# I have determind that the ultimate luman out put is around 100!!



## mpett1 (Dec 17, 2014)

As per my scientific research I have come to the conclusion that the perfect luman output for a general flashlight or headlamp is 100!! Thoughts.


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## nbp (Dec 17, 2014)

Seems fair for most applications.


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## onetrickpony (Dec 17, 2014)

Add two zeroes.


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## mcnair55 (Dec 17, 2014)

I have given this a lot of thought before wading in and after thinking how I use my lights the ultimate lumen output to me is 200,possibly my age of 60 has something to do with it I am not sure.

As much as I require 200 lumens I really now appreciate the moon mode as well.


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## kelmo (Dec 17, 2014)

I agree mate.


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## NonSenCe (Dec 17, 2014)

moonlight. 30-60lumen. and 200. those are all i need (well more than 95% of the times).  so 100lm is just fine.


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## skyfire (Dec 17, 2014)

all my edc lights have a high mode of around 100 lumens. never really needed more than that for general use, and usually use a much lower output for most tasks.

but my work lights need around 200 lumens, preferring a tight beam as well.


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## bright star (Dec 17, 2014)

Well my lowest lumen light is 400 lumens on turbo. I kind of prefer this type of lumen in the dark nowadays . must be getting older lol ...


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## archimedes (Dec 17, 2014)

I've found that <50 lumens works for >90% of my general day-to-day tasks.

I hope you all don't mind if I repost my technical chart of the evolution of flashlight output needs ... the so-called "archimedes peak"


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## scout24 (Dec 17, 2014)

That should be your sig line image... :laughing:


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## archimedes (Dec 17, 2014)

It's so detailed, though, that it would probably consume too much bandwidth (lol).


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## scout24 (Dec 17, 2014)

Maybe a quoted link to the thread where it first appeared ???


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## archimedes (Dec 17, 2014)

scout24 said:


> Maybe a quoted link to the thread where it first appeared ???


Hmmm ... I'll have to give that some thought, thanks


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## scout24 (Dec 17, 2014)

Okay, after derailing the OP's thread and giving that number some thought, my $.02 says it depends on the quality and collimation of the lumens in question.  I find an MN02 at 25 "Surefire Lumens" plenty to walk my dog with most of the time. Plenty of throw, and fantastic at-your-feet spill. 65 lumen P60 or 105 lumen P90 looks like a searchlight in comparison. By contrast, during the day at work, if using a Mule a bit more output (200?) is nice to get a well-lit, even coverage.


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## Kestrel (Dec 17, 2014)

mpett1 said:


> As per my scientific research I have come to the conclusion that the perfect luman output for a general flashlight or headlamp is 100!! Thoughts.


Therefore: 100 lumens = One luman


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## GordoJones88 (Dec 17, 2014)

Your opinion is entirely mistaken.

The True Ultimate Lumen Output Modes are :

1/100/1000


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## Burgess (Dec 17, 2014)

Interesting thread here.

Interesting responses, also.


lovecpf


For _*myself*_ ( age 61 ),

90+ percent of my flashlight needs are covered
with my two-setting LED flashlight providing:


-- 1 to 3 Lumens

and

-- 25 Lumens


Really !


But, don't worry --
I realize that I'm certainly in the minority here on CPF !



edited to add --
I sometimes do not wish to be
the Center of Attention . . . .
< wink >


_


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## reppans (Dec 17, 2014)

0.3 and 3 are my sweet spots and ~45/45% of my usage, but I like having anything from 100-300 lumens from a momentary max from ON.


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## Charles L. (Dec 17, 2014)

Utter nonsense.


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## SparkLite (Dec 17, 2014)

The ultimate lumen output according to the majority of respondents on the forum is actually 0.3 Lumens...

My personal favourite output mode is zero, as it is the most efficient for runtime tests...


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## dss_777 (Dec 18, 2014)

Now that you've solved this problem, please get to work on the following question: How long should a dog's tail be?

Show your work. 

:thumbsup:


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## dc38 (Dec 18, 2014)

This sounds like a job for...LEATHERMAN (supertool300)


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## LightWalker (Dec 18, 2014)

I like 70 myself but 100 is good too in some conditions.


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## Ryp (Dec 18, 2014)

I agree.


