# One man's search for the ideal bushwalking headlamp and other lights



## Ent (Jun 28, 2011)

Hi

Well having lurked and asked and had answered a few questions time to add back to this great forum. I have a passion for bushwalking and like good gear, lights especially so have been trawling the web looking for options. I tend to use a shot gun approach and buy various things until I find something that works for me. That is a key phrase, "something that works for me". With bushwalking some people think a button battery lamp is all that is required while for me something dragged off a night fighting WW1 warship is more my style.:thumbsup:

Ok primary criteria are reliability, water resistance, simple controls, weight, depth and spread of beam, run time and comfort. Some of the above are compatible while others are contrary to each other. But that is to be expected as the best headlamp is the compromises that suit me. I left out cost as while I will haggle and bemoan price at the end of the day quality is long remembered after price is forgotten.

Ok starters are the old school lights that I have had for a few years.

Princeton-Tec Corona (3 x AA)
Princeton-Tec Quad (3 x AAA)
Princeton-Tec EOS (3 x AAA)
Princeton-Tec Apex Extreme (8 x AA)
Brunton 3W Luxeon L3 (4 x AA or 4 x C)
Kathmandu light (Category killer outdoor shop chain) (3 x AA)

New school starters (Just brought)

Zebralight 31 (1 x CR123A)
Zebralight H51 (1 x AA)
Black Diamond Storm (4 x AAA)
Surefire Saint (1 x CR1234A, 3 x CR123A, 2 x AA)
Spark ST5 XML (1 x AA, 1 x 14500)
Spark ST6 ST6-460NW (1 x 18650, 2 x CR123A)
ITP-01 (1 x AAA)

Other lights

Spark SL6-800CW (1 x 18650, 2 x CR123A)
Black Diamond Apollo (4 x AA)
Jetbeam Raptor RTT0 V5 (1 x CR123A, 1 AA)
Fenix LD01 72 Lumen model (1 x AAA)
Fenix LD01 77 Stainless steel model (1 x AAA) (brought two but one is a gift)
Leatherman S2 (1 x AAA)
Jetbeam 140 Lumen (1 x AA)

And of course battery chargers required.

1 x ANSMANN Energy 8 professional - battery charger /tester (had for few years)
1 x Maha Powerex C808M Ultimate Pro Charger (charge AA/AAA/C/D) (808)
1 x Maha Powerex MH-C9000 WizardOne AA/AAA Battery Charger Analyzer (9000)
1 x ML-101 18650 USB charger
1 x Tenergy RCR123A two port charger for their 900 mAH cells, were four now three. Learning experience. Do not brawl with packaging when the floor is tiles!

As you might be able to guess I am looking for a primary and secondary light that can run on the same battery. Great to see that most lights can run on more than one cell type which makes life easier to achieve this. I am looking forward to the revised streamline AA option for the Saint that is been promised. Rather disappointed though that Jetbeam have not used the excellent controls and voltage regulation system from the RTT0 V5 in a headlamp. That would make for one very handy lamp that with a skilful battery box cover any battery type.

So we have the AAA, AA, CR123A and 18650 options covered. In earlier posts on different threads my preference is for a twin AA powered light but such a beast is not out their with the exception of the rather bulky battery pack on the Saint.

Now to nail the right combination for me.

Cheers


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## robostudent5000 (Jun 28, 2011)

have you ordered/own all the "new school" starters? and if not, are you planning to?


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## Ent (Jun 28, 2011)

robostudent5000 said:


> have you ordered/own all the "new school" starters? and if not, are you planning to?



Yeap just brought and turned up.


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## robostudent5000 (Jun 28, 2011)

Ent said:


> Yeap just brought and turned up.


 
wow. that is extremely thorough (almost every possible battery type covered) and shows an impressive level of commitment to finding what you want. 
i will be expecting a full report of the side by side by side by side by side by side by side comparison very soon.


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## Ent (Jun 28, 2011)

robostudent5000 said:


> wow. that is extremely thorough (almost every possible battery type covered) and shows an impressive level of commitment to finding what you want.
> i will be expecting a full report of the side by side by side by side by side by side by side comparison very soon.



That is the aim. To do justice it will be many walks




Given the two Zebralights, Storm and ITP a test run on a two day, one night walk. Injury to fellow walker meant night walk was cancelled so more just camping type workout.

Cheers


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## aimxplode (Jun 28, 2011)

I love my Jetbeam RRT-0. Are you a redditor by any chance?


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## Ent (Jun 28, 2011)

aimxplode said:


> Are you a redditor by any chance?



You have me on that term? To quote one of Australia's less promising politicians, "please explain".

Cheers


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## aimxplode (Jun 28, 2011)

Ent said:


> You have me on that term? To quote one of Australia's less promising politicians, "please explain".
> 
> Cheers


 
Hehe, Reddit is a site where users can submit and vote on interesting stories/ideas/articles. Your username 'ent' is referred alot within groups on that site, originating from a character from Lord of the Rings. Seeing your username, I just felt I had to ask if you were a Redditor .


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## Ent (Jun 28, 2011)

aimxplode said:


> Hehe, Reddit is a site where users can submit and vote on interesting stories/ideas/articles. Your username 'ent' is referred alot within groups on that site, originating from a character from Lord of the Rings. Seeing your username, I just felt I had to ask if you were a Redditor .



No but I am a Lord of the Rings fan. Ents are my favourite creatures of that world. My height, size and dare a say long and rousing style of correspondence sort of fits the profile as well. Also Ent is generally one of the shortest user names so easy for me to remember. Given the success of the books I am surprised it does not feature more in users names so nice to come to site where it has not already been used.

Cheers


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## Ent (Jun 28, 2011)

Um? Not what I am use to uploading images so I will be image-less.

Ok lets start with the old school that did not make the cut. The first been the Princeton Tec Apex Extreme. This was suppose to be the great light hope but crashed and burned for many reason.

1. The battery pack is not water proof.
2. The battery pack is eight cells of two parallel banks each with four cells in series but the contacts were unreliable with the bigger flat topped rechargeable so you never knew if one or two banks were working.
3. The main beam had an unpleasant tint and "sun spots" with a hole in the middle. Not a good light but the beam was a thrower.
4. The four LED had the same overly bluish tint and did not match well with the main beam.
5. Would start on high and then had to be cycled through all the modes.

