# The Official Zebralight Thread .



## C.M.S

With all the zebralight flashlight threads new and old floating around I thought I would make a "Official" thread about these mighty fine lights with all your questions and comments HERE :thumbsup:

Ill start with my fairly newly purchased SC600 II L2 : two words, LOVE IT !


----------



## GeoBruin

I'll bite. I've owned every Zebralight made in most of their variations in the last 5 years except the s6330. 

What's still with me? My SC62w rides with me in my pocket at all times, my H600w is my go to headlamp for most things except shorter night runs as my H52w and H32w have that covered. I also have older h5xw variants stashed in most places I may find useful... truck, night stand, tool box etc. 

Love my Zebras.


----------



## Charles L.

I have so many flashlights… and all I really need is an SC62 and H600F.


----------



## C.M.S

GeoBruin said:


> I'll bite. I've owned every Zebralight made in most of their variations in the last 5 years except the s6330.
> 
> What's still with me? My SC62w rides with me in my pocket at all times, my H600w is my go to headlamp for most things except shorter night runs as my H52w and H32w have that covered. I also have older h5xw variants stashed in most places I may find useful... truck, night stand, tool box etc.
> 
> Love my Zebras.



now I just need to figure out which Zebra I want next :shrug: .


----------



## CaptainPicard

I just got a H52w. LOVE IT! (Present from the gf makes it extra special, and the light rocks, but you know that.)
Also have an H51w, SC52, and H600w.

I love my zebras.


----------



## more_vampires

From the moment I first got my hands on my SC52D (daylight,) SC600W (warm,) and H502R (red floody headlamp,) I realized that I basically obsoleted most of my EDC options in one whack. There's about 30-40 lights in a junk box now because of one purchase order.

Love these things. I like how I can hide turbo mode. I love how the low modes go so low you start thinking "whoa, better turn that back up so I can see." Programming, slick build quality, great finish, I could go on but I know for certain I preach to the choir. 

Last power outage, it was these three lights. Oh I had MORE lights, they just didn't get used. 

I love Zebras. I've got two on me right now.


----------



## Romanko

I just wonder, if there somebody who has only zebralights?


----------



## markr6

Romanko said:


> I just wonder, if there somebody who has only zebralights?



I'm getting there! At the max I had about 20 nice lights. Now I have 6 Zebralights and 6 others worth mentioning (2xL10, 2xPD32UE, EA4w and S200C2); sold everything else.

Like I've said before, I always thought Zebralights were ugly, but I just couldn't get past the perfect UI (at least for me), wide range of output, size, and efficiency. They're really all I need, but I'm keeping my other lights for specific uses. But if ZL ever makes a thrower...things will get interesting!


----------



## C.M.S

+1 on them coming out with a Thrower ..


----------



## Capolini

I mostly have modded throwers and a few modded EDC's!!

I do have One [1] Zebralight.the SC62d. It is my favorite EDC!


----------



## AVService

I have an SC52 in my pocket every moment of every day since they arrived on the market.

If its not Broken don't Fix it!






And how can a thread be "official" without Pics?!?!


----------



## C.M.S

Banging my head right now trying to decide which Zebra I'm getting next , I'm thinking headlamp , but there's the H600w , H602w and the H600Fw , decisions decisions decisions . Oh then there's the SC62w I want ..


----------



## BeastFlashlight

How about a little SC62 vs SC600 argument? I'm still torn


----------



## C.M.S

BeastFlashlight said:


> How about a little SC62 vs SC600 argument? I'm still torn



Some say that the SC600's head is a bit bulky for EDC , SC62 has the smaller head for better EDC some say , I carry the SC600 and think it's just fine for EDC use . That's the only comparison I've read about . Other than maybe the SC62 gets hotter in high than the larger head SC600 . ?? 

Its a win win with either one in my opinion . :thumbsup:


----------



## BeastFlashlight

I actually JUST read a post that explained it perfectly;

"For me:


SC52w = when I want the smallest light to save space/weight, and option to use AA battery
SC62w = when I want a ton more light and runtime with slightly larger body
SC600w = when I want just as much light as the SC62, but able to run it for extended periods of time on high settings since it doesn't get so hot. And also a tighter hotspot for a little more throw (at least perceived).


Only want ONE? I'd go with the SC62. Not much bigger than 52 but way more output and runtime. (H1 on the 52 doesn't count IMO, kills the battery way too fast)"



I know what u mean C.M.S. I think I have a better pocket tolerance for a little extra bulk like you, and some need it absolutely tiny


----------



## KDM

BeastFlashlight said:


> How about a little SC62 vs SC600 argument? I'm still torn



Theres no debate and only one answer, get both. Seriously both great lights, I own both. If I know I'll be using high mode for extended periods I go for the 600. For a more comfortable edc the 62.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

BeastFlashlight said:


> SC52w = when I want the smallest light to save space/weight, and option to use AA battery



For me, I'd phrase that differently:

"SC52w = when I want the smallest light to save space/weight, use AA battery, and option to use 14500 battery"

I'm not really interested in using lithium-ion cells. I'd much rather use Eneloops. Safer, more reliable, and can use an alkaline if I absolutely have to. But it's nice to have the option of a 14500 if I want more output for a brief period.


----------



## Charles L.

Another option is to get an SC600 and an SC62d. The Luxeon emitter in the 62d peaks at *only* 320 lumens, but never gets too hot and has a great tint. Easily my favorite EDC -- SC600's spend more time on the shelf these days.


----------



## twistedraven

The 320lumens provided by the Luxeon are the brightest 320 lumens I've ever seen. Easily enough to do whatever you want except throw light at the farthest distances. Seems like higher CRI and pure white make objects better defined when lit, so it almost looks brighter than other lights at around the same amount of lumens. The 62D does get hot fast, but it doesn't seem to step down, which is really good. I wouldn't want 920 lumens if I can only use it for 5 mins.


----------



## markr6

I've never seen the SC62d get hot, at least within 5 minutes. But I sold mine so I can't confirm.

Speaking of heat, I don't see it as a drawback on the SC62(w) either. I mean, just use it at the 326 lm mode (3.9 hrs) and reserve the 930lm for situations when you really need it. Ot 577lm mode. Lots of nice options!

I would rather have and not use than settle for maxing it out and still want more, and not have it in one small package. Both great lights though.


----------



## KITROBASKIN

In a reasonably warm environment, on a headstrap, with a fresh battery, on full high with the SC62d, it can get hot but I do not know how hot because I have not let it do that for long. I am guessing it will taper off before significant damage is done and of course not be as hot as the XML2 versions. The second highest high will suffice for most needs and seems to be able to be used for extended time periods.

Edit: I remember now that I did run full-on for sustained periods indoors. The light got hot but not too hot to hold onto. (I was hoping to eliminate low level flickering when left on in highest high)


----------



## C.M.S

How do y'all like the neutral tint emmiters ? I've read it's a tint lottery .


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

C.M.S said:


> How do y'all like the neutral tint emmiters ? I've read it's a tint lottery .



I had good luck on the SC52w-L2, but I read lots of complaints about the tint of the original version (SC52w).

XM-L2's don't have the perfectly consistent tint of a Nichia 219 across the whole beam, but if you don't expect perfection, the extra brightness and efficiency makes sense on the Zebralights.


----------



## markr6

C.M.S said:


> How do y'all like the neutral tint emmiters ? I've read it's a tint lottery .



Yes, a lotto that would rival winning a $500 million Powerball! OK, not that bad. But I've had everything from greenish, yellow...as in YELLOW like an actual yellow bug bulb, one near a Nicha 219B and another almost cool white like 5000K.

My SC62w is good, but not great (a bit too yellow). My SC600w is pretty amazing and almost cool. Even though I hate cool whites, this one is great. Right around 5000K without the bluish tint so you get the best of both worlds. My SC52w is close to a Nichia 219B which is perfect.


----------



## Charles L.

C.M.S said:


> How do y'all like the neutral tint emmiters ? I've read it's a tint lottery .



Yes, I lost that lottery with my SC600. Won with an Armytek, lost with a Zebralight. Oh well, my eyes prefer the tint from a Nichia 219 or Luxeon anyway.


----------



## C.M.S

My SC600 L2 is the cool white version and I like it , wanted to try a "W" for my next but I hate yellow tint . But then again the H600 is on my to get list for outdoors and I'm thinking a neutral tint will be more pleasing ..


----------



## KITROBASKIN

Charles L. said:


> Yes, I lost that lottery with my SC600. Won with an Armytek, lost with a Zebralight. Oh well, my eyes prefer the tint from a Nichia 219 or Luxeon anyway.



Anything IS possible, but the only way my SC62d's would not be my most used lights is if ZL sold us an SC62n, with a Nichia 219b 5000K...


----------



## RIX TUX

I have a sc52 and sc600II and then I got a sc62. I sold the sc52 I think my sc600 II will never be used again. The sc62 is like the other two rolled into one.


----------



## RIX TUX

markr6 said:


> But if ZL ever makes a thrower...things will get interesting!



me too, everybody needs a thrower and zl needs to get with the program


----------



## RIX TUX

BeastFlashlight said:


> How about a little SC62 vs SC600 argument? I'm still torn


same output, 62 is half the weight and smaller......much better for the pocket.......the sc62 may be the smallest 18650 battery light out there now


----------



## markr6

Yes the SC62 definitely fits in your pocket better. Maybe it's just me, but I can't comfortably carry even my SC52w in jeans. And they're not tight; just basic "loose straight leg" Arizonia jeans I got a JC Penny.

Carrying a SC600? No way. I would need to be wearing something like this:


----------



## otis311

:shakehead LOL that picture is priceless.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

RIX TUX said:


> me too, everybody needs a thrower and zl needs to get with the program



Tough to make a thrower in a small form (unless you go with one of those nutty lenses that just paint a big picture of your LED). Since Zebralight is all about small lights, I don't think a thrower would make sense in their current lineup. They would need to start a whole new design for them.


----------



## markr6

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Tough to make a thrower in a small form (unless you go with one of those nutty lenses that just paint a big picture of your LED). Since Zebralight is all about small lights, I don't think a thrower would make sense in their current lineup. They would need to start a whole new design for them.



I think a big version of the SC600 would be nice. Basically, something like the Eagletac S200C2. Stretch it a bit and increase the head. No twisty head, just the usual Zebralight UI. But personally, I think I prefer the forward clicky on my S200C2. I ONLY use high mode; lower modes on a thrower don't make sense for me since I bought my thrower specifically to throw.


----------



## MBentz

I haven't touched any of my other lights in my EDC rotation since I purchased the SC62w. I always thought the ZL UI was a bit wonky, but in use it is actually quite good. Now my real question is 52w, d, or Fw?


----------



## more_vampires

D for daylight. It's nice and creamy on my Zebra, got lucky.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

MBentz said:


> I haven't touched any of my other lights in my EDC rotation since I purchased the SC62w. I always thought the ZL UI was a bit wonky, but in use it is actually quite good. Now my real question is 52w, d, or Fw?



w, if you like neutral tints, and a higher CRI than you get with cool white
d, if you like cool tints, but want a higher CRI than you get with Cree's cool white
F, I'm not sure why you'd want a permanent diffuser on an already floody light, but I guess it's up to you


----------



## davidt1

I have H502w and H52w. I am sticking with AA for now due to my obsession with discreet EDC.


----------



## ForrestChump

@ davidt1 -

I've seen all your posts with these pics.

Obsession is an understatement. You need a 30 day in house recovery center followed by a strong 12 step program. :nana:


----------



## oneinthaair

Where can the zebralight s6330 be found?


Sent from my iPhone using Candlepowerforums


----------



## Swede74

davidt1 said:


> I have H502w and H52w. I am sticking with AA for now due to my obsession with discreet EDC.





ForrestChump said:


> @ davidt1 You need a 30 day in house recovery center followed by a strong 12 step program. :nana:



Or a 13 step program :naughty:


----------



## more_vampires

Wow, that's like... 2 better than 11! :rock:

...but why not just have 10 modes and make 10 one step brighter? 

Zebralight: Goes to 11? Nah, we go to 13!


----------



## RIX TUX

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Tough to make a thrower in a small form (unless you go with one of those nutty lenses that just paint a big picture of your LED). Since Zebralight is all about small lights, I don't think a thrower would make sense in their current lineup. They would need to start a whole new design for them.


well I have a Roche f12 and its the same size and throws pretty good, so it can be done


----------



## RIX TUX

markr6 said:


> I think a big version of the SC600 would be nice. Basically, something like the Eagletac S200C2. Stretch it a bit and increase the head. No twisty head, just the usual Zebralight UI. But personally, I think I prefer the forward clicky on my S200C2. I ONLY use high mode; lower modes on a thrower don't make sense for me since I bought my thrower specifically to throw.


 but a thrower beam needs less lumens, my best thrower is only 220 lumens


----------



## thebackcourse

I'm sure my opinion has been stated numerous times by others and I hope I'm not beating a dead horse...but I REALLY like what I've heard about the ZLs but I wont buy one because they wont make one, JUST ONE lol, light with a normal switch on the tail cap. All my lights have tailcap switches, and since I carry a light both for general use and to supplement my carry piece, I'm not going to mess with 2 switch types. I am not willing to risk fumbling with a goofy contrarian switch in the event I find myself in a situation in which fractions of a second can make the difference between living and dying. 

I wish they'd make just a single tac switch type light...because I like almost everything else about them.

Is there a specific reason they don't make a bottom switch? It really seems to me that they're just trying to be different for the sake of being different. I get it, you're a unique little snow flake lol...now make the light I actually want! lol I've never tail-stood a light, because I just don't think LED light bounces all that well, so that's not something that ever remotely factors into my flashlight buying decision making process. I'm open to new ideas...I just don't see a side switch as anything remotely new, it's regressive if anything. Just my opinion...and worth exactly what I was paid for it lol.


----------



## C.M.S

markr6 said:


> Yes the SC62 definitely fits in your pocket better. Maybe it's just me, but I can't comfortably carry even my SC52w in jeans. And they're not tight; just basic "loose straight leg" Arizonia jeans I got a JC Penny.
> 
> Carrying a SC600? No way. I would need to be wearing something like this:




Is that Dave Grohl ? LOL 


EDCing a SC600 works for me without jeans like that .


----------



## RIX TUX

thebackcourse said:


> I'm sure my opinion has been stated numerous times by others and I hope I'm not beating a dead horse...but I REALLY like what I've heard about the ZLs but I wont buy one because they wont make one, JUST ONE lol, light with a normal switch on the tail cap. All my lights have tailcap switches, and since I carry a light both for general use and to supplement my carry piece, I'm not going to mess with 2 switch types. I am not willing to risk fumbling with a goofy contrarian switch in the event I find myself in a situation in which fractions of a second can make the difference between living and dying.
> 
> I wish they'd make just a single tac switch type light...because I like almost everything else about them.
> 
> Is there a specific reason they don't make a bottom switch? It really seems to me that they're just trying to be different for the sake of being different. I get it, you're a unique little snow flake lol...now make the light I actually want! lol I've never tail-stood a light, because I just don't think LED light bounces all that well, so that's not something that ever remotely factors into my flashlight buying decision making process. I'm open to new ideas...I just don't see a side switch as anything remotely new, it's regressive if anything. Just my opinion...and worth exactly what I was paid for it lol.


I think ZL's are not considered a tactical type light by design. And I used to favor a tail switch but bought a side switch light and like them much better.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

RIX TUX said:


> I think ZL's are not considered a tactical type light by design. And I used to favor a tail switch but bought a side switch light and like them much better.



Yes. If you like a tail switch, then buy from another manufacturer. There are plenty of choices. No point in trying to turn a cat into a dog.

I have lights with various kinds of switches. They all have a use, and I don't find using different switches a problem. A simple on/off tail switch is probably easiest for newbies or tactical situations, but I like variety.


----------



## AVService

I would not even consider a ZL for a tactical application?
The switching is just not as predictable as needed for the application regardless of opinion?

If I pull a gun and light and need full output from the light every time I want a single mode light period.


----------



## Erik1213

As you can see by my signature, I have many Zebras.

My SC52w is used on moon mode to illuminate my room a bit at night because I want it to be as dark as possible but not so dark that I can't find my way to the bathroom. That solves that problem completely.

The first SC600w was my first Zebralight. It was my EDC for a long time and I really like the light. I won't sell it.

Then I upgraded to the SC600w L2, which became my next EDC. I loved it so much more! The PID regulation, the battery meter, the smaller size. A wonderful upgrade!

Somewhere around here I ended up purchasing the S6330 with three Zebralight ZL631 (18650) batteries for the same price Zebralight was selling just the light for. It doesn't see much use but when I do break it out, I have had people make comments like "I thought there was a train coming at me!" It's such a hilariously bright light.

I was gifted an SC51f and I use that as my headlight because the frosted lens makes up close work a breeze.

My last Zebralight was an SC62d. I wanted a smaller light (not that the SC600 was much bigger) that was high CRI and almost cool white. I won with this one! It has replaced everything. I always keep it in my pocket. It's such a nice all around light. But, it was also the first Zebralight to leave me in the dark. The LED actually fell off of the PCB. Zebralight repaired it under warranty and all is well again!

I am really tempted to buy the standard cool white SC62 because I don't have any cool white lights and would really like to try one out. I wish I could find a good beamshot to see how green/purple/blue the LED tint is in one of them.


----------



## rpm00

I currently have a SC52 SC600 L2 and SC62w. My favourite by far is the 62w because the tint is just so damn nice and the form factor is very compact. I usually only EDC in my coin pocket so it doesn't get EDC time like my smaller lights. 

I had an SC62d which I sold because of the poor output for an 18650. The 62w is just way better and just as good tiny in my opinion. 

I've been thinking about a headlamp but can't decide which to get. Thinking a AA model might be the best balance between weight and runtime. But I'm really stuck on whether to get flood, wide or not. I don't have a specific application for the use so want something that would be general purpose. Usually I'm using the headlamps indoors though working around the house.


----------



## TheBelgian

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> w, if you like neutral tints, and a higher CRI than you get with cool white
> d, if you like cool tints, but want a higher CRI than you get with Cree's cool white
> F, I'm not sure why you'd want a permanent diffuser on an already floody light, but I guess it's up to you



On a headlight Fw is absolute bliss.


----------



## C.M.S

I wonder why the SC62d isn't high output like the cw 62 or 62w . Because of the different emmiter ?


----------



## twistedraven

Yes most likely. The luxeon T doesn't push lumens and isn't as efficient as the Cree leds. The Nichia 219 is even worse in this regard if I remember correctly. 320lumens is plenty for anything that doesn't require long throw though.

Speaking of Nichias, how cool would it be to have a 3x Nichia Zebralight?


----------



## C.M.S

I actually like the ZL cool white tint , how does the "daylight" tint compare ?


----------



## more_vampires

Sir, like carrots and potatoes.


----------



## eastenn

TheBelgian said:


> On a headlight Fw is absolute bliss.



I will agree here. I got my H52Fw first and carried it around in my pocket for a week until my SC62w showed up..now, the SC62w takes the cake for any EDC purpose. The H52Fw beam is too floody to be a primary EDC, but as a lightweight headlamp it excels. The beam is spread out very nicely and no concentrated hot spot, but puts out enough light to see what you are doing without having to be at the highest level. I wanted a headlamp for close up tasks like camping, rolling under the truck to change the oil, and night fishing or hunting.


----------



## TheBelgian

eastenn said:


> I will agree here. I got my H52Fw first and carried it around in my pocket for a week until my SC62w showed up..now, the SC62w takes the cake for any EDC purpose. The H52Fw beam is too floody to be a primary EDC, but as a lightweight headlamp it excels. The beam is spread out very nicely and no concentrated hot spot, but puts out enough light to see what you are doing without having to be at the highest level. I wanted a headlamp for close up tasks like camping, rolling under the truck to change the oil, and night fishing or hunting.


I clip my H52Fw to the oustide of my pant pocket or my coat breastpocket, gives a very nice handsfree EDC (on top of my Fenix E11 XP-E2, currently have 4 simultaneous EDC (I have a problem, I know) ). Often put the ZL in moonlight mode (L2a) when walking on the street, just to be more visible to cars, plus no need to fumble for my E11 when I need to light the keyhole (or even switch on the lights when I arrive home if I just need to go straight to my room).


----------



## C.M.S

I'm sure this is already known by many , but 35mm print film canisters fit the SC600 II L2 perfect . Makes for a nice little lantern :thumbsup:


----------



## TheBelgian

markr6 said:


>



Dude could EDC a TM36.


----------



## tandem

C.M.S said:


> I'm sure this is already known by many , but 35mm print film canisters fit the SC600 II L2 perfect . Makes for a nice little lantern :thumbsup:



Very timely, thank you thank you thank you. I was just wandering around the house looking for diffusers from other lights to see if any fit the SC600IIL2. Old translucent film cannisters I have a-plenty.


----------



## C.M.S

:thumbsup:


----------



## oneinthaair

Can the zebralight s6330 be found anywhere? Are they coming out with a new one?


Sent from my iPad using Candlepowerforums


----------



## kj2

oneinthaair said:


> Can the zebralight s6330 be found anywhere? Are they coming out with a new one?
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Candlepowerforums



It's discontinued, but ZL told me in 2014 their were planning on a XM-L2 version.


----------



## markr6

twistedraven said:


> Speaking of Nichias, how cool would it be to have a 3x Nichia Zebralight?



Derek Dean has one! http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...arlco-Optics&p=4486341&viewfull=1#post4486341


----------



## more_vampires

markr6 said:


> Derek Dean has one! http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...arlco-Optics&p=4486341&viewfull=1#post4486341



Awesome! I've thought before that ZL would be well off offering a triple option. I'd buy it! Cool mod!


----------



## Desdinova

Bought myself a ZL SC62 for my birthday this month. It's my first and I LOVE IT!!! Now I want a SC600, just for the heck of it. Somebody stop me before I buy again! Must resist, must resist, must resist...


----------



## TheBelgian

Desdinova said:


> Bought myself a ZL SC62 for my birthday this month. It's my first and I LOVE IT!!! Now I want a SC600, just for the heck of it. Somebody stop me before I buy again! Must resist, must resist, must resist...



If you're going to buy ZL again I would advice getting the SC52w or any of the headlights instead. The difference between the SC600 and the SC62 is not large enough to warrant getting both. If you go with a headlight, take the Fw option, blissful beam....


----------



## Martin L

I´m in love! The feel to have a Zebra in your hand is... Well, awesome! The quality; like the feel of the anodizing, the rubber button with that crisp click, the perfect anodized threads. I can go on... I only have one Zebra for the moment, but the family is increasing...

My SC52fw is great when i work around the house. The diffused beam is perfection. The tint is even better than my L10 Nichia 219b!!! That say's alot. It is more rosy/warm and very easy to my eyes and most of all totally even in colour from spill to hotspot! The size vs battery life is good, but sometimes I have the thoughts going to the SC600fw, but it´s only up to me to bring an extra 14500 and I am fine for several hours of beatiful light. I could´nt be happier with a head light. This will stay with me forever.

I had a SC52d, but sold it due to the cold spill tint. Hotspot had a nice neutral tint and was quite small/throwy which can be fine, but for EDC I like it a little bit floodier. The large spill size angel was great and convenient (not to detract). It was quite a good thrower in that small size with a 14500, but I had to let it go due to the cold blu-ish spill that coloured the hole output leaning towards cool tinted light. Not my cup of tea....

I hope my incoming SC52w and 62w are fine regarding the big tint issue that everybody talks about... I am a huge Zebralight fan already so I guess I will keep hunting for the good tinted lights and try to sell the others... The UI and size vs performance ratio is hard to beat! They will cover every need you´ll have from close up to medium range. My D40Avn (a pocketable thrower with a descent UI) covers my throwy needs . I have learned that all of my lights must be more or less pocketable otherwise they will turn into shelf queens... Zebralights are all more or less pocketable


----------



## sarge1967

Martin L said:


> I have learned that all of my lights must be more or less pocketable otherwise they will turn into shelf queens... Zebralights are all more or less pocketable


I know how you feel, I don't own near as many lights as most of you folks do but I find that my small LD09 gets 95% of my daily use. My TN12 sits in it's pouch on my EDC bag most of the time. I rarely use the thing. 
Can't wait till I get my sc52w!


----------



## markr6

Desdinova said:


> Bought myself a ZL SC62 for my birthday this month. It's my first and I LOVE IT!!! Now I want a SC600, just for the heck of it. Somebody stop me before I buy again! Must resist, must resist, must resist...





TheBelgian said:


> If you're going to buy ZL again I would advice getting the SC52w or any of the headlights instead. The difference between the SC600 and the SC62 is not large enough to warrant getting both. If you go with a headlight, take the Fw option, blissful beam....



I sort of agree. I have both just becasue I had the SC600w first. I may have purchased the 600 if it came second, but maybe not. They are very close, but if you need that high output for any length of time, say 5+ minutes at a time, the SC600 is a good buy. A decent amout of throw over the SC62 too. And yes, a headlamp is a MUST.


----------



## Desdinova

Thanks. Appreciate the advice. Now I want a SC52 so badly I can taste it!!!


----------



## fnsooner

Martin L said:


> My SC52fw is great when i work around the house. The diffused beam is perfection. The tint is even better than my L10 Nichia 219b!!! That say's alot. It is more rosy/warm and very easy to my eyes and most of all totally even in colour from spill to hotspot!
> :





Interesting that you say that. I have only one flashlight that has any kind of rosy tint to it and that is my H600Fw. It has my favorite tint of all my lights. I wonder if the flood lens has anything to do with the rosieness.


----------



## Desdinova

Good advice. Now I want a SC52 so badly I can taste it!


----------



## Desdinova

Sorry for the double post.


----------



## Desdinova

I'm sold on a SC52 for an EDC, but which one?! CW, W, D, et al? On sure I don't want the "floody" versions, but only owning a single ZL (SC62), and that only for a couple of weeks, I have no other ZL's for tint comparisons. I will say that so far, I'm happy with the tint of my 62 (CW I believe). Any thoughts?


----------



## more_vampires

With the way I feel about Zebralights, you're just going to have to start getting them. I have the "D," you see. I also have a "W."

...it's the addiction you see. (CW,W,D?) :laughing:


----------



## tandem

Derek's triple sure is nice. I'm going to pretend I never saw it and go back to enjoying my SC600 Mk II L2.


----------



## SubLGT

What new flashlights can we expect to see from Zebralight in 2015?


----------



## Tixx

markr6 said:


> I sort of agree. I have both just becasue I had the SC600w first. I may have purchased the 600 if it came second, but maybe not. They are very close, but if you need that high output for any length of time, say 5+ minutes at a time, the SC600 is a good buy. A decent amout of throw over the SC62 too. And yes, a headlamp is a MUST.



Both are great! I did sell my SC600w and replaced it with the SC62w for the reason that the 600 was just not pocketable due to the head diameter.


----------



## Charles L.

Speaking of great Zebralights, and of Zebralight innovation and quality: I find myself looking at Policescannerman's de-domed, Vinhn-massaged SC6330 for sale in the custom lights forum way more than my wallet thinks I should (btw, someone please put me out of my misery and buy this light!). I even researched the Vinhn threads about the light. And came upon this thread -- everyone ZL aficionado should read post 9. Says a lot coming from one of the most respected modders on this forum:

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...6-BREAKING-NEWS-Zebralight-S6330-XM-L2-4500K-)


----------



## sarge1967

Ordered my sc52w today!:twothumbs I am really looking forward to getting this light. It will be used daily in my job.


----------



## ScottJD

Since this is a ZebraLight thread I thought I would ask. 
What good Li-Ion cell protected will work? 
I just received KeepPower 14500 Sanyo 840mAh cells and one won't even allow me to close he tail cap all the way to work. 
The other is so tight I wouldn't trust it once it starts heating up or in the summer when it could expand a little. The spring is %100 compressed and still has a little more gap on the tail cap so it's not completely screwed on. 

So I guess I need to return them and look for other options. 
What protected Li-Ion cells do you run in your SC52W L2 or SC52 L2?


Sent from my iPad using Candlepowerforums


----------



## Phoebus

I've had my SC52 L2 for a couple of days now, and I like it even more than my Olight S15 Baton. The only thing missing are accessories. Does anyone know of any pouches, diffusers, or any othe accessories that will work with the SC52s?


----------



## ScottJD

Good questin about the defuser. I'm thinking I may need to 3D print one to fit. One in red and one in white maybe. 
The only things I've found so far was an optional replacement titanium coated belt clip.
If I find it again I'll post the link for you.

EDIT
i didn't find the belt clip but I remebered it was on banagaloo or some site like that. 
I did find this thread, it has 3 different cases people use, good ideas and a defuser from a Felix light that fit and more. Check this thread out:
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?356918-Zebralight-SC52-way-to-secure-it

I hope this helped. 

EDIT 2: lol
I found the URL. Someone mentioned this one worked on another post either in this site or another site I frequent that I can't mention without an admit editing me. But this is the belt clip alternative:
http://www.banggood.com/Titanium-Alloy-LED-Flashlight-Clip-For-Nitecore-Jetbeam-Niteye-p-89414.html



Phoebus said:


> I've had my SC52 L2 for a couple of days now, and I like it even more than my Olight S15 Baton. The only thing missing are accessories. Does anyone know of any pouches, diffusers, or any othe accessories that will work with the SC52s?


----------



## mihail

I have a SC52w L2, a H32w and a SC62w which arrived two days ago. SC52w is my favourite in terms of tint, but, overall, I like the SC62 more because of the runtime. Except for the H32w, the other two have a rosy tint which is very pleasant for my eyes.


----------



## Desdinova

OK. I just pulled the trigger on a Zebralight sc52w. It will be my second ZL. I guess I'm getting hooked on ZL's. Oh well. I guess it beats drugs.


----------



## djburkes

I just received my SC62 in cool white yesterday. So far, I love it. It is perfect for EDC.


----------



## Outlander

I've bought a H302w, a H52FW, and a SC62w all within the last week.


----------



## oneinthaair

Did a little mod to my SC600 MKII L2

I hate the stock clip that comes with the 600's!

They're ugly and unpractical!

Welcome the...

Titanium Prometheus clip

















Had to open up the center just a hair to clear the lip on the light. It fits flush now. With the O-ring.




The little nub keeps the clip in the perfect place!






Sent from my iPhone using Candlepowerforums


----------



## Martin L

I did recieve my 52w and 62w two weeks ago. Zebralight delivered two units with beautiful tints (or am I a lucky man?). My hunt is over. Zebralight is da poop! I am a real ***** when it comes to tint and the only complain is the purple spill, but otherwise pure perfection. My L10 219b tint is more even from spill to hot spot, but my new Zebra's has a little bit more warmth in their tints due to the extra gold and rosy touch, still very neutral IMO and all the colors really comes to life. This was exactly what I wanted - I couldn´t be happier! . 

By the way. The reflectors are not the same! The 52 has a more textured reflector making the hot spot and corona blends better. The 62 is more light textured, the reflector is more bling bling, which defines the hot spot more and make it throw a little bit better I guess. I can´t find my self reading about this discovery earlier... It is not easy to see on my picture though, but something else in real life.


----------



## Airmanb

I received an H600w MKII recently to replace my old one, also an H600w MKII, that I preordered and got right when it came out and there was a significant difference in tint. One was slightly yellow and the new one is perfect creamy white! I mean perfect! For me anyway. I was blown away! I also noticed that the rubber is a little bit softer than the old one and the anodizing is lighter. My old one had a slight bug in the UI where it would just stop functioning until I waited a second and so far after repeatedly trying to replicate the issue I am unable to with the new Zebralight! I think Zebralight is really stepping up there QC game!


----------



## more_vampires

Zebralight: I've never RMA'ed one.


----------



## Fireclaw18

I think Zebralight changed the tints on their neutrals a year or two ago. My SC52w (early model) looks like it has 4C tint, but my newer SC62w looks like it has the much better 4D tint. 

I don't own one, but pictures of the SC52w L2 also looks like it has the 4D tint.

The 4C tint is very yellow. The 4D tint is slightly rosy, much more like a Nichia 219A. Colors tend to look much better with 4D tint even though both are around the same color temperature.


----------



## markr6

Fireclaw18 said:


> I think Zebralight changed the tints on their neutrals a year or two ago. My SC52w (early model) looks like it has 4C tint, but my newer SC62w looks like it has the much better 4D tint.
> 
> I don't own one, but pictures of the SC52w L2 also looks like it has the 4D tint.
> 
> The 4C tint is very yellow. The 4D tint is slightly rosy, much more like a Nichia 219A. Colors tend to look much better with 4D tint even though both are around the same color temperature.



Personally I think they're getting random grab bags. Kind of like the plain brown bag at the grocery store for $5 filled with surprises. Mysterious and exciting until you open it


----------



## davehutch

Almost decided...but not quite :mecry:
I was originally thinking about a Thrunite TN12 but I was never "excited" aout it for some reason, then I found ZL :wave:
I have large hands so I can see a benefit to the SC600W MkII L2, but I can also see an advantage to having a smaller light that pretty much does the same thing...the SC62W.
Any last minute advice for me before I just toss a coin?


----------



## Swede74

davehutch said:


> Any last minute advice for me before I just toss a coin?



I would take the pocket clip into consideration. On the SC62 it is securely attached to the light with two screws. The clip-on style clip on the SC600 on the other hand, while not flimsy or of poor quality, could come off so if a dependable clip is important to you, the SC62 seems like the logical choice.

If you plan to use the light on the high output modes for extended periods of times, I would suggest the SC600 which with its larger mass should have better heat dissipation properties. 

I guess I'm not making things easier for you


----------



## oneinthaair

Check out a few post up^^^^ I added a Prometheus Ti clip to my SC600. That was the only complaint I had with the light.


Sent from my iPhone using Candlepowerforums


----------



## C.M.S

I think my next ZL is going to be the new SC32w , was going to get the Olight S-10 L2 , but for basically 20 bucks more the ZL is a no brainer to me . Love ZL's UI & build quality / anodizing .


----------



## davehutch

Swede74 said:


> I would take the pocket clip into consideration. On the SC62 it is securely attached to the light with two screws. The clip-on style clip on the SC600 on the other hand, while not flimsy or of poor quality, could come off so if a dependable clip is important to you, the SC62 seems like the logical choice.
> 
> If you plan to use the light on the high output modes for extended periods of times, I would suggest the SC600 which with its larger mass should have better heat dissipation properties.
> 
> I guess I'm not making things easier for you



Both good points actually and I had thought about that. I'd probably pocket carry (jacket) and note that you can attach a lanyard to the 600, but not to the 62, so swings and roundabouts really.
Am I reading it right, or did the SC62 perform at max output for longer than the SC600 in selfbuilt's review? Is it simply because max is slightly lower on the 62?


----------



## C.M.S

davehutch said:


> Both good points actually and I had thought about that. I'd probably pocket carry (jacket) and note that you can attach a lanyard to the 600, but not to the 62, so swings and roundabouts really.
> Am I reading it right, or did the SC62 perform at max output for longer than the SC600 in selfbuilt's review? Is it simply because max is slightly lower on the 62?



I'm sure runtime is minimal between the two , I have the SC600 and feels great in my large hands btw .
is throw important to you ? If so go with the 600 , the throw is really good IMO .


----------



## Swede74

davehutch said:


> Am I reading it right, or did the SC62 perform at max output for longer than the SC600 in selfbuilt's review? Is it simply because max is slightly lower on the 62?



From Selfbuit's review:


selfbuilt said:


> My non-cooled SC600-II showed a less dramatic (and rapid) reduction in output, compare to the non-cooled SC62 runtime above. Again, I suspect this is due to the lower thermal mass for heatsinking available on the SC62. :shrug:



I think it has to do with both the slightly lower output, and the SC600's ability to sustain max output longer.
To clarify what I meant: If they had started at the exact same output level, say 1000 lm, the SC62 would have stayed in H1 longer, but the SC600 would have been brighter.


----------



## davehutch

oneinthaair said:


> Check out a few post up^^^^ I added a Prometheus Ti clip to my SC600. That was the only complaint I had with the light.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Candlepowerforums



Nice! And you can still have a lanyard if necessary ��

OK, just ordered the SC600W MKII L2.
Now for a charger and a pair of batteries...

Have gone for a pair of Xtar 3400mAh (panasonic protected) and a Nitecore UM10 for flexibility


----------



## Swedpat

Time to wake up this thread after more than a years sleep!

Since several years I have two Zebralight headlamps: H501w and H501r. During a few years I have considered to get an SC52w as well. At the beginning of this year I decided to pull the trigger. But then I saw that a new SC5 had been released. So I ordered an SC5w(the same order included an Eagletac MX25L3C Nichia 219). The satisfaction of the SC5w resulted in another order next month of an H52w and SC52w. 
Then I saw that Zebralight also released newer mule version after my H501w: H502w. With much more modes and much brighter. I recall that while I really like H501w I have often find it a bit under powered, except from the high mode. 15lm mid mode is often a bit dim, while 85lm is fully adequate but means too short runtime. The new H502w has among other levels 25 and 50lm and much better runtime at 100lm than H501w at 85lm. 
I placed an order again, the third within three months: this time not only of an H502w but also an SC52d(it was at sale).

At this moment I consequently own seven Zebralight AA lights. And I LOVE them! Zebralight probably offers the finest 1AA lights and headlamps at the market! If it's of interest I can tell that H502w definitely is an improvement compared to H501w: the beam is as well wider and brighter(and yes; much lower too). The tint of my H502w is cooler than H501w. And while I often found the 15lm level of H501w too dim, the 50lm level of H502w is adequate. 
While SC52 and SC5 have similar beams the LUXEON T emitter of SC52d is smaller and provides a smaller hotspot with better throw than the other. The tint is cooler but still neutral.

Here is a picture of my current Zebralight collection(apologize for the bad image quality, don't know why it's so bad. The original is much better):


----------



## KeepingItLight

You could start a ZebraLight showroom. I love it!


----------



## Fireclaw18

I love Zebralights and over the years have owned a bunch. I have had some QA problems with my Zebralights, but perhaps this isn't surprising as I tend to get first-run preorders. Over the years I have had the following:

LightWhat I likedWhat I didn'tSC51my first Zebralight. Great size and nice UI. My first quality e-switch light.
Super slippery body, easy to accidentally turn-on button, and greenish tint. Clip mount gets in the way after "clipectomy" performed.SC52even smaller than SC51. Much better button with much less chance of accidental activation.
Greenish tint. Slippery body. Clip mount gets in the way after "clipectomy" performed.SC80Finally a small Zebralight with grip!Seemed a bit bigger and heavier than needed for the size battery used though. Also my light had a QA issue where H2 didn't work. All other modes worked fine except H2 (light would blink and then turn off if cycled to H2).SC52wJust like the SC52, but with neutral yellowish tint.QA issue: Mine tended not to stay in 500 lumen turbo more than 30 seconds though even on a fresh 14500.SC600Great light. Nice grip in handToo large for pocket EDC. Greenish tint. My early preorder had a QA issue with a defective switch. Was fixed via warranty repair.SC62wnice output and perfect tint with no hint of green. Nice size.Slippery body. QA issue in that wouldn't stay in turbo for more than 5 seconds. Returned for replacement which mostly fixed the problem, but still doesn't stay in turbo as long as it is supposed to.SC32wPerfect tint. Much better tint than my SC52w.Light is almost too small. QA issue: Same problem as my SC62w... won't stay in turbo more than 15 seconds even on a fresh quality 16340. As a result, I consider this light too unreliable to EDC.SC5w
Great grip. Great tint.
Heavy with a thicker than needed battery tube. No 14500 support. Serious QA issue: After 1 month of use, max output declined from 500 lumens to approximately 25 lumens. All modes continue to work, just turbo is now around 25 lumens making this light useless for EDC until repaired.
SC63wnice size, perfect tint, no QA issues.
Super-slippery body in need of knurling. Ramps down relatively fast due to heat. Clip mount gets in the way when clip is removed (problem common to all Zebras with the screw-in clip)SC600w III HIPerfect in every way and my favorite Zebralight. Feels like a million bucks in the hand, small enough to EDC, great throw, perfect tint, zero QA issues, can run in turbo mode indefinitely. Very little ramp-down due to heat even when left tailstanding on turbo.Lanyard ring digs into the bottom of the hand. However, this is forgivable as the ring also serves as an antri-roll device.


----------



## markr6

^ I agree about the SC600w III HI...my favorite! Some anodizing issues on mine, but not a big deal.


----------



## Flint Hills

I'm late to the party but I just got my first Zebralight, an SC52W L2. I love it so far!

One question. When you double click to go straight to medium mode, is it supposed to flash on high for a split second before going to medium? It's not a big deal but having High set to 280 and medium set to 25 it's a noticeable bright flash.


----------



## recDNA

Yup it does


----------



## tops2

Flint Hills said:


> I'm late to the party but I just got my first Zebralight, an SC52W L2. I love it so far!
> 
> One question. When you double click to go straight to medium mode, is it supposed to flash on high for a split second before going to medium? It's not a big deal but having High set to 280 and medium set to 25 it's a noticeable bright flash.



The way I get around the pre flash is press and hold from off to cycle to medium..


----------



## jondextan

I have the SC52w (none L2), does it have a strobe mode?


----------



## swan

Lost my zl sc600mk 3 - naturally i ordered another one in cw again.

I noticed this one was slightly down on output and has a much more aggressive pid stepdown, with the output dropping a lot quicker on h1.

So i had a crack at changing the pid setting to the highest +5 degrees c setting. It worked and now its holds its lux on h1 much longer getting a little hotter of course but is also a little brighter than before and matchs my first one. I never adjusted the pid on the first one so it makes me wonder why this one was set on low.


----------



## GunnarGG

jondextan said:


> I have the SC52w (none L2), does it have a strobe mode?



You can program H2 to strobe.
Then you access the strobe with a doubleclick from H1.


----------



## jondextan

Appreciate it!


----------



## CreeCrazy

Zebralight is by far my favorite flashlight manufacturer. I have 10 now I believe. I need to get them all together for a family picture. I Had all the newest versions and just today sold the SC600w MKIII as I still have the HI version. I wish they would release the HI version in CW. Can't recommend them enough.


----------



## wolfgaze

Has anyone ever placed an order on the Zebralight website while the item in question was backordered? I'm just curious how they process that order - will they wait until the item comes back into stock and then only charge you once it ships? I want to order an SC5w (back ordered) and a spare pocket clip (in stock)...

Thanks...


----------



## Brasso

That's pretty much how they do it. 

I'm contemplating ordering the SC5w also. I'm not sure why they call it a Warm tint though. 4400k is clearly in the neutral camp, bordering on cool.


I find it odd that they offer an SC5fc, but not an SC5c. The only difference being the lens. I'm going to cross my fingers and hope they release an SC5c for just a bit before I order.


----------



## KeepingItLight

Brasso said:


> I find it odd that they offer an SC5fc, but not an SC5c.



The *ZebraLight SC5Fc* uses a Cree XM-L2 EasyWhite emitter that is rated by ZebraLight for "Typical CRI: 83-85, Nominal CCT 4000K." 

If you check the Cree datasheet for this emitter, you will see that it uses four LEDs mounted side-by-side. The four LEDs have small gaps that run between them. Without a frosted lens to blur the beam, you would probably see a dark doughnut hole or dark cross in the hot spot when using the beam at short distances.


----------



## Brasso

So it's basically an updated MCE. 

I guess I won't wait.


----------



## KeepingItLight

Yeah. I don't have the *ZebraLight SC5Fc*, but on paper it looks to have decent output and a nice floody beam. The one I am waiting for is the *ZebraLight SC600Fd Mk. III Plus*. It is slated to offer the high output of a Cree XHP50 emitter, together with a CCT of 5000K and a CRI of 93-95 Ra.


----------



## snowlover91

Wolfgaze, when placing an order on ZL's website for something they will charge the card even if the item is back ordered then ship it as soon as a shipment arrives. 

I have a SC5fd and it's a great little light. I wouldn't recommend it for outdoors but inside around the house it's a great light. My wife actually has mine now and uses it for reading all the time at night or riding in the car. It's a well balanced light with a very diffuse and floody beam. I imagine the SC5fc would be similar just warmer.


----------



## Denny Francisco

*Is there somebody with only Zebralights?*



Romanko said:


> I just wonder, if there somebody who has only zebralights?



That would be me! 

I love cave exploring, night cycling, and night sailing. Yeah, I hear ya, am I some kind of nocturnal nut? Yes, these activities involve the need and appreciation for good flashlights. 

And Zebralights are most impressive. Over the years I have purchased more than 5 models and they just keep improving them! I started out purchasing some AA lights. 
The latest, the Zebralight SC5, puts out 535 lumens, is super compact, nice user interface, and built solidly. So I got rid of all the other AA lights. They're history! 

Then I got a focused beam headlight...and Zebralight makes the best UI, the most compact, and the brightest headlights, period! 

For cycling I got a SC600 and was wowed by 750 L, perfect beam, waterproof, compact size, and high efficiency. What could beat that? The SC 62! It is the most compact(less than 4" long!)
18650 battery light, puts a 1000 L perfect beam on the pavement, will burn for 2.5 hours at 620 L, and, having a spare rechargeable battery, I always have light! I even have a
6 watt solar panel on the back of my bike when touring that charges the 18650 battery during the day so I always have light at night when camping. Zebralights are ultracompact, 
built seamlessly, perform to specs, and have such a large range of brightness and burn times, there's no reason to be stuck in the dark. For some years I purchased a lot of Fenix and other brand 
flashlights. But you know what? My Zebralight SC62 is SO perfect for my needs, a marvel of brightness, size, and convenience, that I need no other flashlight! A small strip of 1" elastic 
and velcro allows me to mount it on top of a vent hole in my bike helmet for the best and lightest bike light for the money. And it fits into any pocket! Unlike bike headlights with self-contained batteries, I can simply 
pop in a spare 18650 battery whenever and wherever I need light.

Okay, confession, I DO have a second flashlight...a Blackwater Kite Ti that fits on my keychain, puts out 140 lumens, is a miniscule 1.7" long, and has a built-in micro USB charging port. Holy Candlepower!


Denny Francisco [email protected]


----------



## wolfgaze

Brasso said:


> I'm contemplating ordering the SC5w also.



I placed my order tonight... This will be my first ZL... I'm looking forward to configuring the outputs to my liking...


----------



## snowlover91

wolfgaze said:


> I placed my order tonight... This will be my first ZL... I'm looking forward to configuring the outputs to my liking...



Let us know when it ships, I think you'll be impressed with it! They're built like a tank and extremely durable too. I've dropped mine multiple times on concrete with no issues whatsoever. The anodizing ZL uses is much more durable than other lights.


----------



## wolfgaze

snowlover91 said:


> Let us know when it ships, I think you'll be impressed with it! They're built like a tank and extremely durable too. I've dropped mine multiple times on concrete with no issues whatsoever. The anodizing ZL uses is much more durable than other lights.



I had emailed ZL prior to placing my order and got an estimate of 5 - 10 business days before they would be back in stock...

Thanks for the heads up regarding the build quality... 

Looking forward to adding a high quality *AA* light to my collection.... Only other AA lights I own are the Fenix LD12 and (2) Fenix E12's (the latter two I'm thinking about giving away to my nephews)... 

I have to say that I'm not huge fan of the aesthetic design of many of the Zebralight models, however I do like the unique design of the SC5 and the combination of its compact size, advanced *UI*, build quality, and the neutral tint & good beam profile - well it wasn't hard deciding to acquire this light.... I just needed to figure out how to remedy the pocket clip stiffness and I got that issue remedied due to the feedback from you and another user in the SC5 thread....


----------



## markr6

We've definitely been back in the "nothing in stock" mode for awhile now. Not that I'm waiting on anything, but I hope that changes.


----------



## TheRealSpinner

wolfgaze said:


> Has anyone ever placed an order on the Zebralight website while the item in question was backordered? I'm just curious how they process that order - will they wait until the item comes back into stock and then only charge you once it ships?...



I ordered an SC600w and an SC600 HI 2 weeks ago (along with a couple of the batteries Zebralight sells), didn't realize the HI was backordered until somebody in this site mentioned it. Zebralight charged me for the entire order WHEN I placed the order. After I found it the HI was backordered, I emailed them asking about availability; they responded by telling me that it would ship out in about 2 weeks, and if I wanted, I could cancel the order amd receive a refund.

Tomorrow is 2 weeks from the email response (which was a few days after the order was placed). I'll let you know when I get a shipping notice. :hairpull:


----------



## snowlover91

Yeah they charge you once the item is ordered and ship it within a few days if it's in stock or a few weeks if it's back ordered. It's worth the wait though, once you get the light you'll understand why ZL is so popular on here.


----------



## recDNA

KeepingItLight said:


> Yeah. I don't have the *ZebraLight SC5Fc*, but on paper it looks to have decent output and a nice floody beam. The one I am waiting for is the *ZebraLight SC600Fd Mk. III Plus*. It is slated to offer the high output of a Cree XHP50 emitter, together with a CCT of 5000K and a CRI of 93-95 Ra.


Oh yeah. There will be a wait in this one.


----------



## CreeCrazy

Figured I'd throw up a family photo of my ZL's


----------



## tops2

CreeCrazy said:


> Figured I'd throw up a family photo of my ZL's



Hi CreeCrazy, can you list which ones these are? I think I can tell the SC52w, SC5w, SC63w and SC600 (not sure which version). I did click on the full pic but can't quite read the labels, and not sure if there's some repeats (but with different tints)?

Otherwise, awesome family of Zebralights!


----------



## Swede74

CreeCrazy, is the one in the middle a H52 (early version)?


----------



## noboneshotdog

I have the SC600 MKII and often use it on its side at work. I really appreciate the flat spots of the head that keep if from rolling. I am afraid I may regret upgrading to the MKIII if my light is constantly rolling away on me. Can anyone vouge for the anti-roll ability of the MKIII? I particularly use the head of the MKII on all sorts of uneven surfaces. I am a plumbing and heating tech by trade.

Does the indent of the button provide any anti-roll?


----------



## BudmanNC

The cut out for the button gives it an anti-roll spot.


----------



## Random Dan

I ordered an SC52w on Saturday. Since everything was back ordered I was prepared to wait it out for a few weeks. Just got the email that it shipped! Some companies don't even ship in-stock items that fast. Thanks Zebralight!


----------



## wolfgaze

Random Dan said:


> I ordered an SC52w on Saturday. Since everything was back ordered I was prepared to wait it out for a few weeks. Just got the email that it shipped! Some companies don't even ship in-stock items that fast. Thanks Zebralight!



Hoping to receive an email shipment confirmation regarding my SC5w order I placed late last week....


----------



## Brasso

I ordered an sc5w 5 days ago.

As of today, most online vendors now show this item in stock. However, I also have not received a shipping notice from Zebralight yet.

Hopefully soon.


----------



## snowlover91

noboneshotdog said:


> I have the SC600 MKII and often use it on its side at work. I really appreciate the flat spots of the head that keep if from rolling. I am afraid I may regret upgrading to the MKIII if my light is constantly rolling away on me. Can anyone vouge for the anti-roll ability of the MKIII? I particularly use the head of the MKII on all sorts of uneven surfaces. I am a plumbing and heating tech by trade.
> 
> Does the indent of the button provide any anti-roll?



It does give it some anti-roll and the clip also gives a nice anti-roll.


----------



## eraursls1984

CreeCrazy said:


> Figured I'd throw up a family photo of my ZL's





tops2 said:


> Hi CreeCrazy, can you list which ones these are? I think I can tell the SC52w, SC5w, SC63w and SC600 (not sure which version). I did click on the full pic but can't quite read the labels, and not sure if there's some repeats (but with different tints)?
> 
> Otherwise, awesome family of Zebralights!


SC52w, SC63w, SC600w MKIII, SC62, H51, SC600w MKII, SC600 MKIII (HI?), SC63, SC5w


----------



## wolfgaze

Brasso said:


> I ordered an sc5w 5 days ago.
> 
> As of today, most online vendors now show this item in stock. However, I also have not received a shipping notice from Zebralight yet.
> 
> Hopefully soon.



Brasso any word yet on your order?


----------



## Brasso

I left a message with Zebralight and they responded that any orders placed now would be filled in 3 days. So I'm going to wait 3 days and see what happens.


----------



## Raoh

CreeCrazy said:


> Figured I'd throw up a family photo of my ZL's




Great collection!


----------



## wolfgaze

Thanks for the info....


----------



## GaryRanson

I placed an order April 29 for a SC600w Mk III HI and SC5w and received a shipping notice May 2.


----------



## wolfgaze

Brasso, I received my shipment confirmation & tracking # today... I presume you did as well...


----------



## Brasso

I did. 

Now the anticipatory wait.


----------



## TA_ls1

GaryRanson said:


> I placed an order April 29 for a SC600w Mk III HI and SC5w and received a shipping notice May 2.



Was this shipping notice just for your SC5w or the MH III HI too? I'm wondering because I ordered my MK III HI on 4/25 and it hasn't shipped yet.


----------



## GaryRanson

TA_ls1 said:


> Was this shipping notice just for your SC5w or the MH III HI too? I'm wondering because I ordered my MK III HI on 4/25 and it hasn't shipped yet.



Both items shipped and I just received notification that the SC5w is back in stock.


----------



## TA_ls1

Ok, thanks


----------



## markr6

More models back in stock, still no HI though.


----------



## Random Dan

My SC52w arrived yesterday and so far I'm loving it. I'm not nearly as picky about tints as many on here but to me the tint is perfect. I still haven't been able to reprogram the sublevels. Is there a trick to getting the clicks right?


----------



## markr6

Random Dan said:


> Is there a trick to getting the clicks right?



Not really. Just make sure it's on for a few seconds, then start the double clicking. Doesn't have to be that fast, just consistent.


----------



## Brasso

On each level, you have to be in the low mode of that level to start. Then make 6 rapid clicks.....and just keep going. After 6 clicks you should see the output ramping from low to high within that level. When you get the output you want just turn it off. You can only program the lower level of each mode. The high in each level is set and cannot be altered.


----------



## TheRealSpinner

TA_ls1 said:


> Was this shipping notice just for your SC5w or the MH III HI too? I'm wondering because I ordered my MK III HI on 4/25 and it hasn't shipped yet.



I ordered my SC600w MK III HI on 4/18, and they still haven't shipped it yet. Monday will be 3 weeks, and they originally told me 2 weeks. Starting to get a bit impatient.


----------



## roger-roger

First post, and glad to have found a more or less active ZL thread.

Ordered an SC62w on 5/3, which was labeled as "in stock". By 5/4 it was in possession of the USPS and on the move. Latest update shows it *should* arrive tomorrow. 

I'm currently in the process of completely updating a torch collection of a Fenix E35 and PD100. Had a Malkoff 6P that turned up missing about a year ago.

We live is a modest hurricane zone, so the plan is to have 4 lights based on the CR123A. Received a Fenix E15 a couple days ago. Will be ordering a ZL H32 cool white head lamp as soon as available. SC32 is also on the list.

There is also the Fenix E35, which I have no qualms using with stacked CR123A, if the electricity were go out for more than a couple days.

Oh yeah, for bedside use will also be ordering an SC600 MKIII hopefully, next week. Not sure whether it will be neutral or cool white. Need to do a quick evaluation of the SC62w first.


----------



## roger-roger

(P.S. Still having my posts moderated.) 

Can anyone vet online ZL source BrightGuy, or should I stick with ZebraLight?


----------



## tops2

roger-roger said:


> (P.S. Still having my posts moderated.)
> 
> Can anyone vet online ZL source BrightGuy, or should I stick with ZebraLight?



I ordered my SC5w from them over last Christmas and it arrived pretty quick!


----------



## TA_ls1

TheRealSpinner said:


> I ordered my SC600w MK III HI on 4/18, and they still haven't shipped it yet. Monday will be 3 weeks, and they originally told me 2 weeks. Starting to get a bit impatient.



I would assume we will get a light from the same batch hopefully, and soon. They told me 2 weeks when I ordered mine on 4/26, so I hope they ship this upcoming week. It will be worth the wait I bet.


----------



## Flint Hills

roger-roger said:


> (P.S. Still having my posts moderated.)
> 
> Can anyone vet online ZL source BrightGuy, or should I stick with ZebraLight?



I called them with a question, very nice on the phone. Then ordered a Zebralight and had great service and quick shipping. I would definitely do business with them again!


----------



## Flint Hills

Does anyone has the sc5fc? I saw a good review on the sc5fd but I'm interested in the warmer fc. Though I'm sure I'd be happy with either.

Can someone comment on the size of the sc5 vs the sc52? I have and love an sc52w l2 and it's about at the top of size and weight I want to pocket carry. I worry the sc5 will be a tad big/heavy.

I really wish they would make an sc52fc or fd!


----------



## wolfgaze

Flint Hills said:


> Can someone comment on the size of the sc5 vs the sc52?



If you go to Youtube and search *Zebralight SC5*, the reviews near the top from *CPFSelfbuilt* and *WeAllJuggleKnives* show the size comparison between the SC5 and SC52....


----------



## Brasso

Anyone know if they're planning an H5 headlamp?


----------



## roger-roger

No joy on the arrival of the SC62w--hopefully Mon. 

I'll have to say the more I read of others' experiences, the more nervous I get about whether I'll be happy with the color tone on the particular SC600w MKIII I receive. Cool white is the safer bet, but it wouldn't be my first choice all things considered.


----------



## Brasso

I must say that I am very happy with my SC5w. This may very well be the best zebralight they've ever made.

Zebralight, if you're listening.....A 2xAA version of this would be awesome.


----------



## Random Dan

The more I use my SC52w the more convinced I am that it is the perfect EDC light for me. I'm gonna be spending my summer working in the backcountry at Philmont Scout Ranch and I think I'll be taking my SC52w and H502pr as my light sources. They're super light and AAs are easy to scavenge if necessary.


----------



## haushine

TheRealSpinner said:


> I ordered my SC600w MK III HI on 4/18, and they still haven't shipped it yet. Monday will be 3 weeks, and they originally told me 2 weeks. Starting to get a bit impatient.



On pins and needles but worth the wait


----------



## wolfgaze

Brasso said:


> I must say that I am very happy with my SC5w. This may very well be the best zebralight they've ever made.



I haven't received mine yet.. Hopefully tomorrow...

Glad to hear you're enjoying yours...


----------



## Onthebrightside

Do zebra lights have a zebra paint scheme or is that just a rumor?


----------



## Brasso

Onthebrightside said:


> Do zebra lights have a zebra paint scheme or is that just a rumor?



Seriously?

They're HA green. They've never been any other color.


----------



## recDNA

Brasso said:


> I must say that I am very happy with my SC5w. This may very well be the best zebralight they've ever made.
> 
> Zebralight, if you're listening.....A 2xAA version of this would be awesome.


Very good point. A 2 x AA version would really be easier to handle than my sc32w.


----------



## roger-roger

Brasso said:


> I must say that I am very happy with my SC5w. This may very well be the best zebralight they've ever made.
> 
> Zebralight, if you're listening.....A 2xAA version of this would be awesome.




In comparison to the SC62 it would be about 1.25" longer, and about the same thickness. It would still be outclassed in terms of light performance.

That would be a configuration I'd be interested in. It's advantage for my personal needs would be its ability to use primary AA's, in situations where that would be useful.


----------



## markr6

I thinned out my Zebralight herd. Actually, the SC5w OP went to roger-roger above. He's in for a real treat; that tint was he best of the best! But I just didn't use it since I'm pretty much an 18650 user exclusively. Also sold my SC600w II L2 to make room for the upcoming SC600 Plus, but that could have been a mistake...we'll see. And the MKIII HI is just so impressive, I use that for just about every application I can think of. GET IT IF YOU DON'T HAVE IT.


----------



## Brasso

18650 lights are great for around the house when a recharger is readily available, but there are many situations where a AA battery source is more convenient. I like to have both.


----------



## markr6

Brasso said:


> 18650 lights are great for around the house when a recharger is readily available, but there are many situations where a AA battery source is more convenient. I like to have both.



I thought this, but after a couple years I just haven't ran into a single need other than running with my H52w. I understand everyone is different though. I use the same philosophy when backpacking...if there's something I don't use after a long time, it's out (except emergency, first aid, of course)

I always carry a small, single 18650 charger with me. At 1amp, it can get the job done pretty quick.


----------



## roger-roger

Shipping notices in. This would be for an SC600w MKIII and H32Fw (shipping label created), and an SC62w (out for delivery).


----------



## roger-roger

The SC62w in my possession checks out fine as far as I can tell--both aesthetically and for the short term, functionally.

Relying on selfbuilt's review I've been able to master the basic functions, including a reliable switch on to Low. The *tactile* and especially *audible* characteristics of the switch help much for the latter, as I use rhythm/tempo of the downstroke/upstroke of the click to complete the .6 sec hold into Low. 

No doubt I'll have to relearn the timing to switch into Low when I come back to the SC62W tonight and for a while after, but its muscle memory and beat timing. With enough use it can become instinctual.

So right now I can easily get into Low/Medium/High, and what I think are two of their sub-levels (hopefully the right term). Strobe and its four sub-levels, and battery test.

I have an idea, but still not completely sure which of what I'm getting below--yet.



> High: H1 1000 Lm (PID, approx 2 hr) or H2 620 Lm (PID, approx 2.5 hrs) / 350 Lm (3.9 hrs) / 160 Lm (11 hrs) - Medium: M1 70 Lm (30 hrs) or M2 32 Lm (66 hrs) / 12 Lm (172 hrs) - Low: L1 3.7 Lm (16 days) or L2 0.4 Lm (2.5 months) / 0.06 Lm (4.6 months) / 0.01 Lm (5.5 months)





At this point from where I'm standing experience-wise (zilch) with ZL, this SC62w has set the bar pretty high for my expectations of the four other ZebraLights I have coming in. :O)


----------



## recDNA

I have such an itchy trigger finger to go for the Mark III 5700k model. My lab is about 11m x 11m and I wonder if it would brightly light the entire area. The sc62w looks kind of dim in such a big space even on H1. It is good enough but not dazzling. 

I feel like the fool, however, with a HI CRI model due this fall that may blow away the Mark III... But I have an itchy trigger finger!


----------



## snowlover91

recDNA said:


> I have such an itchy trigger finger to go for the Mark III 5700k model. My lab is about 11m x 11m and I wonder if it would brightly light the entire area. The sc62w looks kind of dim in such a big space even on H1. It is good enough but not dazzling.
> 
> I feel like the fool, however, with a HI CRI model due this fall that may blow away the Mark III... But I have an itchy trigger finger!



Why not the MK3 HI version? It'll have a little warmer tint and extra throw! Waiting for the next ZL to come out is agonizing, I'm hoping they don't have any delays!


----------



## recDNA

snowlover91 said:


> Why not the MK3 HI version? It'll have a little warmer tint and extra throw! Waiting for the next ZL to come out is agonizing, I'm hoping they don't have any delays!


Don't want throw in the lab. Want room illumination not a spot. I have an MH20GT in my jacket for throw. I might be better off with a triple Sinner but the ZL is a lot cheaper.

I actually like 5700k. It is a lot warmer than our fluorescent lighting. I just don't know if the difference between the MKIII and the 62w will be that noticeable unless you try one immediately after the other.


----------



## wolfgaze

Received my SC5w yesterday. Quite pleased with it... Great build quality, excellent tint & beam profile.. I really like the Zebralight UI... I've got my High mode set to the lowest 107 lumen sublevel to extend battery life - and I like that I can easily switch to the highest output mode with a simple double-click... The default Medium mode (45 lumens) is sufficient for most applications and there is a long runtime (8 hours) in this mode which is great...


----------



## low

Being this is the Official Zebrahead Thread, I have some official business from them that I will share with you. Before I learned of the SC600Fd lll coming out, I purchased a SC52d and a SC52w. (2-6-16) I got the SC52d, but the SC52w was not delivered even though the tracking said it was delivered. Well, it appears that Zeb will reship the lost flashlight and the ride along 14500 battery! I have always ordered from Zeb themselves (except for the SC62d that I just got from going gear) and I see that will not change due to there fine customer service.


----------



## Equitymind

recDNA said:


> I have such an itchy trigger finger to go for the Mark III 5700k model. My lab is about 11m x 11m and I wonder if it would brightly light the entire area. The sc62w looks kind of dim in such a big space even on H1. It is good enough but not dazzling.
> 
> I feel like the fool, however, with a HI CRI model due this fall that may blow away the Mark III... But I have an itchy trigger finger!



I have the Mark III 5700K model and its downright neutral compared to most of my Nitecores in cool white. It is extremely bright and with the adjustable step down will last me quite awhile. It is still my go-to light in most situation. The S63w is my newest light and my EDC but I complement the floodiness of that beam by also carrying my Mark III at night. It will more than light up a 11X11 room in my opinion and surprisingly well. The HI will be my next purchase so it will be interesting to compare the brightness of the Mark III vs the throw (but lower lumens) of the HI.

I'd be curious if anyone has those two and could speak towards that.


----------



## recDNA

Equitymind said:


> I have the Mark III 5700K model and its downright neutral compared to most of my Nitecores in cool white. It is extremely bright and with the adjustable step down will last me quite awhile. It is still my go-to light in most situation. The S63w is my newest light and my EDC but I complement the floodiness of that beam by also carrying my Mark III at night. It will more than light up a 11X11 room in my opinion and surprisingly well. The HI will be my next purchase so it will be interesting to compare the brightness of the Mark III vs the throw (but lower lumens) of the HI.
> 
> I'd be curious if anyone has those two and could speak towards that.


I heard the 63 heats up quickly and is similar to my 62w so I think I will skip that one. Since I have the MH20GT I have no need of the mkIII hi. I also don't like to order items not in stock. There was a time I would just buy every one and sell the ones I liked least but I sold faster with no fee back in cpfmp. Now I would have to discount an item since it is used then pay a fee and pay shipping so selling isn't very attractive.


----------



## Brasso

Agreed. I have several I'd like to sell to fund a sc600 but it's just too much trouble and money anymore.


----------



## roger-roger

Received two brand new ZL's yesterday-- an SC600w MK III, and an SC600 L2 MK II. Both in top shape aesthetically, the MK III with the familiar knock/rattle just like in the video. That with the proper red battery from ZebraLights. Pretty sure I can live with it.

Anyway two lights enter, one light leaves. I'll know by this weekend which I'll keep and which goes on the block. I'm leaning to keeping the MK III, but not sure yet.


----------



## recDNA

Many people recommend applying shrink wrap but that is too much trouble for me. Would wrapping black electrical tape around the battery do the trick?


----------



## markr6

recDNA said:


> Many people recommend applying shrink wrap but that is too much trouble for me. Would wrapping black electrical tape around the battery do the trick?



Yes, but all the way around could be too thick...you'll need to try. I've even been so lazy to wrap it in part of a Post It note and that works too.


----------



## recDNA

Ya I guess if battery is hot enough to ignite paper it has already exploded.


----------



## markr6

recDNA said:


> Ya I guess if battery is hot enough to ignite paper it has already exploded.



Just for fun I laid a single layer (1 ply) of toilet paper directly on my SC63 lens for several minutes on H1. If that didn't ignite, there's no way a battery would come close. And like you said if it did, you got some major problems inside that nearly air-tight tube!


----------



## TA_ls1

I used pvc shrink wrap from illumn.com to fix battery rattle in my sc62w. It only costed 1.00 and I was nervous, but it was so easy! Just trim a little off if you have to and it slides right on the battery. 30 sec to a min later with a blow dryer and you're good to go, it really helped stop the rattle.


----------



## markr6

TA_ls1 said:


> I used pvc shrink wrap from illumn.com to fix battery rattle in my sc62w. It only costed 1.00 and I was nervous, but it was so easy! Just trim a little off if you have to and it slides right on the battery. 30 sec to a min later with a blow dryer and you're good to go, it really helped stop the rattle.



Those are my first choice. Perfect fit!


----------



## recDNA

Postit sounds easier. If I buy a markIII I will try a postit.


----------



## markr6

recDNA said:


> Postit sounds easier. If I buy a markIII I will try a postit.



BTW, almost anything would work. I just used the post it since the sticky part helped keep it aligned while I wrapped it around.


----------



## wolfgaze

I'm enjoying the beam tint on the SC5w so much I don't know if I'll ever be able to purchase another cool-white LED again....


----------



## roger-roger

Just shrink wrapped the Panasonic/Sanyo NCR18650 GA from ZL, and its reduced the rattle on the SC600w MK III to a muffled sound. Imo very acceptable. 

I'm loving the tint. Not going to do any side-by-sides. As a working light, as opposed to a collectible and not that I'll "work" with it, but if I like what I see then that's fair enough. Need to avoid the search for known deficiencies and/or faults, and just use it as a tool.


----------



## stolnik

low said:


> Being this is the Official Zebrahead Thread, I have some official business from them that I will share with you. Before I learned of the SC600Fd lll coming out, I purchased a SC52d and a SC52w. (2-6-16) I got the SC52d, but the SC52w was not delivered even though the tracking said it was delivered. Well, it appears that Zeb will reship the lost flashlight and the ride along 14500 battery! I have always ordered from Zeb themselves (except for the SC62d that I just got from going gear) and I see that will not change due to there fine customer service.



Zebralight made sure you and the person who received the light by mistake were both happy :laughing: I hope that SC52w will be delivered to You this time.


----------



## kj2

Ordered the SC600w MKIII HI last Thursday, but received the SC600w MKIII. Although it's a bummer that I received the wrong light, I couldn't help myself to check the SC600w MKIII.
I like the tint, no let me rephrase that.. I really like the tint  it's so much nicer to my eyes, than the SC600 MKII that I already had. Emailed the dealer for an exchange for the HI that I ordered, but maybe I'll keep this one (with some cash back, since the HI is slightly more expensive  ).


----------



## wolfgaze

I find the strobe on the SC5 to be nauseating! Which I guess is a good thing should I ever have to use it ward someone off and away from me....


----------



## Brasso

I finally got around to putting some of Phaserburn's diffuser film on my SC5w, like I do all my edc lights, and it just turned it from a 10 into a 11. I love it. Phaserburn's diffuser film is much less floody than the frosted lens that Zebralight uses. This stuff gives the light a flood effect, but still with a hot spot. It's a perfect balance imo. If you guys have never tried his diffuser film you should order some. It's really cheap and it makes a world of difference.


----------



## Wendee

Brasso said:


> I finally got around to putting some of Phaserburn's diffuser film on my SC5w, like I do all my edc lights, and it just turned it from a 10 into a 11. I love it. Phaserburn's diffuser film is much less floody than the frosted lens that Zebralight uses. This stuff gives the light a flood effect, but still with a hot spot. It's a perfect balance imo. If you guys have never tried his diffuser film you should order some. It's really cheap and it makes a world of difference.



Today I put Phaserburn's diffuser film on my Thrunite TN4A and I love it! Actually, it's on a scope cover that flips open, not directly on the flashlight. 

I have a Zebralight SC600 mkII coming in the mail (7 weeks since shipped..sigh) and I'd like to try the diffuser film on it too (I have tons left), but I'm not sure how that would work. Are you leaving the film on your SC5w permanently? If not, what do you do to store it when you remove it (I assume you want to re-use it)? If you're outside, do you just put the diffuser film in your pocket, if taken off of the flashlight? 

I haven't been able to find a "scope cover" or any other device that would mount to the SC600 mkII so I'd have to put the film right onto the flashlight lens. I'm thinking it will end up getting all wrinkled or wrecked if it's always being removed/put back on? 

Any tips or advice would be appreciated.


----------



## Brasso

I leave it on permanently. It's easy to peel off if you need to, but I've found that it doesn't really leave the film in great shape after you do that. The SC5w is so floody already that there really isn't any benefit to not just going ahead and making it more diffuse. It doesn't have any real throw to begin with.


----------



## Wendee

Brasso said:


> I leave it on permanently. It's easy to peel off if you need to, but I've found that it doesn't really leave the film in great shape after you do that. The SC5w is so floody already that there really isn't any benefit to not just going ahead and making it more diffuse. It doesn't have any real throw to begin with.



OK thanks. I'll be using the SC600 mostly outdoors, so I probably won't put diffuser on it then (unless I finally find some type of scope cover type of gadget that will fit).

Glad to hear the diffuser film is nice on the SC5w. I've been eyeing that one for a while now and I think it will be my next Zebralight. I'll be ordering from a US store though, not from China, it takes way too long to ship. 

Thanks again


----------



## kj2

kj2 said:


> Ordered the SC600w MKIII HI last Thursday, but received the SC600w MKIII. Although it's a bummer that I received the wrong light, I couldn't help myself to check the SC600w MKIII.
> I like the tint, no let me rephrase that.. I really like the tint  it's so much nicer to my eyes, than the SC600 MKII that I already had. Emailed the dealer for an exchange for the HI that I ordered, but maybe I'll keep this one (with some cash back, since the HI is slightly more expensive  ).


Decided to keep the SC600w MKIII, although I ordered the HI version. Like the tint it has, and anodizing and switch is good. Do want to order the HI when it's back in stock.


----------



## markr6

Brasso said:


> I finally got around to putting some of Phaserburn's diffuser film on my SC5w, like I do all my edc lights, and it just turned it from a 10 into a 11. I love it. Phaserburn's diffuser film is much less floody than the frosted lens that Zebralight uses. This stuff gives the light a flood effect, but still with a hot spot. It's a perfect balance imo. If you guys have never tried his diffuser film you should order some. It's really cheap and it makes a world of difference.


Couldn't agree more! I've had the same piece on my H600w for years. Any time I buy a ZL headlamp, I purchase the regular version and put the d-c-fix on it. I also think it's much better than the frosted lens.


----------



## wolfgaze

Brasso said:


> Phaserburn's diffuser film is much less floody *than the frosted lens that Zebralight uses*.



Do you mean one of their 'floody' models/variants? Do you own one of those?


----------



## kj2

Just did a side-by-side with the SC600 MKII and the SC600w MKIII. Output is similar but the tint on the 600w MKIII is much easier on my eyes. Big plus, for me, is that the newer ZL's have more click in the switch. My SC600 MKII has a soft click switch, so sometimes I don't notice that I pressed it or I can't feel the click. Hope the HI comes in stock quickly, because I want to check that version as well


----------



## Brasso

wolfgaze said:


> Do you mean one of their 'floody' models/variants? Do you own one of those?




Yes, to both. I own two flood headlamps ( H51fw and H600fc ) and they are much more floody and diffuse than the diffuser film. With the diffuser film you still have a hotspot. It's just a diffused hotspot. With the flood version Zebralight there is no hotspot.


----------



## snowlover91

kj2 said:


> Just did a side-by-side with the SC600 MKII and the SC600w MKIII. Output is similar but the tint on the 600w MKIII is much easier on my eyes. Big plus, for me, is that the newer ZL's have more click in the switch. My SC600 MKII has a soft click switch, so sometimes I don't notice that I pressed it or I can't feel the click. Hope the HI comes in stock quickly, because I want to check that version as well



Wow it must be pretty good to get you to keep it along with the MK2 you have. When the MK3 HI is back in stock would you mind taking some beamshots to compare the MK2, MK3 and MK3 HI models? I've noticed the firmer click on mine which I also like, it's amazing the light these are capable of while staying relatively cool for the first few minutes of turbo.


----------



## tech25

Brasso, would you be able to take a comparison beamshot of the h51fw and the h600fc? 

I have the H51fw and am looking to upgrade. Thanks


----------



## kj2

snowlover91 said:


> Wow it must be pretty good to get you to keep it along with the MK2 you have. When the MK3 HI is back in stock would you mind taking some beamshots to compare the MK2, MK3 and MK3 HI models? I've noticed the firmer click on mine which I also like, it's amazing the light these are capable of while staying relatively cool for the first few minutes of turbo.



Once arrived, and weather allows it, I'll shoot some shots. The 600w MKIII does get hot fairly quickly on H1. But there is PID for


----------



## Brasso

tech25 said:


> Brasso, would you be able to take a comparison beamshot of the h51fw and the h600fc?
> 
> I have the H51fw and am looking to upgrade. Thanks




I wish I had a camera that could do that. I tried with the iphone and both photo's turned out looking identical, which they most definitely are not. Beam and tint wise they are virtually identical. Of course H600 puts out 800 lumens on high while the h51 puts out 172. The only reason I got the H600 was because it can run 4 times longer at the same output. Will I ever need it? Maybe. If you don't need the longer run time there is no real reason to upgrade. You can't run the H600 for very long at 800 lumens anyway. It almost get's too hot to touch after only a minute. It will run quite nicely though at 100 lumens for 11 hrs.


----------



## tech25

No problem! I am just curious of the difference between the XPG and XML- is the hotspot bigger/more diffused? the hotspot on the h51fw even though it is diffused, still annoys me as my eye gets drawn to it as I pan the light around (I currently have diffuser film over my H51fw) I am not too sure about getting the h602 due to the lack of throw. 

Is the size that much more noticeable? I plan on keeping it in my jacket pocket as a backup flashlight and to use it as a headlamp. 

Thanks.


----------



## Brasso

The floodiness of both is pretty much the same. Have you tried the 602, 502 models? They are mules. Pure flood. No hot spot at all. And no throw at all either. Purely up close in your face type lights.


----------



## tech25

The lack of throw is stopping me from trying those, though most of my use is within 5-10 yards I still want to be able to look out further. 

I guess that I will wait for a headlamp with the xhp 35 led- IF it ever happens.

I just realized that Zebralight never said if this will come out.


----------



## roger-roger

Thought I'd ask about this here. I checked out Phaserburn"s Panjo sale, and its closed. What is the procedure here--wait till its reopened or...?


----------



## Equitymind

tech25 said:


> The lack of throw is stopping me from trying those, though most of my use is within 5-10 yards I still want to be able to look out further.
> 
> I guess that I will wait for a headlamp with the xhp 35 led- IF it ever happens.
> 
> *I just realized that Zebralight never said if this will come out*.



Here is ZL themselves discussing that very topic:

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...I-Plus-XHP50&p=4863509&viewfull=1#post4863509


----------



## run4jc

Sorry to veer off that topic, although I will mention that the H32w is a great headlight for most things. I use mine when taking early morning runs, although the days getting longer are negating the need for it - for now. I usually walk out the door at 5AM for a 30 minute or so run. I find that the H32w has good throw but still gives me good illumination of the ground directly in front of me.

I've thinned my "herd of Zebras" lately - these remaining 5 are all used regularly. Oddly enough, none of them serve as EDC (HDS and Aeon hold that role) but they do get regular use.

H32w - already mentioned 
H52w L2- the oldest light in this group - used mainly as a kitchen light - stays in a cabinet for quick use when hunting for items in a dimly lit cabinet
SC600MKIII HI - most recent acquisition - my go to pocket thrower 
SC32w - another "kitchen light." As silly at this sounds, it 'lives' on the kitchen bar - I tail stand it for kitchen illumination in early morning. Provides just enough light without flooding over into the adjacent master bedroom where my wife is still snoozing...
SC62w - not as much use as it used to get - it is usually clipped to my waistband when running for a backup light. Still one of the best tints in a non-high CRI light that I have ever owned.


----------



## Flint Hills

Does anyone have both the sc52w l2 and the sc52d? Would you care to share some beamshots comparing the two and/or your opinions? I've seen some comparisons and a couple beamshots but was hoping for a direct comparison and some updated thoughts.


----------



## markr6

roger-roger said:


> Thought I'd ask about this here. I checked out Phaserburn"s Panjo sale, and its closed. What is the procedure here--wait till its reopened or...?





Here it is: http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?398824-Phaserburn-s-Diffusion-Film-CPF-Service-amp-Int-l-Shipping-Avail


----------



## roger-roger

markr6 said:


> Here it is: http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?398824-Phaserburn-s-Diffusion-Film-CPF-Service-amp-Int-l-Shipping-Avail




Thanks (duh, on my part).

Ordered an SC5 cw op on Mon. This Priority shipment has had great workmanlike USPS tracking--its already left Ft Worth.


----------



## kj2

Noticed my SC600w MKIII led glows shortly after I turned off the light. More people having this?


----------



## markr6

kj2 said:


> Noticed my SC600w MKIII led glows shortly after I turned off the light. More people having this?



Yes, and many of my other lights to some degree. My TM16 practically gave out "useful" light for about 15 seconds! Wannabe moonlight mode.


----------



## wolfgaze

kj2 said:


> Noticed my SC600w MKIII led glows shortly after I turned off the light. More people having this?



CPF user *mhanlen* mentions this in his Youtube review....


----------



## wolfgaze

*markr6* which Zebralights do you currently have in your possession? I read that you sold your SC5w....


----------



## markr6

wolfgaze said:


> *markr6* which Zebralights do you currently have in your possession? I read that you sold your SC5w....



I recently cleaned house...only H51w, SC52w, H52w, SC63w, SC600w III HI and H600w II remain. Not sure I needed to say "only", but some of you have a dozen or more!


----------



## wolfgaze

markr6 said:


> *SC600w III HI*



How are you liking this model? Would you say the tint is similar to what you remember of the SC5w? Does the hot spot blend/diffuse well into the spill? 

I am debating whether to spring for the SC600w MK3 HI or to wait for the PLUS (floody, high CRI) model/variant that is due out in August... I'm in no rush to get another light so I can certainly wait - I'm just not sure which model I would prefer. I'm really enjoying my SC5w (tint & beam profile)... So I'm not sure if I would prefer to add a seemingly more powerful version of this type of light, or go with a powerful flooder that will produce very accurate color rendering... I do like floody beams...


----------



## recDNA

Obviously BOTH! LOL


----------



## tops2

wolfgaze said:


> How are you liking this model? Would you say the tint is similar to what you remember of the SC5w? Does the hot spot blend/diffuse well into the spill?
> 
> I am debating whether to spring for the SC600w MK3 HI or to wait for the PLUS (floody, high CRI) model/variant that is due out in August... I'm in no rush to get another light so I can certainly wait - I'm just not sure which model I would prefer. I'm really enjoying my SC5w (tint & beam profile)... So I'm not sure if I would prefer to add a seemingly more powerful version of this type of light, or go with a powerful flooder that will produce very accurate color rendering... I do like floody beams...



I also am considering these 2 and don't really like to buy lights that I won't use. To me, if the Plus version can throw as far (or even slightly further) than the SC5w, that's the only one I'll choose. But if its going to be too floody with way less throw than SC5w, then I guess the correct answer is getting both...

I have a feeling if I get the Plus version, I'll use it all the time and find excuses to use it. But if I get the HI version, it may just sit on the shelf for the (rare) moments I need throw...




recDNA said:


> Obviously BOTH! LOL



Lol..the correct answer when considering 2 (or multiple) lights!


----------



## rexet

I love Zebralight!
So far I own a SC600w MKII L2 and two SC52w L2 and they work like a charm!
This week I put an order for two other lights: a SC5w and a SC62w.

I live in the city (Paris) in a flat with no garden or basement. I just have no use of all these lights... but I can't stop myself buying more Zebras :shrug: !


----------



## wolfgaze

rexet said:


> This week I put an order for two other lights: a *SC5w*



I think you will love it... Had mine for a little over a week and really enjoying it....


----------



## Flint Hills

I wonder what the new *sc53* series might be like...?


----------



## markr6

wolfgaze said:


> How are you liking this model? Would you say the tint is similar to what you remember of the SC5w? Does the hot spot blend/diffuse well into the spill?
> 
> I am debating whether to spring for the SC600w MK3 HI or to wait for the PLUS (floody, high CRI) model/variant that is due out in August... I'm in no rush to get another light so I can certainly wait - I'm just not sure which model I would prefer. I'm really enjoying my SC5w (tint & beam profile)... So I'm not sure if I would prefer to add a seemingly more powerful version of this type of light, or go with a powerful flooder that will produce very accurate color rendering... I do like floody beams...



SC600w III HI is completely different from the SC5w OP I had. That SC5 could have passed for a 5000K Nichia 219 easily. It was that good! The HI is warmer and more yellow, but still very nice. For something that throws like that in such a small package, I'm not as picky.

The SC600w III HI vs SC600Fd III Plus are going to be night and day...completely different. One will make the other look way too floody; the other way too narrow/throwy. That's not a bad thing since you have to pick the right tool for the job, but I really wish the Plus wasn't going to have the frosted lens. I like to shoot for a nice balanced beam when possible. But that high CRI is irresistible and I'll be buying one ASAP.


----------



## rexet

wolfgaze said:


> I think you will love it... Had mine for a little over a week and really enjoying it....


Yeah I saw your posts on the SC5 dedicated post because I am also on "back order" status. I hope it will be in stock soon. I have 8 Eneloop Pro waiting to power this little gem


----------



## wolfgaze

markr6 said:


> SC600w III HI is completely different from the SC5w OP I had. That SC5 could have passed for a 5000K Nichia 219 easily. It was that good! The HI is warmer and more yellow, but still very nice. For something that throws like that in such a small package, I'm not as picky.
> 
> The SC600w III HI vs SC600Fd III Plus are going to be night and day...completely different. One will make the other look way too floody; the other way too narrow/throwy. That's not a bad thing since you have to pick the right tool for the job, but I really wish the Plus wasn't going to have the frosted lens. I like to shoot for a nice balanced beam when possible. But that high CRI is irresistible and I'll be buying one ASAP.



Thanks for the feedback Mark... I think I will wait until August (or whenever the release will be) and wait to evaluate the reviews of the Plus/High CRI model - then I will make my decision....


----------



## markr6

wolfgaze said:


> Thanks for the feedback Mark... I think I will wait until August (or whenever the release will be) and wait to evaluate the reviews of the Plus/High CRI model - then I will make my decision....



One other suggestion, if you're impatient like me: buy the SC600 HI and see how you like it. You could always return it or sell it. August isn't far away, but there's always a possibility the Plus will be cancelled or changed in a negative way. Or even pushed closer to 2017. I hope not, but you never know!


----------



## wolfgaze

markr6 said:


> One other suggestion, if you're impatient like me: buy the SC600 HI and see how you like it. You could always return it or sell it. August isn't far away, but there's always a possibility the Plus will be cancelled or changed in a negative way. Or even pushed closer to 2017. I hope not, but you never know!



The thing is, where I live right now I really don't have a need for much throw for my flashlight applications... When I'm outside it's mostly walking the dog or shining a flashlight around our smaller-sized property... However if I relocate Colorado like I hope to do - I can definitely see the benefit of having a flashlight with more throw while outside... I really like the beam tint of my SC5w and now that you've told me about how the SC600 MK3 HI tint is different - I think I'm more inclined to wait for the possible next model/variant and see what that's like... If it's High CRI does that mean it will be utilizing a different emitter and the beam tint will be quite different than the MK3 HI? (I'm not well-versed in flashlight technical details).... 

Lastly, does anyone know the CRI rating for the SC5w? I didn't see it listed on the ZL spec page... It's so easy on my eyes when I'm illuminating objects with it...


----------



## markr6

wolfgaze said:


> Lastly, does anyone know the CRI rating for the SC5w? I didn't see it listed on the ZL spec page... It's so easy on my eyes when I'm illuminating objects with it...



That one is 75. I think it has to do with the overall tint too. Mine was so nice, no yellow. It was like a 5000K Nichia but with lower CRI. But that didn't matter to me since the tint in general was so nice.


----------



## tops2

When used alone, mine doesn't feel too cool nor too warm..just nice like markr6 mentioned. Its only when doing beam shots with different tint lights I notice it.

Next to my BLF 348, my SC5w is a little more yellow.
Next to my Astrolux A01, my SC5w is a bit cool.

With these 3 light for my reference, I actually don't have a preference tint-wise..just depends on mood.


----------



## wolfgaze

Are there any Zebralight users who purchase the headlamp lights but primarily end up using them as regular EDC lights? Something about the ergonomics of holding a light in that manner seems very appealing to me....


----------



## TheRealSpinner

I have the h602w. I tried using it as an edc standalone, but I don't like using it for walking around. The 90 degree light isn't great for that function.

I DO love it for work done in my hands, and up close, but like I said, not great for going on walks at night. I use my SC600w MKIII for that. 😉


----------



## tsask

wolfgaze said:


> I am debating whether to spring for the SC600w MK3 HI or to wait for the PLUS (floody, high CRI) model/variant that is due out in August......


I am chomping at the bit for that SC600w MK3 HI, maybe I can wait.......


----------



## wolfgaze

TheRealSpinner said:


> I have the h602w. I tried using it as an edc standalone, but I don't like using it for walking around. The 90 degree light isn't great for that function.
> 
> I DO love it for work done in my hands, and up close, but like I said, not great for going on walks at night. I use my SC600w MKIII for that. 😉



According to the ZL website, the H602w has a *120* degree beam spread. I do understand that would certainly not be ideal for illuminating Medium/Longer range distances... I would be looking at the H600Fw MKII or the H600Fd MK III, which has a 90 degree beam spread and should give somewhat better throw with a more diffused hot spot.... 

How do you find the ergonomics to be when holding the light in your hand?


----------



## roger-roger

wolfgaze said:


> Are there any Zebralight users who purchase the headlamp lights but primarily end up using them as regular EDC lights? Something about the ergonomics of holding a light in that manner seems very appealing to me....



I have an H32Fw that for my urban environment doesn't have enough throw, to fulfill the requirements for a "general purpose" EDC light. That said, its performance definitely gives me hope that the SC600 PLUS might be able to step into that slot. 

The 32Fw could work well for a 4:30am dog walker function but alas, it will soon spend most of its lonely days as part of my on-road tire change kit.


----------



## TheRealSpinner

wolfgaze said:


> How do you find the ergonomics to be when holding the light in your hand?



Yeah, I got it. The ergonomics is what I was speaking about. When walking, my hands hold a standard flashlight very comfortably. Holding the H602w, I have to **** my hand back so that the light points forward. It gets uncomfortable very quickly.

The amount of light coming out of the H602w is actually quite helpful when trying to illuminate the area directly in front of my feet, weather I'm holding it in my hand, or as a headlamp. Like you said, no usable throw, though. I'd even say that even after 10 or 15 feet, it's almost unusable.

Keep in mind that I live in an urban city, and there are generally plenty of street lights around. So, when I'm using a light, it needs to he bright enough to augment the ambient light.

What I HAVE found, is that the SC63w and the SC600w MKIII HI really complement one another. I am also interested in the MKIII Floody version I've heard of recently, and will probably also purchase that. Just to see. 😉


----------



## wolfgaze

TheRealSpinner said:


> Yeah, I got it. The ergonomics is what I was speaking about. When walking, my hands hold a standard flashlight very comfortably. Holding the H602w, I have to **** my hand back so that the light points forward. It gets uncomfortable very quickly.
> 
> The amount of light coming out of the H602w is actually quite helpful when trying to illuminate the area directly in front of my feet, weather I'm holding it in my hand, or as a headlamp. Like you said, no usable throw, though. I'd even say that even after 10 or 15 feet, it's almost unusable.
> 
> Keep in mind that I live in an urban city, and there are generally plenty of street lights around. So, when I'm using a light, it needs to he bright enough to augment the ambient light.
> 
> What I HAVE found, is that the SC63w and the SC600w MKIII HI really complement one another. I am also interested in the MKIII Floody version I've heard of recently, and will probably also purchase that. Just to see. 



Thanks for the feedback...My normal preference for holding a flashlight is about chest height, with my arm in a folded position, closed fist with my thumb on the tail cap (thumb pointing towards me).... I do this with my SC5w and I can still operate the clicky sideswitch by maneuvering my thumb even though the switch is now facing downward... This grip position just feels more comfortable to me and I feel like I have a better position and vantage point for shining the light... 

I will also wait for the PLUS model to be released... Does anyone know if Zebralight will normally place the SKU on their site and accept pre-orders? Have they done this in the past?


----------



## MX421

TheRealSpinner said:


> Yeah, I got it. The ergonomics is what I was speaking about. When walking, my hands hold a standard flashlight very comfortably. Holding the H602w, I have to **** my hand back so that the light points forward. It gets uncomfortable very quickly.
> 
> The amount of light coming out of the H602w is actually quite helpful when trying to illuminate the area directly in front of my feet, weather I'm holding it in my hand, or as a headlamp. Like you said, no usable throw, though. I'd even say that even after 10 or 15 feet, it's almost unusable.
> 
> Keep in mind that I live in an urban city, and there are generally plenty of street lights around. So, when I'm using a light, it needs to he bright enough to augment the ambient light.
> 
> What I HAVE found, is that the SC63w and the SC600w MKIII HI really complement one another. I am also interested in the MKIII Floody version I've heard of recently, and will probably also purchase that. Just to see. 😉



I made some rope to hang my H602w from my neck. I just keep it on when i'm doing anything at night and press the switch for on. I augment this with another light of course for anything outside my immediate circle since it has zero throw. I also use my SC63 or SC62 as a augmentation light. I don't have a SC600 MK3 HI, but my Armytek Predator probably throws a little better if i need a throw situation. Still working on which light works best in what situation though since i have obtained quite a few lights this past year and am rotating through them for the best mix for each occasion.


----------



## Swedpat

Flint Hills said:


> Does anyone have both the sc52w l2 and the sc52d? Would you care to share some beamshots comparing the two and/or your opinions? I've seen some comparisons and a couple beamshots but was hoping for a direct comparison and some updated thoughts.



I have both and really like them. Here are two beamshots(maybe not of the best class) with different shutter speeds. I adjusted the color balance of the camera to daylight, which in my eyes reproduces the tints fairly accurate to what I perceive with my own eyes. SC52d(to right) has a smaller emitter which provides a smaller, slightly more throwy beam. Both lights were on M1 level(50 resp. 39lm).
I can tell that SC52d definitely does not look dimmer to my eyes than SC52w L2 despite less lumens.


----------



## run4jc

Nicely done. Very useful. :twothumbs


----------



## PB Wilson

I just ordered an H600Fd Mk III and I too was wondering about holding it in hand. I can envision it spending a good deal of time in a breast pocket but the cord around the neck sounds promising if it isn't bouncing around too much.

What about holding it like a pen with the head of the light tucked in the webbing of my hand between my index finger and thumb? I think that might work well if it's not too chunky. I'll report back when I get it.

Anyway, I'm glad that I'm choosing a headlamp (90 degree bend) style light because it will definitely come in handy on my forehead and will blow my old Petzel out of the water.


----------



## Flint Hills

Swedpat said:


> I have both and really like them. Here are two beamshots(maybe not of the best class) with different shutter speeds. I adjusted the color balance of the camera to daylight, which in my eyes reproduces the tints fairly accurate to what I perceive with my own eyes. SC52d(to right) has a smaller emitter which provides a smaller, slightly more throwy beam. Both lights were on M1 level(50 resp. 39lm).
> I can tell that SC52d definitely does not look dimmer to my eyes than SC52w L2 despite less lumens.



Great, thank you!


----------



## wolfgaze

I had to walk home late Sunday night, took me an hour and 15 minutes.... I had my SC5w with me and medium mode (45 lumens) provided the perfect amount of light to illuminate the terrain during my walk... Got home and ran the battery test/check feature - and still got 4 flashes... The runtime on this light and particularly in the medium 45 lumen mode is just superb...


----------



## tops2

wolfgaze said:


> I had to walk home late Sunday night, took me an hour and 15 minutes.... I had my SC5w with me and medium mode (45 lumens) provided the perfect amount of light to illuminate the terrain during my walk... Got home and ran the battery test/check feature - and still got 4 flashes... The runtime on this light and particularly in the medium 45 lumen mode is just superb...



:twothumbs
I love the efficiency of the SC5w. I know 18650 lasts much longer than AAs..but on my 2 most used levels (45 lumens & ~0.1 lumens), my Eneloops lasts basically "forever".


----------



## Oztorchfreak

I have found that with the SC52 L2 using an 14500 battery that the runtime is not very good when using the highest level.

Because of that poor runtime I use my SC600 MKIII more often.

Or I use the SC5 that has about 300 lumens using an AA battery which is quite an amazing output.


CHEERS


----------



## wolfgaze

I subscribed to the Zebralight newsletter.... Is it safe to assume that they will email subscribers every time a new product is scheduled to be released? Or when it's officially available for order?


----------



## kj2

Only received one or two emails from ZL about new lights. And that is in the last 1,5/2 years.


----------



## markr6

wolfgaze said:


> I subscribed to the Zebralight newsletter.... Is it safe to assume that they will email subscribers every time a new product is scheduled to be released? Or when it's officially available for order?



When it's available for sale IIRC. But I usually have the new lights in hand by the time they send the emails!


----------



## wolfgaze

Thanks for the responses... I find that interesting because you would think that sending more updates and information to their Customer base would really serve to promote and boost sales... 

What are your all opinions on Zebralight's operations... Do you think they struggle to keep up with demand because demand is really high - or because their production/batch quantities are kept on a smaller scale?


----------



## snowlover91

wolfgaze said:


> Thanks for the responses... I find that interesting because you would think that sending more updates and information to their Customer base would really serve to promote and boost sales...
> 
> What are your all opinions on Zebralight's operations... Do you think they struggle to keep up with demand because demand is really high - or because their production/batch quantities are kept on a smaller scale?



My best guess is that it's a combination of both. They have high demand for their products relative to their size. However they also seem to be small as well since they receive their lights in "batches." I'm perfectly fine with them staying small so long as they keep doing what they do best; producing compact lights with a great UI, thermal management system and high CRI options in neutral tint.


----------



## Jbones

I've recently fallen in love with zebralights, the UI, their ability to tail stand, output, build quality, all in such a tiny package. Downright amazing. I have the sc5, sc5fd, mk3 hi, mk3 neutral, and h602 in my collection, and always carry at least one along side my p60 for the day

You're right about the h602 headlamp, it's all the way a mule, just a big even circle of light at least 120 degrees. Not a thrower at all, but priceless for construction and service work, especially close up in a dark basement or crawl space when you need both your hands free. The head strap is pretty comfortable to boot

In my experience, even if they are a relatively small operation, I've always had orders fulfilled before the lead time they gave me, so kudos to that. Especially with my mk3 hi I lucked out big time, they said a month when I contacted them after placing the order, a week and a half later I had a shipping notification in my email.

Plus, their customer service is top notch, I never had a problem with any of the lights I ordered, so I can't speak to that, but every question I sent them about product specs and wait times were answered the same day


----------



## markr6

snowlover91 said:


> My best guess is that it's a combination of both. They have high demand for their products relative to their size. However they also seem to be small as well since they receive their lights in "batches." I'm perfectly fine with them staying small so long as they keep doing what they do best; producing compact lights with a great UI, thermal management system and high CRI options in neutral tint.



I agree!


----------



## rexet

My little Zebras collection


----------



## cmd

Looks like new headlamps are now available for pre-order, shipping date 6/30. 83-85 CRI just does not cut it for me any more, just spoiled by Nichias. At least it looks like the lenses are not frosted.

Glad they are getting new products out though - still very happy EDC'ing my SC63w even if it is not high CRI.

Hope they come out with that high output high CRI SC600.


----------



## markr6

Those H603_ headlamps look nice, but just way too floody for me. Never had the need for an H602. Looking forward to more new stuff though.


----------



## drummer132132

Probably pick up either the H603 or H603w in the future and definitely get the H600Fw Mk iii xhp35 when it gets released.


----------



## wolfgaze

Snowlover, what is the exact model # of your SC5 flooder?

Does anyone reading this thread own the High CRI SC5's, the *SC5Fc* or *SC5Fd*? Would love to read some feedback on these two models and possibly see some photos of beamshots outdoors.... I love my SC5w and now I'm really intrigued by the High CRI variants....


----------



## snowlover91

wolfgaze said:


> Snowlover, what is the exact model # of your SC5 flooder?
> 
> Does anyone reading this thread own the High CRI SC5's, the *SC5Fc* or *SC5Fd*? Would love to read some feedback on these two models and possibly see some photos of beamshots outdoors.... I love my SC5w and now I'm really intrigued by the High CRI variants....



I have both the SC5w and SC5fd. I believe I posted a thread awhile back with so,e beamshots comparing it with some other lights. Basically the SC5fd has excellent tint and a diffuse beam, imagine the SC5w with scotch tape and that's about what it's like. However the CRI is much better and the tint a nice neutral/paper white. It wouldn't be a good outdoor light due to the diffuse beam, definitely a close up only light and indoors imo. 

However if you're out in the country where it's pitch black it'll do pretty well but anywhere with city lights around or light pollution it just doesn't have enough punch outdoors. Hope that helps!


----------



## wolfgaze

snowlover91 said:


> I have both the SC5w and SC5fd. I believe I posted a thread awhile back with so,e beamshots comparing it with some other lights. Basically the SC5fd has excellent tint and a diffuse beam, imagine the SC5w with scotch tape and that's about what it's like. However the CRI is much better and the tint a nice neutral/paper white. It wouldn't be a good outdoor light due to the diffuse beam, definitely a close up only light and indoors imo.
> 
> However if you're out in the country where it's pitch black it'll do pretty well but anywhere with city lights around or light pollution it just doesn't have enough punch outdoors. Hope that helps!



That was helpful feedback, thank you....


----------



## snowlover91

wolfgaze said:


> That was helpful feedback, thank you....



Here is the thread I referenced. Has some indoor beamshots. 
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...ordered-the-Zebralight-SC5fd!&highlight=Sc5fd


----------



## wolfgaze

snowlover91 said:


> Here is the thread I referenced. Has some indoor beamshots.
> http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...ordered-the-Zebralight-SC5fd!&highlight=Sc5fd



Thanks... I'm still kinda curious what the *SC5Fc* would look like with the warmer 4000k beam....


----------



## cmd

markr6 said:


> Those H603_ headlamps look nice, but just way too floody for me. Never had the need for an H602. Looking forward to more new stuff though.



Agreed, 120 degree is just to much for me especially for a headlamp.


----------



## davidt1

PB Wilson said:


> I just ordered an H600Fd Mk III and I too was wondering about holding it in hand. I can envision it spending a good deal of time in a breast pocket but the cord around the neck sounds promising if it isn't bouncing around too much.
> 
> What about holding it like a pen with the head of the light tucked in the webbing of my hand between my index finger and thumb? I think that might work well if it's not too chunky. I'll report back when I get it.
> 
> Anyway, I'm glad that I'm choosing a headlamp (90 degree bend) style light because it will definitely come in handy on my forehead and will blow my old Petzel out of the water.



No bouncing if you walk, sit, or stand. Obviously it will bounce if you run. I have been EDCing and using my ZL AA angle light this way since the H501 (perhaps 8 years ago). I imagine the H600 series will work even better due to being bigger and heavier.

The cord is also a headband. Transforming from neck light to headlamp takes mere seconds.





Don't forget your angle light can be much more than a headlamp.


----------



## tops2

snowlover91 said:


> I have both the SC5w and SC5fd. I believe I posted a thread awhile back with so,e beamshots comparing it with some other lights. Basically the SC5fd has excellent tint and a diffuse beam, imagine the SC5w with *scotch tape* and that's about what it's like. However the CRI is much better and the tint a nice neutral/paper white. It wouldn't be a good outdoor light due to the diffuse beam, definitely a close up only light and indoors imo.
> 
> However if you're out in the country where it's pitch black it'll do pretty well but anywhere with city lights around or light pollution it just doesn't have enough punch outdoors. Hope that helps!



I finally tried the scotch tape trick a few nights ago and boy..I shoulda tried it earlier. It makes the beam so much more smooth and peasant to me. I'm actually now interested in a floody headlamp from Zebralight in the future (just picked up the new Armytek Wizard Pro XHP50 and really like the floody beam).


----------



## roger-roger

Couple weeks ago I had the hankering to try out the SC52 High CRI Daylight. Sent an email to Zebralight and alas, its officially discontinued. Otoh further experience with the H32F, leads me to guess I'd be totally happy with the throw from the upcoming SC600 PLUS.


----------



## roger-roger

Any thoughts on a 26650 powered Zebralight? Doesn't seem that battery configuration has advanced or is advancing much


----------



## markr6

roger-roger said:


> Any thoughts on a 26650 powered Zebralight? Doesn't seem that battery configuration has advanced or is advancing much



I always thought that would be great. Something between the $200 S6330 and 1x18650. I like the size and looks of other 1x26650 lights, but I would really want the Zebralight UI. I suggested it to them but don't remember getting a response. That size light would feel good in your hand without being too big and heavy. It's not that much more power than an 18650, but something worthwhile IMO.


----------



## ShineOnYouCrazyDiamond

I would bet a 26650 version of the SC600 MkIII HI would be pretty awesome. Even without more lumens it would give the space for a wider and deeper reflector for more a little bit more throw. Keep the same exact form factor with just a proportionate bump in size and I'm sure it would feel great in the hand too.


----------



## tops2

I just found out there's more and more of these XHP 50/70 26650 lights comes out so it would be awesome for Zebralight to join too. I'm tempted by Olight R50 Seeker and Klarus G20 and other lights like this, but I'm totally spoiled by the Zebralight UI and efficiency and moonlight levels!


----------



## noboneshotdog

I emailed zebralight a few weeks back asking whether or not they were planning a 26650 light in the future and they responded "no plans" .


----------



## Drift Monkey

roger-roger said:


> Any thoughts on a 26650 powered Zebralight? Doesn't seem that battery configuration has advanced or is advancing much



It's been pretty stagnant. 18650s are still my choice...they advance these all the time.


----------



## roger-roger

noboneshotdog said:


> I emailed zebralight a few weeks back asking whether or not they were planning a 26650 light in the future and they responded "no plans" .





Drift Monkey said:


> It's been pretty stagnant. 18650s are still my choice...they advance these all the time.



Too bad. The 18650 is definitely sitting in a sweet spot.




tops2 said:


> I just found out there's more and more of these XHP 50/70 26650 lights comes out so it would be awesome for Zebralight to join too. I'm tempted by Olight R50 Seeker and Klarus G20 and other lights like this, but I'm totally spoiled by the Zebralight UI and efficiency and moonlight levels!




Same here. A ZL version would have bee a great light.


----------



## carl

What about mini-usb charger ports like the Nitecore MH20 and Manker U11? I thought there were plans for this feature but I heard that rumor maybe 3 years ago which is quite a long time...even for ZL.

Maybe nobody at ZL wants to deal with a fragile rubber cover.


----------



## Drift Monkey

carl said:


> What about mini-usb charger ports like the Nitecore MH20 and Manker U11? I thought there were plans for this feature but I heard that rumor maybe 3 years ago which is quite a long time...even for ZL.
> 
> Maybe nobody at ZL wants to deal with a fragile rubber cover.



I'd rather charge externally either way anyway.


----------



## mccraggen

Can someone explain to me why I see so much zebralight stuff on here? Are they the new brass ring?


----------



## Andrey

mccraggen said:


> Are they the new brass ring?


Haha! Made me learn what brass ring is! :thumbsup:

Zebralight makes the best headlamps and, arguably, best flashlights for the price.
You should get one!


----------



## mccraggen

Another torch to the ever growing pile haha


----------



## tops2

Lol.. Zebralight sounds complicated at first, and the looks is hit and miss for me. But after using other lights first, then getting used to the Zebralight UI allowed me to really appreciate this UI. It makes it really hard for me to use other lights.

I also love the sub lumen levels of Zebralights too.


----------



## Strintguy

Agreed, the simple UI that allows direct access to moonlight and high is something my other lights are missing.


----------



## Warp

mccraggen said:


> Can someone explain to me why I see so much zebralight stuff on here?



They are great lights. Small, bright, efficient, well made, great mode spacing and output options, very practical and unique UI.


----------



## mccraggen

I'll have to look into one, what's a good one to look at?


----------



## PB Wilson

mccraggen said:


> I'll have to look into one, what's a good one to look at?



This one:

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?403410-Zebralight-SC600w-Mk-III-HI-Pocket-Thrower

I've had my HI for a short while and it impresses me every time I use it. I purposefully don't turn on the house lights at night when letting the pooches out just so I can wield my HI and look for critters in the trees on my property. It's a wonderful light.


----------



## tops2

mccraggen said:


> I'll have to look into one, what's a good one to look at?



For a small option, take a look at SC52w. Small and decently pocketable, with option to use AA or li-ion.

For larger pocket EDC option, SC63w is good. Much more output than SC52w with longer runtime. If you don't mind "older" model, the SC62w is on sale direct from Zebralight, but it's listed as back order. The light is more floody and has shorter throw.

For their large light, the SC600 MKIII HI has almost universal positive feedback. Larger than the SC63w so it can run at the max brightness for much longer time and runs cooler. Throw is reportedly longer with good spill. It has a hotspot so depends on you if you like well defined hotspot or smoother hotspot to spill transition. Most likely my next planned purchase to complement my Zebralight H600Fd headlamp.

The SC600 MKIII Plus version is planned for 8/2016 release. Same size as the HI, but with high CRI. This seems to be the version most are waiting for because of the high CRI. I'm mostly waiting for this version to decide between the Plus or the HI version.

If you don't mind headlamps, I recommend the H600Fd/c. The "F" stands for floody. The light has a frosted lense so there's not a well defined hotspot and the beam is a nice wide area. It throws less than a non flood version that has clear glass. But for closer distance usage, I love the flood version. The choice between "d" and "c" versions is how warm you want the light to be. These lights are also high CRI (just slightly less than the Plus version but more than their other lights).

You can't really go wrong with any version and you have access to the same UI in all versions. If you had to get only today, I'd recommend the HI version. Otherwise, it depends on what you prefer. If you need help to decide, just let us know what you're looking for and many will help guide you. And it sounds like Zebralight has good customer service and they'll guide you to what you're looking for.


----------



## scs

tops2 said:


> For a small option, take a look at SC52w. Small and decently pocketable, with option to use AA or li-ion.
> 
> For larger pocket EDC option, SC63w is good. Much more output than SC52w with longer runtime. If you don't mind "older" model, the SC62w is on sale direct from Zebralight, but it's listed as back order. The light is more floody and has shorter throw.
> 
> For their large light, the SC600 MKIII HI has almost universal positive feedback. Larger than the SC63w so it can run at the max brightness for much longer time and runs cooler. Throw is reportedly longer with good spill. It has a hotspot so depends on you if you like well defined hotspot or smoother hotspot to spill transition. Most likely my next planned purchase to complement my Zebralight H600Fd headlamp.
> 
> The SC600 MKIII Plus version is planned for 8/2016 release. Same size as the HI, but with high CRI. This seems to be the version most are waiting for because of the high CRI. I'm mostly waiting for this version to decide between the Plus or the HI version.
> 
> If you don't mind headlamps, I recommend the H600Fd/c. The "F" stands for floody. The light has a frosted lense so there's not a well defined hotspot and the beam is a nice wide area. It throws less than a non flood version that has clear glass. But for closer distance usage, I love the flood version. The choice between "d" and "c" versions is how warm you want the light to be. These lights are also high CRI (just slightly less than the Plus version but more than their other lights).
> 
> You can't really go wrong with any version and you have access to the same UI in all versions. If you had to get only today, I'd recommend the HI version. Otherwise, it depends on what you prefer. If you need help to decide, just let us know what you're looking for and many will help guide you. And it sounds like Zebralight has good customer service and they'll guide you to what you're looking for.



Thought the Plus would have a frosted lens, or has ZL changed plans?


----------



## Andrey

mccraggen said:


> Another torch to the ever growing pile haha


You may find to your amusement that once you have a Zebralight you don't use much all other lights from the pile.




tops2 said:


> SC63w is good.


Plus one on this. Perfectly pocketable, one of the smallest lights using 18650 battery. And throws impressively far!
SC63w or SC62w is a perfect complement for a flood headlamp if you decide to get one.




tops2 said:


> If you don't mind headlamps, I recommend the H600Fd/c. The "F" stands for floody. The light has a frosted lense so there's not a well defined hotspot and the beam is a nice wide area. It throws less than a non flood version that has clear glass. But for closer distance usage, I love the flood version.


Headlamp is a must have for camping, car work, and many other activities. I even prefer using one at home instead of ceiling lights. 
'F' version is a great all-around light for starters. Most popular among my friends given a choice which light they want as a gift. 
While providing nice wide lighting for an area nearby, 'F' headlamps have a diffused hot spot throwing for 40-80 feet which makes them convenient for walking in the dark.
For close hand work the 'flood' variants are the best: H603c, H502c. 

Being a fan of small lights, H502c is my favorite now. An amazing tiny light!




tops2 said:


> These lights are also high CRI


Yep! This is the way to go. After seeing the light of the H502c, I want all my lights in high CRI.

Colder 5000K version is better if you are looking for illumination during the day -- dark places in a house, car underbody etc. In these circumstances for daylight-adapted eyes you need a brighter light. The brighter the lighting, the higher color temperature appears comfortable and vice versa. Take a look at Kruithof Curve describing this phenomena.


----------



## CelticCross74

I consider Zebralights so well designed and made they are literally factory mass produced customs. I only have two because they are always sold out of nearly everything else lol. Brass ring? Almost. Make them IP68 rated and improve the anodization juuuust a touch and bam...


----------



## Swedpat

CelticCross74 said:


> I consider Zebralights so well designed and made they are literally factory mass produced customs. I only have two because they are always sold out of nearly everything else lol. Brass ring? Almost. Make them IP68 rated and improve the anodization juuuust a touch and bam...



I agree with you. My first Zebralight AA flashlight(had headlamps since earlier) was SC5w. I liked it so much I then ordered the predecessor SC52w. And after that SC52d. And headlamp H52w. Can't have too many of these!
And there is a reason I like single AA light so much: the size makes it portable everywhere. The battery is the most available in the world. And there are several options of chemistry to use with them. No need for matching of cells; just put in any AA and if there is some energy left it works, at least at lower modes. 
And here I consider Zebralight as the finest AA light in the world. Everything is top-notch and I have not had any issues with any of my Zebralights. 
Next supplement to my Zebralight collection will be an 18650 flashlight and headlamp. 
Apart from that: yes; I would like Zebralight offered a 2AA as well!


----------



## recDNA

The mkiii hi throws about 15k cd?


----------



## tops2

scs said:


> Thought the Plus would have a frosted lens, or has ZL changed plans?



I think its supposed to have the frosted lens. Sorry if I added to the confusion.

I know they're both really different in purposes..but I only have one bank account! :laughing:
But I think having the H600Fd, the smarter choice is the SC600w MKIII HI to compliment. The Plus version would just be in some ways redundant...but it just sounds sooooo tempting!



recDNA said:


> The mkiii hi throws about 15k cd?



I believe mhanlen measured ~18.3k cd from his youtube review. I faintly remember someone maybe measuring ~18k-19k also.


----------



## markr6

tops2 said:


> But I think having the H600Fd, the smarter choice is the SC600w MKIII HI to compliment. The Plus version would just be in some ways redundant...but it just sounds sooooo tempting!



You're absolutely right. I agree, but I'm still going to get the Plus ASAP!


----------



## ktsl

Swedpat said:


> I agree with you. My first Zebralight AA flashlight(had headlamps since earlier) was SC5w. I liked it so much I then ordered the predecessor SC52w. And after that SC52d. And headlamp H52w. Can't have too many of these!
> And there is a reason I like single AA light so much: the size makes it portable everywhere. The battery is the most available in the world. And there are several options of chemistry to use with them. No need for matching of cells; just put in any AA and if there is some energy left it works, at least at lower modes.
> And here I consider Zebralight as the finest AA light in the world. Everything is top-notch and I have not had any issues with any of my Zebralights.
> Next supplement to my Zebralight collection will be an 18650 flashlight and headlamp.
> Apart from that: yes; I would like Zebralight offered a 2AA as well!



SC5 is indeed a fantastic light. But it misses a beacom mode that I uses so often. Getting Sc32 instead. Similar output, slightly smaller form factor. My entire light system is cr123a/18650 straight. Only keep one AA light for the doomsday's sake.

btw, not that it matters to me, but sc5 doesn't use PID. just so as you know.


----------



## Cobraman502

I have a ZL SC600 MK III HI and I was considering adding a glow in the dark marking on the light so that it is easily located at night on the night stand. I was even thinking I would just leave the light on in the lowest lumen output but I'm not entirely sold on that yet.

If you have any ideas please share them.


----------



## Native89

Cobraman502 said:


> I have a ZL SC600 MK III HI and I was considering adding a glow in the dark marking on the light so that it is easily located at night on the night stand. I was even thinking I would just leave the light on in the lowest lumen output but I'm not entirely sold on that yet.
> 
> If you have any ideas please share them.



Ahhhh. You got me thinking. 
Maybe a glow in the dark O-ring in of the pocket clip channels?
Glow bead on a fob? Reflective paracord fob?
Reflective sticker on the tailcap?
I might personally go with the O-ring if I can find one. 


Also like to add that I've had my MKIII HI for about a month and I'm already itching to get an SC63w to compliment it.
Ugh. Caught some kind of Zebralight bug.


----------



## CelticCross74

glow in the dark lanyard or GITD lanyard beads. Messing with GITD rings will likely mess something up. Ive got the ZL bug as well but of course nobody has anything in stock they sell out so fast. Only have the MkII NW and MkIII HI not sure what to get next....


----------



## Cobraman502

Native89 said:


> Ahhhh. You got me thinking.
> Maybe a glow in the dark O-ring in of the pocket clip channels?
> Glow bead on a fob? Reflective paracord fob?
> Reflective sticker on the tailcap?
> I might personally go with the O-ring if I can find one.
> 
> 
> Also like to add that I've had my MKIII HI for about a month and I'm already itching to get an SC63w to compliment it.
> Ugh. Caught some kind of Zebralight bug.



I was thinking of purchasing a 24 mm GITD o ring and add it to the exterior of flashlight just under the head in the cut section between the switch and the zebra logo. Even adding something around the tail cap could work.


----------



## Cobraman502

Might use 1x3mm tritium vile in the open area of the pocket clip. http://www.mixglo.com/vials.html

Need to find clear heat shrink and might have all I need


----------



## Repsol600rr

So the sc52d is discontinued. Crap! I wanted to buy a backup because I love mine and want one working well into the future. I just now got 14500s for it and what a difference.


----------



## chillinn

Repsol600rr said:


> So the sc52d is discontinued.



Says who? What gives you that crazy idea? Perhaps it is Zebralight's avante garde business plan of keeping most side-clicky models out of stock? Says "out of stock" at ZL site, not "discontinued." Nor is it listed under discontinued in their "compare all models" spread sheet. Also, Night Owl Gear has them in stock.


----------



## Repsol600rr

I saw it in a post a couple pages ago. Tried to quote it. I see I failed. Good news though.
Edit: post 273


----------



## chillinn

Well, I can believe that. I ordered an SC62c from their site, where it was clearly indicated that it was in stock. After 5 days of not hearing anything regarding fulfillment, I contacted support, who informed me the light was discontinued. The refund happened quickly, and I was able to find one on the Bay.


----------



## Repsol600rr

Night owl gear says available on back order. So not good news. Spiffy. Gonna start looking around. If I can't find one oh well. I still need a sc62w.


----------



## roger-roger

Is there any interest in an evolution of the SC52 to SC53? If there is, it might be helpful if ZL knew about it. 

I'm definitely hoping for this. Seriously the SC5 as an AA powered light is due to size, not an effective replacement for the smaller "52" form factor. Not even close.


----------



## markr6

roger-roger said:


> Is there any interest in an evolution of the SC52 to SC53? If there is, it might be helpful if ZL knew about it.
> 
> I'm definitely hoping for this. Seriously the SC5 as an AA powered light is due to size, not an effective replacement for the smaller "52" form factor. Not even close.



I couldn't agree more. Get something like the SC52 to handle the 500lm on an eneloop for 2-3 minutes. I'd be a buyer again. I can't imagine the extra mass of the SC5 being that necessary to handle a little longer run before stepping down. Of course I could be wrong. Personally I think it was just a matter of timing and technology. 500lm/1minute on the 14500 was pushing it. Now I think ZL could put the SC5 performance back into the smaller body. At least that's my hope.


----------



## KeepingItLight

Cobraman502 said:


> I have a ZL SC600 MK III HI and I was considering adding a glow in the dark marking on the light so that it is easily located at night on the night stand. I was even thinking I would just leave the light on in the lowest lumen output but I'm not entirely sold on that yet.
> 
> If you have any ideas please share them.



The ZebraLight UI offers two beacon modes. The first flashes at the H1 level. The second flashes at the Low level you have selected. Thus, you can program L2 to the lowest of the three choices, set L2 to be the active Low mode, and leave the flashlight running in low beacon mode. Runtime should be looooooong.

This may not be what you are looking for, but it is a neat capability nevertheless.


----------



## Swedpat

markr6 said:


> I couldn't agree more. Get something like the SC52 to handle the 500lm on an eneloop for 2-3 minutes. I'd be a buyer again. I can't imagine the extra mass of the SC5 being that necessary to handle a little longer run before stepping down. Of course I could be wrong. Personally I think it was just a matter of timing and technology. 500lm/1minute on the 14500 was pushing it. Now I think ZL could put the SC5 performance back into the smaller body. At least that's my hope.



I understand these thoughts. SC5 is built like a tank and some may think it's unnecessary beefy. In my opinion it's not too wide but it could have been a cm longer for at better hold in the hand, however. With such a beefy body why makes it as short as possible? 
And the grip is much better with the knurling than with the design of SC52 which makes the light to tend to glide away from the fingers. 
I would like the width of SC52 but with the knurled body design of SC5. 
And yes; the possibility to use 14500 hardly is a drawback even if the brightness isn't higher.
Anyway: I like these Zebralights so much I ordered a SC52w and SC52d AFTER I got SC5w. All of them are keepers.


----------



## wolfgaze

KeepingItLight said:


> The ZebraLight UI offers two beacon modes. The first flashes at the H1 level. The second flashes at the Low level you have selected. Thus, you can program L2 to the lowest of the three choices, set L2 to be the active Low mode, and leave the flashlight running in low beacon mode. Runtime should be looooooong.
> 
> This may not be what you are looking for, but it is a neat capability nevertheless.



KeepingItLight - is this only for the SC600 UI? Doesn't appear to be applicable to my SC5 after testing it out...


----------



## KeepingItLight

wolfgaze said:


> KeepingItLight - is this only for the SC600 UI? Doesn't appear to be applicable to my SC5 after testing it out...



I just tested on my *ZebraLight SC62w* and also on my *ZebraLight H600Fd Mk. III*. It works on both of them.


Turn on the flashlight in Low mode. 
Double-click 6 times to enter program mode (i.e., click 12 times fast). 
Double-click one or more times to select the lowest L2 mode. 
Click once to turn off the flashlight, and lock in your choice. 
Pause for a second, and then triple-click to turn on the blinky modes. 
Double-click to cycle through the blinky modes. Stop when you see the low beacon. (Do not look into the light when you are doing this. Instead, aim it at your palm.) 
There are four blinky modes: 1. slow strobe, 2. fast strobe, 3. low beacon, and 4. high beacon. They cycle in that order.

Hope this works for you. Please try again, and let us know.

EDIT: I just looked at selfbuilt's review of the *ZebraLight SC5*. At the 6:15 mark, he demonstrates the blinky modes. Alas, there are only two: a slow strobe and a fast strobe. There are no beacons on the SC5.


----------



## Taxman

I just picked up the Zebralight SC52w L2, and I'm liking it a lot. 

It's insanely bright for a AA. I'm using Pana eneloops in it. The lowest low, without getting into the customized settings, is like 1/3 of a lume. You can actually see the individual diodes on the LED in this setting. That will last 3 weeks I believe at that setting...crazy.


----------



## markr6

Taxman said:


> That will last 3 weeks I believe at that setting...crazy.



Yeah talk about a SHTF light. I once ran a AAA alkaline in my SC52w just for fun. Real loose fit but it worked. And it never completely died on low after hours...just kept going!


----------



## Taxman

I am confused with part of the UI. For reference I am posting the UI from the manufacturer below. I understand and have accomplished cycling through the two (2) default modes that are present in H / M / L. And I have cycled through the additional sub-level modes within each H/M/L modes. But the manufacturer indicates that there is an additional low mode ( three sub's in total) at 0.01 where the H & M modes there are only two sub modes in addition to the default?

So to get there I:

-Click and hold for a 1/2 second to arrive at the default low
-double click 6 times to arrive at 0.34L
-double click again to arrive at 0.06L
-double click again to arrive at 0.01L

What ever choice I settle on, I can click once to turn off the light and that setting will now be the 2nd toggle setting from the default low, correct? So If I drilled down to the 0.01L setting and one-clicked, my low setting for the light would now allow me to toggle in low between 2.7L and 0.01L, correct? This is f'ing amazing!!




Light Output (runtimes)

High: H1 *280* Lm (0.9 hrs) or H2 *172* Lm (1.7 hrs) / *108* Lm (3 hrs)
Medium: M1 *50* Lm (7.5 hrs) or M2 *25 *Lm (12 hrs) / *12* Lm (27 hrs)
Low: L1 *2.7 *Lm (4 days) or L2 *0.34* Lm (3 weeks) / *0.06 *Lm (2 months) / *0.01 *Lm (3 months)


----------



## snowlover91

Taxman said:


> What ever choice I settle on, I can click once to turn off the light and that setting will now be the 2nd toggle setting from the default low, correct? So If I drilled down to the 0.01L setting and one-clicked, my low setting for the light would now allow me to toggle in low between 2.7L and 0.01L, correct? This is f'ing amazing!!
> Light Output (runtimes)
> 
> High: H1 *280* Lm (0.9 hrs) or H2 *172* Lm (1.7 hrs) / *108* Lm (3 hrs)
> Medium: M1 *50* Lm (7.5 hrs) or M2 *25 *Lm (12 hrs) / *12* Lm (27 hrs)
> Low: L1 *2.7 *Lm (4 days) or L2 *0.34* Lm (3 weeks) / *0.06 *Lm (2 months) / *0.01 *Lm (3 months)



Yep that's it, once you toggle through the lower modes you just click once to save it. Then when you turn the light back on in that mode you double click to alternate between L1 and the L2 mode you selected.


----------



## roger-roger

Received a reply from ZL, re: the fate of the SC52.

- no plans for an update to the SC52
- no plans at this time for size reduction of the SC5
- there's been designer "talk" on the miniaturizing of the SC5 driver for the SC52


----------



## xtibi

And no plans for the XHP50 headlamp. 😭


----------



## RTTR

Just the thread I was looking for. Been a long time since I frequented this forum, as its been a long time since I've had myself looking at a new EDC light, but my Surefire fandom is over, they just don't excite me anymore.

I'm looking at the SC63 or SC5 for my new EDC, obviously two very different lights in terms of power source, but I'm open to either. I have read reports of the SC63 PIDing really fast. I don't plan on trying to do night hikes with it at 1300 lumens all night, its just the wrong light for that application I know. But how badly does it ramp down, in Self Builts test on the SC600 MK3 it looks like with no cooling and default PID setting it falls to around the 550-650 lumen mark, is that what is to be expected out of the SC63 despite its mass and size difference? I could very well get the SC5 and be guaranteed knowing what it will thermal drop to as it seems its a traditional timed sense, 500 lumens for about 3 minutes and 300ish there after.

What makes the best EDC option out of those two, I'm def interested in a Zebralight as my next torch and preferably a sub 1" diameter head, never cared to EDC anything bigger which is unfortunate because the SC600 MK3 is a beast.


----------



## KeepingItLight

RTTR said:


> What makes the best EDC option out of those two, I'm def interested in a Zebralight as my next torch and preferably a sub 1" diameter head, never cared to EDC anything bigger which is unfortunate because the SC600 MK3 is a beast.



Yeah, I tried to pocket-carry my *ZebraLight SC62w* a few times, but, eventually, I stopped doing it because it was too big. Nowadays, I carry the 1xAAA *Astrolux A01* flashlight in my pants pocket. I usually have a larger, 18650 light, such as the SC62w, in my daypack or jacket.


----------



## Crazyeddiethefirst

I asked Zebralight if they were going to replace the SC-80(works on AA and CR123A's. Was told they have a design but that it was unlikely to be seen anytime soon. Because of this I have been hunting for an old SC-80 for almost a year-tonight, I scored and bought one for $50!


----------



## markr6

roger-roger said:


> - there's been designer "talk" on the miniaturizing of the SC5 driver for the SC52



Good, let the designers bring it to life...not the marketing guys!


----------



## snowlover91

Crazyeddiethefirst said:


> I asked Zebralight if they were going to replace the SC-80(works on AA and CR123A's. Was told they have a design but that it was unlikely to be seen anytime soon. Because of this I have been hunting for an old SC-80 for almost a year-tonight, I scored and bought one for $50!



Hmm I would love for them to bring this back, it's was a pretty good design. I never had the privilege to own one but I could see it being a hit light if they bring it back.


----------



## Imon

Yeah, I have a old SC80c. Besides for the pocket clip I think it's a fantastically versatile light.
Zebralights said they were going to use a 85 CRI Luxeon Rebel LED with the "c" model.
Color temperature is about 4000K - kind of a funky mellow yellow color. It compares rather unfavorably to my HDS with a 219.

I was told awhile back by Zebralight that they intended to replace the SC80 with a newer model called the SC82.
Does anyone remember if the SC82 ever came out?


----------



## roger-roger

Here's my scaled down ZL inventory, and I'm pretty comfortable with the less is more paradigm.


----------



## scout24

Nice selections! My sc62w has recently found it's way back into my pocket. Hard to beat the outpur range in that size.


----------



## tops2

roger-roger said:


> Here's my scaled down ZL inventory, and I'm pretty comfortable with the less is more paradigm.



Didn't you have two versions of the SC600 MKIII? Did you have the SC63w too? I'm wondering how or why you ended up picking the SC62w? For me, seeing the discount Zebralight is offering for the previous models makes me want to pickup the SC62w since so many here love it. It sounds like a more powerful SC5w, which I love too even though I don't use it much these days.


----------



## roger-roger

tops2 said:


> *Didn't you have two versions of the SC600 MKIII? Did you have the SC63w too?* I'm wondering how or why you ended up picking the SC62w? For me, seeing the discount Zebralight is offering for the previous mark dels makes me want to pickup the SC62w since so many here love it. It sounds like a more powerful SC5w, which I love too even though I don't use it much these days.




Yes, yes, and had the SC63w on order, but cancelled/refunded when it was revealed the ''in stock" status at ZL website was not up to date.

The SC62 was the first ZL I bought. If I hadn't been only testing the waters at the time, I'd have gone with the SC63, but that's hind sight. What I can say is comparing side-by-side the SC600w MK3 XHP35 to the SC62w, at 60-70' there is a moderate but noticeably stronger beam in the SC600w MK3. 

I'd love to have that small improvement the SC63w brings over the SC62w, but perhaps I'll wait for the next update. The SC600 format produces a great light, but for my needs and unless it changes, having that and the SC63/62 is redundant.


----------



## Repsol600rr

Does anyone know if zl will ever make a non f version of the sc5fd. Id love a non frosted lens with the daylight tint. My sc52d has a great beam profile for my uses and looking at their site the only way I can get the tint I want is with the frosted lens which I don't want on a handheld. I can't imagine it would be much more difficult to offer it with a regular lens and op reflector and have it as a somewhat replacement for the sc52d.


----------



## tops2

roger-roger said:


> Yes, yes, and had the SC63w on order, but cancelled/refunded when it was revealed the ''in stock" status at ZL website was not up to date.
> 
> The SC62 was the first ZL I bought. If I hadn't been only testing the waters at the time, I'd have gone with the SC63, but that's hind sight. What I can say is comparing side-by-side the SC600w MK3 XHP35 to the SC62w, at 60-70' there is a moderate but noticeably stronger beam in the SC600w MK3.
> 
> I'd love to have that small improvement the SC63w brings over the SC62w, but perhaps I'll wait for the next update. The SC600 format produces a great light, but for my needs and unless it changes, having that and the SC63/62 is redundant.



Ahh, thanks for the feedback.


----------



## snowlover91

roger-roger said:


> Yes, yes, and had the SC63w on order, but cancelled/refunded when it was revealed the ''in stock" status at ZL website was not up to date.
> 
> The SC62 was the first ZL I bought. If I hadn't been only testing the waters at the time, I'd have gone with the SC63, but that's hind sight. What I can say is comparing side-by-side the SC600w MK3 XHP35 to the SC62w, at 60-70' there is a moderate but noticeably stronger beam in the SC600w MK3.
> 
> I'd love to have that small improvement the SC63w brings over the SC62w, but perhaps I'll wait for the next update. The SC600 format produces a great light, but for my needs and unless it changes, having that and the SC63/62 is redundant.




I have both the 62 and 63 series and if you have one you definitely wouldn't need both. Imo the tint is slightly better on my 62w and it runs longer on the turbo mode. However the 63w appears slightly brighter and is more compact and pocket friendly. Both are great lights but there isn't much of an advantage in buying the 63w especially with the 62 series on sale for $69.


----------



## roger-roger

snowlover91 said:


> *I have both the 62 and 63 series and if you have one you definitely wouldn't need both.* Imo the tint is slightly better on my 62w and it runs longer on the turbo mode. However the 63w appears slightly brighter and is more compact and pocket friendly. Both are great lights but there isn't much of an advantage in buying the 63w especially with the 62 series on sale for $69.




Agree. It would be a lateral upgrade if I did it at all, with the SC62 being passed on.


----------



## KeepingItLight

snowlover91 said:


> I have both the 62 and 63 series and if you have one you definitely wouldn't need both. <snip>



Agreed. With the SC63w priced at $85 a copy, I could not justify an upgrade from the SC62w. I have to say, though, that sitting on the sidelines, while everyone here at CPF was writing about their new SC63w flashlights, was tough!

When the *ZebraLight SC600Fd Mk. III Plus* was announced last winter, I knew I had made the right decision to skip the SC63w.




Repsol600rr said:


> Does anyone know if zl will ever make a non f version of the sc5fd. Id love a non frosted lens with the daylight tint. My sc52d has a great beam profile for my uses and looking at their site the only way I can get the tint I want is with the frosted lens which I don't want on a handheld. I can't imagine it would be much more difficult to offer it with a regular lens and op reflector and have it as a somewhat replacement for the sc52d.



The odds are that ZebraLight will not make a version of the *ZebraLight SC600Fd Mk. III Plus* with a clear lens. The reason has to do with the way the four LEDs of a Cree XHP50 emitter are laid out. There is a small gap between them. Without the use of a frosted lens, the gaps will cause a dark cross to appear in the center of the hot spot. 

I have seen designs that use the XHP50 in flashlights that have OP reflectors that are much larger than what you get in a ZebraLight. Those big lights can get away with using a clear lens, but I am afraid that might be impossible in the compact lights that ZebraLight builds. 

We can always hope that ZebraLight will prove me wrong, but I would not hold breath on it!


----------



## Repsol600rr

Well that may be the case with that light. But what about the sc5fd. Not sc600fd. I don't think they use the same led. The 5fd is an XM-l2 easy white.


----------



## snowlover91

Repsol600rr said:


> Well that may be the case with that light. But what about the sc5fd. Not sc600fd. I don't think they use the same led. The 5fd is an XM-l2 easy white.



The easy white is a similar concept, I've seen pictures of some who have been able to use the right reflector design and prevent the "donut hole" but in small reflectors it would probably have beam artifacts.


----------



## markr6

The EC4S with XHP50 seemed fine to me. I could find that "cross" on a white wall, but it was very faint and not a big deal at all. Even for a complainer like me  But the wider head may have helped that.


----------



## markr6

*SC600F III Plus *is now on the spreadsheet!! 1800 lumens! 70CRI

FD Plus down from 1600 to 1500lm. I'm still a buyer, though.


----------



## Repsol600rr

snowlover91 said:


> The easy white is a similar concept, I've seen pictures of some who have been able to use the right reflector design and prevent the "donut hole" but in small reflectors it would probably have beam artifacts.


Ah. Well that's annoying. I didn't know that about the led. Thanks for the info.


----------



## StandardBattery

markr6 said:


> *SC600F III Plus *is now on the spreadsheet!! 1800 lumens! 70CRI
> 
> FD Plus down from 1600 to 1500lm. I'm still a buyer, though.


So it dropped from 90CRI to 70CRI or is that a typo?


----------



## markr6

StandardBattery said:


> So it dropped from 90CRI to 70CRI or is that a typo?



No, it's an additional model. SC600Fd (5000K, 93CRI) and SC600F (5700K, 70 CRI). Gotta be crazy to give up that 93-95 CRI in my opinion, but whatever floats your boat!


----------



## StandardBattery

markr6 said:


> No, it's an additional model. SC600Fd (5000K, 93CRI) and SC600F (5700K, 70 CRI). Gotta be crazy to give up that 93-95 CRI in my opinion, but whatever floats your boat!


That's a relief I was worried there for a moment. Missed the missing 'd', I was wondering why you posted what I thought was an old addition. Need more coffee... 5K/93CRI just sounds too good to believe so I guess I was on edge.


----------



## markr6

StandardBattery said:


> 5K/93CRI just sounds too good to believe so I guess I was on edge.



I know! I still worry something will change. I guess it did with the 1600 down to 1500lm, but I'm fine with that. Hand-burner modes don't get much respect from me anyway.


----------



## flybird

I have a question of runtime on beacon/strobe mode. For Both AA and 18650 model.
There is no information on their site. ( or I might couldn't find it )
If anyone knows , please kindly advise. Thanks.

Edit : I currently own H502d and H600FW MkII


----------



## Repsol600rr

Sc62w on it's way. Now to decide which headlamp. H52fw of h32fw. Current battery system greatly favors the 52. But I think from what I've read the 32 might be a better light.


----------



## roger-roger

When do you recharge or change batteries, and how does that relate to ZL's 4 flash battery indicator?


----------



## markr6

roger-roger said:


> When do you recharge or change batteries, and how does that relate to ZL's 4 flash battery indicator?



It's a pretty good estimate, but not perfect. I remember my SC5w OP being pretty finicky. Sometimes it would flash twice on a fairly fresh cell. If I loosened and re-tightened the cap, it would go up to 4 flashed. Then maybe back down to 3 flashed after I turned it on for 10 seconds.

I definitely recharge batteries anytime it hits 2 flashes. But don't trust it completely. Sometimes I'll get 4 flashes on 18650 lights after using them a lot...then I read 4.81v on my DMM! Definitely shouldn't be 4 flashes at that point. That's more like 50%


----------



## roger-roger

markr6 said:


> It's a pretty good estimate, but not perfect. I remember my SC5w OP being pretty finicky. Sometimes it would flash twice on a fairly fresh cell. If I loosened and re-tightened the cap, it would go up to 4 flashed. Then maybe back down to 3 flashed after I turned it on for 10 seconds.
> 
> I definitely recharge batteries anytime it hits 2 flashes. But don't trust it completely. Sometimes I'll get 4 flashes on 18650 lights after using them a lot...then I read 4.81v on my DMM! Definitely shouldn't be 4 flashes at that point. That's more like 50%




Thanks. I'm evaluating my H32Fw to choose another headlamp, and notice after moderate use it tends to take a few hours to come back from 2 blinks to 4.


----------



## Repsol600rr

Just received my sc62w. Even after seeing pictures this thing is still smaller and lighter than I expected even with a 3400 in it. It's pretty much exactly the same size and lighter than my hds rotary. And it's now my brightest light. I'm very happy with the tint on mine. I did ask in the little box for one with as even and consistent a tint as possible. So if they actually picked it out they did a great job and if not then I got really lucky. I like the blinky modes setup better than on the sc52 because I can rotate through all 4 without having to pick two presets like with the brightness levels and that I have 4 in the first place. Very happy so far especially considering the price.


----------



## tops2

roger-roger said:


> When do you recharge or change batteries, and how does that relate to ZL's 4 flash battery indicator?



With my SC5w, since Eneloops have less capacity than 18650, I use the battery indicator. Especially when it flashes twice, I'll recharge. But it doesn't feel like the battery indicator scales linear. It felt like 4->3 flashes takes much longer than 3->2 flashes. 2->1 flash felt pretty short.

But with my H600Fd, I don't use it heavily, but I just top off every week. I guess due to my light use, its usually 4 flashes whenever I check.




markr6 said:


> It's a pretty good estimate, but not perfect. I remember my SC5w OP being pretty finicky. Sometimes it would flash twice on a fairly fresh cell. If I loosened and re-tightened the cap, it would go up to 4 flashed. Then maybe back down to 3 flashed after I turned it on for 10 seconds.
> 
> I definitely recharge batteries anytime it hits 2 flashes. But don't trust it completely. Sometimes I'll get 4 flashes on 18650 lights after using them a lot...then I read *4*.81v on my DMM! Definitely shouldn't be 4 flashes at that point. That's more like 50%



4 flashes? Isn't that 5 flashes! 
lol! Sorry, couldn't resist!


----------



## markr6

tops2 said:


> 4 flashes? Isn't that 5 flashes!
> lol!  Sorry, couldn't resist!



haha yeah, 4.81v happens with a $.99 PoopFire charger


----------



## Doug

Is the H60?fw MK 3 XHP35 available yet? Is it 120 degree beam? 5000k?


----------



## StandardBattery

Doug said:


> Is the H60?fw MK 3 XHP35 available yet? Is it 120 degree beam? 5000k?


A H600Fw MK III has 90deg beam and id 4500K. For 5K right now I think you need a "d" series light (e.g. XXXXFd), and that would be an EasyWhite emitter not the XHP35.

A H603w would have a 120deg beam, and 4500K temperature with the XHP35. 
A H603d would have a 120deg beam, a 5000K temperature, but uses the EasyWhite LED. 

Don't know that there will be a 120deg, 5K light that uses the XPH35, at least not for a while. It would not be an "f" series light as those are frosted an 90deg.


----------



## Doug

Anyone know where I can get a H603D? Would it have the new smooth body?


----------



## StandardBattery

Doug said:


> Anyone know where I can get a H603D? Would it have the new smooth body?


Any reason you can't buy it from Zebralight, otherwise Illumn is great, check if he has stock.


----------



## Doug

StandardBattery said:


> Any reason you can't buy it from Zebralight, otherwise Illumn is great, check if he has stock.



Illum does not have any, and ZL has not replied to a message sent through its contact us form for like a month, and all I get when I call is voicemail.... And I leave a message every time.... Dealers tell me they are 2 months behind on delivers, I guess I am assuming that, if I order directly from ZL, they will never process my order.....


----------



## roger-roger

Doug said:


> Illum does not have any, and ZL has not relived to a message sent through its contact us form for like a month, and all I get when I call is voicemail.... And I leave a message every time.... Dealers tell me they are 2 months behind on delivers, I guess I am assuming that, if I order directly from ZL, they will never process my order.....




As can be seen the 603d is listed "in stock". So far my experience is that means its either as it says, or just recently gone out of stock. Try sending another message. I've always received rely within a day or two or three.

The 603 will have the smooth body.


----------



## snowlover91

Zebralight is usually pretty good about replying to messages. I'm guessing at this point they're caught up with the preorders for the new SC600 Plus model coming out that everyone has been waiting for. If you order from ZL directly they usually ship out quickly, all my orders have been fine.


----------



## neil944

I've ordered several lights directly from ZL over the last couple months. They have always shipped within a few days if they are showing "in stock"


----------



## Doug

I just ordered a H603D .... Let's see how long they take! I am use to Amazon, so ZL will certainly be slower....


----------



## roger-roger

Let me reiterate: I ordered an SC63w recently, marked as in-stock at the ZL website. After 4-5 days with no notice of shipping, I went back and the SC63w was indeed marked out-of-stock. 

I'm not complaining. The community here is fine with the way ZL runs their ordering business--charging customers for out-of-stock items. Curiously in this case I've come to accept that ethic, probably because I've more or less become a part of that community, and also due to the numerous testimonies of ZL's customer service. That and ZL's unique place imo, as a small and highly innovative *production* company--they get slack for that.

In most circumstances these business practices are for me unacceptable.


----------



## markr6

I never really think about paying for stock/out of stock items. I assume it will eventually get to me. But they need to notify their customers IMMEDIATELY so they can plan accordingly. For example, cancel the order and buy from another seller in case they need it for an upcoming trip or whatever the reason may be.


----------



## Doug

I received a shipping notice email from ZL today.... I guess there shipping Dept is on the ball at least!


----------



## snowlover91

Doug said:


> I received a shipping notice email from ZL today.... I guess there shipping Dept is on the ball at least!



Awesome! Their email department is probably busy answering all the questions about the new SC600 Plus model


----------



## DaveSebring

I ordered my SC600w III Hi on Sept 9th direct from Zebralight and it arrived on the 19th.

Nice light


----------



## markr6

FYI - They added "MacAdam ellipse" column to the product sheet


----------



## tops2

Not sure where to ask this...

Since the SC5w's head is listed as larger than the SC62w/SC63w... Would this mean at the approximate same lumen level, the SC5w may throw slightly further? Or at least both will throw approximately same distance at about the same lumen level?


----------



## StandardBattery

tops2 said:


> Not sure where to ask this...
> 
> Since the SC5w's head is listed as larger than the SC62w/SC63w... Would this mean at the approximate same lumen level, the SC5w may throw slightly further? Or at least both will throw approximately same distance at about the same lumen level?



No, the optical window is essentially the same, and although my SC5 series have frosted windows I believe that the 62 may have a deeper reflector for a tighter beam and more throw, but they could be pretty close in that dimension as well, hard to say exactly because of the frosted window... but certainly I would not expect it. The best you can do for more throw would be the get a Cree HI emitter which I don't think they offer yet in the SC5 series.


----------



## eraursls1984

StandardBattery said:


> No, the optical window is essentially the same, and although my SC5 series have frosted windows I believe...


The SC5 Is available with a frosted lens, but not all of them have frosted lenses.


----------



## StandardBattery

eraursls1984 said:


> The SC5 Is available with a frosted lens, but not all of them have frosted lenses.


Yes, I obviously know that... but I don't have one of them to check the depth of the reflector or the finish on.


----------



## mightysparrow

Is there any way to predict whether Zebralight will be coming out with a new version of a particular light in the next six months, when there is no sign of such a new design on the Zebralight website?

I'm debating whether to purchase a SC32 now (on backorder) or wait for a new version. I notice that the current version became available for purchase in January, 2015. I can wait six months or so, but if it will take a year or more for a new version to appear, I'd be inclined to buy now.


----------



## iamlucky13

mightysparrow said:


> Is there any way to predict whether Zebralight will be coming out with a new version of a particular light in the next six months, when there is no sign of such a new design on the Zebralight website?



On their home page there is a link in the left column labeled "Compare All Models" that leads to a Google spreadsheet. I have read they often list upcoming models in it, but haven't been able to verify, since every time I've tried to load it, I get "Google Docs encountered an error. Please try reloading this page, or coming back to it in a few minutes."


----------



## markr6

mightysparrow said:


> Is there any way to predict whether Zebralight will be coming out with a new version of a particular light in the next six months, when there is no sign of such a new design on the Zebralight website?
> 
> I'm debating whether to purchase a SC32 now (on backorder) or wait for a new version. I notice that the current version became available for purchase in January, 2015. I can wait six months or so, but if it will take a year or more for a new version to appear, I'd be inclined to buy now.



Good question. The SC32(w) is feeling a bit stale. Nothing wrong with it, but it seems like time for an update. I think there was some mention of the CR123 format being pushed to the "bottom of the list" regarding any upgrades. I can't remember which thread though.


----------



## mightysparrow

iamlucky13: thanks for your response. I have seen the chart on Zebralight's website - that's where I learned the date on which the current version became available. I'm sorry to hear the page isn't loading for you. I haven't had any problems loading it.

markr6: thanks for the response and the info regarding the talk online of the CR123 format being a low priority for an upgrade. I'll investigate a little to see if that information comes directly from Zebralight. I'll see if I can find the thread in which that is mentioned.


----------



## iamlucky13

mightysparrow said:


> iamlucky13: thanks for your response. I have seen the chart on Zebralight's website - that's where I learned the date on which the current version became available. I'm sorry to hear the page isn't loading for you. I haven't had any problems loading it.



Oops. I wondered if I might just be sharing common knowledge.

Thanks for responding though. I've tried "coming back in a few minutes" to the spreadsheet a dozen times over the last week. Knowing that you were able to open it, I tried again using Internet Explorer, and it opened fine. Apparently the problem is Firefox, or something to do with my settings on Firefox.

Looking through the discontinued light list, I was interested to see there used to be an H51Fc. I'm currently headlamp shopping, and after figuring out Zebralight's nomenclature, decided to buy the H52Fc...only to go to their website and find out it doesn't exist.

It's encouraging to know they went this route once before, but the spreadsheet doesn't give any hints the light I want is forthcoming. The basic body (H52Fw) has been out for 3 years. A high CRI emitter and driver pair (SC5Fc) has been out for over a year. I don't think I'm going to try waiting to see if the fusion of those two comes out any time soon.


----------



## eraursls1984

I would expect a SC3 before a new SC32. Just imagine what they could do with the CR123 after they got 500 lumens out of an Eneloop.


----------



## iamlucky13

iamlucky13 said:


> On their home page there is a link in the left column labeled "Compare All Models" that leads to a Google spreadsheet. I have read they often list upcoming models in it, but haven't been able to verify, since every time I've tried to load it, I get "Google Docs encountered an error. Please try reloading this page, or coming back to it in a few minutes."



A quick self-help tech support follow-up in case anybody else has this problem:

It appears my trouble opening the Zebralight spreadsheet is related to the fact that I was logged into my personal Google Docs account and/or Gmail. When I log out, or try to view the Zebralight spreadsheet from another browser or in private browsing mode, it opens fine.


----------



## roger-roger

eraursls1984 said:


> I would expect a SC3 before a new SC32. Just imagine what they could do with the CR123 after they got 500 lumens out of an Eneloop.



You might be correct on that (unfortunately). Personally I don't favor the increase in size in the SC5 format, most likely in place to increase heat sink ability to handle the added brightness. I'd rather ZL go for a moderate increase, in order to maintain compactness and light weight.


----------



## mightysparrow

roger-roger said:


> You might be correct on that (unfortunately). Personally I don't favor the increase in size in the SC5 format, most likely in place to increase heat sink ability to handle the added brightness. I'd rather ZL go for a moderate increase, in order to maintain compactness and light weight.



I see your argument - I have a long commute and physical limits on how much I can carry due to health issues - so I, too, have hesitated on the SC5, as great as it is in performance, function, and quality, due to its bulk and weight. I've also hesitated because I have a first generation SC52, sort of similar in basic performance.

I just don't know what to do about whether to go ahead and buy a SC32w now. My frugal side tells me to wait, but I've been very frugal for years compared to many flashlight fans. I've been lusting for the SC32w since it was the SC31 and SC80.

Edit on October 20: I emailed Zebralight last night, and this morning I found a very prompt reply in my inbox indicating that there are no plans to issue a new version of the SC32/H32 in the next six months.


----------



## brighterthanthesun

Hello ZL fans, I am about to buy my first and need some help. Please give me your opinions between the SC63 and the SC63w to help me decide. I instinctively like the higher max output of the SC63, but I have heard good things about the tint of the SC63w. I never thought that I would get this picky about a flashlight, CPF is really having an effect on me. Thanks


----------



## emarkd

brighterthanthesun said:


> I instinctively like the higher max output of the SC63, but I have heard good things about the tint of the SC63w



You literally won't be able to tell the difference between 1100 and 1300 lumens by the naked eye. You'll definitely be able to tell the difference in tint though. Don't get caught up in chasing max lumens. That's a losing battle anyway. Buy good light.


----------



## AVService

emarkd said:


> You literally won't be able to tell the difference between 1100 and 1300 lumens by the naked eye. You'll definitely be able to tell the difference in tint though. Don't get caught up in chasing max lumens. That's a losing battle anyway. Buy good light.




Agree completely!
I have carried the SC52 since it came out and got the SC52w the day it came out and the difference is astonishing to me.


----------



## tops2

brighterthanthesun said:


> Hello ZL fans, I am about to buy my first and need some help. Please give me your opinions between the SC63 and the SC63w to help me decide. I instinctively like the higher max output of the SC63, but I have heard good things about the tint of the SC63w. I never thought that I would get this picky about a flashlight, CPF is really having an effect on me. Thanks



I say go ahead and try the "w" version and just hope you like it. Lol.
When I started my journey down flashlights last year, I was debating between the SC5 vs SC5w and just bit the bullet an tried the "w". Now I only prefer neutral whites. Granted, I probably won the tint lottery... My coworker really liked my SC5w so I brought him to Illumn to buy one too. So I had a rare opportunity to do beamshot comparison and found his more "white" and mine slightly "warmer".


----------



## brighterthanthesun

I ordered the SC63w on Monday and it came this morning (Thursday). Wow is it small! Now I just have to wait until dark, I can't wait.


----------



## brighterthanthesun

My first impression of the 63w...where have you been all of my life!!! I am still trying to get it set the way I want, but I love the tint. Comparing the sc63w to my other lights makes their cool white look awful. Very happy with my purchase.


----------



## tops2

brighterthanthesun said:


> My first impression of the 63w...where have you been all of my life!!! I am still trying to get it set the way I want, but I love the tint. Comparing the sc63w to my other lights makes their cool white look awful. Very happy with my purchase.



Lol. Congrats! Its hard to go back to my other lights after getting used to the Zebralight UI...at least for me.


----------



## markr6

tops2 said:


> Lol. Congrats! Its hard to go back to my other lights after getting used to the Zebralight UI...at least for me.



No kidding. With the exception of some simple momentary/forward clicky lights (MD2, T25C2), they all suck in comparison!


----------



## Cunha

I want an sc63HI to make it a little less floody. Otherwise it's the best edc thing I've ever seen.


----------



## markr6

Lots of updates going on the Zebralight spreadsheet!!


Eco Series flashlight and headlamps with black anodizing! TIR optics. AA, CR123, 18650 versions.


----------



## jak

markr6 said:


> Lots of updates going on the Zebralight spreadsheet!!
> 
> Eco Series flashlight and headlamps with black anodizing! TIR optics. AA, CR123, 18650 versions.


Bro, I beat you by 8 minutes this time... VICTORY! Check it:
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...Zebralight-Eco-Series-Flashlight-and-Headlamp


----------



## Climb14er

I received the SC62cw light and some Panasonic Sanyo 18650GA batteries and am truly blown away by the light for EDC. Will supplement the SC52 for EDC and psobably carry the SC62 most of the time.


----------



## markr6

jak said:


> Bro, I beat you by 8 minutes this time... VICTORY! Check it:
> http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...Zebralight-Eco-Series-Flashlight-and-Headlamp



Haha you got it! But this _is _the official ZL thread


----------



## emarkd

Anybody see the C3 on the sheet? 3xXHP70 for 9000 lumens. Gimme.


----------



## TCY

My wallet ain't ready for this...


----------



## emarkd

Mine either, but I'm excited. I've been waiting for another big Zebra. Its been a long time since the 6330 was a thing. The idea of a big flooder with Zebras boost driver abilities and smart PID regulation is a winner. I want.


----------



## low

But there is no price for the C3. Does $189.00 sound about right? I have never purchased a flashlight above 5000K, but being this one will be 5700K, I might be able to get by with that. 9000 lumens makes up for a lot, and coming from a Zebralight will this will definitely rock!


----------



## iamlucky13

Oh wow. This sounds like they're making a big departure from their past gradual iterations. I'm very intrigued, but I hope they're not going to have compromise on quality and features to achieve a $39 price on that H3.

I'm deeply troubled by the C3 though. Looking at wonders like the Olight X7 and Convoy L6, I keep having to tell myself over and over again I do not have any legitimate need to hold the equivalent of multiple car headlights in the palm of my hand. Now Zebralight is trying to corrupt me, too!


----------



## drummer132132

Looking forward to the C3 as well. If it's as good as the SC6330 (which I wish I had) it will be very nice.


----------



## tech25

Interesting, it looks like they listened to people about going back to a similar flood beam like the original headlamps (less then 180 degrees due to the TIR). 

now my questions is, should I buy the H600fw now, or wait and pick up a few of the eco line lights?


----------



## jak

I wonder if all the Eco lights will have a TIR lens like ArmyTec, or like Olight. Beam type _is_ listed as floody.


----------



## TCY

tech25 said:


> Interesting, it looks like they listened to people about going back to a similar flood beam like the original headlamps (less then 180 degrees due to the TIR).
> 
> now my questions is, should I buy the H600fw now, or wait and pick up a few of the eco line lights?



They are different products. H600Fw has way more features than the eco line but twice the cost.


----------



## tech25

I most probably end up with a H600fw and a couple of eco line lights- just because...


----------



## StandardBattery

jak said:


> I wonder if all the Eco lights will have a TIR lens like ArmyTec, or like Olight. Beam type _is_ listed as floody.


Would make sense. This is the economy line, and once designed the TIR is much less expensive. However, it's a crowded market so it will be interesting to see what they produce at what price point. If they stay away from all that ugly text on some of those other lights they are off to a good start. I hope they do 18350 in the economy line, they might need built in charger also to be competitive.


----------



## jak

StandardBattery said:


> If they stay away from all that ugly text on some of those other lights they are off to a good start. I hope they do 18350 in the economy line, they might need built in charger also to be competitive.


I don't see them doing an 18350... requires a new column in the spreadsheet. (Ha!)
I agree that a built in charge would be great, but if it's not mentioned in that notes section, I feel like it's not in the forecast.

I'm most curious as to what they'll look like. A black Zebralight, I assume that's a more cost effective choice.


----------



## eraursls1984

jak said:


> I don't see them doing an 18350... requires a new column in the spreadsheet. (Ha!)
> I agree that a built in charge would be great, but if it's not mentioned in that notes section, I feel like it's not in the forecast.
> 
> I'm most curious as to what they'll look like. A black Zebralight, I assume that's a more cost effective choice.


They currently use natural HA, the black requires an extra step of dyeing. It may eliminate a QC step making sure that the natural HA meets the color standards though .


----------



## tops2

After much debate the whole year, I've finally pulled the trigger on the Zebralight SC600w MKIII. Its scheduled to be delivered on Monday so I can't wait!

I ended up picking this light cause I wanted one with good balance of closer range use and good enough throw for me. And when I go on night walks, I prefer to bring just one good all around light and don't like to bring multiple lights.

I made the decision based on 4 of the lights I own:
- I have the Zebralight H600Fd and love the floody beam for close distance, but found it lacking in throw. This ruled out the newer SC600Fd as it'll feel like a duplicate to me.
- My only thrower is the EagleEye X6 (which I bought due to price so I can try out a "throwy" light) and while the throw is pretty awesome (to me anyways), I find the beam too tight, small and intense for close range. This kinda reminds me of when I was able to demo the SC600w MKIII HI. I do still think about the HI a lot due to all the praise.
- I have the Zebralight SC5w and like the beam on this light. I find this beam to be the most versatile with good enough CRI and good tint on mine. I basically want a higher power version of this light (which I know technically should be SC600w MKII).
- To me, my most "balanced" outdoor light is my Thrunite TN12 2014. It has a bigger hotspot with pretty decent (especially compared to my X6). It throws way further than I'd ever need.

The longest consideration is between the SC62w/SC63w vs the SC600w MKIII. But I have much smaller and more comfortable pocket EDC, so end the end, I said screw it and get the larger light. I'd only bring this light out for night walks so in the end, the size difference isn't that big of a deal. And the feedback from everyone here really helped too!

The only thing left actually is to order some Sanyo GA batteries and hopefully pick them up on Monday from Illumn. Can't wait! Now my Zebralight collection will (slowly) grow to the SC5w, H600Fd and SC600w MKIII.


----------



## roger-roger

tops2 said:


> After much debate the whole year, I've finally pulled the trigger on the Zebralight SC600w MKIII. Its scheduled to be delivered on Monday so I can't wait!
> 
> I ended up picking this light cause I wanted one with good balance of closer range use and good enough throw for me. And when I go on night walks, I prefer to bring just one good all around light and don't like to bring multiple lights....




Based on your deliberations I'm going to say that was a good choice (I have/had the SC62w and SC5). The SC600w MK3 is probably my favorite ZL, and the only reason mine got sold was the preference to keep a minimalist collection. Its larger form factor didn't quite fit into most of my needs, alas.


----------



## tops2

I had the SC600w MKIII for 2 days now and have decided to return the light.

First the good. The light is much smaller and lighter than I expected but outputs so much light. I like the beam with the larger hotspot and good spill. The build is typical solid Zebralight. On H1, the beam throws basically the same as my Thrunite TN12 2014.

The reason I ended up returning it today is the tint. From the comments everywhere, I expected the beam to be more yellow vs the creamy of the previous generation. But I wasn't expecting it to be so yellow. Especially at lower levels, everything has that "dirty yellow" tinge that I don't like. Since most of my usage is at lower levels, the yellowness bothered me a lot. Even though its rated CRI is 80 vs my SC5w's CRI 75, all colors appears washed out yellow. Its almost the opposite of what I don't like about cool whites washing out everything in a blue-ish tint. The colors on my SC5w looks so much better and pops.

But I guess from my limited experience with XHP35 leds, I don't really like them that much for "neutral white" as it appears more yellow to me. The Armytek Wizard Pro v3 I had was warm..and basically had the same dirty yellow.

Not really sure if I wanna try the SC600 MKIII since others mentioned its pretty neutral for a cool white light. I kinda wanna try the SC63 too, but afraid to get one with a "donut hole". The cool white of the Armytek Wizard Pro v3 looks pretty good to me. Or just go with the older SC600w MKII or SC62w (when it come back in stock). But then I don't really wanna play tint lottery that much and don't wanna take advantage of Zebralight and buy and return... Or I should take a break for a while and enjoy what I already have! 

As an aside...kudos to Zebralight for such good customer service. Started the RMA process on Zebralight's website around 9pm last night and within an hour, got a reply and RMA number!


----------



## maukka

tops2 said:


> I had the SC600w MKIII for 2 days now and have decided to return the light.
> The reason I ended up returning it today is the tint.



That was my experience as well. Just get the SC600w MKIII HI. It's pretty much perfect.


----------



## Tachead

maukka said:


> That was my experience as well. *Just get the SC600w MKIII HI. It's pretty much perfect.*



More and more reports are stating that there is a lottery with the HI too. It is only a 5-Step model as well. I wish ZL would just charge $20 more a model and start cherry picking the emitters for all their models. I for one would gladly pay more for a guaranteed clean tint on the BBRL.


----------



## markr6

Tachead said:


> More and more reports are stating that there is a lottery with the HI too. It is only a 5-Step model as well. I wish ZL would just charge $20 more a model and start cherry picking the emitters for all their models. I for one would gladly pay more for a guaranteed clean tint on the BBRL.



That would be great. I'd pay more too.

My HI tint is the exact same tint as the standard MKIII I had (sold). Both great lights, but decided to use my HI as the "do it all" light even though it's quite throwy.


----------



## Connor

Tachead said:


> I wish ZL would just charge $20 more a model and start cherry picking the emitters for all their models.



Cherry picking LEDs DOES. NOT. WORK. EVER. (for a normal company)

-every single LED is different and they're sold in batches of hundreds/thousands with considerable variance even within a certain binning
-colour temperature/tint perception is highly subjective
-if a company picks the "best" LEDs for _some _users they cannot throw away the "bad" LEDs for obvious economical reasons, thus the other non-cherry-picked lights get worse LEDs which _will _produce more unhappy customers


----------



## eraursls1984

Connor said:


> Cherry picking LEDs DOES. NOT. WORK. EVER.
> 
> -every single LED is different and they're sold in batches of hundreds/thousands with considerable variance even within a certain binning
> -colour temperature/tint perception is highly subjective
> -if a company picks the "best" LEDs for _some _users they cannot throw away the "bad" LEDs for obvious economical reasons, thus the other non-cherry-picked lights get worse LEDs which _will _produce more unhappy customers


I thinki t works with the ones they already cherry pick, why wouldn't it with any other models? They can throw away, give away, sell at a discount if the person paying a premium for tint has already paid for several emitters (part of the price increase would cover multiple emitters, part would be labor).


----------



## tops2

maukka said:


> That was my experience as well. Just get the SC600w MKIII HI. It's pretty much perfect.




Lol. I'm starting to consider it again. Once "concern" is the amount of spill at lower levels. It does sound like a high levels there's enough spill.



markr6 said:


> My HI tint is the exact same tint as the standard MKIII I had (sold). Both great lights, but decided to use my HI as the "do it all" light even though it's quite throwy.



Hm..I was under the impression the HI isn't as yellow? Thought it was more creamy? If its yellowish still..then not sure if I'll like it then...


----------



## Tachead

Connor said:


> Cherry picking LEDs DOES. NOT. WORK. EVER. (for a normal company)
> 
> -every single LED is different and they're sold in batches of hundreds/thousands with considerable variance even within a certain binning
> -colour temperature/tint perception is highly subjective
> -if a company picks the "best" LEDs for _some _users they cannot throw away the "bad" LEDs for obvious economical reasons, thus the other non-cherry-picked lights get worse LEDs which _will _produce more unhappy customers



Lol, do you even know how little an emitter costs when you buy them in multiple spools of 1000. It is probably one of the cheapest components in a light. Some people, including myself, would be willing to pay $20-50US more for a light with a hand picked emitter close to or right on the black body radiation line. The premium price would easily offset throwing away a certain percentage of emitters. Or, they could even resell them to budget light makers at a discount. They don't have to do it for every line either, maybe just the C and D models. And, the lower MacAdam Ellipse step rated emitters they could purchase the lower the number of rejects there would be.


----------



## Duramarks

I had a custom holder for my SC62 made at a Amish boot and tach store today. 
This thing is great.


----------



## StandardBattery

Duramarks said:


> I had a custom holder for my SC62 made at a Amish boot and tach store today.
> This thing is great.
> .....


Nice and simple. Looks great, being open no one has to think the clip is attached to a big knife.
Hope it continues to work well for you.


----------



## Duramarks

The best part is that it was $8


----------



## Connor

Tachead said:


> Lol, do you even know how little an emitter costs when you buy them in multiple spools of 1000. It is probably one of the cheapest components in a light. Some people, including myself, would be willing to pay $20-50US more for a light with a hand picked emitter close to or right on the black body radiation line. The premium price would easily offset throwing away a certain percentage of emitters. Or, they could even resell them to budget light makers at a discount. They don't have to do it for every line either, maybe just the C and D models. And, the lower MacAdam Ellipse step rated emitters they could purchase the lower the number of rejects there would be.



Yes, I do. Do you? It's probably the most _expensive _component in a ZebraLight (except for the machined body itself). 
It's not economically feasible to throw away that many emitters. Even with the 2-step MacAdam ellipse region you probably have to throw away 90% for that near-perfect tint you are looking for. 

Take a step out of your filter bubble and realize that there are only very few people like us who are looking for that _really _perfect tint. Most don't even care for neutral white or high(er) CRI.


----------



## Tachead

Connor said:


> Yes, I do. Do you? It's probably the most _expensive _component in a ZebraLight (except for the machined body itself).
> It's not economically feasible to throw away that many emitters. Even with the 2-step MacAdam ellipse region you probably have to throw away 90% for that near-perfect tint you are looking for.
> 
> Take a step out of your filter bubble and realize that there are only very few people like us who are looking for that _really _perfect tint. Most don't even care for neutral white or high(er) CRI.



Yes, I do. Around $3 an emitter for an XHP35(depending on quantity) and that is from a middle man. I am sure it would be even cheaper when ordered direct. It is no where near the most expensive component. How is it not economically feasible? I think you may need to take an economics or math course. They could throw out 50% of the emitters and if they even charged $20 more per light it would cover the thrown out emitters more then 3 times(many people would be willing to pay more then $20 more too). and, they could sell the left over emitters if they wanted to. 90%? What are you talking about? The C&D models use 2-step Easywhite emitters now and they are all close to perfect. I don't think I have even heard anyone complain about the tint on a C or D model. If they could source all 2-step emitters, they wouldn't even have to do any more then they are doing now. The problem is they cant because they are hard to get in numbers or don't exist for certain models. 

People who buy the C&D models do care. Most normal people don't even know who ZL is. I would guess that a large part of the people who buy ZL care about tint.

More and more people are learning about the benefits of higher CRI, better tint, and chosing the right temp for the application every day. A shift is even happening in the household lighting market. Many new LED lights have at least 80 CRI because customers are starting to want the higher CRI models. They also come in all different temps now including 2700K, 3000K, 4000K, 5000K, etc. The days of the ignorant consumer are starting to come to an end when it comes to lighting. Many home decorating magazines and TV shows are doing segments and articles on CRI, colour temp, etc. too lately. Things are changing fast. More and more flashlight companies are offering different colour temps and high CRI options too. Even Nitecore(a much more mainstream and mass produced brand) has a bunch of High CRI options this year as well as many models with colour temp options.


----------



## emarkd

You can buy 3-step Nichia emitters from an individual "middle man" on blf right now for 4 bucks each. That's a very tight Nichia binning, bought in small quantities. I'm sure a big manufacturer can get them for less in bulk.

That said, I can only assume that supply is an issue with the "best" tint emitters. There's no other reason we don't see more of them. This is the first time I can remember the 3-step Nichia's showing up anywhere, this guy only got a handful of them, and he says he can't get more until February. So maybe it would be hard for a manufacturer to even supply a large order of them? I don't know, just thinking out loud.


----------



## Connor

Tachead said:


> How is it not economically feasible?



It's not feasible because they're not gonna sell more than a few hundred / low thousands of those more expensive lights (that's my guess!) while having to throw away hundreds if not thousands of emitters at ~$2 a piece. 
BTW: I don't know the price for the 2-step / highest flux emitters but I assume they are considerably more expensive .. and *very *hard to get. 

Regarding the rate of the "perfect tint" emitters: Look at what happened with the SC600Fd III+ with XHP50 / 3-step MacAdams ellipse region emitters. 
This is by all means one of the better binnings and even then lots of CPF users were complaining about the tint. My personal SC600Fd III+ has a quite nice tint but it's definitely not perfect either. 

Also: someone has to test all those emitters. This takes a lot of time and money, too. I still don't think it's possible to do this for $20 more .. it would have to be considerably more expensive. And then you end up with a light very few people are actually buying because they don't even know about the difference. I'd love to see a "guaranteed perfect tint" option by Zebralight, I just don't see it happening.


----------



## Derek Dean

I've been a tint snob from day one, but I quickly learned that it was an exercise in futility trying to get a light with a perfectly tinted LED.

Zebralight does what they do so well, with their wonderfully efficient drivers, and their precision machined bodies. I'm willing to take full responsibility for my obsessively compulsive need for good tint and simply do that part of it myself, adding filters to get me that final little way towards perfect. I've filtered all 4 of my Zebras (including the triple Nichia 219), and now they are all very nearly perfect, with only minor, and perfectly acceptable, loss of output.......... and it only cost pennies per light. 

But hey, don't let me stop you'all from your quest for the perfectly tinted LED...... sometimes that's half the fun : )


----------



## eraursls1984

Derek Dean said:


> I've been a tint snob from day one, but I quickly learned that it was an exercise in futility trying to get a light with a perfectly tinted LED.
> 
> Zebralight does what they do so well, with their wonderfully efficient drivers, and their precision machined bodies. I'm willing to take full responsibility for my obsessively compulsive need for good tint and simply do that part of it myself, adding filters to get me that final little way towards perfect. I've filtered all 4 of my Zebras (including the triple Nichia 219), and now they are all very nearly perfect, with only minor, and perfectly acceptable, loss of output.......... and it only cost pennies per light.
> 
> But hey, don't let me stop you'all from your quest for the perfectly tinted LED...... sometimes that's half the fun : )


What filters did you use?


----------



## tops2

Derek Dean said:


> I've been a tint snob from day one, but I quickly learned that it was an exercise in futility trying to get a light with a perfectly tinted LED.
> 
> Zebralight does what they do so well, with their wonderfully efficient drivers, and their precision machined bodies. I'm willing to take full responsibility for my obsessively compulsive need for good tint and simply do that part of it myself, adding filters to get me that final little way towards perfect. I've filtered all 4 of my Zebras (including the triple Nichia 219), and now they are all very nearly perfect, with only minor, and perfectly acceptable, loss of output.......... and it only cost pennies per light.
> 
> But hey, don't let me stop you'all from your quest for the perfectly tinted LED...... sometimes that's half the fun : )



Just curious how do you attach the filter? Does it have the same effect as the "diffuser tape" though?


----------



## Derek Dean

eraursls1984 said:


> What filters did you use?





tops2 said:


> Just curious how do you attach the filter? Does it have the same effect as the "diffuser tape" though?



So as not to hijack this thread, check out this link for all the information you need:
*http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?320811-Changing-LED-Tint-With-Filters*

Be aware that some of the links in my first post might be outdated, but a little Googling will get you up to date info. If you have any further questions, feel free to PM me and I'll be more than happy to answer them, at length, as I'm a HUGE filter advocate.

P.S. One CPF member uses a PINK Highlighter pen to add a bit of magenta to the front of his cover glass, getting rid of most of the irritating green tint he had. Pretty cool stuff.


----------



## eraursls1984

Derek Dean said:


> So as not to hijack this thread, check out this link for all the information you need:
> *http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?320811-Changing-LED-Tint-With-Filters*


Thank you. I saw that thread years ago, couldn't remember where I saw it.


----------



## tops2

Derek Dean said:


> So as not to hijack this thread, check out this link for all the information you need:
> *http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?320811-Changing-LED-Tint-With-Filters*
> 
> Be aware that some of the links in my first post might be outdated, but a little Googling will get you up to date info. If you have any further questions, feel free to PM me and I'll be more than happy to answer them, at length, as I'm a HUGE filter advocate.
> 
> P.S. One CPF member uses a PINK Highlighter pen to add a bit of magenta to the front of his cover glass, getting rid of most of the irritating green tint he had. Pretty cool stuff.



Wow! Didn't even know tips like this existed! Thanks! Time to dig through that thread and learn some more. :twothumbs


----------



## Random Dan

Just got my SC5Fc today. Most beautiful beam of any light I've used. The only problem is that the H2 mode has a quite noticeable high pitched whine. Is this typical of the SC5 or should I return it?


----------



## dubliftment

markr6 said:


> That would be great. I'd pay more too.
> 
> My HI tint is the exact same tint as the standard MKIII I had (sold). Both great lights, but decided to use my HI as the "do it all" light even though it's quite throwy.


The tint on my SC600w HI is astonishingly much better than the SC600w that I returned (coincidentally the refund and the HI arrived the same day.) The HI has an incredibly good tint. It is has nice color rendering too. No purple, almost no yellow. Heck, this light has a slightly cooler CCT than my SC52Fw. Actually, upon returning the SC600w and ordering the HI I specifically asked them to select a sample without tint shift to yellow and as cool as possible. So obviously they did. Only thing I did, because it is too throwy for me, I put some magic tape over the lens (which is only so lightly structured that you still can see the LED and the peeling of the reflector.)


----------



## ridwan_neutron

is there any built in rechargeable flashlight from zebralight?


----------



## noboneshotdog

ridwan_neutron said:


> is there any built in rechargeable flashlight from zebralight?



Not yet . But there are rumors there may be one coming.


----------



## bexamous

So here is my biggest issue with Zebralight... you buy a flashlight, year later some cool new thing is out and gotta get it.. but the old one is still awesome... I've now got...
SC600
SC600W
SC80W
SC600 MKII
S6330
SC600F MKIII Plus

The SC600 is still great flashlight... what do I need all these for? Also when can I preorder this C3 I hear of?


----------



## tops2

bexamous said:


> So here is my biggest issue with Zebralight... you buy a flashlight, year later some cool new thing is out and gotta get it.. but the old one is still awesome... I've now got...
> SC600
> SC600W
> SC80W
> SC600 MKII
> S6330
> SC600F MKIII Plus
> 
> The SC600 is still great flashlight... what do I need all these for? Also when can I preorder this C3 I hear of?



Wow! I notice you don't have any of the SC62(w)/63(w). Just curious of your reasoning?


----------



## eraursls1984

There was just an update. I think the SC5c XP-L 93-95 CRI is new.


----------



## markr6

eraursls1984 said:


> There was just an update. I think the SC5c XP-L 93-95 CRI is new.



Good find! The SC5x line was too fat and heavy for a 1AA IMO, but I'm sure many will jump all over this one.


----------



## emarkd

Yeah I got an email notification too, and I agree that's probably the change. At least, I don't remember that light from before. I kinda like the SC5x form so I can see myself buying that light. Wonder what XP-L they're using though, cause I didn't know they were available with that high of a CRI.


----------



## eraursls1984

markr6 said:


> Good find! The SC5x line was too fat and heavy for a 1AA IMO, but I'm sure many will jump all over this one.


I agree, but a SC5c sure does temp me. I have a few more Zebralights higher up on the want list though.


----------



## hmihaylov

At least per XP-L Datasheet, there are XP-L bins with CRI 90+
I am wondering, however why Zebra are not using the newer XP-L2. It should be more efficient. And also has CRI 90+ version.

The other update to Zebralight's spreadsheet is specifying H3 and H3w's LEDs to be again XP-L. Same concern.


----------



## Gt390

I just checked the Zebralight web page and didn't see an sc5c. Does anyone have a link?


----------



## emarkd

Gt390 said:


> I just checked the Zebralight web page and didn't see an sc5c. Does anyone have a link?



Its not released yet so it won't be on the webpage proper. On the left of the main page, click the red "Compare all models" "button" and it'll take you to the product comparison spreadsheet. You'll see it there, at least all that's known about it. It is a pre-release item though, so specs can (and probably will) change before it makes it to market (if it ever does...).


----------



## Gt390

I see, thank you. Hopefully it is not vapor ware. Does Zebralight make a habit of putting things up and then not releasing them?


----------



## markr6

Gt390 said:


> I see, thank you. Hopefully it is not vapor ware. Does Zebralight make a habit of putting things up and then not releasing them?



Q50 is a great example LOL! There were others, but nothing I would call a habit or excessive. That's what makes them great...always thinking about the next thing, but not just throwing stuff at the wall to see what sticks. I also remember a weird yellow plastic 2AA model - the S5200. Oh and the TC series (tail clicky) switches. At one point, they had a "Prototype" page on their webpage, but no more.


----------



## emarkd

Yeah I wouldn't call it a habit either, but it happens. I think its kinda neat that we sometimes get a glimpse of whatever they're working on, even well before its ready. I'm sure every company on the planet has had a few product ideas along the way that never actually made it to production, for one reason or another. We just don't ever hear about them, usually.


----------



## Gt390

You would think they would just replace the frosted lens in the sc5fc with a clear one. But I guess they went the extra step of swapping the led too. 
Could be just the light I have been looking for. Hopefully they do produce it.


----------



## eraursls1984

Gt390 said:


> You would think they would just replace the frosted lens in the sc5fc with a clear one. But I guess they went the extra step of swapping the led too.
> Could be just the light I have been looking for. Hopefully they do produce it.


It's because the easy white XM-L2's have 4 dies, so they use the frosted lens to hide the cross in the beam.


----------



## Random Dan

Gt390 said:


> You would think they would just replace the frosted lens in the sc5fc with a clear one. But I guess they went the extra step of swapping the led too.
> Could be just the light I have been looking for. Hopefully they do produce it.


The XM-L2 easywhite in the SC5Fc is quad-die so it won't produce a nice beam with clear lense. 

I'm pretty excited for a spot+spill beam with 93-95 cri and a two step MacAdam ellipse.


----------



## Gt390

Thank you both for that explanation. Would you mind giving a little input in laymans terms on the 2 step mcadams elipse.
it is all Greek to me.


----------



## Random Dan

Here's a good description along with a picture: http://www.usailighting.com/stuff/c...bcf5da65a8d3c26a56b82e7/misc/macadam_faqs.pdf

A two step ellipse means very tight tint tolerances, even more so than lamp manufacturers use.


----------



## tech25

This is what I gathered from the forums: The Mcadam ellipse is how much tint shift there is in the beam. The "c" and "D" lights have specifically picked leds that minimize tint shift (Blue or Green creeping into the beam color) as well as better CRI. I believe one step is zero shift and two step is zero perceptible shift. You loose a little lumens but get a better beam tint. There is a discussion about it in this thread Zebralight H600F c/d mk3 85cri and XM-L 2? page 16 or so.


----------



## Gt390

Thanks guys both the tech page print and the stuff covered in the discussion on page 16 helped me out a lot.
I feel I have a decent understanding of it now at least at the basic level as it relates to tint variance.


----------



## Gt390

Oh and if offered as shown on the comparisons page at Zebralight I would own one as soon as available


----------



## jgmoosehunter

Regarding the new C3, how long does ZL usually take to release a product, once it appears on the spreadsheet? Any guesses based on past practice?


----------



## markr6

Random Dan said:


> I'm pretty excited for a spot+spill beam with 93-95 cri and a two step MacAdam ellipse.



Me too. I can probably be talked into one even though I complain about the physical size.


----------



## hmihaylov

markr6 said:


> Me too. I can probably be talked into one even though I complain about the physical size.



I am hopeful there will be a change of size for SC5 Mark II. A positive one. Meaning it will get smaller instead of bigger


----------



## low

hmihaylov said:


> I am hopeful there will be a change of size for SC5 Mark II. A positive one. Meaning it will get smaller instead of bigger




Agreed.


----------



## dubliftment

smaller, brighter, higher CRI and more efficient. SC53(F)c/d, let's hope it happens. But even if it stays an SC5, with the specs stated as of now, I will give it a try. Still wondering why they do not go for a High CRI SC63c/d with XPL LED.


----------



## eraursls1984

dubliftment said:


> smaller, brighter, higher CRI and more efficient. SC53(F)c/d, let's hope it happens. But even if it stays an SC5, with the specs stated as of now, I will give it a try. Still wondering why they do not go for a High CRI SC63c/d with XPL LED.


SC63c with the fully customizable UI that they mentioned may come in 2017, that may just be the perfect light.


----------



## Cobraman502

Anyone check out the Zebralight Spreadsheet recently. Looks like there is a new addition, SC5c MkII. I am really hoping that this has the fully customizable UI that I have been reading about in this thread. Might have to wait for the SC63c since I love the 18650s, might have smaller bezel and longer run times.


----------



## emarkd

Cobraman502 said:


> Anyone check out the Zebralight Spreadsheet recently. Looks like there is a new addition, SC5c MkII. I am really hoping that this has the fully customizable UI that I have been reading about in this thread. Might have to wait for the SC63c since I love the 18650s, might have smaller bezel and longer run times.



