# What hobby charger do you use?



## kramer5150 (Oct 22, 2009)

...to charge your Lithium-Ion cells?

What do you like and dislike about it?

I'm curious...


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## roadie (Oct 22, 2009)

i use cellpro FMA 4S ....

charge all my 18650s and 26650s

as i can solder and mod, so i make my own batteries pack .....


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## csshih (Oct 22, 2009)

I'm also interested!


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## KiwiMark (Oct 22, 2009)

I recently bought this:
http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/store/uh_viewitem.asp?idproduct=7028

I really like it - great for charging whatever (NiCd, NiMH, LiCo, LiMn, LiFePO4, Pb) at whatever rate (0.1V - 5.0V). It can also cycle & discharge.

What I really like about it is the price - bloody good value IMO.
What I dislike about it is that discharging is limited to 1 amp up to 5 watts.

So I have ordered this:
http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/store/uh_viewitem.asp?idproduct=7523
Which gives me the ability to discharge at 5 amps up to 25 watts. It also lets me charge 8 Li-ion cells and up to 7A (5A is probably plenty, but I do use 8 x IMR 18650 cells in my Elephant II body).

Considering its capabilities I think it is also good value.

Both these chargers require 12V DC power - but it really isn't hard to utilise a PC ATX PSU to run them. I will be able to run both off a single PSU well within the specs (I have a spare 460W PSU with max 30A @ 12V).

I do like the higher charge rates available as I have a reasonable number of 32600 Li-ion cells (some protected and some unprotected) and 26500 IMR cells (AW lists max charge rate at 5A) and 18650 IMR (AW lists max charge rate at 4.5A). I have 2 of the WF-139 chargers and they work well, but I can't crank them up to 3 or 4 amps charging rate. Then there are the lower charging rates - I am looking at buying a couple of 10440 cells which I could charge at 0.1 or 0.2 amps, my WF-139 chargers charge to fast for those little cells. I also have some 10Ah NiMH D cells and some 4Ah NiCd D cells - it is good to be able to charge those as needed at a decent charge rate.

To charge whatever I just connect the cells with magnets, no size is too big or small and I don't need a bunch of different battery holders.


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## CaseyS (Oct 22, 2009)

Kiwimark, wrt the balancing cable, did you have to buy a multipin connector and crimper in order to create the cable, or did you just cannibalize a cable that came with the charger? Any suggestions on where to buy the magnets and what specifications they should have? If you charge less than the maximum number of cells, what do you do with the remaining magnet leads? Is there any danger of a short? I assume if you only need to charge one cell, you don't need any balance connectors? Thanks in advance if you can clear any of this up.


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## clintb (Oct 22, 2009)

iCharger 208B, two of them.

Seen here: http://www.progressiverc.com/index....&category_id=1&option=com_virtuemart&Itemid=1

*Specs*
*Charging:*
8S lithium (LiPo, Li-Ion, LiFe), integrated balancing
1-25 NiCd/NiMh cells
2-36V Lead Acid
20A charge at 350W
*Discharge:*
20A discharge at 30W
Can be used with external resistors to increase discharge to 600W (Lixx only)
*Input Voltage:*
4.5V-32.0V DC
*Other:*
USB for logging and firmware upgrade
Temp probe
Actual efficiency of 93% (user measured. other chargers are low 80's and go down from there)
On board logging, 36 hours. (log while away from computer)

*What do I like?*


It's tiny, but has tons of power.
The cooling fan only comes on when it needs to and at the speed necessary.
Everything, and I mean everything, is adjustable to what I deem appropriate.
Don't want it trickle charging your NiCd/Nixx, turn it off.
Want the cutoff of LiPo charging to be at 4.18V instead of 4.20V, easy enough.
You don't feel the per cell figures of the balancing circuit jive with your super bad multimeter, no problem you can calibrate them.
Say I have a pack/cell that needs to be cycled, but it's fully charged. Most chargers would start with the charge portion of the cycle. Not with this one! You can start with either the charge or discharge.
Abbreviated forming charge. Starts off with a 1C charge until a certain voltage, then tapers the Amperage, basically like the CC/CV of a LiPo charge. Great for getting a NiCd/NiMh pack back in balance without waiting 16 hours for a .1C charge.
Turn off all the beeps.
Backlight brightness is adjustable.
Per cell Internal Resistance readings!


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## greenpea76 (Oct 22, 2009)

Thunder Power 1010C from my Helicopters and 
Duratrax ICE charger for everything else in between.


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## KiwiMark (Oct 22, 2009)

CaseyS said:


> Kiwimark, wrt the balancing cable, did you have to buy a multipin connector and crimper in order to create the cable, or did you just cannibalize a cable that came with the charger? Any suggestions on where to buy the magnets and what specifications they should have? If you charge less than the maximum number of cells, what do you do with the remaining magnet leads? Is there any danger of a short? I assume if you only need to charge one cell, you don't need any balance connectors? Thanks in advance if you can clear any of this up.



You don't always need balancing leads - in fact the balance charge option is only available for Li-ion cells, I don't think you need if for NiCd or NiMH cells. For charging my 6 x 4Ah NiCd D cells I just connect cell to cell with some of these and then the main charging leads to each end. For single cell you are right - balance connectors aren't needed.

For charging several LiCo cells at once the balance leads are a good idea - you don't want to have 3 cells at 4.14 and one cell at 4.38! You should also charge only a matched set - all the same brand/type of cell of the same age that have been used together. The charger has connections for different balance leads for different numbers of cells (2, 3, 4, 5 & 6 cell on my 6 cell charger) so you need a different balance lead for each number. Check this thread for more on magnet balance leads.


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## sadtimes (Oct 22, 2009)

http://www.electrifly.com/chargers/gpmm3155.html

love this one.. but if i had to do it over again i would go with the Duratrax ICE.. it is in the same price range


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## PCC (Oct 23, 2009)

I have a Multiplex N-5014. The price was right as my brother gave it to me when he upgraded his charger. I've used it a few times so far and have not really had enough experience with it to have any negative opinions of it. The only negative I have with it so far is that it requires a 11-15V DC power source instead of 110V AC. I ended up getting a regulated 13.5V power supply for it.


