# Incandescent phase out



## jso902 (Feb 19, 2014)

Hi, 
I understand that incandescent lights are gradually losing ground to an ever growing led market 

Does this mean our incandescent head lamps will soon be custom ordered? 
And what happens if they are banned?


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## yellow (Feb 20, 2014)

hmm.
good question,
but as there still seems to be no "thinking" in the bans of incans 
(here, 70 W bulbs are banned, but the even more useless lights running from XX number of 12 V bulbs is not even considered, even when the total watt sums up at 500-1000 or more)

I do not think those "small" bulbs will ever be banned, even these 10 or 20 W types, like Silva and such



PS: with "incandescent head lamps" I immediately think of Petzl Zoom and similar crap - good when _there was nothing_, 20 years ago - but these REALLY are a type of incan light no one can be sad that they are replaced by much better led lights ...
... or which ones are You thinking of?


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## StorminMatt (Feb 22, 2014)

yellow said:


> I do not think those "small" bulbs will ever be banned, even these 10 or 20 W types, like Silva and such



They won't be banned. But they can sure be discontinued due to a lack of sales. In the end, there is little difference.


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## SemiMan (Feb 23, 2014)

There would never be any reason to ban flashlight bulbs ... total energy usage and related emissions is almost nil ... as well as the market size is so small and getting smaller.


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## AnAppleSnail (Feb 23, 2014)

"Standard" incandescent light bulbs in the 100-watt, 75-watt, 60-watt, and 40-watt output ratings will be banned. These are bulbs used in light sockets around your home. Exceptions include:

"Specialty" bulbs. Trouble lights, oven light bulbs, fridge lights.
"Halogen bulbs" ban delayed. These will be available for several years, if nothing changes.

The light bulb ban has a lot of good and bad things going for it, but the political discussions are best suited for The Underground subforum.

Small filament bulbs in flashlights have been steadily losing ground to other light sources. Efficiency, durability, bigger numbers on the box (Lumens x Runtime), cool factor, soulless priority of measurables over aesthetics, pick your favorite reason.


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## idleprocess (Feb 23, 2014)

AnAppleSnail said:


> Small filament bulbs in flashlights have been steadily losing ground to other light sources. Efficiency, durability, bigger numbers on the box (Lumens x Runtime), cool factor, soulless priority of measurables over aesthetics, pick your favorite reason.


The loss of shelf space at major retailers is a far greater danger to the availability of incandescent flashlight bulbs than legislation. If the demand fades, the supply is sure to follow.


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## Monocrom (Feb 23, 2014)

Yeah.... Pick your favorite incandescent lights you already own, and stock up on bulbs for them NOW.


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## Timothybil (Feb 24, 2014)

Those companies with strong federal/military contracts (Surefire, Streamlight, et. al.) will be carrying incan bulbs for quite a while. Those contracts almost always contain a clause about spare parts being made available for xx years afterwards. Since Surefire, et. al. are still selling incan lights, I'm sure there will be bulbs available for many years to come.


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## markr6 (Feb 24, 2014)

AnAppleSnail said:


> "Standard" incandescent light bulbs in the 100-watt, 75-watt, 60-watt, and 40-watt output ratings will be banned. These are bulbs used in light sockets around your home. Exceptions include:
> 
> "Specialty" bulbs. Trouble lights, oven light bulbs, fridge lights.
> "Halogen bulbs" ban delayed. These will be available for several years, if nothing changes.
> ...



Any chance the torpedo or flame-shape bulbs with candelabra bases will be classified "specialty"? Hopefully they'll keep those going. I'm sure a big plastic heat sink/electronics cover will look lovely exposed on those $1000 chandeliers!


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## idleprocess (Feb 24, 2014)

Venturing a little OT here...



markr6 said:


> Any chance the torpedo or flame-shape bulbs with candelabra bases will be classified "specialty"? Hopefully they'll keep those going. I'm sure a big plastic heat sink/electronics cover will look lovely exposed on those $1000 chandeliers!


Most candelabra-base bulbs have neither the lumen output nor the medium Edison base to be classified as "general service bulbs" thus are not the target of present legislation.

It's worth noting that with advances in LED, we will likely soon see LED's efficient and thermally rugged enough not to require significant heatsinking alongside monolithic drivers that can fit within a truly minute volume.


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## inetdog (Feb 24, 2014)

My problem with our living room ceiling light is that even though it has a frosted globe, the clearance from the sockets to the globe is so short that I need a round lamp rather than a candle shape and so I have not found an LED that will fit. 
All of the candelabra socket bulbs are flame shaped and are too long to fit.


