# Best flashlight for under $50



## jbrett14 (Feb 24, 2010)

Would love to hear your opinions on what would be the best overall flashlight for under $50.

My preferences would be:

1) AA or 123 batteries
2) Throw \ runtime \ light output (in order of importance)
3) Clickie

Main uses would be for camping & hiking.

I was researching the Fenix L2D-CE. Is this an old model? How does it compare to the Streamlight Stylus Pro? or the Streamlight ProPoly Lux 4AA?

Added note regarding #. 2 above: Although these are listed in order of importance, all three are important to me. Hence the reason I listed them at all. Things that are not important to me were not listed at all, e.g. housing material, color, knurling, whether the light can stand up on it's end, etc.

Thanks!


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## wingnut86 (Feb 24, 2010)

How about this one?

Or this one for more throw.

Just a note, the prices are lower at dealer sites, $40 and $46 respectively.


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## Locoboy5150 (Feb 24, 2010)

jbrett14 said:


> I was researching the Fenix L2D-CE. Is this an old model?



Yes, the Fenix L2D series has been discontinued and replaced by the LD20.


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## Toaster (Feb 24, 2010)

Eagletac T100C2 MKII, Neutral White, Smooth Reflector


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## stallion2 (Feb 25, 2010)

apparently wholesaletip.com still has LD2's for sale. they look really expensive though ($80+)...not sure why that would be. i bought an LD20 a few months back and its been my favorite alkaline-cell driven light yet and i'm positive i didn't spend $80 on it.


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## hyperloop (Feb 25, 2010)

Fenix TK20, using "CPF8" code at 4sevens, it comes in below $50.


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## jhc37013 (Feb 25, 2010)

Throw, run time and clicky being important under $50 I would suggest the Eagletac P100C2 or if you can stand a little bigger light the T100C2 MKII they are great lights at any price. If you get a T100 you can get a 18650 rechargeable battery and charger, if you don't want to spend money on rechargeable setup right now you will have a good light in place when you do decide to go that route. The T100C2 will run at full output regulated for nearly 3hrs on a 18650 battery. Don't forget to use your CPF discounts!

Edit: sorry but I almost made it out to sound the T100C2 is a 18650 only light but it also runs on cr123 batterys

Link to Eagletac-USA for these lights
http://www.eagletac-usa.com/default.aspx


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## chenko (Feb 25, 2010)

Oh yes, lots of throw with the Eagletac models! :thumbsup:


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## hyperloop (Feb 25, 2010)

If it helps, there is a beamshot of the TK20 at 115ft, courtesy of Egise's Led Lenser P7 review, i've borrowed the pic to post here


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## jbrett14 (Feb 25, 2010)

You guys are GREAT! I really appreciate the fast responses, and suggestions.

It's been a while since I was active in these forums and a lot has changed in lights since then.

A couple more quick questions to anyone who may know:

That TK20 beamshot looks fantastic. How would this compare with the T100C2?
Is the T100C2 too tight of a spot or is it as nice as the TK20?


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## jbrett14 (Feb 25, 2010)

jhc37013 said:


> Don't forget to use your CPF discounts!
> http://www.eagletac-usa.com/default.aspx



It's been a while since I have been here. What discounts?


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## jbrett14 (Feb 25, 2010)

Another quick question:

Is there any difference in light output between the T100C2 and the T100C2 Mark II?

Is one just an older model?


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## The Hawk (Feb 25, 2010)

A few days ago I purchased a Coleman MAX. It runs on 2 AA batteries, produces 115 lumens and has a run time of 5 hours (according to Coleman). It was about $25.00 at W-Mart. I know some folks on here do not like these lights and certainly I am a rookie at best compared to others on here. However, I feel that I got my $'s worth. The bulb is a CREE LED.
I agree with you in that there is a lot of excellent info on this site. 
Good luck with your hunt.


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## pwatcher (Feb 25, 2010)

+1 for Fenix TK20. Rugged, easy to find if you drop in at night in the leaves (yellow rubber grip), excellent thrower, warm enough tint for good outdoor color rendition!


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## noisebeam (Feb 25, 2010)

stallion2 said:


> apparently wholesaletip.com still has LD2's for sale. they look really expensive though ($80+)...not sure why that would be. i bought an LD20 a few months back and its been my favorite alkaline-cell driven light yet and i'm positive i didn't spend $80 on it.


One can still get new in box L2D-q5 from some sellers for ~$55 shipped. I just ordered one after I returned an LD20-q5 for about the same price perhaps a few dollars more.


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## hyperloop (Feb 25, 2010)

am afraid i cannot speak for the eagletac lights, got myself a TK20 and didnt see a need to go looking for anything else. This is one incredibly tough light! specs wise, maybe other lights may beat it but till the day you hold one in your own hand, thats when you will know what they mean when they say that the TK20 is tough!!


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## wingnut86 (Feb 25, 2010)

I have a TK20, and it is a great light, but it makes a whining noise in high mode. many of these are known to do that. People will tell you that it isn't a very big deal, but when you're outside at night using this light in the summer time, bats are a concern...Oh, and the noise is annoying. Just a heads up if you are thinking about this light.

The P100C2 and T100C2 MKII should be brighter than the TK20 as well. The T100C2 MKII should out throw it, and the P100C2 should be in the same ball park throw wise as the TK20.

Both the P100C2 and the T100C2 MKII use the same LED and driver so the output will be the same, the throw will just be better on the T100. Runtime is pretty damn good too.

Both are available in cool white as well as neutral white.

They are both also regulated very well on cr123a and Li-ion. Only difference is that the T100C2 will accept an 18650, where as the P100C2 will take a 17670.


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## Lumenly Challenged (Feb 25, 2010)

I have a L2d Q5 and it is the light that started my new hobby (thanks everyone  lovecpf). It is all you will need. I used to EDC it, rather long but perfect for camping. 

I said "used to" for a reason-Nitecore.

If you can go to 60 dollars the SR3 @47's w/discount for 60.00 Shipped, should be all you could use.

61.60 a D20 r2 at Lightjunction w/ discount.