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## mpett1 (Dec 18, 2014)

One light one mode. I would choose a light 80-100. Not to bright for close work and enough brightness and throw for getting out there a little bit.


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## torchsarecool (Dec 18, 2014)

As much as I like being silly with really Bright torches, I gotto agree that around the house or general tasking I will never use more then 75-100 lumens. my sunwayman d20a on low/medium is usually the one I grab whilst at home and this would support your conclusion

just a thought though. My fenix tk60 on mid(110 lumens) is not suitable around the house because of the tight hotspot, thus throwing doubt on the whole thing.


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## marsos52 (Dec 18, 2014)

yea, I have this conversation a lot with a few flashlight loving buddies. they want power lumens, anything under a 1000 lumens is laughing material for them.
And, they laugh at my lights. 

Although, they're lights are cheaper quality, no name products as opposed to mine, custom American made quality lights. They can't even see or feel the difference between 
mine and theirs. they only want high lumens.

I do have one light that can give out 800 and another 400 and honestly I never go to the higher settings,

I agree 60 to 120 lumens is plenty for most situations. even in self defense it will blind some one in a close encounter.


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## cland72 (Dec 18, 2014)

I always thought that if I had to grab one light for the end of the world, it would be a Malkoff M61LL 219 in a Surefire C2 host. It really is the perfect amount of light.


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## archimedes (Dec 18, 2014)

cland72 said:


> I always thought that if I had to grab one light for the end of the world, it would be a Malkoff M61LL 219 in a Surefire C2 host. It really is the perfect amount of light.


I like the M60LL / C3 for the additional power options, but same basic idea :thumbsup:

EDIT - An MD3 with a High/Low ring might arguably be even better ... but I do like that C3-HA


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## cland72 (Dec 18, 2014)

archimedes said:


> I like the M60LL / C3 for the additional power options, but same basic idea :thumbsup:



Silly me, I forgot about the 2xAA capabilities of the 3 cell light. I change my answer to a Surefire 9P (since I don't have a C3) :twothumbs


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## H-Man (Dec 18, 2014)

Not shown: J curve of post count vs desired rutime and S curve of post count vs desired CRI. 

In all seriousness, I need more light. I'll do night bike rides when it is too hot to bike in the daytime, 100 lumens is a minimum for traveling at what is a slow pace for me, I usually use upwards of 400 lumens and still find it insufficient to illuminate things at high speeds (I've exceeded 40 MPH on my bike before.)

I'll work on cars and find 100 lumens insufficient for seeing something buried in the engine bay.

At the same time, I have a light that I don't know the run time of because I had to steal the eneloops out of it after the 10,000th hour of runtime.


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## jabe1 (Dec 18, 2014)

dss_777 said:


> How long should a dog's tail be?
> 
> Show your work.
> 
> :thumbsup:


Not enough area to show the formula, but the correct answer is: 

About _that _long.

As to lumen output, .3/ 40/ 120 works well for me, with the second mode being used mostly.


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## Charles L. (Dec 18, 2014)

H-Man said:


> In all seriousness, I need more light. I'll do night bike rides when it is too hot to bike in the daytime, 100 lumens is a minimum for traveling at what is a slow pace for me, I usually use upwards of 400 lumens and still find it insufficient to illuminate things at high speeds (I've exceeded 40 MPH on my bike before.)
> 
> I'll work on cars and find 100 lumens insufficient for seeing something buried in the engine bay.
> 
> At the same time, I have a light that I don't know the run time of because I had to steal the eneloops out of it after the 10,000th hour of runtime.



Of course you need more light to bike at night. Try mountain biking at night with 100 lumens -- and become intimate with a tree.

And of course you'd prefer more light to see in an engine bay. Or to detect buoys and pilings when on a boat. Or for search and rescue. Or when camping. Heck, I prefer more lumens to walk around my yard at night. Or read at night (my eyes are getting old). And a lot less to walk around my house when everyone is asleep.

Any of you guys fans of Regularcarreviews on youtube? This discussion reminds me of their parody of an Accord owner: "I got the 4 cylinder, and that's fine, just fine." (Warning: be prepared to be shocked if you visit that site for the first time )

The idea that 100 lumens is the ultimate output is, as I said before, utter nonsense. In fact, I get the impression that the OP wasn't serious to begin with.


