# ZebraLight SC600 MkII



## BWX

*ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**



> *Dec 2, 2012:* We will release an SC600 MkII next month to replace this one and half year old design. Main improvements include:
> 1. *900Lm max ANSI* (SC600's 750Lm rating is based on T6 LEDs. Most SC600s shipped actually come with U2 LEDs)
> 2. programmable M and L (similar to the H502 and SC52) and much longer runtimes.
> 3. Total length 101.6mm (5.4mm shorter) and lighter.
> 4. Battery indicator, similar to the H502 and SC52.



SC600 MKI

EDIT- Pics and description

 Zebra Light SC600 MKII 











*Pre-order. Estimated shipping date: March 22, 2013*​
*Main Features and Specifications*

LED: Cree XM-L Cool White (Norminal CCT 6300K)
User Selectable Levels: 3 main level (High, Medium and Low). Each main level can 
be configured to one of its two sub-levels. The second sub-level of the High (H2) can be further configured to different brightness levels or strobes.
Light Output


High
-H1 *900Lm* for the first 5 min and then step down to *500Lm* (tbd) or 
-H2 *500Lm* (tbd) /* 270Lm* (tbd) / 4Hz Strobe


Medium
-M1 * 90Lm* (tbd) or 
-M2 * 27Lm* (tbd) / *9Lm* (tbd)


Low
-L1 * 3Lm* (tbd) or
-L2 *0.6Lm* (tbd) / *0.1Lm* (tbd) / *0.02Lm* (tbd)
Runtimes will be tested using ZebraLight ZL631 batteries. Light output are 
ANSI out the front (OTF) values. All levels are current regulated.​

Operating Voltage Range: 2.7V - 4.2V
Battery: One 18650 size (up to 68mm long) 3.6/3.7V Li-ion rechargeable battery. Batteries are not included in the package.
Parasitic Drain: Negligible (much less than the self discharging of batteries)
Beam Type
-80 degree spill
-10 degree hot spot​

Dimensions
-Head Diameter: 30 mm
-Body Diameter: 25mm
-Length: 101.6 mm​

Weight
-tbd​

Features
-Battery capacity indicator (LED flashes 1-4 times, 4 short clicks to start)
-Lanyard ring
-Automatically stepping down from High to Medium, and from Medium to Low when battery capacity is low
-Builtin over-discharging protection with 2.7V cutoff
-Electronic soft-touch switch
-Smart user interface provides fast and easy access to all brightness levels
-Precision machined unibody casing from premium grade aluminum
-Durable natural hard anodized finish (Type III Class I)
-Ultra clear lens with anti-reflection coatings on both sides
-Orange peel textured reflector
-Battery reverse polarity protection
-Waterproof to IPX7 (2 meters, 30 minutes)​


*Operations*
This light has 3 main levels (High, Medium, and Low). Each main level can be configured 
to one of its two sub-levels. The second sub-level of each main level can be further 
configured to different brightness levels or strobes.​

Basic Operation
-Short click turns on the light to High or turns off the light.
-Long click (press and hold for about 0.7 seconds) turns on the light to Low​

Advanced Operation and Configuration
-Short click turns on the light to High. Short click again quickly to cycle from High to Medium, and Low.
-Press and hold to cycle from Low to High, release to set. When press and hold, the light always cycle from Low to High regardless which level you are currently in.
-Double click to toggle and select between the two sub-levels for that main level. Sub-level selections (except the strobe) for the 3 main levels are memorized after the light is turned off and through battery changes.
-The second sub-level of each main levels can be configured after 6 double clicks. Double click (startng with the 7th) to cycle and select different brightness levels or strobes. Short click to turn off the light when finishing configurations. The selections for the second sub-level are memorized after the light is turned off and through battery changes.
-This light uses the LEDs to indicate the estimated remaining battery capacity by flashing 1 to 4 times. To start the battery indicator, short-click 4 times without pause from OFF.​


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## tonkem

BWX said:


> Does anyone know if there is a review comparing the original to the new MkII? Does anyone have one yet?




They have not been released yet. You can check Zebralights website, as it is normally accurate....


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## shelm

*Swede74 *beaten again


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## tonkem

Great, I guess I should look at the website first, or at least read the post more completely. Thanks Shelm! Good to see them updating it....


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## BWX

I posted a link to the page with the "news" on it at zebralight,but then when I saw a huge yellow box with a warning not to post external links to retailers other than candlepower marketplace links so I edited post and took it down. Not sure what that's about.. but anyway..

I thought maybe a reviewer might have gotten a sample or something.. If anyone sees an early review, post a link.


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## eloreno

Man that's a bummer. I just received my second sc600 last Friday. I would have waited had I known.


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## maxrep12

eloreno said:


> Man that's a bummer. I just received my second sc600 last Friday. I would have waited had I known.


I feel your pain.

I have one sc52, and another on order, but I think I will sell one of em' to get the sporty "turbo" MKll model of the sc600!


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## shelm

maxrep12 said:


> I have one sc52, and another on order,


i am thinking that, since the SC600II is a XML flashlight, i dont need another Zebralight with floody XML. SC600 xml and SC52 xml are quite similar .. if you're open to it


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## BWX

eloreno said:


> Man that's a bummer. I just received my second sc600 last Friday. I would have waited had I known.





I was thinking about ordering an SC600 last night and saw that announcement at zebralight.com - glad I didn't decide to buy one a few days before. I think I'll just wait and buy the MkII when they come out. Then I'll forget about this flickering D25LC2 I've been EDC'ing. Maybe I'll send it back to Eagletac (again)


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## Swede74

shelm said:


> *Swede74 *beaten again



It's the time zones' fault. :laughing: They probably make all their announcements when I'm sound asleep, dreaming up a clever design for the SC53.








> Originally Posted by *eloreno*
> 
> 
> Man that's a bummer. I just received my second sc600 last Friday. I would have waited had I known.
> I feel your pain.
> 
> I have one sc52, and another on order, but I think I will sell one of em' to get the sporty "turbo" MKll model of the sc600!



I feel it too, but you probably got one with the U2 LED, so chances are it's only marginally less bright at the highest level than Mk II. Still, a minor change in output seems like the least significant update in comparison to reduced size and better runtimes. If you already have one one, you could always consider not using it (the one you received Friday) and selling it in mint condition.


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## BWX

_*SC600's 750Lm rating is based on T6 LEDs.*_

The funny thing is that they do not list the lumen rating of the current U2 model, or the other mode's lumen rating of the u2 model.. or the new MkII's other mode's output. maybe the other mode's output are all the same as the T6 version? 

It would be cool if the normal step down high mode was now going to be 600 lumens or something other than the standard 500.


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## eloreno

Swede74 said:


> I feel it too, but you probably got one with the U2 LED, so chances are it's only marginally less bright at the highest level than Mk II. Still, a minor change in output seems like the least significant update in comparison to reduced size and better runtimes. If you already have one one, you could always consider not using it (the one you received Friday) and selling it in mint condition.



I believe I did get a U2 binned LED. I got my first SC600 by pre order, and it was one of the very first released. I've had no problems with it. My second, which I just received on Friday, is an SC600w and it seems to me that even though it's neutral tinted, that it's brighter than the SC600. So, it just might have a U2 emitter in it. 

The reason I'll probably end up buying another one, of the cool white variety, are the other upgrades. The fuel gauge is an excellent addition, as are the extra levels. I have enjoyed both features on my SC52 and H502d. Add to that the smaller size AND the 150 lumens, and I don't think I'll be able to pass it up!


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## JKolmo

2. programmable M and L (similar to the H502 and SC52) and much longer runtimes.

Hmmm, one way to interpret this would be that M and L now will be programmable to lower subsettings than the current version's M and L, and that these lower M and L subsettings also provide "much longer runtimes" simply because they are lower lumens, no?


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## tonkem

eloreno said:


> I believe I did get a U2 binned LED. I got my first SC600 by pre order, and it was one of the very first released. I've had no problems with it. My second, which I just received on Friday, is an SC600w and it seems to me that even though it's neutral tinted, that it's brighter than the SC600. So, it just might have a U2 emitter in it.
> 
> The reason I'll probably end up buying another one, of the cool white variety, are the other upgrades. The fuel gauge is an excellent addition, as are the extra levels. I have enjoyed both features on my SC52 and H502d. Add to that the smaller size AND the 150 lumens, and I don't think I'll be able to pass it up!



Agreed. My son has one and he loves it. I would be interested in the additional features and not just the higher output. It is also almost a quarter of an inch SMALLER than the previous model!

I agree the much longer runtimes will be based on the lower modes not previously available.


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## carl

eloreno said:


> Man that's a bummer. I just received my second sc600 last Friday. I would have waited had I known.



But if the current model comes with the U2, does it really matter much if it all? The battery indicator is no big deal (IMHO) and what if the new one, although shorter, looks bland or otherwise not so great? I really like the looks of the current model - no frills just purpose built.


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## tonkem

carl said:


> But if the current model comes with the U2, does it really matter much if it all? The battery indicator is no big deal (IMHO) and what if the new one, although shorter, looks bland or otherwise not so great? I really like the looks of the current model - no frills just purpose built.



We shall see when it comes out.


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## TMCGLASSON36

I hope the MKII has the same new machining as the SC52 and a screw down pocket clip. The higher output is not such a big deal to me. The current level is great as it stands. But as we all know more lumens is always nice!


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## tonkem

TMCGLASSON36 said:


> I hope the MKII has the same new machining as the SC52 and a screw down pocket clip. The higher output is not such a big deal to me. The current level is great as it stands. But as we all know more lumens is always nice!



Yes more lumens on tap with the same or longer runtime on high would be nice.


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## TMCGLASSON36

I have my H2 set at 200 lumens on my SC600 and thats all I use at work. The 750 is only used outdoors walking the the dogs so they don't get to far ahead in the woods. But I like havin it if I need it. My SC52 is set H2 108L and its plenty for EDC, but it floors my buds when my little candle gets lite up at 500L. LOL


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## Onthelightside

I was just coming to post this... I will be quite happy if they update the SC600w version.


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## TMCGLASSON36

Onthelightside said:


> I was just coming to post this... I will be quite happy if they update the SC600w version.


I'm sure it will get the new UI. I been wanting to try a W version. I guess I'll wait till the current SC600W start showing up in the MarketPlace.


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## henry1960

TMCGLASSON36 said:


> I hope the MKII has the same new machining as the SC52 and a screw down pocket clip. But as we all know more lumens is always nice!



Im hoping for the same!!!


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## Fireclaw18

henry1960 said:


> Im hoping for the same!!!



I'm not a fan of pocket clips on my lights. It's one of the things I dislike about the SC51/52. The clip mount protrudes and has very sharp corners and edges. I carry my EDC loose in my pocket so have no use for the clip. Normally I perform a "clipectomy" on all my lights, but this really isn't an option with the SC52. I'd really hate it if the new SC600 MkII had an SC51 style clip.


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## Onthelightside

So now I am wondering if they will do the same for the H600


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## henry1960

Fireclaw18 said:


> I'm not a fan of pocket clips on my lights. It's one of the things I dislike about the SC51/52. The clip mount protrudes and has very sharp corners and edges. I carry my EDC loose in my pocket so have no use for the clip. Normally I perform a "clipectomy" on all my lights, but this really isn't an option with the SC52. I'd really hate it if the new SC600 MkII had an SC51 style clip.



I 90 Percent of the time do not use the clip eaither but it is allways nice to have it just in case...And thats only if they use the same clip as the SC51 & SC52
If they put the clip that was on old model SC600 I will take and keep off...


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## Badbeams3

I`m guessing one change will be the use of the U3 emitter. Surprised they did not use that in the SC52...maybe next month. Well, my SC600 is in perfect condition...sounds like it needs to be packed back up...and find it`s way under my brother in-laws Christmas tree...just got his doctorate in education...so double reason...then, da new one shall be mine! 900 lumen out of something that small...yea baby...I`m digging it already...


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## maxrep12

It sounds like the low setting options will include the .01 lumens currently offered on the sc52? That was my only tiny quarrel with the sc600, a .1 lumen low is not quite low enough to serve as a locator setting.

So where will the 5.4mm size reduction come from?

At 4.0 inches and 900 lumens, I have to get this light! I also have to get the s6330...and I have two sc52's...way to corner the market ZL.


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## BWX

I hope Xtar (Panasonic) 3100 mah protected fit the MkII.. I didn't even think about that.. Maybe even the new bigger 3400 mah batts will fit the new one though?


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## magnum70383

BWX said:


> I hope Xtar (Panasonic) 3100 mah protected fit the MkII.. I didn't even think about that.. Maybe even the new bigger 3400 mah batts will fit the new one though?



Ya, I'm debating rather to get the protected panasonic 3400 batteries!


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## hb-light

I think the fact that people barely use the zebralight clips is because you need two hands to clip it on to something... If zebralight made a PINCH clip that would solve the problem... 

It's simple, you pinch to open i.e. increase the gap between the point of the clip and the flash light itself... and slide it in where ever they want... WITH ONE HAND... the clip and the flashlight should CLAMP down hard...

We need a ONE HANDED CLIP... way more useful... 

IF zebralight were to make it... I'm guessing it would incorporate some kind of spring...

It's frustrating using two hands and frustrating to see they didn't figure this out.


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## twl

magnum70383 said:


> Ya, I'm debating rather to get the protected panasonic 3400 batteries!



If you plan to mostly use the medium and lower brightness selections, then the higher mah AW (Panasonic) 18650 batteries like the 2900, 3100, and 3400 will be best.
However, if you plan to mostly use the high and turbo settings which draw high current, then you will get best results from the AW 2600 mah 18650.

I realize that this sounds unusual, but the chemistries are different. The 2600 is the older LiCo chemistry, and that holds up to higher drain better, and holds up its voltage better in those conditions. It will hold the high setting brightness for longer than the 3100(and probably the 3400 too) before it starts dropping off.
The newer chemistry with the Nickel in it can last longer at low current draw, but drops voltage faster at high current, so the run times on high or turbo won't be as good with the new chemistry that is used in the 2900, 3100, and 3400.

So, for a LED like the XML that likes a lot of current to run at high power, the 2600 is still the battery of choice.
If you want to mostly use the low modes, then get the 3400.
If you look at the discharge graphs of these different batteries closely at the high discharge rates vs the low discharge rates, you can see what I'm saying.


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## Onthelightside

> I realize that this sounds unusual, but the chemistries are different. The 2600 is the older LiCo chemistry, and that holds up to higher drain better, and holds up its voltage better in those conditions. It will hold the high setting brightness for longer than the 3100(and probably the 3400 too) before it starts dropping off.
> The newer chemistry with the Nickel in it can last longer at low current draw, but drops voltage faster at high current, so the run times on high or turbo won't be as good with the new chemistry that is used in the 2900, 3100, and 3400.
> 
> So, for a LED like the XML that likes a lot of current to run at high power, the 2600 is still the battery of choice.
> If you want to mostly use the low modes, then get the 3400.
> If you look at the discharge graphs of these different batteries closely at the high discharge rates vs the low discharge rates, you can see what I'm saying.



Interesting! I am just waiting for metal air batteries for my lights. Not sure if you have heard of them but they are pretty cool very high energy density I have been working with them in my lab. Li-ion is so yesterday


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## AVService

Is Zebralight historically on target with the time frame for delivery?
They claim this will be available next month,have they been right in the past?


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## hatman

twl said:


> If you plan to mostly use the medium and lower brightness selections, then the higher mah AW (Panasonic) 18650 batteries like the 2900, 3100, and 3400 will be best.
> However, if you plan to mostly use the high and turbo settings which draw high current, then you will get best results from the AW 2600 mah 18650.
> 
> I realize that this sounds unusual, but the chemistries are different. The 2600 is the older LiCo chemistry, and that holds up to higher drain better, and holds up its voltage better in those conditions. It will hold the high setting brightness for longer than the 3100(and probably the 3400 too) before it starts dropping off.
> The newer chemistry with the Nickel in it can last longer at low current draw, but drops voltage faster at high current, so the run times on high or turbo won't be as good with the new chemistry that is used in the 2900, 3100, and 3400.
> 
> So, for a LED like the XML that likes a lot of current to run at high power, the 2600 is still the battery of choice.
> If you want to mostly use the low modes, then get the 3400.
> If you look at the discharge graphs of these different batteries closely at the high discharge rates vs the low discharge rates, you can see what I'm saying.



Fascinating.

Is there any downside to using the 2600 on high?


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## Badbeams3

AVService said:


> Is Zebralight historically on target with the time frame for delivery?
> They claim this will be available next month,have they been right in the past?



Hmm...not so much...but, I think they will be more/less on target with this one. The sc600 has been off their web site for some time now http://www.zebralight.com/ ...noticed them gone a couple weeks ago..only the SC600w remain. So...I think they have cleared their old stock for the most part. Dealers, I believe...are hoping to clear stocks of many lights over the Christmas time. Then I think we will see them (and other U3 lights) appear when they refill their stocks. So...I believe these will be out shortly...next month some time. Either the newer models will sell for more...or we will see sale pricing on the older models.


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## Erik1213

AVService said:


> Is Zebralight historically on target with the time frame for delivery?
> They claim this will be available next month,have they been right in the past?



No. Because Q50.


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## Alpinebully

I just received my first ZebraLight a week or so ago, the SC600w. It was shipped from China and took about 3 weeks to arrive from my order date.

As others have said had i known about this MKII version i most likely would have waited, however now that i have received the SC600w im very hesitant to purchase any more ZebraLight, lights.

The Anodizing is pretty poor with markings in it on the head and the tail cap area. The deburring around the switch is uneven. The tail cap isnt even centered to the body of the flashlight!!! The w LED color is nice but there are artifacts around the uneven hotspot. Inside the battery tube, at the head end where the circuity and positive terminal are, glue? has run from there and pooled a little in one area of the battery tube making the battery a tight fit. One of these things id accept but all of them in one light really makes me question and doubt their QC.

If i thought i could get a replacement quickly id send it back but given the time it took to arrive in the first place, ill write this one off but again sadly it will be my first and last unless i eventually buy a replacement second hand that has been properly inspected and beam shots confirmed etc.


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## Alpinebully

FWIW, given the battery discussion above the Unprotected 3100mAh Panasonic cells fit in my SC600w but i just received some 3100mAh Panasonic's with Protection and they do not really fit inside the SC600w; they do but they are a real struggle to extract...

Thanks for the info TWL; re the 2600mAh cells etc. I might just have to pick a few up and try them out.


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## Badbeams3

Alpinebully said:


> I just received my first ZebraLight a week or so ago, the SC600w. It was shipped from China and took about 3 weeks to arrive from my order date.
> 
> As others have said had i known about this MKII version i most likely would have waited, however now that i have received the SC600w im very hesitant to purchase any more ZebraLight, lights.
> 
> The Anodizing is pretty poor with markings in it on the head and the tail cap area. The deburring around the switch is uneven. The tail cap isnt even centered to the body of the flashlight!!! The w LED color is nice but there are artifacts around the uneven hotspot. Inside the battery tube, at the head end where the circuity and positive terminal are, glue? has run from there and pooled a little in one area of the battery tube making the battery a tight fit. One of these things id accept but all of them in one light really makes me question and doubt their QC.
> 
> If i thought i could get a replacement quickly id send it back but given the time it took to arrive in the first place, ill write this one off but again sadly it will be my first and last unless i eventually buy a replacement second hand that has been properly inspected and beam shots confirmed etc.



Can you send it back for a refund? Lose in the shipping cost...but why hold on to something you are unhappy about.


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## Alpinebully

Badbeams, if i thought id get a replacement within a week and felt certain that it would be a 'good example' then i would but waiting 3-6 weeks to take another gamble on the tint color etc. and now with xmas upon us the postage system just about grinds to a halt; i dont like sending or trying to receive items OS this time of the year at all. 

I go camping just about every second weekend and this is my first warm tinted light so im enjoying that and focusing on that, id rather just use it then wait for a replacement. The light works and in a few months the finish will be well worn anyways... It is what it is and i think i was expecting to much mind you ive had other Chinese lights (Fenix) and they have all been 100% perfectly machined and finished etc. 

The off center tail cap is really strange, ive tried looking over every single photo i can lay my eyes on, online and cannot tell if they are all this way or not... ill post up some photos.


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## Patriot

I'm eager to see how they shaved over 5mm in length! It's really neat to see zebralight incorporate real improvements and updates. It would be nice to see really innovative pocket clip but with regards to the MKII, I'm sure that changes made have already been finalized for production.


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## Badbeams3

Alpinebully said:


> Badbeams, if i thought id get a replacement within a week and felt certain that it would be a 'good example' then i would but waiting 3-6 weeks to take another gamble on the tint color etc. and now with xmas upon us the postage system just about grinds to a halt; i dont like sending or trying to receive items OS this time of the year at all.
> 
> I go camping just about every second weekend and this is my first warm tinted light so im enjoying that and focusing on that, id rather just use it then wait for a replacement. The light works and in a few months the finish will be well worn anyways... It is what it is and i think i was expecting to much mind you ive had other Chinese lights (Fenix) and they have all been 100% perfectly machined and finished etc.
> 
> The off center tail cap is really strange, ive tried looking over every single photo i can lay my eyes on, online and cannot tell if they are all this way or not... ill post up some photos.



Understandable. Looking at my SC600 I see no flaws at all...looks perfect in every way. I think you got hold of a reject...made it`s way back into the mix. Are there no dealers local you could order from in the future? Makes it much easier to return, exchange...whatever. I never order online. I always use the phone and guide my dealer through an inspection before sending it...with the assurance and understanding that if things are not 100%...they can expect it returned. Still run into problems though...ordered an S10 and the battery fit was so tight...I sent it back for a refund (I really loved that light...for the one night we were together).


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## Alpinebully

Using a set of verniers i measure 1mm or 0.039" difference between the two sides the cap is off. It can be felt easily when in the hand if you rub your thumb up and down on the knurling on the side of the battery cap, and do it all around basically one side it is flush with the lanyard band and one side the lanyard band sticks out - this is not the side where the lanyard ring is located its about 90degrees from the ring, basically if the side with the logo and switch is the front, the lanyard hole is the back then im talking about the other two quadrents - left and right. I dont know whats off center, maybe its the lanyard 'band' or everything from the underside of it and up.

There are also some deep machining marks covering approx 1/4 of the dia. of the body in the section under the lanyard 'band' seen in the 2nd photo. So perhaps the light wasnt in the tool straight in the first place i dont know.

Other marks in the anodizing can be seen in the battery cap, it feels smooth where the marks are. I havent bothered taking photos of everything i originally mentioned but can do if anyone really wants to see my every complaint.

Example of anodizing marks






Gouging in the area under the lanyard 'banding'





Battery cap is about flush on the right side, but off on the left.





Compare the left to the right side, the shelf between the oring and the edge, its 1mm difference from the left side to the right.





.


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## CarpentryHero

I have had poor luck with the ones I bought from there main site too. Poor anodizing on one and an sc60 with what may be dirty contacts in the head or a loose connection.


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## magnum70383

twl said:


> If you plan to mostly use the medium and lower brightness selections, then the higher mah AW (Panasonic) 18650 batteries like the 2900, 3100, and 3400 will be best.
> However, if you plan to mostly use the high and turbo settings which draw high current, then you will get best results from the AW 2600 mah 18650.
> 
> I realize that this sounds unusual, but the chemistries are different. The 2600 is the older LiCo chemistry, and that holds up to higher drain better, and holds up its voltage better in those conditions. It will hold the high setting brightness for longer than the 3100(and probably the 3400 too) before it starts dropping off.
> The newer chemistry with the Nickel in it can last longer at low current draw, but drops voltage faster at high current, so the run times on high or turbo won't be as good with the new chemistry that is used in the 2900, 3100, and 3400.
> 
> So, for a LED like the XML that likes a lot of current to run at high power, the 2600 is still the battery of choice.
> If you want to mostly use the low modes, then get the 3400.
> If you look at the discharge graphs of these different batteries closely at the high discharge rates vs the low discharge rates, you can see what I'm saying.



Wow FINALLY I get it. Thank you so much!


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## peterharvey73

Wow, I think the light is fine by me.
There certainly are some scratches from the annodising at the tail cap.
In the last photo, the lanyard ring is certainly a little thicker on the right than on the left.
A bit too picky.
I've seen much much worse build quality around than this; like clearly off centered LED emitters.
Nevermind, everyone is different - I understand where you are coming from...






Alpinebully said:


> Using a set of verniers i measure 1mm or 0.039" difference between the two sides the cap is off. It can be felt easily when in the hand if you rub your thumb up and down on the knurling on the side of the battery cap, and do it all around basically one side it is flush with the lanyard band and one side the lanyard band sticks out - this is not the side where the lanyard ring is located its about 90degrees from the ring, basically if the side with the logo and switch is the front, the lanyard hole is the back then im talking about the other two quadrents - left and right. I dont know whats off center, maybe its the lanyard 'band' or everything from the underside of it and up.
> 
> There are also some deep machining marks covering approx 1/4 of the dia. of the body in the section under the lanyard 'band' seen in the 2nd photo. So perhaps the light wasnt in the tool straight in the first place i dont know.
> 
> Other marks in the anodizing can be seen in the battery cap, it feels smooth where the marks are. I havent bothered taking photos of everything i originally mentioned but can do if anyone really wants to see my every complaint.
> 
> Example of anodizing marks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Gouging in the area under the lanyard 'banding'
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Battery cap is about flush on the right side, but off on the left.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Compare the left to the right side, the shelf between the oring and the edge, its 1mm difference from the left side to the right.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


----------



## Alpinebully

peterharvey73 said:


> Wow, I think the light is fine by me.
> There certainly are some scratches from the annodising at the tail cap.
> In the last photo, the lanyard ring is certainly a little thicker on the right than on the left.
> A bit too picky.
> I've seen much much worse build quality around than this; like clearly off centered LED emitters.
> Nevermind, everyone is different - I understand where you are coming from...



I understand exactly where your coming from too Peter, but what i genuinely find strange here is how can the out of center tail cap happen with a product machine made, i would have thought they would all be basically identical and therefor in design made completely symmetrical in ie. AutoCAD then manufactured etc. as most other SC600's appear to be in the photographs ive seen (I assume these are not made 1 at a time by a bloke on a lathe etc... Its hard to show in the photos and i certainly didnt see it first, it became clear to me while holding the light that it wasnt even.

And as i said above, its the sum total of the 'little' things that bother me. Like little 'chips' in the chamfering of the edges, specially around the on/off button as i feel it every time i turn the light on or off.


----------



## twl

hatman said:


> Fascinating.
> 
> Is there any downside to using the 2600 on high?



Not really. 
During the last half of the run time, the 2600 holds on to its voltage better than the 3400. 
However, much depends on your use of the light, and what voltages you decide to recharge at.
If you are an early recharger, and don't wait for the light to get down under 3.5 volts, then you get basically as good from the 2600 as you would from the 3400.
If you recharge a little later, and use 3.4 or even 3.3 volts as your lower limit, then the 2600 is better.

However, if you are the type of user who waits for the protection circuit to cut-off the light, then the 3400 will still last longer because it has higher capacity than the 2600. So, it can run longer at the lower levels at the tail end of the run time because of that.
That's where the benefit of the 3400 is. At the tail end.

The thing is, that if you don't use the tail end of your run times, and like to recharge at mid-voltages to keep your battery more than half-full, then you get just as good or better results off the 2600, and it costs a lot less to buy the 2600. And early recharging helps give longer battery longevity with more cycles.

The 3400 is still a great battery, and I'm not downing it. I'm just saying that there are some circumstances that you can get as good or better results from the 2600, and pay less money for them.

I personally never wait for the battery to get run way down to the bitter end before recharging. I always like to have my batteries as full as possible when I go out with the light.


----------



## JKolmo

Good stuff twl, thanks for sharing! 

Just so that I understand completely, does a high MAh cell take longer to reach lets say 3.6V from fully charged than a 2600 given the same type use? If not, and if always recharging at approx 3.6V, I don't see the point in shelling out for high MAh cells.


----------



## sspc

twl said:


> ...
> The thing is, that if you don't use the tail end of your run times, and like to recharge at mid-voltages to keep your battery more than half-full, then you get just as good or better results off the 2600, and it costs a lot less to buy the 2600. And early recharging helps give longer battery longevity with more cycles.


Thanks for sharing the benefits of the 2600 mah batts (this is helpful). But would early charging "give longer battery longevity with more cycles"? Since early charging would increase the frequency of charging cycles (compared to later charging), isn't it possible that consistently early charging a batt will degrade a battery as fast as late charging (over time) because you're charging the battery more often?

So on one end you gain more cycles but at the same time since more cycles are happening more frequently, do you reach the batteries cycle max sooner?


----------



## twl

JKolmo said:


> Good stuff twl, thanks for sharing!
> 
> Just so that I understand completely, does a high MAh cell take longer to reach lets say 3.6V from fully charged than a 2600 given the same type use? If not, and if always recharging at approx 3.6V, I don't see the point in shelling out for high MAh cells.



It depends on the brand of batteries involved, but the best 3400 will reach 3.6v at the same time as the AW2600 at a 2 amp load.
At a 3 amp load, they reach 3.5v at the same time. Both batteries are fairly comparable down to that level.
But, with either 2 amp or 3 amp load, the 2600 holds on to its voltage from 3.5v down to 3.3v at higher levels for a longer time before dropping off pretty hard at about 3.3v-3.25v.


So basically, if you recharge before it gets down to 3.5v, the AW 2600 is as good as the 3400 under heavier loads.
If you wait until 3.3v-3.25v to recharge, the 2600 is better than the 3400, because the 2600 maintains voltage better than the 3400 in that range, just before dropping off fairly hard at the end of its capacity.
If you run the battery lower than 3.25v, the 2600 quickly runs out of capacity, and the 3400 will continue trailing off down to the cutoff voltage. So, for some purposes, the 3400 would be better for that. The 3400 "hangs on" longer at the lower voltage range at the end of the run time. That's where it gives its real benefit, and it might not run the turbo or high levels down there. But it would still run on the lower settings.
That's the synopsis.


----------



## JKolmo

Thanks for that synopsis twl, very well put! 

AW 2600 MAhs it is for me...


----------



## twl

sspc said:


> Thanks for sharing the benefits of the 2600 mah batts (this is helpful). But would early charging "give longer battery longevity with more cycles"? Since early charging would increase the frequency of charging cycles (compared to later charging), isn't it possible that consistently early charging a batt will degrade a battery as fast as late charging (over time) because you're charging the battery more often?
> 
> So on one end you gain more cycles but at the same time since more cycles are happening more frequently, do you reach the batteries cycle max sooner?



Yes, it would depend on the battery.
But generally speaking, shallow cycling will make the battery last longer because it extends the number of cycles in its life.
The number of cycles in a battery's life is not fixed. It varies with depth of discharge, and shallow cycling extends the number of cycles in its life. Deep discharging reduces the number of cycles in its life.
And high charging voltages also reduces battery life. If you charge to 4.1v or 4.15v, instead of 4.2v, you'll get more cycles out of the battery too.
And you have to weigh that against how it might impact your usage of the light.

Most of this stuff is variable, and YMMV, and your usage/needs will dictate what's best for you. That's why they give these discharge curves in various current loads, so you can match the battery to the way you use your light or device.


----------



## sspc

Thanks TWL for the details!! This is a big help to me.

Regarding the new ZL. I'm really intrigued by the smaller size. The single 18650 flashlights are my favorite form factor and the smaller the better. My only reservation is the diameter on the SC600 as I love to pocket carry my lights but this one may be too good to pass up


----------



## twl

sspc said:


> Thanks TWL for the details!! This is a big help to me.
> 
> Regarding the new ZL. I'm really intrigued by the smaller size. The single 18650 flashlights are my favorite form factor and the smaller the better. My only reservation is the diameter on the SC600 as I love to pocket carry my lights but this one may be too good to pass up



I have found that if you have relatively loose fit pants, like slacks or cargo pants, it feels fine in your pocket. In tight jeans, it feels like a lump in your pocket.
So, it comes down to your attire.

I don't have a Zebralight SC600, but I have a light that is just as small, about 102mm long and 31.5mm head. So, it's virtually the same size as a SC600, and I find it just fine to carry in a pocket.

It's a triple XPG2 with 1600 lumens on high at turn on. A real pocket rocket.





That black thing above the business card is a 18650 battery carrying capsule. It's about 3.5" long.


----------



## TEEJ




----------



## carl

Alpinebully said:


> Using a set of verniers i measure 1mm or 0.039" difference between the two sides the cap is off. It can be felt easily when in the hand if you rub your thumb up and down on the knurling on the side of the battery cap, and do it all around basically one side it is flush with the lanyard band and one side the lanyard band sticks out - this is not the side where the lanyard ring is located its about 90degrees from the ring, basically if the side with the logo and switch is the front, the lanyard hole is the back then im talking about the other two quadrents - left and right. I dont know whats off center, maybe its the lanyard 'band' or everything from the underside of it and up.
> 
> There are also some deep machining marks covering approx 1/4 of the dia. of the body in the section under the lanyard 'band' seen in the 2nd photo. So perhaps the light wasnt in the tool straight in the first place i dont know.
> 
> Other marks in the anodizing can be seen in the battery cap, it feels smooth where the marks are. I havent bothered taking photos of everything i originally mentioned but can do if anyone really wants to see my every complaint.
> 
> Example of anodizing marks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Gouging in the area under the lanyard 'banding'
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Battery cap is about flush on the right side, but off on the left.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Compare the left to the right side, the shelf between the oring and the edge, its 1mm difference from the left side to the right.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .



Good eye! Apart from the scatches on the tailcap, I never would have caught the other irregularities. 

'Ignorance is bliss...'


----------



## eloreno

My recently received sc600w looks the same I regards to the bulging ring under the tailcap.


----------



## Alpinebully

eloreno said:


> My recently received sc600w looks the same I regards to the bulging ring under the tailcap.



Thanks for the comment eloreno, kinda glad to know im not alone.

So, does you example also have the deep machine mark / gouging under the protruding lanyard ring 'band'? 






And also, while im at it i might as well show you the 'glue'... 

See in the last photo in the original set of images with the battery inserted how at the 'bottom' quadrant, the battery isnt sitting even? Well i dare say this is why;






This blob, has run about 5-10mm along the battery tube and its interferance can be seen on the battery plastic wrap as it creases the wrapping of the battery.


----------



## tobrien

Thanks for the battery explanations twl!


----------



## Southpaw1925

Man...my sc600 is only a month old! Now the latest version is shorter, brighter, and longer run time?? Tempting!


----------



## Fireclaw18

twl said:


> I have found that if you have relatively loose fit pants, like slacks or cargo pants, it feels fine in your pocket. In tight jeans, it feels like a lump in your pocket.
> So, it comes down to your attire.
> 
> I don't have a Zebralight SC600, but I have a light that is just as small, about 102mm long and 31.5mm head. So, it's virtually the same size as a SC600, and I find it just fine to carry in a pocket.
> 
> It's a triple XPG2 with 1600 lumens on high at turn on. A real pocket rocket.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That black thing above the business card is a 18650 battery carrying capsule. It's about 3.5" long.



That's awesome. I wish I had one! But it's not quite in the same class as the SC600. For one thing, it costs 3x as much, and lacks Zebralight's nice interface.


----------



## twl

Fireclaw18 said:


> That's awesome. I wish I had one! But it's not quite in the same class as the SC600. For one thing, it costs 3x as much, and lacks Zebralight's nice interface.



Thanks.
And that's exactly why I prefer it, but the pocket triple doesn't have my favorite UI either. But it's acceptable. I would rather it have a UI that is similar to the one on my Malkoff Wildcats.
I didn't intend to derail the thread with the photo.
I just used the photo in response to a question about carrying a light of the size of the SC600, and it gave me a good excuse to post a pic of my new light too, which just happens to be about the same size as the SC600.


----------



## THE_dAY

Still learning about the 18650, little did I know some great info would be hiding in a Zebralight thread... thanks twl!


----------



## jhc37013

Alpinebully said:


> This blob, has run about 5-10mm along the battery tube and its interferance can be seen on the battery plastic wrap as it creases the wrapping of the battery.




I've had that glue in all 4 SC600's I've bought but I was able to clean it all of all of them.


----------



## Pvt. Pile

I wasn't overly impressed with my sc600 when it first arrived. Mainly the throw and beam pattern did my head in! I put an o-ring behind the reflector to move it forward about a millimeter. Since then it throws twice as far as it did, and while the beam isn't free of artifacts, its improved dramatically. Zebralight are like Forest Gump nowadays.....you never know what ya gonna get! I can say NOW the sc600 is my favourite light, and has been for some time, and I WILL get the sc600 mkII.....But even one quality control glitch, and I'm done with them. So come on zebralight, spend some of your profits on a decent quality control manager, preferably one with chronic obsessive compulsive disorder so at least I know it'll be perfect. I'm sure a few CPF members would love the job lol!


----------



## BWX

I had FIVE H501 lights go bad and thought I'd never buy another ZL. The first lasted almost a year- then quit, on the first replacement, the switch quit after a few months, just intermittent and eventually stopped turning light on. The 2nd replacement- same thing, the third replacement the same freaking thing, the fourth replacement was defective and never worked right (flickering etc), the the final one lasted for a few months and then the switch quit working same as all the others - and red goo started seeping out of the head into the battery tube, then it quit working. They offered to replace it again, but sending them back to China eventually cost more than just buying another light so I just cut my losses. 5th replacement is sitting on a shelf, dead. Expensive little light with all the shipping back to China, and the cost of the light, just to have a pretty paper weight.

I think what happened is that I actually used the lights, almost every day, and ran them as work lights while fixing my mountain bike etc.. I actually used them, I didn't carry them around "just in-case". I never abused them though. So I thought I was never going to get another ZL, but I think there was a design defect in that H501, and that they sent my used defective lights as replacements. Hopefully I'll get a good MkII if I talk myself into actually buying a ZebraLight again.


----------



## maxrep12

BWX said:


> I had FIVE H501 lights go bad and thought I'd never buy another ZL. The first lasted almost a year- then quit, on the first replacement, the switch quit after a few months, just intermittent and eventually stopped turning light on. The 2nd replacement- same thing, the third replacement the same freaking thing, the fourth replacement was defective and never worked right (flickering etc), the the final one lasted for a few months and then the switch quit working same as all the others - and red goo started seeping out of the head into the battery tube, then it quit working. They offered to replace it again, but sending them back to China eventually cost more than just buying another light so I just cut my losses. 5th replacement is sitting on a shelf, dead. Expensive little light with all the shipping back to China, and the cost of the light, just to have a pretty paper weight.
> 
> I think what happened is that I actually used the lights, almost every day, and ran them as work lights while fixing my mountain bike etc.. I actually used them, I didn't carry them around "just in-case". I never abused them though. So I thought I was never going to get another ZL, but I think there was a design defect in that H501, and that they sent my used defective lights as replacements. Hopefully I'll get a good MkII if I talk myself into actually buying a ZebraLight again.



Sorry to hear the troubles with your h501. Like yourself, I too use my lights, as night lights, walk the dog an hour every night, fixing things under sinks, garages, etc, etc. I carry them as well. My sc600 has been perfect as well as my sc52.

I'm guessing ZL's actually see more daily usage from their owners simply because their efficient design lend them to tackle many long utilitarian jobs, while providing the needed flood illumination.


----------



## Pvt. Pile

About the only reason I'm gonna give ZL another shot, is the fact that I had a sc51 which lasted 14months. Not the longest life, but as an electrician who spends hours a day either under houses or in roof spaces, and considering the abuse it got....it did really well. So it died and I got the sc600 as a replacement due to longer battery life. And as I posted above, it wasn't up to scratch at all. I really hope they get it right this time! On a side note....is anyone aware of any custom reflectors Or maybe a tir lens for the sc600?


----------



## Badbeams3

I think one thing we will see in this new model is the electronics isolated from the batt chamber. A good thing. But...I hope they keep the spring in the head. I can see where there might be a temptation to do away with it to make the light shorter. But if they do that...down goes the dependability/durability...drops will be more likely to cause damage...


----------



## Fireclaw18

Badbeams3 said:


> I think one thing we will see in this new model is the electronics isolated from the batt chamber. A good thing. But...I hope they keep the spring in the head. I can see where there might be a temptation to do away with it to make the light shorter. But if they do that...down goes the dependability/durability...drops will be more likely to cause damage...



I just took a look down the battery tube of my very early model SC600. It doesn't have a spring in the head. Just a raised metal disk on the back of the circuit board.


----------



## magnum70383

Wow. I mostly just buy fenix lights. Now... I think I'll be switching to Zebralight. SC600 MKII and SC6330. wow... I was looking at the tk75. But that uses 4 batteries instead of 3 for the SC6330!


----------



## jbrett14

Fireclaw18 said:


> I'm not a fan of pocket clips on my lights. It's one of the things I dislike about the SC51/52. The clip mount protrudes and has very sharp corners and edges. I carry my EDC loose in my pocket so have no use for the clip. Normally I perform a "clipectomy" on all my lights, but this really isn't an option with the SC52. I'd really hate it if the new SC600 MkII had an SC51 style clip.



Ditto! I want to remove the clip on my SC51, but the sharp corners are even worse than just keeping the clip on. I thought about filing the corners down, but then if I decide to sell it, the value goes down. Oh well. Still love the light.


----------



## Fireclaw18

jbrett14 said:


> Ditto! I want to remove the clip on my SC51, but the sharp corners are even worse than just keeping the clip on. I thought about filing the corners down, but then if I decide to sell it, the value goes down. Oh well. Still love the light.



Zebralight should round the edges and corners on the clip mount. The mount would still protrude with the clip removed, but with rounded edges at least it wouldn't dig into your hand or cut holes in your pocket.


----------



## Pretbek

I have discovered the convenience of angled lights: being able to change the beam direction when tail-standing (tail-hanging, tail-clinging-to-some-metal-surface). I wouldn't mind an H600 MkII. Zebralight? When you get a chance?


----------



## jbrett14

twl said:


> shallow cycling extends the number of cycles in its life. Deep discharging reduces the number of cycles in its life.



I didn't read every word of every other post, but this has me wondering if I understand the lingo correctly. 

Are you saying that it's better to charge a battery BEFORE it is depleted? And if so, is it better to charge batteries even if they have only been used for a short amount of time? E.g. should I charge my batteries each day in which I may have only used my light for 30 minutes (assuming it had a max. 2 hour run time), as opposed to charging after mulitiple days of use?


----------



## twl

jbrett14 said:


> I didn't read every word of every other post, but this has me wondering if I understand the lingo correctly.
> 
> Are you saying that it's better to charge a battery BEFORE it is depleted? And if so, is it better to charge batteries even if they have only been used for a short amount of time? E.g. should I charge my batteries each day in which I may have only used my light for 30 minutes (assuming it had a max. 2 hour run time), as opposed to charging after mulitiple days of use?



Yes, as long as you don't over-charge it.
The shallow cycles allow more cycles in the battery's lifetime.
You could charge it every day if you want to.
I usually only charge it on days after I have given the light some use. If I haven't used the light, then I don't recharge it until I have used it some.

For lights that have very low output and don't drag the battery down much, you might not find that it needs charging until a few days use.
For me personally, if I had a light with a 2 hour run time and it was down 30 minutes, I would charge it up full before I went out the next time. I like to have a full battery when I go out, and it's not hurting your battery any to do it. In fact, it IS better to do that than to run it down to cut-off.

You can read all about this stuff online at Battery University.


----------



## jbrett14

BWX said:


> I had FIVE H501 lights go bad and thought I'd never buy another ZL. The first lasted almost a year- then quit, on the first replacement, the switch quit after a few months, just intermittent and eventually stopped turning light on. The 2nd replacement- same thing, the third replacement the same freaking thing, the fourth replacement was defective and never worked right (flickering etc), the the final one lasted for a few months and then the switch quit working same as all the others - and red goo started seeping out of the head into the battery tube, then it quit working. They offered to replace it again, but sending them back to China eventually cost more than just buying another light so I just cut my losses. 5th replacement is sitting on a shelf, dead. Expensive little light with all the shipping back to China, and the cost of the light, just to have a pretty paper weight.
> 
> I think what happened is that I actually used the lights, almost every day, and ran them as work lights while fixing my mountain bike etc.. I actually used them, I didn't carry them around "just in-case". I never abused them though. So I thought I was never going to get another ZL, but I think there was a design defect in that H501, and that they sent my used defective lights as replacements. Hopefully I'll get a good MkII if I talk myself into actually buying a ZebraLight again.



Wow, I must say that you are more tolerant than I would be if I had FIVE of any companies lights go bad. One or two is one thing, but FIVE? For me it would be strike three and you're out, onto another brand. 

I only have two ZL's but I really only use one on a regular basis. So far so good.


----------



## jbrett14

Fireclaw18 said:


> Zebralight should round the edges and corners on the clip mount. The mount would still protrude with the clip removed, but with rounded edges at least it wouldn't dig into your hand or cut holes in your pocket.



Exactly! I am a bit puzzled why they didn't do this, in light of the fact that it's a removable clip (meaning, not everyone will keep it on). One would think that to satisfy both, clip users and non clip users, that they would have made it not so sharp, knowing that the clip may be removed permanently by some users.


----------



## jbrett14

twl said:


> Yes, as long as you don't over-charge it.



Forgive my ignorance, but from my understanding, don't the chargers stop charging when the batteries are fully charged, thereby preventing any "over-charge"? 

On my currrent chargers, for example, one says "done" and goes into some kind of sleep mode (trickle charge?). The other just goes from a red light to a green light. Is it critical then that I remove the batteries right away after the light turns green? I assumed they go into a different mode and stop the full charging process.


----------



## StarHalo

Wisdom handed down from before the time flashlights used li-ions: Do not charge over 4.15 volts, do not drain below 3.6 volts.


----------



## twl

jbrett14 said:


> Forgive my ignorance, but from my understanding, don't the chargers stop charging when the batteries are fully charged, thereby preventing any "over-charge"?
> 
> On my currrent chargers, for example, one says "done" and goes into some kind of sleep mode (trickle charge?). The other just goes from a red light to a green light. Is it critical then that I remove the batteries right away after the light turns green? I assumed they go into a different mode and stop the full charging process.



Some do.
Some allow it to go over 4.2v, which is bad.

In fact, as StarHalo points out, you can also improve your battery cycle life by not charging it as high, too.
I use 4.1v as my stopping point.
The battery is 100% full at 4.2v, so if you stop the charge early, you lose some.
There are pros and cons to doing things of this nature, and the protocol should be something you can live with, and makes sense to you.

Technically speaking, any charging over 3.92v adds charging stress to the cell. Unfortunatly, 3.92v is nearing the 40% discharged level, so most people are going to add some charging stress in favor of capacity. Where you decide to operate your battery is up to you.
Just don't go over 4.2v, even if your charger and protection circuit allow it to happen.

Recharging at 3.6v is a common practice, as StarHalo notes, because 3.6v is a mostly discharged cell, down around 30% or 25%, I can't remember which.
3.8v is 50% discharged. There is really very little left under 3.6v, and if you have a heavy current drawing light like 2 amps, it might not operate on high or turbo in some cases way down in discharge like that. Depends on the light.

So what we were getting at in the eariler conversation is that if you are going to pull your batteries at 3.6 or especially down to around 3.4v to recharge, then the 2600 gives you a little bump of capacity benefit at around that level, and you get a little more run time because of that before you hit the 3.4v state. All the very high capacity batteries like the 3400 or the 3100 or 2900 add much of their extra capacity at the low voltage levels below 3.4v, so you don't really get their benefits if you are pulling the battery at 3.5v or 3.4v. Now, the 3400 has some pretty good juice, and it is making a good run at the 2600 in the higher voltage states, and it's not bad at all up there. 
So, I'm not saying that the 3400 is bad. It's very good. But it costs more and with a high-current light, you might find that you get as good or better results by using the AW 2600 at a lower cost because of the characteristics its chemistry gives it.


----------



## Badbeams3

I think most the charger sold now days just shut off. Overcharging could cause an unwanted POP...and lawsuit. If a charger is over charging, I would think it defective and toss it in da trash.


----------



## twl

Yes, for the good quality chargers, I'd agree.

However, the point being made about that is that even charging to 4.2v is still doing some partial damage to the cycle life of the battery from charging stress.
4.2v might be "safe" and "100%", but it is not a low charge stress voltage.

The 4.15v charge and 3.6v discharge protocol that StarHalo mentioned has been around for a long time, among li-ion users who are looking for better battery cycle life.


----------



## Badbeams3

twl said:


> Yes, for the good quality chargers, I'd agree.
> 
> However, the point being made about that is that even charging to 4.2v is still doing some partial damage to the cycle life of the battery from charging stress.
> 4.2v might be "safe" and "100%", but it is not a low charge stress voltage.
> 
> The 4.15v charge and 3.6v discharge protocol that StarHalo mentioned has been around for a long time, among li-ion users who are looking for better battery cycle life.



Most chargers do not allow you to set the stop point. Not sure what the price difference would be to get one that does.


----------



## twl

Badbeams3 said:


> Most chargers do not allow you to set the stop point. Not sure what the price difference would be to get one that does.



I'm sure that you're correct about that.

However, that doesn't change the effect that it's having on the battery. It may take some effort on the part of the user, along with a voltmeter, to employ these charging and discharging techniques.

Most people will not, and just let the charger do its thing. And that's fine, and they can expect the typical result it has on their batteries. 
But, they can still employ the shallow discharge voltage tactics regarding recharging, to reduce the effects of deep discharging on cycle life if they want to. And that will definitely have a good effect if they do that.

Or, they can just run them down until they click off every time. And take the normal 300-500 cycle life that comes with it.
It's all up to the user to do what he sees fit with his lights and batteries.
These things I present are simply options for people who might want to use them.


----------



## jbrett14

twl, I am not certain that I fully understand HOW you would stop the charging process at that voltage. Are you suggesting that one should stand by their charger and take measurements at certain intervals, and then pull them out when the preferred voltage is reached?


----------



## twl

jbrett14 said:


> twl, I am not certain that I fully understand HOW you would stop the charging process at that voltage. Are you suggesting that one should stand by their charger and take measurements at certain intervals, and then pull them out when the preferred voltage is reached?



If necessary, yes that's one way to do it.

Or if that's not convenient, you can let it finish up at 4.2v. I'm not saying it's easy or fun. I'm just saying it's a way to extend your battery's cycle life.


----------



## jbrett14

Got it. Thanks twl. Much appreciated.


----------



## Badbeams3

900 lumen. I think that puts it at the top of the single 18650 lights...save maybe for some over driven budget lights. Like many here I have only had my SC600 about a month...maybe one hours actual use...other than a few overnight runs on moonlight mode. Dam it. I really must have the brightest, latest toy out...gifting it would also mean giving them my charger and the new Eagletac 3100mh batt I got with it. Guess I would then buy a Nitecore i4 charger $25...car adapter $5...newer Eagletac 3400mh batt $19. So about $50 plus whatever the light cost...guessing another $100....so $150. Ah...expensive to stay on top of this hobby...and of course I must have a SC52...and what do you want to bet a 600 lumen U3 version of that is right around the corner too. Lol


----------



## AVService

Well if its any consolation I ordered a 600 Today after talking at some length to the Zebralight Sales Manager about the new model and a lot of other Zebra stuff.
I will certainly get the new Super600 when it shows up but I think I want to have one of the current ones too. There are a lot of Retina Frying opportunities I don't want to miss between now and then so I just jumped into the water!

The really exciting one seems to be the 6330 too!

Ed



Badbeams3 said:


> 900 lumen. I think that puts it at the top of the single 18650 lights...save maybe for some over driven budget lights. Like many here I have only had my SC600 about a month...maybe one hours actual use...other than a few overnight runs on moonlight mode. Dam it. I really must have the brightest, latest toy out...gifting it would also mean giving them my charger and the new Eagletac 3100mh batt I got with it. Guess I would then buy a Nitecore i4 charger $25...car adapter $5...newer Eagletac 3400mh batt $19. So about $50 plus whatever the light cost...guessing another $100....so $150. Ah...expensive to stay on top of this hobby...and of course I must have a SC52...and what do you want to bet a 600 lumen U3 version of that is right around the corner too. Lol


----------



## tonkem

Badbeams3 said:


> 900 lumen. I think that puts it at the top of the single 18650 lights...save maybe for some over driven budget lights. Like many here I have only had my SC600 about a month...maybe one hours actual use...other than a few overnight runs on moonlight mode. Dam it. I really must have the brightest, latest toy out...gifting it would also mean giving them my charger and the new Eagletac 3100mh batt I got with it. Guess I would then buy a Nitecore i4 charger $25...car adapter $5...newer Eagletac 3400mh batt $19. So about $50 plus whatever the light cost...guessing another $100....so $150. Ah...expensive to stay on top of this hobby...and of course I must have a SC52...and what do you want to bet a 600 lumen U3 version of that is right around the corner too. Lol



And don't forget the s6330 at 2400 lumens and a year runtime on low!


----------



## Badbeams3

tonkem said:


> And don't forget the s6330 at 2400 lumens and a year runtime on low!



Well of course...I must have one serious light as well. Just cause.


----------



## hatman

The EagleTac TX25C2, supposedly due the end of December and manufacturer-rated at up to 1030 lumens, is intended as competition for the SC600s.

http://eagletac.com/html/tx25c2/specs.html


----------



## StarHalo

hatman said:


> The EagleTac TX25C2



EagleTac once again comes through with a little more output than the competition, and modes that were apparently chosen by drawing numbers out of a hat.. :shakehead


----------



## Badbeams3

StarHalo said:


> EagleTac once again comes through with a little more output than the competition, and modes that were apparently chosen by drawing numbers out of a hat.. :shakehead



Not more lumen: ANSI FL-1 lumen: 8525​-658/388/7...about 50 less. But not sure why no choice around the 100 lumen level...I find that the most generally desirable level.


----------



## Patriot

Badbeams3 said:


> Not more lumen: ANSI FL-1 lumen: 8525​-658/388/7...about 50 less.



To me, it's silly for them to post such numbers when the 852L ANSI number is the only one we care about. As if 852L isn't keeping up with the pack.


----------



## hb-light

I kind of got excited when i read this thread... but now i'm thinking it's only 150lumen difference from the original... 

The way i see it 750L to 900L is the same as 500L to 750L... the former is not THAT much of a difference... so I figure the 750L to 900L isn't going to be that much of a difference either... I think i'm just going to stick with the vanilla version

if i didn't have the original sc600... i'd be getting a sc600 mkII

In fact I don't feel any of the upgraded specifications make it worth getting since I have the vanilla. 

So the circuitry is isolated from the tubing?? Does this mean it's going to be more water proof?


----------



## TEEJ

I now have mixed emotions about it....I use my SC600 every day...and, tonight, it just died on me for no apparent reason.

I checked the cell, and the cell was fine, plus I swapped in other cells as a control...still nothing.

It was on...and then it just went off...and will not come back. 

So, I found it to be very useful, and would have looked at the upgrade, except now I am looking askance at ZebraLight as a brand.


It might be she caught me looking at these pics last night:







And dumped me before I could dump her.


----------



## Patriot

TEEJ said:


> I now have mixed emotions about it....I use my SC600 every day...and, tonight, it just died on me for no apparent reason.
> 
> I checked the cell, and the cell was fine, plus I swapped in other cells as a control...still nothing.
> 
> It was on...and then it just went off...and will not come back.




Man, I would love to know what happened to your light. That kinda stuff drives me nuts! Hopefully they'll fix it for you.


----------



## juplin

I will get one if there is memory for the last used mode.


----------



## LEDburn

The first time I dropped my sc600w onto the road from 1.5m (5ft) I really cringed and was so scared to turn it on as I didn't want to be disappointed. 
It has happened 3 times since, always on bitumen or concrete, and the only thing I worry about is the glass now. It's definitely showing it's been used and somewhat abused.

In any case, I definitely haven't had any flimsy Zebras. 
My sc80 has copped its fair share of abuse too - it got dropped from my hand when up on a ladder (so at least 2m) and then fell down two flights of concrete stairs, opening up and even having the battery come out in the process!! Wipe it down, reassemble and back to work


----------



## BWX

jbrett14 said:


> Wow, I must say that you are more tolerant than I would be if I had FIVE of any companies lights go bad. One or two is one thing, but FIVE? For me it would be strike three and you're out, onto another brand.
> 
> I only have two ZL's but I really only use one on a regular basis. So far so good.



Well that is what I did. I have bought a lot of other lights since then, none have been Zebra lights. I got an EagleTac D25LC2 instead of the SC600 for example. I'm hoping they fixed the problems that caused the switches or electronics on my H501 to continuously fail. I really liked that light- when it worked! The ZL was my first high quality light, every single light in my sig has been after that one.



hatman said:


> The EagleTac TX25C2, supposedly due the end of December and manufacturer-rated at up to 1030 lumens, is intended as competition for the SC600s.
> 
> http://eagletac.com/html/tx25c2/specs.html



"Twist the head to select between three output levels."
No thanks I do not want a ridiculous "twisty"... I don't know what they are thinking. I'd buy it (maybe) if they put the output level selection on the button like they could with that light.. or give the option at least.


----------



## Pvt. Pile

I hate waiting! Cmon zebralight, we know you're looking at our posts....give us a teaser!


----------



## jbrett14

“Patience is bitter, but its fruit is sweet” Jean-Jacques Rousseau


----------



## sspc

sspc said:


> Thanks TWL for the details!! This is a big help to me.
> 
> Regarding the new ZL. I'm really intrigued by the smaller size. The single 18650 flashlights are my favorite form factor and the smaller the better. My only reservation is the diameter on the SC600 as I love to pocket carry my lights but this one may be too good to pass up





twl said:


> I have found that if you have relatively loose fit pants, like slacks or cargo pants, it feels fine in your pocket. In tight jeans, it feels like a lump in your pocket.
> So, it comes down to your attire.



I found this pic by selfbuilt with the Nitecore EC2 (which I currently pocket carry with ease) next to a SC600, and I'm pleasantly susprised to see that the SC600 bezel diameter is not too much larger than the EC2...good news for me.


----------



## CouldUseALight

I'm really torn on my sc600. :thinking:

On one hand it has the best UI I've encountered in a flashlight so far. 

On the other hand it's finished like Russian milsurp. A $90 light should have more polish, but maybe I'm spoiled.


----------



## maxrep12

CouldUseALight said:


> I'm really torn on my sc600. :thinking:
> 
> On one hand it has the best UI I've encountered in a flashlight so far.
> 
> On the other hand it's finished like Russian milsurp. A $90 light should have more polish, but maybe I'm spoiled.


I have actualy found ZL lights to have much finer grade machining than most brands. Perhaps your unitcame off the line right before a fresh cutting tool change. I am kind of a stickler in this regard. My impression is that many brands hide rougher tool finishing by beadblasting, Sunwayman does a good fonishing job as well, same with Armytek as far as I can tell
.


----------



## Southpaw1925

My fit and finish were superb as well.


----------



## eloreno

I have over a dozen zebralights, and I've only had finish problems on two of them and that's counting my recently acquired sc52 with the slightly off center XML. In my experience zebralight has great quality control. To be sure, simply make a note that you're very picky and have them look over the light before they send it to you. Be sure to mention finish imperfections and centering of the led.


----------



## CouldUseALight

eloreno said:


> To be sure, simply make a note that you're very picky and have them look over the light before they send it to you. Be sure to mention finish imperfections and centering of the led.



Good advice for sure. My LED appears centered and I'd be upset if it wasn't in a light of this cost.

I'm not too far outside Irving, and had a chance to see 5-6 of their lights on display in a local cheaperthandirt gun shop. The ones I saw were inconsistent in the anodizing, but the lights were mounted, and it could have been wear and tear changing mounts.


----------



## Alpinebully

I left a note whilst making payment for my SC600w, just saying how i was really looking forward to what would be my first Zebralight and that that i was on CPF; thinking this would be more then enough of a heads up that im a little fussy and again, also very excited to be getting my first Zebralight...

Didnt work out to well for me tho  Haha, and the LED in my SC600w isnt centered either... but im not sure what the cause of the artifacts are around the hotspot, i thought they may be coming from the reflector, or looking very closely at the LED - the rubber clear dome over mine has 'spots' in it which none of my other XM-L U2's have had.

The off center tail cap will always remain my No.1 pet peeve, i wouldnt expect such bad work on a $20 light let alone a $100 light!


----------



## eh4

Pvt. Pile said:


> ...But even one quality control glitch, and I'm done with them. So come on zebralight, spend some of your profits on a decent quality control manager, preferably one with chronic obsessive compulsive disorder so at least I know it'll be perfect. I'm sure a few CPF members would love the job lol!



I'm feeling more and more confident for the future employment potential of the coming Autism Spectrum Disorder generation, re. the new DSM. definitions.


----------



## BWX

^^ LOL


----------



## hb-light

Apparently Zebralight says, water could actually be poured into the battery﻿ tube, and it would not reach the electronics. You could dump the water out, put a battery in and off you go. 

But i wonder about the 2.5meters of pressure with the battery tubing exposed.... is it the same as with the cap on?


----------



## dts71

U3 sounds interesting but what about the tint? New bins might need some time, 4Sevens S2 mini was terrible for example.


----------



## shelm

> _1. 900Lm max ANSI (SC600's 750Lm rating is based on T6 LEDs. Most SC600s shipped actually come with U2 LEDs) with more efficient driver/LED._



Does this mean that SC600MkII comes with XM-L1 (U2 or whatever, U3)?
XM-L2 has been announced by CREE, 20% increased output.
If SC600MkII doesnt come with XM-L2, then i wont grab it then.
So hopefully Zebralight installs the new XM-L2 in the MkII flashlight!!


----------



## Fireclaw18

shelm said:


> Does this mean that SC600MkII comes with XM-L1 (U2 or whatever, U3)?
> XM-L2 has been announced by CREE, 20% increased output.
> If SC600MkII doesnt come with XM-L2, then i wont grab it then.
> So hopefully Zebralight installs the new XM-L2 in the MkII flashlight!!



XML2 was just announced. It might not be available for purchase for a few months.


----------



## TEEJ

eh4 said:


> I'm feeling more and more confident for the future employment potential of the coming Autism Spectrum Disorder generation, re. the new DSM. definitions.



Ironically, IIRC, they dropped Aspergers, and now its just part of the spectrum in the DSM. Aspies are in mourning over the identity loss.

I have a feeling that a large number of aspies are in the forum, and, yup, they'd be perfect QA/QC monitors.


----------



## Patriot

maxrep12 said:


> I have actualy found ZL lights to have much finer grade machining than most brands. Perhaps your unitcame off the line right before a fresh cutting tool change. I am kind of a stickler in this regard. My impression is that many brands hide rougher tool finishing by beadblasting, Sunwayman does a good fonishing job as well, same with Armytek as far as I can tell
> .




Same here. I've been very fortunate with receiving perfect lights. They all look like they were CNC'd and then finished for museum display purposes.


----------



## levelflight

It will be interesting to see how the UI functions in daily use. Less weight will be a bonus, although I'm so used to mine it's hardly noticed. Hopefully it will have a hard mount clip like the SC60, although I had to dremel tool mine with a cratex tip to remove the very sharp edges, so now it's as smooth as silk. Without a hard mount clip I'm likely not to purchase the 6330.

A competitor, at least for my money, will be the EagleTac TX25C2 XM-L U2. Once again a very interesting cycle of new lights is on the way.


----------



## BWX

levelflight said:


> It will be interesting to see how the UI functions in daily use. Less weight will be a bonus, although I'm so used to mine it's hardly noticed. Hopefully it will have a hard mount clip like the SC60, although I had to dremel tool mine with a cratex tip to remove the very sharp edges, so now it's as smooth as silk. Without a hard mount clip I'm likely not to purchase the 6330.
> 
> A competitor, at least for my money, will be the EagleTac TX25C2 XM-L U2. Once again a very interesting cycle of new lights is on the way.



"Twist the head to select between three output levels. "
So no, it is not a competitor to a superb "button press" UI, for this kid.


----------



## levelflight

Point taken. I presume you are a current SC600 user...
I'm personally grown a little tired of the UI delay between 'pushing' and 'getting.' I'm looking for an improvement that maintains the positive aspects of the ZL UI while enhancing its user friendliness and hopefully the MKII is it.

So much about these equally impressive lights—and I mean the many brands in current use, is and will forever remain the subjective opinion of the user. Truly, to this point in time there is no perfect flashlight even though many of us will vigorously defend our choice. For my part, all I can add is that the removing of this light from my pocket, turning it on, making brightness adjustments as required, turning it off, and then returning it to my pocket at least twenty-five times a day (sometimes more), has me convinced what the successful upgrade path for this light would be for me.

The bottom line is we are all winners as manufacturers begin to focus more closely on the refinements of operation, while at the same time providing significant improvement to light output and field usefulness. When I recall my youthful days of running through a pair of D-cells in a single evening reading comic books beneath the sheets, I really have little to complain about. The upside is that the creators of these lights really do listen to what we have to say. How great is that?!!!
I love this hobby even though it sometimes hurts both my wallet and my shelf.


----------



## BWX

No I'm not a current SC600 user... I just hate small twisty lights. God invented buttons for a reason.


----------



## levelflight

There you go...sounds like you are a twisty light user. Are we just electing to trade positions here??

Having never used a variable output light my inclination is to explore that possibility. I asked selfbuilt if he would consider recompiling his numerous reviews to isolate lights of particular function in the same way he does by battery type, to better serve this purpose.
I sometimes find the button location not as convenient to access depending upon my hand position on the light, while the body is always in contact with my hand and a twisty ring would prove quite useful.
So the search goes ever on.

I'm very glad I don't have to justify my expenditures in this hobby. Downgrading from RC helicopters has been a wallet friendly experience!


----------



## roadkill1109

any pics of the new light? Will this be the best EDC for 2012-2013?


----------



## roadkill1109

---duplicate post--- sorry


----------



## BWX

levelflight said:


> There you go...sounds like you are a twisty light user. Are we just electing to trade positions here??
> 
> Having never used a variable output light my inclination is to explore that possibility. I asked selfbuilt if he would consider recompiling his numerous reviews to isolate lights of particular function in the same way he does by battery type, to better serve this purpose.
> I sometimes find the button location not as convenient to access depending upon my hand position on the light, while the body is always in contact with my hand and a twisty ring would prove quite useful.
> So the search goes ever on.
> 
> I'm very glad I don't have to justify my expenditures in this hobby. Downgrading from RC helicopters has been a wallet friendly experience!



I just got into RC Helis! (but PC sim-racing and gaming in general can be way more expensive)


----------



## moozooh

Upon thinking about it, it's highly likely the light is using XM-L U3, but even then numbers don't exactly add up. With the old driver, the U3 would only have yielded around 850..860 ANSI lm. Just how efficient is this new driver if it sustains some 50 extra lumen for several minutes after power-on as required for ANSI testing? I guess we can expect a year's worth of runtime on the lowest setting...


----------



## levelflight

BWX said:


> I just got into RC Helis! (but PC sim-racing and gaming in general can be way more expensive)



The birds I fly start at about $7K and move up quickly from there. Never knew sim racing and gaming was such a heavy financial addiction...guess I couldn't afford them as well


----------



## Chadh4x

Damn, I just got a sc600 a week ago. I did not even take it outside yet.... :-( now there's the mkII wish I would have known...


----------



## carl

roadkill1109 said:


> any pics of the new light? Will this be the best EDC for 2012-2013?



I suspect it will look a lot like the current H600 but with the reflector swapping its location with the switch. Moving the reflector to the front of the light will make the whole light shorter than the H600. 

Just like the H600:
1) It will have cooling slots on the head
2) body ribs (also similar to the SC52)
3) 2 clip grooves on the body
4) stainless retainer ring for the glass lens (no more aluminum bezel ring)
5) enclosed electronics inside the battery tube (like the SC52)
6) same switch
7) No U3 LED for about a year


----------



## mgscheue

BWX said:


> I just got into RC Helis! (but PC sim-racing and gaming in general can be way more expensive)



That's for sure. I do iRacing, which I love, but have a relatively economical setup. Some people go nuts with three screens and $1000 pedals and such. And I have some RC helis, too.

This is a fairly inexpensive hobby. I guess I'll hold on to my original SC600, though the SC52 is tempting.


----------



## Beaver

Who has the best deals on ZL's?

Looking for possible waiting lists for the SC600 MKII (would be my first 18650). Problem is I have a $100 B-Day gift card burning a hole in my pocket and the SC52 is calling my name.

I don't have enough for both so don't even say it.:mecry:


----------



## Norm

Beaver said:


> Who has the best deals on ZL's?
> 
> Looking for possible waiting lists for the SC600 MKII (would be my first 18650). Problem is I have a $100 B-Day gift card burning a hole in my pocket and the SC52 is calling my name.
> 
> I don't have enough for both so don't even say it.:mecry:



*Discussions of/with dealers should be conducted in the Dealers Corner and the Manufacturers Corner of the MarketPlace. - Norm*


----------



## Pvt. Pile

That was a quick bollocking!


----------



## hb-light

I think a fairly powerful magnet would be a GREAT improvement on the tail end of the light... also... 

an improved clip... one that opens when pinching for one handed utility... clip it anywhere with one hand!!!


----------



## Patriot

Still no pictures of it yet, right?


----------



## GordoJones88

Patriot said:


> Still no pictures of it yet, right?


----------



## shelm

GordoJones88 said:


>



Is that your design or did you steal it from CarpentryHero? lovecpf


----------



## Patriot

It's a more complex design than I would have thought.


----------



## neutralwhite

got this reply from ZL in response to thread below...


*Ticket status: Completed

Department: Sales

Subject: SC600W QUESTION

The SC600 is an 18 month old design that has been 'studied' by other manufactures thoroughly, and have been out of stock (discontinued) for a while. I am not supprised that some other manufactures may finally bring out T6 lights that are close to what we achieved 18 months ago in terms of performance but in a much bigger body size, and without any meaningfull 'Low' output levels.
You may want to take a look at the new SC600 MkII (900Lm, 4inch).
*
Sincerely,

Lillian Xu
ZebraLight, Inc.
8320 Sterling Street
Irving, TX 75063


http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...-SC600w-help&p=4088720&highlight=#post4088720


----------



## GordoJones88

tnfdy said:


> Department: Sales
> Subject: SC600W QUESTION
> 
> You may want to take a look at the new SC600 MkII (900Lm, 4inch).
> 
> Sincerely,
> Lillian Xu
> ZebraLight, Inc.



Dear Zebralight,

HERE TAKE MY MONEY!

Sincerely,
Gordo


----------



## levelflight

Would like to take a look, how about some pics?


----------



## mizjif

Lol! I love that response from ZL. And they are correct. Of my entire collection, and lights I've bought and sold, the ZL SC600 is the only one thats stayed with me. Form factor, side switch, size, MODES, UI....nobody has come close to producing a light as perfect for me. And so I will probably buy the MKII in the w version.


----------



## biglights

Pvt. Pile said:


> That was a quick bollocking!



I fell of my chair reading this one


----------



## neutralwhite

is there a recommended UK seller to buy from , or somewhere else with free shipping to the UK?.
thanks.


----------



## GordoJones88

tnfdy said:


> Is there a recommended UK seller to buy from, or somewhere else with free shipping to the UK?



Yes.


----------



## neutralwhite

thanks, are FLASHAHOLICS in the UK good?. stuff from the US seems some $40/£20 cheaper with free shipping though.
http://www.flashaholics.co.uk/






GordoJones88 said:


> Yes.


----------



## CM2010

Great customer service from flashaholics, you can't go wrong.


----------



## neutralwhite

thanks CM2010 !. 



CM2010 said:


> Great customer service from flashaholics, you can't go wrong.


----------



## neutralwhite

Subject: SC600W QUESTION

We had some sporadic water leaking issues in some early models, and up to first few batches of H501. But those issues disappeared all of a sudden when the guy in charge of that part of the manufacturing in China went to work for another headlamp manufacture. Most other RMAs are caused by longer than specified protected batteries (we'll see less with the introduction of our own 'proper' sized 18650s and 14500s).
I don't read CPF much, but I think a fair discussions/polls should be 'for all major brands' in say 2012, and without user DIY services (replacing bezel/lens, switches, etc.)

Sincerely,

Lillian Xu
ZebraLight, Inc.
8320 Sterling Street
Irving, TX 75063


----------



## moozooh

Lillian has also told me SC600 mk2 will have XM-L U3.


----------



## shelm

moozooh said:


> Lillian has also told me SC600 mk2 will have XM-L U3.



that's worse than XM-L2 

many XM-L U2 are greenish from my experience. 2nd gen XP-G2 has great tint. I am expecting the XM-L2 to have great tint too!


----------



## twl

shelm said:


> that's worse than XM-L2
> 
> many XM-L U2 are greenish from my experience. 2nd gen XP-G2 has great tint. I am expecting the XM-L2 to have great tint too!



Once you get up into this kind of lumens territory, these incremental improvements of LED, such as XML to XML-2 do not really have all that much impact to the eye. Yes, there is some difference, but going from 900 lumens to 1000 lumens is not something that is easily seen by eye as a difference when comparing them in identical beams, with the 1/3 of a db being the only difference between them.
To get a 3db difference, which is generally accepted as the parameter for seeing a definitely identifiable change, you'd have to go from a 900 lumen light to an 1800 lumen light, comparing the lights with identical beams with only the 3db difference between them. 

When people compare lights of different types which have close output levels, it is most often the beam characteristics that they see as differences.


----------



## moozooh

shelm said:


> that's worse than XM-L2
> 
> many XM-L U2 are greenish from my experience. 2nd gen XP-G2 has great tint. I am expecting the XM-L2 to have great tint too!



I don't see how this is a meaningful comparison without naming the color bins. XP-G and XM-L are at all different emitters; whereas XP-G had avg. 75 CRI in cool white, while XM-L only does 65. XP-G2 has "great tint" because XP-G had it, not because it's new gen. Likewise, XM-L2 is expected to be the same as XM-L in that respect.

In SC600 mk2, XM-L2 U2 would make around 960 lumen vs. claimed 900 for XM-L U3. Not that much of a meaningful difference, and I bet it would take ZL months to wait and pick the better XM-L2 U2 tint bins in amounts required for production, while I take it they're already on it with the U3.

Personally, I'll just wait until there is enough XM-L2s on the market to cherry-pick the tint that would suit me the best, and mod my old SC600 with it (or maybe sell it and get the new light for the better electronics, and mod that).


----------



## LightWalker

I would rather have the extra runtime than an extra 100 lumens but I guess most people are after the highest lumen number.


----------



## BWX

FWIW All of my FIVE H501 lights that died were totally stock, unmolested, and un-abused- running eneloop aa batteries. I have a very expensive H501 paperweight now (including the cost of four times shipping it back with no compensation for the cost of doing so). Oh well... Hopefully I'll have better luck in the future with ZL.


----------



## jbrett14

BWX said:


> FWIW All of my FIVE H501 lights that died were totally stock, unmolested, and un-abused- running eneloop aa batteries. I have a very expensive H501 paperweight now (including the cost of four times shipping it back with no compensation for the cost of doing so). Oh well... Hopefully I'll have better luck in the future with ZL.



You know what they say - "fool me once ............

I still can't believe you kept buying them after the second or third failure. I would say that ZL owes you a few lights just for being so loyal. I feel for ya man. As you say, that is an expensive paperweight.


----------



## GordoJones88

jbrett14 said:


> You know what they say - "fool me once ............
> 
> I still can't believe you kept buying them after the second or third failure. I would say that ZL owes you a few lights just for being so loyal. I feel for ya man. As you say, that is an expensive paperweight.


 
He shipped the same light back 4 times and apparently it doesn't work again.
You should use the "lemon law" when a product is unable to be fixed after 3 times you get a new one.


----------



## jbrett14

GordoJones88 said:


> He shipped the same light back 4 times and apparently it doesn't work again.
> You should use the "lemon law" when a product is unable to be fixed after 3 times you get a new one.



I agree, he should get a new one, and perhaps another one for his hassles.


----------



## neutralwhite

come, move over to fenix ! all this ZL sadness will never make me buy a ZL.


----------



## crazyk4952

tnfdy said:


> come, move over to fenix ! all this ZL sadness will never make me buy a ZL.



Fenix flashlights are not without their problems, too. I know there were issues with the battery carrier on the TK40 and I've had issues with my E21.


----------



## neutralwhite

true, but on this forum there was even a POLL asking if your ZL had problems. something like that. damn!.
what does this all say about their CQ, CS. ?. not so good.
real shame, cos I pretty like ZL.




crazyk4952 said:


> Fenix flashlights are not without their problems, too. I know there were issues with the battery carrier on the TK40 and I've had issues with my E21.


----------



## presidentsdad

I was very intrigued by this light as well, but had never really heard too much about Zebralight. Is this a pretty good brand as far as reliability/longevity goes? It seems to have the features that I'm looking for (ultra low light, non-tactical interface, small and rechargeable).


----------



## hotlight

As far as ZLs QC:
out of the 4 or 5 ZLs I've had, none have failed.....my buddies H501 rubber boot was about worn thru after 6 months tho.

my SC51w and H51w just completed a southbound hike of the Appalachian Trail with me......2184 miles and neither missed a beat.....used 14500 li ions in both of them, and still didn't have any issues. Rain, snow, Sandy....no issues.

I must be lucky when it comes to the ZLs.....

To be honest, I had a HDS and Saint Minimus on standy...I didn't think the ZLs would make it the whole way. 


As far as their CS-- I've always got a response back to my questions within 48 hours, but, I've also read of people sending in defective lights and not getting updates/etc for long periods of time. Like I said, I must be lucky when it comes to the ZLs.


----------



## neutralwhite

seem lucky. fenix QC seems way better. nothing has failed on me, and seems many like fenix here in the UK as a best seller compared to ZL who aint on the list. ( taken from http://www.flashaholics.co.uk/ )


*New Arrivals**Best Sellers**Popular Brands*   *Nitecore EA4**Pila IBC Charger**Nitecore Torches**Fenix TK75**Lockblock Bike Mount**Fenix Light**Nitecore MH40**Fenix HP11**Maxpedition Gear**Olight S20 Baton**Fenix LD22**Solarforce**Eagletac GX25L2 R22**Nitecore TM11**Olights**Eagletac SX25L2 R33**Jetbeam BA20**Jetbeam**Fenix E50**Jumbo Versipack**Sunwayman**Olight M20S XP-G2**Thrunite**4Sevens**Olight S80**Olight SR90**Eagletac Lights

*


----------



## jbrett14

tnfdy said:


> come, move over to fenix ! all this ZL sadness will never make me buy a ZL.



I loved the quality of the Fenix light I had, but their switch location, or type (twisty), does not fit my preference. And thus far, I personally have had no issues with the 2 ZLs that I have, one of which is used regularly for work.

I am guessing that the reason there are more negative comments about any issues with ZL is because they appear to be the most popular lights out there. More lights equals more comments. 

Let's assume that two different manufacturers had the same defect ratio of 1:10. Company A sold 10 lights having only 1 negative comment. Company B sold 100 lights having 10 negative comments. It would appear that Company B had more problems, yet in reality they are proportionately the same. Of course, I have no clue how many of each brand are used by the active members in this forum. But from what I can tell of the number of posts in each thread, ZL dominates the forum. So, they must be doing something right, or there are a lot of delusional members in here.


----------



## neutralwhite

thanks, but if they are doing so well, why still the QC issues which are apparent but nothing done?. 
if really so many followers, and I see there really are on here, they dont seem to of noticed that, and still sell on to they think, delusional buyers without real explanation of their faults and a passion to correct.

if they showed they were doing something with better QC, I would buy, but it all seems so quiet on that.
many seem frustrated, & I am sure if company B sold 100, doesn't really mean they will have any negatives at all. 

something like that.

thanks lots.


----------



## jbrett14

I hear ya tnfdy. I know if I continued having problems with a light the price of the ZL, I would stop buying their lights. 

I have not read of too many problems with ZLs, and most folks who own them continue buying more.

Is there a poll with Fenix problems?

I'm not sure we could ever tell which brand is the most reliable in this forum because so many here just buy new lights every year. Heck, even a dollar store light can last a year.

My guess is that ANY light with an electronic switch will be more prone to failure than a mechanical or twisty switch. This is the one thing that has stopped me from dumping a bunch of money into some of these ZLs that I would really like to have.


----------



## Bwolcott

jbrett14 said:


> I hear ya tnfdy. I know if I continued having problems with a light the price of the ZL, I would stop buying their lights.
> 
> I have not read of too many problems with ZLs, and most folks who own them continue buying more.
> 
> Is there a poll with Fenix problems?
> 
> I'm not sure we could ever tell which brand is the most reliable in this forum because so many here just buy new lights every year. Heck, even a dollar store light can last a year.
> 
> My guess is that ANY light with an electronic switch will be more prone to failure than a mechanical or twisty switch. This is the one thing that has stopped me from dumping a bunch of money into some of these ZLs that I would really like to have.



I dont know which brand is most reliable but I do know every Fenix Ive owned had excellent build quality, I cant say the same for some others


----------



## neutralwhite

thanks, and same here. I got the cash bunch to dump, but surely not on ZL till I see solid quality, & customer focused improvements. hmmmm, whenever that will be. 
thanks jbrett14 !. goodnight from London!.


----------



## jbrett14

Bwolcott said:


> I dont know which brand is most reliable but I do know every Fenix Ive owned had excellent build quality, I cant say the same for some others



Yeah, Fenix is nice for sure. I feel that way about JetBeam as well. Very nice quality.

And so far, I can say the same for ZL.


----------



## Fireclaw18

jbrett14 said:


> ...
> My guess is that ANY light with an electronic switch will be more prone to failure than a mechanical or twisty switch. This is the one thing that has stopped me from dumping a bunch of money into some of these ZLs that I would really like to have.



In theory, an electronic switch should actually hold up better than a mechanical switch since the internal mechanism is simpler. There are fewer moving parts to wear out.

A mechanical switch has a rotating piece of plastic inside it, similar to the mechanism on a pushbutton ballpoint pen. In contrast, the moving part of an electronic switch is a simple momentary pushbutton switch. This mechanical simplicity is the reason why electronic switches tend to be flatter and take up less space inside a light.


----------



## BWX

jbrett14 said:


> You know what they say - "fool me once ............
> 
> I still can't believe you kept buying them after the second or third failure. I would say that ZL owes you a few lights just for being so loyal. I feel for ya man. As you say, that is an expensive paperweight.



"Shipping them back" should be a clue I was talking about _replacement_ lights for defective ones. So yeah, either the switch or the electronics failed in every single* replacement*, most in the exact same way, and they were all different lights- not the same exact "repaired" lights sent back to me.. So something was up with QC in a big way, or they were sending me "repaired" defective lights from someone else for replacements, which seems to be what happened. It's hard to say. It might have been 6 lights, I lost track and they deleted some of my records on the ZL website. 

Also they did offer to replace the LAST (fifth or sixth) defective light, but the shipping added up was getting ridiculous and I didn't think I was ever going to get a "good one" anyway.


----------



## neutralwhite

crazy. makes me just wonder how they seem to get away with all this. if there ain't good QC & CS, i ain't buying!. not sure in 2013 they will be, but there isn't really a good enough official response from them. ZL seems like its got no staff. just some defective machines machining away lol.



BWX said:


> "Shipping them back" should be a clue I was talking about _replacement_ lights for defective ones. So yeah, either the switch or the electronics failed in every single* replacement*, most in the exact same way, and they were all different lights- not the same exact "repaired" lights sent back to me.. So something was up with QC in a big way, or they were sending me "repaired" defective lights from someone else for replacements, which seems to be what happened. It's hard to say. It might have been 6 lights, I lost track and they deleted some of my records on the ZL website.
> 
> Also they did offer to replace the LAST (fifth or sixth) defective light, but the shipping added up was getting ridiculous and I didn't think I was ever going to get a "good one" anyway.


----------



## BWX

ZL design is great though, and if you get a "good one" - it's going to be a great light. 

I think the problem is that when heavily used, in my experience, they are not reliable. They are pushing the boundaries of small and bright though, so overheating is always going to be an issue. Mine never over-heated, but they did get hot. Maybe something in the electronics cannot handle the heat the way it was designed? I don't know. I will probably buy an SC600 MkII though, and just hope for the best. My flickering (on high) EDC D25LC2 is bugging me.


----------



## jbrett14

BWX said:


> "Shipping them back" should be a clue I was talking about _replacement_ lights for defective ones. So yeah, either the switch or the electronics failed in every single* replacement*, most in the exact same way, and they were all different lights- not the same exact "repaired" lights sent back to me.. So something was up with QC in a big way, or they were sending me "repaired" defective lights from someone else for replacements, which seems to be what happened. It's hard to say. It might have been 6 lights, I lost track and they deleted some of my records on the ZL website.
> 
> Also they did offer to replace the LAST (fifth or sixth) defective light, but the shipping added up was getting ridiculous and I didn't think I was ever going to get a "good one" anyway.




Sorry about that. I was joking a bit. 

Seems odd that the buyer would have to pay shipping for sending back an item that is defective because of the fault of the company who first shipped it. 

Your case certainly has had an impact on my considerations of buying more ZebraLights. I am kind of in hold mode right now, waiting for more ZL reviews and experiences with customer service. 

Thanks for sharing.


----------



## neutralwhite

same. good move. wait on!. not only customer service, but QUALITY CONTROL.

....shipping once is acceptable possibly, but not again and again. ZL jokers!.
if ZL is so good, and i guess sometimes it is, they ain't so upfront to acknowledge this and work to make things even better.
keeping their customers pretty in the dark, really.




jbrett14 said:


> Sorry about that. I was joking a bit.
> 
> Seems odd that the buyer would have to pay shipping for sending back an item that is defective because of the fault of the company who first shipped it.
> 
> Your case certainly has had an impact on my considerations of buying more ZebraLights. I am kind of in hold mode right now, waiting for more ZL reviews and experiences with customer service.
> 
> Thanks for sharing.


----------



## g.p.

I have both Fenix and ZL lights that I abuse daily at work, and knock on wood, I haven't had any issues yet. I dropped my TK41 and the switch quit working for a few hours, but then it worked again. Wierd! I would say that they are both very reliable though.

Here's what sold me on trying ZL: http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?321619-Zebralight-Torture-Test

:twothumbs


----------



## BWX

Well where is it? Ir is 1/1/13 and no light available.


----------



## fnj

BWX said:


> Well where is it? Ir is 1/1/13 and no light available.



Call back on 2/1/13. It will only be late if it's not released by 1/31/13.


----------



## TEEJ

LOL - That's true....if in December of 2012 they say it will be out "Next month" that just means in January of 2013.

January has more than one day...


----------



## BWX

I want it now dammit! LOL.


----------



## TEEJ

BWX said:


> I want it now dammit! LOL.



LOL

Just do those dilation eye drops they give you for eye tests, and then use the SC600 while you wait.


----------



## BWX

If I had one.. This will be my first sc600. Using a (flickering) D25LC2 now for this class of light.


----------



## tatteredmidnight

BWX said:


> If I had one.. This will be my first sc600. Using a (flickering) D25LC2 now for this class of light.



GAH, i thought i was the only one. I just pulled the trigger on the sunwayman c20c, can't wait any more. I'm sure I'll find a way to justify the sc600 mkII when they release it.

-- Adam


----------



## BWX

tatteredmidnight said:


> GAH, i thought i was the only one. I just pulled the trigger on the sunwayman c20c, can't wait any more. I'm sure I'll find a way to justify the sc600 mkII when they release it.
> 
> -- Adam


Mine only flickers when in one of the high modes (loose head mode), but still, it's annoying- and it is my EDC. Otherwise I like it, but if the ZL is a good one, meaning no problems, I think I will like it more.


----------



## rexet

I can't wait to order it also! This could be my main everyday flashlight


----------



## hkowboy

Anyone heard anything?


----------



## jbrett14

Seems like I read that it was to be released on 1-13-13, but I cannot remember where I read it, or that it was for this specific light.


----------



## neutralwhite

i think i read the same, on here. thanks.
but someone from a shop in the US did mention that it was the end of Jan, Early Feb.
thanks.




jbrett14 said:


> Seems like I read that it was to be released on 1-13-13, but I cannot remember where I read it, or that it was for this specific light.


----------



## BWX

You'd think they would at least post a pic or something. What's with the secrecy?


----------



## tonkem

BWX said:


> You'd think they would at least post a pic or something. What's with the secrecy?



I am sure they are just being conservative, as they have posted some pics of lights that have yet to come to light, Q50 ... I am sure they will post soon.


----------



## twl

It probably looks the same as the Mk1, so maybe they think they don't need to put up any pics.


----------



## blackFFM

twl said:


> It probably looks the same as the Mk1, so maybe they think they don't need to put up any pics.



I don't think so since the new design is 5mm shorter than MKI.


----------



## tonkem

twl said:


> It probably looks the same as the Mk1, so maybe they think they don't need to put up any pics.



Doubt it will be the same, as they say: We will release an SC600 Mk II next month to replace this *one and half year old design*. Main improvements include:1. 900Lm max ANSI (SC600's 750Lm rating is based on T6 LEDs. Most SC600s shipped actually come with U2 LEDs) with more efficient driver/LED.
2. programmable M and L (similar to the H502 and SC52), much longer runtimes (at the lowest level)
3. *Total length 101.6mm (5.4mm shorter) and lighter.*
4. Battery indicator, similar to the H502 and SC52.


----------



## CarpentryHero

tonkem said:


> Doubt it will be the same, as they say: We will release an SC600 Mk II next month to replace this *one and half year old design*. Main improvements include:1. 900Lm max ANSI (SC600's 750Lm rating is based on T6 LEDs. Most SC600s shipped actually come with U2 LEDs) with more efficient driver/LED.
> 2. programmable M and L (similar to the H502 and SC52), much longer runtimes (at the lowest level)
> 3. *Total length 101.6mm (5.4mm shorter) and lighter.*
> 4. Battery indicator, similar to the H502 and SC52.



That'll be a nice improvement, I like the new features on the sc52, I wonder if the clip will be screwed on too?


----------



## Oztorchfreak

*Hi Guys.*


*When is this SC600 MKII coming out????*

I love my SC600 and the interface is probably the best UI around as far as push button lights go.

The LOW BATTERY feature will be greatly appreciated I am sure as not many other lights have that feature still.

I wonder how the SC600 MKII will be able to check the battery level when either 1 x 18650 (4.2V) or 2 x CR123 (6V) batteries are installed.

Does anyone know yet what tint the LED produces at least on HIGH as another green tinted light is not wanted in my collection.

The SC600 Cool White is a little bit on the green side even when it is on HIGH mode in some parts of the beam.


*CHEERS*


----------



## BWX

Should be withing 30 days.. You'd think.


----------



## fnj

Actually I should think 23 days would be more like it.


----------



## GordoJones88

Oztorchfreak said:


> *Hi Guys.*
> 
> 
> *When is this SC600 MKII coming out????*


 
January 31, 2013 @ 11:59pm UTC/GMT (last time zone)


----------



## turkeylord

GordoJones88 said:


> January 31, 2013 @ 11:59pm UTC/GMT (last time zone)


I heard it was going to be right after they release the Q50...


----------



## roadkill1109

No leaked pictures of the light yet?


----------



## fnj

turkeylord said:


> I heard it was going to be right after they release the Q50...



Oh that hurts. That hurts bad. :devil:


----------



## GordoJones88

turkeylord said:


> I heard it was going to be right after they release the Q50...



The Q50 has met it's end. It has been removed from the ZL datasheet.


----------



## tonkem

GordoJones88 said:


> The Q50 has met it's end. It has been removed from the ZL datasheet.



They also deleted ALL future products. Not a bad idea, being that they set expectations that are not always met.


----------



## markr6

tonkem said:


> They also deleted ALL future products. Not a bad idea, being that they set expectations that are not always met.



Oh wow they did! Probably had a moment of "oh crap, we have NOTHING in stock...let's get to work and sell some stuff"


----------



## BWX

fnj said:


> Actually I should think 23 days would be more like it.



I'm not holding my breath for 23 or 30 or 40 days. If there isn't even a picture out yet on the 8th, I wonder.


----------



## LEDburn

Oztorchfreak said:


> *Hi Guys.*I wonder how the SC600 MKII will be able to check the battery level when either 1 x 18650 (4.2V) or 2 x CR123 (6V) batteries are installed.
> *CHEERS*



Well, to start with, unless you actually want a fried light, I would not even be giving the sc600 the chance to test 2 x CR123's. 
The reason the light is so efficient is due to the specific voltage range it operates within 

I'd be guessing it meters in the same way the sc52 does. How that is, I have no clue.


----------



## SwordEdge

*Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

Received a bit more info from Zebralight about the upcoming SC600 MK2. Doesn't add much from their website, but still:



> The SC600 Mk2 will have a U3 bin LED, up from T6 in the SC600, which adds about 106Lm. The SC600 Mk2 driver is a bit more efficient. And lastly, the driving current is increased slightly in the SC600 Mk2.
> 
> Sincerely,
> 
> Lillian Xu
> ZebraLight, Inc.
> 8320 Sterling Street
> Irving, TX 75063



At least I know it's not an XM-L2.. still pretty awesome at 900lm. Wonder if U3 bin will mean more tint problems?

cheers!


----------



## druidmars

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

Yes, at least now we have one more piece of the puzzle. It's not XM-L2 yet...


----------



## roadkill1109

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

no pics yet? awww..


----------



## neutralwhite

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

damn, this is some secret!. lol.



roadkill1109 said:


> no pics yet? awww..


----------



## BWX

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

I saw that info about U3 yesterday.. I wonder if that will up the specs at all?


Yeah it must be ugly if they are so ashamed to show pics! :naughty: 
(reverse psychology)..


----------



## Hitthespot

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

This is good news that they are continuing and updating the SC600. This has been my most used light in 2012. It's wide spot has been the most useful, especially with 750 lumens at my disposal. It has survived my 2 year old grandson ( who thinks it's his when he comes over ) and my hard use all year. I don't care about an extra 150 lumens, it might not be that noticible, but extra run times is a welcome addition. I might have to pick up a new one, and I really don't need it. LOL.


----------



## neutralwhite

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

better than the PD32UE?.
how?.
looking at maybe getting this new MKII.

thanks.





Hitthespot said:


> This is good news that they are continuing and updating the SC600. This has been my most used light in 2012. It's wide spot has been the most useful, especially with 750 lumens at my disposal. It has survived my 2 year old grandson ( who thinks it's his when he comes over ) and my hard use all year. I don't care about an extra 150 lumens, it might not be that noticible, but extra run times is a welcome addition. I might have to pick up a new one, and I really don't need it. LOL.


----------



## BWX

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

Interface is better than PD32 I think.. Plus it is smaller, and brighter..


----------



## neutralwhite

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

would a U3 LED have tint issues like someone above said ^ ?



BWX said:


> Interface is better than PD32 I think.. Plus it is smaller, and brighter..


----------



## BWX

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

I have no clue.. maybe someone else has an idea, but I don't know how they would since the flashlight isn't available yet.


----------



## Harry999

BWX said:


> Interface is better than PD32 I think.. Plus it is smaller, and brighter..



The specs are for the Cool White SC600 MKII so it will be brighter. The Neutral Tint of the PD32 UE has higher CRI and so for me personally is better than Cool White for EDC use. 

I will still consider upgrading my Mark 1 SC600 because of the increased efficiency on low and medium levels. Where the SC600 has the edge is moonlight modes with extremely long runtimes which make it a great light for emergency use.


----------



## BWX

I'm sure they'll have a warm or neutral version of the MkII eventually.. Or maybe not?


----------



## neutralwhite

i think it will be available when its released in neutral already. 
this it will be the SC600w MKII, not the cool white normal SC600 MKII.


correct anyone?.



BWX said:


> I'm sure they'll have a warm or neutral version of the MkII eventually.. Or maybe not?


----------



## cyclesport

neutralwhite said:


> i think it will be available when its released in neutral already.
> this it will be the SC600w MKII, not the cool white normal SC600 MKII.
> 
> 
> correct anyone?.



It would seem that you're correct. EG: Illuminationgear is showing both the Zebralight SC600 and SC600W MKII on their website now, allthough "out of stock" status in anticipation the product launch very soon.


----------



## Oztorchfreak

Does anyone know if Zebralight is aligned with any other brand or not.

I am just wondering if Zebralight is a totally independent manufacturer of this brand of lights or are they made by another OEM manufacturer as is common with other brands of flashlights nowadays.


*CHEERS*


----------



## leon2245

Oztorchfreak said:


> Does anyone know if *Zebralight* is aligned with any *other* brand or not.
> 
> I am just wondering if *Zebralight* is a *totally* *independent* manufacturer of this brand of lights or are they made by *another OEM manufacturer* as is common with other brands of flashlights nowadays.
> 
> 
> *CHEERS*


(emphasis mine)



Good question O.T.F. I've always *assumed* that they *ARE* independent, just because Zebra Lights are so *unique* looking. I've never seen anything vaguely like Z.L.'s from others in the past. Some are getting similar in style lately, but not *exact copies *​like certain models seemingly shared among *OTHER* brands, & NO one to my knowledge has Z.L.'s _*user interface.*_

Still someone could be making them for Z.L. despite that, it would not surprise me.


----------



## BWX

I thought SPARK was made by ZL or the same guy designs SPARK lights, or something like that.. The interface is very similar.


----------



## Fireclaw18

BWX said:


> I thought SPARK was made by ZL or the same guy designs SPARK lights, or something like that.. The interface is very similar.



Not that similar. The interface on the Zebralight is unique. The Spark's interface is much more generic. The lights do look similar however in that both Sparks and Zebralights use electronic side switches and feature grey anodizing with ribbed heatsinking at the head.


----------



## BWX

Yeah I have had both.. they aren't the same, but similar in that you hold the electronic switch and it rotates through the different levels, then you release and it stops. I thought I read on here somewhere that there was some sort of link between those manufacturers but I never looked into it any further. I'm sure someone on here knows exactly what I'm talking about.


----------



## henry1960

BWX said:


> I thought I read on here somewhere that there was some sort of link between those manufacturers but I never looked into it any further. I'm sure someone on here knows exactly what I'm talking about.




Didnt one of the head Zebra light workers quit Zebra light and now is employed at Sparks?...Thats what i thought i read a couple of years ago...


----------



## Fireclaw18

henry1960 said:


> Didnt one of the head Zebra light workers quit Zebra light and now is employed at Sparks?...Thats what i thought i read a couple of years ago...



That sounds familiar. I recall reading that somewhere on CPF as well.


----------



## BWX

Yeah that sounds familiar. I know there is a connection there somewhere. My SPARK headlamp is awesome. I love it.. My Spark SL6-800CW is peice of crap that won't stay on in turbo for more than 10 seconds and then just shuts off.. it doesn't go into a lower mode as it is supposed to. I sent it back twice to goinggear- they tested this one and sent it to me. It does the same damn thing. I got fed up and it is in a drawer. It does the same with all of my 10 or so Panasonic 3100 batteries and three other 18650 batts.

That's another reason I am waiting for this new MKII SC600- because my expensive SPARK SL6-800CW is a piece of junk.


----------



## CM2010

I got rid of my SL6 after only a day it just felt very cheap compared my SC600.


----------



## Cessquill

Hi - a bit of a noob question, I apologise, but I'm just starting to get into this. Been reading the forums for a while, but only just joined.

I'm looking at getting this when it comes out (the "w" version, hopefully) as an EDC, and I'm guessing that its shortened length is going to limit the selection of 18650 batteries that can be used.

Ideally I'm looking at putting a rechargeable into this - does anybody have any thoughts on which batteries might fit and still give respectable performance? I know we can't really be too sure on the information we've got so far, but any pointers would be appreciated.


----------



## eloreno

Cessquill said:


> Hi - a bit of a noob question, I apologise, but I'm just starting to get into this. Been reading the forums for a while, but only just joined.
> 
> I'm looking at getting this when it comes out (the "w" version, hopefully) as an EDC, and I'm guessing that its shortened length is going to limit the selection of 18650 batteries that can be used.
> 
> Ideally I'm looking at putting a rechargeable into this - does anybody have any thoughts on which batteries might fit and still give respectable performance? I know we can't really be too sure on the information we've got so far, but any pointers would be appreciated.



Welcome to CPF, as you said, there's no way to know for sure, but my bet is the SC600 MKii will fit all batteries the current SC600 fits and probably more. AW batteries are always recommended.


----------



## LEDburn

eloreno said:


> Welcome to CPF, as you said, there's no way to know for sure, but my bet is the SC600 MKii will fit all batteries the current SC600 fits and probably more. AW batteries are always recommended.



I use AW 3100mAh cells which are just a Panasonic cell wrapped in his own branded outer - the official Zebralight 18650's use the same cells and are very close in price. Same with the ZL 14500 vs AW - price wise - the AW is 750mAh vs ZL @ 840mAh. 

Unless you NEED to support a fellow CPF member and buy cells off him (which is up to you) then it may be easier to get them both from the same source. I have had lights arrive and have been forced to wait for batteries before, it really sucks!!!


----------



## LEDburn

Duplicate deleted.


----------



## Cessquill

Thank's for that. I was looking at the AW 3100mAh, and if they're very similar to the ZL's, it's hopefully likely they'll fit.

I was just a bit wary that the current SC600 states "up to 67mm", and the mkII has shaved 5.4mm off its total length. As far as I can work out the AW's weight in at 67.3mm. Being wet behind the ears on this, I wasn't sure how much give there would be.

I'm in the UK, so options are a little more limited, but like you say, I didn't want a light to turn up only to have to wait several days to be able to use it. If I could be sure I'd get a couple of batteries today and start charging them ready.


----------



## LEDburn

I have read of issues with the first model SC600 where some brands of battery are a tight fit but with mine I have no issues at all - they're not even remotely tight. I have 3100 & 2200 mAh AW cells, all 6 fit.


----------



## KeeblerElf

I have used Eagletac's protected 3100mAh and 3400mAh cells in my SC600. Both seem to fit fine and run well. Mine is a later version, though (with lanyard ring).


----------



## magnum70383

Will this light have a clip? Is it small enough to fit in a jeans pocket? I got used to carrying my EDC inside my pocket with clip


----------



## Cessquill

magnum70383 said:


> Will this light have a clip? Is it small enough to fit in a jeans pocket? I got used to carrying my EDC inside my pocket with clip


The current version comes with a clip, so it might be safe to assume that the MkII version would also.

At 101.6mm long and (I assume *) a bezel diameter of 30mm and body diameter of 25.4mm, it's likely to be one of the smallest 18650 flashlights out there. Unless you're used to AAA-sized, it should be OK in jeans. I carry an asthma inhaler around that's vaguely the same diameter but a bit shorter.

* that's the diameter of the current model and I haven't seen any updates on it yet


As an aside, am I right in assuming that the H600 is the headlamp equivalent of the SC600? If so, has anybody seen any plans to update that in line with the SC600's new features?


----------



## toysareforboys

twl said:


> It's a triple XPG2 with 1600 lumens on high at turn on. A real pocket rocket.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That black thing above the business card is a 18650 battery carrying capsule. It's about 3.5" long.


WTF is the NAME of that flashlight!!

-Jamie M.


----------



## KeeblerElf

toysareforboys said:


> WTF is the NAME of that flashlight!!
> 
> -Jamie M.



That's an Oveready/Torch Labs Moddoolar, available from oveready.com. Beautiful light!


----------



## toysareforboys

jbrett14 said:


> twl, I am not certain that I fully understand HOW you would stop the charging process at that voltage. Are you suggesting that one should stand by their charger and take measurements at certain intervals, and then pull them out when the preferred voltage is reached?


Why not get a charger that shows ya the voltage?? 

http://www.cpfmarketplace.com/mp/showthread.php?240304






-Jamie M.


----------



## toysareforboys

KeeblerElf said:


> That's an Oveready/Torch Labs Moddoolar, available from oveready.com. Beautiful light!


If I understand correctly, that light in the picture is only capable of 1600 lumens when powered by TWO 18650 batteries, on a single battery the maximum output is 1070 lumens right?



Oveready said:


>



And those aren't even OTF ratings? 

-Jamie M.


----------



## StandardBattery

toysareforboys said:


> If I understand correctly, that light in the picture is only capable of 1600 lumens when powered by TWO 18650 batteries, on a single battery the maximum output is 1070 lumens right?
> 
> 
> 
> And those aren't even OTF ratings?
> 
> -Jamie M.



Why are you posting this stuff/spam to the Zebralight thread. :thinking:


----------



## toysareforboys

StandardBattery said:


> Why are you posting this stuff/spam to the Zebralight thread. :thinking:


That oveready flashlight was posted 3 times already in this thread  Just wanted to compare it's real output, apples for apples, against the SC600 mk2 

-Jamie M.


----------



## twl

toysareforboys said:


> That oveready flashlight was posted 3 times already in this thread  Just wanted to compare it's real output, apples for apples, against the SC600 mk2
> 
> -Jamie M.



The place to do that would be on the Oveready page in the custom light forum.
There are plenty of us that would be happy to talk about it there, apples to apples.


----------



## toysareforboys

twl said:


> The place to do that would be on the Oveready page in the custom light forum.
> There are plenty of us that would be happy to talk about it there.


Thanks, didn't know they were in there 

-Jamie M.


----------



## twl

toysareforboys said:


> Thanks, didn't know they were in there
> 
> -Jamie M.



Here's the link to the Oveready page in the Custom Light Forum.
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/forumdisplay.php?139-Oveready

I'll keep an eye out for your question there, and we can talk all about it.


----------



## Pvt. Pile

C'mon zebralight, give us a picture ya bollox!


----------



## WmArnold1

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



Hitthespot said:


> This is good news that they are continuing and updating the SC600. This has been my most used light in 2012. It's _*wide spot*_ [emphasis added] has been the most useful, especially with 750 lumens at my disposal...



Agreed; although their spec's say it's a 10° spot, mine looks more like 20° on the wall. Maybe ZL will update their spot/spill spec's too. :devil:


----------



## BWX

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

So who thinks this will be available to purchase in 10 days? I'm doubtful, but I hope I am wrong.


----------



## fnj

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

Maybe 11 days.


----------



## BWX

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

I doubt that too..


----------



## druidmars

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

That's just marketing to keep us all excited... bahhh


----------



## ScottyD14

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



BWX said:


> So who thinks this will be available to purchase in 10 days? I'm doubtful, but I hope I am wrong.




I'm new to the forum, but thought I'd register to share some information I've received from Zebralight. I asked if they had an official release date scheduled on the light and received this response on Friday:

"Subject: SC600 Mk II Release Date


Between late Feb and March, 2013.


Irving, TX 75063"

I'm sure it's not the news you all would like to hear, but at least it's news!


----------



## Beckler

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

I don't know what I'll do 'til then. I have some ceilings, walls and trees that need 900 Lm on them ASAP.


----------



## shelm

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



ScottyD14 said:


> I'm new to the forum, but thought I'd register to share some information I've received from Zebralight. I asked if they had an official release date scheduled on the light and received this response on Friday:
> 
> "Subject: SC600 Mk II Release Date
> 
> 
> Between late Feb and March, 2013.
> 
> 
> Irving, TX 75063"
> 
> I'm sure it's not the news you all would like to hear, but at least it's news!



so the update timeline is ?

Jan: S6330
Feb: S6330
March: SC600 MKII
And then after that:
SC52w .. maybe in late April/May


----------



## GordoJones88

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



shelm said:


> So the update timeline is?
> 
> Jan: S6330
> Feb: S6330
> March: SC600 MKII



Feb: S5310 3xAA


SC600 MKII Release Date: March 31, 2013 11:59:59 UTC/GMT

Only 70 More Days Till Release !


----------



## Badbeams3

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



Beckler said:


> I don't know what I'll do 'til then. I have some ceilings, walls and trees that need 900 Lm on them ASAP.



I `m beginning to have some doubts as to the increase in lumen over the later model SC600`s. Unless they upgrade to the U3.

"1. 900Lm max ANSI (*SC600's 750Lm rating is based on T6 LEDs. Most SC600s shipped actually come with U2 LEDs*) with more efficient driver/LED. 

