# 5C collets



## niner (Nov 7, 2009)

I did some research on 5C collets. Hardinge seems to be the favorist. How about Lyndex? Is it good enough for the hobbist?

Also, how many of you find the need for the full set of 5C? Full set (69 pcs) of Lyndex is about $800, half of what you would pay for Hardinge. Not sure if it is a good idea to pick up the full set for the better price, or buy one when I need at a higher price.


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## gadget_lover (Nov 7, 2009)

5c collets are designed to work within a very narrow range of diameters. If you try to clamp a piece that is too big or too small in a 5c collet the collet may be damaged or the piece may not be held properly. That's why there are so many of them.

If I were limited to 5c collets, I'd plan my work around the sizes I have available. For instance, I might chose a diameter for a flashlight body that is an even multiple of 1/16 inch so it will fit in the collet for second operations such as grooving, knurling, etc.


That said, I picked up a set in 1/32 inch increments. I should be OK for just about all forseeable uses. It is a hassle to remember 3/8 is bigger or smallwer than 13/32. 


I can't speak to the quality of Lydex VS Hardinge others. I can tell you that cheap ones may or may not need a little fitting to get them to fit in collet blocks. Of my 32 piece set, 4 would not fit my spin indexer until I cleaned up the locating groove. 


Daniel


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## Bruceter (Nov 7, 2009)

For a home shop there is nothing wrong with Lynex or Royal collets. They are both good quality USA made collets. I know several production shops that use them with no problems.

Bruceter


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## McGizmo (Nov 7, 2009)

I have acquired a mixed bag of 5C's through the years and mostly used that came with used lathes. The few Hardinge in there do seem to be better and there are a few imports that don't seem to function nearly as well. Not much of a contribution here but the main reason I post is to tout the virtue of emergency 5C collets! They are great! I prefer the brass as it seems to be fine in holding the work for me and it is easy to machine. I don't do any heavy production runs and the brass holds up fine. I use some nylon emergency collets for holding reflectors for re-work or second operations.

I have used the brass collets to turn down the diameter of MCPCB's for instance. I can successfully turn down a 1/16" MCPCB by grabbing 1/32" of it in a shallow bore brass collet and turning half of it down to the desired diameter. I then flip it over holding it by the new diameter in a new custom or standard collet and then work off the excess diameter on the other side.

I have some brass collets that have multiple bore steps in them and they can serve to hold various parts I want to mess with.


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## niner (Nov 7, 2009)

Thank you guys for all the advice!

Choosing a stock size based on available collet makes a lot of sense. As a hobbyist, I have the option to that. Thank you.

I never thought of getting emergency collet. Sounds like it is something really useful.

I think I will get a 1/32 set, with a few more emergency collets.


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## PEU (Nov 7, 2009)

gadget_lover said:


> It is a hassle to remember 3/8 is bigger or smallwer than 13/32.



Thats one of the many advantages of the metric system, you don't have to remember fractions 


Pablo


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## cmacclel (Nov 8, 2009)

I have the $300 Lynex set. I originally as yourself research and found that the favorite was the Hardinge collets. I then thought I scored a set from Ebay that the seller said where like new and wound up sending them back. 

Right out of the box my 1/2" Lyndex collet was bad as it would not clamp my 1/2 " carbide boring securely. I called up enco and the replacement worked fine. I called Lynex up directly and they would not help at all.

One think with collets is unless you buy precision ground bar stock......they stink to use  If you buy 1" stock it usuallly comes a few thousands larger or is not perfectly round. This makes it a ROYAL PAIN to use in collets. I stocked up on the steel 5c collets at $5 each.

If I had to do it again I would only buy the sizes you think you will use as for the year I have had a collet closer I have only used the 1" collet once and a steel emergengy collet for my pill fobs. 


Mac


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## precisionworks (Nov 8, 2009)

Quite a few videos on YouTube from Hardinge

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v6CRvtsCt6o

As Mac said, collets work best when the material & the collet are really close to size on size. If the material is dead round & the collet is bored/reamed perfectly round, there will be three contact areas within the collet. The range of collapse on the 5C is tiny, maybe .005", and the more it is collapsed the worse it performs.

For some work, turning a step in the jaws of the chuck is useful. 













When used on parts that are larger diameter than the boring diameter (these jaws were bored at .500") there is six point contact.


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## niner (Nov 8, 2009)

Thank you Mac and Barry for all the sound advice:thumbsup:

I only use a few bar size. So buying a few collets for those stock would be more than I need for now. I will get a few import emergency collets, just in case I need a size that I don't have and in a hurry.


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## precisionworks (Nov 8, 2009)

> I will get a few import emergency collets


If you bore those about .001" smaller than the diameter of the part, you'll get six point contact similar to the jaws on the lathe. Depending on the part, it will sometimes have six tiny marks but the grip is solid.


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## kromeke (Nov 10, 2009)

Bruceter said:


> For a home shop there is nothing wrong with Lynex or Royal collets. They are both good quality USA made collets. I know several production shops that use them with no problems.
> 
> Bruceter



I wouldn't be too sure about that. 

All the Lyndex I've purchased were made in Japan, which is normally ok with me, but I don't like Lyndex because they don't spring the collets open.