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## Hack On Wheels (Oct 23, 2009)

Awesome, thanks for starting this thread. Eventually I'm going to have to invest in a hobby charger for my li-ions and I get lost with the balancing leads and all the different setups; it's great to see what works for people.


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## kramer5150 (Oct 23, 2009)

Crappers...
My fears and suspicions have come true, that the lower priced models all require external DC power (IE more $$$). Although I can get PS's from the junk bins at work, so thats almost a non-issue, provided they have the power.

In that light the Pila dual bay unit looks like a real bargain and the next logical step up from the WF-139.

But thanks everyone for your suggestions and please keep them coming!!


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## Bullzeyebill (Oct 23, 2009)

I believe that all of the good expensive hobby charger need an external power supply.

Bill


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## Jay T (Oct 23, 2009)

drmalenko said:


> http://www.electrifly.com/chargers/gpmm3155.html
> 
> love this one.. but if i had to do it over again i would go with the Duratrax ICE.. it is in the same price range



That's the same one I have, the Triton EQ. Unlike some of the other chargers this one is AC/DC. It plugs into the wall outlet, no need for a power supply.


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## csshih (Oct 23, 2009)

anyone use this one?:
http://www.hobbypartz.com/skychb6chdup.html

looks like it is feature packed, with USB software, and it also has AC input!


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## Bullzeyebill (Oct 23, 2009)

csshih said:


> anyone use this one?:
> http://www.hobbypartz.com/skychb6chdup.html
> 
> looks like it is feature packed, with USB software, and it also has AC input!



Very nice unit. Be great for AA NiMh's and LiIon, and + is balancing with LiIon in series. Did not have these when I purchased my original Triton unit, however I do need more discharging current for C and D cells. The newer full size Tritons look good, but no built in balancing for LiIon, or did I miss something.

Bill


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## nvrdark (Oct 23, 2009)

Triton2 EQ
1)Will charge any type of battery
2) Has built in 110v power supply 8A or 12v in.
3) Nice GUI with a rotery knob not just buttons.
4) temp input option
5) nive informative backlit display
6)10 memories
7) Built in ballancer for Lions

Link
http://www.electrifly.com/chargers/gpmm3156.html


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## csshih (Oct 23, 2009)

hmm.. ouch, expensive.


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## kramer5150 (Oct 23, 2009)

Does the quality of the DC P/S affect the performance of these kinds of chargers (assuming that the capacity is not exceeded)?


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## darkzero (Oct 23, 2009)

I also use the Turnigy Accucel-6 mainly for larger cells but I still use my WF-139 too (don't have the reported issues with mine). I can't comment on how great the Accucel-6's quality is but I'm very happy with it especially for the price. Only thing I hate is the screen scratches very easily, other than that never had a problem with it. Which reminds me I need to sell my old Battery Space charger that I used for C lions.


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## smopoim86 (Oct 23, 2009)

kramer5150 said:


> Does the quality of the DC P/S affect the performance of these kinds of chargers (assuming that the capacity is not exceeded)?



It depends, but if it's not surging, or a very rippled switching supply I'd say it would be fine.


I'm using a Bantam BC8 powered by a Chinese 13.5v Meanwell clone psu(it was only $40 shipped off ebay 350w). I have a set of charging bays for 18650 and some magnet leads for anything else. I'm definitely happy with how the whole setup turned out.

Here's a few pics (The PSU I used before the Meanwell Clone). http://smopoim86.smugmug.com/Gear/Electronics/9969534_sPJQM/1/681118977_vJtjG#681119203_9yD9s


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## SilverFox (Oct 24, 2009)

Hello Kramer5150,

I use a Schulze charger and have found that it does an excellent job of charging all the battery chemistries.

Tom


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## Vikas Sontakke (Oct 25, 2009)

I am using Thunder AC6 with built-in AC cord. It looks extremely similar to the SkyCharger and came with both USB and temperature probe (but can NOT use both at the same time). I am still getting used to the interface. I wish could make my own holder. With magents, it is little bit pain. I tried to solder 12 gage wire to small round DX magent but lost most of the magnetism. Fortunately, I just slapped on bunch of the button magnets together to the soldered one. I should have gone for a more flexible wire. The 12 gage stranded is too big and inflexible for making home made cables.


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## Mech3 (Oct 25, 2009)

Hyperion EOS1210i. I bought this unit for its high NiCd & NiMH capabilities, it can do 30 cells at one time. I use it to maintain all my cordless power tools, as well as my lithium batteries for my other hobbies.


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## Mjolnir (Oct 25, 2009)

Kiwimark, does your tenergy charge your LiCo and IMR cells at 4.2 volts? The manual seems to say that it charges "Lilo" cells at 4.1 volts, and LiPo cells at 4.2 volts. If by "lilo" cells it means lithium ion cells, shouldn't it be 4.2 volts?


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## tsmith35 (Oct 25, 2009)

I'm using a Pila IBC charger. It's small, easy to use, and charges my batteries consistently.


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## KiwiMark (Oct 25, 2009)

Mjolnir said:


> Kiwimark, does your tenergy charge your LiCo and IMR cells at 4.2 volts? The manual seems to say that it charges "Lilo" cells at 4.1 volts, and LiPo cells at 4.2 volts. If by "lilo" cells it means lithium ion cells, shouldn't it be 4.2 volts?



The charging algorithms are the same - so you can charge the LiCo or LiMn cells using the LiPo setting to use a CC/CV charging method at 4.2V or you can use the LiIo setting to charge to 4.1V.

4.1V = ~90% charge level and you will get more cycles out of the cells.
4.2V = ~100% charge level and you will not get as many cycles out of the cells.

I have been using the LiPo setting.


