# Bail-out-bag for evac from work hi-rise.



## Blackbeagle (Feb 21, 2006)

Have the following scenario: I just accepted a new job - my previous was in a single story building - parking right outside the door in a private parking lot, so a BOB at work was a non-issue. The new job is in a high-rise. I'll be on the 20th floor, parking inside the building on about the 4th. On the assumption that we get hit (power outage, fire, earthquake...) what do you recommend that I pack to get out of the building and safely elsewhere (I'm assuming that I cannot get to the car and/or the car is a total loss.)

Some background - I EDC a TL2, changing to a L2 (as soon as I find a cheap source - any suggestions?), I also EDC a folding knife, multi-tool, cell phone on my belt. I'm not worried about combat, doomsday scenarios, so no weapons/hunting... though I will definitely include OC spray just because of panic reaction causing stupid people to do stupid things. The location is dense city right alongside a major shopping mall. The cubicle space I'll be in will be very small - no room for a major pack and not private - must be relatively inconspicuous so no major tools (axe, prybar) can be included.

Starters for me would be a fixed blade knife, paracord, N95 mask, glasses (I wear contacts, I'm assuming that particles in the air means I have to ditch them), gloves and cell phone emergency boost batteries. I'm debating on secondary light sources (chemical or LED.) I'm thinking of possibly also a G2 with a SC. I watched the 9/11 tapes of the people evacuating down the stairs and was stunned by all the smoke in the air. Just thinking about having to hump myself down 20 flights under those conditions chills me. I'm also assuming no transportation necessary - I can walk home, but it will take most of the day. I'm also assuming home is intact (I do have evac kits at home just in case.) I'm also assuming that as part of the evac from the building, we pull the medical kits from the kitchen so small med needs are taken care of.

Suggestions kind friends?


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## Lunal_Tic (Feb 21, 2006)

Disposable evac mask would be nice. Evac-U8 

-LT


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## Sigman (Feb 21, 2006)

Maybe a whistle? 

I'd still throw in a small 1st aid kit. 

Pencil/pen/paper? 

Extra batteries? 

A few keychain lights to give away to others? 

Maybe a few protein/granola bars for the walk home or possibility of being holed up temporarily?


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## SJACKAL (Feb 21, 2006)

Would you care to invest in a parachute? If you know how to use it and is serious about surviving an attack/accident/disaster...

I know it sounds wild and crazy.... but when you recall those TV images of people jumping off buildings during fire...


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## dfred (Feb 21, 2006)

Blackbeagle said:


> ... though I will definitely include OC spray just because of panic reaction causing stupid people to do stupid things.


The use of OC in enclosed spaces has been known to _cause_ panics. At least one of those horrible nightclub stampedes in the last few years was touched-off by bouncers OCing somebody and the droplets wafting around the club. The sensation of not being able to breathe is just about guaranteed to cause panic in people... 




Lunal_Tic said:


> Disposable evac mask would be nice. Evac-U8
> 
> -LT



I second this recommendation. By maintaining your ability to breathe you have a much better chance of calmly exiting a smoke/fire situation without having to blindly run while trying not to breathe -- hopefully avoiding a panic situation in the first place. They are also a great idea when traveling, for any smoke/fire situation in planes or hotels. Here's a link to the manufacturer's page on them:

http://www.evacsafety.com/en/products/evacu8/index.html

When I first got mine a couple years ago I was traveling a lot for work. Initially I was worried that airport security would hassle me about the thing as it looks sorta strange. But I've never been asked once about it -- apparently it's carried by air crews and the security folks are quite familiar with them.


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## ACMarina (Feb 21, 2006)

Whistle is a fantastic idea. A nice pair of leather work gloves would be good, too. Food, water, snacks are always good. 

I'm guessing if you're in a highrise you're probably in some sort of business apparel, so I'd maybe toss in a pair of tennis shoes and athletic socks for that walk home. I hate dress shoes


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## parnass (Feb 21, 2006)

You will find this two part article, _Urban Preparation Kit_, of interest: 

http://outdoors-magazine.com/s_article.php?id_article=171


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## magic79 (Feb 21, 2006)

Unless you have your keys on you at all times (i.e. not in a jacket pocket that's in your office while you are in a meeting), put a spare car and house key in your BoB. 

For that matter, consider that if you leave your BoB in your office, there is a good chance you would not be able to retrieve it if you are in another office, on another floor, grabbing lunch in the cafeteria, in the bathroom, etc. A BoB that you cannot retrieve is worthless. 

