# Cree R Bins Have Arrived



## Steve L (Oct 29, 2007)

I was surfing the Dealers Corner at CPF Marketplace and came across this thread: http://www.cpfmarketplace.com/mp/showthread.php?t=170835 . The R bins(R2, WG tint) have come out ahead of schedule and are in stock. I was under the impression that we would not see R bins until Q1 08, Cree is really moving fast. Are you excited that the R bins are finally here? The 100 lumen per watt standard has been met. Let the modding begin!!


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## NA8 (Oct 29, 2007)

*Re: Cree R bins Have Arrived*

Sounds like fun.


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## light_emitting_dude (Oct 29, 2007)

*Re: Cree R bins Have Arrived*

Q5 step aside.


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## 270winchester (Oct 29, 2007)

*Re: Cree R bins Have Arrived*

sucks for those who paid premium for the Q5 bins.


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## Steve L (Oct 29, 2007)

*Re: Cree R bins Have Arrived*



270winchester said:


> sucks for those who paid premium for the Q5 bins.


Yeah, I was thinking the same thing. It seems like the Q5's 15 minutes of fame only lasted about 14 minutes. The more I think about it the happier I am I bought a Dereelight DBS and CL1H(P60 style drop-in). I think Modular lights are the best bet when the technology is changing this fast. Around $30 for the new pill when there released and I'll be good to go.


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## frosty (Oct 29, 2007)

Hooray.


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## cmichael (Oct 29, 2007)

*Re: Cree R bins Have Arrived*



light_emitting_dude said:


> Q5 step aside.


 
R4 pocket rocket will come soon...:twothumbs


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## Steve-11 (Oct 29, 2007)

Well _of course_ the R bin is out now, I knew it would be as I just ordered a P3D Q5 just _hours_ ago...


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## Shagbd (Oct 29, 2007)

son of a ........
what kinda increased should we expect to see compared to the Q5?


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## easilyled (Oct 29, 2007)

*Re: Cree R bins Have Arrived*



270winchester said:


> sucks for those who paid premium for the Q5 bins.



Not necessarily ...

Its been confirmed by some quite authoritative sources that there
is virtually no difference in efficiency between Q4 and Q5 because although
the Q5 can produce slightly more output at a given current, it takes
more power to do this since it has a higher Vf.

So it might be that the R2s are also hardly any better than the Q5s/Q4s.

I think one has to adopt the attitude of being pleased that there
is the potential for improvement whilst being happy with what one has.

Its only going to show to any significance when there's a jump of
about 4 or 5 Cree output levels.


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## Daekar (Oct 29, 2007)

Yes, lets hope the R2s have lower Vf than the Q5s, that would make a big difference. :twothumbs Looking forward to seeing the first "R" mods!


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## Steve L (Oct 29, 2007)

Hi Shagbd, these R2's are rated at 114-122 lumens at 350ma and 275 lumens at 1000ma(1 amp). Let the games begin.:twothumbs


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## WadeF (Oct 29, 2007)

Ordered an R2 WG bin! I may try to swap it for a Q4 or Q5 on one of my Dereelight pills to create the R2 bin DBS.  Should have results next week.


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## jzmtl (Oct 29, 2007)

I'm going to wait a year or so, till they have R5, or S5 out before spend any money again. A new light everytime a new bin comes out is not happening.


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## Delta (Oct 29, 2007)

Sounds great! Now why not offload all those pesky P4 models to us for say...half price? If not, the way Fenix keeps throwing out new models, they're going o have a buttload of lights they can't sell.

I think Lighthound currently has 3-4 LED generations of the same light.


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## Sgt. LED (Oct 29, 2007)

Is it bad to still want at least 1 light in each new bin?
An *addiction* is a recurring compulsion by an individual to engage in some specific activity, despite harmful consequences to the individuals health, mental state or social life.


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## Gladius01 (Oct 29, 2007)

This LED technology going really fast, like computer processors, it is really going to go head to head with HID soon, which is good news. I wait until someone have develop multi LEds with 4000 lumes. I better save some money now.


