# Exploding Batteries



## Marion David Poff (Jul 21, 2007)

Howdy,

I am interested in exploding batteries, and I would be happy to search for threads....

But, I keep getting an error message, and so the search function is not working for me....

If you could be so kind as to post some links, etc.....

Marion


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## FILIPPO (Jul 21, 2007)

https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/169038&highlight=exploding

https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/166992&highlight=exploding

https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/124776&highlight=exploding

https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/106242&highlight=exploding

......
there are too many thread about batts. explosions.
here you are the link with search: http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/search.php?searchid=2572243 
I don't know if you can read it...

I recive the same error message if I search :" batteries explosions"
don't know why:candle:

good reading...LOL


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## LuxLuthor (Jul 21, 2007)

Couple other threads of relevance, and good safety reminders to those who may not know.

https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/152013
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/posts/1916528#post1916528
http://www.cpfmarketplace.com/mp/showthread.php?t=157673


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## senna94 (Jul 21, 2007)

All of those threads are excellent and provide many hours of interesting reading. For simplicity sake though I think we should have a simple list of dos and don'ts of battery safety. Someone with far more experience than me should compile this list. Perhaps it already exists and I just haven't found it.
:candle:

After reading those threads I am afraid to go near my flashlights!!!!!!!!!!


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## LuxLuthor (Jul 21, 2007)

Senna, I think that is an excellent suggestion...but it would take someone of 'impeachable' authority and experience such as Buchmann (of Battery University) to do it....but under the kind of scrutiny and expertise that you see on this forum, it would be hard to list all the "do's and don'ts" that would cover all the relevant nuances, and have it stand on its own merits.

Remember that REPORTED battery explosions are still exceedingly rare. While there was just a post about Milwaukee Tools recalling NiCad packs, I think the biggest concern is over the dangers of Lithium Cobalt Ion (& RC 'LiPo') batteries because of the explosive/fire/thermal runaway potential.

After all the reading and posting I have done about Lithium cells (which I ONLY started doing in ernest this spring)....I think the biggest danger lies with using UNPROTECTED cells, especially IN SERIES, and ESPECIALLY IF CHARGING IN SERIES & EVEN MORE SO WITH CHARGERS THAT DO NOT TERMINATE CURRENT ONCE CELLS REACH 4.15 TO 4.2 VOLTS. 

Other simple guidelines that are more geared to Lithium cells are:
Always use Protected Li-Ion cells. At least follow this until you have spent the time reading about, and have had some experience using Li-Ion cells. If you then use Unprotected cells, make sure you check voltages before and after charging, and follow other sensible precautions commensurate with their lack of protection circuits.

 Stop using a light when you first notice dimming.

 Understand the pro's and con's, and workings of your charger.

Attend to the charging. Do not succumb to the Ron Popille Rotisserie: "Set It and Forget It" strategy when charging Lithiums....or do it somewhere (fireplace/outside) where nothing gets harmed if you do forget. Tom (SilverFox) has said many times that if he has to go run an errand, he unplugs the chargers and restarts when he gets back.

 Charge in an area that maximizes safety if something goes wrong. If you do not have a garage or fireplace, at least get some bricks to place batteries on, and have some some kind of ventilation available.
Many common fire extinguishers will not work with a Lithium metal fire, nor do you want to stand around in a moment of panic trying to figure out what to do, or breathing in the fumes--so have your sand/water/appropriate fire extinguisher sitting nearby. 

My strategy during warmer weather is to charge in the garage on concrete after removing all flammables, and in the event of problem, pull the charger cord from wall and hit the garage opener door as I exit.
​These are just a few things off the top of my head, and compared to the many experts in the field of batteries, some of whom are members here....I am a hapless beginner noob. Once you have spent the time reading, using, and watching your cells, you develop confidence....but like hazards of guns or electricity, assuming Lithium batteries are just like your good old Alkaline cells is not a good way to start out. Once you have spent some time learning about guns or electricity you develop confidence, but also you learn the importance of safety measures that the beginner may not appreciate. Same with Lithiums.

