# Surefire Commander Rechargeable owners



## ebow86 (Jun 22, 2011)

I just got a brand new Surefire 8AX commander, my question is pretty simple, what exactly is the little piece of round foam that fell out of the barrel when I took out the battery? It looks like it might have something to do with the tailcap, not really sure. Should I reinsert this little foam piece or leave it out?


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## oldways (Jun 22, 2011)

Mine never had any foam that i know of. It works fine. The 8AX is a good light.


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## ebow86 (Jun 22, 2011)

oldways said:


> Mine never had any foam that i know of. It works fine. The 8AX is a good light.



Are you close to your's? If so maybe you could do me a favor by looking down the barrell of the light and seeing if there is any small round piece of foam on the inside of the tailcap switch. Without the foam piece in place you should be able to see the inside of the rubber switch.


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## oldways (Jun 22, 2011)

OK I looked. No foam, just the inside of the switch boot(black) and the white plastic? disc.


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## ebow86 (Jun 22, 2011)

oldways said:


> OK I looked. No foam, just the inside of the switch boot(black) and the white plastic? disc.



That's a million. Any ideas what the little round piece of foam might be? I know size15's would know.


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## oldways (Jun 22, 2011)

Dont have a clue. Mine is several years old and never had any foam. I would toss the foam and enjoy the light.


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## ebow86 (Jun 22, 2011)

Well I'm screwed. I was afraid of this happening and it did. Mine has come with the old charger that dosen't blink green when the cycle is complete, it just a constant green light. Ohhh man, now what?


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## DimeRazorback (Jun 22, 2011)

Call Surefire.


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## ebow86 (Jun 22, 2011)

This is strange. On the bottom of the charger it states that the green light will blink when fully charged. I have had the pack on charger for close to 3 hrs, no blinking light. I have also tried taking the battery out and snapping it back in, no effect. Mmmm...


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## oldways (Jun 22, 2011)

Mine does the same. It charges fine. I have charged the B90s many times with no problems.


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## Size15's (Jun 22, 2011)

I've no idea about the foam - any chance of a photo please?

(The only 8-Series light I have is an 8NX)


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## ebow86 (Jun 22, 2011)

Size15's said:


> I've no idea about the foam - any chance of a photo please?
> 
> (The only 8-Series light I have is an 8NX)


 
sorry no camera. I have searched every thread on the CN400 charger. What's baffling me is why does the bottom of the charger say " will blink when fully charged" if this is indeed the oldest model that doesn't blink? Any chance you can fill me in on what might be going on with my charger Al?


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## Size15's (Jun 22, 2011)

I think this issue of the charge not blinking has been raised before. Perhaps in a 10X thread?
Its all bit of a mystery to me I'm afraid.


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## Mike 208 (Jun 22, 2011)

I have the older model (8X), and it came with a green piece of felt that went inside the barrel ontop of the switch. I honestly don't know why it's there (my 6R and 9AX did not come with the felt), but it doesn't interfere with the lights' operation. As was already suggested, call Surefire and see what they have to say about this.


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## angelofwar (Jun 22, 2011)

The old chargers were 12 hr chargers ebow...sorry... I have 3 different chargers for my B65's. 2 of the newer one's that start off red, turn green when "good enough to use" and blink when fully charged. My 2nd oldest one (a laser products version) just stays on green (for about 12 hours) and blinks when done (i.e. an "overnight" charger). My oldest, also a LP one, doesn't even have a cradle, just two plugs on wires the connect to the ends of the batteries...I don't even think this one has a light.

But, I seriuosly think you have the 12 hour charger. Pic's of the top and bottom of the charger might help. The foam thing sounds like a "shipping-plug" for the battery??? Just a guess.


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## ebow86 (Jun 22, 2011)

Ok here's the result of my testing so far

Completly discharged battery placed in charger 6:10 PM
Green light comes on approx 7:30 PM (didn't catch exact time it switched over)
Left battery sit on charger approx 1 more hour, no blinking green light


Runtime test
Run 1- 10 min
Run 2- 10 min
Run 3- 15 min (light is starting to yellow slightly)
Run 4- 12 min (getting very yellow now)
Run 5- 3 min (battery is dead completly)

So I got 50 minutes on the dot. Now, compairing my results with siverfox's in this graph, http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?71750-SureFire-B90-Battery-Performance
It looks to be like I got the same results as his "incomplete charge" test run, he got nearly 52 min 
With his fully charged run, he got nearly 57 minutes.