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## Mjolnir (Oct 25, 2009)

KiwiMark said:


> The charging algorithms are the same - so you can charge the LiCo or LiMn cells using the LiPo setting to use a CC/CV charging method at 4.2V or you can use the LiIo setting to charge to 4.1V.
> 
> 4.1V = ~90% charge level and you will get more cycles out of the cells.
> 4.2V = ~100% charge level and you will not get as many cycles out of the cells.
> ...



That makes sense. That charger does seem like a very good value for what it offers. Can you set it to terminate charge at a specific voltage, like 4 volts?


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## KiwiMark (Oct 25, 2009)

Mjolnir said:


> That makes sense. That charger does seem like a very good value for what it offers. Can you set it to terminate charge at a specific voltage, like 4 volts?



No, but I don't think you would gain much in battery lifespan compared to 4.1 volts. It does 4.2V (LiPo), 4.1V (LiIo), 3.6V (LiFePO4) as well as storage charge (3.75V for Li-Io, 3.85V for LiPo and 3.3V for LiFe). I don't think that I need more options than that.


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## nein166 (Nov 1, 2009)

I have taken a nail applied flux and silver brazed the pointy end.
Then soldered a wire to the brazed end.
And put the DX magnet on the heat of the nail. Sand the head flat first.
A little superglue around the edge and the magnet stays put.
Solder a banana jack to the other end for a nice connector cable.
Not sure of the resistance in the cable if that matters, I haven't noticed a problem.


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## Russel (Nov 2, 2009)

I use a FMA 4S and a 10S.


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## T0RN4D0 (Dec 25, 2009)

Has any of you ever experienced any problems with charging protected 18650 (or any other) cells? I'm especially interested with those who use the Turnigy Accucel 6...


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## Greg G (Dec 25, 2009)

I use a Triton 2 for my 12aa packs and a WF-139 for my 18650's and 16340's. 

I like the Triton a lot. I will be gathering some various battery holders to charge Li Ions with it as well.


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## rmteo (Dec 25, 2009)

T0RN4D0 said:


> Has any of you ever experienced any problems with charging protected 18650 (or any other) cells? I'm especially interested with those who use the Turnigy Accucel 6...



I have several Accucel-6 chargers (as well as some others) which I use mainly with Lithium chemistry cells (LiPo, LiIon and LiFePO4) and occasionally for charging some D size NiMH. All my cells are unprotected and I have not had any problems - what issues are you having with the protected cells?


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## T0RN4D0 (Dec 25, 2009)

I'm not having them, i am planning on ordering it tho, just want to make sure. Its just that hobby chargers are usually meant for charging packs of cells, and i would be using mine to only charge single cells, so i want to make sure everything is gonna be ok


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## Billy Ram (Dec 31, 2009)

With KiwiMark and others satisfaction with the Turnigys I went ahead a got one.





Just like others I'm totally satisfied with mine. It came with a lot of handy connectors along with a thermocouple. The volt meter reads close to my Fluke and balance charges my IMRs to 4.18v. I had some balance leads sent along with the charger for connecting to battery holders. I also went ahead and had the $30 12.5a. power supply sent along and believe these things may need a good power supply to work accurately. 
For the money :twothumbs
Billy


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## Black Rose (Dec 31, 2009)

I'm probably going to get an Accucel-6, as my Li-Ion cells are multiplying like rabbits.

Anyone come across a pre-made temperature probe for the Accucel-6?
There are instructions on the HobbyKing site on how to make your own, but I don't think my skills are up to par for taking on that task


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## rmteo (Dec 31, 2009)

I have not made nor used a temp probe - I prefer to use the port for USB. Even when charging 8x 16340 cells in parallel at the max. 5A rate, you can barely feel any heat build up in the cells. Same with charging 2x 18650 at 5A.

Now NiMH is another story altogether. The only NiMH I use are some 10000mAH D cells. I usually charge them at 3.6A for 2 reasons - it is 1mAH per second and secondly, the springs on those cheap plastic battery holders get melty hot at anything much above 4A or so. At the end of the charge, those big D's are pretty hot - I'm guessing about 140F or 60C.


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## BVH (Dec 31, 2009)

I use a Schulze. There's nothing like it's ability to be firmware upgraded for new and emerging cell chemistries and charging algorythyms.


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## 325addict (Dec 31, 2009)

no one at all. I use either my own design Li-ion battery charger, or a modified Trustfire TR-001, or, I use a bench power supply with voltage and current regulation. With such a power supply, you will be able to charger ANY battery safely, AS LONG AS YOU KNOW EXACTLY what you're doing... I can charge a tiny AAA Ni-MH cell as well as a huge car-battery with the same power supply....

Timmo.


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## The Dane (Jan 2, 2010)

Turnigy Accucell-6 for light duty and Hyperion EOS 1210I for HD.
They do anything from LA to LiFe.


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## klorsey (Jul 28, 2010)

Removed by klorsey


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## Bullzeyebill (Jul 28, 2010)

klorsey, you are doing a variation of this which is not condoned here on CPF. You have already asked for help in your original thread. Just to help you out here because you are new to CPF. 

Bill


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## clintb (Jul 29, 2010)

Ended up selling both of my iCharger 208B's and went for a single FMA PowerLab 8 battery workstation. 1000W charging on 24V input, 100W discharge via internal heatsink/fans, 1000W regenerative discharge into lead acid batteries. It's a monster of a charger, developed by a very trusted name that's focused on safety.


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## pepko (Jul 29, 2010)

clintb said:


> Ended up selling both of my iCharger 208B's and went for a single FMA PowerLab 8 battery workstation. 1000W charging on 24V input, 100W discharge via internal heatsink/fans, 1000W regenerative discharge into lead acid batteries. It's a monster of a charger, developed by a very trusted name that's focused on safety.



... and is it able to charge new samsung 18650 3000mAh with 4.35V charging voltage ?


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## klorsey (Jul 29, 2010)

Hi Bullzeyebill.