The big issue was the mismatch between the main beam and four LEDs. I would lend it to people for night walks and they would find the main beam so bright and focused that they could not see the ground in front of them and if they looked at something close they were blinded and struggled even more to see their feet. They then tried the four LEDs and the light was just acceptable but they lost the distance to spot markers. It quickly became frustrating switching between the beams and after a while it wound up as been used as a massively over weight Quad.

Nice idea poorly executed. Not one of Princeton-Tec's finest design moments. Amazing that it is still been sold. Every kid loved the look as they felt like a serious search and rescue person. Actually the remote battery pack meant it sat well on the head so might have suited the smaller child's head. Very sexy light but failure in the bush.

Cheers


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## JA(me)S (Jun 28, 2011)

This is going to be an interesting read...

 - Jas.

To post pics, you have to use an image hosting service - I use ImageShack (just out of habit - if others have better, please let me know). Just make sure the images are a max of 800 x 800 to conform with CPF rules.


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## nick-nack (Jun 29, 2011)

You can also use Flickr or photobucket. I find photobucket easier to upload images with but I prefer Flickr because its more user friendly as far as sorting pictures.


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## Ent (Jul 2, 2011)

Continuing with what did not work last time with the old school head lamps. This is the Bruntom one. 

This is a 3 watt single beam heasdlamp. It has the advantage starting low and then going high along with the option to run on four AA or four C depending on the battery packs used. The AA is split into two doubles and despite the weight of the the four AA does as remarkable good job of spreading the load using a single head band strap. In fact the slim line battery pack concept would be a good one for any headlamp with remote battery pack to follow. The C battery pack is a clip on belt type.

It has a good beam clear of noticeable issue but tends strongly to the blue spectrum. In fact it matches very well with my Cygolite Cross beam so tends to do duty as a jerryrigged headlamp on my bicycle helmet.

The biggest issue is build quality or more accurately lack off. The C battery pack fell apart and the replacement stop working but a piece of copper in the bottom fixed the issue of a broken or loose bit. The double AA battery packs will implode and chuck batteries if bumped too hard. The connector is rather indifferent and sometimes works, sometime does not work. This has all happened under rather light use and never been out in the rain.

Also the single beam is not really suitable in spread to make a light that you can walk by. On the bike the Cross beams give the spread so you can use the Brunton on the helmet to pick up more distant objects to avoid.

In all very poor plastic means it is better suited to light duty. It is not a light I would like to subject to a winter rain storm. Sadly Brunton has lost the plot as once they were a wonderful brand name and I still carry as my most trusted item a USA made compass from them.

Cheers


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## Ent (Jul 8, 2011)

Hi All

To break away from the headlamps themselves this post looks at the fuel sources for them. On an eight day walk using lithium AAs brought in Australia the bill was $100 for the twenty batteries consumed. Yeap, we get charged about five dollars a AA or AAA for that matter. So battery life and the use of rechargeables will play a big factor in the choice.

I must admit I am rather tempted by the CR123A battery factor as it offers very impressive lumen rating with small size and reasonable run time. The trouble in Australia is they cost anything from six to twenty dollars per battery while in the USA at around $1.20 to $1.60 per battery bulk bought. As mentioned AA and AAA lithium are very expensive as well. This means rechargeable options are worthwhile examining.

Battery testing for the non technical is not an exact science and I envy and respect those forum members with the equipment and willingness to do this. My approach is rather basic and naturally flawed but in a way reflects reality. 

First on the CR123A issue. I brought 900 mAH Tenergy protected cells, 500 mAH AW unprotected ones (by accident), and 750 mAH protected cells. As the Surefire Saint is strongly against the use of rechargeables I was limited to using the Zebralight H31 as the test light. Curious are the result when run at 220 lumen.

Tenergy 900mAH gave thirty minutes
AW 500mAH gave thirty minutes
AW 750mAH gave forty five minutes.

Now you could argue that the protection on the Tenergy cells is cutting in early while the unprotected AW were at the mercy of the Zebralight protection system. Well the unprotected cells were not drained beyond their recharge point even if the warning blinking was ignored. Actually the AW cells are internally consistent with the 750mAH ones lasting half as long again. Tenergy ones were new cells as were the AW ones so I can say that Tenergy have a different mAH standard. Ok this shock is not a shock to harden holders of the light but is very disappointing to a newbie as it is not just Fleabay selling inflated mAH ratings.

Now running a Zebralight H31 on full is impressive but normally the second high of one hundred lumens is more than adequate. So rechargeables RCR123A from AW are a worthwhile choice around the camp providing that you have a backup light to change the battery. Assuming AW is not messing with mAH rating then a quality primary from say Panasonic USA should give double the run time so make a worthwhile light to use on the track for walking by. Just have to ensure a fresh battery if changing a battery on track not a good idea.

Cheers


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## Ent (Jul 9, 2011)

Sorry for spilling the post but either Candlepower does not like Firefox or my connection is rather suspect, it is a 3G wireless broadband connection.

Anyway, now to the AA and AAA rechargeables. The advent of the the Maha battery chargers in my arsenal has given me the ability to confirm a few suspicions and trouble shoot issues. As frequently mentioned on this site, not all batteries are created equal. If their home is Japan then they generally perform better, especially if they carry Sanyo as the family name. If from China and have a name like Vatra then they might be reasonable but not fantastic. If they are from China and have a generic name then Junk (not in the form of a boat either) should be their name.

The break in cycle on the Maha charger is many hours as is the analyse mode so progress has been slow shifting through the various batteries I have. The eight cell Maha has been given a workout using the condition feature. It is worthwhile noting that more than a few Duracells of Japanese origin have been rejected by the four AA/AAA charger as gone high voltage and do not fully charge on the eight cell charger, These batteries have had a gentle life and only ever been charged as an individual on the ANNSMAN charger. The Energiser ones appear to be ok but I have not sufficiently played with them enough to confirm this.