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## mpett1 (Dec 18, 2014)

Yes I was but I believe your taking it out of context. I didn’t mean the perfect light for every task. But for most tasks of just a grab and go look for something maybe work under the sink or go look into a dark room or garage for something. Oh don’t get me wrong I love to have a multi function light like maybe 1000 lm to use.


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## H-Man (Dec 19, 2014)

mpett1 said:


> Yes I was but I believe your taking it out of context. I didn’t mean the perfect light for every task. But for most tasks of just a grab and go look for something maybe work under the sink or go look into a dark room or garage for something. Oh don’t get me wrong I love to have a multi function light like maybe 1000 lm to use.


I wasn't sure so I was posting the joking part first and the serious part later so that it wouldn't sound OT. I've been writing out coursework all day so humor may be a bit lost on me.


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## sgt253 (Dec 19, 2014)

dss_777 said:


> Now that you've solved this problem, please get to work on the following question: How long should a dog's tail be?
> 
> Show your work.
> 
> :thumbsup:




HAHAHA! Best reply/quote of 2014. Brilliant!


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## TEEJ (Dec 19, 2014)

Lumens by them self are not that meaningful.

You can't SEE lumens, you essentially see the resultant lux.

So, if the light is floody, 100 lumens can be so spread out that there's not enough lux....and, if tight, 100 lumens could be too bright and cause glare, etc.


Its like saying what the perfect horsepower for a vehicle should be...without knowing if the vehicle is an army tank or a motorcycle....and showing a chart that shows that the older the vehicle, the lower the HP.

Essentially, its not a meaningful question...and correlating it to post counts is cute and seems, at least superficially, to be pithy, albeit, the conclusion is simply that the longer a person has been posting, the more likely that they started with lights in that lumen output range and beam shape that they consider "normal".


Later posters (lower post counts) would be starting off with higher lumen options available than their predecessors had, and, to them, a lower lumen output is not as desirable or "normal". A floodier pattern for example is now possible from a practical basis, because of higher lumen options to allow the same lux to simply cover a wider area.


A more useful data set might be how much lux on the subject is preferred for different tasks.

This has already been done of course.


Example: (There are many, this one is one of the simpler ones)


ActivityIllumination
_(lux, lumen/m2​)_Public areas with dark surroundings20 - 50Simple orientation for short visits50 - 100Working areas where visual tasks are only occasionally performed100 - 150Warehouses, Homes, Theaters, Archives150Easy Office Work, Classes250Normal Office Work, PC Work, Study Library, Groceries, Show Rooms, Laboratories500Supermarkets, Mechanical Workshops, Office Landscapes750Normal Drawing Work, Detailed Mechanical Workshops, Operation Theatres1,000Detailed Drawing Work, Very Detailed Mechanical Works1500 - 2000Performance of visual tasks of low contrast and very small size for prolonged periods of time2000 - 5000Performance of very prolonged and exacting visual tasks5000 - 10000Performance of very special visual tasks of extremely low contrast and small size10000 - 20000




If you scan the chart, you'd see that if you only start with 100 lumens, the area that you can get sufficient lux in, is often too small to be truly useful.

If the argument is that you simply prefer dimmer light than recommended for tasks to avoid eyestrain....OK, but, that means you want it dimmer than lighting levels that are healthier for you.


If your personal use is limited to finding the bathroom at 3 am in a strange hotel room, etc...fine, a candle would work...but some people need to see more detail, and use their lights differently...and, a higher lux on what they are trying to see is better for them.


So, if your use is close range/short duration with a tight beam, 100 L might be too much and glare badly...but, if your use is long range and long duration, say patrolling a large area, 100 L is going to be woefully in adequate....and so forth, regardless of your post count.


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## archimedes (Dec 19, 2014)

Ummm ... @*TEEJ* ... my chart was a "joke" 

EDIT - It seems like half the posters in this thread are just goofing around, and the other half are super serious


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## fresh eddie fresh (Dec 19, 2014)

E1B is my perfect everything light and it has around a 100 lumen high, so I agree!


