# SureFire M1 Dissected



## milkyspit (Nov 1, 2006)

I've been turning the SureFire M1 into a *Project-M* light dubbed the M90-M1 Illuminator, for a while now. Someone pointed out that it might be of interest to snap a photo of the disassembled light in that few folks have ever seen the guts. Here it is!









Some quick notes... the window is polycarbonate and press-fit tightly against an O-ring... the little black dot is an IR filter... the circuit board is a resistored IR LED with a spring on the underside... the items from circuit board (left) to IR filter and O-ring (right) all fit inside the body shown above the parts... threading on the tail end is SureFire C Series compatible, and threading on the head end is incompatible with any part that I've ever encountered... seems to be specific to this light, which actually does make some sense given the light was probably designed to be robust, self-contained, and permanently sealed.

Note there's an O-ring seal between body and head that ensures weatherproofness.


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## wquiles (Nov 1, 2006)

Very neat - thanks for sharing :rock: 

Will


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## arewethereyetdad (Nov 1, 2006)

I'm the "someone" who requested these pics.  Thanks Scott! Very interesting, indeed. So the head *is* screwed on! And you're one of the first to UN-screw it! 

Looks good. Thanks for showing us. They say ya learn somethin' every day.


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## chesterqw (Nov 2, 2006)

an IR led only?

man... i was thinking of something way better.


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## CM (Nov 2, 2006)

Not surprising they use a puny 5mm LED. Probably comparable to what they use in remote controls. I tried one (bought at over $100 a year ago  ) and was very disappointed. I ended up rolling a few of my own including this:




and this:





Both pumping out 44x what the M1 can put out using an Osram LED driven 1A constant current :nana: Yeah, the Osram emits a very very faint red glow but at well over 100 yards away (the range of this thing) the thing is invisible to the unaided eye.

The biasing circuit (resistor) is also no surprise since the M1 is extremely long in the tooth. 

Now, show us what you can do with this dinosaur Milky.


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## trivergata (Nov 2, 2006)

I'm trying to figure out is a A19 reflector would fit in that head. Any measurements on the inner bore?


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## milkyspit (Nov 2, 2006)

trivergata said:


> I'm trying to figure out is a A19 reflector would fit in that head. Any measurements on the inner bore?



No measurements at present of the head's inner bore, but I can tell you that I've slid a McR-19 reflector into the head and it seemed to fit nicely, though the bulkhead at the head end did obscure a fair amount of the wide end of the reflector.


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## milkyspit (Nov 2, 2006)

CM said:


> Not surprising they use a puny 5mm LED. Probably comparable to what they use in remote controls. I tried one (bought at over $100 a year ago  ) and was very disappointed. I ended up rolling a few of my own including this:
> 
> 
> 
> ...




CM, given that my night vision at present is my own two eyes, I don't know squat about what these toys can or can't do! On the other hand, I can walk from my house to the quarry in the dead of night, often with no lighting at all. :nana:


What can I do with this dinosaur? Plenty... uh, I think!  Here's the standard photo collage plus a new one, for starters... eventually I'll probably break the mod part of the M1 into its own thread...

*Initial Builds...
*





















*Yesterday's Builds...
*





Woohoo!


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## trivergata (Nov 2, 2006)

Thanks, milky - I'm going to have fun with this guy. Am I the only one interested in this one becasue of the ultra-cool look?

I doubt it..............

Josh


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## CM (Nov 2, 2006)

milkyspit said:


> CM, given that my night vision at present is my own two eyes, I don't know squat about what these toys can or can't do! On the other hand, I can walk from my house to the quarry in the dead of night, often with no lighting at all. :nana:
> 
> 
> What can I do with this dinosaur? Plenty... uh, I think!  Here's the standard photo collage plus a new one, for starters... eventually I'll probably break the mod part of the M1 into its own thread...
> ...





Very cool...Are you planning on making a Cree based light?


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## cy (Nov 2, 2006)

very nice! 

so how did you separate head without damage?


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## arewethereyetdad (Nov 2, 2006)

cy said:


> very nice!
> 
> so how did you separate head without damage?



He heats it to 750 degrees and twists it off.


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## trivergata (Nov 2, 2006)

Really? 750? Is that the magic number?

Guess I'll be getting into the furnace in the lab...............I love working for a university..............

If that was a joke, let me know before I have a puddle of molten surefire............seems the front lense wouldn't hold up to that, not to mention the electronics...............

