# The Coleman Conversion



## Nitro (Aug 23, 2004)

*The Coleman Conversion with BEAMSHOTS!*

I have this spotlight with a 100W Hologen stock bulb, which suited me fine, until I started reading this forum.

Inspired by Sway's LightForce, I decided to upgrade mine to an HID.

I received a 35/50W HID and bulb in the mail, so I'm ready to go.

Armed with the knowledge from Sway's experience, there are a list of issues, I might have solutions for.

1. The high voltage wire from the Ignitor to Bulb Socket can not be lengthened, so that forces me to mount the Ignitor on top of the light. I'm going to drill holes in the light to feed the wires through. Actually I think it will look cool.

2. The Ballast needs to adequately dissipate heat, so I'm going to mount it in an aluminum box under the light. I might even mount heat sinks to the box if necessary. I just have to find the right box.

3. Apparently the Ballast doesn't take to kindly to the battery dropping under the minimum voltage when operating. After the ballast shuts off, the absent load raises the battery voltage enough to fire the ballast. Which then drops the voltage and shuts off again. It ends up in a vicious cycle, beating on the ballast until the light is shut off.

I may have a design for a simple circuit that will trip a safety cutoff after the the ballast shuts off the first time. A reset button will have to be pushed to turn the light back on after reconnecting the battery. It will act kind of like a circuit breaker, only in reverse. I'll have to do some testing though. I'm also thinking of mounting some LED's in the box to indicate the battery charge.

4. The other issue is relative to my light, and that's mounting the bulb socket. I want to keep the external focusing ability of the stock light, so I have to come up with another mount, but still use part of the existing one. Fortunately I happen to know a machinist that's going to design one for me.

I'll post some pictures once I make some progress.

To be continued...


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## Nitro (Aug 30, 2004)

Update:

I'm still waiting for the machinist to make the base for the socket. As soon as I get something from him I'll post a picture. Those machinists are almost as slow as programmers.

I have a few designs for the cutoff circuit. The simplest one, which would be very easy to create, is to use an SCR (run in series with the Ballast) as a trigger. You can hook the switch up to the Gate, which will close (turn on) the SCR, conducting current through the Ballast. The SCR will stay closed until the current stops flowing through the Ballast (ie Ballast shutting off due to low voltage). The other way to turn it off is to put another switch in series with the SCR to stop the current. So, you have one switch to turn it on, and one switch to turn it off. Not the most ideal, but it would work and be simple to create.

Another issue is the SCR will drop 0.7V across it. So the Ballast will shut off when the Battery drops below 8.7V instead of 8V, losing 0.7V of runtime. The question is, how much runtime are we talking for the battery to drop from 8.7 to 8.0 Volts, and would it be acceptable to lose that 0.7 Volts?

There are other components that can be used like a FET or Relay that would not drop any volts, but the circuits become little more complicated. I'm trying to come up with the simplest approach. Anyone else have idea's?


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## Sway (Aug 30, 2004)

Nitro,

Your getting way over my head when talking circuit design /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/icon3.gif I have seen some LED low voltage indicators talked about in RC Forums and places that sale Li-Poly battery packs. I remember seeing one for $10.00 that comes on at 10V which should keep you ballast and lamp very happy, if I run across it again I will post the link.

Later
Sway


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## Nitro (Aug 30, 2004)

Sway,

Thanks.

I'm going out of town for a week, so check back then.

Later.


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## cheesehead (Aug 30, 2004)

Nitro, 

0.7 volts with a SLA at 12 volts is probably about 15 minutes. But an SLA at 8-9 volts is bad, that's very low for an SLA and may damage it. A cut-off around 10-11 volts is safer, especially since there is little energy left at 9 volts. 

cheese


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## larryk (Aug 31, 2004)

Nitro, check into this,

http://www.keyquestsupplies.com/shop/index.php?shop=1&cat=80

Larry.


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## Nitro (Sep 11, 2004)

[ QUOTE ]
*cheesehead said:*
Nitro, 

0.7 volts with a SLA at 12 volts is probably about 15 minutes. But an SLA at 8-9 volts is bad, that's very low for an SLA and may damage it. A cut-off around 10-11 volts is safer, especially since there is little energy left at 9 volts. 

cheese 

[/ QUOTE ]

I was planning on creating a NiMH pack. What would happen if it dropped under 9V? I'm also wondering how much current the ballast will be drawing at that voltage.

I have a couple different circuits that will cutoff at a predefined voltage, but they are more complicated. I was thinking of using one, but I'm not sure how much room I'll have and if I want to get into building larger circuits. So far I haven't found any pre-existing (low $$$) circuits that will do what I want though.


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## Nitro (Sep 11, 2004)

[ QUOTE ]
*larryk said:*
Nitro, check into this,

http://www.keyquestsupplies.com/shop/index.php?shop=1&cat=80

Larry. 

[/ QUOTE ]

Larry,

Do you know if this circuit will disconnect *permanently*, or will it come back on if the voltage rises above 10V again? If it stays off, it should work great.


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## larryk (Sep 11, 2004)

I can't really say, I bought one a while ago and just tested it to see if it worked properly. It did shut off at right around 10 volts under drain. I've never used it since because I changed my mind and went with a 14.4 volt NimH pack using 4 Amp C cells. The C cell pack shut down the light right at about 1 volt per cell with no load. I am using the same Kenrad set up you have. My only concern was that after a runtime test the next time I tried the light the Ballast was shot. I do know if it was from heat or it just did not like the lower voltage at the end of the runtime test, or something else. Having the 50 Watt boost is nice but the Kenrad Ballasts don't seem very well designed. I'm not the only person to have there ballast fail with only a few hours of use.