Fortunately, there are new Lithium Ion technologies that are virtually eliminating these fire/explosion/thermal runaway issues.... AW has already come out with a Saphion type of Lithium Ferrous Phosphate cell, and will likely move to include that new safe technology in other cell sizes we all want.


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## Illum (Jul 21, 2007)

if your a cr123a powered flashlight user...

_*INVEST IN A ZTS TESTER!

it could save your life!
*_


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## jumpstat (Jul 21, 2007)

ZTS tester states 3V lithiums, can it perform tests on 3.7 rechargeables safely?


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## Illum (Jul 21, 2007)

jumpstat said:


> ZTS tester states 3V lithiums, can it perform tests on 3.7 rechargeables safely?



on the normal ZTS, not on the mini....http://www.lighthound.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=1793

but its only good for RCR123A, 18500, 17650, 18650


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## half-watt (Jul 21, 2007)

jumpstat said:


> ZTS tester states 3V lithiums, can it perform tests on 3.7 rechargeables safely?



Yes, depending on the model. Just did some tests on them today using the ZTS MBT-1 (available from Lighthound.com - a better price than some other OnLine Retailers).


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## enLIGHTenment (Jul 21, 2007)

LuxLuthor said:


> Many common fire extinguishers will not work with a Lithium metal fire, nor do you want to stand around in a moment of panic trying to figure out what to do, or breathing in the fumes--so have your sand/water/appropriate fire extinguisher sitting nearby.



Water is not a good fire management option for lithium batteries. It's simply not effective on lithium fires.

Further, in the event of batteries igniting while under charge, there's also 110v in the charger to worry about. Don't even think about throwing water on a burning charger unless the charger has been unplugged first.

Use a bucket of *dry* sand or, if no 110v power is present, a class D fire extinguisher rated for lithium.


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## LuxLuthor (Jul 21, 2007)

enLIGHTenment said:


> Water is not a good fire management option for lithium batteries. It's simply not effective on lithium fires.
> 
> Further, in the event of batteries igniting while under charge, there's also 110v in the charger to worry about. Don't even think about throwing water on a burning charger unless the charger has been unplugged first.
> 
> Use a bucket of *dry* sand or, if no 110v power is present, a class D fire extinguisher rated for lithium.



I made that all quite clear in my last bullet 2nd paragraph post. The water is in case there is a fire that spreads to fabric, wood, or some secondary item that may be burning. I never said to throw it on the charger or Lithium batteries. 

Like I started out saying, anyone who tried to make a list of safety items...if they forgot to make sure and say to unplug the charger first before contemplating using water for any other secondary burning fire their post would get picked apart....so it's a pretty hopeless idea unless you are someone like Buchmann and post it as a fixed HTML page.

Good Luck, Senna, and keep reading.


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## Illum (Jul 21, 2007)

class D is a lab grade fire extinguisher and you need a license for it....as its contents are not exactly safe to handle either...

fighting metal fires is basically poison against poison


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## SilverFox (Jul 22, 2007)

If I might offer a small point of clairification...

Batteries don't explode... They rapidly vent, sometimes accompanied by flame. 

Tom


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## Illum (Jul 22, 2007)

SilverFox said:


> If I might offer a small point of clairification...
> 
> Batteries don't explode... They rapidly vent, sometimes accompanied by flame.
> 
> Tom



oh...might want to look back on some pictures...cells that eject entire guts isn't just venting...its stark raving mad and exploding like a bullet in one direction

I suppose its debatable:thumbsup:


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## senna94 (Jul 22, 2007)

Illum_the_nation said:


> if your a cr123a powered flashlight user...
> 
> _*INVEST IN A ZTS TESTER!
> 
> ...