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## Bullzeyebill (Oct 29, 2007)

I will be more interested in new binned leds when they get the vf at 350mA's down to 2.8 or lower. That will be great with single primary AA, AAA, CR123, CR2 applications.

Bill


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## ViReN (Oct 29, 2007)

Kewl!.... that was fast.


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## evan9162 (Oct 29, 2007)

Shagbd said:


> son of a ........
> what kinda increased should we expect to see compared to the Q5?



Less than 10% brighter on average.


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## WadeF (Oct 29, 2007)

I have a P2D Q2, held off on a Rebel100 and Q5 version, but I might not be able to resist a R2.  

A P3D R2 should do 200 actual lumens out the front. 

If the Vf is lower like the P4-Q2's it would rock, but I have a feeling they will be similar to Q5's, but we'll see.


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## mossyoak (Oct 29, 2007)

Delta said:


> Sounds great! Now why not offload all those pesky P4 models to us for say...half price? If not, the way Fenix keeps throwing out new models, they're going o have a buttload of lights they can't sell.
> 
> I think Lighthound currently has 3-4 LED generations of the same light.



they wont have a buttload of lights they cant sell. we arent the average person buying from fenix, most people dont have a clue what the bins and junk mean. they jsut buy the one that looks the coolest, or the cheapest.


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## liquidsix (Oct 29, 2007)

I wonder why Q5 is a Q5 and not R1, its not like there was a P5. I ask now because I thought there might be an R1 but apparently there isn't.


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## liquidsix (Oct 29, 2007)

I also wonder if this means Cree can now develop a Warm White LED (circa 3,000K) that is about as bright as a P4. I'd love that because they have a much higher C.R.I. than all of the Cool White leds that we're so accustomed to.


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## ViReN (Oct 29, 2007)

evan9162 said:


> Less than 10% brighter on average.



and eyes will have hard time in making out this 10% difference oo:


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## Bolster (Oct 29, 2007)

Sorry to barge in with a noobie question, but could someone please explain the tint abbreviations? Wasn't able to find them in the welcom mat. WG, what's that- a greenish tint? WH? WC-a blue purple tint? Is there a chart somewhere?


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## SaVaGe (Oct 29, 2007)

*Re: Cree R bins Have Arrived*



270winchester said:


> sucks for those who paid premium for the Q5 bins.


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## PhantomPhoton (Oct 29, 2007)

Fast yet again! 

I also hope that VF is lower on these than on the Q5s.

So... who wants to start ogling the S-bin Crees with me?!?!


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## mds82 (Oct 29, 2007)

I cant wait to get my hands on a few of these


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## Delta (Oct 29, 2007)

mossyoak said:


> they wont have a buttload of lights they cant sell. we arent the average person buying from fenix, most people dont have a clue what the bins and junk mean. they jsut buy the one that looks the coolest, or the cheapest.



I'm talking about US internet dealers. Average people don't buy lights from places like Lighthound. It's a niche market, and this niche knows the difference, hence, noone will buy a L2D-CE (P4) that costs only $2.00 less than a Q5 L2D.

I think they are still sitting on some LUX P1Ds....

When you think about it, it's good for the end user but not for the dealers.


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## Nake (Oct 29, 2007)

Bolster said:


> Sorry to barge in with a noobie question, but could someone please explain the tint abbreviations? Wasn't able to find them in the welcom mat. WG, what's that? What are other designations?


 
Look here.

https://www.candlepowerforums.com/posts/1903261&postcount=1


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## TA_ls1 (Oct 29, 2007)

Wow, I just received my Olight T20 Q5 today, so i defintely hope that there is not much of a difference between this and the R bins. Probably not much I would notice at least because this is my first high performance light.


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## Daekar (Oct 29, 2007)

I think that if the Vf doesn't go down on the R bins then the P4 and Q2 bins are still going to be attractive. They won't necessarily produce quite as much light, but the efficiency gains make them more attractive to those who are looking for an EDC or some other practical light where maximum output isn't the goal. I'm certainly glad that my D-mini upgrade will have a Q2 in it instead of a Q5 because efficiency lends itself better to that form factor...


