# NITECORE EC4S XHP50(2x18650) REVIEW Updated



## FlashLion (Sep 11, 2015)

Hello 
This is a review of the dual 18650 battery powered flashlight Nitecore EC4S. It is the second released flashlight produced by Die-cast process of forming the aluminum alloy body.
Result of this process of forming is a uniform body with less thread connection points(only at the tailcap and front bezel) and minimum connecting elements,as this should ensure better shock resistant of the construction and better heat transfer through the whole flashlight.

Initially the review was made after testing a sample of the EC4S,which actually is a pre-release/prototype sample.
Later I got the final version from Nitecore and I am updating the review with new run time tests and pictures.
Many of the first comments below the review were about the XHP50 neutral white tint. Please note that the final retail version features a Cool White XHP50 LED and this is actually the main difference between the both versions I tested.











*The EC4S shares the same design as the previously released model EC4.
Read also my EC4 Review for more impressions.*
The same uni-body construction with black stoving-varnish finish.
The same dual side switch and user interface.
The main difference compared to the EC4 is the different,more powerful LED,which gives max brightness almost double the EC4 max brightness.
Note,that I am saying *max* brightness. It is a common practice manufacturers to post the maximum measured output on the box and in the specification list.
The reality though,is different. Most of the current high oуtput flashlights lose their max output after minute of use(and even less) and can't provide the same high output at any battery discharge state. Check out the run time graphs attached to the review to see the actual output during a full discharge. 
The higher output requires more batteries for higher voltage,or a special boost driver circuit. 
Unlike the EC4,where two batteries were enough for stable output from the XM-L2 LED,the EC4S has a higher voltage LED and two batteries are not enough for maintaining stable output.

The first visible difference is...of course the tail-cap screw. For easier distinguish from its XM-L2 brother the EC4,the designers have decided to color the tail screw in reddish color,but not exactly pure red. I made all possible to represent it in my pictures,but can't guarantee your monitor will match the settings on my and will reproduce the color correctly.
Anyway,I did not have any information about the red tail and opening the box I told myself-WT...is this a mistake.Am I receiving an entirely red flashlight?:laughing:
I figured out shortly after that,only the tail screw is in red.
Not the most beautiful color,but definitely gives personality to the EC4S and makes it really easy to discern,if you have also the EC4.




The upgrade over the EC4 is the new LED,which was promised to gives a neutral white floody beam.
Initially it was announced the EC4S will be equipped with a Cree MT-G2 led,but recently it was changed to a Cree XHP 50 LED.
(link to the official Cree XHP 50 page)
The XHP50 used here is a cool white LED producing cool white floody beam.
The XHP 50 is a newer LED,I believe it is driven at 6V here.

This is a picture of the two EC4S samples I tested.
The Neutral white prototype version on left.
The final Cool white version on the right.
Both LEDs are Cree XHP50.
The neutral white version so far remains only a test version. If you buy the EC4S,it will come with a cool white XHP50. 





The packaging and accessories.













Close up of the switch.
You can see well the stoving-varnish treated finish of the aluminum alloy body.








There is a blue indicator light under the silicone switch.
Can be used for battery voltage state,or as a location helping light.




Aluminum orange-peel reflector. Absolutely clean glass lens with anti-reflective coating.
Matte grey stainless steel bezel.








The two batteries have their own channel to prevent rattling,but there is no wall in between.
Batteries are always connected at the tailcap.No lock out possible by unscrewing the tailcap.



Protected batteries fit well in the body. Unprotected IMR work too.




A thick rubber/silicone gasket has the purpose to seal the tailcap and protect the interior from water and dust.
Two negative springs for more stability of the battery and better current flaw. 
The screw head,which is the pinkish part on the picture below is the element you have to rotate when attaching the tailcap.
This is why this part is machined differently and has anti-slip knurling.
Initially my impression of the dark pinkish finish was that it is well anodized,but after some time of use,the finish started to wear out.
I would prefer more conventional anodizing on this part,which is often moving and in contact with fingers,gloves,etc. 





The positive pole at the head has a physical reverse polarity protection.
I found it works with flat top IMR Keeppower 3500 batteries,though.




Standard 1/4 inch camera thread. You can use the flashlight mounted on a tripod.
Very useful for camping,or home work.





*User Interface*

Five brightness levels,plus 3 flashing modes.
Clicking the ON/OFF button activates/deactivates the light. Press and hold it for a second to activate Moonlight mode,directly from Off.
If you press and hold it,while the light is ON,this will activate the Blue indicator light under the button.Will turn the light Off,as well. 
There is no memory for the indicator light. If you need the indicator light for easier locating the flashlight,you have to activate it manually,every time. 

The second switch(with the four lines) is for mode selecting.
Press it to select among UltraLow-Low-Mid-High-Turbo modes,while the light is ON.
Press and hold it to activate Strobe mode. Press and hold again to activate Beacon and again to activate SOS mode.
Short press will return the constant light mode.
If you press and hold the switch for a second,while the light is OFF,this will activate Turbo mode directly.
Double click(the mode switch) starts Strobe mode immediately from OFF.

There is memory for the last used mode,except the 3 flashing modes.
The mode memory is extremely quick and does not require any special timings for ON/OFF to make it work.
If you leave it on High mode,it will start on High mode,no matter how quickly will turn it ON/OFF. 

The UI is quite easy to remember and use. I did not find any trouble using it in real life situations.
Quick and accurate response from the driver.

There is one more function of the mode switch. If you press it briefly,while the light is OFF,the blue indicator light will show the level of the batteries by simple blinking.
Three flashes indicates battery voltage over 50%.
Two indicates battery voltage below 50%.
One flash means the batteries need to be replaced.

There is also switch locking option. Press and hold both switches together,for over one second to turn the light Off and lock the switches.
To unlock,press and hold both switches again,for over one second.

*Run Time performance*
This time I tested only using a small cooling fan.
The EC4S gets hot after few minutes on Turbo mode.
On High mode it does stay quite cool. This means,if you use it in the cold weather,it will not heat on High mode,at all-providing constant 1000Lm light.

There was no thermal protection activating during the tests.
There is a low voltage warning-the light starts blinking as a Strobe,when the battery voltage is too low.
As you can see from the graph,I waited at least 60 minutes for a low voltage protection,but there was no such.
Battery voltage after the test 2,6V. Really low voltage. What I am observing is that the battery protection also does not trip,if the discharge current is very low. 

The discharge curve on Turbo mode shows that the output is highly depending on the voltage.
With decreasing the battery voltage,the brightness becomes lower.
The brightness is still impressive for a compact flashlight,but without a specific buck-boost driver,the output is performing as direct drive.

There is a difference in the performance on both tested samples.Yes,no flat regulation as many may expect,but for a 6V LED and no boost circuit,the result is normal.
The higher output is mostly a result of the different LED.The cool white LEDs usually show higher lumen output.
A small cooling fan was used to get the optimal performance.
No timed or thermal step down in my test.







A closer look at the first 60 minutes.






Here is a more interesting graph,comparing the High mode on the EC4S and Turbo on the EC4.
This is a comparison of the EC4 on its max mode,and the EC4S on High mode.
Lower output,longer run time.




*Lumen measurements:
30 sec after activating.
*
Turbo mode *1990* Lm (2080 Lm initial) (the max output highly depends on the batteries) 
High mode *934 *Lm
Mid mode *392* Lm
Low mode *61 *Lm
UltraLow mode *1 *Lm

Pretty well spaced brightness levels.

Because of the electronically working dual side switch,the flashlight is in Standby mode,while the light is OFF.
In this state the driver consumes small current from the batteries.
My measurements show: 350µA on the prototype and *180*µA* on the latest tested version.*
This will not be a problem if you use the flashlight every day,every week,but if you plan to keep it on the shelf without using it for weeks,or months,it is recommended to take out the batteries,to prevent unnecessary discharge.
It is definitely not a good choice for emergency flashlight that will stay without use,in case you need it someday.

