleanly contact the gold colored spring on the bottom of the switch. If the washer is a real tight fit, you may pull apart the assembly trying to remove it from the kroll in the future. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif Now is the time to sand the edges of the washer (if ever).

I hope this is as useful to others as it has been for me.

Daniel


----------



## TCG (Jan 7, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Excellent! 

When you gonna send me one to beta test? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif


----------



## JollyRoger (Jan 7, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

oh, you think you're so funny, TCG! I think he's already beta-tested this himself!
/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif
(I know, it couldn't hurt to ask)


----------



## gadget_lover (Jan 7, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

I'll tell you what... This evening I will make up a batch of 5 or 6. I just ordered an LSL so I'll need another one anyway /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

As thanks for help with this project (ideas and criticism):
One's for Klaus, one for Nascar, one for TCG, maybe one for my doctor (also an flashaholic), one for likebright and I think for grins I may send one to Peter. I'll mail the basic parts to paulw.

Now it's up to the entrepreneurs of CPF to make and sell them. I'd love to see Peter include one with each LS that he sells.

Daniel.


----------



## this_is_nascar (Jan 7, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Excellent Daniel. Thanks a bunch.


----------



## TCG (Jan 7, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Thank you Daniel!


----------



## PaulW (Jan 7, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Daniel,

If you want to send the parts that would be great. I'll use your directions to fabricate the drop-in and report how well it goes. That should be an interesting test of a kit because I'm only moderately skilled at this kind of thing.

Paul


----------



## tvodrd (Jan 7, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Daniel,

You get my vote for "Bang-for-the-buck mod of they year." /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumbsup.gif

Larry


----------



## Klaus (Jan 8, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Much appreciated Daniel

Klaus


----------



## MR Bulk (Jan 8, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Daniel,

I am truly dazzled. If you care to make up a completed Kroll w/concentric springs/SMT resistor for me, consider it sold. And name yo' pross.


----------



## VMamie (Jan 8, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

So the flashlight is not modified at all, not even the Kroll switch? Should I obtain extra Kroll switch in my attempts at creating this "drop-in" high/low switch?

This is really great stuff, I use flashlight for reading or illuminating my laptop's keyboard while my wife sleeps, so I don't need too much light. Plus I love the extra long runtime this low mode gives. I am still waiting on my first Luxeon and Arc flashlight. Does Arc provide more of their Kroll switches for a fee and shipping costs? Or is their Kroll switches standard and obtainable elsewhere, if so where can I get more, ratshack?

Hey Daniel, what if the resistor is more of a variable version like a small potentiometer instead? Then with a small (eyeglass repair) screwdriver you can poke through the hole in the washer and adjust the resistance as a way to make more or less light available on the fly, sort of...

Thanks!


----------



## gadget_lover (Jan 8, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Mr Bulk, I've run out of 1/8 watt resistors, so I'm stuck with SMT at the moement. For grins, I'm trying to use it with the reversed spring (inner is shorter and lighter) design. It's not going good. Of the 5 prototypes today, only 1 came out well, and I'm not sure why it was different. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif If I can get it to work, I'll send you one if you send me a PM with a mailing address. You get to supply your own Kroll (I don't have any spares).

VMamie, You are correct that neither the Kroll nor the light are not altered in any way. The conical spring in the Kroll pulls out with only a tug. The washer+spring assembly is pressed into place where the original spring was. The washer can be removed and the original spring will fit back in.

Daniel


----------



## gadget_lover (Jan 9, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Oh, about the use of a potentiometer: I think it would be neat, but you only have a space less than 5/16 across and 2/10 high to work in. The springs have to compress into that area, so it gets tight quickly. I have enough problems doing this with discrete components. If you manage to do one with a pot I'd like to have a copy /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

Daniel


----------



## Likebright (Jan 10, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Dan, pm sent.
This sounds really interesting. 
I already EDC my LSHF-P this would, indeed, be a added dimension.
Mike


----------



## gadget_lover (Jan 10, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Thank you gifts (spring assembies) are in the mail to Paulw, Nascar, TCG and Mr. Gransee. Kraus and Likebright will get thiers next week when I can get to the post office again. I think I promissed one to Mr. Bulk too. (memory getting hazy, nust need new battery!)

If anyone else wants the parts and can't find them, I'll send the springs, washer and resistor if you send $2.00 to cover the cost of postage, padded envelope and parts. PM me for address.

I'll not be assembling these. There are much more talented people on this forum that may want to do that, and I'm sure they can provide better quality work.

Daniel


----------



## this_is_nascar (Jan 10, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Thanks again Daniel. What can I do as a jesture of my appreciation? Any interest in a red Dorcy 1xAAA LED light? If so, PM or E-Mail me your address.


----------



## Alan Hsu (Jan 11, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Has anyone tried it on the Surefire Z52?


----------



## gadget_lover (Jan 11, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

[ QUOTE ]
*Alan Hsu said:*
Has anyone tried it on the Surefire Z52? 

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't think it's been tried. The trick relies upon a smart voltage regulator that does not try to boost the current once the voltage drops to a certain point. It probably would not work with any incandescent.

You might be able to create a similar spring assembly for the Z52, but it requires either altering or removing the stock spring. This is trivial with the Kroll switch, I don't know how difficult it would be with the Surefire.

Daniel


----------



## gadget_lover (Jan 11, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

[ QUOTE ]
*this_is_nascar said:*
Thanks again Daniel. What can I do as a jesture of my appreciation? Any interest in a red Dorcy 1xAAA LED light? If so, PM or E-Mail me your address.


[/ QUOTE ]

Wait a second! That was MY gesture of appreciation for your feedback and ideas /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif
But thanks for the offer.

Daniel


----------



## VMamie (Jan 12, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Daniel,

PM Sent.


----------



## gadget_lover (Jan 14, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Hi folks.

The ARCs I have available for testing are pretty few. My previous tests have all been done with an LSH-P (premium). Today I got an LSH-S (standard). I found the same spring+resistor assembly produced a lower light output in the new light.

I set up my trusty pseudo lux meter (a CDS cell attached to an ohm meter) and did some measurements. I found the standard LSH produced the same light output with 8 ohms as the LSH-P did with 11. According to the p-lux meter, the premium was about 50% brighter (a reading of 50 compared to 75) with the same resistor and battery.

So, if you are creating your own mods, you might want to try various resistances in the range of 5 to 20 ohms to see which gives you the level you want.