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## saabluster (Oct 29, 2007)

Dear Q5 and Luxeon whatevers.
ME'NE, ME'NE, and TE'KEL


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## greenLED (Oct 29, 2007)

As I've mentioned before, I personally won't make the jump between adjacent bins. IMO, it's a waste of my money in terms of the gain in brightness that I might get. I'm not interested in jumping on the "brightest bin of the month" bandwagon. Upgrading from Lux to Q or R-bin Cree's... that's another matter! :twothumbs


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## alphazeta (Oct 29, 2007)

bleh, I have about 4 fenix heads opened up with the epoxy painstakenly picked off. Q5 WCs are in already in route, but now maybe I'll only transplant one of the Q5s in there. My friends will probably all probably want the R2s in their hosts... 

*sigh* clears up some longterm drawer space for the Q5s in route....:ironic:


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## BentHeadTX (Oct 29, 2007)

Relax,
The Q5 is an R1... that is my claim and I'm sticking to it! The arrival of the R2 bins tell me that Cree is not full of crap and they said "R bins in Q4 2007" they don't mean March, 2009. Yep, I have eight Q5 bins that arrived last week but I am not worried... they have their use plus a few spares in case I screw up the mod.

What does the R bin really mean to me? Well, I have a Fenix L1D CE with a P3 bin and a L2D RB100. For bike lighting, I prefer the Crees throw and thought about the Q5 but decided to wait to see if the R bins would make it Q4 2007. Viola! The R bins are rolling right on schedule! (Must shake off the Luxeon and Proton concepts of time) 

Now for 4Sevens to announce the R bins L1/L2D series.


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## Germ (Oct 29, 2007)

Could someone explain the progression of bins or link to an explanation? What makes a successive bin better than previous ones?


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## TigerhawkT3 (Oct 29, 2007)

Germ said:


> Could someone explain the progression of bins or link to an explanation? What makes a successive bin better than previous ones?


Answer is here.


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## jtr1962 (Oct 29, 2007)

liquidsix said:


> I also wonder if this means Cree can now develop a Warm White LED (circa 3,000K) that is about as bright as a P4. I'd love that because they have a much higher C.R.I. than all of the Cool White leds that we're so accustomed to.


They have made such an LED and I've already tested it here. BTW, warm whites don't necessarily have a higher CRI than cool whites if all they do is shift the relative magnitudes of the primary blue emitter and yellow phosphor peaks in the spectrum to bring down the color temperature.


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## gnef (Oct 29, 2007)

efficiency. each successive bin is an increase in efficiency, meaning that for the same amount of power drawn from the battery, you are able to get more light.


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## TigerhawkT3 (Oct 29, 2007)

gnef said:


> efficiency. each successive bin is an increase in efficiency, meaning that for the same amount of power drawn from the battery, you are able to get more light.


No, each successive bin (the flux bin, anyhow, which is pretty much the only one we talk about) is an increase in output at a particular current level. If emitter A produces 100L at 350mA while emitter B produces 110L at 350mA, you might think that emitter B is more efficient, but if emitter A does it at 3.2V and emitter B does it at 3.7V, emitter A is actually more efficient (~89L/W instead of ~85L/W).


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## Paul6ppca (Oct 29, 2007)

Is the vf posted anywhere yet? How would a R2 do with flupic and a single rcr123?
Will a single lion battery be able to relaize an output og 275 lumens??


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## Burgess (Oct 29, 2007)

These are indeed *great times* to be a Flashaholic !

:wave:

_


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## milkyspit (Oct 29, 2007)

Burgess said:


> These are indeed *great times* to be a Flashaholic !
> 
> :wave:
> 
> _




+1


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## daveman (Oct 29, 2007)

BentHeadTX said:


> ...The arrival of the R2 bins tell me that Cree is not full of crap and they said "R bins in Q4 2007" they don't mean March, 2009...


That's what I find most comforting with this timely release of R bins from Cree as well. Not only is Cree's binning system tight (effectively guaranteeing the consumer a SPECIFIC output), unlike some other LED manufacturers with ranges of ~40 lumens between bottom and peak output @ 350 ma, Cree is inclined to keep to its published schedule as well, something very rare indeed.


