# Need help with G2 replacement bulb



## photon1c (Mar 21, 2010)

Hello!
So I have had a Surefire G2 for something like 5 or 6 years. The bulb finally gave out. I am looking for a replacement but I am not sure I want to shell out $20+ for a p60 bulb from Surefire. The whole flashlight, new in the box, including 2 batteries plus an additional 2 batteries the seller threw in was only $30 at a gunshow.

I noticed this Chinese website called dealextreme has cheap drop-ins (though they all seem to be LED based) but they don't document their products very well, and I have no idea what would fit.

So my questions are;

1) Are there any cheap replacements that are real xenon (incandescent) bulbs ?

2) If I go with an LED replacement, which one (from dealextreme or other) would be the best?

Thanks

ETA: I found a huge post with lots of listings and links for LED (only) drop-in replacements for the P60. I couldn't make heads nor tails of it, but I would really like to replace it with a xenon incandescent. If that's not possible, what's a good cheap LED replacement that is not too blue?


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## WildChild (Mar 21, 2010)

Either a LED replacement module or if you want to keep it as an incandescent flashlight, you may want to take a look at Lumens Factory replacement modules:

http://lumensfactory.com/cart.php?cat_id=2&sub_cat_id=2

They are well known here and they are not bad at all!


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## Kestrel (Mar 21, 2010)

+1 on the Lumens Factory incandescent lamp assemblies. Although I don't have one, I've read a lot of good things about them here - it sounds like they are THE top-rated incan drop-ins.

Regarding LED drop-ins, these incan folks here kind of get a little touchy talking about LED's in this subforum.  If you're interested in those, there are a number of great threads in the LED subforum, just search the forums for "SureFire G2 LED upgrade" or somesuch. Or just cut out all of the pesky reading and pick up a Malkoff M60W 'warm' LED dropin. ;-)

Edit: Oh, and :welcome:


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## Niconical (Mar 21, 2010)

P60 lamps are usually available cheap on theMarketplace (sister forum to this one). 

In this thread for example there are 2 currently for sale at $8 each.


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## photon1c (Mar 21, 2010)

Thanks folks!
This is exactly what I am looking for!


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## photon1c (Mar 21, 2010)

Ok so I tried to PM that user on cpfmarketplace. I was surprised to find that my login didn't work there, so I registered (same username and PW as here).
I tried to login and it keeps saying

"You have entered an invalid username or password. Please press the back button, enter the correct details and try again. Don't forget that the password is case sensitive. Forgotten your password? Click here!"

When I registered here (candlepowerforums) I could log in and post immediately after following the link in the confirmation email. 

What gives?


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## Niconical (Mar 22, 2010)

Possibly just an error, try changing the password, or just leave it a while. 

In the meantime I will PM the P60 seller and ask him to contact you here on the main forum.


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## mdocod (Mar 22, 2010)

Hello Photon1c,

Welcome to CPF!

Normally speaking, as previously said, it's often frowned upon to venture into the discussions of LEDs when said communications reside in the incandecent section of this forum. However, it would be irresponsible to withhold valuable information to a new member of CPF merely because of the location of his or her first post. The flashlight in question is incandecent in it's stock configuration and it is perfectly reasonable to ask for recommendations on both incan and LED options in the same thread given the circumstances. 

With that said: 
In the last few years, advancements in LED efficiency and output have progressively been encroaching on illumination levels previously only attainable in incandecent configurations. It started with the smaller single cell flashlights and has worked it's way up the chain. there now exists an LED alternative for just about every level of raw output up to hundreds and even thousands of lumens, often with several fold better run-time than an equivalent size incandecent configuration. There are still great advantages to incandecent flashlights, many of those advantages are realized by over-coming cost-of-operation through conversion to rechargeable options. Also, there are valid arguments to be made for the quality of the light, the spill/beam intensity balance, and the occasional need to start a fire. Most people have moved in the direction of LED illumination tools for most applications. 

For a 2xCR123 size flashlight, It's hard to argue with an LED. The G2 does introduce one problematic limitation; the plastic body does not properly sink heat away from higher power LED modules. Basically, you have to limit yourself to about 2 watts continuous (that's still a solid 100 torch lumens with a modern emitter), or get a multi-mode module and make a point never to run it in high mode for more than a few minutes at a time. The M60L from malkoffdevices.com would be the standard recomendation here, but it is priced about double what a G2 runs. If you'd rather keep the price point down around that $20 or so range like the P60, check out maybe a 3 mode solarforce or lumensfactory or dereelight module. 

DealExtreme and other sites like it can have their ups and downs. Tends to be that the quality control is all over the map. A product that is reviewed as being excellent one day has a part changed on it in the next batch and it's suddenly junk but it takes a few dozen people finding out the hard way before word makes it back to the reviews and reports online. I would say, proceed at your own risk in that department. If time is money, and you have to spend 3 hours of research to pick out the good DX modules from the duds, then you may as well just spent the extra money on one of the "name brands" I mentioned above. You can buy most of those from dealers right here in the states rather than wait for international snail mail. (While those "name brands" are still Chinese manufactured products, they are supported by a network of USA based resellers. Much better CS and QC). 