My only reason for doing this is because this thread seems to have a lot more people participating,than mine.Neither thread seems to show much interest in common household sizes of NiMH batteries like AA's etc.

I was just hoping that some people who actually own these chargers might say a few words about their experiences or knowledge on this topic.As it now stands,I have no idea if these hobby chargers can even charge more than,say 1x AA NiMH at a time.

If it's against the forum rules,I'll remove it.


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## clintb (Jul 29, 2010)

klorsey,

To answer your question regarding hobby chargers and charging/discharging/cycling more than one NiMh AA/AAA/C/D at a time, yes, they can. You have to check the specs for each charger though. Something like an FMA CellPro 10s ONLY does LiPo, no Nixx. You'll be looking for a multi-chemistry charger.

For actually charging multiple loose AA/AAA/C/D cells, you'll have to rig up a holder, or get something from mouser.com or digikey.com, even RadioShack for the cheap plastic multi-cell carriers...

PM me if you don't get answers anywhere else, and so we keep this thread on-topic.


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## clintb (Jul 29, 2010)

pepko said:


> ... and is it able to charge new samsung 18650 3000mAh with 4.35V charging voltage ?


I'm not in front of my PL8 at the moment, and the manual doesn't state, but I did ask in the PL8 support thread on rcgroups.com. For LiPo, it can be adjusted up to 4.30V per cell, and that's it.

Have a link to these new cells that go up to 4.35V?


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## pepko (Jul 29, 2010)

clintb said:


> Have a link to these new cells that go up to 4.35V?



https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/275159


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## DHart (Aug 9, 2010)

I'm also considering the Accucel 6 to charge my li-ions, as an upgrade from my WF-139 (which has served me very with no problems). Can anyone recommend the best way to connect this charger to the individual li-ion cells? Is it good to get a cradle of some sort, or can you easily connect to the cells without a cradle? Any pics that you might be able to share to demonstrate cell connection would be wonderful.

I use 18650, 17670, 14500, and 16340 li-ions mostly, and some 16340 LiFePO4 and AA Eneloops as well.

Thanks, in advance.


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## Battery Guy (Aug 9, 2010)

KiwiMark said:


> No, but I don't think you would gain much in battery lifespan compared to 4.1 volts.



Depending on the application and the cell, you can get an enormous improvement in cycle-life by reducing the cut-off voltage from 4.1 to 4.0 V. My general rule of thumb is that you will get 2X to 5X improvement in cycle life for every 0.1 V reduction in the cut-off voltage. 

So if you are getting 300 cycles to 80% original capacity when charging to 4.2 V, you would expect 600-1500 cycles by reducing your cut-off voltage to 4.1 V, and 1200-7500 cycles by reducing your cut-off voltage to 4.0 V.

It is a rule of thumb, but very much in the ballpark. This is one of the "tricks" used for military and space applications where extremely high cycle life is required.

By the way, the "300 cycles to 80% original capacity" is the industry standard for consumer electronics. This is what the top tier manufacturers in Japan and Korea try to hold to. Most of the cells I see coming out of China are in the 50 to 200 cycles to 80% original capacity. These are generalizations, as I have certainly seen Japanese cells perform poorly, and there are a few really top notch Chinese manufacturers (BYD and Lishen come to mind). 

Also, there are really big safety benefits to be had by charging the cell to only 4.1 V or even 4.0 V compared to 4.2 V. 

For the average hobbyist that is using lithium-ion cells from anonymous manufacturers, charging to 4.1 V or 4.0 V is really quite a good idea.

So charging to lower voltages has big benefits, but of course you are sacrificing stored energy. Unfortunately, I cannot give you a "risk-benefit" chart that would quantify the trade-offs. This has to be determined for each individual cell.

Cheers,
BG


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## syncytial (Aug 9, 2010)

DHart said:


> I'm also considering the Accucel 6 to charge my li-ions, as an upgrade from my WF-139 (which has served me very with no problems). Can anyone recommend the best way to connect this charger to the individual li-ion cells? Is it good to get a cradle of some sort, or can you easily connect to the cells without a cradle? Any pics that you might be able to share to demonstrate cell connection would be wonderful.
> 
> I use 18650, 17500, 14500, and 16340 li-ions mostly, and some 16340 LiFePO4 and AA Eneloops as well.
> 
> Thanks, in advance.



sdnative sells custom built 18650 cradles. He had a sales thread in the custom lights forum, but it's now closed. Still useful as a reference. He has a website as well. Other options include clamps and magnets e.g. here.

My preference is the cradle solution - if you're using spacers for your smaller cells now, you can probably continue to use them in a cradle.

Another option some have used is to buy cheap chargers and strip the guts, just using the cradle as a cell holder.


- Syncytial


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## KiwiMark (Aug 9, 2010)

DHart said:


> I'm also considering the Accucel 6 to charge my li-ions, as an upgrade from my WF-139 (which has served me very with no problems). Can anyone recommend the best way to connect this charger to the individual li-ion cells? Is it good to get a cradle of some sort, or can you easily connect to the cells without a cradle? Any pics that you might be able to share to demonstrate cell connection would be wonderful.
> 
> I use 18650, 17500, 14500, and 16340 li-ions mostly, and some 16340 LiFePO4 and AA Eneloops as well.



I like the LuxLuthor method: https://www.candlepowerforums.com/posts/3073396#post3073396
I don't think I could solder well enough to make my own leads though, so I PMed Lux and paid him to supply me with the necessary leads.
I use the magnet leads to charge 10440, 14500, 16350, 18650, 26500 & 32650 Li-ion (LiCo, LiMn & LiFePO4 chemistries) as well as AAA, AA & D cell NiMH and some D cell NiCd I still use. It's hard to find something that I can't charge!


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## pae77 (Aug 9, 2010)

Hi Kiwi Mark,

I've gone ahead and ordered an Accucel 6 and am also interested in getting a set of those magnet leads made for me as my soldering skills are presently non existent. Do you use any balancing leads with those as well or do you mostly just charge in parallel?