So,if you use a ZTS tester and match remaining capacity of like cells and also use a volt meter to make sure they have the same voltage you should be safe, correct????
:shrug:


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## Quickbeam (Jul 22, 2007)

Info on my site, with additional links at the bottom of the page.

http://www.flashlightreviews.com/features/123burst.htm


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## senna94 (Jul 22, 2007)

Thanks for the link and info Quickbeam. Clear concise and logical suggestions that will dramatically reduce the chances of having a problem with 123 cells. 
As stated on your site there is no way of reducing the risk 100%,but a few simple steps can greatly reduce the odds of that happening. 

Thanks!!!!!
:thumbsup:


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## Illum (Jul 22, 2007)

senna94 said:


> So,if you use a ZTS tester and match remaining capacity of like cells and also use a volt meter to make sure they have the same voltage you should be safe, correct????
> :shrug:



if you would prefer yes...just don't set the tolerances too high

I just use the ZTS alone, theres always one cell in a box of surefires that will give me multiple readings, that cell would be for a single celled light


EDIT: 
I PMed Quickbeam about the hazard on draining down cr123as and I was told after numerous full cycle tests including draining cr123As to exhaustion for runtime purposes and has never ran into an explosion


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## half-watt (Jul 22, 2007)

Quickbeam said:


> Info on my site, with additional links at the bottom of the page.
> 
> http://www.flashlightreviews.com/features/123burst.htm



QB,

i just want to say how much your website was, and though not adding new reviews at this time, still is appreciated by the Light/Ultralight backpacking community. We've referred to your website for a few years now as the final court of appeal in all matters related to lighting. Great job!

Thank you for your years of service, much time, and great effort you put into your FLR website.

Many thanks.


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## Illum (Jul 22, 2007)

heres another link to add, this was from today oo:
*My Aleph 1 Exploded and cought on fire.*


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## paulr (Jul 22, 2007)

As far as I can tell, the ZTS is basically a conveniently packaged load tester. It puts a resistive load across the battery and then lights LED's corresponding to set voltage points. A handy gadget if you want to sort a lot of batteries in a hurry, but you can do the same thing with a load resistor and your existing voltmeter if you want to save yourself some cash at the expense of some convenience.


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## BB (Jul 22, 2007)

LuxLuthor said:


> My strategy during warmer weather is to charge in the *garage on concrete* after removing all flammables, and in the event of problem, pull the charger cord from wall and hit the garage opener door as I exit.​



* I would like to give a big WARNING NOT TO CHARGE LITHIUM CELLS ON CONCRETE* unless there are zero flammable items nearby...

Concrete "spalls" when exposed to high/concentrated heat... Spalling is when little chunks of concrete are sent flying (as if from a small explosive charge) from the differential heating of the concrete. A small amount of lithium could easily be sent flaming 3-4 feet straight up or sideways (larger amounts--don't I don't know how far--probably lots of variables)...

Ask how I know? As kids, my Dad would sometimes bring magnesium home for use to "play with". One day I did this on the concrete steps and had a very pretty pyrotechnic display from shooting concrete and flying/burning magnesium.

-Bill


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## LuxLuthor (Jul 22, 2007)

Senna, my previous posts here were more directed at rechargeable Lithium Ion cells. If all you are really asking about is disposable, small 123a cells....that is in another category.

* [Humor]* In reading the recent Barefootone 'event' I'm hoping people from this thread will ask him to correct the subject from "exposion" to a more benign "venting" and point out that it is a good thing he did not throw any water near the light, how he should have had a Class D fire extinguisher, not breathe or touched anything, and remind him how rare it is to be struck by lightning, have a meteor come crashing through his house, or have his computer monitor burst into flames....in other words, for him not to worry as long as he has the: "One ZTS 'ring' to rule them all"  *[/Humor]*

Ya gotta love the irony.


