# Magic Fire 65W HID



## mohanjude (Apr 24, 2012)

*Magic Fire 65W HID 5500-lumen 4x18650 HID Flashlight *


Size	*207mm x 70mm x 49mm	NetW	800
Material	6061-T6 Aluminum	Anodise	HaIII
LED	65W HID 4300K	Battery	*4 x 18650 in Series*( Not Included)
Reflector	Deep Aluminum Alloy*SMO reflector	Lumen	*5500 Lumen
Waterproof	Rain Proof	Battery Holder	*Aluminum Alloy
Switch	Tail cap click Switch	Shot Range*	*1500 Meters
Glass Lens	High temperature* Toughtened Coating*Glass Lens	*Runtime	*1 hour

*It appears to have LV warning as it flash when low voltage state is reached*

I have ordered mine and is already shipped. Should be here in the next few days.


As many of us already know the first generation had many issues. Most of them were around the packaging and cosmetically damaged lights. Others were about practical issues such as the sharp edges of the battery tube, no LV indicator etc.

If this HID light outputs the same ratio as the previous generation it would be expected to deliver around 50w or more. This hopefully will result in a compact thrower that is cheap to buy and maintain due to the use of commonly and easily available 18650 cells.

Pictures from distributor cnqualitygoods


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## Colonel Sanders (Apr 24, 2012)

I hope they also fixed whatever caused my reflector to fog up in a major way. It was a decent performer before that. Now....not so much. 

Making the springs keep contact has been a bit of a chore as well despite a little smoothing and tweaking here and there. Perhaps all is well on the newest version.

No gashes on mine (luckily!)...just aggravation and poor reliability.


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## xed888 (Apr 24, 2012)

Looking forward to your input, mohan!

On Ric's page, he says to let the light cool every 10 mins. Is this necessary or is he being cautious? And do batts only last 40 mins?
Im a HID noob.


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## warmurf (Apr 24, 2012)

Wow! Great output in such a small package!! Agree, seems weird that it has to be turned off every 10 mins? Let's hope this one get's a review because if the quailty issues are sorted, there would be quite a few of us out there wanting a little power package like this....


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## ma_sha1 (Apr 24, 2012)

Beam shots from other forums: 
100 meter distance, Left to right: MF65W, Olight SR90, Olight X6 (6 XML).


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## BVH (Apr 24, 2012)

Even if it's only 65 Watt INPUT and around 50 Watts Output, that's a lot of heat to be dissipated by a small mass such as this light. I'm not surprised if he is recommending a cool down period. I'd be happy with 40 mins run time.


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## BVH (Apr 24, 2012)

warmurf said:


> Wow! Great output in such a small package!! Agree, seems weird that it has to be turned off every 10 mins? Let's hope this one get's a review because if the quailty issues are sorted, there would be quite a few of us out there wanting a little power package like this....



Is there a thread somewhere on this light that Ive not found? Where is he recommending a cool down?


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## Doberman (Apr 24, 2012)

40 Watts version has LV warning also.
Worked well on my MF; Thougt initial that it was a bug, but it outlined as feature.

@BHV: Cool down recommendation is stated in the product description in the webshop 



> *Please turn it off every 10 minutes to let the torch cool down.*



Rgds
André


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## BVH (Apr 24, 2012)

Can you describe the flashing? Is it like a single flash every so many seconds or partial seconds or is it a rapid flickering?


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## Doberman (Apr 24, 2012)

It was, as i remeber about twice a second, and it was flashing, not flickering or something other misinterpretable behaviour.
So you will recognize it very fast in use. 
I shut down the HID at once and by accident had the item description on a browser window open, where Ric mentioned the LV warning.
Measuring the batteries statet 3.1 Volts each (12,3V for the pack). I guess that´s somewhat 2.9Volts when in use. 
So the HID warns when package Voltage drops below ~12 Volts.
Thats OK for me and i think it´s also OK for the 18650´s.

Rgds


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## mohanjude (Apr 24, 2012)

Looks like the package will be delivered sometime during the day on Wednesday.... hopefully DHL will be as quick as before.


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## mohanjude (Apr 24, 2012)

LV indicator - I actually have not experienced the flashing on my 45W. Maybe I am just not pushing the light until the batteries are almost exhausted.


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## Ginseng (Apr 24, 2012)

mohanjude said:


> Looks like the package will be delivered sometime during the day on Wednesday.... hopefully DHL will be as quick as before.


Did you buy it off of Ric's new consumer site or the original wholesale/retail site?

Wilkey


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## mohanjude (Apr 24, 2012)

I wasn't aware of the new consumer site. I purchased it off cnqualitygoods.


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## Ginseng (Apr 24, 2012)

mohanjude said:


> I wasn't aware of the new consumer site. I purchased it off cnqualitygoods.


Ric posted a week or two ago in the Dealer Forum but I can't seem to locate the thread for some reason. Wish I'd bookmarked the site (which was heavily under construction). Looking forward to your measurements BTW.

Wilkey


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## Doberman (Apr 25, 2012)

Just read this: Cooldown every 10 minutes recommended ? How long ? 1 minute, 10 minutes ?
So not really useable for nighthikes etc. 
I will discontinue this version and wait patiently for the two-mode version that i would like to see on the next version; 4o Watts in normal mode and 65 Watts for special situations and flashoholics 
Ric, please work on such a version with your vendor ......


