# What's the best car headlight???



## AlexGT

I want to replace the headlights in a 2005 Town and country LX minivan, what brand offers the most light output? Are sylvania Xtra vision the best or are there better ones?



Thanks!
AlexGT

Edit: Not sure if I should post in general or the cafe. hmmm...


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## Dustin Liu

:grouphug:


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## mdocod

as far as bulbs you can find in stores around town... GE nighthalks, and Silvania Silverstars both tend to be pretty good... I think Nighthalks usually sell at wallmart for around $25 a pair... and Silverstars sell for around $30... But I saw some Silverstars at a reduced price at checker auto recently- $23 a pair if memory serves me correctly.


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## ak645

Sylvania Silverstars are the brightest street legal lights.Excellent tint.I have them in both ny cars.

Andy


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## Timson

I presume you want to stick with a straight lamp swap and not go the whole hog - ie - replace system for full HID (The best)

I use Philips 100W Lamps which are excellent performers.

Just make sure your wiring loom and alternator is up to supplying twice the usual current. You might want to give them a miss if your headlamps have plastic lenses too!

In fairness - the big differences in lighting performance come from the design of the vehicles reflector / optics.
If the lights are badly designed...there's only so much improvement available by adding brighter lamps......You can't polish a turd......Is the phrase I was always told and in most cases that proves to be the case.


Tim.


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## pedalinbob

I have Silverstars in my car, and my wife's truck has the Xtravisions.

The Silverstars are a bit whiter...perhaps a little brighter...but, I think the Xtravisions are excellent bang-for-the-buck lights.

I don't really think the Silverstars are worth the extra cost.
A pair cost me around $35 (pretty good deal) , and I think you can get the Xtravisions for about $20 - $24.

Bob


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## chmsam

Just a thought but you might want to check in with your local road rally club for suggestions. Most auto parts stores carry crap for bulbs. They'll know the local places that carry decent bulbs or a good web site to go to. Hellas are good replacement bulbs that have higher wattage.

Most stock headlight assemblies don't like real high wattage lights (too much plastic to deal with the extra heat). Good replacement lamps are the way to go but IMHO I think most of the supposedly high output lights are not higher wattage but just whiter or bluer. These mght help you see a little bit better but really just tend to tick off the other drivers on the road. 

The biggest bang for the buck? Simply aim the healights you already have properly. Find a flat parking lot, park about 20' away from the side of a building (no windows!), and aim the lights at the side of the building. The high beams ought to be forming a rectangular box that's a tad lower than the level of the lights. Low beams ought to be a bit lower and have more spread, but not too far to the left (duh!). A little spread to the right is OK so that you can see joggers, pets, disabled cars, deer, etc.

Auxillary lights are the next best bet. They are not too expensive. Be sure that the alternator will handle the juice needed. Use the wiring harness and hardware that comes with the lights. It's made for that purpose. Use other stuff and you'll blow fuses, trip breakers, and burn up wire.

The vast majority of stock driving or fog lights are totally worthless and only there for show. But do not go too far over board. There are a lot of morons around here who have high wattage driving lights that are not aimed and are way over DOT limits. That's just plain dangerous for other drivers.


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## AlexGT

Thanks for the replies, I just want something a little bit brighter or whiter. I'm probably going to go with the silverstars.

Thanks
AlexGT


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## scott.cr

I'm going to make a lot of enemies by saying this, but Silverstars are NOT brighter. They use the same wattage as standard headlamps, 51W low beam, 60W high beam. They have a blue tint on them to make the color temp look hotter, and of course this blue tint absorbs some usable light. Do not fall for their marketing claims that they are "whiter" and "brighter," it's all 100% false. (Of course "whiter" is subjective, and as such, an easy scam to market without getting into legal trouble.)

When I worked in the automotive industry my company had some of the then-new "hyper white" lamps tested, and the PIAAs were the best performers because they only lost 15% light ouput compared to stock uncoated lamps. The worst performers lost over 55% performance compared to uncoated. Back then, my favorite phrase was "Where can we get more of these placebos?"

A couple others have suggested overwattage lamps, and these are about the only thing (except HIRs) that can output more light from the stock housing without going through a huge conversion. Of course, there are various safety issues that would have to be addressed (wiring capabilities, extra heat in the housing, etc).

This company is not related to the forum, but they have a very knowledgeable sales staff:
http://www.candlepowerinc.com/

They're in Canada but friendly to U.S. sales.


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## yuandrew

I was told in the Hidplanet forum that Silverstars work by using a different filiment design which burns hotter (think Photoflood lamps vs a standard incandescent) and they tint them blue to bring the light level down to the point where it won't be too glareing to others. In case you're wondering; their life is also somewhat shorter than the standard Sylvania Halogen headlights.