Both EC4S samples I tested seems to have slightly different driver electronics,not only because of the lower Standby consumption,but also because of the way of controlling the brightness.
There is something like a PWM controlling on Low and Medium modes in the EC4 and EC4S NW. I don't detect any similar flickering in the Cool white EC4S sample.

Nitecore EC4 and EC4S side by side.
(neutral white EC4S sample on the two pictures below)



Crop of both LEDs,side by side.
Cree XM-L2 and Cree XHP 50



Because of the multi-core(die) design,the XHP requires an textured/orange-peel reflector for mixing well the beam and reducing the artifacts and darker zones in the center of the beam,which can obtain due to the empty space between the cores.
On a white wall I can clearly see different brightness zones in the center of the hotspot. 
Outdoor this should not be so noticeable.
The produced light is Cool white light.
*
Beamshots*

Indoor
5 meters, 1/6sec





















5 meters, 1/50sec









Some beam shots at 1 meter.
1 meter,1/20sec




 






1 meter, 1/250sec








1 meter, 1/500sec








*Outdoor*
*I took outdoor beam shots when I was testing the neutral white sample and it is the EC4S on all pictures below.
The actual variant has much cooler white beam and is slightly brighter.
Beam shape seems identical.
*
~75 meters distance










I measured the EC4 1000Lm, the EC4S 1900Lm
Peak beam intensity according to the specifications= EC4 26000cd, EC4S 19600cd
I measured higher intensity on the EC4 than the stated,~30000cd. Did not measure the EC4S,yet.

Crop




Both flashlights
~75 meters








At close distance
Nitecore EC4S NW all modes.








 





Close distance
EC4S NW Turbo
EC4 Turbo



Close distance
EC4S NW High
EC4 Turbo (actually the same output)




*I tried also the EC4S NW with the Olight M22 diffuser and the result is awesome!*










*Good points:*
Clean well rounded design; Comfortable grip; Relatively lightweight; Can be defined as compact; Good build quality; Very high maximum brightness for its size;Low voltage warning;
Good relatively wide and floody beam;
Great dual switch User interface; Good run time curve on High mode,thanks to the higher voltage of two batteries; Well spaced modes;
It is easy to find a good diffuser cap for even more flood beam;

*Weak points:*
Not constant on Turbo mode; You will not get the max brightness every time you turn On the flashlight,or after a minute of use; No low voltage protection in my tests;
There are artifacts in the beam; No pocket clip ; High Standby consumption; No lock out the tailcap possible; The thermal step down is not programmed as needed;

Thanks for reading!

Thanks to Nitecore for providing the EC4S samples for test and review!


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## markr6 (Sep 11, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) REVIEW*

Thanks for the review. I've been waiting for the "full" version


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## sidecross (Sep 11, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) REVIEW*

For people who do like the Nitecore EC4 I would expect the prices for this light will drop when the newer EC4S is officially released.


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## scintillator (Sep 11, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) REVIEW*

Thanks for the great review,fun to read.


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## SCEMan (Sep 11, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) REVIEW*

Very informative review with excellent images and beamshots. 
Thanks for your time and effort preparing this.:twothumbs


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## akhyar (Sep 11, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) REVIEW*

Thanks for the excellent and detail review.
So much hope for this light, but the lack of regulation in the Turbo mode and the large standby current are real bummer


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## Parrot Quack (Sep 11, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) REVIEW*

Thanks for the review. I know a lot of effort goes into a review of this kind and I appreciate all of the effort.

Who knows if the light should be added to the stable. Time will tell if I add this light. My apologies for the negative reading post as that is a reflection of my frustration with what I read. Either which way, thank-you for the very well thought out review as it's the facts of the review that are causing me the troubles, not the review itself. 

By chance, did Nitecore mention a release date?

.......................................................................:goodjob:


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## tobrien (Sep 11, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) REVIEW*

FL, I actually didn't look to see who posted this review prior to viewing it, but when i saw the _amazing_ photography, I thought to myself "this is definitely a 'FlashLion' review"

I was right


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## Ryp (Sep 11, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) REVIEW*

Thanks for the great photographs + review!


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## KeepingItLight (Sep 11, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) REVIEW*

I love the floody beam on the *Nitecore EC4S*!

I see that the 2150 lumens promised by turbo mode is very short lived. It drops to 90% in something like only 2 minutes on your runtime chart. Although that is mildly disappointing, I don't think it is a big problem. I have learned to treat turbo modes as temporary modes, useful only for short periods. Turbo on the EC4S certainly meets that standard. The decline from 90% to 50% is less precipitous. The EC4S reaches 50% in about 53 minutes.

More interesting to me is performance on high. Your chart shows a flat, well-regulated 1100 lumens that lasts for 75 minutes. After that, the EC4S falls into a gentle direct-drive decline.

One of the big concerns is the large standby current. Nitecore seems not to care about it. Several of its releases this year have significant parasitic drains. Other flashlight makers, such as Eagletac and Zebralight, have no trouble producing models with minuscule standby currents. I would like to see Nitecore do the same.

Did you check standby current when the EC4S is locked out? In its electronic-lockout mode, parasitic current might be lower than when it is not locked out.

Your treatment of over-discharge is top-notch. Other reviewers should emulate you. Readers take note, in tests by FlashLion, _over-discharge is possible with the EC4S even when you are using protected batteries._

Thanks for a great review!


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## sidecross (Sep 11, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) REVIEW*

My thanks too for an excellent review. I have the EC4 and like this light, but it would not be a good choice for 'wait to be needed flashlight'. I use mine every day and always have spare batteries. Prices for the Nitecore EC4 have been low as $49.


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## twistedraven (Sep 11, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) REVIEW*

The turbo mode is useless to me, but the flat regulation without getting hot in high is nice. It would be interesting to compare the EC4s's high mode with the new TK35UE high mode. Fenix lists their high mode to last 3 hours, but I wonder under what regulation-- if it's similar or not.


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## markr6 (Sep 11, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) REVIEW*



twistedraven said:


> The turbo mode is useless to me, but the flat regulation without getting hot in high is nice. It would be interesting to compare the EC4s's high mode with the new TK35UE high mode. Fenix lists their high mode to last 3 hours, but I wonder under what regulation-- if it's similar or not.



TK35UE, 2015 just to be clear (I assume). Gosh Fenix, Eagletac, really getting confusing with these model numbers. The date thing really screws up web searches!


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## Timothybil (Sep 11, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) REVIEW*

I am really disappointed at the lack of regulation in Turbo mode. What the graph tells me is that after a few minutes, I would actually get more light from using High mode than from the depleted Turbo. Not desirable at all. If I buy a light with specs of 2000 lumens on turbo, with ATR to prevent overheating, I expect to get as close to 2000 lumens as possible until the cells run dry, not some dying curve after a few minutes of the claimed output. Otherwise, it seems like a nice light. I like the beam - If what I wanted was a cheaper flooder than the TM06, it looks like this could fit the bill. But that lack of regulation kills it for me. Not that I am really looking, my TM16 provides enough flood for my needs as well as the ability to really reach out and touch someone.


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## sidecross (Sep 11, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) REVIEW*



Timothybil said:


> I am really disappointed at the lack of regulation in Turbo mode. What the graph tells me is that after a few minutes, I would actually get more light from using High mode than from the depleted Turbo. Not desirable at all. If I buy a light with specs of 2000 lumens on turbo, with ATR to prevent overheating, I expect to get as close to 2000 lumens as possible until the cells run dry, not some dying curve after a few minutes of the claimed output. Otherwise, it seems like a nice light. I like the beam - If what I wanted was a cheaper flooder than the TM06, it looks like this could fit the bill. But that lack of regulation kills it for me. Not that I am really looking, my TM16 provides enough flood for my needs as well as the ability to really reach out and touch someone.