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## warmurf (Apr 25, 2012)

Of the three beam shots on Ma sha1 comments it looks to me that the MF was the brightest? A little hard to tell and the SR90 may have a brighter hot spot but overall to my eyes it appears the brightest. Anyone else agree?


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## mohanjude (Apr 25, 2012)

warmurf said:


> Of the three beam shots on Ma sha1 comments it looks to me that the MF was the brightest? A little hard to tell and the SR90 may have a brighter hot spot but overall to my eyes it appears the brightest. Anyone else agree?



Yes you are right and it actually looks a very nice bright spill.

What I hope to do is to try and do a side by side comparison of some Beamshots with the MF 45W.
It is raining cats and dogs here in Cardiff, Wales at the moment so I might not get the opportunity even if I received the torch.

It is looking like it is out for delivery.


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## yifu (Apr 25, 2012)

mohanjude said:


> Yes you are right and it actually looks a very nice bright spill.
> 
> What I hope to do is to try and do a side by side comparison of some Beamshots with the MF 45W.
> It is raining cats and dogs here in Cardiff, Wales at the moment so I might not get the opportunity even if I received the torch.
> ...


Looking foward to your first impressions! Or i might just wait out for the upcoming 85W version, which should be the smallest 85W HID ever built.


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## mohanjude (Apr 25, 2012)

OK the HID arrived. I have been very busy today due to unforseen issues at work.
Just a couple of snaps of the packaging which is a great improvement from the previous packaging. Well wrapped and not a mark on it. Initial impression very bright. As bright as the ebay 65W HID at a quick flick of the switch

You can see both the 45w and 65W next to each other with their respective battery cages that look the same. I had to label the 65w to make it easier to identify it.


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## warmurf (Apr 25, 2012)

Is the 85W a reality? Is it coming or are people just speculating? That would be worth waiting for? Although to be fair it would deserve 6 x 18650s, which then takes away from the compact size. 85W with three 18650s seems like putting a 2 gallon fuel tank on a V8 Mustang..........:sick2::shakehead:duh2:


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## BVH (Apr 25, 2012)

Is the battery cartridge as tight a fit as with the 40 watt?


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## mohanjude (Apr 25, 2012)

Yes battery cartridge does not appear to be any different to the naked eye.

I have used eagletac 3100 cells.

I am hoping to take some beamshots tomorrow. Externally the 45W looks the same as the 65W to me. I have had to charge another set of 4 cells so immediately couldn't draw a comparison. Keep you guys posted.


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## MDJAK (Apr 25, 2012)

My Magic Fire 45W is on its way back to Ric in China as the bulb went bad. I am going to pay the difference and upgrade to this new light.

I look forward to receiving it. Will report when I do.

mark


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## Colonel Sanders (Apr 26, 2012)

Warmuf, these lights use 4 cells, not 3. You know, I just might be willing to upgrade this light if the price is right and if I could have a new reflector tossed on with the deal.


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## jmpaul320 (Apr 26, 2012)

if there is ever an 85w version made i will definately be wanting one... the option to have 18650 cells and a replaceable bulb (and better build quality) makes these better options than the ebay hids


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## BVH (Apr 26, 2012)

I'm not really sure I'd call the bulbs "replaceable" in the sense that it's a simple plug-n-play task. They are not conventionally sized bulbs either. Not easily available. It takes fine soldering skills and requires damage to the bulb's return wire to get the job done.


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## Ginseng (Apr 26, 2012)

BVH said:


> I'm not really sure I'd call the bulbs "replaceable" in the sense that it's a simple plug-n-play task. They are not conventionally sized bulbs either. Not easily available. It takes fine soldering skills and requires damage to the bulb's return wire to get the job done.


Agreed. Without a significant internal redesign, it is not at all straightforward to replace. I've had my head opened up and it does not look like it's meant to be user serviceable.

Wilkey


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## jmpaul320 (Apr 26, 2012)

BVH said:


> I'm not really sure I'd call the bulbs "replaceable" in the sense that it's a simple plug-n-play task. They are not conventionally sized bulbs either. Not easily available. It takes fine soldering skills and requires damage to the bulb's return wire to get the job done.



thanks for the info


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## Patriot (Apr 26, 2012)

Looking forward to the beamshots and measurements!


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## hahoo (Apr 26, 2012)

Patriot said:


> Looking forward to the beamshots and measurements!




x2


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## mohanjude (Apr 26, 2012)

OK - the gremlins have struck again... I thought this HID looked identical to the 45W.... side by side was no different. It looked really bright - but then I had forgotten that the 45W HID was not a bad light at all. Putting them side by side after having charged the 2nd set of 18650 gave me that sinking feeling. I have now had confirmation from Rick via email that the 'shipping department' has sent me a 45W by mistake instead of the 65W. So here we are with a another false start. He has promised to put it right with no cost to me. He is hopefully going to ship the '65W' light in the next few days as it sounds like he hasn't got one in stock. I am sorry to have got off to this false start but these things do happen....