I find a beam about as bright as the ARC AAA is good for most close up work, walking at night, etc. The LSH's hotspot makes it look like it will throw a lot farther than the AAA, but that's an optical illusion. 

Just more food for thought.

Daniel


----------



## Wolfen (Jan 14, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

If anyone makes a couple extraof these I would really like to try one out. I have a Surefire / Kroll-McGizmo modded tail cap on my L4. A perfect light for dual output.


----------



## PaulW (Jan 14, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Daniel,

My drop-in assembly and parts arrived in the mail. What a beautiful job you did! And how tiny it is. BTW, it works great, just as advertised. It's like a preview of the Arc4+ I ordered.

I'm using it in an Arc Premium, and the low beam is as bright as my Arc AA. It's just perfect for use reading a menu in a dark restaurant or finding my way in a theater after the movie has started.

I'm going to get out a large magnifying glass and try to duplicate your work for my other Arc. It ought to be a very satisfying project/mod.

Thanks for making all this fun possible.

Paul


----------



## PaulW (Jan 14, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

[ QUOTE ]
*Wolfen said:*
If anyone makes a couple extraof these I would really like to try one out. I have a Surefire / Kroll-McGizmo modded tail cap on my L4. A perfect light for dual output. 

[/ QUOTE ]

Wolfen,

It would be great in an L4. But I think that it woould be substantially different from the way the Arc drop-in is constructed. The L4 has a set of contacts in the Tailcap that contact the body (part of the lock-out feature). I believe that the resistor would have to be located in that part of the circuit rather than in the spring. In any event, it will be a more challenging application and might involve disassembling the switch.

I don’t mean to discourage anyone from trying. I would love to see it done. But it will take a great deal of skill and effort. I would pay a competent modder $10 to $20 to do it for me.

Paul


----------



## gadget_lover (Jan 14, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Paul, I'm glad that it got there OK. It's really pretty simple to assemble using the instuctions posted earlier in this thread.  (constuction details post)  

Did you check the springs for proper length? The post I reference above describes how. I did not adjust the spring lengths because I was not sure how much variance there was between individual Kroll switches and ARC battery packs. It's important that the compressed spring does not extend too far from the threaded hole in the battery pack. That would be the longer spring.

I like mine adjusted so that it's low beam until the very last turn of the battery pack. That is accomplished by carefully trimming or bending the shorter (inner) spring

Daniel


----------



## PaulW (Jan 14, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Daniel,

Yes, the springs are too long. I haven’t screwed the tail all the way in because of that. I plan to follow the spring cutting adjustments this evening.

I will use Post #438201 (01/07/04 03:52 PM) for instructions. I think that’s the one you mean. This is the one that describes your final configuration, with the larger-diameter, outer spring being the longer one (as opposed to earlier configurations and pictures where the smaller-diameter inner spring is longer).

Paul


----------



## gadget_lover (Jan 14, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Paul, thanks for the heads up on the link. The number on the message did not match the number in the header. I've fixed it now.

Let me know how the adjustment goes... It hasn't given me problems but....

Daniel


----------



## PaulW (Jan 14, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Daniel,

I finished the "adjustment." I ended up snipping each spring a few times until I got it just right. It works like a charm.

I have discovered something that I think takes this mod to a new dimension. I found a third mode on mine. When the tail is screwed on to a "sweet spot" -- the point where it almost turns on the high beam, but not quite -- I can get a _boost_ effect. That is, when the light is on, it's on low beam. But just by depressing the kroll (or the metal part of the tail) a little bit, the high beam will come on.

And it does even more. It's quite sensitive to touch. From the off position, if I squeeze the head with my fingers and press the switch with my thumb, it comes on high. If I squeeze the tail with my index finger and press the switch with my thumb, it comes on high. No twisting of the tail is required. 

The momentary mode is even more fun. If I have it on momentary low, just by moving my little finger, I can switch it to momentary high. It doesn't take much practice to achieve remarkable control.

This effect is evidently due to some slack in the threads. I don't know whether it can be obtained with all Arc LSs. I hope so, though. Imagine making your way through the house in the wee hours while on low beam. If you hear a crash on the other side of the room, or heavy breathing, just a tiny twitch of the finger gives a boost to high beam.

I'm playing with my upgraded Arc LS and, as Kramer once blurted, "I'm a lovin' it!" /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Paul


----------



## Wolfen (Jan 14, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

PaulW,
I have a *Kroll switch * inside the shell of the SureFire LOTC. Don McGizmo made a few of these. It uses the stock Kroll springs.


----------



## gadget_lover (Jan 14, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Wolfen, the mod *should* work in a Kroll in an L4, but we haven't established the appropriate wattage or resistance for the L4. I'll have one to examine within a week, so I'll let you know then.

Daniel


----------



## this_is_nascar (Jan 14, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Daniel, it arrived today. It took me an entire 30-seconds to be up and running in my ARC LSH-P. This MOD kicks ***. You are da' man.

/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/bowdown.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/buttrock.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumbsup.gif

I'd like you to make me 2-more units please. I will pay you $15.00 each, assuming you feel that's a fair price for parts and labor. I hope my offer doesn't insult you if, in fact, I'm too low on my offering.


----------



## gadget_lover (Jan 14, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Nascar, are you sure you don't just want the parts so you can enjoy the thrill of assembling it yourself? The smell of curing epoxy and burned fingertips from the soldering iron can be (ahem) invigorating.

/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

If you really want be to do it for you, I will. I'm doing another batch because my new LSH came with the 123-tsp and the 2AA TSP. It's amazing how quickly I became used to having it. Send me a PM to let me know if you want parts VS assembled.

I hope the one I sent Peter Gransee worked just as well. I'd really like to see him make and sell them with the LS line to keep it alive after the ARC4 is available. It would not be as efficient as the ARC4, but it does make it more than competitive with the SF L1.

Daniel


----------



## TCG (Jan 14, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Well, my mailbox was empty today, so I can't share the joy quite yet. I did fool around and do some looking at my L4 thou. 

A 10 ohm 1/4 watt resistor across the back brings my L4 to about the same brightness as my lsh-p. Held it there for about 1 minute and the resistor didn't get very warm. Not enough hands to measure the current at the moment. 