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## mcnair55 (Dec 19, 2014)

H-Man said:


> Not shown: J curve of post count vs desired rutime and S curve of post count vs desired CRI.
> 
> In all seriousness, I need more light. I'll do night bike rides when it is too hot to bike in the daytime, 100 lumens is a minimum for traveling at what is a slow pace for me, I usually use upwards of 400 lumens and still find it insufficient to illuminate things at high speeds (I've exceeded 40 MPH on my bike before.)
> 
> ...



You are bringing specifics into the equation,not many automotive lights offer much more than 100 lumens which seems to be the about the average,anything to bright working on vehicles tends to be a hindrance rather than an aid.


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## Daekar (Dec 19, 2014)

archimedes said:


> I've found that <50 lumens works for >90% of my general day-to-day tasks.
> 
> I hope you all don't mind if I repost my technical chart of the evolution of flashlight output needs ... the so-called "archimedes peak"



God, that graph is so true.


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## TEEJ (Dec 19, 2014)

archimedes said:


> Ummm ... @*TEEJ* ... my chart was a "joke"
> 
> EDIT - It seems like half the posters in this thread are just goofing around, and the other half are super serious





I seemed too serious?


I don't get accused of that too often.


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## mpett1 (Dec 19, 2014)

Its all good!!


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## RWT1405 (Dec 19, 2014)

I also find my Malkoff M60/61 LL's to be the best, for the majority of what I need in a light. A MD2 or 3, with a high/low switch, will cover most everything I need.


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## GordoJones88 (Dec 19, 2014)




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## nbp (Dec 19, 2014)

Oooooh, shiny!! :huh:


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## Mike 208 (Dec 20, 2014)

75 to 100 lumens is good for EDC; For work, the more the merrier.


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## H-Man (Dec 20, 2014)

mcnair55 said:


> You are bringing specifics into the equation,not many automotive lights offer much more than 100 lumens which seems to be the about the average,anything to bright working on vehicles tends to be a hindrance rather than an aid.



If the car is new, maybe, but with the age of cars I can afford I need as much light as I can get so that I can actually spot things the exact same color as the rest of the engine bay (like vacuum lines, lost tools, bolts, etc.)


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## Taz80 (Dec 20, 2014)

archimedes, Seeing as how some CPF'ers are getting up there in years your chart may have to start taking an upturn.


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## archimedes (Dec 20, 2014)

Taz80 said:


> archimedes, Seeing as how some CPF'ers are getting up there in years your chart may have to start taking an upturn.[emoji14]oke:


That thought had actually occurred to me ...


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## ForrestChump (Dec 20, 2014)

I got the HDS GD 120, coming from WAY brighter lights, 100 lumens is surprisingly useful in 95% of what Im doing. I dig it.


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## Mmassey338 (Dec 21, 2014)

100 lumens is MUCH too bright for 49.5% of what I need a light for, and MUCH too dim for another 49.5%, but perfect about 1% of the time.


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## gravelmonkey (Dec 21, 2014)

If you look at it as: "You have to make do with one, single mode light for the rest of your life. Assuming XM-L in P60 reflector style beam shape, what brightness do you go with?"

I'd agree that 100 is ideal for 2*AA and upwards sized lights, anything smaller tends to have a bit too short run time IMO.

Thankfully, the above situation is hypothetical and we have multi-mode lights :twothumbs


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## thinkFlashlights01 (Dec 21, 2014)

I like 500+ lumens. It gives me more versatility.


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## thedoc007 (Dec 21, 2014)

thinkFlashlights01 said:


> I like 500+ lumens. It gives me more versatility.



Agreed. 100 lumens is plenty for most tasks in total darkness, but I use my lights most often at work, doing truck inspections. The main challenge there is overcoming ambient lighting, and seeing well in shadowed areas. 100 lumens of a very tight beam would be adequate, but it would be terrible to use a tight beam - it would mean taking much more time to scan every inch. With a bright flooder (my current favorite for the purpose is my Eagletac G25C2 Mk II with diffuser, on high) it goes quicker, AND lowers my chances of missing anything.

You can always dim a bright light, but if you bring a light that is too weak, you are pretty much SOL. So my preference, despite a decent post count, is always for max possible brightness. Even if I had to use a single mode, I would want at least 400 lumens, or more if the beam was very floody. (My loaner light is an Ultrafire Wf-501b 500 lumen single mode...I don't worry about it, it is dead simple to use, and it is bright enough to do the job well.)