Duracell is very annoying as they are an expensive brand and they were once sold as 2650 mAH but I notice that the same battery is now been sold as 2450 mAH. This suggests that Duracell had a re-think, forced or otherwise, about their claims. The Energisers have always been sold as claiming 2500 mAH.

The Maha MH-C9000 quickly identified the reason for very inconsistent run times with the Duracells in lights and GPS. The measured mAH was all over the shop as mAH ratings were anything from 1000 to 2300 mAH for the AAs. The MH-C808M would charge them but then when tested on the ANNSMAN charger/tester they would be anywhere from 50 to 100 percent charged. This was backed up by the run time in the Black Diamond Apollo with less than two hours to around four been achieved before the red warning light would come on. Testing the batteries would then reveal one to two rather dead cells and others with 30 to 60 percent charge. Also if left a couple of days some would drop from 100 percent to 50 percent or less indicating internal issues.

In other words, Duracells were a chook's lottery and not to be trusted in the bush. Vatra appeared as bad, if not worse. The Sanyos off all types gave a solid performance by comparison, and Energisers indicated at least consistent performance across cells.

All the batteries were of varying and unknown ages but I thinks the Duracells were the newest. Anyway, the good news is the break in mode on the MH-C9000 worked on most batteries to improve performance, in some cases dramatically.

As break-in mode is around thirty-six to forty-eight hours much more work is required to be definitive on results but personally I am very disappointed by Duracell and would avoid buying Chinese made batteries regardless of the well known brand name stuck on them. Also take stated mAH with a lot of salt.

Cheers


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## tedh (Jul 10, 2011)

I really like my Sanyo Eneloops. I recognize the tradeoffs, and they may not be the highest-performing option out there. But, I am more than happy to trade a little performance for a lack of surprises. They do what I expect them to, and that's worth something to me. 

Ted


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## Ent (Jul 10, 2011)

tedh said:


> I really like my Sanyo Eneloops. I recognize the tradeoffs, and they may not be the highest-performing option out there. But, I am more than happy to trade a little performance for a lack of surprises. They do what I expect them to, and that's worth something to me.
> 
> Ted



I agree, especially when bushwalking and a few days in there is nothing worst than variability of performance. I would much rather know and trust so many hours out of a GPS/light than find some batteries last three walking days and then others barely half a day. That is one thing I am testing out and the Maha MH-C9000 charger is helping with. I am testing batteries using the Black Diamond Apollo and as it is a four AA light all it just takes is one bad cell to muck up run times.

I tend to nowadays use rechargeables, as as many I think I need, but carry a spare set of lithium primaries as backup as they are the lightest of all battery chemistry and most likely to work in all conditions.

One sad recurring theme at the moment with AA/AAA batteries is most are somewhat to significantly under their claimed mAH plus more than a few are near flat after a week. I have not put much effort into checking out the Eneloops batteries simply because they have worked well.

It is getting rather tiring the games battery labels play with country of origin and claimed mAH changing. I have a sneaking suspicion that with Energiser lithium primaries you get noticeable run time differences depending if they are made in China, Singapore, or the USA.

As for the deliberate confusion with "me to" brand names with similar names and colour scheme I wonder if legislative action should be considered and enforced. On Fleabay some claims are just ridiculous and when one seller was claiming one thing in the description and another in the specifications I fired off a complaint to Ebay. Yeap, nothing happened and the seller continued on their merry way. Ebay needs to think long and hard about practices or else face a strong back lash with legislative restrictions.

If I have learnt anything it is trust Sanyo Japanese rechargeables and be highly suspect of any other brands. Often the Sanyo batteries are the same price or cheaper than Duracell, Energiser, Vatra and a raft of other you beaut Chinese made batteries.

Have noticed though with Sanyo that the increase in storage life and cycles has come about with a loss in capacity. But then you have the high capacity ones which are reliable for a couple of weeks, so better suited to bush walking where fewer batteries carried is a good thing.

Cheers


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## Gregozedobe (Jul 10, 2011)

Ent said:


> That is one thing I am testing out and the Maha MH-C9000 charger is helping with. * I am testing batteries using the Black Diamond Apollo* and as it is a four AA light all it just takes is one bad cell to muck up run times.



Why not use simply the discharge function of your c9000 (set to the appropriate mA rate) ? That way you know immediately exactly which battery is the weak link.


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## Ent (Jul 10, 2011)

Hi Gregozedobe

Thanks for the tip. Still coming to terms with the little monster and using the break-in function to restore more life into rather slack cells. Actually that function appears to work very well. Finding though some cells are rather variable and while getting good mAH rating they go flat quite quick in storage. The ANNSMAN battery tester is also handy doing a quick spot check.


The idea is to get the batteries sorted and then push on looking at each headlamp. Next week will be a test in snow so be good to have batteries in good condition. I will be fascinated to see of the lithium ion ones handle the cold. Assuming we can get to the starting point and not strike closed roads.

Cheers


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## carrot (Jul 10, 2011)

I really want to point out to you the Petzl CORE battery system for Tikka2 series headlamps. It is a li-ion system and can be programmed to adjust the output level to your tastes and runtime needs. You can carry a couple and swap them out easily, and if you should need to use primaries you can just pop out the CORE battery and pop in any type of 3xAAA batteries. It's a pretty good system and is treating me well so far.


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## Satanta (Jul 11, 2011)

I will have to keep an eye on this thread as it is covering some ground and ansering questions I did not even think to ask such as batteries.

I use a low-end $20USD$$ Energizer headlamp for such things as crawling under the house or in the attic and exploring old abandoned houses and caves. Keeping in mind I am visually impaired some low-end lights won't work but 'too bright' have their drawbacks as well. I do not remember the make but there is an adjustable handheld that attaches to a headband but the ones you mention gives me more options to research to find what I need for a head-mounted walkabout. Thanks.


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## Ent (Jul 11, 2011)

carrot said:


> I really want to point out to you the Petzl CORE battery system for Tikka2 series headlamps. It is a li-ion system and can be programmed to adjust the output level to your tastes and runtime needs. You can carry a couple and swap them out easily, and if you should need to use primaries you can just pop out the CORE battery and pop in any type of 3xAAA batteries. It's a pretty good system and is treating me well so far.