Yeah that light's been there a few days. It definitely looks promising for the tint/CRI. But unless there's a major re-design it won't have a smaller bezel than the SC63w. The SC5x has never been a particularly small light. Sure its shorter than the '63, but its not thinner. If anything its head is slightly _thicker_ - 0.9mm thicker according to Zebralight. In the hand though it feels like an even bigger difference than that, but maybe its just me.

I like the SC5x lights though. They look tough, solid. And they feel good in the hand with all that knurling. I expect I'll have to add a SC5c mk2 to my collection.


----------



## TCY

If the sc5c is $69 it's probably worth taking one. Too bad it's an AA light tho, make it SC63C with the 2-step Macadam ellipse and every tint snob would be happy.


----------



## markr6

TCY said:


> If the sc5c is $69 it's probably worth taking one. Too bad it's an AA light tho, make it SC63C with the 2-step Macadam ellipse and every tint snob would be happy.



That would be great! My SC63w is pretty good, but it always has me wishing for a little more. Just a little dingy looking on medium levels.


----------



## eraursls1984

Spreadsheet updated. Did we already know that the C3 was a 4x18650 with 3xXHP-70 and 9000 lumens?


----------



## eraursls1984

Im pretty sure that was the update. They just updated it again and now in the column for runtime it says "PID".


----------



## markr6

eraursls1984 said:


> Spreadsheet updated. Did we already know that the C3 was a 4x18650 with 3xXHP-70 and 9000 lumens?



The 9000lm has been there. The update may have been for the "400+" lumens on the SC5c but I could be wrong. I don't remember seeing that.

Ooh we have a "dimensions" column now.


----------



## eraursls1984

markr6 said:


> The 9000lm has been there. The update may have been for the "400+" lumens on the SC5c but I could be wrong. I don't remember seeing that.
> 
> Ooh we have a "dimensions" column now.


4.3x3x0.9 for the C3. What does the 0.9 mean?

The 400+ lumens was there on the last update. Try to keep up, or you'll never get that Q50.


----------



## Random Dan

Those dimensions don't sound like a popcan light. The batteries must be next to each other in a line to keep the body 3"x0.9"


----------



## markr6

eraursls1984 said:


> The 400+ lumens was there on the last update. Try to keep up, or you'll never get that Q50.



Post of the day!! :laughing:


----------



## emarkd

Random Dan said:


> Those dimensions don't sound like a popcan light. The batteries must be next to each other in a line to keep the body 3"x0.9"



That doesn't work either. 3x 18650 in series would be a helluva lot longer than 4". I'm of the mind that someone has just screwed up entirely and that those numbers don't make any sense at all.


----------



## eraursls1984

emarkd said:


> That doesn't work either. 3x 18650 in series would be a helluva lot longer than 4". I'm of the mind that someone has just screwed up entirely and that those numbers don't make any sense at all.


Unless they were side by side. I doubt that because it would be a weird form factor with more than 2 batteries. From 11:58-12:40 I got 10 emails about an edited document. I don't know if that's each time something is edited, or each time the edits are saved.


----------



## Random Dan

emarkd said:


> That doesn't work either. 3x 18650 in series would be a helluva lot longer than 4". I'm of the mind that someone has just screwed up entirely and that those numbers don't make any sense at all.


Sorry if my post wasn't clear. I meant that the batteries would be side by side in a row of four. Like in a battery caddy. Seems a bit odd but the dimensions match.


----------



## roger-roger

dubliftment said:


> *smaller, brighter, higher CRI and more efficient. SC53(F)c/d, let's hope it happens. *But even if it stays an SC5, with the specs stated as of now, I will give it a try. Still wondering why they do not go for a High CRI SC63c/d with XPL LED.




I've posted a couple times my inquiry a few months ago, to ZL of the possibility of an SC53. Their response at the time being negative to the SC53, with *only* a possibility of looking into adapting the SC5 tech into the SC52. 

Perhaps there's not enough interest in the SC52 form factor. If there is I'd suggest those interested to communicate that interest directly with ZL. It almost seems ZL is avoiding competing with Olight & co in this category, the smaller high performance AA device, an understandable marketing strategy. I myself am not interested in the bulkier SC5.


----------



## amanichen

eraursls1984 said:


> 4.3x3x0.9 for the C3. What does the 0.9 mean?
> 
> The 400+ lumens was there on the last update. Try to keep up, or you'll never get that Q50.



Sounds rectangular maybe? A flat pack light with three leds side by side? If it were a cylinder only two measurements would be needed.


----------



## Connor

@amanichen
I figured something like that too but I imagine a "flat pack light" (with those dimensions&weight) would be really awkward to hold.


----------



## Swede74

Maybe it will look like a bigger, bulkier and better version of the SC5200 that never left the drawing board?












> Price: $59.00
> Availability:
> Not for Sale
> Description
> 
> Estimated release date: TBD
> Main Features and Specifications (Preliminary)
> 
> LED: CREE XLamp XP-E Cool White (Color Temperatures: 5700-6350 K)
> Light Output:
> High
> Medium
> Low
> Weight
> Dimensions
> Length 3.25 inches (82.6 mm)
> Height 1.24 inches (31.2 mm)
> Width 0.85 inches (21.7 mm)
> Battery: Two AA size alkalines, 1.5v lithium primaries, or NiMH rechargeables.
> Features
> Electronic soft-touch switch, with a 200,000 cycle operating life
> Smart user interface provides fast and easy access to all brightness levels
> Battery reverse polarity protection
> Premium grade Alcoa aluminum alloy
> SCHOTT ultra clear lens with anti-reflection coatings on both sides
> Durable natural hard anodized finish (Type III Class I)
> Waterproof
> 
> Operations
> 
> When Off
> Short click turns on the light to High instantly. Click again quickly to cycle from High to Medium, and Low.
> Press and hold to cycle through Low, Medium and High, release to set.
> 
> When On
> Short click turns off the light.
> Press and hold to cycle from Low to High, release to set. The light always cycle from Low to High regardless which level you are currently in.
> Double click at any level to toggle and select between the two sub-levels for that level. All selections are memorized after the light is turned off and through battery changes.
> 
> Accessories (TBD)
> 
> Silicone cover
> Clip
> Horizontal holster


----------



## tech25

That would be awesome, a compact 2x AA flashlight.

Reminds me of my old *Duracell / Mallory Hand Held Compact with Copper Top, *you can see it online in the flashlight museum.

Just looked it up and its a 4x 18650? I guess we will wait and see for more updates.


----------



## markr6

Connor said:


> @amanichen
> I figured something like that too but I imagine a "flat pack light" (with those dimensions&weight) would be really awkward to hold.


Fenix LD50-ish but with 4 cells sideways? Never would have figured, but I guess it could be possible.


----------



## recDNA

I would love an sc32 with that HI CRI XP-L


----------



## JDodd

Is ZebraLight exhibiting at SHOT?


----------



## emarkd

JDodd said:


> Is ZebraLight exhibiting at SHOT?


They were not on the table list I saw


----------



## INFRNL

Can anyone tell me when ZL usually releases the new models. I was thinking about picking up my first ZL but would hate to have the new model released right after. I also need to decide which model will be my first. 
Thinking about picking up the SC600w mkIII HI but I also need to look at the other models too (5, 52, 63)

Thanks


----------



## OnlyownEnergizer250lumen

INFRNL said:


> Can anyone tell me when ZL usually releases the new models. I was thinking about picking up my first ZL but would hate to have the new model released right after. I also need to decide which model will be my first.
> Thinking about picking up the SC600w mkIII HI but I also need to look at the other models too (5, 52, 63)
> 
> Thanks



Same here, about to buy an H603w... anyone know?


----------



## eraursls1984

INFRNL said:


> Can anyone tell me when ZL usually releases the new models. I was thinking about picking up my first ZL but would hate to have the new model released right after. I also need to decide which model will be my first.
> Thinking about picking up the SC600w mkIII HI but I also need to look at the other models too (5, 52, 63)
> 
> Thanks


If I were in your shoes I'd go with the SC600 MK III if it's not to big, or the SC62w if you need something more EDC-able. I say the 62 because it's on sale, and I'm hoping for the fully programmable UI later this year.


----------



## INFRNL

eraursls1984 said:


> If I were in your shoes I'd go with the SC600 MK III if it's not to big, or the SC62w if you need something more EDC-able. I say the 62 because it's on sale, and I'm hoping for the fully programmable UI later this year.



Thanks and yes, fully programmable ui would be awesome!

I honestly do not know what I'm after. I currently only own a couple of older 4-7's; one uses a rcr123 and the other 2xrcr123. Lights have improved in the past few years since i got these. They both still work great and my initial intention was to get something with more output and a bit further throw. So I started looking for lights and that opened up a whole giant can of worms:laughing:

I definitely want to try a few new brands and want to have a few different options but definitely not ready for a big thrower. No matter what I end up with it has to be carryable in pants or coat pocket.

Will look at the ZL site again and see what strikes my interest but I'm still leaning on the sc600 first. I was actually going to buy the first sc600 a few yrs ago cause I think they came out when i bought my 4-7's but never gave in. I also think I want models that use rcr123 or 18650 because the output and runtime seem to be much better than the AA/AAA models but who knows

Thanks again, will continue my research, etc


----------



## OnlyownEnergizer250lumen

Just ordered my first ever Zebralight, the H603w from Andrew & Amanda, great customer service from them, should be here in a week or so, excited!!!


----------



## INFRNL

OnlyownEnergizer250lumen said:


> Just ordered my first ever Zebralight, the H603w from Andrew & Amanda, great customer service from them, should be here in a week or so, excited!!!



Congrats! Thats a pretty good idea for headlamp, can double as a flashlight as well. I need to get a good headlamp myself, I've been resting my light wherever I can but a headlamp would have been much more helpful in many case



EDIT: Not sure where you guys order from, but just placed my order through ZL. Went with the SC600w mkIII HI. I think this might be just what I'm looking for. 

The Sc63w looked compelling as well. I imagine the 63 is very similar to the 600 output wise, but obviously slightly smaller and smaller head so probably doesn't throw quite as well? It actually looks like ZL are all nice and fit ea use just right. I could see eventually owning the whole line, but I still want to explore other manufacturers as well.


----------



## eraursls1984

INFRNL said:


> The Sc63w looked compelling as well. I imagine the 63 is very similar to the 600 output wise, but obviously slightly smaller and smaller head so probably doesn't throw quite as well? It actually looks like ZL are all nice and fit ea use just right. I could see eventually owning the whole line, but I still want to explore other manufacturers as well.


The will not maintain the higher outputs as long do to less mass. The Hi throws more because of the slightly larger reflector and the HI LED.

Good luck on obtaining other manufacturers, you should've done that before getting a ZL. ZL has spoiled me in terms of production lights.


----------



## mightysparrow

*SC62w is Outstanding for Anyone with Carry Weight Limitations*



eraursls1984 said:


> If I were in your shoes I'd go with the SC600 MK III if it's not to big, or the SC62w if you need something more EDC-able. I say the 62 because it's on sale, and I'm hoping for the fully programmable UI later this year.



I received my new SC62w from Zebralight late last week, and I have to say I don't think there could be a better value out there - even if it wasn't on sale. I needed something with more performance than I had, and decided to buy my first 1x18650 light. However, because the light is for carry on my commute to work and back, I also needed to choose a light that gave me a lot of performance in a compact, lightweight package. The SC62w meets all of those needs, and the quality, neutral tint, and beam profile are outstanding for my purposes. I cannot recommend this light more highly. The time from order to delivery was about one month.


----------



## tops2

*Re: SC62w is Outstanding for Anyone with Carry Weight Limitations*



mightysparrow said:


> I received my new SC62w from Zebralight late last week, and I have to say I don't think there could be a better value out there - even if it wasn't on sale. I needed something with more performance than I had, and decided to buy my first 1x18650 light. However, because the light is for carry on my commute to work and back, I also needed to choose a light that gave me a lot of performance in a compact, lightweight package. The SC62w meets all of those needs, and the quality, neutral tint, and beam profile are outstanding for my purposes. I cannot recommend this light more highly. The time from order to delivery was about one month.



What are the odds! Me too. Decided to pull the trigger on the SC62w and love it. Its on the larger side of pocket EDC to me, but its pretty much almost perfect.


----------



## JLeephoto

INFRNL said:


> Congrats! Thats a pretty good idea for headlamp, can double as a flashlight as well. I need to get a good headlamp myself, I've been resting my light wherever I can but a headlamp would have been much more helpful in many case



If you're considering a HL, I'd suggest the H600fd or fc HI CRI. I'm like a broken record raving about this light but am a headlamp fan and couldn't be more impressed with this one for an all around work light. 
Like you, I'm coming from a batch of old 47s and I'm looking for a replacement for a Quark Mini 123 for EDC. I went with an Olight R1 but am not satisfied with form factor. Wish I would've tried ZL.


----------



## eligibleforreimbursement

roger-roger said:


> I've posted a couple times my inquiry a few months ago, to ZL of the possibility of an SC53. Their response at the time being negative to the SC53, with *only* a possibility of looking into adapting the SC5 tech into the SC52.
> 
> Perhaps there's not enough interest in the SC52 form factor. If there is I'd suggest those interested to communicate that interest directly with ZL. It almost seems ZL is avoiding competing with Olight & co in this category, the smaller high performance AA device, an understandable marketing strategy. I myself am not interested in the bulkier SC5.



Zebralight CS says the SC53 is coming out later in 2017, after the SC5 mk II series

Olight S1A form factor is perfect, but bezel up + exposed button are a real bummer.


----------



## OnlyownEnergizer250lumen

Do you have a H602/603 to compare the beam pattern with, to ensure that you wouldn't prefer the pure flood beam instead for up close work over the "flood*y*​"?

I ask because I just spent a week deciding which to get, and went with the H603w, still shipping so I don't know what I'm getting yet lol. I did consider the H600F as you mention but I was afraid there would still be too much of a hotspot. I already have a Nitecore HC30 and the hotspot bothers me for reading.


----------



## JLeephoto

OnlyownEnergizer250lumen said:


> Do you have a H602/603 to compare the beam pattern with, to ensure that you wouldn't prefer the pure flood beam instead for up close work over the "flood*y*​"?
> 
> I ask because I just spent a week deciding which to get, and went with the H603w, still shipping so I don't know what I'm getting yet lol. I did consider the H600F as you mention but I was afraid there would still be too much of a hotspot. I already have a Nitecore HC30 and the hotspot bothers me for reading.



I do not have both to compare. I knew I wanted to try a HI. I suspect you got the right one for your intended purpose. Enjoy. 
I don't do much reading in bed anymore as I've gone all audiobook but if I did I'd probably choose same. For what it's worth, the spill blends so well with the spot that I don't find it distracting up close. The HC30 is a much tighter spot with much less spill but I like it for longer range outdoors and price is right when it's on sale.


----------



## INFRNL

eraursls1984 said:


> The will not maintain the higher outputs as long do to less mass. The Hi throws more because of the slightly larger reflector and the HI LED.
> 
> Good luck on obtaining other manufacturers, you should've done that before getting a ZL. ZL has spoiled me in terms of production lights.


Thank you for the info. I am not necessarily looking for one particular size. I also am looking for something slightly larger that has good throw and spill which would be beyond what ZL offers. If I like the sc600 enough which I'm sure i will, I may just join the club and get a SC32(3),SC52(3), and SC62(3) as well, to cover my compact needs...time will tell.

I was looking at the Elzetta's, Malkoff's, and Surefire but i'm not too sure i could deal with only Hi/lo. I like having the different settings. I typically use moonlight, med, high. Ideally It may be nice to have a light with infinitely variable levels. Although I do like that the ZL's have the sub level's, thats definitely a nice touch



mightysparrow said:


> I received my new SC62w from Zebralight late last week, and I have to say I don't think there could be a better value out there - even if it wasn't on sale. I needed something with more performance than I had, and decided to buy my first 1x18650 light. However, because the light is for carry on my commute to work and back, I also needed to choose a light that gave me a lot of performance in a compact, lightweight package. The SC62w meets all of those needs, and the quality, neutral tint, and beam profile are outstanding for my purposes. I cannot recommend this light more highly. The time from order to delivery was about one month.





tops2 said:


> What are the odds! Me too. Decided to pull the trigger on the SC62w and love it. Its on the larger side of pocket EDC to me, but its pretty much almost perfect.


what are the differences between the sc62 and sc63? quick look, it seems that the sc63 is slightly smaller, higher power and only $10 more, logic would tell me to just get the 63, but I could be missing something, idk. any input/info is appreciated




JLeephoto said:


> If you're considering a HL, I'd suggest the H600fd or fc HI CRI. I'm like a broken record raving about this light but am a headlamp fan and couldn't be more impressed with this one for an all around work light.
> Like you, I'm coming from a batch of old 47s and I'm looking for a replacement for a Quark Mini 123 for EDC. I went with an Olight R1 but am not satisfied with form factor. Wish I would've tried ZL.


ha ha, I just posted a comment in your thread.
My needs for a headlamp are not as yours are. I would mainly just need it mainly for working on my semi during a breakdown or at home on a vehicle. Not sure i would need it for more than that but who knows. Definitely having an option of higher output as the one you recommend would probably be fine. i'll have to take a look at what they have. Thank you



eligibleforreimbursement said:


> Zebralight CS says the SC53 is coming out later in 2017, after the SC5 mk II series
> 
> Olight S1A form factor is perfect, but bezel up + exposed button are a real bummer.



I'm definitely interested to see the new lineup/catalog. any idea of any release dates?

Thanks for all the input/info. I will try to check this thread often and will update you on my thoughts of the sc600 when I get a chance to check it out once it arrives. It may end up being all I really need, won't be able to tell until I get back out on the road


----------



## lampeDépêche

So do we know what they have in mind for an SC53? Hi CRI? XP-L? New programmable UI? What's on the menu?

I owned an SC52w and loved it. Now I have traded up (in my opinion) for the H52w--all the same functionality, plus headlight option, plus smaller head.

But I'd still look very hard at an SC53 if it had some new features. And I hope they are not going to kill that line because of the SC5 line--not only do I like the smaller, slimmer size, I also like the support of 14500 cells. (Which I also enjoy in my H52w and H502w).


----------



## markr6

eligibleforreimbursement said:


> Zebralight CS says the SC53 is coming out later in 2017, after the SC5 mk II series
> 
> Olight S1A form factor is perfect, but bezel up + exposed button are a real bummer.



Great info! Thanks. I'm surprised it lets you link to the actual ticket on their site. I would remove that link just in case someone tried to reply or mess with that.


----------



## emarkd

INFRNL said:


> what are the differences between the sc62 and sc63? quick look, it seems that the sc63 is slightly smaller, higher power and only $10 more, logic would tell me to just get the 63, but I could be missing something, idk. any input/info is appreciated



I own both. I'll give you my impressions:

SC63w pros:

Smaller and better looking
More output
Broader beam (more floody)

SC63w cons:

Tint is much more of a lottery -- lots of green '63ws out there
Worse thermals -- output throttles faster
Battery fitment is touchy
Costs more

SC62w pros:

Beautiful tint
Fits just about any 18650 cell
Cheaper

SC62w cons:

Less output
Kinda ugly
Slightly larger

So to wrap up, I like the beam shape on the '63w slightly more, although there's absolutely nothing wrong with the '62ws beam either. And the '62w has MUCH better tint. The body of the '63w is smaller and prettier, but that lack of mass means the thermal regulation kicks in faster. So in reality, after just a minute or two of running on high, the '63w has probably already stepped down below the output of the '62w. So I call the output difference a wash. I personally don't much care about the battery fitment issues, although others do, so that's a non-factor for me as well. And the sizes are close enough that I wouldn't call it much of a difference either.

That leaves the light's design and its tint as really the only deciding factors for me. So if you want the prettiest, smallest light, buy the '63w. If you want the prettiest, cleanest output buy the '62w.

In my opinion, of course...


----------



## markr6

Good summary, but I would never consider the tint as a factor between the two...for a new buyer. It may be fine on your SC62w, but I've tried a few and two were very yellow, one was just OK. One of the yellows were so bad, it looked like one of those yellow bug bulbs! Total tint lottery across the board unfortunately.


----------



## roger-roger

eligibleforreimbursement said:


> Zebralight CS says the SC53 is coming out later in 2017, after the SC5 mk II series
> 
> Olight S1A form factor is perfect, but bezel up + exposed button are a real bummer.





Excellent news on the SC53. 

I bought an Olight S1 at Black Fri prices, and was waiting for an S1A neutral to pop up, as I won't pay msrp for most other brands. Now I can probably wait. Longer. Of course if smallest size is the desired feature, ZL is not competing in that arena.


----------



## emarkd

markr6 said:


> otal tint lottery across the board unfortunately.



Yeah I'm sure that's true and I can only speak definitively about the lights I've had myself, which is a very small sample size. But it was my impression from following reports online and talking with others that the _chances_ of getting good tint are better with the '62 than with the '63, but of course nothing is guaranteed. I could be completely wrong though.

I really wish my '63w were't so green...


----------



## markr6

emarkd said:


> Yeah I'm sure that's true and I can only speak definitively about the lights I've had myself, which is a very small sample size. But it was my impression from following reports online and talking with others that the _chances_ of getting good tint are better with the '62 than with the '63, but of course nothing is guaranteed. I could be completely wrong though.
> 
> I really wish my '63w were't so green...



Mine is leaning towards yellow, but not bad. I can't complain after thinking about all the other bad ones I've seen.


----------



## mightysparrow

*Re: SC62w is Outstanding for Anyone with Carry Weight Limitations*



tops2 said:


> What are the odds! Me too. Decided to pull the trigger on the SC62w and love it. Its on the larger side of pocket EDC to me, but its pretty much almost perfect.



It's on the larger side of pocket edc for me, too. I'm glad I decided to go for it - I agree with you that it's about perfect.


----------



## recDNA

INFRNL said:


> Thank you for the info. I am not necessarily looking for one particular size. I also am looking for something slightly larger that has good throw and spill which would be beyond what ZL offers. If I like the sc600 enough which I'm sure i will, I may just join the club and get a SC32(3),SC52(3), and SC62(3) as well, to cover my compact needs...time will tell.
> 
> I was looking at the Elzetta's, Malkoff's, and Surefire but i'm not too sure i could deal with only Hi/lo. I like having the different settings. I typically use moonlight, med, high. Ideally It may be nice to have a light with infinitely variable levels. Although I do like that the ZL's have the sub level's, thats definitely a nice touch
> 
> 
> 
> what are the differences between the sc62 and sc63? quick look, it seems that the sc63 is slightly smaller, higher power and only $10 more, logic would tell me to just get the 63, but I could be missing something, idk. any input/info is appreciated
> 
> 
> 
> ha ha, I just posted a comment in your thread.
> My needs for a headlamp are not as yours are. I would mainly just need it mainly for working on my semi during a breakdown or at home on a vehicle. Not sure i would need it for more than that but who knows. Definitely having an option of higher output as the one you recommend would probably be fine. i'll have to take a look at what they have. Thank you
> 
> 
> 
> I'm definitely interested to see the new lineup/catalog. any idea of any release dates?
> 
> Thanks for all the input/info. I will try to check this thread often and will update you on my thoughts of the sc600 when I get a chance to check it out once it arrives. It may end up being all I really need, won't be able to tell until I get back out on the road


the 62 will accept protected or unprotected batteries. The 63 only unprotected.


----------



## ScottFree

Decided to dip my toes back into Zebralight and since I haven't owned one for a few years, or at least far back enough that I can't remember when I last bought mine so I would like to ask a few questions if I may about the lights themselves. Mainly I want to know if the published runtime/lumen specs are accurate or if they are under/over sold, and how solid are they in terms of surviving whacks, dings and drops. IIRC my Zebralights were pretty solid. 

At the moment I'm looking buying one of the SC5 or SC32, though I may say to hell with it and buy both.


----------



## Connor

ScottFree said:


> Decided to dip my toes back into Zebralight and since I haven't owned one for a few years, or at least far back enough that I can't remember when I last bought mine so I would like to ask a few questions if I may about the lights themselves. Mainly I want to know if the published runtime/lumen specs are accurate or if they are under/over sold, and how solid are they in terms of surviving whacks, dings and drops. IIRC my Zebralights were pretty solid.



According to many reviews the runtime/lumens specs are accurate if not a little "under sold". The newer models have become lighter/smaller and perhaps somewhat less solid than the old Zebralights but they're still *very *good. Electronics are potted now. 
Glass lenses can always break on a drop ..


----------



## AVService

ScottFree said:


> Decided to dip my toes back into Zebralight and since I haven't owned one for a few years, or at least far back enough that I can't remember when I last bought mine so I would like to ask a few questions if I may about the lights themselves. Mainly I want to know if the published runtime/lumen specs are accurate or if they are under/over sold, and how solid are they in terms of surviving whacks, dings and drops. IIRC my Zebralights were pretty solid.
> 
> At the moment I'm looking buying one of the SC5 or SC32, though I may say to hell with it and buy both.


I have been carrying either an SC52 and/or SC5 every day for several years now and pull them out all day long and many drops and fumbles a day later I have yet to have a single problem.

I don't drop the bigger ones for some reason but still no issues there either.


----------



## JLeephoto

ScottFree said:


> At the moment I'm looking buying one of the SC5 or SC32, though I may say to hell with it and buy both.



I was debating between 52w and 32w and had decided to do the same and get both when I saw that the 32w was backordered. If you have a good source, let me know. 
About the time we get these they'll be an update of course.


----------



## INFRNL

I've been all over the place, sorry i missed some comments/responses about the 62w/63w. i appreciate all the input.

I think i mentioned it; I ordered the sc600w mkIII HI neutral white. Got it on saturday, my eyes aren't what they once were but to me it looks like it is perfect (at least close). I believe they are 4400k. depending on what light i compare it to changes the tint but it has a nice neutral tint with a slight creamy/rosy hue. no yellow, no green, etc. hotspot is great and spill is pretty good. 

still getting used to the ui and sideswitch(coming from a 4/7 tailswitch, takes a little getting used to) but over all I like what can be done with the ui, etc.
Size is nice and small with a slightly larger head. If it would help thermals, I wouldn't even mind if the length was a bit longer. It definitely has the best tint out of my current 4 lights. It makes my old quark neutral white look greenish now and by itself it always seemed to have a good tint. As long as I'm not comparing lights and using them individually, they all are good overall.

EDIT: I should add in that I also picked up a fenix pd35tac. by itself it appears to have a very close to true white tint (maybe a very very faint hint of blue) but when compared to the ZL the tint has a more noticeable hint of blue. crazy how this happens. Also wanted to add that on the H2 setting which I believe is 580lm, the pd35 has 500lm but lights everything up more. i imagine some of this is because the pd is a cool white and ZL is neutral. However the ZL works just as well on it's H1 setting compared to the pd's 1000lm high setting. I live in the city so i cannot yet test distance just approx 80-100 in the back yard. The ZL has more spill and a bigger hot spot but the PD still allows me to see more; mainly in the step below the highest (approx 500/580lm setting)

The only thing I wish was better on the sc600 is that the spill was brighter. Not sure If I would need the new sc600fd mkIII plus or what. 

Being that I have the sc600w probably no need for a 62w/63w unless I just want fairly similar lights. obviously the 62w/63w would be a little smaller(at least the 63w) and probably a slightly different beam pattern


I can definitely see me spending a ton of money in my search for a few lights to cover my needs. Only way to learn and know what i want/need, I suppose. Thanks again


----------



## Cobraman502

INFRNL said:


> I've been all over the place, sorry i missed some comments/responses about the 62w/63w. i appreciate all the input.
> 
> I think i mentioned it; I ordered the sc600w mkIII HI neutral white. Got it on saturday, my eyes aren't what they once were but to me it looks like it is perfect (at least close). I believe they are 4400k. depending on what light i compare it to changes the tint but it has a nice neutral tint with a slight creamy/rosy hue. no yellow, no green, etc. hotspot is great and spill is pretty good.
> 
> still getting used to the ui and sideswitch(coming from a 4/7 tailswitch, takes a little getting used to) but over all I like what can be done with the ui, etc.
> Size is nice and small with a slightly larger head. If it would help thermals, I wouldn't even mind if the length was a bit longer. It definitely has the best tint out of my current 4 lights. It makes my old quark neutral white look greenish now and by itself it always seemed to have a good tint. As long as I'm not comparing lights and using them individually, they all are good overall.
> 
> EDIT: I should add in that I also picked up a fenix pd35tac. by itself it appears to have a very close to true white tint (maybe a very very faint hint of blue) but when compared to the ZL the tint has a more noticeable hint of blue. crazy how this happens. Also wanted to add that on the H2 setting which I believe is 580lm, the pd35 has 500lm but lights everything up more. i imagine some of this is because the pd is a cool white and ZL is neutral. However the ZL works just as well on it's H1 setting compared to the pd's 1000lm high setting. I live in the city so i cannot yet test distance just approx 80-100 in the back yard. The ZL has more spill and a bigger hot spot but the PD still allows me to see more; mainly in the step below the highest (approx 500/580lm setting)
> 
> The only thing I wish was better on the sc600 is that the spill was brighter. Not sure If I would need the new sc600fd mkIII plus or what.
> 
> Being that I have the sc600w probably no need for a 62w/63w unless I just want fairly similar lights. obviously the 62w/63w would be a little smaller(at least the 63w) and probably a slightly different beam pattern
> 
> 
> I can definitely see me spending a ton of money in my search for a few lights to cover my needs. Only way to learn and know what i want/need, I suppose. Thanks again



If you want a decent throwing 18650 for pretty cheap and great UI check out the Astrolux S2. This design was from BLF originally called Kronos x6. http://m.banggood.com/Astrolux-S2-XPL-HI-1400LM-EDC-LED-Flashlight-18650-p-1037831.html. This like has a 60,000 Lux hotspot and is nice and small. About 1400 lumens on high. 

There is a coupon code floating around here or on BLF site for about $5 off. Got mine for $28 shipped.


----------



## INFRNL

Cobraman502 said:


> If you want a decent throwing 18650 for pretty cheap and great UI check out the Astrolux S2. This design was from BLF originally called Kronos x6. http://m.banggood.com/Astrolux-S2-XPL-HI-1400LM-EDC-LED-Flashlight-18650-p-1037831.html. This like has a 60,000 Lux hotspot and is nice and small. About 1400 lumens on high.
> 
> There is a coupon code floating around here or on BLF site for about $5 off. Got mine for $28 shipped.


thank you.

I do not think i am looking for a compact thrower, maybe at some point. Overall The sc600w mkIII Hi seems to be close to what I'm looking for. Won't be able to tell for the next few days probably.

I would say my main use minus close work is when I stop at a rest area or similar to let my dog out to run around and what not. I would say typically up to 3-400ft maybe distance wise, but i would like the light to adequately light up a large area at a time. Maybe i need a flood beam but one that will project out to 400ft or close to. 

When I get back on the road here in the next couple days, i will try out the ZL and PD35-tac that i picked up and see what my conclusion/thoughts turn up to be.

Thanks again


----------



## mightysparrow

recDNA said:


> the 62 will accept protected or unprotected batteries. The 63 only unprotected.



I eliminated the SC63 from my consideration for this reason. Great light, but I just don't want to deal with unprotected cells.


----------



## markr6

mightysparrow said:


> I eliminated the SC63 from my consideration for this reason. Great light, but I just don't want to deal with unprotected cells.



In contrast, I don't want to deal with protected cells. I wish Zebralight just kept the size the same as the SC62 and allowed both so there wasn't any confusion.


----------



## tops2

I see why people love the SC62w. After being disappointed with the yellow tint on the SC600w MKIII that I received, I ended up debating which 18650 light to get again. But finally one day, it happened the SC62w came back in stock on Zebralight's website so I promptly ordered. I have the light for about 2 weeks not but haven't had a chance for a real extended usage yet, but from what I tried, I love it.

I love the size and weight for an 18650 light. Its even a tiny bit smaller and lighter than my H600Fd. Its small and light enough that I'd pocket carry it sometimes, where as the SC600w MKIII feels "bulky" in comparison. While it loses some versatility vs a headlamp, its much more ergonomic to hand hold if I take a walk. Its nice and floody, while throwing far enough for me. Its basically what I wanted as a more powerful version of my SC5w with higher max and longer runtime.

The only nitpicky thing is on the lower levels while white wall hunting, the hotspot is a bit yellow while the spill is whiter/creamier. The yellowness is less pronounced on any of the high levels. But when used outside in nature settings, its pretty pleasant some how. I do still think the tint of my SC5w is hard to beat, but my SC62w is not bad as well.

Luckily for me, it feels like the SC62w has satisfied most of what I'm looking for so I can start saving money again!


----------



## snowlover91

Tops, the 62w is an excellent light! If you get one with good tint then it's tough to beat. Just don't try the MK3 HI edition, it's the best light ZL has produced imo for tint, hotspot, and a good balance of throw/spill. I have both the 62w and 63w and find I use them both a good bit. The tint on my 62w is actually a little bit better too. It's amazing how compact and powerful these lights are. 

I cant wait for the new SC5c MK2 version. I'm guessing this one might have the new programmable driver and with an XP-L at 4000k and 93-95 cri it could set a new standard for AA flashlights. Anyone hear when they are planning to release it?


----------



## INFRNL

snowlover91 said:


> Tops, the 62w is an excellent light! If you get one with good tint then it's tough to beat. Just don't try the MK3 HI edition, it's the best light ZL has produced imo for tint, hotspot, and a good balance of throw/spill. I have both the 62w and 63w and find I use them both a good bit. The tint on my 62w is actually a little bit better too. It's amazing how compact and powerful these lights are.
> 
> I cant wait for the new SC5c MK2 version. I'm guessing this one might have the new programmable driver and with an XP-L at 4000k and 93-95 cri it could set a new standard for AA flashlights. Anyone hear when they are planning to release it?



I recently got the mk3 hi and it does have a great tint and beam. I haven't had a chance to really use it yet but it seems great so far.

Guess i shouldn't get the 62/63w then...haha

This is my first ZL, so I can't compare or comment on other models


----------



## StandardBattery

INFRNL said:


> I recently got the mk3 hi and it does have a great tint and beam. I haven't had a chance to really use it yet but it seems great so far.
> 
> Guess i shouldn't get the 62/63w then...haha
> 
> This is my first ZL, so I can't compare or comment on other models


If you're only buying one light you are on the wrong forum


----------



## ScottFree

StandardBattery said:


> If you're only buying one light you are on the wrong forum



Absolutely. Two at a time is the way to go.


----------



## INFRNL

Technically i did buy 2 at a time, unfortunately the second one wasn't a zl

Does this count....you guys going to let me slide this time:shrug:


----------



## emarkd

Yeah that's OK. Most of us buy other lights too. While we're confessing, only about 10% of my lights are zebras.


----------



## INFRNL

emarkd said:


> Yeah that's OK. Most of us buy other lights too. While we're confessing, only about 10% of my lights are zebras.



Well at least you have 2 of them... Haha
I'm still trying to decide how much i like the side switch, i generally prefer tailswitch.

I do need to get a headlamp at some point and i know many like the zl ones. Need to figure which one would be best for my needs


----------



## emarkd

INFRNL said:


> Well at least you have 2 of them... Haha
> I'm still trying to decide how much i like the side switch, i generally prefer tailswitch.
> 
> I do need to get a headlamp at some point and i know many like the zl ones. Need to figure which one would be best for my needs



I'd have to go count to know for sure, but I've got a lot more than 2.

I like side switches well enough, and I _really_ like e-switches. Zebra's got one of the best switches in the industry - large, responsive, very easy to find. Its great.

My favorite zl headlamp is the H600fd mk3 easywhite -- pure white, high CRI, very floody. Love it.


----------



## JDodd

I have the H600c. It's one of my first premium light purchases, my first Zebra. I like it a lot, so I also bought the SC600Fd Mk III Plus. I'm looking forward to the C3, though I hope the dimensions in the ZebraLight spreadsheet are incorrect/intentionally misleading, because I'd love to have a popcan Zebra.

I'm too new to call myself a newbie. I can't get these interfaces straight in my head. I'm used to on and off.


----------



## noboneshotdog

INFRNL said:


> I recently got the mk3 hi and it does have a great tint and beam. I haven't had a chance to really use it yet but it seems great so far.
> 
> Guess i shouldn't get the 62/63w then...haha
> 
> This is my first ZL, so I can't compare or comment on other models



Welcome to the forum. Zebralights are great. There are so many great lights to be had and manufacturers with amazing products. New releases are put out almost weekly from one manufacturer or another. So, take your time and enjoy. Soon enough you will have more lights than you know what to do with.


----------



## INFRNL

noboneshotdog said:


> Welcome to the forum. Zebralights are great. There are so many great lights to be had and manufacturers with amazing products. New releases are put out almost weekly from one manufacturer or another. So, take your time and enjoy. Soon enough you will have more lights than you know what to do with.



I have actually been a member for around 5yrs but definitely new to zl. Thanks though.

Also i can already see what you are talking about. This has got to be the most complicated hobby i have encountered. My other past hobbies have been computers, phones, knives, and vaping gear. None of these have been as complicated as researching for a flashlight, even though one would think it would be easy. There are just too many variables to think about in a flashlight. 

Size, battery size, beam profiles, switches, ui's, color temp, output, runtime, manufacturers, etc, etc, etc. Its crazy.

Right now i have my eye on just a few brands i want to explore but this is also starting to grow as I research and hear about others. 

I am really only looking for a few lights to cover my needs but also want to try a few brands to see what I really like. I know that i will end up with a ton and will just keep the ones i like most, then move the others to a better home or gift them to friends/family. It's just the nature of learning what we like/need.

Thanks again


----------



## JLeephoto

emarkd said:


> My favorite zl headlamp is the H600fd mk3 easywhite -- pure white, high CRI, very floody. Love it.



It's my favorite all around HL as well but I think INFRNL previously mentioned he'd be using one to exercise his dogs at longer distances (correct me if I'm wrong.)

I've found the throw on my 600fd mkiii to be a little short for that and switch out to a Nite Core HC30 for that purpose and it has a much tighter beam and throw. It has a similar size, shape. I don't know what the equivalent ZL model would be but I suspect it would be even nicer.


----------



## INFRNL

JLeephoto said:


> It's my favorite all around HL as well but I think INFRNL previously mentioned he'd be using one to exercise his dogs at longer distances (correct me if I'm wrong.)
> 
> I've found the throw on my 600fd mkiii to be a little short for that and switch out to a Nite Core HC30 for that purpose and it has a much tighter beam and throw. It has a similar size, shape. I don't know what the equivalent ZL model would be but I suspect it would be even nicer.




Jlee is correct about me exercising my dog(which is why i got the sc600), but headlamp need would most likely be used for close distance. Working on vehicle, or like recently repairing 60-70ft of fence in the dark tgat blew down from the crazy winds we had last week.

I do not think id be using a headlamp while walking around or exercising the dog. But that could change in the future, who knows.

Also the other night fixing the fence, headlamp would have been much better than holding the sc600 with my mouth...but it worked and i managed, just not ideal


----------



## Jambo

Personally, can't wait to see what the SC5 mkII's like. And the SC53, and the SC600 mkIII new models, and the...


----------



## JDodd

INFRNL said:


> Right now i have my eye on just a few brands i want to explore but this is also starting to grow as I research and hear about others.
> 
> I am really only looking for a few lights to cover my needs but also want to try a few brands to see what I really like. I know that i will end up with a ton and will just keep the ones i like most, then move the others to a better home or gift them to friends/family. It's just the nature of learning what we like/need.



I believe you're entirely correct.

I have my eye on ZebraLight, HDS, and McGizmo. I have no idea how a flashlight could be worth even half as much as HDS and McGizmo lights, but I plan to find out.


----------



## emarkd

JDodd said:


> I believe you're entirely correct.
> 
> I have my eye on ZebraLight, HDS, and McGizmo. I have no idea how a flashlight could be worth even half as much as HDS and McGizmo lights, but I plan to find out.



Off-topic for this thread, but lots of folks find those other lights worth the money. Personally I think HDS is an actual _bargain_; you get more than you pay for. I'm not sure I'd say the same for McGizmo, but they're still very nice lights that should cost more than a factory-made light and every flashlight aficionado should at least give them a try. And hey, if you find that one of those lights isn't worth it to you, they're remarkably easy to sell on the secondary market, often for nearly full retail.


----------



## JLeephoto

INFRNL said:


> I should note that i got the sc600w mk3 plus not hi as previously mentioned.
> 
> Jlee is correct about me exercising my dog(which is why i got the sc600), but headlamp need would most likely be used for close distance. Working on vehicle, or like recently repairing 60-70ft of fence in the dark tgat blew down from the crazy winds we had last week.



I think the H600fd MK3 HI would be ideal in this role. In fact, I can't think of anything better especially if you're already using unprotected 18650s.


----------



## INFRNL

JLeephoto said:


> I think the H600fd MK3 HI would be ideal in this role. In fact, I can't think of anything better especially if you're already using unprotected 18650s.



What is the difference between all the models?
I'm seeing h600, 602, 603, f, fc, fd, fw, w, mk2, mk3,etc, etc

I know some have clear lenses, some frosted, some 4000k, 4400k, 5000k

I'm not sure on a headlamp but i like the 4400k on my sc600, but i think i would like the 4000k too. The 4400k can already be pretty white on h1, more neutral on h2. Not sure what the hicri 5000k would be like. Although i imagine on a headlamp I'd be using medium, h2 at most.

I'm pretty sure for my use I would want a frosted lens?


----------



## JStraus

emarkd said:


> I'd have to go count to know for sure, but I've got a lot more than 2.
> 
> I like side switches well enough, and I _really_ like e-switches. Zebra's got one of the best switches in the industry - large, responsive, very easy to find. Its great.
> 
> My favorite zl headlamp is the H600fd mk3 easywhite -- pure white, high CRI, very floody. Love it.



I am about to order either the H600fd or the H600fw (XHP35). Have you used both? Does is the XML easywhite that much better for color rendering and tint than the XHP 35?

I'd love your feedback!


----------



## snowlover91

I emailed ZL yesterday about their plans for this year and some of the upcoming lights. The new SC5 MK2 model they're aiming for late march or early April release. It probably won't have the new programmable UI we've heard rumors about. However they did mention some of the upcoming 18650 lights this year may be released with the new programmable UI. I'm pretty excited to see what their programmable UI will be like and hope it's a home run.


----------



## scs

snowlover91 said:


> I emailed ZL yesterday about their plans for this year and some of the upcoming lights. The new SC5 MK2 model they're aiming for late march or early April release. It probably won't have the new programmable UI we've heard rumors about. However they did mention some of the upcoming 18650 lights this year may be released with the new programmable UI. I'm pretty excited to see what their programmable UI will be like and hope it's a home run.



Thanks for the heads up. Gonna hold off buying any ZL until that new programmable UI comes out, bug free. Y'all keep buying though.


----------



## TCY

I'm eager to see what changes can ZL bring to their SC MK4 series. I know they are gonna be good but how good?


----------



## snowlover91

TCY said:


> I'm eager to see what changes can ZL bring to their SC MK4 series. I know they are gonna be good but how good?



At some point you have to wonder what else can be done? Other than changing how the UI works their lights are about as compact as you can get for an 18650 cell. LED technology isn't advancing nearly as fast as it was years ago, the main area for improvement is tint consistency now. I'm excited about the programmable circuit, to see how it works and what options they give us. The new SC5 MK2 sounds like a winner too. Should we start a thread for that one soon?


----------



## scs

snowlover91 said:


> At some point you have to wonder what else can be done? Other than changing how the UI works their lights are about as compact as you can get for an 18650 cell. LED technology isn't advancing nearly as fast as it was years ago, the main area for improvement is tint consistency now. I'm excited about the programmable circuit, to see how it works and what options they give us. The new SC5 MK2 sounds like a winner too. Should we start a thread for that one soon?



I'd be a fan of a separate, more heavy duty ZL line. I appreciate that ZL already pots their electronics. I'm thinking of more robust bodies, optics, seals, bezels, switches etc. Give it the Elzetta treatment. Design it to take a lot of punishment. Tough as nails + top notch driver performance is a combination that's tough to beat.

A ZL tactical line or thrower line, even.


----------



## snowlover91

scs said:


> I'd be a fan of a separate, more heavy duty ZL line. I appreciate that ZL already pots their electronics. I'm thinking of more robust bodies, optics, seals, bezels, switches etc. Give it the Elzetta treatment. Design it to take a lot of punishment. Tough as nails + top notch driver performance is a combination that's tough to beat.
> 
> A ZL tactical line or thrower line, even.



Yeah that would be great to see. With them being such a small company though I imagine they would have to do quite a bit of expanding to support branching out like that. I would love to see them do a few throwers. Their upcoming C3 with 9k lumens will be interesting. People have been asking for a multi-cell 18650 from them for awhile and it appears we may finally get one.


----------



## TCY

snowlover91 said:


> At some point you have to wonder what else can be done? Other than changing how the UI works their lights are about as compact as you can get for an 18650 cell. LED technology isn't advancing nearly as fast as it was years ago, the main area for improvement is tint consistency now. I'm excited about the programmable circuit, to see how it works and what options they give us. The new SC5 MK2 sounds like a winner too. Should we start a thread for that one soon?



That's exactly what I've been thinking. Without better LED techs I doubt that ZL can really achieve a major breakthrough besides the 100% programmable UI. For me the upgraded UI alone is not enough to justify a $100 purchase and I'm perfectly happy with my Plus. (that becomes a different story if the 2 Macadam ellipse SC64d/c hits the shelf)

Start a thread if you want, if ZL is going to release the light in 2-3 months time there's gonna be plenty of things to talk about.


----------



## JLeephoto

scs said:


> Tough as nails + top notch driver performance is a combination that's tough to beat.
> 
> A ZL tactical line or thrower line, even.



A tough tail switched 18650 thrower with the existing UI and high CRI would do it for me.


----------



## roger-roger

The SC5 MK2 seriously needs to be down-sized from the current model, as would the SC53. Both difficult tasks considering ZL's brilliantly designed and executed side-switch. It will be difficult but can be done however, if ZL is up to the task.


----------



## scs

roger-roger said:


> The SC5 MK2 seriously needs to be down-sized from the current model, as would the SC53. Both difficult tasks considering ZL's brilliantly designed and executed side-switch. It will be difficult but can be done however, if ZL is up to the task.



To me they're short enough. The diameter of the SC5, while comfortable to hold, is a bit chunky for carry in most cases, but the SC52 is way too narrow for comfortable or secure holding. Somewhere in between would be nice.
Perhaps the driver size is also governing the size of the SC5.
Neverthless, looking at the size of readily available drivers, like those for P60 drop ins, I'm always impressed by how compact ZL's drivers are. A few have matched ZL in that regard in 1 AA size lights, but in larger lights ZL appears to reign supreme, and no one else seems to have the incentive to match or overtake.


----------



## TCY

The C3's dimension now on spread sheet: Dimensions in LxHxD (inch):4.3x3.0x0.9


----------



## eraursls1984

TCY said:


> The C3's dimension now on spread sheet: Dimensions in LxHxD (inch):4.3x3.0x0.9


That was posted about 3 weeks ago. I think the only new thing on the list is the SC5c MK II.


----------



## davidt1

Wanted to buy a 62w, but looks like they are gone.


----------



## tops2

davidt1 said:


> Wanted to buy a 62w, but looks like they are gone.



I was actually surprised how long they had their clearance sale for! It was briefly in stock a few weeks ago and I was lucky enough to have checked during that time...


----------



## derfyled

scs said:


> I'd be a fan of a separate, more heavy duty ZL line. I appreciate that ZL already pots their electronics. I'm thinking of more robust bodies, optics, seals, bezels, switches etc. Give it the Elzetta treatment. Design it to take a lot of punishment. Tough as nails + top notch driver performance is a combination that's tough to beat.
> 
> A ZL tactical line or thrower line, even.


A titanium Zl...


----------



## Connor

derfyled said:


> A titanium Zl...



I don't think that material would work very well with the current line of compact/high-powered ZLs. 
A pure silver ZL (with clear hard anodizing) on the other hand .. :naughty:


----------



## derfyled

Well, if 4sevens and olight can do it, why not ZL? If the heat is a problem, I would gladly sacrifice a couple of lumens for a titanium body...

I admit that silver would be nice but that would become a jewel for display, not a tool anymore.


----------



## Connor

Not necessarily, silver is relatively cheap ($17/ounce) and a ZL only weighs ~2 ounces. 
Titanium is a really bad heat conductor and the PID would kick in much earlier and the light would lose lots of its technical appeal, I think. 
IMHO one of the big pros of ZL is the "unibody" construction that leads the heat away from the LED so well.


----------



## Tachead

Connor said:


> Not necessarily, silver is relatively cheap ($17/ounce) and a ZL only weighs ~2 ounces.
> Titanium is a really bad heat conductor and the PID would kick in much earlier and the light would lose lots of its technical appeal, I think.
> IMHO one of the big pros of ZL is the "unibody" construction that leads the heat away from the LED so well.



Titanium also weighs more then aluminum, scratches more easily, has grittier threads, can't be locked out by loosening the tailcap, and costs far more(both due to material costs and machining costs). Really, other then the aesthetical appeal to some people, it is a terrible material for use as a flashlight body.


----------



## Andrey

Connor said:


> silver is relatively cheap ($17/ounce)


Wow. It never occurred to me. Why don't we see lights made of silver?
There are lots of lights which are much more expensive per ounce of body weight. This makes the cost of material a small fraction of the total price.


----------



## Connor

Andrey said:


> Wow. It never occurred to me. Why don't we see lights made of silver?
> There are lots of lights which are much more expensive per ounce of body weight. This makes the cost of material a small fraction of the total price.



Well they would have to be made from bar stock and they'd have to melt the CNC shavings back into silver bars which would drive up the price considerably, I guess. 
From a thermal conductivity point of view silver would be absolutely awesome, though: 
Silver 429 W·K−1
​Copper 401
Aluminum 236
Titanium 22

On the other hand Silver is quite heavy (Aluminum x4) and not a very strong metal.


----------



## jgmoosehunter

For those interested, I saw an S6330 sell on EBay this week for $330. Is this a typical price for one of these? Until they actually reveal the new C3 (if ever) I might be interested in buying a used one. Looks like such a great light!

http://www.ebay.com/itm/RARE-New-Ze...423292?hash=item1a24bb96bc:g:xg8AAOSwjDZYjia9


----------



## emarkd

I was in that bidding, but not for that much. A really clean one like that will normally bring 300+. Users less, obviously, but not a lot less. They're interesting lights and I'd like to have one myself, but they're quite dated now. Interesting from a collector standpoint but I'm not sure how compelling they'd be to a user with the current class of soda can lights on the market.


----------



## jgmoosehunter

Give me a couple options, that in your opinion rival this light. I am interested in similar lights with a quality UI like ZL has...



emarkd said:


> I was in that bidding, but not for that much. A really clean one like that will normally bring 300+. Users less, obviously, but not a lot less. They're interesting lights and I'd like to have one myself, but they're quite dated now. Interesting from a collector standpoint but I'm not sure how compelling they'd be to a user with the current class of soda can lights on the market.


----------



## emarkd

M43 Meteor. Half the price, 3 UIs to choose from, selectable in the programming, and UI2 is remarkably similar to Zebralight. Plus it's available with several emitter choices. Mines the nichia 219c and I love it.


----------



## lampeDépêche

I've been off-line for a few weeks now--any new news on the "C3", i.e. the 3x XHP70, 4x 18650 light that ZL is promising?

On the S6330 and replacements. I agree that the S6330 is no longer cutting-edge tech. But one advantage that it has over e.g. the M43 Meteor is that it uses reflectors over Carcio optics.

I know that these optics allow lights to be a lot more compact. But I just do not like the beams that lenses produce. It's a matter of taste, I know, but I always prefer a reflectored beam to a Carcio-style beam.


----------



## emarkd

lampeDépêche said:


> I know that these optics allow lights to be a lot more compact. But I just do not like the beams that lenses produce. It's a matter of taste, I know, but I always prefer a reflectored beam to a Carcio-style beam.



Generally I don't disagree with you. Reflectors are my favorite too. Optics can be neat though, and it works well in the soda can lights. There are other soda-cans with reflectors though. Niwalker makes a few neat ones. The Olight X7 is very popular right now. Couple of Eagletac models, etc. But I really like the Meteor.


----------



## tonkem

I own the Meteor and had a 6300. The 6330 is a bit larger(longer) than the M43, but the M43 would blow it away in output. As well, I like the ability to program my own outputs with the UI on the Meteor. The Meteor also feels more solid than the Zebralight did. Just my .02. I prefer the wall of light that the Meteor produces, versus the more focused beam that the 6330 had. I sold the 6330.... for the reasons mentioned above. The Meteor, in all points, was a better light, IMHO.

Photos below, Left to right. Meteor, 6330, Lupine Wilma, and Lupine Betty


----------



## gilson65

just wondering does the sc52wl2 come with a pocket clip thanks


----------



## tonkem

Yes it does.



gilson65 said:


> just wondering does the sc52wl2 come with a pocket clip thanks


----------



## gilson65

cheers tonkem


----------



## roger-roger

gilson65 said:


> cheers tonkem




Its the chromed screw-on type pocket clip. Smoother operation with less tension than the slip on.


----------



## roadkill1109

Anybody with the new SC600 MKIII, is it any good?


----------



## tonkem

I have an Sc600 MKIII, but for carry I prefer the SC63. 

I love all Zebralights so I am a bit biased  I would not hesitate to get the SC600 MKIII. It is a great light, and quite powerful for such a small size, but it would depend on what you are going to use it for. It will not throw, as it is mostly flood, but I find that it is all the light I ever need. 




roadkill1109 said:


> Anybody with the new SC600 MKIII, is it any good?


----------



## gilson65

thanks :twothumbs


----------



## JLeephoto

roger-roger said:


> Its the chromed screw-on type pocket clip. Smoother operation with less tension than the slip on.



I don't have the other to compare but use the new version daily without issue. I'm not very picky about pocket clips unless they are a hassle in some way and this one is not.


----------



## Rockjunkie15

I recently picked up a sc600 III HI Neutral White and it's a fantastic little EDC. I also edc an armytek c2 partner pro xhp35 warm and although it technically has around 500ish more lumens, the zebra light seems to have similar useable flood as well as a lot more throw. Great light from Zebra!


----------



## lampeDépêche

Rockjunkie15 said:


> ...I also edc an armytek c2 partner pro xhp35 warm and although it technically has around 500ish more lumens, the zebra light seems to have similar useable flood as well as a lot more throw...



Yeah, I seem to recall hearing that Armytek's numbers are generally inflated.

I forget the details. Maybe they are still advertising "emitter lumens" instead of actual ANSI numbers?

Anyhow--yup, the SC600 III HI is a terrific light. Got it right here in the front left pocket. 
It's also pretty tough--I have dropped it from waist-height onto pavement several times now with only minor scratches.


----------



## TCY

lampeDépêche said:


> Yeah, I seem to recall hearing that Armytek's numbers are generally inflated.
> 
> I forget the details. Maybe they are still advertising "emitter lumens" instead of actual ANSI numbers?
> 
> Anyhow--yup, the SC600 III HI is a terrific light. Got it right here in the front left pocket.
> It's also pretty tough--I have dropped it from waist-height onto pavement several times now with only minor scratches.



I think AT lists both emitter and OTF lumens but only tells the emitter lumen figure to your face, the OTF figure is tucked into the "specifications" tab hoping that no one would notice.


----------



## scs

The ZL has a HI emitter and a reflector. The AT has a HD emitter and a TIR optic designed for a more general purpose beam. Hence more throw from the ZL.


----------



## scs

I am interested to see which can take more abuse though.
I think AT's body definitely wins with its more robust bezels, thicker construction, and stronger acrylic optic
Electronics wise, perhaps, ZL, because it it better potted.
Switch wise, perhaps AT.


----------



## Swedpat

While I find Zebralight to be excellent lights there is one thing I don't like with their 18650 models. For example comparison between H52w and H603W: while the M1 and H1 levels of H52W are 50 and 280lm the M1 and H1 of H603W are 61 and 1126lm. While H603 is 4times brighter at H1 than H52W it's only 1,2times brighter at M1! The difference between M1 and H1 SHOULD be about the same, it's WAY to big difference between M1 and H1 of their 18650 models! M1 of H603 should consequently be ~200lm or so. I find this so big drawback I chosed Nitecore H30W as my single 18650 headlamp instead.


----------



## Connor

Human perception for lumens isn't linear so it makes sense to space the levels like Zebralight does IMHO. 
Anyway, fully programmable levels are supposedly coming this year ..


----------



## JLeephoto

Swedpat;5054782 The difference between M1 and H1 SHOULD be about the same said:


> I've noted the same between my SC600 MK3 Hi. My solution is to preset to M1 and a lower level H2 to make the spacing a more moderate jump. It's an easy double click from H2 if I temporarily need a thousand lumens.
> If ZL replaces all their lights with customizable levels, a lot of us will be making the switch.
> 
> I also like the NC H30W when I need the extra throw but still prefer my H600fd MK3 for general use.


----------



## eraursls1984

H502g added I believe. Also, not sure if the H52 and H52F as already on the discontinued list, but it is now.


----------



## markr6

Just noticed the ZL635 3500mAh 18650 Protected Li-ion Battery on sale. Not for me, but I'll duck before someone replies with a complaint about how some lights don't accept protected cells.


----------



## roger-roger

markr6 said:


> Just noticed the ZL635 3500mAh 18650 Protected Li-ion Battery on sale. Not for me, but I'll duck before someone replies with a complaint about how some lights don't accept protected cells.




A good indicator they don't plan to remove the spring connections from their 18650 headlamps.


----------



## Tachead

roger-roger said:


> A good indicator they don't plan to remove the spring connections from their 18650 headlamps.




Or better yet, maybe a switch back to the duel spring design for all models going forward:naughty:.


----------



## markr6

Tachead said:


> Or better yet, maybe a switch back to the duel spring design for all models going forward:naughty:.



OR...they want to stock something to feed the upcoming C3!!!


----------



## emarkd

That one's rumored to be built in battery. I hope it's not, but that's the talk.


----------



## markr6

emarkd said:


> That one's rumored to be built in battery. I hope it's not, but that's the talk.



Oh you're right, I forgot about that.


----------



## Tachead

markr6 said:


> Oh you're right, I forgot about that.



Lets hope it's just a rumor. I don't see it selling very well if it has a built in battery and it already has a lot of competition in its class. Most of which has full cell support.


----------



## markr6

Tachead said:


> Lets hope it's just a rumor. I don't see it selling very well if it has a built in battery and it already has a lot of competition in its class. Most of which has full cell support.


Someone referred to a quote from ZL about the battery here, but I don't remember seeing that original statement anywhere. I'll probably buy it either way, but won't be too happy with a special battery.

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?425657-Zebralight-C3-4x18650-9000-lumens!&p=5027772&viewfull=1#post5027772


----------



## TCY

So I asked ZL about future plans for SC600 MK4/SC64:

"_We plan to release some (new version of) 18650 lights later this year, with a new programmable UI and some other upgrades, but I don't know which model will be the first."_


----------



## Cobraman502

TCY said:


> So I asked ZL about future plans for SC600 MK4/SC64:
> 
> "_We plan to release some (new version of) 18650 lights later this year, with a new programmable UI and some other upgrades, but I don't know which model will be the first."_



Good then I can start saving. I really hope they have a UI where you can set your brightness levels. Like a combination of ZL and Dr. Jones lucidv2. IMHO that would be the best UI.


----------



## markr6

TCY said:


> So I asked ZL about future plans for SC600 MK4/SC64:
> 
> "_We plan to release some (new version of) 18650 lights later this year, with a new programmable UI and some other upgrades, but I don't know which model will be the first."_



Exciting sutff! I want a programmable SC64 with a Nichia. I just can't play the tint lotto anymore.


----------



## Tachead

markr6 said:


> Exciting sutff! I want a programmable SC64 with a Nichia. I just can't play the tint lotto anymore.



I look forward to see what they come up with too. Unfortunately Nichia's have a tint lottery too although they tend to be more consistent. The key is low MacAdam Ellipse binned emitters no matter where they source them from. Give us some 2-step or "03" binned emitters Zebralight!. I hope for a SC64c with a 4000K 2-Step high CRI emitter.


----------



## Lumencrazy

Tachead said:


> I look forward to see what they come up with too. Unfortunately Nichia's have a tint lottery too although they tend to be more consistent. The key is low MacAdam Ellipse binned emitters no matter where they source them from. Give us some 2-step or "03" binned emitters Zebralight!. I hope for a SC64c with a 4000K 2-Step high CRI emitter.



They are always sold out.So why would they increase their costs for such a small market.We may think we are their biggest customer but just look at the monthly stats for this forum and then estimate how many of the total actually buy Zebralights. They would go out of business trying to please us.


----------



## Tachead

Lumencrazy said:


> They are always sold out.So why would they increase their costs for such a small market.We may think we are their biggest customer but just look at the monthly stats for this forum and then estimate how many of the total actually buy Zebralights. They would go out of business trying to please us.



I disagree. I think we are a very large part of their market and that most of their customers are flashlight enthusiasts even if they aren't frequent CPF visitors. ZL is a small niche company whose sales are limited. Normal people don't even know what a ZL is and they are barely even sold at any stores. I bet if you asked 1000 random people off the street in any large city in North America you would be lucky to find anyone who even knows who ZL is or what they make. Plus, even normal people's lighting expectations are rapidly changing. Just look at the household lighting market. Look at home designer magazines. CCT, Tint, and CRI are quickly becoming common knowledge to even your average Tom, ****, and Jane. Times are a changing and less and less people are willing to put up with low quality LED lighting.

ZL wouldn't have to increase their costs. I think a lot of people would be happy to pay a premium for more ZL models with better binned emitters(c & d models).


----------



## roger-roger

I have the impression buyers :wave: are ordering shipments out before they arrive in country. Have always found it unusual customers would lay down money and then wait, but there you have it. It is a part of ZL's sales MO, and they back it up with quick refunds as needed. Smart.


----------



## Lumencrazy

I owned three Zebralights before I ever heard of this forum. They are sold in many places around the world.


----------



## markr6

Lumencrazy said:


> I owned three Zebralights before I ever heard of this forum. They are sold in many places around the world.



I also see a lot of chatter about them on other forums like backpacking light, EDCforums, and all that zombie/prepper stuff. Sales on Amazon and youtube videos give them a lot of exposure too.


----------



## Tachead

They are still a small niche company that only sells a fraction of the numbers that most of the mainstream companies sell and are only available in a few specialty stores(most online). I suspect that most ZL users are flashlight enthusiasts and enthusiasts are willing to spend a bit more for better emitters. Most normal people wouldn't spend what ZL charges for a flashlight or headlamp. That may change with their ECO series being released this year though. That line can appeal to the sheeple but, I would like to see them start using more tightly binned emitters in their high end models. I personally would be happy to pay more for this option.


----------



## Lumencrazy

Sometimes we think that because we are aware no one else is. We often forget that we are outsiders discussing someone who is running a successful word-wide business. Instead of recommending to them what they need to do, we should show them our achievements in the flashlight business. That would give them great inspiration.


----------



## lampeDépêche

Can someone wake me up when the C3 comes?

It's the only light on the horizon that I am actually interested in.


----------



## AVService

I lost my SC52 again this week and when I accepted that, I ordered another right away!

This of course was followed by me finding the lost one yesterday too ?

I can't live without mine!


----------



## markr6

lampeDépêche said:


> Can someone wake me up when the C3 comes?
> 
> It's the only light on the horizon that I am actually interested in.



Same here. They didn't even have a general ETA when I asked last week so who knows. The programmable 1x18650 light they have coming is interesting too, but I have a feeling that will be a while.


----------



## roger-roger

I'll continue to wait patiently for an SC53 release.


----------



## markr6

roger-roger said:


> I'll continue to wait patiently for an SC53 release.



I hope it's basically an SC52 without the ribbed body, new programmable UI, and no tint lotto (wishful thinking there)


----------



## snowlover91

My last email to ZL they had hoped to release or announce the SC5 MK2 in late March or first half of April. That was a few months ago though, no idea if they're on track or not. I'm eager to see the new programmable UI for their 18650 lights later this year. ZL seems to be one of the few flashlight companies still really trying to develop the perfect edc light. High cri, programmable UI, compact, great run times, etc.


----------



## Cobraman502

snowlover91 said:


> My last email to ZL they had hoped to release or announce the SC5 MK2 in late March or first half of April. That was a few months ago though, no idea if they're on track or not. I'm eager to see the new programmable UI for their 18650 lights later this year. ZL seems to be one of the few flashlight companies still really trying to develop the perfect edc light. High cri, programmable UI, compact, great run times, etc.



Yep I have been tempted to build you a p60 surefire but it's just to big for edc for me. I currently use an SC52w and the UI is just perfect for edc. I'm also waiting for a sc64 to come out with the new UI.


----------



## scs

Has ZL ever tried TIR optics for its single cell lights? They could help reduce length at the head end instead of the tail end, and be stronger than the current lenses. Honey combed and frosted optics are available for the F models as well. Thoughts?


----------



## snowlover91

scs said:


> Has ZL ever tried TIR optics for its single cell lights? They could help reduce length at the head end instead of the tail end, and be stronger than the current lenses. Honey combed and frosted optics are available for the F models as well. Thoughts?



From their spreadsheet it looks like they're working on headlamps/flashlights with TIR optics but not much detail.


----------



## markr6

SC5c up for preorder! ** New black clip and redesigned from the SC5. I can't really tell how much smaller/larger it is from the photos.

Also H53c and H53Fc on the list!!! No more 14500 support. Looks like there will be other flavors coming in the future:

_New generation SC5, with cool white (600Lm), neutral white and high CRI versions._


----------



## iamlucky13

markr6 said:


> Also H53c and H53Fc on the list!!! No more 14500 support.



Woohoo!

The H53Fc was _exactly_ the sort of light I was looking for when I joined this site. It didn't exist at the time, so I went with a high CRI, floody Armytek instead.

So now I don't need it, but I don't know if I will be able to resist the H53Fc when it comes out.

Given the output claimed for the SC5c II with the same voltage limitations, the lack of 14500 support doesn't seem like a major drawback.

Very glad to see that the pending Eco series lights are an expansion of their product line, not replacements for existing models.


----------



## Random Dan

I'm excited for the H53Fc as long as it is about the same size/weight as the H52. My H600Fc is my favorite headlamp for the tint and beam profile, but sometimes it is a bit too heavy.


----------



## Connor

This seems to be the new programmable UI .. very nice. 
We get the current L/M/H mode groups + *two *new seperate L/M/H mode groups where any of the modes can have any available brightness level. Plenty of choice for everyone. 



Multiple UI Groups
This light comes with three UI groups, G5, G6 and G7. The G5, set as the factory default, can be selected with 5-click from OFF, while G6 and G7 can be selected with 6-click and 7-click from OFF respectively. UI group selections are memorized after the light is turned off and through battery changes.
In all three UI groups
H can be either H1 or H2; M can be either M1 or M2; L can be either L1 or L2
from OFF: 1-click to H; 2-click to M; press and hold to cycle from L, M to H

In G5
H1 is fixed at 475Lm, H2 can be 352, 236, or 144Lm
M1 is fixed at 79Lm, M2 can be 40, 18, or 7.4Lm
L1 is fixed at 2.8Lm, L2 can be 1.0, 0.28 or 0.08Lm

In G6 and G7
H1, H2, M1, M2, L1 and L2 can be programmed to any of the 12 available brightness levels
Double-click 6 times at the H1, H2, ... L2 to enter the programming mode for that level. Once in the programming mode, use double-click to go up one level and triple-click to go down one level. Use 1-click to exit the programming mode

Three consecutive 5-click (or 6-click, 7-click) to reset the G5 (or G6, G7) back to the factory default settings




Source: http://www.zebralight.com/SC5c-Mk-II-AA-Flashlight-Neutral-White-High-CRI_p_192.html (bottom)


----------



## scs

Sweet! Not perfect but pretty dang good compared to the current UI.
I'd prefer 3 programmable levels in at least the H group and preferably in the M group as well.

For the 18650 models, though, this still doesn't satisfy some users' preference to have ready access to max and 2 other very useful H2 levels.

Wonder if ZL allows only 2 because it's an AA light, but will offer 3 for 18650 lights. That would be perfect.


----------



## Random Dan

I'm just excited that I can make it turn on to medium and double-click for high. My only complaint with the UI on my SC52 is that getting to medium, which is the one I use most frequently, without flashing high first is a bit slow.


----------



## gunga

Oh wow, even in the AA model? Sweet!


----------



## scs

Makes one think whether G5 is really needed at all.
And why G5-G7 and not G1-G3? Hmmmm. Perhaps ZL has more surprises up its sleeves.


----------



## TCY

Random Dan said:


> I'm just excited that I can make it turn on to medium and double-click for high. My only complaint with the UI on my SC52 is that getting to medium, which is the one I use most frequently, without flashing high first is a bit slow.



*In all three UI groups*


H can be either H1 or H2; M can be either M1 or M2; L can be either L1 or L2
*from OFF: 1-click to H; 2-click to M; press and hold to cycle from L, M to H*

Looks like it's still double click for medium. This might change for future ZL offerings though.


----------



## TCY

I think G5 is there so people can just use the light without taking too much time to configure the UI. It's nothing for us veteran ZL users but the learning curve is a bit steep for first time owners.

Just daydreaming: If the SC series has a larger memory because of the size difference, Maybe it can have even more features like allowing user to choose which mode to bring up with a single click?


----------



## scs

TCY said:


> *In all three UI groups*
> 
> 
> H can be either H1 or H2; M can be either M1 or M2; L can be either L1 or L2
> *from OFF: 1-click to H; 2-click to M; press and hold to cycle from L, M to H*
> 
> Looks like it's still double click for medium. This might change for future ZL offerings though.



It also says that each of the 6 slots in G6 and G7 can be programmed to any one of the 12 levels, so one can set "H" (1 click) to any of the 12 levels. Could use ZL's confirmation though.


----------



## scs

TCY said:


> I think G5 is there so people can just use the light without taking too much time to configure the UI. It's nothing for us veteran ZL users but the learning curve is a bit steep for first time owners.
> 
> Just daydreaming: If the SC series has a larger memory because of the size difference, Maybe it can have even more features like allowing user to choose which mode to bring up with a single click?



Yeah, but G6 can be preprogrammed to default G5. Unless that's too much work in factory, and or some savvy folks still prefer to have G5 around. With G6 and G7, I personally would not go back to G5.


----------



## scs

Despite this exciting revelation, I think it wise to wait and see if there are any bugs. Lot's of clicks and potential click timing issues.


----------



## TCY

scs said:


> It also says that each of the 6 slots in G6 and G7 can be programmed to any one of the 12 levels, so one can set "H" (1 click) to any of the 12 levels. Could use ZL's confirmation though.



Thanks for pointing it out. If I'm not mistaken, ZL's H, M and L no longer stands for High, Mid and Low in UI G6 and G7, they are now more of a group one two and three? This is exciting.


----------



## Random Dan

TCY said:


> *In all three UI groups*
> 
> 
> H can be either H1 or H2; M can be either M1 or M2; L can be either L1 or L2
> *from OFF: 1-click to H; 2-click to M; press and hold to cycle from L, M to H*
> 
> Looks like it's still double click for medium. This might change for future ZL offerings though.


Yeah it always turns on to H, but I can program H to be any of the 12 brightness levels, so I would think I could set it in the 20-30lm range.


----------



## TCY

Random Dan said:


> Yeah it always turns on to H, but I can program H to be any of the 12 brightness levels, so I would think I could set it in the 20-30lm range.



I get it now, this is actually useful. Medical personnel can set H1 to 3 lumens and they no longer need a dedicated penlight. Well done ZL


----------



## tech25

Just what I have been waiting for and I just bought an H600fc... I thought this would come out in a couple of years!

I guess I will be buying another light... Oh well😜


----------



## tech25

It seems like this will still have the three "groups" (formerly known as low, med, high) but each group we will be able to set to whatever brightness we want and have the double click still available (for example H1 and H3 on the double click) so a single click will turn on to group one to whatever we set it to and a double click while it's on that set level will set it to a second level as per Zebralight's usual UI.


----------



## lampeDépêche

So a while ago I said that the C3 was the only light I was excited about.

I was wrong.

I am now super-psyched about the H53c.
14500-output on an Eneloop.
Great tint.
New UI
XPL emitter.
And it's smaller! 

I'm considering sending them a check for a pre-pre-order.


----------



## TCY

lampeDépêche said:


> So a while ago I said that the C3 was the only light I was excited about.
> 
> I was wrong.
> 
> I am now super-psyched about the H53c.
> 14500-output on an Eneloop.
> Great tint.
> New UI
> XPL emitter.
> And it's smaller!
> 
> I'm considering sending them a check for a pre-pre-order.



I will definitely get a H53Fc even if it doesn't come with the new UI. The new headlamp seems too good to pass, especially when I have zero headlamps at my disposal.

By the way can you actually do the pre-pre-order thing to secure your queue? I might just do that too


----------



## snowlover91

So has anyone tested just to see if the new programmable UI works on the MK3 HI or SC63w? Just curious since ZL has hidden things in their UI...


----------



## TCY

snowlover91 said:


> So has anyone tested just to see if the new programmable UI works on the MK3 HI or SC63w? Just curious since ZL has hidden things in their UI...



Tried with my Plus, negative.


----------



## lampeDépêche

TCY said:


> By the way can you actually do the pre-pre-order thing to secure your queue? I might just do that too



Nah, I doubt it. It would be a nightmare for their ordering department.


----------



## markr6

scs said:


> Sweet! Not perfect but pretty dang good compared to the current UI.



I like it!!! I don't find it very useful on this SC5c since the modes are spaced well and runtimes are short enough as is on high. But this will be nice on a SC63 type light where you may want to use two lower H levels instead H1 all the time, which I rarely do.

Now I'm going to feel the need to replace all my ZLs with new versions!!


----------



## Connor

I think the only thing I'll probably do with this new UI will be making G6 to medium/high/low: single click from off to low, long press from off to medium, double click from off to high, all levels the same as G5.


----------



## roger-roger

H1 - 475 lm
H2 - 236 lm
M1 - 144 lm


----------



## drummer132132

roger-roger said:


> H1 - 475 lm
> H2 - 236 lm
> M1 - 144 lm



My thoughts too and go from there


----------



## eraursls1984

Connor said:


> I think the only thing I'll probably do with this new UI will be making G6 to medium/high/low: single click from off to low, long press from off to medium, double click from off to high, all levels the same as G5.


This may cause preflash of the high mode when you click for low. Currently low comes on first and if you long press it locks in, if you release quickly it jumps to high. The only way to avoid preflash on long press and single click would be to delay the long press mode until you have completed a long press, or do a single click.


----------



## gunga

Connor said:


> I think the only thing I'll probably do with this new UI will be making G6 to medium/high/low: single click from off to low, long press from off to medium, double click from off to high, all levels the same as G5.



I thought about something like that. The issues I can see is that scrolling through the modes will be medium-high-low. Also I'll end up blinding myself if I mix old and new Zebralights...

Unless I sell all the old ones. Hmmm...


----------



## eraursls1984

scs said:


> Makes one think whether G5 is really needed at all.
> And why G5-G7 and not G1-G3? Hmmmm. Perhaps ZL has more surprises up its sleeves.


Perhaps they skip to G5 because the number corresponds​ to the number of clicks to get into this mode group. 1-4 clicks are taken by 1-H, 2-M, 3-blinky modes, 4-voltage readout.


----------



## Connor

eraursls1984 said:


> This may cause preflash of the high mode when you click for low. Currently low comes on first and if you long press it locks in, if you release quickly it jumps to high. The only way to avoid preflash on long press and single click would be to delay the long press mode until you have completed a long press, or do a single click.



If it works the same I would probably get a "medium" preflash when clicking for low in my scenario (medium>high>low).


----------



## eraursls1984

Connor said:


> If it works the same I would probably get a "medium" preflash when clicking for low in my scenario (medium>high>low).


Yes, that would be correct.


----------



## eraursls1984

*I'd love to see (at least in the 18650 models) the G6 be L1, L2, M1, M2, H1, H2, and G7 be L1, L2, L3, M1, M2, M3, H1, H2, H3.*


----------



## scs

eraursls1984 said:


> Perhaps they skip to G5 because the number corresponds​ to the number of clicks to get into this mode group. 1-4 clicks are taken by 1-H, 2-M, 3-blinky modes, 4-voltage readout.



That could very well be it.

I'm thinking of programming the medium levels into L, low levels into H, and high levels into M.
I'd mostly use the light around the house, so don't need immediate access to max or the other high levels,and like mark mentioned, I'd probably not use max or the level below that anyways.
With the above config, from off, 1 click brings up low, so no accidental blinding. From there, press and hold cycles thru medium, high, and then low again. Makes sense to me, the cycling up in output from low. From off, 2 clicks bring up high. From there, press and hold for medium, or 2 clicks to low. From off, press and hold brings up medium. From there, press and hold again to cycle thru medium, high,and low, or 2 clicks to low.

Or, program the high levels into L, medium levels into M, and low levels into H. This, too, can work well.

Or low in L, high in M, and medium in H. This one not as well for me.


----------



## Tachead

lampeDépêche said:


> So a while ago I said that the C3 was the only light I was excited about.
> 
> I was wrong.
> 
> I am now super-psyched about the H53c.
> *14500-output on an Eneloop.*
> *Great tint.*
> New UI
> *XPL emitter.*
> And it's smaller!
> 
> I'm considering sending them a check for a pre-pre-order.



Not to put a damper on your excitement but...

I wouldn't say these lights are getting 14500 output as many single 14500 lights are 900+ lumens.

It's not looking like the tint will be that great actually. Unless ZL specifically hand picks emitters, about 80% of these new lights will have a greenish tint to one degree or another. 

And, these lights use the newer XP-L2.


----------



## markr6

I thought I was a negative person :laughing:

Could be true, though. We'll see soon enough.


----------



## Random Dan

Nobody even owns one yet and we're already ragging on the tint? Wow.


----------



## Tachead

markr6 said:


> I thought I was a negative person :laughing:
> 
> Could be true, though. We'll see soon enough.



Sorry, I wasn't trying to be negative, I was just trying to keep the facts straight. 

One positive note about the tint is that because this light is 4000K nominal vs 5000K nominal(like the Plus) it should exhibit less green, even on the worst samples, and more yellow. It also won't have the same extremes due to the tighter binning and thus will stay closer to the black body radiation line on the whole. CCT aside, tint wise, it should still be a descent step up from the Plus which is good. It's just too bad they didn't go with the 3500K variant of this emitter as, CCT aside, it has a much better tint range.


----------



## Tachead

Random Dan said:


> Nobody even owns one yet and we're already ragging on the tint? Wow.



No one is ragging, just talking about it.

The tint range can be accurately determined by Cree's spec sheets. They give you the exact tint range that the emitters used will fall into. A lot of people don't/didn't know this and just buy and then are surprised by the tint. This happened with the Plus. People who read the spec sheets knew that the Plus would exhibit greenish tints, on average, before it was even released. This light, on the other hand, will exhibit a bit less green and more yellowish/orange tints on average however due to its warmer CCT. 

Ideally, you want an emitter to fall right on the black body radiation line(BBRL) no matter its CCT. The problem with the emitters used for the Plus and these new lights(SC5c MKII, H53c, H53Fc) is that the particular bins that ZL chose have a strong bias towards falling above the BBRL(about 80% bias). This means that the tints, on average, will fall further away from the BBRL.

One thing to remember however is that these emitters are still high CRI and are from the tightest tint variation bin that Cree offers. I commend ZL for sourcing these and offering lights with better emitters then most other companies offer. There are only so many high CRI emitter options currently(especially if you want to stick with a specific CCT) so I do still think these were one of the best choices if they wanted to strictly go with a 4000K emitter.


----------



## Cobraman502

Anyone replace the stock SC52w clip with something else, preferably darker and less shiny. Was even considering on painting just the clip but that probably wouldn't hold up well.


----------



## AVService

Cobraman502 said:


> Anyone replace the stock SC52w clip with something else, preferably darker and less shiny. Was even considering on painting just the clip but that probably wouldn't hold up well.


The one on the right!
Looks a lot better and is much stronger too but ended up not being nearly as easy to use for me?


----------



## DMS1970

Clips are on eBay, but they're pricey, amd one of the sellers is "made to order" with 6 week delivery. If there are any better alternatives, I'd be interested.

in the short term, you could sandblast, glass bead, or even scuff the clip with sand paper.


----------



## Cobraman502

DMS1970 said:


> Clips are on eBay, but they're pricey, amd one of the sellers is "made to order" with 6 week delivery. If there are any better alternatives, I'd be interested.
> 
> in the short term, you could sandblast, glass bead, or even scuff the clip with sand paper.



Yeah I was thinking of sanding the stock then painting it with a matte finish.


----------



## noboneshotdog

Cobraman502 said:


> Yeah I was thinking of sanding the stock then painting it with a matte finish.




imagescertificity.com

This is a Olight R50 Pro. The bezel was initially a bright blue color. I didn't like it so I took it off and superheated it with my torch until it turned this darker color. There is still a blue o-ring in the background that you might be able to notice but I am quite pleased with how the stainless steel darkened up with a heat treatment. This may be an option.


----------



## noboneshotdog

This was the initial color of the bezel before heat treatment. 



how to capture screencertificity.com


----------



## Cobraman502

noboneshotdog said:


> This was the initial color of the bezel before heat treatment.
> 
> 
> 
> how to capture screencertificity.com



Ah perfect a reason to buy a blow torch muhaha. I think this might be the best option yet and hey if it damages the clip I'll get another from ZL for a few bucks. Not as costly as the aftermarket and I don't need deep carry. I like the top sticking out give me a place to grab well even if I have gloves on.


----------



## noboneshotdog

I'm not sure if it's possible to ruin it. My bezel was glowing red with no negative effects.


----------



## Cobraman502

noboneshotdog said:


> I'm not sure if it's possible to ruin it. My bezel was glowing red with no negative effects.



Good to know I will give it a try.


----------



## Slayer2003

I have to ask a question that I'm sure has been asked before, but after quite some time searching for an answer, I cannot seem to find one, not one that really explains this fully anyhow.

I'm looking to obtain my first Zebralight, as the newly refreshed SC600 series appeals to me, however when I go to purchase one I'm noticing all of the vendors are showing a very black model. However the reviews, forum posts and the like are showing VERY grey models. How do I get one of these grey models?!

What I did seem to find about this that didn't really answer my question, is that their anodizing coloration is rather inconsistent batch-to-batch, so some of the lights will end up a tad different shades of black compared to others. But the ones I have seen are no where NEAR black, they are straight up grey.


----------



## TCY

Slayer2003 said:


> I have to ask a question that I'm sure has been asked before, but after quite some time searching for an answer, I cannot seem to find one, not one that really explains this fully anyhow.
> 
> I'm looking to obtain my first Zebralight, as the newly refreshed SC600 series appeals to me, however when I go to purchase one I'm noticing all of the vendors are showing a very black model. However the reviews, forum posts and the like are showing VERY grey models. How do I get one of these grey models?!
> 
> What I did seem to find about this that didn't really answer my question, is that their anodizing coloration is rather inconsistent batch-to-batch, so some of the lights will end up a tad different shades of black compared to others. But the ones I have seen are no where NEAR black, they are straight up grey.



The "standard" anodizing colour for ZL lights would be dark grey but it is indeed inconsistent, e.g. my SC600Fd Mk III Plus being darker than my SC62W.

I've asked ZL before and their reply was that they have been using "_the same aluminum material and the same anodizing process for the last several years. Natural (undyed) anodizing can have slightly different shades/colors from batch to batch or even within the same batch_."


----------



## eraursls1984

Slayer2003 said:


> I have to ask a question that I'm sure has been asked before, but after quite some time searching for an answer, I cannot seem to find one, not one that really explains this fully anyhow.
> 
> I'm looking to obtain my first Zebralight, as the newly refreshed SC600 series appeals to me, however when I go to purchase one I'm noticing all of the vendors are showing a very black model. However the reviews, forum posts and the like are showing VERY grey models. How do I get one of these grey models?!
> 
> What I did seem to find about this that didn't really answer my question, is that their anodizing coloration is rather inconsistent batch-to-batch, so some of the lights will end up a tad different shades of black compared to others. But the ones I have seen are no where NEAR black, they are straight up grey.


Non are black (yet, the new eco line will be). They range from grey to a darker grey. It's not dark enough to consider black in any decent lighting.


----------



## recDNA

I like fully programmable option since the only modes I ever want to use are H1, H3, and M3. I have never had any need for fewer than 40 lumens.


----------



## snowlover91

recDNA said:


> I like fully programmable option since the only modes I ever want to use are H1, H3, and M3. I have never had any need for fewer than 40 lumens.



Yeah I'm glad to see this change, it gives flexibility and customization options and they added an extra medium setting too.


----------



## DMS1970

What is this new Eco line?


----------



## iamlucky13

I don't think they've said anything official about the Eco line except what is on the product comparison spreadsheet on their website.

Basically, it looks like there will be AA, CR123A, and 18650 models each in a flashlight and headlamp version. The AA headlamp will be $39.90, and the rest of the models aren't priced yet. The headlamp will use a total internal reflection lens (like the Olight H1), instead of a frosted lens like Zebralight normally uses to achieve a floody beam. Among other changes, the user interface will be simplified, with only 5 modes.


----------



## DMS1970

iamlucky13 said:


> I don't think they've said anything official about the Eco line except what is on the product comparison spreadsheet on their website.
> 
> Basically, it looks like there will be AA, CR123A, and 18650 models each in a flashlight and headlamp version. The AA headlamp will be $39.90, and the rest of the models aren't priced yet. The headlamp will use a total internal reflection lens (like the Olight H1), instead of a frosted lens like Zebralight normally uses to achieve a floody beam. Among other changes, the user interface will be simplified, with only 5 modes.



thank you for the clarification!


----------



## markr6

The new black clips are available for $3.49. Says they're for SC51, SC52, SC53, SC31, SC32, SC60, SC62, SC63. I may order one just to see if I like it. I never had a problem with the old ones, though.


----------



## Crazyeddiethefirst

I too never had a problem with the original clips, but like the look of the new ones. Only 3 of my 4 Zebras getting it, the oldest Zebra takes a clip on....
Here is what they look like(original on left, new on right, in black) 
http://i958.photobucket.com/albums/...ghts/93BE3312-6282-48EF-801E-6C6154BAC30C.jpg
http://i958.photobucket.com/albums/...ghts/208E4823-C92F-4755-813C-3B38404157C1.jpg


----------



## markr6

Crazyeddiethefirst said:


> I too never had a problem with the original clips, but like the look of the. Ew ones. Only 3 of my 4 Zebras getting it, the oldest Zebra takes a clip on....
> Here is what they look like(original on left, new on right, in black)
> http://i958.photobucket.com/albums/...ghts/93BE3312-6282-48EF-801E-6C6154BAC30C.jpg
> http://i958.photobucket.com/albums/...ghts/208E4823-C92F-4755-813C-3B38404157C1.jpg



Thanks for the photos! I know they're not real expensive, but I couldn't decide without seeing them on old models first. Well, I'm still undecided!


----------



## Cobraman502

I know they are more money than the ZL clips however you get titanium and deep carry. https://www.etsy.com/listing/488592692/stealth-design-titanium-pocket-clip-for


----------



## gunga

I use the ti deep carry from USA knifemakers. Around $10.


----------



## Cobraman502

gunga said:


> I use the ti deep carry from USA knifemakers. Around $10.
> 
> View attachment 5587



Hey that's pretty nice. Yeah I was not sure of the hole distance, thread and size of the holes on the clip. Figured I would just get something made for the light I have.


----------



## Crazyeddiethefirst

The new Zebralight clips are only $3.49 each. thanks for the tip on the $10 Ti deep carry clips, Mike...I had not seen those yet. I will say the new clips are very secure and instead of Phillips screws like their original clips, the new ones are T6 Torx.


----------



## gunga

Oh. T6 torx? Way better. The Phillips were super fragile. 

Note that the knife clips need a bit of work because the clip holes are too widely spaced. Otherwise they are great.


----------



## Cobraman502

Cobraman502 said:


> I know they are more money than the ZL clips however you get titanium and deep carry. https://www.etsy.com/listing/488592692/stealth-design-titanium-pocket-clip-for



Just received the clip and installed. 

http://imgur.com/a/Gi19a


----------



## Koam

Cobraman502 said:


> Just received the clip and installed.
> 
> http://imgur.com/a/Gi19a



Nice looking clip, I really like that.


----------



## Cobraman502

Koam said:


> Nice looking clip, I really like that.



Yeah it sits really nice in the pocket and has a good amount of spring. Not too much where it's hard to get over your pants material. The guy I bought it from sells a much more. They are expensive but well made and not messing with fit. Even domes with the tool for the screws.


----------



## Crazyeddiethefirst

Another use of the new Zebra clip:
http://i958.photobucket.com/albums/...ghts/F0285320-42D8-4013-B683-3D06D3DA3CC1.jpg
http://i958.photobucket.com/albums/...ghts/4097931E-C4D7-4772-BF86-4D995A5CA191.jpg


----------



## AVService

Cobraman502 said:


> Yeah it sits really nice in the pocket and has a good amount of spring. Not too much where it's hard to get over your pants material. The guy I bought it from sells a much more. They are expensive but well made and not messing with fit. Even domes with the tool for the screws.


I find mine impossible to get over my pants materiel and so it rides so high it will fall off my pocket!

It is a great looking and solid clip but does not work for me at all it turns out.

I switched back to the standard Zebra clip and all is well again.


----------



## axd

Well, I recently acquired a 502pr, and am extremely disappointed by the product. 

It was supposed to provide a *deeper red* experience, but in fact it looks more orangish than other red LEDs.

I've summarised my findings here: https://github.com/axd1967/502pr/tree/master/grating


----------



## snowlover91

AVService said:


> I find mine impossible to get over my pants materiel and so it rides so high it will fall off my pocket!
> 
> It is a great looking and solid clip but does not work for me at all it turns out.
> 
> I switched back to the standard Zebra clip and all is well again.



You may want to try the new black clip out. It's superior to the old ZL clip and is much easier to "bend" to the right stiffness for pocket carry.


----------



## TCY

I'm here to report on ZL's anodizing quality which I found to be very impressive, although I kinda already know that.

Here's the story: my water cup is made of ceramic, with a very heavy base. Normally I would praise its sturdiness (it has little colour squares painted which can also be a nice quick CRI tester lol!), but not when I put my nice lights around it. With some water in it, the force of me putting the cup onto the table can do some serious damage to flashlights' anodizing.

Below is a quick shot of my M43, hit by the flashlight killer cup ~2 months ago:




You can see that the cup hit so hard it chipped off a tiny bit of aluminium alloy along with the anodizing. My M43 stopped being perfect that day and I was heartbroken 

About 10 minutes ago the flashlight killer stroke again, with similar water level and force, but this time the victim was my H53Fc, the new kid on the playground:




Which leads to the reason I'm writing this. You can see that the damage done is so trivial compared to M43's wound, there's still a portion of anodizing intact. My level of heartbroken-ness was the same nevertheless:mecry:

My SC600Fd Plus too a couple hits on the tailcap, but with a milder force, so no visible damage whatsoever.


----------



## gunga

Impressive. Glad to hear the anodizing and base metal is nice and tough. Do you know what alloy zebralight uses?


----------



## TCY

gunga said:


> Impressive. Glad to hear the anodizing and base metal is nice and tough. Do you know what alloy zebralight uses?



According to their staff, 6061 which is probably what everyone else use. I believe they are of higher quality though, as the bar stocks ZL use are from Alcoa.


----------



## snowlover91

Thanks for the report! I have also noticed the ano on my lights seems much tougher than on other lights where it seems to flake off or chip easier. My dad has one on a keychain that after 1 year of use barely has any ano missing. His previous light had scratches all over during that same amount of time. Mine also hold up to drops on concrete and hardwood floors with minimal to no damage at all.


----------



## TCY

snowlover91 said:


> Thanks for the report! I have also noticed the ano on my lights seems much tougher than on other lights where it seems to flake off or chip easier. My dad has one on a keychain that after 1 year of use barely has any ano missing. His previous light had scratches all over during that same amount of time. Mine also hold up to drops on concrete and hardwood floors with minimal to no damage at all.



Thanks for sharing, glad to know that other ZL owners are experiencing the same durability. My old P12, now in my dad's backpack, has tiny flakes all over the place even though it stays in the backpack most of the time.


----------



## markr6

Just noticed they added "+" to the CRI in the spreadsheet for many of the newer lights (i.e. 80+). I see this on light bulbs many times. I assume it just means for an 80+, 80 is the minimum? Could be higher? How much higher?


----------



## iamlucky13

Right, that would indicate a minimum, which is how the LED's are often binned. Since Cree seems to bin their Easywhite LED's in 10 CRI increments, hypothetically an 80+ CRI light could be as high as 89 CRI, but if it were 90 CRI, they'd sell it as 90+ to get a higher price on it. How likely that is to actually happen though, I don't know.


----------



## hmihaylov

I have a question about the new firmware.

One thing I did not like about the old firmware was that for the strobe modes the levels could not be changed. Is this an option in the new firmware? Are they with different levels in G6 and G7 than in the main ones? They were always set to H1 in the old firmware. If you have H1 set to a different value for G6 or G7 in the new firmware, would they use that new level?


----------



## markr6

Just realized EVERYTHING is in stock. At least all of the current models. Even many of the sale/older models.

Now for something new so I can blow more money!!


----------



## jon_slider

markr6 said:


> Could be higher? How much higher?


not much (2-3 CRI) if maukka's tests of other models is any indication

e.g.: *SC600Fd III Plus CRI *spec is 90-93. maukka tested it at 91 CRI




here is the *SC5Fc*, rated 83-85 CRI. maukka tested it at 83 CRI


----------



## eraursls1984

The list was updated with the SC53c and SC53w added with a release date of 7/17. It looks like it has the H53c/w driver.


----------



## Tixx

So the difference between G6 and G7 is you get more modes in G7? One more of each? I could not figure it out.


----------



## emarkd

Tixx said:


> So the difference between G6 and G7 is you get more modes in G7? One more of each? I could not figure it out.



I'm pretty sure G6 and G7 are functionally identical. Its just two memory "slots" so you can set up two different fully programmable UIs and switch back and forth between them quickly. G5 is still there too, so there's really 3 groups, but G5 is limited in programmability, much like the original UI.


----------



## eraursls1984

Tixx said:


> So the difference between G6 and G7 is you get more modes in G7? One more of each? I could not figure it out.


No, they all have 6 modes. My hope is that at least the 18650 lights get one group with 9 modes. It could be a new mode group (larger driver, more memory?) or even just 9odes on G7.


----------



## Tixx

eraursls1984 said:


> No, they all have 6 modes. My hope is that at least the 18650 lights get one group with 9 modes. It could be a new mode group (larger driver, more memory?) or even just 9odes on G7.



So then what is the difference between G6 and G7?


----------



## eraursls1984

Tixx said:


> So then what is the difference between G6 and G7?


They are the same fully programmable UI, and G5 is the old UI.


----------



## dmsoule

Tixx said:


> So then what is the difference between G6 and G7?



They are identical by default, but you can program each to your liking, giving you 3 different mode spacings total: G5, G6, and G7.


----------



## Tixx

dmsoule said:


> They are identical by default, but you can program each to your liking, giving you 3 different mode spacings total: G5, G6, and G7.



Oh, ok. Thanks.


----------



## Cobraman502

Any word on an SC64w?


----------



## Cobraman502

Well straight from Zebralight

Department: Sales

Subject: ZebraLight, Inc.:

No plans for SC64 series in the next few months. 

Sincerely,

ZebraLight, Inc.
2908 Story Rd. W
Irving, TX 75038


----------



## gunga

Dang it! I'm looking for a new high cri 18650 model with updated UI.


----------



## Cobraman502

gunga said:


> Dang it! I'm looking for a new high cri 18650 model with updated UI.



Yeah me too.


----------



## markr6

I pulled all the 18650s I had in flashlights today just to do a discharge-test on the Opus 3100. I definitely noticed the crushed tops from the Zebralights (NCR18650GA). I don’t think it’s a safety concern at this point, just a little annoying.


----------



## meti

markr6 said:


> I pulled all the 18650s I had in flashlights today just to do a discharge-test on the Opus 3100. I definitely noticed the crushed tops from the Zebralights (NCR18650GA). I don’t think it’s a safety concern at this point, just a little annoying.



Sadly that's why I stopped using my SC600... two crushed battery is enough for me, I keep it in my collection but won't use it anymore.


----------



## terjee

Quick note in crushing... some batteries seem more prone to this than others. Could be worthwhile to try a different type (as long or shorter)? And was the NCR18650GA batteries of the flat-top type, or button top? (They're sold with and without button top IIRC).


----------



## vadimax

Sony VTC6 is 64.9 mm long.


----------



## Cobraman502

Anyone know if the olight s1a tail cap fits the Zebralight sc52w?


----------



## vadimax

BTW, I cannot understand Zebralight's engineers. Was it life or death importance to make the SC600 Mk III so short that nearly all unprotected batteries happen to be too long for that light?! Just 2 mm longer and the issue would be nonexistent.


----------



## noboneshotdog

vadimax said:


> BTW, I cannot understand Zebralight's engineers. Was it life or death importance to make the SC600 Mk III so short that nearly all unprotected batteries happen to be too long for that light?! Just 2 mm longer and the issue would be nonexistent.



Agree, it was compact enough personally. If you REALLY needed to go any smaller go 14500. Just an opinion. I actually like the light to fill my hand.


----------



## terjee

vadimax said:


> BTW, I cannot understand Zebralight's engineers. Was it life or death importance to make the SC600 Mk III so short that nearly all unprotected batteries happen to be too long for that light?! Just 2 mm longer and the issue would be nonexistent.



A lot of (most of?) the protected batteries are arguably unsuitable. The light can pull something like 8A at full throttle, which the protected batteries are often not happy with, and it might trigger the protection circuits.


----------



## emarkd

Yeah all this battery stuff was hashed out months ago, over and over again. They_ probably _made it extra-short so protected cells wouldn't fit, because the light needs more current than they really want to give. Also Zebra wanted to use pogo pins instead of springs for that same reason - more current carrying capacity. And since pogo pins have a much shorter range of "adjustment" for the fit, the size of the cell becomes very particular. These weren't just pointless design decisions, they're relevant to the performance of the light.

And as far as Zebra's lights not "filling your hand", well yeah, that's what they do. Zebra makes small lights. Lots of other people make big lights, if that's what you want.


----------



## vadimax

terjee said:


> A lot of (most of?) the protected batteries are arguably unsuitable. The light can pull something like 8A at full throttle, which the protected batteries are often not happy with, and it might trigger the protection circuits.



Sorry? Have you read my post? Where have you found the word "protected"? The stupidity of the issue is that most *unprotected* flat top cells are being crushed if you close the tail cap tight.

In the SC600 Mk III specification we read: "Battery: One 18650 size (i.e. unprotected, 65.0-65.2 mm long) 3.6-4.35V li-ion rechargeable". In the Sanyo NCR18650GA specification: "Dimensions: 18.43mm x 65.05mm". In the post #701: "I definitely noticed the crushed tops from the Zebralights (NCR18650GA).".

What?!


----------



## noboneshotdog

emarkd said:


> Yeah all this battery stuff was hashed out months ago, over and over again. They_ probably _made it extra-short so protected cells wouldn't fit, because the light needs more current than they really want to give. Also Zebra wanted to use pogo pins instead of springs for that same reason - more current carrying capacity. And since pogo pins have a much shorter range of "adjustment" for the fit, the size of the cell becomes very particular. These weren't just pointless design decisions, they're relevant to the performance of the light.
> 
> And as far as Zebra's lights not "filling your hand", well yeah, that's what they do. Zebra makes small lights. Lots of other people make big lights, if that's what you want.



It just seems that Zebralight feels they have to make every new rendition of thier SC600 series brighter and smaller. I personally think the SC600 MKII was the perfect size. Smaller doesn't equate to better for me ZL. 

I appreciate ZL's small form, but a little bit of mass is nice too.

I have owned most SC600 iterations, just prefer MKII best.


----------



## terjee

vadimax said:


> Sorry? Have you read my post? Where have you found the word "protected"? The stupidity of the issue is that most *unprotected* flat top cells are being crushed if you close the tail cap tight.



CPF is friendly >90% of the time, let's try to keep it that way? Responses like that are just begging for "Oh, you're one of those, let me get my spoon...", and then it just goes downhill from there. I get that you probably meant no harm, and I hope that's mutual. 

As to the point; you said you couldn't understand their engineers. I simply offered a possible explanation, that it could have been a goal for them to avoid the lights being used with protected batteries. While you spoke of unprotected batteries, I chose to reference protected because they're tied in with the possible explanation I was trying to offer.

Would it have been better if it was 2mm longer? Quite possibly, but also besides the point I was getting at, namely explaining a possible motivation for the choice.

I do see I answered fairly short, and could probably have been more clear. Sorry for that.


----------



## Connor

vadimax said:


> BTW, I cannot understand Zebralight's engineers. Was it life or death importance to make the SC600 Mk III so short that nearly all unprotected batteries happen to be too long for that light?! Just 2 mm longer and the issue would be nonexistent.



65.0-65.2 mm is exactly what a 18650 flattop cell is _supposed _to measure by the industry standards (and high quality cells like the Panasonic NCR18650GA or LG IMR18650MJ1 are exactly that length and fit fine).


----------



## emarkd

noboneshotdog said:


> It just seems that Zebralight feels they have to make every new rendition of thier SC600 series brighter and smaller. I personally think the SC600 MKII was the perfect size. Smaller doesn't equate to better for me ZL.
> 
> I appreciate ZL's small form, but a little bit of mass is nice too.
> 
> I have owned most SC600 iterations, just prefer MKII best.



Yeah I don't really disagree with you. I'd still be interested in a mk4 light even if it wasn't smaller than the mk3. And in fact I'm not sure how they'd get it any smaller anyway. And FWIW, I've had all three iterations too, still have them, and I also liked the mk2 best. Its a great light to hold and use.


----------



## terjee

Would be interesting to get a couple of you guys in touch with the design team at Zebralight. Anyone tried to reach out to them to suggest it?


----------



## vadimax

terjee said:


> CPF is friendly >90% of the time, let's try to keep it that way? Responses like that are just begging for "Oh, you're one of those, let me get my spoon...", and then it just goes downhill from there. I get that you probably meant no harm, and I hope that's mutual.
> 
> As to the point; you said you couldn't understand their engineers. I simply offered a possible explanation, that it could have been a goal for them to avoid the lights being used with protected batteries. While you spoke of unprotected batteries, I chose to reference protected because they're tied in with the possible explanation I was trying to offer.
> 
> Would it have been better if it was 2mm longer? Quite possibly, but also besides the point I was getting at, namely explaining a possible motivation for the choice.
> 
> I do see I answered fairly short, and could probably have been more clear. Sorry for that.



Out of a wild guess I think Zebralight missed one obvious mass production issue: tolerances are too tight to be massively reproduced. So they issue lights that even the shortest unprotected cells do not fit (that are mass produced as well and suffer length deviations as well). This way we've got a good in all other respects light that requires to... hand pick a fitting cell?

Now which phrase describes it best:

a) the best is the enemy of the good enough?
b) too much of a good thing is good for nothing?
c) let well enough alone?


----------



## noboneshotdog

emarkd said:


> Yeah I don't really disagree with you. I'd still be interested in a mk4 light even if it wasn't smaller than the mk3. And in fact I'm not sure how they'd get it any smaller anyway. And FWIW, I've had all three iterations too, still have them, and I also liked the mk2 best. Its a great light to hold and use.



I would buy a MKIIII in a heartbeat. Especially with the new UI. :thumbsup:


----------



## vadimax

noboneshotdog said:


> I would buy a MKIIII in a heartbeat. Especially with the new UI. :thumbsup:



Well, having a SC5c I discovered no need in those G6 and G7.


----------



## terjee

vadimax said:


> Out of a wild guess I think Zebralight missed one obvious mass production issue: tolerances are too tight to be massively reproduced. So they issue lights that even the shortest unprotected cells do not fit (that are mass produced as well and suffer length deviations as well). This way we've got a good in all other respects light that requires to... hand pick a fitting cell?



Yeah, definitively agree that tolerances is an issue, no question about it. Both with the light itself. Including the pogo pins specifically, but also minor details like the tension of the springs in the pins. Also tolerances with the batteries.

Even if they get every single dimension spot on, there's still the issue of how hard it would push against the cell, and how much pressure the cell will tolerate. That is, not just tolerances on dimensions, but pliability of the cell.

Vaping community (which also relies heavily on 18650s) has had similar issues. I seem to recall people having an impression that some cells are more affected than others, but I don't know if there's a good reason for that, other than those cells being more typically used.

Have an SC600w Mk III on the way, which I assume is "at risk". I'll investigate a bit when it arrives. 

Would interesting to see if there's at least a battery type that would be suitable, without having to pick individual cells.


----------



## dmsoule

I love my SC600 mk3, and I'm glad they shrunk it down - no wasted space, a marvel of engineering. My LG hg2, Samsung 30q, and Panasonic NCR18650GA cells all fit perfectly, no issues. Just my two cents.


----------



## vadimax

dmsoule said:


> I love my SC600 mk3, and I'm glad they shrunk it down - no wasted space, a marvel of engineering. My LG hg2, Samsung 30q, and Panasonic NCR18650GA cells all fit perfectly, no issues. Just my two cents.



Well, looks like a lottery :thinking: I hope mine will be fine. Got a response from [email protected] and he cannot recall any issues as well. At least their batch is OK


----------



## markr6

I figured the NCR18650GA fit fine in my SC600w HI...I guess it does. But after a while just being in my briefcase I noticed the top was crushed in pretty bad. Just simply from tossing my briefcase into my car rather gently. I can't imagine it was caused by this light, but since I don't swap batteries, it definitely was. I never dropped it or handled it rough.

As long as it's only cosmetic I'm fine with since it's such a great light.

Same with my SC63w.


----------



## Swedpat

I just placed an order for a Zebralight SC600w Mark III from Nkon.


----------



## TCY

I cycle a couple of NCR18650GAs with my Fd Plus and the flat tops have not been crushed at all.


----------



## snowlover91

The battery issue has been discussed at length in other threads before, not sure why it is being rehashed again. Some like it, others don’t. Some prefer the pogo pins and see their benefit, others don’t like the drawbacks. At the end of the day mine works great, has no reliability issues, and has the benefit of a shorter light. Sometimes you have to push the limit of what’s possible and ZL seems to do that fairly frequently. It will be interesting to see what they offer in their MK4 and SC64 series lights and if they go away from the pogo pins or keep them.


----------



## markr6

snowlover91 said:


> The battery issue has been discussed at length in other threads before, not sure why it is being rehashed again.



Because I had no issues with pogo pins. I stated in the past my batteries looked fine...now they don't even after light use and no drops.

If you want everyone to never ever post about things in the past, even with a slightly different take or "update", you would have to build your own forum.


----------



## snowlover91

markr6 said:


> Because I had no issues with pogo pins. I stated in the past my batteries looked fine...now they don't even after light use and no drops.
> 
> If you want everyone to never ever post about things in the past, even with a slightly different take or "update", you would have to build your own forum.



My post wasn’t directed at you or anyone else but at the overall idea of the debate being rehashed in length again. Pages and pages were spent in multiple threads on it, even some heated debates. It got tiring to the point of the mods having to step in several times... Don’t take things so personal


----------



## markr6

I wasn't really taking it personal. It's just an important thing to note IMO. People got bent out of shape on the pogo vs. spring, protected, unprotected, cell length, etc.

But while I defended the design originally, I'm not so sure now. This is a pretty substantial cell crush especially when you consider the use: hardly none at all! It sits in my briefcase which never gets dropped. The most action it sees is me setting it gently on my passenger seat, horizontally. Not even vertically where it could possibly put some force on the cell.

Flat top NCR18650GA - again, when I say I hardly use this light, I mean it. I just don't use it anymore. So for the cell to get like this gives me some concern.








How I carry it in my briefcase


----------



## terjee

Could you get it touch with them (Zebralight) directly, and maybe send in both light and cell?
Would be interesting for them to be able to evaluate a confirmed case of this, and compare your specific light and battery, to see what's up. Pogo pins too long? Threading too far into the light? Battery out of spec?

Simply knowing could put a lot of minds to ease, and offer solutions for those worrying about theirs.

Quick question of my own: did it ever get warm? Either self-heating, or exposed to heat?


----------



## markr6

terjee said:


> Could you get it touch with them (Zebralight) directly, and maybe send in both light and cell?



I did ask a while back since I saw some people posting about the 6 vs 3 pins on their SC63. ZL said it wasn't an update. The 6-pin setup was designed for the higher current SC600 Plus only and that the 6-pin on the SC63 was "a mixup during assembly/manufacturing". They didn't really offer any help or advice on the cell getting crushed so I just left it at that.

My SC600 HI did the same thing; basically to the same extent on another 18650GA.


----------



## snowlover91

Hmmm mine isn’t dented anything like that. It has a minor dip but nothing quite like that. My Plus model hasn’t dented any of the cells, only my HI model has. I’m thinking they worked out the kinks and variances since it’s release but I might would see about getting ZL to replace it.


----------



## Swedpat

Today I received Zebralight SC600w III. Awesome light! It's very compact for a single 18650 light, actually not very much bigger than SC5. I earlier wondered if I should have ordered the HI option instead but the hotspot is wide and powerful so for an allround light I don't think I need it. Apart from that I guess that the slightly larger reflector provides better throw at a given output compared to SC5, because the LEDs seem to be very similar size.
The tint is very warm, actually warmer than I expected. It feels considerably warmer than SC5w, despite almost the same stated tint. The tint is actually very different in color so it's a bit difficult to compare. If there is anything I wish had been different with this light I wish M1 level had been twice as what it's now, I think it's too big difference between M1 and H1. Otherwise I am satisfied with it. 

Here is a comparison to SC5 and Surefire E1L Outdoorsman which shows how small SC600 III is!






SC5w to left and SC600w III to right:


----------



## markr6

Swedpat said:


> If there is anything I wish had been different with this light I wish M1 level had been twice as what it's now, I think it's too big difference between M1 and H1.



I totally agree. It's even worse (more pronounced) on the HI version. Luckily, when I'm using the HI it's as a mini thrower, so H1 is usually the case.


----------



## ven

Very nice Swedpat got to love these little ZL's Got the sc63w 4500k xhp 35 today myself and really like it(next will be the xhp50).












My 2



Clip is a little shiny/blingy



xp-l2 hi cri/ xhp35 4500k


----------



## Swedpat

ven,

O yeah, sc63 is even more compact than SC600 III! I just wonder about the lack of knurling: isn't it slippery? Also I think the heat dissipation isn't as good because of the smaller mass. But this is only an issue if running the light at the highest or next highest level for extended period, I guess.


----------



## markr6

I find the SC63w easy to hold. The clip gives it a lot of grip, otherwise it would be too slippery. It gets hot fast and usually starts stepping down after 10-15 seconds (maybe a little sooner/longer depending on ambient temp)


----------



## ven

Compared to the D4 it's super grippy :laughing:. As mark said, no issue re- being slippy . I think the design maybe love/hate and a small part of the reason I decided on this one next. It's super light, feels nice in hand. The clip is decent other than being shiny(not for me, prefer the sc5c clip but subjective ). 

It certainly kicks out a lot of light, handles heat very well considering it's size. I really like it, if ever an 18650 light could be used for EDC, this has to be up there with very few compact 18650 fed lights. 

I cant believe I have waited so long for a ZL , amount I have read and pondered (Mark6 played a huge part). Along with the design, LED choices and trick driver, the nice green ano also is a strong point for me. They are not cheap compared to some well known brands , but there is a lot stuffed into the small/ light package!


----------



## TCY

That ano on your SC63W looks oily/greasy, definitely shiner than that of my SC600Fd plus and SC62w but I'm sure they are of high quality. I've seen greasy looking ZL ano before, dunno what's the cause. Temperature?
Comparison:


----------



## ven

Yes it is shiny, picks up light easy anyway. The sc5c mkII looks the same mat as your sc600fd which will be my next ZL


----------



## roger-roger

The SC32w is not currently listed at ZL.


----------



## eraursls1984

roger-roger said:


> The SC32w is not currently listed at ZL.


This is sad, but it's been this way for awhile.


----------



## recDNA

emarkd said:


> Yeah all this battery stuff was hashed out months ago, over and over again. They_ probably _made it extra-short so protected cells wouldn't fit, because the light needs more current than they really want to give. Also Zebra wanted to use pogo pins instead of springs for that same reason - more current carrying capacity. And since pogo pins have a much shorter range of "adjustment" for the fit, the size of the cell becomes very particular. These weren't just pointless design decisions, they're relevant to the performance of the light.
> 
> And as far as Zebra's lights not "filling your hand", well yeah, that's what they do. Zebra makes small lights. Lots of other people make big lights, if that's what you want.


But if they're crushing GA flat tops where is one to go?


----------



## recDNA

markr6 said:


> I figured the NCR18650GA fit fine in my SC600w HI...I guess it does. But after a while just being in my briefcase I noticed the top was crushed in pretty bad. Just simply from tossing my briefcase into my car rather gently. I can't imagine it was caused by this light, but since I don't swap batteries, it definitely was. I never dropped it or handled it rough.
> 
> As long as it's only cosmetic I'm fine with since it's such a great light.
> 
> Same with my SC63w.


You won't know if it is only cosmetic until it vents right?


----------



## ven

Dont want to go over old ground, however marks GA top is on the more sever side of pushed in..........I have had a few over the years which have looked not quite as bad(they do push in too easy though!). No issues other than cosmetic, mine were caused by drops with the cell in a light(not ZL). Stil for piece of mind and what a cell costs, i would swap it out for another high drain(maybe one that is shorter in the specs). 

Way too early as only a couple of days, however the 30Q I am using shows no signs at all of any dents/pushed in. The base of the cell also looks fine other than the normal little swirl from the contact spring. I always check my cells when charging anyway, so anything untoward over the coming weeks/month.........i will report with pics. 
As of now



the end


----------



## markr6

Thanks for the update ven. At the risk of getting flamed and told I'm not able to bring up anything from the past, I won't update my NCR18650GA damage. Just keep an eye on them like you said.


----------



## ven

markr6 said:


> Thanks for the update ven. At the risk of getting flamed and told I'm not able to bring up anything from the past, I won't update my NCR18650GA damage. Just keep an eye on them like you said.



Coincidentally, i checked a BD cell in my predator...........guess what 




Its not the only cell i have used in the v2.5 pro, so might have been caused away from this light..............but its been in there and used for maybe 12m or more.

Still getting used by the way


----------



## emarkd

recDNA said:


> But if they're crushing GA flat tops where is one to go?


Well when I made that comment the discussion wasn't about crushed cells. It was about only fitting unprotected cells. If there's new info to add then of course I think it's valid discussion.

Besides, when did folks start caring what I think anyway...


----------



## vadimax

recDNA said:


> But if they're crushing GA flat tops where is one to go?



I have got a SC600w HI today and it is OK with NCR18650GA. It has 3 pins at the "+" and 4 at the "-". No damage to the mentioned battery at all. Purchased at NKON.


----------



## ven

That's a different design then to the sc63w vad, this has 3 pogo's at the + and a moderate spring in the tail cap. Maybe the sc63w does not suffer the same(sorry if been mentioned in previous posts).


----------



## Trevilux

For me the new interface has become indispensable.


*For the SC5w MK II I use the G7 group as follows:*
H1-0.33 lum H2-3.2 lum (direct access one short click)
M1-550 lum M2-274 lum (direct access 2 clicks)
L1-21 lum L2-92 (long press)


*Perfect distribution:* 0.33 / 3.2 / 21/92/274/550


I hate now my old SC52, I think I should get the new SC53 .....


----------



## ven

Awesome pic Trev, could reach out and grab it from the screen I am also a big fan of the UI on the sc5c mkII, very cool how you can change the levels around and have 3 groups. Although more advanced than the older UI reg programming, i still like the old UI as well. As long as i can get a couple of levels i use the most easily, i am happy.


----------



## tompen41

What happened to the SC32W. Is it discontinued or just out of stock. Can't find one anywhere.


----------



## 18650

tompen41 said:


> What happened to the SC32W. Is it discontinued or just out of stock. Can't find one anywhere.


 It would not at all be surprising if they dropped CR123 models for having a fraction of the sales of the 18650 and AA ones.


----------



## Trevilux

Arrived SC53c, I love the tint and the configurable interface. This and the SC5w MK II are my new EDC for rotation, the old SC52 with CW.... is in the box again...


----------



## TCY

I might as well post this here for more people to see. For those who are wondering about ZL's IPX7 rating:

I asked ZL over a year ago about the awkward IPX7 rating and here's their reply:

"_We actually believe that the waterproofness of all of our lights are better than any other popular brands. The three possible ingress points (glass, switch cover, and tail cap) are all designed and verified thoroughly and manufactured to high standards."

_So it basically sounds like ZLs are IPX8 and tech guys at ZL are just conservative when it comes to ratings. If one is careful enough to observe, all of ZL's newer generation lights like the H53 and SC5 Mk II line are rated IPX8 instead of older generation's IPX7 however they have the same (2 meters, 30 minutes) after them which is another evidence of them being conservative in the past. AFAIK ZL is the only manufacturer that actually specifies their water ingression test condition which is required by the IP rating system (immersion depth and duration are to be specified by manufacturer). 

For those who don't know, the IP6- rating is for solid particle protection. Since solid particle (e.g, dust) are larger than water molecules I believe every IPX8 rated flashlight should naturally be dust proof. 

Which is another reason why I trust ZL products and would 100% recommend them.:thumbsup:


----------



## Lesterq

Is the Zebralights with their PID flashlights with the longest runtime on High mode?


----------



## TCY

Lesterq said:


> Is the Zebralights with their PID flashlights with the longest runtime on High mode?



Depends on ambient temperature, PID is just a mechanism to maintain the light's heat in a predetermined level (IIRC all ZL's PID kick in at 53 degrees C by default), PID alone doesn't have much to do with runtime. If used in a low temp environment, the light runs on higher levels for a longer time thus decreasing runtime, vice versa.


----------



## Alyx

Just got my hands on a SC600W MK3 HI and I'm already looking to get a second ZL light which would either the SC600Fd or SC600F.
What are the differences between the two other than the latter being more powerful in terms of lumens?


----------



## TCY

"d" means higher CRI, tint within a smaller variance (3 vs 5 Macadam Ellipse ) and neutral white (5000K) tint.

I'd grab the Fd over regular F all day every day.


----------



## Swedpat

I have SC53c since some week. I also got the H53c. Nice warm tint, but these are slightly less bright than SC52w/H52w.
About the SC53 I don't understand why Zebralight does not make it with knurling like SC5 instead of this pretty slippery surface. 
Anyway, a slippery body is not a problem with side switch as it is with tail switch so it isn't a serious problem, just that it could have been better.


----------



## gk1610

I received zl h603w, I love a wide beam 120 degree, it's amazing, except this light dont have pocket clip


----------



## tompen41

The SC32W is available again on their site. Just got one shipped..........


----------



## Alyx

TCY said:


> "d" means higher CRI, tint within a smaller variance (3 vs 5 Macadam Ellipse ) and neutral white (5000K) tint.
> 
> I'd grab the Fd over regular F all day every day.



Thanks


----------



## anthon87

I'm waiting for the SC600W HI to have G6 and G7 programming. I'll buy it when they release it


----------



## markr6

anthon87 said:


> I'm waiting for the SC600W HI to have G6 and G7 programming. I'll buy it when they release it



Yea that gap between M and H modes is too much. Luckily I primarily use the H modes on this light as a mini thrower, but the G6 and G7 will be very welcomed.


----------



## eraursls1984

markr6 said:


> Yea that gap between M and H modes is too much. Luckily I primarily use the H modes on this light as a mini thrower, but the G6 and G7 will be very welcomed.


Yep, although they got that gap right on the SC5c MK II.


----------



## Swedpat

markr6 said:


> Yea that gap between M and H modes is too much. Luckily I primarily use the H modes on this light as a mini thrower, but the G6 and G7 will be very welcomed.





eraursls1984 said:


> Yep, although they got that gap right on the SC5c MK II.



That has been my biggest critical point when it comes to 600 series: while the H modes compared to AA powered series are very much increased due to higher battery capacity the L and M are practically the same. This results in a too big difference between the M and H modes. M1 should be at least 100-150lm.

Anyway SC600 MK III is an awesome light and I will not get rid of it without a serious improvement is offered.


----------



## guardrail

Looks like they added a new *SC600w IV Plus*, Cree XHP50.2, listed with 2440 max lumens, yet not released: 2017/10.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet...dit?hl=en&authkey=CNqP6KIC&pref=2&pli=1#gid=0
​​​


----------



## markr6

In addition to the new Plus and SC64c, there are three new models on the product sheet!

SC600 IV

SC600w IV

SC600w IV HI

ps. make that FIVE (SC64 and SC64w)

pps. add all the new 64/604 headlamps...can't keep up!


----------



## anthon87

markr6 said:


> In addition to the new Plus and SC64c, there are three new models on the product sheet!
> 
> SC600 IV
> 
> SC600w IV
> 
> SC600w IV HI
> 
> ps. make that FIVE (SC64 and SC64w)
> 
> pps. add all the new 64/604 headlamps...can't keep up!



I can't wait till I have in my hands that SC600w IV HI with the new UI!


----------



## Cobraman502

markr6 said:


> In addition to the new Plus and SC64c, there are three new models on the product sheet!
> 
> SC600 IV
> 
> SC600w IV
> 
> SC600w IV HI
> 
> ps. make that FIVE (SC64 and SC64w)
> 
> pps. add all the new 64/604 headlamps...can't keep up!



Headlamps are up now


----------



## twistedraven

Looks like they're just driving the XHP35 a little harder. Probably not worth it at all, unless they have a new driver that's way more efficient, or a new body that makes a better beam (for the non floody models). Multiple UI groups is cool, but I already really like the old Zebralight UI.


My SC600 MK3 HI has a tint that I cherry-picked among 3 different units, I wouldn't want to do that again with the MK4 considering the small increase in output.


----------



## markr6

Yeah I love my SC600 HI, but always bothered by that jump from M1 to H2 or whatever I set. This IV is the answer! Rolling dice on the tint though.


----------



## emarkd

twistedraven said:


> Looks like they're just driving the XHP35 a little harder.



May not even be that. Could be they were just able to source a higher flux bin emitter from Cree this time around. It's been a year since the last one, after all. So it could be the exact same light but with a different emitter bin and flashed with the new firmware. Maybe.


----------



## moozooh

Personally I'm _this_ close to considering the extra UI groups a killer feature. The reason is that whenever I give my SC600 to somebody, they inevitably turn it on on High and dazzle themselves and everyone around when in the vast majority of cases they would've wanted a Mid or a Low. If I tell them they need to hold the button for Low, they either release it too quick and dazzle themselves again, or skip to Mid and, in their confusion, to High, _again_. So whenever I am at some kind of hiking trip or some other outside get-together with other people, I'd rather prefer a simpler, more beginner-friendly UI that would start at M1 (which is the most frequently used mode in my light anyway).


----------



## markr6

Nobody gets my Zebralights to borrow...for several reasons!


----------



## vadimax

markr6 said:


> Nobody gets my Zebralights to borrow...for several reasons!



+1. This is blasphemy!  An infidel shall never touch the sacred...


----------



## sc00ts19

moozooh said:


> Personally I'm _this_ close to considering the extra UI groups a killer feature.



I’ve wanted a ZL for a while and the new ui is what finally sold me on an H53c. I have G6 and 7 set up for short click to moonlight, long press medium, double click high. G7 is set up as a low group. It’s nice not having to worry about my son blinding himself on accident.


----------



## Cobraman502

Can someone post a beam shot of the sc53c vs another light? I’m interested in the sc64C and I never had a high cri light.


----------



## Swede74

Cobraman502 said:


> Can someone post a beam shot of the sc53c vs another light? I’m interested in the sc64C and I never had a high cri light.



It is not exactly what you asked for, but perhaps the Zebralight SC5c II vs Zebralight SC51 and Nitecore MT1A is close enough?

Camera settings: ISO 200, White Balance = "Fluorescent". 

More beamshots here, here and SC5c II vs SC53w here


----------



## 18650

markr6 said:


> In addition to the new Plus and SC64c, there are three new models on the product sheet! SC600 IV SC600w IV SC600w IV HI ps. make that FIVE (SC64 and SC64w) pps. add all the new 64/604 headlamps...can't keep up!


 Nothing to succeed the SC62d. Sad!


----------



## TCY

Cobraman502 said:


> Can someone post a beam shot of the sc53c vs another light? I’m interested in the sc64C and I never had a high cri light.



http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...parison-XM-L2-CW-NW-XHP50-XP-L2-219B-amp-219C

The H53Fc uses the same LED so it would be a suitable point of reference.


----------



## Cobraman502

Thanks for the beam shots guys not sure if I will go with the sc64C as it’s 4000k seems a little low on the temp. I have the SC52w right now and I really like that. I think it’s 4500k. Might go for the sc64w instead. Is the extra cri worth it. You guys happy with the sc53c?


----------



## Swedpat

markr6 said:


> Nobody gets my Zebralights to borrow...for several reasons!





vadimax said:


> +1. This is blasphemy!  An infidel shall never touch the sacred...



If some infidel which is aware of my flashlight hobby ask me to lend out a flashlight I have a few budget lights in my collection who could be used for that purpose.


----------



## SubLGT

markr6 said:


> In addition to the new Plus and SC64c, there are three new models on the product sheet!
> 
> SC600 IV
> 
> SC600w IV
> 
> SC600w IV HI
> 
> ps. make that FIVE (SC64 and SC64w)
> 
> pps. add all the new 64/604 headlamps...can't keep up!



I own three ZLs. If the new UI allows me to get rid of the very annoying 0.6 sec timing requirement to get into LOW from OFF, then I can see a SC64 or SC64w in my future, as long as the tint is decent.


----------



## sc00ts19

SubLGT said:


> I own three ZLs. If the new UI allows me to get rid of the very annoying 0.6 sec timing requirement to get into LOW from OFF, then I can see a SC64 or SC64w in my future, as long as the tint is decent.



It absolutely will. That’s how I have mine set up, single click to low. Something I dislike about the old ui is the high flash while double clicking to medium. This can be removed by setting the double click as your high settings. Really, the old ui is very good, and many like it as is. The new ui solves a lot of issues many people had by making it fully customizable. I think it was an excellent and intelligent compromise on ZL’s part.


----------



## markr6

18650 said:


> Nothing to succeed the SC62d. Sad!



I'm kicking myself for selling mine. They need a new UI model and a bump in lumens wouldn't hurt. Maybe some day.


----------



## SubLGT

sc00ts19 said:


> It absolutely will. That’s how I have mine set up, single click to low.



Thanks for the information.


----------



## Cobraman502

sc00ts19 said:


> It absolutely will. That’s how I have mine set up, single click to low. Something I dislike about the old ui is the high flash while double clicking to medium. This can be removed by setting the double click as your high settings. Really, the old ui is very good, and many like it as is. The new ui solves a lot of issues many people had by making it fully customizable. I think it was an excellent and intelligent compromise on ZL’s part.



I was hoping the new UI would fix someone the issues I was facing, looks like it will.


----------



## tetradog

sc00ts19 said:


> That’s how I have mine set up, single click to low. Something I dislike about the old ui is the high flash while double clicking to medium. This can be removed by setting the double click as your high settings.



Setting single click to Low is what eliminates the double-click High flash.


----------



## SubLGT

I was reading the 40 page thread about the SC63 and Sc63w, and came across this post from markr6 which I think is a good description of the XHP35 tint lottery



> It's not just blue vs. yellow. If you get a "yellow" tint, you got screwed. I had two SC63w lights and one was literally yellow, one was neutral. It's just the variance in LEDs from Cree. Unfortunately a lottery; are you lucky or not?
> 
> Whether you like cool or neutral is a personal preference, but there's really 4 scenarios:
> 
> Cool with bad tint: blue/purple crap
> Cool with good tint: pure white with a cooler feel to it
> Neutral with bad tint: yellow or green
> Neutral with good tint: pure white with a warmer feel, maybe a slight pinkish or tan hue (in a good way)



http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...Light-SC63-and-variants-like-the-SC63w/page34


----------



## eraursls1984

SubLGT said:


> I was reading the 40 page thread about the SC63 and Sc63w, and came across this post from markr6 which I think is a good description of the XHP35 tint lottery.





> _Cool with bad tint: blue/purple crap_
> _Cool with good tint: pure white with a cooler feel to it_
> _Neutral with bad tint: yellow or green_
> _Neutral with good tint: pure white with a warmer feel, maybe a slight pinkish or tan hue (in a good way)_


I always hear of bad green tint on neutral white lights, but I've only seen green (as well as blue and purple) on my cool white lights. Then again I've only had about 50-60 lights, a far lower sample than others here.. When my neutral lights are bad they are very yellow. A little yellow is fine, a little magenta is great, pure white is Also great. Any blue, purple, or green at all is terrible, IMO.


----------



## twistedraven

I've yet to see a Cree domed LED in a reflector not give a greenish corona and purplish spill, no matter its color temperature (or CRI or closeness to the bbl). The HI emitters interact with the reflectors differently, so the tint difference from hotspot to spill is greatly mitigated. As a result you'll get an average color throughout the entire beam, but you're still subject to the lottery.


----------



## markr6

eraursls1984 said:


> I always hear of bad green tint on neutral white lights, but I've only seen green (as well as blue and purple) on my cool white lights.



I forgot about this. The best example of a green neutral was my SC52w...so green it was delegated to car duty. Within a week or so it was stolen out of my car!! I honestly didn't care about that as much as my GPS, some cash and knife that was taken.

I still have my other SC52w, which is a nice neutral. It's a keeper!


----------



## roger-roger

Speaking of the UI, seriously I'd like to capability to set 100 Lu in medium.


----------



## TCY

ZL plans to release H600Fd/c MKIV and H604d/c with XHP50.2 in "a few months". It's a darn long wait period but I'll skip the flashlight version and wait.


----------



## ven

roger-roger said:


> Speaking of the UI, seriously I'd like to capability to set 100 Lu in medium.




You should be able to roger, you can select any of the levels to a medium setting with the new UI, might not be bang on 100lm but it will be close.


----------



## roger-roger

ven said:


> You should be able to roger, you can select any of the levels to a medium setting with the new UI, might not be bang on 100lm but it will be close.




Excellent. Looks like I won't be able to resist the XHP 50.2 offering, which the new UI complements nicely.


----------



## Cobraman502

FYI from Zebralight sales

We'll start to take pre-orders of Mk 4 generation 18650 lights right before the end of this month.

SC series is late November


----------



## markr6

Cobraman502 said:


> FYI from Zebralight sales
> 
> We'll start to take pre-orders of Mk 4 generation 18650 lights right before the end of this month.




:rock: :rock: :rock: :rock: :rock:


----------



## Tachead

Cobraman502 said:


> FYI from Zebralight sales
> 
> We'll start to take pre-orders of Mk 4 generation 18650 lights right before the end of this month.
> 
> SC series is late November


They told me the pre-order for the SC64c would open by the end of October.

Maybe they meant the H series is late November? 

I guess we will see.


----------



## Cobraman502

Well I hope it is end of October


----------



## roger-roger

I may as well quote 



> In a few days


----------



## mcease022

roger-roger said:


> I may as well quote



Awesome! I'm excited for this!! :twothumbs


----------



## markr6

zebralight.com.......F5.......F5.......F5


----------



## insanefred

markr6 said:


> zebralight.com.......F5.......F5.......F5




STOP,you'regonnacrashtheirsiteandruinitforallofus!!!!!!!!MyspacebarbuttonjuststoppedworkingWTFLOL!!:sigh:


----------



## Random Dan

insanefred said:


> STOP,you'regonnacrashtheirsiteandruinitforallofus!!!!!!!!MyspacebarbuttonjuststoppedworkingWTFLOL!!:sigh:


I've had that happen a few times. Usually clicking on "go advanced" fixes the issue.


----------



## noboneshotdog

It looks like ZL is going to use the very last day of October to meet thier October release deadline of the SC and MKlV lights. :thinking:


----------



## vadimax

Well, an unpleasant incident with my SC600w HI has happened: it managed to switch on in my pocket. Have no idea how the button got depressed, but I noticed it is running high when the pocket got warm. The light was damn hot and battery depleted to 3.131V.

Nothing was damaged in the process, but kind of discouraging


----------



## eh4

vadimax said:


> Well, an unpleasant incident with my SC600w HI has happened: it managed to switch on in my pocket. Have no idea how the button got depressed, but I noticed it is running high when the pocket got warm. The light was damn hot and battery depleted to 3.131V.
> 
> Nothing was damaged in the process, but kind of discouraging



Zebralight rocks. I actually had my first failure after 3+ years and 6 lights, my newest light failed, something like this probably, it was hot in my pocket, wouldn't turn on, figured I'd run out the battery. Fresh battery no good, works in other nearly identical ZL H600 light. Sent it in for warranty with a pocket clip heat shrink tubed on and received back in the mail the same light with clip and tubing, repaired and in perfect working order. 
But turning on to high in the pocket is not good, that's for sure, it doesn't happen very often now that I've trained myself to be aware of the button, and the heat generally gives it away pretty quickly.
- you can always lock it out at the battery cap, but who does that when it's in their pocket? Maybe people smarter than me, I just treat it like its loaded and check it when in doubt.
I asked for but didn't receive an assessment of what went wrong, I'll just assume that the thermal protection failed on my unit, it seems to ramp down and work fine now, as do the others.


----------



## Derek Dean

vadimax, I wouldn't let that discourage you. I've had my SC600 turn on in my pocket a few times over the years. Hey, it's pretty big light to be carrying in a pocket, and it's simply bound to happen occasionally. It certainly will let you know when it's on :devil:, but like you, I've never had anything serious happen, just a hot pocket, which to be honest, I usually find kind of funny. 

I feel Zebralight has done an excellent job of finding that sweet spot having the switch recessed enough to not come on under most conditions, and yet still be fairly easy to activate when needed quickly. 

Unless you find it happening often, I wouldn't worry about it.


----------



## eh4

sc00ts19 said:


> It absolutely will. That’s how I have mine set up, single click to low. Something I dislike about the old ui is the high flash while double clicking to medium. This can be removed by setting the double click as your high settings. Really, the old ui is very good, and many like it as is. The new ui solves a lot of issues many people had by making it fully customizable. I think it was an excellent and intelligent compromise on ZL’s part.



That sounds really neat. 
I'm only up to Mk II lights, looking forward to Mk III, just as soon as they're old hat and all ironed out.


----------



## terjee

I’ll often drop mine in a Manker holster, button facing inward, and/or do tailcap lockout, depending.


----------



## markr6

I noticed they "cleaned up" the landing page...only a few flashlights displayed. Of course you can see them all by clicking the menu. But that tells me we're getting close!


----------



## Connor

vadimax said:


> Well, an unpleasant incident with my SC600w HI has happened: it managed to switch on in my pocket. Have no idea how the button got depressed, but I noticed it is running high when the pocket got warm. The light was damn hot and battery depleted to 3.131V.



That's actually the main reason why I didn't buy an Emisar D4: if this thing turns on in your pocket on turbo it has the potential to be a lot more than just "unpleasant". Since the button is not recessed at all it's bound to happen.


----------



## Tachead

Connor said:


> That's actually the main reason why I didn't buy an Emisar D4: if this thing turns on in your pocket on turbo it has the potential to be a lot more than just "unpleasant". Since the button is not recessed at all it's bound to happen.



The D4 has both the ability to tail cap lockout as well as an electronic lockout though so, it won't happen if proper caution is used. With any high power light like these, caution should always be taken.


----------



## anthon87

markr6 said:


> I noticed they "cleaned up" the landing page...only a few flashlights displayed. Of course you can see them all by clicking the menu. But that tells me we're getting close!



in the reseller page they have all the new models listed, can't wait!!


----------



## Connor

Yeah, I know .. but you know how it is, you don't always remember things like these, e.g. when you're distracted .. back in the pocket it goes without lockout enabled. 
Which makes the D4 kind of unsuitable as an EDC light (for me at least). Not dissing the D4 in general, though - it's a very nice flashlight, it just needs continual attention if you don't want a hot surprise in your pants to be happening. ;-)


----------



## markr6

MARK IV - THEY'RE UP FOR SALE!!!

SC600w IV HI ordered...contemplating the SC64

Nov 30 ship


----------



## Tachead

SC600w MK IV Plus and SC64c pre-ordered. These will be my first ZL flashlights.


----------



## Tachead

markr6 said:


> MARK IV - THEY'RE UP FOR SALE!!!
> 
> SC600w IV HI ordered...contemplating the SC64
> 
> Nov 30 ship



I thought you said the new UI wasn't enough of a reason to spend $100 Mark lol? You ZL junkie you


----------



## markr6

Tachead said:


> I though you said the new UI wasn't enough of a reason to spend $100 Mark lol? You ZL junkie you



If I did, I don't remember 

On the SC600 *HI**, *the spacing from medium to high (even highest medium to lowest high) is horrible. At least the way I have, and want, it set. So the new UI is key. I want to close that gap a little and still have access to the higher modes, since that's all I use this light for. It will be perfect as long as I win that tint lottery.


----------



## Cobraman502

Just ordered SC64C!!!! High CRI baby! 900 lumens


----------



## Cobraman502

Tachead said:


> SC600w MK IV Plus and SC64c pre-ordered. These will be my first ZL flashlights.



You convinced me to go with the sc64C rather than the w.


----------



## Connor

Did you guys notice there's a new 
SC600F Mk IV Plus 18650 XHP50 Floody Cool White Flashlight
and 
SC600Fd Mk IV Plus 18650 XHP50 Floody 5000K High CRI Flashlight?

Those haven't been mentioned anywhere before. 

I'm gonna have to choose between the SC64c and the SC600Fd Mk IV Plus ... damn, that's hard.


----------



## Tachead

markr6 said:


> If I did, I don't remember
> 
> On the SC600 *HI**, *the spacing from medium to high (even highest medium to lowest high) is horrible. At least the way I have, and want, it set. So the new UI is key. I want to close that gap a little and still have access to the higher modes, since that's all I use this light for. It will be perfect as long as I win that tint lottery.



Yeah, the ability to fully pick your output levels on the new UI is nice. I too hope to win the tint lottery as it costs me more to send them back here in Canada then it does for you guys in the US.

I almost got the HI too but, decided to go with the Plus. I generally prefer more floody lights and liked the higher output if needed. I figured if I need throw I have other much more capable options. Hope I made the right decision:thinking:.


----------



## benhar

So on the SC600w does the HI mean High CRI or is it just referring to the hotspot? Was about to jump when I hesitated on which neutral to get.


----------



## Cobraman502

benhar said:


> So on the SC600w does the HI mean High CRI or is it just referring to the hotspot? Was about to jump when I hesitated on which neutral to get.



Just hotspot. It’s domeless led


----------



## Tachead

Cobraman502 said:


> You convinced me to go with the sc64C rather than the w.



I hope you(we) like it. The good thing is if you don't like it you can always send it back and get the "w" instead for just the cost of a bit of postage. I have a few other 4000K lights and it has become my favorite CCT for any night time or outdoor use. Go much cooler and it is just harsh when you have been sitting in average 2700-3000K household light, outside in the 4000K moonlight, or around a campfire. I don't like feeling like I just stepped into a hospital and cool light can affect your sleep patterns too. During the day, for supplemental light, I prefer 4500-5000K but, still don't mind 4000K..


----------



## Tachead

Connor said:


> Did you guys notice there's a new
> SC600F Mk IV Plus 18650 XHP50 Floody Cool White Flashlight
> and
> SC600Fd Mk IV Plus 18650 XHP50 Floody 5000K High CRI Flashlight?
> 
> Those haven't been mentioned anywhere before.
> 
> *I'm gonna have to choose between the SC64c and the SC600Fd Mk IV Plus ... damn, that's hard. *



Just do what I did and get both:devil:. I got the regular Plus though instead of the floody.


----------



## Cobraman502

Tachead said:


> I hope you(we) like it. The good thing is if you don't like it you can always send it back and get the "w" instead for just the cost of a bit of postage. I have a few other 4000K lights and it has become my favorite CCT for any night time or outdoor use. Go much cooler and it is just harsh when you have been sitting in average 2700-3000K household light, outside in the 4000K moonlight, or around a campfire. I don't like feeling like I just stepped into a hospital and cool light can affect your sleep patterns too.



Exactly and I think that the 900 lumens is plenty for EDC use. I use the SC52w for a while and that has a max 500 lumen blast. So now stepping into a high cri light with a lot more battery will be perfect. I will be getting a new pocket clip for the SC64C from popsclips on Etsy. He sells deep carry titanium in various finishes. 

SC52W


----------



## moozooh

Some news.

1. All of ZL's 4th gen 18650 lights (including headlamps) are now on the site and available for (pre-)order except for the 2440lm cool white SC600 IV Plus.
2. The 4th gen includes a total of 10 side-clicky lights (quite an absurd amount—that's more than their AA/CR123 lights have in total) and 10 headlamps.
3. All of the 3rd gen 18650 lights have been retired.

Also, this is merely speculation, but it appears that ZL is phasing out CR123 SC-series lights. Considering the power and success of their recent AA lights this is not surprising. CR123 headlamps will probably hold on for a bit longer considering the (marginally) smaller size.

And another small tidbit is that H604, H604c, and H604d, as well as H600F, H600Fc, and H600Fd have the same max output. I'm not sure whether this is a mistake, but it does seem very odd considering the c/d lights have a different family LED in them (XHP50.2, as opposed to XHP35 in CW lights).


----------



## terjee

I couldn’t resist, so ordered an SC64c as well. For me, the c vs w is simple:
- w has more lumens, which I don’t need.
- c is high CRI, which I really want
- c is 4000k, which I also really want
- w is 5-step
- c is 2-step

At this rate, it wouldn’t surprise me if I end up with a full set of the c-lights. Not sure I’d need the full set of headlamps though.


----------



## terjee

moozooh said:


> Also, this is merely speculation, but it appears that ZL is phasing out CR123 SC-series lights. Considering the power and success of their recent AA lights this is not surprising. CR123 headlamps will probably hold on for a bit longer considering the (marginally) smaller size.



If they made an SC32c, I’d probably buy it. 

To be honest though, it’d probably be risky on their part, and L91 AA offers a lot of what’s good about the CR123A, even improves some.


----------



## markr6

Now it's time to hurry up and wait for a month. Brutal!!


----------



## TCY

Paid for the H600Fc & EMS. I was told that the high CRI flavours wouldn't be available for another few months, what a pleasant surprise. The annual ZL waiting game begins.


----------



## fneuf

I'm not familiar with the Zebra waiting game. How does it turn for reviews? Will some selected reviewers be able to put their hands on some early products? Or do we usually have to wait another few weeks after initial shipments to get reviews?


----------



## TCY

fneuf said:


> I'm not familiar with the Zebra waiting game. How does it turn for reviews? Will some selected reviewers be able to put their hands on some early products? Or do we usually have to wait another few weeks after initial shipments to get reviews?



Zebralight rarely hands out review samples to reviewers (selfbuilt gets them a lot because he is awesome) and they certainly don't hand out review samples before fulfilling a big bunch of pre-orders, so we rely on those who get the light first to provide valuable information.


----------



## 18650

Tachead said:


> The D4 has both the ability to tail cap lockout as well as an electronic lockout though so, it won't happen if proper caution is used. With any high power light like these, caution should always be taken.


 I would never depend on tail cap lockout as caps always have a way for loosening or tightening up on their own if in a pocket. At the same time the electronic lockout would make it way too annoying for EDC use.


----------



## Tachead

18650 said:


> I would never depend on tail cap lockout as caps always have a way for loosening or tightening up on their own if in a pocket. At the same time the electronic lockout would make it way too annoying for EDC use.


I have never had a light turn on after locking the tail out myself but, I rarely lock them out unless I'm putting them in a backpack or something. And, I am not a huge fan of electronic lockouts either but, I would use one of these methods as apposed to not enjoying a good light because I am scared of an accidental activation. Either that or man up and just accept the chance of a slight leg burn. I generally choose the latter.


----------



## ven

Depending on the light, undoing the tail cap a few MM to break contact ,keeps the tail cap on the O ring/s. By this ,there is still resistance(compared to being undone a few threads anyway). Never had a tail cap budge from being undone, not to power up or actually physically come off. That would take several full rotations which although not impossible, very unlikely. When locking in, there is a noticeable amount of resistance you would expect from sealing with an O ring. IMO it’s still the best method for locking a light out, personally prefer it to elec lock outs.

Touch wood, but not had any issue so far with my ZLs for accidental activation. Yes pocket carry, but what pocket a light is carried in,stays just for that light. Certainly no keys or coins get mixed in with an edc light(or any for that matter other than key chain lights).


----------



## moozooh

In my opinion, an EDC—as opposed to specialist or heavy-duty tools—should be convenient first and everything else second. If, as the name implies, it's expected to be _carried every day_, then being optimized for that purpose should be a given. So if a light forces you to jump through hoops just to avoid a dangerous accident, it's probably a poor fit for an EDC.

That being said, having 1st and 2nd gen SC600s, I've never had either of them turn on in a pocket. That _could_ be because I never put it in the same pocket with objects small or sharply angled enough to depress the button—not because I'm that safety-minded, but rather because I don't like it when something gets tangled in the clip or the lanyard (mine is a loop), or when the light itself makes it hard to take out whatever else it is there.


----------



## vadimax

ven said:


> Depending on the light, undoing the tail cap a few MM to break contact ,keeps the tail cap on the O ring/s. By this ,there is still resistance(compared to being undone a few threads anyway). Never had a tail cap budge from being undone, not to power up or actually physically come off. That would take several full rotations which although not impossible, very unlikely. When locking in, there is a noticeable amount of resistance you would expect from sealing with an O ring. IMO it’s still the best method for locking a light out, personally prefer it to elec lock outs.
> 
> Touch wood, but not had any issue so far with my ZLs for accidental activation. Yes pocket carry, but what pocket a light is carried in,stays just for that light. Certainly no keys or coins get mixed in with an edc light(or any for that matter other than key chain lights).



Mine lives in a pocket alone. Something from the outside has managed to “penetrate” the leather coat and make a direct “hit” on the switch. Probability is miniscule, yet it has happened :shrug:


----------



## gk1610

I made leather holsters for zl h603 lens avoid a keys or anything, I think you can do the same thing.


----------



## Tachead

moozooh said:


> In my opinion, an EDC—as opposed to specialist or heavy-duty tools—should be convenient first and everything else second. If, as the name implies, it's expected to be _carried every day_, then being optimized for that purpose should be a given. *So if a light forces you to jump through hoops just to avoid a dangerous accident, it's probably a poor fit for an EDC.
> *
> That being said, having 1st and 2nd gen SC600s, I've never had either of them turn on in a pocket. That _could_ be because I never put it in the same pocket with objects small or sharply angled enough to depress the button—not because I'm that safety-minded, but rather because I don't like it when something gets tangled in the clip or the lanyard (mine is a loop), or when the light itself makes it hard to take out whatever else it is there.



A dangerous accident? They are flashlights, not handguns man. The worst case scenario with a light with thermal management in your pocket is a slight burn or maybe a damaged pocket lining and you will likely notice, pull it out, and turn it off before that even happens. Now, if placing a high output light in a bag, especially if it will be left unattended, then I would definitely lock it out.


----------



## Tachead

gk1610 said:


> I made leather holsters for zl h603 lens avoid a keys or anything, I think you can do the same thing.



Very nice work sir:thumbsup:


----------



## ven

Like that a lot gk


----------



## Cobraman502

Yeah great job on the holster.


----------



## SubLGT

markr6 said:


> ...It will be perfect as long as I win that tint lottery.



Will there also be a "battery crusher" lottery?


----------



## markr6

SubLGT said:


> Will there also be a "battery crusher" lottery?



I would bet on it. Odds closer to the $1 scratch-off variety.


----------



## vadimax

gk1610 said:


> I made leather holsters for zl h603 lens avoid a keys or anything, I think you can do the same thing.



Well, I’ve got a Maxpedition 4” flashlight sheath. I guess it will settle accidental switch on issue:






BTW, SC600w HI fits it perfectly.


----------



## gk1610

^ thanks, I using sc600w too


----------



## vadimax

SubLGT said:


> Will there also be a "battery crusher" lottery?



The proper answer would be — VTC6


----------



## Tachead

Hey Ven, any chance you could post a size comparison pic of your SC63w and SC53w? Thanks:thumbsup:


----------



## ven

Tachead said:


> Hey Ven, any chance you could post a size comparison pic of your SC63w and SC53w? Thanks:thumbsup:



Here is a pic already taken, if you need any more just shout and will take


----------



## Cobraman502

ven said:


> Here is a pic already taken, if you need any more just shout and will take



Based off the size difference, glad I went with the SC64c. Much better run times with larger cell and almost double the output.


----------



## Tachead

ven said:


> Here is a pic already taken, if you need any more just shout and will take



Thank you sir, I really appreciate it:thumbsup:.

No rush but, if you have a chance could you take one with the 53 right next to the 63 please. Thanks again man.


----------



## Tachead

Cobraman502 said:


> Based off the size difference, glad I went with the SC64c. Much better run times with larger cell and almost double the output.



Yeah, it really doesn't look that much bigger considering it has near 4 times the capacity with the 18650. I am just considering getting the 53c for a new bedside light but, I am not sure if its worth it with my 64c on the way.


----------



## tompen41

vadimax said:


> Well, I’ve got a Maxpedition 4” flashlight sheath. I guess it will settle accidental switch on issue:
> 
> Here is a great holster that fits the SC600s and the SC63s great. https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B072XG92T1/?tag=cpf0b6-20
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BTW, SC600w HI fits it perfectly.


----------



## ven

Tachead said:


> Thank you sir, I really appreciate it:thumbsup:.
> 
> No rush but, if you have a chance could you take one with the 53 right next to the 63 please. Thanks again man.



Here you go





The size difference for me is quite noticeable in hand, already the sc63w feels small but does sit nicely. The sc53w if anything does not sit as nice/comfy/natural in hand, imho the sc63 or sc64 in your case makes more sense. Certainly if there is no need for a smaller/lighter flashlight(bedside duty) and could benefit from being a little larger in size(easier to grab, bigger fuel tank).

The sc63 and sc64 are very very compact as is, unless the buyer is uncomfortable with 18650 chemistry or simply prefer AA form/fuel.....................imo 18650 makes far more sense in several ways. 

Why have i got a couple of AA ZL's? Well good question as i prefer the 18650 fed by a good way. Well in short i saw them for sale, thought i would try them out, the xp-l2 4000k hi cri really tempted me of the sc5c mkII(not to mention the new UI). Then the sc53w again the 4500k xp-l2 pushed me over the edge(new UI again). Then i do like the design of the sc53w over the sc5c as well.................simple as that. Right now, the sc53w is in my coat, the sc5c in my fleece.


----------



## ven

Although not as nice as gk's hand made holster, i have found the leather xeno holster works pretty well. I have a couple, one for my HDS rotary and one for the haiku. As the lights are similar in size(with the sc63w), they do work fine with the sc62d/sc63w
No pic with a ZL but to give an idea










Around $10 or so, Hong Kong equipment(HKe) had them for sale


----------



## gk1610

^ holster so smooth, I like that color holster 
BTW: I consider betwwen sc64c and sc64w, 900 lumen ,93-95cri and 1400 lumen, cri 80+, should I try it ?


----------



## Tixx

terjee said:


> I couldn’t resist, so ordered an SC64c as well. For me, the c vs w is simple:
> - w has more lumens, which I don’t need.
> - c is high CRI, which I really want
> - c is 4000k, which I also really want
> - w is 5-step
> - c is 2-step
> 
> At this rate, it wouldn’t surprise me if I end up with a full set of the c-lights. Not sure I’d need the full set of headlamps though.



Debating this right now myself.


----------



## gunga

ven said:


> Here you go
> 
> The size difference for me is quite noticeable in hand, already the sc63w feels small but does sit nicely. The sc53w if anything does not sit as nice/comfy/natural in hand, imho the sc63 or sc64 in your case makes more sense. Certainly if there is no need for a smaller/lighter flashlight(bedside duty) and could benefit from being a little larger in size(easier to grab, bigger fuel tank).
> 
> The sc63 and sc64 are very very compact as is, unless the buyer is uncomfortable with 18650 chemistry or simply prefer AA form/fuel.....................imo 18650 makes far more sense in several ways.
> 
> Why have i got a couple of AA ZL's? Well good question as i prefer the 18650 fed by a good way. Well in short i saw them for sale, thought i would try them out, the xp-l2 4000k hi cri really tempted me of the sc5c mkII(not to mention the new UI). Then the sc53w again the 4500k xp-l2 pushed me over the edge(new UI again). Then i do like the design of the sc53w over the sc5c as well.................simple as that. Right now, the sc53w is in my coat, the sc5c in my fleece.



Thanks Ven. I'm going to pre order an sc64c, but am happy with my h600fc III, so perhaps am sc53c will make the $15 shipping more palatable. I already have an sc5c II and h53c.


----------



## ven

I do like the sc53w form gunga, but in hand it does feel tiny where as the 18650 just feels more natural for me. I am not a huge fan of AA anyway, so my thoughts are bias some what being honest. The AA ZL's are certainly my fav AA lights i have(maybe 6 or 7 total at a guess). 

If you dont have a 63 gunga, then the 64 should become a fav...........tiny tiny light ...........I am really enjoying the 4500k xhp35 beam, bright, floody and nice CT

Some holster pics with ZL this time




Can sit all the way in and use 2nd stud, but i prefer something to grab for ease of use.








Rear and side, belt loop on back


----------



## Tachead

ven said:


> Here you go
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The size difference for me is quite noticeable in hand, already the sc63w feels small but does sit nicely. The sc53w if anything does not sit as nice/comfy/natural in hand, imho the sc63 or sc64 in your case makes more sense. Certainly if there is no need for a smaller/lighter flashlight(bedside duty) and could benefit from being a little larger in size(easier to grab, bigger fuel tank).
> 
> The sc63 and sc64 are very very compact as is, unless the buyer is uncomfortable with 18650 chemistry or simply prefer AA form/fuel.....................imo 18650 makes far more sense in several ways.
> 
> Why have i got a couple of AA ZL's? Well good question as i prefer the 18650 fed by a good way. Well in short i saw them for sale, thought i would try them out, the xp-l2 4000k hi cri really tempted me of the sc5c mkII(not to mention the new UI). Then the sc53w again the 4500k xp-l2 pushed me over the edge(new UI again). Then i do like the design of the sc53w over the sc5c as well.................simple as that. Right now, the sc53w is in my coat, the sc5c in my fleece.



Thank you sir, both for the pics and the insight[emoji106]. 

I too definitely prefer 18650 fuel. So much so, in fact, that almost all my lights and headlamps are 18650 powered. The exception however, is my bedside table light. Currently(for the last couple of years) I have been using an Astrolux A01 with a Nichia 219B SW40 R9050 in it which is an AAA light. I mainly use it on moonlight mode(sub 1 lumen) with just the occasional burst of medium and high so, it lasts for months on a Eneloop Pro AAA. So, I definitely don't need any more capacity. I am very happy with this light for bedside table use and it has one of the best tints available in my opinion but, one thing bothers me, it doesn't stably tailstand. Other then that it is perfect. This is the reason why I am considering the SC53c but, I already have the SC64c and SC600w MK IV Plus XHP50.2 coming so, I might just wait and see how they are first. Then again, it would be nice to have something to tide me over until they arrive[emoji317].


----------



## Tachead

gunga said:


> Thanks Ven. I'm going to pre order an sc64c, but am happy with my h600fc III, so perhaps am sc53c will make the $15 shipping more palatable. I already have an sc5c II and h53c.



$15? How do you get that option? The cheapest I saw when ordering was $22.95US for EMS.


----------



## terjee

Tachead said:


> $15? How do you get that option? The cheapest I saw when ordering was $22.95US for EMS.



I guess it varies by country?


*Discount(s):*$0.00*Taxes:*$0.00​*Shipping:*$0.00​


----------



## Tachead

terjee said:


> I guess it varies by country?
> 
> 
> *Discount(s):*$0.00*Taxes:*$0.00​*Shipping:*$0.00​



Yes. Gunga and I are from Canada. We don't get the free shipping option anymore. On the plus side, international customers orders generally ship a week before US customers for pre-orders so, we will get our lights first(providing a fast shipping option is chosen of course).


----------



## TCY

Some further intel:
H52/H53's pocket clip is compatible with H600 MKIV headlamp series. 
MKIV housing does not have any visual updates. A few internal modifications, not our concern.
"_A hint of green is possible in a 3-step 5000K "Fd“ light, but very rare in a 3-step 4000K "Fc" light."

_Glad I went for the c flavour.


----------



## markr6

The c was crazy yellow IMO. But I'm crazy enough to give it another try. I'm a big lotto player...it's killing me!


----------



## TCY

The 4000K XP-L2 on my H53Fc is a bit yellowish compared to my 4000K 219C D4vn, but it actually appears to be more natural when it's the only light source around. If my upcoming H600Fc has a tint of similar quality I'd be a happy buyer.


----------



## Connor

Anyone else noticed this?

 SC600 Mk IV Plus  ... and it's gone. Both from the ZL "featured products" website and from the "ZebraLight Product Comparison" Google doc.


----------



## terjee

Could it have been dropped?
Given apparent preference for W and C type lights, I wouldn’t be too surprised I guess.


----------



## gunga

Tachead said:


> Yes. Gunga and I are from Canada. We don't get the free shipping option anymore. On the plus side, international customers orders generally ship a week before US customers for pre-orders so, we will get our lights first(providing a fast shipping option is chosen of course).



Ems is $14.95 for me. 2 lights.


----------



## Tachead

gunga said:


> Ems is $14.95 for me. 2 lights.



How do you get that Gunga? They quote $22.95US EMS to Canada right here at the bottom of the page...

http://www.zebralight.com/Free-Shipping-Worldwide_ep_43-1.html


----------



## Tachead

Connor said:


> Anyone else noticed this?
> 
> SC600 Mk IV Plus  ... and it's gone. Both from the ZL "featured products" website and from the "ZebraLight Product Comparison" Google doc.



I don't think anything has changed Connor. There is still 30 lights on the flashlight page just like I believe there was the morning they opened the pre-orders.


----------



## Connor

Tachead said:


> I don't think anything has changed Connor. There is still 30 lights on the flashlight page just like I believe there was the morning they opened the pre-orders.



There was a SC600 Mk IV Plus (XHP50.2, cold white, 2440 lumens) until recently.


----------



## Tachead

Connor said:


> There was a SC600 Mk IV Plus (XHP50.2, cold white, 2440 lumens) until recently.


I don't recall seeing that model on the fact sheet or the website. I am almost positive there was never more then 30 models on the flashlight page. I think you might be confusing the 2440 lumens for the specs of the 'w' plus on the fact sheet. They changed it to 2300 on the actual model page now though.


----------



## Connor

I'm positive about the removed version, too. 
It even has its own thread over at German TLF http://www.taschenlampen-forum.de/threads/zebralight-sc600-iv-plus.59502/


----------



## Tachead

Connor said:


> I'm positive about the removed version, too.
> It even has its own thread over at German TLF http://www.taschenlampen-forum.de/threads/zebralight-sc600-iv-plus.59502/



Ok, I don't recall seeing it but, then again, I don't usually pay any attention to cool white models these days. Either way, it doesn't appear to exist now so, you are going to have to pick another model. There is a CW version of the floody plus...


----------



## Connor

Nonono ... absolutely *no *CW flashlights for me anymore. :green: If it's not high CRI, it's not a flashlight for me. 
I was just wondering why it disappeard from the ZL website.


----------



## Tachead

Connor said:


> Nonono ... absolutely *no *CW flashlights for me anymore. :green: If it's not high CRI, it's not a flashlight for me.
> I was just wondering why it disappeard from the ZL website.



Oh, ok. I had to bite my tongue to not ask you why you would want 70 CRI CW anyway lol. I chalked it up to there is the odd person who still likes low CRI CW for some reason. To each their own right.

I am guessing it disappeared due to bad tint variation(not being an easywhite) and lack of interest. But, that's just a guess.


----------



## Tachead

You might have to go for the new Fd Plus then if you want something cooler that is still high CRI.


----------



## Connor

Tachead said:


> You might have to go for the new Fd Plus then if you want something cooler that is still high CRI.



I _will _order the FD Plus. ;-) IMHO the other 2 new Mk IV Plus lights are kind of redundant anyway, yes, they're a little bit brighter ... but they're missing 91+ CRI. Makes all the difference, esp. in a flooder.


----------



## Tachead

Connor said:


> I _will _order the FD Plus. ;-) IMHO the other 2 new Mk IV Plus lights are kind of redundant anyway, yes, they're a little bit brighter ... but they're missing 91+ CRI. Makes all the difference, esp. in a flooder.



Remember CRI isn't everything though and it doesn't seem to make a huge difference in actual use once you are up over 80+ CRI with Cree's anyway by many accounts. I think CCT, Tint, and beam style are more important to me personally when all these new lights are already over 80+ CRI. But, at the same time, given the choice I would always take the highest CRI I can get if all else were equal. 

I went with the SC600w MKIV Plus because I prefer a clear lens on a light like this. I will use my H600Fc or d MKIII if I need the extreme floodiness that a frosted lens provides. The extra 500 lumens and better chances at the tint lottery are bonuses too.


----------



## Random Dan

Tachead said:


> Remember CRI isn't everything though and it doesn't seem to make a huge difference in actual use once you are up over 80+ CRI with Cree's anyway by many accounts. I think CCT, Tint, and beam style are more important to me personally when all these new lights are already over 80+ CRI. But, at the same time, given the choice I would always take the highest CRI I can get if all else were equal.
> 
> I went with the SC600w MKIV Plus because I prefer a clear lens on a light like this. I will use my H600Fc or d MKIII if I need the extreme floodiness that a frosted lens provides. The extra 500 lumens and better chances at the tint lottery are bonuses too.


I agree. CCT and tint are much easier to see than CRI. I can't tell that my 83-85 CRI XM-L2 easywhite renders colors any different than my 92+ CRI Nichias.


----------



## gunga

Tachead said:


> How do you get that Gunga? They quote $22.95US EMS to Canada right here at the bottom of the page...
> 
> http://www.zebralight.com/Free-Shipping-Worldwide_ep_43-1.html



I put 2 lights in my cart. I check out and it's $15.


----------



## Tachead

gunga said:


> I put 2 lights in my cart. I check out and it's $15.


But, what about the check box for what shipping method you want? Did you pick EMS or leave it blank?


----------



## gunga

I checked the ems option. It cost me $15. All your questions got me to pre-order.


----------



## Tachead

gunga said:


> I checked the ems option. It cost me $15. All your questions got me to pre-order.


Lol nice. I have my order in too. It went in about 10min after the pre-order opened☺️. I'm looking forward to trying my first ZL flashlights.


----------



## twistedraven

I await to see tint deviation between hotspot, corona, and spill on MK4 plus before I even consider replacing my MK3 HI with it. What's cool about the MK4 plus isn't its 2300 lumen output (really 2300 lumen doesn't appear much brighter than 1300 lumens), but its non-pid 700 lumen output. I wonder how long it can sustain that with full regulation on a fresh 18650 cell. No doubt the XHP50.2 is more efficient than an XHP35.


----------



## Derek Dean

Tachead said:


> Lol nice. I have my order in too. It went in about 10min after the pre-order opened☺️. I'm looking forward to trying my first ZL flashlights.


Your first Zebralights? Man, you're in for a real treat. I will say though, the UI can take a bit of patience to figure out, I mean, you can read about it all day long, but once you start clicking, it can seem confusing at first, so my recommendation would be to stay in the pre programmed mode for a while to simply get used to that, before even attempting to use the fully programmable modes. 

Personally, I probably won't even be using those fully programmable modes as I've always found Zebralight's choices to be spot on for my purposes.


----------



## terjee

Derek Dean said:


> I will say though, the UI can take a bit of patience to figure out, I mean, you can read about it all day long, but once you start clicking, it can seem confusing at first, so my recommendation would be to stay in the pre programmed mode for a while to simply get used to that, before even attempting to use the fully programmable modes.
> 
> Personally, I probably won't even be using those fully programmable modes as I've always found Zebralight's choices to be spot on for my purposes.



I think this is pretty good advice.

I do appreciate having the options of the new UI available, but so far I’m thinking I’d like to stay within the normal setup. There’s something nice about knowing what to expect from the different clicks and holds, no matter which zebra I pick up. Shifting down H1 could be worth considering, but I think I’d like to keep my highs, mids and lows where they are.


----------



## gk1610

the multi UI so good, h1, h2, m1,m2, l1,l2 may come to change, It awesome


----------



## anthon87

terjee said:


> I think this is pretty good advice.
> 
> I do appreciate having the options of the new UI available, but so far I’m thinking I’d like to stay within the normal setup. There’s something nice about knowing what to expect from the different clicks and holds, no matter which zebra I pick up. Shifting down H1 could be worth considering, but I think I’d like to keep my highs, mids and lows where they are.



One of the best changes of the new UI is that now the M1 mode is fixed at around 130lm instead of 60lm. 

Personally I'm very happy with only that change and I don't think I'll ever use G6 and G7, mode spacing is now perfect from stock (that old 61lm M1 was a deal breaker to me)


----------



## Tachead

Derek Dean said:


> Your first Zebralights? Man, you're in for a real treat. I will say though, the UI can take a bit of patience to figure out, I mean, you can read about it all day long, but once you start clicking, it can seem confusing at first, so my recommendation would be to stay in the pre programmed mode for a while to simply get used to that, before even attempting to use the fully programmable modes.
> 
> Personally, I probably won't even be using those fully programmable modes as I've always found Zebralight's choices to be spot on for my purposes.



These are just my first ZL flashlights, I have a couple of their headlamps and have followed their products for years. I was just waiting for the right flashlight model to come out. I like their UI for the most part too but, have always disliked the pre-flash to medium and the fact that it's easy to high flash yourself if you don't get the timing right going to moonlight. So, for me, the new UI is a big improvement. I look forward to trying it out.


----------



## Tachead

twistedraven said:


> I await to see tint deviation between hotspot, corona, and spill on MK4 plus before I even consider replacing my MK3 HI with it. What's cool about the MK4 plus isn't its 2300 lumen output (really 2300 lumen doesn't appear much brighter than 1300 lumens), but its non-pid 700 lumen output. I wonder how long it can sustain that with full regulation on a fresh 18650 cell. No doubt the XHP50.2 is more efficient than an XHP35.



I have come to realize that although a perfect tint and low tint deviation are traits I still prefer and shoot for, it doesn't really matter much in real world use. If you just enjoy using your lights for what they were intended for, instead of sitting in your house shinning them at a white wall, you will stress yourself out a lot less. It's not worth missing out on good models just because the tint or tint deviation isn't 100% perfect imo. Plus, when it comes to high output Cree emitters, you will have trouble finding any lights that are perfect for you if you are too picky. I would stick to Nichia if you don't like tint deviation and some of their latest emitters don't have perfect tints either even if they do have little tint deviation. 

The HI and Plus are different lights that are intended for different purposes imo. So, I don't know if I would ever look at the Plus as a replacement for the HI. The Plus will likely be far more floody and have a much larger hotspot. 

The Plus will still be a lot brighter. Even with our non-linear perception of brightness, it will appear close to 25% brighter which is a significant increase. 

The highest non-PID mode is actually 358 lumens. I believe them leaving the PID in brackets on the 705 lumen mode out is a typo. It says below that the "three highest output levels" are PID thermal regulated.


----------



## markr6

Tachead said:


> I have come to realize that although a perfect tint and low tint deviation are traits I still prefer and shoot for, it doesn't really matter much in real world use.



I really tried to make this work, but I can't. I'm reminded every time I use one of my least-favorite tinted lights, like last night. I was doing some work in my basement and using one of my zebralights with a yellowish tint was just a real downer. Usually when I have to do something I don't want to, but get to use a nice flashlight, at least it makes it a little more enjoyable. Of course it did the job just fine, but any light would. I want to to settle.

Shining it on a wall beforehand is simply a benchmark to know what you'll be using and experiencing for the rest of the light's lifetime.

Tuning your car to do 0-60 in 5 seconds is a hell of a lot of fun, but not something that really matters in the real world driving to work and getting groceries every day.


----------



## twistedraven

Tachead;5149414
The highest non-PID mode is actually 358 lumens. I believe them leaving the PID in brackets on the 705 lumen mode out is a typo. It says below that the "three highest output levels" are PID thermal regulated.[/QUOTE said:


> If that's true it would be a real downer.
> 
> Yes in general I like throwers, and if I want flood I go with pure flood aka something with frosty lens. 2300 lumens (especially if it's floodier) than 1300 doesn't look too much brighter to me. Only when I use my L6vn which is 6500 lumens do I finally think "Hey! This thing is 2-3 times brighter!" Because it's a large output increase and a large throw increase.
> 
> It's true that real world use mitigates tint differences in the beam, but I still tend to notice it and it still affects me. The zero tint deviation in the beam of the MK3 HI, plus it's decently throwy, which is why it's overall my favorite light.


----------



## Tachead

twistedraven said:


> If that's true it would be a real downer.
> 
> Yes in general I like throwers, and if I want flood I go with pure flood aka something with frosty lens. 2300 lumens (especially if it's floodier) than 1300 doesn't look too much brighter to me. Only when I use my L6vn which is 6500 lumens do I finally think "Hey! This thing is 2-3 times brighter!" Because it's a large output increase and a large throw increase.
> 
> It's true that real world use mitigates tint differences in the beam, but I still tend to notice it and it still affects me. The zero tint deviation in the beam of the MK3 HI, plus it's decently throwy, which is why it's overall my favorite light.



I guess we could email ZL and confirm. Either way, with the new higher efficiency components ZL is using, the higher efficiency of the XHP50.2, and the clear lens, the Plus should be able to hold the highest output of any ZL yet. 

Yeah, beam pattern definitely affects perceived brightness. I definitely think the Plus will seem brighter then the HI though as it will likely have a much brighter spill even if it lacks the tight hotspot. It's added output will likely make up for some of the throw too although it will still likely fall short in the throw department. 

In an ideal world all my lights would have a tint right on the BBL with zero tint deviation from hotspot to spill but, unfortunately lights like that are few and far between now a days(especially single emitter high output reflector based ones). So, for now, I try my hand at the tint lottery and save my smaller Nichia lights for the white wall. Hopefully one day LED tech will give us what we want. At least we are seeing improvements in CRI and output though.


----------



## Tachead

markr6 said:


> I really tried to make this work, but I can't. I'm reminded every time I use one of my least-favorite tinted lights, like last night. I was doing some work in my basement and using one of my zebralights with a yellowish tint was just a real downer. Usually when I have to do something I don't want to, but get to use a nice flashlight, at least it makes it a little more enjoyable. Of course it did the job just fine, but any light would. I want to to settle.
> 
> Shining it on a wall beforehand is simply a benchmark to know what you'll be using and experiencing for the rest of the light's lifetime.
> 
> Tuning your car to do 0-60 in 5 seconds is a hell of a lot of fun, but not something that really matters in the real world driving to work and getting groceries every day.



I know, I get a bit OCD about tints too but, it really can be a bit of a lost cause now a days when it comes to Cree and you can sure burn through a lot of money in your search(how many ZL's have you bought in the last few years Mark). Just checking Cree's Spec sheets can tell a lot and I often know what lights to avoid before I even have to try them(the old Fd Plus is a perfect example). But, then there is always still the lottery too. Sticking to higher CCT's(5000-5500K nominal) can help avoid yellow too(if you don't like yellow). 3500-4500K nominal are always going to be differing degrees of yellow even when right on the BBL. I also suggest you stick with lights that use the Nichia 219B if you want perfect tints. Or, if you want to go with Cree and ZL still I recommend the "d" models using the XM-L2 Easywhite and frosted lenses as they are 5000K nominal, have very clean tints, and have little to no tint lottery it seems. Time will tell, maybe the new "d" models will be good too. 

Oh, life is rough for us tint snobs:mecry:. These are serious first world problems.


----------



## Tixx

anthon87 said:


> One of the best changes of the new UI is that now the M1 mode is fixed at around 130lm instead of 60lm.
> 
> Personally I'm very happy with only that change and I don't think I'll ever use G6 and G7, mode spacing is now perfect from stock (that old 61lm M1 was a deal breaker to me)



I use the new configurations to do the following

Single click - Moonlight modes
Press and hold - High modes
Double click - Medium modes

Solves 2 issues:
This way I don't have to time the press and hold to get to moonlight, it is always a click away

Then I don't have the high pre-flash getting to medium, I only have a moonlight flash which goes unnoticed.


----------



## moozooh

twistedraven said:


> What's cool about the MK4 plus isn't its 2300 lumen output (really 2300 lumen doesn't appear much brighter than 1300 lumens), but its non-pid 700 lumen output. I wonder how long it can sustain that with full regulation on a fresh 18650 cell.


The 705lm mode is PID-controlled as well, but assuming no temperature downscaling the runtime should be around 2.7–2.9 hours on a 3500mAh cell.


----------



## iamlucky13

twistedraven said:


> Tachead said:
> 
> 
> 
> The highest non-PID mode is actually 358 lumens. I believe them leaving the PID in brackets on the 705 lumen mode out is a typo. It says below that the "three highest output levels" are PID thermal regulated.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If that's true it would be a real downer.
Click to expand...


The listing page now says 705 lumen mode is PID. It would have been a good assumption anyways based on the observation that lights that size don't seem to be able to continuously dissipate the heat of more than about 400 lumens of output.

One of the people involved in designing the thermal control of the Emisar D4, which is about the same size as the SC600 was very open in discussing and sharing the results of her development work, so there's some good data available about that light. Depending on ambient conditions and the maximum heat setting, it looks to me like it usually settles down in the 400-600 lumen range.


----------



## gunga

Tixx said:


> I use the new configurations to do the following
> 
> Single click - Moonlight modes
> Press and hold - High modes
> Double click - Medium modes
> 
> Solves 2 issues:
> This way I don't have to time the press and hold to get to moonlight, it is always a click away
> 
> Then I don't have the high pre-flash getting to medium, I only have a moonlight flash which goes unnoticed.



It works in theory but I get a preflash on moonlight modes when programmed like this.


----------



## Tachead

iamlucky13 said:


> The listing page now says 705 lumen mode is PID. It would have been a good assumption anyways based on the observation that lights that size don't seem to be able to continuously dissipate the heat of more than about 400 lumens of output.
> 
> One of the people involved in designing the thermal control of the Emisar D4, which is about the same size as the SC600 was very open in discussing and sharing the results of her development work, so there's some good data available about that light. Depending on ambient conditions and the maximum heat setting, it looks to me like it usually settles down in the 400-600 lumen range.



I am aware of Toykeeper's work. The D4 is a lot different light though(quad with comparatively inefficient driver) so, I don't know how much it really applies here. 

You are right though, small lights can only dissipate so much heat and 300-500 lumens seems to be about the range for lights this size(depending on conditions of coarse). It still depends a lot on design however so, every light will be different. Various things affect a lights thermal efficiency including the emitter used(and number of emitters), driver design and components, driver/emitter MCPCB to body thermal transfer efficiency, lens transmission specs, body weight and construction, cell resistance, etc. 

I don't know how practical having much higher outputs would be anyway, on lights like these, even if the heat wasn't an issue. A single 18650 can only handle so much and personally having a crazy powerful light that sucks the cell dry in 15 minutes and sheds the cycle life of the cell doing it is not what I am after. If I want more sustained output, I will go for a larger light with a higher cell capacity.


----------



## Tachead

gunga said:


> It works in theory but I get a preflash on moonlight modes when programmed like this.



What about when you set it up this way...



snowlover91 said:


> Here is how I set mine up, you may want to try it as it works great for me.
> 
> Single click - I programmed my low settings of choice here, a 3 lumen and around .28 lumen setting.
> Double click - This is my high mode, when I double click from off you don't get a weird preflash you can see since the single click is low. Works out great.
> Press/hold - This is my medium setting, I put my most used level here which is 79 lumens. If I need more light I just hold a bit longer and get the high. The only thing you'll notice with the press/hold setup like this is it'll very briefly start at the L1 level and then kick up to your medium setting.
> 
> The reason this setup works so well is I have instant click to low, if I need more than that I just press/hold and it cycles to M then H. From off if I need medium it's quickly accessible with the press and hold and if I want high from off it will just take two quick clicks. This seems to be the best setup for how I use my light, since I use the 79 lumen and moonlight modes the most. Maybe try setting this on your G6 or G7 and see how you like it? Hope this helps



Do you still get a preflash in moonlight?


----------



## twistedraven

Well I was hoping with the more efficient emitter and/or driver, there would be more energy passed out the front of the host as light, and less energy wasted as heat. Looks like we're not quite there yet. On the other hand, the 350-400 lumen output might see an increase in runtime over previous zebralights. Maybe it will reach up to 5 hours now, which would be pretty damned good for a flat regulated runtime on 1 cell.

I too don't like the idea of short bursts of high output when a cell and/or host can't handle it, and as a result it gets regulated down really fast.


----------



## Derek Dean

twistedraven said:


> If that's true it would be a real downer.
> 
> It's true that real world use mitigates tint differences in the beam, but I still tend to notice it and it still affects me. The zero tint deviation in the beam of the MK3 HI, plus it's decently throwy, which is why it's overall my favorite light.


Yep, they've actually corrected that on their webstie to show the 705 lumen level having PID. Do remember that you can adjust the temperature activation point of the PID control up/down by 5 degrees..... so you do have some leeway. 

As far as tint goes, it's incredibly simple to color correct the tint of your lights. I honestly can't understand why more folks don't do it. The movie and photo industries have been doing this since color film was invented. Of course, depending on how much filtration you add, it will lessen the output a bit, but with these new generation high powered lights, and the adjustable UI, I can't think of one reason not to use a filter on the front to color correct a light. Heck, I've got several Nichia 219 lights, and I've even filtered those, only lightly, but still, and now all my lights are just the way I like them, not a squeaker in the bunch.


----------



## twistedraven

I've done the pink highlighter trick on my H600fd, and it works wonders. Plan on using filters for the H600fc once I get it. For lights with tint shift within the beam though, the filters don't solve the shift problem.


----------



## sc00ts19

Tachead said:


> What about when you set it up this way...
> 
> 
> 
> Do you still get a preflash in moonlight?



I have mine configured the same way and there is no preflash going into any mode. The first output you see is the moonlight, then either medium or high.


----------



## Hugh Johnson

Tixx said:


> I use the new configurations to do the following
> 
> Single click - Moonlight modes
> Press and hold - High modes
> Double click - Medium modes
> 
> Solves 2 issues:
> This way I don't have to time the press and hold to get to moonlight, it is always a click away
> 
> Then I don't have the high pre-flash getting to medium, I only have a moonlight flash which goes unnoticed.



That sounds perfect.


----------



## snowlover91

Tachead said:


> What about when you set it up this way... Do you still get a preflash in moonlight?





snowlover91 said:


> _Here is how I set mine up, you may want to try it as it works great for me. _
> 
> _Single click - I programmed my low settings of choice here, a 3 lumen and around .28 lumen setting. _
> _Double click - This is my high mode, when I double click from off you don't get a weird preflash you can see since the single click is low. Works out great. _
> _Press/hold - This is my medium setting, I put my most used level here which is 79 lumens. If I need more light I just hold a bit longer and get the high. The only thing you'll notice with the press/hold setup like this is it'll very briefly start at the L1 level and then kick up to your medium setting. _
> 
> _The reason this setup works so well is I have instant click to low, if I need more than that I just press/hold and it cycles to M then H. From off if I need medium it's quickly accessible with the press and hold and if I want high from off it will just take two quick clicks. This seems to be the best setup for how I use my light, since I use the 79 lumen and moonlight modes the most. Maybe try setting this on your G6 or G7 and see how you like it? Hope this help._



I still use this setup on my SC5 MK2 and it works great. It avoids any noticeable flashes of light since the quick click is set for the moonlight modes. I think it’s the only way to set up the new UI and avoid it but it is also much better than the default UI as well. I’m glad ZL finally went with customizable drivers so we can have choices


----------



## Tachead

snowlover91 said:


> I still use this setup on my SC5 MK2 and it works great. It avoids any noticeable flashes of light since the quick click is set for the moonlight modes. I think it’s the only way to set up the new UI and avoid it but it is also much better than the default UI as well. I’m glad ZL finally went with customizable drivers so we can have choices


Good to know. I think I will try this setup when my lights arrive.


----------



## autoxer

snowlover91 said:


> I still use this setup on my SC5 MK2 and it works great. It avoids any noticeable flashes of light since the quick click is set for the moonlight modes. I think it’s the only way to set up the new UI and avoid it but it is also much better than the default UI as well. I’m glad ZL finally went with customizable drivers so we can have choices


I am still using this on my SC5w MK2 (thanks again snowlover91!) as well, and can't imagine it any other way now. The "preflash" is moonlight (or a very low mode) - perfect in my opinion (I would rather have a dim flash transition to a brighter light, rather than vice-versa.)


----------



## scs

twistedraven said:


> Well I was hoping with the more efficient emitter and/or driver, there would be more energy passed out the front of the host as light, and less energy wasted as heat. Looks like we're not quite there yet. On the other hand, the 350-400 lumen output might see an increase in runtime over previous zebralights. Maybe it will reach up to 5 hours now, which would be pretty damned good for a flat regulated runtime on 1 cell.
> 
> I too don't like the idea of short bursts of high output when a cell and/or host can't handle it, and as a result it gets regulated down really fast.



With heat out of the way, I hope ZL can match or surpass the output and runtime performance set by Olight's M2R: 700 lumens for 1:40.


