# Best lamp for Geocaching



## dmmd01 (Dec 3, 2007)

Hi, I go geocaching every available moment and am in need of a good headlamp for this activity. Night caches require that I navigate trails and look for markers that may be 500 ft apart. Of course I also need to be seeing the ground in front of me. I want something that is very bright, lightweight (no neck kinks please), waterproof, and rechargable (new batteries are a pain). I haven't seen a headlamp over $200, so price isn't really an issue. I don't know/understand the difference between LED, Luxeon, Halogen, 1 watt, 3 watt, etc... so let's keep it simple: which is best?


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## PhantomPhoton (Dec 4, 2007)

Unfortunately, the short answer is a headlamp like that doesn't exist to my knowledge; mainly the waterproof part; without buying an overpriced specialty headlamp. The only thing that comes to mind is a stenlight.

The most expensive headlamp I personally own is a Black Diamond Solaris. They're on sale at sierratradingpost.com still I think. However they are definitely not worth the retail price. I was quite disappointed in mine for the cost. At the STP price I'd consider it an okay deal. 
The good part is that the solaris is a rechargible light that has incan and a bank of 4 5mm leds (small ones that give off an angry blue light).
The bad news is the light isn't very rugged, and definitely not dunkable. The battery pack is also large and stuck to the back of the headstrap.


LED headlamp technology is wayyyyyyy behind. Like 3 years behind technology wise. Most headlamps are abysmal in output and runtimes. (mostly due to cheap 3AAA battery packs )
In order to get a half way decent LED headlamp you have to mod your own at the moment.


LEDs, a quick rundown.
Lumileds is a company owned by Phillips. They make the Luxeon brand LEDs... Luxeon I, III, V, K2, and Rebel.
Cree is a company that makes the popular XRE LEDs, you'll often see Crees referred to by their bin. (P4, Q2, Q5, R2, etc.)
Seoul Semiconductor is a company that uses the Cree die and coats it with their own phosphor process. SSC P4 U-bin LEDs are commonly used in modding headlamps.
These are the current major players in power LEDs. Luxeon I, III, and V and some K2s are old technology that has been surpassed by Cree and SSC. Luxeon I's (1-watt rated) and Luxeon III's (3-watt rated) are what are found in virtually every production headlamp along with 5mm LEDs.
Watts simply refers to how much power an LED eats up. Two years ago watts meant something, but nowadays it means almost nothing. It became a marketing gimmick to those who are unenlightened. So ignore watts for the time being.
You have much to read about and learn. :welcome:
Try asking LED questions in the LED forum after you've read up a bit more.

Hope this helps.


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## Daekar (Dec 4, 2007)

dmmd01 said:


> Hi, I go geocaching every available moment and am in need of a good headlamp for this activity. Night caches require that I navigate trails and look for markers that may be 500 ft apart. Of course I also need to be seeing the ground in front of me. I want something that is very bright, lightweight (no neck kinks please), waterproof, and rechargable (new batteries are a pain). I haven't seen a headlamp over $200, so price isn't really an issue. I don't know/understand the difference between LED, Luxeon, Halogen, 1 watt, 3 watt, etc... so let's keep it simple: which is best?



May I ask a few questions? 

1) What is geocaching? Is color rendering/spectral distribution important for this? If it is, LEDs may not give you what you want - Incans still rule the color-spectrum roost at the cost of inefficiency.
2) What do you define as "lightweight"..? I would say that my PT Apex (4AA) is lightweight, but not compared to my Zebralight. I've never gotten a neck-kink from my Apex and it's the most capable and versatile headlamp I know of.
3) How waterproof? Do you want to go swimming with it, or do you need to keep out the rain?
4) How important is runtime at this "very bright" setting? Do you need to have the very bright setting on all night without a battery change, or will you mostly use less light and the high mode for brief spotting only?

The more information you can give us, the more we can help you! :wave:


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## Lightmania (Dec 4, 2007)

Geocaching is hunting with GPS for the small treasures in boxes hidden by normal people. Those normal people then posted the lat/long approximation location online at www.geocaching.com 

Then other normal people look up the lat/long and download it to their GPS and go after those hidden treasures. Often of the time, the treasures hidden are simply small containers with a bunch of small items such as pencils, coins, keychain lights, little toys, etc. Once those caches are found, he/she can take one item and leave behind an item and sometime there's a log book to leave comments in. This is the common type of cache as there are other different kind of caches to go after. Then those normal people go back home and post the result of their hunts at the said website. 

There are geocaches sites ALL over US and a lot more around the world. I've done a few caches myself (mostly the local ones) and it's a huge load of fun.