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## Cerealand (Dec 21, 2014)

thedoc007, so you're the outlier on archimedes' graph. My post count is so-so, but I still lured to the brightness from time to time.


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## Chicken Drumstick (Dec 22, 2014)

mpett1 said:


> As per my scientific research I have come to the conclusion that the perfect luman output for a general flashlight or headlamp is 100!! Thoughts.


Depends completely on the situation of "general use". And the optic/reflector/led in question. e.g.

100 lumens from an XM-L in a tiny OP reflector or behind a TIR/aspheric on flood will be completely different to 100 lumens from an XR-E in a 2" SMO reflector.


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## ForrestChump (Dec 22, 2014)

Headlamp wise I just swapped out a Takkina ( 60 Lumens ) to a Tikka ( 80 Lumens ).

That said @ 60 there was plenty of light to walk a trail, it wasn't impressive by any means but did the job well enough. It's designed for "some movement & proximity lighting" per Petzl and filled that roll perfectly.

So Im thinking the 80 will be plenty for night hikes.

@ $15.00 on sale for the Tikinna...... Petzl just whoops everyone all the time. IMO


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## jwag73 (Dec 23, 2014)

Depending on the light, 100 luman can be plenty for basic needs.


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## H-Man (Dec 23, 2014)

I shined a light through my glasses in a dark room. I estimate that the total light output was cut in half by the lens. Makes sense seeing how the glasses are better suited for daytime use (transitions lenses and antiglare material are likely to blame on top of them being a bit thick.)


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## Charles L. (Dec 23, 2014)

thedoc007 said:


> Agreed. 100 lumens is plenty for most tasks in total darkness, but I use my lights most often at work, doing truck inspections. The main challenge there is overcoming ambient lighting, and seeing well in shadowed areas. 100 lumens of a very tight beam would be adequate, but it would be terrible to use a tight beam - it would mean taking much more time to scan every inch. With a bright flooder (my current favorite for the purpose is my Eagletac G25C2 Mk II with diffuser, on high) it goes quicker, AND lowers my chances of missing anything.
> 
> You can always dim a bright light, but if you bring a light that is too weak, you are pretty much SOL. So my preference, despite a decent post count, is always for max possible brightness. Even if I had to use a single mode, I would want at least 400 lumens, or more if the beam was very floody. (My loaner light is an Ultrafire Wf-501b 500 lumen single mode...I don't worry about it, it is dead simple to use, and it is bright enough to do the job well.)



So much good stuff in this post: 

"The main challenge there is overcoming ambient lighting, and seeing well in shadowed areas." Ambient lighting and shadows definitely affect one's desired lumen output.

"You can always dim a bright light, but if you bring a light that is too weak, you are pretty much SOL." Says it all, really. 

"So my preference, despite a decent post count, is always for max possible brightness." Of course. And a trip to vinh's forum disproves Archimedes' graph, if anyone actually were to believe it (seemed tongue-in-cheek to me).

I've determined that the ultimate lumen output depends entirely on the task at hand, but usually is somewhere between 0.1 and 1000. Thankfully there are a few lights that can accommodate.


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## BennyBoomBox (Dec 25, 2014)

Charles L. said:


> So much good stuff in this post:
> 
> "The main challenge there is overcoming ambient lighting, and seeing well in shadowed areas." Ambient lighting and shadows definitely affect one's desired lumen output.
> 
> ...



ahaha true that on another note I do like useing my tk61 on low around the house the hot spot it like a 100lms bright to my eyes


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## MidnightDistortions (Jan 3, 2015)

There are some cases where you will need a 500+ lumen flashlight, for most of my uses i only need 30-60 lumens. The higher lumen lights are best when you need floodlights to encompass the entire area. If you're outside needing to look for a lost pet in the dark or for scaring burglars away.  If you are walking in the park at night or trailing at night all those extra lumens might be too much especially when there are others trying to walk in their adjusted to dark eyes. It's kinda like those people who drive with their brights on, it's too bright for others and often times it's blinding because most of the time you are driving in total darkness or with the what little allumination the city lights have.