I am in agreement, if I want high output I use my Nitecore TM26.


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## Stefano (Sep 11, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) REVIEW*

Thanks for review.
Great beamshot


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## markr6 (Sep 11, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) REVIEW*



Timothybil said:


> I am really disappointed at the lack of regulation in Turbo mode. What the graph tells me is that after a few minutes, I would actually get more light from using High mode than from the depleted Turbo. Not desirable at all. If I buy a light with specs of 2000 lumens on turbo, with ATR to prevent overheating, I expect to get as close to 2000 lumens as possible until the cells run dry, not some dying curve after a few minutes of the claimed output. Otherwise, it seems like a nice light. I like the beam - If what I wanted was a cheaper flooder than the TM06, it looks like this could fit the bill. But that lack of regulation kills it for me. Not that I am really looking, my TM16 provides enough flood for my needs as well as the ability to really reach out and touch someone.



Yeah, it seems like a long time ago that I said "sounds too good to be true" or something to that effect. TK35 it is...if I must have a 2x18650


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## KeepingItLight (Sep 11, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) REVIEW*



markr6 said:


> Yeah, it seems like a long time ago that I said "sounds too good to be true" or something to that effect. TK35 it is...if I must have a 2x18650



It does now seem that there are a few clouds in silver lining!

Don't forget the *Nitecore P36*. It has a worse standby drain than the *Nitecore EC4S*, but the difference is that you can easily lock out the P36 with a twist of the tail cap. The P36 has ten constant output levels ranging between 2 and 2000 lumens. It uses a simple mode dial to select levels. It also has direct access to low, high, and strobe from off. 

One more thing: the P36 runs a neutral-white *Cree MT-G2* emitter.


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## Str8stroke (Sep 11, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) REVIEW*

Outstanding review sir. Very nice work.


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## Chaitanya (Sep 12, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) REVIEW*

Thanks for the review, looks like this is perfect light for photography purposes. Could you ask for the NW version of EC4 for review? It has been selling in India for quite sometime now. And a direct comparison between the two would really awesome.


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## FlashLion (Sep 12, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) REVIEW*

Thank you all for the comments!

Nitecore contacted me to inform,that the reviewed by me version of the EC4S is a* pre-release* version and the measured parameters could differ from the end retail version.
Nitecore engineers are still working on improving the driver circuit for better performance. They will upgrade the EC4S with a "new power management circuit".
Let's cross fingers and hope they will correct also the high standby current :thumbsup:.

So,this is probably why they slowed down the release.
Once I get the final version,I will update the review with new data.


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## Parrot Quack (Sep 12, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) REVIEW*



FlashLion said:


> Thank you all for the comments!
> 
> ---snip---
> 
> So,this is probably why they slowed down the release. Once I get the final version,I will update the review.



.......................................................................:thumbsup:

I sure hope they remove what I think to be a direct drive circuit and change it to a circuit similar to the EC4.


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## G. Scott H. (Sep 12, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) REVIEW*

Most important to me: fix the low voltage warning. If the light is supposed to flash at low voltage, and you got the cells down to 2.6v without tripping that particular function, then something is wrong.


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## akhyar (Sep 12, 2015)

*NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*

My hope that they can fix the high standby current, improve the regulation and fix the low voltage warning as from what I read, non-proteced IMR batteries are they way to go for the extra lumens.
If the production version still display the same problems as the pre-released sample review by FL, maybe I just jump the gun on the old EC4 as with discount code, they almost hit $40 nowadays from some retailers. Hope that it can breach the $40 barrier once the EC4S is launched [emoji16]


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## skelton660 (Sep 12, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*

Me thinks they are waiting until EC4 sales flatline *THEN* release this, knowing those who bought the EC4 will no doubt buy this.


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## Parrot Quack (Sep 12, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*



skelton660 said:


> Me thinks they are waiting until EC4 sales flatline *THEN* release this, knowing those who bought the EC4 will no doubt buy this.



Depending on the regulator Nitecore chooses to use. Like the regulator in the EC4.....yes. Like what was shown in the review......probably not.


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## sidecross (Sep 12, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*

I have no interest in buying the Nitecore EC4S even before it was tested here. As I wrote before if I need high output I will use my Nitecore TM26. I do like like the EC4 even though it is not a champion of top notch engineering. I bought a second EC4 for $48.71 shipped and it is working fine.


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## akhyar (Sep 21, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*

I found this at aliexpress, and the store is selling it t US$97.95.
Not sure if this is thisl price is sanctioned by Nitecore or from an unauthorised seller.
@Flashlion, the store uses some of your photos in this review. 

http://www.aliexpress.com/store/pro...ion-18650-14500-16340/613291_32298000153.html


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## FlashLion (Sep 21, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*



sidecross said:


> I have no interest in buying the Nitecore EC4S even before it was tested here. As I wrote before if I need high output I will use my Nitecore TM26. I do like like the EC4 even though it is not a champion of top notch engineering. I bought a second EC4 for $48.71 shipped and it is working fine.


I see a potential in the EC4S,even with this driver. Using a high power flashlight on its highest mode is not a must. Can be used on the lower 1000Lm mode and the plus is the better beam. This of course,if high throw is not preferred.



akhyar said:


> I found this at aliexpress, and the store is selling it t US$97.95.
> Not sure if this is thisl price is sanctioned by Nitecore or from an unauthorised seller.
> @Flashlion, the store uses some of your photos in this review.
> 
> http://www.aliexpress.com/store/pro...ion-18650-14500-16340/613291_32298000153.html


Good find *akhyar*!
So,they sell a flashlight that is not released yet? 
My sample of the EC4S came in a standard Nitecore retail box and does not seem to be a special test/review sample.
I suspect that there may be some more EC4S like my produced and they have to sell out. I could be wrong,of course,as I am very far from manufacturing and selling processes and don't have enough info about what is going on. I just get a flashlight and test it for the review.
The EC4S is already revealed on the main website.I wonder,if they have finished the driver yet.Time will tell. Their example pictures of the run time are hard to believe,though.


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## zs&tas (Sep 22, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*

I think high power lights must use the right cells, I would like to know if using imr, after half hour of use in a mid mode what turbo brightness can be reached, for me that would be a real world scenario, I suspect for many too.

Edit: forgot to say , great review as usual, and stunning photos ! :twothumbs


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## FlashLion (Sep 22, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*



zs&tas said:


> I think high power lights must use the right cells, I would like to know if using imr, after half hour of use in a mid mode what turbo brightness can be reached, for me that would be a real world scenario, I suspect for many too.
> 
> Edit: forgot to say , great review as usual, and stunning photos ! :twothumbs


Thanks for reading *zs&tas* !
I will keep in mind your recommendation for my next runtime tests,eventually on the final version of this flashlight.


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## Parrot Quack (Sep 23, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*

Just FYI, the EC4S has been released for sale on Amazon. I ordered a copy with a pair of Orbtronic 3400 mAh batteries that should be here early next week.


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## Tac Gunner (Oct 10, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*

I'm tempted to pick one of these up because I have a really good coupon but I can't decide if I'm ok with its direct drive turbo. I have a p60 with an xhp50 and love it so this seems like a good step up, better heat sink and it does have better runtimes than my p60 that is running on 2x18350's. I can also get a 2014 Tk35ue for a good price so I'm in between which of these two would be the better choice.


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## Parrot Quack (Oct 10, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*

Unless you're in need of a sweet floody light, I'd look at a different Nitecore light.......something like a TM16 or a TC90. FWIW, both are sweet lights.


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## KeepingItLight (Oct 10, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*



Tac Gunner said:


> I can also get a 2014 Tk35ue for a good price...