I don't go at night, though. At least, not around here anyway (not exactly friendly at night). So I don't know if color rendering is important enough. If I ever go out at night for geocaching, I'll probably use either my HDS U60 or ROP 2C LE, heheh. 

www.geocaching.com

Good luck on your hunt, dmmd01!


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## mountainpenguin (Dec 4, 2007)

Princeton tec Apex or apex Pro with a Mod will do for most of what you want its not that much less bright than a sten 1m waterproof so unless your swimming for caches itl be fine. For distance spotting you might want an additional mega bright light


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## spinkid (Dec 4, 2007)

I always go with my trusy MYO XP (now modded with a better led). I love this light for geocaching. Started geocaching with a small 3AAA PT incan light and to me a decent LED is better a getting a reflection if the cache isn't entirely hidden. My last cache was done in Upstate NY where I was for training and I used my MYO XP, and an original T4 (Trios) for the distance trail spotting. This was also done with a NUVI 350 as my personal GPS was at home. Night caching is the only way I go, I find daytime a bit boring unless my kids feel like going.


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## funkymonkey1111 (Dec 4, 2007)

Lightmania said:


> Geocaching is hunting with GPS for the small treasures in boxes hidden by normal people. Those normal people hid the treasures have posted the lat/long approximation location online at www.geocaching.com
> 
> Then other normal people look up the lat/long and download it to their GPS and go after those hidden treasures. Often of the time, the treasures hidden are simply small containers with a bunch of small items such as pencils, coins, keychain lights, little toys, etc. Once those caches are found, he/she can take one item and leave behind an item and sometime there's a log book to leave comments in. This is the common type of cache as there are other different kind of caches to go after. Then those normal people go back home and post the result of their hunts at the said website.
> 
> ...



is the use of "normal" here to be tongue-in-cheek? i know some geocachers, and "normal" isn't a word that comes to mind when i think of them....


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## chris_m (Dec 4, 2007)

dmmd01 said:


> I haven't seen a headlamp over $200, so price isn't really an issue.


Here you are then http://www.asutsitrail.com/servlet/the-69/Lupine-Wilma-X-380/Detail


If that is within budget, then that's your answer. Otherwise http://www.outdoorgb.com/p/silva_478_lightweight_headlamp/


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## Lightmania (Dec 4, 2007)

funkymonkey1111 said:


> is the use of "normal" here to be tongue-in-cheek? i know some geocachers, and "normal" isn't a word that comes to mind when i think of them....



Heheh, yeah, sorta. There are bound to be some colorful characters these days but I meant it as it is. If I wasn't into GPS, I might find geocaching odd if I didn't know what it was. After all, this is a sport where people hiding things for other people to find. 

It's not that far different from us and our flashlight obsessions. Most of us are normal everyday folks but to many outside, it's weird to them. (until the power goes out! )

Its all in good humor!


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## Lightmania (Dec 4, 2007)

Oh, dmmd01, just curious, what lights have you been using for your night geocaching?


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## angelofwar (Dec 4, 2007)

Here's some waterproof one's...and they work fine with rechargeable batteries...I've had mine for many years, with no complaints...I used to take it caving through some Ice-caves in Iceland, and it survived...plus all the smart features help...the throw's not the best, and it's not the most stylish, but this is the best for peripheal and "area lighting", and built with performance under extreme conditions, in mind.

http://www.foxfury.com/products/signature_series/outdoor/index.htm


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## vader (Dec 5, 2007)

mountainpenguin said:


> Princeton tec Apex or apex Pro with a Mod will do for most of what you want its not that much less bright than a sten 1m waterproof so unless your swimming for caches itl be fine. For distance spotting you might want an additional mega bright light



+1 on that. I have had the Apex for years now and It works great for Geocaching. It has a bright spotlight for looking into the little cracks for micros, and it has a great area light for general hiking and getting around.


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## GrnXnham (Dec 5, 2007)

We are geocachers, also. (2000+ finds).

We night cache quite often and I find that my Princeton Tec Apex headlamp is perfect for night caching and finding glint/fire tacks. It blows away 90% of the other headlamps out there.

Happy caching!


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## Chronos (Dec 5, 2007)

I do a lot of hiking and geocaching at night. I haven't yet found a great headlamp for geocaching. I prefer multi-level floody beams. We keep the beams on low unless something goes "bump" in the night (we've come across fresh animal remains, a few bobcats, coyotes, and a bear). We are usually on trails (we prefer trails vs. urban caching), so floody beams help illuminate the paths and trails. Throwy beams do little in the outback. We also bring along flashlights (of course, I bring more than one  ) as I find them indespensible for foraging through undergrowth when looking for the cache.

Summary: I prefer a floody, multi-level headlamps. I always use LED headlamps. I also strongly recommend bringing along a couple good flashlights.