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## latestarter (Feb 25, 2014)

Dont mean to but in on the op thread but are Maglite still making all there C and D lights in incan, or are we just seeing the leftovers in shops.
I might have to stock up if they arnt in manufacter any more.


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## StorminMatt (Feb 25, 2014)

As far as I know, Mag is still making incandescent flashlights. In fact, within the last year, they even upgraded their incandescent bulbs to the new Xenon bipin design. Of course, I'm not sure how well incandescent Mags are selling compared to the new LED models.


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## idleprocess (Feb 26, 2014)

StorminMatt said:


> As far as I know, Mag is still making incandescent flashlights. In fact, within the last year, they even upgraded their incandescent bulbs to the new Xenon bipin design. Of course, I'm not sure how well incandescent Mags are selling compared to the new LED models.


Less and less common on store shelves at big box retailers and Fry's. Not sure if they're in contention any more at sporting goods stores.


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## Hallis (Mar 13, 2014)

Monocrom said:


> Yeah.... Pick your favorite incandescent lights you already own, and stock up on bulbs for them NOW.



This is exactly what i've been doing. over the last few months i've picked up parts, bulbs, etc for incandescant mod projects that i've either owned in the past and missed or always wanted. Good thing about that is that usually when you can find the parts they're very affordable. I'm going to keep it around more for nostalgia purposes as I use LED's for actual instances where i need light. There's just something about them. 

that and being able to set fire to something with your 10k lumen 16 cell monster just putting a smile on your face. 

So yah. Stocking up on bulbs wherever I can find them. Because besides the "ban" conversation which I think is moot for our purposes older hardware eventually phases out and becomes unavailable. As a result i've had a somewhat hard time finding certain WA bulbs. but thanks to a few fellow flashaholics i've been able to attain a small stash.


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## AnAppleSnail (Mar 13, 2014)

inetdog said:


> My problem with our living room ceiling light is that even though it has a frosted globe, the clearance from the sockets to the globe is so short that I need a round lamp rather than a candle shape and so I have not found an LED that will fit.
> All of the candelabra socket bulbs are flame shaped and are too long to fit.



It's not so hard to get a larger globe. "Cars won't fit into my stable, so I can't get one."


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## Monocrom (Mar 13, 2014)

Hallis said:


> This is exactly what i've been doing. over the last few months i've picked up parts, bulbs, etc for incandescant mod projects that i've either owned in the past and missed or always wanted. Good thing about that is that usually when you can find the parts they're very affordable. I'm going to keep it around more for nostalgia purposes as I use LED's for actual instances where i need light. There's just something about them.
> 
> that and being able to set fire to something with your 10k lumen 16 cell monster just putting a smile on your face.
> 
> So yah. Stocking up on bulbs wherever I can find them. Because besides the "ban" conversation which I think is moot for our purposes older hardware eventually phases out and becomes unavailable. As a result i've had a somewhat hard time finding certain WA bulbs. but thanks to a few fellow flashaholics i've been able to attain a small stash.



If you have project lights that run off of inca. bulbs, even more reason to stock up now. I'm mainly focusing on spare bulbs for my custom Leef-bodied SF M4, my SF M6, SF P91 bulbs, and streamlight bulbs for my SL Scorpion and my modded SL NightFighter (basically took off the ridiculous grip ring and chucked it in the trash; making the NF a much better and handier little light). Not sure if I should buy a few SureFire E-series bulbs for my one SF E2E that hasn't been converted over to an LED light.


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## markr6 (Mar 13, 2014)

AnAppleSnail said:


> It's not so hard to get a larger globe. "Cars won't fit into my stable, so I can't get one."



Don't try saying that to someone with a $1500 chandelier with exposed bulbs! Those pretty much require a nice looking "all glass" bulb with no janky plastic base at the bottom and visible LEDs on a post. Not that I'm going to drop that kind of money personally, but that's a large majority of the lamps I see in the decorating magazines my wife reads.


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## Hallis (Mar 13, 2014)

Monocrom said:


> If you have project lights that run off of inca. bulbs, even more reason to stock up now. I'm mainly focusing on spare bulbs for my custom Leef-bodied SF M4, my SF M6, SF P91 bulbs, and streamlight bulbs for my SL Scorpion and my modded SL NightFighter (basically took off the ridiculous grip ring and chucked it in the trash; making the NF a much better and handier little light). Not sure if I should buy a few SureFire E-series bulbs for my one SF E2E that hasn't been converted over to an LED light.