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## PurpleDrazi (Oct 29, 2007)

alphazeta said:


> bleh, I have about 4 fenix heads opened up with the epoxy painstakenly picked off.



I have a L2D CE I'd like to upgrade . . . any tips on getting the head off?

Francis


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## alphazeta (Oct 29, 2007)

For me getting off the head has always been easy. I wrap above & below the joint with a LOT of rubber bands. (Think, build up a 1/2" diameter of rubber bands around the light.) Then u just twist with your bare hands. 
On a few of them it helps to heat the head. I don't even bother with external heating. I just put the head on an L2DCE on TURBO  until it heats up. & yes, it will heat up. Then Twist -> *POP*. 

Of course, I've had bad luck & all the emitters I've come across have been FULLY potted to all the way up the the cree ring.

Hope that helps... & let me know if it doesn't. There are a few other methods you can try. But I don't think you'll need them...


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## f22shift (Oct 29, 2007)

i've never tried but another suggestion would be to use a hot iron on the head. i can imagine it will heat up really fast and i can't imagine any more damage than boiling it in hot water.
i haven't tried though so i can't guarantee. 
i think also instead of rubber bands, an old bike tire tube would work.

i used a hot iron before to loosen a tub valve. couldn't use a blow torch.


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## ViReN (Oct 29, 2007)

Human Eye can detect changes in brightness from Q5 to R5 and for Q5 to R2, it would be very difficult to know with with eye alone. The difference between Q5 and R2 will only be visible on light meter. Chances are for those who pay Premium on R2 now (already having Q5's on hand) would likely be disappointed, unless of course the Vf of these LED's is drastically low compared to existing Q5 Bin's

Possible Good Upgrades would be
P4 ---> Q5
Q5 ---> R5


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## Phaetos (Oct 29, 2007)

jzmtl said:


> I'm going to wait a year or so, till they have R5, or S5 out before spend any money again. A new light everytime a new bin comes out is not happening.



Blasphemy! Stone him!!! :sick2:


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## edc3 (Oct 29, 2007)

Sgt. LED said:


> An *addiction* is a recurring compulsion by an individual to engage in some specific activity, despite harmful consequences to the individuals health, mental state or social life.




There should be something about harmful consequences to one's finances as well... :mecry:


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## Melven (Oct 30, 2007)

Phaetos said:


> Blasphemy! Stone him!!! :sick2:



What happened to the old CPF standby of buy both?


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## Calina (Oct 30, 2007)

Shouldn't this topic be discussed in the LED forum?


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## Bullzeyebill (Oct 30, 2007)

This is the Led forum.

Bill


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## PhantomPhoton (Oct 30, 2007)

No, no this is the LED _Flashlight_ Forum .

So yea if you're anal about strict adherence to order than we are in the wrong place. 

Luckily the CPF mods are pretty good as far as forum mods go. (And they're good looking too!) So they usually give us a bit of leeway... sometimes.


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## LEDninja (Oct 30, 2007)

liquidsix said:


> I also wonder if this means Cree can now develop a Warm White LED (circa 3,000K) that is about as bright as a P4. I'd love that because they have a much higher C.R.I. than all of the Cool White leds that we're so accustomed to.


Cutter is selling them
N2 Flux 8B Tint(2720k to 3050K) (+$0.50)
P3 Flux 8A Tint(2900k to 3100K) (+$0.50)
P4 Flux 7A Tint(3200k to 3500K) (+$0.50)
from here.


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## daveman (Oct 30, 2007)

What I'm most anxious to see is what Lumilleds will do for a response. I expect to see the R3 within 4 months, so I don't think Lumilleds can sit on whatever they have in the lab for long.


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## evan9162 (Oct 30, 2007)

daveman said:


> What I'm most anxious to see is what Lumilleds will do for a response. I expect to see the R3 within 4 months, so I don't think Lumilleds can sit on whatever they have in the lab for long.