So it might be that the sc600 U2 equipped models are already at the 900 lumen rating...for example the new Nitecore P26 is rated at 860 ansi lumen...in Selfbuilts test they came in at 760, 20 lumen below the later SC600 models, at 780. So it could be just an update to reflect that they all now come with the U2...perhaps the only change might be a tad longer run time...maybe a hair brighter, battery indicator. shorter length and more level choices (resulting in longer run times, super low low).

I`m not really expecting to see much, if any, increase in lumen output over the existing SC600`s...


----------



## WmArnold1

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



Beckler said:


> I don't know what I'll do 'til then. I have some ceilings, walls and trees that need 900 Lm on them ASAP.


----------



## Beckler

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



Badbeams3 said:


> I `m beginning to have some doubts as to the increase in lumen over the later model SC600`s. Unless they upgrade to the U3.
> ...



I had the same thought, and I do believe that's what they're trying to imply. Altho it doesn't actually mention what LED it *will* have. Maybe XML2 :O


----------



## Badbeams3

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



Beckler said:


> I had the same thought, and I do believe that's what they're trying to imply. Altho it doesn't actually mention what LED it *will* have. Maybe XML2 :O



Yea secret stuff. But if their history is a clue...they will stick U2`s in there till the use up their supply...then switch over to a higher output...whatever...U3, XML2...without saying anything.


----------



## moozooh

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

You haven't been looking well, have you. This was on previous page, and this in a nearby thread. It's U3.


----------



## Badbeams3

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



moozooh said:


> You haven't been looking well, have you. This was on previous page, and this in a nearby thread. It's U3.



My confidence level would be higher if they posted it on their manufactures web page...see no reason for them not. The rep claims an increase of 106 lumen using a U3...to 900 according to the web page info. That would put existing SC600`s at 794 lumen...might be right. Still...why not put it in print so it`s clearly understood.


----------



## StandardBattery

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



Badbeams3 said:


> My confidence level would be higher if they posted it on their manufactures web page...see no reason for them not. The rep claims an increase of 106 lumen using a U3...to 900 according to the web page info. That would put existing SC600`s at 794 lumen...might be right. Still...why not put it in print so it`s clearly understood.



I'm hoping the more it is delayed, the better chance there is it will appear with XM-L2. I don't know if this a factor or not, but they seem to run on a pretty tight inventory.


----------



## fnj

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



ScottyD14 said:


> I'm new to the forum, but thought I'd register to share some information I've received from Zebralight. I asked if they had an official release date scheduled on the light and received this response on Friday:
> 
> "Subject: SC600 Mk II Release Date
> 
> 
> Between late Feb and March, 2013.
> 
> 
> Irving, TX 75063"
> 
> I'm sure it's not the news you all would like to hear, but at least it's news!


----------



## tatteredmidnight

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

I am disappointed that Zebralight has effectively exited a market they dominated (1x18650 compact side switch). As I noted, I purchased an alternative largely because the ZL is just not available. Updating the product line is all well and good, but it would be nice if they would offer SOMETHING in that form factor until they can execute the update.

-- Adam


----------



## Badbeams3

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



tatteredmidnight said:


> I am disappointed that Zebralight has effectively exited a market they dominated (1x18650 compact side switch). As I noted, I purchased an alternative largely because the ZL is just not available. Updating the product line is all well and good, but it would be nice if they would offer SOMETHING in that form factor until they can execute the update.
> 
> -- Adam



Lol..patience is not one of my virtues either. Seems we all sort of enjoy comparing lights...but the anticipation once decided...tough to bear. What light did you get?


----------



## tatteredmidnight

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

Sunwayman c20c Tomahawk. Very impressive little light, really enjoying it.

-- Adam


----------



## Badbeams3

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



tatteredmidnight said:


> Sunwayman c20c Tomahawk. Very impressive little light, really enjoying it.
> 
> -- Adam



And one of the best looking lights too


----------



## tatteredmidnight

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

I almost feel like ZL tricked me out of getting the SC600. When they were coming out with it I hadn't switched to 18650 really yet, and they were teasing the Q50, so I put off buying it. Lots of lights later, I've standardized on 18650, I'm ready to invest in the form factor they basically invented, and its not available. Its like a cruel joke. Not that they didn't offer it for a long time, I just have a wandering attention.

-- Adam


----------



## LEDburn

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



tatteredmidnight said:


> I am disappointed that Zebralight has effectively exited a market they dominated (1x18650 compact side switch). As I noted, I purchased an alternative largely because the ZL is just not available. Updating the product line is all well and good, but it would be nice if they would offer SOMETHING in that form factor until they can execute the update.
> 
> -- Adam





tatteredmidnight said:


> Sunwayman c20c Tomahawk. Very impressive little light, really enjoying it.
> 
> -- Adam



The SC600 is clearly a very popular light, and for good reasons too!
What you have effectively done is purchased a light with less power, and worse efficiency and then come here to complain. Well done!

Guess you will be buying the MKII as well seeing as it will be so much better than that c20c?


----------



## LEDburn

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

Duplicate.


----------



## Badbeams3

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



tatteredmidnight said:


> I almost feel like ZL tricked me out of getting the SC600. When they were coming out with it I hadn't switched to 18650 really yet, and they were teasing the Q50, so I put off buying it. Lots of lights later, I've standardized on 18650, I'm ready to invest in the form factor they basically invented, and its not available. Its like a cruel joke. Not that they didn't offer it for a long time, I just have a wandering attention.
> 
> -- Adam



Myself I ordered a Nitecore EC25. I like the blue lit camera switch, and memory, something my SC600 does not have. From here my eyes are tilting toward a muti emitter light. Think I have enough sub 1000 lumen level lights...I`m ready for a big boy toy next. Just got to wait till my wallet fattens up a bit...


----------



## tonkem

Zebralights are worth the wait.


----------



## neutralwhite

it seems they are, especially in terms of UI which is good compared to fenix. 
i keep seeing myself counting up all over the place with this new pd32ue.
someone at work has a ZL, and the UI is straightforward. 



tonkem said:


> Zebralights are worth the wait.


----------



## magnum70383

The wait is killing me... I want a new EDC


----------



## jbrett14

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



tatteredmidnight said:


> I am disappointed that Zebralight has effectively exited a market they dominated (1x18650 compact side switch). As I noted, I purchased an alternative largely because the ZL is just not available. Updating the product line is all well and good, but it would be nice if they would offer SOMETHING in that form factor until they can execute the update.-- Adam



Do they not still offer the SC600?


----------



## Badbeams3

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



jbrett14 said:


> Do they not still offer the SC600?



Not on the Zebralight web site (out of stock)...and dealer stocks are drying up...might be able to find them with a bit of hunting around..


----------



## jbrett14

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



Badbeams3 said:


> Not on the Zebralight web site (out of stock)...and dealer stocks are drying up...might be able to find them with a bit of hunting around..



Hmmm, you are right, that is strange. I assumed the SC600 was still readily available. It is odd that they would not have had it's replacement in place BEFORE exhausting the production of the current model. 

While waiting for their lights - this one and the S6330 - I decided to get a SkyRay King instead of the upcoming S6330 and I am glad I did. I have currently been looking at other 1 x 18650 lights but I am not willing to give up my love for a side-switch light. I am not sold on that camera button switch on the Nitecore (I think it's Nitecore). And the only other one that looked like it MIGHT satisfy me is the Spark SL6 but it's too much $. 

Another less popular one is the Shadow GF1 but I have yet to hear from anyone as to how they like it. I love my Shadow S-L3, and am impressed with the quality at that price, so I may end up just getting the Shadow instead of the upcoming ZebraLight.


----------



## GordoJones88

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



jbrett14 said:


> I have currently been looking at other 1 x 18650 lights but I am not willing to give up my love for a side-switch light.



There is the new Eagletac TX25C2 you could take a look at.


----------



## jbrett14

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



GordoJones88 said:


> There is the new Eagletac TX25C2 you could take a look at.



Not sure how I missed this one. Looks very nice but I am not sure I would like the UI. 

Also, it looks like the switch may have the same problem that the older ZebraLights did - accidental turn-on. Does anyone know if this is a problem with this light? If not, I would consider it if it could be turned on in high mode with just the switch (no twisting).

It's a very nice looking light for sure.


----------



## g.p.

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

It's funny that we all probably have more lights than one person will ever need, but are still to anxious to wait!

I don't care if it takes longer, as long as they are using the time to make updates. I hate buying a light and having it updated a few months later, leaving me disappointed that I was in on the first shipment. Sure some things aren't availabe at the release date, but the upgrades that are a result of an obvious lack of testing make me mad.


----------



## lightliker

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

Received a mail from Zebralight: The SC600MarkII will be available in about 4-6 weeks fromnow :thumbsup:


----------



## GordoJones88

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

Received a mail from Zebralight: The SC600MarkII will be available sometime this year!


----------



## BWX

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

4 to 6 weeks? WTF!? 4 to 6 weeks sucks.

Edit-- well I got sick of waiting so I just got a MKI SC600..


----------



## lightliker

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

So it will be 2014? 


GordoJones88 said:


> Received a mail from Zebralight: The SC600MarkII will be available sometime this year!


----------



## StarHalo

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

Friendly reminder: You need at least a 10% difference in brightness for it to be perceptible by the eye. Assuming the current SC600 nudges the 800 lumen mark, another 10% is 880 lumens - the difference between an 800 and 900 lumen light will just barely be noticeable if you're paying close attention. Much less than the disparity between a mode change, even two modes that are close.


----------



## Cessquill

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

That could potentially put it into the first week of March, which is over three months - a quarter of a year - after the original announcement. That's assuming there are no delays. Then there's the potential of any teething issues from the first batch, and (for me) the time it's going to take to get to the UK.

Personally, I'm looking for an EDC with a bit of extra power when needed. Where I am, by March/April the nights will be lighter and the extra power less required until November.

Their announcement effectively stopped me buying in December for Christmas, but now I'm thinking one of the others out there will do the job. Maybe an Eagletac TX25C2 or D25LC2. Or maybe look again at the CR123 route. Oh, back to the drawing board...


----------



## twl

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



Cessquill said:


> That could potentially put it into the first week of March, which is over three months - a quarter of a year - after the original announcement. That's assuming there are no delays. Then there's the potential of any teething issues from the first batch, and (for me) the time it's going to take to get to the UK.
> 
> Personally, I'm looking for an EDC with a bit of extra power when needed. Where I am, by March/April the nights will be lighter and the extra power less required until November.
> 
> Their announcement effectively stopped me buying in December for Christmas, but now I'm thinking one of the others out there will do the job. Maybe an Eagletac TX25C2 or D25LC2. Or maybe look again at the CR123 route. Oh, back to the drawing board...



In that amount of time, there will be a number of new contenders out there, along with the existing ones that you already mentioned.
Time is on your side. All the lights are getting better fairly quickly now. 
I always try to wait as long as I can to get the most upgraded technology when I make the plunge.


----------



## leon2245

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



tatteredmidnight said:


> I almost feel like ZL tricked me out of getting the SC600. When they were coming out with it *I hadn't switched to 18650 really yet*, and they were teasing the Q50, so I put off buying it. Lots of lights later, I've standardized on 18650, I'm ready to invest in the form factor they basically invented, and its not available. Its like a cruel joke. Not that they didn't offer it for a long time, I just have a wandering attention.
> 
> -- Adam




Does anyone know if the sc600 II is now compatible with CR123a's too, or just 18650? Just curious.


----------



## tatteredmidnight

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

I'm assuming its going to be 18650 only, as that seems to be how ZL gets their efficiency in this light, by having a narrow voltage range on their driver. Also the MKI only took 18650's, so I'm guessing its going to be the same config.

-- Adam


----------



## twl

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



leon2245 said:


> Does anyone know if the sc600 II is now compatible with CR123a's too, or just 18650? Just curious.



I have a friend who is a Zebralight dealer, and he didn't know at first that the light was 1 x 18650, and he was putting 2 x CR123 in it and it was running with them in there! He used it that way for several weeks until I told him that he needed to use an 18650 in there.
Believe it or not, the thing didn't suffer any damage.
Now he's using the proper battery configuration, but apparently the Mk1 was able to withstand a good bit of over-voltage without frying.


----------



## TEEJ

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



StarHalo said:


> Friendly reminder: You need at least a 10% difference in brightness for it to be perceptible by the eye. Assuming the current SC600 nudges the 800 lumen mark, another 10% is 880 lumens - the difference between an 800 and 900 lumen light will just barely be noticeable if you're paying close attention. Much less than the disparity between a mode change, even two modes that are close.



This is important if the light is to make you notice its brighter. We can perceive that ~ 10% as mentioned. If the light is to SEE things with, you can see more with more lux on targets.

For example, if you had a set of markers lined up, and used the dimmer beam to see what markers you could make out, and then used a stronger beam, even only a little stronger, to see if there were any additional markers that you could now see, you would see the additional areas lit up even if you could not see the added lumens. It may not even look any brighter...you'd just notice a few things out there you didn't notice before.

The reason is we can't SEE lumens. We can ONLY see the resultant lux. As most lights have, especially at closer ranges, a hot spot, it tends to make our eyes have trouble judging "brightness". (Once the lux is maxing our ability to stop down...its all the same to us) Our eyes still perceive OBJECTS though, and THOSE are more visible with even a few more lumens, depending upon the targets themselves.


----------



## Badbeams3

The extra lumen may not be that noticeable. But brighter better is still my rule. Never the less, not sure I`m going to upgrade. Pretty happy with my current SC600. Think I would rather use the $100 towards the purchase of a multi emitter light. Maybe the Zebralight model. Will have to see whats best down the road, when I`m ready to move on it.


----------



## neutralwhite

with it being 4200k would that carry a higher CRI than 75?.
my pd32ue is 75cri.
thanks.


----------



## moozooh

Cree specifies all of their neutral white XM-Ls as 75 CRI.

Re: brightness differences; while a 10–20% difference in brightness might not be noticeable or at all beneficial, a 10–20% difference in runtimes surely could. I've been using SC600 as my bike light in a city with immense light pollution (predominantly those orange sodium streetlights, no less), so I mainly use it on the highest settings. Even some extra 15 minutes at the brightness level I'm used to could mean a lot.


----------



## neutralwhite

thanks what cri is the ZL then?. 75 too?.
its a neutral white right?.




moozooh said:


> Cree specifies all of their neutral white XM-Ls as 75 CRI.
> 
> Re: brightness differences; while a 10–20% difference in brightness might not be noticeable or at all beneficial, a 10–20% difference in runtimes surely could. I've been using SC600 as my bike light in a city with immense light pollution (predominantly those orange sodium streetlights, no less), so I mainly use it on the highest settings. Even some extra 15 minutes at the brightness level I'm used to could mean a lot.


----------



## moozooh

It's a neutral white, of course, but there's no telling where it becomes available. Cool white is 4-6 weeks away, nobody has even said anything about the neutral one.


----------



## neutralwhite

thanks,....the neutral is way better, easily. 
surprised that ain't out first.



moozooh said:


> It's a neutral white, of course, but there's no telling where it becomes available. Cool white is 4-6 weeks away, nobody has even said anything about the neutral one.


----------



## Oztorchfreak

moozooh said:


> Cree specifies all of their neutral white XM-Ls as 75 CRI.
> 
> Re: brightness differences; while a 10–20% difference in brightness might not be noticeable or at all beneficial, a 10–20% difference in runtimes surely could. I've been using SC600 as my bike light in a city with immense light pollution (predominantly those orange sodium streetlights, no less), so I mainly use it on the highest settings. Even some extra 15 minutes at the brightness level I'm used to could mean a lot.




Are you using good quality 3400mah Li-ions in your SC600?

I will do a run test on my SC600 using Panasonic 18650B 3400mah Li-ions and see what I get keeping in mind that If the SC600 is left on continuosly the step-down in output will kick in and that is probably how you would be using it on bike rides.

What light level do you normally use when you are riding at night?

The SC600 MKII should have a battery warning and some other little changes that would be welcomed and my SC600 is a bit yellowy even though it is not the Neutral Tinted SC600W version. 



*CHEERS*


----------



## TEEJ

My SC600W produced yellow like a fog light beam. My SC600 produced a nice white beam, not blue at all, nice and creamy white.

I second the motion to consider what 18650's you use in the SC600 as far as run time goes.

Some cells have a higher mah, but, can't support the higher amp flows/current draws needed for max out put modes. Other cells can run longer on max output, even if their mah rating is lower, as they can keep up the amps longer above whatever threshold the light needs.

HJK has charts that illustrate all of that...so that you can choose cells that match the light's characteristics. GENERALLY, I have simply used high quality 3400 mah cells and had great run time.


----------



## tatteredmidnight

TEEJ said:


> My SC600W produced yellow like a fog light beam. My SC600 produced a nice white beam, not blue at all, nice and creamy white.
> 
> I second the motion to consider what 18650's you use in the SC600 as far as run time goes.
> 
> Some cells have a higher mah, but, can't support the higher amp flows/current draws needed for max out put modes. Other cells can run longer on max output, even if their mah rating is lower, as they can keep up the amps longer above whatever threshold the light needs.
> 
> HJK has charts that illustrate all of that...so that you can choose cells that match the light's characteristics. GENERALLY, I have simply used high quality 3400 mah cells and had great run time.



The 3400Mah Panasonic cells have *much* better high-draw characteristics than their 3100Mah cells did, its like night and day.

-- Adam


----------



## TEEJ

tatteredmidnight said:


> The 3400Mah Panasonic cells have *much* better high-draw characteristics than their 3100Mah cells did, its like night and day.
> 
> -- Adam



Correct...and their 2600 mah cells were better than the 3100 mah cells in some high draw cases, the reverse relationship.

So, as I found, the 3400 mah's are, for me at least, working out great.


----------



## moozooh

Oztorchfreak said:


> Are you using good quality 3400mah Li-ions in your SC600?
> 
> I will do a run test on my SC600 using Panasonic 18650B 3400mah Li-ions and see what I get keeping in mind that If the SC600 is left on continuosly the step-down in output will kick in and that is probably how you would be using it on bike rides.
> 
> What light level do you normally use when you are riding at night?



Depends on the speed and the ambient light. When I was working on my previous job, I'd often go home very late at night, so I cruised down empty streets lit by sodium streetlights at around 25-30 km/h or so. I would commonly use the turbo setting letting it drop to sustained max after five minutes, but if the asphalt was wet or it still rained, I would reload the turbo after the dropdown. In (near-)complete darkness and on speeds of <15 km/h, I found the 70-something setting to work just fine, too (especially since I didn't need to see too far ahead). With higher CRI I would expect that my need for raw output would be significantly less, too.

I'm using Orbtronic protected 3400 mAh.


----------



## WmArnold1

Oztorchfreak said:


> ... I will do a run test on my SC600 using Panasonic 18650B 3400mah Li-ions and see what I get keeping in mind that If the SC600 is left on continuously, the step-down in output will kick in and that is probably how you would be using it on bike rides...



Although it's impossible to predict when my SC600 & Panasonic 18650*A* steps-down from H2 to M1, it always stays within M1 for 50-60 minutes before stepping down to L1. Which, for me, is plenty of time to gracefully stage a swap or return to the charger. Imho, ZL's step-down feature almost completely guarantees that I will never be unexpectedly thrown into total-darkness.


----------



## twl

The Panasonic 3400 18650B with protection circuit as seen by several brands is so very close to equaling the AW2600 in the later stages of depletion that it is no longer really a consideration to get the 2600. Unless it is for fitment issues, because we are seeing some of these 3400 cells being too fat to fit in some lights.
If the light itself has a discharge protection circuit, and the losses from the battery protection circuit can be eliminated, and use the bare 18650B alone, then it exceeds any of the protected versions by a fair margin at any point along the scale. That's only if you feel comfortable with an unprotected cell.

Regarding the graceful step-down behavior, you can thank Henry Schenker of HDS for that concept, which he pioneered probably around 8 years ago in the ARC and HDS lights. And his lights still have that feature in them today.


----------



## Badbeams3

twl said:


> The Panasonic 3400 18650B with protection circuit as seen by several brands is so very close to equaling the AW2600 in the later stages of depletion that it is no longer really a consideration to get the 2600. Unless it is for fitment issues, because we are seeing some of these 3400 cells being too fat to fit in some lights.
> If the light itself has a discharge protection circuit, and the losses from the battery protection circuit can be eliminated, and use the bare 18650B alone, then it exceeds any of the protected versions by a fair margin at any point along the scale. That's only if you feel comfortable with an unprotected cell.
> 
> Regarding the graceful step-down behavior, you can thank Henry Schenker of HDS for that concept, which he pioneered probably around 8 years ago in the ARC and HDS lights. And his lights still have that feature in them today.



Yep, I remember the good o`l days...


----------



## leon2245

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



twl said:


> leon2245 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Does anyone know if the sc600 II is now compatible with CR123a's too, or just 18650? Just curious.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have a friend who is a Zebralight dealer, and he didn't know at first that the light was 1 x 18650, and he was putting 2 x CR123 in it and it was running with them in there! He used it that way for several weeks until I told him that he needed to use an 18650 in there.
> Believe it or not, the thing didn't suffer any damage.
> Now he's using the proper battery configuration, but apparently the Mk1 was able to withstand a good bit of over-voltage without frying.
Click to expand...


That's great, thanks for the info.


----------



## Oztorchfreak

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

*
Hi Guys.*


I just did a run time test on my SC600.

I charged a protected Blazar (Panasonic) 18650B 3400mah Li-ion battery in my Soshine SC-S7 Universal charger until the display read "FULL" at around 4.17 volts.

I put it into my SC600 and switched it on at the highest output setting of TURBO that is 750 lumens and it ran for 5 minutes at that level until the "step-down" circuit of the light kicked in that adjusted the light down to the HIGH mode which is set at 500 lumens.

The light ran for a total run time of 4 hours and 10 minutes of usable light until the battery protection circuit stopped any further drop in output voltage.

I put the battery back into the SC-S7 charger resetting the PTC and I took it straight out and the voltage measured 2.9v.

I put the battery back into the charger until the display read "FULL".

The display read 4 hours 55 minutes of charging time and a total charging figure of 3524mah.

I was away when the HIGH mode dropped out but I will edit this post when I check that figure in the next couple of days.

With the SC600 using the said batteries it gave me quite a long amount of usable run time that I was surprised at seeing as I started the SC600 at the TURBO setting.

I configured my SC600 to be at the highest lumen output levels in each mode.

The higher lumen levels of each mode are as follows.

Each mode has a user defined second mode that is available by double clicking the button quickly when each mode is switched on at via the shortcuts or when the push button is held down and cycled to.

*H1* *(TURBO) *is set to 750 lumens until the "step-down" of five minutes occurs that drops the light down to the next lower mode.

*H**2 *(the user selectable sublevel) can be set to 500, 330 or 200 lumens or strobe at a rate of 4hz, if you can call 4hz a strobe which most of us would disagree with.

*A setting of at least 10hz would qualify as a strobe mode I think.*

A strobe rate of 4hz only qualifies this mode to be a fast flashing mode above what a normal beacon mode would be set to run at IMHO.

I hope the SC600 MKII has a much faster strobe rate than 4hz (flashes per second)!


*M1 *(MEDIUM HIGH) is set to 65 lumens.

*M2* (the lower user selected sublevel) is 21 lumens.

*
L1 *(LOW HIGH) is set at 2.5 lumens. 

*L2 * (the lower user selected sublevel) can be set to 2.5 or 0.1 lumens.


The SC600 *"memorises"* the selected levels that it ran at in each mode and runs at that level after "turn off".

When the SC600 is switched on and placed into the H1 (TURBO) mode, after 5 minutes the step-down kicks in and the light will run at the user selected light level of H2.

When the STROBE mode has been set as H2 the light will be operating at 500 lumens after "step-down" when the light is switched back on in the TURBO mode or at any time that the light is operating and has been placed in the TURBO mode. 
*
The "TURBO" setting is not really a mode but just what the HIGH mode runs at in reality before "step down" occurs if I confused anybody.*



*CHEERS*


----------



## phips

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

I have never been a fan of the nested Zebralight interface but I think I am finally ready to give in and buy one of these when they come out.
Currently I use a D25LC2 but it lacks a real moon mode and the interface has blinky modes on the main line so it is not perfect as well.

This light will probably not be too different from the MK I.
However I really hope that removing the pocket clip / lanyard attachment leaves a smooth body without any edges.
It might seem like a small thing, but personally I really dislike bodies that are uncomfortable (again in my opinion) to grip.


----------



## Beckler

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



phips said:


> I have never been a fan of the nested Zebralight interface but I think I am finally ready to give in and buy one of these when they come out.



I agree with this and will probably get it simply because no other 18650 light will have the same brightness and multi-level capability. I could easily be mistaken but all the 8-900Lm 18650 lights I've seen only have some random combination of 3 or so levels. :|


----------



## Beckler

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

<duplicate>


----------



## g.p.

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

Have either of you tried the UI in person? It looks complicated on paper, but is really intutive once you use it. It's by far the best UI I have used of any light - single button, double button, or otherwise. Even my preschooler was was able to figure out the basic operation on his own.


----------



## Cessquill

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

Personally not tried it, and apologies for a very entry-level question, but - could anybody pick it up and use it in an emergency?


----------



## Badbeams3

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



Cessquill said:


> Personally not tried it, and apologies for a very entry-level question, but - could anybody pick it up and use it in an emergency?



Probably. But it would come on in high or turbo. My thinking is it`s not the best "anybody can use"...lay around light.


----------



## Beckler

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

I've not tried it myself either, and I realize it still will be quite usable. It's just to me, the idea of turning on, then switching levels, then *double clicking* (!) to get to a proper level...ya that's just not optimal--at all. There just *has to be* a better way. But that's not unique to ZL. No one's really innovating in this area, it seems...


----------



## neutralwhite

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

what way would you suggest?
fenix ain't really no better.
thanks.




Beckler said:


> I've not tried it myself either, and I realize it still will be quite usable. It's just to me, the idea of turning on, then switching levels, then *double clicking* (!) to get to a proper level...ya that's just not optimal--at all. There just *has to be* a better way. But that's not unique to ZL. No one's really innovating in this area, it seems...


----------



## TEEJ

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

As you can program it. you could make it come on in LOW instead of high, etc, if you wanted to...and they anyone COULD just use it, etc.

Mine are all set for on at turbo though, and the wife/kids had no trouble, as they KNOW my lights will melt brain tissue if they look AT the beam, etc...so its just not a problem.


----------



## neutralwhite

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

so ZL UI is better than Fenix's ?.
it looks it.
i get so confused counting up & damn down with these fenix's...
pd32ue.



TEEJ said:


> As you can program it. you could make it come on in LOW instead of high, etc, if you wanted to...and they anyone COULD just use it, etc.
> 
> Mine are all set for on at turbo though, and the wife/kids had no trouble, as they KNOW my lights will melt brain tissue if they look AT the beam, etc...so its just not a problem.


----------



## BWX

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

I like my Fenix LD20 UI, but I do not like two button UIs. I'd probably already have a PD32U if it wasn't for that two button UI. IMHO ZL has the UI thing covered.


----------



## phips

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

I did some thinking about this flashlight and came to the conclusion that I will buy a H600Fw 
Having just one light that does everything (in my case: flashlight, head lamp, bike light) is very appealing to me.
Also I am really curious if an angle light is as practical as I think it is.


----------



## markr6

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



phips said:


> I did some thinking about this flashlight and come to the conclusion that I will buy a H600Fw Having just one light that does everything (in my case: flashlight, head lamp, bike light) is very appealing to me.Also I am really curious if an angle light is as practical as I think it is.



I think you'll find it practical. I only use mine as a headlamp but since I got it the H51 has been downgraded to "miscellaneous use" without the band since I hate cool whites now. I find using headlamps without the headband is quite nice. I don't really see any downsides and it's nice to stand it on a table and light up a work area.


----------



## fnj

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



Cessquill said:


> Personally not tried it, and apologies for a very entry-level question, but - could anybody pick it up and use it in an emergency?



Most definitely. Someone who knows nothing whatever about it is going to either:

1) Click the button quickly - it will come on bright just as he expects a flashlight with a click switch to do. Perfect for an emergency.

2) Hold the button down - he will immediately see that it cycles between dim, medium, and bright continuously as long as he holds it down, and pretty quickly he will pick up that it stays in whichever mode it is in when he lets go. Pretty intuitive. Entirely acceptable in an emergency.

3) Somewhat less likely - he will do something in between (1) and (2) and it will come on in either medium or low. If it comes on in low because he clicked it too slowly, he will probably try again and get medium or high. This is OK in an emergency. Two out of three he will get either very bright (high) or bright (medium) light the first time, and almost certain he will after a couple of tries.

4) Pretty unlikely he will even try double clicking it while it is on, so he's not going to mess with the H2, M2, or L2 programming. Even if he does try it, it's hardly the end of the world. It takes determined clicking to get it into strobe mode.


----------



## fnj

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



TEEJ said:


> As you can program it. you could make it come on in LOW instead of high, etc, if you wanted to...and they anyone COULD just use it, etc.



If I understand you, permit me to take exception. You can program what level high is, picking between the fixed H1 level or several choices for H2 levels. You can program what level medium is, picking between the fixed M1 level or several choices for M2 levels. And you can program what level low is, picking between the fixed L1 level or several choices for L2 levels. But you can't change the behavior that one quick click from off always goes to high, one slow-but-not-too-slow click from off always goes to low, and holding down the button always cycles between low, medium, and high repeatedly as long as you hold it down.

You can always make it come on in either high or low depending on how you click it, but with no dependency at all on programming. It's not a flexible-but-compl;icated as the HDS EDC.


----------



## TEEJ

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

You pick the level that it comes on in...pick a lower one, and it comes on dimmer, etc.



Frankly, I prefer lights to come on in HIGH/MAX anyway....and that's how mine are set up. If I want it dim, I just select a dim light.


----------



## Badbeams3

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



fnj said:


> If I understand you, permit me to take exception. You can program what level high is, picking between the fixed H1 level or several choices for H2 levels. You can program what level medium is, picking between the fixed M1 level or several choices for M2 levels. And you can program what level low is, picking between the fixed L1 level or several choices for L2 levels. But you can't change the behavior that one quick click from off always goes to high, one slow-but-not-too-slow click from off always goes to low, and holding down the button always cycles between low, medium, and high repeatedly as long as you hold it down.
> 
> You can always make it come on in either high or low depending on how you click it, but with no dependency at all on programming. It's not a flexible-but-compl;icated as the HDS EDC.



This is how mine works as well. No way to pick...say the 65 lumen level at turn on.


----------



## twl

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

Look, it isn't a matter of whether a child can "figure it out' or whether some neophyte can get it to turn on in an emergency, even if those circumstances were to happen.
The truth of the matter is that some people just don't like this User Interface, and don't want it, and really aren't interested, even if somebody is telling them that "this is the world's greatest interface" in their biased opinion.

So, it's much easier to just come to grips with this fact that not everybody likes or wants this, and that's the way life is.
There is no such thing as the "world's greatest interface", no matter how hard some people want to proclaim it. There is the "best interface for YOU" and that is as far as it goes. 

So, some will like it, and some will hate it, and never want to buy it, and that's perfectly okay for them.


----------



## twl

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

Here's the thing.

It's not a matter of whether a child can "figure it out" or if a stranger can make it work in an emergency, even if those things might occur.
The issue is that some people just don't like this User Interface, and don't really care if somebody else wants to proclaim it to be "the worlds greatest user interface".
They just don't want it. It doesn't suit them.
Simple as that.

It's okay.
Not everybody is going to like ZL or want to buy a ZL.


----------



## g.p.

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



twl said:


> Here's the thing.
> 
> It's not a matter of whether a child can "figure it out" or if a stranger can make it work in an emergency, even if those things might occur.
> The issue is that some people just don't like this User Interface, and don't really care if somebody else wants to proclaim it to be "the worlds greatest user interface".
> They just don't want it. It doesn't suit them.
> Simple as that.
> 
> It's okay.
> Not everybody is going to like ZL or want to buy a ZL.


So you haven't personally tried it?








Just kidding...sorry for asking.


----------



## twl

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



g.p. said:


> So you haven't personally tried it?
> 
> Just kidding...sorry for asking.



Yes, as a matter of fact, I've personally tried it many many times. Probably hundreds of times.
I have a very close friend who is a ZL dealer(as I mentioned previously), and he lets me play with the lights every time I go there.
And I can get any ZL at dealer cost, any time I want.
But, I simply don't like the way they work, and so I don't buy them.


----------



## Badbeams3

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

My favorite IC is found on the Olight Baton lights. Simple and straight forward. Runner up for me is the Nitecore EC25 type control...but the Zebralight is nice too...


----------



## selas

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



twl said:


> Yes, as a matter of fact, I've personally tried it many many times. Probably hundreds of times.
> I have a very close friend who is a ZL dealer(as I mentioned previously), and he lets me play with the lights every time I go there.
> And I can get any ZL at dealer cost, any time I want.
> But, I simply don't like the way they work, and so I don't buy them.


Must be something drawing you back all those 'hundreds' of times


----------



## neutralwhite

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

never tried it myself, but looks simple enough once you get going.
fenix has bored me already with the up downs. 



selas said:


> Must be something drawing you back all those 'hundreds' of times


----------



## twl

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



selas said:


> Must be something drawing you back all those 'hundreds' of times



Yes, it's the steak dinners that his wife cooks when I visit!
But, I am a flashaholic, and I do like to try out the lights when I go there, and it is always in the back of my mind that I could get a real low price if I could just start liking them.
I wanted to see if I could get used to them, and maybe they'd grow on me.

It's really not a big deal. People like different things, and that's pretty normal.


----------



## g.p.

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

You could always mark them up a little and sell them to me. Win, win.


----------



## twl

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



g.p. said:


> You could always mark them up a little and sell them to me. Win, win.



The one I like the best is the H600. Then, the SC600 next after that. I haven't played with the SC52, but I wasn't too thrilled about the SC51, and so I don't think the SC52 is going to change my mind. Im not too keen on AA lights.
I will try out a 6330 next time I go. He told me that he has some on order.


----------



## selas

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



twl said:


> The truth of the matter is that some people just don't like this User Interface, and don't want it, and really aren't interested, even if somebody is telling them that "this is the world's greatest interface" in their biased opinion.
> 
> Some will like it, and some will hate it, and never want to buy it, and that's perfectly okay for them.


I'm curious what there is to 'hate' about the UI. Surely instant access to high & low (& double-click from off for medium) isn't hateful?


----------



## twl

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



selas said:


> I'm curious what there is to 'hate' about the UI. Surely instant access to high & low (& double-click from off for medium) isn't hateful?



I don't know. You'd have to ask somebody who "hates" it.
I just strongly dislike everything about the UI. It has everything I don't like, and nothing that I do like.


----------



## StandardBattery

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



twl said:


> I don't know. You'd have to ask somebody who "hates" it.
> I just strongly dislike everything about it.



So is there a multi-level interface with more than 2 levels that you love?


----------



## twl

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



StandardBattery said:


> So is there a multi-level interface with more than 2 levels that you love?


No.
And I don't like side switches. And I don't like electronic switches. And I don't like multiple clicks, or presses-and-holds for mode changes or ramping, or "timed clicks", either. 
There is literally nothing about this UI that I like at all.

I like the small size of the light, and I like the power output for the size. Those are the parts I like.
I like the H600 best out of the lot because at least it has the switch on the end, and it is smaller.


----------



## StandardBattery

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



twl said:


> No.
> And I don't like side switches. And I don't like electronic switches. And I don't like multiple clicks, or presses-and-holds, or "timed clicks", either.
> There is literally nothing about this UI that I like at all.


So why do you post in this thread?


----------



## StandardBattery

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



twl said:


> twl said:
> 
> 
> 
> No.
> And I don't like side switches. And I don't like electronic switches. And I don't like multiple clicks, or presses-and-holds for mode changes or ramping, or "timed clicks", either.
> There is literally nothing about this UI that I like at all.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> StandardBattery said:
> 
> 
> 
> So why do you post in this thread?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I like the small size of the light, and I like the power output for the size. Those are the parts I like.
> I like the H600 best out of the lot because at least it has the switch on the end, and it is smaller.
Click to expand...

Are you interested in happiness?


----------



## twl

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



StandardBattery said:


> So why do you post in this thread?



I posted information in this thread earlier, and then the subject was brought up by others about people unable to use, or not-liking the UI.
So, I posted the obvious answer that some people simply don't like it, and never will, and that it is to be expected.
Then, it appears that some questions were raised about "Who could not like it?", as if it was some universally liked thing, which it clearly is not.
And so I answered their questions, and yours too.
Anything else?

Edited to add:
Happiness? Sure, I like happiness.


----------



## neutralwhite

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

i got to try this ZL UI, and see the love,...& hate,...but it seems mostly all love. 
gotta try..


----------



## g.p.

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



StandardBattery said:


> So is there a multi-level interface with more than 2 levels that you love?





twl said:


> No.



So ZL conceivably has the best multi-level UI there ever has been...but you just don't like any of them! 

:lolsign:   :kiss:


----------



## twl

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



g.p. said:


> So ZL conceivably has the best multi-level UI there ever has been...but you just don't like any of them!
> 
> :lolsign:   :kiss:



I will admit that it might be the "best there has ever been" for the people who like it enough to think that about it.

Just like I have my own ideas about what is "best".

These opinions are not universal, and that is the basis of my post about it being expected that not everyone will like it, and it's no big deal if they don't.
It's not heresy to not like a light's UI.

You know, people go on threads for other lights like Fenix or Olight or JetBeam or whatever, and say they don't like the UI or mode choices for some lights all the time, or comment about the button, or all kinds of things. Nobody seems to think that's unusual or "needs questioning".


----------



## LEDburn

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

twl likes to criticize Zebralight in many ways in many threads so I would take his "advice" with a grain of salt.

With that said, I used to think little of the bland look and (what I thought to be) complex UI myself so can understand some people just don't get it. It really is the simplest and most advanced UI out there on a mainstream flash light.

Instant access to low or high is exactly what you want in a light and once you've had it, you wont want a light that doesn't. 

Think of the sub levels of ways to increase runtime: don't need or want full output? Double click and you have a lower level and longer runtime! 

The sc52 is a perfect example, especially as AA's and 14500 have much lower energy content: I have it set to turn on at 172L which is fine for almost any task, has about 90 mins runtime. Then if I need the extra oomph, instead of reprogramming or whatever other way other lights achieve mode changes (twist head for eg), I quickly double click andnI instantly have 500L pouring out. *Yep, that's just a stick, not brown snake* *double click* 3 seconds later object identified and back to 172L.

Easy as breathing. My girlfriend, with absolutely no instruction (cause I knew this would happen!!) from myself on how to use it, has adopted the SC80 and has mastered full functionality 

Just goes to show anyone (unbiased, willing to accept it) can work it out and realize how useful it is!


----------



## g.p.

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



twl said:


> You know, people go on threads for other lights like Fenix or Olight or JetBeam or whatever, and say they don't like the UI or mode choices for some lights all the time, or comment about the button, or all kinds of things. Nobody seems to think that's unusual or "needs questioning".


Those people usually give valid reasons, suggestions and examples on how to improve whatever they don't like.

Of course you are entitled to your opinion just like everyone else. I just don't understand how you can expect to make a comment about one of the most universally loved features of a light in it's thread and not expect people to ask you questions and for more details? When someone doesn't like a feature it is usually because they like something better. Being the flashaholics that we are, we are always on the look out for something new or something that we missed. 

At my work you aren't allowed to complain unless you have a valid suggestion on how to make it better. It makes people think and become part of the solution. Being that you have such strong opinions against ZL I was kind of excited that you may have found something better. Sadly it now seems like you were just trolling for reactions.


----------



## g.p.

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



LEDburn said:


> Easy as breathing. My girlfriend, with absolutely no instruction (cause I knew this would happen!!) from myself on how to use it, has adopted the SC80 and has mastered full functionality
> 
> Just goes to show anyone (unbiased, willing to accept it) can work it out and realize how useful it is!


I know how that goes! My wife has claimed my SC51. I didn't mind though because it gave me a good reason to get an SC52! 
:twothumbs


----------



## phips

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

Concerning the interface and people that are happy with it:
Are you always able to tell if you are in primary or secondary mode?
And if you are, is it because you remember which mode you left it on, or can you simply tell from the brightness?


----------



## g.p.

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

I can usually tell if I'm in the lowest mode or the highest mode because they are such extremes. For the medium levels I have to double click to tell if I don't remember where I left it. I always try to leave each level in it's lowest mode and ramp up if I feel the need. Saves a little on batteries, especially if my wife and kids are using it. It also doesn't get so hot if my little guy takes it and has it on high.


----------



## Cessquill

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



twl said:


> Look, it isn't a matter of whether a child can "figure it out' or whether some neophyte can get it to turn on in an emergency, even if those circumstances were to happen.


I'm afraid that is a matter to me, which was why I raised it and included a "noob warning". In times of emergency, my mind is not going to be concentrated on how to turn on a light. I don't want my other half in trouble because something is too clever for its own good and not intuitive enough. Again, apologies for what's probably a face palm question.

I've figured that I've waited now nearly two months, I might as well hang on and see what this is like. If it's no good, I can still go to an Eagletac or similar. Still looking at the H600, but that might be in addition to an EDC.


----------



## twl

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



Cessquill said:


> I'm afraid that is a matter to me, which was why I raised it and included a "noob warning". In times of emergency, my mind is not going to be concentrated on how to turn on a light. I don't want my other half in trouble because something is too clever for its own good and not intuitive enough. Again, apologies for what's probably a face palm question.
> 
> I've figured that I've waited now nearly two months, I might as well hang on and see what this is like. If it's no good, I can still go to an Eagletac or similar. Still looking at the H600, but that might be in addition to an EDC.



I'm sorry. I didn't really intend to minimize your real concerns, but was trying to focus more on the matter of wider range acceptability, and the fact that different people will have different levels of acceptance of this(or any) UI on a light.
I should have worded my response better. I realize that a safety issue is a serious matter.


----------



## StarHalo

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



Cessquill said:


> I don't want my other half in trouble because something is too clever for its own good and not intuitive enough.



No Li-ions for non-flashaholic/family emergency lights, even output modes are undesirable in that role. Zebralights aren't what you want if that's the application you're shopping for.


----------



## BWX

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

Hey I have a question for anyone using an SC600.. and I wonder if this will be the same for the MKII is this is "normal"? 

I've had mine for 2 days. My sc600 will not cycle past the H1 turbo mode fast like all the other modes.

If I configure the high mode to be H2 (500, 330, or 200 lm), it always cycles normally and fast.

If I turn the light on into 750 lm H1 mode, and then click and hold to try to cycle past, it will take between 3 and 6 seconds (I just tried it and it took 6 full seconds to cycle past).. most times it is at least 2 or 3 full seconds.

BUT- If I turn the light on in low mode, then wait a few seconds, then hold down to cycle, it will go through all the levels, get to turbo H1, and then pause for about 2 seconds, then cycle past, then after that it will cycle normally- at normal speed, past the H1 mode. **Actually sometimes it does and sometimes it doesn't, I just tested it and it seems to randomly "hang" after the H1 mode and pause up to 6 or 7 seconds when forst trying to cycle past H1. 

Sheesh. I have horrible luck with Zebralights. This cannot be normal.


----------



## StandardBattery

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



BWX said:


> Hey I have a question for anyone using an SC600.. and I wonder if this will be the same for the MKII is this is "normal"?
> 
> I've had mine for 2 days. My sc600 will not cycle past the H1 turbo mode fast like all the other modes.
> 
> If I configure the high mode to be H2 (500, 330, or 200 lm), it always cycles normally and fast.
> 
> If I turn the light on into 750 lm H1 mode, and then click and hold to try to cycle past, it will take between 3 and 6 seconds (I just tried it and it took 6 full seconds to cycle past).. most times it is at least 2 or 3 full seconds.
> 
> BUT- If I turn the light on in low mode, then wait a few seconds, then hold down to cycle, it will go through all the levels, get to turbo H1, and then pause for about 2 seconds, then cycle past, then after that it will cycle normally- at normal speed, past the H1 mode. **Actually sometimes it does and sometimes it doesn't, I just tested it and it seems to randomly "hang" after the H1 mode and pause up to 6 or 7 seconds when forst trying to cycle past H1.
> 
> Sheesh. I have horrible luck with Zebralights. This cannot be normal.


Interesting, my original SC600 does not behave in this way, I can't remember what I have H2 set to, probably the default. I also checked my recent SC600w that I just got 2-3weeks ago and does not have this behavior either. 

I think it would have come up already if anyone had seen it. You better post your description to Zebralight and see what they say.


----------



## Erik1213

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

I didn't even realize that the light would cycle through modes till you posted this. I never use that feature. Short click for high, long press for low and double click for medium. It's much quicker than low and wait for a cycle. But, alas, mine does not pause during the cycle, no matter the high mode setting.


----------



## Badbeams3

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



Erik1213 said:


> I didn't even realize that the light would cycle through modes till you posted this. I never use that feature. Short click for high, *long press for low and double click for medium*. It's much quicker than low and wait for a cycle. But, alas, mine does not pause during the cycle, no matter the high mode setting.



Mine won`t do that...just switches between low 1 and low 2...


----------



## StandardBattery

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



Badbeams3 said:


> Mine won`t do that...just switches between low 1 and low 2...


It will do that if you double click from OFF, not once it is already on.


----------



## Badbeams3

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



StandardBattery said:


> It will do that if you double click from OFF, not once it is already on.



Oh, I didn`t know that...yea that works! Only thing is I get a bright flash doing it...


----------



## Erik1213

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

Just for medium, which isn't bad. The key is the long press for low, no flash, no blindness.


----------



## Badbeams3

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



Erik1213 said:


> Just for medium, which isn't bad. The key is the long press for low, no flash, no blindness.



Yea, think I prefer this more gentle approach.


----------



## BWX

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

Oh yeah, mine does go into med if you double click from off- didn't know that.. but it does work- with the blast from turbo first of course. No biggie as it can be pointed at the ground easily.

I just tested it again and it took 15 full seconds to cycle past H1 on the first try from cold.. (cold meaning not turned on on 15 minutes, then single click from off to get to turbo H1, then wait a few seconds, press and hold to cycle, and counted one-one thousand, two-one thousand, three.. all the way to 15 one thousand, then it cycled!! So yeah.. It is defective for sure! I think the circuit doesn't work properly until it gets warmed up or something, then sometimes it works. 

I just got it in the mail two days ago. I emailed TorchDirect and explained it to them. Hopefully they won't jerk me around. 

I'm so _freaking_ (_nice language version_) sick of getting defective lights after paying big bucks for supposed "high quality" flash lights. Really freaking really sick of it.

Eagletac defective D25LC2 clicky x2 right off the bat- the third one in use but flickers on high/ loosened mode, so I got the SC600
Zebralight Defective x6 - 5 defective H501, yes 5.. one defective SC600 so far.
Spark- 3 defective SL6-800CW - current one is in sock drawer, defective $100 paperweight from GG. 

Seriously WTH is going on here. I'm using Panasonic 3100 18650's.. I have like 10 of them. Cannot be blamed on the batteries. Plus those batteries all work perfect in other 18650 lights that are not defective.


----------



## Badbeams3

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



BWX said:


> I just tested it again and it took 15 full seconds to cycle past H1 on the first try from cold.. (cold meaning not turned on on 15 minutes, then single click from off to get to turbo H1, then wait a few seconds, press and hold to cycle, and counted one-one thousand, two-one thousand, three.. all the way to 15 one thousand, then it cycled!! So yeah.. It is defective for sure! I think the circuit doesn't work properly until it gets warmed up or something, then sometimes it works.



Afraid so. Mine does not hesitate for even a second...starts to cycle right away...


----------



## BWX

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

Ok, thanks for all results of your testing.

More testing for me.. put in fresh battery with 4.11v. Worked perfect every time no matter what.. for a little while. Then after a few minutes testing it.. it starts again with the delay. It looks like it works perfect with completely fresh battery, but when battery gets below 4.00v or so, it starts this delay business. I did one test where it took 22 seconds to start to cycle after H1, even with the new (fresh) battery. When battery is down around 3.7 or 3.8, it is constant with this delay after H1. Oh well. 

At least I now it is not a feature, and it will not be on MKII, and it is just a defective MKI.


----------



## Badbeams3

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

Well, let me see if I have a batt below 4 volts...


----------



## Badbeams3

No, both my batts are reading out at 4 volts...


----------



## fnj

It's probably insulting to mention this, but you have to mash heck out of the switch when you hold it down. Otherwise it may not really be down all the time.


----------



## LEDburn

fnj said:


> It's probably insulting to mention this, but you have to mash heck out of the switch when you hold it down. Otherwise it may not really be down all the time.



Nope, it actually sounds like you scored a dud light too if that's the case.
Not one of my five Zebras need the force you're describing in order to cycle through the modes.


----------



## Cessquill

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



StarHalo said:


> No Li-ions for non-flashaholic/family emergency lights, even output modes are undesirable in that role. Zebralights aren't what you want if that's the application you're shopping for.


Sorry, that wasn't the main application - there are standard lights around for that use - I'm just getting into this and was thinking about emergency situations as a side issue. It would predominately be for EDC in a range of situations that call for various levels of light.


----------



## Pvt. Pile

fnj said:


> It's probably insulting to mention this, but you have to mash heck out of the switch when you hold it down. Otherwise it may not really be down all the time.


That's odd!


----------



## magnum70383

MAN..... Zebralight is reeeeeeeeeally taking their sweet time getting this light out...


----------



## henry1960

magnum70383 said:


> MAN..... Zebralight is reeeeeeeeeally taking their sweet time getting this light out...



:tired::tired::tired::tired::tired:


----------



## Lumosnox

> Originally Posted by *eloreno*
> 
> 
> Man that's a bummer. I just received my second sc600 last Friday. I would have waited had I known.
> I feel your pain.
> 
> I have one sc52, and another on order, but I think I will sell one of em' to get the sporty "turbo" MKll model of the sc600!
> 
> 
> I feel it too, but you probably got one with the U2 LED, so chances are it's only marginally less bright at the highest level than Mk II. Still, a minor change in output seems like the least significant update in comparison to reduced size and better runtimes. If you already have one one, you could always consider not using it (the one you received Friday) and selling it in mint condition.



So does that mean that they have been shipping the H600s with U2 LEDs as well?


----------



## blackFFM

It's february. By the time the MKII really hits the market it better features a XM-L2! Otherwise their new light will be already outdated.


----------



## brightasday

magnum70383 said:


> MAN..... Zebralight is reeeeeeeeeally taking their sweet time getting this light out...



OK, let me say up front that I'm a big Zebralight fan. I think they make tremendous flashlights, with great UI, superior output, great runtimes, etc. IMO they can not be beat. But as good as they are with flashlights, they are at least as BAD with estimates of when new lights will be available (if that makes any sense at all). Honestly I don't think anyone should make any plans based on their estimates of release dates.


----------



## g.p.

Isn't it Chinese New year? Nothing gets done for several weeks around that time of year.


----------



## neutralwhite

its about that time, yes.
longer wait.
why ain't ZL keeping us updated?.
some CS hey!.




g.p. said:


> Isn't it Chinese New year? Nothing gets done for several weeks around that time of year.


----------



## BirdofPrey

Asked a two part question last night. Asked about my H600 failure and whether there was anything I could do about it since I've barely used it and it died on me. Then I asked if they had any updates on the MK2 (which I may not be buying now). The only reply I got was that the MK2 was slated for release in four weeks.


----------



## magnum70383

IT's ok, lazy *** zebralight by delaying their lights = saving me money 



brightasday said:


> OK, let me say up front that I'm a big Zebralight fan. I think they make tremendous flashlights, with great UI, superior output, great runtimes, etc. IMO they can not be beat. But as good as they are with flashlights, they are at least as BAD with estimates of when new lights will be available (if that makes any sense at all). Honestly I don't think anyone should make any plans based on their estimates of release dates.


----------



## BWX

fnj said:


> It's probably insulting to mention this, but you have to mash heck out of the switch when you hold it down. Otherwise it may not really be down all the time.





No I no what you mean, mine does need quite a bit of force to hold it down.. It's not too bad though. 

When testing it I really make sure it is depressed though.. And it still does that delay thing only when going past turbo mode. 

Sometimes it won't jump to low for 22 seconds, then every time it goes past it is a 1.5 second delay on turbo mode.

Anyway, I am keeping this light. Everything about it is good except for that, but I keep the high mode on H2 330 lumen mode anyway and it works perfect. If I want 800 lumen blast I just double click to get to H1, and if I want to cycle in that mode I just cycle with multiple single clicks.

It has a nice tint, is way brighter than my D25LC2, like by a lot.. maybe that is just the beam pattern though, and everything else is perfect. If it fails in some other way, it goes back to ZL.


----------



## WmArnold1

When I'm in the dark and want to start in Medium or Low mode, I click-and-hold until the brightness cycles up. Doing that; I've noticed that low mode comes on instantly and if I release the button too soon, (say, < 1.5 seconds) I'm blind-sided [pun intended] with turbo-mode. Subsequently, I silently count "one-thousand-one, one-thousand-two" before releasing in darkness now. If it's just dim, (say, in a restaurant ~evil-grins~ I look away and quickly double click from off into medium. If anyone asks; I say that I just took a picture.


----------



## BWX

I just point it at the floor and double click from off to get med. mode. You could always put the lens up against your shirt or pant leg to avoid the blast from high.


----------



## Pvt. Pile

At the moment I don't even want the mk2. I'm happy with the mk1. But its killing me to see what it looks like. And I'm afraid once I see it, I'll order it, but I don't need it, but I'll end up getting it! I know you know what I mean.


----------



## blackFFM

Pvt. Pile said:


> At the moment I don't even want the mk2. I'm happy with the mk1. But its killing me to see what it looks like. And I'm afraid once I see it, I'll order it, but I don't need it, but I'll end up getting it! I know you know what I mean.





There is always a reason for another flashlight purchase. Maybe buy neutral white this time.


----------



## JKolmo

Pvt. Pile said:


> And I'm afraid once I see it, I'll order it, but I don't need it, but I'll end up getting it! I know you know what I mean.



LOL! I don't think I need a single one of the let's say ten latest flashlights I,ve ordered...


----------



## Fbygden

Information that I got from Zebralight regarding the release of MKII (I got this information 24/2 so I guess it's 3 weeks left)

Department: Sales

Subject: Release of SC600 MKII

The estimated release date is five weeks from now.

Sincerely,

Lillian Xu
ZebraLight, Inc.
8320 Sterling Street
Irving, TX 75063


----------



## Mlehman

Not sure if this is allowed on candlepowerforums but if anybody wants to sell their used sc600 please send me a message. Im looking to purchase this light and if I could save a little money on a used sc600 that would be perfect.
Again, I apologize if this is a no-no
Thanks!!


----------



## neutralwhite

also better idea to stick it on cpf market place. 



Mlehman said:


> Not sure if this is allowed on candlepowerforums but if anybody wants to sell their used sc600 please send me a message. Im looking to purchase this light and if I could save a little money on a used sc600 that would be perfect.
> Again, I apologize if this is a no-no
> Thanks!!


----------



## rexet

Fbygden said:


> Information that I got from Zebralight regarding the release of MKII (I got this information 24/2 so I guess it's 3 weeks left)
> 
> Department: Sales
> 
> Subject: Release of SC600 MKII
> 
> The estimated release date is five weeks from now.
> 
> Sincerely,
> 
> Lillian Xu
> ZebraLight, Inc.
> 8320 Sterling Street
> Irving, TX 75063


Thank you for this update. I guess we can wait for March


----------



## Fbygden

rexet said:


> Thank you for this update. I guess we can wait for March



That might be the case, from what I understand Zebralight are known for often postponing their release dates.


----------



## Wiggle

BWX said:


> I just point it at the floor and double click from off to get med. mode. You could always put the lens up against your shirt or pant leg to avoid the blast from high.



Are you doing this not to disturb others as much or because you think it influences your vision? In my experience, a flash of high lumens lasting a quarter second or so does nothing to your vision provided you don't fire it right into a mirror. Maybe in the darkest of environments but if you want medium rather than low I'd think it's safe to say you're not in such a place.

If you really want, blink for that instant when you're cycling past high.


----------



## leon2245

Yeah just blink or point it into your body, or just deal with a short bright flash; easily worth it for what is probably the 2nd greatest UI of all time.


----------



## Pvt. Pile

leon2245 said:


> Yeah just blink or point it into your body, or just deal with a short bright flash; easily worth it for what is probably the 2nd greatest UI of all time.


What do you reckon is better? I want!


----------



## leon2245

Pvt. Pile said:


> What do you reckon is better? I want!



But you also need its 700+ lumen turbo max mode right? Because 2nd best UI is still a pretty good UI!


----------



## juplin

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



Badbeams3 said:


> Yea, think I prefer this more gentle approach.


Both slowly cycling-through from low and pre-flash from high are not the best solution for frequent users of medium mode.
Zebralight should provide the option of memory for last used mode (i.e. medium mode in this case) like they did for cool white/ neutral white option.


----------



## fnj

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



juplin said:


> Both slowly cycling-through from low and pre-flash from high are not the best solution for frequent users of medium mode.
> Zebralight should provide the option of memory for last used mode (i.e. medium mode in this case) like they did for cool white/ neutral white option.



Guess I'll have to speak up for the UI as it presently is. It's dead simple and foolproof to get medium. Whether starting from off or on, you just hold down the button. If you start from off, it's a perfectly repeatable one second step. I like the predictability of it, which you don't get with last-used-mode memory. It's also just as dead simple to get low or high. In fact I'll come right out and say it. Not "second best" UI, it's perfectly tenable to regard as "best UI" in the business, or at least tied with one or two others. I know it's close compared to the HDS or the LF2XT UI; you could rate any one of them #1.


----------



## kaichu dento

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



juplin said:


> Both slowly cycling-through from low and pre-flash from high are not the best solution for frequent users of medium mode.
> Zebralight should provide the option of memory for last used mode (i.e. medium mode in this case) like they did for cool white/ neutral white option.





fnj said:


> Guess I'll have to speak up for the UI as it presently is. It's dead simple and foolproof to get medium. Whether starting from off or on, you just hold down the button. If you start from off, it's a perfectly repeatable one second step. I like the predictability of it, which you don't get with last-used-mode memory. It's also just as dead simple to get low or high. In fact I'll come right out and say it. Not "second best" UI, it's perfectly tenable to regard as "best UI" in the business, or at least tied with one or two others. I know it's close compared to the HDS or the LF2XT UI; you could rate any one of them #1.


While I understand the desire to have makers present their lights as we would like to have them, it's impossible for them to be completely wrong if they have a wide following that likes the light just as is.
The Zebralight UI may not be my own favorite either, but there is nothing at all 'wrong' with it and if anything they are already trending in a direction that may eventually have even users like Juplin happy.
If they keep offering a wider range of brightness options for each of the three user windows then we'll eventually have a high or low capable of bridging over into medium output instantly accessible one one end or the other.
A wide enough range of double-click position brightness options could allow the light to be a low-level fans dream, or a high only available light depending on which options the owner has chosen.


----------



## tatteredmidnight

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

I'm a huge fan of the Zebra UI. The only improvement i can see from here is going to fully programmable modes that offer all the available settings from moonlight to turbo. 3 modes of your choosing would be pretty much ideal. You could even set them all the same if you just want something where anyone can mush the button and get light.

The only UI i like as much as the Zebra UI is the magnetic control ring. I know its not as efficient, but for my EDC needs, the pro's outweigh the cons.

-- Adam


----------



## StarHalo

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



tatteredmidnight said:


> I'm a huge fan of the Zebra UI. The only improvement i can see from here is going to fully programmable modes that offer all the available settings from moonlight to turbo. 3 modes of your choosing would be pretty much ideal.



That would be Jetbeam's IBS interface, and yes, it's that good. _Was_ that good, when they stopped making it a few years ago.


----------



## LEDburn

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

You either want something bright you can use to see and identify an object, or something dim so you don't strain your eyes. 
It doesn't get any simpler than that. 

If you want to save battery life that bad and absolutely cannot stand the flash (double clicking as you remove it from your 
pocket isn't hard) then I'm sure the tiny amount of time it takes to cycle from low to medium will well and truly be fine - so why all the complaining? 
Guess people just have to whinge when something doesn't make sense to them. Go buy a single mode 40L light and always have medium, no cycling and no risk of the dreaded flash of high


----------



## neutralwhite

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

then for outdoor use at night, the SC600 CW or NW?.
cool white works better on the eyes at night outdoors than neutral white right?.


thanks.


----------



## moozooh

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

In most circumstances and for most people, neutral is easier on the eyes. The disadvantages are lower brightness and possible tint issues (too yellow or somesuch).


----------



## neutralwhite

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

thanks, on a two side notes if you could, ; 

the fenix pd32ue 5000k is 740 Lumens on highest.
with the new MkII 4200k NW being 900 Lumens (correct?),...which would be brighter?.
obviously the MkII nw is lower kelvin at 4200 than 5000.
would the extra 150+ lumens on the MkII NW make up for it?.

*& also*
...what would be the better emitter in terms of brightness and even efficiency in the new MkII NW?. T6 or U2?.


thanks.


----------



## moozooh

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

Seriously?.. You've asked several hundred questions in different threads and don't seem to understand the answers.

900 lumen is brighter than 740. However, the NW version won't be 900 lumen because NW emitters are less efficient than CW, and, logically, less bright. Expect a figure around 790 lm or so. Either way it should be brighter than the Fenix, albeit only marginally.

Lower color temp will mean the beam will be somewhat yellower, not less bright. CCT does not relate to brightness and can't directly make up for it.

U2 is more efficient than T6.

Go read the wiki.


----------



## Pvt. Pile

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

Every man has his breaking point!


----------



## neutralwhite

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

thanks. 


moozooh said:


> Seriously?.. You've asked several hundred questions in different threads and don't seem to understand the answers.
> 
> 900 lumen is brighter than 740. However, the NW version won't be 900 lumen because NW emitters are less efficient than CW, and, logically, less bright. Expect a figure around 790 lm or so. Either way it should be brighter than the Fenix, albeit only marginally.
> 
> Lower color temp will mean the beam will be somewhat yellower, not less bright. CCT does not relate to brightness and can't directly make up for it.
> 
> U2 is more efficient than T6.
> 
> Go read the wiki.


----------



## BWX

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

LOL @ "several hundred questions"... hehe


----------



## neutralwhite

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

810 now !. lool!. 



BWX said:


> LOL @ "several hundred questions"... hehe


----------



## PocketBeam

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

I didn't know there was a wiki. That should help educate my dad.

NW, most people don't notice or care about tint, assuming the tint is not horrible. My SC52 is slightly greenish. But unless I think about it I don't notice. Nobody I have shown it to has said it is anything but white. I do like a neutral white light, but I would rather have more lumens, especially outdoors. Based on sales, most people prefer lumens over neutral white. (I base that on what I have read in the forums. I have not seen hard numbers)

So my suggestion is not to worry about tint so much for your application.

Btw, what is the latest eta for the Mark II?


----------



## neutralwhite

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

looking like mid march...




PocketBeam said:


> I didn't know there was a wiki. That should help educate my dad.
> 
> NW, most people don't notice or care about tint, assuming the tint is not horrible. My SC52 is slightly greenish. But unless I think about it I don't notice. Nobody I have shown it to has said it is anything but white. I do like a neutral white light, but I would rather have more lumens, especially outdoors. Based on sales, most people prefer lumens over neutral white. (I base that on what I have read in the forums. I have not seen hard numbers)
> 
> So my suggestion is not to worry about tint so much for your application.
> 
> *Btw, what is the latest eta for the Mark II?*


----------



## neutralwhite

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

i see the new sc600MkII will be some 5.4mm (0.54cm) less in length.
would this still be OK for an AW3100 to fit?. thanks.
was advised to wait until its released to see the exact fits.
thanks.


----------



## BWX

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



neutralwhite said:


> i see the new sc600MkII will be some 5.4mm (0.54cm) less in length.
> would this still be OK for an AW3100 to fit?. thanks.
> was advised to wait until its released to see the exact fits.
> thanks.



Well how the heck is anyone supposed to know that if no one has seen or tested it yet? 
Does moozooh have reason to lash out you for asking pointless questions maybe? 



> Seriously?.. You've asked several hundred questions in different threads and don't seem to understand the answers.
> .......
> .......



Ok, now I see what you mean.. LOL


----------



## AussieRanga

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



neutralwhite said:


> i see the new sc600MkII will be some 5.4mm (0.54cm) less in length.
> would this still be OK for an AW3100 to fit?. thanks.
> was advised to wait until its released to see the exact fits.
> thanks.



You were advised (presumably by the manufacturer or a dealer) to wait until it is released so why did you ask here?

As much as everyone here really wants one, nobody has one and if they do, they are good at keeping secrets!!!

Wait until someone posts they have one before continuing to ask pointless questions maybe? You don't need a post count of several hundred 

Now I see why a few people have told you off!! 



moozooh said:


> Seriously?.. You've asked several hundred questions in different threads and don't seem to understand the answers.


----------



## neutralwhite

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

zzzzzzzz




AussieRanga said:


> You were advised (presumably by the manufacturer or a dealer) to wait until it is released so why did you ask here?
> 
> As much as everyone here really wants one, nobody has one and if they do, they are good at keeping secrets!!!
> 
> Wait until someone posts they have one before continuing to ask pointless questions maybe? You don't need a post count of several hundred
> 
> Now I see why a few people have told you off!!


----------



## Bullzeyebill

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



neutralwhite said:


> zzzzzzzz



What are you implying with your zzzzzzzzzzzz's? You might want to pay some attention to what people are saying about your postings. If you have a problem with my intervention here, please PM me.

Bill


----------



## neutralwhite

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

thank you.



Bullzeyebill said:


> What are you implying with your zzzzzzzzzzzz's? You might want to pay some attention to what people are saying about your postings. If you have a problem with my intervention here, please PM me.
> 
> Bill


----------



## TEEJ

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



neutralwhite said:


> hello & thanks, yes i have paid attention to what people are telling me, and constructively working to better my threads and posts.
> now if they could leave me to get on with it please, and no,..i dont have a problem one bit with you intervention, sir!.
> now if we could get back to the topic of the thread please.
> thank you.



LOL


zzzzzzzzzzzz = hello & thanks, yes i have paid attention to what people are telling me, and constructively working to better my threads and posts.
now if they could leave me to get on with it please, and no,..i dont have a problem one bit with you intervention, sir!.
now if we could get back to the topic of the thread please. 
thank you.




Seriously, the most constructive thing you could do, is to go and re-read all the threads you posted in (I'll wait, go ahead...) and see the OVERALL pattern there. Almost all of your neutral and lumen and vision related questions were answered at least a few times, a few different ways...and, yes, there are a lot of concepts to absorb....and, it DOES take time to absorb them....so, you WILL have an understandable learning curve.

The other thing you can do for the rest of the threads you are posting in....is to think about each post others have already made, and how it impacts what you already know, and, what they might indicate where you want to fill in missing gaps.

AFTER doing that, based upon the historical patterns you have already established...you will find that you may not need to ask the same questions that you had previously, as the information was already presented. You may find other questions that are not obvious though, and, use those questions to fill in your missing pieces.


Pretending to be falling asleep when being told something you would rather not hear is disrespectful, and sends a message that you only want to talk, but not listen and interpret....much as a teenager might behave. You might WANT to listen, and the zzzzzz's might be misrepresenting what you really feel, but, you are sending the wrong message.

We can't see if you're smiling or enraged or actually snoring when you type...so, your typed words are all we have to judge you. (If you can snore while typing, of course, that would be a fairly unique gift...)

If you don't want to be perceived as someone with the interpersonal and interpretive skills of a teenager....you may want to put a little more effort into these areas, to avoid us getting the wrong impression.


Lets return to our regularly schedule thread now.


----------



## neutralwhite

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

+1. 
many thanks, and I agree with you right there dear TEEJ.
BIG sorry to everyone about the Zzzzz's. 
if i go over my threads and posts, even I would be mad, really im sure. 

...forgive me.








TEEJ said:


> LOL
> 
> 
> zzzzzzzzzzzz = hello & thanks, yes i have paid attention to what people are telling me, and constructively working to better my threads and posts.
> now if they could leave me to get on with it please, and no,..i dont have a problem one bit with you intervention, sir!.
> now if we could get back to the topic of the thread please.
> thank you.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Seriously, the most constructive thing you could do, is to go and re-read all the threads you posted in (I'll wait, go ahead...) and see the OVERALL pattern there. Almost all of your neutral and lumen and vision related questions were answered at least a few times, a few different ways...and, yes, there are a lot of concepts to absorb....and, it DOES take time to absorb them....so, you WILL have an understandable learning curve.
> 
> The other thing you can do for the rest of the threads you are posting in....is to think about each post others have already made, and how it impacts what you already know, and, what they might indicate where you want to fill in missing gaps.
> 
> AFTER doing that, based upon the historical patterns you have already established...you will find that you may not need to ask the same questions that you had previously, as the information was already presented. You may find other questions that are not obvious though, and, use those questions to fill in your missing pieces.
> 
> 
> Pretending to be falling asleep when being told something you would rather not hear is disrespectful, and sends a message that you only want to talk, but not listen and interpret....much as a teenager might behave. You might WANT to listen, and the zzzzzz's might be misrepresenting what you really feel, but, you are sending the wrong message.
> 
> We can't see if you're smiling or enraged or actually snoring when you type...so, your typed words are all we have to judge you. (If you can snore while typing, of course, that would be a fairly unique gift...)
> 
> If you don't want to be perceived as someone with the interpersonal and interpretive skills of a teenager....you may want to put a little more effort into these areas, to avoid us getting the wrong impression.
> 
> 
> Lets return to our regularly schedule thread now.


----------



## mykhal

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

http://www.zebralight.com/SC600-Mk-II-18650-XM-L-900Lm-Flashlight_p_106.html


----------



## ormandj

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



mykhal said:


> http://www.zebralight.com/SC600-Mk-II-18650-XM-L-900Lm-Flashlight_p_106.html



Hopefully we'll see a neutral version soon. Thanks for the link!


----------



## Beckler

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

Been waiting for this for some time now! Will be my first 18650 light I think...was going to be the JB RRT21 but why would I get one that's half as bright? 

BTW, about the interface, why would they be omitting the ability to have a few more options? It's already programmable, so just let us choose which level it comes on at (on short click), and a few other things. Nobody agrees completely (nor should they) on the best arrangement of functions, so just let us choose. I really think it makes no sense to not have this...it would turn an already apparently good UI into an incredible one.


----------



## sbbsga

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*












MkI as reference


----------



## Cessquill

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

It does look like you could reverse that clip, and hence mount it on a cap.


----------



## sbbsga

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



Cessquill said:


> It does look like you could reverse that clip, and hence mount it on a cap.



Yes, one of the features that was carried forward from MkI.


----------



## Beckler

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

At 900 Lm surely this thing has the highest brightness:size ratio...


----------



## Overclocker

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

same crappy clip

no more screwed on bezel. this is most likely press fit SS bezel ala sc52

and i bet this is an integrated mcpcb/driver board like sc52 so goodbye easy emitter swaps

but the fuel gauge feature is a very nice improvement, i really like it on the sc52

so in the end it's 2 steps forward, 1 step back, 1 step sideways


----------



## phips

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

Is there a good reason that Zebralight does not use XM-L2 emitters?
Brightness and runtime will surely be impressive enough but they could possibly squeeze out another 10% performance.


----------



## Overclocker

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



phips said:


> Is there a good reason that Zebralight does not use XM-L2 emitters?
> Brightness and runtime will surely be impressive enough but they could possibly squeeze out another 10% performance.



because they don't need to. they still have technical superiority over all other competitors using just XML1 so by delaying XML2 they could extend the lifetime of the model. remember ZL is not like nitecore with a new model every week


----------



## sspc

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



Overclocker said:


> same crappy clip


Im probaly alone on this but I like the clip. I apprecaite clips that allow for bezel down pocket carry AND can be used on a hat with the business end facing forward. I really appreciate the Nitecore EC2 clip which does both of these things without having to be removed and flipped around.


----------



## neutralwhite

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

same!. 



sspc said:


> Im probaly alone on this but I like the clip. I apprecaite clips that allow for bezel down pocket carry AND can be used on a hat with the business end facing forward. I really appreciate the Nitecore EC2 clip which does both of these things without having to be removed and flipped around.


----------



## holylight

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

is on sale now!!


----------



## sspc

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



holylight said:


> is on sale now!!


Yep. See post #424.


----------



## markr6

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

LOL the SC600 MkII is going to have more separate threads than the EA4!


----------



## Tulip bush

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

So it's still not released yet?


----------



## Oufti

In the description they don't say (as for the earlier model) that the 900 lumens mode is a momentary turbo mode at startup... Will it be 900 lumens permanent ?


----------



## phips

I highly doubt that a constant 900 lumen would be thermally possible with the small head.


----------



## Tulip bush

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

I got the impression it was available, but not so?


----------



## ledmitter_nli

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



Tulip bush said:


> I got the impression it was available, but not so?



Estimated to ship in late March


----------



## cyclesport

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



Tulip bush said:


> I got the impression it was available, but not so?



Delete/sorry.


----------



## GordoJones88

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

Same crappy clip is gonna pop off and poke somebody's eye out.


----------



## Tulip bush

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

Thanks


----------



## neutralwhite

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

does the 'w' usually follow soon?.
thanks.


----------



## g.p.

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



sspc said:


> Im probaly alone on this but I like the clip. I apprecaite clips that allow for bezel down pocket carry AND can be used on a hat with the business end facing forward. I really appreciate the Nitecore EC2 clip which does both of these things without having to be removed and flipped around.



+1 I love this style of clip too for the same reasons...BUT I've tried it with the sc600 and it's too heavy for it to be practicle. Unless my cap is on tight enough to give me a headache it slow slides down due to the weight on the brim. 

Also, this clip sucks and isn't tight enough on the light. I spent a cold couple hours digging through my snowy front yard the one anly time I tried to rely on this clip. It didn't even make it to the mailbox and back before it let go.


----------



## Patriot

Oufti said:


> In the description they don't say (as for the earlier model) that the 900 lumens mode is a momentary turbo mode at startup... Will it be 900 lumens permanent ?



Of course not. Every manufacturer always states the highest output attainable, along with estimated run-times for each level.


----------



## BWX

Updated original post with pics and highly formatted info..


----------



## Sh3ngLong

Can't wait for this to be available on Amazon. I got a $75 gift card to spend. 


Sent from my Galaxy Note II


----------



## Oufti

Oufti said:


> In the description they don't say (as for the earlier model) that the 900 lumens mode is a momentary turbo mode at startup... Will it be 900 lumens permanent ?



They just updated their description, 900 lumens will indeed be the turbo mode for the first 5 minutes.


----------



## neutralwhite

way better than my old fenix pd32ue at 3 mins.
this is a great thing. 



Oufti said:


> They just updated their description, 900 lumens will indeed be the turbo mode for the first 5 minutes.


----------



## PocketBeam

Am I missing something? The SC600 has four high brightness levels, 750, 500, 330, and 200. But the new mark II has only three high brightness levels, 900, 500, and 270. That is counting Turbo. If we don't count Turbo, the new model still has one less high mode. This seems like a down grade? I am hoping there is another high mode not mentioned.

Best would be if your secondary high mode could be set to any available level, even L3. That way with mode memory a single short click could turn the light on at low. And a press and hold turn on, could be H2.


----------



## BWX

PocketBeam said:


> Am I missing something? The SC600 has four high brightness levels, 750, 500, 330, and 200. But the new mark II has only three high brightness levels, 900, 500, and 270. That is counting Turbo. If we don't count Turbo, the new model still has one less high mode. This seems like a down grade? I am hoping there is another high mode not mentioned.
> 
> Best would be if your secondary high mode could be set to any available level, even L3. That way with mode memory a single short click could turn the light on at low. And a press and hold turn on, could be H2.



It has two more low modes, and one more medium mode, so it looks like they sacrificed a high mode, but gained one extra medium mode, and two extra low modes.


edit- 
-by my count the MKI has 10 modes, and the MKII has 12. 
Or if you don't count the 500lm H1 mode after step down as a separate mode, then the MKI has 9 modes and the MKII has 11


----------



## oeL

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



neutralwhite said:


> does the 'w' usually follow soon?.



I have something in mind about the NW emitters not beeing available.

For the SC52W Zebralight told me:

_We'll release the SC52w in late March or early April. Don't know about the XM-L2 plans yet._

I'm so happy with my SC600W that I decided to left the cool white lights behind me. In the forests its like switching from black & white to color TV


----------



## neutralwhite

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

thanks, just wondered how fast the "w"'s come out after the normal CW.
thanks for that. will wait and see, but hope its not so long..




oeL said:


> I have something in mind about the NW emitters not beeing available.
> 
> For the SC52W Zebralight told me:
> 
> _We'll release the SC52w in late March or early April. Don't know about the XM-L2 plans yet._
> 
> I'm so happy with my SC600W that I decided to left the cool white lights behind me. In the forests its like switching from black & white to color TV


----------



## Beckler

neutralwhite said:


> way better than my old fenix pd32ue at 3 mins.
> this is a great thing.



Actually no, it's a disappointment. So the big upgrade for MkII is an extra 150Lm, which @750-900 you'll barely notice, for 5min? For cycling use then, there's no difference using the MkII, except the battery indicator which isn't usable in that application since it's poorly implemented.


----------



## neutralwhite

ohhhh. ok. hmmmm,...true. 



Beckler said:


> Actually no, it's a disappointment. So the big upgrade for MkII is an extra 150Lm, which @750-900 you'll barely notice, for 5min? For cycling use then, there's no difference using the MkII, except the battery indicator which isn't usable in that application since it's poorly implemented.


----------



## AussieRanga

Beckler said:


> Actually no, it's a disappointment. So the big upgrade for MkII is an extra 150Lm, which @750-900 you'll barely notice, for 5min? For cycling use then, there's no difference using the MkII, except the battery indicator which isn't usable in that application since it's poorly implemented.



You're assuming that the driver isn't more efficient proving longer runtimes for an equivalent level compared to its' predecessor. 

I think it's easy to see the spec's on the ZL site aren't completed yet so nobody can conclude just how much of an improvement this newer version will be.

As far as a disappointment? Given the fact the new low modes are definitely going to be a useful addition and compared to PD32, the size, max output, runtime and overall fell will more than likely be superior so I hardly feel that to be disappointing..

Do I think it will warrant an immediate purchase to replace my Mk 1? No, not for me but only because I am in the process of building an engine which is currently taking enough of my funds!


----------



## shelm

Beckler said:


> Actually no, it's a disappointmen



+ 1

EagleTac T20C2 MkII XM-L2 U2: *681 *ANSI ET lumens
Zebralight SC600 MkII XM-L U3: "*900*" ANSI ZL lumens
EagleTac TX25C2 XM-L2 U2: *965 *ANSI ET lumens
Eagtac G25C2 MkII XM-L2 U2: *980 *ANSI ET lumens

The TX25C2 XM-L2 is being reviewed now by selfbuilt.
Also note that ZL Co. uses rounded numbers. I don't believe in the "900" to be exact. Maybe they measured a range of 840-880 and then decided to write "900" on the webpage 

Just kidding.


----------



## GunnarGG

Beckler said:


> For cycling use then, there's no difference using the MkII...



I guess you mean compared to mkI.
Compared to PD32 there is a huge difference. 

About delivery, I saw here or some other SC600 thread a question regarding delivery time.
I ordered a H502d febr 13, in the order confirmation mail they said that they wouldn't process the order until febr 15 due to the chinese new year.
On febr 16 I got the shipping notification and febr 22 I had the light in my hand.
That is pretty good.

So, as long as they get the lights manufactured it doesn't take to long to get them to the customer.


----------



## Beckler

GunnarGG said:


> I guess you mean compared to mkI.
> Compared to PD32 there is a huge difference.



Yes I did mean compared to Mk I. Anyone seen a comparison of step down times for current lights? The TX25C2 for example has a 200s (3min) time, but it's only about a 950-750 reduction. Speaking of that light, I would really consider it but it simply doesn't have enough brightness levels...750-450-7 doesn't make much sense IMO.


----------



## neutralwhite

so ZL are saying (in the red) that low level lumen ratings on both the MkII's will be exact right?. 
cos looking back at the old sc600 and sc600w, there are differences in say the lower levels, L1 & L2. the CW has more options at low levels.
how would you interpret that answer?.

and "we added more features of the sc600MkII" .

such as?.
??


thanks.


*Customer*
2/26/2013 2:14:27 AMI notice with the new cool white sc600mkII there are more options on low 1 and low 2. 

would this be the same options on the sc600w MkII as well?. im looking for the exact same options on low 1 & 2, but on the neutral version. 

as I see with your previous sc600w, there are not as much options on L1, and L2 compared to now the new but cool white sc600MkII.

thanks.




*Staff (Administrator)*
2/26/2013 5:01:38 AMTo your first question, yes, the SC600w MkII will have exactly the same UI (and all the levels) as the SC600 MkII. 
To your second question, yes, we added more features to the SC600 MkII.


----------



## carl

From ZL Website:
M1 90Lm (tbd) 
M2 27Lm (tbd) / 9Lm (tbd) 
L1 3Lm (tbd) or
L2 0.6Lm (tbd) / 0.1Lm (tbd) / 0.02Lm (tbd) 

I prefer all levels bumped up a bit: 
M1 150Lm 
M2 27Lm
L1 10Lm
L2 3Lm or .2Lm

What's with the .02Lm? Would the majority of users want to go that low?


----------



## neutralwhite

thanks, compared to fenix pd32ue, these levels and yours are more true to life. 

I just put in an order in for it.
thanks


----------



## joelbnyc

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



BWX said:


> Eagletac defective D25LC2 clicky x2 right off the bat- the third one in use but flickers on high/ loosened mode, so I got the SC600
> Zebralight Defective x6 - 5 defective H501, yes 5.. one defective SC600 so far.
> Spark- 3 defective SL6-800CW - current one is in sock drawer, defective $100 paperweight from GG.



That's disheartening, I'm deciding on first 18650 purchase. GG didn't replace the defective lights? Are we permitted to discuss retail distributors here?

Btw this whole thread is interesting and often hilarious...


----------



## neutralwhite

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

well when i ordered, i made clear on the order note, and paypal message to 'quality control' check it again all over properly before delivery or its been sent back for a full refund & im heading back to fenix!.


----------



## BWX

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



joelbnyc said:


> That's disheartening, I'm deciding on first 18650 purchase. GG didn't replace the defective lights? Are we permitted to discuss retail distributors here?
> 
> Btw this whole thread is interesting and often hilarious...


No, GG replaced it, but the replacement (that they tested while I was on the phone with them before they sent it), did the exact same thing. So I gave up.. I like GG though, I don't think they did anything wrong on purpose.

I never sent my defective SC600 back to the guy I bought it from here on CPMK even though he said he would replace it. I'm just using it as is and work around the malfunction as everything else works fine. It won't cycle past turbo properly while holding power button, but everything else is great. I set H2 to 330lm and then just double click to get to turbo 750lm mode then double click to go back to 330lm H2 and use it like that. It cycles past H2 mode fine, and even cycles past 750lm H1 turbo mode with a short click. I like the tint and output, so I'm keeping it. if it fails in some other way I will send it back to ZL.


----------



## PocketBeam

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

I notice the Zebralight website still doesn't list runtime for each mode. I assume this is because they don't have a production version to test. I don't know how Zebralight has done things with other models, and what is normal for them. What is the chance that the March 22 date will be delayed? What are the chances the current specs will change, e.g. brighter lumens?

Can someone give best calculated runtime guesses?


----------



## neutralwhite

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

+1. not so sure this march 22 will happen. hope so. 



PocketBeam said:


> I notice the Zebralight website still doesn't list runtime for each mode. I assume this is because they don't have a production version to test. I don't know how Zebralight has done things with other models, and what is normal for them. What is the chance that the March 22 date will be delayed? What are the chances the current specs will change, e.g. brighter lumens?
> 
> Can someone give best calculated runtime guesses?


----------



## Coolz

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

Maybe… they have reconsidered a few things, like, perhaps using a new emitter? *cough* XM-L2 *cough* I know, I know.


----------



## PocketBeam

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

As for brighter, my thinking is 900 is 20% more than 750. So maybe when they get a production version, they will test it and get a higher value. Maybe not. I just hope there are no problems with the production run. Shouldn't be any as it is the SC52 circuit in the same SC600 body.


----------



## TEEJ

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*

IIRC, the 750 was lower than actual on the last SC600's anyway, so the 900 L is not going to be night and day over whatever the 750+ L was actually at.

IE: For the money, if looking for a small handy floody light, the new 900 L version is a sweet deal. If you already have the 750+ L version, I'm not sure its worth it to upgrade. I'm upgrading anyway...because I'm like that, but not because I think it makes sense. (To be fair, people keep borrowing my SC600's...so spares are my real motive)


----------



## xed888

TEEJ said:


> IIRC, the 750 was lower than actual on the last SC600's anyway, so the 900 L is not going to be night and day over whatever the 750+ L was actually at.
> 
> IE: For the money, if looking for a small handy floody light, the new 900 L version is a sweet deal. If you already have the 750+ L version, I'm not sure its worth it to upgrade. I'm upgrading anyway...because I'm like that, but not because I think it makes sense. (To be fair, people keep borrowing my SC600's...so spares are my real motive)



I think selfbuilt tested it to be 750 lumens on the dot. Check out his review


----------



## Philonous

Right now getting an SC52 is my priority, since my SC51 was stolen (I was an idiot, forgot to take it off my bike). But whilst the new innards on this are nice, the real benefit for me would be the size and weight reductions. I edc the Mk I, and it's a great light, but for my purposes the biggest improvement would be to make it a bit shorter. It's fine as is, but in a pocket that little bit of extra room will make things easier. And I'm a fan of easier.


----------



## BWX

My U2 version SC600 is definitely brighter than 750 lumens on turbo. I bet it is closer to 800+ just comparing it my Eagletac D25LC2.


----------



## fnj

The reason for me, a Mk I owner, to want one of these Mk IIs is the battery level readout. Period. And it will be WELL worth it.


----------



## PocketBeam

Isn't the mark II the U2 version, thus 900 lumens? Or is it brighter because of the new circuit?

I have this on pre-order. I agree, you won't see 750-900 lumen difference. But I don't have the SC600. I do have the SC52 with 14500, so I get 500 lumens. So I will see the difference. Plus I get a bigger reflector, and longer run times. I do like the battery gauge. I wish it had more detail or levels, but maybe it would flash too much and take too long. I use the battery gauge to tell me when to change batteries. Much better then trying to remember how much you have used it.

Two weeks to go...


----------



## fnj

PocketBeam said:


> Isn't the mark II the U2 version, thus 900 lumens? Or is it brighter because of the new circuit?
> 
> I have this on pre-order. I agree, you won't see 750-900 lumen difference. But I don't have the SC600. I do have the SC52 with 14500, so I get 500 lumens. So I will see the difference. Plus I get a bigger reflector, and longer run times. I do like the battery gauge. I wish it had more detail or levels, but maybe it would flash too much and take too long. I use the battery gauge to tell me when to change batteries. Much better then trying to remember how much you have used it.
> 
> Two weeks to go...



The LF2XT had the cat's meow of a battery gauge. Click it 5 times fast and it blinks out the voltage down to two decimal places. I love the LF2XT and have despaired of anything ever matching it for what it is.


----------



## PocketBeam

I know some like the battery gauge that blinks out the voltage, but I prefer a gauge I don't have to decode. Not to mention showing voltage means a lot of blinks, and time. But I do see the advantage to knowing the voltage.

So I like the battery gauge on the SC600, just wish it showed maybe six levels, with a slightly faster blink rate. Any way, don't want to derail with a which is better discussion.


----------



## neutralwhite

hi - what would be the intensity of the MkII CW? 
like for instance my old fenix pd32ue was 6000ckd if im right, so with the SCMkII being like some 900 lumens (150 or so lumens more), how much would that be?. 

how much more intense would the brightness be?.
thank you.


----------



## holylight

neutralwhite said:


> hi - what would be the intensity of the MkII CW?
> like for instance my old fenix pd32ue was 6000ckd if im right, so with the SCMkII being like some 900 lumens (150 or so lumens more), how much would that be?.
> 
> how much more intense would the brightness be?.
> thank you.



it be not much brighter. the big question I have is how long can it run at 900 Lm before it turn hot!! keep my finger cross


----------



## PocketBeam

neutralwhite said:


> hi - what would be the intensity of the MkII CW?
> like for instance my old fenix pd32ue was 6000ckd if im right, so with the SCMkII being like some 900 lumens (150 or so lumens more), how much would that be?.
> 
> how much more intense would the brightness be?.
> thank you.



You can't compare candela to lumen. Lumen measures total brightness, everything combined. Candela measure brightness in only one specific spot, just the brightest part of the beam. Considure a 60 watt light bulb with and without a reflector around it. They both have the same lumens since the total brightness didn't change, but the candela in one direction becomes a lot brighter with the reflector.

Some lights have a deep reflector that have higher candela than shallow reflectors. So they can throw a beam farther, but the spot will be smaller. To small a spot and it is not useful. Think of a high candela laser beam, throws for miles but not very useful in a flashlight. 

So you really need to see the beam shot to know how those lumens are used.


----------



## neutralwhite

many thanks, 



PocketBeam said:


> You can't compare candela to lumen. Lumen measures total brightness, everything combined. Candela measure brightness in only one specific spot, just the brightest part of the beam. Considure a 60 watt light bulb with and without a reflector around it. They both have the same lumens since the total brightness didn't change, but the candela in one direction becomes a lot brighter with the reflector.
> 
> Some lights have a deep reflector that have higher candela than shallow reflectors. So they can throw a beam farther, but the spot will be smaller. To small a spot and it is not useful. Think of a high candela laser beam, throws for miles but not very useful in a flashlight.
> 
> So you really need to see the beam shot to know how those lumens are used.


----------



## PocketBeam

holylight said:


> it be not much brighter. the big question I have is how long can it run at 900 Lm before it turn hot!! keep my finger cross



The web page says five minutes at 900 lumens before it steps down. I would assume that is around when it gets too warm.


----------



## holylight

PocketBeam said:


> The web page says five minutes at 900 lumens before it steps down. I would assume that is around when it gets too warm.



5 minutes is good enough. sc52 get hot in 1 minute ( with 14500 ) . but however I still love it


----------



## PocketBeam

I think the mark II light levels are messed up. As I mentioned before it shows one less high level mode than the original. But I also noticed the original shows a five minute turbo of 750 lumens dropping to 500 lumens. The mark II shows the five minute turbo of 900 lumens but dropping to the same 500 lumens. I think this is a mistake.

Assuming a 20% gain, as the 750 to 900 is, it should drop to 600 lumens.

Does that sound correct?


----------



## mauiblue

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



holylight said:


> is on sale now!!



I just placed my pre order in tonight. Yippee!  Looking forward in getting it and enjoying a new torch at where I work (night time security work at a large storage warehouse facility).


----------



## holylight

mauiblue said:


> I just placed my pre order in tonight. Yippee!  Looking forward in getting it and enjoying a new torch at where I work (night time security work at a large storage warehouse facility).



congrats ! keep our finger cross for a worthy light


----------



## maroast

PocketBeam said:


> I think the mark II light levels are messed up. As I mentioned before it shows one less high level mode than the original. But I also noticed the original shows a five minute turbo of 750 lumens dropping to 500 lumens. The mark II shows the five minute turbo of 900 lumens but dropping to the same 500 lumens. I think this is a mistake.
> 
> Assuming a 20% gain, as the 750 to 900 is, it should drop to 600 lumens.
> 
> Does that sound correct?




I don't think it works that way exactly. I believe the led/circuit step down is a function that protects the light from excess heat. Sure the light can run at 600 lumens... But it will be difficult to manage the heat. 

Also, I don't see any reason why the SC52 with its XML emitter and a 4.2v Li-ion battery (just like the SC 600) can't put out 750-900 lumens just like the SC600 .... But zebralight limited the output to 500lumens for 1min with a step down to 280 lumens because a light of this size can't manage the heat from 500+ lumens very efficiently....it would decrease the life of the light.


----------



## WmArnold1

maroast said:


> I don't think it works that way exactly. I believe the led/circuit step down is a function that protects the light from excess heat. Sure the light can run at 600 lumens... But it will be difficult to manage the heat...



I respectfully disagree; ZL isn't driving the LED thermally harder to reach 900 lm, they're just using LEDs with improved efficacy; upgrading from XM-L (T6/U2) to either XM-L (U3) or XM-L2 (U2) [we can only guess which one] Imho, the 750 lm legacy was from a XM-L (T6) and there was a un-spec'd bump when ZL started using XM-L (U2)'s.

Anyway, back on topic; the thermal step-down level of the MkII should also enjoy the same 20% efficacy gain that PocketBeam predicts - but, it's still pure speculation until we get one.


----------



## PocketBeam

Thanks for the conformation. As for the U2 or U3, they did say this back in December about it, "900Lm max ANSI (SC600's 750Lm rating is based on T6 LEDs. Most SC600s shipped actually come with U2 LEDs) with more efficient driver/LED.".

Still not 100%... I hope it is a U3 with even higher output, or same output but longer runtimes.


----------



## neutralwhite

U3 would be good. 
same output, longer runtimes. 


PocketBeam said:


> Thanks for the conformation. As for the U2 or U3, they did say this back in December about it, "900Lm max ANSI (SC600's 750Lm rating is based on T6 LEDs. Most SC600s shipped actually come with U2 LEDs) with more efficient driver/LED.".
> 
> Still not 100%... I hope it is a U3 with even higher output, or same output but longer runtimes.


----------



## PocketBeam

Well, if they switched to a XM-L2 then the XM-L2 U2 would be brighter than the XM-L U3. Also afaik the XM-L2 U2 just came out in Dec 2012, and is the highest they make right now.

Also I noticed the XML2's are binned, or tested, at 85C, or 185F. So if I understand that correctly, I don't have to worry about my flashlight over heating.


----------



## RobCob

Ya I'm not sure why they aren't releasing it with XM-L2 instead of the U2 emmiter. Not sure why Zebralight waits so long to update their lights as evident with the lack of upgrade on this light and the sc52 to the new XM-L2 and no lights featuring XP-G2 either.


----------



## blackFFM

If they are not switching to the XM-L2 what will the sc600w MK II will be like? Will it feature a XM-L T6 or what? I don't know if this light is still on my list. No more cool white for me so I obviously have to wait even longer.


----------



## BWX

I am sure if the L2 isn't in there at launch, it will be sooner or later down the road, or maybe the U3 or whatever.

Look at the MKI I just bought a couple months ago, it didn't launch with the U2, but my MKI has a very bright and efficient U2 LED in there.


----------



## twl

blackFFM said:


> If they are not switching to the XM-L2 what will the sc600w MK II will be like? Will it feature a XM-L T6 or what? I don't know if this light is still on my list. No more cool white for me so I obviously have to wait even longer.



The last report was that it will be a XML-U3, and that most of the Mk1 models shipped with U2. 
No XM-L2 has been mentioned.
Surely they will eventually switch over to it at some point. No mention of when.


----------



## holylight

Countdown, 1 more week before pre order shipping. Guess will get mine between early to mid April.


----------



## Cessquill

holylight said:


> Countdown, 1 more week before pre order shipping. Guess will get mine between early to mid April.


Dang - I thought you'd snagged one then!

Being a newb to this, I'm oscillating between an SC600 mkII and an SC52 as an EDC. Part of me thinks that the SC600 might take a few months to work out kinks and become readily available; the other part tells me to stop being so impatient and go for the higher power. The third part tells me to get both.

As mentioned, I wish ZL would employ a version or release number if they're going to upgrade the same unit during its life cycle. I appreciate that it's common practice to tweak designs and seek better parts, but in other areas these are normally invisible to the consumer (eg, the Xbox picking different graphics chips). It would seem that Zebralight's changes are quite significant.


----------



## neutralwhite

hi, i would get both and use the SC52w for pocket.



Cessquill said:


> Dang - I thought you'd snagged one then!
> 
> Being a newb to this, I'm oscillating between an SC600 mkII and an SC52 as an EDC. Part of me thinks that the SC600 might take a few months to work out kinks and become readily available; the other part tells me to stop being so impatient and go for the higher power. The third part tells me to get both.
> 
> As mentioned, I wish ZL would employ a version or release number if they're going to upgrade the same unit during its life cycle. I appreciate that it's common practice to tweak designs and seek better parts, but in other areas these are normally invisible to the consumer (eg, the Xbox picking different graphics chips). It would seem that Zebralight's changes are quite significant.


----------



## holylight

Cessquill said:


> Dang - I thought you'd snagged one then!
> 
> Being a newb to this, I'm oscillating between an SC600 mkII and an SC52 as an EDC. Part of me thinks that the SC600 might take a few months to work out kinks and become readily available; the other part tells me to stop being so impatient and go for the higher power. The third part tells me to get both.
> 
> As mentioned, I wish ZL would employ a version or release number if they're going to upgrade the same unit during its life cycle. I appreciate that it's common practice to tweak designs and seek better parts, but in other areas these are normally invisible to the consumer (eg, the Xbox picking different graphics chips). It would seem that Zebralight's changes are quite significant.



“Listen to the quietest whispers of your mind. They are telling you the choices that will help you the most.”


----------



## PocketBeam

twl said:


> The last report was that it will be a XML-U3, and that most of the Mk1 models shipped with U2.
> No XM-L2 has been mentioned.



Is there a source link for this? Just wondering how reliable the information is, and if anything else was said. As for updating, Zebralight has stated on the mk I site that by the end most came with the U2 led. So they must upgrade when they produce a new batch. Too bad we don't know when that happens.

Cessquill, I edc the SC52, and love it. I carry it clipped on the inside of my front pants pocket. I don't even notice it is there. I have the SC600 mk II on order. It is bigger, so I am not sure it will work so well in my front pocket. So think of the size and how you will carry it.

I use/will use li-ion in both. So it will be a 500 to 900 lumen jump. But also a jump from one minute to five minutes on that turbo high mode. I have noticed one minute is enough for a lot of things, but sometimes I need it to last longer. I think five minutes will cover most jobs. If it doesn't, it still drops to the SC52 turbo high level.

I think for me, that both will have their place.

As for working out the bugs, well Zebralight will stand behind the light. The just fixed the button on my H51. Also the electronic chip is not really new as it is the same design as the SC52. The body style is not new. In fact they call it the mark II because this is just a updated version.


----------



## twl

PocketBeam said:


> Is there a source link for this? Just wondering how reliable the information is, and if anything else was said. As for updating, Zebralight has stated on the mk I site that by the end most came with the U2 led. So they must upgrade when they produce a new batch. Too bad we don't know when that happens.
> 
> Cessquill, I edc the SC52, and love it. I carry it clipped on the inside of my front pants pocket. I don't even notice it is there. I have the SC600 mk II on order. It is bigger, so I am not sure it will work so well in my front pocket. So think of the size and how you will carry it.
> 
> I use/will use li-ion in both. So it will be a 500 to 900 lumen jump. But also a jump from one minute to five minutes on that turbo high mode. I have noticed one minute is enough for a lot of things, but sometimes I need it to last longer. I think five minutes will cover most jobs. If it doesn't, it still drops to the SC52 turbo high level.
> 
> I think for me, that both will have their place.
> 
> As for working out the bugs, well Zebralight will stand behind the light. The just fixed the button on my H51. Also the electronic chip is not really new as it is the same design as the SC52. The body style is not new. In fact they call it the mark II because this is just a updated version.



It's been talked about quite a bit on this thread, and it apparently was from Zebralight.
The "upgrade" will be to the XML-U3, according to what has been posted by others here.

I think if you go back through the pages of this thread, you will find out the source of the information. It didn't come from me.

Edit:
Go to post #153 of this thread, where member "Moozoh" states that Lillian(Zebralight) told him that it will be a U3.
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?349198-ZebraLight-SC600-MkII/page6


----------



## PocketBeam

Thanks twl. So the XM-L U3 seems confirmed, at least as of mid December or three months ago. 

I thought the post right above it was interesting. Zebralight says most problems are caused by people putting batteries in that are too long.


----------



## kaichu dento

Cessquill said:


> Being a newb to this, I'm oscillating between an SC600 mkII and an SC52 as an EDC. Part of me thinks that the SC600 might take a few months to work out kinks and become readily available; the other part tells me to stop being so impatient and go for the higher power. The third part tells me to get both.


It sounds like you're only interested in the SC52 because it's available now and if that is the case, and you think you need the higher power, then I'd say to wait for the SC600 MkII. 
There is also the size factor to take into account and if you have no problem with the larger light then it's still probably the one to go with, but if you'd like something slimmer for slipping into your pocket and not looking so bulky, the SC52 is going to be an excellent light for those purposes, and I'll risk saying it, probably better for most people in all reality.


----------



## Cessquill

PocketBeam said:


> Cessquill, I edc the SC52, and love it. I carry it clipped on the inside of my front pants pocket. I don't even notice it is there. I have the SC600 mk II on order. It is bigger, so I am not sure it will work so well in my front pocket. So think of the size and how you will carry it.


Thanks, and to kaichu dento. I wear a Scott-e-vest most of the time that could easily accommodate an SC600 without it being noticeable or heavy. Since it will, I may as well hold out - just being impatient. Will probably end up with both anyhow, knowing me. Thanks again.


----------



## Streak

I have edc'd the SC51/52 since it came out. What I like is that it is very light and can be held between your lips for hands free use which I do often.
The SC600 is a bit heavy to do this with unless you have really strong lips!


----------



## JetskiMark

Streak said:


> I have edc'd the SC51/52 since it came out. What I like is that it is very light and can be held between your lips for hands free use which I do often.
> The SC600 is a bit heavy to do this with unless you have really strong lips!



Funny. It sounds like you need to EDC a headlamp.


----------



## TEEJ

JetskiMark said:


> Funny. It sounds like you need to EDC a headlamp.



LOL

My thought too.

The places I go, there's no WAY I would consider my mouth as a prehensile organ...I'd be too worried about what wee beasties I'd be introducing into my system.

Heck, even just putting a hand into a pocket transplants what's on the hands to the pocket...and to what's in the pocket, and then into my mouth in that case. 



:eeew:


----------



## neutralwhite

you know, if I compared the new SC600 MkII 900 Lumens to a 340 Lumens Fenix PD32 G2, would there be a BIG difference in brightness?. 
would it be over double the brightness of the pd32?. the pd32g2 intensity is 5950ccd if that helps.
wondering if the brightness would stand out double and more to 340 lumens.
thanks.


----------



## JetskiMark

Yet after reading Streak's post, I immediately wrapped my lips around my SC52.

Good thing I'm not germ-phobic.

I'll stick with my H600w.

And I'm now drinking a hot cup of coffee to kill anything I might have just ingested. Or to keep it wide awake.

Back on topic, I really hope an SC600w MkII becomes available soon.


----------



## TEEJ

neutralwhite said:


> you know, if I compared the new SC600 MkII 900 Lumens to a 340 Lumens Fenix PD32 G2, would there be a BIG difference in brightness?.
> would it be over double the brightness of the pd32?. the pd32g2 intensity is 5950ccd if that helps.
> wondering if the brightness would stand out double and more to 340 lumens.
> thanks.



You'd be able to SEE MORE than with the dimmer light.

Sometimes, humans suck at being able to judge brightness from say a white wall type setting, as we have no reference points.

We CAN see more stuff though, so in a target-rich environment, say a stand of trees, etc, you will see more trees and more details, with a light that's even a little brighter...even if you can't tell the difference just shining the two beams on a wall or onto the ground, etc.


----------



## neutralwhite

thanks Teej. 



TEEJ said:


> You'd be able to SEE MORE than with the dimmer light.
> 
> Sometimes, humans suck at being able to judge brightness from say a white wall type setting, as we have no reference points.
> 
> We CAN see more stuff though, so in a target-rich environment, say a stand of trees, etc, you will see more trees and more details, with a light that's even a little brighter...even if you can't tell the difference just shining the two beams on a wall or onto the ground, etc.


----------



## g.p.

JetskiMark said:


> Funny. It sounds like you need to EDC a headlamp.


I wish that the SC52 had a reversible clip like the sc600. That way it could be mounted on the brim of a hat in a pinch. Way better than holding it in your mouth. That would make it the perfect edc IMO. Until then my Lumapower Trust 1 will still be my dedicated edc at work. I tried mounting the sc600 on my hat brim, but it was too heavy.


----------



## mauiblue

Streak said:


> I have edc'd the SC51/52 since it came out. What I like is that it is very light and can be held between your lips for hands free use which I do often.
> The SC600 is a bit heavy to do this with unless you have really strong lips!



I would get the optional head band from Zebralight if I needed to go hands free. I think the SC51/52 would fit in the head band holder. 

Sent from my DROID RAZR MAXX using Tapatalk 2


----------



## PocketBeam

g.p. said:


> I wish that the SC52 had a reversible clip like the sc600. That way it could be mounted on the brim of a hat in a pinch. Way better than holding it in your mouth. That would make it the perfect edc IMO.



The clip from my H51 fits the SC52 perfectly. And you can reverse it. I have been using the H51 clip for several weeks now, because it is easier to clip into my pants pocket.


----------



## g.p.

mauiblue said:


> I would get the optional head band from Zebralight if I needed to go hands free. I think the SC51/52 would fit in the head band holder.
> 
> Sent from my DROID RAZR MAXX using Tapatalk 2


My SC51 came with a headband, but the non-H model of lights need to be mounted with the light on one side of your head in order to point forward. This allows very little up and down adjustment and your head blocks all of the light on one side. I have an H51 at work and it's 100% better for use in the headband.



PocketBeam said:


> The clip from my H51 fits the SC52 perfectly. And you can reverse it. I have been using the H51 clip for several weeks now, because it is easier to clip into my pants pocket.


Thanks for the tip! I'll give that try since I don't use the clip on my H51.


----------



## GordoJones88

TEEJ said:


> The places I go, there's no WAY I would consider my mouth as a prehensile organ...I'd be too worried about what wee beasties I'd be introducing into my system.
> 
> Heck, even just putting a hand into a pocket transplants what's on the hands to the pocket...and to what's in the pocket, and then into my mouth in that case.



Sometimes I stick it up a nostril and other times I hold it in my mouth.


----------



## Samy

LOL awesome thread. Just stick in your eye like a monicle, call yourself a Borg


----------



## chukar

*Re: Zebralight SC600 MKII info*



GordoJones88 said:


> Same crappy clip is gonna pop off and poke somebody's eye out.



I don't like the clip either, seems like it will just pop off too often, but maybe not I'll see when I finally own this one.


----------



## EZO

g.p. said:


> My SC51 came with a headband, but the non-H model of lights need to be mounted with the light on one side of your head in order to point forward. This allows very little up and down adjustment and your head blocks all of the light on one side. I have an H51 at work and it's 100% better for use in the headband.



I've used my SC51w with the headband a few times and I find that if you make sure to aim it in the same direction as your eyes are naturally looking and adjust it to point towards the center of your field of view it works quite well. That way it lights up anything you are looking at. 

A side mounted headlamp worked pretty well for Aki from "Final Fantasy - The Spirits Within"....remember? (Wish I could get one of those. There's a scene in the film where she practically lights up a whole city block with it.)


----------



## neutralwhite

to ZL;

Subject: XML U2/U3 with a 1C tint ?.

..hello. what emitter and tint is in the new SC600MkII please?.
XML U2/U3 with a 1C tint ?.



*Staff (Administrator)*
3/18/2013 12:00:52 AMXM-L U3, either 1C or 1D tint (but recent batches are all with 1C).


----------



## jeffkruse

So if I understand this correctly the SC600MKII will not have an XML-2 emitter? I thought using the new XML-2 was all the rage. 
Is the XML-U3 the same as an XML-2 T6? What would you rather have, a XML-U3 or XML-2 T6? Why can’t it have an XML-2 U2?