D10's can be had for less than $50 there also.:thumbsup:


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## Toaster (Feb 25, 2010)

The beam profile of the T100C2 MKII w/ OP reflector is very nice and much cleaner than the ringy TK20. The T100C2 throws ~40% further than the TK20, runs 2-2.5x longer on rechargeable batteries, and has higher output (220-200 versus 150). In terms of capability it's no contest, it walks all over the TK20. That's the benefit of moving from a 2xAA powered light to an 18650 powered light.

The only real difference between the MKI and MKII T100C2 is the bezel design. Otherwise they are functionally identical. If you want more info on either light, check out the reviews:
Eagletac T100C2 MKI
Eagletac T100C2 MKII
Fenix TK20


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## joe1512 (Feb 25, 2010)

You might want to check out the review of the TrustFire1200 in the budget section. It is 46 bucks and is the most lumens you can get for your money.

It IS a DX light, so quality might be a bit lower. Reviews are positive though.

a stainless steel itp a1 with cr123 is a good choice too. Its 33 bucks, durable, well received at this forum and 203 lumens (more with an RCR123) max with 3 modes. You can put it on your keychain if desired, making it very handy and versatile.


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## ki4hou (Feb 25, 2010)

I'll probably get bashed for saying this but I'd take an LED maglight any day. It's tough, battery life is great, and its very inexpensive. I've got an LED minimag I use at work daily. Put Lithium AAs in it and its lasted well over a year as opposed to a week or two with an incandescent model. I have to put it on dim to check patients eyes with it because its too bright. I Suppose if it ever does die I can grab my HID spotlight lol


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## wingnut86 (Feb 25, 2010)

ki4hou said:


> I'll probably get bashed for saying this but I'd take an LED maglight any day.



No bashing from me...I'm in full agreement. But I also like the other models mentioned.


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## jbrett14 (Feb 25, 2010)

Wow, and I thought this would be easy - ha!

Just as I was leaning toward the P100C2 (or T100C2), I start reading all these posts and reviews and seeing photos of beamshots, and now I am beginning to question whether these 100C series lights have too tight of a spot (throw). 

It appears (based on pictures only) that the P20C2 (or T20C2), although more money, have far better beams of light, with plenty of throw AND spill.

Although I really want good throw, I am not sure I want a light that has ALL throw and very little spill, which is what it appears to be with the 100C series. Maybe I am wrong here.

I wish I could see these lights before I buy. I would love to test them at night, outside, up into a tree. A few years back I bought a Streamlight 3AA Tasklight luxeon. It had very good throw but it had NO spill light, making it useless to me. I don't want to make that mistake again.

I would like this light to be more powerful than my Streamlight Argo headlight.

I really appreciate all the great input.


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## drifts1 (Feb 25, 2010)

+1 for the T100C2mkII, mine is in nuetral white w/smo reflector. Spill is not as big as my TK11R2 but i think I use it more. Anyways for under $50 I cant think of a better light :twothumbs


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## Egsise (Feb 25, 2010)

Toaster said:


> The beam profile of the T100C2 MKII w/ OP reflector is very nice and much cleaner than the ringy TK20. The T100C2 throws ~40% further than the TK20, runs 2-2.5x longer on rechargeable batteries, and has higher output (220-200 versus 150). In terms of capability it's no contest, it walks all over the TK20. That's the benefit of moving from a 2xAA powered light to an 18650 powered light.


Some thoughts....

What if you happen to drop your flashlight and it hits the ground with button first....
T100C2: no any kind of protection to button
TK20: yeah of course the button is recessed and well protected against accidents like that

For hiking the neutral white led is a must.

Fenix diffuser tip aka the cone, you will find it very useful to be able to turn your flashlight in to a lantern.

Yellow rubber grip, so easy to find it when you drop it.


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## jbrett14 (Feb 25, 2010)

Egsise said:


> Some thoughts....
> 
> What if you happen to drop your flashlight and it hits the ground with button first....
> T100C2: no any kind of protection to button
> ...



That is a great point, and one that came to my mind. I can't think of a reason that I, personally, would want the clickie to extend past the end of the light body. ??? Seems to me that you would want it protected, not only from falls, but from accidental engagement. Perhaps I am missing something.

Still researching. I have not ruled out the Fenix lights.

To those who own the P100C2 or T100C2: Do you feel like the light has plenty of spill?

To those who use your light for camping or hiking, etc.: Would you favor a AA or 123 battery-type light? Feel free to explain. Thanks


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## jhc37013 (Feb 25, 2010)

The 100 series has plenty of spill for being a throwy light. If you want more balance between throw and spill check out the Fenix PD30 or even the Eagletac P20C2 MKII although the P20C2 MKII may be more than your willing to spend.


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## jbrett14 (Feb 25, 2010)

jhc37013 said:


> The 100 series has plenty of spill for being a throwy light. If you want more balance between throw and spill check out the Fenix PD30 or even the Eagletac P20C2 MKII although the P20C2 MKII may be more than your willing to spend.



Funny you mention this. I was JUST checking both of these out before coming back here.

It appears that the Fenix PD30 is about the same cost as the EagleTac P20C2 MKII (around $65), yet the P20C2 has about 60 more lumens and slightly better runtime.

Is there any reason anyone would recommend one over the other, aside from these obvious facts?

Does anyone know where I would find the best deal for either of these lights? Any discounts for being a member here?

Thanks a bunch.


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## wingnut86 (Feb 25, 2010)

I can highly recommend the P20C2 MKII. The beam is almost perfect. Very bright, and and fits the hand nicely. 

If your worried about the button getting damaged, included is a neat little rubber ring that acts as a tail stander and gives protection. Or EagleTac sells tailcaps specifically for that. Linked here.

It only comes out to like 65 bucks after cpf discount and shipping refund at the linked site for the light.


Oh, and a member here measured the actual out the front lumens for the P20C2 MKII to be 330 at start up!


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## jhc37013 (Feb 25, 2010)

jbrett14 said:


> Funny you mention this. I was JUST checking both of these out before coming back here.
> 
> It appears that the Fenix PD30 is about the same cost as the EagleTac P20C2 MKII (around $65), yet the P20C2 has about 60 more lumens and slightly better runtime.
> 
> ...