I missed picking up on that one. I have in the past found that three AAA lights are neither one thing or another, either been rather dim or short on battery life. Admittedly that is based on the Princeton-Tec Quad and EOS experience. I am spending a bit of time with the BD Storm that looks like it can throw out 100 lumens for some time and has just about any option that you could ask for in a light plus manages to squeeze in four AAA into the space most only manage three. I just wish that BD had gone for two AAs instead as that would give a similar amount of capacity at half the running cost, that been assuming AAA sell for the same price as AA per battery.

Also I must admit I am rather anti Petzl as they took forever to introduce voltage regulation (did not allow/recommend lithium primaries) and many of their lights are weatherproof rather than water resistant. A guiding company I know used Petzl and found that after a few months they eventually succumbed to water ingress. I looked at the website and found it struggled to load with broken links (they are having issues it appears) and battled to find out the specifications on the Tikka 2. If I look at the graph for all their lights run time it looks like 40/50 lumens and less than an hour at that light level? Here is the link http://www.petzl.com/en/outdoor/headlamps/select-headlamp-performance now am I reading it right?

Hi Satana

Yes as I get older I find brighter lights are useful and equally as important light tint along with spread. The past high powered lights were rather tightly focus and that made life challenging as close objects would blind me with reflected light. I find a like a boarder light but still like a bit of depth. Not sure if a like or dislike the BD Storm approach of switching between the two beams or the Zebralight H31 approach of broad good colour light and 220 lumens of power to blast out into the darkness. I think it is what you get use to and the type of work you are doing with a light that will govern your choice.

Cheers


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## carrot (Jul 11, 2011)

All of the 3xAAA models from Petzl are unregulated. That would give them the typical discharge curve of any unregulated/direct drive 3xAAA light. This sort of no-regulation is not exactly preferable for everyone but it works quite fine for me.

The cool part about the CORE battery system is that it is a lithium ion battery pack with a regulation circuit inside that you can program to hold output at whatever two settings you like (since the Tikka2 series each only has two white output modes to offer). You recharge it via Micro-USB with either a computer or any USB power adapter. I like this system a lot as I can set it up however I like and it makes recharging easy since I can just plug it in, instead of using a cell cradle, as well as being able to go to disposables if I run out of juice in my battery pack.

I can't speak to its water resistance over time but in my testing in the sink and shower the Tikka2 has proven to be quite the champ with the electronics never getting wet (the battery compartment is not sealed, but the electronics compartment is).


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## gcbryan (Jul 11, 2011)

Ent, I'd be interested to hear your comments on the Storm and on the H51. I have the Storm and the H51f and just put in an order for the regular H51 as well.

Here are my thoughts regarding that group. The Storm is "close but no cigar" in my book. I like it but having to carry 4 AAA's and trying to change them in the cold is not ideal...especially that 4th battery where you have to pull on a piece of film to get that battery out.

I like much of what the Storm does but do not like the fact that every time you turn it on it toggles between spot and flood plus the fact that it always comes on in high. The toggling is the worst aspect however.

I like the true flood and I like the infinitely adjustable brightness levels. It drops out of regulation after the first 25% of battery capacity is used up and that is a little early I think.

The H51f is very nice. The 2nd sub-level in high is too clumsy to use but I don't need it so it's not an issue. Now that I've used it for a few days I like just about everything about this light. I wish the diffusion was a little less so that I would get a little more throw. I don't need more throw for much of the time but it's nice to have a hiking light that does everything.

That's why I decided to order the H51 today. That provides enough throw (I think) and on some hikes/climbs where I need to see a little further I'll use it all the time. On other hikes I'll just use the H51f and get more light everywhere. If I need more throw at some point during the hike/climb I'll switch to the H51.

I really like the H51f for in camp, in the house, around the yard, working on whatever type of uses as well. The beam quality is very nice.

If I take both Zebralights with me I'll just consider one of them a battery holder 

I'm looking forward to hearing your comment expecially on the H51 (what is it not doing for you?). Maybe you need the H51f as well


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## Ent (Jul 11, 2011)

gcbryan said:


> Ent, I'd be interested to hear your comments on the Storm and on the H51.



Hi gcbryan

I agree with your comments on the Storm. If it was two AA's with either memory or starting low to high on the output it would be very hard to go past. Also a second switch or different sequence for changing from flood to beam would be good. It is amazing that Black Diamond crammed so much good stuff in they mucked up on these issues. It is a promising but flawed light instead of a brilliant one. I have been using it to test run times of various batteries and around three and half hours before the light goes from flashing green to red. With rechargeables you do not get much time on orange. The Duracells 1000 mAH that tested out at around 920 mAH gives three and three quarter hour run time on the full beam so not bad. Yeap, nice try but no banana.

I must admit with the H51 that the H31 is just so much nicer. It is smaller and brighter but not by that much based on specifications alone, but very noticeable in real life. I am tending towards the H31 for money no object type trips where the weight and life of batteries is more important than cost. I do however like the florescent head band of the H51 and think this should be standard on any head lamp. 

I have the Spark 220 which is bit more capable in the battery department been able to take a 14500 cell. I fitted the defuser lens to it and this gives excellent flood ability. It is much happier running on 14500 compared to standard AA but have not play much with it. Though I was rather disappointed when the end cap spring fell out. It was very poorly glued in. Also not so sure on the longevity of that design as the end cap screws a printed circuit board against the body to form the circuit. In fact the Spark range has a few issues with switch reliability I have found. The 800 lumen torch switch is very hit and miss and not to be recommended to people like police that things must just work. The end switch is actually a rather poor joke. Love the light output of the Sparks I have and the electronic regulation plus very solid body but no so sure on switches and general build finish.

Still very much playing with the lights at home but gradually getting to understand their foibles. When many days in on a bushwalk reliability is a big issue and that is where i think Spark might come undone. Sure all issues have been fixable, at home, but losing an end cap spring on a night walk in adverse weather is something that could have serious safety issues as is dodgy switches of its brethren.