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## jasonck08 (Aug 9, 2010)

Battery Guy said:


> For the average hobbyist that is using lithium-ion cells from anonymous manufacturers, charging to 4.1 V or 4.0 V is really quite a good idea.


 
I would say Charge to 4.20v as your never going to recharge your cells 300x anyways before upgrading, loosing, or damaging them perminiatly (ie. accidental overdischarge). I'd say the max some of my cells have is about 20 cycles. I don't charge and discharge enough for it to be worth charging it to only 4.1v or 4.0v. I'd rather have max capacity.

More on topic:

I have the tenergy Accucell-6 and I love it. Works great for all chemistries. I've used it to charge Li-ion, IMR's, Lifepo4's, Ni-mh's and Lead Acid batteries. It's a steal at the $30 price point!


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## KiwiMark (Aug 10, 2010)

pae77 said:


> Hi Kiwi Mark,
> 
> I've gone ahead and ordered an Accucel 6 and am also interested in getting a set of those magnet leads made for me as my soldering skills are presently non existent. Do you use any balancing leads with those as well or do you mostly just charge in parallel?



I guess I mostly charge 1 cell at a time, so no need for balancing leads 90% of the time. For the other 10% of the time I use balancing leads. I have found out that you can use 6 cell leads for any number of cells - you just have to keep the unused balancing wires out of the way.



jasonck08 said:


> I would say Charge to 4.20v as your never going to recharge your cells 300x anyways before upgrading, loosing, or damaging them perminiatly (ie. accidental overdischarge). I'd say the max some of my cells have is about 20 cycles. I don't charge and discharge enough for it to be worth charging it to only 4.1v or 4.0v. I'd rather have max capacity.



I'd have to pretty much agree with that.

For anyone recharging every week they would take 6 years to get 300 cycles on their cells - so the cell will be too old before they have too many cycles through them. For anyone recharging every day - you probably need all the capacity you can get if you need to recharge them that often, and wearing them out would be a good excuse to get new higher capacity cells.


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## old4570 (Aug 10, 2010)

Anyone using the IMax B6 ????

These are like cheap now compared to like 6 months ago ...


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## pae77 (Aug 10, 2010)

Wow, that's really cheap, at about $25 including shipping. Looks about the same as the Accucel except for the lack of a cooling fan. Wonder if it's a clone? Anyway, seems like a great deal.


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## zer0ne (Aug 10, 2010)

KiwiMark said:


> I like the LuxLuthor method: https://www.candlepowerforums.com/posts/3073396#post3073396
> I don't think I could solder well enough to make my own leads though, so I PMed Lux and paid him to supply me with the necessary leads.
> I use the magnet leads to charge 10440, 14500, 16350, 18650, 26500 & 32650 Li-ion (LiCo, LiMn & LiFePO4 chemistries) as well as AAA, AA & D cell NiMH and some D cell NiCd I still use. It's hard to find something that I can't charge!



Does the strong magnet interferes with the PCB if the cells are protected?


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## KiwiMark (Aug 10, 2010)

zer0ne said:


> Does the strong magnet interferes with the PCB if the cells are protected?



Not in the slightest. I've never seen the magnets make any difference.


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## zer0ne (Aug 10, 2010)

KiwiMark said:


> Not in the slightest. I've never seen the magnets make any difference.


hmm..interesting. Isn't the PCB consists of some IC chip? Well, I not sure if the magnet would do damage to the chip without the user knowing.


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## pae77 (Aug 10, 2010)

I hope the magnets don't damage the PCB because I frequently use magnets like that to hold cells fixed in position (i.e., keep them from rolling around) while I check them with a DMM.


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## ptolemy (Aug 10, 2010)

I use/used thunder ac6. it worked very good. but now i upgraded to higher end charger with dedicated 25amp PS.

i also used backup power supply but it's a spare now.

ac/dc chargers are fine for most charging until you get into high capasity cells and want to balance few at a time.

i like my new charger so much that i am thinking of selling thunder ac6 and power supply since balancing 26650x 2 or more it simply doesnt have enough juice for


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## tankahn (Aug 10, 2010)

I got a Triton charger earlier. Then I bought the icharger 106B+. This one allows USB monitoring. It bricked a few days later. Hobbyking sent me a replacement. Now I am able to monitor its progress with a computer with graph display. The monitoring software is in German, its free anyway and easy to figure out. Monitoring give one a better idea which batteries are turning bad. I found most of the li-ion batteries I bought a few years ago are still okay. The hobby charger helps me save me money as it never overcharge. The battery is bought up to no more than 4.2 volts while current is gradually lowered before it terminates. There are safety features like temperature probes, time limit cut-offs etc. The icharger has a "storage" charge which charge/discharge the battery to 3.6volts. Couldn't get that to work as it terminates too early. To do that I hook the battery to a small fan and let the battery run down using the icharger monitoring mode which measure its voltage under load. I would turn the fan off for a second to get its resting voltage.


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## DHart (Aug 10, 2010)

Syncytial and Kiwi Mark.... thanks for the info on leads and connections.


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## pae77 (Aug 10, 2010)

My Accucel 6 should be showing up in todays mail. Looking forward to playing with it. Hopefully, I'll be able to make it work temporarily for single cell charging with alligator clips and magnets, until I get some better leads.


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## pae77 (Aug 10, 2010)

Well my Accucel 6 was delivered on schedule today. I can't believe how small and just plain cute it is! I would like to thank those that described in positive terms how they use these to charge their cells and basically helped convince me to try this approach to charging Li-ion batteries.

At the very reasonable prices these or similar units are currently available for, I think these hobby chargers really are a very nice solution for charging Li-ion cells.

I've started out by just charging one 10440 cell (at a user selectable .1 amp charge current) which I was able to do with the cable that came with the charger and some magnets I already had. I really am loving how the display constantly shows the actual voltage of the cell in real time as it is charging. These things really seem to be quite a bargain to me for what they can do and how they work (assuming it doesn't malfunction in the near future).