----------



## Tachead

scs said:


> With heat out of the way, I hope ZL can match or surpass the output and runtime performance set by Olight's M2R: 700 lumens for 1:40.



Olight has great drivers too but, the MKIII already pretty much matches the performance of the M2R and is better regulated(more flat) so, the MK IV Plus should easily surpass it with its improved driver and more efficient emitter. The M2R will always have the advantage without cooling however as it has over 2X the heatsink mass and isn't thermally regulated.

Here is a graph of output efficacy comparing the M2R vs the MKIII HI. I assume it is from the same review you got your runtime specs for the M2R from.






Courtesy of maukka.

The M2R NW has a higher efficacy but, remember that the MKIII HI is using the XHP35 HI emitter vs. the XHP35 HD in the M2R. The HI emitters have roughly 15% lower output so, if you take that into account they are almost identical in efficacy.

M2R NW: 111 lm/W
MKIII HI: 96 + 15% = 110.4 lm/W

It should also be pointed out that the MKIII HI is using a much warmer emitter with considerably higher CRI which also lowers output compared to the one the M2R uses. With this taken into account, the MKIII HI's efficacy would go even higher.


----------



## Cobraman502

Tachead said:


> Olight has great drivers too but, the MKIII already pretty much matches the performance of the M2R and is better regulated(more flat) so, the MK IV Plus should easily surpass it with its improved driver and more efficient emitter. The M2R will always have the advantage without cooling however as it has over 2X the heatsink mass and isn't thermally regulated.
> 
> Here is a graph of output efficacy comparing the M2R vs the MKIII HI. I assume it is from the same review you got your runtime specs for the M2R from.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Courtesy of maukka.
> 
> The M2R NW has a higher efficacy but, remember that the MKIII HI is using the XHP35 HI emitter vs. the XHP35 HD in the M2R. The HI emitters have roughly 15% lower output so, if you take that into account they are almost identical in efficacy.
> 
> M2R NW: 111 lm/W
> MKIII HI: 96 + 15% = 110.4 lm/W
> 
> It should also be pointed out that the MKIII HI is using a much warmer emitter with considerably higher CRI which also lowers output compared to the one the M2R uses. With this taken into account, the MKIII HI's efficacy would go even higher.



Great info I was going to by the M2R but it’s to big for EDC for me. The M1R was supposed to be released but when I called Olight they said not until fall 2018. I was shocked and said ok I’ll go but the Zebralight with High CRI and uses 18650 that’s the size of your M1R.


----------



## Tachead

Cobraman502 said:


> Great info I was going to by the M2R but it’s to big for EDC for me. The M1R was supposed to be released but when I called Olight they said not until fall 2018. I was shocked and said ok I’ll go but the Zebralight with High CRI and uses 18650 that’s the size of your M1R.



Yeah, Olight makes pretty nice lights too but, I think ZL are a fair notch up from them in a number of ways. I bet your new SC64c will actually be smaller and lighter then the M1R when it is released even though it only uses an 18350. It does have some nice features too though like the tail switch and built in magnetic charger but, the MxR series are tactical lights and their features and design are tailored to that purpose. ZL's features and design are much better suited to EDC imo.


----------



## terjee

SC600Fc Mk IV Plus just got added:
http://www.zebralight.com/SC600Fc-Mk-IV-Plus-18650-XHP50-Floody-4000K-High-CRI-Flashlight_p_228.html

Looks like there’ll be another pre-order from me!


----------



## Tixx

terjee said:


> SC600Fc Mk IV Plus just got added:
> http://www.zebralight.com/SC600Fc-Mk-IV-Plus-18650-XHP50-Floody-4000K-High-CRI-Flashlight_p_228.html
> 
> Looks like there’ll be another pre-order from me!



Wonder why they are concentrating on the flood versions. Would love a 4000k 93+ Cri 50.2 without the frosted lense.


----------



## ven

Tixx said:


> Wonder why they are concentrating on the flood versions. Would love a 4000k 93+ Cri 50.2 without the frosted lense.



Me too as i find the reflector based ZL floody enough. Would have thought to do with the quad die and smoothing out the beam. A way around would be to rough the dome up a bit ,giving it a slight frost effect.


----------



## Tachead

Tixx said:


> Wonder why they are concentrating on the flood versions. Would love a 4000k 93+ Cri 50.2 without the frosted lense.





ven said:


> Me too as i find the reflector based ZL floody enough. Would have thought to do with the quad die and smoothing out the beam. A way around would be to rough the dome up a bit ,giving it a slight frost effect.



Me three. 

I also find it strange they used the XHP50 in this new frosted version when they have 4000K High CRI XHP50.2 emitters in stock to be used in the floody headlamp "c&d" models:thinking:.


----------



## Tachead

So many new models:hairpull:. I have the SC64c and SC600w MKIV Plus coming and I just ordered a H502c L2 for reading in bed to tide me over until they arrive(had been thinking about getting this for a while). I also have wanted an SC600w HI for a while and now this SC600Fc MKIV is tempting too. ZL may be getting a lot of money from me this year.


----------



## terjee

Tachead said:


> Me three.



I’m tempted to say me four.

I have the SC64c on preorder, will add the SC600Fc as well, but I’d probably be interested if there was a non-floody 4000K High CRI XHP50.2 in the SC600-family.

I asked them about if there would be an SC600Fc, and within hours I got an email back saying something along the lines of “I just added that to the site minutes ago”. I’m wondering if the same thing would happen if one of you guys ask about an SC600c with 4K high CRI XHP50.2?


----------



## Keitho

Darn it, got me too, yet another preorder I'm waiting for...


----------



## Derek Dean

Tachead said:


> Me three.
> 
> I also find it strange they used the XHP50 in this new frosted version when they have 4000K High CRI XHP50.2 emitters in stock to be used in the floody headlamp "c&d" models:thinking:.


It is strange. That's also why I went with the SC600w IV...... no frosted lens. I imagine at some point they WILL come out with the 50.2 c and d versions for the SC600, so if that's what you're after, it might be worth waiting for, however, it's worth noting that both the c & d 50.2 headlamps are only being offered with a frosted lens at this time. Hmmmmm......... 

Personally, I've got a feeling the 4500 color temp of the 50.2 w version is going to be right on target, and if not, I'll bet it's close enough that a bit of filtration will get it where it needs to be.


----------



## NPL

Tixx said:


> Wonder why they are concentrating on the flood versions. Would love a 4000k 93+ Cri 50.2 without the frosted lense.


+1

An h600c with xhp50.2 4000k 93 CRI with reflector would be perfect!


----------



## TCY

SC600Fc Mk IV Plus now available for pre-order.:huh:


----------



## Glock27

Damn you Zebralight! Pre-Ordered a 64W. Couple days later I ended up ordering a 64c and H604c and, of course, some more cells. Couple days after that I absolutely had to order a SC600 Mk IV Plus and even more cells....

G27


----------



## markr6

I'm really proud of my self for holding back on these new lights. I only ordered the SC600w IV HI to replace the III. Not much of a move but I wanted the new UI. I don't use my SC63w often, so I can't justify adding or replacing. But that SC64c/w is on my radar, waiting for some reviews.


----------



## Tachead

markr6 said:


> I'm really proud of my self for holding back on these new lights. I only ordered the SC600w IV HI to replace the III. Not much of a move but I wanted the new UI. I don't use my SC63w often, so I can't justify adding or replacing.But that SC64c/w is on my radar, waiting for some reviews.



Yep, that's some good self control Mark:thumbsup:. I am up to 3 lights now since the pre-order started

Why do you need to wait for reviews of the SC64c/w? It is basically your SC63w with the upgraded UI and the exact same emitter for the "w" or the exact same emitter as in your SC5c MKII for the "c". Aside from the tint lottery, it will have the exact same tint and beam as your SC63w and SC5c MKII but, the "c" will likely be less yellowish on the higher levels due to it being driven harder. It sounds like there are no other changes but, possibly the new style clip.

If it helps, I can let you know how the SC64c is when I get mine. I should be one of the first to get it is I ordered minutes after the pre-order opened.


----------



## tompen41

You are not alone, I did almost the same thing! Ordered the SC600w Mk IV Plus even though I have the SC600 MK lll Hi, then ordered the SC64w even though I have the SC63w!


----------



## markr6

Tachead said:


> Why do you need to wait for reviews of the SC64c/w?



I just want to see if there is a strong bias towards a specific tint. I'm always an early adopter, occasionally getting screwed with a green or some other weird issue. I'm sure it will be OK but I want to wait on this one. I just don't use my SC63w enough to get excited about updating. I do use my H600w all the time, so I should update that one...almost 5 years old now!


----------



## Tachead

markr6 said:


> I just want to see if there is a strong bias towards a specific tint. I'm always an early adopter, occasionally getting screwed with a green or some other weird issue. I'm sure it will be OK but I want to wait on this one. I just don't use my SC63w enough to get excited about updating. I do use my H600w all the time, so I should update that one...almost 5 years old now!



Well, as far as the SC64c is concerned there is about an 80-90% chance of getting a sample above the BBL(unless ZL is cherry picking) and it is 4000K nominal so, it will almost definitely be fairly yellow with the worst samples being slightly greenish. The SC64w will have the same chances at the tint lottery as the SC63w did as it uses an identical emitter.

I will post when I get my SC64c though to let you know how it is. Keep in mind, as you know, this won't matter much when it come to tint as the lottery will be as much at play as ever.


----------



## noboneshotdog

Does anyone know if Zebralight is updating the PID in the MKIV lights for a smoother step down when needing to cool off.

I didn't really like how noticeable the level change was in my MKIII as it stepped down. It almost seemsed to flicker as output was decreaseing.


----------



## Tachead

noboneshotdog said:


> Does anyone know if Zebralight is updating the PID in the MKIV lights for a smoother step down when needing to cool off.
> 
> I didn't really like how noticeable the level change was in my MKIII as it stepped down. It almost seemsed to flicker as output was decreaseing.


ZL already has the smoothest thermal step-down of any company on the market that I know of(close to 400 brightness levels I believe). And, they also have the most accurate thermal management due to putting the temperature sensor on the same MCPCB as the LED(no one else does this that I am aware of). So, I don't know what more you could expect? Small high output lights like these have to get dimmer quickly to control the heat and you are going to notice it no matter what. If you want it to step down slower(less noticeable) then I suggest you use H2 or H3 instead of H1. That will make the light not get hot so fast and in turn make the step-down less aggressive.


----------



## emarkd

There are others who put the temp sensor on the mcpcb. You can even get "hobbyist" parts like that now - see led4power.com. None of that changes the fact that you're right though. Zebra does thermal control right, as good as any and much better than most. And as for making it smoother, I think that's a physics limitation, because over the past few years the lights have gotten both stronger (hotter) and smaller. You can't cheat the laws of physics.


----------



## TCY

With ZL's current PID it would step down a bit more smoothly if the temp setting gets cranked up. Don't know if I'd recommend it though, 53 C is a very well thought out level by ZL.


----------



## Tachead

emarkd said:


> There are others who put the temp sensor on the mcpcb. You can even get "hobbyist" parts like that now - see led4power.com. None of that changes the fact that you're right though. Zebra does thermal control right, as good as any and much better than most. And as for making it smoother, I think that's a physics limitation, because over the past few years the lights have gotten both stronger (hotter) and smaller. You can't cheat the laws of physics.



Although those boards you linked have a temp lead footprint they are not the same thing. They use a wire to feed temperature from the emitter MCPCB to a separate driver board(usually separated by a bulkhead in the body of the light). ZL uses a single MCPCB for all components. The temp sensor, emitter, and driver are all one piece on the same board. As far as I know, ZL is the only flashlight company doing this. I am guessing this is part of the reason why ZL's thermal regulation is so much smoother and more accurate when compared to other high power lights like the Emisar D4.


----------



## emarkd

Tachead said:


> Although those boards you linked have a temp lead footprint they are not the same thing. They use a wire to feed temperature from the emitter MCPCB to a separate driver board(usually separated by a bulkhead in the body of the light). ZL uses a single MCPCB for all components. The temp sensor, emitter, and driver are all one piece on the same board. As far as I know, ZL is the only flashlight company doing this. I am guessing this is part of the reason why ZL's thermal regulation is so much smoother and more accurate when compared to other high power lights like the Emisar D4.


Nahh, it goes further than that. The emisar uses the built in thermal feature of the attiny mcu. It's wildly inaccurate, plus it's completely separated by where the real heat is since it's on the driver. Led4Powers setup is good, very good. It measures the temp where the heat is, on the mcpcb, but keeps the mcu and other components on the much cooler driver board. It's very capable of being just as accurate and smooth as Zebras offering, assuming the PID function of the firmware is up to the job. 

But again I'm not trying to take anything away from Zebra. They're hard to beat.


----------



## Tachead

emarkd said:


> Nahh, it goes further than that. The emisar uses the built in thermal feature of the attiny mcu. It's wildly inaccurate, plus it's completely separated by where the real heat is since it's on the driver. Led4Powers setup is good, very good. It measures the temp where the heat is, on the mcpcb, but keeps the mcu and other components on the much cooler driver board. It's very capable of being just as accurate and smooth as Zebras offering, assuming the PID function of the firmware is up to the job.
> 
> But again I'm not trying to take anything away from Zebra. They're hard to beat.



I would think there would still be more lag time due to the temp sensor being remote vs. connected directly by trace like on the ZL no? Would that not effect accuracy and precision? Your right the firmware definitely needs to be taken into account too though(just look how much TK was able to improve the D4's regulation). Plus, wouldn't it be more accurate to monitor both the heat generated by the driver and the emitter vs. just the emitter? It seems like ZL's system is quite a bit more advanced then the Led4powers you linked but, I am no electronics engineer and have never tried theirs. 

Yeah, ZL definitely is hard to beat, the make some nice lights. Their thermal regulation looks by far the smoothest and most accurate of any light I have tested in my lightbox setup. Their driver design also looks pretty amazing. I was going to post pics of it but, the ones of the SC600 MKIII HI are no longer posted due to the photobucket third party hosting change.


----------



## anthon87

I've ordered a SC600W HI version but I'm hesitating if it the beam will be too "throwier" for EDC and walking. I have a Emisar D4 which is very floody and also don't want the zebralight to be "too floody" I want something intermediate between the Emisar D4 and my tactical Acebeam L16.

I think I'm correct choosing the HI version, right?


----------



## TCY

Yes. Your L16 has over 90K cd which is way too much for EDC applications. I expect the MKIV HI to have ~22-25K CD since its just a brightness upgrade from the MK3 (~17-19K cd from unofficial tests) which means it would have impressive throw with a generous spill for EDC. Good choice


----------



## Cobraman502

anthon87 said:


> I've ordered a SC600W HI version but I'm hesitating if it the beam will be too "throwier" for EDC and walking. I have a Emisar D4 which is very floody and also don't want the zebralight to be "too floody" I want something intermediate between the Emisar D4 and my tactical Acebeam L16.
> 
> I think I'm correct choosing the HI version, right?



I have the mk3 hi and it’s great for hiking. Generous spill however I have ordered the sc64C because the beam profile on my SC52w is amazing. It has a larger less defined hot spot but still enough to get some distance.


----------



## gk1610

Surprise! Aah! zebralight


----------



## Tachead

gk1610 said:


> Surprise! Aah! zebralight


Lol.


----------



## noboneshotdog

15 days until lift off.


----------



## Tachead

noboneshotdog said:


> 15 days until lift off.


Shhh... We are trying not to think about it:whoopin:.


----------



## gurdygurds

Anyone have some photos of your well used, beat-up, and generally worn user Zebras?


----------



## geokite

Will ZL continue to develop CR123 powered lights? 

This thought went through my head, thought of how handy a H302w would be, and then picked up one (the last?) on Amazon. Nice light; big fat head, just a mm shorter than a H502w, and nice tint.


----------



## WebHobbit

OK ZL Gurus! Need some advice here. I been trying to come up with a new EDC. I have been carrying the Malkoff MD2 with M61 and a Triad tail-cap (with clip) for several years and I did love it. However I was wanting something a little thinner and a little lighter. The MD2 is typical 6P size with a one inch body and a slightly larger head. The M61 had in my opinion the perfect balance of throw and spill and did it all with "only" 325 lumens and a single 18650. Since I had never owned a ZL I tried an SC32 first. I found it "too small"...but the biggest problem I had was I kept trying to press a non-existent tail switch. This muscle memory started back in the 1990s with a Surefire! 

So at that point I decided to stick with a tail-switch operated light. I sold the little SC32 and bought a Malkoff MDC. This light has a one inch head and an even thinner body. It carries REALLY WELL...but I find this one a little uncomfortable to use in the traditional "tactical hold" of which I am accustomed to. I think it's a combination of it's short length (3.75 inches) and NOT having that ergonomic wonder -the Oveready Triad tail-cap. It also has zero knurling...so it's a little slick. Now I am thinking hard about trying the larger ZLs. I know I will have to develop a new habit with the side-switch but after I get used to that change it should be more comfortable to use than the MDC....I hope!

So here is where I need you guy's opinion's on which ZL model to try next? Here is my criteria:

Come on in a mode bright enough to momentarily blind a bad guy (250+ lumens I should think)
18650 battery
I prefer the screwed on pocket clip unless someone can convince me the removable ones are strong enough to hold in place.
No green tint (I'm used to the Malkoff standard cool tint but neutral would be OK as long as it isn't too yellow)
Capable of at least 90 minutes of bright (300+ lumens) output
Some throw (300+ feet) would be great but a nice spill is more important to me.

Please advise!


----------



## TCY

WebHobbit said:


> OK ZL Gurus! Need some advice here. I been trying to come up with a new EDC. I have been carrying the Malkoff MD2 with M61 and a Triad tail-cap (with clip) for several years and I did love it. However I was wanting something a little thinner and a little lighter. The MD2 is typical 6P size with a one inch body and a slightly larger head. The M61 had in my opinion the perfect balance of throw and spill and did it all with "only" 325 lumens and a single 18650. Since I had never owned a ZL I tried an SC32 first. I found it "too small"...but the biggest problem I had was I kept trying to press a non-existent tail switch. This muscle memory started back in the 1990s with a Surefire!
> 
> So at that point I decided to stick with a tail-switch operated light. I sold the little SC32 and bought a Malkoff MDC. This light has a one inch head and an even thinner body. It carries REALLY WELL...but I find this one a little uncomfortable to use in the traditional "tactical hold" of which I am accustomed to. I think it's a combination of it's short length (3.75 inches) and NOT having that ergonomic wonder -the Oveready Triad tail-cap. It also has zero knurling...so it's a little slick. Now I am thinking hard about trying the larger ZLs. I know I will have to develop a new habit with the side-switch but after I get used to that change it should be more comfortable to use than the MDC....I hope!
> 
> So here is where I need you guy's opinion's on which ZL model to try next? Here is my criteria:
> 
> Come on in a mode bright enough to momentarily blind a bad guy (250+ lumens I should think)
> 18650 battery
> I prefer the screwed on pocket clip unless someone can convince me the removable ones are strong enough to hold in place.
> No green tint (I'm used to the Malkoff standard cool tint but neutral would be OK as long as it isn't too yellow)
> Capable of at least 90 minutes of bright (300+ lumens) output
> Some throw (300+ feet) would be great but a nice spill is more important to me.
> 
> Please advise!



SC600w Mk IV HI or SC600w Mk IV Plus for maximum brightness (not throw!), SC64w for screwed on pocket clip. The removable clips used by ZL are pretty sturdy but obviously not as sturdy as screwed on ones.


----------



## eraursls1984

I'd say a SC62w, or the new SC64w. The 62 has dual springs, the 64 has the new UI. The SC600w MK IV HI is going to be the best thrower. It would need a slight modification to have a solid clip though. You can use an Oveready clip on it, but would need a small spacer the thickness of the clip to make a connection between the tailcap and body.


----------



## WebHobbit

I couldn't decide! So I opted to pre-order both of the ones I'm interested in. I guess if I don't like one or both of them I can always sell them in the MarketPlace for a slight loss and move on.


----------



## Derek Dean

WebHobbit said:


> I couldn't decide! So I opted to pre-order both of the ones I'm interested in. I guess if I don't like one or both of them I can always sell them in the MarketPlace for a slight loss and move on.


I'll be interested to hear how you like them. If you're like many folks here, you'll end up keeping both : )

One suggestion. If you're new to ZL, the UI can take a bit of time to get used to, so I'd suggest that you spend most of your first hours with the lights in the G5 mode with the factory presets. This is how they should come to you from the factory. Just forget about the G6 and G7 modes for the time being. 

Before my first ZL light arrived, I spent quite a bit of time reading the instructions on the website and trying to acquaint myself with the unusual operation, and by the time the light arrived I felt pretty confident I would be able to operate it....... but....... I found once I had the light in my hands, it still took awhile to get the hang of the single click, double click, click and hold, etc....... especially the quick click and hold for just the right amount of time to get into the lowest level. 

Of course, like many here, I've come to absolutely love the UI because it allows me to quickly and easily find the right amount of light for many different situations, and the G6 and G7 modes will allow us to customize the UI further to our specific needs...... but for a beginner, those added G6 and G7 modes could be quite confusing..... so just take it one step at a time. Enjoy!


----------



## WebHobbit

Thanks!

Actually the default of H-2300 and M-171 in the SC600w/IV Plus sounds about perfect. The single click to blind an attacker...and the double-click for most utility type work. Similarly on the SC64 H-1616 and M-147 are nearly as good. I see that the run-time estimates on the SC600w/IV Plus are 1.8 hours and 12.1 in H and M and that sounds PERFECT. Wonder why they don't list any for the SC64?


----------



## terjee

WebHobbit said:


> I couldn't decide! So I opted to pre-order both of the ones I'm interested in. I guess if I don't like one or both of them I can always sell them in the MarketPlace for a slight loss and move on.



That’s one cool light, and one natural/not cool. Was that intentional?

Sorry if that’s mentioned in the threads above, just wanted to throw the comment in quickly while there might still be time to change the order if it wasn’t intentional.


----------



## WebHobbit

terjee said:


> That’s one cool light, and one natural/not cool. Was that intentional?
> 
> Sorry if that’s mentioned in the threads above, just wanted to throw the comment in quickly while there might still be time to change the order if it wasn’t intentional.




Yes that was intentional


The rationale being that I KNOW I like 5700 Cool (same on paper as many of my Malkoffs have been)...and they don't list a cool non-floody for the other yet. Plus I "need" to try a 4500 anyway so this seemed a good opportunity and the listed specs are CRAZY good...so


----------



## terjee

WebHobbit said:


> Yes that was intentional
> 
> 
> The rationale being that I KNOW I like 5700 Cool (same on paper as many of my Malkoffs have been)...and they don't list a cool non-floody for the other yet. Plus I "need" to try a 4500 anyway so this seemed a good opportunity and the listed specs are CRAZY good...so



Sounds like good rationale. 

Sorry for the extra noise, just felt a bit urgent. I’m sure people have gotten lost in the version numbers before.


----------



## tompen41

WebHobbit said:


> I couldn't decide! So I opted to pre-order both of the ones I'm interested in. I guess if I don't like one or both of them I can always sell them in the MarketPlace for a slight loss and move on.
> 
> For the SC600w Mk IV you might want to consider a different battery because of the amp draw. Either the Sony VTC6 or Samsung 30Q.


----------



## WebHobbit

Well that's what ZL pushes right on the SAME PAGE. So I kinda figured it was good enough.


----------



## tompen41

I am not an expert on batteries but I have the SC600w MK lll and have ordered the MK IV Plus which draws a lot more amps. If you go back through thread on the SC600 MK IV you will see some posts about this issue and they recommended the two batteries I posted. I have already bought some of both of them for my SC600 MK IV when it arrives plus other lights I have.

Here is a post from that thread I mentioned.



 Originally Posted by *TCY* 

_While being compatible with all battery type would be nice I doubt they would do it. The 1500lm SC600Fd III plus draws 8A already on turbo and this one does almost 2500 lm. I suspect even the much beloved 18650GA wouldn't be able to handle that current draw.

_

Yup. Time to stock up on Sony VTC5 and Samsung 30Q. Like the much brighter Emisar D4, these new Zebras will need high-drain cells to really shine.


----------



## Tachead

WebHobbit said:


> Well that's what ZL pushes right on the SAME PAGE. So I kinda figured it was good enough.


It is good enough and that is why it is the cell ZL sells on their site. The GA is rated for 10amps continuous draw, 15amp burst which is more then enough for any light ZL makes including this new Plus XHP50.2. It will work great as will a number of other cells. What you want to stay away from is cells with low continuous draw ratings like the Panasonic B's.

Let us know what you think about your new ZL's WebHobbit, I hope you enjoy them👍.


----------



## WebHobbit

Hey guys I decided to cancel the SC600 part of my order. I may revisit that later but the more I think about it the more the non screwed in clip kills it for me. Anyway I have asked for that change under the My Account part of the page. Of course no reply yet (sent last night) and I expect they wont get to it before Monday and that's fine. Should I also do this over email or is the way I did it gonna take care of it? Anyone have experience with order changes on the ZL site?


----------



## Jose Marin

Ive done everything through the site, the holiday is probably is going to slow the response though.


----------



## WebHobbit

Would you believe they already responded and refunded the difference?


----------



## noboneshotdog

Will we get shipping notifications when the pre-orders are shipped out in approximately 5 days?


----------



## Tachead

noboneshotdog said:


> Will we get shipping notifications when the pre-orders are shipped out in approximately 5 days?


Yes. But, keep in mind orders are shipped in the order they were placed. So, the people who ordered first will get theirs first and there will likely only be so many in the first batch. Meaning some of the later orders might not get shipping notices until quite a bit later(when the second batch is finished) depending on how many were made in the first batch vs how many were purchased of course. The 30th is just when the shipping starts.


----------



## noboneshotdog

Tachead said:


> Yes. But, keep in mind orders are shipped in the order they were placed. So, the people who ordered first will get theirs first and there will likely only be so many in the first batch. Meaning some of the later orders might not get shipping notices until quite a bit later(when the second batch is finished) depending on how many were made in the first batch vs how many were purchased of course. The 30th is just when the shipping starts.



Sweet. I ordered my SC600W HI within the first few hours of pre-order. Did I hear that they ship from China and US will have a slight delay compared to those in closer proximity to China?


----------



## Tachead

noboneshotdog said:


> Sweet. I ordered my SC600W HI within the first few hours of pre-order. Did I hear that they ship from China and US will have a slight delay compared to those in closer proximity to China?


I believe that was the case with past pre-orders. I am not sure with this one.


----------



## dsoden

Hello. I'd like to tell my Zerbralight story. I apologize that it is partly ranting, partly venting, but I hope I can get some honest feedback from other Zerbralight fans to help me decide on future purchases.

A couple years ago I got my first Zebralight, the SC63w. A short time after placing my online order through the Zebralight website, I got a phone call from Zebralight. The gentleman wanted to confirm my order. Along with the light I had also ordered a protected mode battery. He pointed out that the SC63w would not accept that battery and he wanted to confirm if I'd ordered that battery for use in that light, which I had. I thought to myself that this is the kind of customer service that all companies should strive for. I imagine most companies would have just blindly fulfilled my order and left me to deal with my own problem.

Anyway, once the light arrived it immediately became my every day carry light and everyone I showed it to was extremely impressed. Then, this past summer I lost it, and had to switch back to my Olight S2. The S2 is also a great light but I really missed the neutral white color of the SC63w. I decided to order a replacement. 

When I went to the website, I found that the selection had grown considerably. It actually was a bit frustration trying to make sense of all the part numbers and subtle differences between all of the different lights. I thought the design of the new headlamps was pure genius and eventually settled on an H600w MkIII. However, when it arrived and I opened the box, it contained an SC600 III. I laughed to myself that their part numbers are so confusing that even their shipping department cant understand it 

I sent them an email explaining the issue. I got back a response with an RMA number and instructions to ship it back and wait 6-8 weeks for an evaluation. I could not believe this and was quite furious. I replied that I expected them to ship me out the correct light immediately along with a prepaid return shipping slip for the other light. They requested pictures of the light, and then complied with my request. This back and forth took a couple more days then it should have but I eventually got my light and I all was well. I figured I'd just had bad luck. Someone in the shipping department was having a bad day, then someone in customer service just sent me a canned reply without actually reading what my issue was. 

So a month and a half went by and the new light failed. It simply would not turn on anymore. I swapped batteries between lights, confirmed voltage, etc. and it was definitely the light. So I emailed customer service. Yep, got back the same response of ship the light back and wait 6-8 weeks. Well after 6 weeks I thought I should check on the status and sent them another email. I got back a reply that they had my light and it would be another 4-5 weeks.

OMG! How long does it take to open the box, put a know good battery in it and turn it on? "Yep, the light is dead, ship him new one."

So there is the dilemma. Do they have so many failed lights that they are that backed up? I want to order 2 more lights as Christmas gifts for my parents. They are snowbirders and use their brand X headlamps almost every night. I think they would really love these high performance lights but I wouldn't want to have them go through what I am currently experiencing. 

So if anyone is still reading, would you mind telling me your experiences with failure rate, customer service, etc? Maybe suggest an alternative light?

On a side note, when I first ordered the headlamp I'd also ordered the glow-in-the-dark headlamp light holder but the headlamp strap that comes with the H600w MkIII does not come apart. There is no way to install the glow-in-the-dark mount


----------



## noboneshotdog

Tachead, I want to purchase a magnet for the tailcap. Is the tailcap diameter 25mm or does the 25mm include the protrusion of the lanyard clip? TIA


----------



## Tachead

noboneshotdog said:


> Tachead, I want to purchase a magnet for the tailcap. Is the tailcap diameter 25mm or does the 25mm include the protrusion of the lanyard clip? TIA


Which model are you asking about? The SC64?


----------



## noboneshotdog

Tachead said:


> Which model are you asking about? The SC64?



Oh, sorry. SC600 lV HI


----------



## Tachead

noboneshotdog said:


> Oh, sorry. SC600 lV HI


I don't own one of the SC600 series but, I assume the spec is the diameter of the tailcap without the lanyard lug. Maybe someone else can chime in to confirm?


----------



## terjee

Tachead said:


> I don't own one of the SC600 series but, I assume the spec is the diameter of the tailcap without the lanyard lug. Maybe someone else can chime in to confirm?



I can.

Also, due to the design of the tailcap, personally I’d wait with ordering the magnet until you have the light in hand. The tailcap isn’t entirely flat, which leaves you with several options, not just covering the whole thing or a subset, but also ring-options, which could fit a bit down in an indentation, perhaps allowing for securing it a bit more.

Without having given it a lot of though, that’s probably what I’d have done, but I tend to stay away from magnets on lights due to compasses etc.

For sure if you have a dealer for your magnetic fix yet (sorry, I couldn’t resist the pun), but supermagnete.de has a pretty wide selection, if you want to look into the ring option. Oh, and several discounts until the 27. apparently, just noticed while dooublechecking the link.


----------



## noboneshotdog

terjee said:


> I can.
> 
> Also, due to the design of the tailcap, personally I’d wait with ordering the magnet until you have the light in hand. The tailcap isn’t entirely flat, which leaves you with several options, not just covering the whole thing or a subset, but also ring-options, which could fit a bit down in an indentation, perhaps allowing for securing it a bit more.
> 
> Without having given it a lot of though, that’s probably what I’d have done, but I tend to stay away from magnets on lights due to compasses etc.
> 
> For sure if you have a dealer for your magnetic fix yet (sorry, I couldn’t resist the pun), but supermagnete.de has a pretty wide selection, if you want to look into the ring option. Oh, and several discounts until the 27. apparently, just noticed while dooublechecking the link.



OK cool. So it is 25mm cap?


----------



## terjee

noboneshotdog said:


> OK cool. So it is 25mm cap?



I can't find my calipers at the moment, but yes, 25mm appears to be the outer diameter of the tail cap, excluding the keyring protrusion, but including the beveled sides etc. Because of the bevelling, the end of the cap would be slightly smaller, and a 25mm magnet would probably not be a good fit.

Excuse the quality please:






The largest magnet I'd personally order for this would probably be 20mm. That's about the diameter of the outer side of the ring-indentation.


----------



## noboneshotdog

terjee said:


> I can't find my calipers at the moment, but yes, 25mm appears to be the outer diameter of the tail cap, excluding the keyring protrusion, but including the beveled sides etc. Because of the bevelling, the end of the cap would be slightly smaller, and a 25mm magnet would probably not be a good fit.
> 
> Excuse the quality please:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The largest magnet I'd personally order for this would probably be 20mm. That's about the diameter of the outer side of the ring-indentation.



Awesome! Thanks for the reply! :thumbsup:


----------



## geokite

Partly in response to dsoden: 

I have about 23 ZLs, from the past couple of years (oldest is a H501) and I've sold a couple. I've only had one issue upon receipt, a dark spot in the middle of the beam (don't remember what light it was), and that got handled by the retailer. All the other lights: no problems. Nada. Zilch.

Current favorite light is the H302w. Could use that light for most of my needs. Glad I don't have to


----------



## markr6

*SC600w IV HI JUST SHIPPED!*


----------



## Tachead

markr6 said:


> *SC600w IV HI JUST SHIPPED!*


Nice, I wonder if the SC64's are done too. What was your order number if you don't mind me asking?


----------



## markr6

Tachead said:


> Nice, I wonder if the SC64's are done too. What was your order number if you don't mind me asking?



10375987- ordered 10/31


----------



## Tachead

markr6 said:


> 10375987- ordered 10/31


Ha, that's funny I was the order right before you. I'm 10375986. Hopefully mine ships soon too. I ordered two of the new models though so, maybe they will be finished last.


----------



## tompen41

My SC64W shipped. Order 10376154 Funny I ordered the SC600 IV a few days before the SC64 
.


----------



## Tachead

I thought ZL shipped in the order orders were received. I wonder why they are shipping so out of order.


----------



## markr6

I'm sort of regretting the purchase though. I'm not sure I'll gain much with the IV HI over the III HI, but I was curious. Hoping to sell the III if it works out, but that may or may not go over well.


----------



## terjee

Tachead said:


> I thought ZL shipped in the order orders were received. I wonder why they are shipping so out of order.



My guess would be that if two people ordered the same light, they’d be shipped in order, but that they won’t hold back one type while waiting for another type.


----------



## Tixx

markr6 said:


> I'm sort of regretting the purchase though. I'm not sure I'll gain much with the IV HI over the III HI, but I was curious. Hoping to sell the III if it works out, but that may or may not go over well.



Just cancelled my order yesterday. I'm going to hold off.


----------



## markr6

I think the programmable UI will be worth it to me. That was my main motivation. The jump from M1 to H2 was far too great. So I think tint will be the only variable. Fingers crossed!


----------



## gurdygurds

I always held off on Zebralight because of the "old" UI. Not that it's fully programmable, (and I know how to program it properly :twothumbs) I decided to give them a try. Very happy that I did. SC53C that I got is the most excited I've been about a light in a while. Loving this light.



markr6 said:


> I think the programmable UI will be worth it to me. That was my main motivation. The jump from M1 to H2 was far too great. So I think tint will be the only variable. Fingers crossed!


----------



## joelbnyc

So what batteries are ideal, for SC64c and SC600w Mark IV Plus?

What has been working well in SC63's? In XHP50 SC600 III Plus lights? Without dents?

I have flat top 30Q's that are specced shorter than the 3500mAh Sanyo GA's. I presume though that at least for the SC64c, 15A would be overkill and a medium-drain 3500mAh like the GA, if it works, would be better?

But for the Mark IV Plus's XHP50.2, would a higher drain cell result in higher output for longer, even with the buck/boost driver? Thinking Sony VTC6 or VTC5A?


----------



## ven

If you already have the 30Q flat tops, they will work fine


----------



## Tachead

ven said:


> If you already have the 30Q flat tops, they will work fine



+1, the 30Q will work great.

Any cell that meets the length requirements and is 8 amps+ continuous will work fine in these lights. They are well regulated and protected so there is no need to get too picky.


----------



## emarkd

Ooh, glad to see these are shipping. That's exciting! I've not ordered yet myself, waiting for some first-hand experiences before I dive it, but I already know the new programmable UI is awesome on my SC5c mk2. That alone will probably be worth the upgrade if the tint of the new emitters isn't too terribly bad...


----------



## Glock27

I'm tempted to call the IRVING, TX post office and tell them to get their butts over to 2908 Story Road W and pick up those little boxes! Mine's been setting there with a label on it since 9:13 AM....
64w Order 10376059

G27


----------



## noboneshotdog

I ordered the SC600 HI order #10375993 and it has shipped as well. I am a US resident. 

Some of the order discrepancy regarding order of shipment may be due to some paying extra for expedited shipping. I paid for it.


----------



## TCY

For those who have ordered earlier but your light hasn't been shipped yet: 

Try contact ZL. My SC600Fd III Plus order with DHL shipping was placed pretty early on last year but wasn't shipped while someone else's order got shipped even though he placed his order later on. I got his order number and contacted ZL. ZL shipped my light within a day and refunded the DHL money I have paid. That's what I call good service. 

You can read the full story here: http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?414887-Zebralight-SC600Fd-III-Plus-XHP50/page22


----------



## noboneshotdog

Looks like postal processing is updated. Mine should arrive in NH on Friday.


----------



## Tachead

noboneshotdog said:


> Looks like postal processing is updated. Mine should arrive in NH on Friday.




Which light did you order again?


----------



## noboneshotdog

Tachead said:


> Which light did you order again?



SC600 HI IV


----------



## markr6

Yeah sitting since 9am, but finally updated and on the move! I didn't pay extra for Priority this time; just regular first class mail.


----------



## Tachead

noboneshotdog said:


> SC600 HI IV


Right. So it seems like just the HI and 64w have shipped so far. Just trying to keep track.

Edit: It looks like the Plus and regular MK IV's are shipping now too.


----------



## Tixx

Tachead said:


> Right. So it seems like just the HI and 64w have shipped so far. Just trying to keep track.
> 
> Edit: It looks like the Plus and regular MK IV's are shipping now too.



Ordered a 64w a few hours ago and got shipping notice just now.


----------



## Tachead

Tixx said:


> Ordered a 64w a few hours ago and got shipping notice just now.


Nice, looks like they have a bunch of them ready. Now if they can just get the 64c's done. I am guessing that is what is holding up my order.


----------



## terjee

Have all the ones that shipped been from the US office, or any shipped from China yet?
(The ones to Canada ship from US office as well?)


----------



## Tachead

terjee said:


> Have all the ones that shipped been from the US office, or any shipped from China yet?
> (The ones to Canada ship from US office as well?)


Some have shipped from China too. Another guy from Canada in the Plus thread had his order shipped yesterday. Canada gets shipped from China too.


----------



## terjee

Tachead said:


> Some have shipped from China too. Another guy from Canada in the Plus thread had his order shipped yesterday. Canada gets shipped from China too.



Thanks. 

Crossing my fingers that everyone gets theirs before the holidays.


----------



## WebHobbit

Mine says shipped and I didn't order until 11/20


----------



## joelbnyc

Tachead said:


> +1, the 30Q will work great.
> 
> Any cell that meets the length requirements and is 8 amps+ continuous will work fine in these lights. They are well regulated and protected so there is no need to get too picky.



Some people picky enough to buy Zebralights might also be picky (neurotic ) enough to insist on having the optimal cell  *

Edit* The 600c Mark IV Plus XHP 50.2 looks like *flux bin J2*, 4500K 80+ CRI, with min 1040 lm @ 1.4A and 6V at 85C led junction temp. The 64c's XP-L2 looks like* flux bin U5*, 4000K 90+ CRI, min 360 lm @ 1.05A (at, it looks like, ~2.81V) with 85C led junction temp. Using Cree's datasheets, Zebra's Specs (modes, efficiency of driver and temp/output regulation), and HKJ's battery comparator data, we could estimate current draw from 4.2V to cutoff, for a specific light and output mode, with Sanyo GA/LG MJ1 vs Samsung 30Q/Sony VTC6. If I recall correctly, the less the boost/buck driver has to work, the more efficient it is.

According to HKJ's discharge comparator, under ~3A the GA's become more power-dense than 30Q/VTC6 if we drain our cells fully. If we recharge at ~3.3V or more, the 30Q/VT6 win out handily at all but the lowest current draws

7A: (GA in red, VTC6 in Blue)







And 1A: (GA in red, VTC6 in Blue)


----------



## anthon87

10375989 shipped! SC600W HI

But the H53w I ordered a few days after the SC600W will probably arrive next week. They are my first entry to zebralight. I hope I like them!


----------



## Tachead

joelbnyc said:


> Some people picky enough to buy Zebralights might also be picky (neurotic ) enough to insist on having the optimal cell  *
> 
> Edit* The 600c Mark IV Plus XHP 50.2 looks like *flux bin J2*, 4500K 80+ CRI, with min 1040 lm @ 1.4A and 6V at 85C led junction temp. The 64c's XP-L2 looks like* flux bin U5*, 4000K 90+ CRI, min 360 lm @ 1.05A (at, it looks like, ~2.81V) with 85C led junction temp. Using Cree's datasheets, Zebra's Specs (modes, efficiency of driver and temp/output regulation), and HKJ's battery comparator data, we could estimate current draw from 4.2V to cutoff, for a specific light and output mode, with Sanyo GA/LG MJ1 vs Samsung 30Q/Sony VTC6. If I recall correctly, the less the boost/buck driver has to work, the more efficient it is.
> 
> According to HKJ's discharge comparator, under ~3A the GA's become more power-dense than 30Q/VTC6 if we drain our cells fully. If we recharge at ~3.3V or more, the 30Q/VT6 win out handily at all but the lowest current draws



Yep, the 30Q and VTC6 hold their voltage better at high amp draws but, honestly I don't think it is going to make much of a difference in these well regulated lights. If you want I can run some runtime/output graphs in my lightbox setup when I get my lights and have a chance. I have the SC64c and SC600w MKIV Plus coming and have GA's and VTC6's in stock.


----------



## Tachead

anthon87 said:


> 10375989 shipped! SC600W HI
> 
> But the H53w I ordered a few days after the SC600W will probably arrive next week. They are my first entry to zebralight. I hope I like them!


Let us know what you think. I think you are in for a treat, they are great lights[emoji106] .


----------



## terjee

My take on high drain vs. low drain batteries:

With high drain, it matters.

With low drain, it doesn’t matter, because runtime far exceeds enough either way. 

Therefore, I use high drain almost exclusively. Gives a few extra bonuses for vapers, and I have a preference for IMR/INR anyway.


----------



## Tachead

terjee said:


> My take on high drain vs. low drain batteries:
> 
> With high drain, it matters.
> 
> With low drain, it doesn’t matter, because runtime far exceeds enough either way.
> 
> Therefore, I use high drain almost exclusively. Gives a few extra bonuses for vapers, and I have a preference for IMR/INR anyway.



Yep, that's true for sure. 

The thing is though, ZL's aren't really high drain devices. Their highest drain light to date(SC600Fd MKIII Plus) only draws 7-8amps and that is only for about the first 15 seconds until the PID kicks in on it's highest mode and only on an almost fully depleted cell. On a close to fully charged cell it only draws about 4-5 amps. And, most of ZL's other lights draw considerably less then that light. 

Something like the 30Q or VTC6 might help a little on certain lights like the new Plus(XHP50.2) but, I don't think it will be a big difference. It certainly wouldn't be a bad thing either though. I will probably do some testing when I get some time to see what the difference is.


----------



## Connor

Zebralight SC600Fd Mk IV Plus ordered from NKON - they're in stock now. 
Grabbed another Sanyo NCR18650GA and a Sony Konion US18650VTC6 to see what works better in this light. 

The wait begins.


----------



## joelbnyc

Tachead said:


> If you want I can run some runtime/output graphs in my lightbox setup when I get my lights and have a chance. I have the SC64c and SC600w MKIV Plus coming and have GA's and VTC6's in stock.



That'd be fun to see. The only flat tops I have are 30Q's.

My 64c I plan to use mostly indoors, so I may get some GA's. Or attempt to remove the button tops on my unprotected button top MJ1's, but I'd rather not mess with that just to save a few bucks.


----------



## markr6

I may eventually jump on one of the Plus lights. The frosted ones were way too floody for me in the past, but now that there's a clear lens I may have to try it.


----------



## Connor

markr6 said:


> I may eventually jump on one of the Plus lights. The frosted ones were way too floody for me in the past, but now that there's a clear lens I may have to try it.



I *love *the frosty floodyness .. no more tunnel vision. Just get a SC600w IV HI for the other hand. :buddies:


----------



## markr6

I'm typically a floody person, but after getting the previous HI (Mk III) I just can't put it down. Possibly too narrow for some use, but not very often.

If I need floodier, I'll probably pick up the standard SC600w IV. Great do-it-all beam. Lots of decisions with this flood (HA!!!) of new lights.


----------



## noboneshotdog

My SC600 MKIV HI arrived today in NH. I can't express how pleased I am. Tint is quite nice for a Cree (I did ask for them to test for good tint). PID is MUCH less aggressive than it was in my SC600 MKIII FD PLUS (that I gifted to a friend) which I am quite pleased with. There is minimal step down even at the 1400 lm level. I did up the PID temp 5 degrees. The light got fairly hot, but not uncomfortably hot. Super pleased w the lack of step down, this was a concern of mine before purchasing.

Anodizing looks terrific! Not blotches or fading from top to bottom. Nice deep dark grey hue. 

Lastly it has a great "all around" beam. Nice hot spot with plenty of spill. This is my first HI model of the SC600. I have owned the Plus and CW in the past. But have been enjoying warmer tints over the last few years. 

Two thumbs up for this one ZL. 

Also it's nice to have the new programmable UI. I have G6 H1 and H2 set for medium with M1 and M2 as high. And set G7 H1 and H2 to low and put L1 and L2 as high. The options are endless. 

I just sold my Olight R50 Pro to a coworker and this is my new work light. You guys with one on order will surely be pleased!


----------



## Tachead

noboneshotdog said:


> My SC600 MKIV HI arrived today in NH. I can't express how pleased I am. Tint is quite nice for a Cree (I did ask for them to test for good tint). PID is MUCH less aggressive than it was in my SC600 MKIII FD PLUS (that I gifted to a friend) which I am quite pleased with. There is minimal step down even at the 1400 lm level. I did up the PID temp 5 degrees. The light got fairly hot, but not uncomfortably hot. Super pleased w the lack of step down, this was a concern of mine before purchasing.
> 
> Anodizing looks terrific! Not blotches or fading from top to bottom. Nice deep dark grey hue.
> 
> Lastly it has a great "all around" beam. Nice hot spot with plenty of spill. This is my first HI model of the SC600. I have owned the Plus and CW in the past. But have been enjoying warmer tints over the last few years.
> 
> Two thumbs up for this one ZL.
> 
> Also it's nice to have the new programmable UI. I have G6 H1 and H2 set for medium with M1 and M2 as high. And set G7 H1 and H2 to low and put L1 and L2 as high. The options are endless.
> 
> I just sold my Olight R50 Pro to a coworker and this is my new work light. You guys with one on order will surely be pleased!




Glad you are happy with it man:thumbsup:.

Now...

Pictures please.


----------



## noboneshotdog




----------



## noboneshotdog




----------



## noboneshotdog




----------



## noboneshotdog

Please note, all these pictures were taken on a Galaxy S4 and I am no photographer. 

This is a picture of a popcorn ceiling in my house. The image does not resemble the actual beam. Corona is much brighter in real life and hot spot is less defined.


----------



## noboneshotdog

Telephone pole is approximately 275 feet away. Remember, not a photographer.


----------



## WebHobbit

Why don't they offer the flood lens option for the smaller head 63/64 series lights?


----------



## Tachead

WebHobbit said:


> Why don't they offer the flood lens option for the smaller head 63/64 series lights?



They will install one for you if you ask for it. Others have done this. You either have to send your light in and pay a nominal fee to have it done or when you buy it ask for the frosted lens in the comments section or email them first and ask. It is a special request kind of thing.


----------



## Tachead

Thanks for the pics noboneshotdog, looking good:thumbsup:.


----------



## JimmyLSX

I recieved my SC600w Hi mk4 today and it’s slightly less brighter then my SC600w Hi mk3. I measured 1074 lumens at max for the IV and 1196 lumens for the III. With 16113 Candela for the IV and 17896 Candela for my III @ 1 meter.

The IV cri is better then the III, but I’m a bit disappointed in the max output, I was hoping for the IV Hi to break the 300 meter beam distance barrier.

Curious if anyone else has both lights and can compare.


----------



## snowlover91

For whatever reason, the HI emitters that ZL uses seem to have some very consistent and good tint. When I bought the MK3 HI last year I got one of the best and most pleasing tints I’ve ever had, nearly identical to a Nichia. Many others on the forum also reported very nice consistency and pleasing tint from that light as well and it seems that may continued with the MK4 HI as well. Great news if so!


----------



## noboneshotdog

Which mode were people complaining about pre-flash? I'm not getting it on my MKIV when entering low mode if that's what is was.

Edit:
I do get it in high and medium modes though, but that isn't very bothersome to me.


----------



## noboneshotdog

JimmyLSX said:


> I recieved my SC600w Hi mk4 today and it’s slightly less brighter then my SC600w Hi mk3. I measured 1074 lumens at max for the IV and 1196 lumens for the III. With 16113 Candela for the IV and 17896 Candela for my III @ 1 meter.
> 
> The IV cri is better then the III, but I’m a bit disappointed in the max output, I was hoping for the IV Hi to break the 300 meter beam distance barrier.
> 
> Curious if anyone else has both lights and can compare.



I have to think that my MKIV HI is pushing close to 1400 lumens. At least it is to my seasoned flashaholic eyes. I would be curious to find out from someone w a good light meter. I can't recall them ever being far off from there specified output numbers in the past. Hmmmmm


----------



## JimmyLSX

noboneshotdog said:


> I have to think that my MKIV HI is pushing close to 1400 lumens. At least it is to my seasoned flashaholic eyes. I would be curious to find out from someone w a good light meter. I can't recall them ever being far off from there specified output numbers in the past. Hmmmmm


I’m using a Dr. Meter 1330B, sure it may not be the best but it does let me gauge how bright my lights are to their specs. I tried 3 different batteries 30q, vtc6, sanyo ncr18650GA all charged to 4.2volts, each in my mk4 and not once did output ever go above 1100 lumens in my makeshift sphere. My mkIII Hi with a 4.06 volt sanyo ncr18650GA cell continually puts out over 1100 lumens in my sphere. I’m currently considering in returning my mk IV.


----------



## noboneshotdog

JimmyLSX said:


> I’m using a Dr. Meter 1330B, sure it may not be the best but it does let me gauge how bright my lights are to their specs. I tried 3 different batteries 30q, vtc6, sanyo ncr18650GA all charged to 4.2volts, each in my mk4 and not once did output ever go above 1100 lumens in my makeshift sphere. My mkIII Hi with a 4.06 volt sanyo ncr18650GA cell continually puts out over 1100 lumens in my sphere. I’m currently considering in returning my mk IV.



Dang. That stinks. Mine is brighter than I could ever wish for for my needs. I am very happy. It would be a bit disappointing if others have the same result. Thanks for sharing your findings with us.


----------



## MSGinMD

noboneshotdog said:


>


Is that a magnet on the bottom of the light?


----------



## noboneshotdog

MSGinMD said:


> Is that a magnet on the bottom of the light?



Yup. 25mm x 3mm.
I love magnets for my work light (plumbing hvac) as I can stand it up on a ferrous surface w/o it constantly falling on the floor when I inadvertently bump it while getting the job done.


----------



## MSGinMD

noboneshotdog said:


> Yup. 25mm x 3mm.
> I love magnets for my work light (plumbing hvac) as I can stand it up on a ferrous surface w/o it constantly falling on the floor when I inadvertently bump it while getting the job done.


Ok thanks. How did you attach the magnet super glue or Jb Weld? I would like to do the same thing to my Zebralight. Thanks.


----------



## noboneshotdog

MSGinMD said:


> Ok thanks. How did you attach the magnet super glue or Jb Weld? I would like to do the same thing to my Zebralight. Thanks.



Gorilla Glue 5 minute Epoxy. But anything similar like JB weld would work I would think.

Edit: I picked mine up at http://www.magnets365.com/ but I think they are china based as it took 3 weeks to get to US.


----------



## Petrsv

noboneshotdog said:


> Gorilla Glue 5 minute Epoxy. But anything similar like JB weld would work I would think.
> 
> Edit: I picked mine up at http://www.magnets365.com/ but I think they are china based as it took 3 weeks to get to US.


i



I would like like to do the same. Do you get 1 magnet or is it a pack for the $5?


----------



## Nichia!

noboneshotdog said:


> Gorilla Glue 5 minute Epoxy. But anything similar like JB weld would work I would think.
> 
> Edit: I picked mine up at http://www.magnets365.com/ but I think they are china based as it took 3 weeks to get to US.



Tail cap picture? Try to shake it hard and see if there is Any battery rattle?


----------



## noboneshotdog

Nichia! said:


> Tail cap picture? Try to shake it hard and see if there is Any battery rattle?



There is rattle when shaken left and right w Sony VTC6 batteries. But no rattle when shaken up and down.

Also, I shook it vigorously in all directions when turned on and did not loose any connection.


----------



## noboneshotdog

It's the same exact pogo pin pattern in the head side as well.

Edit: it is a tighter pattern in the head though as to make contact with the positive flat top of the battery.


----------



## Nichia!

Does Tailcap comes with pogo pins?


----------



## noboneshotdog

Nichia! said:


> Does Tailcap comes with pogo pins?



Yup, you must have posted as I was. See pic above.


----------



## noboneshotdog

I actually whacked both the tail and head against my hand quite hard while it was on and still didn't loose connection.

Edit: and no signs of damage / denting to the positive terminal yet too.


----------



## noboneshotdog

It was just one magnet that I purchased CPF user Petrsv.


----------



## ven

Congrats noboneshotdog(that user name is awesome), got to love ZL's. The latest UI is super useful and great for tweaking pretty much perfect levels. I think i would go clip less with the 600. So tempted, i need another ZL soon, dont have the HI version yet either.


----------



## noboneshotdog

ven said:


> Congrats noboneshotdog(that user name is awesome), got to love ZL's. The latest UI is super useful and great for tweaking pretty much perfect levels. I think i would go clip less with the 600. So tempted, i need another ZL soon, dont have the HI version yet either.




Thanks Ven. Had an "old timer" friend that used to always say "thier ain't no bones in a hot dog", hence the user name. 

I purchased the D4 a month or so ago and absolutely love it. I had Vihn put Nichia 219c 4000k in with the offset board from MTN, but wanted something with a little more regulation. And with the new ZL UI I am having just as much fun with this light as I could imagine. I think this light will definitely fit the fun, durable, regulated work light niche I was hoping it would be.


----------



## Tachead

noboneshotdog said:


> *There is rattle when shaken left and right w Sony VTC6 batteries.* But no rattle when shaken up and down.
> 
> Also, I shook it vigorously in all directions when turned on and did not loose any connection.



These are what you need...

https://www.illumn.com/batteries-ch...battery-pvc-wrap-clear-pre-cut-10-pieces.html

I install them on all my cells to increase durability and make for a tighter fit in all lights.


----------



## noboneshotdog

Tachead said:


> These are what you need...
> 
> https://www.illumn.com/batteries-ch...battery-pvc-wrap-clear-pre-cut-10-pieces.html
> 
> I install them on all my cells to increase durability and make for a tighter fit in all lights.



Oh nice. I have some. Never thought of double wrapping. Just used for repairs. Thanks. :thumbsup:


----------



## Tachead

noboneshotdog said:


> Oh nice. I have some. Never thought of double wrapping. Just used for repairs. Thanks. :thumbsup:



No problem:thumbsup:. Make sure you cut off exactly 2mm for unprotected cells if you have the same ones. That makes then fit perfectly.


----------



## noboneshotdog

Tachead said:


> No problem:thumbsup:. Make sure you cut off exactly 2mm for unprotected cells if you have the same ones. That makes then fit perfectly.



Gotcha, doing it now.


----------



## Tachead

noboneshotdog said:


> Gotcha, doing it now.



Nice. Let us know how they fit after you add an extra layer.


----------



## noboneshotdog

Tachead said:


> Nice. Let us know how they fit after you add an extra layer.



Fit great. With room to spare. Very minimal rattle. Which personally did not bother me much in the first place. But it's nice to have a bit of a snugger fit with the added battery protection. Thanks again!


----------



## Tachead

noboneshotdog said:


> Fit great. With room to spare. Very minimal rattle. Which personally did not bother me much in the first place. But it's nice to have a bit of a snugger fit with the added battery protection. Thanks again!




Nice. No problem:thumbsup:. You can try another layer if you want an even tighter fit but, remember you only want it so tight so that cell doesn't get stuck in there.


----------



## noboneshotdog

Tachead said:


> Nice. No problem:thumbsup:. You can try another layer if you want an even tighter fit but, remember you only want it so tight so that cell doesn't get stuck in there.



Hahahaha. No kidding right, don't want stuck batteries. I may be able to add another layer, but I am more than pleased with the results. Thanks again!


----------



## Nichia!

I was right about the battery rattle! Not just mine.


----------



## Tachead

Nichia! said:


> I was right about the battery rattle! Not just mine.


Yep, it's pretty common with many flashlights if you shake the hard enough from right to left. And, the pogo pins on newer ZL's tend to exaggerate it as they don't apply as much pressure as a traditional double spring design. It is necessary for manufacturers to bore the battery compartment fairly wide as well so that they can accommodate many different models and brands of cells. It's an easy fix though if it bothers you.


----------



## Petrsv

noboneshotdog said:


> It was just one magnet that I purchased CPF user Petrsv.


thank you


----------



## Bob_McBob

JimmyLSX said:


> I recieved my SC600w Hi mk4 today and it’s slightly less brighter then my SC600w Hi mk3. I measured 1074 lumens at max for the IV and 1196 lumens for the III. With 16113 Candela for the IV and 17896 Candela for my III @ 1 meter.
> 
> The IV cri is better then the III, but I’m a bit disappointed in the max output, I was hoping for the IV Hi to break the 300 meter beam distance barrier.
> 
> Curious if anyone else has both lights and can compare.



That's disappointing since ZL is usually pretty accurate about their output ratings. Did you try emailing them?


----------



## JimmyLSX

Bob_McBob said:


> That's disappointing since ZL is usually pretty accurate about their output ratings. Did you try emailing them?



I've purchased over 8 zebralights and so far this SC600w IV Hi is the only one to not meet their H1 max and be below it. Every other Zebralight I've own/owned always put out more lumens then their advertised spec at max which made me believe they were always underrated. The other levels through H2, M1,M2, etc I tested are pretty inline with zebralights spec, just not the max 1400. I even charged one of my samsung 30q's to 4.35volts and tested again still only 1070-1095 lumens at max. 
Things I do like about the light though is definitely the new Ui, the tint is much better then my MK3 Hi and so is the Cri. Things I find different from my Mk3 Hi, the reflectors Orange peel is more aggressive then the mk3 Hi, the button is more recessed and easier to click, their are more pogo pins, IV Hi 5 on positive and 5 on negative vs III Hi 3 on positive and 4 on negative. 

I decided to keep the light and not email them about it, sure it would be nice to have those extra 300 lumens on max but the light would just get hotter and ramp down faster.


----------



## Random Dan

JimmyLSX said:


> I decided to keep the light and not email them about it, sure it would be nice to have those extra 300 lumens on max but the light would just get hotter and ramp down faster.



If the problem is a less efficient emitter or driver then it may actually produce more heat compared to one running the proper 1400lm. If it is pulling the same current but producing less light then that extra energy has to be going somewhere.

I would definitely email ZL and ask for an exchange if I were you.


----------



## Tachead

noboneshotdog said:


> It's the same exact pogo pin pattern in the head side as well.
> 
> Edit: it is a tighter pattern in the head though as to make contact with the positive flat top of the battery.



So, just to confirm, there is 5 pogo pins at the positive end as well? The MKIII's only had 3 so, using 5 should spread out the force and help prevent these lights from denting cells. Smart thinking ZL:thumbsup:.


----------



## noboneshotdog

Tachead said:


> So, just to confirm, there is 5 pogo pins at the positive end as well? The MKIII's only had 3 so, using 5 should spread out the force and help prevent these lights from denting cells. Smart thinking ZL:thumbsup:.



Yup, here it is.


----------



## noboneshotdog

It would seem ZL is listening. :thumbsup:


----------



## Tachead

noboneshotdog said:


> It would seem ZL is listening. :thumbsup:




Yep, they are awesome.


----------



## jb509

Tachead said:


> So, just to confirm, there is 5 pogo pins at the positive end as well? The MKIII's only had 3 so, using 5 should spread out the force and help prevent these lights from denting cells. Smart thinking ZL:thumbsup:.



It depends which MK III. My SC600w Mk III Hi has 5 on the positive side and 4 on negative but the SC600Fd Mk III Plus has 5 on the positive side and 5 on negative as well.


----------



## lampeDépêche

So has anyone ordered the new SC600 Mk IV Plus with the clear lens?
Has anyone received one yet?

I have been EDC'ing the Mk III HI for over a year now, and it is a great light.

I would be happy to buy a new improved version of that. 

If the Mk IV HI will put out 1400 lumens, then that would be enough to warrant a replacement of my Mk III.

But I am worried about the reports of low output--we need more evidence about that (confirmation that it is a widespread problem, or evidence that it was just one bad apple in the batch).

Otherwise, I may be very tempted by the clear-lensed Plus, offering 2300 lumens (!!!!).

It may not have the same concentrated beam as the HI, but then again it may have nearly the same throw, just due to brute force.

I'm excited!


----------



## Tachead

jb509 said:


> It depends which MK III. My SC600w Mk III Hi has 5 on the positive side and 4 on negative but the SC600Fd Mk III Plus has 5 on the positive side and 5 on negative as well.


Oh, so they must have made the upgrade mid production on the MKIII HI's. The original MKIII HI's had only 3 pins on the positive side.


----------



## Tachead

Tachead said:


> Oh, so they must have made the upgrade mid production on the MKIII HI's. The original MKIII HI's had only 3 pins on the positive side.


Edit: Yes, I found a post about it. Looks like they made the change mid production due to the reports of dented cells. It's nice that ZL's are co Stanley refining their designs.


----------



## JimmyLSX

Random Dan said:


> If the problem is a less efficient emitter or driver then it may actually produce more heat compared to one running the proper 1400lm. If it is pulling the same current but producing less light then that extra energy has to be going somewhere.
> 
> I would definitely email ZL and ask for an exchange if I were you.



You hit the nail on the head Dan, I ended up testing my mk IV versus mk III with a laser temp gun after your suggestion. With freshly charged 30q cells to 4.2v and both lights at 77 degrees F cold start with Ambient temp 77 degrees F, after two minutes the head of the MK IV was at 111 degrees F and the head of the MK III at 96 degrees F. Yeah somethings not right with my IV. I sent them an email earlier today. Thanks for the suggestion.


----------



## lampeDépêche

JimmyLSX said:


> Yeah somethings not right with my IV. I sent them an email earlier today. Thanks for the suggestion.



Ah, okay: so we are getting more evidence, as I hoped for, and it is looking like one bad apple rather than a bad batch.

Okay--if a few people get Mk IV HI's that really put out 1400 (±5%), then I will probably go for that. 

The 2300 lumens from the PLUS is very tempting, but I really like the beam profile on my Mk III HI, so might stick with that.


----------



## JoeRodge

Has anyone got the Plus version yet? I pre-ordered mine about 2 weeks ago. Haven't heard anything yet.


----------



## jb509

JoeRodge said:


> Has anyone got the Plus version yet? I pre-ordered mine about 2 weeks ago. Haven't heard anything yet.



Received shipment tracking from Zebralight. ETA is mid of next week. pre-ordered on Nov 1.


----------



## anthon87

JimmyLSX said:


> You hit the nail on the head Dan, I ended up testing my mk IV versus mk III with a laser temp gun after your suggestion. With freshly charged 30q cells to 4.2v and both lights at 77 degrees F cold start with Ambient temp 77 degrees F, after two minutes the head of the MK IV was at 111 degrees F and the head of the MK III at 96 degrees F. Yeah somethings not right with my IV. I sent them an email earlier today. Thanks for the suggestion.



That is strange, the cell or driver heating itself due to the inefficiency could'nt make that difference in the head between III and IV

If the light heats up quicker, it has to be either because it's emiting more lumens; or the led is more inefficient and generates less light at the same or higher current.

I don't think Zebralight is using older bin for their leds than the ones used last year...

Let's see if more people receive the light and have similar results. Mine should arrive in three weeks...


----------



## markr6

My SC600w IV HI will be here in a few hours. I will do a comparison against the III HI and let you know what I see.


----------



## lampeDépêche

markr6 said:


> My SC600w IV HI will be here in a few hours. I will do a comparison against the III HI and let you know what I see.



Thanks, markr6. You and I are both fans of the III HI, so your impressions will tell me a lot.


----------



## JimmyLSX

anthon87 said:


> That is strange, the cell or driver heating itself due to the inefficiency could'nt make that difference in the head between III and IV
> 
> If the light heats up quicker, it has to be either because it's emiting more lumens; or the led is more inefficient and generates less light at the same or higher current.
> 
> I don't think Zebralight is using older bin for their leds than the ones used last year...
> 
> Let's see if more people receive the light and have similar results. Mine should arrive in three weeks...


Well it’s either an inefficient boost driver or led. I’m not certain but something isn’t right with my IV Hi. I hope markr6’s SC600w IV Hi is correct and in working order as zebralight specs it to be and not have all these be a potentially bad batch.


----------



## markr6

OK you guys are right on the UI. I missed the "from off" part. The confusing thing is that it operated as the old UI as well.

But the brightness:

MK III: 1857
MK IV: 1801

Just arbitrary numbers using a lux meter bouncing the light. So just slightly weaker than my MKIII, but I'll keep it for the new UI. That spacing between medium and high is much better now that I have it tweaked a bit.


----------



## noboneshotdog

markr6 said:


> Nope. HORSE SHEET!!!! All this money, time waiting, delays from USPS, and here's what I got:
> 
> An SC600w III HI with "SC600w IV HI" printed on it. Literally!!
> 
> 1. Brightness is identical on both flashlight, ALL modes. Identical.
> 2. *IT HAS THE OLD UI!!!* Even the old manual instructions inside. Says nothing about G5, G6, G7 and doesn't program like that. It's the same old 6-double clicks, then double clicks to cycle thru. The new UI was literally the _ONLY _​ reason I purchased this.
> 
> Typical Zebralight BS. I'm done. Hell, I'm done with this flashlight crap in general. No matter what you buy you have a 30% chance of things working out.
> 
> p.s. now that I compare them further, I can say the MK III is a little brighter and tighter beam than the IV. Wow, what a dud.



Ummmmmm. That stinks. Did you say that you DID NOT get the new UI either? 

I got mine last Friday, this is my first HI light from ZL. Mine DID come with the new UI though. I have completely programed G6 and G7. Mine seems bright, but I don't have a light meter or previous HI to compare.

Mine came with old instructions, but new UI. I had to go to ZL website to figure out programming.


----------



## JimmyLSX

markr6 said:


> Nope. HORSE SHEET!!!! All this money, time waiting, delays from USPS, and here's what I got:
> 
> An SC600w III HI with "SC600w IV HI" printed on it. Literally!!
> 
> 1. Brightness is identical on both flashlight, ALL modes. Identical.
> 2. *IT HAS THE OLD UI!!!* Even the old manual instructions inside. Says nothing about G5, G6, G7 and doesn't program like that. It's the same old 6-double clicks, then double clicks to cycle thru. The new UI was literally the _ONLY _​ reason I purchased this.
> 
> Typical Zebralight BS. I'm done. Hell, I'm done with this flashlight crap in general. No matter what you buy you have a 30% chance of things working out.
> 
> p.s. now that I compare them further, I can say the MK III is a little brighter and tighter beam than the IV. Wow, what a dud.



To get into the new UI thats modifiable you have to click 6 or 7(G6,G7) times from off. I’m pretty certain your light has that feature, except everything else. Thanks Mark going to request a refund instead of replacement, hopefully some fallout gives zebralight a wake up call to not slack off just because how much we love their lights.


----------



## Tachead

I think it should be pointed out that the difference in brightness might not be easily noticed without a light meter guys. 1126-1400 lumens is only about a 5% increase in perceived brightness. Our eyes just aren't very good at seeing small differences in brightness.


----------



## markr6

I understand the brightness can look the same, but since the new one looks a little LOWER, I'm not holding out hope. Light meter test in a few minutes...


----------



## Tachead

markr6 said:


> I understand the brightness can look the same, but since the new one looks a little LOWER, I'm not holding out hope. Light meter test in a few minutes...


Oh, ok. I just figured I would point out that the slightly increased brightness on H1 won't be a big difference visually.

What I can't believe is that you seem to have gotten the old firmware. That's weird.


----------



## markr6

Tachead said:


> Oh, ok. I just figured I would point out that the slightly increased brightness on H1 won't be a big difference visually.
> 
> What I can't believe is that you seem to have gotten the old firmware. That's weird.



It is the new one. I forgot about the 6 or 7 clicks to enter those modes. Being in G5 it operates like the old UI. Too confusing for me, but I've got G6 set where I want it. Kind of an expensive move or me just to get that M1 level bumped up! I guess the bonus is having 5 pogo pins instead of 3. I'll try unloading my MKIII on ebay.


----------



## Tachead

markr6 said:


> It is the new one. I forgot about the 6 or 7 clicks to enter those modes. Being in G5 it operates like the old UI. Too confusing for me, but I've got G6 set where I want it. Kind of an expensive move or me just to get that M1 level bumped up! I guess the bonus is having 5 pogo pins instead of 3. I'll try unloading my MKIII on ebay.


Oh, that's good at least. So what's the word on the light meter results?


----------



## Glock27

WTF. USPS hasn't updated tracking for 3+ days: The item is currently in transit to the destination as of December 1, 2017 at 9:05 am. It is on its way to ROLLA, MO 65401. I was expecting Saturday delivery...

G27


----------



## markr6

Tachead said:


> Oh, that's good at least. So what's the word on the light meter results?



Sorry, I put that up top in my edited post.

MK III: 1857
MK IV: 1801

Just arbitrary numbers using a lux meter bouncing the light. So just slightly weaker than my MKIII, but I'll keep it for the new UI. That spacing between medium and high is much better now that I have it tweaked a bit. Good enough; MK III is up for sale.


----------



## Tachead

markr6 said:


> Sorry, I put that up top in my edited post.
> 
> MK III: 1857
> MK IV: 1801
> 
> Just arbitrary numbers using a lux meter bouncing the light. So just slightly weaker than my MKIII, but I'll keep it for the new UI. That spacing between medium and high is much better now that I have it tweaked a bit. Good enough; MK III is up for sale.


Ok thanks. How do the tints compare?


----------



## markr6

Tachead said:


> Ok thanks. How do the tints compare?



Exactly the same, which is good. I always loved the MK III. Perfect outside in the woods!


----------



## Tachead

markr6 said:


> Exactly the same, which is good. I always loved the MK III. Perfect outside in the woods!


Nice.


----------



## benhar

Glock27 said:


> WTF. USPS hasn't updated tracking for 3+ days: The item is currently in transit to the destination as of December 1, 2017 at 9:05 am. It is on its way to ROLLA, MO 65401. I was expecting Saturday delivery...
> 
> G27



Me too! Down to the 9:05 part (different destination). Pretty frustrating.


----------



## vadimax

Glock27 said:


> WTF. USPS hasn't updated tracking for 3+ days: The item is currently in transit to the destination as of December 1, 2017 at 9:05 am. It is on its way to ROLLA, MO 65401. I was expecting Saturday delivery...
> 
> G27



Well, I have received one of my parcels 57 days after a registered shipment. During that period I have filed a parcel search on USPS than received the package, but USPS still has no idea about its whereabouts (from time to time I get messages that the parcel is still not found).


----------



## markr6

I thought my new MK IV HI seemed less throwy than the MK III. Check out the difference in orange peel on the reflectors! It's clearly more aggressive on the IV (more/smaller dimples).

That sort of takes away from the whole point of the HI, Zebralight's "thrower". If you even want to call it one. I do. With the standard SC600s already having a nice flood/throw mix, I liked a solid differentiation between the two. I'm ok with this since the III and IV are so close...I guess I prefer it in a way. Still happy with the IV!


----------



## lampeDépêche

markr6 said:


> Still happy with the IV!



mark6r, that was not the impression you gave at the start! 

At your first look, you were upset about:
1) the old UI
2) no increase in output
3) slight decrease in throw

1) turned out to be a mistake; your light does have the new UI.
But 2) and 3) still seem to be the case.

So you paid $89 for a slightly dimmer light with less throw and a better UI?

I'm puzzled--how come you went from being very unhappy with the light to now being happy with it?


----------



## holygeez03

Did he mean the the Regular MK IV, not the HI?


----------



## markr6

I'm referring to the SC600w HI IV here. My goof on the UI, that's what I was complaining about. The other things were simply observations; I don't see how I was complaining about that.

If you look back, even a year, you'll see how I've been waiting for better M>H spacing on the SC600w HI...or a new UI to fix it myself. They produced exactly that. I've said that over and over; that would be enough for me to justify buying the IV.

$89? How? Even if I lowball and sell the III at $50, that's $39 for the new UI that makes the light perfect. Seems worthwhile to me.


----------



## shotypua24

markr6 said:


> I'm referring to the SC600w HI IV here. My goof on the UI, that's what I was complaining about. The other things were simply observations; I don't see how I was complaining about that.
> 
> If you look back, even a year, you'll see how I've been waiting for better M>H spacing on the SC600w HI...or a new UI to fix it myself. They produced exactly that. I've said that over and over; that would be enough for me to justify buying the IV.
> 
> $89? How? Even if I lowball and sell the III at $50, that's $39 for the new UI that makes the light perfect. Seems worthwhile to me.



I've been thinking of getting the 4. But i think the 3 would be a good choice for now  

How do thwy both compare?


----------



## twistedraven

markr6 said:


> I thought my new MK IV HI seemed less throwy than the MK III. Check out the difference in orange peel on the reflectors! It's clearly more aggressive on the IV (more/smaller dimples).
> 
> That sort of takes away from the whole point of the HI, Zebralight's "thrower". If you even want to call it one. I do. With the standard SC600s already having a nice flood/throw mix, I liked a solid differentiation between the two. I'm ok with this since the III and IV are so close...I guess I prefer it in a way. Still happy with the IV!



They made that change in reflector within the MK3 release as well. My original MK3 HI had a reflector very much like yours to the left, while the two more recent MK3 HIs I bought to get the best tint had reflectors more akin to the one on the right. Either way, there shouldn't bee too much of a difference in throw because of that slight change. The higher output should more than make up for it.


----------



## holygeez03

Except it appears that it may not be higher output...


----------



## Nichia!

twistedraven said:


> They made that change in reflector within the MK3 release as well. My original MK3 HI had a reflector very much like yours to the left, while the two more recent MK3 HIs I bought to get the best tint had reflectors more akin to the one on the right. Either way, there shouldn't bee too much of a difference in throw because of that slight change. The higher output should more than make up for it.




This is Very Bad news! Changing the reflector is stupid move! They have destroyed the concept of the (HI) because we suppose to have a (thrower) and not (flooder) Light!


----------



## lampeDépêche

markr6 said:


> ...that's $39 for the new UI that makes the light perfect. Seems worthwhile to me.



Thanks, mark6r--your reply helps me to understand the new light better, and also understand your priorities as a light-buyer.

For me, it will take more than the new UI to bump the Mk III HI out of its place in my pocket. But I can totally see why the new UI is worth it to you.


----------



## ven

Nichia, its nit a HUGE change as the OP does look fairly mild, if anything it should(will) make the beam nicer on the eye.


----------



## Dio

Any chance the newer IV HI has got more lumens but due to being slightly more dispersed (due to different reflectors) the intensity appears the same, hence the confusion about the increase in output not appearing to have had an impact; is the hotspot size the same between III and IV HI models?


----------



## twistedraven

When I compared the 3 MK3 HI models that had the differing OP reflectors, the throw seemed to be the same.


----------



## markr6

It's so close it's hardly worth mentioning. I was going to hold back, but my eyes did detect that at first glance. Definitely not something that a buyer should ponder.

I'm just glad the tint is 100% on with this one 

p.s. I like how the anodizing seems to be getting a little darker on each light I buy! The anodizing process can vary a lot in general, so I'm sure it's not an intentional thing. But a whole lot better than the light olive stuff from 2012ish.


----------



## emarkd

I haven't ordered one yet but I'm glad to hear the tint is good. Honestly that's the most important thing to me. I could care less about a ~5% decrease in output if it means good tint and that new UI. Thanks, good to hear!


----------



## Glock27

w00T! SC64w landed! Only 2 noticeable changes. Now 5 pogo pins in head instead of the 62s' 3. New style blackened clip. I am Not a fan of this new clip design. It is wider, clunky looking, and doesn't go in or out of pocket as easy. I took it off and replaced with old design.

G27


----------



## markr6

Pogo pin peak

3+4 vs 5+5


----------



## markr6

Glock27 said:


> w00T! SC64w landed! Only 2 noticeable changes. Now 5 pogo pins in head instead of the 62s' 3. New style blackened clip. I am Not a fan of this new clip design. It is wider, clunky looking, and doesn't go in or out of pocket as easy. I took it off and replaced with old design.
> 
> G27



Oh man on the 64s? Bummer. I'll be replacing it as well, if I get one.

Never mind, they're no longer available!! CRAP!

That's too bad, it shows the silver slip in the SC64 photo online. If they wern't taking the time to re-shoot the new one, at least mention it on the page.


----------



## holygeez03

Can you post a photo of the new clip?


----------



## WebHobbit

Sooooo...looks like USPS LOST my SC64w:

https://tools.usps.com/go/TrackConf...=2&text28777=&tLabels=9405510200829587420171,


----------



## lampeDépêche

markr6 said:


> Pogo pin peak
> 
> 3+4 vs 5+5



Okay, that is a *clear* improvement.

I would especially like it if the pins in the head would not dent in the flat-top button on the top of the cell. That denting led to intermittent contact-loss when the light was jarred length-wise, which led it to drop to a lower mode. (Happened when I tried to use it as a bike head-light, riding on rough surfaces.)

Now that there are five, arranged differently, it may work much better: no denting, no contact-loss, no light jumping modes.


----------



## noboneshotdog

lampeDépêche said:


> Okay, that is a *clear* improvement.
> 
> I would especially like it if the pins in the head would not dent in the flat-top button on the top of the cell. That denting led to intermittent contact-loss when the light was jarred length-wise, which led it to drop to a lower mode. (Happened when I tried to use it as a bike head-light, riding on rough surfaces.)
> 
> Now that there are five, arranged differently, it may work much better: no denting, no contact-loss, no light jumping modes.



Yes I have shaken, banged and jostled my new MKIV HI pretty hard without loosing contact or denting my Sony VTC6 batteries. So far so good. :thumbsup:


----------



## benhar

Got mine today! My first ZL and I'm loving it so far.

Having trouble programming it though... I seem to keep programming the same level. Got H1 programmed, but when I go to program H2 I seem to keep programming H1 again. Maybe my timing is off with the double clicking or something.


----------



## noboneshotdog

benhar said:


> Got mine today! My first ZL and I'm loving it so far.
> 
> Having trouble programming it though... I seem to keep programming the same level. Got H1 programmed, but when I go to program H2 I seem to keep programming H1 again. Maybe my timing is off with the double clicking or something.



I found YouTube videos to be helpful.


----------



## TCY

benhar said:


> Got mine today! My first ZL and I'm loving it so far.
> 
> Having trouble programming it though... I seem to keep programming the same level. Got H1 programmed, but when I go to program H2 I seem to keep programming H1 again. Maybe my timing is off with the double clicking or something.



One way to make sure which level is getting programmed: use H2 as an example, get to H2 and turn off the light, turn it back on at H2 and do the multiple double clicks.


----------



## likethevegetable

benhar said:


> Got mine today! My first ZL and I'm loving it so far.
> 
> Having trouble programming it though... I seem to keep programming the same level. Got H1 programmed, but when I go to program H2 I seem to keep programming H1 again. Maybe my timing is off with the double clicking or something.



1st: Make sure you're in G6 or G7 to begin with.

2nd: as TCY said, you will only program the mode you turned it on to from off. Go to the mode you want to change. Turn the light off. Then turn it on to that mode. Then double-click six times.

Oh boy am I ever excited for the H600Fc!


----------



## likethevegetable

I noticed the other day that there was a bit of light poking through the rubber button my H53c with the light on high - anyone else notice that?


----------



## markr6

lampeDépêche said:


> Okay, that is a *clear* improvement.
> 
> I would especially like it if the pins in the head would not dent in the flat-top button on the top of the cell. That denting led to intermittent contact-loss when the light was jarred length-wise, which led it to drop to a lower mode. (Happened when I tried to use it as a bike head-light, riding on rough surfaces.)
> 
> Now that there are five, arranged differently, it may work much better: no denting, no contact-loss, no light jumping modes.



The of the NCR18650GA in my SC63w has been totally crushed!! Still working fine though. I'll be interested in the SC64w setup.


----------



## Connor

Just got my SC600Fd IV Plus from NKON. 

Quick observations: 
-the manual in the box is an old one and does not mention the new multiple mode groups (but they do work) - still, this is not very good for a new ZL user
-6 pogo pins on both sides
-no battery rattling (NCR18650 GA)
-same length as the Fd III Plus
-darker grey ano (nice)
-button feels more "clicky"
-quick ceiling bounce comparison with smartphone lux meter: ~700 (Mk IV) vs. ~600 (Mk III) .. so definitely no problems here
-I can see NO stepping at all when the PID kicks in. Nada. The Mk III is more "blinky" when stepping down. 

And, most importantly:
I *finally *hit the LED tint jackpot: even on low the tint is (almost) perfectly white and better than my Fd Mk III Plus, which I already considered to be quite good. 

Will post beamshots later.


----------



## neutralwhite

I'm getting mine from there too!.




Connor said:


> Just got my SC600Fd IV Plus from NKON.
> 
> Quick observations:
> -the manual in the box is an old one and does not mention the new multiple mode groups (but they do work) - still, this is not very good for a new ZL user
> -6 pogo pins on both sides
> -no battery rattling (NCR18650 GA)
> -same length as the Fd III Plus
> -darker grey ano (nice)
> -button feels more "clicky"
> -quick ceiling bounce comparison with smartphone lux meter: ~700 (Mk IV) vs. ~600 (Mk III) .. so definitely no problems here
> -I can see NO stepping at all when the PID kicks in. Nada. The Mk III is more "blinky" when stepping down.
> 
> And, most importantly:
> I *finally *hit the LED tint jackpot: even on low the tint is (almost) perfectly white and better than my Fd Mk III Plus, which I already considered to be quite good.
> 
> Will post beamshots later.


----------



## JStraus

I'm trying to figure out the difference here with between the Fd III Plus and the Fd IV Plus.

Is it just output and programmable UI modes? It looks to have the same led it appears.

I love my Fd III Plus, but might pass on the IV if I am correct. 




Connor said:


> Just got my SC600Fd IV Plus from NKON.
> 
> Quick observations:
> -the manual in the box is an old one and does not mention the new multiple mode groups (but they do work) - still, this is not very good for a new ZL user
> -6 pogo pins on both sides
> -no battery rattling (NCR18650 GA)
> -same length as the Fd III Plus
> -darker grey ano (nice)
> -button feels more "clicky"
> -quick ceiling bounce comparison with smartphone lux meter: ~700 (Mk IV) vs. ~600 (Mk III) .. so definitely no problems here
> -I can see NO stepping at all when the PID kicks in. Nada. The Mk III is more "blinky" when stepping down.
> 
> And, most importantly:
> I *finally *hit the LED tint jackpot: even on low the tint is (almost) perfectly white and better than my Fd Mk III Plus, which I already considered to be quite good.
> 
> Will post beamshots later.


----------



## Connor

JStraus said:


> I'm trying to figure out the difference here with between the Fd III Plus and the Fd IV Plus.
> 
> Is it just output and programmable UI modes? It looks to have the same led it appears.
> 
> I love my Fd III Plus, but might pass on the IV if I am correct.



Yes, just +316 lumens and different levels (I love the 1035 lumens H2) and the new UI. 
The XHP50 LED is probably a binning or two higher than what they used in the Mk III.


----------



## benhar

TCY said:


> One way to make sure which level is getting programmed: use H2 as an example, get to H2 and turn off the light, turn it back on at H2 and do the multiple double clicks.


Thanks, that did the trick!


----------



## Tachead

Connor said:


> Yes, just +316 lumens and different levels (I love the 1035 lumens H2) and the new UI.
> The XHP50 LED is probably a binning or two higher than what they used in the Mk III.



The LED might be a higher bin but, I believe most of the increase in brightness is due to ZL using some new componentry and increasing the drivers efficiency. So, the driver is slightly improved as well.


----------



## JoeRodge

This makes me sad. I want mine, now! Pre-ordered on the 17th of November and just got this from Zebralight, "Your order will be shipped in about 2-3 weeks. Too many pre-orders came in than what we expected, especially for that SC600w IV Plus"

Order: 10376512


----------



## markr6

Interesting! I wish they would just wait and make 1000 of these things, then announce it. But I understand they can't have that many eggs in one basket in case something goes wrong, or not selling as expected.


----------



## Connor

Tint shots SC600Fd III Plus (left) vs. SC600Fd IV Plus (right)
Photos taken with Nexus 6P and "Manual Camera". Colour temperature locked at 5800K ([email protected])












^both lights on L1 (2.9 vs. 4.0 lumens)






^both lights on M1 (100 vs. 135 lumens)


The Mk IV is definitely less green and more pinkish on low (less than it appears in the photos, though). 
I like it very much. :bow:


----------



## TCY

Congrats, would you say it's more Nichia white than Cree white?:naughty:


----------



## WebHobbit

So I'm sitting here watching my SC64w 18650 XHP35 Neutral White tail stand on high. Mixed feelings here.

1) LOVE the tint and the beam profile. Just beautiful

2) Clip is so-so..

3) TOO HOT! PID doesn't seem aggressive enough. It's been on for about 13 minutes now and it's been too hot to comfortably hold since 3 minutes in. 

This is my first 18650 ZL...this heat thing is probably why US made lights like the Malkoff MD2/M61 "only" put out 325 lumens. They don't get so hot you want to drop them.


----------



## Connor

@TCY 
Now that you mention it .. the tint is actually really close to the Nichia 219Bs in my Manker Mk34. :duh2:


----------



## TCY

Connor said:


> @TCY
> Now that you mention it .. the tint is actually really close to the Nichia 219Bs in my Manker Mk34. :duh2:



Nice. Maybe besides tint lottery... Cree is secretly catching up?:thumbsup:


----------



## Tachead

WebHobbit said:


> So I'm sitting here watching my SC64w 18650 XHP35 Neutral White tail stand on high. Mixed feelings here.
> 
> 1) LOVE the tint and the beam profile. Just beautiful
> 
> 2) Clip is so-so..
> 
> 3) TOO HOT! PID doesn't seem aggressive enough. It's been on for about 13 minutes now and it's been too hot to comfortably hold since 3 minutes in.
> 
> This is my first 18650 ZL...this heat thing is probably why US made lights like the Malkoff MD2/M61 "only" put out 325 lumens. They don't get so hot you want to drop them.



It will get less hot while being passively cooled in your hands. You can adjust the thermal regulation as well to make it stay 5 degrees Celsius cooler if you want. Here are the instructions...



PID Thermal Regulation Temperature Programming for three highest output levels
Turn off the light from H1 and then turn back on to H1 
Press and hold to cycle from Low to High 6 times 
On the 7th (or more) cycle, release the switch
when High, to add 1 degree C (up to 5 max) 
when Med, to revert back to the factory default 
when Low, to subtract 1 degree C (up to 5 max) 
 
 


Also, you can always run it on a lower level. You don't need to run it on H1 all the time. The lowest H2 mode is 264 lumens and is not PID controlled so it will run perfectly flat regulated for most of the battery without getting as hot. Keep in mind that the top 3 PID controlled modes are meant to give you the highest brightness possible for the conditions and will adjust brightness in real time to stay within a safe limit. They will not harm anything and the LED is not overdriven. Although it gets hot it is perfectly safe and feel free too use it as much as you need.


----------



## Derek Dean

WebHobbit said:


> So I'm sitting here watching my SC64w 18650 XHP35 Neutral White tail stand on high. Mixed feelings here.
> 
> 1) LOVE the tint and the beam profile. Just beautiful
> 
> 2) Clip is so-so..
> 
> 3) TOO HOT! PID doesn't seem aggressive enough. It's been on for about 13 minutes now and it's been too hot to comfortably hold since 3 minutes in.
> 
> This is my first 18650 ZL...this heat thing is probably why US made lights like the Malkoff MD2/M61 "only" put out 325 lumens. They don't get so hot you want to drop them.


My understanding is there is a way to lower the temperature where the thermal stepdown kicks in, some method of double clicking no doubt. You might give that a try. 

Other than that, it sounds like you got a might fine light. If nothing else, you could consider turning the light down manually when it gets too hot : )


----------



## Tachead

Derek Dean said:


> My understanding is there is a way to lower the temperature where the thermal stepdown kicks in, some method of double clicking no doubt. You might give that a try.
> 
> Other than that, it sounds like you got a might fine light. If nothing else, you could consider turning the light down manually when it gets too hot : )



Yep, I gave him the instructions on how to adjust the PID in my post.

I also pointed out that ZL's thermal regulation will keep the lights temperature within safe limits. Although some may find the light not as comfortable as they would like, it is perfectly safe and can run indefinitely even on the top level(H1). In a light this small, with this much output, heat is inevitable. Up here in the north I love that lights like this also serve as a great hand warmer in the winter.


----------



## WebHobbit

I lowered it 5 degrees and to be honest I can't tell any difference (shrugs). H1 still feels like I'm holding an actual flaming TORCH by the wrong end!



It could be this just aint for me. Maybe I'm just a tactical butt switch guy. It's a very interesting UI though and the beam IS beautiful.


----------



## Tachead

WebHobbit said:


> I lowered it 5 degrees and to be honest I can't tell any difference (shrugs). H1 still feels like I'm holding an actual flaming TORCH by the wrong end!
> 
> 
> 
> It could be this just aint for me. Maybe I'm just a tactical butt switch guy. It's a very interesting UI though and the beam IS beautiful.



You have pretty sensitive hands for a tactical guy there Webhobbit.

The light should only get to about 40-50C at most with the PID lowered. That is a hot summer day in some places. You should try the Emisar D4 if you want to see hot lol. I believe it can hit 70C with the thermal regulation turned up. Now that's hot.

Remember, you don't have to use the high modes but, they are there if you need them and they are perfectly safe even if you do find them a bit warm. At levels similar to a MD2 M61N the light should only get a bit hotter due to the ZL's much smaller size. The bonus is the ZL will get 2-3 times the regulated runtime compared to the M61N due to its far more advanced driver. Heat is always the tradeoff for output, even your MD2 would get quite hot eventually if it were putting out 1400 lumens(remember that is twice the output of the Hound Dog 18650). It is just the nature of the beast and small lights get hot faster.


----------



## Tachead

WebHobbit said:


> I lowered it 5 degrees and to be honest I can't tell any difference (shrugs). H1 still feels like I'm holding an actual flaming TORCH by the wrong end!
> 
> 
> 
> It could be this just aint for me. Maybe I'm just a tactical butt switch guy. It's a very interesting UI though and the beam IS beautiful.


Oh, just to confirm, did you do the whole process 5 full times? It only goes up or down one degree at a time so you have to do it 5 full times. You can check if it worked with a infrared temp gun.


----------



## WebHobbit

Yep did it 5 times...unfortunately I don't have access to a temp gun.

I haven't given up yet guys. H2 doesn't seem to become a Hot Spire of Hell. So that's encouraging.

I'm gonna carry it to work today and see how it does.


----------



## TCY

A ZL with PID cranked all the way down has a temp cap of 48C with +-0.1C accuracy.


----------



## Auringonvalo

I'm wondering, if SC600Fd IV can last longer without stepping down than III version when using outputting the same lumens? Also interested to see, if VTC6 battery lasts longer than Sanyo GA when using mostly H1 mode with its step downs. Personally, I find these flashlights too compact which harms cooling and high modes are then less useful. The body could be longer at least to protect the battery from heat because the body is rated for 85C and fall/winter outdoor temps could then pretty much maintain H1 at max or close until the battery runs out.

Maybe Zebralight one day produce bigger and more powerful version of SC600Fd which is similar to Astrolux MF01.


----------



## Tachead

Auringonvalo said:


> I'm wondering, if SC600Fd IV can last longer without stepping down than III version when using outputting the same lumens? Also interested to see, if VTC6 battery lasts longer than Sanyo GA when using mostly H1 mode with its step downs. Personally, I find these flashlights too compact which harms cooling and high modes are then less useful. The body could be longer at least to protect the battery from heat because the body is rated for 85C and fall/winter outdoor temps could then pretty much maintain H1 at max or close until the battery runs out.
> 
> Maybe Zebralight one day produce bigger and more powerful version of SC600Fd which is similar to Astrolux MF01.



I think you are missing the whole point of Zebralight's design. They are designed to be as small as possible and use the most advanced thermal regulation in the industry to still allow use of extremely high outputs. Yes, in average conditions they will only hold that output for a while(long enough to put your dog out or do other daily tasks)but, their thermal regulation is designed to step down in such small increments that it is hardly noticed. If you want extremely high sustained outputs you need to go with a much larger multi cell light. And, there are plenty of light companies making large lights already. ZL's niche is extremely small easy to carry EDC lights. Also, keep in mind a single cell light running outputs like on some of the new models would kill a VTC6 in only minutes which isn't very practical or useful even if it could do it anyway imo. A single 18650 only has so much capacity and you need 3 - 4 of them for a descent runtime at sustained high outputs.


----------



## Derek Dean

Tachead said:


> I think you are missing the whole point of Zebralight's design. They are designed to be as small as possible and use the most advanced thermal regulation in the industry to still allow use of extremely high outputs. Yes, in average conditions they will only hold that output for a while(long enough to put your dog out or do other daily tasks)but, their thermal regulation is designed to step down in such small increments that it is hardly noticed. If you want extremely high sustained outputs you need to go with a much larger multi cell light. And, there are plenty of light companies making large lights already. ZL's niche is extremely small easy to carry EDC lights. Also, keep in mind a single cell light running outputs like on some of the new models would kill a VTC6 in only minutes which isn't very practical or useful even if it could do it anyway imo. A single 18650 only has so much capacity and you need 3 - 4 of them for a descent runtime at sustained high outputs.


This makes me wonder what has happened to their C3 light? I'm quite intrigued by the limited specs posted on their website.


----------



## gurdygurds

Has anyone found a way to actually speak with someone at Zebralight? I'm finding the communication via their website messaging a little rough.


----------



## markr6

Derek Dean said:


> This makes me wonder what has happened to their C3 light? I'm quite intrigued by the limited specs posted on their website.



Just hoping it isn't another Q50! I figured they were just busy getting all the new 64/600 lights finalized, so the C3 had to wait a little longer.


----------



## Tachead

Derek Dean said:


> This makes me wonder what has happened to their C3 light? I'm quite intrigued by the limited specs posted on their website.



I can't be sure but, I am guessing they cancelled that and just haven't removed it from the spec sheet yet. Either that or put it way on the back burner. It has been on the spec sheet for a very long time.


----------



## Tachead

gurdygurds said:


> Has anyone found a way to actually speak with someone at Zebralight? I'm finding the communication via their website messaging a little rough.



Are you using the "add request" function in your account? They always answer me promptly(usually the same day or next day at the latest).


----------



## Tachead

markr6 said:


> Just hoping it isn't another Q50! I figured they were just busy getting all the new 64/600 lights finalized, so the C3 had to wait a little longer.



They announced the C3 way before the 64 and MKIV series was announced though. In fact, I think they announced the C4 quite a bit before the SC53, SC5 MKII, and H53 series as well. My guess it is cancelled or just not very important to them. I guess an email would answer our question though.


----------



## TCY

Derek Dean said:


> This makes me wonder what has happened to their C3 light? I'm quite intrigued by the limited specs posted on their website.



They plan to get the C3 manufactured in their new shiny Texas factory so it's a milestone "Made in USA" ZL.. but I guess the factory is having some hiccups. ZL told me the R&D of C3 has been completed months ago.


----------



## Mattz68

Tachead said:


> I think you are missing the whole point of Zebralight's design. They are designed to be as small as possible and use the most advanced thermal regulation in the industry to still allow use of extremely high outputs. Yes, in average conditions they will only hold that output for a while(long enough to put your dog out or do other daily tasks)but, their thermal regulation is designed to step down in such small increments that it is hardly noticed. If you want extremely high sustained outputs you need to go with a much larger multi cell light. And, there are plenty of light companies making large lights already. ZL's niche is extremely small easy to carry EDC lights. Also, keep in mind a single cell light running outputs like on some of the new models would kill a VTC6 in only minutes which isn't very practical or useful even if it could do it anyway imo. A single 18650 only has so much capacity and you need 3 - 4 of them for a descent runtime at sustained high outputs.


. Perfectly stated by “Tachead”...the smallest and brightest has always been Z.L’s mission for sure. But that’s what makes them so darn versatile over most of the competition. Look at the SC600, what if they stopped at the original design and hadn’t continued evolving? Other flashlight companies have fallen by the wayside, while Zebralight’s popularity continues to grow for this very reason.


----------



## Mattz68

markr6 said:


> Just hoping it isn't another Q50! I figured they were just busy getting all the new 64/600 lights finalized, so the C3 had to wait a little longer.


 Man, Zebralight really missed the boat by not coming out with the Q50 (for newer members of the herd -this was a 4AA soda can light prototype that never actually came to fruition). They would have sold 1000’s of these things! Too late now...we have the TN4A (awesome light for money) among others...


----------



## WebHobbit

Well guys I am now a believer! Carried my new SC64w today at work. Carried just fine. The new stiff black clip works well and seem to ease up a little on the tightness after taking it on and off the pocket lip a few times but it's still very strong. My earlier concerns with the heat is no longer an issue. I just have it start in H2 (875) and if I "need" more I can simply double click. I am finding the default setup otherwise just perfect for me. I use the medium and H2 more than anything. I LOVE the UI!!!!!!!!!!!!! I find the "hold and ramp through modes" very natural and FUN to use. I am a convert and now I think I'm gonna order it's big brother the new SC600 plus!


----------



## tompen41

You will love the SC600w lV Plus! It will really make a believer out of you. The 64 is a great carry light but the Plus is a whole wall of light!


----------



## WebHobbit

Slightly off topic but this is the first time I've messed with unprotected 18650s...the red cells from ZL -on my Xtar VP1 -they get a little warmer than my protected cells do around the middle of the charging cycle...not hot but a little warm. This is normal -yes?


----------



## terjee

Just got shipping notification for SC64c (China to Norway).


----------



## Derek Dean

WebHobbit said:


> Well guys I am now a believer! Carried my new SC64w today at work. Carried just fine. The new stiff black clip works well and seem to ease up a little on the tightness after taking it on and off the pocket lip a few times but it's still very strong. My earlier concerns with the heat is no longer an issue. I just have it start in H2 (875) and if I "need" more I can simply double click. I am finding the default setup otherwise just perfect for me. I use the medium and H2 more than anything. I LOVE the UI!!!!!!!!!!!!! I find the "hold and ramp through modes" very natural and FUN to use. I am a convert and now I think I'm gonna order it's big brother the new SC600 plus!


Yep, the ZL UI is quite amazing in it's well thought out versatility, and the form factor of the SC64w is just perfect for an EDC work light. 

I go back and forth between my SC62w and my SC600 series lights all the time. Of course the SC6x series is thinner, and practically disappears in the pocket, but the SC600 series light's extra mass let's me run at a higher level without getting hot as quickly as the smaller SC6x series, so as usual, it's a trade-off as to which one I decide to carry. Usually, I'll carry the SC62w if I have a day job that might go into the evening, and I'll carry the SC600 if I have a night job where I know I'll need the extra output. 

I'll be interested to hear if, like many ZL users, you find the extreme LOW level outputs to be just as useful as the higher outputs. The ability to quickly and easily match the light level to whatever task is at hand is one of ZL's great strengths. 

In any case, enjoy your new light.


----------



## ven

Yes cells can get a little warm(sometimes quite warm with a higher charge rate ).


----------



## Derek Dean

WebHobbit said:


> Slightly off topic but this is the first time I've messed with unprotected 18650s...the red cells from ZL -on my Xtar VP1 -they get a little warmer than my protected cells do around the middle of the charging cycle...not hot but a little warm. This is normal -yes?


That's a good question. This is also my first time using those red unprotected highdrain cells supplied by ZL. I imagine warm is ok, but you might get a quicker answer over on the "Flashlight Electronics-Batteries Included" forum.

Edit: Oh, I see ven answered our question. Thanks mate : )


----------



## Tachead

terjee said:


> Just got shipping notification for SC64c (China to Norway).


Awesome, what was your order number if you don't mind me asking? Hopefully mine will ship soon too.


----------



## terjee

Tachead said:


> Awesome, what was your order number if you don't mind me asking? Hopefully mine will ship soon too.



Ordernumber 10376002, ordered on 2017-10-31.

Got tracking number, but not appeared in trace yet. Chose postal, so it’ll be a while before it gets here.


----------



## Glock27

Order 10376146 Placed 11-3-17 64c & 604c Not Shipped yet.

G27


----------



## TCY

Order# 10376017, H600Fc MKIV, asked ZL 2 days ago and got told that my order will be shipped in about 3 weeks.


----------



## Tachead

terjee said:


> Ordernumber 10376002, ordered on 2017-10-31.
> 
> Got tracking number, but not appeared in trace yet. Chose postal, so it’ll be a while before it gets here.


Thank you sir. I was about 15 orders before you so hopefully my shipping notice is coming soon as well. I paid for the fastest DHL shipping option. Did you just order the SC64c with this order? I have to say, I am not real happy about ZL shipping orders that were placed after mine first. Most companies ship in the order orders are received from my experience.


----------



## Dio

Tachead said:


> Thank you sir. I was about 15 orders before you so hopefully my shipping notice is coming soon as well. I paid for the fastest DHL shipping option. Did you just order the SC64c with this order? I have to say, I am not real happy about ZL shipping orders that were placed after mine first. Most companies ship in the order orders are received from my experience.



Most companies don't update their whole model lineup at the same time so it should be understandable that not every model is ready at the same time in quantities that will enable all orders to ship. 

My guess is you either ordered more than one model and they don't have them all ready to ship or you ordered a model that (whilst you ordered before others) is not ready to ship, unlike the models requested by those who placed their order after yours. Hope that makes sense..


----------



## Tachead

Dio said:


> Most companies don't update their whole model lineup at the same time so it should be understandable that not every model is ready at the same time in quantities that will enable all orders to ship.
> 
> My guess is you either ordered more than one model and they don't have them all ready to ship or you ordered a model that (whilst you ordered before others) is not ready to ship, unlike the models requested by those who placed their order after yours. Hope that makes sense..


The models I ordered are both shipping and ready now. Hopefully I will get a shipping notice soon as I was one of the first to place a pre-order.


----------



## terjee

Tachead said:


> Thank you sir. I was about 15 orders before you so hopefully my shipping notice is coming soon as well. I paid for the fastest DHL shipping option. Did you just order the SC64c with this order? I have to say, I am not real happy about ZL shipping orders that were placed after mine first. Most companies ship in the order orders are received from my experience.



I ordered this, and separately ordered an SC600Fc a few days later. Also want two headlamps, but given the price, that it’s my first time ordering from Zebralights directly, and that the ship dates for the headlamps is later, I figured those can wait. 

Did you order anything else at the same time? My guess is that’d be the reason, if another item is delaying it. Or custom requests in order comments etc.


----------



## Tachead

terjee said:


> I ordered this, and separately ordered an SC600Fc a few days later. Also want two headlamps, but given the price, that it’s my first time ordering from Zebralights directly, and that the ship dates for the headlamps is later, I figured those can wait.
> 
> Did you order anything else at the same time? My guess is that’d be the reason, if another item is delaying it. Or custom requests in order comments etc.


I probably should have placed my pre-orders separately too as I would already have a light to tide me over then. It would have been nice if ZL would have emailed me to say one is ready and asked if I wanted it to ship now.

I ordered the SC64c and SC600w MKIV Plus(XHP50.2). So, now that they are both shipping(the Plus has been shipping for a while) I hope to get a shipping notice soon, especially because I paid for the most expensive shipping method. Hopefully ZL is just picking me ones with amazing tints.


----------



## Tixx

Tachead said:


> I probably should have placed my pre-orders separately too as I would already have a light to tide me over then. It would have been nice if ZL would have emailed me to say one is ready and asked if I wanted it to ship now.
> 
> I ordered the SC64c and SC600w MKIV Plus(XHP50.2). So, now that they are both shipping(the Plus has been shipping for a while) I hope to get a shipping notice soon, especially because I paid for the most expensive shipping method. Hopefully ZL is just picking me ones with amazing tints.




I did the expensive shipping twice. Both times it was a fail. Never again.


----------



## Tachead

Tixx said:


> I did the expensive shipping twice. Both times it was a fail. Never again.


What do you mean fail? And, what models did you order?


----------



## Dio

Tachead said:


> The models I ordered are both shipping and ready now. Hopefully I will get a shipping notice soon as I was one of the first to place a pre-order.



Yeah that sucks. I cancelled an order recently. Was quoted 2 weeks and a month later my light still hadn't shipped. I guess they are just flat out and missed orders happen. Have you contacted them?


----------



## TCY

Tachead said:


> I probably should have placed my pre-orders separately too as I would already have a light to tide me over then. It would have been nice if ZL would have emailed me to say one is ready and asked if I wanted it to ship now.
> 
> I ordered the SC64c and SC600w MKIV Plus(XHP50.2). So, now that they are both shipping(the Plus has been shipping for a while) I hope to get a shipping notice soon, especially because I paid for the most expensive shipping method. Hopefully ZL is just picking me ones with amazing tints.



Email them with you order #. There were instances where they set the expensive shipping orders aside for shipping priority but ended up forgetting about it. Happened to me once, they refunded my DHL money.


----------



## Tachead

Dio said:


> Yeah that sucks. I cancelled an order recently. Was quoted 2 weeks and a month later my light still hadn't shipped. I guess they are just flat out and missed orders happen. Have you contacted them?


Not yet, I am trying to be patient. Hopefully I will get a shipping notice soon. I will post when I do.


----------



## Tachead

TCY said:


> Email them with you order #. There were instances where they set the expensive shipping orders aside for shipping priority but ended up forgetting about it. Happened to me once, they refunded my DHL money.


Hopefully that didn't happen this time. I will give them some time but, if I don't get a shipping notice in a while I will contact them and ask what's going on. I try to be patient with these things because I know pre-orders are an uncertain thing but, it gets frustrating when you see people that ordered after you getting shipping notices. Not to mention, they didn't contact me when the SC600w MKIV Plus was done to ask if I wanted mine shipped even though my order was placed less then 15 min after the pre-order opened. Well, hopefully I will just get an email soon and can tell you guys they are on their way.


----------



## Tixx

Tachead said:


> What do you mean fail? And, what models did you order?



I no longer know what they were. People with regular shipping where getting theirs when mine had not shipped. I ordered 1 light, not multiple models, each time.


----------



## TCY

Tachead said:


> Hopefully that didn't happen this time. I will give them some time but, if I don't get a shipping notice in a while I will contact them and ask what's going on. I try to be patient with these things because I know pre-orders are an uncertain thing but, it gets frustrating *when you see people that ordered after you getting shipping notices*. Not to mention, they didn't contact me when the SC600w MKIV Plus was done to ask if I wanted mine shipped even though my order was placed less then 15 min after the pre-order opened. Well, hopefully I will just get an email soon and can tell you guys they are on their way.



That's the sign of contacting them... they ship orders based on order#.


----------



## joelbnyc

How long do preorders usually take to ship?

Waiting in US for a SC64c on 11/23 (order #103766XX), and a SC600w IV Plus on 11/27 (order #103768XX), under the impression that "preorders start shipping Nov 30th," like their site says. I figured a few days tops.

Do they practice just-in-time inventory/manufacturing or something? Like manufacturing in batches only after they have payment in hand from X number of orders? Or do they just have a very small number of people doing their pack and shipping?


----------



## noboneshotdog

Is there a final concensus as to how many lumens the SC600 MKIV HI is putting out? It seems I recall some of the first few guys that received it and had meters were stating it was less than the 1400 manufacturers specs.

I got mine last week and was curious if what I am seeing is 1400 lm or not. 

I will say one thing, I am VERY happy with my light weather it is or isn't 1400 lm.


----------



## Tachead

joelbnyc said:


> How long do preorders usually take to ship?
> 
> Waiting in US for a SC64c on 11/23 (order #103766XX), and a SC600w IV Plus on 11/27 (order #103768XX), under the impression that "preorders start shipping Nov 30th," like their site says. I figured a few days tops.
> 
> Do they practice just-in-time inventory/manufacturing or something? Like manufacturing in batches only after they have payment in hand from X number of orders? Or do they just have a very small number of people doing their pack and shipping?



There are between 800 and 1000 orders before you because you ordered almost a month after the preorders opened. The pre-orders just "start" shipping on the 30th. There are 10 new flashlight models and 10 new headlamp models plus all the other older models. They can only make lights so fast and likely make a set size of each model at a time so depending when you order you might have to wait for the second or even third batch. It will take a while before they get caught up as it sounds like they got more orders then expected. Pre-orders are always uncertain. You have to order an in stock item if you want fast shipping or a guaranteed delivery date. If you want a rough idea how much time you are looking at email ZL and they will give you an idea.


----------



## Tachead

TCY said:


> That's the sign of contacting them... they ship orders based on order#.


Yep, I will contact them if I don't get a shipping notice early next week. I don't want to be pushy as I know they are very busy. I am going to be patient for now. Plus, there has only been one report of an SC64c shipping so far.


----------



## joelbnyc

Tachead said:


> There are between 800 and 1000 orders before you because you ordered almost a month after the preorders opened. The pre-orders just "start" shipping on the 30th. There are 10 new flashlight models and 10 new headlamp models plus all the other older models. They can only make lights so fast and likely make a set size of each model at a time so depending when you order you might have to wait for the second or even third batch.



Thanks. I'm not hating on them. I can wait. 

But for a bunch of engineers, a script outputting an estimated ship date is trivial. Any decent undergrad CS or engineering student could bang it out in 20 minutes.

And I'm sure there is freely available open source code they could adapt if this would be too much effort. Then all they have to do is input a few variables for each light that comes out.

Under-promise, over-deliver.


----------



## Tachead

joelbnyc said:


> Thanks. I'm not hating on them. I can wait.
> 
> But for a bunch of engineers, a script outputting an estimated ship date is trivial. Any decent undergrad CS or engineering student could bang it out in 20 minutes.
> 
> Under-promise, over-deliver.



No problem:thumbsup:.

I agree with the under promise, over deliver mantra for sure but, I don't really think it applies here. 

It says that shipping "starts" on the 30th, not that all orders will ship on the 30th. They really have no idea how many orders they will receive for each model so, there is no way for them to estimate a shipping date for everyone who orders. In fact, they have no idea even how many of each model to make at first. A pre-order is always uncertain and I believe ZL is just giving people a rough idea when the first lights will begin to ship. Depending on when you order and how many people order before you, the time until shipping could/can vary greatly. It always works this way for pre-orders from my experience, not just with flashlights either. If you want to get your pre-order shipped close to the estimated shipping start date, you have to order right away when the pre-order opens, otherwise you may have to wait for later batches and/or for all the others in line in front of you to be served first.


----------



## Derek Dean

joelbnyc said:


> Thanks. I'm not hating on them. I can wait.
> 
> But for a bunch of engineers, a script outputting an estimated ship date is trivial. Any decent undergrad CS or engineering student could bang it out in 20 minutes.
> 
> And I'm sure there is freely available open source code they could adapt if this would be too much effort. Then all they have to do is input a few variables for each light that comes out.
> 
> Under-promise, over-deliver.


Hmmm......I got my shipping notice on Nov. 27, so they beat their original estimate by 3 days. 

I'll say this, Joel......first, this is typical for a ZL release, which is why folks who already have a ZL go out of their way to get on the pre-order list early, and second, if you're new to ZL lights, then you'll find out..... it's worth the wait : )


----------



## TCY

This is how ZL's manufacturing and shipping works:

ZL makes lights in very small quantities, batch after batch because of manufacturing difficulties. For example, ZL lights' housing are carved out of one bar of aluminium for maximum structural integrity and heat dissipation, which only a handful of the flashlight manufacturers do, but this costs A LOT MORE, is technically more difficult to do so and takes more time than your typical processes used by mainstream manufacturers. They do the anodisation process under better conditions e.g. sub-zero degree C environment, which requires some serious industrial grade air-con. This is the reason ZL ano is tougher than most of the "Type III mil grade hard ano" out there on the market.

Because of this, ZL can only meet a portion of the pre-orders initially, hence why people swarm in when ZL is about to accept pre-orders. Typically only those who pre-ordered on day 1,2 and 3 can get the first batch, and ZL will have to make batch number two, even three, to fill the leftover pre-orders.


----------



## vadimax

terjee said:


> I ordered this, and separately ordered an SC600Fc a few days later. Also want two headlamps, but given the price, that it’s my first time ordering from Zebralights directly, and that the ship dates for the headlamps is later, I figured those can wait.
> 
> Did you order anything else at the same time? My guess is that’d be the reason, if another item is delaying it. Or custom requests in order comments etc.



I don’t understand you, man... Don’t you trust eu.nkon.nl any more? They are Zebralight representatives in EU. And their service is perfect (at least for me) so far


----------



## joelbnyc

Tachead said:


> No problem:thumbsup:.
> 
> I agree with the under promise, over deliver mantra for sure but, I don't really think it applies here.
> 
> It says that shipping "starts" on the 30th, not that all orders will ship on the 30th. They really have no idea how many orders they will receive for each model so, there is no way for them to estimate a shipping date for everyone who orders. In fact, they have no idea even how many of each model to make at first. A pre-order is always uncertain and I believe ZL is just giving people a rough idea when the first lights will begin to ship. Depending on when you order and how many people order before you, the time until shipping could/can vary greatly. It always works this way for pre-orders from my experience, not just with flashlights either. If you want to get your pre-order shipped close to the estimated shipping start date, you have to order right away when the pre-order opens, otherwise you may have to wait for later batches and/or for all the others in line in front of you to be served first.



I realize they don't know how many orders they will get. From a coding standpoint, that doesn't matter though. It's just a variable with a value you can increment.

They could write a simple script and reuse it for each new light, that would for each order output on the checkout page an expected ship date, with adjustable values assigned to constants for orders needed for a new batch, and estimated turnaround time for each light they come out with. Not rocket science. They have to have some ballpark range worked out with their factories.

Or at least, add a qualifier to "preorder shipping starts Nov 30," to clarify that it could actually be several weeks or even months before you receive your order.

I guess if they changed some lights to "backordered," that's better than nothing. I still would have ordered, but these days customers kind of expect shipping estimates.



TCY said:


> ZL makes lights in very small quantities, batch after batch because of manufacturing difficulties. For example, ZL lights' housing are carved out of one bar of aluminium for maximum structural integrity and heat dissipation, which only a handful of the flashlight manufacturers do, but this costs A LOT MORE, is technically more difficult to do so and takes more time than your typical processes used by mainstream manufacturers. They do the anodisation process under better conditions e.g. sub-zero degree C environment, which requires some serious industrial grade air-con. This is the reason ZL ano is tougher than most of the "Type III mil grade hard ano" out there on the market.
> 
> Because of this, ZL can only meet a portion of the pre-orders initially, hence why people swarm in when ZL is about to accept pre-orders. Typically only those who pre-ordered on day 1,2 and 3 can get the first batch, and ZL will have to make batch number two, even three, to fill the leftover pre-orders.



I get that their manufacturing is in a class of its own, I definitely respect that. I'm guessing the founder(s) are electrical/mechanical engineers? Do they have professional profile somewhere? Must be an interesting story how these guys get into lights and start their own companies.

I'm psyched to have the lights in my hands, after hearing about them over the years


----------



## terjee

Tachead said:


> Plus, there has only been one report of an SC64c shipping so far.



Thinking about mine?

I have two orders and one RMA, so it’s entirely possible that it could be some other factor, maybe the picked mine early out of pity? ;-)

It also hasn’t had any tracking updates, so could be a clerical error as well. 



vadimax said:


> I don’t understand you, man... Don’t you trust eu.nkon.nl any more? They are Zebralight representatives in EU. And their service is perfect (at least for me) so far



Sure I trust them, I think I’ve run about 40 orders with them at this point, and they’re my #1 preferred dealer. They just hadn’t listed these lights when the preorder opened.

Their service has always been impeccable, often answering email far outside office hours, and they’re generally enjoyable to deal with. 

It’s likely that I’ll use them for the two headlamps I’ve got planned.


----------



## terjee

joelbnyc said:


> But for a bunch of engineers, a script outputting an estimated ship date is trivial. Any decent undergrad CS or engineering student could bang it out in 20 minutes.



As someone that does systems development for a living, I tend to strongly disagree with statements like these.

It seems trivial when you have no idea what you’re talking about, but then you dive in, and understand what makes the statement obviously false for this or that particular case.

(Just to be clear; I’m making up stuff below to illustrate a point, nothing implied about how anything is actually done)

Take Zebralight as an example, and the SC600-style body. It’s entirely possible that their production lines finishes SC600-styles lights one type at a time. Say in batches of 50 lights.

Then say you’ve gotten 110 orders for SC600Fc, and 40 for SC600Fd. You can satisfy both by making three batches of the Fc, and one of the Fd, so it’s all good.

In order to make as many customers happy as soon as possible though, you start by doing two batches of the SC600, then one of the Fd, and finally the last batch of Fc.

But what if it had been different? What if you’d gotten 110 orders for the Fd and 40 for the Fc? (Reversed counts). Then you’d probably make 2 Fd batches first instead, and the wait times would be flipped.

Yeah, you could make the system take order counts into the mix as they come in, but then you’re doing an integration with the web shop, and things start to grow.

You could have someone responsible at the factory update the system about readiness of various lights and ship out estimated shipping dates to people that have ordered already, but then you’re not only making a system, but also pulled resources for it. And so it goes.

Before you even get to any of this though, you’d have to start by defining what you want, and find someone to do it.

Yeah, these things can definitively be done, and would be nice to have, but “trivial” and “bang it out in 20 minutes” is usually missing the mark by a wide margin. 



joelbnyc said:


> Under-promise, over-deliver.



I agree in principle, but it could be argued that the principle applies in the other direction as well. If you start handing out expected shipping dates (even if you say estimated), peoples expectations will quickly adapt.

All of that said, I’ll concede the point that they could have updated the page a bit as said “new orders expected to ship” and a later date, or given “within 2 weeks” or some such, but I wouldn’t consider it a major issue.


----------



## TCY

joelbnyc said:


> I realize they don't know how many orders they will get. From a coding standpoint, that doesn't matter though. It's just a variable with a value you can increment.
> 
> They could write a simple script and reuse it for each new light, that would for each order output on the checkout page an expected ship date, with adjustable values assigned to constants for orders needed for a new batch, and estimated turnaround time for each light they come out with. Not rocket science. They have to have some ballpark range worked out with their factories.
> 
> Or at least, add a qualifier to "preorder shipping starts Nov 30," to clarify that it could actually be several weeks or even months before you receive your order.
> 
> I guess if they changed some lights to "backordered," that's better than nothing. I still would have ordered, but these days customers kind of expect shipping estimates.
> 
> 
> 
> I get that their manufacturing is in a class of its own, I definitely respect that. I'm guessing the founder(s) are electrical/mechanical engineers? Do they have professional profile somewhere? Must be an interesting story how these guys get into lights and start their own companies.
> 
> I'm psyched to have the lights in my hands, after hearing about them over the years



George, the owner of ZL, is a Chinese-American software engineer who moved to the states back in the 80s. AFAIK ZL was a hobby of his and eventually turned into a full time career.. don't remember where I read this. it might be just him doing the work or they have a dedicated R&D team, either way they know their stuff. 

You're gonna love it.


----------



## WebHobbit

Derek Dean said:


> Yep, the ZL UI is quite amazing in it's well thought out versatility, and the form factor of the SC64w is just perfect for an EDC work light.
> 
> I go back and forth between my SC62w and my SC600 series lights all the time. Of course the SC6x series is thinner, and practically disappears in the pocket, but the SC600 series light's extra mass let's me run at a higher level without getting hot as quickly as the smaller SC6x series, so as usual, it's a trade-off as to which one I decide to carry. Usually, I'll carry the SC62w if I have a day job that might go into the evening, and I'll carry the SC600 if I have a night job where I know I'll need the extra output.
> 
> I'll be interested to hear if, like many ZL users, you find the extreme LOW level outputs to be just as useful as the higher outputs. The ability to quickly and easily match the light level to whatever task is at hand is one of ZL's great strengths.
> 
> In any case, enjoy your new light.





Insofar as the low mode(s). I still really can't see any scenario where I would use it beyond an emergency "have to save this battery as there is a power-outage". I have seen the arguments about preserving night adapted vision and all that. I guess we just don't keep our house as dark at night as many of you. We have a couple of fairly bright night lights in place so there aren't many areas that are "cave dark" in our place EVER (unless we lose power). We also have three different lights that come on outside around the property at night so it's not pitch-black out there either until you walk away from the buildings toward the fields. So for me the SC64w's most used are (in order):

M-127 Lumens
H2 -875 Lumens
H1- 1400 Lumens


----------



## niraya

WebHobbit said:


> Insofar as the low mode(s). I still really can't see any scenario where I would use it beyond an emergency "have to save this battery as there is a power-outage". I have seen the arguments about preserving night adapted vision and all that. I guess we just don't keep our house as dark at night as many of you. We have a couple of fairly bright night lights in place so there aren't many areas that are "cave dark" in our place EVER (unless we lose power). We also have three different lights that come on outside around the property at night so it's not pitch-black out there either until you walk away from the buildings toward the fields. So for me the SC64w's most used are (in order):
> 
> M-127 Lumens
> H2 -875 Lumens
> H1- 1400 Lumens



Where I live. it is pitch totally dark at night, you can't see your hand waving in front of your face, and any light above 0.5 lumen is painfully blinding when turned on in the middle of night. Zebralight headlamps and Armytek Wizard Pro at lowest settings are perfect and totally sufficient to move inside an, around house.


----------



## SubLGT

Glock27 said:


> w00T! SC64w landed! Only 2 noticeable changes. Now 5 pogo pins in head instead of the 62s' 3. New style blackened clip….



How is the tint on your sample?


----------



## eh4

For an all night work light I think 60+/- lumens for 8.5 hours (H52 and H53) or 30 hours (H600 models) is hard to beat. 
I find myself setting the L and M to their highest settings, and the H to the lower 4 hour setting to be about perfect for most uses... the L gets swapped to its second lowest mode and the M to its lowest mode for dark adapted use, and H only gets popped up to its highest level in daylight, or occasionally to light up a larger area at night. 
I'm looking forward to the MK IV for its being able to supply a high CRI "c" model that beats my MK II "w" in brightness, but I'm not sure if messing with G6 and G7 programming will be easier with 5, 6, and 7 clicks than just swapping the L and M settings when needed.


----------



## noboneshotdog

eh4 said:


> For an all night work light I think 60+/- lumens for 8.5 hours (H52 and H53) or 30 hours (H600 models) is hard to beat.
> I find myself setting the L and M to their highest settings, and the H to the lower 4 hour setting to be about perfect for most uses... the L gets swapped to its second lowest mode and the M to its lowest mode for dark adapted use, and H only gets popped up to its highest level in daylight, or occasionally to light up a larger area at night.
> I'm looking forward to the MK IV for its being able to supply a high CRI "c" model that beats my MK II "w" in brightness, but I'm not sure if messing with G6 and G7 programming will be easier with 5, 6, and 7 clicks than just swapping the L and M settings when needed.



Swapping between G5 G6 AND G7 is super easy. You will love it!


----------



## tompen41

Where are the run times for most of the new lights? Especially the SC64w. I see the SC600w lV but is this normal for ZL to be this late bringing out the specs for new lights?


----------



## Dio

tompen41 said:


> Where are the run times for most of the new lights? Especially the SC64w. I see the SC600w lV but is this normal for ZL to be this late bringing out the specs for new lights?



That is a little worrying for a potential buyer I suppose but for a ZL fan it really wont bother them too much.

I like the fact that they aren't just posting BS numbers; they are likely just waiting on accurate lab results..


----------



## Glock27

I’m afraid we will experience slow fulfillment of orders for a while for a couple reasons. 


An unprecedented number of new models released at the same time.
Chinese New Year. I don’t think much gets built or shipped in China during this festival. Delays in manufacturing and shipping will compound.


G27


----------



## Bob_McBob

They're so backlogged it's going to take them more than two months to ship pre-orders?


----------



## Tachead

Bob_McBob said:


> They're so backlogged it's going to take them more than two months to ship pre-orders?


I would guess yes. They are still not even close to done shipping all the new flashlight models and they still have 10 new headlamp models to go after that. Then there is regular orders(older models) to fulfill as well. They are going to be busy for a while.


----------



## ven

All be it frustrating, its worth the wait for one of the best lights under $100 on the planet, couple of weeks, month.................worth it! Or do what i do, just dont order straight off, wait for stock more local. Yep its painful, but its not like i dont have a ZL or 2 to keep me illuminated.


----------



## Glock27

I'm OK with the wait, I have plenty of Zebra's in my herd to tide me over. I just hope they revisit putting a Yugo clip on a Lamborghini! 

G27


----------



## ven

Which clip is the issue? I have the black clip on an sc5c mkII and the chrome like clips on my others. Retention seems a bit strong on the black clip i have, not sure which i prefer as the chrome is a little blingy. My clips just tend to be an anti roll more than anything though, hardly ever use them.


----------



## Glock27

The new black clip is much harder to both deploy and re-pocket. The "pinch point" where it puts pressure on the pocket material is too close to a rib and the angle the tip is at makes clipping back in pocket much harder. The increased width and thickness also makes the SC64 feel chunkier
Zebralight has gone to great lengths to make the SC series the lightest and smallest in class. The new clip fails in this respect.
I think the old style clip was perfection. I would be real happy with a Black DLC coated old style one for new lights.

G27


----------



## ven

Right got you, are they similar to these
*




*


Does not sit well on the sc5c mkII, notice the angle it rests on.





Very tight, super strong even!


----------



## NPL

Runtimes for sc600w Mk4 HI have been posted, and light does not seem to be that much more efficient thank mk3. PID runtimes aside, the runtimes increase is minimal. Looks like with the MK4 you'll get more of a turbo H1 but it will most likely step down faster thank the MK3. Also noticed the MK3 can provide a higher constant lumen on its highest non regulated mode.


----------



## 18650

Has it been confirmed the new SC600Fd uses the old XHP50 as opposed to the XHP50.2 of the other new daylight models?


----------



## insanefred

NPL said:


> Runtimes for sc600w Mk4 HI have been posted, and light does not seem to be that much more efficient thank mk3. PID runtimes aside, the runtimes increase is minimal. Looks like with the MK4 you'll get more of a turbo H1 but it will most likely step down faster thank the MK3. Also noticed the MK3 can provide a higher constant lumen on its highest non regulated mode.



Yeah they look pretty much the same. If you ignore the far better lumen spacing, higher H1 mode and a more programmable UI. Did I mention the better lumen spacing?

Oh and I just got my sc600w 4 hi. I originally had the plus ordered but was told there would be a three week wait. So I canceled it and got the Hi instead. I will re-order the plus later this month.


----------



## NPL

insanefred said:


> Yeah they look pretty much the same. If you ignore the far better lumen spacing, higher H1 mode and a more programmable UI. Did I mention the better lumen spacing?
> 
> Oh and I just got my sc600w 4 hi. I originally had the plus ordered but was told there would be a three week wait. So I canceled it and got the Hi instead. I will re-order the plus later this month.


Yup, lumen spacing for highest medium is Def improved. I just recall claims that newer models are way more efficient hence the higher lumens, but reality is that they are mostly pushing more current to the LED to get higher output, and it's really not about efficiency.


----------



## Tachead

NPL said:


> Yup, lumen spacing for highest medium is Def improved. I just recall claims that newer models are way more efficient hence the higher lumens, but reality is that they are mostly pushing more current to the LED to get higher output, and it's really not about efficiency.



I am not sure how to calculate efficacy but, the MKIV seems like it is a fair amount more efficient. If you compare the highest non-PID modes the MKIII HI is about 15% brighter but gets 1:18min or about 23% less runtime then the MKIV. Maybe someone can chime in that knows more about this kind of thing?


----------



## NPL

Mk3 does 312lm/4.3 hrs, or 139lm/12hrs.
Mk4 does 264lm/5.6hrs or 127lm/13.6hrs. 

Not entirely sure on how to compare them with exact science, but efficiency seems almost the same to me... definitely not significant to justify the highest H1 setting being increased solely by driver efficiency. The report so far that the MK4 heats up quicker and gets hotter makes sense to me.


----------



## LogicalBeard

Tachead said:


> I am not sure how to calculate efficacy but, the MKIV seems like it is a fair amount more efficient. If you compare the highest non-PID modes the MKIII HI is about 15% brighter but gets 1:18min or about 23% less runtime then the MKIV. Maybe someone can chime in that knows more about this kind of thing?




I use Anthony Sculimbrene’s method; total lumes output. I call it Lumen minutes. You multiply the output by the hours and then by 60. For example, if you get 100 lumens for 15 hours. 100 times 15 times 60.


----------



## Tachead

NPL said:


> Mk3 does 312lm/4.3 hrs, or 139lm/12hrs.
> Mk4 does 264lm/5.6hrs or 127lm/13.6hrs.
> 
> Not entirely sure on how to compare them with exact science, but efficiency seems almost the same to me... definitely not significant to justify the highest H1 setting being increased solely by driver efficiency. The report so far that the MK4 heats up quicker and gets hotter makes sense to me.



Here are the calculations using LogicalBeard's formula...

MKIII - 312 x 4.3 x 60 = *80486*

MKIV - 264 x 5.6 x 60 = *88704

*80486/88704 = approximately *9.3% higher efficiency*.

The MKIV is clealy quite a bit more efficient. 

Now, the new HI's clearly have a problem as multiple people have reported their new MKIV's are less bright then their MKIII's so, I don't think they are a great example to use as comparison until ZL fixes the issue. 

Tompen41 compared his new SC64w to his SC63w and says that it is significantly brighter on H1 and takes 30-45 seconds longer to get as hot which indicates better efficiency. 

It should also be pointed out that ZL has said that they upgraded certain electrical components on the new MKIV's.

Either way, we will know more once more get into the hands of people to run tests on. I have a high end data logging light meter and a ligthbox setup but, I don't have any MKIII's to compare. I can do some testing on my lights when they get here though.


----------



## Tachead

LogicalBeard said:


> I use Anthony Sculimbrene’s method; total lumes output. I call it Lumen minutes. You multiply the output by the hours and then by 60. For example, if you get 100 lumens for 15 hours. 100 times 15 times 60.




Thanks:thumbsup:


----------



## NPL

Tachead said:


> Thanks:thumbsup:




Anthony Sculimbrenes method only works or can be applied to two equivalent lumen values because the output of an LED is not linear, but curved. As an LED is driven harder to emit more lumens, the efficiency or Lumen/Watt drops significantly. 

For example, the MK3 at 61 lumens runs for 33 hours... so that would give us 61 x 33 x 60 = 120780, which is higher than the values you calculated in your post for both the MK3 and MK4. The output of the MK4 at 264 lumens will definitely be more efficient than the MK3 or MK4 running at 312 lumens.

For a more even comparison, it would be best to choose lumen values that are as close as possible, and at lower outputs where the output of the LED is more linear:
MK3: 61 lumens x 33 hours x 60 = 120780
MK4: 56.4 lumens x 36 hours x 60 = 121824

The efficiency upgrade from MK3 to MK4 based on more comparable values is 0.86% more efficient.


----------



## LogicalBeard

NPL said:


> Anthony Sculimbrenes method only works or can be applied to two equivalent lumen values because the output of an LED is not linear, but curved. As an LED is driven harder to emit more lumens, the efficiency or Lumen/Watt drops significantly.
> 
> For example, the MK3 at 61 lumens runs for 33 hours... so that would give us 61 x 33 x 60 = 120780, which is higher than the values you calculated in your post for both the MK3 and MK4. The output of the MK4 at 264 lumens will definitely be more efficient than the MK3 or MK4 running at 312 lumens.
> 
> For a more even comparison, it would be best to choose lumen values that are as close as possible, and at lower outputs where the output of the LED is more linear:
> MK3: 61 lumens x 33 hours x 60 = 120780
> MK4: 56.4 lumens x 36 hours x 60 = 121824
> 
> The efficiency upgrade from MK3 to MK4 based on more comparable values is 0.86% more efficient.



It applies to lights with regulated output. I agree you should compare similar outputs though. You probably know this but as you get into low lumen outputs, like moonlight, lights become less efficient in lumens per minute.


----------



## Tachead

I wouldn't put too much faith in ZL specs anyway guys. For starters, the lower output ratings are likely extrapolations or estimates as I highly doubt they had time to run these newly manufactured lights for several days or months. Also, there are multiple mistakes. The SC600, 600w, and 600w HI all list the same output and runtimes for instance. That is not possible as the HI emitters output about 15% less lumens at the same current as their HD variants and warmer CCT emitters also output less lumens at the same current. So, they all should have different runtimes or outputs.

We need to wait until these lights get into more people hands to run comparative testing. I will say that some of the comparative observations like Tompen41's of the SC64w vs SC63w sound promising. 

I think it is also important to note that we are already at such a high level of efficiency with these lights that a little increase, or not, really doesn't matter much for real world use. It should also be noted that ZL never drives the emitters in their lights beyond the manufacturers specifications so any increase in drive current that may or may not have been made is not harmful in any way.


----------



## NPL

I don't think the new mk4's will be harmful as you mention, but I do think the compromise will be in runtimes and faster step downs. My guess is the MK4 will start off brighter but step down below the mk3 which will sustain more lumens longer as it's not being driven as hard. I think alot will depend on user preference. Some prefer crazy turbos, while others longer lasting highs. I like both


----------



## axd

Hello all,

Evrey time I navigate to zebralight.com I get a 
[h=2]403 - Forbidden: Access is denied.[/h]
Does anyone know if this usual? Judging from other activity on CPF, as well as from http://www.isitdownrightnow.com/zebralight.com.html, the site seems to be normal.

I have been complaining to ZL about what I consider questionable ZL claims (see https://github.com/axd1967/502pr) and it looks like my IP adress has been blocked, because I cannot access the case number that I opened at ZL. But I can be mistaken.

thx


----------



## Glock27

Their site loads fine for me here. Haven't had any problem accessing it everyday.
Your isp might be on a blacklist which takes a while to clear.

G27


----------



## axd

Glock27 said:


> Their site loads fine for me here. Haven't had any problem accessing it everyday.
> Your isp might be on a blacklist which takes a while to clear.
> 
> G27



Just to be sure - _who_ would be blacklisting my ISP? ZL?


----------



## Glock27

It wouldn't be Zebralight blocking you, but their isp blocking your isp. One guy in our school district somehow managed to get our isp on a blacklist and it took over a week for it to be lifted. He got a big talking to...
Have you tried logging in to your account from another location?

G27


----------



## Bob_McBob

The non-Plus SC600 models are all in stock now, but SC600 Plus and SC64 models have switched to back ordered.


----------



## axd

meanwhile I tried their customer email, and guess what? I get a 

 452 <[email protected]> Mailbox size limit exceeded


----------



## evil_twin

Hey. Yesterday received sc64c. Everything is fine, but the button is not centered.


----------



## vadimax

ven said:


> Right got you, are they similar to these
> *
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *
> 
> 
> Does not sit well on the sc5c mkII, notice the angle it rests on.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Very tight, super strong even!



I have replaced it with an older one:






A bit less tight and visually more attractive to me.


----------



## ven

I have a spare bling clip Vad, somewhere in my parts bin! Might do a swap, but i only have 1 clip and 2 potential AA lights.....................decisions decisions :thinking:


----------



## vadimax

ven said:


> I have a spare bling clip Vad, somewhere in my parts bin! Might do a swap, but i only have 1 clip and 2 potential AA lights.....................decisions decisions :thinking:



I see no problem here: https://eu.nkon.nl/flashlights/zebralight-flashlights-79/sc-clip-with-screws.html


----------



## Glock27

axd said:


> meanwhile I tried their customer email, and guess what? I get a
> 
> 452 <[email protected]> Mailbox size limit exceeded




Only way I talk to them is through: https://zebralight.3dcartstores.com/crm.asp?action=contactus 
Log into your account, send them a message and they'll contact you.
I don't think sending emails works anymore. <[email protected]>
Please squawk about that on the contact us entry!

G27


----------



## ven

vadimax said:


> I see no problem here: https://eu.nkon.nl/flashlights/zebralight-flashlights-79/sc-clip-with-screws.html



:laughing: :thumbsup:


----------



## markr6

I took my SC600w IV HI backpacking and noticed when I clicked it once for high, it would turn on for about 1/2 second then turn off. When I turned it back on, it worked fine. It did this every time. Fully charged NCR18650GA.

Other modes it started and stayed on, M1 for instance.

It wasn't that cold, certainly not as cold as when I took my MK III out on other trips last winter. 28° the first night and still malfunctioning into the next day around 45°.

On a related note, my H600w worked fine, even when starting on H1. And last year, even when it was acting up in the cold (7°F), it would step down...not turn off completely. So I don't know what's going on.


----------



## Outdoorsman5

markr6 said:


> I took my SC600w IV HI backpacking and noticed when I clicked it once for high, it would turn on for about 1/2 second then turn off. When I turned it back on, it worked fine. It did this every time. Fully charged NCR18650GA.
> 
> Other modes it started and stayed on, M1 for instance.
> 
> It wasn't that cold, certainly not as cold as when I took my MK III out on other trips last winter. 28° the first night and still malfunctioning into the next day around 45°.
> 
> On a related note, my H600w worked fine, even when starting on H1. And last year, even when it was acting up in the cold (7°F), it would step down...not turn off completely. So I don't know what's going on.



Hey markr, my SC600w mk III HI did that exact same thing. I sent it back to ZL in May, but when I got it back it was still doing it. Because I had a few camping & backpacking trips and love the light so much, I didnt send it back until recently. I requested they replace the light but got a msg from them last week saying they couldnt duplicate the problem & were sending it back to me with a bunch of new batteries. I messaged them back asking them to spend more time with light until it happened and that I had 6 perfectly good batteries - it was not a battery issue. I asked them again to replace the light. I havent heard back yet but have always had good experiences with them. If I were you I would EXCHANGE that light. 

Markr, since you recommended this light to me a year ago, it has become the greatest handheld light Ive ever used (barring the glitch). I love it combined with my floody headlight (either H600w or H52w). The throw of it is sooooo impressive for its size. The new UI of the mk IV is AWESOME!! Love the flexibility of the new G6 & G7 modes. 

On another thread I complained that my new mkIV HI was malfunctioning but I fixed it. I was hoping I wouldnt be without it too. I just cleaned the threads and no more problems (the head wasnt tightening down far enough, but after removing some grit on the threads it worked just fine.)

Hope you get yours worked out soon.


----------



## axd

Glock27 said:


> Only way I talk to them is through: https://zebralight.3dcartstores.com/crm.asp?action=contactus
> Log into your account, send them a message and they'll contact you.
> I don't think sending emails works anymore. <[email protected]>
> Please squawk about that on the contact us entry!
> 
> G27




That was the way I tried, that's how I discovered the issue: I (still) get a 403 Forbidden Access :-(

In other words, I am unable to reach out to ZL, and this is beginning to smell. (And I cannot believe my ISP is an issue, it's one of the biggest in the country.)


----------



## Tachead

axd said:


> That was the way I tried, that's how I discovered the issue: I (still) get a 403 Forbidden Access :-(
> 
> In other words, I am unable to reach out to ZL, and this is beginning to smell. (And I cannot believe my ISP is an issue, it's one of the biggest in the country.)


Maybe you should contact your ISP. None of us have any trouble contacting ZL. They are always very nice and quick to reply to me. Not sure what is going on but, there is nothing any of us can do for you.


----------



## markr6

Outdoorsman5 said:


> Hey markr, my SC600w mk III HI did that exact same thing. I sent it back to ZL in May, but when I got it back it was still doing it. Because I had a few camping & backpacking trips and love the light so much, I didnt send it back until recently. I requested they replace the light but got a msg from them last week saying they couldnt duplicate the problem & were sending it back to me with a bunch of new batteries. I messaged them back asking them to spend more time with light until it happened and that I had 6 perfectly good batteries - it was not a battery issue. I asked them again to replace the light. I havent heard back yet but have always had good experiences with them. If I were you I would EXCHANGE that light.
> 
> Markr, since you recommended this light to me a year ago, it has become the greatest handheld light Ive ever used (barring the glitch). I love it combined with my floody headlight (either H600w or H52w). The throw of it is sooooo impressive for its size. The new UI of the mk IV is AWESOME!! Love the flexibility of the new G6 & G7 modes.
> 
> On another thread I complained that my new mkIV HI was malfunctioning but I fixed it. I was hoping I wouldnt be without it too. I just cleaned the threads and no more problems (the head wasnt tightening down far enough, but after removing some grit on the threads it worked just fine.)
> 
> Hope you get yours worked out soon.



Thanks. I'll give mine a cleaning to see what happens. It only happens in the cold, so I won't get my hopes up. I'll switch the battery too, but it's never been a problem with the MK III.


----------



## Bob_McBob

I got a shipping notice for a combined SC600w HI IV and SC64c order yesterday, so they are moving along with pre-orders. Not sure if it was actually shipped yet because the tracking still shows no data 24 hours later.


----------



## Tachead

I just received my SC600w MKIV Plus and SC64c pre-order.


----------



## Derek Dean

Tachead said:


> I just received my SC600w MKIV Plus and SC64c pre-order.


I'll be interested in your thoughts on both.


----------



## noboneshotdog

Tachead said:


> I just received my SC600w MKIV Plus and SC64c pre-order.



Yup. You are the one we have all been waiting for. Pour on the info thick. I'm curious about output of IV HI. Also if pid is set much higher than past HI lights. Mine doesn't seem to step down much at all when on high. But, Im actually happy about this.


----------



## NPL

Tachead said:


> I just received my SC600w MKIV Plus and SC64c pre-order.


Sweet, looking forward to your feedback. Did you get hit with custom duties or brokerage fees receiving them in Canada?


----------



## Tachead

I will post my first impressions in each models threads guys:thumbsup:.

NPL - I went with DHL to get them fast so yes, I did(you always do with DHL). My last ZL order I just went with the standard EMS and did`t have to pay any additional fees.


----------



## Tachead

Here they are...


----------



## Mattz68

Sweet looking flashlights! God...Zebralight has come along way in aesthetics, while retaining their original style. My 1st Zebralight (SC60) was kinda of an ugly duckling. It reminds me of Subaru in the automotive world...a distinctive style that not everyone finds appealing, but grows on you if you like simple and understated.


----------



## marinemaster

Tachead said:


> Here they are...



These pictures are gorgeous [emoji106]
It reminds me of a gun metal color Surefire I once had.....


----------



## ven

Congrats Tachead, i guess the sc64c will become your EDC. So tiny/compact, awesome UI and plenty of hi cri brightness.................what more could one ask


----------



## WebHobbit

I guess my journey to the ZL side is nearly complete (still waiting for my SC600w IV Plus to ship). I love the ZebraLights so much I'm not sure I NEED/WANT any other brands! Other than my Malkoff Hound Dog 18650s ZL has all my needs covered. 

From left to right:

SC53w (AA), H53C (AA), SC64w (18650)






full size:

https://lrpctech.files.wordpress.com/2017/12/03-zl.jpg

I'm not a head-band user but I got the H53 because I figured the right angle light would be ideal for when I work inside computer cases...or under desks...or under sinks, etc. The SC64w is my constant EDC. The SC53w is my backup EDC that normally rides in my "car bag". I use Lithium AA primaries in the 53s.


----------



## markr6

^ BLACK!! or is that just the lighting?

How's your SC64w tint?


----------



## likethevegetable

WebHobbit said:


> I use Lithium AA primaries in the 53s.



I recently found 4x 4pc L91 Lithium AA for $16CAD at a grocery store so I bought 48 of them at $1/pc. They make the H53c super lightweight and give me more confidence for those -30°C days.


----------



## WebHobbit

markr6 said:


> ^ BLACK!! or is that just the lighting?
> 
> How's your SC64w tint?





Not black....dark green HA. LOVE that color! I wouldn't mind having a vehicle this color!

I love the tint on all 3!


----------



## holygeez03

The almost completely knurled SC600 body and cap is uglier than their other lights in my opinion. I wish they looked a little more like the SC64... but I am still looking forward to mine showing up in the mail.


----------



## lampeDépêche

As tiny as the SC53 is, the H53 is just a little bit smaller! And with same emitter, reflector, outputs, etc. 

That's part of why the H53 is my never-leave-home-without-it light.

The knurling on the SC600 does not offend me esthetically, but à chacun son gout. What is true for everyone is that it not only improves grip, but also increases surface area, which then increases heat dispersion. So it's another heat-management tool, among other things.


----------



## anthon87

I also have a H53w, received last week. It's a Little piece of jewelry!

Now waiting for my SC600w HI IV, it should arrive in less than two weeks


----------



## markr6

Got a response from ZL about my SC600w IV HI turning off in the cold.

_Try it with a new NCR18650GA to see if that's the case. The Mk IV version is driven slightly harder than the Mk III. Any resistance in the current loop from electrical contacts or increased battery's internal resistance after repeated charging and discharging may affect the performance, especially in low temperature.

_I think I have two new cells in storage, plus I'll clean the threads to see if that helps. I'm still surprised it turns off instead of stepping down like my H600w once did in the cold.


----------



## Tachead

marinemaster said:


> These pictures are gorgeous [emoji106]
> It reminds me of a gun metal color Surefire I once had.....



Thanks man:thumbsup:. They are a touch blurry as I just took them quick and the lighting was low. Maybe I will try to get some even better ones later.

I like the colour too:rock:.


----------



## Tachead

ven said:


> Congrats Tachead, i guess the sc64c will become your EDC. So tiny/compact, awesome UI and plenty of hi cri brightness.................what more could one ask




Thanks Ven:thumbsup:. 

I will likely alternate between the two for EDC. They are both way smaller then I thought. Pictures on the internet really don`t convey the size I realize now that I have them in hand. 

You should give one of these SC600 series lights a try Ven. They are still amazingly small and honestly offer a better hand feel and added grip over the SC63/64 imo. They are still great EDC lights imo. I am thinking about adding a HI to the stable as well for when I need a bit more punch and the nice consistent beam the HI emitters give.


----------



## Tachead

WebHobbit said:


> I guess my journey to the ZL side is nearly complete (still waiting for my SC600w IV Plus to ship). I love the ZebraLights so much I'm not sure I NEED/WANT any other brands! Other than my Malkoff Hound Dog 18650s ZL has all my needs covered.
> 
> From left to right:
> 
> SC53w (AA), H53C (AA), SC64w (18650)
> 
> full size:
> 
> https://lrpctech.files.wordpress.com/2017/12/03-zl.jpg
> 
> I'm not a head-band user but I got the H53 because I figured the right angle light would be ideal for when I work inside computer cases...or under desks...or under sinks, etc. The SC64w is my constant EDC. The SC53w is my backup EDC that normally rides in my "car bag". I use Lithium AA primaries in the 53s.



Yeah, Zebralight's are definitely addicting. I have sold most of my other lights now. IMO they make the best headlamps and EDC lights in the industry. I think a persons lighting needs would be well taken care of with a ZL headlamp, a ZL EDC light or two, a couple of Malkoff's or Elzetta's, and a Surefire X300U or Streamlight TLR.

Nice pictures by the way:thumbsup:.


----------



## ven

Love the line up pic WebHobbit, i have the sc53w myself and prefer the 4500k to the 4000k hi cri flavour of the xp-l2(subjective). Its such a tiny little thing.................. Glad your enjoying ZL as a whole, imo they are certainly the manufacturer that has my most interest right now. Also the sc63w 4500k of xhp35 awesomeness , damn thats a nice beam and tint! So bright and powerful, such refined step downs that make it very hard to tell its stepping down till its actually done. Another thing i love is how compact it is, just ridiculous and pretty much makes 16340 lights redundant(smaller than some with 5x the fuel tank). Luckily i love my 16340 lights and being a flashaholic its all good, but for some who just need a few lights , zebralight are a must imho. Also the dark ano is one of my fav's, the HA of surefire and ZL's dark green are my top ano picks!


----------



## Tachead

holygeez03 said:


> The almost completely knurled SC600 body and cap is uglier than their other lights in my opinion. I wish they looked a little more like the SC64... but I am still looking forward to mine showing up in the mail.



Honestly, I think the SC600 series feels much better in the hand and offers better grip. I do like the crazy tininess the SC64 offers though.


----------



## ven

Tachead said:


> Thanks Ven:thumbsup:.
> 
> I will likely alternate between the two for EDC. They are both way smaller then I thought. Pictures on the internet really don`t convey the size I realize now that I have them in hand.
> 
> You should give one of these SC600 series lights a try Ven. They are still amazingly small and honestly offer a better hand feel and added grip over the SC63/64 imo. They are still great EDC lights imo. I am thinking about adding a HI to the stable as well for when I need a bit more punch and the nice consistent beam the HI emitters give.




Yes i thought the same(i thought you had zebralight for some reason, unless it was just headlamp/s). They are crazy compact, i dont have a 600 yet but its going to happen and more than likely be the xhp50.2. Also it will be reflector based, i dont really think i need a flood lens as the reflector lights are floody enough, yet the large soft hotspot just helps focus on a subject. I like pure flood, but i also like to focus at times , just makes certain applications easier to deal with(see basically). So yes, sc600 will be in my future at some point................also tempted with the sc64c as well(no point in me getting the sc64w having the sc63w, even with the old UI i am happy enough)


----------



## Tachead

ven said:


> Yes i thought the same(i thought you had zebralight for some reason, unless it was just headlamp/s). They are crazy compact, i dont have a 600 yet but its going to happen and more than likely be the xhp50.2. Also it will be reflector based, i dont really think i need a flood lens as the reflector lights are floody enough, yet the large soft hotspot just helps focus on a subject. I like pure flood, but i also like to focus at times , just makes certain applications easier to deal with(see basically). So yes, sc600 will be in my future at some point................also tempted with the sc64c as well(no point in me getting the sc64w having the sc63w, even with the old UI i am happy enough)



Yeah, I just had 3 of their headlamps up until now. These are my first ZL flashlights. I have wanted one for a while but, waited so long because I was strongly apposed to the new pogo pin design. But, now that they changed it to prevent cell terminal denting, I decided I would dive in and I am happy I did.

I prefer reflector based clear lens lights as well. I use a headlamp for floody or full flood applications. I will say, the new frosted lens 4000K Fc Plus is tempting though. I am going to post my initial impressions with the Plus(XHP50.2) in it's thread if you are interested. I really like it too so far. The only negative thing I can say about it thus far is again, it's tint consistency across the beam. But, I am sure you already knew that as it is a trait of these new fully phosphor coated Cree's.


----------



## ven

Very cool, yep always interested in comments/feedback on these ZL's. I think the lens coatings dont help the tint much either, these can throw some crazy in the beam. My sc63w is quite nice, little rosy in the 4500k beam. But the xp-l2 i am not too sure on yet, the 4500k i like, 4000k can be ok at times. Just a bit too much yellow for me, colours look nice which is the important thing. The xhp50.2 i dont have experience with, but can imagine the tint lottery will come into play...............again! I am willing to take a chance anyway .


----------



## Tachead

A little XHP50.2 reflector cell phone macros for you guys...


----------



## ven

:naughty:


----------



## PieDemon

I'm curious about the pogo pin arrangement near the head in the mk4 variants with XHP35 emitters (either hi or regular) due to positive battery terminal denting potential when dropped.

I've got a sc63w, sc600w III HI and sc600Fd III Plus. The sc600w III HI was one of the early ones in that series probably, I ordered it not long after they became available and the sc600Fd III Plus definitely came a lot later.
What I have noticed in sc63w and sc600w III HI is that there's a triangle in the middle on the head side which has dented one of my batteries during a mishap, in the sc63w this is fine as the springs still force a good contact. However in the newer and sc600Fd I noticed its a ring of 6 pogo pins avoiding a lot of pressure in the middle which caused the dent in my sc63w battery, I'm curious if this is a deliberate design shift and standard in all later mk3/current mk4 sc600 designs or if it was to lower resistance for better high current handling in the XHP50 models.

Not so concerned about it for my own use as I only regularly use my sc63w these days and I'm fine with that (although the thought of a sc64w and/or sc64c is beyond tempting with the new mode group UI). Its more that I know someone who did get an early sc600w mk3 and because it uses pogo pins in the back and front dented batteries after dropping have for him caused intermittent contact issues turning the flashlight off. If this issue is fixed in the sc600 mk4 series that news might be of use to him.


----------



## Outdoorsman5

markr6 said:


> Got a response from ZL about my SC600w IV HI turning off in the cold.
> 
> _Try it with a new NCR18650GA to see if that's the case. The Mk IV version is driven slightly harder than the Mk III. Any resistance in the current loop from electrical contacts or increased battery's internal resistance after repeated charging and discharging may affect the performance, especially in low temperature.
> 
> _I think I have two new cells in storage, plus I'll clean the threads to see if that helps. I'm still surprised it turns off instead of stepping down like my H600w once did in the cold.



Hey Markr6, 
I got a similar request from ZL on my Mk III HI that behaved like yours. I cleaned it & changed batteries & nothing I could do fixed the problem. I actually lived with the problem for about 10 months. I sent it back to them in May, but when it came back to me it was still behaving the same way. I am now waiting on them to REPLACE the light rather than trying to fix it again. If you can't get it running 100% then I'd ask them to replace it. 

My new SC600w Mk IV HI had a different & temporary problem. The threads were so gritty that the tailcap wasn't able to tighten all the way. Once I cleaned them that problem was fixed. Hopefully you can get yours running 100% without returning it to ZL.


----------



## Tachead

PieDemon said:


> I'm curious about the pogo pin arrangement near the head in the mk4 variants with XHP35 emitters (either hi or regular) due to positive battery terminal denting potential when dropped.
> 
> I've got a sc63w, sc600w III HI and sc600Fd III Plus. The sc600w III HI was one of the early ones in that series probably, I ordered it not long after they became available and the sc600Fd III Plus definitely came a lot later.
> What I have noticed in sc63w and sc600w III HI is that there's a triangle in the middle on the head side which has dented one of my batteries during a mishap, in the sc63w this is fine as the springs still force a good contact. However in the newer and sc600Fd I noticed its a ring of 6 pogo pins avoiding a lot of pressure in the middle which caused the dent in my sc63w battery, I'm curious if this is a deliberate design shift and standard in all later mk3/current mk4 sc600 designs or if it was to lower resistance for better high current handling in the XHP50 models.
> 
> Not so concerned about it for my own use as I only regularly use my sc63w these days and I'm fine with that (although the thought of a sc64w and/or sc64c is beyond tempting with the new mode group UI). Its more that I know someone who did get an early sc600w mk3 and because it uses pogo pins in the back and front dented batteries after dropping have for him caused intermittent contact issues turning the flashlight off. If this issue is fixed in the sc600 mk4 series that news might be of use to him.



Yes, the design change should help prevent the denting issue. Now the force is dispersed between more pins and is concentrated around the perimeter of the positive terminal instead of the weaker center.

ZL is always refining their designs and that is one of the things that is great about them.


----------



## PieDemon

Tachead said:


> Yes, the design change should help prevent the denting issue. Now the force is dispersed between more pins and is concentrated around the perimeter of the positive terminal instead of the weaker center.
> 
> ZL is always refining their designs and that is one of the things that is great about them.



That force dispersion is exactly why I was informing about it, do you know if its in the general design for current sc600 mk4 variants or if it only applies to the high current ones. Logically I'd expect it to be for all models as less body variations about would make logistic sense and less dented batteries results in more happier users. But I could also understand the reasoning that 3 pogo pins is enough to handle XHP35 currents and for XHP50 models the ring of 6 is used.

And I guess in hindsight by extension I'm also interested in what arrangement the new sc64 body uses! Is it still like the sc63 with a spring at the tail? And how many pogo pins (and in what arrangement) on the head side internally? No current plans to order one anytime soon, but I thought like that when I had a sc62w and the sc63w came along. I'm sure eventually I'll give in at some point in the future.


----------



## Tachead

PieDemon said:


> That force dispersion is exactly why I was informing about it, do you know if its in the general design for current sc600 mk4 variants or if it only applies to the high current ones. Logically I'd expect it to be for all models as less body variations about would make logistic sense and less dented batteries results in more happier users. But I could also understand the reasoning that 3 pogo pins is enough to handle XHP35 currents and for XHP50 models the ring of 6 is used.
> 
> And I guess in hindsight by extension I'm also interested in what arrangement the new sc64 body uses! Is it still like the sc63 with a spring at the tail? And how many pogo pins (and in what arrangement) on the head side internally? No current plans to order one anytime soon, but I thought like that when I had a sc62w and the sc63w came along. I'm sure eventually I'll give in at some point in the future.



As far as I know all new models(SC64 variants and SC600 variants) use the new pogo pin designs(some are not out yet though but, I assume they will be the same). The SC600 variants with XHP50/50.2 use 6 pogo pins at both the positive and negative end and the XHP35 variants use 5 pogo pins at both ends. The SC64 variants use 5 pogo pins at the positive terminal and a spring at the negative.


----------



## ingokl

According to some pictures linked in the SC64c topic the SC64x lights have a tailcap spring and five instead of three pogo pins.


----------



## JoeRodge

My pre-order from Nov 17th of the "SC600w IV Plus SC600w Mk IV Plus 18650 XHP50.2" just shipped today. I've been so annoyed(AKA impatient) not being able to play with my new light. Can't wait!


----------



## markr6

Outdoorsman5 said:


> Hey Markr6,
> I got a similar request from ZL on my Mk III HI that behaved like yours. I cleaned it & changed batteries & nothing I could do fixed the problem. I actually lived with the problem for about 10 months. I sent it back to them in May, but when it came back to me it was still behaving the same way. I am now waiting on them to REPLACE the light rather than trying to fix it again. If you can't get it running 100% then I'd ask them to replace it.
> 
> My new SC600w Mk IV HI had a different & temporary problem. The threads were so gritty that the tailcap wasn't able to tighten all the way. Once I cleaned them that problem was fixed. Hopefully you can get yours running 100% without returning it to ZL.



ZL asked me to try a new cell. I had two, so...

1. Charged two NCR18650GA to 4.19v
2. Cleaned threads and contacts with rubbing alcohol
3. Tested several times turning on at H1. Worked fine.
4. Placed the light w/ battery inserted in fridge for 5 minutes at 39°F - turned on a few times and it was OK. At the 4th or 5th turn on it turned off within 1/2 second. Again, same thing. Again, OK.
5. Let it sit at room temperature overnight. After first turn on, it turned off. Again, off.

Definitely a lemon. Since this is not the first report, I can't trust this. It's going back. WHY DID I SELL MY MK III HI SO SOON?!?!?!?! Lesson learned. I think I will just buy another MK III HI to play it safe. Screw the new UI. OR would you guys try another IV HI?


----------



## Connor

markr6 said:


> Definitely a lemon. Since this is not the first report, I can't trust this. It's going back. WHY DID I SELL MY MK III HI SO SOON?!?!?!?! Lesson learned. I think I will just buy another MK III HI to play it safe. Screw the new UI. OR would you guys try another IV HI?



Definitely try another one. Intermittent defects like yours can slip through quality control .. it's just bad luck. Chances are your next light will be fine!


----------



## SubLGT

Do the tint differences between the SC64 and SC64w mirror those of the SC63 versus SC63w?


----------



## markr6

SubLGT said:


> Do the tint differences between the SC64 and SC64w mirror those of the SC63 versus SC63w?



I'm guessing you mean the actual cool/warm color of the lights. If so, yes, they are the same (5700K for cool white, 4500K for the w)

But "tint" technically refers to the shift between any number of the same lights. So if you have ten SC63 lights and compare all of them, each will be a little different, some may be way off (yellowish, greenish, etc)


----------



## Outdoorsman5

I just sent the msg below to Zebralight, and am hoping they respond by REPLACING my SC600w Mk III HI. Please also read my "P.S.S" complaint about the output of the SC600w Mk III HI vs the SC600w Mk IV HI. The H1 setting looks identical!! I'm curious to see what they say about this as I can't tell the slightest difference between the two outputs.

"PLEASE REFER THIS MSG TO A MANAGER. THIS LIGHT IS STILL MALFUNCTIONING AND NEEDS TO BE REPLACED.
I just got the SC600w Mk III HI in the mail from you. You stated that you could not duplicate the problem & blamed it on my 6 batteries being bad (that I bought from you) or my XTAR chargers weren’t working properly (which all 6 of them work just fine.) I opened up the box, pulled out the light, and within minutes of use it turned off by itself! I read on CPF where someone else was having this problem (CPF user name - markr6) but only when the light was cold. I put the light in my freezer for a while today, and when I pulled it out it didn’t take long to see the problem appear again. After 10-20 times of turning the light on & off, it started malfunctioning. This looks to be a problem when the light gets cold (which for me is often when using it camping or jogging in cold weather.) This makes sense why it worked over the summer for me just fine but malfunctioned last winter and again now.

Here is a timeline of events – I bought the light in December 2016. It malfunctioned on a backpacking trip in Jan. I used it jogging several mornings in Jan where it did the same thing. I went camping in March & backpacking in April and the light malfunctioned both times plus many other times at home. I returned it to you in May. When I got it back it did not malfunction again until I used it in cold weather backpacking in Nov. I then returned it to you a 2nd​ time last month, and still the problem persists.

I hope this helps. Clearly this light needs to be replaced, and quality control of your other lights needs to be tested in cold temps.

Thank you,

**P.S. I just turned the light on and it turned off by itself again, and it is now at room temperature. Very strange. 
**P.S.S. I do have a complaint to make on another subject – My new SC600w Mk IV HI that just arrived last week seems to be the EXACT same brightness on H1 as the Mk III HI. I am just doing a ceiling bounce test, but this is disappointing. I still love the light & new UI, but am feeling lied to regarding the output. Maybe my eyes are lying to me, but I doubt it. I understand how the human eye perceives an increase in brightness (a double in lumens looks like only a 25% increase to our eyes,) but I should notice at least some difference from 1126 lumens vs. the new 1400 lumens.
Mark Smith
(Outdoorsman5 on CPF)"


----------



## Outdoorsman5

markr6 said:


> ZL asked me to try a new cell. I had two, so...
> 
> 1. Charged two NCR18650GA to 4.19v
> 2. Cleaned threads and contacts with rubbing alcohol
> 3. Tested several times turning on at H1. Worked fine.
> 4. Placed the light w/ battery inserted in fridge for 5 minutes at 39°F - turned on a few times and it was OK. At the 4th or 5th turn on it turned off within 1/2 second. Again, same thing. Again, OK.
> 5. Let it sit at room temperature overnight. After first turn on, it turned off. Again, off.
> 
> Definitely a lemon. Since this is not the first report, I can't trust this. It's going back. WHY DID I SELL MY MK III HI SO SOON?!?!?!?! Lesson learned. I think I will just buy another MK III HI to play it safe. Screw the new UI. OR would you guys try another IV HI?



Markr6, my light that has been malfunctioning over the past year is the Mk III not my new Mk IV. My SC600w Mk IV HI works just fine even after leaving it in the freezer for a long time. BUT, my SC600w Mk III HI behaves like yours. If I were you I'd just return it for a new Mk IV and hope it works. I'm waiting on ZL to respond to my msg above regarding my malfunctioning light and the fact that H1 on both lights look identical.


----------



## markr6

Outdoorsman5 said:


> Markr6, my light that has been malfunctioning over the past year is the Mk III not my new Mk IV. My SC600w Mk IV HI works just fine even after leaving it in the freezer for a long time. BUT, my SC600w Mk III HI behaves like yours. If I were you I'd just return it for a new Mk IV and hope it works. I'm waiting on ZL to respond to my msg above regarding my malfunctioning light and the fact that H1 on both lights look identical.



Not good 

Did you happen to see the part where I mentioned it does not have to do with the cold at all? So there's definitely a defect.

pc_light, can I have my SC600w III HI back?


----------



## neutralwhite

" maybe my eyes are lying to me "
lol.


----------



## Outdoorsman5

markr6 said:


> Not good
> 
> Did you happen to see the part where I mentioned it does not have to do with the cold at all? So there's definitely a defect.
> 
> pc_light, can I have my SC600w III HI back?



Ah, I did not see that. Well maybe mine is not triggered by the cold either. It has cut out on me a few more times since sending that msg. Zebralight responded a few min ago. They just said send the light back to them, nothing more. I responded with a request for them to address my last complaint regarding H1 not looking any brighter in the new model. I know my msg to them shows a bit of my irritation. I was expecting a brighter flashlight since they advertised it as brighter. None of this changes the fact that I still think the SC600w HI is the greatest flashlight ever made. I hope they get the kinks worked out before these get in the hands of people less forgiving.


----------



## Outdoorsman5

neutralwhite said:


> " maybe my eyes are lying to me "
> lol.



Tee Hee


----------



## markr6

I mentioned them being the same brightness in a thread (or this one?) after comparing them as well. Not a huge deal to me, just an observation. The change isn't enough to notice I guess. I do like the new UI. Leaning towards trying another one...


----------



## anthon87

quite a surprise that my H53w doesn't come with AR glass, why? We pay a lot for "Premium" flashlights and the manufacturer tries to save money in the flashlight parts, how much is de difference between an AR and normal glass, $0.5?


----------



## markr6

markr6 said:


> I mentioned them being the same brightness in a thread (or this one?) after comparing them as well. Not a huge deal to me, just an observation. The change isn't enough to notice I guess. I do like the new UI. Leaning towards trying another one...



They responded and I got an RMA, so I'll get a refund. Still not decided on what to get. The III again or another IV. I feel like they may be pushing these too hard to be reliable. I don't want a light that has to have the freshest, best, fully charged battery every time I go to use it on high. My III was reliable even on fairly old cells, should have kept it!


----------



## JoeRodge

Shipping label was created almost 48 hours ago but hasn't been given to USPS. Normal?


----------



## markr6

JoeRodge said:


> Shipping label was created almost 48 hours ago but hasn't been given to USPS. Normal?



Usually just 1 day. Maybe the USPS system just didn't update it yet. Wouldn't surprise me; it's pretty useless in general.


----------



## JoeRodge

I hope so! Im hoping to get it by the 23rd but I know that is probably unlikely being in California. Wanted it before Christmas lol.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

JoeRodge said:


> I hope so! Im hoping to get it by the 23rd but I know that is probably unlikely being in California. Wanted it before Christmas lol.



Consider yourself lucky to be in the US. I just ordered a SC600w mkIV HI, using EMS shipping to Canada. That will take 2 weeks to get here. Probably 3 weeks, based on prior EMS shipping from China, and I doubt Zebralight gets things here any faster. And that's if I'm lucky, and customs doesn't sit on it for another 1-2 weeks. Even DHL can take up to 2 weeks to get here (though usually it's about a week).

Best way to buy items from China is to order and forget. You get a nice surprise a few weeks later.


----------



## gunga

Weird. Last time I did ems it took a few days to Canada.


----------



## Tachead

Me too. EMS only takes about 7 days max to get to me in Ontario from ZL China and DHL takes about 3 days, 4 at the most.


----------



## Tachead

markr6 said:


> They responded and I got an RMA, so I'll get a refund. Still not decided on what to get. The III again or another IV. I feel like they may be pushing these too hard to be reliable. I don't want a light that has to have the freshest, best, fully charged battery every time I go to use it on high. My III was reliable even on fairly old cells, should have kept it!



They are definitely not pushing them too hard Mark. The XHP35 is capable of 1800+ lumens without overdriving or going over Cree's recommended limits and ZL never over drives emitters. You just got a lemon. I would just try another one.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

gunga said:


> Weird. Last time I did ems it took a few days to Canada.



If I watch the tracking, it takes almost a week to get from Vancouver to the east. I think it's Canada Post that handles it the whole way in Canada?

I think the biggest delay can be customs, though. Sometimes stuff flies right through. Other times, it sits for almost 2 weeks.

DHL I've had take only a couple of days. Other times, a couple of weeks. Too expensive for such a variance, IMO.

I don't find EMS much faster than regular (free) China Post, on average. But, sometimes China Post can take 2 months if I'm unlucky, so it's more of a gamble.


----------



## markr6

Tachead said:


> They are definitely not pushing them too hard Mark. The XHP35 is capable of 1800+ lumens without overdriving or going over Cree's recommended limits and ZL never over drives emitters. You just got a lemon. I would just try another one.



Thanks. I'll give the IV another try.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

markr6 said:


> Thanks. I'll give the IV another try.



Maybe ZL is purposely sending you crap as revenge for all your complaining about their tints! :laughing:


----------



## markr6

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Maybe ZL is purposely sending you crap as revenge for all your complaining about their tints! :laughing:



They come in everyday hoping I bought another...then send me greenies and laugh


----------



## Outdoorsman5

markr6 said:


> Thanks. I'll give the IV another try.



Markr6,

If I were you I'd get the Mk IV as well. The new UI is AWESOME!! Other than that, same light as the Mk III. Hope you don't get another dud. I just sent my Mk III back to them today, and am hoping for the a good one too. Luckily my Mk IV is a 100%.


----------



## JoeRodge

I got it today!!! The size of this flashlight is mins blowing. It's my first Zebralight so I didn't quite grasp how small everyone said they were. The mail clerk handed me my package and I was like, "wait...what..." -- I was worried lol. I have the cells charging and can't wait to try it out.

This new clip everyone seems to hate is great btw. Without knowing the old one I can't find any issues. Fits well into my work pants and slides out just fine. No hitches or anything.

It turns out USPS 
's online tracking is crap like someone mentioned. It hadn't updated since the 19th and didn't until it arrived at my local post office.


----------



## Tachead

JoeRodge said:


> I got it today!!! The size of this flashlight is mins blowing. It's my first Zebralight so I didn't quite grasp how small everyone said they were. The mail clerk handed me my package and I was like, "wait...what..." -- I was worried lol. I have the cells charging and can't wait to try it out.
> 
> This new clip everyone seems to hate is great btw. Without knowing the old one I can't find any issues. Fits well into my work pants and slides out just fine. No hitches or anything.
> 
> It turns out USPS
> 's online tracking is crap like someone mentioned. It hadn't updated since the 19th and didn't until it arrived at my local post office.


Which light did ya get Joe? Also, please let us know what you think once you break it in.


----------



## JoeRodge

Tachead said:


> Which light did ya get Joe? Also, please let us know what you think once you break it in.


I got the SC600w IV Plus and I have zero complaints so far. Still figuring out all the modes. The anodized coating is flawless. I still can't get over how small the light is, lol. I heard people getting other models for a smaller form factor. I would be scared to use/lose anything smaller!






Gonna play with it a bit more after work.


----------



## Tachead

JoeRodge said:


> I got the SC600w IV Plus and I have zero complaints so far. Still figuring out all the modes. The anodized coating is flawless. I still can't get over how small the light is, lol. I heard people getting other models for a smaller form factor. I would be scared to use/lose anything smaller!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Gonna play with it a bit more after work.



Yeah, it's an awesome light. If you think that is small you should see the SC64 series.

You have good taste in batteries as well I see☺️.


----------



## TCY

JoeRodge said:


> I heard people getting other models for a smaller form factor. I would be scared to use/lose anything smaller
> 
> Gonna play with it a bit more after work.



AFAIK at this point the only two smaller 18650 lights available on the market are: ZL's own SC64 line and DQG's Tiny, but besides the ~8mm decrease in length, a ZL destroys it in every other category except price.


----------



## JoeRodge

Tachead said:


> Yeah, it's an awesome light. If you think that is small you should see the SC64 series.
> 
> You have good taste in batteries as well I see☺️.




I've seen Odyssey batteries last 12-14 years in some pretty extreme applications lol. It's one of those times where you get what you pay. Worth every penny  -- I got a huge stack of stickers and a few of those mats lol.



TCY said:


> AFAIK at this point the only two smaller 18650 lights available on the market are: ZL's own SC64 line and DQG's Tiny, but besides the ~8mm decrease in length, a ZL destroys it in every other category except price.



This light is gonna be perfect for me. I have a habit(damn you Dad) of sticking flashlights in my mouth as I work on cars, etc. Just the right size to chomp down on lol.


----------



## R2RO

Just received my sc600w Mk IV HI today. The shipping within the US was extremely fast. It only took four days to deliver. Got to say, I love the light! The tint is very nice and on the slightly warm side(I despise cool white). Not near as warm as my f600c mk iii, but warmer than olights neutral white. The throw is pretty awesome for such a small pocketable torch. It's a really nice pairing with the floody headlamp(h600fc). It throws waaay farther than fc, around four times more. The spill is enough to really light the path, not just a needle point hot spot. Not sure why some people complain the lows aren't low enough on the Mk IV's, it's super low. Too low for me to ever program the lowest in fact. I like the "moonlights" too.

Bottom line is that it's an awesome outdoors/woods torch. Took it on a night hike as soon as the sun went down. I used to think the h600fc had some distance just by pure output, but this takes it to a whole other level. Can't go wrong with a ZL. Small, efficient, and best UI in the business. And no its not difficult to learn at all.


----------



## JoeRodge

I was also gonna mention mine had a great tint as well. Btw, I'm not seeing much Rosey color like I've seen in some people's shots. The color is great!


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

TCY said:


> AFAIK at this point the only two smaller 18650 lights available on the market are: ZL's own SC64 line and DQG's Tiny, but besides the ~8mm decrease in length, a ZL destroys it in every other category except price.



Oh, I forgot I even had a DQG Tiny. Yes, it's a nice light, and extremely small. Not much bigger than just the battery. But, yes, the Zebralight is a nicer light overall. I guess that's why my DQG gets so little use. If you have a Zebralight, the DQG doesn't really have a place, unless you really really need something a bit smaller.



R2RO said:


> Just received my sc600w Mk IV HI today. The shipping within the US was extremely fast. It only took four days to deliver.



Jealous! I'm still waiting for mine to ship.  It's in stock, but I guess they all took the last few days before Christmas off. Still, mine has to come from China. Does China even take Christmas off?

Anyway, I was trying to decide which SC600w mkIV model to get, but from reports like yours, is sounds like I made the right choice. It will be my first Zebralight with the new UI, so I'm looking forward to setting it up so I don't accidentally blind myself in the middle of the night with a bad click length. That was really my only complaint about Zebralights, in the past.



> Not sure why some people complain the lows aren't low enough on the Mk IV's, it's super low. Too low for me to ever program the lowest in fact. I like the "moonlights" too.



The really low moonlights are great for getting up on moonless nights, if you live out in the country. Just enough to see with, but not enough to wake you up or spoil any night vision. If you have any stray light at all (neighbor's street lights, you live near a town, etc), then the lowest moonlights are rather pointless.


----------



## R2RO

I totally agree that moonlight settings are very useful, around the house or getting out of a tent at night. I'm just saying that the Mk IVs have gotten some flak for not going low enough. I definitely don't agree with that. It's really really low. Any lower and it would be off. Can't please everyone I guess. 

Also there's no battery rattle at all with the unprotected cells from the zebralight store on the sc600w Mk IV HI.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

R2RO said:


> I totally agree that moonlight settings are very useful, around the house or getting out of a tent at night. I'm just saying that the Mk IVs have gotten some flak for not going low enough. I definitely don't agree with that. It's really really low. Any lower and it would be off. Can't please everyone I guess.
> 
> Also there's no battery rattle at all with the unprotected cells from the zebralight store on the sc600w Mk IV HI.



I haven't got mine yet, but if they've dropped the extreme lows they have on some models it's not much of a loss. I think they list them as 0.01 lumens, but they're actually about 0.001 lumens or less. Extremely dim, and useless even in total darkness. I like the low they list as 0.06 lumens (sometimes second-lowest on some models, sometimes the lowest); it is quite useful.

I haven't got my new light yet, but I too hope they haven't dropped the 0.06 lumen level. I don't care if they drop the one dimmer than that. From the description on the website, I think they've dropped the extreme low.


----------



## typevii

Well i guess this is one where we are all searching for the perfect flashlight.
For me, the sc600fd mkIII with a low of 0.18 is useless to me as a true moonlight mode, way too bright. I love the H1 and H2, mediums i never use, and low, well it is just too high now.
So still searching for a true low option and an amazing high. Waiting to see what the new mkiv headlights can do, but after the sc600 fd it’s going to be tough.


----------



## scs

Anyone with the SC64C and/or SC64W AND the SC600w MK4 Plus. Who's got a more even beam across the entire width of the beam, IOW, who floods better? Thanks.


----------



## Tachead

scs said:


> Anyone with the SC64C and/or SC64W AND the SC600w MK4 Plus. Who's got a more even beam across the entire width of the beam, IOW, who floods better? Thanks.


Well, they are both pretty similar but, I would go with the Plus. It is super bright(both spill and hotspot) and it has a bit larger hotspot which covers more area especially at range.


----------



## Tachead

I just ordered a SC64w as well to give me a different CCT and emitter option. I will post my thoughts on it vs the 64c when it arrives. I might grab a HI eventually too for a throwier option to go along with my Plus. Man these ZL's are addicting.


----------



## terjee

Got shipping notification for an SC600Fc Mk IV Plus, at 04:38 CEST.

Really looking forward to testing this, it’ll most likely be my primary indoor light for quite some time.


----------



## markr6

I finally pulled the trigger on the SC64w. Also ordered another IV HI since my first one was defective. Fingers crossed for two good samples with good tints. BE THERE!! NO WHAMMY!


----------



## R2RO

It seems the plus vs Hi thread is dead. Anyone have both and can give some insight? Also wondering about sc64 vs sc53 or maybe compared to headlamp varieties for smaller edc lights. Pics please! Please and thank you.


----------



## terjee

R2RO said:


> Also wondering about sc64 vs sc53



SC64 is an 18650 light, while SC53 is an AA one, so those would be quite different.


----------



## jlittle

I can’t decide between the 600 or 64.... it’s a tough choice.


----------



## Connor

jlittle said:


> I can’t decide between the 600 or 64.... it’s a tough choice.



I vote for the 600s. If you plan to use the high modes often, the additional mass makes quite a difference. 
The 6x serie's only winning point is size/weight.


----------



## Tachead

jlittle said:


> I can’t decide between the 600 or 64.... it’s a tough choice.


The 64 is better as an EDC light. It has a nice screwed on clip and is easier to clip and unclip from your pocket. It is also lighter and more slender so it is more comfortable to carry clipped in your front pants pocket.

The 600 has a better in hand feel and is much more grippy due to its knurling. It is better for extended use and handles the heat of the high modes better.

They both have their pros and cons and excel at different things. The simple answer is buy both.


----------



## Keitho

For me, the 64 (previously the 63) usually comes with me in my front pocket, the 600 stays somewhere else close by as a backup. The 64's size, weight, and runtime usually win the day. I'm a sucker for high output flooder, though, so the 600Fd sees plenty of runtime. Can't wait for my 600Fc!


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

terjee said:


> SC64 is an 18650 light, while SC53 is an AA one, so those would be quite different.



Yes, but if you're going for pocketability, the SC53 is an excellent choice. Nowhere close to the output or run-time of the SC64, but unless you need the extra power of the SC64, then the SC53 might be a better choice.


----------



## R2RO

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Yes, but if you're going for pocketability, the SC53 is an excellent choice. Nowhere close to the output or run-time of the SC64, but unless you need the extra power of the SC64, then the SC53 might be a better choice.



Yeah, I mean size and pocketability. I'm aware it's 18650 vs AA and what that means. I was hoping for a pick comparing the two. Also an AA is nice as a cold weather option. Although I have an h600fc and it's been flawless in 20f weather. Anyone have problems in 0f Temps with li-ion? I know the output can suffer but mediums still work right?


----------



## R2RO




----------



## Tachead

R2RO said:


> Yeah, I mean size and pocketability. I'm aware it's 18650 vs AA and what that means. I was hoping for a pick comparing the two. Also an AA is nice as a cold weather option. Although I have an h600fc and it's been flawless in 20f weather. Anyone have problems in 0f Temps with li-ion? I know the output can suffer but mediums still work right?


Just wanted to let you know, the SC64 is even smaller then your H600Fc(not a lot but, a noticeable amount). I have both.


----------



## likethevegetable

FWIW, my H53c and Spyderco Dragonfly 2 fit in my coin pocket side-by-side


----------



## ven

Although i can cope, i almost find the sc53w too small in hand, heck the sc63w is small as is, but feels easier to hold and use(subjective). I find the sc53 more for carrying in case i might need it now and then. The sc63/64 for actual use which is planned and the run time benefits from the larger fuel supply inspires more confidence. 




Size there is not much at all in it, away from scales and in hand, weight is not even that noticeable to me. So the benefits of carrying the sc63 far outweigh the sc53 for me(personal choices) . Of course, everyone will vary with their needs and wants, especially if they want nimh fed lights.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

R2RO said:


> Anyone have problems in 0f Temps with li-ion? I know the output can suffer but mediums still work right?



I find that both lithium ion and NiMH start to suffer at 0F temperatures. But my regulated lights (like Zebralights) do a pretty good job of maintaining full output. It's the unregulated lights that show a noticeable drop in brightness. I'm sure run-time suffers in both cases, but I've never measured that.