Cheers


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## gcbryan (Jul 11, 2011)

ENT, how does the H51 compare to the Storm as far a throw. The H51 should throw further than the Storm ...right? (the H51 is what I have coming in the mail).

Also, since you mentioned the red battery indicator on the Storm in reference to rechargeables I've noticed that even with alkaline batteries I don't get all that long in the orange indicator light range.


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## AaronG (Jul 12, 2011)

I love my H51F. I could never imagine going back to the crap I had before! If I could go back in time I would have bought the H51Fw instead.

When the H502 comes out I'll be ordering one of them as well


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## Ent (Jul 12, 2011)

gcbryan said:


> ENT, how does the H51 compare to the Storm as far a throw. The H51 should throw further than the Storm ...right? (the H51 is what I have coming in the mail).



Hi 

Living in the centre of towns makes it hard to compare through as way too much background light. But in the unit it appears to be much of a muchness. The beam on the Storm is more focused so that actually means it probably can throw the same distance even though not as bright with the spill. Then the human eye might be compensating. The real test will be out in the bush. 

Frankly the Storm and H51 are significant improvements on my traditional lights. The run time of the Storm is about what you need while I am no so sure on the H51. It is unfair comparison as the H51 throws out more light but you are looking at max (so somewhat lower in the real word) 2700 mAH for the H51 versus 4000 mAH capacity for the Storm (based on rechargeables). The single battery of the HF51 is what makes it so cute but also gives it limitations. The Spark by allowing the option of 14500 gives it an edge in light power but with the frosted lens throw will not be as good. It would be fair to say that the H51 does not need a frosted lens as much but still the Spark with it matches the Storm's floods for coverage.

The H51 at this stage has not put a foot wrong but as mentioned I do like the H31 a little bit more.

Cheers


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## gcbryan (Jul 12, 2011)

I don't expect the H51 to match the Storm as far as runtime on 1 AA vs 4 AAA's but to me I'd rather have 1 AA on my head and 1 in my pocket since changing batteries is much easier in the H51.

The Storm throws pretty well as long as the batteries are fresh (regulated). I didn't care for the beam so I put a piece of tape of the lens of the Storm. It reduced the throw a bit but not much since the Storm didn't have really have a sharply defined hotspot anyway.

I know the H51 has to throw more than the H51f so I was just curious as to which threw further Storm or H51. I'm pretty sure the H51 will throw as far as I would want in a headlamp anyway which is only moderately so.

I guess I'll be able to personally compare the two beams soon enough anyway 

The Spark line always appeared to me to be heavier than the Zebralights and I don't need or want any more output. The user interface of the Spark seemed to be not as nice as that in the Zebralights as well. For some reason I feel that the design quality is better with Zebralight even though the Spark may have a more rugged body.

I stayed away from the H31 just because I've stayed away from CR123's in general for the most part. I already have lights that use 18650 (including dive lights) and AA batteries are just easier to find and afford without ordering in bulk. I use lithium AA primaries a lot so CR123 just doesn't appeal to me as much as it did at one time. Also I'm just trying to keep things simple.

It will be interesting to see what you ultimately find to be the right headlamp for you!

I have no interest in Fenix or Surefire in this regard and even though I use 18650 it's too large for a headlamp for me and I've also not sure I want to strap a 18650 to my head


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## Ent (Jul 12, 2011)

Hi

Tend to agree that the 18650 battery in the Spark format makes for one impressive looking head lamp. Seeing it compared to the Spark AA version is like looking at a Clydesdale and Shetland pony. I assume part of the bulk is do with the bigger emitter and the remainder to handle the heat. In fact the weight could rather push the vertical adjustment system to hold steady.

My issue for a single AA is when walking around three hours is normal for night walks with me. Any shorter run time means changing batteries and that is not always as straight forward in the bush. Still for the weight and bulk a spare H51 could be carried as having a backup light makes sense as well.

Actually what attracted me to the Surefire Saint was its ability to run AA batteries but the battery box is rather large and makes for a heavy light in that configuration. I am told real soon is a streamlined AA version and hope that it comes out soon. Honestly nothing can beat the variable control on the Saint. All other systems are decidedly clunky by comparison. As far as a light the Saint has a few issues with tint and distortion but with is control system I can forgive it heaps. Big issue is blinding fellow walkers and the Saint is as fool proof as you can get. The Strom is a pest by comparison and the Zebralight takes a little bit of familiarity as I tend to not hold long enough so wind up starting on high. 

Amazing I started off looking for a AA only light but in the double AA range not much around so got sidetracked into other battery formats. Being side tracked is something I am rather good at I am finding.

Cheers Brett


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## gcbryan (Jul 12, 2011)

That brings up a good point...the perfect Zebralight would be one where the current switch is replaced by a rotating dial for brightness control. It already have rotation for beam angle control.

Go back to XP-E for greater throw, very slightly diffuse the beam to make it less annoying for hiking and buiid in a flip-back diffuser for in camp work/reading and that just might be the perfect light weight light for most outdoor use. Make the flip-back diffuser removable for those who don't want it. Carry two or an extra battery and you're set


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## Ent (Jul 12, 2011)

Hi

The perfect would be if Jetbeam took their Raptor RTTO V5 torch logic and made it into a head lamp. Variable control and simple conversion from CR123A to AA with 255 lumens. Now with a remote compact twin AA battery pack you would have a killer of a light. In fact the Saint with updated emitter and streamline twin AA battery pack would be there as well. Might steal the defuser idea from Spark but do it like a screw on filter as with camera filters and have the ability to park the filter on the non control end of the light. Nice thoughts but sadly the manufacturers sort of design what they like rather than actually looking at what people are after. The features are there in the form of excellent electronic rotary controls a proven defuser system and battery packs. I live in hope someone will come up with this. In fact the Saint if it was not so hung up on been anti lithium ion you could have either compact twin double AA, single 18650 or use there parallel logic used with their three CR123A pack to give excellent run time with an almost unlimited array of battery packs. Sadly their entire aim seams to be to sell their own brand CR123a cells. A case of marketers making product design decisions.