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## KiwiMark (Aug 10, 2010)

pae77 said:


> (assuming it doesn't malfunction in the near future).



Mine's done quite a bit of charging and is still working flawlessly - they seem to be fairly good quality, especially for the price.


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## pae77 (Aug 10, 2010)

Yeah, I really can't get over the sophistication and apparent quality for the price. I only paid about $39 including shipping and the unit was shipped the same day I paid for it by priority mail and came very quickly. 

And since it is constantly displaying the cell voltage, I guess it would be a simple matter to stop the charge process when the cell reaches whatever voltage one preferred to charge to, assuming one wished to charge to something a little lower than the standard 4.20 volts.


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## KiwiMark (Aug 11, 2010)

pae77 said:


> And since it is constantly displaying the cell voltage, I guess it would be a simple matter to stop the charge process when the cell reaches whatever voltage one preferred to charge to, assuming one wished to charge to something a little lower than the standard 4.20 volts.



You can set it to 4.1V or 4.2V and do a normal charge or a quick charge (cuts off charging when the amps drop to 1/5 the starting amps instead of 1/10). You can also do a storage charge which partially charges it for the ideal storage voltage.

And of course as you say you can watch the voltage and interrupt it at any point.

Part of the reason I like these hobby chargers is this flexibility that standard cradle chargers just don't offer. I also like to charge at somewhere around 1/2 C or a little above so I usually charge my 5000mAh 32600 cells at around 2.5 - 3.0 amps and my 10440 at 0.1 amps - it is really hard to find another charger that can hold AAA sized cells and D sized cells and can charge at 0.1A for the AAA sized cells and at 3.0A for the D sized cells. Hobby chargers just work for all my charging needs and other chargers only suit some of my batteries.

Have fun playing with your charger. :thumbsup:


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## pae77 (Aug 11, 2010)

Thanks for the added info. I am having fun with it. 

Btw, what actual voltage do your 10440's usually end up at as measured by a DMM after you charge them using the normal 4.20 program?



KiwiMark said:


> You can set it to 4.1V or 4.2V and do a normal charge or a quick charge (cuts off charging when the amps drop to 1/5 the starting amps instead of 1/10). You can also do a storage charge which partially charges it for the ideal storage voltage.
> 
> And of course as you say you can watch the voltage and interrupt it at any point.
> 
> ...


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## KiwiMark (Aug 12, 2010)

pae77 said:


> Btw, what actual voltage do your 10440's usually end up at as measured by a DMM after you charge them using the normal 4.20 program?



I can't guarantee perfect accuracy on my DMM, but I got 4.18V on one of my 10440 around 30-60 minutes after charging.


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## pae77 (Aug 12, 2010)

I can't guarantee the accuracy of my cheap DMM either but I am seeing apparently much lower ending voltages on all my batteries. Usually around 4.04-4.08 according to my DMM. I'm not sure whether that is the proper result of the true CC/CV algorithm or whether my A6 needs to be calibrated. 

Fortunately, these chargers are super easy to calibrate provided one has access to a known accurate DMM. 

I would like to check and possibly adjust the calibration of my Accucell but I will have to wait until I can get access to a known accurate DMM or find some way to verify the accuracy of mine, because I certainly don't want to mess it up and inadvertently cause it to start charging too high.


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## KiwiMark (Aug 12, 2010)

pae77 said:


> I can't guarantee the accuracy of my cheap DMM either but I am seeing apparently much lower ending voltages on all my batteries. Usually around 4.04-4.08 according to my DMM. I'm not sure whether that is the proper result of the true CC/CV algorithm or whether my A6 needs to be calibrated.



You definitely are using the LiPo setting? The LiIo setting only charges to 4.1V which would leave my batteries around 4.08 like what you are getting. Standard charge at 0.1A on LiPo settings should result in a cell that measures 4.15+ unless the charger is out on its voltage reading. At 0.1A charging rate the charger will CV charge at 4.2V until the amps have dropped to 10ma, when you stop charging the volts will drop, but it shouldn't be a whole lot since it was at 4.2V at 0.01A.

If you are using the right settings then I would suggest finding a good fluke multimeter and calibrating the Accucell charger - then see how charging goes and check the cell afterwards with the same multimeter. Unfortunately I don't know anyone with a good accurate multimeter I can borrow and I can't afford to buy one at the moment - It would be good to test my chargers & batteries properly.


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## pae77 (Aug 12, 2010)

Yes, I'm almost positive I was using the LiPo setting. I'll do some more testing when I have another battery to charge. 

Can't afford to buy a Fluke either. :mecry:

Only thing I currently have available to compare my DMM to is the voltage report on my LF2XT which can report the voltage of any 10440 inside the light, but I don't know how accurate that is either. It generally measures a 10440 .01 volts higher than what my DMM measures for the same battery. But that's still no guarantee either of them are accurate. And the battery inside the LF2XT is under load when it's being measured, which further complicates things.

One way or another, I'll get it figured out and calibrated eventually though. In the meantime, it's not hurting anything by undercharging a bit, if in fact that's what it's doing.

Btw, I opened the charger up to lube the fan. Everything looks pretty nice and neat inside. Fan is a lot quieter after putting some Tuf Glide on the fan's shaft.


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## KiwiMark (Aug 12, 2010)

pae77 said:


> Btw, I opened the charger up to lube the fan. Everything looks pretty nice and neat inside. Fan is a lot quieter after putting some Tuf Glide on the fan's shaft.



I used Nano-oil on mine. Huge improvement!


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## pae77 (Aug 12, 2010)

It doesn't seem to heat up much at all and the air that the fan blows out is always quite cool so far ime. It makes me wonder whether a fan is even necessary. I have contemplated unplugging it to see whether the charger would start to heat up or not without the fan operating. 

Too bad it's not on some kind of temperature controlled activation so it would only turn on if/when really needed. But for the price, I can't complain.