----------



## shelm

jeffkruse said:


> So if I understand this correctly the SC600MKII will not have an XML-2 emitter? I thought using the new XML-2 was all the rage.
> Is the XML-U3 the same as an XML-2 T6? What would you rather have, a XML-U3 or XML-2 T6? Why can’t it have an XML-2 U2?



omg


----------



## neutralwhite

lol,..OMG what?.




shelm said:


> omg


----------



## blackFFM

jeffkruse said:


> So if I understand this correctly the SC600MKII will not have an XML-2 emitter? I thought using the new XML-2 was all the rage.
> Is the XML-U3 the same as an XML-2 T6? What would you rather have, a XML-U3 or XML-2 T6? Why can’t it have an XML-2 U2?



XM-L2 T6 is used for neutral white tints, XM-L2 U2 for cool white. XM-L U3 is cool white and nothing like XM-L2 T6. Maybe they are just equally bright. Nobody says it can't have a XM-L2 U2. Zebralight won't just use it because they wanna stick to the "old" XM-L. Nobody knows why because it makes no sense after 3 month of delay.


----------



## fnj

One word. Inventory. You buy a bunch of XM-Ls and you have them inventoried, you don't throw them all away just because something newer comes along.


----------



## blackFFM

fnj said:


> One word. Inventory. You buy a bunch of XM-Ls and you have them inventoried, you don't throw them all away just because something newer comes along.




Somehow other manufacturers get to manage the switch to the newer emitters without any problems. The XM-L2 is around for some time, sc600 MKII was announced 3 months ago. Can't imagine their XM-L U3 are laying around half a year. They can still put them in their sc52.


----------



## PocketBeam

I don't think just using the latest bin is so simple. What about time to test it with your thermal design and circuits? Theoretical should always be tested. The more testing, the better the QC. Also I assume there are order lead times, minimum orders, order problems, etc. It is what it is.

From the Flashlight wiki
Cree XM-L LED with 6 yellow strips and 3 brass bonding wires
Cree XM-L 
Bin	700mA	1000mA 1500mA	3000mA
T2 200-220 275-303 390-429 650-715
T3 220-240 303-330 429-468 715-780
T4 240-260 330-358 468-507 780-845
T5 260-280 358-385 507-546 845-910
T6 280-300 385-413 546-585 910-975
U2 300-320 413-440 585-624 975-1040
U3* 320-340 440-468 624-663 1040-1105

Cree XM-L2
Cree XM-L2 (at 25°C) 
Bin 700mA	1000mA 1500mA 3000mA
S4 186-196 256-268 360-377 612-641
S5 196-207 268-284 377-400 641-679
S6 207-227 284-313 400-439 679-746
T2 227-250 313-343 439-483 746-820
T3 250-273 343-375 483-528 820-895
T4 273-296 375-406 528-571 895-970
T5 296-318 406-438 571-615 970-1044
T6 318-341 438-468 615-659 1044-1119
U2* 341-364 468-500 659-703 1119-1193


----------



## Cessquill

Thanks guys for advice re SC52 / SC600 - much appreciated to a newcomer. Laziness kind of forced my hand, since the only place I found in the UK with stock of the SC52 has now sold out.

Have spent time reading up about LED types (XM-L and the like was confusing me). Give it a few days and we'll know either way whether the SC600 is out.

I have seen one online store offering the SC600w mkII - however, they said it was speculation at this point, and were hoping to know more in April. You can add it to your basket, which is odd for what isn't officially vapourware yet - http://www.illuminationgear.com/14301/354482.html


----------



## GordoJones88

I don't think you guys understand.

Zebralight will announce the XM-L2 U2 SC600 MKII the day after you buy the XM-L U3 version.


----------



## Streak

TEEJ said:


> LOL
> 
> My thought too.
> 
> The places I go, there's no WAY I would consider my mouth as a prehensile organ...I'd be too worried about what wee beasties I'd be introducing into my system.
> 
> Heck, even just putting a hand into a pocket transplants what's on the hands to the pocket...and to what's in the pocket, and then into my mouth in that case.
> 
> 
> 
> :eeew:




LOL, problem is that I have the headband it came with but I dont EDC the headband, only the light! Must be my Zimbabwean upbringing and living in South Africa that's made me immune to all of the germs.

I must say in general that I really love the UI of the Zebralights in particular instant access to both dim and bright from the off position. I can not understand why none of the other manufacturers out there who are notorious for borrowing ideas have not even tried to copy this feature.


----------



## juplin

The reliability of the button of old SC600/W is very bad. The button of my two old SC600/W will go crazy sometimes, but will be back to normal shortly. I don't trust the button of old SC600 series. Hope the button of new SC600 MkII will be improved.


----------



## PocketBeam

juplin said:


> The reliability of the button of old SC600/W is very bad. The button of my two old SC600/W will go crazy sometimes, but will be back to normal shortly. I don't trust the button of old SC600 series. Hope the button of new SC600 MkII will be improved.



Contact Zebralight and have it repaired. They fixed the button on my H51.


----------



## Cessquill

ZL site appears to have gone down whilst I was looking at it. Could be nothing.


----------



## GunnarGG

Cessquill said:


> ZL site appears to have gone down whilst I was looking at it. Could be nothing.



Works for me


----------



## Cessquill

GunnarGG said:


> Works for me


Yeah. Came back up after about five minutes. Was idly hoping they were publishing some updates. Might have just been a crash/reboot.

As you were.


----------



## thaugen

I wonder if today is the day the SC600 MkII will ship?


----------



## derfyled

GordoJones88 said:


> I don't think you guys understand.
> 
> Zebralight will announce the XM-L2 U2 SC600 MKII the day after you buy the XM-L U3 version.



That's exactly what I think they will do. Releasing other flavor later on (neutral, high-cri) is also part of the marketing gimmick.


----------



## Beckler

thaugen said:


> I wonder if today is the day the SC600 MkII will ship?



I wonder how long it will take them to update the Mar. 22 date on their site to a later date. The SC600 (MkI) page still mentions "next month" (from Dec. 2012) as the release date. This is just my opinion, but when companies don't take the time to ensure their website is always updated and accurate, it's very clumsy and unprofessional.


----------



## markr6

Beckler said:


> This is just my opinion, but when companies don't take the time to ensure their website is always updated and accurate, it's very clumsy and unprofessional.




My opinion as well! Same with Facebook and other social media sites...I believe the expression is "**** or get off the pot"


----------



## ghodan

How many candela comes out of the ZebraLight SC600 MkII if measured the same way/standard as Nitecore and Fenix measure it?


----------



## joelbnyc

Beckler said:


> I wonder how long it will take them to update the Mar. 22 date on their site to a later date. The SC600 (MkI) page still mentions "next month" (from Dec. 2012) as the release date. This is just my opinion, but when companies don't take the time to ensure their website is always updated and accurate, it's very clumsy and unprofessional.


I could have sworn Zebralight's SC600 preorder page said "XM-L2 U2" last week... Now it says "XM-L"

So it looks like they updated *something*...


----------



## Nicola

Google cache has same page as it appeared on 12 Mar 2013 01:45:51 GMT

It says "LED: Cree XM-L Cool White (Norminal CCT 6300K)" as it is now...


----------



## blackFFM

joelbnyc said:


> I could have sworn Zebralight's SC600 preorder page said "XM-L2 U2" last week... Now it says "XM-L"




Maybe this is wishful thinking. Since I'm only interested in a neutral white version I will have to wait much longer. I'm guessing early 2014...:shakehead


----------



## kwak

22nd been and gone here, no notice of dispatch.

Said it before but i really mean it this time, that's the LAST time ZL gets any of my money.

No updates, no nothing.
Seems their "customer service" just gets worse.


I'll give it till the 29th if i've not received a dispatch or a update i'll carry out a PayPal claim.


----------



## PocketBeam

Almost 7pm in Texas, so it looks like a no go for shipping today. Maybe they shipped out of China today?

I agree, Zebralight is terrible at communications. Good thing that is not why I buy the lights.

BTW, the web site says "estimated" shipping date...


----------



## neutralwhite

cancelled my order some weeks back. 
didn't risk it. no more ZL for me. 



kwak said:


> 22nd been and gone here, no notice of dispatch.
> 
> Said it before but i really mean it this time, that's the LAST time ZL gets any of my money.
> 
> No updates, no nothing.
> Seems their "customer service" just gets worse.
> 
> 
> I'll give it till the 29th if i've not received a dispatch or a update i'll carry out a PayPal claim.


----------



## GordoJones88

Does it say March 22 2013, or just March 22 ?

Because . . .


----------



## PocketBeam

It says "Estimated ship date: March 22nd, 2013".

I don't know why people are upset when it says estimated. And I assume they know pre-orders can be delayed. I wouldn't call this delayed until it is over a week late, even that would only be a slight delay.


----------



## mauiblue

Heck, HDS takes months if not a year before customers receive their orders. I'm not too concerned about my pre order. If there are any issues, it's easy enough to get a charge back on my card. But I'm not going to be concerned about it for the time being. 

Sent from my DROID RAZR MAXX using Tapatalk 2


----------



## thedoc007

I just placed a pre-order in early March. While I'm in no particular hurry (I have no shortage of x1 18650 lights), I am disappointed that they won't even bother to give us some updates. If they explain what the delay is ahead of time, I can live with a substantial delay if need be. However, this is not a limited run custom light. This is a mass-produced light from a large company, and as such they have an obligation to honor what they said. If they estimated a shipping date of March 22 in January, and are off by a day or two, no big deal. But when March 21 rolls around, if they aren't going to be shipping out, they should know that, and should also inform their customers of the situation. If I don't at least hear something from them, or see an update on their website, I too will seriously consider cancelling. I don't want to support companies who feel that they can make false promises without repercussions.


----------



## PocketBeam

I scanned the SC52 thread to see how late it was.
I also looked at their facebook page, which still has a post about a Oct. 20th shipping date. I then found a cpf forum post that had responded to another post saying:

"Pre-order. Shipping starts on Oct 20, 2012" <- gotta be a typo, how could they start shipping them 5 days before the release
Yeah I think that's a typo. The poster someone linked in one of the more recent posts several days ago showed preorders starting October 25 with an expected ship date of November 15.

_________


Then on Nov. 16th, someone posted that they revised the shipping date to Nov. 23rd. Then on Nov. 23rd several people got shipping notices.

So, assuming the Oct. 20th should have been pre-order date which actually started on Oct. 25th. Then the expected ship date of Nov. 15th was an actual ship date of Nov. 23rd. Or one week and one day late. Not bad in my book.

So if that follows, March 22nd, becomes March 30th, which is a Saturday. If they are closed weekends that could push it to Monday, April 1st. I will leave it to someone else to make the fools joke...

I will admit it is tough waiting. This will be my first 18650 light, ever!


----------



## Oufti

Same here

The lack of communication make this experience unnecessary unnerving, when you know the time it takes to make a mass email to those who have pre - ordered and/or to update the website page it's a ridiculous effort to keep the customer happy. 

I even don't care too much if there is a delay if I know there will be one, not communicating is a very bad marketing strategy.


----------



## Patriot

oops....I was on the wrong page.


----------



## PocketBeam

Patriot said:


> oops....I was on the wrong page.



??? What? This message was not an edit. If you realized you made a mistake during the post, why not just cancel it? Or do I misunderstand something?


----------



## Lite_me

^^ Yes ...You can post something, and so long as you edit it, within 60sec I think, it does not show the 'edit' line at the bottom.

That's what Patriot must have done.


----------



## BWX

I am shocked they didn't ship!


----------



## PocketBeam

Lite_me said:


> ^^ Yes ...You can post something, and so long as you edit it, within 60sec I think, it does not show the 'edit' line at the bottom.
> 
> That's what Patriot must have done.


 
Thanks for educating me.


----------



## AussieRanga

neutralwhite said:


> cancelled my order some weeks back.
> didn't risk it. no more ZL for me.



I am perplexed by the sheer ignorance displayed by many a forum user.

Didn't risk what? Getting an absolutely killer light that will make almost every single other 18650 light seem huge and unnecessary? 
You don't even own a ZL so by saying "no more" you actually mean "wont be buying any" in which case you're in the group above. If you bought a light based solely on someone else's bad experience with CS, you wouldn't own many lights.

When a Kia doesn't live up to expectations nobody cares when you complain or it doesn't live up to demands.
However, if a Porsche breaks down or doesn't perform, even those Kia owners are going to have something to say.
It's much the same with ZL - they have high expectations seeing as they are in a high price range and have big performance claims - as soon as someone isn't happy, there'll be an equally vocal person who has absolutely no clue what they're on about as THEY HAVE NO PERSONAL EXPERIENCE! These are the people you're listening to 99% of the time. Don't believe me? Go read some trashing of ZL and you will find I am right. twl is a classic example, they don't own a single ZL but will trash the brand in a heartbeat.


----------



## thedoc007

I submitted a request for an update through the ZL site, shortly after making my post above. They already updated it, and the admin who responded says that shipping did indeed start on Friday. Don't know what kind of backlog there might be, but unless they are flat-out lying (which I doubt) they are shipping at least some of the orders on time. That's all I wanted, would have preferred they send out a mass e-mail, rather than making me go and ask them, but hey, if they are shipping, no real complaints.


----------



## bjt3833

thedoc007 said:


> I submitted a request for an update through the ZL site, shortly after making my post above. They already updated it, and the admin who responded says that shipping did indeed start on Friday. Don't know what kind of backlog there might be, but unless they are flat-out lying (which I doubt) they are shipping at least some of the orders on time. That's all I wanted, would have preferred they send out a mass e-mail, rather than making me go and ask them, but hey, if they are shipping, no real complaints.



If that's true I kind of find it hard to believe NO forum member was in the first batch so either somebody is holding out on us and they should spill it  or they did fib.

unless maybe they're shipping to dealers first or something silly.


----------



## thaugen

Zebralight just sent me an email stating my pre-order SC600mkii would ship in two or three weeks.


----------



## mauiblue

I don't expect my order to be here next week. If it is, it will be a wonderful surprise. I am hoping though since I did place a pre order a couple weeks ago I'm hoping to have it within a few weeks. 

Sent from my DROID RAZR MAXX using Tapatalk 2


----------



## holylight

Is good thing that shipment is delay rather than sending defective product to me.


----------



## Nicola

ZL website updated:

[h=3]Shipping started on March 22.[/h]


----------



## sspc

Im excited about this light but I am not in the rush that some here seem to be because I won't order directly from ZL (I want to be able to deal with a US vendor). So I'm sure I'll be some weeks behind the curve as I wait for goinggear or illuminationgear to start carrying this one.


----------



## Patriot

PocketBeam said:


> ??? What? This message was not an edit. If you realized you made a mistake during the post, why not just cancel it? Or do I misunderstand something?



Looks like we all figured it out. Yeah, corrected before the minute mark.


----------



## fnj

A lot of words being eaten today.


----------



## PocketBeam

I wonder why they didn't update more then just the shipping status? I mean specifically they still don't list runtimes, I have one on pre-order so it doesn't affect my order, but I would still like to know the expected runtimes at each level.


----------



## thedoc007

PocketBeam said:


> I wonder why they didn't update more then just the shipping status? I mean specifically they still don't list runtimes, I have one on pre-order so it doesn't affect my order, but I would still like to know the expected runtimes at each level.




Ironic post given your signature, but I agree with you. If they are shipping product there is no reason why they shouldn't have the official specs at hand.


----------



## tino79

I got an email this night at 02:32 GMT + 1:00 that my order is shipped, with tracking ID.


----------



## Oufti

When did you order? Just curious, I must be in the first to order and still no news... 



tino79 said:


> I got an email this night at 02:32 GMT + 1:00 that my order is shipped, with tracking ID.


----------



## tino79

I placed my order a few houres after it was possible. Zebralight says: order date: 2/22/2013


----------



## Oufti

Just like me. Oh well, we'll see. 



tino79 said:


> I placed my order a few houres after it was possible. Zebralight says: order date: 2/22/2013


----------



## Cessquill

Looking forward to you guys receiving yours so we can get some real world thoughts.


----------



## SLWhite11

Great news! My preorder was on 2/23 so hopefully will see an email from ZL soon!


----------



## BWX

Just wondering, does anyone have a review up yet? Anywhere?


----------



## sspc

BWX said:


> Just wondering, does anyone have a review up yet? Anywhere?


The light is not out yet. Maybe in the next few weeks some reviews may start to surface.


----------



## BWX

sspc said:


> The light is not out yet. Maybe in the next few weeks some reviews may start to surface.



I know it isn't out yet, but that doesn't mean someone couldn't have gotten a pre-sale sample or other type pre-production model.. or whatever.. Maybe they did, and they're under some kind of NDA? I dunno, I do not follow ZL releases as closely as many here.


----------



## holylight

I will not be surprise if selfbuild is the first to review it.


----------



## michael3

I called them to find out when they would be shipping, apparently they ship from china on the 22nd and once they arrive in the states they will ship from which ever distributor you bought one from. I ordered mine just hours or less after they made preorder available on zl website. after asking them they sent me an e-mail to let me know that they would be shipping my order from texas 10 business days after the 22nd. that puts them shipping it around april 5th and it arriving around the 9th or 10th. it's worth waiting for. I do agree that more info from them would be nice, but as long as it is the usual high quality light then I will be satisfied.


----------



## BeastFlashlight

4" long, ok I'm in! I settled for Fenix PD32UE as my pocket light for weeks but at nearly 6" long i gotta switch, it falls sideways in your pocket too much and it's to visually obvious when sideways.

Ok here's my question please, is the talk in here about this light having neutral white in the near future just wishful thinking or is it very common for newly produced lights to add different colors in the first couple months? More specifically does Zebralight have a predictable pattern in this regard? I mean at 900 lumens, and being a POCKET light, I def think it's worth it to sacrifice a little bit of that brightness for better color, IMHO.


----------



## mauiblue

I emailed last night ZL and Lillian of customer service said I should be receiving my order in 10-15 business days. The order will be coming out of Texas. Cool. Looking forward in receiving the order. My order date was 10 March 13.


----------



## Matjazz

Zebralight site said:


> Weight: tbd



Are they waiting for it to come from China so they can put it on scales?


----------



## Cessquill

Matjazz said:


> Are they waiting for it to come from China so they can put it on scales?


You'd have thought they'd have a final copy to get the specs from before it was shipped to customers.


----------



## TEEJ

Cessquill said:


> You'd have thought they'd have a final copy to get the specs from before it was shipped to customers.



LOL

That's inefficient, there's a scale at the post office....


----------



## markr6

I'm going to have to wait a while for this one before purchasing. A light like this needs to be built, tested, tested then tested again by the manufacturer. Then they should have a few people test them out in everyday situations for a few weeks and get their feedback. Get all the specs right, complete the marketing, then release when the light is ready. Maybe they do some of this, but I'm doubtful.

I don't like the hype and under-delivering form ZL lately. Not to mention the "out of stock" and "back order" status on many of their most popular lights - one, two or even three weeks is acceptable now and then, but not all throughout the year. They need to ramp up and make "oh darn, it's out of stock" the exception instead of "oh! it's in stock now"

I love ZL but feel their lights are now released in several stages - "mass prototypes", final product, then a final product with issues resolved/small updates.


----------



## neutralwhite

+1. i used my money, saved up some more, and bought an alpha ready made instead. better investment by far it seems compared to silent ZL.
if only if ZL were more in touch with us, and all that. 
cancelled my ZL order ages back!.




markr6 said:


> I'm going to have to wait a while for this one before purchasing. A light like this needs to be built, tested, tested then tested again by the manufacturer. Then they should have a few people test them out in everyday situations for a few weeks and get their feedback. Get all the specs right, complete the marketing, then release when the light is ready. Maybe they do some of this, but I'm doubtful.
> 
> I don't like the hype and under-delivering form ZL lately. Not to mention the "out of stock" and "back order" status on many of their most popular lights - one, two or even three weeks is acceptable now and then, but not all throughout the year. They need to ramp up and make "oh darn, it's out of stock" the exception instead of "oh! it's in stock now"
> 
> I love ZL but feel their lights are now released in several stages - "mass prototypes", final product, then a final product with issues resolved/small updates.


----------



## lightcycle1

I like ZL too, bit I tend to wait for tried and proven lights. I dont get jazzed about anything very new on the scene until its been put through its paces by the masses.

Sent from my SCH-S720C using Tapatalk 2


----------



## Overclocker

so much ZL hate going around. personally i'd cut them some slack. zebra's are always delayed

always

nothing new in that dept.

fwiw sc52 was executed pretty well IMHO, being version1 and all


----------



## markr6

Overclocker said:


> fwiw sc52 was executed pretty well IMHO, being version1 and all




That's true, I don't think we've seen any real problems with that one. And I will definitely be getting the warm version expected soon!


----------



## thedoc007

Overclocker said:


> so much ZL hate going around. personally i'd cut them some slack. zebra's are always delayed
> 
> always
> 
> nothing new in that dept.



This is my first dealing with ZL, is that supposed to make us feel better? I mean, it might be a little reassuring that the delay doesn't mean we are getting ripped off, but it certainly doesn't give me confidence about dealing with the company. Any entity, be it corporation or individual, who is consistently late loses a great deal of respect in my book. I am willing to wait for quality, but overpromising consistently shows a lack of respect for the end customer. We'll see how I feel about the light, but if what you say is true, it might be my last purchase too.


----------



## PocketBeam

This is not a totally new light, it is a version 2. Come on, it is right in the name, mark 2. As I understand it, the body is not new, the circuit is not new as it is the same one used in the SC52. Even the led has been used for a bit.


----------



## PocketBeam

BeastFlashlight said:


> Ok here's my question please, is the talk in here about this light having neutral white in the near future just wishful thinking or is it very common for newly produced lights to add different colors in the first couple months? More specifically does Zebralight have a predictable pattern in this regard? I mean at 900 lumens, and being a POCKET light, I def think it's worth it to sacrifice a little bit of that brightness for better color, IMHO.




Zebralight is good about releasing neutral white versions. But expect the wait to be three months. I could be off on that number. But it has been about three months for the SC52, and no W version listed yet.

Personally I like a very slightly warm version. But I find these cool white versions to be close enough, that I would rather have more lumens. My SC52 is ever so slightly green, most of the time I don't notice it, just seems white. Besides, the eye is more sensitive to green any way. Ever notice green lasers are much brighter than red at the same power level. Even cameras have to use two green sensors for every red or blue sensor, so they can match what the eye sees. Too bad that green beams look sick. So a tiny bit green, and I mean tiny, is OK by me.


----------



## BWX

PocketBeam said:


> This is not a totally new light, it is a version 2. Come on, it is right in the name, mark 2. As I understand it, the body is not new, the circuit is not new as it is the same one used in the SC52. Even the led has been used for a bit.



How could it use the same body and be smaller at the same time? I mean look at the pictures. It is not the same body.


----------



## Fireclaw18

BWX said:


> How could it use the same body and be smaller at the same time? I mean look at the pictures. It is not the same body.




Yes. You can see in the pictures where the body differs. On the new SC600 Mk II, the angle where the body flares into the head is much sharper than on the old SC600. The other external elements are the same, but that flaring section is what was shortened.

I expect internally, Zebralight gained the extra space by switching to a combined LED / driver board like on the SC52. Having one unified board instead of a separate driver and star frees up additional space making for a more compact light. The downside is this does suck for modders since it's probably almost impossible to swap emitters.


----------



## neutralwhite

delay with ZL http://www.cpfmarketplace.com/mp/sh...alight-SC600-MKII-Release-Date&highlight=MkII


----------



## BWX

neutralwhite said:


> delay with ZL http://www.cpfmarketplace.com/mp/sh...alight-SC600-MKII-Release-Date&highlight=MkII



Yeah big surprise there. I will wait.


----------



## PocketBeam

Fair enough, the body is new. But I think it is 95% the same. To me it looks like they shortened the tail section. But it is hard to tell by pictures alone. Sounds like a good thing to see in a review... hint hint.

Btw, I think the circuit has a slight tweak on it as well, so not exactly the same as the SC52...


----------



## PocketBeam

BWX said:


> Yeah big surprise there. I will wait.



You are serriously replying to a dealer DELAY post saying you will WAIT?

I expect the delay is so they can supply to the people that did the preorder directly from the website.


If you have decided not to order, or canceled your order, why are you posting here? If you haven't made up your mind OK, but accept that others have ordered and aren't complaining about little things.


----------



## TMCGLASSON36

The date they posted(3/22/13) is shipping from China to ZL HQ in Texas and yes ZL should be a little more forthcoming about what the dates represent. I preordered mine the day it was availiable(2/22/13). It's the same thing that happened with the SC52. I guess they should just put the month instead of the exact date ,when they are estimating. The wait will be over soon and all will be well again. Until the SC32 comes out. LOL!!


----------



## Mr Floppy

neutralwhite said:


> delay with ZL



Why do you care? You cancelled ages back and you were never ever getting a Zebralight


----------



## neutralwhite

I do care because there is a lot to love for ZL, but its just not their with the customer.
second thoughts. not my fault. 
thanks.



Mr Floppy said:


> Why do you care? You cancelled ages back and you were never ever getting a Zebralight


----------



## BWX

PocketBeam said:


> You are serriously replying to a dealer DELAY post saying you will WAIT?
> 
> I expect the delay is so they can supply to the people that did the preorder directly from the website.
> 
> 
> If you have decided not to order, or canceled your order, why are you posting here? If you haven't made up your mind OK, but accept that others have ordered and aren't complaining about little things.



No I will wait to place an order, not just because I have no idea when the product will actually get here, but also because who knows if there will be flaws that are ironed out in later revisions..

Don't get mad because you didn't notice it has a different body and I happened to be the one to point it out to you. LOL.


----------



## BeastFlashlight

PocketBeam said:


> Personally I like a very slightly warm version. But I find these cool white versions to be close enough, that I would rather have more lumens.



Man that's impressive, you don't prefer cool white but in the case of ZL their cool white is ok with you! Seems like the praise over the quality of ZL goes on forever that's it I'm definitely gonna get one


----------



## holylight

The sc600mk2 is shipped on 240313. I ordered it on 220213. Hopefully can received it by next week.


----------



## PocketBeam

BeastFlashlight said:


> Man that's impressive, you don't prefer cool white but in the case of ZL their cool white is ok with you! Seems like the praise over the quality of ZL goes on forever that's it I'm definitely gonna get one



I really like my SC52 a lot. I have mentioned else where that a couple of edges are sharp. I even filed the edge next to the clip so it wouldn't cut into my pants pocket. Zebralight is bad at communication. So they are not perfect. But bottom line, I love my SC52. The SC600 mk II will be my fourth Zebralight, first was the H50 which still works.

If people are on the fence, I could do a pros and cons as I see them. Btw, this "delay" is common to many manufactures. I used to work for a manufacturer that always made the deadlines. They would ship product even if there were problems, but they shipped on time. Still I am just as eager to get mine as the next person.


----------



## BeastFlashlight

PocketBeam said:


> If people are on the fence, I could do a pros and cons as I see them.


I've hopped over the fence but i still wouldn't mind a pros & cons list. I know your pro con list will be for ZL in general and i would like to hear it, but one con i've heard for this specific light is it's thickness. Perhaps it's subjective as to what people consider too big for a pocket light but i don't think i'll be bothered by it's width at all, at 4" long it won't bother me, if it were 6" long the thickness would become an issue for me (in pocket).


----------



## PocketBeam

Well, I think the UI is a huge pro. It is one handed, gives direct access to high or low, has the main levels, and each level has easy access to a secondary level which is programable. Quick access to high, medium or low, from off. Overall the UI is very quick to work with, except for programming a secondary level. The light is very bright, 900 lumens for five minutes, which few rival. The circuit is very efficient, so run time is efficient. This is a update, so much is tried and true, with little differences. There is a battery level meter that uses a one to four flashes scale. I haven't seen anyone complain that the low wasn't low enough (based on SC52).


Cons: Price, it certainly isn't cheap. Warranty is only one year. Zebralight is not good at comunicating updates or information. As for the size, it might be fat for some, but I think that might be personal preference. You have limited brightness levels that can be programmed, for example you may want a medium that is just a little brighter or dimmer than the options given. You can't program the primary high, medium, or low, although it does remember if you last used primary or secondary high mode, etc. I think I saw a poll on here that showed about a 17% problem rate, I don't know if Fenix, four7s, or others are higher or lower, and of course there are issues with the poll... 

Things that fall into opinion are the body size, body design, color, led tint, things like that. I know there is a thread that lists every little issue with the SC52. If you find it, my advice is to read it carefully and form your own opinion. Even my complaint of sharp edges on the SC52 only one or two mentioned, and I think most (including myself) didn't think was a big deal.


----------



## markr6

PocketBeam said:


> and of course there are issues with the poll...



I'm getting off topic here but I saw this and really wanted to respond. I think there are issues with just about every poll in every forum. There's way too much bias, user error, brand loyalty, emotional opinions, etc. for me to take them seriously. I'll participate in them occasionally for fun, but would never let the results change my decision to purchase or pass a specific item.

I do base my decisions on objective reviews and beamshots (and sometimes subjective opintions from those I trust). I also put a lot of weight into Amazon reviews...go ahead and make fun of me if you want, but I've ALWAYS been 100% satisfied with my purchases there since I tend to research and choose items with high marks (i.e. mostly 5/5 stars, 500+ reviews make it hard to pass up).

Here we sometimes have 9, 17, 30 people? in a poll...some probably complaining because it got scratched after going into the garbage disposal - that's not a poll, it's a reason to vent and stir up trouble and unfortunatley give great companies a bad image for those ready to make a purchase.

I'll justify this rant by attempting to get on topic by saying I'll eventually get an SC600w even though I totally do not need another light!


----------



## thedoc007

markr6 said:


> I totally do not need another light!



You, sir, are on the wrong forum! Everybody here needs more lights!


----------



## holylight

Teacher: 'Billy, If there are 5 birds on a fence & you shoot 1, How many are left ?'
Billy: 'None, the others would fly away.'
Teacher: 'The answer is 4, but I like the way you think.'

Billy: 'I have a question for you, Miss. There are 3 women eating ice cream cones, 1 licking, 1 biting, & 1 sucking. Which one is married ?'
Teacher nervously answers: 'The one sucking ?'
Billy: 'The answer is the one with the wedding ring on, But I like the way you think !!!!....'


----------



## neutralwhite

that's what I thought!. 



thedoc007 said:


> You, sir, are on the wrong forum! Everybody here needs more lights!


----------



## Overclocker

PocketBeam said:


> This is not a totally new light, it is a version 2. Come on, it is right in the name, mark 2. As I understand it, the body is not new, the circuit is not new as it is the same one used in the SC52. Even the led has been used for a bit.



nope! it's practically a new light. except for perhaps the tailcap and clip it has nothing in common with mk1. gone is the screwed on bezel. lens is most probably now held in by a press fit ring. led mcpcb most likely also integrates the driver electronics.


----------



## markr6

thedoc007 said:


> You, sir, are on the wrong forum! Everybody here needs more lights!



Yes indeed! And I need to stop selling lights but it's fun to try and get that never-ending perfect collection.


----------



## PocketBeam

Overclocker said:


> nope! it's practically a new light. except for perhaps the tailcap and clip it has nothing in common with mk1. gone is the screwed on bezel. lens is most probably now held in by a press fit ring. led mcpcb most likely also integrates the driver electronics.



Isn't the body 90% the same? And the circuitry is basically the same as used in the S6330 and very simular to the SC52?


----------



## sdr

All I know is that I have carried the original SC600 everyday for the last year and a half and can't wait to get my hands on the new Mark II.


----------



## holylight

sdr said:


> All I know is that I have carried the original SC600 everyday for the last year and a half and can't wait to get my hands on the new Mark II.



All I can say is I dont have sc600 and can't wait to get my hands on the new Mark II.


----------



## henry1960

holylight said:


> All I can say is I dont have sc600 and can't wait to get my hands on the new Mark II.



They`ll Be Here Soon!!


----------



## TEEJ

I believe the herd is heading from China to US on ~ first week in April...so second week in April is maybe when they get there/could be shipped to consumers, at the soonest....so the third week in April is a fairly realistic expectation to GET one by....if your order was on the initial ship-to list.


----------



## henry1960

TEEJ said:


> I believe the herd is heading from China to US on ~ first week in April...so second week in April is maybe when they get there/could be shipped to consumers, at the soonest....so the third week in April is a fairly realistic expectation to GET one by....if your order was on the initial ship-to list.



Ya Lets Just Hope The Ship Thats Coming From China To The USA Does Not Run Out Of Gas Half Way Here...LOL


----------



## neutralwhite

..& everyone in England get's them first !. lool!. 



henry1960 said:


> Ya Lets Just Hope The Ship Thats Coming From China To The USA Does Not Run Out Of Gas Half Way Here...LOL


----------



## BWX

The more I use the SC600 MkI, the more I wish they would make a light identical to the SC600, but with the option for a tail switch. It might add a cm or so, but I think it would be worth it. Sometimes it's just a pain fumbling around for that side switch in the dark. It is my EDC now though and it is a great little light still.


----------



## PocketBeam

BWX said:


> The more I use the SC600 MkI, the more I wish they would make a light identical to the SC600, but with the option for a tail switch. It might add a cm or so, but I think it would be worth it. Sometimes it's just a pain fumbling around for that side switch in the dark. It is my EDC now though and it is a great little light still.



I find tail switches to be a pain. You must hold the light up, like you surrender, so you can click with your thumb. If you just let your arm drop by your side, your thumb is in a perfect position to hit a side button. It is a more natural arm and hand position.

You should get the H600, which will have the button on the end. Decent arm and hand position. And super easy to clip to clothes and use hands free. I still really like my H51 because of that. Super versatile light for pocket carry ability but still having hands free capability.


----------



## Sador

PocketBeam said:


> I find tail switches to be a pain. *You must hold the light up, like you surrender, so you can click with your thumb*. If you just let your arm drop by your side, your thumb is in a perfect position to hit a side button. It is a more natural arm and hand position.
> 
> You should get the H600, which will have the button on the end. Decent arm and hand position. And super easy to clip to clothes and use hands free. I still really like my H51 because of that. Super versatile light for pocket carry ability but still having hands free capability.


 I'm guessing you've never really needed a tactical light? Tail switch is ideal for hand alignment in that scenario. Hard to reach that side button while holding your service weapon AND the flashlight in a two-hand grip.


----------



## blackFFM

PocketBeam said:


> I find tail switches to be a pain. You must hold the light up, like you surrender, so you can click with your thumb. If you just let your arm drop by your side, your thumb is in a perfect position to hit a side button. * It is a more natural arm and hand position.*



Don't know about that one. There are many applications where the sideswitch is a pain.


----------



## PocketBeam

Sador said:


> I'm guessing you've never really needed a tactical light? Tail switch is ideal for hand alignment in that scenario. Hard to reach that side button while holding your service weapon AND the flashlight in a two-hand grip.



The SC600 is not a tactical light. Even if you moved the switch to the tail it wouldn't be a tactical light. There is no momentarily, and you could accidentally double click when trying to turn it off. Not to mention the button will be to hard to press.

Oh, and if you want to carry in the hands up position, you can. Just use the middle or ring finger to turn it on/off.

This is a SC600 thread, but if you were talking about other, tactical light, well I remember they used to train with the big mags with the side switch, in the hands up position. I used to have one and used it this way when I carried a weapon for personal security. Part of the reason was so you could club them with the big light. Well, lights aren't big enough to club with for the most part. They used to be big enough you could rest them on your shoulder. Now your arm gets tired in that position.

Also one school was to hold the flashlight and weapons hands together, to help brace the gun. I prefer not to give a target, so like to place the flashlight far away from my body. In that position tail and side can both be used.

Any way, I don't do personal security any more. And I find side switches are easier to use overall, but definitely on a non-tactical light like the SC600.


----------



## blackFFM

What I like about tail switches is that you always know and feel where it's at no matter how you grip the light.


----------



## neutralwhite

+1.



blackFFM said:


> What I like about tail switches is that you always know and feel where it's at no matter how you grip the light.


----------



## BWX

blackFFM said:


> What I like about tail switches is that you always know and feel where it's at no matter how you grip the light.



Exactly my point. Side switches are what can "be a pain" in that regard, tactical or not.


----------



## PocketBeam

blackFFM said:


> What I like about tail switches is that you always know and feel where it's at no matter how you grip the light.



Well, I think this is opinion, so to each their own. Obviously they still sell a lot of tail switches. As far as feel, I think it depends on the light. I have had some tgat were easy to feel, and others not so. My SC52 with clip sits only one way in my pocket, so it is easy to feel. I have another tail switch light, and well, far too many times have I tried pressing on the lens to turn on the light. Ugh, fingerprints on the lens. 

Maybe you should start a new thread and see how many people would buy a SC600 with a tail switch. Maybe make it a poll. If there is enough interest Zebralight might do a trial run maybe. Seems you have three votes already.


----------



## Cessquill

Again, apologies for being new to this - I've not seen link below before. If it's common knowledge, feel free to delete.

Using the Compare All link on the ZL site, it takes you to a Google Docs spreadsheet of all their units. The SC600 MkII still had sketchy specs, but I found it useful, since it clearly classified which of their flashlights were current (something that their website doesn't do). Also interesting to note an SC5310 which I hadn't seen before (although people here might have). Is it likely that this might be a better source for specs than their main site - it does seem a little more up to date?

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet...authkey=CNqP6KIC&hl=en&authkey=CNqP6KIC#gid=0


----------



## blackFFM

PocketBeam said:


> Maybe you should start a new thread and see how many people would buy a SC600 with a tail switch. Maybe make it a poll. If there is enough interest Zebralight might do a trial run maybe. Seems you have three votes already.



Why should I do that? I don't want a sc600 with a tail switch. If I would want a sc600 it's because it is so short with the side switch.


----------



## SLWhite11

tino79 said:


> I got an email this night at 02:32 GMT + 1:00 that my order is shipped, with tracking ID.



Any updates on your tracking ID tino79? Was hoping you would see it making its way across the country. Wishful thinking I suppose.


----------



## PocketBeam

I haven't seen any one else mention getting a tracking number. Has any one else gotten a tracking number?

On a different note, does anyone know a aspherical lens that will or should fit this? I am looking for a way to make it throw farther.


----------



## henry1960

Wish I Could Get A Tracking #....


----------



## mauiblue

No tracking number for me. I am hoping the wait will be finally over soon enough 

Sent from my DROID RAZR MAXX using Tapatalk 2


----------



## kwak




----------



## Creep0815

You lucky guy!  Could you give us some impressions (brightness, beamshape)...


----------



## jeffkruse

Oh no! I don't see a spot for a wrist laynard?


----------



## holylight

nice!


----------



## Cessquill

That's significantly smaller and lighter. It's made up my mind.


----------



## maroast

Can you take a better pic of the emitter? I want to see if it's an XM-L2. Thanks!


----------



## twl

maroast said:


> Can you take a better pic of the emitter? I want to see if it's an XM-L2. Thanks!



Looks like a green board to me. That's XML.
XML2 has a silver color board.


----------



## Cessquill

neutralwhite said:


> to ZL;
> 
> Subject: XML U2/U3 with a 1C tint ?.
> 
> ..hello. what emitter and tint is in the new SC600MkII please?.
> XML U2/U3 with a 1C tint ?.
> 
> 
> 
> *Staff (Administrator)*
> 3/18/2013 12:00:52 AMXM-L U3, either 1C or 1D tint (but recent batches are all with 1C).


I'm guessing that it's not.

However, I'm also confused if they were getting batches in (according to the text above), how they were unable to update their website with specifications. The weight on their site still says tbd. I'm thinking that it has been determined, since we've seen photos of it on a customer's set of scales. Obviously they might not be calibrated to some kind of ISO standard, but we've got a better gauge than "tbd".


----------



## maroast

Double post!


----------



## itsjusttim

beam shots please. man that thing is tiny


----------



## PocketBeam

Cessquill said:


> I'm guessing that it's not.
> 
> However, I'm also confused if they were getting batches in (according to the text above), how they were unable to update their website with specifications. The weight on their site still says tbd. I'm thinking that it has been determined, since we've seen photos of it on a customer's set of scales. Obviously they might not be calibrated to some kind of ISO standard, but we've got a better gauge than "tbd".



Based on this delay, I assume they have to send the light out for Ansi testing. Sure would be nice to see the website updated though.

To the person wondering about a laynard, I suppose you use the hole in the clip or the track for the clip. Just tie it tightly around the trench the clip would go in. Edit, it does have a small split ring for a laynard. See below pics.

This does look slightly shorter.

Would be nice to see if the emitter reflection can fill up the reflector. I know some of the first batch of SC600 had the issue where the reflector was too high or low . I assume they fixed it on the mark II...


----------



## kwak

Sorry guys, only had time to stick the pics up.

Wrote a bit a review for another forum i use so i'll just copy and paste that review below:




My eagerly awaited SC600 MKII arrived today.

Been EDCing my SC600 MKI since May 2011, in that time it's been used for everything from night hiking, working on my cars and bikes, used regularly at work, even used it to get back a friends watch last year that had fallen into the sea, 10m underwater and no problems.

I find the beam and brightness levels pretty much perfect for 90% of jobs that need a light.

So when the MKII was announced i decided to put aside my worries of ZL's missed deadlines and recent QA problems with previous lights and pre-order one.

Plain but functional packaging







Comes with the usual pocket clip, instructions and spare O-rings







LED nicely centred







Well lubed and cut threads







MKII has a very very slight smaller diameter body diameter at 25mm (25.4mm on the MKI)
Both have the exact same head diameter at 30mm
The MKII is a noggin shorter at 102mm compared to the MKI at 107mm












MKII is also slightly lighter at 78.6g







MKI at 87.3g







The MKII has a lanyard attachment






Why on earth they put that ugly lump on it i don't know, if i could get it coated again i'd grind it straight off.
I don't know of 1 single person that has attached a lanyard to their SC600, rubbish idea.

I'm very pleased to say that my larger 3100mAh and upwards protected cells fit easily in the MKII.
My MKI was one of the pre-ordered ones with the small battery tube so no protected cells over 2400mAH fit.

The MKII has a battery level test.
4 x quick presses and it flashed to tell you what the battery voltage is, i like that.

Unfortunately when they did the MKI second revision (lets call it MKI b) ZL in their infinite wisdom programmed the light to automatically step down depending on the battery voltage (the 750 to 500lm step down is timed, this is a auto step down from 500 downwards).
So you start a hike on 500 lumens and the torch gradually keeps stepping down the lower the battery voltage gets.
My MKI a version stays on 500 lumens until the low voltage cut-off turns the light off.

When i use my torch i set it in the output i feel i need to get a job done, if i wanted a lower level i'd set it on that lower level.
With this auto step down you buy a 500 lumen light but can't actually use it as a 500 lumen light if the battery voltage is low.
Only reason i can think ZL did this auto step down is so they can brag about their run times, for me it's a major negative against the torch though.


Not had much of a chance to test it yet, but in a room with the curtains closed the MKII is brighter but only very slightly.
More noticeable is the distinct hot spot in the MKII's beam, looks like the MKII will have a slightly better throw than the MKI but i'll reserve judgement till i get to test it at night.



+ Points
Lighter
Slightly smaller
Bigger internal diameter of the battery tube
Battery level indicator

- Points
That lanyard attachment
Auto step down *edit opinion now changed after real world test (post #716)



I'll update this thread as i use it over time.


Cheers
Mark


----------



## kwak

I think the pics give a greater impression of size difference than real life.

Basically instead of having the externally threaded screw off cap like on the MKIb and my MKIa, they've threaded the inside of the bezel and used a threaded chrome collar (that you can see in my pics below)
They've then moulded in the external screw bezel into the body but managed to 1/2 it's size from 1cm (from that first lip) to 5mm.

These pics give a better idea rather than my mumblings












And comparison pics of the internal threaded collar












Got to give ZL credit where it due, i've not read 1 single report of anyone saying "i wish the SC600 was smaller" yet by some clever thinking they've managed to get more power in a smaller package.


----------



## Wiggle

How pocketable is this light? Currently have the SC52 and love it but wonder if I have the pocket room for the extra power and capacity of the 18650 based light.


----------



## kwak

Just snapped a couple of beam shots.


MKII







MKI







I'm crap at beam shots, but this is pretty close to what i'm seeing with my eye.
The MKII is slightly brighter everywhere, but it's noticeably brighter in the hot spot.

This is true at longer distances as well.
When i shine both torches at a wall around 50 meters away the MKII is noticeably brighter in the hotspot than my MKI version.
So the MKII does throw better than the MKI.


----------



## PocketBeam

Does the auto stepdown happen right away, or closer to the end of the battery life? Will be nice to see a runtime versus output graph to see how much the stepdown affects it.


----------



## itsjusttim

amazing! thanks for the pics and quick responses.


----------



## Lurveleven

kwak said:


> - Points
> That lanyard attachment
> Auto step down



I think the auto step down is a good thing, the MKI sudden shut down on all modes is not something I want. I prefer gradual dimming at the end instead of suddenly being left in the dark. That was the reason for me not to get the MKI.
I really hope they will get rid of that lanyard attachment in a later revision, because I will not get this light if they keep it there.


----------



## melty

PocketBeam said:


> Does the auto stepdown happen right away, or closer to the end of the battery life? Will be nice to see a runtime versus output graph to see how much the stepdown affects it.



The stepdown happens once the battery is unable to maintain the current output level. You can check out the SC52 runtime graphs, I assume they'll be quite similar.



kwak said:


> Unfortunately when they did the MKI second revision (lets call it MKI b) ZL in their infinite wisdom programmed the light to automatically step down depending on the battery voltage (the 750 to 500lm step down is timed, this is a auto step down from 500 downwards).
> So you start a hike on 500 lumens and the torch gradually keeps stepping down the lower the battery voltage gets.
> My MKI a version stays on 500 lumens until the low voltage cut-off turns the light off.
> 
> When i use my torch i set it in the output i feel i need to get a job done, if i wanted a lower level i'd set it on that lower level.
> With this auto step down you buy a 500 lumen light but can't actually use it as a 500 lumen light if the battery voltage is low.
> Only reason i can think ZL did this auto step down is so they can brag about their run times, for me it's a major negative against the torch though.



Unless I'm mistaken, the light steps down _instead_ of turning off, meaning you're not left completely in the dark when the battery gets low. I don't see how that could be a negative.

Edit: Ninja posted by Lurveleven :fail:


----------



## michael3

mine is coming on tues.


----------



## PocketBeam

I just got a tracking number! USPS. Ordered 2/25. I am in Southern California,USA.



> This email confirms that your order was Shipped. Please contact us if you have any questions about your order.
> 
> Tracking code: xxxxxxxxx
> 
> Shipping to continental U.S. via USPS takes about 2-4 days. USPS Tracking: https://tools.usps.com/go/TrackConfirmAction.action
> 
> International orders are shipped from China via postal airmail, EMS, or DHL. You can query your package by the tracking code above according to your shipping method. Please allow 2-6 weeks on average for airmail and custom clearance. You can track here: http://www.17track.net/IndexEn.html or EMS : http://www.ems.com.cn/english.html DHL : http://www.dhl.com
> 
> Thank you for choosing ZebraLight, Inc..



Good point melty. I have the SC52 and haven't noticed any step downs, well other than the known 500 to 280 one minute step down.


----------



## Lurveleven

I forgot to mention that I find the implementation of the stepping down not to be satisfactory, at least on my H600 headlamp, and I think the implementation is the same on SC600 MkII. I was running on H2 and double clicked to go to H1, it almost immediately stepped down to medium. I wanted to go back to H2, but this was impossible because it was stuck in H1 that immediately stepped down to medium if I tried to enter high mode.


----------



## Nicola

When did you ordered it?

I ordered mine on March 8th.

I also asked ZL CS (via website msg) for a shipping forecast a couple of days ago but I had no answer at all.


----------



## Swede74

kwak said:


> I think the pics give a greater impression of size difference than real life.
> 
> Basically instead of having the externally threaded screw off cap like on the MKIb and my MKIa, they've threaded the inside of the bezel and used a threaded chrome collar (that you can see in my pics below)
> They've then moulded in the external screw bezel into the body but managed to 1/2 it's size from 1cm (from that first lip) to 5mm.



So the bezel is not press-fit (press-fitted?) after all, like so many of us expected it to be. This should open up for aftermarket diffusers and colour filters if there is sufficient demand, and of course it's great news for modders.

If I weren't already the happy owner of a SC52, I'd have a hard time resisting this little gem.


----------



## jeffkruse

I use the wrist laynard caving. I even wish the bump was a little bigger to allow for the lanyard to directly connect rather than go through a little metal ring. Does the MKII come with a lanyard?


----------



## PocketBeam

Regarding the step down, I tried the SC52 with some cheap li-ion batteries. It couldn't even hold the 500 lumen turbo mode for one minute like it should have. It was stepping down, and using the light just a little would cause it to step down even faster. I then tried good name brand batteries, and I could use the light a lot, and still have it hold turbo for the full minute. No more step down issues.

My thought is I like not being left in the dark. And if I truly need turbo, I can just put in a decently charged battery. But so far on my SC52 I have had turbo when I needed it. Of course I usually recharge around the 25% to 50% level.


----------



## melty

Lurveleven said:


> I forgot to mention that I find the implementation of the stepping down not to be satisfactory, at least on my H600 headlamp, and I think the implementation is the same on SC600 MkII. I was running on H2 and double clicked to go to H1, it almost immediately stepped down to medium. I wanted to go back to H2, but this was impossible because it was stuck in H1 that immediately stepped down to medium if I tried to enter high mode.



Is that worse than the light shutting off completely? I agree that it would be ideal to step down from H2 to H1, but there would be several details to work out when implementing that behavior. Details that probably weren't worth the trouble for the small amount of time the light would be able to stay in H1.


----------



## michael3

i ordered mine feb 23rd.


----------



## melty

Does anyone know what emitter the latest revision sc600w used? I was thinking of getting an sc600 Mk II and getting a neutral mod, but that won't be possible if the sc52 and sc6330 are any indication. Soooo, I'm considering having my sc600w modded with a 5000k XM-L2 emitter while I wait for sc600w Mk II. That being said, I don't want to bother with a mod if it isn't going to affect brightness much (tint AND brightness push it over the edge).


----------



## Lurveleven

melty said:


> Is that worse than the light shutting off completely? I agree that it would be ideal to step down from H2 to H1, but there would be several details to work out when implementing that behavior. Details that probably weren't worth the trouble for the small amount of time the light would be able to stay in H1.



I didn't say it was worse, I said it was an unsatisfactory implementation. Considering the huge difference in load on the batteries between the 750 lm turbo mode and the 170 lm H2 mode, you may be able to run a long time on the 170 lm mode after it is unable to run on turbo mode.


----------



## Nicola

michael3 said:


> i ordered mine feb 23rd.



I hope to get mine before the end of April...


----------



## neutralwhite

[email protected]






3 Apr (3 days ago)















to me











Hi Darryl

I have held off ordering them to stop delaying the rest of my order but that didn't really work as I have been waiting weeks already.

As soon as this order arrives I will place a new one for the SC600MKII - my guess would be mid to late April before they arrive if we are lucky.

Kind Regards
Antony Cole

Tel: +44 (0)1460 240336

Flashaholics, Unit 5 Lopen Business Park, Mill Lane, Lopen, Somerset TA13 5JS


----------



## kwak

Lurveleven said:


> I think the auto step down is a good thing, the MKI sudden shut down on all modes is not something I want. I prefer gradual dimming at the end instead of suddenly being left in the dark. That was the reason for me not to get the MKI.
> I really hope they will get rid of that lanyard attachment in a later revision, because I will not get this light if they keep it there.



Each to their own.

For me personally when i'm out i set the light output to suit the situation.
If i'm running or walking fast then i want 500 lumens so i can look ahead and pick a path over rough terrain.

If i'm on my mountain bike then it's absolutely essential my light maintain it's constant output.

My H600 does this annoying step down and it drives me crazy.
My early SC600 stays on 500 lumens until the battery runs out, i much prefer that.



melty said:


> Unless I'm mistaken, the light steps down _instead_ of turning off, meaning you're not left completely in the dark when the battery gets low. I don't see how that could be a negative.



Some confusion there i think.

The low voltage cut-off comes in at 2.7v.
It does not matter if the light has this step down or not the torch still switches off at 2.7v


The difference is, with my early SC600 the light will stay on 500 lumens until 2.7v then turn off.
With this auto step down it'll just keep stepping down the output until 2.7v then turn off.

It's pretty pointless buying a 500 lumen torch is i can't use 500 lumens when I want to use it.

I will use the MKII as my EDC and keep my MKI for outdoors stuff.
It's a shame though as this ruins what is otherwise a pretty fantastic torch.



Swede74 said:


> So the bezel is not press-fit (press-fitted?) after all, like so many of us expected it to be. This should open up for aftermarket diffusers and colour filters if there is sufficient demand, and of course it's great news for modders.
> 
> If I weren't already the happy owner of a SC52, I'd have a hard time resisting this little gem.



You are absolutely correct.
It was pointed out on another forum that i'd made a mistake, it does seem a lot more likely that it's a press fit bezel rather than threaded :thumbsup:


----------



## neo_xeno

received my shipping notification. should be here by monday, coming from texas.


----------



## henry1960

Should receive mine Monday


----------



## SLWhite11

Preordered mine on 2/23, received tracking number today. Shipping from TX, should in my hands in KY on Tuesday, 4/9!


----------



## holylight

The lanyard hole is wonderful. Can secure it with lanyard.


----------



## Overclocker

> If i'm on my mountain bike then it's absolutely essential my light maintain it's constant output.



oh really. i've ridden quite a bit with the sc600 mk1 ver1. there's no warning it just shuts off completely leaving you in the dark. fatal flaw. could even get you killed or injured.


----------



## WmArnold1

kwak said:


> ... Some confusion there i think.
> 
> The low voltage cut-off comes in at 2.7v.
> It does not matter if the light has this step down or not the torch still switches off at 2.7v
> 
> The difference is, with my early SC600 the light will stay on 500 lumens until 2.7v then turn off.
> With this auto step down it'll just keep stepping down the output until 2.7v then turn off.
> 
> It's pretty pointless buying a 500 lumen torch is i can't use 500 lumens when I want to use it.
> 
> I will use the MKII as my EDC and keep my MKI for outdoors stuff.
> It's a shame though as this ruins what is otherwise a pretty fantastic torch.



I have a SC600 Mk-I with the step-down feature. It's virtually impossible to predict when
I have accumulated around two hours of Turbo/High run-time and trigger a step-down into
medium, but, I have repeatedly clocked more than an _*hour*_ of 65 lm Medium between the
first drop-down from high and the second drop-down into low. The corresponding battery
trigger points are something like: 3.370 volts and 2.915 volts, respectively. YMMV

I've never had the patience to clock after dropping into low, but I guesstimate around
2 hours of 2.8 lm low between 2.915 volts and the 2.700 volt cut-off. And, the lowest
0.1 lm low should last around 20 days. Enough time to safely navigate out of a cave!

The point I'm compelled to make is that we can safely EDC Turbo/High modes knowing
that we will always have 1-hour of 65 lm Medium plus 2-hours of 2.8 lm low _*in reserve
*_if we unexpectedly drop-down. Imho, that beats the hell out of cluelessly wielding
Turbo/High modes until one is unexpectedly thrust into total darkness. Murphy's law
says that it would happen at the worst possible moment too.


----------



## PocketBeam

Keep in mind the circuit has been updated to a new version. I would guess step down has changed, perhaps simular to the SC52.


----------



## BWX

My SC600 MKI(b) (bought a couple month ago) with the U2 has the lanyard knob, plus I think it is quite a bit brighter than the MKI T6 in kwak's pics (if that is a T6) , so it should be a *lot* closer to the output of the MKII. 

Also it looks as if my OP is more like the MKII in those pics than the MKI in those pics, or maybe somewhere in between. Could just be the lighting I guess, but that MKI has a lot of orange peel. Definitely more than mine.


----------



## PocketBeam

BWX, sounds like you got a mk II but without the new circuit board. I assume four clicks does not give you the flashes for battery level. So you got a upgrade, nice.


----------



## Nicola

ZL staff wrote my order (March 8th) should be shipped in 5/7 days.

Then, shipping fm China to Italy via EMS will take... around 20 days...

...I'll have to wait up to first days of May to have it in my hands...


----------



## BWX

PocketBeam said:


> BWX, sounds like you got a mk II but without the new circuit board. I assume four clicks does not give you the flashes for battery level. So you got a upgrade, nice.



Hmm. it's definitely a MKI b, because it has the screw-on bezel. But it is bright as **** on turbo, I have to say. Puts my Eagletac D25LC2 U2 to shame really.
No readout though, but it does have the lanyard nub! Is that just a regular MKI b (U2)?


----------



## kwak

WmArnold1 said:


> I have a SC600 Mk-I with the step-down feature. It's virtually impossible to predict when
> I have accumulated around two hours of Turbo/High run-time and trigger a step-down into
> medium, but, I have repeatedly clocked more than an _*hour*_ of 65 lm Medium between the
> first drop-down from high and the second drop-down into low. The corresponding battery
> trigger points are something like: 3.370 volts and 2.915 volts, respectively. YMMV
> 
> I've never had the patience to clock after dropping into low, but I guesstimate around
> 2 hours of 2.8 lm low between 2.915 volts and the 2.700 volt cut-off. And, the lowest
> 0.1 lm low should last around 20 days. Enough time to safely navigate out of a cave!
> 
> The point I'm compelled to make is that we can safely EDC Turbo/High modes knowing
> that we will always have 1-hour of 65 lm Medium plus 2-hours of 2.8 lm low _*in reserve
> *_if we unexpectedly drop-down. Imho, that beats the hell out of cluelessly wielding
> Turbo/High modes until one is unexpectedly thrust into total darkness. Murphy's law
> says that it would happen at the worst possible moment too.



Problem here is 65 lumens is absolutely useless to me.
I don't care if it lasts 2 hours or 2 years on 65 lumens, it's not enough illumination to do the jobs i want to do.

I bought a 500lumen light (turbo is useful but doesn't really count) NOT a 65 lumen light.
So i should be able to use 500 lumens for as long as the battery lasts.


----------



## kwak

Overclocker said:


> oh really. i've ridden quite a bit with the sc600 mk1 ver1. there's no warning it just shuts off completely leaving you in the dark. fatal flaw. could even get you killed or injured.



EVERY lithium based torch shuts off at low voltage, even if it doesn't the protected batteries will.

It makes absolutely no difference if the SC600 has step down or not it STILL turns off at 2.7v


The difference is, with my none step down SC600 i can use it on 500 lumens constantly up until the second before it turns off.
I know roughly when my battery is going to die, so if i'm coming up on a technocal section then i'll swap batteries before it reaches it's cut-off.




WmArnold1 said:


> I have a SC600 Mk-I with the step-down feature. It's virtually impossible to predict when
> I have accumulated around two hours of Turbo/High run-time and trigger a step-down into
> medium, but, I have repeatedly clocked more than an _*hour*_ of 65 lm Medium between the
> first drop-down from high and the second drop-down into low. The corresponding battery
> trigger points are something like: 3.370 volts and 2.915 volts, respectively. YMMV
> 
> I've never had the patience to clock after dropping into low, but I guesstimate around
> 2 hours of 2.8 lm low between 2.915 volts and the 2.700 volt cut-off. And, the lowest
> 0.1 lm low should last around 20 days. Enough time to safely navigate out of a cave!
> 
> The point I'm compelled to make is that we can safely EDC Turbo/High modes knowing
> that we will always have 1-hour of 65 lm Medium plus 2-hours of 2.8 lm low _*in reserve
> *_if we unexpectedly drop-down. Imho, that beats the hell out of cluelessly wielding
> Turbo/High modes until one is unexpectedly thrust into total darkness. Murphy's law
> says that it would happen at the worst possible moment too.



Problem here is 65 lumens is absolutely useless to me.
I don't care if it lasts 2 hours or 2 years on 65 lumens, it's not enough illumination to do the jobs i want to do.

I bought a 500lumen light (turbo is useful but doesn't really count) NOT a 65 lumen light.
So i should be able to use 500 lumens for as long as the battery lasts.


----------



## Overclocker

> EVERY lithium based torch shuts off at low voltage, even if it doesn't the protected batteries will.
> 
> It makes absolutely no difference if the SC600 has step down or not it STILL turns off at 2.7v
> 
> 
> The difference is, with my none step down SC600 i can use it on 500 lumens constantly up until the second before it turns off.
> I know roughly when my battery is going to die, so if i'm coming up on a technocal section then i'll swap batteries before it reaches it's cut-off.




ok. you'll swap batteries. and you know when to. wow. somehow that's better than the flashlight automatically and gracefully stepping down to let you know it's time to swap batteries  you know, enjoying the ride more than worrying about when the flashlight will suddenly plunge you into darkness (and consequently into a ditch)


----------



## BWX

Does it matter either way really? You still have to change the batts.. you should change them before it doesn't let you have H1 mode anyway. Just a thought. As soon as mine steps down I change batts. (doesn't usually happen because usually I have already changed the batts though).. Chicken or egg?

Should you be running a 1x 18560 light on 500 lumen mode with a low batt anyway? I guess ZL decided, no.


----------



## henry1960

BWX said:


> Does it matter either way really? You still have to change the batts.. you should change them before it doesn't let you have H1 mode anyway. Just a thought. As soon as mine steps down I change batts. (doesn't usually happen because usually I have already changed the batts though).. Chicken or egg?
> 
> Should you be running a 1x 18560 light on 500 lumen mode with a low batt anyway? I guess ZL decided, no.


DITO!!!


----------



## kwak

Overclocker said:


> ok. you'll swap batteries. and you know when to. wow. somehow that's better than the flashlight automatically and gracefully stepping down to let you know it's time to swap batteries  you know, enjoying the ride more than worrying about when the flashlight will suddenly plunge you into darkness (and consequently into a ditch)



Of course i know how long my battery lasts, i have used my MKI SC600 pretty much daily for nearly 2 years.

Have you tried mountain biking, running or even hiking off-road in Greece?
Most mountainous areas are EXTREMELY rocky, these rocks are razor sharp and very slippy.
My mate had to be near enough carried off one mountain because he slipped in the day time.

With the beam pattern of the SC600 much less than 500 lumens is absolutely useless here off-road at night even at a steady walk.

So i don't care in the slightest if i get 2 hours at 200 lumens or 24 hours at 65 lumens, IT'S NOT ENOUGH ILLUMINATION FOR THE JOB.

If you use your light for other things then obviously your opinion will be different but for ME this step down is a very strong negative for his light.




BWX said:


> Does it matter either way really? You still have to change the batts.. you should change them before it doesn't let you have H1 mode anyway. Just a thought. As soon as mine steps down I change batts. (doesn't usually happen because usually I have already changed the batts though).. Chicken or egg?
> 
> Should you be running a 1x 18560 light on 500 lumen mode with a low batt anyway? I guess ZL decided, no.



Yes it DOES matter to ME

I've tried using my H600 for MTBing and the step down makes it's absolutely useless.
My MKIa SC600 has no step down and it's better for the jobs i want it to do.


Be nice if ZL offered a option, as i will not be buying any more lights with this auto step down, so unless they do something they have lost me as a future customer.


----------



## Byggeren

If I had to choose between :

1. 90 minutes of 500 lumens than nothing
2. 90 minutes of 500 lumens than 30 minutes of 20 lumens

I'd take number 2 any day. That's what this is about.


----------



## kwak

Byggeren said:


> If I had to choose between :
> 
> 1. 90 minutes of 500 lumens than nothing
> 2. 90 minutes of 500 lumens than 30 minutes of 20 lumens
> 
> I'd take number 2 any day. That's what this is about.




No it's not.

It's: 
1/ 90 mins of 500 lumens 
2/ 20 mins of 500 lumens, 40 mins of 100 lumens, 80 mins of 60 lumens

For me anything less than 500 lumens with the SC600/H600 is useless so for my use it's

1/ 90 mins of 500 lumens (MKI)
2/ 20 mins of 500 lumens (MKII)

So if i go out with the H600 or my new SC600 MKII for say 90 mins i HAVE to take 5 batteries and change them every 20 mins.

With my non step down MKI i take 2 batteries and swap them at 75 mins as i don't want to be plunged into unexpected darkness.


----------



## holylight

kwak said:


> No it's not.
> 
> It's:
> 1/ 90 mins of 500 lumens
> 2/ 20 mins of 500 lumens, 40 mins of 100 lumens, 80 mins of 60 lumens
> 
> For me anything less than 500 lumens with the SC600/H600 is useless so for my use it's
> 
> 1/ 90 mins of 500 lumens (MKI)
> 2/ 20 mins of 500 lumens (MKII)
> 
> So if i go out with the H600 or my new SC600 MKII for say 90 mins i HAVE to take 5 batteries and change them every 20 mins.
> 
> With my non step down MKI i take 2 batteries and swap them at 75 mins as i don't want to be plunged into unexpected darkness.



I would not waste time write all these, I will go read up review to find other lights..... peace


----------



## Overclocker

kwak said:


> No it's not.
> 
> It's:
> 1/ 90 mins of 500 lumens
> 2/ 20 mins of 500 lumens, 40 mins of 100 lumens, 80 mins of 60 lumens
> 
> For me anything less than 500 lumens with the SC600/H600 is useless so for my use it's
> 
> 1/ 90 mins of 500 lumens (MKI)
> 2/ 20 mins of 500 lumens (MKII)
> 
> So if i go out with the H600 or my new SC600 MKII for say 90 mins i HAVE to take 5 batteries and change them every 20 mins.
> 
> With my non step down MKI i take 2 batteries and swap them at 75 mins as i don't want to be plunged into unexpected darkness.




aha now i understand what you're saying. what 18650 are you using btw? perhaps it sags too much. try a sanyo 2600, flatter discharge curve. a cell that sags too much will prematurely stepdown on zebralights







that's selfbuilt's graph for the sc52 using 14500. it only steps down to MED when the cell is down to less 10%


----------



## Nicola

kwak said:


> It's:
> 1/ 90 mins of 500 lumens
> 2/ 20 mins of 500 lumens, 40 mins of 100 lumens, 80 mins of 60 lumens...



I understood your point.

Are these real time measurements or it's just an example?


----------



## BWX

kwak said:


> No it's not.
> 
> It's:
> 1/ 90 mins of 500 lumens
> 2/ 20 mins of 500 lumens, 40 mins of 100 lumens, 80 mins of 60 lumens
> 
> For me anything less than 500 lumens with the SC600/H600 is useless so for my use it's
> 
> 1/ 90 mins of 500 lumens (MKI)
> 2/ 20 mins of 500 lumens (MKII)
> 
> So if i go out with the H600 or my new SC600 MKII for say 90 mins i HAVE to take 5 batteries and change them every 20 mins.
> 
> With my non step down MKI i take 2 batteries and swap them at 75 mins as i don't want to be plunged into unexpected darkness.



If that was the case, I would see your point, but that's not the case. Not for me. I use Xtar 3100mah 18650 - basically, Panasonic 3100 18650 cells. I have never sat there and let my light stay at 500 lumen until it drains, I just wouldn't do that with this light, I would use a light with more metal in there for that, like a 2x 18650 light- but that's besides the point. I get just about the same amount on 500 lumens as I would if it didn't step down because I never run the batts that low. I would probably get closer to 1.7 hours or more.. either way. It wouldn't be 20 minutes that's for damn sure.

here's what they say on ZL-



> Step regulation: High steps down to the user selected Med or Med steps down to the user selected Low when *battery capacity* (not necessary the voltage) is low


.
So maybe you should get better batteries? That's if you are using crummy ones I guess.


----------



## WmArnold1

BWX said:


> Does it matter either way really? You still have to change the batts.. you should change them before it doesn't let you have H1 mode anyway. Just a thought. As soon as mine steps down I change batts. (doesn't usually happen because usually I have already changed the batts though).. Chicken or egg?
> 
> Should you be running a 1x 18560 light on 500 lumen mode with a low batt anyway? I guess ZL decided, no.



I try to change my battery before hitting the step-down, but I've been surprised a few times too. 

People vote with their purchases, and I personally bought the ability to retrieve a fresh battery with medium mode within an hour instead of groping around in darkness when I'm surprised.

However, everyone's situation is different. I suppose I could see the benefit of groping around if I was chaperoning the Miss Universe pageant, but I don't think there are many, if any, guys that lucky. ~grins~ For mountain biking; I think it's stupid - but that's just my $0.02 - fail however you want.


----------



## TEEJ

The Eagletac 3400 mah cells fit the SC600 (Some 3400's are too fat), and don't sag like the others, much better overall performance, more than JUST the added mah, they hold higher draw much longer, etc.

If you leave it at 900 lumens, it can drop to 500 L before it drops to lower, etc...so complete darkness will not be a surprise. 

There's also some blinking to warn you if the cells are going too low, and so forth....its not without advanced notice.



PS - If you start groping around at a Miss Universe Pageant, I'm pretty sure the law suits would wipe out any savings on cells, lights, etc...so, despite the Id-based lure of the scenario, the best bet is STILL more lighting.

You should never count on ONE light, double or triple redundancy should be mandatory.

One = Zero

Two = One

etc.


----------



## WmArnold1

TEEJ said:


> PS - If you start groping around at a Miss Universe Pageant, I'm pretty sure the law suits would wipe out any savings on cells, lights, etc...so, despite the Id-based lure of the scenario, the best bet is STILL more lighting.



Don't spoil my fantasy Teej; "Sorry Miss, I was only groping for my 18650. Would you help me look?" :devil:

Seriously tho; I can't imagine any realistic benefit of a few additional minutes of H1 in lieu of stepping down into medium.


----------



## TEEJ

WmArnold1 said:


> Don't spoil my fantasy Teej; "Sorry Miss, I was only groping for my 18650. Can help me look?" :devil:



sigh, OK....


First, be sure she is situated between you, and where on the floor the dropped 18650 must be laying....then ask for her to help look there....


If there are a lot of potential helpers, be sure to have lost a sufficient number of loose 18650's....

:devil:


----------



## kwak

Overclocker said:


> aha now i understand what you're saying. what 18650 are you using btw? perhaps it sags too much. try a sanyo 2600, flatter discharge curve. a cell that sags too much will prematurely stepdown on zebralights
> 
> 
> 
> that's selfbuilt's graph for the sc52 using 14500. it only steps down to MED when the cell is down to less 10%



I have around 20 18650 cells, from rubbish surefire through to non protected 3400mAh Panasonics.

This is not a battery problem it's a function of the torch.

To copy the description from the ZL site


> Automatically stepping down from High to Medium, and from Medium to Low when battery capacity is low



So depending on the battery voltage the torch automatically steps down to 90Lm then 3Lm



Nicola said:


> I understood your point.
> 
> Are these real time measurements or it's just an example?



No sorry Nicola they were just figures i used as an example.
From the ZL site the torch will step down from high to medium (500Lm to 90Lm) then medium to low (90Lm to 3Lm).



BWX said:


> If that was the case, I would see your point, but that's not the case. Not for me. I use Xtar 3100mah 18650 - basically, Panasonic 3100 18650 cells. I have never sat there and let my light stay at 500 lumen until it drains, I just wouldn't do that with this light, I would use a light with more metal in there for that, like a 2x 18650 light- but that's besides the point. I get just about the same amount on 500 lumens as I would if it didn't step down because I never run the batts that low. I would probably get closer to 1.7 hours or more.. either way. It wouldn't be 20 minutes that's for damn sure.
> 
> here's what they say on ZL-
> 
> .
> So maybe you should get better batteries? That's if you are using crummy ones I guess.



If that works for you then good on ya.

For me personally i do NOT want a auto step down.


Those figures were just picked at random to better show what i mean.
I will time the step down when i get some free time and see what the actual time is.

The actual figure is irrelevant for me and my uses though as the cut-off voltages are 2.7v on both my non step down MKI and my step down MKII.

As i said above i have AW, Redilast, Panasonic non protected in capacities from 2200mAh through to 3400mAh the problem is NOT my batteries.
I just prefer a torch without a auto step down, simple.


----------



## fnj

kwak said:


> Those figures were just picked at random to better show what i mean.



Let me get this straight. So you just completely made up your stepdown numbers, passed them off as real, and complain about the design based on those bogus numbers?


----------



## PocketBeam

Lets table the step down discussion until actual measurements are done, ok? Table.. measurements, pun intended.


----------



## Byggeren

Remember that running the light on high is putting a load on the battery, it will at some point reach the set low voltage limit. At this point you can have the flash light turn completely off, which is the easy thing to do, or you can let the electronics step down to a lower level and still get some more usable light out of the battery without destroying it. If nothing else, it's enough to find the back up battery. This does not necessary mean you get less runtime on high. I know I prefer the step down rather than complete darkness, it's a great feature!


----------



## Nicola

kwak said:


> No sorry Nicola they were just figures i used as an example.



So what I mean is:

Now I'm very interested to see a full runtime review because a judgment of this feature can vary depending on WHEN the step down occurs.

Maybe you could still accept a step down feature if it allows you to still run 90% of the comparable no-step-down max-output runtime,
while most people could agree that a step down after only 40% of the no-step-down max-output runtime is quite limiting your usage freedom...

Imho.


----------



## kwak

fnj said:


> Let me get this straight. So you just completely made up your stepdown numbers, passed them off as real, and complain about the design based on those bogus numbers?



You indeed do NOT have it straight, in any way what-so-ever.

The 90 mins was used by Byggeren as an example, i then expanded on his example to better put across the point i was trying to make.

No one has tried to deceive anyone in any way what-so-ever.
To the point where when questioned i was clear as daylight about my response.


If you did reread the thread then you will see that my complaint was not registered as a complaint.
I put in my list of negatives "Auto step down" that's NOT a "complaint about the design" it's a negative regarding a feature.


If you do not like my review fair enough, compared to many others reviews on here it's pretty poor.
Pics are fuzzy, beam shots are terrible, review is quick, i know that.
Still it's all i have so either take something from it, or ignore it, your choice.


I wrote my quick review because that's all i've had time to do.
I wrote MY thoughts and MY opinions, obviously other peoples opinions will differ.
Again fair enough, i can't very well write other peoples opinions though can i




Currently running the step down test, i'll see how quickly the new light steps down and cuts-off.
I'm running my MKIa SC600 next to it so it'll be a interesting test i think.


----------



## kwak

Nicola said:


> So what I mean is:
> 
> Now I'm very interested to see a full runtime review because a judgment of this feature can vary depending on WHEN the step down occurs.
> 
> Maybe you could still accept a step down feature if it allows you to still run 90% of the comparable no-step-down max-output runtime,
> while most people could agree that a step down after only 40% of the no-step-down max-output runtime is quite limiting your usage freedom...
> 
> Imho.



The kids are in bed, i've got the MKIa and the MKII lined up next to each other with my phone videoing both beam shots.
I'll run both till the cut-off kicks in.

I haven't used my 3400mAh as i have a early start tomorrow and it's already 01:45 here.
But i have 2 x Redilast 2200mAh cells, both at 4.09v, both are good cells in good condition so any drop won't be as a result of a poor quality battery.


----------



## PocketBeam

I liked the review. After you do rundown/stepdown test, could you do some throw beamshots comparing mk I to mk II? It would be nice to see what you mean by the mk II throws farther.


----------



## WmArnold1

kwak said:


> Currently running the step down test, i'll see how quickly the new light steps down and cuts-off.
> I'm running my MKIa SC600 next to it so it'll be a interesting test i think.



YES, this will be a very interesting test Kwak - thanks in advance!!! For comparison; my Mk-1b steps-down from H1 to M1 after about 2 hours and spends more than an hour in M1 before stepping-down again, into L1. (fwiw, I'm using 3100 mAh NCR 18650A's) As I said above, I've never been patient enough to endure the time required to reach the shut-down point, but I guesstimate that it's about 2 hours after stepping-down from M1 into L1. Until you weigh-in with your Mk-II results; I think that's a fair predictor of what to expect.

So; I hope you're prepared to babysit your test for a total of five hours (give-or-take) before reaching total darkness. And, that's if your light wasn't left on H2, M2, or L2, because; if you accidently do that, the time to darkness will be a _**lot**_ longer. Btw, you should probably use a fan for the first 2 hours; my Mk-Ib gets pretty hot just sitting without a breeze.. ;-)


----------



## TEEJ

Its ~ 900 L to start (not 500 L unless you are going for a softer starting drive amperage to begin with, etc...)....and drops from there one level out of ~ 11 IIRC.

Its not just on at 900 L, and then going dark....which was the concern.

ALL lights with a turbo mode and/or heat management have the ability to be extra bright for a while if needed, like a car with nitrous injection, etc.

For example: You can have a regulated light with no heat management system, as its driven softly enough that its high is like another light's medium...and then not have to drop to medium, as you already started there.

Some prefer a dimmer light that can't get brighter than say 500 L, and some prefer a brighter light that dims down to say 500 L if needed to manage the extra heat from the added brightness.


We each choose the UI/heat management scenario we prefer.


----------



## BWX

Yeah I am really interested to see those results of the step down test. Use a fan though!


----------



## michael3

if someone doesn't like or prefer the step down what is the problem. let them live in peace. I personally like the step down feature and depend on it. but if someone else doesn't then there is nothing wrong with that.


----------



## BWX

michael3 said:


> if someone doesn't like or prefer the step down what is the problem. let them live in peace. I personally like the step down feature and depend on it. but if someone else doesn't then there is nothing wrong with that.



LOL- No one is saying there is anything wrong with that.. 

They, (we, I) are arguing, (discussing, talking) about if it really makes any difference at all given the fact the best batteries are used.


----------



## sdr

kwak said:


> Why on earth they put that ugly lump on it i don't know, if i could get it coated again i'd grind it straight off.
> I don't know of 1 single person that has attached a lanyard to their SC600, rubbish idea.



Actually, I personally love that "lump." If you would care to see what I had to say about it back in December of 2011 you can click here: *http://tinyurl.com/Lanyard-Bump *and scroll down to my pictorial post -- It's the 3rd one down.

Cheers!


----------



## michael3

it just sounded like from some of the "argument" that some people are making a simple point that they would prefer no step no matter what. that is all I am refering to. that is fine for them. as far as the rest of the debate that is great. good info, good things to know for everybody.


BWX said:


> LOL- No one is saying there is anything wrong with that..
> 
> They, (we, I) are arguing, (discussing, talking) about if it really makes any difference at all given the fact the best batteries are used.


----------



## kwak

WmArnold1 said:


> YES, this will be a very interesting test Kwak - thanks in advance!!! For comparison; my Mk-1b steps-down from H1 to M1 after about 2 hours and spends more than an hour in M1 before stepping-down again, into L1. (fwiw, I'm using 3100 mAh NCR 18650A's) As I said above, I've never been patient enough to endure the time required to reach the shut-down point, but I guesstimate that it's about 2 hours after stepping-down from M1 into L1. Until you weigh-in with your Mk-II results; I think that's a fair predictor of what to expect.
> 
> So; I hope you're prepared to babysit your test for a total of five hours (give-or-take) before reaching total darkness. And, that's if your light wasn't left on H2, M2, or L2, because; if you accidently do that, the time to darkness will be a _**lot**_ longer. Btw, you should probably use a fan for the first 2 hours; my Mk-Ib gets pretty hot just sitting without a breeze.. ;-)



I wish i'd read your post before starting 

So i lined up the torches so the beams were next to each, set both to 500Lm, set the phone to video mode and kept an eye on the torches.

100 mins the MKI hit it's low voltage cut-out, the head was at 48c
175 mins the MKII stepped down with the head at 32c

Removed the MKI battery after it cut-off and it read 3v
Removed the MKII battery after it stepped down and it read 2.9v

Batteries used were AW 2200mAh both were at 4.09v before starting and both batteries are the same age with the same charge cycles.


So i'll be the first to put my hand up and admit that i jumped the gun with regards to the step down and that in actual use it's not really much of a problem.

I am absolutely stunned at how efficient the MKII is compared to the MKI.
If both head temps were close i would say that maybe there was a problem with the MKI's battery.
But the fact that the MKII's head never went above 32c backs up the results, as it shows me that the torch is running more efficiently and not converting anywhere near as much battery energy into heat.

It also fits with my experience of real world use of the MKI as i get around 100mins when out in the mountains.

In all honesty i'm absolutely stunned, that's close to twice as efficient 


I won't edit the "negative points" list as it would stop a lot of the following posts making sense.

But i will say that in real world use the auto step down is NOT that much of a problem.
I would still prefer it stay on 500Lm until it hit the LVC, but with only 0.2v before the LVC kicks in it's still very usable.

Also noticed last night that the MKII has a spring + connection rather than the dot the MKIa has.
MKIa left MKII right







So i won't need to use my little magnets on my flat top batteries any more :thumbsup:


I did try more beam shots, but i just can't seem to get the ISO and exposure to a level where it's close to what i'm seeing with my eyes.
I'll have another go tomorrow night though :thumbsup:

Again, i apologise for jumping the gun on the auto step down, sorry.


----------



## kwak

TEEJ said:


> Its ~ 900 L to start (not 500 L unless you are going for a softer starting drive amperage to begin with, etc...)....and drops from there one level out of ~ 11 IIRC.
> 
> Its not just on at 900 L, and then going dark....which was the concern.
> 
> ALL lights with a turbo mode and/or heat management have the ability to be extra bright for a while if needed, like a car with nitrous injection, etc.
> 
> For example: You can have a regulated light with no heat management system, as its driven softly enough that its high is like another light's medium...and then not have to drop to medium, as you already started there.
> 
> Some prefer a dimmer light that can't get brighter than say 500 L, and some prefer a brighter light that dims down to say 500 L if needed to manage the extra heat from the added brightness.
> 
> 
> We each choose the UI/heat management scenario we prefer.



I do use the turbo mode and have found it extremely useful on many many occasions, i personally judge a lights output on it's constant output though, as this is what i'll be using the vast vast majority of the time.

It's like buying a car 100% based upon how it feels at 150mph
Sure i will hit 150mph a few times throughout it's life BUT to me it's more important how it feels on B-roads at 50mph or the motorway at 80mph.


----------



## BWX

Wow that is really interesting info! 

I wonder how my MKI(b) with the U2 would do in comparison.. I guess there is one way to find out, but I do not have a way to measure the temp accurately. The time alone would be interesting, but couldn't compare directly with your results for obvious reasons. Still would be interesting.


----------



## WmArnold1

BWX said:


> Wow that is really interesting info!
> 
> I wonder how my MKI(b) with the U2 would do in comparison.. I guess there is one way to find out, but I do not have a way to measure the temp accurately. The time alone would be interesting, but couldn't compare directly with your results for obvious reasons. Still would be interesting.



Note that I posted the results for my Mk-I(b) above, specifically; here and here

What seems most interesting to me up-front, is that Kwak's Mk-II is getting 175 minutes before the first step-down using 2200 mah cells whereas my Mk-I(b) is only getting 130 minutes or so using 3100 mah cells - WOW - I'm sure the Mk-II is brighter too.


----------



## WmArnold1

kwak said:


> So i'll be the first to put my hand up and admit that i jumped the gun with regards to the step down and that in actual use it's not really much of a problem.
> 
> ... I won't edit the "negative points" list as it would stop a lot of the following posts making sense.
> 
> But i will say that in real world use the auto step down is NOT that much of a problem.
> I would still prefer it stay on 500Lm until it hit the LVC, but with only 0.2v before the LVC kicks in it's still very usable.



I sincerely admire the way you did your own real-world test and published your findings honestly. Kudos Kwak!

But, I still respectfully suggest that you edit your earlier posts, appending a line in _RED_ saying that you reversed your opinion within a later post; #716. (including a link) Editing your earlier posts won't stop the following posts from making sense because they each quoted your original (un-edited) post.



kwak said:


> I am absolutely stunned at how efficient the MKII is compared to the MKI.



Me too! Your Mk-II got 175 minutes using 2200 mah cells and my Mk-I(b) only gets 130 minutes with 3100 mah cells - I'm truly envious! Great Job ZL!!!

Someday; please clock the M1 "reserve" run-time following the first step-down. This test doesn't have to start from a full charge; E.g. I'm doing my tests just before I recharge to get an idea how closely my sporadic EDC use gets to said reserve, and, how much run-time there is in M1 before stepping-down into L1. Thanks in advance.


----------



## BWX

That is truly a huge jump in efficiency. The entire MKII is making more sense to me, now.



WmArnold1 said:


> Note that I posted the results for my Mk-I(b) above, specifically; here and here
> 
> What seems most interesting to me up-front, is that Kwak's Mk-II is getting 175 minutes before the first step-down using 2200 mah cells whereas my Mk-I(b) is only getting 130 minutes or so using 3100 mah cells - WOW - I'm sure the Mk-II is brighter too.




Oh yeah.. I am still interested to see what mine would do though.. Should be very similar I guess.


----------



## fnj

kwak said:


> [Stepdown test results]



Very nice test! Very informative. Thanks are due.


----------



## WmArnold1

Overclocker said:


> dude after all the BS you posted earlier you simply had it coming LOL
> 
> after what you did i'm not sure we could trust your data. it doesn't make sense how mk2 could be so much more efficient that mk1 (mk1 is very efficient to begin with). but perhaps most telling is the lower temps on mk2. higher efficiency simply couldn't account for that huge a temp discrepancy. perhaps mk2 has a thermal throttling feature ZL isn't telling us about



Well.. It's not _*all*_ efficiency gains Overclocker; apparently, the Mk-II is stepping-down closer to the 2.7 volt shutdown level than the Mk-I(b) did:

Note that Kwak's Mk-I(a) shut-down around 3.0 volts, my Mk-I(b) steps down around 3.370 and 2.915 volts, and, last but not least; Kwak's Mk-II first step-down occurred around 2.9 volts. So, some of the "efficiency" certainly comes from shifting the first step-down by 0.47 volts, give-or-take.

Personally; I trust Kwak's readings to the extent that anyone can typically trust common DVM's (digital volt-meters) Hopefully, others will post their experiences soon. Kwak may have made a mistake, but I respect him for gracefully correcting himself.


----------



## AussieRanga

Duplicate


----------



## Bullzeyebill

I've removed several posts that are flaming, disrespectful to others, and responses to those posts. Attack the post, not the poster. Also, be careful when accusing others of trolling. It's a flashlight folks, get along.

Bill


----------



## Cessquill

TEEJ said:


> The Eagletac 3400 mah cells fit the SC600 (Some 3400's are too fat), and don't sag like the others, much better overall performance, more than JUST the added mah, they hold higher draw much longer, etc.


From what we now know, does this mean that the Eagletac 3400 will fit into the MkII? It measures 18.6mm x 68mm. My guess is they will.

Kwak - I don't know whether this compares with any of the cells you've got?

Being my first 18650, I'd like to get some batteries ordered in and charged up beforehand.


----------



## kwak

WmArnold1 said:


> I sincerely admire the way you did your own real-world test and published your findings honestly. Kudos Kwak!
> 
> But, I still respectfully suggest that you edit your earlier posts, appending a line in _RED_ saying that you reversed your opinion within a later post; #716. (including a link) Editing your earlier posts won't stop the following posts from making sense because they each quoted your original (un-edited) post.



Great idea, done :thumbsup:




WmArnold1 said:


> Me too! Your Mk-II got 175 minutes using 2200 mah cells and my Mk-I(b) only gets 130 minutes with 3100 mah cells - I'm truly envious! Great Job ZL!!!
> 
> Someday; please clock the M1 "reserve" run-time following the first step-down. This test doesn't have to start from a full charge; E.g. I'm doing my tests just before I recharge to get an idea how closely my sporadic EDC use gets to said reserve, and, how much run-time there is in M1 before stepping-down into L1. Thanks in advance.



Do you mean MKII?
As my MKIa does not have a step down.




WmArnold1 said:


> Well.. It's not _*all*_ efficiency gains Overclocker; apparently, the Mk-II is stepping-down closer to the 2.7 volt shutdown level than the Mk-I(b) did:
> 
> Note that Kwak's Mk-I(a) shut-down around 3.0 volts, my Mk-I(b) steps down around 3.370 and 2.915 volts, and, last but not least; Kwak's Mk-II first step-down occurred around 2.9 volts. So, some of the "efficiency" certainly comes from shifting the first step-down by 0.47 volts, give-or-take.
> 
> Personally; I trust Kwak's readings to the extent that anyone can typically trust common DVM's (digital volt-meters) Hopefully, others will post their experiences soon. Kwak may have made a mistake, but I respect him for gracefully correcting himself.



Should clarify that those voltages were taken seconds after the MKIa shut off and the MKII stepped down.

I have just retested the batteries again now they have a chance to cool down and recover and i'm getting
MKIa = 3.53v
MKII = 3.38v

With lithium batteries they have a tendency to "bounce back" after the load has been removed, the cell temperature also has an effect on the voltage.

I have thought about rigging it up so the battery is external so i can monitor voltages during tests.
Problem is though, the test would be pretty pointless as it's not putting the cell in a "real world" scenario as you've removed heat from the equation. 




Bullzeyebill said:


> I've removed several posts that are flaming, disrespectful to others, and responses to those posts. Attack the post, not the poster. Also, be careful when accusing others of trolling. It's a flashlight folks, get along.
> 
> Bill



Thanks Bill


----------



## Nicola

kwak said:


> 100 mins the MKI hit it's low voltage cut-out, the head was at 48c
> 175 mins the MKII stepped down with the head at 32c
> ...
> Batteries used were AW 2200mAh ...



Considering that I ordered the SC600 MkII along with a ZL 3100 mah battery... WOW!


----------



## TEEJ

Nicola said:


> Considering that I ordered the SC600 MkII along with a ZL 3100 mah battery... WOW!



Should have gotten the 3400 mah (Eagletac for example...)

Then even more WOW


----------



## WmArnold1

kwak said:


> Do you mean MKII?
> As my MKIa does not have a step down.



Yes; obviously you can't measure anything regarding step-downs on your Mk-I(a)




kwak said:


> Should clarify that those voltages were taken seconds after the MKIa shut off and the MKII stepped down.
> 
> I have just retested the batteries again now they have a chance to cool down and recover and i'm getting
> MKIa = 3.53v
> MKII = 3.38v
> 
> With lithium batteries they have a tendency to "bounce back" after the load has been removed, the cell temperature also has an effect on the voltage.



Said bounce-back is one of the reasons that measuring step-down voltages is hard to quantify. Furthermore, ZL has said that the way the light decides when to step-down is more complicated than simply measuring battery voltage.

However, I still feel that measuring the no-load voltage within seconds of a step-down gives us a fair idea of where we stand in the battery discharge curve. And, Imho, ZL is banking on a little bounce-back after stepping-down around 2.9V. Slightly off-topic; I'll bet there isn't much bounce-back after stepping-down from M1 to L1..



kwak said:


> I have thought about rigging it up so the battery is external so i can monitor voltages during tests.
> Problem is though, the test would be pretty pointless as it's not putting the cell in a "real world" scenario as you've removed heat from the equation.



I agree; we may never know exactly how ZL decides when to step-down from H1 to M1 and stay-down as the voltage bounces back a little. But, again, *consistently* measuring the zero-load voltage within seconds of a step-down is a good benchmark for us to compare.


----------



## TEEJ

How about aiming the lights at a lux meter with a USB data logger and letting'm rip, and see what they do?



If they both run for say 2 hours, a pre/post reading of cell voltage would reveal who's cell had the most go go juice left...and a relative efficiency curve against the brightness, etc.


----------



## PocketBeam

WmArnold1 said:


> Furthermore, ZL has said that the way the light decides when to step-down is more complicated than simply measuring battery voltage.



So maybe it is time based and voltage based. The longer it takes to drop voltage, the longer it waits to drop output. So lets say you have a 1500mah battery, it may drop levels at 3.2volts. Then with a 3000mah battery, which in theory can run twice as long, it drops levels at 2.8 volts.

So end result is that a bigger battery gives longer runtime on high, but the SAME runtime on the dropped down level. Hope that makes sense. And, of course, my numbers are hypothetical.


----------



## Nicola

TEEJ said:


> Should have gotten the 3400 mah (Eagletac for example...)
> 
> Then even more WOW



I've got a wonderful xtar 3400, but since it's 68,5mm long while MkII accept up to 68,0mm, I decided for a ZL battery (just to be sure I can play with my new toy when it will arrive...)


----------



## neo_xeno

just received my sc600 MKII and can confirm that eagletac 3400's fit


----------



## kwak

Had a bit of a play with the camera on manual mode tonight and i've found a setting i'm pretty happy with.

So here are 2 beam shots, both are on Turbo mode, the wall is approximately 10 meter away from both the camera and torches.

MKIa *edited








MKII slightly brighter with a slightly tighter hopspot







I'm redoing the stepdown/run time test as well as i've just found out my temp gun was not operating correctly.
Rather than mess about with video i've set my Gopro to snap a pic every 5 secs, i've also mounted a clock in front of the camera so i don't have to mess about checking pic meta data for times.

Fingers crossed my gopro battery lasts longer than the MKII's battery


----------



## Lurveleven

It doesn't look like the camera used the same setting for the two pictures.


----------



## Nicola

It doesn't look but it is so. Both pics have same parameters (saved on my desktop and checked):

Canon
Canon DIGITAL IXUS 980 IS
f/2.8
1/6 sec.
ISO-200
No flash, compulsory


----------



## melty

Lurveleven said:


> It doesn't look like the camera used the same setting for the two pictures.



The EXIF data shows identical settings between the pictures.



kwak said:


> Had a bit of a play with the camera on manual mode tonight and i've found a setting i'm pretty happy with.
> 
> So here are 2 beam shots, both are on Turbo mode, the wall is approximately 10 meter away from both the camera and torches.
> 
> MKIb
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> MKII slightly brighter with a slightly tighter hopspot
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm redoing the stepdown/run time test as well as i've just found out my temp gun was not operating correctly.
> Rather than mess about with video i've set my Gopro to snap a pic every 5 secs, i've also mounted a clock in front of the camera so i don't have to mess about checking pic meta data for times.
> 
> Fingers crossed my gopro battery lasts longer than the MKII's battery



I thought you had a MKIa. In any case that MKII looks a LOT brighter. That has to be a larger jump than just from 750 to 900 lumens doesn't it? Are you sure they were both in turbo mode? Do they look that much brighter in person? Questions question question... 

That spill looks WAY brighter. I'm officially impressed.


----------



## kengps

Anybody have a Lux reading with a good meter yet?


----------



## kwak

Yes sorry, mine is indeed a MKIa i've edited the post.

Yep both were on turbo mode and both had fresh batteries.

The MKII is noticeably brighter in every scenario i've tested, from close work to hiking.
It's not vastly brighter but after a day or 2's use i could tell you which is which just from the brightness and beam pattern.

Not sure what happened the other day, but on tonight's hike i felt the MKII getting very warm, certainly as warm as the MKIa and certainly warmer than the 32c i reported.

So i tested again tonight with a different heat gun and found that the MKII runs around 2c-3c hotter than the MKIa

I will post the details later as i've also got a LOT less run time with the MKII this time.


----------



## PocketBeam

Just got mine. Yay. I noticed the box rattles, oh no! It was just the loose pocket clip.

My Orbtronic 3400 just barely fit, in fact it slightly sticks halfway. And to get it out I have to do a small palm slap. Not bad though, but I would be careful.

The orange peel is very light, almost a smooth a smooth reflector. This means it should throw farther. But the beam is not perfect. If you rotate the flashlight while on, you can clearly see the beam rotating. If you don't use a white wall, or don't rotate you tend not to notice. I will need to check more at night.

The edges around the button are sharpish, same as the first gen SC52.

Also seems the lows are lower than the SC52, but I need to test and compare more.

The clip can be mounted tail or head, and when on the tail, the laynard bump stops it from rotating all the way around. The clip has flanges so it is easier to put on, but these flanges stick up more than I like. Also, the clip end does not touch the flashlight body, there is a half milimeter gap. So not the tightest clip.

Everything else seems great. Another solid light, glad I got it. Any questions, other than runtime?


----------



## kwak

Ok got some weird results

Started both torches at the same time, both had a AW 2200mAh battery both batteries at 4.08v

1 hour and 21 mins the MKII stepped down, removed battery and found voltage at 3.13v
1 hour and 23 mins the MKI turned off with battery voltage at 3.31v

I put the MKII battery back in and continued the test.
Must have missed the second step down (camera battery died) but i did witness it turn off after 5 hours 24 mins


It's looking like either i missed the step-down on the first test, or the battery i used for this test is absolutely knackered
Missing the step-down could also explain why i got low temp readings in the first test.

Still that's not bad, 80mins on 500Lm mode is as good as my MKIa BUT it then has a further 4 hours run time left on lower modes

IF i did miss the step-down in the first test it would seem to me at least that the lumen drop is not as significant as i first thought.
Obviously this was white wall blasting, in real world use i expect the drop to be more noticeable.

Cracking torch though i'm really really happy with it, just need to grind that lanyard bump off now :devil:


----------



## SGH77

neo_xeno said:


> just received my sc600 MKII and can confirm that eagletac 3400's fit



Does anyone know if these will fit? http://lygte-info.dk/review/batteries2012/AmpMax 18650 3400mAh (Black) UK.html


----------



## WmArnold1

kwak said:


> Ok got some weird results
> 
> Started both torches at the same time, both had a AW 2200mAh battery both batteries at 4.08v
> 
> 1 hour and 21 mins the MKII stepped down, removed battery and found voltage at 3.13v
> 1 hour and 23 mins the MKI turned off with battery voltage at 3.31v
> 
> I put the MKII battery back in and continued the test.
> Must have missed the second step down (camera battery died) but i did witness it turn off after _*5 hours 24 mins*_



I don't think it's weird that your Mk-II is stepping-down closer to the way my (and probably all) Mk-I(b)'s do; 130 min T/H1 + 60 min M1 + 120 min L1 = 5 hours & 10 minutes (give or take; I'm using 3100 mah cells) That's what many CPF'ers expected.

However, as much as I treasure the step-down feature, I would be glad to see ZL extend H1 run-time a little by decreasing the 3-hour M1/L1 "reserve" a little. Your first results gave me the impression that they did. Further benchmarking by everyone will firm this feature up, statistically.


----------



## kwak

WmArnold1 said:


> I don't think it's weird that your Mk-II is stepping-down closer to the way my (and probably all) Mk-I(b)'s do. That's what many CPF'ers expected.
> 
> However, as much as I treasure the step-down feature, I would be glad to see ZL extend H1 run-time a little by decreasing the 4-hour M1/L1 "reserve" a little. Your first results gave me the impression that they did. Further benchmarking by everyone will firm this feature up, statistically.



Be good to see what sort of times everyone else is getting before the step-down.

Not really done any sort of torch review before so it's tough finding a way to check the step-down.
My first plan was to video the torch, but non of my cameras batteries last long enough 

The gopro set to take a pic every 5 secs was perfect as i was able to skip through the pics to view the light intensity.
The battery only lasts around 90 mins though and i can't charge AND use the camera at the same time 


I'll have a think about it and see if i can come up with another solution.


----------



## 20$Bandit

Just got my MK II, I am very impressed. The total weight with Tenergy 2800 Mah is 4.7 oz for a 900 lumen light that is amazing!


----------



## PocketBeam

I ran mine for half an hour at H2, 500 lumens, no turbo. It got up to 49.4C/120.9F. Which is very hot, but barely holdable.


----------



## carl

Looks great. I hope someone tells them to round the corners around the bezel and button opening.


----------



## Cessquill

neo_xeno said:


> just received my sc600 MKII and can confirm that eagletac 3400's fit


Thank you  I'll put in an order shortly.


----------



## shelm

neo_xeno said:


> just received my sc600 MKII and can confirm that eagletac 3400's fit



of course they fit  *Eagletac *3400 are the shortest protected NCR18650B's on the market. 68mm long only.
Has anyone tried cells longer than 69.0mm, e.g. *generic *protected NCR18650/NCR18650A/NCR18650B's?

The NCR18650PD is unprotected and shorter:


----------



## henry1960

Orbtronic 3400 Fits In The New MKII Also Tight But Fits...


----------



## BWX

My X-tar 3100 (Panasonic) 18650 are tight. I have about 5 of them. One I had to take the label off, the others are just a little tight, and one I have to rotate a certain direction to fit past the inside ridge in my MKI(b). They all work though. 

Is the MKII that same inside diameter? Does it have that ridge?


----------



## mauiblue

Great to see people are receiving their orders. The photos posted on this thread of the new light looks cool. 

Now to muster a bit more patience until mine comes in

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2


----------



## TEEJ

BWX said:


> My X-tar 3100 (Panasonic) 18650 are tight. I have about 5 of them. One I had to take the label off, the others are just a little tight, and one I have to rotate a certain direction to fit past the inside ridge in my MKI(b). They all work though.
> 
> Is the MKII that same inside diameter? Does it have that ridge?



Hmm, my Xtar 3400's did not fit into the Mk1 at ALL.

The Eagletac 3400's slipped right in....Callies Kustoms 3400's were too tight to fit, but close...and the Fastech 3400's could fit, but were very tight.


----------



## BWX

^^ Interesting info.. thanks.


----------



## holylight

This is most powerful beam ever build in action  *Published on Apr 8, 2013 * 120804-N-ZZ999-001 SAN DIEGO, Calif. (Jul. 30, 2012) The Laser Weapon System (LaWS) temporarily installed aboard the guided-missile destroyer USS Dewey (DDG 105) in San Diego, Calif., is a technology demonstrator built by the Naval Sea Systems Command from commercial fiber solid state lasers, utilizing combination methods developed at the Naval Research Laboratory. LaWS can be directed onto targets from the radar track obtained from a MK 15 Phalanx Close-In Weapon system or other targeting source. The Office of Naval Research's Solid State Laser (SSL) portfolio includes LaWS development and upgrades providing a quick reaction capability for the fleet with an affordable SSL weapon prototype. This capability provides Navy ships a method for Sailors to easily defeat small boat threats and aerial targets without using bullets. (U.S. Navy video by Office of Naval Research/ Released) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Omold...ature=youtu.be


----------



## Cessquill

Umm, OK. Have I missed something?


----------



## TEEJ

holylight said:


> This is most powerful beam ever build in action  *Published on Apr 8, 2013 * 120804-N-ZZ999-001 SAN DIEGO, Calif. (Jul. 30, 2012) The Laser Weapon System (LaWS) temporarily installed aboard the guided-missile destroyer USS Dewey (DDG 105) in San Diego, Calif., is a technology demonstrator built by the Naval Sea Systems Command from commercial fiber solid state lasers, utilizing combination methods developed at the Naval Research Laboratory. LaWS can be directed onto targets from the radar track obtained from a MK 15 Phalanx Close-In Weapon system or other targeting source. The Office of Naval Research's Solid State Laser (SSL) portfolio includes LaWS development and upgrades providing a quick reaction capability for the fleet with an affordable SSL weapon prototype. This capability provides Navy ships a method for Sailors to easily defeat small boat threats and aerial targets without using bullets. (U.S. Navy video by Office of Naval Research/ Released) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Omold...ature=youtu.be



Wow, I never realized the full turbo effect of the SC600 Mk II, the Navy has turned them into weapons....amazing discovery.


----------



## PocketBeam

Did anyone else notice beam artifacts? Try rotating the light while shining on a white wall. Is it just mine?


----------



## toysareforboys

PocketBeam said:


> Did anyone else notice beam artifacts? Try rotating the light while shining on a white wall. Is it just mine?


I haven't received mine yet  I got my 65mm length Panasonic 3400mah batteries all charged up and waiting though!!

-Jamie M.


----------



## bexamous

Oh shoot I don't check up for a few weeks and now the MK2 is out? Is zebralight.com only place to order?-- Says backordered? Lame: (  (


----------



## toysareforboys

bexamous said:


> Oh shoot I don't check up for a few weeks and now the MK2 is out? Is zebralight.com only place to order?-- Says backordered? Lame: (  (


These guys are getting a big shipment any day, pre-order is not full: https://illuminationsupply.com/zebr...0-lm-flashlight-18650-p-495.html#.UWX2ylf4Y2E

Use coupon code ZebraStripes for an INSANE deal.

Best batteries to use with it: http://www.fasttech.com/products/0/...onic-ncr18650b-rechargeable-3400mah-37v-18650

-Jamie M.


----------



## holylight

toysareforboys said:


> Best batteries to use with it: http://www.fasttech.com/products/0/...onic-ncr18650b-rechargeable-3400mah-37v-18650
> 
> -Jamie M.


 Clever choice. Very good.


----------



## sassaquin

bexamous said:


> Oh shoot I don't check up for a few weeks and now the MK2 is out? Is zebralight.com only place to order?-- Says backordered? Lame: (  (



E2Fiieldcare.com (CellGuy) has a post on The Marketplace that they have a few in stock and he also lists a discount code.


----------



## Sh3ngLong

Would love to see beamshot comparisons between the old and the new! 

** Sent from my Galaxy Note II **


----------



## toysareforboys

sassaquin said:


> E2Fiieldcare.com (CellGuy) has a post on The Marketplace that they have a few in stock and he also lists a discount code.


Nice! Came out about $8 more expensive for me than my link above, but if you don't want to wait, that's a great option 

-Jamie M.


----------



## henry1960

PocketBeam said:


> Did anyone else notice beam artifacts? Try rotating the light while shining on a white wall. Is it just mine?



No...Yours Is Not The Only One Mine Is The Same...:shakehead


----------



## Nicola

Sh3ngLong said:


> Would love to see beamshot comparisons between the old and the new!



Have a look here: http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...t-SC600-MkII&p=4179996&viewfull=1#post4179996


----------



## toysareforboys

Nicola said:


> Have a look here: http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...t-SC600-MkII&p=4179996&viewfull=1#post4179996


Thanks for the link. A LOT sharper hotspot, might have to DC fix it, should help with the beam artifacts too 

-Jamie M.


----------



## BWX

toysareforboys said:


> These guys are getting a big shipment any day, pre-order is not full: https://illuminationsupply.com/zebr...0-lm-flashlight-18650-p-495.html#.UWX2ylf4Y2E
> 
> Use coupon code ****** for an INSANE deal.
> 
> Best batteries to use with it: http://www.fasttech.com/products/0/...onic-ncr18650b-rechargeable-3400mah-37v-18650
> 
> -Jamie M.


Ok, you convinced me... just pre-ordered on a whim.


----------



## PocketBeam

henry1960 said:


> No...Yours Is Not The Only One Mine Is The Same...:shakehead



Thanks for the confirmation. Well, at least in real world use I haven't noticed the artifacts. I used the light for an hour last night and didn't notice.
I think the artifacts are from the square led, and the almost smooth reflector. So you get more throw, a smaller hotspot, and a sharper hotspot. It would be nice to see some throw beamshot comparisons between the mk-Ia and the mk-II.

I have noticed that on non-turbo, high2 or medium1, the run time is great. After that hour of H2, I still got four flashes from the battery guage. And I tried the highest medium (M1) for nine hours straight and after that I still had three flashes from the battery guage. And doing a ceiling bounce with the M1 mode, I could still read a book in the room. So the runtime is great.


----------



## toysareforboys

BWX said:


> Ok, you convinced me... just pre-ordered on a whim.


Nice  Did the coupon code work for ya?

-Jamie M.


----------



## holylight

PocketBeam said:


> Thanks for the confirmation. Well, at least in real world use I haven't noticed the artifacts. I used the light for an hour last night and didn't notice.
> I think the artifacts are from the square led, and the almost smooth reflector. So you get more throw, a smaller hotspot, and a sharper hotspot. It would be nice to see some throw beamshot comparisons between the mk-Ia and the mk-II.
> 
> I have noticed that on non-turbo, high2 or medium1, the run time is great. After that hour of H2, I still got four flashes from the battery guage. And I tried the highest medium (M1) for nine hours straight and after that I still had three flashes from the battery guage. And doing a ceiling bounce with the M1 mode, I could still read a book in the room. So the runtime is great.



Good.