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## ma_sha1 (Apr 26, 2012)

"Wha, yoo blamin mei?
How abt put one in each han, now yo hav 90 Wa" :devil:


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## Fusion_m8 (Apr 28, 2012)

Somehow I just got this sinking feeling that the difference in output of the 65w to the 40w will not be as great as expected. Those of us who have the ebay 35w/55w/75w HIDs find that the difference in output between the 35w mode and 75w mode is not visually as much as the figures themselves suggest. Compounded by the fact that Chinese made flashlights have always overrated the outputs of their flashlights for marketing and sales purposes. A 40w ballast is already a handful for 4x18650s to handle, imagine a 65w ballast, I doubt very much even the best 3100mah cells today can cope with that kind of punishment and produce true 65w figures.


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## yifu (Apr 28, 2012)

Well, quad XPG drop ins run at around 22W and a single 3100mah cell will deliver full output. 65W runs down to 17ish watts per 18650 and thats definitely do-able. If you're worried, you can always use the newer 2250maH LiMn cells. Those will deliver 30Ws each easily.


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## ma_sha1 (Apr 28, 2012)

Good suggestion on the battery choice, since the start up current will likely be over 6A, the max for 3100 cells. 

I haven't seen reviews on CPF, but here is a big long thread elsewhere about the new Panasonic 10A IMR cell: CGR18650CH 

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...e-made-2250mah-10a-imr-battery-aw-slayer.html


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## yifu (Apr 28, 2012)

A little bit off topic but, yep that's the cell i was talking about. Kallie's Kustoms has a protected version of it(i think). With that cell a 85W version can certainly be a reality, even though the runtime would be a bit abysmal


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## Fusion_m8 (Apr 28, 2012)

Yeah, been there, done that, bought the t-shirt... 

I've been using Panasonic CGRs before I got my 40w. I reckon the CGRs are better than AW IMRs, my incands seem to run brighter for longer on the CGRs.


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## BVH (Apr 28, 2012)

For those of you with the Kallies CGR2250's and other CGR's from other sellers, does the shrink wrap stop about 1/32" short of fully covering the metal case on the negative end? Mine from Kallies and another seller overseas came the same way which is a definite killer/dead short scenairo for use in the Magic Scorpion and other, tight clearance lights. I don't understand why the material doesn't wrap a little bit around the case as is does on the positive end.


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## willieschmidt (Apr 28, 2012)

BVH said:


> For those of you with the Kallies CGR2250's and other CGR's from other sellers, does the shrink wrap stop about 1/32" short of fully covering the metal case on the negative end? Mine from Kallies and another seller overseas came the same way which is a definite killer/dead short scenairo for use in the Magic Scorpion and other, tight clearance lights. I don't understand why the material doesn't wrap a little bit around the case as is does on the positive end.


Check out Ebay and wrap them anyway you like in three colors or clear. I use clear and seal a label inside to identify. Works for me. YMMV
*(18650 Battery) 29.5MM Φ18.5MM PVC HEAT SHRINK TUBING 25FT*


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## BVH (Apr 28, 2012)

Can't. There is no more space to add even .003" shrink tubing (times both sides for .006") and have the loaded cartridge fit in the tube.


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## Fusion_m8 (Apr 29, 2012)

BVH: My CGRs the same as yours, with the fully exposed bottom. I don't see why it will be a dead short scenario as the whole body of the cell and flashlight is negative current, only the carrot/button top/positive contact spring the only positive current right? I think the exposed bottom would only be a problem with protected cells where they have that conductive strip that connects the PCB at the base to the positive on top of the cell?


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## willieschmidt (Apr 29, 2012)

BVH said:


> Can't. There is no more space to add even .003" shrink tubing (times both sides for .006") and have the loaded cartridge fit in the tube.


 Strip the original wrap.


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## BVH (Apr 29, 2012)

Fusion_m8 said:


> BVH: My CGRs the same as yours, with the fully exposed bottom. I don't see why it will be a dead short scenario as the whole body of the cell and flashlight is negative current, only the carrot/button top/positive contact spring the only positive current right? I think the exposed bottom would only be a problem with protected cells where they have that conductive strip that connects the PCB at the base to the positive on top of the cell?


If the cells were in parallel, there would be no issue when any case touched any other case but since they are in series, there are different voltages at any given two different cases. The moment the two battery cases in the two forward-most positions in the carrier touched the body, there was instant arc and much heat and a tiny bit of smoke.


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## Fusion_m8 (Apr 29, 2012)

Bugger... I'll use AW IMRs then.


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## BVH (Apr 29, 2012)

Not sure if I'm explaining this clearly. Try lining up 4 18650 in series in a line. Place the negative Volt meter probe on the last cell case and then proceed to probe the other 3 cases up the line. You'll get positive Voltage readings so to touch case number one with cases number 2-4 will result in a negative to positive short.


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## Colonel Sanders (Apr 29, 2012)

BTW, they are a bit hard to find (see very little mentioned of them) but AW now makes 2000mah IMRs as well as their old 1600mah version.

However, I don't see any reason why 4 x 3100s shouldn't work just fine for 65w. 3.6v x 6.2a= 22.32w x 4= 89.28w



Fusion_m8 said:


> Bugger... I'll use AW IMRs then.