I put 9004 Xtravisions in my Dad's Corolla and they do seem brighter than stock but you'll notice the difference on the road. For best results; I heard that you should try re-aiming your headlights after changing the bulb.


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## greenLED

ak645 said:


> Sylvania Silverstars are the brightest street legal lights.Excellent tint.I have them in both ny cars.


I put some in my car after my wife complained she couldn't see well at night - what a difference! I had becomed used to them, but the other night I pulled in right next to my neighbors, who were just leaving - the difference between stock lamps and the SilverStars is just amazing! One happy user here.


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## HighLight

I had Silverstars in a Caravan I used to own. If its something a little bit brighter and whiter you want than I think you will be happy with the SilverStars. They are a straight swap and legal too. Also on this topic I read somewhere that the Xtra Vision bulbs that we get in North America are the Silverstar bulbs that are marketed in Europe. Apparently the SilverStar bulb available in Europe does not have the blue tint like the ones we get in North America. I stand to be corrected on this though.


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## s0crates82

xtravision put out more lumens than any other of the same wattage.

silverstars put out the prettiest color available within a group of the same wattage range, though significantly less lumen output due to the filter.

your best bet for total output would be a projector retrofit with HID. but not sure if that's what you want to do to a T&C.

if you only want to change bulbs, xtravision is the ticket.


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## Fenris

Another vote for silverstars.


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## 270winchester

I put in some silvania silver stars in my car after buying the extra-vision bulbs. I wouldn't say it's that much brighter, but they are definitely a less yellow color. It's nice, very white and very bright.

It's supposed to put out the same amount of luminous flux as the other street legal halogen bulbs, but I see better in mose cases with it.

what it does terrible on, is freshly paved freeways with the pitch-black tar. The higher wavelength light gets absorbed much quickly. One day I merged onto highway 980 afte they paved it and thought my lights went out at exactly the same time. it wasn't until I pased an older, more used streach that the road was lit up again.


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## Orbit

The Silver stars are probably the best cheap option.


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## 270winchester

I noticed that the original poster was asking for a recent model minivan. If it uses H4 or H7 bulbs then the best bulb I have yet to see is the Osram Silver Star, not silvania, but Osram. Those things are danged white and bright and do cast a good coverage on the road.


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## PlayboyJoeShmoe

Whatever is in my Ram is pretty good, but when I need to replace 'em I think Extravisions will be the ones.

In my old '90 F350 I had a cloudy lense on one side. I was able to dremel a 9006 to go where a 9004 was and the extra watts on that side evened things up. If your vehicle uses 9004 it might be usefull to try that...


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## Flummo

HighLight said:


> Apparently the SilverStar bulb available in Europe does not have the blue tint like the ones we get in North America. I stand to be corrected on this though.


Correct, they look like this: http://www.elfa.se/elfa-bin/dyndok.pl?lang=en&vat=0&dok=4600.htm (I think you can order them on that site too if you want to.)

According to lamp tests in some Swedish newspaper the Silver Stars are one of the best available, along with Philips Vision Plus. I know what I'll buy when I need a H4/H7 lamp...  

But when it comes to dim headlights it seems that the point you need to look at is: what voltage does the lamps really get? I have measured the voltage at the lamps in a number of cars, and a 1V drop between the lamp and battery seems to be about average in older cars, in newer it might even be worse. NOT good for the light output...


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## VWTim

I you're in the US I'd recommend against using higher than standard wattage bulbs. The DOT code for headlights still puts a LOT of glare into the eye's of incoming drivers. This is from back before street signs were as reflective as they are now.

Any bulb from Osram is usually great, also even going from generic Taiwan bulbs to German bulbs of the same rating can have a BIG difference. THe quality control and the internal reflectors make a difference. Also if the wiring harness from the facotry is lacking, lots of times running a new relay'd harness will increase output.


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## AlexGT

Can someone explain the relay harness thing to prevent power loss? What relay to use how to set it up. Thanks!

BTW the bulb is a 9007

AlexGT


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## VWTim

Check out here for the relay wiring diagram. I use something similar I build in car.
http://www.rallylights.com/useful_info/headlamp_wiring.htm

Many cars out there run the full power load of the headlights thru the indash headlight switch. This causes a bunch of resistance so the lights don't see the full level of power the alternator is putting out. Using a Relay cuts that distance for power to travel WAY down, plus limits the number of connections the power has to go thru.
hth,


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## AlexGT

I just removed the bulb and checked and the bulb is a H13, but the T&C user manual says its a 9007 are the 2 bulbs the same?