----------



## sdr

After seeing these beamshots that were provided by _*kwak*_ ( *http://tinyurl.com/SC600MkII-Beamshots )* I couldn't hold out any longer. I ordered the SC600 MkII directly from ZebraLight on Monday of this week -- 4/8/13. Yesterday 4/10/13 I fired off an inquiry to ZebraLight asking when they anticipated the SC600 MkII would be available for shipment? I received a response from Lilian Xu in _Department Sales_ less than 8 hours later. Here is her response to my question: *"The estimated shipping date is about three to four weeks if you place the order now."*

I ordered and received the original SC600 directly from ZebraLight back in November of 2011 and have carried it daily since that time. As a pocket-able EDC torch it is the best all-around light that I have ever owned. The amount of light that tiny unit produces is phenomenal. It is hard to imagine how much better the MkII version will be? I guess I'll just have to wait to find out. But that's where it stands with ZebraLight if you order right now -- 3 to 4 weeks. *sigh* I just thought I'd pass that information along. Cheers!


----------



## sdr

toysareforboys said:


> These guys are getting a big shipment any day, pre-order is not full: https://illuminationsupply.com/zebr...0-lm-flashlight-18650-p-495.html#.UWX2ylf4Y2E
> 
> Use coupon code ZebraStripes for an INSANE deal.
> 
> Best batteries to use with it: http://www.fasttech.com/products/0/...onic-ncr18650b-rechargeable-3400mah-37v-18650
> 
> -Jamie M.



Wow! I just tried your Coupon Code and you're right -- that is an INSANE discount. Too bad I already ordered mine directly from ZL.


----------



## toysareforboys

sdr said:


> Wow! I just tried your Coupon Code and you're right -- that is an INSANE discount. Too bad I already ordered mine directly from ZL.


Damn straight! Same deal on the SC52 as well, retarded how good their prices are!

I would cancel with ZL and order from them, you'll get it sooner I guarantee 

-Jamie M.


----------



## eloreno

toysareforboys said:


> Damn straight! Same deal on the SC52 as well, retarded how good their prices are!
> 
> I would cancel with ZL and order from them, you'll get it sooner I guarantee
> 
> -Jamie M.




Good advice, this.


----------



## sdr

toysareforboys said:


> Damn straight! Same deal on the SC52 as well, retarded how good their prices are!
> 
> I would cancel with ZL and order from them, you'll get it sooner I guarantee
> 
> -Jamie M.



I might be tempted to do that if had not previously done business with the folks at ZebraLight. But I have done business with them in the past and know they are great to deal with. I suppose I'm just an old school kind of guy? But I like to go with what I know. Even if it costs a little bit more. But there's no denying that is a really great deal with Illumination Supply.

I do have a question for you, though. You referenced an unprotected battery as being the best for use with the SC600 MkII. Since I'm still on the fence -- Protected v. Unprotected -- I'd be curious to hear your thoughts about that. I'm also curious to know whether the protected version of that Panasonic NCR 18650B which is 69.4 mm tall, as opposed to the 65mm of the unprotected cell, will fit in the MkII? I've been using an AW 18650 Protected 2900 mAh in my MKI and it is 68.16mm tall. Do you think the MKII will accept an extra MM+?


----------



## toysareforboys

sdr said:


> the protected version of that Panasonic NCR 18650B which is 69.4 mm tall


Will absolutely not fit. Due to the tailcap design on the MKII it has to be fully screwed down or the light will not function. Anything much over 68mm will damage the electronics if you screw it down hard enough to work with a battery 1.5mm over spec!! Your AW should be tight, but work.

-Jamie M.


----------



## sdr

toysareforboys said:


> Will absolutely not fit. Due to the tailcap design on the MKII it has to be fully screwed down or the light will not function. Anything much over 68mm will damage the electronics if you screw it down hard enough to work with a battery 1.5mm over spec!! Your AW should be tight, but work.
> 
> -Jamie M.



Thanks, Jamie! I greatly appreciate your response. I ordered the 3100 mAh Zebralight battery when I ordered my new light. That's what I'll be running in my new light, but I haven't been able to find any specs on that battery. I believe that it's just a re-labeled Panasonic battery? But I'm not sure.


----------



## BWX

toysareforboys said:


> Nice  Did the coupon code work for ya?
> 
> -Jamie M.



Yup, it just didn't look as it did on the Paypal page (if you use Paypal), like it said on the site. On the next step the code result showed up.
Not a bad deal, saved almost $15.


----------



## toysareforboys

sdr said:


> Thanks, Jamie! I greatly appreciate your response. I ordered the 3100 mAh Zebralight battery when I ordered my new light. That's what I'll be running in my new light, but I haven't been able to find any specs on that battery. I believe that it's just a re-labeled Panasonic battery? But I'm not sure.


Do you think the battery you bought is the one that Zebralight shows in their stock MKII images? Almost looks like they show an unprotected flat top in their stock pics, where the battery they sell is protected with raised top?:










The battery you ordered: http://www.zebralight.com/ZL631-3100mAh-18650-Protected-Li-ion-Battery_p_102.html

I wasn't able to find any specs for the ZL protected 18650. I would e-mail ZL and confirm the battery you ordered from them will in fact fit in the MKII! Would be hilarious if it doesn't!! lol.

-Jamie M.


----------



## Nicola

From ZL website, SC600MkII Specs: "Runtimes will be tested using ZebraLight ZL631 batteries."

So, no doubt it's the right battery...


----------



## toysareforboys

Nicola said:


> From ZL website, SC600MkII Specs: "Runtimes will be tested using ZebraLight ZL631 batteries."


Ahhh, yes yes. Would you say the two pictures I posted are of the same battery??

-Jamie M.


----------



## Nicola

At least they look similar, ZL talk about a battery in the specs, there's a battery in the pic along the MkII, but clues are not evidence so... who can tell?


----------



## sdr

I ordered the Protected ZebraLight 18650 battery shown here: http://www.zebralight.com/ZL631-3100mAh-18650-Protected-Li-ion-Battery_p_102.html But I cannot find any data that reflects the actual size of that cell? So, I'll just hope that it fits. *He said with fingers crossed*


----------



## PocketBeam

I am using protected Orbtronic 3400mah, which they say are panasonic 18650b. The spec says 68.9mm, and they fit. Remember there is a spring at the positive end as well as the negative end.

From the website - Battery cell: Panasonic NCR18650B, Capacity (Ah): 3.4 Ah (3400mAh), Charging Voltage (V): 4.2 V, Energy (Wh): 12.2 Wh, Energy Density (Wh/L): 730 Wh/L, Nominal Voltage (V): 3.6V - 3.7V, Weight (g): 46 g, Diameter (mm): 18.6 mm (+/- 0.03), Length (mm): 68.9 mm (+/- 0.03) -


----------



## flasherByNight

Can anyone post some pics in hand and anything else that might give me a clue as to pocketability


----------



## BWX

PocketBeam said:


> I am using protected Orbtronic 3400mah, which they say are panasonic 18650b. The spec says 68.9mm, and they fit. Remember there is a spring at the positive end as well as the negative end.
> 
> From the website - Battery cell: Panasonic NCR18650B, Capacity (Ah): 3.4 Ah (3400mAh), Charging Voltage (V): 4.2 V, Energy (Wh): 12.2 Wh, Energy Density (Wh/L): 730 Wh/L, Nominal Voltage (V): 3.6V - 3.7V, Weight (g): 46 g, Diameter (mm): 18.6 mm (+/- 0.03), Length (mm): 68.9 mm (+/- 0.03) -



"Remember there is a spring at the positive end as well as the negative end."

Hmm.. I just looked for the first time and my MKI(b) has two springs like the MKII.


----------



## sdr

flasherByNight said:


> Can anyone post some pics in hand and anything else that might give me a clue as to pocketability



I don't have any pics of the new MkII but I can refer you to some shots of the slightly larger MkI that I posted in this forum over a year ago. They'll give you a good idea of just how small the SC600 really is. Bear in mind when you're looking at my pictures that the new torch is even smaller than the original light you'll see in this link: *http://tinyurl.com/SC600-Photos *Once on that page just scroll down until you see the photos. It's the 3rd post down. Cheers!


----------



## TEEJ

flasherByNight said:


> Can anyone post some pics in hand and anything else that might give me a clue as to pocketability



There are of the Mk I - which is a teensie bit larger...but so close you should get the idea at least.


----------



## sdr

TEEJ said:


>



That's a different clip than the one on my MkI. Did that clip come with your light or was that an after-market offering? It appears to fit under the tail-cap?

Here is an old pic of mine:





And here is a pic of the same MkI in my hand...





The new MkII is, what, 5mm shorter! I can hardly wait!


----------



## Ned-L

toysareforboys said:


> These guys are getting a big shipment any day, pre-order is not full: https://illuminationsupply.com/zebr...0-lm-flashlight-18650-p-495.html#.UWX2ylf4Y2E
> 
> Use coupon code ZebraStripes for an INSANE deal.
> 
> Best batteries to use with it: http://www.fasttech.com/products/0/...onic-ncr18650b-rechargeable-3400mah-37v-18650
> 
> -Jamie M.


Can you confirm whether those batteries have any button at all? I understand that they should work with the SC600 MKII because of the spring, but it looks like they might not work with lights that need a button top? Am I reading the page right that they are two Panasonic 3400 mah batteries for $17.95 with free shipping? That sounds too good to be true.


----------



## Ned-L

toysareforboys said:


> Nice! Came out about $8 more expensive for me than my link above, but if you don't want to wait, that's a great option
> 
> -Jamie M.


I ordered one last night from E2 Field Gear and it shipped today. Because it included free shipping, it only cost $2.24 more than from Illumination Supply - incredible deal at Illumination Supply.


----------



## toysareforboys

Ned-L said:


> Can you confirm whether those batteries have any button at all? I understand that they should work with the SC600 MKII because of the spring, but it looks like they might not work with lights that need a button top? Am I reading the page right that they are two Panasonic 3400 mah batteries for $17.95 with free shipping? That sounds too good to be true.


They have a flush/flat top, they are unprotected, 65mm length, nice and skinny so they fit flawlessly in EVERY single one of my flashlights. The price is $17.95 for two batteries including shipping anywhere on planet earth!!! I know it sounds too good to be true, but trust me!!! Also, look at the quantity pricing!!! I ordered 5 (so 10 batteries in total), NOBODY can even come close to touching that price!!!



Ned-L said:


> I ordered one last night from E2 Field Gear and it shipped today. Because it included free shipping, it only cost $2.24 more than from Illumination Supply - incredible deal at Illumination Supply.


Yeah, I'm in Canada and the shipping cost from E2 is why Illumination Supply was $8 cheaper in total.

Might not be able to reply for a while, ISP just swapped out my modem for an all in one modem/router and it's blocking ports for my servers, so I'm switching it to bridge mode and installing dd-wrt on an old PC with dual gigabit cards, should be sweeeet 

Looking very promising so far 






-Jamie M.


----------



## mauiblue

Ned-L said:


> I ordered one last night from E2 Field Gear and it shipped today. Because it included free shipping, it only cost $2.24 more than from Illumination Supply - incredible deal at Illumination Supply.





I figured if I pre-ordered direct from Zebralight I'd be receiving the torch as soon as it was available. I assumed wrong. Oh, well. 

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2


----------



## BWX

My total for everything (shipping included) was $83.26 at IS.


----------



## Ned-L

BWX said:


> My total for everything (shipping included) was $83.26 at IS.


That's an incredible deal and what it calculated for me. I was definitely tempted to go for the best deal, but in stock versus on-order was worth $2.24 more to me


----------



## BWX

Yeah if I had known, I would have gone for the 2 bucks more, but have it sooner.. Oh well, no biggie. it'll come soon enough I am sure.


----------



## mauiblue

sdr said:


> After seeing these beamshots that were provided by _*kwak*_ ( *http://tinyurl.com/SC600MkII-Beamshots )* I couldn't hold out any longer. I ordered the SC600 MkII directly from ZebraLight on Monday of this week -- 4/8/13. Yesterday 4/10/13 I fired off an inquiry to ZebraLight asking when they anticipated the SC600 MkII would be available for shipment? I received a response from Lilian Xu in _Department Sales_ less than 8 hours later. Here is her response to my question: *"The estimated shipping date is about three to four weeks if you place the order now."*
> 
> <snip>
> 
> *sigh*
> Thanks for post. I pre-ordered earlier last month and I'm patiently waiting. Everyday brings me higher on the shipping queue .
> 
> Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2


----------



## don.gwapo

Just got mine. Wow, what a bright shorty light. Fast delivery too.

MarkII next to its big brother.







Sole purpose, as a Night Light. .






Fenix TK camping lampshade & Oveready delrin tailstand shroud attached.

The light comes with a clip, spare o-rings & user's manual. My 3100mAh Eagletac & Orbtronic fits really well with room to spare.


----------



## Ned-L

My SC600 MKII arrived today - not bad as I ordered it on April 11th from E2 Field Gear and it shipped USPS! First impressions very positive.


----------



## PocketBeam

don.gwapo, nice pics. I may have to order the Fenix tk camping shade. Does it fit well? I wonder if the tk diffuser will fit as well?


----------



## sdr

+1 on the pics, don.gwapo!


----------



## don.gwapo

PocketBeam said:


> don.gwapo, nice pics. I may have to order the Fenix tk camping shade. Does it fit well? I wonder if the tk diffuser will fit as well?



Thanks! The TK lampshade & diffuser fits well, not loose or tight. With <1 lumen on L2, its a perfect night light using either of the two Fenix accessories.



sdr said:


> +1 on the pics, don.gwapo!



Thanks!


----------



## holylight

Unboxing mk2




































first impression, the light is driving the bin to the max as it gets warm at turbo fast.


----------



## holylight

Left is mk2 right is sc52





Left is mk2 right is sc52
(Another shot just on off the lights)

Sorry for the poor hp camera photos.
As you know sc52 is no pushover at 500lm. Mk2 is about double as bright to my eyes. So the manufacture stated 900LM should be true. But note that mk2 gets hot faster than sc52 at highest selection.


----------



## BWX

toysareforboys said:


> These guys are getting a big shipment any day..... *snip*
> 
> 
> -Jamie M.



Hmm.." any day"?

I guess I should have inquired a little bit further before I jumped on that deal maybe, or where you got that information? 

Maybe I am worrying about nothing and it is going to ship any minute now. Or maybe it'll be 2 weeks? Hard to say I guess, I thought it would be a few days by the sound of your post.


----------



## Augusto

Just received it in Brazil. It's incredible small!


----------



## TEEJ

I was comparing the Mk I and Mk II versions, and I noticed a few things I didn't notice already mentioned as such, and some of course that were:


The HA color is a little different, and the Mk II is definitely shorter but the same diameters 





















The Mk II has a pretty smooth reflector vs the OP on the Mk I. 

The head facets on the Mk II are more chamferred, and extend forward to past where the Mk I bezel started (This might allow a deeper reflector bowl despite the shorter overall head length).










The Mk I LED has more of the white background plate showing, and the Mk II has mostly black plate showing. The black frame is rounded in sections on the Mk II, and square on the Mk I.























The tail caps are a direct swap with each other, threads and depth, etc, match perfectly.



Cell clearances in the lights are the same diameter, and depth (The double ended spring set-up allows ~ same length cells by taking up the slack though for different lengths, and, my older Mk I had a bit of spring sag.)





I confirmed the depths with a gauge (To bases not to springs) - they are the same.


Viewed from inside the cell tube at the back of the LED - The Mk II has a sealed circuit board, and the Mk I has an exposed circuit board.

















I'll have beam shots later on, assuming its not raining again....


----------



## PocketBeam

TEEJ said:


> Cell clearances in the lights are the same diameter, the internal cell length room is ~ 1 mm less in the Mk II than the Mk I.



Did you account for the spring at the positive side of the mk II? Also did you account for spring compression at the negative side?


----------



## Swede74

TEEJ said:


> I'll have beam shots later on, assuming its not raining again....



It is IPX7-rated. Just saying...:devil:


----------



## TEEJ

Swede74 said:


> It is IPX7-rated. Just saying...:devil:



LOL

But my camera isn't.


----------



## TEEJ

PocketBeam said:


> Did you account for the spring at the positive side of the mk II? Also did you account for spring compression at the negative side?



Yes, but I added that they take about the same cell lengths due to it...the spring is just MORE compressed from what I can tell. (I was editing when you posted)


----------



## toysareforboys

holylight said:


> Sorry for the poor hp camera photos.


Wow, awesome photos!!! The MKII is VERY impressive 

-Jamie M.


----------



## TEEJ

OK, just checked with a depth gauge...the MK I and II have the same overall cell tube length, the spring tension was the only difference after all.

(posting/editing as I was taking pics...had to catch up w/myself)


----------



## WmArnold1

TEEJ said:


> I was comparing the Mk I and Mk II versions, and I noticed a few things I didn't notice already mentioned as such, and some of course that were...
> 
> The Mk I LED has more of the white background plate showing, and the Mk II has mostly black plate showing. The black frame is rounded in sections on the Mk II, and square on the Mk I.



Thanks for your Pix and measurements, Teej!!! Your picture above clearly shows that the reflector diameter is about 14% smaller and maybe a little deeper too ==> The MK-II hot-spot will be correspondingly smaller and brighter.

Edit: Oops - I was wrong. The faces are not at the same distance from the camera - the butt-caps are aligned - sorry.

Btw, can anyone tell whether the new bezel ring is threaded or press-fitted? From Teej's Pix, I'd guess press-fitted.


----------



## TEEJ

WmArnold1 said:


> Thanks for your Pix and measurements, Teej!!! Your picture above clearly shows that the reflector diameter is about 14% smaller and maybe a little deeper too ==> The MK-II hot-spot will be correspondingly smaller and brighter.
> 
> Btw, can anyone tell whether the new bezel ring is threaded or press-fitted? From Teej's Pix, I'd guess press-fitted.



I don't see anything threaded there, I'd say pressed.



PS - There's a parallax thing so the closer bezel looks larger....in person, they look the same diameter.


----------



## WmArnold1

TEEJ said:


> I don't see anything threaded there, I'd say pressed.
> 
> PS - There's a parallax thing so the closer bezel looks larger....in person, they look the same diameter.



Sorry Teej - you're correct of course. I edited my original post to reflect my error.


----------



## JetskiMark

TEEJ said:


> I was comparing the Mk I and Mk II versions, and I noticed a few things I didn't notice already mentioned as such, and some of course that were: <snip>



Thank you very much for all of the info and effort that went into that comparison.

I hope that a neutral version will be available in the near future. I am not going to hold my breath though.


----------



## TEEJ

I did use a gauge on the inner reflector part, and they do measure the same, at least when measuring the inner and outer bezel diameters.

I would have to remove the reflectors to get the actual depth, albeit from the outside, looking at the heads, they look to be very similar in depth too...just attained differently.


----------



## TEEJ

JetskiMark said:


> Thank you very much for all of the info and effort that went into that comparison.
> 
> I hope that a neutral version will be available in the near future. I am not going to hold my breath though.



You might not need to.

I'll put up some beam shots later if I can, but from what I can see so far, it looks pretty neutral all by itself as is.

Its not yellow, but its pretty creamy white as far as I can tell informally so far.


----------



## flasherByNight

Anyone got this thing in Stock? Looks like a waited to o long as usual e2 is out


----------



## PocketBeam

Nice work TEEJ. You have a nice comparison review going. I would be interested in the beamshot comparison. Nice to see how the brightness compares, and some long distance throw comparisons would be nice.


----------



## Slidder

1) Does the II throw as wide and long as the I 
2) From the intensity of the II beam, I think it may throw farther. 

However I want to know if it is just as wide a throw as I


----------



## Mr Floppy

TEEJ said:


> You might not need to.
> 
> I'll put up some beam shots later if I can, but from what I can see so far, it looks pretty neutral all by itself as is.



do you have the SC600w version to compare it with?


----------



## TEEJ

Mr Floppy said:


> do you have the SC600w version to compare it with?



I don't have the SC600W handy (I have it, but its on duty elsewhere at the moment...).

I have beam shots comparing the SC600 to the SC600W though in the first SC600 thread though, so, for tint at least, you could look at that thread. Those are somewhat blurrier pics than I can take now, but, they are very representative.


----------



## JetskiMark

TEEJ said:


> I don't have the SC600W handy (I have it, but its on duty elsewhere at the moment...).
> 
> I have beam shots comparing the SC600 to the SC600W though in the first SC600 thread though, so, for tint at least, you could look at that thread. Those are somewhat blurrier pics than I can take now, but, they are very representative.



You made me work searching for your helpful beam shots.

I had not seen those since you posted them. Good comparison. I prefer the warm.



TEEJ said:


> SC600 Left/SC600W rt
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> SC600
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> SC600W
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hope that helps!


----------



## PocketBeam

Hm, I can see the colors better in the cool white. For example if you compare the trees, in the SC600w the trees look the same color. But the SC600 you can clearly see the front tree is a different color. And if you look at the flowers at the very bottom the yellow and green stand out more for the cool white.


----------



## twl

The warmer tints accent the browns and reds, at the expense of the blues.
All it amounts to is a tint shift.
Some people prefer one way, and other people prefer the other way.


----------



## Augusto

FastTech NCR18650B fits just fine in SC600II.


----------



## TEEJ

twl said:


> The warmer tints accent the browns and reds, at the expense of the blues.
> All it amounts to is a tint shift.
> Some people prefer one way, and other people prefer the other way.



Yeah, the tint is just what colored lens you prefer to look at your world through....no wrong answer per se, unless you didn't see something because you needed some more lumens.


----------



## melty

PocketBeam said:


> Hm, I can see the colors better in the cool white. For example if you compare the trees, in the SC600w the trees look the same color. But the SC600 you can clearly see the front tree is a different color. And if you look at the flowers at the very bottom the yellow and green stand out more for the cool white.



It's also possible that the blues are being exaggerated in the first picture, causing the trees to contrast more than usual. Hard to say without a control shot or knowing the camera and settings used. In my experience warm lights are no-contest better at representing colors (including blue).

Patiently for the SC600w MkII.


----------



## TEEJ

melty said:


> It's also possible that the blues are being exaggerated in the first picture, causing the trees to contrast more than usual. Hard to say without a control shot or knowing the camera and settings used. In my experience warm lights are no-contest better at representing colors (including blue).
> 
> Patiently for the SC600w MkII.



In my experience, warms are better for some colors, and worse for others...just like the white lights are.

I also find that after my eyes are dark adapted, I see in Black and White anyway, and it doesn't matter what the colors are.

I also find that for borderline/max distances, the white light shows more of what's out there due to the extra lumens available in white light, and the sacrifice in LED efficiency to throw yellower light...so there's fewer lumens to see anything with.

I'm doing forensic investigations, and, disaster response type work...so, sometimes color is important, and, sometimes its not. 

I might use a UV light to make certain things pop out better, or a yellower light, or a whiter light, etc...depending on what/who I'm looking for.

For COLORS, a high CRI light works best. Warm ≠ High CRI though...despite a lot of people who swear otherwise until I show them real life with examples outside at night, etc.

Most high CRI lights ARE warm tinted, but, its not the tint that makes them high CRI...and that's what I think confuses people.

Its akin to a lot of politicians being lawyers, but, being a lawyer doesn't make you a politician.


----------



## kaichu dento

twl said:


> The warmer tints accent the browns and reds, at the expense of the blues.
> All it amounts to is a tint shift.
> Some people prefer one way, and other people prefer the other way.


I used to prefer warm tints over all others, then just before having all my cool lights modded, realized I liked cool tints on low levels with a floody pattern, and now, somewhat like the three bears, have found that I do like a very neutral, if only so slightly warmish tint, but not so much as to appear anything other than incandescent in appearance. 



TEEJ said:


> Most high CRI lights ARE warm tinted, but, its not the tint that makes them high CRI...and that's what I think confuses people.


That is definitely one of the most unfortunate misconceptions regarding hCRI emitters, and I suppose it has more than a little to do with the fact that at the time they began to become readily available there was a strong sense of need to make them more incandescent-like, hence a focus on warmth over straightforward accuracy, which is slightly ironic in that the main strength of striving for hCRI emitters was greater accuracy in color rendition.

This is one of the reasons that Don chose the Nichia 119 and others have gone over to the XP-G replacement version (219) in such numbers - hCRI accuracy, coupled with neutrality of tint, or as is the case with my personal favorite 219, just ever so slightly on the warmish side. 

Seeing your posted beamshots above has me looking forward to getting one of the SC-600w's as soon as they are available.


----------



## TEEJ

I have one high CRI XM-L2 as well. I haven't had a chance yet to benchmark it against the 219's I have though.

If the weather holds tonight, I might do some small scale shots analogous to the ones posted above, except hopefully, less blurry.

The old camera had no manual overide, this one does.


----------



## TEEJ

I took some shots last night...will try to host/post tonight?


----------



## TEEJ

Daytime Control shots:


























The above show what ~ 2,100 - 5,100 Lux looks like, with about as high CRI a light source as possible (The sun), to get an idea of true colors, etc.
The above were all shot on full auto, freehand. (I tried an exposure that I was also going to use for the night shots, but it was so blow-out I could not even photo-chop it to be other than a solid white box.)


For the shots below, all are shot at ISO 800, F 2.0 at 1/2 second WB off. The camera is on a tripod, the lights are hand held. They are all a bit under exposed relative to what I saw at the far end of the ranges shot, and extremely over exposed at close distances...but, all the same relative to each other at least.






Dark - Ambient Control


SC600 Mk II:





































SC600 M I:
































For comparison:



Xeno EO3 Nichia 219 High CRI:































Xeno EO3 XM-L2 U2:












Overall:


Notice the colors look pretty dam similar for all of the lights, but you see more with the brighter ones. As the lights were hand held, I found that higher/lower aim, etc, did impact the perceived brightness, esp as lower shots made more glare/hot spots on the grass, etc. I took a few of each to try to allow better comparison after weighing these types of variables.

The 750 L Mk I vs 900 L Mk II is of course only ~ 17% difference, but if you look closely at details, you'll see that the Mk II shows more stuff.


I hope this provides some perspective on the lights.


----------



## DLaird8201

Thanks for the pics Teej!!!


----------



## PocketBeam

Really nice pics. Nice to see the 219 compared. I think with each generation the cool whites get better and better.


----------



## Nicola

Mine was shipped today...


----------



## AmperSand

So was mine!!


----------



## Nicola

My shipping confirms average time from order (march 8th) to shipping being 40 days as ZL CS told lately to somebody here...


----------



## noboneshotdog

There was earlier talk of run times and efficiency of the MkII has anyone had a chance to test run times on Panasonic 3100 or 3400 batteries yet. Still waiting for mine to come....

Steve


----------



## TEEJ

I used the Mk II yesterday on a project, and it ran at full tilt boogie mode for about an hour straight w/o getting too hot to hold, and then I noticed a step down. That was on an Eagletac 3400.

It did get pretty hot, but my hand was obviously wicking off enough heat to handle it. 



I didn't time it exactly, I just noticed the time early in the process, and at the stepdown I noticed. There may have been small incremental step downs that were too small to see before that, I was in the middle of a forensic investigation, and concentrating on what I was looking for rather than what I was looking with.


----------



## markr6

TEEJ - thanks for the great beamshots on the previous page. I LOVE that Xeno w/ Nichia 219, by the way. Just wish it was a bit more floody but that's what I usually prefer.


----------



## TEEJ

markr6 said:


> TEEJ - thanks for the great beamshots on the previous page. I LOVE that Xeno w/ Nichia 219, by the way. Just wish it was a bit more floody but that's what I usually prefer.



I will be trying a High CRI XM-L2 soon, and I'm hoping that it is floodier than the Nichia 219 as well. It will have maybe double the lumens to boot, so, I', looking forward to seeing what it can do. I Have the drop-in, just waitng for the right host...)


----------



## TEEJ

melty said:


> It's also possible that the blues are being exaggerated in the first picture, causing the trees to contrast more than usual. Hard to say without a control shot or knowing the camera and settings used. In my experience warm lights are no-contest better at representing colors (including blue).
> 
> *Patiently for the SC600w MkII*.



In case you are impatient:

http://www.cpfmarketplace.com/mp/sh...-Used-ZebraLight-SC600W-w-Box-Great-Condition!


----------



## melty

TEEJ said:


> In case you are impatient:
> 
> http://www.cpfmarketplace.com/mp/sh...-Used-ZebraLight-SC600W-w-Box-Great-Condition!



Heh. Thank you sir, but I already have one of those in my pocket. Perhaps that's why I can be so patient.


----------



## flasherByNight

Got the flashlight, got the charger. .. but no batteries. *smacks forehead Just realized they're being shipped from Tokyo, doh.


----------



## TEEJ

flasherByNight said:


> Got the flashlight, got the charger. .. but no batteries. *smacks forehead Just realized they're being shipped from Tokyo, doh.



The slow boat.


----------



## sdr

Well, for what it's worth. I'm still waiting for ZL to ship my Mk II but I'm chomping so hard at the bit that I just bought two more AW 18650 Protected 3400 mAh Batteries from Lighthound. So, now - in addition to all of the 18650's I have either laying around or already in my SC600 Mk I - plus the one I ordered when I ordered my new light from ZL - I now have two more on the way! 

Sheesh! Now that I will have so many 18650's on hand maybe I should just pop for the S6330, too? At least then I'd have a place to put 'em all!

Wow! Who'd have thunk that flashlights were as addictive as heroin??? And to think that it all started with a Harbor Freight freebie!!!


----------



## BeastFlashlight

How good/bad is ZL customer service? I ordered another SC600 mkII yesterday for a gift and it turned out to be a bad choice, emailed today about canceling before it ships, do u guys think my email will fall of deaf ears? No reply all day


----------



## fnj

flasherByNight said:


> Got the flashlight, got the charger. .. but no batteries. *smacks forehead Just realized they're being shipped from Tokyo, doh.
> 
> 
> TEEJ said:
> 
> 
> 
> The slow boat.
Click to expand...


The raft is circling in the Sargasso Sea.


----------



## neutralwhite

both good and bad. 
mixed stuff on them...they should refund hopefully if its not already shipped. email again asap. they might just catch that 2nd one!.





BeastFlashlight said:


> How good/bad is ZL customer service? I ordered another SC600 mkII yesterday for a gift and it turned out to be a bad choice, emailed today about canceling before it ships, do u guys think my email will fall of deaf ears? No reply all day


----------



## BeastFlashlight

I sent a reply email to my confirmation email and i went to their site & sent one too, but i'll take your advice & send another


----------



## sdr

BeastFlashlight said:


> I sent a reply email to my confirmation email and i went to their site & sent one too, but i'll take your advice & send another



No worries, my friend. I also cancelled my order with ZebraLight this afternoon and already received an email from Lillian in CS that a full refund was forthcoming. They are good people to deal with. If you sent them an email they WILL get back to you.


----------



## sdr

In relation to my cancellation. As excited as I was even earlier today to get the new version, my eyes strayed. I ended up cancelling the ZebraLight in order to instead buy an ArmyTek Predator V.2 XP-G2 with a Gold Crenelated Bezel. 

With no delivery date in sight it just came down to who had inventory IN STOCK! I love my ZL SC600 Mk I and will continue to use it as my primary EDC. But I have wanted a Predator for a while and got tired of waiting for the new Mk II ZL. 
This is what happens when I'm just sitting around the house all day recovering from a dental surgery -- I get into TROUBLE!


----------



## BeastFlashlight

Just saw my cancelation confirmed email!! Thanks guys for the moral support lol, my cancelation just came down to the SC600 not running on CR123s that's all, nothing to do with any type of performance complaints from me, great light!!


----------



## Byggeren

Augusto said:


> FastTech NCR18650B fits just fine in SC600II.



I got my SC600II today from ZL, and can confirm the same. I have a brand new set of protected NCR18650B from Fasttech, and they slip right in. Great light and great battery


----------



## TEEJ

sdr said:


> In relation to my cancellation. As excited as I was even earlier today to get the new version, my eyes strayed. I ended up cancelling the ZebraLight in order to instead buy an ArmyTek Predator V.2 XP-G2 with a Gold Crenelated Bezel.
> 
> With no delivery date in sight it just came down to who had inventory IN STOCK! I love my ZL SC600 Mk I and will continue to use it as my primary EDC. But I have wanted a Predator for a while and got tired of waiting for the new Mk II ZL.
> This is what happens when I'm just sitting around the house all day recovering from a dental surgery -- I get into TROUBLE!



LOL

Those are such totally different lights.

The Pred's throw is incredible, but at close range, its a small circle of light (I love mine) that's not that useful for task lighting/camping/indoor use, etc.

The SC600 is very floody, and perfect for tasks/indoor use, etc...but has very little range relatively speaking.

Having both is of course, always the answer.


----------



## kevinfc

Got tired of waiting for Zebralight to post spec's, so I'm doing a run time test on my new sc600 mkII. Running it head up in a glass of water with the bezel exposed. Powering it is a 3400mah unprotected Panasonic cell charged to 4.19v. It is running on high (500 lumen setting). I'll post my results soon.


----------



## TEEJ

kevinfc said:


> Got tired of waiting for Zebralight to post spec's, so I'm doing a run time test on my new sc600 mkII. Running it head up in a glass of water with the bezel exposed. Powering it is a 3400mah unprotected Panasonic cell charged to 4.19v. It is running on high (500 lumen setting). I'll post my results soon.



Damn....its run for several hours so far, VERY impressive.




Hmmmm.maybe not....the time of my post is several hours BEFORE I posted it?


----------



## sdr

TEEJ said:


> LOL
> 
> Those are such totally different lights.
> 
> The Pred's throw is incredible, but at close range, its a small circle of light (I love mine) that's not that useful for task lighting/camping/indoor use, etc.
> 
> The SC600 is very floody, and perfect for tasks/indoor use, etc...but has very little range relatively speaking.
> 
> Having both is of course, always the answer.



That's my thinking exactly! I love my SC600! I'm sure that I would love the Mk II, also. But I am impatient and decided to cancel my order for the Mk II and order a torch that was IN STOCK and that I've also wanted for a very long time -- The Armytek Predator! Of course, I will continue to carry the SC600 as my primary EDC. But I have wanted a light with some decent throw to compliment the ZL's XM-L floody emitter for some time now. The Predator's v.2 XP-G2 should fill that role quite nicely, I suspect?

Teej, since you have the Predator, I would like to ask you what batteries you've been using in it? I finally ordered some Orbtronic 18650 3100mAh Panasonic's in anticipation of my new Predator. Having cancelled an order for some 3400mAh AW's upon reading about compatibility issues with those 3 little bumps on the negative end of the AW's and the Predator's tail-cap contact. Do you have any thoughts on that? Have you experienced any compatibility issues between batteries and the Armytek light? Sorry for asking so many questions -- I'm just thirsting for knowledge.

Cheers & Thanks!


----------



## TEEJ

sdr said:


> That's my thinking exactly! I love my SC600! I'm sure that I would love the Mk II, also. But I am impatient and decided to cancel my order for the Mk II and order a torch that was IN STOCK and that I've also wanted for a very long time -- The Armytek Predator! Of course, I will continue to carry the SC600 as my primary EDC. But I have wanted a light with some decent throw to compliment the ZL's XM-L floody emitter for some time now. The Predator's v.2 XP-G2 should fill that role quite nicely, I suspect?
> 
> Teej, since you have the Predator, I would like to ask you what batteries you've been using in it? I finally ordered some Orbtronic 18650 3100mAh Panasonic's in anticipation of my new Predator. Having cancelled an order for some 3400mAh AW's upon reading about compatibility issues with those 3 little bumps on the negative end of the AW's and the Predator's tail-cap contact. Do you have any thoughts on that? Have you experienced any compatibility issues between batteries and the Armytek light? Sorry for asking so many questions -- I'm just thirsting for knowledge.
> 
> Cheers & Thanks!



Well, My Pred has eaten every 18650 I've fed it w/o a hiccup. You can actually PROGRAM it for what cell you load in, RCR123's, 18650's, primaries, whatever.

The best deal is the 2-pack's of 3400 18650's at Fastech for ~ $17 (that's total, for TWO cells)...or ~ $8.50/cell for 3400 mah 18650's.
They are a touch fat for only a few lights, but the Pred ain't one of them...it eats the fattest one's I have.

I have a lot of Eagletac 3400's, I bought a few DOZEN of them, and they fit every 18650 light I have...so to avoid multiple cell/light combo's, I tend to use what fits everything...it makes carrying spares easier.



The Pred's tail contact looks a little like a button cell battery at the end of a spring..instead of just a spring. I could see how it might end up just touching the bumps if the bumps formed a < ~9 mm circle. (The contact is ~9 - 10 mm in diameter).

If the cell was designed to work in series for example with only those bumps in contact, it should also work with the Pred's tail contact.

Because of the heavy regulation, to fully take advantage of the Pred's power, you would really benefit from the higher amp capacity of the 3400 vs the chemistry of the 2900/3100 mah versions.


----------



## PocketBeam

Back on topic...

The mark I had the below runtimes, which this model should exceed.

High: H1 500Lm with 750Lm turbo in the first 5 min (2hrs) or H2 200Lm (5.9hrs) / 330Lm (3hrs) / 500Lm (2.1hrs) / 4Hz Strobe
Medium: M1 65Lm (18hrs) or M2 21Lm (50hrs)
Low: L1 2.8Lm (280hrs) or L2 0.1Lm (80days)
Runtimes are tested using Panasonic NCR18650 (2900mAH) batteries.


----------



## kevinfc

I have to recheck my readings, these run times are very long


----------



## holylight

2 cons for mk2, is it only me or anyone share the same. 

The beam of mk2 next to the hot spot is abit to yellow. Compare to p25 which is whiter.




mk2





p25


I don't have sc600 but I do have sc52 and found out when clicking the button there is click sound in mk2 compare to silence click in sc52.


----------



## JetskiMark

holylight said:


> I don't have sc600 but I do have sc52 and found out when clicking the button there is click sound in mk2 compare to silence click in sc52. <snip>



The sound the button makes is similar with all of my Zebralights. That includes an S6330, (2x) SC600w MKI, (2x) H600w and an SC52.


----------



## kevinfc

My first test with a 3400mah Panasonic went over 3.5 hours at what I thought was 500 lumens. It was so hard to believe that I stopped the test and tested the battery, it read 3.59v. The brightness seemed to fade from the beginning, but I didn't see a step down. I'll test again and report back


----------



## kevinfc

I like the clickier switch, it's easier to push and gives a more affirmative response


----------



## PocketBeam

I would have expected just short of three hours... as I recall runtime is related to temperature, I think selfbuilt mentioned something about that in his SC52 review. My feeling is this light lasts a long, long time on 3400 cells.

holylight, yes my button makes a click sound. I didn't think about it until you mentioned it. The beam in my SC600 mk II might be slightly yellow, simular to what I see in your photos. I think the beam tint is great. I wonded if the CRI is higher?


----------



## mauiblue

Nicola said:


> My shipping confirms average time from order (march 8th) to shipping being 40 days as ZL CS told lately to somebody here...



Thanks for posting. I think I ordered a few days after you so hopefully I should be getting mine in the near future. I won't cancel my order any time soon as I already invested enough time and patience. Crossing my fingers 

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2


----------



## itsjusttim

same here, have already been waiting for 1.5months.. whats another few weeks.


----------



## kevinfc

I got 145 minutes from a Panasonic 3400mah cell charged to 4.19v. Final voltage at stepdown was 3.23v


----------



## holylight

yes my button makes a click sound. I didn't think about it until you mentioned it. The beam in my SC600 mk II might be slightly yellow said:


> From the beam shot you can also notice p25 hotspot is more powerful compare to mk 2 but than of course p25 is larger in size.
> 
> Well nothing's perfect, the small size and good ui to trade off with less whiter beam and button click sound is ok.


----------



## SGH77

Nice surprise ZL said my SC600 mKII was to be shipped from China on the 17th April and it will take 2-4 weeks to arrive, well it arrived today, which is only 4 working days.The Ampmax 18650 3400mAh fits easily, even though they are suppose to be to long, the review says 68.6mm (my calipers show as 68.3)The other thing is I have a Palight v60 which is marketed as the smallest 18650 torch in the world... well it aint true the sc600 mkII is smaller, even with the batteries removed and them all screwed tight (as the v60 is a screw cap for on/off). The real truth is the the Palight is not 98mm but just over 102mm by my calipers or if my calipers are wrong my eye isnt, the SC600/2 is at least a mm smaller side by side.So can we add the SC600 MKII is the smallest 18650 torch in the world? See how it performs tonight.


----------



## holylight

JetskiMark said:


> The sound the button makes is similar with all of my Zebralights. That includes an S6330, (2x) SC600w MKI, (2x) H600w and an SC52.



sc52 button is silence click.


----------



## holylight

YouTube reviews up....

NEW!! ZEBRA LIGHT SC600 Mk II 900 Lumen Flashlight "The Ultimate Weapons Light" by 20$Bandit 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mNDzKzCNwS0


----------



## sspc

holylight said:


> YouTube reviews up....
> 
> NEW!! ZEBRA LIGHT SC600 Mk II 900 Lumen Flashlight "The Ultimate Weapons Light" by 20$Bandit
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mNDzKzCNwS0



Thanks for the link. I'm waiting on reviews from the more seasoned flashlight reviewers. This reviewer compares the MKII to the Quark 123x2 but these lights are not in the same class (as far a output and effeciency goes).


----------



## Overclocker

sspc said:


> Thanks for the link. I'm waiting on reviews from the more seasoned flashlight reviewers. This reviewer compares the MKII to the Quark 123x2 but these lights are not in the same class (as far a output and effeciency goes).



dude the video title says it all LOL. sc600 is the last thing i want on my weapon


----------



## PocketBeam

Thanks for the review link. I think the reviewers favorite things are the brightness, small size, but most importantly was the weight. And I have to agree after pocket carrying since I got it. I do forget it is in the pocket. The light weight is really nice.

As for mounted to a weapon, well it isn't bad. Of course it isn't close to ultimate since their is no remote switch and you would have to two hand the light to turn it on or off. But if you are looking for a weapon mount for the SC600 mk II that fits, barely, check out the video.

What was the guy doing off camera when he was first turning it on? Seemed like he had trouble turning it on? Maybe he was trying for medium or low and got confused? And here I thought the interface was simple and intuitive.


----------



## holylight

PocketBeam said:


> Thanks for the review link. I think the reviewers favorite things are the brightness, small size, but most importantly was the weight. And I have to agree after pocket carrying since I got it. I do forget it is in the pocket. The light weight is really nice.
> 
> As for mounted to a weapon, well it isn't bad. Of course it isn't close to ultimate since their is no remote switch and you would have to two hand the light to turn it on or off. But if you are looking for a weapon mount for the SC600 mk II that fits, barely, check out the video.
> 
> What was the guy doing off camera when he was first turning it on? Seemed like he had trouble turning it on? Maybe he was trying for medium or low and got confused? And here I thought the interface was simple and intuitive.



He got into troubled with old battery I guess. Or he didn't know how to operate mk2 as he just got it and he was clicking few times to on mk2.


----------



## mauiblue

Well, FINALLY! 
Just got a shipping confirmation today. Placed the order on 10 March 2013. Should be here by the end of the week. I'll post here how it goes when I receive my new torch . 

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2


----------



## brag

I ordered 27 mar from ZL, am I getting close? No tracking info yet


----------



## mauiblue

brag said:


> I ordered 27 mar from ZL, am I getting close? No tracking info yet



Yes, since you pre ordered you are in the queue. For me it is six weeks from my order to receiving a shipping confirmation. 

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2


----------



## PocketBeam

brag, you must be close. But I would send an email to Zebralight with your order details and check on it. They may take a few days to respond, but they do seem to respond.


----------



## keenism

Anyone else have a button that lets light through when its on?


----------



## PocketBeam

keenism said:


> Anyone else have a button that lets light through when its on?


 I get a tiny bit of light on the front half circle edge of the button. It is not even enough to locate the light with. If your button is the same as mine, I wonder how you noticed as it is so dim and just a sliver of light?


----------



## jhc37013

PocketBeam said:


> I get a tiny bit of light on the front half circle edge of the button. It is not even enough to locate the light with. If your button is the same as mine, I wonder how you noticed as it is so dim and just a sliver of light?



hmm that is scary I don't think any of the Zebra's I have owned have ever had lumen leakage, if light can get out then water/moister (take your pick) can get it.

Nevermind maybe you are talking about (seeing) through the rubber switch? I was thinking out the side of the switch.


----------



## keenism

jhc37013 said:


> hmm that is scary I don't think any of the Zebra's I have owned have ever had lumen leakage, if light can get out then water/moister (take your pick) can get it.
> 
> Nevermind maybe you are talking about (seeing) through the rubber switch? I was thinking out the side of the switch.



No need to worry bud, there are no holes or tears. Light is getting though the rubber button via what appears to be a reflection off of 2 metal things. Also only noticeable on high....but I do wonder how many lumens im losing do this, the rubber is pretty tough.....but its bright as hell and lights up a massive area (my new fav walking light) so its all good.


----------



## TEEJ

jhc37013 said:


> hmm that is scary I don't think any of the Zebra's I have owned have ever had lumen leakage, *if light can get out then water/moister (take your pick) can get in*.
> 
> Nevermind maybe you are talking about (seeing) through the rubber switch? I was thinking out the side of the switch.



That's not necessarily true. The light could leak from a silicone/clear gasket, etc, for example...but, frankly, I'm not sure a pathway exists to get backward past the reflector bowl to the switch area....but....

Its possible that some light from the LED is striking the rear of the reflector bowl's lip next to it, and reflecting back.

If you look at the light coming through the button, and its brighter to the lens side of the button, that's probably it.



I can't imagine losing even a full lumen like that.

A simple test might be to go into a dark room, put the light bezel down on a hard flat surface like a desk top, etc...on high, and so you can't see if the light is on/off w/o lifting it. Then, look at the button for the leaking light. If you DO see it, take a piece of cardboard, etc...to BLOCK light, and move it around the button to see if you block what you are seeing (Accounting for stray light reflecting off the shiny ring around the button).

If you can't block any of it, then it may be from inside the light after all. So, then press the button to change the brightness with the bezel still tight to the table, and see if turning the light on/off up/down changes the brightness of the suspected leak.

*If it does change, then its DEFINITELY the light*, but, again, the OTF was measured, and, if there's leakage, its already missing from the OTF lumen #...and of mostly academic interest rather than cause for panic.


----------



## lightcycle1

Good luck with those SC600's everyone. I wanted one, bit I'm not giving them amother thin dime of my cash.
2 months waiting now for my faulty H51 and no replies to my inquiries as to its whereabouts. Never again. ZL is not an option for me anymore and its sad because I liked their lights.

Sent from my SCH-S720C using Tapatalk 2


----------



## PocketBeam

Yes, a tiny amount of light leaks through the rubber/silicon button itself. No worries of water proofness from that. And the amount of light is less than the lowest low of 0.01 lumens. I mean the leakage is super tiny. And it was so small I had to verify my eyes were not playing tricks. I verified it by blocking all light coming from the front and then turning the light on and off.

I see no cause for alarm. I don't see it as a problem. It isn't even bright, you can't even see it from a few feet away. I bet once people forget about it, no one else brings it up. I am amazed he noticed it.


----------



## mauiblue

lightcycle1 said:


> Good luck with those SC600's everyone. I wanted one, bit I'm not giving them amother thin dime of my cash.
> 2 months waiting now for my faulty H51 and no replies to my inquiries as to its whereabouts. Never again. ZL is not an option for me anymore and its sad because I liked their lights.
> 
> Sent from my SCH-S720C using Tapatalk 2



I'm sorry that you had this issue with ZL. I bought a Thrunite TN11 last year and it didn't last long. It's now dead and a reminder to not buy another Thrunite, ever. Of all the lights I've bought, I've only had this one disappointment. 

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2


----------



## PocketBeam

lightcycle1 said:


> Good luck with those SC600's everyone. I wanted one, bit I'm not giving them amother thin dime of my cash.
> 2 months waiting now for my faulty H51 and no replies to my inquiries as to its whereabouts. Never again. ZL is not an option for me anymore and its sad because I liked their lights.
> 
> Sent from my SCH-S720C using Tapatalk 2



When I got my SC52 I sent my H51 in for repair. I felt like the button didn't always respond. I say felt like, because when I tried, I couldn't find any problems. Well I sent it in. It took about a month and a half but I got it back. Also they did respond to my status queries. Yes, they are slow, but they do respond. Have you checked your spam box or given them a couple days to respond? I seriously doubt they will keep your light and not return it to you.


----------



## henry1960

PocketBeam said:


> When I got my SC52 I sent my H51 in for repair. I felt like the button didn't always respond. I say felt like, because when I tried, I couldn't find any problems. Well I sent it in. It took about a month and a half but I got it back. Also they did respond to my status queries. Yes, they are slow, but they do respond. Have you checked your spam box or given them a couple days to respond? I seriously doubt they will keep your light and not return it to you.


I agree...I think there is some miscommunication here...


----------



## lightcycle1

Welp she got back to me today.

2 months and its still in freaking China.

Sent from my SCH-S720C using Tapatalk 2



Sent from my SCH-S720C using Tapatalk 2


----------



## TEEJ

I had a warranty repair of my SC600 (Mk1) and I send it via Cell Guy on CPFM, whom I bought it from. He told me its an average of 6-10 weeks to get it back, and it ended up taking ~ 8 weeks or so (2 months), and it worked like a charm when I got it, still does.


----------



## lightcycle1

Ypu can see my "Own 2 headlamps going for a 3rd" thread if you wish to read further comments on ZL's approaching Total Fail service levels.



Sent from my SCH-S720C using Tapatalk 2


----------



## sdr

I too wish everyone who's waiting for the Mk II the very best of luck with their new lights...once they get them. I know that I love my Mk I and have carried it daily with no issues for about a year and a half. I had ordered the Mk II myself but tired of waiting for it and cancelled last Friday afternoon, ordering in its stead an Armytek Predator -- Which was listed as IN STOCK on their website. Bear in mind that I placed my new order for the Predator only last Friday and it is currently in my hands on Wednesday of the following week, having arrived early this morning via FedEx. I will no doubt re-order the Mk II at some time in the future, once in becomes available! But for now I'm going with the _"Bird in the hand,"_ philosophy and enjoying a new torch tonight...not at some unknown time in the distant future.


----------



## mauiblue

I must admit, this is the longest I've waited for a new flashlight to come in. But this is a new model offered by Zebralight and obviously is in high demand so I am willing to give ZL some leeway. Looks like my patience will pay off as I will be receiving my new light in the next day or so. 

Sent from my DROID RAZR MAXX using Tapatalk 2


----------



## maxrep12

sdr said:


> I too wish everyone who's waiting for the Mk II the very best of luck with their new lights...once they get them. I know that I love my Mk I and have carried it daily with no issues for about a year and a half. I had ordered the Mk II myself but tired of waiting for it and cancelled last Friday afternoon, ordering in its stead an Armytek Predator -- Which was listed as IN STOCK on their website. Bear in mind that I placed my new order for the Predator only last Friday and it is currently in my hands on Wednesday of the following week, having arrived early this morning via FedEx. I will no doubt re-order the Mk II at some time in the future, once in becomes available! But for now I'm going with the _"Bird in the hand,"_ philosophy and enjoying a new torch tonight...not at some unknown time in the distant future.


I ordered my MKII yesterday from CellGuy, and will have it before Friday. Perhaps you were already aware, but over at the marketplace in the dealers corner, retailers will keep us cpf'ers updated with their stock as well as when they expect to receive stock. Enjoy your Predator. ArmyTek makes some great looking lights, especially the Viking!


----------



## keenism

PocketBeam said:


> Yes, a tiny amount of light leaks through the rubber/silicon button itself. No worries of water proofness from that. And the amount of light is less than the lowest low of 0.01 lumens. I mean the leakage is super tiny. And it was so small I had to verify my eyes were not playing tricks. I verified it by blocking all light coming from the front and then turning the light on and off.
> 
> I see no cause for alarm. I don't see it as a problem. It isn't even bright, you can't even see it from a few feet away. I bet once people forget about it, no one else brings it up. I am amazed he noticed it.



I thought it was light reflecting off of the silver ring around the button, but it was only in those two spots...that's how I noticed, and yes it's very dim. Nothing to worry about apparently.


----------



## thedoc007

I received mine just yesterday, although it was delivered a few days ago, I was not around to receive it. But mine is missing the pocket clip - I got two O-rings, the little silver ring, and the manual, and nothing else. No lanyard, and no clip. Not very useful...anyone know the best way to proceed from here? Frankly if I have to ship it I'm not going to bother, I'll just use it around the home and use other lights when I go out. But after waiting almost a month over the stated shipping date, and the missing clip, I am VERY unhappy with Zebralight right now. 

The light itself works great, and the threads are super smooth, something that several common manufacturers need to improve - glad to see that ZL is taking the time and effort to make it smooth out of the box.


----------



## holylight

There's no lanyard only a clip, 2 orings, light and cards. 






Email zl about the missing clip. Is a detachable clip so zl can sent to you.


----------



## PocketBeam

My clip was not attached and was under the cardboard, I.e. under the spot where the clip is in the above picture. And there is no lanyard, but there is a tiny split ring attached.


----------



## mauiblue

Definitely need the clip as I would be carrying it in my pocket. If you can, call them about the discrepancy. Also send them an email message. Don't let up until you get the satisfaction you deserve.

Sent from my DROID RAZR MAXX using Tapatalk 2


----------



## GordoJones88

Watch out that clip doesn't pop off and poke somebody's eye out!


----------



## Byggeren

The pocket clip was missing on mine also. I Contacts ZL on the web page, they sent me a one the same day. I'm very pleased with the support! 

I don't know if I'll ever use it though


----------



## AbnInfantry

The Zebralight SC600 MkII I purchased from E2 Field Gear also didn't come with a pocket clip. I contacted E2 Field Gear and they've mailed me a pocket clip.


----------



## mauiblue

I just got the light about an hour ago. Charging up my Callie's Kustoms batteries for tonight's patrol. 

Sent from my DROID RAZR MAXX using Tapatalk 2


----------



## sticktodrum

I just ordered one from E2 Field Gear. It seems they actually had them in stock, so we'll see how that goes. I had an order in with Zebralight directly, but sent them an email to cancel it. I guess we'll see how this whole thing pans out. I've really been looking forward to this light.


----------



## toysareforboys

sticktodrum said:


> I just ordered one from E2 Field Gear. It seems they actually had them in stock, so we'll see how that goes. I had an order in with Zebralight directly, but sent them an email to cancel it. I guess we'll see how this whole thing pans out. I've really been looking forward to this light.


I ordered from Illumination Supply and got my shipping notice today! Can't wait 

I got my Pana 3400's all charged up and ready! I read somewhere that they didn't fit, too long, so I checked mine:






But then realized they were talking about the protected ones 

-Jamie M.


----------



## flasherByNight

E2 Shipped very fast for me, excellent customer service from the small amount of experience I've had. Would definitely use again.
I ordered the panasonics too (from a suggestion earlier in the thread), they better fit!
Actually though it was the earlier versions of the original SC600 that apparently they didn't fit in (due to thickness).


----------



## PocketBeam

My Orbtronic 3400 fit and they are Panasonic protected batteries. I think some forget the spring on the positive side... Or as flasher pointed out, could be confusing the mk I.


----------



## bjt3833

I ordered march 10th and received mine today.

Every 18650 I have fits and works just fine. They range from the notoriously long protected Fasttech Panasonic 2900s to Eagletac 3400s and the Zebralight and Orbtronic 3100s. 

The led looks to be centered by my eye so the beam has no dark spots in the hotspot. I look forward to getting some real lumen ratings out there tho. I believe the 900 turbo, 500 and 270 ratings but I'm not sure about any of the other lower ones. This is mostly comparing to the known ratings of the sc52 since the beams are so similar. It is definitely brighter than my Nitecore ec25 judging by a ceiling bounce which is the only way I can tell for sure about lumen comparisons when beam patterns vary in flood or throw much. 

According to my eye and an app on my phone, M1 is the same brightness on the sc52 and sc600. 

I get 70uA draw when off at the tailcap and 3.18A draw at startup on turbo. Was measuring these by myself just holding the probes so didn't want to go through all of the different levels. 

The button does have a more pronounced click than my sc52 and I do have the ever so slight light coming through two spots on the button but it is hard to see even when looking for it so it is a nonissue. 

Threads are smooth as silk. 

Just wanted to address all the comments or questions I've seen. 
I think that covers the various comments from the thread. 
Please overlook any typos. I sent this from my iPad and jumped around a lot as stuff popped into my mind.


----------



## bjt3833

Oh and the zebralight 18650 batteries are most definitely what I'd consider flat top although I've never had any flat top batteries so I may be misinformed. The wrapper is higher than the positive contact of the battery and that's what flat top is in my eyes. 
Pretty sure I saw that question in this thread before but I'm definitely not scrolling through all 31 pages to confirm.


----------



## Byggeren

toysareforboys said:


> I ordered from Illumination Supply and got my shipping notice today! Can't wait
> 
> I got my Pana 3400's all charged up and ready! I read somewhere that they didn't fit, too long, so I checked mine:
> 
> 
> 
> But then realized they were talking about the protected ones
> 
> -Jamie M.



The huge protected Panasonic NCR18650B from Fasttech slipped right into my SC600II. No worries


----------



## chappel

Ordered mine directly from Zebralight on 4/15; so far haven't even gotten my email confirming shipment, although I expect it shouldn't be much longer (fingers crossed). I've been waiting for a MkII since they first announced the original was being updated (in January, maybe?) so I'm thinking another week or two won't kill me.


----------



## noboneshotdog

chappel said:


> Ordered mine directly from Zebralight on 4/15; so far haven't even gotten my email confirming shipment, although I expect it shouldn't be much longer (fingers crossed). I've been waiting for a MkII since they first announced the original was being updated (in January, maybe?) so I'm thinking another week or two won't kill me.



This morning I emailed E2 FieldGear and they confirmed that they have them in stock, so I cancelled my order w ZebraLight and am hoping to have it early next week. Both E2 and Zebralight have both sent emails and Zebralight cancelled my order and sent a paypal refund notification. The waiting is almost over!


----------



## mauiblue

I had fun with the light last night. Still trying to figure out getting into the program mode. Other than that, I am satisfied with this new model. Fits/clips in my jeans pocket with no problems. 

Sent from my DROID RAZR MAXX using Tapatalk 2


----------



## bjt3833

mauiblue said:


> I had fun with the light last night. Still trying to figure out getting into the program mode. Other than that, I am satisfied with this new model. Fits/clips in my jeans pocket with no problems.
> 
> Sent from my DROID RAZR MAXX using Tapatalk 2



While in the mode level you want to change the 2 level of just double click until until it starts accessing the other levels is basically what I do. 
I roughly count to 6 double clicks which is what you are supposed to do to access them and then when you find the level you want to program turn off the light for a second or two and it'll be all set. Just remember that clicking too much doesn't hurt to get into it. It might help to do the high level first since it has the slow strobe so it's most obvious to realize you did it properly.


I did a step down timer test earlier and 5 minutes of 900 lumens with my hand holding it for maximum heat transference this little thing gets TOASTY. At exactly 5 minutes it stepped down and it was hot enough to leave red on my hand where it wasn't far from burning me. Not complaining at all because it puts out some major light for the size and apparently has excellent heat transfer to the outside because I popped the battery out immediately and it was barely warm at all. The heat definitely goes where it is supposed to through the body and even the little stainless ring around the switch was hotter than the aluminum body I think. I guarantee you can never complain of colds hands at night when you have this puppy on you.


----------



## srmd22

noboneshotdog said:


> This morning I emailed E2 FieldGear and they confirmed that they have them in stock, so I cancelled my order w ZebraLight and am hoping to have it early next week. Both E2 and Zebralight have both sent emails and Zebralight cancelled my order and sent a paypal refund notification. The waiting is almost over!



Just did the same!


----------



## noboneshotdog

Got mine from E2 FieldGear yesterday. This sucker is a POCKET ROCKET! It is ALOT smaller than what I had expected from the pics that have been posted. I cant believe the amount of light that comes out of such a small unit. Very happy with this purchase!


----------



## Cessquill

I don't suppose anybody from the UK has seen it hit the shores yet, have they? I held off ordering it direct to support local business (and I didn't know what the customs situation would be), but I've yet to see any local retailers mention it on their websites.


----------



## TEEJ

My ZL SC600 Mk II swallows and runs fine on all the 3400 mah cells I tried, including the Fasttech _protected_, XTAR, etc. 

In fact, when I double checked, the Mk II has MORE ROOM for cells than the Mk I does...as some of the larger 3400's were a tight fit in the Mk I, but fit into the Mk II.


----------



## srmd22

Well, y'all talked me into it. Incoming from E2 FieldGear, shipped yesterday! Should be here any day now!


----------



## david57strat

mauiblue said:


> I just got the light about an hour ago. Charging up my Callie's Kustoms batteries for tonight's patrol.
> 
> Sent from my DROID RAZR MAXX using Tapatalk 2



I would love to get my hands on one of these Zebralights. Just out of curiosity, which particular model of Callie's Kustoms batteries are you using, and is that a Pila charger? Could you please share your experience with them? I've been using EagleTac 3100mah 18650 batteries for about a year, and have been extremely pleased with them (dependability, output, etc.); but I'm not dead-set on using those exclusively, and am happy to experiment with other makers who use Panasonic-based 18650 batteries - especially since I have more lights that work on my favorite (18650) batteries, and tend to be gravitating towards the purchase of more 18650 lights.


----------



## TEEJ

Callies Kustoms work great too, and they have 3400 mah 18650's that fit, etc. The "Zombie Response" version of the 18650 3400 mah cells' _STICKER_ makes them a tight fit, but the std label 3400 mah Caliies Kustoms fit fine.

I also use their IMR 18650's for lights that have iffy safety controls and/or benefit from super heavy amp supplies, as the IMRs make the lumens scream out a lot better under heavy load...at a sacrifice in total run time for lower/normal loads. (SC600 regulation means IMR's are not needed for peak output)


----------



## toysareforboys

Mine arrive today! OMFG it's so much brighter than my SC600w 




LICK FOR HIGH RES! (sorry for the mess, have a track day tomorrow so had to charge my cams and junk)

Love love love this light. I'll give it a try EDC'ing it but it's quite a bit bigger than my current edc, the SK68 

-Jamie M.


----------



## chappel

Ordered on the 15th direct from ZebraLight, and just got my shipment notification - I should have it by Friday, so 2-4 weeks was an accurate estimate. Can't wait!


----------



## Nicola

TEEJ said:


> My ZL SC600 Mk II swallows and runs fine on all the 3400 mah cells I tried, including the Fasttech _protected_, XTAR, etc. ...



so dual spring make xtar 3400 acceptable even if slightly longer than recommended specs?,


----------



## JetskiMark

toysareforboys said:


> LICK FOR HIGH RES! <snip>



I tried that, but it didn't work.

It will be interesting to see beamshots comparing the MKI to the MKII.


----------



## toysareforboys

JetskiMark said:


> I tried that, but it didn't work.
> 
> It will be interesting to see beamshots comparing the MKI to the MKII.


I'll see what I can do tonight 

-Jamie M.
(p.s. LICK HARDER!)


----------



## SGH77




----------



## toysareforboys

Had someone ask me for a side by side of SK68, SC600w and SC600 MKII:




LICK FOR HIGH RES!

-Jamie M.


----------



## TEEJ

JetskiMark said:


> I tried that, but it didn't work.
> 
> It will be interesting to see beamshots comparing the MKI to the MKII.





http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...t-SC600-MkII&p=4186337&viewfull=1#post4186337

Post #838 Has that beam shot comparison. (Mk I vs Mk II)



Plus reference shots of the scene in daylight for comparison, and with comparison lights with a Nichia 219 High CRI/XM-L2.


----------



## TEEJ

Nicola said:


> so dual spring make xtar 3400 acceptable even if slightly longer than recommended specs?,



It looks like it.

At first I thought there was less room in the Mk II, but it was just that the spring in the Mk I had sagged a smidge. A depth gauge indicated the actual battery length is the same internally.

The Mk II actually has a smidge MORE internal diameter room for your fatter 18650's than the Mk I, at least on mine.


----------



## toysareforboys

I was asked to post a pic comparing the lowest low modes on both the SC600w and the MKII. The lowest mode on the MKII was accessed by long pressing the button to start in low mode, clicking 6 times to enter programming mode, then double clicking until the lowest low setting was reached:





LICK FOR: HIGH RES or UBER HIGH RES!!

That is the best pic I could take with my camera. The SC600w looks just a hair brighter in this pic than it does in real life, but the MKII is spot on. This was taken with a calibrated white balance and high CRI source for the background lighting, not sure if you can make out the tint difference between the two lights 

-Jamie M.


----------



## Nicola

Thanks TEEJ.

Now I tried and 69mm long XTAR 3400 seems to fit with no problems (or damage possibility) in MkII notwithstanding 68mm specs.

I compared MkII brightness to my ET D25LC2 XM-L2 and found them very similar, so I reminded that battery should come from ZL with 50% charge.
MkII battery test confirmed it (2 flashes).

So I'm imagining what brightness I will see this night after I will charge XTAR 3400 to 100% :huh:


----------



## toysareforboys

Nicola said:


> So I'm imagining what brightness I will see this night after I will charge XTAR 3400 to 100% :huh:


The MKII has regulated output so the battery charge doesn't affect the brightness 

-Jamie M.


----------



## Nicola

...no possible stepdown?


----------



## toysareforboys

Nicola said:


> ...no possible stepdown?


I'd assume it'd stepdown eventually but probably when the battery was very low 

And remember it steps down automatically after 5 mins or whatever if it's on high 

-Jamie M.


----------



## srmd22

Arrived today. Loaded an old 18650 with 3.7 left on it, and this thing lights up the place-- it's the bees knees, baby! Seriously, this is my first Zebralight, and I love everything about it, fit and finish, UI, big output. Got it within three days of ordering from E2 Field Gear.


----------



## PocketBeam

Congratulations on your first Zebralight. I bet it isn't the last.


----------



## mauiblue

david57strat said:


> I would love to get my hands on one of these Zebralights. Just out of curiosity, which particular model of Callie's Kustoms batteries are you using, and is that a Pila charger? Could you please share your experience with them? I've been using EagleTac 3100mah 18650 batteries for about a year, and have been extremely pleased with them (dependability, output, etc.); but I'm not dead-set on using those exclusively, and am happy to experiment with other makers who use Panasonic-based 18650 batteries - especially since I have more lights that work on my favorite (18650) batteries, and tend to be gravitating towards the purchase of more 18650 lights.



I heard great feedback on the Callie's Kustoms batteries (3100) and the Pila charger on this site that I had to get them. Also I've got some Redilast batteries (3100) which are working out well with my Nitecore Tiny Monster. I also used these cells on Thrunite TN11. I wish the Pila charger had a four bay model which would be a bit more convenient. 

Sent from my DROID RAZR MAXX using Tapatalk 2


----------



## Nicola

toysareforboys said:


> I'd assume it'd stepdown eventually but probably when the battery was very low
> 
> And remember it steps down automatically after 5 mins or whatever if it's on high



Correct, it was not a stepdown, I confirm ET D25LC2 XM-L2 turbo brightness is very near to MkII.
In the end, ET specs say 621 lm, Selfbuilt found that ET is often conservative about lm (and the opposite about runtime), so I think D25LC2 could be around 750 lm.

Both very good, I appreciate ET for CR123A and MkII for wider spill, overall form factor, UI and side switch.


----------



## TEEJ

My Mk II starts to blink/step when the 18650 gets down to ~ 3.8 v


----------



## Nicola

TEEJ said:


> My Mk II starts to blink/step when the 18650 gets down to ~ 3.8 v



About blinks: is it correct to consider them as follows?

4 blinks = 100%, 
3 blinks = 75%, 
2 blinks = 50%, 
1 blink = 25%


----------



## markr6

TEEJ said:


> My Mk II starts to blink/step when the 18650 gets down to ~ 3.8 v



Damn, isn't that about 70% full on a 3400mah 18650?


----------



## Binomial

Hello all,

I got my ZebraLight SC600 mk ii yesterday. I have waited a long time. Order date March 6, order shipped April 18, order received May 2. This is my second ZebraLight. I own a ZebraLight SC52 (and a Fenix LD01). I am very pleased with the flashlights that I selected. I have the feeling that I only need a good headlamp to complete my collection.

Best regards


----------



## TobyZiegler

Binomial said:


> I have the feeling that I only need a good headlamp to complete my collection.



I think Zebralight could help with that too :thumbsup:
I would recommend H502... great little light and can act as a backup / EDC as well!


----------



## bjt3833

TEEJ said:


> My Mk II starts to blink/step when the 18650 gets down to ~ 3.8 v




What kind of battery is that? My unprotected panasonic 18650A was at 3.3 today and hadn't exhibited any step down or anything. I just swapped it because it was down to a single blink on the voltage check and didn't wanna head out for the day with it that low.


----------



## BWX

I ordered mine on 04/11/2013 from illuminationsupply thinking falsely that they would be getting a shipment in "any day".. So on the 20th I wrote them and asked what was up and they said they would be getting a shipment in next week. I left pre-order open. Then on the 29th they wrote saying they got a shipment but not enough to send me one.. Whatever.. It was a good deal, but I cancelled the pre-order. I'll wait till someone has one in stock.


----------



## brag

Mine came from zebra light. I'm very happy, sc52 and 6330 came at the same time, the ui is pretty cool!!! 

Thanks ZL


----------



## toysareforboys

bjt3833 said:


> What kind of battery is that? My unprotected panasonic 18650A was at 3.3 today and hadn't exhibited any step down or anything. I just swapped it because it was down to a single blink on the voltage check and didn't wanna head out for the day with it that low.


I tested tonight and used a partially charged 3400mah unprotected Panasonic battery. At the visual step down mark (I had massive fan cooling and kept making it go to turbo mode every 5 mins) I pulled the battery out (was pretty warm) and was at 3.1v. I did the battery check in the flashlight and it was at a single blink.

Sounds like you might have an iffy battery TEEJ?

-Jamie M.


----------



## thedoc007

Nicola said:


> About blinks: is it correct to consider them as follows?
> 
> 4 blinks = 100%,
> 3 blinks = 75%,
> 2 blinks = 50%,
> 1 blink = 25%



I haven't used it enough to confirm the exact numbers, but I do know it isn't that. If it was 100% at 4, then after <2 minutes, it would have to drop to 3 flashes. A better way to put it would be:

4 flashes = >75%
3 flashes = 50-75%
2 flashes = 25-50%
1 flashes = <25%

That isn't just nitpicking...3.9 volts vs. 4.2 volts will give you a LOT less runtime, but it might gave you the same number of flashes...no substitute for the OLED readout of the TM26. More companies need to start using that...


----------



## Nicola

thedoc007 said:


> ... A better way to put it would be:
> 
> 4 flashes = >75%
> 3 flashes = 50-75%
> 2 flashes = 25-50%
> 1 flashes = <25%
> ...



I agree. That's what I meant.
I find "flashes" another cool feature of this little beast.


----------



## Tulip bush

I haven't read the entire thread, but can somebody let me know if the sc600 II is stepped or constant output, just wondering if it would hold the 500 lm until the battery cuts out.

thanks


----------



## Johnno

It's stepped. It will only hold 500lm while there is enough juice left in the cell to do so... then it steps to the user selected med level, rinse/repeat to the user selected low level and then powers down when the cut-off voltage (2.7V) is reached.


----------



## Oztorchfreak

Great light if you get someone that actually has them in stock anywhere in the world.

These have not hit the Australian market yet as far as I know.

Is it really worth the purchase if people already have the older MKI version like myself?

The main thing that I would consider worther of upgrading to it for is the battery level functions like my Zebralight SC52.

The SC52 is really a great little pocket rocket that I hardly notice in my jeans and is my EDC light now.



*CHEERS*


----------



## flasherByNight

so based on flashes or step downs is there a generic/general good idea of when the battery should be charged?


----------



## PocketBeam

If you have the mk I should you upgrade? I would so no if you just want a brighter light. The mk I is already very bright, 750-900 is not really noticeable unless side by side. Reasons to upgrade, battery level meter, lower low, longer runtime. Your decision if that is enough. Please note, I don't have the mk I, just have the mk II.


----------



## Tulip bush

Johnno said:


> It's stepped. It will only hold 500lm while there is enough juice left in the cell to do so... then it steps to the user selected med level, rinse/repeat to the user selected low level and then powers down when the cut-off voltage (2.7V) is reached.



Thanks, that's a shame, I thought it might have full time constant like an armytek. Still a cracking light though.


----------



## AmperSand

Oztorchfreak said:


> Great light if you get someone that actually has them in stock anywhere in the world.
> 
> These have not hit the Australian market yet as far as I know.
> 
> Is it really worth the purchase if people already have the older MKI version like myself?
> 
> The main thing that I would consider worther of upgrading to it for is the battery level functions like my Zebralight SC52.
> 
> The SC52 is really a great little pocket rocket that I hardly notice in my jeans and is my EDC light now.
> 
> 
> 
> *CHEERS*




Im from Aus too, got sick of waiting and ordered from e2fieldgear. Arrived pretty quickly. I have an sc600 and sc52 as well as getting the sc600 mkii.
Definately worth the upgrade just for the programmable med and low modes and lower low modes along with better circuit efficiency and more compact package.
I also have a pre-stepdown sc600, so having stepdown at lower voltages is nice also.
Sc52 still has a lower low than the lowest low of the sc600 mkii.
I have a 3 year old son with autism and its especially handy to have the super low modes to check on him at night without disturbing him. 
The highest output looks identical between my sc600 and sc600 mkii (even on a ceiling bounce) , so if highs are all you care about not a lot of difference there at all.


----------



## oeL

Tulip bush said:


> Thanks, that's a shame, I thought it might have full time constant like an armytek. Still a cracking light though.



When you compare the armytek programmed to constant brightness with the zebralight both behave quite the same: At the last few % of capacity they step down, allowing you to grap a spare cell out of your pocket (or even find your way home at reduced brightness). Former models with constant brightness regulation didn't have this feature - and it was no fun at all to jump around in the forest at night and all of a sudden find yourself in total darkness...

Still you have (estimated) more than 90 % of capacity at full brightness. And because both (the SC600/II and the Armytek single 18650 lights) are accepting Panasonic based 3400 mAh cells (AW 3400 or unprotected NCR18650B) the runtime is great.

The real difference on regulation is the turbo mode of the MKII: The claimed 900 lm are for the first 5 minutes only. The Armytek starts on high and stays on high. 
For Armytec one should note that the lumens value is (still) the LED emitter value and not (yet) OTF (off the front) which is a bit less. Probably not much, because of the high quality reflector and front glass used.


----------



## fnj

Tulip bush said:


> Thanks, that's a shame, I thought it might have full time constant like an armytek. Still a cracking light though.



I am getting the sense that you don't know what stepped regulation is, though it's presumptuous of me to think so. In any case, there will be readers who don't know, so here's the deal.

True fixed regulation, like presumably the Armytek, holds the setting absolutely flat, until the battery can no longer support that level any more; the end behavior after that is unspecified. Without further specification, the light might go out instantly at that point. Or it might dim out smoothly. Or it could (gasp) step down in an orderly fashion. Or conceivably it could do other things, like start flickering. I don't know which one of those the Armytek does.

True stepped flat regulation, like the SC600 Mk II and the HDS EDC, holds the setting absolutely flat until, in the judgement of the designer, the real time measured state of the battery no longer can support that level with safety to the battery. Then it steps down to a reduced level, and there can be a number of such steps, ending with again unspecified behavior at the absolute end of light production.

That's right, those who read carefully. They are pretty much the SAME THING. The stepped flat is nothing but a subset of the fixed. Neither one can hold that flat setting when the battery can't maintain it any more. Either one has to do SOMETHING at that point. The only wiggle room is how close either one lets the battery get to the irreduceable limit before either stepping down or going out, and in my experience they never tell you that. You have to wait for a graph of lumens versus run time from a test.

Anyway, thank you Tulip bush, you got me to check the Armytek site. Those are some sweet lights, and I don't think I'm going to be able to resist a Predator Pro 2.5 or perhaps a Viking Pro 2.5, but probably the former because it is a quite different beam from my SC600 Mk I. It will probably get here before my old Mk II order!

Note to, ahem, "all" other manufacturers. How can Armytek offer free DHL worldwide on orders over $95.00 while they use the slow boat from China?


----------



## fnj

Just want to very briefly mention, if you visit Armytek and buy certain stuff currently on big promotion, and include a certain CPF promo code on top of that, you are going to come away VERY pleased indeed.


----------



## Tulip bush

Thanks......oeL and fnj, I am still learning, and it's great that you guy's help. So the predator and viking are like the sc600 II with regards to stepped, but the pro predator and viking are constant from start to finish. I think I've got it. I'm going to read it again and hopefully the penny will drop,,,,, I'm not the brightest of people:duh2:.


----------



## fnj

Tulip bush said:


> Thanks......oeL and fnj, I am still learning, and it's great that you guy's help. So the predator and viking are like the sc600 II with regards to stepped, but the pro predator and viking are constant from start to finish. I think I've got it. I'm going to read it again and hopefully the penny will drop,,,,, I'm not the brightest of people:duh2:.



As I understand it, the Pros are more programmable than anything I have ever heard of including HDS EDC, and you can set your own regulation method: fixed, stepped, or absolutely maximal with smooth droop at the end. Not only that but you can program not only output mode, but even HOW MANY modes there are! I know that sounds incredible, but that is my understanding.

We almost certainly should take this off topic conversation to another thread.


----------



## Bullzeyebill

Let's not get carried away with a long discussion re Armytek in this ZebraLight thread.

Bill


----------



## Tulip bush

Bullzeyebill said:


> Let's not get carried away with a long discussion re Armytek in this ZebraLight thread.
> 
> Bill


:thumbsup:


----------



## oeL

​OT comments removed. Let's stay on topic.------ Bill

Back on topic:

One should note that stepping down when reaching the capacities end is a feature improvement Zebralight introduced later. Their first models just switched off, leaving you in total darkness. And the steps are big steps and noticeable, so this includes some kind of low voltage warning as well. Other lights might dim over time, and since your eyes will adapt you might even not notice it at all. In my eyes, the regulation of the Zebras like in the SC 600 MkII is one of the best currently available.

Just the turbo/high switch, one might like it, the other not. But I see that the SC 600 is too small to handle the 900 lm longer than 5 minutes, especially because of the lack of temperature based regulation (like the Zebra S6330).

Hopefully the SC600"w" MkII will arrive soon


----------



## AussieRanga

Oztorchfreak said:


> Great light if you get someone that actually has them in stock anywhere in the world.
> 
> These have not hit the Australian market yet as far as I know.
> 
> Is it really worth the purchase if people already have the older MKI version like myself?
> 
> The main thing that I would consider worther of upgrading to it for is the battery level functions like my Zebralight SC52.
> 
> The SC52 is really a great little pocket rocket that I hardly notice in my jeans and is my EDC light now.
> 
> 
> 
> *CHEERS*



I'm from Aus and my friend has had his for about 3 weeks now. 

I have a Mk1 NW so it's a bit hard to compare them. At first I found I liked the feel of my Mk1 in the hand, then he removed the STUPID (!!!) ring for attaching lanyards and the Mk2 felt pretty good. I got out the Dremel and completely removed the knobby bit on the Mk1 where the ring would go and it feels even better again!!

I think I'll get one just for the lower lows, better efficiency and the fact it's CW as after being on the NW band wagon for so long and having recently got the sc52, I am actually finding CW has it's time and place and is still very relevant. 
Yes, colours definitely appear more real at night with NW but simply being able to see more and identify things easier makes it an easy choice for an electrician and avid underground explorer 

Had I owned a Mk1 CW, I may not be so inclined to ugrade.
Will I buy a Mk2 NW if I get the CW? Probably, but I doubt I'm alone there!


----------



## Johnnyt

Oztorchfreak said:


> Great light if you get someone that actually has them in stock anywhere in the world.
> 
> These have not hit the Australian market yet as far as I know.
> 
> Is it really worth the purchase if people already have the older MKI version like myself?
> 
> The main thing that I would consider worther of upgrading to it for is the battery level functions like my Zebralight SC52.
> 
> The SC52 is really a great little pocket rocket that I hardly notice in my jeans and is my EDC light now
> 
> *CHEERS*



In the cpf marketplace torchdirect has it in stock. I ordered yesterday and got a shipping notice today!

http://www.cpfmarketplace.com/mp/sh...com-ZebraLight-LRI-Best-Price-on-Earth!/page2


----------



## Romo Lampkin's Cat

I joined just to make this post! I've been lurking off and on for years.

I bought and received an SC600 mkII a couple weeks ago. In the past few years I've become more concerned with self-defense, and in the past few months I decided I wanted to carry a flashlight. The SC600 is my first "real" flashlight. The build quality, the feel of the switch, the compactness -- all outstanding. And it's insanely bright, as expected.

But there's one thing I don't like about it: color. I get green tint around the hotspot and a purple discoloration around the outer perimeter of the spill. In turbo mode, the discoloration is less noticeable and I would characterize the color as cool white. I get this on all settings, including turbo.

Regardless of whether I like its color (and I don't), I don't plan to send it back. It's my first EDC and I'm pretty happy with it. It's just nutso to be able to walk into my backyard and see, well, everything when I hit the button. My middle son (age 6) has discovered without any influence from me that he likes flashlights too, and he takes one of my Dorcy Cool Blue #1's to bed so he can read with it. (Yes, he's six and he reads in bed with a flashlight. Pretty cool huh?) But he loves it when I shine the SC600 on the ceiling of his room so he can compare it to the paucity of light coming from the Cool Blue. We then chant "Hefty hefty hefty! Wimpy wimpy wimpy!" together and laugh. He doesn't even know where that comes from but he likes to say it. Ah, good times with flashlights.


----------



## Bullzeyebill

Awesome, I am happy that your like your SC600 even though it does not meet all of your expectations. Also + that one of your son's is liking flashlights, maybe he will become a flashaholic, if his dad can afford it. LOL.

Bill


----------



## Oztorchfreak

Johnnyt said:


> In the cpf marketplace torchdirect has it in stock. I ordered yesterday and got a shipping notice today!
> 
> http://www.cpfmarketplace.com/mp/sh...com-ZebraLight-LRI-Best-Price-on-Earth!/page2





I am still not sure about whether or not to get the SC600 MKII.

I have the SC600 MK I version.

The SC52 is doing such a great job as my EDC that I don't think I need it now.

The SC52 is so tiny in my pocket that it is a wonder that it has not gone through the washing machine yet!

The battery level and low battery warning functions work really well and on a AA Imedion LSD (low self discharge) 2400mah battery it goes for ages.

I really think that using my Efest 3.7v 700mah IMR or one of my Soshine 3.7v Li-ion 700mah batteries in it is just for showing off but very impractical as the runtime is not very long and the kickdown cuts in to drop the light back down in output.



CHEERS


----------



## holylight

Sc 52 is almost perfect. 1 tier higher than mk2.


----------



## thaugen

Romo Lampkin's Cat said:


> I joined just to make this post! I've been lurking off and on for years.
> 
> I bought and received an SC600 mkII a couple weeks ago. In the past few years I've become more concerned with self-defense, and in the past few months I decided I wanted to carry a flashlight. The SC600 is my first "real" flashlight. The build quality, the feel of the switch, the compactness -- all outstanding. And it's insanely bright, as expected.
> 
> But there's one thing I don't like about it: color. I get green tint around the hotspot and a purple discoloration around the outer perimeter of the spill. In turbo mode, the discoloration is less noticeable and I would characterize the color as cool white. I get this on all settings, including turbo.
> 
> Regardless of whether I like its color (and I don't), I don't plan to send it back. It's my first EDC and I'm pretty happy with it. It's just nutso to be able to walk into my backyard and see, well, everything when I hit the button. My middle son (age 6) has discovered without any influence from me that he likes flashlights too, and he takes one of my Dorcy Cool Blue #1's to bed so he can read with it. (Yes, he's six and he reads in bed with a flashlight. Pretty cool huh?) But he loves it when I shine the SC600 on the ceiling of his room so he can compare it to the paucity of light coming from the Cool Blue. We then chant "Hefty hefty hefty! Wimpy wimpy wimpy!" together and laugh. He doesn't even know where that comes from but he likes to say it. Ah, good times with flashlights.



Welcome to the forum and thanks for sharing your story! As a father of three I spend a good deal of time playing flashlight games with my kids as well. 

Regarding your experience with the tint on the Sc600Mkii mine is exactly the same. I love everything about this light except the tint. It seems all my Zebralights with XML emitters have had the nasty green hotspot with purple rings. My XPG Zebralights have beautiful tints. All this being said I am very happy with my Sc600Mkii. It is a great light, but I do hope the XML2 will improve the tint quality.


----------



## fnj

Romo Lampkin's Cat said:


> I joined just to make this post! I've been lurking off and on for years.
> 
> I bought and received an SC600 mkII a couple weeks ago. In the past few years I've become more concerned with self-defense, and in the past few months I decided I wanted to carry a flashlight. The SC600 is my first "real" flashlight. The build quality, the feel of the switch, the compactness -- all outstanding. And it's insanely bright, as expected.
> 
> But there's one thing I don't like about it: color. I get green tint around the hotspot and a purple discoloration around the outer perimeter of the spill. In turbo mode, the discoloration is less noticeable and I would characterize the color as cool white. I get this on all settings, including turbo.
> 
> Regardless of whether I like its color (and I don't), I don't plan to send it back. It's my first EDC and I'm pretty happy with it. It's just nutso to be able to walk into my backyard and see, well, everything when I hit the button. My middle son (age 6) has discovered without any influence from me that he likes flashlights too, and he takes one of my Dorcy Cool Blue #1's to bed so he can read with it. (Yes, he's six and he reads in bed with a flashlight. Pretty cool huh?) But he loves it when I shine the SC600 on the ceiling of his room so he can compare it to the paucity of light coming from the Cool Blue. We then chant "Hefty hefty hefty! Wimpy wimpy wimpy!" together and laugh. He doesn't even know where that comes from but he likes to say it. Ah, good times with flashlights.



I remember that when the SC600 first came out the weird color variations in the beam were a bitter disappointment to many of us. We just accepted it as a tradeoff due to the horrible XM-L, but it always seemed to me that whoever was responsible for the XM-L design and execution at Cree should be shot (obvious hyperbole here, guys). If that was the best they could do, sorry but it just stinks. I can't wait to see if the XM-L2 is any better in terms of the horrible color problems with the XM-L - I am getting one from Brand A since Brand Z is not coming through with it at this time.

Notwithstanding my derision for the XM-L, it sure has allowed some wonderful flashlights to be made, like the SC600! And oh yeah, you bet I have an SC600 Mk II on order!


----------



## SAVERIO

Romo Lampkin's Cat said:


> Regardless of whether I like its color (and I don't), I don't plan to send it back. It's my first EDC and I'm pretty happy with it. It's just nutso to be able to walk into my backyard and see, well, everything when I hit the button. My middle son (age 6) has discovered without any influence from me that he likes flashlights too, and he takes one of my Dorcy Cool Blue #1's to bed so he can read with it. (Yes, he's six and he reads in bed with a flashlight. Pretty cool huh?) But he loves it when I shine the SC600 on the ceiling of his room so he can compare it to the paucity of light coming from the Cool Blue. We then chant "Hefty hefty hefty! Wimpy wimpy wimpy!" together and laugh. He doesn't even know where that comes from but he likes to say it. Ah, good times with flashlights.



Awesome! I gave my 6 yr old daughter a Fenix E11 and she loves it!!! 
It's so funny to see a 6yr old "EDC" a flashlight. haha!

Thanks for your comments about the SC600 MKII. 
This is one I have been researching/comparing against the EagleTac (I'm very indecisive...). 

I see that people are saying these are not stocked anywhere. Is that maybe just a non-U.S. thing? Most places I've inquired do have stock of the SC600 MKII.


----------



## kaichu dento

thaugen said:


> It seems all my Zebralights with XML emitters have had the nasty green hotspot with purple rings. My XPG Zebralights have beautiful tints. All this being said I am very happy with my Sc600Mkii. It is a great light, but I do hope the XML2 will improve the tint quality.





fnj said:


> I can't wait to see if the XM-L2 is any better in terms of the horrible color problems with the XM-L..


Much like my first P4, my first XM-L impressed me with its beam pattern, but disappointed with tint shifting across the beam. Both great emitters for a soft floody beam, but poor in tint consistency in the warmer versions.

Maybe with the XM-L2 they'll finally get it dialed, but I suspect that it's a problem related to large area emitters and getting the phosphor thickness just right that needs to be addressed.


----------



## PocketBeam

I don't think the green is that bad. Most of the time I don't notice.

As for the purple, I believe that is the anti-reflective coating.


----------



## kaichu dento

In general usage where you're focusing on looking for things they're not bad at all, but when you start looking at areas where the tint shift is apparent, then it's there. Whether it's bad enough to worry about is another thing and I still have lights with both emitters that I like a lot.

Don't know about the anti-reflective coating theory, but it's been noted in both these emitters in lights with no coating as well.

None of that is going to stop me from getting an SC600 MkIIw though.


----------



## wedlpine

PocketBeam said:


> I don't think the green is that bad. Most of the time I don't notice.
> 
> As for the purple, I believe that is the anti-reflective coating.



Could it be chromatic aberration?


----------



## thaugen

kaichu dento said:


> In general usage where you're focusing on looking for things they're not bad at all, but when you start looking at areas where the tint shift is apparent, then it's there. Whether it's bad enough to worry about is another thing and I still have lights with both emitters that I like a lot.



This is a great point. I only notice the green and purple tint when white wall hunting. And I do love to do some white wall hunting!


----------



## GordoJones88

Romo Lampkin's Cat said:


> But there's one thing I don't like about it: color. I get green tint around the hotspot and a purple discoloration around the outer perimeter of the spill.



The bluish-purplish hue around the edges of the spill can indeed be from the anti-reflective coating. 









Having a greenish tint is not necessarily normal and is not simply just part of having an XML LED. You can buy a Cool White XML that has a very nice white tint. However, most Cool White LEDs are not whitish. Lots of flashaholics will opt for a Neutral White LED, which is typically a tad bit yellowish and is not actually a neutral white color. The yellowish/greenish halo around the hotspot is the reflection of the yellow LED. You can even sometimes see the halo as a square shape of the LED. It's much more complicated than that, and everybody has their own opinion, which is just fine.


----------



## kaichu dento

GordoJones88 said:


> The bluish-purplish hue around the edges of the spill is indeed from the anti-reflective coating.


No it's not, otherwise it wouldn't exist on lights without coated lenses.

This is the SC600 MkII thread and it needs to go back to being about the light itself.


----------



## fnj

The XM-L LED is an important and prominent feature of the SC600 MkII as it was of the SC600 before it.


----------



## Waymed

After reading 32 pages on this thread, I believe that I want one of these lights.

My eyes are tired from reading....lol.


----------



## kaichu dento

Everyone is aware of that, but going too far into emitter or battery discussion is a derail of the light centered thread.


----------



## ToyTank

Is anyone using a white Film Can diffuser on the MKII? 

I'm assuming it works as it did on the MKI but I see no mention after searching this thread.


----------



## toysareforboys

ToyTank said:


> Is anyone using a white Film Can diffuser on the MKII?
> 
> I'm assuming it works as it did on the MKI but I see no mention after searching this thread.


I use DC Fix Sand film on my flashlight lenses when I need more flood. http://www.homedepot.ca/product/window-transparency-film-sand/983422

-Jamie M.


----------



## Johnnyt

*ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*

Received my new sc600 MKII and been playing with it for a couple days. I am still getting used to the interface as it is my first ZL and it is growing on me. However, for me, I wish they would have reversed the functionality of the long click vs the short click. Short clicking thru low med high or holding the click to go directly to high seems much more intuitive to me than than hold clicking for l-m-h. Also I have a hard time getting just the right timing down for low. Sometimes I hold down too long and it cycles to medium. Sometimes too short and it short clicks to high which is really bad if your need is the moonlight mode. However maybe it'll be old hat soon.

My biggest disappointment with my particular light is that I am wondering if I have a bit of a loser in what many refer to as the tint lottery. The hotspot of my light is not particularly cool in color so that was quite pleasing maybe a mix of cool-neutral. However in all but the brightest mode the ring right around the hotspot does seem to have some 'mountain dew'-ness to it. It is hard to explain really as the beam does not have rings per se. But to me at least the tint of the beam in general on low and medium is just not pleasing. If I can figure out how to post a pic I may try to see if I can capture something that better explains what my eyes (or mind?) is seeing.

For brevity I am skipping a lot I like about this light but just wanted to point out these couple of things. I do not regret the purchase but was expecting to really love the output of the beam more than I do so far.


----------



## toysareforboys

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*



Johnnyt said:


> My biggest disappointment with my particular light is that I am wondering if I have a bit of a loser in what many refer to as the tint lottery. The hotspot of my light is not particularly cool in color so that was quite pleasing maybe a mix of cool-neutral. However in all but the brightest mode the ring right around the hotspot does seem to have some 'mountain dew'-ness to it. It is hard to explain really as the beam does not have rings per se. But to me at least the tint of the beam in general on low and medium is just not pleasing. If I can figure out how to post a pic I may try to see if I can capture something that better explains what my eyes (or mind?) is seeing.


Are you using it indoors, hunting those elusive white wall creatures?!? That's the only time I notice it. A bit of green and a bit of purple, you're not seeing things. Outdoors I don't notice at all.

-Jamie M.


----------



## Johnnyt

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*



toysareforboys said:


> Are you using it indoors, hunting those elusive white wall creatures?!? That's the only time I notice it. A bit of green and a bit of purple, you're not seeing things. Outdoors I don't notice at all.



Hi Jamie- yes most of my playing has been indoors so far as the are too many street lights near the house to try mediums and lows outside. My former EDC was an eagletac D25LC2 clicky which was very cool beam but I loved all the modes. I lost that light so I won't be able to compare directly. I also have a crelant EDC with a pleasant creamy colored beam that ramps and somehow that also I seem to like. I will have to compare it tomorrow to see it I can pinpoint the beam differences at similar ouputs. The crelant ramps in brightness so should be easy to set up a comparison.


----------



## toysareforboys

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*



Johnnyt said:


> Hi Jamie- yes most of my playing has been indoors so far


I tried super hard, different modes, different camera settings, but I couldn't get the green to show up good on the camera.




LICK FOR HIGH RES!

I highlighted the purple region, and from looking at the light with my eye, and then my computer monitor, I highlighted the area that's slightly greenish in real life, it might be slightly closer to the hotspot than where I drew it.

-Jamie M.


----------



## ToyTank

toysareforboys said:


> I use DC Fix Sand film on my flashlight lenses when I need more flood. http://www.homedepot.ca/product/window-transparency-film-sand/983422
> 
> -Jamie M.



The film can works as a diffuser wand giving light in all directions-(for photos it gives a "large" light source giving MUCH better photos)

Putting diffuser film on the lens gives a cone of diffused light. Both are useful but are not functionally the same.

Camping at night the SC600 and film can make a perfect lantern for soft light on the table or in the tent. 

On the MKI it snaps tight and secure in place. I'm hoping that is the case for the MKII. Any place that processes film will give you a white film can for free:thumbsup:


----------



## Romo Lampkin's Cat

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*



Johnnyt said:


> My biggest disappointment with my particular light is that I am wondering if I have a bit of a loser in what many refer to as the tint lottery. The hotspot of my light is not particularly cool in color so that was quite pleasing maybe a mix of cool-neutral. However in all but the brightest mode the ring right around the hotspot does seem to have some 'mountain dew'-ness to it. It is hard to explain really as the beam does not have rings per se. But to me at least the tint of the beam in general on low and medium is just not pleasing. If I can figure out how to post a pic I may try to see if I can capture something that better explains what my eyes (or mind?) is seeing.
> 
> For brevity I am skipping a lot I like about this light but just wanted to point out these couple of things. I do not regret the purchase but was expecting to really love the output of the beam more than I do so far.



What you describe is exactly what my light does. I describe the color as "puke green" and I really don't like it. Mine looks just like the picture prior to this post with the hotspot surrounded by green with purple around the edge of the spill. Do I like it? Not even a little. But I only seem to notice it when I'm playing with the light and not actually using it. So far it's had duty under a couple of cars, searching for toys under beds, tail standing while getting for bed, making me laugh in the backyard in the dark, etc. I never notice the color when I'm really using the light. Usually I'm just marveloling at the photon cannon that fits in the palm of my hand, and sometimes I even think I can feel it kick when turbo mode engages. Plus, it just feels so good in my hand, moreso than any light I've ever owned.

I've never been able to get under a car in blazing daylight and use a flashlight to see, well, everything under the car. Using the SC600 is like flipping the car over so the sun illuminates the underside. I've never enjoyed inspecting nooks and crannies so much as I do with this light.

Last Friday I took my two older sons to a Cincinnati Reds game. While walking back across the Ohio River to Newport, I was seeing how far I could hit spots. I was able to illuminate the sides of a riverboat at least 150 yards away. The area was fairly well lit; had it been completely dark I'm sure the light would have been magnificently effective.

On the way home I needed gas. The exit on I-71 I used had a lone gas station which was closed, but the pumps were still open for credit card business. The surrounding area was virtually unlit, being in the middle of Ohio farmland. Play time! While the gas was flowing I tried to see how far down the road my SC600 would shine. I probably couldn't make out anything farther than 100 to 200 yards, but I could see road signs several times farther than that. Again I marvelled at the device in my hand.

Guess what? I don't notice the color in those instances.


----------



## GordoJones88

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*



Johnnyt said:


> My biggest disappointment with my particular light is that I am wondering if I have a bit of a loser in what many refer to as the tint lottery. The hotspot of my light is not particularly cool in color so that was quite pleasing maybe a mix of cool-neutral. However in all but the brightest mode the ring right around the hotspot does seem to have some 'mountain dew'-ness to it. It is hard to explain really as the beam does not have rings per se. But to me at least the tint of the beam in general on low and medium is just not pleasing.



Yes, some Zebralight XML lights can be a bit greenish.
Perhaps you didn't see the post from the previous page.


----------



## Waymed

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*

I just received my MkII today. Super bright.
I have not tried the program levels yet.

I just have one question for today........how do you get the strobe on?
I have read about the strobe in the program levels......but what do you have to do to just turn the strobe on?

I am a bit thick today.....forgive me....


----------



## ToyTank

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*



Waymed said:


> I just have one question for today........how do you get the strobe on?
> 
> I am a bit thick today.....forgive me....



I think you set the strobe as one of the high levels. IIRC

-From off short click to get high and wait a couple seconds
-Double click 3 times to start changing modes
-Double again will change modes, double click until you find strobe
-click once to shut off

Now from High double click will change from H1 to strobe

It is a great UI but if it's your first ZL it can be annoying at first.


----------



## melty

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*



ToyTank said:


> I think you set the strobe as one of the high levels. IIRC
> 
> -From off short click to get high and wait a couple seconds
> -Double click 3 times to start changing modes
> -Double again will change modes, double click until you find strobe
> -click once to shut off
> 
> Now from High double click will change from H1 to strobe
> 
> It is a great UI but if it's your first ZL it can be annoying at first.



You must double click *6 *times (12 clicks total) to enter programming mode. Otherwise I think you're spot on.


----------



## Waymed

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*

Thanks Gents....I will give it a shot!


----------



## moozooh

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*

The slight purple tint in the spill is a side-effect of anti-reflective coating, and is unavoidable. As for the green, yes, ZL has been known for preferring greenish XM-Ls over purplish (a cool white XM-L is bound to be skewed towards one of the two tints). One possible rationale I see for this choice is that a greenish beam will light up greenish parts of the outdoors slightly better (grass, trees, moss, etc.). The most important part, of course, is that neither is very noticeable outdoors.


----------



## fnj

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*



moozooh said:


> The slight purple tint in the spill is a side-effect of anti-reflective coating, and is unavoidable. As for the green, yes, ZL has been known for preferring greenish XM-Ls over purplish (a cool white XM-L is bound to be skewed towards one of the two tints). One possible rationale I see for this choice is that a greenish beam will light up greenish parts of the outdoors slightly better (grass, trees, moss, etc.). The most important part, of course, is that neither is very noticeable outdoors.



That's like saying all warm whites are brownish-orangish (actually that is much closer to the truth; it's unavoidable). But in truth if you go for 6500 K in an XM-L you can get 1A and 1D tint bins - check Illumination Supply or any other good source - and the worst they will give you is a slight hint of rosy on the "bottom" extreme edge and an almost insignificant hint of greenish on the "top" extreme edge of 1D. OTOH 1B is clearly too greenish and 1C is borderline unless you luck out with one near the bottom edge. 1B and many 1C's are just plain undesirable for most tastes; quite repulsive for greenophobes like me. What you really want to do if you are absolutely committed to best possible results is to hand pick from 1A or 1D for closest to the center. Perhaps for a "special connoisseur edition" like the "GT" guaranteed tint HDS used to offer for a price premium.

http://flashlightwiki.com/images/f/f6/Ansiwhite.jpg


----------



## moozooh

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*

I don't understand exactly what in my post you're contesting, sorry.


----------



## TEEJ

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*



moozooh said:


> I don't understand exactly what in my post you're contesting, sorry.



He's mostly agreeing with you, but doesn't like green.


----------



## kaichu dento

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*



moozooh said:


> The slight purple tint in the spill is a side-effect of anti-reflective coating, and is unavoidable.


This myth, or half-truth keeps getting repeated so much that you would expect to see posters saying that the way to get rid of the purplish tint by using a non-coated lens. 

The reason no one suggests this solution is that they're simply repeating what they've heard enough that they believe it, but it runs in the face of the fact that lights with un-coated lenses have long shown the same effect with both P4's and XM-L's.


----------



## fnj

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*

Also, if people trouble to hook up an XM-L with no optics whatsoever and actually examine the light provided, they will see the purplish halo.


----------



## regulator

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*

I too really dislike the green tinted lights. I have seen some fantastic cool whites with almost no trend towards a tint. If there is a shift of tint, I prefer more towards the "rose" or pink color. This shift seems more natural to me. Probably because sunlight seems either very white or shifts more yellow/red as it gets dimmer. Incandescent lights also shift towards yellow and orange. Green gives things a lifeless and strange look to me. Blue tinted lights are probably the worst. I would hope that Zebralight XML lights would tend towards NOT favoring a green tint and stay as close to true cool white as possible.


----------



## toysareforboys

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*



regulator said:


> I too really dislike the green tinted lights.


My cool white (XM-L2 U2 1B) SRK arrived today from cnquality goods! That was FAST!!!!



 
LICK FOR HIGH RES! or LICK HERE FOR UBER HIGH RES!!! 

Just for S&G I compared it to my new SC600MKii, and OMG does the SC600MKii ever look GREEN when side by side with the SRK (both are cool white). Makes me even more disappointed with the green and purple beam of the SC600MKii






Exposure set so that the SRK beam is at 99% of the maximum possible exposure of the camera sensor. SC600MKii on Turbo, SRK on High.



 
LICK FOR HIGH RES! or LICK HERE FOR UBER HIGH RES!!! 

Can’t wait till it’s dark out





-Jamie M.


----------



## holylight

toysareforboys said:


> My cool white (XM-L2 U2 1B) SRK arrived today from cnquality goods! That was FAST!!!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LICK FOR HIGH RES! or LICK HERE FOR UBER HIGH RES!!!
> 
> Just for S&G I compared it to my new SC600MKii, and OMG does the SC600MKii ever look GREEN when side by side with the SRK (both are cool white). Makes me even more disappointed with the green and purple beam of the SC600MKii
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Exposure set so that the SRK beam is at 99% of the maximum possible exposure of the camera sensor. SC600MKii on Turbo, SRK on High.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LICK FOR HIGH RES! or LICK HERE FOR UBER HIGH RES!!!
> 
> Can’t wait till it’s dark out
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -Jamie M.



Pick on someone your own size not elephant vs a mouse :X


----------



## markr6

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*



toysareforboys said:


>



UUUgh meanie greenie!  I understand the lights are totally different in output, but tint vs. tint that SC600 is a bit of a let down for me.


----------



## toysareforboys

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*



holylight said:


> Pick on someone your own size not elephant vs a mouse :X


I wasn't comparing the brightness of course, just the beam quality and general tint  The SRK cost me half what the SC600MKii did, and it's got three times as many LED's! lol. I hoped ZL woulda picked a nicer one to put in the MKii 



markr6 said:


> UUUgh meanie greenie!  I understand the lights are totally different in output, but tint vs. tint that SC600 is a bit of a let down for me.


Because I had been using my SC600MKii almost exclusively since I received it, I hadn't really noticed how horrible the tint was. Baby poo green corona, light purple start of the spill  Now that I take any of my good lights (SC600w, custom 3xNichia 219 light, etc.) and compare the beam side by side with the MKii, 

-Jamie M.


----------



## shelm

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*

so far i didn't read many people expressly _praising _the tint of their SC600MkII. maybe we should run a poll on tint satisfaction regarding SC600 Mk ii and also SC52?


----------



## toysareforboys

holylight said:


> favorite lights saber 1a(aa), sc52(aa), v11r(aa), p25(18650). sc600 mk II(18650) - There is always light in the darkness


Why is the SRK not on your favourite lights list?

-Jamie M.


----------



## holylight

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*



shelm said:


> so far i didn't read many people expressly _praising _the tint of their SC600MkII. maybe we should run a poll on tint satisfaction regarding SC600 Mk ii and also SC52?


sc52 is nicer white tint


----------



## holylight

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*



toysareforboys said:


> I wasn't comparing the brightness of course, just the beam quality and general tint  The SRK cost me half what the SC600MKii did, and it's got three times as many LED's! lol. I hoped ZL woulda picked a nicer one to put in the MKii
> 
> 
> 
> -Jamie M.



Ok pal, I was reading too fast haha


----------



## holylight

toysareforboys said:


> Why is the SRK not on your favourite lights list?
> 
> -Jamie M.



I got it recently and not really tested it. But it will be on soon cause its worth every cent I spent minus the branded issue and after I think of a nice video link to go along with it


----------



## regulator

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*



holylight said:


> sc52 is nicer white tint



That is encouraging to hear. Where did you purchase yours?


----------



## Samy

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*

Ok, time to inform you of my SC600 which is not working properly.

First of all i love my Zebralight SC600. I purchased it from their website and it arrived in march 2012, 14 months ago. I carry it most nights in my pocket along with either a 4 Sevens Quark AA2 (purchased 2011) or a SunwayMan V10a (2012) which are faultless. I use my SC600 maybe every night or every other night for about 5-10 minutes and I get about 2-3 weeks from my AW 2600 or 3100 18650 batteries between charges so it doesn't get a lot of use but it gets fairly regular use. Never dropped or misused.

In the past 2 weeks the switch has been playing up. When i press it i can both hear and feel it click, but nothing happens. If something does happens it's usually a random activation of a mode not intended. I have discovered that if i press REALLY HARD when i click it i can usually get to the mode that i want. It's now becoming unreliable and i'm going to start carrying something else and leave the SC600 as an emergency or backup light. It's a real shame because it's a great light. I use my SC51 (purchased 2011) for about 10 mins each night as a bedside light and i usually read in bed with my H51 (purchased about the same time as the SC600) for an hour or so each night without dramas.

It's a real shame that 2 months out of warranty and it decides to play up. I have 2 other zebras so i'll wait a good while to see if they play up as well before i think about purchasing another Zebra.

Back to the good old reliable forward clicky tactical type lights for my EDC's...

Has anyone else had switch issues?

cheers


----------



## holylight

regulator said:


> That is encouraging to hear. Where did you purchase yours?



My friend, I got it from http://www.zebralight.com/


----------



## thedoc007

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*



Samy said:


> In the past 2 weeks the switch has been playing up. When i press it i can both hear and feel it click, but nothing happens. If something does happens it's usually a random activation of a mode not intended. I have discovered that if i press REALLY HARD when i click it i can usually get to the mode that i want. It's now becoming unreliable...and i'm going to start carrying something else and leave the SC600 as an emergency or backup light.



Your call, but I think the emergency backup light HAS to work every time. The whole point of having a backup is to know that it will work no matter what, even if everything else fails. I would talk to Zebralight (submit a question through their website) and see what they might do for you. Be sure to mention you are a member on CPF. They might be willing to at least meet you halfway, given that the warranty has expired recently.