Josh


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## milkyspit (Nov 2, 2006)

Well, Dad's actually not kidding... but it's not quite that simple, and a bit of it is a Milky trade secret. 

Some things to watch for...

The polycarbonate lens WILL melt if exposed to that sort of temps!

The body WON'T FREE if NOT exposed to that sort of temps!

The O-rings may or may not melt, but you'll probably need them for grip anyway.

Even at 750 degrees... or at least WAY hot enough to cause instant second or third degree burns, and to make wood smoke and possibly burst into flame (no kidding!), a piece of rubber won't help budge the thing, and in fact will probably start to melt as soon as it touches the head. Same with a silicone pad (won't melt but will probably rip into pieces). Oven mitt is too slippery, towel is too slippery...

Believe me, it's NOT easy! oo:


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## milkyspit (Nov 2, 2006)

CM said:


> Very cool...Are you planning on making a Cree based light?



I want to say yes, but don't have any Cree emitters yet! Though I'm told there are a few inbound.

Anyone who wants to supply a nice Cree or two in the interest of science (as well as their own build)... well, please do!


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## trivergata (Nov 6, 2006)

I kinda figured it was a bit more than heat and go - doing a selective heat process, are we?

I figure a good boiling should get it working - worked on a KL1 and E1E, among others. Not anywhere near 750, but then again, it works, so.................I used leather and Vice grips to twist the KL1, but the E1E I just picked it up and twisted away after about 5 minutes on a really high boil..............wearing welding gloves, of course.

Josh


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## ianb (Jan 18, 2007)

snap! 





...well similar  I managed to get my newly aquired M1(thanks Benighted :thumbsup: ) to pieces more easily than I thought. 10 minutes suspended in gently boiling water and it twisted of (with rubber for grip). Now I have to just wait for the rest of my supplies(seoul/driver/lens) to try and make something like Milky's creation.

any idea what I can clean the threads at the head/body off with? I guess its some kind of loctite/threadlock, but I don't wan't to wear the threads or coating off with a wire brush.

thanks, Ian


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## arewethereyetdad (Jan 18, 2007)

ian, it appears that yours has a delrin guarded tailcap. Haven't seen that version yet. The one in Milky's post has a metal clicky tailcap. Is yours a newer version?


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## DasRonin (Jan 18, 2007)

I'd love a cree mod to one of my M1s! This is a great thread to see the "innerds" of the M1. 

I'd love to have Milky for a neighbor!


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## bombelman (Jan 18, 2007)

arewethereyetdad said:


> ian, it appears that yours has a delrin guarded tailcap. Haven't seen that version yet. The one in Milky's post has a metal clicky tailcap. Is yours a newer version?


Looks a bit like the ones Nekomane makes, no ?

Awesome light btw !! Still for sale anywhere ?


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## milkyspit (Jan 18, 2007)

bombelman said:


> Looks a bit like the ones Nekomane makes, no ?
> 
> Awesome light btw !! Still for sale anywhere ?



+1 on guessing that's a Nekomane tailguard.

I've still got 5 ML1 hosts on hand, although they're intended for mods. If you want me to build yours then no worries, I've got it ready and waiting for ya! 

Ian, nice job! They don't all come apart so easily... which isn't meant in the least to take away from your excellent work. BEAUTIFUL photo, too! Puts mine to shame.


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## bombelman (Jan 18, 2007)

Great !
What options are there ? Would an XR-E with McR-17XR work in it ?
Or otherwise a shortened McR-18/20 ?

I've seen te RULER-FLAT *curves* your lights produce,
what boards do you use, or are those Milky Customs ?

Depending on options and price, maybe... (PM welcome)
As an Arc LS collector (modder),
I'm a Surefire virgin... It would be my first


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## ianb (Jan 18, 2007)

yes its a beauty the tail guard! A Nekomane original, very nice work too. I swopped it out from the Z58 this morning, while the M1 was boiling 

I thought it sounded easier than you had had experience, I didn't have to get it to 750 degrees :wow: . In fact boiling it went against my better judgement, but I have read about it on here for opening heads up before.