Because of that, I've begun carrying a small BoB in my pants' cargo pocket at all times. This is the one I have:

http://www.countycomm.com/POCKETORGANIZER.htm

Best price on an L2 is OpticsHQ.com with membership ($5) and CPF discount coupon (CPF05).


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## BIGIRON (Feb 21, 2006)

Evac mask, dependable flashlight, whistle, leather gloves. Also one or two bottles of water with the "sport" top so you can rinse eyes if needed.

Frankly, if I worked on the 20th, I would have a parachute and a tool that could break a window.

I'm not particularly afraid to die, I'm just terrified that I might die like those poor folks on 911.


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## revolvergeek (Feb 21, 2006)

Lots of Cyalume chemical light sticks, however many that you can comfortably carry. 30 minute Hi-Intensity yellow and/or 8 hour green. The 30 minute yellows actually last much longer than that, and generally put out very usable light for a couple of hours. 

If you have to evac during a power failure they are worth their weight in gold. 
You can pop them and give them to some of the people around you and they are bright enough to keep them from trying to mob you for your flashlight. Works to keep people from crowding you during the evac, and then later my earn you some brownie points with your boss/coworkers for pre-planning. 

I spent a lot of time driving supplies into the area's hit by hurricane Rita, and you cannot imagine how much some of the deputies appreciated a handful of lightsticks. Most of them were stuck in utter darkness with nothing but personal (often very cheap) flashlights with limited batteries. Glowsticks allowed for 1) some minor personal lighting so they could see their immediate surroundings with no fire hazard and 2) visual location of where everybody was at a given moment.


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## bjn70 (Feb 21, 2006)

I would reconsider the prybar. If you work in a cube, then you could carry a briefcase, and a reasonable prybar would fit in a briefcase.


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## Makarov (Feb 21, 2006)

You should put your stuff in a bag that you hide inside a ordinary cardboard-box. Preferably a type that's already in your office-enviroment. That vould keep your gear inconspicious even in plain sight. This could reduce the danger of pilfering.

As the others said, bottled water, some dry food.
I would also suggest a spaceblanket, it'll work as a temporary shelter and keep you dry if it rains.

I don't have a bag stashed at work, but my "manpurse" (backpack) got a lot of the items mentioned here, sans the water and food(I'm currently looking into that)



Most of these items I carry because I actually need them, some are there for emergency purposes. Not in this picture is a emergency stove from Esbit that I recently purchased. (I have yet to test it, so I can't say how efficient it is.)


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## daloosh (Feb 21, 2006)

Good to think about, with the move to a new environment. My office bailout bag is packed similarly to my home kit, but contains less because 1) there's less space as you point out and 2) the city environment offers more to the resourceful than home. My BOB fits in the CountyComm bag we all know and love and sits in my desk drawer (locked at nite) behind some hanging files. It takes up about 7.5 inches of linear space in the drawer.

Here's a picture:








Here are the contents. The exact models changes over time, so examples are listed:
Multitool (wave, paratool, swisstool)
Folding knife (vesuvius, endura, grip)
Incandescent (E2e, Scorp, G2)
LED (Ultra-G, Arc AA, SL Jr.)
Tom's PSK (StarFlash mirror, 4X Fresnel magnifier, 18 inch duct tape, antiseptic swabs, alcohol swab, safety pins, hydrocortisone cream, antibacterial towelette, 24 inch double strand stainless steel wire)
Brunton compass
Lifeboat matches
Bic lighter
Fox 40 whistle
Stanley wonderbar II (7.5" long)
EVAC-U8 smoke hood
Rain poncho
Disposable hand warmers
Space blanket
Space bag (like a sleeping bag made of space blanket)
N-95 foldable respirator mask
Foxlabs pepper spray
Sudacon wipes
Flex cuffs
Small first aid kit
Small sewing kit
Soap/Purell/alcohol wipes
Binoculars (monocular)
Paracord (20-25ft x 2)
Batteries (123, AA, AAA, lithium AA)
H2O (pouches, treatment pills, filter)
Rite in the Rain pad
Fisher space pen
$1 coinlights
GMRS/FRS two way radio
AM/FM/SW radio
Cut resistant, heat resistant gloves
Cash

Some of the items are not in the bag, as I use them, but reside nearby, like the multitool, LED flashlight and knife. Well, OK, the cash part is always in short supply!