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## LuxLuthor (Jul 22, 2007)

BB said:


> * I would like to give a big WARNING NOT TO CHARGE LITHIUM CELLS ON CONCRETE* unless there are zero flammable items nearby...
> 
> Concrete "spalls" when exposed to high/concentrated heat... Spalling is when little chunks of concrete are sent flying (as if from a small explosive charge) from the differential heating of the concrete. A small amount of lithium could easily be sent flaming 3-4 feet straight up or sideways (larger amounts--don't I don't know how far--probably lots of variables)...
> 
> ...



See, now that is some new, and interesting information that I had never heard of before. I never even have heard of the word "spalls" before, so thanks, Bill :thumbsup:

I make sure to remove all flammables from my garage floor (or use the fireplace), but now I suppose if this information is considered you almost would need to charge insiide a LipoSack, or on a small box of sand. At some point dumping the Lithium Cobalt for the new Saphion (LiFeSO4/Emoli/A123) technology in various Li-Ion sizes cannot get here fast enough.


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## Braddah_Bill (Jul 22, 2007)

Marion David Poff said:


> Howdy,
> 
> I am interested in exploding batteries, and I would be happy to search for threads....
> 
> ...




This should keep you busy for awhile:

G2 explosion by Kumar 762 
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/140755

more on the G2 explosion *PICS* 
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/140717


Cyclops Flashlight Explosion 
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/122500

Primary Lithium battery explodes!
http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=121303&page=1&pp=30

CR123A meltdown in PM6: What happened? 
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/91245

ROAR of the Pelican (CR123 Explosion during use, firsthand account) 
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/120888&page=1&pp=30

A Little Accident. W/123\'s and a Peli. M6 
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...ead.php?t=78843

Battery exploded in flashlight 
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...ad.php?t=114455 

Accident w/Amondotech 123s and SF M2 Detonator G&P Tailcap Chop KL3 Head!
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/128059&page=1&pp=30


Flash Amp Testing
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/28692


Battery explosion with Fenix P1D 
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/169038&highlight=exploding

My Aleph 1 Exploded and cought on fire.
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/170187


123 Primary Lithium cell info/testing/links 
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/124776&highlight=exploding


Safety Concern Re: Lithium Multicurrent Universal Fast Smart Charger. 
http://www.cpfmarketplace.com/mp/showthread.php?t=157673


Bill


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## g36pilot (Jul 23, 2007)

-deleted-


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## g36pilot (Jul 23, 2007)

Here are a few more:

*Li Battery Venting Incidents:*

http://www.batteriesdigest.com/id396.htm 1999 LAX/TSA flashlight “explosion”
http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=120888&page=1&pp=30 Original Incident Post PM6 w/BS 123s
http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=141137&page=1&pp=30 CR123 Electrolyte Fume Exposure Incident
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/78843 Another PM6 incident
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/91245 Another documented venting incident with Pelican PM6 flashlight
http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showpost.php?p=1460697&postcount=478PM6 w/SF123
http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showpost.php?p=1461982&postcount=490 Same as above
http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showpost.php?p=1485475&postcount=613 BS battery venting in PM6 during test with 60/100 capacities.
http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showpost.php?p=1485564&postcount=614 Photos of vented BS battery in PM6 during test with 60/100 capacities.
http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showpost.php?p=1487003&postcount=626 PM6 vents 3 for 3 in testing
http://flashlightreviews.com/reviews/pelican_m6.htm Pelican PM6 info
http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showpost.php?p=1364309&postcount=1 SL Scorpion w/Panasonic 123s Venting
http://forums.groundspeak.com/GC/index.php?showtopic=132932&st=0&p=2223457&#entry2223457 SF 9P w/unknown CR123s venting w/ injury
http://66.102.7.104/search?q=cache:VrZlo5l-ilwJ:glocktalk.com/sitemap/topic/352933-1.html+surefire+flashlight+exploded+lithium&hl=en&gl=us&ct=clnk&cd=25 Maxfire LX w/Chinese 123s
http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=122500 Cyclops flashlight w/Cyclops batts explode
http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=122500&page=1&pp=30 Cyclops incident thread
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/121303 Li AA explodes
http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showpost.php?p=1535329&postcount=1Amondotech 123’s vent
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/169038 Chinese PW Powerstation CR?123 in PD1 venting
http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showpost.php?p=1536209&postcount=38 Mod’d light/AmondoTech CR123s
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/157900 WE 6v w/BS 123’s
http://www.consumeraffairs.com/recalls04/browning.html Browning flashlight recall (2 reports)
http://www.consumeraffairs.com/recalls04/dorcy.html Dorcy recall w/house fire reported
http://www.cpsc.gov/cpscpub/prerel/prhtml03/03195.htmlA&T Fuji Power CR123A Recall (5 venting incidents reported)
http://www.cdc.gov/niosh/fire/reports/face9939.html AED explosion w/injuries
http://www.glocktalk.com/showthread.php?&threadid=537333 Ledwav Z5 weapon light incident
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/71161 CR123 systems banned from nuclear power plant after fire.
http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?p=1529062#post1529062Defective Chinese light on Air Canada
http://www.jouster.com/cgi-bin/guntalk/config.pl?noframes;read=25245 Aimshot Xenon Illuminator model TX-125 weapon light meltdown
http://www.xanga.com/Cr0c0/490345068/item.html Japanese blog/venting incident
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/170187 Aleph 1 w/BS CR123’s vent/explode