Cheers


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## gcbryan (Jul 13, 2011)

In case you haven't seen it in my H51f thread on this page Ted has linked to a diffuser he got from Fenix and fitted to his H51. It flips back when not in use.

My Fenix diffuser just arrived today. I'm playing around with it on my H51f but am really waiting for my H51 (which arrives Friday I hope) to do the final fitting and see if I want to use it or not.

It's something to check out if you haven't seen it.


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## ringzero (Jul 13, 2011)

Ent said:


> To break away from the headlamps themselves this post looks at the fuel sources for them. On an eight day walk using lithium AAs brought in Australia the bill was $100 for the twenty batteries consumed. Yeap, we get charged about five dollars a AA or AAA for that matter. So battery life and the use of rechargeables will play a big factor in the choice.




So you consumed an average of 2.5 lithium AA cells per day - makes me curious as to what you are doing to consume cells at that rate. Backpacking at night, major night hikes, or maybe a little bit of caving on the side? ;>

I know two guys who thru-hiked most of the Appalachian Trail carrying only Photons (little tiny plastic lights running on button-cells) for light. ;>

.


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## gcbryan (Jul 13, 2011)

ringzero said:


> So you consumed an average of 2.5 lithium AA cells per day - makes me curious as to what you are doing to consume cells at that rate. Backpacking at night, major night hikes, or maybe a little bit of caving on the side? ;>
> 
> I know two guys who thru-hiked most of the Appalachian Trail carrying only Photons (little tiny plastic lights running on button-cells) for light. ;>
> 
> .


 
Remember everything in Oz is poisonous or dangerous in some manner  I'd have bright lights on high too I believe under those conditions...or perhaps I'd just stay home


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## carrot (Jul 13, 2011)

gcbryan said:


> Remember everything in Oz is poisonous or dangerous in some manner  I'd have bright lights on high too I believe under those conditions...or perhaps I'd just stay home


 Oh yeah, in Oz I'd be running my Saint on high all the time...


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## bbb74 (Jul 13, 2011)

gcbryan said:


> Remember everything in Oz is poisonous or dangerous in some manner  I'd have bright lights on high too I believe under those conditions...or perhaps I'd just stay home


 
I think this is a bit of a misconception I'd like to try to bust 

We have on average about 1-3 deaths per year from snake bites. We have less deaths per million people per year than the USA from snake bites.

There are only 2 spiders that can cause death here, and there has been no deaths since 1956 from spider bites apart from one who was maybe bitten but not treated.

I won't count the occasional death from a crocodile as they are only found in certain places in the north and generally you have to do something unwise to get taken by one.

The only other really dangerous critter I can think of is the box jellyfish, which is only found in certain areas and only at certain months of the year. These locations are signed and there are either protected swimming areas or sting suits you can wear to avoid a sting. There's been 60-something deaths from these in the past ~130 years. There's also the Irukanji jellyfish which is only found in certain places, and has caused 2 deaths in the past decade.

If you compare the total of the above to other mundane causes of death such as falling off horses, ladders, electrocution etc, there is way fewer deaths from dangerous critters. Compare it to the road death toll (~1300 in Aus, >30,000 in the USA) and it pales into insignificance.


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## gcbryan (Jul 13, 2011)

bbb74 said:


> I think this is a bit of a misconception I'd like to try to bust
> 
> We have on average about 1-3 deaths per year from snake bites. We have less deaths per million people per year than the USA from snake bites.
> 
> ...



I guess we have to blame those misconceptions on another (perceived) Australian trait...exaggeration


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## ringzero (Jul 15, 2011)

bbb74 said:


> I think this is a bit of a misconception I'd like to try to bust
> ...
> If you compare the total of the above to other mundane causes of death such as falling off horses, ladders, electrocution etc, there is way fewer deaths from dangerous critters. Compare it to the road death toll (~1300 in Aus, >30,000 in the USA) and it pales into insignificance.




Excellent job of debunking a myth, bbb74.

Not having visited Australia I don't have any first hand knowledge of its hazards.

From casual reading and watching various nature shows, I had long had the idea that the great outdoors was safer in Australia than in North America, mainly because of the lack of large dangerous mammals.

We've got big, potentially deadly mammals in the form of bears, of several varieties, mountain lions, and a few other large mammals that you wouldn't want to tangle with.

Many varieties of venomous snakes that could possibly be fatal without prompt treatment.

Two types of spiders and one type of scorpion that could possibly be fatal without treatment.

Of course the deadliest predator roaming around outdoors, here and in Australia, walks on two legs.

.


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## bbb74 (Jul 16, 2011)

ringzero said:


> We've got big, potentially deadly mammals in the form of bears, of several varieties, mountain lions, and a few other large mammals that you wouldn't want to tangle with.


 
I have to admit, while doing some trails in the US and Canada, I was always a bit nervous because of bears  Even stumbled across a black bear at one point but it ran away. Saw a couple of brown bears but they were a fair way off and I was not walking 

On a guided tour of Fraser Island here in Aus, we had a really hilarious tour guide who started out the tour with a description of all the different animals that would be out to get us while doing walks, he spend a bit of time talking about the drop bear (like a koala bear, but bigger, with claws, and they drop out of trees (hence the name) and you're done for). There was only 2 aussies on the tour the rest were from overseas, and we aussies stayed mum (which was difficult!). 50 meters into our first walk, a small stick falls out of a tree onto a girl's shoulder and she lets out this blood curdling scream  My british future fiancee and wife was on the trip with me, and I'd already quietly told her it was all a joke because she was looking a bit freaked out too  On the other hand, a german guy on the tour really wanted to see a dingo, and was considering walking around with a steak tied to himself to try to attract one


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## carrot (Jul 16, 2011)

bbb74 said:


> On a guided tour of Fraser Island here in Aus, we had a really hilarious tour guide who started out the tour with a description of all the different animals that would be out to get us while doing walks, he spend a bit of time talking about the drop bear (like a koala bear, but bigger, with claws, and they drop out of trees (hence the name) and you're done for).


 Is that why you Aussies all wear those ridiculous hats? Do you rub Vegemite behind your ears too?


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## gcbryan (Jul 16, 2011)

Carott, I don't think we have much room to talk...