Replacing the spring on the Z57 clicky switch should work very well. The spring is the only thing that touches the back of the battery. Problem is there doesn't seem to be an easy way of non-destructivley removing the spring from the Z57. I took it apart (what a ***** that was) in hopes that the part connected to the battery spring could be removed and replace with something machined to fit. Not quite that easy. Need to think on it some more. 

The lotc (z52?) from the e1e shows more promise. The spring is similarly sized to the kroll battery spring and pulls out of a pocket the same way. The diameter of the spring pockets are close enough that the springs can be interchanged. A mod very similar to what Daniel has created would probably work well with the lotc. Possibly even the same mod he created for the lsh. The spring pocket in the lotc measures 0.030 smaller in diameter than the pocket in the kroll. 

Might try something like that after I examine Daniels handywork when it arrives. Odds are the talented Daniel and his magic bottle of glue might beat me to it thou. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

Todd


----------



## gadget_lover (Jan 15, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Todd, Is that the level you would want? How about others? Does a 20 Ohm resistor give you something close to an Arc AA level?

If the spring on the L4 is similar to the one on my L1, I'd imagine that the spring could be fully compressed and trapped there by a second spring assembly that fits up against the sides of the cap.

What we are hoping is that there will be a reasonable way to add a third contact leg to the Z57 tailcap.

Daniel


----------



## TCG (Jan 15, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Here is the z57 (by the light of the Super Baby Pin /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif)







Hard to see, but the spring is wrapped around a small center post that is then flaired out with a punch or press. It would be easy to remove, but hard to put back. 

20 ohms is a little brighter than the arc aaa. lots bigger beam thou. It would be very usable at that level. 

Todd


----------



## gadget_lover (Jan 15, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Funny, my previous pictures were illuminated by my LSH! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

That's not the same spring design as the L1. It might be possible to trim this spring down and put a second one outside it connected by a resistor. I'm not sure it would work well. I'm still thinking that a third contact may be the way to go with this switch.

Yet another other thought was a thin wavy washer the same diameter as the battery tube that would sit between the tailcap and the battery tube. It could be built to have lower resistance when the peaks were pressed down. With the right materials (nichrome wire?) it might even act as a variable resistor.

Hmmmmmm.

Daniel


----------



## this_is_nascar (Jan 15, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Daniel, PM sent.


----------



## this_is_nascar (Jan 15, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

I don't know anything about resistors and electronics and all that good stuff, so bare with me. I have a question concerning this MOD. I haven't had the time to prove this one way or the other on this one that I have. Since this resistor is cutting the current flow to the LED, how does that affect runtime. For example, a normal LSH running un-modded yeilds 2-hours of constant bright light. With this MOD in low-beam mode, am I still only to expect 2-hours or will the runtime be largly increased?


----------



## TCG (Jan 15, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Would you like an explanation or just an answer. 

The simple answer is that in the low level mode the run time will be greatly increased. Compared to something like the arc4 at the same brightness, the runtimes will be shorter. Power is wasted in the resistor. 

The worst case would be to choose a resistor that left the light in regulation. Then the runtime would actually go down with the resistor in place.

An experiment is worth a thousand words. Put your light on low, and let it run all night. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif 

If you would like, I could try to explain in more detail later tonight.

Todd


----------



## this_is_nascar (Jan 15, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Thanks Todd. Running the light all night is exactly what I'm planning to do. It's be running for about 40-minutes now. I think I may be able to prove or dissprove this by letting the light run in low-mode for 2.5 hours or so, then try to go to high. If high-beam yields sun-mode, that would prove to me that less power is being consumed, since normal moon-mode would occur at the 2 hour and 10 minute mark on this particular LSH.


----------



## gadget_lover (Jan 16, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

The resistor is in series with the electronics. It forces it out of regulation. The resistor drops the current to about 30ma, depending on the resistance of the circuitry and LED. Assuming 1300 mah in a CR123a, that's 43 hours at 30ma. As the battery voltage drops, so does the current and the LED light level.

I've run mine for 24 hours straight. I posted about it somewhere in this thread. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif I started with a battery that was used for a while, then turned it on and left it on. At 12 hours I stopped the test to see if it would still enter Sun-mode. Yup, it did. It started to dim after 16 hours or so, but was still usable at 24 hours. It came back to a nice bright 'moon mode' when I put it in high beam after 24 hours.

I'm guessing that I can get about 30 - 40 hours of moon mode IF I don't use sun-mode and start with fresh batteries. I figure that mine's mostly in moon mode, and I use it for 5 to 10 minutes a day. I'll have to replace the battery sometime in March to assure that I have Sun-mode when I want it. If I just use it till it dims out I'll be replacing the battery in June or July.

I'm sure the ARC4 will do even better simply because it uses PWM for dimming instead of resistance. It will also step down to the next level when the battery can no longer handle the currnt required for the current level.

Daniel


----------



## this_is_nascar (Jan 16, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

The is awesome. Last night, I ran on dim-mode from 9:15 pm until 6:00 am this morning. I had left the light on the LM631. It had only dropped 2-ticks the entire time. I than fired up to full power and sun mode light brightly. I didn't have a chance to leave it on sun-mode very long, but it was nice to see that it was capable of doing so.


----------



## Klaus (Jan 16, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Talking about 2 ticks makes me think you talk about the ARC4 and not the "moon spring" though ? 

/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif

Klaus


----------



## this_is_nascar (Jan 16, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

No, I'm talking about this modification. The light meter only dropped 2-ticks, numbers, units (call it what you will). This is extremely impressive.


----------



## Klaus (Jan 16, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Sorry Ray - I was just confused as the digital regulation on the ARC4 was referred to as "ticks" and so I thought as a tester of those units you just posted in the wrong thread.

Klaus


----------



## Alan Hsu (Jan 16, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Now if someone can make the modded Kroll switch as a regular item at the Shoppe...


----------



## gadget_lover (Jan 17, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

I've found that using JB-WELD instead of normal epoxy is a good idea for this project.

JB-Weld allows you to make final solder connections without the epoxy melting. Kwik JB-Weld is not as temperature tollerant (only good for 300 degress) but cures in a couple hours and sets quickly. The Kwik version does not appear to have any problems with short soldering sessions.