Check you PM's and 4sevens is a great place to buy Fenix.


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## jbrett14 (Feb 26, 2010)

wingnut86 said:


> It only comes out to like 65 bucks after cpf discount



I'm a little behind. How exactly does one get this "cpf discount"?


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## jhc37013 (Feb 26, 2010)

I sent you a PM with the discount page.


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## jbrett14 (Feb 26, 2010)

jhc37013 said:


> I sent you a PM with the discount page.



Got it. Thanks a bunch!


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## Kevin1322 (Feb 26, 2010)

I'm surprised nobody has pointed you to the "Show Your Solarforce" thread yet. It can be seen here: https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/228693

There are mixed views on the Solarforce L2, but I recommend you take a look at them. Maybe they aren't as good as the Surefire, but Surefire only makes lights for 5% of the lighting community as said so right on their site. Quality, but pricy. Fenix makes great lights too; I personally have lights from all three companies. The great thing about Solarforce L2s is that you can get a good quality light for $20 then put whatever P60 drop in you want from anywhere from $15-$90 depending on what you want (good XP-E for throw, 3 level, pushing 250 lumens for less than $20). Their are numerous ways to customize your light or upgrade it, especially the light output, which is a big one for me. As fast as the LED technology is growing, it makes sense to me to be able to upgrade the light down the road with out having to buy a whole new light each time. Plus you can have different drop ins to use depending if you want a huge amount of lumens or better run time, throw or flood, or a mixture of all. It can use CR123x2 (L2m only needs one), RCR123x2, 1x18650, or 2xAA if you use a small extension. This is what is making this light so popular. A quality light (maybe not a primium, depending on who you ask, but doesn't have the premium price tag either), with a huge amount of options and upgradability. Check it out. If you want to buy one there are places on line. I will be glad to recommend some places should you decide to go that way. Just PM me. Oh, and did I mention it comes in 3 different colors in case you don't want black?

P.S. This is a long thread. My list of Solarforce L2s is on page 27 post #781, seen here https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/228693&page=27
You will notice different switches, clips, lengths, heads, bezels, P60 drop ins, a serious throw head, a lamp head, and every piece is interchangable with other L2 lights.


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## Egsise (Feb 26, 2010)

jbrett14 said:


> To those who use your light for camping or hiking, etc.: Would you favor a AA or 123 battery-type light? Feel free to explain. Thanks


I like to use rechargeable AA's, chargers and cells are very cheap and AA's are being used in many gps devices.
AA's could be found/salvaged from almost everywhere, CR123's could be little harder to find.


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## joe1512 (Feb 26, 2010)

CR123s have better energy density and their higher voltage means higher potential output of the light which is a nice option to have.

If you are going camping or whatnot, you can easily take several spare CR123s with you... they are tiny and relatively light.


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## jbrett14 (Feb 26, 2010)

Thanks guys.

Kevin: I will look into that Solarforce.

At this point in my research, I am thinking it would be best to narrow down the choices within each brand, then comparing my one choice of each brand with each other.

Starting with the EagleTac, I am trying to decide between these 4:

P100C2
P20C2 Mark II
T100C2 Mark II
T20C2 Mark II (I don't think I can afford this one but if somebody led me to believe it was far superior to the other 3, I might try to justify the purchase).

Again, my uses would be for hiking, general camping, and also the need to shine a bit further for spotting animals at night, or landmarks while kayaking in the dark. I do not care about any strobe features nor do I need a light with 15 brightness levels - 2 or 3 is just fine.

Also, I think I could justify going a little over the $50 mark, considering I would get a discount.

I am leaning toward the P20C2 Mark II from this group. Once I decide, I can stop considering the others and move on to compare to other brands. Yes, I struggle with making decisions like this.  Money does not grow on trees at my house.

Thanks again guys.


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## Sector7 (Feb 26, 2010)

Egsise said:


> Some thoughts....
> 
> What if you happen to drop your flashlight and it hits the ground with button first....
> T100C2: no any kind of protection to button


 
Eagletac dealers offer optional recessed stand-up tailcaps for the P100/P20 and T100/T20 series

Eagletac-USA


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## damn_hammer (Feb 26, 2010)

I don't think you're going to beat the Eagletac P100A2 in the 2xAA format for the price they're showing w/CPF discount at pts-flashlights.com, which is well below your price cap. It's available in XP-E Q4 in Neutral making it a very good camping/hiking light to have. I have the P100A2 in cool white, and love it. It does lean towards throw, but has plenty of usable spill to the beam. I also have the Eagletac T100C2 that I'm very happy, and is good bang for buck in the 2xCR123/18650 format. 

The LED multi-mode mini mag is a good deal if you can get it on sale for around the $10 like you could at Lowes, and HD awhile back, but for mag full price vs. the ET P100A2, it goes to the ET w/out question. If you want blinking modes, the MiniMag Multimode does have them however.

The Coleman Max Cree in 2xAA mentioned earlier in this thread is a good single mode light, but hard to find. Here's a thread on it ... https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/202659


I own the ET P100A2, T100C2 MKII, Minimag multi-mode, and Coleman Max. My experience with ET has been nothing but good. They provide very good quality for the price, and customer service from both PTS (dealer), and ET (manufacturer) has been great. The newer ET's with a XP-G LED are slightly above your price range, but might be worth a reach.


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## Anak (Feb 26, 2010)

Kevin1322 said:


> I'm surprised nobody has pointed you to the "Show Your Solarforce" thread yet. It can be seen here: https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/228693
> 
> ... The great thing about Solarforce L2s is that you can get a good quality light for $20 then put whatever P60 drop in you want from anywhere from $15-$90 depending on what you want (good XP-E for throw, 3 level, pushing 250 lumens for less than $20). Their are numerous ways to customize your light or upgrade it, especially the light output, which is a big one for me. As fast as the LED technology is growing, it makes sense to me to be able to upgrade the light down the road with out having to buy a whole new light each time. Plus you can have different drop ins to use depending if you want a huge amount of lumens or better run time, throw or flood, or a mixture of all. It can use CR123x2 (L2m only needs one), RCR123x2, 1x18650, or 2xAA if you use a small extension. This is what is making this light so popular. A quality light (maybe not a primium, depending on who you ask, but doesn't have the premium price tag either), with a huge amount of options and upgradability. Check it out. If you want to buy one there are places on line. I will be glad to recommend some places should you decide to go that way. Just PM me. Oh, and did I mention it comes in 3 different colors in case you don't want black?
> 
> ...