I'm also a gamer that often times will go through a strategy guide book during a game and generally too much light can ruin the atmosphere of the game when i need to pause to check the guide. But that's my uses. Some people actually need higher lumen output or just really like the higher lumens. If i get too much reflection from the light then it's too bright for me, but i'll take a few lights with really high lumens with a good flood , you never know when you might need one.


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## arcticscythe (Jan 5, 2015)

Im new here but I gotta add a stipulation. 100 lumens with a good orange-peel reflector. I dont like the bright hot spot and the soft flood. really I just wish the surefire 6p bezel would shrink without losing its blend between throw and flood. 

I used a 170 lumen light for years and it was too bright on high. The low mode wasnt rated but I would put it around 50 or so and it was great around the house.

J


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## Bullzeyebill (Jan 5, 2015)

I am noticing that I am using lights in the 20-100 lumens range around the house. In fact I have been using one of PK's Icon Rouge single AA lights, which has a stated 50 lumens max, and it is working just fine, with a nice throw, and decent beam. I bought a bunch of them before Xmas a gave several out as gifts. Got some more later, and will be sending one of them to my daughter in Penn.

Bill


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## C.M.S (Jan 5, 2015)

200 lumens works for me most of the time , but it's really really NICE to be able to crank out 1100 :thumbsup:


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## A264 (Jan 21, 2015)

100 inside a house I find just a bit much, outside within 30yds property it works well enough to NOT draw unwanted interest.
I have settled on A2 of course, based on over 25 years many funny and shocking uses of flashlights from the batman solitaire to surefires m6/streamlight box light.
when I used 100ish inside, WHEN other people are involved THEY did not expect the brightness.
I have never had a brightness problem with the A2 but still get the question, why do you have a flashlight


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## CyclingSalmon14 (Jan 22, 2015)

GordoJones88 said:


> Your opinion is entirely mistaken.
> 
> The True Ultimate Lumen Output Modes are :
> 
> 1/100/1000



I find 1 not enough or 100 to much.

I think for me 0.5,5,50,500,5000?

Plenty of good lower modes and plenty of diffrence. Coulf maby do with a 200 but i dont find 500 is too much if 50 wont get it done.

What i actual use is more like ML-100-300/600 (Depend on light in use)-2000ish or more.

But LUMENS DONT MATTER.

IV FOUND beam shape tint and CRI ti matter far more.

I like floody lights with a brighter fentre but not a real hot spot more just a brighter middle.


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## MidnightDistortions (Jan 22, 2015)

A264 said:


> 100 inside a house I find just a bit much, outside within 30yds property it works well enough to NOT draw unwanted interest.
> I have settled on A2 of course, based on over 25 years many funny and shocking uses of flashlights from the batman solitaire to surefires m6/streamlight box light.
> when I used 100ish inside, WHEN other people are involved THEY did not expect the brightness.
> I have never had a brightness problem with the A2 but still get the question, why do you have a flashlight



I recently tested this theory of 100 lumens in the house, if you're using a flashlight at night instead of using the lights in the house, 1-15 lumens is really all you need and your eyes can adjust better anyway. But if the power goes out using 100+ lumen flashlights is really beneficial, especially in an emergency where you need a good lantern/candle. I need to make some stands or get something to properly stand some 2D 130 lumen LED Mags i got so they don't get knocked around but they work great as a candle with the head on. Might be too bright with it off.. but never tested that part out.


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## chadvone (Jan 23, 2015)

The faster I am moving the more light I like. Inside after sunset real use lumens 25-120. Playing, being paranoid .001 -.3


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## hoop762 (Jan 23, 2015)

Anything less than 500 just makes me sad all over. I've never found a use for moonlight mode or even low modes on my lights, Never use em. Most of my light use is outdoors, but even indoors when I need light, I need a lot of it, not a little. The lights I carry and use on a daily basis currently are all 1k+ lumen VNs. There's no way I can go back.


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## night.hoodie (Jan 23, 2015)

Agree with OP, when idk what I need, for dark I take a neutral 1.8/115 cc/unregulated- really easy to keep an idea of cell life. But my newish Fenix cc/regulated 8/25/85 is growing on me, fiercely, though its run time is not as good, the "regulated" thing makes up for that, sort of. 