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## syncytial (Aug 12, 2010)

pae77 said:


> I would like to check and possibly adjust the calibration of my Accucell but I will have to wait until I can get access to a known accurate DMM or find some way to verify the accuracy of mine, because I certainly don't want to mess it up and inadvertently cause it to start charging too high.




This thread may be of interest.

A quick look at the 'Bay showed that one known seller of pre-built inexpensive voltage reference boards isn't selling them at the moment. I did see another seller offering a seemingly well-made bare board (you need to supply/install parts) for ~$5.00. It was claimed populated, functioning & tested boards would be available soon.

The ICs used are inexpensive, so if you're handy in that way, you could build a reference yourself inexpensively. It's preferable if somewhere in the chain there's a known standard though... that's one advantage of dealing with a supplier like this.


- Syncytial.


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## TedTheLed (Aug 12, 2010)

I use a dc power supply with analog meters that was less than $100, I can dial in any voltage 1-30 at up to 3 amps.

if I got another I'd get one with digital readouts, then you could just set the voltage max for what ever and the thing would turn off when that number was reached..


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## pae77 (Aug 13, 2010)

syncytial said:


> This thread may be of interest.
> 
> A quick look at the 'Bay showed that one known seller of pre-built inexpensive voltage reference boards isn't selling them at the moment. I did see another seller offering a seemingly well-made bare board (you need to supply/install parts) for ~$5.00. It was claimed populated, functioning & tested boards would be available soon.
> 
> ...


Yes, that thread was very interesting and relevant, indeed. Thanks for pointing me to it. I would like to get one of those inexpensive reference devices when they are again available.


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## alphazeta (Aug 15, 2010)

Thanks to the recent bumps of this thread in the last week, my interest in upgrading to a hobby charger peaked up.

After initially a targeting either a turnigy 6 or thunder ac6, I decided to go with a Triton. 
Can't wait for it to arrive. I guess I owe a thanks to this thread's enablers :thumbsup:
-AZ


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## Aquanaut (Aug 21, 2010)

pae77 said:


> Fortunately, these chargers are super easy to calibrate provided one has access to a known accurate DMM.



With access to an accurate DMM, could you supply us with the basics to calibrate a charger? Do you mean to actually change the finish voltage of the charger?


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## pae77 (Aug 21, 2010)

Aquanaut said:


> With access to an accurate DMM, could you supply us with the basics to calibrate a charger? Do you mean to actually change the finish voltage of the charger?


When I said "these chargers" are easy to calibrate, I was referring to the charger I personally have which is an Accucell 6. I am not personally familiar with the Triton or any other brands aside from the one I have and thus have no idea how one would calibrate that brand/model or other brands or even if they can be calibrated, although one would think that any good quality hobby charger should be capable of being calibrated. So I cannot provide instructions that would necessarily be applicable to calibrating "chargers" in general. On my specific charger, I have found that calibrating it does actually have the effect of changing the "finish voltage of the charger" as measured by my DMM.

There is a video on Youtube showing someone demonstrating the process of calibrating the Accucell 6. The video shows an older version of the Accucell 6 but the procedure remains the same on the current model. FWIMBW, here's a link to the video. I suppose it is likely that many other brands or models of hobby chargers can be calibrated by a somewhat similar procedure.


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## Billy Ram (Aug 21, 2010)

I can tell you the Accucell 8 doesn't calibrate like the Accucell 6 does in the video. If it can be calibrated at all it may have to be done by connecting to your computer by usb cable. "You would need the software too." My Accucell 8 reads very close to my Fluke 77 that's only accurate to +or- .3% DC volts. My cells read 4.16-4.17v after resting by my Fluke DMM. Which could be 4.14749v or 4.18251v. Close enough ?
Billy


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## pae77 (Aug 21, 2010)

Billy Ram said:


> I can tell you the Accucell 8 doesn't calibrate like the Accucell 6 does in the video. If it can be calibrated at all it may have to be done by connecting to your computer by usb cable. "You would need the software too." My Accucell 8 reads very close to my Fluke 77 that's only accurate to +or- .3% DC volts. My cells read 4.16-4.17v after resting by my Fluke DMM. Whitch could be 4.14749v or 4.18251v. Close enough ?
> Billy


Sounds about perfect to me. . . I've now got most of my new cells in good condition finishing up around ~4.15 on my cheap DMM (after applying a touch of calibration), which is just about where I want them. For now, I'm assuming it's accurate to about + or - .02 or so, but I hope to check it against some decent reference sometime.

Are you sure you can't access that "hidden" calibration screen on your unit? You have to hold down both keys before turning the unit on and then still holding down those two keys, turn the unit on, (i.e., apply the power to it). Anyway, it works on my A6, just as shown in the video.


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## KiwiMark (Aug 22, 2010)

Billy Ram said:


> I can tell you the Accucell 8 doesn't calibrate like the Accucell 6 does in the video.



Really? Mine does. Both my Accucel 6 & Accucell 8 calibrate exactly as shown in the video.


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## LuxLuthor (Aug 22, 2010)

Mech3 said:


> Hyperion EOS1210i. I bought this unit for its high NiCd & NiMH capabilities, it can do 30 cells at one time. I use it to maintain all my cordless power tools, as well as my lithium batteries for my other hobbies.



Ditto.

Let's see:

2 x Hyperion 1210i (plus two LBA balancer modules)
2 x Maha C9000
2 x Tenergy/DN 4S Parallel charger
1 x Competition Electronic Turbo-35-GFX
1 x Maha C777 Plus-II
2 x Pila IBC
3 x DSD with Nokia PS (No longer used)
2 x Maha MH-C401FS (No longer used)
1 x eStation BC6
1 x Hitech Automatic NiMH 2-10 cell
3 x Multi-Current Universal Smart NiMH Charger
3 x Generic Li-Ion Generic "Smart" charger like these. (One melted, other two not used)​I think that's all of them.


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## Billy Ram (Aug 22, 2010)

KiwiMark said:


> Really? Mine does. Both my Accucel 6 & Accucell 8 calibrate exactly as shown in the video.