Here's a link to get you started:
http://www.lighthound.com/Solar-For...-In-for-L2-Flashlight-Three-Modes_p_3472.html

Enjoy,
Eric


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## jefflrrp (Mar 22, 2010)

mdocod said:


> Hello Photon1c,
> 
> Welcome to CPF!
> 
> ...


 
+1 to everything he said. What an informative post. :thumbsup:


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## Kestrel (Mar 22, 2010)

jefflrrp said:


> +1 to everything he said. What an informative post.


+2 and +1. :thumbsup:


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## kramer5150 (Mar 22, 2010)

I am not really a fan of DX one way or another. As with anything there are pros and cons, and in my collection there is a place for cheap stuff along side the higher end.

I use these in my SF-M2 and G2. Their SKU:3218 has performed admirably in either of my SF incan hosts.

I will take some outdoor beamshots tonight for your viewing pleasure, so you can compare it to my P60 and P61.

Left to right:
SF P61 - SKU:3218 - SF P60
















**EDIT**
I'll also throw in a beamshot of my SF-A2. bigchelis measured it at 85L OTF, it also has a very white color tint (for an incan) so its a good reference for you in terms of color as well as lumen output. I have switched the soalrforce strike bezel with the standard SF bezel shown below on my G2 host.


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## ampdude (Mar 22, 2010)

I received a couple of the DX drop-ins from a fellow forum member a couple of weeks ago and they are pretty good, especially for about $3 shipped that DX is asking. One I have is marked 10W and the other is 15W. Surprisingly the 15W one is a little dimmer, I'm assuming it's mislabeled. They both draw about 1.4A off of two IMR16340 cells.

While I don't expect them to be as long lasting as a geniune Surefire bulb, they are a reasonable cheap alternative if you have the higher voltage rechargeable batteries to use with them.


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## kramer5150 (Mar 23, 2010)

beamshots. Note that I am under-driving the SKYU:3218 to some degree by not using IMR cells. Tailcap current draw is 1.53A with non-IMR cells.

First a couple for reference.
An RC-N3-Q5 (LED) this light measured 145L in bigchelis' sphere





A SF-A2. My point and shoot really messes up the red tints in all these lights, and over- exagerates that color band. Yes my A2 is a RED led model, but the center spot is no where near this red in person. So disregard this image from a color standpoint. This light measured 85L in bigchelis' sphere.





SF-P60. disregard exaggerated red hue.





SF-P61. disregard red hue around the center spot.





DX SKU-3218





RC-N3-Q5 140L





SF-A2. Ignore red hue, this is 85L





SF-P60





SF-P61





DX SKU:3218


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## ampdude (Mar 23, 2010)

How much current does your SKU-3218 (15W) draw?

Funny that SKU-3162 (10W) is about $.24 more. Unfortunately I can't find a DX SKU that is a direct 6v replacement for the P60 or P61.


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## kramer5150 (Mar 23, 2010)

ampdude said:


> How much current does your SKU-3218 (15W) draw?
> 
> Funny that SKU-3162 (10W) is about $.24 more. Unfortunately I can't find a DX SKU that is a direct 6v replacement for the P60 or P61.



1.53A with non-IMR cells (12.85W)... So I think I am under-driving it a fair amount with these cells.


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## paintballdad (Mar 23, 2010)

If you want to stick with a xenon lamp assembly I have a couple up for sale in the CPFMP .

http://www.cpfmarketplace.com/mp/showthread.php?t=219239


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## bstrickler (Mar 23, 2010)

I have a LumensFactory EO-4, which is rated at 190 lumens, but puts out somewhat less than my MN10 (on 2x17670) in my M4/M3 lego, which is rated at 125 lumens. It's got a nice smooth beam, but it seems to be over-rated, but there's a chance I may be underdriving it (I'm using cells from old laptop battery packs, instead of AW's IMR or protected 18650's)

I would personally go with rechargeable/lithium ion lamps, so you can save a good bit of money in the long run, and have them be just as reliable. 

If you are in the military/law enforcement, I would use unprotected cells, because you never know when you'll have to run the lamp longer than expected. The LAST thing you want, is for the light to suddenly die, and leave you chasing a perp in the dark! It's better to kill a $5-$10 battery, than potentially lose your life, or get injured.

If you want to know about LED dropins, I would post a question on the LED section of the forum. 