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## Fusion_m8 (Apr 29, 2012)

Unprotected 3100mah cells are not "safe" chemistry cells like IMRs and CGRs. Using 4 in series could seriously be tempting fate. I've tried to squeeze protected Xtar 2400s and 2600s and they could not fit because they were too wide.


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## mohanjude (Apr 30, 2012)

I am using x4 Eagletac 3100 - they fit perfectly. It says IC protection against over charge or short circuit protection.

Mohan


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## Colonel Sanders (Apr 30, 2012)

After I removed the ridge from the top of the tube, my Redilast 2900s fit fine in my MF (but it's snug, no doubt.)



Fusion_m8 said:


> Unprotected 3100mah cells are not "safe" chemistry cells like IMRs and CGRs. Using 4 in series could seriously be tempting fate. I've tried to squeeze protected Xtar 2400s and 2600s and they could not fit because they were too wide.


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## BLUE LED (Apr 30, 2012)

mohanjude said:


> I am using x4 Eagletac 3100 - they fit perfectly. It says IC protection against over charge or short circuit protection.
> 
> Mohan



Thank you for the info, as I plan on using Eagletac 18650 3100mAh cells. I realise the runtime won't be very long, but I will probably buy the 45W too.


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## Patriot (Apr 30, 2012)

The battery fit situation is so bad with this light it's almost in need of a battery compatibility specific thread, as in the case of the TM11. 

I can 'wedge' 3000mah Ultra-Fire cells in mine but they're very tight, not to mention they're fire cells.

Redilast 2900mah cells work.

Eagletac 3100mah cells work according to Mohanjude.

Kallie's CGR 2250mah cells don't work according to BVH


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## mohanjude (May 1, 2012)

Here are pictures of the batteries inside the battery tube.

The Green batteries from Panasonic fit perfectly.






















mohan


Patriot said:


> The battery fit situation is so bad with this light it's almost in need of a battery compatibility specific thread, as in the case of the TM11.
> 
> I can 'wedge' 3000mah Ultra-Fire cells in mine but they're very tight, not to mention they're fire cells.
> 
> ...


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## yifu (May 3, 2012)

mohanjude said:


> OK - the gremlins have struck again... I thought this HID looked identical to the 45W.... side by side was no different. It looked really bright - but then I had forgotten that the 45W HID was not a bad light at all. Putting them side by side after having charged the 2nd set of 18650 gave me that sinking feeling. I have now had confirmation from Rick via email that the 'shipping department' has sent me a 45W by mistake instead of the 65W. So here we are with a another false start. He has promised to put it right with no cost to me. He is hopefully going to ship the '65W' light in the next few days as it sounds like he hasn't got one in stock. I am sorry to have got off to this false start but these things do happen....


So have you heard from them again? Have they shipped the 65W version yet? Maybe there's no such thing as a 65W MagicFire, only 40W Magicfires, and everyone got cheated. Please do report back when you receive the "65W" version. Thanks for being an early adopter, so we can learn from your mistakes or otherwise


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## mohanjude (May 3, 2012)

I have had a variety of excuses including International Labour day. I am not impressed with the slow progress but I am going to give it a few more days.


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## Fusion_m8 (May 3, 2012)

yifu said:


> So have you heard from them again? Have they shipped the 65W version yet? Maybe there's no such thing as a 65W MagicFire, only 40W Magicfires, and everyone got cheated. Please do report back when you receive the "65W" version. Thanks for being an early adopter, so we can learn from your mistakes or otherwise



A) I'm not sure if you've ever dealt with Ric before, but I have and I can assure you he is not that kind of person. 

B) The MF65w *does* exist, read the posts from the 40w forum and you can see that some users in China already have it and have taken measurements.


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## Fusion_m8 (May 3, 2012)

Patriot said:


> Kallie's CGR 2250mah cells don't work according to BVH



The Kallie's aka Panasonic CGRs DO work in the MF40w. Those are the cells I'm using in my 40w.


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## yifu (May 3, 2012)

Of course i have dealt with Ric before, and i'll agree, he tries to make things right everytime something goes wrong. Since he is just a distributor, i was worried that he got cheated by the manufacturer. And i've seen the posts on shoudian.com as well, it's just that i would like to get a CPFer's impression before i jump in.


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## mohanjude (May 3, 2012)

Ok I have had a email from Ric saying he has shipped but no tracking info.. Monday is 'Labour day' in the UK so looks like it will Tuesday when it arrives if he has shipped today. DHL do not deliver on the weekends unless Saturday delivery is paid which is a premium..


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## mohanjude (May 8, 2012)

OK here we go ROUND 2 - the replacement 65W light has arrived - thanks Ric for sending it as promised.

Packaging is exactly the same.. carboard sleeve and bubble warp protecting the torch inside plastic sealed DHL envelope
























No obvious damage apart from a very small nick on the Bezel. I am not complaining but you can see it on the front shot

It looks identical to the 40W - in fact if I didnt put a 65W sticker on it I wouldn't know. The 65W is the one on the left and will be now on from all the photos.






The battery cage is exactly the same







I had trouble intially getting the Eagletac 3100 to work - it would flick on and switch off immediately. Tried with Panasonic 18650 3100 and worked. Switched back to Eagletac and it worked again.. protection having second thoughts ??