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## Nitro (Sep 12, 2004)

[ QUOTE ]
*larryk said:*
I can't really say, I bought one a while ago and just tested it to see if it worked properly. It did shut off at right around 10 volts under drain. I've never used it since because I changed my mind and went with a 14.4 volt NimH pack using 4 Amp C cells. The C cell pack shut down the light right at about 1 volt per cell with no load. I am using the same Kenrad set up you have. My only concern was that after a runtime test the next time I tried the light the Ballast was shot. I do know if it was from heat or it just did not like the lower voltage at the end of the runtime test, or something else. Having the 50 Watt boost is nice but the Kenrad Ballasts don't seem very well designed. I'm not the only person to have there ballast fail with only a few hours of use. 

[/ QUOTE ]

Well for $11.50 maybe I'll give it a try. Thanks.

BTW, where do you have you Ballast mounted?


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## Nitro (Oct 22, 2004)

Hello Everyone,

Sorry I haven't posted an update lately, but the machinist who was working on the base for this light had a Heart Attack. He happens to be my father.

I haven't been reading or posting much in these forums lately, for obvious reasons, but I want everyone to know my father is doing well.

I'm not going to give up on this project. As a matter of fact, I have a prototype that is amazing. I'll post some pictures as soon as a can.

Thank you for your patients.


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## Lunal_Tic (Oct 28, 2004)

Just wanted to say good luck and God bless. I hope things are improving for you and your father.

-LT


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## Nitro (Nov 3, 2004)

[ QUOTE ]
*Lunal_Tic said:*
Just wanted to say good luck and God bless. I hope things are improving for you and your father.

-LT 

[/ QUOTE ]

Thank you Lunal. I really appreciate it.

I'm making some beam shots of this light. Unfortunately I don't ave anything (that won't be washed out) to compare it to. But I think you'll get the picture.


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## Sway (Nov 3, 2004)

Hi Nitro,

Glad to hear you father is OK........So the light is progressing most excellent /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/happy14.gif Waiting on some pic's /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Later
Sway


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## Nitro (Apr 21, 2006)

Hello Everyone,

I haven't posted much on these forums this past year, because it's been a real difficult one. I'm sorry to say I lost my father due to Cancer.

Anyway, while cleaning the garage I came across a project him and I were working on, "The Coleman Conversion". After his Heart Attack we didn't work on this light much, but we did manage to put together a prototype. It only seems fitting that I continue where we left off.

Here is the original light:
















The problem is there's no room in the light to fit the Igniter and Ballast, so we mounted them to the outside of the light, as you can see. We were so anxious to see this light in action, we had to do something.






Not the prettiest design, but it works. We were thinking of running the wires inside the light, permanently mounting the Ignitor and Ballast and applying silicone to any cracks or holes. However, I was wondering if anyone had other ideas before I take the plunge?

Thanks


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## Nitro (Apr 22, 2006)

*Re: The Coleman Conversion with BEAMSHOTS!*

I took these shots at close range (~100ft). Although once I get a battery pack together, I'll take it on the road for some long distance fun.

The beam on the left is a MagCharger with WA1160 bulb. It's the brightest light I have next to the Coleman. The first shot was taken with a 4 sec shutter. As you can see the beam on the Coleman is way overexposed.






I decided to speed the shutter up to 1 sec, so you can get a better perspective of the difference in light intensity. 






Although there really is no comparison. The Mag60 is ok for the 100-200 foot range, but the Coleman is begging for a longer distance. Nothing I have in my suburban backyard, unless I get on my roof.
:thinking:


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## Sway (Apr 22, 2006)

Hi Nitro,

Sorry to hear about your father, my condolences.

Good to see your back at the Coleman project, this is the same situation I was/am in with the Blitz host “what to do with the ballast and igniter”. You can place the ballast with the battery pack but keep the cord between it and the igniter to 1 meter or less and make sure it can get some air for cooling. I wouldn’t box it up or restrict air flow to it, I’m not 100% sure but I think that’s what happened to my first ballast it got too hot.

I used a piece of flat stock and shaped a frame to mount the ballast and igniter on, Eh’ it ain’t very pretty but it works for now.

One on the right.





Nice beam shots and it’s good to see another back a modding spots :thumbsup:

Later
Kelly


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## Nitro (Apr 22, 2006)

Sway,

Good to hear from you, and thank you.

I was almost embarrassed to post a picture of my ballast, but after seeing yours I don't feel so bad. :hahaha:

(Kidding of course)

I'll probably mount the ballast right where it's at on the outside. Then I won't have to worry about air flow.

Btw, what are you using for a battery? I need to come up with something.

Thanks.


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## guiri (Apr 27, 2008)

So, are there 100w HID's available and is anyone making any conversions from them?


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## guiri (Apr 27, 2008)

Sorry, forgot to subscribe


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## Nitro (May 7, 2008)

guiri said:


> So, are there 100w HID's available and is anyone making any conversions from them?


 
None that I know of. But if you find any, let us know.


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## Hellchicken (Jul 22, 2008)

Hello!

Can you plz tell me where i can get those "Coleman"-Lights?
At coleman.com i found one, but it looks very different.

Thanks,

the Hellchicken


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## Nitro (Aug 8, 2008)

To tell you the truth I don't know where you would find one today, other then used at CPF or eBay. I got mine over 20 years ago at a local sporting goods shop.


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