I'll post what I finish, separately from your thread, don't want to cram it, in a week or two,

The photo  thanks :laughing: I've been trying to take better photo's of my lights, as I see so many nice shots on CPF to put my skills to shame.

thanks, Ian


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## bombelman (Jan 26, 2007)

trivergata said:


> Thanks, milky - I'm going to have fun with this guy. Am I the only one interested in this one becasue of the ultra-cool look?
> 
> I doubt it..............
> 
> Josh



I'm with you all the way.. BTW, do you own an M1 ?
:naughty: :naughty: 
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/150163


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## bombelman (Jan 31, 2007)

Can anyone here tell me the thread-pitch of the M1 head ?

Thanks !


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## trivergata (Jan 31, 2007)

bombelman said:


> I'm with you all the way.. BTW, do you own an M1 ?
> :naughty: :naughty:
> 
> Yeah, I have one I'm experimenting with and doing a custom build on another for someone..........M1, P4 bin XR-E and a FluPic..........tasty!
> ...


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## bombelman (Feb 5, 2007)

Sheeeesh....... That was very hard to open !
It did not open yesterday so I had to retry today... 
It worked, I got it open without a scratch...!

Now, how do I remove the lens and O-ring ?


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## milkyspit (Feb 5, 2007)

bombelman said:


> Sheeeesh....... That was very hard to open !
> It did not open yesterday so I had to retry today...
> It worked, I got it open without a scratch...!
> 
> Now, how do I remove the lens and O-ring ?




Uh, you punch it out, destroying it in the process. Then find another to cram into place later. Seriously.


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## bombelman (Feb 5, 2007)

milkyspit said:


> Seriously.



I had already pushed it out from the inside-out, but now there is a hole in the lens and the edges are still glued.... 

But I think head will do the rest (as it did with opening the head  )

Is there an internal aperture of 14mm ?
And where to get a 21mm lens ? :naughty: 

Cheers !


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## bombelman (Feb 5, 2007)

I got the lens out ! Great what a little heat can do...
The bezel is very odd, and fixing another lens will not be easy...

There is also a fixed aperture of about 14mm wide (or narrow) that needs to be opened up to 19~20mm and the head needs to (will) be bored to accomodate a nicer reflector... McR-20 ?


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## ICUDoc (Mar 8, 2007)

SO bombelman.....

......what did you do next???


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## ICUDoc (Apr 4, 2007)

bombelman said:


> Is there an internal aperture of 14mm ?
> And where to get a 21mm lens ? :naughty:
> 
> Cheers !


Hey, bombelman
Did you find a source for the lens?


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## bombelman (Apr 4, 2007)

Hey man, to be honest, the M1 is still sitting here and I have been busy with Arc related projects. However, I did not forget it.

I have found 20mm lenses and 22.7mm lenses, but not 21mm.
A watch-crystal could be an option. Either way, the internal apertures needs to be bored (read: dremeled ?) otherwist it would be difficult to place a reflector in it.

For the lens to stay,it should be glued in or epoxied or loctite'd...

BTW, what type of switch does your M1 have ?


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## milkyspit (Apr 4, 2007)

bombelman said:


> Hey man, to be honest, the M1 is still sitting here and I have been busy with Arc related projects. However, I did not forget it.
> 
> I have found 20mm lenses and 22.7mm lenses, but not 21mm.
> A watch-crystal could be an option. Either way, the internal apertures needs to be bored (read: dremeled ?) otherwist it would be difficult to place a reflector in it.
> ...




I finished a special M1 build for Skalomax the other day... an X155-M1 Illuminator with Seoul emitter. The unusual thing about that one was fitting a 20mm reflector inside... that took some doing! 20mm actually exceeds the inner diameter of the head, heh heh. :naughty:

Found a thick polycarbonate lens in the parts box that was just the right diameter for a friction fit... gently got the lens pressed into place via lots of patience and some quality time using a vise as a small hydraulic press of sorts (minus the hydraulics).

Result was GREAT! But it took one HECK of a long time to get everything to fit, and to play nice together... and in the end, forgot to take photos! 

Oh well.


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## ICUDoc (Apr 4, 2007)

Hi bombelman, milkyspit!
My M1 has a clicky that is identical to the one on my Surefire M3. Sorry I don't know the model number. I have lathed a custom heatsink/LE holder and bored out the batt tube and that constricting exit hole from the head to fit a 19mm McR. The whole thing looks fabulous, but it seems the Milky plastic lens / press fit option is going to be the one to go for. I think I will buy a few polycarb. ones and lathe or Dremel them down to size.....


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## milkyspit (Apr 5, 2007)

Guys, Skalomax just posted photos of the M1 mod I did for him *over here*.