I like the *Nitecore P36* better than the 2014 *Fenix TK35UE*. Both use the *Cree MT-G2* emitter, but the P36 has more throw and much better mode spacing. The only knock on the P36 is its high standby current. A quick 1/4 turn of the tail cap keeps mine locked out.


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## Tac Gunner (Oct 11, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*

Well I have considered the P36 as well, I have a coupon that makes it cheaper than the tk35ue. I may end up getting an EC4S because of the coupon and while turbo is direct drive (at least in this sample, final production might be different) high is well regulated and still bright enough for most tasks. I have considered no bigger lights like the tm16, k60, tk75, etc but I wouldn't use them as often compared to a smaller light like these as most of big lights end up being at home or in the vehicle when the need arises for them, the smaller lights are what I carry most often.


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## bizchng (Oct 18, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*

I am also thorn between P36 and EC4S ... *sigh ... In the end I may end up with the more affordable one ...


----------



## picrthis (Oct 18, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*

Looks like they eliminated the blue light buttons too on the final product, can't be used for location now.


----------



## DanM (Oct 18, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*

Received my EC4S Friday, looks like a nice light, but mine is going back. The threads on the tail cap are cut very poor so that the tail cap poops off with just a little pressure on it. Come on Nitecore I have 
the EC4 and the threads on it look twice as deep as on the EC4S.


----------



## Tac Gunner (Oct 19, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*



bizchng said:


> I am also thorn between P36 and EC4S ... *sigh ... In the end I may end up with the more affordable one ...



That's what I'm thinking lol



DanM said:


> Received my EC4S Friday, looks like a nice light, but mine is going back. The threads on the tail cap are cut very poor so that the tail cap poops off with just a little pressure on it. Come on Nitecore I have
> the EC4 and the threads on it look twice as deep as on the EC4S.



Sorry to hear that, hope it isn't a wide spread problem though. Other than that issue is there any differences from the review sample?


----------



## D6859 (Oct 19, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*



picrthis said:


> Looks like they eliminated the blue light buttons too on the final product, can't be used for location now.



Does that mean the standby drain is lower than 350 uA?


----------



## xed888 (Oct 20, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*



D6859 said:


> Does that mean the standby drain is lower than 350 uA?



+1


----------



## FlashLion (Oct 20, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*



DanM said:


> Received my EC4S Friday, looks like a nice light, but mine is going back. The threads on the tail cap are cut very poor so that the tail cap poops off with just a little pressure on it. Come on Nitecore I have
> the EC4 and the threads on it look twice as deep as on the EC4S.


I hope Nitecore will take seriously their quality control inspection and will not spoil the good impression of the EC4/S.



picrthis said:


> Looks like they eliminated the blue light buttons too on the final product, can't be used for location now.


I wonder,if all these extra features for instant access to different modes,location flashing and voltage indication require more specific electronics,which causes the high standby drain. Less electronics,less points for defects.



bizchng said:


> I am also thorn between P36 and EC4S ... *sigh ... In the end I may end up with the more affordable one ...


For me,the location of the switch could be also a crucial factor. The switch on the EC4/S can be accessed with a different grip. I don't have the P36,but in my opinion to be possible to activate it,is needed to keep your thumb on the tail,which requires holding the flashlight with the hand up.


----------



## JvdW (Oct 20, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*



bizchng said:


> I am also thorn between P36 and EC4S ... *sigh ... In the end I may end up with the more affordable one ...



Same here, but as FlashLion mentioned the different grip...
For me the EC4(s) is more practical.


----------



## Parrot Quack (Oct 20, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*

Repeating myself, I have both the EC4 and the EC4S and prefer the EC4. The EC4 is more throwy and the EC4S is more floody.

Personally, I love the tint and throw of the EC4. I can't say anything bad about the EC4S but I can't say anything good either. Throw or flood, personal choice.


----------



## markr6 (Oct 20, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*

Took my EC4S with me hunting for 3 nights this past weekend. I sure missed my NW lights  This made the (first for the season) SNOW look pretty blue. But nice balance of throw/flood for being in the woods.


----------



## gottawearshades (Oct 20, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*




D6859 said:


> Does that mean the standby drain is lower than 350 uA?


----------



## markr6 (Oct 20, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*



D6859 said:


> Does that mean the standby drain is lower than 350 uA?



Not until they flush out a huge batch of old stock at crazy discounts just like the EA4


----------



## FlashLion (Oct 22, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*

Good news!
Another sample of the EC4S is flying to me. Will post new measurements once I receive it.:thumbsup:


----------



## martinaee (Oct 23, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*

Oh cool. I didn't realize the back was a 1/4 inch thread mount. That's nice and gives it a lot of versatility if you have a sturdy tripod.


----------



## markr6 (Oct 23, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*

Am I the only one that disagrees with Nitecore calling this a neutral white? I think it's clearly a cool white. Not bad; just definitely not a neutral.


----------



## markr6 (Oct 23, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*



FlashLion said:


> Good news!
> Another sample of the EC4S is flying to me. Will post new measurements once I receive it.:thumbsup:



Any ideas on why they're sending a second light? Do they want you to review the "official" production version? Maybe they updated something? Maybe people buying these at 50% off specials are getting old versions so they can clear out that stock and replace it with the updated version?

I wish I knew for sure...this light has always raised some flags even before it was released. I'm still enjoying mine, though!


----------



## FlashLion (Oct 23, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*

The screw mount is a great option.Good for using the flashlight as a work lamp.With diffuser will be good also for some photographic needs.

My information is that they send me a test/prototype sample (by mistake) and the final version should differ in performance.
The sample I reviewed above definitely has a neutral white LED. 
As I posted in one of my previous comments,this sample came in a standard retail box with all accessories.Nothing to tell this is not a final version.


----------



## markr6 (Oct 23, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*

Good deal! Looking forward to the update. Thanks!


----------



## FlashLion (Oct 28, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*

OK.The current(probably final) version of the EC4S arrived.
No changes in the design,or user interface. The blinking blue switch indicator is still available.





The newest thing is here:




Even the flashlight was advertised as neutral white,in the actual version it has а cool white XHP50 led.
This is a bit disappointing for people that prefer warmer light(including me).
Another thing that is noticeable-the cool white beam has more easily noticeable artifacts in the hotspot.

The good news is the Standby current draw. It is now much lower ~180µA.
I had no time yet to test the output regulation.


----------



## markr6 (Oct 28, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*

Bummer on the CW. I wish mine was warmer, but I still think it's OK for a CW (and I don't like CW!)

I do notice artifacts in the center of the beam, but only when testing on a wall and while moving and focusing on that area.

I purchased mine right when they came out. Do you think it would be the lower 180uA drain, or is that something they may have changed halfway thru the release?


----------



## FlashLion (Oct 28, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*



markr6 said:


> Bummer on the CW. I wish mine was warmer, but I still think it's OK for a CW (and I don't like CW!)
> 
> I do notice artifacts in the center of the beam, but only when testing on a wall and while moving and focusing on that area.
> 
> I purchased mine right when they came out. Do you think it would be the lower 180uA drain, or is that something they may have changed halfway thru the release?


I don't know. If possible,try to find a DMM and measure your EC4S. This will be helpful for anyone that bought from the first samples.


----------



## markr6 (Oct 28, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*



FlashLion said:


> I don't know. If possible,try to find a DMM and measure your EC4S. This will be helpful for anyone that bought from the first samples.



I figured this required more than just a DMM. I have a decent one. Is it easy to measure?


----------



## FlashLion (Oct 28, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*



markr6 said:


> I figured this required more than just a DMM. I have a decent one. Is it easy to measure?


The current is not high,so the regular test leads are ok. Just remove the tailcap and connect one probe to each of the batteries.
I measured it with a cheap DMM a few moments ago and it gives the same result as the more expensive one. If your DMM have different ranges put it on 2000µA.
Initially may be displayed over-range,because of the blinking blue switch. You have to wait it before seeing the actual Standby drain.