 
Thank you for this post!

New guy here. Having fun learning the new vocabulary worth of alphabet soup. There's a ton of technical stuff on this site.

I like the idea of a flashlight that can run either CR123s or AAs.


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## Egsise (Feb 26, 2010)

Sector7 said:


> Eagletac dealers offer optional recessed stand-up tailcaps for the P100/P20 and T100/T20 series
> 
> Eagletac-USA


I know, but the OP has 50$ limit for the light.


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## wingnut86 (Feb 26, 2010)

If your leaning towards an EagleTac, I just received an e-mail from them saying the LED modules for the P20A2 MKII, P20C2 MKII and the T20C2 MKII will be available for less than $25. Mike at PTS also said that they are expecting them to be in sometime in March. This would make the two lights I mentioned, Upgradeable. As of now, I think the first ones to be available will be the XP-G R5 and the XP-E Q4 Neutral white, both smooth and textured reflectors I would imagine.

The two main factors that could cause one to pay the higher price for the T20C2 MKII rather than the P20C2 MKII is the fact that the T20C2 accepts 18650's, and that it has quite a bit more throw.

I personally love the size of the P20C2. It's the exact same length as my Surefire G2, but it's quite a bit narrower, just not too narrow though.

Here is a review for the T20C2 MKII.

And one for the P20C2 MKII as well.

There is a good chance that that site has a review for some of the other lights that you are pondering.


But if AA's are your thing, the P100A2 and the P20A2 MKII would be great choices as well....


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## jbrett14 (Feb 26, 2010)

damn hammer, you have given me reason to reconsider a AA model, even after I was leaning toward a 123 model. 

Thanks for making this even more difficult. Ha! Seriously, thank you very much for the suggestions. I will look into them.

Note to anyone wanting to help in my quest: Although I did post "best flashlight for UNDER $50", I think I could be pursuaded to spend a bit more (maybe $60 or so) if the right light was at that cost, and considering some discounts.

Another question: How come none of these lights come with a thumb-operated clickie on the side of the light, rather than the end? Seems more logical (& ergonomical) to me to be able to operate the light while holding it as most folks hold a flashlight (in the most comfortable and natural position).


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## jbrett14 (Feb 26, 2010)

wingnut86 said:


> Here is a review for the T20C2 MKII.
> 
> And one for the P20C2 MKII as well.
> 
> ...



Wingnut, I appreciate all of your posts.

I have spent a good amount of time at that website - GREAT site!

Jonny


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## Egsise (Feb 26, 2010)

jbrett14 said:


> Another question: How come none of these lights come with a thumb-operated clickie on the side of the light, rather than the end? Seems more logical (& ergonomical) to me to be able to operate the light while holding it as most folks hold a flashlight (in the most comfortable and natural position).


Hold yes, but you don't need the click click clickety click it all the time so it doesn't bother even if the clicky is at the end.
And I would guess that tailcap switch is the cheapest and easiest way to manufacture a switch.


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## Toaster (Feb 26, 2010)

Egsise said:


> Some thoughts....
> 
> What if you happen to drop your flashlight and it hits the ground with button first....
> T100C2: no any kind of protection to button
> TK20: yeah of course the button is recessed and well protected against accidents like that



LOL I've seen people grasping at straws to justify their purchase before. But bringing up button drop durability as an issue is a first  In a drop, the tailcap is not likely to be damaged. The bezel and lens is far more likely to be damaged, followed by the driver as both are not usually shock insulated by a _spring_ and are usually at the heavy end of the light which strikes first. Just look at Surefire's lights and see how many have a protruding tailcap. If it was an issue, they would have stopped making it that way a long time ago.


To the OP, the benefits of a non protruding tailcap are tailstanding capability + reduced chance of accidental pocket activation. The benefits of a protruding tailcap are easy activation of light under all conditions, easy manipulation with gloved hands, and easy manipulation with fat fingers. It's for that reason that just about any light with a tactical focus does not come with a recessed switch. So pick what appeals most to you based on features, and not based on some unfounded durability concerns. Anyways with the Eagletacs as has been mentioned, you are not stuck either way. The XP-G models include a boot that allows for tailstanding. The 100 series can be ordered with a tailstanding tailcap (1, 2) if you prefer.


Anyhow I'm a bit puzzled by your inclination towards the P20C2 MKII. It is by far the least throwiest of the lights you are considering which I thought was the most important factor for you?


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## Egsise (Feb 26, 2010)

Toaster said:


> LOL I've seen people grasping at straws to justify their purchase before. But bringing up button drop durability as an issue is a first  In a drop, the tailcap is not likely to be damaged. The bezel and lens is far more likely to be damaged, followed by the driver as both are not usually shock insulated by a _spring_ and are usually at the heavy end of the light which strikes first. Just look at Surefire's lights and see how many have a protruding tailcap. If it was an issue, they would have stopped making it that way a long time ago.


One reason why I bought the TK20 and not TK11 was how the switch was protected.
And trust me, I have dropped my TK20 from heights that would brake a protruding switch.
So far there are no bezel, lens or driver problems, perhaps the TK20 is better built than the other lights that you meant?
To me a protruding switch is an accident waiting to happen.

The TK20 switch is quite easy to operate even with gloves.
The tailstanding capability sucks, it's wobbly.


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## Toaster (Feb 26, 2010)

Egsise said:


> One reason why I bought the TK20 and not TK11 was how the switch was protected.
> And trust me, I have dropped my TK20 from heights that would brake a protruding switch.