If you use Eneloops for your AA cells, they're good down to -20C (-4F). But I find they'll work colder than that, though probably because they get some jacket-pocket warmth. Same probably goes for lithium-ion.

I think if you're really worried about operation in very cold weather (such as a flashlight you leave in a car), you're better going with AA lithium primaries (like Energizer lithium), or CR123. But for "normal" cold weather use, I've never had a problem with either Eneloops or lithium-ion.


----------



## vadimax

ven said:


> Although i can cope, i almost find the sc53w too small in hand, heck the sc63w is small as is, but feels easier to hold and use(subjective). I find the sc53 more for carrying in case i might need it now and then. The sc63/64 for actual use which is planned and the run time benefits from the larger fuel supply inspires more confidence.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Size there is not much at all in it, away from scales and in hand, weight is not even that noticeable to me. So the benefits of carrying the sc63 far outweigh the sc53 for me(personal choices) . Of course, everyone will vary with their needs and wants, especially if they want nimh fed lights.



Ven, sorry for OT question: what is this shiny object in the background (vertical cylinder with horizontal ridges)? It reminds me a pure silicon bar from a semiconductor factory.


----------



## Keitho

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> I find that both lithium ion and NiMH start to suffer at 0F temperatures. But my regulated lights (like Zebralights) do a pretty good job of maintaining full output. It's the unregulated lights that show a noticeable drop in brightness. I'm sure run-time suffers in both cases, but I've never measured that.



Same here, I've never noticed brightness suffering around 0 degree F with regulated Zebralights, though I bring extra cells at those temps. Not only do cells have a smaller capacity, but the lights don't step down due to temp--adds up to shorter runtimes.


----------



## markr6

R2RO said:


> Yeah, I mean size and pocketability. I'm aware it's 18650 vs AA and what that means. I was hoping for a pick comparing the two. Also an AA is nice as a cold weather option. Although I have an h600fc and it's been flawless in 20f weather. Anyone have problems in 0f Temps with li-ion? I know the output can suffer but mediums still work right?



I was backpacking last winter and noticed some issues for the first time. It was about 7°F and my H600w would not stay on H1. That's OK since I never use that mode, but I'll often turn it on just to mess around and light up the woods with all the snow. I noticed it would step down within 1 second after turning it on. I can't remember if it was stepping down to H2, or M1. But for the rest of the 1.5hr hike, I kept it on M1 which ran fine.

And on my older Fexix PD32UE, the two highest modes are identical in output anytime it's below 40° or so. I think the battery is just old in that one.


----------



## ven

vadimax said:


> Ven, sorry for OT question: what is this shiny object in the background (vertical cylinder with horizontal ridges)? It reminds me a pure silicon bar from a semiconductor factory.



Just a vase


----------



## wweiss

Would that the ZL had a more pleasing look.


----------



## Outdoorsman5

R2RO said:


> Yeah, I mean size and pocketability. I'm aware it's 18650 vs AA and what that means. I was hoping for a pick comparing the two. Also an AA is nice as a cold weather option. Although I have an h600fc and it's been flawless in 20f weather. Anyone have problems in 0f Temps with li-ion? I know the output can suffer but mediums still work right?



I've used Li-ion batteries on cold weather hikes several times. I would REALLY like to measure cold temp runtimes because each time I use one of my go to headlights (ZL H600w Mk II or ZL H52w) with Li-ion in cold weather I get shocked with lower than expected runtimes. Each time I thought I got somewhere around half the listed runtimes. In Nov I took our BSA troop on a climbing trip where we had to hike in that Friday night. The temps weren't really that low (in the 30's F). In the last 1.5 hours or so I switched from using my handheld light (SC600w Mk III HI) to using my headlight (H52w). I used H2 at 102 lumens (listed runtime is 3 hours) for that 1.5 hours or so. As I was putting up my tent in camp my light unexpectedly dropped from H2 (102 lumens) down to L1 (2.7 lumens) and wouldn't return to high or medium. I warmed the light up in my pocket a bit, and it returned to high & medium mode but for only a very short time. The battery was spent, and I couldn't believe it. I had to put in my backup Energizer Lithium battery which I didn't expect to even need. This same thing happened to me on a backpacking trip earlier this year on a longer than expected night hike in January using my H600w Mk II). It happened last year as well, but again I didn't measure actual runtimes, but was surprised with lower than expected runtimes. 

Just from my use, I'm guessing the runtimes for Li-ion batteries in cold-ish temps are cut in half. I've wondered many times, would I just be better off with my H52w with an Energizer Lithium battery plus a backup battery compared to using my H600w Mk II with a single 18650 Li-ion battery in cold temps?? My guess - yes.

I'D LOVE TO HEAR FROM OTHERS WITH ACTUAL EXPERIENCE ON THIS!! Thanks!!!


----------



## markr6

That's why I often take my SC600w HI in addition to the H600w. I don't really need it or use it much, but it's fun and calling it a "backup battery" sort of helps me justify bringing it along.

Other than my cold weather experience comments above, I can't comment on runtimes since I didn't use it much after the hike in.


----------



## SubLGT

For cold weather use, Panasonic has the NCR18650F cell.

https://na.industrial.panasonic.com/sites/default/pidsa/files/ncr18650f.pdf


----------



## Keitho

Outdoorsman5 said:


> I've used Li-ion batteries on cold weather hikes several times. I would REALLY like to measure cold temp runtimes because each time I use one of my go to headlights (ZL H600w Mk II or ZL H52w) with Li-ion in cold weather I get shocked with lower than expected runtimes. ... The temps weren't really that low (in the 30's F). ... Just from my use, I'm guessing the runtimes for Li-ion batteries in cold-ish temps are cut in half.



I suspect that you were probably experiencing a lot greater effect from lack of stepdown than low temp cell capacity. I also run my lithium ion ZL's (600Fw and 63/64) outdoors on H2a, but on my bicycle helmet and handlebar with a lot of moving air. I don't experience a terrific drop in capacity from, let's say 50 deg F down to single-digits F. My theory, not backed up by any kind of rigorous testing, is that my lights don't step down very much or at all at 50 deg F because of active cooling; so, any drop in my runtime at 0 deg F is due only to battery capacity, not flashlight thermal regulation. The lithium ion chemistry certainly suffers at low temps, but shouldn't drop capacity by half. For me, capacity seems to be only slightly different on H2 in very cold temps.

But, runtime is dramatically different at cold temps on H1: like, Emisar D4 kinds of runtimes when actively cooled by cold moving air (not much more than a dozen minutes!)

BTW, nice recommendation from SubLGT on the NCR18650f--I didn't know that kind of cell existed!


----------



## markr6

markr6 said:


> I finally pulled the trigger on the SC64w. Also ordered another IV HI since my first one was defective. Fingers crossed for two good samples with good tints. BE THERE!! NO WHAMMY!



It just occurred to me...I should have placed two separate orders!!! Now I have to wait for the backordered item to come in before I get the one that is currently in stock.


----------



## Connor

According to the sources below you can expect ~50% capacity at -20°C and ~80% capacity at 0°C. 

https://optibike.com/lithium-battery-performance-in-cold-temperatures/
http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/discharging_at_high_and_low_temperatures


----------



## Outdoorsman5

markr6 said:


> That's why I often take my SC600w HI in addition to the H600w. I don't really need it or use it much, but it's fun and calling it a "backup battery" sort of helps me justify bringing it along.
> 
> Other than my cold weather experience comments above, I can't comment on runtimes since I didn't use it much after the hike in.



I do the same thing Markr6! I don't usually carry a backup 18650 if I have an 18650 headlight and handheld. Why carry an 18650 all by itself .




SubLGT said:


> For cold weather use, Panasonic has the NCR18650F cell.
> 
> https://na.industrial.panasonic.com/sites/default/pidsa/files/ncr18650f.pdf



Hmm, I didn't know this battery existed. Wonder if they make it in a 14500? 




Keitho said:


> I suspect that you were probably experiencing a lot greater effect from lack of stepdown than low temp cell capacity.



If I was running my light on H1 then I'd agree with you, but since I was running my H52w on the lowest H2 setting (108 lumens), I don't think the thermal regulation would ever need to kick in whether in warmer or colder temps. I think at 108 lumens the ZL H52w just runs at that output constantly without the need for temperature regulation (I could be wrong I guess.) Thanks for your other input.


----------



## Tixx

markr6 said:


> It just occurred to me...I should have placed two separate orders!!! Now I have to wait for the backordered item to come in before I get the one that is currently in stock.



Yeah, this weekend I did separate orders. Learned that waiting for other things at ZL before. Just cancel and place separately. They usually get back with a cancel within 24 hours.


----------



## markr6

Tixx said:


> Yeah, this weekend I did separate orders. Learned that waiting for other things at ZL before. Just cancel and place separately. They usually get back with a cancel within 24 hours.



I would, but I think I bug them enough. I'll put to work the very little patience I have


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Outdoorsman5 said:


> If I was running my light on H1 then I'd agree with you, but since I was running my H52w on the lowest H2 setting (108 lumens), I don't think the thermal regulation would ever need to kick in whether in warmer or colder temps. I think at 108 lumens the ZL H52w just runs at that output constantly without the need for temperature regulation (I could be wrong I guess.) Thanks for your other input.



IIRC, it doesn't have any temperature regulation at all, unless you put a 14500 in it. Then, it will step down after 1 minute (a timed step-down, regardless of temperature).

IMO, I think those 1-minute step-downs are a bit too aggressive. Even on that small light, it's only getting warm after 1 minute. They could have gone 2 minutes, or perhaps even 3 minutes (like the SC5 series).


----------



## Outdoorsman5

Well crap...I just discovered 2 big flaws in my new SC600w Mk IV HI.

1. When I go from G5 to G6 & back to G5, only one of my medium modes works. For instance, I cannot go from M1 to M2 or M2 to M1. The light is stuck in whatever medium mode I left it in last. So when I go back into G6, all of those modes may work just fine. When I go into G7 medium modes may or may not be working. If I cycle from G5 to G6 to G7, I am seeing this problem effecting all 3 groups or sometimes just one of the groups. I can duplicate the problem every time now by going from G5 to G6 & back to G5. Every time medium quits working properly. As I cycle around sometimes it starts working again & other times it doesn't. I sent Zebralight an RMA for this light dang it.

2. As I have been experimenting with this light it has now cut out by itself when in H1 three times. The light just turns off & won't come back on for a second or so. This is the same problem I have been having with my older SC600w Mk III HI (which I've now returned 3 times and am waiting on a replacement.)

I hope ZL isn't having some underlying QC issues with their SC600 lights - I sure love the HI lights and the new UI. I'd like to hear back from folks to see if anyone else is seeing the UI problem that I've been seeing or the problem with the light cutting out like markr6 & I have seen.


----------



## Connor

Outdoorsman5 said:


> 1. When I go from G5 to G6 & back to G5, only one of my medium modes works. For instance, I cannot go from M1 to M2 or M2 to M1. The light is stuck in whatever medium mode I left it in last. So when I go back into G6, all of those modes may work just fine. When I go into G7 medium modes may or may not be working. If I cycle from G5 to G6 to G7, I am seeing this problem effecting all 3 groups or sometimes just one of the groups. I can duplicate the problem every time now by going from G5 to G6 & back to G5. Every time medium quits working properly. As I cycle around sometimes it starts working again & other times it doesn't. I sent Zebralight an RMA for this light dang it.



I've experienced something similar after programming G6/G7 on my SC600Fd Mk4 Plus, couldn't switch between H1/H2 anymore and sometimes this "moved" from G6 to G5 like in your case. I think I found the reason for it: when you are in the free programming mode in G6/G7 and double click a few times after already having reached the highest level, the behaviour you mentioned is triggered reliably. I reported this to ZL. 

BTW: resetting G6/G7 and not moving beyond the highest level while programming fixed it in my case. Seems like a simple arithmetic overflow error to me. Not a dealbreaker (for me) but shouldn't have slipped through quality control.


----------



## Outdoorsman5

Connor said:


> I've experienced something similar after programming G6/G7 on my SC600Fd Mk4 Plus, couldn't switch between H1/H2 anymore and sometimes this "moved" from G6 to G5 like in your case. I think I found the reason for it: when you are in the free programming mode in G6/G7 and double click a few times after already having reached the highest level, the behaviour you mentioned is triggered reliably. I reported this to ZL.
> 
> BTW: resetting G6/G7 and not moving beyond the highest level while programming fixed it in my case. Seems like a simple arithmetic overflow error to me. Not a dealbreaker (for me) but shouldn't have slipped through quality control.



Thanks Connor. I just tried what you suggested but no luck fixing my problem. I still cannot switch between M1 & M2 in the G5 group (at the moment.) Btw, while I was attempting to reprogram my H1 in both G6 & G7 my light just cut out on me making that the 4th time it's done that. My battery is fully charged, so that's not it. Anyway, thanks for the suggestion. My problem with the UI is similar to yours but my medium M1 & M2 are what's affected. This light is sadly going BACK!! Also, sadly I have an H600w Mk IV and an SC64w on order. I hope this problem doesn't show up in those lights or I'm giving up for a while until the problem is fixed. My older Zebralights works just fine and are still my favorites BY FAR.


----------



## Connor

Ya, your light seems to have additional issues, no doubt. ZL will take care of you. 
New driver and new firmware for the microcontroller .. seems they didn't check closely enough for new bugs and new problems.


----------



## KITROBASKIN

Pictures of ZL in the home

https://photos.app.goo.gl/wdltlr0pTnSdaobk2

https://photos.app.goo.gl/rilYEomucijQUh3G2

One of these is used every night. One stays safe (has the stock clip). The 52 has a 1/4 minus green filter under bezel ring outside of lens.


----------



## CelticCross74

Day 32 waiting on Mk IV....ZL just told me it will be three more weeks to complete the current batch underway of the IV. This is of course perfectly fine. I have come to the conclusion that near any ZL are the best urban EDC lights of all time. The amount of sophisticated technology packed into these such small feature rich lights is amazing. Soooo....if I am not back posting about my awesome new IV in 21 days.....tell....Nitecore....their new ....SRT7GT.....blows.....(cue the Police's "Message in a Bottle")


----------



## HaloLED

Outdoorsman5 said:


> Well crap...I just discovered 2 big flaws in my new SC600w Mk IV HI.
> 
> 1. When I go from G5 to G6 & back to G5, only one of my medium modes works. For instance, I cannot go from M1 to M2 or M2 to M1. The light is stuck in whatever medium mode I left it in last. So when I go back into G6, all of those modes may work just fine. When I go into G7 medium modes may or may not be working. If I cycle from G5 to G6 to G7, I am seeing this problem effecting all 3 groups or sometimes just one of the groups. I can duplicate the problem every time now by going from G5 to G6 & back to G5. Every time medium quits working properly. As I cycle around sometimes it starts working again & other times it doesn't. I sent Zebralight an RMA for this light dang it.
> 
> 2. As I have been experimenting with this light it has now cut out by itself when in H1 three times. The light just turns off & won't come back on for a second or so. This is the same problem I have been having with my older SC600w Mk III HI (which I've now returned 3 times and am waiting on a replacement.)
> 
> I hope ZL isn't having some underlying QC issues with their SC600 lights - I sure love the HI lights and the new UI. I'd like to hear back from folks to see if anyone else is seeing the UI problem that I've been seeing or the problem with the light cutting out like markr6 & I have seen.



My SC600w Mk IV HI just randomly quit working one day. I was using it on medium settings and after I had turned it off it would not turn on again. It was not frequently used. I sent it back for repair and it was about 10 weeks before it came back. 
I have a 50.2 version on backorder. The SC600w malfunction just reinforces my two is one - one is none philosophy where electronics are concerned. I suppose a light like the SC600 could be made much more reliable but its size would increase and I wouldn't be able to afford it.


----------



## JoeRodge

I just swapped the battery on my SC600w Mk IV Plus when I stepped into my car just now. I might be going crazy but my positive terminal totally looks slightly concave, in a circle(pushed down in the same shape as the pogopin plscements.. I've heard previous generations having this issue. It doesn't look real bad but it's on both 18650s provided by Zebralight, the GA's. I'm getting a few more on Teusdays. I'm gonna compare them.


----------



## Tachead

JoeRodge said:


> I just swapped the battery on my SC600w Mk IV Plus when I stepped into my car just now. I might be going crazy but my positive terminal totally looks slightly concave, in a circle(pushed down in the same shape as the pogopin plscements.. I've heard previous generations having this issue. It doesn't look real bad but it's on both 18650s provided by Zebralight, the GA's. I'm getting a few more on Teusdays. I'm gonna compare them.



Did you drop the light at all or expose it to any shock? If not, your cell may have just been a little longer then the tolerances allow(the tolerances are very tight unfortunately). 

These new MKIV's are going to be better then the MKIII's due to the force being dispersed between more pins and around the perimeter of the terminal but, if a hard enough shock or drop happens they will still dent cells. My 64c dented a cell the other day when I dropped it on a hard surface but, up until that point the cells were fine. 

These pogo pins just don't offer any give once fully compressed and the flat top cells positive terminals are pretty weak and prone to denting(unlike button tops which are much stronger). These lights will never protect batteries as well as a duel spring design will but, it is a trade off for a smaller light and easier tailcap installation and removal. It should also be noted that even many duel spring designs will dent flat top cells with enough shock. Malkoff's will dent flat top cells, for instance, if dropped hard enough. 

The only thing you can really do if you want added protection is use an O-ring to help cushion the positive terminal. And, of course, don't drop the light if you can help it(I can't apparently and now my nice new light has a ding in it along with my brand new VTC6 lol).


----------



## Dio

HaloLED said:


> My SC600w Mk IV HI just randomly quit working one day. I was using it on medium settings and after I had turned it off it would not turn on again. It was not frequently used. I sent it back for repair and it was about 10 weeks before it came back.
> I have a 50.2 version on backorder. The SC600w malfunction just reinforces my two is one - one is none philosophy where electronics are concerned. I suppose a light like the SC600 could be made much more reliable but its size would increase and I wouldn't be able to afford it.



Do you mean the SC600w III HI? The IV HI hasn't even been out long enough for your 10 week wait to make sense is all...


----------



## gunga

Can anyone comment on the moonlight mode on the sc64c? I've read they are much higher than previous generation lights but would like real world impressionms.


----------



## Tachead

gunga said:


> Can anyone comment on the moonlight mode on the sc64c? I've read they are much higher than previous generation lights but would like real world impressionms.



I can, what would you like to know specifically? I have the SC600w MKIV Plus, H600Fc MKIII, H600Fd MKIII, and H502c L2 to compare it to. I also have an SC64w on order.


----------



## scs

Tachead said:


> Did you drop the light at all or expose it to any shock? If not, your cell may have just been a little longer then the tolerances allow(the tolerances are very tight unfortunately).
> 
> These new MKIV's are going to be better then the MKIII's due to the force being dispersed between more pins and around the perimeter of the terminal but, if a hard enough shock or drop happens they will still dent cells. My 64c dented a cell the other day when I dropped it on a hard surface but, up until that point the cells were fine.
> 
> These pogo pins just don't offer any give once fully compressed and the flat top cells positive terminals are pretty weak and prone to denting(unlike button tops which are much stronger). These lights will never protect batteries as well as a duel spring design will but, it is a trade off for a smaller light and easier tailcap installation and removal. It should also be noted that even many duel spring designs will dent flat top cells with enough shock. Malkoff's will dent flat top cells, for instance, if dropped hard enough.
> 
> The only thing you can really do if you want added protection is use an O-ring to help cushion the positive terminal. And, of course, don't drop the light if you can help it(I can't apparently and now my nice new light has a ding in it along with my brand new VTC6 lol).



I have 2 GA cells, both dented in dual spring lights, in which the springs have room to flex. Just like the new pogo pin pattern, the end of the positive spring needs to be wide enough to distribute the impulse. Otherwise, dual springs perform no better than these pogo pins in practice.


----------



## scs

Outdoorsman5 said:


> Well crap...I just discovered 2 big flaws in my new SC600w Mk IV HI.
> 
> 1. When I go from G5 to G6 & back to G5, only one of my medium modes works. For instance, I cannot go from M1 to M2 or M2 to M1. The light is stuck in whatever medium mode I left it in last. So when I go back into G6, all of those modes may work just fine. When I go into G7 medium modes may or may not be working. If I cycle from G5 to G6 to G7, I am seeing this problem effecting all 3 groups or sometimes just one of the groups. I can duplicate the problem every time now by going from G5 to G6 & back to G5. Every time medium quits working properly. As I cycle around sometimes it starts working again & other times it doesn't. I sent Zebralight an RMA for this light dang it.
> 
> 2. As I have been experimenting with this light it has now cut out by itself when in H1 three times. The light just turns off & won't come back on for a second or so. This is the same problem I have been having with my older SC600w Mk III HI (which I've now returned 3 times and am waiting on a replacement.)
> 
> I hope ZL isn't having some underlying QC issues with their SC600 lights - I sure love the HI lights and the new UI. I'd like to hear back from folks to see if anyone else is seeing the UI problem that I've been seeing or the problem with the light cutting out like markr6 & I have seen.



Did you have to pay shipping for all 3 times you had to return it?
I think it's ridiculous the customer has to pay for shipping back a defective light.
More ridiculous you had to do that multiple times.


----------



## Tachead

scs said:


> I have 2 GA cells, both dented in dual spring lights, in which the springs have room to flex. Just like the new pogo pin pattern, the end of the positive spring needs to be wide enough to distribute the impulse. Otherwise, dual springs perform no better than these pogo pins in practice.



I too have cells that have been dented in duel spring lights. I think the real problem is flat top cells. The positive terminal is just too weak and is easily dented. You can feel how soft it is when you straighten a bent one out. If the cell manufacturers would just make them stronger I bet the problem would go away.

Either way, it is no big deal. They usually still make contact just fine and even if they don't a small screwdriver or mini needle nose pliers and a bit of careful prying will quickly fix the problem.


----------



## scs

Tachead said:


> I too have cells that have been dented in duel spring lights. I think the real problem is flat top cells. The positive terminal is just too weak and is easily dented. You can feel how soft it is when you straighten a bent one out. If the cell manufacturers would just make them stronger I bet the problem would go away.
> 
> Either way, it is no big deal. They usually still make contact just fine and even if they don't a small screwdriver or mini needle nose pliers and a bit of careful prying will quickly fix the problem.



I've since tossed the 2 cells. They were so dented, I wasn't sure that the the metal wasn't close to making contact with the vent below it.


----------



## gunga

Tachead said:


> I can, what would you like to know specifically? I have the SC600w MKIV Plus, H600Fc MKIII, H600Fd MKIII, and H502c L2 to compare it to. I also have an SC64w on order.



Is the sc64c brighter on the lowest moonlight mode? I really use the lowest level.


----------



## Tachead

gunga said:


> Is the sc64c brighter on the lowest moonlight mode? I really use the lowest level.



If you mean the lowest mode on the H600Fc MKIII(0.01 lumens) then yes, but not much. It is 0.05 lumens so it is the same as the H600Fc's second lowest mode by the specs. 

I just compared them and in real life. Of course the beam profiles are very different but yes, it is close to the same as the second lowest mode.

If you have an Astrolux A01(Nichia 219B SW40 R9050) it is almost identical in brightness to its moonlight mode.


----------



## Tachead

scs said:


> I've since tossed the 2 cells. They were so dented, I wasn't sure that the the metal wasn't close to making contact with the vent below it.


You likely could have fixed them by carefully prying the contact back up. It bends rather easily.


----------



## paojerokid

https://youtu.be/EwMGCogCCCo


----------



## noboneshotdog

Here are my 2 VTC6 batteries that are being rotated in my new SC600 IV HI. This is my work light that gets dropped more often than I want to admit to. Both drops landed on the tailcap. The positive terminal is still in perfect condition.


----------



## noboneshotdog

^^^^
Both of my batteries have an extra clear battery wrap on them for a snugger fit, if anyone noticed. I'm OK with the dents. I kind of come to expect it with the heavy use my work lights get. 

I also have a magnet adhered to my tailcap with double sided tape that remarkably didn't break during the 2 impacts.


----------



## Tachead

noboneshotdog said:


> Here are my 2 VTC6 batteries that are being rotated in my new SC600 IV HI. This is my work light that gets dropped more often than I want to admit to. Both drops landed on the tailcap. The positive terminal is still in perfect condition.


It is only the positive terminal that is really weak. Although I does look like the negative can be dented too. It takes a fall on the head to dent the positive badly generally. When I dropped my SC64c on its head last week it dented my VTC6 quite badly. It was so dented it would no longer make contact on any of my chargers. Luckily, a little careful prying with a small screwdriver quickly fixed the problem.


----------



## scs

Tachead said:


> You likely could have fixed them by carefully prying the contact back up. It bends rather easily.



Nope. Tried it. The dent was so severe, not even a hair could get underneath.


----------



## Tachead

scs said:


> Nope. Tried it. The dent was so severe, not even a hair could get underneath.


Oh, crap you must have dropped that one good. And here I thought mine was bad.


----------



## gogdog

> Did you have to pay shipping for all 3 times you had to return it?
> I think it's ridiculous the customer has to pay for shipping back a defective light.
> More ridiculous you had to do that multiple times.



I mentioned in the forums elsewhere...but if you do the original purchase with Paypal, paypal will reimburse you the return shipping fees if you need to return your light. You do need to activate the feature (its free) for future purchases (its not retroactive). I just returned a fenix light and Paypal reimbursed my return shipping fee. Google "paypal refund return shipping".

What this also means...is that if you can't quite decide between two zebralights, you can buy both! When you return the one you don't want, Paypal will make that return shipping free. But this would also work if a light is defective....Paypal will also pay for that shipping.


----------



## Dio

gogdog said:


> What this also means...is that if you can't quite decide between two zebralights, you can buy both! When you return the one you don't want, Paypal will make that return shipping free. But this would also work if a light is defective....Paypal will also pay for that shipping.



So have you contacted PayPal to see if this is a legitimate cause to return an item and be refunded for the shipping?

Seems a bit of a dog act to me mate..

Why not be less impulsive, do your research and buy what you need/will likely keep?

I guess that's the age of entitlement for ya


----------



## gogdog

You are certainly entitled to your own opinion (age of entitlement and all), though you make it sound like I'm scamming the system. Its completely legitimate. Paypal is essentially just another credit card company that is providing a perk if you use their service. They want people to use Paypal at checkout because they receive the merchant processing fees, so the more people they can get to use Paypal, the more money Paypal makes. All credit card companies give perks/incentives to use their service. 

For example....when doing a zebralight checkout, I need to either choose my Visa card, which will give me a Price Protection Perk so if the price drops within the next 90 days, they will reimburse me the difference. 
OR...I can select Paypal, and know that I can return it for free if I don't like it, choose a different product ...OR, in the case of some users here, that they need to return a defective light and zebralight doesn't pay the return shipping.

When you start the claim....Paypal only really cares about you uploading the proof that you actually shipped the item back to the manufacturer. Its like returning at Walmart...they only care if you have the receipt and just want to know whether its broken or not. Paypal only gives you a dropdown for the "return reason" and gives the following options ->

I no longer need the item
I ordered the wrong item or size
Other
The item arrived damaged
The item didn't meet my expectations
The item isn't as described
The seller sent the wrong item

Certainly, buying 2 zebralights because I'm on the fence about which one I'll prefer is certainly covered by several of these...(I no longer need the item, Other, The item didn't meet my expectations...).

I wouldn't really call myself "impulsive" after doing my research for a week, deciding on a h53 model....but after never having a zebralight before, I can't decide whether I would prefer the h53c or h53w.


----------



## R2RO

gogdog said:


> You are certainly entitled to your own opinion (age of entitlement and all), though you make it sound like I'm scamming the system. Its completely legitimate. Paypal is essentially just another credit card company that is providing a perk if you use their service. They want people to use Paypal at checkout because they receive the merchant processing fees, so the more people they can get to use Paypal, the more money Paypal makes. All credit card companies give perks/incentives to use their service.
> 
> For example....when doing a zebralight checkout, I need to either choose my Visa card, which will give me a Price Protection Perk so if the price drops within the next 90 days, they will reimburse me the difference.
> OR...I can select Paypal, and know that I can return it for free if I don't like it, choose a different product ...OR, in the case of some users here, that they need to return a defective light and zebralight doesn't pay the return shipping.
> 
> When you start the claim....Paypal only really cares about you uploading the proof that you actually shipped the item back to the manufacturer. Its like returning at Walmart...they only care if you have the receipt and just want to know whether its broken or not. Paypal only gives you a dropdown for the "return reason" and gives the following options ->
> 
> I no longer need the item
> I ordered the wrong item or size
> Other
> The item arrived damaged
> The item didn't meet my expectations
> The item isn't as described
> The seller sent the wrong item
> 
> Certainly, buying 2 zebralights because I'm on the fence about which one I'll prefer is certainly covered by several of these...(I no longer need the item, Other, The item didn't meet my expectations...).
> 
> I wouldn't really call myself "impulsive" after doing my research for a week, deciding on a h53 model....but after never having a zebralight before, I can't decide whether I would prefer the h53c or h53w.



The PayPal reimbursement is fine. But ordering and returning to zebralight is the problem. People return because they are tint snobs and don't like the tint they received. Come on people. They aren't amazon. Zebralight is a small company that excels in customer service. If too many keep returning their lights for nit picky reasons they might stop being so lenient with returns. Suggesting you should buy whatever you might want and then returning what you don't is irresponsible. Don't ruin it for everyone.


----------



## Tachead

R2RO said:


> The PayPal reimbursement is fine. But ordering and returning to zebralight is the problem. People return because they are tint snobs and don't like the tint they received. Come on people. They aren't amazon. Zebralight is a small company that excels in customer service. If too many keep returning their lights for nit picky reasons they might stop being so lenient with returns. Suggesting you should buy whatever you might want and then returning what you don't is irresponsible. Don't ruin it for everyone.



I have to agree. 

If people abuse ZL's generous return policy then one day they might just get rid of it.


----------



## moshow9

Dio said:


> So have you contacted PayPal to see if this is a legitimate cause to return an item and be refunded for the shipping?
> 
> Seems a bit of a dog act to me mate..
> 
> Why not be less impulsive, do your research and buy what you need/will likely keep?
> 
> I guess that's the age of entitlement for ya





R2RO said:


> The PayPal reimbursement is fine. But ordering and returning to zebralight is the problem. People return because they are tint snobs and don't like the tint they received. Come on people. They aren't amazon. Zebralight is a small company that excels in customer service. If too many keep returning their lights for nit picky reasons they might stop being so lenient with returns. Suggesting you should buy whatever you might want and then returning what you don't is irresponsible. Don't ruin it for everyone.





Tachead said:


> I have to agree.
> 
> If people abuse ZL's generous return policy then one day they might just get rid of it.



This. If the light is defective, by all means. But because you didn't like the tint or wanted to choose the better tint between multiple lights? That is not a defect nor something that will prohibit proper function of the light.

I have purchased plenty of lights where I either outright didn't like the tint or was less than pleased with it. But not once did I think about returning it. The seller fulfilled their obligation by getting a fully functioning product out to me. Personal preference to tint, imho, should not be held against them. What I have done is either gift that light to a friend or family member, or list it for sale.


----------



## Alan

moshow9 said:


> This. If the light is defective, by all means. But because you didn't like the tint or wanted to choose the better tint between multiple lights? That is not a defect nor something that will prohibit proper function of the light.
> 
> I have purchased plenty of lights where I either outright didn't like the tint or was less than pleased with it. But not once did I think about returning it. The seller fulfilled their obligation by getting a fully functioning product out to me. Personal preference to tint, imho, should not be held against them. What I have done is either gift that light to a friend or family member, or list it for sale.



👍👍👍


----------



## Derek Dean

I'm only go to weigh in on this because I think it's important to discuss all sides of an issue. 

It used to be that you'd go to a store, compare items that were there, by physically handling them and trying them out, then you'd pick one and take it home. The only real reason for a return was if it stopped working within the store's return period. 

But now, with on-line shopping becoming much more the norm, it's different. Often times, even with many hours spent researching on-line forums, it can be difficult to know whether an item is going to be what you hoped it would be, so you take a chance and order it, knowing that you can return it if for any reason if it doesn't fulfill your needs. 

The seller is hoping that by offering this liberal return policy that it will induce the prospective buyer to go ahead and purchase an item, and that once they get the item in their hands, they will be so happy with it that will keep it. 

Now, let's look at a particular scenario: Someone new to flashlights spends a lot of time on CPF checking things out, decides they like ZL, but even with many questions asked can't decide between the HIGH, more throwy version of the SC600, or the Plus, with more lumens, but a more floody version of the SC600. 

They could, of course, make a choice, pick one and order it, and if it works, great...... and if not, they return it and get the other one. That's a reasonable course of action, but what if they kind of like the first one they get, but still aren't quite sure, so they send that one back and get the 2nd one, but then find out they really liked the first one better, so now they have to send the 2nd one back and order the first one again. 

These are expensive lights, and some folks might only purchase one, so they want to make sure they get the right one, and that may only be possible by ordering several models and comparing them side by side.... picking the one that works best for their needs, and then paying to return the other one (or getting PayPal to pay for that if it's allowed). 

I don't think that's entirely unreasonable. It may not be how YOU would do it, but it's certainly not illegal. Yes, ZL is a small company, and if every light got returned for reasons other than a defect, then they might need to begin including some type of restrictions in the return policy, but I'd let ZL worry about that. 

As far as returning because of a bad tint....... well, as far as I'm concerned, that falls within the purview of the current ZL return policy. You see, the only way we get across to the manufacturer how important tint to us is by returning unacceptable tints, and the more people that do that, the quicker ZL will realize just how important tint is to their client base, and in turn will begin demanding better tints from CREE. 

When I sell things on ebay, I always give a "return for any reason" policy, with the buyer paying for return shipping. This helps put the potential buyer at ease, knowing that they can return it if they don't like it "for any reason". It works, and my stuff sells very quickly. 

Now, having said all that...... how often do I return lights..... not very often at all, but I wouldn't hesitate one bit if I didn't like a light. As for tint, I just add filters, it's MUCH easier and more reliable, but I have considered returning my SC6000w IV Plus because the lowest level is only .2 lumen, and I really do miss the .06 or lower of the earlier lights. 

Yes, I knew that going in, and believe me, it almost stopped me from purchasing it, but I ordered it anyway just to see if I could live with the higher lowest level.......because I knew I could return it if I found it really bothered me...... but it looks like I'll end up keeping the light because I love everything else about it, so you see, the ZL light return policy worked in their favor this time. 

Anyway, I just think it's good to try to see all sides of this particular issue : )


----------



## KITROBASKIN

Hey Derek Dean, 
Good to hear from you. 
The ZL's are so small to begin with, have you considered bringing your thumb and/or index finger partially in front of the lens, thereby reducing the amount of light coming out the front, and saving your fully night-adapted eyesight? Not only that, the first thing I do when getting up in the middle of the night is turn the SC62d on with the beam facing the floor down at my feet, and not looking down there. This helps also in case the low setting is on the higher choice, then it is a quick double click to get the light low. Also, a person can keep the beam down by the feet and look ahead of it, thus preserving night vision.

One online retailer of flashlights specifically stated (last time I looked) that dissatisfaction with tint is not a reason to return a flashlight to them. Those who do not like that can shop elsewhere.

When someone is cherrypicking flashlights, does the dealer/manufacturer then sell the returned flashlight as refurbished or as-new with full price? What if the cherry picker dropped the flashlight hard on carpet while playing with it? Someone else gets stuck with the cherrypicker's goof? 

The idea that we used to go to actual stores and actually try out what we buy before we buy it is not always true either. Oftentimes there is no demo model and the boxes are sealed. Got to buy it first.

Did Amazon kind of force other vendors to have liberal return policies, and as with anything involving humans, some will game the system whether out of greed, deceit, or laziness? Zebralight will hopefully continue their return policy and hopefully most will not abuse it. Personally, it seems if a person who wants to try out two or more different ZL's and only keep one, then he/she should ask Zebralight before-hand if that is OK. If the person scoffs at communicating with ZL honestly, then it is clear that person knows that what they are doing is... kind of selfish and self centered maybe? Or maybe a dog-eat-dog mentality?


----------



## gogdog

Ok, its not like I have anything to hide....I'm just following ZLs return policy. I've now sent them an email explaining exactly what I intend to do and if thats kosher or even slightly frowned upon. Its pretty clear what their policy is though ->



> Our guarantee is unconditional. If any purchase fails to meet your complete satisfaction, for any reason, you may return it or exchange it within 30 days of receipt of your shipment.



I mean...I'm pretty sure most anything falls under the "for any reason" clause.



> You see, the only way we get across to the manufacturer how important tint to us is by returning unacceptable tints, and the more people that do that, the quicker ZL will realize just how important tint is to their client base, and in turn will begin demanding better tints from CREE.



As an online retailer myself...complaints from our users drives about 90% of our innovation/development schedule. I love it if a user returns something and actually writes an honest "WHY" they returned it...it allows us to get a "pulse" on our user base and what they are really looking for.

Edit: Here is the email I sent ->


> Hi...I have been researching Zebralights for the past week or so. They are expensive so I want to make sure that I get the right one. I've also never owned a Zebralight so I'm not positive exactly how they differ in real life.
> 
> So...If I order both a h53c and a h53w because I can't quite decide on which color/intensity I would prefer more, is it fine if I return one?
> 
> Basically...would you discourage someone from buying 2 different models when they know for sure that they will return one? Of course I would pay for return shipping, and I wouldn't use them out in the field, just testing at home.


----------



## lampeDépêche

These are hard questions, and I don't have any new answers.

BUT, I want to thank everyone who has spoken so far, because people have kept it civil and constructive.

In particular, gogdog, I want to thank you for answering in a helpful way and not getting defensive or snapping at people.

Your email strikes me as exactly right: if they say "go for it," then you have all the permission you need.

I remember years ago I spoke on the phone to someone at KnifeCenter about purchasing 3 knives with the intention of sending back 2. They said that would make them very unhappy, so I did not do it. (I don't remember exactly what they said--probably not "that will make us very unhappy"--but that was the message all the same). 

So, different sellers have different codes. I try to cooperate with the sellers who are solid and reliable, as both KnifeCenter and ZL have been for me over the years.

And I really appreciate everyone keeping it polite and respectful here.


----------



## archimedes

lampeDépêche said:


> These are hard questions, and I don't have any new answers.
> 
> BUT, I want to thank everyone who has spoken so far, because people have kept it civil and constructive.
> 
> .... I really appreciate everyone keeping it polite and respectful here.



Adding my agreement here.

One other point, with regard to the aforementioned and posted eMail .... Although @gogdog is welcome to post their own side of communications with ZL (and has done so) , please do not "copy-paste" any private replies here.

Paraphrasing and/or presenting a condensed version (summary) of private communications is perfectly acceptable, however.


----------



## gogdog

> Paraphrasing and/or presenting a condensed version (summary) of private communications is perfectly acceptable, however.



Thanks for that...I just read rule #12. So I'll definitely paraphrase. 

And yeah...I'm not one to get offended or anything. I was just surprised because I thought I was going to be thanked for the tip on Paypal shipping refunds, but got a different response instead. Which...is actually good. It gave me a different perspective and helps keep my own morals on check!


----------



## KITROBASKIN

Well done, gogdog. We have all learned.


----------



## Tachead

gogdog said:


> Thanks for that...I just read rule #12. So I'll definitely paraphrase.
> 
> And yeah...I'm not one to get offended or anything. I was just surprised because I thought I was going to be thanked for the tip on Paypal shipping refunds, but got a different response instead. Which...is actually good. It gave me a different perspective and helps keep my own morals on check!



I for one thank you very much for pointing out that PayPal has a shipping refund program👍. I did not know that and have now signed up.

I also thank you for keeping it civil and think you emailing ZL to see what they say was very honest and respectful. I look forward to hearing what they say.


----------



## gunga

I thank every one for keeping it civil and gogdog for the info.


----------



## Derek Dean

Yes, a civil group to be sure. I would like to clarify..... I do understand that we shouldn't abuse these policies, as that's just not good for anybody in the long run. I merely felt the other side of the coin concerning unconditional returns should be looked at. 

And KITROBASKIN, thanks, yes, it's been awhile since I've been around, and thanks too for the suggestions for achieving a super low level with the SC600w IV Plus, but hey, I've got 4 other Zebras that will fill that late night roaming duty quite nicely, so I'll simply use my new ZL as my work light, and use my trusty SC62w as my nightstand light.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

I'll just add that I _hate_ it when people return lights for reasons like "bad tint". Because, it means that "bad tint" gets recycled to someone like me, that accepts the light they get (as long as it works).

The "tint lottery" is stacked against me, if people get to return lights because they only want the ones with perfect tint.

So, I really do _not_ like a company's policy if it is too generous.


----------



## Outdoorsman5

scs said:


> Did you have to pay shipping for all 3 times you had to return it?
> I think it's ridiculous the customer has to pay for shipping back a defective light.
> More ridiculous you had to do that multiple times.



Sorry for the late reply. I did have to pay for shipping each time, but they sent me 3 free 18650's when they sent my light back last time. That was nice of them.

I do want to say (especially to those reading this and are new to Zebralights) that even though I've run into some bad luck with my last two lights, Zebralight is by FAR my favorite flashlight & headlight company. I own over a dozen of them (bought my first around 2010.) Because of the UI (absolutely the very best around), Size/Weight (smallest & lightest in the business), Always on the Cutting Edge, Usual Great Quality, and Customer Service there is no other company that comes close to what they are doing (for my uses). If I'm looking at a light and it's not a ZL, I'm probably not interested because it won't have their awesome UI and it's probably not as small. 

I will be patient through whatever this problem is that they are having. If this problem is widespread with their new lights then what an expensive nightmare they have on their hands. I placed an order last month for the new SC64w and H600w Mk IV. If those both come back defective then I will return them too & just bow out for a while until the problem is fixed (which surely they will fix this problem.) I'd be back though because I still want these new improvements. The new UI with G5, G6, & G7 is AWESOME (I wouldn't mind having a G8, G9, etc.!) I like accessing other outputs quickly without having to reprogram the light with these 3 groups. They keep finding ways to make their lights better, and as long as they do that then I'm a buyer.

Hopefully this will all be resolved soon.


----------



## axd

Today I tried sending customer service an email from a totally different account and a different ISP, but mentioning my personal name , and I still get the issue: as if ZL is rejecting my emails.

Can someone of this thread PM me ? I would like to try something else.

It feels like I'm being shunned by ZL.

(Sorry for interfering in this thread)


----------



## markr6

I have a feeling my SC64w and SC600w IV HI order will take a while 

Regarding their return policy, it seems standard to me. If I buy a pair of pants that fit but just don't look the way I want, I expect to return them no questions asked. Maybe they just wrinkle funny. If I buy a keyboard and the buttons click too loud and annoying, I'm returning it. If I buy running shoes that smash my toes, I'm returning them. None of these are necessarily "defective"; they simply don't work for me and may work for someone else. They will likely end up back in the inventory if I don't use them or tear the tags off. Life is hard like that sometimes.

OTOH, if I mix and purchase a gallon of paint and decide I don't like the color, too bad. I should have bought a $3 sample jar and tested it on the wall. If Zebralight wants to somehow make LED sample packs, I'm in.

Returning a product that grossly fails to meet your expectations is fine. "Window shopping" is not...i.e. buying 8 lights and returning the 7 you don't like. That is taking advantage of a generous return policy. But this is obviously a gray area where opinions will differ.

Personally, I returned two lights that were clearly no good. One was yellow, like bug-bulb yellow. The other was the "purple eye" in center.


----------



## markr6

HA! Literally 5 minutes after writing that I check my mail and see that both just shipped!!


----------



## Outdoorsman5

markr6 said:


> HA! Literally 5 minutes after writing that I check my mail and see that both just shipped!!



Sweet! Put em both through their paces (I know you would without this request) and report back to us. Specifically, program G5, G6, & G7. Then go back into each mode and test L1 & L2, M1 & M2, and H1 & H2 then go to one of the other modes (G5 or G6 or G7) & do the same. Then repeat repeat repeat to see if anything malfunctions. 

It was only after I programmed all three (G5, G6, & G7) and then went from one to another that I became aware of the problem I was having with my SC600w Mk IV HI (could not move from M1 to M2 at times - medium was just stuck unless I disconnected the battery...someone else reported the same problem except it was H1 & H2 that was affected in their light.) 

Hope yours works perfectly!!


----------



## markr6

Fingers crossed. I feel like things are getting too complicated with more to go wrong unfortunately. I know a lot of us here asked for a programmable UI, but now I'm regretting it. I should have these Friday or Saturday to check.


----------



## NPL

I have been thinking about the Zebralight UI, and how it can be easily made much better.

I think its great that we have G5, G6 and G7 modes with freedom to program each mode in G6 and G7, but there is still a big weakness if you ask me.
I get the impression that everyone is adjusting the L M H in different orders to be able to access the setting they want from single click, Hold and double click.
The issue is once the order has been changed from the default L-M-H, ramping by holding down simply doesn't work intuitively. I believe ramping should always be from Lowest to Highest.

The way Zebralight can fix this is to allow users to program the shortcuts (single click, double click) to reach their desired mode without having to change the sequence for ramping.

For example, if you were to keep the default settings in G5, but you prefer to access Medium with a single click, then you would just program your single click to Medium, but the light would still ramp nicely from L , M , H.

What do you guys think? Would that not be ideal?

I currently programmed my H53c to go straight to Medium from single click, but I absolutely hate ramping the light now as it is no longer intuitive. 

Please share your thoughts!


----------



## CelticCross74

!!!?? I just recieved a confirmation tracking number from ZL today 2!! "2-4 days via USPS" AFTER the 2-3 weeks it is taking to ship it here from China!...if I am not posting about finally receiving my copy 2 months after I ordered the IV....tell...SF ..to stop calling their "made in the USA" overpriced lights stuffed with overseas electronics...."Made in the USA"....(cue the 1980's Police hit song "Message in a Bottle")....AGAIN...


----------



## markr6

Personally, I was fine with the old UI. Nice, solid setup with a short learning curve. All I wanted was to ditch the H1 if necessary for H2a and H2b. Or to narrow the gap between M1 and H2. This new UI does that, but also a lot more that I don't need. No big deal, as long as it works as designed without any flukes.

I never understood the "timing" issue. I could press and hold to go into low without any problems...even after downing a keg and 4 lines of coke. And the "preflash"? Pffftt!


----------



## Outdoorsman5

NPL said:


> I have been thinking about the Zebralight UI, and how it can be easily made much better.
> 
> I think its great that we have G5, G6 and G7 modes with freedom to program each mode in G6 and G7, but there is still a big weakness if you ask me.
> I get the impression that everyone is adjusting the L M H in different orders to be able to access the setting they want from single click, Hold and double click.
> The issue is once the order has been changed from the default L-M-H, ramping by holding down simply doesn't work intuitively. I believe ramping should always be from Lowest to Highest.
> 
> The way Zebralight can fix this is to allow users to program the shortcuts (single click, double click) to reach their desired mode without having to change the sequence for ramping.
> 
> For example, if you were to keep the default settings in G5, but you prefer to access Medium with a single click, then you would just program your single click to Medium, but the light would still ramp nicely from L , M , H.
> 
> What do you guys think? Would that not be ideal?
> 
> I currently programmed my H53c to go straight to Medium from single click, but I absolutely hate ramping the light now as it is no longer intuitive.
> 
> Please share your thoughts!



I like moving from Low to Medium to High, so I have kept G6 & G7 somewhat consistent with G5. Because of this the only change I'd make with the UI is adding a G8 & G9  What I've done with G6 & G7 is just selected different high modes, medium modes, & low modes so I can have quicker access to them. I even like the idea of setting G7 to a basic setup (one low, one medium, & one high - I do this by making H1 & H2 the same output, M1 & M2 the same, and L1 & L2 the same) that way if I hand the light off to someone else I won't have to train them on how to use it - just tell them to hold the button down. I love the UI!!


----------



## markr6

CelticCross74 said:


> !!!?? I just recieved a confirmation tracking number from ZL today 2!! "2-4 days via USPS" AFTER the 2-3 weeks it is taking to ship it here from China!...if I am not posting about finally receiving my copy 2 months after I ordered the IV....tell...SF ..to stop calling their "made in the USA" overpriced lights stuffed with overseas electronics...."Made in the USA"....(cue the 1980's Police hit song "Message in a Bottle")....AGAIN...



I don't think it's possible for them to give a USPS number while it's still on the way from China. Is it? I guess if they printed the label first, but I doubt they would do that. Crap...I hope that's not the case for mine. I just don't think they would do that.

Update-- nope, just updated and on it's way!


----------



## CelticCross74

21 digit tracking code(DHL, EMS, postal air mail) out of China-8 digit USPS tracking number once they arrive in the states. My ZL confirmation email at the bottom "please allow 2-6 weeks for one if not all of those 3 different services so USPS can 2-4 day deliver from China"!!?? 

This is SO STUPID! What actually has been going on here? Possible communication break down between two completely different cultures and languages?


----------



## markr6

I don't know what's going on there. I think that's the first I heard of a US buyer getting it straight from China.


----------



## Michael_Fr

Outdoorsman5 said:


> It was only after I programmed all three (G5, G6, & G7) and then went from one to another that I became aware of the problem I was having with my SC600w Mk IV HI (could not move from M1 to M2 at times - medium was just stuck unless I disconnected the battery...someone else reported the same problem except it was H1 & H2 that was affected in their light.)
> 
> Hope yours works perfectly!!



I have the same issues with my SC600w Mk IV. I played around a lot with the programming in the past couple of days and twice I could not change from M1 to M2 (no, I did not assign the same brightness to both). Also twice, my light was stuck in medium and could only be turned off by removing the tailcap. Also, I had the impression that every now and then it would save one brightness level higher than I had programmed in modes just above moonlight.

I have now finished programming and stopped changing a lot of things around and the light works flawless. I could not clearly reproduce the issues, but they seem to occur if you change groups and program the different modes a lot. I don‘t think I‘ll return it unless I get issues during normal operation.


There is only one thing I would like to change on the UI: Strobe is easily activate when turning the light on in H1 (single click) and then directly changing to H2 (double click). I wish strobe could be deactivated completely since I never use it.


Best, Michael


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

markr6 said:


> I never understood the "timing" issue. I could press and hold to go into low without any problems...even after downing a keg and 4 lines of coke. And the "preflash"? Pffftt!



My issue with timing was never when I was awake and drunk or high. It was getting up in the middle of the night, and pressing the switch to get a nice low sub-lumen mode.

"Oooops! I clicked too short. Arrrrh! My eyes!!!"
" Dammit! I better double-click to drop down a mode? (I'm asleep and confused.) Arrrrrgh! Strobe!!! It thought is was a triple-click."

By this time, my wife wakes up and kills me.

I now keep a clicky light that always starts in moonlight, by my bed. When my SC600w mkIV HI arrives in another day or two, that might change.


----------



## Michael_Fr

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> My issue with timing was never when I was awake and drunk or high. It was getting up in the middle of the night, and pressing the switch to get a nice low sub-lumen mode.
> 
> "Oooops! I clicked too short. Arrrrh! My eyes!!!"
> " Dammit! I better double-click to drop down a mode? (I'm asleep and confused.) Arrrrrgh! Strobe!!! It thought is was a triple-click."
> 
> By this time, my wife wakes up and kills me.
> 
> I now keep a clicky light that always starts in moonlight, by my bed. When my SC600w mkIV HI arrives in another day or two, that might change.



Exactly the reason why I programmed the low modes to H1/2 and vice versa. 

Best, Michael


----------



## markr6

I just click and hold slightly longer than a no-mode flashlight. I thought doing cocaine was more hardcore than just being tired, but maybe not!


----------



## Lou Minescence

I have had my SC600w IV for about a week now. Working flawless so far. I have the short click ( high ) and press and hold ( low ) modes programed to low outputs. I have the mid programed to a low and max output. The mid works best for when I walk the dog.
My Zebralight headlamp with G5,6,7 outputs would lose its low beacon output when the light was in G6 or G7. Instead of flashing in the lowest output it would flash in the highest low output. The SC600w IV does not have that problem. Im am happy with this light.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

markr6 said:


> I just click and hold slightly longer than a no-mode flashlight. I thought doing cocaine was more hardcore than just being tired, but maybe not!



I could try snorting some coke when I wake up in the middle of the night, just before trying to turn on my Zebralight. But, seems like a lot of work. I'll just try the new UI instead.


----------



## Tachead

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> I could try snorting some coke when I wake up in the middle of the night, just before trying to turn on my Zebralight. But, seems like a lot of work. I'll just try the new UI instead.



Lol, that might make ruining your night vision less of a problem. 

Personally, I only found that I flashed myself when I first started using ZL's. Now that I have muscle memory for the click and hold I can't even remember the last time I hit high by accident.


----------



## gurdygurds

This was my biggest concern and why I always steered clear of the little AA Zebras. I thought I would blind myself in the middle of the night. Now oddly enough I find myself programming 0.01 to press and hold and high mode to single click. SC53C PERFECT light for around the house.


----------



## gogdog

Well, I got my response back from Zebralight...but, it was a bit of a letdown. By that...I feel like I didn't really get what the management of ZL really feel. I just got a quick reply from some customer support person that simply copy and pasted the return policy from their returns and refunds page, and thats it. Nothing else. 

If I take that at face value...that really does mean that its ZL policy that returns are unconditional, for any reason. But...people should realize, myself included, that processing any order and shipping it out does cost a company money so buying 8 products to return 7 would be abuse. But I'm still of the opinion that if you really are torn between two products that I still wouldn't hesitate to buy both. I don't feel that you should do it often though, but...I did do it for my first ZL purchase and I'm anxiously awaiting their arrival. This is my first $60 flashlight so want to be sure its what I want.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Michael_Fr said:


> Exactly the reason why I programmed the low modes to H1/2 and vice versa.



That would mess up the way I use my older Zebralights. I think I'll just create a G6 group that still has the low-med-high when holding, but I'll set them all to very low outputs. That way, if I screw up, it will still be a sub-lumen output.

Of course, that means I'll have to remember to set the G6 mode to be active before I go to bed....

Maybe I'll stick with my current (non Zebra) light as the bedside light.


----------



## KITROBASKIN

Thanks for the report regarding ZL's customer-focussed return policy. Seems like you are justified in your quest to get what works best for you.


----------



## Tixx

Michael_Fr said:


> Exactly the reason why I programmed the low modes to H1/2 and vice versa.
> 
> Best, Michael



Same here, I reverse the Low group and the high groups so it is press and hold for the H levels and click for the L levels. Plus the double click to M levels has a preflash of moonlight instead of high.


----------



## NPL

Tixx said:


> Same here, I reverse the Low group and the high groups so it is press and hold for the H levels and click for the L levels. Plus the double click to M levels has a preflash of moonlight instead of high.


So are you reversing the H and L levels with the intention to change the single click shortcut, or with the intention to change the way the light ramps?

If you could program the single click to go straight to Low, would you still reverse the H and L?


----------



## evgeniy

Anyone received SC600FC/FD plus IV ?


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

A future UI improvement would be to have the option to turn off strobes completely. i.e., triple-click just acts like a double-click.

Occasionally, with the existing UI, I accidentally trigger strobes if I turn on the light (single-click), then change from H1 to H2 (double-click). It gets interpreted as a triple-click, which I definitely don't want. Since I dislike strobes, it would be good to have the option to turn them off. The BLF Q8 has that feature.

I'm not even sure what the purpose of strobes are on a small EDC light, like a Zebralight. On a tactical light, maybe.


----------



## Tachead

evgeniy said:


> Anyone received SC600FC/FD plus IV ?



http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?395603-The-Official-Zebralight-Thread/page38

Post #1133

I haven't seen any reports of Fc's yet though.


----------



## Tachead

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> A future UI improvement would be to have the option to turn off strobes completely. i.e., triple-click just acts like a double-click.
> 
> Occasionally, with the existing UI, I accidentally trigger strobes if I turn on the light (single-click), then change from H1 to H2 (double-click). It gets interpreted as a triple-click, which I definitely don't want. Since I dislike strobes, it would be good to have the option to turn them off. The BLF Q8 has that feature.
> 
> I'm not even sure what the purpose of strobes are on a small EDC light, like a Zebralight. On a tactical light, maybe.



What I do is set the strobe mode to the low beacon. That way if you accidentally go to it you don't get strobed, you only get a very dim slow moonlight beacon.

Some people use the strobes for biking and walking to alert vehicles. The beacons are very useful to backcountry campers, kayakers, fisherman, etc. to help you find your tent or campsite at night. The moonlight beacon is also useful to find your flashlight late at night when you wake up for a leak etc.


----------



## Tixx

NPL said:


> So are you reversing the H and L levels with the intention to change the single click shortcut, or with the intention to change the way the light ramps?
> 
> If you could program the single click to go straight to Low, would you still reverse the H and L?



Yes, I programmed the L levels to a click and the H levels to a click and hold by reversing them in the program. Easier to single click to L than risk not holding long enough and getting H instead.


----------



## markr6

SC64w and SC600w IV HI delivery updated from Saturday to TODAY!!! Very nice surprise from USPS.

p.s. I have 4 new NCR18650GA just sitting around. So I'm using two of those for these new lights to be sure of any battery crushing. The cells in my SC63w really crushed the tops, and possibly some with the SC600w III HI (but I can't remember if I swapped cells from another light). Running a charge-test cycle on them now. Come on mail man!


----------



## Tixx

In Stock

SC600Fc Mk IV Plus 18650 XHP50 Floody 4000K High CRI Flashlight


----------



## markr6

Tested the SC600w IV HI (replacement) and SC64w last night. ABSOLUTELY THRILLED with this set!! They even included a free NCR18650GA.

I ordered some spare silver clips (SC63 style) and planned on replacing the black, but I don't know. Even after all the trash I talked about the black, I'm OK with this. Maybe it was just my SC5w II that it didn't work well with. Seems fine on the SC64w. Not loose, not tight.

No issues with the IV HI turning off within 1/2 second like my previous light. No issues with the SC64w at all.

Nice dark anodizing. Quiet yet responsive switches - the best yet!!

Tint? Damn, just perfect. PERFECT!! Both of them are a match and I detect the slightest tannish/pinkish color. *Almost like a good 4500K Nichia. Absolute perfection.* So glad I didn't go with the SC64c.

And some pics...








I tried to vary the distance and modes to match the intensity, but still blew out the SC600. You can still see the nice similar tints though.






Thanks again Zebralight!!


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

markr6 said:


> Tested the SC600w IV HI (replacement) and SC64w last night. ABSOLUTELY THRILLED with this set!!
> 
> Tint? Damn, just perfect. PERFECT!! Both of them are a match and I detect the slightest tannish/pinkish color. *Almost like a good 4500K Nichia. Absolute perfection.*



To the site mods: someone has hi-jacked Mark's account. Please reset it so the real Mark can start posting again.


----------



## markr6

Haha what? I always liked the Nichia 4500K.

Or is it because I'm not complaining?


----------



## ven

:twothumbsGOOD TINT!

Nice one mark, sound similar to my sc63w in tint! Kind of like a little rosy in ways, very nice on the eye! I do find the HI emitters pretty consistent in "tint"(generally) compared to the domed.


----------



## Tachead

My SC64w will be here early next week. Hopefully I get a nice tint too.


----------



## ven

Tachead said:


> My SC64w will be here early next week. Hopefully I get a nice tint too.



I am sure you will, you would have to get pretty unlucky imo. I am yet to have a bad xhp35/xhp35 HI (and xpl HI for that matter)"tint" so to speak. I find 4500k pretty much perfect with a hint of warmth


----------



## Tachead

ven said:


> I am sure you will, you would have to get pretty unlucky imo. I am yet to have a bad xhp35/xhp35 HI (and xpl HI for that matter)"tint" so to speak. I find 4500k pretty much perfect with a hint of warmth



I hope so. My worst tinted XHP35 HD was very purplish/magenta(far below the BBL). I don't mind a bit of roseyness/magenta but, this was extreme. 

I like 4500K for all around use as well but, prefer 4000K or less at night. Now I will have both with the 64c&w.

I wish ZL would offer the SC64w with the XHP35 HI too. I would love a throwy SC64 with no tint shift:rock:.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

markr6 said:


> Haha what? I always liked the Nichia 4500K.
> 
> Or is it because I'm not complaining?



Yes, because you're finally happy about tint, so it can't be the real you! :laughing:

My SC600w MkIV HI is "out for delivery" now, so I'm looking forward to equally good tint as you. No :green:


----------



## markr6

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Yes, because you're finally happy about tint, so it can't be the real you! :laughing:
> 
> My SC600w MkIV HI is "out for delivery" now, so I'm looking forward to equally good tint as you. No :green:



Got it. Other than 2 or 3 really bad lights, the rest were just "ok" to good enough. But these are downright amazing. I didn't plan on upgrading my old H600w, but maybe.

Running both on high, I don't notice the PID kicking in. On the SC63w is was very noticeable, with stepdowns at 1-second intervals after running it for about 15 seconds at room temp. It's either less noticeable/more gradual on the SC64w, or it runs cooler and efficient, or just not working. I think my eyes are just missing it. Great lights!


----------



## noboneshotdog

markr6 said:


> Got it. Other than 2 or 3 really bad lights, the rest were just "ok" to good enough. But these are downright amazing. I didn't plan on upgrading my old H600w, but maybe.
> 
> Running both on high, I don't notice the PID kicking in. On the SC63w is was very noticeable, with stepdowns at 1-second intervals after running it for about 15 seconds at room temp. It's either less noticeable/more gradual on the SC64w, or it runs cooler and efficient, or just not working. I think my eyes are just missing it. Great lights!




Okay here is a very unscientific test with my Etekcity lasergrip 630 infrared thermometer.

At about 5 minutes into run time on my sc600 MK4 HI on its highest output 1400 lm the temperature came up to 134 degrees Fahrenheit and continued to stay at 134 degrees up to the 10-minute mark where I ended my test.

At the 10-minute mark the spot just below the heat sink fins was 134 degrees, the center of the body was 128 degrees and the tail cap was 125 degrees.

I do have my PID set at its highest level. 5 degrees higher than what it came out of the package set at.

I didn't notice any drop in output in lumen intensity on my ceiling.

My feeling is that these are running efficient enough that PID doesn't need to kick in on these units due to the efficiency of the LED or my PID just isn't working. Difficult to say. But, seeing that the temperature stayed at 134 degrees from the five minute to ten minute mark without any drop would bring me to that conclusion.


----------



## Connor

I'm pretty sure all of the 18650-powered Mk4s drop in brightness due to heat/PID regulation. Do a ceiling bounce and use your smartphone as a lux meter. 

As mark6 said above: the new Mk4s step down completely unnoticeably .. I can't see any stepping on my SC600Fd Mk4 Plus either .. but the lux meter does.


----------



## Tachead

noboneshotdog said:


> Okay here is a very unscientific test with my Etekcity lasergrip 630 infrared thermometer.
> 
> At about 5 minutes into run time on my sc600 MK4 HI on its highest output 1400 lm the temperature came up to 134 degrees Fahrenheit and continued to stay at 134 degrees up to the 10-minute mark where I ended my test.
> 
> At the 10-minute mark the spot just below the heat sink fins was 134 degrees, the center of the body was 128 degrees and the tail cap was 125 degrees.
> 
> I do have my PID set at its highest level. 5 degrees higher than what it came out of the package set at.
> 
> I didn't notice any drop in output in lumen intensity on my ceiling.
> 
> My feeling is that these are running efficient enough that PID doesn't need to kick in on these units due to the efficiency of the LED or my PID just isn't working. Difficult to say. But, seeing that the temperature stayed at 134 degrees from the five minute to ten minute mark without any drop would bring me to that conclusion.



The thermal regulation is working perfectly. 134F is about the exact temp it should be holding it at with the PID turned up all the way. The new PID just has so many steps, and steps down so gradually, that your eyes just aren't seeing it(humans eyes are not good at detecting small changes in brightness). If you had a light meter you would see that it drops gradually as it heats up and then levels out at the output it needs to be at to maintain the set temperature. Zebralight has the most advanced thermal regulation in the industry. With the tests I have done, it makes most other company's look primitive by comparison.


----------



## pappajohan

Still on the fence trying to convince myself that the SC64 will be a justifiable upgrade from my SC63......

For sure going to replace my SC600 mk3 HI with the mk4 equivalent, but as I tend to carry my SC63 more the SC64 will be my main focus....

Any good input?[emoji4]


----------



## markr6

Connor said:


> I'm pretty sure all of the 18650-powered Mk4s drop in brightness due to heat/PID regulation. Do a ceiling bounce and use your smartphone as a lux meter.
> 
> As mark6 said above: the new Mk4s step down completely unnoticeably .. I can't see any stepping on my SC600Fd Mk4 Plus either .. but the lux meter does.



Good idea...it's working on my 64w! Just arbitrary numbers bounced under my desk:

Start - 1806
1:22 - 1443
1:40 - 1152
1:50 - 898

In that 2 minutes, I swear nothing changed. But when I turned it off an back on, back up to 1806 and only then could I tell the difference since it was much brighter. Good stuff!!


----------



## recDNA

Tachead said:


> Did you drop the light at all or expose it to any shock? If not, your cell may have just been a little longer then the tolerances allow(the tolerances are very tight unfortunately).
> 
> These new MKIV's are going to be better then the MKIII's due to the force being dispersed between more pins and around the perimeter of the terminal but, if a hard enough shock or drop happens they will still dent cells. My 64c dented a cell the other day when I dropped it on a hard surface but, up until that point the cells were fine.
> 
> These pogo pins just don't offer any give once fully compressed and the flat top cells positive terminals are pretty weak and prone to denting(unlike button tops which are much stronger). These lights will never protect batteries as well as a duel spring design will but, it is a trade off for a smaller light and easier tailcap installation and removal. It should also be noted that even many duel spring designs will dent flat top cells with enough shock. Malkoff's will dent flat top cells, for instance, if dropped hard enough.
> 
> The only thing you can really do if you want added protection is use an O-ring to help cushion the positive terminal. And, of course, don't drop the light if you can help it(I can't apparently and now my nice new light has a ding in it along with my brand new VTC6 lol).


I'm done with ZL until/unless this issue is completely eliminated


----------



## Tachead

recDNA said:


> I'm done with ZL until/unless this issue is completely eliminated



It is not just ZL man. It is the unprotected flat tops that are the problem. Several other brands and designs of lights will dent them too including some firearm ready weapon lights. The tops on these cells are ridiculously soft(I know because I have bent them with a screw driver). If you want tougher cells you need to use button tops and ZL(other then the H600 series) won't take them. The only company that has designed a system to protect against this that I know of is Surefire. They use a plastic buffer to stop the spring from being completely compressed and thus protect the terminal. Here it is...







Some other companies like Malkoff and Oveready use O-rings to help protect the cell terminals.


----------



## recDNA

But ZL requires them. Other companies offer choices. Whatever the reason I don't want any flashlight that does this. The shame is it was done to shave just a few mm of the length which is pretty meaningless. Not looking to **** anyone off. Just scared me. I mention it because I was just about to buy the new 600 cuz it is in stock. I had a battery in a different flashlight vent once. I don't need that excitement again ever.


----------



## Tachead

recDNA said:


> But ZL requires them. Other companies offer choices. Whatever the reason I don't want any flashlight that does this. The shame is it was done to shave just a few mm of the length which is pretty meaningless. Not looking to **** anyone off. Just scared me. I mention it because I was just about to buy the new 600 cuz it is in stock. I had a battery in a different flashlight vent once. I don't need that excitement again ever.



I know man. If you remember, I was one of the biggest opponents against these new pogo pin designs. So much so that I didn't buy any of their new flashlights until a few weeks ago. But, now I realize it isn't a big deal. Honestly, these new ZL flashlights are the best EDC lights I have ever owned and any shortcomings they have are far outweighed by the many great pros. These really are awesome lights man and you would definitely be missing out if you didn't try one. 

Plus, ZL addressed the pogo pin issue and totally redesigned the layout and amount of them to make them be more friendly to cells...

Old design...





New design...





This new design should give them much better protection and they should now only be damaged in hard head down drops. Unfortunately, until cell manufacturers start making stronger positive terminals(not likely to happen as they don't even condone using this way), these cells will never be fully immune to dents in any light though.


----------



## recDNA

Ya not for me but thanks for the explanation. I'm certain to drop it and I do not trust dented unprotected li ion cells. I'm frankly afraid of thermal runaway or gas venting. Go to silly lengths to avoid it. I'm not suggesting others should feel that way nor that my concern is reasonable.


----------



## Tachead

Oh, I should add, I really don't think you need to worry about any cell venting due to this. People have dented them so bad(in other lights) there wasn't even a space left under the positive terminal(it was fully flat). These lights will not dent them anywhere near that bad. Plus, there is another metal plate under the metal terminal. Imo it would be near impossible to puncture those two metal plates with any flashlight terminal design. And, if you have a bad drop and don't feel good about the damage, you could always just retire the cell.


----------



## noboneshotdog

Tachead said:


> The thermal regulation is working perfectly. 134F is about the exact temp it should be holding it at with the PID turned up all the way. The new PID just has so many steps, and steps down so gradually, that your eyes just aren't seeing it(humans eyes are not good at detecting small changes in brightness). If you had a light meter you would see that it drops gradually as it heats up and then levels out at the output it needs to be at to maintain the set temperature. Zebralight has the most advanced thermal regulation in the industry. With the tests I have done, it makes most other company's look primitive by comparison.



Yup they are spot on. 

They kept my light almost perfectly at 134 degrees for the duration of my heat test.

And Markr6 was right. The PID does kick in but is barely noticeable. My lux app started at 250 lux and ended at 150 lux after 10 minutes on high of my SC600 MKIV HI. 

I couldnt visibly detect any decrease in lumens and the output was still very high at the end of the test. 

The PID is so sensitive that I saw a lux increase almost immediately after dissipating heat with my hand. 

Wow! I am even more impressed with this light after doing these tests.


----------



## Tachead

recDNA said:


> Ya not for me but thanks for the explanation. I'm certain to drop it and I do not trust dented unprotected li ion cells. I'm frankly afraid of thermal runaway or gas venting. Go to silly lengths to avoid it. I'm not suggesting others should feel that way nor that my concern is reasonable.



It is not the cell that gets dented though. It is the flimsy raised metal terminal. There is at least one other layer of steel underneath the terminal with a couple of mm air space in between. And, the terminal bending absorbs the shock and protects that. 

But, it's up to you man. Just know, you are definitely missing out. As you know from owning older ZL flashlights, you can't really top these for EDC lights and these new ones are even better in almost every way.


----------



## recDNA

If the metal on top bends in and touches the metal under it does it short? In another thread a guy had thermal runaway and the only apparent problem with the GA was the dented ends.


----------



## Tachead

noboneshotdog said:


> Yup they are spot on.
> 
> They kept my light almost perfectly at 134 degrees for the duration of my heat test.
> 
> And Markr6 was right. The PID does kick in but is barely noticeable. My lux app started at 250 lux and ended at 150 lux after 10 minutes on high of my SC600 MKIV HI.
> 
> I couldnt visibly detect any decrease in lumens and the output was still very high at the end of the test.
> 
> The PID is so sensitive that I saw a lux increase almost immediately after dissipating heat with my hand.
> 
> Wow! I am even more impressed with this light after doing these tests.




Yep, ZL's are awesome:rock:. It is even cooler when you see the PID working in graph format. I will post a runtime output graph of my SC64w when it gets here next week.


----------



## Tachead

recDNA said:


> If the metal on top bends in and touches the metal under it does it short? In another thread a guy had thermal runaway and the only apparent problem with the GA was the dented ends.



I'm not sure but, I don't think these lights could ever dent a positive terminal in that much. The pogo pins just aren't long enough. And, the space is fairly large. I have never seen a ZL dent a cell more then a little bit even when severe drops have happened. SCS said he dented a couple GA's so bad, in another brand of light with duel springs, that he couldn't even get anything under to bend it back up and they were fine. My guess is the guy in the other thread you are talking about had another issue going on like bad charging habits or a defective cell. Or, he some how very severely dented it which these lights don't do. 

There is always going to be a bit of danger when using lithium ion cells unfortunately(even if they don't get dented). You can always recycle a cell if you feel unsure about it if it gets dented.


----------



## recDNA

So if they touch there is a short? I wondered if u can put a screwdriver in there to bend back up but if connect is a dead short obviously a really bad idea


----------



## Tachead

recDNA said:


> So if they touch there is a short? I wondered if u can put a screwdriver in there to bend back up but if connect is a dead short obviously a really bad idea



I am not sure as I have never seen one dented enough, in any light, to touch(the space underneath is pretty large). I know the sides of the cell are negative though but, not sure about the top underneath the positive terminal. 

You can definitely bend it back up. It bends really easily because it is so soft and weak. I have only had to do it once because it wouldn't quite touch the terminals in one of my chargers. I just used a small flat blade screwdriver and carefully bent it back up. Problem solved. But, if you are uncomfortable trying it or want to be extra safe, it is only $5 for a new one so, just throw it in the recycle bin.

Keep in mind, this doesn't happen all the time. I have only severely dented two cells in any light ever(one in a ZL one in an Armytek). Both were severe bezel down falls onto extremely hard surfaces(concrete and porcelain). They were so hard they dented the bezels.


----------



## recDNA

Well the MK4 is listed as backordered now so my problem is solved. Earlier today ZL told me it was in stock.


----------



## Tachead

recDNA said:


> Well the MK4 is listed as backordered now so my problem is solved. Earlier today ZL told me it was in stock.




Oh, it is the cool white you are after?


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Okay, I finally received my SC600w MkIV HI. Here are my initial impressions...


Great light! It's actually a little smaller than I expected, which is nice. Good fit for the hand. I'm glad I didn't go for the SC64w. I have three AA Zebralights if I need something more pocketable.


The tint is very good, too. I measure it at 4200K. It compares very favourably to a Nichia 219B tint at 4000K. Not quite as good as a Nichia. There's a slight hint of green in the corona, but overall it's very pleasant. My SC5w has the cleanest tint of my Zebralights; I'd say it is perfect, with no hint of green anywhere. However, it's also somewhat cooler, so I prefer the warm tint of the SC600w.


I'm glad I got the HI version. I considered the regular SC600w, but I think it would have been too floody for my purpose. The HI version still has quite a large hot spot; larger than I was expecting. Plenty of flood for outdoors, and even indoors. It's definitely not a thrower, but it has enough throw to make it useful outdoors. Very good balance of throw and flood, IMO. But I always found the other Zebralights too be too floody, and not very good outdoors.


I like how the thermal step-down works. It's not noticable at all, until you turn the light off and on again. I programmed mine down -5C, because I don't like hot lights. Even so, it still gets pretty warm after a couple of minutes. This kind of surprised me, but I guess it shouldn't. 46C is pretty warm. Well, I think I dropped the temperature down; there's no way to tell without a thermal camera. It's -25C outside right now, with a wind chill of -40. Maybe I should go check if it stays on maximum, outside? No, maybe not.


I'm using Samsung 30Q flat-top cells, and there's no hint of any denting on either battery end. The 6 pogo pins on the positive terminal should help (rather than the 3 they used to use). I haven't dropped it yet, though. There's actually just enough room to use Samsung 30Q button-tops in it, though I certainly wouldn't recommend it. Those button-tops are barely raised.


The efficiency is excellent. After playing around with it for an hour or so, my battery voltage is still at 4.07v. Very impressive.


I haven't seen any sign of the "bugs" mentioned. I programmed G6, and modes in G5 still work fine. I haven't tried setting up G7 yet, but I don't think I'll need it.


The only negative I have so far is the moonlight modes. The lowest is not nearly dim enough. The lowest is about the same brighness as the brighest moonlight mode on most of my other Zebralights. It's okay, but really not dim enough for middle-of-the-night if it's dark. I think the SC600w should have gone one level lower. Well, I'll try it tonight and see if it's too bright. With the moon out and light coming in the window, it will probably be fine, but when the moon is no longer up, I think it might be too bright. I estimate it at about 0.1 "real lumens", or about 0.3 "Zebralight lumens". It seems brighter than the 0.07 lumens in the spec, even if you assume that Zebralight is now listing their moonlight modes accurately (which they always over-estimated in the past). I was expecting about 0.01 lumens, which would have matched their "0.06 lumen" figure on previous Zebralights.


----------



## recDNA

Tachead said:


> Oh, it is the cool white you are after?


yes. All of my other lights are neutral or Hi CRI Just want max lumens in pocketable size


----------



## Tachead

recDNA said:


> yes. All of my other lights are neutral or Hi CRI Just want max lumens in pocketable size




Cool. The SC64 is in stock:devil:.


----------



## recDNA

Tachead said:


> Cool. The SC64 is in stock[emoji317].


Yes but at this output level I feel like the mass of the bigger light is needed. In any event the crushed cells still freak me out. I'd end up constantly recycling cells due to dents.


----------



## Tachead

recDNA said:


> Yes but at this output level I feel like the mass of the bigger light is needed. In any event the crushed cells still freak me out. I'd end up constantly recycling cells due to dents.



Yep, it helps a bit if you are going to use the highest PID modes for longer durations but, it is not a huge difference. The SC600 is nicer in the hand as well but, the SC64 is definitely better for pocket EDC imo. 

Lol, unless you plan on constantly dropping your light bezel first on concrete I wouldn't worry about it much.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

On my new SC600w MkIV HI, I noticed something odd. When I turn the light off, the LED continues to glow for a long time. I have other lights that glow for a few seconds, but this light will glow for almost an hour! It gets dimmer and dimmer, and you can only see it in total darkness after the first few seconds, but it definitely glows a long time. It's not powered by the battery, since nothing changes when I unscrew the tailcap. So, there must be some big slow-draining capacitor in the driver that leaks power into the LED for quite a long time.

It's not an issue, but it is something that's much more pronounced on this light than any of my others. I have a Sunwayman that does this for a few minutes, but not nearly as long as the SC600w MkIV HI.

Any others notice this?

Oh, and I also measure my light to have a max output of about 1050 lumens. That's only 75% of the 1400 lumens that Zebralight lists. But, I also measure my CCT at 4200K, which is warmer than the 4500K in the spec (and I like the warmer tint). So, maybe it's just my sample?

Has anyone else measured the lumens from their SC600w MkIV HI?






Tachead said:


> Yep, it helps a bit if you are going to use the highest PID modes for longer durations but, it is not a huge difference. The SC600 is nicer in the hand as well but, the SC64 is definitely better for pocket EDC imo.
> 
> Lol, unless you plan on constantly dropping your light bezel first on concrete I wouldn't worry about it much.



Yes, the SC600 is nice in the hand, not too big at all. AA/AAA lights are better for the pocket, anyway. And yes, I don't find it's a cell-denter, which I was concerned about before I bought. I think a few cases has blown that worry out of proportion.


----------



## mjgillen

markr6 said:


> Tested the SC600w IV HI (replacement) and SC64w last night. ABSOLUTELY THRILLED with this set!!



Congratulations!


----------



## SubLGT

recDNA said:


> If the metal on top bends in and touches the metal under it does it short? ...



There are some photos (dropbox links) of an unwrapped NCR18650GA here, where you can see the construction details on the positive end:

https://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/t...ench-test-results-a-great-10a-battery.688543/


----------



## recDNA

SubLGT said:


> There are some photos (dropbox links) of an unwrapped NCR18650GA here, where you can see the construction details on the positive end:
> 
> https://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/t...ench-test-results-a-great-10a-battery.688543/


I don't undertand it but if the top bends down and touches metal below does it short?


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

recDNA said:


> I don't undertand it but if the top bends down and touches metal below does it short?



No, they should both be part of the cathode terminal. Under all that, are layers of material (perpendicular to the terminal), both cathode and anode, separated by a sheet between them. You'd have to squish the terminal into those layers for it to short out. I think that would require quite a bit of force, more than just bending the positive terminal bit that sticks up.

Oh, but if you straighten out a bent positive terminal, don't do it with a metal screwdriver. The anode terminal includes the sides of the cell, and if there's a rip in the outside wrap, you might short the battery.


----------



## likethevegetable

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> On my new SC600w MkIV HI, I noticed something odd. When I turn the light off, the LED continues to glow for a long time. I have other lights that glow for a few seconds, but this light will glow for almost an hour! It gets dimmer and dimmer, and you can only see it in total darkness after the first few seconds, but it definitely glows a long time. It's not powered by the battery, since nothing changes when I unscrew the tailcap. So, there must be some big slow-draining capacitor in the driver that leaks power into the LED for quite a long time.



I'm not an LED expert, but I know that white LEDs are commonly achieved by coating the die in a phosphor material (phosphorescence = glow in the dark). Maybe the particular phosphor that CREE used has a longer time constant than other LEDs


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

likethevegetable said:


> I'm not an LED expert, but I know that white LEDs are commonly achieved by coating the die in a phosphor material (phosphorescence = glow in the dark). Maybe the particular phosphor that CREE used has a longer time constant than other LEDs



I doubt that is the case. The phosphor coatings typically react in microseconds. At most, they probably glow for a few milliseconds after removing the the blue light that causes them to glow. I think the SC600w LED glow, which lasts for close to an hour, has to be the result of the driver gradually releasing its charge. It must have a capacitor in it, without a bleeding resistor to drain it.


----------



## recDNA

What does ZL charge for shipping? Got a gift card so don't want to go over.


----------



## Tachead

recDNA said:


> What does ZL charge for shipping? Got a gift card so don't want to go over.




You are in Canada correct?


----------



## recDNA

No USA


----------



## Tachead

recDNA said:


> No USA



Oh, my bad. In though you were in Canada. 

I am not sure then but, I don't think it is much for the cheapest option. Maybe someone can chime in from the US.


----------



## Tachead

It appears it is free if over $50US.

http://www.zebralight.com/Free-Shipping-Worldwide_ep_43-1.html


----------



## recDNA

Thanks I couldn't find that.

Any particular advantage of the sc600 MK4 cool over the sc64 cool?


----------



## likethevegetable

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> I doubt that is the case. The phosphor coatings typically react in microseconds. At most, they probably glow for a few milliseconds after removing the the blue light that causes them to glow. I think the SC600w LED glow, which lasts for close to an hour, has to be the result of the driver gradually releasing its charge. It must have a capacitor in it, without a bleeding resistor to drain it.



Wouldn't the capacitance have to be pretty high to last the long (T=RC)? and if it was high enough and on the output of the boost converter, wouldn't we see charging/discharging transients when going between modes? I'd be interested in seeing what ZL has to say.


----------



## Tachead

recDNA said:


> Thanks I couldn't find that.
> 
> Any particular advantage of the sc600 MK4 cool over the sc64 cool?



No problem.

I don't have those particular models but, do have both a SC600w MKIV Plus and SC64c which are exactly the same emitter aside.

*SC600 MKIV
*
A tiny bit more throw(due to larger reflector), better in hand feel, more grippy(due to knurling), slightly better thermal performance, and a smoother running tailcap due to pogo pins.

*SC64*

Much better for a front pants pocket EDC imo. It has a nicer screwed on clip that is easier to clip to your pocket and stays put, it is quite a bit thinner and lighter, and it shreds your pocket less and clips and unclips more smoothly due to the lack of knurling.


----------



## recDNA

Tachead said:


> No problem.
> 
> I don't have those particular models but, do have both a SC600w MKIV Plus and SC64c which are exactly the same emitter aside.
> 
> *SC600 MKIV
> *
> A tiny bit more throw(due to larger reflector), better in hand feel, more grippy(due to knurling), slightly better thermal performance, and a smoother running tailcap due to pogo pins.
> 
> *SC64*
> 
> Much better for a front pants pocket EDC imo. It has a nicer screwed on clip that is easier to clip to your pocket and stays put, it is quite a bit thinner and lighter, and it shreds your pocket less and clips and unclips more smoothly due to the lack of knurling.


The sc64 doesn't have pogo pins in the tailcap?


----------



## Tachead

recDNA said:


> The sc64 doesn't have pogo pins in the tailcap?



Nope, just at the positive end. The tail cap has a spring(it's the same as the H600's tailcap) .


----------



## recDNA

I wonder how they can claim the same output as the 600 with less efficient conductor?


----------



## noboneshotdog

likethevegetable said:


> Wouldn't the capacitance have to be pretty high to last the long (T=RC)? and if it was high enough and on the output of the boost converter, wouldn't we see charging/discharging transients when going between modes? I'd be interested in seeing what ZL has to say.



I just tested my SC600 MKIV HI and am not detecting any after glow for more than a couple of seconds.


----------



## Tachead

noboneshotdog said:


> I just tested my SC600 MKIV HI and am not detecting any after glow for more than a couple of seconds.



Try going in a pitch black room, letting your eyes adjust, and looking closely.


----------



## noboneshotdog

Tachead said:


> Try going in a pitch black room, letting your eyes adjust, and looking closely.



Still no more than 5 seconds on mine.


----------



## ingokl

recDNA said:


> I wonder how they can claim the same output as the 600 with less efficient conductor?


The less efficient conductor only influences the required current draw from the battery (and thus the runtime), but not the LED current which is regulated by the driver. Anyway I think the difference will be relatively small and only be relevant (if at all) at max power levels.

Just to do the math:
The tailcap spring has a electrical resistance of less than 0,01 Ohm (at least the one of my SC62w). At 4A battery current (around 15 Watt and more than max power of the XHP35) the spring would cause a powerloss of 0,16 Watt (I x I x R), which is only slightly more than 1% of the total power.


----------



## recDNA

Thanks for the explanation about the spring. I just noticed that Nitecore has a new MH23 with 1800 lumens that isn't much bigger than the sc600 yet takes all kinds of 18660 with no head compression issues. I have the MH20GT and I am pleased with it so may put ZL on the back burner until more info is out on the sc64. Sometimes user lumen ratings are far different from spec. as with any brand.


----------



## Tachead

recDNA said:


> Thanks for the explanation about the spring. I just noticed that Nitecore has a new MH23 with 1800 lumens that isn't much bigger than the sc600 yet takes all kinds of 18660 with no head compression issues. I have the MH20GT and I am pleased with it so may put ZL on the back burner until more info is out on the sc64. Sometimes user lumen ratings are far different from spec. as with any brand.



The MH23 is way bigger then the SC600 and almost twice the weight. Here is the MH20GT next to the SC600 MKIII and the MH23 is even longer...












I should also point out that I have owned both the MH20 and the SC600 series and the ZL blows it away in almost every way. It's brighter, a lot smaller and lighter, has much better build quality, potted electronics, tougher anodizing, better thermal regulation, a more advanced and efficient driver, a more durable recessed button, a much more advanced and deluxe programmable UI, and better customer support.

The only thing the MH20 really has going for it is the built in charging, two stage button, and the more advanced voltage readout.

The MH20, GT, and 23 are still nice lights but, they are no where near ZL imo.


----------



## Tachead

Oh, I forgot to mention that Nitecore's will only take button top cells due to mechanical reverse polarity protection.


----------



## recDNA

Wow there really is a huge difference. I guess that is how they facilitate protected batteries, charging by usb, and increased throw. The sc600 is too big for me to pocket carry as is thE MH23. I'm still interested in the sc64 as I said but I hope some user with a meter and a sphere will give lumen and candella ratings. One guy who bought the 600 Hi showed way less than the claimed 1400 lumens on startup. I wonder if the sc64 has the same issue? I haven't seen any reviews with numbers yet. I'm still interested just decided to wait to see some user numbers.


----------



## Tachead

recDNA said:


> Wow there really is a huge difference. I guess that is how they facilitate protected batteries, charging by usb, and increased throw. The sc600 is too big for me to pocket carry as is thE MH23. I'm still interested in the sc64 as I said but I hope some user with a meter and a sphere will give lumen and candella ratings. One guy who bought the 600 Hi showed way less than the claimed 1400 lumens on startup. I wonder if the sc64 has the same issue? I haven't seen any reviews with numbers yet. I'm still interested just decided to wait to see some user numbers.



My SC64w should be here Monday or Tuesday. I have a high end data logging light meter but, have not calibrated my setup to measure lumens or cd unfortunately. I can give you some impressions though if you would like. I will also say that ZL is generally very accurate with their lumen measurements and this new HI stuff is the first thing I have ever read about them not meeting their lumen numbers. All of Selfbuilt's measurements of their earlier lights showed them to be very accurate. Also, another user compared his new SC64w to his older SC63W and said it was very noticeably brighter. I believe it is somewhere earlier in this thread.


----------



## recDNA

Yes that is an excellent point about the 64 looking brighter than the 63

My 62w is my EDC so I am a fan.


----------



## Tachead

recDNA said:


> Yes that is an excellent point about the 64 looking brighter than the 63
> 
> My 62w is my EDC so I am a fan.



I never got to try a 62w unfortunately. Everyone seems to like that one. 

Here is the post I was talking about, it was a pain to find as I forgot it was in the SC64c thread...



tompen41 said:


> Just received my SC64w lV today Order # 10376154 First impressions, the reflector is slightly different than the SC63w, it is a little more dimpled and not quite as smooth as the SC63w. Anodizing is identical on both. 5 pogo pins in the front instead of the 3 of the SC63, both have spring in tailcap. Obvious difference in lumens when you first turn them on. SC64 much brighter. Second difference and I don't understand why, the SC63 heats up faster on Hi than the SC64 and both using the red GA batteries from ZL. In a little over a minute the 63 gets uncomfortable to hold and the 64 can go another 30 to 45 seconds before it gets to the same temp. And the 64 is 300 lumens more! Clip is different but I don't find it a problem, however I did order 3 of the old style chrome clips as referenced earlier in this thread. I think I do like the old one better. Light here now can't wait to check in dark. There seems to be a slight difference in the hotspot diameter even though they are listed as 80 and 12 degrees.
> 
> Another observation: The hot spot on the SC64w is smaller and spill is smaller also than the SC63w even though the specs say 80 and 12 for both, the SC64 hot spot is definitely a little smaller which would mean it throws a little farther.


----------



## recDNA

Thanks! The smaller hotspot and spill would also make it look brighter.

On the 600 MKIV HI

[ QUOTE] 
Oh, and I also measure my light to have a max output of about 1050 lumens. That's only 75% of the 1400 lumens that Zebralight lists. But, I also measure my CCT at 4200K, which is warmer than the 4500K in the spec (and I like the warmer tint). So, maybe it's just my sample? [/QUOTE]


----------



## Tachead

recDNA said:


> Thanks! The smaller hotspot and spill would also make it look brighter.
> 
> On the 600 MKIV HI
> 
> [ QUOTE]
> Oh, and I also measure my light to have a max output of about 1050 lumens. That's only 75% of the 1400 lumens that Zebralight lists. But, I also measure my CCT at 4200K, which is warmer than the 4500K in the spec (and I like the warmer tint). So, maybe it's just my sample?



No problem. I don't think it is a large difference in hotspot or spill size, probably just a small variation from sample to sample because the 64 uses the exact same emitter as the 63 and I don't think ZL changed the reflector at all other them maybe a coarser OP. 

Yep, I follow all these threads. There has been at least three people that have measured the HI and all said that it was equal to or slightly less bright then the MKIII HI. I have a feeling that something is going on with this first run of HI's. I bet the driver has been misprogrammed for H1 or something. Hopefully ZL sorts it out.

There have been no reports of low outputs with other models however.

It is important also to note that a couple hundred of lumens on H1 doesn't really make much difference in actual use anyway. Especially considering H1 is more of a quick use mode and quickly steps down due to heat.


----------



## recDNA

The funny thing is even with step down you still seem to perceive the original brightness for quite some time. A trick your brain plays on you.

BTW, thanks for the best flashlight convo I've had in a long time. I used to sit and chat flashlights for hours following 7 or 8 very active threads. Miss those days.


----------



## Tachead

recDNA said:


> The funny thing is even with step down you still seem to perceive the original brightness for quite some time. A trick your brain plays on you.
> 
> BTW, thanks for the best flashlight convo I've had in a long time. I used to sit and chat flashlights for hours following 7 or 8 very active threads. Miss those days.



Yeah, are(humans) eyes really suck at perceiving differences in brightness. I also find that once you are over 1000ish lumens, it takes a lot more to impress. Probably because it takes about 4000 to seem close to twice as bright. A couple or few hundred extra lumens is basically nothing and really not worth getting excited about imo. 

No problem lol. I find I go through spurts during boring parts of the year(usually winter). Sometimes I won't read on CPF or anywhere about flashlights for months or even years. But, I always end up coming back because I have always been into flashlights(25+ years). I do have many other hobbies though so, I tend to cycle through them. Gotta love CPF, there are some nice, helpful, and very intelligent people on here and it's always fun BSing with others with a common interest.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

noboneshotdog said:


> I just tested my SC600 MKIV HI and am not detecting any after glow for more than a couple of seconds.



You need to be in a perfectly dark room, and your eyes have to be fully dark-adapted. You won't notice it if you just try it in a dark room after going in there from a bright room. (And make sure to turn it off and on with your eyes closed.) It just barely glows for a long time, gradually getting dimmer, and you have to look really close at it, directly facing the lens. Well, that's how it works on mine.

I have this on several other lights, just never this long.





recDNA said:


> Thanks! The smaller hotspot and spill would also make it look brighter.
> 
> On the 600 MKIV HI
> 
> [ QUOTE]
> Oh, and I also measure my light to have a max output of about 1050 lumens. That's only 75% of the 1400 lumens that Zebralight lists. But, I also measure my CCT at 4200K, which is warmer than the 4500K in the spec (and I like the warmer tint). So, maybe it's just my sample?


[/QUOTE]

BTW, I measured 1150 lumens on a fresh cell, with my SC600w MkIV HI. It drops to about 1050 lumens when the battery is down to 3.7v. I guess it's not perfectly regulated. Still, quite a ways from 1400 lumens, though. But mine is also warmer than 4500K, so perhaps that's the reason?


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Has anyone tried the mode group reset on the models with the new UI? Specifically, the SC600w MkIV HI ?

The manual states, "Three consecutive 5-click (or 6-click, 7-click) to reset the G5 (or G6, G7) back to the factory default settings"

I can't seem to get it to work. It doesn't reset my mode groups. No big deal if it doesn't work, but I'm surprised if this slipped through QA testing. Or, maybe I'm doing it wrong?

I set my G7 modes all to the lowest moonlight setting. (Pretty easy to verify if anything changes.)
Then, I clicked 7 times (quickly), followed by a pause, then another 7 times, then another pause, then another 7 times.
I check my modes, and they were all still at the lowest moonlight level.

Am I missing something about what this is supposed to do?


----------



## Connor

Do not pause. Click 15 / 18 / 21 times in one go.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Connor said:


> Do not pause. Click 15 / 18 / 21 times in one go.



Well, that works! Thank you. I guess I'm dumber than I look (well, I look kinda dumb too). :thumbsup:


----------



## Knaver

Hello, I recently ordered the SC600fc MKIV Plus, (4000K) and it’s supposedly arriving on Tuesday. It is my first ZL flashlight although I have had 3 of their headlamps.


----------



## Tachead

Knaver said:


> Hello, I recently ordered the SC600fc MKIV Plus, (4000K) and it’s supposedly arriving on Tuesday. It is my first ZL flashlight although I have had 3 of their headlamps.


Hi. I started with their headlamps as well and recently tried their flashlights. They are great too. Let us know what you think of it when it arrives👍.


----------



## markr6

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Well, that works! Thank you. I guess I'm dumber than I look (well, I look kinda dumb too). :thumbsup:



No problem, I had to think about it for a while. The wording is a little confusing but I couldn't say it any better.

_Three consecutive 5-click (or 6-click, 7-click) to reset the G5 (or G6, G7) back to the factory default settings

_On another note, I noticed the clip is very loose on my new SC64w. Hopefully it just needs tightened. I remember some SC62s in the past having taps too shallow so you couldn't tighten it. Hopefully that's not the case with mine! The smallest torx bit I have is T9, so I had to order some...probably uses a T6 or 7. Not sure yet but I'll have enough to try.


----------



## Tachead

markr6 said:


> No problem, I had to think about it for a while. The wording is a little confusing but I couldn't say it any better.
> 
> _Three consecutive 5-click (or 6-click, 7-click) to reset the G5 (or G6, G7) back to the factory default settings
> 
> _On another note, I noticed the clip is very loose on my new SC64w. Hopefully it just needs tightened. I remember some SC62s in the past having taps too shallow so you couldn't tighten it. Hopefully that's not the case with mine! The smallest torx bit I have is T9, so I had to order some...probably uses a T6 or 7. Not sure yet but I'll have enough to try.


If it is tapped too shallow it is super easy to fix. Just file a tiny bit off the bottom of the screws but, be careful to smooth out the edges and the start of the thread after you are done. Also, do not over tighten them or you will strip them as the body is just aluminum which is soft. A tiny bit of blue Loctite(242 or 243) can be used if you want to protect against loosening down the road.


----------



## Tachead

Oh, if you want to check if they are too short then remove the clip and lightly screw the screws into the body and compare the gap to the clip thickness.

Again, do not over tighten! These screws are tiny and just need to be snug.


----------



## lampeDépêche

So has anyone answered the question that I really care about?

Namely: is the new SC600 Mk IV Plus (the XHP50.2 w/ the clear window) an improvement over the Mk III HI?

I got a Mk III HI when it came out, and have EDC'ed that ever since. Seems about perfect for my uses.

Out of the new crop of MK IV lights, only the Plus neutral tempts me--doubling the lumen output, even for short bursts, would be great. And the new modes might be nice, too.

So has anyone who has both of them said, "yes, it's a good trade-up" or "no, not a lot of improvement for your hundred bucks"?


----------



## Tachead

lampeDépêche said:


> So has anyone answered the question that I really care about?
> 
> Namely: is the new SC600 Mk IV Plus (the XHP50.2 w/ the clear window) an improvement over the Mk III HI?
> 
> I got a Mk III HI when it came out, and have EDC'ed that ever since. Seems about perfect for my uses.
> 
> Out of the new crop of MK IV lights, only the Plus neutral tempts me--doubling the lumen output, even for short bursts, would be great. And the new modes might be nice, too.
> 
> So has anyone who has both of them said, "yes, it's a good trade-up" or "no, not a lot of improvement for your hundred bucks"?


Check out the Plus thread. There was just a very thorough beamshot comparison posted.

I don't have the HI(yet) but, I do have the Plus, SC64w, and SC64c. 

They are very different lights and will both excel at different tasks/uses. 

The HI has a tight hotspot and will throw better but, is less ideal for close to medium range tasks. It also has a more consistent tint with less tint shift across the beam due to the XHP35 HI emitter(HI emitters have the lowest tint shift offered in a Cree emitter). 

The Plus on the other hand has a huge hotspot and very bright spill. It will be better for close to medium range tasks. The Plus is also more efficient and ultra bright on H1. For medium range tasks it is like turning on a high output 120V floodlight. It lights up my whole back yard like daylight. But, it has more tint shift across the beam(even more then a standard XM-L2 or the like) due to Cree's new fully phosphor coated emitter design(used on the XP-L2, XP-G3, XHP50.2, XHP70.2). Keep in mind this doesn't matter much in actual use though and is more of a white wall problem.


----------



## lampeDépêche

Tachead said:


> Check out the Plus thread. There was just a very thorough beamshot comparison posted.



Thanks, Tachead!

Those beam-shots are very informative (thanks, Paojerokid!). I have gotten used to the Mk III HI's throw, and don't want to give it up.

I may go for the MK IV HI, since it has the same beam profile, an increase in lumens (probably not noticeable, 1.1k vs. 1.4k), and the new UI. 

But I may wait, as well--I'm not sure it's a $90 improvement.

ETA: let me put that differently: The Mk III HI, currently in stock and on sale, is a *very* good deal.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

lampeDépêche said:


> Thanks, Tachead!
> 
> Those beam-shots are very informative (thanks, Paojerokid!). I have gotten used to the Mk III HI's throw, and don't want to give it up.
> 
> I may go for the MK IV HI, since it has the same beam profile, an increase in lumens (probably not noticeable, 1.1k vs. 1.4k), and the new UI.
> 
> But I may wait, as well--I'm not sure it's a $90 improvement.
> 
> ETA: let me put that differently: The Mk III HI, currently in stock and on sale, is a *very* good deal.



IMO, $10 extra is worth it for the new UI, even if everything else was the same.


----------



## markr6

Sometimes you gotta give it a shot. I sold my MK III HI and took a beating, but I was happy to do so for the new UI alone. But then I got a defective HI IV so returned it. Now the replacement is even better with a very nice tint...matches my new SC64w as well. All worked out in the end!


----------



## recDNA

markr6 said:


> Sometimes you gotta give it a shot. I sold my MK III HI and took a beating, but I was happy to do so for the new UI alone. But then I got a defective HI IV so returned it. Now the replacement is even better with a very nice tint...matches my new SC64w as well. All worked out in the end!


When I see a review with a sphere rating of 1400 lumens on Hi I will be interested. I do wish the 64 was also available with MKIV XHP HI emitter for just a little extra throw.


----------



## Tachead

Well, just got my SC64w. So far I am loving it and I ended up getting a great rosey creamy tint.


----------



## markr6

Tachead said:


> Well, just got my SC64w. So far I am loving it and I ended up getting a great rosey creamy tint.




YES!!!!!!


----------



## Tachead

markr6 said:


> YES!!!!!!




:rock:


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

recDNA said:


> When I see a review with a sphere rating of 1400 lumens on Hi I will be interested. I do wish the 64 was also available with MKIV XHP HI emitter for just a little extra throw.



I got about 1150 lumens on my 600w MkIV HI. However, that could be +/- 10% or so. It was a quick check. I'll do a better check another time. I do, however, don't believe it's 1400, even on a fresh cell.

I noticed that it gradually decreases output down to under 500 lumens, due to PID. But it takes several minutes for that. There's enough mass on the 600w to soak up a lot of heat before PID kicks in. This was tail-standing. If you're holding it, it can probably run brighter on PID.

BTW, have there been any other lumen measurements on this light?


Oh, markr6, I thought I had the same bug with my light that you had (shutting off on max, right after turning on). It happened 2 or 3 times. I thought, "crap!" However, I cleaned the threads and end of the body tube, and made sure I screwed the cap on tight. I haven't seen it since. I've tried to replicate it dozens of times, including outside below -20C. So, if anyone experiences something similar, it may just be you didn't screw down the tailcap tight. Maybe the high current required on max needs a solid tailcap connection, or the driver cuts the light. I'm not saying that's what the issue was with yours, but a loose cap seems to have similar symptoms.


----------



## anthon87

I have an integrating shpere but my SC600w Hi was sent 36 days ago and I'm still waiting for it...


----------



## markr6

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Oh, markr6, I thought I had the same bug with my light that you had (shutting off on max, right after turning on). It happened 2 or 3 times. I thought, "crap!" However, I cleaned the threads and end of the body tube, and made sure I screwed the cap on tight. I haven't seen it since. I've tried to replicate it dozens of times, including outside below -20C. So, if anyone experiences something similar, it may just be you didn't screw down the tailcap tight. Maybe the high current required on max needs a solid tailcap connection, or the driver cuts the light. I'm not saying that's what the issue was with yours, but a loose cap seems to have similar symptoms.



Yeah I think it was you that mentioned it before, so I cleaned it up real good. Still happened about 1/3 of the time...always on the first try. I could never reproduce it twice in one shot, so I'm pretty sure it was some defect. Had nothing to do with the cold like I originally though since it did it indoors all the time at 70°. New one is working just fine!


----------



## gunga

Tachead said:


> Well, just got my SC64w. So far I am loving it and I ended up getting a great rosey creamy tint.



How do you like it vs the sc64c?


----------



## Tixx

Anyone else notice this? XHP 50 vs XHP 50.2 and the High output differences. About a 200 lumen loss using XHP 50.2

SC600Fc Mk IV Plus 18650 XHP50 Floody 4000K High CRI Flashlight
ree XHP50 Cool White LED

Nominal CCT: 4000K 
Typical CRI: 93-95 
Tint deviation: 3-step 
High: H1 *1816* Lm (PID, 

H600Fc Mk IV 18650 XHP50.2 Floody 4000K High CRI Headlamp


 Cree XHP50.2 Neutral White LED
Nominal CCT: 4000K 
Typical CRI: 93-95 
Tint deviation: 3-step 
 
High: H1 *1568* Lm (PID, )


----------



## Connor

No .. it's not a "loss" it's a design choice by Zebralight. The headlights do have considerably less mass so H1 cannot be set as high without being regulated down very quickly.

The real question is: why didn't they use XHP50.2 for the SC600Fc/d Mk4 Plus. ;-)


----------



## Tixx

Connor said:


> No .. it's not a "loss" it's a design choice by Zebralight. The headlights do have considerably less mass so H1 cannot be set as high without being regulated down very quickly.
> 
> The real question is: why didn't they use XHP50.2 for the SC600Fc/d Mk4 Plus. ;-)



Yes, it was an observation wondering why each was chosen for their respective hosts.


----------



## markr6

Tachead said:


> If it is tapped too shallow it is super easy to fix. Just file a tiny bit off the bottom of the screws but, be careful to smooth out the edges and the start of the thread after you are done. Also, do not over tighten them or you will strip them as the body is just aluminum which is soft. A tiny bit of blue Loctite(242 or 243) can be used if you want to protect against loosening down the road.



Thanks for the info. The cheapo $11 bit set I got on amazon is pretty nice. The T6 fit and I was able to tighten it down. I didn't shorten them so I did tighten pretty good...I was worried about stripping it like you said.

I think I will keep the black clip on even after all the trash I talked about it 

p.s. Here's another beam shot. I'm just so thrilled with the tint on my SC64w. Both 4500K, the Nichia just appears a little cooler in person like in this photo. Otherwise very close. Good color rendering on both. In a way the SC64w (80+ CRI) seems better than the Nichia (92) by warming thing up just a bit.


----------



## gunga

Ugh. I want to get one but trying to decide between sc64c and sc64w. My sc5c II was quite good (the second, the first was too green) so I'm leaning towards the 64c but pinkish tint is awesome...


----------



## markr6

gunga said:


> Ugh. I want to get one but trying to decide between sc64c and sc64w. My sc5c II was quite good (the second, the first was too green) so I'm leaning towards the 64c but pinkish tint is awesome...



I got a nasty yellow SC5c II, so I went with the w here. But you just never know. The CRI of 80 vs 90 never really impressed me (household bulbs are a totally different story), so it was an easy choice.


----------



## radsaq

markr6 said:


> I got a nasty yellow SC5c II, so I went with the w here. But you just never know. The CRI of 80 vs 90 never really impressed me (household bulbs are a totally different story), so it was an easy choice.



I got an SC5c II and liked it so much I got an SC53c... which I liked so much I got an SC64c. :laughing: The beam profile and tints between the three are essentially identical on a white wall, so if gunga is a fan of the SC5c II emitter then the SC64c will probably be nearly indistinguishable from that.


----------



## gunga

I didn't like thr tint and cri of my sc63w. Do you find the sc64w to be better?


----------



## Tachead

gunga said:


> How do you like it vs the sc64c?



Give me a day or two more to play with it a little and compare to the 64c, as I just got it yesterday, and then I will post a comparison:thumbsup:.


----------



## markr6

gunga said:


> I didn't like thr tint and cri of my sc63w. Do you find the sc64w to be better?



My SC63w was pretty good, but definitely not something to get excited about. Nothing to complain about either. Most of my other Zebralights were at least a little better. This SC64w is MUCH better. When I start doing comparisons with that L11C Nichia, I know it's a keeper!


----------



## gunga

Hmmm. I found the neutral SC62W and sc63w to be "ok". Didn't like the colour rendering. The sc64w sounds potentially interesting. I do want to get one. Tachead, you dropped your sc64c right?

I may try to get one second hand but like minty usually.


----------



## Tachead

Here guys, here are some quick comparative outdoor beamshots of the SC64w and SC64c. It was a pretty bright night unfortunately and these arent the greatest shots but, it will hopefully give you an idea. The SC64w was on H2(875 lumens) and the SC64C was on H1(900 lumens).

Control





SC64w





SC64c










I will post more shots and my impressions once I have some more time with the 64w.


----------



## Tachead

Here are a couple of a colourful magazine to try and show the colour rendition differences. The SC64w was on L1(2.9 lumens) and the SC64c was on L1(2.1 lumens).

SC64w






SC64c


----------



## gunga

Difference is too subtle for me to see on my phone.


----------



## Tachead

gunga said:


> Difference is too subtle for me to see on my phone.



I just redid the tree pics and added a gif. See if that is any better. Sorry, this is my first time trying this.


----------



## Tachead

gunga said:


> Hmmm. I found the neutral SC62W and sc63w to be "ok". Didn't like the colour rendering. The sc64w sounds potentially interesting. I do want to get one. Tachead, you dropped your sc64c right?
> 
> I may try to get one second hand but like minty usually.



Yep, I dropped it and put a nice ding in the bezel. Just under a 4 foot drop onto a porcelain sink. Dented it but barely even fizzed on the anodizing. Dented a brand new VTC6 pretty good too. At least I proved ZL's are tough.


----------



## ven

Bummer, but it’s out of the way now, can relax and enjoy the light more I find.


----------



## markr6

gunga said:


> Difference is too subtle for me to see on my phone.



I think this is due to the camera balancing and adjusting the shot. A side by side would probably show a difference, or white balancing a camera to a specific temperature. I don't know if Tachead can do that, depends on the camera.


----------



## pse

How would you compare a sc64w/c to SC600w mk4 plus or the SC600Fd mk4 plus? Had to return SC600w mk3 because of defective LED, now would like to decide...


----------



## Tachead

markr6 said:


> I think this is due to the camera balancing and adjusting the shot. A side by side would probably show a difference, or white balancing a camera to a specific temperature. I don't know if Tachead can do that, depends on the camera.


Yes, my camera was just set to auto. I will try redoing it tonight with it set to a fixed CCT. What would you suggest for CCT? Sorry, I am a rookie at comparative shots.


----------



## markr6

Tachead said:


> Yes, my camera was just set to auto. I will try redoing it tonight with it set to a fixed CCT. What would you suggest for CCT? Sorry, I am a rookie at comparative shots.



No expert here, but I try to ignore the "5000K is standard...sunlight.." mentality. That doesn't always work. Just go with what actually makes the light look like it does in person. It will likely be anywhere from 4000-5000K.


----------



## Tachead

ven said:


> Bummer, but it’s out of the way now, can relax and enjoy the light more I find.


Yeah, no big deal. My lights are users so it is bound to happens eventually. At least I know now that ZL's can role with the punches☺️.


----------



## Connor

Tachead said:


> Yes, my camera was just set to auto. I will try redoing it tonight with it set to a fixed CCT. What would you suggest for CCT? Sorry, I am a rookie at comparative shots.



[email protected] is 5780K, that's why I use 5800K for my tint shots.


----------



## Tachead

pse said:


> How would you compare a sc64w/c to SC600w mk4 plus or the SC600Fd mk4 plus? Had to return SC600w mk3 because of defective LED, now would like to decide...


The 64's are smaller, lighter, and have a better clip. The also clip and unclip easier and will be more friendly to fabric due to their lack of knurling. 

The Plus(XHP50.2) is considerably brighter, has a slightly larger hotspot, feels better in the hand, is more grippy(due to the knurling), has better thermal efficiency(will run longer/brighter on PID modes), and will likely be slightly more efficient due to the newer generation emitter.

I have never owned a frosted lens Plus(Fd&c) flashlight so I cannot comment on them.


----------



## NPL

Tachead said:


> Yes, my camera was just set to auto. I will try redoing it tonight with it set to a fixed CCT. What would you suggest for CCT? Sorry, I am a rookie at comparative shots.


You should use a CCT that falls between both tints you are using for most realistic comparison of how your eye will perceive the light. So between the W and C, I would set the white balance to around 4200 or 4300.


----------



## markr6

NPL said:


> You should use a CCT that falls between both tints you are using for most realistic comparison of how your eye will perceive the light. So between the W and C, I would set the white balance to around 4200 or 4300.



Well put. Not comparing harnessed sun here, although someone feel free to invent that! Two fairly warm-ish lights so low 4000s sounds good.


----------



## Michael_Fr

Tachead said:


> Yeah, no big deal. My lights are users so it is bound to happens eventually. At least I know now that ZL's can role with the punches[emoji5].



Dropped my brand new SC600w on concrete as well after less than a week. Had not closed the zipper of my jacket pocket properly and it fell out as I was putting on my jacket while walking away from my car. I even kicked it accross the concrete accidentally. Resulted in a few dings in the anodizing and my brand new VTC6. Looks like one of MY lights now.

At least I still have a shiny SC64w. We‘ll see how long it lasts...


Best, Michael


----------



## Tachead

Here you go guys. This is the magazine one done over using 4300K white balance...


----------



## Tachead

Here is another again at 4300K. This is with the SC64w on M2(22.9 lumens) and the SC64c on M2(16.6 lumens)...


----------



## gunga

I'm more interested in your impressions!


----------



## markr6

They both look nice. Which would you keep if you could only keep one?


----------



## Tachead

gunga said:


> I'm more interested in your impressions!



Well, they are both nice lights. The 64w is definitely brighter but, not a huge amount. The trade off is it heats up way faster on H1. The 64c can run for a long time, if not indefinitely on H1, before stepping down much due to heat. I like the 64c better at nightime as its yellowish tint is pleasing when you wake up in the middle of the night. I also suspect it will better for outdoor nighttime activities like camping and hiking. I like the 64w better during the day as it is a bit cooler and has a more pleasing tint indoors. It is a better all around EDC light imo. About tint, the 64w definitely wins overall on my samples anyway(keep in mind this is highly subjective). It has a rosey creamish tint that is a bit more pinkish then your average Nichia 219B. It has a minimal amount of tint shift across the beam. The tint shifts a bit still from hotspot to corona like most Cree's but, its minimal. The 64c on the other hand has a yellowy tint with maybe just a slight bit of roseyness in the hotspot on the highest modes. It has a stronger tint shift towards strong yellow with maybe a slight hint of green in the corona(depending on ambient lighting). This is due to Cree's new full phosphor coating used on the XP-L2, XP-G3, XHP50.2, and XHP70.2. Colour rendition wise they are both pretty good. Maybe not quite Nichia good but, not enough worse to matter in normal use imo. The 64c is slightly better then the 64w but, again not a huge difference and the tint and CCT difference is much more noticeable.

Overall, I like them both and both excel at different uses. If I could only keep one however, it would be the 64w for its added brightness and better all around tint and CCT for general EDC tasks. 

I hope this helps. Let me know if you have any more questions.


----------



## gunga

Nice. I was using my sc5c II yesterday and liking it. I'll need to figure it out and get one of these sc64. Thanks for your insites.


----------



## Tachead

Well, I think I am officially a ZL junkie guys. I just ordered a SC600w MKIV HI. 

I did sell my SC600w MKIV Plus though to make room. I just found that although the Plus was a fair amount brighter, it didn't offer enough of a difference in beam profile compared the the 64's and I prefer them for front pocket EDC.

I have now sold off most of my other lights and am running ZL almost exclusively aside from lanterns(because they don't make them). I plan to get a couple of new single/2 mode tactical style lights(Surefire, Malkoff, Elzetta) that can be firearm mounted if needed and a new compact WML(likely X300/XC or TLR series) and then I think I am good for lights for a while. 







I have the H600Fc MKIII for nightime headlamp use, the H600Fd MKIII for daytime headlamp use, the H502c L2 for reading in bed, the SC64c for nightime flashlight use, the SC64w for daytime flashlight use, and now the SC600w MKIV HI for a throwier option to go along with my floody headlamps outdoors. I think I will soon have all my lighting bases covered once again.


----------



## Tachead

gunga said:


> Nice. I was using my sc5c II yesterday and liking it. I'll need to figure it out and get one of these sc64. Thanks for your insites.



No problem man, anytime:thumbsup:. 

I think if you like your SC5c II you will like the SC64c as it should have a near identical tint and CRI(tint lottery aside of course). It's just a bigger, brighter, higher capacity version of it really. Honestly, its thermal performance on H1 is pretty impressive too. Here is a 5 minute runtime/output graph of it on H1(900 lumens)in a 23.8C room...






Notice, not much stepdown at all and the lights head was only 45.3C at the end of the test.


----------



## Tachead

markr6 said:


> They both look nice. Which would you keep if you could only keep one?




See the post under yours:thumbsup:.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

recDNA said:


> When I see a review with a sphere rating of 1400 lumens on Hi I will be interested. I do wish the 64 was also available with MKIV XHP HI emitter for just a little extra throw.



I've been doing some more output testing with my SC600w MkIV HI, and I think I've settled near about 1200 lumens. I don't have a sphere, so I'm really ball-parking it against other lights of which I've tested previously. Those other lights tend to test close to what others have measured.

Anyway, I certainly wouldn't claim any better accuracy than +/- 10% from real lumens. And, if my calibration on prior lights is off, it could be even less accurate than +/- 10%.

1200 lumens tends to be around the usual Zebralight mark-down when it comes to output claims, so it's probably around that. I'm very interested in what other people measure. I'd be surprised if people get 1400 lumens.

I'll happily give up a couple of hundred lumens for this tint. It's grrrrrreat!


----------



## lampeDépêche

Tachead said:


> I think I will soon have all my lighting bases covered once again.



All your bases are belong to ZL! 

I know the feeling--I EDC a MK III HI and an H52w everyday, and often add an H502w in the other pocket for those times when I want pure mule with no artefacts.

I would be tempted to EDC the H600w in place of the H52w, but I love the security of knowing that I can always run AAs, AAAs, AAAAs, 14500s, 10440s, etc. etc. in my H52 and H502.

But that's just my prepper Walter Mitty talking, so it bears no connection to reality--in reality, having two 18650 lights is always going to provide me with enough light for any situation.

I'm somewhat tempted by the SC63/64 line, but since I don't mind the size of the SC600 Mk III HI, I figure there's no advantage to them.


----------



## recDNA

sc32w not discussed much lately but it is still for sale. Just thought I'd let people know the low voltage protection sucks. I had an AW Imr 16340 in there and the light suddenly shut off. No blinks nor drops in output first. No warning at all. When I tested voltage after 10 min it was only 1.7 volts! Of course now the battery is ruined. Just thought I would warn people not to depend on its low voltage protection actually working.


----------



## tech25

Tachead said:


> I have the H600Fc MKIII for nightime headlamp use, the H600Fd MKIII for daytime headlamp use, the H502c L2 for reading in bed, the SC64c for nightime flashlight use, the SC64w for daytime flashlight use, and now the SC600w MKIV HI for a throwier option to go along with my floody headlamps outdoors. I think I will soon have all my lighting bases covered once again.



Nice collection! When in doubt, get one of each! I am planning on getting an H600fc or d MK 4 to upgrade my H600fc MK 3- just for the programability. I also plan on getting a mule like the H502c for reading and close up tasks.


----------



## NPL

Tachead said:


> Here you go guys. This is the magazine one done over using 4300K white balance...


Thanks for sharing these images. Were they taken in Raw or jpg? If in jpg, they will give a good indication of colour temp but not for color rendering as the camera will automatically boost colors accordingly to make the overall image more vivid. I have an sc5w mk2 with xp-l2 4500k 80 CRI and h53c with 4000k, 90+ CRI, and side by side I see a huge difference in color rendering of reds. I will try and take a photo with fixed white balance on raw to show the difference.


----------



## SmeepyBeeper

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> I've been doing some more output testing with my SC600w MkIV HI, and I think I've settled near about 1200 lumens. I don't have a sphere, so I'm really ball-parking it against other lights of which I've tested previously. Those other lights tend to test close to what others have measured.
> 
> Anyway, I certainly wouldn't claim any better accuracy than +/- 10% from real lumens. And, if my calibration on prior lights is off, it could be even less accurate than +/- 10%.
> 
> 1200 lumens tends to be around the usual Zebralight mark-down when it comes to output claims, so it's probably around that. I'm very interested in what other people measure. I'd be surprised if people get 1400 lumens.
> 
> I'll happily give up a couple of hundred lumens for this tint. It's grrrrrreat!




I can't wait for more information about the lumen output of the MkIV HI. I think it's going to be my first "real" edc.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

recDNA said:


> sc32w not discussed much lately but it is still for sale. Just thought I'd let people know the low voltage protection sucks. I had an AW Imr 16340 in there and the light suddenly shut off. No blinks nor drops in output first. No warning at all. When I tested voltage after 10 min it was only 1.7 volts! Of course now the battery is ruined. Just thought I would warn people not to depend on its low voltage protection actually working.



Maybe the LVP sucks in that light because it's primarily designed for CR123 batteries, and draining those flat is okay (because they're disposable)?

On the other Zebralights, I do wish the LVP gave some kind of warning, other than just a step-down. If I'm using the light on low, then I really don't get any warning about the battery getting drained. Sure, I can do 4-clicks to check the level, but I seldom do that. Other brands sometimes do occasional flashes to warn you the battery is getting low... that might be nice around 3.0v. An indicator LED would be even better, but that isn't something Zebralight seems to do.


----------



## recDNA

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Maybe the LVP sucks in that light because it's primarily designed for CR123 batteries, and draining those flat is okay (because they're disposable)?
> 
> On the other Zebralights, I do wish the LVP gave some kind of warning, other than just a step-down. If I'm using the light on low, then I really don't get any warning about the battery getting drained. Sure, I can do 4-clicks to check the level, but I seldom do that. Other brands sometimes do occasional flashes to warn you the battery is getting low... that might be nice around 3.0v. An indicator LED would be even better, but that isn't something Zebralight seems to do.


Agreed. Need flashes or something. A protected flashlight should never allow a li ion battery drop to 1.7 volts. CR123A is not a safe alternative. The amp draw is WAY over spec. It gets really hot almost immediately.


----------



## Tachead

tech25 said:


> Nice collection! When in doubt, get one of each! I am planning on getting an H600fc or d MK 4 to upgrade my H600fc MK 3- just for the programability. I also plan on getting a mule like the H502c for reading and close up tasks.


Thanks. Yep, sometimes I find the only way to find what you want is to try them and sell off the ones that don't meet your needs. I am at that point now. I suspect when my new HI comes I will have all I need for my uses. I thought about upgrading to the MKIV headlamps too but, I am finding I don't use the new UI much and the tint on my MKIII's are perfect. I suspect this will not be the case with the MKIV's due to the use of the XHP50.2. But, I guess we will find out. The mules are by far the best for reading imo. They have a very smooth beam with very little glare.


----------



## Tachead

NPL said:


> Thanks for sharing these images. Were they taken in Raw or jpg? If in jpg, they will give a good indication of colour temp but not for color rendering as the camera will automatically boost colors accordingly to make the overall image more vivid. I have an sc5w mk2 with xp-l2 4500k 80 CRI and h53c with 4000k, 90+ CRI, and side by side I see a huge difference in color rendering of reds. I will try and take a photo with fixed white balance on raw to show the difference.



They are just shot with my Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge on Pro mode with a fixed 4300K white balance. Any suggestions on further settings or how to shoot raw images? 

I will say, the difference between the XHP35 80+ CRI compared to the XP-L2 93-95 CRI is definitely not huge, even when it comes to red rendering(when comparing my samples anyway but, keep in mind the CRI can vary between samples). It is no where near the difference of going from say a 70+ CRI neutral white XM-L2 to a Nichia 219B R9050. And, any small benefit is somewhat overshadowed by the XP-L2's less then optimal tint and tint consistency across the beam imo. 

I look forward to your comparison photos. I will post some more too if you make any recommendations on further beneficial camera settings.


----------



## ingokl

Did you already compare the lowest low of the 64c to that of the 64w? What is your impression, especially compared to the 0,01 lumen level of former ZLs ?


----------



## markr6

On the zebralight site, I cannot seem to leave a review. A small popup window appears (popup allowed) for about 1/2 second then goes away, then the page just reloads even after logging in. IE and Firefox. Maybe it's just me?


----------



## Tachead

ingokl said:


> Did you already compare the lowest low of the 64c to that of the 64w? What is your impression, especially compared to the 0,01 lumen level of former ZLs ?



They are very close to the same. The output of both is almost exactly the same as the second lowest moonlight mode on the H600Fc MKIII or almost identical to the moonlight on the Astrolux A01 Nichia 219B SW40 R9050. It is still lower then the vast majority of lights on the market and still works well with fully dark adapted eyes in the middle of a moonless night. I would still prefer they left the 0.01 mode but, it isn't that big of a deal and still works quite well.


----------



## Tachead

I am thinking about ordering on of these for my SC64w. It's custom made out of 0.05-0.055" thick military grade 5 titanium with a matte black powder coat finish. What do you guys think? Here it is on an SC52...


----------



## markr6

I saw them on ebay and they look good, but dang that sticks out like 1/3 the width of the actual light. I hate when they do that! But deep pocket which the ZL doesn't do.


----------



## ingokl

Tachead said:


> They are very close to the same. The output of both is almost exactly the same as the second lowest moonlight mode on the H600Fc MKIII or almost identical to the moonlight on the Astrolux A01 Nichia 219B SW40 R9050. It is still lower then the vast majority of lights on the market and still works well with fully dark adapted eyes in the middle of a moonless night. I would still prefer they left the 0.01 mode but, it isn't that big of a deal and still works quite well.


Thanks for your assessment! Both should be ok for me. Although I would also prefer the 0,01 lumen mode as an additional option.


----------



## NPL

Tachead said:


> They are just shot with my Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge on Pro mode with a fixed 4300K white balance. Any suggestions on further settings or how to shoot raw images?
> 
> I will say, the difference between the XHP35 80+ CRI compared to the XP-L2 93-95 CRI is definitely not huge, even when it comes to red rendering(when comparing my samples anyway but, keep in mind the CRI can vary between samples). It is no where near the difference of going from say a 70+ CRI neutral white XM-L2 to a Nichia 219B R9050. And, any small benefit is somewhat overshadowed by the XP-L2's less then optimal tint and tint consistency across the beam imo.
> 
> I look forward to your comparison photos. I will post some more too if you make any recommendations on further beneficial camera settings.


I just realized that your photos with 80 CRI are with the xhp35 Hi. On the xp-l2 80cri, I def see the difference in reds. Cool to hear that the xhp35 hi is good with Reds. I wonder what the R9 value is on that LED... Haven't been able to find it online.


----------



## Tachead

NPL said:


> I just realized that your photos with 80 CRI are with the xhp35 Hi. On the xp-l2 80cri, I def see the difference in reds. Cool to hear that the xhp35 hi is good with Reds. I wonder what the R9 value is on that LED... Haven't been able to find it online.



Remember these emitters are 80+ CRI bins. That means they are a least 80 CRI but, could be as much as 89 depending on what ZL got and possibly the particular sample. 

The XHP35 HD actually. And, the XP-L2 in the "c" models is still a bit better at colour rendition but, not what I would classify a "huge" difference. 

I'm not sure what the R9 would be on these 80+ CRI XHP35's but, I would suspect not crazy high. I would guess between 5 and 30. Maukka measured only 7 R9 on his SC600w MKIII HI but, that uses the XHP35 HI.

So, any recommendations on how to set my camera to be more accurate for comparisons? Thanks:thumbsup:.


----------



## Tachead

markr6 said:


> I saw them on ebay and they look good, but dang that sticks out like 1/3 the width of the actual light. I hate when they do that! But deep pocket which the ZL doesn't do.



Remember that is a SC52 though which is considerably thinner then the SC63/64 series. But, yeah, there is no other way to offer a deep carry option on SC ZL unfortunately. I have knives with a similar clip design though and the width doesn't really matter much in use. I sure would like a deep carry option for my SC64's but, I just need to decide if spending almost half the cost of the light on a clip and waiting 7-8 weeks is worth it:thinking:.


----------



## Tachead

ingokl said:


> Thanks for your assessment! Both should be ok for me. Although I would also prefer the 0,01 lumen mode as an additional option.




No problem:thumbsup:. 

I too would prefer if they still offered the 0.01 lumen mode on all models.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Tachead said:


> I too would prefer if they still offered the 0.01 lumen mode on all models.



Agreed. I wish the new models had one level moonlight lower than they have. A real 0.01 lumen level would be great. Not the old 0.01 lumen level that was really much dimmer and almost useless, but what was referred by Zebralight as 0.06 lumens. That 0.06 was really about 0.01 lumens, and perfect for the dimmest level.

Zebralight's lumen claims, at least for the moonlight level on the new models, now appears to be more accurate, and thus brighter.


----------



## Tachead

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Agreed. I wish the new models had one level moonlight lower than they have. A real 0.01 lumen level would be great. Not the old 0.01 lumen level that was really much dimmer and almost useless, but what was referred by Zebralight as 0.06 lumens. That 0.06 was really about 0.01 lumens, and perfect for the dimmest level.
> 
> Zebralight's lumen claims, at least for the moonlight level on the new models, now appears to be more accurate, and thus brighter.



What old ZL models are you referring to? I have the H600Fc MKIII, H600Fd MKIII, and H502c L2 and all their 0.01 lumen moonlight modes appear almost exactly the same.


----------



## NPL

Tachead said:


> Remember these emitters are 80+ CRI bins. That means they are a least 80 CRI but, could be as much as 89 depending on what ZL got and possibly the particular sample.
> 
> The XHP35 HD actually. And, the XP-L2 in the "c" models is still a bit better at colour rendition but, not what I would classify a "huge" difference.
> 
> I'm not sure what the R9 would be on these 80+ CRI XHP35's but, I would suspect not crazy high. I would guess between 5 and 30. Maukka measured only 7 R9 on his SC600w MKIII HI but, that uses the XHP35 HI.
> 
> So, any recommendations on how to set my camera to be more accurate for comparisons? Thanks:thumbsup:.


Ideally you would take the photos on raw, then export them into jpg with equal or no processing to ensure color saturation is consistent between both shots. I doubt your phone shoots Raw, so there are some other workarounds. 

If your camera can be adjusted for profiles, that have vivid, contrast, saturation adjustments, try and set them all to zero. You can usually do this in your typical Canon or equivalent point and shoot, not sure about phones. A special photo app would probably be required. 

Last but not least, the best thing you can do is take only 1 photo with both lights on at the same time. That way, any photo enhancements done to the image should be equal on all areas of the photo. The challenge here is getting both lights to similar output levels and picking a subject that is fairly consistent across both beam shots. Hope this helps.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Tachead said:


> What old ZL models are you referring to? I have the H600Fc MKIII, H600Fd MKIII, and H502c L2 and all their 0.01 lumen moonlight modes appear almost exactly the same.



How bright are they? I have an SC52 and SC52w, which claim a 0.01 lumen mode, but it is _incredibly_ dim. I estimate it's probably 0.001 lumens in reality, or maybe even less. Not visible during the day, even if you look right into the lens. IMO, it's too low to be useful. I like the one that's one level up from that. The lowest mode on my SC600w MkIV HI is about two levels up from that. It's probably around 0.1 lumens, or could be the 0.07 lumens that is claimed.

The point is, I'd like a *real* 0.01 lumen mode. I used to get that on older Zebralights, usually called their "0.06 lumen" mode.


----------



## Knaver

Tachead said:


> Hi. I started with their headlamps as well and recently tried their flashlights. They are great too. Let us know what you think of it when it arrives.


I’m very happy with the purchase. (SC600fc MK IV Plus) Very nice warm creamy tint, very bright, will be using daily in R/HVAC service work. It fits quite nicely in one of my nylon Leatherman holsters.


----------



## lampeDépêche

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> How bright are they? I have an SC52 and SC52w, which claim a 0.01 lumen mode, but it is _incredibly_ dim. I estimate it's probably 0.001 lumens in reality, or maybe even less. Not visible during the day, even if you look right into the lens. IMO, it's too low to be useful.



Yes, I have an old H51 with a low-low like that. I keep it on my nightstand, constant-on, and it guides me back to bed in the middle of the night. I get well over a month on an AA eneloop battery.

I agree that aside from acting as a channel-marker in a pitch-black room, it is not very useful. The other ZL lows, though, are super useful.


----------



## gunga

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> How bright are they? I have an SC52 and SC52w, which claim a 0.01 lumen mode, but it is _incredibly_ dim. I estimate it's probably 0.001 lumens in reality, or maybe even less. Not visible during the day, even if you look right into the lens. IMO, it's too low to be useful. I like the one that's one level up from that. The lowest mode on my SC600w MkIV HI is about two levels up from that. It's probably around 0.1 lumens, or could be the 0.07 lumens that is claimed.
> 
> The point is, I'd like a *real* 0.01 lumen mode. I used to get that on older Zebralights, usually called their "0.06 lumen" mode.



I disagree. I actually love the lowest low on the zebralights for wandering around without disturbing the kids. 

My jetbeam and sunwayman are even lower. Great stuff.


----------



## NPL

Here is a beamshot comparison of my h53c (xp-l2 4000k 92 CRI) on the left, and SC5w mkii (xp-l2 4500k 80 CRI) on the right. More noticeable in real life, but I find reds substantially more vibrant with the h53c.


----------



## Tachead

NPL said:


> Ideally you would take the photos on raw, then export them into jpg with equal or no processing to ensure color saturation is consistent between both shots. I doubt your phone shoots Raw, so there are some other workarounds.
> 
> If your camera can be adjusted for profiles, that have vivid, contrast, saturation adjustments, try and set them all to zero. You can usually do this in your typical Canon or equivalent point and shoot, not sure about phones. A special photo app would probably be required.
> 
> Last but not least, the best thing you can do is take only 1 photo with both lights on at the same time. That way, any photo enhancements done to the image should be equal on all areas of the photo. The challenge here is getting both lights to similar output levels and picking a subject that is fairly consistent across both beam shots. Hope this helps.




Thanks for the advice man:thumbsup:.

The Pro mode on my S7 Edge has all of those features so I will try it next time.


----------



## lampeDépêche

gunga said:


> I disagree. I actually love the lowest low on the zebralights for wandering around without disturbing the kids.
> 
> My jetbeam and sunwayman are even lower. Great stuff.



You guys may not be disagreeing after all.

Different ZLs have very different lows. The H51 that I described above, which I use for my channel-marker, is actually *too dim to navigate by*. Even in pitch dark, even with dark-adapted eyes. If I hold it at waist-height, it will not illuminate the floor far enough in front of my feet to make sure I'm not about to step on the dog. (Granted, he is black, but still.) It's too dim to read with, unless I hold it within a few centimeters of the page.

That's my only ZL whose low-low is like that. With my others, the low-low is great for night-time, dark-adapted activities. I can navigate through the house, read, do small chores, etc., all in the lowest low. (That's how I have all of them set: L2 is always the lowest of the three options.)

I am a big fan of ultra-low modes. I like taking my Photon Freedom red lights and putting them on their lowest levels to see what I can do with them (on lowest, not much!) But my H51 is so low that it doesn't let you see anything but its own emitter. Maybe it's because is a few years old, and they have brought up the output of their lowest lows?.


----------



## Tachead

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> How bright are they? I have an SC52 and SC52w, which claim a 0.01 lumen mode, but it is _incredibly_ dim. I estimate it's probably 0.001 lumens in reality, or maybe even less. Not visible during the day, even if you look right into the lens. IMO, it's too low to be useful. I like the one that's one level up from that. The lowest mode on my SC600w MkIV HI is about two levels up from that. It's probably around 0.1 lumens, or could be the 0.07 lumens that is claimed.
> 
> The point is, I'd like a *real* 0.01 lumen mode. I used to get that on older Zebralights, usually called their "0.06 lumen" mode.



Pretty darn dim. Only really useful for when you wake up in the middle of the night, in a near pitch black room, and have dark adapted eyes. I do find it useful though in certain circumstances. Yeah, the one that is one level up from that(0.05 lumens) is the brightness of the lowest modes on the SC64c and w.


----------



## Tachead

Knaver said:


> I’m very happy with the purchase. (SC600fc MK IV Plus) Very nice warm creamy tint, very bright, will be using daily in R/HVAC service work. It fits quite nicely in one of my nylon Leatherman holsters.




Nice, glad you like it:thumbsup:.


----------



## Tachead

gunga said:


> I disagree. I actually love the lowest low on the zebralights for wandering around without disturbing the kids.
> 
> My jetbeam and sunwayman are even lower. Great stuff.



I too like to have the 0.01 lumen mode. But, the 0.05-7 lumen mode is still pretty good.


----------



## Tachead

NPL said:


> Here is a beamshot comparison of my h53c (xp-l2 4000k 92 CRI) on the left, and SC5w mkii (xp-l2 4500k 80 CRI) on the right. More noticeable in real life, but I find reds substantially more vibrant with the h53c.



Thanks for the comparison:thumbsup:.

Keep in mind that the CCT difference will effect things as well though. Warmer CCT's definitely enhance certain colours, especially earth tones. I know they do because I have the H600Fc&d MKIII and they are identical lights with the same CRI so, they work great for CCT comparison.


----------



## Tachead

lampeDépêche said:


> You guys may not be disagreeing after all.
> 
> Different ZLs have very different lows. The H51 that I described above, which I use for my channel-marker, is actually *too dim to navigate by*. Even in pitch dark, even with dark-adapted eyes. If I hold it at waist-height, it will not illuminate the floor far enough in front of my feet to make sure I'm not about to step on the dog. (Granted, he is black, but still.) It's too dim to read with, unless I hold it within a few centimeters of the page.
> 
> That's my only ZL whose low-low is like that. With my others, the low-low is great for night-time, dark-adapted activities. I can navigate through the house, read, do small chores, etc., all in the lowest low. (That's how I have all of them set: L2 is always the lowest of the three options.)
> 
> I am a big fan of ultra-low modes. I like taking my Photon Freedom red lights and putting them on their lowest levels to see what I can do with them (on lowest, not much!) But my H51 is so low that it doesn't let you see anything but its own emitter. Maybe it's because is a few years old, and they have brought up the output of their lowest lows?.




What is the spec of the lowest low?


----------



## Tachead

I just found this deep carry clip too. It is made from 0.045" thick Aerospace Titanium and is available in many different finishes as well.


----------



## pomp92

Good, but found where?


----------



## Tachead

pomp92 said:


> Good, but found where?



This one...







Is from Pops Custom Clips on Etsy.

And, this one...






Is from blade4sell on ebay.

I believe both companies offer multiple styles and/or finish options. But, none are cheap as they are custom made titanium clips.


----------



## pomp92

Thank you Teached


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Tachead said:


> Pretty darn dim. Only really useful for when you wake up in the middle of the night, in a near pitch black room, and have dark adapted eyes. I do find it useful though in certain circumstances. Yeah, the one that is one level up from that(0.05 lumens) is the brightness of the lowest modes on the SC64c and w.



Okay, it sounds like we're talking about the same levels. So, it sounds like the SC64w goes one level lower than the SC600w IV HI.



lampeDépêche said:


> Different ZLs have very different lows. The H51 that I described above, which I use for my channel-marker, is actually *too dim to navigate by*. Even in pitch dark, even with dark-adapted eyes. If I hold it at waist-height, it will not illuminate the floor far enough in front of my feet to make sure I'm not about to step on the dog. (Granted, he is black, but still.) It's too dim to read with, unless I hold it within a few centimeters of the page.




Yup, that's the lowest-low on the SC52's. The SC5 uses 1-level up from that as its lowest. The SC600w IV HI, uses 2 levels up from that.

The SC600w lowest is actually my preferred moonlight, but not for middle-of-a-dark-night. I like it one level below, for that.


----------



## Tachead

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Okay, it sounds like we're talking about the same levels. So, it sounds like the SC64w goes one level lower than the SC600w IV HI.


 ZL says they are both the same at 0.07 lumens. I can tell you for sure if you don't mind waiting a week or so. I have a HI ordered and am just waiting for ZL to ship it.


----------



## Tachead

pomp92 said:


> Thank you Teached




No problem:thumbsup:.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Tachead said:


> ZL says they are both the same at 0.07 lumens. I can tell you for sure if you don't mind waiting a week or so. I have a HI ordered and am just waiting for ZL to ship it.



:thumbsup:


----------



## lampeDépêche

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> ...The SC600w IV HI, uses 2 levels up from that.
> 
> The SC600w lowest is actually my preferred moonlight, but not for middle-of-a-dark-night. I like it one level below, for that.



Agreed! For middle-of-the-night lows, my SC600 MKII HI is slightly too bright on its lowest-low. My H52w is about right.

I should do some comparison shots with all of these. I just eyeballed the low-low on my old H51 and the low-low on my new H53w next to each other, and the visible difference is about 3-5 fold, so the actual lumen difference is 10-fold to 25-fold?


----------



## holygeez03

The increased lux per lumen of the HI might be throwing off your perception? It's the lux that hurts your eyes...


----------



## tech25

Tachead said:


> Thanks for the comparison:thumbsup:.
> 
> Keep in mind that the CCT difference will effect things as well though. Warmer CCT's definitely enhance certain colours, especially earth tones. I know they do because I have the H600Fc&d MKIII and they are identical lights with the same CRI so, they work great for CCT comparison.



Can I bother you to do a few beam shot comparisons between the c&d? I have seen the ones out there but I have the H600fc mk3 and want to get the mk4. I like the CCT of 4500 and went for the "c" at 4000 but maybe I should go for the "d" at 5000... I am prob going to sell the mk3, but getting both the c&d is not really an option right now.


----------



## Tachead

holygeez03 said:


> The increased lux per lumen of the HI might be throwing off your perception? It's the lux that hurts your eyes...



Yep, lights with a tighter hotspot always appear brighter then they are. 

Really, moonlight modes aside, the HI is not a great choice for close range tasks or especially a bed side light imo(just basing this on reviews and beamshots as mine isn't here yet). I have heard more then one person complain about it having too tight/intense of a hotspot for many closer range tasks or even to be a great all around light. I think it is more of niche light best suited to outdoor use.


----------



## holygeez03

The best nightstand light: H502c


----------



## Tachead

tech25 said:


> Can I bother you to do a few beam shot comparisons between the c&d? I have seen the ones out there but I have the H600fc mk3 and want to get the mk4. I like the CCT of 4500 and went for the "c" at 4000 but maybe I should go for the "d" at 5000... I am prob going to sell the mk3, but getting both the c&d is not really an option right now.



Do you mean against a white wall or? 

I can tell you that, personally, I think the Fd(5000K) is best for daytime use for supplemental light. Imo it is too cool for use at night both indoors and outdoors. I do love it however for daytime use and I use it for various tasks during the day. 

You might want to decide based on where/when you use your headlamp the most. For instance, for camping and/or nightime hiking the Fc(4000K) is the best choice imo as it is warm and calming and matches the moonlight well. It also isn't a harsh contrast compared to a campfire like the Fd is. The Fc is also best if you use it at night indoors as it is closer to the 2700 - 3000K indoor lighting most people use in their living rooms and bedrooms. It will also wake you up less and cause less sleep disturbance if used near or during bedtime.


----------



## Tachead

holygeez03 said:


> The best nightstand light: H502c



There is a H502c L2 on my nightstand right now lol. I use it mainly for reading in bed though and generally prefer a regular flashlight to an angle light/headlamp for a general purpose nightstand light. My SC64c has been getting used lately and works quite well. My benchmark in the past was an Astrolux A01 Nichia 219B SW40(4000K) R9050.

Do you have the H502c or H502c L2?


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Tachead said:


> Yep, lights with a tighter hotspot always appear brighter then they are.



It's possible that it's partially due to perception, but certainly not all. There's no doubt it is *much* brighter than the earlier zebralights with the same ~ 0.07 lumens claimed in the specs.



> Really, moonlight modes aside, the HI is not a great choice for close range tasks or especially a bed side light imo(just basing this on reviews and beamshots as mine isn't here yet). I have heard more then one person complain about it having too tight/intense of a hotspot for many closer range tasks or even to be a great all around light. I think it is more of niche light best suited to outdoor use.



Yes, I got it for outdoors, but since it's my latest light, I have to try it out everywhere! 

Besides, I don't use it to directly illuminate stuff in the middle of the night. I use it ceiling-bounced. Still too bright.


----------



## Tachead

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Yes, I got it for outdoors, but since it's my latest light, I have to try it out everywhere!
> 
> Besides, I don't use it to directly illuminate stuff in the middle of the night. I use it ceiling-bounced. Still too bright.



I totally understand. I often use a new light in the kitchen and bathroom in the evening instead of the AC lighting. I think it drives my GF nuts. She sometimes comes in, flicks the AC light on, and rolls her eyes. That's ok, I roll mine too when she comes home with another ridiculously expensive piece of hand made pottery.

Yeah, ceiling bouncing helps a bit but, not if it is too bright.


----------



## snowlover91

Tachead said:


> Yep, lights with a tighter hotspot always appear brighter then they are.
> 
> Really, moonlight modes aside, the HI is not a great choice for close range tasks or especially a bed side light imo(just basing this on reviews and beamshots as mine isn't here yet). I have heard more then one person complain about it having too tight/intense of a hotspot for many closer range tasks or even to be a great all around light. I think it is more of niche light best suited to outdoor use.



I use my MK3 HI for plenty of indoor tasks without issue. It frequently goes into my “around the house” rotation and as a bedside light too. I will say for close range tasks you have to have it on a lower setting but it does a very good job.

I find the frosted lens ZL I have is actually worse for close range tasks if I’m not pointing the light directly away from me since the light scatters out to the sides. I was working on my car last night, set the frosted lens ZL down to shine on what I was trying to fix and the glare from it was almost unbearable. I believe it’s the MK3 Plus Fd model I have. I also noticed the lens has cracked, not sure but I think my 2 year old daughter got ahold of it... and it’s been through a few wash/dry cycles too.


----------



## noboneshotdog

I had a dream last night that I received a new SC600 MKIV in the mail. Upon opening the box an accessory pack fell out. It had a second tailcap with a spring as well as a drop in spring adapter for the positive contact.

I was so excited in my dream to report my new findings. Oh well. It was only a dream. What a great dream.


----------



## Tachead

snowlover91 said:


> I use my MK3 HI for plenty of indoor tasks without issue. It frequently goes into my “around the house” rotation and as a bedside light too. I will say for close range tasks you have to have it on a lower setting but it does a very good job.
> 
> I find the frosted lens ZL I have is actually worse for close range tasks if I’m not pointing the light directly away from me since the light scatters out to the sides. I was working on my car last night, set the frosted lens ZL down to shine on what I was trying to fix and the glare from it was almost unbearable. I believe it’s the MK3 Plus Fd model I have. I also noticed the lens has cracked, not sure but I think my 2 year old daughter got ahold of it... and it’s been through a few wash/dry cycles too.



Yeah, I am sure it will still work but, it is definitely not ideal. I have heard several people say the HI does not have the best beam profile for an all around light. Personally I don't like a tight defined hotspot for many tasks, especially indoor ones. When it comes to reflector based lights, I think the SC63/64 series has a great beam profile for an all around light. It strikes a good balance between flood and throw with its large hotspot, corona, and bright spill. 

Yep, glare can start to be an issue with some designs and uses. I find this can be a problem with some lanterns. 

I look forward to putting the MKIV HI through its paces when it gets here and I will post my impressions once I use it for a bit.


----------



## lampeDépêche

Tachead said:


> Yeah, I am sure it will still work but, it is definitely not ideal. I have heard several people say the HI does not have the best beam profile for an all around light. Personally I don't like a tight defined hotspot for many tasks, especially indoor ones.



Yeah, I think that's probably right. The Mk III HI is certainly not a thrower (esp. if you hang around Vinh's site!), but it is on the throwy side of an ideal all-purpose light. I wonder how its profile compares to some other popular EDCs like the Malkoff or HDS--probably not a lot throwier than they are, given the size of their reflectors.

Anyhow--I basically agree with you. For indoor stuff, I am more likely to reach for my H52w, which I always have, or even my H502w, which I often have. The MkIII HI is a better outdoor light (as well as a better 1000 lumen light, which the AA-models cannot do of course). 

Somebody said that the H502 is the ideal bed-side light? I almost agree, but not quite: for tip-toeing around at night and keeping the wife and kids asleep, I want something with a more shrouded beam. I do love the quality of the H502w's light--love love that pure mule wall of light, like being in an even bubble of illuminated glow. And it is certainly true that lower lux is the key to preserving night-vision. (Strictly speaking, "moonlight" started as a measure of lux, not lumens. On a moonlit night with no other light around, the moon is still bombarding you with millions--maybe billions!--of lumens! But they are spread out over such a wide area that the lux is very low.)

But I also want to keep the light out of my wife's eyes. So the narrower beams are better for not bothering other people.


----------



## holygeez03

My H502c is so old that it doesn't even have the "ribs" on the outside of the tube... My H52Fw is also "smooth walled"... I assume they are both very early production models. I prefer this style.

My H502c sits on my nightstand, in a little wood-block holder I made to make it more stable... almost every evening, I turn it on to the 0.04lm mode before it gets dark... then when I go to bed there is just enough light to navigate and I can turn it off from bed. If I need to navigate in the middle of the night, I turn it on to 0.04 and sometimes wall-bounce the 2lm mode if needed... I replace the AA every few months (or less frequently).

I travel with the H52Fw and use it in a similar manner where ever I am staying... especially useful since I don't always know where the lights are and the light sources are usually way too bright anyway.

It appears the H52w and Fw are no longer available and the other H52's are being clearanced... which means there will be soon be no AA-sized ZL headlamp that can hit 500 lumens? That's a shame...


----------



## lampeDépêche

holygeez03 said:


> I travel with the H52Fw and use it in a similar manner where ever I am staying... especially useful since I don't always know where the lights are and the light sources are usually way too bright anyway.



We could be twins. I *love* knowing that no matter what hotel, what city, what country I wake up in, I will have light right there, under my control. No matter whether I need to get up and pee, or have to get up for a fire alarm (as has happened to me in hotels!), I will have the light I need.

I agree that it's a shame that ZL changed the drivers in their headlamps. I guess I sort of understood why they switched to the low-voltage driver for the SC5 series--that is a very impressive trick to get circa 500 lumens from an eneloop (though I have never purchased one).

But with the H53 series, they don't have either of the good features--they don't have the high-voltage driver that can run from 3.7v Li-Ion cells, and they don't have the SC5-style driver that can get 500 lumens from an eneloop.

How often do I use my H52w on the H1 burst-mode? Not super often, true, and never for long. But I do use it now and then, and I really like having it available. 
(Ask a fighter pilot: "how often do you use afterburner? Not much, right, and not for very long? So you won't mind if we leave it out of the next version of your jet, right?")


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

lampeDépêche said:


> Anyhow--I basically agree with you. For indoor stuff, I am more likely to reach for my H52w, which I always have, or even my H502w, which I often have. The MkIII HI is a better outdoor light (as well as a better 1000 lumen light, which the AA-models cannot do of course).



I like throwers for indoor tail-standing. The lower brightness of spill keeps stray light out of your eyes better.



> Strictly speaking, "moonlight" started as a measure of lux, not lumens. On a moonlit night with no other light around, the moon is still bombarding you with millions--maybe billions!--of lumens! But they are spread out over such a wide area that the lux is very low.



Totally OT, but let's calculate it:


Intensity of sunlight at moon's distance from sun: 120000 lux
Radius of moon: 1737000 meters
Cross-sectional area of moon = pi * 1737000^2 = 9.48 * 10^12
Albedo of moon: 0.12
Effective lumens reflected: 0.12 * 9.48*10^12 * 120000 = 1.36*10^17


So, over a hundred quadrillion lumens!


Not bad, but the sun is about 4 * 10^28 lumens, so a little brighter.






holygeez03 said:


> It appears the H52w and Fw are no longer available and the other H52's are being clearanced... which means there will be soon be no AA-sized ZL headlamp that can hit 500 lumens? That's a shame...



Zebralight has also stopped supporting 14500 cells in their small AA lights (the SC53), so we don't have any small AA lights that do 500 lumens either. The SC5 will do it, but it's quite a bit fatter than the SC52. I keep a 14500 in one of my SC52's, for a bright pocket-light.


----------



## Tachead

Here are some more pics of custom deep carry titanium clips for you guys. I am definitely considering ordering one to try on my SC64's.


----------



## lampeDépêche

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Totally OT, but let's calculate it:
> 
> 
> Intensity of sunlight at moon's distance from sun: 120000 lux
> Radius of moon: 1737000 meters
> Cross-sectional area of moon = pi * 1737000^2 = 9.48 * 10^12
> Albedo of moon: 0.12
> Effective lumens reflected: 0.12 * 9.48*10^12 * 120000 = 1.36*10^17
> 
> 
> So, over a hundred quadrillion lumens!



I love it! Thanks so much for doing this.

"My pocket flashlight has a moonlight mode."
"Really?!?! It can put out one hundred quadrillion lumens??"

Okay, since you are good at Fermi-estimations, maybe I can ask you to take it one step further:

The number you produced is the moon's output. What about the amount of light from the moon that hits the earth?

For simplicity, suppose that the amount you calculated is distributed evenly over a half-sphere facing the sun. Now imagine that the earth is somewhere in that half-sphere, seeing a full moon. What portion of that half-sphere does the earth subtend? (I'm guessing this will be in steradians, or some other ungodly unit I don't understand). 

Very crude ball-parking: Wiki tells me that it would take about 200k copies of the moon (viewed from the earth) to cover the entire celestial sphere (viewed from the earth). The earth will look bigger from the moon than the moon does from the earth, so suppose it will take about 100k copies of the earth to cover the celestial sphere viewed from the moon. Which means about 50k earth-discs in the half-sphere of the sun's reflection. So let's take the total reflective output of the moon (as you calculated) and divide it by 50k, to get a *very* crude ball park for the amount of moonlight falling on the earth during a full moon.

So about 2 trillion lumens? That's an approximation of the amount of moonlight that falls on the earth during a full moon. A lot of lumens.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

lampeDépêche said:


> I love it! Thanks so much for doing this.
> 
> "My pocket flashlight has a moonlight mode."
> "Really?!?! It can put out one hundred quadrillion lumens??"
> 
> Okay, since you are good at Fermi-estimations, maybe I can ask you to take it one step further:
> 
> The number you produced is the moon's output. What about the amount of light from the moon that hits the earth?



Okay, a rough calculation:


Distance of moon from earth: 384400 km
Effective surface area of a sphere at that distance
= 4 * pi * 384000^2 = 1.85 * 10^12 sq km


But since the "full moon" is only shining back light over half a sphere, make that 9.26 * 10^11 sq km


Earth radius: 6371 km
Cross-sectional area of earth = pi * 6371^2 = 1.28 * 10^8 sq km


Ratio of cross section to light "surface" = 1.376 * 10^-4


So, lumens hitting earth is (1.36 * 10^17) * (1.376 * 10^-4) = 1.87 * 10^13


That's about 19 trillion lumens worth of "energy" hitting earth from the full moon. Note, it is significantly less at times other than full moon.


Anyway, that assumes I didn't get something wrong.


----------



## lampeDépêche

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Okay, a rough calculation:
> 
> ...That's about 19 trillion lumens worth of "energy" hitting earth from the full moon.



We started from pretty different starting data, and produced results within *just* one order of magnitude apart from each other (2 vs. 19). 

That's pretty good! 

I think it justifies the summary claim, "during a full moon, the earth is being hit by trillions, possibly tens of trillions, of lumens of moonlight."

ETA: Then mark6r says, "meh--trillions of lumens, but lousy tint!"


----------



## tech25

Tachead said:


> Do you mean against a white wall or?
> 
> I can tell you that, personally, I think the Fd(5000K) is best for daytime use for supplemental light. Imo it is too cool for use at night both indoors and outdoors. I do love it however for daytime use and I use it for various tasks during the day.
> 
> You might want to decide based on where/when you use your headlamp the most. For instance, for camping and/or nightime hiking the Fc(4000K) is the best choice imo as it is warm and calming and matches the moonlight well. It also isn't a harsh contrast compared to a campfire like the Fd is. The Fc is also best if you use it at night indoors as it is closer to the 2700 - 3000K indoor lighting most people use in their living rooms and bedrooms. It will also wake you up less and cause less sleep disturbance if used near or during bedtime.



I mostly use my fc indoors. For daytime when I need a headlamp I have never had a problem with the fc. I guess the fc is the best for me, just if you have a few comparison shots for color (not a white wall) real useage, I would appreciate it.

I just compared it to my PK PR-1 that has a cool tint (bluish) which for some reason doesn't bother me too much. Now I'm back to the fd as a new light...


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

lampeDépêche said:


> I think it justifies the summary claim, "during a full moon, the earth is being hit by trillions, possibly tens of trillions, of lumens of moonlight."
> 
> ETA: Then mark6r says, "meh--trillions of lumens, but lousy tint!"



Lol. Yeah, but good luck to him if he tries to return the moon. 

I can see it on a T-shirt: "My lover promised me the moon and stars, but all I got was this lousy tint!"


----------



## Tachead

tech25 said:


> I mostly use my fc indoors. For daytime when I need a headlamp I have never had a problem with the fc. I guess the fc is the best for me, just if you have a few comparison shots for color (not a white wall) real useage, I would appreciate it.
> 
> I just compared it to my PK PR-1 that has a cool tint (bluish) which for some reason doesn't bother me too much. Now I'm back to the fd as a new light...


I don't have any already taken but, I will take a couple when I get a chance.


----------



## likethevegetable

Tachead said:


> Here are some more pics of custom deep carry titanium clips for you guys. I am definitely considering ordering one to try on my SC64's.



Tac, these clips are bad-***!

Do you know of any similar clip-on types (rather than screws), for say, an H600x or H53x?


----------



## Tachead

likethevegetable said:


> Tac, these clips are bad-***!
> 
> Do you know of any similar clip-on types (rather than screws), for say, an H600x or H53x?


Yep, they are pretty sweet. I couldn't resist and ordered 2 different types of clips. Both will be custom made to my specs. I will post picks when they get here but, it will be a while as it takes a month or so to make them plus shipping time.

I don't know about any custom options for the headlamps but, the best clip I have found for the H600 series is the Nitecore MH style clip. It fits perfectly like it was made for them. They can be found here(Type B are the ones)...

http://www.nitecorestore.com/Pocket-Clip-for-Nitecore-P12-Flashlight-p/acc-clip-nitecore.htm


----------



## likethevegetable

Tachead said:


> Yep, they are pretty sweet. I couldn't resist and ordered 2 different types of clips. Both will be custom made to my specs. I will post picks when they get here but, it will be a while as it takes a month or so to make them plus shipping time.
> 
> I don't know about any custom options for the headlamps but, the best clip I have found for the H600 series is the Nitecore MH style clip. It fits perfectly like it was made for them. They can be found here(Type B are the ones)...
> 
> http://www.nitecorestore.com/Pocket-Clip-for-Nitecore-P12-Flashlight-p/acc-clip-nitecore.htm



Thanks for the link. I purchased some AT Wizard clips but they are extremely tight and too fat for my H53c (made a huge scratch, oops), will take a grinder to it and file it down, might even try to open them it up a bit (method TBD). I don't mind the stock H53 clip as it rides down to the tailcap, but I will definitely want something deep carry for the H600. I have an old Thrunite clip that I think will work as well.


----------



## archimedes

lampeDépêche said:


> ....
> 
> I think it justifies the summary claim, "during a full moon, the earth is being hit by trillions, possibly tens of trillions, of lumens of moonlight."
> 
> ETA: Then mark6r says, "meh--trillions of lumens, but lousy tint!"



Ok, yes, this made me laugh


----------



## Tachead

likethevegetable said:


> Thanks for the link. I purchased some AT Wizard clips but they are extremely tight and too fat for my H53c (made a huge scratch, oops), will take a grinder to it and file it down, might even try to open them it up a bit (method TBD). I don't mind the stock H53 clip as it rides down to the tailcap, but I will definitely want something deep carry for the H600. I have an old Thrunite clip that I think will work as well.



No problem👍. 

Yeah, the Armytek ones don't fit well. They are too wide for the clip channel ZL uses. The Nitecore one fits perfectly into the channel and are deep carry.


----------



## Tachead

archimedes said:


> Ok, yes, this made me laugh


Me too☺️.


----------



## lampeDépêche

Tachead said:


> Me too☺️.



Hey, glad to provide a moment of comedy in your day.

Mark6r--you know we love, you, right?


----------



## snowlover91

Tachead said:


> Yeah, I am sure it will still work but, it is definitely not ideal. I have heard several people say the HI does not have the best beam profile for an all around light. Personally I don't like a tight defined hotspot for many tasks, especially indoor ones. When it comes to reflector based lights, I think the SC63/64 series has a great beam profile for an all around light. It strikes a good balance between flood and throw with its large hotspot, corona, and bright spill.
> 
> Yep, glare can start to be an issue with some designs and uses. I find this can be a problem with some lanterns.
> 
> I look forward to putting the MKIV HI through its paces when it gets here and I will post my impressions once I use it for a bit.



I suppose it all comes down to personal preference since the MK3 HI I have works better for me as an all around light than most of my other ones. It’s not an EDC light for me but around the house it’s great indoors, outdoors and for up close tasks for me. To each his own


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

It's only been a week, and my MkIV HI honeymoon is over. It's a great light, but I'm mainly using it just for outdoor stuff, which is why I got it.

I'm back to the SC52w for indoors (love the flood). I'm trying out the SC5w again for a night-light (good low for middle of the night, and a large base with low center of gravity makes for really easy tail-standing). The MkIV HI is just too bright for a night-light.


----------



## recDNA

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> It's only been a week, and my MkIV HI honeymoon is over. It's a great light, but I'm mainly using it just for outdoor stuff, which is why I got it.
> 
> I'm back to the SC52w for indoors (love the flood). I'm trying out the SC5w again for a night-light (good low for middle of the night, and a large base with low center of gravity makes for really easy tail-standing). The MkIV HI is just too bright for a night-light.


The MKIV HI about 15k cd?


----------



## Tachead

recDNA said:


> The MKIV HI about 15k cd?



I believe the MKIII HI was measured around 18K cd by a number of people. Not sure about the MKIV HI though but, it has a slightly more aggressive OP on the reflector which may affect things a bit. I can try and measure mine when it gets here.


----------



## recDNA

Tachead said:


> I believe the MKIII HI was measured around 18K cd by a number of people. Not sure about the MKIV HI though but, it has a slightly more aggressive OP on the reflector which may affect things a bit. I can try and measure mine when it gets here.


Thanks!


----------



## Flint Hills

I have an SC52w L2. I keep trying to talk myself into upgrading to the SC5c. Does anyone here have both and care to comment? 

I've read mixed reviews on the tint of the "c" emitter and that's what I'm most concerned about. I would prefer a little warmer, that's why I think the c may be a good fit?

Other than my SC52w, all of my lights have Nichia.


----------



## NPL

Flint Hills said:


> I have an SC52w L2. I keep trying to talk myself into upgrading to the SC5c. Does anyone here have both and care to comment?
> 
> I've read mixed reviews on the tint of the "c" emitter and that's what I'm most concerned about. I would prefer a little warmer, that's why I think the c may be a good fit?
> 
> Other than my SC52w, all of my lights have Nichia.


I upgraded from h52w to h53c (same LED options you are referring to).

Much prefer the tint and color rendering of the h53c. Cct is definitely warmer. If you prefer cooler lights, then the SC5w would be a better option. Ifind the 4000k is much better suited for night time,way more comfortable and soothing on the eyes with better rendering or reds and Earth tones. The 4500k is more clinical and low CRI rendering from my h52w made colors feel washed out. Hope this helps


----------



## Flint Hills

NPL said:


> I upgraded from h52w to h53c (same LED options you are referring to).
> 
> Much prefer the tint and color rendering of the h53c. Cct is definitely warmer. If you prefer cooler lights, then the SC5w would be a better option. Ifind the 4000k is much better suited for night time,way more comfortable and soothing on the eyes with better rendering or reds and Earth tones. The 4500k is more clinical and low CRI rendering from my h52w made colors feel washed out. Hope this helps



Great, thanks!

Any chance you could share some beamshots comparing your two w and c?


----------



## NPL

I don't own the h52w anymore...


----------



## Michael_Fr

Today I tested the thermal regulation on my Zebralights:

I ran my SC600w and SC64w on H1 until the PID kicked in and measured the temperature with an infrared thermometer. Both lights have the PID set to factory defaults.

The SC600‘s temperature was 55 degrees C which is a value I have stumbled across several times in the forums. The SC64w had only 50 degrees C. Does Zebralight use lower temps for smaller lights?

Best, Michael


----------



## ven

I would imagine so Michael, as smaller lights will heat up faster( zebras) so with less mass/heat sinking ability, it would make sense to have a lower temp dialled in. Just guessing ............


----------



## R2RO

Michael_Fr said:


> Today I tested the thermal regulation on my Zebralights:
> 
> I ran my SC600w and SC64w on H1 until the PID kicked in and measured the temperature with an infrared thermometer. Both lights have the PID set to factory defaults.
> 
> The SC600‘s temperature was 55 degrees C which is a value I have stumbled across several times in the forums. The SC64w had only 50 degrees C. Does Zebralight use lower temps for smaller lights?
> 
> Best, Michael



What was the time difference like for the step down? Did the sc600 run brighter for much longer or was it similar?


----------



## Michael_Fr

R2RO said:


> What was the time difference like for the step down? Did the sc600 run brighter for much longer or was it similar?



I didn‘t measure time exactly, but the SC600w lastet a lot longer before stepping down. My guess would be 5 minutes for the SC600w vs. 1-2 minutes for the SC64w.
Of course, that comparison is unfair since the SC600‘s cutoff temp is 5 degrees higher - so it is not just a result of the higher mass.

On a sidenote: I did the comparison at room temperature with the lights lying down. Might be a different story when holding the lights in hand.

Best, Michael


----------



## joelbnyc

Any recent estimates on when SC64w and SC64c are in stock?


----------



## Tachead

joelbnyc said:


> Any recent estimates on when SC64w and SC64c are in stock?


You just missed the "c" as it was in stock for awhile until yesterday or the day before. Just shoot ZL an email and they will let you know. Generally the fastest way to get one is just order it and they will ship as soon as available.


----------



## joelbnyc

Yeah I figured it was maybe returns tho? I will email them  any good comparison posts or reviews on 64c vs 64w?


----------



## Tachead

joelbnyc said:


> Yeah I figured it was maybe returns tho? I will email them  any good comparison posts or reviews on 64c vs 64w?


It was is stock for a couple of week or more so, I don't think so but who knows I suppose.

Post #1540 and just before that I posted some comparisons.


----------



## JoeRodge

I just started a dry leaf on fire with my sc600w plus lol.


----------



## Alyx

I burnt a hole in my tent with my mk iv plus


----------



## joelbnyc

Tachead said:


> It was is stock for a couple of week or more so, I don't think so but who knows I suppose.
> 
> Post #1540 and just before that I posted some comparisons.



Oh right thanks. They said 1-3 weeks lead time.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

JoeRodge said:


> I just started a dry leaf on fire with my sc600w plus lol.





Alyx said:


> I burnt a hole in my tent with my mk iv plus



Okay, whoever burns their house down first using a Zebralight, wins!


----------



## lampeDépêche

JoeRodge said:


> I just started a dry leaf on fire with my sc600w plus lol.



Wait, how did you do that? With a magnifying lens? By putting the leaf in contact with the ZL's lens?


----------



## JoeRodge

lampeDépêche said:


> Wait, how did you do that? With a magnifying lens? By putting the leaf in contact with the ZL's lens?



I just turned it on,with PID turned to Max. I then placed the leaf on top of the flashlight.

Edit: after changing those PID settings the light for sure gets too hot to hold lol


----------



## fudgefarmer

Has anyone started receiving the new H600/604 models yet? I ordered my H600Fc three weeks ago and I’m starting to get antsy. It said “five week lead time” so I knew I’d be in for a bit of a wait, but now I’m curious just how long. I know there were probably a ton of preorders before mine and I haven’t seen anyone post anywhere about having one yet, so I’m wondering if that five weeks was until they started shipping them at all or until they’d ship my particular order.


----------



## Tachead

fudgefarmer said:


> Has anyone started receiving the new H600/604 models yet? I ordered my H600Fc three weeks ago and I’m starting to get antsy. It said “five week lead time” so I knew I’d be in for a bit of a wait, but now I’m curious just how long. I know there were probably a ton of preorders before mine and I haven’t seen anyone post anywhere about having one yet, so I’m wondering if that five weeks was until they started shipping them at all or until they’d ship my particular order.


Someone in the thread for them said ZL said they will start shipping in 5-10 days. That was three days ago. He ordered his in early November though, so you may have a bit longer to wait depending on how many were ordered before you and how big their initial batch is. Patience is key with pre-orders man and waiting is just part of the deal.

If you do want an update on your particular order though just email ZL and ask for an estimate.


----------



## markr6

The H604w has been in stock for a while...just not sure anyone here ordered that. The 600's seem to be more popular. I'm looking forward to the feedback on these!


----------



## Flint Hills

My new SC5c mkii won't hit H1 on a lithium primary. Is that normal? It goes to H1 just fine with an Eneloop Pro or an alkaline even but not an Energizer ultimate lithium. I'm assuming it's because of voltage and such. It's kind of a bummer because the lithiums are lighter, last longer and work great in hot or cold.


----------



## Nuppet

Tachead said:


> If it is tapped too shallow it is super easy to fix. Just file a tiny bit off the bottom of the screws but, be careful to smooth out the edges and the start of the thread after you are done. Also, do not over tighten them or you will strip them as the body is just aluminum which is soft. A tiny bit of blue Loctite(242 or 243) can be used if you want to protect against loosening down the road.


 Thanks for the tip of filing the bottom of the screws. Works fine with SC64c I just got.


----------



## Tachead

Nuppet said:


> Thanks for the tip of filing the bottom of the screws. Works fine with SC64c I just got.


No problem man, happy to help👍.


----------



## 18650

They really need to update the pages for the H600Fd, H604d, and SC600Fd. There are lots of blank specs and I still don't know if it's a mistake in the specs saying the SC600Fd is using the regular XHP50 over the XHP50.2 the other 2 are using.


----------



## markr6

Need to get all the new stuff out of the way soon...get going on this C3!!


----------



## Nuppet

18650 said:


> They really need to update the pages for the H600Fd, H604d, and SC600Fd. There are lots of blank specs and I still don't know if it's a mistake in the specs saying the SC600Fd is using the regular XHP50 over the XHP50.2 the other 2 are using.


 I've wondered myself the same thing, so a couple of days ago I asked Zebralight if H600Fc used XHP50.2 and not XHP50. The answer from them was "Yes, the H600Fc comes with the newer XHP50.2 LED".


----------



## likethevegetable

My H600Fc IV just shipped (to Canada, via EMS). Purchased Nov. 13. The anticipation is killing me!


----------



## HVACn00b

fudgefarmer said:


> Has anyone started receiving the new H600/604 models yet? I ordered my H600Fc three weeks ago and I’m starting to get antsy. It said “five week lead time” so I knew I’d be in for a bit of a wait, but now I’m curious just how long. I know there were probably a ton of preorders before mine and I haven’t seen anyone post anywhere about having one yet, so I’m wondering if that five weeks was until they started shipping them at all or until they’d ship my particular order.



I ordered the sc600w IV plus and h604d on 11/27/17 
Order 68xx 
I was told they’d ship my s600 last week as a partial order... they never shipped my partial order. Thenwas told the h604d would be 5-10 more business days... that was their respond on 1/14
Still no response or tracking on ether lights :/


----------



## NPL

likethevegetable said:


> My H600Fc IV just shipped (to Canada, via EMS). Purchased Nov. 13. The anticipation is killing me!


Oh yes!! Hope they ship mine soon too. Please give us your initial impressions when you receive it.


----------



## wweiss

FYI - here is an underwater beam tint comparison between a ZL SC600W III HI (on the right) and a TN12 (2016) - both on their highest modes - resting on a stone under 6" of cold pond water. Tints and lux are almost identical to me... 

These two are my favorites for ratio of flood to spot and great tint. The TN12, however does a much, much better job of heat dissipation and runtime. I find the ZL's smaller form and build useful, but it is unattractive - as if it comes out of Russian army surplus... Nonetheless, I find I'm grabbing it more when the dog has to go.


http://photos.app.goo.gl/jORBeGlkMWpLuzbO2

(Both lights bought as NW)


----------



## markr6

That one on the left looks very green. But it could be the water tricking eyes. LOL russian army surplus! I never thought of that but kinda see it now.


----------



## JoeRodge

I was just about to post the same thing. The one on the left is very, very green.


----------



## wweiss

It's the green pond water... The TN12 is shooting deeper into open water...


----------



## JoeRodge

wweiss said:


> It's the *green* pond water... The TN12 is shooting deeper into open water...


----------



## evgeniy

likethevegetable said:


> My H600Fc IV just shipped (to Canada, via EMS).



We wait for your review !


----------



## TCY

H600Fc IV pre-ordered on 31/10, shipped 24/01.. damn that's a long wait. What's worst is that It has arrived on Aus on the 26th but it's Australia day so gotta wait till the 29th. Good thing I got a shiny Convoy C8 clear HI to play with.


----------



## TCY

Hats off to DHL though. Picked up my new light at 3:12pm, 24th AU time, processed through AU DHL facility & custom cleared at 3:29am, 26th. If Friday is not Australia day the light would be delivered in less than 40 hours, almost 8,000 km across the globe.


----------



## Tachead

TCY said:


> Hats off to DHL though. Picked up my new light at 3:12pm, 24th AU time, processed through AU DHL facility & custom cleared at 3:29am, 26th. If Friday is not Australia day the light would be delivered in less than 40 hours, almost 8,000 km across the globe.


Can you give us some first impressions? What is the tint like? Do you have a H600Fc MKIII to contact pare to? Thanks.


----------



## TCY

Tachead said:


> Can you give us some first impressions? What is the tint like? Do you have a H600Fc MKIII to contact pare to? Thanks.



Will do when I get it. Don't have a III on hand but I do have a D4vn with 4000K 219C so I can do a Cree vs Nichia comparison maybe. Tint & CRI wise we know the Nichia would win but Based on my experience with the H53Fc I bet the H600Fc MKIV would do well to.


----------



## Misthailin

I’ve spent quite some time following this thread and haven’t posted anything, but all my new lights are in now. So I thought this would be a good time for a first post. No studies or anything scientific here, just what I think about these lights. SC600 IV Plus - this thing is a beast. I’ve shown this light to plenty of people over the couple weeks I’ve had it, and everyone seems to agree. The sc600w IV Plus is the brightest of the 4 zebralights I have, and the coolest to show off. H600Fd Mk IV - I’m still debating over whether the small bit of extra area the H600 lights up over the SC600 is worth the loss of perceived brightness. Maybe I would enjoy one of the non flood versions better? I will wait and post again when I use this light in the dark. This one was just the most underwhelming for me of the bunch to open. Mind you, I am newer to being in to flashlights and have much more experience (and money) in knives, so my opinion is just that. New. I am just trying these lights out in a semi dark room, so I have not used any of these lights in complete darkness, as I just got the H600fd and the sc64c today. SC64c - my first impression of this light, I like it. It has a nice warm tint to it. So far I enjoy the color of this light, out of the 4 zebralights I have, I definitely like the color on this one the most. More than enough light for any normal everyday task you may encounter also. The SC52w L2 -This is my first Zebralight ever, and this light started my zebra addiction. Very small easy to carry light that served me well for a couple years. Thank you all for all the information this thread has provided!


----------



## Bob_McBob

Last month I ordered an SC600w IV HI and SC64c to compare with my SC600w III HI and SC63w. After putting them through the paces, I ultimately ended up returning both lights, but for different reasons. The SC64c was an easy decision because the beam was an absolutely vile mix of pissy yellows with all the colours of the Cree rainbow near the edges. No amount of high CRI goodness would ever make that acceptable, and after reading maukka's reviews of high CRI XP-L2s, I can't recommend the SC64c. The SC600w IV HI was a harder decision, and I'm not completely sure I should have returned it.

To start, my III is a mid-2016 production with a smoother orange peel reflector. That means it has a tighter hotspot and more throw than the later production III (and IV). I've come to rely on the throw when I'm using it as my "one light" setup on hikes where I don't take a headlamp and dedicated thrower, so that was a point against the IV. On the other hand, I think the new reflector is an improvement for the SC6x series since a smooth beam is preferable for a small EDC (my SC63w also has the old style reflector).







(photo by markr6)

In terms of tint, the IV was actually nicer, with a very pleasing and even neutral white beam compared to the slightly uneven and yellow III. Here is a photo showing the tighter hotspot of the III, which you probably shouldn't use as a meaningful comparison of tint (and mind the cobwebs...).






While testing runtimes I discovered some interesting things about the latest Zebralight PID implementation. The surface temperature of both new lights hits the max PID setting almost dead on at 55°C, while the older lights tend to sit more in the 51-53°C range. That means the newer lights can step down less aggressively, resulting in significantly longer turbo runtime with the IV vs. the III.






Unusually, runtimes for the new lights have a sawtooth pattern where the driver slowly hunts up and down rather than maintaining a smooth output. I didn't notice it during use, but it's a significant departure from the silky smooth runtimes we are used to seeing with previous Zebralights. I can also confirm reports from several other owners the IV has almost exactly the same maximum output as the III, despite Zebralight claiming a 25% increase (there is an initial 10s burst at 7% higher).









I don't have a comparison handy yet, but the SC64c output follows a similar pattern.






Another thing I noticed about both new lights is the switch has less tactile feedback and a softer "click". And of course you will lose the extreme 0.01 lumen moonlight some ZL owners have come to love. The difference is obvious in a dark room or looking directly into the emitter.

Overall I think the SC600w IV HI is a fine light, but for my specific use the slightly throwier older-style III is preferable, and I don't like to duplicate lights too much. The IV also has the benefit of the new programmable UI as well as significantly longer turbo runtime. It's another excellent ZL light I would have no problem recommending. The SC64c... well, hope yours isn't as bad as mine? With a 3V emitter it's a good candidate for a Nichia 219C swap, but I'm not hardcore enough to pull apart a Zebralight.


----------



## NPL

Misthailin said:


> I’ve spent quite some time following this thread and haven’t posted anything, but all my new lights are in now. So I thought this would be a good time for a first post. No studies or anything scientific here, just what I think about these lights. SC600 IV Plus - this thing is a beast. I’ve shown this light to plenty of people over the couple weeks I’ve had it, and everyone seems to agree. The sc600w IV Plus is the brightest of the 4 zebralights I have, and the coolest to show off. H600Fd Mk IV - I’m still debating over whether the small bit of extra area the H600 lights up over the SC600 is worth the loss of perceived brightness. Maybe I would enjoy one of the non flood versions better? I will wait and post again when I use this light in the dark. This one was just the most underwhelming for me of the bunch to open. Mind you, I am newer to being in to flashlights and have much more experience (and money) in knives, so my opinion is just that. New. I am just trying these lights out in a semi dark room, so I have not used any of these lights in complete darkness, as I just got the H600fd and the sc64c today. SC64c - my first impression of this light, I like it. It has a nice warm tint to it. So far I enjoy the color of this light, out of the 4 zebralights I have, I definitely like the color on this one the most. More than enough light for any normal everyday task you may encounter also. The SC52w L2 -This is my first Zebralight ever, and this light started my zebra addiction. Very small easy to carry light that served me well for a couple years. Thank you all for all the information this thread has provided!


Welcome Misthailin. 

I'd love to hear more about your H600fd mk4 especially after you use it indoors and for up close tasks in proper darkness. In a ceiling bounce, how does the new Fd compare to your other new lights? 
Thanks


----------



## Tachead

Bob_McBob said:


> Last month I ordered an SC600w IV HI and SC64c to compare with my SC600w III HI and SC63w. After putting them through the paces, I ultimately ended up returning both lights, but for different reasons. The SC64c was an easy decision because the beam was an absolutely vile mix of pissy yellows with all the colours of the Cree rainbow near the edges. No amount of high CRI goodness would ever make that acceptable, and after reading maukka's reviews of high CRI XP-L2s, I can't recommend the SC64c. The SC600w IV HI was a harder decision, and I'm not completely sure I should have returned it.
> 
> To start, my III is a mid-2016 production with a smoother orange peel reflector. That means it has a tighter hotspot and more throw than the later production III (and IV). I've come to rely on the throw when I'm using it as my "one light" setup on hikes where I don't take a headlamp and dedicated thrower, so that was a point against the IV. On the other hand, I think the new reflector is an improvement for the SC6x series since a smooth beam is preferable for a small EDC (my SC63w also has the old style reflector).
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (photo by markr6)
> 
> In terms of tint, the IV was actually nicer, with a very pleasing and even neutral white beam compared to the slightly uneven and yellow III. Here is a photo showing the tighter hotspot of the III, which you probably shouldn't use as a meaningful comparison of tint (and mind the cobwebs...).
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> While testing runtimes I discovered some interesting things about the latest Zebralight PID implementation. The surface temperature of both new lights hits the max PID setting almost dead on at 55°C, while the older lights tend to sit more in the 51-53°C range. That means the newer lights can step down less aggressively, resulting in significantly longer turbo runtime with the IV vs. the III.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Unusually, runtimes for the new lights have a sawtooth pattern where the driver slowly hunts up and down rather than maintaining a smooth output. I didn't notice it during use, but it's a significant departure from the silky smooth runtimes we are used to seeing with previous Zebralights. I can also confirm reports from several other owners the IV has almost exactly the same maximum output as the III, despite Zebralight claiming a 25% increase (there is an initial 10s burst at 7% higher).
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I don't have a comparison handy yet, but the SC64c output follows a similar pattern.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Another thing I noticed about both new lights is the switch has less tactile feedback and a softer "click". And of course you will lose the extreme 0.01 lumen moonlight some ZL owners have come to love. The difference is obvious in a dark room or looking directly into the emitter.
> 
> Overall I think the SC600w IV HI is a fine light, but for my specific use the slightly throwier older-style III is preferable, and I don't like to duplicate lights too much. The IV also has the benefit of the new programmable UI as well as significantly longer turbo runtime. It's another excellent ZL light I would have no problem recommending. The SC64c... well, hope yours isn't as bad as mine? With a 3V emitter it's a good candidate for a Nichia 219C swap, but I'm not hardcore enough to pull apart a Zebralight.