Why not? Flashlights are certianly a tiny part of Lumileds' market. Honestly, having the absolute brightest LED probably isn't that important in their eyes, and probably isn't that important to maintain good sales. The Rebel-100 demand exceeds supply right now, limiting availability.

They are doing quite well, selling into tons of other applications that the brightest LED makes no difference in, such as traffic lights, display backlighting, camera phone flashes, architectural lighting, RGB displays, vehicle lighting, etc. Vendors may prefer Luxeons over XR-Es for other reasons besides just brightness, including tighter color and Vf binning, the device packaging, beam profile, optics availability, compatability with existing designs, etc.

They only have to remain competitive enough in brightness to keep things going well. 

There are a lot of things to consider besides just brightness for how competitive an LED manufacturer is going to be.


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## Delta (Oct 30, 2007)

evan9162 said:


> Why not? Flashlights are certianly a tiny part of Lumileds' market. Honestly, having the absolute brightest LED probably isn't that important in their eyes, and probably isn't that important to maintain good sales. The Rebel-100 demand exceeds supply right now, limiting availability.
> 
> They are doing quite well, selling into tons of other applications that the brightest LED makes no difference in, such as traffic lights, display backlighting, camera phone flashes, architectural lighting, RGB displays, vehicle lighting, etc. Vendors may prefer Luxeons over XR-Es for other reasons besides just brightness, including tighter color and Vf binning, the device packaging, beam profile, optics availability, compatability with existing designs, etc.
> 
> ...




Now wait just a minute!! Are you saying......the world DOESN'T revolve around flashlights?!?!?

*BLASPHEMY!!*


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## alphazeta (Oct 30, 2007)

f22shift said:


> i've never tried but another suggestion would be to use a hot iron on the head. i can imagine it will heat up really fast and i can't imagine any more damage than boiling it in hot water.
> i haven't tried though so i can't guarantee.
> i think also instead of rubber bands, an old bike tire tube would work.
> 
> i used a hot iron before to loosen a tub valve. couldn't use a blow torch.



Hehe, since we're a bit off topic... One of my favorite heating sources is a tea light candle. Pops thoses emitters right off their stars...

Rubber bands are not my tool of choice, but it's the only thing accessible when friends decide to bring their lights to me AT THE OFFICE for modding. :shakehead Works well enuff though.


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## Bolster (Oct 30, 2007)

evan9162 said:


> ...Honestly, having the absolute brightest LED probably isn't that important in their eyes, and probably isn't that important to maintain good sales. The Rebel-100 demand exceeds supply right now, limiting availability...



And that will be changing quickly as competitors offer more for less. In general, a business that rests on its laurels, falls behind. So, c'mon Lumileds, let's see whatcha got.


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## Patriot (Oct 30, 2007)

greenLED said:


> As I've mentioned before, I personally won't make the jump between adjacent bins. IMO, it's a waste of my money in terms of the gain in brightness that I might get. I'm not interested in jumping on the "brightest bin of the month" bandwagon. Upgrading from Lux to Q or R-bin Cree's... that's another matter! :twothumbs


 
I feel the same way. If it's a huge change then it will have my attention but these bins are so close, within 5% of eachother. It just doesn't make sense for me to trade out or replace flashlights for that difference.




> *Gladius* >This LED technology going really fast, like computer processors, it is really going to go head to head with HID soon, which is good news. I wait until someone have develop multi LEds with 4000 lumes. I better save some money now.


 
I think you're right. Things are moving so fast. I notice that my WiseLED P4 is already as bright or brighter than my AE24/s and runs longer. Different beams altogether of course, but it's interesting to see how the 25w and under HIDs are being out performed right now, as far as output is concerned.


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## Outdoors Fanatic (Oct 30, 2007)

Delta said:


> I'm talking about US internet dealers. Average people don't buy lights from places like Lighthound. It's a niche market, and this niche knows the difference, hence, noone will buy a L2D-CE (P4) that costs only $2.00 less than a Q5 L2D.
> 
> I think they are still sitting on some LUX P1Ds....
> 
> When you think about it, it's good for the end user but not for the dealers.