*Material Safety Data Sheets & Other Chemistry Data:*

HF: HydroFluric Acid 
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydrofluoric_acid HF data
http://www.emedicine.com/emerg/topic804.htm HF data
http://www.bu.edu/es/labsafety/ESMSDSs/MSHydFluoricAcid.html#anchor888417 HF MSDS
http://www.gpbatteries.com.hk/pic/MSDS_PhotoLithum.pdf GP MSDS
http://www.septechnologies.biz/battery/products/manufactures/sanyo/spec_sheet/sanyo_lithium_msds.pdf Sanyo Li Battery MSDS Data
*[FONT=Arial,Bold]http://www.seabird.com/pdf_documents/msds_sheets/Saft_3.6VLithiumAA.pdf[/FONT]**[FONT=Arial,Bold] MSDS/PSDS Li-SOCl[/FONT]**[FONT=Arial,Bold]2[/FONT]*
http://www.gfschemicals.com/Search/MSDS/2534MSDS.PDF Li HexaFl 
http://www.duracell.com/oem/safety/pdf/2003_5C.pdf Duracell MSDS
http://www.hp.com/hpinfo/globalcitizenship/environment/pdf/msds_lg_liion.pdf LG18650 MSDS
http://www.batteryspace.com/prod-specs/MSDSLiion.pdfBatteryspace MSDS w/HF warning

*Technical Data:*

http://www.duracell.com/procell/chemistries/lithium.asp# Duracell Batt Construction Pictorial
http://www.duracell.com/oem/primary/Lithium/safety.asp#underwriters Duracell *Safety and Reliability, UL Testing*
http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?p=1389277 CR123 disected
http://www.duracell.com/Procell/pdf/Li123_US_OS.pdf Duracell 123 Engineering Data Sheet
http://data.energizer.com/PDFs/123.pdf Energizer 123 Engineering Data Sheet