What are you using to do your measurements Bob? And, are you using cooling? I only ran a couple of 5 minute tests without cooling on my SC64c and SC600w MKIV Plus but, my results appear to differ from yours. I am using a Extech HD450 Datalogging Light Meter with the logging set at a 1 second resolution(meaning these graphs are taking a reading and accurate to 1 second).

SC600w MKIV Plus...






SC64c...






Both tests were 5 minutes long and done at an ambient temperature of between 23 and 24C with no cooling.


----------



## Misthailin

NPL said:


> Welcome Misthailin.
> 
> I'd love to hear more about your H600fd mk4 especially after you use it indoors and for up close tasks in proper darkness. In a ceiling bounce, how does the new Fd compare to your other new lights?
> Thanks



Well in a ceiling bounce test, the H600fd didn’t light up the room as much as my SC52w L2. So it lit up a completely dark room the least of the 4. (Hopefully that is what a ceiling bounce is!). Honestly the light is alright, but again I don’t know if it is just me, or if it is maybe defective, but it just isn’t as bright as any of the others. I’m happy with the other 2, and the old SC52w L2 is great. It does light up a room, just not as bright as I want. Maybe I had higher expectations for this Floody version as far as what it could do? I’m not sure. It is a fine light for working. I think, at this point, I’m going to order another one. I’ll keep this one, and maybe sell it if I like another version better. Can’t wait to hear other opinions!


----------



## Tachead

Misthailin said:


> Well in a ceiling bounce test, the H600fd didn’t light up the room as much as my SC52w L2. So it lit up a completely dark room the least of the 4. (Hopefully that is what a ceiling bounce is!). Honestly the light is alright, but again I don’t know if it is just me, or if it is maybe defective, but it just isn’t as bright as any of the others. I’m happy with the other 2, and the old SC52w L2 is great. It does light up a room, just not as bright as I want. Maybe I had higher expectations for this Floody version as far as what it could do? I’m not sure. It is a fine light for working. I think, at this point, I’m going to order another one. I’ll keep this one, and maybe sell it if I like another version better. Can’t wait to hear other opinions!



Are you sure you have it set to G5 and H1? There is no way it should be less bright then your SC52w L2. You either have it set incorrectly or it is defective. I have the H600Fd MKIII(which is almost 700 lumens less on H1)and it is very bright but, floody.


----------



## Misthailin

Tachead said:


> Are you sure you have it set to G5 and H1? There is no way it should be less bright then your SC52w L2. You either have it set incorrectly or it is defective. I have the H600Fd MKIII(which is almost 700 lumens less on H1)and it is very bright but, floody.



I have it set right. It must be defective... it doesn’t even get warm while on for a couple minutes.


----------



## Tachead

Misthailin said:


> I have it set right. It must be defective... it doesn’t even get warm while on for a couple minutes.


That is unfortunate. Well, I am sure ZL will help you out and get you a new one. Just put in a request through your account. Let us know how it turns out.


----------



## NPL

Misthailin said:


> Well in a ceiling bounce test, the H600fd didn’t light up the room as much as my SC52w L2. So it lit up a completely dark room the least of the 4. (Hopefully that is what a ceiling bounce is!). Honestly the light is alright, but again I don’t know if it is just me, or if it is maybe defective, but it just isn’t as bright as any of the others. I’m happy with the other 2, and the old SC52w L2 is great. It does light up a room, just not as bright as I want. Maybe I had higher expectations for this Floody version as far as what it could do? I’m not sure. It is a fine light for working. I think, at this point, I’m going to order another one. I’ll keep this one, and maybe sell it if I like another version better. Can’t wait to hear other opinions!


I am pretty sure your unit is defective, as it should be significantly brighter than your sc52w. It should also warm up on H1. Try reprogramming in G6 and see if you can get it any brighter.


----------



## Bob_McBob

Tachead said:


> What are you using to do your measurements Bob? And, are you using cooling? I only ran a couple of 5 minute tests without cooling on my SC64c and SC600w MKIV Plus but, my results appear to differ from yours. I am using a Extech HD450 Datalogging Light Meter with the logging set at a 1 second resolution(meaning these graphs are taking a reading and accurate to 1 second).



I'm using zak's ceilingbounce app. After some further testing, I realized my new phone (Pixel 2) gives very low resolution data from the light sensor compared to my old phone (Nexus 5), which is why the output looks so stepped. I didn't realize previously because I'm used to seeing stepped PID outputs with Zebralights. However, the oscillation in the output with the new lights is unmistakable even with the poor resolution. Unfortunately I can't run the test again with the Nexus 5 because I already returned the lights.

All of these runtimes were measured with the Pixel 2, room temperature and no cooling, and the highest PID setting.


----------



## neutralwhite

is there any beam shots of the MkIV cool white ?
is there any blue in this LED? 
looking for white.
thanks.


----------



## Tachead

Bob_McBob said:


> I'm using zak's ceilingbounce app. After some further testing, I realized my new phone (Pixel 2) gives very low resolution data from the light sensor compared to my old phone (Nexus 5), which is why the output looks so stepped. I didn't realize previously because I'm used to seeing stepped PID outputs with Zebralights. However, the oscillation in the output with the new lights is unmistakable even with the poor resolution. Unfortunately I can't run the test again with the Nexus 5 because I already returned the lights.



Thanks for the update Bob. I agree, there are definite oscillations(ringing) on these Gen 4 ZL's. I just posted some graphs I ran tonight on your thread on Reddit. The Gen 4 lights have smoother thermal regulation that is less visible compared to the Gen 3's but, this lack of stability once the lights temperature equalizes is a definite step backwards even if it is not visible in use(not sure if it is as I haven't tested running H1 for that long). Zebralight needs to spend some time further tuning their PID on these new lights and possiblely add some more dampening so the output stays more stable like the Gen 3 lights.

Here is the SC64c(Gen 4 ZL) compared to the H600Fc MKIII(Gen 3 ZL). Both tests are 30 minutes with no cooling. 

SC64c...






H600Fc MKIII...


----------



## Misthailin

NPL said:


> I am pretty sure your unit is defective, as it should be significantly brighter than your sc52w. It should also warm up on H1. Try reprogramming in G6 and see if you can get it any brighter.



So I tried programming in g6, maybe a touch brighter... nothing like it should be though. My sc64c on max brightness gets warm at the lens in a couple of seconds. The H600fd should get at least as warm in the same time being almost 700 lumens more. It just doesn’t get warm. Entered a Warranty ticket through zebralight today.


----------



## NPL

Misthailin said:


> So I tried programming in g6, maybe a touch brighter... nothing like it should be though. My sc64c on max brightness gets warm at the lens in a couple of seconds. The H600fd should get at least as warm in the same time being almost 700 lumens more. It just doesn’t get warm. Entered a Warranty ticket through zebralight today.


That's unfortunate. Does the SC64c seem brighter?


----------



## Misthailin

NPL said:


> That's unfortunate. Does the SC64c seem brighter?



Oh yea, it is absolutely brighter. When I turn on my SC64c in a dark room, I’m like wow that lights up the room pretty well. When I do the same with the H600fd I think, is this thing on high???? And that is looking directly at the area I’m pointing it at. If I look at the floor when I have it pointed at the wall forget about it, very dim. The sc64c can light up a 12x12 room ceiling to floor no problem.


----------



## pantagana23

I have a question regarding the new UI (I have the SC5w MkII): In G6 and G7 mode groups, it is listed to have 12 available brightness levels for all modes.
However, I haven't been able to find which brightness levels are those.
Does anyone have more information on this?


----------



## Tixx

pantagana23 said:


> I have a question regarding the new UI (I have the SC5w MkII): In G6 and G7 mode groups, it is listed to have 12 available brightness levels for all modes.
> However, I haven't been able to find which brightness levels are those.
> Does anyone have more information on this?



SC5w Mk II AA Flashlight Neutral White
All 12


High: H1 *550* Lm (3min, then 407lm, total 0.5 hr) or H2 *407* Lm (0.9 hr) / *274* Lm (1.5 hrs) / *166* Lm (2.8 hrs) 
Medium: M1 *92* Lm (4.9 hrs) or M2 *46*Lm (9.6 hrs) / *21* Lm (21 hrs) / *8.6* Lm (48 hrs) 
Low: L1 *3.2 *Lm (4.2 days) or L2 *1.1* Lm (14 days) / *0.33 *Lm (50 days) / *0.09 *Lm (4.3 months)


----------



## Grijon

Sorry if this is a dumb question in this thread:

Has anyone actually ran their ZL for months on end to test the runtime listed? Seeing .09 Lm for 4.3 months is what has me curious.


----------



## Tachead

Grijon said:


> Sorry if this is a dumb question in this thread:
> 
> Has anyone actually ran their ZL for months on end to test the runtime listed? Seeing .09 Lm for 4.3 months is what has me curious.


https://www.reddit.com/r/flashlight...finally_turned_off/?utm_source=reddit-android


----------



## likethevegetable

Just an FYI fellas - my H600Fc came in and I started a new thread with my first impressions: http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?443663-Zebralight-H600Fc-Mk-IV-First-Impressions :twothumbs


----------



## pantagana23

Tixx said:


> SC5w Mk II AA Flashlight Neutral White
> All 12
> 
> 
> High: H1 *550* Lm (3min, then 407lm, total 0.5 hr) or H2 *407* Lm (0.9 hr) / *274* Lm (1.5 hrs) / *166* Lm (2.8 hrs)
> Medium: M1 *92* Lm (4.9 hrs) or M2 *46*Lm (9.6 hrs) / *21* Lm (21 hrs) / *8.6* Lm (48 hrs)
> Low: L1 *3.2 *Lm (4.2 days) or L2 *1.1* Lm (14 days) / *0.33 *Lm (50 days) / *0.09 *Lm (4.3 months)



These are levels available in G5, to my knowledge. H1/M1/L1 is fixed, and H2/M2/L2 can be modified to levels you have stated.

However, in G6/7, you are supposed to be able to i.e. put medium lumens level in place of H1 (short click). 

How many lumens, and what are the 12 levels available on H1/2 (short click from off), M1/2 (double click from off), and L1/2 (press-hold from off), is not listed.

In my example, I would like to put medium levels to short click, high to double click, and leave low to press-hold (as medium gives me best output-runtime ratio, would like to use the clicky button twice as less than now, prolonging the rubber and button life this way).

If anyone has this data of 12 levels in each mode for G6/7, or has tested this, it would be great.


----------



## ingokl

It is the 12 levels of the G5 mode. That are the ones meant by "available" lumen levels. You can just assign these to any level (L1, L2, M1....) you like. So for the SC5w Mk II for example the data of the lumen levels is 0.09, 0.33, 1.1, 3.2, 8.6, 21, 46, 92, 166, 274, 407 and 550 lumen.


----------



## pantagana23

ingokl said:


> Is the 12 levels of the G5 mode. That are the ones meant by "available" lumen levels. You can just assign these to any level (L1, L2, M1....) you like. So for the SC5w Mk II for example the data of the lumen levels is 0.09, 0.33, 1.1, 3.2, 8.6, 21, 46, 92, 166, 274, 407 and 550 lumen.



That's it, this makes it clearer. Time to go programming.


----------



## anthon87

I've just received my SC600w IV HI, ordered in november.

I've read it here before but I wanted to confirm that is making 1000lm at start. I have a integrating sphere and those are the lumens in H1 mode, In H2 it should have 875lm but only makes 650lm

What happened here? Are the 1400lm LED lumens instead of ANSI lumens? 1000lm for a XHP35 flashlight in turbo is a joke

I'm using a new LG MJ1 fully charged cell, but tried an VTC6 with the same results


----------



## Tixx

pantagana23 said:


> These are levels available in G5, to my knowledge. H1/M1/L1 is fixed, and H2/M2/L2 can be modified to levels you have stated.
> 
> However, in G6/7, you are supposed to be able to i.e. put medium lumens level in place of H1 (short click).
> 
> How many lumens, and what are the 12 levels available on H1/2 (short click from off), M1/2 (double click from off), and L1/2 (press-hold from off), is not listed.
> 
> In my example, I would like to put medium levels to short click, high to double click, and leave low to press-hold (as medium gives me best output-runtime ratio, would like to use the clicky button twice as less than now, prolonging the rubber and button life this way).
> 
> If anyone has this data of 12 levels in each mode for G6/7, or has tested this, it would be great.


Yes, those G5 levels are the same levels (12) available in the customizable G6/G7. Just you can put them anywhere you want in G6/G7 instead of being locked into the G5 setup.


----------



## Tachead

anthon87 said:


> I've just received my SC600w IV HI, ordered in november.
> 
> I've read it here before but I wanted to confirm that is making 1000lm at start. I have a integrating sphere and those are the lumens in H1 mode, In H2 it should have 875lm but only makes 650lm
> 
> What happened here? Are the 1400lm LED lumens instead of ANSI lumens? 1000lm for a XHP35 flashlight in turbo is a joke
> 
> I'm using a new LG MJ1 fully charged cell, but tried an VTC6 with the same results



Sounds like your homebuilt sphere is not calibrated properly for a throwy light. Several other people have measure the MKIV HI around 1100-1200 lumens at startup. 

I have noticed that ZL lists both the normal SC600's and HI at 1400 lumens. That is not possible(unless they are driving it harder) as the HI produces about 15% less then the HD at the same drive level. 1400 - 15% is right around 1200. My guess is ZL just copy and pasted the same specs for all three. They should probably correct that.

1200 lumens in a light this small is not a joke. Driving it harder would just make it step down ridiculously fast. If you want that then buy an Emisar D4. 

Also, keep in mind that going from 1200-1400 lumens is only about a 4% difference in perceived brightness and barely even noticeable.


----------



## anthon87

Tachead said:


> Sounds like your homebuilt sphere is not calibrated properly for a throwy light. Several other people have measure the MKIV HI around 1150-1200 lumens at startup.
> 
> I have noticed that ZL lists both the normal SC600's and HI at 1400 lumens. That is not possible(unless they are driving it harder) as the HI produces about 15% less then the HD at the same drive level. 1400 - 15% is right around 1200. My guess is ZL just copy and pasted the same specs for all three. They should probably correct that.
> 
> 1200 lumens in a light this small is not a joke. Driving it harder would just make it step down ridiculously fast. If you want that then by an Emisar D4.
> 
> Also, keep in mind that going from 1200-1400 lumens is only about a 4% difference in perceived brightness and barely even noticeable.



I have tested other thrower lights such as m2x-ut or acebeam L16 and my lumens results match with other people reviews.

I'll read the current at the tailcap in each mode. I'ts ok if the light is under driven, but not ok if current is high and lumens are low


----------



## Tachead

anthon87 said:


> I have tested other thrower lights such as m2x-ut or acebeam L16 and my lumens results match with other people reviews.


That doesn't mean it's accurate with every light. Unless you are using a store bought professionally calibrated integrating sphere who knows.

Either way, if you are not happy with it ZL has a 30 day money back guarantee. They will exchange it(in case it has an issue/defect) or give you a refund.


----------



## Tachead

anthon87 said:


> I have tested other thrower lights such as m2x-ut or acebeam L16 and my lumens results match with other people reviews.
> 
> I'll read the current at the tailcap in each mode. I'ts ok if the light is under driven, but not ok if current is high and lumens are low


Make sure you read it with a high quality clamp meter and a short piece of heavy gauge wire(preferably at least 10 gauge or thicker). Multimeters generally don't give accurate readings, especially at high currents.


----------



## anthon87

Tachead said:


> Make sure you read it with a high quality clamp meter and a short piece of heavy gauge wire(preferably at least 10 gauge or thicker). Multimeters generally don't give accurate readings, especially at high currents.



Got 3.61A for 1050lm from a fully charged cell so in my opinion is low efficiency


----------



## recDNA

anthon87 said:


> Got 3.61A for 1050lm from a fully charged cell so in my opinion is low efficiency


Shouldn't it be pulling 6 amps in H1?


----------



## anthon87

recDNA said:


> Shouldn't it be pulling 6 amps in H1?



I've repeated the test. H1 draws 3.67A for 1050lm. Tested the current in the integrating sphere and Im getting the same lumens as when using the tailcap


----------



## Tachead

anthon87 said:


> Got 3.61A for 1050lm from a fully charged cell so in my opinion is low efficiency



Well, if you are not happy then take advantage of the 30 day money back guarantee.


----------



## JStraus

Oh buddy: https://www.reddit.com/r/flashlight...ight_55_months_01_lumens_test_day_300_update/




Grijon said:


> Sorry if this is a dumb question in this thread:
> 
> Has anyone actually ran their ZL for months on end to test the runtime listed? Seeing .09 Lm for 4.3 months is what has me curious.


----------



## Grijon

JStraus said:


> Oh buddy: https://www.reddit.com/r/flashlight...ight_55_months_01_lumens_test_day_300_update/





Tachead said:


> https://www.reddit.com/r/flashlight...finally_turned_off/?utm_source=reddit-android



Ah ha ha - great, thanks!


----------



## IlluminationDomination

I have SC62,,my favorite EDC light.


----------



## recDNA

Can I program the sc64 so one of the medium modes is 305 lumens while leaving 1600 and 1000 as the two high modes? If so how? I've read the directions on the website but I don't see how to do what I am asking.


----------



## Tachead

recDNA said:


> Can I program the sc64 so one of the medium modes is 305 lumens while leaving 1600 and 1000 as the two high modes? If so how? I've read the directions on the website but I don't see how to do what I am asking.


You can program any of the 6 modes to any available brightness level you want and in any order you want.


----------



## recDNA

Tachead said:


> You can program any of the 6 modes to any available brightness level you want and in any order you want.


I only want to change M2 to 305 lumens. How?


----------



## Tachead

recDNA said:


> I only want to change M2 to 305 lumens. How?


You simply go into G6 or G7, go to the mode you want to change(M2), double click until you are into programming mode, pick the mode you want(double click for brighter and triple click for lower), and then turn the light off. It will save whatever you chose forever util you change it or do a factory reset.


----------



## recDNA

how go to G6 (whatever that is) now how go to M2 now how do I know which one is 305 lumens?


----------



## Tachead

recDNA said:


> how go to G6 (whatever that is) now how go to M2 now how do I know which one is 305 lumens?


To get to G6 click 6 times from off. It will stay in that mode forever until you switch out if it. M2 is medium 2 so you can either hold until you hit the middle mode or turn the light off after you are in G6 and Dou le click from off. Once in medium(M1) double click to go to M2. Then switch modes until you get to the one you want and turn off to save. The SC64c doesn't have a 305 lumen mode. The closest is 341. It is the third mode from the top so, to know you are in it scroll to the brightest mode and then scroll back down 2 modes.

All off this is listed in detail in the lights instructions from ZL.


----------



## recDNA

I think 305 is 4th from the top but I don't know how to tell from M2. I'll read it again but it made no sense to me. Sounded like it was going up by infinite adjustment. I would need to know how many steps from where M2 starts to where I need to stop. You press and hold to scroll up I think. Too much drop from 1000 in H2 to whatever M1 is. Yes I know vision is logarithmic in perception. It's still too much.


----------



## NPL

recDNA said:


> how go to G6 (whatever that is) now how go to M2 now how do I know which one is 305 lumens?


Very clear instructions are listed on the Zebralight website. Have you referred to them first?


----------



## recDNA

NPL said:


> Very clear instructions are listed on the Zebralight website. Have you referred to them first?


Several times before I asked. They seem to imply I will magically KNOW when I hit 305 lumens


----------



## noboneshotdog

recDNA said:


> Several times before I asked. They seem to imply I will magically KNOW when I hit 305 lumens



Checking out YouTube videos was very helpful to me when I set mine up. Sometimes seeing it done is all it takes to make sense. Good luck!


----------



## recDNA

noboneshotdog said:


> Checking out YouTube videos was very helpful to me when I set mine up. Sometimes seeing it done is all it takes to make sense. Good luck!


Good tip. I hope they tell me how to recognize a particular output level I wish to set


----------



## Connor

recDNA said:


> Good tip. I hope they tell me how to recognize a particular output level I wish to set



You'll have to count, either from the bottom or down from the top level. Similar to what's it like on the HDS UI.


----------



## ven

Why 305lm, it may be too bright or not bright enough.............just a number. I set mine of actual brightness, so when it looks about right for the amount i want to use(be it for indoor or outdoor use), thats what i set for the level. I dont have a clue what my levels are bellow max output on my ZL's. Could be 150lm ish, could be 250lm ish, but what i do know is it is the correct output to what i want..............if makes sense. 

So when setting your level, just keep double clicking till it looks good for the application, go back a level and see if it will do instead and save some energy, if not revert back and save it. Everyone is different, but that is how i set mine..............actual use not a figure.


----------



## recDNA

I prefer a number. I like each level down to be about a third of the one above it. I like to know what they are. I keep 1600 and 1000 yet will almost never use 1600. I just may use it for a few seconds once in a while.

Battery life is insignificant to me. I have batteries and time to recharge them. I also seldom use a flashlight for longer than a minute at a time.


----------



## Dio

recDNA said:


> I prefer a number...
> 
> Battery life is insignificant to me....



Well luckily you can choose to set the levels based on a theorhetical number you need to have it programmed to in order to keep your OCD at bay.. (1000L is barely dimmer than 1600L and isn't this magical 1/3 value???)

-or- you could just set it to whatever levels appears visually useful and not worry about battery life..


Your logic just seems odd to me, I would only need to know a certain level was "XXX specific lumens" so I could ensure I was going to get the runtime needed - if I didn't care about runtime then I would just set my levels based on what let me see the easiest. 

I say just buy a damn light, use it, enjoy it or return it. The amount of worrying some people do over lights really makes you wonder about humanity


----------



## recDNA

Look. I explained 1600. It's for a few seconds once in a while just cuz it's there. The 1000 I'll use a lot. 300 will be used most. When I set it I will be a home. What looks good here is different than what looks good under fluorescent lights in the lab. Picking what looks good when you set it implies you will either always use the light in the same place OR you will reset every time you use it. I only want to program it once. Infinite adjustment is my favorite UI but no magnetic adjustment wheel on Zebralight.


----------



## Tachead

recDNA said:


> Look. I explained 1600. It's for a few seconds once in a while just cuz it's there. The 1000 I'll use a lot. 300 will be used most. When I set it I will be a home. What looks good here is different than what looks good under fluorescent lights in the lab. Picking what looks good when you set it implies you will either always use the light in the same place OR you will reset every time you use it. I only want to program it once. Infinite adjustment is my favorite UI but no magnetic adjustment wheel on Zebralight.


How are you liking the light by the way recDNA? What's the tint like on the cool white version?


----------



## markr6

Dio said:


> The amount of worrying some people do over lights really makes you wonder about humanity



:welcome:

I can worry about lights with the best of them!


----------



## twistedraven

Got my H600FCs in today!











All 3 are pretty indistinguishable in terms of anodizing finish.





Lenses seem to be all equally frosted.





Tint difference between the three is very minimal. The camera has a hard time picking it up in this case, but the one in the middle is ever so slightly less rosy/more green than the two on the outside. Deciding between the other two was very hard for me. I ultimately went for the one on the right.







H600FC MK4 on left (93-95cri XHP50.2 4000k), SC600MK3 HI in middle (80cri XHP35 HI 4500k), H600FD MK3 on right (83-85cri XML2 5000k).
The tint differences here are slightly exaggerated. In person I saw the HI's hotspot to be slightly less greenish than it is in picture, but only a little bit. Also keep in mind that my particular SC600 MK3 HI was also cherrypicked between 3 different samples to be the least green I could get it. The differences in tint between the three samples for those was more apparent than the 3 samples of the H600FC I received today.





H600FC MK4 on left, H600FD MK3 on right. This picture is fairly accurate to what I saw in person at the time with my currently adapted eyes. The tint on both is pretty great, but I would probably choose the FC for nighttime tasks, not to mention its higher output and higher CRI (which will be much more subtle of an effect than just discerning the raw differences in color temperature and how that affects spectral balance on objects you view.)


A couple of observations: Zebralight says you can use a protected 18650 for the H600FC's highest output, but it needs be capable of highish drain regardless. The Olight 3600mah 10amp battery I put in it refused to work with the H1 output. A keeppower 3500mah did work, however. For the sake of reduced resistance, I would run unprotected cells only in this light.

The luminous efficacy of the XHP50.2 is great. The H2 output of the H600FC MK4 (980 lumens) takes way longer to get hot to the touch than the H1 output (870 lumens) on the H600FD MK3, even though it's rated for a higher CRI. An advancement of 2-3 generations of LED tech.


I will do some runtime tests next.


----------



## Tachead

twistedraven said:


> Got my H600FCs in today!
> 
> All 3 are pretty indistinguishable in terms of anodizing finish.
> 
> Lenses seem to be all equally frosted.
> 
> Tint difference between the three is very minimal. The camera has a hard time picking it up in this case, but the one in the middle is ever so slightly less rosy/more green than the two on the outside. Deciding between the other two was very hard for me. I ultimately went for the one on the right.
> 
> H600FC MK4 on left (93-95cri XHP50.2 4000k), SC600MK3 HI in middle (80cri XHP35 HI 4500k), H600FD MK3 on right (83-85cri XML2 5000k).
> The tint differences here are slightly exaggerated. In person I saw the HI's hotspot to be slightly less greenish than it is in picture, but only a little bit. Also keep in mind that my particular SC600 MK3 HI was also cherrypicked between 3 different samples to be the least green I could get it. The differences in tint between the three samples for those was more apparent than the 3 samples of the H600FC I received today.
> 
> This picture is fairly accurate to what I saw in person at the time with my currently adapted eyes. The tint on both is pretty great, but I would probably choose the FC for nighttime tasks, not to mention its higher output and higher CRI (which will be much more subtle of an effect than just discerning the raw differences in color temperature and how that affects spectral balance on objects you view.)
> 
> 
> A couple of observations: Zebralight says you can use a protected 18650 for the H600FC's highest output, but it needs be capable of highish drain regardless. The Olight 3600mah 10amp battery I put in it refused to work with the H1 output. A keeppower 3500mah did work, however. For the sake of reduced resistance, I would run unprotected cells only in this light.
> 
> The luminous efficacy of the XHP50.2 is great. The H2 output of the H600FC MK4 (980 lumens) takes way longer to get hot to the touch than the H1 output (870 lumens) on the H600FD MK3, even though it's rated for a higher CRI. An advancement of 2-3 generations of LED tech.
> 
> I will do some runtime tests next.



Thanks twistedraven👍.

The tint on the MKIV Fc looks very similar to the MKIII Fc. Here is a picture for comparison. This is the Fd and Fc MKIII's. This is very close to what I see in person. 






How much brighter is the new Fc MKIV on H1 compared to the Fd MKIII? And, how quickly does it get hot on H1?


----------



## twistedraven

I'd say it looks about a third more bright than the H600FD MK3. Both being frosted, you can't really discern a more intense center spot, but in close range I get the sense that the MK4 lights up a wider area of stuff a little bit better than the MK3. It's about what I would expect from 15-1600 lumens vs 900 lumens. 

Yeah your comparison picture is definitely what I see with regards to my MK4 FC vs MK3 FD.


----------



## Tachead

twistedraven said:


> I'd say it looks about a third more bright than the H600FD MK3. Both being frosted, you can't really discern a more intense center spot, but in close range I get the sense that the MK4 lights up a wider area of stuff a little bit better than the MK3. It's about what I would expect from 15-1600 lumens vs 900 lumens.
> 
> Yeah your comparison picture is definitely what I see with regards to my MK4 FC vs MK3 FD.


Thanks👍.

What about heat wise on H1? How quickly does it heat up compared to you Fd MKIII?


----------



## twistedraven

Tachead said:


> Thanks.
> 
> What about heat wise on H1? How quickly does it heat up compared to you Fd MKIII?




H600FC's MK4 H1 seems to get hot faster than H600FD MK3's H1. I think that also supports the idea that the light is very picky about which protected cells it uses, because it draws so much current. Another user has also said that its H1 cuts out sooner than later on protected cells as well.

I would definitely use unprotected high drain cells for H600FC MK4.


----------



## likethevegetable

Tachead, I don't have another light to compare, but my Fc IV heats up very quickly on H1, in under 10 seconds the lense is pretty hot to keep my finger on.


----------



## twistedraven

The H1 output of the H600FC MK4 isn't really usable to me. I've never seen a Zebralight's PID kick in as rapidly as with the H1 of this light. It stays steady around 1600 lumen to a slow decrease to like 1-1200 lumen for the first minute of usage, then the PID kicks in so rapidly over the next 10 seconds, taking its output to around 5-600 lumen, and it's very noticeable.

I think the 500ish lumen output will be the sweet spot on this light for me. I'm gonna test runtime on that setting.


----------



## scs

twistedraven said:


> The H1 output of the H600FC MK4 isn't really usable to me. I've never seen a Zebralight's PID kick in as rapidly as with the H1 of this light. It stays steady around 1600 lumen to a slow decrease to like 1-1200 lumen for the first minute of usage, then the PID kicks in so rapidly over the next 10 seconds, taking its output to around 5-600 lumen, and it's very noticeable.
> 
> I think the 500ish lumen output will be the sweet spot on this light for me. I'm gonna test runtime on that setting.



How about the 980 lumen H2?


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

anthon87 said:


> Got 3.61A for 1050lm from a fully charged cell so in my opinion is low efficiency



Test it at a lower level. H1 is a bit unfair for an efficiency test, and not very practical since you can't run it on full output for more than a few minutes. Use something around 300 lumens and see if the efficiency is a lot better.

BTW, I don't think your SC600w MkIV HI has unusually low output. I measure mine around 1050 lumens most of the time. I might stretch it to 1150-1200 lumens on a fully-charged cell immediately after I turn it on, but it's certainly nowhere close to the stated 1400 lumens. I think Zebralight just screwed up on that claim.

As far as efficiency goes, I haven't measured mine, but it's much more efficient than most of my "budget lights" which use XPL emitters and linear or FET drivers.


----------



## Tachead

twistedraven said:


> H600FC's MK4 H1 seems to get hot faster than H600FD MK3's H1. I think that also supports the idea that the light is very picky about which protected cells it uses, because it draws so much current. Another user has also said that its H1 cuts out sooner than later on protected cells as well.
> 
> I would definitely use unprotected high drain cells for H600FC MK4.



Thanks for the report👍. That is what I figured.


----------



## Tachead

likethevegetable said:


> Tachead, I don't have another light to compare, but my Fc IV heats up very quickly on H1, in under 10 seconds the lense is pretty hot to keep my finger on.


Thanks👍.


----------



## Tachead

twistedraven said:


> The H1 output of the H600FC MK4 isn't really usable to me. I've never seen a Zebralight's PID kick in as rapidly as with the H1 of this light. It stays steady around 1600 lumen to a slow decrease to like 1-1200 lumen for the first minute of usage, then the PID kicks in so rapidly over the next 10 seconds, taking its output to around 5-600 lumen, and it's very noticeable.
> 
> I think the 500ish lumen output will be the sweet spot on this light for me. I'm gonna test runtime on that setting.


It's still nice to have it for a burst mode though no? That way if you just need a lot of light for a bit to check something it's there.


----------



## lampeDépêche

Tachead said:


> It's still nice to have it for a burst mode though no? That way if you just need a lot of light for a bit to check something it's there.



That is *exactly* how I feel about H1 levels, whether in ZL or in other lights. I do not mind the fact that I can use it only for a minute or less--that is often all that I need at the highest level. I know that it is not intended for long use. But I want the option of pushing the system at a level that it can only sustain for a brief time. 

The comparison that always comes to mind for me is afterburner in a fighter jet. How long can I fly using afterburner? Not long--certainly not all the way back to base. But when I need it for 5 seconds, it is incredibly handy.

Imagine if a pilot came back to the jet manufacturer and said, "that afterburner mode is a fraud; it only works for 10 seconds. You should take it out, and make the maximum cruising speed now your absolute maximum speed for the plane." Anybody would think they were crazy. Making the afterburner available does not *prevent* you from using the maximum cruising speed (i.e. H2). If you want to treat H2 as though it's the absolute maximum on your light, then go ahead. That's what I do, too, 95% of the time. When I'm cruising, I stick to cruising speed. But I want the option of kicking in the afterburner when things get risky!

ETA: My comment is not directed at TwistedRaven's case, just at the general issue of top levels that self-limit after some time or in response to heat. I'm in favor of lights with that option, but some do it better and some do it worse. If a light had an H1 that lasted only 3 seconds and used up half of the 18650's capacity, then that would not be a good implementation. It's possible that TR's light has implemented its H1 in a poor way, and he has every right to complain about it.


----------



## Tachead

lampeDépêche said:


> That is *exactly* how I feel about H1 levels, whether in ZL or in other lights. I do not mind the fact that I can use it only for a minute or less--that is often all that I need at the highest level. I know that it is not intended for long use. But I want the option of pushing the system at a level that it can only sustain for a brief time.
> 
> The comparison that always comes to mind for me is afterburner in a fighter jet. How long can I fly using afterburner? Not long--certainly not all the way back to base. But when I need it for 5 seconds, it is incredibly handy.
> 
> Imagine if a pilot came back to the jet manufacturer and said, "that afterburner mode is a fraud; it only works for 10 seconds. You should take it out, and make the maximum cruising speed now your absolute maximum speed for the plane." Anybody would think they were crazy. Making the afterburner available does not *prevent* you from using the maximum cruising speed (i.e. H2). If you want to treat H2 as though it's the absolute maximum on your light, then go ahead. That's what I do, too, 95% of the time. When I'm cruising, I stick to cruising speed. But I want the option of kicking in the afterburner when things get risky!
> 
> ETA: My comment is not directed at TwistedRaven's case, just at the general issue of top levels that self-limit after some time or in response to heat. I'm in favor of lights with that option, but some do it better and some do it worse. If a light had an H1 that lasted only 3 seconds and used up half of the 18650's capacity, then that would not be a good implementation. It's possible that TR's light has implemented its H1 in a poor way, and he has every right to complain about it.



Nicely put, I agree completely.


----------



## Tachead

lampeDépêche said:


> That is *exactly* how I feel about H1 levels, whether in ZL or in other lights. I do not mind the fact that I can use it only for a minute or less--that is often all that I need at the highest level. I know that it is not intended for long use. But I want the option of pushing the system at a level that it can only sustain for a brief time.
> 
> The comparison that always comes to mind for me is afterburner in a fighter jet. How long can I fly using afterburner? Not long--certainly not all the way back to base. But when I need it for 5 seconds, it is incredibly handy.
> 
> Imagine if a pilot came back to the jet manufacturer and said, "that afterburner mode is a fraud; it only works for 10 seconds. You should take it out, and make the maximum cruising speed now your absolute maximum speed for the plane." Anybody would think they were crazy. Making the afterburner available does not *prevent* you from using the maximum cruising speed (i.e. H2). If you want to treat H2 as though it's the absolute maximum on your light, then go ahead. That's what I do, too, 95% of the time. When I'm cruising, I stick to cruising speed. But I want the option of kicking in the afterburner when things get risky!
> 
> ETA: My comment is not directed at TwistedRaven's case, just at the general issue of top levels that self-limit after some time or in response to heat. I'm in favor of lights with that option, but some do it better and some do it worse. *If a light had an H1 that lasted only 3 seconds and used up half of the 18650's capacity, then that would not be a good implementation.* It's possible that TR's light has implemented its H1 in a poor way, and he has every right to complain about it.



Cough...Cough...Emisar D4.


----------



## twistedraven

I can get the argument for burst modes and why they might be needed (though I can't see when and why I would use a burst mode honestly.) 

I'm more or just venting on why it's not very practical to have such a highly driven output on a tiny host with next to no heat sinking capability. That is also why I've never been a fan of big output soda can lights. On other Zebralights I'm completely fine with the PID implementation on the highest output, because the PID is more gradual.

In my H600FD MK3's case, the H1 isn't driven quite as hard, and the drop from 900 lumens to 500 lumens takes longer, plus is less of a drop, so the implementation of PID isn't as obtrusive. I just timed it, and at around the 1:40 mark, you notice a couple big steps of decreases, but it's nothing quite as drastic as the H1 on the H600FC MK4. On the SC600 HI MK3, the PID drops start kicking in around 1:40 as well, but they're spaced out further, and are smaller drops, so the decline down 8-900 lumens is also very gradual and less obtrusive. The extra mass no doubt helps the light absorb more heat before it has to start lowering output due to lack of adequate surface area to heatsink. It's only around the 4 minute mark that the SC600MK3 HI finally ramps down to around 500 lumens, but again, in a very gradual manner.


This is just my own personal bias against burst or turbo modes in general, but I feel that with the added mass of the SC600 body, if Zebralight were to produce a slightly bulkier headlamp that could lead to a better PID experience with the H600FC MK4's highest output, it would lead to a better experience overall. With the current implementation, the PID on this light might as well be a hard stepdown. But there of course you might run into comfort issues with the added weight.

Now, having said all of that, I went to test the H2 output of the H600FC at its 980lm output mode, and the results are very agreeable. In this output mode, the light acts very much like the SC600 with its H1, and is no doubt much better than the H600FD MK3 at around 900 lumens. The light slowly ramps down to 500 lumens, but it takes it a whole 3-4 minutes, and the transition is completely smooth and unobtrusive. 

The 562lumen output mode might as well be fully regulated to a flat line, because PID drop isn't really even detectable, and it does it over a course of several, several minutes. For a light of this minute size to maintain 500 lumen output with 90 cri is an amazing feat I must say.

It's my opinion that Zebralight implemented PID as a response to lights with timed stepdowns, to create something that felt more natural to the user. The H1 of the H600FD/C MK4 defeats the purpose of PID.


----------



## Tachead

twistedraven said:


> I can get the argument for burst modes and why they might be needed (though I can't see when and why I would use a burst mode honestly.)
> 
> I'm more or just venting on why it's not very practical to have such a highly driven output on a tiny host with next to no heat sinking capability. That is also why I've never been a fan of big output soda can lights. On other Zebralights I'm completely fine with the PID implementation on the highest output, because the PID is more gradual.
> 
> In my H600FD MK3's case, the H1 isn't driven quite as hard, and the drop from 900 lumens to 500 lumens takes longer, plus is less of a drop, so the implementation of PID isn't as obtrusive. I just timed it, and at around the 1:40 mark, you notice a couple big steps of decreases, but it's nothing quite as drastic as the H1 on the H600FC MK4. On the SC600 HI MK3, the PID drops start kicking in around 1:40 as well, but they're spaced out further, and are smaller drops, so the decline down 8-900 lumens is also very gradual and less obtrusive. The extra mass no doubt helps the light absorb more heat before it has to start lowering output due to lack of adequate surface area to heatsink. It's only around the 4 minute mark that the SC600MK3 HI finally ramps down to around 500 lumens, but again, in a very gradual manner.
> 
> 
> This is just my own personal bias against burst or turbo modes in general, but I feel that with the added mass of the SC600 body, if Zebralight were to produce a slightly bulkier headlamp that could lead to a better PID experience with the H600FC MK4's highest output, it would lead to a better experience overall. With the current implementation, the PID on this light might as well be a hard stepdown. But there of course you might run into comfort issues with the added weight.
> 
> Now, having said all of that, I went to test the H2 output of the H600FC at its 980lm output mode, and the results are very agreeable. In this output mode, the light acts very much like the SC600 with its H1, and is no doubt much better than the H600FD MK3 at around 900 lumens. The light slowly ramps down to 500 lumens, but it takes it a whole 3-4 minutes, and the transition is completely smooth and unobtrusive.
> 
> The 562lumen output mode might as well be fully regulated to a flat line, because PID drop isn't really even detectable, and it does it over a course of several, several minutes. For a light of this minute size to maintain 500 lumen output with 90 cri is an amazing feat I must say.
> 
> *It's my opinion that Zebralight implemented PID as a response to lights with timed stepdowns, to create something that felt more natural to the user. The H1 of the H600FD/C MK4 defeats the purpose of PID.*



That may be a part of why ZL and other manufactures implemented thermal regulation but, I don't think it is the main reason.

Thermal regulation gives you the most output possible and adjusts in real time to the current conditions. So, if you are at 500 lumens and then you walk outside into a colder ambient environment, it will instantly ramp back up and give you the most light possible. The same goes for if it's windy or you start moving allowing more air flow over the body. A timed step down just gives you the same neutered output all the time no matter the conditions.

It is amazing how sensitive and accurate ZL's thermal regulation is too. Even if you just slightly blow on the head when it is tailstanding it will ramp back up a bit. Just touching the head or grabbing the body of the light will make it almost instantly ramp back up too.


----------



## likethevegetable

From an engineering perspective, PID control is the paragon solution for applications like these. Feedback and integral control is the backbone of all sophisticated control sysyems where you manipulate a control variable (current) to achieve a desired process variable (heat). I observed it when using my light outside at -25°C vs. in my basement, pretty cool to see it in action.

On an unrelated note, ZL recommend I use Sony VTC6 for optimal H1 performance.


----------



## Nuppet

likethevegetable said:


> From an engineering perspective, PID control is the paragon solution for applications like these. Feedback and integral control is the backbone of all sophisticated control sysyems where you manipulate a control variable (current) to achieve a desired process variable (heat). I observed it when using my light outside at -25°C vs. in my basement, pretty cool to see it in action. On an unrelated note, ZL recommend I use Sony VTC6 for optimal H1 performance.


 Please give a link as far as the Zebralight homepage is concerned the Sanyo NCR18650GA is still the recommended cell.


----------



## likethevegetable

Their customer service sent this:

"Yes. The H1 level draws high current that the internal resistance of the battery (and the protection circuit, if there is one) would reduces the supply voltage to the headlamp to very low. Use low internal resistance batteries (Sony VTC6, ...) is highly recommended, and without protection circuit if you can tolerate."


----------



## Nuppet

likethevegetable said:


> Their customer service sent this: "Yes. The H1 level draws high current that the internal resistance of the battery (and the protection circuit, if there is one) would reduces the supply voltage to the headlamp to very low. Use low internal resistance batteries (Sony VTC6, ...) is highly recommended, and without protection circuit if you can tolerate."


 I'm still perplexed as to why ZB will write this to you and not update their home page accordingly as there are other earlier lights with higher output.


----------



## Tachead

Nuppet said:


> I'm still perplexed as to why ZB will write this to you and not update their home page accordingly as there are other earlier lights with higher output.


The lights will still run absolutely fine on the recommend unprotected GA cells. And, all ZL lights draw less, most significantly less, then their 10amp continuous current rating. You can just run a higher current cell(like the VTC6) if you want a bit more current overhead and maybe very slightly better performance in H1. What they are trying to say is that performance might be reduced on H1 if you use some protected cells or older lower current rated cells.


----------



## Nuppet

Tachead said:


> The lights will still run absolutely fine on the recommend unprotected GA cells. And, all ZL lights draw less, most significantly less, then their 10amp continuous current rating. You can just run a higher current cell(like the VTC6) if you want a bit more current overhead and maybe very slightly better performance in H1. What they are trying to say is that performance might be reduced on H1 if you use some protected cells or older lower current rated cells.


 Yeah, my assumption was that he was using the NCR18650GA cell and that was what he communicated to ZL, thus my confusion. Probably my assumption is wrong then. In any case, my very own H600Fc is on the way so I can test myself  Edit: Fix typo NCR18650GC -> NCR18650GA


----------



## Hugh Johnson

Anther poster reported UI glitches and random shut offs. Are these known issues?


----------



## markr6

Hugh Johnson said:


> Anther poster reported UI glitches and random shut offs. Are these known issues?



At least two (including myself) had the SC600w IV HI shut off by itself. My replacement is working fine, though.

p.s. I just saw the thread Outdoorsman5 posted about 4 straight bugs in lights he purchased. I hope any bugs are worked out. I also hope we didn't reach a point of "too much to break"...over-complicating things and/or pushing too hard causing problems to arise. Other than a few bugs, the MK I and II lights have been very reliable IMO. I don't know a lot about the technical details, so I just trust Zebralight is keeping things within reason.


----------



## Tachead

markr6 said:


> At least two (including myself) had the SC600w IV HI shut off by itself. My replacement is working fine, though.
> 
> p.s. I just saw the thread Outdoorsman5 posted about 4 straight bugs in lights he purchased. A mod locked the thread, and said it may even be removed (more of a "Jeer" thread). I can't say I agree with that since this is important information for all Zebralight fans. Maybe a summary can be posted here. Regardless, I hope any bugs are worked out. I also hope we didn't reach a point of "too much to break"...over-complicating things and/or pushing too hard causing problems to arise. Other than a few bugs, the MK I and II lights have been very reliable IMO. I don't know a lot about the technical details, so I just trust Zebralight is keeping things within reason.



Personally, I think the mods did the right thing. His post was way out of line and broke several rules. Maybe if he would have stayed calm and worded it better instead of flying off the handle like an angry child it would have been ok.

I will also say I find it weird/unlikely that he got so many lights with problems when almost nobody else has(I have read 2 reports and I follow all of the light forums regularly) in the several thousands of lights sold. Also, the fact that ZL tested his lights several times and couldn't find anything wrong suggests to me the issue might not be with the lights and maybe with how he uses them or another variable. 

I have had 4 of the new lights(I sold one of them after about a month of use) and none of them have any glitches that I have found.


----------



## Tixx

My SC600Fc Mk IV Plus 18650 XHP50 Floody 4000K High CRI Flashlight was a little glitchy. It was sent back. I'll buy again when confident all this stuff has been worked out of these new lights. Seems like a real mess they got into unfortunately.


----------



## likethevegetable

Hey Tixx, what glitches can you report?

The only little hiccup I've found was my H600Fc IV wouldn't shut off from L1 (only once) after I adjusted the PID temperature.. a simple unscrew of the tail-cap fixed it. Other than that, I've been using my G6 program without any issue.


----------



## Tixx

likethevegetable said:


> Hey Tixx, what glitches can you report?
> 
> The only little hiccup I've found was my H600Fc IV wouldn't shut off from L1 (only once) after I adjusted the PID temperature.. a simple unscrew of the tail-cap fixed it. Other than that, I've been using my G6 program without any issue.



It would turn on and then could not change modes. I would just stick no matter what. Maybe 5% of the time. Hard to reproduce since so random. Did standard battery swaps and reprogramming, but nothing worked. Only unscrew the tail cap turned it off and then it worked again until next time.


----------



## TCY

Just got my H600Fc. 219C level tint albeit a tad creamy yellowish, not even joking here. Insanely pleasant tint without the Nichia pinkness. I wouldn't know it's a Cree if no one tells me. This stuff is good. Will post some signature TCY comparison shots later!


----------



## markr6

ALL SC64 flavors in stock right now!


----------



## geokite

Not sure how many of us use strobe, but the new UI has strobe levels fixed at the H1 and low levels (from G5) in G6 and G7. IMO this is not apparent from their description of the light. And the PID still does not function during strobe.

With 20+ other ZL, so far I'm not using the G6 and G7 modes in my one IV light (SC600w IV+). Got too much finger memory...


----------



## Nuppet

I've received my new H600Fc Mk IV today, and the tint is very nice with a hint of pink when compared side by side with SC53c, SC64c or H53Fc. A pocket clip was also included.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

geokite said:


> With 20+ other ZL, so far I'm not using the G6 and G7 modes in my one IV light (SC600w IV+). Got too much finger memory...



I find that G6 and G7 are still handy, even if you want to preserve the L-M-H sequence to keep consistent with your other zebras. I set up G6 to be all very low modes (the lowest 6 levels). It gives a good selection for nighttime use around the house, and if I accidentally turn it on high, it's only a few lumens (not 1200 lumens!).

G7 I set up for middle modes, which are great for tail-standing to light a room when watching a movie or something. It's just easier than re-programming the M2 mode if I want it a little brighter or dimmer.


----------



## psp300639

I got a brand new zebralight sc600w mkiv plus and this is suppose to be my first zebralight ever bought..i was impressed with the latest user interface built in this unit. I did program the G6 and G7 similarly as per the users manual however it was not to my expectation. In group 6 I program the H1 and H2 to 705lm and 358lm respectively likewise in M1 and M2 to 2300lm and 1311lm respectively. The L1 and L2 were left in default mode. I use this type of program so a "single click" will more of general purpose light as stated in H1 & H2 at lower lumens and "Double click" mode for full light as stated in M1 & M2. The unit work as intended however the problem with the "press and hold" mode features if I start to use the led light will cycle starting from H >M>L or simply will start to cycle from "High" then to "Medium" then lastly "Low" and the cycle continues all over again. Seems odd to my understanding as per user manual it should start always from L >M>H or simply Low > Medium > High and cycle continues all over until you let it go to its intended choice. I never tested the built-in features of the "PID" since the instruction manual says press and hold to cycle starting from L>M>H but this unit done the reverse program starting from H>M>L as stated earlier. Anyone experience this type of issues?


----------



## ven

Sounds normal PSP, if you swap the levels around then you will get the sequence swapped. Basically changing your high etc around to low, the cycle will change with your modes. Other option is use G5 for when you want to cycle low/med/high(I know not ideal). But yes mine both do it as well.


----------



## terryoregon

Just ordered a *SC600Fd Mk IV Plus* two days ago, and was expecting to wait a while because it's listed as "*Availablility: Back Order"*.
But one day later I got a shipping notice with tracking, even though it's still showing as _back order_ on Zebralight's website.

Per recent discussions, I will certainly run it through the ringer to see if any anomalies show up.

Edit: Well wow, they sent it 2-day shipping, arrived today (2/10). Been playing with all the modes for the last hour, no anomalies, seems to behave perfectly.
Now, for the first time, gota go play with the G6/G7 programming. 






.


----------



## recDNA

I finally got my order processed for cool white sc64. Not happy using unprotected batteries but it is what it is. Just want to try it. Probably back on sale a week after I get it. Any indentations on the battery will scare me out of using it.


----------



## SmeepyBeeper

Is it unusual for Zebralight threads to be rough? My SC64 has rough threads even after cleaning and lubing.


----------



## terryoregon

Just to see if it could be done, I programmed my SC600Fd Mk IV Plus to a *single level light*. With G6 programming, every level can be programmed to the same output, thus I could loan it to someone with zero training. On/off, nothing more. Way cool!



> Is it unusual for Zebralight threads to be rough? My SC64 has rough threads even after cleaning and lubing



The tail cap on both my Zebraights screw down buttery smooth.


----------



## recDNA

SmeepyBeeper said:


> Is it unusual for Zebralight threads to be rough? My SC64 has rough threads even after cleaning and lubing.


NOW you tell me! Just ordered one. My 62 has very smooth threads.


----------



## markr6

I've probably had 18+ Zebralights in my hands over the years. The threads vary. Nothing will beat my SC52w, which is silent and smooth and takes no effort. The newer ones seem a little more coarse, but I think that's just due to the pressure on the springs/pins; a much tighter fit.


----------



## Kivatch

I had a somewhat "bad" experience with my H600w mkII, the battery holder part is not uniformly machined. The anti-slip denting is thicker on one side of the metal piece. 

It is quite hard to describe but I could definitely feel it when changing the battery. When I received the lamp I was a bit disappointed because my only other Zebralight was a SC52w which has a superb machining. Apart from this issue the lamp is great and the threads are smooth.


----------



## Tachead

markr6 said:


> I've probably had 18+ Zebralights in my hands over the years. The threads vary. Nothing will beat my SC52w, which is silent and smooth and takes no effort. The newer ones seem a little more coarse, but I think that's just due to the pressure on the springs/pins; a much tighter fit.



Yep, they vary. I think the anodizing effects the smoothness as well, as the threads are anodized, and it varies as well(which is common with Class 1). Either way, the threads are well done and work just fine even if the smoothness varies.


----------



## IlluminationDomination

markr6 said:


> I've probably had 18+ Zebralights in my hands over the years. The threads vary. Nothing will beat my SC52w, which is silent and smooth and takes no effort. The newer ones seem a little more coarse, but I think that's just due to the pressure on the springs/pins; a much tighter fit.



I only have One Zebralight. An SC62. It has the smoothest threads of any light I have ever had. I have not lubed it for about 8 months. It does not need it. It is smooth as butter and silk!


----------



## Tachead

IlluminationDomination said:


> I only have One Zebralight. An SC62. It has the smoothest threads of any light I have ever had. I have not lubed it for about 8 months. It does not need it. It is smooth as butter and silk!


Lubricants minimize thead and o-ring wear as well as helps maintain waterproofness. They should still always be used and maintained no matter how smooth threads are.


----------



## Tredd

I just received my H600Fc MKiV and noticed that my light has condensation(?) built up behind the frosted lens. I have searched about this issue and haven't found much about it, other than it can be some sort of anti-glare coating?. Is this something common?


----------



## Kivatch

Tredd said:


> I just received my H600Fc MKiV and noticed that my light has condensation(?) built up behind the frosted lens. I have searched about this issue and haven't found much about it, other than it can be some sort of anti-glare coating?. Is this something common?



Does it happens after the light has been on a high output ? Condensation can form behind the optics if there is moisture or moist air inside the flashlight and if it suddenly cools down.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Kivatch said:


> Does it happens after the light has been on a high output ? Condensation can form behind the optics if there is moisture or moist air inside the flashlight and if it suddenly cools down.



Yeah, I've had this happen on some lights. It's usually because there is humidity trapped in the light, probably during manufacturing in humid climates. Open it up, and let all the parts dry for a couple of days. Preferably somewhere warm and dry, like a sunny window. On all my lights, it eventually went away by itself, even if I didn't try to dry them out intentionally.


----------



## Tredd

Kivatch said:


> Does it happens after the light has been on a high output ? Condensation can form behind the optics if there is moisture or moist air inside the flashlight and if it suddenly cools down.



Even after hours of it off, the mark remains. I’ve left the light on high for a few minutes and it seems to remain the same; the “condensation” does not evaporate with heat.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Tredd said:


> Even after hours of it off, the mark remains. I’ve left the light on high for a few minutes and it seems to remain the same; the “condensation” does not evaporate with heat.



Are you sure it's water condensation, and not some kind of oil residue?


----------



## IlluminationDomination

Tachead said:


> Lubricants minimize thead and o-ring wear as well as helps maintain waterproofness. They should still always be used and maintained no matter how smooth threads are.


 OK,Thanks.

I may be new on here, however I have been at this hobby for 7 years.

I use NO-OX-ID for many things. Lubing the threads is one of them. The stuff works great and usually lasts about 1 year b/4 I need to apply it again.:thumbsup:


----------



## Outdoorsman5

Tachead said:


> Personally, I think the mods did the right thing. His post was way out of line and broke several rules. Maybe if he would have stayed calm and worded it better instead of flying off the handle like an angry child it would have been ok.
> 
> I will also say I find it weird/unlikely that he got so many lights with problems when almost nobody else has(I have read 2 reports and I follow all of the light forums regularly) in the several thousands of lights sold. Also, the fact that ZL tested his lights several times and couldn't find anything wrong suggests to me the issue might not be with the lights and maybe with how he uses them or another variable.
> 
> I have had 4 of the new lights(I sold one of them after about a month of use) and none of them have any glitches that I have found.



Tachead, I've seen prior comments from you before. You seem like a cool guy, so I will give you the benefit of the doubt. In your comment above though, you are coming across as a know-it-all and oddly offended that someone dare speak poorly of your beloved lights. You should refrain from that behavior here. My first post regarding my recent bad experience (4 defective Zebralights in a row) was the truth but broke some rules I was unaware of - my bad. I rewrote the post (see below) WITH VIDEOS OF THE DEFECTS. It's funny how several, including you, just assumed automatically that I was either wrong or lying (lying is what you implied by the way.) I simply wanted to report the truth about a problem I have now seen in 4 lights in a row. IS THIS FORUM (which I have loved for years) ABOUT REPORTING THE TRUTH OR SHOULD WE ALL JUST HIDE IN THE CORNER WHEN OUR PRECIOUS LIGHTS MALFUNCTION?

This thread details my 4 defective Zebralights including videos:

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...GHT-REVIEW-%96-2-Malfunctions-in-all-4-lights


----------



## StandardBattery

IlluminationDomination said:


> I have SC62,,my favorite EDC light.


A true Classic.


----------



## Tachead

Outdoorsman5 said:


> Tachead, I've seen prior comments from you before. You seem like a cool guy, so I will give you the benefit of the doubt. In your comment above though, you are coming across as a know-it-all and oddly offended that someone dare speak poorly of your beloved lights. You should refrain from that behavior here. My first post regarding my recent bad experience (4 defective Zebralights in a row) was the truth but broke some rules I was unaware of - my bad. I rewrote the post (see below) WITH VIDEOS OF THE DEFECTS. It's funny how several, including you, just assumed automatically that I was either wrong or lying (lying is what you implied by the way.) I simply wanted to report the truth about a problem I have now seen in 4 lights in a row. IS THIS FORUM (which I have loved for years) ABOUT REPORTING THE TRUTH OR SHOULD WE ALL JUST HIDE IN THE CORNER WHEN OUR PRECIOUS LIGHTS MALFUNCTION?
> 
> This thread details my 4 defective Zebralights including videos:
> 
> http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...GHT-REVIEW-%96-2-Malfunctions-in-all-4-lights



I am sorry if I offended you but, your first thread was a way out of hand imo and just rubbed me the wrong way quite frankly. Your new thread is much better and appreciated. I was not trying to imply you were lying by the way. I was more thinking it was user error but, now I see that is likely not the case and you apparently just have very bad luck. You have to understand it seemed odd that you were having so many issues when almost no one else on any forum was. Anyway, this forum is definitely about reporting the truth and I appreciate your contribution:thumbsup:.


----------



## archimedes

I find that using A LITTLE BIT OF CAPITALIZATION GOES A LONG WAY ... in terms of tone


----------



## Outdoorsman5

Tachead said:


> I am sorry if I offended you but, your first thread was a way out of hand imo and just rubbed me the wrong way quite frankly. Your new thread is much better and appreciated. I was not trying to imply you were lying by the way. I was more thinking it was user error but, now I see that is likely not the case and you apparently just have very bad luck. You have to understand it seemed odd that you were having so many issues when almost no one else on any forum was. Anyway, this forum is definitely about reporting the truth and I appreciate your contribution:thumbsup:.



Thank you for the thoughtful reply Tachead. As suspected, you are truly a cool guy.


----------



## Tachead

Outdoorsman5 said:


> Thank you for the thoughtful reply Tachead. As suspected, you are truly a cool guy.



Thank you and I am sorry again I was a little harsh.

Oh, I forgot to mention... good luck with your problem lights. I am sorry you are having so many issues and I hope you get them sorted quickly. Keep us updated please:thumbsup:.


----------



## Outdoorsman5

Tachead said:


> Thank you and I am sorry again I was a little harsh.
> 
> Oh, I forgot to mention... good luck with your problem lights. I am sorry you are having so many issues and I hope you get them sorted quickly. Keep us updated please:thumbsup:.



Thanks man, and I sure will.


----------



## noboneshotdog

Tachead said:


> Thank you and I am sorry again I was a little harsh.
> 
> Oh, I forgot to mention... good luck with your problem lights. I am sorry you are having so many issues and I hope you get them sorted quickly. Keep us updated please:thumbsup:.



+1. I was a little skeptical as well and am sorry for coming off a bit prideful /assuming. Good luck Outdoorsman.


----------



## Flint Hills

I need some help from the experts, please!

I'm on my second SC5c MK II. The first one would not hit H1 on Energizer Ultimate Lithium but would function normally on Eneloop Pro or plain old alkaline. I contacted Zebralight and they said it was not normal, to return it. I returned it and have received my replacement but it does the exact same thing. I've tried contacting them again with no response.

These are brand new lithiums that function perfectly in my SC52w L2. When battery checking with the SC52 they give 4 flashes indicating a full charge but the same battery in the SC5 mkii only shows 2 flashes. I prefer the lithium because of weight and with my use, they last months. The Eneloop Pro in this SC5 is dead after a week. I'm not very familiar with Eneloop but that seems very short.

I'm not sure if what I'm experiencing is normal or if I've had very bad luck in receiving two units in a row that are defective in the same way?


----------



## Outdoorsman5

noboneshotdog said:


> +1. I was a little skeptical as well and am sorry for coming off a bit prideful /assuming. Good luck Outdoorsman.



No worries, thanks man!


----------



## radsaq

Flint Hills said:


> I need some help from the experts, please!
> 
> I'm on my second SC5c MK II. The first one would not hit H1 on Energizer Ultimate Lithium but would function normally on Eneloop Pro or plain old alkaline. I contacted Zebralight and they said it was not normal, to return it. I returned it and have received my replacement but it does the exact same thing. I've tried contacting them again with no response.
> 
> These are brand new lithiums that function perfectly in my SC52w L2. When battery checking with the SC52 they give 4 flashes indicating a full charge but the same battery in the SC5 mkii only shows 2 flashes. I prefer the lithium because of weight and with my use, they last months. The Eneloop Pro in this SC5 is dead after a week. I'm not very familiar with Eneloop but that seems very short.
> 
> I'm not sure if what I'm experiencing is normal or if I've had very bad luck in receiving two units in a row that are defective in the same way?



I haven't tried lithium primaries in the SC5xx lights, but with somewhat old eneloop pros I rarely see more than 2 flashes from the battery check in the SC5c II and SC53c. Many of them also can't keep up with H1 on the SC5c II even when freshly-charged, as it's simply asking for a lot of current from the poor little batteries.  (For this reason, I kinda think the SC53x lights just make a lot more sense even though the specs aren't as impressive as the SC5x II.)

That being said, I would be surprised if a fresh lithium AA couldn't achieve H1 for any length of time. And eneloop pros have higher self-discharge than regular eneloops, but they shouldn't die that fast.


----------



## Tachead

My custom titanium deep carry clips just came in for my SC64w&c. They turned out pretty nice. One is black powder coated 6Al-4V titanium with a CNC engraved Punisher Skull symbol that I sent the maker and the other is stone washed 6Al-4V titanium. Here they are...


----------



## pantagana23

radsaq said:


> I haven't tried lithium primaries in the SC5xx lights, but with somewhat old eneloop pros I rarely see more than 2 flashes from the battery check in the SC5c II and SC53c. Many of them also can't keep up with H1 on the SC5c II even when freshly-charged, as it's simply asking for a lot of current from the poor little batteries.  (For this reason, I kinda think the SC53x lights just make a lot more sense even though the specs aren't as impressive as the SC5x II.)
> 
> That being said, I would be surprised if a fresh lithium AA couldn't achieve H1 for any length of time. And eneloop pros have higher self-discharge than regular eneloops, but they shouldn't die that fast.



To reply both, I have an SC5w II, and asked the manufacturer regarding Energizer lithiums. They stated that I would not be able to get max output, due to max current limit of Energizer (2.5A continuous, 4A burst). Thus why I don't use those, but Eneloop Pro instead.
I've had the light EPro go from 3 flashes to 1 flash within a day, without even using it. However, the batteries are freshly bought, and I haven't charged them. The ones that were charged seem to hold up when not used. This is a consuming little light when using it, drains EPros faster than I expected. However, this could be just my subjectivity.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

pantagana23 said:


> To reply both, I have an SC5w II, and asked the manufacturer regarding Energizer lithiums. They stated that I would not be able to get max output, due to max current limit of Energizer (2.5A continuous, 4A burst). Thus why I don't use those, but Eneloop Pro instead.
> I've had the light EPro go from 3 flashes to 1 flash within a day, without even using it. However, the batteries are freshly bought, and I haven't charged them. The ones that were charged seem to hold up when not used. This is a consuming little light when using it, drains EPros faster than I expected. However, this could be just my subjectivity.



Don't believe the flashes. I find they're almost random, except right after I put in a fresh Eneloop (they always give 4 flashes then).

There's almost no parasitic drain in the SC5, so your Eneloops will not drain in the light. If the battery is dead after a week, then either you've used the light a fair bit, or your battery is bad, or there's something wrong with the light.


----------



## markr6

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> If the battery is dead after a week, then...



...it's a Nitecore. OOH!!!!!! Just kidding  (not really)


----------



## recDNA

Someone mentioned another name brand battery at Mtn electronics they liked better than the GA. Anybody remember the suggestion?

BTW, I just received a new GA with my new sc64. It doesn't say Sanyo nor GA anywhere on the battery. Is this normal?


----------



## likethevegetable

recDNA said:


> Someone mentioned another name brand battery at Mtn electronics they liked better than the GA. Anybody remember the suggestion?
> 
> BTW, I just received a new GA with my new sc64. It doesn't say Sanyo nor GA anywhere on the battery. Is this normal?



The ones I have are all red with a barely readable text on it, doesn't say Sanyo


----------



## recDNA

likethevegetable said:


> The ones I have are all red with a barely readable text on it


Thanks. Mine says 18650 3.7V 3500mAh and under it do not short circuit in bold clear print but no brand


----------



## markr6

recDNA said:


> BTW, I just received a new GA with my new sc64. It doesn't say Sanyo nor GA anywhere on the battery. Is this normal?



Yes that's normal. Sometimes the plain Sanyo/Panasonic or any brand for that matter may come with the clear label if a re-seller puts it on just to identify the mAh and voltage. Never from the factory though


----------



## recDNA

markr6 said:


> Yes, the plain Sanyo/Panasonic or any brand for that matter may come with the clear label if a re-seller puts it on. Never from the factory


I don't know what clear label means. Mine is all red with writing in black.


----------



## markr6

nevermind...I think some do have writing from the mfg now


----------



## recDNA

This is what mine looks like. Came direct from Zebralight.


----------



## markr6

Yeah that's what I was talking about. Just a clear label with plain black font. Not from the manufacturer, just something sellers put on to help out and keep things straight.

If it were printed on the red wrapper itself, Panasonic/Sanyo did it. Much like the older cells like NCR18650A...B...and so on. Not sure why but the newer GA's only recently started getting the printing. liionwholesale has a photo on their site of this. Maybe just the "made in china" cells? I don't know for sure.


----------



## Tachead

recDNA said:


> This is what mine looks like. Came direct from Zebralight.


Yes, that is normal many sellers put that label on as the stock battery has no info on it and it helps people know what it is.


----------



## Tachead

recDNA said:


> Someone mentioned another name brand battery at Mtn electronics they liked better than the GA. Anybody remember the suggestion?
> 
> BTW, I just received a new GA with my new sc64. It doesn't say Sanyo nor GA anywhere on the battery. Is this normal?


Several other cells will fit. I recommend the Sony VTC6 or Samsung 30Q if you want a higher discharge cell and if you want something similar to the GA then the LG MJ1 or Samsung 35E.


----------



## recDNA

Thanks! I'm disappointed in my sc64. H1 is super bright but H2 should still be brighter than H1 on my sc62w. It isn't. Not even close. H1 on sc62w is brighter than H2 on sc64. Kind of defeats the purpose of my purchase since I planned to use H2 as my bright mode.


----------



## Tachead

recDNA said:


> Thanks! I'm disappointed in my sc64. H1 is super bright but H2 should still be brighter than H1 on my sc62w. It isn't. Not even close. H1 on sc62w is brighter than H2 on sc64. Kind of defeats the purpose of my purchase since I planned to use H2 as my bright mode.


How is the tint on your sample of the CW?


----------



## recDNA

Looks white to me. I like it.


----------



## Tachead

recDNA said:


> Looks white to me. I like it.


Nice. How does it compare to your HDS 3 o'clock high?


----------



## recDNA

Tachead said:


> Nice. How does it compare to your HDS 3 o'clock high?


3 o'clock high is warmer


----------



## Tachead

recDNA said:


> 3 o'clock high is warmer


Thanks. Yeah I bet the 3 o'clock high is closer to ZL's "d" offerings as they are 5000K too. The CW ZL's should be more like the high noon as they are both 5700K nominal.


----------



## recDNA

Not like the old days when cw meant blue or green. I like the white tint. I'm just mad H2 not over 1000 lumens as advertised unless the sc62w has more lumens in H1 than advertised. Something wrong somewhere.


----------



## Tachead

recDNA said:


> Not like the old days when cw meant blue or green. I like the white tint. I'm just mad H2 not over 1000 lumens as advertised unless the sc62w has more lumens in H1 than advertised. Something wrong somewhere.


Could it have something to do with the different emitters and different reflectors? I hear the SC62 was quite a bit more throwy then these newer models(SC63/64). Sometimes a more throwy light will seem brighter then one that is the same output but more floody.


----------



## recDNA

Tachead said:


> Could it have something to do with the different emitters and different reflectors? I hear the SC62 was quite a bit more throwy then these newer models(SC63/64). Sometimes a more throwy light will seem brighter then one that is the same output but more floody.


That's a factor but it isn't close. Even the spill is WAY brighter in 62w H1 compared to 64 H2. Not really that close.

I may eventually look to trade the 64 for an MKIV Hi (not hinting for offers like I said I need time) . I'll give it some time. I won't sell because it isn't worth paying the fee unless selling several flashlights and I don't really have much to sell.

I obviously like the size of the 64 but I do miss the beam pattern of the 62w. Tint not really a factor for me. I like the tints of both.

I regret the purchase at this point.


----------



## Tachead

recDNA said:


> That's a factor but it isn't close. Even the spill is WAY brighter in 62w H1 compared to 64 H2. Not really that close.
> 
> I may eventually look to trade the 64 for an MKIV Hi (not hinting for offers like I said I need time) . I'll give it some time. I won't sell because it isn't worth paying the fee unless selling several flashlights and I don't really have much to sell.
> 
> I obviously like the size of the 64 but I do miss the beam pattern of the 62w. Tint not really a factor for me. I like the tints of both.
> 
> I regret the purchase at this point.



Don't forget you can always send it back to ZL for an exchange or refund within 30 days. I sent my MKIV HI back.


----------



## recDNA

Tachead said:


> Don't forget you can always send it back to ZL for an exchange or refund within 30 days.


It works fine so I wouldn't rip them off with a return. An exchange is a good idea. Why did u return the MKIV HI?


----------



## Tachead

recDNA said:


> It works fine so I wouldn't rip them off with a return. An exchange is a good idea. Why did u return the MKIV HI?



It's not ripping them off. They have the policy for a reason. If you are not happy with the light in any way you can return it. I decided I didn't need a third ZL flashlight. I am putting the money towards an OR Boss or HDS Clicky.


----------



## recDNA

Tachead said:


> It's not ripping them off. They have the policy for a reason. If you are not happy with the light in any way you can return it. I decided I didn't need a third ZL flashlight. I am putting the money towards an OR Boss or HDS Clicky.


I gave some thought to your beam profile analysis and retested the lights. I had been testing at 10m, the length of my playroom. I tested again at 1 meter. No question H2 on 64 is brighter than H1 on 62w but at any distance it is so spread out it appears dim. Also at 1 m I can see a yellow circle around the hotspot of the 64. At any distance it isn't visible in fact there is no hotspot at any distance.

Must have been some reason the MKIV HI was the one to go? Beam profile? Tint?


----------



## Tachead

recDNA said:


> I gave some thought to your beam profile analysis and retested the lights. I had been testing at 10m, the length of my playroom. I tested again at 1 meter. No question H2 on 64 is brighter than H1 on 62w but at any distance it is so spread out it appears dim. Also at 1 m I can see a yellow circle around the hotspot of the 64. At any distance it isn't visible in fact there is no hotspot at any distance.
> 
> Must have been some reason the MKIV HI was the one to go? Beam profile? Tint?



Yeah, these 64's are quite a bit more floody then the 62's from what I hear. That can really change the perception of brightness but, it is nice for close to medium tasks imo. 

The beam profile was pretty nice but, a bit throwy for an EDC light imo(particularly for up close tasks). The tint was amazing. It was the best I have ever seen from a Cree and was very similar to some of the Nichia's I have had. In addition to it being a bit throwy for a small EDC light the form factor and clip was not as nice as the 64's for a pocket EDC(I knew this before I got it as I had the Plus XHP50.2). The 64's are quite a bit smaller and more comfortable in the pocket and the screwed on clip is much better imo(especially now that I changed them to custom deep carry clips). The lack of knurling is also easier on the pants and allows it to clip and unclip more smoothly but, it also makes the light less grippy. 

The HI still has a lot of benefits though but, I just feel like if I need more throw then the 64's I will go with a bigger light that can actually throw.


----------



## recDNA

You've mentioned my big concern about all of the 600 series - crappy clips and too thick to comfortably carry. I carry a thrower in my coat pocket that isn't that much bigger than the 600 but it also uncomfortable to carry in jeans. The 600 might be better in a little holster but I wear a cell phone pouch on my right side so the holster would have to go on my left. A little too faux tactical for my taste. I'm not military nor police so it is silly to appear to try to LOOK like it. 

My best bet may be to simply return it for a refund. I'll give it 2 weeks of edc then decide. I did like programming medium higher. I may program low a little higher too. I don't use the 64 in my bedroom so I have little use for less than 10 lumens.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

recDNA said:


> Not like the old days when cw meant blue or green. I like the white tint. I'm just mad H2 not over 1000 lumens as advertised unless the sc62w has more lumens in H1 than advertised. Something wrong somewhere.



Well, if it's any consolation, I doubt you're getting 1600 lumens on H1 either.


----------



## recDNA

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Well, if it's any consolation, I doubt you're getting 1600 lumens on H1 either.


H1 produces more output than any other small light I've seen. Whatever it is it is darn bright. I just don't like pure flood.
I really like the new programmable UI (though I would prefer a wifi or other type that doesn't require multiple clicks.) One real beef I have is the lack of pid in modes other than high. I would prefer 2 clicks to get to high and that is doable but H1 without pid is just too dangerous. I would prefer 1 click access to medium the mode I use most.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

recDNA said:


> H1 produces more output than any other small light I've seen. Whatever it is it is darn bright. I just don't like pure flood.
> I really like the new programmable UI (though I would prefer a wifi or other type that doesn't require multiple clicks.) One real beef I have is the lack of pid in modes other than high. I would prefer 2 clicks to get to high and that is doable but H1 without pid is just too dangerous. I would prefer 1 click access to medium the mode I use most.



Doesn't that light have the new UI? Just program G6 or G7 to whatever 1-click mode you want.

Also, I thought PID was used in the brightest couple of H2 modes as well as H1. So it should be fine. If you're overheating below those levels, then you're probably hiking in a volcano crater.


----------



## recDNA

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Doesn't that light have the new UI? Just program G6 or G7 to whatever 1-click mode you want.
> 
> Also, I thought PID was used in the brightest couple of H2 modes as well as H1. So it should be fine. If you're overheating below those levels, then you're probably hiking in a volcano crater.


I wanted to program M1 to 1600 lumens. If I do it will have no pid. That way TWO clicks to get to least used mode. Heck I wish I could program H1 to strobe mode so it took 3 clicks to get it. I never use strobe so it is a wasted mode.


----------



## Nuppet

recDNA said:


> I wanted to program M1 to 1600 lumens. If I do it will have no pid. That way TWO clicks to get to least used mode. Heck I wish I could program H1 to strobe mode so it took 3 clicks to get it. I never use strobe so it is a wasted mode.



I just tested the PID on my H600Fc Mk IV with M1 set to H1 (1568 Lm) in G6 and it works, so not all of the new 18650 lights with the new programmable UI behave the same with respect to PID?


----------



## recDNA

It says right in directions pid on H modes only and others have written it doesn't work. Maybe more will chime in here. I'm not going to search the threads for it but I know folks have written pid doesn't work in M or L mode groups.

If someone with a 64 tests M1 at 1600 and gets definite pid I will do it for sure. Thanks for the 411!

I had it get darn hot in my pocket on L1. I wish all modes had pid. Hot is hot what difference what output.


----------



## Nuppet

recDNA said:


> It says right in directions pid on H modes only and others have written it doesn't work. Maybe more will chime in here. I'm not going to search the threads for it but I know folks have written pid doesn't work in M or L mode groups.
> 
> If someone with a 64 tests M1 at 1600 and gets definite pid I will do it for sure. Thanks for the 411!
> 
> I had it get darn hot in my pocket on L1. I wish all modes had pid. Hot is hot what difference what output.



I might have overlooked it but for H600Fc Mk IV, SC64 and SC600w Mk IV Plus there are not written anything that PID not working with H1 mapped to M1.

My understanding is that PID should work as expected: "PID thermal regulated outputs (three highest output levels)" and for my H600Fc it does.

http://www.zebralight.com/SC64-18650-XHP35-Cool-White-Flashlight_p_211.html


----------



## recDNA

I interpret that as H1 H2 H3 but you could be right. I would be positive except I read someone else did exactly what I describe and lost pid on M1 at H1 output.

I just wrote to Zebralight customer service to get a definitive answer.


----------



## joelbnyc

Does anyone know how to to remove the clip from the SC64's? Some kind of tiny star screw it looks like, I wonder if a standard laptop/pc tool set would have the correct one?


----------



## Nuppet

joelbnyc said:


> Does anyone know how to to remove the clip from the SC64's? Some kind of tiny star screw it looks like, I wonder if a standard laptop/pc tool set would have the correct one?



I bought pc tool set containing a Torx driver size T6 for removing the clip.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Torx


----------



## SKV89

I just received my Zebralight SC5W II as a replacement for the SC5C II that I returned because of the horrible green tint. The tint of the SC5W doesn't seem to have the green tint but also doesn't have any pleasing rosy tint I see in the XPL and XPL-HI 5A,5D flashlights that I own.

Now I'm wondering why do I keep hearing how great the Zebralight UI is. I just realized that they don't even have memory mode and it always start on HI with normal click. Starting with low mode is tricky because if you hold the button too long, it begins the cycle and I wouldn't want that to wake up others in the middle of the night. Armytek's UI is far better, although their customer service is horrible (they don't reply to emails).


----------



## Nuppet

SKV89 said:


> I just received my Zebralight SC5W II as a replacement for the SC5C II that I returned because of the horrible green tint. The tint of the SC5W doesn't seem to have the green tint but also doesn't have any pleasing rosy tint I see in the XPL and XPL-HI 5A,5D flashlights that I own.
> 
> Now I'm wondering why do I keep hearing how great the Zebralight UI is. I just realized that they don't even have memory mode and it always start on HI with normal click. Starting with low mode is tricky because if you hold the button too long, it begins the cycle and I wouldn't want that to wake up others in the middle of the night. Armytek's UI is far better, although their customer service is horrible (they don't reply to emails).



Your Zebralight has the new UI so that you can program it how you like. I've changed my new Zebralights so that click is low mode, double click is high and long press is medium.

http://www.zebralight.com/SC5w-Mk-II-AA-Flashlight-Neutral-White_p_193.html


----------



## ven

SKV, the xp-l2 is quite yellow, certainly no rosy from any of the xp-l2's i have. Closest to rosy with a ZL i have found the 4500k xhp35.

The UI is decent, just program your modes so H1(1 click) becomes a low of your choice(or what ever level suits your 1 click needs). You can swap around your levels to any of the 12 in g6 and g7 groups. After you spend a little time, you might grow to love it as i do. Before giving up on the sc5c, try and use in a variety of conditions. Mine can be quite nice on the eye(sc5c mkII 4000k) at times, providing my eyes have not been contaminated to other colour temps. I have had from crazy not mellow yellow, to a softer cleaner tint. Still i prefer the lower CRI 4500k xp-l2 out of my xp-l2 offerings..................in short i dont care much for this LED and disappointed ZL are actually using it. Hi cri i dont care if the beam is off in tint, rather have a little less and a beam i can enjoy.............thats me though. I will say my sc62d's luxeon T wipes the floor in every way with the xp-l2(subjective). Clean, colours looks fine(85cri) and not yellows,blues or any other colour of the rainbow to be found.


----------



## SKV89

I just did some ceiling bounce lux measurements on the SC5w II, omg this thing maxes out much lower than the advertised 550 lumens. Here are the measurements

SC5w mkII - 44
Utorch UT01 NW - 49 (advertised as 400 lumens. I bought for $10)
Thrunite Archer 2A v2 NW - 72 (advertised as 500 lumens)

What's up with that? I thought Zebralight were one of the more reputable companies that wouldn't false advertise their lumen ratings.


----------



## likethevegetable

There's clearly a flaw in your measurement system since all of your measure are 10-20% of the specified values...

Lux and lumens are different. Think of lux as a point measurement - it's light density, or pressure. You need to add up all of the lux measurements in a sphere around the flashlight (integrate) to get lumens, just like you would add up pressure to get force. Lumens is total output. Your phone can't measure total lumens by only looking at a small segment of the beam with it's small sensor. Since lux varies (ie. Your beam has a spot/spill shape), this causes a problem. Enter ceiling bounce.

To determine lumens from lux, you need to first diffuse the initial beam to make it as uniform as possible, ie. use an integrating sphere, or an easily accessible white ceiling. This means that the lux would be the same everywhere in a sphere, so your total lumens is then just the area of a sphere multiplied by your lux measurement. This how you calibrate a lumen/lux scale factor, but to use your phone, you have to know the lumens of one light beforehand.


----------



## Tachead

SKV89 said:


> I just did some ceiling bounce lux measurements on the SC5w II, omg this thing maxes out much lower than the advertised 550 lumens. Here are the measurements
> 
> SC5w mkII - 44
> Utorch UT01 NW - 49 (advertised as 400 lumens. I bought for $10)
> Thrunite Archer 2A v2 NW - 72 (advertised as 500 lumens)
> 
> What's up with that? I thought Zebralight were one of the more reputable companies that wouldn't false advertise their lumen ratings.


Your method of measurement is notoriously inaccurate. Different beam profiles, different CCT's, your measuring device, and other factors will all throw off your measurements. Ceiling bounce works ok for making runtime output graphs but, that is the only thing it is really good for. Even the readings from a calibrated light box with an actual light meter should be taken with a grain of salt. The only way to get accurate lumen measurements is with a well calibrated NIST certified integrating sphere and they cost $10000+.


----------



## SKV89

likethevegetable said:


> There's clearly a flaw in your measurement system since all of your measure are 10-20% of the specified values...
> 
> Lux and lumens are different. Think of lux as a point measurement - it's light density, or pressure. You need to add up all of the lux measurements in a sphere around the flashlight (integrate) to get lumens, just like you would add up pressure to get force. Lumens is total output. Your phone can't measure total lumens by only looking at a small segment of the beam with it's small sensor. Since lux varies (ie. Your beam has a spot/spill shape), this causes a problem. Enter ceiling bounce.
> 
> To determine lumens from lux, you need to first diffuse the initial beam to make it as uniform as possible, ie. use an integrating sphere, or an easily accessible white ceiling. This means that the lux would be the same everywhere in a sphere, so your total lumens is then just the area of a sphere multiplied by your lux measurement. This how you calibrate a lumen/lux scale factor, but to use your phone, you have to know the lumens of one light beforehand.



I think you completely misunderstand me. I'm just giving a relative comparison. I am not presenting to you the lumen measurements. The SC5w appears dimmer to my eyes than the other two lights so I did a ceiling bounce lux test. Also, the ceiling bounce lux test would be more advantageous to less floody lights like the SC5w However the other two lights that are much floodier than the SC5w measured higher lux rating. Also the UT01 is much warmer tinted than the SC5w so it is again at a disadvantage. If it was actual lumen ratings in an integrated sphere, I am sure SC5w would be fair much worst compared to the other two.


----------



## likethevegetable

SKV89 said:


> I think you completely misunderstand me. I'm just giving a relative comparison. I am not presenting to you the lumen measurements. The SC53 appears dimmer to my eyes than the other two lights so I did a ceiling bounce lux test. Also, the ceiling bounce lux test would be more advantageous to less floody lights like the SC53. However the other two lights that are much floodier than the SC53 measured higher lux rating. Also the UT01 is much warmer tinted than the SC53 so it is again at a disadvantage. If it was actual lumen ratings in an integrated sphere, I am sure SC53 would be fair much worst compared to the other two.



Yes I certainly did misunderstand. Fair enough, relative comparisons can be useful - but your method of diffusing the beam is a ceiling which is pretty unreliable. Do you have an SC53 or SC5w.. big difference between the max outputs..


----------



## SKV89

SC5W mkii rated at 550 lumens not SC53. I edited my previous post (typed too fast)


----------



## mightysparrow

I might as well contribute my impressions of the SC64w that arrived yesterday, after ordering it late last week during the few days when this light was in stock at ZL. Please take my comments in light of the fact that this SC64w is an upgrade from my SC62w - I have not owned a SC63 or SC63w. 

I am very pleased with the SC64w. I have just tested the beams of the 62w and 64w side by side, after reading the comments in posts just above this one. It seems to me as a result of these brief and unscientific "eyeballing" tests that the overall beam diameter of the two lights is very similar - however, the 64w seems to have a larger, more diffuse hot-spot - not much of a hot-spot, really. I don't know that the 62w actually throws farther than the 64w, as claimed by other posters, because I have only tested the two lights inside, in a relatively small area. The 64w definitely has more efficiency and overall output power than the 62w - no doubt about that. The difference is significant, as claimed by ZL, although I have no means of measuring output precisely.

I am very happy with the beam tint in the 64w, which is a very neutral white similar to the 62w. I see no green, and only maybe a hint of purple in the spill - but not enough to distract me or be noticeable in use of the light. The fit and finish of the 64w is superb - the anodizing, which is a bit darker than the 62w, looks even, and the black clip looks good in my opinion. The button feels great - nice and firm - not too mushy. The threads were lubed upon arrival - only a little grit which I cleaned off before re-lubing the threads and o-ring. I like the smaller length of the 64w compared to the 62w - even if the newer model has a slightly wider front end. 

The 64w will be my new daily commuting light - ready to help me walk to and from the bus stops in the dark, walk out of a dark subway tunnel after a breakdown, or walk many miles home from work at night in the event of a civil emergency. The engineering, quality and performance of my Zebralights makes them tools I would not want to have to live without. I think they're the best value I can find for my use, and I feel darn lucky to have them.


----------



## likethevegetable

mightysparrow said:


> I might as well contribute my impressions of the SC64w that arrived yesterday, after ordering it late last week during the few days when this light was in stock at ZL. Please take my comments in light of the fact that this SC64w is an upgrade from my SC62w - I have not owned a SC63 or SC63w.
> 
> I am very pleased with the SC64w. I have just tested the beams of the 62w and 64w side by side, after reading the comments in posts just above this one. It seems to me as a result of these brief and unscientific "eyeballing" tests that the overall beam diameter of the two lights is very similar - however, the 64w seems to have a larger, more diffuse hot-spot - not much of a hot-spot, really. I don't know that the 62w actually throws farther than the 64w, as claimed by other posters, because I have only tested the two lights inside, in a relatively small area. The 64w definitely has more efficiency and overall output power than the 62w - no doubt about that. The difference is significant, as claimed by ZL, although I have no means of measuring output precisely.
> 
> I am very happy with the beam tint in the 64w, which is a very neutral white similar to the 62w. I see no green, and only maybe a hint of purple in the spill - but not enough to distract me or be noticeable in use of the light. The fit and finish of the 64w is superb - the anodizing, which is a bit darker than the 62w, looks even, and the black clip looks good in my opinion. The button feels great - nice and firm - not too mushy. The threads were lubed upon arrival - only a little grit which I cleaned off before re-lubing the threads and o-ring. I like the smaller length of the 64w compared to the 62w - even if the newer model has a slightly wider front end.
> 
> The 64w will be my new daily commuting light - ready to help me walk to and from the bus stops in the dark, walk out of a dark subway tunnel after a breakdown, or walk many miles home from work at night in the event of a civil emergency. The engineering, quality and performance of my Zebralights makes them tools I would not want to have to live without. I think they're the best value I can find for my use, and I feel darn lucky to have them.



Thanks for the info, very well written.

Zebralights just have that certain quality about them. Anytime I get something new, I always think of ways I would have designed it or how I could improve it. 

When I got my first ZL, I immediately recognized the masterful design and that there is no way I could ever conceive a better product. Kind of humbling to own such a cool piece of technology and engineering.


----------



## anthon87

SKV89 said:


> I just did some ceiling bounce lux measurements on the SC5w II, omg this thing maxes out much lower than the advertised 550 lumens. Here are the measurements
> 
> SC5w mkII - 44
> Utorch UT01 NW - 49 (advertised as 400 lumens. I bought for $10)
> Thrunite Archer 2A v2 NW - 72 (advertised as 500 lumens)
> 
> What's up with that? I thought Zebralight were one of the more reputable companies that wouldn't false advertise their lumen ratings.



I should receive a SC5W II in a week or two, I'll make some measurements in my integrating sphere

Looks like Zebralight has over measured the lumens in these last gen lights.

My SC600w HI IV should make 1400 /875lms and only makes 1050/650 and I'm not the only one with these numbers, all the owners say that the IV is less bright than the III and the III makes 1120lm...


----------



## wweiss

Perfectly happy with my III. 
Just wish the spill was wider and brighter - Olight with their S2R Baton has a perfect spill - the III center spot, however is excellent. The local Coyotes think much less of it, but my dog likes the beam punch...


----------



## Bob_McBob

Response from ZL about overheating springs and PID output ringing in current generation 18650 lights.

http://budgetlightforum.com/comment/1281808#comment-1281808


----------



## vadimax

SKV89 said:


> I just did some ceiling bounce lux measurements on the SC5w II, omg this thing maxes out much lower than the advertised 550 lumens. Here are the measurements
> 
> SC5w mkII - 44
> Utorch UT01 NW - 49 (advertised as 400 lumens. I bought for $10)
> Thrunite Archer 2A v2 NW - 72 (advertised as 500 lumens)
> 
> What's up with that? I thought Zebralight were one of the more reputable companies that wouldn't false advertise their lumen ratings.



This reminds me old Russian anecdote (P - pilot, T - technician):

P: Technician, gauges!
T: 220!
P: 220 of what?!
T: What gauges?!


----------



## recDNA

I have the 64 cw and the 62w. I much prefer the beam profile of the 62w. I am carrying the 64 since I laid out the $ for 2 batteries for it (VTC6 & GA) but I don't know how long that will last. I wish H2 were a little brighter. I really miss having a hotspot even a short range to help me search for an object like a microscope slide cover slip that fell on the floor. With the total flood I just couldn't see it. The 64 is super bright on H1 but I just would like a hotspot. I wish they had an MK1V Hi option for the 64 to get some hotspot. The real MKIV Hi is too fat for me to carry comfortably. I'm sure I will end up carrying the 62w again once the newness wears off.


----------



## evgeniy

Bob_McBob said:


> Response from ZL about overheating springs and PID output ringing in current generation 18650 lights.
> http://budgetlightforum.com/comment/1281808#comment-1281808



spring isn’t a problem in all modes, except H1. And we can use any 18650 battery in these headlamps, it’s important point. 
thanks, Zebralight. 
(2 caps, 1st universal, with long spring, and 2nd special cap with pins for 65mm unprotected, will be better, but 2 caps costs more money).


----------



## Tachead

recDNA said:


> I have the 64 cw and the 62w. I much prefer the beam profile of the 62w. I am carrying the 64 since I laid out the $ for 2 batteries for it (VTC6 & GA) but I don't know how long that will last. I wish H2 were a little brighter. I really miss having a hotspot even a short range to help me search for an object like a microscope slide cover slip that fell on the floor. With the total flood I just couldn't see it. The 64 is super bright on H1 but I just would like a hotspot. I wish they had an MK1V Hi option for the 64 to get some hotspot. The real MKIV Hi is too fat for me to carry comfortably. I'm sure I will end up carrying the 62w again once the newness wears off.



I am not sure where you are getting this no hotspot thing. I have 2 x SC64's(w & c) and both have a very defined hotspot. It is a large hotspot but still much smaller then many other lights. It is no where near "total flood" even the frosted lens ZL's aren't total flood and still have somewhat of a hotspot albeit highly diffused. If you want an example of total flood try one of ZL's "flood" models like the H502 or H604 series.


----------



## recDNA

Tachead said:


> I am not sure where you are getting this no hotspot thing. I have 2 x SC64's(w & c) and both have a very defined hotspot. It is a large hotspot but still much smaller then many other lights. It is no where near "total flood" even the frosted lens ZL's aren't total flood and still have somewhat of a hotspot albeit highly diffused. If you want an example of total flood try one of ZL's "flood" models like the H502 or H604 series.


I can see the hotspot against a wall from 3 feet. On the marked up hardwood floor It was too big to be useful discerning an edge. If a hotspot is that big to my eyes it is all flood. In a well lit room the spill was probably invisible so what I am calling all flood is essentially the huge hotspot. There is no question the 62 has a more visible hotspot.

In the dark pointing the 64 at my house from my car maybe 10m it lights up the entire front of the house and again I see no hotspot. It may be measurably there using instruments but definitely not visible to my eyes. If it were a giant flat white wall maybe I could see it but that isn't real life use.


----------



## Tachead

recDNA said:


> I can see the hotspot against a wall from 3 feet. On the marked up hardwood floor It was too big to be useful discerning an edge. If a hotspot is that big to my eyes it is all flood. In a well lit room the spill was probably invisible so what I am calling all flood is essentially the huge hotspot. There is no question the 62 has a more visible hotspot.
> 
> In the dark pointing the 64 at my house from my car maybe 10m it lights up the entire front of the house and again I see no hotspot. It may be measurably there using instruments but definitely not visible to my eyes. If it were a giant flat white wall maybe I could see it but that isn't real life use.



Imo the SC64 has the perfect beam profile for close to medium range use. I have no trouble using it for a variety of tasks. It is perfect for close up tasks but, still has a reasonable amount of throw for medium range stuff. Personally, I hate a tight defined hotspot for close up tasks and think it is much harder to use in this application unlike the more even lighting the 64's provide. This is part of the reason I sent the HI back. This just shows that we all have our own set of preferences. 

Yes, the 62's have a slightly tighter hotspot. Most users mentioned that difference when they upgraded.

This shot is at more then 10 meters and you can clearly see the hotspot but, yes it is large.


----------



## recDNA

Bob_McBob said:


> Response from ZL about overheating springs and PID output ringing in current generation 18650 lights.
> 
> http://budgetlightforum.com/comment/1281808#comment-1281808


I'd like to reply to them the GA they favor is available in protected format. I'd also like to ask if my sc64 gets dangerously hot spring on H1? I use H1 frequently for 5-10 minutes at a time.


----------



## Tachead

recDNA said:


> I'd like to reply to them the GA they favor is available in protected format. *I'd also like to ask if my sc64 gets dangerously hot spring on H1? I use H1 frequently for 5-10 minutes at a time.*



It doesn't. 

I have run multiple 30 minute runtime tests on H1 with no external cooling at 24C ambient temperature on both the 64c&d. My tail springs look good as new and have noticed no issues whatsoever with the tailcap or spring. I am pretty sure the guy that started that thread about the H600Fc is blowing the spring temperature way out of proportion. He is the only person that has even mentioned it out of the many people that have reviewed that light. If there was an issue with the spring it would become discolored and/or break and I am sure ZL would have noticed it when testing the new model.


----------



## recDNA

Tachead said:


> It doesn't.
> 
> I have run multiple 30 minute runtime tests on H1 with no external cooling at 24C ambient temperature on both the 64c&d. My tail springs look good as new and have noticed no issues whatsoever with the tailcap or spring. I am pretty sure the guy that started that thread about the H600Fc is blowing the spring temperature way out of proportion. He is the only person that has even mentioned it out of the many people that have reviewed that light. If there was an issue with the spring it would become discolored and/or break and I am sure ZL would have noticed it when testing the new model.


Zebralight replied they are aware of the problem so I infer there is a problem. My spring looks shiny and perfect. I am more concerned that a hot spring might damage the battery or cause it to vent.


----------



## Tachead

recDNA said:


> Zebralight replied they are aware of the problem so I infer there is a problem


 No, they replied they are aware of the high current through the spring, not that it is a problem. They said that they will switch to pogo pins on later models. If there was a problem they would have switched to pogo pins on this model. As long as adequate batteries are used I bet it works just fine. As I said, many other users have reviewed this light and none of them mentioned any issue whatsoever with the spring or tailcap.


----------



## recDNA

Tachead said:


> No, they replied they are aware of the high current through the spring, not that it is a problem. They said that they will switch to pogo pins on later models. If there was a problem they would have switched to pogo pins on this model.


In my experience designs are usually expensive to change and are seldom done unless there is a significant reason. The high current is a given. They advertise it. My inference is pogo pins were used because high current in springs is a problem. You mentioned it is not a problem in the 64 since springs are perfect. My concern is not solely about the springs longevity but their heat conduction to the battery.


----------



## Tachead

recDNA said:


> In my experience designs are usually expensive to change and are seldom done unless there is a significant reason. The high current is a given. They advertise it. My inference is pogo pins were used because high current in springs is a problem. You mentioned it is not a problem in the 64 since springs are perfect. My concern is not solely about the springs longevity but their heat conduction to the battery.



They already have the tailcap made. All they would have to do is shorten the cell compartment by 5mm. That is a very simple change in the CAD program and could be done in a few minutes so, it would not be expensive. 

You don't need to worry about the battery, it will never get even close to hot enough to cause a problem. These light step down drastically in less then a minute and thus the current draw drops off dramatically. Most cells are safe to 85C(at least 60 even with old low current cells) and that is if the whole cell reaches that temp not just the metal protection plate on the negative terminal. 

Remember ZL is a US company and is open to liability so, they are not going to want to sell an unsafe light. I have learned over the years that people on these forums cry about the smallest little things even if they have no effect on actual use. Also, people have been know to greatly exaggerate any issues or problems. You have to watch what you read and take it with a grain of salt imo.


----------



## recDNA

Tachead said:


> They already have the tailcap made. All they would have to do is shorten the cell compartment by 5mm. That is a very simple change in the CAD program and could be done in a few minutes so, it would not be expensive.
> 
> You don't need to worry about the battery, it will never get even close to hot enough to cause a problem. These light step down drastically in less then a minute and thus the current draw drops off dramatically. Most cells are safe to 85C and that is if the whole cell reaches that temp not just the metal protection plate on the negative terminal.
> 
> Remember ZL is a US company and is open to liability so, they are not going to want to sell an unsafe light. I have learned over the years that people on these forums cry about the smallest little things even if they have no effect on actual use. Also, people have been know to greatly exaggerate any issues or problems. You have to watch what you read and take it with a grain of salt imo.


I think you are right in most respects. I am more careful than most. My concern is that little hot ring on the negative plate might over time cause pockets of change in the chemistry of the battery making it less stable. If the battery blew when charging we might not even associate it with the Zebralight especially if the battery is rotated to another light. As I said I am more careful than most. One man's paranoia is another man's prudence.


----------



## Tachead

recDNA said:


> I think you are right in most respects. I am more careful than most. My concern is that little hot ring on the negative plate might over time cause pockets of change in the chemistry of the battery making it less stable. If the battery blew when charging we might not even associate it with the Zebralight especially if the battery is rotated to another light. As I said I am more careful than most. One man's paranoia is another man's prudence.



I don't think you need to worry in this case. I have read reports of lights springs getting so hot they turned red hot, discolored, hardened, and broke and there was still no issues with cells. It sounds like ZL springs are not even getting hot enough to discolor so, we are talking way cooler then that. Just keep your terminals clean(I recommend Deoxit Gold be applied periodically from when the light is new) to keep resistance down and enjoy your light. 

You are right to be cautious and it is smart imo. Lithium ions should be used with care.


----------



## recDNA

I was having a discussion yesterday about the PID in M1 slot with output set at 1600 lumens. I read somewhere you lose PID in M1 but that was wrong. The PID follows the top 3 output levels no matter what slot they are in. This directly from ZL customer​ support. I should have asked if I could program a solid 1600 lumens into the 3 click slot. I don't use blinky modes.


----------



## niraya

recDNA said:


> I was having a discussion yesterday about the PID in M1 slot with output set at 1600 lumens. I read somewhere you lose PID in M1 but that was wrong. The PID follows the top 3 output levels no matter what slot they are in. This directly from ZL customer​ support. I should have asked if I could program a solid 1600 lumens into the 3 click slot. I don't use blinky modes.


I just do not understand how could they release such screwed up H1 PID. It is worse than PID in H2R Olight - useless level . I will test it another week and probably return and wait for next, fixed batch _ *in the future *_to try again. :sick2:

And their response on BLF:
_“1) We are aware of the high current through the spring, and that’s the exactly why we switched to multiple pins in our flashlight products. High output headlamp models will move to the pin design *in the future.* Different spring materials or bypass won’t help much because *some of our customers will still insist *on using their low quality high resistance protected batteries. 
2) We are aware of the ringing/oscillating in the Mk 4 18650 lights. We’ll try to fine tune the PID parameters (and possibly setting up a *new calibration process)* *in future*. “_
It is just so absurd.


----------



## evgeniy

recDNA said:


> The PID follows the top 3 output levels no matter what slot they are in.



Because without PID flashlight may be damaged, (no matter in what group you enabled Hi modes).



Tachead said:


> Remember ZL is a US company and is open to liability so, they are not going to want to sell an unsafe light.



Yes. And it's one of reasons , why we choose Zebra's.


----------



## geokite

recDNA said:


> I was having a discussion yesterday about the PID in M1 slot with output set at 1600 lumens. I read somewhere you lose PID in M1 but that was wrong. The PID follows the top 3 output levels no matter what slot they are in. This directly from ZL customer​ support. I should have asked if I could program a solid 1600 lumens into the 3 click slot. I don't use blinky modes.


Strobe levels cannot be changed, per a reply from zl I got recently. IMO their product description is misleading on this.


----------



## ven

General question here guys(no fighting allowed :laughing: ) . I am pondering a 600, more than likely an xhp50 for the larger body over the sc63/64 series. So with that in mind, i am really tempted by the sc600fd mkIII . The newer mk IV UI would be preferred, but not a must or over important. What is important is the tint. So UI out of the equation , would you stick with the tried and tested mk III or risk the mk IV and potential fugly tint of the xhp50.2(tend to be yellow and i dont want too much yellow). I dont care if one is 1500lm and the other 1800lm+, i care more for a long duration of 200-400lm beam of usefulness , and easy on the eye tint than anything.


----------



## Connor

For me, out of two Fd Mk III Plus and one Fd Mk IV Plus, the Mk IV had the best tint.

_The lottery is real™._


----------



## ven

Thanks connor, damn back to square 1 haha. So thats the xhp50 V the xhp50.2, both same colour temp? I was thinking around 5000k temp to limit the yellow side.


----------



## Connor

ven, check out http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?395603-The-Official-Zebralight-Thread&p=5160547&viewfull=1#post5160547


----------



## sc00ts19

geokite said:


> Strobe levels cannot be changed, per a reply from zl I got recently. IMO their product description is misleading on this.



“In G6 and G7
H1, H2, M1, M2, L1 and L2 can be programmed to any of the 12 available brightness levels”

This seems pretty clear, was there another section of the product description that you’re referring to?


----------



## ven

Connor said:


> ven, check out http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?395603-The-Official-Zebralight-Thread&p=5160547&viewfull=1#post5160547



Thank you connor, looks like you certainly have a winner there. Other than my xp-l2 AA fed ZL's, my others i have been very happy with(xhp35 4500k and Luxeon T 5000k).


----------



## evgeniy

may be, PID in mk. IV version isn't optimal (tuned for max.output), but what we have in practice for H600Fc/Fd headlamps ?

1) max. mode for continuous use in any weather is *280lm* (may be, except very hot nights), this mode has no PID.
_And no problems with PID, no problems with springs.
_
2) In cold/moderate cold weather (as currently in my city, ~~0C) *580lm* mode will work without PID and may be used for continuous use.(In hot weather yes, brightless will be decreased. )
_No problems with PID, no problems with springs.
_
3) For short time in any weather we can use turbo mode, *980lm*, for 1-2min. With PID, but in any case we 'll receive 1-2min of bright light. It's more than user usually need for "turbo" purposes from headlamp,
for many years I use turbo mode in my Zebra headlamps for few tens seconds, <1min.
_No problems with PID, no problems with springs._

4) watercooled / hard cooled tests + continuous use of 1560lm mode, other "bdsm" use, etc.
_Yes, in these modes we 'll have problems with PID and problems with springs._


----------



## AEDe

Tachead said:


> It doesn't.
> 
> I have run multiple 30 minute runtime tests on H1 with no external cooling at 24C ambient temperature on both the 64c&d. My tail springs look good as new and have noticed no issues whatsoever with the tailcap or spring. I am pretty sure the guy that started that thread about the H600Fc is blowing the spring temperature way out of proportion. He is the only person that has even mentioned it out of the many people that have reviewed that light. If there was an issue with the spring it would become discolored and/or break and I am sure ZL would have noticed it when testing the new model.



Guy. I offered 2 simple test . You can perform it and find out who is right. Until you check it out stop blaming me


----------



## joelbnyc

Can anyone recommend a diffuser cap for the SC64's? The ones I have don't fit well.


----------



## Tachead

AEDe said:


> Guy. I offered 2 simple test . You can perform it and find out who is right. Until you check it out stop blaming me


My point is there is no safety issue and the light will still work fine even if the performance on H1 isn't optimal.


----------



## niraya

Tachead said:


> My point is there is no safety issue and the light will still work fine even if the performance on H1 isn't optimal.


 Regarding safety at least two people reported other problem too (drain and LVP)

https://www.reddit.com/r/flashlight..._zebralight_behavior/?st=jdxcddfp&sh=f69d36e5


----------



## recDNA

niraya said:


> Regarding safety at least two people reported other problem too (drain and LVP)
> 
> https://www.reddit.com/r/flashlight..._zebralight_behavior/?st=jdxcddfp&sh=f69d36e5


Wow that sounds scary bad. So far my 64 has no such symptoms. This is why many favor protected batteries. If the flashlight fails there is still backup protection. At least there was no venting.


----------



## Tachead

niraya said:


> Regarding safety at least two people reported other problem too (drain and LVP)
> 
> https://www.reddit.com/r/flashlight..._zebralight_behavior/?st=jdxcddfp&sh=f69d36e5


It's a defect light. It happens with all electronics from time to time. This is the first time I have ever seen this kind of problem with a ZL though. Must be something wrong with the driver as it never should have drained the cell. I had a MKIV Plus and it worked flawlessly.


----------



## geokite

sc00ts19 said:


> “In G6 and G7
> H1, H2, M1, M2, L1 and L2 can be programmed to any of the 12 available brightness levels”
> 
> This seems pretty clear, was there another section of the product description that you’re referring to?


Yes, three of the strobes are listed as being at H1 brightness. H1 is configurable. Since the strobe works in G5, G6, and G7, one would think the strobe will work at the H1 setting in all three.

If one interprets the spec sheet as only applying to H5, then one could assume the strobe doesn't work at all in H6 or H7.


----------



## niraya

Tachead said:


> It's a defect light. It happens with all electronics from time to time. This is the first time I have ever seen this kind of problem with a ZL though. Must be something wrong with the driver as it never should have drained the cell. I had a MKIV Plus and it worked flawlessly.


I had H600Fc MkIV and it was malfunctioning dud. :sigh:


----------



## sc00ts19

geokite said:


> Yes, three of the strobes are listed as being at H1 brightness. H1 is configurable. Since the strobe works in G5, G6, and G7, one would think the strobe will work at the H1 setting in all three.
> 
> If one interprets the spec sheet as only applying to H5, then one could assume the strobe doesn't work at all in H6 or H7.



The instructions don’t mention anything about the strobe modes being programmable in anyway. I think it’s pretty unfair to accuse a manufacturer of being misleading because one’s assumption are wrong.


----------



## likethevegetable

sc00ts19 said:


> The instructions don’t mention anything about the strobe modes being programmable in anyway. I think it’s pretty unfair to accuse a manufacturer of being misleading because one’s assumption are wrong.



And I think keeping the strobes consistent throughout all modes was the right thing to do. I set low modes on G6 for H1, a super dim high frequency strobe doesn't really make sense.. not that I use my strobes at all anyway, they really only ever get activated by accident.

I do wish that ZL added the H1 mode (but in non-strobe) in the three-click strobe rotation as well.. that would give a shortcut from off to the highest level which would be pretty cool (provided that's where you left off)..


----------



## recDNA

geokite said:


> Strobe levels cannot be changed, per a reply from zl I got recently. IMO their product description is misleading on this.


What I had in mind was completely replacing strobe with H1 PID normal level in the strobe slot. I understand now it isn't possible. Just wanted to make sure I am understood. I have no use for blinky modes and that could isolate H1 so even long pressing to scroll through modes would never show H1. That would be desirable to me. 3 clicks to get super high very short output that I could never ever get to be accident. Neat.


----------



## mightysparrow

Has anyone yet received a light with instructions that include the new programming configurations (G6, G7)? I've looked at the thread and can't find this specifically addressed in recent posts. I'm asking this question because the instructions I received with my SC64w last week did not include any mention of the new programming configurations. I'm curious if ZL is shipping all the lights with instructions that haven't yet been changed to mention the new configurations.


----------



## geokite

sc00ts19 said:


> The instructions don’t mention anything about the strobe modes being programmable in anyway. I think it’s pretty unfair to accuse a manufacturer of being misleading because one’s assumption are wrong.


The instructions say H1 is programmable, and that 3/4 strobe modes are set at H1. The instructions do not state that in G6 or G7 the strobe is set at the G5 H1 level; how would the user come to that conclusion if H1 is programmable?


----------



## sc00ts19

geokite said:


> The instructions say H1 is programmable, and that 3/4 strobe modes are set at H1. The instructions do not state that in G6 or G7 the strobe is set at the G5 H1 level; how would the user come to that conclusion if H1 is programmable?



I do understand what you’re saying and you raise an interesting point of why the strobe modes brightness levels don’t mirror the brightness levels of the currently selected ui group. 

When I read the instructions, G5 is the default ui group. H1 is the default high for this group. Beacon levels are based off of these H1 and L1 and the 3x click designation completely separates them from the ui group. 

G6 and G7 are merely 2 separate ui groups that offer 6 fully programmable levels each, not including beacon modes. 

I suppose ZL could include something like, “19Hz Strobe at G5 H1” in their instructions but I don’t think that’s really necessary.


----------



## terryoregon

mightysparrow said:


> Has anyone yet received a light with instructions that include the new programming configurations (G6, G7)? I've looked at the thread and can't find this specifically addressed in recent posts. I'm asking this question because the instructions I received with my SC64w last week did not include any mention of the new programming configurations. I'm curious if ZL is shipping all the lights with instructions that haven't yet been changed to mention the new configurations.



ZL only sent me a generic manual that says nothing about G6/G7 on my new SC600Fd MK IV (ordered directly from ZL a couple of weeks ago). It does however say in the manual:
. . .


> Please refer to www.zebralight.com for information specific to this product.



The detailed website listing does show info about G6/G7.


----------



## Tixx

terryoregon said:


> ZL only sent me a generic manual that says nothing about G6/G7 on my new SC600Fd MK IV (ordered directly from ZL a couple of weeks ago). It does however say in the manual:
> . . .
> 
> The detailed website listing does show info about G6/G7.


Yeah, wish the paperwork inside the box with the light actually had the G6/G7 info. I just noticed that 2 days ago when I put it with some new lights and didn't see the new UI even mentioned. I have 7 with the new UI and none had updated paperwork.


----------



## mightysparrow

Thanks to terryoregon and Tixx for the responses to my question. Yes, I can see that ZL staff are very busy lately - there's no runtime data for the SC64 on the website and no updated instruction sheet available yet. I'm glad they put a priority on fulfilling our orders, though, rather than focusing on the other tasks! I'm liking the SC64w very much.

I will probably type out my own instruction sheet, as I did with my Emisar D4s -- it's nice to have to remind me of the way to change the configurations, if I ever decide to do that. I'm sticking with the basic, old-fashioned configuration so far, just because it is the same for all my Zebralights and therefore easier for me to remember how to operate each light! 

Jeff


----------



## R2RO

That's exactly what I do. Stick with the old setup. Since I have a mkiii headlamp and mkiv flashlight, I don't want to have two different UIs to deal with. That could get confusing. Besides the possibility of a high flash accidentally, I really like the g5(old way) of doing things. I guess until I upgrade to mkiv headlamps, I'll just leave them as is.


----------



## sc00ts19

I’ve kept my h53c on G7 which is programmed to the 6 lowest outputs, H1 being the lowest. I have an sc64w on the way and plan on leaving it on G5, so in preparation i’ve had my h53c on G5. At 0300 the other morning while getting dressed for work I single clicked expecting .06 lumens and received 276 🤩. I also recommend keeping all of your lights on the same ui.


----------



## Nuppet

Yeah, mixing new and old Zebralight UI can be confusing (blinding) when I want to have low on single click. As it is, all my Zebralights headlamps have the new UI and on the new flashlights I kept the new pocket clip so that by color and feel I know which UI I have to deal with. One SC5Fw is donated and perhaps I'll do that with the others as well.


----------



## Mr. LED

Tachead said:


> It doesn't.
> 
> I have run multiple 30 minute runtime tests on H1 with no external cooling at 24C ambient temperature on both the 64c&d. My tail springs look good as new and have noticed no issues whatsoever with the tailcap or spring. I am pretty sure the guy that started that thread about the H600Fc is blowing the spring temperature way out of proportion. He is the only person that has even mentioned it out of the many people that have reviewed that light. If there was an issue with the spring it would become discolored and/or break and I am sure ZL would have noticed it when testing the new model.



I ran tests for H1 during a few minutes and checked immediately the spring after the first two minutes, and the temperature was normal, not even warm.


----------



## anthon87

I never switch between G5/G6/G7, I set G6 with the modes I want and only use it in that group

For my SC600W HI IV

Long click: Low: 22.9 / 0.07lm
Single click: Medium: 264 / 127
Double click: High: 1400 / 875lm

For my H53W

Long click: Low 12 / 0.07
Single click: Medium 122 / 65
Double click: High: 330 / 275lm

I have a SC5w II incoming that I will set the same way

I think this is the best UI for a EDC light, ever


----------



## Fireclaw18

Anyone have an SC64W?

If so how does it compare to the SC63W?

Both have the same body and the 64W is rated less than 300 lumens more. My guess is the difference in output is barely noticeable. However, I'm curious how long the SC64W can maintain max output. My S63W starts ramping down very quickly. Even though the body does not seem that hot. Even after I set the PID to well above manufacturer default it still ramps down quite fast.

In contrast, my SC600 IV Plus barely ramps down at all and the body gets substantially hotter (but still never too hot to touch) even at the default setting.


----------



## brighterthanthesun

Does anyone know if the C3 will ever be released?


----------



## noboneshotdog

brighterthanthesun said:


> Does anyone know if the C3 will ever be released?



Hahahaha. I asked ZL a few weeks back and they said they have no plans for production at this time.


----------



## Cobraman502

Anyone have a video review of the SC64w or even just the new UI?


----------



## sc00ts19

Cobraman502 said:


> Anyone have a video review of the SC64w or even just the new UI?



Here  https://youtu.be/PkGJtcaa8W0 is a good video on the new ui. I’m surprised there aren’t any reviews on the sc64w. I just got one yesterday, what a great light!


----------



## sc00ts19

I’ve noticed that my h53c will flash once when I tighten down the tailcap. I can loosen the tailcap, click the button, then tighten the tailcap and it will flash. My sc64w does not do this at all. The h53 will also flash about every 12-15 seconds when the battery gets low, does the sc64 do this too? I’m wondering if anyone else has noticed this? Would this be a difference in the driver due to the different battery types?


----------



## Nuppet

sc00ts19 said:


> I’ve noticed that my h53c will flash once when I tighten down the tailcap. I can loosen the tailcap, click the button, then tighten the tailcap and it will flash. My sc64w does not do this at all. The h53 will also flash about every 12-15 seconds when the battery gets low, does the sc64 do this too? I’m wondering if anyone else has noticed this? Would this be a difference in the driver due to the different battery types?



I've not noticed the low battery flashing, but my AA ZL blinks with loosen/tighten tailcap while my 18650 ZL does not.


----------



## Cobraman502

sc00ts19 said:


> Here  https://youtu.be/PkGJtcaa8W0 is a good video on the new ui. I’m surprised there aren’t any reviews on the sc64w. I just got one yesterday, what a great light!



Awesome thanks.


----------



## guardrail

Received my SC600w Mk IV, H53Fc and SC5c Mk II this week. Without having tested them that much, everything seems fine (still haven't tried the new UI or any longer runtimes). But, I found an irritating failure in the switch of the H53Fc and the SC5c II: the black layer of the button is not 100%. When the light is on, light is visible through part of the switch button (see attached images). Is this a known phenomena? Couldn't find anything on here by searching the forum, but I could have missed it. If anyone else have experienced this, did you contact ZL, and what did they say about it?


----------



## NPL

I have the same "issue" on my h53c and h600fc mk4. Zebralight has already responded saying that it is not an issue and that the button allows some light to go thru. No big deal


----------



## Fireclaw18

My SC600 IV plus also allows some light through the switch.

I figure that this an intended design change, so that you have an extra indicator the light is on.


----------



## recDNA

Fireclaw18 said:


> My SC600 IV plus also allows some light through the switch.
> 
> I figure that this an intended design change, so that you have an extra indicator the light is on.


The guy at ZL wishes he thought of claiming that flaw to be a "feature"


----------



## guardrail

NPL said:


> I have the same "issue" on my h53c and h600fc mk4. Zebralight has already responded saying that it is not an issue and that the button allows some light to go thru. No big deal



OK cool, thanks for the info


----------



## Dio

My SC64 doesn't seem to do this, nor does my SC5w or SC53Fc...the AA lights must be at least 6 months old however, and the SC64 would be about a month old..

If you compare to an older model, does the rubber switch boot feel thinner or like a different rubber compound perhaps?


----------



## guardrail

Dio said:


> If you compare to an older model, does the rubber switch boot feel thinner or like a different rubber compound perhaps?



I only have an SC32w to compare with, and it was really hard to tell any significant difference by neither visual appearence nor tactile feeling.


----------



## Fireclaw18

Dio said:


> My SC64 doesn't seem to do this, nor does my SC5w or SC53Fc...the AA lights must be at least 6 months old however, and the SC64 would be about a month old..
> 
> If you compare to an older model, does the rubber switch boot feel thinner or like a different rubber compound perhaps?


Feels the same.


----------



## likethevegetable

I have light leakage on both my H53c and H600Fc IV.. the ZL rep said it is a nonuniformity in the pigmentation process. The rubber is originally transparent and dyed black.


----------



## scs

This leakage of light through the switch is unacceptable.
Why did it not occur before and why is it happening now?
Don't let standards drop, please.


----------



## Dio

scs said:


> This leakage of light through the switch is unacceptable.
> Why did it not occur before and why is it happening now?
> Don't let standards drop, please.



I second that! 

Either they stopped adding some sort of barrier to keep light out of the switch area OR the process which the rubber boots are made has changed OR the compound of the rubber boot has changed. I' sure there are other possibilities but those are the three obvious ones IMO..


----------



## vadimax

guardrail said:


> Received my SC600w Mk IV, H53Fc and SC5c Mk II this week. Without having tested them that much, everything seems fine (still haven't tried the new UI or any longer runtimes). But, I found an irritating failure in the switch of the H53Fc and the SC5c II: the black layer of the button is not 100%. When the light is on, light is visible through part of the switch button (see attached images). Is this a known phenomena? Couldn't find anything on here by searching the forum, but I could have missed it. If anyone else have experienced this, did you contact ZL, and what did they say about it?



Weird. My sample of SC5c exposes nearly no light at all. I need to hide in a dark room to notice a barely visible glow near the edge of the button.


----------



## Fespe

Today I checked both my flashlight after reading the post about light leakage from the switch and my sc600w VI have none, but my sc5w mkII have some leakage. But if I didn't read this problem I probably never noticed it.


----------



## markr6

WOW! I heard about this from a few people but had no idea it was this bad. I figured just a tiny "crack" with light showing thru. I don't have this on any of my lights.


----------



## DavidRZ

Just purchased my first ZL, the SC5w. Sure hope it arrives quickly. Looks like a great light.

Not good seeing the light seeping through the control button, sure hope my light doesn't have this issue.


----------



## guardrail

scs said:


> This leakage of light through the switch is unacceptable.
> Why did it not occur before and why is it happening now?
> Don't let standards drop, please.



After being in contact with ZL, I have now sent the two lights back to them for a refund.


----------



## ven

Well i sold my sc5c mkII and funded a minty sc62..............cool white 6300k............... Feel free to re-read that haha.

I defo prefer the 18650 format, just makes more sense for little size difference. The beam is nice and quite bright compared to my 62d(1000 V 320) which goes without saying. Now the cool beam is clean, no blue to my eyes at all. Its more a pure white, colours look fine which i am glad of. Although much lower CRI, cooler by 2000k over the xp-l2...............i prefer it. The 5000k 62d still wins for me though, but i can live with the 6300k white beam easy enough. 
Ano is a little darker to






Really like the 62 design and feel .


----------



## SKV89

The SC5c MKII 4000k had the worst tint I have ever seen and I have about 50 flashlights. It is so yellow green I returned it right away. The SC5w II 4500k had better tint but still above the BBL line and not the most attractive for me. I prefer on or slightly below the BBL line for a rosier tint. The previous XPL-HI and XPL HD had much better tint than the XP-L2. I have a bunch of 4000k tints such as the Emisar D4 xpl-HI 5D and they are the best neutral tint ever. So it's not really the color temperature that causes the ugly beam but the amount it deviates from the BBL line.


----------



## ven

Agree SKV, pretty much the same. I have the sc53w which is 4500k and easier on the eye than the sc5c mkII . Its not perfect.............but its OK and i can live with it. My sc5c was too yellow, at times it fell easy on the eye, but mostly not so. So i would hardly use it, i mean why would i when i could grab a nice nichia in stead. Agree, the xpl HI 4k are very nice I have stayed away from the xhp70.2 and xhp50.2 so far, the latest CREE just dont do it for me. The xp-g3 to me is also one to avoid, as with the xp-l2. I can cope with a bit of yellow(219c 4k) but not very yellow.............Thankfully we have choices!


----------



## joelbnyc

Is there a way to set the UI in the SC64 to just be a normal quick-press to lo-med-high instead of one short click while off going straight to High mode?

I can't count the number of times I've turned it on full blast at night while trying to long-press for the low mode. It's really annoying. Somehow I missed that this was a one-quick-press-to-high light.

The SC64w is my first ZL. Love the form factor. But if i cant turn off this one-press-to high then it will sadly sit in a drawer while I use my Manker E11 or 2700K Convoy S3 for my-around-the house-at-night-light.


----------



## terryoregon

joelbnyc said:


> Is there a way to set the UI in the SC64 to just be a normal quick-press to lo-med-high instead of one short click while off going straight to High mode?



Yes, that's the beauty of the G6/G7 programming. Just program "high" to low (L1) levels, and it will turn on by default in low. Quoting from Zebralight:


> H1, H2, M1, M2, L1 and L2 can be programmed to *any* of the 12 available brightness levels


----------



## autoxer

joelbnyc said:


> Is there a way to set the UI in the SC64 to just be a normal quick-press to lo-med-high instead of one short click while off going straight to High mode?
> 
> I can't count the number of times I've turned it on full blast at night while trying to long-press for the low mode. It's really annoying. Somehow I missed that this was a one-quick-press-to-high light.
> 
> The SC64w is my first ZL. Love the form factor. But if i cant turn off this one-press-to high then it will sadly sit in a drawer while I use my Manker E11 or 2700K Convoy S3 for my-around-the house-at-night-light.





terryoregon said:


> Yes, that's the beauty of the G6/G7 programming. Just program "high" to low (L1) levels, and it will turn on by default in low. Quoting from Zebralight:



joelbnyc, I like to have my light set up in the exact way you describe. I found this setup in another thread (http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...-MK-II-H-CRI&p=5102433&viewfull=1#post5102433) and after trying it, really can't imagine using my Zebralights any other way.

I have an SC5w Mk II, H53c, and SC64w, and use this same basic configuration on all three. I hope you can get yours set up like this and enjoy the light!


----------



## low

A quick question for those that return flashlights, does zebralight contact you and let you know they received the RMA flashlight? Do they tell you when they ship the new light? The reason I ask is I returned one that when on high it it seemed to have a short, and they said they will give me a replacement. They received it Friday and no word at all, is this common?


----------



## terryoregon

low said:


> A quick question for those that return flashlights, does zebralight contact you and let you know they received the RMA flashlight? Do they tell you when they ship the new light? The reason I ask is I returned one that when on high it it seemed to have a short, and they said they will give me a replacement. They received it Friday and no word at all, is this common?



Yes, in my case they did, just received a notice a couple of days ago.



> Department: Customer Service
> 
> Subject: ZebraLight, Inc.: Update Tracking #3**13
> 
> We received the package, and let you know the tracking when we ship the replacement.
> 
> Sincerely,
> 
> ZebraLight, Inc.
> 2908 Story Rd. W
> Irving, TX 75038


----------



## joelbnyc

terryoregon said:


> Yes, that's the beauty of the G6/G7 programming. Just program "high" to low (L1) levels, and it will turn on by default in low. Quoting from Zebralight:





autoxer said:


> joelbnyc, I like to have my light set up in the exact way you describe. I found this setup in another thread (http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...-MK-II-H-CRI&p=5102433&viewfull=1#post5102433) and after trying it, really can't imagine using my Zebralights any other way.
> 
> I have an SC5w Mk II, H53c, and SC64w, and use this same basic configuration on all three. I hope you can get yours set up like this and enjoy the light!



Thank you both, great to know. Going to set this up now.


----------



## terryoregon

.
What do you get when you combine a new Reed Instruments SD-1128 light-meter-data-logger and a Zebralight *SC600Fd MK IV Plus*?






.
. . . . . .*. . . . . . . . . . . . . .**MORE RUNTIME GRAPHS* (by someone who's never done them before)

Intrigued by the noted oscillations in output on gen 4 lights (as seen in page 56 of this very thread), I decided to see if mine had the same characteristics.

Since most gen 4 graphs tend to focus on the higher levels, I chose *557* lumens for some extra perspective. As you can see in the 1st graph, even at this level the oscillations are still evident. Note, the Samsung battery was capacity tested on an Xtar Dragon (results; 2506mah). 






.

I then repeated the test again with *ACTIVE COOLING*. This time, a block of blue ice was placed behind the light with a small fan behind the blue ice. Therefore, cool air was continually blowing over the light during the test.

As you can see, active cooling makes a LOT of difference (zero oscillations). Also note that Zebralights don't just shut down unexpectedly when the battery is low, but give you plenty of extra runtime at a much lower output.






.
.

And just for good measure, I ran another test at *135* lumens. Of course PID is no longer necessary and we have excellent regulation for 9.5 hrs.





.
.
PS: this is the 1st time I've posted runtime graphs, be kind. It's fun, but was a lot of work re-learning line charts in Excel.


----------



## DavidRZ

Just got my first Zebralight yesterday, an SC5w. What an awesome light!! I'm very impressed with the quality of this light so far. I know some complain about the UI, but I find it very intuitive and great.

So far, I'm sold on this as my new EDC light.


----------



## Jose Marin

Cool meter and great graphs, i need to upgrade to something like that.


----------



## ven

Awesome stuff Terry


----------



## Derek Dean

Yep, excellent graphs there, Terry. Thanks for posting them.


----------



## SubLGT

terryoregon said:


> ...Intrigued by the noted oscillations in output on gen 4 lights...



Are these oscillations visible to the naked eye?


----------



## terryoregon

SubLGT said:


> Are these oscillations visible to the naked eye?



That will be debated. In a separate test, I sat in a dark room with only the Zebralight on and watched the light meter until I could see the output drop, then rise within a couple of minutes. Yes, I could visually see it was happening, *but I was looking for it.* It was rather subtle. Under normal use, I don't think you would notice it.


----------



## SKV89

Thanks Terry for your useful data. I was thinking of getting a SC600w IV Plus but seems like Zebralight can't even sustain 500 lumens so what's the point. Rather just stick with my Emisar D4.


----------



## niraya

SubLGT said:


> Are these oscillations visible to the naked eye?


Yes, very clearly anytime everywhere on H600Fc mkIV


----------



## IlluminationDomination

*

MY SC62

*No worries, just wondering. The light is not affected by it.


First picture: If you look at 9 O'Clock there is a dark spot on the LED. The horizontal mark above the bond wire is a scratch.








The scratch bisects the bond wires and points directly to 6 O,Clock where the dark spot is.







Just curious does anyone know what causes that? 

You are able to see it with the naked eye when on ML.


----------



## DavidRZ

New to ZL, just received my first last week and now ordered another. First a SC5w and now a SC600w IV Plus. 

What great lights and I'm very glad to have stumbled upon these. The build quality and useful beam pattern is awesome. What a great light mine have been.


----------



## Dio

SKV89 said:


> Thanks Terry for your useful data. I was thinking of getting a SC600w IV Plus but seems like Zebralight can't even sustain 500 lumens so what's the point. Rather just stick with my Emisar D4.



I think you misinterpreted the graphs or something as it is quite clear the ZL can maintain over 500L..

See the uncooled one where it maintains 95% of its' initial output for 15 minutes? 

Also, "active cooling" is when you'e holding the light - it may not be dead flat like the graph here as it may be a more effective means of cooling than simply holding it BUT if it can maintain 95% of its output (about 500L) without any cooling at all, for 15 minutes, you can bet it will last longer than that in your hand.


I have a D4 with XP-L HI and can tell you that when you put them side by side and fiddle around so the D4 is about the same brightness, it doesn't even last 5 minutes before it is insanely hot and already dropping output in far more noticible steps than the superior PID implemented on the ZL. 

If you really must put it into terms that are simple to comprehend D4 is a toy (219C version is a borderline gimmick IMO) whereas ZL's are well calibrated tools.


----------



## mightysparrow

Nice work, Terry. Thanks for sharing the information.


----------



## anthon87

Today I received my SC5W II, it's a great tiny light.

I thought the size would be similar to my SC600W HI IV but it's a lot smaller.

I have measured lumens in my integrating sphere and it makes 470lm in turbo with a Eneloop Pro. It's awesome how it manages to get such light from a single NIMH cell

Here they are (H53w, SC5w II and SC600w HI IV)


----------



## Fireclaw18

Dio said:


> I have a D4 with XP-L HI and can tell you that when you put them side by side and fiddle around so the D4 is about the same brightness, it doesn't even last 5 minutes before it is insanely hot and already dropping output in far more noticible steps than the superior PID implemented on the ZL.
> 
> If you really must put it into terms that are simple to comprehend D4 is a toy (219C version is a borderline gimmick IMO) whereas ZL's are well calibrated tools.


I don't think it's the programming on the D4 that's the problem. The D4's programming is actually quite good, though some things could be improved (ramping down due to heat is done rapidly and in visible steps. Ramping up after it cools down is done gradually and very slowly in invisible steps. These issues are fixed on the upcoming FW3A).

The reason why the D4 ramps down so much faster is the structure of the light: The Zebralight uses a one-piece unibody construction. This means that the heat from the emitter spreads evenly between the head and and body unlike in the D4 where it concentrates in the head. Whenever there is a transition between 2 separate pieces of aluminum there is much less heat transmission compared to a solid single-piece.

Also the D4 has far fewer heatsink fins, and those that are there aren't as deep. The Zebralight has a much better array of heatsink fins.

I've noticed that my D4s tend to get hot and ramp to a fraction of their output in less than a minute, while my SC600w IV plus seems to maintain its initial output. The Zebralight gets quite hot, but never too hot to touch, and its output doesn't drop like on the D4.

I agree that the D4 is a great "pocket rocket" toy. Its massive output is great for wowing your friends. But for any use where you're going to have the light on turbo for more than 30 seconds the SC600w IV Plus is a much better choice.


----------



## Cobraman502

We still need to point out that the D4 has 4 leds and the Zebralight has 1.


----------



## Cobraman502

We still need to point out that the D4 has 4 leds and the Zebralight has 1.


----------



## Dio

Cobraman502 said:


> We still need to point out that the D4 has 4 leds and the Zebralight has 1.



More LEDs, less current to each emitter, should be more efficient but it isn't. What are you getting at?


----------



## Fireclaw18

Dio said:


> More LEDs, less current to each emitter, should be more efficient but it isn't. What are you getting at?


Efficiency is typically how long the light will run at a particular output before the battery depletes without heat being an issue. The primary governing factors for efficiency should be the emitter choice and the driver. The D4 with XPL HI has a more efficient emitter setup, while the Zebralight probably has the more efficient driver.

The fast rampdown of the D4 is not related to efficiency. Instead, it's due to programming in the driver and the mechanical design of the light in how it removes heat. The SC600 is much better here due to its unibody construction and more numerous heat sink fins. It sheds heat better, allowing the light to stay at high output with minimal rampdown.


----------



## Dio

Fireclaw18 said:


> Efficiency is typically how long the light will run at a particular output before the battery depletes without heat being an issue. The primary governing factors for efficiency should be the emitter choice and the driver. The D4 with XPL HI has a more efficient emitter setup, while the Zebralight probably has the more efficient driver.
> 
> The fast rampdown of the D4 is not related to efficiency. Instead, it's due to programming in the driver and the mechanical design of the light in how it removes heat. The SC600 is much better here due to its unibody construction and more numerous heat sink fins. It sheds heat better, allowing the light to stay at high output with minimal rampdown.



Thanks for expanding on my thoughts. Gotta keep it brief sometimes as there's a [nearly 1 year old] child running amok at that moment that needs constant monitoring.

Seeing as the emitter setup should be more efficient but the driver isn't, it's kinda a moot point IMO. Unless you are able and the light can be modified with a better performing driver then I would argue, with the sum of all parts, that the D4 light is overall, less efficient. 

I think another factor that is relevant is also that the D4 achieves almost ALL of its output levels via a FET dimmed via PWM whereas the ZL's are only [from anecdotal evidence from ZL themselves] powered PARTIALLY by a FET on the highest level only. I think that is the main factor for greater heat at lower levels; the added potential efficiency of a quad setup can't compensate for this lack of efficiency of the driver.


----------



## Fireclaw18

Programmed my SC64W to be moonlight (one-click), turbo (double-click), medium (click-and-hold). Much better for night use. No risk of blasting yourself with light in the middle of the night.

On the other hand, I still prefer the default UI for daytime EDC use. Going to try swapping back and and forth between the UIs in the morning and evening.


----------



## sc00ts19

Fireclaw18 said:


> Programmed my SC64W to be moonlight (one-click), turbo (double-click), medium (click-and-hold). Much better for night use. No risk of blasting yourself with light in the middle of the night.
> 
> On the other hand, I still prefer the default UI for daytime EDC use. Going to try swapping back and and forth between the UIs in the morning and evening.



I’ve had mine set up this way for the last week and I love it! Try as I might I could just not get used the the g5 programming as I’ve had an h53c that I’ve run in this configuration for several months. I intended to carry the sc64w in g5 but had too many negligent discharges with dark adapted eyes. Now I don’t even have to think about it, just short click for moonlight with no chance of not timing it correctly. 

IMO, it would be best to pick a mode layout and stick with it. Switching back and forth will most likely be too difficult to keep track of. For me, it was far easier to just get used to double clicking for hi.


----------



## Tixx

sc00ts19 said:


> I’ve had mine set up this way for the last week and I love it! Try as I might I could just not get used the the g5 programming as I’ve had an h53c that I’ve run in this configuration for several months. I intended to carry the sc64w in g5 but had too many negligent discharges with dark adapted eyes. Now I don’t even have to think about it, just short click for moonlight with no chance of not timing it correctly.
> 
> IMO, it would be best to pick a mode layout and stick with it. Switching back and forth will most likely be too difficult to keep track of. For me, it was far easier to just get used to double clicking for hi.



I do similar. single click moonlight, but do double click medium and press and hold for high modes.


----------



## niraya

Tixx said:


> I do similar. single click moonlight, but do double click medium and press and hold for high modes.


 Does that not kill the normal L-M-H order when keeping pressed button? (making it L-H-M instead?)

Single click for L, hold for M and double click for H does preserve the L-M-H order.


----------



## Tixx

niraya said:


> Does that not kill the normal L-M-H order when keeping pressed button? (making it L-H-M instead?)
> 
> Single click for L, hold for M and double click for H does preserve the L-M-H order.



It does kill that order, you are correct. Personally I don't scroll through ever. It actually reverses since press and hold goes H-M-L. I just flipped the function of L and H and left M the same.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

I have noticed a consistent and reproducible problem with my SC600w MkIV HI. It shuts off in the cold if I use H1.

This morning I was out for a walk in cold weather (-10C). When I started out, the light worked fine in all modes, including H1. But, after I shut the light off for awhile, and it cooled down below freezing, it would no longer work in H1. It would light up for about 5 seconds, then just shut off. I tried it many times, and it would not work in H1 (1400 lumens) no matter how I put it there. The battery was at 3 flashes (measured it at 3.7v when I got home), using a high-drain Samsung 30Q (bought a few months ago).

All other modes worked fine. I could use H2 okay. I eventually got it to work again in H1, by turning on H2 (500 lumens) and warming up the light under my coat. Once the light was warm, H1 would stay on. But if it cooled off again, H1 wouldn't stay lit. When I got home and used H1 indoors, it was fine.

So, cold + full output does not work on the SC600w MkIV HI.

I noticed this problem in the past, but it wasn't reproducible. Maybe it works a little better on a full battery, or maybe it just wasn't cold enough when I was trying it, or maybe I didn't let the light cool down enough.

I'm rather disappointed by this. I bought this for my main light for outdoor use, which includes during the winter. I'll still use it, since I like the beam profile and tint. But, I might not use it when it's below freezing, or accept the fact it's only a 500 lumen light in the cold.

I'm guessing Zebralight doesn't test their lights in freezing conditions. Maybe that's not an issue for most customers.


----------



## terryoregon

> So, cold + full output does not work on the SC600w MkIV HI.



Could it be the battery? Stand by, will put my SC600Fd Mark IV Plus in the freezer for an hour, and see what happens. 

Battery used: Samsung INR18650-25R (20A)


----------



## NPL

I suspect the cold battery is the issue. Try again but warm up the battery in your hand before putting it in the "frozen" light. I bet it will work just fine. My guess is that the battery can't sustain the high current draw when it's so cold, which would probably be an issue for all high output lights used in their turbo settings.


----------



## markr6

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> I have noticed a consistent and reproducible problem with my SC600w MkIV HI. It shuts off in the cold if I use H1.



Check out post #1274 and before in this same thread. Outdoorsman5 had the same problems as I did. I soon realized it wasn't the cold. The problem is random, wasn't the cold, and wasn't the bettery/dirty contacts in our case. Fortunately my replacement IV is working great.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

NPL said:


> I suspect the cold battery is the issue. Try again but warm up the battery in your hand before putting it in the "frozen" light. I bet it will work just fine. My guess is that the battery can't sustain the high current draw when it's so cold, which would probably be an issue for all high output lights used in their turbo settings.



I suspect if it was the battery, the light would step-down from H1, like it does when the battery is low. That is not what is happening. The light just shuts off from H1. Well, sort of. The LED goes out, but the driver is still "on". I have to click the button once to "really" shut off the light, then I can turn it on again normally.




markr6 said:


> Check out post #1274 and before in this same thread. Outdoorsman5 had the same problems as I did. I soon realized it wasn't the cold. The problem is random, wasn't the cold, and wasn't the bettery/dirty contacts in our case. Fortunately my replacement IV is working great.



It's possible, but my issue doesn't seem random. It is reproducible, every time, when it is below freezing (around -10C in my case). As soon as I warm the light up, it works properly.

Hopefully, it's just a problem in cold weather, and not an indication of future problems at all times. I have no desire to go through a repair via China. And I know how ZL tends to just return lights with "no problem found" if it's random.


----------



## terryoregon

.
One hour in the freezer at -2F. No problems. Turned on, stayed on high for about 5min, then started throttling down in small steps as it got warm (expected).
SC600Fd Mark IV Plus
Samsung INR18650-25R (20A) 

Environmental testing at Zebralight (every device) would be very expensive - especially if you're going to have buttons pushed while it's in the chamber. I worked in electronics manufacturing for 37yrs, and this was only done on every device for expensive medical monitors. On other products, like calculators, it was only done during design - or when a defect trend developed (related to heat/cold).


----------



## markr6

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> It's possible, but my issue doesn't seem random. It is reproducible, every time, when it is below freezing (around -10C in my case). As soon as I warm the light up, it works properly.
> 
> Hopefully, it's just a problem in cold weather, and not an indication of future problems at all times. I have no desire to go through a repair via China. And I know how ZL tends to just return lights with "no problem found" if it's random.



Try it at room temperature a bunch of times. When I started doing that, I could reproduce the problem about half the time. I first noticed it in the cold so I assumed that was the problem, but the more I used it the more I found it acting up at room temp as well. Regardless, after turning it back on once or twice, it seemed to stop. It's like it had to sit idle for a few minutes before it would act up again.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

terryoregon said:


> .
> One hour in the freezer at -2F. No problems. Turned on, stayed on high for about 5min, then started throttling down in small steps as it got warm (expected).
> SC600Fd Mark IV Plus



The Plus may not have the same issue as the HI, since it likely uses a different driver. Also, I'm not sure a freezer test is sufficient to test for the flaw. As soon as my light warms up, the problem goes away.

Just a bizarre thought, but I wonder if the problem might be the temperature sensor that controls PID? Maybe if it zeros-out the sensor, it causes a bug in the driver that turns off the light? Okay, probably not, but just a thought.




markr6 said:


> Try it at room temperature a bunch of times. When I started doing that, I could reproduce the problem about half the time. I first noticed it in the cold so I assumed that was the problem, but the more I used it the more I found it acting up at room temp as well. Regardless, after turning it back on once or twice, it seemed to stop. It's like it had to sit idle for a few minutes before it would act up again.



I just tried it a few times, indoors. Works fine. I'm hoping it stays that way.


----------



## IlluminationDomination

I guess your all stumped by my photos!


----------



## recDNA

Tixx said:


> It does kill that order, you are correct. Personally I don't scroll through ever. It actually reverses since press and hold goes H-M-L. I just flipped the function of L and H and left M the same.


I'd like to change mine to M-H-L so high requires 2 clicks but too much trouble.


----------



## Fireclaw18

recDNA said:


> I'd like to change mine to M-H-L so high requires 2 clicks but too much trouble.



It takes at most 5 minutes to reprogram all 6 modes in one of the mode groups. That's too much trouble????


----------



## scs

terryoregon said:


> .
> What do you get when you combine a new Reed Instruments SD-1128 light-meter-data-logger and a Zebralight *SC600Fd MK IV Plus*?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
> . . . . . .*. . . . . . . . . . . . . .**MORE RUNTIME GRAPHS* (by someone who's never done them before)
> 
> Intrigued by the noted oscillations in output on gen 4 lights (as seen in page 56 of this very thread), I decided to see if mine had the same characteristics.
> 
> Since most gen 4 graphs tend to focus on the higher levels, I chose *557* lumens for some extra perspective. As you can see in the 1st graph, even at this level the oscillations are still evident. Note, the Samsung battery was capacity tested on an Xtar Dragon (results; 2506mah).
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
> 
> I then repeated the test again with *ACTIVE COOLING*. This time, a block of blue ice was placed behind the light with a small fan behind the blue ice. Therefore, cool air was continually blowing over the light during the test.
> 
> As you can see, active cooling makes a LOT of difference (zero oscillations). Also note that Zebralights don't just shut down unexpectedly when the battery is low, but give you plenty of extra runtime at a much lower output.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
> .
> 
> And just for good measure, I ran another test at *135* lumens. Of course PID is no longer necessary and we have excellent regulation for 9.5 hrs.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
> .
> PS: this is the 1st time I've posted runtime graphs, be kind. It's fun, but was a lot of work re-learning line charts in Excel.



Thanks for the runtime plot. According to this review: http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...H2R-review-(Headlamp-right-angle-18650-XHP50) the H2R with a NW XHP 50 emitter, manages 600 lumens for 2 hours and 40 minutes, albeit with a 3500 mAh GA instead of the 2507 mAh used in the ZL and not with a high CRI emitter like in the ZL. There are offsetting factors at work here. Does anyone believe that the ZL would have posted similar runtimes with the NW XHP50 in the Olight or has Olight markedly surpassed ZL in efficiency in this instance?


----------



## recDNA

Fireclaw18 said:


> It takes at most 5 minutes to reprogram all 6 modes in one of the mode groups. That's too much trouble????


It takes me that long to do one setting! I have trouble finding the exact output i want


----------



## ven

1st world problems are a *beep* 

I tend to set levels(what ever light, not just ZL where i can program) in the environment used. When i have in the day(of course not bright day light, but dark room), its never been right at the night time. I tend to wait till dark, more darker! in the room or outside, then just try and relax and chill doing it. Not a chore, but try and enjoy it if makes sense. With a few practices, you will be able to do it on the fly issue free. In fact, other than the h17f driver, the ZL was one of the more user friendly i found. 

Well pondered around a mk IV plus and being honest, dont quite have confidence there. UK stock is none available, so any issue would be shipping outside of country................not really a want. So mkIII sc600fd plus 5000k will be my next. As much as i do like and prefer the newer UI(ability to have what i want more finally tuned), the older UI is still sweet! As long as i have a decent output/duration ratio, i am happy!


----------



## sc00ts19

recDNA said:


> It takes me that long to do one setting! I have trouble finding the exact output i want



I’ve found it helpful to keep the spec sheet in front of me. Then go all the way up or down in output , whichever is closer, then from there I can count my way up or down the spec sheet and know what output I’m programming to. I used to do it just by guessing roughly what output I thought useful, but it kicked my ocd into over drive.


----------



## recDNA

sc00ts19 said:


> I’ve found it helpful to keep the spec sheet in front of me. Then go all the way up or down in output , whichever is closer, then from there I can count my way up or down the spec sheet and know what output I’m programming to. I used to do it just by guessing roughly what output I thought useful, but it kicked my ocd into over drive.


That's exactly what I do and it is time consuming. Soon I hope we'll be able to program with a computer or cell phone.


----------



## SKV89

For those interested, here are my ceiling bounce comparisons for the SC5w II 4500k XPL2 80CRI

SC5w II Unit 1 (advertised at 550 lumens): 44 lux
SC5w II Unit 2 (advertised at 550 lumens): 68 lux
SC5w II Unit 3 (advertised at 550 lumens): 74 lux
Thrunite Archer 2A v3 NW version (CW advertised at 500 lumens): 72 lux
Utorch UT01 NW 4000k (CW version advertised at 400 lumens) Unit 1: 54 lux
Utorch UT01 NW 4000k (CW version advertised at 400 lumens) Unit 2: 58 lux
Utorch UT01 NW 4000k (CW version advertised at 400 lumens) Unit 3: 59 lux
Nitecore TIP CRI 2007 (advertised at 240 lumens): 40 lux

These are tested with fully charged batteries. The measurements are surprisingly consistent even when tested weeks apart. For example, if I test the same UT01 unit at 59 lux on day 1 and then repeat the test on day 19 using the same fully charged battery, the results wil be exactly the same at 59. I am not saying the ceiling bounce results are accurate but just saying its consistent. Ceiling bounce favors spotty lights over floody lights so in my comparison above, it should favor SC5W more than the other lights since SC5W has the spottiest beam.


----------



## SKV89

Dio said:


> I think you misinterpreted the graphs or something as it is quite clear the ZL can maintain over 500L..
> 
> See the uncooled one where it maintains 95% of its' initial output for 15 minutes?



I just don't know why it can't maintain 500 lumens for the entire duration. The Armytek Wizard using an older gen XHP50 and the Olight H2R Nova can maintain over 500 lumens for more than 2 hours.
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...H2R-review-(Headlamp-right-angle-18650-XHP50)

Also the Imalent HR70 claims to be able to hold 1,000 lumens, although it is CW and not hi CRI. 

I was just expecting more out of the SC600W Plus XHP50.2 thinking it can maintain 1,000 lumens given all the praises of the Zebralight unibody construction being able to dissipate heat.


----------



## scs

SKV89 said:


> I just don't know why it can't maintain 500 lumens for the entire duration. The Armytek Wizard using an older gen XHP50 and the Olight H2R Nova can maintain over 500 lumens for more than 2 hours.
> http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...H2R-review-(Headlamp-right-angle-18650-XHP50)
> 
> Also the Imalent HR70 claims to be able to hold 1,000 lumens, although it is CW and not hi CRI.
> 
> I was just expecting more out of the SC600W Plus XHP50.2 thinking it can maintain 1,000 lumens given all the praises of the Zebralight unibody construction being able to dissipate heat.



Right, two separate observations here: 1) the ZL doesn't appear to be able to shed heat fast enough even in the 500 lumen range to maintain that output without stepping down. 2) even when enough cooling is provided, at around 500 lumens, the ZL manages just over 1 hour of constant output, whereas the Olight H2R using the older XHP 50 emitter maintains around 6oo lumens for 2 hours and 40 minutes. Unless a convincing argument can be made that the combination of the ZL's higher CRI and therefore less efficient XHP 50.2 and the lower capacity cell used in the test accounts for the lower performance, I think ZL has fallen behind in driver efficiency at this output range.


----------



## niraya

scs said:


> Unless a convincing argument can be made that the combination of the ZL's higher CRI and therefore less efficient XHP 50.2 and the lower capacity cell used in the test accounts for the lower performance, I think ZL has fallen behind in driver efficiency at this output range.


Olight was measured with 40% more battery capacity. The rest is probably reasonable for high CRI ?


----------



## SKV89

niraya said:


> Olight was measured with 40% more battery capacity. The rest is probably reasonable for high CRI ?



Olight was measured with 200% of Zebralight's efficiency using the same Sanyo NCR18650GA battery


----------



## Connor

What's the source for that graph?


----------



## SKV89

Connor said:


> What's the source for that graph?



Maukka's review 
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...H2R-review-(Headlamp-right-angle-18650-XHP50)


----------



## ven

New edition to the little family, mkIII plus 5k














Got to test out later, but so far all seems good.


----------



## niraya

SKV89 said:


> Olight was measured with 200% of Zebralight's efficiency using the same Sanyo NCR18650GA battery



That was mkIII
MKIV was measured with 2500mAh vs Olight 3500mAh .


----------



## SKV89

niraya said:


> That was mkIII
> MKIV was measured with 2500mAh vs Olight 3500mAh .



Yes mk3 vs Olight's XHP50. I would love to see how Olight's XHP50 NW (<4000k) compare with Zebralight's MKIV w/ the XHP50.2. Do you have a link to where the Zebralight is compared with the Olight measured at 2500mah vs 3500mah?


----------



## niraya

SKV89 said:


> Yes mk3 vs Olight's XHP50. I would love to see how Olight's XHP50 NW (<4000k) compare with Zebralight's MKIV w/ the XHP50.2. Do you have a link to where the Zebralight is compared with the Olight measured at 2500mah vs 3500mah?


 Compare efficiency from Olight review vs post #1949 http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...light-Thread&p=5192703&viewfull=1#post5192703 of this thread (HC600Fc/d MK IV should be similar if not better in eff. to SC600Fd Plus). Current draw of HC600fc is here http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...KIV-headlamp&p=5192182&viewfull=1#post5192182


----------



## ven

Never thought I would say the most ridiculous design on a flashlight would go to ZL. Who on earth thought it would be a good idea to incorporate a fixed lanyard loop on the body. It digs in when using and can not really avoid it due to position of switch in use. Absolutely hate it ! To a point it is really annoying me, as the sc600 mkIII is quite comfy in hand......other than the stupid ring. Great light ruined...........did I say stupid.


----------



## Nichia!

ven said:


> Never thought I would say the most ridiculous design on a flashlight would go to ZL. Who on earth thought it would be a good idea to incorporate a fixed lanyard loop on the body. It digs in when using and can not really avoid it due to position of switch in use. Absolutely hate it ! To a point it is really annoying me, as the sc600 mkIII is quite comfy in hand......other than the stupid ring. Great light ruined...........did I say stupid.



Wow first time to be angry ven!!!


----------



## StandardBattery

ven said:


> Never thought I would say the most ridiculous design on a flashlight would go to ZL. Who on earth thought it would be a good idea to incorporate a fixed lanyard loop on the body. It digs in when using and can not really avoid it due to position of switch in use. Absolutely hate it ! To a point it is really annoying me, as the sc600 mkIII is quite comfy in hand......other than the stupid ring. Great light ruined...........did I say stupid.


Yes, that was a bad idea, I'm surprised more have not complained. It's far from the most ridiculous though.


----------



## Connor

I don't even notice it's there.


----------



## ven

:laughing:

Oh it makes me mad haha, it is like why? Hopefully now you will not notice it still Connor. Just with using it for a couple of nights, every time i am holding it it is just there and my finger falls on it. I dont really want to file it off, will see how i get on over time. 





Depending how held, it either digs in





or





Other than that its awesome, just a crazy idea imo( subjective) as it would only fit a key ring, of which would make it even more uncomfortable in hand.


----------



## ven

Nichia! said:


> Wow first time to be angry ven!!!



haha,


----------



## StandardBattery

I positioned the clip to try to hide it as much as possible, but then there is the clip, which i need most od the time for my daily carries, but my mk4 is not a daily carry so i first used it without the clip, attachment was so annoying. It can also interfere with how i want my clip positioned, very annoying. Personally, even though it means scaring, if a mk4 becomes a daily carry or something i need often, i'm probably going to have to grind it off or use it in some way instead of the stock clip. The mkIII rules


----------



## ven

I thought of using the clip, but then it wont be aligned with the milled flat of the body................ideally no built in loop would be perfect.Such a comfy in hand feel with the little chunk of light. I took in work today and used a good bit . As long as i position the loop between little finger and ring finger, it was fine. Of course when i wear gloves it does not matter as much..............oh well, not a deal killer, just a gripe really.





Still will get a HI at some point anyway.................


----------



## markr6

Connor said:


> I don't even notice it's there.



Same here...but next time I use it I probably will!


----------



## ven

:nana: sorry in advance


----------



## DavidRZ

ven said:


> Never thought I would say the most ridiculous design on a flashlight would go to ZL. Who on earth thought it would be a good idea to incorporate a fixed lanyard loop on the body. It digs in when using and can not really avoid it due to position of switch in use. Absolutely hate it ! To a point it is really annoying me, as the sc600 mkIII is quite comfy in hand......other than the stupid ring. Great light ruined...........did I say stupid.



Nothing I grinder couldn't fix in 30 seconds.


----------



## markr6

DavidRZ said:


> Nothing I grinder couldn't fix in 30 seconds.



I remember at least one person doing this years ago when the SC600 first came out. A little rough cosmetically, but it works. And grinding stuff never gets boring!


----------



## ven

I have a few grinders...............might get carried away though No, unfortunately my OCD could not cope with it. I can cope as is for now, my night time rant and man tantrum has subsided haha. I dont like it, nothing will change that, but today i found a way that works , so all ok for now:thumbsup:

Still stupid though  I would prefer something along lines of the older surefires, where you can remove the ring(lanyard attachment) . Or incorporate in the tail cap as another option, anything but make it stick out of the body without being able to remove! Thats me though...............might be 1000's of ZL owners who think best thing since sliced bread.


----------



## Fireclaw18

markr6 said:


> I remember at least one person doing this years ago when the SC600 first came out. A little rough cosmetically, but it works. And grinding stuff never gets boring!


Actually the very first version of the SC600 had no lanyard loop. People complained about the lack so they added one in later.


----------



## DavidRZ

Fireclaw18 said:


> Actually the very first version of the SC600 had no lanyard loop. People complained about the lack so they added one in later.



Can't please everyone. Far easier for us to get rid of then to add for those that need it.


----------



## holygeez03

It does seem like a solid but removable option would come close to pleasing everyone.


----------



## markr6

Fireclaw18 said:


> Actually the very first version of the SC600 had no lanyard loop. People complained about the lack so they added one in later.



I checked wayback machine from 2011 and it shows a lanyard bump. I guess there were two versions of the original before MKII?

Oh I see it now. No lanyard September 2011..but lanyard on November 2011. I like the looks of it without.

HAHA! It's fun looking back...we've come a long way.

_High: H1 *500*Lm with *750*Lm turbo in the first 5 min (2hrs)_


----------



## Fireclaw18

markr6 said:


> I checked wayback machine from 2011 and it shows a lanyard bump. I guess there were two versions of the original before MKII?
> 
> Oh I see it now. No lanyard September 2011..but lanyard on November 2011. I like the looks of it without.
> 
> HAHA! It's fun looking back...we've come a long way.
> 
> _High: H1 *500*Lm with *750*Lm turbo in the first 5 min (2hrs)_


Yup. I have one of the first edition preorders. It has no lanyard bump.

Wonder if it's worth trying to upgrade. The first generation SC600s used a separate star for the LED and a screw-on bezel. Shouldn't be impossible to mod. I bet mine would be a lot brighter with the stock greenish-tint cool-white XML upgraded to an SST-40. Output might double.

On the other hand, my SC600 is barely used and in perfect condition. It might not look so pristine if I mod it.


----------



## tech25

I have an SC600w first version with the loop, I don't care for it but find that it helps me orient the button by feel. Its also a bit bigger than the later versions so it doesn't bother me too much.


----------



## jtblue

I received my SC64 today, ordered on 10-Feb, sent on the 23-Feb and received 22-Mar.

Just a few things to note. It does show some light through the button at max output (not a problem for me) and that there is a coil spring in the tail cap; I was under the impression that there were pogo pins on both ends?

Apart from that, I am a happy customer!


----------



## markr6

jtblue said:


> I was under the impression that there were pogo pins on both ends?



The spring is normal on the SC64 series


----------



## jtblue

markr6 said:


> The spring is normal on the SC64 series


Phew, thanks for clearing that up!


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

markr6 said:


> The spring is normal on the SC64 series



It's odd that they use a spring for the SC64, but pogo pins on both ends for the SC600 series. Any idea why the different choice? If anything, I think the shorter pogo pins would be more of a benefit for the SC64.


----------



## StandardBattery

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> It's odd that they use a spring for the SC64, but pogo pins on both ends for the SC600 series. Any idea why the different choice? If anything, I think the shorter pogo pins would be more of a benefit for the SC64.


Why do you think that?


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

StandardBattery said:


> Why do you think that?



The SC64 is designed to be a compact light, so even just a millimeter shaved off its length might be desirable. The pogo pins allow for a shorter battery compartment, even if just a little bit.

The SC600 lights are not really designed to be extremely compact, so an extra millimeter of length by using springs wouldn't be a big deal. Though, I guess they want pogo for the higher output designs like the Plus, to allow for higher current.


----------



## ven




----------



## ven

updated ZL nerd herd


----------



## Nichia!

ven said:


>



And???? [emoji106] or [emoji107]


----------



## ven

Like it nichia! Need to have some dark to try out. Its not the same as my sc63w 4500k xhp35 in "tint" which is like a slightly warm neutral. This is ever so slightly towards yellow which is probably the intensity difference(over a more flood type beam). Its nice, no off tint or anything like that. Form factor of course exact same as the plus, stupid annoying body ring which is not as annoying anymore(just stupid) lol. It complements the plus nicely for me(one throwy and one floody) and quite punchy. Not crazy focused, fairly intense close up(under 10ft or so) which softens as the beam travels. Its no light for a throw junkie, kind of a happy medium type beam which is more than adequate for EDC type wants and needs. Not too focused to become dedicated and more limited in use(for me anyway). 

How it compares to the IV , dont know if the lumen difference can be seen...............Would have thought a couple of hundred lumens past 1100 is neither here or there. Not tested for too long, but it looked to hold max output for the couple of mins i tested without getting hot.


----------



## markr6

ven said:


> updated ZL nerd herd



Look at this guy! Holding out on Zebralights for so long and now you have an entire herd


----------



## ven

:laughing: 

Always slow to the party!

For me Mark, part of the problem was sourcing my side(UK) and not importing from ZL themselves. Can not be bothered with the issue of sending back if any issue...........PITA. After surefire, ZL is the most in manufacturers i have! I like their 18650 lights but dont care much for their AA (wont be getting another anyway). I still want an sc62w to add.............just need a mint tidy one.


----------



## ven

Crappy pic, just a rough n ready quick beam shot


----------



## ven

Tail caps


----------



## markr6

I figured they all had 5+ pins now. Interesting


----------



## Fireclaw18

My SC64w has 5 pins at the head. I think this is up from my SC63W which only had 3.


----------



## Nichia!

ven said:


> Crappy pic, just a rough n ready quick beam shot



???


----------



## SKV89

Found a Taiwanese thread with beamshots of Zebralights. For some reason my Chrome cannot translate this site but the pictures are all you really need.

http://www.wii.tw/~fogerdis/viewthread.php?tid=60087


----------



## ven

Nichia! said:


> ???



:laughing: xhp35 HI 4500k

Impressive beam yes, like it! Plenty bright and throwy enough for most uses IMO. Plenty bright spill also...............good all round punchy beam


----------



## ven

SKV89 said:


> Found a Taiwanese thread with beamshots of Zebralights. For some reason my Chrome cannot translate this site but the pictures are all you really need.
> 
> http://www.wii.tw/~fogerdis/viewthread.php?tid=60087




Translate is working on my chrome, its the best bit! Makes for great dissatisfaction article reading


----------



## Nichia!

ven said:


> :laughing: xhp35 HI 4500k
> 
> Impressive beam yes, like it! Plenty bright and throwy enough for most uses IMO. Plenty bright spill also...............good all round punchy beam





Glad you like it
it's one of my favorite EDC lights..


----------



## ven

Nichia! said:


> Glad you like it
> it's one of my favorite EDC lights..



I could understand fully why, zebra's are great lights

Wonder which will be my next:thinking: it will be 18650 fed.................thats all i know.
More frontal pic


----------



## ven

Even though the sc600 mk III/IV is a bit of a chunk, its till super compact.


----------



## Nichia!

ven said:


> I could understand fully why, zebra's are great lights
> 
> Wonder which will be my next:thinking: it will be 18650 fed.................thats all i know.
> More frontal pic





Which one is your favorite??


----------



## ven

Nichia! said:


> Which one is your favorite??




I think the sc62d just pips the others, lowest output(or near enough lowest) at 320lm(think the sc53w is of similar lumens). Just like the design, feel, beam and colour temp/tint of the luxeon T. The sc600 plus 5k and HI i seem to like around the same. The sc63w is a floody 4500k beam of usefulness for me and the sc62 6300k is a clean white . So a little variety in there as everyone is either different temp, domed, HI or LED to keep things fresh. My least fav is the sc53w, still more yellow than i like from the hateful xp-l2(yes i hate that LED) and AA is not really my fav form factor...............even less so in a ZL as the 18650 are compact enough with far more benefits. I am going to spend some time with the sc53w to try and get to like it more. Its not as bad as the xp-l2 4k in the sc5c anyway! I dont care how high the cri is, if the beam is too tinted in any colour. The 85cri luxeon wipes the floor with the 4k and 4.5k xp-l2's in my eyes and use..............not even close, even though 8-10 cri less. Of course thats just my opinion, so take with a pinch of salt. I am sure if your ambient lighting or what your eyes are adapted to suits the xp-l2, you wont have the same complaints as me(YELLLLOOOOOOOOOWWWWW)


----------



## Tixx

Nichia! said:


> Which one is your favorite??



Having had all those and more shown in the pic, if I was to choose just one Flashlight, it would be the SC64 for the size, pocketability, capacity, weight and range of output. The SC600 floods are awesome if you don't mind the extra diameter or use a holster instead of pocket. LED choice aside.


----------



## ven

The sc63/64 are the most compact of all the 18650 fed ZL's, i can also see why a fav. Tbh, i think you would be hard pushed to go wrong with any of the 18650 lights, providing you picked more safely in LED choice. The xhp's(none .2) seem to be quite consistent, certainly the HI's from my experience anyway. Only slight purple on outer edge(not noticeable in use, only to look for)from the lens coating. 

I am very happy with the xhp35 4500k /xhp35 HI 4500k and xhp50 5000k  Of course the Philips Luxeon T as well, this to me eyes is pretty clean white with an edge of creamy(very slight), maybe a little comparable to the nichia 219c 5000k(not all, just some as these also have a slight variance).

What has surprised me being more 4000-5000k type guy, is the sc62's 6300k pure white. Although colours are not as rich, they are also not washed out and pale. This type of colour temp works fine for me during day time(yes i know it sounds crazy). But bare in mind, my daytime use is mainly in work with cool artificial lighting. It can make 4000k overly warm, yet 5-6k actually looks/appears how a 4-5k light would around the home in the evening..............if makes sense, as hard to explain :thinking:. Either way, its one of not many CW lights i own and can enjoy.


----------



## recDNA

I'd love to see a Zebralight sc65 with an XP-G2 with an emphasis on throw. I like a visible hotspot


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

recDNA said:


> I'd love to see a Zebralight sc65 with an XP-G2 with an emphasis on throw. I like a visible hotspot



That's what the XHP 35 HI versions are for. They have pretty good throw, considering the small size of the light. You can't drive the XP-G2 hard enough and still stay within spec for it to be worthwhile.


----------



## recDNA

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> That's what the XHP 35 HI versions are for. They have pretty good throw, considering the small size of the light. You can't drive the XP-G2 hard enough and still stay within spec for it to be worthwhile.


xpl hi then. no xhp throws in little head


----------



## 18650

recDNA said:


> xpl hi then. no xhp throws in little head


 XHP35 = 4 XP-G's stitched together is it not?


----------



## staticx57

No, closer to 4 XP-E2


----------



## recDNA

I want a hotspot. 1 g2 better than 4


----------



## g.p.

Zebralight doesn't offer free shipping to Canada anymore. :mecry:

Anybody know of a Canadian distributor?


----------



## MikeSalt

I have to say, Zebralight cured my flashlight addiction. I got myself an SC52D and it has been the perfect EDC, even displacing a McGizmo Haiku from that duty. Since the Zebralight two or three years ago , the only other flashlight I have bought is an Olight M-series thrower to replace the duties normally served by my Roar of the Pelican, which I have discontinued use due to the scarcity of the Pelican bulbs.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

g.p. said:


> Zebralight doesn't offer free shipping to Canada anymore. :mecry:
> 
> Anybody know of a Canadian distributor?



They will ship via EMS, which is pretty good. Costs about $15, and you'll have it in about a week or two. It comes via Canada Post, so you won't have to pay brokerage fees or taxes.


----------



## dtrkyman

Has anyone been able to contact zebra recently? They have had my light for months and I can not get a response from their message system and no one answers their phone!


----------



## SubLGT

dtrkyman said:


> Has anyone been able to contact zebra recently? They have had my light for months and I can not get a response from their message system and no one answers their phone!



Zebralight is becoming like Armytek.


----------



## markr6

dtrkyman said:


> Has anyone been able to contact zebra recently? They have had my light for months and I can not get a response from their message system and no one answers their phone!



By message system do you mean sending a message online thru the contact us link? That's the best bet. I feel like a lot of people are like me these days...let the phone ring. Hell, I screen calls from everyone and hardly answer anymore (sometimes my wife ) The "Phone:" is blank on their contact page, so that tells me something.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

markr6 said:


> By message system do you mean sending a message online thru the contact us link? That's the best bet. I feel like a lot of people are like me these days...let the phone ring. Hell, I screen calls from everyone and hardly answer anymore (sometimes my wife ) The "Phone:" is blank on their contact page, so that tells me something.



Every time I get a call from a number I don't recognize (usually with no name associated to the number), I add it to my call blocking list. Lately, I'm getting much less calls! 

In our country, we do have a "do not call list" you can subscribe to, which is supposed to stop telemarketers. But, it's useless. Call blocking does the job much better, since usually the same number calls every few days.


----------



## recDNA

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Every time I get a call from a number I don't recognize (usually with no name associated to the number), I add it to my call blocking list. Lately, I'm getting much less calls!
> 
> In our country, we do have a "do not call list" you can subscribe to, which is supposed to stop telemarketers. But, it's useless. Call blocking does the job much better, since usually the same number calls every few days.


I do the same but it hasn't reduced the calls at all. They use computers to spoof numbers so you're just blocking people who you never heard of and never really called you at all. I've gotten spam calls from the actual number of the phone in my hand!


----------



## g.p.

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> They will ship via EMS, which is pretty good. Costs about $15, and you'll have it in about a week or two. It comes via Canada Post, so you won't have to pay brokerage fees or taxes.


Not bad, but still stinks when the rest of the world gets free shipping. At the very least free shipping could still be offered when spending a minimum amount. Just sick of paying higher prices and getting screwed because I live in Canada.

Either way this has led me to branch out and discover some other new lights. Zebralight had a hold on me for many, many years, and it's been good to see what else is available now (Whole line up of Emisar lights, and a Helius Sigma IX and XI on the way!:twothumbs). I really haven't been impressed with the cell versatility that Zebralight gave up in order to accommodate the new UI. I don't think it's worth the trade off, and the lack of free shipping was just the final straw.


----------



## markr6

I just noticed the SC32 for sale, in stock. The 4th image shows the inside electronics, etc. I don't ever remember seeing that on their site but it could just be me not into CR123.

Good deal on the old SC62 too.

Sony VTC6 on sale. And the new SC53Fc for sale.


----------



## holygeez03

Is there any benefit to using that Sony 30A battery in the SC600w MKIV Plus?


----------



## Connor

@holygeez03
Only if you use it a lot on max level for short amounts of time.


----------



## holygeez03

I suppose I use it a decent amount on Max for short intervals... what does the Plus draw at initial turn on?


----------



## firehawk

I just lost my cr123 floody flashlight. It was used every day, but I don't see one made anymore. If they had any, I'd buy one today.


----------



## Tixx

Unfortunately that Sony was overpriced. It's now the standard selling price at places like RTD Vapor.


----------



## recDNA

firehawk said:


> I just lost my cr123 floody flashlight. It was used every day, but I don't see one made anymore. If they had any, I'd buy one today.


sc32. Is it out of stick again? They did have it. I nearly bought a backup


----------



## holygeez03

The SC32 is currently in stock... the SC32w is out-of-stock.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

holygeez03 said:


> I suppose I use it a decent amount on Max for short intervals... what does the Plus draw at initial turn on?



I think it's somewhere around 8A. The ZL recommended Sanyo GA cell (10A draw) might be a little under-powered, but still within spec. I'd use a Sony VTC6 or a Samsung 30Q, which should be more than enough. A 30A draw cell is overkill.

The nice thing about Zebralights is that they are well regulated, so getting the highest voltage under load from your cell isn't really needed (like it is with lights that use a FET driver). Run-time is mostly determined by the watt-hours of the cell under load, not the amp-hours. That's why I think a VTC6 might be a better choice than a GA cell. Good combo of capacity and high-drain.


----------



## jtblue

So about month ago I dropped my SC64 from 1 meter，it struck the ground bezel down and the lense and bezel ring both flew off. I've pressed the lense and bezel ring back on and so far I haven't had a problem with it even after multiple accidental drops from the same height.

So, my question is, has anybody else had this happen to them?


----------



## noboneshotdog

jtblue said:


> So about month ago I dropped my SC64 from 1 meter，it struck the ground bezel down and the lense and bezel ring both flew off. I've pressed the lense and bezel ring back on and so far I haven't had a problem with it even after multiple accidental drops from the same height.
> 
> So, my question is, has anybody else had this happen to them?



No. Some people only wish there bezel and lens would fall off without breaking. ZL are one of the most difficult lights to modify due to how difficult they are to remove the lens and bezel. So, consider yourself lucky. Maybe you can get it back off and put a nice Nichia led in it. Hahahaha :thumbsup:


----------



## akuu

Hi. 
I've recently bought SC5w mk II 
I've found that white emitter board is somewhat cracked (?). I don't know what to make of this - whether it's something normal or something to be concerned about. What do you guys think?
Here are pics:

_*broken links, no images... removed by Admin_


----------



## jtblue

noboneshotdog said:


> No. Some people only wish there bezel and lens would fall off without breaking. ZL are one of the most difficult lights to modify due to how difficult they are to remove the lens and bezel. So, consider yourself lucky. Maybe you can get it back off and put a nice Nichia led in it. Hahahaha :thumbsup:



Ah I see, yeah next time it happens I'll sell it for a premium haha


----------



## easilyled

So, I seem to recall reading this thread that there are some software bugs in some of the latest versions of the Zebralgihts. Anyone know which versions these are and whether they'll be fixed soon?


----------



## JoeRodge

I'm really frustrated with Zebralight. I've made threads and mentioned it here...but this thing has destroyed 3 of my 18650 cells. Yes, it'd a new version with 5 pogo pins on both sides.

Two of the batteries can't even hold a charge anymore (the two that have damage to the negative end of the cell)

A few people have suggested using gaskets without naming any specific sized gasket. What frustrates me the most is that Zebralight has ignored me after my first message of my concern. My second message was about possible preventing the issue. It's been many days without a response.

I love the light but this will probably be my last. If I can't drop a 100 dollar flashlight off my couch and onto the floor, if I can't drop it whole under a car, it's useless.


----------



## akuu

akuu said:


> Hi.
> I've recently bought SC5w mk II
> I've found that white emitter board is somewhat cracked (?). I don't know what to make of this - whether it's something normal or something to be concerned about. What do you guys think?
> Here are pics:
> 
> _*broken links, no images... removed by Admin_



Here are working pics 
https://photos.app.goo.gl/4JW4GJ8afDbd94ah6
https://photos.app.goo.gl/SuHWf1LNpWV9GCJZ9


----------



## sp5it

It's just dirt. Shame on ZL anyway. 
Mike


----------



## majid

I just got my first Zebralight, a SC600Fc IV Plus (4000K, high CRI, floody, XHP50). Wow, is this thing tiny, yet insanely bright! (my other 18650 lights are a couple of Elektrolumens EDC, some Eagletacs and Nitecores, and my EDC either a Nitecore Tip CRI or an Olight S1R). The floody beam is very smooth. At full output, it measures 88 CRI on my UPRTek CV600 spectrometer, at medium, 92 CRI. The high output is not sustainable for more than a minute or so as the light gets very warm (I am using the red 3500mAh 10A Panasonic cells). I am very happy with my purchase this far.


----------



## akuu

That is definitely some kind of crack. It's pretty obvious if you look closely against the sunlight, also really hard to capture via phone camera. The question is how deep the crack is, whether it's just the white top surface of the board, and how will it affect durability (which probably nobody can answer anyway  )


----------



## jtblue

JoeRodge said:


> I'm really frustrated with Zebralight. I've made threads and mentioned it here...but this thing has destroyed 3 of my 18650 cells. Yes, it'd a new version with 5 pogo pins on both sides.
> 
> Two of the batteries can't even hold a charge anymore (the two that have damage to the negative end of the cell)
> 
> A few people have suggested using gaskets without naming any specific sized gasket. What frustrates me the most is that Zebralight has ignored me after my first message of my concern. My second message was about possible preventing the issue. It's been many days without a response.
> 
> I love the light but this will probably be my last. If I can't drop a 100 dollar flashlight off my couch and onto the floor, if I can't drop it whole under a car, it's useless.



I mentioned a few posts before you that I had dropped my ZL bezel down from about a meter and until I read your post I never even thought to check my battery for damage. So after a quick inspection I too found that the top of my battery is a little dented.

I have an SC64, which has 5 pogo pins at the head and a coil spring on the cap. I'll play around with some o-rings at work and see which size fits best while still allowing the battery enough clearance to make contact. I acknowledge that this is less than ideal and will contact ZL in regards to this.

Also note that I used a NCR18650GA battery.


----------



## jtblue

akuu said:


> That is definitely some kind of crack. It's pretty obvious if you look closely against the sunlight, also really hard to capture via phone camera. The question is how deep the crack is, whether it's just the white top surface of the board, and how will it affect durability (which probably nobody can answer anyway  )



I'd contact ZL about it, better safe than sorry!


----------



## akuu

Does anyone own SC5 mk I and mk II?
I'd love to know whether the body and tailcap thickness (their walls, not overall diameter) are the same, and if not how much they differ.


----------



## Ned-L

ven said:


> I think the sc62d just pips the others, lowest output(or near enough lowest) at 320lm(think the sc53w is of similar lumens). Just like the design, feel, beam and colour temp/tint of the luxeon T. The sc600 plus 5k and HI i seem to like around the same. The sc63w is a floody 4500k beam of usefulness for me and the sc62 6300k is a clean white . So a little variety in there as everyone is either different temp, domed, HI or LED to keep things fresh. My least fav is the sc53w, still more yellow than i like from the hateful xp-l2(yes i hate that LED) and AA is not really my fav form factor...............even less so in a ZL as the 18650 are compact enough with far more benefits. I am going to spend some time with the sc53w to try and get to like it more. Its not as bad as the xp-l2 4k in the sc5c anyway! I dont care how high the cri is, if the beam is too tinted in any colour. The 85cri luxeon wipes the floor with the 4k and 4.5k xp-l2's in my eyes and use..............not even close, even though 8-10 cri less. Of course thats just my opinion, so take with a pinch of salt. I am sure if your ambient lighting or what your eyes are adapted to suits the xp-l2, you wont have the same complaints as me(YELLLLOOOOOOOOOWWWWW)



My last ZL purchase was the sc62d. I like it a lot, but am seriously tempted by the slightly smaller size and increased output of the sc64. I am leaning towards the sc64w (sadly it appears to be backordered). Any thoughts/suggestions in deciding which version to get?


----------



## ven

Ned-L said:


> My last ZL purchase was the sc62d. I like it a lot, but am seriously tempted by the slightly smaller size and increased output of the sc64. I am leaning towards the sc64w (sadly it appears to be backordered). Any thoughts/suggestions in deciding which version to get?



I have the sc63w, so pretty much the same except older UI and a few less lumens. Still the xhp35 4500k which is a tad rosy on my zebra. Really like it, certainly more flood bias than throw . I am not a fan of the xp-l2 at all(c version iirc), so that i will not be getting at any time. 

Size wise there is really not much in it at all, yes sc63/64 smaller. I actually prefer the sc62 body/design and in hand feel over the newer version.


----------



## Ned-L

Ven: would it be comfortable carrying the sc64w loose in the front pocket of a pair of khaki pants? I mostly wear dress khaki pants to work and found that the sc62d feels just a little too bulky loose in front pants pockets. For shorts and casual pants I like clipping it in my front pocket or side pen/knife pocket.


----------



## ven

Ned-L said:


> Ven: would it be comfortable carrying the sc64w loose in the front pocket of a pair of khaki pants? I mostly wear dress khaki pants to work and found that the sc62d feels just a little too bulky loose in front pants pockets. For shorts and casual pants I like clipping it in my front pocket or side pen/knife pocket.



No scales and without looking up their weight, in hand compared they feel very similar. I would be very surprised if there would be a difference in front pocket between them.There is literally a 4mm difference(eye measured) in length, head/ body are of similar diameter. If you cant get on with the sc62d, i cant see the sc64w working any better IMO. If its more brightness required, it sure has a noticeable difference. In hand swapping the lights around, you can tell/feel the 4mm difference a little. 

Could always try out one, you will like it, also the other could be as a back up. If its not for you or not enough difference, easily sell on.


----------



## emarkd

akuu said:


> Does anyone own SC5 mk I and mk II?
> I'd love to know whether the body and tailcap thickness (their walls, not overall diameter) are the same, and if not how much they differ.



Sorry, I haven't checked in here in a few days so I'm just seeing this, but I've got both lights. The short answer is that the newer light has slightly thinner walls. My micrometer has a dead battery so I can't be specific, but here's some pics:

The two bodies, 1st gen on the left, mk2 on the right:





The two tailcaps, where the difference is more noticeable. Same orientation:





End-to-end comparison. Still first-gen on the left:





Tailcap swap:


----------



## ven

Very interesting Mark, thanks for sharing  I presume zebra's changes are to save grams , lighter,compact as possible(well even though the mk1/2 sc5 are little chunks).


----------



## guardrail

guardrail said:


> After being in contact with ZL, I have now sent the two lights back to them for a refund.



Follow up on the light leakage through switch buttons:
I returned the first two lights to ZL. 
After that I ordered from NKON.nl instead (due to avoid the new China customs here in Sweden). 
Same thing on those two lights (SC64w and H53Fw); smaller leakage but still not solid black switch buttons. In addition to that the SC64w suddenly died and refused turn on ever again. I returned both lights to NKON. 
The SC64w was explained to be dead because of the chip. 
After receiving two handpicked replacement lights from NKON, I now have them both with fully solid switch buttons  Both are great lights.


----------



## Ned-L

Does anyone EDC the SC63 or SC64 loose in their front pants pocket? I suspect that the SC64 may be the perfect 18650 light to EDC. I have the SC62d and find it just a tiny bit too bulky to EDC loose in front pants pocket, which I have to do when wearing certain dressier pants. I am hoping that the SC64, which I know is only marginally shorter (and appears to be just a little less bulky in the head), would be comfortable when carried loose. Thanks for your opinion.


----------



## JoeRodge

jtblue said:


> I mentioned a few posts before you that I had dropped my ZL bezel down from about a meter and until I read your post I never even thought to check my battery for damage. So after a quick inspection I too found that the top of my battery is a little dented.
> 
> I have an SC64, which has 5 pogo pins at the head and a coil spring on the cap. I'll play around with some o-rings at work and see which size fits best while still allowing the battery enough clearance to make contact. I acknowledge that this is less than ideal and will contact ZL in regards to this.
> 
> Also note that I used a NCR18650GA battery.



They offered me not a single solution. Pretty frustrated.


----------



## Tixx

Ned-L said:


> Does anyone EDC the SC63 or SC64 loose in their front pants pocket? I suspect that the SC64 may be the perfect 18650 light to EDC. I have the SC62d and find it just a tiny bit too bulky to EDC loose in front pants pocket, which I have to do when wearing certain dressier pants. I am hoping that the SC64, which I know is only marginally shorter (and appears to be just a little less bulky in the head), would be comfortable when carried loose. Thanks for your opinion.



Yes, I do (SC64) and it is one of my top EDC lights.


----------



## Lou Minescence

I just bought a SC600w IV HI and a couple Sony VTC6 batteries from Zebralight yesterday. When I try to run the light on it’s highest output it cuts out using either of the fully charged VTC6 batteries. I can run the light perfectly on it’s highest output on the Sanyo NCR18650GA batteries I have. The Sony VTC6 batteries work perfectly in my other high output lights including my SC600w MkIV plus.
I think the pogo pins of the SC600 HI do not make a good enough contact on the 6.5mm flat positive end of the Sony battery. The Sanyo battery has an 8mm flat area at the positive end. 
Any similar experiences out there ?