I'm following an auction for silverstars but want to make sure.

Thanks!
AlexGT


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## Diesel_Bomber

I'm surprised no one's mentioned Daniel Stern Lighting. The tech section is especially important. It includes wiring diagrams and discussions on color-coated bulbs and beam patterns.

I'd stick with the stock bulbs. Maybe higher wattage, but never anything color coated. Definitely go for relays and big wires. If you do the work yourself you can easily rewire your headlights with Bosch 30 amp relays and 10awg wire, with the appropriate fuses, for about the same cost as a set of Silverstars. You'll be amazed at how white stock halogen bulbs look when they're actually getting their full rated voltage.


Cheers! :buddies:


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## Flummo

VWTim said:


> The DOT code for headlights still puts a LOT of glare into the eye's of incoming drivers. This is from back before street signs were as reflective as they are now.


A spinoff on that would be to get a set of european headlights instead of the DOT-approved american ones. I have never had the "fortune" to ride in a car with DOT-lights at night since they're not road legal here, but from what I hear they are pretty useless compared to "E-code" european lights. 

But changing the entire headlights would be quite a bit more expensive than just changing lamps, and changing lamps is where we started this thread...


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## Handlobraesing

Silverstar is just another filter coated wannabe HID bulb. 

Get the GE Nighthawk or Sylvania XtraVision. They're basically the best non ricer bulb you can get.

Diesel bomber, stock bulbs are usually rather pretty lame. They're "long life" bulb at the expense of output in order to minimize burn outs during warranty


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## 270winchester

Handlobraesing said:


> Get the GE Nighthawk or Sylvania XtraVision. They're basically the best non ricer bulb you can get.



I replaced my xtra-visions and the Silverstars let me see better at night...

they are definitely NOT HID- wannabes. even though it is coated with blueish color, the light is white, not a tint of blue to it. from the receiving end of the beam it casts a very bright , white light. please don't compare it to the 4.99 Ebay Special.

If you have driven with Silverstars and reached the "ricer look" conclusion then I want to know how white your other lights are. If you haven't actually seen them in operation, don't discriminate because of the color of its glass....


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## VWTim

Flummo said:


> A spinoff on that would be to get a set of european headlights instead of the DOT-approved american ones. I have never had the "fortune" to ride in a car with DOT-lights at night since they're not road legal here, but from what I hear they are pretty useless compared to "E-code" european lights.
> 
> But changing the entire headlights would be quite a bit more expensive than just changing lamps, and changing lamps is where we started this thread...



Very true. I run E-codes in all my cars, but then they're older so much easier as they use standard 7" lights. With enough searching you can find E-code lamps for later model cars from Europe. Just remember, DON"T buy your lights from England, or in a RHD pattern, as the road sign glare will become oncoming driver glare.


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## Handlobraesing

The blue coating makes the light whiter by taking away a portion of longer wavelength spectrum, thus reducing the total output. They're HID wannabe, because the only purpose of the blue coating is to mimic the color of HID. Taking away a portion of light does not increase lumen output, but rather reduces it.


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## ak645

Handlobraesing said:


> The blue coating makes the light whiter by taking away a portion of longer wavelength spectrum, thus reducing the total output. They're HID wannabe, because the only purpose of the blue coating is to mimic the color of HID. Taking away a portion of light does not increase lumen output, but rather reduces it.



Have you seen the SilverStars in action? Are you speaking from personal experience? 

Andy


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## 270winchester

Handlobraesing said:


> The blue coating makes the light whiter by taking away a portion of longer wavelength spectrum, thus reducing the total output. They're HID wannabe, because the only purpose of the blue coating is to mimic the color of HID. Taking away a portion of light does not increase lumen output, but rather reduces it.



That's a helluva generalization. There are degrees of tint-playing, and there is a huge difference in the results. Have you ever seen the Silver stars in person? The HID-wannabes I have seen have horrible blue color and really dim. The Silverstars are far from that. putting it in the same category as those Ebay Wonders is just not fair categorization to tell people who have never seen the light in person.

The portion of light taken is more than compensated with the amount of light produced at the filament(hehe, now the bulb lumen is in dispute, we can call it "fillement lumen). The bulb is designed to be DOT legal, so you are not losing any light by using it when compared to any other street legal headlight lamp.

The same cannot be said of the really blue lamps.


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## rudbwoy69camaro

270winchester said:


> Have you ever seen the Silver stars in person? The HID-wannabes I have seen have horrible blue color and really dim.



I upgraded to HID. 2002 Tahoe, no modification. Too bad I can't do a projector retrofit, no room.