*Government & Industry Reports:*

http://www.iata.org/NR/ContentConnector/CS2000/SiteInterface/sites/whatwedo/dangerousgoods/file/US_DOT_HM224E_Lithium_Battery_Ban.pdf Federal Register Vol. 69, No. 240 December 15, 2004
http://www.wrf.com/docs/publications/12574.pdf Li-Ion Batteries In Transport
http://www.caa.co.uk/docs/33/CAPAP2003_04.PDF Dealing w/inflight lithium battery fires
http://www.mobilit.fgov.be/data/aero/FAALiBaFiRe.pdf DOT Flammability Assessment CR123s
http://www.ntsb.gov/events/2006/PhiladelphiaPA/Exhibits/350561.pdf NTSB fire tests- Compartment PSI increases
http://www.fire.tc.faa.gov/pdf/systems/Lithium-ion_battery_04112006.pdf
http://www.unece.org/trans/doc/2000/ac10/ST-SG-AC10-27a2e.pdf UN Dangerous Goods/Li Testing 12/2000
http://www.unece.org/trans/doc/2005/ac10c3/ST-SG-AC10-C3-2005-43e.docUN Dangerous Goods Li-Ion Discussion 2005
http://www.ntsb.gov/publictn/2005/HZB0501.htm KMEM battery vent NTSB 2004
http://www.atp.nist.gov/eao/wp05-01/chapt4.htm Risk & Financial Analysis Encouraging Off-Shore Li-Ion Production
http://www.wrf.com/docs/events/1117.pdf Battery Transportation & Waste Regulation
http://www.cdc.gov/niosh/fact0002.html NIOAH exploding flashlight risk
http://www.ayovac.com/technical/pdfs/tech_uslithium.pdf Primary Li Batt Limited On Pax Aircraft
http://www.batteryuniversity.com/partone-5.htm Li-On, The Ideal Rechargeable? No

*Destructive Testing:*

http://www.utahflyers.org/ LiPo Lithium Polymer battery fire videos, check left hand menu page >videos>LiPo Fires 1,2,&3 This is a different battery chemistry than the CR123 and fires causes by overcharging/intentional mismanagement. 
http://www.a123systems.com/html/tech/safety.html RCR123 Li-Ion Nail Penetration Test Video
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v499/yuandrew/CPF/1deb7ccd.jpg Microwaved 123
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v499/yuandrew/CPF/2fa146a8.jpg MMicrowaved 123
http://www.modelaircraft.org/lithsafety.asp Safety Testing Imperative
http://www.pcpitstop.com/pcsafety/video.asp Laptop Li-Ion Battery Fire Video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vS2hGoJVmlA YouTube Intentional Battery Vent


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## LuxLuthor (Jul 23, 2007)

Holy Moly....g36pilot....that is one heck of a resource post you just made.....thanks in advance of checking all those links. I recognize some of them.


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## g36pilot (Jul 24, 2007)

Thanks LL. I merely collected the work and misadventures of others for reference.

And once again, thanks to CPFer's Newbie, Silverfox, incident reporters, numerous other members, and battery/flashlight retailers (for test material support) for the education relative to our applications.


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## DM51 (Jul 25, 2007)

Here's another_one, posted just a few hours ago.


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## LED61 (Jul 25, 2007)

Illum_the_nation said:


> oh...might want to look back on some pictures...cells that eject entire guts isn't just venting...its stark raving mad and exploding like a bullet in one direction
> 
> I suppose its debatable:thumbsup:


 
I think what Tom really meant was--and I've seen him quote the terms before--"rapid disassembly accompanied by flame"


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## LuxLuthor (Jul 25, 2007)

I guess we should redefine a device that propels a projectile out a barrel also is the result of a "rapid venting" of a powdered mixture of potassium nitrate, charcoal, & sulfur, triggered by an "internal short."


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## DM51 (Jul 25, 2007)

LuxLuthor said:


> I guess we should redefine a device that propels a projectile out a barrel also is the result of a "rapid venting" of a powdered mixture of potassium nitrate, charcoal, & sulfur, triggered by an "internal short."


LOL, that sounds very uncomfortable, Lux. I think you'd better stop eating that stuff.


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## LuxLuthor (Jul 25, 2007)

I have been listening to Ron White and Lewis Black too much again.


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## Quickbeam (Jul 27, 2007)

I copied the links from Braddah_Bill and g36pilot and added them to the 123A Explosion page on FlashlightReviews.com. My thought is to try to collect as much information in one place as I can for everyone's use and reference. I have also linked to this thread. If there are any objections, please let me know and I'll remove the "borrowed" content.

Doug P.