I've tried to figure out what kind of point you're trying to make here, but I'm not seeing it. But I'll humor you for the moment. What height can you drop your light from that will break a protruding tailcap, but would not harm the lens or bezel? I'm curious to hear about this as you seem to be very focused on the non-business end of the light as the major durability concern in a fall.




> So far there are no bezel, lens or driver problems, perhaps the TK20 is better built than the other lights that you meant?



Dude you crack me up. So if I understand correctly, you logic is: "My TK20 has not broke, therefore it must be better built than other lights." Am I getting this right? You're either making some stupendous leaps in logic, or else you have a very low standard when it comes to flashlights :laughing: The TK20 is certainly a tough light. Tough enough that it won't be a concern for most users. But you're deluding yourself if you think it's anywhere near as indestructible as the best built lights on the market.


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## Egsise (Feb 26, 2010)

I understand that you are a surefire user so let's just leave it here.


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## vali (Feb 26, 2010)

Toaster said:


> But you're deluding yourself if you think it's anywhere near as indestructible as the best built lights on the market.



Yeah, but McGuizmos are a bit over $50


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## jbrett14 (Feb 26, 2010)

Toaster said:


> To the OP, the benefits of a non protruding tailcap are tailstanding capability + reduced chance of accidental pocket activation. The benefits of a protruding tailcap are easy activation of light under all conditions, easy manipulation with gloved hands, and easy manipulation with fat fingers. It's for that reason that just about any light with a tactical focus does not come with a recessed switch. So pick what appeals most to you based on features, and not based on some unfounded durability concerns. Anyways with the Eagletacs as has been mentioned, you are not stuck either way. The XP-G models include a boot that allows for tailstanding. The 100 series can be ordered with a tailstanding tailcap (1, 2) if you prefer.
> 
> 
> Anyhow I'm a bit puzzled by your inclination towards the P20C2 MKII. It is by far the least throwiest of the lights you are considering which I thought was the most important factor for you?



Excellent points for sure. Makes sense to me. Thanks.

I was unaware that the P20C2 was the "least throwiest of the lights". This is why I have spent so much time researching. Although there is much INFO (charts, graphs, words, etc.) about these lights on the reviews, etc. there are very few, if any, real life beam shots, taken in the real outdoor world.

Yes, throw is very important to me, but not to the point of having a light that can only zoom in on a small target. I personally hate lights that are so focused on throw that they offer very little spill light to light up what is around me (e.g. hiking at night). But from what I am finding, most all of these lights seem to offer plenty of spill.

What would really be most helpful for me is to see a comparison of beamshots to a light that I have already used in the field (Streamlight Argo HD headlight or Streamlight ProPoly 4AA Luxeon). I am very familiar with the light output of these two lights. I would love to see some kind of usefull comparison from ANY of the lights suggested in this thread to one of these two lights that I am familiar with. I wouldn't want a light with any less spill than either of these two lights. If I could find a light with equal spill as these SL's but much more throw, I would be more than satisfied. 

Thanks for your post. You made some VERY valid arguments about the clickie switch. I won't worry about it being recessed because I don't really care if a light can stand on it's end. I have never needed this feature in the real world of where I plan to use the light.

Jonny


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## jbrett14 (Feb 26, 2010)

Egsise said:


> To me a protruding switch is an accident waiting to happen.



In theory, I think like you do. But I am curious if you know of any real life examples of these swithes failing due to protuding. Like toaster stated, if this were a real problem the manufacturers probably would not be making them this way.

Any thoughts?

I appreciate your input.

That TK20 does look like a sweet light. I have not ruled it out.

Jonny


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## Toaster (Feb 26, 2010)

jbrett14 said:


> I was unaware that the P20C2 was the "least throwiest of the lights". This is why I have spent so much time researching. Although there is much INFO (charts, graphs, words, etc.) about these lights on the reviews, etc. there are very few, if any, real life beam shots, taken in the real outdoor world.



I know it's not as useful as a real life reference. But as an objective measurement, the square root of peak lux measured equates to how much "throw" a light has. Or as a simple rule of thumb, doubling peak lux gives you ~40% increase in throw.



> Yes, throw is very important to me, but not to the point of having a light that can only zoom in on a small target. I personally hate lights that are so focused on throw that they offer very little spill light to light up what is around me (e.g. hiking at night). But from what I am finding, most all of these lights seem to offer plenty of spill.



I think what's confusing you is that while some of these lights are being described as throwy, none of them can be classified as dedicated throwers. Those are much bigger lights with large reflectors, pencil thin beams, and very little sidespill like the Dereelight DBS, Tiablo A10, Jetbeam Raptor RRT-1, etc. That's a completely different class of light as opposed to what's been recommended here so far.



> What would really be most helpful for me is to see a comparison of beamshots to a light that I have already used in the field (Streamlight Argo HD headlight or Streamlight ProPoly 4AA Luxeon). I am very familiar with the light output of these two lights. I would love to see some kind of usefull comparison from ANY of the lights suggested in this thread to one of these two lights that I am familiar with. I wouldn't want a light with any less spill than either of these two lights. If I could find a light with equal spill as these SL's but much more throw, I would be more than satisfied.



The Propoly 4AA luxeon has a dimmer spill than any of the lights that have been recommended. If that is your cutoff point, you have nothing to worry about.

Anyhow from what I've seen so far in this thread, of the Eagletacs I think you'd probably be happiest just springing for the 380 lumen T20C2 MKII XP-G R5 even though it's a little more than you wanted to spend. It has everything that you want. Crazy high output, good throw, bright wide spill, and long runtime. The P20C2 MKII doesn't have the throw or runtime you're looking for. The T100C2 lacks the bright wide spill you seem to want. And the P100C2 lacks the long runtime you asked for.


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## jbrett14 (Feb 26, 2010)

Toaster, I really appreciate that last post. I do want to comment on your last paragraph but I need to get home first. I'll comment tonight. 

Thanks a bunch.