Hope that helps! Geocaching in the dark is a blast!:twothumbs


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## 2ManyLights (Dec 5, 2007)

PhantomPhoton said:


> ... a headlamp like that doesn't exist to my knowledge; mainly the waterproof part; without buying an overpriced specialty headlamp.


 
I thought a lot of the PT headlamps were waterproof. My early incan PT HLs were. (ie vortec 2AA)

After reading these posts, I may have to go back and re-visit the Apex. I remember it being big. It felt like I had a lunchbox on my head.


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## vader (Dec 5, 2007)

2ManyLights said:


> I thought a lot of the PT headlamps were waterproof. My early incan PT HLs were. (ie vortec 2AA)
> 
> After reading these posts, I may have to go back and re-visit the Apex. I remember it being big. It felt like I had a lunchbox on my head.



If I am right the Apex is waterproof to 3 feet. 

They make a couple of different models of the PT Apex. One has 4-AA one has 8-AA and one runs on 2 CR123's. The last one is by far the lightest weight and the most comfortable. Here is the link.

https://www.brightguy.com/products/Princeton_Tec_APEX_PRO.php

IMO the best headlight out there for the price.


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## Fireman78 (Dec 8, 2007)

Hello fellow geocacher! I use a Petzl MYO XP for all my caching adventures. It's a great all purpose headlamp. BTW- my geocaching title is also Fireman78- whats yours? BTW- everyone else here is the geocaching page- http://www.geocaching.com/


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## a4d (Dec 8, 2007)

Wow these seems like alot of fun. I've never heard of this before but when i go home for christmas me and my cousin are going to try a few places. Yes i have a Handheld GPS. Sorry can't help you with the light though but thanks for introducing this to me.


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## Coop (Dec 10, 2007)

Another fellow geocacher here :wave: Unfortunately I have a serious lack of time to go caching, so not many finds yet. When I go geocaching in the dark (usually after working the lateshift or nightshifts in wintertime) I use the Petzl E+Lite in combination with a handheld light. The choice of handheld depends on the situation a bit. Incan when its foggy or long distance spotting is needed, or LED when runtime is needed. 

I'm planning to get a PT Apex tho, still the best headlamp, without spending an insane ammount of money.


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## DevL (Dec 10, 2007)

Dont listen to the comments about color rendition. Modern LEDs provide excellent color rendition. If you dont have a fit because things are lit differently by regular light bulbs at home and the flourescents at your office you wont care about color rendition with modern, high output LEDs vs incan bulb lights.

Get a Zebralight and use Fenix L2D RB100 as a ahndlheld for throw. If you want it all on your head get a L1D body as well and strap that to the side of your Zerbalight headband. You will only need to run rechargable AA's for your lights and possibly only 1 AA for each light.

These are waterproof which some other reccomendations are not.


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## Coop (Dec 10, 2007)

DevL said:


> Dont listen to the comments about color rendition. Modern LEDs provide excellent color rendition.




I beg to differ, but as the search function will provide plenty information on the subject I won't go into it here. I'm a very big fan of LED lights, but Geocaching at night is one of the few things I regularly switch to incan for. The better depth perception (due to color rendition) of an incan is very valuable to me. It really helps when you're looking for stuff in the dark, and mostly stuff you only have a vague or no description of.


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## chris_m (Dec 12, 2007)

Unless you're meaning something different by depth perception to what I understand, then I have to disagree with that. I now use a quad emitter LED light for night orienteering, which for those who don't know is running around the woods at night, finding controls on difficult to find features on a very detailed map. Depth perception is really important for this, and the LEDs certainly aren't a disadvantage - the extra light compared to an equivalent incan (and also a lighter battery due to the lower power requirements) are far more of an advantage. Certainly my results speak for themselves - as of tonight that's 3 wins in a row, and 4 this year out of 6 events (I only very narrowly lost one of the others).


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## NightBeacon (Dec 13, 2007)

While on my last night cache I used the Princeton Tec Apex headlamp. Most of the time I used the mode that uses the 4 ultrabrite LED's. This setting provided good lighting of the trail and was very useful locating the reflective trail markers. At one point when the spacing of the markers greatly increased I changed to the mode that uses the maxbrite LED which dramatically increased the throw over the ultrabrites and I could then locate several markers further ahead on the trail.
This headlamp can use NiMH rechargable AA batteries along with alkalines and lithium.
I have found this headlamp to be very comfortable due to the strap that goes over the top of my head along with the battery pack in the rear.


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## yellow (Dec 16, 2007)

DevL said:


> Dont listen to the comments about color rendition. Modern LEDs provide excellent color rendition.