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## ringzero (Jul 16, 2011)

bbb74 said:


> I have to admit, while doing some trails in the US and Canada, I was always a bit nervous because of bears  Even stumbled across a black bear at one point but it ran away. Saw a couple of brown bears but they were a fair way off and I was not walking




That's OK, bears make me nervous too. :>

Most black bears, most of the time, are completely harmless.

However, a very few black bears have been known to track, then stalk, then kill, then eat humans - although thankfully that's very rare.

Every once in a while I'll notice an article about a black bear tearing into a tent and attacking the occupants, sometimes with fatal results. Usually this is blamed on the scent of food being present inside the tent, not purposeful predation.

When encountering a bear, since you don't know if it's a "normal" black bear, or one of the rare killer bears, a little nervousness may be justified. ;>

Those big brown bears they have up North are a whole other story. You don't want to be around those without a rifle, or a shotgun loaded with deer slugs.



bbb74 said:


> On a guided tour of Fraser Island here in Aus, we had a really hilarious tour guide who started out the tour with a description of all the different animals that would be out to get us while doing walks, he spend a bit of time talking about the drop bear (like a koala bear, but bigger, with claws, and they drop out of trees (hence the name) and you're done for). There was only 2 aussies on the tour the rest were from overseas, and we aussies stayed mum (which was difficult!). 50 meters into our first walk, a small stick falls out of a tree onto a girl's shoulder and she lets out this blood curdling scream  My british future fiancee and wife was on the trip with me, and I'd already quietly told her it was all a joke because she was looking a bit freaked out too  On the other hand, a german guy on the tour really wanted to see a dingo, and was considering walking around with a steak tied to himself to try to attract one




LOL, I love it!

Drop bears! Those are some tourists who got their money's worth, I'd reckon. ;>

.


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## Ent (Jul 20, 2011)

Um?

Australia and dangerous animals? I have seen a friend levitate a few time getting away from a snake. Meeting one while swimming can explain Australians performance in a swimming pool. Actually button grass, a tall grass, they can move along the top that can put them at chest or even eye hight. 

No our fauna is generally not dangerous if left along, just cunning. We have a bird that has learnt how to undo pack zips. Mongrels stole my stash of lollies on the last trip.

High battery consumption is due to dark huts and early evenings with sun down at 6.00pm in winter so basically once at a hut it is lights on. The big eater was the GPS and Black Diamond Apollo and a night wander on the Princeton-tec Corona kill three in one go.

As for light conservation on fellow walker I think has got six months out of a CR2032 light but the last four you needed a match to find the headlamp when it was on. I like brightly light places as I tend to cook rather elaborate meals. Though the power drain on the BD Apollo and Princeton-tec light is what got me heading down this track.

Cheers Brett


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## Ent (Jul 20, 2011)

Hi All

Well back from the snow shoe walk in Mount Field National Park. As the first night was car camping so I got to play with some of the new toys. Basically having now used a 18650 torch in the form of a Spark 800 I am converted as for such a small size it packs a hell of a punch. Though the Jetbeam CR123A and AA powered Raptor is still very impressive.

Anyway on the snow section it was carry what you can so settled on the Zebralight H31 powered by AW RCR123A and the Saint powered by CR123A and the Black Diamond Apollo powered by four AA Sanyo 2700 mAh batteries as my contribution to group comfort. Ok the Jetbeam came along but was not used. 

Imagine crystal clear blue skies a metre and half of fresh snow and minus 3.9 Celsius. Perfect winter conditions with no wind even up on the exposed mountain tops. There was no night walking and a full moon meant that you could see for miles.

Anyway the BD ran nicely for four hours with more life left in the rechargeables. The Zebralight was used as spot lighting at 100 lumen setting and killed two AW 750 mAh batteries. The Saint was my primary head lamp used sparingly.

Love the Saint control system as gloves did not trouble it but is is rather dim unless on full power in such moonlit conditions. The Zebralight was superb but interestingly a friend that had the H51 was greeted with a flat battery. Yeap the typical issue of lamps switching on due to bumping in the pack. My H31 was packed in a plastic hard case so no issue there. 

Another walker brought along a Ultrafire clone of the Zebralight. I gave him a AW 14500 750 mAh cell. Interestingly though a sparing user of lights he flattened the battery in one night.

Findings. Well Zebralights button placement and ability to knock it is an issue requiring careful packing. The Saint system appears rather hard to knock on so wins there big time. The BD Apollo is a lot of weight for not much light compared to the H31 but gives a nice even light. The Ultrafire worked and it did remember the last power setting. It starts high and goes low with total flood light. Good around camp but not so sure if I would want it when walking looking for track markers.

Cheers Brett


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## gcbryan (Jul 20, 2011)

All you have to do with the Zebralight to prevent accidental activation is a slight twist of the tail cap. It doesn't take much. Twist it the least bit and press the button and it doesn't activate.


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## Ent (Jul 21, 2011)

Hi 

Makes sense and works. Will use it myself and pass this on to my friend unless he has not already figured this out himself.

Thanks.


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## robostudent5000 (Aug 8, 2011)

Ent, any updates?


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## Ent (Aug 10, 2011)

Hi All

Well going for a long walk with the remainds of the flue is not to be recommended and also be prepared for Tasmaps and Parks (Government Mapping and National Park departments of Tasmania) to stuff up maps big time. So yes got rather lost on the walk to Reynolds Falls. 

Anyway for the two day walk I took the Zebralight H31 and the Saint in minimal configuration. It was envisage that the walk back to camp from the falls would be a night for the last half an hour or more so I had the Fenix 10D as spare in the day pack with the Saint. The idea was to use the H31 with L-ion batteries as flood lighting around the camp site.

Like a few plans of mice and men it did not work out. In fact failed in epic style. So after 17.7 kilometres and over 700 metres up and then down we made camp at a claimed wonderful spot about fifteen minutes before dark. Just enough time to pitch the tents and get water. The spot was wonderful for only one creature, that being the leech, or more accurately the Four Ways Tasmanian Attack Leech to give the full name. The weather had all the mood of the X Files and it was ultra damp so no fire. The leeches just drove you into your tent where they encircled you waiting for you to appear. I have never had a tent before covered in leeches with more than a few sneaking in through on clothing.