Daniel


----------



## Likebright (Jan 25, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

I just received my drop in Kroll switch mod from gadget lover and I have to say it is a great addition to my Arc LSH. With the two power levels it doubles the versatility of the light. 
Great Job Dan! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumbsup.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink2.gif
Thanks
Mike


----------



## MR Bulk (Jan 25, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

GOT mine yesterday, but have not had a chance to try it yet. Just wanted to say THANKS, Daniel! Let me know if you ever need anything...


----------



## gadget_lover (Jan 26, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

I expect Mr. Bulk to be too busy for a while due wrangling the VIP logistics. That's a good thing. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif 

Glad they got there OK. I worry that some postal inspector will see springs and things (in an envelope) on an Xray machine and send the Homeland Security guys to my house for a little talk. Nah, not really, but I can see them delayed if the springs trip a metal detector.

Have fun with them guys.

Daniel

P.S. Mr. Bulk has already paid me back; He put me on the list to buy one of his new VIP models.


----------



## Klaus (Jan 26, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Got my mail from Daniel today - WOW - Thank you very much and again I want to propose this for the gadget / mod of the year ! It also works nicely on other Kroll-equipped lights (like my 2AA/3AA bodies driving SF KL1/KL4 heads) and should work fine on Mag/Sandwich/Kroll combos too.

Klaus


----------



## Ben H (Jan 26, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Daniel,

Thanks for sharing the details of this mod with us all. What a great idea. I made a couple of these this weekend and they work awesome. They weren't as hard to make as I first feared.


----------



## gadget_lover (Jan 27, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

[ QUOTE ]
*Klaus said:*
Got my mail from Daniel today - WOW - Thank you very much and again I want to propose this for the gadget / mod of the year ! It also works nicely on other Kroll-equipped lights (like my 2AA/3AA bodies driving SF KL1/KL4 heads) and should work fine on Mag/Sandwich/Kroll combos too.

Klaus 

[/ QUOTE ]

Thanks for the compliment. Much appreciated.

As for using this with other lights, there is a possible "gotcha". This problem arises if the boost circuitry sees the lower voltage and tries to increase the current to make up for it. This will overload the resistor, causing it to let the magic smoke out. This should only be a problem when using low value resistors (under 6 ohms at a guess) or multiple batteries. 3 x CR123A is 9 volts, so a 5 ohm resistor may not drop the voltage enough to force the light out of regulation. 

If you smoke the resistor, you will end up with only the "full power" mode left.

On a related note. I see a 66 ohm resistor drops the current in my new streamlight TL-3LED to 45 ma. Total power disipated by the resistor just is just inder 1/8 watt. The LUX5 at 45ma still has a killer hot spot that's plainly visible on the far wall of my living room with the lights on.

Daniel


----------



## gadget_lover (Feb 1, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Hi Folks,

I changed the design a bit so that it uses only one spring and does not have to be soldered after the epoxy is applied. If anyone wants the gory details I can post them. The end result is functionally the same, the new way is just a bit easier (for me, anyway) to assemble. Being a good techie, I'm never quite satisfied. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

I also posted in the B/S/T forum that I'll sell completed units for $12.50 each including postage. Ordering information is there in a thread titled "FS: Hi/Low beam spring for ARC LSH".

I've gotten several queries from folks that want to use one in a modified LS. Those would be the ones hopped up to drive the LED at 700 ma. The mod works fine with those witha 10 ohm resistor.. It will also work with other lights with 3 volt power packs.

I've been sick this last week, so I've been slow to repsond to folks. Sorry about that. Let me know if I've forgotten to respond to an of you.

Daniel


----------



## Klaus (Feb 1, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Thanks again Daniel,

and yes - please tell us the "easier way" /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif


/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumbsup.gif

Klaus


----------



## Bullzeyebill (Feb 1, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Will this drop in work with first run LS's, with voltage regulator. Current ARC LS's have current regulation, but you knew that.

Bill


----------



## gadget_lover (Feb 1, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Actually, I did not know that the original had voltage reg VS the current model's current regulation. 

I saw it work in an LSH with the serial nuber "002" last Friday, but that does not answer the question.

The mod allows you to knock the LS out of regulation. Does the first run LS drop into moon mode when the battery voltage drops? I'd appreciate it if you could test it for me. Simply use a 10 ohm resistor to complete the circuit from the negative end of the battery to the threads of the ARC's body. The 10 ohm resistors are available at radio shack in a pack of 5 for one dollar.

Daniel.


----------



## Bullzeyebill (Feb 1, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

I will get some at RS tomorrow and test. Can I test for current draw at same time? 

Bill


----------



## gadget_lover (Feb 1, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

[ QUOTE ]
*Bullzeyebill said:*
I will get some at RS tomorrow and test. Can I test for current draw at same time? 

Bill 

[/ QUOTE ]

Sure. Just set your meter to milliamps and go from battery to resistor to meter to threads. It sometimes takes 4 hands to do that. I frequently tape the light to a solid surface like the coffee table, much to my wife's chagrin.

Daniel


----------



## gadget_lover (Feb 1, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Hi Folks,

I'm going to try to describe the new version and the technique used to build it.

*General:* 
A single spring is insulated from a brass washer. A resistor is connected from the washer to the spring, as low as possible. The resistor is bent in such a way that as the spring is compressed the lowest loop contacts the resistor's lead, giving full power.

There are several key points;
<ul type="square">[*] Soldering should be done before applying epoxy. Heat weakens epoxy.
[*] The resistor's leads should not have to move. If they do, they will eventually break.
[*] The lowest coil should be coated with epoxy to prevent the contact from shorting.
[*] A 1/4 watt resistor can be made to fit. These are easier to find than 1/8 watt.
[*] The epoxy sets quickly, so only epoxy 3 or 4 at a time. I find that I make 3 batches of epoxy with each run. One to paste the spacers, one to attach the spring and a final to make sure the bottom coil and resistor are properly coated.
[/list] 

*PARTS LIST:*
Spring - 3/8 x 3/4 x .032 (C-566 from century springs). Use one half
Resistor - 10 ohms for an LSH-P
Washer - Brass #6 from True Value. 3/8th inch outside diameter.
Spacer - Cardboard or plastic disc cut to match washer.

Here's the spacer, the resistor soldered to the washer and the spring.






*Supplies:*
JB-Weld - Kwik or Marine.
Solder - 40/60 rosin core


*Tools:*
Low wattage soldering iron with small tip
Needle nose pliers
Fine sand paper (200 grit or finer)
Small file or dremel with grinder.
Exacto knife or scalpel.
Any ohm-meter (DMM, analog, etc).