Jonny


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## jugornot (Feb 26, 2010)

The TK20 is a great light. I have 2. I can't speak for the eagletac as I don't have one. For a little more you can move up to the dereelight javelin. It is a pretty amazing light. for xpg r5 it is $63. Further with minimal investment it is very customizable. 3xAA, Smo reflector. buy a c2h body (I think $12 was mentioned) and you can move into many different battery combination's. Not to mention it is a p60 host, so as new emitters become available you can upgrade. Just thought I would mention it. It has a very good throw with good spill. 300 lumens out the front with 3xAA. It makes a lot of sense for deciding what you like. Everything looks out of stock right now which says much about its popularity. There are promises of a new shipment next week.


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## jbrett14 (Feb 26, 2010)

Toaster said:


> Anyhow from what I've seen so far in this thread, of the Eagletacs I think you'd probably be happiest just springing for the 380 lumen T20C2 MKII XP-G R5 even though it's a little more than you wanted to spend. It has everything that you want. Crazy high output, good throw, bright wide spill, and long runtime. The P20C2 MKII doesn't have the throw or runtime you're looking for. The T100C2 lacks the bright wide spill you seem to want. And the P100C2 lacks the long runtime you asked for.



I suspect the T20 is indeed the one I might like the best of this bunch (hard to tell until I see some better photos of beams in the outdoor world). However, according to the reviews, it actually has the worst runtime of the bunch. The P20 actually has a longer runtime on CR123's. The P100 actually has the best runtime.

Approx. ratings, according to the reviews:
Lumens \ Runtime (2 x CR123) \ High Spot Lux

P100C2 : 220 \ 2.5 Hr. \ 7470
T100 C2 MK II : 220 \ 2.5 Hr. \ 11760

P20C2 MK II : 305 \ 1.75 Hr. \ 5140
T20C2 MK II : 294 \ 1.5 Hr. \ 8180

I am assuming that High Spot Lux is the indicator for throw ability.

Since I have been using my Streamlight Argo, which is a great light, yet only about 55 lumens of light, I am now wondering if any one of these lights, even the P100, which is the least expensive, would be plenty sufficient for what I want.

Is it safe to assume that a 220 lumen light is 4 times brighter than my 55 lumen Argo or is it not that obvious?

Jonny


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## jbrett14 (Feb 26, 2010)

Out of curiousity, and desiring to learn more about how lights are reviewed, why is it that the P20 & T20 get lower scores (light-reviews) for light output than the P100 & T100?

This surprises me, given that the 20's are using an "improved" Cree.

Jonny


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## jhc37013 (Feb 26, 2010)

For those that have both the T20C2 MKII and P20 MKII could you compare the spill size and the size of the hotspot, this might help the OP a little bit more.

I suspect the the hotspot is going to be much smaller for better throw and the spill is going to be narrower with the T20C2. If this is indeed true then the P20 would light up a wider area at closer range both in the spill and on target with the hot spot. This is just something you may want to consider, that and the size difference.


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## jbrett14 (Feb 27, 2010)

Anyone have experience with this light:

http://www.light-reviews.com/itp_c6_tactical/

One place has it listed for only $35

Jonny


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## jhc37013 (Feb 27, 2010)

I always wanted to pick a iTP c6 I always thought they looked really cool and the specs seems pretty good. I guess because its around 6" long and over 1.5" at bezel I never pulled the trigger. I still might one day though.


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## Egsise (Feb 27, 2010)

jbrett14 those lumens and runtimes were with cool white leds, for outdoors I would use neutral white led, the difference is huge.


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## csa (Feb 27, 2010)

jbrett14 said:


> Another question: How come none of these lights come with a thumb-operated clickie on the side of the light, rather than the end? Seems more logical (& ergonomical) to me to be able to operate the light while holding it as most folks hold a flashlight (in the most comfortable and natural position).



Nobody answered this with the most important point: you can never FIND the switch on the body without fiddling around. Most of us like our light to come on right away when we need it, and the only place on the whole light that is obvious and always the same is the end. If we're shining them at walls, sure, we know where the switch is before we use it, but pull any light out of a pocket or bag, the way you actually use it, and tell me which one comes on more quickly and conveniently. Rolling the light around looking for the switch is just silly.


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## jbrett14 (Feb 27, 2010)

Egsise said:


> jbrett14 those lumens and runtimes were with cool white leds, for outdoors I would use neutral white led, the difference is huge.




When you say "the difference is huge", do you mean the difference in the quality of light, or do you mean the difference of lumens and runtimes being huge?

I do like the neutral better for outdoors but I did not think the lumens and runtime would be that big of a difference. Less, perhaps, but not huge.

Jonny


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## hyperloop (Feb 27, 2010)

jbrett14 said:


> When you say "the difference is huge", do you mean the difference in the quality of light, or do you mean the difference of lumens and runtimes being huge?
> 
> I do like the neutral better for outdoors but I did not think the lumens and runtime would be that big of a difference. Less, perhaps, but not huge.
> 
> Jonny



the difference if i am correct, would be in the rendition of color, difference in lumens is definitely there as well, but the largest difference is IMHO in the color rendition, take a look here to see a simple comparison between 2 similar lights (Romisen RC N3) one with a Q5 and the other with a warm white.


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## waddup (Feb 27, 2010)

imo, the best flashlight for $50 is buying a used $100 light.... for $50


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## Anak (Feb 27, 2010)

As a newbie looking into the Solarforce lights, where is the best place to purchase online?

TIA


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## Egsise (Feb 27, 2010)

Both I guess. 

The neutral white leds are less efficient than cool white, the average difference is something like -25%?
I think the Eagletac rating of 200 lumens from neutral led vs 220 lumens from cool white may be a little optimistic, it would be great to see some lightbox comparisons of those two models to confirm the actual difference.
Runtimes are the same cause the driver is the same, so the difference is only in brightness.

For the difference in the color of the light, well you just need to see it yourself.
Led flashlight users who have cool white leds are ok with the color.
Many of those who have seen a real life side by side comparison of the cool vs neutral, prefer the neutral white for outdoors.
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/posts/2654418&postcount=269
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/posts/3242715&postcount=5
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/posts/3094372&postcount=47

For the protruding tailcap switch failures, it happens, but not that much that it would be a problem, I guess thats cause they are very cheap to replace.
I just don't like the idea of my flashlight switch failing in the middle of nowhere.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murphy's_law


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## orbital (Feb 27, 2010)

+

The T100C2 MkII SMO/neutral is the only light I have two of.