I was stuffed to cook so broke out the emergency jelly beans and gave up any idea of a hot meal. As the main pack was covered in leeches I used the Saint from the day pack on leech spotting patrol and it worked ok. I ran it on low setting to see the watch as I was rather unwell and made a regime of eating or drinking something every fifteen minutes. A case of forcing food and drink in as it is too easy not to eat when wrecked.

After a cold and wet night but not too bad in a decent sleeping bag and tent I awoke had a light breakfast and headed the hell out of the Land of the Four Million Leeches.

The Saint is rather annoying as it is very loose on the headband so you need two hands to adjust it else it turns around in its holder. It is hard to identify which end has the control and easily put upside down thus further annoying you. Honestly the colour and quality of light is very poor especially compared to the white and clear Zebralight H31. For my eyes it needs to be run on near maximum to blast through the distorted beam to actually see things clearly.

Frankly given its massive cost I am increasingly becoming disenchanted with it. Yes it will likely survive anything and the rotary control is still the best control mechanism for a light but lacks smoothness. Its 100 lumens is not really as bright as say the BD Storm 100 lumens and the quality of beam as mentioned is only a shadow of the H31.

I hate but respect the Saint at the same time if you can understand the two rather conflicting words. The fact I have 50 CR123 for it means I will chuck it in my pack probably more than it deserves and when the batteries are used up it will sit as a cupboard keeper never to be used again.

I just wish that the Zebralight had a better control system. It is not bad but take the electronics that can use unprotected L-ion and light quality it has combined with a rotary lumen control and it would be dam hard to beat.

Cheers Brett


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## Ozgeardo (Aug 10, 2011)

Just weighing in late here (as I have been out in the Australian Bush). 
Firstly most critters that would do you harm in Australia are usually more scared of you than you are of them. Give them some space and you will not have a problem.
Secondly and back to the subject (how we easily digress and I am just a guilty)
I also have spent many years in search of the perfect bush walking headlamp and as Carrot has mentioned the unregulated Petzl 3 x AAA's suit me just fine. I have a Tactikka XP modded with a SSC-P4 up grade. I am usually in the field for 8 days/7 nights and only use 2 x sets of Sanyo Eneloops (which also power my Garmen Foretrex GPS) I take about 6 x AAA's as spares and that usually sees me through. (I also use/carry a Olight M30 for SAR and a Quark RGB for special navigation tasks with 4 spare RCR123's that take care of all my remaining battery needs)
The XP I find one of the most ergonomically easy lights to use and meets all of my requirements including a quick and easy to use diffusing lens (I use the Red), water proof, excellent angle adjustment, comfortable headband, easy adjustment and spot light. Generally I like regulated lights but the XP as a headlamp gives me excellent run time due to the lack of regulation and acts as a battery vampire for my GPS if required, which cuts out about 1.1 volts (after 16 hours use) on NiMh but the XP will run down to .9 or .8 volts (another night or at least a few hours more if necessary)
I generally use my XP for 95% of all my lighting requirements.
Just my 2 cents worth.


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## Yoshie (Aug 25, 2011)

Ent said:


> Hi
> 
> In fact the Saint with updated emitter and streamline twin AA battery pack would be there as well.
> 
> Cheers



what emitter are you referring to?


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## Ent (Aug 28, 2011)

Yoshie said:


> what emitter are you referring to?



Basically the one in a Zebralight H31. Lovely clear white light. I note that the Saint uses a very different lens as well so that might be the difference? I am not at the stage of enlightenment to pull apart and examine the emitters let alone replace them.

Cheers


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## Ent (Sep 12, 2011)

Hi

Well having been a couch potato finally got out for another bushwalk. It was an easy overnight walk to a hut. The setup taken was

Spark ST6 ST6-460NW (1 x 18650, 2 x CR123A) - headlamp
ITP-01 (1 x AAA) - headlamp
Spark SL6-800CW (1 x 18650, 2 x CR123A) - torch

Lights were used in the hut with only the dash to the water tank being outside.

Used the lights generally in fixed positions to light up the cooking and eating area. Did use the ITP as a headlamp when wandering around.

First the fuel for the beasts. For the 18650 lights I used AW 2900 protected cells with the Spark supplied Sanyo unprotected cells on standby. Used a Ansmann claimed 1100 mAH AAA rechargeable battery. This tested out at 911 mAH. Found when swapping the AW for the unprotected cell that my storage container was too short as the protected cells were longer.

First the bad. The Spark torch suffers from sadly usual Spark indifferent quality. The switches (on front and on on the bottom) did not work reliably thus making selecting the power level frustrating. Sure it has been pointed out that the longer protected cells can stop the tail switch working but the top switch became so unreliable that with some playing around I managed to get the tail switch to work. It is a chook's if the tail switch works when you screw it up. Yeap, and the front part of the light became unscrewed as well. The threads are roughly cut and are very course in use. The actual design and thickness of the materials is excellent but the machining is very poor.

The good. The Spark torch is a lumen king and at 500 lumens more than powerful enough to light up a work area when suspended from a nail in the celling. The 800 lumen high was not used as it will only go for five minutes at the setting before dropping back. Battery life is excellent with one battery lasting for a couple of hours. The Spark headlamp is even better on battery life due to lower lumen output. For the fixed position use its broader beam was even better than the torch. Basically for a luxury lighting solution the 18650 powered lights are king.

The surprise package was the ITP AAA headlamp. I just love the thing. Instead of taking spare batteries it is tempting to take this as a backup light. At 85 lumens it is more than powerful enough for any around camp work and the two sub power levels are well chosen. Low is good enough for bumbling around with the middle level giving good output and battery life. It is not a toy and when mated with a high capacity AAA cell and set on medium output it is hard to go past.

I wish that Spark would get their quality sorted out. My next torch will like be another Jetbeam as honestly they kill Spark on the quality of construction count. I do however like the Spark touch size and impressive light output but unless Spark has a long hard look at themselves that is my last Spark purchase.

Cheers


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