*Pictures:*
In these drawings, the gold is the brass washer. The light grey is the plastic spacer. The dark grey are the leads. The spring is blue and the brown is the resistor.

This is a drawing of the device from above. Note the lead of the resistor that goes all the way to the edge and then folds back on itself before connecting to the washer. The spacer is not shown for clarity.






This next drawing is a cutaway from the side. It gives an idea of the layers involved.






Next we have the side view.






Ok, here's the project without the final epoxy coat. The spacer is epoxied to the washer. In the second you can see the edge of the resistor's lead pushed out of the way so that it doesn't get epoxy on it in the next step.










And lastly, the finished product. In the second picture the contact is clearly visible.








*Adjustments:*
Like the type 1 spring assembly, the springs should be short enough that no extra pressure is placed on the battery when fully compressed. There are enough variations in the battery pack, battery size and kroll switch that no single spring length will be perfect. Follow the spring length instructions from the type 1 instructions.

After the spring is short enough, you can adjust the contact point by bending the top coil of the spring down or up. Use two pairs of pliers to avoid over stressing the epoxy. Bend the last coil towards the washer to delay the full beam. Bend it up (away from the washer) to cause the full beam when the battery pack is only half screwed in. 

No, I am not selling these.

Daniel


----------



## TheFire (Feb 2, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Wow. I really liked the original idea, liked it even better when the kroll version came up, and am now in awe of this option. Great Work!


----------



## Klaus (Feb 2, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

[ QUOTE ]
*Bullzeyebill said:*
Will this drop in work with first run LS's, with voltage regulator. Current ARC LS's have current regulation, but you knew that.

Bill 

[/ QUOTE ]

Bill,

just tested this for you - and YES it does work - you will obviously need to use one of the TSP 123 or TSP 2AA bodies with the old rev1 head though - and you MIGHT need to fiddle a little with the length of the springs.

I can confirm that the low beam does work while its brighter than the current regulated rev2 falling in moon mode as the resistor seems to drop the voltage not enough to get a similar dimm brightness level. Remember the rev1 circuit worked to lower voltage levels than the rev2 which might be part of the issue.

It might be advisable to use a slightly higher resistance for this rev1 ARC mod though - for modding the original twistie packs there is still Daniels original moon-washer approach which is described at the beginning of the thread.

Klaus 

Edited for clarity


----------



## gadget_lover (Feb 2, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Klaus, I'm having problems parsing this: [ QUOTE ]

he low beam does work while being slightly brighter than the current regulated rev2 falling in moon mode as the resistor does drop the voltage to the rev1 head to a lower and therefore not as bright level. 

[/ QUOTE ]

Was the revision 1 dimmer with 10 ohms, or was it brighter? Is it likely that the difference is simply one of the BIN of the Luxeon?

Daniel


----------



## Klaus (Feb 2, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Daniel,

excuse my poor english and spagetti-type sentences /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/blush.gif

What I wanted to say is that the low level with the rev1 circuit (voltage regulated) is BRIGHTER than the rev2 circuit (current regulated) using the same switch (yours) at 10Ohm I think.

I *think* this is due to the rev2 circuit falling out of regulation with the 10Ohm resistor whereas the voltage regulated rev1 circuit which works down to lower voltages anyway keeps the current to the LED higher when resistored down by 10Ohm. Therefore my *guess* that using a slightly higher resistance might drop the rev1 circuit to the same lower brightness level.

As the combination of TSP packs with Rev1 heads was never shipped by ARC and might not in too broad circulation though this shouldn´t be an issue as its working OK, just a bit brighter - if you want to be able to offer the "right" brightness with the old rev1 heads & TSP combos too I could do some further testing and see what resistor value would be appropiate to reach a somewhat similar (lower) brightness level.

Klaus


----------



## dtlent (Feb 2, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Just to let you all know that Gadget_Lover is an ingenious person! I just picked-up one of his drop in high/low units and it works perfectly!

Low Power similar to what an AAA-LE would put out and the original Hi Power the ARC LS normally puts out! Well worth the cost to purchase from Gadget_Lover.

Thanks, Daniel!


----------



## gadget_lover (Feb 2, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Dlent, It was nice to meet you. Thanks for the testimonial. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

Klaus; Your engish is MUCH better than My german. It's also better than many people who post messages on the internet. I only know the german word for no, and I'd probably misspell it. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

The exact level of brightness varies from light to light, so I won't worry about it unless someone makes a special request.

Daniel


----------



## Zigzago (Feb 3, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Congratulations to gadget_lover for an elegant, ingenious design. I'll probably order a couple.

One concern though: is it possible that this mod might make the Kroll less reliable? I'm thinking of jamming, broken springs, etc. I know the Krolls aren't perfect to begin with and I wouldn't want to increase the odds of a malfunction.


----------



## TheFire (Feb 3, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

I don't think it makes the switch less reliable in the other ways it fails (that's usually inside the mechanical portion of the switch). I think that it shouldn't increase the odds too much, especially this new design.


----------



## gadget_lover (Feb 3, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

I'll probably draw fire for this, but I'd assert that the kroll may become more reliable. 

A prime cause of switch failure is burn spots on the contacts where the initial contact is made. My understanding is the burn is worse with more current.

The tendancy is to leave the LS is low beam most of the time so most of the time when you turn it on there's only 30 milliamps or so instead of up to an amp.

Having said that... I could be wrong! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

If properly adjusted, the spring will not add any stress to the kroll or the battery. Only the spring flexes, so there should be nothing extra wearing out.

Daniel


----------



## JoeyL (Feb 3, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Hello folks!

I am the lucky recipient of one of these new spring modules and it worked great from first application. I've been playing with it for the last few days and it really is an ingenious design. No muss, no fuss and no tweaking needed.
Great job, Daniel!

I'll try this L4 dimmer next. Now that would be amazing.


----------



## gadget_lover (Feb 3, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Has anyone actually tried to build their own spring assemblies from the instuctions / descriptions I posted? 

Daniel


----------



## jpeg (Feb 4, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

I'm going to try...

I think pictures might help though... 
(edit)---- 
oops, just saw your post with the pictures... You might want to update the link at the beginning of the thread, I got lost at first... This looks pretty easy. Thanks for the idea and the great tutorials... I'll let you know how it goes. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif
-J


----------



## gadget_lover (Feb 4, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

JoeyL actually got the first one of the new type. 