----------



## Mr Floppy

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*

Speaking of tints, given that the H502w and SC52w are going to be using a neutral XM-L2, I wonder if we can expect the same in the SC600w mkII?


----------



## fnj

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*



Samy said:


> Ok, time to inform you of my SC600 which is not working properly.
> 
> First of all i love my Zebralight SC600. I purchased it from their website and it arrived in march 2012, 14 months ago. I carry it most nights in my pocket along with either a 4 Sevens Quark AA2 (purchased 2011) or a SunwayMan V10a (2012) which are faultless. I use my SC600 maybe every night or every other night for about 5-10 minutes and I get about 2-3 weeks from my AW 2600 or 3100 18650 batteries between charges so it doesn't get a lot of use but it gets fairly regular use. Never dropped or misused.
> 
> In the past 2 weeks the switch has been playing up. When i press it i can both hear and feel it click, but nothing happens. If something does happens it's usually a random activation of a mode not intended. I have discovered that if i press REALLY HARD when i click it i can usually get to the mode that i want. It's now becoming unreliable and i'm going to start carrying something else and leave the SC600 as an emergency or backup light. It's a real shame because it's a great light. I use my SC51 (purchased 2011) for about 10 mins each night as a bedside light and i usually read in bed with my H51 (purchased about the same time as the SC600) for an hour or so each night without dramas.
> 
> It's a real shame that 2 months out of warranty and it decides to play up. I have 2 other zebras so i'll wait a good while to see if they play up as well before i think about purchasing another Zebra.
> 
> Back to the good old reliable forward clicky tactical type lights for my EDC's...
> 
> Has anyone else had switch issues?
> 
> cheers



OK, since you ask, yes, mine has been liable to do this since I first received it. I reached the opposite resolution to yours vis-a-vis "blame". I assumed that I was "doing it wrong". And, lo, if I press very firmly and deliberately, it works fine. I can't say yours isn't more hinky than mine; it's your call what you can live with. Actually, if you want to know what I REALLY think, no mechanical switch is ever going to be really reliable. The only thing you can ever trust with your life is a twisty.


----------



## holylight

PocketBeam said:


> I don't think the green is that bad. Most of the time I don't notice.
> 
> As for the purple, I believe that is the anti-reflective coating.



Is not bad but the green is there. I see your other post you support zl a lot, but mk2 tint is indeed not very good.


----------



## stevieo

I recently bought sc600 mk ii and sc52. love both lights. very unique ui.

both lights have very similar beams, tint and color. both have a purple tint on the same corresponding coronas on white walls.

these are perfectly fine lights without any outdoor tint issues as far as I am concerned.


----------



## markr6

stevieo said:


> these are perfectly fine lights without any outdoor tint issues as far as I am concerned.



Then stay away from neutral tints or you'll start driving yourself crazy like I did!


----------



## Johnno

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*



fnj said:


> Actually, if you want to know what I REALLY think, no mechanical switch is ever going to be really reliable. The only thing you can ever trust with your life is a twisty.



A twisty is still a form of mechanical switch. Lots can go wrong - corrosion, a poor contact, a bad cell, etc. It's best not to trust one's life to any kind of switch, regardless of implementation or form. Carry back-ups and trust your life to the odds that they all won't fail at the same time... good odds them. 

I own a sc600, I still haven't convinced myself that I need a sc600 mk ii though. For those of you that don't own either and consider yourself a flashlight affectionado, this simply is a must have light, period.


----------



## noboneshotdog

I really don't find my MKII to be as green as some hear have described. I would describe mine more as a creamy white, not so blue as a typical cool white. Actually a pleasant color. Am I alone in my assessment or are most feeling that theirs are green? Maybe my eyes aren't picking up the green so much, but I'm pleased with my tint. I did read a post some pages back that someone had contacted Zebra to find out what led they were going to use. I recall them saying that the first batch were planning on using certain leds and than they would be using U3 leds. Wondering if this may be the reason some are complaining of green or not. Just a suggestion...no facts to back this last statement up.


----------



## noboneshotdog

noboneshotdog said:


> I really don't find my MKII to be as green as some hear have described. I would describe mine more as a creamy white, not so blue as a typical cool white. Actually a pleasant color. Am I alone in my assessment or are most feeling that theirs are green? Maybe my eyes aren't picking up the green so much, but I'm pleased with my tint. I did read a post some pages back that someone had contacted Zebra to find out what led they were going to use. I recall them saying that the first batch were planning on using certain leds and than they would be using U3 leds. Wondering if this may be the reason some are complaining of green or not. Just a suggestion...no facts to back this last statement up.



Just found the post I referred to its #648 of this thread. I guess they are ALL U3's but the first batch were 1D and more recent batches are 1C. This MAY be the discrepancy some are finding with their lights.


----------



## TEEJ

LOL

Just wait for the XM-L2 versions....


----------



## fnj

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*



Johnno said:


> A twisty is still a form of mechanical switch. Lots can go wrong - corrosion, a poor contact, a bad cell, etc. It's best not to trust one's life to any kind of switch, regardless of implementation or form. Carry back-ups and trust your life to the odds that they all won't fail at the same time... good odds them.



There is a very, very fundamental difference. A clicky is sealed up. If anything goes wrong in there you're SOL. You can't fix it. A twisty is "inside out". There is nothing sealed up. If anything goes wrong, you can always fix it or work around it. Your examples of corrosion and bad contact never happen suddenly, and never prevent function altogether. You can scrape corrosion with a penny or a rock, though I have NEVER had the occasion to need to do so. Even if the spring breaks or falls out (if there even is one), you can almost always still turn it on. Worst case, you can wad up some aluminum foil.

With a clicky, you're always rolling the dice that the next time you click it, it won't emit a hollow clunk and freeze up.

I would pick one twisty over two or even three clickies in the admittedly far fetched scenario that my life depended on having one working light for a long long stretch of time with no chance of going to get more clickies. In the end, just as you say, there is no substitute for redundancy, and when I leave the house, day or night, I do by habit have two twisties on my person 100% of the time. As well as two car keys 

But if I just pick up a light to use for some opportunistic purpose, I admit clickies are just really nice to use.


----------



## stevieo

markr6 said:


> Then stay away from neutral tints or you'll start driving yourself crazy like I did!



markr6, good to know. thanks for the insight. I usually stick with cool whites. cheers,


----------



## TEEJ

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*

There is a point of diminishing return. While a clicky, technically, CAN fail, other than el cheapo lights that use garbage parts, I don't SEE them failing...I could understand them doing it, its just that there's not that much to go wrong in there either.

And, if they did go bad, you can actually fix them, depending on the reason.

Depending upon the design, I could see being dropped/hit at the wrong angle hitting the switch in such a way as to damage it. Of course, that can affect a head as well as a tail, and can go for about any light.

Twisties are just simpler...you just need a ground path and you're good to go. That makes them more reliable. Of course, if the clicky only fails once in a million times, etc, the room for improvement is not that great.




That said, I have, in my pockets as we speak, two twisties and three clickies.


Why take chances.


----------



## fnj

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*

My Mk II FINALLY shipped! I will soon have something intelligent to say


----------



## Climb14er

Oztorchfreak said:


> I am still not sure about whether or not to get the SC600 MKII.
> I have the SC600 MK I version.
> The SC52 is doing such a great job as my EDC that I don't think I need it now.
> CHEERS



I have to agree! The MKI I've had for quite some time... works perfectly. The newer SC52 is a fantastic pocket EDC. I take the latter on long trips with a couple spare batteries.

Personally, I'll wait for a few more generations of the SC600 to come out.

I've got patience and a few fantastic lights in the house, truck, EDC, etc to last me quite some time.


----------



## WilsonCQB1911

If anyone is interested in more runtime data, since zebralight doesn't seem to have published any....

i used an AW 3400 protected cell that had been fully charged on my Pila charger a few months ago and had sat on a shelf until today. So it had likely come down a bit in capacity, but maybe not a whole lot.

I turned the light on with a single click and started my stopwatch. Light went into turbo for five minutes and then stepped down at exactly the five minute mark. It then continued to run for 2 hours 4 minutes until it stepped down again. My ZTS tester showed the battery to be under 10% of capacity.


----------



## moozooh

Sounds entirely consistent with ZL's measurements, good.


----------



## tonkem

Zebralight has added the runtimes for the Mkii on their website.


----------



## BirdofPrey

Thinking about squeezing the trigger on one of these. Anyone know who has the best price going? 

Was wanting the neutral version but currently running with my duty light as my edc and it's too bulky. 

Sent from my Transformer TF101 using Tapatalk HD


----------



## tonkem

BirdofPrey said:


> Thinking about squeezing the trigger on one of these. Anyone know who has the best price going?
> 
> Was wanting the neutral version but currently running with my duty light as my edc and it's too bulky.
> 
> Sent from my Transformer TF101 using Tapatalk HD



Fairly sure that www.e2fieldgear.com has the best price. Check in the cpfmarketplace in the dealer forum for a coupon code.


----------



## Johnnyt

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*



Johnnyt said:


> Received my new sc600 MKII and been playing with it for a couple days. I am still getting used to the interface as it is my first ZL and it is growing on me. However, for me, I wish they would have reversed the functionality of the long click vs the short click. Short clicking thru low med high or holding the click to go directly to high seems much more intuitive to me than than hold clicking for l-m-h. Also I have a hard time getting just the right timing down for low. Sometimes I hold down too long and it cycles to medium. Sometimes too short and it short clicks to high which is really bad if your need is the moonlight mode. However maybe it'll be old hat soon.
> 
> My biggest disappointment with my particular light is that I am wondering if I have a bit of a loser in what many refer to as the tint lottery. The hotspot of my light is not particularly cool in color so that was quite pleasing maybe a mix of cool-neutral. However in all but the brightest mode the ring right around the hotspot does seem to have some 'mountain dew'-ness to it. It is hard to explain really as the beam does not have rings per se. But to me at least the tint of the beam in general on low and medium is just not pleasing. If I can figure out how to post a pic I may try to see if I can capture something that better explains what my eyes (or mind?) is seeing.
> 
> For brevity I am skipping a lot I like about this light but just wanted to point out these couple of things. I do not regret the purchase but was expecting to really love the output of the beam more than I do so far.



Well it's been a couple more weeks of using the mkII and I still can't seem to shake my disappointment in the greenish tint on medium and low settings. Not much I can do about it but can say something I now do not think time and use will allow me to overlook. I got the light to replace my lost eagletac d25lc2 XML CW and do appreciate the flexibility of the interface as well as the true hidden strobe as opposed to the ET. However I went ahead and just ordered a XM-L2 LC2. I look forward to comparing the tints and brightness levels.

One point I would like feedback on though is the short click going to high instead of low. Does anyone else wish the short click went to low then med then high, and for click and hold to go directly to high? That would make SO much more sense to me. Plus I have been accidentally blinded (even indirectly) by this light many times from not getting the long click timing right to enter in low and I feel my suggested interface would eliminate that. Any thoughts from other owners?


----------



## Nicola

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*

I agree about D25LC2 XM-L2 has a nicer tint if you compare the beams on a white wall.
I like both torches. Overall, I like SC600 better. No problems with ZL UI.

Just my 2 cents.


----------



## kaichu dento

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*



Nicola said:


> I agree about D25LC2 XM-L2 has a nicer tint if you compare the beams on a white wall.


Do you find the reverse to be true on surfaces other than white walls then?


----------



## Derek Dean

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*



Johnnyt said:


> Well it's been a couple more weeks of using the mkII and I still can't seem to shake my disappointment in the greenish tint on medium and low settings. Not much I can do about it but can say something I now do not think time and use will allow me to overlook.


Tint is VERY important to me. I know CPF members that will buy 2 or 3 of the same light so that they pick the tint they like best and then sell the others. 

Other members will find a light with the features they want and then mod it with an LED that has the tint they like. 

I have that same type of obsession with tint, so I understand both of those options, however, I've found another approach that works even better for me, using inexpensive and easily available filters to get the tint very close to what's pleasing to MY eye. What's neat about this method is that it's quickly and easily reversible if you change your mind or want to sell the light. 

Honestly, when I first got my Zebralight SC600, I almost sent it back for a refund because the tint freaked me out. It was green in the center and purple around the edges, yuuck! However, after playing with my filter set for a while I was able to find a filter that gets the tint pretty darn close to neutral, and I'm so glad I did, because I really love the SC600 and have used it for my night job for the last year and half. 

Since then I've filtered ALL my lights and now they all have gorgeous tinted beams. Not only that, because I mainly use my Zebralight SC600 for closeup and medium range work I decided to add a light diffusing filter to even out the beam a bit more. This was easy because the filter pack comes with many different diffuser filters as well. 

Of course, the SC600 bezel unscrews, which makes it easy to put the filters inside, and I think the SC600 Mark II has a press on bezel, but I have many other lights with fixed bezels, and for those I just use a small piece of double sided tape to affix the plastic filter to the outside of the glass cover, and I've never had a problem with the filters getting scratched or coming off. 

If you're interested, check out this thread:
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?320811-Changing-LED-Tint-With-Filters

By the way, I've always had a bit of trouble consistently getting the SC600 to come on in low and have blinded myself more than once, but many other folks seem to not have any trouble at all. Anyway, don't let it bother you. What I do sometimes is just put my hand over the front until it comes on, and then switch it to low if I miss and hold it to long. The other option is to just leave the light ON, in the moonlight mode, all night, bezel down, and just pick it up to use it and put it back down bezel down when your finished. Because it uses so little power in that mode, you can do that every night and not worry about running down your battery. 

In any case, it's such a minor quibble for what I consider to be the best EDC light available, that I just can't fault it for that OR the tint (which is easily fixable). 

Enjoy your new light .


----------



## Nicola

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*



kaichu dento said:


> Do you find the reverse to be true on surfaces other than white walls then?



No. I just don't see any noticeable (to me) difference.


----------



## Cessquill

BirdofPrey said:


> Thinking about squeezing the trigger on one of these. Anyone know who has the best price going?
> 
> Was wanting the neutral version but currently running with my duty light as my edc and it's too bulky.
> 
> Sent from my Transformer TF101 using Tapatalk HD


Mine turned up this week from www.illuminationgear.com. Good price, good service and quick delivery (considering I'm not in the US).


----------



## regulator

Hi Cessquill. I got mine from them as well and fast service. They are great to deal with. I also purchased an Eagletac GX25A3 from them that I like a lot.


----------



## BirdofPrey

Think I'm going to order mine this weekend from illumination gear. E2 adds tax on and puts it out to me for $95 after SC600 discount code. 

Sent from my ridiculously large Galaxy Note 2.


----------



## Romo Lampkin's Cat

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*



Johnnyt said:


> Well it's been a couple more weeks of using the mkII and I still can't seem to shake my disappointment in the greenish tint on medium and low settings. Not much I can do about it but can say something I now do not think time and use will allow me to overlook.



Time has enabled me to learn how to ignore the puke green tint.



Johnnyt said:


> One point I would like feedback on though is the short click going to high instead of low. Does anyone else wish the short click went to low then med then high, and for click and hold to go directly to high? That would make SO much more sense to me. Plus I have been accidentally blinded (even indirectly) by this light many times from not getting the long click timing right to enter in low and I feel my suggested interface would eliminate that. Any thoughts from other owners?



I like that the shortest click goes to the last high setting because one of the uses for this light is defense in the dark. Shining this light in anybody's face at night is sure to give them grief, and I like that to be as simple as possible: hit the switch and BLAMMO!

Regarding the UI in general, it seems to be holy writ 'round these here parts that the Zebralight UI is pure heaven, the best. Perhaps I lack experience with other lights (I confess that I do) but if this UI is heaven then the others must be pure hell, because I'm not impressed. My biggest objection is that selection of low on startup is based on the length of time I hold the switch. It sounds simple but I suspect that a lot of us have trouble with this, and I would much prefer a dual-control interface like the on the SRT-7. But I'll gladly trade the single button interface, foibles notwithstanding, for the signifcantly smaller size of the SC600. Plus, the fit and finish on the SC600 are outstanding.

I practice with my light to ensure I am well-lubed. Am I complaining? No! "Practice" is fun because I get to play with the light, and isn't playing around with the light part of the joy of having the light? Besides, flashlights are like cars. There are some things I like; there are some things I don't care about; and there are some things which really bug me. On the whole, the SC600 Mk II thrills me and I'm glad I have it. If only my car were in the world of automobiles what my SC600 is in the world of flashlights.


----------



## Cessquill

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*

After having mine for a couple of days, a couple of my thoughts. And this is my first foray into the world of decent flashlights, so I think I struck lucky by accident...

My main choice for initially finding the SC600 (before the mkII was out) was it's size. It sounds shallow, but I wear a Scott-e-vest Fleece 7.0 jacket, wanted to carry around a flashlight and was looking for something that fitted in one of its pockets. I could have got an AA light, but I figured I'd look for the biggest small light I could find.

A lot of researching around this forum and a few noob questions later, and here I am with a MkII, three EagleTac 3400's and a Nitecore i4 Charger. And very happy.

The interface, although a bit bewildering at first, I got used to in an evening. Quick press for high, long press for low, all that stuff. I can see why some might not like it, but after a bit of practice it's second nature.

Build quality is great. There was a tiny scuff on mine, but I'm sure there will be many more. If anything it's good for me, since it means I haven't got the remorse of putting its first scratch on it. Built like a tank.

My only gripe is the lanyard ring; however, it's more the position of it rather than its presence. Personally I will use it with a lanyard (once I find a decent one) - I spent weeks looking for this light, months waiting for its release, a pretty penny buying it, and weeks waiting for its delivery - I'm going to strap it to my wrist. However, it sticks out right where my pinky finger sits. Right in the way. I'd personally put it on the opposite side, in line with the switch (I think). I don't want it on the base, since it's handy in vertical mode. All in all though, not a huge deal.

Being new to this, I'm quite pleased that I'm not affected by the discolouration. It looks great to me when I've used it on walks.

Anybody use a good lanyard with it, and are there any decent headbands that it'll fit?

And thanks for the time and patience in helping me get into this hobby. I've all ready got my eyes on an SC52 as a round-the-house light, and I know it won't stop there...


----------



## kaichu dento

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*



Cessquill said:


> My main choice for initially finding the SC600 (before the mkII was out) was it's size. It sounds shallow, but I wear a Scott-e-vest Fleece 7.0 jacket, wanted to carry around a flashlight and was looking for something that fitted in one of its pockets. I could have got an AA light, but I figured I'd look for the biggest small light I could find.


Nice mini-review and I think that choosing by size, particularly as large as you can carry without it getting in the way, is a great reason to help in choosing a light.

Maximum runtime goes up as battery capacity goes up and it's nice to see more acknowledgement of the fact that the UI is not that complicated when one takes the time to learn it.

Heck, it's no worse than learning to drive a manual transmission.


----------



## gteague

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*

just got mine in this afternoon. ordered from amazon. this is to hold me over until henry at hds gets his clicky production ramped up (hopefully this month) so that i can upgrade my hds from 140 to 200 lumens. i love those hds lights (i've carried one as my primary edc for the last 4 years) but they can't hold a candela (sorry!) to the new high tech lights from fenix, nitecore, and this zebralight which claims a jaw-dropping 900+ lumens and uses the 18650 instead of the 'puny' cr123 of the hds. i have my doubts about that zl600 lumens figure since i also have a nitecore ec25 at ?600+? lumens which blows it away side-by-side, but the zl600 is plenty for me coming from my 140 lumens hds.

anyway, one of my most used features of my hds, nitcore, and fenix lights is a momentary setting. in the best of my lights i can momentary low, momentary turbo, locked low, and locked turbo with just a simple sequence of button presses. i've only been playing with my new zebralight mkii for a few minutes, but i can't find a momentary mode at all. is it completely missing in action? that feature is pretty well required for a 'tactical' light.

my opinion so far is extremely favorable. despite using a battery with 3-4 times the capacity as my hds, it's only about 1/4" longer, just one ounce heavier, and has a side switch which i much prefer to a tail clicky. the hds lights, even with the flush button, will not tailstand unless you fuss about and equalize the pressure on the rubber diaphragm of the switch whereas the zebralight has an absolutely flat bottom. about the only thing the hds has over the zebralight (and most other lights) is the flexibility of the programming.

anyway, anyone have any tips on how to make up for the lack of momentary mode? or have i missed how to do it with this light?

thanks,

/guy


----------



## KITROBASKIN

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*

No momentary. I got used to it quickly because it is so good in so many ways. If you want the high setting just for a couple seconds click quick, then click to turn off, but not too quick in less you want to go from high to lowest. This is with an sc52 but should be the same. Practice all the functions, you never know what you might like. The battery status test is useful. There are sc52 videos that show the functions, probably sc600 mk2 videos out there too. Having a lot of light is nice.


----------



## Howiezowie

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*

Received my SC600 MkII today, fulfilled by Amazon, from seller named "TorchLight" (I wanted it soon, and liked that I could get this light in 2 days with Amazon Prime.) There has been some discussion about how batteries, especially protected types might fit, so I'm giving some detailed info in case it helps others.

 Battery fit observations and measurements:  

I only have Orbtronic protected 3400s, and happy to say that they do fit, although to remove one of them a gentle shake was required. This is because the diameter of the cell at the base is just a little wider, (I think due to the protection circuit installed back there, or just manufacturing tolerance differences.) The battery glides down all the way via gravity, but needs a _very gentle_ "push" (just barely more than a touch,) to get the final 3mm to seat into the tube. To remove, a gentle shake is needed to dislodge that 3mm, then the battery glides out by itself. The other battery glided in and out without issue. Doing the best I can, my inexpensive digital calipers measure the diameter of the battery tube opening as approximately 18.8mm, and the widest dimension across the of that Orbtronic battery base seems a hair _over _18.8 (but I don't trust the calipers much in the hundredths range too much.) Anyway, point is the batteries DO fit width-wise. Length-wise, my two batteries measure 68.8mm and 68.9mm respectively. (I imagine soldering technique etc. in manufacturing accounts for variation.) 

Once the battery is seated and resting on the positive terminal, (which is a *spring*,) the base of battery just barely sticks out (0.35mm) from end of the tube. The positive terminal spring seems to be able to depress 2.65mm. The spring in the tail cap, which measures about 11.8mm long, protrudes 2.6mm beyond the lip of the cap. The result of all of this, in the case of my Orbtronic batteries, is that the tail cap spring will be effectively/probably depressed to maximum with the tail cap screwed down. Whether this tight fit will have any negative consequences (no pun intended,) down the road, I do not know. Speaking of the tail cap, the light came with threads lubricated, and the screw action is extremely smooth and precise.

 LED tint and other observations:  

The tint of the XM-L "cool white" LED, unfortunately for my tastes, has the [expected] "green" emanating around from the edge of the hotspot. The hotspot, itself, seems a rather clean white. The green tinted ring dissipates further outward into the less bright floody area, which has a purple tint. The beam tints are quite similar to my SC52 (same cool white XM-L version), although the SC52 hotspot itself seems green whereas the SC600 hotspot is "whiter". Also, in highest output settings, my SC600 has a more pronounced purple outer flood area than the SC52. That purple tint on the outside of the beam tends to accentuate the "green" appearance of the inner flood area, as the two colors contrast somewhat. I have not yet viewed outdoors, which I expect to look less jarring than a white wall/ceiling, but the tint issue is definitely noticeable indoors. 

I barely notice the raised nub for the lanyard attachment ring, which others have complained about. I have large hands, which might account for the placement of that spot not bothering me much. The light is in all other respects as I expected, based on reviews and comments. Finish and quality appear excellent. Brightness modes work nicely, and as expected for Zebralight UI, although they do take some getting used to, especially the timing and duration of presses, as well documented in the forums. 

Lastly, following some others' observations of the sound of button presses: While both the SC600 II and SC52 buttons have a definite tactile "click" _sensation_, the SC600 actually has more of an audible "click" _sound_, whereas the SC52 _barely _makes a sound. At arm's length, pressing the SC52 button I can just make out the "click", but the SC600 "click" sound is a fair bit louder and more apparent. However, for comparison, it's still softer than traditional "clicky" buttons on other lights. Personally, the sound is not an issue for me.

Those are my impressions and observations. I hope they have some use to other readers.


----------



## gteague

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*

thanks for your impressions of this light. i ordered mine the exact same way. found out later i live only a mile or two from the distributer over in irving although the addresses for them i've seen on the forum differ from the one on the website.

anyway, i had purchased two AW 3400mah cells for a couple of nitecore lights i got recently and found out the flattop batteries would not work in those lights so i was delighted to be able to put these cells to use in the zebralight although, unlike your experience, i had to put a 'sleeve' of a cylinder of paper around the aw battery to keep it from rattling. i noticed a british gent on youtube had to do the same thing and i stole his method which works perfectly although, truthfully, the strength of the spring on each end of the cell would most likely keep it from much rattling.

i'm still trying to get familiar with the unfamiliar interface and sometimes having problems determining whether i'm on medium or low. i'm practicing trying to get it into high, med, or low from off. high and med are easy, but unless it's pitch dark i have to put a finger in front of the lens to see whether it came on in low.

this light is definitely in competition to take the place of the hds lights i've carried for years as my primary edc. the hds lights are much lower in output, use a cr123 vs 18650, and have a tailcap button vs the side button (which i much prefer), but they also have a 'momentary' mode, can be physically reconfigured (adding a larger battery compartment, for example), and the benefit of being supremely customizable with a little effort to learn the programming 'language' and jumping the hurdle of implementing it with only one button.

/guy


----------



## KITROBASKIN

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*



gteague said:


> ... unless it's pitch dark i have to put a finger in front of the lens to see whether it came on in low.
> 
> 
> /guy


Just to be sure, and for the benefit of those who are not familiar with the ZL user interface: the low, medium and high settings have two immediate options. Getting the other option requires a quick double click. If your low setting is on moonlight, you can change it to a brighter option.


----------



## gteague

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*

even the 'brightest' of the lows is virtually undetectable unless you're looking at the light from the front or it reflects off something or (it goes without saying, you're in a dark enough room. i have the same problem with the 3 lumen mode of the tm26--it would be all too easy to think the light is off given the right circumstances.

i haven't gotten to the programming modes yet. the instructions say you can configure the sublevels. does this mean you can set any level you want? or perhaps choose from the existing ones, like move a medium level into the low mode? i'm still poking around and experimenting. i think there's a youtube out there that concentrates on the ui, i'll have to go find that one again now that i have the light in hand.

[upd: answering a couple of my own questions. the programming mode is easy to understand and enter. simply turn the light on to whatever level you want to change the sub-level of (you can't change the main l/m/h levels) and then double-click 6 times. i couldn't tell if there was any indication or not, but after the 6 double-clicks you should notice that each double-click after that is cycling the light level in 3 steps. simply select one of the 3 levels and then single-click to off. the light level you just selected is now the sub-level of whatever mode (l/m/h) you were in when you entered programming mode. i can tell you that the lowest of the 3 sub-levels under the low level is about as little illumination as you can get. if you look directly into the reflecter it just looks like the led is barely glowing. still, in an ultra dark room it 'throws' a few feet and you can see it. i'd rate this programming feature as next-to-useless except for the fact you can set the high sub-level to strobe and you can set that low sub-level to a nearly undetectable, but still useful, setting. on my hds lights you have about 30 levels to work with for each channel and if you want your low level to be only a handful of lumens below your medium level it is trivially easy to do. or you can even swap the low channel for the medium channel if you want to change the sequence in which you access those modes.]

anyway, just came back from one of my nightly walks and the sc600 interface and pre-set levels work very well in my environment. subjectively, i think the highest mode is only about 300, perhaps 400 lumens tops. but my eyes are bad and i'm just guessing. it has good 'spillover' and the actual view is better than some of the lights i've owned over the years that cost much more than this one. although i wouldn't call the quality of the light 'cool white', i can't see a trace of the greens or purples some people are reporting, but then i'm not looking that hard for those flaws. i will say the tint works much better outdoors than indoors against a white wall where it does look ugly even without the green and purple hues.

as someone who works nights and carries a light every waking hour, the things that mean more to me are an easy to use interface, good weight and balance, a belt clip that hangs onto your belt, and the ability to survive the inevitable drops. this light feels very good in my hand with the control falling naturally right under the thumb and the weight is well balanced. only time will tell about the ruggedness and ability to shrug off the occasional drop or rainshower.

the engineers and designers actually put in the time on this light and made some wise choices as to specs and operation. i'll be more than happy to carry this as my edc light.

/guy


----------



## TEEJ

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*



gteague said:


> even the 'brightest' of the lows is virtually undetectable unless you're looking at the light from the front or it reflects off something or (it goes without saying, you're in a dark enough room. i have the same problem with the 3 lumen mode of the tm26--it would be all too easy to think the light is off given the right circumstances.
> 
> i haven't gotten to the programming modes yet. the instructions say you can configure the sublevels. does this mean you can set any level you want? or perhaps choose from the existing ones, like move a medium level into the low mode? i'm still poking around and experimenting. i think there's a youtube out there that concentrates on the ui, i'll have to go find that one again now that i have the light in hand.
> 
> [upd: answering a couple of my own questions. the programming mode is easy to understand and enter. simply turn the light on to whatever level you want to change the sub-level of (you can't change the main l/m/h levels) and then double-click 6 times. i couldn't tell if there was any indication or not, but after the 6 double-clicks you should notice that each double-click after that is cycling the light level in 3 steps. simply select one of the 3 levels and then single-click to off. the light level you just selected is now the sub-level of whatever mode (l/m/h) you were in when you entered programming mode. i can tell you that the lowest of the 3 sub-levels under the low level is about as little illumination as you can get. if you look directly into the reflecter it just looks like the led is barely glowing. still, in an ultra dark room it 'throws' a few feet and you can see it. i'd rate this programming feature as next-to-useless except for the fact you can set the high sub-level to strobe and you can set that low sub-level to a nearly undetectable, but still useful, setting. on my hds lights you have about 30 levels to work with for each channel and if you want your low level to be only a handful of lumens below your medium level it is trivially easy to do. or you can even swap the low channel for the medium channel if you want to change the sequence in which you access those modes.]
> 
> anyway, just came back from one of my nightly walks and the sc600 interface and pre-set levels work very well in my environment. *subjectively, i think the highest mode is only about 300, perhaps 400 lumens tops. but my eyes are bad and i'm just guessing. *it has good 'spillover' and the actual view is better than some of the lights i've owned over the years that cost much more than this one. although i wouldn't call the quality of the light 'cool white', i can't see a trace of the greens or purples some people are reporting, but then i'm not looking that hard for those flaws. i will say the tint works much better outdoors than indoors against a white wall where it does look ugly even without the green and purple hues.
> 
> as someone who works nights and carries a light every waking hour, the things that mean more to me are an easy to use interface, good weight and balance, a belt clip that hangs onto your belt, and the ability to survive the inevitable drops. this light feels very good in my hand with the control falling naturally right under the thumb and the weight is well balanced. only time will tell about the ruggedness and ability to shrug off the occasional drop or rainshower.
> 
> the engineers and designers actually put in the time on this light and made some wise choices as to specs and operation. i'll be more than happy to carry this as my edc light.
> 
> /guy




One factor when trying to judge the lumen output of a light that seems to stymie people is that you can't SEE lumens...so looking at a beam and trying to say how many of them are out there is very hard.

You CAN see lux though, which represents the lumens that hit something and bounced back to your eyes. A very concentrated beam puts most of its lumens in a small circle of light, so that the light from that small circle bounces back and is perceived as a small bright circle of light.

A floody beam takes its lumens and spreads them out over a large area, so the amount of lumens in any one area is less concentrated. This is perceived as a dimmer light over a larger surface area...IE: "Less Bright"


The reality is that it takes a LOT more lumens to paint a large surface area than it does to paint a small circle.

The output of the light though, due to the lower surface brightness, is perceived as lower, as the eye is not perceiving it as "Bright" an input from a hot spot, etc.


This is why I can show people a ~ 130 lumen thrower and a 1,000 lumen flooder, shine them both at something, and have them all describe the 130 L light as "Brighter". Its just how our eyes perceive brightness - If our pupils have to stop down, even if its due to a small patch of light we are looking at, we perceive it as "Bright".


If I shine the two above lights at an array of targets spread out in a fan pattern of various distance targets...the flood might light up 50 targets at one time, and the thrower might light up 2 of them, etc. - So, ask which light lets you SEE more, and the flooder wins, as it put out ~ 10x the light. 


So the bottom line is that for most TASKS, a floody beam is just going to light up more at a time, allowing you to see more naturally. A throwy beam is going to make you look at what's going on through a small field of view at a time, as if you had tunnel vision....but its concentrated lumens will look "Brighter".




People who "grew up with" or have "calibrated" their idea of what a "normal" beam of light looks like, typically are used to very concentrated beams, and all of the light being in a relatively small circle. This is most often due to the historical lack of lumens, so that TO see anything, you HAD TO concentrate what you did have.

This can lead to people making blanket statements such as "Its impossible to read with 100 lumens, its too bright" - Because with the beam angles that they are used to, all 100 lumens in a teeny circle put too much LUX on the page, and it glared, etc.

If they had a floody beam, that 100 L would be spread out over a large area, and not be too bright at all.

In fact, as many many people read by ordinary incan light bulbs, which might be putting out closer to 1,000 L than to 100 L, its fairly obvious that the "100 L is too much to read by" people don't even realize that the more you spread the lumens out, the less glare you'll have....as to them, THEIR 100 L was too bright to read with, etc, and, to them, that's their baseline for comparison.


----------



## gteague

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*

i finally got to compare the sc600mk2 with the nitecore ec25 and there's just no contest--the nitecore just blows the zebralight away. at least inside shining them against some slightly off-white walls at 10-30'. now granted, your comparison of the 'concentrated' vs 'floody' certainly applies in the case. the sc600 has slightly more 'spread' whereas the ec25 has most of it's light concentrated in a small circle. in other words, if you were looking at a flat wall and wanted to see into each corner the sc200 seems to work better. the ec25 is so bright in the center that even if it did throw more light in the corners your attention is so drawn to the blazing spot in the center that it's hard to tear your gaze away.

so i have to conclude (as a true flashaholic always will!) that there is plenty of room to justify keeping both. for tactical use the ec25 is the clear choice with its blinding, focused, concentrated center core of cool white light, its momentary modes in the interface, and far superior 'random' strobe. the sc600 is quite a bit warmer and there is more 'spread' of the light. for walking in the dark the sc600 would be much better as you might see the snake that is lurking outside of that concentrated circle of light from the ec25. the sc600 is also more belt friendly, being shorter and without the oversized head of the ec25. weight comparison with battery is 173g for the ec25 and 130g for the sc600mk2.

[later edit: tks @howiezowie for pointing out my brain disconnect. at least i was consistent in my mistake! i can only plead that i hadn't been up very long (i work overnights) and the caffeine hadn't properly kicked in yet.]

/guy


----------



## Howiezowie

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*

We have been talking about the SC600 MkII, not a SC200, (Which doesn't exist.) You may want to edit your post to correct the references. Cheers.


----------



## poonchasta

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*

I just got a sc600 mkii to replace my sc60 as EDC. The M1 mode on the sc600 mkii is rated at 90 lumens, but when I compare it to the M1 mode on the sc60 rated at 42 lumens they look almost the same. Has anyone else noticed this? Did they just put the wrong lumen rating on it?


----------



## TEEJ

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*



poonchasta said:


> I just got a sc600 mkii to replace my sc60 as EDC. The M1 mode on the sc600 mkii is rated at 90 lumens, but when I compare it to the M1 mode on the sc60 rated at 42 lumens they look almost the same. Has anyone else noticed this? Did they just put the wrong lumen rating on it?



You can't see lumens, so its not relevant. 

If you are comparing the size of the hot spots and perceiving the amount of glare that makes your pupils stop down as relative to brightness, you are comparing lux. If you take the same lumens and spread them out thinner, you have less lux, and it looks dimmer.

This is why humans are SO poor at comparing the out put of lights...we really can't SEE what it is we are LOOKING FOR.


----------



## melty

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*



TEEJ said:


> You can't see lumens, so its not relevant.
> 
> If you are comparing the size of the hot spots and perceiving the amount of glare that makes your pupils stop down as relative to brightness, you are comparing lux. If you take the same lumens and spread them out thinner, you have less lux, and it looks dimmer.
> 
> This is why humans are SO poor at comparing the out put of lights...we really can't SEE what it is we are LOOKING FOR.



Doing a ceiling bounce test is a pretty good way of approximating relative lumen output between two lights. You're still seeing lux, but it's cumulative lux created by indirect light, so the change in this lux number is going to be approximately the same as the change in lumens.

Even with the same hotspot, 90 lumens isn't going to appear all that much brighter than 42 lumens. With binning and manufacturing tolerances (regarding lumen ratings), plus Zebralight's history of ninja LED upgrades, there's no way to know what the actual output of a light is without individually measuring it.


----------



## TEEJ

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*



melty said:


> Doing a ceiling bounce test is a pretty good way of approximating relative lumen output between two lights. You're still seeing lux, but it's cumulative lux created by indirect light, so the change in this lux number is going to be approximately the same as the change in lumens.
> 
> Even with the same hotspot, 90 lumens isn't going to appear all that much brighter than 42 lumens. With binning and manufacturing tolerances (regarding lumen ratings), plus Zebralight's history of ninja LED upgrades, there's no way to know what the actual output of a light is without individually measuring it.



True, but we suck at lux too.



What I have found is that if I shine two lights at a wall, one has to be a lot brighter to tell, especially if the beam angles and proportions of hotspot to corona to spill are different....there's too many variables.

But, if I set up a series of targets in a fan shaped pattern with various distances, so that the full beam width and depth are illuminating targets, the one with even slightly more lumens will light up more total targets.


So, in real life, say if you are searching outside, or in a warehouse, etc, and you can see more of what's out there at a time, those extra lumens can actually make a difference.

If you are hunting white walls, or just want it to LOOK brighter...it has to be a lot brighter to notice.


Same on a bounce test.

The throwier lights will be bouncing back down from a more centralized spot, and the floodier lights will be bouncing down from a less centralized spot.

As most people bounce test with a meter right under the light aimed up at the ceiling, this will tend to favor throwier lights (Tighter focused beams).

I've seen light meters with bounce tests vary results for the same light by simply having some clothes hanging on something or not, the kitchen sink being full or empty, or different stuff laying on the kitchen table, and so forth.


So, if I compare a Mk1 to a MkII, I can tell the difference in targets lit up, and with a light meter, but, if I am only seeing the beam of ONE of them, with a new scene I have not shot before, without a chance to COMPARE the beams, I would have a hard time guessing which light the beam came from....I'd need a reference point to compare to have a shot at that.

That means I could buy a new one, and randomly turn it on, and not be able to tell it from the old one. It doesn't mean it wasn't worth it per se, because I'd see more STUFF with the new one, I just wouldn't know it unless I had reference points.



It might be like comparing two runners w/o stop watches.

John and Fred are both fast, but John does the mile in 3:50, and Fred does it in 4:20.

Without a stop watch, or seeing them side by side, or against other racers, you'd be hard pressed to say who was faster if you saw John run it at one track in January, and Fred run it on a different track in July.


John and Fred are out camping, and are charged by an enraged and famished Grizzly Bear coming at them from 100 yards away. They turn and run the other way as fast as they can. Would you rather be John, or Fred?


You could not tell the difference, but, it might matter anyway.


----------



## gteague

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*



TEEJ said:


> <del>
> If you are hunting white walls, or just want it to LOOK brighter...*it has to be a lot brighter to notice*.
> <del>



given the criteria--brightest setting, same batteries same voltage, white(ish) walls, 10-30'--yes the (or at least, my) ec25 is definitely a *_lot_* brighter than my sc600mk2, no contest.

at 15-20' and with the beam pointed at a 90º angle straight into the wall, the reflection from the ec25 actually hurts your eyes whereas the sc600mk2 allows you to see the entire wall surface without any strain. if you shine both lights at the same place it is nearly impossible to tell that the sc600mk2 is even on.

/guy


----------



## TEEJ

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*



gteague said:


> given the criteria--brightest setting, same batteries same voltage, white(ish) walls, 10-30'--yes the (or at least, my) ec25 is definitely a *_lot_* brighter than my sc600mk2, no contest.
> 
> at 15-20' and with the beam pointed at a 90º angle straight into the wall, the reflection from the ec25 actually hurts your eyes whereas the sc600mk2 allows you to see the entire wall surface without any strain. if you shine both lights at the same place it is nearly impossible to tell that the sc600mk2 is even on.
> 
> /guy



Correct, the tighter beam angle is perceived a being the brighter light.

I do the same demonstration with the SC600 and a 131 lumen maglight.

I shine them both at a wall, and everyone says the maglight is a lot brighter....as its 131 lumens are more concentrated.


I can flip that too, a 1,500 lumen mule against the 900 L SC600, and the SC600 is "brighter"


Essentially, if you have a tighter beam, it can look brighter...even if it has 1/10 the lumens of the floody light, and so forth.


Even the PROPORTION of hot spot to corona to spill makes a difference. If more of the lumens are in the hot spot, the light looks brighter at close range...as the eyes/brain add the size of the corona to it to boot. Spill is typically not counted in brightness, as its dim by comparison.

So a light with 90% of its 1,000 lumens in the corona/hotspot and 10% spill is essentially giving you a perceived 900 L hotspot/brightness impression.

If another light has 60% of its light in the corona/hotspot, and 40% spill, its essentially giving you a 600 L impression, and so forth.


----------



## gteague

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*

yep. and for that reason my conclusion in the earlier post still stands. the ec25 seems to make a much better tactical light whereas the sc600 would seem to have many advantages as a 'walking around actually wanting to see things more general purpose' light. and, unlike the ec25 it has some very useful low modes--the ec25 is seriously deficient in that regards as a tactical light needs a red option or a map reading mode. 

at any rate, i am very glad that i have both of them.

/guy


----------



## TEEJ

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*

Its why I have both too.


----------



## koubilaihan

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*

Just received mine. What a great little light this is. As soon as I practice and learn the way to always start it in low mode, I can easily see it replacing my HDS (140 lm) as my EDC light. I am planning to keep my HDS in the bed stand in order to check the kids at night, walk around the house etc.
I can't wait for night to come to take it for a walk.


----------



## ledmitter_nli

holylight said:


> 2 cons for mk2, is it only me or anyone share the same.
> 
> The beam of mk2 next to the hot spot is abit to yellow. Compare to p25 which is whiter.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> mk2
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> p25
> 
> 
> I don't have sc600 but I do have sc52 and found out when clicking the button there is click sound in mk2 compare to silence click in sc52.



They must be using an awful BIN.

For instance, for my custom dropin I chose specifically the rather overlooked 3C BIN:






This is what it looks like. There's a hint of a rose-magenta at the edges and a gentle neutral off-white in the middle. Somewhat like the Nichia 219.






No way am I buying a light unless I see beams or I know exactly what BIN is being used.


----------



## Romo Lampkin's Cat

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*



gteague said:


> even the 'brightest' of the lows is virtually undetectable unless you're looking at the light from the front or it reflects off something or (it goes without saying, you're in a dark enough room. i have the same problem with the 3 lumen mode of the tm26--it would be all too easy to think the light is off given the right circumstances.



I think this should be clarified for people considering the SC600 MkII. How "detectable" a light is depends entirely on the surrounding light and any surface off of which the flashlight's beam is reflecting. I've got an SC600 MkII in my pocket right now, sitting in my office chair in a room whose lighting level is normal for a commercial building. The brightest low setting's detectabiility is moot; I don't need a flashlight to illuminate objects that are already so brightly lit.

However, the "brightest" low mode is easily detectable in a dim room. I watch television on a projector in my basement, and the lights are off because the dimmer the room, the better the picture looks. Even with the projector on , the "brightest" low setting is detectable and after the PJ is turned off, the highest low setting quite bright indeed and I can easily see objects across the room. This is in a house that is never completely dark and with eyes that aren't truly night-adjusted. If I'm in my bedroom with night-adjusted eyes, the "brightest" low setting looks positively blazing, so much so that I usually switch to the secondary low mode that I've programmed. (I prefer the lowest setting.)

Whether the setting is useful (quite a different matter from detectable) is pure personal preference.

Accidently leaving the light on in the lowest setting falls nicely into the "of no consequence" bucket, since it is rated to run about 200 days on that setting. Accidentally leaving the light on turbo while inside your pocket, well, you'll know about that well before the five-minute stepdown occurs. Ask me how I know...

I was at the Outer Banks last week. One night I and my three youngs sons went looking for crabs. The SC600 Mk II is great fun in those circumstances. I don't doubt there are actually 900 lumens pouring out of it in turbo mode and even though it's not a thrower, you can see a loooooong way with this rascal, even at one of the lower "high" settings. The crabs stood no chance and even with the floody nature of this light I could still paint buildings several hundred feet away. It's so bright that I was careful not to shine it into the eyes of anybody who was walking toward us or who was sitting on the sand in the dark.


----------



## crazyk4952

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*



Romo Lampkin's Cat said:


> Accidentally leaving the light on turbo while inside your pocket, well, you'll know about that well before the five-minute stepdown occurs. Ask me how I know...



Sounds like there is an interesting story there...


----------



## KITROBASKIN

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*

And just to clarify, in case Zebralight leadership is looking at these posts: Many, many of us LOVE THE LOW AND VERY LOW SETTINGS. This adds versatility to very bright lights. No longer must I carry a Photon Freedom or ReX Photon squeeze light when roving about with a Zebralight in hand, in order to have illumination suitable for navigation with night adapted eyes.

For those who can't see the lowest setting without looking into the beam, go to bed with your torch on the lowest low and maybe an hour later, open your eyes, get up and walk around inside a dark room. You will find it gives a nice amount of light that doesn't hurt the eyes. It is also a way to find your light if you need to set it down in the dark. As has been said, the energy use is minimal. Just keep the primary setting for low on the brightest, to help you see when it needs to be turned off, and... remember to turn off your light. Hopefully, many of you would agree? Other opinions?


----------



## Nicola

+1

I agree.


----------



## Brown3ulie

They have not been released yet. You can check Zebralights website, as it is normally accurate....


----------



## kaichu dento

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*



Romo Lampkin's Cat said:


> I think this should be clarified for people considering the SC600 MkII. How "detectable" a light is depends entirely on the surrounding light and any surface off of which the flashlight's beam is reflecting. I've got an SC600 MkII in my pocket right now, sitting in my office chair in a room whose lighting level is normal for a commercial building. The brightest low setting's detectabiility is moot; I don't need a flashlight to illuminate objects that are already so brightly lit.
> 
> However, the "brightest" low mode is easily detectable in a dim room. I watch television on a projector in my basement, and the lights are off because the dimmer the room, the better the picture looks. Even with the projector on , the "brightest" low setting is detectable and after the PJ is turned off, the highest low setting quite bright indeed and I can easily see objects across the room. This is in a house that is never completely dark and with eyes that aren't truly night-adjusted. If I'm in my bedroom with night-adjusted eyes, the "brightest" low setting looks positively blazing, so much so that I usually switch to the secondary low mode that I've programmed. (I prefer the lowest setting.)
> 
> Whether the setting is useful (quite a different matter from detectable) is pure personal preference.
> 
> Accidently leaving the light on in the lowest setting falls nicely into the "of no consequence" bucket, since it is rated to run about 200 days on that setting. Accidentally leaving the light on turbo while inside your pocket, well, you'll know about that well before the five-minute stepdown occurs. Ask me how I know...
> 
> I was at the Outer Banks last week. One night I and my three youngs sons went looking for crabs. The SC600 Mk II is great fun in those circumstances. I don't doubt there are actually 900 lumens pouring out of it in turbo mode and even though it's not a thrower, you can see a loooooong way with this rascal, even at one of the lower "high" settings. The crabs stood no chance and even with the floody nature of this light I could still paint buildings several hundred feet away. It's so bright that I was careful not to shine it into the eyes of anybody who was walking toward us or who was sitting on the sand in the dark.


Really nice post here and worth a thorough read for everyone.


----------



## ergotelis

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII interface and tint observations*

Bought a sc600 mk2, but had a terrible accident....!!!!!


----------



## sticktodrum

ergotelis said:


> Bought a sc600 mk2, but had a terrible accident....!!!!!



Well then...what happened?

Sent from my Nexus 10 using Tapatalk HD


----------



## ergotelis

I will tell you when i have news...Zebra made everything possible to make room and make modders' life difficult!


----------



## Overclocker

ergotelis said:


> I will tell you when i have news...Zebra made everything possible to make room and make modders' life difficult!



MCPCB with other components on it


----------



## ergotelis

Just completed the most difficult mod i have ever done.(swapped a xm-l2 u2 led). Took me 4 hours. By every mean, i DO NOT suggest to do it unless you are a very experienced modder.

Light is not working after the mod, even though i did my best, but i found the mistake.....:


I put the led the opposite!!!!Please somebody shoot me!!!!!:drunk:


----------



## Overclocker

ergotelis said:


> Just completed the most difficult mod i have ever done.(swapped a xm-l2 u2 led). Took me 4 hours. By every mean, i DO NOT suggest to do it unless you are a very experienced modder.
> 
> Light is not working after the mod, even though i did my best, but i found the mistake.....:
> 
> 
> I put the led the opposite!!!!Please somebody shoot me!!!!!:drunk:





hahahaha! the other day i was reflowing i actually had to bring out the PDF just to make sure. the dot is the negative 

so you took out the MCPCB? stupid question: no components under the MCPCB?

btw you really didn't have to break the glass  PM me for more info. zebra will kill me if i told everyone how to do it


----------



## toysareforboys

Overclocker said:


> hahahaha! the other day i was reflowing i actually had to bring out the PDF just to make sure. the dot is the negative


Do you swap the LED for one with a better tint? This green/purple from my MKII is enough to make me puke 

Do you get more output from a LED swap too? Why not use U3?

<- flashlight noob.

-Jamie M.


----------



## Overclocker

toysareforboys said:


> Do you swap the LED for one with a better tint? This green/purple from my MKII is enough to make me puke
> 
> Do you get more output from a LED swap too? Why not use U3?
> 
> <- flashlight noob.
> 
> -Jamie M.



we'd have to wait for ergotelis. i wasn't brave enough to mod it. i chickened out when i saw that integrated mcpcb driver board


----------



## toysareforboys

Overclocker said:


> we'd have to wait for ergotelis. i wasn't brave enough to mod it. i chickened out when i saw that integrated mcpcb driver board


hahaha. ok 

If he does it and is successful, are you gonna do it?!?

-Jamie M.


----------



## Overclocker

toysareforboys said:


> hahaha. ok
> 
> If he does it and is successful, are you gonna do it?!?
> 
> -Jamie M.



yep definitely! let's wait for him to post the pix. i just knew if there was someone who could mod it it would have to be ergotelis


----------



## ergotelis

I will continue my effort tomorrow. 
Overclocker, I think I found another way too to remove the glass without breaking it, it was too fun!!!the other details via pm  
I didn't remove the mpcb, but I removed the switch and every plastic part the flashlight has.
the mod seems to be successful.I used 2 different soldering irons and an air heat gun
more to come tomorrow!!!


----------



## juplin

ergotelis said:


> Overclocker, I think I found another way too to remove the glass without breaking it, it was too fun!!!the other details via pm


Let me guess. hot-melt adhesive ? :naughty:


----------



## BWX

What's with the PM BS? Who cares what ZL thinks?


----------



## Bronco

toysareforboys said:


> This green/purple from my MKII is enough to make me puke



When oh when is ZL going to announce availability of the SC600W MkII?????


----------



## Nicola

About the tint:

I bought a Fenix E15 (XP-E), so I wanted to compare its beam to my pocket rocket SC600MkII 
(just for understand the differences in brightness, spot, spill, flood, etc...).

Well, it happened the E15 tint made the SC600MkII ashamed.

Anyway, after the comparison was ended, the SC600MkII was back to its proud status of pocket rocket and the its tint "was back to" ok. 

Conclusion: SC600MkII is a wonderful torch and its tint is "ok", but it's better not to use it for tint comparison with anything.


----------



## trgrhppy

I just received my SC600 MK11 today. I had looked at size comparison photos, but it is still smaller than I had anticipated! So much light from a small package!
Tint is acceptable, and an AW 2900 mAh battery fits nicely. Finish is good, and the pocket clip seems to work as was intended.
I am happy with it!


----------



## Nicola

I have to tell you this story:

I had dinner with some friends, we were at a restaurant under one of those big outdoor umbrellas used to keep you from moisture in a summer night.

I was showing the SC600 to my friend, he wanted to see "how much light can come out from that thing", so I pointed it from the table to the umbrella and pulled the trigger.

Suddenly a loud voice coming from another table: "Naaaah, that's incredible!" LOL!

I don't know who it was, but he was surely impressed! 

It was really funny.


----------



## toysareforboys

Nicola said:


> I have to tell you this story:
> 
> I had dinner with some friends, we were at a restaurant under one of those big outdoor umbrellas used to keep you from moisture in a summer night.
> 
> I was showing the SC600 to my friend, he wanted to see "how much light can come out from that thing", so I pointed it from the table to the umbrella and pulled the trigger.
> 
> Suddenly a loud voice coming from another table: "Naaaah, that's incredible!" LOL!
> 
> I don't know who it was, but he was surely impressed!
> 
> It was really funny.


Awesome story 

When people haven't seen any of these new high power LED lights they are truly blown away. I showed one of my friends and his dad said "pffft, I got one that's brighter". Lugs out this massive flashlight, battery out of a CAR attached to it. Fires it up, lol! MKii blew it away in both throw and brightness 

-Jamie M.


----------



## Stefano

Sorry for my bad English
I was thinking to buy Zebra SC600 MKII, do you think this model is "stable" or there might be some updates or upgrades in the near future? (update in the immediate future)
I would not buy and then find out that after a series improved.
Thanks

(Translated with Google translator)


----------



## sticktodrum

Stefano said:


> Sorry for my bad English
> I was thinking to buy Zebra SC600 MKII, do you think this model is "stable" or there might be some updates or upgrades in the near future? (update in the immediate future)
> I would not buy and then find out that after a series improved.
> Thanks
> 
> (Translated with Google translator)



I'm sure it's stable. The SC600 MkII is newly released.

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 4 Beta


----------



## ArcticHighlander

Bronco said:


> When oh when is ZL going to announce availability of the SC600W MkII?????


I emailed Zebralight about this a week or more back and just received a response that they plan to release it in the next few months. Since I was told by an excellent vendor of theirs a few days ago that it was supposed to have been released 6 months ago and he had still been given no availability date, you can take it for whatever its worth.


----------



## Cessquill

ArcticHighlander said:


> I emailed Zebralight about this a week or more back and just received a response that they plan to release it in the next few months. Since I was told by an excellent vendor of theirs a few days ago that it was supposed to have been released 6 months ago and he had still been given no availability date, you can take it for whatever its worth.


Well, they said in December that the SC600 MKII would be released in January (announcement still on their website). It finally started appearing in early April. Whilst I've no doubt that a "w" version will appear, I haven't seen anything official on their site. If their CS is telling you, then great - it's happening.


----------



## Stefano

sticktodrum said:


> I'm sure it's stable. The SC600 MkII is newly released.
> 
> Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 4 Beta



Thanks for the reply.
I could not find information on LEDs, first or second generation?
I'm afraid that the first generation and it can get out an update soon XM-L2..


----------



## pjandyho

For you SC600 and SC600 II owners, I just put up a holster by Thors Hammer for sale in CPFMP. Only one for sale.

http://www.cpfmarketplace.com/mp/sh...m-Eagletac-Thor-s-Hammer-Holster-for-ZL-SC600


----------



## toysareforboys

pjandyho said:


> For you SC600 and SC600 II owners, I just put up a holster by Thors Hammer for sale in CPFMP. Only one for sale.
> 
> http://www.cpfmarketplace.com/mp/sh...m-Eagletac-Thor-s-Hammer-Holster-for-ZL-SC600


Wow, that is purrrdy! And with a spare battery holder too, nice.

-Jamie M.


----------



## magnum70383

This is bad....... cuz I want one! I just bought the S6330 a while ago.........


----------



## magnum70383

Annnnnnnnd, I gave up, I just bought one.........


----------



## Stefano

sticktodrum said:


> I'm sure it's stable. The SC600 MkII is newly released.



I sent email to zebralight, I asked what LED uses the new SC600, respond that uses XM-L.
My fear coming out soon new SC600 version with XM-L2.
I ordered a torch SC600MKII yesterday :-(
Do you think that this is a real possibility?

(Translated with Google translator)


----------



## toysareforboys

Stefano said:


> I sent email to zebralight, I asked what LED uses the new SC600, respond that uses XM-L.
> My fear coming out soon new SC600 version with XM-L2.
> I ordered a torch SC600MKII yesterday :-(
> Do you think that this is a real possibility?


You can get the LED changed to XM-L2 if you want now (voids your warranty).

-Jamie M.


----------



## Stefano

toysareforboys said:


> You can get the LED changed to XM-L2 if you want now (voids your warranty).
> 
> -Jamie M.



No I do not want to do modding 
I have a flashlight in order, I do not know whether to cancel and wait a little longer.
If in a month or two SC600 comes with upgrade XM-L2 would be a disaster..

(Translated with Google translator)


----------



## BobK

Stefano said:


> No I do not want to do modding
> I have a flashlight in order, I do not know whether to cancel and wait a little longer.
> If in a month or two SC600 comes with upgrade XM-L2 would be a disaster..
> 
> (Translated with Google translator)



Stefano, I would not worry too much about it. I have both the second version of the SC600 and the SC600mkII and setting aside the beam profile differences, there is little increase in light overall with the mkII. It is detectable, yes, but only just. I do not think that the change to an XM-L2 would translate into that much more light overall, certainly not enough to be declared a disaster.

Besides, the light is so nifty that you surely will wish you had an additional one (or more.) If and when the upgrade finally comes out you will have a valid excuse to purchase a second (or third) one at that time.


----------



## Stefano

BobK said:


> Stefano, I would not worry too much about it. I have both the second version of the SC600 and the SC600mkII and setting aside the beam profile differences, there is little increase in light overall with the mkII. It is detectable, yes, but only just. I do not think that the change to an XM-L2 would translate into that much more light overall, certainly not enough to be declared a disaster.
> 
> Besides, the light is so nifty that you surely will wish you had an additional one (or more.) If and when the upgrade finally comes out you will have a valid excuse to purchase a second (or third) one at that time.







Many thanks for your opinion.
I have 6 Zebra Headlamp, this is my first Zebra hand_torch I hope to have the same satisfaction I had with the others.


----------



## Stefano

Stefano said:


> Many thanks for your opinion.
> I have 6 Zebra Headlamp, this is my first Zebra hand_torch I hope to have the same satisfaction I had with the others.



I finally bought the Zebralight SC600 
I made a little review is made of Italian but there are some photos that may be of interest.

Link:
http://www.cpfitaliaforum.it/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=22&t=5795&p=87405#p87405

Link (short) http://goo.gl/dSpJK


----------



## Swede74

Stefano said:


> I finally bought the Zebralight SC600
> I made a little review is made of Italian but there are some photos that may be of interest.
> 
> Link:
> http://www.cpfitaliaforum.it/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=22&t=5795&p=87405#p87405
> 
> Link (short) http://goo.gl/dSpJK



I just read your review on the Italian forum (I used Google Translate). Thank you, I think the throw (or, "pull", as Google Translate seem to want to call it) shows up very well in the second set of beamshots (the ones with the carport to the right). You work fast, by the way, it didn't take you long to get all those photos up


----------



## Stefano

Swede74 said:


> I just read your review on the Italian forum (I used Google Translate). Thank you, I think the throw (or, "pull", as Google Translate seem to want to call it) shows up very well in the second set of beamshots (the ones with the carport to the right). You work fast, by the way, it didn't take you long to get all those photos up



Thanks Swede74
I tried to do my best, unfortunately the external photographs are of poor quality because I only have a Coolpix L25.
But I think I've given a small panorama of this Zebra, I love this brand !
SC600 MKII is my seventh Zebralight flashlight.

(Translated with Google translator)


----------



## Nicola

Swede74 said:


> ... I think the throw (or, "pull", as Google Translate seem to want to call it) ...



Unfortunately italian word "tiro" from verb "tirare" has two meanings. One is "to pull", the other is "to throw" and Google seems to be unable to choose the correct one... 

Bravo Stefano!


----------



## gteague

let's hope no one uses google translate when someone needs a life vest 'thrown' to them! [g]

many years ago while living outside possuoli (pozzuoli?) i went to the local gas station needing a container of propane. unfortunately the words for 'propane cylinder' and 'blow-up sex toy doll' sound nearly exactly alike. bombola/bombala (?) but i was glad i could afford the gas station crew a good laugh!

/guy (aka guido [but not _*a*_ guido!]... who loved napoli but not the brigate rosse who, in 1978, left aldo moro's body inside a station wagon only kilometers from his rented house on the grounds of the castle at lago di patria)


----------



## Likebright

I received mine yesterday. Really fine light. I am prone to cool white lights for my EDCs and this is a good one with out the green tint I see in a lot of The U2 LEDs.
The first thing I did was pay a visit to my grinding wheel and grind off that goofy lanyard protrusion jetting out from the tube. 
This thing gets hot if left in Turbo much more than a minute. The interface of brightness settings is as it is with other Zebra Light pretty intuitive. It does seem to get confused and hang up between high power and low sometimes but it may be something I am doing. 
For the size of the package and the weight this takes EDC to a new level. 
Glad I have one. 



Mike


----------



## sticktodrum

Fantastic photo.


----------



## GunnarGG

Yes, great photo!

It would be interesting to see what it looks like where you ground off the lanyard attachment point.


----------



## toysareforboys

GunnarGG said:


> It would be interesting to see what it looks like where you ground off the lanyard attachment point.


That thing annoys the hell out of me  Little gremlins always like to line up the pocket clip with the lanyard attachment and damn if I can ever get it back on my pocket! 

-Jamie M.


----------



## Likebright

GunnarGG said:


> Yes, great photo!
> 
> It would be interesting to see what it looks like where you ground off the lanyard attachment point.


It isn't pretty but it sure is gone. It is covered up when I put the cup on so I can hold the light in my mouth.
I call this mouth mode and the tail cup is mostly always on there when I cary it so I don't chip up my purely whites when holding the thing in my mouth as I do some times.


----------



## Badbeams3

Likebright said:


> It isn't pretty but it sure is gone. It is covered up when I put the cup on so I can hold the light in my mouth.
> I call this mouth mode and the tail cup is mostly always on there when I cary it so I don't chip up my purely whites when holding the thing in my mouth as I do some times.



Nice photo work in your two pic`s...


----------



## GunnarGG

Good work.
I feel very hesitant to do things like this that destroys the finish on a new or new looking light (or whatever thing it is).
But if it's just in the way and it's a user light it's the right thing to do.

I did grind of the crenelations on my E2DL and I didn't feel very well doing it but now I actually bring the light with me sometimes in my pocket, before that it was a shelf queen.
So I figure it was an improvement.


----------



## thedoc007

toysareforboys said:


> That thing annoys the hell out of me  Little gremlins always like to line up the pocket clip with the lanyard attachment and damn if I can ever get it back on my pocket!



I did it for a different reason (clip was just too likely to fall off) but my solution might work for you. I super-glued the clip to my light, now it stays on, and stays oriented exactly the same way all the time. I see no reason to ever take it off, so why not just make them one piece?


----------



## toysareforboys

thedoc007 said:


> I did it for a different reason (clip was just too likely to fall off) but my solution might work for you. I super-glued the clip to my light, now it stays on, and stays oriented exactly the same way all the time. I see no reason to ever take it off, so why not just make them one piece?


Ah ha, nice  Great thinking. I might try and bend the clip or something to make it grip my pocket tighter, it's fallen out three times, including once into the toilet  So once I get it gripping better I'll try out your superglue idea 

-Jamie M.


----------



## gteague

i've had no trouble with my sc600 as of yet. but i have a nitecore ec25 and that clip springs off at a bad glance. it might well get the superglue treatment.

/guy


----------



## Likebright

I have since found that when I put the clip on it hides where I've filled of the lanyard ring pretty good. 
I use the clip about a forth of the time when I carry in my cargo pants. 
You have to pinch the clip loop occasionally to get the thing not to slide around the light. But I have never had it come off. 
Mike


----------



## stevieo

i dremel off everything that bothers me & i do not care about looks. but the sc600 mk 2 lanyard ring is not an issue for me. I like it. the clip could be better but does not bother me either. the foto of the lightbright's dremeled off lanyard ring looks perfectly fine to me. i use Tec P7 clips with lobster claws or split rings & paracord. nice work lightbright!! looks good to me.


----------



## Likebright

Thanks stevieo & everybody.
This light fits nicely next to my wallet in my jeans and and tighter fitting pants. I clip it into the pockets on my cargo pants.
Makes a good, powerful EDC!

Mike


----------



## 3Cylinders

Any word on ETA for the warm version of the SC600 MkII? I'm definitely on board for that one.


----------



## ArcticHighlander

3Cylinders said:


> Any word on ETA for the warm version of the SC600 MkII? I'm definitely on board for that one.


On July 9th they emailed me: Department: Sales
Subject: SC600w MKII
We plan to release the SC600w MK II in the next few months. 
Sincerely,
Lillian Xu
ZebraLight, Inc.
2908 Story Rd. W
Irving, TX 75038 However, it was supposed to be release last December, so who knows? Anyone know how to insert a line break? Can't find it even on advanced. "Enter" does nothing.


----------



## TEEJ

ArcticHighlander said:


> On July 9th they emailed me: Department: Sales
> Subject: SC600w MKII
> We plan to release the SC600w MK II in the next few months.
> Sincerely,
> Lillian Xu
> ZebraLight, Inc.
> 2908 Story Rd. W
> Irving, TX 75038 However, it was supposed to be release last December, so who knows? Anyone know how to insert a line break? Can't find it even on advanced. "Enter" does nothing.



On the return ≠ line break, etc, issue, on my Droid and laptop...I can't get it to space either. On the Mac stuff, its normal, spaces with a return, etc. 

No clue why. 

I used to be able to post from the phone or laptop too, but, lately, I can't unless its all one long run on line of text.


----------



## BababooeyHTJ

How difficult is it to replace the lens on this light? 

I'll be honest thats the only concern that I have with this light especally since I hear that warranty work is done in China and takes a really long time. 

My convoy s3 is super easy to pull apart and change parts if need be.


----------



## BababooeyHTJ

I also just received my SC600 MKii. I was looking at the emitter at work today and I noticed that it has a cloudy spot. I own a few budget lights with an XM-L emitter and not a one has a blemish. This light cost almost as much as the rest of my lights combined. I'm not sure how that slipped through quality control. I'm hoping for a decent resolution with zebralight. I even paid a little extra for shipping to get it to arrive faster.


----------



## Badbeams3

BababooeyHTJ said:


> I also just received my SC600 MKii. I was looking at the emitter at work today and I noticed that it has a cloudy spot. I own a few budget lights with an XM-L emitter and not a one has a blemish. This light cost almost as much as the rest of my lights combined. I'm not sure how that slipped through quality control. I'm hoping for a decent resolution with zebralight. I even paid a little extra for shipping to get it to arrive faster.



I imagine they will replace it if not satisfied...but you may have to pay for shipping it back...and be without one for a while...


----------



## ArcticHighlander

BababooeyHTJ said:


> I also just received my SC600 MKii. I was looking at the emitter at work today and I noticed that it has a cloudy spot. I own a few budget lights with an XM-L emitter and not a one has a blemish. This light cost almost as much as the rest of my lights combined. I'm not sure how that slipped through quality control. I'm hoping for a decent resolution with zebralight. I even paid a little extra for shipping to get it to arrive faster.


If you bought it through a US vendor you should be able to exchange it fairly easily. I know one US vendor even inspects and tests them before shipping.


----------



## GehenSienachlinks

Zebralight says they are coming out with xm l2 version in 2-3 months time .


----------



## AmperSand

BababooeyHTJ said:


> I also just received my SC600 MKii. I was looking at the emitter at work today and I noticed that it has a cloudy spot. I own a few budget lights with an XM-L emitter and not a one has a blemish. This light cost almost as much as the rest of my lights combined. I'm not sure how that slipped through quality control. I'm hoping for a decent resolution with zebralight. I even paid a little extra for shipping to get it to arrive faster.



I noticed on mine when in the lowest low setting I can see a few dark spots on the phosphor of the led. No idea if it was like this when I got it as ive only noticed it in the last few weeks, got it in the first round of releases.


----------



## WilsonCQB1911

BababooeyHTJ said:


> I also just received my SC600 MKii. I was looking at the emitter at work today and I noticed that it has a cloudy spot. I own a few budget lights with an XM-L emitter and not a one has a blemish. This light cost almost as much as the rest of my lights combined. I'm not sure how that slipped through quality control. I'm hoping for a decent resolution with zebralight. I even paid a little extra for shipping to get it to arrive faster.




Are you sure it's not just a shadow? If looking straight down the reflector there will be a shadow that covers the dome of the LED. If you look at an angle it'll disappear.


----------



## ArcticHighlander

GehenSienachlinks said:


> Zebralight says they are coming out with xm l2 version in 2-3 months time .


For the SC600 MKII or SC600w MKII? The latter is supposed to be released around then.


----------



## GehenSienachlinks

ArcticHighlander said:


> For the SC600 MKII or SC600w MKII? The latter is supposed to be released around then.



Should be both , first would be cool white .


----------



## BababooeyHTJ

WilsonCQB1911 said:


> Are you sure it's not just a shadow? If looking straight down the reflector there will be a shadow that covers the dome of the LED. If you look at an angle it'll disappear.



I wish, I don't see it on my boss' light or any of my other XM-L lights. 



Badbeams3 said:


> I imagine they will replace it if not satisfied...but you may have to pay for shipping it back...*and be without one for a while*...




Yeah, thats the worst part.


----------



## Stefano

To help a user forum in the choice between SC600 and Fenix ​​PD35 I made a comparison in the forest with some pictures.

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?361481-pd35/page8

(Translated with Google translator ..)


----------



## Badbeams3

Stefano said:


> To help a user forum in the choice between SC600 and Fenix ​​PD35 I made a comparison in the forest with some pictures.
> 
> http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?361481-pd35/page8
> 
> (Translated with Google translator ..)



"Next photo: Eagletac SX25L3 - MT-G2 P0 LED - (*1057* lumens level)"

Adds a lot of color...nice!


----------



## Stefano

Badbeams3 said:


> "Next photo: Eagletac SX25L3 - MT-G2 P0 LED - (*1057* lumens level)"
> 
> Adds a lot of color...nice!



Hopefully soon Zebra MKII with neutral tint, the cool white of these Zebra I like, is very pleasant, but in the midst of nature, the difference is remarkable.
Notes: Eagletac SX25L3 - MT-G2 P0 LED has tint 5000 degrees kelvin


----------



## Badbeams3

Stefano said:


> Hopefully soon Zebra MKII with neutral tint, the cool white of these Zebra I like, is very pleasant, but in the midst of nature, the difference is remarkable.
> Notes: Eagletac SX25L3 - MT-G2 P0 LED has tint 5000 degrees kelvin



Think at this point I can say I prefer neutral whites despite their lower output, over their standard counter parts.


----------



## Stefano

Badbeams3 said:


> Think at this point I can say I prefer neutral whites despite their lower output, over their standard counter parts.



All my lights are cool withe but one Zebra H51w and EagleTac SX25L3
Lights current offer great power, even if they have a 7​​% less than a cool withe this is no longer a problem.
My next lights will all be neutral.

(Translated with Google translator ..)


----------



## ArcaneLogic

Received my SC600 MKII a few days ago. I like that it's shorter (I thought my SC600 was already short!). I like the options for even lower lows. I like the extra run time at the lower outputs. However, it really isn't practically brighter. Yeah, side by side you can just barely tell it's brighter and the hot spot is tighter, but can I light up things with the MKII that I couldn't with my original SC600? No. Also, the MKII is a cooler tint - more blue around the corona of the hot spot, and a little bit of green in the surround. My original SC600 is more neutral - yellow and a tiny hint of pink in the surround (only noticeable if you're pointing it at a white wall or ceiling). I prefer the tint and floodiness of the original, but the form factor and features and runtime of the MKII. Both amazing lights though, and very very close - they really do have to be compared and squinted at side-by-side to notice any difference. If you have an SC600 and don't really need another light, then my advice would be to just stick with what ya got.

The one I received does have some small nicks around the edge of the button hole and around the bezel. The nicks are anodized over, so they happened before the anodizing process. They're small but noticeable at a quick glance. I don't know that it's enough for me to return it, but it is annoying. People who keep their mint condition flashlights on velvet pillows would be pretty miffed, but for me I bought it to use so...


----------



## fnj

Just wanted to add my case here, a little late. I finally received my Mk II some time ago. In my particular case my Mk II is significantly better tint than my Mk I. Both obviously have the XM-L universal color ring crappiness, but I won the lottery with the newer one. Actually neither one is all that bad, and I doubt very much if there is a perfect XM-L that rides the neutral line exactly, neither greenish nor rosy.

The biggest difference in my particular case is the switch! It is dramatically better in my Mk I. The switch in my Mk I required superhuman strength to press, had extremely poor feedback, and was prone to quite bad bounce which showed up as coming on in low and then immediately cutting to eyesplitting high within a small fraction of a second.

My Mk II has none of that. It doesn't require anything like the ridiculous amount of strength to click, there is a very nice click feedback, and it is positive in action with no surprises. It is a great pleasure to use, unlike my Mk I.

I absolutely applaud the battery strength readout. I recharge when it changes from 4 blinks to 3, or certainly by the time it's not too far into the 2 blink region. Deep discharging lithium ions is what wears them out.

It seems obvious to me that everyone's mileage is going to vary, but I wanted to make the case for: Great job, Zebra!


----------



## MDJAK

I readily admit that, due to work constraints, I've not been able to read this lengthy thread, but I got my MkII today. While it is much brighter than the earlier model I own, the switches in my case operate the same. The light is slightly smaller and lighter and feels overall more cheaply made. That is a bit disappointing. Just sayin'.


----------



## rpm00

Ordered by MKII today! I really like my SC52, so I'm hoping it's big brother will be just as nice!


----------



## rpm00

Woo! Got my MkII today! Can't wait to test it out! 

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I727 using Tapatalk 4


----------



## BWX

My MKI switch hardly ever works correctly.. Now this is the definitely the last ZebraLight I ever buy. I gave them one more chance after my H501 switch was defective after a few months, then they gave me 5 more that all were non functional within 3 months.. (switch or other internal problems). 

Then I got the MKI (b) while waiting for the MKII, and now the switch is constantly having a mind of it's own. It almost never does what I want it to, and constantly flashes into turbo, or changes sub modes on it's own, or won't cycle, or won't turn on to low.. Just a regular POS. 

It looks like they have discontinued almost all their products now. Are they going out of business? It wouldn't surprise me with their terrible QC department.


----------



## shelm

BWX said:


> Now this is the definitely the last ZebraLight I ever buy. (...) Just a regular POS.
> 
> It looks like they have discontinued almost all their products now. Are they going out of business? It wouldn't surprise me with their terrible QC department.



I am not gonna defend Zebralight, i only have experience with my SC52g and am okay with it so far. The zebra continues to live unharmed because i don't let it leave out of the stable. But man you're a senior community member, very respected, so you cannot boot the company in the face like that imho. It's too hurtful for the company and us readers with such harsh comments coming from you! You make the CEO feel very bad. Pull on the reins heeya! 

But CPF newbies can. They're fierce, tactless, rude and respectless. Shame on them!


----------



## BWX

Well I'm not trying to be rude..

I'm just very frustrated with ZL, and I feel very stupid now for giving them a second chance. 
I think after 7 failed ZL products (one H501 and FIVE replacements and then one SC600 MKI (B)... I cannot understand how anyone ever gets one that works, if they actually use it for any length of time such as a daily carry.

That's just one person's experience.. too bad it happens to be mine. 

What I was really wondering is if they are going out of business, and used my personal story with ZL as an example of why I am not surprised if they are.

Did you see their website? There's only like four flashlight and four headlamps, and all the rest are discontinued. 


I would send this expensive little SC600 back, but I know what will happen. I will spend a bunch of $$ on shipping, and they will continue to send me defective/ remanufactured lights until after 5 or 6 defects and months later and 100 dollars more wasted on shipping, I give up. That's what happened with my H501. It is a $200 paperweight now. At least this SC600 still works as a flashlight, but it probably won't for long. Same exact thing happened with H501, all six of them. And I know what O am doing with lipos and LED flashlights.. it is not user error.

Oh well.. it' only money right?


----------



## Cessquill

I figured they were rationalising their range, but if you go onto their product spreadsheet (Compare All Models link on the left), there are other products not yet on their site. Including a MkII version of the H600 headlamp.


----------



## stevenkelby

BWX, you haven't tried a MKII switch yet, correct?

Do you have a MKII on order?


----------



## gteague

this is my first zl, but i'm not thrilled with the mk2 switch. the detents are not positive enough and you get 'bounces' or intermediate levels when going into the 3 levels. and i love having the very low levels, but there's not enough granularity of level choices.

but it is the perfect size for edc carry (the nitecore ec25 is just that much too long) and i do like a side switch as opposed to a rotary or endcap switch.

my ideal would be for hds to make a 18650 light. they do offer an option for a 17xxx? battery, but that battery is about 3/4" longer than the 18650 which would put it closer to the ec25 range than the sc600 range.

/guy


----------



## BWX

stevenkelby said:


> BWX, you haven't tried a MKII switch yet, correct?
> 
> Do you have a MKII on order?



Nope- I was going to get one eventually, but after the 6th Zebralight to have a switch flake out on me, I am not going to be buying anymore ZL flashlights.


----------



## stevenkelby

That's a pity, the new switches are spot on and reliable.


----------



## fnj

BWX said:


> My MKI switch hardly ever works correctly.. Now this is the definitely the last ZebraLight I ever buy. I gave them one more chance after my H501 switch was defective after a few months, then they gave me 5 more that all were non functional within 3 months.. (switch or other internal problems).
> 
> Then I got the MKI (b) while waiting for the MKII, and now the switch is constantly having a mind of it's own. It almost never does what I want it to, and constantly flashes into turbo, or changes sub modes on it's own, or won't cycle, or won't turn on to low.. Just a regular POS.
> 
> It looks like they have discontinued almost all their products now. Are they going out of business? It wouldn't surprise me with their terrible QC department.



I'm not going to tell you to marketplace your Mk I and get a Mk II; or to just live with the Mk I; I don't find fault with your personal decision, but I just want to emphasize what I wrote a little above about my own experience. I found the Mk I very temperamental just like yours, but the Mk II is a completely different story for me. A joy to use. As for my Mk I, if this helps at all, I found that if I use extreme superhuman force on the button, and operate it with extreme deliberation, it does pretty much work properly.

FWIW (not a whole lot!), my impression is that the problems ZL does have are not QC so much as they are bad human-engineering choices. They did listen to us. Nobody liked the SC50/51/60 because they came on in the pocket by themselves; they addressed THAT problem effectively but introduced another problem therein. It seems to me in the Mk II they did get it right, but hey, I'm only judging by my own sample.

I do have a few SC/H/50/50a/51, and a couple of them have switch wonkiness too, so the above is probably too simplistic. I just live with it - unpleasantly. I'm just not going to get into the game of the slow boat to (and from) China returns.


----------



## peterharvey73

I don't have a Mk II yet, but I find that with my Mk I, I must press the button truly the whole way down to get it to work. Just pressing the old Mk I down, and making a click sound does nothing...


----------



## rpm00

Sad to hear all these negative experiences with ZL. Although I've only had it a couple days I'm super happy with my MkII and my SC52. Two of my favorite lights. 

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I727 using Tapatalk 4


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## peterharvey73

I guess Zebralight tried really really hard to make the SC600's button as stiff as possible so that it would not accidentally turn on. Maybe they should have thought more ergonomically, and just let the user lock out the tail cap to prevent accidental turn on???


----------



## fnj

peterharvey73 said:


> I guess Zebralight tried really really hard to make the SC600's button as stiff as possible so that it would not accidentally turn on. Maybe they should have thought more ergonomically, and just let the user lock out the tail cap to prevent accidental turn on???



That was/is always possible on the SC60/600.


----------



## KITROBASKIN

rpm00 said:


> Sad to hear all these negative experiences with ZL. Although I've only had it a couple days I'm super happy with my MkII and my SC52. Two of my favorite lights.
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I727 using Tapatalk 4



The MkII seems like a fine flashlight. The SC52 is my favorite small flashlight by far, and a true neutral tint would make it the pinnacle of small size flashlights in my eyes. The switch seems great. 

I don't doubt for a second any of the negative reports. If Surefire was making these lights the price would be $200 easily. The factory in China making Zebralights has clearly made mistakes. Some of the previous design flaws have been improved upon. Some would consider the profusion of discontinued models a sign of innovation, a desire to improve. Others see it differently and they may be right. Maybe Zebralight is a struggling company. It would be nice if any members of this community had evidence one way or another; I don't.


----------



## Samy

BWX said:


> My MKI switch hardly ever works correctly.. Now this is the definitely the last ZebraLight I ever buy. I gave them one more chance after my H501 switch was defective after a few months, then they gave me 5 more that all were non functional within 3 months.. (switch or other internal problems).
> 
> Then I got the MKI (b) while waiting for the MKII, and now the switch is constantly having a mind of it's own. It almost never does what I want it to, and constantly flashes into turbo, or changes sub modes on it's own, or won't cycle, or won't turn on to low.. Just a regular POS.
> 
> It looks like they have discontinued almost all their products now. Are they going out of business? It wouldn't surprise me with their terrible QC department.




My MK1 (b) switch worked flawlessly but suddenly died in march this year, 13 months after i purchased it. I can still occasionally select modes but it takes great skill due to the level of difficulty and pressure required to try and get into the mode i need. This light is now unreliable and i cannot use it.

I have an older SC51 (used for 2 years) and a H51 (used for 15 months) which i use daily and have no issues though these use the older 'soft' switches. 

I may purchase another headlamp from them in the future but for the moment, i look elsewhere for flashlights - i don't trust the build quality of Zebralight atm.

cheers


----------



## ArcaneLogic

My MkI had a flawless switch initially, but now it's over a year old and takes a decent effort to click (double clicks are doubly dubious). My H600's switch is flawless to date and is about a year old. My MkII's switch is flawless so far (I've had it about a month now). We'll see how it's working after a year.

Woohoo! H600 MkIIs are out - PID thermal regulation!!!! 1020 lumens! A true H602 flood model! Neutral tints! Oh my goodness...


----------



## BWX

Yeah the new headlamp is tempting.. See? I am an idiot for even thinking about getting one! I'm sure it would be broken the second it goes out of warranty if it even lasted that long. I don't EDC headlamps though, so it might. 

I have a SPARK ST6 500CW headlamp that I use all the time, and it works great. It puts out a ton of light on turbo, and it is the ver.2 that has more power and runs cooler and has no timer on turbo.

My Spark SL6-800CW is a piece of crap that shuts itself off when put into turbo mode, and it needs to have tail cap removed before it turns back on.. The first one did the same, I sent it back to goinggear, they sent me this one out after they "tested it", and it does the exact same thing. That's another $95 light that I got burned by. I thought ZL and Spark were related as companies somehow, or the same guy owns both or something. not sure.

Oh, and my SC600 Mk1(b) also acts completely differently when it has a brand new freshly charged battery and it really starts acting crazy when I run it on high for a while and it gets warmed up, then the switch barely works at all. It's just a bad design or bad QC, or something, it doesn't matter to me what it is, all I know is that it was expensive, and it is crap.


----------



## ghodan

What is the trow in meters of the SC600 MK2 and how much candela does it have?


----------



## roadkill1109

Have there been any recent quality report issues with the SC600 MKII?

After being impressed by the SC52, im looking to purchase it's big bro, the MKII. Is it okay to get this or do we have to wait a bit more for ZL to sort out any quality issues?


----------



## Fallingwater

I have a MKI, improved model (according to the site I got it from, it's had several improvement over the very first original, including lower vampire draw and other minor things I can't recall). I'm unwilling to spend the money for another SC600, since my MKI works flawlessly and has no switch issues whatsoever (yet, fingers crossed). However, I do like increased efficiency.

Is there any way of upgrading my MKI's circuit board to a MKII? Do Zebralight sell bare boards at all?


----------



## Overclocker

roadkill1109 said:


> Have there been any recent quality report issues with the SC600 MKII?
> 
> After being impressed by the SC52, im looking to purchase it's big bro, the MKII. Is it okay to get this or do we have to wait a bit more for ZL to sort out any quality issues?




ok my sample size =4 only but fwiw they've all been very good. imho better wait for sc600w mk2 with the new PID.

personally i'll be getting the h600w mk2 + 7777 deep-carry clip. PID. lighter and slimmer than sc600


----------



## moozooh

Not sure how this went under the radar with so many hi-performance light fans around here, but ZL will be updating the SC600 mkII with XM-L2 and—wait for it!—PID controller similar to the one in S6330. Already! Quickest ZL product obsoletion ever?

I'll let you marvel at the OTF and runtime numbers for yourself. Pants shat in 3...2...1... 

I really, _really _think it's high time to release S5310 if things get as wild as they do!


----------



## doceric

Can we say that this is the brightest in terms of flood among the single battery LED flashlight?


----------



## markr6

moozooh said:


> Pants shat in 3...2...1...



LOL!!!



moozooh said:


> I really, _really _think it's high time to release S5310 if things get as wild as they do!



And the Q50


----------



## moozooh

doceric said:


> Can we say that this is the brightest in terms of flood among the single battery LED flashlight?


Can't say about custom builds (those guys will always find a way to fry the LED in the most torturous ways), but among mass production lights this would be the brightest as far as I'm aware. I'm wondering what the peak current draw is—might be that it goes slightly above 3.0 amps if the thermal controller says the LED is cool enough.

Earlier this year I was thinking about retiring my SC600-U2 which I'd been using as a bike lamp and secondary trek light in favor of an AA-based light, but considering it usually takes me _at least two weeks_ to deplete a 3400 mAh cell, I might upgrade it to SC600 mkII L2 after all. If it's at least as thrifty as the normal mkII I will never need to bring a replacement battery with me, saving _quite _some weight compared to 3×2 eneloop XX cans... or quite some money compared to 3×2 lithium primaries.


----------



## TEEJ

As soon as you buy the SC600 II PID 1,100 Lumen version....they will release the 1,800 Lumen PID MK-R version.


----------



## noboneshotdog

TEEJ said:


> As soon as you buy the SC600 II PID 1,100 Lumen version....they will release the 1,800 Lumen PID MK-R version.



Looks like Im going to be owning A LOT of Zebralights then......who can RESIST!!!!


----------



## creyc

An SC600 has been on my wish list for quite some time! I guess I may as well wait for the new SC600 II, or pick up an existing SC600 once they start going on clearance..hmmm


----------



## ArcticHighlander

I was planning on buying one for its extended range - down to .01 lumens. The H600 only went down to .1 lumens and was too bright for some things. Instead I bought the new H600w MKII which came out recently. It has an OTF/ANSI range from .01 to 1020 lumens; higher highs and lower lows and a good range inbetween. Plus it can be used either as a flashlight or headlamp.


----------



## LEDburn

They're almost here!!

New SC600w Mk2: http://www.zebralight.com/SC600w-Mk-II-L2-18650-XM-L2-Flashlight-Neutral-White_p_122.html

New (newest) SC600cw Mk2: http://www.zebralight.com/SC600-Mk-II-L2-18650-XM-L2-Flashlight-Cool-White_p_123.html

Both have XM-L2 LED's and both feature the tweaked UI and PID 

They are listed as "not for sale" which is what they did with the H52w and H52fw models - they finally put those up for pre-order this morning. Of course I had to grab a H52fw


----------



## Derek Dean

What's impressive to me about the new specs., is that the runtime has almost doubled at the 65 lumen level, compared to my original ZL SC600, from 18 hours to 30 hours. That's quite an increase in a level that I use frequently. Very nice indeed.


----------



## DMS1970

XM-L2 sounds great, I've had zero issues with my MKII. Are these available anywhere yet? What are the chances that the s6330 will see the xm-l2? THAT would rock with 3000+ lumens.......


----------



## Johnno

LEDburn said:


> They are listed as "not for sale" which is what they did with the H52w and H52fw models - they finally put those up for pre-order this morning. Of course I had to grab a H52fw



*Shakes fist at LEDburn* 

Whelp... looks like my wallet has developed anorexia again and its all your fault! Just pre-ordered a H52fw as well. 

And I'll be ordering a XM-L2 based SC600cw Mk2 just as soon as they allow pre-orders. *sigh*

I've completely stopped buying other brands of lights now for a good couple of years - the assortment of Zebra's I have in my stable more than sufficiently cover all of my needs.


----------



## kaichu dento

Derek Dean said:


> What's impressive to me about the new specs., is that the runtime has almost doubled at the 65 lumen level, compared to my original ZL SC600, from 18 hours to 30 hours. That's quite an increase in a level that I use frequently. Very nice indeed.


+ 1

I'm finally ready to pick one of these up - improved specs and non-cool tint in a pocketable light that can do .001 to just over 1,000 lumens.


----------



## chanrobi

LEDburn said:


> They're almost here!!
> 
> New SC600w Mk2: http://www.zebralight.com/SC600w-Mk-II-L2-18650-XM-L2-Flashlight-Neutral-White_p_122.html
> 
> New (newest) SC600cw Mk2: http://www.zebralight.com/SC600-Mk-II-L2-18650-XM-L2-Flashlight-Cool-White_p_123.html
> 
> Both have XM-L2 LED's and both feature the tweaked UI and PID
> 
> They are listed as "not for sale" which is what they did with the H52w and H52fw models - they finally put those up for pre-order this morning. Of course I had to grab a H52fw



I've been waiting for the MKII version of the W in neutral for a while!!


----------



## moozooh

Wow, the specs are are rather confusing... not in a way than I expected.

MkII XM-L:
_M1 *90*Lm (30hrs)
L1 *3*Lm (25days)
_
MkII XM-L2:
_M1 *70* Lm (30 hrs)
L1 *3.8 *Lm (16 days)
_
M1 and L1 are the two brightness levels that generally see the most use on my light. If the stated numbers are correct, I am completely unconvinced that the XM-L2 version is the winner here. Does this boggle anyone else's mind?


----------



## pjandyho

moozooh said:


> Wow, the specs are are rather confusing... not in a way than I expected.
> 
> MkII XM-L:
> _M1 *90*Lm (30hrs)
> L1 *3*Lm (25days)
> _
> MkII XM-L2:
> _M1 *70* Lm (30 hrs)
> L1 *3.8 *Lm (16 days)
> _
> M1 and L1 are the two brightness levels that generally see the most use on my light. If the stated numbers are correct, I am completely unconvinced that the XM-L2 version is the winner here. Does this boggle anyone else's mind?


That's weird. Aren't XM-L2 supposed to be more efficient?


----------



## Derek Dean

Well, if you look at the rest of the specs., they seems to be consistent with the XM-L2 being more efficient. Maybe I'm wrong, but I seem to remember reading when the SC600 first came out that some of the levels were current controlled and some used PWM. Can anybody confirm that? 

If that's the case, it's possible that for some reason this level got changed from how it's controlled. Pure speculation, and probably wrong, just thought I'd put it out there. 

In any case, I've read quite a few reviews reporting that the new XM-L2 lights seem to have a more consistent color across the beam-profile, unlike the yellow center and purple fringe we got with so many XM-L Leds, so that would certainly be welcome.


----------



## fnj

Derek Dean said:


> I seem to remember reading when the SC600 first came out that some of the levels were current controlled and some used PWM



Not unless my memory is a whole whale of a lot worse than I thought. Actually, come to think of it, I've forgotten how bad I thought my memory was. :huh:


----------



## moozooh

Derek Dean said:


> Well, if you look at the rest of the specs., they seems to be consistent with the XM-L2 being more efficient. Maybe I'm wrong, but I seem to remember reading when the SC600 first came out that some of the levels were current controlled and some used PWM. Can anybody confirm that?



I believe that was the 51 series lights. Compare: SC51 on Jan'12 and on Aug'12. The spreadsheet likewise confirms the current regulation made its way into the lights at a later date.

But that doesn't matter because both the mkII and the mkII L2 are all current-regulated from the start, as advertised. If a light's efficiency drops where it has to uniformly, unconditionally increase, it's either a webmaster's mistake or a bug in the driver.


----------



## ArcticHighlander

kaichu dento said:


> + 1
> 
> I'm finally ready to pick one of these up - improved specs and non-cool tint in a pocketable light that can do .001 to just over 1,000 lumens.


.01 to 1020 for the non-cool tint.


----------



## markr6

Well, I'm 99% ready to complete my order for a SC600w MKII!

I don't need another light, especially another one running 18650. But after about 1 year into being a flashaholic, *I've come to the conclusion that I can't have everything! *Zebralight comes as close as possible, only lacking a momentary on. I've finally gotten over this and decided everything else makes up for that.

Just like people say with knives: "the best one is the one you have with you when you need it". And I always go for my Zebralights first since they do everything I want (every mode you could possibly need, quick access to any mode, good runtimes, nice beam, etc.)

So, I'm about to pull the trigger...my wallet is holding me back...


----------



## BababooeyHTJ

The original SC600 MKii is on sale for $55 at E2 field gear. I don't need another one but I love mine and am considering ordering another at that price.

I pulled the trigger. How can you say no at that price?


----------



## stevenkelby

BababooeyHTJ said:


> The original SC600 MKii is on sale for $55 at E2 field gear. I don't need another one but I love mine and am considering ordering another at that price.
> 
> I pulled the trigger. How can you say no at that price?



It's $62.90 now. Was it $55 before?


----------



## BababooeyHTJ

stevenkelby said:


> It's $62.90 now. Was it $55 before?



It comes out to $55 after promo code "BLF".


----------



## stevenkelby

BababooeyHTJ said:


> It comes out to $55 after promo code "BLF".



Did you get one for that?

It says on the product description page: 
*No other discounts or coupons apply. Orders will additional coupons or discounts added will be cancelled.*

http://www.e2fieldgear.com/zebralight-sc600-mark-2-mk-ii-cool-white-led-flashlight-with-900-lumens/​


----------



## BababooeyHTJ

Oh, I didn't see that. I'm sure that my order will end up being cancled. Thats too bad.


----------



## stevenkelby

Damn that would have been an awesome deal! Still a good deal at $63. If you still want it, maybe email them and explain.


----------



## tubed

Ok,
i give up. What does PID stand for?


----------



## thaugen

tubed said:


> Ok,
> i give up. What does PID stand for?



*​*Proportional-Integral-Differential


----------



## tubed

thaugen said:


> *​*Proportional-Integral-Differential



Hmm.
and what does that mean to a layman?


----------



## thaugen

tubed said:


> Hmm.
> and what does that mean to a layman?



I found this in another thread on the same subject...

"I found a good layman's explanation here."


----------



## moozooh

In this case it's a small built-in chip that tries to maintain target light output while preventing the LED from overheating. It does so by reading thermal data from the LED and gradually adjusting the power fed to it so that it is in safe boundaries.


----------



## bodhran

If we needed an output that was PID controlled. How would this effect us, what would we see in actual use? I saw that the s6330 uses this but did not see any post of peoples impressions of it in use.


----------



## moozooh

It would be as bright as possible in the first few seconds/minutes, gradually falling off to normally expected levels (for a light of given size and weight) as the LED is heating up to its upper safe limit. This fall-off would take place:
— sooner if it's hot outside and/or ventilation is poor;
— or later (or never) if it's cold, raining, or if the light is mounted onto a bike or used underwater.
Such a light would also attempt to restore its initial brightness on the fly if its cooling conditions increased somehow (such as if weather conditions suddenly changed, or you started moving faster, etc.)


----------



## noboneshotdog

WOW!!!! $62.90 at E2 FIELDGEAR is a steal of a deal. I may get some early Christmas presents for family/friends at this price!!!!!!!!!


----------



## bodhran

Thanks for the information Moozooh.


----------



## hurld

So this new model Sc600 with PID will stay brighter longer, run longer? Why is it so much better than the mk2 on sale? Guess I'm slow lol. To buy the mk2 on sale or wait for the PID, not sure what I should do. I have the sc52 and love it. I know the Sc600 has longer run time, but is it noticeably brighter?

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 4


----------



## BababooeyHTJ

It has PID so it'll stay at a brighter setting for longer. The original MKii just goes to 900Lm and steps down after 5 minutes. I only use that setting for short bursts anyways. So that doesn't effect me to be honest. Going by their specs runtimes per lumen don't seem any better than the original XM-L version. Just brighter. 

I would love a neutral tint though and thats only available in the L2.


----------



## tacticalpineapple

Got my SC600 MK2 from E2FieldGear the other day, and I am fully prepared to be chastised profusely for what I'm about to say. Is anyone else COMPLETELY DISAPPOINTED in this light? Let me be clear. I absolutely love everything about the light EXCEPT the brightness. I did a side by side comparison with my Fenix TK15 (gen 1 ~330lm) and the lights were identical in brightness. When I read 900lm, I was anticipating being blown away with light, but that didn't happen. 

Am I crazy?


UPDATE: illuminationgear.com is advertising this light at 1200lm? What the eff is going on here with this light. From my naked eye, this thing looks like it puts out about 300lm, not a drop more.


----------



## stevenkelby

tacticalpineapple said:


> Got my SC600 MK2 from E2FieldGear the other day, and I am fully prepared to be chastised profusely for what I'm about to say. Is anyone else COMPLETELY DISAPPOINTED in this light? Let me be clear. I absolutely love everything about the light EXCEPT the brightness. I did a side by side comparison with my Fenix TK15 (gen 1 ~330lm) and the lights were identical in brightness. When I read 900lm, I was anticipating being blown away with light, but that didn't happen.
> 
> Am I crazy?
> 
> 
> UPDATE: illuminationgear.com is advertising this light at 1200lm? What the eff is going on here with this light. From my naked eye, this thing looks like it puts out about 300lm, not a drop more.



Sorry to hear you're dissapionted, that's a bummer but it sounds like something wrong.

First, what batteries are you using? Have you tried different ones?

Your light might be faulty, do all levels work with obvious differences between them? 

Lastly, are you sure it's not just the beam shape that makes it look less bright? Compare it to the TK15 in a ceiling bounce. A TK15 has a very small hot spot so the light is very concentrated in the center. SC600 will have much more spill.


----------



## T0rch

tacticalpineapple said:


> UPDATE: illuminationgear.com is advertising this light at 1200lm?



There's an XM-L2 version that's scheduled for shipping later this month that specs out at 1100 Lm. Maybe that's the one they're talking about?


----------



## BWX

tacticalpineapple said:


> Got my SC600 MK2 from E2FieldGear the other day, and I am fully prepared to be chastised profusely for what I'm about to say. Is anyone else COMPLETELY DISAPPOINTED in this light? Let me be clear. I absolutely love everything about the light EXCEPT the brightness. I did a side by side comparison with my Fenix TK15 (gen 1 ~330lm) and the lights were identical in brightness. When I read 900lm, I was anticipating being blown away with light, but that didn't happen.
> 
> Am I crazy?
> 
> 
> UPDATE: illuminationgear.com is advertising this light at 1200lm? What the eff is going on here with this light. From my naked eye, this thing looks like it puts out about 300lm, not a drop more.



I have an "old" MKI (B) XM-L U2 that looks like it puts out about 800 lumens on "turbo".. It's crazy bright for a light this size. Are you sure you are seeing the turbo mode or that it is working? Does the head get hot in about 30 seconds after you turn on turbo? If not, then you aren't in the right mode for some reason.


----------



## tacticalpineapple

stevenkelby said:


> Sorry to hear you're dissapionted, that's a bummer but it sounds like something wrong.
> 
> First, what batteries are you using? Have you tried different ones?
> 
> Your light might be faulty, do all levels work with obvious differences between them?
> 
> Lastly, are you sure it's not just the beam shape that makes it look less bright? Compare it to the TK15 in a ceiling bounce. A TK15 has a very small hot spot so the light is very concentrated in the center. SC600 will have much more spill.



Thanks for your replies guys. I tried both Pana 3400 protected and the Sanyo 2600 protected cells. Same performance with both types of cells. I have no way of determining whether the light is faulty or not, but I am going to return it and order another through Amazon. 

There are definitely 3 distinct primary levels, and the sub levels seem to have different outputs.

I went into a dark room in my house and shined the lights against the wall. The hotspots were exactly the same brightness between the SC600 MK2 and the TK15. However, once outside the TK15 is clearly more throwy. The SC600 II is much more floody. Is it possible that those supposed extra lumens are "lost" in the flood? I've been reading Selfbuilt's FAQs re: his testing methodology, but I'm not a technical guy and had some trouble understanding the science behind the lumens and tests, etc.

T0rch: There is indeed a new version scheduled to ship to dealers on the 29th that is spec'd at 1100lm, but the site is not very clear. Either way, 1200lm is incorrect.

BWX: The head doesn't get that hot, especially not that quickly. Again, I'm not sure the light is working properly because I have nothing to compare it to. I guess the main issue is whether a flood-style light can appear less bright than a thrower? Either way, I'm seriously disappointed because while I really enjoy having a flood light as an EDC, I was hoping to be blown away with light, and that just isn't the case.

Thanks for responding yall...


----------



## BWX

When you get one that works right, you will be blown away by it's output for size. 

Did you try clicking once for on in high mode from off, wait a few seconds, then double click for turbo?

It sounds like you are in H2 mode, not H1 mode. H2 can be set for lower output.. I have mine set for 300 lumens (about).. When in high mode, double click 6 times to adjust H2 between 3 different outputs (stop on desired output) Turn off light to save. Then when single click to turn on, it will go into that output.. but again, double click to get to H1 (turbo).

This is for MKII L2 below


High: H1 1100 Lm (PID, approx 2 hr) or -- 

H2 670 Lm (PID, approx 2.5 hrs) / 356 Lm (3.9 hrs) / 162 Lm (11 hrs)

http://www.zebralight.com/SC600-Mk-II-L2-18650-XM-L2-Flashlight-Cool-White_p_123.html


When you get it to Turbo mode, it will get hot quick and will be insanely bright for it's size, then you'll know it is in turbo.


----------



## fnj

Apologies if this sounds condescending, and doubly so if I get anything wrong!

Lumens measure luminous flux (total light output integrated over all directions). Candela measure luminous intensity (brightness of a spot). One candela is one lumen per steradian, but remember that no practical light gives even illumination. The illumination is always nonlinearly distributed in two dimensions. The human eye is spectacularly bad at comparing lumens, even in an A-B test. It is only fair at comparing candela.

A "thrower" will always "out-wow" a more floodie light.

I have a strong hunch there is nothing "wrong" with your Zebra.


----------



## AmperSand

tacticalpineapple said:


> Thanks for your replies guys. I tried both Pana 3400 protected and the Sanyo 2600 protected cells. Same performance with both types of cells. I have no way of determining whether the light is faulty or not, but I am going to return it and order another through Amazon.
> 
> There are definitely 3 distinct primary levels, and the sub levels seem to have different outputs.
> 
> I went into a dark room in my house and shined the lights against the wall. The hotspots were exactly the same brightness between the SC600 MK2 and the TK15. However, once outside the TK15 is clearly more throwy. The SC600 II is much more floody. Is it possible that those supposed extra lumens are "lost" in the flood? I've been reading Selfbuilt's FAQs re: his testing methodology, but I'm not a technical guy and had some trouble understanding the science behind the lumens and tests, etc.



Is the sc600 mkii hotspot roughly 3 times the size of the tk15 while being the same apparent brightness on the wall?
Think what 300 x 3 is.

You have 3x more hotspot at roughly similar lux. You have 3 x more lumens.


----------



## BWX

fnj said:


> Apologies if this sounds condescending, and doubly so if I get anything wrong!
> 
> Lumens measure luminous flux (total light output integrated over all directions). Candela measure luminous intensity (brightness of a spot). One candela is one lumen per steradian, but remember that no practical light gives even illumination. The illumination is always nonlinearly distributed in two dimensions. The human eye is spectacularly bad at comparing lumens, even in an A-B test. It is only fair at comparing candela.
> 
> A "thrower" will always "out-wow" a more floodie light.
> 
> I have a strong hunch there is nothing "wrong" with your Zebra.



Yeah but it doesn't get hot, so he is not in turbo mode, either because the light is defective and will not go into turbo, or because he does not know how to operate the light. Either way he is not even seeing the highest output.



EDIT

tacticalpineapple,
I just did a test, and by 2:00 min in Turbo, my SC600 MKI B starts to get hot.. You can really start feeling heat building in head and starting in the battery tube.

See what happens for you, but do not hold onto light tight, your hand will dissipate heat, just hold it at the bottom, and touch it every 10 seconds near the head to see how hot it is.


Also if battery is low in voltage, it will not go into turbo.


----------



## ArcticHighlander

tacticalpineapple said:


> UPDATE: illuminationgear.com is advertising this light at 1200lm? What the eff is going on here with this light. From my naked eye, this thing looks like it puts out about 300lm, not a drop more.


 Illuminationgear I believe is correct. They list 1200 LED lumens, 900 lumens OTF/Ansi. The second number is the realistic one. They list the first because many other ZL competitors (like Armytek) only list LED lumens to make them appear brighter than they are. Listing both allows a direct comparison in output with those competitors.


----------



## tacticalpineapple

fnj said:


> Apologies if this sounds condescending, and doubly so if I get anything wrong!
> 
> Lumens measure luminous flux (total light output integrated over all directions). Candela measure luminous intensity (brightness of a spot). One candela is one lumen per steradian, but remember that no practical light gives even illumination. The illumination is always nonlinearly distributed in two dimensions. The human eye is spectacularly bad at comparing lumens, even in an A-B test. It is only fair at comparing candela.
> 
> A "thrower" will always "out-wow" a more floodie light.
> 
> I have a strong hunch there is nothing "wrong" with your Zebra.



Thanks for this FNJ, very informative.


----------



## tacticalpineapple

BWX said:


> When you get one that works right, you will be blown away by it's output for size.
> 
> Did you try clicking once for on in high mode from off, wait a few seconds, then double click for turbo?
> 
> It sounds like you are in H2 mode, not H1 mode. H2 can be set for lower output.. I have mine set for 300 lumens (about).. When in high mode, double click 6 times to adjust H2 between 3 different outputs (stop on desired output) Turn off light to save. Then when single click to turn on, it will go into that output.. but again, double click to get to H1 (turbo).
> 
> This is for MKII L2 below
> 
> 
> High: H1 1100 Lm (PID, approx 2 hr) or --
> 
> H2 670 Lm (PID, approx 2.5 hrs) / 356 Lm (3.9 hrs) / 162 Lm (11 hrs)
> 
> http://www.zebralight.com/SC600-Mk-II-L2-18650-XM-L2-Flashlight-Cool-White_p_123.html
> 
> 
> When you get it to Turbo mode, it will get hot quick and will be insanely bright for it's size, then you'll know it is in turbo.




BWX: Thanks for the reply. Before turning on the light I read the instruction manual. One quick click to turn on into H1 (I believe ZL does NOT use the term "Turbo" so to be consistent, I will use "H1" to denote the highest setting). After the light is in H1, I can double click to get to sub-level H2. 

I tried following your instructions about double clicking 6 times (12 clicks total?) to program the light, but I seem to trigger some kind of strobe mode.

UPDATE: The light definitely got warm, but I wouldn't call it hot.


----------



## fnj

tacticalpineapple said:


> BWX: Thanks for the reply. Before turning on the light I read the instruction manual. One quick click to turn on into H1 (I believe ZL does NOT use the term "Turbo" so to be consistent, I will use "H1" to denote the highest setting). After the light is in H1, I can double click to get to sub-level H2.