I read that when the green light comes on the charger that mean the battery has gotten approx 85% charge, with the remaining 15% being feed whenever the green light starts to blink

Since my charger is only going to a solid green and not blinking green even after an extended period on time on the charger, I believe there is a posibility that I am only recieveing an 85% charge, I dont own a voltage meter so I can clarify anything.
Lets assume for a moment that I have the older charger that doesn't switch to a blinking green light when fully charged, then why does the sticker on the bottom of the charger clearly say "green light will blink when fully charged"? Doesn't make sense. I will wait to hear from more members here before I contact surefire and sort things out.


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## angelofwar (Jun 22, 2011)

Another thing ebow that occured to me, it sounds like the battery may need some conditioning...


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## ebow86 (Jun 22, 2011)

angelofwar said:


> Another thing ebow that occured to me, it sounds like the battery may need some conditioning...



Whats the best method for doing this, completly discharging then recharging again?


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## angelofwar (Jun 22, 2011)

Yeah, run it through a few charge cycles (4-5 depending on condition of the cell). Also, about every 4-6 months run it down completely (1 volt / cell = dead), so, say for example, the B65 will stop powering a P60 at around 4.85. It's made of 4ea. 2/3A cells, so, every once in awhile, I need to discharge it (run-it-down) to about 4 volts (1 volt per cell), to help maintain a "healthy" balance of chemical reactions.

Hope this helps, and let us know if you can get the B90 back in operating condition!


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## ebow86 (Jun 22, 2011)

Well the light was brand new factory sealed with I recieved it today, so I'm not sure why I'm having these issues.


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## angelofwar (Jun 22, 2011)

How long was it sitting in the storage area??? or since it left SF??? Exactly. LOL! The nicads are testing for functionality before leaving SF, but Ni-Cad's lose there charge over time, and it's recommended in the manual to run it through 3-4 charge cycles before it's ready for use.


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## Meganoggin (Jun 23, 2011)

AOW has hit the nail on the head - cycle the B90's through a few charge / discharge's and they should perform better. And yes the charger takes ages to fully charge a B90.

However, once it is working right you will love it, mine came with a car charger, which is really useful on long trips away from home.


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## SilverFox (Jun 23, 2011)

Hello Ebow86,

The main problem with battery packs is that the cells that make it up may be out of balance.

With a new light, put the battery pack on the charger and let it charge for 24 hours. By that time the green light should be blinking.

If you monitor the temperature of the pack while charging, all the cells should warm up evenly. If one cell is cooler, it is out of balance and under charged. The extra time spent on trickle charge, after the main charge, serves to balance the cells and bring them all up to the same state of charge.

If you charge the pack for 24 hours and the green light never gets to the blinking stage, you may have issues with your battery. These chargers usually don't have problems, but there is also the remote possibility that the charger is the problem, but that is highly unlikely. The most likely problem with be a cell in the battery pack.

To revive the cells in the battery pack, you should use a volt meter to monitor your progress. Using the light until it goes out can reverse charge a cell and cause damage. It is much better to follow your progress using a voltmeter.

Tom


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## angelofwar (Jun 23, 2011)

SilverFox said:


> Using the light until it goes out can reverse charge a cell and cause damage.



Even with a NiCad???


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## ebow86 (Jun 23, 2011)

Thank you everyone for your help. Great news, the charger, for whatever reason, is blinking now. I left one cell on since early this morning and it's is not showing a full charge with blinking green light. I will go ahead and leave it on the charger for another 24 hours. Then tomorrow I will run the light down, not all the way, and give it another charge.


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## ebow86 (Jun 23, 2011)

One other thing, what's the longest amount of time that I should leave the battery on the charger? Will leaving it over 24 hrs do any harm? I also have a 10X dominator that I would like to "recondition", when I'm discharging the B20 and B90 batteries, how far down should I run them since I don't have a voltage meter?