~Brian


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## hyperloop (Mar 23, 2010)

Lumensfactory HO-9 + 2xRCR123s, GREAT combo


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## ampdude (Mar 23, 2010)

The only reason to go with a 3.7v lamp is in a single cell setup, not with an 18650. If you have a two cell body you might as well use a 7.2v lamp. 3.7v lamps are just not as bright as 6v and 9v lamps and they draw a lot more current as well. In addition the higher voltage lamps are more versatile in that you can run them on primaries as well.


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## mdocod (Mar 23, 2010)

Most of the lamps being discussed here are not going to run correctly on a pair of regular photo lithium primary cells.

Photon1c, are you interested in converting to a li-ion rechargeable setup? Initial investment can be upwards of $75 or more but the long term savings if you use the light frequently can more than pay for itself. You'll have to decide based on how heavily you use the light.


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## kramer5150 (Mar 23, 2010)

It should also be pointed out that run time with 2xRCR123 incan setups is _really _short, under ~10 minutes in most cases.


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## mdocod (Mar 23, 2010)

kramer5150 said:


> It should also be pointed out that run time with 2xRCR123 incan setups is _really _short, under ~10 minutes in most cases.



Howdy Kramer5150,

A 2xRCR123 setup that only runs for 10 minutes would be very unstable and dangerous for the cells. I'm sure you already know this but a 2xIMR1634 configuration is required for anything that drains off that quickly. (don't want anyone to get any dangerous ideas here  ) I suggest a 2xIMR16340 setup regardless of the bulb chosen if one chooses to stick with an incan bulb as the IMR cells run with a flatter discharge and have less resistance, so better brightness than most RCR123s when averaged through the discharge. 

The ES-9 will run for about 30-45 minutes on most RCR123 or IMR16340s and is about the same brightness as a stock P60 on CR123s. 

SR-9/P90 type lamps, which are the most logical way to go in this configuration (in my opinion) will run for about 30 minutes on most RCR123 or IMR16340s.

Anything more powerful than that should only be run with IMR16340 cells. 

1.5A bulbs like the HO-9 will replicate the runtime (15-20 minutes) and output of a P61 (~120+ torch lumen) when driven by a pair of IMR16340s. Often the 1.5A range of "9V" lamps will also throw better than the P61. Great practical configuration if the user is already use to the run-time of the SF HOLA lamps. 

Eric


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## kramer5150 (Mar 24, 2010)

mdocod said:


> Howdy Kramer5150,
> 
> A 2xRCR123 setup that only runs for 10 minutes would be very unstable and dangerous for the cells. I'm sure you already know this but a 2xIMR1634 configuration is required for anything that drains off that quickly. (don't want anyone to get any dangerous ideas here  ) I suggest a 2xIMR16340 setup regardless of the bulb chosen if one chooses to stick with an incan bulb as the IMR cells run with a flatter discharge and have less resistance, so better brightness than most RCR123s when averaged through the discharge.
> 
> Eric



I should probably clarify...
The DX SKU:3218 draw is 1.52A in the setup pictured below. It will run for about ~20 minutes until visible dimming. But I don't like to run the cells _near _that far down so I mentally set a ~10 minute cap. So I based my "10 minute runtime" on that, but its not the actual run time of the setup. This gives me some room for error, just to play it safe. (RCR123 can become explosively dangerous if depleted below ~2.75V). I would probably do the same with IMR cells, even though I could safely discharge them deeper than that.

I can't disagree with any of the points you made... IMRs are definitely the way to go (I have a pair on order)







**EDIT**
Anyone wanting to get into high current draw multi-cell Lithium Ion setups should read the "flame/fire/explosive" sticky thread atop the battery sub forum.


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## my_O_my (Mar 24, 2010)

I've ordered these for my G2 for spares to my spare P60, and they really are not bad at all for under $4. I've ordered a total of 4 and all have been exactly the same, yielding exactly the same beam profile. The light is not as white as what the Surefire P60 puts out, but I don't notice unless I shine it on a white wall. The beams are also more focused than the P60. Overall, I would say they are "slightly" less bright than the original lamp assembly, but not enough for me to notice out side...Because who uses a G2 indoors right 

If you like the broad hotspot of the P60, these may not be the Ideal replacement, but if you really don't give a rats arse, and as long as it's 60+ lumens of light, go for it.

BTW, the 4 that I have received, have all been G&P branded assemblies.


The same site also has these ones available, but they are probably the same dang thing as the others.

And they are made for 2xCR123a's ONLY!


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## photon1c (Mar 28, 2010)

Thanks for all the tips and links and especially beam pictures.

I should point out that my job pays for the CR123A's so I'll probably stick with those. 

I prefer Incand over LED because I don't like the blue hue of LEDs and it can be critical if I'm waist deep in a piece of equipment and need to identify wire colors or something.

Now I need to go re-read all the posts and figure out what to get. 

Thanks again to everyone for taking the time to help!


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## angelofwar (Mar 29, 2010)

Sent ya a PM photon r.e. P60's. It can be a little overwhelming at first. Welcome to CPF BTW!


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