True that. Lighthound is becoming a Fenix Museum.


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## milkyspit (Oct 30, 2007)

Some very random thoughts... first, I applaud Cree's willingness to push the envelope, and even exceed their own estimates on availability... it's a refreshing change from what seems the norm in the technology business.

As far as these ever-more-lofty bins being released and whether it's worth jumping to them... well, that depends. If somebody just upgraded a light to a Q5 or even a Q4, I would say the R2 would be pretty underwhelming. On the other hand, if somebody is building a brand new light right now, why not use the best part available? See, the decision of whether to use an R2 depends heavily on the context of the question.

Other factors will determine applicability, too... for example, the general life cycle of emitter releases tends to be an initial availability of a certain brightness, but with somewhat less-than-white tints... this because the production process isn't yet yielding enough pieces that make the grade (R2 in this case) to allow the luxury of sorting into neat-and-tidy reels of like tint, nor does it allow for cherrypicking the best ones from the batch. As yields improve, a more complete selection will tend to become available. The upshot of this: stepping back a bin or two might be worth it for some folks in order to trade a little brightness for a better tint. I recently installed some Q4 in my own lights even though the Q5 was available, because I had Q4 emitters with WC tint, my personal fave. No regrets on that decision! :naughty:

Another thing worth considering... Cree and Seoul Semiconductor (SSC) may well be advancing their product lines at similar rates, but their marketing strategies make the results look different. Cree's tighter flux binning means they can announce improved bins on a regular basis, whereas SSC cannot. Consider: the U-bin for SSC spans 91 through 118 lumens... that means SSC cannot release their next-higher flux bin until they're able to produce parts with more than 118 lumens flux with some regularity. This same range applied to Cree spans their Q2, Q3, Q4, Q5, and R2 bins, so Cree has been able to release all these while SSC is still at its U bin. Does this mean Cree has been moving more quickly, or pushing the state of the art more? Not necessarily. It's not the speed with which new bins are released, but rather the larger picture of how many lumens each manufacturer's best product can reach as studied over time... imagine a chart showing best-available flux perhaps every six months, extending outward...


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## holeymoley (Oct 30, 2007)

daveman said:


> Cree is inclined to keep to its published schedule




Sorry, where can I find this?


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## Delta (Oct 30, 2007)

http://www.cutter.com.au/prodimages/xrerdmap.gif


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## Delta (Oct 30, 2007)

Has anyone even seen a Q3??


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## holeymoley (Oct 30, 2007)

Delta said:


>



Sorry, I meant the proposed release dates for the R3 and R4.


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## BentHeadTX (Oct 30, 2007)

All hail Cree!

Think about it... we are blunted by Luxeons gradual moves and a history of unobtanium bins. Cree states that Q5 bins will be available in Q3 2007 and they are! (holy crap, batman!) Then they get radical and state that R bins will be available Q4 2007...and they are! Not VAPORWARE the 31st of December 2007 with a "paper release" but ACTUAL LEDs shipping one month into the quarter. 

Face it, a company out there is not full of crap with promises but actual shipping LEDs. I can buy with confidence that the LED won't turn blue at 1,000mA (Seoul and Rebel) but can take the hit and keep going. Heck, I like the aluminum ring that I can snap Fraen FRC faceted reflectors so they hold themselves together. Look ma! No torn off domes! 

I have LuxeonI LEDs, LuxeonIII, LuxeonV, Seoul Semiconductor P4 U bins, one Rebel and some Cree lights. My favorites are the LuxeonIII and Cree XRE LEDs... the LuxIII for "old school" and the Cree XRE for everything else. 

I have 10 Cree XRE LEDs and plan to use and abuse them. When it all comes down to the chase, reliability is very important to me and I use Cree XRE. Now for Fenix to introduce R bins to the LxD series so I can replace my first generation P3 lights. Patients is a virtue. 

At the end of the day, after the white wall hunters, the runtime freaks and the bleeding edge folks get done... the flashlight has to work. My mods run Cree XRE Q5 bins because they work. I am not in a pissing contest.