A minor point; you're probably hip to this, but here goes. A quick click does not necessarily turn it on to H1. It turns it on to either H1 or H2, whichever was last selected for H. If you click once, observe the light for a couple of seconds, then double-click once, it will either get brighter or dimmer. That's how you tell H1 from H2. After that, every time you double-click again, you change between H1 and H2 (unless you double-click six times within a certain period of time, which is like a secret handshake).


----------



## jbrett14

This is interesting. I was JUST ABOUT to order from E2 Field Gear until I saw this. Makes me wonder if the low price is BECAUSE of this problem. Perhaps these lower priced units are returned units. Anyone know?

I would sure hate to pay for a new unit that had been returned for being faulty.

Has anyway purchased one from E2 at this price, who also received a properly functioning unit?


----------



## BWX

fnj said:


> A minor point; you're probably hip to this, but here goes. A quick click does not necessarily turn it on to H1. It turns it on to either H1 or H2, whichever was last selected for H. If you click once, observe the light for a couple of seconds, then double-click once, it will either get brighter or dimmer. That's how you tell H1 from H2. After that, every time you double-click again, you change between H1 and H2 (unless you double-click six times within a certain period of time, which is like a secret handshake).



Yeah.. I just figured it wasn't in H1 because he was complaining that it wasn't that bright. 








tacticalpineapple said:


> BWX: Thanks for the reply. Before turning on the light I read the instruction manual. One quick click to turn on into H1 (I believe ZL does NOT use the term "Turbo" so to be consistent, I will use "H1" to denote the highest setting). After the light is in H1, I can double click to get to sub-level H2.
> 
> I tried following your instructions about double clicking 6 times (12 clicks total?) to program the light, but I seem to trigger some kind of strobe mode.
> 
> UPDATE: The light definitely got warm, but I wouldn't call it hot.



I call it "turbo", because it is a temporary higher output mode that only lasts a certain amount of time, ZL doesn't though, correct.. H1 actually has two levels, Higher- full power, then after a certain period of time (or heat for newer models), it goes back down to a lower output mode.. but the user didn't change anything, it is still in "H1" technically.. If you turn it back on after a few minutes, it will be in H1 still.

When you double clicked 6 times, and got that flashing mode, that is one of the modes you can set for H2. You should also have noticed a marked difference in light output between the three modes.. mine is around 220 lumens, 330 lumens, and 500 lumens. Yours will be higher because of better emitter, or maybe it is just different because they felt like changing it. There should still be three separate brightness levels, and a flashing level to set for H2.. **EDIT** I should add that you can keep double clicking to infinity and keep cycling between H2 modes to select. So they just keep going in a circle.

If you couldn't also tell the difference between those brightness levels in setting H2, and all you noticed was the flashing mode, then I think maybe you just don't have the natural ability to tell the difference between these different output levels, or else you're doing it wrong, looking at the wrong place in the beam, or something.. You might have better luck outside in the dark, pointing it at a white wall, or some other large flat object. 

The difference between H1 highest output (or turbo), and H2 highest output should still be quite a difference.


----------



## noboneshotdog

jbrett14 said:


> This is interesting. I was JUST ABOUT to order from E2 Field Gear until I saw this. Makes me wonder if the low price is BECAUSE of this problem. Perhaps these lower priced units are returned units. Anyone know?
> 
> I would sure hate to pay for a new unit that had been returned for being faulty.
> 
> Has anyway purchased one from E2 at this price, who also received a properly functioning unit?



I have not purchased the SC600 at this price from E2, but wish I had. I bought mine from E2 a few months back. E2 IS a reputable US based seller and DOES NOT deal in dishonest ways. He is simply making room for the SC600 L2 which I will also be purchasing from E2 as well. Zebralight puts out a great high quality/performance RELIABLE light, and E2 sells high quality reliable products. 

On another note, any other purchasers of the SC600 MKII looking forward to and planning on picking up the SC600 MKII L2?


----------



## jbrett14

Thanks hotdog. I have never purchased from E2, so I appreciate the feedback. I have, however, purchased several other Zebralight products, all of which I love. But because of the numerous negative comments I have read, pertaining to the SC600 MKII, I became skeptical of it's reliability, etc., wondering if many of them were returned, and then resold.


----------



## KITROBASKIN

noboneshotdog said:


> On another note, any other purchasers of the SC600 MKII looking forward to and planning on picking up the SC600 MKII L2?


 
Definitely looking to get either the SC600w L2 OR the SC62 (whatever variant that has a pleasing cast). One factor will be what H1 (highest setting) will be in those two models. DEFINITELY looking to fellow members for feedback on those models. And yes, the SC52 is so great in so many ways. I tried and tried to find another manufacturer that makes a compact 1X 18650 torch that can best a Zebra. No such luck for me.


----------



## Mr Floppy

KITROBASKIN said:


> DEFINITELY looking to fellow members for feedback on those models.



Looking forward to see some runtime graphs of the PID thermals from selfbuilt. He uses a fan I believe so hopefully he'll do one with both fan off and on. I wonder if he has a logging temperature probe?


----------



## Nicola

tacticalpineapple said:


> ... I did a side by side comparison with my Fenix TK15 (gen 1 ~330lm) and the lights were identical in brightness. ...



Hi, some time ago, I did a side by side comparison with my Fenix PD32 (G5 - 315lm) and I can say the difference was huge.

For what I remember, maybe hotspot is not so different, PD32 tint is whiter and hotspot is more concentrated, but overall light of SC600 MkII is washing out the PD32.

I feel there's something wrong with your SC600 MkII.

Just my two cents.


----------



## tacticalpineapple

fnj said:


> A minor point; you're probably hip to this, but here goes. A quick click does not necessarily turn it on to H1. It turns it on to either H1 or H2, whichever was last selected for H. If you click once, observe the light for a couple of seconds, then double-click once, it will either get brighter or dimmer. That's how you tell H1 from H2. After that, every time you double-click again, you change between H1 and H2 (unless you double-click six times within a certain period of time, which is like a secret handshake).



I'm definitely turning the light on into H1. Double click goes into a dimmer H2. Thanks for the reply.


----------



## tacticalpineapple

noboneshotdog said:


> I have not purchased the SC600 at this price from E2, but wish I had. I bought mine from E2 a few months back. E2 IS a reputable US based seller and DOES NOT deal in dishonest ways. He is simply making room for the SC600 L2 which I will also be purchasing from E2 as well. Zebralight puts out a great high quality/performance RELIABLE light, and E2 sells high quality reliable products.
> 
> On another note, any other purchasers of the SC600 MKII looking forward to and planning on picking up the SC600 MKII L2?



I agree w/ noboneshotdog that E2 is reliable. My comments were in no way intended as a slight against that company, and it is entirely possible that this light is performing perfectly well and that I'm just not impressed by the brightness.


----------



## tacticalpineapple

Nicola said:


> Hi, some time ago, I did a side by side comparison with my Fenix PD32 (G5 - 315lm) and I can say the difference was huge.
> 
> For what I remember, maybe hotspot is not so different, PD32 tint is whiter and hotspot is more concentrated, but overall light of SC600 MkII is washing out the PD32.
> 
> I feel there's something wrong with your SC600 MkII.
> 
> Just my two cents.



Thanks Nicola. I think there may be something wrong as I have stated in my earlier posts. Full disclosure, I am a complete noob to flashlights. I've owned the Fenix Tk15 for about 3 years now. I just recently received a SupBeam K40vn from Vinhnguyen54. In this most recent order, I purchased the Foursevens Penlight (which I've been EDC'ing, and have fallen in love with. I highly recommend this Penlight), and the ZL SC600 MK2. The TK 15 is just as bright as the ZL which is why I was concerned and came to the forums w/ my questions.


----------



## jbrett14

I don't know if this site will help you, but I found it helpful in trying to understand your situation. 

It is clear, to me, that the SC600 is MUCH brighter than the TK15. However, based on these photos, it appears that the TK15 does have a brighter spot at the end of the throw, which is possibly why you perceive them to be equally bright.

Check it out: http://fonarik.com/test/indexen.php?model=207&scene=1&mode=0


----------



## tacticalpineapple

jbrett14 said:


> I don't know if this site will help you, but I found it helpful in trying to understand your situation.
> 
> It is clear, to me, that the SC600 is MUCH brighter than the TK15. However, based on these photos, it appears that the TK15 does have a brighter spot at the end of the throw, which is possibly why you perceive them to be equally bright.
> 
> Check it out: http://fonarik.com/test/indexen.php?model=207&scene=1&mode=0




Wow, cool site man. Where in MI are you? The SC600 is definitely floodier, not to belabor the point. I don't think mine is that bright, however. May be defective. Won't know until I get another.


----------



## jbrett14

tacticalpineapple said:


> Wow, cool site man. Where in MI are you? The SC600 is definitely floodier, not to belabor the point. I don't think mine is that bright, however. May be defective. Won't know until I get another.



I live in the thumb, in the small town of Imlay City. How about you?

Sure sounds like yours is indeed defective. I was hoping this wasn't the case, as I just ordered one.


----------



## justanotherguy

Has anyone seen this light for $62.....I swear I found a site a couple days ago that had the mkii for that.... I should have book marked it..... even the mki would be nice
Pm me


----------



## stevenkelby

justanotherguy said:


> Has anyone seen this light for $62.....I swear I found a site a couple days ago that had the mkii for that.... I should have book marked it..... even the mki would be nice
> Pm me



From earlier in this thread:

http://www.e2fieldgear.com/zebralight-sc600-mark-2-mk-ii-cool-white-led-flashlight-with-900-lumens/


----------



## justanotherguy

Thanks man....I hit so many forums I couldnt remember where I saw it!!!


----------



## BababooeyHTJ

I'm really fond of the neutral tint on my H602 and an considering placing a pre-order for an L2 just for that. My only gripe is the 150Lm setting on H2 instead of M1. I'm probably just going to wait it out until zebralight redesigns their ui a bit. 

I love my SC500 and use the 270Lm setting most of the time. I would love to be able to easily switch between a 330Lm setting and 150Lm. I would be all over one for that.


----------



## tacticalpineapple

jbrett14 said:


> I live in the thumb, in the small town of Imlay City. How about you?
> 
> Sure sounds like yours is indeed defective. I was hoping this wasn't the case, as I just ordered one.




I'm out in Detroit.


----------



## verysimple

Just got my sc600 mkII, put a new 18650 in it and now the battery is stuck inside.. Whats the trick to get the battery out?


----------



## jbrett14

tacticalpineapple said:


> I'm out in Detroit.



Go Tigers!


----------



## Sway

Remove the tail cap, hold the light at an angle tail end down, whack it down on a piece of wood or something similar till the battery comes out enough to get a hold on it. Do not put that battery back in the light.


----------



## stevenkelby

Or stick a strong little magnet to the battery and pull it out.

Lastly, epoxy or hot glue a bolt or other handle to the battery and pull it out when the glue sets. The glue should clean off the battery no problem once it's out.


----------



## pjandyho

verysimple said:


> Just got my sc600 mkII, put a new 18650 in it and now the battery is stuck inside.. Whats the trick to get the battery out?


What battery are you using in there? I have some Nitecore batteries and I realized they are thicker in diameter compared to the AW batteries.


----------



## verysimple

that worked thanks.. had to use pliers and destroy new 18650, but light lives on.



Sway said:


> Remove the tail cap, hold the light at an angle tail end down, whack it down on a piece of wood or something similar till the battery comes out enough to get a hold on it. Do not put that battery back in the light.


----------



## verysimple

panasonic 3400 mah protected from intl-outdoor



pjandyho said:


> What battery are you using in there? I have some Nitecore batteries and I realized they are thicker in diameter compared to the AW batteries.


----------



## verysimple

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c5fk9wro9y0



pjandyho said:


> What battery are you using in there? I have some Nitecore batteries and I realized they are thicker in diameter compared to the AW batteries.


----------



## davpet

Hi guys!

I see there is some debate about the real brightness of this light. I love mine, and I think it is bright enough, but I don't know if it is really 900 lumens. So, a few days ago I purchased a Lupine Piko TL Mini Max, which is supposed to be 1200 lumens, and with a (closet)bounce test I compared it to the SC600 II. According to my measurements, the piko is more than 1.6x brighter than the SC600 II. (1660 lux vs. 987 lux in a ceiling bounce test). Even without a lux meter, it's obviously brighter. The situation was similar when I compared the S6330 with the Betty TL S. (you can read about it in the S6330 thread). So, either there is a problem with Zebralight's measurements, or the Lupines are over-performing.


----------



## fnj

We all understand that lux and lumens (and candela for that matter) measure completely different things, right? "Bright" is sufficiently vague that it could mean any of those. However, if you contest lumen output, you have to be measuring lumens.


----------



## davpet

And this is why you don't point the light directly to the lux meter, but perform a ceiling bounce test. This way, of course you won't get the actual lumen output of the light, but if you test more than one, you can easily estimate the output ratio among them. Selfbuilt does the same thing in his tests.


----------



## fnj

No, actually you can't test lumens with a lux meter at all.


----------



## jbrett14

I think the point was, as davpet stated: "you can easily estimate the output ratio among them"


----------



## davpet

I can roughly tell if the total light output between two sources are the same or not. If for example I turn a light on to a level where it puts out 1000 lumens, and in a bounce test the lux meter shows 500 lux, and I crank it up to the 2000 lumen mode, the meter will show cc. 1000 lux. (this was just an example) Good enough for me, and a lot of other people use this method here on this forum.


----------



## jbrett14

I agree, it's a great way to quickly give a comparison of various lights.


----------



## Beacon of Light

Heres hoping ZL eventually let's us able to program H1 to L1 levels in any of the 96 levels available. The it would be truly a customizable light we would all love and cherish.



BababooeyHTJ said:


> I'm really fond of the neutral tint on my H602 and an considering placing a pre-order for an L2 just for that. My only gripe is the 150Lm setting on H2 instead of M1. I'm probably just going to wait it out until zebralight redesigns their ui a bit.
> 
> I love my SC500 and use the 270Lm setting most of the time. I would love to be able to easily switch between a 330Lm setting and 150Lm. I would be all over one for that.


----------



## Beacon of Light

Got my SC600 mkII from E2 and it arrived flawless. Didn't really need a flashlight as all I use are headlamps now, but for $62 OR $89 with a Xtar VP-1 charger (which I opted to go with as I love the VP1 I already own, but having ability to charge 4 18650 cells, now I am complete) it was a no-brainer. Great deal and great light. Only nitpicks are the greenish tint not so great and the roughness of the finishing near the on/off switch could be smoother. As always ZL's UI is impeccable and second to none! This was also purchased to tide me over until they get the coo white versions of the H600/H602/H52/H32 and H302 headlamps in.


----------



## moozooh

The output ratio of ceiling bounce tests will always be skewed towards the more throwy lights if lux meter is located near the light, since more rays will be sent back directly towards the sensor rather than in random directions. Positioning the meter father from the source, on the other hand, may skew the results towards the flooder. Ceiling itself, or rather its finish, also matter, obviously. All in all not a very reliable metric, especially if done in an unprepared space...


----------



## BababooeyHTJ

verysimple said:


> Just got my sc600 mkII, put a new 18650 in it and now the battery is stuck inside.. Whats the trick to get the battery out?



I have a couple of 3400mah panasonics from fasttech that fit super tight too. I just remove the tail cap and and flick my wrist. That always does the trick. I have one battery that fits so tight that it makes a pop sound on the way out. Thankfully the battery chamber in the H602 is a hair wider and longer. I assume that the new SC600 MKii l2 has the larger tube too.



Beacon of Light said:


> Heres hoping ZL eventually let's us able to program H1 to L1 levels in any of the 96 levels available. The it would be truly a customizable light we would all love and cherish.



This is exactly what I'm holding out for myself.


----------



## thedoc007

moozooh said:


> The output ratio of ceiling bounce tests will always be skewed towards the more throwy lights if lux meter is located near the light, since more rays will be sent back directly towards the sensor rather than in random directions. Positioning the meter father from the source, on the other hand, may skew the results towards the flooder. Ceiling itself, or rather its finish, also matter, obviously. All in all not a very reliable metric, especially if done in an unprepared space...



Again, if you are trying to get an exact number, you are correct. It isn't going to tell you if a light is 982 or 1015 lumens. But if you are comparing different lights, and just want to get an approximate ratio, it works quite well. While different surfaces do indeed change the reading, the RELATIVE difference between two lights shining at the same surface is still valid.


----------



## jbrett14

thedoc007 said:


> Again, if you are trying to get an exact number, you are correct. It isn't going to tell you if a light is 982 or 1015 lumens. But if you are comparing different lights, and just want to get an approximate ratio, it works quite well. While different surfaces do indeed change the reading, the RELATIVE difference between two lights shining at the same surface is still valid.



I agree, it does work well, especially when comparing similarly shaped beams of lights. Thus far, I would say all of my lux tests are consistent with what I actually see outdoors in the dark.


----------



## carl

Derek Dean said:


> What's impressive to me about the new specs., is that the runtime has almost doubled at the 65 lumen level, compared to my original ZL SC600, from 18 hours to 30 hours. That's quite an increase in a level that I use frequently. Very nice indeed.



I am assuming those new lumen numbers only apply for the first few minutes until it throttles down as the LED heats up - in which case efficiency is probably not changed much.

And on the topic of heat build-up, is the LED mounted on a thick backplate for good heat transfer - rather than a thin one?


----------



## moozooh

It shouldn't throttle at lower levels—only the higher two are PID-controlled, and the numbers are measured by ANSI standards (i.e. sustained output rather than initial burst).


----------



## ozzy1990

Ok so, Zebralight SC600 Mark II XM-L vs SC600w Mk II L2 XM-L2 is it really worth the extra $30?


----------



## T0rch

ozzy1990 said:


> Ok so, Zebralight SC600 Mark II XM-L vs SC600w Mk II L2 XM-L2 is it really worth the extra $30?


 For me yes it is because the old SC600 Mk II XM-L steps down after 5 minutes where, if I'm understanding correctly, the new SC600 Mk II XM-L2 does not.


----------



## ozzy1990

Does this have the same beam pattern as the headlamp version? I love my hw600 but I want something with a tighter beam.


----------



## carl

moozooh said:


> It shouldn't throttle at lower levels—only the higher two are PID-controlled, and the numbers are measured by ANSI standards (i.e. sustained output rather than initial burst).



Oh, ok then.

But what about the heat transfer path? Is the LED mounted on a thick backplate for good heat transfer - rather than a thin one?


----------



## carl

duplicate post - my computer is going south...


----------



## noboneshotdog

carl said:


> Oh, ok then.
> 
> But what about the heat transfer path? Is the LED mounted on a thick backplate for good heat transfer - rather than a thin one?



Zebralight makes the entire light (except battery cap) from a single piece of aluminum and mounts there led directly to that aluminum stock. The heat transfer path is really good on these lights. Some model descriptions also mention this heat sinking method in the list of features.


----------



## carl

noboneshotdog said:


> Zebralight makes the entire light (except battery cap) from a single piece of aluminum and mounts there led directly to that aluminum stock. The heat transfer path is really good on these lights. Some model descriptions also mention this heat sinking method in the list of features.



Excellent! Thanks for the info!

BTW, anybody know how thick the LED aluminum mount thickness is?


----------



## StarHalo

L2 shipping date has passed, let's hear some reviews..


----------



## sdr

I was pleasantly surprised to see that ZebraLight's website was showing the Mk II L2 in stock yesterday. Having gone down a dark road with ZL in the past by placing a pre-order, this time I waited until I saw them "In Stock." I pulled the trigger yesterday and I'm hoping to see one in my hot little hands sometime next week. *he said, with fingers crossed* 

My SC600 Mk I @750Lm has seen daily service for exactly 2 years (since Nov. 2011) and has earned a rest. I'll be happy to share my thoughts once the Mk II L2 arrives.


----------



## sdr

Wow! That was Fast. I just checked the ZebraLight website and it's now showing the SC600 Mk II L2 on "Back Order." Hopefully mine will ship in the next few days. It said they were "In Stock" when I placed my order 12 hours ago. Time will tell, I guess? *fingers crossed a little tighter*


----------



## noboneshotdog

sdr said:


> Wow! That was Fast. I just checked the ZebraLight website and it's now showing the SC600 Mk II L2 on "Back Order." Hopefully mine will ship in the next few days. It said they were "In Stock" when I placed my order 12 hours ago. Time will tell, I guess? *fingers crossed a little tighter*



Hate to put a wrench in your hopes but this is Zebralights response to my inquiry of whether or not they were on schedule with there initial release date: I asked them in the beginning of this week......

Department: Sales

Subject: SC600 MKII L2

Shipping has started for US and oversea orders. The current lead time (from the time you place your order to shipping) is about 4 weeks.

Sincerely,

ZebraLight, Inc.
2908 Story Rd. W
Irving, TX 75038


----------



## markr6

You would think they would get so sick and tired of replying to emails and wasting time that they would instead:

1. Push [already over-optimistic] ETAs out another month or so
2. Don't put products on "backorder" or "preorder" so far ahead
3. Push up their sleeves and get an huge inventory produced FIRST, then start the hype, then satisfy 10x the amount of customers by having them in stock

I know I'm not the only one asking them for updates. Then you have vendors, and how many other flashaholics out there besides this forum? They should make it easier on themselves IMO.


----------



## Razzle

For those that already have the new one......should I buy it or save thirty five bux and purchase the previous model?


----------



## KITROBASKIN

noboneshotdog said:


> Hate to put a wrench in your hopes... The current lead time (from the time you place your order to shipping) is about 4 weeks.



We also need to remember that 4 weeks in "Zebralight time" is either 'a couple of months' or 'eventually'


----------



## sdr

I just sent them an email to inquire about the order I placed yesterday. I'll wait to see what their response is before I cancel my order. As I mentioned above, the only reason I placed the order was because their website indicated that the MK II in Cool White was "In Stock." It had previously shown it as being on "Pre-Order." 

I went through this BS with ZL when trying to get the first Mk II. After waiting forever I finally cancelled the Mk II and ordered an ArmyTek Predator which I got within a week. 

I love my first generation SC600 Mk I and carry it everyday--have for the past 2 years. Sad that ZebraLight cannot achieve and maintain an inventory on the lights they produce. They have a great product. But that's meaningless if you can't get it into the hands of the people who want it. Like I said, I will wait to see how they respond to my email before I cancel my order. But cancel I will if they do the "back order, pre-order" dance with me AGAIN!


----------



## noboneshotdog

sdr said:


> I just sent them an email to inquire about the order I placed yesterday. I'll wait to see what their response is before I cancel my order. As I mentioned above, the only reason I placed the order was because their website indicated that the MK II in Cool White was "In Stock." It had previously shown it as being on "Pre-Order."
> 
> I went through this BS with ZL when trying to get the first Mk II. After waiting forever I finally cancelled the Mk II and ordered an ArmyTek Predator which I got within a week.
> 
> I love my first generation SC600 Mk I and carry it everyday--have for the past 2 years. Sad that ZebraLight cannot achieve and maintain an inventory on the lights they produce. They have a great product. But that's meaningless if you can't get it into the hands of the people who want it. Like I said, I will wait to see how they respond to my email before I cancel my order. But cancel I will if they do the "back order, pre-order" dance with me AGAIN!



I did the same dance with the SC600 MKII as well and cancelled with them too. Found that there distributors were getting their stock out quicker than Zebralight was, so went thru E2 Field Gear, a US seller. Have mine on preorder with them as we speak. Seems like ZL has gotten a few lights out and have seen a pic of one on the SC600 MK II L2 preorder thread on CPF. At this point no US based orders confirmed yet.


----------



## moozooh

So you already have the original SC600, and you want the new model, but the wait is killing you somehow? Not defending ZL's dubious timing announcement practices, but can't understand your rage either. It's not like you're left without a light in the meantime. In practice it's going to be barely different from the original SC600.


----------



## sdr

moozooh said:


> So you already have the original SC600, and you want the new model, but the wait is killing you somehow? Not defending ZL's dubious timing announcement practices, but can't understand your rage either. It's not like you're left without a light in the meantime. In practice it's going to be barely different from the original SC600.



My friend, I believe that you are missing the point? I have plenty of lights. And, yes, I do already have an SC600 Mk I which I love. ZebraLight makes a great product, there's no disputing that. My frustration is with their business model. They hype their products but you can't get your hands on them. That's what I'm outraged about. I waited for months on a pre-order for a Mk II and ended up cancelling in favor of another company's product that I could get. I swore that I would never do that again. Yesterday I ordered a Mk II L2 ONLY because their website indicated that they were "In Stock." Which, I believe, would be a reasonable assumption considering the pre-order ship date was supposed to be Oct. 29. Today their website says they are on "Back Order" for the Cool White version, which is the one I paid for. I am awaiting a response to my email asking them whether they actually had the light I paid for yesterday or if the "In Stock" sign was just a mistake and I actually paid for a light to be delivered at some distant date in the vague and nebulous future? If I paid for a light that was in stock, then fine. But if what I paid for was a few months of anticipation/frustration, well, then I have better use for my money.

Cheers!


----------



## moozooh

You're spot-on—I'm still missing the point.

From here it looks this way: 1) ZL hasn't yet confirmed the light indeed wasn't in stock at the time you placed the order, nor had the time to apologize if that was a mistake, yet you're already raging; 2) you're impatient enough to withdraw your money and spend it on another light, leading me to believe it needed not be SC600 mkII L2 in particular. (Which, considering you already have plenty of lights, makes your "better use for money" comment slightly ironic.) Correct me if I'm wrong on any of these counts.

Looks like you'll get what you want in either case, and ZL will be directly or indirectly punished if they were playing foul anyway. So what's the reason for the rage?


----------



## sdr

moozooh said:


> You're spot-on—I'm still missing the point.
> 
> From here it looks this way: 1) ZL hasn't yet confirmed the light indeed wasn't in stock at the time you placed the order, nor had the time to apologize if that was a mistake, yet you're already raging; 2) you're impatient enough to withdraw your money and spend it on another light, leading me to believe it needed not be SC600 mkII L2 in particular. (Which, considering you already have plenty of lights, makes your "better use for money" comment slightly ironic.) Correct me if I'm wrong on any of these counts.
> 
> Looks like you'll get what you want in either case, and ZL will be directly or indirectly punished if they were playing foul anyway. So what's the reason for the rage?



Forgive me, but I'm at a bit of a loss for your concern in this matter? Unless of course you're just trying to bait me? In which case I will simply bid you a good day.

Cheers, my friend!


----------



## jbrett14

sdr: I completely understand your frustrations. However, is it so much that ZL "hypes their products" or that WE are the ones guilty of doing that?

From my perspective, the only people I see "hyping" these lights are USERS. Perhaps if we could tame our addictions then our frustrations would be minimal.

I love ZL lights as much as the next guy, but at some point, we must learn to be patient and realize that the ZL company, although able to make great lights, is questionable regarding some business practices.


----------



## Razzle

I'm just gonna buy the "old" model for sixty five bucks.


----------



## jbrett14

Razzle said:


> I'm just gonna buy the "old" model for sixty five bucks.



That is what I recently did. It's a great light, but if your main goal is just to get a bunch of high quality light in such a small package, I recommend the UltraFire UF-T50 for half the cost, and it doesn't get as hot. It's output is nearly identical to the ZL.

If money is not tight, however, then the ZL UI may be worth every penny to ya.


----------



## sdr

Well, I think this says it all...


User/DateMessage*Customer*
11/2/2013 3:02:20 PMHowdy!

I placed an order yesterday for a new SC600 MkII L2 Cool White because your website said that it was "In Stock." Today I notice that your site shows that this light is now on "Back Order." Can you tell me if the light I ordered will be shipping soon or if I will be waiting for you to re-stock? In other words, was it in stock when I ordered and will it be shipping soon?

Thanks,

sdr




*Staff (Administrator)*
11/2/2013 7:53:11 PMIt was our mistake, it should be 'back order'. 

The estimated shipping date is around three weeks. Let us know if you don't want to wait, 
and cancel for refund.



*Customer*
11/3/2013 12:32:55 AMCancel my order and refund my money!


----------



## KITROBASKIN

jbrett14 said:


> That is what I recently did. It's a great light, but if your main goal is just to get a bunch of high quality light in such a small package, I recommend the UltraFire UF-T50 for half the cost, and it doesn't get as hot. It's output is nearly identical to the ZL.
> 
> If money is not tight, however, then the ZL UI may be worth every penny to ya.



Tight money or not, it doesn't look like the Ultrafire uf t50 has a low,low or even a low brightness setting. The few reviews I saw (on FastTech) mentioned that it gets very hot on the high setting and finding the switch can take some searching. For maybe $25 more, one can get the original MKII? Definitely worth it in my book. I ordered an SC52 from Illumination Supply last spring. They had it in stock, Zebralight.com did not. It came in a few days, no fuss, no muss.

Seems like if someone wants to, maybe rant a little about ZL behavior, not that big a deal. We would like to think ZL is listening. They should. Maybe they can sell all the torches their Chinese factory can assemble. One of the respected modders on this forum holds the opinion that ZL is second only to Surefire in build quality and therefore a very good value. 
And while I am not going to spend time defending that opinion, it is frustrating when we read one thing from ZL but quite another thing happens, or nothing happens. Better to vent here than with our loved ones at home don't you think? And that includes the household pets OK?


----------



## jbrett14

KITROBASKIN said:


> Tight money or not, it doesn't look like the Ultrafire uf t50 has a low,low or even a low brightness setting. The few reviews I saw (on FastTech) mentioned that it gets very hot on the high setting and finding the switch can take some searching. For maybe $25 more, one can get the original MKII? Definitely worth it in my book. I ordered an SC52 from Illumination Supply last spring. They had it in stock, Zebralight.com did not. It came in a few days, no fuss, no muss.



I hear ya. ZL does seem to have the very best range of brightness, and I can see why this would be a factor for those who find those low lows important.

To anyone who is not that concerned with low lows, and who is looking to spend less money, I can assure you that the UltraFire UF-T50 does NOT get nearly as hot as the ZL. In fact, it's not even close. The ZL is MUCH hotter. Just trying to help anyone out there who may desire a VERY BRIGHT and good quality light without having to spend more money than they need to. Interestingly, the UltraFire actually has more modes within it's lowest & highest output due to it's variable output. But it doesn't go as low as the ZL.


----------



## fnj

Assuming Ultrafire is not lying about its 2.5A drive level and 800 lumens, if then it does not "get hot" then it can only be because it has garbage thermal design and the heat is not being conducted adequately out of the LED. There is no magic way to prevent heat at a given current level in a given LED. All you can do is slow - for a time - a whole heck of a lot of heat getting away from the LED itself into the body of the light, which is where it belongs.

The reason the ZL gets warm fast is because its thermal design is doing its job very efficiently. Any fool can put a LED in a tube and make it light brightly. Only somebody who cares enough to have the LED live longer than a few hours, and has the design expertise and engineering ability can give it a proper thermal design.


----------



## KITROBASKIN

Thanks to jbrett14 we have another option to consider and others who can speak from another perspective about thermal management etc. No one should feel the need to defend ZL based on what was said here, don't you think? Thank You all for making this forum so informative.


----------



## jbrett14

fnj said:


> Assuming Ultrafire is not lying about its 2.5A drive level and 800 lumens, if then it does not "get hot" then it can only be because it has garbage thermal design and the heat is not being conducted adequately out of the LED. There is no magic way to prevent heat at a given current level in a given LED. All you can do is slow - for a time - a whole heck of a lot of heat getting away from the LED itself into the body of the light, which is where it belongs.
> 
> The reason the ZL gets warm fast is because its thermal design is doing its job very efficiently. Any fool can put a LED in a tube and make it light brightly. Only somebody who cares enough to have the LED live longer than a few hours, and has the design expertise and engineering ability can give it a proper thermal design.



Seems logical to me. Thanks for your input. I suppose time will tell. It will be interesting to see which of these two lights stands the test of time. I will be sure to use my TrustFire as much as my ZL. If, after a year or two, the TrustFire still puts out the same amount and quality of light as the ZL, then I would say that TrustFire figured out a way to design a reliable BRIGHT light without having to get so darn hot. Note: the TrustFire DOES get very warm, but not HOT like the ZL.


----------



## LeukTech

A host getting hot is a very good thing in my book, and should never be considered a con. The faster a host heats up when pushing 2+ amps, is a good indication of the hosts heat-sinking quality (it does depend on the size of the host too, as more material will = longer time to heat up).


----------



## BWX

LeukTech said:


> A host getting hot is a very good thing in my book, and should never be considered a con. The faster a host heats up when pushing 2+ amps, is a good indication of the hosts heat-sinking quality (it does depend on the size of the host too, as more material will = longer time to heat up).



Exactly my thinking. I like how fast my SC600 MKI B heats up on highest output. If it didn't I'd be worried, and the LED would probably not have long to live.


----------



## StarHalo

In case you missed it, Selfbuilt reviews the L2.


----------



## jakepen

What battery should I use? As far as a rechargeable 18650 goes. What's the best battery, should it be button top or not?


----------



## noboneshotdog

I use AW 18650 3100mah batteries w no problem. The 3400s will work too if your looking for the latest and greatest. I will be purchasing some in the near future myself. You can get them in the sellers section of cpf. These are flat tops btw.


----------



## toysareforboys

jakepen said:


> What battery should I use? As far as a rechargeable 18650 goes. What's the best battery, should it be button top or not?


http://www.fasttech.com/products/0/10001980/1141100-panasonic-ncr18650b-rechargeable-3400mah-3-7v

Flat top work great. 

-Jamie M.


----------



## jakepen

Ok, how is the spill on this light? I'm looking for a edc that is just s wall of light.


----------



## toysareforboys

jakepen said:


> Ok, how is the spill on this light? I'm looking for a edc that is just s wall of light.


I wouldn't really call it a wall of light, but it is very floody and impressive none the less. It's still great for EDC, awesome interface (can be turned on directly into moonlight mode and turbo mode at any time, one button press, sweet!), amazing brightness for its size, uses 18650 battery, takes a beatin and keeps on tickin (judging by the amount of times I've dropped mine on concrete and it still works 100%).

And yes, the colour of the beam *IS* that ugly! lol.

SC600MKii Turbo:












Not quite super comfy for EDC but here's my 1x26650 P60 style full copper 4 x Nichia 219's at a hair over 2 amps each, TiR optics.






So schmexy.

And just for S&G here's my SRK (real/3xTerroid version):






-Jamie M.


----------



## jakepen

You don't like the color of the beam?


----------



## toysareforboys

jakepen said:


> You don't like the color of the beam?


Ewwwww no! It's the worst out of any flashlight I own! Even my $5 SK68 looks way better. Compare the SRK to the MKii in the above pictures, that's a bone stock cool white SRK!! lol.

I'll be throwing this one in the trash and picking up the SC600MKii Warm U2 version once it's out.

-Jamie M.


----------



## StarHalo

toysareforboys said:


> I'll be throwing this one in the trash



I'll gladly cover the cost of shipping and take it off your hands.


----------



## BirdofPrey

toysareforboys said:


> Ewwwww no! It's the worst out of any flashlight I own!



I personally love the tint of my H602. 



Sent from my ridiculously large Galaxy Note 2.


----------



## toysareforboys

StarHalo said:


> I'll gladly cover the cost of shipping and take it off your hands.


haha, thanks  I'll "hand me down" this one through the family. The person due next in line for it is currently using my old SC600w so I'm not too sure he'll like the beam colour in this one very much  If he doesn't like it I'll throw it up for sale.

-Jamie M.


----------



## jakepen

So the mk2 is an ugly tint? A little yellow or greenish. Not a pure white?


----------



## toysareforboys

jakepen said:


> So the mk2 is an ugly tint? A little yellow or greenish. Not a pure white?


Mine to my eyes is greenish in the middle/hot spot and purple ish in the corona around it (not the purple ish part at the edge of the spill because of the IR coated lens). It all depends on your eyes though, to some people it's fine, but the green in it really bothers me.

I just pre-ordered the SC600*w* MKii L2 from Illumination Supply for an INSANE deal: http://www.cpfmarketplace.com/mp/sh...s-SC600-MKII-L2-SC600W-MKII-L2-Gen-1-Clerance

If I'm not happy with the tint I'll get the LED swapped out.

I'd hope that even the non w/warm version of the new L2 model has a better tint than the old MKii.

-Jamie M.


----------



## KITROBASKIN

toysareforboys said:


> http://www.fasttech.com/products/0/10001980/1141100-panasonic-ncr18650b-rechargeable-3400mah-3-7v
> 
> Flat top work great.
> 
> -Jamie M.



I have had good luck with FastTech. Are those batteries protected? I'm thinking not. Is FastTech shipping batteries by surface because of the aircraft issues with LiPo's? If that is the case, we're talking a few weeks, maybe 4 if I'm not mistaken.


----------



## toysareforboys

KITROBASKIN said:


> I have had good luck with FastTech. Are those batteries protected? I'm thinking not. Is FastTech shipping batteries by surface because of the aircraft issues with LiPo's? If that is the case, we're talking a few weeks, maybe 4 if I'm not mistaken.


Flat tops are non-protected. But if you use them in the SC600 you DON'T need protected  It has low voltage protection already.

Not sure on their shipping issues, I've always gotten my batteries from them super fast!

-Jamie M.


----------



## fnj

Just throwing this in. Every XML or XML-2 light I have ever seen has that stomach wrenching putrid lemon lime ring.


----------



## markr6

toysareforboys said:


> Flat tops are non-protected. But if you use them in the SC600 you DON'T need protected  It has low voltage protection already.
> 
> Not sure on their shipping issues, I've always gotten my batteries from them super fast!
> 
> -Jamie M.



+1 on all this!


----------



## srg818

toysareforboys said:


> I just pre-ordered the SC600*w* MKii L2 from Illumination Supply for an INSANE deal: http://www.cpfmarketplace.com/mp/sh...s-SC600-MKII-L2-SC600W-MKII-L2-Gen-1-Clerance



$95? Isn't that the regular price for the SC600*w* MKii L2?


----------



## tonkem

srg818 said:


> $95? Isn't that the regular price for the SC600*w* MKii L2?



Yes. But with the coupon noted in the cpf dealer section it is a great price. I pre ordered mine. Bad news is fell to early December.


----------



## toysareforboys

srg818 said:


> $95? Isn't that the regular price for the SC600*w* MKii L2?


It's the REGULAR price, but who pays regular prices? lol. Send them a message and ask for the best coupon code 

-Jamie M.


----------



## SYKO

(where's the delete option?:duh2


----------



## SYKO

tonkem said:


> Yes. But with the coupon noted in the cpf dealer section it is a great price. I pre ordered mine. Bad news is fell to early December.



Are you talking about an order from Illumination Supply? I have a SC600 MKii L2 preorder and was told a few days ago ZL is taking probably another 2 weeks until they ship. I hope they hurry up and send these lights out asap.​


----------



## markr6

SYKO said:


> Are you talking about an order from Illumination Supply? I have a SC600 MKii L2 preorder and was told a few days ago ZL is taking probably another 2 weeks until they ship. I hope they hurry up and send these lights out asap.​



Yes, December now. UGH! I need a new hobby!


----------



## bjt3833

For those worried about backorder time, I ordered my L2 from Zebralight on the 7th and it shipped the 11th even tho they'd told me 3 week wait so they're definitely getting them in and out ASAP. It seems they're taking care of their own orders first, as they should be.


----------



## P1X4R

i ordered direct from zebralight. it was an "in stock" item. ordered on a friday and received a shipping notice on the following tuesday.


----------



## ChessFan

I have made some runtime tests with my SC600 MKII. Voltages have been measured without too much rest (between 30 seconds and 1 minute), unless otherwise specified. At the max output it did make sense to add a second measurement after 2 minutes, due to the higher voltage sag.
Rested voltages could be extrapolated using this excellent resource by HKJ:

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?345795

I have also added corrected values, as my multimeter is not particularly accurate (sorry for that), but adding 0.04 Volts to all the values comes quite close to reality.
Current drain is an approximation, but shouldn't be too far off.
Runtimes were measured until the light stepped down to medium for the H2 tests. The runtime on H1 (max mode) is calculated based on cumulative 5 minute runs, also until stepdown to medium.
It is interesting to see how the flashlight's battery capacity checker reacts to the battery's state of charge.


----------



## moozooh

Thanks a lot for the test. I suppose you turned off the light every time the stepdown timer lowered the output, is that right? 62 minutes is an okay time assuming it really draws 3 amps. The new L2, on the other hand, only seems to last 45-ish minutes at pretty much the same brightness (extrapolating from selfbuilt's 3100 mAh test figures)?


----------



## ChessFan

Yes, I have turned off the light right after the stepdown to 500 Lm. So I did 2 consecutive 5 minute runs before every voltage measurement, except for the last one where the light stepped down to medium after almost 2 minutes. My light actually steps down from max after 5 minutes and 2 second, my reaction time was around 1 second, so every run took approximately 5 min 3 sec. 

I am also somewhat puzzled by the over 60 minutes of runtime, compared to the L2's 42 minutes with a NCR18650A, which shouldn't be driven much harder for a bit higher output. It's quite a difference. Maybe it has something to do with the fact that I've used an unprotected NCR18650B, with a lower voltage sag than the protected ones, added to the fact that the NCR18650A is notorious for a higher voltage sag than the NCR18650B.






A test of the MKII L2 with a 3400 mAh Panasonic would be interesting, then we would know.


----------



## SYKO

Come on already, I hate waiting on stuff especially if I already paid for it.


----------



## sam7

SYKO said:


> Come on already, I hate waiting on stuff especially if I already paid for it.


 Yeah, I finally cancelled. I like their lights, but I got tired of parking my money in their bank. Probably I'll be back when can stock the product.


----------



## markr6

sam7 said:


> Probably I'll be back when can stock the product.



Hopefully you're very young! I'm 32 years old but will probably be long gone by then


----------



## SYKO

lol...^

But seriously, I'm worried about all this talk about purple tint. If mine is like that I'm sending it back and will probably sell my 2x 18650 I have now, the other 2 from fasttech that are probably still in Hong Kong,plus my new 18650 charger.

I should just cancel the fasttech order anyway, I don't need 4x18650 batteries for a single battery light.:shakehead


----------



## P1X4R

the only purple tint i'm seeing is if you look at the business end from an angle (not directly, lol). it's probably the glass and outer reflector ring creating this. however, it does not show on the beam at all. mine's the cool white version. very happy with it.


----------



## StarHalo

SYKO said:


> I should just cancel the fasttech order anyway, I don't need 4x18650 batteries for a single battery light.:shakehead



Change the man to fit the clothes; buy three more lights..


----------



## KITROBASKIN

P1X4R said:


> the only purple tint i'm seeing is if you look at the business end from an angle (not directly, lol). it's probably the glass and outer reflector ring creating this. however, it does not show on the beam at all. mine's the cool white version. very happy with it.



Thanks for the report.


----------



## SYKO

StarHalo said:


> Change the man to fit the clothes; buy three more lights..




Figured someone would say something like this soon enough on CPF. I would like to but have other things calling for my money.
Trying to buy things slowly to save my bank account.





P1X4R said:


> the only purple tint i'm seeing is if you look at the business end from an angle (not directly, lol). it's probably the glass and outer reflector ring creating this. however, it does not show on the beam at all. mine's the cool white version. very happy with it.



That's good to hear,order the cool white and hopefully it's like yours.


----------



## noboneshotdog

Just got an update from e2 field gear. He just got a tracking # for a partial shipment of the L2. Only has cw in stock for the moment due to high demand for the nw for preorder. Looks like these are finally being shipped to US based distributors!


----------



## ozzy1990

Mine should be here Saturday according to the tracking info


----------



## ozzy1990

Its here


----------



## toysareforboys

ozzy1990 said:


> Its here


OMG beamshots!

-Jamie M.


----------



## AmperSand

Mine too!


----------



## AmperSand

The herd is expanding!


----------



## m1ke

I'm jealous. Still waiting for the postman.


----------



## SYKO

How do you Australian blokes get your lights already.:ironic: I'm in Texas and still don't have mine. I live about 300 miles away from Zebralight.
Anyway,pics please and where did you guys order your light from?


----------



## bodhran

SYKO...could be when you placed your order and who you ordered from. I've had mine for 3 weeks now. Order placed 9/30 from the Zebralight USA site for a ZL SC600w MkII L2.


----------



## m1ke

Ugh, just got an email informing me it could take six weeks for delivery.


----------



## AmperSand

I preordered the minute it went up for preorder. Direct from zebralight. It shipped on 29th oct, arrived 22nd nov. I did however move houses inbetween and have mail redirection etc when it was supposed to arrive. May have added a few days to delivery


----------



## CrazyM

Can anyone who has received their new SC600 MkII L2 please leave it on H1 for 5-10 minutes and then report on how hot the light is getting? I'm interested to know what temperature the PID control is set at, if its warm, hot, or burning...


----------



## AmperSand

Id say hot. Its more than warm but I wouldn't say burning either. It all heats very quickly (great thermal path) and doesnt escalate in heat much.


----------



## CrazyM

Thanks for that Amper. Much appreciated


----------



## evgeniy

Anyone try to use Keeppower 3400 in SC600w mkII L2 (latest model) ?


----------



## AmperSand

Tight fit. I have a 3100mah that fits good, but 3400 I have 2 of both are tight but do go in, work but are just a little difficult to remove. They fit my sc600 mkii fine however.


----------



## SYKO

You guys going to do some beamshots for us with nothing in our hands? The outdoor kind mainly.


----------



## AmperSand

Silly me. I Love forgot one of the herd!


----------



## toysareforboys

AmperSand said:


> Silly me. I Love forgot one of the herd!


Wow, that SC500 MKii is pretty beat up! 

-Jamie M.


----------



## AmperSand

Yeah it's had a useful life


----------



## AmperSand

I've had to file the bezel area a few times from dings etc that were sharp. Still operates perfectly tho. Takes a good beating and still performs outstandingly!


----------



## markr6

I like seeing all the updates...getting really anxious for mine to ship! I'm sure it will come one of these years.


----------



## TouchOfRed

Not sure, this one or PD35?


----------



## AmperSand

Personal preference I guess.
There is a huge size difference. More mode choices on sc600 mkii l2.
I like low lows too. If I had to pick one over the other it would be the zebralight. I use cpf mentality and got both however


----------



## evgeniy

AmperSand said:


> Tight fit. I have a 3100mah that fits good, but 3400 I have 2 of both are tight but do go in, work but are just a little difficult to remove. They fit my sc600 mkii fine however.



Thank you !


----------



## TSD

AmperSand, would you compare the beam of the two? I will be picking up a SC600 MKII L2 in the future, but I am wondering if the beam of the PD35 has any advantages over the Zebralight. From what I gather, the zebralight has larger (brighter too?) spill, and as large or larger of a hotspot. Also, which one throws further? Selfbuilt measured the zebra L2 at 10,600lux, while the PD35 is listed at 8600cd.

Also, great side by side! I think that is the best picture showing the size difference I have seen yet.


----------



## AmperSand

I will try to when I get a chance tonight. Its a hard comparison because I believe the reflector sits far too low in my sample of the SC600w Mkii L2 so it screws the beam/throw up a little bit IMO. The reflector height of my SC600 Mkii is far better. And the PD35 appears to have a perfectly seated reflector also.
I love the tint of the SC600W Mkii L2 but the reflector being too low peeves me a bit. Had the same prob with the original SC600 I have, but you can open the front of it and put a spacer in to raise it a little.
Zebralight really need to consider that even if the reflector is .5mm to 1mm too low its going to have an effect on the beam. I have been tossing up whether or not I should raise this with them or if its something I can live with because it doesnt affect the beam _that_ much, but for the SC600 Mkii and SC600w Mkii L2 sharing the same reflector, the beamshapes do look different to my eye, I'd say my reflector sits maybe .5mm too deep, not much I know.


----------



## evgeniy

AmperSand said:


> Tight fit. I have a 3100mah that fits good, but 3400 I have 2 of both are tight but do go in, work but are just a little difficult to remove. They fit my sc600 mkii fine however.



Today I received Keeppower 3400. Not fit in SC600 mkII, not fit to H600w.
I removed external black layer, and re-packed with blue shrinking (from Fasttech), with this shink battery tight fits in both flashlights.


----------



## AmperSand

I think there is a lot of variance with the 3400mah cells. I have 2 and one fits better than the other, but even the best fitting one takes some work to get out, it won't just slide out easily like my 3100mah cells


----------



## AmperSand

Infact, most of the issues I've encountered with them is how the thin connection that runs from the pcb along the length of the battery sometimes has a kink at the end and adds to the OD of the cell at one end.


----------



## TSD

Ampersand, did you get a chance to compare the Zebra SC600 L2 beam to the PD35? I'm anxiously awaiting your input!


----------



## noboneshotdog

Got my SC600 MKII L2 yesterday and AW 3400s fit with no problem at all, just as smooth as my AW 3100s. There tough to find these days, but Vapor Kings has them in stock w very fast US shipping.


----------



## m1ke

Received my Mk II L2 this week, thankfully it arrived long before I expected. I love this light—it's a real monster for its size. Great UI, great power. I went for the cool white for the extra brightness.


----------



## LEDburn

m1ke said:


> Received my Mk II L2 this week, thankfully it arrived long before I expected. I love this light—it's a real monster for its size. Great UI, great power. I went for the cool white for the extra brightness.



Same here, I was expecting to find a H52fw when I opened the package but was quite surprised to see my SC600w L2 which shipped two weeks after the H52fw did. Now I am a bit worried that my headlamp might have been lost in the mail 

In any case I am very happy with the new and improved SC600w as (on my sample at least) the beam is much whiter and definitely brighter than my previous one. The beam is certainly a tad cooler at 4400K but I think it is just about perfect. 
I chose the neutral version because the difference in output between the two is 80 lumens which at the 1000 lumen level is definitely not going to be very noticeable but the difference in tint absolutely will be. 
To each his own I say! I prefer neutral so would have still been happy with less than 1000 lumens. The better feel the light has in my hands, the lower lows and increased efficiency are mainly what I was after.


----------



## blackFFM

ZL send me a cool white instead the nw I ordered and responded never to my email. Not a fan of their new anodizing so I let this light go.


----------



## pomp92

After 2 *h600w, h51w and sc31w I bought one h600fw mkii L2 and a sc600w mkii L2. Damn, even Zebralight has chosen the wrong way. :shakehead

-Absolutely different tint between my two new torches (same emitter!), one is green the other pink. 
-Poor quality machining, notches on the body, especially on those stupid sharp edges. 
-Poor anodizing, smoot instead of matte, so delicate that it arrived just scratched. When i put on the clip it removed all the anodizing on the edge of the flashlight.

Sent back the SC600, kept the h600 (pink tint). I'll buy a SC600 rev B and i'll mod it with a GOOD WW LED, frosted lens and ss bezel, but Zebralight lost another customer with this new flashlights. :shakehead


----------



## b30nepi

Received my SC600w MK II L2 Today. First impressions are that I am very pleased with it. For such a tiny light it has a nice heft to it. I did not notice any problems with mode switching (low modes etc). Tint is mostly pure white. The only purple part is the very outer edge, however this seems to be from the anti reflective coating on the lens. Comparing the tint to my sc52w, the sc52w is slightly warmer than the sc600w mkii l2 on all settings for my particular lights. Comparing the two also made me realize that the difference between 500 lumens and 1000 lumens is not impressively huge (which I am also ok with). I did a fast sink test and then a shower test. The sc600w l2 passed with no water passing any seals. Running the sc600wmkii l2 on the highest mode for an extended period of time did get the light pretty hot. I was still able to hold it, however it was very close to uncomfortable. I also do not see this as a problem in particular (PID Control keeps it safe). Maybe my hands are not as tough as the rest of you flashaholics. Anodizing on my light had a matte powdery feel compared to a smooth shell feel of other models (again not a positive or negative, just an observation). The only thing I was not impressed with is the pocket clip. I wish it had the screw on type of the sc52 models. The clip still seems sturdy enough, I just prefer the other type mentioned. My final opinion that its a good light. If you really desire the sc600 mkii l2 for personal fun and collection, get it, you won't be disappointed. If you want the longer runtimes, especially in the high output modes, then also get it. However, if you do not need the extra high output for the extended runtimes in your daily use, I would purchase the sc52 model instead for its small size and ability to also provide some high output (even if for only a minute at a time). You would also have the option to use a common AA sized battery when desired.


----------



## markr6

How does everyone feel about the beam? I noticed it's quite throwier than the SC52w with a smaller hot spot, but I think thats good in a larger/higher output light. Sometimes I feel the switch is recessed TOO far, but not a big deal. The tint is perfectly white, matching my H52w - very happy with that! Overall, nothing to really complain about on this one!


----------



## m1ke

markr6 said:


> Sometimes I feel the switch is recessed TOO far, but not a big deal.


With no electronic lock-out, I actually like that.


----------



## markr6

m1ke said:


> With no electronic lock-out, I actually like that.



Yeah that was their intent...lots of complaints with the earlier models. It is good to see manufacturers listening and improving


----------



## BWX

I soldiered on and continued to EDC my MK I (B).. and the switch finally settled down and started working correctly. It was screwed up from about the 2 month mark to maybe the 6 month mark of every day use. It must have finally "broken in", and works pretty good now. Hope it continues to do so.


----------



## LEDburn

pomp92 said:


> After 2 *h600w, h51w and sc31w I bought one h600fw mkii L2 and a sc600w mkii L2. Damn, even Zebralight has chosen the wrong way. :shakehead
> 
> -Absolutely different tint between my two new torches (same emitter!), one is green the other pink.
> -Poor quality machining, notches on the body, especially on those stupid sharp edges.
> -Poor anodizing, smoot instead of matte, so delicate that it arrived just scratched. When i put on the clip it removed all the anodizing on the edge of the flashlight.
> 
> Sent back the SC600, kept the h600 (pink tint). I'll buy a SC600 rev B and i'll mod it with a GOOD WW LED, frosted lens and ss bezel, but Zebralight lost another customer with this new flashlights. :shakehead



You act surprised that you received two lights with different tinted CREE EMITTERS so you clearly have a bit to learn still. Go check out the MANY MANY Quark threads and you will see this is not new news at all. Zebralight don't specify bins so expecting the same tint is kinda foolish really. Yes it sucks but welcome to Cree and the tint lottery.

As far as machining and anodising durability, I find that Zebralight are generally no worse than other manufacturers, possibly even better! If this is your first light which you have received which wasn't 100% perfect then I would say you have had abnormally good luck every other time. It certainly is no Armytek but at least it doesn't wear out just from carrying it in your pocket for a week (hello 4sevens).

I really don't think anyone could care if you buy another ZL or not. Just means less people to compete with so we should get ours sooner, thanks 

The first thing I did was water test and then after it passed a half hour dunk on the second highest PID setting, I got out the dremel and groud off the stupid lanyard attachment point so the body didn't have any uncomfortable bumps. Obviously I am more a fan of function over form. Perhaps others should stop having a whinge and get out there and use their torches more? Mine has a sweet tint but even if it was a tad green I would still keep this amazing light as it is immensly powerful, versatile and extremely useful. 

Go buy an Oveready or some other exclusive brand if you have such high expectations.


----------



## neutralwhite

it's not about go and find someone else if you've got high expectations, it's about the company meeting our 'high expectations' which we,...expect them to do!.





LEDburn said:


> You act surprised that you received two lights with different tinted CREE EMITTERS so you clearly have a bit to learn still. Go check out the MANY MANY Quark threads and you will see this is not new news at all. Zebralight don't specify bins so expecting the same tint is kinda foolish really. Yes it sucks but welcome to Cree and the tint lottery.
> 
> As far as machining and anodising durability, I find that Zebralight are generally no worse than other manufacturers, possibly even better! If this is your first light which you have received which wasn't 100% perfect then I would say you have had abnormally good luck every other time. It certainly is no Armytek but at least it doesn't wear out just from carrying it in your pocket for a week (hello 4sevens).
> 
> I really don't think anyone could care if you buy another ZL or not. Just means less people to compete with so we should get ours sooner, thanks
> 
> The first thing I did was water test and then after it passed a half hour dunk on the second highest PID setting, I got out the dremel and groud off the stupid lanyard attachment point so the body didn't have any uncomfortable bumps. Obviously I am more a fan of function over form. Perhaps others should stop having a whinge and get out there and use their torches more? Mine has a sweet tint but even if it was a tad green I would still keep this amazing light as it is immensly powerful, versatile and extremely useful.
> 
> Go buy an Oveready or some other exclusive brand if you have such high expectations.


----------



## neutralwhite

duplicated post.


----------



## jbrett14

neutralwhite said:


> it's not about go and find someone else if you've got high expectations, it's about the company meeting our 'high expectations' which we,...expect them to do!.



The problem is that expectations are subjective and no matter how good a product or company is, there will ALWAYS be consumers that simply are not very reasonable. Some folks will find the most insignificant things to complain about, seemingly oblivious to the fact that NOTHING is perfect.

I happen to appreciate all the reports of all the different lights, good and bad. But I must say that some of the expectations (complaints) in this forum are extremely insignificant in the mind of this perfectionist. Sometimes I wonder if these lights are even being used in the real world or if their light only sees the painted walls of an office or bedroom.

Bottom line: NO company will EVER be able to live up to the "high expectations" of consumers who are unreasonable. There will ALWAYS be consumers who complain, even when there is nothing significant to complain about. I can attest to this with my own business.

Having said that, there is always room for improvement, but what becomes an improvement to one consumer, will end up being a complaint by another.


----------



## kaichu dento

jbrett14 said:


> The problem is that expectations are subjective and no matter how good a product or company is, there will ALWAYS be consumers that simply are not very reasonable. Some folks will find the most insignificant things to complain about, seemingly oblivious to the fact that NOTHING is perfect.
> 
> I happen to appreciate all the reports of all the different lights, good and bad. But I must say that some of the expectations (complaints) in this forum are extremely insignificant in the mind of this perfectionist. Sometimes I wonder if these lights are even being used in the real world or if their light only sees the painted walls of an office or bedroom.
> 
> Bottom line: NO company will EVER be able to live up to the "high expectations" of consumers who are unreasonable. There will ALWAYS be consumers who complain, even when there is nothing significant to complain about. I can attest to this with my own business.
> 
> Having said that, there is always room for improvement, but what becomes an improvement to one consumer, will end up being a complaint by another.


In this day and age of LED's, coming up with a consistent tint is not an unreasonable expectation and constantly accusing anyone who wants predictable tints of only looking at walls is too easy of an accusation.

They make LED bulbs for homes now that have consistent tints and we should be able to expect as much from the emitters in our hand held lights.

For a self-proclaimed perfectionist to suggest otherwise is fine, for themselves, but here on a forum filled with members who have been replacing emitters as a matter of course for years, it rings hollow to suggest there's something wrong with asking a company to give us the tint advertised.

Your final statement is ridiculous too - if Zebralight gave us a consistently cool white for their cool tint and a creamy warm tint with no purple or green, there would be no complaints from anyone. The complaints come from green tints when we wanted warm white.


----------



## KITROBASKIN

Well Said kaichu dento. This is a very competitive market. There are flashlight makers who are aware of users who expect good beam quality. Could it be that ZL has prioritized maximum output with as low price as possible? (Driving the emitters so high and not paying for the inevitable rejection of the "lesser" quality Cree LED's that they must buy from Cree?) 

Or is there more to this story?


----------



## jbrett14

kaichu dento said:


> In this day and age of LED's, coming up with a consistent tint is not an unreasonable expectation and constantly accusing anyone who wants predictable tints of only looking at walls is too easy of an accusation.
> 
> They make LED bulbs for homes now that have consistent tints and we should be able to expect as much from the emitters in our hand held lights.
> 
> For a self-proclaimed perfectionist to suggest otherwise is fine, for themselves, but here on a forum filled with members who have been replacing emitters as a matter of course for years, it rings hollow to suggest there's something wrong with asking a company to give us the tint advertised.
> 
> Your final statement is ridiculous too - if Zebralight gave us a consistently cool white for their cool tint and a creamy warm tint with no purple or green, there would be no complaints from anyone. The complaints come from green tints when we wanted warm white.



Apparently you misunderstood my post. Nowhere did I specify what complaints I was referring to. Perhaps I misunderstood the chain of posts as well.

I agree that broad variations in tint is a worthy complaint. Especially at the prices of some of these lights.

However, I do see a difference from a household replacement bulb vs. a flashlight, which encompasses far more design than just a bulb that works in a household electrical circuit. Obviously the tint of a household bulb needs to be more consistent and appealing. Otherwise it would look very odd to see, for example, different variations within a set of 6 recessed light fixtures in the same room (a kitchen for example), whereas a flashlight is typically used by itself. 

But again, I agree with you that broad variations in tint is a worthy complaint. But I was not talking about complaints limited to tint variations. Some of the complaints are as insignificant as a SLIGHT color variation of the body of the light, as if the manufacture made a mistake. Really? No doubt there are some legitimate complaints for a lot of these pricey lights. I have had a few myself. But some of these complaints cause me to ponder whether the user spends more time using the lights or just looking at them and critiquing them. That's all. I didn't mean to suggest that complaints regarding broad tint variations was ridiculous. It's not.


----------



## kaichu dento

jbrett14 said:


> Apparently you misunderstood my post. Nowhere did I specify what complaints I was referring to. Perhaps I misunderstood the chain of posts as well.
> 
> I agree that broad variations in tint is a worthy complaint. Especially at the prices of some of these lights.
> 
> However, I do see a difference from a household replacement bulb vs. a flashlight, which encompasses far more design than just a bulb that works in a household electrical circuit. Obviously the tint of a household bulb needs to be more consistent and appealing. Otherwise it would look very odd to see, for example, different variations within a set of 6 recessed light fixtures in the same room (a kitchen for example), whereas a flashlight is typically used by itself.
> 
> But again, I agree with you that broad variations in tint is a worthy complaint. But I was not talking about complaints limited to tint variations. Some of the complaints are as insignificant as a SLIGHT color variation of the body of the light, as if the manufacture made a mistake. Really? No doubt there are some legitimate complaints for a lot of these pricey lights. I have had a few myself. But some of these complaints cause me to ponder whether the user spends more time using the lights or just looking at them and critiquing them. That's all. I didn't mean to suggest that complaints regarding broad tint variations was ridiculous. It's not.


In that case I have to agree with you and admit the main point that caught my eye was the reference to looking at walls, which has been a pet peeve response of mine when it's used to suggest that we never look at things that are white, or that we're being unreasonable when we want things that are white not to be green or purple.

Great point regarding the multiple bulbs in a house as opposed to the single emitter in a flashlight, but as a carrier of multiple lights that I'll go to as the situation calls for, at least a similarity in tints is much more enjoyable, particularly when they land within our own personal range of preference.

At the end of the day, I mostly have to agree with the basis for both of your posts, especially now that I understand the previous one better.


----------



## jbrett14

kaichu dento said:


> In that case I have to agree with you and admit the main point that caught my eye was the reference to looking at walls, which has been a pet peeve response of mine when it's used to suggest that we never look at things that are white, or that we're being unreasonable when we want things that are white not to be green or purple.
> 
> Great point regarding the multiple bulbs in a house as opposed to the single emitter in a flashlight, but as a carrier of multiple lights that I'll go to as the situation calls for, at least a similarity in tints is much more enjoyable, particularly when they land within our own personal range of preference.
> 
> At the end of the day, I mostly have to agree with the basis for both of your posts, especially now that I understand the previous one better.



It's nice to gain a better understanding of others, when we take the time to clarify things. Thanks.

I can see how my wall comment would have been interpreted in the wrong way. Actually, I too do a lot of wall (or ceiling) comparisons, just for the fun of it.  It's that flashaholic in us.


----------



## BOHAWG

LEDburn said:


> You act surprised that you received two lights with different tinted CREE EMITTERS so you clearly have a bit to learn still. Go check out the MANY MANY Quark threads and you will see this is not new news at all. Zebralight don't specify bins so expecting the same tint is kinda foolish really. Yes it sucks but welcome to Cree and the tint lottery.
> 
> As far as machining and anodising durability, I find that Zebralight are generally no worse than other manufacturers, possibly even better! If this is your first light which you have received which wasn't 100% perfect then I would say you have had abnormally good luck every other time. It certainly is no Armytek but at least it doesn't wear out just from carrying it in your pocket for a week (hello 4sevens).
> 
> 
> I really don't think anyone could care if you buy another ZL or not. Just means less people to compete with so we should get ours sooner, thanks
> 
> The first thing I did was water test and then after it passed a half hour dunk on the second highest PID setting, I got out the dremel and groud off the stupid lanyard attachment point so the body didn't have any uncomfortable bumps. Obviously I am more a fan of function over form. Perhaps others should stop having a whinge and get out there and use their torches more? Mine has a sweet tint but even if it was a tad green I would still keep this amazing light as it is immensly powerful, versatile and extremely useful.
> 
> Go buy an Oveready or some other exclusive brand if you have such high expectations.



I totally concur with you..... So many members here think just because they can go online and get a specific emitter from a specific bin and replace the one in their specific light that a company that produces THOUSANDS of lights per year should accommodate their specific needs......hahahahahahah..... If because Zebralight makes so many lights, someone would choose to think that process would be totally flawless...... I guess that since Ford,BMW,Chevrolet,Mercedes,etc., makes so many cars, their should be no trips to the auto mechanic
I find Zebralight to be a very good company with a great product..... I used a SC600 for two years, working inside a sugar plant in North Dakota and between the extreme cold, wet sugar, sugar dust, being dropped in a bucket of oil and being even left outside to freeze up in the rain.... this light never failed once and in the dark, not doing against the wall color tests, the only thing I was personally worried about was it being bright and working and it did both FLAWLESSLY! 

So again I totally agree..... go buy an Oveready or some other exclusive brand if you have such high expectations!


----------



## jakepen

How do I get into strobe? Is there a fast strobe mode? 

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk


----------



## neutralwhite

but then again, what happens if Oveready or some other exclusive brand fails?.
how far do you go?. - for even higher expectations?. 
these companies need to help us out more with better QC rather than profit focus as usual.




BOHAWG said:


> I totally concur with you..... So many members here think just because they can go online and get a specific emitter from a specific bin and replace the one in their specific light that a company that produces THOUSANDS of lights per year should accommodate their specific needs......hahahahahahah..... If because Zebralight makes so many lights, someone would choose to think that process would be totally flawless...... I guess that since Ford,BMW,Chevrolet,Mercedes,etc., makes so many cars, their should be no trips to the auto mechanic
> I find Zebralight to be a very good company with a great product..... I used a SC600 for two years, working inside a sugar plant in North Dakota and between the extreme cold, wet sugar, sugar dust, being dropped in a bucket of oil and being even left outside to freeze up in the rain.... this light never failed once and in the dark, not doing against the wall color tests, the only thing I was personally worried about was it being bright and working and it did both FLAWLESSLY!
> 
> So again I totally agree..... go buy an Oveready or some other exclusive brand if you have such high expectations!


----------



## KITROBASKIN

To think that just because you got a sweet tint and you got one of the durable ones and therefore no one is allowed to point out the problems with their flashlights... Let me guess. The unlucky and those who expect more, have no right to speak of it in your midst. Is that it? Are we wasting your time or did your mother tell you to clean up your room. And please pardon me if you have some illness that makes you so easily provoked.


----------



## neutralwhite

+1.
I have high expectations, I expect more, and will chase it up for them to get it right. 
it has to start somewhere rather than going up a level. it should be fair across the board of flashlight makers. 




KITROBASKIN said:


> To think that just because you got a sweet tint and you got one of the durable ones and therefore no one is allowed to point out the problems with their flashlights... Let me guess. The unlucky and those who expect more, have no right to speak of it in your midst. Is that it? Are we wasting your time or did your mother tell you to clean up your room. And please pardon me if you have some illness that makes you so easily provoked.


----------



## KITROBASKIN

Yeah neutralwhite. I mostly loved the two Zebralights I tried and am looking to get an SC62d when it comes out. And it seems that we members love to hear that other members are pleased with their ZL. We need to hear that too, don't you think?


----------



## TotalDbag

I bought an SC600 MK2 XM-L2 in neutral white yesterday. I can't wait for it to arrive. It'll be the first Zebralight I've owned. 


Sent from my iPhone 5


----------



## markr6

If a cheap $10 flashlight can have [almost] the same tint over and over, I think a $95 flashlight should come pretty close as well.

And in the car example, how would people feel if their neighbors F150 had 45 extra horsepower than their exact same model off the line?


----------



## neutralwhite

same here!. 
mine is on it's way from Illumination Supply in California. Should be with me by end of the month....



TotalDbag said:


> I bought an SC600 MK2 XM-L2 in neutral white yesterday. I can't wait for it to arrive. It'll be the first Zebralight I've owned.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone 5


----------



## KITROBASKIN

neutralwhite said:


> same here!.
> mine is on it's way from Illumination Supply in California. Should be with me by end of the month....



That is so great. Very exciting. Wish I could be in your position. Illumination Supply is thinking I may be too picky about the tint and so is not really recommending a purchase but I just think there are ones with a decent tint based on multiple reports on this forum! Anyways, more power to you folks who have one on order. (That does reflect on the integrity of IS, though. They have done right by me.)


----------



## TotalDbag

I bought mine from zebralight and the tracking number says it'll be here the 23rd.


Sent from my iPhone 5


----------



## neutralwhite

thanks. Yes, I did add a note on the order, and emailed Craig before exactly what I was looking for with this cool white L2, and that was really;.......no yucky Green!,..and the usual rest. 
i trust that they will pick out a good enough one. that will do. let's see. 

i would of ordered one from "flashaholics" here in the UK, but they are sold out. 




KITROBASKIN said:


> That is so great. Very exciting. Wish I could be in your position. Illumination Supply is thinking I may be too picky about the tint and so is not really recommending a purchase but I just think there are ones with a decent tint based on multiple reports on this forum! Anyways, more power to you folks who have one on order. (That does reflect on the integrity of IS, though. They have done right by me.)


----------



## neutralwhite

hi,..best wishes on that order - some say don't order direct from them as they send you anything without taking much care of what you tell them you want, so I went with Illumination Supply. I have faith in IS.
but the whole thing is a lottery really isn't it!. lol.
if your not happy with it, send it back. that's what I will do if it comes from IS like that, but again, I ain't concerned so much somehow being IS. 




TotalDbag said:


> I bought mine from zebralight and the tracking number says it'll be here the 23rd.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone 5


----------



## BWX

What the hell happened to this thread.


----------



## TotalDbag

neutralwhite said:


> hi,..best wishes on that order - some say don't order direct from them as they send you anything without taking much care of what you tell them you want, so I went with Illumination Supply. I have faith in IS.
> but the whole thing is a lottery really isn't it!. lol.
> if your not happy with it, send it back. that's what I will do if it comes from IS like that, but again, I ain't concerned so much somehow being IS.



Well I didn't leave them any specific instructions, so I think I'm good. And this is only my second light, so as long as it's bright and it works I probably won't care.


Sent from my iPhone 5


----------



## neutralwhite

received mine earlier today (sat) got here in a week. 
love this light, and it looks so small compared to videos.
really fascinated by the UI, love it loads. 

zebralight, & craig and calvin at Illumination supply are a credit to the flashlight world.
thank you kindly.


----------



## BirdofPrey

Anyone know what is up these? Ordered mine a few days ago from illumination supply. Figured I'd get my name on the list. Any word on when they might be getting some of these out of Zebralight? 

Sent from my ridiculously large Galaxy Note 2.


----------



## srg818

BirdofPrey said:


> Anyone know what is up these? Ordered mine a few days ago from illumination supply. Figured I'd get my name on the list. Any word on when they might be getting some of these out of Zebralight?
> 
> Sent from my ridiculously large Galaxy Note 2.



I ordered mine from IS in November and am still waiting so it might be a long wait especially if they're filling orders sequentially.


----------



## maxrep12

What an interesting group we are. Ordering from vendors with our special discounts and free shipping, only to request that the guy trying to run a business, sort through his supply to give us the best tinted lights. Of course this means that the less attractive tints get passed on to someone else.

I have never asked for preferential treatment, as I am buying at a discount. I have also never returned a light to a hardworking business owner because of tint. If you don't like the tint, sell the unit in the marketplace rather than make additional work for those businesses who are already cutting their profit margins for members here. If you are not convinced you have a solid chance of getting the tint you are hoping for, buy a different brand or a different model that have the color reviews you trust.

I imagine many cpf retailers would echo these thoughts.


----------



## KITROBASKIN

Yes, the issue of asking preferential treatment is a zero sum game unless significant numbers of buyers don't mind green tinted torch beams. I took a discount from a vendor who charges a little more than ZebraLight on their website but the personal service I received afterwards compels me to not take a discount from them again.

Seems like a major reason vendors offer discounts to CPF members is that word of mouth can spur sales. It's worth it to them. That's why good reviewers here get flashlights sent to them.

It would be nice if ZL could figure out a way to get rid of the green. Recently got an Xtar wk26(?) for <$18 with XPE(?);beautiful tint: A $38 Sportaclight (EagleTac) P60 dropin triple XPG2; gorgeous white tint: and an MBI HF Nichia 3level switch;no green. 

Just read recently on the forum that current regulation circuitry(or something like that) can cause a shift to green. 

The UI and form factor is just so great with ZL's...


----------



## Etsu

Yes, I don't want vendors to let customers pick & choose the best tints. It screws over everyone that places a regular order and expects they'll get a fair shake.

As for sending stuff back because of tint, I generally agree it's an underhanded thing to do. I can understand if it's the first light from that manufacturer you've purchased, and the tint is _really _bad. But by now, we all know Zebralight's tints are a gamble. Yet, I've seen people posting that they buy several lights, and keep sending them back until they get a perfect one. Not cool!

If I was a vendor and a customer tried that stunt on me more than once, he'd be blacklisted from future sales.


----------



## kaichu dento

KITROBASKIN said:


> It would be nice if ZL could figure out a way to get rid of the green. Recently got an Xtar wk26(?) for <$18 with XPE(?);beautiful tint: A $38 Sportaclight (EagleTac) P60 dropin triple XPG2; gorgeous white tint: and an MBI HF Nichia 3level switch;no green.


They've known a way to do it all along, but have chosen to not be selective about tint because they carry their sales on the greatness of the product itself, regardless of tint.

The other manufacturers you mention are getting great tints because it's what they've been buying; selective bins.


----------



## ctrashp

I received my QTY 2 1100 lum SC600 MKii's last night . They are impressive, to be so small.. They feel very solid, and work flawlessly. So far I am very pleased. They will get a workout. Because they will be carried daily to work. take care, ctrashp


----------



## KITROBASKIN

ctrashp said:


> I received my QTY 2 1100 lum SC600 MKii's last night . They are impressive, to be so small.. They feel very solid, and work flawlessly. So far I am very pleased. They will get a workout. Because they will be carried daily to work. take care, ctrashp



I am jealous


----------



## neutralwhite

Ticket status: Completed

Department: Sales

Subject: WATERPROOF SC600MKII L2 / ZL'S POSITION

The SC600 Mk II and SC600 Mk II L2 bezels are press fit. From what we've seen over the last several years, 'press fit' is not an issue. We usually revise a design every 2-3 months. For example, the SC52 has had 5 revisions since its inception. If press fit were an issue, we'd have changed it long time ago. Some of our future designs may use screw on bezel, but that's more of a production (assembly) decision than waterproofness related.

Sincerely,

ZebraLight, Inc.
2908 Story Rd. W
Irving, TX 75038


----------



## BWX

Well on a side note, the SC600 MKI B U2 works well as a make-shift hand warmer on the 330 lumen setting.


----------



## BOHAWG

maxrep12 said:


> What an interesting group we are. Ordering from vendors with our special discounts and free shipping, only to request that the guy trying to run a business, sort through his supply to give us the best tinted lights. Of course this means that the less attractive tints get passed on to someone else.
> 
> I have never asked for preferential treatment, as I am buying at a discount. I have also never returned a light to a hardworking business owner because of tint. If you don't like the tint, sell the unit in the marketplace rather than make additional work for those businesses who are already cutting their profit margins for members here. If you are not convinced you have a solid chance of getting the tint you are hoping for, buy a different brand or a different model that have the color reviews you trust.
> 
> I imagine many cpf retailers would echo these thoughts.



+1


----------



## jbrett14

maxrep12 said:


> What an interesting group we are. Ordering from vendors with our special discounts and free shipping, only to request that the guy trying to run a business, sort through his supply to give us the best tinted lights. Of course this means that the less attractive tints get passed on to someone else.
> 
> I have never asked for preferential treatment, as I am buying at a discount. I have also never returned a light to a hardworking business owner because of tint. If you don't like the tint, sell the unit in the marketplace rather than make additional work for those businesses who are already cutting their profit margins for members here. If you are not convinced you have a solid chance of getting the tint you are hoping for, buy a different brand or a different model that have the color reviews you trust.
> 
> I imagine many cpf retailers would echo these thoughts.



EXACTLY MY THOUGHTS. 

I run a kitchen cabinet business and I can only imagine what would happen if every customer came in expecting me to hand select each cabinet door simply so the grain of the wood meets their expectations. When I get folks who are obviously not a fan of the natural grain of any specific wood species, I tell them to get a painted cabinet as there is no way I want to be responsible for THEIR complaints. Furthermore, if every customer were to return their cabinets because of personal dislikes regarding non-faulty things I would go out of business in a matter of months.

I can only imagine how some of these flashlight dealers would feel if EVERY one of us were to request the same thing. My guess is that they would find another job.


----------



## kaichu dento

jbrett14 said:


> EXACTLY MY THOUGHTS.
> 
> I run a kitchen cabinet business and I can only imagine what would happen if every customer came in expecting me to hand select each cabinet door simply so the grain of the wood meets their expectations. When I get folks who are obviously not a fan of the natural grain of any specific wood species, I tell them to get a painted cabinet as there is no way I want to be responsible for THEIR complaints. Furthermore, if every customer were to return their cabinets because of personal dislikes regarding non-faulty things I would go out of business in a matter of months.
> 
> I can only imagine how some of these flashlight dealers would feel if EVERY one of us were to request the same thing. My guess is that they would find another job.


You guys need to all remember that in an age where predictable tints are easily acquired, none of these analogies are accurate.

Tell your customers they're getting red oak and see how they react when you sell them white instead.

Your excellent signature line applies perfectly here.


----------



## jbrett14

Etsu said:


> Yet, I've seen people posting that they buy several lights, and keep sending them back until they get a perfect one. Not cool!
> 
> If I was a vendor and a customer tried that stunt on me more than once, he'd be blacklisted from future sales.



Exactly!

No small business can survive with this nonsense.


----------



## jbrett14

kaichu dento said:


> You guys need to all remember that in an age where predictable tints are easily acquired, none of these analogies are accurate.
> 
> Tell your customers they're getting red oak and see how they react when you sell them white instead.
> 
> Your excellent signature line applies perfectly here.



 Just shows how all things are subjective. In MY mind, your analogy is more like somebody buying a ZebraLight and getting a JetBeam as they are two entirely different products. My analogy of varying grains of the SAME wood is actually perfectly consistent with the SAME flashlight having varying tints. And those tints are subjective. E.g. some may hate a greenish tint or a blueish tint while others are more concerned with whether the light will be bright enough for the job, without concern for subtle tint variations.

The point is that because tints are subjective, the burden should not be put on the seller. And since ZL is apparently known to have tint variations, then anyone who buys them ought to either accept what they get (unless it's defective), or sell it and buy another one, rather than taking the profits away from the seller by having him ship multiple times. It's not the sellers fault, so why put the burden on him.


----------



## fnj

You guys need to remember that selecting tint bin does not give you absolutely identical tints. There is plenty of variation within a bin. There are plenty of bins that encompass both rosy and greenish. There is no magic way to achieve a perfectly repeatable tint. All you can do is laboriously hand select at tremendous labor.


----------



## kaichu dento

Both of these last two posts pretend that Cree is the only game on the planet and neglect the existence of Nichia and their very reproducable tints when that is what's required. 

Has either one of you guys ever had a Nichia 119 Haiku?


----------



## 18650

kaichu dento said:


> Both of these last two posts pretend that Cree is the only game on the planet and neglect the existence of Nichia and their very reproducable tints when that is what's required. Has either one of you guys ever had a Nichia 119 Haiku?


 You can stick with those and let the market take care of itself.


----------



## kaichu dento

18650 said:


> You can stick with those and let the market take care of itself.


How does the market take care of itself if not through marketing approaches, product development, customer demand, pricing, customer service, reliability and here we go, product predictability.

Some products by design deliver what they promise, while others get their supporters to accept compromise as the rule of thumb.

Now what's your point?


----------



## pjandyho

Hi KaichuDento,

I understand where you are coming from. I love my Nichia 119 Haiku as well as my other Nichia 219 powered lights. They produce the best tints available. Having said this, I must say that I was once a tint snob and preferred only HCRI or at least a neutral in the Q3 5A/B range, but lately I tend to be a little more easy on tints. Greenish, yellowish, or even slightly bluish is fine because I realized that in actual use now, I don't really care that much. Of course it doesn't mean I will not have a stronger preference towards neutral or HCRI when it comes to choosing a light, especially if it's a Nichia in there.


----------



## Etsu

kaichu dento said:


> Both of these last two posts pretend that Cree is the only game on the planet and neglect the existence of Nichia and their very reproducable tints when that is what's required.
> 
> Has either one of you guys ever had a Nichia 119 Haiku?



Zebralight loves brightness. I like the Nichia 219, but it's only about half as efficient (in terms of lumens/watt) as a cool white Cree XM-L2. It's great for most purposes, but ZL loves to advertize lumens. I think that's why they stick to Cree in most of their top sellers.


----------



## markr6

The thing that really frustrates me is that my Nitecore EA4W (far from a "premium" model) has the most perfect neutral white tint XM-L. But all of my Zebralights with the same emitter were NOWHERE close. Did I get lucky, or does Nitecore have some trick on getting only perfect tints?


----------



## UMDTERPS

does anyone know where to get the latest edition of this light? (the one with 1100 lumens)


----------



## tonkem

Out of stock most places. Check the marketplace or dealer section of cpfmarketplace for a couple of dealers. illumination supply and e2fieldgear are the 2 I have dealt with. Just checked illuminationsupply and they have the cool white in stock.


----------



## UMDTERPS

tonkem said:


> Out of stock most places. Check the marketplace or dealer section of cpfmarketplace for a couple of dealers. illumination supply and e2fieldgear are the 2 I have dealt with. Just checked illuminationsupply and they have the cool white in stock.



Thanks!

There might be a local store near me that may have it (I just emailed them) called, knife center?
http://www2.knifecenter.com/ not sure if anyone has dealt with them.


----------



## jbrett14

kaichu dento said:


> Both of these last two posts pretend that Cree is the only game on the planet and neglect the existence of Nichia and their very reproducable tints when that is what's required.
> 
> Has either one of you guys ever had a Nichia 119 Haiku?



I hear ya, and I do not disagree that there ARE ways to make a flashlight that has a more consistent tint. But this was not the issue in which I personally was posting about. 

The issue in which I was speaking had more to do with buyers who KNOW that those more consistent tints are NOT what is being used in the ZebraLights, and yet, after buying a ZebraLight, with this foreknowledge, and receiving a tint which they deem unworthy because it doesn't have the "perfect" tint (subjective), they want to return the item back to the seller, putting the burden on him to replace it. 

If somebody wants to make sure they get a tint which they are happy with, they ought to buy a brand which they know uses more consistent tints. Otherwise, they should accept what they get, or sell it, not send it back to the seller, as if he sold them a defective item. 

To my knowledge ZebraLight never advertised that every buyer would receive a "perfect" white tint. If they did, then yes, the buyer has an argument for replacement.

Again, my position is not to argue whether ZebraLight should or should not try to use more consistent tints. That's their business. If they choose not to, and somebody STILL buys them, then the buyer ought to be responsible and accept the luck of the draw, so as not to burden the seller.


----------



## markr6

I don't know, on the fence about this. But most stores online let you return for any reason, often specifying "Other" or "Changed my mind" as the reason.

So if I purchase a pair of gloves and I simply change my mind, or they are navy blue instead of the cobat blue color on my monitor, it shouldn't matter. It's in their policy and they accepted that as a part of doing business (i.e. 30 days to return for whatever reason - if they are tired of getting them back, just change the policy!!) That could affect sales, but so could bad QC, bad customer service, slow shipping, an act of God or a million other things)


----------



## jbrett14

markr6 said:


> I don't know, on the fence about this. But most stores online let you return for any reason, often specifying "Other" or "Changed my mind" as the reason.
> 
> So if I purchase a pair of gloves and I simply change my mind, or they are navy blue instead of the cobat blue color on my monitor, it shouldn't matter. It's in their policy and they accepted that as a part of doing business (i.e. 30 days to return for whatever reason - if they are tired of getting them back, just change the policy!!) That could affect sales, but so could bad QC, bad customer service, slow shipping, an act of God or a million other things)



Excellent points markr6. 

You are right, if a business has a policy like that, then it's their own fault if they don't like it when somebody with higher expectations returns something.

But there is a fine line of providing "customer satisfaction". These policies are designed to attract business, but no business owner could survive if 100% of their customers acted upon it. There is always some financial loss calculated into the working budget of the business. It's expected, but only to a degree. They know that MOST customers will be somewhat reasonable, allowing them to take financial hits to satisfy the unreasonable customers.

Within the circles of flashlight dealers, we are talking about very small businesses, relative to a business like Amazon. I just think we buyers need to be more mindful of the difficulties of running a small business, and learn to be more reasonable with them. They cannot survive if we ALL returned lights because of slight tint dislikes. The only reason they can afford to please those who DO send these non-defective lights back, is because of customers who never would. It is the profits they make from the majority of customers which allows them to lose profits to those customers with special requests. 

I know this from running a small business myself. I don't mind making less profit from SOME customers, because I know that with MOST customers, we will make the needed profits to survive. So we can "satisfy" ALL customers so long as the number of special requests is kept to a minimum. Nobody wants an unhappy customer, so we, at times, "bend over backwards" to satisfy even the most unreasonable customer. But again, this is only possible because of all the wonderful reasonable customers we have.


----------



## 18650

kaichu dento said:


> How does the market take care of itself if not through marketing approaches, product development, customer demand, pricing, customer service, reliability and here we go, product predictability. Some products by design deliver what they promise, while others get their supporters to accept compromise as the rule of thumb. Now what's your point?


 In this case, the manufacturer promises a Cree XM-L2 of 4400K in their product and that's what they deliver. Maybe it's just a vocal minority and the rest don't view it as a compromise or maybe they don't care enough to start a crusade over it. Personally it seems all silly to me because from my perspective people are arguing "ugly" green vs "ugly" yellow. Full disclosure: I own 1 Zebralight and it's not a Cree.


----------



## 18650

markr6 said:


> The thing that really frustrates me is that my Nitecore EA4W (far from a "premium" model) has the most perfect neutral white tint XM-L. But all of my Zebralights with the same emitter were NOWHERE close. Did I get lucky, or does Nitecore have some trick on getting only perfect tints?


 3C vs 4C is not the same.


----------



## markr6

18650 said:


> 3C vs 4C is not the same.



Then they should switch to whatever is in the Nitecore because it is perfectly white. Then again, coming back to personal preferences (but I think 99% would agree with me)


----------



## toysareforboys

Finally got my shipping notice for my SC600W MKII L2!!! Can't wait to get it, should hold its brightness good on my -40 degree walks! 

-Jamie M.


----------



## fnj

18650 said:


> In this case, the manufacturer promises a Cree XM-L2 of 4400K in their product and that's what they deliver. Maybe it's just a vocal minority and the rest don't view it as a compromise or maybe they don't care enough to start a crusade over it. Personally it seems all silly to me because from my perspective people are arguing "ugly" green vs "ugly" yellow. Full disclosure: I own 1 Zebralight and it's not a Cree.



Oh, they promise 4400K? Not 4399 or 4401? May I ask where is that promise made?

Also, LEDs with the same CCT can have significantly different tints.


----------



## KITROBASKIN

Much of this tint discussion is being repeated although some differently worded, valid points are being made on both sides.

Just to reiterate something perhaps not mentioned recently: We want ZL and stocking dealers to know that their wonderful lights have had some really bad tint issues compared to other competitive brands and ZebraLight CAN do better, evidenced by even budget manufacturers. How best to get their attention? $$$$.

Hopefully they have improved, maybe less green and more yellow.

Taken from a dealer's website that I do business with:

"Products returned for cosmetic or personal preference issues such as: LED tint, LED centering, inductor noises, etc will not be considered RMAs."

So, dealers make their own decisions regarding what they will do, as will consumers. Tell us what you'll do; present your case. If it sounds like you are telling me what I have to do, well.....


----------



## 18650

fnj said:


> Oh, they promise 4400K? Not 4399 or 4401? May I ask where is that promise made?
> 
> Also, LEDs with the same CCT can have significantly different tints.



That's what it says on the product page. They buy what Cree calls a 4400K emitter. That's it. Seriously. People are content to call the 219A a 92 CRI emitter but it only reaches that rating when driven near max. No one seems concerned enough to start crusades about that.

What if moonlight mode on one is higher than another? What if the LED is off by 0.5mm? What if the ANSI FL-1 ratings are off by a couple percent? What if one sample has a slightly louder buzz at a lower level than another sample? What if one sample has shorter or longer battery life because of small Vf variations in the emitter? Do you get upset about that too?


----------



## kaichu dento

pjandyho said:


> Hi KaichuDento,
> 
> I understand where you are coming from. I love my Nichia 119 Haiku as well as my other Nichia 219 powered lights. They produce the best tints available. Having said this, I must say that I was once a tint snob and preferred only HCRI or at least a neutral in the Q3 5A/B range, but lately I tend to be a little more easy on tints. Greenish, yellowish, or even slightly bluish is fine because I realized that in actual use now, I don't really care that much. Of course it doesn't mean I will not have a stronger preference towards neutral or HCRI when it comes to choosing a light, especially if it's a Nichia in there.


This pretty well mirrors my feelings too, and if we know a particular brand is known for 'bad' tints then we can either avoid or mod. 
Biggest disappointment with Zebralight is the desirable designs they've come up with paired with difficulty of modding.



markr6 said:


> The thing that really frustrates me is that my Nitecore EA4W (far from a "premium" model) has the most perfect neutral white tint XM-L. But all of my Zebralights with the same emitter were NOWHERE close. Did I get lucky, or does Nitecore have some trick on getting only perfect tints?


That's a better example of my premise that 'decent' tints are not that difficult to obtain than the one I made myself. If other providers of decent lights are able to deliver, why not the rest of the field as well, particularly when they go through the trouble of presenting us with the one letter suffixes which supposedly indicate a given tint. Said it before although I think it should go without saying, yellow, pink, orange, pink or red are all warm, green is not.



jbrett14 said:


> I hear ya, and I do not disagree that there ARE ways to make a flashlight that has a more consistent tint. But this was not the issue in which I personally was posting about.
> 
> The issue in which I was speaking had more to do with buyers who KNOW that those more consistent tints are NOT what is being used in the ZebraLights, and yet, after buying a ZebraLight, with this foreknowledge, and receiving a tint which they deem unworthy because it doesn't have the "perfect" tint (subjective), they want to return the item back to the seller, putting the burden on him to replace it.
> 
> If somebody wants to make sure they get a tint which they are happy with, they ought to buy a brand which they know uses more consistent tints. Otherwise, they should accept what they get, or sell it, not send it back to the seller, as if he sold them a defective item.
> 
> To my knowledge ZebraLight never advertised that every buyer would receive a "perfect" white tint. If they did, then yes, the buyer has an argument for replacement.
> 
> Again, my position is not to argue whether ZebraLight should or should not try to use more consistent tints. That's their business. If they choose not to, and somebody STILL buys them, then the buyer ought to be responsible and accept the luck of the draw, so as not to burden the seller.





jbrett14 said:


> Excellent points markr6.
> 
> You are right, if a business has a policy like that, then it's their own fault if they don't like it when somebody with higher expectations returns something.
> 
> But there is a fine line of providing "customer satisfaction". These policies are designed to attract business, but no business owner could survive if 100% of their customers acted upon it. There is always some financial loss calculated into the working budget of the business. It's expected, but only to a degree. They know that MOST customers will be somewhat reasonable, allowing them to take financial hits to satisfy the unreasonable customers.
> 
> Within the circles of flashlight dealers, we are talking about very small businesses, relative to a business like Amazon. I just think we buyers need to be more mindful of the difficulties of running a small business, and learn to be more reasonable with them. They cannot survive if we ALL returned lights because of slight tint dislikes. The only reason they can afford to please those who DO send these non-defective lights back, is because of customers who never would. It is the profits they make from the majority of customers which allows them to lose profits to those customers with special requests.
> 
> I know this from running a small business myself. I don't mind making less profit from SOME customers, because I know that with MOST customers, we will make the needed profits to survive. So we can "satisfy" ALL customers so long as the number of special requests is kept to a minimum. Nobody wants an unhappy customer, so we, at times, "bend over backwards" to satisfy even the most unreasonable customer. But again, this is only possible because of all the wonderful reasonable customers we have.


As usual, a couple of excellent postings and some of your points are behind why although I thought I'd be one of the first to buy an SC52w, I've avoided buying so far. If I were to buy one I'd be expecting ugly tint, and if I found it at least bearable would consider myself lucky.



18650 said:


> In this case, the manufacturer promises a Cree XM-L2 of 4400K in their product and that's what they deliver. Maybe it's just a vocal minority and the rest don't view it as a compromise or maybe they don't care enough to start a crusade over it. Personally it seems all silly to me because from my perspective people are arguing "ugly" green vs "ugly" yellow. Full disclosure: I own 1 Zebralight and it's not a Cree.



If you really want to use the word 'crusade', then you'd have to admit its existence on both sides of the issue, predominantly appropriate when used to identify those who are all too willing to exaggerate and label anyone who dares disagree with them.



18650 said:


> That's what it says on the product page. They buy what Cree calls a 4400K emitter. That's it. Seriously. People are content to call the 219A a 92 CRI emitter but it only reaches that rating when driven near max. No one seems concerned enough to start crusades about that.
> 
> What if moonlight mode on one is higher than another? What if the LED is off by 0.5mm? What if the ANSI FL-1 ratings are off by a couple percent? What if one sample has a slightly louder buzz at a lower level than another sample? What if one sample has shorter or longer battery life because of small Vf variations in the emitter? Do you get upset about that too?


There you go with that word again, and apparently it is becoming more and more applicable to your intolerance for opposing views.

The entire last part of this post is what's called a straw man argument, as the one has nothing to do with the other, but is a blatant attempt to marginalize.

Anyone happy with the ZebraLights as they are are welcome to like them, and those of us who have chosen to hold off buying one are free to express our hopes that they'll at some point take this more seriously.


----------



## 18650

Sure you can but just remember it's not a defect. It's a subjective quality that you don't like. I'm just pointing out it's not broken and the multiple return and try to win the lottery type things being advocated is ridiculous, thus I intolerantly poke fun at it. In the ZL threads it's always the same few individuals drilling the same thing over and over again.

Like you said, Cree isn't the only game in town so people can go there as an option. I'll even freely admit my one Luxeon based light is the only one of my lights that has a truly neutral tint with very little if any color cast in any particular direction. Tint-wise it's way better than any of my Cree lights which range from slightly green, to slightly blue, to slightly purple, or slightly yellow. It's just not a flaw that merits the amount of ink I see used on it.


----------



## kaichu dento

We're never going to agree on certain perspectives, but at least this most recent post of yours is fairly sober in approach and I too agree with most of it.

I'm with you certainly in not enjoying incessant postings going after ZL's already known poor offering when it comes to tint and mostly simply accept it, but on the other hand it's no more enjoyable being grouped with others whose views I don't necessarily share simply because tint matters a lot to me as well.

It would be great to see Luxeon come back strongly into the game and I believe that it will be the multi-level competition between emitter makers that will eventually give us the type of tint predictability that is for the most part standard when it comes to bulbs of all types for home usage.


----------



## Matt.m

Any idea on which 3400mah protected cells will fit in the SC600 MKII L2 if any? I'm looking to pick up some Orbtronic 3400mah protected cells for my TN32 I just ordered and figured I would get an extra for this light as well. Just not sure if they will fit. If not would it be ok to go with an unprotected cell. What are the caveats to that?


----------



## P1X4R

Orbtronic 3400 mAh protected cells fit fine. that's what i exclusively use in my sc600 mkii l2.


----------



## Matt.m

What would you guys recommend. Orbtronic 3400mah, Eagletac 3400mah, or Keeppower 3400mah cells. For this light and for my new TN32. I just plan on buying 4 of the same. 3 for the TN32 and 1 for this light


----------



## toysareforboys

Matt.m said:


> What would you guys recommend. Orbtronic 3400mah, Eagletac 3400mah, or Keeppower 3400mah cells. For this light and for my new TN32. I just plan on buying 4 of the same. 3 for the TN32 and 1 for this light


I know the Keeppower is way better than the Eagletac but haven't seen any test data for the Orbtronic 3400's so not sure where they fit in.

-Jamie M.


----------



## tonkem

Why do you say the Keeppower is better than the eagletac? I have seen reviews of the Keeppower and Orbtronic. Orbtronic is one of the best, but not sure of fit issues. I have eagletac 3100 that I use in my H600 and S6330, without issue.


----------



## toysareforboys

tonkem said:


> Why do you say the Keeppower is better than the eagletac?


In my high drain lights my Keeppower constantly outperforms my Eagletac, both in voltage sag as well in total runtime. In low drain lights the performance is almost identical. I don't own and have not seen discharge charts for the orbtronic 3400's so not sure of their performance in high drain applications.

-Jamie M.


----------



## tonkem

That is good to know, will keep that in mind for future purchases, as the Keeppower are cheaper than the eagletac. 



toysareforboys said:


> In my high drain lights my Keeppower constantly outperforms my Eagletac, both in voltage sag as well in total runtime. In low drain lights the performance is almost identical. I don't own and have not seen discharge charts for the orbtronic 3400's so not sure of their performance in high drain applications.
> 
> -Jamie M.


----------



## Matt.m

Thank you. I know the Keeppower are about $3 cheaper per cell. I'd rather spend the extra $12 though if the Orbtronic are better. I'll have do some more digging to find out.


----------



## toysareforboys

Matt.m said:


> Thank you. I know the Keeppower are about $3 cheaper per cell. I'd rather spend the extra $12 though if the Orbtronic are better. I'll have do some more digging to find out.


I found a discharge chart for the Orbtronic 3400's: http://www.orbtronic.com/images/products/secondary/borb-3400-p-1.jpg

High drain performance looks identical to the Keeppower's.

-Jamie M.


----------



## Matt.m

Do we know if the 3400mah Keeppowers fit in the l2 version of the light?


----------



## roadkill1109

Matt.m said:


> Do we know if the 3400mah Keeppowers fit in the l2 version of the light?



It's tight, but fits with a little force added to it.


----------



## roadkill1109

Wouldn't it be better to run this light with unprotected 18650's? The light is capable of regulating the power so having circuits on the battery would make it redundant, right? 

I mean, sure it would be nice to have a redundant system going with the light, but wouldn't it be better to let the light decide how it will manage the cell's power instead of the cell's protection circuit cutting in when the cell could do much more?

Just my two cents.


----------



## toysareforboys

roadkill1109 said:


> Wouldn't it be better to run this light with unprotected 18650's? The light is capable of regulating the power so having circuits on the battery would make it redundant, right?
> 
> I mean, sure it would be nice to have a redundant system going with the light, but wouldn't it be better to let the light decide how it will manage the cell's power instead of the cell's protection circuit cutting in when the cell could do much more?
> 
> Just my two cents.


I run all my SC600's on unprotected flat top NCR18650B's as well as button top unprotected NCR18650B's. For lights that have low voltage notification/protection I always use my unprotected batteries. In fact I'm not even sure I own any protected 18650's any more.

-Jamie M.


----------



## xnmw

Mine just came today--it shipped with 3400 KeepPowers instead of the bare Panasonics I ordered. Right now it's eating a Nitecore branded 3400--it was a tight fit but seems like it will be fine. Loving the light so far--it is heavier than I thought it would be. It feels very much like a solid chunk of metal.
Compared to my pre-ordered SC52 that I've used heavily... I prefer the machining on the cap of the 52, and the cap of the 600 is darker than the rest of the light. I thought I would hate the clip-on clip vs. the 52's nice screwed-on clip, but I gave it a shot and it's great--makes the 600 much more comfortable to pocket carry. The tint, beam, UI etc is all as I'd expected and I'm quite pleased there. The button is more of a click, much more audible than the 52's--which is near silent. I'm getting used to it. So far so good.


----------



## toysareforboys

xnmw said:


> Mine just came today


Which model?

-Jamie M.


----------



## xnmw

toysareforboys said:


> Which model?
> 
> -Jamie M.


I'm embarrassed to say I'm not sure. I had the Neutral on order, then got tired of waiting and requested to switch to Cool, then got a shipping notice, THEN got an "ok we'll ship you a Cool" note after receiving the shipping notice. I'm 99% sure it's cool, it is very similar to my SC52, which I find to be fairly warm for a "cool" light. I don't have any neutral white lights to use as a reference.


----------



## toysareforboys

xnmw said:


> I'm embarrassed to say I'm not sure. I had the Neutral on order, then got tired of waiting and requested to switch to Cool, then got a shipping notice, THEN got an "ok we'll ship you a Cool" note after receiving the shipping notice. I'm 99% sure it's cool, it is very similar to my SC52, which I find to be fairly warm for a "cool" light. I don't have any neutral white lights to use as a reference.


Ahhh, I see. Very tricky  Glad you like your new light! I'm hoping my new warm one is pretty!! If not I guess I'll have to get Vinh to swap out the LED, probably XML2-U2 5000k de-domed, comes out a nice warm 3500k or so, super creamy beam 




LICK FOR HIGH RES!

-Jamie M.


----------



## Matt.m

So you think just get 3 protected Keeppowers for my TN32 on order and get an unprotected NCR18650B Panny for the zebralight? Still kind of new to the whole Li ion scene. I have an xtar xp4 charger. Unprotected cells kind of scare me with all the gloom and doom stories I've heard. Am I just being ridiculous? Lol


----------



## roadkill1109

Matt.m said:


> So you think just get 3 protected Keeppowers for my TN32 on order and get an unprotected NCR18650B Panny for the zebralight? Still kind of new to the whole Li ion scene. I have an xtar xp4 charger. Unprotected cells kind of scare me with all the gloom and doom stories I've heard. Am I just being ridiculous? Lol



For unprotected 18650's, go with the Panasonics. Been using Panasonic cells for so many years now, no DOOM happening so far. Just let the cells rest after hard use and when they get really hot.

I would suggest the use of protected cells when using 18650's in series, as high-powered lights which use cells in series has a tendency to kill the 18650 closest to the head. I accidentally ruined one which went to zero volts and wouldn't charge anymore no matter what I did.

For lights with regulation, these are best with unprotected cells as you are able toe maximize the runtime and the performance of these cells, such as using them in the ZL SC600. Very very nice light...cant imagine why i didnt buy this sooner!  hahah...

Be careful of lights which do not have cut-off or regulation, these lights will zero the voltage of your 18650, damaging it permanently.


----------



## Matt.m

roadkill1109 said:


> For unprotected 18650's, go with the Panasonics. Been using Panasonic cells for so many years now, no DOOM happening so far. Just let the cells rest after hard use and when they get really hot.
> 
> I would suggest the use of protected cells when using 18650's in series, as high-powered lights which use cells in series has a tendency to kill the 18650 closest to the head. I accidentally ruined one which went to zero volts and wouldn't charge anymore no matter what I did.
> 
> For lights with regulation, these are best with unprotected cells as you are able toe maximize the runtime and the performance of these cells, such as using them in the ZL SC600. Very very night light...cant imagine why i didnt buy this sooner!  hahah...
> 
> Be careful of lights which do not have cut-off or regulation, these lights will zero the voltage of your 18650, damaging it permanently.



Thanks I really appreciate all the help. So 3 protected it is and 1 unprotected for the ZL. Should I just go by when the ZL says the battery is dead or should I periodically check the voltage?


----------



## roadkill1109

Matt.m said:


> Thanks I really appreciate all the help. So 3 protected it is and 1 unprotected for the ZL. Should I just go by when the ZL says the battery is dead or should I periodically check the voltage?



normally i would suggest two unprotected for the ZL, one to use, one for backup, so when it goes low batt, you can use the backup while the primary charges. Also distributing the wear between the two cells will make them last longer (well, technically you're just adding the wear evenly between the two cells). So far in the years of my using 18650's regularly (except for the ruined one) i haven't had the need to throw one away, some don't keep charge as long as they used to (Ultrafire 18650's) so i use them in moderate to low-drain flashlights thereby extending their usability. FYI, i stopped buying those "fire brands once i knew about these Panasonics. Also, I make sure that if i buy protected cells, they should be based on panasonic cells too. 

for the ZL, you know when your light is in need of charging, if you try it on max and it cuts to the next lower, that means your cells are just about spent. I tried letting it rest after noticing it wont go to high anymore and the voltage is between 3.7 to 3.9 volts, which is the time to charge it already. I would suggest the jetbeam i4 interllicharger as this has the most efficient way of charging any type of battery in a reasonable amount of time.


----------



## fnj

Second the idea of alternating between two cells as has been suggested. That's what I do. I swap out to the resting precharged cell when the voltage readout hits 3 blinks, or 2 blinks at the very latest. I favor the Panasonic 2900 unprotecteds on the theory that later, higher capacity models sacrifice some of the safety by making the insulating layer ridiculously thin - this might be silly, but I am well satisfied and sleep more soundly with the 2900s.

By the way, experts will tell you you wear out the cells permanently more quickly by storing them at full charge rather than at around 3.6v or so. The convenience of storing one cell at full charge, ready to go in an instant, makes it worthwhile to me. So far, looks like my cells are lasting very well. Remember, a LiIon starts to get cheaper than primary lithiums by the time it reaches only 6-12 recharges; never mind hundreds!


----------



## pjandyho

fnj said:


> By the way, experts will tell you you wear out the cells permanently more quickly by storing them at full charge rather than at around 3.6v or so. The convenience of storing one cell at full charge, ready to go in an instant, makes it worthwhile to me. So far, looks like my cells are lasting very well. Remember, a LiIon starts to get cheaper than primary lithiums by the time it reaches only 6-12 recharges; never mind hundreds!


I agree. Basically I have my cells fully charged and I don't really see much of of drop in performance. To be honest, I don't even notice any drop at all and some of my cells have been with me for 5 years.


----------



## KITROBASKIN

pjandyho said:


> I agree. Basically I have my cells fully charged and I don't really see much of of drop in performance. To be honest, I don't even notice any drop at all and some of my cells have been with me for 5 years.



Since we are on this issue and a number of you deserve respect for your knowledge:

Very quickly- Is it better to charge batteries at 1C all the time or will the batteries be more long lasting if charged, say .7C or less?


----------



## pjandyho

KITROBASKIN said:


> Since we are on this issue and a number of you deserve respect for your knowledge:
> 
> Very quickly- Is it better to charge batteries at 1C all the time or will the batteries be more long lasting if charged, say .7C or less?


I am afraid I can't comment on that since my charger does not charge at 1C and I have no experience on the longevity of the batteries when charged at 1C.

I think the issue of charging at 1C has more to do with safety than longevity. 18650 should not have an issue but it would be too risky on 16340 or 14500.


----------



## ntalbot

Calling all SC600w MKII owners: is your switch extremely soft like mine?
I received my sc600w mkii yesterday. I love everything about it except the switch. The switch is way softer than my SC52w's. I can barely feel the detent. The action is so mushy i have concentrate to double click successfully. 
I'm trying to find out if mine is normal or an outlier. I would like a firmer switch, or at the very least some assurance that the switch on mine is not faulty and destined to fail early. 
Thanks!


----------



## jbrett14

ntalbot said:


> Calling all SC600w MKII owners: is your switch extremely soft like mine?
> I received my sc600w mkii yesterday. I love everything about it except the switch. The switch is way softer than my SC52w's. I can barely feel the detent. The action is so mushy i have concentrate to double click successfully.
> I'm trying to find out if mine is normal or an outlier. I would like a firmer switch, or at the very least some assurance that the switch on mine is not faulty and destined to fail early.
> Thanks!