I don't have an L4 to play with. I returned the one I borrowed after examining it.

Thanks Jpeg. I'll update the links.


Daniel


----------



## ssb (Feb 6, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Hi Daniel, PM sent for one.


----------



## gadget_lover (Feb 8, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

OK folks. I'm looking for some help.



The biggest weakness to this design is the glued joint between the brass washer (the base)and the nylon spacer. That's where all the force is concentrated when someone tries to pry on one of these assembilies to remove it from a kroll. The washer gets trapped beneath the sharp nylon edge of the kroll and it forces it open like a wedge. To help with removing it, I've generally left a hole in the cent er that you can use with a dental pick or some other small hook.

I guess it's time for the disclaimer; I've only had three units that have broken when used by other people. One was somehow squashed by the post office, one was being 'played with' and the third snagged the end of the battery after the person cut the spring, causing teh spring assembly to break.

So where I need help is in making a better mechanical bond from brass base to spacer to spring.

When I used just a layer of JB Weld, it did pretty well at holding but was not a consistant thickness. To make the spring sit evenly I'd embed it in the epoxy while it was drying but often I'd have the spring sink right through it and end up shorting against the brass base.

When I used a thin piece of celuloid plastic as a spacer (jb-weld on both sides) it would work most of the time, but 5 out of 10 would fail the tug test. I was not able to figure out the difference bwteen the 5 that failed and the 5 that held. I suspect that I forgot to degrease them.

I've moved to using thin nylon washers for the spacer. I solder the resistor to the base first, then superglue the spacer to the base, then super glue the spring to the spacer, then solder the other resitor lead to the spring, then add a coat of epoxy to insulate the contact point and to reinforce the super glue.

With this process I have better than 90 percent that pass the tug test. The tug test is to look for any signs of movement or shifting while pulling with about 10 pounds of force.

But even if they pass the tug test, I've had some that delaminated after being installed in a tight kroll if I pulled and twisted at the same time.

Does any one have a process, or materials change that would make these fool proof? I hate to tell people that they shouldn't remove them from the kroll once it's installed.

Ideas I've had, but not explored;

1) paint bottom of the spring with non conductive paint and not use the spacer.
2) Drill 3 small holes through the spacer and the base and force epoxy through it.
3) Install small (really small) screws through the spacer to the base.
4) Include a bit of sandpaper so that people can reduce the sharp lip in the kroll.
5) make the assembly oval so that there is less for the kroll to bite into.

I'm already degreasing the parts before working with them and roughening the springs to provide better hold.


Any ideas? 

Daniel


----------



## TCG (Feb 8, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

hmmm. you could try.

Folding the bottom end of the spring over, or soldering a glob on the end, then covering with heat shrink tubing. The idea is to make a ball out of the bottom of the spring so it won't pull out so easy. The heatshrink instead of the insulating washer would allow more epoxy/metal washer contact. 

Drilling hole in the washer would also help. Vacuum pot the epoxy to force it into the hole and improve the overall strength of the epoxy. 

Good luck, Todd


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## jpeg (Feb 12, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

TGC: I think his main problem is not with the spring, but with the nylon spacer/brass washer connection... 

GL: I have most of the materials now to make ten of them, so I'll try it and see if I can super-genius up any improvements to the design... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif
Where do you get your nylon spacers?

BTW: DAMN these are small!!! You must have an awesome macro camera to get all these clear pics... 
I'll probably need a pair of tweezers to assemble them.


----------



## gadget_lover (Feb 13, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Yes, the problem is with the nylon spacer/brass washer connection. 

As a work around, I have been simply reducing the diameter of the the spacer and washer to about .375 inch so that it's a looser fit. The spring is already that diameter (more or less) so it's more likely to be the part that is gripped by the kroll's lip.

I've been getting the spacers at the local hardware store; Servalite Stock # 631-f. "Nylon Flat washer 3/8 x .194 x 1/32"

I do use tweezers, and mini forceps and needle nose pliers and some jigs that I built to keep things centered. I use two vices. I use two dremels so I don't have to change attachments in the middle of making a batch. I use a 1 inch belt/disc sander to make sure the bottoms are smooth and clean and the edges are free of burrs. Hmmm. I must be tired. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/icon3.gif

I don't have a great macro. I used to have a close up lens on my Canon 35mm SLR that would allow me to get within an inch. No such luck now. The trick I use is to set the 5 megapixel camera to it's highest resolution then zoom in from over 18 inches away using it's pitiful macro mode. The resulting file is huge, but I then crop the 95% that I didn't want. The remaining 5% ends up being over 640x480, so I resize it to make it more friendly to slow connections.

I hope some of this helps.

Daniel


----------



## jpeg (Feb 13, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

[ QUOTE ]
*gadget_lover said:*


As a work around, I have been simply reducing the diameter of the the spacer and washer to about .375 inch so that it's a looser fit. 

[/ QUOTE ]

I thought 3/8ths of an inch WAS .375" 
3 divided by 8 equals .375 on my calculator anyways... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif 
Good idea though, again a simple elegant solution. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

Thanks for the specs on the washers.

I went to RS today and they didn't have any 1/8 watt 10 Ohm resistors available. 1/4 watt was the smallest they sold. I'll have to try a local electronics store tonight. 

Wow, from your setup it sounds like it's going to be a bit more of a project than I originally expected... I'll still try it, but it's nice to know that if I fail, you still have them available for purchase. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

RE:macro... Hahaha, that's a funny story. The pictures came out great though. Thanks for all your hard work. I'd recommend posting a pic of the assembly next to a dime or something for comparison. It took me a minute in the local Ace hardware to be sure I was looking at the right washers. I actually had to take apart my LSH-P in the store and hold it up to the kroll switch before I would believe they were the right ones... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/yellowlaugh.gif


----------



## gadget_lover (Feb 13, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Jpeg correctly noted that 3/8ths of an inch WAS .375 inch. That's true, but the manufacturing tolerances are such that some of the washers are 10 thousandths or more out of spec. It doesn't matter much when the washer is going under a nut, but it does matter in this instance.

<font color="red">I'm not going to sell these any more. </font> They are easy enough to make. I made the jigs and such to make it easier to process batches. All you really need are small needle nose, wire cutters, soldering iron, and possibly tweezers. 

I will provide replacements for spring assemblies that just fail for no reason.