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## s0crates82

rudbwoy69camaro said:


> I upgraded to HID. 2002 Tahoe, no modification. Too bad I can't do a projector retrofit, no room.



So you just elected to put a incredibly bright lamp in very glarey reflector housings... which will blind anyone unfortunate enough to share the road with you?

Grand.


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## Diesel_Bomber

Handlobraesing said:


> Diesel bomber, stock bulbs are usually rather pretty lame. They're "long life" bulb at the expense of output in order to minimize burn outs during warranty



No argument from me!

While I wouldn't precisely call Silverstars ricer bulbs, the coating on them certainly doesn't help. I also think it's a bandaid. People don't like how their headlights are turning incan-Mag yellow. What this is caused by most of the time is old, corroded wiring that was inadaquate from a voltage-drop standpoint when it was brand new. The wiring only got worse as it aged. Instead of upgrading the wiring to something that'd deliver full rated voltage to the headlight, maintaining a true white halogen color, people swap bulbs to something that filters out the yellow. A band aid, not fixing the real problem.

s0crates82-

The kit rudbwoy69camaro posted replaces the reflector and all; not just cramming an HID capsule into a halogen reflector. It's completely legal(although in the US a "legal" headlight is still pretty ridiculous) and glares no more than the stock headlights would have.


Cheers all. :buddies:


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## schiesz

I am very happy with the output of the Silverstars, and have used both Osram and Silvania (Osram is the parent company to silvania in Europe IRC) and see no difference in them in use. My only complaint is that they burn out fast. I have gone through at least 5 sets of silverstars, one pair lasting only about 6 months. That is in 3 different cars so its not the wiring in the car causing it. I've also had Xtravsions and Nighthawks and the color and output of the silverstars is much nicer. I'd recommend the silverstars, even for the money they cost, but be prepared to replace them more often.

schiesz


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## 270winchester

Diesel_Bomber said:


> The wiring only got worse as it aged. Instead of upgrading the wiring to something that'd deliver full rated voltage to the headlight, maintaining a true white halogen color, people swap bulbs to something that filters out the yellow. A band aid, not fixing the real problem.
> 
> 
> 
> Cheers all. :buddies:



You know, not everyone is so savvy or has enough time on their hands to experiment doing the swapping on their own time. It's far easier to swap bulbs than to tear apart the wiring(which is not the easiest thing to work on in a lot of cars). 

If you pay a shop to do it it will cost 7-8 Silverstar bulbs just for the labor. That's 3-4 years of Silver Stars(assuming a set work foe a year) THat's a long time to own a car for most people(unlike my family).

I'll look into the wiring though. Anyone in the bay area want to help me?


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## Diesel_Bomber

Ya got me there. I can rewire an entire car in my sleep; I do keep forgetting that not everyone can do these things. I'm not suggesting that anyone attempt anything beyond their level of competence. Headlights failing on a deserted country road at night could kill someone. If swapping bulbs is the limit, then Silverstars are indeed better than stock bulbs when used with the stock wiring, while remaining legal. The rest of my post may be pointless. 

On the one vehicle('91 Cavalier) I did where the person was using Silverstars previously, my upgraded wiring w/stock bulbs was brighter than his stock wiring w/Silverstars. I'll admit it, the Silverstars still looked a bit more white. Even if I had to pay someone else to do the wiring, I'd still consider it worth the cost. You're also then free to play with higher wattage bulbs without the chance of burning up your wiring. In the case of the '91 Cavalier, he then put the Silverstars back in with the upgraded wiring.

Whatever amount of light a blue-coated bulb puts out, it could put out more light without the blue coating. I realize that there's a lumen limit on legal bulbs. Silverstars are legal and probably wouldn't be without their coating, where as over wattage bulbs are not.

Different strokes for different folks. :buddies:

Edit: If I was in the area I'd be happy to give you a hand, if you'd have me.


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## Flummo

If you don't like the american(?) silverstars with the coating, you could always buy the (european?) ones with clear glass. As I said earlier, they have gotten eccelent results in tests here.

About rewiring in your sleep, I am one of the lucky few that also could do that. Even if I couldn't i think it would be worth paying someone else (like me  ) to do it, as the normal drop around 1V or more does kill alot of the light you could get with full voltage at the lamps. Actually I think that your original bulbs must be really horrible if a set of 55/60W Philips/Osram/whatever will give you more light with the standard harness than the original lamps would with new wiring...