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## Jay T (Oct 30, 2007)

Umm when Cree states a quarter are you guys sure they are not referring to the company's "Fiscal Year"? A quick search shows that Cree's 1'st quarter of 2008 ended September 23 they have already reported their profits for that quarter. Anything being shipped today will show up on the 2nd quarter 2008 reports. Could this be why they are always ahead of schedule?


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## jasonsmaglites (Oct 30, 2007)

saabluster said:


> Dear Q5 and Luxeon whatevers.
> ME'NE, ME'NE, and TE'KEL


 
hmmm...
looks like the writing is on the wall!


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## saabluster (Oct 31, 2007)

jasonsmaglites said:


> hmmm...
> looks like the writing is on the wall!


:twothumbsGood job! I wasn't sure if anyone got it.


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## Outdoors Fanatic (Oct 31, 2007)

evan9162 said:


> Why not? Flashlights are certianly a tiny part of Lumileds' market. Honestly, having the absolute brightest LED probably isn't that important in their eyes, and probably isn't that important to maintain good sales. The Rebel-100 demand exceeds supply right now, limiting availability.
> 
> They are doing quite well, selling into tons of other applications that the brightest LED makes no difference in, such as traffic lights, display backlighting, camera phone flashes, architectural lighting, RGB displays, vehicle lighting, etc. Vendors may prefer Luxeons over XR-Es for other reasons besides just brightness, including tighter color and Vf binning, the device packaging, beam profile, optics availability, compatability with existing designs, etc.
> 
> ...


Very well put.


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## winston (Oct 31, 2007)

Germ said:


> Could someone explain the progression of bins or link to an explanation? What makes a successive bin better than previous ones?



Can't help, I'm afraid. Instead, I would like to take this opportunity to say that your sigline is the funniest thing I've read in a long time. Thank you.:bow:
-Winston


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## garfieldso (Oct 31, 2007)

WadeF said:


> Ordered an R2 WG bin! I may try to swap it for a Q4 or Q5 on one of my Dereelight pills to create the R2 bin DBS.  Should have results next week.



Much much longed for.......

Q5 should need higher Vf than Q2~Q4 in order to drive the LED with the same current.

Don't know the characteristic of the R series...........We always hope to put in a low vf high current CREE in a single cell of 1.2V~1.5V touch.


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## Khaytsus (Oct 31, 2007)

I have a 4 month old P2D CE, I'm curious if anyone would guestimate what the output difference would be on Low, High and Turbo if I upgraded it to these latest bins?

I'm not even sure what bin this one is honestly.. It's this url: https://www.fenix-store.com/product_info.php?cPath=22_55&products_id=249

I'll have to see how to upgrade it if it seems it's worth it, but I suspect it would be as it'll be several bins better I think. Only problem would be that I would rather my Low not get any higher.


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## Nake (Oct 31, 2007)

Khaytsus said:


> I have a 4 month old P2D CE, I'm curious if anyone would guestimate what the output difference would be on Low, High and Turbo if I upgraded it to these latest bins?


 
I would say you now have a P4 in your P2D CE. I did a swap to a Q5 in my P2D and these are the percentages I gained.

https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/173046


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## vetkaw63 (Oct 31, 2007)

Nake said:


> I would say you now have a P4 in your P2D CE. I did a swap to a Q5 in my P2D and these are the percentages I gained.
> 
> https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/173046



Did you lose any runtime with the higher Vf?
Thanks
Mike


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## Nake (Oct 31, 2007)

vetkaw63 said:


> Did you lose any runtime with the higher Vf?
> Thanks
> Mike


 
I never tested for runtime, doesn't concern me that much.


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## chris_m (Oct 31, 2007)

ViReN said:


> Possible Good Upgrades would be
> P4 ---> Q5
> Q5 ---> R5


 
I've got a light still using P3s - the R2 would give me >50% more light, so maybe worth upgrading? (then again I've got a load of Q2s purchased when it seemed that would be the best available for ages, so might just have to use those instead for now).


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## rizky_p (Oct 31, 2007)

I hopes that R bin will have lower vF, i hate Q5 having high vF thus not really a plug-and-play emmiter for flashlight with cheap driver.