The rough ceiling bounce test shows that under the exact same conditions (daylight with background lux registering on the meter) the 65W is brighter. I know it is a crude test but when you are comparing the 2 it is quite clear. 432 vs 307 on freshly charged cells. A 40% increase..

I didn't have time to check amp draw during my lunch break but I suspect the amp draw will be correspondingly higher

To the naked eye the 65W beam profile looks nice (I did not adjust anything) as I could not see the horrible shadow of the arc wire.














AMP Draw Video - this off Panasonic cells - if I have time I will wire it to a 14.4V LIPO 4amp 20C cell and see if it is any different


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## yifu (May 8, 2012)

Thanks for the impressions. Any idea on lumen output as compared to other lights? In my room a 100 lux ceiling bounce almost exactly corresponds to 1000 lumens output so that would be around 4500 lumens possibly? Is the throw better than the 40W? It looks to me in the photo that the 40W has a tighter hotspot.


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## mohanjude (May 8, 2012)

I could run my ceiling bounce against the Polarion PH50 to get a 'benchmark' comparison.


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## BVH (May 8, 2012)

So looks like about 59.5 Watts input and 47.5 Watts at the bulb based on 80% efficiency. A nice output for a light this size.


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## yifu (May 8, 2012)

mohanjude said:


> I could run my ceiling bounce against the Polarion PH50 to get a 'benchmark' comparison.


That would be great thanks! And BVH, "nice output" is probably abysmal output compared to your collection. i can't afford any of the amazing lights you own, except for maybe the LarryK14, which i will try to start once i find a 600W landing light :devil:


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## mohanjude (May 8, 2012)

Here is the bounce test between Polarion ph50 - peaks at over 500 but levels at 382.

Magic Scorpion was raised to the same height as PH50 - levels off at 367 - so not quiet PH50 but to me this is a nice surprise.

I can't do Beamshots as it is really sunny today (having rained and been very gloomy yesterday). Got to go look for a Myford lathe...

Hope you find this rather simple and basic comparison helpful. I once again at trouble with Eagletac 3100 shutting off.


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## mohanjude (May 8, 2012)

BVH said:


> So looks like about 59.5 Watts input and 47.5 Watts at the bulb based on 80% efficiency. A nice output for a light this size.



I think you are quite right the Ceiling Bounce shows 367 vs 382 = 95% power.

If you use that calculation ph50 - 50w output at 95% would equate to 47.5w assuming that the PH50 delivers a true output of 50W.


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## ma_sha1 (May 8, 2012)

Nice! I saw some 65W now comes with anti reflective coating on another site,

glass looks purpleish. Do you see that on yours?


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## mohanjude (May 8, 2012)

Can't really say - thought I saw purple hue through camera view finder...


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## Patriot (May 8, 2012)

mohanjude said:


> Here is the bounce test between Polarion ph50 - peaks at over 500 but levels at 382.
> 
> Magic Scorpion was raised to the same height as PH50 - levels off at 367 - so not quiet PH50 but to me this is a nice surprise.
> 
> ...






Not trying to nitpick at all mohanjude and I really appreciate the video comparison, but with the sensor that close to the light, camera and you, even the slightest bit of body movement can effect the numbers fairly significantly. Once during a ceiling bounce test in my integrating shower my numbers were thrown off due to the color of my shirt, how close I was and whether the bathroom door was open or not. I discovered early on that I had to set up the meter and light and then video the light meter readout from about 4 feet away, otherwise I was influencing the lux figures. Again, thanks so much for posting this video as it was helpful and good enough for a general result. Obviously, the 65W light, although under spec is really impressive! I'm amazed that it's hanging with the PH50.


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## yifu (May 9, 2012)

Thanks for the comparison. So it really is a "poor man's" mini PH50 then! Maybe not for throw but the output is very close indeed. If the 85W version comes out i think we can safely assume at least Polarion Night reaper output?


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## mohanjude (May 9, 2012)

Patriot said:


> Not trying to nitpick at all mohanjude and I really appreciate the video comparison, but with the sensor that close to the light, camera and you, even the slightest bit of body movement can effect the numbers fairly significantly. Once during a ceiling bounce test in my integrating shower my numbers were thrown off due to the color of my shirt, how close I was and whether the bathroom door was open or not. I discovered early on that I had to set up the meter and light and then video the light meter readout from about 4 feet away, otherwise I was influencing the lux figures. Again, thanks so much for posting this video as it was helpful and good enough for a general result. Obviously, the 65W light, although under spec is really impressive! I'm amazed that it's hanging with the PH50.



Quite right .. very sensitive and as I said it was a comparison between the 2 torches. Factors such as my shirt etc were common to both torches. What I did find is that because there was still ambient light in the room as can be seen in the lux meter my movement did not affect the lux readings as one would if it was total darkness. Before I took the video I did vary the distance and the position I held the Iphone, the lux meter and the surface. It didnt make a large difference and awlays ended up having the same relative changes to both the PH50 and Magic scorpion. Raising the Magic Scorpion off the table made more of a difference than where I was next to the light. As I said it was a quick comparison.