----------



## markr6 (Oct 28, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*



FlashLion said:


> The current is not high,so the regular test leads are ok. Just remove the tailcap and connect one probe to each of the batteries.
> I measured it with a cheap DMM a few moments ago and it gives the same result as the more expensive one. If your DMM have different ranges put it on 2000µA.
> Initially may be displayed over-range,because of the blinking blue switch. You have to wait it before seeing the actual Standby drain.



I don't have the DMM with me right now but I look forward to trying this later today. Thanks!

*OK I just checked my EC4S. 0.060mA, or 60uA. I can live with that!*


----------



## xed888 (Oct 29, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*



markr6 said:


> I don't have the DMM with me right now but I look forward to trying this later today. Thanks!
> 
> *OK I just checked my EC4S. 0.060mA, or 60uA. I can live with that!*



There is still a huge variation between 60uA and Flashlion's 180uA though...


----------



## martinaee (Oct 29, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*

Maybe I'm just dumb, but how does the bottom (the part with the red end/knurling) actually stay on the light? Does it screw in somehow? Looking at the pics I don't see what's actually holding the end physically and securely against the bottom of the light itself. Does something push out of the sides into the threads in the base when you turn the red part?

*edit:* Nevermind... I think I see now. There are screw threads hidden behind the little "flaps" that say Nitecore, right? Secure into the middle of the light. Also what are those little flaps that huge the light that say Nitecore made out of? Rubber? Or is it all aluminum?

Also, what a sweet light. I want one lol. What a powerhouse for 2 18650's and very compact. I like that it has crazy output, but more throw than say an MT-G2 in there. A bummer is the XHP50 not being offered in the neutral white version. They have neutral white XHP50s, but don't want to offer them? Lame.


----------



## markr6 (Oct 29, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*



xed888 said:


> There is still a huge variation between 60uA and Flashlion's 180uA though...



Yeah I'm thankful I got lucky there. Or maybe most are around 60uA and Flashlion was UNlucky? Either way, 60 is much better than I expected. Hell, I would take 180 over some of the reviews showing the EC4 upwards of 300-500!



martinaee said:


> Maybe I'm just dumb, but how does the bottom (the part with the red end/knurling) actually stay on the light? Does it screw in somehow? Looking at the pics I don't see what's actually holding the end physically and securely against the bottom of the light itself. Does something push out of the sides into the threads in the base when you turn the red part?
> 
> *edit:* Nevermind... I think I see now. There are screw threads hidden behind the little "flaps" that say Nitecore, right? Secure into the middle of the light. Also what are those little flaps that huge the light that say Nitecore made out of? Rubber? Or is it all aluminum?
> 
> Also, what a sweet light. I want one lol. What a powerhouse for 2 18650's and very compact. I like that it has crazy output, but more throw than say an MT-G2 in there. A bummer is the XHP50 not being offered in the neutral white version. They have neutral white XHP50s, but don't want to offer them? Lame.



Yes the threads are in between the flaps. They are also aluminum.


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## RCLumens (Oct 29, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*

Greetings - Mine should be arriving today along with a Olight R40. Am going to post some photos hoepfully by tomorrow comparing some of these lights. I too was intrigued with the output, size and relatve simplicity of the UI. I like being able to access low ad turbo at any given time in addition to having a memory mode set to one of the more mid levels.


----------



## dts71 (Oct 30, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50(2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*

Any runtime tests yet? [emoji6]


----------



## markr6 (Oct 30, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50(2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*



dts71 said:


> Any runtime tests yet? [emoji6]



FlashLion did a really nice review on a PRERELEASE version, so take it with a grain of salt.

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...C4S-XHP50(2sx18650)-PreRelease-Version-REVIEW

Also, his parasitic drain measured 350uA; mine measures 60uA. So that could be a change Nitecore made on the final version. Or, simply a fluke on either of our lights.


----------



## creegeek (Oct 30, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50(2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*



markr6 said:


> FlashLion did a really nice review on a PRERELEASE version, so take it with a grain of salt.
> 
> http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...C4S-XHP50(2sx18650)-PreRelease-Version-REVIEW
> 
> Also, his parasitic drain measured 350uA; mine measures 60uA. So that could be a change Nitecore made on the final version. Or, simply a fluke on either of our lights.



Its been a while since my school electronics class, so forgive me, if I wanted to measure the parasitic on my EA45S... is it simply a case of removing the tail-cap and putting my meter in current mode and completing the circuit with my test leads (on the exposed battery terminals)?


----------



## markr6 (Oct 30, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50(2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*



creegeek said:


> Its been a while since my school electronics class, so forgive me, if I wanted to measure the parasitic on my EA45S... is it simply a case of removing the tail-cap and putting my meter in current mode and completing the circuit with my test leads (on the exposed battery terminals)?



Yes. I didn't know it was that easy, but FlashLion told me to do that and it worked fine. It will be a little higher for the first 2 seconds if the switch light is blinking, but then it will level off. I think mine was 70uA while flashing, 60uA after it stopped blinking.


----------



## akhyar (Oct 30, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50(2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*



markr6 said:


> FlashLion did a really nice review on a PRERELEASE version, so take it with a grain of salt.
> 
> http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...C4S-XHP50(2sx18650)-PreRelease-Version-REVIEW
> 
> Also, his parasitic drain measured 350uA; mine measures 60uA. So that could be a change Nitecore made on the final version. Or, simply a fluke on either of our lights.



One user at BLF who just received his EC4S from Banggood's yesterday measured 325uA on his Fluke 189.
Mine just been delivered today but I'm outstation until mid November


----------



## markr6 (Oct 30, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50(2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*



akhyar said:


> One user at BLF who just received his EC4S from Banggood's yesterday measured 325uA on his Fluke 189.
> Mine just been delivered today but I'm outstation until mid November



Ouch!

Mine was purchased Oct. 3 on Amazon, sold by Eastshine (their battery package deal). I guess I'll stop thinking about getting another and just be happy with the one with a reasonable drain.


----------



## creegeek (Oct 30, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50(2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*

I'll measure my lights this evening. I have an EA21 (easy), EA41 (might be hard to test), and the EA45S (easy). I'll post back here with numbers.


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## mnm (Oct 30, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50(2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*

very good review. really helped me to pick the one i want


----------



## Parrot Quack (Oct 30, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50(2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*



markr6 said:


> I guess I'll stop thinking about getting another and just be happy with the one with a reasonable drain.



Okay.


----------



## creegeek (Oct 30, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50(2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*

Measured standby drain:

* Nitecore EA45S standby current 0.09mAh. After 556 days an Eneloop Pro will be at 50% of capacity
* Nitecore EC11 standby current 0.09mAh. After 347 days an Energizer CR123A will be at 50% of capacity
* Nitecore EA21 standby current 0.34mAh. After 147 days an Eneloop Pro will be at 50% of capacity
* Nitecore EA41 standby current 0.55mAh. After 91 days an Eneloop Pro will be at 50% of capacity

The Nitecore EA41 needs to hang its head in shame. At least it has a form of tail-cap lockout - just unscrew "enough" and no power will flow. The Nitecore EA21 tail-cap lockout is what you'd expect and a great way to store for emergencies. Same is true for EC11 which is my first-aid flashlight.