Of course my main worry is that I will not be near it, as we have three floors of the building, but I can't carry much on my body in the office environment and dress code. Similarly, you may not make it to the kitchen to get the first aid kit, so you should pack one. That's a different thread, but my small kit includes an Israeli bandage, compression gauze, an abdominal pad and quickclot. (Don't ask what the big kit at home contains!)

I considered a parachute, but my basic research identified several problems: 1) space needed (big backpack), 2) cost ($1000), 3) operational safety (not have enough space to open, snag on building projections, hit adjoining buildings). 

Well, that's my thoughts on the office BOB, best of luck!

daloosh

Makarov, you mean those little solid fuel bars that sit on a two-legged aluminum stand? Small, easy to use and boils water fine. Not much for cooking, tho.


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## Makarov (Feb 21, 2006)

daloosh said:


> Makarov, you mean those little solid fuel bars that sit on a two-legged aluminum stand? Small, easy to use and boils water fine. Not much for cooking, tho.


Yes that's right. I hoped to use it as a heather inside my "Fjellduk"(The camobag on the right in the picture) it's a kind of multiuse spaceblanket/poncho/tent thingy made for (and by) hunters. You can zip it up and temperature inside will rise due to the reflective material, but if it's well below freezing it won't be enough to be comfortable. They don't recommend using open flame inside, but I know for a fact that the developers do... 

I'm thinking about getting something else that would be a bit easier to use and more safe, tried to start a discussion about it earlier.


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## Lmtfi (Feb 21, 2006)

I would keep a high-rise BOB VERY small, compact and hands-free to carry. There is very little need that I can see for a bunch of tools and knives, blankets etc etc etc. There is considerable need for a mask to filter air in the event of smoke (I would have two), a bandana, a main light (with retention loop) and a long lasting back-up (common battery types), one set of spare batteries, one bottle of water, two granola bars, a 3x5 card with important contact numbers.

There is no precedent for needing a lot of "stuff" to evac a highrise - and 20 floors is do-able. A hefty bag of stuff is the LAST thing I'd want to have. (I have the CountyComm BOB pictured above and although its great - I would never use it as a high-rise evac bag - too bulky and hard to use hands-free.
CountyComm DOES have a new bag that I bought that I think would be right - their Mine Bag: http://www.countycomm.com/MINEBAG2.htm

You priority for a high-rise evac is finding an exit, alternate exit, dealing with smoke, seeing in the dark and getting out. Smoke is more likely to stop you than anything else. Stay lean, light and mean.


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## zespectre (Feb 21, 2006)

I think I agree with those who say a BOB for a highrise environment should be small and light. Your primary purpose(s) for this bag would be
1) Getting the heck out.
2) Getting found if you couldn't get the heck out.

I have a small emergency kit in the office that consists of...
-A pair of safety goggles (the mask type) 
-A couple of "Painters" breath masks (which might at least cut down on dust inhallation). 
-A couple of "baggies" of water (more for washing out eyes/throat vs drinking) 
-some good leather work gloves
-whistle
-a tiny (earbud type) AM/FM radio
-FRS/GMRS radio
-a good strong flashlight (Surefire 6P) with a spare set of batts

I considered tucking a small prybar in my desk too but there's a fire axe mounted right next to my office <grin>.


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## Lee1959 (Feb 21, 2006)

I would add 4 things having worked in this type of enviroment, and also factories where you could be out of areas you know very well. 

A headlamp with both white and red LED, since fire is a real possiblility you might be moving on hands and knees due to smoke higher up, flashlights are hard to use on hands and knees. Red because it helps cut smoke better, so they say I have not tried it. Also if you are moving debris or carrying someone, hands free is a godsend. 

A compass and a little black notebook. A good compass that can be used in a highly metal laden area, and a black book that you have used to recon and write down coordinates the stairs and exits of all posible areas you will be in, in that building. In a no light environment, fire, earthquake or any number of things, plane hit building!!!, things will look real different, especially if you are crawling to avoid smoke, a compass will help you find your direction as long as you know where things are from your location thru previous recon. 

4th is a spool of nylon duck decoy cord, it is small, lightweight and very strong, I prefer it to paracord, it has a 1000 uses from holding doors open or closed to make shift splint tying, to holding up something out of your way to get thru an exit.


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## dg (Feb 21, 2006)

I am curious as to what those of you who feel the need for this 'bob' would intend it to be used for?