MayCooper said:


> I beg to differ, but as the search function will provide plenty





MayCooper said:


> I use the Petzl E+Lite in combination with


Devl is absolutely right and this "LED" light You compare incans (which?) with is a joke. In no way near the output of the other LED-Lights recommended. Its more some kind of "last stance supersmall pack size third emergency light when all others have run out of juice" that helps someone injured to crawl out ot the woods. Or it might be bright enough to read a newspaper at night, but of course not sufficient for navigating around

An Apex, or a Streamlight Argo HP (modded with another led and running on an 17650 / 18650 Li-Ion) are both great and there is nothing comparable
(suppose geocoaching is pretty much the same than hiking / cave exploring: small, watertight, long running while still some output, comparable with a Mag D-cell)


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## Chronos (Dec 17, 2007)

I think MayCooper's point has to do with the color, maybe its the spectra, of the LED beam? I do a _LOT _of hiking, geocaching, and climbing at night. Almost all of my gear is now LED. I've also noticed that with the LED lights there is less contrast vs. good incans. I hate to admit this, but I missed a cache using an LED that was easily found by a buddy with a 2C maglite- it was clear in the incan beam, not in my LED beam.

That said, the output and runtimes on LEDs are unbeatable vs. incans right now. Things have changed dramatically in the past two years! :twothumbs

I had a question for all of you- one of the problems we run into (literally) are tree branches. It has gotten to the point where I'm wearing cheap sunglasses to protect my eyes. Usually the headlamp is aimed more downwards, so low-hanging branches often clip my head and sometimes my face (I usually wear a cap or hat). Has anyone tried using an Inova 24x7 or zebralight or the molle light attached to a pocket or strap? I wonder if this would provide some soft illumination, allowing one to see low hanging branches?


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## chris_m (Dec 17, 2007)

What direction are you looking in? Whilst running into tree branches is an occupational hazard with orienteering (often you do just run straight through small branches, relying on momentum), I don't find it more of a problem at night than in the day. I guess it may be an issue with not much spill on your beam - with 10W of LED I have plenty of spill as well as throw (was particularly noticeable the difference this makes when I went out last week with an upgraded Eos rather than my normal light - that has reasonable throw, but poor spill, and the lack of spill was definitely an issue!)


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## Chronos (Dec 17, 2007)

Honestly, I think you are right. My headlamp is mostly throw which is less than desirable when hiking and geocaching. I'm usually looking "down"  or running to beat a team member to the next coordinates (sort of an "orienteering" game). The problem is greater (obviously) when we're not following trails. I've put some diffusing film on the window of the headlamp but haven't had a chance to test it yet.

I'm seriously considering a Zebralight. Looks like a decent little floody light, with the ability to either attach to a backpack strap or use as a headlamp.


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## a4d (Dec 17, 2007)

Chronos said:


> Honestly, I think you are right. My headlamp is mostly throw which is less than desirable when hiking and geocaching. I'm usually looking "down"  or running to beat a team member to the next coordinates (sort of an "orienteering" game). The problem is greater (obviously) when we're not following trails. I've put some diffusing film on the window of the headlamp but haven't had a chance to test it yet.
> 
> I'm seriously considering a Zebralight. Looks like a decent little floody light, with the ability to either attach to a backpack strap or use as a headlamp.


Just get one of each. A headlamp with throw and a handlight for flood. Or other way around. Headlamp for flood and a handlight for throw.


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## angelofwar (Dec 17, 2007)

[I had a question for all of you- one of the problems we run into (literally) are tree branches. It has gotten to the point where I'm wearing cheap sunglasses to protect my eyes. Usually the headlamp is aimed more downwards, so low-hanging branches often clip my head and sometimes my face (I usually wear a cap or hat). Has anyone tried using an Inova 24x7 or zebralight or the molle light attached to a pocket or strap? I wonder if this would provide some soft illumination, allowing one to see low hanging branches?[/quote]

The Foxfury Signature I mentioned at the beginning of the thread is pretty good at that job...It doesn't "throw" for the price, but makes up for it in peripheal/area lighting


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## chris_m (Dec 17, 2007)

It's interesting with this thread, a conversation I'm having elsewhere and my experiences that whilst the wow factor with my light is the throw, the more important factor for what I do is having decent close in flood. It's only once you have this that you can go after the throw (fortunately the Cree optics I'm using seem to give an almost perfect compromise).


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## Chronos (Dec 19, 2007)

I always have at least one headlamp with me and a few flashlights. 

I'm definitely going to pick up a Zebralight and try it out. 

OT: anyone in the DC metro area interested in a night cache or hike? Or if you're ever in the area and interested, let me know!


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## f22shift (Dec 20, 2007)

i've heard this name but never really knew about this activity. sounds really cool. i'm glad i checked this thread.:candle:


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