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## monkeyboy

(Rant)   

Don't get PIAA bulbs. They're way overpriced and don't last long at all. I had a pair of H7's that only lasted about 6 months. The website advertises them as new technology that emits more efficient whiter light. This is complete BS  

The extra efficiency and whiteness is due to them being overdriven and the blue filter absorbs a lot of this extra light. Also the colour is nothing like HID, it emits a sickly greenish tint in comparison that is not as easy on the eye. HID conversion kits are relatively cheap these days and will outlast these 20 times so will be much cheaper in the long run. They will also produce brighter whiter light.

I also wasted my money on those PIAA LED sidelights. each one uses 2 puny little dim LEDs that you can hardly even see. Standard sidelights are far superior and cost about one fifth of the price.

AAAAAAAA!!! I feel so ripped off!


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## VWTim

The wiring is like running your flashlight with a worn battery and dirty contacts. if Silverstars improve the output, think about what relay'd silverstars will do. I'd help ya for pizza and beer, but I'm in Oregon. Also there are a few companies that sell drop in relay'd wiring harness's. Also I'd be willing to help talk you thru it. It's really rather simple if you can crimp wires.


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## lebox97

similar discussion here a couple months ago...
- but I got outnumbered.

I did learn about the euro UN-coated Osram version silverstars and will try those next.

I have had Sylvania (USA) silverstars in all of my vehicles since they came out 
- I love them - to MY eyes they are whiter and brighter than stock halogen out here in the west where it get's very very dark. They "APPEAR" to put more and easier to see light on the road - also road signage lights up further and brighter (I don't really care what they are coated with - they outperform the stock lamps!).
- odd, have never had any silverstar lamps burnout on me in 6-8 different vehicles, and I keep them on during the day.

rewiring your lights via a relay will also make a big difference - a trick I used in the old SCCA rally days was to wire (good quality wire) power source to back of alternator rather than to battery for another 10-15+% voltage to light (ie. 10-15+% brighter)

making sure they are aimed properly is also good idea!!!
if I remember right - at 20 feet the top of the beam should be adjusted 4 inches below the height of the headlight?

stated in previous post: "Hella lights are the Surefire of the auto lighting world"
hella.com states: "Hella's High Performance Xenon Blue Bulbs produce a brighter, whiter light that is closer in color temperature to actual daylight. This provides increased visibility and less eye fatigue for the driver in all conditions."


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## lebox97

pics of "blue" bulbs vs halogen

here is Osram pics
here is Sylvania pics (pic look doctored - but has been on the site for several yrs?)
here is Hella pics (pic look like my silverstars)
it's the color temp I find most appealing


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## VWTim

lebox97 said:
 

> stated in previous post: "Hella lights are the Surefire of the auto lighting world"
> hella.com states: "Hella's High Performance Xenon Blue Bulbs produce a brighter, whiter light that is closer in color temperature to actual daylight. This provides increased visibility and less eye fatigue for the driver in all conditions."



FWIW, Hella doesn't actually make any headlight bulbs. They are all bought from other distributors. Meaning same bulb part #, some will be German, others will be from a Korean plant. With very different beam profiles. I've had great luck with Philips and Osram bulbs. My Hella Yellowstar bulbs have a Philips "rally" part number on them. They were bought from Philips then coated to Hella's specs.

Also there are other companies that make great lights. In 7" H4 sealed beam replacement, I prefer the beam profile of Cibie's to Hella's. Both are E-code lamps.


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## Diesel_Bomber

lebox97 said:


> stated in previous post: "Hella lights are the Surefire of the auto lighting world"
> hella.com states: "Hella's High Performance Xenon Blue Bulbs produce a brighter, whiter light that is closer in color temperature to actual daylight. This provides increased visibility and less eye fatigue for the driver in all conditions."



Ya got me there; I wasn't aware that Hella was producing blue coated bulbs. I'm not surprised though, they're a company like any other(out to make money) and the blue coated bulbs are one heck of a gravy train. Never on my cars or trucks though. Like I said in that thread, whatever floats your boat. My statement was in reference to Hella's driving and fog lights, not their bulbs or their Optilux brand of lights. That's why I said "Hella lights" and not "Hella bulbs". I can see where the misunderstanding came from, my fault entirely.

Original thread.


Cheers. :buddies:


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## HighLight

IMHO in inclement weather (rain, snow, fog, black rain slicked pavement) I find Sylvania Silverstars (blue tinted ones not osram) definatley not as good as regular lower color temp bulbs. Although admittedly with the SilverStars luminous road signs do illuminate better. Friends who have genuine HID also have said they don't like the way their HID headlights perform in inclement weather also. But then again I don't know what the color temp of their HID lights are. I believe the XeRay BB swapped out the higher color temp bulb for a lower color temp bulb for performance reasons?
If I could get them in Canada for my money I would go with the Osram Silverstars (uncoated).


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