Do you pack all this stuff just for your own use, or for using in helping others in the office? 
Do you don your single smoke mask, and shine your flashlights as you dart for the stairs, or do you give the mask to your female colleague and hang around directing everyone with your flashlight? 

If you are into preparedness and being equiped, then is it morally your job to help everyone who is less prepared, or should the company deal with this and you should just get out first for the sake of your family? 

The more gear you have, then the more it seem that you would intend to get involved in wider rescue activities.

Personally, I can't see the need for anything except perhaps a small flashlight, and an exit strategy.


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## ACMarina (Feb 21, 2006)

Well, the direct definition of the BOB is a bag to help you "Bug out", or get away, from whatever situation you need it for. Some situations might not need anything other than you, while others need more gear than anybody could possibly carry. These are things you'd have to decide for yourself..


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## magic79 (Feb 21, 2006)

I have been researching what to put in a BoB for a few weeks. At first, I was thinking along the lines of many folks with "what would happen if my building were hit like on 9/11?"

Then I realized I had a significantly better chance of winning the Lottery than having my building hit by terrorists.

So, my thinking turned toward what are the most _likely_ scenarios that I would need to evacuate (and it depends on location and frequency of natural disasters).

1. Fire in the building (most likely quite localized)
2. Gas leak or chemical leak (my company uses toxic chemicals)
3. Earthquake
4. Volcanic eruption
5. Flood

The first three would cause immediate evacuation, while the last two would afford more warning.

Then, I read a link someone left on CPF to a fellow in Seattle (sorry...can't find the link). Among other things, he said that when they had to evacuate due to the 2002 earthquake, they were not allowed back in the building due to possible structural damage. Fully HALF of the people had left their wallets, purses, and/or keys in the building!

I immediately added "car key, house key" to the list. Then I read about Katrina victims having trouble getting prescriptions: 3 days of my hypertension meds went in!

That's also when I realized that I'm OUT of my office 25% of the time in other parts of the building. If the fire or chemical alarm went off, it wouldn't matter what was in my BoB because I wouldn't be able to get to it.

And, I think that's a very important point. If you are in the can when the alarm goes off, your BoB is useless sitting under your desk.

As others have said, something small that you can carry the absolute essentials all the time is necessary if you are truly serious.


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## dfred (Feb 21, 2006)

dg said:


> Personally, I can't see the need for anything except perhaps a small flashlight, and an exit strategy.



Some of the building evacuation items suggested here do seem slightly excessive and/or impractical to me as well... :duck:

However I'd argue that "exit strategy" includes the items to make escape feasible... The original question, as I understand it, is simply evacuation from a tall building. To that end something to allow breathing and sight (smoke hood) would seem a necessity since smoke and fire are probably the most likely things to hamper escape in a variety of scenarios. Even if the smoke isn't killing people outright, the chemicals released in fires are extremely nasty and can cause lingering health problems. 

On the issue of who and how you help during a crisis, I'd guess it would be highly situational. In general though I don't believe that one is morally required to give-up a survival item to save a stranger when it would mean one's own death. By being prepared and protecting myself I am better able to help others. I have no rescue training, but if it was feasible for me to guide/carry/drag somebody else out I definitely would try. It's like when they tell you in the planes to put your own O2 mask on first before helping others. If you blackout you're no use to anyone...


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## dfred (Feb 21, 2006)

magic79 said:


> Then, I read a link someone left on CPF to a fellow in Seattle (sorry...can't find the link). Among other things, he said that when they had to evacuate due to the 2002 earthquake, they were not allowed back in the building due to possible structural damage. Fully HALF of the people had left their wallets, purses, and/or keys in the building!




This is a very good point... I was in Seattle for that earthquake. The only injuries at my company were several people hurting themselves while running down the stairs -- twisted ankles, minor falls, etc. As they say, walk don't run. Take stock of the situation and then act...

And something people seem to be forgetting is that skyscrapers tend to be in cities. So barring absolute societal collapse you can buy most items once you get outside. So perhaps _always_ keeping $20-40 on your person would be the best insurance policy of all.


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## SJACKAL (Feb 22, 2006)

dg said:


> Do you pack all this stuff just for your own use, or for using in helping others in the office?
> Do you don your single smoke mask, and shine your flashlights as you dart for the stairs, or do you give the mask to your female colleague and hang around directing everyone with your flashlight?