 OK I must have not been doing it quite right but now it works. Mine wasn't too far off from my DMM and I now have them reading the same. I don't believe this will make much differance while charging in ballance mode. 
Billy


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## Aquanaut (Aug 22, 2010)

pae77 said:


> There is a video on Youtube showing someone demonstrating the process of calibrating the Accucell 6. The video shows an older version of the Accucell 6 but the procedure remains the same on the current model. FWIMBW, here's a link to the video. I suppose it is likely that many other brands or models of hobby chargers can be calibrated by a somewhat similar procedure.



Here might be a thread of interest I found:
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=827821

The calibration technique can be applied to Accucel and Imax hobby chargers at least. There are most likely other chargers that can be calibrated.

The forum thread is long, but very interesting. BTW, there are two menus that can be used to calibrate - not only the total battery finishing voltage , but also the individual cell balance finishing voltages.


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## Billy Ram (Aug 22, 2010)

Aquanaut said:


> Here might be a thread of interest I found:
> http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=827821
> 
> The calibration technique can be applied to Accucel and Imax hobby chargers at least. There are most likely other chargers that can be calibrated.
> ...


 I'm not messing arround with the other menu. I can add up the voltages shown during ballance charging and check the total with my DMM and they're the same. My charger ballances to .01v.
Billy


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## pae77 (Aug 22, 2010)

Aquanaut said:


> Here might be a thread of interest I found:
> http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=827821
> 
> The calibration technique can be applied to Accucel and Imax hobby chargers at least. There are most likely other chargers that can be calibrated.
> ...


It's an interesting thread. Thanks for the reference.

So far at least, I haven't had the need to use the balancing feature of my hobby charger, so I probably won't have to mess around with trying to calibrate that aspect of it. I'm just charging single cells or pairs of cells in parallel (a method in which the cells "self" balance without need for balancing leads). 

The relatively modest power output capability of the Accucell 6 seems perfectly suited for my modest needs.

What I found most interesting in that thread is the idea that the accuracy of the charger can be even further improved by replacing certain resistors with higher quality components. The first A6 I got was so far out of adjustment, it still appeared to be charging low even with the maximum calibration of -20 dialed in. I RMA'd it and got a replacement that appears to be more accurate and only requires a small amount of calibration that is well within the range of adjustment allowed by the calibration menu. So if one gets a "good" example, as I did with my replacement unit, and, apparently as Billy Ram has, one should be able to get by with just applying relatively minor amounts of calibration.

I guess if one pays a bit more for something like an iCharger, one presumably gets higher quality and more accurate components OOTB. Still, I think the Accucell represents great value.


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## Hack On Wheels (Aug 25, 2010)

pae77 said:


> I guess if one pays a bit more for something like an iCharger, one presumably gets higher quality and more accurate components OOTB. Still, I think the Accucell represents great value.



I'm actually having a really tough time deciding on a charger to get. So, I figured I would post in this thread before starting my own.

I'm debating between the Accucel 6, Accucel 8, and iCharger 106B+.
The Accucel 6 is the cheapest by far (almost 1/4 of the iCharger's price!) but the power ratings are very low. It would be a great improvement from my WF-139/DIY setup, but it wouldn't give me much "growing room". I don't think I would ever be likely to need to charge as many cells as the Accucel 8 can, but the increase in power would be great for faster charging of cells/batteries.

For my purposes, it strikes me that the differences are:
-iCharger is presumed to be of higher quality, thus being more reliable and lasting longer
-Accucel 8 may or may not have a USB connection for logging battery tests (I have a lot of cells and salvaged cells that I would like to be able to test for voltage under load and not just capacity)
-Accucel 8 is almost 1/2 the price of the iCharger

They would both have enough power for the foreseeable future and the same combatibility with charging leads and viability for DIY cell balancing. They both can charge the same assortment of cell chemistries...

If anyone has input on either of these chargers that would be appreciated! iCharger has a percieved higher quality/reliability, but that could be an unwarranted assumption due to the higher price. It would be nice if this charger would last me for a good long time.


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## pae77 (Aug 25, 2010)

The power ratings of the Accucell 6 are low for the RC crowd and the high number of big capacity multi series packs they like to charge at one time, but they seem quite adequate for charging a few single cell li-ion flashlight batteries at a time. I haven't charged at higher than 2.4 amps yet and mostly am charging at lower currents than that. I really don't anticipate needing more power than the A6 provides, but of course, ymmv.


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## zer0ne (Aug 25, 2010)

Accucel 8 has no more USB and temperature probe. You can change termination voltage on iCharger to charge those batts requires up to 4.3v.


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## Billy Ram (Aug 25, 2010)

The accucell 8150 was a great deal when it came with usb port and magnetic temp prob. "This is a nice temp prob" Mine has been a great charger but I would have to go with the i106B if I was buying a new one.
Be sure to check out the market place before you buy.
Billy


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## KiwiMark (Aug 25, 2010)

Billy Ram said:


> The accucell 8150 was a great deal when it came with usb port and magnetic temp prob. "This is a nice temp prob" Mine has been a great charger but I would have to go with the i106B if I was buying a new one.



I agree, my 8150 is great and the temp probe is really nice, but I paid $70 and the are now $44. If the temp probe & USB isn't a big deal to someone then the 8150 is still a hell of a good deal.

The i106B looks good for the money, but there are times when I want to charge 8 cells (8 x IMR 18650) at once. Mind you I do have 2 hobby chargers so if I bought a 3rd one then the i806 would be a nice addition.

For the money at $22.50 & $44 you can't really fault either Accucell - they are good quality and work well without costing much at all.


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## pae77 (Aug 25, 2010)

KiwiMark said:


> . . .
> 
> For the money at $22.50 & $44 you can't really fault either Accucell - they are good quality and work well without costing much at all.


I agree with you but they are actually a little higher than that if you count shipping. (About $37 shipped for the A6, iirc.) Still great values though. :thumbsup:


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