*It's a Top 5 light under $100,... and easily the Best light under $50!!*


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## Padre (Feb 27, 2010)

jbrett14 said:


> Would love to hear your opinions on what would be the best overall flashlight for under $50.
> 
> My preferences would be:
> 
> ...


For the money and quality and output you can't beat the MTE C3-907. I have one and love it. Just be sure to buy it from an authorized US distributer so you don't get a phony one. Max 170 Lumens. Great Light my EDC.


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## jbrett14 (Feb 27, 2010)

orbital said:


> +
> 
> The T100C2 MkII SMO/neutral is the only light I have two of.
> 
> *It's a Top 5 light under $100,... and easily the Best light under $50!!*



Your vote is consistent with the majority opinion in this thread. The T100C2 has now received the most votes, hands down, getting almost half the votes, with the TK20, P20C2, & P100C2 getting the majority of the other half.

One thing is clear - the EagleTac lights are by far the ones most recommended by those who have posted in here.

I wish I had seen this earlier:

https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/235171

Although the reviews are fantastic for the runtime graphs, etc. there is nothing like having real world photos of beamshots.

Jonny


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## wingnut86 (Feb 27, 2010)

jbrett14 said:


> I wish I had seen this earlier:
> 
> https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/235171
> 
> ...



Just remember that the P20A2, P20C2 and T20C2 MKII's will have a different beam than the ones pictured. The P100C2 looks to have a beautiful beam though. I think of the recommended EagleTac's, the T100C2 MKII will most likely be the most "Bullet Proof" of the bunch, probably along the lines of the Fenix TK series lights. Although my P20C2 seems pretty durable.


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## jbrett14 (Feb 27, 2010)

Thanks wingnut.

The more I think this thing through, the more I realize that I should have defined my personal perceptions of a good "runtime".

When reading flashlight specs, runtime numbers are provided, based on from the moment the light is turned on, to the point of diminishing to 50% output. Personally, I think there is a more important factor than just looking at these runtime numbers, which can be deceptive. This is why I love the graphs in the reviews. 

I personally hate lights that start off really bright and then immediately start to diminish (the problem with incans). To me, any LED light that is like this, may as well be an incan light.

I would much rather have a light with a 2 hour runtime that maintained a nice flat constant output - the closer to 100% the better - for 1.5-2 hours, before starting to diminish, than a light that had a runtime of 4 hours which started to diminish after 30 minutes. This was the reason that I really loved my old Streamlight Propoly 4AA Luxeon. The thing maintained full brightness for like 4 hours or more - amazing regulation.

Based on this desire, it seems the AA models that have been suggested are becoming less appealing to me, compared to the longer constant high runtimes of the CR123 lights.

As far as the EagleTacs go, they all look pretty nice. If I had to base it strictly on the few beamshot photos that I have seen, I would probably go with one of the 20 Series over the 100 Series. But I am guessing that the smaller, lower priced P100C2 would probably be just fine since, like I said, I have been using a light with far fewer lumens and throw. I am just not sure about it lacking the ability to use the 18650 battery. I have never used these batteries so I don't know much about them or whether this is important.

Jonny


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## Toaster (Feb 27, 2010)

jbrett14 said:


> I suspect the T20 is indeed the one I might like the best of this bunch (hard to tell until I see some better photos of beams in the outdoor world). However, according to the reviews, it actually has the worst runtime of the bunch. The P20 actually has a longer runtime on CR123's. The P100 actually has the best runtime.



If you're primarily using CR123s, then that is correct. However if you're using rechargeables, then the situation changes as the 18650 has significantly more capacity than 2xCR123s or 1x17670.



> Is it safe to assume that a 220 lumen light is 4 times brighter than my 55 lumen Argo or is it not that obvious?



Our eyes don't work that way. It takes about 4x the output for a light to appear twice as bright.




jbrett14 said:


> Out of curiousity, and desiring to learn more about how lights are reviewed, why is it that the P20 & T20 get lower scores (light-reviews) for light output than the P100 & T100?



I suspect it's weighted against price and what else is currently available at the time the review was written.

As far as neutral LEDS are concerned. Imho it helps with color rendition. But so does more lumens. If you have a choice and the difference in output is not so huge, I would go with neutral white every time. But if there's a substantial gap, I'd go for the cool white. With the 100 series, the gap is small and I prefer the neutral white models. For the 20 series, the gap is massive and I would definitely go with the cool white models.


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## damn_hammer (Feb 27, 2010)

I don't have the P20C2, or T20C2, but was surprised by the apparent difference in size between the two. Have a look see: https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/263213

It's quite possible you've already seen that link, but just in case you haven't.


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## nme (Feb 28, 2010)

jhc37013 said:


> I sent you a PM with the discount page.



can you PM me this page also? thanks.


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## Benson (Feb 28, 2010)

csa said:


> Nobody answered this with the most important point: you can never FIND the switch on the body without fiddling around. Most of us like our light to come on right away when we need it, and the only place on the whole light that is obvious and always the same is the end. If we're shining them at walls, sure, we know where the switch is before we use it, but pull any light out of a pocket or bag, the way you actually use it, and tell me which one comes on more quickly and conveniently. Rolling the light around looking for the switch is just silly.


Doesn't have to be a problem, especially with plastic-bodied lights, where the switch side can be ribbed etc. to make it easy to feel at once. Definitely a good argument against Mag and similar -- smooth round body + more-or-less flush side-switch + gloves = rolling the thing around for 10 or 15 seconds looking for the switch.

Worst I ever had in this regard is a S&W Galaxy, with 9 5mm LEDs and 1 xenon bulb -- in a move of astonishing idiocy, they placed the two almost identical rubber-domed switches (one was smooth, one was slightly textured) exactly across from each other. If they'd put them 90 degrees apart, you could get to them both easily, and could orient it in your hand by feel to get them both accessible and know which was which. But 180 degrees? You never knew which was which till you turn it on. Fortunately, they were about the same brightness, so it didn't matter...



waddup said:


> imo, the best flashlight for $50 is buying a used $100 light.... for $50


+1


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## wingnut86 (Feb 28, 2010)

Benson said:


> smooth round body + more-or-less flush side-switch + gloves = rolling the thing around for 10 or 15 seconds looking for the switch.