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## FredericoFreire (Apr 21, 2007)

The brazilian way to do it:

I used a chain wrench + rubber to protect the light;
No heat, it was done in ambient temperature

As a result, a clean removing, with no scratches, nicks or dents. The threads are also very clean.

Very easy and a great result


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## bombelman (Apr 21, 2007)

Excellent !!!


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## ICUDoc (Apr 21, 2007)

These are such pretty torches. Good job FF!
They also make a great little EDC with a Cre / McR19 reflector!


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## bombelman (Apr 21, 2007)

ICUDoc said:


> These are such pretty torches. Good job FF!
> They also make a great little EDC with a Cre / McR19 reflector!


And so how and where does the reflector sit exactly ?


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## sejvaar (Apr 24, 2007)

These are just one level right? Press for momentary/twist for constant? What kind of run time are you getting and what's the mod cost?

Thanks


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## bombelman (Apr 24, 2007)

Depends on the leds used, the circuit and drive-current, and also reflector/lens used and also if boring the head is involved. I think around $80.


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## milkyspit (Apr 25, 2007)

sejvaar said:


> These are just one level right? Press for momentary/twist for constant? What kind of run time are you getting and what's the mod cost?
> 
> Thanks




I've built at least one multi-brightness modified light using a prototype board I'm developing. The rest have been single brightness.

Tailswitch is a tactical clicky: press gently for momentary on, press harder to click the thing on or off.

Cost for the rebuild if I supply everything including the M1 host, is probably somewhere in the $175 to $225 range depending on specifics... but I'd love to grab one of Bombelman's modded M1 for $80! With free EMS shipping?


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## bombelman (Apr 25, 2007)

milkyspit said:


> but I'd love to grab one of Bombelman's modded M1 for $80! With free EMS shipping?


This would have been the price for the mod, excl. the M1 and S&H charges...


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## ICUDoc (Apr 25, 2007)

I'll put a pic on my website over the weekend- www.icudoc.com


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## bombelman (May 2, 2007)

Just want to say I got another M1 and now have 2 in total.
It took a while, but I'm finally getting the chance not to make a useful light
out of them. I hope to finish in May and be able to post results...
I think I'll make a Cree-version and an SSC-version so I can compare them side to side.

1 Minor detail I want to publish:
The body is bored and it can accept an AW17500 (@1100mAH) cell. 

Cheers !!


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## milkyspit (May 2, 2007)

Bombel, that's pretty sweet about the AW17500. I love that sort of ingenuity! Hat's off to you sir. 

Did you mean to type this?
_...I'm finally getting the chance *not* to make a useful light_ :laughing:

Why the heck do you have to be all international and such?  It would be great if you lived right next door to me... I'll bet the two of us could cook up some really crazy mods! :naughty:

Rock on!


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## bombelman (May 4, 2007)

milkyspit said:


> Did you mean to type this?
> _...I'm finally getting the chance *not* to make a useful light_ :laughing:


Should have been without the "not".
I get distracted quite easily... I must have been talking to someone else saying "not" and typing it at the same time... :laughing: 

Anyway, I love this flashlight-addiction.
I don't smoke and don't drink. So it's justified, right ? (...not) :laughing: 

Get me a ticket to Milkyland, or contact KLM and get over to Bombel-Islands. :naughty: 

:lolsign:


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## alantch (Nov 12, 2007)

milkyspit said:


> ... threading on the tail end is SureFire C Series compatible, and threading on the head end is incompatible with any part that I've ever encountered... seems to be specific to this light, which actually does make some sense given the light was probably designed to be robust, self-contained, and permanently sealed.


I just discovered that the threading on both ends of the M1 are the same. I discovered this after someone asked if the head is E-series compatible in my sale thread, and after having said "No", tried the head on the tailend, and sure enough they fit. Just thought I share this here since this thread is on the M1.


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## milkyspit (Nov 12, 2007)

alantch said:


> I just discovered that the threading on both ends of the M1 are the same. I discovered this after someone asked if the head is E-series compatible in my sale thread, and after having said "No", tried the head on the tailend, and sure enough they fit. Just thought I share this here since this thread is on the M1.




You're right, sorry, I stand corrected. 

The length of body tube threaded at head end is shorter, of course, so a tailcap for instance won't thread all the way down... but it does make for some interesting possibilities!

Good catch! :thumbsup:


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