Will N95 mask work for smoke? If so maybe you could buy a box of them and put it in the office with those $1 keychian lights, everyone could grab one on their way out.


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## John N (Feb 22, 2006)

magic79 said:


> Then, I read a link someone left on CPF to a fellow in Seattle (sorry...can't find the link). Among other things, he said that when they had to evacuate due to the 2002 earthquake, they were not allowed back in the building due to possible structural damage. Fully HALF of the people had left their wallets, purses, and/or keys in the building!



That would be Schwert, who hangs out on the equipped.org forum. Here are the articles he wrote on his kit:

http://outdoors-magazine.com/s_article.php?id_article=171
http://outdoors-magazine.com/s_article.php?id_article=172 

-john

Edit: Oops. I see that Parnas has already posted it.


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## John N (Feb 22, 2006)

Don't have time to write much right now, but a couple of quick things.

I'd reconsider the crowbar. If the building is damaged by earthquake or fire, you probably are going to want a way to open doors that have been tweaked by the movement, or that are locked, etc. I keep one in a duffle under my desk. They come in different sizes, so you can simply downscale until you have one that works for you. For example, a 9" fits in the main compartment of a Maxpedition Jumbo w/o sticking out...

Non-flamable, heavy duty work gloves. In case of fire, you don't want your glove to melt to your hand... Something cut resistant for handling debris.

Get the EvacU8. While not perfect, it should be much better than the N95 masks which won't do anything for toxic gasses and carbon monoxide. Probably wouldn't hurt to have some folding N95s for dust once you clear the building.

First aid kit. Good idea to have one on your person. Something geared more towards more serious stuff - burns, cuts, that sort of thing. Serious trama bandages like the First Care Products Emergency Bandage come to mind. I wouldn't count on getting to the supplied kits, and even then there may not be what you need.

I'd try to get in the habit of carrying some drinking water around with you.

Whistle.

Sensible shoes.

-john


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## Makarov (Feb 22, 2006)

dg said:


> I am curious as to what those of you who feel the need for this 'bob' would intend it to be used for?
> 
> Do you pack all this stuff just for your own use, or for using in helping others in the office?
> Do you don your single smoke mask, and shine your flashlights as you dart for the stairs, or do you give the mask to your female colleague and hang around directing everyone with your flashlight?
> ...


You have some valid questions here, but the fact remains that if your prepared you're in a better shape to help yourself AND others. I'm trained as a paramedic, and the mantra from my instructors were "your own safety first". If you get wounded or killed, who will rescue those in need. Will the coworker you give the smokemask remember to check the bathroom or copyroom for people before evacuating?

The single most important thing in preparedness is your mindset, if you have thought things trough beforehand that's a lot more than most people do. 
My thought is that it won't hurt to have some gear ready.


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## daloosh (Feb 22, 2006)

I'm with Mak here. Do you need everything you got, or packed or bought? Most probably not. But you don't know what you need and chance favors the prepared, right? I think it's shortsighted to say I just need to get out of the building (which BTW isn't the limits of the original question). What happens when you get out? All you got is a flashlight and a mask, neither of which will do you much good outside the building in the daytime.

In the building, you may need more than that, like a small prybar to get out the door, or gloves to move broken furniture or glass. Outside, you may need to stay warm or you realize you are hurt and need first aid.

If you think about the next potential steps, at least you've done that much and can survive and help out in an emergency. How you help out is according to your personal choices and training, but just having a level head and a plan is going to help others around you.

I look at our bailout bags as an exercise in planning, and the costs like insurance. You spend a lot for health insurance, home insurance, car insurance and hope to never use it. This is no different. And you can always ditch something, but if you don't have it to begin with, you got squat.

stay safe,
daloosh


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## Mike Painter (Feb 22, 2006)

bjn70 said:


> I would reconsider the prybar. If you work in a cube, then you could carry a briefcase, and a reasonable prybar would fit in a briefcase.


If you consider a prybar - forget it and consider a slightly larger 
multi-tool.


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## John N (Feb 22, 2006)

Good point. Actually, I'd lean towards a Hooligan Bar personally.

-john


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## magic79 (Feb 22, 2006)

I posted a review of the CountyComm.com Bail Out Bag, along with what I keep in it, here: https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/108475

I keep mine in my Yukon in the parking lot since there is a strong chance that I would have to evacuate and not be able to get to my office to get it.