Royal? Old school were US made. Not so sure now. Overpriced nowadays, Hardinge is better in every way than new Royal. (price, accuracy, function)

See this thread for more debate. Disclaimer, I'm in that thread as well:

http://www.practicalmachinist.com/vb/showthread.php?t=190397

It is on Practical Machinist, but I think you can read threads without registration.


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## precisionworks (May 24, 2010)

Old thread, new post 

I'm doing quite a bit of 5C work in the lathe, probably because it came with a 5C chuck. I had a few of this & some of that, but the Hardinge collets were always better than any others. Didn't want to pay $25 each, so sent an email to Joe at Plaza Machinery. Ending up buying 35 Hardinge collets at $12 each, including delivery. I'll be surprised if they aren't nearly new.


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## cmacclel (May 24, 2010)

kromeke said:


> but I don't like Lyndex because they don't spring the collets open.


 

Yup I would have never bought a set if I knew that ahead of time.

Mac


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## wquiles (May 24, 2010)

cmacclel said:


> Yup I would have never bought a set if I knew that ahead of time.
> 
> Mac



So that means that the collets are slightly closed from their nominal diameter and you have to expand them?


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## cmacclel (May 24, 2010)

wquiles said:


> So that means that the collets are slightly closed from their nominal diameter and you have to expand them?


 

I believe they are more like to exact size in there relaxed state.

Mac


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## mossyoak (May 24, 2010)

cmacclel said:


> I believe they are more like to exact size in there relaxed state.
> 
> Mac



Mine were all around .005-.010 under sized but could be pryed open with work. You just about didn't have to tighten them in the chuck they held so tight and you had to press the work out of them when finished. I'm back to my old hardinge and royals.


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## tvodrd (May 28, 2010)

I have a full set of Lyndex 5C's I bought ~5 yrs ago. (1/16-1 1/8 x 1/64ths) They were made in Japan and I have yet to have a problem with one. Just my $.02.

Larry


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## precisionworks (Jun 8, 2010)

The 35 Hardinge collets arrived from Plaza Machinery & they are very nice. Some look brand new, most show signs of light use. 34 of the collets are the "older" style, with deeply stamped size markings. Only one is the "newer" style with the lightly etched size marking.

Nearly new Hardinge 5C collets for half of retail is a good deal any time


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## Wilmette (Jun 8, 2010)

I would love a full set of Hardinge or Lyndex 5Cs. I own *one* Hardinge 5C, a .750 that came with a Yuasa indexable collet closer for the mill I bought off eBay. My set of offshore 5Cs came with my lathe, bought used from an old-timer who worked out of his garage.

I have become a collet junkie of sorts, with a set of Burnerd and Jacobs Rubberflex to augment the 5Cs. What I can't get around is the sky high price of a full set of the good (Hardinge or Lyndex) 5Cs. But I will prevail one day and then the crappy 5C collection will be used for welding practice. :devil:


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## precisionworks (Jun 8, 2010)

> What I can't get around is the sky high price


Everything that's correctly machined, heat treated and ground is expensive, if it's made in the USA, Europe or Japan ... look at a Kurt vise or an Aloris tool holder, same process for metal removal, heat treatment & grinding to finish.


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## Wilmette (Jun 9, 2010)

I hope when my time comes to find a full set of near-new Hardinge 5Cs that I feel like I got the same "bang for buck" as Mr. Kurt.


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## 65535 (Jun 9, 2010)

Wilmette, how is that AF-300 Mini holding up in that location? Very nice looking mill, I can only ever dream of owning one.

I think the machining community should pool in and start a new Bridgeport manufacturing facility, and other quality once made tools.


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## precisionworks (Jun 9, 2010)

> start a new Bridgeport manufacturing facility


Then there would be two 

http://www.bpt.com/index.asp?pageID=63&prodID=56

Brought to you by the same people who make Hardinge collets.


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## 65535 (Jun 9, 2010)

Jeeze from the rarity of the machines I didn't realize they were still produced. But is the quality still there?
And dare I ask the price? $16k I see, not the cheapest date now is it.


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## PEU (Jun 9, 2010)

What would be a good choice for a collet closer for a lathe, focus on making a lot of pieces, so opening and closing should be fairly quick. Thanks!


Pablo


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## Wilmette (Jun 9, 2010)

65535 said:


> Wilmette, how is that AF-300 Mini holding up in that location?



65535, very well so far. Interesting that you immediately found my one controversial test for operating that machine...good eye. The DRO came mounted on that swinging arm from the previous owner, a gunsmith, and I had a thought to try the variable speed capabilities of the frequency drive by leaving the pulley and belt set up for a rather high RPM and varying speed electronically. End result is that it works without sacrificing finish quality, but (of course) it doesn't have quite the cutting power as a pulley change would give you. The AF-300 needed to be within easy reach.

These days, I make the proper pulley change for the needed/wanted speed and leave the VFD at 60 Hz.


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## 65535 (Jun 9, 2010)

I have a 1HP AF-300 Mini for my Taig, for the price it's pretty easy to ignore the lack of Nema 4 rating.


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## precisionworks (Jun 9, 2010)

> a good choice for a collet closer for a lathe, focus on making a lot of pieces, so opening and closing should be fairly quick.


You want a lever type closer so the spindle continues to run & you loosen the collet, change parts, and tighten the collet again.

http://www.machinetools4sale.com/shop/item.asp?itemid=3175


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