----------



## FlashLion (Oct 30, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50(2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*



markr6 said:


> I don't have the DMM with me right now but I look forward to trying this later today. Thanks!
> 
> *OK I just checked my EC4S. 0.060mA, or 60uA. I can live with that!*


Great! This is quite acceptable. Interesting what causes so big difference between the flashlights.



martinaee said:


> Maybe I'm just dumb, but how does the bottom (the part with the red end/knurling) actually stay on the light? Does it screw in somehow? Looking at the pics I don't see what's actually holding the end physically and securely against the bottom of the light itself. Does something push out of the sides into the threads in the base when you turn the red part?
> 
> *edit:* Nevermind... I think I see now. There are screw threads hidden behind the little "flaps" that say Nitecore, right? Secure into the middle of the light. Also what are those little flaps that huge the light that say Nitecore made out of? Rubber? Or is it all aluminum?
> 
> Also, what a sweet light. I want one lol. What a powerhouse for 2 18650's and very compact. I like that it has crazy output, but more throw than say an MT-G2 in there. A bummer is the XHP50 not being offered in the neutral white version. They have neutral white XHP50s, but don't want to offer them? Lame.


The red part is the head of a big screw,which threads are between the flaps. The "flaps" are one piece with the tail cap,made of aluminum alloy.
Having now both,with a neutral white and cool white LED,the NW is definite winner in terms of beam pattern and color rendering.
The only reason I see for using cool white LEDs is their higher maximum output,but this is still not a good reason,as a difference of 200 lumens in the highest output is hardly noticeable by eyes.



RCLumens said:


> Greetings - Mine should be arriving today along with a Olight R40. Am going to post some photos hoepfully by tomorrow comparing some of these lights. I too was intrigued with the output, size and relatve simplicity of the UI. I like being able to access low ad turbo at any given time in addition to having a memory mode set to one of the more mid levels.


Looking forward to the comparison! Thanks




mnm said:


> very good review. really helped me to pick the one i want


Glad to help! 



dts71 said:


> Any runtime tests yet? [emoji6]


The measurements are taken.Next step is forming them in a graph.

Since the first review was on something like a "collectors edition" flashlight(I don't know how many of these with the NW led exist),I will probably modify this review adding the new data and leaving some of the old. There's no need to start another thread. 

Something interesting that I noticed in the new sample-there is a lot of dust on the reflector,inner side of the glass and over the LED.There is also a scratch near the switch.
Any other flashlight I have tested so far from Nitecore,was in perfect condition.


----------



## FlashLion (Oct 31, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50(2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*

These are the results I got with the same 3100mAh batteries.

First is the run time on Turbo mode.
There is a difference in the performance on both tested samples.Yes,no flat regulation as many may expect,but for a 6V LED and no boost circuit,the result is normal. The higher output may be a result of the different LED.The cool white LEDs usually show higher lumen output.
A small cooling fan was used to get the optimal performance.
No timed or thermal step down in my test.






A closer look at the first 60 minutes.





This is a comparison of the EC4 on its max mode,and the EC4S on High mode.
Lower output,longer run time.


----------



## Parrot Quack (Oct 31, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50(2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*

I love the EC4 and will put up with the EC4S. Thanks for all your time and effort with measurements and graphing. Very nice.

At a ~1000 lumens, maybe I can use the EC4S as an extended run EC4.


----------



## sidecross (Oct 31, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50(2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*

The new CREE XHP50 sure is an improvement in battery efficiency.


----------



## dts71 (Oct 31, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50(2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*

Thanks for the updated run times!


----------



## markr6 (Oct 31, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50(2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*

Good stuff. This is the one dirty, rotten cool white light I have that I can put up with since I like everything else about it.


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## dts71 (Nov 3, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*

Would it be possible to get a quick beam comparison between EC4 and EC4s (production) to check the tint?


----------



## FlashLion (Nov 4, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*



dts71 said:


> Would it be possible to get a quick beam comparison between EC4 and EC4s (production) to check the tint?



5 meters, 1/6sec





















5 meters, 1/50sec









Some beam shots at 1 meter.
1 meter,1/20sec




 






1 meter, 1/250sec








1 meter, 1/500sec






1427


----------



## dts71 (Nov 4, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*

Thanks for the beam shots - much appreciated!


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## FlashLion (Nov 10, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*



dts71 said:


> Thanks for the beam shots - much appreciated!


You're welcome!

Review updated for compliance with the latest EC4S sample.:thumbsup:


----------



## gregorv (Nov 12, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*

Maybe this was asked before, does this FL have step down from turbo to high mode. If yes, how long is turbo mode. 
Thank you


----------



## FlashLion (Nov 12, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*



gregorv said:


> Maybe this was asked before, does this FL have step down from turbo to high mode. If yes, how long is turbo mode.
> Thank you


There is no timed step down. You can see the Turbo curve in my run test.The output is decreasing with the voltage.
There should be a thermal step down,or something like that,but I did not managed to activate it.


----------



## gregorv (Nov 12, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*

Interesting, how hot is FL after 10 or 20 minutes..., did something melt? :naughty:
Can you have it in the hands?

I forgot to mention, thank you for your very nice review.


----------



## FlashLion (Nov 12, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*

Thanks for reading *gregorv*!
Yes,it gets hot after 10 minutes and will not be very comfortable in hand.Nothing melt in my tests and I use it as a home work lamp,too. But I recommend switching it to a lower mode when you think it is hot,to protect the batteries,because they get hot too.They are in direct contact with the aluminum body.


----------



## sandotter (Nov 17, 2015)

I got my EC4S today and I like it very much. It would be a perfekt flashlight for me if it had a removable clip. I measured 275µA parasitic drain with my FLUKE 87 V and 3400mAh 18650s from Eagletac. The current in turbo mode was about 2.1A.
I repeated my measurements with Duracell CR123A primaries. The parasitic drain was 285µA and the current in turbo mode 3A, which is double the max continuous current for CR123A primary cells, that are usually rated with 1.5A. Ups.


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## sidecross (Nov 17, 2015)

sandotter said:


> I got my EC4S today and I like it very much. It would be a perfekt flashlight for me if it had a removable clip. I measured 295µA parasitic drain with my FLUKE 87 V and 3400mAh 18650s from Eagletac. The current in turbo mode was about 1.7A which ist a little bit above the max continuous current for CR123A primary cells, that are usually rated with 1.5A


Thank you for the data.


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## FlashLion (Nov 19, 2015)

sandotter said:


> I got my EC4S today and I like it very much. It would be a perfekt flashlight for me if it had a removable clip. I measured 275µA parasitic drain with my FLUKE 87 V and 3400mAh 18650s from Eagletac. The current in turbo mode was about 2.1A.
> I repeated my measurements with Duracell CR123A primaries. The parasitic drain was 285µA and the current in turbo mode 3A, which is double the max continuous current for CR123A primary cells, that are usually rated with 1.5A. Ups.


Thanks for the data *sandotter*!
You can try to made a custom clip and to attach it with a screw to the tripod mount.
Thanks for the measurements!


----------



## D6859 (Nov 20, 2015)

I noticed Shenzhen Best Quality Ourdoor Light is using pictures from your review in AliExpress.. I guess you earn quite an amount of $$$ from the copyright royalties, do you? 

I other news: I was just about to order EC4S when I noticed Nitecore has announced EC4SW (W for NW) coming. I have to re-consider my options again...


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## FlashLion (Nov 20, 2015)

D6859 said:


> I noticed Shenzhen Best Quality Ourdoor Light is using pictures from your review in AliExpress.. I guess you earn quite an amount of $$$ from the copyright royalties, do you?
> 
> I other news: I was just about to order EC4S when I noticed Nitecore has announced EC4SW (W for NW) coming. I have to re-consider my options again...


LOL I can only dream someone to pay for pictures...
Can you pm me the link. I have trouble to find it.
Edit: I found it.It was mentioned earlier in the comments.
They never asked me for permission,but at least keep my watermark clearly visible,which may attract someone to visit my blog and read the good and the bad about this flashlight.


Thanks for the info about the second version of the EC4S. It is much better with the NW LED and I am happy to see Nitecore give us the choice.