Personally, I'd be embarrassed if it took me 10-15 seconds to find the switch on a Maglite, even with gloves on...Hell, I can change the batteries in 15 seconds.


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## jbrett14 (Mar 1, 2010)

A few more questions regarding the EagleTac T100C2 MKII:

I am unfamiliar with 18650 batteries, but understand that some have button ends and some are flat. Does it matter which kind are used in this light?

Once charged, how many days (approx.) will these batteries hold their charge without being used?

Is there any advantage to using CR123 batteries in this light instead of the 18650's?


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## wingnut86 (Mar 1, 2010)

jbrett14 said:


> A few more questions regarding the EagleTac T100C2 MKII:
> 
> I am unfamiliar with 18650 batteries, but understand that some have button ends and some are flat. Does it matter which kind are used in this light?
> 
> ...




For these lights you would need button ends. Li-ion will hold there charge for quite a long time, they are unlike nimh where they will discharge themselves.
I don't use my 18650's much any more, and just measured the voltage and it was 4.18 in both cells, 4.20 is fully charged, they probably haven't been used or charged for nearly 6 months or more.

In this particular light, the runtimes and regulation should be very close with both battery setups. There are a few advantages to using cr123a batteries, one being the storage life 10+ years, not having to recharge them ever...I hate recharging batteries, and not having to worry about them after they are dead. Usually another advantage of using CR123a's is that you get full regulation with regulated led lights, but the T100C2 MKII does that on 18650's too. If lithium AA's and CR123a cells cost the same as rayovac alkalines, I would never deal with rechargeables again... 

If it is a light that you are going to use often, I would recommend Li-ions, but if it will be used not very often, I probably wouldn't even bother with the initial cost of Li-ions. A dozen Surefire CR123a's are only 30 bucks bought locally or shipped to your door. And two AW brand 18650's and his charger the WF-139, all from 4Sevens will come to $50.50. Granted you could get 2 trustfire 18650's and a cheap DSD charger from DX for a total of 15 bucks (the setup I have), and if your lucky, the cells will be quality ones with true capacity...


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## Advil (Mar 1, 2010)

I'm in love with the Quark Mini 123. Pocket/keychain sized but fullsize powered.


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## Egsise (Mar 14, 2010)

HeadCSO said:


> I had an older P10A2. Dropped it on the floor and the lens shattered. Got that replaced and got the lens modification from Eagletac. Dropped it on a carpeted floor and the lens cracked. Gave up after that.



I found some posts about Eagletac and cracked lenses, have that kind of problems solved with the new models?

I would like to buy some of the new Eagletac models but....
I know that my Fenix TK20 does not brake if i accidentally drop it, has anyone tried that with new Eagletacs?


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## JaguarDave-in-Oz (Mar 14, 2010)

I dropped my P100C2 onto a wooden floor a while back and nothing cracked bent or broke. I don't yet really want to try it with my new MkII P20C2 since I've only had it a week or so but the lens looks pretty well mounted and also insulated from the stainless bezel itself by a thickish ring of aluminium and O ring.


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## OCD (Mar 14, 2010)

Had a "duh" moment....See post below...


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## OCD (Mar 14, 2010)

+1 on Quarks. With the 2*AA model, you can get an single AA or CR123 body for multiple configurations, and sizes.


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## Egsise (Jul 22, 2010)

Toaster said:


> LOL I've seen people grasping at straws to justify their purchase before. But bringing up button drop durability as an issue is a first  In a drop, the tailcap is not likely to be damaged. The bezel and lens is far more likely to be damaged, followed by the driver as both are not usually shock insulated by a _spring_ and are usually at the heavy end of the light which strikes first. Just look at Surefire's lights and see how many have a protruding tailcap. If it was an issue, they would have stopped making it that way a long time ago.





jbrett14 said:


> But I am curious if you know of any real life examples of these swithes failing due to protuding. Like toaster stated, if this were a real problem the manufacturers probably would not be making them this way.





JNewell said:


> SF has rebuilt two of my lights, one twice, after serious falls damaged tailcaps and/or bezels.



resurrecting the dead. 

I know I know, that was 4y ago, but has the SF changed anything in their tailcaps after that...
Well anyway, if it can happen it propably will... and it has....so why take the risk?


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## flight medic (Aug 8, 2017)

hyperloop said:


> Fenix TK20, using "CPF8" code at 4sevens, it comes in below $50.



Boy, 7 years really makes a difference. The TK20's are over $100 now. Came across this thread in Google while trying to find cheaper alternatives to the Surefire torches I've been buying (and losing) over the years.


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## Bullzeyebill (Aug 8, 2017)

Usually we don't let totally old threads get bumped. But it would be interesting to compare what we considered $50.00 lights then and now, 7 years later. Welcome to CPF.

Bill


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## ven (Aug 10, 2017)

Well Bill, i will throw a couple of lights(make it 3) in right now near budget that i think stand out(bang for buck).
General few suggested, not perfectly suited ...............just ideas what 50 bucks can get you today.
No order, Convoy L6
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?419516-Review-Convoy-L6-(XHP-70-2x26650)
D4
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?436522-Noctigon-Meteor-D4

L6 can be found for around $50, hard to beat for a good xhp70 hitter. The D4 is pretty new, mtn electronics sells out within hours, Hank at int outdoor is the other option. Around $40, your getting around 4000lm(LED choice dependent) from a light that can slip in your pocket(similar size to a zebralight..............they are tiny!)

Still today, the surefire 6p is a great choice of light, be it for a host or to use the bulb. Drop ins can be bought from around $10.......up to what you want to pay really. Choices of LED's, drivers, optics, reflectors really do give plenty of options to suit most.........very flexible option. 
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?182392-Why-is-the-SureFire-6P-so-good

Cheers! 

:welcome:flight medic


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