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## Doberman (May 11, 2012)

Nice, very nice.
And thanks for sharing the results of your first measurements.
Could you make first experiences with heat development of the MF ? Is it capable of going over 10 minutes runtime without melting the head´s alloy ?

Thx
Doberman


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## Doberman (May 21, 2012)

Hi all,
any news on that from the proud 65-Watt MF owners ? Is it stable for more than 10 minutes runtime ? Is there a tempearture cirquit kicking in or is it up to onwners responsibility th check flashlight temperature ?

Thanks and regards


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## mohanjude (May 25, 2012)

I have used my MF MS 65w for around 10 to 15 mins at a time am I happy to report that the unit has been stable and not shut down due to thermal issues. The head has felt very hot and quite difficult to hold by its head. The whole torch becomes warm but if there is air flow it is ok. I would not recommend tail stand and leaving it on for a long time.


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## jmpaul320 (May 27, 2012)

this light looks light a great entry level hid, aside from the ebay hids which seem to be very large in size


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## hahoo (Jun 1, 2012)

jmpaul320 said:


> this light looks light a great entry level hid, aside from the ebay hids which seem to be very large in size[/QUOTE
> 
> 
> 
> any more info on the light ?


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## MDJAK (Jul 23, 2012)

Good day, fellas (and ladies, if there are any). Some of you may remember a few months back my original Magic Fire (40? 45?) watt suffered a blown bulb. I contacted Ric who initially indicated changing out the bulb would be an easy affair if I knew how to solder. He said he'd send me a bulb. When that didn't arrive I contacted him again. At that point he (or someone who works with him) indicated it is a very difficult job to change the bulb, that the original light was no longer being made, but if I paid the difference and sent back mine, he'd send me the new 65w. I jumped on that. I mailed it back to him, which took a few weeks. After sometime he mailed me the new 65w light. While I've only used it once and briefly, it is BRIGHT, that's for sure, with excellent throw. 

First, kudos to Rick for coming through as promised.

Second, and sorry for not reading through the whole thread, but knowing the previous model sliced the outer coating off my batteries, resulting in my throwing away brand new batteries, which brand or brands are recommended that fit well in this light?

Thank you.

mark


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## Alankujala (Jul 23, 2012)

Mark, I skinned my AW's and then ordered some EagleTac 18650 3100mAh protected Li-ion and they fit beautifully!


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## MDJAK (Jul 23, 2012)

Alankujala said:


> Mark, I skinned my AW's and then ordered some EagleTac 18650 3100mAh protected Li-ion and they fit beautifully!



Thank you. I will order those now.


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## MDJAK (Jul 23, 2012)

Ordered. Sheesh, over 70 bucks with shipping for four batteries. Almost half the cost of the light. Oh well. LOL.

On another note, the nice lanyard that comes with the light, what's up with all the strings hanging out from it? How do I attach this?


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## MDJAK (Aug 29, 2012)

Help, people, please.

So as I stated, I received the replacement 65W light from Ric. He's been great during the blown bulb in my original 45 watt, took that back, charged me a small increased fee for the new light, and shipped it very well packed.

As I stated, I placed 4 batteries in the light and it worked. Super bright I thought. I noticed it skinning the batteries, asked, and purchased the Eagle Tac upon recommendation.

Well, the light would no longer work. It momentarily clicks on and then instantly off. And I mean a brief quarter of a second perhaps. I don't know if the switch went bad.

I emailed Ric and he stated I should use Panasonic (or another brand) UNPROTECTED batteries. Unprotected? I questioned this and he said they are perfectly fine and work well.

Am I wrong to be skeptical? I am a noobie when it comes to this stuff with no knowledge of batteries at all.

Also, I've tried every battery combo I own, both Eagle Tac, and others, and the light does the same thing. I've tried the batteries in my other lights and they work perfectly.

Thanks

Mark


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## BVH (Aug 29, 2012)

I don't remember if the 65 Watt has built-in protection in the battery carrier like the Fire Foxes does? If it does, then it is fine to use unprotected cells. If not, then you take your chances, raise your risk of an issue. If you're using protected cells, they are very likely to be tripping on over-current with the high draw of the 65 Watt (around 60 Watts IIRC from someone who did some testing) So 60 Watts equals about just under 4 Amps when running after warm-up (on fresh charged cells - more if not at full charge) and with a 2.5 - 3 times increase in starting Amps, you're looking at over 9 Amps momentarily. No protected cell is going to provide that without tripping off. That's most likely what you see with the momentary flash. The CGR 2250's and the original AW 1600 IMR's would provide the starting the necessary Amps. IIRC, AW has a new 2000 mAh IMR? That would be fine, too. The CGR's are fat and my 8, at least, had no insulation over the last 32nd inch of the negative "can" so they could not be used due to dead shorting when installing them in the tube. I'd look for AW's new 2000 IMR's.

Of course, you still could have a problem somewhere else - with the ballast, for instance, but it points towards over-current tripping.


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## rufus001 (Aug 29, 2012)

BVH said:


> The CGR's are fat and my 8, at least, had no insulation over the last 32nd inch of the negative "can" so they could not be used due to dead shorting when installing them in the tube.


Any chance of a photo of the bottom of the battery to show exactly where the wrapping is missing? i Have a couple of battery carriers that are very tight fits and don't want to go .