Daniel


----------



## jpeg (Feb 13, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

[ QUOTE ]
*gadget_lover said:*
<font color="red">I'm not going to sell these any more. </font> 

[/ QUOTE ]
Eeep!!! Hope it wasn't something I said... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/ooo.gif


----------



## gadget_lover (Feb 13, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Nope, Nothing you said. I am just not satisfied with my quality control. Out of a batch of 10, 8 people are perfectly happy, one is broken by someone that doesn't follow directions and 1 just sort of breaks for no apparent reason. That's not acceptable to me. Heck, you should not be able to break them!

I never expected more than 5 or 10 people to want to buy them. I hope that someone will step up and make these for sale.

Daniel


----------



## jpeg (Feb 13, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Dang... That means I'll really have to make one work now... 

If I can figure something out to make it 10 out of 10 will you start production again??? It'd be a shame to see these drop out of production.


----------



## gadget_lover (Feb 14, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Well, jpeg, if you can get 10 out of 10 to work you could sell them for 10 to 15 dollars apiece. I would like to know what I could have done to ensure 100%.

Daniel


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## Bullzeyebill (Feb 14, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Daniel, you can not ensure 100%. Nobody expects 100%, SureFire does not expect 100%, or Streamlight, nor Arc, etc. I sort of pulled mine apart a little, but it works fine, and I have switched it around to different lights. I do not expect you to quarantee this procuct, particularly when it is up to us to use it properly. You told us the pitfalls. So be it. Do not stop making and selling these great useful gadgets, cause I want another one, and other people want them, and if we complain, toughen up, do not wimp out.

Bill


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## gadget_lover (Feb 14, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

I had to think about Bill's comments for a bit. I don't agree with the idea that we should accept (or sell) products that are flawed. Flaws in products simply mean that they were designed wrong or made wrong. Often, the best design is not used because the second best design is easier to build. Sometimes it's just cheaper, other times it's faster. Quality design and manufacturing is always better than quality control after it's built.

I put together and maintain computer systems for a living, so my standards (I've been told) are fairly high. On the other hand, I have systems that have run for over a year between reboots, so my standards do pay off.

To bring it back on topic; I'm always disapointed when an idea that should work (and does work in my limited environment) does not work for others. It's obvious that there is something that I'm not doing right in making these, and there's no reason that others should put out good money only to be dissapointed if it breaks prematurely.

Daniel


----------



## jpeg (Feb 15, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Daniel, is the failure alwasy about the bond between the nylon spacer and the brass washer? If so, it would seem that nylon is the wrong material to use. It is designed to be low friction. What if you used something rougher like a cross cut of a fiberglass tent rod or something...


----------



## coyote (Feb 15, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

daniel, i'm deeply saddened to hear you've quit making them. i think it's one of the finest CPF add-ons ever. 

a bunch of Arc carrying friends who saw your product for the first time only yesterday are going to be frustrated that they missed the boat. none of us can re-wire a house lamp, no less make mini electronic components, so they'll have to live without...

i hope someone else can pick up the torch and carry on.


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## gadget_lover (Feb 16, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Yeah, the failures so far have been between the spacer and the brass base. So far I've determined:

1) superglue does not create repeatable results with small surfaces. I only used super glue for one batch. A big batch. Sometimes it's perfect, sometimes it's not. My test samples had been perfect.

2) The original spacer used in the second batch was celluloid plastic cut from a flashlight package. It did not bond well to the epoxy. 1/2 of the failures have been from these.

3) The epoxy bond is greatly weakened if you heat it in the first hour or so after it sets (soldering, for instance).

4) The epoxy bond is weakened if it starts to thicken before it's applied. Small batches and glueing three or four per batch works fine.

5) Failure to remove soldering flux, grease or oil from the parts will result in a weakened bond.

6) The nylon will bond well to the epoxy if clean. The spring will bond best if roughened. Belt sanders are our friends. Running the nylon over a rough piece of sandpaper does not hurt, but does not appear to make it stronger.

7) The epoxy should be allowed to cure overnight before final grinding or sanding to clean up excess. Some of my problems may have stemmed from working with the unit before the epoxy had finished curing.

I followed these guidelines when making the replacement units for the people who have had problems. So far, they have withstood enough force to permanently stretch the spring. I'll be making another batch that I can test to destruction to see if I've really nailed it.

Daniel


----------



## Bullzeyebill (Feb 16, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

YES!!!

Bill


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## TOB9595 (Feb 16, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

YES!!! YES!!!

Tom


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## jpeg (Feb 16, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Sounds like there's still hope for continued manufacturing Dan. If so, I'm glad. As it was said before, I too think this is one of the cooler mods out there, and it would be a shame to witness it die in development... 
I'll still make my own, in part just cause I'm that stubborn, but I'm not up to mass producing them, so I'm happy to hear you still might for the community at large... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

-J


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## bluewater (Feb 16, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

I received mine today...in case you're keeping track Daniel...it works GREAT, no problems. On low beam it's a fair bit dimmer than my AAA, is that the normal brightness?

Thanks for your hard work in developing these, it's got my vote for the best mod of the year!

Blair


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## gadget_lover (Feb 16, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Bluewatter; Thanks for the feedback. If you put the 10 ohm in a premium LS, it should be about as bright as the AA. If you put it in the standard LS, it's a touch dimmer than an AAA.

It's in direct drive when you use the low beam, so a well used battery will be dimmer than a fresh one.

I use 7.5 Ohms for my standard LSH to bring it up to AA brightness. Almost no one asked for the 7.5 ohm model.

Yes, Jpeg, I'm waiting for epoxy to cure on a batch of 10. Then I am going to grab a fish scale (the weighing kind, of course /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif ) to see how much abuse each will take before they die. I figure 30 pounds or so should be sufficient. Then the survivors will each be put into one of several krolls and ripped out again a few times... It should be interesting. 

If all ten survive I'll probably start building them again.

Off topic: Would you believe that selling springs this way in California requires that one apply for a permit, collect sales taxes and file a special tax return monthly, quartely or yearly? But if I refuse to sell to people in my home state I don't have to do any of that? Very silly, but I do believe in paying taxes where taxes are required, so I'll have to get a permit and track the California buyers.

grumble grumble grumble.