----------



## markr6

Lou Minescence said:


> I just bought a SC600w IV HI and a couple Sony VTC6 batteries from Zebralight yesterday. When I try to run the light on it’s highest output it cuts out using either of the fully charged VTC6 batteries. I can run the light perfectly on it’s highest output on the Sanyo NCR18650GA batteries I have. The Sony VTC6 batteries work perfectly in my other high output lights including my SC600w MkIV plus.
> I think the pogo pins of the SC600 HI do not make a good enough contact on the 6.5mm flat positive end of the Sony battery. The Sanyo battery has an 8mm flat area at the positive end.
> Any similar experiences out there ?



Me and another user had the same experience, but it happened with several 18650GA batteries. At first it only seemed to do it in cold weather, but I was able to produce it at room temp as well. It happened most of the time starting on high, so I returned it and got another. No issues with the replacement.

Test it some more with the 18650GA to make sure it works every time. If so, I guess you can blame the sony cells.


----------



## Lou Minescence

markr6 said:


> Me and another user had the same experience, but it happened with several 18650GA batteries. At first it only seemed to do it in cold weather, but I was able to produce it at room temp as well. It happened most of the time starting on high, so I returned it and got another. No issues with the replacement.
> 
> Test it some more with the 18650GA to make sure it works every time. If so, I guess you can blame the sony cells.



Thank you. I will be testing the light for the next couple days. If I have a hint that theres is still a problem with the light it goes back as a return.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

markr6 said:


> Me and another user had the same experience, but it happened with several 18650GA batteries. At first it only seemed to do it in cold weather, but I was able to produce it at room temp as well. It happened most of the time starting on high, so I returned it and got another. No issues with the replacement.
> 
> Test it some more with the 18650GA to make sure it works every time. If so, I guess you can blame the sony cells.



Yes, on my light, I have the same issue in cold weather when the battery gets down to about 50% charged. H1 will shut off within seconds when the light is cold (near freezing). I've had it happen with 30Q's and GA's. I tried a VTC6, but didn't use it in cold enough conditions for the problem to occur.

I thought about returning it, but the hassle isn't worth it. I really like the tint, and the problem only happens in cold weather with a partially discharged cell. I can get it to work in the cold if I warm up the light (either by keeping it in a pocket near me, or by using H2 for awhile until it warms up).

The comment about pogo pins sounds interesting, but I'm not sure that's the issue. I think it likely has something to do with a cold battery not delivering enough current at a high enough voltage for the driver to power H1. Sometime (probably next winter), I'll see if the VTC6 has the same problem. I suspect it will.

The issue is a little annoying, but it's not a deal-breaker. Sending it back for repair now would be futile, since there's no way they could reproduce the issue.

I'd be interested to know if most SC600w MkIV HI's have the same problem in cold weather. You need it to be below freezing for the problem to be easily reproducible, so that may not be possible now. Sticking it in the freezer didn't do it for me, though perhaps my battery wasn't drained enough. Maybe I'll give that a try with a drained VTC6.


----------



## markr6

Mine did it on a fresh battery at 4.20v, about 1 second after turning it on. In the cold, then I noticed the temp didn't matter. I was within the 30-day period so I just swapped it for a new one.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

markr6 said:


> Mine did it on a fresh battery at 4.20v, about 1 second after turning it on. In the cold, then I noticed the temp didn't matter. I was within the 30-day period so I just swapped it for a new one.



Have you tried your new one in very cold conditions, with a 50% drained battery?

I'm running a freezer test now with a VTC6 at 3.75v (about 50% drained). After 1 hour in -20C conditions, I couldn't reproduce the problem. I'll leave it another 2 or 3 hours to make sure it's good and frozen, then try again.

In real-world conditions, it happens at around freezing or maybe slightly below (so much warmer than my freezer) with a 50% drained cell. But, I was using Sanyo GA and Samsung 30Q. Maybe the VTC6 is better in the cold?


----------



## markr6

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Have you tried your new one in very cold conditions, with a 50% drained battery?
> 
> I'm running a freezer test now with a VTC6 at 3.75v (about 50% drained). After 1 hour in -20C conditions, I couldn't reproduce the problem. I'll leave it another 2 or 3 hours to make sure it's good and frozen, then try again.
> 
> In real-world conditions, it happens at around freezing or maybe slightly below (so much warmer than my freezer) with a 50% drained cell. But, I was using Sanyo GA and Samsung 30Q. Maybe the VTC6 is better in the cold?



Yeah I put it through the wringer winter camping and hiking. Same old NCR18650GA I always use. Great light!!


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Okay, a couple more hours in the freezer, and the light works fine on H1. It has to be frozen down close to -20 degrees, which should be cold enough. Maybe I'll try it with a 30Q or GA again, but make sure this time to use a 50% discharged one. I'll have to discharge one, first.

Or, maybe the problem is more complex than just a cold light and partially discharged cell. Or random? Though, I don't think it's random, because it's 100% reproducible in freezing weather outside (at least for awhile, until the light heats up from use).

In any case, the VTC6 works well, even with the freezer test. I'm thinking it's probably a better cell than the GA to use in Zebralights anyway, if you use the light on maximum a lot. Total run time might be longer. If you use medium and low modes a lot, then the GA would be better for sure.


----------



## Lou Minescence

I was offering the pogo pin contact as a possible cause of my light cutting out because the size of the flat contact area on the top of the GA and VTC6 was the only noticeable difference I could find. I measured it too and there was a difference. Next thing to measure would be the actual spread of the pogo pins inside the light. Im going to try to find a way to measure it.
It was a cool night when I tried the light, but upper 30’s. Then again the VTR6 batteries worked fine in other lights.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Lou Minescence said:


> I was offering the pogo pin contact as a possible cause of my light cutting out because the size of the flat contact area on the top of the GA and VTC6 was the only noticeable difference I could find. I measured it too and there was a difference. Next thing to measure would be the actual spread of the pogo pins inside the light. Im going to try to find a way to measure it.
> It was a cool night when I tried the light, but upper 30’s. Then again the VTR6 batteries worked fine in other lights.



It's possible. But for me, I've had the issue with 30Q and GA cells, and not the VTC6 (not yet anyway). These were all bought from Illum, so I'm pretty sure they're genuine cells. Maybe the pins don't work as well in the cold?

I'm not sure why I can't reproduce the problem by freezing my light in the freezer. Maybe using the light outside bumps it around, and that has something to do with contact? I'm really just guessing now.

I tried a freezer test (-20C) with an old laptop cell, and surprisingly the light worked fine with it. It was almost fully charged, though. I'll try some more freezer tests tomorrow, with 50% depleted cells.

I first notice the problem (outside in cold weather) when the battery drops to about 3.85v, which is when the flashlight's battery indicator goes from 4 flashes down to 3 flashes. And only if I haven't used the light for about 15 minutes or so, and kept in a cold outside pocket. Then, it shuts off from H1 all the time, until it warms up a bit if I use H2 or M1. Or if I bring it indoors, where it works fine again.


----------



## ven

As cold cells don’t perform as well as say a more general temp(10- 20oC type temps). Could it not be the actual cold having a more pronounced effect on the voltage sag under load(H1). Just thoughts of course.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

ven said:


> As cold cells don’t perform as well as say a more general temp(10- 20oC type temps). Could it not be the actual cold having a more pronounced effect on the voltage sag under load(H1). Just thoughts of course.



That's certainly possible, and maybe that's why I haven't reproduced the issue with the (better) VTC6 cells.

Does anyone know what happens when the battery suddenly drops below the "low voltage cutoff"? I know what it does at room-temperature operation: the light steps down to medium (around 2.9v on my light), then goes until the voltage drops too low again, then drops to low, then eventually shuts off at some level around 2.7v (but I've never let it go that far).

What happens when it shuts off? Because, when the cold-weather problem shuts the light off in H1, it goes into a strange state. The light isn't "off" as it normally is when you shut it off. In order to turn the light back on, I first have to click the button once, then click it again to turn on. In other words, I have to first "really shut it off", even though the LED is already out.

Is that how the low-voltage-shutoff is supposed to work? If so, then perhaps the battery sags so much in cold weather that it bypasses the "drop a level down" sequence and goes right into "shut this thing off to protect the battery".

Just a thought. There's probably something weird with the driver too, but a high-drain cell seems to mask it.


----------



## Romanko

Just got sc600w mk4 Plus. The light goes through the button and the beam is ugly, it has white point in the centre when you look on white wall. Will try to get SC600w Mk IV.


----------



## Zak

> it has white point in the centre when you look on white wall



A hotspot? I think that's normal and generally considered desirable.

The XHP50.2, and other Cree emitters from the same generation are known for unattractive beams, but it's usually not the hotspot people complain about.


----------



## holygeez03

The MKIV Plus has a rather ugly beam in High mode when pointed at a wall in close proximity due to the tint-shift... this is NOT a light that excels at indoor use and there is rarely a reason to be using High mode in such tight quarters... the light is best suited for outdoor use (or maybe in a large wareheouse), however, it is still completely serviceable when indoors due to its large hotspot and lower modes.

The more I use the plus, the more I have come to appreciate it... and it is quickly becoming a favorite along side my H52Fw and SC62w.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Over the past day, I've tried to reproduce the "SC600w MkIV HI shuts off in H1 when cold" problem. This is a problem I can reliably reproduce in winter conditions, when the battery is about 50% discharged and cold.

I've been trying to reproduce it, to see if it is a battery issue, by freezing it in a freezer at -20C for 2 hours.

Unfortunately, no luck. I have never been able to reproduce it using a freezer test. I have no idea why this would be different than outside in winter.

I have tried a Sony VTC6, Samsung 30Q, Sanyo GA, and even an old laptop cell from a pull. All cells worked fine at about 50% discharged, with the exception of the old laptop cell which would step-down to medium. That is completely expected, though, considering the voltage sag at -20C an old low-drain cell would experience.

I have experienced the "off from H1" issue with the GA and 30Q battery in winter. Never tried the VTC6 in winter.

So, I'm at a loss to explain why this occurs outside, but not in a freezer. I'm even using thick gloves to turn it on, to minimize any warming my hands might give the light. Anyone have an explanation? The only differences I can think of is wind, and lightly bumping around in a pocket. But I'm not sure why that would have any effect.


----------



## markr6

It seems like if the battery wasn't providing enough current, it would just step down like you mentioned with the old laptop cell. This happens on high to medium, medium to low, etc. for all the Zebralights I've had (AA, 18650, and 14500). Never simply turning off completely. I still feel like it's a problem with the electronics. I haven't had any problems with my replacement light even after using it a lot.


----------



## holygeez03

Maybe the freezer is getting the battery much colder than the winter temps? So cold that the problem doesn't occur? Just a thought...


----------



## akuu

@emarkd
Thanks for detailed description and photos. I'm very grateful 

Curious thing, I've asked Zebralights the same question, because I thought nobody would answer  They told me SC5 mk1 and mk2 share exactly the same tailcaps :thinking: Well maybe they do now...


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

holygeez03 said:


> Maybe the freezer is getting the battery much colder than the winter temps? So cold that the problem doesn't occur? Just a thought...




Hmmm, I guess I could try the refrigerator, to see if I can reproduce it. Outside, the temps were between about -10C and freezing.

I agree with Mark that I think it's an electronics issue, but what I'm not sure of is whether it is a rare problem or something wide-spread. For me, it takes specific conditions to reproduce it (temperature of the light, and battery level, and maybe something else). If mine is a common issue, I suspect 99% of people would never encounter it.

Mark's issue seems to suggest it is rare, but he was having it occur in warm conditions too. Mark, did it happen at all battery levels, or just when it gets to about half-drained?


----------



## markr6

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Mark's issue seems to suggest it is rare, but he was having it occur in warm conditions too. Mark, did it happen at all battery levels, or just when it gets to about half-drained?



I can't give exact figures but it would have been between a fresh 4.20v down to about 3.60v - the range I usually keep my cells if possible.


----------



## pipspeak

holygeez03 said:


> The SC32 is currently in stock... the SC32w is out-of-stock.



Anyone know if ZL is planning to release new CR123 lights any time soon? The H32/SC32 date from 2014 IIRC and it doesn't seem like the 'w' versions will ever be available again (I sent ZL a message asking... yet to hear back).


----------



## llmercll

http://www.zebralight.com/SC600Fd-Mk-IV-Plus-18650-XHP50-Floody-5000K-High-CRI-Flashlight_p_227.html
http://www.zebralight.com/SC600Fc-Mk-IV-Plus-18650-XHP50-Floody-4000K-High-CRI-Flashlight_p_228.html

The description for these says cool white, but color temp is allegedly 4000-5000k. The cool white part is an error right?


----------



## holygeez03

I don't see the word "cool" one either one of the linked pages...


----------



## ven

holygeez03 said:


> I don't see the word "cool" one either one of the linked pages...



Zebralight are on the ball, it did show cool white as i checked. They have edited since.....................good stuff!


----------



## NPL

Sort of on the ball... 

They haven't posted runtimes of most of their new lights that have been in stock for quite a while now. Worries me that runtimes might not be as good as expected. Otherwise, why such a delay?


----------



## Ned-L

Just received my new SC64w. Thanks to all the good programming suggestions in this thread, I programmed it as follows:  G6 group: L1 0.92, L2 2.9, M1 264, M2 1400, H1 56.4 H2 127. No accidentally turning it on in high when I wanted moonlight.


----------



## markr6

markr6 said:


> Yeah I put it through the wringer winter camping and hiking. Same old NCR18650GA I always use. Great light!!



Uh oh! Did I speak too soon? Last night I turned this on and POOF! It turned right off like before. I continued to use it for a few minutes, turning it off and on and couldn't reproduce it. Keeping an eye on this one now.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

markr6 said:


> Uh oh! Did I speak too soon? Last night I turned this on and POOF! It turned right off like before. I continued to use it for a few minutes, turning it off and on and couldn't reproduce it. Keeping an eye on this one now.



I'm starting to think that this is a common problem with the SC600w MkIV HI, when batteries get down to about 50% charge. I presume your light wasn't cold (which is when I have my problems), but I don't think it's a coincidence that once your light heated up a bit, you never saw the issue again.

Anyone have a similar issue with the SC600w MkIV Plus? I'm thinking of getting that one next, but I'll wait until they sort out these issues if it's also an issue with other models.


----------



## Lou Minescence

Im back to report about my SC600w MKIV HI after a few days of use.
No problems at all running NCR18650GA.
I put my VT6 in it and turned the light on. It stayed on while on max output but I could see some slight flickering in the beam. I put the NCR18650GA back in and the flickering stopped.
I don’t mind keeping my light and only using NCR18650GA batteries but I don’t want to have a problem light in the future.


----------



## Lou Minescence

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> I'm starting to think that this is a common problem with the SC600w MkIV HI, when batteries get down to about 50% charge. I presume your light wasn't cold (which is when I have my problems), but I don't think it's a coincidence that once your light heated up a bit, you never saw the issue again.
> 
> Anyone have a similar issue with the SC600w MkIV Plus? I'm thinking of getting that one next, but I'll wait until they sort out these issues if it's also an issue with other models.



I have the plus model and no problems so far. I have not run the battery very low in it yet.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

I lubricated the pogo pins with Deoxit Gold, just in case it has anything to do with battery contact. I guess I'll know next winter!

Those pins really don't compress much at all. One or two were a bit stiff, but I doubt it affects anything. Although I haven't had any issues with the pogo pins in other Zebralights either, I still wish they stuck with springs. Maybe with a spring bypass, if resistance is an issue. The SC600 series isn't going for minimum size anyway, so an extra 1mm or 2mm for a spring design shouldn't be an issue.


----------



## holygeez03

I haven't had my MKIV Plus battery (GA) down to 50% yeah, but I will let it.

A SC600w Plus with a spring/bypass and a larger head/reflector would be preferable to me.


----------



## markr6

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> I'm starting to think that this is a common problem with the SC600w MkIV HI, when batteries get down to about 50% charge. I presume your light wasn't cold (which is when I have my problems), but I don't think it's a coincidence that once your light heated up a bit, you never saw the issue again.



Cell was at 4.19v. Fresh off the shelf unused for a few days. Same with the old light - every time it happened the cells were usually 90%, sometimes about 70%+. I never get my lights down to 50% or even close that I recall. And I wouldn't say that it ever "warmed up", since the light only turns on for about 1/2 second. Then I turn it back on and it's always fine then.

So with this first incident on my new light, and dozens with the old returned light, it always works fine after turning on the second time immediately after shutting itself off. Room temp, charged cells.


----------



## BAreEhD

Hi everyone,

Yesterday I received my SC64W from Zebralight. I'm experiencing something that seems strange to me so I thought I'd bounce it off you all.

When I double click from off to get to M1, I get a very brief flash to H1 before it goes down to M1. Is this normal? I would have thought a double click would get me directly to M1 rather than going through H1 first, if even for a fraction of a second.

Thanks!


----------



## Keitho

"preflash" when going to medium is a normal behavior. A lot of folks program to avoid it: put a low or moonlight mode in place of "high," so the preflash is at a lower (and therefore unnoticeable) level than your double-click ("medium") setting. A lot of people seem to have at least one group set up this way: press/hold for high, double-click for medium, single click to moonlight.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Keitho said:


> "preflash" when going to medium is a normal behavior. A lot of folks program to avoid it: put a low or moonlight mode in place of "high," so the preflash is at a lower (and therefore unnoticeable) level than your double-click ("medium") setting. A lot of people seem to have at least one group set up this way: press/hold for high, double-click for medium, single click to moonlight.



Or just do a long-press for about 1.5 seconds to go to medium. That avoids the pre-flash from going through high.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

markr6 said:


> Cell was at 4.19v. Fresh off the shelf unused for a few days. Same with the old light - every time it happened the cells were usually 90%, sometimes about 70%+. I never get my lights down to 50% or even close that I recall. And I wouldn't say that it ever "warmed up", since the light only turns on for about 1/2 second. Then I turn it back on and it's always fine then.
> 
> So with this first incident on my new light, and dozens with the old returned light, it always works fine after turning on the second time immediately after shutting itself off. Room temp, charged cells.



Yours seems to be related to mine, but with different triggers. With me, it's only when the light is (very) cold and the battery 50% drained. After that, it happens every single time, until I warm up the light (either by using other modes, or by bringing the light indoors). I suspect the cause is the same.

This is a total guess, but I wonder if it has something to do with a capacitor or coil that has to be charged up before the light works normally. Maybe in some circumstances, it takes too long (i.e., microseconds) to charge up those components before the microprocessor turns on and tries to light up the emitter.


----------



## markr6

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> This is a total guess, but I wonder if it has something to do with a capacitor or coil that has to be charged up before the light works normally. Maybe in some circumstances, it takes too long (i.e., microseconds) to charge up those components before the microprocessor turns on and tries to light up the emitter.



I don't know much about electronics, but something about a capacitor did come to mind. Something in the electronics isn't quite right.


----------



## BAreEhD

Keitho said:


> "preflash" when going to medium is a normal behavior. A lot of folks program to avoid it: put a low or moonlight mode in place of "high," so the preflash is at a lower (and therefore unnoticeable) level than your double-click ("medium") setting. A lot of people seem to have at least one group set up this way: press/hold for high, double-click for medium, single click to moonlight.


Thanks very much. I'll look into what the best options are for programming.


----------



## Fireclaw18

Zak said:


> A hotspot? I think that's normal and generally considered desirable.
> 
> The XHP50.2, and other Cree emitters from the same generation are known for unattractive beams, but it's usually not the hotspot people complain about.


My SC600w IV Plus' beam isn't bad. But the tint could be better.

I'm a bit surprised that the tint in my Eagtac DX3b mini is so much better than the Zebralight. The Eagtac's tint is slightly rosy with no hint of green. Both use CREE XHP 50.2 emitters. Looks like Eagtac got a better batch of emitters.


----------



## BAreEhD

Looks like Zebralight has finally posted SC64 runtimes. Here they are for the SC64W:

High: H1 1400 Lm (PID, 2.8 hrs) or H2 875 Lm (PID, 2.9 hrs)/502 Lm (PID, 3.2 hrs)/264 Lm (6.3 hrs)

Medium: M1 127 Lm (13.8 hrs) or M2 56.4 Lm (28 hrs)/22.9Lm (2.8 days)/8.5 Lm (7.3 days)

Low: L1 2.9 Lm (18.5 days) or L2 0.92 Lm (1.5 months)/0.26 Lm (3 months)/0.07 Lm (4 months)

Beacon Strobe Mode: 0.2Hz Beacon at Low / 0.2Hz Beacon at H1 / 4Hz Strobe at H1 / 19Hz Strobe at H1


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

I don't know why the runtimes of the SC64w would be different than the SC600w, except for the PID levels of course. So why are they different for the other levels? They use the same LED. Don't they use the same driver? Output levels are all the same, so shouldn't the runtimes be the same too?


----------



## BAreEhD

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> I don't know why the runtimes of the SC64w would be different than the SC600w, except for the PID levels of course. So why are they different for the other levels? They use the same LED. Don't they use the same driver? Output levels are all the same, so shouldn't the runtimes be the same too?


Yeah I noticed the runtimes are longer than anticipated. I'm also curious as to the reason why.


----------



## Tixx

Keitho said:


> "preflash" when going to medium is a normal behavior. A lot of folks program to avoid it: put a low or moonlight mode in place of "high," so the preflash is at a lower (and therefore unnoticeable) level than your double-click ("medium") setting. A lot of people seem to have at least one group set up this way: press/hold for high, double-click for medium, single click to moonlight.



Yeah, flipped mine like that to take care of the pre-flash and make sure my first click was to my moonlight.


----------



## RTTR

So I'm going to pull the trigger on my first ZL, been following this company for some time now and the SC64 really seems like the ticket for me.

Two questions. 64W or 64C? I feel the HI CRI 4000k just might be a tad too yellow for my tastes but is that bad? 
other question is, which battery do they prefer, the Sanyo or Sony that ZL sells?

Ive never been that picky about tint, I will say that that I had an XP-G 4Sevens years ago with the greenest output ive ever seen in my life, it went back. Are the odds that bad with the most recent ZLs?


----------



## holygeez03

Unless you are very picky about your light quality (as in you probably need to be photography-minded)... I would go for the 64w... that way you won't be in situations and wonder "what if I had 500 more lumens available?"... and if you don't have other high CRI lights to compare to, you probably won't notice as much.

I have a 62w and it's one of my favorite lights by far... I have not found a need (yet) to upgrade to the 63 or 64... I have a couple high CRI lights for specific uses, but a good neutral tint/temp with lots of lumens is just fine for 99% of tasks. I would recommend a frosted or flood ZL headlamp (H53Fc of H600Fc) with high CRI to complement your SC64 and use it as a headlamp, handheld light, or angled worklight for close-up work.

From what I have read, ZL has been getting better about tints and LEDs in general seem to be getting better. That being said... it never hurts to add a comment to your order of "please pick a very neutral tint"... it may not help, but you never know.

I have no experience with the Sony battery, but I'm sure it works fine... the Sanyo GA has served me well in my 62w and MKIV Plus and I am always amazed how much capacity is still left when I check... unless one of the resident experts on here says otherwise, I would go for the 3500 mAh.


----------



## ven

I would also go for the W version, the 4500k xhp35 is a much safer choice tint wise. I have tried a few samples of the xp-l2 ,4000-4500k and not impressed. I have found the 4500k easier on the eye, but the 4000k off for me. I don’t even think the CRI is as high as stated either. The xhp35 is around 80 CRI iirc, but it is nice . I personally don’t see the point in high CRI when it taints lighter colours with the yellow beam....yuk! The older xm-l2 easywhite seems a much safer choice(and nicer). The Philips luxeon T is also very nice around 85 CRI(lower output though if an issue........quality before quataty for me). 

As as long as flat top, 30Q and vtc6 work very well in the ZL’s.


----------



## RTTR

Very excited I pulled the trigger and purchased my first ZL, rather my first major light purchase in a few years. Went 64W and Sanyo 18650ga


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

The Sanyo GA battery is the best choice, unless perhaps you're going to be running at max all the time.

Testing run-time of the SC600w MkIV HI at the 264 lumen output (the highest non-PID level), I get the following times before step-down occurs:

Sanyo GA: 6.6 hours
Sony VTC6: 5.8 hours
Samsung 30Q: 5.5 hours

It's clear the 3500mAh Sanyo GA is by far the best performer at moderate output levels. 14% longer than the VTC6, and 20% longer than the 30Q.

I've ordered a SC600w MkIV Plus, but I'll probably use the Sony VTC6 in that one due to the higher current demands at maximum compared to other Zebralights. I think the GA would probably still run slightly longer at max, but it would probably run hotter. For all other Zebralights, I'd go with the Sanyo GA.


----------



## twistedraven

From what I've heard the XPPL2 4000k can be quite yellow, but really it all boils down to the tint lotto. The frosted H600C with XHP50.2 has a tint equally as good as the old 5000k XML2 easywhite. I bought 3 samples and none showed strong yellow/green bias.

XHP35 HI models are pretty safe, especially considering with the flat emitter you will mitigate tint shift within the beam pattern itself.


----------



## NPL

I have the H53c with 90cri xpl2 4000k led. It is more yellow than a 4000k 219c, but still fine in actual use. White wall hunters will be disappointed, but for everything else, color saturation and rendering is great. The 4500k w series from Zebralight will be alot more neutral, but colors will look a little more dull when compared to the 4000k high CRI versions. The xp-l2 is noticeably better than the xpg3 high CRI in 4000k.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Tachead said:


> It is only the positive terminal that is really weak. Although I does look like the negative can be dented too. It takes a fall on the head to dent the positive badly generally. When I dropped my SC64c on its head last week it dented my VTC6 quite badly. It was so dented it would no longer make contact on any of my chargers. Luckily, a little careful prying with a small screwdriver quickly fixed the problem.




I'm trying a solution on my Zebralights with pogo pins to hopefully prevent dented battery terminals if I drop them. So far, I haven't experienced any issue with dents, but why wait?

I bought some cheap adhesive cardboard rings for 18650 terminal insulators. I think they were about $1 for 200 of them. I stacked them over the positive terminal of my batteries, so that the positive terminal is now recessed. the pogo pins can still contact it, but hopefully the cardboard rings will take some of the shock if I drop the light.

I used 6 rings, stacked on each other, for a Sanyo GA battery. Its positive terminal is slightly raised, so I needed a thick stack of rings to make it recessed. I use 4 stacked rings on the Sony VCT6 and Samsung 30Q.








So far, I haven't noticed any downsides. The rings are slightly wider than 18mm, so they do make the battery fit more snug, but there's no problem getting the battery out of the lights. I could trim off a thin edge, but I don't think I need to.

As for the upside, I haven't noticed any. But, I don't plan to do a drop-test to find out!


----------



## Fireclaw18

Looks like a good idea WalkIntoTheLight!

Sure you don't want to conduct that drop test for us? FOR SCIENCE!!!!


----------



## Lou Minescence

Maybe we should set up a ‘go fund me’ account just in case...


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Heh. Well, it's bound to happen sooner or later. I've dropped every one of my AA Zebras many times. The SC5w has pogo pins, but I'm guessing it's not as hard on Eneloops as the 18650 Zebras, since there's zero denting. But I've never dropped an 18650 Zebra yet (at least, not from any significant height), which is odd because they're probably easier to drop. Maybe it's the better knurling on the SC600 series?

On a slightly different subject, does anyone know if the SC600w MkIV Plus is built for a lot of shaking? I imagine it must be, and I'm going to be using it almost exclusively as a bike light. On trails, it's going to get a lot of bumping and shaking. I never had a problem with a BLF A6, and I presume the SC600 must be a lot tougher. Has anyone used them in extreme shock conditions, such as a light mounted on a rifle?


----------



## Nichia!

Malkoff flashlights for bike


----------



## Keitho

My normal bike commute lighting is an SC64C on my helmet, and an sc600fc IV on my bar. I use cheap mounts, so they've hit the ground a few times. Amazing anodize and potting did their job, no ill effects--still pump out tons of beautiful light with amazing efficiency. I'm close to 20,000 miles with ZL on board in the past few years, can't see using anything else (well, except for my M43 to show off on my mtb).


----------



## Random Dan

Keitho said:


> My normal bike commute lighting is an SC64C on my helmet, and an sc600fc IV on my bar. I use cheap mounts, so they've hit the ground a few times. Amazing anodize and potting did their job, no ill effects--still pump out tons of beautiful light with amazing efficiency. I'm close to 20,000 miles with ZL on board in the past few years, can't see using anything else (well, except for my M43 to show off on my mtb).


Any damage from the pogo pins? I've always run double sprung lights on bicycle because I worry about the shock of hitting a bump or pothole hard. I suppose on a helmet it wouldn't be a problem because your body acts as a shock insulator but on the bars ca get jarred pretty good.


----------



## Keitho

I've got a couple of 18650ga with some denting on the + side, but not enough to affect function, in the light or my chargers.


----------



## JoeRodge

My Zebralight, with the new pogo pins setup, has destroyed 4 of my batteries. I work in tight spaces and it's prone to dropping 2-4 feet. This isn't a practical flashlight for anyone working on cars, RVs or anywhere else you might drop the light. Great for walking the dog and sneaking into the kids room at night to check on them.

Honestly, by the Zebralight hype, it was a huge regret buying one of their lights. I still use it because everything else is perfect. But I wont buy another.

Especially how Zebralight customer service dealt with it, "maybe there is something we can do in a future model." 

It's destroyed two 18650GA and two VTC6. The VTC6 positive terminal held up great. The negative end is smashed in though.


----------



## markr6

JoeRodge said:


> My Zebralight, with the new pogo pins setup, has destroyed 4 of my batteries.



Which light? My SC63 dented the cells pretty bad. The new SC64 on the other hand has more pins at the top, and no damage so far.

Or am I confusing it with the SC600 series? I can't get it straight. Regardless, the 5 pins on the SC64 seem to spread the load nicely.


----------



## JoeRodge

SC600 series. It's got the 6 on top and bottom. Just looked at one of my VTC6 and it has a circular pattern of holes dug into the negative terminal. It's just absurd.

I had one cell damaged when it rolled off the couch.

I love this flashlight but losing 30-35 dollars in cells since about mid November is outrageous. One of the GA cells has had internal damage. It won't hold a charge and it's capacity is gone. I figured out that cell was damaged when I had charged it and used it on high for a few minutes. Went to use it on high the next day and it had dimmed down. Checked the voltage and it was at 3.39.

This is the latest VTC6:


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Wow, that's pretty nasty. Maybe you should try the cardboard ring suggestion I posted above? Sounds like we'd have an answer to whether it works or not, pretty quick from you!


----------



## JoeRodge

I know! I feel like I might be a bit of an extreme case, I admit it lol. I'm gonna order a bunch and try it out. I see them on Amazon. Where did you get your rings?


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

JoeRodge said:


> I know! I feel like I might be a bit of an extreme case, I admit it lol. I'm gonna order a bunch and try it out. I see them on Amazon. Where did you get your rings?



I found them on Ebay. Took about 3 weeks to get here. PM me if you want the link.


----------



## noboneshotdog

JoeRodge said:


> SC600 series. It's got the 6 on top and bottom. Just looked at one of my VTC6 and it has a circular pattern of holes dug into the negative terminal. It's just absurd.
> 
> I had one cell damaged when it rolled off the couch.
> 
> I love this flashlight but losing 30-35 dollars in cells since about mid November is outrageous. One of the GA cells has had internal damage. It won't hold a charge and it's capacity is gone. I figured out that cell was damaged when I had charged it and used it on high for a few minutes. Went to use it on high the next day and it had dimmed down. Checked the voltage and it was at 3.39.
> 
> This is the latest VTC6:



Yup. I have 2 that look exactly the same. I have reserved them for my SC600 only. As it would likely bang up any other batteries I put in it as well.


----------



## markr6

That's bad! I don't even have a scratch on my SC600w IV HI or SC64w. But mine probably don't see as much use as others.


----------



## jackbauer

whats the best zebra light to buy?


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

jackbauer said:


> whats the best zebra light to buy?



Well, the real answer is "all of them!" 

Okay, it really depends on what you intend to use it for, what kind of tint you prefer, and what kind of batteries you're comfortable with.

Personally, my favourite EDC is the SC52w (now sold as the SC53w). It's a small pocketable AA light, plenty bright enough for general purpose use. Alternatively, the slightly more chunky SC5w gives you higher output and more throw, still using a AA battery. (The SC5w is probably my favourite all-time light.)

Step up to an 18650 battery with the SC64w, if you don't mind something a bit more bulky to carry around. Very bright, and long run times. Still very small for an 18650 light, but I personally find 18650 lights to be a bit too bulky for an EDC. Many like it, though.

My favourite outdoor light is the SC600w HI. (It uses an 18650 battery.) Bright, and pretty good throw for a small light. (Zebralight's throwiest light.) It's definitely very pocketable for walks, but I wouldn't want to carry it in my pocket all day.

If you just want sheer output, the SC600w Plus has amazing output for a single-emitter light. It's quite floody (more than any other Zebralight), so only useful for modest distances. Great for seeing a large area all at once. Exact same size as the SC600w HI, so pocketable for walks.

Then there's small stubby Zebralights that run on CR123 batteries, but I have no experience with them. They probably make for a good EDC that is brighter than the AA versions.


----------



## jackbauer

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Well, the real answer is "all of them!"
> 
> Okay, it really depends on what you intend to use it for, what kind of tint you prefer, and what kind of batteries you're comfortable with.
> 
> Personally, my favourite EDC is the SC52w (now sold as the SC53w). It's a small pocketable AA light, plenty bright enough for general purpose use. Alternatively, the slightly more chunky SC5w gives you higher output and more throw, still using a AA battery. (The SC5w is probably my favourite all-time light.)
> 
> Step up to an 18650 battery with the SC64w, if you don't mind something a bit more bulky to carry around. Very bright, and long run times. Still very small for an 18650 light, but I personally find 18650 lights to be a bit too bulky for an EDC. Many like it, though.
> 
> My favourite outdoor light is the SC600w HI. (It uses an 18650 battery.) Bright, and pretty good throw for a small light. (Zebralight's throwiest light.) It's definitely very pocketable for walks, but I wouldn't want to carry it in my pocket all day.
> 
> If you just want sheer output, the SC600w Plus has amazing output for a single-emitter light. It's quite floody (more than any other Zebralight), so only useful for modest distances. Great for seeing a large area all at once. Exact same size as the SC600w HI, so pocketable for walks.
> 
> Then there's small stubby Zebralights that run on CR123 batteries, but I have no experience with them. They probably make for a good EDC that is brighter than the AA versions.



thanks bud. i have a fenix light. also have an emisar D4. I was not happy with how it would step down so fast and burn the battery/dim out and burn my hands lol. was debating to get a d4 ti but decided against it because of how the D4 was even though the brightness was amazing.

so I'm debating between the SC64W and the S600w Plus and SC600w Hi now.


----------



## tech25

Folks here like the SC64w best for edc. It is the slimmest of the three and more comfortable in pocket. That being said, I used to edc the original SC600w which was the biggest of the SC series and didn’t have any issue with it. Downside of the SC64w is it does get hot faster than the other two (the other two have more mass and better heat-sinking). So for performance go for one of the other two. For throw go with the “Hi” and for a flood beam go for the “plus”.


----------



## jackbauer

thanks so now narrowed down to sc600w Hi vs Plus..

how much more throw does Hi have compared to plus.

i think i'm leaning towards plus for the flood.

can you tell me what real life situation would i need throw more than flood?

Edit. I just ordered the Plus because of the Lumens and flood...throw is not as important to me at the moment.


----------



## JoeRodge

Beside the battery issues I've had it's the best light I've ever owned Jack. It's got pretty decent throw for how floody it can appear.

I used to ONLY buy lights that w re 5000k-6500k. That isn't the case anymore. The color and depth of objects seem so perfect in 4500k. Objects up close are less bleached out as well. You can't go wrong with your choice.

Btw, I EDC that same light and, when especially in ****ies, I don't notice it being there. Sometimes I check to see if I lost it.


----------



## drummer132132

I have an H600w MKIII with a pocket clip and find it to be the perfect edc. Standing up you can point it any direction. On its side with the clip in a certain position you can ceiling bounce to illuminate a room. When needed you can then use it as a headlamp. Fits well in the pocket via clip. Springs instead of pogo pin so no damaged batteries. Overall it's excellent. I'm tempted to pick up the H600w MK IV just talking about it [emoji28].


----------



## jackbauer

well so far i had a fenix pd35 tactical, emisar d4...for some reason i saw a zebra light thread and a lot of buzz so i'm going to be the proud owner of the h600w MK4 plus pretty soon can't wait.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

jackbauer said:


> thanks so now narrowed down to sc600w Hi vs Plus..
> 
> how much more throw does Hi have compared to plus.
> 
> i think i'm leaning towards plus for the flood.
> 
> can you tell me what real life situation would i need throw more than flood?
> 
> Edit. I just ordered the Plus because of the Lumens and flood...throw is not as important to me at the moment.



I prefer the SC600w MkIV HI for general-purpose use outdoors. It does have some throw, which is good for my use. But I think you'll be happy with the SC600w MkIV Plus.

I believe the HI has about 20,000 candella, which puts the throw (to 0.25 lux) at 280 meters. I find 1 lux is more practical, so half the "useful" throw to about 140 meters.

As a rough guess, I think the Plus has about 13,000 candella, or about 230 meters of throw. 115 meters of "useful" throw. But because it also creates a lot of light up close, it makes it more difficult to see in the distance. Because it is so bright, it achieves throw simply by powering through it.

I have some trees about 500 meters away I often shine lights on. (Yeah, I'm weird that way.) The HI clearly lights them up, though not at the 0.25 lux level required to say it throws that far. The Plus does not appear to light them up at all. Perhaps it does, but the large hot-spot makes it difficult to see a clear separation between the dark and lighted area?

At moderate distances, the Plus throws far enough. So unless you need to see stuff more than 100 meters away, the Plus should be fine. It has an advantage in creating a large area of light, so you don't need to pan around looking at something. It's definitely the winner at moderate distances (less than 100 meters).

I usually carry a C8 (a small dedicated thrower) specifically for seeing stuff far away, and use a Zebralight for everything else.


----------



## drummer132132

jackbauer said:


> well so far i had a fenix pd35 tactical, emisar d4...for some reason i saw a zebra light thread and a lot of buzz so i'm going to be the proud owner of the h600w MK4 plus pretty soon can't wait.



Headlamp?


----------



## tech25

I believe he meant the *SC*600w mk4 plus.

WalkIntoTheLight- thanks for the breakdown, I personally like a more floody light backed up by a spotter. Most of the time I am using a light nearby and the "bouncing ball" effect annoys me. When I used my SC600w as my edc light, I had a diffuser film sandwiched between the lens and the bezel. I removed the adhesive so it was easy to take off and put into body wrapped around the battery. I did find that I barely took it off.


----------



## RTTR

Years of following the Zebralight company I’m kicking myself for not diving in years ago. Received my first ZL the SC64w today. Couldn’t be anymore happy with it. Tint is what I would call perfect for my taste. The size is shockingly smaller than I thought it would be. I love the pocket clip design, was actually expecting it to be chrome with Philips screws but was happily surprised it’s black with black torx screws. I feel this is gonna be a ZL addition starting now.


----------



## ven

RTTR said:


> Years of following the Zebralight company I’m kicking myself for not diving in years ago. Received my first ZL the SC64w today. Couldn’t be anymore happy with it. Tint is what I would call perfect for my taste. The size is shockingly smaller than I thought it would be. I love the pocket clip design, was actually expecting it to be chrome with Philips screws but was happily surprised it’s black with black torx screws. I feel this is gonna be a ZL addition starting now.




Exactly the same as you RTTR, much following and reading on here, only of late joined the party. Better late than never ................................

Recently away for a little break, couple of the ZL's joined me


----------



## jackbauer

thanks for all of your suggestions and breakdowns. I was reading through as much as I could of the thread and couldn't find a good comparison and you all broke it down for me perfectly. I don't really need a crazy thrower as much as a flooder so the Plus seems perfect for me. I'll probably be adding more to my collection at a later time but for now, this should be a good "EDC", except I don't carry it in my pocket...just have it around home for whenever i need haha.


----------



## jackbauer

I have samsung INR18650 3.6 flat 2500 maH 

and AW Protected 2200 mAH (not flat) 3.7 V IC + Power

which is the better battery for the 600W Plus and can I safely use both?

Thanks


----------



## dmsoule

The current Zebralight models only take flat top unprotected cells, so forget about the second one you mentioned. The Samsung should be fine, but a bit low on capacity compared to the 3000 - 3500mah cells out there.


----------



## JoeRodge

jackbauer said:


> I have samsung INR18650 3.6 flat 2500 maH
> 
> and AW Protected 2200 mAH (not flat) 3.7 V IC + Power
> 
> which is the better battery for the 600W Plus and can I safely use both?
> 
> Thanks



Should of just bought a VTC6 or panasonic 18650GA off their site when you ordered. I love both. Longer run times with the panasonic. But the VTC6 will keep you at maximum output for longer.


----------



## RTTR

I’ve got a question about if I’m understanding PID adjustment on my SC64w correctly.

I understand the basics of it, turn it off from H1, turn it back on to H1, cycle from low to high 6 times, on the 7th I’m stopping on high to add temperature, so I stop on high, and then turn off the light added 1C correct? And I repeat the process all over to add another degree?


----------



## Keitho

I think you've got it rttr, that's what I did. I think i went 8 or 9 cycles each time, to be sure I didn't mis-count.

Without taking careful temp measurements, I have no idea if I actually *did* anything to my light, but it was a "fun" 5 minutes.


----------



## JoeRodge

I could feel the increase in heat on my Plus model. It gets HOT! lol.


----------



## RTTR

Tested around cause I wasn't for sure I was doing it right, I put it to do default, using a Raytek temp gun the SC64w head measured 120.0F before it started regulating. applying +1C a dozen times to make sure it all took, it gets to 133.5F head temp before regulating.. the two other high settings 875 lumens and 500 lumens don't seem to get hot enough under 75 degree ambient temps to cause them to step down, 875 lumens doesn't get above 120F and 109F for 500 lumens.. my personally preferred setting for a good usable high on this light is the 500 lumen setting so it should be good and stable indoors and out.. I can't see myself using the 1400 lumens that much, except a quick burst outside to see further out.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

JoeRodge said:


> I could feel the increase in heat on my Plus model. It gets HOT! lol.



I did the opposite on my Plus. I turned the temperature down. I found it gets too hot otherwise.




RTTR said:


> I can't see myself using the 1400 lumens that much, except a quick burst outside to see further out.



Heh, when outside, the highest mode is too fun _not_ to use a lot.


----------



## tsask

I have been admiring the offerings from Zebralight for several years now. My SC600 w III HI on a rotating holster is my main "go to" EDC. At first I was not too sure about the unprotected 18650 cells, but with Zlight's tech I feel completely safe with it. 

_My most recent Zebralight question is an ongoing discussion here. Which 'new' version should I consider? I know one has more throw, the other has more useful light at close distances etc.....oo:_


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

tsask said:


> I have been admiring the offerings from Zebralight for several years now. My SC600 w III HI on a rotating holster is my main "go to" EDC. At first I was not too sure about the unprotected 18650 cells, but with Zlight's tech I feel completely safe with it.
> 
> _My most recent Zebralight question is an ongoing discussion here. Which 'new' version should I consider? I know one has more throw, the other has more useful light at close distances etc.....oo:_



This year I bought the SC600w MkIV HI and the SC600w MkIV Plus. I think they compliment each other very well. One is good for some moderate throw, the other is great for flood and high output. I considered the SC64w, but it seemed to be a compromise light between the other two. Well, I haven't ruled it out completely, yet.


----------



## tsask

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> This year I bought the SC600w MkIV HI and the SC600w MkIV Plus. I think they compliment each other very well. One is good for some moderate throw, the other is great for flood and high output. I considered the SC64w, but it seemed to be a compromise light between the other two. Well, I haven't ruled it out completely, yet.



*thanks for that info.sounds like what others have said as well.* _Would the Mk IV plus have the same throw as my SC600 III HI? _


----------



## RTTR

How low can an 18650 go while still maintaining the ability for the light to its highest modes? I don't have a light meter to experiment. But say if the SC64 is reporting 1 of 4 flashes of battery life, could I assume its likely not gonna be able to do H1 or probably even highest H2 mode? perhaps the light can still do full output at 2 of 4 flashes?

Maybe someone can chime in with charts of like an SC63 or other current XHP35 Zebralight, showing its output ability based on battery drain voltages.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

tsask said:


> thanks for that info.sounds like what others have said as well. Would the Mk IV plus have the same throw as my SC600 III HI?



No, the Plus doesn't throw as far as the HI. Maybe 75% as far. However, the large flood illuminating the foreground makes it more difficult to see in the distance, so in practical terms it's probably half as far. It's great at moderate distances (out to about 100 meters), though. No panning around needed to see stuff, because the hot spot is quite large.




RTTR said:


> How low can an 18650 go while still maintaining the ability for the light to its highest modes? I don't have a light meter to experiment. But say if the SC64 is reporting 1 of 4 flashes of battery life, could I assume its likely not gonna be able to do H1 or probably even highest H2 mode? perhaps the light can still do full output at 2 of 4 flashes?



The Zebralights use a boost driver, and so are fairly well regulated regardless of battery voltage. It's not perfectly flat regulation, but I don't think you'd notice any drop in brightness with your eyes. I find the Zebralights will continue to output at maximum, until the battery voltage drops between 2.8v and 2.9v. At that point, the light will step-down in brightness.

So, essentially, you'll get full output using almost the full capacity of your 18650. That assumes a decent cell. I think if you're using a 10-year old low-drain cell with high internal-resistance, the voltage sag would cause it to hit 2.8v pretty quick.

The number of flashes a Zebralight gives for remaining battery capacity is just a rough guideline. I find that 1 flash means the voltage is below about 3.3v or 3.4v. At that point, the remaining output time is close to 15%, not 25%. That's because the lower voltage means the driver has to use more current to produce the same lumens (because its output is regulated).


----------



## RTTR

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> No, the Plus doesn't throw as far as the HI. Maybe 75% as far. However, the large flood illuminating the foreground makes it more difficult to see in the distance, so in practical terms it's probably half as far. It's great at moderate distances (out to about 100 meters), though. No panning around needed to see stuff, because the hot spot is quite large.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Zebralights use a boost driver, and so are fairly well regulated regardless of battery voltage. It's not perfectly flat regulation, but I don't think you'd notice any drop in brightness with your eyes. I find the Zebralights will continue to output at maximum, until the battery voltage drops between 2.8v and 2.9v. At that point, the light will step-down in brightness.
> 
> So, essentially, you'll get full output using almost the full capacity of your 18650. That assumes a decent cell. I think if you're using a 10-year old low-drain cell with high internal-resistance, the voltage sag would cause it to hit 2.8v pretty quick.
> 
> The number of flashes a Zebralight gives for remaining battery capacity is just a rough guideline. I find that 1 flash means the voltage is below about 3.3v or 3.4v. At that point, the remaining output time is close to 15%, not 25%. That's because the lower voltage means the driver has to use more current to produce the same lumens (because its output is regulated).



Thanks for taking the time to go into the details I was looking for, right now I’m using a fresh Sanyo 18650GA, with the recently purchased light.


----------



## jackbauer

so I just got the light in today and am very happy. The flood is so wide. Bright lumens. almost as small as the D4. Doesn't overheat as fast as the D4 would so I can actually hold it haha...some joggers walking outside my neighborhood were in awe as they were passing by


----------



## PocketBeam

My SC600w Mk IV Plus showed up last night. I am mostly comparing to my previous EDC the Zebralight SC600 Mk II (not L, just II). 

My Mk II brightest was 900Lm, the Plus does 2300Lm. The Plus is very noticeably brighter. That works out to 2.56 times brighter. The 900 used to wow people so this will super wow them I am sure.

The Plus gets very hot. Even putting your hand in front of the beam for bit will make the hand get very hot. I have to pull my hand back after a bit. And I used a IR thermometer and saw 122F-125F top temps while hand holding in room temps. This felt way to hot to hand hold. See this chart - http://www.todayifoundout.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/07/third-degree-burns.png So I turn it on at H1, then held it on, let it loop through modes six times and released on Low, five times. Even doing this to reduce the PID it still feels too hot. I wonder if I messed up somehow?

My Mk II used to get hot, but not this hot and not as fast. Obviously the Plus is pulling more power. But also the plus has less mass in the head area. When empty the Plus is much lighter, especially in the head area, than the Mk II. The Mk II has more mass to dump heat into. The Plus has heat fins cut into the head. But without a fan blowing over the fins, I feel the fins are almost useless. In fact when I hand carry, 1/3 of the fins are covered up. This will trap air which will insulate. At the very least the fin gaps don't let my hand carry away heat as well. Maybe they slow down my hand heating up the light, but I would have preferred a beefier head without fins like the Mk II had. Also with battery and the way I carry, the weight difference is not noticeable.

The tint shift is barely noticeable on the plus. I doubt a non-flashaholic would even seen it if you asked them about it. The tint shift is much better than the Mk II. I am very happy with the tint, and the tiny amount of tint shift (almost none). It is a non-issue.

Some more quick comparisons with the Mk II. The plus has much darker grey, almost black, anodizing. The clip is darker now as well. It is nice that the PID temp can now be programmed a bit. The Plus now has G6 and G7 modes so now any light level can be in any position. And now it is much easier to get into strobe/flash/beacon modes. It is worth noting that the lowest low on the Plus (0.2) is much brighter than lowest low on the Mk II (0.02).

The Plus throws farther than the MK II, but that is kind of expected with 2300 lumens versus the older 900 lumens. But for all that power it doesn't throw much farther. This is because the LED is bigger on the Plus and the Plus has a rougher orange peel. So the hot spot is much larger, but also has a smoother transition. With that said, the Plus can light things up well at 100 yards or 100 meters. If you need more than that, or you really want to wow with a pin point beam, then try maybe the HI model or another company.

I need to carry this for a week or so to add more thoughts. So far I am happy, except for the heat. But I would rather have heat then a lower max brightness. Just wish the head was beefier like the old heads.


----------



## markr6

PocketBeam said:


> Some more quick comparisons with the Mk II. The plus has much darker grey, almost black, anodizing.



This is a change they made not so long ago. I like it not only for the color itself, but for the consistency. In the past, you got anything from olive green to almost black.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

PocketBeam said:


> My SC600w Mk IV Plus showed up last night.
> 
> The Plus gets very hot. Even putting your hand in front of the beam for bit will make the hand get very hot. I have to pull my hand back after a bit. And I used a IR thermometer and saw 122F-125F top temps while hand holding in room temps. This felt way to hot to hand hold. So I turn it on at H1, then held it on, let it loop through modes six times and released on Low, five times. Even doing this to reduce the PID it still feels too hot. I wonder if I messed up somehow?



That should work. I did it to mine as well, though I first released it on medium to reset it. It still gets pretty hot, though not too hot to hold.



> The Plus has heat fins cut into the head. But without a fan blowing over the fins, I feel the fins are almost useless. In fact when I hand carry, 1/3 of the fins are covered up. This will trap air which will insulate. At the very least the fin gaps don't let my hand carry away heat as well.



Yeah, the fins don't do much in still air. I use mine cycling, and the nighttime breeze while moving keeps the light from reaching the PID temperature. 2300 lumens is overkill, but it's fun! I did this the other night, but my battery died after about 30 minutes. Normally, I stick with 700 lumens, which gives me almost 3 hours. A kick up to 1300 lumens when I need it is plenty bright enough, and doesn't kill the battery so fast.


----------



## PocketBeam

(Walkintothelight) I hadn't thought of biking. Yes, the fins should help with biking.

I also think the 705 mode will be my most used. I assume that half hour at 2300 was with partially used batteries? Or the cooling worked so well it drained full batteries in half an hour?

(markr6) The blackish grey looks good. I just wonder how it will look when scratched.

I forgot to mention one other strange change. The place where the split ring goes and the button location are now rotated more. I used to keep my clip right next to the split ring bulge. Then I could reach into my pocket and my thumb would naturally hit the button. Now the clip needs to go in a middle area to do the same. The problem is without that bulge to rest against, it moves over time. I may put some lock tight or super glue on the clip to lock it down. Strange that they moved it.


----------



## snowlover91

jackbauer said:


> so I just got the light in today and am very happy. The flood is so wide. Bright lumens. almost as small as the D4. Doesn't overheat as fast as the D4 would so I can actually hold it haha...some joggers walking outside my neighborhood were in awe as they were passing by



Congrats, which model did you end up getting? The SC600 IV Plus model? I’m looking to upgrade one of my older ZL’s soon.. the customizable UI is one of my favorite aspects of the newer ones.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

PocketBeam said:


> (Walkintothelight) I hadn't thought of biking. Yes, the fins should help with biking.
> 
> I also think the 705 mode will be my most used. I assume that half hour at 2300 was with partially used batteries? Or the cooling worked so well it drained full batteries in half an hour?



It was on a full battery. I think the cooling works well enough that the light never ramped down from full output, though it did feel warm to the touch during the ride. It was about 15C that night, and the breeze generated would have been something like 20-25 km/h.

I think it looked brighter than car headlights, though with more flood and less throw.


----------



## PocketBeam

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> It was on a full battery. I think the cooling works well enough that the light never ramped down from full output, though it did feel warm to the touch during the ride. It was about 15C that night, and the breeze generated would have been something like 20-25 km/h.
> 
> I think it looked brighter than car headlights, though with more flood and less throw.



Wow, so with good cooling it can eat a battery pretty fast. I looked up how bright car headlights are. There is some variance, as there is no brightness standard. But from Wikipedia it seems that 1000 Lumen low and 1650 Lumen high beam per headlight is common. So I would say brighter than a single car headlight, even on high. Of course you can buy brighter headlights.

"The first dual-filament halogen bulb to produce both a low and a high beam, the H4 (60/55 W @ 12 V, 1650/1000 lm ±15% @ 13.2 V),[56]​ was released in 1971[14]​ and quickly became the predominant headlamp bulb throughout the world except in the United States, where the H4 is still not legal for automotive use. In 1989, the Americans created their own standard for a bulb called HB2: almost identical to H4 except with more stringent constraints on filament geometry and positional variance,[57]​[58]​ and power consumption and light output expressed at the US test voltage of 12.8V.[59]​"


----------



## zerostyle

What's everyone's opinion of the best beam profile for a headlamp that would be used for both around the home and camping?

Torn between the H53Fc (90deg all flood) and the H53c (80deg flood + 12deg hotspot). The throw might be nice while camping, but I feel a hotspot gets in the way when you are doing any kind of close up work or indoors.


----------



## tech25

I like the "f" series the best. There still is some hotspot but I find it to be blended and less of a "bouncing ball" effect. I generally use floody lights, when I need more throw I take a thrower along.


----------



## Random Dan

For me I typically only use a headlamp for things which are close: setting up tent, cooking/washing dishes, etc. My favorite beam profile is my H600Fc as it is perfect for things within arm's reach. If I want throw I'll go for a handheld light.


----------



## terjee

zerostyle said:


> Torn between the H53Fc (90deg all flood) and the H53c (80deg flood + 12deg hotspot). The throw might be nice while camping, but I feel a hotspot gets in the way when you are doing any kind of close up work or indoors.



Personally I think the Fc has a much nicer bean profile, for both indoors and outdoors. What the H53Fc lacks though, is a bit of range, as you already touch on. It’s about 270-something lumens for less than an hour, and spread over a wide field, that’s not a lot. 

If possible (considering both budget and weight), I’d really like to recommend you consider the H600Fc as well. It’ll give you more light for longer, sort of giving you best of both. A H53Fc could be added later as well, giving you a lighter light for indoors, and a very good backup for outdoors.

If you want to stick with AA, I think the H53Fc is the one I’d go with. The beam profile is much nicer indoor/up close, and while it doesn’t have a lot of range it has some advantages outdoors as well, such as with regards to bouncy ball.


----------



## JStraus

+1 for the H600Fc. I sold my H600w, which was great, but the Fc is absolutely perfect. I just puts beautiful light wherever you are looking. It has plenty of output for 99% of your needs.




terjee said:


> Personally I think the Fc has a much nicer bean profile, for both indoors and outdoors. What the H53Fc lacks though, is a bit of range, as you already touch on. It’s about 270-something lumens for less than an hour, and spread over a wide field, that’s not a lot.
> 
> If possible (considering both budget and weight), I’d really like to recommend you consider the H600Fc as well. It’ll give you more light for longer, sort of giving you best of both. A H53Fc could be added later as well, giving you a lighter light for indoors, and a very good backup for outdoors.
> 
> If you want to stick with AA, I think the H53Fc is the one I’d go with. The beam profile is much nicer indoor/up close, and while it doesn’t have a lot of range it has some advantages outdoors as well, such as with regards to bouncy ball.


----------



## Tixx

zerostyle said:


> What's everyone's opinion of the best beam profile for a headlamp that would be used for both around the home and camping?
> 
> Torn between the H53Fc (90deg all flood) and the H53c (80deg flood + 12deg hotspot). The throw might be nice while camping, but I feel a hotspot gets in the way when you are doing any kind of close up work or indoors.



I prefer flood type headlamps. Headlamps I find are normally for short to medium distances. Throw is for your flashlight if needed.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Tixx said:


> I prefer flood type headlamps. Headlamps I find are normally for short to medium distances. Throw is for your flashlight if needed.



For walking, I agree. But I sometimes use a Zebra (non-frosted) headlight when I cycle, especially in wooded areas. Great for looking around and seeing stuff off the main trail, and a little throw is important for seeing stuff before you pass it.


----------



## MikeSalt

SC64c: First Thoughts

As far as I could tell, this was not currently available in the United Kingdom, so I ordered directly from Zebralight. With free, tracked shipping and its value under-declared for customs, it came in at a shade under £70, which is astonishing value in the UK.

It came in familiar, environmentally friendly packaging, whcih was good to see. However, let's get the bad news out of the way first. I unscrewed the cap and it didn't have that same quality feel to the motion as my Zebralight SC52d. On closer inspection, I found that it was a triangular thread, not a trapezoidal thread as in my SC52d. I'm sure it is perfectly adequate, I've just been spoiled in my expectations with the SC52d. Anyway, I threw an Efest IMR18650 and carried on.

From then on though, it is nothing but good news. I was quite taken aback by the size of that emitter. However, that emitter, used in a mule-type beam is just outstanding. So much light! Such a smooth beam. I love the colour temperature, and whilst there is the faintest touch of yellow tint to it, this is actually to my taste, so very pleased.

Another nice surprise that I didn't realise the light had until I turned it off is the glow-in-the-dark emitter surround. It just makes so much sense to use what would otherwise be dead space in a mule for such a useful purpose.

The Zebralight interface is fantastic, as always. Within seconds I had it all programmed up the way I like, with the lowest possible moonlight setting. It's not quite as dim as moonlight on an SC52d, but with a more powerful, more efficient emitter, this is to be expected, and it is far dimmer than 'moonlight' from many other makers, so it is another fantastic result from Zebralight.

Yet to use it as a headlight, but everything looks great so far.


----------



## likethevegetable

zerostyle said:


> What's everyone's opinion of the best beam profile for a headlamp that would be used for both around the home and camping?
> 
> Torn between the H53Fc (90deg all flood) and the H53c (80deg flood + 12deg hotspot). The throw might be nice while camping, but I feel a hotspot gets in the way when you are doing any kind of close up work or indoors.



I own an H53c and an H600Fc. I prefer the F optics for pretty much all uses – I find the floody beam more pleasant for short to medium range use, and the compromise in throw isn’t significant. I put some DC-fix window diffuser on my H53c, and now the beam is more like, but still not quite as a nice, as my H600Fc. My next AA Zebralight will be the H54Fc or H55Fc…


----------



## fonfan

There are two defects on reflector surface in my SC5c II. Zebralight quality can to be different.


----------



## Tixx

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> For walking, I agree. But I sometimes use a Zebra (non-frosted) headlight when I cycle, especially in wooded areas. Great for looking around and seeing stuff off the main trail, and a little throw is important for seeing stuff before you pass it.



Completely agree. The faster you are moving, the further you need to see for sure.


----------



## PKFan

Has there been any news of an SC5 II in cool white (I only see w and c)?


----------



## Modernflame

Does Zebralight currently offer a 1xCR123 model?


----------



## ven

I dont think there is right now, the sc32w is showing out of stock and not sure what plans they have down the line. What i will say, the sc64 is super compact and actually the size of a typical 16340 light! Of course if using cr123 cells is the end game, not much help. 

Even the larger sc600 lights are only a little bigger than HDS






sc63w/PR/HDS


----------



## Modernflame

Those are extremely helpful comparison photos. Thanks!


----------



## ven

Your welcome, if anything specific just shout, if i can i will


----------



## MikeSalt

Thanks for the photos ven. Just goes to show what a great job Zebralight make of keeping things compact.


----------



## ven

MikeSalt said:


> Thanks for the photos ven. Just goes to show what a great job Zebralight make of keeping things compact.




Thanks Mike, pretty amazing really how they make such a compact light. Few things impress me along with size, the UI, anodising, and PID how it regulates the output. So smooth.............

Couple more pics, 1st the sc600 and sc63w which shows how compact next to the tiny E1e .





Then an all 16340/CR123 line up with 2 x 18650 ZL's for size


----------



## ktate749

Do all 18650 battery Zebralights use unprotected cells only?

Thanks
Kurt Tate


----------



## ktate749

Please excuse me if this is a repost. This forum is a little tricky to use.
I recently received a new Zebralight headlamp. Is the exact model number listed anywhere on the light or packaging?

Thanks
Kurt Tate


----------



## PocketBeam

ktate749 said:


> Do all 18650 battery Zebralights use unprotected cells only?
> 
> Thanks
> Kurt Tate



No, not all do. The website should note if it needs to be unprotected. Also the ones that only use unprotected batteries will show a shorter battery size of 65.0 to 65.2mm. The ones that can use protected will say longer sizes like up to 69mm. 



ktate749 said:


> Please excuse me if this is a repost. This forum is a little tricky to use.
> I recently received a new Zebralight headlamp. Is the exact model number listed anywhere on the light or packaging?
> 
> Thanks
> Kurt Tate



It should be on the packaging. And it may be on the light itself. If you are not sure, you can post a picture with some info like battery needed, etc, and someone might be able to identify.


----------



## markr6

ktate749 said:


> I recently received a new Zebralight headlamp. Is the exact model number listed anywhere on the light or packaging?



No, headlamps do not have the printing. Only the flashlights. Both have it on the packaging, which was probably covered by the mailing label.


----------



## ktate749

Thanks all. I'm pretty sure I have a H600Fw,c,d Mk IV. I was able to remove the shipping label without damaging the box but there was no model info on it. They allow 69mm batteries, so protected versions are allowed. I've already ordered two Panasonic NCR18650B unprotected batteries. I'm guessing these will work. Is there an advantage to using protected batteries?

Thanks again,
Kurt Tate


----------



## ktate749

Hello again.
One last question (for now anyway). Looking at protected cells I notice that they all had button tops. Will they work with the multipin contact in the flashlight or are there protected flat top cells I didn't see?

Thanks once more,
Kurt Tate


----------



## PocketBeam

ktate749 said:


> Thanks all. I'm pretty sure I have a H600Fw,c,d Mk IV. I was able to remove the shipping label without damaging the box but there was no model info on it. They allow 69mm batteries, so protected versions are allowed. I've already ordered two Panasonic NCR18650B unprotected batteries. I'm guessing these will work. Is there an advantage to using protected batteries?
> 
> Thanks again,
> Kurt Tate



I don't have the H600.. but I believe the shorter unprotected batteries should be fine. Protected batteries protect against over discharge, over charge, heat, short circuit, and such. See this short article for more - https://www.fenix-store.com/blog/wh...en-protected-and-unprotected-18650-batteries/

But note that Zebralights also protect against the same things. So it ends up being redundant and not needed in a Zebralight. But it can help if you have a bad charger, or carry batteries unsafely, i.e. a battery shorts against your keys in your pocket. I feel fine using unprotected batteries in Zebralights.



ktate749 said:


> Hello again.
> One last question (for now anyway). Looking at protected cells I notice that they all had button tops. Will they work with the multipin contact in the flashlight or are there protected flat top cells I didn't see?
> 
> Thanks once more,
> Kurt Tate



The multi pin, or POGO pins in Zebralights are used to carry more current and make the battery shorter. I am not an expert, but I don't think Zebralight has a POGO light that uses protected batteries. While it is possible to make a flat top protected cell, I wouldn't recommend buying one. I can easily glance and see which cells I own that are protected or not.


----------



## tech25

With that model light- you have a protection built in. The plus of having a protected battery would be redundancy for protection. 



ktate749 said:


> Thanks all. I'm pretty sure I have a H600Fw,c,d Mk IV. I was able to remove the shipping label without damaging the box but there was no model info on it. They allow 69mm batteries, so protected versions are allowed. I've already ordered two Panasonic NCR18650B unprotected batteries. I'm guessing these will work. Is there an advantage to using protected batteries?
> 
> Thanks again,
> Kurt Tate


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

BTW, I posted a Youtube review of the SC600w MkIV Plus, comparing it to the HI and other versions. Just if anyone wants to see the beam differences outside.


----------



## anthon87

I'm going to buy a new headlamp and I'm betweem two models

H600w MK IV XHP35 5000k
H600Fd MK IV XHP50.2 HI Cri 5000k

I like lights with some hotspot and a big spill, all my other zebras have a very wide spill so I think the h600W will be the same.

I'm afraid that the H600Fd will be too floody for my taste


----------



## Keitho

The "product comparison" sheet lists the Fd as 5000K, and the w at 4500K...I have a feeling that color temp might also play into your choice along with beam shape. For me personally, right-angle lights are for stuff within 10' or 15', so I tend to go flood. For my outdoor-use lights, I also enjoy the higher CRI, even if that effect is only in my head.


----------



## anthon87

Keitho said:


> The "product comparison" sheet lists the Fd as 5000K, and the w at 4500K...I have a feeling that color temp might also play into your choice along with beam shape. For me personally, right-angle lights are for stuff within 10' or 15', so I tend to go flood. For my outdoor-use lights, I also enjoy the higher CRI, even if that effect is only in my head.



My actual headlamp is a Armytek Elf C2 in Warm 4000k tint, and it's on the too warm side for my taste, 4500-5000 is fine for me

I have a H53w headlamp and the beam is fine for me

My actual zebralights are

SC600W IV HI
H53W
SC5W II


----------



## JStraus

I don't think you'll find the Fd too floody. I changed my H600w our for the Fd and far prefer the beam pattern over the 600w.

If you have other non frosted ZL's then the Fd is a great fit.


----------



## firstcipher

Hi, I want to ask about zebralight h600w MK4 and sc64w, I look at zebralight site the two light have same head diameter dimension spec.
Does two light have a same throw beam distance or not? thanks.


----------



## Romanko

Hi. What to expect from fc and fd? fc 4000k will be like on picture 4000k?


----------



## evgeniy

Romanko said:


> Hi. What to expect from fc and fd? fc 4000k will be like on picture 4000k?



It's tint question 
Fc is ~~~ 3500-4000K, but tint may be sligthly different.


----------



## anthon87

anthon87 said:


> I'm going to buy a new headlamp and I'm betweem two models
> 
> H600w MK IV XHP35 5000k
> H600Fd MK IV XHP50.2 HI Cri 5000k
> 
> I like lights with some hotspot and a big spill, all my other zebras have a very wide spill so I think the h600W will be the same.
> 
> I'm afraid that the H600Fd will be too floody for my taste



Finally I ordered the H600w XHP35

If some day I need more flood, I'd stick some DC fix in the lens


----------



## Mr. LED

MikeSalt said:


> SC64: It's not quite as dim as moonlight on an SC52d, but with a more powerful, more efficient emitter, this is to be expected, and it is far dimmer than 'moonlight' from many other makers, so it is another fantastic result from Zebralight.



do you by any chance have a SC64w to compare the lowest moonlight? I find mine a lot brighter as my old SC62 and it bothers me. If the SC64c is dimmer, I’ll go for it. But nothing beats the SC32w, it has the lowest moonlight ever.


----------



## MikeSalt

Mr. LED said:


> do you by any chance have a SC64w to compare the lowest moonlight? I find mine a lot brighter as my old SC62 and it bothers me. If the SC64c is dimmer, I’ll go for it. But nothing beats the SC32w, it has the lowest moonlight ever.



I do not I'm afraid. It'd definitely dimmer than moonlight on an Olight S1R, if that helps?


----------



## Mr. LED

Unfortunately it doesn’t help, but thanks nonetheless.


----------



## TCY

Unfortunately none of ZL's 18650 MKIV lights have the 0.01lm moonlight mode that many people praise. As a SC62w owner I can say that the lowest low on my H600Fc MK IV (0.08lm) is visually a lot brighter than the 0.01 from my SC62w.


----------



## easilyled

TCY said:


> Unfortunately none of ZL's 18650 MKIV lights have the 0.01lm moonlight mode that many people praise. As a SC62w owner I can say that the lowest low on my H600Fc MK IV (0.08lm) is visually a lot brighter than the 0.01 from my SC62w.



I wonder if its harder to achieve such a low, low with multi-die emitters like the XHP35 and XHP50.2 etc.
The sc52 used an XM-L2 I think, which might be easier passing the minuscule current to it required for such low output without causing flickering.
This is only speculation on my part. No idea whether its correct or not.


----------



## Mr. LED

Yes, that’s the problem. The new lights have a too bright moonlight. I’m wandering if the SC64c is dimmer than SC64w, because it has a XP-L2 emitter.


----------



## Mr. LED

easilyled said:


> I wonder if its harder to achieve such a low, low with multi-die emitters like the XHP35 and XHP50.2 etc.
> The sc52 used an XM-L2 I think, which might be easier passing the minuscule current to it required for such low output without causing flickering.
> This is only speculation on my part. No idea whether its correct or not.



The lowest moonlight is the SC32w with the XM-L2 and CR123. It’s so low I have to use the second lowest, and I like it pretty low!

It may seem crazy, but instead of praising how high my flashlight can go, I like it when it goes really low.
Although Zebralight is my favorite flashlight and I like (almost) every feature, the one I like most is the moonlight.

Does anyone know any other flashlight brand that can go as low or lower than Zebralight?


----------



## markr6

I do love the super low modes and miss it on my SC64w. In comparison, the lowest on my SC52w is equal to the "afterglow" on my SC600w HI IV. More useful than most people would think.


----------



## Mr. LED

What do you mean by “afterglow”? Is it the remaining light that lasts a second after you turn it off?


----------



## markr6

Mr. LED said:


> What do you mean by “afterglow”? Is it the remaining light that lasts a second after you turn it off?



Yes. Fairly bright for 1 second then fades over another few seconds.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Mr. LED said:


> Does anyone know any other flashlight brand that can go as low or lower than Zebralight?



I have an Armytek Prime that has two different moonlight modes. The dimmest is similar to the old Zebralight low moonlights. A bit brighter than the lowest Zebralight, but much dimmer than the new MkIV Zebralight moonlights.

I have a couple of Zebralights (SC52 and SC52w) that have _very_ low moonlights on their lowest settings. IMO, too low to be useful. You can't even tell the LED is on by staring at it, unless it's dark. I find the moonlights from a couple of years ago (such as the SC5w) a bit more useful.

The latest batch (at least on my XHP35 and XHP50.2 Zebras) is too bright for my taste, at least for indoor "middle of the night" use. They're fine for outdoors, where you need a bit more light to see stuff on the ground.


----------



## Tixx

Yes, ZL and their moonlights are the best! The SC64w is definitely on the brighter side of moonlight.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Tixx said:


> Yes, ZL and their moonlights are the best! The SC64w is definitely on the brighter side of moonlight.



Yeah, and I miss even the really low (useless) moonlight level. It was fun to have, even if it wasn't practical. Could be used as an illuminator for finding the light in the dark, though.


----------



## Mr. LED

This really low moonlight can be used as a beacon to find the flashlight in the dark, especially while camping or sleeping in a different than usual place.


----------



## Lou Minescence

Mr. LED said:


> This really low moonlight can be used as a beacon to find the flashlight in the dark, especially while camping or sleeping in a different than usual place.



The low beacon is one of my favorite features. Zebralight and my HDS lights have it. It’s better than a glow in the dark tail cap.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Lou Minescence said:


> The low beacon is one of my favorite features. Zebralight and my HDS lights have it. It’s better than a glow in the dark tail cap.



I like the low beacon just so that if I accidentally triple-click, I don't get an annoying strobe.


----------



## JoeRodge

I'm gonna get a head lamp and I'm stuck between two different models. I really like a decent throw with my flood. I realize these are both floods. But does one have slightly more throw than the other? I assume the unfrosted one has more throw. I'm overwhelmed lol. These are the two I'm looking at: h604d or h600FdAny better option? I prefer the 4500-5000 color temperature. There are so many options, lol.


----------



## TCY

JoeRodge said:


> I'm gonna get a head lamp and I'm stuck between two different models. I really like a decent throw with my flood. I realize these are both floods. But does one have slightly more throw than the other? I assume the unfrosted one has more throw. I'm overwhelmed lol. These are the two I'm looking at: h604d or h600FdAny better option? I prefer the 4500-5000 color temperature. There are so many options, lol.



If you are into throw, steer clear from the h604d as it is a mule light, clear lens + no reflector = 100% flood light. Out of the two the h600Fd has a great combination of throw and flood for a headlamp but it's still on the floody side, with the benefit of high CRI. If you prefer a traditional flashlight beam profile, the H600w Mk IV is the light to get.


----------



## likethevegetable

I believe the F models are the best beam profile. Especially with the 600 series since there's so many lumens available, the sheer output with the floody beam can light up trees across a river. With that said, I put DC-fix on my H53c and it's a slightly throwier version of the F, but I do wish I got the H53Fc instead. I seldom wish I had more flood OR thow than my H600Fc offers, except for when I'm reading or showing off to my friends.

If I never need tons of flood, I put a latex finger cot (or cut off finger tip of glove) over the headlamp and boom, instant H604c / H503c!

I personally would only consider the H600w if I needed it as bike light.


----------



## gurdygurds

Do the F models eliminate the tint shift across the beam? That was the one small nit pick I had with my SC53c and SC53w


----------



## NPL

I find it really odd that Zebralight still hasn't posted runtimes for their xhp50 headlamps even though they have been selling them for what seems to be a very long while now. 

I love Zebralight but this doesn't give me the confidence they are headed in the right direction, especially with poor PID implementation on mk4 lights and possibly overstated max lumens.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

NPL said:


> I find it really odd that Zebralight still hasn't posted runtimes for their xhp50 headlamps even though they have been selling them for what seems to be a very long while now.
> 
> I love Zebralight but this doesn't give me the confidence they are headed in the right direction, especially with poor PID implementation on mk4 lights and possibly overstated max lumens.



What poor PID implementation? I have two MkIV lights, and the PID seems to work fine. What is supposedly wrong?

I think their max lumen estimates are pretty good, with the exception of the 600w MkIV HI. I think that's because they just copied the numbers from the regular 600w MkIV, and didn't take into account that the HI emitter has less output. Yeah, that's not good, and shows poor updating of their website info.


----------



## NPL

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> What poor PID implementation? I have two MkIV lights, and the PID seems to work fine. What is supposedly wrong?
> 
> I think their max lumen estimates are pretty good, with the exception of the 600w MkIV HI. I think that's because they just copied the numbers from the regular 600w MkIV, and didn't take into account that the HI emitter has less output. Yeah, that's not good, and shows poor updating of their website info.


The light oscillates heavily unlike mk3 lights.


----------



## Random Dan

NPL said:


> The light oscillates heavily unlike mk3 lights.


I think that was only with the very early Mk.IV release and has since been corrected. At least that's what I recall reading from some folks who ran tests on BLF.


----------



## NPL

Random Dan said:


> I think that was only with the very early Mk.IV release and has since been corrected. At least that's what I recall reading from some folks who ran tests on BLF.


That's good news if it's the case. Only graphs I have seen to date are the ones showing large oscillations. If you find the newer reports, please do share the link.


----------



## gurdygurds

Don’t hate me but I’m bumping my own question. Those of you with the f models, does the frosted lens eleimnate the tint shift across the beam? Thanks for your help!


gurdygurds said:


> Do the F models eliminate the tint shift across the beam? That was the one small nit pick I had with my SC53c and SC53w


----------



## Random Dan

gurdygurds said:


> Don’t hate me but I’m bumping my own question. Those of you with the f models, does the frosted lens eleimnate the tint shift across the beam? Thanks for your help!


In my experience yes. I have an H600Fc and previously owned an SC5Fc, neither with any noticeable tint shift.


----------



## twistedraven

Frosted lens eliminates probably 80% of the tint shift.


----------



## gurdygurds

Thanks guys!


----------



## megam

What are people's preferences for Fd vs Fc vs Fw, specifically for the H600 Mk IV? I'm not finding beamshots comparing them. I'm just looking for pure white light, and the lumens/lux/runtime of all of them is fine, so I think the Fd is the best for me, but I'm not sure another doesn't have a better tint.


----------



## NPL

megam said:


> What are people's preferences for Fd vs Fc vs Fw, specifically for the H600 Mk IV? I'm not finding beamshots comparing them. I'm just looking for pure white light, and the lumens/lux/runtime of all of them is fine, so I think the Fd is the best for me, but I'm not sure another doesn't have a better tint.


I have the FC mk4 in 4000k and if you are looking for pure white I would recommend the FD model or fw. The FC is on the warmer side.


----------



## iamlucky13

megam said:


> What are people's preferences for Fd vs Fc vs Fw, specifically for the H600 Mk IV? I'm not finding beamshots comparing them. I'm just looking for pure white light, and the lumens/lux/runtime of all of them is fine, so I think the Fd is the best for me, but I'm not sure another doesn't have a better tint.



I'd say go for the Fd version. That's in the range that in my opinion looks the most pure white.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Well, they all look white if it's the only light source you're using. But, yeah, 5000K of the Fd is generally thought of as a more neutral-to-coolish white. For most people starting out, it's a good one to start with. After that, you can decide if you like tints a bit warmer, which makes reds pop a bit more.


----------



## Tejasandre

Finally ordered my first zebra. 600fd. Will be used to drink beer & water grass in the evening. 

Ordered through Amazon & saved tax.


----------



## markr6

Tejasandre said:


> Finally ordered my first zebra. 600fd. Will be used to drink beer & water grass in the evening.



HAHA!! A great way to wind down the day for sure.


----------



## megam

Thanks for the replies, NPL, iamlucky13, and and WalkIntoTheLight. I went with the H600Fd, but I was also buying a SC64w, so I'll be able to compare once they arrive.


----------



## twistedraven

Emmisar D4s with 5000k 90 CRI nichia 219C and Fireflies ROT66 with 4500k 95 CRI Nichia 219B R9080 on the way! I can't wait to compare them with my H600FC sporting the 90 CRI 4000k XHP50.2.

Good time to be a tint snob.


----------



## markr6

twistedraven said:


> Emmisar D4s with 5000k 90 CRI nichia 219C and Fireflies ROT66 with 4500k 95 CRI Nichia 219B R9080 on the way! I can't wait to compare them with my H600FC sporting the 90 CRI 4000k XHP50.2.
> 
> Good time to be a tint snob.



Amazing stuff! I'm on the fence with both of those.

On another note, I know I sound like a broken record here but I really miss the "middle of the night" super low modes on the newer Zebralights. SC64w and SC600w IV HI, even on the lowest setting, are room-lighters. I had to settle for the old thumb-over-the-lens trick this past weekend while moving around at night as to not disturb anyone, or my eyes.


----------



## Mr. LED

I also miss the 0.01 low after I sold my SC62 to get the SC64w. The lowest setting I have to bounce it from the wall, otherwise it’s too bright.

Yesterday I got the SC53w and it has a low moonlight, but the tint is not good. Greenish with green corona, the tint shift so many people complained about. Using by itself is ok, but once I compare to the SC64w and SC32w, it’s bad.


----------



## twistedraven

markr6 said:


> Amazing stuff! I'm on the fence with both of those.
> 
> On another note, I know I sound like a broken record here but I really miss the "middle of the night" super low modes on the newer Zebralights. SC64w and SC600w IV HI, even on the lowest setting, are room-lighters. I had to settle for the old thumb-over-the-lens trick this past weekend while moving around at night as to not disturb anyone, or my eyes.



The R9080 variant of the ROT66 won't be around forever. Sooner or later Fireflies is gonna run out of those emitters. Maukka has tested it to have a very low moonlight mode (>.1 lumen). I know it's probably not going to be the impossibly low .01 lumen that some Zebralights have, but still very low.


----------



## markr6

Mr. LED said:


> Yesterday I got the SC53w and it has a low moonlight, but the tint is not good. Greenish with green corona, the tint shift so many people complained about. Using by itself is ok, but once I compare to the SC64w and SC32w, it’s bad.



That's too bad. It's next on my list to buy. I guess it's just a chance I'll need to take, as usual.


----------



## Mr. LED

Problem with the SC53w is not tint lottery. Check the search for “tint shift” on the SC53w. All of them have it.


----------



## markr6

Thanks, I'm gonna have to pass then if it's consistent.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

I prefer my SC52's, anyway. They can take a 14500, for a 500 lumen max output. Makes it the same output as my SC5w, but in a smaller size.


----------



## Dio

markr6 said:


> Thanks, I'm gonna have to pass then if it's consistent.



It is just like the SC5 Mk2. Indeed it does have a tiny bit of deviation across the beam but I really don't notice it in actual usage.

I ended up with a SC53Fw as I prefer the W over the C emitters and went with frosted lens as a floody light is much more useful indoors for me. Yes, the overall tint coming through the frosted lens is more uniform, but it wouldn't be a deal breaker had they not made me a F version of the SC53w..

As for you however, knowing you get frustrated with ZL from time to time, it may still be a case of buy and return..


----------



## Mr. LED

After some more usage, the SC53w seems ok, as long as I’m not aiming for white walls.


----------



## ven

I just stay away from xp-l2(certainly xp-g3 as well), not tried the xhp50.2 yet as too much of a lottery also. The xm-l2 easywhite, Luxeon T, xhp35 and xhp35 HI are safe options from my experience. Granted the xhp35 are not hi cri, but that is less important to me personally than actual tint. Too yellow(or green) is a no go, even if 100cri for me. If its not easy on the eye, forget it! I will say the Luxeon T of old being around 85cri, is one of the nicest beams/tints i have..............


----------



## twistedraven

I had 3 of the H600FC MK4s at one point, and they were all nice. Their tint was very close to the XML2 easywhite and just so slightly above the black body line subjectively. They probably have the trademark Cree tint shift throughout the beam, but the frosted lens gets rid of 90% of that.


----------



## markr6

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> I prefer my SC52's, anyway. They can take a 14500, for a 500 lumen max output. Makes it the same output as my SC5w, but in a smaller size.



I do like my SC52w. I aimed to replace it with a 53w and even pick up a second one. But maybe I'll hold off for now.


----------



## SubLGT

Zebralights used to be available from multiple USA sources (Illumn, BrightGuy, etc) but that seems to have changed during the last 2 years. No adequate profit for dealers selling Zebralight?


----------



## Tejasandre

So I got my Zebralight H600Fd Mk IV 18650 XHP50.2 Floody 5000K High CRI Headlamp today. Seems a little greenish tintwise. But on max it’s like daylight in my immediate vicinity. 

I like the press hold & ramp ui. Not a fan of the double click with high flash for Medium. 

High ramped down pretty quick. What do you guys set your “high” at for a little more runtime?

I’m thinking lower high, or maybe higher medium, what’s the consensus?


----------



## twistedraven

I set mine to the 900-1000 lumen mode. The 1500 lumen mode steps down too fast to be of any use for me.


----------



## Tejasandre

I’m gonna have to look at the manual & try that. I don’t mind the step down, but it seems really hot.


----------



## twistedraven

It's such a tiny little host with little surface area so about all it can handle is 400ish lumens sustained.


----------



## NPL

I usually set my H1 to 900 ish lumens. The 1500 lumen setting is too unrealistic and it steps down far too quickly.


----------



## Jose Marin

I have a h600fw mk2 on my hardhat for work and it is always on 60lm. 60 is more than enough for up close work and lasts all week easy. If i do need more i go to the lowest high, only time im ever on turbo is to just show off lol


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Batteries are easy to recharge, so I never worry about using less lumens than I want. That said, I probably also mostly use ~50 lumens on my AA Zebras, because indoors that is about the right amount of light most of the time.

Outdoors, I'm usually using somewhere between 700-1500 lumens most of the time. Because... why not?  It's overkill, but it's fun to see stuff 100 meters away, rather than just 10 meters.


----------



## markr6

It was likely mentioned, but are there any Zebralights that should really be using the VTC6 instead of the 18650GA? I know both work, and I'm not really concerned with "first 30 seconds" of measuring output in a sphere. Just in general, does it really matter?


----------



## Connor

Only if you use your light on the highest mode a lot .. and probably only on the plus models.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

markr6 said:


> It was likely mentioned, but are there any Zebralights that should really be using the VTC6 instead of the 18650GA? I know both work, and I'm not really concerned with "first 30 seconds" of measuring output in a sphere. Just in general, does it really matter?



I use the VTC6 in my SC600w MkIV Plus. It's not really necessary, but I estimate the current draw on max is probably between 6A (on a fresh cell) and 8A (when the cell is almost depleted). The Sanyo GA (which is ideal for all the other zebras) is a 10A cell, so you can use it in the 600w Plus, but it's getting near the upper limit of the cell. So, I figure the VTC6 is probably a better cell if you're using the light on max a lot.

I do use the GA cell in the Plus for bike rides, when I know I'm not going to be using max output (which is most of the time). It gives about a half-hour more runtime at 700 lumens (which is what I use 90% of the time as by bike light).

All that said, you're probably not going to be able to use max output for more than a minute or two, unless it's winter or a cool night with some wind. So, using a GA cell in summer is perfectly fine.

In winter, on max output, a VTC6 probably has some advantages beyond just the 10A vs 15A rating. The VTC6 is less susceptible to losing capacity in very cold conditions, so it will probably out-perform the GA in the cold.


----------



## markr6

OK thanks. I was on the fence, but since I don't like to run lights hot I passed on the VTC6. For $6 I should have just ordered both!


----------



## markr6

So are there any official Zebralight dealers left in the US? The one near me is now gone and other than ebay and amazon it seems like direct from ZL is the way to go.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

markr6 said:


> So are there any official Zebralight dealers left in the US? The one near me is now gone and other than ebay and amazon it seems like direct from ZL is the way to go.



I used to buy from Illum several years ago. But last time I checked, they only stocked old versions of ZL's.

Buying direct is easy. Takes only a week from China. I think if you're in the US, it might come from a warehouse there even faster.


----------



## markr6

Yeah Illumn is out. They have 3 models listed. Only 2 in stock. And all of which were introduced 3, 4 and 5 years ago! I can't really call that a dealer.

I buy from ZL and it takes 2-3 days, but I just thought of several of the US guys and wondered what happened...just curious.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

markr6 said:


> I buy from ZL and it takes 2-3 days, but I just thought of several of the US guys and wondered what happened...just curious.



Maybe ZL didn't want to sell the lights at wholesale price. Generally, a retailer will sell it for double what it pays wholesale. So, Zebralight can either sell a light wholesale for $50 to a retailer, or sell it for $100 themselves. Depending on the margins, it can make more sense to sell direct, especially now that anyone can open an on-line store and do it themselves.


----------



## eraursls1984

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Maybe ZL didn't want to sell the lights at wholesale price. Generally, a retailer will sell it for double what it pays wholesale. So, Zebralight can either sell a light wholesale for $50 to a retailer, or sell it for $100 themselves. Depending on the margins, it can make more sense to sell direct, especially now that anyone can open an on-line store and do it themselves.



Margins for the dealers was very low. By the time they handle any returns or warranty claims, it's not worth it.


----------



## Mr. LED

Zebralight has just updated the spreadsheet and added Eco series flashlights and headlamps. Models F5 and H5 (AA), F6 and H6 (18650).


----------



## Bob_McBob

The eco series has been there for two years now. They used to have CR123A models listed as well.

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...Zebralight-Eco-Series-Flashlight-and-Headlamp


----------



## jabe1

...and still no product pages.


----------



## mountainwalker

Can anyone recommend good reliable US resellers for Zebralights?


----------



## archimedes

mountainwalker said:


> Can anyone recommend good reliable US resellers for Zebralights?


So as not to derail this thread, any responses to @mountainwalker should be directed here ...

https://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=451019

No more spamming of this same topic please.

Thank you.


----------



## Mr. LED

Bob_McBob said:


> The eco series has been there for two years now. They used to have CR123A models listed as well.
> 
> http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...Zebralight-Eco-Series-Flashlight-and-Headlamp



Sorry, didn’t notice that.


----------



## gurdygurds

Any of you Zebra folks use a headlamp (detached from the headstrap) as your normal everyday flashlight? Headlamps are a new world to me and while I would get use out of it when camping or doing certain things, it's main usage would be hand held. Just wanted to see if anyone out there does the same and what are the pros and cons of using a headlamp as a handheld light. Happy Friday!


----------



## likethevegetable

gurdygurds said:


> Any of you Zebra folks use a headlamp (detached from the headstrap) as your normal everyday flashlight? Headlamps are a new world to me and while I would get use out of it when camping or doing certain things, it's main usage would be hand held. Just wanted to see if anyone out there does the same and what are the pros and cons of using a headlamp as a handheld light. Happy Friday!


 

I sure do! I won't even get an SC5x or SC6x because my H53c and H600Fc do everything that they can, and more. Although I'll probably get an SC7x in the future...

They are much preferred by me because you can set them up on table and point in any direction, either on tailcap or by using pocket clip as a wedge. You can also clip it in your breast pocket or shirt collar. Additionally, slap some magnets on the pocket clip and you have an entire hemisphere you can point the light at - these options are not possible with a straight light. The only disadvantage I can think of is that some people prefer the feel of straight lights in their hand.


----------



## ven

I have been using h600fw mkII here and there in work, as mentioned it can feel kind of different compared to the straight light. Its handy for quick inspections, nice 4400k i also like and is easy on the eye. I do sometimes wish it had a magnetic tail cap, however i have a habit of knocking them off anyway..............maybe a good thing!





With clip, can be placed on the front of a coat/jacket for ease. For my general EDC uses, i could use it for that yes. Just the change in hold would be the only slight issue. I might give it ago for a bit this winter


----------



## 5S8Zh5

ven said:


> I have been using h600fw mkII here and there in work, as mentioned it can feel kind of different compared to the straight light. Its handy for quick inspections, *nice 4400k i also like and is easy on the eye*....


What is the warmest Zebralight available?


----------



## Dio

5S8Zh5 said:


> What is the warmest Zebralight available?



I would say either the SC53c or the SC64c.


----------



## ven

4000k iirc is around the warmest, trouble i have found though, its quite yellow or certainly a risk of.


----------



## 5S8Zh5

Dio said:


> I would say either the SC53c or the SC64c.





ven said:


> 4000k iirc is around the warmest, trouble i have found though, its quite yellow or certainly a risk of.



Thanks! Does anyone know what the X000K temp is for the Nitecore Tip w/Nichia NVSL219B LED?


----------



## 5S8Zh5

I've had a H502w since Sep 2016 (ribbed tube), and I picked it up and started playing with it. Long story short, it just replaced my PD22 in my pocket as EDC. I know it's a headlight - with a top button and side beam, but I like it as a pocket light. Just checked the battery indicator and it flashed 4 times - is that max? What does the CE on the side stand for?


----------



## aginthelaw

5S8Zh5 said:


> I've had a H502w since Sep 2016 (ribbed tube), and I picked it up and started playing with it. Long story short, it just replaced my PD22 in my pocket as EDC. I know it's a headlight - with a top button and side beam, but I like it as a pocket light. Just checked the battery indicator and it flashed 4 times - is that max? What does the CE on the side stand for?



CE is an abbreviation for some regulatory arm that approves consumer electronics. It’s found on radios, computers, etc.


----------



## holygeez03

5S8Zh5 said:


> What is the warmest Zebralight available?




The SC600w MKIV Plus gets very warm, very quick.... haha


----------



## Connor

5S8Zh5 said:


> What does the CE on the side stand for?



https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CE_marking


----------



## 5S8Zh5

5S8Zh5 said:


> I've had a H502w since Sep 2016 (ribbed tube), and I picked it up and started playing with it. Long story short, it just replaced my PD22 in my pocket as EDC. I know it's a headlight - with a top button and side beam, but I like it as a pocket light. Just checked the battery indicator and it flashed 4 times - is that max?


Just found the box and sure enough, the pocket clips was in it - perfect for a lanyard - and it indexes the beam orientation for no look draw and operation during pre-sunrise dog poop pickup duties in the morning.


----------



## 5S8Zh5

what does _Tint deviation: 2-step_ mean?

i was thinking that my H502w flood headlamp light for pocket carry everyday would do well in changing tire duties while tail standing. or, i could make sure i bring the head strap whenever i drive lol.


----------



## markr6

5S8Zh5 said:


> what does _Tint deviation: 2-step_ mean?
> 
> i was thinking that my H502w flood headlamp light for pocket carry everyday would do well in changing tire duties while tail standing. or, i could make sure i bring the head strap whenever i drive lol.



Good info here from maukka: http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?443749-Zebralight-SC64c-(XP-L2)-measurements-or-quot-why-2-step-means-squat-quot

the funny thing is, all my 5 step lights look MUCH better than any 3's I've tried. But it was a gamble and those varied a lot over the years so I won't be selling many of my Zebralights. My SC64w? Basically a Nichia 219B with only a little less noticeable CRI.


----------



## eraursls1984

markr6 said:


> My SC64w? Basically a Nichia 219B with only a little less noticeable CRI.


Man, I hope I get lucky when I replace my SC62w that I just lost. I wish they'd use XP-L HI's, they have been the most consistly nice tint of all emitters I've used, except for the 219B's. 

Does the newest H600w have the pogo pins like the SC63/64?


----------



## markr6

eraursls1984 said:


> Does the newest H600w have the pogo pins like the SC63/64?



I believe pins on the head, spring in cap. Can someone confirm? I still have the MK II


----------



## dmsoule

markr6 said:


> I believe pins on the head, spring in cap. Can someone confirm? I still have the MK II



Yes, my h604c has five pogo pins at the head and a spring at the tail cap.


----------



## gurdygurds

So who are the wizards that can mod these things? If they had good tint they would be my end all be all. I can survive with this SC53w just fine, but if it had a nice warm even tint I’d be in flashlight nirvana.


----------



## Swedpat

I have SC53c and H53c. There is a very slight tint difference between them only noticeable with a side by side comparison. Both of them have the most incan reminding tint I ever experienced with an LED. This makes me wanting a SC64c!


----------



## 5S8Zh5

markr6 said:


> Good info here from maukka: http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?443749-Zebralight-SC64c-(XP-L2)-measurements-or-quot-why-2-step-means-squat-quot
> 
> the funny thing is, all my 5 step lights look MUCH better than any 3's I've tried. But it was a gamble and those varied a lot over the years so I won't be selling many of my Zebralights. My SC64w? Basically a Nichia 219B with only a little less noticeable CRI.


Still don't have a clue as to what  _Tint deviation: 2-step _means_. _Is it a mode, or an LED tint?


----------



## markr6

5S8Zh5 said:


> Still don't have a clue as to what  _Tint deviation: 2-step _means_. _Is it a mode, or an LED tint?



Here's a simpler diagram. http://www.dga.it/en/elissi-macadam

You want to stay as close to the black body curve of white light as possible, so the 2-step is good. 3 is OK. It goes wild from there, hence the "tint lottery".


----------



## Tejasandre

H600Fd Mk IV 18650 XHP50.2 Floody 5000K

Anyone have issues with it draining batteries while it’s put away?


----------



## JStraus

I have not experienced that with any of my several ZL's. I'd definitely contact Zebralight because I think that's a defect.



Tejasandre said:


> H600Fd Mk IV 18650 XHP50.2 Floody 5000K
> 
> Anyone have issues with it draining batteries while it’s put away?


----------



## markr6

JStraus said:


> I have not experienced that with any of my several ZL's. I'd definitely contact Zebralight because I think that's a defect.



Same thoughts here. ZL is one of the best, if not THE BEST, when it comes to low parasitic drain with electronic switches.


----------



## 18650

5S8Zh5 said:


> Still don't have a clue as to what  _Tint deviation: 2-step _means_. _Is it a mode, or an LED tint?


 It means the tints of the LED's within the given 2 step batch will all fall within the defined area. Larger step numbers mean greater variation from LED to LED within the same batch. Smaller numbers mean lesser variations.


----------



## Tejasandre

JStraus said:


> I have not experienced that with any of my several ZL's. I'd definitely contact Zebralight because I think that's a defect.





markr6 said:


> Same thoughts here. ZL is one of the best, if not THE BEST, when it comes to low parasitic drain with electronic switches.



Thanks guys. Got an email out to zebra light. Gonna try a different battery while I wait.


----------



## gurdygurds

Does Zebralight have any interaction on this or any other forum? I ask because it seems like some of the gripes that the flashlight crowd have with their lights could be easily fixed. Mainly led choice and tint. lots Of us feel the lights are amazing but we struggle with living with the color of light that the leds put out. This seems like an easy fix no? Malkoff neutrals don’t have tint shift with loads of green. Maglite spectrum warm have really nice warm beams that are even. Obviously with all the electronics going on things will glitch or you’ll get a bad light at times, but why is beam color such an issue still? If zebralight used the led that’s in my solitaire warm white I’d throw a party!


----------



## likethevegetable

gurdygurds said:


> Does Zebralight have any interaction on this or any other forum? I ask because it seems like some of the gripes that the flashlight crowd have with their lights could be easily fixed. Mainly led choice and tint. lots Of us feel the lights are amazing but we struggle with living with the color of light that the leds put out. This seems like an easy fix no? Malkoff neutrals don’t have tint shift with loads of green. Maglite spectrum warm have really nice warm beams that are even. Obviously with all the electronics going on things will glitch or you’ll get a bad light at times, but why is beam color such an issue still? If zebralight used the led that’s in my solitaire warm white I’d throw a party!



None that I've seen, or at least no conspicuous interaction. I often think that they MUST be curious and check out the forums at least once in a while.

Have you tried their frosted lenses or DC-Fix?

Like most others, I find tint shift unpleasant in both practice and in white-wall analysis. This drove me to put some DC-Fix on my first ZL, an H53c. Since then, I'm all about diffused optics. When it comes to less than popular tints like yellow or, dare I say, green, I find on a white setting it doesn't look near as good, but in practice, say in a forest, it looks great. For example, my H600Fc is more neutral, perhaps closers to the BBL (pure speculation) than my H53Fc and looks a lot nicer in a white room, but out camping, I prefer my yellowish H53Fc.


----------



## 5S8Zh5

markr6 said:


> Here's a simpler diagram. http://www.dga.it/en/elissi-macadam
> 
> You want to stay as close to the black body curve of white light as possible, so the 2-step is good. 3 is OK. It goes wild from there, hence the "tint lottery".





18650 said:


> It means the tints of the LED's within the given 2 step batch will all fall within the defined area. Larger step numbers mean greater variation from LED to LED within the same batch. Smaller numbers mean lesser variations.


Thanks!


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

gurdygurds said:


> Does Zebralight have any interaction on this or any other forum? I ask because it seems like some of the gripes that the flashlight crowd have with their lights could be easily fixed. Mainly led choice and tint. lots Of us feel the lights are amazing but we struggle with living with the color of light that the leds put out. This seems like an easy fix no? Malkoff neutrals don’t have tint shift with loads of green. Maglite spectrum warm have really nice warm beams that are even. Obviously with all the electronics going on things will glitch or you’ll get a bad light at times, but why is beam color such an issue still? If zebralight used the led that’s in my solitaire warm white I’d throw a party!



Personally, I don't think the "tint lottery" is an issue, at least not any more. There will always be some issues with lights, and given the popularity of Zebralights on this forum, there's bound to be some people that get a greenish tint or are sensitive to tint issues. Those are the people you hear about. Far less people will get a light they're satisfied with and post that they're happy about it. It's just the way the Internet works.

For me, I've been pretty happy with all my Zebralight tints, going back about 5 years. The only one that is slightly greenish, is a first edition SC52 cool white, but I only bought it because neutrals weren't out yet. But it's no worse than any of my other XML cool whites from back in those days.

If you're expecting perfect, you'll have to stick to the HI versions of Cree LEDs. The regular domed Cree emitters will always have some tint shift, and some green in the corona, regardless of the brand of light. Zebralight doesn't do Nichia 219 emitters.

I'm sure if I bought 100 Zebralights, at least 1 of them would be an ugly green I wasn't happy with.


----------



## gurdygurds

I was just reading through the sc64c thread and it’s almost ALL posts about tint, at least once the light got into peoples hands. So I’d say the tint lottery is still very much a thing and again makes me wonder why zebralight chooses the leds that they do.


----------



## eraursls1984

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Personally, I don't think the "tint lottery" is an issue, at least not any more. There will always be some issues with lights, and given the popularity of Zebralights on this forum, there's bound to be some people that get a greenish tint or are sensitive to tint issues. Those are the people you hear about. Far less people will get a light they're satisfied with and post that they're happy about it. It's just the way the Internet works.
> 
> For me, I've been pretty happy with all my Zebralight tints, going back about 5 years. The only one that is slightly greenish, is a first edition SC52 cool white, but I only bought it because neutrals weren't out yet. But it's no worse than any of my other XML cool whites from back in those days.
> 
> If you're expecting perfect, you'll have to stick to the HI versions of Cree LEDs. The regular domed Cree emitters will always have some tint shift, and some green in the corona, regardless of the brand of light. Zebralight doesn't do Nichia 219 emitters.
> 
> I'm sure if I bought 100 Zebralights, at least 1 of them would be an ugly green I wasn't happy with.



I disagree. I have the latest SC5c and the tint is pretty bad. I don't think it's so much that it's bad because of the tint lottery, just that most of the new c's are too yellow. Of the 5 I've had one was perfect, one was good, one barely acceptable, and two horrible. If only they would choose Cree HI, which I have found to be extremely consistent and great tint. I'd also love a 219B version, but I know that'd never happen.


----------



## Dio

The problem is, most people here aren't buying lights because they need them. 

When you aren't buying a light because you need to look at something it seems to cause most owners to see the tint shift. Maybe using the light to actually see something they were looking for or to light a path through the bush to illuminte hazards, would distract them enough from the tint shift to the point where they realized their lights were actually not that bad afterall.

I guess until we buy lights to use and not because we're just a sad bunch of people obsessed with the colour of the light coming out of our devices - even if it has absolutely no negative impact - posts about tint will never stop.. Wait, what am I saying?!? 3 people on here have over 1000 posts on how bad tint shift is so it must be so!!!


GO AND USE YOUR DAMN LIGHTS


----------



## gurdygurds

You being serious?


Dio said:


> The problem is, most people here aren't buying lights because they need them.
> 
> When you aren't buying a light because you need to look at something it seems to cause most owners to see the tint shift. Maybe using the light to actually see something they were looking for or to light a path through the bush to illuminte hazards, would distract them enough from the tint shift to the point where they realized their lights were actually not that bad afterall.
> 
> I guess until we buy lights to use and not because we're just a sad bunch of people obsessed with the colour of the light coming out of our devices - even if it has absolutely no negative impact - posts about tint will never stop.. Wait, what am I saying?!? 3 people on here have over 1000 posts on how bad tint shift is so it must be so!!!
> 
> 
> GO AND USE YOUR DAMN LIGHTS


----------



## bykfixer

gurdygurds said:


> I was just reading through the sc64c thread and it’s almost ALL posts about tint, at least once the light got into peoples hands. So I’d say the tint lottery is still very much a thing and again makes me wonder why zebralight chooses the leds that they do.



GG; Your inbox is full.


Good points Dio. Pressing inviso like button for post 2301.


----------



## gurdygurds

To rant about how everyone is wasting their time and should go USE YOUR DAMN LIGHTS seems extremely lame. Especially when Dio’s posts shows plenty of talk about tint and color shift etc. Poor form sir. Pressing invisible LAME button.


bykfixer said:


> GG; Your inbox is full.
> 
> 
> Good points Dio. Pressing inviso like button for post 2301.


----------



## Zak

Dio said:


> When you aren't buying a light because you need to look at something it seems to cause most owners to see the tint shift. Maybe using the light to actually see something they were looking for or to light a path through the bush to illuminte hazards, would distract them enough from the tint shift to the point where they realized their lights were actually not that bad afterall.



If you were to buy a BMW M3 and found the steering numb and the exhaust note uninspired, it would be entirely reasonable to express disappointment. Sure, it can still drive you from here to there just fine, but so can a Chevrolet Spark that costs 1/5 as much. You didn't buy a performance-oriented version of an already premium car just for its ability to adequately get from here to there.

Similarly, if you buy a high-CRI Zebralight, you're paying a fairly high price for a flashlight marketed in part based on its color quality. It's reasonable to complain when something about the color quality isn't awesome. The enthusiast community has done enough experimentation with different emitters that Zebralight could just pick one we generally like without doing any work on its own. Currently, the Samsung LH351D would make a lot of sense, and has already been shown to work well in the SC64c.

I use my lights. The ones I use a lot have high CRI and nice tint.


----------



## Derek Dean

Dio said:


> The problem is, most people here aren't buying lights because they need them.
> 
> When you aren't buying a light because you need to look at something it seems to cause most owners to see the tint shift. Maybe using the light to actually see something they were looking for or to light a path through the bush to illuminte hazards, would distract them enough from the tint shift to the point where they realized their lights were actually not that bad afterall.
> 
> I guess until we buy lights to use and not because we're just a sad bunch of people obsessed with the colour of the light coming out of our devices - even if it has absolutely no negative impact - posts about tint will never stop.. Wait, what am I saying?!? 3 people on here have over 1000 posts on how bad tint shift is so it must be so!!!
> 
> 
> GO AND USE YOUR DAMN LIGHTS



I think we should simply chalk this post up to a somewhat new member's misunderstanding of our community. From my time here, I've come to know that a great many folks who frequent this forum use their lights extensively, often, like myself, on their job every night. In fact, it's precisely because of this dependence on our lights that we are constantly searching for better tools to help us do our jobs better. 

For some, that job might simply be walking the dog at night, for others it's inspecting aircraft in a hanger or attaching color coded wires in a computer system, and yet for others it might be an emergency rescue where a light will be used to help check for vital signs, a situation where the color of the light can be extremely important. 

So, when it seems that we tend to obsess about little things like beam shape, or tint, it's often because we find these things do indeed make a difference in how we use our lights.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

gurdygurds said:


> I was just reading through the sc64c thread and it’s almost ALL posts about tint, at least once the light got into peoples hands. So I’d say the tint lottery is still very much a thing and again makes me wonder why zebralight chooses the leds that they do.



Fair enough. Almost all my Zebras are "w" tints, not the "c" tints which seem to have more reports about them.

However, it would be interesting to know what the REAL "bad tint" rate is with the "c" tints. It's very possible that most of them are very good, and there's just a few bad tints out of every 1000 lights or something. Generally, I expect that people who are buying the "c" tints are more demanding of color than most people, and that may be a cause of some of the reports too.

I won't be buying any of the "c" tints anytime soon, though that's because I buy Zebras for their output and efficiency (and small size) more than for CRI.


----------



## Bob_McBob

A wild Samsung appeared!







(SC64c with 4000K LH351D on the left, SC63w on the right)


----------



## dmsoule

Nice! What did you use to remove the bezel?


----------



## ven

Awesome!!!


----------



## markr6

"GO AND USE YOUR DAMN LIGHTS"

I'm going to join a Corvette forum. When people start complaining about aesthetics on a $60,000 car, I'll say "GO AND DRIVE YOUR DAMN CAR".


----------



## archimedes

Dio said:


> The problem is, most people here aren't buying lights because they need them.



Curious as to the basis for your assertion here.



Dio said:


> When you aren't buying a light because you need to look at something it seems to cause most owners to see the tint shift. Maybe using the light to actually see something they were looking for or to light a path through the bush to illuminte hazards, would distract them enough from the tint shift to the point where they realized their lights were actually not that bad afterall.
> 
> I guess until we buy lights to use and not because we're just a sad bunch of people obsessed with the colour of the light coming out of our devices - even if it has absolutely no negative impact - posts about tint will never stop.. Wait, what am I saying?!? 3 people on here have over 1000 posts on how bad tint shift is so it must be so!!!
> 
> GO AND USE YOUR DAMN LIGHTS



Leaving aside the aggressive and unpleasant tone, why on earth would I care about the tint of a light that I never use ???

I am truly confused by this.

I have many flashlights, and regularly use the vast majority of these. Others are certainly welcome to their opinion and preferences, but _for me personally_, tint specifically is one of the very *most* important characteristics of the quality of light produced by these tools. If the tint doesn't suit my preferences, or is at least acceptable, I generally have no use for it at all.

The exception to this includes a few flashlights which I do keep essentially as "collectibles" .... For one reason or another, they are historical or vintage items , or "metal art" , or similar. And yes, those rarely or ever are even turned on. And yes, for those, I don't really care much about the tint (and several are indeed from the early "alien blue or squid green" emitter era) .

No need to be attacking others for simply having different preferences. There are plenty of people on CPF who care more about maximum output, than tint or CRI, and that's fine too ... :shrug:


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

archimedes said:


> Dio said:
> 
> 
> 
> The problem is, most people here aren't buying lights because they need them.
> 
> 
> 
> Curious as to the basis for your assertion here.
Click to expand...


I'm pretty confident that most people on this flashaholic group, don't actually _need_ yet another light to add to their existing pile of 20, 30, or 50 lights. For the most part, we buy them as toys. The vast majority of people _need_ about 1 or maybe 2 lights, and those are $10 department store lights, not $100+ lights.

Sure, we can try to justify the purchase of another $100 light, but I've given up trying to spin that story. It's a toy. I want it. Gimmee!!

That said, I think the fact it's a toy is a reason to expect good tint, not accept poor tint. But I'm still unconvinced that Zebralight has any worse tint issue than any other manufacturer that uses Cree LEDs.


----------



## archimedes

I think it's fine to speak for oneself, if you feel that you don't want or need another light, if that is the case. Or if you do, for any reason, or no reason at all.

I think making assumptions about others' wants or needs, is a little less obvious.


----------



## Bob_McBob

dmsoule said:


> Nice! What did you use to remove the bezel?



I used a cheap carving wedge I sharpened and polished beforehand. The o-ring behind the lens has enough give you can slightly compress it while inserting a thin tool under the bezel. Work your way around, very gently prying, and it will eventually pop off. That's the easy part of the mod though.

The entire process is documented here:

https://imgur.com/a/N9scBiB


----------



## markr6

Well done! Dammit Zebralight...please just start doing customs already!!!


----------



## ven

:goodjob::rock:


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

archimedes said:


> I think it's fine to speak for oneself, if you feel that you don't want or need another light, if that is the case. Or if you do, for any reason, or no reason at all.
> 
> I think making assumptions about others' wants or needs, is a little less obvious.



No, I think it's pretty obvious that someone doesn't need 20+ flashlights. 

Anyone here have less than that? If so, it won't be long before you have more.


----------



## gurdygurds

I have 12 lights currently, and that includes two photon freedoms. The Zebras however are so stinking versatile, that they do the job of all my lights in one tidy package. Cool mod Bob McBob! Don’t see many that able to pull that off. Did you re-pot everything once you finished?


----------



## Bob_McBob

gurdygurds said:


> Cool mod Bob McBob! Don’t see many that able to pull that off. Did you re-pot everything once you finished?



The potting material below the board stays in place nicely, so the components slip back in with a perfect fit. I didn't bother repotting the top. I'm not convinced it's doing a whole lot other than perhaps stabilizing the wire that runs through it, and soft silicone potting material is prohibitively expensive if you only need a small amount ($200+).


----------



## Auringonvalo

I'm planning to buy a backup flashlight because SC600Fd Mk3 is the only good light I have. Maybe getting Mk4 to get good flood with good colors. Is there any issues compared Mk3? Zebralight is not planning to release "Sc600Fd Mk5"? Any other light with similar flood, colors but can produce more lumens? I think SC600Fd is a bit too compact, could be somewhat bigger for another battery and better cooling probably. Astrolux MF01 was an option, but no one sells them in EU, so custom fees can make it quite expensive and heard about quality issues and how banggood might have poor customer service for warranty.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Auringonvalo said:


> I'm planning to buy a backup flashlight because SC600Fd Mk3 is the only good light I have. Maybe getting Mk4 to get good flood with good colors. Is there any issues compared Mk3? Zebralight is not planning to release "Sc600Fd Mk5"? Any other light with similar flood, colors but can produce more lumens? I think SC600Fd is a bit too compact, could be somewhat bigger for another battery and better cooling probably.



Sounds like you should wait for the SC700d, which Zebralight will probably release sometime in the next couple of months.


----------



## Bob_McBob

Here's a photo of the H600w Mk IV opened up from Redditor Aeskau. It seems Zebralight have switched to the integrated driver design for all models including non-mule headlamps, which severely limits emitter swap options. There won't be a 144A or E21A ZL headlamp mod. On the plus side the H600Fx models look pretty good to begin with. If high CRI XHP35s in tints above 3000K ever show up they would be an option for the regular models.


----------



## Zak

Bob_McBob said:


> Here's a photo of the H600w Mk IV opened up from Redditor Aeskau. It seems Zebralight have switched to the integrated driver design for all models including non-mule headlamps, which severely limits emitter swap options. There won't be a 144A or E21A ZL headlamp mod. On the plus side the H600Fx models look pretty good to begin with. If high CRI XHP35s in tints above 3000K ever show up they would be an option for the regular models.



Is 5700K better? Arrow has the XHP35A-00-0000-0D0UC40E2 in single quantities.


----------



## Bob_McBob

Zak said:


> Is 5700K better? Arrow has the XHP35A-00-0000-0D0UC40E2 in single quantities.



I meant to say "tints I actually want in a light above 3000K" 

I was debating getting one of those in my last Arrow order but I know I'll never actually keep it in a light at 5700K. The 3000K HI is at least novel enough to get some time in my U21.


----------



## Zak

I actually kind of like my 5700K 219B. Is a 219B cheating?


----------



## agent8698

My last post was 4 years ago, when I purchased a Zebralight H600W Mark II Neutral White from Brightguy.com for $89. It's a headlamp, but I never use it that way, I use it as a general purpose flashlight. It's been great. See 30-second video demonstration on my Google Drive. I was driving at night, came across some deer, turned on the Zerbralight, held it out the window, if you didn't know, you would think it's a police searchlight: https://drive.google.com/open?id=1Ul7ZhPzWalArJqZ8dd_oq7m_fzW6_bId


----------



## ven

Very cool agent, i have (i think anyway) the same light except frosted(H600Fw).......................its actually my fav body out of all the ZL mk's


----------



## markr6

*SC64w HI *just added to the sheet!

The Econ headlamps have been removed, no surprise to me.


----------



## emarkd

markr6 said:


> The Econ headlamps have been removed, no surprise to me.



...and yet the C3 was not. I'm trying not to read too much into that, but if it was dead, vaporware, I'd think they would have removed it today as well. They were obviously cleaning up the sheet, so why wouldn't they?

I'm probably reading too much into that.


----------



## Bob_McBob

I am skeptical about whether the H600c and d IV will look decent without the frosted glass. It hides a multitude of XHP50.2 sins.


----------



## markr6

emarkd said:


> ...and yet the C3 was not. I'm trying not to read too much into that, but if it was dead, vaporware, I'd think they would have removed it today as well. They were obviously cleaning up the sheet, so why wouldn't they?
> 
> I'm probably reading too much into that.



Yes, I'm still hopeful! Regarding the SC64w HI, I wonder if it will be worthwhile since I already have the SC600w HI. Without a larger reflector, it would probably be a waste for me to have all 3. Well, not really, but need to save some cash for the SC700!


----------



## likethevegetable

119 USD = 155 CAD for the SC700d, + shipping and new 2170 cells, ouch. 

I'll defer from pre-ordering and have to see the beam (with DC-fix too) and read some reviews before taking the plunge (half-heartedly hoping for a flaw so I don't feel compelled to buy this..) 

The H503w would be nice to have. Already have the H53c and H53Fc though... And a lot of latex finger cots for diffusion lol


----------



## markr6

likethevegetable said:


> I'll defer from pre-ordering and have to see the beam (with DC-fix too) and read some reviews before taking the plunge (half-heartedly hoping for a flaw so I don't feel compelled to buy this..)



HAHA! I may join you on this plan.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

markr6 said:


> *SC64w HI *just added to the sheet!



I am going to order a SC64w soon. I wonder if it's worth waiting for the SC64w HI? Since I already have the 600w HI, maybe not? Though, I really really like the tint of the 600w HI. It would be great to have that tint in a smaller format. But the smaller hotspot makes the HI less useful as an EDC. Decisions, decisions...


----------



## NPL

SC64w HI looks like a nice addition with good tint. If you only have one zebra edc, looks like the best option. If you already have an sc600w HI, looks redundant. SC64w is probably a better companion to sc600wHI.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

NPL said:


> SC64w HI looks like a nice addition with good tint. If you only have one zebra edc, looks like the best option. If you already have an sc600w HI, looks redundant. SC64w is probably a better companion to sc600wHI.



Yeah, I think you're right. I have the 600w HI for throw, the 600w Plus for flood, so a regular beam profile (similar to my AA Zebras) would be a better fit.


----------



## NPL

Bob_McBob said:


> I am skeptical about whether the H600c and d IV will look decent without the frosted glass. It hides a multitude of XHP50.2 sins.


Was wondering the same thing!


----------



## 18650

It looks like I'll be waiting another year for a 5000K EDC from them. I wish ZL would simplify their CCT offerings and just go with 4000K, 5000K, 5700K and drop 4500K.


----------



## JoeRodge

I love 4500k lol.


----------



## eraursls1984

18650 said:


> It looks like I'll be waiting another year for a 5000K EDC from them. I wish ZL would simplify their CCT offerings and just go with 4000K, 5000K, 5700K and drop 4500K.


Only if they stop using the garbage XP-L2 and use the XP-L HI (or maybe XHP35). I'd prefer 4000K over 4500K, but the current C's look like poop!


----------



## NPL

I love 4500k too.


----------



## markr6

NPL said:


> I love 4500k too.



Another vote for 4500K, but the tint has to be good. I had to gamble a few times to nail it down and finally won. My SC64w 4500K is great, close enough to my Nichia lights.


----------



## gurdygurds

I asked zebralight about their led choices, mainly for their aa lights, and why they don’t use Nichia etc. here the response they gave me. 
o plans for any other LEDs that I know of in the near future. 



The XP-L2 "c" was among the very few choices we had at the begining of 2017. The Nichia 219B was on the way out. The 219C is not efficient (at 4.2C/w) compared to XM-L2 (at 2.2C/w), thermally, which means that any high power 219C lights heats up very quickly. The 219C has a 3-step tint deviation and is not that much better, statistically, from the XP-L2 with the metal reflector/coating and the glass lens we have (especially the corning gorilla glass in some of our lights). 



Sincerely,



ZebraLight, Inc.

2908 Story Rd. W


----------



## markr6

Back in 2013 I was told: _We have been looking into 'n' lights for years, way before 'd' and 'c' lights. For various (supply/channel related) reasons, we've not been able to produce any Nichia based lights up to now. But that might change later this year. Stay tuned. _


----------



## Zak

gurdygurds said:


> The 219C has a 3-step tint deviation and is not that much better, statistically, from the XP-L2 with the metal reflector/coating and the glass lens we have (especially the corning gorilla glass in some of our lights).



I've seen similar responses from Zebralight when other people have sent them the same thing. Indeed, Cree's 2-step binning is tighter than the 3-step Nichia usually offers (though if you buy a reel, you can get sextant bins). Thing is, in combination with Zebralight's optics, 2-step is a lie. (image credit: maukka)







Anyway, now the LH351D is an option, and we know that's good in the SC64c thanks to Bob_McBob. Since the early models had PWM ringing issues too, which has been fixed, they should just make an SC64c II with the Samsung emitter and driver update so people can tell them apart.


----------



## 18650

JoeRodge said:


> I love 4500k lol.


 My beef with 4500K as EDC is because indoor lighting doesn't match up with it (neither does midday sun honestly) and the other d lights are a little too frosty (floody) for EDC duty.


----------



## 18650

gurdygurds said:


> I asked zebralight about their led choices, mainly for their aa lights, and why they don’t use Nichia etc. here the response they gave me. o plans for any other LEDs that I know of in the near future.    The XP-L2 "c" was among the very few choices we had at the begining of 2017. The Nichia 219B was on the way out. The 219C is not efficient (at 4.2C/w) compared to XM-L2 (at 2.2C/w), thermally, which means that any high power 219C lights heats up very quickly. *The 219C has a 3-step tint deviation and is not that much better, statistically, from the XP-L2 with the metal reflector/coating and the glass lens we have (especially the corning gorilla glass in some of our lights).*    Sincerely,    ZebraLight, Inc.  2908 Story Rd. W


 I mean that's the story but it's not like the Cree's have been amazing.


----------



## gurdygurds

Yea I just asked and I’m passing along their response. After buying another SC53w I’m back to using it full time. Everything else is being ignored as the little zebra is so versatile. Perfect tint without any shift would just be the cherry on top, but I think the light is so good I won’t whine too much. 👍🏼


----------



## ven

Well my been around the world zebra is on its way back to me at last. I don’t ever want to go through this again! Sent to Texas at first and they knew I was UK. No big deal , but then they had to send China.....add another week to two on top of the two! Then week holiday and finally yesterday an update. Thankfully no $15 charge after the messing about, so that is appreciated. Also they did update me after the odd bit of pestering . Although not best pleased with time scale, prob 6 weeks+ it will be, they have come through so far. I was hoping the could swap out the cool LED(no biggie as it’s a clean beam)for a 5000k xml2 easywhite. Did not seem interested, even with wanting to pay for it. It’s an older mk1, not anything new to add.


----------



## markr6

SC700d and SC64w HI are up for sale. H600x IV series are up as well.

I a limiting myself to just one, so I can't decide between the 64w HI and 700d. I'm leaning towards the 700.


----------



## likethevegetable

markr6 said:


> SC700d and SC64w HI are up for sale. H600x IV series are up as well.
> 
> I a limiting myself to just one, so I can't decide between the 64w HI and 700d. I'm leaning towards the 700.



Clearly the answer is to get every ZL ever made..

Hah, jokes aside, I think starting a 2170 collection is a no-brainer.

I wonder if they'll announce any other 2170 lights. Maybe a more compact SC71x? Maybe a different CCT?


----------



## markr6

I think it will be the 700. CCT and CRI is perfect for me...on paper. Everyone seems to be saying the XHP 70.2 tint sucks, so I am holding off for now.


----------



## Nichia!

markr6 said:


> I think it will be the 700. CCT and CRI is perfect for me...on paper. Everyone seems to be saying the XHP 70.2 tint sucks, so I am holding off for now.



The tint is very bad but am going to buy one because of the output..


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

markr6 said:


> SC700d and SC64w HI are up for sale. H600x IV series are up as well.
> 
> I a limiting myself to just one, so I can't decide between the 64w HI and 700d. I'm leaning towards the 700.



I'm considering a SC64w HI, but I think I might wait for a review. I really want to know the throw, and how it compares to the SC600w HI. Right now, the sales page is missing the spec for the hot spot angle. (The SC600w HI has a 8 degree hot spot.)


----------



## markr6

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> I'm considering a SC64w HI, but I think I might wait for a review. I really want to know the throw, and how it compares to the SC600w HI. Right now, the sales page is missing the spec for the hot spot angle. (The SC600w HI has a 8 degree hot spot.)



I envision an SC62d kind of spot with the Luxeon T, if you ever had one of those. Not real throwy, but more defined hot spot. With the 64's reflector I just can't imagine it being much like the SC600 HI. But I think that would be a good useful light either way.


----------



## ven

markr6 said:


> I envision an SC62d kind of spot with the Luxeon T, if you ever had one of those. Not real throwy, but more defined hot spot. With the 64's reflector I just can't imagine it being much like the SC600 HI. But I think that would be a good useful light either way.



My fav zebra:rock:.........................i might have said it once or twice


----------



## eraursls1984

markr6 said:


> I envision an SC62d kind of spot with the Luxeon T, if you ever had one of those. Not real throwy, but more defined hot spot. With the 64's reflector I just can't imagine it being much like the SC600 HI. But I think that would be a good useful light either way.



Yeah, I wouldn't expect too much throw in the 64's. For me the HI's are all about good tint and less tint shift.


----------



## Tixx

Preorder on ZL website

SC700d 21700 XHP70.2 Neutral White High CRI Flashlight

H600c Mk IV 18650 XHP50.2 4000K High CRI Headlamp

H600d Mk IV 18650 XHP50.2 5000K High CRI Headlamp

H503w AA Neutral White Flood Headlamp


----------



## markr6

Tixx said:


> Preorder on ZL website
> 
> SC700d 21700 XHP70.2 Neutral White High CRI Flashlight
> 
> H600c Mk IV 18650 XHP50.2 4000K High CRI Headlamp
> 
> H600d Mk IV 18650 XHP50.2 5000K High CRI Headlamp
> 
> H503w AA Neutral White Flood Headlamp



Yes sir!


markr6 said:


> SC700d and SC64w HI are up for sale. H600x IV series are up as well.


----------



## Fireclaw18

Saw the picture of the SC700 on the Zebralight website. Looks good, but definitely too big for pocket EDC. Looks like a scaled-up SC600 with wider head. It's not for me.

I preordered an SC64w HI though.


----------



## Tixx

Fireclaw18 said:


> Saw the picture of the SC700 on the Zebralight website. Looks good, but definitely too big for pocket EDC. Looks like a scaled-up SC600 with wider head. It's not for me.
> 
> I preordered an SC64w HI though.



I agree! Missed that new one there SC64w HI. Might get that.


----------



## easilyled

It seems to me that although the SC700 has a single emitter, it might be a close rival to the Emisar D4S which has a quad-emitter-optic arrangement. It will be interesting to compare them.


----------



## markr6

easilyled said:


> It seems to me that although the SC700 has a single emitter, it might be a close rival to the Emisar D4S which has a quad-emitter-optic arrangement. It will be interesting to compare them.



That's exactly why I'm going for it. While it may not be a direct comparison, I often miss the UI and overall feel of the ZL after using my D4S for a while.


----------



## eraursls1984

I noticed that the HI's no longer say that they use the XHP35 HI's, only the XHP35. This is on both the description and the spreadsheet.


----------



## gurdygurds

I asked in he headlamp forum as well but thought I’d ask in here. 
How well do the SC aa models do in the Headstraps for the H aa models? Im sure it’s not ideal running a straight style zebra on the side of your head, but if it’s “good enough” I may just buy a strap for now to see how much use I’d get out of a headlamp. Thanks


----------



## MikeSalt

I see that Zebralight have a new AA-powered headlamp in the form of the H503w. I wonder if we'll see a H503*c* soon? The fact that it is a Cree doesn't bother me in a mule where tint-shift is much less an issue.


----------



## Bob_McBob

Zebralight just added the H503c, a *Samsung LH351D* light. FINALLY.


----------



## twistedraven

Not bad. LH351D is a nifty LED. Not the best tint, but serviceable, and outputs a lot of lumens with efficiency for its CRI.


----------



## MikeSalt

Bob_McBob said:


> Zebralight just added the H503c, a *Samsung LH351D* light. FINALLY.



Oh man, I've just purchased a H53Fc for a friend because I didn't think the H503c would be that far behind. I cannot see it on the main Zebralight website though, do you mind linking me to your source so that I may see the full spec? Cheers.


----------



## Bob_McBob

Click "compare all models" on the Zebralight site. It's a Google Sheets spreadsheet where new models first appear.


----------



## MikeSalt

Bob_McBob said:


> Click "compare all models" on the Zebralight site. It's a Google Sheets spreadsheet where new models first appear.



Thank you kindly :thumbsup:


----------



## Tixx

Bob_McBob said:


> Zebralight just added the H503c, a *Samsung LH351D* light. FINALLY.



Strange it is an AA light. Would have thought a cr123 or 18650


----------



## markr6

Tixx said:


> Strange it is an AA light. Would have thought a cr123 or 18650



Floody too. I have zero need for these. That's just me, though.


----------



## Tixx

markr6 said:


> Floody too. I have zero need for these. That's just me, though.



Yeah, definitely a pass for me as well. Just a strange offering.


----------



## holygeez03

I know this has been asked before... but one more time before I order some more 18650s for my Zebralights... will the Sony VTC6 30A High Discharge provide any benefit over a Sanyo GA 10A cell?

If not, I will probably stick with the higher capacity...


----------



## ven

There isn't a massive difference in the capacity, 200-300mah(the 3500mah are not that high, closer to 3300). The vtc6 and 30q will suffer less voltage sag under load ,when the voltage is lower as well. So as a rough example, your near 3.5v after a few hours use, want h1 and you will have more chance of holding it with the vtc6(rough idea). Still the GA are fine, i do prefer the vtc6 cells though, also the 30q. As the voltage drops, you need more amps to get the high levels. At 4.2v the amps will be less than whats required at say 3.6v...........(example).


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

holygeez03 said:


> I know this has been asked before... but one more time before I order some more 18650s for my Zebralights... will the Sony VTC6 30A High Discharge provide any benefit over a Sanyo GA 10A cell?



When I compared run-times on a regulated mode (from full to low-voltage step-down), the Sanyo GA lasts 17% longer than the Sony VTC6. However, that's at a fairly low current, due to needing to stick to a regulated non-PID mode. I suspect if you're running the light on max a lot, then the run-times will be closer.

This was tested on the SC600w MkIV HI and the SC600w MkIV Plus, on their lowest high mode. But I also get similar results when running at 700 lumens on my bike, where wind keeps the PID from kicking in.


----------



## dmsoule

It seems Zebralight is finally admitting that the high-CRI xp-l2 emitters don’t perform up to spec. Just added to the spreadsheet:

C64c LE791Samsung LH351D90+4000spill + spot162018Limited Edition with Samsung LH351D in T6 or T7 bin


----------



## markr6

SC64c LE looks great. I feel like 4000K is getting too warm for me, but I do have a 4000K in my MD2 which is perfect. I think it just all depends on the tint. In my MD2, it's very Nichia-pink, so it's fine.

Zebralight stop pumping out these new lights I can't keep up!! 

At this point, I need to stand back and see what else happens before jumping the gun. The SC700d I have on order has to do for now.


----------



## neutralwhite

yes, it looks a little yellowy but cant go by pictures much I guess. I think 4500 9080 is a safer bet if can be modded.



markr6 said:


> SC64c LE looks great. I feel like 4000K is getting too warm for me, but I do have a 4000K in my MD2 which is perfect. I think it just all depends on the tint. In my MD2, it's very Nichia-pink, so it's fine.
> 
> Zebralight stop pumping out these new lights I can't keep up!!
> 
> At this point, I need to stand back and see what else happens before jumping the gun. The SC700d I have on order has to do for now.


----------



## twistedraven

4000k will always be a more yellow/amber looking CCT compared to 4500k, even if both are theoretically right on the BBL. All LH351Ds I've seen though are somewhat on the green side of the BBL though. Won't be near as much as the LP2, and way less tint shift within the beam, but we're not talking about a rosy below BBL type of emitter like the SW45K R9080 nichias.


----------



## markr6

twistedraven said:


> 4000k will always be a more yellow/amber looking CCT compared to 4500k, even if both are theoretically right on the BBL. All LH351Ds I've seen though are somewhat on the green side of the BBL though. Won't be near as much as the LP2, and way less tint shift within the beam, but we're not talking about a rosy below BBL type of emitter like the SW45K R9080 nichias.



Even the 4000K M61 drop-in I mention above is rosy, no yellow/green at all. In that case I can do 4000K, otherwise I want something cooler/white.

https://www.illumn.com/malkoff-devices-m61-219b-v2.html


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Strange why Zebralight doesn't choose better Cree XP-L tints for its neutral options. I have the BLF A6 in both the 5000K XP-L 3D tint, and the 4000K XP-L 5A tint. Both are very pleasant emitters, no green/yellow, with a hint of rosy in the beam. So Cree does offer tints below BBL.


----------



## markr6

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Strange why Zebralight doesn't choose better Cree XP-L tints for its neutral options. I have the BLF A6 in both the 5000K XP-L 3D tint, and the 4000K XP-L 5A tint. Both are very pleasant emitters, no green/yellow, with a hint of rosy in the beam. So Cree does offer tints below BBL.



I have that A6 in the 5000K as well. Very nice, cool but not too cool.


----------



## Tixx

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Strange why Zebralight doesn't choose better Cree XP-L tints for its neutral options. I have the BLF A6 in both the 5000K XP-L 3D tint, and the 4000K XP-L 5A tint. Both are very pleasant emitters, no green/yellow, with a hint of rosy in the beam. So Cree does offer tints below BBL.



Always wondered this as well. I have an Emisar D4, actually two XP-L 4000k which are both with a hint of rose.


----------



## Swedpat

I have SC53c and H53c since earlier. The tint of both these is awesome. Therefore I ordered a SC64c which will arrive any day. Are these not high CRI and if so, about what CRI?


----------



## Bob_McBob

Personally I would return it and wait for the SC64c LE with Samsung LH351D that was just announced.


----------



## ven

Well Bob, all i can say is a big :twothumbs:bow: Looks like ZL have been watching and impressed.....................too much of a coincidence. Lets hope they take not on the nichia for limited run as well................can only hope! 
Got my mk1 ZL headlamp back the other day , sent Texas, they sent China, then to me new switch and guess driver as well(not said). Working anyway, maybe total of 6wks to 8wks(that long not even bothered to keep track lol). Either way came through





Need an older easywhite(4k or 5k) at some point......................


----------



## markr6

Looking forward to the revamped website - "Build Your Zebralight" page where you customize it to your liking.

I can dream...


----------



## ven

:laughing:


----------



## NPL

markr6 said:


> Looking forward to the revamped website - "Build Your Zebralight" page where you customize it to your liking.
> 
> I can dream...


I would pay a premium for that service!


----------



## markr6

Seriously though, I'm so glad to see all the activity lately. I just can't wait another 40+ days to get my SC700d!!


----------



## ven

Well i think off the top of my head, i have 7 zebra's now. My 4500k xml2 headlamp in work is super nice, love the mkIII's xhp50 5k plus, HI 4500k a lot. The sc62 is a nice clean white for a CW beam(ok and a change from all the 4000-5000k), mk I lamp recently returned is cold 6200k but again bearable and will be the house beater dog walking light. Still will say for the 1000th time, the sc62d . Least fav the sc53w as its an xp-l2 4500k, bearable though, much better than the not so hi cri 4000k flavour.................even though less CRI:thinking:

So mk I lamp for dog beater walking light.........................i think i have it right:thinking:


----------



## markr6

ven said:


>



The dog poo on the floor has eyes :laughing:


----------



## ven

haha well spotted!


----------



## Glock27

Weird stuff happening for ZebreLights' latest releases. Pre-orders stated Ship dates of November 23rd for both the SC64w HI and H600c Mk IV that I ordered. They'll both arrive Three weeks EARLY!

G27


----------



## markr6

Glock27 said:


> Weird stuff happening for ZebreLights' latest releases. Pre-orders stated Ship dates of November 23rd for both the SC64w HI and H600c Mk IV that I ordered. They'll both arrive Three weeks EARLY!
> 
> G27



I hope the same happens with the SC700d! I just can't wait until a week before christmas! Anytime in November would be a nice surprise.


----------



## likethevegetable

Anybody ever pick up on some small glitches with their ZebraLights, specifically the newest generation?

I've noticed with my H53c, H53Fc, and SC600w IV Plus, but not my H600Fc yet, that when changing modes quickly, sometimes the light will "lock" onto a mode (usually a dim one), and I'm unable to turn the light off or switch modes. A simple unscrew-rescrew of the tailcap immediately fixes the glitch though. I can't deliberately repeat the glitch, but I've noticed it maybe one or twice in each light in its lifetime. 

I'm not concerned about this, just curious if anyone else has noticed.


----------



## Fireclaw18

likethevegetable said:


> Anybody ever pick up on some small glitches with their ZebraLights, specifically the newest generation?
> 
> I've noticed with my H53c, H53Fc, and SC600w IV Plus, but not my H600Fc yet, that when changing modes quickly, sometimes the light will "lock" onto a mode (usually a dim one), and I'm unable to turn the light off or switch modes. A simple unscrew-rescrew of the tailcap immediately fixes the glitch though. I can't deliberately repeat the glitch, but I've noticed it maybe one or twice in each light in its lifetime.
> 
> I'm not concerned about this, just curious if anyone else has noticed.



*I have two SC64w HI:*

(1) The first one has some UI bugs. Occasionally when going into turbo it will flash and then turn off. Occasionally it will also lock into a low mode and not switch from that. In both cases, simply unscrewing the tailcap and screwing it back in fixes it. These are intermittent bugs that occur maybe one in 20 uses.

(2) My second SC64w HI works perfectly with no bugs.


----------



## markr6

No bugs here. The only bug I can ever think of is my old H600w II (2013). I use this one the most, usually backpacking, and about 1 out of 30 times it won't turn on LOW (press+short hold). This usually seem to happen when I try to turn it on soon after turning it off. So I can either just do a quick click to high, or twist the tailcap. It may actually be even less frequent that I remember, so it's not a big deal.


----------



## SubLGT

Connor said:


> This seems to be the new programmable UI .. very nice.
> We get the current L/M/H mode groups + *two *new seperate L/M/H mode groups where any of the modes can have any available brightness level. Plenty of choice for everyone.
> 
> 
> 
> Multiple UI Groups
> This light comes with three UI groups, G5, G6 and G7. The G5, set as the factory default, can be selected with 5-click from OFF, while G6 and G7 can be selected with 6-click and 7-click from OFF respectively. UI group selections are memorized after the light is turned off and through battery changes.
> In all three UI groups
> H can be either H1 or H2; M can be either M1 or M2; L can be either L1 or L2
> from OFF: 1-click to H; 2-click to M; press and hold to cycle from L, M to H
> 
> In G5
> H1 is fixed at 475Lm, H2 can be 352, 236, or 144Lm
> M1 is fixed at 79Lm, M2 can be 40, 18, or 7.4Lm
> L1 is fixed at 2.8Lm, L2 can be 1.0, 0.28 or 0.08Lm
> 
> In G6 and G7
> H1, H2, M1, M2, L1 and L2 can be programmed to any of the 12 available brightness levels
> Double-click 6 times at the H1, H2, ... L2 to enter the programming mode for that level. Once in the programming mode, use double-click to go up one level and triple-click to go down one level. Use 1-click to exit the programming mode
> 
> Three consecutive 5-click (or 6-click, 7-click) to reset the G5 (or G6, G7) back to the factory default settings
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Source: http://www.zebralight.com/SC5c-Mk-II-AA-Flashlight-Neutral-White-High-CRI_p_192.html (bottom)



These 3 youtube videos have some useful information on how to program a Zebralight:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PkGJtcaa8W0

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a4lsPK7P_4o

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RWgPXqDoV7k


----------



## autoxer

likethevegetable said:


> Anybody ever pick up on some small glitches with their ZebraLights, specifically the newest generation?
> 
> I've noticed with my H53c, H53Fc, and SC600w IV Plus, but not my H600Fc yet, that when changing modes quickly, sometimes the light will "lock" onto a mode (usually a dim one), and I'm unable to turn the light off or switch modes. A simple unscrew-rescrew of the tailcap immediately fixes the glitch though. I can't deliberately repeat the glitch, but I've noticed it maybe one or twice in each light in its lifetime.
> 
> I'm not concerned about this, just curious if anyone else has noticed.



This has happened to me (twice) with my SC64w. I also cannot make it happen deliberately.


----------



## likethevegetable

I contacted ZL about this and they said they'd pass it off to the dev. team. I can appreciate their quick response.

I also offered a suggestion to improve their UI - adding the H1 level (on solid, not flashing) to their beacon rotation, to which they replied "Thanks for your suggestions. We'll think about it. We had thought about using the triple click for lock-unlock, or other (programmable) strobes/beacons."


----------



## Beckler

Ideally it would just be fully programmable. But at least the ability to assign anything to any user input. Why not?


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Single clicks, double clicks, and long presses are fully programmable to any output level. But currently, triple-click is for strobes, and quad-click is for battery check.

IMO, I don't need the ability to program triple-click and quad-click any more than they already are (i.e., select the type of strobe), but I wish they would add a "strobe off" option for a type of strobe. That way, I'd just program the triple-click to be "off". Right now, I program it to a low-output beacon, which is the least annoying strobe option.

A "max solid output" strobe option, like vegetable suggests, sounds okay. It's not the easiest way to get turbo, but I suppose it would allow you to program the regular 6 outputs to something else, if you very seldom use turbo. I wouldn't use it, but I can see some people might. There are other strobe effects I'd like to see added before a turbo option (like "off").


----------



## Bob_McBob

I'm curious to know whether anyone pre-ordered an H503c. Until recently it was listed as pre-order shipping Dec 21, but it's now on back order.


----------



## Monocrom

Got a Zebralight H52 Cool White recently. My only Zebralight. Very happy with it.


----------



## Nev

Monocrom said:


> Got a Zebralight H52 Cool White recently. My only Zebralight. Very happy with it.



I've got them in floody version & spotnspill , they're exellent.


----------



## ven

Monocrom said:


> Got a Zebralight H52 Cool White recently. My only Zebralight. Very happy with it.




CW also, used at home, its a mk1 and been Texas, China, then UK after a repair. Rach uses it nightly for dog walking and garden duty..............proof?






Sent to me showing me she has pinched it! Luckily i have a nice 4000k flavour in work


----------



## easilyled

ven said:


> CW also, used at home, its a mk1 and been Texas, China, then UK after a repair. Rach uses it nightly for dog walking and garden duty..............proof?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent to me showing me she has pinched it! Luckily i have a nice 4000k flavour in work



I think that proves that she carries a torch for you!


----------



## ven

haha, be it on her head! 

She is now a fan of ZL Daniel, she even locks out the tail cap without even thinking.................


----------



## easilyled

ven said:


> haha, be it on her head!
> 
> She is now a fan of ZL Daniel, she even locks out the tail cap without even thinking.................



Very impressive Mark. The most I can get Daniele to do is to carry a brass UltraTac on her keychain. Locking it out is quite complicated. It requires two fast presses once its already off.


----------



## ven

easilyled said:


> Very impressive Mark. The most I can get Daniele to do is to carry a brass UltraTac on her keychain. Locking it out is quite complicated. It requires two fast presses once its already off.



Well Rach has always liked torches, being a tog, she appreciates c/t's etc. So she usually has a couple at hand, even tells me what temp they are when i am using. She is defo a fan of the little ZL's though. She knows about the haiku and HDS which Jon got. Also knows vinh as does little Callum. So i guess we are all flashaholics in one way or another. Madison is a little more hard work, but she does like the CL20 lantern, and every 3 or so days i get " daddy can you swap the batteries please?" Out come the AA loops for some ready charged loops. Tried her with a few little key ring lights, but she has not really taken to them much. More often than not, they do take the mickey out of me and my torches...........................water off a ducks back


----------



## easilyled

ven said:


> Well Rach has always liked torches, being a tog, she appreciates c/t's etc. So she usually has a couple at hand, even tells me what temp they are when i am using. She is defo a fan of the little ZL's though. She knows about the haiku and HDS which Jon got. Also knows vinh as does little Callum. So i guess we are all flashaholics in one way or another. Madison is a little more hard work, but she does like the CL20 lantern, and every 3 or so days i get " daddy can you swap the batteries please?" Out come the AA loops for some ready charged loops. Tried her with a few little key ring lights, but she has not really taken to them much. More often than not, they do take the mickey out of me and my torches...........................water off a ducks back



What an enlightened family .... literally and metaphorically.


----------



## ven

Haha very true..............little  as well, thank you


----------



## Monocrom

ven said:


> CW also, used at home, its a mk1 and been Texas, China, then UK after a repair. Rach uses it nightly for dog walking and garden duty..............proof?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Sent to me showing me she has pinched it!* Luckily i have a nice 4000k flavour in work



That's excellent. Now she can't get mad when you buy MORE lights. :twothumbs


----------



## ven

Ha quite true, does not bother her. But in fairness, compared to previous years the amount of torches coming in have reduced significantly. She knows her surefires more and more(watching tv or films), even insidious, she pointed out "thats an m6" in the opening part when the doors are open and alarm going off. I am sure i have mentioned it to her as well:thinking: who 1st?

Goes without saying, any light worth talking about does get an intro, details about, where from (henry/dan/don/vinh etc). She has always appreciated and used flashlights, but in the last few months with the new family member, she has said a few times about how useful they are. Certainly since its pretty much dark after 4pm................She is also on a G shock binge as well................what have i done!

Little older pic(month or so), there is always a ZL about, as there is a surefire


----------



## Monocrom

Ah, G-Shocks are a slippery slope. Like potato chips, you can't have just one. And they multiply like bunny rabbits. Turn your back for an instant, and there's another one.


----------



## ven

Monocrom said:


> Ah, G-Shocks are a slippery slope. Like potato chips, you can't have just one. And they multiply like bunny rabbits. Turn your back for an instant, and there's another one.



There are zebra's in the back ground, so still on topic lol

Callum is also on the slippery slope...........................pic took before wrapped up


----------



## Monocrom

Very nice. Merry Christmas! :santa:


----------



## xevious

I understand that Zebralight is a USA company that presently outsources manufacturing to China. Was there an earlier time when all Zebralights were made in the USA? I'm wondering about the label change that took place where later lights have "CE" on the label, but that designation isn't present on earlier ones like my SC52w.


----------



## Random Dan

xevious said:


> I understand that Zebralight is a USA company that presently outsources manufacturing to China. Was there an earlier time when all Zebralights were made in the USA? I'm wondering about the label change that took place where later lights have "CE" on the label, but that designation isn't present on earlier ones like my SC52w.


I think they've always been made in China. I remember talk of moving some manufacturing to Texas but I don't know if that ever happened. The older models, like my SC60, have no markings at all.


----------



## markr6

I figured I would mention this here as I did in the SC700d thread. The anodizing on the latest light (SC700d) is much lighter. I call it an olive/brown color like some of the older lights. The anodizing process can vary a lot, but this was a huge change from all the lights I've seen since 2012 or so. I asked ZL is this was intentional. I'll let you know if they respond.


----------



## Zak

The SC64C LE with Samsung LH351D is now listed on the site for preorder:

http://www.zebralight.com/SC64c-LE-18650-4000K-High-CRI-Flashlight-Limited-Edition_p_239.html


----------



## AMD64Blondie

Just received my new Zebralight SC64W.

This light is awesome.

(small,bright,and pocketable.)

Even right out of the box,it worked perfectly.

I'm using ​Samsung INR18650-30Q 3000mAh batteries.


----------



## Tachead

AMD64Blondie said:


> Just received my new Zebralight SC64W.
> 
> This light is awesome.
> 
> (small,bright,and pocketable.)
> 
> Even right out of the box,it worked perfectly.
> 
> I'm using ​Samsung INR18650-30Q 3000mAh batteries.


Yep, great light. It has been my EDC every day for over a year now.


----------



## emarkd

Got shipping notice on my SC64 LE today!


----------



## xevious

Zak said:


> The SC64C LE with Samsung LH351D is now listed on the site for preorder:
> 
> http://www.zebralight.com/SC64c-LE-18650-4000K-High-CRI-Flashlight-Limited-Edition_p_239.html


What does "Limited Edition" mean here? ZL hasn't said anything about a production number on their site...
Historically, do ZL LE lights typically sell out at a good clip or slowly?


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Grrrrr! My SC64w HI has the same "occasional turning off on H1" issue that my 600w HI does. Only in the cold, though. I was out last night, around -10C with a wind, and when I turned it on to H1 (after it was off for several minutes), it shut off after a second. This happened 3 times over the course of the walk (not every time).

Only when cold and windy. Only when the light has been off for awhile (so it's cold). I carry it on a lanyard, not in my pocket, so it does get cold when not turned on.

I thought my 600w HI was just an unlucky sample, but I'm now convinced that this is a design flaw in all Zebralights, at least the ones that use the XHP35 emitter. I've never used my 600+ (XHP50.2) in the winter, but maybe I should check it out too.

Note that I was never able to reproduce this using a freezer test. It only seems to occur outside in the winter.


----------



## markr6

Oh no not again! That's a bummer. My SC600 HI was doing that at room temp as well so it went back. The replacement has been fine.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

markr6 said:


> Oh no not again! That's a bummer. My SC600 HI was doing that at room temp as well so it went back. The replacement has been fine.



I'm not sure where you live, but do you get cold winters? If so, give it a try outside on a breezy winter night below about -10C. Try it with a partially discharged battery, and try it after the light has been off for 10 or 15 minutes exposed to the cold. It's only happens if you turn it on directly to H1, or step up to H1 within seconds of turning on the light in a lower mode.

Any recent use of the light will prevent the problem from occurring. It's got to be thoroughly cold.

For whatever reason, a freezer doesn't seem to do it, even though it's colder.

Maybe all lights don't do this, but I'm 0 for 2 so far. If there's any good news in it, at least it is very infrequent, and only in very cold conditions.


----------



## markr6

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> I'm not sure where you live, but do you get cold winters? If so, give it a try outside on a breezy winter night below about -10C. Try it with a partially discharged battery, and try it after the light has been off for 10 or 15 minutes exposed to the cold. It's only happens if you turn it on directly to H1, or step up to H1 within seconds of turning on the light in a lower mode.
> 
> Any recent use of the light will prevent the problem from occurring. It's got to be thoroughly cold.
> 
> For whatever reason, a freezer doesn't seem to do it, even though it's colder.
> 
> Maybe all lights don't do this, but I'm 0 for 2 so far. If there's any good news in it, at least it is very infrequent, and only in very cold conditions.



I hike in northern Michigan. This isn't the same thing, but the closest I've seen was my H600w II step down from H1 to M1. But that seems to be an issue with the battery not being able to provide sufficient current at a cold temp. It was 9°F/-12°C at the time. Once I ran it for a minute to warm up it was fine...but I still put it back down to M1 since I didn't need much light anyway with all the snow on the ground.


----------



## maukka

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Grrrrr! My SC64w HI has the same "occasional turning off on H1" issue that my 600w HI does. Only in the cold, though. I was out last night, around -10C with a wind, and when I turned it on to H1 (after it was off for several minutes), it shut off after a second. This happened 3 times over the course of the walk (not every time).



This is most probably due to the battery experiencing a very high internal resistance. At a high discharge current a freezing cold battery will probably droop in voltage and the light just assumes it's discharged.


----------



## Connor

At -10°C LiIon cells don't perform very well anymore. This could be normal.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

maukka said:


> This is most probably due to the battery experiencing a very high internal resistance. At a high discharge current a freezing cold battery will probably droop in voltage and the light just assumes it's discharged.



That was my first thought, though I tried with with 30Q, VTC6, and Sanyo GA. At least the first two (high drain) cells should work in the cold.

Also, the behavior is different than a cell that can't provide enough current/voltage. When I use an old low-drain laptop cell in the cold, the behavior is that the light very quickly drops from H1 to low. It doesn't go out. This is the same behavior when LVP kicks in normally at room temperature.

The behavior I'm seeing is that the light goes from H1 to off, in a second or less. However, it's a strange "off" state. Rather than a single-click to turn back on the light, I have to click it once (presumably to _really_ turn it off), then click it again to turn it back on. So, it takes 2 clicks to turn it back on, rather than 1 click.

I'm not sure what behavior the light does if the battery truly goes below the 2.8v low-voltage-protection. Has anyone tried this? I guess maybe it's not possible to test, because you'd have to change the battery to turn it back on. I've tried to see what happens, but I get bored of watching the light in low for hours sitting around the 2.9v level.

All that said, I'm still open to the idea that it's a battery issue. I know that cold batteries don't work well, and might not be able to supply the required current to the light for max output. If the light simply dropped to low, yeah, I'd 100% agree it's the battery. But to shut off completely... sort of?

I suppose it's possible that the battery voltage sags so low, so quickly, when cold, that it triggers the light to go into LVP shut-off mode rather than simply step-down. But, I'm not sure if a high-drain cell would sag so much under load, even at -10C.

I don't think my batteries are fakes. I got them from Illumn. They're about a year old.


----------



## Tachead

My 64w does this from time to time too but, only on H1 and only in the cold.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Tachead said:


> My 64w does this from time to time too but, only on H1 and only in the cold.



Yup, sounds like my SC600w 4 HI and SC64w HI. I suspect my SC600w 4 Plus would do it too, if I used it in winter.

Maybe I should try a really high drain cell in it, like a VTC5A. If it really is the battery (or some combination of battery sag + electronics), I don't think I could find a better cell for the cold. I'll buy one on my next battery order, though that probably won't be this winter.


----------



## Tachead

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Yup, sounds like my SC600w 4 HI and SC64w HI. I suspect my SC600w 4 Plus would do it too, if I used it in winter.
> 
> Maybe I should try a really high drain cell in it, like a VTC5A. If it really is the battery (or some combination of battery sag + electronics), I don't think I could find a better cell for the cold. I'll buy one on my next battery order, though that probably won't be this winter.


I am running brand new VTC6 in mine and it still does it. It doesn't bother me much though as it only happens the odd time, in certain weather conditions, and only on H1. I also find if you start in one of the lower high modes then switch to H1 it doesn't do it.


----------



## JStraus

FWIW, I have a LiIon battery for my motorcycle and it's standard for that type of battery to perform poorly in the cold (near freezing.) This is ok if your machine has a headlight or some accessory it can run to get the battery working—just turn on aux for a bit and the bike will start up fine. But it can be more problematic for OHV's without accessories to get them started in the cold. 
This sounds similar to the ZL's that a clipping 'off' in the cold, but seemingly doing ok once running for a bit. Something about the chemistry that needs to get 'flowing' when cold in my unschooled opinion.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

FWIW, I find the cold H1 problem happens less with a 30Q. However, that's based on very little data (I normally use a VTC6 or GA), so it may be pure coincidence. Next time I go for a long walk in the cold, I'll use a 30Q and see what happens.

I recall seeing some info on the battery sub-forum about 30Q vs. GA in extreme cold. I can't recall the exact info, but I think it concluded that a 30Q did way better (in terms of watt-hours). However, I think they were doing run-time tests while constantly force-freezing the cells, so the cells couldn't warm up. But, that may be a good analogy for the H1 start-up when cold.


----------



## xevious

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> That was my first thought, though I tried with with 30Q, VTC6, and Sanyo GA. At least the first two (high drain) cells should work in the cold.
> 
> Also, the behavior is different than a cell that can't provide enough current/voltage. When I use an old low-drain laptop cell in the cold, the behavior is that the light very quickly drops from H1 to low. It doesn't go out. This is the same behavior when LVP kicks in normally at room temperature.
> 
> The behavior I'm seeing is that the light goes from H1 to off, in a second or less. However, it's a strange "off" state. Rather than a single-click to turn back on the light, I have to click it once (presumably to _really_ turn it off), then click it again to turn it back on. So, it takes 2 clicks to turn it back on, rather than 1 click.
> 
> I'm not sure what behavior the light does if the battery truly goes below the 2.8v low-voltage-protection. Has anyone tried this? I guess maybe it's not possible to test, because you'd have to change the battery to turn it back on. I've tried to see what happens, but I get bored of watching the light in low for hours sitting around the 2.9v level.
> 
> All that said, I'm still open to the idea that it's a battery issue. I know that cold batteries don't work well, and might not be able to supply the required current to the light for max output. If the light simply dropped to low, yeah, I'd 100% agree it's the battery. But to shut off completely... sort of?
> 
> I suppose it's possible that the battery voltage sags so low, so quickly, when cold, that it triggers the light to go into LVP shut-off mode rather than simply step-down. But, I'm not sure if a high-drain cell would sag so much under load, even at -10C.
> 
> I don't think my batteries are fakes. I got them from Illumn. They're about a year old.


It would be interesting to keep one duplicate of the same battery and stash it in your pocket, near body heat. When the light acts, up, swap batteries. See if it still happens.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

xevious said:


> It would be interesting to keep one duplicate of the same battery and stash it in your pocket, near body heat. When the light acts, up, swap batteries. See if it still happens.



Hmmm, yeah, freezing light + warm battery. Good idea. I'll give that a try and see what happens. Supposed to be -20C in a couple of days, so that should be a good test.


----------



## Derek Dean

So, while I have really been enjoying my new SC700d, I've also been contemplating what light I'd like to see next from Zebralight. For me, the SC700d is a light caught between two worlds, it's not small enough to fit in a pants pocket, but it's not large enough to feel like a full sized light. 

Maybe what ZL needs is a Massdrop light..... you know, the SC8XX, running the XP 70.2 LED with a 26650 cell in a much larger body with enough mass and fins to keep it running cool at close to full output. Give it a plug in rechargeable circuit so nobody has to mess with taking the cell out, and keep the same ZL UI...... then make 3 videos, one showing how useful it is to have the incredibly versatility of the ZL UI and 3 programmable setups. A second video showing basic operation, and a final one showing advanced programming.

What do you'all think? Am I off the beam here?


----------



## neutralwhite

hi, - does ZL do better in the Low Modes Than HDS?.
ZL more efficient?.
thanks.


----------



## Mr. LED

neutralwhite said:


> hi, - does ZL do better in the Low Modes Than HDS?.
> ZL more efficient?.
> thanks.



Zebralight is a lot more efficient in the lower modes than HDS.


----------



## neutralwhite

so ZL could now be really "the light that gets you home"
? 



Mr. LED said:


> Zebralight is a lot more efficient in the lower modes than HDS.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

neutralwhite said:


> so ZL could now be really "the light that gets you home"
> ?



Heh, well, you'll get home with a lot more cash in your pocket, for sure.


----------



## maukka

It doesn't take a week to drain a 16340 in an HDS on minimum level (about 3-4 days). With a ZL and an 18650 you will be counting months or a year even. And you still have money for a cab.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Hmmm, yeah, freezing light + warm battery. Good idea. I'll give that a try and see what happens. Supposed to be -20C in a couple of days, so that should be a good test.



Groan. Tried to reproduce the issue with both the SC600w HI and the SC64 HI, in windy -20C temperatures last night. Tried for 3 hours, couldn't reproduce. I tried freezing light + freezing battery, freezing light + warm battery, and warm light + freezing battery. Tried with VTC6, 30Q, and a low-drain 22H.

All cells were charged to 50%, with a resting voltage of 3.75v. I tried 8 cells in total!

The high drain cells worked great. Only the low drain cell had issues when it was frozen. The lights would come on in max, then quickly drop to low, as expected.

I also tried in -10C conditions, and all cell types worked fine on max, even the low-drain.

For the shut off from max issue, it must be gremlins. It only seems to happen when I'm not trying to make it happen. I thought for sure that a windy -20C night for 3 hours would be enough. I've certainly had it occur in less time, in warmer conditions (-10C), and be easily reproduced when it happens. I don't know what the trigger is.


----------



## ven

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> . in warmer conditions (-10C), and be easily reproduced when it happens. I don't know what the trigger is.




Damn...............warmer conditions -10


----------



## xevious

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> For the shut off from max issue, it must be gremlins. It only seems to happen when I'm not trying to make it happen. I thought for sure that a windy -20C night for 3 hours would be enough. I've certainly had it occur in less time, in warmer conditions (-10C), and be easily reproduced when it happens. I don't know what the trigger is.


Given the temperatures where you are at, I wouldn't be surprised if it is gremlins! :candle: How much of the year is it above freezing at night in your neck of the deep dark woods?


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

xevious said:


> Given the temperatures where you are at, I wouldn't be surprised if it is gremlins! :candle: How much of the year is it above freezing at night in your neck of the deep dark woods?



About half the year is above freeing at night. Unfortunately, that's also when the nights are short!

However, the issue really only starts to become a problem below about -10C. And since it's only a problem on max, there's no issue for any of my usual modes. But, it's still annoying.

I did have the issue repeat again while I was out walking a couple of nights ago in cold weather. Very easy to reproduce. And, I figured out that the driver is still turned on, it's only the LED that doesn't get lit. For example, I can double-click to go back to a lower mode, or I can click-and-hold to get into a low mode. Apparently, the problem is that the LED isn't getting power, but the flashlight still thinks it is. Weird.

Once I give that LED some warmth (by using a lower mode), it works on H1. But trying to turn on H1 from off, after letting the light get cold for a few minutes, it's about a 50% chance it will quickly go dark.

All that said, I have been unable to reproduce the problem in controlled conditions (freezer, or letting it sit outside in the cold). It's only ever been an issue when out walking, during "normal" use. Maybe there's another factor besides cold, such as battery contact issues due to the light getting jostled around when walking?

Does cold increase resistance between contact points?


----------



## likethevegetable

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Does cold increase resistance between contact points?



Theoretically, metallic resistance decreases with temperature drops. But 

Maybe the cold is causing the pogo springs to contract and it's losing contact pressure?


----------



## neutralwhite

sounds so. what does ZL say on this?.



likethevegetable said:


> Theoretically, metallic resistance decreases with temperature drops. But
> 
> Maybe the cold is causing the pogo springs to contract and it's losing contact pressure?


----------



## markr6

I still feel like it's a random bug. Mine turned off at room temp as much as it did outside in the cold.


----------



## NPL

The Zebralight family is growing.
Thought I'd share this photo I took. Notice the anodizing colour between sc600w Hi and sc600w plus? Good way to tell them apart without looking at the emitter.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

NPL said:


> The Zebralight family is growing.
> Thought I'd share this photo I took. Notice the anodizing colour between sc600w Hi and sc600w plus? Good way to tell them apart without looking at the emitter.



That's odd. My 600w HI and 600w Plus are almost the exact same shade, both dark. Perhaps the Plus is very slightly darker, but it's really close. Mine are both the MkIV model.


----------



## markr6

Mine have all been the dark gray, very consistent between about 2013 and now with the exception of the SC700d. As mentioned before, the new stock of aluminum from China instead of Michigan is apparently being used for all recent lights. Inconsistency is my biggest pet peeve...but I'm gonna have to get over it since I ordered another SC700d!


----------



## emarkd

Huh, I missed that they swapped aluminum suppliers. Zebra used to make a big deal out of using US metal. Do we know what made them change, or is it assumed to be money?


----------



## markr6

emarkd said:


> Huh, I missed that they swapped aluminum suppliers. Zebra used to make a big deal out of using US metal. Do we know what made them change, or is it assumed to be money?



They mentioned how the price of aluminum fluctuates and they base it off of that. Full post:

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...P70-2-90-CRI&p=5268898&viewfull=1#post5268898


----------



## Mr. LED

Zebralight: 50 shades of grey


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

emarkd said:


> Huh, I missed that they swapped aluminum suppliers. Zebra used to make a big deal out of using US metal. Do we know what made them change, or is it assumed to be money?



Could be that tariffs drove up the cost of US aluminum. Not sure if China retaliated against US tariffs (like Canada has), but that would make sense. Buying steel and aluminum from local sources is now probably cheaper than paying tariffs, wherever you are.


----------



## koziy

Fireclaw18 said:


> *I have two SC64w HI:*
> 
> (1) The first one has some UI bugs. * Occasionally when going into turbo it will flash and then turn off.* Occasionally it will also lock into a low mode and not switch from that. In both cases, simply unscrewing the tailcap and screwing it back in fixes it. These are intermittent bugs that occur maybe one in 20 uses.



Damn, I just had my new SC64w HI do this. Thought the battery might be dented or something so I unscrewed the tail cap and inspected it, which reset the flashlight behavior to normal. I guess I'll keep an eye on the flashlight to see how it acts in the future, but going from replies here, it seems like a known bug. Did you send your flashlight back to ZL under warranty to get your second one or did you just buy another?


----------



## markr6

They replaced my SC600w IV HI and no problems since. I still feel like it's a bug with the driver/electronics.


----------



## timelord276

koziy said:


> Damn, I just had my new SC64w HI do this. Thought the battery might be dented or something so I unscrewed the tail cap and inspected it, which reset the flashlight behavior to normal. I guess I'll keep an eye on the flashlight to see how it acts in the future, but going from replies here, it seems like a known bug. Did you send your flashlight back to ZL under warranty to get your second one or did you just buy another?



I've had this happen to my with my SC600w MK IV HI (maybe 7-8 times?) and also with my SC64w MK IV HI (maybe 2-3 times?). Seems to happy most with fresh batteries, when the flashlight hasn't been used (like overnight, maybe when also when cold). Not sure if getting another will help. I use Panasonic/Sango NCR18650GA's. Wondering if it's worth the headache of trying to warranty or what.


----------



## Random Dan

Has anybody had a chance to directly compare SC64w HI and SC64c LE? I looked back in the thread and didn't see anything.

I like the tint of my SC600w HI so I'm not sure it's worth the loss in efficiency for the LH351D unless it is a significant step up in tint and/or CRI.


----------



## koziy

timelord276 said:


> I've had this happen to my with my SC600w MK IV HI (maybe 7-8 times?) and also with my SC64w MK IV HI (maybe 2-3 times?). Seems to happy most with fresh batteries, when the flashlight hasn't been used (like overnight, maybe when also when cold). Not sure if getting another will help. I use Panasonic/Sango NCR18650GA's. Wondering if it's worth the headache of trying to warranty or what.



Hmm, the fresh battery does seem to be a major factor. Hasn't happened again with the same battery. 




Random Dan said:


> Has anybody had a chance to directly compare SC64w HI and SC64c LE? I looked back in the thread and didn't see anything.
> 
> I like the tint of my SC600w HI so I'm not sure it's worth the loss in efficiency for the LH351D unless it is a significant step up in tint and/or CRI.



Probably because the SC64c LE is brand new and has been on backorder since it was first added to their website. Has anyone even gotten theirs yet?


----------



## Random Dan

koziy said:


> Probably because the SC64c LE is brand new and has been on backorder since it was first added to their website. Has anyone even gotten theirs yet?


That could be. I thought some people had gotten theirs before the backorder but I could be wrong.


----------



## Tachead

Yes, there are a bunch of LE's out in the wild. Emarkd has his already, maybe he will chime in?


----------



## emarkd

Tachead said:


> Yes, there are a bunch of LE's out in the wild. Emarkd has his already, maybe he will chime in?



Sorry, just seeing this. I do have my SC64c LE and its great, but I don't have the HI version to compare to. Sorry.


----------



## dydx

Just another data point...my H600c_IV XPH50.2 shut down this morning @ -14*°*C, the same "_occasional turning off on H1_". Past several morning hikes @ -9*°*C OK. My morning hikes are finished before sunrise, and take about 1-1/2 hours. So headlamp is pretty near ambient outdoor temp.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

dydx said:


> Just another data point...my H600c_IV XPH50.2 shut down this morning @ -14*°*C, the same "_occasional turning off on H1_". Past several morning hikes @ -9*°*C OK. My morning hikes are finished before sunrise, and take about 1-1/2 hours. So headlamp is pretty near ambient outdoor temp.



Ah, okay, same as a couple of my Zebras. Yeah, there's definitely something up with H1 in cold conditions. I don't trust H1 below -10C, unless I've already pre-heated the light by using H2 for a few seconds.

I suspect Zebralight has absolutely no way to test their lights in cold conditions, being designed in Texas. Note that my repeated freezer tests never reproduce the problem. You actually have to use it outside.


----------



## Connor

dydx said:


> Just another data point...my H600c_IV XPH50.2 shut down this morning @ -14*°*C, the same "_occasional turning off on H1_". Past several morning hikes @ -9*°*C OK. My morning hikes are finished before sunrise, and take about 1-1/2 hours. So headlamp is pretty near ambient outdoor temp.



What battery did you use? -14°C would be too cold for the Panasonic 18650 GA


----------



## dydx

Yep, ZL635, which is Panasonic 10A 3500mAh NCR18650GA cell inside. The Pana spec sheet shows -20*°*C to +60*°*C for discharge. Am I missing something?


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Connor said:


> What battery did you use? -14°C would be too cold for the Panasonic 18650 GA



I don't think it's entirely the choice of battery. If I use low-drain laptop cells in -20C conditions, the light will turn on in H1, then almost immediately step down to low and continue to run in low. IMO, that's what should happen, because it's exactly what happens in the summer when a cell is almost drained (thus hitting a low-voltage-protection point).

But with the "turn off from H1" bug (using a high-drain cell), the light turns on in H1, then almost immediately turns off. Well, sort of. The driver isn't off, just the LED is off. I can, for example, double-click and the light will turn on to H2, which means it was still in the H1 mode (just not lit). After that, I can use H1 just fine, even at -20C. I presume because the driver has been warmed up a bit, maybe the battery too (though it doesn't take much).

It may be partially a problem with very cold cells. But I'm not yet convinced it's entirely a cold-cell issue. I haven't really used low-drain cells much in my Zebralights, so it's possible the problem would appear with them too eventually. Maybe it has something to do with a very sudden voltage sag that tricks the driver into thinking the cell is below a safe voltage.

Anyone know what voltage a 30Q or VTC6 sags to in -10C or -20C conditions? Probably at around 5 or 6 amps?


----------



## Connor

I found this for the Sony VTC6: https://www.kronium.cz/uploads/SONY_US18650VTC6.pdf
It has a diagram for 10A discharge at -20 to +60°C.


----------



## koziy

emarkd said:


> Sorry, just seeing this. I do have my SC64c LE and its great, but I don't have the HI version to compare to. Sorry.



Interesting. I didn't realize they were shipping already. For my own data point, this flashlight is turning out to be a relatively long back order.

SC64c LE - Back order placed 1/14 - Not yet shipped
SC700d - Back order placed 1/28 - Shipped on 1/30


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Connor said:


> I found this for the Sony VTC6: https://www.kronium.cz/uploads/SONY_US18650VTC6.pdf
> It has a diagram for 10A discharge at -20 to +60°C.



That's interesting. From that graph, it looks like -20C temps might be a problem, since the voltage sags to about 2.8v. For -10C, it should be okay though, sagging only to about 3.2v.

However, I assume that is for a fully-charged cell at 4.2v resting. Voltage sag would be lower for a partially discharged cell.

I'm not sure I've seen the "off from H1" issue with a fully-charged cell, since it usually appears part-way into my walk. So, maybe the voltage sag at -10C, using a partially discharged cell, does hit the LVP cutoff to shut off the light. It would certainly explain why it works on the second try, since the battery is slightly warmed up (if a couple of seconds is enough to warm it up a bit).

I'm not sure how it explains why the light will not shut off completely when I use a low-discharge old laptop cell. But, I haven't done much experimentation with that, so perhaps it would if I tried it enough times.

I still think part of the cause is a cold driver, but I'm starting to be convinced the battery is a significant cause as well.


----------



## markr6

koziy said:


> Interesting. I didn't realize they were shipping already. For my own data point, this flashlight is turning out to be a relatively long back order.
> 
> SC64c LE - Back order placed 1/14 - Not yet shipped
> SC700d - Back order placed 1/28 - Shipped on 1/30



Good deal on the SC700d though! Mine shipped recently, but USPS decided to take at least 2 days off due to the cold so that'll hold things up. Meanwhile UPS, FedEx, the pizza guy and my 94 year old grandmother are managing just fine.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

markr6 said:


> Good deal on the SC700d though! Mine shipped recently, but USPS decided to take at least 2 days off due to the cold so that'll hold things up. Meanwhile UPS, FedEx, the pizza guy and my 94 year old grandmother are managing just fine.



"Neither snow nor rain nor heat nor gloom of night stays these couriers from the swift completion of their appointed rounds"

They should have added "cold".


----------



## Tachead

markr6 said:


> Good deal on the SC700d though! Mine shipped recently, but USPS decided to take at least 2 days off due to the cold so that'll hold things up. Meanwhile UPS, FedEx, the pizza guy and my 94 year old grandmother are managing just fine.


How cold is it there?


----------



## likethevegetable

Yesterday morning was the coldest weather I ever experienced at -39.8°C (-52°C with wind chill)... Winnipeg, MB, Canada.


----------



## Tachead

likethevegetable said:


> Yesterday morning was the coldest weather I ever experienced at -39.8°C (-52°C with wind chill)... Winnipeg, MB, Canada.


Yep, it's been cold here in Thunder Bay too and was close to that the other night. It is - 30C(-43C with windchill) right now. Everyone is sick of it lol. It's supposed to break soon I hear at least.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

likethevegetable said:


> Yesterday morning was the coldest weather I ever experienced at -39.8°C (-52°C with wind chill)... Winnipeg, MB, Canada.



Winnipeg only has two seasons: freeze your *** off season, and get your *** bit off from mosquitoes season.

BTW, try your Zebralights in that cold. I've never been able to test them down nearly that low. Do they work in H1, using a good high-drain cell?


----------



## NPL

My Zebralights work fine here in Vancouver BC weather. +7C...[emoji14]


----------



## ven

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Winnipeg only has two seasons: freeze your *** off season, and get your *** bit off from mosquitoes season.
> 
> BTW, try your Zebralights in that cold. I've never been able to test them down nearly that low. Do they work in H1, using a good high-drain cell?




The zebra worked, poor mr tachead didnt............. Now that is a test!!!


----------



## Tachead

I couldn't get my light out of my pocket because my hands froze and fell off lol.


----------



## ven

Haha, its not a test i think i would like to do.................. 

Must admit i am fascinated by the news on the polar vortex............WOW


----------



## likethevegetable

My NCR GA's with my H600Fc and SC600w Plus seem to work fine... although I haven't been out for my usual walk lately and if I do, it's short. Withn a fresh cell the 4 flashes turn to 2 real quick lol.

I'll try to brave it and play around with the UI and report any findings.

I noticed with my H53c a while back when it was pretty cold (not this bad) that it kind of changed the programmed modes on me, and it got stuck in a medium mode. Kinda hard to explain but a simple tail cap reset fixed it.


----------



## Mr. LED

Some time ago, people were discussing here that Zebralight wanted to open a USA plant to manufacture for the internal market. Has anybody bought any Zebralight lately, for delivery in USA, and got a box with Made in USA sticker?


----------



## dydx

No sticker on box or branding on ZL light US order of 3 weeks ago.


----------



## markr6

Well, after getting a defective SC700d today I'm finally throwing in the towel. I've stuck up for Zebralight since 2012, having a pretty good run with their stuff. I like what I have, but it ends now. I just don't want to gamble anymore.


----------



## Mr. LED

markr6 said:


> Well, after getting a defective SC700d today I'm finally throwing in the towel. I've stuck up for Zebralight since 2012, having a pretty good run with their stuff. I like what I have, but it ends now. I just don't want to gamble anymore.


----------



## Mr. LED

dydx said:


> No sticker on box or branding on ZL light US order of 3 weeks ago.



does the boxes still have the regular sticker with “made in China”?


----------



## markr6

Mr. LED said:


> does the boxes still have the regular sticker with “made in China”?



I don't see any kind of markings, but most of the box is covered up with a big white sticker shipping label that I can't really see through.


----------



## Tachead

markr6 said:


> Well, after getting a defective SC700d today I'm finally throwing in the towel. I've stuck up for Zebralight since 2012, having a pretty good run with their stuff. I like what I have, but it ends now. I just don't want to gamble anymore.


Bummer, sorry to hear Mark. What was the issue? Hopefully my SC64w HI is ok.


----------



## markr6

Tachead said:


> Bummer, sorry to hear Mark. What was the issue? Hopefully my SC64w HI is ok.



The groove that is cut out near the tail end for the clip to fit into...not even close! It's not wide enough so the clip just sort of wobbles then pops out with the slightest pressure. Useless! Obviously it will need replaced, or just credited so I can forget it altogether.


----------



## Tachead

markr6 said:


> The groove that is cut out near the tail end for the clip to fit into...not even close! It's not wide enough so the clip just sort of wobbles then pops out with the slightest pressure. Useless! Obviously it will need replaced, or just credited so I can forget it altogether.


That is terrible. These are likely made on a CNC lathe so, a whole run may have this issue too(heads up guys). It's too bad to see ZL sh**ing the bed so much lately. I may be done with them too(I was already mad at them for the whole thermal regulation fiasco last year).


----------



## markr6

Tachead said:


> That is terrible. These are likely made on a CNC lathe so, a whole run may have this issue too(heads up guys).



Exactly. They show In Stock, so I assume anyone ordering now, or in the past month, will probably get the same bad deal.

Didn't want to blow up this thread along with the SC700d thread, but felt I should give it some priority.


----------



## Tachead

Well, I just received my SC64w HI and aside from a very slight concentric line at the center of the body, it appears to have no issues. The tint is a bit on the pink/magenta side(not the pure white my SC600w MKIV HI was) unfortunately but, I think I can live with that.


----------



## SubLGT

markr6 said:


> The groove that is cut out near the tail end for the clip to fit into...not even close! It's not wide enough so the clip just sort of wobbles then pops out with the slightest pressure. Useless! Obviously it will need replaced, or just credited so I can forget it altogether.



Ask Zebralight to send you a clip that fits the groove?


----------



## xevious

markr6 said:


> Well, after getting a defective SC700d today I'm finally throwing in the towel. I've stuck up for Zebralight since 2012, having a pretty good run with their stuff. I like what I have, but it ends now. I just don't want to gamble anymore.










But seriously, sorry to hear of the added troubles. I really hope there's some kind of community outreach from Zebralight to address what's going on. They're going to lose a lot of business if they don't... as I imagine a good many of their customers tend to read up on buyer experiences.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

markr6 said:


> The groove that is cut out near the tail end for the clip to fit into...not even close! It's not wide enough so the clip just sort of wobbles then pops out with the slightest pressure. Useless! Obviously it will need replaced, or just credited so I can forget it altogether.



IMO, the bad clip fit is sort of, "meh". Not good, but this isn't a light where I'd use a clip anyway. I think the real fail is that they didn't design it with a split ring for a lanyard attachment (and to prevent rolling). The SC600's did that, why didn't they just use the same design for the SC700??? Major oversight in the design, IMO.


----------



## koziy

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> IMO, the bad clip fit is sort of, "meh". Not good, but this isn't a light where I'd use a clip anyway. I think the real fail is that they didn't design it with a split ring for a lanyard attachment (and to prevent rolling). The SC600's did that, why didn't they just use the same design for the SC700??? Major oversight in the design, IMO.



I'm of the opposite mindset. I can definitely see myself carrying this light -- with the right wardrobe, granted. It wouldn't look good in dress clothes, but it's not terribly uncomfortable in jeans. The 21700 body tube is about the largest diameter that I can tolerate for still being able to put my hand and other stuff into the same pocket, but even if the flashlight took up the entire pocket, I still like to have the option to pocket carry it. That's the one flaw of the otherwise excellent Emisar D4S, no pocket clip.


----------



## markr6

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> IMO, the bad clip fit is sort of, "meh". Not good, but this isn't a light where I'd use a clip anyway.



That was my initial thought, but after seeing the nice photos of a proper sample I coudn't ignore this. I'll never clip it in a pocket, but a clip is nice to have for inside a backpack pocket, organizer, temporarily clipping outside a pocket or backpack strap, etc.

Looking forward to getting the replacement.

Again, I want to focus most of that attention in the SC700d thread. But with Zebralight in general, I guess I finally racked up too many issues over the years to where I just want to give up after this one. It's really just luck of the draw...I know some poor customers were receiving defect after defect. Who knows...I'll probably pull the trigger on that C3 the second it comes out!


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

markr6 said:


> Again, I want to focus most of that attention in the SC700d thread. But with Zebralight in general, I guess I finally racked up too many issues over the years to where I just want to give up after this one. It's really just luck of the draw...I know some poor customers were receiving defect after defect. Who knows...I'll probably pull the trigger on that C3 the second it comes out!



New Zebralight releases are always higher risk than buying when it's already been out a few months. They change the design in subtle ways every time they do a production run, so later runs are usually better than the first runs. That said, I also find it hard to resist buying the new designs right away, even though it goes against my advice.

My last "first buy" was the SC64w HI, but I justified it because it was a simple emitter swap of the SC64w. I think it worked out for me, except for the "off from H1 in very cold weather" issue that most 18650 Zebras seem to suffer from. I don't hold out hope that a Texas design company will ever figure that one out.


----------



## Tachead

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> I don't hold out hope that a Texas design company will ever figure that one out.



I think it is important to keep in mind that ZL already designed one of the smallest and most advanced drivers in the industry(maybe the most). Other then the Lux RC 371D I don't know of any other drivers that are even close and ZL has been making these for many years(although they are constantly evolving). They have also made several other advances in design(not just drivers)and tried new things that others haven't. 

ZL's are at the beading edge of flashlight technology and when you push the line sometimes it takes a while to work the bugs out. Also, sometimes new design choices don't work out and have to be redesigned. This is just the nature of the game with any innovator.


----------



## Random Dan

I don't see cause to bail on Zebralight yet. So far they seem to be handling the issue as well as one could expect, which is more than can be said other companies. I have a light from another brand that is completely inoperable and I've been trying for nearly a month to get an RMA for it. Having a minor functional issue and a company which quickly responds to offer a replacement seems quite nice by comparison.


----------



## wweiss

ZLs suffer from water tightness too. I use mine as a pure water collector- put it outside on a humid evening and I get a barrel full of pure water... Or so it seems.


----------



## markr6

Random Dan said:


> I don't see cause to bail on Zebralight yet. So far they seem to be handling the issue as well as one could expect, which is more than can be said other companies. I have a light from another brand that is completely inoperable and I've been trying for nearly a month to get an RMA for it. Having a minor functional issue and a company which quickly responds to offer a replacement seems quite nice by comparison.



Yeah, I think I'm ok now. It was just all the negative reports over the year that were in the back of my mind, and now that it "happened to me" it all came to the surface. They ALWAYS responded to me within 24 hours in the past to deal with a return or question, so I can't say anything bad about the customer service.