I've not even thought about bulbs for my Surefire E1W or my Streamlight TL-3. The Surefire is more of a collection piece but the TL-3 gets some use now and then.


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## Monocrom (Mar 13, 2014)

Hallis said:


> I've not even thought about bulbs for my Surefire E1W or my Streamlight TL-3. The Surefire is more of a collection piece but the TL-3 gets some use now and then.



I was looking to actually get a TL-3 with the shock-resistant bulbs for future mounting onto a rifle I don't own yet. Was very surprised to see that it was one of the models that Streamlight discontinued. I'm guessing since that was discontinued, both the shock-resistant and standard bulbs for it have been too. Better start ordering from any sites that still have them in stock.

With an E1W, yeah it's more of an extremely rarely use collector's item. Still, you're going to want to be able to fire it up a decade or two from now. Even later on if you pass it down or gift it to someone special. Better get a handful of bulbs.

It is so incredibly frustrating having to stock up on bulbs.... and still knowing your favorite lights might be non-functional decades down the road. :shakehead


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## RetroTechie (Mar 13, 2014)

As to original question:



jso902 said:


> I understand that incandescent lights are gradually losing ground to an ever growing led market
> 
> Does this mean our incandescent head lamps will soon be custom ordered?
> And what happens if they are banned?


I understand that coal stoves are gradually losing ground to an ever growing induction cooker market 

Does this mean our coal stoves will soon be custom ordered? 
And what happens if they are banned?

 

In short: no, incandescent bulbs will remain available. It's only a matter of where, how many, at what price. "Banned" just means "not available anymore through *regular* channels".


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## jso902 (Mar 14, 2014)

inetdog said:


> My problem with our living room ceiling light is that even though it has a frosted globe, the clearance from the sockets to the globe is so short that I need a round lamp rather than a candle shape and so I have not found an LED that will fit.
> All of the candelabra socket bulbs are flame shaped and are too long to fit.



They sell round shaped bulbs with the smaller sockets. They also have adapters.


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## broadgage (Mar 14, 2014)

I very much doubt that incandescent flashlight bulbs will ever be banned.

The market is however a shrinking market, and I forsee many types of flashlight and other miniature bulb going out of production.
Maglight, Surefire and others still manufacture incandescent flashlights and I would expect that they will support the products with replacement lamps for some years at least.

The choice has already declined a lot, many older types of E10 flashlight lamps are no longer readily available. I have not seen 5.5 volt 0.3 amp miniature screw base lamps for years.
Even in prefocus lamps, the choice is rapidly declining.

Very low power incandescents such as 3.8 volt 0.15 amp are now rare.

Similar arguments apply to miniature lamps used in say vintage radio sets, or old cars. The common ones should be around for years, but obscure ones are vanishing rapidly.


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## Monocrom (Mar 14, 2014)

SureFire is keeping just a small handful of their previous huge incandescent line-up. In short order, they got rid of nearly all their older models. Probably would have gotten rid of all of them, except for likely requirements from their Government contracts. No secret the army issues SureFire G2 lights to soldiers during low-light shoot training. (Once the training is over, they take the lights back from those soldiers to use with the next class coming in.) And, yup; incandescent G2 is one of those few that can still be found on SureFire's site.


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## Canuke (May 23, 2014)

markr6 said:


> Don't try saying that to someone with a $1500 chandelier with exposed bulbs! Those pretty much require a nice looking "all glass" bulb with no janky plastic base at the bottom and visible LEDs on a post. Not that I'm going to drop that kind of money personally, but that's a large majority of the lamps I see in the decorating magazines my wife reads.



Hmmm. I've long thought that a different way to reuse old Edison-based fixtures, such as old style table lamps, would be to stick a AC-DC converter in its body/base instead of in the bulb itself. That way, all you need to fit into the A19 form factor are the emitters and heatsinks.

Classic chandeliers should eventually be retrofittable in the same manner; stick the converter in the ceiling, run DC only down to the sockets where the unsinked low-power LED's are. As efficiency improves, the total-lumens ceiling on such a setup will keep rising.

(I'm aware of the economic/mass-market reasons why using Edison base as a DC socket would be trouble: too easy to mix up AC and DC parts. That wouldn't have to stop custom work, though.)


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## inetdog (May 23, 2014)

There is a technique used for high efficiency (CFL or LED) bulbs into standard Edison sockets so that incans cannot be used. Essentially a restricting insulator that require s a narrow center contact on the bulb to reach the socket contact. That might work for this case too, although it would not prevent a DC bulb from being inserted into a standard socket.


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