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## kbear99 (Nov 21, 2015)

Great review. Was on the fence between this and the EC4 but your High-mode graph tells all. It's surprising how much longer the EC4S can run. But now I hear about a new NW version. What's a guy to do?? Hoping to see a EC4W review from you


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## markr6 (Nov 21, 2015)

kbear99 said:


> Great review. Was on the fence between this and the EC4 but your High-mode graph tells all. It's surprising how much longer the EC4S can run. But now I hear about a new NW version. What's a guy to do?? Hoping to see a EC4W review from you



EC4SW available for preorder at Battery Junction. ETA still unknown. I think I'll wait for a big discount this time.


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## D6859 (Nov 22, 2015)

FlashLion said:


> LOL I can only dream someone to pay for pictures...
> Can you pm me the link. I have trouble to find it.
> Edit: I found it.It was mentioned earlier in the comments.
> They never asked me for permission,but at least keep my watermark clearly visible,which may attract someone to visit my blog and read the good and the bad about this flashlight.
> ...



They should provide you with the new flashlight for using your pics. It won't hurt asking, does it?


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## FlashLion (Nov 24, 2015)

D6859 said:


> They should provide you with the new flashlight for using your pics. It won't hurt asking, does it?


PM me if you have experience in this type cases.I may learn how to deal with this.



kbear99 said:


> Great review. Was on the fence between this and the EC4 but your High-mode graph tells all. It's surprising how much longer the EC4S can run. But now I hear about a new NW version. What's a guy to do?? Hoping to see a EC4W review from you


Thanks for reading!
For me the Neutral white XHP50 works perfect in this flashlight,giving a nice neutral light,not too warm white.But Nitecore decided to release any other version,but this.
I am very interested to see how the beam pattern with the MT-G2 will look like,as the much bigger reflector lights like ThruNite TN35 also show darker artifacts in the center.
No plans for testing the MT-G2 version,so far. I am learning about new flashlights,mostly here on the forum.


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## gregorv (Dec 6, 2015)

Hello 

I just got this FL and I have a problem. I have samsung 30q cells (pink) and they are not a good fit for this FL. They are too short. If I shake the EC4S I can hear cells moving inside. FL does not turn ON. 
I also have protected panasonic cells (green) which are longer. If I insert them in FL they are not moving inside and FL works without problem. 

So, does this FL only work with longer (protected) cells?

What do you use? Did you maybe use 30q cells? 

Thank you

Kind regards


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## FlashLion (Dec 6, 2015)

gregorv said:


> Hello
> 
> I just got this FL and I have a problem. I have samsung 30q cells (pink) and they are not a good fit for this FL. They are too short. If I shake the EC4S I can hear cells moving inside. FL does not turn ON.
> I also have protected panasonic cells (green) which are longer. If I insert them in FL they are not moving inside and FL works without problem.
> ...


My sample worked well with unprotected IMR (before Niwalker MMs to kill them). There may be a difference in the spring length,from one flashlight to another. Some people use small magnets to add a little more length to the battery.You can try to stretch the springs,too.


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## gregorv (Dec 7, 2015)

I will try to stretch springs. Do you have any idea how can I access spring which is inside the tube?
I don't have any special tool. 

Thank you


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## markr6 (Dec 7, 2015)

I was going to say flat tops don't work due to the physical reverse polarity protection, but then saw FlashLion said flattops worked. I wonder if this was due to his flattops being "not quite" flat tops. They all seem to vary from brand to brand.


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## KeepingItLight (Dec 7, 2015)

gregorv said:


> I will try to stretch springs. Do you have any idea how can I access spring which is inside the tube?
> I don't have any special tool.
> 
> Thank you




You are bolder than I!


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## FlashLion (Dec 7, 2015)

markr6 said:


> I was going to say flat tops don't work due to the physical reverse polarity protection, but then saw FlashLion said flattops worked. I wonder if this was due to his flattops being "not quite" flat tops. They all seem to vary from brand to brand.


Yes,there are different flat tops,as some unprotected batteries have a recessed top.



gregorv said:


> I will try to stretch springs. Do you have any idea how can I access spring which is inside the tube?
> I don't have any special tool.
> 
> Thank you


You can try to make a simple hook from a piece of thick copper wire,or anything else.


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## markr6 (Dec 7, 2015)

I use two Eastshine protected cells just because they came with my EC4S. But I was curious so I tried some others cells tonight. Here's what DOES NOT work in the EC4S:

1. NCR18650B button top from Mtn Electronics
2. NCR18650B button top (wider/flatter button) from Fasttech
3. NCR18650GA button top from Mtn Electronics

Crazy! Those right there are pretty much the most basic cells you'll find. They literally rocked back and forth in the light...just by listening to them sliding in there I would guess they're at least 3mm from even making contact!!!

I guess they want you using protected cells in here.


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## mattheww50 (Dec 7, 2015)

markr6 said:


> I use two Eastshine protected cells just because they came with my EC4S. But I was curious so I tried some others cells tonight. Here's what DOES NOT work in the EC4S:
> 
> 1. NCR18650B button top from Mtn Electronics
> 2. NCR18650B button top (wider/flatter button) from Fasttech
> ...



I have no idea what the issue is because I am running an EC4S with NCR18650GA button top cells I bought from Mtn Electronics in October specifically for use in this light. They work just fine. They don't rattle around either. My suspicion is somewhere along the line the spring contacts on your EC4S were crushed possibly because the protected batteries you have been using are much longer than the unprotected cells and in tightening down the back, you have crushed the springs, and that's why they don't make contact with unprotected cells. In any event, the NCR18650GA's are the only batteries I have ever used in this light. I can assure you that if these did not work I would have noticed long ago.....


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## sidecross (Dec 7, 2015)

mattheww50 said:


> I have no idea what the issue is because I am running an EC4S with NCR18650GA button top cells I bought from Mtn Electronics in October specifically for use in this light. They work just fine. They don't rattle around either. My suspicion is somewhere along the line the spring contacts on your EC4S were crushed possibly because the protected batteries you have been using are much longer than the unprotected cells and in tightening down the back, you have crushed the springs, and that's why they don't make contact with unprotected cells. In any event, the NCR18650GA's are the only batteries I have ever used in this light. I can assure you that if these did not work I would have noticed long ago.....


This is the reason I use the same battery length in my lights. Without standards of battery length jumping batteries varying in size as much as 2mm is assuming too much on the design of the battery spring mechanism.

I have two Fenix PD40 lights and only use a Keeppower 5200mAh protected battery in only one light because of its size which is really a 26700 at 71.1mm. Other 26650 batteries range from 65.50mm to 71.46mm. The Fenix lights that our 26650 single battery lights have double springs at the head and tail cap, but even so I think it best to try to keep the same battery length if possible.


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## markr6 (Dec 8, 2015)

mattheww50 said:


> I have no idea what the issue is because I am running an EC4S with NCR18650GA button top cells I bought from Mtn Electronics in October specifically for use in this light. They work just fine. They don't rattle around either. My suspicion is somewhere along the line the spring contacts on your EC4S were crushed possibly because the protected batteries you have been using are much longer than the unprotected cells and in tightening down the back, you have crushed the springs, and that's why they don't make contact with unprotected cells. In any event, the NCR18650GA's are the only batteries I have ever used in this light. I can assure you that if these did not work I would have noticed long ago.....



That's the only logical explanation. But I doubt the springs could be crushed that much. This light had a lot of space in it and the protected cells were only 1.5-2mm longer and it was never a struggle to get the cap on. I could just tell when screwing it on.

My standby drain is 60uA. Lot of other reports put it at 300+. I ordered mine pretty early. I wonder if I got a different version and maybe something was changed?

I suspect this is another example of Nitecore needing to get their sheet together.


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## mattheww50 (Dec 8, 2015)

markr6 said:


> That's the only logical explanation. But I doubt the springs could be crushed that much. This light had a lot of space in it and the protected cells were only 1.5-2mm longer and it was never a struggle to get the cap on. I could just tell when screwing it on.
> 
> My standby drain is 60uA. Lot of other reports put it at 300+. I ordered mine pretty early. I wonder if I got a different version and maybe something was changed?
> 
> I suspect this is another example of Nitecore needing to get their sheet together.