I'm looking forward to my replacement SC700d. That will make number 3 now, so I'll have a good idea of any tint variation. The first two were fine.


----------



## AVService

I simply do not understand the clip thing though?

Why not just make the clip the same design for all of their lights as the SC series that screw onto the light?
That way you can decide for yourself whether to keep it on there or not and the clip will not detach on its own ever like every clip on clip ever made will sooner or later?

Maybe make them mount to a curve from now on again with screws so that when detached there is no real difference or downside except for tiny unused screw holes.

Why oh Why???!!!!


----------



## Tachead

I have asked the same question for years. I tried a couple of SC600 variants but, hated the clips so I got rid of them.


----------



## ven

Must admit I would prefer a clip designed similar to the 62/63/64 series. It’s in the minority of flashlights ,I actually like out of the box clip wise.

The 600 clips are hateful ........needless to say, my 600’s go naked


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

I don't find the SC600 clips that bad. They're snap-on clips that most lights have, and seem to hold better than most. However, I don't use them much, because I find the SC600 lights better used with a lanyard attached to its split-ring.

If they went with the SC6x screw-on clips, then if I didn't want to use them I'd have to unscrew them. The new torx screws they use are a PITA if you don't have the correct wrench. And even when removed, I'd still be stuck with a flat part of the body that sticks out. That would make it awkward for some bicycle handlebar mounts.

Personally, I like the SC600 clips the way they are: optional to use, and easy to remove.

If you're concerned about them pulling off under stress, you could always attach them to the light by linking another split ring from the clip to the included split ring.


----------



## burntoshine

Can anyone recommend some 18650 batteries for Zebras? They're for my SC62w and H600w. 

I have been using AW 2900 mah for the longest time, and I want to upgrade and get something with higher amps. I need something that handles the cold well. I've had my H600w immediately step down from high while bicycling in the 20's (degrees).

Thanks in advance!


----------



## NPL

Ncr18650ga, unprotected


----------



## burntoshine

NPL said:


> Ncr18650ga, unprotected



Thanks!

Do you think they are better than the Sony VTC6?


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

For cold, I'd go with the VTV6 or the 30Q, rather than the GA. The first two cells are higher drain, and will perform better in the cold. The GA is a great cell, but will suffer more in freezing conditions. Use the GA in spring/summer/fall.


----------



## AVService

I think I covered the flat part in my post by suggesting that they curve the mount to match the body so that there was no actual downside to having the clip removed should you elect to not use one.

There is just no clip on clip that can be trusted to stay on a light like one that is screwed on.
If you are this deep into this hobby and do not have the correct driver for the screws on the light it seems to me that is pretty easy to change too.

There are only 2 types of snap on clips to me,ones that have fallen off at a bad time and ones that will fall off at a bad time!

This is just one of those details that considering how much we are willing to spend on these tiny lights should be universal in application.
We should be able to count on a pocket clip if we need to.



WalkIntoTheLight said:


> I don't find the SC600 clips that bad. They're snap-on clips that most lights have, and seem to hold better than most. However, I don't use them much, because I find the SC600 lights better used with a lanyard attached to its split-ring.
> 
> If they went with the SC6x screw-on clips, then if I didn't want to use them I'd have to unscrew them. The new torx screws they use are a PITA if you don't have the correct wrench. And even when removed, I'd still be stuck with a flat part of the body that sticks out. That would make it awkward for some bicycle handlebar mounts.
> 
> Personally, I like the SC600 clips the way they are: optional to use, and easy to remove.
> 
> If you're concerned about them pulling off under stress, you could always attach them to the light by linking another split ring from the clip to the included split ring.


----------



## xevious

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> For cold, I'd go with the VTV6 or the 30Q, rather than the GA. The first two cells are higher drain, and will perform better in the cold. The GA is a great cell, but will suffer more in freezing conditions. Use the GA in spring/summer/fall.


That's really helpful info -- thank you!

On a related note, I saw a post about the Sony VTC6 having longevity issues. I didn't look further into the matter, but it would be interesting to see if this is not just a bad batch that someone ran into.


So, I've been back and forth on what Zebralight model I should get, and then even if I should buy one right now given a more recent bump in QC complaints. But, the ZL design is a compelling one. I decided to take a chance on the *SC64c LE*. It was a tough decision. Initially I wasn't sure if I should go for the slightly larger form factor of the SC600 series. But given the beamshots and output compared to the SC64, I didn't see a huge enough improvement. I'm not looking for a long range search light... and that's pretty much the more costly SC700 model, or you can go with another brand that has far more powerful output for the same price (without ZL benefits, of course). The ZL light I wanted would have a good enough form factor for easy pocketing. The SC64 seems to be "just right" in this regard, based on the 18650 cell. It is impressive how small lights are getting, some only a few millimeters larger than the battery. The SC64 is not the smallest, but still quite small considering the rugged build and design.

SO then it came down to the SC64w NW versus SC64c-LE. 1400lm max, versus 828lm max. That's about 475lm difference. However, my use wouldn't have this light on the highest setting all that often. Sure, who wouldn't want more lumens if available. But the tint is something that matters more to me. I did see beamshots of the SC64w in Neutral White and it looks quite good. But the SC64c LE looks even more impressive. I'm just hoping the "tint lottery" is kind to me! In any case, given the strong following for Zebralight and reasonably good resale value, I'm anticipating that if I decide that I need to sell my SC64c LE, I'd probably recoup more of my investment in it (compared to SC64w) after whatever point Zebralight finally discontinues it--it's _supposed_ to be limited right? :candle:


----------



## NPL

burntoshine said:


> Thanks!
> 
> Do you think they are better than the Sony VTC6?


Not better, depends on what you want. The GA has enough power to run the lights at their highest settings, but more capacity than the higher drain cells like the vtc6. I personally barely ever run my Zebralights on the highest setting because it overheats and steps down anyways, so prefer to get a battery best suited to the settings that I will use most. 

I have only used the older ncr18650b in Sub zero freezing conditions and had no issues, but if it's extremely cold don't know if the GA would be the best option.


----------



## markr6

NPL said:


> I have only used the older ncr18650b in Sub zero freezing conditions and had no issues, but if it's extremely cold don't know if the GA would be the best option.



Down to -15°F camping recently, my H600wII was sitting out all night. It worked fine with the 18650GA, but honestly anything probably would have since I was only using 0.06 mode 

Other times, usually on M1, it was coming from my pocket or hung around my neck to stay somewhat warm. So, still not a great test.


----------



## burntoshine

I appreciate the input! I guess I'll be deciding between the Samsung 30Q and the Sony VTC6.


The Samsung 30Q is 15A -- The Sony VTC6 is 30A -- Would there be any discernible difference between 15A and 30A? I'm guessing 15A is plenty, yes?

I've been looking at Battery Junction and Amazon. I miss Lighthound; that store was great. They carried AW, which I thought was best at the time. But from what I understand, protection is not necessary in the batteries because ZL has adequate protection in their lights.

My main concern is being able to use the lower high modes in the freezing cold. I virtually never use the highest mode in any of my Zebralights. I like knowing it's there, but using the penultimate mode instead. The highest mode seems to be barely brighter than the second-to-highest mode, and the penultimate (I just wanted to use that word.) mode has significant more run time. And perhaps it's better for the life of the LED to avoid the highest mode, but I'm not sure about that.

So, is there a trade off between amps and run time? And is there a trade off between protection and run time? Should I be asking this in the battery section? I'm asking here because I'm looking for fuel specifically for Zebralights.

Basically cold performance is of utmost importance, but long run times are nice, too. And reliability, of course.

I think I'm leaning towards the 30Q.


----------



## likethevegetable

Congrats on pulling the trigger Mr. Xevious, the only thing more difficult than choosing your next Zebra is refraining from getting another one in the first place!


----------



## xevious

likethevegetable said:


> Congrats on pulling the trigger Mr. Xevious, the only thing more difficult than choosing your next Zebra is refraining from getting another one in the first place!


Thanks! At least I've got a long anticipation for this one... waiting is part of the thrill, knowing something good is coming in the near future.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

burntoshine said:


> The Samsung 30Q is 15A -- The Sony VTC6 is 30A -- Would there be any discernible difference between 15A and 30A? I'm guessing 15A is plenty, yes?



The VTC6 is a 15A (continuous) cell; it's not anywhere close to 30A. IIRC, it can be run at 20A (continuous) as long as the cell temperature is kept below something like 80C.

The difference between the 30Q and VTC6 is very small, so get either one. If it's of interest to you, I get about 4.5% more run time on my Zebralights from the VTC6, so it's a slightly higher capacity cell than the 30Q. Other than that, they perform almost identical in high-output lights.



> I've been looking at Battery Junction and Amazon. I miss Lighthound; that store was great. They carried AW, which I thought was best at the time. But from what I understand, protection is not necessary in the batteries because ZL has adequate protection in their lights.



Yeah, protection is not needed. Also, I'd be wary of fakes on Amazon... just sayin'. I buy my cells from Illumn.



> My main concern is being able to use the lower high modes in the freezing cold. I virtually never use the highest mode in any of my Zebralights.



That will be no problem at all. I use my Zebralights in temperatures below -20C. You will experience less run-time in the cold, maybe as much as 50% less. But if you're not using max, you'll probably have plenty of run-time anyway. If you plan to be out more than a couple of hours, I'd probably bring a spare just in case.



> So, is there a trade off between amps and run time? Basically cold performance is of utmost importance, but long run times are nice, too. And reliability, of course.



Higher drain cells will generally perform better in cold weather than lower drain cells, but all batteries will lose power and capacity in cold conditions. For example, if I use a low-drain old laptop cell in a Zebralight at -20C, it won't run on high modes. It will just step down to low. The 30Q, VTC6, and even the Sanyo GA cell will work fine, but with reduced run time.


----------



## burntoshine

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> The VTC6 is a 15A (continuous) cell; it's not anywhere close to 30A. IIRC, it can be run at 20A (continuous) as long as the cell temperature is kept below something like 80C.
> 
> The difference between the 30Q and VTC6 is very small, so get either one. If it's of interest to you, I get about 4.5% more run time on my Zebralights from the VTC6, so it's a slightly higher capacity cell than the 30Q. Other than that, they perform almost identical in high-output lights.
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah, protection is not needed. Also, I'd be wary of fakes on Amazon... just sayin'. I buy my cells from Illumn.
> 
> 
> 
> That will be no problem at all. I use my Zebralights in temperatures below -20C. You will experience less run-time in the cold, maybe as much as 50% less. But if you're not using max, you'll probably have plenty of run-time anyway. If you plan to be out more than a couple of hours, I'd probably bring a spare just in case.
> 
> 
> 
> Higher drain cells will generally perform better in cold weather than lower drain cells, but all batteries will lose power and capacity in cold conditions. For example, if I use a low-drain old laptop cell in a Zebralight at -20C, it won't run on high modes. It will just step down to low. The 30Q, VTC6, and even the Sanyo GA cell will work fine, but with reduced run time.



Very cool, my friend! Thank you very much for the response!

I have not been on Illumn's site before. I'll give it a go. 

Far out!


----------



## Tachead

Here are a few quick and dirty cell phone beamshots of the SC64w HI for anyone interested... 

Control






H1(1300 lumens) 





Control 





H1(1300 lumens) 





Control





H1(1300 lumens)


----------



## NPL

Beautiful


----------



## Tachead

NPL said:


> Beautiful


Thanks👍. They don't show the beam profile very well so I will try and get some more in a different location when I have time. The tint is very close to my Malkoff M61L 219B V2 dropin(Nichia 219B SW40 R9050) but, with a bit lower CRI and a touch cooler of course.


----------



## marinemaster

Looks awesome [emoji122]


----------



## Hugh Johnson

Wow Tachead, much nicer than I expected.


----------



## ven

Awesome beam pics tachead, thanks for sharing


----------



## Tachead

Thanks guys and no problem👍.

So, I tried a bit to get some beamshots comparisons to Nichia's but, I was unsuccessful so far lol. As you all probably know it is very hard to get a camera to accurately display what you see with your eyes. I can tell you the tint on my sample is quite nice and definitely is below the black body line. It is more pinkish/magenta then my SC600w MKIV HI was(it was closer to pure white). Compared to the 219B SW40 R9050 in my Astrolux A01's it makes the Nichia's look slightly greenish(really). But, when compared to the same emitter in my Malkoff/Illumn dropin the Malkoff is slightly more pink/magenta. The tint lottery is obviously at work here lol. It does say a lot though that it compares so closely to a Nichia. The colour rendering isn't quite as good but, is more then acceptable for many tasks imo. I really think these XHP35 HI's are one of the best options, tint & tint shift wise, for high output Cree's with decent CRI. 

Anyway, I will see if I can get some more beamshots when time permits. I have access to some even larger indoor areas and when the moon isn't out they are near total darkness.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

My SC64w HI also has a slight rosy/magenta tint to it, at least compared to other Zebralights and most other lights. It's closer to a Nichia 219B than it is to most of my other lights. But pretty close to pure neutral. I like it.


----------



## markr6

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> My SC64w HI also has a slight rosy/magenta tint to it, at least compared to other Zebralights and most other lights. It's closer to a Nichia 219B than it is to most of my other lights. But pretty close to pure neutral. I like it.



My SC64w is like that. A total keeper with a perfect tint! Everything I compare to it is GREEN. My D4S Nichia is very green in comparison, so I need to keep them apart!


----------



## Mr. LED

markr6 said:


> My SC64w is like that. A total keeper with a perfect tint!



Mine too, this one I’ll never part with.


----------



## KITROBASKIN

Broke out the new-in-box SC62d after giving one of the other two to the wife. We are living in a situation where a flashlight is needed nightly and early morn... No internet or cell service either, which explains my scarcity around this dear forum. The new one has the best tint of the three and the lowest low is about perfect (All three are different). Only thing is that it has the skinny, too shiny stock clip, but we use them in slightly modified Nite-Ize head straps, so no biggie.


----------



## Mr. LED

I’ll happily exchange your skinny clip for a brand new model black one, and pay for shipping.


----------



## AMD64Blondie

What's the difference between the SC64W and the SC64W HI?

(I already own the SC64W,just FYI.)


----------



## ven

sc62d ‘s :rock:


----------



## ven

AMD64Blondie said:


> What's the difference between the SC64W and the SC64W HI?
> 
> (I already own the SC64W,just FYI.)



Your LED is domed, the HI is a flat dome/silicon layer . The HI is more focused/hot spot and usually the HI LEDs have less tint shift. I am a fan of the xhp35 HI, excellent LED and imo one of CREEs best.


----------



## AMD64Blondie

The funniest thing is... my HDS Rotary and my Elzetta Charlie are giving me grumpy looks.



(My Zebralight SC64W kicked my Elzetta Charlie out of my EDC rotation,and my Olight S1R II neutral white kicked my HDS Rotary 250 out of my other front jeans pocket...)

Even though I know that my HDS and my Elzetta are likely far tougher lights than my Zebralight and Olight,the Zebralight and Olight are brighter,smaller,and easily rechargeable.


----------



## Mr. LED

Oh I just ordered a SC64w HI and a H600w IV... can’t tell the wife. Luckily the Zebralight all look the same, hope she won’t notice them. :duh2:


----------



## KITROBASKIN

Mr. LED said:


> I’ll happily exchange your skinny clip for a brand new model black one, and pay for shipping.



Gladly if the black clip is compatible with the SC62d body. I'll PM you when I locate my other shiny stock clips, to get your shipping address.

Regarding your post about the wife: I do the same thing; just use the flashlight and not mention anything.


----------



## Mr. LED

Ok I’m waiting for your PM. The black one fits the 62d no problem.


----------



## xevious

Mr. LED said:


> Oh I just ordered a SC64w HI and a H600w IV... can’t tell the wife. Luckily the Zebralight all look the same, hope she won’t notice them. :duh2:


YES! The key spousal advantage of Zebralight -- stealth versions! All SC64 look alike. All SC600 look alike. And so on.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

xevious said:


> YES! The key spousal advantage of Zebralight -- stealth versions! All SC64 look alike. All SC600 look alike. And so on.



To many people, all flashlights look alike.


----------



## likethevegetable

Come on people, you have to be honest with your partners... "I got it on sale for HALF price"


----------



## markr6

Harbor Freight was selling them for $2.99 but I had the FREE with PURCHASE coupon


----------



## Slumber

I've been out of the Zebralight game for a while. Other than my heavily scarred SC62d which is on permanent house-beater duty, I've been Zebra free for a year or two. Today I got my stripes back with a pre-owned SC600iii HI from the marketplace. I forgot how small they are; my last SC600 was the slightly larger MKii. 
As a bonus, with a little adjustment of the tension screws, it fits my Forcetech HDS holster nicely.


----------



## Mr. LED

Just received a new SC53c today and it’s defective. It flashes a beacon every minute when turned off. Tried everything and couldn’t get rid of it. It’s going back. Also the SC700d is going back, horrible blue tint.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Mr. LED said:


> Just received a new SC53c today and it’s defective. It flashes a beacon every minute when turned off.



You sure it's not the battery? I have a SC52w that will flash like that if the battery is low. Not sure if it's an intentional low-battery indicator, or just something weird. But it goes away when I replace the battery with a fresh one.


----------



## Mr. LED

It’s a freshly charged new Eneloop, but I may try another one. Also, after some long time without the battery, when I put the battery back in, it doesn’t turn on, I have to take out the tailcap and out it back a few times. I cleaned all contacts and threads and nothing changed. It’s a dud.


----------



## markr6

I can't believe your 700 is blue. All three of mine were neutral, but honestly pretty strong yellowish compared to any other "5000K" I have.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

markr6 said:


> I can't believe your 700 is blue. All three of mine were neutral, but honestly pretty strong yellowish compared to any other "5000K" I have.



Maybe he's talking about the spill? Most domed Cree emitters have a purplish spill. Does the 700d also have that?

Or, maybe it's just the CCT. 5000K is pretty cool compared to most other neutral-white Zebralights, at least the "w" versions. It might look blue-ish, if someone was expecting a light 4000K-4500K. I have lots of 5000K lights, and they always look like cool-white if I've been using a warmer neutral recently.


----------



## markr6

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Maybe he's talking about the spill? Most domed Cree emitters have a purplish spill. Does the 700d also have that?
> 
> Or, maybe it's just the CCT. 5000K is pretty cool compared to most other neutral-white Zebralights, at least the "w" versions. It might look blue-ish, if someone was expecting a light 4000K-4500K. I have lots of 5000K lights, and they always look like cool-white if I've been using a warmer neutral recently.



I guess there's some small difference in the spill but nothing blue. I remember those days of purple but it's been a while. The "5000K" zebralight mentions is a joke; nowhere near that. Compared to my other 5000K lights, it's not even close, 4000K at best.

But I can say the same for my Emisar D4S Nichia 219C at 5000K. NOWHERE near that. Again, 4000K or so. But compared to the SC700d, they are very similar in tint and CRI.


----------



## Mr. LED

Blue with green corona.


----------



## Mr. LED

The SC64w has the perfect neutral tint, no green and a slight magenta. The SC600w Mk IV HI has a slight green, compared to the SC64w, but by itself is fine. OTOH the SC700d looks cool white...


----------



## markr6

WOW! I almost want that cooler 700! With the 3 I already had, they were so consistent that I can't believe yours is that much cooler. Thanks for the photo!


----------



## Tachead

markr6 said:


> I guess there's some small difference in the spill but nothing blue. I remember those days of purple but it's been a while. The "5000K" zebralight mentions is a joke; nowhere near that. Compared to my other 5000K lights, it's not even close, 4000K at best.
> 
> But I can say the same for my Emisar D4S Nichia 219C at 5000K. NOWHERE near that. Again, 4000K or so. But compared to the SC700d, they are very similar in tint and CRI.



I think you may be mistaking tint with CCT Mark. 

Two emitters can be the exact same measured CCT but, have drastically different tints depending on where they fall in relation to the black body line. The tint lottery is real as you know. 

You also have to remember there is 200-300 CCT bin variation with these Cree emitters(most emitters on the market actually) so, if ZL says 5000K(for instance)that is nominal. So, one person could get a sample at say 4850 and another could get one at say 5150. Even tint differences/lottery aside they would obviously look quite different due to the difference in CCT if compared. The CCT lottery is also real.


----------



## Mr. LED

markr6 said:


> WOW! I almost want that cooler 700! With the 3 I already had, they were so consistent that I can't believe yours is that much cooler. Thanks for the photo!



I can sell it to you, otherwise it’s going back to NKON tomorrow! :sick2:


----------



## Random Dan

I just got a shipping notice for the SC64w HI and SC64c LE that I backordered on the 16th. That's much quicker than I anticipated. I will report back with tint comparison thoughts once they arrive, and then probably return or sell whichever one I like least. Or if they are both nice I'll keep them both, 'cause that's the cpf way.


----------



## xevious

Random Dan said:


> I just got a shipping notice for the SC64w HI and SC64c LE that I backordered on the 16th. That's much quicker than I anticipated. I will report back with tint comparison thoughts once they arrive, and then probably return or sell whichever one I like least. Or if they are both nice I'll keep them both, 'cause that's the cpf way.


USPS tracking finally updated. On Monday, I'll get to try out the SC64c LE.


----------



## gus1989

I received my SC600 MK IV HI back in December. I love this light! Still using the default UI as it matches my SC32. It's the perfect light for taking my walks down the road and in the woods at night. Reaches out far enough, good spill, perfect tint and fits in the hand and pocket nicely. My only little nitpick is that the tail cap is just a little darker than the rest of the light. That only bothers me for a micro second when i have to recharge the battery. Great purchase.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

gus1989 said:


> I received my SC600 MK IV HI back in December. I love this light! Still using the default UI as it matches my SC32.



Try playing with the G6 and G7 groups, and set them up the way you like. I have a few older Zebralights, so I too want to keep the low-medium-high thing going so I don't get confused when using different lights. But, I use different systems for the G6 and G7 groups, depending on the light and the intended purpose.

For example, for a "bedside light" that I sometimes use the SC64w HI for, I set up a G7 group to be the following:

L2 - 0.06 lumens
M2 - 0.86 lumens
H2 - 2.3 lumens

The intent is that when I go to bed, I set the light so that when I do a long-press, I get a very low moonlight. But, if I'm half-asleep and screw up by either pressing too long or too short, I still get a very low mode so I don't blind myself with bright light. I could set all 3 modes to be 0.06 lumens, but I kind of like having slightly different levels even if they're all low.

As for H1, M1, and L1, I set them to modestly higher modes. Basically, levels I use indoors. So, G7 is my "indoor" mode group.

I set G6 as my "outdoor" mode group.

L2 - 7.9 lumens
M2 - 52.5 lumens
H2 - 245 lumens

Basically, those are the modes I use for walking around outdoors, giving me a good range from basic close illumination to a fairly bright level. Then I set up the other modes to be the following:

L1 - 1300 lumens
M1 - 1300 lumens
H1 - 1300 lumens

Yup, all max output. This allows me to double-click from any mode and instantly get turbo. I don't have to press&hold for a few seconds if I need max, I can get it right away.

You'll notice that the levels I normally use all have the traditional low-medium-high settings that older Zebras force you to use. But, I set them up for particular uses, indoors or outdoors.

Anyway, that's how I set my SC64w HI and SC600w IV HI up. I don't really use my SC600w HI indoors, but I set it up for consistency anyway.

The SC600w IV Plus I use on my bike is set up differently, but still similar to my outdoor group.


----------



## koziy

I haven't put as much thought into the exact lumen numbers, but I have set up G6 on all my ZL's to be a little more foolproof than how it comes. There are four main flaws in the ZL G5 UI, in my opinion, at least considering these to be EDC lights which I plan to use frequently with the lower modes. I think these were all mentioned above but I'll reiterate:

1. Off to medium involves an unavoidable, blinding flash of high output light.
2. If you mess up the timing, going from off to low can result in a blinding flash of high output light.
3. From low or medium, there is no shortcut to high; you have to cycle through low and medium modes first.
4. The UI is unique in the industry, so if you've been using other lights lately, you might make a mistake or temporarily forget how to use the ZL. 

My solution is to set H1/H2 (short click) to be my low/moonlight modes and L1/L2 (long press) to be my high/turbo modes. I keep medium at the double click level. 

This solves problems (1-3) by getting rid of the chances of undesired, blindingly bright light, and by giving me a shortcut to high/turbo from any level with a long press. The downside is I lose a shortcut from low to medium that doesn't involve either turning the light off or cycling through high, but I figure that's a matter of priority. If there's a situation where I need more light quickly, it's more likely to involve the need for max output than a medium mode.

It's still a pretty unique UI compared to other lights I own. I understand that some people set H2, M2 and L2 to all be the highest brightness setting, so they can double click from any level to get to turbo, solving (3) and now addressing (4) to an extent, although with sublevel mode memory, this wasn't a good solution for me, since I know I would forget to reset the sublevel before turning it off, thus negating any inherent predictability from how I set up the main levels.


----------



## Random Dan

koziy said:


> It's still a pretty unique UI compared to other lights I own. I understand that some people set H2, M2 and L2 to all be the highest brightness setting, so they can double click from any level to get to turbo, solving (3) and now addressing (4) to an extent, although with sublevel mode memory, this wasn't a good solution for me, since I know I would forget to reset the sublevel before turning it off, thus negating any inherent predictability from how I set up the main levels.


It would be pretty great if there was an option to turn off sub-level memory.


----------



## likethevegetable

I like mapping my UI with single->low, hold->med, double->high.

I don't care for having a shortcut to high (non-tactical user, lol) and can wait the extra second when circulating from holding. To me, maintaining the loop from low->med->high from off is more important, especially if I'm handing my light over to someone. It's also nice to quickly be able to jump from high or low to the medium modes. It's second nature to me now.

I would love to see the following improvements in future UI releases:

Add the brightest mode to the beacon rotation.
I and many others have pretty much zero use for beacons for regular EDC, outdoor, and work light use. The only time I access the beacon mode is by accident. Adding the highest and lowest mode (not-flashing) to the beacon rotation would free up one mode in L2..H1 and offer a shortcut to min or max.

Add a medium brightness cycling beacon mode (200 lumens, 1.5 Hz perhaps)
Allow user to toggle sub-mode memory.
If sub-mode memory disabled, always cycle L1-M1-H1 when holding or accessing directly from off. This would make L2, M2, and H2 more of a hidden mode. I don't think I'd actually use this, but others might.

G5 to behave the same way as G6 and G7 - why not?


----------



## gus1989

I see I'll have to give this some thought about what might work best for me. Thanks for the suggestions.


----------



## koziy

For me, shortcut to high isn't about tactical. It's more of a handy feature for outdoor use so I don't have to turn off or down the light before I can get it brighter. If I'm on a night walk or camping and there's some noise, for example a wild animal, just outside my current range that I can barely see on medium mode, whether a deer, raccoon, fox, coyote, etc., then I could lose track of whatever it is if I have to fiddle around with the flashlight too much before I get it to high., which has in fact happened to me many times.


----------



## xevious

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Try playing with the G6 and G7 groups, and set them up the way you like. I have a few older Zebralights, so I too want to keep the low-medium-high thing going so I don't get confused when using different lights. But, I use different systems for the G6 and G7 groups, depending on the light and the intended purpose.
> 
> For example, for a "bedside light" that I sometimes use the SC64w HI for, I set up a G7 group to be the following:
> 
> L2 - 0.06 lumens
> M2 - 0.86 lumens
> H2 - 2.3 lumens
> 
> The intent is that when I go to bed, I set the light so that when I do a long-press, I get a very low moonlight. But, if I'm half-asleep and screw up by either pressing too long or too short, I still get a very low mode so I don't blind myself with bright light. I could set all 3 modes to be 0.06 lumens, but I kind of like having slightly different levels even if they're all low.
> 
> As for H1, M1, and L1, I set them to modestly higher modes. Basically, levels I use indoors. So, G7 is my "indoor" mode group.
> 
> I set G6 as my "outdoor" mode group.
> 
> L2 - 7.9 lumens
> M2 - 52.5 lumens
> H2 - 245 lumens
> 
> Basically, those are the modes I use for walking around outdoors, giving me a good range from basic close illumination to a fairly bright level. Then I set up the other modes to be the following:
> 
> L1 - 1300 lumens
> M1 - 1300 lumens
> H1 - 1300 lumens
> 
> Yup, all max output. This allows me to double-click from any mode and instantly get turbo. I don't have to press&hold for a few seconds if I need max, I can get it right away.
> 
> You'll notice that the levels I normally use all have the traditional low-medium-high settings that older Zebras force you to use. But, I set them up for particular uses, indoors or outdoors.
> 
> Anyway, that's how I set my SC64w HI and SC600w IV HI up. I don't really use my SC600w HI indoors, but I set it up for consistency anyway.
> 
> The SC600w IV Plus I use on my bike is set up differently, but still similar to my outdoor group.


Thanks for sharing this, *WalkIntoTheLight*. :thumbsup: I like your way of thinking.


----------



## eraursls1984

likethevegetable said:


> G5 to behave the same way as G6 and G7 - why not?


For new users programming G5 (standard Zebralight UI) can be a little difficult, but can be figured out in just a few minutes. The G6/G7 is. A little harder. I think they want to make it easier for people use to their old UI, and newcomers. 

What I would love to see is for G7 to have 2 sub modes for each group, L1, L2, L3, M1, M2, M3, H1, H2, H3. Then, of course, the ability to toggle sub mode memory.


----------



## likethevegetable

That would be wild, 9 modes to choose from!

At that point, I reckon' a ramping UI would work better. But who knows.

I never got around to appreciating ramping UI's, I just love knowing the exact level I'm on hah.


----------



## eraursls1984

likethevegetable said:


> That would be wild, 9 modes to choose from!
> 
> At that point, I reckon' a ramping UI would work better. But who knows.
> 
> I never got around to appreciating ramping UI's, I just love knowing the exact level I'm on hah.



The couple of ramping UI's were really nice. A close second to Zebralight as my favorites. If Zebralight added ramping as G8 or even replaced G7 it would be a perfect UI. I just don't see them doing that.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

I prefer distinct modes, rather than ramps. The problem I have with ramps is it's either too slow to pick the level I want (if the ramp is long), or too difficult to stop at the level I want (if the ramp is quick). Some ramping lights I have do a quick stop half-way up the ramp, which only helps if I want that 50% level which I usually don't. The Narsil and Andruil ramp lights I have are too quick to pick the perfect level (and they make _horrible_ distinct mode lights). The only advantage that ramping has is it's a bit easier to use for complete newbies, other than a single-mode light of course.

I have no problem if Zebralight wants to create a G8 group for ramping, but I certainly wouldn't want them to sacrifice G7 for it.


----------



## Mr. LED

Zebralight UI is really nice for me, but I would add shortcuts for momentary on and electronic lockout. First day I carried the H600w in my small jeans pocket, it turned on accidentally. The headlamp button seems softer to press compared to the side clicks and it’s not as recessed.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Mr. LED said:


> Zebralight UI is really nice for me, but I would add shortcuts for momentary on and electronic lockout.



I'm not a fan of electronic lock-outs, because it's way easier to just slightly twist the tailcap for a lockout. But, they could make 5-clicks a "dummy" mode, where the light would only operate as a single-mode 50 lumen light, and automatically shut off after 1 hour. That way, you could enable dummy mode, and then hand the light to anyone. 50 lumens is bright enough for general-purpose use, and doesn't generate any heat if the light turns on in your pocket. A 1 hour shutoff would preserve the battery in case of accidental activation, or a dummy leaving the light on.


----------



## xevious

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> I'm not a fan of electronic lock-outs, because it's way easier to just slightly twist the tailcap for a lockout. But, they could make 5-clicks a "dummy" mode, where the light would only operate as a single-mode 50 lumen light, and automatically shut off after 1 hour. That way, you could enable dummy mode, and then hand the light to anyone. 50 lumens is bright enough for general-purpose use, and doesn't generate any heat if the light turns on in your pocket. A 1 hour shutoff would preserve the battery in case of accidental activation, or a dummy leaving the light on.


I'm with you -- I prefer a physical lockout. Many lights with them require just a very small turn of the tail cap to achieve it. No big deal at all. Electronic lockout is only necessary when physical lockout isn't possible (like with a body lacking a screw end cap).


I have received my SC64c LE today. I have to say, I'm very impressed at how small this light is. In comparison, I have a Jetbeam RRT-01 that takes an AA, and it's only half an inch shorter than the 18650 powered SC64. The tint is good, although there's a tinge of yellow green in the spot. There is definite tint deviation from spot to spill. But that's all white-wall observing. When shining on everyday objects, it looks _wonderful_. Better than my old SC52w.

Because of previous reports like emitter being off, having some debris stuck in it, switch slightly askew, and anodizing issues, I went over mine with a magnifier. Passed the test. Everything seems to be in order. The anodizing color nearly matches my SC52w, just a little bit darker. I'll follow-up with comparison photos later.

Not that the Zebralight cardboard box is any kind of collectible, but I would have preferred that they mail it in some kind of padded or plastic envelope. There's a big ugly USPS sticker covering most of it. I like to keep the original box. So I removed the USPS label, but it inadvertently sheared off the top layer of paper fiber from the original SC64c LE label... rendering it useless. I've contacted Zebralight and hope they can supply me with a replacement label.


----------



## likethevegetable

xevious said:


> I went over mine with a magnifier. Passed the test.



Taking under the microscope to its literal meaning. I dig it.

I'm glad it's a keeper! I just chose the SC64w HI over it and your impressions aren't making me second guess myself any less... lol.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

xevious said:


> Not that the Zebralight cardboard box is any kind of collectible, but I would have preferred that they mail it in some kind of padded or plastic envelope. There's a big ugly USPS sticker covering most of it. I like to keep the original box. So I removed the USPS label, but it inadvertently sheared off the top layer of paper fiber from the original SC64c LE label... rendering it useless. I've contacted Zebralight and hope they can supply me with a replacement label.



Strange. Every light I've ordered from Zebralight has always come in a padded envelope, with the box inside. I usually throw out the box anyway. I think I've kept one box, in case I ever need to send back a light for repair.


----------



## markr6

Non-US customers: box in padded envelope
US: Big USPS sticker over much of the actual ZL box. Not very attractive for resell. Padded envelope if you happen to buy two and ship the same time.


----------



## xevious

likethevegetable said:


> Taking under the microscope to its literal meaning. I dig it.
> 
> I'm glad it's a keeper! I just chose the SC64w HI over it and your impressions aren't making me second guess myself any less... lol.


Heh, well with the HI you'll have more output. And also, if you're happy with the tint then you've done well.



WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Strange. Every light I've ordered from Zebralight has always come in a padded envelope, with the box inside. I usually throw out the box anyway. I think I've kept one box, in case I ever need to send back a light for repair.





markr6 said:


> Non-US customers: box in padded envelope
> US: Big USPS sticker over much of the actual ZL box. Not very attractive for resell. Padded envelope if you happen to buy two and ship the same time.


Yeah, what's weird is that my first Zebralight came in a padded envelope to a US address. They must have changed their policy at some point. I imagine if you make a request, they'll honor the padded envelope. I don't think I'd ever buy 2 at once... but that could change. 


Here's some direct comparison shots with between the new SC64c (LH351D) and old SC52w (XM-L2). It's interesting to see the differences and similarities.


----------



## koziy

I just got my SC64c LE and I can compare the beam in the following ways:
-The beam shape (size of the hot spot and proportional brightness in the spill) is about the same as the cool white SC64
-It's less bright than the SC64, but not by a huge amount. 
-The beam is slightly warmer than the SC64w HI (the SC64w HI is on the slightly orange side of neutral to my eyes)
-The beam is not nearly as yellow as the SST-20 4000K used in an Emisar D4. I prefer the tint in the SC64c LE, which is warm but more neutral. 

I'm not a tint snob, but I like what I see. I don't notice any tint shift in the beam, like I can easily notice with my H600d IV and SC700d. It's about as evenly tinted as the SC64w HI, except that it's a warmer white and the hot spot is broader.

Also, it did come shipped in the cardboard product box with the shipping label slapped right over the product label, which I find annoying for resale (although I have received flashlights from ZL where the product box was shipped in a padded mailer). You can remove the shipping label and preserve the product label if you are really careful and warm it up first, but it's easy to rip the product label accidentally. Incidentally, the USPS tracking showed this as "Pre-Shipment, Irving, TX" up until last night.


----------



## xevious

koziy said:


> Also, it did come shipped in the cardboard product box with the shipping label slapped right over the product label, which I find annoying for resale (although I have received flashlights from ZL where the product box was shipped in a padded mailer). You can remove the shipping label and preserve the product label if you are really careful and warm it up first, but it's easy to rip the product label accidentally. Incidentally, the USPS tracking showed this as "Pre-Shipment, Irving, TX" up until last night.


Good to hear that you are happy with your SC64c LE. Interestingly enough, I found that the slight greenish hue I saw initially has now faded off. Either my eyes were playing tricks on me, or the emitter needed a little "breaking in"? Whatever the case, I love the beam.

I tried being as careful as I could, removing the remnants of the original USPS label, but there was no way to preserve the original label. I tried warming it... didn't help. 

I also had that strange tracking behavior. For 5 full days after the shipping label was created in the system it read "Pre-shipment, Irving TX". Then just yesterday afternoon, the tracking updated and indicated my local USPS shipping hub. In the morning, it updated further and then said "Out for Delivery."


----------



## likethevegetable

How does color quality compare, koziy? Obviously on paper 90>80, but IRL, is it significant?

Would you recommend the LE over the HI? (Quick, I can still cancel my HI order, lol)


----------



## Dark Attic Works

Well, I just received my SC64w HI and I'm loving it except for one issue - wondering if any of you have experienced this: ocasionally, it gets stuck ON (happened 5 or 6 times now). No amount of clicks or long presses do anything and I have to loosen the tailcap to turn it off. I can't recreated it on demand but it seems to happen after changing modes so maybe the UI freezes or something.

Any thoughts? I emailed Zebralight and they want me to send it back for replacement but they don't cover shipping (even on a defective light!?) so I'm hoping maybe y'all have heard of this and know a fix or something... It's not my first Zebralight (I'm familiar with the UI) and I'm using proper length Samsung unprotected flat-top 18650s. I've even tried a couple different batteries and still experienced this issue. Strange...

Appreciate any suggestions... Thanks in advance.


----------



## likethevegetable

I've had that issue with 3 of my 4 ZLs. Happened maybe 10 times total combined.


----------



## autoxer

Dark Attic Works said:


> Well, I just received my SC64w HI and I'm loving it except for one issue - wondering if any of you have experienced this: ocasionally, it gets stuck ON (happened 5 or 6 times now). No amount of clicks or long presses do anything and I have to loosen the tailcap to turn it off. I can't recreated it on demand but it seems to happen after changing modes so maybe the UI freezes or something.
> 
> Any thoughts? I emailed Zebralight and they want me to send it back for replacement but they don't cover shipping (even on a defective light!?) so I'm hoping maybe y'all have heard of this and know a fix or something... It's not my first Zebralight (I'm familiar with the UI) and I'm using proper length Samsung unprotected flat-top 18650s. I've even tried a couple different batteries and still experienced this issue. Strange...
> 
> Appreciate any suggestions... Thanks in advance.





likethevegetable said:


> I've had that issue with 3 of my 4 ZLs. Happened maybe 10 times total combined.



I have had this happen on my SC64w several (3?) times. I've unscrewed the tailcap to fix it, and I think once a long wait (with no button presses) might have also fixed it - but I am going from memory here.

If it happens again, could you try letting it sit for a little bit (maybe 30 seconds?) and see if the switch becomes responsive again?

If my light does this again I will try it too, but it has not happened in a very long time now.


----------



## koziy

likethevegetable said:


> How does color quality compare, koziy? Obviously on paper 90>80, but IRL, is it significant?
> 
> Would you recommend the LE over the HI? (Quick, I can still cancel my HI order, lol)



I'm the wrong person to ask about color quality. I'm very happy with the tints of both of them. The beam colors seem very uniform and pleasant to my eyes. I don't really like pure yellow light (for example, I will probably end up selling my D4 with SST-20 4000K emitter, it's just too yellow). Neither of these ZL's seem too yellow to me, though. I don't really put too much stock into CRI, personally. A lot of high CRI flashlights do an utterly terrible job of rendering pure whites, so I take those ratings with a grain of salt. Also, like I mentioned earlier, my H600d IV and SC700d are both high CRI, but they have varying degrees of green to greenish yellow in their tints of white. A lot of people here hate that. Outdoors, which is where I use those flashlights, I don't really notice it. Indoors, it's less pretty, especially for the SC700d. 

The HI has a tighter (and brighter) hot spot. It has a noticeable advantage outside in terms of punching light out across a yard, for example. It also heats up faster on the highest mode, but it's pumping more lumens, so that's to be expected. The LE has an advantage for general use, particularly indoors, in my opinion, because the hot spot is broader and a little less intense relative to the spill. Unless ZL comes out with some game-changer, both of these will go into my EDC rotation -- HI for days I might need to use the light outside, and LE for the rest of the time -- and either my cool white SC64 will sit in my drawer unused or I'll end up selling it. So, no, I wouldn't recommend the HI over the LE at all. I recommend getting both.


----------



## Dark Attic Works

autoxer said:


> I have had this happen on my SC64w several (3?) times. I've unscrewed the tailcap to fix it, and I think once a long wait (with no button presses) might have also fixed it - but I am going from memory here.
> 
> If it happens again, could you try letting it sit for a little bit (maybe 30 seconds?) and see if the switch becomes responsive again?
> 
> If my light does this again I will try it too, but it has not happened in a very long time now.



Good suggestion. And thanks for the info. I guess it's not uncommon but at least it's infrequent. Maybe a quirk in the interface makes it freeze with an unusual timing of clicks/presses. I do have my modes set kind of unconventionally. Probably won't bother returning it it's a known issue.

Anyway, great light! Love the tint - to my eyes very neutral in a sort of cream/tan kind of way if that makes sense. Most of my other lights in this size range are floodier so I'm really enjoying the more directional beam. I do wish the lowest moonlight mode was dimmer - it's about the same level as the second lowest mode on my H53w. Interestingly, the H53w has a much warmer and yellower tint even though the color temperature is listed the same.


----------



## likethevegetable

Xevious, your eyes definitely do play tricks on you. I've found some tints can look green when looked at during the day, and yellow and night, and pure white if used as my only source of light. Mr. jon_slider has a nice synopsis here: http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?438804-Zebralight-SC64c/page13


----------



## likethevegetable

NKON now has some SC64c LE available for order.


----------



## Mr. LED

Already out of stock :candle:


----------



## xevious

likethevegetable said:


> Xevious, your eyes definitely do play tricks on you. I've found some tints can look green when looked at during the day, and yellow and night, and pure white if used as my only source of light. Mr. jon_slider has a nice synopsis here: http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?438804-Zebralight-SC64c/page13


Could very well be. Thanks for the link to Jon_Slider's post. I was certain I saw some yellow-green tinge when first using the light. Now, I barely see it. Even when comparing it to other emitters -- that's usually the easiest way to trigger contrast. I'd read someone posting a long while back about emitters "breaking in..." I don't know if there's any truth to that. I'd imagine in any case, Zebralight QC running tests on lights to be sure everything is in order.

But I think the best way to avoid becoming tint OCD is to simply use a light by itself. Comparing may be fine ultimately to understand where the tint falls in the spectrum of your own light collection, but beyond that it's all about usability. And white wall is not real-world anyway.

I've been using my SC64c LE for light duty across several nights. I have to say... WOW. This is such a wonderful light. I stand the SC64c LE next to my hunky copper molded Astrolux S43 and it just amazes me how much better an EDC it makes. I can't imagine a smaller 18650 flashlight with these features and as rugged a build. My tail cap off to Zebralight, and big thank you for taking a chance on using an emitter from a different brand (as I understand it, they'd been using CREE almost exclusively). The Samsung LH351D is excellent.


----------



## woodentsick

Just received an H53c. Not super happy with the tint, looks like I lost the lottery this time round...Some iPhone beamshots:

*H53c
*



Just look at that sickly green/yellow spill :green:*

SC51w
*



I've had this light for many years now, and still love it.
*
Folomov EDC C1
*



Ah, my first Nichia E21A. What a beautiful tint.


----------



## markr6

woodentsick said:


> Just look at that sickly green/yellow spill :green:



I can't really see it on my screen, but I know it's hard to capture on camera and varies on different screens. I'll take your word for it though. With 4000K and 93+ CRI, it should be really nice. Damn the lotto!


----------



## Mr. LED

It’s not lotto, it’s the XP-L which has terrible tint shift. I had a SC53c last week and while the 4000k tint was OK, there is green shift around the hotspot.


----------



## Random Dan

I recently received an SC64c LE and SC64w HI and I've had a little bit of a chance to compare. In short, they are both excellent. The HI has quite possibly the best beam I've seen from Cree emitter. Clean and white with a tiny hint of rosiness, but no green or yellow and no tint shift. The LE is a bit warmer with a slightly yellowish corona that isn't noticeable during actual use. I'm still not sure I can tell the difference in color rendering between the two.

So far I have no quality issues with either. The anodizing is even and dark, the switches are great, no weird ui bugs. I don't like the new black clips as much as the old but it is not a big deal. The LE has good clip tension but the HI's clip is really weak so I'll have to take it off and bend it a bit. 

The 64w HI is in my opinion peak Zebralight. If you are on the fence I would say 100% go for it. I know ZL has had some issues of late, but when they're good they're freakin' amazing.


----------



## leonpower

5-6 years EDC a sc52 ..
3 times has been by mistake ,washed in the washmachine, at 60C for 2 hours !! No problem ,even the battery a olight 14500,has no problem !
Zebralight,flashlights build like tanks :twothumbs


----------



## Mr. LED

I agree, the SC64w HI has the best tint and beam ever. I want one or two more for backups!
If only my SC600w Mk IV HI had the same tint...


----------



## likethevegetable

Woohoo, looks like I made the right choice... Should have my SC64w HI coming in this or next week. I was a bit concerned that the 80 cri on the HI wouldn't satisfy me and was second guessing if I should get the LE with 90 cri instead, but I was really craving a nice 4500k tint as my Plus left some to be desired.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

likethevegetable said:


> Woohoo, looks like I made the right choice... Should have my SC64w HI coming in this or next week. I was a bit concerned that the 80 cri on the HI wouldn't satisfy me and was second guessing if I should get the LE with 90 cri instead, but I was really craving a nice 4500k tint as my Plus left some to be desired.



I don't notice much of a difference between 80CRI and 90CRI. Yeah, colours are a bit better with 90CRI, but for 99% of use it doesn't matter. To me, the tint matters more. High CRI green skin still looks sickly. High CRI cool white still looks harsh. So a good BBL white or slightly rosy (which the SC64w HI is), and a neutral or warmish CCT, is much easier on the eyes.


----------



## Random Dan

For what it's worth I went for a walk in a wooded area last night alternating between using HI and LE, and I consistently couldn't tell which one I was using unless I had them both on side by side.


----------



## xevious

Random Dan said:


> For what it's worth I went for a walk in a wooded area last night alternating between using HI and LE, and I consistently couldn't tell which one I was using unless I had them both on side by side.


That seems sensible. I'd expect the SC64c LE tint to be more noticeable at close range illumination.


----------



## likethevegetable

Just got my SC64w HI, tint is great.


The switch feels different from my other Zebras. It feels more plump and feels like there's more space between the boot and the switch, where the other Zebra's I have I can't discern the spacing. The actually clicking mechanism is fine though, just feels like it's a mm or so lower. I think I've read of another user who's had this concern. I don't know, I kind of like that it's more difficult to activate, but I also don't feel as precise changing modes as it's not as firm and quick to click. Anyone care to chime in?


----------



## marinemaster

leonpower said:


> 5-6 years EDC a sc52 ..
> 3 times has been by mistake ,washed in the washmachine, at 60C for 2 hours !! No problem ,even the battery a olight 14500,has no problem !
> Zebralight,flashlights build like tanks :twothumbs



+1


----------



## xevious

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Strange. Every light I've ordered from Zebralight has always come in a padded envelope, with the box inside. I usually throw out the box anyway. I think I've kept one box, in case I ever need to send back a light for repair.


Well, good thing is that Zebralight finally responded to my inquiry and they're mailing me the sticker label for the box. :twothumbs


----------



## likethevegetable

FYI, this holster is very nice quality for $2 and fits all 18650 ZL's pretty good (SC600 is a bit snug): https://www.aliexpress.com/item/13c...399.html?spm=a2g0s.9042311.0.0.3da24c4dVhO4uh

I plan on sporting it for camping (but have too much ego to rock it in public lol)


----------



## JimIslander

likethevegetable said:


> Just got my SC64w HI, tint is great.
> 
> 
> The switch feels different from my other Zebras. It feels more plump and feels like there's more space between the boot and the switch, where the other Zebra's I have I can't discern the spacing. The actually clicking mechanism is fine though, just feels like it's a mm or so lower. I think I've read of another user who's had this concern. I don't know, I kind of like that it's more difficult to activate, but I also don't feel as precise changing modes as it's not as firm and quick to click. Anyone care to chime in?



My SC64C LE feels like the rubber button cover is slightly thicker and the stroke does seem a hair longer than on my SC52 L2 and SC53c. H604d and H600Fd Mk IV both feel like the SC64C LE. Both are just fine. If I had to pick one over the other, I like the longer stroke better.


----------



## likethevegetable

https://ru.nkon.nl has a bunch of ZL's in stock - (eg. SC700d, SC64w HI, SC64c LE, SC600w HI and Plus) for a great price (especially for Canadians).


----------



## rpaloalto

I bought a zebralight sc600w Hi. It arrived last week. It had a issue with shutting off when going from off to high. If I clicked back on. It would behave normally.
No big deal customer service set up a RMA. Instead of waiting for the whole replacement process. I just ordered a new one. I got it just a few hours ago. It works fine. But has big solder blobs next to led on the mcpcb. One blob is almost touching the mcpcb set screw.

Does this look normal to all of you?
https://imgur.com/BHdwFrI


----------



## xevious

^ That looks shoddy. My SC64c LE has no blobs like that. In fact, the MCPCB screws aren't even visible in the reflector opening.


----------



## likethevegetable

Damn that's disappointing. Should not have made it past QC.


----------



## Fireclaw18

While ugly, I don't think those solder blobs are defects. They aren't actually touching anything so shouldn't affect performance. Frankly even if the blob near the set screw did touch it, it shouldn't cause an issue. The blobs near the screws are from the edges of the DTP ground pad so should already have an electrical connection to the screws even without contact.


----------



## rpaloalto

Thank you all for your input. I'm just going to do a refund. Zebralight has already sent me a RMA. They have been great to deal with. I really like the sc600w hi. So I will try again in a few weeks. First I need to get these 2 lights back to them in the mail. Get the ball rolling on my refunds. And let my bad luck streak pass.

When Zebralight set up the first RMA. For the flashlight, the one that would shut off randomly. I did request to bypass the whole exchange process. And just buy a new one. And pay for overnight delivery. I really wanted it for this weekend. I'm wondering if they tried to help make me happy? By sending out one that was repaired. The website at the time of the second order did say on back order. 

It was a new light. Not like something someone used, and then sent in for repair. Might have been one that was DOA from the manufacturer?
Other then the funky solder blobs. What really caught my attention was the brown burn or heat marks on the board. Not sure if you can see in my picture. But those are burn marks from the heat of the soldering iron. I should know because I'm no good with with my soldering skills. That's how most of my projects turn out 

Im not trying to give zebra a bad time. I have no ill will with them. They have been excellent to deal with. If I want a RMA, no problem. Refund, Exchange or repair my choice.
I just wanted to hear some opinions on my issue. Thanks


----------



## likethevegetable

Good luck with your next orders!


----------



## marinemaster

Any idea if ZL will release the 1xAA with the XHP70.2 led ?
Asking as the spot looks to be in the 15% range. Like a wider spot.


----------



## Nichia!

marinemaster said:


> Any idea if ZL will release the 1xAA with the XHP70.2 led ?
> Asking as the spot looks to be in the 15% range. Like a wider spot.



You are kidding right??!


----------



## marinemaster

Nope.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

The XHP70.2 doesn't make sense in a 1xAA light. It would require a huge voltage booster. Zebralight only boosts to 3v for the 1xAA lights, not 6v or 12v. Even if they could do it, it would take a hit in efficiency.

And, there's no way to drive the XHP70.2 anywhere past about 500 lumens on AA cell. Why stick a 3000 lumen LED in a 500 lumen light?

Doesn't make any sense. If you want a floody AA Zebra, there are already lots of frosted-lens options.


----------



## Bob_McBob

Those aren't burn marks in the photo, it's just shoddy soldering in general. Excessive solder on the pads and poor flux clean-up. It's probably not a problem because the blobs look stable (you don't want a blob breaking off and shorting something), but it is pretty ugly for a light at this price.


----------



## Mr. LED

The brown marks look like paste from the solder. Good solder has soldering paste added to it, for better adherence and it’s completely normal. Yes, the blobs look bigger than normal, but if they’re solid, I wouldn’t worry.


----------



## marinemaster

Ok thanks
Their flood offerings are just a frosted lens. They suck the beam pattern is horrible.


----------



## likethevegetable

Bold statement. I find floody to be far more useful than throwy.


----------



## JimIslander

likethevegetable said:


> Bold statement. I find floody to be far more useful than throwy.



Same here for headlamps. Floody is nice, and flood is almost as good.


----------



## Mattz68

I think marine master’s profile has been hijacked -doesn’t sound like him at all!


----------



## twistedraven

My SC600 HI has two solder bobs to connect the LED. They're on left and right though, nowhere near the screws.


----------



## marinemaster

Mattz68 said:


> I think marine master’s profile has been hijacked -doesn’t sound like him at all!



Lol
Ill ask ZL to secretly build me a 1xAA with the 70.2 [emoji847]


----------



## marinemaster

Correction meant to say 50.2 but that still wont make a difference.


----------



## marinemaster

likethevegetable said:


> Bold statement. I find floody to be far more useful than throwy.



Use one of the SF MaxVision lights. Awesome flood.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

marinemaster said:


> Correction meant to say 50.2 but that still wont make a difference.



It might. Supposedly, there are some 3 volt XHP50.2 emitters available. Pretty limited selection, I imagine. But, it might be possible to use those with Zebralight's 1xAA drivers.

You could always mod it, or pay someone to do it for you. Zebras can be taken apart and have their LED replaced, though it's not as simple as with some other lights.


----------



## AVService

Oh God help me now!

A store in my area is stocking some ZL now according to their web site.

Anyone want to take bets on how long it takes me to go there?

There are really only 2 types of ZL for me,the ones that I own and the ones that I do not own yet.


----------



## ven

AVService said:


> Oh God help me now!
> 
> A store in my area is stocking some ZL now according to their web site.
> 
> Anyone want to take bets on how long it takes me to go there?
> 
> There are really only 2 types of ZL for me,the ones that I own and the ones that I do not own yet.




How long? Well my guess same day they have stock

Better hurry though, any tom, **** and harry might beat you to it


----------



## Andrey

Anyone discovered a difference between H600Fc IV and H600c IV headlamps, besides frosted glass?
The H600c may have some improvements being released one year after the 'F' version.

Trying to decide whether H600c with DC-Fix would be preferable over H600Fc. DC-Fix attached to my H32w few years ago is still there and works really well. It may even provide some extra protection for the glass.


----------



## TangibleOblivion

*My First Zebralight SC62*

Hello all, this is my first post so I am saying hello to all, and I thought I would let everyone know that Zebralight may have some SC62's in stock. I ordered mine 3 days ago and it showed up this morning. The build is flawless and the beam dynamics are excellent. The only thing I haven't tested is the PID. I'll let you all know if there are any problems with it but so far it's beautiful. At $59.99, I don't think there is a better light on the planet.... Best - Nick


----------



## likethevegetable

*Re: My First Zebralight SC62*

Hey Andrey, at one point I owned an H53c and H53Fc. With DC-Fix, the beam is very, very close to that of the frosted glass, maybe just slightly more throw and slight tint shift. I would say that DC-Fix has an indistinguishable optical efficiency to the frosted lens. I also have an H600Fc and found it was more floody than the H53Fc. I'd expect the H600c to be pretty floody as is even without DC-Fix due to the 5mm LED. If I had the choice to return my H600Fc for an H600c, I probably wouldn't take it because I love the beam and the tint on my sample is great. Can't lose either way.


----------



## Mr. LED

*Re: My First Zebralight SC62*



TangibleOblivion said:


> Hello all, this is my first post so I am saying hello to all, and I thought I would let everyone know that Zebralight may have some SC62's in stock. I ordered mine 3 days ago and it showed up this morning. The build is flawless and the beam dynamics are excellent. The only thing I haven't tested is the PID. I'll let you all know if there are any problems with it but so far it's beautiful. At $59.99, I don't think there is a better light on the planet.... Best - Nick



Welcome to CPF. The SC62 is indeed a classic, and Zebralight is still making them (but should stop anytime). The only downside is the LED is cool white, and might not fit everyone. They discontinued the neutral white version. Same with the SC32, the neutral was discontinued and the cool white remained. Two weeks ago they also discontinued the SC32 and sadly this little great light will remain in our memories only. I really can’t understand some Zebralight decisions :thumbsdow


----------



## Derek Dean

*Re: My First Zebralight SC62*



TangibleOblivion said:


> Hello all, this is my first post so I am saying hello to all, and I thought I would let everyone know that Zebralight may have some SC62's in stock. I ordered mine 3 days ago and it showed up this morning. The build is flawless and the beam dynamics are excellent. The only thing I haven't tested is the PID. I'll let you all know if there are any problems with it but so far it's beautiful. At $59.99, I don't think there is a better light on the planet.... Best - Nick


Howdy Nick, and welcome to the forum!

The SC 62 is great light. I've have mine for several years now, using it frequently at work, and it's always performed flawlessly. We'll look forward to hearing how it's working out for you. Enjoy!


----------



## Climb14er

*Re: My First Zebralight SC62*

I haven't bought another light since buying the SC62cw a few years ago. To me, it's the best all around light I've ever used. Small, compact, lightweight, reliable, takes protected and unprotected cells, great balance of throw and flood, lots of bright lumens. I like Cool White lights personally as my eyes like the sharp clarity they bring. YMMV. Now that it's sixty bucks, it's a steal of a light!


----------



## treek13

The cool white SC52 is 49 now, which is also a great deal. I kind of wish I had never found out that I prefer the neutral white offerings.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Yeah, I have a cw and nw SC52. Had them 5 years, and still use them. Their output on AA is great for around the house (they still beat almost all other AA brands). But a nice thing about the SC52's (which they removed in the SC53) is that you can put a 14500 in them for a lot of extra punch. It makes them useful outdoors, too.

The SC5/SC5w claims similar output on a AA that the SC52's get on a 14500. However, I don't find it's quite as bright. The SC5 does have more throw, though, due to the larger reflector. But it can also be difficult to get it to stay on full turbo. The battery has to be very good, and it has to have good contact with the pogo pins in the light.

The SC52 is just simpler with a 14500, and it's smaller too.


----------



## Climb14er

I also have a SC52cw and run 14500's, Eneloops and Alkalines. This is my travel light when I don't want to take 18650's and a small charger, mostly on planes and for longer trips. I can get AA's anywhere and this makes the SC52 ideal for travel... or for very discrete carry in a pants suit when the SC62 might be a little too large. Both lights, great designs.


----------



## FSUwelder1212

Has anyone else noticed the SC5c II and the SC5w II are no longer listed on the site? I wonder if an update is coming or if they killed that product line.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

FSUwelder1212 said:


> Has anyone else noticed the SC5c II and the SC5w II are no longer listed on the site? I wonder if an update is coming or if they killed that product line.



I'm still seeing them on their site. The SC5w II is available, while the SC5c II is on back order. Neither has a discounted price. So, it doesn't appear they're discontinuing them yet.


----------



## Mr. LED

Zebralight website is probably managed by a monkey, it’s the worst I’ve ever seen. The SC32 is officially discontinued now (I asked and they confirmed) and was removed from the website a couple of weeks ago. But the SC32w is still there... although it has been discontinued a long time ago.


----------



## treek13

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> I'm still seeing them on their site. The SC5w II is available, while the SC5c II is on back order. Neither has a discounted price. So, it doesn't appear they're discontinuing them yet.



They are back now but they were definitely gone from the site earlier. I checked back when FSUwelder posted. Zebralight really does have a horribly run site.


----------



## xevious

Mr. LED said:


> Zebralight website is probably managed by a monkey, it’s the worst I’ve ever seen. The SC32 is officially discontinued now (I asked and they confirmed) and was removed from the website a couple of weeks ago. But the SC32w is still there... although it has been discontinued a long time ago.


They often have listed for sale discontinued lights, usually with some kind of discount, until they empty out the stock. Some are really old, like the SC52w.


----------



## marinemaster

My SC52W is great. It absolutely loves Eneloop black label. For a small 1xAA there is no better combo.


----------



## archimedes

After all these years here, I have (yes finally) gotten my first ZebraLight(s).

As @Nichia! was asking for my thoughts on these, as promised, I'll post up a few comments.

I've mainly been using the SC53w to check out the ZL UI, and really enjoyed setting up the G5 / G6 / G7 mode groups. Not too tricky to program, although occasionally I've accidentally blasted my retinas on high in the process :duh2:

Very nice to have firefly and moonlight lows in one bank, and another bank just for fixed output mono-mode.

I want to thank whoever mentioned that the springs in this will accept a AAA without an adapter, as that hadn't occurred to me :goodjob:

Having used a lot of different e-switches, I find the ZL switch to have pretty good ergos, and I'm impressed by the reliability of the multi-click actuations.

I do still prefer the HDS system, at least for accessing the basic functionality, mostly because of the timing needed to get directly to "low" from "off" on the ZL.

The SC62w I also received has somewhat better tint and smoother beamshape than this SC53w, but both are good and warm 

I am really amazed at how tiny, yet solid, both of these seem to be.

All in all, I'm impressed. So, what's next ?


----------



## ven

Nice one Archi, you hopefully will also be impressed with the ano down the line. Pretty tough, drops onto hard surfaces really dont show or anywhere near other manufacturers claimed HA anyway.

One thing for me other than the trick UI and nice ano, is as you say, the size. The 18650 sc63/64 is pretty much typical 16340 size. Similar beam type to the HDS(which as we know is great). But with benefits of potentially 5x the stored energy(mah). The side switch also is super user friendly, i love my tail clickies, but for general holds, switching modes, i find a good side switch hard to beat for the easy /natural click and light up feel.

Whats next, well i would contemplate a bob sc64 219b 9080 flavour, i have been using the 4k one and its pretty much perfection. All the good bits of ZL complemented by one of the better LED's available imo. 

The HI is also worth a look, be it sc64 or the larger(yet still compact) sc600 . The 4500k xhp35 HI is a winner!!!!! Really useful beam, just with an added bit of punch. I am also a fan of their older xhp50 (not .2)






and i have not even mentioned their headlamps........possibly one if not the best available imo
edit- spelin curekshone four awto in crekt


----------



## Nichia!

archimedes said:


> After all these years here, I have (yes finally) gotten my first ZebraLight(s).
> 
> As @Nichia! was asking for my thoughts on these, as promised, I'll post up a few comments.
> 
> I've mainly been using the SC53w to check out the ZL UI, and really enjoyed setting up the G5 / G6 / G7 mode groups. Not too tricky to program, although occasionally I've accidentally blasted my retinas on high in the process :duh2:
> 
> Very nice to have firefly and moonlight lows in one bank, and another bank just for fixed output mono-mode.
> 
> I want to thank whoever mentioned that the springs in this will accept a AAA without an adapter, as that hadn't occurred to me :goodjob:
> 
> Having used a lot of different e-switches, I find the ZL switch to have pretty good ergos, and I'm impressed by the reliability of the multi-click actuations.
> 
> I do still prefer the HDS system, at least for accessing the basic functionality, mostly because of the timing needed to get directly to "low" from "off" on the ZL.
> 
> The SC62w I also received has somewhat better tint and smoother beamshape than this SC53w, but both are good and warm
> 
> I am really amazed at how tiny, yet solid, both of these seem to be.
> 
> All in all, I'm impressed. So, what's next ?



I knew you are going to like them


----------



## archimedes

Anyone here with a SC64c ( Samsung LH351D, 4000K, CRI 90+ ) ... ?


----------



## archimedes

archimedes said:


> Anyone here with a SC64c ( Samsung LH351D, 4000K, CRI 90+ ) ... ?


Nevermind, I found this ...

https://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?p=5253680

Looks like I have some reading to do[emoji14]


----------



## Random Dan

archimedes said:


> Anyone here with a SC64c ( Samsung LH351D, 4000K, CRI 90+ ) ... ?


Had one, but sold it in favor of the hi. What you want to know?


----------



## archimedes

Random Dan said:


> Had one, but sold it in favor of the hi. What you want to know?


Mainly how was the tint, especially at lower levels ?


----------



## Mr. LED

SC700Fd was added to the online spreadsheet.


----------



## Mr. LED

Sharing my collection with you guys


----------



## Bob_McBob

archimedes said:


> Mainly how was the tint, especially at lower levels ?



The original XP-L2 SC64c is not great. Extremely green on all levels with ugly tint shift, and it doesn't even make the rated CRI on H1. The LE version is a significant improvement, though the LH351D suffers from a green tint at lower output levels (significantly less than the XP-L2). I posted some measurements in the SC64c thread, but typical Duv on H1 is in the 0.0004-0.0008 range, and 0.0030 by L1. The worst sample I tested was 0.0060 at L1, but most are much better.


----------



## archimedes

Was mostly interested in the Samsung emitter. That is super helpful info, thanks.


----------



## archimedes

I'm sure others have done this, but I now found a great solution for my main issue with the UI.

In the G6 (or G7) mode bank, I program H1 to "low" and L1 to "high" which removes the timing needed to simply single-click to a low output. If I want high output, I can "click-hold" , but I don't get blasted if I miss the timing when I want low.

If, for some reason, I want to swap back to a "standard" ZL UI ... it is rather easy to swap H1 to H2 and L1 to L2 

I like this system much better :twothumbs


----------



## ven

Yes archi, as i like simple........... With the latest drivers, my H1 and H2 are set to my 2 most used levels. I always like a pretty high level on tap, i also like a do it all, kind of useful for most applications level. Of course a variable, but on a ZL around the 100-200lm type levels. I can use for prolonged periods without heat issues, its not unbearable closer up and can be used for moderate distance.......hence do it all. If i want to swap around, double tap and done. So in ways its like having a dual mode light within a H(could be M or L ). 

So one example would be walking the dog, lower level around the streets, on the field the double tap to higher output to scan about. Double tap to lower when the dog is close by......

How do you find the ano? After surefires natural HA, its my fav bar none!(inc HDS and elzetta).


----------



## bignc

archimedes said:


> I'm sure others have done this, but I now found a great solution for my main issue with the UI.
> 
> In the G6 (or G7) mode bank, I program H1 to "low" and L1 to "high" which removes the timing needed to simply single-click to a low output. If I want high output, I can "click-hold" , but I don't get blasted if I miss the timing when I want low.
> 
> If, for some reason, I want to swap back to a "standard" ZL UI ... it is rather easy to swap H1 to H2 and L1 to L2
> 
> I like this system much better :twothumbs



Well dang. That's pretty smart. Lol I don't know if I am glad or not that you figured that out.  But I AM glad you are enjoying them! I am definitely enjoying my end of the trade too.

Also, it's acceptable to post here because my boy's both have ZL headlamps that I purchased for them.  One a single 123 and one a single AA. Both like them and use them in emergencies.


----------



## archimedes

I've only just received these two days ago, so not yet put the finish to the test, haha.

I'm somewhat surprised how different the anodize is between my SC53w (smooth, very dark slate olive, "slick" to touch, and seemingly quite a thick coating) and my SC62w (appears lighter in both color and thickness, more of a greyish-tan, and with a bit of grippy kinda sandy texture)

I definitely prefer the first of those, looks great to me !

The only clearly better anodize I've seen has been on the Frelux, which is really in another class by itself oo:


----------



## ven

The herd will no doubt grow, other than surefire, off the top of my head, i dont think i own more of one brand. Their headlamps are excellent, so are the sc600 HI 4500k........i have been pondering the 700 for a while as well


----------



## Random Dan

archimedes said:


> Was mostly interested in the Samsung emitter. That is super helpful info, thanks.


I was quite impressed with the Samsung. It had a noticeable yellowish corona when used indoors but outside it was hard to tell it apart from my favorite 219b. It did have some tint shift at lower levels, but not much. Slightly more than with 219b but definitely less than an SST-20.


----------



## marinemaster

My SC53w on High gets hot on Eneloop.
My SC52w on High stays cool on Eneloop.
What is your guys experience ?


----------



## JStraus

marinemaster said:


> My SC53w on High gets hot on Eneloop.
> My SC52w on High stays cool on Eneloop.
> What is your guys experience ?



My 52w ran pretty cool on Eneloop.
My SC5c MKII get's pretty hot on an Eneloop.


----------



## Tixx

archimedes said:


> I'm sure others have done this, but I now found a great solution for my main issue with the UI.
> 
> In the G6 (or G7) mode bank, I program H1 to "low" and L1 to "high" which removes the timing needed to simply single-click to a low output. If I want high output, I can "click-hold" , but I don't get blasted if I miss the timing when I want low.
> 
> If, for some reason, I want to swap back to a "standard" ZL UI ... it is rather easy to swap H1 to H2 and L1 to L2
> 
> I like this system much better :twothumbs



Exactly how I set mine up. Flip the low and high positions. Also removes that pre-flash issue.


----------



## archimedes

Tixx said:


> Exactly how I set mine up. Flip the low and high positions. Also removes that pre-flash issue.


Nice, I'm really liking this system.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

marinemaster said:


> My SC53w on High gets hot on Eneloop.
> My SC52w on High stays cool on Eneloop.
> What is your guys experience ?



It makes sense that the SC53 gets hotter than the SC52 on an Eneloop, since the SC53 max is higher.

My experience, with the AA Zebralights operating on an Eneloop, is

SC52 - gets slightly warm after a few minutes
SC52w - gets warmer than the SC52 (probably because the neutral white is less efficient)
SC5w - gets very hot after a few minutes (bumping it back up to 500 lumens every 3 minutes)

Interestingly, the SC52's on a 14500 lithium-ion cell don't get that hot even after a few minutes (500 lumen output on a 14500). They step-down after 1 minute on a 14500, which is ridiculously short IMO. I can step them back up several times before they get hot. They should have made the step-down timer to be 3 minutes, same as the SC5.


----------



## marinemaster

I set it on the lowest H1 can be set and all is good. Plenty of light does not get hot anymore.
Love the SC53w. Get one [emoji1690]


----------



## gurdygurds

Question for the zebra junkies. Has anyone abandoned their regular zebras in favor of the headlamp style? Just curious if you’ve found the right angle lights to be overall better for you over the straight. I’ve got my first zebra headlamp en route but always wondered how well I’d like using one when it’s not attached to the head strap.


----------



## AVService

gurdygurds said:


> Question for the zebra junkies. Has anyone abandoned their regular zebras in favor of the headlamp style? Just curious if you’ve found the right angle lights to be overall better for you over the straight. I’ve got my first zebra headlamp en route but always wondered how well I’d like using one when it’s not attached to the head strap.



Not me and I have tried to get used to it too.
I just prefer the correct light for the application in the end.
There is no substitute for the HL when called for and the same for the Handheld in my world which is fine as I just have spare batteries all the time in the end which can never be a bad thing.


----------



## NPL

It's totally doable but I find it tedious to remove the light from silicone holder. It's also nicer to hand hold a flashlight as opposed to right angle light.


----------



## lampeDépêche

Using a right-angle ZL as a hand-held? Totally possible.

My H52w is my don't-leave-home-without-it light, and it always rides in my right front pocket, without a headband. I have used it as a hand-held light quite a lot.

However -- after doing that for quite a lot of time, I have to say that the straight-line format (mine is an SC64w-HI) is actually more convenient for waving around in your hand. It just indexes more easily with where you want to point. It's also a bit easier to carry the SC-line of lights as deep-carry pocket clip lights. Not impossible, with the headlamps, but not as convenient.

So if I can have only one, I carry the H52w. But nowadays I almost always keep the SC64 in my left pocket. 

(Just did a house inspection, all through the basement, attic, walls, roof, etc.. I brought my H600w in the head-strap as my headlamp, and was grateful for it in the attic. I brought the SC64w-HI as my handheld, and used it in every room in the house. And my H52w rode in my pocket the whole time -- but I was glad to have it in there!)


----------



## Derek Dean

gurdygurds said:


> Question for the zebra junkies. Has anyone abandoned their regular zebras in favor of the headlamp style? Just curious if you’ve found the right angle lights to be overall better for you over the straight. I’ve got my first zebra headlamp en route but always wondered how well I’d like using one when it’s not attached to the head strap.


Nope. To much of a hassle taking it out of the strap, and I've always got a few other regular Zebras on hand, so it's just not necessary. 

I will say this though, I waited quite a while to get my first headlamp, thinking it's usefulness would be limited, but once I got it, I found myself reaching for it more and more as I began to realize how incredibly useful it is to have both hands free and the light always aimed right where I'm looking.

I'll bet you find the same thing. But with all that said, I still use my regular ZLs nightly on my job, where a headlamp just wouldn't work as well.


----------



## gurdygurds

Thanks for the replies folks. Well I now have an H53c AND an SC53w on the way. Not sure what happened. I was doing sooooooo well not buying lights.......for a little while at least. I’ll be glad to get some Zebras back in my paws for sure though.


----------



## TangibleOblivion

I just got my first Zebralight. It's an SC62 and was on backorder, but for $59.00 I couldn't turn it down. Despite that, I got the light in 3 days! It's flawless, everything lines up just right ans the finish is perfect. I am wondering if anyone has modified a head strap to use this as a headlamp. I have plenty of headlamps but I have been messing around with velcro straps to attach the light to a head strap. I'm going to try to try to find something similar to the plastic piece that holds a bike pump to the frame so I can just snap the SC62 in and out at will. I'll post pics if I find a good solution....


----------



## crashmidget

Just got my first Zebraight, and SC62 and I absolutely love it. I have a lot of lights but for EDC you can't beat it. FYI, I got it 3 days after I ordered it although it
was listed as backordered....I guess you never know with ZL


----------



## gurdygurds

Thanks Derek. I'm starting an experiment putting the H53c to the test as an all around daily\nightly flashlight\headlamp. Working out well so far. Takes some getting used to grip and aim wise but not too bad. Also I've found it pretty quick to pop in and out of the head strap.


Derek Dean said:


> Nope. To much of a hassle taking it out of the strap, and I've always got a few other regular Zebras on hand, so it's just not necessary.
> 
> I will say this though, I waited quite a while to get my first headlamp, thinking it's usefulness would be limited, but once I got it, I found myself reaching for it more and more as I began to realize how incredibly useful it is to have both hands free and the light always aimed right where I'm looking.
> 
> I'll bet you find the same thing. But with all that said, I still use my regular ZLs nightly on my job, where a headlamp just wouldn't work as well.


----------



## TomK85

Really happy with my SC600 & H53. Both are floody’s. Still thinking about the Sc700. Already here that has some experience with the floody version?


----------



## Keitho

Subjectively to me, the size differences are pretty even spacing, SC64 to SC60x to SC700. Since a SC64 rides in my pocket most days, the SC600x's seem a bit too big for EDC use, and the SC700 seems way too big (esp. the head) for my EDC use. But, my suburban-warrior skinny jeans and khakis differ from people with more a more practical wardrobe, so I bet that the SC700 will end up in lots of pockets due to runtime, efficiency (for a high-CRI LED), heat management, and beam. It has a very even beam, no defined hotspot; so, I use it on my bicycle handlebar (compliments an SC64 on my helmet) for conspicuity and lighting while commuting on paved paths and suburban neighborhood roads. 

I think the ZL product comparison spreadsheet has a 2nd 21700 model, so we'll soon have two larger-battery models to choose from. If they ever come up with an SC70 (small-as-possible version of the SC700), I'll reach into my cramped little office-worker pocket to throw my wallet at it pretty fast!


----------



## pantagana23

Well now, my SC5w II had an almost RIP today.
My kid decided to toss it from 15 foot high terrace, and it started blinking, plus eneloop started rattling inside.
In the end, only the battery paid by shrinking a bit from the fall.
After putting a new one in, as good as new 
Here's the damage on the flashlight itself:






Poslano sa mog SM-G960F koristeći Tapatalk


----------



## gurdygurds

Good to see that they can take a shot like a champ. Run4jc had a great post years back documenting some zebralight torture. He threw it around pretty good and the light was fine. I got my first zebralight headlamp and must say I’m loving the thing. Works just fine for me as a stand alone flashlight and of course has the additional utility as a headlamp. Size approaches a AAA light as well. H53c is an excellent light and exceedingly versatile. Once again a Zebralight has relegated other lights to the box in the closet for a little timeout.


----------



## gurdygurds

Does anyone have one of the H503c lights that can share their impressions of it?


----------



## NuisanceValue

gurdygurds said:


> Does anyone have one of the H503c lights that can share their impressions of it?


Yes, it’s a bit of a curate’s egg: parts of it are excellent. But (and it’s a big but) there’s a quite a broad green ring around the edge of the beam. I don’t find this a problem outdoors really, but inside and at short ranges the difference between how things look in the centre of the beam and at the edge is massive.


I was really excited when they announced it as I have an h502d that I like, but have always found it’s not quite bright enough for outdoor use unless on H1, which has quite a short runtime. Also, I wanted the new UI so I have access to moonlight via a short click.


So, ignoring the green ring, I love it as the high CRI really does make a difference, colours look great in the centre of the beam and runtimes are better. However, as a task light for DIY etc I don’t really like it as I just can’t ignore the green ring. To be fair the h502d has one too, but it’s really thin in comparison, much less of a sickly green, and overall less noticeable. 


So I’d like to ask if anyone’s got the 503w, and for the impressions of it. Does it have a better beam pattern? I’d give up some CRI to avoid catching sight of things at the edge of the beam (like my hands) turning an awful green colour. Hope that helps.


----------



## MKayze

anyone have a video comparison of the SC600w Mk IV Plus and the SC600Fd version? Can’t decide between the two for edc.


----------



## JStraus

If your EDC needs aren't much past 100' or so I'd get the Fd. It's a light you really don't have to aim and provides one of the most useful beams in any flashlight for normal use.

The Fd still reaches out pretty good for thing's like walking the dog in the neighborhood because it reaches out pretty well with sheer output for 99% of my needs.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

For EDC, you might want to try something smaller than the SC600 series. The SC64w HI is a nice choice for a bit of throw, or the regular SC64w for a more traditional beam. The SC64c and SC64c LE are a high CRI version (a bit less output, but nicer colors).

Unfortunately, if you want the frosted lens, I think you only have the SC600 option, with the Fd or Fc Plus. It's do-able as an EDC, but you'll notice it in your pocket.

You could go smaller with a AA light, like the SC53Fc. But you won't get the high output and long runtimes. It's good indoors, and at fairly close distances outdoors.


----------



## MKayze

JStraus said:


> If your EDC needs aren't much past 100' or so I'd get the Fd. It's a light you really don't have to aim and provides one of the most useful beams in any flashlight for normal use.
> 
> The Fd still reaches out pretty good for thing's like walking the dog in the neighborhood because it reaches out pretty well with sheer output for 99% of my needs.





WalkIntoTheLight said:


> For EDC, you might want to try something smaller than the SC600 series. The SC64w HI is a nice choice for a bit of throw, or the regular SC64w for a more traditional beam. The SC64c and SC64c LE are a high CRI version (a bit less output, but nicer colors).
> 
> Unfortunately, if you want the frosted lens, I think you only have the SC600 option, with the Fd or Fc Plus. It's do-able as an EDC, but you'll notice it in your pocket.
> 
> You could go smaller with a AA light, like the SC53Fc. But you won't get the high output and long runtimes. It's good indoors, and at fairly close distances outdoors.



I was considering the SC64W HI because of the size but I just like 5000k better. Although I really like the size of the SC64w. Decisions, decisions lol


----------



## MKayze

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> For EDC, you might want to try something smaller than the SC600 series. The SC64w HI is a nice choice for a bit of throw, or the regular SC64w for a more traditional beam. The SC64c and SC64c LE are a high CRI version (a bit less output, but nicer colors).
> 
> Unfortunately, if you want the frosted lens, I think you only have the SC600 option, with the Fd or Fc Plus. It's do-able as an EDC, but you'll notice it in your pocket.
> 
> You could go smaller with a AA light, like the SC53Fc. But you won't get the high output and long runtimes. It's good indoors, and at fairly close distances outdoors.






Hey quick question, I’m about to pull the trigger on the SC64W HI but I’m just curious how long can the SC64W HI sustain 500-700 lumens without dropping down compare to a SC600W IV Plus?


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

MKayze said:


> Hey quick question, I’m about to pull the trigger on the SC64W HI but I’m just curious how long can the SC64W HI sustain 500-700 lumens without dropping down compare to a SC600W IV Plus?



If you hold the SC64w HI in your hand to absorb the heat, it will stay at the 500 lumen mode indefinitely. If it's tail-standing at room temperature, I think it's somewhere around 10-15 minutes. The 600w Plus seems to stay at its 700 lumen mode indefinitely.

On hot nights, subtract some time. On cool nights, add some. By the time you're down into cold winter nights, you can run the lights on full output indefinitely.


----------



## xevious

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> If you hold the SC64w HI in your hand to absorb the heat, it will stay at the 500 lumen mode indefinitely. If it's tail-standing at room temperature, I think it's somewhere around 10-15 minutes. The 600w Plus seems to stay at its 700 lumen mode indefinitely.
> 
> On hot nights, subtract some time. On cool nights, add some. By the time you're down into cold winter nights, you can run the lights on full output indefinitely.


Yep. I think the SC64 is a better value, because the output and flood of the SC600 is only nominally greater. The SC64 is more convenient to hold and carry. Just the right size.


----------



## Stefano

In 2019 I bought only a one Zebralight (headlamp)
I'm thinking of a new light, I normally use little the hand_torches but I was thinking about the SC600w MK4.
I already own an old SC600 MKII L2 - looking at the technical specifications there is a nice improvement but I would like to know if you think it is advantageous to make the purchase.
Has anyone ever upgraded from MKII to MK4? Is the difference very obvious?
Thanks for any thoughts


----------



## NPL

I think it depends on what you want from the light. The sc600w hi will probably be a nice upgrade for clean good tint and more throw, and the sc600w plus or sc600fd or fc will give you more flood, better color rendering and more output. 

Sent from my Pixel using Candlepowerforums mobile app


----------



## Stefano

No I'm not interested in other versions of the SC600, I think the "standard" version (SC600w) XHP35 is the right one for me.
It should be a great balance, I don't need to launch and if I want to see it right up close I have a lot of headlamps,
I was just wondering if those 400 more lumens (compared to the old MKII L2) are so obvious in practical use, probably yes .. I also like the fact that H2 can be 875 lumens - maybe someone in the forum has bought more versions of the same light and can you tell me this.
I have read that the HI versions have a better tint but I hope to have luck with the traditional version.


----------



## Random Dan

I think the big reason to upgrade is the fact that the driver is now programmable. If that's a feature you would use then I'd say go for it.


----------



## NPL

The mk4 programable UI is a nice upgrade, but if you have older Zebralights and new ones like me, you might find it confusing to have the order of low medium high different from one light to another. Simpler to keep them all with the same UI, which defaults to MK3 and older lights. 
The newest lights appear to be overstating the lumen output, as I recall people measuring the lumens to be closer to 1100 and not 1400. Not sure you will have many benefits upgrading to the mk4 of the same model. 

Sent from my Pixel using Candlepowerforums mobile app


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

NPL said:


> The mk4 programable UI is a nice upgrade, but if you have older Zebralights and new ones like me, you might find it confusing to have the order of low medium high different from one light to another. Simpler to keep them all with the same UI, which defaults to MK3 and older lights.



Yes, I need to keep the UI going from low to high, so I don't get confused with my older zebras. However, I still find the new UI very useful. I generally create two groups: one for indoors and one for outdoors. Indoors has lots of low modes. Outdoors has a larger range, and double-clicks from any level goes to max. So, things are still low-to-high, but I can customize the levels and behavior according to my needs at the time.



> The newest lights appear to be overstating the lumen output, as I recall people measuring the lumens to be closer to 1100 and not 1400. Not sure you will have many benefits upgrading to the mk4 of the same model.



It's the "HI" version that overstates their output. Zebralight just copied the specs from the regular versions to the "HI" versions, but forgot that the XHP35 HI emitter has lower output than the regular domed XHP35. So, yes, the output of the SC600w IV HI and the SC64w HI is about 1100 lumens. The regular lights is higher.


----------



## NPL

Thanks for the clarification. I forgot about the three mode groups. I usually program one of them in muggle mode so if I lend the light the user can't reach the highest setting. You can def get creative in each group to suit your specific needs. 

Sent from my Pixel using Candlepowerforums mobile app


----------



## Stefano

Thank you all for the answers.
I decided to try anyway and one SC600w MKIV is already on its way (It was shipped only 5 hours after purchase !!) 
My old SC600w II L2 is a good light I hope that even the most recent version is like the previous one.


I'd also like to try SC600w HI but after the SC600w MKIV I want to try the SC64w, it is since the SC62 model came out that I want to buy this model but then I always refer the purchase! 
If I still wait, I risk seeing the SC65 exit 


I read in another thread that the SC600w HI has 26500 lux.
This value seems very high to me, I wonder if anyone has ever measured the lux of the standard SC600w (MKIV), they are probably half of it?


----------



## Mr. LED

I’ve just bought a brand new H32Fw to complete my collection!


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Stefano said:


> I read in another thread that the SC600w HI has 26500 lux.
> This value seems very high to me, I wonder if anyone has ever measured the lux of the standard SC600w (MKIV), they are probably half of it?



IIRC, I think I measured it to be close to 20,000 lux. I don't think it's anywhere near 26500, but I could be wrong. It is much more throwy than other zebras, impressively so for such a small light.


----------



## Stefano

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> IIRC, I think I measured it to be close to 20,000 lux. I don't think it's anywhere near 26500, but I could be wrong. It is much more throwy than other zebras, impressively so for such a small light.



Yes, i agree
Even if they were 20000 (HI version) they are still many for a small light.


In the past, Selfbuilt has measured 10,600 lux for old SC600 II L2
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/v...M-L2-1x18650)-Review-RUNTIMES-BEAMSHOTS-VIDEO

I suppose the new version XHP35 could also have 13000/14000 lux


----------



## Mr. LED

I’ve read that the SC600w IV HI is 16363 lux.


----------



## NPL

https://amp-reddit-com.cdn.ampproje...600w_mkiii_hi/?amp_js_v=0.1&usqp=mq331AQCKAE=

Just under 18,000 cd of throw. I too find it quite impressive for it's size. 

Sent from my Pixel using Candlepowerforums mobile app


----------



## Stefano

NPL said:


> https://amp-reddit-com.cdn.ampproje...600w_mkiii_hi/?amp_js_v=0.1&usqp=mq331AQCKAE=
> 
> Just under 18,000 cd of throw. I too find it quite impressive for it's size.
> 
> Sent from my Pixel using Candlepowerforums mobile app



Thank you for the link.
It is impressive, especially considering that it refers to MKIII


----------



## Stefano

The SC600w MKIV arrived in Italy in just 8 days ! (with standard shipping) -
The copy I received is perfect, good switch, good aesthetic finish, led centered and good threading.


Unfortunately the big disappointment is the tint color, I don't like it, my old SC600w II L2 is much better.
One thing that struck me right away is that the spot looks slightly larger this in comparison to SC600w II L2 (XM-L2) even though from the specifications it should be the same (10 degree hot spot) 
For the moment I have tried only at home in a room with closed windows but I can say that the difference on the turbo is very evident, I am disappointed by the tint and I am thinking of returning it even if shipping to China with tracking will be very expensive.






[/IMG]


----------



## Stefano

After some tests with the luxmeter I can say that between the old version SC6002 II L2 and the new SC600w MKIV there are approximately 2500 lux of difference.
I think the SC600w MKIV emits approximately 12500/13000 lux


----------



## NPL

Not surprised about the added throw as xml die is larger. Zebralight needs to correct many of the errors in their specs. As for the tint, it is unfortunate that it is not as good. Maybe return it for the HI and it will complement your mk2 light instead of replace it. 

Sent from my Pixel using Candlepowerforums mobile app


----------



## Derek Dean

Stefano, it's SOOOOO easy to change the tint with filters. You really should give it a try. I used to agonize over tint, but now I just I pop on a filter and I'm good to go. Nine times out of ten a minus 1/2 or minus 1/4 green is what I end using (which are magenta colored filters). PM me if you want more info.


----------



## Stefano

Yes I decided to return the light, the tint is too strange, besides being less bright I see the colors very badly, I can't define that color but maybe there's too much green.
I was aware of the risk, I was hoping to get lucky, maybe with HI version I would have been happy, I had read here that with the HI versions it was easier to get a good tint but I wanted to try the same purchase.
These are small flashaholics incidents  fortunately to return it will cost me only 16 euros.


I was lucky with the previous purchase of the H604c which is perfect and has a super tint.


I also had the purchase of the SC64w in my head, but after this bad experience with XHP35 I'm afraid to get another lemon.
I have always received good tint lights, only this SC600w MKIV and the H603w (XHP35) are disappointing - the H603w has a bad tint only at low levels, from 150 lumens up is good.


Now I have to decide what to do next, whether to buy the SC600w HI version or to look at the SC600 Plus version but from the videos I'm afraid it has little throw, does anyone know how many lux the SC600w IV Plus has?


@derek
Thanks for the suggestion but I don't want to use filters on the light, I prefer to return it and try to get a better light.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

If you're a tint snob (which most of us are), go for the SC600w HI or SC64w HI. Great tints, and consistent over the entire beam.

You could try the SC600w Plus, but it has a very floody beam, and it's not perfect tint. It's very bright, though, so the throw might be decent. The problem is that the wall of light it produces will prevent you from seeing very far with it. If you want throw, the SC600w HI is perfect as a general-purpose outdoor light.

Or try the SC700d if you want even more output. I haven't got one, but I hear the tint on it is decent (which is surprising for a Cree XHP70 emitter). Floody light as well, though.


----------



## Stefano

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> You could try the SC600w Plus, but it has a very floody beam, and it's not perfect tint. It's very bright, though, so the throw might be decent. The problem is that the wall of light it produces will prevent you from seeing very far with it.



This is certainly true.
I also think that with such a small mass this light heats up quickly and the usable levels are only those of 1311 and 705 lumens.
SC700 can be an option, I like XHP70 but I am reluctant because I would be forced to buy 21700 spare batteries and I don't even know if among the many chargers I have one compatible with that battery format ..


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Stefano said:


> This is certainly true.
> I also think that with such a small mass this light heats up quickly and the usable levels are only those of 1311 and 705 lumens.



Yes, it does get hot and starts to throttle down after about a minute on 2300 lumens turbo. 705 lumens doesn't seem to overheat at all. And 1311 takes awhile. You can extend the run-time if you grip the light tightly in your hand, which allows you to become the heat-sink. Or, on a cool night, I can run it on turbo for 30 minutes (when the battery runs out) without any overheating, but I'm on a bicycle so it's getting a good breeze to keep it cooled off. Finally, outside in winter it doesn't ramp down either.

Compared to something like the Emissar D4 or FW3A, the 1-ish minute on turbo seems like a good long time. And that much output is really much more than you need, so it's more for entertainment than practical use.



> SC700 can be an option, I like XHP70 but I am reluctant because I would be forced to buy 21700 spare batteries and I don't even know if among the many chargers I have one compatible with that battery format ..



Yup, that's the main reason for why I've held back on that light. I think the small 18650 format is just about perfect.


----------



## ven

Wow , i presumed(one should never presume!) pretty much most HI LED's were safe with the "tint" side of things. i have a mkIII 4500k xhp35 HI and its real nice. Even my sc63w is nice, touch of rosey in there(reminds me a little of the 219b). I think i have been pretty lucky with ZL, only one bad one in the sc5c , the xp-l2 was too yellow for me. At times it was OK, but it did my head in after a bit. Too many choices and lights to keep any that are not up to par. I have 8 at the moment, only a couple of CW and both are fine.........still have them anyway!. I would try another Stefano, defo worth another shot imho. The HI's are great lights.......


----------



## Stefano

ven said:


> would try another Stefano



Do you mean another SC600w? Or Hi version
I don't know whether to make another attempt with SC600w, maybe I could ask NKON if they make a selection before shipping.
Perhaps as they all say the best choice would be HI version, but I have to be careful when the refund arrives I could end up buying yet another Zebralight Headlamp..
I use very little hand lights but I wanted to "update" my old SC600w even though it still works great and has a nice color tint.
The new SC600w has 400 lumens more and has slightly larger spots and spills (I made a brief comparison of the lights) if it wasn't for the bad tint it would have been a successful update.


----------



## Mr. LED

ven said:


> Wow , i presumed(one should never presume!) pretty much most HI LED's were safe with the "tint" side of things. i have a mkIII 4500k xhp35 HI and its real nice. Even my sc63w is nice, touch of rosey in there(reminds me a little of the 219b). I think i have been pretty lucky with ZL, only one bad one in the sc5c , the xp-l2 was too yellow for me. At times it was OK, but it did my head in after a bit. Too many choices and lights to keep any that are not up to par. I have 8 at the moment, only a couple of CW and both are fine.........still have them anyway!. I would try another Stefano, defo worth another shot imho. The HI's are great lights.......



Unfortunately, there’s still lottery with the HI. Last year I bought a SC600w IV HI and it had greenish tint. I sold it and ordered another one, probably from another batch, and it was better. I guess it depends on the batch. My SC64w HI has a perfect tint that makes even my best Zebralight tints look bad. I ordered another one and while good, is not the same.

My SC53c and H53Fc although yellow (4000k right?), don’t bother me, I actually like it. I can’t stand green :green:


----------



## Mr. LED

Stefano said:


> Do you mean another SC600w? Or Hi version
> I don't know whether to make another attempt with SC600w, maybe I could ask NKON if they make a selection before shipping.
> Perhaps as they all say the best choice would be HI version, but I have to be careful when the refund arrives I could end up buying yet another Zebralight Headlamp..
> I use very little hand lights but I wanted to "update" my old SC600w even though it still works great and has a nice color tint.
> The new SC600w has 400 lumens more and has slightly larger spots and spills (I made a brief comparison of the lights) if it wasn't for the bad tint it would have been a successful update.



You can ask NKON to select the tint for you, they always do it for me and was never disappointed. And if they can’t find a tint that you want, they’re honest to tell you.


----------



## likethevegetable

Derek: I have been going back and forth with a dude (super nice guy) with a laser cutter trying to cut a perfect circle of LEE Zircon filter for my Plus. I got one of the cuts to fit nicely without using any glue, but running the light on H1 deformed the filter! For reference, he programmed the laser to cut 29/32 + 1/64 + 1/128 of an inch, lol. To my knowledge, you didn't use the Zircon type filters.. any issues with deformation?

I put a warning filter on my BLF A6 and the tint is awesome! It produces such a pleasant amber tone.


----------



## likethevegetable

WalkIntoTheLight: Out of curiosity, do you have any DC-Fix? I'm interested in seeing how the HI + DC-Fix compares with the Plus.

The greenish cast of my Plus has me longing for a light with a better tint to replace it. I'm trying some LEE filters but you'll see from the post above that I'm running into difficulties.

If the HI + DC-Fix compares with the Plus, I might sell the Plus and buy a HI.

I purchased two SC64w HI's but had to return them due to a faulty switch and then poor anodizing.. then gave up on the model as I don't really need one anyway.. but they made me realize that a 4500k beam should be clean and NEUTRAL, not green. I think I preferred the 600 host to the 64 for better thermals (important when used as a bike light) and feel in hand over pocketability. The SC64w HI beam was amazing though...


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

likethevegetable said:


> WalkIntoTheLight: Out of curiosity, do you have any DC-Fix? I'm interested in seeing how the HI + DC-Fix compares with the Plus.
> 
> The greenish cast of my Plus has me longing for a light with a better tint to replace it. I'm trying some LEE filters but you'll see from the post above that I'm running into difficulties.
> 
> If the HI + DC-Fix compares with the Plus, I might sell the Plus and buy a HI.
> 
> I purchased two SC64w HI's but had to return them due to a faulty switch and then poor anodizing.. then gave up on the model as I don't really need one anyway.. but they made me realize that a 4500k beam should be clean and NEUTRAL, not green. I think I preferred the 600 host to the 64 for better thermals (important when used as a bike light) and feel in hand over pocketability. The SC64w HI beam was amazing though...



I don't have any DC-Fix, but I've used free diffusers from an old laptop screen, as follows:




DC-Fix is probably better, but the laptop diffuser works pretty well. However, it diffuses more than you probably want. There's not much hot-spot left after putting it over the lens. Not quite as diffuse as a frosted lens, but pretty close. I haven't noticed it deforming, but I tend to use it on lower-output lights.

As for the SC64w HI, yeah, stick with the SC600w Plus if you're using it as a bike light. It's really good for that, IMO. As a bike light, you probably won't notice any tint imperfections anyway.


----------



## likethevegetable

The problem is that I only want one flashlight to serve all of those needs!


----------



## Derek Dean

likethevegetable said:


> Derek: I have been going back and forth with a dude (super nice guy) with a laser cutter trying to cut a perfect circle of LEE Zircon filter for my Plus. I got one of the cuts to fit nicely without using any glue, but running the light on H1 deformed the filter! For reference, he programmed the laser to cut 29/32 + 1/64 + 1/128 of an inch, lol. To my knowledge, you didn't use the Zircon type filters.. any issues with deformation?
> 
> I put a warning filter on my BLF A6 and the tint is awesome! It produces such a pleasant amber tone.


I've never had any issues with deformation of the filters, but I've never had the need to use H1. Most of my use is in the 50-70 lumens range for reading, or the 300-400 lumen range for lighting up pathways etc. 

If you're having an issue with deformation, you might try using a pink magic marker on the front glass. It works surprisingly well, however, it does have a tendency to rub off, so if you like the results, you can seal it on with clear tape.


----------



## ven

Stefano said:


> Do you mean another SC600w? Or Hi version
> I don't know whether to make another attempt with SC600w, maybe I could ask NKON if they make a selection before shipping.
> Perhaps as they all say the best choice would be HI version, but I have to be careful when the refund arrives I could end up buying yet another Zebralight Headlamp..
> I use very little hand lights but I wanted to "update" my old SC600w even though it still works great and has a nice color tint.
> The new SC600w has 400 lumens more and has slightly larger spots and spills (I made a brief comparison of the lights) if it wasn't for the bad tint it would have been a successful update.



Yes try another HI version, and as mentioned, get nkon to test out prior to shipping. Then hopefully all should be good


----------



## likethevegetable

WalkIntoTheLight: how about the SC600w HI with the diffuser? How does that compare to the Plus?


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

likethevegetable said:


> WalkIntoTheLight: how about the SC600w HI with the diffuser? How does that compare to the Plus?



I just tried it, and the HI with diffuser is definitely more floody than the Plus (without diffuser). Quite a lot more floody.


----------



## likethevegetable

Thank you!

Might keep the Plus and try the SC64w HI for the third time.. lol


----------



## Stefano

ven said:


> Yes try another HI version, and as mentioned, get nkon to test out prior to shipping. Then hopefully all should be good



Yes when the refund arrives I could buy a HI version on Nkon hoping that they can find a flashlight with acceptable XHP35 led.
I admit to being very tempted by the Plus version - a lot of indecision but what matters to me is having a light with a nice tint (maybe easier with XHP50.2)


----------



## NPL

Stefano said:


> Yes when the refund arrives I could buy a HI version on Nkon hoping that they can find a flashlight with acceptable XHP35 led.
> I admit to being very tempted by the Plus version - a lot of indecision but what matters to me is having a light with a nice tint (maybe easier with XHP50.2)


Stefano, I have the Hi and the Plus. If you are picky with tint like me, the Plus will be very yellow/green with tint shift as well. I did put a Lee Zircon minus green filter on it which made it significantly better at the expense of total output now being about 20% lower. The Hi that I have looks great, no filter needed.

Sent from my Pixel using Candlepowerforums mobile app


----------



## Stefano

NPL said:


> Stefano, I have the Hi and the Plus



Thank you for your information on the two versions.
From the many favorable opinions I seem to understand that if there was a survey the HI version would win without problems.


----------



## ven

Stefano said:


> Yes when the refund arrives I could buy a HI version on Nkon hoping that they can find a flashlight with acceptable XHP35 led.
> I admit to being very tempted by the Plus version - a lot of indecision but what matters to me is having a light with a nice tint (maybe easier with XHP50.2)



I know one or two have got lucky with the xhp50.2, but I am simply not a fan of anything .2. I went for the mkIII xhp50, I’m not disappointed ! You have a lot more chance of an off tint with this LED used in the mkIV plus. Down side , don’t have latest UI, but that’s no deal breaker for me anyway. 

Good luck with the next HI, great light and quite possibly my fav ZL behind the good old sc62d


----------



## StandardBattery

Is it time for a 700 series headlamp? Keep the max output around 1500 lumens and go for longer runtimes? A 21700 used headlamp must be in the works, or maybe people think the size would just be too big?


----------



## NPL

I think 21700 would be too heavy.

Sent from my Pixel using Candlepowerforums mobile app


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

StandardBattery said:


> Is it time for a 700 series headlamp? Keep the max output around 1500 lumens and go for longer runtimes? A 21700 used headlamp must be in the works, or maybe people think the size would just be too big?



Probably too heavy. Besides, do you really need 1500 lumens as your main output on a headlamp? Sure, it's nice for a quick blast, but headlamps are normally for close-up, and 300 or 400 lumens should be more than enough. That would give over 6 hours on an 18650. I'm not sure the 9 or 10 hours you'd get from a 21700 would be worth the extra weight.


----------



## StandardBattery

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Probably too heavy. Besides, do you really need 1500 lumens as your main output on a headlamp? Sure, it's nice for a quick blast, but headlamps are normally for close-up, and 300 or 400 lumens should be more than enough. That would give over 6 hours on an 18650. I'm not sure the 9 or 10 hours you'd get from a 21700 would be worth the extra weight.


It's a zebralight, programmable, and H2 at 900 is fine if you are hiking or walking, but you can set it for anything you want. If you are working real close up work, I recommend using the CR123A or AA versions with total flood. Lots of different ways to even use headlamps.


----------



## StandardBattery

NPL said:


> I think 21700 would be too heavy.


Yes, that could be for many applications. Strapped on a helmet though it may be OK? Overall the battery is not that much heavier than an 18650, and the shell would not have to be much heavier than the 600 series with the max-output is limited to avoid heating issues.


----------



## NPL

Good points. I would personally love to see Zebralight release a multi emitter light to achieve better efficiency, less heat at high output levels, with minimal added weight. 

Sent from my Pixel using Candlepowerforums mobile app


----------



## radellaf

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Probably too heavy. Besides, do you really need 1500 lumens as your main output on a headlamp? Sure, it's nice for a quick blast, but headlamps are normally for close-up, and 300 or 400 lumens should be more than enough.



I love the 700 but don't think I'd be tempted to have the extra weight for more runtime, when the 18650 run long enough. Or, when they wouldn't, a 21700 wouldn't run long enough either. I'm still weight and safety-wise happier with NiMH, unless it is outside a helmet. Which, since I'm walking rather that caving or working on a construction site, not the case.

Is 20ft "close up"? I basically use a headlamp for either walking (15-30ft) or reading (2ft?). Still have an ancient Zipka but have been thinking about a Zebralight AA like maybe the H53Fc, if it wasn't back ordered. Really, I'd like, and be willing to pay for, a LH351D, but I don't want a bare-bulb H503 version. It's nice for showing off the emitter, but I already have the 64LE for that.


----------



## likethevegetable

Well fellas, I ordered another SC64w HI (after two returns) and it came in... it's definitely a keeper! Shout out to the good folks at NKON for putting up with me and hand selecting a darker and quality ano'd sample. I wholeheartedly recommend them; they are my go-to for flashlights and accessories.

Interestingly, this one is very shiny/glossy. My other 3 Zebra's have more of a matte finish. This one is just as dark as my H53c but shiny. My H53c looks almost like it's powder-coated, I think I slightly prefer it to this w HI but both are very nice. I will take some pics in the coming weeks. Having handled 8 ZL's and seen countless pictures online, the ano lottery is real folks.

Similar to the other 2 w HI's I had before, tint is beautiful - clean white.

These images from reddit are similar to mine in ano: 
https://i.redd.it/cz1cce7726431.jpg 
https://i.redd.it/jpgcgkyorjv21.jpg


----------



## noboneshotdog

Wow! That anodizing looks much shinier and darker than any zebralight that I have ever seen. Is this something new they are doing?


----------



## likethevegetable

I wish I knew, but if it is something new, I hope it results in consistent finishes...


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Yeah, I've noticed the SC64w HI anodizing seems much more smooth than my other Zebras. Not as shiny as that picture looks, but I think the lack of knurling tends to amplify the effect.


----------



## xevious

likethevegetable said:


> I wish I knew, but if it is something new, I hope it results in consistent finishes...


Very odd looking, compared to previous anodizing. If it's somehow more resilient to nicks / scratches, then it could be a good thing.


----------



## Romanko

Asked support about releasing updated sc32 and they answered that there will be no update. Can anyone ask them again to show them an interest? Maybe they will release.


----------



## Mr. LED

Romanko said:


> Asked support about releasing updated sc32 and they answered that there will be no update. Can anyone ask them again to show them an interest? Maybe they will release.



I do it every week and they don’t care...


----------



## likethevegetable

Someone on Reddit posted this pic. Pretty cool.


----------



## mega_lumens

This Zebralight fan is here to vent. I can’t find my beloved SC32 so I bought an SC53. I really like the size, output, UI of SC53 but this light is borderline EDC useless to me because of the atrocious impossibly tight clip!! I need 2 hands to wrestle and shred my clothes to get the clip to slide on! How do you miss such an important function in an EDC light? The clip on my SC32 was a breeze to use and was super secure. Zebralight if you’re reading and care, please redesign the clip to be functional.


----------



## Random Dan

mega_lumens said:


> This Zebralight fan is here to vent. I can’t find my beloved SC32 so I bought an SC53. I really like the size, output, UI of SC53 but this light is borderline EDC useless to me because of the atrocious impossibly tight clip!! I need 2 hands to wrestle and shred my clothes to get the clip to slide on! How do you miss such an important function in an EDC light? The clip on my SC32 was a breeze to use and was super secure. Zebralight if you’re reading and care, please redesign the clip to be functional.



Take the clip off, then either clamp it in a vise or screw it on backwards sticking out the tail. Now you can bend it back a bit to reduce tension. One of my zebras with the new black clip came with perfect tension but the other I had to bend a little. Now it works great.


----------



## Stefano

I sent the SC600w XHP35 to China (cost about 16 euros) when Zebralight received the package it issued a refund immediately.
Instead of buying another hand_zebra I bought an H604d.
I have the H604c and it is beautiful, I am really impressed every time I turn it on.
So I wanted to buy the same light but in the 5000K version.
Unfortunately this whole operation was a bit unlucky, I had to pay 16 euros for shipping to return the SC600w with the bad tint and I had to pay 15 euros of customs for the H604d: - /

For the moment I tried it only in a room, fortunately the tint looks beautiful and I'm glad I bought the H604d
I also received a specimen with the new appearance, the new color is darker and more polished.
It's not ugly but I preferred the previous one (or even the color of many years ago)
In the picture: the light with the band is the H604c, the one without headband is the H604d.




[/IMG]


----------



## KITROBASKIN

Emailed Zebralight, next day got a response last May 2nd about returning my failed SC62d with $15. Turns out one of my heavily used (since 2013ish) Zebra's would not go brighter than low and a little higher in brightness. Promptly mailed it and this past week was very pleased to get it back in working order. Maybe they put a new emitter in? It looks the same as my other SC62d with black tic marks on three corners around the LED. Looking inside, they may have replaced the engine/positive end, but not sure. Thank you to Zebralight for honoring their customers with that kind of service, and even though I primarily use that newer SC64 LE(?) my wife uses one of the 62d's (nightly) and I have a back-up 62d in my work/daily pack. This repaired one will go in secure storage with other valuable items.


----------



## Zunkted

Anybody here have a sc700d that has put a lee zircon filter on it? I was looking at there 801-805 zircon minus green filters and i'm not sure on which on to get.


----------



## Derek Dean

Zunkted said:


> Anybody here have a sc700d that has put a lee zircon filter on it? I was looking at there 801-805 zircon minus green filters and i'm not sure on which on to get.


I put a Lee Filter 1/4 minus green on my SC700d and it cleaned it right up. I haven't tried the Zircon filters yet, but I'd recommend that you start by purchasing one of the LEE FILTER Swatch books first (Google it). This way you can play with the different colors to find the one you like best, then if you feel like purchasing a 12"x12" sheet you'll have a better idea of which one you want. 

I found the Lee Filter Designer Swatch books for as little as $2.50 each (always get two swatch books). The nice bonus with these swatch books is that you also get a nice variety of diffusion material. 

By the way, I cut the filter for my SC700d directly from one of the filters included in the swatch book. Put a little piece of double sided tape in the center and put it on the front glass and bam, no more green. Have fun!


----------



## Zunkted

Derek Dean said:


> I put a Lee Filter 1/4 minus green on my SC700d and it cleaned it right up.


Awesome, thank you.


----------



## KITROBASKIN

Yes, Derek Dean is the meister of tint adjustment. You may find a 1/8 minus green does it.

Wanted to mention that my returned SC62d was sent without a clip because I had put a different clip on it and gave all 3 of my slim chrome clips to Mr.LED. Also, Zebralight was not shy about putting thread/oring grease on the returned flashlight.


----------



## Mr. LED

So you’re without a clip now? Is there a way I can help?


----------



## KITROBASKIN

Mr. LED said:


> So you’re without a clip now? Is there a way I can help?


I'm sorry, I was rushing when I wrote that previous post. It was impressive that I sent them a broken flashlight without a clip (did not want to take a chance on losing the aftermarket clip) and they returned the repaired flashlight with an 'old school' new slim chrome clip. Apologies for sloppy post.

Zebralight also replaced the rubber(?) button cover, even though the old one was worn but not damaged.


----------



## Mr. LED

That’s great!


----------



## Robot Mania FU

Quick question....I'm curious if anyone in here owns both the h600fc iv and the sc600fc iv+ in 4000k? I just got my h600fc in the mail and the tint seems to be perfect. Is there much of a difference between the xhp50 and the xhp50.2? I wasn't planning on buying another light, but I reeeeaaaalllllllyyy like this one.


----------



## AcesHigh

So ok recently I got a new Zebralight Sc53c. This will probably last me for the many years to come (use to carry Nitecore). I kinda like the ZL no issue but is there any place where I can buy bidirectional clip for the light? Similar to those of Surefire E1B backup. Would be nice if I could clip this light on the bill of my cap


----------



## dcraig

I noticed the A6 has been added to the spreadsheet. Looks to be an 18650 angle light, 70+ CRI, 5000K, 3 to 800 lumens, 5 modes, TIR optic, black anodization. Curious to see some pics.


----------



## Random Dan

dcraig said:


> I noticed the A6 has been added to the spreadsheet. Looks to be an 18650 angle light, 70+ CRI, 5000K, 3 to 800 lumens, 5 modes, TIR optic, black anodization. Curious to see some pics.


I wouldn't get my hopes too high yet. Things have showed up on the spreadsheet before and never materialized.


----------



## SYZYGY

the A6 doesn't sound very exciting. zzzzzZZzzzZzZzzZZ

where's that damn C3?


----------



## brachypelma44

Derek Dean said:


> I put a Lee Filter 1/4 minus green on my SC700d and it cleaned it right up. I haven't tried the Zircon filters yet, but I'd recommend that you start by purchasing one of the LEE FILTER Swatch books first (Google it). This way you can play with the different colors to find the one you like best, then if you feel like purchasing a 12"x12" sheet you'll have a better idea of which one you want.
> 
> I found the Lee Filter Designer Swatch books for as little as $2.50 each (always get two swatch books). The nice bonus with these swatch books is that you also get a nice variety of diffusion material.
> 
> By the way, I cut the filter for my SC700d directly from one of the filters included in the swatch book. Put a little piece of double sided tape in the center and put it on the front glass and bam, no more green. Have fun!



So, I'm new to ZL and am considering a SC700Fd as a light to use while I'm walking to the chicken yards on the back of our property (75 feet from the house or so) to close them up every night. Do you think that this mod would be necessary for the more diffused version of the light, or only for the standard SC700d since the greenish transitions in the beam are more noticeable on that model?

Thanks in advance.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

It's been 2 years since Zebralight last updated their line of SC600's and H600's. I thought they would be coming out with Mark V models around now. I haven't heard any news of this, and their spreadsheet doesn't indicate any plans. Has anyone heard anything about updated versions?

I'm about to buy another Zebra, and don't know if I should just get another MkIV, or wait a few weeks for a V.


----------



## SSANDERS

I gotta say, I was turned on to ordering a SC64w Hi, thinking it might be THE EDC light that finally pulls me off my SL Protac 2L. 

But the last 2 pages or so of this thread have me a little leery. Tint issues, anodizing inconsistencies, needing a filter to clean up the beam? 
Am I reading too much into some of the nuances?


----------



## Derek Dean

brachypelma44 said:


> So, I'm new to ZL and am considering a SC700Fd as a light to use while I'm walking to the chicken yards on the back of our property (75 feet from the house or so) to close them up every night. Do you think that this mod would be necessary for the more diffused version of the light, or only for the standard SC700d since the greenish transitions in the beam are more noticeable on that model?
> 
> Thanks in advance.


First of all, welcome to CPF!!! I hope you enjoy your time here. Second, I've never bought one of the ZL frosted lens versions, so I couldn't honestly answer you on that question. I will say, however, that the SC700d is already reasonably floody, so I'm not sure you'd really need to get the F version, and, more importantly, the filter swatch books that you can purchase for less than $10 (specifically the Lee Filters Designer Pack),contain not only a large variety of colored filters, but also contain a large variety of diffusion filters as well. 

This has the added bonus of first, letting you purchase the regular unfrosted version of the light to see if you like that, and then if you feel you need more diffusion, it's a simple matter to go through the filter pack and pick exactly the level of diffusion you prefer. 

The only downside to this, as far as I'm concerned, is that with the ZL current lineup, the filters must be attached to the front of the lens, usually with a small square of double sided tape, and although I've never had a problem with this method, it's something to consider.


----------



## Mr. LED

SSANDERS said:


> I gotta say, I was turned on to ordering a SC64w Hi, thinking it might be THE EDC light that finally pulls me off my SL Protac 2L.
> 
> But the last 2 pages or so of this thread have me a little leery. Tint issues, anodizing inconsistencies, needing a filter to clean up the beam?
> Am I reading too much into some of the nuances?



The SC64w HI has the most amazing tint among all Zebralights. And also the darkest anodizing, which people tend to like a lot. There’s no way to go wrong.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Mr. LED said:


> The SC64w HI has the most amazing tint among all Zebralights. And also the darkest anodizing, which people tend to like a lot. There’s no way to go wrong.



Yes, +1 for the SC64w HI. Probably my most-used Zebra. It's a good all-purpose light that you can use indoors and out. The only downside is that it heats up quickly on max, and then throttles down when the temperature controls kick in. This is to be expected on such a small light, though.


----------



## SSANDERS

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Yes, +1 for the SC64w HI. Probably my most-used Zebra. It's a good all-purpose light that you can use indoors and out. The only downside is that it heats up quickly on max, and then throttles down when the temperature controls kick in. This is to be expected on such a small light, though.



I think I read a few pages back that the outputs for the SC64w HI on the ZL site are overstated. Is this still true? 
My ideal UI would be easy access to the 21.3, 245, 467, & 814 lumen settings, in that order. Those outputs would be right on the money for my uses, so I'm hoping they are accurate.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> It's been 2 years since Zebralight last updated their line of SC600's and H600's. I thought they would be coming out with Mark V models around now. I haven't heard any news of this, and their spreadsheet doesn't indicate any plans. Has anyone heard anything about updated versions?
> 
> I'm about to buy another Zebra, and don't know if I should just get another MkIV, or wait a few weeks for a V.



Oh, well. I went ahead and ordered the MkIV H600fc that I've been eyeing for awhile. Zebralight's brand-new models usually require a bit of time for them to get the quirks out anyway, so maybe best not to order a MkV when it first comes out. The exception was the pre-order for the SC64w HI, which has been flawless.

I still think updated models must be coming soon.


----------



## brachypelma44

Derek Dean said:


> First of all, welcome to CPF!!! I hope you enjoy your time here. Second, I've never bought one of the ZL frosted lens versions, so I couldn't honestly answer you on that question. I will say, however, that the SC700d is already reasonably floody, so I'm not sure you'd really need to get the F version, and, more importantly, the filter swatch books that you can purchase for less than $10 (specifically the Lee Filters Designer Pack),contain not only a large variety of colored filters, but also contain a large variety of diffusion filters as well.
> 
> This has the added bonus of first, letting you purchase the regular unfrosted version of the light to see if you like that, and then if you feel you need more diffusion, it's a simple matter to go through the filter pack and pick exactly the level of diffusion you prefer.
> 
> The only downside to this, as far as I'm concerned, is that with the ZL current lineup, the filters must be attached to the front of the lens, usually with a small square of double sided tape, and although I've never had a problem with this method, it's something to consider.




Yeah, I wasn't crazy about the idea of attaching a filter with tape, but if the color was really bad, I would have considered doing it. Fortunately, I got my F version yesterday, and it seems perfectly uniform to me with no noticeable green tint. I've always enjoyed floody flashlights, so I went ahead and ordered it, and tbh, this is kind of like a dream light for me. A total pleasure to use. It lights up the woods around the chicken yards pretty well on the highest setting, too.

Thank you for taking the time to respond.


----------



## Keitho

Dear Zebra-claus,

I have been a very good boy this year. I bought a Zebralight, and only five non-ZL lights. I promise, when I use those other lights, I wish that they had the efficiency and UI of yours. I've been such a good boy that I've hardly complained that there hasn't been a new major release for 13 months. But, I know your elves down in the south pole (that's in TX, right?) have had a busy year.

I can be an even better boy in 2020 and buy many more Zebralights if you check your list twice and find that I deserve one or more presents from my list:
- an SC65 with a high-CRI warm LED and great output (an SC6x body with the performance of something like the HC600c/d: close to 3 hrs at close to 1000 lumens of high CRI)
- an SC70c, small-as-you-can-make it 21700
- a G8 "lending mode" with 3 modes, no double- or triple- or quad-clicks and no strobes

I'll be sure to leave out milk and cookies! If I don't get anything on my list, I'll be forced to spend my flashlight money to buy this stock photo and make a killing selling T-shirts next year on candlepowerforums.com: https://www.canstockphoto.com/santa-with-a-flashlight-3959803.html


----------



## SKV89

Are there any Zebralights that are actually rosy tint?


----------



## Tachead

SKV89 said:


> Are there any Zebralights that are actually rosy tint?


All of the ones I have owned that used the XHP35 HI & HD in 4500K have been(4 lights) as well as the ones I have owned using the Luxeon T in 4000K(H502c L2)and XM-L2 Easywhite in 4000K(H600Fc MKIII)but, remember the tint lottery is real. I will say that I have had 3 different Zebralights with the XHP35 HI and all of them were rosy to different degrees. 

Sent from my SM-N975W using Tapatalk


----------



## ven

:wave: Tachead, hope your well.

SKV89, how true it is, i dont know. But there was a rumour mr zebra does not like rosy tints(hence why no nichia from them amongst other reasons). Apparently mr zebra prefers yellow to rosy. Again how true it is, dont know. As Tac says, the tint loto is defo real!!!. You are safer with xhp 35 HI/ HD . Bob on here mods them to nichia 219b's, i have one and its fantastic.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

SKV89 said:


> Are there any Zebralights that are actually rosy tint?



I have two that are on the rosy-side, or at least not on the green/yellow side.

The SC64w HI. Great tint! Uses a Cree XHP35 HI emitter.

The H600Fc. I just got this one, and again love the tint! Uses a high CRI Cree XHP50.2 emitter. Surprisingly good for a domed Cree, but perhaps the frosted lens smooths things out. My SC600w Plus uses the 50.2, but it's nowhere near as good. (Still decent, but it shows tint shifts, and it's on the green side of BBL.)

Other zebras tend to be on the green or yellow side of the BBL, especially domed emitters. I also like the SC600w HI tint. It's as pure as the SC64w HI, but it's slightly on the yellow side of BBL, when compared side-by-side.

One other Zebra I have it pretty-much dead-center BBL. The SC5w. Nice pure tint, but a little cooler than I like. I like things closer to 4000K than 5000K.




Keitho said:


> - an SC65 with a high-CRI warm LED and great output (an SC6x body with the performance of something like the HC600c/d: close to 3 hrs at close to 1000 lumens of high CRI)



Yeah, I don't think you'll be seeing that in a SC64 sized body anytime soon.



> - an SC70c, small-as-you-can-make it 21700



I'm not a fan of the 21700 sized cells, but I could see that being popular with some.



> - a G8 "lending mode" with 3 modes, no double- or triple- or quad-clicks and no strobes



Oh, I like that one! Good suggestion. IMO, I'd just go with two modes, to make it even more simple, but I suppose I could just program 2 of the 3 modes to be the same.


----------



## Tachead

ven said:


> :wave: Tachead, hope your well.
> 
> SKV89, how true it is, i dont know. But there was a rumour mr zebra does not like rosy tints(hence why no nichia from them amongst other reasons). Apparently mr zebra prefers yellow to rosy. Again how true it is, dont know. As Tac says, the tint loto is defo real!!!. You are safer with xhp 35 HI/ HD . Bob on here mods them to nichia 219b's, i have one and its fantastic.


Hey Ven, Merry Christmas sir, hope you and yours are as well[emoji106]. Long time no speak, how have ya been? I have been focusing on other hobbies but, as usual, I'm back for the winter to see what's new in the lighting world. 

Sent from my SM-N975W using Tapatalk


----------



## Netter1283

Hi all. First time posting, as I've mostly just enjoyed reading all your posts and didn't think I had much else to offer. Until now?

I have a handful of 18650 lights but my ZL SC64w takes the cake for almost everything - _except_ the lack of electronic lockout mode.

I recently picked up a Lumintop EDC18 (XPL 5k) because I do like the Anduril UI and magnet options. But I don't love the beam (not enough spill), extra weight, or the button - a little hard to find in the dark, and a little too firm, enough that my double clicks often end up being single clicks.

I always go back to favoring the ZL for the small size/weight, build quality, perfect tint and beam, battery life, and I just love the button. But I always wish it had a lockout mode. So here's what I came up with...

In one of the fully programmable slots (G6 or G7), set every mode to the lowest output - .07Lm for the SC64w. When you want to lock it out - if you prefer not using the manual lockout tail twist - just put it in G6/7 mode, and if it happens to turn on, no big deal at .07Lm. It will last for months at that level.

FWIW, I have my G6 programmed as follows: 1 click to Moon/Low (.26 / 2.9), click and hold to Medium (22.9 / 127), and double click to High (502 / 1400). Works perfectly for me.

The only thing that I don't like is when I'm in Medium (L1/L2), to get to High (M1/M2) you have to hold down the button way too long. It's like it doesn't realize it's already in L1/L2 and "changes" to that mode first before moving on. Any insight on this??

Bennett


----------



## archimedes

Netter1283 said:


> Hi all. First time posting ....



Hello and welcome to CPF 

Your post above has been approved, but please do not change titles on established threads.

This causes the threads to display improperly with some settings and browsers. Thanks.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Netter1283 said:


> In one of the fully programmable slots (G6 or G7), set every mode to the lowest output - .07Lm for the SC64w. When you want to lock it out - if you prefer not using the manual lockout tail twist - just put it in G6/7 mode, and if it happens to turn on, no big deal at .07Lm. It will last for months at that level.
> 
> FWIW, I have my G6 programmed as follows: 1 click to Moon/Low (.26 / 2.9), click and hold to Medium (22.9 / 127), and double click to High (502 / 1400). Works perfectly for me.
> 
> The only thing that I don't like is when I'm in Medium (L1/L2), to get to High (M1/M2) you have to hold down the button way too long. It's like it doesn't realize it's already in L1/L2 and "changes" to that mode first before moving on. Any insight on this??



I've never had an accidental pocket-activation with any of my zebras. I don't like to lockout, since I want to turn on the light as quickly and easily as possible.

I really like the G6 and G7 programmable groups. But, I made sure to always use the short-click for high and long press for low. I have a few older zebralights with the old interface, and don't want to get confused if I start remapping the new ones so they work differently. Otherwise, I might pick up an old light, and short-click expecting moonlight.

So, for my indoor "middle of the night" group, I set H2/M2/L2 to be the three lowest moonlight levels, with H2 being the brightest moonlight and L2 being the dimmest. It's still the same order of brightness, but they're all dim. If I accidentally short-click instead of doing a long press, I just get "blasted" with a slightly higher moonlight, not full output.


----------



## SKV89

Pretty much sounds like only the XHP35 HI version has a chance for rosy tint. I was hoping for a XHP50.2 version with rosy tint.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

SKV89 said:


> Pretty much sounds like only the XHP35 HI version has a chance for rosy tint. I was hoping for a XHP50.2 version with rosy tint.



I think with the XHP 50.2, you have to go with the high CRI version, such as the H600Fc. Unfortunately, they don't use that 50.2 in the SC600w Plus.

While the H600Fc is really nice, the SC600w Plus isn't bad. It is slightly on the green side, especially the corona. Here is a white-wall beam shot of the SC600w MkIV Plus.








The picture uses auto white-balance and auto exposure. You can see it's not perfect, but it's not that bad. Unless you're white-wall hunting, you can't tell there's any imperfections in the beam tint. But, definitely not rosy like a Nichia 219B emitter.


----------



## MX421

Netter1283 said:


> Hi all. First time postingt



Welcome to CPF!




Netter1283 said:


> I always go back to favoring the ZL for the small size/weight, build quality, perfect tint and beam, battery life, and I just love the button. But I always wish it had a lockout mode. So here's what I came up with...


Why can't you just twist the tailcap to lockout it? I think it only needs a quarter turn.


----------



## ven

Tachead said:


> Hey Ven, Merry Christmas sir, hope you and yours are as well[emoji106]. Long time no speak, how have ya been? I have been focusing on other hobbies but, as usual, I'm back for the winter to see what's new in the lighting world.
> 
> Sent from my SM-N975W using Tapatalk




Merry xmas to you and family(and all at CPF), I am good here thanks, lot better now i have finished for xmas after 2 lots of 12hr's overtime. Yes i get it, watchaholic issues are biting me pretty hard, 3 in a month........ . My last light was an M6 i think, lumens factory 319a as a general use(saving the 250 and 500lm bulbs for special dark occasions lol). But on the zebra, i have a 219b 4000k bob flavour
2nd from right














So thats the last zebra, took the film off for a traditional hot spot/spill beam which i do prefer in this application.


----------



## NPL

I would love to see Zebralight launch a mini thrower. The sc700 series is begging for an xhp35 hi. Or maybe even a little wider head and a touch shallower for wider spill and compactness. 

Sent from my Pixel using Candlepowerforums mobile app


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

NPL said:


> I would love to see Zebralight launch a mini thrower. The sc700 series is begging for an xhp35 hi. Or maybe even a little wider head and a touch shallower for wider spill and compactness.



Yeah, that would be good. I like the SC600w HI, it has some decent throw for such a small light. But, they could probably double that with a bigger reflector and maybe driving it a little harder. Though, over-driving isn't really Zebralight's thing. I'm not sure what the max rated current is for the XHP35 HI, but I thought it would have a little more room than Zebralight is doing in the SC600w HI. A SC700 body would give more ability to cool it.

I wouldn't buy it, because I haven't bought into the 21700 craze yet, but I could see that it might be popular with some.


----------



## Keitho

I bet we'll eventually see a thrower in that SC700 body. They're already doing the hard part, machining a new body with a relatively large head (for ZL)--they just need a smooth reflector and small LED, I guessing it will throw really well for a just-about-pocketable light.


----------



## Mr. LED

I have a direct contact at Zebralight, that I have suggested many times about a SC700 with HI emitter and they don’t seem interested. As well as other suggestions...


----------



## Tachead

Mr. LED said:


> I have a direct contact at Zebralight, that I have suggested many times about a SC700 with HI emitter and they don’t seem interested. As well as other suggestions...


Tell them to fix the huge problem with their lights shutting off on H1 first. It's widespread and myself and several others(im sure)won't be buying anymore of their lights until they fix it. 

Sent from my SM-N975W using Tapatalk


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Tachead said:


> Tell them to fix the huge problem with their lights shutting off on H1 first.



In the cold. They need to test them in a cold-climate winter, not Texas.


----------



## Tachead

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> In the cold. They need to test them in a cold-climate winter, not Texas.


They don't have to be cold, they seem to do it in all temps(albeit maybe not as often). Everyone should be boycotting them until they fix it. It has been going on for years now and they aren't doing anything about it. It's greatly lowered my opinion of ZL. I no longer recommend them and will not buy another(at least won't consider it until they acknowledge the problem and fix it). 

Sent from my SM-N975W using Tapatalk


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Tachead said:


> They don't have to be cold, they seem to do it in all temps(albeit maybe not as often). Everyone should be boycotting them until they fix it. It has been going on for years now and they aren't doing anything about it. It's greatly lowered my opinion of ZL. I no longer recommend them and will not buy another(at least won't consider it until they acknowledge the problem and fix it).



On mine, I've only ever seen it in the cold. -15C and a bit windy seems to be the ideal conditions for it to happen.

Someone suggested it might be related to messing with the PID settings. Perhaps, but I'm not entirely convinced.


----------



## brightasday

Mr. LED said:


> I have a direct contact at Zebralight, that I have suggested many times about a SC700 with HI emitter and they don’t seem interested. As well as other suggestions...



Darn! I was hoping for a Zebralight HI flashlight based on the 21700. I hope they reconsider.


----------



## JimIslander

Tachead said:


> They don't have to be cold, they seem to do it in all temps(albeit maybe not as often). Everyone should be boycotting them until they fix it. It has been going on for years now and they aren't doing anything about it. It's greatly lowered my opinion of ZL. I no longer recommend them and will not buy another(at least won't consider it until they acknowledge the problem and fix it).
> 
> Sent from my SM-N975W using Tapatalk



None of the 11 Zebralights I have do it. I've been running their lights for about 5 years. That's a decent sample. So I buy more, and I don't boycott. Maybe it's a battery thing? Contacts? Has anyone done an analysis of which models do this, when, and on which batteries and temperatures?


----------



## Tachead

JimIslander said:


> None of the 11 Zebralights I have do it. I've been running their lights for about 5 years. That's a decent sample. So I buy more, and I don't boycott. Maybe it's a battery thing? Contacts? Has anyone done an analysis of which models do this, when, and on which batteries and temperatures?



They only do it if started on H1(highest turbo) and often only when cold. It also appears to only be their new models(none of my older models do it). No, not the contacts or the battery as it has been tested by multiple users(I run deoxit gold on all my contacts, Nyogel 760G on all threads, and brand new VTC6 that easily pass load testing). There are reports all over the internet about it(a whole thread dedicated to it here). It is a design flaw and ZL is aware of it(several on here alone have sent lights in for warranty for it). It appears they are continuing to sell lights anyway and not fixing it. There should be a recall but, they appear to care more about profits. They used to be my favourite flashlight company but, not anymore. I have moved on to companies that actually care about their customers and will not buy anymore from them due to this issue and others(I have received a few other lights with cosmetic or other issues). They have some good ideas and nice features(along with one of the most advanced driver designs in the industry)but, it all means nothing if they don't have quantity control and aren't reliable. 



Sent from my SM-N975W using Tapatalk


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

JimIslander said:


> None of the 11 Zebralights I have do it. I've been running their lights for about 5 years. That's a decent sample. So I buy more, and I don't boycott. Maybe it's a battery thing? Contacts? Has anyone done an analysis of which models do this, when, and on which batteries and temperatures?



It's not a battery thing. I've tested that thoroughly, and the behavior is not the same as with a weak or dying battery.

Anyway, I've only seen it on my MkIV lights. Specifically, two that use the XHP35 HI emitter. I have another two MkIV models, but they use the XHP 50.2, and I haven't used them much outside in the cold, so I can't say whether or not they have the same issue. My older Zebras are fine in the cold.

It's not a huge issue, IMO. Once the light warms up just for a second or two, the problem goes away. And it doesn't occur in any other mode than H1 (from off, or a very low mode). But, I do wish they'd acknowledge the problem and fix it. I just don't think they have the conditions in Texas to reproduce it, so it's a waste of time sending back my lights for warranty service. I'd just get them back with "no problem found", after several weeks and wasting money on shipping.


----------



## NPL

I have been using my Mk 3 sc600w hi in freezing conditions lately and have had no issues.the problem seems to be present on mk4 lights with new programmable UI. I will play around with sc64c LE in the cold and see if I come across any issues on my end. 

Sent from my Pixel using Candlepowerforums mobile app


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

NPL said:


> I have been using my Mk 3 sc600w hi in freezing conditions lately and have had no issues.the problem seems to be present on mk4 lights with new programmable UI. I will play around with sc64c LE in the cold and see if I come across any issues on my end.



Does the Mk3 have programmable PID, like the Mk4 does? One theory I heard was that it might be related to changing the default PID settings. I do that on all my lights. I haven't had the issue occur yet this winter, to try that theory.


----------



## Robot Mania FU

I've yet to have an H1 failure in a sense of the light shutting off on my H600fc using sanyo cells. I've been waiting for some colder nights to test it out some more, but the coldest I've gotten was about 19F and windy on the middle of a frozen lake. It performed flawlessly. However, on all my lights I immediately switch to g6 or g7 and swap my highest output and medium outputs (single click for medium, double click for "H1") and never touch the PID settings. The only reason I suggested that moving H1 might have an affect, was that it cleared up the intense heating of the light that some of us were experiencing. When left to default, H1 would get unbelievably hot and immediately start to step down. However, this does not occur when I moved my H1 output level to anything other than a single click. This leads me to believe that the issue is the thermal regulating on the initial single click setting (also remedied by swapping H1 and H2 in my experiences).


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Robot Mania FU said:


> The only reason I suggested that moving H1 might have an affect, was that it cleared up the intense heating of the light that some of us were experiencing. When left to default, H1 would get unbelievably hot and immediately start to step down. However, this does not occur when I moved my H1 output level to anything other than a single click. This leads me to believe that the issue is the thermal regulating on the initial single click setting (also remedied by swapping H1 and H2 in my experiences).



That's the first time I've heard about that. H1 PID works fine on all my lights. Depending on the light (mass, output) I get 1-3 minutes at full power, before the light starts getting hot and it slowly ramps down to about the default H2 level.

Was that issue on an earlier version of a model? Sometimes, it's best not to order from the first batch of new lights, though I've done that myself a couple of times without problems.


----------



## Robot Mania FU

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Was that issue on an earlier version of a model? Sometimes, it's best not to order from the first batch of new lights, though I've done that myself a couple of times without problems.




I wish I could remember what thread it was in. I searched, but can't seem to find the posts. People were just running them on the secondary 980 lumen mode without any issues, however, on the 1500 lumen setting they were heating up very quickly (mind you, this was in the summer which is what I attributed it to)......but being that I spend a lot of time on a boat in open water, I have a lot of fluctuation between temperatures/wind so I decided to test a few things. I found that even though I deemed my h600fc acceptable, there was a significant difference in heat when I ran it on 1500 lumens in the default g5 H1 setting vs when I switched to g6/g7 and put the 1500 lumen setting where the medium setting would normally be (this is how I run all my headlamps anyway. I prefer single click to turn on in medium and double click for the highest setting). I too, thought the H1 PID was working fine, but did notice a difference once I swapped the modes. It is most likely an isolated incident, but since my light runs flawlessly with what I consider a perfect tint, I never addressed it. I only ended up bringing it up when I started noticing people having issues as a suggestion to try and see if it would change anything.


----------



## Duster1671

I also program my G6 slot for single click to medium, double click to high. I haven't noticed any difference in thermal regulation if I have the highest output in the single click or double click spot. I've also never had the H1 shutoff happen with my H600Fc MkIV (or SC64c LE).

My SC600w HI MkIV does have the H1 shutoff issue, and it happens regardless of whether I'm in G5 or reprogrammed G6. I also had it happen last night where I turned the light on to H2, let it run for a few seconds, and then switched to H1. I had thought that would prevent the shutoff by letting the driver heat up a little bit, but no. As soon as I bumped it up to H1 it shut off. This was at about 35°F ambient, no wind to speak of, and default PID settings. At least for my light, the H1 shutoff issue doesn't require very extreme conditions at all.


----------



## CelticCross74

This is an interesting thread. I have 4 ZL's all SC600 lights of their varying LED's in them. All 4 function flawless and see lots of use. I do admit that my SC600 Mk 4 on highest output has indeed just shut off after being on less than a minute. Being a ZL I was not exactly sure what could be wrong. I then noticed I had been recycling the GA cell ZL sells on their site quite a bit. Ordered another fresh GA and some De Oxit red for the contact points and voila! Not a hiccup since.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

I always put some deoxit gold on the contact points when I get a new Zebralight. It hasn't helped with the H1 shutoff. I use good cells, so I'm sure it isn't the battery either. Looks like from your comment that it isn't PID related, so I'll probably give up on testing that. I have seen it at temperatures above freezing, though not very often. It occurs much more frequently (almost reliably) at around -15C. I think it's a combination of the MkIV driver and the XHP35 HI emitter, since that's all I've seen it on (2 different lights). My other Zebras don't seem to have the issue, but they use different emitters. I don't have any that use the regular domed XHP35 emitter, so perhaps that's a problem too, since the driver is likely identical to the HI version.


----------



## CelticCross74

Contact ZL. They have done very well and fast for me in the past. Your case is quite interesting. Let us know what happens.


----------



## Romanko

Did anyone try to use SC64 with one CR123a battery?


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Romanko said:


> Did anyone try to use SC64 with one CR123a battery?



With two of them, I presume. Should work. Operating voltage is 2.7v - 6.0v. No, I've never tried it, because.... why? Well, I suppose if you needed extreme cold-weather performance, it might be useful. Though, I've had no problems using 18650's in -30C weather. (I give out before the battery.)


----------



## Mr. LED

I think he means using only one CR123, with a spacer. It could work, although for around 500 lumens and above the current is too much. But doable in an emergency.

2 CR123 is too long for the body tube. The older SC62 has enough length, but voltage limit is 4.7 volts. I can only wish for a Zebralight that can run on 2 CR123 for emergencies.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Oh, okay. 1 CR123 might not have a high enough voltage, especially under load. But if it can maintain at least 2.9v under load, it should work.


----------



## EBruder

*Any reason to change SC53w from factory default?*

I unfortunately lost (hopefully only misplaced) my 4-5 year old Zebralight in the SC52 size. As the light performed so well while I had it, I decide to pay the premium price Zebralight commands, and I received a new SC53w yesterday. I popped in an Eneloop Pro, and all works well.


I use the light as an EDC for finding things I might have dropped/lost, casual light needs, and a rare night time sidewalk walk. Most use is indoors.

Is there any benefit from changing the factory default setting to any of the myriad of other options?

Many thanks,

EB


----------



## Keitho

*Re: Any reason to change SC53w from factory default?*

I've changed around the modes for a few reasons, but I usually end up back in the default mode, which I got used to and I like. I changed one or 2 lights to be a "1 mode" light for when I hand it to my wife; but, she still ends up triple-clicking, or doing something else, and using it as an excuse to be confused with my "complicated lights." I've changed around the mode order to eliminate the "pre flash" on high when double-clicking from off, but then decided that the pre-flash doesn't actually bother me at all. I have one light as an "indoor only" light with no high modes, but rarely remember to set it to that mode; I've got another with high modes only, but also usually forget to set it to that mode as well.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

*Re: Any reason to change SC53w from factory default?*

I eventually settled on programming most of my Zebras in the following way:

G6 is set up for outdoor use. I set
L2 to ~8 lumens
M2 to ~50 lumens
H2 to ~240 lumens
L1 to max
M1 to max
H1 to max
Then I leave the light set up to use L2/M2/H2 by default.
This allows me 3 very useful modes for outdoor use, from dim to fairly bright. I end up using M2 most of the time. It also gives me instant access to max, with a double-click from any of my modes. Then a double-click back to default. That's great for wanting to check out something in the distance.

G7 is set up for indoor use. I set
L2/M2/H2 to be the 3 moonlight modes
L1/M1/H1 to be 8/50/240 lumens.
Then I leave the light set up to use L2/M2/H2 by default, for nighttime use.
This allows me to access moonlight with any kind of button press. I'll never accidentally blind myself in the middle of the night if I click the wrong way. But if I want brighter light for something else, I can double-click for it when the light is on.


----------



## Duster1671

*Re: Any reason to change SC53w from factory default?*



Keitho said:


> I have one light as an "indoor only" light with no high modes, but rarely remember to set it to that mode; I've got another with high modes only, but also usually forget to set it to that mode as well.


I don't see a lot of utility in the G5/G6/G7 groups for this reason. Sure, the full programmability of G6/G7 is nice, but in normal use I'm not going to be switching between the G groups. Keeping track of which mode group I'm in (L, M, H) is enough of a hassle without adding another layer of complexity.

The more I use my Zebralights, the more I feel the UI essentially lacks elegance. It's easy to shortcut from off to any of the mode groups, but once I'm in a mode group, I feel "stuck" with no easy shortcut to another mode group. For example, I'll switch my light on to High to walk out to my mailbox, but then when I get there I want to drop down to Medium to look in the box. The only options I have are to turn the light off, wait a second, and then shortcut to Medium or hold the button down and wait until it cycles through to the Medium group. Neither one is a great option. 

And further, managing the sub-level within each group is a chore. Say I want my light to come on to H2, but occasionally I'll switch to H1. Well, I need to remember to switch back to H2 before shutting it off otherwise it won't behave the way I want the next time I use it. For this reason, I'm constantly shortcutting to the mode group I want and then double clicking and sometimes double clicking again to get the sub-level I want. The whole experience is cumbersome and has me wondering why the ZL UI gets such high praise.

By contrast, my Anduril lights will easily and intuitively ramp to any brightness I want, or my HDS Rotary will do the same with a simple twist of the tailcap. The Zebralights require too much thought, especially when they're not the only lights I use. And forget about trying to explain the interface to the layman...


----------



## Robot Mania FU

*Re: Any reason to change SC53w from factory default?*



Duster1671 said:


> It's easy to shortcut from off to any of the mode groups, but once I'm in a mode group, I feel "stuck" with no easy shortcut to another mode group. For example, I'll switch my light on to High to walk out to my mailbox, but then when I get there I want to drop down to Medium to look in the box. The only options I have are to turn the light off, wait a second, and then shortcut to Medium or hold the button down and wait until it cycles through to the Medium group. Neither one is a great option.



Have you experimented with swapping your secondary modes to a lower level? For example, why not try leaving H1 at default and then changing "H2" to one of the medium modes. That way you can turn the light on in high, and then just double click to drop it to medium? If you accidentally turn the light back on in medium, then all it would take is a double click to switch back to high. While that still might be more frustrating than your rotary or anduril lights, it might make it a little more bearable? Admittedly, if those types of operations are your preference, ZL's UI will always come up short no matter what you do.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

*Re: Any reason to change SC53w from factory default?*

It sounds like he wants a Zebralight without mode memory, so he always knows how it's going to come on. Interesting idea, which might make a useful feature when Zebralight updates their UI.

In the meantime, he could simply program each H1/H2, M1/M2, and L1/L2 to be the same output level. Essentially turning it into a 3-mode light instead of 6 modes. That way, he always knows what mode he's in (because he programmed it to get rid of the sub-modes). That would essentially get rid of mode memory (and also half the modes).

As for not wanting to ramp though low, in order to go from high to medium. Yeah, just reprogram it so the medium mode is your long-press setting. Or set the low mode and medium mode to the same level, if you don't want a low mode at all.

I find the Zebralight UI to be quite flexible, if you put some thought into how you program the light. But, if you want a ramping UI, then don't get a Zebralight.


----------



## archimedes

Yeah, the ZL UI is flexible but not intuitive ... while the TK UI is intuitive but not flexible.

Oversimplification, I know, but gets to the essence of the difference I'd say.


----------



## skid00skid00

*Re: Any reason to change SC53w from factory default?*

Duster1671,

"but once I'm in a mode group, I feel "stuck" with no easy shortcut to another mode group. For example, I'll switch my light on to High to walk out to my mailbox, but then when I get there I want to drop down to Medium to look in the box. The only options I have are to turn the light off, wait a second, and then shortcut to Medium or hold the button down and wait until it cycles through to the Medium group. Neither one is a great option."

Why haven't you set H2 to a dim setting? Then all you have to do is double-click to get your medium brightness. Double-click to get back to high for the walk back.


----------



## Tuiflies

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Anyway, I've only seen it on my MkIV lights. Specifically, two that use the XHP35 HI emitter. I have another two MkIV models, but they use the XHP 50.2, and I haven't used them much outside in the cold, so I can't say whether or not they have the same issue. My older Zebras are fine in the cold.



My new SC700d does it intermittently but not enough to be an issue. Purchased Oct ‘19. It is not cold related in my case though. I use a Samsung 50E battery.


----------



## Duster1671

I've thought of various ways to mitigate the annoyances with the interface but they all have drawbacks. For example, the walk out to the mailbox is only one of many use-cases for my flashlights, so I wouldn't want to give up a true H2 for easier access to a medium. 

Overall, I enjoy the flexibility of the interface and I like my Zebralights in general (especially the H600Fc and SC64c LE). I just find them a bit fiddly and not at all something you can pick up and start using efficiently without some practice.

Anyway, I have my SC600w Mk IV HI on the way back to Zebralight so they can look at the H1 shutoff issue. I'll report back with their findings (if any).


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Duster1671 said:


> I've thought of various ways to mitigate the annoyances with the interface but they all have drawbacks. For example, the walk out to the mailbox is only one of many use-cases for my flashlights, so I wouldn't want to give up a true H2 for easier access to a medium.



You could always switch between G5/G6/G7, depending where you are. Or, have multiple lights, for specific uses. For example, I use my 600w HI strictly outdoors, so it's always in the same program group. My 600w Plus I use as a bike light, so again, I only use one program group set up for cycling. My SC64w HI is an EDC, so I mostly use it in a single group. My AA Zebras are stricly indoors or night light, so they're set up that way. Etc.

But, yeah, that gets expensive if you don't want that many lights. I don't find a 5-click, 6-click, or 7-click to be that much of a issue, so I'd be content using one light for multiple purposes. Make your G6 your mailbox setting, and set its H2 to 25 or 50 lumens. Use it on G5 the rest of the time.


----------



## Netter1283

I've noticed a weird (what I think is a bug) in all of my Zebralights. I'm curious if anyone has any insight into why this is the case, or if there's a way to fix it (doubtful).


When in M group (M1 or M2) and you hold down, it switches quickly to H group. And when in H group and you hold down, it switches quickly to L group. Great. But when you're in L group and you hold down, there's an extra long pause before switching to M. It seems like it doesn't realize it's the L group, so it tries switching to L, because that's what 'hold' action does. So it takes twice as long when holding from L to M.


This is frustrating because I have G6/G7 set up as H group for low light (single click), L group for medium (hold) and M for high (double click). It's the perfect setup for me. Except when the light is on in L, and I want to get to turbo (M) quickly, it takes way too long.


----------



## Duster1671

That's not a bug, per se. Holding the button always switches the light to Low, then Medium, then High, regardless of the mode you're in. So if you're in Low, yes, there's a longer pause while it switches from Low to Low.

It's more of a quirk of the simple way that function was written, I suppose, than an actual bug. Or maybe that does count as a bug. Idk, I'm not a software engineer


----------



## Keitho

Duster1671 said:


> Idk, I'm not a software engineer



If you _were_ a software engineer, no matter the user report said, you would confidently and loudly say, "that is a feature, not a bug!"

My ZL behave the same way, FWIW. It is a characteristic of the UI: very quick to any desired setting from off, but more difficult once it is on, unless it is in the same mode group (double-click). Sometimes (rarely) I want to go from "on" to "strobe": you can't get there from here (must turn it off, pause, triple-click).


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Yes, all mine do the same. I've never really thought of it as a bug. But now that you mention it, perhaps it would be better to quickly move up to medium if you're already in low.


----------



## SKV89

I took readings to compare the AT Wizards with ZL H600fc MKIV in this thread


----------



## Mr. LED

Keitho said:


> If you _were_ a software engineer, no matter the user report said, you would confidently and loudly say, "that is a feature, not a bug!"
> 
> My ZL behave the same way, FWIW. It is a characteristic of the UI: very quick to any desired setting from off, but more difficult once it is on, unless it is in the same mode group (double-click). Sometimes (rarely) I want to go from "on" to "strobe": you can't get there from here (must turn it off, pause, triple-click).



I see it as a feature, if I press unintentionally to cycle when I’m in moonlight, I have time to think and release the button, not destroying my night vision. Especially groggy in the middle of the night


----------



## Bob_McBob

A couple things you don't see every day. On the left is an SC64w HI with a high CRI XHP35 HI. On the right is an SC64c with a dedomed LH351D.


----------



## Tachead

Nice work Bob, I really should try one of your mods[emoji106]. 

Sent from my SM-N975W using Tapatalk


----------



## AstroTurf

How do the beam shots compare?


----------



## Bob_McBob

AstroTurf said:


> How do the beam shots compare?



I'll see if I can toss something together when I have a 219B light to compare it with tonight. The dedomed LH351D has a noticeably tighter beam than the SC64w HI.


----------



## AstroTurf

Thanks Bob


----------



## Robot Mania FU

Bob_McBob said:


> A couple things you don't see every day. On the left is an SC64w HI with a high CRI XHP35 HI. On the right is an SC64c with a dedomed LH351D.




I've been waiting to see if someone would eventually dedome an sc64c. How are you liking it so far?


----------



## marinemaster

Is ZL going to bring a new 1xAA model successor to SC 53 ?


----------



## neutralwhite

thank you Sir Bob. 



Bob_McBob said:


> I'll see if I can toss something together when I have a 219B light to compare it with tonight. The dedomed LH351D has a noticeably tighter beam than the SC64w HI.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

marinemaster said:


> Is ZL going to bring a new 1xAA model successor to SC 53 ?



Almost certainly, but they'll need to have a reason to update the SC53. New body design? Sure, but why? New LED? Perhaps, but they can probably just use the same SC53 design and call it "a", "b", whatever.

The thing that might result in a SC54 is a new UI. It's been a couple of years since they last updated their lines with the new UI, so maybe it's soon time for them to do it again.

As for the SC53, I find it a bit of a downgrade from the SC52 (except for the new UI). I like that the SC52 can take both AA and 14500. Can't do that with the SC53. But, for AA only, the SC53 is better.


----------



## marinemaster

I always used Eneloop AA white they work fine. Maybe they will bring a new LED.


----------



## Bob_McBob

IMO Zebralight's AA lights really need 14500 support and higher turbo output to be compelling options nowadays. The 18650 lights are so compact it's hard to justify carrying an SC53 instead of an SC64 when they have the same size head.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Some things I'd like to see in the SC54 (and newer UI in general):

1. Programmable triple-click. Not just setting the kind of strobe, but the ability to set it to any other mode as well (moonlight through turbo). Plus, the ability to turn it off, completely.

2. 14500 support, with output up to 1000 lumens (or whatever is feasible). Include PID to regulate heat, not a timed step-down. Use PID for the highest mode on AA, as well.

3. Bring back the lower moonlight modes, or at least 2x as dim as they are now.

4. More tint options, including high CRI, and a very warm tint around 3000K. (Yeah, probably not likely, as ZL tends to stick with 4000K and higher.)

5. Better remaining battery capacity indication. ZL does this pretty well for lithium-ion, but sucks for NiMH. This is probably tricky to do based on voltage, but they should be able to do better than what they do now.

6. Make the body more grippy to hold. I like the SC600's for that.

7. Smaller, brighter, tougher. All the usual demands.


----------



## neutralwhite

what is the difference with ZL PID vs a timed step-down ?.
is PID good?.
deciding on a ZL 62 LE or Skilhunt H04. 

thanks.


----------



## Random Dan

neutralwhite said:


> what is the difference with ZL PID vs a timed step-down ?.
> is PID good?.
> deciding on a ZL 62 LE or Skilhunt H04.
> 
> thanks.


Zebralight has the best thermal regulation of any light I've owned. I can tailstand my SC64w for a while, wait for theoutput to drop as temperature increases, then when I pick it up it almost instantly starts ramping brightness back up as my hand sinks away heat. Nothing else I've seen is that responsive.


----------



## AstroTurf

Does Zebralight use various filters on their lights?

Reason I ask is, that over the last month or so I have collected 7 zebralights.

Some have a Lee Filter look to them, and some appear clear or unfiltered.

Thanks, Jim


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

AstroTurf said:


> Does Zebralight use various filters on their lights?
> 
> Reason I ask is, that over the last month or so I have collected 7 zebralights.
> 
> Some have a Lee Filter look to them, and some appear clear or unfiltered.
> 
> Thanks, Jim



Most of my Zebras have a AR coating on them. That can appear to reflect colors if you look at it on an angle, and sometimes results in an uneven tint across the beam. I don't find it's too bad on the Zebralights, though. At least one of my Zebras has a clear lens on it, though. No idea why they decide to use different lenses on different lights.

IMO, I prefer to have an AR coating. I get much less indirect scatter off the lens if I'm tail-standing it, and it's not distracting to place the light near where I'm sitting. Without a coating, I find there's too much light refracting through the lens.


----------



## AstroTurf

Thank You!!!


----------



## hatman

I would like to see ZL offer the Nichia 319A emitter at 5000K -- beautiful beam!


----------



## mightysparrow

Bob_McBob said:


> IMO Zebralight's AA lights really need 14500 support and higher turbo output to be compelling options nowadays. The 18650 lights are so compact it's hard to justify carrying an SC53 instead of an SC64 when they have the same size head.



I have a different view, because: 1) I have arthritis issues that make the weight difference between the 18650 and AA lights significant; and 2) I don't really miss the 14500 support in my new SC53w, which replaced a first gen. SC52, because the outputs and runtimes using Eneloops are plenty good enough for me.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

mightysparrow said:


> I have a different view, because: 1) I have arthritis issues that make the weight difference between the 18650 and AA lights significant; and 2) I don't really miss the 14500 support in my new SC53w, which replaced a first gen. SC52, because the outputs and runtimes using Eneloops are plenty good enough for me.



Have you tried the SC64? It's really not that much heavier. With batteries, I get 65g vs 81g. Holding them side-by-side, it's not really a noticeable difference.


----------



## mightysparrow

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Have you tried the SC64? It's really not that much heavier. With batteries, I get 65g vs 81g. Holding them side-by-side, it's not really a noticeable difference.



Yes, I own a SC64w. The weight difference is definitely noticeable to me.


----------



## bonC

I just bought SC64W HI and I've configured G6 and G7 the way I like them. Now I'm wondering if I don't put a battery in it for long time (like for storage), will the settings be kept or wil the flashlight reverts to default (factory) settings/configs?


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

bonC said:


> I just bought SC64W HI and I've configured G6 and G7 the way I like them. Now I'm wondering if I don't put a battery in it for long time (like for storage), will the settings be kept or wil the flashlight reverts to default (factory) settings/configs?



AFAIK, the settings remain forever. I have a 600w Plus I only use in the summer for cycling. For at least 6 months, it sits in storage without a battery. It remembers everything when I use it again in the spring.


----------



## SYZYGY

eeprom's non-volatile


----------



## bonC

Thanks, that's reassuring as I have more 18650 flashlights then batteries.

My ZL set


----------



## AstroTurf

greatly disappointed in the lack of runtime specs on some zl's...


----------



## jon_slider

neutralwhite said:


> thank you Sir Bob.



Sir neutralwhite
I would like to send you a private message about one of the lights in your signature, but your inbox is full.. 
could you PM me when it is empty please?

thanks


----------



## AstroTurf

zebras?

nah, they're bunny rabbits!!!


----------



## SlippySnorlax

So when are these mk. V lights coming out?:candle:


----------



## Thujone

SlippySnorlax said:


> So when are these mk. V lights coming out?:candle:



I have not looked for a while, just saw ZL hasn't updated the spreadsheet in a long time. Are they OK?


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Thujone said:


> I have not looked for a while, just saw ZL hasn't updated the spreadsheet in a long time. Are they OK?



They're still alive and selling products. But, they haven't done much new development in a couple of years. It could just be that their current models are still fairly cutting-edge, and selling well. So, there may not be much need for new models.

It seems the innovation in LEDs has slowed a lot in the past couple of years. So, maybe we're reaching a peak where new flashlight designs aren't really much better than the previous generation.


----------



## ktsl

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> It seems the innovation in LEDs has slowed a lot in the past couple of years. So, maybe we're reaching a peak where new flashlight designs aren't really much better than the previous generation.



If I remember correctly right now the lm/watt numbers are more than 50% of the theoretical value. So no significant improvement anymore, not like 5% from incandescent to 50% in LED.


----------



## NPL

The one main thing Zebralight should do is replace their high CRI Cree LEDs with either Samsung or Nichia LEDs. Otherwise, I agree, not much else they need to improve on. 

Sent from my Pixel using Candlepowerforums mobile app


----------



## ktsl

NPL said:


> The one main thing Zebralight should do is replace their high CRI Cree LEDs with either Samsung or Nichia LEDs. Otherwise, I agree, not much else they need to improve on.
> 
> Sent from my Pixel using Candlepowerforums mobile app


Let SC600 allow protected 18650's!


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

ktsl said:


> Let SC600 allow protected 18650's!



Why? The light already has built-in LVP. Besides, something like the SC600w Plus needs to draw up to 8 amps for full output. Protection might trip, or at least add unnecessary resistance. I prefer a shorter light that 65mm cell length allows.

You can use protected cells in their headlamps, where length isn't as important. IMO, they should really ditch support there too, but they still have it.


----------



## holygeez03

Seems like almost everything ZL is on Back Order... not sure if this is due to high demand (panic) or supply/manufacturing issues in China... probably the latter, or maybe both.


----------



## pyna

i've settled on a 1xAA for my pocket, and so far the zebralight h53c has defended against all comers for a while. Wondering if I'd prefer the SC version and definitely hoping for some movement in specs to give me an easy to excuse to get one


----------



## SlippySnorlax

This may come off as an odd question; but does anyone here know if there are custom Zebralights out there? (i.e. titanium body) Would I have to fabricate something like this myself? Because I love everything about my Zebralights, especially the UI and efficiency, however... a custom zebra with rad titanium body, pocket clip, engraving maybe? Sheesh!


----------



## NPL

@pyna, 
The sc5 version is noticeably larger in the head. It will not feel as minimalist compared to sc53 series, but you will get better output, throw and heat management. Both are nice and different enough to maybe warrant having both 

@SlippySporlax
BobMcBob in the other forum does custom Zebralight mods, by changing the emiter to Samsung or Nichia for better color rendering and better tint. There's also a guy who sells custom clips for Zebralights, I think they are titanium. You won't find any titanium Zebralights though, and honestly, there would be no benefit other than aesthetic and collector appeal, not to mention the price would be ridiculously high if they ever ventured that way.

Sent from my Pixel using Candlepowerforums mobile app


----------



## TCY

Been two years since my last post - happy to report that my H600FC IV is still going strong. Tint is actually still pleasant even when compared directly against my Wizard Pro Nichia. Have no complaint whatsoever. Looking forward to a ZL version of 144A headlamp though.


----------



## ktsl

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Why? The light already has built-in LVP. Besides, something like the SC600w Plus needs to draw up to 8 amps for full output. Protection might trip, or at least add unnecessary resistance. I prefer a shorter light that 65mm cell length allows.
> 
> You can use protected cells in their headlamps, where length isn't as important. IMO, they should really ditch support there too, but they still have it.



Because allowing protected 18650 won't hurt. For you, you can still just use unprotected 18650 and forget about the additional ability.

I know it's not needed for sc600, but my point is why strip that additional ability? It's perfectly possibly that a customer may have a huge light in parallel to one-cell sc600. Fenix tk75 for example, which requires button top. 

Also, sc600 does take up to 6volts, at least for the earlier generation. So just extending that tube a bit longer, we can use two cr123a in emergency situations. No H1? Fine with me. My current outdoor system: a 18650 light (Fenix tk15UE), and one super light-weight h32fw cr123 headlamp, 3~4 cr123 batteries as backup. See? Nice and neat, cold temperature ready. If I were to use sc600 in lieu of tk15UE, I need to pack an extra 18650 because it doesn't take cr123s.


----------



## ktsl

TCY said:


> Been two years since my last post - happy to report that my H600FC IV is still going strong. Tint is actually still pleasant even when compared directly against my Wizard Pro Nichia. Have no complaint whatsoever. Looking forward to a ZL version of 144A headlamp though.



I am more and more doubtful of the need of high-cri nowadays. Human eyes are super adaptive. We tell apart minute differences in colors, after staring at them for long enough. 3000K or 7000K light, after a while you won't notice any discomfort, or anything at all, unless you look for it.

I like my sc600 III Hi tint. I like my Fenix HT 18 tint. I like my Ti Lan Pro tint. unless I put them side-by-side, I couldn't tell any differences in colors at all.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

NPL said:


> @pyna,
> The sc5 version is noticeably larger in the head. It will not feel as minimalist compared to sc53 series, but you will get better output, throw and heat management. Both are nice and different enough to maybe warrant having both



I'll second that. If you're going to stick with AA batteries, then the SC5 makes for a nice outdoor compact light. The extra throw is very useful, and the extra brightness helps a bit (though it's not a huge difference). IMO, I don't find the smaller SC53 much good outdoors. For a headlamp, the H53 makes sense (though I prefer the H600Fc).

I don't use my SC5w much anymore, since I much prefer the SC600w HI for outdoors. But it's 18650 based.






ktsl said:


> Because allowing protected 18650 won't hurt. For you, you can still just use unprotected 18650 and forget about the additional ability.
> 
> I know it's not needed for sc600, but my point is why strip that additional ability? It's perfectly possibly that a customer may have a huge light in parallel to one-cell sc600. Fenix tk75 for example, which requires button top.
> 
> Also, sc600 does take up to 6volts, at least for the earlier generation. So just extending that tube a bit longer, we can use two cr123a in emergency situations. No H1? Fine with me. My current outdoor system: a 18650 light (Fenix tk15UE), and one super light-weight h32fw cr123 headlamp, 3~4 cr123 batteries as backup. See? Nice and neat, cold temperature ready. If I were to use sc600 in lieu of tk15UE, I need to pack an extra 18650 because it doesn't take cr123s.



Zebralight's niche is very small, bright, and efficient lights. Sticking to flat-tops allows them to do that as well as possible.

Sure, allowing protected cells and CR123 doesn't sound like a big deal, but it forces the light to be a little longer, and possibly a bit thicker. They also then have to worry about protection circuit tripping at H1, or people complaining that it won't work on H1 with CR123 or that it drains the CR123's way too fast.

You could pick up an older (and larger) model if you really need cell compatibility for emergency use. Those support longer cells, but I'm not sure if they do CR123 (other than the SC32 of course). If you're using it for emergencies, then the extra brightness and new UI of the latest models probably doesn't matter to you.


----------



## AstroTurf

having given this a lil bit of thought...

how bout they update, and list accurate specs for their lights.

that is all, rant over!


----------



## noboneshotdog

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> They're still alive and selling products. But, they haven't done much new development in a couple of years. It could just be that their current models are still fairly cutting-edge, and selling well. So, there may not be much need for new models.
> 
> It seems the innovation in LEDs has slowed a lot in the past couple of years. So, maybe we're reaching a peak where new flashlight designs aren't really much better than the previous generation.



Ya, I've been wondering about ZL too. Seems like all the other brands are coming out with innovative stuff. Acebeam seems to be leading the way. ZL still hasn't come out with that multi emitter light that has been on the spreadsheet for a couple of years now. It's been so long I'm forgetting what it was called.

It's not that I don't like ZL, because I do. I would be the first to buy a new and cutting edge release from them. Even just a new design and I would throw my money at them. Too bad.....


----------



## TCY

ktsl said:


> I am more and more doubtful of the need of high-cri nowadays. Human eyes are super adaptive. We tell apart minute differences in colors, after staring at them for long enough. 3000K or 7000K light, after a while you won't notice any discomfort, or anything at all, unless you look for it.
> 
> I like my sc600 III Hi tint. I like my Fenix HT 18 tint. I like my Ti Lan Pro tint. unless I put them side-by-side, I couldn't tell any differences in colors at all.



Oh Professionals might need high CRI lights say doctors, but people buy things because they want it, not need it:naughty:

And tint on the SC600 III HI is already better than that of vast majority of lights (6500K 70CRI) on the market.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

High CRI is very useful for telling things apart. Our eyes really need that color separation to do a good job. Low CRI light, such as most cool-white LEDs, makes things look flat and washed out. It's fine if all you need is a distinction between light and dark, such as in a factory or navigating around the concrete jungle. But in the woods, high CRI makes differences between leaves, rocks, and branches really pop. You can use a lower output with a high CRI light, and see even better (up to a point).


----------



## ktsl

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Sure, allowing protected cells and CR123 doesn't sound like a big deal, but it forces the light to be a little longer, and possibly a bit thicker. They also then have to worry about protection circuit tripping at H1, or people complaining that it won't work on H1 with CR123 or that it drains the CR123's way too fast.
> 
> You could pick up an older (and larger) model if you really need cell compatibility for emergency use. Those support longer cells, but I'm not sure if they do CR123 (other than the SC32 of course). If you're using it for emergencies, then the extra brightness and new UI of the latest models probably doesn't matter to you.



Well, almost all other 1x18650 lights can take cr123a. Yet cr123a will have problems in the highest brightness most of the time. But I don't see much complaining. If you specify it clearly there's no problem.

You misunderstood when I say emergency use. I don't do emergency use everyday By emergency I mean emergency. For me, the ability of taking cr123a or lack thereof is preventing me from upgrading to Mk IV HI. Really can't convince myself to get another light so restrictive. sc600 became an around-the-house light for me, while it could have been much more than that.


----------



## ktsl

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> High CRI is very useful for telling things apart. Our eyes really need that color separation to do a good job. Low CRI light, such as most cool-white LEDs, makes things look flat and washed out. It's fine if all you need is a distinction between light and dark, such as in a factory or navigating around the concrete jungle. But in the woods, high CRI makes differences between leaves, rocks, and branches really pop. You can use a lower output with a high CRI light, and see even better (up to a point).



Theoretically. Did you ever have that experience yourself? 

Back in the cool white days there were no complaint about not being able to tell things apart in the field. People hated the tint, but that's it. It's only when people started on high cri they begin to say it has this advantage. An imagined advantage on paper.


----------



## ktsl

TCY said:


> Oh Professionals might need high CRI lights say doctors, but people buy things because they want it, not need it:naughty:
> 
> And tint on the SC600 III HI is already better than that of vast majority of lights (6500K 70CRI) on the market.



Hear, hear!

6500k


----------



## Connor

ktsl said:


> Theoretically. Did you ever have that experience yourself?
> 
> Back in the cool white days there were no complaint about not being able to tell things apart in the field. People hated the tint, but that's it. It's only when people started on high cri they begin to say it has this advantage. An imagined advantage on paper.



I can't take you for a walk in the woods with me to simply *show* you the difference between a 70 CRI and 95 CRI light, but if you have already done this yourself and you don't see any difference something is wrong with your eyes. 
It is clearly visible.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Connor said:


> I can't take you for a walk in the woods with me to simply *show* you the difference between a 70 CRI and 95 CRI light, but if you have already done this yourself and you don't see any difference something is wrong with your eyes.
> It is clearly visible.



+1. I love the high CRI H600Fc IV for hikes. It makes all the subtle brown tones in a forest, pop. I used to use cool-white before better tints became available, but it's really awful when I compare side-by-side. Cool white is fine indoors or around a colorless concrete landscape, but in a forest it's really bad.


----------



## ktsl

Connor said:


> I can't take you for a walk in the woods with me to simply *show* you the difference between a 70 CRI and 95 CRI light, but if you have already done this yourself and you don't see any difference something is wrong with your eyes.
> It is clearly visible.



You misunderstood my point. Of course there are differences if you put them side my side. But, if you use 70 cri light by itself, it wouldn't cause you any trouble telling things apart in the field. Like I said, before this era of high-cri lights, people never complained about not being able to tell things apart. They just complain about the tint.


----------



## Connor

I would argue that a high CRI light would help about anyone to "tell things apart" more easily/quickly. Especially in the woods a low CRI light turns everything into blue-green-grey slurry because of the missing red spectrum.


----------



## Derek Dean

ktsl said:


> Like I said, before this era of high-cri lights, people never complained about not being able to tell things apart.


First, we didn't complain for the last 100 years because incandescent lights, with a typical color temperature of 2700, have a CRI of 100%, so everything looked great. 

Then, when LED lights first appeared, we didn't complain because we were simply happy to have an LED light that put out 100 lumens with 2 levels. 

But once LED light technology began to mature, and many lights were able to put out more light than needed by their users, with much greater efficiency, we began to focus not only on the quantity of light, but also on the *quality* of that light. It's simply the natural progression that we see with any new technology. 

To put it simply, we didn't complain about the low CRI of those early LED lights, because we were so enamored of the new technology that we were willing to put up with a beam that maybe didn't render as well as the old incandescent lights, but in return promised so much more, such as a light source that didn't burn out after 50-100 hours. 

Of course, we all have different priorities, and some folks simply don't see any real benefit to high CRI lights, and that's fine, it's not really a matter of right or wrong, it's just a personal preference.


----------



## Keitho

Yes, what DD said. A 20 second search finds evidence that in 2005, people were certainly complaining about LED color http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?92415-What-s-the-benefit-of-incandescent-over-LED. Its obvious from the snark in that thread that it was an old debate in 2005, back when Star Wars episode III was the third worst thing to have happened to Star Wars, Foo Fighters was relevant, and Bush Jr was adamant that global warming is fiction...


----------



## ktsl

Keitho said:


> Yes, what DD said. A 20 second search finds evidence that in 2005, people were certainly complaining about LED color http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?92415-What-s-the-benefit-of-incandescent-over-LED. Its obvious from the snark in that thread that it was an old debate in 2005, back when Star Wars episode III was the third worst thing to have happened to Star Wars, Foo Fighters was relevant, and Bush Jr was adamant that global warming is fiction...



This is exactly what I said, people complained about the tint (i.e. color).


----------



## ktsl

Derek Dean said:


> But once LED light technology began to mature, and many lights were able to put out more light than needed by their users, with much greater efficiency, we began to focus not only on the quantity of light, but also on the *quality* of that light. It's simply the natural progression that we see with any new technology.
> 
> To put it simply, we didn't complain about the low CRI of those early LED lights, because we were so enamored of the new technology that we were willing to put up with a beam that maybe didn't render as well as the old incandescent lights, but in return promised so much more, such as a light source that didn't burn out after 50-100 hours.
> 
> Of course, we all have different priorities, and some folks simply don't see any real benefit to high CRI lights, and that's fine, it's not really a matter of right or wrong, it's just a personal preference.



Well, people certainly complained about the color a lot. But no so much on not being able to tell things apart. If people were too happy to have LED to complain about the latter, why would they complain about the former? In my opinion it's because the latter not so much a problem.

I myself hated early <70cri lights, mostly for the color. Nowadays, ~80 cri 4500k or 5000k works very well (e.g. sc600 Mk III HI). I am doubtful if >90 cri is really that necessary. I have several 219b, they look great. At the same time, sc5c can have a green tint with >90 cri . Anyone complain that sc600 III Hi have problems telling things apart?


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

There's no doubt, that for people with normal vision, high CRI is a huge benefit to seeing things, especially in a forest. If you don't believe me, just try it for yourself. I'm sure there are exceptions: people with color-blindness, etc.

Maybe we don't absolutely need high CRI. Sure, the 75 or 80 CRI of a standard neutral-white LED still looks pretty good (such as the SC600w or SC64w), especially compared to ugly 65 CRI cool white. And, yeah, if we had nothing better, cool white would still do the job. But that's a bit like saying we could live by just eating plain potatoes for the rest of our lives. We might be able to do it, but why would anyone want to when there's so many better options?


----------



## Fireclaw18

The value of high-CRI also depends on the use. 

I walk outside with my high-CRI light and want to see something 500 feet away, I see nothing. It's not bright enough and doesn't throw far enough.

Do the same with a similar light with XPL HI and I can clearly see what I'm looking at.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Fireclaw18 said:


> The value of high-CRI also depends on the use.
> 
> I walk outside with my high-CRI light and want to see something 500 feet away, I see nothing. It's not bright enough and doesn't throw far enough.
> 
> Do the same with a similar light with XPL HI and I can clearly see what I'm looking at.



That has nothing to do with CRI. I can see further with my SC600w IV HI than I can with my SC600w IV Plus, even though the Plus is brighter and has the same tint and CRI. The reason is obvious.

We're talking about similar beam profiles and similar lux on the target when we're comparing high CRI and low CRI.


----------



## Swedpat

I have clearly seen the difference between a low and high CRI light. Low CRI in the woods washes out the colors so brown and green look almost the same. Also blue and purple look very similar. And in my experience it's not required to have high CRI like nichia 219 to make a big difference. Mostoften warm tint at all is superior to cool tint.


----------



## Buck91

Does anybody have the LED specs for the XHP35 ZL used in the SC63W? Zeroair's review has it listed as a 4500k with unknown CRI but mine looks a bit warmer to my eyes. Hard to get a good read on CRI by eyeball but I'm thinking 80-85, can anybody confirm?


----------



## Seattle Sparky

High CRI is important to me in some cases, in particular when I am at work and dealing with color coded wires. On some wires colors, due to manufacturing or due degrading of insulation ,would be hard to distinguish even with high CRI illumination, and close to impossible without hcri. For that purpose my zebra headlamp is hcri, with hcri HDS back up, and cool white malkoff e2xtd when I need to see things way out there, cri is not important for that.
Below photo taken without flash, but with H604c 4000k XHP50.2 , in 1600 lumen mode.




[/IMG]




[/IMG]


----------



## Mr. LED

Buck91 said:


> Does anybody have the LED specs for the XHP35 ZL used in the SC63W? Zeroair's review has it listed as a 4500k with unknown CRI but mine looks a bit warmer to my eyes. Hard to get a good read on CRI by eyeball but I'm thinking 80-85, can anybody confirm?



Zebralight rates it at 80+ CRI, so I think you’re spot on.


----------



## Bob_McBob

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> There's no doubt, that for people with normal vision, high CRI is a huge benefit to seeing things, especially in a forest. If you don't believe me, just try it for yourself. I'm sure there are exceptions: people with color-blindness, etc.
> 
> Maybe we don't absolutely need high CRI. Sure, the 75 or 80 CRI of a standard neutral-white LED still looks pretty good (such as the SC600w or SC64w), especially compared to ugly 65 CRI cool white. And, yeah, if we had nothing better, cool white would still do the job. But that's a bit like saying we could live by just eating plain potatoes for the rest of our lives. We might be able to do it, but why would anyone want to when there's so many better options?



It's hard to believe anyone can walk in a natural setting at night and not notice the difference between high CRI and low CRI lights. CRI 80 is more acceptable than CRI 70, but both make everything look dull and lifeless and blend together compared to R9050 or especially R9080 with the improved red rendering. Every light I carry is high CRI, but my car has low CRI LED headlights, and it's quite frustrating how dead everything looks and how much harder it is to distinguish some road markings compared to tungsten-halogen or daylight. And there's no upgrade path because they come as sealed units that cost a fortune.

I understand many people just want to have a lot of lumens or a lot of throw and don't really care what it looks like, but I feel like most who claim CRI doesn't matter haven't really compared lights in a meaningful way. It's not the dark ages of LED flashlights where anything is acceptable as long as it has reasonable output. There are many high CRI offerings, and many more if you're willing to learn.


----------



## ktsl

Swedpat said:


> I have clearly seen the difference between a low and high CRI light. Low CRI in the woods washes out the colors so brown and green look almost the same. Also blue and purple look very similar. And in my experience it's not required to have high CRI like nichia 219 to make a big difference. Mostoften warm tint at all is superior to cool tint.



It's interesting to notice most people seems to be walking in the green woods? Most of my camping trips are into dry woods, I try to avoid camping in wet conditions. Now everything is brown anyways, and <4000k just make it worse for me. Maybe this is why our reference points are different. I'd pick 5000k 80cri over 4000k 90cri any day, but again this is just my personal preference.


----------



## Robot Mania FU

ktsl said:


> I myself hated early <70cri lights, mostly for the color. Nowadays, ~80 cri 4500k or 5000k works very well (e.g. sc600 Mk III HI). I am doubtful if >90 cri is really that necessary. I have several 219b, they look great. At the same time, sc5c can have a green tint with >90 cri . Anyone complain that sc600 III Hi have problems telling things apart?




You're right, of course it's not necessary. For years, I've carried an sc32w daily and thought it had a great tint. To me, it was perfect. I couldn't care less about high cri. My most recent zebralight purchase was an h600fc. I bought it because I thought a 4000k high cri headlamp would help me distinguish colors and contrasts while out fishing at night. It definitely does, but no it's not necessary. However, I liked it so much that I find myself carrying it as my daily light. To me, high cri seems like one of those things that you miss when you no longer have it. 

I may be in the minority here because I know people praise high cri while out in the woods or the field or specifically in my case, night fishing (which is why I bought one in the first place).....but that is where I feel I can get by with any light to be honest. Where I found I missed having high cri was in the light that I carried and used for daily tasks.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Robot Mania FU said:


> You're right, of course it's not necessary. For years, I've carried an sc32w daily and thought it had a great tint. To me, it was perfect. I couldn't care less about high cri. My most recent zebralight purchase was an h600fc. I bought it because I thought a 4000k high cri headlamp would help me distinguish colors and contrasts while out fishing at night. It definitely does, but no it's not necessary. However, I liked it so much that I find myself carrying it as my daily light. To me, high cri seems like one of those things that you miss when you no longer have it.



Yeah, the H600Fc has really nice tint. I was very happy with the SC64w HI and SC600w HI tints, until I tried the H600Fc.


----------



## NPL

Bob_McBob said:


> It's hard to believe anyone can walk in a natural setting at night and not notice the difference between high CRI and low CRI lights. CRI 80 is more acceptable than CRI 70, but both make everything look dull and lifeless and blend together compared to R9050 or especially R9080 with the improved red rendering. Every light I carry is high CRI, but my car has low CRI LED headlights, and it's quite frustrating how dead everything looks and how much harder it is to distinguish some road markings compared to tungsten-halogen or daylight. And there's no upgrade path because they come as sealed units that cost a fortune.
> 
> I understand many people just want to have a lot of lumens or a lot of throw and don't really care what it looks like, but I feel like most who claim CRI doesn't matter haven't really compared lights in a meaningful way. It's not the dark ages of LED flashlights where anything is acceptable as long as it has reasonable output. There are many high CRI offerings, and many more if you're willing to learn.


I agree 100%. 80cri is better than 70, but the main missing element in 70 and 80 CRI LEDs is the non existent R9 Red value. That's why 9050 and 9080 make a significant difference in color rendering, because you get an R9 value closer to 50 or higher. If you had an LED that rendered to 100cri, but had an R9 value of zero, it would still be crap. I too find that distinguishing anything is easier with 90cri light vs a marginally brighter 70cri equivalent. 

Sent from my Pixel using Candlepowerforums mobile app


----------



## ktsl

Robot Mania FU said:


> You're right, of course it's not necessary. For years, I've carried an sc32w daily and thought it had a great tint. To me, it was perfect. I couldn't care less about high cri. My most recent zebralight purchase was an h600fc. I bought it because I thought a 4000k high cri headlamp would help me distinguish colors and contrasts while out fishing at night. It definitely does, but no it's not necessary. However, I liked it so much that I find myself carrying it as my daily light. To me, high cri seems like one of those things that you miss when you no longer have it.
> 
> I may be in the minority here because I know people praise high cri while out in the woods or the field or specifically in my case, night fishing (which is why I bought one in the first place).....but that is where I feel I can get by with any light to be honest. Where I found I missed having high cri was in the light that I carried and used for daily tasks.



I have sc32w as well. Such a great tool. Mine has a tint that's a bit too yellow, other than that it's perfect. 

Enthusiasts will create scenarios that are so convincing to themselves. But try explaining high-cri to your non-flashlight hiking buddy. Even better, imagine explaining that to Alex Honnold, or Bill Gates, or Justin Beiber. Imagine the look on their faces.

I was one of those who felt my eyes just opened when I came across the high-cri leds. After several camping and hiking trips, honestly, it doesn't matter...


----------



## trojansteel

So I've been out of the flashlight game for about a year and a half. Currently, I've got an HDS, Malkoff, BOSS, tain, and a few others including an older AA Zebralight which I love. 

I'm looking to get an 18650 Zebralight, but it looks like there are so many options. I wouldn't mind the headlamp design. 

Which is the best High-Cri variant?

Thanks


----------



## NPL

In my experience, the sc64c LE With Samsung LED has the best tint and High CRI. I previously owned the h600fc mk iv with high CRI xhp50.2 and sold it because I found the tint too green for my liking. The 80 CRI xhp35 versions should have a good tint, but color rendering especially in reds will be weak compared to 90cri options. 

Sent from my Pixel using Candlepowerforums mobile app


----------



## trojansteel

NPL said:


> In my experience, the sc64c LE With Samsung LED has the best tint and High CRI. I previously owned the h600fc mk iv with high CRI xhp50.2 and sold it because I found the tint too green for my liking. The 80 CRI xhp35 versions should have a good tint, but color rendering especially in reds will be weak compared to 90cri options.
> 
> Sent from my Pixel using Candlepowerforums mobile app



Thanks!