I don't have the sc600 but I recently bought the H602 and my switch is the same way. It is much softer than my other 3 Zebralights. At first, I thought it was defective but it seems to work fine. I prefer the CLICK of the other 3 I have but as long as it works, I'm fine with it.


----------



## fnj

ntalbot said:


> Calling all SC600w MKII owners: is your switch extremely soft like mine?
> I received my sc600w mkii yesterday. I love everything about it except the switch. The switch is way softer than my SC52w's. I can barely feel the detent. The action is so mushy i have concentrate to double click successfully.
> I'm trying to find out if mine is normal or an outlier. I would like a firmer switch, or at the very least some assurance that the switch on mine is not faulty and destined to fail early.
> Thanks!



Decidedly not mushy in the case of my two. They are not ridiculously overfirm like my Mk I, which I can barely use at all with extreme effort, but the action is very ergonomic, with a click release feedback and and an audible click. My Mk IIs are an absolute delight to use. They are not w's, but I can't imagone why there should be any difference at all.


----------



## TouchOfRed

Just got mine, in fact, i got it at friday. Well, ive played around with it and o Totally love it, but the switch is.. I cant say broken because it works, but sometimes it wont turn on or off, and when i'm trying to get to like Low2 from Low1, it turns of etc, so it doesnt register sometimes when i push. Is this a faulty lamp or am i doing something wrong? (Cant see what i'm doing wrong though)
this is the sc600 mkII l2, and i'm using a Fenix 3400mah battery. 


Thanks guys, i live in Sweden, so if i'm sending it back it Will cost me alot, and take alot of time. To bad


----------



## toysareforboys

TouchOfRed said:


> Just got mine, in fact, i got it at friday. Well, ive played around with it and o Totally love it, but the switch is.. I cant say broken because it works, but sometimes it wont turn on or off, and when i'm trying to get to like Low2 from Low1, it turns of etc, so it doesnt register sometimes when i push. Is this a faulty lamp or am i doing something wrong? (Cant see what i'm doing wrong though)
> this is the sc600 mkII l2, and i'm using a Fenix 3400mah battery.
> 
> 
> Thanks guys, i live in Sweden, so if i'm sending it back it Will cost me alot, and take alot of time. To bad


I noticed when using protected batteries with mine it behaves like that sometimes, I think because the tail cap isn't making a perfect electrical connection (because the battery is too long). When I drop in my flat top Pana 3400's it works flawless every time.

-Jamie M.


----------



## DavidMB

This light seems pretty amazing. Any advice on how to decide between the cool white and warm version?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## thedoc007

DavidMB said:


> This light seems pretty amazing. Any advice on how to decide between the cool white and warm version?



It is indeed a very nice light.

Tint preference is just that, a preference. Go with whichever you like better...after all, you're the one who will use it regularly. No other opinion really matters.


----------



## kaichu dento

DavidMB said:


> This light seems pretty amazing. Any advice on how to decide between the cool white and warm version?


Although I generally prefer slightly warmish tints, the tendency for ZL to deliver green instead of warm, I'd go with the cooler tint. Some users seem to have found the warm version acceptable, but I can't recall any complaints about the cool version and it should be the safer bet if you're good with cooler tints.


----------



## CrazyM

kaichu dento said:


> Although I generally prefer slightly warmish tints, the tendency for ZL to deliver green instead of warm, I'd go with the cooler tint. Some users seem to have found the warm version acceptable, but I can't recall any complaints about the cool version and it should be the safer bet if you're good with cooler tints.



That said, in the newer warm Zebralights (H52, SC600MkII L2) I have had 3 out of 3 with beautiful warm tints, no green at all. This is similar with other reports on CPF so i think they may be using a different bin now.


----------



## kaichu dento

CrazyM said:


> That said, in the newer warm Zebralights (H52, SC600MkII L2) I have had 3 out of 3 with beautiful warm tints, no green at all. This is similar with other reports on CPF so i think they may be using a different bin now.


Really!! Okay, then maybe I'm back to thinking of ordering one! 

Would that apply to the SC52w as well?


----------



## pjandyho

kaichu dento said:


> Really!! Okay, then maybe I'm back to thinking of ordering one!
> 
> Would that apply to the SC52w as well?


I am happy with my SC52w and although the tint is not perfect (since I would prefer more rosy), I think it is pretty good. I have seen worst neutral tints from other lights.


----------



## TouchOfRed

toysareforboys said:


> I noticed when using protected batteries with mine it behaves like that sometimes, I think because the tail cap isn't making a perfect electrical connection (because the battery is too long). When I drop in my flat top Pana 3400's it works flawless every time.
> 
> -Jamie M.



If i use protected 2600mah nitcorebatts, might that work? 
All my batts is flattop i Think. :/ 

thanks for for the reply


----------



## pjandyho

TouchOfRed said:


> If i use protected 2600mah nitcorebatts, might that work?
> All my batts is flattop i Think. :/
> 
> thanks for for the reply


I am not sure myself and would love to know the answer. The problem I had with the Nitecore 2600 batts is that they are slightly fatter than my AW. Can't seem to fit them into my Malkoff tubes whereas I have no issues with the AW batteries. Not sure if Nitecore would fit in the SC600w L2.


----------



## BirdofPrey

Mine (in neutral) will supposedly be here today. Will be a nice compliment to the new headlamp I got from them last month. 

Sent from my ridiculously large Galaxy Note 2.


----------



## Etsu

kaichu dento said:


> Although I generally prefer slightly warmish tints, the tendency for ZL to deliver green instead of warm, I'd go with the cooler tint. Some users seem to have found the warm version acceptable, but I can't recall any complaints about the cool version and it should be the safer bet if you're good with cooler tints.



I think the green is just part of Cree's LEDs. ZL may be less picky about the tint than other manufacturers, but all my XPG and XML Cree LEDs show some hint of green, regardless of the brand of light. It doesn't bother me, and it's only noticeable on white-wall tests, but it's there. The green is more noticeable the warmer the tint, but it's there in cool-white too.

If a hint of green bothers you, probably better to stick to Nichia or Luxeon LEDs.


----------



## markr6

ntalbot said:


> Calling all SC600w MKII owners: is your switch extremely soft like mine?
> I received my sc600w mkii yesterday. I love everything about it except the switch. The switch is way softer than my SC52w's. I can barely feel the detent. The action is so mushy i have concentrate to double click successfully.
> I'm trying to find out if mine is normal or an outlier. I would like a firmer switch, or at the very least some assurance that the switch on mine is not faulty and destined to fail early.
> Thanks!



It's pretty soft on mine. Here's a quick comparison of all mine

H51w (naturally very soft with the big button)
SC600W II - very soft
H52w - almost same as above
H600w II - just slightly harder
H600w - ROCK hard
SC52w - tied with H600w, maybe even harder


----------



## BirdofPrey

Ok, got it. Question. I've never used any of the program modes on my Zebralights and was curious as to whether the SC600 might come programmed for anything other than the highest setting with an initial turn on. 

Reason I ask is that my light really isn't overly impressive. My H600 kind of blew me away but this, not so much. 

My Nitecore P25 is considerably brighter to my eyes. I realize that the focus of the beam is different but this is a considerable difference in hotspot brightness. 

Opinions? 

Sent from my ridiculously large Galaxy Note 2.


----------



## TouchOfRed

pjandyho said:


> I am not sure myself and would love to know the answer. The problem I had with the Nitecore 2600 batts is that they are slightly fatter than my AW. Can't seem to fit them into my Malkoff tubes whereas I have no issues with the AW batteries. Not sure if Nitecore would fit in the SC600w L2.



Ive tried with My Fenix 3400mah, aw 3400mah, Nitecore 2300mah, flashlight is still the same with all batts. 
I have a couple of Ultrafire batts lying around, but i'm not even going to put those in any of My lights. 

i might have gotten a faulty light? Do you Know if i'm paying for the shipping to Zebralight? I thought because it's going to be a warranty send in, i might dont have to pay for shipping?


----------



## ntalbot

markr6 said:


> It's pretty soft on mine. Here's a quick comparison of all mine
> 
> H51w (naturally very soft with the big button)
> SC600W II - very soft
> H52w - almost same as above
> H600w II - just slightly harder
> H600w - ROCK hard
> SC52w - tied with H600w, maybe even harder



Thanks Mark! I guess they moved back to a soft switch for the SC600w mkII, or they got a batch of soft switches.
Nick


----------



## ntalbot

BirdofPrey said:


> Ok, got it. Question. I've never used any of the program modes on my Zebralights and was curious as to whether the SC600 might come programmed for anything other than the highest setting with an initial turn on.
> 
> Reason I ask is that my light really isn't overly impressive. My H600 kind of blew me away but this, not so much.
> 
> My Nitecore P25 is considerably brighter to my eyes. I realize that the focus of the beam is different but this is a considerable difference in hotspot brightness.
> 
> Opinions?
> 
> Sent from my ridiculously large Galaxy Note 2.


 
Is the switch on yours pretty soft?


----------



## ntalbot

ntalbot said:


> Is the switch on yours pretty soft?



BirdofPrey PM'd me and said his switch is neither soft nor hard and has a nice click to it.


----------



## Philabuster

The switch on my SC600w MKII is so soft I cannot stand using it anymore. 

I reverted back to my original 2 year old SC600w as my EDC after a few days. I really like the firm, clickie switch--especially when using gloves. I have NEVER had a problem with the firm switch and absolutely love it. 

I am going to send the MKII light back to Zebralight for an exchange. I hate the switch that bad.:sick2:

I also noticed the original SC600w has a slight green tint to it, but less noticeable than my SC52w--both are perfectly acceptable tints to me. 

By contrast, the new SC600w MKII has a PINK tinge to the color and is a bit annoying, but not as annoying as the limp switch.


----------



## Mr. Tone

I just ordered a SC600w MKII from Illumination Supply last night. I am looking forward to the ultra low modes and the UI, too. In addition, I like that this is designed around an 18650 only. I have plenty of lights to compare this to once I get it. Once it arrives I will give my first impressions. 

Nobody has a low enough moonlight mode for me but I have a feeling this will do the trick. The best moonlight modes I currently have are from a Thrunite Neutron 1A with neutral white XM-L and a L3 Illumination L10 with the Nichia 219. Those moonlight modes do work well for me but I wouldn't mind going lower.


----------



## decooney

Philabuster said:


> I reverted back to my original 2 year old SC600w as my EDC after a few days. I really like the firm, clickie switch--especially when using gloves. I have NEVER had a problem with the firm switch and absolutely love it.



Good to know. Thanks for the post. I've been struggling about parting with my SC600 MKI b light after picking up a new Eagletac TX25C2, but have decided to keep the older SC600. I think now after reading this I'm going to keep it. I really like it too, and it fills a niche' with nice soft even light that works really well in situations where some of the newer lights I just bought can be too much of a powerhouse in some situations.


----------



## Mr. Tone

decooney said:


> Good to know. Thanks for the post. I've been struggling about parting with my SC600 MKI b light after picking up a new Eagletac TX25C2, but have decided to keep the older SC600. I think now after reading this I'm going to keep it. I really like it too, and it fills a niche' with nice soft even light that works really well in situations where some of the newer lights I just bought can be too much of a powerhouse in some situations.



That makes sense because the TX25C2 is quite a compact thrower. When I first got the TX25C2 I was surprised by how tight and throwy the beam was because of the compactness of the light. I am hoping the Zebralight will have a larger and more gentle hotspot. According to the specs and reviews it should give me a wider spill and hotspot and not be as intense in the hotspot, either. This will be a good thing for general purpose use.


----------



## markr6

Mr. Tone said:


> That makes sense because the TX25C2 is quite a compact thrower. When I first got the TX25C2 I was surprised by how tight and throwy the beam was because of the compactness of the light. I am hoping the Zebralight will have a larger and more gentle hotspot. According to the specs and reviews it should give me a wider spill and hotspot and not be as intense in the hotspot, either. This will be a good thing for general purpose use.



I'm more of a floody person, but still like my SC600w II. It has a smaller hotspot than the SC52w which I really like, but with better throw of course.


----------



## Etsu

Mr. Tone said:


> Nobody has a low enough moonlight mode for me but I have a feeling this will do the trick. The best moonlight modes I currently have are from a Thrunite Neutron 1A with neutral white XM-L and a L3 Illumination L10 with the Nichia 219. Those moonlight modes do work well for me but I wouldn't mind going lower.



If you find the L10's moonlight mode too bright, then you certainly like low modes! ZL is great for low-low modes, but IMO, I find the lowest mode to be so dim as to be useless. Maybe good if you want to leave the light on all night so you can see where it is in the dark (camping?), but no good for seeing anything with it. Fun to play with for a bit, but that's about it. It's probably there more so that ZL can advertize extremely long (several months!) run-time.


----------



## tonkem

Etsu said:


> If you find the L10's moonlight mode too bright, then you certainly like low modes! ZL is great for low-low modes, but IMO, I find the lowest mode to be so dim as to be useless. Maybe good if you want to leave the light on all night so you can see where it is in the dark (camping?), but no good for seeing anything with it. Fun to play with for a bit, but that's about it. It's probably there more so that ZL can advertize extremely long (several months!) run-time.



Yes, but this varies by model. My H502 has a lower moonlight than the Sc52, and the S6330 has a higher moonlight than the sc52, for instance. The moonlight for the s6330 is extremely useful and with a 1 year runtime on the lowest mode


----------



## Etsu

tonkem said:


> YThe moonlight for the s6330 is extremely useful and with a 1 year runtime on the lowest mode



Probably varies by how good your vision is, too. I'm not too good below about 0.1-0.2 lumens, except for the hot-spot. Below about 0.03 lumens, and even the hot spot isn't much use to me. I think ZL's 0.01 lumen mode is well below 0.01 lumens in reality. Maybe it's closer to 0.01 lumens on the s6330, which would make it more useful.

Edit: I looked up the stats on the s6330, and it's quite a bit brighter on all modes than my ZL. Not surprising, since it has 3 emitters. So, I now see why it would be useful even on the lowest setting.


----------



## Mr. Tone

Etsu said:


> If you find the L10's moonlight mode too bright, then you certainly like low modes! ZL is great for low-low modes, but IMO, I find the lowest mode to be so dim as to be useless. Maybe good if you want to leave the light on all night so you can see where it is in the dark (camping?), but no good for seeing anything with it. Fun to play with for a bit, but that's about it. It's probably there more so that ZL can advertize extremely long (several months!) run-time.



What is nice is that there are several moonlight low modes to chose from with this Zebralight. I live in a rural area so there is very little ambient light in my house at night. When I need to get up in the middle of the night I do not like my eyes adjusting. The Neutron and L10 moonlight modes do not make me lose night vision and they are the first ones I had that did not. I also have a 4 mode drop-in from International Outdoor with a neutral white XM-L2 in it that has a moonlight mode equal to my Neutron. There are times, though, that I wish I had an even lower moonlight mode. I guess I am like Beacon of Light in that regard.


----------



## BWX

Etsu said:


> If you find the L10's moonlight mode too bright, then you certainly like low modes! ZL is great for low-low modes, but IMO, I find the lowest mode to be so dim as to be useless. Maybe good if you want to leave the light on all night so you can see where it is in the dark (camping?), but no good for seeing anything with it. Fun to play with for a bit, but that's about it. It's probably there more so that ZL can advertize extremely long (several months!) run-time.



I use SC600 MKI B moonlight mode all the time. You must not spend any time outside in the dark, with dark adjusted eyes.. Moonlight mode is very usable, not a gimmick at all.


----------



## Etsu

BWX said:


> I use SC600 MKI B moonlight mode all the time. You must not spend any time outside in the dark, with dark adjusted eyes.. Moonlight mode is very usable, not a gimmick at all.



I never said moonlight mode wasn't useful. I said the very dimmest of the moonlight modes on ZL isn't useful (to me). The other two brighter moonlights modes on it are fine. I like that ZL has 2 useful moonlight modes, and I wish that I could program them both as low modes (sadly, ZL doesn't allow it). But I think they included the 3rd and dimmest moonlight mode as a gimmick for advertizing very long run times. Some may like it to use for general illumination, and that's okay, I'm just not one of them. It's fine for lighting up a wrist-watch at close range, but my watch already has a light on it for that purpose.


----------



## markr6

Etsu said:


> I never said moonlight mode wasn't useful. I said the very dimmest of the moonlight modes on ZL isn't useful (to me). The other two brighter moonlights modes on it are fine. I like that ZL has 2 useful moonlight modes, and I wish that I could program them both as low modes (sadly, ZL doesn't allow it). But I think they included the 3rd and dimmest moonlight mode as a gimmick for advertizing very long run times. Some may like it to use for general illumination, and that's okay, I'm just not one of them. It's fine for lighting up a wrist-watch at close range, but my watch already has a light on it for that purpose.



I totally agree. I use the middle of the lowest, and of course, the highest low that is permanently set. But I would probably program the middle two if that were an option. Not a big deal for me though. And I too would never use the lowest.


----------



## BWX

Etsu said:


> I never said moonlight mode wasn't useful. I said the very dimmest of the moonlight modes on ZL isn't useful (to me). The other two brighter moonlights modes on it are fine. I like that ZL has 2 useful moonlight modes, and I wish that I could program them both as low modes (sadly, ZL doesn't allow it). But I think they included the 3rd and dimmest moonlight mode as a gimmick for advertizing very long run times. Some may like it to use for general illumination, and that's okay, I'm just not one of them. It's fine for lighting up a wrist-watch at close range, but my watch already has a light on it for that purpose.



Well I guess I haven't seen it so I cannot comment on that specific moonlight mode. I have a feeling I could use it outside on a very dark night with dark-adjusted eyes though.. The regular moonlight mode on the MKI B is actually very bright and throws quite a ways in the above scenario. I could use .5% or even .2% of that output.


----------



## RedForest UK

BWX said:


> Well I guess I haven't seen it so I cannot comment on that specific moonlight mode. I have a feeling I could use it outside on a very dark night with dark-adjusted eyes though.. The regular moonlight mode on the MKI B is actually very bright and throws quite a ways in the above scenario. I could use .5% or even .2% of that output.



There is a big difference, the moonlight on the MKI is blinding compared to the lowest mode on the SC52 (which I think is the same as on the new SC600). I find the MKI moonlight still too bright for a lot of uses with night adapted eyes, the highest programmable moon mode on the SC52 is about right but still too bright up within a couple of metres with fully adapted eyes (probably about 2/3rds of the SC600 MKI moon mode). There is a big drop to the middle moonlight, which I would say is below 10% of the MKI SC600s moonlight level, that is useable up to a few metres with fully night adapted eyes, but otherwise only within about a foot or so. The very lowest level is a bit stupid tbh, probably only 10-20% of the last one, so only 1-2% of the SC600 MKI's moonlight mode and imo completely useless apart from making the light itself visible/possible to find in the dark with night adapted eyes.

Also, going from the second lowest mode on the SC52 to the very lowest is only a drop on my DMM from 1.4mA to 1.25mA, so at levels that low most of the input current is lost in the circuit itself anyway, another reason I think it's a wasted mode choice. The highest SC52 moonlight level is about 2.2mA and the L1 mode 12.4 for comparison.


----------



## DavidMB

Is the moonlight that much brighter on the 600 compared to the sc52? When I looked at the specs I thought it went just as low, or was very close.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## tonkem

The old SC600, yes. But the newer one is probably very close. I don't have both, but I do have the Sc52 and have the H600 which was before Zebra added all the lower lower modes, and the H600 is brighter than the SC52. 



DavidMB said:


> Is the moonlight that much brighter on the 600 compared to the sc52? When I looked at the specs I thought it went just as low, or was very close.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## RedForest UK

It is on the MKI, which has only one moonlight mode. That is stated to be 0.1, the SC52 supposedly has 0.3, 0.06 and 0.01, but according to my two one of these must be out by quite a bit. If the SC52 levels are accurate then I would estimate my SC600 MKI to be about 0.5 lumens. Others have claimed that the official output levels for the SC52 are stated to be much higher than they are in reality though so it may be those that are off. The two lowest sub-levels of the SC52 are really low, like the difference from a normal 3 lumen low mode to a sub 0.5 lumen moonlight again from the moonlight mode to the 2nd lowest, and then again from that to the lowest one.


----------



## Etsu

RedForest UK said:


> It is on the MKI, which has only one moonlight mode. That is stated to be 0.1, the SC52 supposedly has 0.3, 0.06 and 0.01, but according to my two one of these must be out by quite a bit. If the SC52 levels are accurate then I would estimate my SC600 MKI to be about 0.5 lumens. Others have claimed that the official output levels for the SC52 are stated to be much higher than they are in reality though so it may be those that are off. The two lowest sub-levels of the SC52 are really low, like the difference from a normal 3 lumen low mode to a sub 0.5 lumen moonlight again from the moonlight mode to the 2nd lowest, and then again from that to the lowest one.



ZL way overstates the output of the SC52, especially in the moonlight modes. So, your MKI is probably closer to 0.1 lumens.

When I get time, I'll take a photo showing the moonlight modes of the SC52 when compared to other brands. I think that 4sevens is fairly accurate in their moonlight estimates in the Quarks (not so much for the Preon, IMO), so you may want to compare against them if you have any.

As someone else mentioned, it may just be that it's really hard to accurately and consistently output at very, very low modes.


----------



## decooney

Mr. Tone said:


> That makes sense because the TX25C2 is quite a compact thrower. When I first got the TX25C2 I was surprised by how tight and throwy the beam was because of the compactness of the light. I am hoping the Zebralight will have a larger and more gentle hotspot. According to the specs and reviews it should give me a wider spill and hotspot and not be as intense in the hotspot, either. This will be a good thing for general purpose use.



One of the first lights I got before jumping up to giant lights was my Zebra SC600 MKIb. It was not until I tried different larger and more throwy or more powerful 1x18650 and 2x18650 lights did I truly learn to appreciate the ZL and how it sprays nice wide and even light all over a large area in front of you. Even today I'm fascinated with the wide floody beam that it puts out. My little SC600 is the perfect micro-scale version of my larger O'Light SR96 which lights up a football field.


----------



## Mr. Tone

decooney said:


> One of the first lights I got before jumping up to giant lights was my Zebra SC600 MKIb. It was not until I tried different larger and more throwy or more powerful 1x18650 and 2x18650 lights did I truly learn to appreciate the ZL and how it sprays nice wide and even light all over a large area in front of you. Even today I'm fascinated with the wide floody beam that it puts out. My little SC600 is the perfect micro-scale version of my larger O'Light SR96 which lights up a football field.



I am glad to hear you like the beam profile. From the review it looks like the SC600w MKII should be very similar to the one you have.


----------



## decooney

Mr. Tone said:


> I am glad to hear you like the beam profile. From the review it looks like the SC600w MKII should be very similar to the one you have.



The main difference I see in reviews is the newer MKII version has more of a hot spot and it will definitely throw a little more than the MKI a/b versions.


----------



## Mr. Tone

decooney said:


> The main difference I see in reviews is the newer MKII version has more of a hot spot and it will definitely throw a little more than the MKI a/b versions.



It is too bad that Zebralight has not developed a diffuser to go along with these lights. That would be a nice addition to have a super low mode that is very even and diffused. Once I have this in hand maybe I will figure out something that will work for a diffuser. I am supposed to get it by Friday or Saturday as I got my shipping notice.


----------



## Mr Floppy

Mr. Tone said:


> It is too bad that Zebralight has not developed a diffuser to go along with these lights.



I've read somewhere that the Solarforce L2 range of filters and diffusers will fit. That's assuming that the new MK2 has the same diameter as the first. SC600


----------



## decooney

Mr. Tone,
Interesting you bring that up. One of the reasons I ended up with a separate 1x18650 light (O'Light M22 Warrior) was partly due to being able to quickly pop on a diffuser, changing it from a great little thrower to a flooder in seconds. I missed my prior Klarus XT11 I gave away to my brother-in-law and replaced it with an M22. A diffuser is a huge difference on an M22 for example, but somehow I think it will make less of a difference on a ZL if you add a diffuser. As I recall for comparison purposes, you also own a TX25C2 and it is much more throwy with much more noticeable hot spot than my ZL SC600. I see them as two completely different type lights, especially for close range use. I like each for very different reasons, because they are so different. If I had to guess, you might be very surprised with how floody the little ZL is stock without a diffuser. Very cool light, I think you're gonna like it quite a bit for the same reasons.


----------



## BirdofPrey

Just wanted to throw something out there. Went to my mom's earlier. She doesn't live out in the nice dark country side like me but she does live outside of town. 

With some ambient light as well as diffused (clouds) moonlight, I could pretty clearly see that my SC600 was shining light onto the neighbor's house. While I may have had a hard time seeing "detail" it was bright enough to see basic stuff. Doors, Windows, etc. 

According to a Google maps measuring tool, it appears to be a distance of 232 yards. 

For a light with so much use able spill, that is pretty darn impressive. 

Sent from my ridiculously large Galaxy Note 2.


----------



## BWX

232 yards.. Sounds like a good number. I'll go with that.


----------



## TouchOfRed

Yo, ive talked to Zebralight and they Said its going to take about 8weeks for them to fix the faulty switch.. Is that normal? If it is, that sucks... I can rather buy a new flashlight.. Not sure im happy with them. They make great lights, but 8weeks... Cmon


----------



## kaichu dento

Etsu said:


> I think the green is just part of Cree's LEDs. ZL may be less picky about the tint than other manufacturers, but all my XPG and XML Cree LEDs show some hint of green, regardless of the brand of light. It doesn't bother me, and it's only noticeable on white-wall tests, but it's there. The green is more noticeable the warmer the tint, but it's there in cool-white too.
> 
> If a hint of green bothers you, probably better to stick to Nichia or Luxeon LEDs.


I've definitely got XR-E's and XP-G's with no hint of green, especially my Draco and Clicky right off the top of my head but the whole issue of whether a particular tint is noticeable on white walls or anything else is really a non sequitur in my book as I became selective about my lights not only to get the job done, but to also enjoy it and although I can get just as much work done with most any tint, I can do it much more enjoyably with the light that appeals to my preference.

I'm sure that at some time in the next month or so that I'll probably go ahead and give a try to both the SC-52 and SC-600 II and will do so with full expectation of not liking the tint, but rather looking forward to the UI.


Mr. Tone said:


> I just ordered a SC600w MKII from Illumination Supply last night. I am looking forward to the ultra low modes and the UI, too. In addition, I like that this is designed around an 18650 only. I have plenty of lights to compare this to once I get it. Once it arrives I will give my first impressions.
> 
> Nobody has a low enough moonlight mode for me but I have a feeling this will do the trick. The best moonlight modes I currently have are from a Thrunite Neutron 1A with neutral white XM-L and a L3 Illumination L10 with the Nichia 219. Those moonlight modes do work well for me but I wouldn't mind going lower.


My V10R Ti definitely goes low enough for me at probably about .01, but this aspect of the newer lights from ZebraLight is one of the reasons I've been so interested in them.

Look forward to hearing your take on the lower levels, not to mention how good your switch is.


----------



## BWX

TouchOfRed said:


> Yo, ive talked to Zebralight and they Said its going to take about 8weeks for them to fix the faulty switch.. Is that normal? If it is, that sucks... I can rather buy a new flashlight.. Not sure im happy with them. They make great lights, but 8weeks... Cmon



My first ever "real" LED light was an H501.. It worked for almost a year, then the switch went out.. Then it took probably 10 weeks for turnaround for a second one, which worked for a few months (switch), then another 8 week turnaround (then switch broke), then they sent another that was DOA, then that took 8 weeks, then they sent another that worked for three months and then the switch started acting up, then red goo started coming out if the battery tube end, then it quit working.. Now I have a $95 dollar paperweight, more like $200 if you consider all the shipping money I wasted trying to get a good one, which never happened. I gave up after that.

Yea if it takes only 8 weeks, consider yourself lucky. You'll probably get a dud ("re-manufactured"... right) in return though so I would think very seriously about sending anything back. I got 5 defective lights in a row from ZL.

My SC600 MI B switch started acting up bad and was almost unusable, but I ended up waiting to see if it would work in and loosen up.. Finally after six months, it now works great (it literally took 6 months of EDC for break-in), and I was about to send it back. I'm glad I didn't now.


----------



## Etsu

TouchOfRed said:


> Yo, ive talked to Zebralight and they Said its going to take about 8weeks for them to fix the faulty switch.. Is that normal? If it is, that sucks... I can rather buy a new flashlight.. Not sure im happy with them. They make great lights, but 8weeks... Cmon



This is a brand new flashlight you got with a faulty switch, isn't it? If so, that's really bad customer service. They should ship you a new light right away, not fix a broken light they sold you. Demand better service. You paid for a new light, you should get a new light that works. You shouldn't have to wait 2 months to get it, either.

Different story if this is a light that developed a warranty problem after a few months of use. But even in that scenario, 8 weeks (plus probably another 4-6 weeks combined shipping delays) is poor service, IMO.


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## RedForest UK

BWX: That sounds very unlucky, I've had two experiences with Zebralight returns. One time my H501w started acting weird so I sent it in for repair. I got it back around 8 weeks later (yes it was a long wait) but it was the same light with the circuit replaced for the newer version and it has worked fine since then. The second time I returned an SC51w and never heard back from them despite me following it up, they just said they never received it. I'm not sure if I would class that as bad service as if it was lost in the post it wasn't their fault, but they didn't do anything to fix it. At least I got my money back from the post office as the package was insured.

TouchofRed: I agree if the light is as new you should ask for a replacement instead. If not then unfortunately 8 weeks is the turnaround time.


----------



## Mr. Tone

The last Zebralight I purchased was a H501w back when they came out a number of years ago. I really like the Zebralight concepts and designs but I have held off on another because of my experience with the H501w. It never actually worked right for long. It works exactly as it's supposed to on the low and medium modes. However, on high it will flicker and this is something very obvious and distracting. It will do this with freshly charged nimh batteries including Eneloops. It also does it with alkalines. It will not flicker with 14500 but as many know that gives a noticeable reduced high output. I cleaned it thoroughly with DeOxit, rubbing alcohol, etc. None of that helped. 

I contact Zebralight about it and they said I could ship it back to China and gave me a RA. I wasn't about to do that as I figured the chance of it getting lost in the mail wasn't worth having no light at all. So I just decided to get a Spark headlamp instead and relegated the Zebralight to my toolbox as a last resort light. Hopefully this SC600w MKII will be reliable for me. I am finally giving Zebralight a try again because I really like the design of this light.


----------



## Mr. Tone

decooney said:


> Mr. Tone,
> Interesting you bring that up. One of the reasons I ended up with a separate 1x18650 light (O'Light M22 Warrior) was partly due to being able to quickly pop on a diffuser, changing it from a great little thrower to a flooder in seconds. I missed my prior Klarus XT11 I gave away to my brother-in-law and replaced it with an M22. A diffuser is a huge difference on an M22 for example, but somehow I think it will make less of a difference on a ZL if you add a diffuser. As I recall for comparison purposes, you also own a TX25C2 and it is much more throwy with much more noticeable hot spot than my ZL SC600. I see them as two completely different type lights, especially for close range use. I like each for very different reasons, because they are so different. If I had to guess, you might be very surprised with how floody the little ZL is stock without a diffuser. Very cool light, I think you're gonna like it quite a bit for the same reasons.



I like a diffused light best when using moonlight modes. That was my one of my problems with my Quark with XP-E. When using it in moonlight mode you could only see the hotspot. The Neutron has a more even beam and so does the L10. In addition, the Quark was too bright for me at 0.2 lumens.  However, if this SC600w MKII will give me a beam similar to a P60 drop-in with a XM-L2 and orange peel reflector I will be happy with it and not need a diffuser. I am hoping it will be similar.


----------



## RedForest UK

Mr. Tone said:


> However, if this SC600w MKII will give me a beam similar to a P60 drop-in with a XM-L2 and orange peel reflector I will be happy with it and not need a diffuser. I am hoping it will be similar.



If anything it should be a bit floodier, with my MKI there is a wider hotspot but no real corona (not like the 2-stage hotspots of my OP P60 XM-Ls) and then the flood extends noticably wider than a P60 beam as well.


----------



## Mr. Tone

RedForest UK said:


> If anything it should be a bit floodier, with my MKI there is a wider hotspot but no real corona (not like the 2-stage hotspots of my OP P60 XM-Ls) and then the flood extends noticably wider than a P60 beam as well.



That would be even better!


----------



## GunnarGG

*Sv: ZebraLight SC600 MkII*

Mr. Tone,

You said that you used your H502 with a 14500.
The H502 is for alkaline and NiMh only afaik.
Could it be that the circuit got damaged of over voltage?


----------



## Mr. Tone

*Re: Sv: ZebraLight SC600 MkII*



GunnarGG said:


> Mr. Tone,
> 
> You said that you used your H502 with a 14500.
> The H502 is for alkaline and NiMh only afaik.
> Could it be that the circuit got damaged of over voltage?



Oops, I meant to say that I had the H501w. I never had a H502w and I just forgot the proper model. The H501w was designed to work with AA and 14500 but it said that with 14500 the output would be only like 40% of high vs. AA. I will edit my post to avoid any further confusion.


----------



## RedForest UK

*Re: Sv: ZebraLight SC600 MkII*

Have you tried tightening the tailcap a bit harder? I found at one point that on eneloops my H501w would flicker a bit on high, I'd thought the tailcap was already fully screwed down but I tried tightening it with a bit more force and the flickering went away. No problems since then.


----------



## Mr. Tone

*Re: Sv: ZebraLight SC600 MkII*



RedForest UK said:


> Have you tried tightening the tailcap a bit harder? I found at one point that on eneloops my H501w would flicker a bit on high, I'd thought the tailcap was already fully screwed down but I tried tightening it with a bit more force and the flickering went away. No problems since then.



Oh, yes, I tried that. Believe me when I say I tried everything with the H501w.


----------



## EZO

After waiting more than six weeks, I finally received the Zebralight SC600W MkII L2 I ordered from Illumination Supply. It was worth the wait! 
Firstly, the tint is just gorgeous. It is a warm creamy neutral color and the best way I can describe it is that it looks like sunshine on a cloudless day. Perfect! Although I've previously posted about my experience and thoughts on the whole SC52W green tint brouhaha, which I think is overblown, when I compare the tint of the SC600W MkII with the SC52W the difference is night and day. The SC52W definitely is greenish by comparison. (but still not really a problem except when pointed at a white wall for no other reason than to judge the tint)

The fit and finish is also perfect and the light has a great "hand feel". I'm delighted with the light.

The switch is firm and works the way it should but it took a little time with the light to get used to the pressure and "touch" that it likes.

And although I have no real use for the feature, the 19 Hz high frequency "disorienting dazzler" strobe setting is unique and interesting and has been kind of fun to play around with. Kinda' psychedelic! 

I have only one nit-picky complaint. When I first got the light, I noticed that there was a foggy film on the lens. After cleaning the lens carefully it was dramatically improved but it turns out there is still a subtle film on the *inside* of the lens! Not pleased about this manufacturing "sloppiness" but in real world use of the light it seems irrelevant.


----------



## ntalbot

EZO said:


> After waiting more than six weeks, I finally received the Zebralight SC600 MkII I ordered from Illumination Supply. It was worth the wait!
> Firstly, the tint is just gorgeous. It is a warm creamy neutral color and the best way I can describe it is that it looks like sunshine on a cloudless day. Perfect! Although I've previous posted about my experience and thoughts on the whole SC52W green tint brouhaha, which I think is overblown, when I compare the tint of the SC600 MkII with the SC52W the difference is night and day. The SC52W definitely is greenish by comparison. (but still not really a problem except when pointed at a white wall for no other reason than to judge the tint)
> 
> The fit and finish is also perfect and the light has a great "hand feel". I'm delighted with the light.
> 
> The switch is firm and works the way it should but it took a little time with the light to get used to the pressure and "touch" that it likes.
> 
> And although for the time being I have no real use for the feature, the high frequency "disorienting dazzle" strobe setting is unique and interesting and has been kind of fun to play around with. Kinda' psychedelic!
> 
> I have only one nit-picky complaint. When I first got the light, I noticed that there was a foggy film on the lens. After cleaning the lens carefully it was dramatically improved but it turns out there is still a subtle film on the *inside* of the lens! Not pleased about this manufacturing "sloppiness" but in real world use of the light it seems irrelevant.



So you got the SC600 mkII, not the SC600w mkII? And it looks warm, neutral and creamy?
That's strange! I thought the tint would be pretty cool on the non-"w" versions.


----------



## EZO

ntalbot said:


> So you got the SC600 mkII, not the SC600w mkII? And it looks warm, neutral and creamy?
> That's strange! I thought the tint would be pretty cool on the non-"w" versions.



OOPS! My Bad! It is the SC600*W* MKII. I'll go back and correct the omission in my post.


----------



## Mr. Tone

EZO said:


> OOPS! My Bad! It is the SC600*W* MKII. I'll go back and correct the omission in my post.



Hopefully my tint will be nice, too.


----------



## EZO

Mr. Tone said:


> Hopefully my tint will be nice, too.



Good luck! It does seem to be a crap shoot. Hopefully, Zebralight has gotten the hint from all the complaints about the tint issues and they are now putting more effort into addressing this problem.


----------



## KiwiMark

So, I'm considering buy this light (the w version) and want to order from Zebralight due to the free international shipping (will save me quite a bit).

I see: *
Availability:* Back Order

So, what does that mean?
Do I just order the light and wait, if so then how long is it likely to take?
Do they get these lights in regularly and ship to those that ordered with me only having to wait for a week or two?
Or will they get stock in and change the availability to "in stock" if I just wait for a while?
i.e. should I just keep checking their site or should I order a light now and patiently wait for their stock to arrive and my light to be sent out?


----------



## Etsu

EZO said:


> After waiting more than six weeks, I finally received the Zebralight SC600W MkII I ordered from Illumination Supply. It was worth the wait!
> Firstly, the tint is just gorgeous. It is a warm creamy neutral color and the best way I can describe it is that it looks like sunshine on a cloudless day.



Just to nitpick. Sunlight on a cloudless day is around 5500K, which is in the color temperature range of cool white, not neutral. But, I know what you mean... we tend to think of sunlight as a warmer color than it actually is. But if you want to test it out, shine your neutral white light on top of some sunlight at mid day, and your light will look quite yellow in comparison.





KiwiMark said:


> So, I'm considering buy this light (the w version) and want to order from Zebralight due to the free international shipping (will save me quite a bit).
> 
> I see: *
> Availability:* Back Order
> 
> So, what does that mean?



In theory, it means they expect to have some available soon to ship (that's what they told me), so they're accepting orders. But in reality, it seems to mean absolutely nothing. ZL seems to take orders then cancel them, or leave you waiting for weeks/months, or ship right away. You may as well just roll some dice to guess what they're going to do.


----------



## EZO

Etsu said:


> Just to nitpick. Sunlight on a cloudless day is around 5500K, which is in the color temperature range of cool white, not neutral. But, I know what you mean... we tend to think of sunlight as a warmer color than it actually is. But if you want to test it out, shine your neutral white light on top of some sunlight at mid day, and your light will look quite yellow in comparison.



If you say you know what I meant, what's the point of nitpicking? It seems "nitpicking" for the sake of it has become a hallmark here at CPF. In any event, it was meant descriptively, not literally as it has the "feel" of sunlight streaming in through a window on a sunny day.


----------



## Mr. Tone

EZO said:


> Good luck! It does seem to be a crap shoot. Hopefully, Zebralight has gotten the hint from all the complaints about the tint issues and they are now putting more effort into addressing this problem.



To be fair, the tint thing is really probably more of a Cree problem than anything to do with Zebralight. XM-L and XM-L2 are particularly troublesome with the different gradients of tint they produce. The light that comes off from the side of the emitter is quite ugly and different from the front. All of my XM-L and XM-L2 lights have a different CCT in the spill, hotspot, and corona. It is unfortunate for sure. That is thing I like a lot about the Nichia 219 Hi CRI and also the MT-G2 is that both of those emitters seem to have a fairly consistent tint between the spill, corona, and hotspot. The smaller Cree emitters don't seem to have as much a problem with this as the XM-L variants.


----------



## EZO

Mr. Tone said:


> To be fair, the tint thing is really probably more of a Cree problem than anything to do with Zebralight. XM-L and XM-L2 are particularly troublesome with the different gradients of tint they produce. The light that comes off from the side of the emitter is quite ugly and different from the front. All of my XM-L and XM-L2 lights have a different CCT in the spill, hotspot, and corona. It is unfortunate for sure. That is thing I like a lot about the Nichia 219 Hi CRI and also the MT-G2 is that both of those emitters seem to have a fairly consistent tint between the spill, corona, and hotspot. The smaller Cree emitters don't seem to have as much a problem with this as the XM-L variants.



I agree! On the other hand, CREE has a lot of incentive to improve the accuracy and consistency of its tints on all emitters they produce for reasons that go far beyond fussy flashlight enthusiasts. Much of their business, far more than flashlights, is for architectural and commercial applications where CRI is critical. For example, in store display lighting many products, especially food items look very unappealing under the wrong color temperature and lighting designers and architects need to have their specifications met or they will not buy CREE products. This can only bode well in the long run for us flashaholic tint snobs.


----------



## Mr. Tone

EZO said:


> I agree! On the other hand, CREE has a lot of incentive to improve the accuracy and consistency of its tints on all emitters they produce for reasons that go far beyond fussy flashlight enthusiasts. Much of their business, far more than flashlights, is for architectural and commercial applications where CRI is critical. For example, in store display lighting many products, especially food items look very unappealing under the wrong color temperature and lighting designers and architects need to have their specifications met or they will not buy CREE products. This can only bode well in the long run for us flashaholic tint snobs.



You are right on about the need for consistent tint and CRI. One thing I have noticed, though, is that these tint differences and problems are most noticeable when using a reflector. If you have the opportunity to see what a XM-L2 produces when completely bare and using no reflector you would see what I mean. The ugly tint that is near the side of the emitter doesn't make it's way onto objects because it is projected onto the housing it is in and lost. I do not know what happens when using an optic, though, such as a Carlco, etc.


----------



## 18650

kaichu dento said:


> I've definitely got XR-E's and XP-G's with no hint of green, especially my Draco and Clicky right off the top of my head but the whole issue of whether a particular tint is noticeable on white walls or anything else is really a non sequitur in my book as I became selective about my lights not only to get the job done, but to also enjoy it and although I can get just as much work done with most any tint, I can do it much more enjoyably with the light that appeals to my preference.


 I have many XP-G and a couple XP-G2's here (and XP-E's too) and there's green, blue, and purple. Some more than others. Random tint is random.


----------



## toysareforboys

18650 said:


> I have many XP-G and a couple XP-G2's here (and XP-E's too) and there's green, blue, and purple. Some more than others. Random tint is random.


My SC600 MKii (not L2) is so lemon lime with a hint of purple it's disgusting 

I recently got a P60 dropin from Vinhnguyen54 and it's got a XML2-U2 5000k de-domed at 3amps and OMG the beam is so warm and creamy  I'd guess around 3500K-4000k and no hint of any colours at all and throws like a monster for a P60 style light 




LICK FOR HIGH RES!

I pray that my SC600w L2 tint will be at least even half as pretty 

-Jamie M.


----------



## Etsu

EZO said:


> If you say you know what I meant, what's the point of nitpicking? It seems "nitpicking" for the sake of it has become a hallmark here at CPF. In any event, it was meant descriptively, not literally as it has the "feel" of sunlight streaming in through a window on a sunny day.



Sure, but warm and creamy "neutral" is not what sunlight streaming in through a window actually is. If you want sunlight, get a cool white XML.


----------



## EZO

Mr. Tone said:


> You are right on about the need for consistent tint and CRI. One thing I have noticed, though, is that these tint differences and problems are most noticeable when using a reflector. If you have the opportunity to see what a XM-L2 produces when completely bare and using no reflector you would see what I mean. The ugly tint that is near the side of the emitter doesn't make it's way onto objects because it is projected onto the housing it is in and lost. I do not know what happens when using an optic, though, such as a Carlco, etc.



You make an interesting point. You would think there might me a simple method to mask the emitters so they won't do that in a reflector.


----------



## Etsu

EZO said:


> You make an interesting point. You would think there might me a simple method to mask the emitters so they won't do that in a reflector.



Or perhaps make a reflector that is only reflective on the last half of it, and black on the first half (the part closest to the LED). That way, some of the edge light of the LED would be absorbed by the black, while the good-tinted center light would hit the reflector and be used. It's not perfect, but might help if some kind of LED mask wasn't possible (due to heat or something like that).


----------



## toysareforboys

Etsu said:


> Or perhaps make a reflector that is only reflective on the last half of it, and black on the first half (the part closest to the LED). That way, some of the edge light of the LED would be absorbed by the black, while the good-tinted center light would hit the reflector and be used. It's not perfect, but might help if some kind of LED mask wasn't possible (due to heat or something like that).


I've noticed when you de-dome a LED a LOT less light comes out the "side" of the LED and none of my de-domed lights have any strange colours in the spill.

-Jamie M.


----------



## EZO

Etsu said:


> Sure, but warm and creamy "neutral" is not what sunlight streaming in through a window actually is. If you want sunlight, get a cool white XML.



I guess it depends on what time of day or even what time of year along with one's latitude and longitude but the SC600 MKII L2 I received is more reminiscent of sunlight than any cool white light I own XML or otherwise. Anyway, I see you are still picking nits with my statement. Color temperature measurements aside, this is just my general impression of the output of this light, and I like it so I'll describe it the way I please and you do that for your own lights, OK?


----------



## BWX

Mr. Tone said:


> So I just decided to get a Spark headlamp instead and relegated the Zebralight to my toolbox as a last resort light.



I got a Spark SL6-800CW, and had nothing but issues with it.. Won't work on turbo, just cuts off.. have to take off tail cap to restart light.. it is useless. Did same thing trying to replace it with Going Gear. Three replacements all did same, but they said they tested it before sending. I dunno. Never got one that works.. Nice looking $100 paperweight. :-/

BUT, I also got a ST6 500CW headlamp too.. (old XM-L T6) with diffuser lens. 

That might be one of the most useful lights I own. I use it all the time, so many different uses.. It has great run time and output and a very nice cool white tint. It is probably my favorite light in general. Wouldn't mind upgrading to a new one with latest XM L2 when they come out for even more output and more run-time. But really, this "old" XM-L is just fine really.
Such an awesome headlamp.


----------



## Mr. Tone

toysareforboys said:


> I've noticed when you de-dome a LED a LOT less light comes out the "side" of the LED and none of my de-domed lights have any strange colours in the spill.
> 
> -Jamie M.



This is something I plan to experiment with in the future. I am not quite ready to start de-doming but getting close to buying a few XM-L2 on Noctigon boards to see what happens and if I can do it right.


----------



## Mr. Tone

BWX said:


> I got a Spark SL6-800CW, and had nothing but issues with it.. Won't work on turbo, just cuts off.. have to take off tail cap to restart light.. it is useless. Did same thing trying to replace it with Going Gear. Three replacements all did same, but they said they tested it before sending. I dunno. Never got one that works.. Nice looking $100 paperweight. :-/
> 
> BUT, I also got a ST6 500CW headlamp too.. (old XM-L T6) with diffuser lens.
> 
> That might be one of the most useful lights I own. I use it all the time, so many different uses.. It has great run time and output and a very nice cool white tint. It is probably my favorite light in general. Wouldn't mind upgrading to a new one with latest XM L2 when they come out for even more output and more run-time. But really, this "old" XM-L is just fine really.
> Such an awesome headlamp.



That is too bad. I have had good luck with mine, which is a SD6-460NW. I bought the optional reflector so I have both options. I prefer full flood with it most of the time and the magnet is very handy.


----------



## BWX

Never got the magnet! I was always going to get one, but forget about it. That would make it even more useful. Bet that NW looks nice.
maybe if I get another I'll try the NW version.


----------



## kaichu dento

18650 said:


> I have many XP-G and a couple XP-G2's here (and XP-E's too) and there's green, blue, and purple. Some more than others. Random tint is random.


You got random tints because you bought random emitters. There is no green, blue or purple on the best of the Cree's, and that's what I got because random wasn't what I was interested in.


----------



## RIX TUX

I have sc600 and wondering if anyone has modified it to make it throw more? different reflector or something else? thanks


----------



## Slumber

RIX TUX said:


> I have sc600 and wondering if anyone has modified it to make it throw more? different reflector or something else? thanks



There was a post a while back where someone replaced the reflector on the SC600 with an optic. The beam looked more concentrated, but I don't know how much more throw he got out of it.


----------



## Etsu

kaichu dento said:


> You got random tints because you bought random emitters. There is no green, blue or purple on the best of the Cree's, and that's what I got because random wasn't what I was interested in.



You're only going to get random with Zebralight's Cree designs. They could hand-pick the best tints for a bit higher cost, but they don't.


----------



## kaichu dento

Etsu said:


> You're only going to get random with Zebralight's Cree designs. They could hand-pick the best tints for a bit higher cost, but they don't.


Unfortunately and apparently true, but if some of the recent posts are any indicator it may be getting at least a little better.

Are most of you guys buying direct from Zebralight? I guess any recent upgrades would be coming direct from the factory than from other sources.


----------



## markr6

kaichu dento said:


> Unfortunately and apparently true, but if some of the recent posts are any indicator it may be getting at least a little better.
> 
> Are most of you guys buying direct from Zebralight? I guess any recent upgrades would be coming direct from the factory than from other sources.



I've been buying from both Illumination Supply and Zebralight direct. Obviously, though, the newest models are basically right out of ZL since they're on backorder and just being passed thru (not sitting in a vendors warehouse). I was OK with this since I wanted the "new" anodizing color. Unfortunatley the tint lottery is still there for sure. Actually, based on my last SC52w, it's gotten even worse.


----------



## Etsu

markr6 said:


> I've been buying from both Illumination Supply and Zebralight direct. Obviously, though, the newest models are basically right out of ZL since they're on backorder and just being passed thru (not sitting in a vendors warehouse). I was OK with this since I wanted the "new" anodizing color. Unfortunatley the tint lottery is still there for sure. Actually, based on my last SC52w, it's gotten even worse.



And given the long back-order wait for the SC52w, Zebralight has zero incentive to improve the tint variability. They're selling out just fine the way it is.

Perhaps if they ran their business better and improved inventory management, there might be an opportunity to sell more if they were more consistent, but that's not the case. Besides, most people don't care much about tint, they care about lumens.


----------



## EZO

markr6 said:


> I've been buying from both Illumination Supply and Zebralight direct. Obviously, though, the newest models are basically right out of ZL since they're on backorder and just being passed thru (not sitting in a vendors warehouse). I was OK with this since I wanted the "new" anodizing color. Unfortunatley the tint lottery is still there for sure. Actually, based on my last SC52w, it's gotten even worse.



It is interesting that you bring this up. Maybe it was a form of "magical thinking" but the fact that I had to wait for so long for my SC600W MK II L2 to ship led me to think that perhaps the later production runs were the reason I was so pleased with the tint. Then again, maybe I just got lucky. Anyway, I bought from Illumination Supply because it was hard not to pass up their steeply discounted holiday promotion on Zebras, although I too have purchased directly from Zebralight. As far as I can tell, in regard to the tint, I don't think it makes a difference where you order from. Time will tell if the tint issues from Zebra products improve or not but Etsu makes a good point. If Zebralight can't make them fast enough, they have little motivation to address the issue. Then again, one has to believe that a company like Zebralight that goes to such lengths to design circuitry that virtually no other firm in the industry can match must care about things like tint.


----------



## markr6

Good points. Please note that I also recently purchased an H600wII, SC600wII and H52w and they ALL have really nice, matching, neutral tints. I just can't seem to catch a break on the SC52w though.


----------



## Mr. Tone

Surprisingly, I received my SC600w MKII this morning. Every now and then USPS surprises me with delivering a package _before_ the estimated delivery date instead of _after_. Now, on to first impressions. This thing is even more compact than I expected, which is nice. It has great output and the tint is good. As far as the tint goes it still has the typical CCT difference between the hotspot and spill. This is not Zebralight's fault but just the way these Cree XM-L2 chips are designed. Specifically, the hotspot is warmer or more yellow than the spill.

The high output is very bright and similar to my other neutral white XM-L2 lights. However, the moonlight modes were what I was so drawn to by this light and it does not disappoint. As I said earlier, I have been using the moonlight modes of my Thrunite Neutron 1A neutral white and also a 4-mode P60 drop-in from International Outdoor with a neutral white XM-L2 in it and a orange peel reflector. Those moonlight modes have been working well for me but sometimes I wished I could go lower. The highest of the moonlight modes on the Zebralight is almost the same or maybe a little brighter than my other two lights. However, the lowest and middle moonlight modes on the Zebralight are definitely lower in output. The lowest of which is crazy dim! That is awesome how they managed to pull off that low of a current. I will have to wait until bedtime and night adapted eyes to figure out which one I will select.

The fit and finish are all really good. My only problem is that the pocket clip was bent on one of the prongs that wrap around the light. The box was undamaged so it must have come that way from the factory. I took a couple pics of it just to be on the safe side. After I did that I tried to bend it back into shape by hand so that it would work. Hopefully, it will be ok and not break but I know how metal does not like to be bent back and forth. 

So my first impressions are really good and I like the UI. I am looking forward to some more time with it and especially having even lower moonlight modes to choose from.


----------



## EZO

Mr. Tone - Sorry to hear about the damaged clip. I hope they replace it for you, as they should. In a worst-case scenario, Zebralight sells clips for this light as an after market accessory for $2.95 (USD).

P.S. I've been really enjoying the moonlight modes on this light too. All in all, this is one impressive flashlight.


----------



## Mr. Tone

^

That is good to know replacement clips are inexpensive. I can imagine it would break or fall off and get lost at some point, anyway.


----------



## TouchOfRed

BWX said:


> My first ever "real" LED light was an H501.. It worked for almost a year, then the switch went out.. Then it took probably 10 weeks for turnaround for a second one, which worked for a few months (switch), then another 8 week turnaround (then switch broke), then they sent another that was DOA, then that took 8 weeks, then they sent another that worked for three months and then the switch started acting up, then red goo started coming out if the battery tube end, then it quit working.. Now I have a $95 dollar paperweight, more like $200 if you consider all the shipping money I wasted trying to get a good one, which never happened. I gave up after that.
> 
> Yea if it takes only 8 weeks, consider yourself lucky. You'll probably get a dud ("re-manufactured"... right) in return though so I would think very seriously about sending anything back. I got 5 defective lights in a row from ZL.
> 
> My SC600 MI B switch started acting up bad and was almost unusable, but I ended up waiting to see if it would work in and loosen up.. Finally after six months, it now works great (it literally took 6 months of EDC for break-in), and I was about to send it back. I'm glad I didn't now.





Etsu said:


> This is a brand new flashlight you got with a faulty switch, isn't it? If so, that's really bad customer service. They should ship you a new light right away, not fix a broken light they sold you. Demand better service. You paid for a new light, you should get a new light that works. You shouldn't have to wait 2 months to get it, either.
> 
> Different story if this is a light that developed a warranty problem after a few months of use. But even in that scenario, 8 weeks (plus probably another 4-6 weeks combined shipping delays) is poor service, IMO.





RedForest UK said:


> BWX: That sounds very unlucky, I've had two experiences with Zebralight returns. One time my H501w started acting weird so I sent it in for repair. I got it back around 8 weeks later (yes it was a long wait) but it was the same light with the circuit replaced for the newer version and it has worked fine since then. The second time I returned an SC51w and never heard back from them despite me following it up, they just said they never received it. I'm not sure if I would class that as bad service as if it was lost in the post it wasn't their fault, but they didn't do anything to fix it. At least I got my money back from the post office as the package was insured.
> 
> TouchofRed: I agree if the light is as new you should ask for a replacement instead. If not then unfortunately 8 weeks is the turnaround time.



Thanks Guys for your replies, i emailed them again and explained. Hope the Will change their mind about it, if not. I'm not sure i Will stay as a customer to Zebralight anymore. Too bad for me though, because i love the UI and the design of them. 

About the break-in, how did the light act up? Because mine works, but it skips/not register the click sometimes when i push it, and turns off when i want to go to the sublevels. And sometimes i must click it like 15times to turn it on, and when i'm turning it off, ill have to remove the tailcap if it cant turn of thru the switch.

EDIT: i got an email, and they Said that they Will ship me a new light, but i need to send in My light before they ship me a new One. I get a new light yaaay, but still 8week i guess. 
What do you guya Think, is it good it bad service? Im not sure what to Think..


----------



## BWX

*"And sometimes i must click it like 15times to turn it on, and when i'm turning it off, ill have to remove the tailcap if it cant turn of thru the switch."*

That's much worse than mine was when it was acting weird. 

Mine would just not register clicks, even though it was a full deliberate click. Or it would double click when I intended one click, but only heard one click. Just was not working good. Never had issues as bad as what you're saying. If it was that bad, yeah I would have returned it.

It took me years before I bought another ZL after the H501 experience. I wanted an SC600 though, so I finally just got one, and then the switch issue, but it resolved itself or broke-in or whatever as I said. 

If the switch was on the tail, I'd be happy. As it is, it's a great EDC, but I wish they had a model with a tail clicker. I literally always have it on me, take it everywhere I go, and use it about 50 times a day, every day.


----------



## Mr. Tone

I played around with the moonlight modes last night. I went with the middle one which seems like it is about 1/2 to 3/4 the brightness of my Thrunite Neutron. That seems in line with selfbuilt's review(.02 lumens). The lowest one is just a little too low for my general use but still not useless, that's for sure. It is useless if your eyes aren't dark adapted, of course. In that situation you can't even tell it is on unless you look at the emitter or put the light right up to an object. Now I finally have a moonlight mode that is just right for my needs.


----------



## ntalbot

I contacted Illumination Supply about my extremely soft switch on my SC600wMkII (it's so soft that it's tricky to change modes). This is their reply:

"Hi Neil,

I had a chat with Zebralight and they confirmed that the switch is now soft. Unfortunately they were not the ones who changed the part, it was the manufacturer. Most (if not all, as we don't open the packages to check) of the new models we're getting from Zebralight have the same feel to the switch now.

Craig "

I guess I'll just live with the switch since I got lucky with the tint.


----------



## markr6

ntalbot said:


> I contacted Illumination Supply about my extremely soft switch on my SC600wMkII (it's so soft that it's tricky to change modes). This is their reply:
> 
> "Hi Neil,
> 
> I had a chat with Zebralight and they confirmed that the switch is now soft. Unfortunately they were not the ones who changed the part, it was the manufacturer. Most (if not all, as we don't open the packages to check) of the new models we're getting from Zebralight have the same feel to the switch now.
> 
> Craig "
> 
> I guess I'll just live with the switch since I got lucky with the tint.



Yup, unfortunate for those who liked the firm switch. Personally, I preferred the hard switch. My SC52w is rock hard and makes it easier to switch modes. It also helps if you're wearing gloves since it's already tricky enough with the darn thing recessed into an abyss.

Even some of my Zebralights are somewhere in between, which is fine. But any softer and I can see how it would be difficult to change modes.


----------



## TouchOfRed

Not that anyone cares, but i'm going to send it back and wait those 8weeks it's going to take. Or more..
And then start to look for an alternate flashlight in the same size/output, the output is going to be very hard to match, if there even is a similar sized light with same output, dont think so.. 


Well, i have a Fenix PD35 which i'm VERY happy with, 850lumens is more than enough i need, really.. So i'm going to start there. I Know Spark has a similar light? With a recessed switch and about the same size. 
I also want the Moonlight mode, thats Why i wanted the Sc600 and the High output. Because i thought the PD35 dont have a low enough mode.


Also, not sure i'm going to stay as a customer to Zebralight, i mean, two months waiting time for a flashlight.. At least two months.. Well, i guess it is what it is. Nothing to so about it now, just not buying any more flashlights from Zebralight.. Only My loss though..


Would love some tips Guys


----------



## Etsu

Etsu said:


> This is a brand new flashlight you got with a faulty switch, isn't it? If so, that's really bad customer service. They should ship you a new light right away, not fix a broken light they sold you. Demand better service. You paid for a new light, you should get a new light that works. You shouldn't have to wait 2 months to get it, either.



To add:

The warranty with my Zebralight states the following:

_Our guarantee is unconditional. If any purchase fails to meet your complete
satisfaction, for any reason, you may return it or exchange it within 30 days of
receipt of your shipment. Before returning any product, you MUST obtain a
Return Merchandise Authorization number (RMA) from a customer service
representative. Include the original invoice received with the merchandise and
send the package prepaid, via UPS or insured USPS Mail_


So you should be able to exchange it for a *new *light or get a refund, since it's less than 30 days. Don't accept a repair.


----------



## BWX

TouchOfRed said:


> Not that anyone cares, but i'm going to send it back and wait those 8weeks it's going to take. Or more..
> And then start to look for an alternate flashlight in the same size/output, the output is going to be very hard to match, if there even is a similar sized light with same output, dont think so..
> 
> 
> Well, i have a Fenix PD35 which i'm VERY happy with, 850lumens is more than enough i need, really.. So i'm going to start there. I Know Spark has a similar light? With a recessed switch and about the same size.
> I also want the Moonlight mode, thats Why i wanted the Sc600 and the High output. Because i thought the PD35 dont have a low enough mode.
> 
> 
> Also, not sure i'm going to stay as a customer to Zebralight, i mean, two months waiting time for a flashlight.. At least two months.. Well, i guess it is what it is. Nothing to so about it now, just not buying any more flashlights from Zebralight.. Only My loss though..
> 
> 
> Would love some tips Guys




I'm kind of in same boat but have even more demanding "wants"..
Check out Eagletac D25LC2 Clicky XM-L2..

http://www.eagletac-usa.com/products/product.aspx?pid=1-28-7180

That was my EDC before I hot the SC600, I had the older XML U2, not the XM-L2.

The only thing wrong with that is no moonlight, and the interface.. the clicks to change modes only go around twice.. then go to flashing modes which is stupid. And it remembers.. so you can only switch modes twice with quick clicks, not just twice in a certain amount of time.. It's pretty bad, and a shame really. Very poor decision by Eagletac. If you can get by that though, it's a great small, lightweight, powerful EDC. Lighter than SC600, narrower, but a little longer. No moonlight makes it a deal breaker though if you need it.

I am still looking for the perfect (for me) 18650 EDC too.. 

Been waiting for YEARS now. 


-Very small and lightweight like the D25LC2 clicky, SC600, etc..
-crazy powerful for size like the SC600, D25LC2, and others...
-but also tail clicky..
-interface with totally hidden strobes/ flashing/ etc modes (or none at all)
-moonlight like SC600
-no second button or "twisty heads" (like almost all tail clickers now)..
-can get to moonlight all the way to turbo with no head turns, second buttons, crazy click sequence (like SC600)

It doesn't exist unfortunately for me.

Once someone makes that light I think it will sell well.. but no one has done it.


----------



## markr6

BWX said:


> I'm kind of in same boat but have even more demanding "wants"..
> Check out Eagletac D25LC2 Clicky XM-L2..
> 
> http://www.eagletac-usa.com/products/product.aspx?pid=1-28-7180
> 
> That was my EDC before I hot the SC600, I had the older XML U2, not the XM-L2.
> 
> The only thing wrong with that is no moonlight, and the interface.. the clicks to change modes only go around twice.. then go to flashing modes which is stupid. And it remembers.. so you can only switch modes twice with quick clicks, not just twice in a certain amount of time.. It's pretty bad, and a shame really. Very poor decision by Eagletac. If you can get by that though, it's a great small, lightweight, powerful EDC. Lighter than SC600, narrower, but a little longer. No moonlight makes it a deal breaker though if you need it.
> 
> I am still looking for the perfect (for me) 18650 EDC too..
> 
> Been waiting for YEARS now.
> 
> 
> -Very small and lightweight like the D25LC2 clicky, SC600, etc..
> -crazy powerful for size like the SC600, D25LC2, and others...
> -but also tail clicky..
> -interface with totally hidden strobes/ flashing/ etc modes (or none at all)
> -moonlight like SC600
> -no second button or "twisty heads" (like almost all tail clickers now)..
> -can get to moonlight all the way to turbo with no head turns, second buttons, crazy click sequence (like SC600)
> 
> It doesn't exist unfortunately for me.
> 
> Once someone makes that light I think it will sell well.. but no one has done it.



I think SOO many of us want exactly this! So where the heck is it?!?!?! No reason Zebralight should have the monopoly on an awesome UI. But I could do without the tail click for a side switch. Either way is fine really.


----------



## Mr. Tone

I also had an Eagletac D25LC2. I really liked the size and everything but my biggest problem was that it didn't have a true moonlight mode. The UI was fine for me as it was almost the same as a Quark.


----------



## RedForest UK

ntalbot said:


> I contacted Illumination Supply about my extremely soft switch on my SC600wMkII (it's so soft that it's tricky to change modes). This is their reply:
> 
> "Hi Neil,
> 
> I had a chat with Zebralight and they confirmed that the switch is now soft. Unfortunately they were not the ones who changed the part, it was the manufacturer. Most (if not all, as we don't open the packages to check) of the new models we're getting from Zebralight have the same feel to the switch now.
> 
> Craig "
> 
> I guess I'll just live with the switch since I got lucky with the tint.



That's interesting, I just received an SC600 MKII L2 from the latest IS batch too. It has the best fit and finish (centering of LED, cleanliness of lens/reflector assembly) of any Zebralight I've ever owned before, so that's good. The tint is very good too, there is a relative shift towards green on the lower modes but it makes my SC52w look bad even on matched output levels (and I thought I'd got lucky with a decent tint on that one). I'd say it's a 4D leaning towards 5A tint on the highest mode, which is about perfect imo, then moving down to 4C/B and towards 4S on the lower modes. 

The beam is noticably tighter than my MKI SC600, so sorry for any misinformation I previously gave based on that. The improvements to the UI and PID are nice too.

I have also however noticed the much softer click switch. Previously I have had an H501w (soft switch), SC51w (soft/medium switch), H51 (soft/medium switch), SC600 (hard switch), SC52w (hard switch). This latest SC600w MKII has a softer switch than any of my previous Zebralights, including the H501w. The click is still there, and I think it actually makes changing modes easier with my index finger when held like a pencil, but for thumb clicking it seems to lack the solidity of my old SC600 and inspires less confidence in the robustness of the switch and reliability of mode changes. Time will tell if I get used to it I suppose.


----------



## DavidMB

Does anyone know how many lumens the average car headlight is? I'll bet on high this light comes close.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## BWX

DavidMB said:


> Does anyone know how many lumens the average car headlight is? I'll bet on high this light comes close.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk



One low beam up to 2350 lumens.. On my car I upgrade my H11 to H9 bulbs.. 55 to 65 watt. 
I think H11 go up to about 1,700 lumens a piece, H9 up to about 2350 lumens

So just for both low beams, that's about 4700 lumens. My car runs all the beams together when high beams are used.. So 4700 lumens plus the both high beams which are 9005 bulbs.. which are I think 60 watts and about 1,860 lumens each.
**edit- checked Osram website. 1860 lumens for 60watt 9005.

4700 plus 3720 lumens..

That's *8420 lumens* just for my halogen equipped car when full brights are used.. 4700 for just low beams. 
(2009 Subaru Impreza)

So, no this light doesn't even come close.. there are lights out there that do though.

My Xtar S-1 looks like it is coming close when compared directly.. but my S-1 2350 lumens still cannot touch my car's headlights on full brights. It is getting there though. the Halogen car headlights, with the high CRI, is in a different league as far as real usability though.


----------



## KITROBASKIN

Hey markr6,

Saw that you are selling an SC600w L2 over at the cpfmarketplace. It sounds like you did not use it; just examined it. What differences did you see with your other SC600w L2? And I'm talking about the tint, the button, the finish, the operation. And if you would, tell us if there is yellow around the hotspot or is the hotspot yellow at the mid to lower levels.
Anything else? (Seems like you briefly mentioned it before)
Thanks


----------



## markr6

KITROBASKIN said:


> Hey markr6,
> 
> Saw that you are selling an SC600w L2 over at the cpfmarketplace. It sounds like you did not use it; just examined it. What differences did you see with your other SC600w L2? And I'm talking about the tint, the button, the finish, the operation. And if you would, tell us if there is yellow around the hotspot or is the hotspot yellow at the mid to lower levels.
> Anything else? (Seems like you briefly mentioned it before)
> Thanks



They are nearly identical. The tint on both are very nice, especially when compared to my greenish SC52w. The anodizing is about the same but maybe a touch darker on the new one. The switches are the same - not "too" soft but definitely not hard like my SC52w or old H600w. I'm not familiar with any yellow around the hotspot. All the Zebralights I've had were nice and consistent with the only issue being the green tint on several SC52w lights. No issues with the operation either.


----------



## TouchOfRed

DavidMB said:


> Does anyone know how many lumens the average car headlight is? I'll bet on high this light comes close.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk



my lowbeam has about 3200x2 lumens. 
Ive got about 31k lumens when i have all My lights turned on.


----------



## DavidMB

Okay, that's not really close. I saw an earlier post that said there isn't much of a difference between the 500 and 1000 lumen settings. Do you think that's true?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## thedoc007

TouchOfRed said:


> my lowbeam has about 3200x2 lumens.



It may have a lot of bulb lumens, but the OTF lumen number will be drastically lower. Efficiency isn't a high priority with car headlights, and for safety reasons, a great portion of the beam is lost due to the reflector design. This is to avoid blinding oncoming drivers. I've done some visual comparisons, with reference points, and my TK75 and TM26 both seem substantially brighter than your average pair of incandescent headlights. But those are 4x18650 lights...the SC600 will definitely not be in the same league.



DavidMB said:


> I saw an earlier post that said there isn't much of a difference between the 500 and 1000 lumen settings. Do you think that's true?



On a white wall, it won't seem like a huge difference...the 1000 lumen hotspot will not look that much brighter. If you take the light outside at night, though, you'll see that 1000 lumens lights up a LOT more area (primarily a flood light, not a thrower). If you are using it as a walking light, the difference will be large and obvious. So it really depends on how you use it.


----------



## BWX

thedoc007 said:


> It may have a lot of bulb lumens, but the OTF lumen number will be drastically lower. Efficiency isn't a high priority with car headlights, and for safety reasons, a great portion of the beam is lost due to the reflector design. This is to avoid blinding oncoming drivers. I've done some visual comparisons, with reference points, and my TK75 and TM26 both seem substantially brighter than your average pair of incandescent headlights. But those are 4x18650 lights...the SC600 will definitely not be in the same league.
> 
> .



Yeah the point is that 8240 real bulb lumens, even if it's 70% of that in real OTF lumens.. Most flashlights cannot compare, not to my car anyways.. Especially given the high CRI of halogen compared to relatively low CRI of an XML.


----------



## Bullzeyebill

Let's stay on topic here. The discussion is about the ZebraLight SC600 Mk II.

Bill


----------



## BWX

Bullzeyebill said:


> Let's stay on topic here. The discussion is about the ZebraLight SC600 Mk II.
> 
> Bill



Well he was comparing SC600 to car headlights... so it was in response to that.


----------



## kaichu dento

Got my SC600w mkII L2 the other day and have some regrets at not getting one sooner.

I'd been interested right away but talk of green tint kept me away until MarkR put one up in the MarketPlace.

I've liked the XM-L beam pattern from the start but as with the Seoul P4 before it, I've accepted that the wider area amitters show color banding across their beam which is both less noticeable (to me) and less desirable than a slightly coolish or neutral emitter.

From my perspective this light should never have been considered warm unless the only starting point was cool, which is a place we passed bu a couple years ago. The light as I see it is about as centered in the neutral zone as can be and I'm much happier with it than I'd expected to be.

Love and hate for the buried switch, but I'm sure it'll come on accidentally and as longs as one is not wearing gloves, not too much of a problem. Personally would have preferred a little more chamfering for easier access on such a deep hole, and a firmer click like my old SC51w had.

Definitely hate the addition of three clicks to strobe, but just like walking along a cliff, I'll be careful not to go there.

All in all a great light, and as an affirmed green-tint avoider, there appears to be no reason not to buy one.


----------



## toysareforboys

kaichu dento said:


> Definitely hate the addition of three clicks to strobe, but just like walking along a cliff, I'll be careful not to go there.


Wow, so THAT'S what they did. I also find it annoying. I usually single short press for turbo, then double click it down to medium or whatever it is. With my new L2 I gotta wait a while before double clicking down to medium or it'll go strobe on me, will take a little while to get used to.

-Jamie M.


----------



## EZO

kaichu dento said:


> Got my SC600w mkII L2 the other day and have some regrets at not getting one sooner.
> 
> I'd been interested right away but talk of green tint kept me away until MarkR put one up in the MarketPlace.
> 
> I've liked the XM-L beam pattern from the start but as with the Seoul P4 before it, I've accepted that the wider area amitters show color banding across their beam which is both less noticeable (to me) and less desirable than a slightly coolish or neutral emitter.
> 
> From my perspective this light should never have been considered warm unless the only starting point was cool, which is a place we passed bu a couple years ago. The light as I see it is about as centered in the neutral zone as can be and I'm much happier with it than I'd expected to be.
> 
> Love and hate for the buried switch, but I'm sure it'll come on accidentally and as longs as one is not wearing gloves, not too much of a problem. Personally would have preferred a little more chamfering for easier access on such a deep hole, and a firmer click like my old SC51w had.
> 
> Definitely hate the addition of three clicks to strobe, but just like walking along a cliff, I'll be careful not to go there.
> 
> All in all a great light, and as an affirmed green-tint avoider, there appears to be no reason not to buy one.



I would agree with pretty much everything you've said. I too would have been happy with slightly better access to the deep switch but I've gotten used to it and I recognize that they made what they felt was a necessary judgement call. I don't mind the three clicks to strobe as I don't use it too often but it is there if I want it. All in all, the longer I've had the light, the more pleased I am with it. One of the amusing/interesting revelations was that when I stand it next to an old SolarForce L2m it is shorter.


----------



## markr6

I wish the recess was a bit shallower like the SC52. It would probably allow for access with some gloves. You really need to get your finger tip down in there. But something I can get used to.

I asked ZL about the softer switch (forgot ntalbot already did this via IS - 1st post on this page). Anyway, they responded and said from what they've seen in the early "L2" pre-production samples, the switch is slightly crispier than the SC600 II, but still on the 'soft' side.

So, just have to wait and see really. All of my Zebralight switches vary to some extent, even between two identical lights ordered at the same time from the same vendor.


----------



## EZO

You know, after thinking about the three clicks to strobe concerns last night I discovered that three very rapid clicks can access the strobe in LESS than one second. What's the problem really? How often does one really need strobe?

On another note regarding the narrow access to the recessed switch, I've decided to have my thumb surgically altered to fit the switch indent perfectly. I'll report back with the results after the scar tissue forms!


----------



## fnj

EZO said:


> You know, after thinking about the three clicks to strobe concerns last night I discovered that three very rapid clicks can access the strobe in LESS than one second. What's the problem really? How often does one really need strobe?
> 
> On another note regarding the narrow access to the recessed switch, I've decided to have my thumb surgically altered to fit the switch indent perfectly. I'll report back with the results after the scar tissue forms!



If the three click strobe is what it sounds like from reading about it, i strongly guess nobody cares that it takes one second to hit strobe. What many of us HATE is that the valuable 3-click-for-low has been taken away and wasted on a stupid strobe. The vast majority of users will never once use strobe on purpose. It would be far better if it wasn't there at all, or failing that, hard to get to, just like the original design.


----------



## EZO

fnj said:


> If the three click strobe is what it sounds like from reading about it, i strongly guess nobody cares that it takes one second to hit strobe. What many of us HATE is that the valuable 3-click-for-low has been taken away and wasted on a stupid strobe. The vast majority of users will never once use strobe on purpose. It would be far better if it wasn't there at all, or failing that, hard to get to, just like the original design.



Since you can engage any output level so easily on this light, the three click to the strobes is merely another sub menu access. Who needs "3-click-for-low" when it is available with one slightly longer click? Wasted? For the life of me, the insane degree of nitpicking these issues on this board seems to be getting more and more out of control as time goes on. The Zebra UI is one of the best in the business and I have few complaints about this otherwise excellent product.


----------



## BWX

What the hell? Why did they put a strobe mode back on it? My MKI B U2 doesn't have a strobe at all.. I thought that was one great feature, not having stupid, annoying modes that no one wants.

Instead they damage the interface by making a strobe come on after three clicks? Amazingly bad.


I was thinking about upgrading to a MKII at some point, and getting a warmer tint version, and for being slightly smaller overall. Not anymore!! 

I guess I have the best version already, no stupid strobe mode wrecking the interface. I click three times, I have low mode, like it should be.


----------



## EZO

Three clicks in the scheme of this UI is really just a hidden sub menu that can be accessed fairly rapidly if you should ever want it. Otherwise, it can just be ignored. I believe that was the design intent.


----------



## markr6

EZO said:


> Three clicks in the scheme of this UI is really just a hidden sub menu that can be accessed fairly rapidly if you should ever want it. Otherwise, it can just be ignored. I believe that was the design intent.



Yeah. Anyway, I'm surprised people are using 3 clicks to get to low. Passing thru high and medium on the way, although very brief, seems contradictory to the main purpose of keeping your night-adapted eyes in the dark.


----------



## BWX

You can just put the lens up against your shirt and click through higher modes. I do it all the time, this is my EDC for many months..

If you hold button down to get low, you might let it go a bit too long and get a blinding medium (with dark adapted eyes) as well. Especially with frozen hands or gloved hands.


----------



## markr6

BWX said:


> You can just put the lens up against your shirt and click through higher modes. I do it all the time, this is my EDC for many months..



That's true, I have done this on occasion for other lights.


----------



## EZO

BWX said:


> You can just put the lens up against your shirt and click through higher modes. I do it all the time, this is my EDC for many months..



This seems to defeat the whole idea of having a sophisticated UI like this in the first place, but everyone should use the light according to their preferences. 



BWX said:


> If you hold button down to get low, you might let it go a bit too long and get a blinding medium (with dark adapted eyes) as well. Especially with frozen hands or gloved hands.



Well, this isn't exactly a glove friendly light under any circumstances and I've had the same experience but I find the longer I own the flashlight the more "muscle memory" I develop with the UI and controling the light as I want is becoming second nature.


----------



## kaichu dento

fnj said:


> If the three click strobe is what it sounds like from reading about it, i strongly guess nobody cares that it takes one second to hit strobe. What many of us HATE is that the valuable 3-click-for-low has been taken away and wasted on a stupid strobe. The vast majority of users will never once use strobe on purpose. It would be far better if it wasn't there at all, or failing that, hard to get to, just like the original design.


My thoughts exactly, although I do recognize that some like the availability of the strobe, which is where we find the origin of this type of 'problem', where the preferences of one group by necessity of one manner or another, are placed above those of the other group.

In the present case, those wanting strobe easily accessible have won the day on the new UI.



BWX said:


> What the hell? Why did they put a strobe mode back on it? My MKI B U2 doesn't have a strobe at all.. I thought that was one great feature, not having stupid, annoying modes that no one wants.
> 
> Instead they damage the interface by making a strobe come on after three clicks? Amazingly bad.
> 
> 
> I was thinking about upgrading to a MKII at some point, and getting a warmer tint version, and for being slightly smaller overall. Not anymore!!
> 
> I guess I have the best version already, no stupid strobe mode wrecking the interface. I click three times, I have low mode, like it should be.


I'm another user, and I'm sure that if there's a few of us, there's more out there too, who did like the ability to give three quick clicks to low, rather than the 'hold down for the right length of time' method to low.



BWX said:


> You can just put the lens up against your shirt and click through higher modes. I do it all the time, this is my EDC for many months..
> 
> If you hold button down to get low, you might let it go a bit too long and get a blinding medium (with dark adapted eyes) as well. Especially with frozen hands or gloved hands.


To continue, I found it far easier to point the light at the ground behind me while I did my three quick clicks for low, and having already formed this habit with my SC51w, discovered strobe within seconds of getting my new light the other day.


----------



## RIX TUX

EZO said:


> Since you can engage any output level so easily on this light, the three click to the strobes is merely another sub menu access. Who needs "3-click-for-low" when it is available with one slightly longer click? Wasted? For the life of me, the insane degree of nitpicking these issues on this board seems to be getting more and more out of control as time goes on. The Zebra UI is one of the best in the business and I have few complaints about this otherwise excellent product.


+1.........really some of these nellies could find something wrong with a $100 dollar bill.


----------



## markr6

RIX TUX said:


> +1.........really some of these nellies could find something wrong with a $100 dollar bill.



It's not in my pocket!

As far as people complaining, I don't mind. It's fun to read and they're entitled to their opinion. I like Zebralights so if they don't change anything, fine. If they want to take constructive criticism to make changes and continually try to improve, that's fine too.


----------



## EZO

markr6 said:


> It's not in my pocket!



Probably spent it on that SC600 MkII!


----------



## markr6

EZO said:


> Probably spent it on that SC600 MkII!



HAHA that's OK...WELL worth it!


----------



## BWX

RIX TUX said:


> +1.........really some of these nellies could find something wrong with a $100 dollar bill.



Nellies? What's that supposed to mean? 

It's a flashlight forum. I'll voice my opinion all day long - as long as I can do it without *insulting anyone*, or *name calling*, it's completely fine. 

Don't like it? Don't read it. Everyone that wants to opine respectfully should do the same.

It looks like you find it hard to make your point without throwing names at people though, huh? :shakehead


----------



## Bullzeyebill

RIX TUX, and BWX, play nice. Attack the post not the poster. If a post appears offensive click on the "report a post" icon and report it.

Bill


----------



## kaichu dento

EZO said:


> Since you can engage any output level so easily on this light, the three click to the strobes is merely another sub menu access. Who needs "3-click-for-low" when it is available with one slightly longer click? Wasted? For the life of me, the insane degree of nitpicking these issues on this board seems to be getting more and more out of control as time goes on. The Zebra UI is one of the best in the business and I have few complaints about this otherwise excellent product.


None of us unhappy with the change had any problem with the original UI which is now being changed, and it's the change that we see as unnecessary. 

Not nitpicking nearly so much as wishing they'd left it alone.


RIX TUX said:


> +1.........really some of these nellies could find something wrong with a $100 dollar bill.


Apparently you guys didn't like the UI the way it was until just now, but I sure did.

I've got the newer UI and having it in my hands for less than 10 seconds found the most obnoxious strobe when running through the UI the way it used to work.

Having had a good number of lights with a wide variety of UI's, I'm fully capable of adapting to any, but still would prefer they'd left it alone and even though some of you didn't like the original UI, many of us did.


----------



## Bullzeyebill

kaichu dento, please do not intervene. See my post above yours. Attack the post not the poster. Anything other than that is considered Flaming, and baiting.

Bill


----------



## kaichu dento

Bill, I was trying to explain why some of us prefer the UI the way it was, and liked the triple click mode access without strobe. 

I've edited my post above.


----------



## Overclocker

BWX said:


> I'm kind of in same boat but have even more demanding "wants"..
> Check out Eagletac D25LC2 Clicky XM-L2..
> 
> http://www.eagletac-usa.com/products/product.aspx?pid=1-28-7180
> 
> That was my EDC before I hot the SC600, I had the older XML U2, not the XM-L2.
> 
> The only thing wrong with that is no moonlight, and the interface.. the clicks to change modes only go around twice.. then go to flashing modes which is stupid. And it remembers.. so you can only switch modes twice with quick clicks, not just twice in a certain amount of time.. It's pretty bad, and a shame really. Very poor decision by Eagletac. If you can get by that though, it's a great small, lightweight, powerful EDC. Lighter than SC600, narrower, but a little longer. No moonlight makes it a deal breaker though if you need it.
> 
> I am still looking for the perfect (for me) 18650 EDC too..
> 
> Been waiting for YEARS now.
> 
> 
> -Very small and lightweight like the D25LC2 clicky, SC600, etc..
> -crazy powerful for size like the SC600, D25LC2, and others...
> -but also tail clicky..
> -interface with totally hidden strobes/ flashing/ etc modes (or none at all)
> -moonlight like SC600
> -no second button or "twisty heads" (like almost all tail clickers now)..
> -can get to moonlight all the way to turbo with no head turns, second buttons, crazy click sequence (like SC600)
> 
> It doesn't exist unfortunately for me.
> 
> Once someone makes that light I think it will sell well.. but no one has done it.





haha that's what you call hidden blinkies! and it's great in fact i want my Quarks to behave like this instead of having to pass through the blinkies

no it doesn't remember, it resets to LOW after a certain amount of time of being off. so the next tiem you turn it on it starts at low as it should then half-press to get desired level. if you missed it then just cycle to low again WITHOUT having to go through the blinkies

unfortunately it doesn't have a true moonlight


----------



## EZO

kaichu dento said:


> <snip>Apparently you guys didn't like the UI the way it was until just now, but I sure did.<snip>
> 
> <snip>even though some of you didn't like the original UI, many of us did.<snip>



This is an odd assumption and is the sort of statement that can make this forum polarizing. Just because someone is OK with the newer UI doesn't mean they "didn't like the UI the way it was". Both have their merits.


----------



## Swede74

How about a UI that allows you to program H1, M1 and L1 to_ any_ of the 15 available modes? For instance, with the following configuration

H1 = 3.5 lm H2 = 330 lm
M1 = 1020 lm M2 = 30 lm
L1 = 65 lm L2 = 0.01 lm

a single short click would turn the light on in low. You would also have reasonably easy access to max output - press and hold would get you there in less than a second. 

I wouldn't want this to be the factory settings, and I am aware there is a trade-off: you would have to cycle through a whole lot of modes when programming the light, but on the other hand, most users don't do that very often.


----------



## kaichu dento

EZO said:


> This is an odd assumption and is the sort of statement that can make this forum polarizing. Just because someone is OK with the newer UI doesn't mean they "didn't like the UI the way it was". Both have their merits.


Polarizing? A few of us expressed disappointment over the newer version of the UI which led to the post below, suggesting that there was something invalid in wishing they'd left it alone.
If 'the Zebra UI was one of the best' and preference for them to have left it alone is regarded as 'and insane degree of nitpicking' and 'out of control' then it seemed like the logical conclusion.
Thanks for clarifying that you like both of them. 


EZO said:


> Who needs "3-click-for-low" when it is available with one slightly longer click? Wasted? For the life of me, the insane degree of nitpicking these issues on this board seems to be getting more and more out of control as time goes on. The Zebra UI is one of the best in the business and I have few complaints about this otherwise excellent product.


----------



## EZO

kaichu dento said:


> Polarizing? A few of us expressed disappointment over the newer version of the UI which led to the post below, suggesting that there was something invalid in wishing they'd left it alone.
> If 'the Zebra UI was one of the best' and preference for them to have left it alone is regarded as 'and insane degree of nitpicking' and 'out of control' then it seemed like the logical conclusion.
> Thanks for clarifying that you like both of them.



Ascribing a value judgement or assumption that someone else doesn't like something based on a statement that they don't mind something else can be polarizing. Perhaps there might have been a better word for it but people don't like to be told what they think or perceive.

The "insane degree of nit-picking" on these boards was a comment hardly meant to be limited to the Zebra UI and the discussion of this complaint has certainly not been limited to "a few of us" or even this singular thread. Obviously, we are all here to discuss all aspects of flashlight design, manufacture and user experience but sometimes I am amazed to see the same complaints, sometimes petty in nature repeated over and over and over, month after month and this is what I am referring to. For example, many of us appreciate appealing neutral tints on our lights but the number of keystrokes and disagreement devoted to analyzing, describing and dissecting the qualities of tints has started to seem like "tintsanity" to me. I prefer to use my lights out in the world where I have learned that these tint issues usually become completely irrelevant, while some CPFers prefer to sit around in their pajamas pointing their lights at the ceiling and then run to their computers to complain about the qualities, colors, slight purple tinges around the edges, etc., etc. It leaves me shaking my head sometimes. Of course, many will disagree with my take on this, as is their privilege but this is just my perspective.


----------



## KITROBASKIN

Yeah, for indoors, the 'cooler' (white is white) works better for me. But after getting that XML2 5000k 3C tint, it seems more pleasant outdoors; colors are better. My Nitecore TM26 has a slight tinge of green in the lower levels (not really a problem), but the SC52 I gave to my mother was distractingly green, indoors and out.

Testing flashlight tint while wearing pajamas will definitely skew the results. 

The search for perfection can take many forms. Expecting others to have the same fervor as ourselves will always be a disappointment.


----------



## Bullzeyebill

PM sent to kaichu dento.

Bill


----------



## kaichu dento

EZO said:


> Obviously, we are all here to discuss all aspects of flashlight design, manufacture and user experience but sometimes I am amazed to see the same complaints, sometimes petty in nature repeated over and over and over, month after month and this is what I am referring to. For example, many of us appreciate appealing neutral tints on our lights but the number of keystrokes and disagreement devoted to analyzing, describing and dissecting the qualities of tints has started to seem like "tintsanity" to me. I prefer to use my lights out in the world where I have learned that these tint issues usually become completely irrelevant, while some CPFers prefer to sit around in their pajamas pointing their lights at the ceiling and then run to their computers to complain about the qualities, colors, slight purple tinges around the edges, etc., etc. It leaves me shaking my head sometimes. Of course, many will disagree with my take on this, as is their privilege but this is just my perspective.


I agree with so much of this, but just ask that you allow that what may seem petty to one user can be the most important aspect for another.
The 'tintsanity' is a very real problem at times, in fact so much so that others not suffering from the disease get grouped in as 'tintsane' when they actually use their lights in a manner justifying the selectivity exhibited.

I use my lights like everyone else and have had to hone my desired specs as I learn more about my own particular set of desired functions and qualities, but while I can do all my work with any range of whitish tints, there's one 219 equipped light I have that I constantly find myself reaching for because of how natural everything looks, and pleasing too.

It can definitely get old reading some of the same things, but then again, here we are to discuss and I guess we need to let others do the same on the points that are important to them.


----------



## Mr Floppy

kaichu dento said:


> The 'tintsanity' is a very real problem at times, in fact so much so that others not suffering from the disease



Normally I'd say first world problems but really? Disease? Better check my health insurance


----------



## EZO

kaichu dento said:


> I agree with so much of this, but just ask that you allow that what may seem petty to one user can be the most important aspect for another. The 'tintsanity' is a very real problem at times, in fact so much so that others not suffering from the disease get grouped in as 'tintsane' when they actually use their lights in a manner justifying the selectivity exhibited. I use my lights like everyone else and have had to hone my desired specs as I learn more about my own particular set of desired functions and qualities, but while I can do all my work with any range of whitish tints, there's one 219 equipped light I have that I constantly find myself reaching for because of how natural everything looks, and pleasing too. It can definitely get old reading some of the same things, but then again, here we are to discuss and I guess we need to let others do the same on the points that are important to them.



If you've read some of my posts here and there on this forum you know that I appreciate tint qualities too. In fact, I have gotten to the point where the only lights I purchase now are neutral or high CRI tints and the 219 is really in a class by itself but I just don't make myself crazy over this stuff. I was really unhappy with the tint on my SC52W yet when I started using it outdoors I discovered that the greenish hue became a complete non-issue. It was really only an issue when I pointed it at the ceiling. 

I think what I am finding so exasperating about what I have labeled "tintsanity" is the highly critical, almost maniacal intensity one often sees displayed here over every little issue. I've already explained myself about the "tint" thing but it goes way beyond that. For example, several weeks back I made a simple comment about how pleased I was with the tint on my new SC600w Mk II and how it seemed warm and creamy and reminded me of sunlight. This was just an offhanded, casual, descriptive remark, not an analytical scientific one but suddenly I found myself having to defend my statement when I got dragged into an argument and condescending little lecture about the true color temperature of sunlight on a cloudless day being 5500K, blah, blah blah and how, "If you want sunlight, get a cool white XML". I mean, really? Is this kind of argument necessary or useful? In fact, the poster actually began his remarks with the statement, _"Just to nitpick"_. Well, he got that one right! It is getting to be that one can't have a simple congenial conversation around here without someone jumping down your throat over this picked nit or that. The atmosphere here seems very different than just a few years ago and hardly for the better. The whole thing has started to seem kind of OCD and neurotic, frankly. While this kind of thing has been going on for a long time here and is often to be expected on internet chat forums it was more or less occasional rather than always. Personally, I don't think it lends to a good sense of community, which in the end is much of why I think we are all here. 

So, in any event, I do understand where you are coming from in your quest for tint perfection and you surely have my blessings.....as long as you are not wearing your pajamas when you've got that favorite 219 in your hand.


----------



## Bullzeyebill

EZO said:


> Personally, I don't think it lends to a good sense of community, which in the end is much of why I think we are all here.



That is what CPF is all about, and people like me, as a member of the CPF community, and other moderators, and administrators want to always see this as one of the goals here. I too am concerned about pettiness leading to flaming comments re a persons opinions. I am close to closing this thread.

Bill


----------



## nunnya

I just received my SC600W Mk2 and enjoy the new interface.
I never used the 3 click option for low on my SC52 because there was bright blink before it went low which defeated the purpose.
The new button doesn't feel as clicky as the old one but it's fine.
When you consider size, output, and run time it's tough to beat.

nunya


----------



## RIX TUX

Has anyone had both of the mk ii versions? I'm wondering if the newer version is much brighter and if it has more throw?​


----------



## RCLumens

Greetings all! I received my Mkii L2 about a week ago. Initial thoughts were I didn't like the softer button. After a week or so, can say I'm getting used to it. It's definitely a cooler (as in beam color) light, and must say I'm getting used to the new switch. I have the first run of the sc600 (not the mkii) and mostly got this light to because it had a real strobe and to see what the PID was all about. In comparison to the first sc600, the beam profile seems to have a more defined spot, and thus throws farther. (not all that much but noticeable to the eye no doubt) Also for those who might have the older models like me - it seems the mkii L2 heats up quite a bit faster than the first model. Is this because of the higher output? Perhaps I was thinking the PID would keep the temp down on max? if anyone knows would love to here your thoughts on this. I'm still in search of a small tactical light - single 18650 edc or maybe even a single rcr123 - I guess I'll post a new thread for that. 

Cheers~


----------



## neutralwhite

tactical HDS.




RCLumens said:


> Greetings all! I received my Mkii L2 about a week ago. Initial thoughts were I didn't like the softer button. After a week or so, can say I'm getting used to it. It's definitely a cooler (as in beam color) light, and must say I'm getting used to the new switch. I have the first run of the sc600 (not the mkii) and mostly got this light to because it had a real strobe and to see what the PID was all about. In comparison to the first sc600, the beam profile seems to have a more defined spot, and thus throws farther. (not all that much but noticeable to the eye no doubt) Also for those who might have the older models like me - it seems the mkii L2 heats up quite a bit faster than the first model. Is this because of the higher output? Perhaps I was thinking the PID would keep the temp down on max? if anyone knows would love to here your thoughts on this. I'm still in search of a small tactical light - single 18650 edc or maybe even a single rcr123 - I guess I'll post a new thread for that.
> 
> Cheers~


----------



## kaichu dento

EZO said:


> ...several weeks back I made a simple comment about how pleased I was with the tint on my new SC600w Mk II and how it seemed warm and creamy and reminded me of sunlight. This was just an offhanded, casual, descriptive remark, not an analytical scientific one...


I remember seeing that one and all I could do was scratch my head over the response you got.

Now that I've got mine I'd describe it pretty much the same way, nice creamy tint and while a bit cooler than I wish it was, very definitely serviceable and along with my TC-R1, they make up my go-to show-how-bright-LED-lights-have-become lights.

It's also amazing how you can actually feel heat on your hand from a foot away when on the highest setting. It's my new hand warmer.


----------



## moozooh

So, I've found myself in a peculiar situation. My boss accidentally broke the glass of my old SC600 U2, so I now have a good incentive and opportunity to upgrade. And since S5310 is still nowhere in sight, I've decided to give this model another go—this time neutral white though.

The good part: even though I didn't ask for it, boss offered to reimburse the purchase of a new light. Moreover, he was so impressed with the light and the fact that I've been using it as a bike lamp (which it's really, really good for, btw), he told me to order not one but _three_ lights: one for me, one for himself, and one for his wife's bike.

The ugly part: all of SC600 models are somehow sold out/out of stock _everywhere_, and it actually seems like virtually all the ZL lights are on back-order at the main site, wtfwtfwtf! How did this happen? How do I procure myself three new SC600w L2 pieces now? 

I've already submitted an inquiry to the customer service department (hoping they would at least mail me a new SC600 glass if all else fails), and while I'm waiting for their response, I have the perfect time to panic to my heart's content!


----------



## BWX

moozooh said:


> So, I've found myself in a peculiar situation. My boss accidentally broke the glass of my old SC600 U2, so I now have a good incentive and opportunity to upgrade. And since S5310 is still nowhere in sight, I've decided to give this model another go—this time neutral white though.
> 
> The good part: even though I didn't ask for it, boss offered to reimburse the purchase of a new light. Moreover, he was so impressed with the light and the fact that I've been using it as a bike lamp (which it's really, really good for, btw), he told me to order not one but _three_ lights: one for me, one for himself, and one for his wife's bike.
> 
> The ugly part: all of SC600 models are somehow sold out/out of stock _everywhere_, and it actually seems like virtually all the ZL lights are on back-order at the main site, wtfwtfwtf! How did this happen? How do I procure myself three new SC600w L2 pieces now?
> 
> I've already submitted an inquiry to the customer service department (hoping they would at least mail me a new SC600 glass if all else fails), and while I'm waiting for their response, I have the perfect time to panic to my heart's content!



Yeah it's really crappy how they seem to *always be out of stock, everywhere..* especially on the warmer tints. ZL should get their act together and make more. I wouldn't mind a Neutral MKII either. My MKI B U2 is insanely bright on highest setting, I wonder how much brighter the MKII L2 really is. Maybe mine is just so bright because of variability of LEDS and manufacturing, and I just got a really, really good one. Nice tint too.


Too bad (for ZL) I never make that impulse buy, because there's nothing to buy.


----------



## moozooh

With recent ZL you almost wish you'd made an impulse buy, because once you miss it, you actually _do _miss it. Interestingly, this was not the case at all back in 2012, when every then-current light was in stock and/or actively produced. It appears that changing the assembly line really dropped ZL's manufacturing capacity by like an order of magnitude. Either that, or the demand for their offerings has increased by as much. Both versions about equally plausible, but none exactly reassuring.

I guess I'll have to wait until they restock the SC600s. Not like I have other options, do I? As long as ZL is still alive they're bound to create more of their most popular models at least at some point. Hopefully by the start of the next biking season (early/mid-April for me).


----------



## fnj

moozooh said:


> I guess I'll have to wait until they restock the SC600s.



What makes you so sure they ever will? Lately they exhibited a propensity for very short production runs of models and no repeat production runs.


----------



## Mr Floppy

moozooh said:


> Interestingly, this was not the case at all back in 2012, when every then-current light was in stock and/or actively produced. It appears that changing the assembly line really dropped ZL's manufacturing capacity by like an order of magnitude.



I assume that is due to the process of moving it all to the US. I'm sure costs would be higher to set up in the US so can only go small scale at first.


----------



## BWX

Seem like as soon as they release something, it is out of stock, and then discontinued shortly thereafter.. Pretty lame actually.


----------



## worktheweb

moozooh said:


> and it actually seems like virtually all the ZL lights are on back-order at the main site, wtfwtfwtf! How did this happen? How do I procure myself three new SC600w L2 pieces now?



I just bought the SC600 MkII L2 last week from zebralight.com. It was similarly "back-ordered", so I e-mailed them first to see what the wait time would be. They said it should ship within 3 days, so I pulled the trigger. In reality the "back-ordered" light shipped the same day I ordered it (4 hours and 50 minutes later, to be exact) and got to my house two days before it was supposed to arrive according to the tracking data. I was very pleasantly surprised. Your mileage may vary, of course, but I would e-mail them to see if the "back-order" is real, or just laziness with their inventory system.


----------



## Joys_R_us

Strange, 2 weeks ago they answered my inquiry with 4weeks lead time...for the SC600L2


----------



## worktheweb

Joys_R_us said:


> Strange, 2 weeks ago they answered my inquiry with 4weeks lead time...for the SC600L2



One thing of note: I live in the US. I have heard that there is different fulfillment and manufacturing for US and Non-US locations. That may explain the difference.


----------



## kaichu dento

moozooh said:


> So, I've found myself in a peculiar situation. My boss accidentally broke the glass of my old SC600 U2, so I now have a good incentive and opportunity to upgrade. And since S5310 is still nowhere in sight, I've decided to give this model another go—this time neutral white though.
> 
> The good part: even though I didn't ask for it, boss offered to reimburse the purchase of a new light. Moreover, he was so impressed with the light and the fact that I've been using it as a bike lamp (which it's really, really good for, btw), he told me to order not one but _three_ lights: one for me, one for himself, and one for his wife's bike.
> 
> The ugly part: all of SC600 models are somehow sold out/out of stock _everywhere_, and it actually seems like virtually all the ZL lights are on back-order at the main site, wtfwtfwtf! How did this happen? How do I procure myself three new SC600w L2 pieces now?
> 
> I've already submitted an inquiry to the customer service department (hoping they would at least mail me a new SC600 glass if all else fails), and while I'm waiting for their response, I have the perfect time to panic to my heart's content!


While you're searching for your lights you may want to consider the SC600w mkII (non-L2 version) depending on your preferences.

Once difference you may be happy for is the 3 clicks to strobe, whereas the non-L2 still has 3 clicks to low as you've already become accustomed to.
Another quirk is that while the mkII has 3 selectable sub-levels for each of high, medium and low, the L2 seems to be lacking in the ability to offer the extra choices. 

That said, the two medium levels available seem to be fairly well balanceable with the other modes and you primary deciding factor would probably be: strobe on 3 clicks or not.

I played with an original SC600 only once and don't remember much about it, but the newest ones are surprisingly bright and I can see them making a great bicycle headlight.


----------



## Joys_R_us

worktheweb said:


> One thing of note: I live in the US. I have heard that there is different fulfillment and manufacturing for US and Non-US locations. That may explain the difference.



Hope you didn't get delivered a returned product...


----------



## worktheweb

Joys_R_us said:


> Hope you didn't get delivered a returned product...



Everything looked to be in perfect condition. I haven't had any issues with it thus far. It has been a great little light.


----------



## LEDburn

kaichu dento said:


> While you're searching for your lights you may want to consider the SC600w mkII (non-L2 version) depending on your preferences.
> 
> Once difference you may be happy for is the 3 clicks to strobe, whereas the non-L2 still has 3 clicks to low as you've already become accustomed to.
> Another quirk is that while the mkII has 3 selectable sub-levels for each of high, medium and low, the L2 seems to be lacking in the ability to offer the extra choices.



I assume you mean the revised first edition when you refer to the 'mkII?' As in, the one where you get less thann 700OTF lumens on H1 and no PID thermal management?

Your post is a little confusing as (if you are talking about revised first edition) you cannot program any other level bar H2.

The actual mkII (by ZL naming standards) has always had the UI where 3 clicks from off will enter strobe mode.
No SC600w models have programmable M2 and L2 unless they have 3 clicks for strobe.


----------



## moozooh

I believe kaichu was referring to this mkII which indeed didn't have a 3-click strobe shortcut. I've actually considered that model briefly, but as it never received a neutral version I'd decided to forgo it. This time I'm firmly on the NW train. Both because 4400 K is a bit closer to what I would consider to be neutral, and because, let's face it, it's over a thousand lumens anyway. I already have all the e-***** benefits I need from using a kickass piece of gear, time to concentrate on quality of life!

That being said, PID is a great boon to biking due to the ample cooling when in motion. It shines the brighter the faster I would go, not even specialized bike lamps do that, lol. And I have both "city" (1020) and "cross-country" (620) modes for it, too. I expect that if even vanilla SC600 took half the eternity to drain a 3400 mAh battery in virtually every realistic use case in my experience, this new version would do even better... with this 3600 mAh I'm about to get! Man, these modern flashlights are so cray-cray, totally better than required. I thought I'd have to get an S5310 at some point to avoid lugging around heavy Li-Ion spares in long trekking trips, but even with my old model I've never drained a Li-Ion in 2-2.5 weeks of regular use, _not even once_. Even less of a chance of that happening now, I suppose...

I did email ZL, and Lillian told me about the 4 week lead if I order now, which is exactly what I'm intending to do. Mind you, I'm Russian, which puts me about on par with South Africans and Australians with regards to shipping time/priority, but hopefully the lights are here by early April, which would be just in time for biking season.


----------



## Erik1213

In case anyone has been waiting to order a new SC600w MKII L2, they are finally back in stock at Zebralight.com

I just ordered one to replace my old SC600w.


----------



## Erik1213

Just, finally, got an SC600wII and the only thing that is odd is the switch is so much softer than the one on my first gen. It almost doesn't even have an audible click. Is this normal?


----------



## markr6

Erik1213 said:


> Just, finally, got an SC600wII and the only thing that is odd is the switch is so much softer than the one on my first gen. It almost doesn't even have an audible click. Is this normal?



Yes. It can make it hard to double click unfortunately. It's OK, but I wish it was in between the really hard and soft click - like my H52w and H600w II.


----------



## kaichu dento

Erik1213 said:


> Just, finally, got an SC600wII and the only thing that is odd is the switch is so much softer than the one on my first gen. It almost doesn't even have an audible click. Is this normal?


That describes my switch perfectly and as in all changes, not much you can do but get accustomed to the newer switch.

I had some fun with mine tonight and it's the first time I ran around some trails with it, switching from one level to another. At first it seemed completely too far between low and medium, but changing the selected low mode made for a decent level jump.

I'd still prefer an extra level or two of medium, but again, just like the switch, nothing to do but use it until it seems natural.


----------



## kj2

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**

Just ordered one


----------



## ncvetteman

OK, I am new to 'high tech' LED flashlights. I got hooked after reading a lot of the post on this forum and watching some videos on YouTube about some of the great lights that are available, so I decided to order a couple.

I ordered the Zebralight SC600w MKII and I also ordered the Fenix PD35. :twothumbs

I look forward to comparing them.

Randy


----------



## kj2

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**

Came in today  Nice looking light, although there are some dents in the metal :thinking: but not in the coating. Switch is soft.


----------



## callmaster

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**



kj2 said:


> Came in today  Nice looking light, although there are some dents in the metal :thinking: but not in the coating. Switch is soft.




Nice, where did you order it from?


----------



## kj2

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**



callmaster said:


> Nice, where did you order it from?


Seller here in the Netherlands. - NKon.


----------



## kj2

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**

Having this light for 12 hours now and must admit, those low-output modes, I'm starting to like it more and more by the second 
And on High you've plenty of reach


----------



## ncvetteman

*Warm (neutral White) or Cool White?*

I am new to this. Is there any consensus as to which is the preferred light color? ........... Warm(neutral white) or Cool white? 

Thanks!


----------



## RIX TUX

*Re: Warm (neutral White) or Cool White?*



ncvetteman said:


> I am new to this. Is there any consensus as to which is the preferred light color? ........... Warm(neutral white) or Cool white?
> 
> Thanks!



I'm a cool guy............
its a little more output usually


----------



## Charles L.

*Re: Warm (neutral White) or Cool White?*



ncvetteman said:


> I am new to this. Is there any consensus as to which is the preferred light color? ........... Warm(neutral white) or Cool white?
> 
> Thanks!



I have one with warm tint. Inside the house against a white wall, it looks yellow. But outside, it looks more natural. Warm does have slightly lower output.


----------



## Erik1213

*Re: Warm (neutral White) or Cool White?*

It's all about your personal preference. I like neutral/warm white lights. I can appreciate cool but a bad cool white bothers me more than a bad neutral white and I only have one Zebra with a good cool white (SC51f).

My only beef with the new SC600w is the LED tint. I was hoping it would be the pinkish white that my SC52w has, which I love. This is more of a yellow white that my original SC600w has, almost the exact same just ever so slightly cooler. Oh well, still an awesome light and the tint really doesn't bother me that much because it looks great outside.