But I would like a cc/regulated 2/20/200, with a 2 day firefly runtime, 10 hours on med, 200 for an hour, seems the best elegant compromise (if those run times are possible with a single AAA). Along with a second bright one with 400/800/1600 with any runtime on LiMn, covers all my possibilities. That's all I can conceive I'd want, other than desire for colors like a yellow (bug light), an amber, a deep red, a green peaked where the eye sees it strongest, and a Kmart-Special/police blue, a forensic 360-375nm, and a sterilizing 254nm, but I have no idea what lumens I want from colors yet.

---


> 1/10/100



Does this exist?


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## wjv (Jan 26, 2015)

I generally agree. For a long time my favorite EDC was a Fenix LD10 3. 13. 45. 100 and rarely used it on the 100 lumen setting.

Now my EDC is a Spark SG5 1, 8, 40, 110, 280 and the majority of the real usage is on the 40 lumen setting or less. I dare say I use the 1 lumen and 8 lumen settings more than the 40 lumens by 2x or 3x. I went with the Spark for my new EDC not because of lumens, but because it is a mule (almost) and has a super floody beam.

I have brighter lights, but in reality when I crank the LD50 up to 1,800 lumens I'm just playing around and it is massive overkill. For real usage I use it on 25 or 140 lumens.

Honestly I enjoy playing with lights on max, but I never understood the "I need a light for walking my dog and it has to be at least 2,000 lumens" perspective. But the nice thing is that there is no harm / no foul in having and using a light that has more lumens than needed, except for close up work where too much light can be blinding.

There is no doubt that different tasks/situations have different lighting requirements. When i walk my dog he HAS to be on a leash because he is so dumb that he will run in front of cars, or try and chase the pack of coyotes (he's a Yorkie BTW). But someone living on a 30 acre farm who owns a dog who is smart enough to come when called, might actually want and need a 2,000 lumen light for "walking the dog". .


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## Tacti'cool' (Jan 26, 2015)

I recently got a malkoff m61nl and have been nothing but amazed. 120 lumen at 4000k and 5 hour battery life....perfect unless you need a thrower. I am slowly realizing beam quality and tint are much more important than mongo output. I am really hoping to see a m61nll in the near future.


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## dss_777 (Jan 28, 2015)

Tacti'cool' said:


> I recently got a malkoff m61nl and have been nothing but amazed. 120 lumen at 4000k and 5 hour battery life....perfect unless you need a thrower. *I am slowly realizing beam quality and tint are much more important than mongo output*. I am really hoping to see a m61nll in the near future.



Further proof for my theory that it's all part of Gene Malkoff and Don McLeish's plan for world domination. :thumbsup:

(cue the sound of faint, evil laughter in the background...)


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## RobertM (Jan 28, 2015)

night.hoodie said:


> 1/10/100
> Does this exist?



It does with an HDS EDC! Just program those levels, or whatever levels you would like. 
On mine, I personally chose 0.02/1/25/170 which seem to work nicely. 25 is the startup level and seems to work well for ~90% of of my EDC lighting needs.


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## FroggyTaco (Jan 28, 2015)

gravelmonkey said:


> If you look at it as: "You have to make do with one, single mode light for the rest of your life. Assuming XM-L in P60 reflector style beam shape, what brightness do you go with?"
> 
> I'd agree that 100 is ideal for 2*AA and upwards sized lights, anything smaller tends to have a bit too short run time IMO.
> 
> Thankfully, the above situation is hypothetical and we have multi-mode lights :twothumbs



I would say 40 lumens.


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## westfork (Jan 29, 2015)

My preferred output is one mode of around 100 lumens and one to infinity  I never use a flashlight indoors and our outdoors can be very dark with no ambient light source except for the moon and stars. When there is no moon you may not be able to see your hand in front of your face since with no light pollution there is no reflected light from the clouds. Virtually every night I need to check on something with the livestock and that is where a very long throw is necessary, especially with the predators that have been taking our cattle. When out with the dogs the 100 lumens is fine but with the capability to send a strong floody light to see what may be coming our way and to be able to get some good shots off. I have liked the old S12 for this use and am hoping the new PD40 works as well. Decent output and small enough to easily stuff in your back pocket. I really like the 26650 format.


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## Tixx (Jan 31, 2015)

Well, I guess that is the end!


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