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## Lmtfi (Feb 22, 2006)

I suggest against building an urban BOB with crowbars/prybars or other heavy equipment. Respectfully - load up with lots of hardware for every emergency scenario and you have a much better chance of being the best-equipped person who never got out of the building. 

Don't Rambo your BOB. Essentials...essentials...essentials.


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## Mike Painter (Feb 22, 2006)

John N said:


> Good point. Actually, I'd lean towards a Hooligan Bar personally.
> -john



At nine pounds and 30 inches for the baby hooligan or Halligan as the more common name around here is not as carry friendly and does not have the cutting ability or the gas shutoff valve that the Biel does.
It is also harder to cut sheet metal with.


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## Joe Talmadge (Feb 22, 2006)

magic79 said:


> For that matter, consider that if you leave your BoB in your office, there is a good chance you would not be able to retrieve it if you are in another office, on another floor, grabbing lunch in the cafeteria, in the bathroom, etc. A BoB that you cannot retrieve is worthless.



Graphic illustration of that, in a non-emergency: I work in a tiny two-story building. I was in a meeting room downstairs when the fire alarm went off, and we all shuffled outside. So, standing there in the heat, it occurred to me I could just drive home or to somewhere to eat ... except that all my stuff, including car keys, was upstairs in my office, and I couldn't have gone upstairs to get it. Now, at minimum, I take my car keys and my USB drive with critical data with me, even if it's just for a meeting downstairs. This particular fire drill lasted like 45 minutes, they had trouble turning it off for some reason, and I had the pleasure of standing in 90+ degree heat just for lack of a little foresight. 

If you're going to bother to put together a building evac BOB, it's gotta be small enough to carry on you ... something that fits into your laptop bag, say.


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## Perel (Mar 5, 2006)

daloosh said:


> I considered a parachute, but my basic research identified several problems: 1) space needed (big backpack), 2) cost ($1000), 3) operational safety (not have enough space to open, snag on building projections, hit adjoining buildings).


Seriously, rapelling gear seems like it would be a much better idea than a parachute for a 'plan C' evacuation of a highrise.


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## BlueGerbil (Mar 5, 2006)

In your room:

- something to attach a rope to

In your desk: 

- something to break the window
- a rope long enough to reach "safe ground"
- climbing gear w/ rappeling device
- working gloves
- proper training to use that stuff
- some small light (SF 6P) w/ spares
- mask in the event of fire
- some bottled water

On you:

- key for your car and your home
- USB stick w/ essential data
- cell phone
- multitool
- small light (AAA)


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## Cmoore (Mar 5, 2006)

I would seriously consider a smoke hood such as one of these:

http://www.aeromedix.com/?_siteid=aeromedix&_sessid=a83517bc981462ab6def09f444b1c81e&action=sku&sku=evac1


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## abvidledUK (Mar 5, 2006)

Don't restrict yourself to one BOB, have one in car, one in office, smaller one in office, etc

Smokes the killer, have face mask and goggles.

Oven gloves too, the type with fingers.


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## Makarov (Mar 5, 2006)

Hmm, seems like a lot of people recommend the EVAC-U8, shouldn't we look into doing a GB for these, trying to buy directly from the manufacturer?


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## Perel (Mar 5, 2006)

I would be in for several..


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## TacticalGrilling (Mar 7, 2006)

Ever see THESE ? Very trick piece of kit to satisfy your needs. Also, what about duct tape? Too many uses not to be in there. Just tape about 10 yards around your nalgene bottle. Toss a couple carabiners on the outside and throw a riggers belt in there, too. Climbing rope will be a bit much to fit in the bags you've described, but hopefully responders could handle this. Might want to check out Jumbo Versipack or DevilDog from Maxpedition, too. Great bags.


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## daloosh (Mar 8, 2006)

Prybabies are great, small useful tools!
daloosh


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## pathalogical (Mar 9, 2006)