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## MDJAK (Aug 29, 2012)

BVH said:


> I don't remember if the 65 Watt has built-in protection in the battery carrier like the Fire Foxes does? If it does, then it is fine to use unprotected cells. If not, then you take your chances, raise your risk of an issue. If you're using protected cells, they are very likely to be tripping on over-current with the high draw of the 65 Watt (around 60 Watts IIRC from someone who did some testing) So 60 Watts equals about just under 4 Amps when running after warm-up (on fresh charged cells - more if not at full charge) and with a 2.5 - 3 times increase in starting Amps, you're looking at over 9 Amps momentarily. No protected cell is going to provide that without tripping off. That's most likely what you see with the momentary flash. The CGR 2250's and the original AW 1600 IMR's would provide the starting the necessary Amps. IIRC, AW has a new 2000 mAh IMR? That would be fine, too. The CGR's are fat and my 8, at least, had no insulation over the last 32nd inch of the negative "can" so they could not be used due to dead shorting when installing them in the tube. I'd look for AW's new 2000 IMR's.
> 
> Of course, you still could have a problem somewhere else - with the ballast, for instance, but it points towards over-current tripping.



I think you are right about the protection being the cause. Hmm. I'll have to look for those new AW batteries. Thank you very much for your quick reply.

The battery carrier: I don't know if it has protection built in. It seems pretty bare bones.


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## BVH (Aug 29, 2012)

rufus001 said:


> Any chance of a photo of the bottom of the battery to show exactly where the wrapping is missing? i Have a couple of battery carriers that are very tight fits and don't want to go .



I was sure I'd taken pics of my own but cannot find any. Here's a pic on Ebay showing a different brand but the short label is exactly as mine were. I ended up cutting the wrapper from all of mine and finding some thin wall (.005") shrink tube and re-wrapping them so the ends wrapped completely around the tail section. The only downside is that the mating end of an adjoining cell (or carrier contact) must have a very tiny protrusion to make contact beyond the .003" - .004" wrap. All brands I have sen are the same. In an insulated, plastic battery housing, such as a laptop, it does not matter because there is no common contact with a metal case. Take a look on Callies own site and you can somewhat make out the same condition on their pic.

http://www.ebay.de/itm/280831047533


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## rufus001 (Aug 29, 2012)

I thought that it was the bottom that was a little short on wrap not the bottom of the side of the battery. But checking the ebay photo it's clear what you mean. Wouldn't this bare side contact the inside of the torch in most lights and therefore cause a short? Or is there generally enough room for it not to be a problem? And I'm guessing this is not a problem at all in e-cigs(which I have never seen)?


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## BVH (Aug 29, 2012)

rufus001 said:


> I thought that it was the bottom that was a little short on wrap not the bottom of the side of the battery. But checking the ebay photo it's clear what you mean. Wouldn't this bare side contact the inside of the torch in most lights and therefore cause a short? EXACTLY! I saw the issue so I was ready for the short when I first tried to insert them in my 45 Watt Magic Fire with it's ultra-tight clearance. Although others said there was no issue. The moment mine made contact, I saw a spark and heat at the contact site was tremendous.Or is there generally enough room for it not to be a problem? There may be room in other devices or if the body is plastic then no issue. Remember, I removed the sharp edge at the beginning of the tube so bare metal was exposed. But I would not trust a thin Annodization to protect against a short. And I'm guessing this is not a problem at all in e-cigs(which I have never seen)?


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## MDJAK (Sep 4, 2012)

You were right. I got the AW IMR batteries you recommended , charged 'em up, placed them in the MagicFire 65 watt, went outside when it was very dark here in NY suburbs, and next thing I knew it was like an invitation to every moth and bug in the universe. It is a powerful light. I like it. Now I'll have to wait for cooler weather, when the bugs are less ubiquitous, and compare it to my Abyss.

Thank you very much.


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## Zephrus (Oct 10, 2012)

warmurf said:


> Of the three beam shots on Ma sha1 comments it looks to me that the MF was the brightest? A little hard to tell and the SR90 may have a brighter hot spot but overall to my eyes it appears the brightest. Anyone else agree?



It's an illusion or "eye trick." If you vignette the 65W image it's at least just as bright or brighter. Looks like a slightly higher color temp too.


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## Zephrus (Oct 11, 2012)

Just pulled the trigger on one of these bad boys along with 4 Panasonic 3100s . Should have it sometime next week. Looking forward to doing beamshots, throw tests, lux readings and will also do a FLIR thermal profile.


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## mohanjude (Oct 11, 2012)

Zephrus said:


> Just pulled the trigger on one of these bad boys along with 4 Panasonic 3100s . Should have it sometime next week. Looking forward to doing beamshots, throw tests, lux readings and will also do a FLIR thermal profile.



Did you manage to find it from the source?

Mohan


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## Zephrus (Oct 11, 2012)

Found it on Flashlight-Torch.com. They have 1 left if anybody's interested.


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## Toppe (Oct 13, 2012)

Zephrus said:


> Found it on Flashlight-Torch.com. They have 1 left if anybody's interested.



Damn, sold out! I want to buy one, so that we can compare lumens with a FF3.