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## Germ (Oct 31, 2007)

winston said:


> Can't help, I'm afraid. Instead, I would like to take this opportunity to say that your sigline is the funniest thing I've read in a long time. Thank you.:bow:
> -Winston


 
Glad you like it Winston, you are the first to comment on it  Here it is in case I go back to listing my flashlights in my sig and someone wonders what it was:

Now, if I would just take up a hobby that would help get me laid... :thinking:

I was cruising the forum, frustrated, and gave thought to some of my hobbies and their attactiveness to females: firearms? nah, computers? nah... flashlights?! oh, hell no


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## ViReN (Oct 31, 2007)

chris_m said:


> I've got a light still using P3s - the R2 would give me >50% more light, so maybe worth upgrading? (then again I've got a load of Q2s purchased when it seemed that would be the best available for ages, so might just have to use those instead for now).



Chris, to eyes it would be more like 15-20 %... to luxmeter yes, it would be 50% increase.


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## Khaytsus (Nov 1, 2007)

Nake said:


> I would say you now have a P4 in your P2D CE. I did a swap to a Q5 in my P2D and these are the percentages I gained.
> 
> https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/173046



Hey, thanks for the link.. Even links to a thread on how to update it. Now, if I had the balls to do it.


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## THE_dAY (Nov 2, 2007)

Khaytsus said:


> Hey, thanks for the link.. Even links to a thread on how to update it. Now, if I had the balls to do it.



contact *datiLED* if you'd like your fenix modded, he does excellent work!


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## Lumbee1 (Nov 2, 2007)

What is the Vf of the Q5 compared to the P4 or if anyone know the R-bins? CREE doesn't have any product documentation showing a Vf difference between and P-bins and a Q-bins. Unfortunately, they have no documentation at all on the R-bins.


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## orbital (Nov 2, 2007)

Germ said:


> Now, if I would just take up a hobby that would help get me laid... :thinking:
> 
> I was cruising the forum, frustrated, and gave thought to some of my hobbies and their attactiveness to females: firearms? nah, computers? nah... flashlights?! oh, hell no



The name Germ may not be the ideal name for gettin' some......

+

Anyway, great to see the R bins arriving, 
but I'd really like to see what SSC has to offer.

~could be a whole lot of nothing, or REALLY something!


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## Darell (Nov 2, 2007)

Calina said:


> Shouldn't this topic be discussed in the LED forum?



Yup. That's what it was made for.


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## Gomer (Nov 2, 2007)

All I want to know is when the R2 will push down the Q5 down to around $5 a pop :-D


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## Darell (Nov 2, 2007)

Gomer said:


> All I want to know is when the R2 will push down the Q5 down to around $5 a pop :-D



Ah... you beat me to it! I'm also looking for those "closeout" Q5's. So any of you stuck with that old stock, please let me know. I pay top dollar! Q4, Q5. I'm easy. Get that old stuff out of the way!


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## Gomer (Nov 2, 2007)

Darell said:


> Ah... you beat me to it! I'm also looking for those "closeout" Q5's. So any of you stuck with that old stock, please let me know. I pay top dollar! Q4, Q5. I'm easy. Get that old stuff out of the way!



I'm actually looking to pick up a bunch. Need about 10 whites and 4 royal blues.


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## WeLight (Nov 2, 2007)

liquidsix said:


> I also wonder if this means Cree can now develop a Warm White LED (circa 3,000K) that is about as bright as a P4. I'd love that because they have a much higher C.R.I. than all of the Cool White leds that we're so accustomed to.




We have them in stock already dude

Cheers
WeLight
Cutter Electronics


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## Mr_Light (Nov 2, 2007)

I am wondering if constant current drivers (like a SHARK) will compensate for the higher vf and still deliver the same 1000mA to a Q5 that it would to a Q2?


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## Melchior (Nov 2, 2007)

Here I was debating to overdrive some Q2 or just use a bunch of P4's...

Heh, the falling prices of Q4/5's from R-Series bin is music to my ears.


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