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## yuandrew (Jul 28, 2007)

> Destructive Testing:
> 
> http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v499/yuandrew/CPF/1deb7ccd.jpg
> Microwaved 123
> http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v499/yuandrew/CPF/2fa146a8.jpg MMicrowaved 123



I know those are on my Photobucket host but they were actually done by Pydpiper a while back; I just happened to saved his pictures. The microwave experiment was mostly his idea though. My idea I suggested to him was to "rapid-charge" a semi-depleted set of SureFire cells by hooking them directly to 120 volts AC (with a long extension cord)

Before:






After:









Thread:

https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/77377


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## heckubus (May 1, 2008)

Hi,

not being a soldier or in law enforcement, I can't imagine why I would spend hours researching this issue.. Why expose myself and my family to a risk that can only be mitigated by hours of research and care when alternative and safer batteries are available? Just a newbie sharing his initial thoughts...


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## 5kids (May 1, 2008)

I found Pelican's bulletin regarding use of batteries. No surprise, but they don't approve Surefire...hmmm perhaps its the competition? _If someone else posted this before, I applogize. I searched CPF for 30 minutes and couldn't find it._

http://www.pelican.com/support/bulletins/tech_bulletin_LithiumBatteryWarning.pdf

Highlights from bulletin:

Lithium batteries can explode, leak or cause
burns if not handled appropriately. Please
observe the following rules of thumb:​ 
• Use only Panasonic™, Energizer™, Duracell™, or Sanyo™ cells
• Do not mix with used or other battery types/brands​• Replace all cells at the same time
• Do not open batteries
• Do not dispose of in fire
• Do not heat above 75C (167F)
• Do not expose contents to water
• Do not recharge
• Do not install backwards

On another note.. I work as an Engineer and was meeting with a salesperson for an industrial wireless monitor that happens to use 2x123A primaries. Of couse I inspected them and saw they used Panisonic cells. When I asked about user battery replacement, they explained that because of potential vibration at some installations they solder the batteries in place so they don't have any intermmittent contact probelms. I expressed my concern about soldering and potentially blocking vent holes because Lithium batteries can somtimes explode and that loose batteries are actually banned from commercial flights.​ 
Of course I got some questions from the salesperson and my boss as to why I knew so much about batteries, I just explained it was for some "hobby" interrest that I have. I couldn't come out of the closet that I'm a flashaholic.

One week later, I met with a more technical person from the same company, and he mentioned that it had gotten back to him about me knowing a lot about lithium batteries and raised some safety concerns.​

I guess all my time spent at work at CPF wasn't a complete waste!


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## MaxIcon (May 1, 2008)

heckubus said:


> Hi,
> 
> not being a soldier or in law enforcement, I can't imagine why I would spend hours researching this issue.. Why expose myself and my family to a risk that can only be mitigated by hours of research and care when alternative and safer batteries are available? Just a newbie sharing his initial thoughts...


 
For a long time, the best and brightest small flashlights were only available with CR123. With LEDs, this is not as critical, but CR123s are a major part of the cutting-edge flashlight industry now, and many people have quite a lot of CR123 powered gear. The battery failures are a relatively new development, partly due to the proliferation of CR123 gear driving a market for inexpensive batteries.

I use them in my car kits and earthquake kits due to the very long shelf life, and the lower likelihood of battery leakage destroying the equipment. Years ago, when Maglites were among the best you could get, alkaline cells were the standard, and I had many pieces of emergency gear damaged due to battery leakage, plus the shelf life wasn't good enough for long term storage. Lithium cells just weren't very available back then. Some of my current 'quake and car kits have CR123 batteries that have been in there for 5+ years, and they're still working and in good shape on the annual checkups.

YMMV, as always, but CR123 batteries solved quite a few problems for me in disaster preparedness - compact, powerful lights that I can count on working if I need them, even after years of storage. I just have to buy good quality batteries (and replace my old incandescents with LEDs, now)...


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