Daniel


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## TheFire (Feb 16, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

INAL, but how is it that selling things like that requires a permit, taxes, and returns? If it's a sole proprietorship, don't you report any income on your income tax in just the same way you would any other miscellaneous income? Since you've already payed sales tax on the items you're using to construct them, I thought that took care of that difficulty.


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## gadget_lover (Feb 17, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

The Fire wrote... Since you've already payed sales tax on the items you're using to construct them, I thought that took care of that difficulty


That's what I thought. In California the income tax is different from sales tax. I get to pay my 11 or 12 % state income tax on every thing I earn PLUS the 8.5 % (or is it 8.75 this year???) for sales to people inside the state. They consider the construction a "manufacturing" process and the springs a "Manufactured personal property". I'd consider making a deal with someone out of state to resell to california people if I didn't think it was a shady way to do business.

On the plus side, with the proper permits one can buy supplies for manufacturing or resale without paying the sales tax.

Daniel

(yes, I know that the 11 or 12 % may not be correct this year, and I understand what a marginal tax bracket is)


----------



## jpeg (Feb 17, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

I'm an electronics ignoramus, and I'm probably about to show my lack of education, but why did you go with a 1/8 amp 10 ohm resistor? I went to two Radio Shacks this week, and neither had anything in the catalog less than 1/4 amp. Will 1/4 amp work? Is it a form factor thing? Are the Radio Shacks that different where you live? Help I'm confused... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/ooo.gif


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## gadget_lover (Feb 18, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Yes, Jpeg, the form factor of the 1/8 watt just works out nicely. My original design used two springs and a 1/4 watt was too big. A 1/4 watt can work in the second version, but it's a very tight fit, and may require that you insulate the lead that connects to the base to prevent shorting to the spring.

I came up with 10 Ohms because it gave me about the light of an ARC AA when used in my LSH-P. My calculations indicated that the voltage drop across the 10 ohm would create less than 1/8 watt of heat. I tried various resistances to verify that the light would act as I expected.

My 'destruction tests' shows that I can't make all of them stand up to even 10 pounds of pull. The spring deforms at less than that. 

So, Will people want them if I include the following disclaimer?

[ QUOTE ]
This assembly replaces the spring in a Kroll. It should be considered
a permanent alteration to the Kroll even though it can be removed from
the Kroll. Removing it from the Kroll will probably destroy the assembly.
The original Kroll spring can be re-installed after removing the spring
assembly.

The warranty is void if the spring assembly is damaged while trying
to remove it from the Kroll. Pulling on the spring is also likely to
destroy the assembly and will void the warranty.

[/ QUOTE ]

Daniel


----------



## jpeg (Feb 18, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

After reading all the work you went through to make these bomb-proof, I'd buy one in a heartbeat. (Of course I have to try on my own first...) 
I don't think many people will be removing them once they're in. Congratulations on the success of your pull test... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif
-J


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## gadget_lover (Feb 18, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

I'm making these again. I posted new 'for sale' notices in the B/S/T forums. The description and caveats are different enough that I felt a fresh post was in order.

Thanks to very one for the support.

Daniel


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## dtlent (Feb 18, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Daniel,
I think your disclaimer is fair and you should start building them again. You have a market for it and no one else is picking it up. Also you have the expertise.

I'm thinking about purchasing a couple of the new versions?

In fact, could you have 2 ready for me this Friday?

Thanks!

Larry


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## gadget_lover (Feb 18, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Thanks for the feedback, Larry. I can have a pair ready for Friday pickup. I'll set them aside for you. 10 Ohm or 7?

Daniel


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## dtlent (Feb 18, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Daniel,
10 ohms, thanks!
It will probably be around 12 noon, if that's okay. I can come earlier, if you want.
Larry


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## chasino (Feb 18, 2004)

Just got my hi-lo unit. Installed it in an instant. Brilliant concept and execution. I really like the way you can gently twist to the lo setting and a hard squeeze will give you a burst of the hi setting.


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## vcal (Feb 18, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

[ QUOTE ]
*gadget_lover said:*
I'm making these again. I posted new 'for sale' notices in the B/S/T forums. The description and caveats are different enough that I felt a fresh post was in order.

Thanks to very one for the support.

Daniel 

[/ QUOTE ]
Daniel, is that assy. for the same exact Kroll switch that fits the MiniMag?


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## gadget_lover (Feb 18, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

VCAL, Yes it is the same kroll. The problem using this mod with the MiniMag is that the moves in relation to the spring. I've used it in a mini-mag by carefully adjusting it so that turning the kroll less than a turn will switch modes, but doing that sacrifices the water resistance.

Although I use one this way, I don't recommend it for use with a minimag.

Daniel


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## springnr (Feb 18, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Daniel, above an beyond and you really didn't have to. So thanks thanks thanks. 

The new units slip right in and a clip or so later I was good to go. After I managed to take the sprong out of the last unit forgive me if I don't yank on this one. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif It looks like it would stand up to it though.

I appreciate it and thanks again. Keith


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## gadget_lover (Feb 18, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Keith, You are welcome. Too bad I couldn't just e-mail you some sprong (tm).

Daniel

(for those wondering what in the world we are talking about.... Keith had an assembly that died an early death.)


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## Daddyo (Feb 19, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

PayPal sent


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## gadget_lover (Mar 25, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

I found that the Wizard converter board (from the sandwich shoppe) will not work with this mod. If the voltage drops too low, the converter will stop passing current. If it's below the LED's Vf, the board will try to suck more amps from the battery to compensate. I haven't tested to see the exact result.

Has anyone used this mod with a wizard?


----------



## DaveT (Jun 21, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Gadget_lover - just wanted to say that these are the bee's knees...thanks
Dave


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## gadget_lover (Jun 21, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

Glad you like it, Dave. It was a fun concept to pursue.

Dan


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## BugLightGeek (Jul 30, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

So, since I haven't followed this in a while...are these still available anywhere? Have they been improved or just forgotten?

I'm looking for one for my Arc LS 123 twisty pack.......


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## gadget_lover (Jul 31, 2004)

*Re: simple high/low drop-in for Arc LS / L4*

I stopped making them months ago. Someone made some and was selling them on B/S/T forum.

The one for the twisty pack wasn't very sophisticated. A piece of tape and a resistor will do the trick. I never offered to make those because I came to the conclusion that the extra thickness of the resistor could cause damage to the light if you really crank down on the twisty. That does tend to happen when you hand it to a curious family member.

Daniel


----------