SC52w on the left and SC600wII on the right.


----------



## kj2

*Re: Warm (neutral White) or Cool White?*

I just noticed that the machining on both sides are slightly different. Do more SC600's have this?








Knurling in a point- Knurling rounded.


----------



## markr6

*Re: Warm (neutral White) or Cool White?*



Erik1213 said:


> It's all about your personal preference. I like neutral/warm white lights. I can appreciate cool but a bad cool white bothers me more than a bad neutral white and I only have one Zebra with a good cool white (SC51f).
> 
> My only beef with the new SC600w is the LED tint. I was hoping it would be the pinkish white that my SC52w has, which I love. This is more of a yellow white that my original SC600w has, almost the exact same just ever so slightly cooler. Oh well, still an awesome light and the tint really doesn't bother me that much because it looks great outside.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> SC52w on the left and SC600wII on the right.



What the heck?!?! I want an SC52w like that!! I've tried over 10 and they are all the greenest light I've ever seen.


----------



## cyclesport

*Re: Warm (neutral White) or Cool White?*

I don't mean to derail this thread, but a question for Erik1213..._when_ did you purchase your SC52w highlighted in your beamshot comparison to the left of your SC600wII? Reason I ask, is that it looks remarkably like the tint on (mine and other poster's) new H52w, claiming to utilize the same 4400k XM-L2 emitter in the SC52w...only usually most SC52w's are a yellow/green tint. My light dealer speculated a few mos ago that (1) ZL would be purchasing CREE reels in the US which might give them better control over tint selection...or in the alternative...(2) the rose/pinkish tint of the H52w may have been the result of sheer luck, and ZL simply latched onto a good tinted reel? Your beamshot seems to indicate what I've been hoping for...that newer SC52ws would ultimately utilize the great rose tint of the H52w. Please tell me your SC52w was purchased from a new lot of recently manufactured lights?!


----------



## Erik1213

*Re: Warm (neutral White) or Cool White?*

The light was ordered directly from Zebralight.com on 5/15/13. I believe it was also a preorder. So, definitely not a new batch.


----------



## cyclesport

*Re: Warm (neutral White) or Cool White?*



Erik1213 said:


> The light was ordered directly from Zebralight.com on 5/15/13. I believe it was also a preorder. So, definitely not a new batch.



Thanks for the info. I was hoping it was one of the newest gen SC52w's. Not sure what to think at this point other than perhaps you lucked out in the tint lottery...


----------



## markr6

*Re: Warm (neutral White) or Cool White?*



cyclesport said:


> Thanks for the info. I was hoping it was one of the newest gen SC52w's. Not sure what to think at this point other than perhaps you lucked out in the tint lottery...



Very lucky! I ordered several from different dealers and from Zebralight.com. Tested at least 10 in person. All green so I finally gave up after a few months of that hassle


----------



## cyclesport

*Re: Warm (neutral White) or Cool White?*



markr6 said:


> Very lucky! I ordered several from different dealers and from Zebralight.com. Tested at least 10 in person. All green so I finally gave up after a few months of that hassle



Haha...yeah, I know from your previous posts you've tried many SC52w's in an attempt to get a good one, and also that you have the H52w so you know what I mean by the nice rose tint it has. I still have hope that when the new SC52w L2 is launched, it will have a much improved tint similar to the H52w? I'm awaiting the reports/beam shots from those future owners...


----------



## duckied

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**



kj2 said:


> Came in today  Nice looking light, although there are some dents in the metal :thinking: but not in the coating. Switch is soft.



Odd, Mines also came with a little dent on the head. Oh well they pretty much did what I will eventually do one day. lol But being that I spent almost $100 bucks I expected a little better.


----------



## moozooh

*Re: Warm (neutral White) or Cool White?*



ncvetteman said:


> I am new to this. Is there any consensus as to which is the preferred light color? ........... Warm(neutral white) or Cool white?



Neutral white is more of an acquired taste, but in cases with XM-L and similar high-power LEDs, there's a lot of important benefits to it. NW renders natural colors (such as green, brown, red) considerably better, provides better contrast outdoors (very important for biking and trekking). It's also easier on the eyes and doesn't burn out melatonin as much, meaning you'll have easier time going to sleep upon heavy use. The cons are that it may look rather unpleasantly yellow-ish or pink-ish indoors, and is very slightly (almost unnoticeably) dimmer than its CW counterpart. However, the better contrast and color rendition make up for that small loss.

When the first NW ZebraLights were coming out, the difference in brightness between CW and NW would be 13-14%, and that actually felt significant. These days it's closer to 7-8%, and the neutral SC600w L2 has already cleared the psychological barrier of 1000 lumens just as well as the cool SC600 L2. Basically the only major reason _not_ to go neutral white at this point is if the tint really doesn't suit your needs/tastes. Otherwise it's hands-down better.


----------



## ncvetteman

*Re: Warm (neutral White) or Cool White?*



moozooh said:


> Neutral white is more of an acquired taste, but in cases with XM-L and similar high-power LEDs, there's a lot of important benefits to it. NW renders natural colors (such as green, brown, red) considerably better, provides better contrast outdoors (very important for biking and trekking). It's also easier on the eyes and doesn't burn out melatonin as much, meaning you'll have easier time going to sleep upon heavy use. The cons are that it may look rather unpleasantly yellow-ish or pink-ish indoors, and is very slightly (almost unnoticeably) dimmer than its CW counterpart. However, the better contrast and color rendition make up for that small loss.
> 
> When the first NW ZebraLights were coming out, the difference in brightness between CW and NW would be 13-14%, and that actually felt significant. These days it's closer to 7-8%, and the neutral SC600w L2 has already cleared the psychological barrier of 1000 lumens just as well as the cool SC600 L2. Basically the only major reason _not_ to go neutral white at this point is if the tint really doesn't suit your needs/tastes. Otherwise it's hands-down better.



Thanks! I just got my Zebralight SC600w MKII L2 today. I really like it a lot. I think I like the tint just fine. :thumbsup:


----------



## moozooh

moozooh said:


> So, I've found myself in a peculiar situation. My boss accidentally broke the glass of my old SC600 U2, so I now have a good incentive and opportunity to upgrade. And since S5310 is still nowhere in sight, I've decided to give this model another go—this time neutral white though.
> 
> The good part: even though I didn't ask for it, boss offered to reimburse the purchase of a new light. Moreover, he was so impressed with the light and the fact that I've been using it as a bike lamp (which it's really, really good for, btw), he told me to order not one but _three_ lights: one for me, one for himself, and one for his wife's bike.



My lights arrived at the PO a couple days ago, so I'm going to grab them tomorrow. Wish me luck with the tint lottery, haha! Though I'm arguably in a privileged position on that end: I have not one but three lights to pick from. 

Going to post a small report when I get them. Wish I had three 18650 batteries...


----------



## Etsu

*Re: Warm (neutral White) or Cool White?*



moozooh said:


> Neutral white is ... also easier on the eyes and doesn't burn out melatonin as much, meaning you'll have easier time going to sleep upon heavy use.



I don't buy that argument. Light therapy treatments (to keep people awake when they want to shift their natural sleep cycles) uses very intense light. Upwards of 300 uW/sq cm, or more. Yes, it's best to use bluish light, but it also must be very intense over a time period of at least several minutes.

You'd have to be shining your flashlight directly in your face to have a significant impact on your sleep cycle due to the affects you describe.

There are plenty of benefits to neutral or warm white lights, but not affecting your sleep as much as CW isn't one of them.


----------



## moozooh

*Re: Warm (neutral White) or Cool White?*

Where I live, light therapy is conducted exclusively during the early hours of the day, when it's bright anyway. At night, even bright blue indicator LEDs can mess up sleep cycle. For instance, the article here suggests an effect at 8 lux, and also that it's the amount of short wavelengths that matters, not their relative purity:
http://www.health.harvard.edu/newsletters/Harvard_Health_Letter/2012/May/blue-light-has-a-dark-side/

When you're shining a 300+ lumen light around in the dark, especially when you tailstand it or hit a reflective surface (glassy, metallic, or wet), a lot of light is reflected right into your eyes. Most of it is blue. Neutral white lights have weaker blue in their spectrum, which is why they feel easier on the eyes. The difference might be unnoticeable in EDC use, but when you're using the light daily for an extended amount of time (such as when camping), it may well accumulate in less than a week.

[EDIT]
Anyway, got my lights! (And the spare lenses for my old one as well!)

Good news: they all work, have no noticeable bugs or defects from my preliminary testing, and appear to be watertight (I've yet to make a conclusive test like I've done with my other lights).

Not so good news: they all have very minor variations in anodizing color, machining, button stiffness, brightness, and tint. If they weren't all from the same order (that was placed at a time when a very limited amount was available) I would have thought them to be made on different factories. None of the differences are a dealbreaker, though, but the light with the highest brightness and the best tint had a stiffer button and an anodizing color that I wouldn't pick otherwise. Sad to be forced into a compromise. Zebralight should really pay more attention to this; when you have a single light you just take it as it is, but when you get the opportunity to compare you realize how inconsistent they are. If it weren't generally between "good" and "better", all things considered, ZL's business would be in deep trouble already. :shakehead And why are those buttons so stiff? The ones on my old SC600 and H502 were perfect!

If I get the opportunity to take a group photo of the lights before I give away the surplus two in the next few days I'll definitely do it.

And from what I've seen so far, I absolutely love the tint and brightness of the piece I decided to keep for myself. :thumbsup:

[EDIT 2]
More good news: all three survived the water torture. Put them under open tap one by one, then put each into a bowl filled with water, dunk the front end perpendicularly to water surface repeatedly to ensure that water pressure imitated realistic conditions, then clicked the button a few dozen times while underwater. I tested two of the lights on a near-discharged battery, and when it suddenly gave out mid-test, that frightened the hell out of me. Retested with a fresh battery, and both lights worked fine. Probably tripped the protection circuit somehow. :shrug:

At the same time I should say that none of the tailcaps on the new lights fit tightly: they're all about a millimeter shorter than they should be. On my old SC600 the most I could fit into the gap between the cap and the body was a single sheet of paper. On the new ones, the entire instruction manual (that's equivalent to five sheets) fits comfortably. Needless to say, that leaves the tailcap O-ring more exposed than before.

[EDIT 3]
Strobe modes step down as well! Now that's something new.


----------



## harryk387

*Re: Warm (neutral White) or Cool White?*

Looks like my ZL SC600w MKII L2 is coming in sometime today. I already have a fenix pd35 that i edc, but not knowing what output its going to turn on with is kind of annoying. Also, on an 18650, turbo only lasts a few minutes before im pretty much stuck with high as the highest setting. This will be my first neutral white light so hopefully I like the tint. Ill likely do a comparison vid of the two once the sc600 gets here. Stay tuned


----------



## harryk387

So its finally here...

First impressions. Smaller than i thought it would be (definitely a plus). Although the head of the zebralight is a tad wider than on the fenix pd35 i edc, the shorter body is definitely better. 

In terms of the tint, im not sure how im liking the neutral white tint. Its very much like an early incandescent light bulb tint, which really seems a little dimmer than the cool white tint of my pd35. 850 lumens of the pd35 v 1020 lumens of the sc600mkii- the pd35 actually looks brighter. So far ive only tested them out in my bedroom which isnt dark enough yet to completely test it out. 

Otherwise, Im loving the interface. I love being able to go straight to the output i need from off without having to mess around with a separate mode changing button. Also like the programmability of each output. Im thinking of trying out the cool white version of the sc600mkii l2 and see if i like that better. Any good beam shot comparisons of the neutral white v cool white version of this light?

Anyway, here are some pics of the two lights side by side. Ill take some beamshots later tonight, and maybe try to get a video if my galaxy s3 can pick up the difference in tint and brightness....

SC600 & PD35 tail-stand (pd35 needs a little help tailstanding by leaning against sc600)


----------



## Charles L.

Hey Harry,

I don't have beamshots but I do have cool and neutral white versions of the SC600 II L2. Cool white definitely *looks* brighter. Having said that, I think you'll find that the NW version generates more light than you may think at first -- it is very floody and the tint is yellow, but it puts out like a beast. It's also regulated for a relatively long time. 

Your pics illustrate why the SC600 is such a great lttle light. Class-leading brightness and efficiency in a compact package. Not to menton better moonlight modes and a more versatile UI. And it tail-stands


----------



## harryk387

I still havent tried the light out in complete darkness, once i get home tonight ill get a better idea of the tint and brightness.


----------



## moozooh

I've gotten a hold of a laser thermometer, and measured the temperature of my old SC600-U2 and the new SC600w II L2 in the first five minutes on H1 (before SC600-U2 has a chance to step down), standing head down. The reference point was the leftmost part of ZL logo (the "Z"), as it is the point where I rest my thumb if the light becomes too hot. The measurement wasn't absolutely precise, so take it with a grain of salt; however, I estimate the margin of error to be less than 1.0°C. The numbers fully corroborate my own sensations from handling either light.

Note: the SC600-U2 is a simple modded version of the original SC600 with an XM-L U2 mounted on a copper PCB (mod done by vinhnguyen). It should have somewhat better thermal conductivity than the original model.





About 45°C is when either light becomes painful to handle. For the new mk2 L2 this happens at the point of measurement already by the end of the third minute, meaning it's not really feasible to run it on turbo for long in hot weather while holding it with bare hands. (Not that I was going to.) This suggests one or more (or all) of the following:
1) the mk2 L2 feeds significantly more juice to the LED at full power compared to the original model, perhaps closer to 3.1-3.2 A;
2) the mk2 L2's body has significantly better thermal design, allowing it to become its own radiator almost entirely;
3) high thermal conductivity, while good for the LED, may not be the most ergonomic choice for its owner after all.

Also, I seem to have noticed a defect with my piece.  More on that later.


----------



## harryk387

so Ive been playing around with my new ZL SC600W mkii l2 and i think the neutral white tint is growing on me. Compared to my fenix pd35, i love the user interface, so great to be able to choose which mode to get to from off. I took a quick video comparing the pd35 to the SC600W mkii l2 on their highest outputs. Sorry for the crap quality, but i think you guys can still get a basic idea of the difference in tint at the very least.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_2vJyOR9BbE&feature=youtu.be


----------



## ohio72

Just received my first Zebralight SC600 MK II yesterday and I'm having a problem trying to find the 4 different blinking modes. It says to triple click from off and I have tried and tried but no luck. Any help would greatly be appreciated! Thanks.


----------



## kj2

ohio72 said:


> Just received my first Zebralight SC600 MK II yesterday and I'm having a problem trying to find the 4 different blinking modes. It says to triple click from off and I have tried and tried but no luck. Any help would greatly be appreciated! Thanks.



Triple click from off, and then double click to switch modes.


----------



## Swede74

ohio72 said:


> Just received my first Zebralight SC600 MK II yesterday and I'm having a problem trying to find the 4 different blinking modes. It says to triple click from off and I have tried and tried but no luck. Any help would greatly be appreciated! Thanks.



I don't have the SC600 MK II but I have the SC62d and as far as I can tell, they share the same user interface. If your light is pre-programmed to 0.2 Hz beacon, it will flash once every five seconds, and at least on my light, it takes a while for it to start flashing after the triple click. Not more than a couple, maybe three seconds, but long enough to make you wonder if maybe you accidentally turned the light off.


----------



## ohio72

I have done that and no luck.


----------



## ohio72

I bought the light used and I can do the other H M and low modes. When I triple click from off it stays on a low setting.


----------



## Swede74

ohio72 said:


> I have done that and no luck.



If you get the battery gauge started by 4 short clicks you have the right technique, so if that feature is working OK, maybe you have to consider sending it back for repair / replacement.

Edit: Sorry, I didn't know you bought it used when I wrote this. It's a fairly new model so it should still be under warranty though.


----------



## ohio72

I can get the battery gauge to work no problem. I just can't get to the blinking modes from off. I have the slow strobe for my H2 when I double click on high.


----------



## Swede74

ohio72 said:


> I can get the battery gauge to work no problem. I just can't get to the blinking modes from off. I have the slow strobe for my H2 when I double click on high.



I'm sorry again for adding to your confusion, I just realized you have the Mk II, not the Mk II - L2; the Mk II has a different user interface. It's only the very latest models that have the triple-click to activate strobe feature.

Mk II: http://www.zebralight.com/SC600-Mk-II-18650-XM-L-900Lm-Flashlight_p_106.html

Mk II - L2: http://www.zebralight.com/SC600-Mk-II-L2-18650-XM-L2-Flashlight-Cool-White_p_123.html


----------



## ohio72

Yeah your right. I thought it was the L2 version. Sorry about all that. I still like this light for my first Zebralight though. Will have to get L2 version soon. Thanks for your time though.


----------



## Swede74

ohio72 said:


> Yeah your right. I thought it was the L2 version. Sorry about all that. I still like this light for my first Zebralight though. Will have to get L2 version soon. Thanks for your time though.



You're welcome. I hope you will enjoy your first Zebra, but beware, even single Zebras have been known to turn into herds in no time


----------



## Stefano

I received my SC600w (MK II L2) today, the tint is good

Together with the SC600 I also bought the H600w and H602w.
Last month, the new H52w, all four lights have the same good tint.

Everything seems perfect, just the SC600 is sticky, the torch is clean but maybe someone at the factory has touched with greasy hands 

I also have the earlier models of SC600 and headlamp, the difference is that the switch current is very soft, I was used to in that it was much harder. 
But it is just a matter of getting used to it..

(Terrible translation by Google Translator


----------



## moozooh

moozooh said:


> Also, I seem to have noticed a defect with my piece.  More on that later.



So, I've finally received extra 18650 batteries and borrowed a DSLR camera to make some photos. Warning: pic-heavy <strike>as usual</strike>. 

All images done at a 'daylight' white balance setting (IIRC it was 5400 K) and slightly desaturated to better match my perception. Beamshots are done against an A4 sheet of paper. So everything looks pretty close to what it is in real life.

*Tint* (triple SC600w II L2 vs. SC600-U2)





The leftmost light has the most yellow/green hue. The difference is very subtle, but it's there. The middle two show no noticeable differences.


*LED defect*





Same light, different angle:





The dark area definitely shouldn't be there. Thankfully, it doesn't seem to impair output noticeably when compared to other two L2 pieces. That being said...


*Brightness variance*





Two L2 pieces, same output level (H1), 1/4000 shutter. Yes, *one of them is, in fact, not as bright as the other* with all conditions (battery charge, temperature, runtime) being equal. I would say by at least 150 lumen, since I can easily detect it with my bare eye. I don't expect it to be in the ballpark of same bin variation; besides, only the highest settings seem to be affected. Likely something to do with a misfiring PID controller, or maybe an improperly mounted LED.


*Hotspot size*










L2 has a larger, less defined hotspot! I consider it to be more of a good thing. A couple more pics from behind the sheet, with different shutter settings:


----------



## markr6

Nice shots! Tints look good to me, except little boy blue on the right LOL. Just a personal preference though. That dark spot on the LED is strange, never seen that before.


----------



## toysareforboys

moozooh said:


> L2 has a larger, less defined hotspot! I consider it to be more of a good thing. A couple more pics from behind the sheet, with different shutter settings:


Wow, I really like the "behind the sheet" photo! Thanks for the great pics 

You got me worried about my SC600w MKii L2 LED so I got out the camera and took a look, defect free, woot!






Thanks again for the great pics!

-Jamie M.


----------



## moozooh

markr6 said:


> Nice shots! Tints look good to me, except little boy blue on the right LOL. Just a personal preference though.


Thanks! I'd say all tints are very good and look truly neutral to my eye, just a tad more rosy than my H502d which sports the most neutral, highest CRI LED out of the lights I have. Of all the NW XM-Ls I've seen photographed here on CPF, this is definitely one of the better ones. Needless to say, I have no regrets in forgoing the CW version—it really has nothing to offer that NW doesn't do better.

Interestingly enough, most people I've asked about SC600/SC600w prefer the cool one as it appears brighter and whiter to them. Oh well! Then again, all of it happened indoors, and NW lights didn't have enough room to show their advantages there. At least they didn't have to look at all the things people typically deal with when using flashlights as intended: roads, woods, color-coded wires, campfire food, and so on.



markr6 said:


> That dark spot on the LED is strange, never seen that before.


I just hope it isn't some kind of phosphorus rot/burnout that will deteriorates over the next few months or so. It does seem to directly react to temperature, as when I turn the cold light on L1/L2/M2 it isn't visible, but if I turn it on any of the high settings and then switch to L1/M2, it appears there until the light cools down somewhat. I should point out: the light that is unusually dim isn't the one that has the dark spot!

All in all I'm rather disappointed by ZL's quality control. At least two of the three lights I've received shouldn't have gone past it, and I'd really like to know why they have. Unfortunately I have neither time nor desire to wait another two months for RMA roundabout, as is typically the case with these things, so my boss and I will have to settle with what we have. I'll most likely skip on any further offerings until I'm sure ZL has tightened up their QC policies.


----------



## RIX TUX

ohio72 said:


> I bought the light used and I can do the other H M and low modes. When I triple click from off it stays on a low setting.



might be the 900 lumen model?


----------



## TEEJ

There's a programming sequence, and, I did this accidentally, where I changed the turbo output, so I THOUGHT the light had gotten dimmer than it used to be...but, I was able to reprogram it later, and, low and behold, it was brighter again on all levels.



Food for thought.


----------



## moozooh

If you're referring to my post, yes, I'm aware of the sequence; the unexpected brightness variance is on H1 which is non-programmable and is the highest possible setting. I've double-checked this several times to make sure the modes were the same. The difference seemed to be unnoticeable on most settings except the highest two or so. Either way the extra lights are gone now so I don't have anything to compare anymore. I'm currently left with my old SC600 and an mk2 L2 with the dark spot on the LED, and to be fair, it's hard to tell the brightness difference between them on the highest settings due to different tints and hotspot sizes at a brief glance. Although in that respect it's fine for me either way.


----------



## Fireclaw18

Dark spot on the LED?

Is it on the phosphor of the LED or just the dome? If it's just on the dome maybe you can unscrew the bezel, remove the lens and reflector and wipe off the LED with a alcohol lens wipe. that might fix the problem.


----------



## moozooh

I'm afraid it's on the phosphor layer. Besides, I wouldn't be able to unscrew the bezel as ZL's new flashlight head design uses press-fit bezels that cannot be undone (let alone redone) in any accessible way. Which is a shame, because that basically forces one to RMA a light that has its lens broken—the weakest point of any light by far—as one wouldn't be able to just swap it with a spare one. I've actually no idea what to do with lights past their warranty period!

I'm willing to forgive most of these blunders, but surely they wouldn't disappoint so hard if they didn't regularly plague one of the brightest and most deserving manufacturers currently on the market to begin with. ZL is all about providing maximalist experience in minimalist package, a feature explored fully in a scope entirely unique to them and to this point unrivaled; it can be traced in every aspect of their lights from UI to price point. Few brands out there—regardless of industry type—ever manage to successfully establish the same kind of this-or-nothing connection in just a few years of operation. It's criminal to let it go down the drain due to something as mundane as QC issues.


----------



## Charles L.

moozooh said:


> It's criminal to let it go down the drain due to something as mundane as QC issues.



Agreed. I haven't had trouble with my ZL's (yet!), but it's hard to ignore the number of problems mentioned on this site.


----------



## InspectHerGadget

Charles L. said:


> Agreed. I haven't had trouble with my ZL's (yet!), but it's hard to ignore the number of problems mentioned on this site.



I agree there seems to be a huge number of quality issues reported and variations too. It is like they've farmed out production to a number of different little factories and supervision is not up to scratch.

I ordered one last weekend from Zebralight on 'backorder' which could mean weeks or months to get one of these hot running super suns in my hands. I'm starting to wonder if it is worth it although most likely I'll proceed. 

Just one comment though and that is the temperatures that they run at. It does seem to me from comments that 50C it seems to run at is effectively too hot for most people. Other manufacturers seem to be more conservative on heat production. Even my P5R.2 Lenser runs hot a little not so hot it is anywhere near uncomfortable so probably closer to 40C if that and that is running a AA size customised cell and 270 Lumens.

I wonder if they're over cooking the duck on this one? In it's defence it has a big fat chunky head, relatively, all of which help dissipate heat.


----------



## JohnSmith

Small quantities of cool white and neutral white versions are back in stock at Illumination Supply. I've been eyeing this light up for a while and just jumped on a cool white version for myself. Just passing along the info for anyone else waiting for these to appear again.


----------



## UnderPar

I just got my cool white version of this light. Really a cool light. UI is absolutely fantastic. This replaces my QT2L-X as EDC. But I will still alternate them since I really love that model of FourSevens.


----------



## InspectHerGadget

UnderPar said:


> I just got my cool white version of this light. Really a cool light. UI is absolutely fantastic. This replaces my QT2L-X as EDC. But I will still alternate them since I really love that model of FourSevens.
> 
> They look like a great light and I take it no quality issues at all?



Congratulations on what seems like a trouble free delivery with no forceps required.... Exciting! Send us all a cigar.

Let us know how it goes, I will be eager for any comments. The switch is a common source of complaints so I'd be very interested in what you have to say about that and how easy it is to change modes.


----------



## InspectHerGadget

JohnSmith said:


> Small quantities of cool white and neutral white versions are back in stock at Illumination Supply. I've been eyeing this light up for a while and just jumped on a cool white version for myself. Just passing along the info for anyone else waiting for these to appear again.



I've noticed that they have posted that recent batches have some discolouration of the tail cap anodising and not to order it if this is an issue for you.

I suppose if I got one like that it wouldn't bother me. What concerns me though is the huge number of complaints of all sorts on this thread or is it just because there is a huge number of these out in the market? 

A rhetorical question I guess as only ZL would know the number of returns and faults, we just have to guess unless someone starts a poll?

Now there is an idea!


----------



## mekquake

Already done http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?346631-Did-a-zebra-SC50-50-51-52-ever-die-on-you


----------



## InspectHerGadget

mekquake said:


> Already done http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?346631-Did-a-zebra-SC50-50-51-52-ever-die-on-you



Ouch!

i have to say reassuring...not!

It is for SC5x series but it is indicative I guess...people must love them enough to keep buying thEm though.


----------



## TEEJ

Most will not "report" that there WAS no issue, but, if there was, they tend to want to. 

What tends to happen in enthusiast forums, is that every single problem is mentioned, and, very few, proportionally, of those with no issue. This makes enthusiast forums show threads about problems (And this goes for any forum, trucks, lights, guns, cars, watches, whatever....) tend to make products seem problematic, due the tendency to report disproportionally. Its just an artifact of using forums.



As many thousands of lights are sold, obviously the complaints are a small percentage, which is normal for most stuff with decent QA/QC. The perspective is that if you see a lot of the same complaints, it tends to indicate that if you might have a problem, those might be what to expect.


Overweighting a small sample's statistical power is a common problem for enthusiast forum readers trying to gauge a products reliability.


----------



## JohnSmith

I received my SC600 MKII cool white version from Illumination Supply. And WOW, what a compact and bright light. I had been considering this light for a while, but what pushed me into a decision to buy it are the photos comparing it to the Surefire E1L in this thread: http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...x18650)-Review-RUNTIMES-BEAMSHOTS-VIDEO/page9
I just couldn't believe an 1100 lumen, 1x18650 light could be that small.

Here's a size comparison to my HDS EDC 200 Clicky:






My version has a nice responsive switch, not mushy at all, good tactile feedback and easy to multi-click. The tint on the high levels is white with a touch of yellow/warmth, and on the lower levels there's a touch of green. I'm OK with this, as I didn't buy it for the tint.

There's some discoloration of the anodizing on the tailcap, perhaps it wasn't fully cleaned prior to anodization. This defect was disclosed by the vendor beforehand, and I had no problem with this issue. Overall I'm pleased and I look forward to putting it to use.

I'm not crazy about the clip, though. Can anyone recommend an aftermarket version that might be a little more grippy to the pocket (i.e. more tension)?


----------



## markr6

JohnSmith said:


> I'm not crazy about the clip, though. Can anyone recommend an aftermarket version that might be a little more grippy to the pocket (i.e. more tension)?



It seemed pretty tight to me. Did you try bending it downward a bit before attaching? I usually find I need to do this when I get a new pocket knife.


----------



## Oztorchfreak

I have the SC52 and the new SC600 MK2 and neither have showed any signs of problems but the switch on my older SC600 MK1 needs a very hard press to operate at all and is very unreliable now.

I now press it hard many times to make a better contact if the problem is the contact surfaces inside the switch but it seems to have made no difference.

This light has not seen a lot of usage so I don't know why the switch is playing up nowadays.

Has anyone else had any problems with SC series switches/push buttons?



*CHEERS*


----------



## UnderPar

I have absolutely no issues with SC600 MKII L2 switch. Will order for another ZL. The SC52 L2 soon as the stocks are available.


----------



## carl

Oztorchfreak said:


> I have the SC52 and the new SC600 MK2 and neither have showed any signs of problems but the switch on my older SC600 MK1 needs a very hard press to operate at all and is very unreliable now.
> 
> I now press it hard many times to make a better contact if the problem is the contact surfaces inside the switch but it seems to have made no difference.
> 
> This light has not seen a lot of usage so I don't know why the switch is playing up nowadays.
> 
> Has anyone else had any problems with SC series switches/push buttons?
> 
> 
> 
> *CHEERS*



I wonder if electronic switches on flashlights can become unreliable after several years similar to switches and buttons on other electronic devices like calculators, microwaves, etc.. It may be that the most reliable switches on flashlights are mechanical clickies like the McClicky - as long as the amps are within reason. 

This is why I went with the Sunwayman V20C - a mechanical clicky at the tail and another switch up front to change modes - a magnetic rotary ring rather than an electronic pushbutton switch.


----------



## JohnSmith

markr6 said:


> It seemed pretty tight to me. Did you try bending it downward a bit before attaching? I usually find I need to do this when I get a new pocket knife.



A little bending and now it's perfect. Thanks!


----------



## Charles L.

TEEJ said:


> Overweighting a small sample's statistical power is a common problem for enthusiast forum readers trying to gauge a products reliability.



This.


----------



## Fireclaw18

carl said:


> I wonder if electronic switches on flashlights can become unreliable after several years similar to switches and buttons on other electronic devices like calculators, microwaves, etc.. It may be that the most reliable switches on flashlights are mechanical clickies like the McClicky - as long as the amps are within reason.
> 
> This is why I went with the Sunwayman V20C - a mechanical clicky at the tail and another switch up front to change modes - a magnetic rotary ring rather than an electronic pushbutton switch.



Electronic switches are supposed to be more reliable than clicky switches. This is because an electronic switch is mechanically much simpler, so there's less to wear out inside.

A clicky switch has a small rotating part, usually made out of plastic. This part has ridges and teeth on it and it rotates each time the button is depressed. It functions similarly to the rotating part inside a typical push-button ballpoint pen. If those teeth wear out, the switch will no longer function correctly.

Mechanically an electronic switch is actually just a simple momentary pushbutton. When the button is depressed it closes a connection below the button. This connection stays closed only as long as the button is held down. When it is released the connection is broken. The only moving parts are the button and spring, which can both be metal .... there's no delicate rotating piece to wear out. This simple momentary pushbutton is then attached to a driver circuitboard, which determines what happens when the button is depressed... but the circuit has no moving parts to wear out.

Another advantage is that the flashlight's main current doesn't flow through an electronic switch. This means the switch can be much smaller and lighter, and the wiring to it can be very fine. With a clicky switch, all of the power to the emitter flows through the switch, so it needs to be able to handle much higher current without failing.

*Bottom line*: Like anything with moving parts, an electronic switch can fail, but it should have a much longer expected lifetime than any clicky switch.


----------



## fnj

Fireclaw18 said:


> Electronic switches are supposed to be more reliable than clicky switches. This is because an electronic switch is mechanically much simpler, so there's less to wear out inside.
> 
> A clicky switch has a small rotating part, usually made out of plastic. This part has ridges and teeth on it and it rotates each time the button is depressed. It functions similarly to the rotating part inside a typical push-button ballpoint pen. If those teeth wear out, the switch will no longer function correctly.
> 
> Mechanically an electronic switch is actually just a simple momentary pushbutton. When the button is depressed it closes a connection below the button. This connection stays closed only as long as the button is held down. When it is released the connection is broken. The only moving parts are the button and spring, which can both be metal .... there's no delicate rotating piece to wear out. This simple momentary pushbutton is then attached to a driver circuitboard, which determines what happens when the button is depressed... but the circuit has no moving parts to wear out.
> 
> Another advantage is that the flashlight's main current doesn't flow through an electronic switch. This means the switch can be much smaller and lighter, and the wiring to it can be very fine. With a clicky switch, all of the power to the emitter flows through the switch, so it needs to be able to handle much higher current without failing.
> 
> *Bottom line*: Like anything with moving parts, an electronic switch can fail, but it should have a much longer expected lifetime than any clicky switch.



Excellent point. Electronic switches that are metal dimples contacting a metal contact can essentially last forever, at least mechanically speaking. The tradeoff is that there is essentially zero current drain and wiping action. These factors mean that the contact can get unreliable through corrosion and minute impurities.

The balance against total failure is definitely on the side of decently designed electronic switches. Anyone who has had a mechanical clicky emit that dreaded CLUNK, followed by mechanical freeze-up, knows what I am talking about. However, Zebra's switches have a reputation for becoming quirky.


----------



## LightWalker

fnj said:


> Excellent point. Electronic switches that are metal dimples contacting a metal contact can essentially last forever, at least mechanically speaking. The tradeoff is that there is essentially zero current drain and wiping action. These factors mean that the contact can get unreliable through corrosion and minute impurities.
> 
> The balance against total failure is definitely on the side of decently designed electronic switches. Anyone who has had a mechanical clicky emit that dreaded CLUNK, followed by mechanical freeze-up, knows what I am talking about. However, Zebra's switches have a reputation for becoming quirky.



If the mechanical switch on a Fourseven's Quark fails, I think it would be covered under the 10 year warranty but if not they only cost about $9 and are easily replaced. At that price you can afford to have a spare on hand.

If the switch on a ZL fails after the one year warranty you will probably have to spend quite a bit of money to get it fixed and be without the light for weeks.


----------



## BirdofPrey

LightWalker said:


> If the mechanical switch on a Fourseven's Quark fails, I think it would be covered under the 10 year warranty but if not they only cost about $9 and are easily replaced. At that price you can afford to have a spare on hand.
> 
> If the switch on a ZL fails after the one year warranty you will probably have to spend quite a bit of money to get it fixed and be without the light for weeks.



I've sent one in about four years after purchase. I waited around 5 weeks to get it back. 

I only paid a little over $2 to ship it to them. They paid the shipping back to me. 

So... 

Sent from my ridiculously large Galaxy Note 2.


----------



## BWX

LightWalker said:


> If the mechanical switch on a Fourseven's Quark fails, I think it would be covered under the 10 year warranty but if not they only cost about $9 and are easily replaced. At that price you can afford to have a spare on hand.
> 
> If the switch on a ZL fails after the one year warranty you will probably have to spend quite a bit of money to get it fixed and be without the light for weeks.



That is a good point. I think for $90+, a flashlight should come with a much better warranty than 1 year.


----------



## LightWalker

BirdofPrey said:


> I've sent one in about four years after purchase. I waited around 5 weeks to get it back.
> 
> I only paid a little over $2 to ship it to them. They paid the shipping back to me.
> 
> So...
> 
> Sent from my ridiculously large Galaxy Note 2.



I have a spare so a 5 week wait wouldn't bother me too much and a little over $2 won't hurt either.



BWX said:


> That is a good point. I think for $90+, a flashlight should come with a much better warranty than 1 year.



I agree.


----------



## lornranger

Just got my SC600 MKII. The switch is rather hard to press, compared to my H600W. Is this a defect? On the other hand, the anodizing on the SC600 is perfect, whereas the H600W anodizing is a botch job.


----------



## markr6

lornranger said:


> Just got my SC600 MKII. The switch is rather hard to press, compared to my H600W.



That's strange. Seems like all the older models had the harder switch; newer ones were very soft. So looks like they still vary a lot, unless you purchased this used or from a supplier with older stock.


----------



## lornranger

markr6 said:


> That's strange. Seems like all the older models had the harder switch; newer ones were very soft. So looks like they still vary a lot, unless you purchased this used or from a supplier with older stock.



I purchased mine direct from zebralight. After some prodding, i discovered the problem. The electronic switch beneath the rubber cover was not installed exactly in the centre. It is slanted more to the body, rather than the head. So if i use my fingernail to poke the rubber cover nearer to the head, i can poke an empty space. 

So do i have whats essentially a manufacturing defect? After waiting for 2 months?!


----------



## markr6

lornranger said:


> I purchased mine direct from zebralight. After some prodding, i discovered the problem. The electronic switch beneath the rubber cover was not installed exactly in the centre. It is slanted more to the body, rather than the head. So if i use my fingernail to poke the rubber cover nearer to the head, i can poke an empty space.
> 
> So do i have whats essentially a manufacturing defect? After waiting for 2 months?!



Oh geeeeez, not another (new to me) issue!!??!! ZL you're killing me!


----------



## BWX

lornranger said:


> I purchased mine direct from zebralight. After some prodding, i discovered the problem. The electronic switch beneath the rubber cover was not installed exactly in the centre. It is slanted more to the body, rather than the head. So if i use my fingernail to poke the rubber cover nearer to the head, i can poke an empty space.
> 
> So do i have whats essentially a manufacturing defect? After waiting for 2 months?!



I'm surprised if I get a ZL without some sort of issue or defect.


----------



## cagenuts

BWX said:


> I'm surprised if I get a ZL without some sort of issue or defect.



Eish that's not good as I've just ordered three from E2 Field Gear (one day before their 4th 15% discount of course).

The lights have to find their way across the Atlantic to South Africa so sending them back is not an option. Perhaps the lumen gods will be kind to me.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

lornranger said:


> Just got my SC600 MKII. The switch is rather hard to press, compared to my H600W. Is this a defect? On the other hand, the anodizing on the SC600 is perfect, whereas the H600W anodizing is a botch job.



How hard to press? In another thread, http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?387195-Zebralight-SC52w-L2-comparison-to-SC52, I posted some information on how hard the button is to press. On the old "hard button" models, it takes 1.3kg of force to activate the switch. On the new "soft button" models, it takes 0.6kg of force. So the soft switches are twice as easy to press.

I'm only basing this on a very limited sample, but does this correspond with others experiences with the change of Zebralight switches?

I think I prefer the hard switches to the soft ones, but the soft ones aren't too bad.

If you're correct in saying yours is a defect, does that mean that every Zebralight now has soft switches, and if you get a hard one it might indicate a problem? Are there others out there still getting new Zebralights with hard switches?


----------



## markr6

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> If you're correct in saying yours is a defect, does that mean that every Zebralight now has soft switches, and if you get a hard one it might indicate a problem? Are there others out there still getting new Zebralights with hard switches?



I don't want to speak for lornranger, but he said *"The electronic switch beneath the rubber cover was not installed exactly in the centre." *That would be what we need to call a "defect", if anything. NOT the actual softness/firmness because we already confirmed ZL had a switch switch (pun!) from their supplier at some point.

Personally, I have 3 obviously distinct switches:

SC52w: very hard press with loud click sound
H600wII: crisp clicky feel, slight sound (absolutely perfect IMO)
H52w and SC600wII: soft, no sound at all


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

markr6 said:


> I don't want to speak for lornranger, but he said *"The electronic switch beneath the rubber cover was not installed exactly in the centre." *That would be what we need to call a "defect", if anything. NOT the actual softness/firmness because we already confirmed ZL had a switch switch (pun!) from their supplier at some point.



I just checked out the switch on my SC52w-L2 (which I find soft), and I don't think the switch is exactly centered under the rubber cover either. It's slightly towards the upper (towards the bezel) part of the rubber cover. I can still click anywhere on the rubber, but it's easier to click if I press slightly above center. It's quite a bit more difficult if I press below center.

On my old SC52 (hard button), it seems to be more centered, or even very slightly below dead-center. Though it's tougher to tell, because there's very little give in the rubber when feeling around (because it's a hard switch to click). Because of the stiffness, it tends to press about the same wherever you touch it.

Sounds like his switch is centered quite a bit higher than mine.

So there appears to be some tolerances when installing the button. I never noticed this until these posts about it.



> Personally, I have 3 obviously distinct switches:
> 
> SC52w: very hard press with loud click sound
> H600wII: crisp clicky feel, slight sound (absolutely perfect IMO)
> H52w and SC600wII: soft, no sound at all



I think my SC52 falls into your 1st category, and my SC52w-L2 falls into your second. Though I wouldn't call it "crisp", but I'm used to the hard press. It definitely makes a clicking sound, so doesn't fit into your 3rd category.


----------



## NutSAK

markr6 said:


> Personally, I have 3 obviously distinct switches:
> 
> SC52w: very hard press with loud click sound
> H600wII: crisp clicky feel, slight sound (absolutely perfect IMO)
> H52w and SC600wII: soft, no sound at all



Mine don't fit into this description. I would describe mine as follows:

*SC600 MkII L2*: stiff button with loud click sound. Well, not "loud", but very audible for a microswitch.
*SC52w L2*: softer button, but still a definite click that can be heard and felt. It has a very similar feel to my H51fw. I would say this one is crisp and perfect, like your H600wII above.

My opinion is that microswitches like this show a great deal of unit-to-unit variation. For instance, I own two Sunwayman D40Avn, and they both have very different button characteristics. One is easily felt and heard, the other is "soft" and is not audible. I removed the switch cover from the "soft" one and re-centered it, and that slightly improved the feel. However, while the switch cover was completely removed from the soft switch, the action still wasn't as solid as the other unit with the cover on.


----------



## markr6

This reminds me of when I used to be into Fenix lights. I had two LD22 and one LD12 (or the other way around, I forget). Anyway, between all 3 lights, their side switches were completely different. One was totally silent with little feedback which I really liked. The others made a pretty loud click sound, one worse than the other. Another personal preference thing I guess.


----------



## NutSAK

markr6 said:


> Another personal preference thing I guess.



Yes, I would say that it's down to unit variation _and_ personal preference. I like to feel a definite click, but also don't want the switch too stiff, especially in Zebralight's design where the button is recessed.

Some of that personal preference even comes into play in how we describe them, I would imagine.


----------



## lornranger

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> I just checked out the switch on my SC52w-L2 (which I find soft), and I don't think the switch is exactly centered under the rubber cover either. It's slightly towards the upper (towards the bezel) part of the rubber cover. I can still click anywhere on the rubber, but it's easier to click if I press slightly above center. It's quite a bit more difficult if I press below center.
> 
> On my old SC52 (hard button), it seems to be more centered, or even very slightly below dead-center. Though it's tougher to tell, because there's very little give in the rubber when feeling around (because it's a hard switch to click). Because of the stiffness, it tends to press about the same wherever you touch it.
> 
> Sounds like his switch is centered quite a bit higher than mine.
> 
> So there appears to be some tolerances when installing the button. I never noticed this until these posts about it.



Well reading your post makes me feel better, knowing mine is not the only one with off centre switch. My H600W has the perfect switch, soft and easy to press with my finger, but if it is put in my pocket for daily edc use, I bet it would be very easy to accidentally activate the flashlight. It is also installed perfectly in the centre; at least to me.

My SC600 switch is not actually installed higher than yours. It is way lower than yours. If i press the l part of the power on symbol with my fingernail, i press into empty space and cannot activate the flashlight. I have to press below the lower half of the circle to activate the switch.


----------



## lornranger

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> How hard to press? In another thread, http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?387195-Zebralight-SC52w-L2-comparison-to-SC52, I posted some information on how hard the button is to press. On the old "hard button" models, it takes 1.3kg of force to activate the switch. On the new "soft button" models, it takes 0.6kg of force. So the soft switches are twice as easy to press.
> 
> I'm only basing this on a very limited sample, but does this correspond with others experiences with the change of Zebralight switches?
> 
> I think I prefer the hard switches to the soft ones, but the soft ones aren't too bad.
> 
> If you're correct in saying yours is a defect, does that mean that every Zebralight now has soft switches, and if you get a hard one it might indicate a problem? Are there others out there still getting new Zebralights with hard switches?



Well my SC600 takes twice the pressure versus my H600W.


----------



## lornranger

I contacted zebralight and they agree that it is a manufacturing defect, and asked if I would like replacement or refund.


----------



## BWX

lornranger said:


> I contacted zebralight and they agree that it is a manufacturing defect, and asked if I would like replacement or refund.



Now the fun begins. You will not get a brand new light in my experience, but a "re-manufactured" light, with probably an entirely different set of issues. I went through this with them for a period of about three years and six H-501 lights. I eventually gave up after they all failed. I now have a $200 paperweight as a reminder (counting cost of shipping all those times). Pink goo came out of the last one, no joke.. In light of that I would say get a refund, and re-purchase the light.

I do EDC an SC600 MKI B that works great though, even though the switch was messed up from new, but finally "wore-in"..


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

lornranger said:


> Well reading your post makes me feel better, knowing mine is not the only one with off centre switch.
> 
> My SC600 switch is not actually installed higher than yours. It is way lower than yours. If i press the l part of the power on symbol with my fingernail, i press into empty space and cannot activate the flashlight. I have to press below the lower half of the circle to activate the switch.



It sounds like yours is installed way too far off centre for it to be considered acceptable. You're right that it's a manufacturing defect.

One of the things I've noticed on my (soft switch) SC52w-L2, is that the button is recessed slightly more than on the older (hard switch) SC52. It's perhaps 0.5mm further into the head. This makes it slightly more difficult to press, despite it being softer, because my thumb is bigger than the switch and doesn't fit into the hole very well. It's easier if I use the tip of my thumb or finger, which can press into the hole better. I sometimes miss doing a double-click because my thumb is too fat.

There does appear to be a wide range for switch configuration!


----------



## lornranger

BWX said:


> Now the fun begins. You will not get a brand new light in my experience, but a "re-manufactured" light, with probably an entirely different set of issues. I went through this with them for a period of about three years and six H-501 lights. I eventually gave up after they all failed. I now have a $200 paperweight as a reminder (counting cost of shipping all those times). Pink goo came out of the last one, no joke.. In light of that I would say get a refund, and re-purchase the light.
> 
> I do EDC an SC600 MKI B that works great though, even though the switch was messed up from new, but finally "wore-in"..



Err.... wait! You had to bear the cost of shipping the flashlight to them?!

Well, well, zebralight replied again and said that my switch was installed normally, not a manufacturing defect. My switch is a hard switch. So I guess they had changed the switch again! Any replacement they offer will be the same regarding the position. Wtf is this?


----------



## BWX

lornranger said:


> Err.... wait! You had to bear the cost of shipping the flashlight to them?!
> 
> Well, well, zebralight replied again and said that my switch was installed normally, not a manufacturing defect. My switch is a hard switch. So I guess they had changed the switch again! Any replacement they offer will be the same regarding the position. Wtf is this?




This is typical ZL BS. That's what it is.

Yeah over the long time period I shipped it back to them so many times, I always thought I would get a working light that would last for years so I figured, what's another $20 to get a $95 light fixed/ replaced? This one will surely work! Nope. 

At first I had to send them to China and that was more. Later it was to Texas I think, not sure. It was an expensive lesson. I'd have to go back through records to give exact amounts.


----------



## Bigblue

Just got my SC600 MKII L2. I can't get over how small it is. Shorter than my Thrunite Archer 1A. Amazing for an 18650 light. Love the functionality of this UI. 

Never had the older vesions of SC600 so can't compare the feel of the switch. But it feels solid to me. This will be fighting my PD35 for most use light.


----------



## lornranger

Bigblue said:


> Just got my SC600 MKII L2. I can't get over how small it is. Shorter than my Thrunite Archer 1A. Amazing for an 18650 light. Love the functionality of this UI.
> 
> Never had the older vesions of SC600 so can't compare the feel of the switch. But it feels solid to me. This will be fighting my PD35 for most use light.



Is the placement of your sc600 perfect? Feel below the thick rubber cover for the tip of the electronic switch.


----------



## Bigblue

lornranger said:


> Is the placement of your sc600 perfect? Feel below the thick rubber cover for the tip of the electronic switch.



I tried powering on / off throughout the rubber cover, it feels pretty center to me. Now if I just grab it, I never had to press with any "force". Also while on the table, my 5-year old picked it up and turned it on / off with ease too, never had to adjust position of his finger.


----------



## lornranger

Bigblue said:


> I tried powering on / off throughout the rubber cover, it feels pretty center to me. Now if I just grab it, I never had to press with any "force". Also while on the table, my 5-year old picked it up and turned it on / off with ease too, never had to adjust position of his finger.



Seems like your version is the soft switch.


----------



## TEEJ

I prefer the harder switch, as it helps avoid the hot pocket issues.


----------



## Oztorchfreak

TEEJ said:


> I prefer the harder switch, as it helps avoid the hot pocket issues.




I also prefer the harder button as with the softer one it is easy to make mistakes when doing multiple quick clicks.

A well known supplier of flashlights told me recently that Zebralight are using the same part number but the manufacturer of that button changed the pressure of the button without Zebralight being told.

I will not buy an updated SC52 L2 unless it had the same sort of pressure to activate just like my older SC52.

There seems to be different buttons getting around with the new SC52 L2 looking at the discussions about it.

I do not like the soft mushy button on my new SC600 MKII and regret buying it now.



CHEERS


----------



## kj2

Just tried to add the pocketclip on my SC600 MKII L2, and immediately scratched some of the anodizing 
Someone else had/have the same problem?


----------



## Slumber

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**

I've scratched every light that uses that method of mounting a clip. However, I've scratched almost every light I own other ways too.


----------



## jimboutilier

kj2 said:


> Just tried to add the pocketclip on my SC600 MKII L2, and immediately scratched some of the anodizing
> Someone else had/have the same problem?



I thought I did that too when I first got my SC600 MKII L2, but it turned out the mark was residue from the clip itself and wiped off with a bit of lubricant. Hopefully yours isn't an actual scratch either.


----------



## kj2

jimboutilier said:


> I thought I did that too when I first got my SC600 MKII L2, but it turned out the mark was residue from the clip itself and wiped off with a bit of lubricant. Hopefully yours isn't an actual scratch either.



It's a scratch  can feel it with my fingernail. There are actually two markings. Both on the protruding sections of the body where the clips belongs.
_Photo is not mine and not my light with the scratches I talk about. Just want to point out, where the scratches are._


----------



## StandardBattery

My SC600w II L2 has the softer button, but I've never really found it an issue so far. It does not get a lot of use though right now as I have a couple other earlier ones that get more use when my SC60/62 lights are not suffcient and I'm not using some other bigger light. The SC600 models tend to get more use in the winter months since they are easy to pocket carry when I have a coat.


----------



## candini

BWX said:


> Now the fun begins. You will not get a brand new light in my experience, but a "re-manufactured" light, with probably an entirely different set of issues. I went through this with them for a period of about three years and six H-501 lights. I eventually gave up after they all failed. I now have a $200 paperweight as a reminder (counting cost of shipping all those times). Pink goo came out of the last one, no joke.. In light of that I would say get a refund, and re-purchase the light.
> 
> I do EDC an SC600 MKI B that works great though, even though the switch was messed up from new, but finally "wore-in"..





This is crazy and sad. And we all keep buying ZL. I have the SC600 and just ordered the H600 from Illum and wondering how long mine will last after reading all these horror stories. Perhaps their customer service would be good if the USA went back to manufacturing once again.


----------



## cagenuts

candini said:


> This is crazy and sad. And we all keep buying ZL. I just bought the H600 from Illum and wondering how long mine will last after reading all these horror stories.



I've just bought three with no option of returning them so I'm going to be positive about it.


----------



## candini

Oztorchfreak said:


> I also prefer the harder button as with the softer one it is easy to make mistakes when doing multiple quick clicks.
> 
> A well known supplier of flashlights told me recently that Zebralight are using the same part number but the manufacturer of that button changed the pressure of the button without Zebralight being told.
> 
> I will not buy an updated SC52 L2 unless it had the same sort of pressure to activate just like my older SC52.
> 
> There seems to be different buttons getting around with the new SC52 L2 looking at the discussions about it.
> 
> I do not like the soft mushy button on my new SC600 MKII and regret buying it now.
> 
> 
> 
> CHEERS



I like my light so far but agree about the mushy button. They corrected the turn on problem but created another one. I too have problems discerning how many presses to change functions.


----------



## TotalDbag

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**

Mine's making a funky smell. Is that normal? (I'm hoping I've just never noticed it) it's not the battery because I've switched it out. It's a burning sulfur (like fireworks) plus metal smell. It produces the smell whenever it's turned on. It still works perfectly fine, but I've kinda refrained from using it at this time.


----------



## markr6

jimboutilier said:


> I thought I did that too when I first got my SC600 MKII L2, but it turned out the mark was residue from the clip itself and wiped off with a bit of lubricant. Hopefully yours isn't an actual scratch either.



Same here!


----------



## candini

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**



TotalDbag said:


> Mine's making a funky smell. Is that normal? (I'm hoping I've just never noticed it) it's not the battery because I've switched it out. It's a burning sulfur (like fireworks) plus metal smell. It produces the smell whenever it's turned on. It still works perfectly fine, but I've kinda refrained from using it at this time.



I have not smelled that with mine but I would get in touch with ZL right away and ask them about it. Good gosh, great lights but they seem to be plagued with problems that occur at the worse times.


----------



## kj2

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**

Contacted ZL about the clip. Asked if it would be possible to receive a new clip. CS isn't really working along. Story now is that, I've to buy a other new ZL light so I could get a extra clip...


----------



## markr6

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**



kj2 said:


> Contacted ZL about the clip. Asked if it would be possible to receive a new clip. CS isn't really working along. Story now is that, I've to buy a other new ZL light so I could get a extra clip...



What about the one on their Accessories page for $2.95? Or are you guys talking about something else?


----------



## kj2

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**



markr6 said:


> What about the one on their Accessories page for $2.95? Or are you guys talking about something else?


That's the SC600 clip. But why should I pay for a new clip, when ZL includes a clip that scratches my light :thinking:
This is a good example to see how their CS works and handles a complain.


----------



## markr6

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**



kj2 said:


> That's the SC600 clip. But why should I pay for a new clip, when ZL includes a clip that scratches my light :thinking:
> This is a good example to see how their CS works and handles a complain.



Oh I didn't know it was due to the scratching. In that case, for $2.95 I would think they would mail one free of charge. I'm guessing yours has a chip in it or sharp edge?


----------



## kj2

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**

Clip self looks good, only it just a bit to high. Which causes scratches on the places I showed on the photo.


----------



## Derek Dean

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**

kj2, if the clip works fine, then honestly, I can't see being too concerned. If you use your lights, they're going to get scratched anyway. I just checked both of my SC600s, and they both have a few scratches around the area where the clips attach, very similar to the ones in the photo you posted. To my way of thinking, that's just what should be expected with this type of clip.

However, if your clip is defective, in that it doesn't fit the groove correctly because it's too big or something, and you feel it can't possibly fulfill it's function, then it might be worth pursing the matter.


----------



## kj2

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**

Looks like ZL CS is shipping me a new clip.
Edit: ZL ships a new clip to me


----------



## BWX

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**

About the switches... 

Mine was messed up when I first got it. (the SC600 MKI B).. I almost sent it back, but the light was great otherwise (tint, output). It was so bad that it would double click on it's own when I only clicked one time. and other times I could not get it to double click, one click would not register, and the switch felt terrible and stiff.

I ended up doing nothing , and just kept EDC'ing the light. After about three months, the switch started acting better, and soon started working perfectly 100%, all of the time, and it also softened up a bit, quieted down a bit, and now it feels perfect and works perfect many months later.

I use this light every single day, and go through about a battery every two or three days on average, depending. Sometimes I go through 2 batts in a day.

So I guess what I am saying is, that the switches can go from really bad, to really good, with use and break-in time.







candini said:


> This is crazy and sad. And we all keep buying ZL. I have the SC600 and just ordered the H600 from Illum and wondering how long mine will last after reading all these horror stories. Perhaps their customer service would be good if the USA went back to manufacturing once again.



Yeah that was pretty terrible experience. A few years later I gave in and got an SC600, and I am pretty happy I did. I can see myself using this flashlight as my EDC for years now that I am used to the side switch.. (I used to only like tail switches, but I am getting used to it). 

I guess that is why we keep buying them, when you get a good one, it is really good.


----------



## Peace Train

I'm strongly considering taking the plunge and ordering the SC600w MKII L2. Yes, even after spending half the afternoon reading about the issues in this and other threads. Reminds me of 1970-80's Jaguar owners and their cars. (And here I've got a '69 Camaro in the garage. What am I thinking? :thinking: ) It's funny that switch problems are why I ultimately passed on the Niwalker Nova MM15, but I'm really liking the passion everyone here shares about the MKII L2.


MY QUESTION: One of the many things I'd like to use the MKII L2 for is night hikes in the desert. With the approaching days of summer where it gets to be 100ºF/38ºC at midnight (and much hotter during the times I'll be out), I'm wondering whether to expect any issues relating to overheating with the MKII L2, whether I'm relegated to lowest settings, etc? Does anyone have experience with this?


----------



## Johnno

Peace Train said:


> MY QUESTION: One of the many things I'd like to use the MKII L2 for is night hikes in the desert. With the approaching days of summer where it gets to be 100ºF/38ºC at midnight (and much hotter during the times I'll be out), I'm wondering whether to expect any issues relating to overheating with the MKII L2, whether I'm relegated to lowest settings, etc? Does anyone have experience with this?



You'll be fine - all modes. However, if you keep opting for cycling it to the highest output mode manually and running it that way for more than a few minutes, it will get too warm to hold after a bit. 

Don't let all the issues discussed turn you off - folks just like to gripe, gives them something to do. Its a GREAT light. Perfect size for hikes/runs.


----------



## Clayton4971

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**

Night walks in the desert ? No way that's when the rattle snakes come out to play .


----------



## Peace Train

Johnno said:


> You'll be fine - all modes. However, if you keep opting for cycling it to the highest output mode manually and running it that way for more than a few minutes, it will get too warm to hold after a bit.



Great to hear a little heat won't hurt it. I've been torn between this and the EagleTac D25LC2 Clicky (w/either XM-L2 or Nichia 219). And.....I'm almost decided. :thinking:




Clayton4971 said:


> Night walks in the desert ? No way that's when the rattle snakes come out to play .



Hahaha rattlesnakes, scorpions, gila monsters, coyotes, bobcats...it's when all the wildlife comes out to play! Besides, snakes are like dogs, they only panic and bite when they sense fear.




JOHNNO said:


> Don't let all the issues discussed turn you off - folks just like to gripe, gives them something to do. Its a GREAT light. Perfect size for hikes/runs.



Much appreciated Johnno. One thing I've noticed is that even with the griping, this is one of the friendliest forums I've been involved with. Glad to be onboard! :twothumbs


----------



## Derek Dean

Howdy Peace Train, and weclome to CPF! 
First, you can't go wrong with a ZL SC600. A spectacular light! However, have you considered a headlamp? It's great to have your hands free when your hiking. Plus, what most of us do is have at least two lights when we go out, just in case. So, your ideal combo might be a semi-floody ZL headlamp for general hiking duties, and a small more throwy torch for searching ahead on the trail or just spotting animals at a distance. 

By the way, most of the torches you're interested in require something like an 18650 lithium-ion rechargeable battery. I'd recommend spending some time reading up on how to use and charge them safely:
http://batteryuniversity.com/
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/forumdisplay.php?9-Flashlight-Electronics-Batteries-Included

Have fun, and happy hiking!


----------



## markr6

Peace Train said:


> Great to hear a little heat won't hurt it. I've been torn between this and the EagleTac D25LC2 Clicky (w/either XM-L2 or Nichia 219). And.....I'm almost decided. :thinking:



I just picked up a *D25LC2 w/ Nichia 219*...becasue I'm a sucker for the 219! Nice light. But between that and my SC600wII, it would be easy if I had to choose just one - the SC600w. Smaller, better UI, low and moonlight mode, all modes accessible from the same switch, easy one-hand operation. And the D25LC2 low mode is rediculously bright. I can easily light up my shed in the back yard about 100' away. The programmable "moonlight mode" doesn't seem much lower. I asked EagleTac about it and they said the same thing..."it's not much lower"


----------



## Peace Train

Derek Dean said:


> Howdy Peace Train, and weclome to CPF!
> First, you can't go wrong with a ZL SC600. A spectacular light! However, have you considered a headlamp?



Thanks Derek! And thanks for the confirmation. I actually have a Petzl headlamp for backpacking (and fix-it jobs around the house), but use it only during the cooler months when I'm not instantly drenched in sweat. I was looking for a great all-around light that's suitable on trail too; glad to know the SC600 fits the bill. The battery links you sent are great btw, much appreciated!




markr6 said:


> I just picked up a *D25LC2 w/ Nichia 219*...becasue I'm a sucker for the 219! Nice light. But between that and my SC600wII, it would be easy if I had to choose just one - the SC600w.



Yes, I knew the risks of posting in this thread. ZL will be hearing from me soon. 

:grouphug: You guys really know how to make a guy feel welcome!


----------



## XJ-light

I've been reading for a week and this light seems to be the smallest with the smoothest transition from beam to spill.
I plan on using it on a bike where it would throw enought to see ahead and have the spill bright enought for up close and the sides.
Am I correct with this idea?


----------



## TEEJ

The thing to remember about forums (Car forums, light forums, toaster forums, etc...) is that people who are happy with a product tend to just use it, and only a SMALL minority will feel the need to share that a product did what they thought it would...as that's sort of the default assumption...not exciting or important news to most. On the other hand, a LARGE proportion WILL feel the need to share NEGATIVE feed back/warn their friends if THEIR light, toaster, etc, has a problem. Its pretty normal.

The impact of course, as you may have noticed, is that a newb stumbles upon an enthusiast forum, and there seems to be nothing but problems and complaints...and its confusing, as they are complaining about something that you'd THINK they'd be a fan of, etc....as in, if its so BAD, why are they HERE?



So, always take a forum's post balance with a grain of salt and perspective...if 100,000 people are happy, and 5 have a problem, you'll see the 5 online complaining/sharing, even if they have join forums JUST to make that post....and maybe NONE of the 100,000 are posting that everything was as expected. In a large enough forum, some of the 100k might see the complaint by one of the 5, and might pop in to the thread to say, "that's funny, mine was fine?" or something to that effect.




BTW - for the desert, a good UV light is great, as scorpions etc, fluoresce in UV light, makes them glow in the dark really nice (Useful for checking your boots/tent/sleeping bag too, etc..)

390 nm UV works fine, 365 nm is awesome. The Range of the 390 nm UV lights tends to be better though, as its easier to get mor power at 390 than at 365 nm.


----------



## Peace Train

TEEJ said:


> 390 nm UV works fine, 365 nm is awesome. The Range of the 390 nm UV lights tends to be better though, as its easier to get mor power at 390 than at 365 nm.



Great info on UV, thanks for this! I may look into these eventually, though I've had way more scorpions in my home over the years than I've ever come across outside. 




TEEJ said:


> The thing to remember about forums (Car forums, light forums, toaster forums, etc...) is that people who are happy with a product tend to just use it, and only a SMALL minority will feel the need to share that a product did what they thought it would...as that's sort of the default assumption...not exciting or important news to most. On the other hand, a LARGE proportion WILL feel the need to share NEGATIVE feed back/warn their friends if THEIR light, toaster, etc, has a problem. Its pretty normal.



Psychology is an interesting thing, isn't it? The places I've experienced otherwise, across the board, are hi-fi stereo forums. They rave about the good and bash the bad...and sometimes each other. Much more friendly and cost conscious here I'd say!


----------



## TEEJ

Peace Train said:


> Great info on UV, thanks for this! I may look into these eventually, though I've had way more scorpions in my home over the years than I've ever come across outside.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Psychology is an interesting thing, isn't it? The places I've experienced otherwise, across the board, are hi-fi stereo forums. They rave about the good and bash the bad...and sometimes each other. Much more friendly and cost conscious here I'd say!



LOL

I'd imagine some of your audiophiles would shudder at the thought of lossy MP3s the way some people here might shudder at the thought of low CRI LEDs, etc.


The rest of the people just want to know if "It can go to 11?" or "How many Lumens?"





PS - Scorpions INSIDE fluoresce too, plus, all SORTS of other stuff as well, if you feel like a bit of science experimentation, etc. :devil:


----------



## StandardBattery

TEEJ said:


> LOL
> 
> .....
> The rest of the people just want to know if *"It can go to 11?"* or "How many Lumens?"
> 
> 
> ...


That's the "turbo" or "burst-mode"! I was laughing at a recent head-lamp that has a burst mode... you typically have a head lamp so you have your hands free, but their burst most is only activated while you hold the button... If that's not crazy.... but hey it goes to 11.


----------



## Peace Train

Ah the illusive 11. THAT is the holy grail in every forum! 




TEEJ said:


> LOL
> I'd imagine some of your audiophiles would shudder at the thought of lossy MP3s the way some people here might shudder at the thought of low CRI LEDs, etc.



Hahaha but it's sooo much more than the format! Interesting how music can get overlooked in the scheme of things. Are we looking at what the light's pointed at...or the beam?

Anyway, there's currently nothing that's going to reproduce sound the same way as hearing it live without amplification, just like there isn't much that'll reproduce the sun at dawn on a semi-cloudy day. To make up for that we get to have tint and sound preferences, and products that keep popping up to help us decide what all that really means. 

One thing's for sure -- I'm glad most of the variables at CPF are left to the manufacturers and modders. It's much simpler. AND easier on the wallet. 




TEEJ said:


> plus, all SORTS of other stuff as well, if you feel like a bit of science experimentation, etc. :devil:



I KNOW, that's what I'm afraid of. :duck:


----------



## Peace Train

XJ-light said:


> I've been reading for a week and this light seems to be the smallest with the smoothest transition from beam to spill.
> I plan on using it on a bike where it would throw enought to see ahead and have the spill bright enought for up close and the sides.
> Am I correct with this idea?



Sounds good to me. I use a bike-specific 250 Lumen NiteRider, but I bet the SC600 Mk II in a handlebar mount set at 150 or 300 Lm would work fine. Plus it’s a more useable light for other tasks and activities. Of course, my SC600 isn’t here yet so you might want to see what the others have to say.


----------



## kaichu dento

XJ-light said:


> I've been reading for a week and this light seems to be the smallest with the smoothest transition from beam to spill.
> I plan on using it on a bike where it would throw enough to see ahead and have the spill bright enough for up close and the sides.
> Am I correct with this idea?


I can't say if it's the best, but the SC600's are all a great flashlight for bicycle usage.

Great hot spot that will go down the road with lots of smoothly blended spill to allow for good peripheral vision without lighting up the sides so much as to be distracting.


----------



## Derek Dean

XJ-light said:


> I've been reading for a week and this light seems to be the smallest with the smoothest transition from beam to spill.
> I plan on using it on a bike where it would throw enought to see ahead and have the spill bright enought for up close and the sides.
> Am I correct with this idea?


Howdy XJ-light, and welcome to CPF!
My only problem with using the SC600 for a bike light would be that it will certainly blind anybody coming towards you. Of course this assumes you're wanting a light for street riding. If in the country, it would probably be fine. 

You might want to consider checking out the "Transportation Lighting" area of CPF for more discussion on this:
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/forumdisplay.php?86-Bicycle

The Philips Safe Ride is a neat light that has a horizontal cutoff, similar to a car headlight, to keep extraneous light from blinding those coming towards you:
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00620Z8M2/?tag=cpf0b6-20

There is a newer version, but it's much more expensive. Happy hunting!


----------



## Peace Train

What cells are people using in their SC600 MkII's? 
Protected, Unprotected?
Olight, Panasonic NCR18650B...?Also, is 3.7v 3600mah the way to go? 

thanks


----------



## kaichu dento

Derek Dean said:


> My only problem with using the SC600 for a bike light would be that it will certainly blind anybody coming towards you. Of course this assumes you're wanting a light for street riding. If in the country, it would probably be fine.
> 
> The Philips Safe Ride is a neat light that has a horizontal cutoff, similar to a car headlight, to keep extraneous light from blinding those coming towards you:
> 
> There is a newer version, but it's much more expensive. Happy hunting!


Dean, thanks for this info.

As always you come through with helpful and well thought out tips and I'm looking strongly at getting one of these Philips lights, largely due to the cutoff in the beam pattern, although I'll probably try to drop the emitter down to 4500k or so.


----------



## UnderPar

Peace Train said:


> What cells are people using in their SC600 MkII's?
> Protected, Unprotected?
> Olight, Panasonic NCR18650B...?Also, is 3.7v 3600mah the way to go?
> 
> thanks



In my SC600 MkII L2, am using Panasonic 18650B, unprotected.


----------



## cagenuts

I'm going to be using a Keeppower protected with a Sanyo UR18650FM cell inside.


----------



## markr6

UnderPar said:


> In my SC600 MkII L2, am using Panasonic 18650B, unprotected.



+1. Protected in a ZL doesn't make much sense to me. Not even the "better safe than sorry" argument given the quality of Panasonic cells, quality charger, low voltage protection built into the SC600, and occasional monitoring of the battery with a DMM. Just my opinion.

I even use some old 7-year batteries salvaged from an old laptop on occasion. 2000mAh unknown brand but they still work great!


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

XJ-light said:


> I've been reading for a week and this light seems to be the smallest with the smoothest transition from beam to spill.
> I plan on using it on a bike where it would throw enought to see ahead and have the spill bright enought for up close and the sides.
> Am I correct with this idea?



I use a SC52 as a bike light, and it works well. I usually keep it at around 100 lumens, and point it down a bit to avoid shining it directly at drivers. I think the beam profile is similar to the SC600. The small XML-based lights are great for their wide hot spot and even transition to spill.


----------



## TEEJ

The way its regulated, I'd just use a whatever reliable protected 18650 that had the most mah for its amp draw. IMR, etc, is overkill, as it doesn't seem brighter on them, etc.


----------



## moozooh

kaichu dento said:


> I can't say if it's the best, but the SC600's are all a great flashlight for bicycle usage.
> 
> Great hot spot that will go down the road with lots of smoothly blended spill to allow for good peripheral vision without lighting up the sides so much as to be distracting.



Confirming this. Been using early model SC600 (cool white) for a couple years, switched to neutral mk2 L2 this spring. I'm absolutely satisfied with the angle, hotspot size (very large with smooth corona), tint, and of course the PID-accelerated brightness that synergizes very well with riding. I can possibly imagine a perfectly done bike lamp to outperform it, sure, but it would be a dedicated, very expensive device that's hardly usable elsewhere, while an SC600 you can just drop in and out of the holder in mere seconds and have the benefits of both worlds for no extra cost.

Using a protected Orbtronic 3400 mAh because I like my batteries safe when outside the light, too.


----------



## kj2

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**



kj2 said:


> Looks like ZL CS is shipping me a new clip.
> Edit: ZL ships a new clip to me



Received the new clip. It's better than the clip, that came with the light. Still, it needed a hard press to get it on. At least I know, it won't fall off easily


----------



## markr6

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**

Love my SC600wII L2, but the SC62 is now available in stock!! That means the *SC62w *should be close! Sounds like the perfect light for me! Sorry SC600 ...maybe.

From the SC62 and SC62w thread:

*SC600II L2*
H1 1100 Lm (PID, approx 2 hr) or H2 670 Lm (PID, approx 2.5 hrs) / 356 Lm (3.9 hrs) / 162 Lm (11 hrs)

*SC62*
H1 1000 Lm (PID, approx 2 hr) or H2 620 Lm (PID, approx 2.5 hrs) / 350 Lm (3.9 hrs) / 160 Lm (11 hrs)

$10 cheaper
Lighter (half the weight)
Smaller, especially the head
Almost identical output
Same runtimes

Beam style could be the only major difference. But from what I can tell on my SC62d, the beam is still pretty throwy like the SC600.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**



markr6 said:


> Beam style could be the only major difference. But from what I can tell on my SC62d, the beam is still pretty throwy like the SC600.



Probably due to the smaller Philips Luxeon emitter size. If they stick a Cree XML in the same reflector, it should be floody like most of their other lights.


----------



## PieDemon

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**



markr6 said:


> Love my SC600wII L2, but the SC62 is now available in stock!! That means the *SC62w *should be close! Sounds like the perfect light for me! Sorry SC600 ...maybe.
> 
> From the SC62 and SC62w thread:
> 
> *SC600II L2*
> H1 1100 Lm (PID, approx 2 hr) or H2 670 Lm (PID, approx 2.5 hrs) / 356 Lm (3.9 hrs) / 162 Lm (11 hrs)
> 
> *SC62*
> H1 1000 Lm (PID, approx 2 hr) or H2 620 Lm (PID, approx 2.5 hrs) / 350 Lm (3.9 hrs) / 160 Lm (11 hrs)
> 
> $10 cheaper
> Lighter (half the weight)
> Smaller, especially the head
> Almost identical output
> Same runtimes
> 
> Beam style could be the only major difference. But from what I can tell on my SC62d, the beam is still pretty throwy like the SC600.



Finally made that unwise step to register an account here after a long period of being a lurker when information is needed, something tells me my bank account might hate the decision.

I noticed that recent addition as well, I own a sc62d currently (Luxeon T LED) and while I like the tint of this one I have been on the fence about considering my luck with either this new addition (once a neutral white version shows up) or just go for the sc600w. I've borrowed a sc600 owned by a friend for a week, when running this one on the highest output it heats up pretty fast and while the rated outputs might not be far off between the models I suspect the temperature based PID regulation would limit the current much faster on the sc62 form factor. Also the sustained output will probably be a bit lower due to being able to shed less heat over time. However if a short period of high output as an option is good enough I can see some big benefits with it being cheaper and smaller.

So I'll probably wait for a few solid reviews on the sc62/sc62w to see how well it handles the high current with the much lighter and smaller body (tint doesn't really matter for this). It'd be awesome if it's not too far off from the performance the sc600 delivers early on for at least 4-5 minutes. The sc600 is definitely less convenient to carry around in your pocket with the bigger head compared to the size of the sc62 form factor which is actually smaller than many single AA based models, it also weighs a fair bit more but I'm usually more concerned with the size rather than that factor.

I might also go for something aimed at long throw distance considering the sc62d is bright enough as it is for general purpose use to me but that's a decision for when I can justify buying more things I don't really need.


----------



## TEEJ

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**



markr6 said:


> Love my SC600wII L2, but the SC62 is now available in stock!! That means the *SC62w *should be close! Sounds like the perfect light for me! Sorry SC600 ...maybe.
> 
> From the SC62 and SC62w thread:
> 
> *SC600II L2*
> H1 1100 Lm (PID, approx 2 hr) or H2 670 Lm (PID, approx 2.5 hrs) / 356 Lm (3.9 hrs) / 162 Lm (11 hrs)
> 
> *SC62*
> H1 1000 Lm (PID, approx 2 hr) or H2 620 Lm (PID, approx 2.5 hrs) / 350 Lm (3.9 hrs) / 160 Lm (11 hrs)
> 
> $10 cheaper
> Lighter (half the weight)
> Smaller, especially the head
> Almost identical output
> Same runtimes
> 
> Beam style could be the only major difference. But from what I can tell on my SC62d, the beam is still pretty throwy like the SC600.



I will bet any amount that neither puts out 2 HOURS of 1,000 lumen output. It will step down or whatever you want to cal it or over heat or the cell won't be able to maintain the draw rate, etc. 

IE: If 670 or 620 L runs for 2.5 hrs, why would 1,100 or 1,000 L run 2 hrs?


----------



## thedoc007

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**



TEEJ said:


> I will bet any amount that neither puts out 2 HOURS of 1,000 lumen output. It will step down or whatever you want to cal it or over heat or the cell won't be able to maintain the draw rate, etc.



Zebralight freely acknowledges this...as well as pointing out the with the L2 version, the runtime and brightness both greatly depend on ambient temperature/cooling. I was actually impressed with how forthcoming they were, in comparison to other claims I have seen, which give out close to zero actual information. 

It is precisely because of the PID that those runtime claims might be accurate (under ANSI rules), when accounting for stepdown. I know the Mk II (non-L2) could handle 500 lumens in pretty much any conditions without overheating. It may be that after the first few minutes, H1 and H2 are pretty similar in output, and therefore the runtime difference between the two modes is not great. Just supposition, haven't had the opportunity to test it yet. But it isn't implausible, given the ANSI rules. Whether or not those rules make sense is another matter...


----------



## TEEJ

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**



thedoc007 said:


> Zebralight freely acknowledges this...as well as pointing out the with the L2 version, the runtime and brightness both greatly depend on ambient temperature/cooling. I was actually impressed with how forthcoming they were, in comparison to other claims I have seen, which give out close to zero actual information.
> 
> It is precisely because of the PID that those runtime claims might be accurate (under ANSI rules), when accounting for stepdown. I know the Mk II (non-L2) could handle 500 lumens in pretty much any conditions without overheating. It may be that after the first few minutes, H1 and H2 are pretty similar in output, and therefore the runtime difference between the two modes is not great. Just supposition, haven't had the opportunity to test it yet. But it isn't implausible, given the ANSI rules. Whether or not those rules make sense is another matter...



LOL

No, the ANSI rules do not make sense, other than as a biased party inclusion during development.


----------



## EsthetiX

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**



TEEJ said:


> I will bet any amount that neither puts out 2 HOURS of 1,000 lumen output. It will step down or whatever you want to cal it or over heat or the cell won't be able to maintain the draw rate, etc.
> 
> IE: If 670 or 620 L runs for 2.5 hrs, why would 1,100 or 1,000 L run 2 hrs?




I use use it as a bike light. It never steps down.


----------



## Peace Train

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**


----------



## TEEJ

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**



EsthetiX said:


> I use use it as a bike light. It never steps down.



Lol

You never NOTICED that it stepped down. 

It IS hard to notice though. ...as it's incremental - so don't feel bad.


----------



## markr6

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**

I decided to test some of the 2000mAh cells I pulled out of an old laptop pack. They are from a laptop used fairly often for about 5 years. Total age of the laptop/cells are probably 7 years.

I charged the cell to 4.19v (max on my WP2II) and ran it in my SC600wII L2 on H2/620lm. It lasted about 1 hour at that level (PID was dimming it though) and another 15 minutes or so on one of the medium levels. After this, it would turn on for only 1 second, on any mode, then turn off. I measured the voltage at 2.53v. Zebralight states a 2.7v cutoff though. I wonder if it actually was closer to 2.7v if I let it rest for a minute? I measured the 2.53v within 2 minutes of removing the battery.


----------



## BWX

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**

Well Olight 3400mAh don't fit in my MK1 B. About 0.1 mm too fat. 

Nothing a rat tail file can't fix.

All my batts are kind of tight, guess it won't hurt to open it up a little.


Funny thing is that Eagletac 3400mAh batts fit fine. I thought they were the same Panasonic cells.


----------



## cagenuts

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**



BWX said:


> Nothing a rat tail file can't fix.



On the light or the battery?


----------



## BWX

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**



cagenuts said:


> On the light or the battery?



On the inside of the light. Just needs a few tenths of a mm really. Not sure what a file would do to a plastic covered battery but I'm pretty sure it would wreck it. LOL


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**



BWX said:


> Not sure what a file would do to a plastic covered battery but I'm pretty sure it would wreck it. LOL



You could remove the plastic wrap, but I think you'd then have a cathode that covers not just the end of the cell but also the outside body of the cell. You'd have to be careful that the inside wall of the flashlight wouldn't create a short. Not worth the risk, IMO.


----------



## BWX

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**



WalkIntoTheLight said:


> You could remove the plastic wrap, but I think you'd then have a cathode that covers not just the end of the cell but also the outside body of the cell. You'd have to be careful that the inside wall of the flashlight wouldn't create a short. Not worth the risk, IMO.



Yeah I don't want to mess up nice new batteries. I'll just gently message the inner walls of the SC600 with a file until the batts fit.. (That sounded dirty, LOL)


----------



## ShineOnYouCrazyDiamond

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**

I just wanted to post that after a year of going back and forth on buy a SC600w MKII that I purchased one on CPFMP and it is definitely one of the best production lights I own. The quality is great. The tint is great. The beam is great. The UI has a few quirks, but it is still very flexible and offers a great variety of available levels.

I am using a Keepower 3400 Protected cell with it with no fitment problems. 

You get a lot of light for your money with this one.


----------



## Jeffg330

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**



ShineOnYouCrazyDiamond said:


> The UI has a few quirks, but it is still very flexible and offers a great variety of available levels.



Glad your liking it shine on, curious what the quirks you refer to are. Is it just the UI in general?


----------



## ShineOnYouCrazyDiamond

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**



Jeffg330 said:


> Glad your liking it shine on, curious what the quirks you refer to are. Is it just the UI in general?



Other people have mentioned the issues so I don't want to sound repetitive so I'll just outline the ones I notice. They are really just limitations of a single button interface where you can either do A or B but not both.


No direct access to high while on. I like that feature in the HDS lights.
Going to medium from off there is no way to avoid a bright flash with the double click.

That's really about it. Now that I've had the light a few days I would say that this light could be one of the best jacket season EDCs. A little too bulky for regular daily EDC, but it fits into a jacket pocket and you'd forget its there. I saw a thread comparing the SC600 to a EagleTac G25C2. I would say the SC600 does put out more lumens, but the throw still goes to the G25C2. But for most (non-tactical) situations the trade off in size may not be worth the throw.


----------



## Valpo Hawkeye

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**

Isn't press and release direct access to high? Pressing and holding until the light ramps from low to medium avoids the bright flash.


----------



## markr6

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**



Valpo Hawkeye said:


> Isn't press and release direct access to high? Pressing and holding until the light ramps from low to medium avoids the bright flash.



You can do that, but I'm too impatient to wait. I usually just double click really fast to get to medium.

Still loving this light after...I don't remember, maybe a year? I thought my SC62w would replace it or come close to it, but it didn't. The SC62w will definitely get used more just because it's easier to carry, but both definite keepers.


----------



## Valpo Hawkeye

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**

Oh, agreed. Just responding to Shine On about no access to medium without a flash.


----------



## ShineOnYouCrazyDiamond

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**



Valpo Hawkeye said:


> Isn't press and release direct access to high? Pressing and holding until the light ramps from low to medium avoids the bright flash.



From off, yes. From ON? I don't know, I'll have to test it out.


----------



## fnj

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**



ShineOnYouCrazyDiamond said:


> From off, yes. From ON? I don't know, I'll have to test it out.



Don't have to test. Press and hold always goes to progressively higher settings from the starting point, repeatedly, wrapping back to low after high.

If you start from off, the ramp always starts from low, but if you start when on, it starts from whatever setting you are in to begin with.


----------



## ShineOnYouCrazyDiamond

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**

That would then prove what I am saying that there is no quick access to high while the light is on. The quickest option I can think of is a click to turn it of with a pause and then a click to turn it back on high - this is faster than holding through low and medium.


----------



## markr6

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**



fnj said:


> Don't have to test. Press and hold always goes to progressively higher settings from the starting point, repeatedly, wrapping back to low after high.
> 
> If you start from off, the ramp always starts from low, but if you start when on, it starts from whatever setting you are in to begin with.



None of my Zebralights go higher from the starting point. Rather, they go back to low then up thru the cycle. Click and hold from Medium = back to L>M>H


----------



## cagenuts

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**



markr6 said:


> None of my Zebralights go higher from the starting point. Rather, they go back to low then up thru the cycle. Click and hold from Medium = back to L>M>H



That is my experience as well. I've just confirmed on my SC52.


----------



## Valpo Hawkeye

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**

I overlooked "while on"...


----------



## fnj

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**



markr6 said:


> None of my Zebralights go higher from the starting point. Rather, they go back to low then up thru the cycle. Click and hold from Medium = back to L>M>H



Good catch. Correction accepted.


----------



## markr6

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**



fnj said:


> Good catch. Correction accepted.



Not that I didn't trust you. With all the quirky things reported from ZL in the past, you never know


----------



## StandardBattery

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**


----------



## ShineOnYouCrazyDiamond

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**

Just thought I'd share something from the HDS thread.


----------



## UnderPar

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**

 
:thumbsup: :thumbsup:


----------



## StandardBattery

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**

The clip seems too long though for the SC600.


----------



## ShineOnYouCrazyDiamond

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**

I guess that's personal preference. It's a little long (for the HDS too) but much more functional that the pressure clip which keeps popping off when I try to put it in my pocket. Hopefully some custom folks will come up with other clip options to go in the mounting ring.


----------



## TheJaRoD

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**

How's the switch on the MkII nowadays? After having read up on flashlights the past week for the first time in a few years I've started getting the itch to upgrade my sc600 to MkII... But after reading the past 10 pages in this thread I sort of dread getting a soft switch. My sc600 has a pretty stiff switch with a nice distinct click and it feels just right to me. And I just measured it needed about 700 grams to activate.

It's mostly improved runtimes and the battery indicator I like about the new one. Though a bit more lumen when needed might be nice even though low/medium is what I use most of the time.
Or maybe I should wait for a MkIII? Anyone have any inside information about such things? :naughty:


----------



## ShineOnYouCrazyDiamond

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**

I don't think the switch on my MkII is too soft, but I do find it a little irritating that you have to hit it just right for it to work. You have to come straight down on it with almost the tip of your finger. If you hit it from the side it doesn't activate well.


----------



## TheJaRoD

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**

Well that doesn't sound too great. On my sc600 it's pretty much impossible to not activate it no matter how I push the switch, thought I did get it to click once and nothing happened. But can't replicate that. I do have a higher capacity battery coming. Currently running a grey trustfire but have ordered a 2-pack 3100mah panasonic, so that should be quite the upgrade.


----------



## Bad_JuJu

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**

I haven't had the same issue with my newer sc600w MKII L2. The switch isn't terribly soft nor is it horribly stiff. It sits just right of the middle on the "stiffer" side. I haven't had the same trouble when attempting to turn it on either. Turns on no matter how I hit the button dead center or off center. Sorry to hear of your problems. mine has been great.


----------



## justanotherguy

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**

I have two SC600 II L2...Bought them used, the first one I got has a super light touch switch. The second has an awesome hard click switch....
Odd


----------



## TheJaRoD

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**

Ok so really seems the button quality it very random. I decided to get a neutral white mkII, should be a pretty good upgrade. If the button is soft or generally sucky I'll just have to return it or sell it. I'll report back in 2 to 8 weeks...


----------



## Oztorchfreak

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**

My SC600 Mk II has a super soft button and is not like the harder definite feel of my first original model SC600.

I hate it being soft as it depends on click counts for every operation and timing is everything with a Zebralight UI.

The beam is a nice colour not green or anything else ugly.

It is a lucky dip with these buttons.

My new SC52 L2 has a nice definite clicky feel to it.



CHEERS


----------



## TheJaRoD

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**

I got my MkII today and the button has a nice click to it but it needs much less pressure to activate than the original. My original needs 700 grams of pressure and MkII needs about 350 so I'm slightly worried it might turn on in the pocket since I also have my keys there... And it almost feels too small for my hand  I feel the original was just the right size for my hand. Guess I'll keep em both on me and dual wield them for a while and see which I should sell. Though I do like the extra functions and modes on the new one a whole bunch.

And I noticed MkII steps down from high almost instantly with a 3.5v battery, the original one takes several seconds.


----------



## Slumber

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**

I received my third SC600. Its my first "w" from Zebra, and I'm very pleased with it. I had the Original SC600 and a MK II L2 in cool before (sold both) and both were great lights, but this baby is nice. No QC or tint issues with this one. I'm very glad I opted for the "w" this time around. I'm no tint snob, but when I get a good tint, it's still appreciated.


----------



## Cantthinkof1

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**



Slumber Pass said:


> I received my third SC600. Its my first "w" from Zebra, and I'm very pleased with it. I had the Original SC600 and a MK II L2 in cool before (sold both) and both were great lights, but this baby is nice. No QC or tint issues with this one. I'm very glad I opted for the "w" this time around. I'm no tint snob, but when I get a good tint, it's still appreciated.



How long does it stay on it's highest setting before it steps down?


----------



## Slumber

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**

I have no idea. I ran it on high for about 15 mins and I didn't perceive a step down. The PID probably kicked in as the light warmed up, but I didn't notice it.


----------



## tandem

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**



Cantthinkof1 said:


> How long does it stay on it's highest setting before it steps down?



Check out CPF'r SelfBuilt's detailed review for the answer:

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...M-L2-1x18650)-Review-RUNTIMES-BEAMSHOTS-VIDEO


----------



## texastactical

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**

Does anyone carry this light bezel up, clipped in a pocket?


----------



## eshold

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**



texastactical said:


> Does anyone carry this light bezel up, clipped in a pocket?



I have been carrying mine this way. It keeps the largest part of the light out of your pocket and allows you to grab the body with your thumb on the switch, ready to go. It is recessed enough that it will not activate, nor will it with your thumb pressed flat over the button at moderate pressure. I find it very ergonomic. Best light I have ever had, by far.


----------



## markr6

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**

Nice buy on Massdrop right now. $79!


----------



## toysareforboys

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**



markr6 said:


> Nice buy on Massdrop right now. $79!


Thanks for the heads up, all sold out of warm, dammit! 

-Jamie M.


----------



## chuckhov

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**

All sold out of warm?

That can't be!... Every knows that NW and WW doesn't sell

-Chuck


----------



## markr6

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**

I knew I wasn't going crazy! I swore I saw the "w" version at one point, but only the CW the past couple days. I already have one, so no big deal. This should clear out some inventory if the MKIII turns out to be a big seller!


----------



## WarRaven

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**



chuckhov said:


> All sold out of warm?
> 
> That can't be!... Every knows that NW and WW doesn't sell
> 
> -Chuck


Maybe they only made ten?
If there's no sales numbers, we're guessing.


----------



## markr6

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**



WarRaven said:


> Maybe they only made ten?
> If there's no sales numbers, we're guessing.



42 SC600 sold so far.
SC600*w* was limited to 20 and sold out quick. I'm not sure why Massdrop set the limit (feedback from ZL, a poll, a guess?)


----------



## twistedraven

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**

79 for a new SC600 is nice. I'm holding off for the XPL-HI version though.


----------



## recDNA

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**



twistedraven said:


> 79 for a new SC600 is nice. I'm holding off for the XPL-HI version though.


XP-L HI neutral white!


----------



## markr6

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**



recDNA said:


> XP-L HI neutral white!



I'm ready for it!! Planned for September, so I'll give them until 2016  Could be a winner, but could also be TOO throwy for me. We'll see.


----------



## markr6

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**

SC600/w II L2 on sale at Zebralight - $89. Still a hefty price (worth it IMO), but could indicate the *SC600 III* is getting _REAL _close now


----------



## BWX

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**

Too bad about what they did to wreck the interface though..

*"Beacon-strobe mode can be accessed from 3 short-clicks when the light is Off. "* 

It's supposed to go into LOW when you do that ZebraLight! W. T. H. !?

I won't buy a MKII or MKIII until they fix that nonsense. I don't want strobes and beacons always coming on by accident on my $100 ZebraLight. That's why I spent $100 on a flashlight, an interface without stupid strobes constantly coming on all the time. I have "crappy" $40 and $50 and $60 lights for that.


I guess I will stick with my MKI B XM-L U2 cool white for the foreseeable future.. I wanted a neutral white version too, but not with that interface. 

Sorry Zebralight, you aren't getting any more 100 dollar bills from me until you fix it.


----------



## markr6

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**

Yeah they changed that a while ago. Some like it, some hate it, some don't care. I never accessed low with 3 clicks, so I don't care. You get a flash of high and medium by triple clicking, so I don't know why people would use that to get to low. Click and hold is fine. I never miss it, but some people can't seem to time it right and end up getting medium. That's still better than going through high IMO.

Ideally, it would be from off 1 click = low. Double click = high. Press and hold for medium.


----------



## twistedraven

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**

Low used to be accessible via 3 short clicks?? I'm glad they changed it then. Low being accessible via a press and hold is why I love Zebralight.

The only downside about strobe being 3 clicks is if you turned the light on in high, and want to change to high2 real quick-- if you do it too quickly you get strobe. That still gets me sometimes.


----------



## markr6

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**



twistedraven said:


> The only downside about strobe being 3 clicks is if you turned the light on in high, and want to change to high2 real quick-- if you do it too quickly you get strobe. That still gets me sometimes.



Yup! I do that a lot...I'm impatient!


----------



## markr6

Actually, you can still technically 3-click to low if you time it right  

Or press and hold. Here it is on the SC5w OP (same new UI)



I know, not ideal...but it's there. I still don't understand why anyone would want to do that.


----------



## BWX

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**



twistedraven said:


> Low used to be accessible via 3 short clicks?? I'm glad they changed it then. Low being accessible via a press and hold is why I love Zebralight.
> 
> The only downside about strobe being 3 clicks is if you turned the light on in high, and want to change to high2 real quick-- if you do it too quickly you get strobe. That still gets me sometimes.



You could always do either. 3 short clicks or press and hold- then release for low. 

I don't understand why people don't understand that you can just press the head of the light into your shirt at night and click three times really quick and no flash of light.

You can check to make sure it is in low if your eyes are night adjusted by looking at the edge of the bezel as it is against your shirt, or your coat, or your pants, or your dog, or your wife or g/f. Very easy to do and doesn't take a brain surgeon to figure it out.
Sometimes with the flakey switch operation, holding down and releasing gets you a big flat blast of turbo because when you thought you pressed down, it wasn't "all the way" pressed down because switch is inconsistent as per usual with ZL switches. 3 clicks to low with head of light against your shirt is SAFER, that's why I do it. I actually use the thing every day, I don't sit and look at it on a shelf or use it once every three weeks like some people seem to. If they used it ever day they would know why 3 clicks to low is a good thing to have.


Too bad ZL had to go and wreck the interface so strobe and flashy modes are always right there, ready to go off with one click to many which happens ALL THE TIME with their half-defective switches that they always use which seem to have a mind of their own anyways. 

Also too bad they can't get a decent switch with some consistency either, you'd think for $100/ light they could afford it.


----------



## markr6

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**

If you're putting it against your shirt, I guess you can do what I'm doing in the video above...then check to see if it's in low or strobe. In fact, that would probably be even more obvious.


----------



## BWX

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**

I don't want stupid strobe / flashing at all on my ZL interface.

Hey it's fine with me, I just won't buy another one until they fix it. It'll save me $100 that I probbaly don't need to spend on a flashlight anyways. They can **** off their paying customers all they want. I will just not buy one. Easy.


----------



## twistedraven

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**

Never once had a problem with accidentally pressing the light into high while holding it down for low spanning multiple Zebralights. Pressing it down for low makes a whole lot more sense to me than pressing it up against one's shirt to mask the higher output modes. 3 clicks to get to strobe is a whole lot less 'there' than a held press IMO.

Regardless of the fact, I'm just happy that there's press hold to get to low. Being able to single click for instant high, or press hold to start at low then cycle from low to med then high is the whole reason why I love Zebralight.

I do agree though that strobe modes are rather useless, and should be something even more complicated to get to-- or just have the ability to be programmed to just not be there in the first place.


----------



## markr6

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**



BWX said:


> I don't want stupid strobe / flashing at all on my ZL interface.
> 
> Hey it's fine with me, I just won't buy another one until they fix it. It'll save me $100 that I probbaly don't need to spend on a flashlight anyways. They can **** off their paying customers all they want. I will just not buy one. Easy.



Strobes are pretty useless IMO. I wish they would either kill it or bury the hell out of it like 8 fast clicks. Or something Eagletac-ish like 3,821 fast clicks in under 10 seconds.


----------



## BWX

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**



twistedraven said:


> Never once had a problem with accidentally pressing the light into high while holding it down for low spanning multiple Zebralights. Pressing it down for low makes a whole lot more sense to me than pressing it up against one's shirt to mask the higher output modes. 3 clicks to get to strobe is a whole lot less 'there' than a held press IMO.
> 
> Regardless of the fact, I'm just happy that there's press hold to get to low. Being able to single click for instant high, or press hold to start at low then cycle from low to med then high is the whole reason why I love Zebralight.




_"Sometimes with the flakey switch operation, holding down and releasing gets you a big flat blast of turbo because when you thought you pressed down, it wasn't "all the way" pressed down because switch is inconsistent as per usual with ZL switches. 3 clicks to low with head of light against your shirt is SAFER, that's why I do it."_

And I returned two with much worse switches until I got this one which I could "live with"..


----------



## fnj

Strobes are STUPID. Stamp them the heck out.


----------



## snowlover91

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**



BWX said:


> _"Sometimes with the flakey switch operation, holding down and releasing gets you a big flat blast of turbo because when you thought you pressed down, it wasn't "all the way" pressed down because switch is inconsistent as per usual with ZL switches. 3 clicks to low with head of light against your shirt is SAFER, that's why I do it."_
> 
> And I returned two with much worse switches until I got this one which I could "live with"..



How recent was your most recent purchase of one? Reason I ask is they have significantly improved and upgraded their side switches so that now they're very reliable while providing nice feedback as well. I personally would be upset if they changed low access to 3 clicks, it's far easier to press and hold and makes much more sense too. Never had any issues accidentally getting medium or high with the current UI.


----------



## KeepingItLight

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**

I feel sorry for you guys that have trouble with this. Obviously, it is not working for you. The level of frustration only emphasizes how much you like your Zebralights. You just can't get the press-and-hold to work right.

You probably know the trick of saying "Zebralight" silently to yourself while you press and hold. Actually, "Ze-bra" works for me.

After reading several of these posts, I spent some time trying to recreate the problem. In many, many attempts, I was never able to accidentally activate high by doing a press-and-hold. Not once.

As someone who uses strobe, I hope Zebralight keeps things just as they are. Like Mark, I would never use a triple-click for low.




snowlover91 said:


> How recent was your most recent purchase of one? Reason I ask is they have significantly improved and upgraded their side switches so that now they're very reliable while providing nice feedback as well. I personally would be upset if they changed low access to 3 clicks, it's far easier to press and hold and makes much more sense too. Never had any issues accidentally getting medium or high with the current UI.



This may explain why I never have trouble. I have the SC62w.


----------



## uofaengr

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**

Never have trouble either, and would hate 3 clicks to low. Use mine everyday too.


----------



## BWX

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**



snowlover91 said:


> How recent was your most recent purchase of one? Reason I ask is they have significantly improved and upgraded their side switches so that now they're very reliable while providing nice feedback as well. *I personally would be upset if they changed low access to 3 clicks, it's far easier to press and hold and makes much more sense too. *Never had any issues accidentally getting medium or high with the current UI.



It's not if/ or. It's both. Mine does both. (MkI B U2) Hold and release for low or 3 quick clicks for low.. First click is high, 2nd med, 3rd, low. Also hold down to go through low, med, high, and let off to select when the light is on, just like normal. 

The new ones are F-ed up.. 3 clicks gets to strobe? WTF!? F strobe!


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## snowlover91

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**



BWX said:


> It's not if/ or. It's both. Mine does both. (MkI B U2) Hold and release for low or 3 quick clicks for low.. First click is high, 2nd med, 3rd, low. Also hold down to go through low, med, high, and let off to select when the light is on, just like normal.
> 
> The new ones are F-ed up.. 3 clicks gets to strobe? WTF!? F strobe!



No need to get so upset over a UI change. There are a lot of people who like quick access to strobe and like having access to it from off so the 3 clicks is a good compromise for this. The press and hold for low is far more natural than 3 quick clicks IMO. I honestly don't think it's a big deal and if they were to remove strobe they'd have a lot of people who like it get upset. Their UI is top notch and easy to use once you use it some, very natural and my preferred UI versus other lights where you click multiple times for different modes.

KeepingItLight, this is most likely why few issues have arisen with recent ZL releases as it appears they refined their switch process. I'm not sure if they redesigned it or put higher quality parts or better QC, however they did do something in recent years to improve switch feedback/quality as I've seen few issues with recent releases while older models more than 1.5-2 years old were plagued with problems.


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## markr6

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**

Switches, like the tint, have been all over the place. I had an SC600w with a mushy switch...it made NO sound. No feedback. Very difficult and irritating to use.

In contrast, I have an SC52w which rivals the sound of a cement truck slamming into a glass building. CLICK CLICK!! Actually I don't mind it, but something in between is best. I have a couple others which have nice feedback, but a very quiet click...perfect.

Just when I think the tint and switch thing is now consistent, I try another and get something completely different.

I'm a sucker for ZL, so we'll see what the SC600 III brings. I won't be able to resist that one.


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## Lumencrazy

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**

*SC600w Mk II L2 18650 XM-L2 Flashlight on sale on the website. ** Something new on the horizon?*


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## markr6

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**



Lumencrazy said:


> *SC600w Mk II L2 18650 XM-L2 Flashlight on sale on the website. ** Something new on the horizon?*



Yes! See post #1833  Someone else also asked ZL and they said next week for the SC600 III. Hopefully they don't break the $100 mark.


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## more_vampires

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**

One week more.... one week more....

I hope they don't blow the release. I want! WANT! Want the Mk3. I've been impatient about this for WAY too long.


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## snowlover91

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**



markr6 said:


> Yes! See post #1833  Someone else also asked ZL and they said next week for the SC600 III. Hopefully they don't break the $100 mark.



I expect you'll be preordering this when it releases right? This light could be exactly what I've been waiting for so I might be preordering depending on specs. I really hope 4.35v support for newer 18650 batteries is added.


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## markr6

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**



snowlover91 said:


> I expect you'll be preordering this when it releases right? This light could be exactly what I've been waiting for so I might be preordering depending on specs. I really hope 4.35v support for newer 18650 batteries is added.



Yeah  or is it

Yeah ?

LOL...I'm a sucker for Zebralights. I think my SC600w II L2 is perfect, but the curiosity will get me. Is this going to be mostly a thrower with the XP-L HI? Or will be be the SC600 II plus a little extra throw? I think the latter since (I'm guessing) the reflector won't be deep like some other lights. I just can't wait to find out! Of course, when they publish specs it may help me decide for sure, but I'll probably end up buying...I could always sell if I don't like/need it. That's always worked out in the past, but I'm currently sitting on two lights I don't need...any they won't SELL!


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## snowlover91

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**



markr6 said:


> Yeah  or is it
> 
> Yeah ?
> 
> LOL...I'm a sucker for Zebralights. I think my SC600w II L2 is perfect, but the curiosity will get me. Is this going to be mostly a thrower with the XP-L HI? Or will be be the SC600 II plus a little extra throw? I think the latter since (I'm guessing) the reflector won't be deep like some other lights. I just can't wait to find out! Of course, when they publish specs it may help me decide for sure, but I'll probably end up buying...I could always sell if I don't like/need it. That's always worked out in the past, but I'm currently sitting on two lights I don't need...any they won't SELL!



From what I've read the dedomed XP-L will come close to doubling the throw if all other things (output, reflector, etc) are the same. I believe Selfbuilt measured around 12k from the L2 model so if they use a dedomed XP-L they should be able to achieve 20k easily if all else is the same. If they change the output and/or reflector design then that would certainly affect the results too. My guess is they'll leave the design the same but add support for 4.35v 18650 batteries. This would probably give us 20-22k in throw.


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## markr6

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**

MK III's 


ModelMSRPBatteryLEDTypical CRINorminal CCTBeam TypeModels w/ Similar Beam ProfileModesANSI OTF Max OutputANSI OTF Low OutputBezel DiameterLengthWeightReleasedNotes(USD)AACR12318650(Kelvin)(Lumens)(hrs)(Lumens)(hrs)(Inch)(Inch)(oz)SC Series Side Clicky FlashlightSC600w Mk III HI951Cree XHP35 HI804500spill + spotSC600 I & II15PID
0.01
6 mo
1.2
3.8
2.35
11/ 2015
SC600w Mk III951Cree XHP35804500spill + spot15
PID
0.016 mo1.23.82.3510/ 2015SC600 Mk III951Cree XHP35705700spill + spot15
PID0.016 mo1.23.82.3510/ 2015


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## sdr

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**

*MUST HAVE!!!*





*Got the cash in my hot little hand!

So, c'mon Zebralight...release that bad boy,
SC600 MkIII, and take my money...PLEASE!!!*​


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## oeL

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**



markr6 said:


> Someone else also asked ZL and they said next week for the SC600 III.



And... the MK II is on sale now. Won't take long any more


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## legendofzelda

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**

can anyone tell me whats so great about this light ?


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## g.p.

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**

What's not great about this light?


legendofzelda said:


> can anyone tell me whats so great about this light ?


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## BWX

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**



legendofzelda said:


> can anyone tell me whats so great about this light ?




It's my EDC for years (SC600 MK1B), that's what. 

New one? Better in most ways but one. They screwed up the interface. 3 clicks to STROBE. Not 3 clicks to low. So new one? Not great, could have been great. Brand new one doesn't use protected cells so it can be a mm shorter or whatever, so that's not great. Last one that used interface that could go 3 clicks to low was great, and is great still.


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## ShineOnYouCrazyDiamond

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**



legendofzelda said:


> can anyone tell me whats so great about this light ?



At this point I would be looking at the threads covering the MkIII, not the MkII. There's tons of threads on the forum which cover all aspects, good and bad, about this light. 

One of the key pro aspects of this light is that it's one of the smallest 18650 available and has amazing thermal controls and long (as in months) low level runtime. 

It can be a bit of a floody light which is good and bad depending on the situation. If you desire a bit more throw check out the MkIII HI version.


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## toysareforboys

*Re: ZebraLight SC600 MkII *with PICS**



legendofzelda said:


> can anyone tell me whats so great about this light ?


I switched from it as my EDC to a Nitecore MH20. So nice being able to recharge it with my cellphone charger in my car 

-Jamie M.


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## Cessquill

Hi - stupid question alert, but I couldn't find anything in the search.I accidentally smashed the lens on mine and have a replacement coming. Is it an easy job to fix? Everything else still works fine.


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## Romo Lampkin's Cat

I'm pleased to report four years of EDC with my SC600 MkII. I'm still using the original pair of Panasonic 18650's I purchased with the light. I lost the clip on the light so I purchased two more.

A previous question was "What's so great about this light?" Yes.

You know those flashlight fantasies where there's a power outage and the light cannon in your pocket saves the day? I had that experience in March at a spelling bee. There were 67 fifth through eighth graders in an interior ball room in a large building on a small Midwestern college campus. On the other side of the room was about 200 of their family and friends, including me. About 20 minutes into the bee, the entire room plunged into total darkness. About two seconds later the lights flashed one time and the room went dark again. Then a generator on the roof started and the exit signs lit up, but the lights in the room did not illuminate, obviously not being on the emergency circuits.

As the room buzzed, a few small lights pierced the darkness as people used the LEDs on their phones. A few seconds later I pulled my SC600 out of my pocket, aimed it at the ceiling, and turned it on high (500 lumens). The reaction was instantaneous. The adults on my side of the room exclaimed loudly and the kids on the other side of the room all started to laugh. I heard my 11-year-old son yell something like "My dad just got out his light saber!" The bee resumed in the darkness as the judges used cell phone lights, and I stood the SC600 on its tail on the empty chair next to me and it illuminated the peanut gallery's side of the room for the next 40 minutes or so until power was restored. It got uncomfortably hot to the touch but didn't miss a beat, and the on-board power meter suggested that I had only drained about 1/4 of the power reserves. The light off the ceiling was so bright that the woman sitting immediately to my left was knitting, and the man immediately to my right was reading a book.

The only thing I don't love about my SC600 MkII is the puke-green tint. If I ever have to or choose to replace the light, it will probably be with another SC600 but with neutral tint. A friend took delivery of an MH20 about two weeks ago and it's a fantastic light, but I'd go straight for another SC600.


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## Bluebloa

Could you tell me, pls. I cant Pm you! Thank you very much!


Overclocker said:


> hahahaha! the other day i was reflowing i actually had to bring out the PDF just to make sure. the dot is the negative
> 
> so you took out the MCPCB? stupid question: no components under the MCPCB?
> 
> btw you really didn't have to break the glass  PM me for more info. zebra will kill me if i told everyone how to do it



Could


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