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## Zephrus (Oct 13, 2012)

BVH said:


> If the cells were in parallel, there would be no issue when any case touched any other case but since they are in series, there are different voltages at any given two different cases. The moment the two battery cases in the two forward-most positions in the carrier touched the body, there was instant arc and much heat and a tiny bit of smoke.



An HV anti-corona, anti-arcing spray [varnish] or compound will solve most all the problems in this area. Make sure the inner lining is relatively clean and free of oils, and then carefully and evenly coat it will about .1-.2mm of something such as the following. It will adhere permanently to almost anything:










LINK:
HV Anti-Corona Dope


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## Zephrus (Oct 13, 2012)

Toppe said:


> Damn, sold out! I want to buy one, so that we can compare lumens with a FF3.



Based on everything I've seen and read in the forum, I'd take a stab and say (figuring conservatively) that the MF65W is putting out around 4600-4800 Lumens OTF. As a quick aside, as great as the FF3 is (and it *is* awesome), I liked the MF65W over the FF3 because 1. It has a SMO reflector and a tighter beam, and therefore will have a bit more throw (as *Mohan's* pics show). The FF3 is a remarkable light in many ways and it seems just a _bit_ too floody for my taste. Not bad but just skirting the boundary. 2. I really like the look of the MF65W body a lot. Yeah it's about 2 inches longer than the FF3 but I don't mind that. It's still just as portable IMO. The biggest reason was maximum throw/output for the size/money.

I wouldn't want you to run a LS test solely for my sake, but if you want to do it for the group and those here who are interested in maybe buying one, that's cool :thumbsup: No guarantees but If you really want to get one to do the test and wouldn't mind PMing me your name, I believe I could contact F-T.com and they just _might_ have one available for you. I'm sure everybody here is itching to know about its true output just as we are and how it stacks to the FF3.


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## Toppe (Oct 13, 2012)

Zephrus, i have sent you pm.


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## bxstylez (Oct 16, 2012)

Toppe said:


> Damn, sold out! I want to buy one, so that we can compare lumens with a FF3.





I received an email update from them that they were going to receive 3 units by friday to ship out

I lucked out and ordered one right away
looks like 1 more in stock now


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## Toppe (Oct 16, 2012)

bxstylez said:


> I received an email update from them that they were going to receive 3 units by friday to ship out
> 
> I lucked out and ordered one right away
> looks like 1 more in stock now



I did exactly the same nine hours ago. Hope it will come here within two weeks :twothumbs


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## bxstylez (Oct 16, 2012)

Toppe said:


> I did exactly the same nine hours ago. Hope it will come here within two weeks :twothumbs




sold out again!


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## Zephrus (Oct 16, 2012)

bxstylez said:


> sold out again!





They do tend to go fast just like the FF3. Can't wait to see what the output of this light is.


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## BeastFlashlight (Apr 16, 2013)

Has any owners of this light found a holster that fits it really well? I was disappointed that it didn't come with one


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## Fusion_m8 (Apr 16, 2013)

I keep mine in a 60rnd ammo pouch, fits pretty snug.


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## BeastFlashlight (Apr 16, 2013)

That's not a bad option can it strap on your belt? I'll prob just have to research the dimensions of a ton of flashlights till I find 207mm x 70mm x 49mm or slightly bigger


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## BeastFlashlight (May 17, 2013)

This is not really a Magic Fire post as far as HID, BUT I got my Magic Fire host completely gutted and modded into an incredible LED flood light by Vestureofblood! He was really impressed with the metal content, he packed the entire top section with solid aluminum heat sink (over 2 inches long), bonded 4 copper sink pads on top of that and put 4 short orange peel reflectors on the pads with 4 de-domed XML2s. Man is it one HUGE circle of flood light! It's regulated to 3,200 lumens constant output and it can run for 17.5 minutes before totally reaching crucial heat limit. Spectacular flood light!! Almost no hot spot at all.

Wasn't sure if I should post about my LED mod in this HID thread but it is in fact the MF host and I thought I'd compliment the heat sink potential of it


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## Colonel Sanders (May 18, 2013)

BeastFlashlight said:


> This is not really a Magic Fire post as far as HID, BUT I got my Magic Fire host completely gutted and modded into an incredible LED flood light by Vestureofblood! He was really impressed with the metal content, he packed the entire top section with solid aluminum heat sink (over 2 inches long), bonded 4 copper sink pads on top of that and put 4 short orange peel reflectors on the pads with 4 de-domed XML2s. Man is it one HUGE circle of flood light! It's regulated to 3,200 lumens constant output and it can run for 17.5 minutes before totally reaching crucial heat limit. Spectacular flood light!! Almost no hot spot at all.
> 
> Wasn't sure if I should post about my LED mod in this HID thread but it is in fact the MF host and I thought I'd compliment the heat sink potential of it



Yeah, I bought the direct drive version of this light he made and shockingly it has a higher output than my FF3! (at least according to my meter on a ceiling bounce test.) Incredible output! The throw was only 25k @ 1m but it makes for one helluva dog walking light. It does tend to get hot (but not quite unholdable) after about 12-15 minutes.


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## BeastFlashlight (May 18, 2013)

Yeah it is my favorite flood light. I here a lot about the TM26 flood light, there's NO way TM26 can be better


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