I wish protected cells were only 1.5-2 mm longer. The reality is many of them are 4-6mm longer. The cells is an 18650 so the nominal length is 65mm, yet I have protected cells that
are over 70 mm long. The reality is the thinnest protection circuits are on the order of 2.5mm and most are 3-4 mm. Every time there is a charger review, there is a comment about the
maximum length cell that can be accommodated, and it is never only 67mm, it is usually 69-71mm, and even that isn't long enough some times.


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## SCEMan (Dec 8, 2015)

I have 2 sets of unprotected batts that I use in my EC4S:

NCR18650PF button top
NCR18650GA flat top w/magnets

Both allow breaking the connection by only loosening the tail cap screw 3 turns - so no worries about standby drain.


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## markr6 (Dec 9, 2015)

I checked the springs on mine. They don't seem compressed at all, and I also noticed they are "double" springs with a smaller one underneath the main spring. So I still have no idea why my button top unprotected cells are so loose in the tubes. Again, I can hear them sliding back and forth so I'd guess a good 3mm or more of empty space. I'm not too bothered by it since I got the protected cells included with the light; so I'll keep running those.


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## gregorv (Dec 13, 2015)

I have one newbie question, what is the difference between flat tops and buttom top cells. 

Regarding samsungs 30q which do not work in my FL, I think nitecore should have tested more cells... All my other FL work with protected and unprotected cells. This is the first FL with this problem. 

Thank you.


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## mattheww50 (Dec 13, 2015)

Essentially all Li-Ion cells come from the factory with flat tops. That simply means that there is no protruding positive terminal. A button top is a small piece of metal that is either a small magnet so it stays in place, or is welded in place to create the familiar protrusion on the positive terminal, or button. Protection has nothing to do with flat versus button top. Protection is a small circuit board added to the cell to limit charging voltage, discharge current, and discharge voltage from the cell to prevent overcharging, over heating, or operation below the minimum safe voltage for the cell. Like the button top, protection is always added by a 3rd party, cells do not come from the factory with protection. Protection usually 3-5 mm the length of the cell, the button top usually adds a couple mm as well. So while a 18650 is nominally 65mm long, protected cells with button tops can in fact exceed 70mm in length, and may not fit in some chargers or flashlights. OTOH lights requiring protection and/or button cells may have a battery chamber that is too long for a unprotected, flat top cell.


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## Benny Boy (Dec 22, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*

I found the same to be true. I returned my EC4S after using my P36 for a day. The P36 has a hugh beautiful flood, and is still very useful at 200 meters. I wish the EC4s had the P36 2 inch reflector, as I really like the top buttons on the EC4/EC4S, but the p36 is a far better lamp(as far as light quality). An issue I have with the EC4 is my unprotected cells are too short.
The carrier in the P36 allows me to use the shorter cells, after a dab of solder is applied.







Parrot Quack said:


> Repeating myself, I have both the EC4 and the EC4S and prefer the EC4. The EC4 is more throwy and the EC4S is more floody.
> 
> Personally, I love the tint and throw of the EC4. I can't say anything bad about the EC4S but I can't say anything good either. Throw or flood, personal choice.


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## Bullzeyebill (Dec 30, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*

Moving this to Flashlight reviews forum.

Bill


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## shilent (Dec 31, 2015)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*

I ordered a EC4SW from Nitecore which should be here this Saturday, can't wait.

I'm wondering though, if running it on turbo, what happens if you put it into high once turbo reaches 1000 lumens? Will it continue with a steady decline?


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## FlashLion (Jan 3, 2016)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*



shilent said:


> I ordered a EC4SW from Nitecore which should be here this Saturday, can't wait.
> 
> I'm wondering though, if running it on turbo, what happens if you put it into high once turbo reaches 1000 lumens? Will it continue with a steady decline?


Hi,congrats on your purchase! Did you already get your EC4SW and what are your impressions?

The EC4S can only limit the output to the specified level.It has no ability to boost the output in the state when battery voltage is low.
It will continue to gradually decrease,depending on the battery voltage.


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## Guitartec (Jan 3, 2016)

Nubie here. Great review, very enlightening. Just made the plunge on the EC4S on Amazon so it's not here yet. Just wonderin'... can't I just put a pc of paper on the battery terminal to act as a cap lock out while in storage?


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## shilent (Jan 3, 2016)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*



FlashLion said:


> Hi,congrats on your purchase! Did you already get your EC4SW and what are your impressions?
> 
> The EC4S can only limit the output to the specified level.It has no ability to boost the output in the state when battery voltage is low.
> It will continue to gradually decrease,depending on the battery voltage.



I received mines on Dec 31st, a couple days early. I've been posting about it in the " *2015* New Nitecore EC4SW, 2000 Neutral white Lumens" thread.

I really like the light so far. It's smaller than I thought it would be, feels great in hand. My first neutral white, and it makes all my cool white lights look horrible. I think I'm done with cool white, no more buying lights unless it's neutral. I would've preferred around 60 lumens instead of 80 for the low mode, other than that, it's almost perfect.

Your review states that the NW version uses some type of PWM in low and med modes. I'm very sensitive to PWM but do not notice it unless I really look for it.

The battery level indicator has me confused. The manual states:

3 blinks is above 50%
2 blinks less than 50%
1 blink battery close to depletion
In my experience, and also what others are saying in the other thread, 1 blink pretty much means change/charge batteries NOW. I wish Nitecore made 1 blink less than 25%, this makes more sense in my opinion.

I'm not sure if I got a defective one, but my low mode doesn't work properly when batteries are low. With my Panasonic NCR18650B 3400 at 3.36V, my low mode is dimmer than ultralow, and the PWM is worse. Battery level indicator still showing two blinks. If you get a chance, could you test yours at this battery level? If they all behave like this, then I can live with that. If not, I'd like to get it exchanged.


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## zs&tas (Jan 4, 2016)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*

That voltage would be charge time anyways wouldnt it ?


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## shilent (Jan 4, 2016)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*



zs&tas said:


> That voltage would be charge time anyways wouldnt it ?



That's what I would've thought, but:
1. Battery indicator shows two blinks.
2. All other modes work fine.
3. These Panasonic batteries are rated down to 2.8V.

If it wasn't for reasons 1 and 2, I would just blame it on batteries being too low.


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## dellman666 (Jan 9, 2016)

Thanks for review. Amazing photos as always .


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## Mr. Tone (Jan 12, 2016)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*



shilent said:


> Your review states that the NW version uses some type of PWM in low and med modes. I'm very sensitive to PWM but do not notice it unless I really look for it.



The reviewer's neutral white version was a prototype prior to the cool white version. The reviewer's neutral white version was also XHP50 and not MT-G2.


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## shilent (Jan 12, 2016)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*



Mr. Tone said:


> The reviewer's neutral white version was a prototype prior to the cool white version. The reviewer's neutral white version was also XHP50 and not MT-G2.



I was confirming that PWM is being used for low and medium modes on my EC4SW MT-G2.


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## Mr. Tone (Jan 13, 2016)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*



shilent said:


> I was confirming that PWM is being used for low and medium modes on my EC4SW MT-G2.



What about the moonlight mode?


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## shilent (Jan 13, 2016)

*Re: NITECORE EC4S XHP50 NW (2sx18650) PreRelease Version REVIEW*



Mr. Tone said:


> What about the moonlight mode?



Moonlight (ultra low) mode does not use PWM as far I can tell. Only low and med mode.


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## start90a (Jan 16, 2016)

Ooh! I can't read all those posts:laughing: 
Review is very useful, thanks. 
Initially this was not interesting me, but now the more I look at, the more I want it! Not good for my wallet..


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