20 floors eh ? I hope I'm not offending but, are you physically fit ? Have you used the stairs to go to your office or are you going to use the elevator every single day ? My suggestion is start getting used to the stairs. Use the stairs 2 or 3 times a week. Use a stopwatch to time yourself; from when you enter the building to when you sit at your desk and from your desk back outside. It will give an idea of how long it will take you to exit. You must also try running up and down the stairs, see what the difference in time is then. You will have to allow more time during actual escape because of other people who will panic and 'be in your way'. Count how many steps per landing in case your vision is impared/obstructed. I'm sure the floor numbers are marked. Is there only one way out of your office, note any alternate exits from office. After seeing a documentary about the bombing of the WTC in '93, they installed reflective tape on the stairs and handrails, this makes your flashlight even more useful. Does the building owner/management practice fire drills ? Make suggestions for possible improvement. I remember in grade school how they made us line up at the door before we left the classroom. People in panic mode will not follow rules or any kind of order. It would be nice to help some people along the way, but you can't help everyone. Having said that, the best way to help others is by spreading the word. Encourage others to carry a flashlight, this will greatly reduce panic. Explain to others what a B.O.B. is. I think bringing extra stuff to hand out to others is a bad idea. They will just mob you for anything else you have.

Being prepared means thinking about what might happen, which means you are already prepared.


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## pathalogical (Mar 9, 2006)

SJACKAL said:


> Will N95 mask work for smoke? If so maybe you could buy a box of them and put it in the office with those $1 keychian lights, everyone could grab one on their way out.


Good idea but, people will just steal the stuff or just get locked in some cabinet where only one person has they key and will be nowhere to be found when the stuff is really needed.


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## Blackbeagle (Mar 10, 2006)

I ordered a BOB from CountyComm. Looks like too many people got hired, we had to expand to another floor. We're going to take a look at the space sometime next week so I'll get a better feel for just how much cubicle space I end up with to work with. Regular fire drills are scheduled but it still looks to be a bear - two stairwells for the building means evac will be slow and likely to be pretty smokey in real life. The company actually sponsors a fitness program and yeah, some of the staff actually go up and down using the stairs - killer way to get in shape, but it is cheap and always available.


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## beezaur (Mar 10, 2006)

pathalogical said:


> 20 floors eh ? I hope I'm not offending but, are you physically fit ? . . .



Thinking about evacuating a smoky building reminds me of some work I did wearing a respirator a while ago. It was the full face kind with two large filters, one screwed on each side of the mask.

Despite the fact that I could suck enough air through the filters, it was pretty hard to breathe. I kept getting out of breath and having to stop working. Steady deep breathing worked the best. Because of the way the fluid dynamics of air moving through a filter works, you get more air in easier when you breathe in slower and deeper.

I haven't tried one, but don't think it would be real easy to breathe through a small emergency respirator like an Evacu-8.

Just something to think about. You should count on having a reduced physical capacity during evacuation, either for smoke or for a respirator.

Scott


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## pathalogical (Mar 10, 2006)

beezaur said:


> Thinking about evacuating a smoky building reminds me of some work I did wearing a respirator a while ago. It was the full face kind with two large filters, one screwed on each side of the mask.
> 
> Despite the fact that I could suck enough air through the filters, it was pretty hard to breathe. I kept getting out of breath and having to stop working. Steady deep breathing worked the best. Because of the way the fluid dynamics of air moving through a filter works, you get more air in easier when you breathe in slower and deeper.
> 
> ...


Hmm, interesting comments. I have some N95's just for home use. Breathing does get a bit laboured with these as well, slow and steady makes it easier to breathe. It also tends to fog up my eyeglasses ! I just Googled the Evacu-8 smoke hood and it allows 15 minutes of breathing. I did not know this. Check the first of my two consecutive posts. Interesting how I suggested timing yourself going up/down stairs at your normal pace and running up and down prior to the Google search. If it takes you more than 15 minutes, maybe two might be better to have than one.

http://www.safetycentral.com/evsmokhood.html


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## beezaur (Mar 10, 2006)

I think 90% of the battle with smoke and escaping through it is irritants.

A few breaths of stinging smoke will make you pretty much unable to breathe. If you can't get out of it I think you pretty much choke to death. Most things that will irritate your tissue can be filtered out pretty easily with a regular respirator like you can get at Sears -- the filters with the yellow and purple sticker for example.

Carbon monoxide is tricky to remove. It requires special chemicals in the filter which I think is the reason behind the 15 minute rating on the Evacu-8. After that the filter is basically reduced to an ordinary particulate filter.

I have often wondered just how much carbon monoxide (CO) you could breathe before it takes you down, all other smoke effects aside. I mean, suppose you just have the yellow/purple filter or a worn out/expired Evacu-8. Would you make it down 20 stories of stairs before you passed out from CO poisoning?

I don't mean to say you don't need a CO-capable respirator. I just wonder, realistically, how much escape is possible with a plain respirator filter?

Scott


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