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## angelofwar (Jun 23, 2011)

General rule, is once the light starts to get noticeably dim (from "white" to "yellow" for incans, if that makes sense)


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## ampdude (Jun 24, 2011)

I have an old charger for the smaller B65 batteries which I use with three different batteries, so old it has a Laser Products marked wall wart. It's worked fine for me. And when the batteries are only slightly discharged, it seems to act like a smart charger and only charge for a short while until the light turns green. I keep hearing about people saying the old chargers cook the batteries, or otherwise ruin them, but I've never had a problem with mine. I really love the incan glory of a P60 or P61 on rechargeables. Really nice knowing I don't always have to use primaries with them. P60's are so cheap and plentiful I never had to worry about how I use them. In a cheap G2 with an AN14 extender for use around the house, perfect!


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## angelofwar (Jun 24, 2011)

ampdude said:


> I have an old charger for the smaller B65 batteries which I use with three different batteries, so old it has a Laser Products marked wall wart. It's worked fine for me. And when the batteries are only slightly discharged, it seems to act like a smart charger and only charge for a short while until the light turns green. I keep hearing about people saying the old chargers cook the batteries, or otherwise ruin them, but I've never had a problem with mine. I really love the incan glory of a P60 or P61 on rechargeables. Really nice knowing I don't always have to use primaries with them. P60's are so cheap and plentiful I never had to worry about how I use them. In a cheap G2 with an AN14 extender for use around the house, perfect!



Ditto...first time I fired up a G2 with a B65, I was like "Wow...such beautiful, FREE light...". I acquired 20 B65's in Iraq for $3 a pop. So, I'm set for awhile. I think you may be the only other CPF'er I've heard of amp that still uses B65 on a regular basis. I have 5 or 6 lights set-up to use them, and 4 chargers :devil:


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## ampdude (Jun 25, 2011)

Yep, I'm old school. Hey, I still have LP's.


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## ebow86 (Jun 25, 2011)

I'm really enjoying the light right now. I'll admit that the overall output won't blow your socks off or anything, and I wish the beam was a little whiter, it's definitely on the yellow side, even hot off the charger. However, I always wanted a commander rechargeable, particular the 8NX, but I couldn't justify how high of a price surefire was asking. With the news of discontinuation, I knew I had to get one fast. To be honest I always overlooked the 8AX, I felt it carried too much of a price difference over the nitrolon 8NX to justify the price, so I never payed much attention to it. When a certain store had them on discount, I knew this was my time to act. I got it for $110 brand new, factory sealed, which is a hell of a deal IMO, especially considering the fact that just a few months ago they were going for around $220 new. Normally I would have gone for the 8NX, but there was only a $10 difference between the HA 8AX and the 8NX. Plus I had intentions on turboheading it and the only 8NX's available were OD green and yellow, which I figured wouldn't look that great with a black turbohead attached, so the 8AX was the obvious choice.

I have a KT5 HA turbohead on the way now and I'm very excited. I have heard very good things about the N5 LA and I can't wait to put it to the test. I'm going to try and see if I can borrow a camera long enough to take a few pics of my newest addition and post them here for you guys to check out.


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## lumen aeternum (Oct 6, 2012)

FYI Surefire recently emailed me this:

"the 8AX Commander products have been discontinued however there will be some form of upgrade program offered in the future that will be offered online through our website. We have not set a date yet so please subscribe to our email listing for updates."

My instructions for the B90 battery say:

" CN400 rapid smart chargers will not overcharge a B90 battery even if left in the charger for extended periods. however, routinely charging for over 3 hours in a C300 charger (discontinued model) will result in overcharging and reduced battery life. Recharge time using either charger is approxiately two hours."


How many hours is the 110 Lumen xenon X80 lamp supposed to last?

Anyone recall which LED heads fit the 8AX? I have an old scribbled note that says "KL-7-HA-WH digital"

And I would think that by now someone must have figured out a way to make up the equivalent or better of the B90 battery pack from cells?


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