----------



## Robot Mania FU

trojansteel said:


> So I've been out of the flashlight game for about a year and a half. Currently, I've got an HDS, Malkoff, BOSS, tain, and a few others including an older AA Zebralight which I love.
> 
> I'm looking to get an 18650 Zebralight, but it looks like there are so many options. I wouldn't mind the headlamp design.
> 
> Which is the best High-Cri variant?
> 
> Thanks




The sc64c LE definitely has the best tint/cri out of the bunch with the LH351d from samsung. I carry an h600fc because I'm finding that I actually prefer the headlamp design even for an edc light, but there is no denying the LH351d if tint/cri is your main concern.


----------



## trojansteel

Robot Mania FU said:


> The sc64c LE definitely has the best tint/cri out of the bunch with the LH351d from samsung. I carry an h600fc because I'm finding that I actually prefer the headlamp design even for an edc light, but there is no denying the LH351d if tint/cri is your main concern.



How does this Hi-Cri variant of the H600Fc compare to the Samsung? http://www.zebralight.com/H600Fc-Mk-IV-18650-XHP502-Floody-4000K-High-CRI-Headlamp_p_218.html


----------



## NPL

I like the Samsung high CRI, at least in my copy. Similar to Nichia 219c, if not better. The xhp50.2 high CRI led in the h600fc was significantly more green, there's no comparison. 

If Zebralight made a high CRI headlamp with Samsung lh351d LED, I would get one. 

Sent from my Pixel using Candlepowerforums mobile app


----------



## AstroTurf

*H503c AA LH351D 4000K Neutral White High CRI Flood Headlamp
*
QUOTE=NPL;5380412]I like the Samsung high CRI, at least in my copy. Similar to Nichia 219c, if not better. The xhp50.2 high CRI led in the h600fc was significantly more green, there's no comparison. 

If Zebralight made a high CRI headlamp with Samsung lh351d LED, I would get one. 

Sent from my Pixel using Candlepowerforums mobile app[/QUOTE]


----------



## NPL

Yes, forgot about that, but I don't find mules very useful. It would need to be in an optic or reflector. 

Sent from my Pixel using Candlepowerforums mobile app


----------



## Robot Mania FU

trojansteel said:


> How does this Hi-Cri variant of the H600Fc compare to the Samsung? http://www.zebralight.com/H600Fc-Mk-IV-18650-XHP502-Floody-4000K-High-CRI-Headlamp_p_218.html




That's the exact light I carry daily and I love it. I used to only use it as a head lamp, but I started to find myself missing it when I went back to my other lights. The frosted lens negates the tint shift that some have complained about with the xhp50.2, but I still wouldn't put it as high up as the sc64c LE. If you want the best CRI zebralight has to offer, that's your winner. 

Now with that being said, the h600fc 4000k is no slouch. The tint on mine is very clean (mostly due to the frosted lens. The xhp50.2 definitely has some tint shift without it). If I had to compare, I would say it leans a tad more yellow than a 4000k nichia 219. I would still take the LH351D over both.


----------



## MX421

AstroTurf said:


> *H503c AA LH351D 4000K Neutral White High CRI Flood Headlamp
> *
> QUOTE=NPL;5380412]I like the Samsung high CRI, at least in my copy. Similar to Nichia 219c, if not better. The xhp50.2 high CRI led in the h600fc was significantly more green, there's no comparison.
> 
> If Zebralight made a high CRI headlamp with Samsung lh351d LED, I would get one.
> 
> Sent from my Pixel using Candlepowerforums mobile app


[/QUOTE]

Personally i love mules for many purposes. I've been using mules since i got my H602w a few years ago. A even consistant flood is great for all closeup tasks, but sometimes you need some throw. My current H604c and H600Fc are almost as good as my SC64c tintwise, at least for me. I got the H600Fc used and if i had my choice, i would prefer a H600c. I use all three consistently and personally find the Headlamps the best light to take when you go take a pee


----------



## markr6

That C4, though


----------



## Buck91

Very happy with my current 18650 headlamps but looking at upgrading the AA headlamp in my travel bag. I've owned (and extensively used) a ZL H50-Q5 headlamp for many years and its been drop dead reliable and easy to use. The pure flood of the XRE Q5 had been great for up-close tasks and is OK for general purpose as well, but I've developed an appreciation for a more balanced beam such sa my AT Wizard Pro or the Thrunite TH20. I see the newer ZL's (ie H53c) are rated for 80 degree spill and 12 degree hotspot while the flood (H53Fc) is a 90 degree flood... Can anybody comment on how these two compare? It looks to me like the H53Fc is the same reflector as the regular version except with a frosted lens? So not a true flood like my old H50 or the newer H503c?


Also, unrelated question. The old H30-Q5 is advertised as "EMI/RFI Shielded to protect forehead from brightness regulating circuit." Does this have any real-world advantages and is it carried over into the modern ZL offerings?


----------



## NPL

The h53fc will probably have a similar beam profile to your AT Wizard, maybe a touch less floody. The H53fc is not a mule, so it will have a more intense center that gradually diffuses into the spill. I personally always recommend the clear glass version (h53c) for the extra throw when needed, and you can add a layer of DC fix on the glass to make it almost identical to the H53fc beam profile. If you get the H53fc, and suddenly need more throw, you can't make it more intense. 

Sent from my Pixel using Candlepowerforums mobile app


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

NPL said:


> The h53fc will probably have a similar beam profile to your AT Wizard, maybe a touch less floody. The H53fc is not a mule, so it will have a more intense center that gradually diffuses into the spill. I personally always recommend the clear glass version (h53c) for the extra throw when needed, and you can add a layer of DC fix on the glass to make it almost identical to the H53fc beam profile. If you get the H53fc, and suddenly need more throw, you can't make it more intense.



I've played around with diffuser film on my clear Zebralight lenses. But, I still recommend the frosted lens for a headlamp. Sure, you might want the extra throw 1% of the time. The other 99% of the time, you're stuck using diffuser film which isn't as transparent as frosted glass, and you lose some light output. Plus, it can be a hassle removing and reattaching it.

Far easier to use a frosted lens for your headlamp, and carry a straight flashlight with a clear lens for your thrower.

As for mules. Meh, not for me. I really don't like the harsh shadows, and of course the very limited reach.


----------



## markr6

markr6 said:


> That C4, though



My bad, C3. Been out of the game for a while.


----------



## AstroTurf

Zebralight C3 no longer listed on spreadsheet...


----------



## wicky998

Is zebra still operational during this pandemic?


----------



## archimedes

wicky998 said:


> Is zebra still operational during this pandemic?


I was wondering that too.


----------



## Mr. LED

wicky998 said:


> Is zebra still operational during this pandemic?



Yes, they returned operations on February 10.


----------



## wicky998

Mr. LED said:


> Yes, they returned operations on February 10.



Thanks man , good to know !


----------



## archimedes

Thank you for the update.


----------



## Stefano

wicky998 said:


> Is zebra still operational during this pandemic?



I also wonder about this.
Recently I wrote to customer service to ask if they are planning a 18650 version of the H502pr (or new H503pr) but after a few hours I get an error ..
"452 <cs @ zebralight.com> Domain size limit exceeded "

Currently I see many items out of stock on the site but I know that in March they were operational because they sent me back a light that I had sent for repair (parasite discharge)


----------



## Robot Mania FU

Stefano said:


> I also wonder about this.
> Recently I wrote to customer service to ask if they are planning a 18650 version of the H502pr (or new H503pr) but after a few hours I get an error ..
> "452 <cs @ zebralight.com> Domain size limit exceeded "
> 
> Currently I see many items out of stock on the site but I know that in March they were operational because they sent me back a light that I had sent for repair (parasite discharge)




I know last month in the middle of April I wrote to them to ask on the back order status of an sc64c LE and got a response of 5 weeks. That would place the lead time for next week, so I can only assume they are still operational.


----------



## Stefano

Stefano said:


> I also wonder about this.
> Recently I wrote to customer service to ask if they are planning a 18650 version of the H502pr (or new H503pr) but after a few hours I get an error ..
> "452 <cs @ zebralight.com> Domain size limit exceeded "
> 
> Currently I see many items out of stock on the site but I know that in March they were operational because they sent me back a light that I had sent for repair (parasite discharge)



I tried to write to the sales department through the Zebralight registered account, they replied after a few hours.
At the moment there is no news on a new version with red light AA or 18650


----------



## Romanko

An interesting anodizing like in old ones, not the dark. Picture found in one store.

http://enecrosse.ru/components/com_virtuemart/shop_image/product/ZebraLight_H600w_5e00ce4611df0.jpg


----------



## Mr. LED

My favorite color. I bought one H53Fc last year that has this tint!


----------



## Mgizler

Tried and tried to find another SC5, but keep striking out or missing a sale by minutes. But landed a New sc52 l2 on the mall. Pumped to have another zebralight in my collection!!


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Mgizler said:


> Tried and tried to find another SC5, but keep striking out or missing a sale by minutes. But landed a New sc52 l2 on the mall. Pumped to have another zebralight in my collection!!



I have a couple of SC52's, and I like that they can take a 14500 battery. They're actually a little brighter than the SC5 which only will take NiMH. However, I usually just run them with Eneloops, since they're almost always indoor lights so I don't need the extra brightness. The SC5 is the brightest 1xAA light I know, although you need a good cell to get the highest level. I think I'm a little fonder of the smaller SC52 format, though.


----------



## Mgizler

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> I have a couple of SC52's, and I like that they can take a 14500 battery. They're actually a little brighter than the SC5 which only will take NiMH. However, I usually just run them with Eneloops, since they're almost always indoor lights so I don't need the extra brightness. The SC5 is the brightest 1xAA light I know, although you need a good cell to get the highest level. I think I'm a little fonder of the smaller SC52 format, though.



I loved my old sc52. But I ended up selling it to purchase an SC5w. I really enjoyed the sc5w. And ran Eneloop pros in each one of them. That’s what I will most likely use when it gets here. 
I ended up selling the sc5w to put the money towards a different purchase altogether. I quickly realized that I regretted my decision. 

It seems as though ZL has been out of stock on nearly everything in the last few months. What gives? I don’t ever remember it being like this.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Mgizler said:


> It seems as though ZL has been out of stock on nearly everything in the last few months. What gives? I don’t ever remember it being like this.



My guess is that when China shut down all their factories, Zebralight's stock dried up. I think China's factories are back up now, so I presume new lights should be resupplied soon. But, I've noticed that during the past couple of years, everything I've bought from their main store has been back-ordered, and usually takes about 2 weeks to ship after I order. Maybe that still what they're doing. Zebralight is horrible about keeping their web page up to date.


----------



## Mgizler

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> My guess is that when China shut down all their factories, Zebralight's stock dried up. I think China's factories are back up now, so I presume new lights should be resupplied soon. But, I've noticed that during the past couple of years, everything I've bought from their main store has been back-ordered, and usually takes about 2 weeks to ship after I order. Maybe that still what they're doing. Zebralight is horrible about keeping their web page up to date.



Good point. I figured there were some issues since China was poop down. But it seems like it’s been this way for years with them. Hopefully they get restocked back up. I would really like another SC5


----------



## Jeffg0330

> . But it seems like it’s been this way for years with them. Hopefully they get restocked back up. I would really like another SC5



Which version SC5 are you looking for? The 4500K is available now and the high CRI is on “back order” but from my recent experiences on “back order” from Zebralight translated to next day shipped. But the CW isn’t even listed currently


----------



## Mgizler

Jeffg0330 said:


> Which version SC5 are you looking for? The 4500K is available now and the high CRI is on “back order” but from my recent experiences on “back order” from Zebralight translated to next day shipped. But the CW isn’t even listed currently



I guess I just assumed since it said back order that they weren’t in stock and I never placed an order on one. I never even tried to. 
I was looking for another sc5w or SC5 cool white. Or neutral. Really any one.


----------



## AstroTurf

i think nkon has them in stock



Mgizler said:


> I guess I just assumed since it said back order that they weren’t in stock and I never placed an order on one. I never even tried to.
> I was looking for another sc5w or SC5 cool white. Or neutral. Really any one.


----------



## bhds

I'm looking to get a new single AA work edc to replace the Thorfire TG06s that I lost. I'm thinking of maybe getting the SC53 but worried that it may be too floody. I already own an H52 and I need something with a bit more concentrated throw than it has. Anyone have both the headlamp and flashlight that can give me some insight?


----------



## wicky998

bhds said:


> I'm looking to get a new single AA work edc to replace the Thorfire TG06s that I lost. I'm thinking of maybe getting the SC53 but worried that it may be too floody. I already own an H52 and I need something with a bit more concentrated throw than it has. Anyone have both the headlamp and flashlight that can give me some insight?



The 53 is my edc and I love it . I’ve never said “I wish it was brighter or tighter” for my everyday tasks but yours may differ . It’s a perfect beam for edc


----------



## StagMoose

I have a SC5w ii. Also have a floody headlamp but it is a 600. I really like the beam profile of the SC5. It isn’t the floody frosted lens but it is still an overall floody light. 

I prefer the floody lens on the 18650 headlamps for sure, but with the reduced output of the 2AA lights it seems (to me) to not be as drastic of a spot and spill, but it isn’t the perfectly smooth light wall of the floody lens.


----------



## Romanko

They've just discontinued SC5 Mk II. It's strange.
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet...-fjOuWXFm8IsdeONeXfZpJjWygUn2w&urp=gmail_link


----------



## vadimax

Romanko said:


> They've just discontinued SC5 Mk II. It's strange.



SC5 were too good making all other models pointless  But SC5w is still available at eu.knon.nl.


----------



## Mgizler

Crazy. It’s such an amazing light. But I guess I understand that it kills all their other lights


----------



## Mgizler

Hopefully my sc52 will be here this week!


----------



## StagMoose

That is strange. Maybe they are moving to different emitters and there will be something even brighter? 

That was a great light and the flagship of the AA lights. Seems a strange one to discontinue; why not one of the lower output models?


----------



## Jeffg0330

StagMoose said:


> That was a great light and the flagship of the AA lights. Seems a strange one to discontinue; why not one of the lower output models?



Maybe a sales based decision? I’d be curious to know if the SC5 outsells the SC53 overall. I own both and reach for the 53 every time I want a single aa light. I personally don’t need the higher output for my applications, and love the way it disappears in my pocket.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Romanko said:


> They've just discontinued SC5 Mk II. It's strange.



I don't think it really was a good fit in their line-up. When I want a small EDC, I grab a SC52 (or SC53). My SC5w isn't very good for EDC, since it's rather fat. It's impressively bright, and the larger reflector gives it modest throw, but not so much better than the SC52/53 that it's worth the extra space in my pocket.

When I want a pocketable EDC for outdoors, I'll use the SC64w HI. It's an 18650 light, but because it's thinner than the SC5 it's actually more pocketable.

The SC5 is kind of a hybrid, but it's extra diameter is a big drawback. I use mine mainly as a bedside light, now. The extra size makes it very stable when tailstanding. But I doubt most people would buy it for that purpose.


----------



## Mgizler

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> I don't think it really was a good fit in their line-up. When I want a small EDC, I grab a SC52 (or SC53). My SC5w isn't very good for EDC, since it's rather fat. It's impressively bright, and the larger reflector gives it modest throw, but not so much better than the SC52/53 that it's worth the extra space in my pocket.
> 
> When I want a pocketable EDC for outdoors, I'll use the SC64w HI. It's an 18650 light, but because it's thinner than the SC5 it's actually more pocketable.
> 
> The SC5 is kind of a hybrid, but it's extra diameter is a big drawback. I use mine mainly as a bedside light, now. The extra size makes it very stable when tailstanding. But I doubt most people would buy it for that purpose.




Good point. Now that you mention it? I do remember the SC5 feeling rather large in my pocket. I typically carry my lights clipped to the inside of my left front pocket and I remember it feeling like a pocket hog. Oh well, I think I’ve given up on wanting another SC5. Hopefully this sc52 that I have coming will help change my mind. It’s been a long time since I’ve had one.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Mgizler said:


> Good point. Now that you mention it? I do remember the SC5 feeling rather large in my pocket. I typically carry my lights clipped to the inside of my left front pocket and I remember it feeling like a pocket hog. Oh well, I think I’ve given up on wanting another SC5. Hopefully this sc52 that I have coming will help change my mind. It’s been a long time since I’ve had one.



Stick a 14500 in your SC52 and it's as bright as the SC5.


----------



## Mgizler

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Stick a 14500 in your SC52 and it's as bright as the SC5.



Surprisingly That’s one thing I never did when I had my old sc52. Does it take button top, flat top, or either?


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Mgizler said:


> Surprisingly That’s one thing I never did when I had my old sc52. Does it take button top, flat top, or either?



I'm pretty sure it requires a button-top. I use a Keeppower cell in mine (I have a SC52 and SC52w). Though, I almost always use Eneloops, since I bring a SC64 or SC600 if I need a lot of output.

One extra benefit of the 14500 in the SC52, is that the max mode (after the step-down from 500 lumens) is well-regulated. On an Eneloop, the max mode is not regulated (the other modes are regulated).

That's also a benefit of the SC5 using Eneloops. It does have very well regulated modes on all levels, regardless of the battery drain condition. I really wish they put the SC5 driver in a SC52 or SC53 body. That would make a kick-*** design. Perhaps there isn't enough room?


----------



## Mgizler

Nice. Thanks for the info. I have eneloop pro’s I use in my lights. That what I used in my old SC5 and sc52. 

His thing can get here fast enough. Coming from Germany. Taking a long time. I believe it’s been in customs for quite a few days.


----------



## Erik1213

Edit: never mind. Everything is back up and running.


----------



## Tapis

Zebralight claims worldwide free shipping on orders $50+. Yet, on checkout there is only a $27 DHL option for the flashlight to be sent to Canada. Has anybody encounter this problem? Could it be because of Covid-19?


----------



## Fireclaw18

Tapis said:


> Zebralight claims worldwide free shipping on orders $50+. Yet, on checkout there is only a $27 DHL option for the flashlight to be sent to Canada. Has anybody encounter this problem? Could it be because of Covid-19?




I haven't tried ordering anything from Zebralight for a year or two, but it wouldn't surprise me.

Neal from Nealsgadgets mentioned that the cost to ship from China to the U.S. via DHL tripled due to the Coronavirus.


----------



## AstroTurf

its not a problem... as you put it.

here you can find the shipping details:

http://www.zebralight.com/Free-Shipping-Worldwide_ep_43-1.html

dhl is a paid, and not free option...



Tapis said:


> Zebralight claims worldwide free shipping on orders $50+. Yet, on checkout there is only a $27 DHL option for the flashlight to be sent to Canada. Has anybody encounter this problem? Could it be because of Covid-19?


----------



## Tapis

Thanks all. Today I got this answer from Zebralight regarding the missing free shipping option:

_"Our forwarder can't provide the registered airmail recently, only DHL is available. We will provide the registered airmail when our forwarder informs us. I don't know when though."_


----------



## AstroTurf

dang, so what they're sayin is... they cant get there from here?



Tapis said:


> Thanks all. Today I got this answer from Zebralight regarding the missing free shipping option:
> 
> _"Our forwarder can't provide the registered airmail recently, only DHL is available. We will provide the registered airmail when our forwarder informs us. I don't know when though."_


----------



## guardrail

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> The SC5 is kind of a hybrid, but it's extra diameter is a big drawback. I use mine mainly as a bedside light, now. The extra size makes it very stable when tailstanding. But I doubt most people would buy it for that purpose.



I actually do that too :laughing:


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Tapis said:


> Zebralight claims worldwide free shipping on orders $50+. Yet, on checkout there is only a $27 DHL option for the flashlight to be sent to Canada. Has anybody encounter this problem? Could it be because of Covid-19?



2 or 3 years ago I asked them if their free shipping to Canada was still an option (I had used it previously). I was told that some Canadians were ripping them off, because the free option didn't require a signature and Canadians were claiming they never received it, so they removed that option. So, since then, I am stuck paying for EMS shipping. It costs about $15, IIRC, and takes 1-2 weeks. Signature required, though I'm not sure how that works now with Canada Post refusing to collect signatures for the next year.

Are you only seeing DHL as an option, now? Perhaps they removed EMS because Canada Post is refusing signatures on everything? Well, DHL is the fastest. You should get it within a few days. Expensive, though.


----------



## Tapis

^ Thanks for your comment. Yes, I'm only seeing a DHL option. And I guess buying the light from a US seller to be mailed to Canada won't end up being cheaper, so sadly our options are very limited.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Wow, yeah, that really sucks. I just went to order a red headlamp they have on sale, but you're right that DHL is the only option. It adds more than 50% to the price! Okay, that's out for now.


----------



## AstroTurf

but but but,

that lil red headlamp is really sweet!!!

Jim



WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Wow, yeah, that really sucks. I just went to order a red headlamp they have on sale, but you're right that DHL is the only option. It adds more than 50% to the price! Okay, that's out for now.


----------



## Mgizler

Did a little night time magnet fishing last night and did not have a headlamp. I ended up clipping my olight s2r to my hat. Not real fond of this option. I have had a lot of zebra lights in the last 15 years but I have never tried one of the headlamps. After last night I really wanted to pick one up. So I just ordered an H53w a little while ago. I am excited to have a decent head lamp again. I was thinking about going with one of the 600 series headlamps but was unsure of the weight. However, the longer runtime might have made it worth it.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Mgizler said:


> Did a little night time magnet fishing last night and did not have a headlamp. I ended up clipping my olight s2r to my hat. Not real fond of this option. I have had a lot of zebra lights in the last 15 years but I have never tried one of the headlamps. After last night I really wanted to pick one up. So I just ordered an H53w a little while ago. I am excited to have a decent head lamp again. I was thinking about going with one of the 600 series headlamps but was unsure of the weight. However, the longer runtime might have made it worth it.



I use the H600Fc. It's about the same size and weight as the SC64 series. That is, very small and light. No problem at all. I don't usually use it higher than about 150 lumens, but it's fun and impressive cranked up to 1500 lumens.

I think I'd be fine using a AA headlamp at around 100 lumens, which would give 2-3 hours run-time. 18650 is overkill most of the time, but it's great to have when you need it.


----------



## tech25

The AA lights are great, I use one more frequently than my 18650. Not a huge difference in weight and size between the two but the 18650 is more noticeable on the head. I do like the increased runtime and power on the 18650 but find that I tend to keep the 18650 in my bag vs the AA which I can throw in my pocket.


----------



## Mr. LED

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Wow, yeah, that really sucks. I just went to order a red headlamp they have on sale, but you're right that DHL is the only option. It adds more than 50% to the price! Okay, that's out for now.



Try www.nkon.nl the shipping is more reasonable I guess.


----------



## Mgizler

tech25 said:


> The AA lights are great, I use one more frequently than my 18650. Not a huge difference in weight and size between the two but the 18650 is more noticeable on the head. I do like the increased runtime and power on the 18650 but find that I tend to keep the 18650 in my bag vs the AA which I can throw in my pocket.




I do love the power of an 18650 light. But the AA platform is definitely easier to carry/pocket.


----------



## JimIslander

Mgizler said:


> Did a little night time magnet fishing last night and did not have a headlamp. I ended up clipping my olight s2r to my hat. Not real fond of this option. I have had a lot of zebra lights in the last 15 years but I have never tried one of the headlamps. After last night I really wanted to pick one up. So I just ordered an H53w a little while ago. I am excited to have a decent head lamp again. I was thinking about going with one of the 600 series headlamps but was unsure of the weight. However, the longer runtime might have made it worth it.



Everyone needs an 18650 headlamp. 

The 600 series headlamps weigh 1.4 oz, less than most AA headlamps (except Zebralight AAs, which weigh 1.1 oz). Figure 1.6 oz for 18650 and you get 3 oz total with 3x-4x more run time than an AA light and twice the max brightness or more (when needed), at the cost of a total additional weight of 1 oz.


----------



## Mgizler

JimIslander said:


> Everyone needs an 18650 headlamp.
> 
> The 600 series headlamps weigh 1.4 oz, less than most AA headlamps (except Zebralight AAs, which weigh 1.1 oz). Figure 1.6 oz for 18650 and you get 3 oz total with 3x-4x more run time than an AA light and twice the max brightness or more (when needed), at the cost of a total additional weight of 1 oz.




I hate you! Hahaha. Now I need to order another headlamp!


----------



## tech25

JimIslander said:


> Everyone needs an 18650 headlamp.
> 
> The 600 series headlamps weigh 1.4 oz, less than most AA headlamps (except Zebralight AAs, which weigh 1.1 oz). Figure 1.6 oz for 18650 and you get 3 oz total with 3x-4x more run time than an AA light and twice the max brightness or more (when needed), at the cost of a total additional weight of 1 oz.



The size/weight ratio between the two isn’t much of a difference. however, on my forehead when moving around, I definitely notice the 18650 more than the AA. I think it has to do with the bracket holding the light, it seems to be designed around the AA/CR123 length and was just made bigger for the 18650 but it’s slightly more unwieldy. 

That being said, I agree that having both are better than trying to decide between the two. Smaller AA for more compact carry but the 18650 for longer runtime and more power. 

For hiking and travel I take the 18650 just to stay with one battery size. (HDS 18650, Malkoff MD2, Convoy C8 and ZL H600fc- might be overkill but not for CPF)


----------



## Slumber

Do the 18650 headlamps work with the same flat top unprotected batteries the SC600's use?


----------



## Mr. LED

Slumber Pass said:


> Do the 18650 headlamps work with the same flat top unprotected batteries the SC600's use?



Yes. Also with protected batteries, because the bodies are a little longer and there’s a spring in the tailcap.


----------



## JimIslander

Slumber Pass said:


> Do the 18650 headlamps work with the same flat top unprotected batteries the SC600's use?



As Mr. LED said, they definitely do. They work with *almost any 18650* due to the long internal size and tail spring, unlike many of the flashlight versions of these lights.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Mr. LED said:


> Yes. Also with protected batteries, because the bodies are a little longer and there’s a spring in the tailcap.



Yeah, I always wondered why Zebralight uses pogo pins in the SC600, but a spring in the H600. I used to think it was to improve conductivity, for the high output of the SC600 Plus. But the H600c uses the same LED (just a high CRI version), and needs the same current. So, obviously a tail-spring is sufficient for the 6-8 amps of current on max. They must use the pogo pins to shave off a millimeter or two of body length. So, why not do that in the headlamps as well?


----------



## Mr. LED

That’s a million dollars question.


----------



## JimIslander

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Yeah, I always wondered why Zebralight uses pogo pins in the SC600, but a spring in the H600. I used to think it was to improve conductivity, for the high output of the SC600 Plus. But the H600c uses the same LED (just a high CRI version), and needs the same current. So, obviously a tail-spring is sufficient for the 6-8 amps of current on max. They must use the pogo pins to shave off a millimeter or two of body length. So, why not do that in the headlamps as well?



That was my guess. Shorter length has been a factor in sales, so maybe catering to that selection criteria to aid sales. I was disappointed when I realized my flashlight couldn't use some of the batteries I have on hand that the headlamp can use with ease. So I standardized on batteries that would work in any of my lights. Got rid of or limit owning lights that can't use standard batteries (i.e. FourSevens Maelstrom MMU-X3R).


----------



## Bob_McBob

Interestingly, my last batch of SC64c LEs has the old-style less textured OP reflector that ZL stopped using in 2017.


----------



## StagMoose

I like the spring over the pogo pins. I don’t care about the minor length it adds.


----------



## Fireclaw18

I don't think the spring adds any length since it can compress flat.

However, I do recall reports saying the spring would get very hot. This is because its a long spring that has no bypass and is not low resistance. The pogo pins should be better for high current output.


----------



## StagMoose

They are also better for denting batteries. I primarily am a Zebralight headlamp user. I prefer other options for pocket carry. Having used their headlamps for nearly a decade I’ve had no issue with the spring. I have had issues with the pogo pins. I think they make a fine product, but for me that is a headlamp. I can see why some folks would like their SC lights, but just not my preference. 

Bit of an apples to oranges comparison, but my Malkoff 1AA smokes the Sc5ii in throw and run time. With only 90 lumens on high the Malkoff throws farther than the 500 lumen Zebralight and runs twice as long. The zebra offers a lot of modes, is smaller and of course likely wouldn’t be run on high constantly. However, the 1AA has a low mode that is just as useful as half the Zebra modes, and a low low sub lumen that works like the zebra, For me. Others might disagree but in my testing that is the conclusion i came to for my uses.


----------



## Mr. LED

The Malkoff may have more throw, but that’s it. Malkoff MDC AA at 90 lumens has a runtime of 1 hour. The SC5 at 92 lumens has 4.9 hours of runtime. Malkoff AA at 9 lumens has 18 hours, SC5 at 8.6 lumens has 48 hours. Malkoff AA at 0.3 lumens has 200 hours, SC5 has 1200 hours. Like you said, APPLES TO ORANGES.


----------



## Random Dan

I'd be interested to see a runtime comparison test. I've no doubt the zebralight is more efficient, but 5x longer runtime at 90lm seems like too huge a difference.


----------



## Mr. LED

You can see on Selfbuilt’s test of the XM-L2 version of the SC5 (https://www.candlepowerforums.com/v...L2)-Review-RUNTIMES-BEAMSHOTS-VIDEO-and-more!), that his results are consistent with specs from Zebralight website. Consider the new version MKII XP-L2 is more efficient, just take a look at the specs and compare with Malkoff’s specs, which I believe are also true due to his reputation.


----------



## StagMoose

Mr. LED said:


> The Malkoff may have more throw, but that’s it. Malkoff MDC AA at 90 lumens has a runtime of 1 hour. The SC5 at 92 lumens has 4.9 hours of runtime. Malkoff AA at 9 lumens has 18 hours, SC5 at 8.6 lumens has 48 hours. Malkoff AA at 0.3 lumens has 200 hours, SC5 has 1200 hours. Like you said, APPLES TO ORANGES.



Right, I guess the point I was making is the the Zebralight even with its higher lumen output, doesn’t provide as much useable light. The 90 lumens of the Malkoff is more useful than the 500 of the Zebralight. The 8 lumens on low mode is more useful than most of the middle range modes of the Zebralight and it will produce them for about a day. 

The lights are apples/ oranges. But in use as a flashlight there is a performance advantage to the Malkoff in my use. I have not tested a Zebralight to see if it reaches its claims, but regarding the useablility of its output, that was the point. The Zebralight has little more than mule level beam profile at given lumens in comparison to the Malkoff. 

Not saying one is bad, but an observation gathered from use. I can try and take some pictures of this as I found it interesting and surprising myself.


----------



## marinemaster

I had the Malkoff 1xAA and ended up selling it. The lumens spacing was not right, was either too bright or too dim. The beam was too narrow. As a utility light it must have a broad beam like the SF Titan AAA does.
My ZL SC 52&53 have great spot and flood combination.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

StagMoose said:


> Right, I guess the point I was making is the the Zebralight even with its higher lumen output, doesn’t provide as much useable light. The 90 lumens of the Malkoff is more useful than the 500 of the Zebralight.



I hate pencil beams, and the tunnel vision that throwers give. For an EDC, I absolutely require some flood.


----------



## Jeffg0330

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> I hate pencil beams, and the tunnel vision that throwers give. For an EDC, I absolutely require some flood.


+1 for needing some EDC flood here too. I’m guessing StagMoose needs lights to reach out for his specific purpose. I’d be interested to see the pics if you take them. BTW has anyone noticed this thread hit 100 pages? Pretty cool


----------



## StagMoose

I tend to use floody headlamps for anything close up or for walking in the woods. I pair that with a more throwy hand held light. I don’t find Pencil beams useful and outside of Mag Lights don’t have any. 

So while the AA zebra lights are very good at what they do, their usefulness to me is limited as my headlamp makes them redundant. 

Not to say they are bad, as I really like Zebralights for a number of reasons. I’m just glad we have so many options in lighting to choose from. 

I live in a rural area with a lot of farmland, so seeing far away across fields is generally important. Most lights i carry need to be able to throw a minimum of 50 yds with useful light.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

If I'm using a headlamp, I'll carry a C8 for throw. I'm not sure why you'd only want 90 lumens if you need to reach out far. Either it's painting a small dot, or it's just not going to reach far anyway. I want at least 1000 lumens in a thrower. That gives some useful throw, without being so narrow it's useless. C8 is great for balancing throw and the size of the light.

If I could only carry 1 outdoor light, it would be the SC600w MkIV HI. It's a great combination of throw, but still enough flood it can be used up close too. Not great indoors, but it's a fantastic all-purpose outdoor EDC.


----------



## StagMoose

The 1AA MDC isn’t a thrower. Maybe I have the wrong impression, but I carry that as a backup light or in a pack. 

Prefer a M61HOT or Surefire EDCL/ LX2 with a more modern head for a smaller carry light. Generally also take a Hound Dog of some flavor. 

Apologies for the confusion.


----------



## mcantu

I'm a little disappointed in Zebralight right now. I ordered an SC64c LE on 6/7 with Priority Mail shipping even though I only live 3 hours away from them. They printed a shipping label on 6/8 and now it's been 3 business days and it still hasn't hit the USPS


----------



## bhds

I have an SC53 on backorder and was wondering, do they send you an email when they finally ship it?


----------



## Robot Mania FU

mcantu said:


> I'm a little disappointed in Zebralight right now. I ordered an SC64c LE on 6/7 with Priority Mail shipping even though I only live 3 hours away from them. They printed a shipping label on 6/8 and now it's been 3 business days and it still hasn't hit the USPS



Have you contacted them? That doesn't seem right at all. I just placed an order with them yesterday and it is already in transit. I hope they get everything sorted out for you.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

It might be USPS. I've had an order stuck in USPS limbo since May 26. The mail system is s**t nowadays. The only luck I've had is from Amazon, because they don't use the public mail system.


----------



## Mgizler

I have really been enjoying my H53w! It has a lot more throw than I expected. The beam color is just about perfect as well. Still waiting on my h600w. The sc52 I picked up on the exchange took a month to get to NYC and is now finally moving in my direction. Hopefully it will be here tomorrow. The h600w will most likely be here next month. I am excited to test it out also! Especially against the h53w.


----------



## AstroTurf

New stock ZL 600 series light clips have changed.


----------



## Mr. LED

AstroTurf said:


> New stock ZL 600 series light clips have changed.



What’s the difference?


----------



## AstroTurf

Old style had a decorative opening and was wider at that point.
New style is thinner, the same width from top to bottom.
I’d say about 3/8” wide.


----------



## Mr. LED

Can you post pics, please?


----------



## AstroTurf

Mr. LED said:


> Can you post pics, please?



I cannot as I do not have a hosting service.

I will send a couple pix to your email address if you pm it to me.

You could then host and post em if you like.

Jim


----------



## AstroTurf

AstroTurf said:


> Old style had a decorative opening and was wider at that point.
> New style is thinner, the same width from top to bottom.
> I’d say about 3/8” wide.


this is what I ordered... http://www.zebralight.com/Pocket-Clip-for-SC80-SC600_p_86.html

this is what I got... http://www.zebralight.com/Pocket-Clip-for-all-H600-and-H60X_p_229.html

the product bags were not mislabeled, and it seems to work fine, so, no harm, no foul.

Jim


----------



## AstroTurf

AstroTurf said:


> this is what I ordered... http://www.zebralight.com/Pocket-Clip-for-SC80-SC600_p_86.html
> 
> this is what I got... http://www.zebralight.com/Pocket-Clip-for-all-H600-and-H60X_p_229.html
> 
> the product bags were not mislabeled, and it seems to work fine, so, no harm, no foul.
> 
> Jim



I should also mention that one of these new style clips came on a ZL Sc600w IV Hi that I received yesterday.


----------



## mcantu

Robot Mania FU said:


> Have you contacted them? That doesn't seem right at all. I just placed an order with them yesterday and it is already in transit. I hope they get everything sorted out for you.



I finally got it. It was supposed to take 2-4 days but it ended up taking 8 days. They didn't ship it until 4 days after they printed the label


----------



## skid00skid00

AstroTurf said:


> I cannot as I do not have a hosting service.
> 
> Jim



It's drag-and-drop easy to use imgur dot com


----------



## Robot Mania FU

mcantu said:


> I finally got it. It was supposed to take 2-4 days but it ended up taking 8 days. They didn't ship it until 4 days after they printed the label



Good to hear. Mine was supposed to be here on the 15th, but the update has been sitting on "the package is moving within the USPS network".


----------



## JimIslander

MY ZEBRALIGHTS. One failure. Put too long a battery into an SC53c. They replaced it no questions asked.

FLASHLIGHTS
SC52 L2 AA Cool White - *Old faithful. CAPABLE OF RUNNING A 14500!*
SC53c AA Neutral Neutral High CRI - Favorite AA
SC53Fc AA Floody Neutral White High CRI
SC600w Mk IV Plus 18650 XHP50.2 Neutral White
SC64w HI 18650 XHP35 Neutral White High Intensity - Love how bright this is, but second choice due to tint
SC64c LE 18650 4000K High CRI Flashlight Limited Edition - Favorite Flashlight; excellent tint and beam profile


HEADLAMPS
H604c 18650 XHP50.2 Flood 4000K High CRI
H604d 18650 XHP50.2 Flood 5000K High CRI - Best for ultra close work
H600w Mk II 18650 XM-L2 Neutral White
H600Fc Mk IV 18650 XHP50.2 Floody 4000K High CRI. Favorite overall Headlamp; excellent tint and beam profile -This is the perfect "outdoor" light. I use it on back country hunts, where I might need to skin an animal and hike back to camp in the dark.
H600Fd Mk IV 18650 XHP50.2 Floody 5000K High CRI
H51 XP-G AA – DESTROYED BY ALKALINE (Duracell AA) - *LAST TIME I EVER USED AN ALKALINE BATTERY*
H52w AA Neutral White
H53Fc AA Floody Neutral White High CRI


----------



## GregGA

Robot Mania FU said:


> Have you contacted them? That doesn't seem right at all. I just placed an order with them yesterday and it is already in transit. I hope they get everything sorted out for you.



I ordered a SC64c LE on Thursday 6/18, shipped 6/19 and received it today, 6/24. It is a beautiful light and will replace my SC 600 II L2 as my EDC. It is amazing the reduction of size they have accomplished in the five years since I bought the 600. The color rendering is excellent.


----------



## JimIslander

GregGA said:


> I ordered a SC64c LE on Thursday 6/18, shipped 6/19 and received it today, 6/24. It is a beautiful light and will replace my SC 600 II L2 as my EDC. It is amazing the reduction of size they have accomplished in the five years since I bought the 600. The color rendering is excellent.



My favorite Zebralight.


----------



## likethevegetable

Been a while since I've been on here! Hope everyone is doing well :twothumbs

JimIslander, impressive collection! I try to be a minimalist with my collection and own the H53c, H600Fc IV, and SC64w HI. I had the Plus but ended up selling it, a bit too comparable to the H600Fc beam and too green a tint for my taste. My only wish at this point from ZL is a 700 model with some decent throw! I really hope COVID hasn't hurt their business too much.


----------



## Mr. LED

likethevegetable said:


> I really hope COVID hasn't hurt their business too much.



Unfortunately it has. The factory told me their production is very slow at the moment.


----------



## PoliceScannerMan

If you were going to get a 4000K CRI flood ZL head lamp would you go with Samsung LH351D or Cree XHP50.2 Neutral White LED??


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

PoliceScannerMan said:


> If you were going to get a 4000K CRI flood ZL head lamp would you go with Samsung LH351D or Cree XHP50.2 Neutral White LED??



I can't speak for the LH351D, but I am pleasantly surprised at the XHP50.2 in the H600Fc. Warm, high CRI, and no green corona. I think the frosted lens certainly helps with that, but the 4000K high CRI XHP50.2 looks a lot nicer than the 4500K regular CRI XHP50.2 they use in the SC600 Plus. Of course, you give up some output for that, but it's a fair trade in a head lamp.


----------



## PoliceScannerMan

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> I can't speak for the LH351D, but I am pleasantly surprised at the XHP50.2 in the H600Fc. Warm, high CRI, and no green corona. I think the frosted lens certainly helps with that, but the 4000K high CRI XHP50.2 looks a lot nicer than the 4500K regular CRI XHP50.2 they use in the SC600 Plus. Of course, you give up some output for that, but it's a fair trade in a head lamp.



Ty for the reply. Yep this would be just a mule type headlamp, no reflector or frosted window.


----------



## DayofReckoning

I don't know how I've been a flashaholic for so long, and never owned a Zebralight. One of the most appealing things to me, while contemplating purchasing one, is that crazy low moonlight mode they can do.

I would like to ask the more knowledgeable folks here about the overall efficiency of the drivers and hardware used in Zebralights, and how the runtime, at a given output, on these lights compare to most of the competition. Is there anything about the Zebralights in this regard that puts them anywhere above what Acebeam, Olight, and Fenix are doing?


----------



## JimIslander

DayofReckoning said:


> I don't know how I've been a flashaholic for so long, and never owned a Zebralight. One of the most appealing things to me, while contemplating purchasing one, is that crazy low moonlight mode they can do.
> 
> I would like to ask the more knowledgeable folks here about the overall efficiency of the drivers and hardware used in Zebralights, and how the runtime, at a given output, on these lights compare to most of the competition. Is there anything about the Zebralights in this regard that puts them anywhere above what Acebeam, Olight, and Fenix are doing?



Literally most of their lights are among the MOST efficient, lightest weight, most compact, and brightest in their class. Also excellent interface. Not all are the number one in each class, but ALL are very good in each class.


----------



## Robot Mania FU

PoliceScannerMan said:


> Ty for the reply. Yep this would be just a mule type headlamp, no reflector or frosted window.



I have both the LH351D (sc64c LE) and the 4000k xhp50.2 (h600fc). The tint on my h600 with the frosted lens is excellent, but still a small step below the LH351D (perfect IMO) and that's coming out of a clear lens. I've never used either out of a mule, but I would imagine the LH351D would look much better than the xhp50.2 with no diffusion.


----------



## JimIslander

Robot Mania FU said:


> I have both the LH351D (sc64c LE) and the 4000k xhp50.2 (h600fc). The tint on my h600 with the frosted lens is excellent, but still a small step below the LH351D (perfect IMO) and that's coming out of a clear lens. I've never used either out of a mule, but I would imagine the LH351D would look much better than the xhp50.2 with no diffusion.



I agree that of those two the LE has the best tint to my eyes. In fact, SC64c LE is my favorite flashlight, and I have many.


----------



## PoliceScannerMan

Robot Mania FU said:


> I have both the LH351D (sc64c LE) and the 4000k xhp50.2 (h600fc). The tint on my h600 with the frosted lens is excellent, but still a small step below the LH351D (perfect IMO) and that's coming out of a clear lens. I've never used either out of a mule, but I would imagine the LH351D would look much better than the xhp50.2 with no diffusion.



Perfect thank you!!


----------



## AstroTurf

depends on your battery of choice...

i have both a h503c and a h604c. both mules, both hi cri, both 4000k tints, both with no hint of yellow or green to me.

so it really comes down to power source, power level, and weight.

had i it all over to do again, i would still own both. bigger for work, smaller for around the house.

Jim



PoliceScannerMan said:


> If you were going to get a 4000K CRI flood ZL head lamp would you go with Samsung LH351D or Cree XHP50.2 Neutral White LED??


----------



## Robot Mania FU

Now if only they could make an sc32 with a 4000k LH351D


----------



## Mr. LED

Robot Mania FU said:


> Now if only they could make an sc32 with a 4000k LH351D



Oh yeah


----------



## likethevegetable

PoliceScannerMan said:


> If you were going to get a 4000K CRI flood ZL head lamp would you go with Samsung LH351D or Cree XHP50.2 Neutral White LED??



My sentiments are the same as WalkIntoTheLite: My H600Fc IV has a great tint, no green at all, but my SC600w IV Plus was pretty darn green so I sold it. I don't have the Samsung LED to compare, but I've heard it's nice.


----------



## Mgizler

Finally got my sc52l2, h600 L2, and I actually picked up a new without box sc5w II. !! Man I love the SC5w. It was the zebralight that I missed the most out of all the ones I had. 

The sc52 is nice also I need I get a 14500 in it. 

I also can’t wait to test out the h600!!


----------



## DayofReckoning

Is there any difference between the SC64 and the SC600 when it comes to, lack of a better term, "beefiness"? Body tube thickness, etc? I see it weighs more than the SC64, obviously because it's larger, but wasn't sure if that's due to just the size difference, or if the SC600 had any of a more thicker, "beefier" design. Does it feel any more solid in the hand? 

And just FWIW, I've been agonizing over the Zebralight website for days, on the fence about a first Zebralight purchase.


----------



## AstroTurf

DayofReckoning said:


> Is there any difference between the SC64 and the SC600 when it comes to, lack of a better term, "beefiness"? Body tube thickness, etc? I see it weighs more than the SC64, obviously because it's larger, but wasn't sure if that's due to just the size difference, or if the SC600 had any of a more thicker, "beefier" design. Does it feel any more solid in the hand?
> 
> And just FWIW, I've been agonizing over the Zebralight website for days, on the fence about a first Zebralight purchase.



Yes, it is thicker/beefier...

Same interior battery compartment, thicker body walls, bigger head, better heat management... Sc600 Wins!!!

Which one ya gettin?


----------



## DayofReckoning

AstroTurf said:


> Yes, it is thicker/beefier...
> 
> Same interior battery compartment, thicker body walls, bigger head, better heat management... Sc600 Wins!!!
> 
> Which one ya gettin?



Since your comment, I'm leaning towards the SC600W MK IV Plus, I just wish it came with the new Samsung LH351D as an option.


----------



## AstroTurf

DayofReckoning said:


> Since your comment, I'm leaning towards the SC600W MK IV Plus, I just wish it came with the new Samsung LH351D as an option.



Got one... awfully green

Sc600w mk iv hi would be my recommendation, or

The Sc64c le is a very nice light also.

Jim


----------



## DayofReckoning

AstroTurf said:


> Got one... awfully green
> 
> Sc600w mk iv hi would be my recommendation, or
> 
> The Sc64c le is a very nice light also.
> 
> Jim



Green bad, green not good. Thanks for the heads up and suggestions. I'm still pondering over the different models.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

I have the 600 Plus and 600 HI. I don't find the Plus too green, but there's definitely some of it in the corona. The HI has a very nice tint, even and clean with no green. But those lights serve very different purposes, so decide what you plan to use it for, before making the decision on which to get. The HI is great for a compact all-purpose outdoor light that has some useful throw. The Plus is a much floodier light, great for lighting up a wider area, but won't throw as far.

I use the Plus as a bike light, which it's really great at. Very efficient, bright, and lights up a wide area. I use the HI as an outdoor light on walks. It's great for moderate throw, but still has enough spill to make it useful up close.


----------



## noboneshotdog

DayofReckoning said:


> Green bad, green not good. Thanks for the heads up and suggestions. I'm still pondering over the different models.



SC600 W HI is a bit beefier has a nice tint and some decent throw. A little chunky in the pocket and not a great clip. It's a push on clip which lessens how securely it holds.

SC64C LE is slimmer in the pocket, had a great tint and a fixed pocket clip that is screwed to the body.

The SV600 W HI will be better for longer distance but still good for medium and maybe close up work if you don't mind the glare from the hot spot

SC64C LE will be more general purpose including close up use, but not much throw.


----------



## this_is_nascar

I've been involved in flashlights for many years and I just got my 1st ZebraLight.

ZebraLight SC64w HI

So far, I'm enjoying it.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## AstroTurf

Congrats!!!



this_is_nascar said:


> I've been involved in flashlights for many years and I just got my 1st ZebraLight.
> 
> ZebraLight SC64w HI
> 
> So far, I'm enjoying it.
> 
> 
> Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## DayofReckoning

The advice is very much appreciated guys.

I've narowed it down to the SC600w Mk IV, but torn between the HI and the Plus. With it's higher output and better efficiency, I would choose the Plus, but I also love throw and small, punchy hotspots, and I'm wondering if the throw and hotspot of the HI is worth the tradeoff. WITL makes it sound like it is.

Are there any Lux measurements around on these two lights? Or can owners give me a rough estimate of what either throws? 

Thanks


----------



## DayofReckoning

this_is_nascar said:


> I've been involved in flashlights for many years and I just got my 1st ZebraLight.
> 
> ZebraLight SC64w HI
> 
> So far, I'm enjoying it.
> 
> 
> Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk



Can I ask what your first impressions were on build, fit and finish?


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

DayofReckoning said:


> The advice is very much appreciated guys.
> 
> I've narowed it down to the SC600w Mk IV, but torn between the HI and the Plus. With it's higher output and better efficiency, I would choose the Plus, but I also love throw and small, punchy hotspots, and I'm wondering if the throw and hotspot of the HI is worth the tradeoff. WITL makes it sound like it is.
> 
> Are there any Lux measurements around on these two lights? Or can owners give me a rough estimate of what either throws?
> 
> Thanks



Yeah, if you're only going to get one of those lights, the HI is probably a better choice. It's much more useful as an all-purpose outdoor light. Enough throw to be useful, but not so much that it's useless up close.

IIRC, the HI has a little under 20K candella. I think the Plus is close to that as well (perhaps a bit less than the HI), but remember that the Plus is twice as bright. You don't get to see as far with the Plus, because all the foreground brightness kills your vision to see very far. So, don't just go by the lux numbers.


----------



## NPL

I owned both, kept the sc600w Hi. They serve a different purpose. The Plus is good for up close, but it's very floody so not ideal for longer distances. On turbo it does have OK reach, but it will overheat and step down. The Plus also has a pretty strong Green tint. The Hi has a nice pure white tint, feels significantly brighter because of the added intensity, and outdoors feels much more useful. I find the Hi too throwy for indoor use but can manage if it's my only light. 

Sent from my Pixel using Candlepowerforums mobile app


----------



## noboneshotdog

NPL said:


> I owned both, kept the sc600w Hi. They serve a different purpose. The Plus is good for up close, but it's very floody so not ideal for longer distances. On turbo it does have OK reach, but it will overheat and step down. The Plus also has a pretty strong Green tint. The Hi has a nice pure white tint, feels significantly brighter because of the added intensity, and outdoors feels much more useful. I find the Hi too throwy for indoor use but can manage if it's my only light.
> 
> Sent from my Pixel using Candlepowerforums mobile app



I've had the same exact experience. Sold the PLUS and kept the HI.


----------



## this_is_nascar

DayofReckoning said:


> Can I ask what your first impressions were on build, fit and finish?


1st impression was concerning how small it is for a 18650 light. I love it's compact size. I've been EDCing it and enjoying it. It took me a bit to fully understand how to config the interface, but I got the hang of it. I love the range of brightness and the tint is great. Build quality is excellent from what I've seen.

If I had one complaint, it would be concerning how tight the tolerances are for which 18650 you use. I have 18650 lights that will run on whatever you have, allowing you to use use 2xCR123 if needed.

The way the ZL is made, there is very small tolerances for length of cell used. You can only use unprotected flat top cell. I wouldn't have minded an extra 1/4 inch in length, if it could except all 18650 cells.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## DayofReckoning

Everyone have has been [FONT=Verdana,Arial,Tahoma,Calibri,Geneva,sans-serif]exponentially[/FONT] helpful.

I'm sold. SC600w Mk IV _*HI*_ it is.


----------



## AstroTurf

DayofReckoning said:


> Everyone have has been [FONT=Verdana,Arial,Tahoma,Calibri,Geneva,sans-serif]exponentially[/FONT] helpful.
> 
> I'm sold. SC600w Mk IV _*HI*_ it is.



Good Choice!!!


----------



## MB320

Realised yesterday that ZL have removed free shipping to UK/EU for now with the only option being DHL $42! Guess that’s one way to stop me from buying more...


----------



## Mr. LED

MB320 said:


> Realised yesterday that ZL have removed free shipping to UK/EU for now with the only option being DHL $42! Guess that’s one way to stop me from buying more...



Buy from www.nkon.nl

Corona has been cruel with shipping, no flights, etc...


----------



## MB320

Yeah I probably will, always had good experiences from them. Although they’ve had to hike their prices in response it seems! Oh well.


----------



## Jimmyboots

Is Zebralight known for taking their time shipping items that are in stock? I got a order shipped email on the 7th but it’s been in preshipping status the whole time.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

MB320 said:


> Realised yesterday that ZL have removed free shipping to UK/EU for now with the only option being DHL $42! Guess that’s one way to stop me from buying more...



Yeah, I know. It's already stopped me from buying a light this summer. It's almost like Zebralight is trying to wreck their business. No new models for the past couple of years (other than maybe an LED swap). Now, ridiculous shipping costs. I don't get it. They ship from China (for non US orders), so why drop the cheaper options? I'm not getting this kind of restriction from other companies.



Jimmyboots said:


> Is Zebralight known for taking their time shipping items that are in stock? I got a order shipped email on the 7th but it’s been in preshipping status the whole time.



I find they usually take 3 or 4 days to really ship, after they send out the email. It will probably be shipped tomorrow (Monday).


----------



## MB320

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Yeah, I know. It's already stopped me from buying a light this summer. It's almost like Zebralight is trying to wreck their business. No new models for the past couple of years (other than maybe an LED swap). Now, ridiculous shipping costs. I don't get it. They ship from China (for non US orders), so why drop the cheaper options? I'm not getting this kind of restriction from other companies.
> 
> 
> 
> I find they usually take 3 or 4 days to really ship, after they send out the email. It will probably be shipped tomorrow (Monday).



Yeah, I’m pretty disappointed. Generally wouldn’t consider any other brand however there’s no way I’m paying that sort of money for shipping from the same place I’ve ordered multiple lights from for free. Hope they bring cheaper options back.


----------



## DayofReckoning

Hey guys, just a little update here. When debating between the SC600w Mk IV HI and Plus, I reevaluated how I would be using the light, and actually ended up choosing the Plus, as I felt it's higher output and more floody beam may be more useful to me. I received the SC600W MK IV Plus yesterday, and spent the day and night using it, experimenting with the UI, comparing to other lights, etc.

To say that I am completely filled with disappointment and regret would be an understatement. Disappointment and regret, in that I wasted so much time, money, and effort buying other lights, searching for that light that checks all the boxes, and is everything I ever wanted a light to be, when I could have just gotten a Zebralight in the first place. 

The UI and it's sheer versatility, the beam quality, the quality of the anodization, the quality of the threads, the construction of the body and components, I couldn't be more impressed. 

The Zebralight hype is real, and it's completely justified. I'm glad to be part of the club now. I need a AA Zebralight now!


----------



## Lou Minescence

DayofReckoning I agree that a Zebralight stands the test of time. The main reason I like them is the mode spacing and compact size. Most lights now go from 7 - 30 lumens for a low to 200, 500,1000 etc and that is too much of a jump between spacing to be useful to me. I like the high top ends lights have now but lower useful levels are forgotten. Zebralight philosophy remains the best overall.
Money wasted on other lights ?
Maybe but it was fun too.


----------



## DayofReckoning

Absolutely, Zebralight allows you to choose whatever output that is of your liking, with spacing that is as big, or as small as you would like.

One thing important to note, the Zebralight UI appears to be extremely complicated and hard to learn when one is reading the instructions. However, once in hand, it took only a few moments to master the UI. I love it.


----------



## JStraus

DayofReckoning said:


> Hey guys, just a little update here. When debating between the SC600w Mk IV HI and Plus, I reevaluated how I would be using the light, and actually ended up choosing the Plus, as I felt it's higher output and more floody beam may be more useful to me. I received the SC600W MK IV Plus yesterday, and spent the day and night using it, experimenting with the UI, comparing to other lights, etc.
> 
> To say that I am completely filled with disappointment and regret would be an understatement. Disappointment and regret, in that I wasted so much time, money, and effort buying other lights, searching for that light that checks all the boxes, and is everything I ever wanted a light to be, when I could have just gotten a Zebralight in the first place.
> 
> The UI and it's sheer versatility, the beam quality, the quality of the anodization, the quality of the threads, the construction of the body and components, I couldn't be more impressed.
> 
> The Zebralight hype is real, and it's completely justified. I'm glad to be part of the club now. I need a AA Zebralight now!




Oh man, I kinda cringe everytime I see pics of 8 different D4V2CXTiYZW3A's on someone's bench. I have a few, to be sure, but I have more ZL's because they all pretty much fill a different purpose, and are all much better built lights.


----------



## this_is_nascar

I've owned my ZebraLight SC64w HI for a few weeks now and really love it.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## DayofReckoning

Biggest criticism I have so far is that the model numbers and choices on the website are very confusing. Also is confusing as to why they build a light of this price and quality, and don't use AR coatings on the glass. Not a big deal, I'm certain the difference in output is marginal at best, but still.

Looking at the pogo pins, I think if there was a pin in the center, a protected cell would work. It's just the length that would be an issue, these are unbelievably small for an 18650 light.


----------



## Jimmyboots

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> I find they usually take 3 or 4 days to really ship, after they send out the email. It will probably be shipped tomorrow (Monday).




I got the light in yesterday. It’s so much smaller than I expected. It’s a gift and I’m sure it will be appreciated. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

DayofReckoning said:


> Biggest criticism I have so far is that the model numbers and choices on the website are very confusing. Also is confusing as to why they build a light of this price and quality, and don't use AR coatings on the glass. Not a big deal, I'm certain the difference in output is marginal at best, but still.



Out of all my Zebralights, only my SC52w (original version, bought as a pre-order) doesn't have AR coatings. All my others do. I'm not sure why they didn't use a coating on the SC52w. Perhaps to minimize tint shift, or perhaps they just forgot in the early production units.

Anyone else have a SC52w without AR coatings?

Anyway, I do believe they use AR coating on almost all their lights. Are their any current models that don't?

Disclaimer: I'm actually not sure if my frosted lens Zebra has an AR coating. I'm going by how the light reflects off the glass. Hard to tell with the frosting.


----------



## likethevegetable

I like your 'disappointed' sentiment, DayofReckoning. I agree, ZebraLights are collection killers, hah.


----------



## DayofReckoning

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Out of all my Zebralights, only my SC52w (original version, bought as a pre-order) doesn't have AR coatings. All my others do. I'm not sure why they didn't use a coating on the SC52w. Perhaps to minimize tint shift, or perhaps they just forgot in the early production units.
> 
> Anyone else have a SC52w without AR coatings?
> 
> Anyway, I do believe they use AR coating on almost all their lights. Are their any current models that don't?
> 
> Disclaimer: I'm actually not sure if my frosted lens Zebra has an AR coating. I'm going by how the light reflects off the glass. Hard to tell with the frosting.



I'm not certain. The website only say's "optical grade glass". I looked at some pictures of the SC600W IV from a few years ago, and the pics almost look like it is AR coated. I ordered mine straight from Zebralight, so surely this is a newer sample. Perhaps they went against using the AR coating on newer lights due to complaints about it affecting the tint, which can happen with some coatings.

Hopefully, some others can chime in.


----------



## DayofReckoning

Spent a few minutes looking around at this topic of AR coated glass on the Zebralights. From what I can gather, it almost appears as though there is no consistency as to what lights, and when, get the treatment.

FWIW, my Acebeam X45II has a heavy AR coating, and I could swear that it is negatively effecting the tint. Also ran across a few reports from users that the AR coating was causing a colored ring in the spill of their Zebralight.

With the bad tint shift of these emitters, perhaps no coating is for the better.


----------



## this_is_nascar

DayofReckoning said:


> Biggest criticism I have so far is that the model numbers and choices on the website are very confusing. Also is confusing as to why they build a light of this price and quality, and don't use AR coatings on the glass. Not a big deal, I'm certain the difference in output is marginal at best, but still.
> 
> Looking at the pogo pins, I think if there was a pin in the center, a protected cell would work. It's just the length that would be an issue, these are unbelievably small for an 18650 light.


When I asked the same question, the ZL experts told me they don't use an AR coated lens because it could promote tint-shift.

I've never heard of that, but I thought its lack of presence was strange myself.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## this_is_nascar

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Out of all my Zebralights, only my SC52w (original version, bought as a pre-order) doesn't have AR coatings. All my others do. I'm not sure why they didn't use a coating on the SC52w. Perhaps to minimize tint shift, or perhaps they just forgot in the early production units.
> 
> Anyone else have a SC52w without AR coatings?
> 
> Anyway, I do believe they use AR coating on almost all their lights. Are their any current models that don't?
> 
> Disclaimer: I'm actually not sure if my frosted lens Zebra has an AR coating. I'm going by how the light reflects off the glass. Hard to tell with the frosting.


My recently purchased SC64w HI does not have an AR coated lens.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## DayofReckoning

Thanks for confirming ThisisNascar.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

I take back my earlier statement about AR coatings. Upon closer inspection of 5 lights I have handy right now, only 2 of them appear to have AR coatings. (SC52 cool white, and SC600 MkIV HI.) Another 3 don't (SC52w, SC64 HI, and H600 Fc mkIV).

However, only the SC52w appears to have a strong reflection off the internal glass, so it's noticeable. The glass on the other ones appears to sort of act like it has an AR coating, but without the purple reflection you see with the usual AR coatings. So, I'm guessing they don't have an AR coating.

In any case, yeah, it does appear somewhat random!


----------



## Buck91

DayofReckoning said:


> Hey guys, just a little update here. When debating between the SC600w Mk IV HI and Plus, I reevaluated how I would be using the light, and actually ended up choosing the Plus, as I felt it's higher output and more floody beam may be more useful to me. I received the SC600W MK IV Plus yesterday, and spent the day and night using it, experimenting with the UI, comparing to other lights, etc.
> 
> To say that I am completely filled with disappointment and regret would be an understatement. Disappointment and regret, in that I wasted so much time, money, and effort buying other lights, searching for that light that checks all the boxes, and is everything I ever wanted a light to be, when I could have just gotten a Zebralight in the first place.
> 
> The UI and it's sheer versatility, the beam quality, the quality of the anodization, the quality of the threads, the construction of the body and components, I couldn't be more impressed.
> 
> The Zebralight hype is real, and it's completely justified. I'm glad to be part of the club now. I need a AA Zebralight now!




99% how I feel about my sc64w. If only it could accept primaries “just in case.”


----------



## Mgizler

They are truly fantastic lights. I recently picked up an h600w MKII and I could not be happier. I do not know why I waited so long to get a headlamp like this.


----------



## Robot Mania FU

DayofReckoning said:


> Hey guys, just a little update here. When debating between the SC600w Mk IV HI and Plus, I reevaluated how I would be using the light, and actually ended up choosing the Plus, as I felt it's higher output and more floody beam may be more useful to me. I received the SC600W MK IV Plus yesterday, and spent the day and night using it, experimenting with the UI, comparing to other lights, etc.
> 
> To say that I am completely filled with disappointment and regret would be an understatement. Disappointment and regret, in that I wasted so much time, money, and effort buying other lights, searching for that light that checks all the boxes, and is everything I ever wanted a light to be, when I could have just gotten a Zebralight in the first place.
> 
> The UI and it's sheer versatility, the beam quality, the quality of the anodization, the quality of the threads, the construction of the body and components, I couldn't be more impressed.
> 
> The Zebralight hype is real, and it's completely justified. I'm glad to be part of the club now. I need a AA Zebralight now!




There it is. The initial realization that you don't need to buy a bunch of lights anymore, quickly followed by wanting more zebralights. The sc32w ended my need for an edc light.....but then I needed a headlamp and in came the h600fc....but then why would I edc a 16340 light when I have so many 18650's?....then came the sc64c LE and so on.....and so on. Welcome to the club of never "needing" to buy another light again.....until you want another zebralight


----------



## this_is_nascar

If I had one complaint about my ZebraLight SC64w HI, it would be its inability to use whatever 18650 I have lying around.

I would have not minded an additional 1/4 in length to accommodate a larger spring or tailcap that would allow button top and/or protected cells. I would also have liked it to be able to accommodate 2xcr123 like many other 1x18650 lights.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

this_is_nascar said:


> If I had one complaint about my ZebraLight SC64w HI, it would be its inability to use whatever 18650 I have lying around.
> 
> I would have not minded an additional 1/4 in length to accommodate a larger spring or tailcap that would allow button top and/or protected cells. I would also have liked it to be able to accommodate 2xcr123 like many other 1x18650 lights.



I might agree for the larger SC600 light format. But for the SC64 pocket EDC format, size is critical for me. I really like that it's not much larger than a small AA light. Besides, almost all my cells are flat-top unprotected, which fit great. I also don't really see the need for running primaries. They probably wouldn't provide enough power, and they're bloody expensive. The only situation they make sense is in extreme cold, and even then lithium-ion can still work (just not as well).




WalkIntoTheLight said:


> I take back my earlier statement about AR coatings. Upon closer inspection of 5 lights I have handy right now, only 2 of them appear to have AR coatings. (SC52 cool white, and SC600 MkIV HI.) Another 3 don't (SC52w, SC64 HI, and H600 Fc mkIV).
> 
> However, only the SC52w appears to have a strong reflection off the internal glass, so it's noticeable. The glass on the other ones appears to sort of act like it has an AR coating, but without the purple reflection you see with the usual AR coatings. So, I'm guessing they don't have an AR coating.
> 
> In any case, yeah, it does appear somewhat random!



One more data point: just checked my SC600w IV Plus, and it does have an AR coating. So, it's 50% so far. Go figure.


----------



## !mprovise

My favorite ZL is the little H52. While not the best at any one thing, it checks a lot of boxes for versatility.


----------



## DayofReckoning

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> I might agree for the larger SC600 light format. But for the SC64 pocket EDC format, size is critical for me. I really like that it's not much larger than a small AA light. Besides, almost all my cells are flat-top unprotected, which fit great. I also don't really see the need for running primaries. They probably wouldn't provide enough power, and they're bloody expensive. The only situation they make sense is in extreme cold, and even then lithium-ion can still work (just not as well).
> 
> 
> 
> 
> One more data point: just checked my SC600w IV Plus, and it does have an AR coating. So, it's 50% so far. Go figure.



When judging whether a piece of glass has AR coatings, keep in mind that AR coatings should be detectible solely on color (usually green or purple) reflected when holding the glass at the correct angle. The actual amount of reflections, or lack of, cannot be used to judge whether or not a glass contains AR coatings, but instead judged upon whether there are any visible colors on the glass.

As an optics enthusiast for a sizeable amount of time, I have yet to see a piece glass that was AR coated that didn't have some type of color present in the coating.

Is your SC600w IV Plus an early model? Perhaps the first few batches contained the coatings, then they were dropped later on?


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Yeah, the SC600 IV Plus reflects a greenish image, so it definitely has an AR coating. The other 2 zebras have a purple reflection, so they must use a different kind of AR coating.

I can't recall if my SC600 Plus was an early model. I don't think it was a pre-order, but I did buy it fairly soon after it was released.


----------



## JimIslander

Green reflection = 9-layer coating. Purple is 6. Green is best, but both are very good in flashlights.


----------



## this_is_nascar

JimIslander said:


> Green reflection = 9-layer coating. Purple is 6. Green is best, but both are very good in flashlights.


Good to know. I've only ever seen it in purple.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## gottawearshades

YES!

I love these lights, but this choice on ZL's part (making a flashlight that runs at 6v but can't fit primaries) continues to give me a pain in the pain receiver.



this_is_nascar said:


> If I had one complaint about my ZebraLight SC64w HI, it would be its inability to use whatever 18650 I have lying around.
> 
> I would have not minded an additional 1/4 in length to accommodate a larger spring or tailcap that would allow button top and/or protected cells. I would also have liked it to be able to accommodate 2xcr123 like many other 1x18650 lights.
> 
> 
> Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## DayofReckoning

I guess no light in existence will ever be "perfect", maybe some have found it, but had the Zebralight been able to take CR123's in a pinch, it would put it that much closer to perfection. 

I want a SC700D with a smooth reflector and XHP35 HI. Trying not to hold my breathe though, don't see it happening.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

DayofReckoning said:


> I want a SC700D with a smooth reflector and XHP35 HI. Trying not to hold my breathe though, don't see it happening.



Yeah, throwers aren't really their thing. Though, the SC600w HI is a step in that direction. Have you given it a try? Definitely wouldn't throw as well as a SC700 model with the same emitter, but the SC600 HI is decent enough for such a small light.


----------



## DayofReckoning

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Yeah, throwers aren't really their thing. Though, the SC600w HI is a step in that direction. Have you given it a try? Definitely wouldn't throw as well as a SC700 model with the same emitter, but the SC600 HI is decent enough for such a small light.



Oh, I've been contemplating over all the different models, that's for sure, including the HI. I know the current AA models aren't the best when compared to the previous model, but I would still like one.

Right now, I'm trying to justify the increased cost, size, and weight of the SC5C MKII, but I'm having difficulty doing so when the SC53c is there.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

DayofReckoning said:


> Oh, I've been contemplating over all the different models, that's for sure, including the HI. I know the current AA models aren't the best when compared to the previous model, but I would still like one.
> 
> Right now, I'm trying to justify the increased cost, size, and weight of the SC5C MKII, but I'm having difficulty doing so when the SC53c is there.



I find the SC5 gives much more throw than the SC52/SC53. Not just because it's a bit brighter, but it uses a larger reflector which makes for a much tighter hot-spot.

The SC5 is kind of like the AA equivalent to the 18650 SC600 HI. The SC53 is like the 18650 SC64.


----------



## DayofReckoning

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> I find the SC5 gives much more throw than the SC52/SC53. Not just because it's a bit brighter, but it uses a larger reflector which makes for a much tighter hot-spot.
> 
> The SC5 is kind of like the AA equivalent to the 18650 SC600 HI. The SC53 is like the 18650 SC64.



Thanks for the reference WITL. I was leaning towards the SC53 only based on trying to get the smallest, lightest Zebralight I can get.


----------



## AstroTurf

smallest would be an h model.



DayofReckoning said:


> Thanks for the reference WITL. I was leaning towards the SC53 only based on trying to get the smallest, lightest Zebralight I can get.


----------



## DayofReckoning

AstroTurf said:


> smallest would be an h model.



Had the Fenix LD15R, couldn't get used to the right angle in hand, never felt right.


----------



## AstroTurf

ah, understood...

how about the difference in total lumens? sc53 vs sc5



DayofReckoning said:


> Had the Fenix LD15R, couldn't get used to the right angle in hand, never felt right.


----------



## DayofReckoning

AstroTurf said:


> ah, understood...
> 
> how about the difference in total lumens? sc53 vs sc5



The AA capacity isn't great in the first place, and that burst of the sc5 is likely to drain the cell quickly, so I imagine those extra lumens would have to be used sparingly. It's hard when you don't have both in hand, I'm thinking the smaller size and weight of the sc53 in pocket might be worth the tradeoff of lower throw and max brightness.


----------



## AstroTurf

agreed


----------



## JimIslander

I agree. 53 is about my max size for EDC, so I would carry it over the 5 any day. For work it's 18650 lights. I especially like the LE.


----------



## AstroTurf

i find the 53 to be slippery, compared to the 5 knurling, which feels very secure in my hand.


----------



## JimIslander

JimIslander said:


> I agree. 53 is about my max size for EDC, so I would carry it over the 5 any day. For work it's 18650 lights. I especially like the LE.



I run mine with a clip. It gives me a a reference point for the button too.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

DayofReckoning said:


> The AA capacity isn't great in the first place, and that burst of the sc5 is likely to drain the cell quickly, so I imagine those extra lumens would have to be used sparingly. It's hard when you don't have both in hand, I'm thinking the smaller size and weight of the sc53 in pocket might be worth the tradeoff of lower throw and max brightness.



Yeah, IIRC, I think the max brightness on the SC5w gives me about 20-25 minutes of run time. (Stepping it back to full output every 3 minutes, because it ramps down with a hard-coded 3-minute timer.) Using a standard Eneloop. You'd get a bit better run-time with an Eneloop Pro.

I think it makes a decent light for outdoors, due the tighter hot-spot. However, I prefer 18650 lights for outdoors. So, I generally prefer the smaller SC53 size for a AA light. With a AA light, I don't really need the 500 lumens of the SC5.


----------



## DayofReckoning

Although subjective, I think the SC5 is the better looking light, and I don't like the shiny ano on the SC53. On the other hand, an advantage of the SC53 is that it has a lower moonlight mode versus the SC5.

Kind of off topic, but I wish there were a viable spot on these lights to try and have some Tritium installed. I think the heat fins of the SC600w are too small.


----------



## holygeez03

Did I read above that the SC600 Plus AR coating might have switched from purple to green? I have a pre-order model and the only negative thing I can say about the light is the outer purple ring that it has... especially when using it with snow covered ground. I am pretty sure it is caused by the shiny steel bezel reflecting light back onto the lens.

I'd be curious if this has been improved... I have also considered painting the shiny bezel.


----------



## DayofReckoning

holygeez03 said:


> Did I read above that the SC600 Plus AR coating might have switched from purple to green? I have a pre-order model and the only negative thing I can say about the light is the outer purple ring that it has... especially when using it with snow covered ground. I am pretty sure it is caused by the shiny steel bezel reflecting light back onto the lens.
> 
> I'd be curious if this has been improved... I have also considered painting the shiny bezel.



My SC600W Plus I received last week, which surely is newer stock, has no coating. Thisisnascar just received an Sc64 and it has no coating. He says Zebralight told them him they dropped it due to it promoting tint shift, which I believe to be true.


----------



## holygeez03

DayofReckoning said:


> My SC600W Plus I received last week, which surely is newer stock, has no coating. Thisisnascar just received an Sc64 and it has no coating. He says Zebralight told them him they dropped it due to it promoting tint shift, which I believe to be true.




Interesting... who wants to trade me a SC600w Plus without the coating for one with a coating?


----------



## AstroTurf

maybe zebralight...

shoot em a message complaining of an ugly tint shift.

keep us posted, as i may do the same thing.



holygeez03 said:


> Interesting... who wants to trade me a SC600w Plus without the coating for one with a coating?


----------



## this_is_nascar

DayofReckoning said:


> My SC600W Plus I received last week, which surely is newer stock, has no coating. Thisisnascar just received an Sc64 and it has no coating. He says Zebralight told them him they dropped it due to it promoting tint shift, which I believe to be true.


No, ZL didn't tell me that. Another user suggested that may be the reasoning.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## DayofReckoning

this_is_nascar said:


> When I asked the same question, *the ZL experts* told me they don't use an AR coated lens because it could promote tint-shift.
> 
> I've never heard of that, but I thought its lack of presence was strange myself.
> 
> 
> Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk





this_is_nascar said:


> No, ZL didn't tell me that. Another user suggested that may be the reasoning.
> 
> 
> Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk



Sorry, I mistook "Zebralight Experts" as in Zebralight themselves.

On another note, in some pictures I've seen, the SC700D, with it's XHP70.2, which is notorious for tint shift, looks to have AR coated glass :shrug:


----------



## AstroTurf

mine, in hand, does not look to have any ar on its lens?!?

go figure?



DayofReckoning said:


> On another note, in some pictures I've seen, the SC700D, with it's XHP70.2, which is notorious for tint shift, looks to have AR coated glass :shrug:


----------



## this_is_nascar

No problem. I can see where my response could be interpreted that way. The consensus of the group in the discussion was the lack of the AR coating was to avoid tint shift, etc. Made sense to me and it was something I never thought of.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## DayofReckoning

Had a moment of weakness guys  Worse yet, I drug this thread into talking about AA's, then ordered an SC700d last night. :sigh:


----------



## AstroTurf

DayofReckoning said:


> Had a moment of weakness guys  Worse yet, I drug this thread into talking about AA's, then ordered an SC700d last night. :sigh:



A good light


----------



## DayofReckoning

AstroTurf said:


> A good light



I don't doubt. Will be interesting to see the riddle of what kind of glass it comes with. When did you buy yours BTW?


----------



## AstroTurf

Prolly about March


----------



## Derek Dean

DayofReckoning, the SC700d is a bodacious light. The fit and finish of the light I received was outstanding, more like sculpture, just beautiful, and it must be among the most versatile lights available, with such a wide range, from super duper low moonlight mode all the way to a blinding wall of light, and everything inbetween. It fits nicely in a jacket pocket too. I'll look forward to hearing your impressions once you receive yours. 

I too recently succumbed to my ZL weakness and ordered an H600Fd, my first ZL headlamp, so I'll look forward to checking that out.


----------



## DayofReckoning

Derek Dean said:


> DayofReckoning, the SC700d is a bodacious light. The fit and finish of the light I received was outstanding, more like sculpture, just beautiful, and it must be among the most versatile lights available, with such a wide range, from super duper low moonlight mode all the way to a blinding wall of light, and everything inbetween. It fits nicely in a jacket pocket too. I'll look forward to hearing your impressions once you receive yours.
> 
> I too recently succumbed to my ZL weakness and ordered an H600Fd, my first ZL headlamp, so I'll look forward to checking that out.



Derek, thank you for your comment. Make no mistake, I'm no spring chicken to lights, and I dare bring another brands name here, but I own my share of Surefire's from their heyday, and owned more than a few Malkoff, and one week after owning this SC600W Plus, I still cannot get over the quality of the machining and anodizing, the sheer amazement of it's engineering and efficiency, and the flawless beam. Truly the best of the best. The potted electronics and Company being based here in the US is the cherry on top.

And I'm going to make another bold claim here that liable to rustle some feathers. After using the Zebralight UI for a week, and seeing how quickly and painlessly it becomes second nature, I'm going to proclaim that it's the BEST UI on the market, and here we go boys, even better than a Rotary. I say that because the Zebralight allows for you to access 3 different custom brightness levels of your choosing *instantly*. I can think of no other light that can do that.


----------



## SYZYGY

*Re: The Official Zebralight Thread*



DayofReckoning said:


> After using the Zebralight UI for a week, and seeing how quickly and painlessly it becomes second nature, I'm going to proclaim that it's the BEST UI on the market, and here we go boys, even better than a Rotary. I say that because the Zebralight allows for you to access 3 different custom brightness levels of your choosing *instantly*. I can think of no other light that can do that.



i'm a fan of it, too. but here are my complaints...

first, it would be nice to be able to move the strobe around instead of being forced to use 3 clicks to enter that mode. what if someone wants to be all tacticool and have 1-click strobe? or long-press strobe?

next, and this one is getting into the limitations of having a single-button UI.. having to wait for the timeouts is frustrating. for example, going from off to M2 involves a double click, a pause, and then another double click. if you don't wait long enough for the timeout, it puts you into battery-check mode (4 clicks from off). similarly, going from off to H2 without waiting long enough for the timeout puts you into strobe mode.

finally, programming a new light is a PITA. idk about you guys, but i usually change every single level on G6 and G7. that takes a poop LOAD of clicks.
it would be cool if they had an inexpensive USB programmer for it. i know it's an engineering challenge due to weatherproofing, but maybe it could be like a dummy battery with pogo pins that pushes against test pads inside.

single-button interface has a lot of advantages. low cost, low manufacturing complexity, easy to weatherproof, long service life, compact size, etc.
but at the end of the day, i think single-button interface is still poop. the best single-button interface in the world is still a single-button interface at the end of the day.
the best possible shitty interface. which thankfully turns out to be surprisingly good in this case, but still, jeez.

i think maybe i'd like two three-position rocker switches and an on/off button.
this would give quick access to 9 brightness levels.

the first switch would be macro adjust, second for micro adjust. kind of like shifting gears on a bike.

idk, just spitballing.


----------



## Derek Dean

DayofReckoning, of course you're preaching to the choir here (and by the way, I use my SC600w Plus every night at work), and believe me, I agree, and FOR ME, the ZL UI really is the "best", but "best" is such a subjective term, and since you've owned Surefire and Malkoff lights, you can understand that some members prefer a "keep it simple" approach, with a non-electronic switch and uncomplicated driver, and who's to say their setup isn't the "best" for them? Same with rotary controls, some folks LOVE that type of UI. I've got one, and enjoy using it occasionally, but for the most part, ZL has ruined me for other flashlights : )

Anyway, I'm not really arguing, it's merely semantics, but I have seen fist fights started here over lesser proclamations : )

Finally, SYZYGY, even though I love the idea of the programmable UI on the newer ZL models, I actually find the standard UI to work perfectly for my needs, so I haven't gotten into that part of the lights yet, but it sounds to me like it's one area that could use some work. I wonder if a small Bluetooth transceiver could be included in future models, allowing you to connect with your smart phone or computer, and do the UI setup that way?


----------



## DayofReckoning

Derek Dean said:


> DayofReckoning, of course you're preaching to the choir here (and by the way, I use my SC600w Plus every night at work), and believe me, I agree, and FOR ME, the ZL UI really is the "best", but "best" is such a subjective term, and since you've owned Surefire and Malkoff lights, you can understand that some members prefer a "keep it simple" approach, with a non-electronic switch and uncomplicated driver, and who's to say their setup isn't the "best" for them? Same with rotary controls, some folks LOVE that type of UI. I've got one, and enjoy using it occasionally, but for the most part, ZL has ruined me for other flashlights : )
> 
> Anyway, I'm not really arguing, it's merely semantics, but I have seen fist fights started here over lesser proclamations : )
> 
> Finally, SYZYGY, even though I love the idea of the programmable UI on the newer ZL models, I actually find the standard UI to work perfectly for my needs, so I haven't gotten into that part of the lights yet, but it sounds to me like it's one area that could use some work. I wonder if a small Bluetooth transceiver could be included in future models, allowing you to connect with your smart phone or computer, and do the UI setup that way?



Derek, In my excitement to proclaim all the virture's of the Zebralight, it was easy to forget that what's best for us might not be best for others, as you well explained. Everyone has different tasks, uses, and preferences, but from the viewpoint of just being a standard old flashaholic doing normal everday tasks, it's hard to envision any UI that is more capable  Of course, in my humble opinion.

As far as programming the Zebralights UI, I actually find it extremely well implemented. In fact, looking over the directions of other custom UI programming that I see instructions for on other lights, the Zebralight implementation is quite painless and easy to learn. Of course, this being just my opinion as well.


----------



## Mgizler

I prefer the SC5 to anything else in the AA format. I recently picked up an sc52 and then found another sc5w. And the sc52 is not going to get any pocket time. The SC5 is better all around for me. Feels better in the hand, better grip, more throw, and crazy bright on a single Primary AA.


----------



## Barrington

Ok - this is probably going to seem a silly question. Why would I spend the extra cash to buy a Zebralight rather than (say) a Thrunite or an Olight? And if you were to recommend one model to best demonstrate the benefits of Zebralights which would it be?


----------



## Lou Minescence

Barrington said:


> Ok - this is probably going to seem a silly question. Why would I spend the extra cash to buy a Zebralight rather than (say) a Thrunite or an Olight? And if you were to recommend one model to best demonstrate the benefits of Zebralights which would it be?



Zebra lights are different from each other as far as size, battery type and emitter. The user interface are almost all the same. They cost more than some other lights but not much more and have better resale value here on CPF. As far as recommendations of what Zebralight to get you should list your personal preferences. Preferred battery, size, tint, etc.
My favorite is the SC53w. I wear it on a neck lanyard. It’s always ready.


----------



## this_is_nascar

Barrington said:


> Ok - this is probably going to seem a silly question. Why would I spend the extra cash to buy a Zebralight rather than (say) a Thrunite or an Olight? And if you were to recommend one model to best demonstrate the benefits of Zebralights which would it be?


I've been info flashlights for a couple decades now. I've always heard of ZL, but only purchased my 1st one a few weeks ago. My main reason for giving ZL any serious consideration was the very dim firefly mode I've always ready about. Also, the UI had always seem to get high marks.

I spent many days and hours researching offings. I originally wanted a 1xAA format, but quickly learned that none of them support 14500 lithium-ion cells. So, owning 18650 lights, that's what I focused on next. ZL claims to have some of the smallest 18650 based lights available.

I ended up getting the SC64w HI, because it seems to meet my needs of an EDC as far as a balance of throw and spill. I was disappointed to learn that only flat-top unprotected cells can fit in the light. I would have sacrificed an additional 1/4 inch in length for its ability to fit any and all 18650 cells. Damn, for less than $25, I can but a Convoy S2+ or Sofirn SP31 v2.0 that will handle any 18650 I put in there. Anyway, I purchased the ZL and some unprotected flat-top 3500 mAH cells.

So far, I've been very pleased with the light. I love the tint and the UI. I've been EDCing since I got it.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## Buck91

*Re: The Official Zebralight Thread*



SYZYGY said:


> i'm a fan of it, too. but here are my complaints...
> 
> first, it would be nice to be able to move the strobe around instead of being forced to use 3 clicks to enter that mode. what if someone wants to be all tacticool and have 1-click strobe? or long-press strobe?
> 
> next, and this one is getting into the limitations of having a single-button UI.. having to wait for the timeouts is frustrating. for example, going from off to M2 involves a double click, a pause, and then another double click. if you don't wait long enough for the timeout, it puts you into battery-check mode (4 clicks from off). similarly, going from off to H2 without waiting long enough for the timeout puts you into strobe mode.
> 
> finally, programming a new light is a PITA. idk about you guys, but i usually change every single level on G6 and G7. that takes a poop LOAD of clicks.
> it would be cool if they had an inexpensive USB programmer for it. i know it's an engineering challenge due to weatherproofing, but maybe it could be like a dummy battery with pogo pins that pushes against test pads inside.
> 
> single-button interface has a lot of advantages. low cost, low manufacturing complexity, easy to weatherproof, long service life, compact size, etc.
> but at the end of the day, i think single-button interface is still poop. the best single-button interface in the world is still a single-button interface at the end of the day.
> the best possible shitty interface. which thankfully turns out to be surprisingly good in this case, but still, jeez.
> 
> i think maybe i'd like two three-position rocker switches and an on/off button.
> this would give quick access to 9 brightness levels.
> 
> the first switch would be macro adjust, second for micro adjust. kind of like shifting gears on a bike.
> 
> idk, just spitballing.





I love my ZL UI and wouldn’t change a thing.


----------



## Random Dan

*Re: The Official Zebralight Thread*

Back in 2012 when I bought my first ZL, an SC60, their UI was one of the best in the game. I still really like it, but it feels a bit clunky. 

Let's say I'm in medium and I want a bit more light. Wait, am I in m1 or m2? Double click. Light gets dimmer. Drat. Press and hold to ramp low-med-high. But is this h1 or h2? I only needed a bit more light not full turbo. Better double click again to find out. If it gets brighter then double click again.

I've found myself in that exact scenario many times. Don't get me wrong, I still really like the UI and it's better for a ZL than anything else out there except narsil/anduril, but daaang an SC64 with anduril would be sweet.


----------



## nightshade

*Re: The Official Zebralight Thread*

Love the ZL design and interface. I wish they would add a CC, ramping interface to the line up , in any battery format. Also thoroughly enjoy the Thrunite TH20 and it's very D10'ish and robust interface. I think I've finally cracked the TH20 code. So, I've got that going for me, which is nice.


----------



## Buck91

*Re: The Official Zebralight Thread*



nightshade said:


> Love the ZL design and interface. I wish they would add a CC, ramping interface to the line up , in any battery format. Also thoroughly enjoy the Thrunite TH20 and it's very D10'ish and robust interface. I think I've finally cracked the TH20 code. So, I've got that going for me, which is nice.







TH20 is definitely a diamond in the rough. Try reflowing your favorite 3535 LED in there and you'll be really tickled! BTW, what clip are you running on there?


----------



## DayofReckoning

*Re: The Official Zebralight Thread*



Random Dan said:


> Back in 2012 when I bought my first ZL, an SC60, their UI was one of the best in the game. I still really like it, but it feels a bit clunky.
> 
> Let's say I'm in medium and I want a bit more light. Wait, am I in m1 or m2? Double click. Light gets dimmer. Drat. Press and hold to ramp low-med-high. But is this h1 or h2? I only needed a bit more light not full turbo. Better double click again to find out. If it gets brighter then double click again.
> 
> I've found myself in that exact scenario many times. Don't get me wrong, I still really like the UI and it's better for a ZL than anything else out there except narsil/anduril, but daaang an SC64 with anduril would be sweet.



I can understand that, this can be remedied somewhat by making the primary mode and secondary mode the same, so basically you turn the 6 mode light into 3. It's not perfect but it's an option to cut down on "what mode am I in" type of stuff like you described.


----------



## Random Dan

*Re: The Official Zebralight Thread*



DayofReckoning said:


> I can understand that, this can be remedied somewhat by making the primary mode and secondary mode the same, so basically you turn the 6 mode light into 3. It's not perfect but it's an option to cut down on "what mode am I in" type of stuff like you described.



Yeah I've certainly thought about that. I do kinda like 6 modes though. The tricky part about taking advantage of the programmable ui is that while my most used zl, the sc64, has it, the rest are too old. I'd rather they all keep the same ui so I don't get confused.


----------



## this_is_nascar

Never owning any other ZB than my SC64w HI, I'm enjoying the UI. It meets my main goals which have always been the ability to get to either low, med and high directly from off.

Anything other than that is just nice to have things for me.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## DayofReckoning

I agree ThisisNascar. No, it's not perfect, as Dan pointed out. It's customizability is impressive though. I setup my Group 7 as a single mode tactical style, and group 6 as my normal preferred preset.


----------



## Mgizler

My first ZL was an sc50. I had some issues at first adapting to the UI. But since then, I’ve had about a dozen of them and now it’s second nature to run through the modes and get to what I need. I used to always blind myself in the beginning (about 10yrs ago) trying to access low in the middle of the night. Haha.


----------



## DayofReckoning

Mgizler said:


> My first ZL was an sc50. I had some issues at first adapting to the UI. But since then, I’ve had about a dozen of them and now it’s second nature to run through the modes and get to what I need. *I used to always blind myself in the beginning (about 10yrs ago) trying to access low in the middle of the night. Haha*.



I had a perfect image of the XHP50.2 in my vision when I closed my eyes, for like 10 minutes, after figuring I was gonna take a peek into the bezel to see how dim the moonlight mode was :shakehead


----------



## this_is_nascar

Mgizler said:


> My first ZL was an sc50. I had some issues at first adapting to the UI. But since then, I’ve had about a dozen of them and now it’s second nature to run through the modes and get to what I need. I used to always blind myself in the beginning (about 10yrs ago) trying to access low in the middle of the night. Haha.


That's what I have my setup to use the GYM. G6 is setup so a single click goes to firefly. My medium level brightnesses are setup to come on with a press and hold from off. I hate the way G5 is defaulted because of that same issue of potentially blinding you.

It really took me a bit to get the concept of the levels and programing, but I'm probably the exception. I can buzz right thru it now.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## DayofReckoning

Just to add a little to the data, my SC700D came in today. No AR coatings :thinking: (not complaining, the tint is beautiful!)


----------



## Robot Mania FU

*Re: The Official Zebralight Thread*



Random Dan said:


> Back in 2012 when I bought my first ZL, an SC60, their UI was one of the best in the game. I still really like it, but it feels a bit clunky.
> 
> Let's say I'm in medium and I want a bit more light. Wait, am I in m1 or m2? Double click. Light gets dimmer. Drat. Press and hold to ramp low-med-high. But is this h1 or h2? I only needed a bit more light not full turbo. Better double click again to find out. If it gets brighter then double click again.
> 
> I've found myself in that exact scenario many times. Don't get me wrong, I still really like the UI and it's better for a ZL than anything else out there except narsil/anduril, but daaang an SC64 with anduril would be sweet.




My only suggestion would be to set the high modes to H1/M1 and the medium settings to H2/M2. Leave them on the medium settings (single click from off for M1, double click from off for M2), and then that way all you have to do when the light is on is double click when you need more light.


----------



## this_is_nascar

Once I realized that with the ZL UI, low doesn't have to mean dimmest and high doesn't have to mean brightest, I was able to get past my confusion.

Be default, a single quick click is HIGH. I have my HIGH set to moonlight, so when I press once from off, I'm in moonlight mode, which is what I want. My double click from off is set to the the brightest light.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## Random Dan

*Re: The Official Zebralight Thread*



Robot Mania FU said:


> My only suggestion would be to set the high modes to H1/M1 and the medium settings to H2/M2. Leave them on the medium settings (single click from off for M1, double click from off for M2), and then that way all you have to do when the light is on is double click when you need more light.


If there were an option to disable memory for sub-levels I would probably do exactly this. For me that would be a major improvement to the ui. But I don't want to have to keep track of which sub-level I turn it off in.


----------



## this_is_nascar

*Re: The Official Zebralight Thread*



Random Dan said:


> If there were an option to disable memory for sub-levels I would probably do exactly this. For me that would be a major improvement to the ui. But I don't want to have to keep track of which sub-level I turn it off in.


I don't understand your concern with the current memory, knowing there are any of three levels to get get to directly from off.



Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

*Re: The Official Zebralight Thread*



Robot Mania FU said:


> My only suggestion would be to set the high modes to H1/M1 and the medium settings to H2/M2. Leave them on the medium settings (single click from off for M1, double click from off for M2), and then that way all you have to do when the light is on is double click when you need more light.



That's what I do, in one of the mode groups. I have L2/M2/H2 set to 3 different levels, all medium or lower. Then L1/M1/H1 all set to max output. So, it's a simple double-click from whatever level am I on, to get to turbo. Works really well for when I just want a quick blast of light to look at something farther away.


----------



## WebHobbit

*Re: The Official Zebralight Thread*

So I finally was coming around to the idea of ordering a SC600w IV HI to compliment my SC600w IV Plus.....and now they seem to have DROPPED this particular SKU!

So BUMMED


----------



## AstroTurf

*Re: The Official Zebralight Thread*

wow, that is a-shame.

it's a really great light.



WebHobbit said:


> So I finally was coming around to the idea of ordering a SC600w IV HI to compliment my SC600w IV Plus.....and now they seem to have DROPPED this particular SKU!
> 
> So BUMMED


----------



## Lou Minescence

*Re: The Official Zebralight Thread*



WebHobbit said:


> So I finally was coming around to the idea of ordering a SC600w IV HI to compliment my SC600w IV Plus.....and now they seem to have DROPPED this particular SKU!
> 
> So BUMMED



Definitely a buzz killer.


----------



## this_is_nascar

Wonder why.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Strange. Maybe it's just a blip. Their website is usually out-of-date and poorly maintained. The spreadsheet still has it listed as a current model.

Or, perhaps they're finally soon coming out with a Mk V version of their lights, and they're de-listing the Mk IV once it sells out. Christmas season isn't too far away, so it kind of makes sense they'd come out with something new in the next couple of months.


----------



## Jimmyboots

Speaking of SC600w’s. I’ve been using a SW600w L2 II for a bit now and was curious if it was worth upgrading. 

I like the fact that I can use protected and unprotected cells, not sure if this is the case with future models. 

Also I never use the high setting so max output is irrelevant to me. 

A smaller sized light would be nice and I think the UI is a bit different which may be nice as the ui one the mkii is a little annoying to me. But that’s a nitpick. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## WebHobbit

Someone on the subreddit Flashlights said it was a shortage of that particular emitter
.


----------



## WebHobbit

Someone found it in stock at GPKnives and sent me a link....but now I'm kind of wondering if I should hold out for a possible new SC600xxx?


----------



## NPL

Xhp35 Hi led has been officially discontinued by Cree, but they have announced the xhp35.2 HI which is probably not yet available. Based on LED design of the second gen replacement, it is suspected to be more efficient but likely more green in tint. Nobody knows for sure until we see it. 

Sent from my Pixel using Candlepowerforums mobile app


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

That's too bad. The XHP35 HI has a really nice, even, clean tint. It's especially pleasant on the SC64w HI, though the SC600w IV HI is nice too. Not so good if the XHP35.2 HI is :green:


----------



## WebHobbit

Went ahead and placed an order for the SC600w IV HI at GPKnives. Never ordered with them before. Hope all goes well! And thanks to SlumberPass for the tip off.


----------



## AstroTurf

you'll do well with them.

a good company to deal with.

imo, Jim



WebHobbit said:


> Went ahead and placed an order for the SC600w IV HI at GPKnives. Never ordered with them before. Hope all goes well! And thanks to SlumberPass for the tip off.


----------



## DMS1970

Are there any new lights coming from Zebralight? I did not go for a 700 but I've had most of their other lights. Ready for them to up the bar again...


----------



## WebHobbit

I wish they would update the site more....they STILL don't have any run-time info posted for the 700 series lights


----------



## markr6

They somehow blocked google docs here at work and I can't open the spreadsheet now. Is the C3 still listed on that?


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

markr6 said:


> They somehow blocked google docs here at work and I can't open the spreadsheet now. Is the C3 still listed on that?



Nope. They still have that entry-level A6 listed, though. I doubt they'll ever do that one, either.


----------



## likethevegetable

On the topic of UI, I think a really cool option to toggle would be if when you hold, it ramps through each sub-mode then mode in increasing brightness. Click-ClickHold would take you opposite direction. Sort of how Anduril operates. I'm not partial to ramping UI's because I don't need 20 modes, 6 seems to be a great amount for me.


----------



## geokite

I recently bought and received a H604d. The ring around the button is different from other new ZLs I have received before, and is different from what they have in their pictures of all headlights. It is not shiny and does not have the 45 degree slope. It is not as comfortable to press the button (but I might get used to it). I have only seen this type of button ring on a H302w I got back from ZL warranty service a couple of years ago.








I emailed ZL asking about the button ring and they said "We changed the switch/button ring design of our headlamps 2 or 3 years ago.". 

Is this reply consistent with what you have received from ZL? If you have bought a new HL from ZL in the past 2-3 years, did it have this matte ring or the shiny 45 degree kind?

Thanks!
Steve


----------



## turbodog

this_is_nascar said:


> I've been info flashlights for a couple decades now. I've always heard of ZL, but only purchased my 1st one a few weeks ago. My main reason for giving ZL any serious consideration was the very dim firefly mode I've always ready about. Also, the UI had always seem to get high marks.
> 
> I spent many days and hours researching offings. I originally wanted a 1xAA format, but quickly learned that none of them support 14500 lithium-ion cells. So, owning 18650 lights, that's what I focused on next. ZL claims to have some of the smallest 18650 based lights available.
> 
> I ended up getting the SC64w HI, because it seems to meet my needs of an EDC as far as a balance of throw and spill. I was disappointed to learn that only flat-top unprotected cells can fit in the light. I would have sacrificed an additional 1/4 inch in length for its ability to fit any and all 18650 cells. Damn, for less than $25, I can but a Convoy S2+ or Sofirn SP31 v2.0 that will handle any 18650 I put in there. Anyway, I purchased the ZL and some unprotected flat-top 3500 mAH cells.
> 
> So far, I've been very pleased with the light. I love the tint and the UI. I've been EDCing since I got it.
> 
> 
> Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk




the sc62 will take a button top protected 18650 cell.

it's an older light but still very bright

have to order straight from ZL site... most dealers are out of stock on it

http://www.zebralight.com/SC62-18650-Flashlight-Cool-White_p_147.html

1000 lumens
takes 69mm cell length

I run a variety of flat top and button tops. no problems. Diameter can be a little snug with a protected cell due to 2 layers of shrink wrap.


----------



## chillinn

this_is_nascar said:


> I originally wanted a 1xAA format, but quickly learned that none of them support 14500 lithium-ion cells.



Assuming the Zebralight AA lights did accept 14500 Li-ion, because the modes are regulated, output would be identical to running an AA. I believe the older SC52 did accept 14500, but the AA-only Zebralights have higher max brightnesses. It has been suggested that 14500 would give those highest modes longer runtime and more consistent output than an AA, so one would have to decide just how much they'd be running those highest modes to say 14500 is essential and lack of support a dealbreaker. I use 14500 in other lights, but I personally see no reason the AA Zebralights should support 14500. But I would fight to the death to defend your right to decide for yourself, I just saw a possibility you might not have considered everything.



turbodog said:


> Diameter can be a little snug with a protected cell due to 2 layers of shrink wrap.



I understand this_is_nascar may already have protected cells, so still good info, but I just wanted to point out Zebralights have built-in low voltage protection, so a protection circuit on an ICR is not necessary and/or redundant. Redundancy can be a good thing. But I would run IMR or INR before ICR. I think some prefer to have the negligible extra capacity of ICR. But capacities have gone up for most chemistries in the last few years. And its 18650 were talking about, so just how many weeks of runtime does anyone need on one cell? I think beyond making it to and through the weekend is just overkill.


----------



## skid00skid00

" I believe the older SC52 did accept 14500, but the AA-only Zebralights have higher max brightnesses."

AA: 300 lumens
LiIon: 540 lumens

It's WAY brighter in person, and I love it.


----------



## this_is_nascar

Thanks for the responses. I've since gotten passed any desire to own a AA based ZL. I have enough AA lights, I'd I ever decided to dedicate myself to that platform. I've since ordered several of those red labeled 18650s from the ZL sure and gave been doing fine.

I EDC my SC64w HI. I've since purchased another one as a spare, an SC64c LE and an SC600w MK IV HI.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## chillinn

this_is_nascar said:


> I've since gotten passed any desire to own a AA based ZL. I have enough AA lights, I'd I ever decided to dedicate myself to that platform.



Too impractical? I find this actually relatively common near-fanatical devotion to Li-ion formats (esp. with CPFers) hard to understand. I am chemistry and format agnostic, (NiMH, Li-FeS2, even Alkaline or Super Heavy Duty if that is all that is available, IFR, INR, IMR, ICR; AAA, AA, 2/3AA, 10180, 10440, 14500, CR123A, 16340, 18500, 18650, etc.) whatever it takes, you know?) and see there's a right tool for the right job. But throwing ZL AA in with other AA lights, as _just another AA light _is sort of missing the tree for the forests, overlooking that the ZL AA draws 5 amps in turbo. I seriously doubt any other AA draws more than 1 or 2 amps. That makes a big difference. But I do understand that sometimes 475Lm - 550Lm is just not enough lumens for many, and I admit that during the day, outside in the shade, that output is only barely adequate for close range stuff. If it is not enough lumens for most tasks at 3am on a moonless night up to 30 yards, then I am very grateful for my eyes. Some CPFers have very stringent requirements, like the CPF member that has to inspect airplanes and uses a 3A FM1794, and I just use that for fun, like waking up fish sleeping in the underwater docklight currents at 5AM.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

The AA zebralights are plenty bright enough for most uses, but a AA cell only has about a quarter the energy of a 18650 cell. So, I prefer the AA zebras for indoors, and the 18650's for outdoors (because I don't want to carry a spare battery on a long walk).


----------



## chillinn

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> (because I don't want to carry a spare battery on a long walk).



Either you're walking too far or too brightly! Or maybe you're not carrying enough flashlights. Bring it down to 144Lm and walk less than 2 hours and 48 minutes, or down to 40Lm and walk less than 9 hours and 36 minutes.

But definitely don't give up the 18650 stuff... not what I meant.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

chillinn said:


> Either you're walking too far or too brightly! Or maybe you're not carrying enough flashlights. Bring it down to 144Lm and walk less than 2 hours and 48 minutes, or down to 40Lm and walk less than 9 hours and 36 minutes.



Well, I use regular Eneloops, so cut that time down by 25%. But, yeah, I know that a single AA is good enough for many hours at my usual brightness (which is about 25-50 lumens). However, I also like to pump it up to max and check out things in the distance. Mainly for fun. But a few minutes of that, and the SC5w seriously begins to deplete a AA cell. I just don't want to have to limit myself. 18650 gives me plenty of run-time at whatever output I want.

I use my SC52's and SC5w indoors, mainly as room lighting. At about 100 lumens, they'll last about 3 hours on an Eneloop, which is enough time to watch a movie. TV is much better with ceiling-bounced dim-ish light.


----------



## chillinn

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> I also like to pump it up to max and check out things in the distance.



I probably knew that, but it is nice to chat sometimes.




WalkIntoTheLight said:


> I use my SC52's and SC5w indoors, mainly as room lighting.



I thought I was the only one that did this. Installed lighting is nice, but you could not call it "fun." Besides the ceiling lights in this rental, I only have one actual lamp. For the last few years, I was using a couple 2xAA Outsoorsman with z68s and Elite heads. Since the SC5c II arrived last week, it has been just that. Zebralight makes a fantastic room lamp. And then when I have to move, it is effortless to get flashlights to the new place. My folks had a lot of lamps, and we moved a lot. When you carry a porcelain lamp, you can't carry anything else, so it is a lot of trips from the house to the truck, then from the truck to the new house.


----------



## this_is_nascar

chillinn said:


> Too impractical? I find this actually relatively common near-fanatical devotion to Li-ion formats (esp. with CPFers) hard to understand. I am chemistry and format agnostic, (NiMH, Li-FeS2, even Alkaline or Super Heavy Duty if that is all that is available, IFR, INR, IMR, ICR; AAA, AA, 2/3AA, 10180, 10440, 14500, CR123A, 16340, 18500, 18650, etc.) whatever it takes, you know?) and see there's a right tool for the right job. But throwing ZL AA in with other AA lights, as _just another AA light _is sort of missing the tree for the forests, overlooking that the ZL AA draws 5 amps in turbo. I seriously doubt any other AA draws more than 1 or 2 amps. That makes a big difference. But I do understand that sometimes 475Lm - 550Lm is just not enough lumens for many, and I admit that during the day, outside in the shade, that output is only barely adequate for close range stuff. If it is not enough lumens for most tasks at 3am on a moonless night up to 30 yards, then I am very grateful for my eyes. Some CPFers have very stringent requirements, like the CPF member that has to inspect airplanes and uses a 3A FM1794, and I just use that for fun, like waking up fish sleeping in the underwater docklight currents at 5AM.


Thanks, but I guess I don't understand the point you're attempting to make. I stopped purchases lights just to leave sitting on a shelf years ago. The few lights I have left are what I consider my lights that I will use. I can't imagine why I'd want a ZL AA based light, when I consider all the other lights u have at my disposal.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## likethevegetable

To NASCAR's point, I have a AA ZebraLight that basically sits on a shelf. I have two others that I mainly use: SC64w HI and H600Fc. That's about the extent of my collection, if you don't consider my gf's headlamp that I gave her.


----------



## Climb14er

The SC52cw is one of my favorite lights! Usually run 14500's, can run Eneloops, AA Lithiums, AA Duracells, any other over the counter Standard AA. Great for traveling, use it a lot for inside the house. Tremendous all around function.


----------



## WebHobbit

Is there a 5100 mAh unprotected cell that will properly fit and work in the ZL SC700d? Seems wrong that we can only use the 4000 in this


----------



## chillinn

this_is_nascar said:


> Thanks, but I guess I don't understand the point you're attempting to make.



Just trying to ferret out that you and others need brighter and/or longer running lights than AA can provide, at least that is what I was obtusely missing when I commented.


----------



## markr6

chillinn said:


> Just trying to ferret out that you and others need brighter and/or longer running lights than AA can provide, at least that is what I was obtusely missing when I commented.



For me it's stuff like backpacking trips. I COULD get by with an AA, but for about 1oz penalty why chance it. One time I was doing my usual nighttime stuff on low or medium...would have lasted well past the trip length. But I came upon a cave a decided to check that out. Those big dark spaces sure eat up lumens! I was running on high for at least an hour. I never would have had fun with an AA. Just one example.

I have an old Fenix PD32UE on my bike, use it almost daily. An AA wouldn't get the job done there either.


----------



## chillinn

I really want an SC700d. They don't give runtimes, product page just reads "3000 Lm (PID, approx. hours)." I wish I had a reason for it, because except for brief tests to be amazed at its brightness, it would just sit around. I would never use the runtime. I like that I use up AA capacity, and I cherish my collection of Eneloops. I actually like swapping cells... it is a neat activity. Maybe if Eneloops did not exist... then I probably wouldn't touch AAA/AA lights.

But I also love my Keeppower 1200mAh 18350's. They make single incan E really worthwhile for me. I also use them to run FM1794... still short runtimes, but plenty of it because I have no reason for it. I don't know what I'd do without these Keeppowers (other than abuse 16340s).


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

I am considering getting the SC700d for my bike, just for the extra run-time that a 5000mAh cell would give me. Currently, I use the SC600w IV Plus, with 3500mAh cells. That gives me almost 3 hours at 700 lumens. Almost good enough, but I usually put in a new cell half-way through my ride, because I don't want to cut it too close. I think a SC700d might allow me to just use a single cell (I'd carry a spare anyway, just in case).

So, there are cases where even a 18650 doesn't have enough capacity, even if you're not using high modes just for fun.


----------



## this_is_nascar

So, between the SC53c and SC53w, is the only difference the CRI, thus impacting total output? I didn't see anything else different on the ZL spreadsheet.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## brightasday

WebHobbit said:


> Is there a 5100 mAh unprotected cell that will properly fit and work in the ZL SC700d? Seems wrong that we can only use the 4000 in this



I use a Samsung 50E (5000mAh) exclusively in the SC700d without any problems. Outside I mostly use H2 at 945 lumens, with occasional burst of H1 when I want to see farther. Works great!


----------



## chillinn

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> I am considering getting the SC700d for my bike...



Does a 21700 fit on most hobby Li-ion cell chargers that can take xx650? I have the common old model Nitecore D4, and specs list acceptable sizes up to 26650. (Regardless of knowing it will mostly sit around doesn't stop me from wanting it, and of course, wanting it certainly doesn't stop me from buying it.)




this_is_nascar said:


> So, between the SC53c and SC53w, is the only difference the CRI, thus impacting total output? I didn't see anything else different on the ZL spreadsheet.



I cautiously say "yes." I think that is precisely correct, because the higher the CRI, the less efficient an LED will be. But I am becoming more skeptical about what I "know."

Also, the badge on the SC5w II likely has a w where the c would be on an SC5c II. This minor difference is crucial.


----------



## SubLGT

WebHobbit said:


> Is there a 5100 mAh unprotected cell that will properly fit and work in the ZL SC700d? Seems wrong that we can only use the 4000 in this



The Samsung 50G or the Vapcell G50.

https://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/t...reat-performer-but-“max”-rating-issue.943067/



> ...The Vapcell G50 is a great performing ultra-high capacity 21700 cell. These beat the blue Vapcell 12A 5000mAh, Samsung 50E, and Samsung 50E2. Vapcell says they are rewrapped Samsung 50G cells and they look and perform essentially the same as the Samsung 50G......Samsung gives the 50G a 9.8A continuous rating and a 14.7A non-continuous (“temperature-limited”) rating. This means you can use it at 14.7A as long as the cell temperature does not go over 60°C/140°F. The 9.8A rating is what you must use when comparing this cell to others. Hard use of this cell can bring it to 60°C so don’t let it get more than warm.
> 
> The capacity of the two cells I tested was 4978mAh and 4979mAh...




https://www.candlepowerforums.com/v...w-of-Vapcell-INR21700-5000mAh-G50-(Gold)-2020


----------



## chillinn

SubLGT said:


> WebHobbit said:
> 
> 
> 
> Is there a 5100 mAh unprotected cell that will properly fit and work in the ZL SC700d?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Samsung 50G or the Vapcell G50.
> 
> https://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/t...reat-performer-but-“max”-rating-issue.943067/
> 
> https://www.candlepowerforums.com/v...w-of-Vapcell-INR21700-5000mAh-G50-(Gold)-2020
Click to expand...


Incredible. That's a lot of cap. 9.8A max. continuous discharge current. But me personally, I think I'd rather have 30A max. discharge current in the 21700 VTC6 for 4000mAh capacity and considerably more cost, nearly 3 to 1 compared to the 50G. (except Zebra sells this 30A 21700 for a third less than my favorite Li-ion sellers (image there is of IMR cell, cell is INR, and btw shouldn't need protection).


Anyone know how many amps the SC700d draws?




WebHobbit said:


> Seems wrong that we can only use the 4000 in this



Just pointing out the difference is less than the capacity of a typical AAA cell:
Energizer Ultimate Lithium AAA 1053mAh @1A, 
Eneloop Pro AAA 930mAh @1-2mA, and 
Duracell Alkaline AAA 970mAh @1mA.

Is that extra capacity worth the reduction in max. continuous discharge current?


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

chillinn said:


> Just pointing out the difference is less than the capacity of a typical AAA cell:
> Energizer Ultimate Lithium AAA 1053mAh @1A,
> Eneloop Pro AAA 930mAh @1-2mA, and
> Duracell Alkaline AAA 970mAh @1mA.
> 
> Is that extra capacity worth the reduction in max. continuous discharge current?



It's energy that matters, not capacity. The AAA battery has about 1Wh of energy. For a lithium-ion battery, an extra 1000mAh is 3.6Wh of energy. So, yes, it's worth it. If I'm going with a 21700 light, I want the maximum energy battery I can get. Otherwise, I may as well stick with a 18650 light which is smaller and lighter and much more pocketable.


----------



## SubLGT

chillinn said:


> ....Anyone know how many amps the SC700d draws?...



8-10 amps is what I remember reading in these threads:

https://www.candlepowerforums.com/v...Zebralight-SC700d-21700-XHP70-2-90-CRI/page30

http://budgetlightforum.com/node/65105

One potential drawback with the Samsung 50G is that the + contact is deeply recessed.


----------



## chillinn

Good stuff... learning, learning...


----------



## geokite

geokite said:


> I recently bought and received a H604d. The ring around the button is different from other new ZLs I have received before, and is different from what they have in their pictures of all headlights. It is not shiny and does not have the 45 degree slope. It is not as comfortable to press the button (but I might get used to it). I have only seen this type of button ring on a H302w I got back from ZL warranty service a couple of years ago.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I emailed ZL asking about the button ring and they said "We changed the switch/button ring design of our headlamps 2 or 3 years ago.".
> 
> Is this reply consistent with what you have received from ZL? If you have bought a new HL from ZL in the past 2-3 years, did it have this matte ring or the shiny 45 degree kind?
> 
> Thanks!
> Steve




It crossed my mind that ZL might be sending out refurbished lights. 

Steve


----------



## AstroTurf

All of my ZL have the older style shiney 45 degree angle button shroud.

What you have pictured appears to me to be a new design.

My ZL collection numbers 15 at this moment, and starts with the first Sc600 and includes a H32f as well.

My hope is that ZL will recover.

Jim



geokite said:


> I recently bought and received a H604d. The ring around the button is different from other new ZLs I have received before, and is different from what they have in their pictures of all headlights. It is not shiny and does not have the 45 degree slope. It is not as comfortable to press the button (but I might get used to it). I have only seen this type of button ring on a H302w I got back from ZL warranty service a couple of years ago.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I emailed ZL asking about the button ring and they said "We changed the switch/button ring design of our headlamps 2 or 3 years ago.".
> 
> Is this reply consistent with what you have received from ZL? If you have bought a new HL from ZL in the past 2-3 years, did it have this matte ring or the shiny 45 degree kind?
> 
> Thanks!
> Steve


----------



## SYZYGY

*Re: The Official Zebralight Thread*



chillinn said:


> Too impractical? I find this actually relatively common near-fanatical devotion to Li-ion formats (esp. with CPFers) hard to understand.



regarding AA lights.. i EDC a SC64w HI which uses 18650. to me, this light is already pretty small, and i would be surprised if i'd actually appreciate having an even smaller light if it comes at the expense less output and much less energy capacity.

i would actually be pretty curious to try one, but i'm afraid of buying one and just having it sit on a shelf. or having to resell it at a loss.

the other thing is i just refuse to use alkaline batteries anymore unless there's no other option. i hate non-rechargeable, and i REALLY hate when they leak.

which brings us to options like eneloop Ni-MH rechargeable. these are _ok_, and i reluctantly use them in my camera flashes for my DSLR (i'm about to buy strobe flashes that take lithium cells instead!). but i have to say that my experience with them is much worse than with 18650 and 21700. even though they're high end batteries, i've left them mostly charged and come back to them months later to find that they're dead and won't take a charge. lightly used eneloops, mind you. and no, it's not due to leaving them in a device. it's either from self discharge or defects or just going bad all on their own for some reason i don't understand. am i just unlucky? in contrast, my experience with 18650 and 21700 cells has been a real pleasure.

none of the smaller (AA) zebralights support 14500 batteries?* i'm 100% not interested in going back to alkaleak or NiMH cells, so i'll happily stick with their other offerings.*


----------



## likethevegetable

The new AA ZebraLight (53's and Mk II, silly name convention) do not accept 14500 Li-Ion, unfortunately. I believe the 52 series does, but alas, you miss out on the great UI improvement.


----------



## chillinn

AstroTurf said:


> My hope is that ZL will recover.
> 
> Jim



What did I miss? Is Zebralight alright? Did something happen to Zebralight? I don't think I can bear any more bad news.


----------



## AstroTurf

chillinn said:


> What did I miss? Is Zebralight alright? Did something happen to Zebralight? I don't think I can bear any more bad news.


This post eludes to ZL sending out refurb lights as new...

#3167

I don't think they'd do that, and was just thinking out loud.

Jim


----------



## JimIslander

AstroTurf said:


> This post eludes to ZL sending out refurb lights as new...
> 
> #3167
> 
> I don't think they'd do that, and was just thinking out loud.
> Jim



Yes, not likely. Too expensive to send back to China. Difficult to disassemble. They could, however, just send out lights that people have sent back for tint or other reasons.


----------



## Derek Dean

geokite said:


> I recently bought and received a H604d. The ring around the button is different from other new ZLs I have received before, and is different from what they have in their pictures of all headlights. It is not shiny and does not have the 45 degree slope. It is not as comfortable to press the button (but I might get used to it). I have only seen this type of button ring on a H302w I got back from ZL warranty service a couple of years ago.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I emailed ZL asking about the button ring and they said "We changed the switch/button ring design of our headlamps 2 or 3 years ago.".
> 
> Is this reply consistent with what you have received from ZL? If you have bought a new HL from ZL in the past 2-3 years, did it have this matte ring or the shiny 45 degree kind?
> 
> Thanks!
> Steve




I recently received a new H600Fd, and it has that same style switch/button ring design seen in your photo. I hadn't noticed it until you pointed it out. Personally, I don't find any issue with using the new style, as the switch itself has exactly the right amount of sensitivity for me, not to hard and not to soft, just right. All around, simply an excellent light with an impeccable finish. My only issue, and that would be nitpicking, is that I'm not overly fond of the headband. I find it a bit uncomfortable, so I've replaced it with the one that came with my Skilhunt H03 and have ordered a replacement strap from Skilhunt for that light (and yes, that was the new style ZL headband).


----------



## geokite

Derek Dean said:


> I recently received a new H600Fd, and it has that same style switch/button ring design seen in your photo. I hadn't noticed it until you pointed it out. Personally, I don't find any issue with using the new style, as the switch itself has exactly the right amount of sensitivity for me, not to hard and not to soft, just right. All around, simply an excellent light with an impeccable finish. My only issue, and that would be nitpicking, is that I'm not overly fond of the headband. I find it a bit uncomfortable, so I've replaced it with the one that came with my Skilhunt H03 and have ordered a replacement strap from Skilhunt for that light (and yes, that was the new style ZL headband).



Thank you! great! good to hear my suspicion was incorrect. Yea!

Yes, this is quite a light. I needed to put some tape on the lens of my H603d to smooth it out, but not this H604d. Yes, this new headband is hard but it should last a lot longer.

Steve


----------



## chillinn

Well, I really should not have spent this money, but I am panicked they will not be available when I could spend the money. I just ordered
SC5c II (another, the third one, gifted the first, plan on gifting the one I am holding),
SC5w II and 
SC53c

The SC53c was a late call. I was messing around with my SC62c, and realized that while using my SC5c II, I completely missed that super low 0.01Lm mode, which the SC53c has... plus the same Cree XP-L2 EasyWhite emitter as SC5c II that I really dig. 

But next to my SC62c, the tint of my current SC5c II does appear to have a green cast. Next to everything else, it looks yellow casted. I think this model might be haunted. But I do not mind. 

Last night I was looking at all the models I have missed. I wish I could have scored an SC80c,  Operating Voltage Range: 0.7V - 4.2V, so it ran on AA, CR123A, 14500, & 16340, of whatever chems are available. Incredible.


----------



## this_is_nascar

chillinn said:


> Well, I really should not have spent this money, but I am panicked they will not be available when I could spend the money. I just ordered
> SC5c II (another, the third one, gifted the first, plan on gifting the one I am holding),
> SC5w II and
> SC53c
> 
> The SC53c was a late call. I was messing around with my SC62c, and realized that while using my SC5c II, I completely missed that super low 0.01Lm mode, which the SC53c has... plus the same Cree XP-L2 EasyWhite emitter as SC5c II that I really dig.
> 
> But next to my SC62c, the tint of my current SC5c II does appear to have a green cast. Next to everything else, it looks yellow casted. I think this model might be haunted. But I do not mind.
> 
> Last night I was looking at all the models I have missed. I wish I could have scored an SC80c,  Operating Voltage Range: 0.7V - 4.2V, so it ran on AA, CR123A, 14500, & 16340, of whatever chems are available. Incredible.


I'm familiar with the SC53c, but what's the SC5c?


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## chillinn

this_is_nascar said:


> I'm familiar with the SC53c, but what's the SC5c?



ZL SC5c II

AA, HighCRI 4000K, 475Lm max, 0.08Lm min, new interface, and the pulse schema does not affect me at all, so far, unlike the SC5w OP destroyed me. When I catch a bug in the beam zipping by, I sometimes see it. Historically, I care, but not this time.

anticipation thread

its here thread


----------



## this_is_nascar

Thanks.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## raggie33

how stable does a aa zebralight maintain its brightness? does it dim fast as the battery depletes? im talking about alkaline battery's


----------



## JimIslander

raggie33 said:


> how stable does a aa zebralight maintain its brightness? does it dim fast as the battery depletes? im talking about alkaline battery's



Come on. You know the answer already, right? Zebralights are well regulated regardless of battery type.







https://www.candlepowerforums.com/v...EO-and-more!&p=4126607&viewfull=1#post4126607


----------



## raggie33

JimIslander said:


> Come on. You know the answer already, right? Zebralights are well regulated regardless of battery type.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.candlepowerforums.com/v...EO-and-more!&p=4126607&viewfull=1#post4126607


it would take a month to tell you all the things i dont know. and the stuff i do know im sure the answers will change lol


----------



## raggie33

can some one tell me to get the lowest light mode on a SC53w AA Neutral White Flashlight? im talking about the mode that last 3 months


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

raggie33 said:


> can some one tell me to get the lowest light mode on a SC53w AA Neutral White Flashlight? im talking about the mode that last 3 months



With the light off: click 5 times rapidly. This puts it into the default mode group.

Press the button and hold for about 1 second. The light should turn on to a low mode.

Double-click. That should switch the mode to moonlight.
Double-click again. That should switch the mode back to low.
Double-click again. That should switch the mode back to moonlight.
Double-click again. That should switch the mode back to low.
Double-click again. That should switch the mode back to moonlight.
Double-click again. That should switch the mode back to low.
Double-click again. That should switch the mode to a super-low moonlight.
Click once. That should turn off the light and memorize that low moonlight mode.

When you press & hold the switch, it will turn on to either low, or the super-low moonlight. If you get low, then double-click to go to the moonlight.

If you want to choose another moonlight mode to memorize, then just keep double-clicking when you're in the programming setting, and it will cycle through the 3 moonlight levels. Click to turn off and memorize.


----------



## chillinn

raggie33 said:


> can some one tell me to get the lowest light mode on a SC53w AA Neutral White Flashlight? im talking about the mode that last 3 months



In G5, click and hold for a second before releasing the button. Once in the lowest pair of modes, double clicking switches between L1 and L2. 

G6 and G7, activated by 6 and 7 clicks from off, respectively, you can program every single level to where you want it. I programmed highs at the M1 & M2 pair, lows at the H1 and H2 pair, and mediums at the L1 & L2 pair, so that a single click goes to the low pair now H1 & H2, double click goes to the high pair now M1 & M2, and click and hold for 1 second goes to the medium pair, now L1 & L2.

It took a while before any of this made sense to me.


----------



## raggie33

looks like im going to sell all my non custum lights. zebra rocks it is hard to put in words but its pretty much perfect. i even like the low low mode i was in the woods playing with it. i heard what sounded like gun shots i then switched it to low low and ducked down. man i need to move. i think the home invasion suspects are still on the loose


----------



## WebHobbit

I've pretty much done the same. I kept my two Malkoff Hound Dog 18650s but the rest are all Zebras now. They really are fantastic designs. As far as I am concerned ZL is the pinnacle. I do wish I had the patience to program G6 or G7 but I don't. That's the only thing I think I would add if I could - some easier way to program them - like way the Oveready BOSS does it.


----------



## hcd615

Hi, I am not sure if this will help anyone or even needed to be done, but I made a chart so I could reference it when programming my new SC53W lights. Not sure how to insert the chart to show and not be a link. If anyone wants the chart as a .pdf I can email it to them. Or I can plug in the lumens for other lights for a reference chart, I don't mind doing that. I also did charts for my SC64W HI and SC600W IV Plus.

https://imgur.com/a/zSQVX6y


----------



## hcd615

I received two Zebralight SC53W's today from GP Knives. I think one may have been used because when I cycle through the L1, M1, H1 - it acts as H1, M1, L1. It is High, Medium, Low - not like the factory setting as the lights come in G5 of Low, Medium, High.

I tried to look and see if there was a way to factory reset the light but I don't see how to. I guess I will have to go into G5 and see how it is setup, the light may be in G6 or G7 if it is acting that way i assume.


----------



## AstroTurf

Three consecutive 5-click (or 6-click, 7-click) to reset the G5 (or G6, G7) back to the factory default settings



hcd615 said:


> I received two Zebralight SC53W's today from GP Knives. I think one may have been used because when I cycle through the L1, M1, H1 - it acts as H1, M1, L1. It is High, Medium, Low - not like the factory setting as the lights come in G5 of Low, Medium, High.
> 
> I tried to look and see if there was a way to factory reset the light but I don't see how to. I guess I will have to go into G5 and see how it is setup, the light may be in G6 or G7 if it is acting that way i assume.


----------



## hcd615

Mistake....


----------



## hcd615

AstroTurf said:


> Three consecutive 5-click (or 6-click, 7-click) to reset the G5 (or G6, G7) back to the factory default settings



Thank you for the info. I did the five clicks and got the light to G5 and it worked perfect. I will reset G6 and G7 now. Thank you again!!


----------



## hcd615

AstroTurf said:


> Three consecutive 5-click (or 6-click, 7-click) to reset the G5 (or G6, G7) back to the factory default settings



Reset - WORKED PERFECTLY!

The G6 I didn’t do fast enough which I am glad because it was still going H, M, L so I learned how fast you have to do the clicks for reset. 

Did the 3 consecutive 6-clicks faster and now it is perfect, L, M, H. 

I had a ZL years ago and thought it was too complicated so I sold it. I wanted to try them again so I bought some new ones this past week and now that I understand the programming of the lumens I love the lights. 

Thank you again so much for the help.


----------



## AstroTurf

Hey, No Prob.

PS Anyone wanting a H502pr

ZL shows them now in stock, and at 54 bucks it is prolly one of the best red lights available on the market today.

Jim

Edit: I just ordered my second one. They are that good at what they do!!!


----------



## this_is_nascar

To make it simple, 15 clicks to reset G5, 18 to reset G6 and 21 to reset G7, all starting from the off position.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## this_is_nascar

hcd615 said:


> I received two Zebralight SC53W's today from GP Knives. I think one may have been used because when I cycle through the L1, M1, H1 - it acts as H1, M1, L1. It is High, Medium, Low - not like the factory setting as the lights come in G5 of Low, Medium, High.
> 
> I tried to look and see if there was a way to factory reset the light but I don't see how to. I guess I will have to go into G5 and see how it is setup, the light may be in G6 or G7 if it is acting that way i assume.


Well, that would suck, but I've read from someone else that they feel they got a refurbished unit direct from the ZL site.

You may have gotten a returned unit that someone sent back because they didn't like the tint.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## chillinn

hcd615 said:


> I received two Zebralight SC53W's today from GP Knives. I think one may have been used because when I cycle through the L1, M1, H1 - it acts as H1, M1, L1. It is High, Medium, Low - not like the factory setting as the lights come in G5 of Low, Medium, High.



That is pretty weird. I programmed my G6 and G7 with highs as M1/M2, mediums as L1/L2, lows as H1/H2 but press and hold from off still cycles L M H.




hcd615 said:


> I tried to look and see if there was a way to factory reset the light but I don't see how to. I guess I will have to go into G5 and see how it is setup, the light may be in G6 or G7 if it is acting that way i assume.




From the SC53 product page, at bottom:


Zebralight said:


> Three consecutive 5-click (or 6-click, 7-click) to reset the G5 (or G6, G7) back to the factory default settings



So 
15 clicks from off resets G5 to factory settings, 
18 clicks from off resets G6 to factory settings, and 
21 clicks from off resets G7 to factory settings.




AstroTurf said:


> PS Anyone wanting a H502pr
> 
> ZL shows them now in stock, and at 54 bucks it is prolly one of the best red lights available on the market today.



Note: previous generation interface.


----------



## AstroTurf

and your point is?



chillinn said:


> Note: previous generation interface.


----------



## raggie33

ty everyone i got it on the lowest setiing the timeing was my issue i found the lowest setting is more useful then i thought it would be


----------



## chillinn

AstroTurf said:


> and your point is?



Simply, it does not have the new generation interface, that is, it is missing the fully programmable G6 & G7 mode groups. Nothing more. The submodes are still programmable.

I think it is a pretty neat headlamp. I'd love to see that emitter in their sideclicky flashlights with a gold or gilded orange peel reflector. But I think they can do better with the output level of the highest mode, and probably 3 times better. But the headlamp is for cavers (spelunkers?), really, so any higher output would begin to adversely affect dark adapted vision, so I would not change this headlamp, other than perhaps double the runtimes on all modes, at least.


----------



## AstroTurf

ZL brings back a 14500 powered flashlight... for a limited time.

Check out their website, scroll to the bottom, an wahlah...

A SC52F L2, which can run 14500 batteries is on sale for 45 bucks.

w00 h00!!!

Jim

PS If I didn't already have one running 14500 on my desk, I would have bought them all!!!


----------



## AstroTurf

PSS I just checked and it looks like they have 13 left.



AstroTurf said:


> ZL brings back a 14500 powered flashlight... for a limited time.
> 
> Check out their website, scroll to the bottom, an wahlah...
> 
> A SC52F L2, which can run 14500 batteries is on sale for 45 bucks.
> 
> w00 h00!!!
> 
> Jim
> 
> PS If I didn't already have one running 14500 on my desk, I would have bought them all!!!


----------



## chillinn

Brought back... or clearing left over new old stock? Or building out left over old parts?

Product page claims runtimes are the same for 14500 and Eneloop "2000mAh" (which I did not know existed... I have only seen Eneloop 1900mAh and Eneloop Pro 2500mAh, and have only previously seen Zebralight test with Eneloop Pro). Assuming this model is old stock, they would have tested with their own Zebralight labeled 14500... which I can only assume were 750mAh_ at best_. Which means... more runtime on newer Vapcell 1000mAh 14500 than on Eneloop (but which Eneloop... Standard or Pro? Is 2000mAh a typo? or a generalization? Or were previous generation standard Eneloops actually 2000mAh?)


----------



## AstroTurf

missed the point...


----------



## chillinn

AstroTurf said:


> missed the point...



Yes... rather escapes me why everyone is crazy about Zebralight on 14500 when the modes are _regulated_, as in precisely the same mode brightness levels between NiMH or Li-ion, except for the top two modes. So you get 535Lm for one minute (difference between 300Lm and 285Lm probably negligible). Is that it? The point is having 535Lm for a whole endless minute? By all means, enlighten me. 

Eneloop Pro still has way more energy than 14500. Though I am happy about the new 1000mAh Vapcell, it is still less impressive than Eneloop Pro.


----------



## this_is_nascar

I think the desire for 14500 support is the ability to use any and all AA type cells available.

For example, I can honestly say that both my Lumintop Tool AA and Ultratac A1 can and will safely run on any and all AA types cells that are available.

You can't say that with the SC53 series from ZL. That ability was lost because there was no code space left after ZL added the ability to customize G6 and G7 fully. They code only fit either the 14500 support or the customization support.

That's what read anyway.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## chillinn

Yeah, but when you're hard up for cells, you can't readily grab any 14500. It's going to be alkaline AA in desperate emergency situations, no matter how popular the 14500 get, and that popularity is waning since several makers figured out how to get 500Lm, or close to it, from Eneloops. The SC80, tho, I find compelling in that regard. Too bad those are gone. 

The most impressive use for 14500, IMO, is hotrodding old incan single AA lights, or incan MagLites, or just plain non-Zebralight non-regulated 14500 LED lights, Coast, Pelican, Klarus, Fenix, Nitecore, etc. There are enough 14500/AA lights. The Zebralight regulation, which I love, very nearly makes 14500 in Zebralight irrelevant. Want Li-ion Zebralight and long runtimes, get an 18650 Zebralight.


----------



## raggie33

chillinn said:


> Yeah, but when you're hard up for cells, you can't readily grab any 14500. It's going to be alkaline AA in desperate emergency situations, no matter how popular the 14500 get, and that popularity is waning since several makers figured out how to get 500Lm, or close to it, from Eneloops. The SC80, tho, I find compelling in that regard. Too bad those are gone. The most impressive use for 14500, IMO, is hotrodding old incan single AA lights, or incan MagLites,mor just plain non-Zebralight non-regulated 14500 lights, Coast, Pelican, Klarus, Fenix, Nitecore, etc. There are enough 14500/AA lights. The Zebralight regulation, which I love, very nearly makes 14500 in Zebralight irrelevant. Want Li-ion Zebralight and long runtimes, get an 18650 Zebralight.


have 16 eneloops comeing crazy the world we live in today i just ordered them today and they be here today


----------



## chillinn

raggie33 said:


> have 16 eneloops comeing crazy the world we live in today i just ordered them today and they be here today



That's some seriously fast shipping. Best I have seen is 3 days, which blew me away. I ordered 16 Ladda 2450 (Eneloop Pro) from IKEA 3 weeks and 3 days ago, no sign of them, but they're _only_ 3 days late.


----------



## skid00skid00

"Yeah, but when you're hard up for cells, you can't readily grab any 14500. It's going to be alkaline AA in desperate emergency situations,"

This is called "cherry picking". In an emergency situation, you'll be lucky to find *any* stock, with AA being sold out *first*.


"The Zebralight regulation, which I love, very nearly makes 14500 in Zebralight irrelevant. Want Li-ion Zebralight and long runtimes, get an 18650 Zebralight."

At the time, Zebralight got ONLY 300 lumens out of AA, and 540 out of LiIon. Imagine what they could get out of LiIon NOW.

I'd love for people like you to rationally explain why they want *fewer* features in any specific item, when more features are available. Digital camera forums also have many outspoken posters, who decry the ability of a camera to do (OMGZ) VIDEO RECORDING!!! (Must be satan taking over those manufacturers!  )


----------



## chillinn

skid00skid00 said:


> chillinn said:
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah, but when you're hard up for cells, you can't readily grab any 14500. It's going to be alkaline AA in desperate emergency situations,
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This is called "cherry picking". In an emergency situation, you'll be lucky to find *any* stock, with AA being sold out *first*.
Click to expand...


This is called a misapplication of cherry picking while actually cherry picking a single case without support. Will they sell out? Who said anything about finding new stock in stores? AA are _everywhere_. You will find them brand new or half spent in myriad devices in your own home and if the emergency dire enough, abandoned homes, half spent at garbage dumps, and generally just lying around. 




skid00skid00 said:


> chillinn said:
> 
> 
> 
> "The Zebralight regulation, which I love, very nearly makes 14500 in Zebralight irrelevant. Want Li-ion Zebralight and long runtimes, get an 18650 Zebralight.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> At the time, Zebralight got ONLY 300 lumens out of AA, and 540 out of LiIon. Imagine what they could get out of LiIon NOW.
Click to expand...


I imagine short runtimes of 700Lm, or shorter runtimes of 1000Lm. I understand people love lumens. Personally, I fail to see where one can not make due with 500Lm, nor why they can't get another light if they can't.



skid00skid00 said:


> I'd love for people like you to rationally explain why they want *fewer* features in any specific item, when more features are available. Digital camera forums also have many outspoken posters, who decry the ability of a camera to do (OMGZ) VIDEO RECORDING!!! (Must be satan taking over those manufacturers!  )



Well, ad hominem argument notwithstanding, you're also begging the question aka petitio principii, or employing circular argument, and the camera argument is, btw, a straw man. Do I want fewer features? Is that my argument? I don't believe so. Running a chemistry that burdens the platform with nothing of value is not useful, thus not a feature, but instead superfluous. And otherwise, there is much to be said for avoiding feature creep. 

Zebralight chose to maximize efficiency by designing the driver specifically around _Eneloops_. We don't know what sacrifice would be made to that efficiency by also supporting 14500, but we can assume the design is simpler to leave out 14500 support. Again, there are myriad competitors that do as you and others wish, support both chemistries, thus there is no compelling reason for Zebralight to do the same. And they already did, and one of those models is, for the moment, available. I would never stop you from purchasing it, and I am glad it is available to you.

I was never arguing that Zebralight should do this or not do that, only that I am perplexed a little by the insistence of support for both chemistries when the driver is regulated. If it wasn't regulated, and all the modes got brighter, then it would make sense to me.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

chillinn said:


> Zebralight chose to maximize efficiency by designing the driver specifically around _Eneloops_. We don't know what sacrifice would be made to that efficiency by also supporting 14500, but we can assume the design is simpler to leave out 14500 support.



Zebralight used to make AA lights that would work with both NiMH, alkaline, and lithium-ion 14500. I have a SC52 and SC52w light that does this. If I compare their Eneloop efficiency against a "Eneloop-only" light like my SC5w at moderate power, it's close. But, the SC5w is a more efficient light. However, the SC5w is also a newer light, so perhaps general improvements also have an effect on its better efficiency.

Note, the difference isn't huge. IIRC, it's somewhere around 10%. I think you get a better efficiency improvement just by going with a cool-white LED.


----------



## chillinn

This is in no way accurate just my experience. I really think it comes down to the fact the 14500 are cool as hell, because we all grew up with friggin dry cell AA. Alkaline batteries have been around for some time, but I swear in the 1970's, heavy duty cells seemed to be the ubiquitous AA, and alkaline was expensive. Then it was a short day of being amazed at how much better alkaline were in the late 1970s and into the 1980s, until the issue with leaks happened so much they became hated. Then NiCad AA rechargeable gave us many recharges and low capacity. Then the HSD NiMH were revolutionary. Then I assume ICR14500 LiCo cells appeared, but only for the intrepid few that were in the know, slowly becoming more popular as the secret got out. LSD NiMH AA appeared within maybe half a decade of 14500. Eneloops are only about 10 years old. I am still quite taken by Eneloops, only really discovering them less than 3 years ago, and this after being blown away by IMR14500 LiMn about a year or two before that. With Eneloops, it was an issue of decent capacity and no longer needing to charge the thing just before I needed it; they sat ready. 

Now at least one label has increased 14500 capacity to 1000mAh. I am still waiting for the 14500 INR stock to reappear, and this is just for my own purpose of a couple AA Malkov hosts with Elite heads and MN02, which I doubt would interest many that want the 14500 for lumens. I want some compact low level incan runtime, that's my bag. 

I am ok with Zebralight AA lights being AA only. And I'm not preaching to exclude 14500 support, I'm not, I just care less because Eneloops need so much less care than 14500. It is my own fault for irresponsibly abusing and killing at least 7x AW IMR14500, and they are hard to kill compared to unprotected LiCo, and AW seems to be gone. When Zebralight did support 14500, the driver had low voltage cut off, which is just great... but I was into other lights when those were available, and when I did get the SC5w OP, it killed me, so I assume the earlier drivers had the same issue, and passed on the ZL 14500 opportunity. It was with caution and some trepidation that I finally tried the SC5c II. Success... it does not destroy me. Even now the SC52F L2 AA is available again for a short time, and at discount, I am too much of a coward to try it because I expect the same results as I had with SC5w OP, and because I think the Mk II platform is probably superior. idk, just a suspicion, and we all have our biases. Fear and/or bias is always irrational. 

Funny thing, I have a suspicion that with Li-ion, the problem I had with SC5w OP isn't there, because the SC62c doesn't seem to kill me; I kept it. And I am giving the SC53c a shake, and I am optimistic. But I am probably done with the ZL drivers in the hosts that are shaped like the SC52, assuming because of what it looks like, the entire generation of those might cause me migraine. 

I think few are bathing ourselves in the light as a room lamp for hours on end as WalkIntoTheLight and I do. They are using flashlights more ordinarily, with the lumens pointed away from them and not bouncing all over the place and into their eyes. They probably think were weird. I'm ok with that, too.


----------



## this_is_nascar

chillinn said:


> Yeah, but when you're hard up for cells, you can't readily grab any 14500. It's going to be alkaline AA in desperate emergency situations, no matter how popular the 14500 get, and that popularity is waning since several makers figured out how to get 500Lm, or close to it, from Eneloops. The SC80, tho, I find compelling in that regard. Too bad those are gone.
> 
> The most impressive use for 14500, IMO, is hotrodding old incan single AA lights, or incan MagLites, or just plain non-Zebralight non-regulated 14500 LED lights, Coast, Pelican, Klarus, Fenix, Nitecore, etc. There are enough 14500/AA lights. The Zebralight regulation, which I love, very nearly makes 14500 in Zebralight irrelevant. Want Li-ion Zebralight and long runtimes, get an 18650 Zebralight.


I agree. I'm in the camp that prefers my ZLs just the way they are. I was just attempting to explan what I believe to be the case with those disappointed due to the lack of 14500 support.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## this_is_nascar

chillinn said:


> That's some seriously fast shipping. Best I have seen is 3 days, which blew me away. I ordered 16 Ladda 2450 (Eneloop Pro) from IKEA 3 weeks and 3 days ago, no sign of them, but they're _only_ 3 days late.


Is there just one variety of these Ladda cells from Ikea. I keep hearing about them and have an Ikea pretty close to me.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## chillinn

this_is_nascar said:


> I agree. I'm in the camp that prefers my ZLs just the way they are.



We are as one, this_is_nascar... we are as one.



this_is_nascar said:


> Is there just one variety of these Ladda cells from Ikea. I keep hearing about them and have an Ikea pretty close to me.



Ostensibly, there are two. But the brown 900mAh Ladda are supposedly Chinese standard Eneloops. Only the Ladda 2450 are manufactured in Japan by FDK, and must be Eneloop Pro. So effectively, at ~$7 a quad, those are the only ones worth having. 

Ever been to an IKEA? I went in one trying to find the Ladda. I wasted an hour looking around, and then another hour looking for an employee to ask before leaving disgusted. IKEA is an absurd place. You just kind of have to go in, see something you like, and get it, but there is no finding what you are looking for unless you already know where it is.


----------



## this_is_nascar

chillinn said:


> We are as one, this_is_nascar... we are as one.
> 
> 
> 
> Ostensibly, there are two. But the brown 900mAh Ladda are supposedly Chinese standard Eneloops. Only the Ladda 2450 are manufactured in Japan by FDK, and must be Eneloop Pro. So effectively, at ~$7 a quad, those are the only ones worth having.
> 
> Ever been to an IKEA? I went in one trying to find the Ladda. I wasted an hour looking around, and then another hour looking for an employee to ask before leaving disgusted. IKEA is an absurd place. You just kind of have to go in, see something you like, and get it, but there is no finding what you are looking for unless you already know where it is.


So, the 2450s are the ones I should get?


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## this_is_nascar

These ones, yes?

https://www.ikea.com/us/en/p/ladda-rechargeable-battery-70303876/


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## chillinn

this_is_nascar said:


> These ones, yes?
> 
> https://www.ikea.com/us/en/p/ladda-rechargeable-battery-70303876/



yes

Bear in mind that Eneloop Pro promise 500 recharges compared to 2000+ recharges with standard Eneloops. IME, Eneloop Pro do not tolerate over discharge as well as Eneloop, which seem to recover better with less of a knock on capacity and amps, but even standard Eneloop, with enough instances of over discharge, become IMO unusable. So I have split the difference and stocked up on both branded standard Eneloop and IKEA Ladda 2450. Now I know more, I hope I can baby these. My original set of branded Eneloop Pro maybe lasted 4 months and 30 recharges. My own fault. I wasn't even resting them, but I think the many over discharges below 0.97V did it.

Also, if you order from IKEA, their estimated ship time is not exaggerated, and if anything, it is conservative. Three weeks for me was last Wednesday, and still no sign of them or any indication on their provided tracking function shows anything. About a week ago, IKEA sent a notice they were "picking" my order, but the tracking doesn't indicate that... indicates nothing but the order is in. I am patient, but this is getting ridiculous. And trying to contact IKEA to inquire will force the order to cancel. But the savings, I suppose, will make it all worth it, when they finally arrive.


----------



## raggie33

i love my zebra but i wonder why do you all love them?what are there pros


----------



## this_is_nascar

raggie33 said:


> i love my zebra but i wonder why do you all love them?what are there pros



In particular, I love my SC64 series because it's one of the smallest lights available using the 18650 cell. I really enjoy the lowest brightness setting as well. You'll be hard pressed to find such a dim low, in such a small package.


----------



## this_is_nascar

chillinn said:


> yes
> 
> Bear in mind that Eneloop Pro promise 500 recharges compared to 2000+ recharges with standard Eneloops. IME, Eneloop Pro do not tolerate over discharge as well as Eneloop, which seem to recover better with less of a knock on capacity and amps, but even standard Eneloop, with enough instances of over discharge, become IMO unusable. So I have split the difference and stocked up on both branded standard Eneloop and IKEA Ladda 2450. Now I know more, I hope I can baby these. My original set of branded Eneloop Pro maybe lasted 4 months and 30 recharges. My own fault. I wasn't even resting them, but I think the many over discharges below 0.97V did it.
> 
> Also, if you order from IKEA, their estimated ship time is not exaggerated, and if anything, it is conservative. Three weeks for me was last Wednesday, and still no sign of them or any indication on their provided tracking function shows anything. About a week ago, IKEA sent a notice they were "picking" my order, but the tracking doesn't indicate that... indicates nothing but the order is in. I am patient, but this is getting ridiculous. And trying to contact IKEA to inquire will force the order to cancel. But the savings, I suppose, will make it all worth it, when they finally arrive.



Thanks. I'll probably just pay the bridge toll and head over. Yes, I've been there before, but never noticed batteries, so it will be an adventure. Are you suggesting the 2450's are like the Pros and the other more like the standard Eneloop? I've only used the standards. I forget what I read that steered me toward the standard Eneloops over the Pros.


----------



## chillinn

this_is_nascar said:


> Are you suggesting the 2450's are like the Pros and the other more like the standard Eneloop? I've only used the standards. I forget what I read that steered me toward the standard Eneloops over the Pros.



More confidently than that. The brown Ladda 900mAh cells test just like standard Eneloop, and package indicates they are made in China. It is not a stretch to say these are Chinese standard Eneloop with the Ladda label. More assuredly, the Ladda 2450 not only test as Eneloop Pro, the package indicates they are made in Japan, and Japan reportedly has only one factory where they could be made, which is FDK, which is where all Japanese Eneloop, standard and Pro, are manufactured. So Ladda 2450 are definitely Eneloop Pro relabeled, similarly to at least one generation of Duracell that had the white tops were Japanese Eneloop, and Fujitsu 2550mAh and 1900mAh are Eneloop Pro and standard Eneloop, respectively. These Ladda 2450 are precisely Eneloop Pro, just the battery wrapper is different.

Probably what steers you towards Pro is the increase in capacity from 1900mAh to 2500mAh. But this is at the cost of the number of recharges, I think 2100 now for standard Eneloop, but only 500 for Pro.


----------



## this_is_nascar

chillinn said:


> More confidently than that. The brown Ladda 900mAh cells test just like standard Eneloop, and package indicates they are made in China. It is not a stretch to say these are Chinese standard Eneloop with the Ladda label. More assuredly, the Ladda 2450 not only test as Eneloop Pro, the package indicates they are made in Japan, and Japan reportedly has only one factory where they could be made, which is FDK, which is where all Japanese Eneloop, standard and Pro, are manufactured. So Ladda 2450 are definitely Eneloop Pro relabeled, similarly to at least one generation of Duracell that had the white tops were Japanese Eneloop, and Fujitsu 2550mAh and 1900mAh are Eneloop Pro and standard Eneloop, respectively. These Ladda 2450 are precisely Eneloop Pro, just the battery wrapper is different.




OK, thanks. So I'm back to trying to remember why I chose the standards over the Pros when I 1st purchased my Eneloops .


----------



## raggie33

amazon has 8 eneloops the white 10 years for 18.99


----------



## chillinn

this_is_nascar said:


> OK, thanks. So I'm back to trying to remember why I chose the standards over the Pros when I 1st purchased my Eneloops .



Eneloop Pro is expensive, ~$22/quad (making the $7/quad Ladda 2450 an incredible savings). Eneloop is ~$13/quad, and sometimes goes on sale for $8/quad. Just a guess.


----------



## this_is_nascar

Nah, it had nothing to do with cost. I think it had something to do with the standards having a longer shelf life with minimal discharge rate vs the Pros. Possibly something about total number or charges or similar too.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## chillinn

Not certain, but I believe the shelf life, which is the self discharge rate, would be the same between standard and Pro.


----------



## gottawearshades

Does anybody carry an SC53 or similar light on their keys? I'm considering it, but I'm worried it will get too beat up on a crowded keychain. The bezel is not too protective. 

Thoughts?


----------



## this_is_nascar

gottawearshades said:


> Does anybody carry an SC53 or similar light on their keys? I'm considering it, but I'm worried it will get too beat up on a crowded keychain. The bezel is not too protective.
> 
> Thoughts?


I don't, but I don't see any reason for concern. Sure, it's going to get scratched and look like that it's actually been used, but I'd suspect it to be just fine.



Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## AstroTurf

I carry mine in my watch pocket.



gottawearshades said:


> Does anybody carry an SC53 or similar light on their keys? I'm considering it, but I'm worried it will get too beat up on a crowded keychain. The bezel is not too protective.
> 
> Thoughts?


----------



## chillinn

gottawearshades said:


> Does anybody carry an SC53 or similar light on their keys? I'm considering it, but I'm worried it will get too beat up on a crowded keychain. The bezel is not too protective.
> 
> Thoughts?



Kind of big for the keychain IMO. If you want an AA keychain light, I'd recommend the D.Q.G Tiny AA in stainless steel, really small, and steel, so it will take abuse. Stainless steel is kind of heavy, so alternative recommendation, Fenix E05 in black anodized aluminum. I'm also partial to the L3 Illumination L11C Nichia, another aluminum AA light well regarded for its size and excellent tint. Even the Lumentop AA Tool Nichia in aluminum would fit better on the keys than ZL. These lights are much skinnier, and some are shorter, than Zebralight SC53. Clip that in your pocket. 

But if you must put a Zebralight on your keychain, at least remove the clip and screw something in the clip holes more like a ring, and attach a split ring to that, and attach that ring to your key ring, so it can better hang free.


----------



## Bob_McBob

Bob_McBob said:


> Interestingly, my last batch of SC64c LEs has the old-style less textured OP reflector that ZL stopped using in 2017.



This must have been a one-off use of old stock parts because my latest order is back to the more textured OP reflectors.


----------



## chillinn

But tell us how you really feel about the SC64c.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

chillinn said:


> Kind of big for the keychain IMO. If you want an AA keychain light, I'd recommend the D.Q.G Tiny AA in stainless steel, really small, and steel, so it will take abuse. Stainless steel is kind of heavy, so alternative recommendation, Fenix E05 in black anodized aluminum. I'm also partial to the L3 Illumination L11C Nichia, another aluminum AA light well regarded for its size and excellent tint. Even the Lumentop AA Tool Nichia in aluminum would fit better on the keys than ZL. These lights are much skinnier, and some are shorter, than Zebralight SC53. Clip that in your pocket.
> 
> But if you must put a Zebralight on your keychain, at least remove the clip and screw something in the clip holes more like a ring, and attach a split ring to that, and attach that ring to your key ring, so it can better hang free.



Yes, the DQG Tiny AA is much smaller than a AA zebralight. Here's my comparison of the two lights (the zebra is a SC52, but it's basically the same size as the SC53).


----------



## chillinn

Wow, that is small. Looks only about half an inch taller than an AA cell. _I need one._ FastTech still has them. Maybe next month.


----------



## chillinn

I've decided to bail on the idea of going to a jeweler to swap in the new clips and do this myself. I thought the screws were hex, but they are not. These look like Apple screws, no pun intended, but not 5 pointed stars with round points (pentalobe), but 6 pointed stars with rounded points. Torx?

Anyone know what these screws are, what the tool is called? I think they must be Torx, answered my own question. 

So does anyone have this clip and these screws, and a Torx set to check the size and standard (metric??). I don't want to buy a full Torx set, just the one size I need. TIA


----------



## this_is_nascar

chillinn said:


> I've decided to bail on the idea of going to a jeweler to swap in the new clips and do this myself. I thought the screws were hex, but they are not. These look like Apple screws, no pun intended, but not 5 pointed stars with round points (pentalobe), but 6 pointed stars with rounded points. Torx?
> 
> Anyone know what these screws are, what the tool is called? I think they must be Torx, answered my own question.
> 
> So does anyone have this clip and these screws, and a Torx set to check the size and standard (metric??). I don't want to buy a full Torx set, just the one size I need. TIA


I thought I saw clips available on the ZL website.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## chillinn

this_is_nascar said:


> I thought I saw clips available on the ZL website.



yes. These clips are hated.. I did not mind the older stainless clips, once loosened. Thicker metal, less of a blade, which the thin new clip I think is, skinshaver, pocket destroyer. So I got some after market Ti deep carry clips from eBay seller blade4sell. Don't care they're Ti, think stainless would have felt softer, but you can see from his images, the metal is thicker, less of a blade.

So... the OEM clip screws are Torx, but idk if they're metric or English sized, and I have no idea what the screw head size is. Getting the exact size of the screw head is important to avoid tool marks and stripping the screw. My hope was someone that has a Zebralight with the new clip also has a complete set of Torx wrenches and could tell me the screw head size... so I could acquire a Torx wrench with a handle in that size...






...and get the damn thing off and recycle it immediately, and then install the new Ti deep carry clips... which haven't arrived, still being made. But victory loves preparation.




* :'(*
*--->*



* *


----------



## AstroTurf

i think ive read that they are t-5.


----------



## chillinn

AstroTurf said:


> i think ive read that they are t-5.



Thanks! Can anyone confirm?

Edit: Searching for "zebralight clip screws T-5 torx" revealed this, which includes T-6 Torx screws, and this, which includes T-6 Torx screws, and looks just like the clips I bought, and a Reddit comment by ZapperDubs, "They might be T6 torx, from what I've read,", not all that convincing, but also this etsy sale of T-6 Torx screws for Zebralight.

I would prefer a confident comment from a CPFer that has a Zebralight with the new clip and screws and their own Torx wrench set.


----------



## raggie33

it sure seems like mine uses t6


----------



## knucklegary

Chilling. I am not sure where you are located.. If in USA take a trip to Big Box or hardware store with ZL in hand and try fitting Torx wrenches into the screw heads
Grab a Torx "key" style, like Bondus mfgr., that has an assortment, just to find out what size

Btw, the size Torx driver is, usually, limited to machine thread size. Sometimes a special oversize head diameter will use a larger size Torx, but more than likely not in your case
Good luck!


----------



## chillinn

You have a set of Torx keys, Raggie33, or are you just eyeballing it?

Thanks knucklegary! I did not consider WalMart, Lowe's or Home Depot, but had thought about going into a hardware store, like Ace... none around here. But I'm 7mi. from the others. That's a decent idea now you spelled it out for me.


----------



## raggie33

yep i have some cheap ones t7 was to big t6 felt perfect


----------



## chillinn

raggie33 said:


> yep i have some cheap ones t7 was to big t6 felt perfect



Asking because idk, does T6 indicate metric or English, or is there a T6 metric, and a T6 English? Or is there no such thing, only one T6?


----------



## raggie33

i think a t6 is a t6 id just buy a cheap set off ebay or amazon


----------



## knucklegary

My educated guess is t8-9


----------



## chillinn

Thanks fellas. I'm don't want to take any chances, so I'll just get a Cyberdyne Systems T-800.


----------



## knucklegary

chillinn said:


> Asking because idk, does T6 indicate metric or English, or is there a T6 metric, and a T6 English? Or is there no such thing, only one T6?



There are English & Metric screw sizes, but far as I know only one universal Torx drivers

Let us know what you come up with..


----------



## SYZYGY

*Re: The Official Zebralight Thread*

don't be such a tightwad, lol. just buy a nice set of quality torx bits. useful thing to have.

on my SC64w HI, the clip screws are T6.

and no, there are not "english or metric" torx sizes haha

PS: if you're looking for a screwdriver set, i can recommend this one:

TEKTON 2841 Everybit Ratchet Screwdriver, Electronic Repair Kit and Security Bit Set, 135-Piece
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B008HYVG6I/?tag=cpf0b6-20

i'm a "tool aficionado" and can make higher end recommendations if you want, but i really like this set and have used it for about 7 years.
and yes, it includes a T6 bit.

the bits are not ultra high end, but they're not poop, either.
i've gotten an acceptable amount of use out of them from a wear perspective.
they will get surface rust over time in humid environments, so oil em up if that bothers you. just like you'd oil any tool.


----------



## chillinn

SYZYGY said:


> don't be such a tightwad, lol.



I now somehow live on ~$800/month. The only tools I ever bought, owned and used were a little pocket-sized phillips head screwdriver, which is all I used in my career as a systems administrator (sure miss that sweet income), other than a Gerber Dime, which mostly opens boxes for me, and an oil filter wrench and oil pan bolt wrench for my 240.

A full set of Torx keys is not a quality set, and that is all I could afford. 



SYZYGY said:


> on my SC64w HI, the clip screws are T6.
> 
> and no, there are not "english or metric" torx sizes haha
> 
> PS: if you're looking for a screwdriver set, i can recommend this one:
> 
> TEKTON 2841 Everybit Ratchet Screwdriver, Electronic Repair Kit and Security Bit Set, 135-Piece
> https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B008HYVG6I/?tag=cpf0b6-20
> 
> i'm a "tool aficionado" and can make higher end recommendations if you want, but i really like this set and have used it for about 7 years.
> and yes, it includes a T6 bit.
> 
> the bits are not ultra high end, but they're not poop, either.
> i've gotten an acceptable amount of use out of them from a wear perspective.
> they will get surface rust over time in humid environments, so oil em up if that bothers you. just like you'd oil any tool.



Thanks for the size confirmation and info. And thanks for the recommendation. Nice set. In 50 years, I have never seen a Torx screw. I'm probably going to pay ~$9 for a single, dedicated T-6 Torx screwdriver, instead.


----------



## SYZYGY

*Re: The Official Zebralight Thread*



chillinn said:


> I now somehow live on ~$800/month. The only tools I ever bought, owned and used were a little pocket-sized phillips head screwdriver, which is all I used in my career as a systems administrator (sure miss that sweet income), other than a Gerber Dime, which mostly opens boxes for me, and an oil filter wrench and oil pan bolt wrench for my 240.
> 
> A full set of Torx keys is not a quality set, and that is all I could afford.
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks for the size confirmation and info. And thanks for the recommendation. Nice set. *In 50 years, I have never seen a Torx screw. I'm probably going to pay ~$9 for a single, dedicated T-6 Torx screwdriver, instead.*



hrm, something seems wrong with buying a single size torx driver to use for one specific application. and perhaps only using it once on top of that.
can't you just borrow a torx driver from a friend or something?

or if you're really desperate, buy one from home depot, use it once (and try to keep it looking brand new), and then return it? that's probably what i'd do, and i'm not ashamed to admit it.

and btw, of the common drive systems, torx is my favorite.
ime, it's the least likely to cam out or get damaged, and it transmits torque well. i wish everything was torx.
https://rtstools.com/why-torx-bolts-are-better-than-hex-bolts/


----------



## chillinn

*Re: The Official Zebralight Thread*

Not a single application. There are 4 clips, 2 screws per clip... so there are 16 applications, so ~56¢ for each 8 unscrews and each 8 screws. That's way cheaper than my first intention, which was to use a jeweler. And I may still get more use out of it. It's not that bad. The clips cost together $100, the lights $264, and I'll have spent about $100 on cells. I know how deep I'm in.


----------



## archimedes

So @chillinn if you have a CONUS address, I may have a "Benchmade Blue Box Torx Kit" which I will send you free, as long as I can find it.

The bits are not of great quality and in fact one of them has already broken, but it originally included (2x ea) T6, T8, and T10.

The design does not allow for putting much torque on the bits, but if used carefully, it should do what you need. PM if interested.


----------



## raggie33

i live on about the same chillin but ive found tools always i mean always pay for them selfs


----------



## chillinn

archimedes, that is typically beneficent of you, and very generous also, thank you. Understand it is the thought that counts! Honestly, I am looking forward to owning a handled Torx T-6 screwdriver. This won't be the last time I use it. I have designs on squandering at least 30 percent of my monthly income on lights and cells in October. jon_slider has seen the list. One of them needs a clip (so I'll get a tiny baggie of T-6 screws and little nuts to go with them), and one of them is going to need a clip replacement, but I am waiting to see both before I hunt for new pocket clips. I am going to adopt the T-6 Torx screw as standard on any future clip replacements. The October list is too long, only the top 4-6 items will make it, so the rest of the list, that absolutely can wait, will be for November and December. 

Reminds me to ask, is it remotely possible to get AliExpress to ship Li-ion to the US? 8x Vapcell INR14500 H10 10A made the bottom of the list. How did Li-ion Wholesaler ever get them if it is illegal to import Li-ion?


----------



## archimedes

Ok, nice to hear that you are set for those tools, cheers.


----------



## chillinn

I'm just planning on getting the one T-6 screwdriver, not a set. I know this is making tool lovers cringe. I only have about 25 lights. I am a minimalist.


----------



## archimedes

That works too ... I have one MIP hex driver, basically solely for McGizmo clips :shrug:


----------



## KITROBASKIN

Recently posted a "Cheer Thread" for Zebralight: A company that stands by its products. Here's a 3 minute 30 second video on that thread showing tint and going through our family story with Zebralight. 

https://youtu.be/v-Q_nj4XHsY


----------



## Robot Mania FU

After years of seeing the posts about it, it finally happened to me. I've lost my favorite flashlight. It was the day after a wedding and I made more stops than I can even remember to help with cleanup (had my sweatpants on after a LONG night) and it must have slid out of my pocket somewhere. When I got home, it was gone. 

My immediate response was to replace it, annnnnnnnnnnnd BACK ORDERED

But all hope is not lost. This is the perfect excuse to order the SC64w HI for the time being in hopes that my LE somehow turns up.


----------



## this_is_nascar

Definitely, two different lights, but I enjoy my SC64w HI and EDC it.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## Robot Mania FU

Crisis averted! I found my sc64 le in a couch 

Going a little over a week without it really solidifies it as my EDC. Man did I miss this thing.


----------



## AstroTurf

Great News!!!



Robot Mania FU said:


> Crisis averted! I found my sc64 le in a couch
> 
> Going a little over a week without it really solidifies it as my EDC. Man did I miss this thing.


----------



## this_is_nascar

Yes, great news indeed.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## 911blackadder

KITROBASKIN said:


> Recently posted a "Cheer Thread" for Zebralight: A company that stands by its products. Here's a 3 minute 30 second video on that thread showing tint and going through our family story with Zebralight.
> 
> https://youtu.be/v-Q_nj4XHsY




I love Zebralight all the time, when I loosing it I buy it again and repeat.
I wish they have a Nichia Hi-CRI on their arsenal, it's gonne be realy intresting!


----------



## NPL

I'm still hoping for an sc700 Hi model, in 4000 or 4500k. I agree though, to me they are still the best. And they should def try Nichia and others. 

Sent from my Pixel using Candlepowerforums mobile app


----------



## Outdoorsman5

I posted a question yesterday on ZL's website about the SC64w, and today the SC64w is listed as "discontinued." I am now wondering if:
A) Is Zebralight coming out with a replacement/new model, or
B) Did the SC64w not sell well enough to keep making it?

Does anyone out there have any intel? Thanks!


----------



## Outdoorsman5

ZL just responded to my question regarding the discontinued SC64w by saying, it has just been dicontinued. No upgraded new version is planned for the near future. Bummer.


----------



## gunga

Dang. Geez. I like my SC64c LE. But still. They could use a refresh?


----------



## Buck91

Outdoorsman5 said:


> ZL just responded to my question regarding the discontinued SC64w by saying, it has just been dicontinued. No upgraded new version is planned for the near future. Bummer.



Wow. I have a sc63w and it’s an absolutely stellar little light. Despite the lack of primary support it’s become my go-to for travel and hiking.


----------



## vadimax

gunga said:


> Dang. Geez. I like my SC64c LE. But still. They could use a refresh?



Out of these two models I have picked SC64c LE as well. May be this is the answer. 1400lm in that small body looks like an overkill to me when the only heat sink available is your hand


----------



## Robot Mania FU

vadimax said:


> Out of these two models I have picked SC64c LE as well. May be this is the answer. 1400lm in that small body looks like an overkill to me when the only heat sink available is your hand




Yup. My h600fc heats up VERY quickly on the 1568 lumen setting. It's fine while being used as a headlamp as its not making contact with any skin (and still makes me giggle at how much of an area I can light up just by turning my head), but holding it in your hand gets HOT. The sc64c LE on H2 (533 lumens) seems to be the optimal high setting for me. 

I guess I don't personally see the need for the sc64w when the sc64c LE and sc64w HI exist. With that being said, I get where everyone is coming from when zebralight discontinues one of their favorite models. I was furious when the sc32w was discontinued before I could grab a second one.


----------



## this_is_nascar

When I 1st decided to get a ZL several months ago, I went on a rampage and got a couple of the 64 and 53 series.

When all was said and done the SC64w HI is what ended up being my EDC. It really does make most of my other lights inferior in utility.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Yes, the SC64w HI is the go-to if you want a nice bright EDC. But, even it can't handle max output for very long. The body is just too small to absorb much heat.

I have to wonder why Zebralight hasn't refreshed their line-up in 2 or 3 years. Weird.


----------



## WebHobbit

I know I'm a weirdo ZL outlier but I had the SC64_ & I sold it as I prefer the straighter and thicker 600 series bodies. It carries just as well for me and I prefer it's looks over the skinnier one. And as a nice bonus it handles the highs better too with the slightly greater mass. I carry clipped in my front left pocket. For the record I EDC a SC600w IV HI at work and a SC600w IV Plus when not at work. I love them. Around the house I usually default to the SC700d...it's my desk and bedside table light


----------



## this_is_nascar

I've never found a need to run my EDC ZL on high for any long period of time. If I need that much light for a long time, I'll grab one of my others that are more up to the task.

I EDC my 64 series because of its size to output to runtime ratio. I'm not looking to EDC one of these novelty lights that can set stuff on fire, etc.

As far as new versions of models, I wouldn't mind seeing new offerings. In particular, something that can take any 18650 I have lying around. I won't mind the additional 1/4" or so required to do this.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## WebHobbit

I wouldn't mind seeing a more compact version of the SC700. Basically I want the same sized head as my beloved 600 series but with the 21700 cell inside for even longer runtime. I would probably dump my 600s insofar as EDC for THAT.


----------



## Outdoorsman5

As a follow up to my post last week, I just noticed that ZL has discontinued the SC600 Mk IV HI (my favorite outdoors light), plus they discontinued the regular SC600 Mk IV and the SC52F. I hope they don't continue getting rid of lights! I also hope they are doing ok financially!!


----------



## Outdoorsman5

Once a flashaholic always a flashaholic - I just ordered 5 of my favorite zebralights just in case they knock any of them off the list too!


----------



## markr6

Outdoorsman5 said:


> Once a flashaholic always a flashaholic - I just ordered 5 of my favorite zebralights just in case they knock any of them off the list too!



Hardcore! I can't believe the SC600 IV HI is out. That's one of the best.


----------



## NPL

They probably discontinued all xhp35 hi lights because emitter was discontinued. I suspect they will launch a new version with xhp35.2 Hi with small improvement in brightness and still unknown in terms of tint.

Sent from my Pixel using Candlepowerforums mobile app


----------



## this_is_nascar

NPL said:


> They probably discontinued all xhp35 hi lights because emitter was discontinued. I suspect they will launch a new version with xhp35.2 Hi with small improvement in brightness and still unknown in terms of tint.
> 
> Sent from my Pixel using Candlepowerforums mobile app


Interesting. When I click your link, it brings up the TT app from the Play Store, not a CPF app.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## AstroTurf

Curious...

which 5 did you order?



Outdoorsman5 said:


> Once a flashaholic always a flashaholic - I just ordered 5 of my favorite zebralights just in case they knock any of them off the list too!


----------



## Outdoorsman5

AstroTurf said:


> Curious...
> 
> which 5 did you order?



That’s funny you’re asking. After I made that post I knew I should’ve added that info (I would’ve asked too). So, I already have 2 of my all-around favorite SC64w HI. So here’s what I bot today so I’d have 2 of each:

- SC53w - greatest AA flashlight of all time!
- H53w - greatest AA headlight for outdoor use of all time!
- H53Fw - greatest AA headlight for indoor use of all time!
- H600w Mk IV - greatest 18650 headlight for outdoors of all time!
- H600Fw Mk IV - greatest 18650 blah blah for indoors of all time!

And of course each of the lights above have the greatest UI of all time as well. Now I just need to find an SC600w Mk IV HI and an SC64w on the secondary market to have 2 of each of those. I use my lights a lot. We go camping with our Scout Troop each month.


----------



## NPL

this_is_nascar said:


> Interesting. When I click your link, it brings up the TT app from the Play Store, not a CPF app.
> 
> 
> Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


Very weird. I just clicked on it and you are right. I don't even see this link when I respond. The app adds it automatically.


----------



## Gnolg

Why is not [FONT=&quot]Zebralight SC5w Mk II on your list? (why do you prefer [/FONT]SC53w?)


----------



## AstroTurf

Thank you!!!



Outdoorsman5 said:


> That’s funny you’re asking. After I made that post I knew I should’ve added that info (I would’ve asked too). So, I already have 2 of my all-around favorite SC64w HI. So here’s what I bot today so I’d have 2 of each:
> 
> - SC53w - greatest AA flashlight of all time!
> - H53w - greatest AA headlight for outdoor use of all time!
> - H53Fw - greatest AA headlight for indoor use of all time!
> - H600w Mk IV - greatest 18650 headlight for outdoors of all time!
> - H600Fw Mk IV - greatest 18650 blah blah for indoors of all time!
> 
> And of course each of the lights above have the greatest UI of all time as well. Now I just need to find an SC600w Mk IV HI and an SC64w on the secondary market to have 2 of each of those. I use my lights a lot. We go camping with our Scout Troop each month.


----------



## Outdoorsman5

markr6 said:


> Hardcore! I can't believe the SC600 IV HI is out. That's one of the best.



Hardcore! Sooooooo funny!!
I can't believe they're knocking it off too. The SC600w IV HI is the greatest outdoor-use throwy little ZL ever.


----------



## Outdoorsman5

Gnolg said:


> Why is not Zebralight SC5w Mk II on your list? (why do you prefer SC53w?)



The SC5w is an awesome light too. I like the smaller formfactor of the SC53w light a bit more. Just a personal preference really and is driven by my appreciation of small lightweight equipment. I often use my SC53w by holding it in my mouth, so I can use both hands for a task, so I figure the smaller the better. The SC5w would work just as good since it's only a little bit bigger & heavier. Also, I almost never run my single AA lights on max, so the added heft of the SC5w wouldn't add any benefits for me. Still, the SC5w is an awesome light and shares in having the greatest UI of all time!!! I just like the SC53w more.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Outdoorsman5 said:


> Hardcore! Sooooooo funny!!
> I can't believe they're knocking it off too. The SC600w IV HI is the greatest outdoor-use throwy little ZL ever.



WTF is zebralight doing? That's their best light ever. I really hope it's just a sign they're about to update their lights, and replace that one with a new emitter.


----------



## Outdoorsman5

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> WTF is zebralight doing? That's their best light ever. I really hope it's just a sign they're about to update their lights, and replace that one with a new emitter.



A response I received from ZL regarding them discontinuing the SC64w, suggests there aren’t any updates (at least for that light and perhaps other lights) coming anytime soon. I asked ZL if they were removing it from their list to make way for an upgrade, and their response was “no upgraded new version in the near future.” 

Restating my earlier concern, I hope ZL is doing ok. I remember when Quarks went away when 4Sevens went out of business. I met with the owner (not about flashlights but for another matter) after that happened, and he eluded to losing the lawsuit that SUREFIRE hit him with sunk his business for good. I even had the impression that it sunk his desire to stay in the business period. I have thought since then that I wish I had known. I would have doubled up on a few of my favorites (like the 2AA throwy Quark Turbo QB2A XP-G2 and the 18650 bodies that turned other Quarks into 18650 lights.) I hope that never happens again, especially to ZL!!


----------



## Connor

I have a bad feeling (but no evidence) about what's going on at ZebraLight - and I say that as a fan of the company. 
It has been *too* long since they offered any new lights and brands like e.g. Emisar make more interesting flashlights with new features and LEDs now.


----------



## gunga

Hmmm. Maybe stock up on a few more.


----------



## markr6

gunga said:


> Hmmm. Maybe stock up on a few more.




I spent all my money on toilet paper.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Connor said:


> I have a bad feeling (but no evidence) about what's going on at ZebraLight - and I say that as a fan of the company.
> It has been *too* long since they offered any new lights and brands like e.g. Emisar make more interesting flashlights with new features and LEDs now.



I have criticized their lack of new models as well. But, to be fair, their current line-up is still state-of-the-art for the niche they are in. Perhaps they have decided that improvements are not necessary right now. However, that doesn't explain why they are discontinuing models. It seems like a going-out-of-business sale, if they are really not planning replacements. It's too late in the year for a new line-up to generate Christmas sales, so I'm inclined to believe they aren't releasing anything new.


----------



## Outdoorsman5

markr6 said:


> I spent all my money on toilet paper.



Markr6, THAT WAS SOOOOOOO FUNNY --- AGAIN! I'm sitting in my office all by myself and BUSTED OUT laughing!!


----------



## gurdygurds

The lack of new models doesn't bother me but I hope they're doing ok business wise in general. I'd hate for them to disappear.


----------



## neutralwhite

come back ZL.


----------



## Buck91

I simply have no use for one right now but if my AT Wizard Pro XHP50 Warm or ZL sc64w ever go missing or break I would LOVE to try out the H600c Mk IV 18650 XHP50.2 4000K High CRI Headlamp... Wonder what they will have available if/when the time comes.


----------



## Robot Mania FU

I still periodically fall back on my h600fc as my light that I carry for the day once it gets colder out. I wear a lot of flannels and heavier shirts with chest pockets and have grown to love clipping a right angle light to my pocket to still have hands free use when I'm just doing quick tasks. As much as I love my sc64c LE and my new found love for malkoff's....I still end up with the h600fc in my pocket once the fall/winter hits.


----------



## this_is_nascar

Sounds like I should hold onto the very few ZL's I own.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## AMD64Blondie

Love my 2 Zebralights that I own..(SC64w and SC700d).

They're awesome.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

The last major shake-up for most of their lights was the MkIV releases, way back in October 2017. That's over 3 years ago! They did some emitter swaps with the SC64 in 2018/2019, and of course the SC700 earlier last year. But that's about it! It doesn't seem they're doing any engineering or design work anymore.

From what I can find on google, it seems they're basically a Chinese company that is registered in Texas and run by a couple of family members. They might have a couple of staff there, I presume doing sales. Revenue around $2M per year, though that's probably not too accurate. They abandoned a copyright registration to their logo many years ago... I'm not sure why.

Doesn't look good, unless they're planning a MkV release soon, and are just denying it for sales reasons.


----------



## Outdoorsman5

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> The last major shake-up for most of their lights was the MkIV releases, way back in October 2017. That's over 3 years ago! They did some emitter swaps with the SC64 in 2018/2019, and of course the SC700 earlier last year. But that's about it! It doesn't seem they're doing any engineering or design work anymore.
> 
> From what I can find on google, it seems they're basically a Chinese company that is registered in Texas and run by a couple of family members. They might have a couple of staff there, I presume doing sales. Revenue around $2M per year, though that's probably not too accurate. They abandoned a copyright registration to their logo many years ago... I'm not sure why.
> 
> Doesn't look good, unless they're planning a MkV release soon, and are just denying it for sales reasons.



All really good points WITL! I have one more thing to add. I asked ZL, maybe 2 months ago, if they were planning on releasing a SC700d HI. They simply replied with a flat, "No." This isn't much, but it does add to the evidence that they aren't engineering new items. I hope we're all wrong, and they come out with lots of new releases. That would be awesome (and terribly expensive for me.) If, however, ZL goes away or drastically shrinks, I sure would hate that. These are my favorite lights to use and to give as gifts.


----------



## JimIslander

I love my 14 Zebralights.


----------



## markr6

As a person that too often jumps on the "next best thing", I surprised myself by hanging onto the H600w II. 2013?!?! Where does time go.

Anyway, no plans/need to update in all that time. I guess what I'm saying, I can't even think of anything for them to make or update. Well OK, make the C3 then I'm good.


----------



## Outdoorsman5

markr6 said:


> As a person that too often jumps on the "next best thing", I surprised myself by hanging onto the H600w II. 2013?!?! Where does time go.
> 
> Anyway, no plans/need to update in all that time. I guess what I'm saying, I can't even think of anything for them to make or update. Well OK, make the C3 then I'm good.



I have used my H600w II for that long too, and agree it's hard to beat. I'm liking my new H600w Mk IV and the H600Fw Mk IV a bit more for the most recent UI update; otherwise, there's not much difference in the 2013 model and today's models. These ZL are the best of the best to me. I'm giving 4 headlights away (to guys in our Scout Troop that have commented on my lights) as Christmas gifts. I can't wait!


----------



## desmobob

Outdoorsman5 said:


> I have used my H600w II for that long too, and agree it's hard to beat. I'm liking my new H600w Mk IV and the H600Fw Mk IV a bit more for the most recent UI update; otherwise, there's not much difference in the 2013 model and today's models.



And I'm yet another still rocking an H600w MkII for several years. No reason to update it!


----------



## Owen

My old SC52w has gotten glitchy, lately, and more so in the last week. 
Was blaming an Eneloop with a dented button top, but that was wishful thinking.
I broke down and ordered the SC64w HI that I've been debating vs. a SC53w. Also ordered a couple of 18650s, just in case. 
I have a pair of unprotected Orbtronic 3500mAh IMRs(bought by accident instead of protected cells) listed as 18.5x65.6mm, but saw the Sanyos on the ZL site are 18.2x65.1mm. Doesn't seem like much difference, but I didn't want to take any chances. I haven't confirmed the measurements, but these suckers are pretty fat. I had to sand the tube on a Malkoff MD2, and even remove the label from one, to get them to fit. 
Wondering if they'll work in the SC64(?).


----------



## this_is_nascar

Il be honest, I've been into flashlights for a couple decades and have only gotten a ZL within the last 6-months or so. All that time, I did just fine without it, as I will if or when they go away or never release another product.

While their interface is my favorite of all the lights I own, it's their size (53 and 64) that keeps me holding on to the few I do have.

All that being said, they really should make a statement as to what their plans are going to be moving forward.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## likethevegetable

nascar, I agree, ZL is pretty quiet with zero advertising. I hope they're doing well financially because they make a one-of-a-kind light, and for selfish reasons I want them to continute to do so.


----------



## gurdygurds

Uuuuuuhhhhhhhhhh.........this doesn't give me a warm fuzzy feeling



Untitled by Six Pound Cat, on Flickr


----------



## Outdoorsman5

OH NO!!!! I just pulled them up on google maps and saw both locations in Irving, TX show up as permanently closed. I hope they are at least planning on keeping their China operations going. I’ll ask them on their website and see what comes up. I’ll report back if they answer.


----------



## gunga

Did they ever make an sc53c with Samsung LED? Or just cree easy white.


----------



## AstroTurf

New on their site...

They state: *Starting Jan 1, 2021, we will accept orders from U.S. customers only.*

Better get em while you can!!!


----------



## this_is_nascar

AstroTurf said:


> New on their site...
> 
> They state: *Starting Jan 1, 2021, we will accept orders from U.S. customers only.*
> 
> Better get em while you can!!!


Wow. So what that does mean for warranty issues?


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## AstroTurf

There are no changes in the warranty portion of the website... Yet.



this_is_nascar said:


> Wow. So what that does mean for warranty issues?
> 
> 
> Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## markr6

Well...the world is ending.

I can't believe it! I may update my old H600w after all.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

That certainly sounds like they're going out of business, and selling off all their existing stock. That's really too bad. I was a proud fan-boy. Luckily, I probably have all the zebralights I need for awhile. There was 1 or 2 I was interested in earlier this year, but they changed shipping rates to Canada to make it prohibitive to order from them.

I expect them to close up shop early next year, once they've sold most of their stuff. If you want anything, you probably just have a couple of months to get it. Don't expect any warranty service, because they won't be around to offer it.

Oh well, I'm set for awhile, but I suppose it's an excuse to try out some other premium brands. The problem is, finding regulated lights at a reasonable price isn't easy. Everyone seems to want to use linear and FET drivers, which I generally don't like due to their inefficiency and inconsistent output.


----------



## Connor

Yeah, that looks like they're dead. RIP ZebraLight, I really liked you. :candle:

IMHO the most interesting brand in the "ZL category" right now is Emisar/Noctigon. Not up to par in terms of efficiency but lots of nice features and LEDs to choose from.


----------



## ieslei

Oh God, nooo! Zebralight is my favorite brand by far!!!!! [emoji22][emoji22][emoji22][emoji22]

Enviado de meu MI 9 usando o Tapatalk


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Connor said:


> Yeah, that looks like they're dead. RIP ZebraLight, I really liked you. :candle:
> 
> IMHO the most interesting brand in the "ZL category" right now is Emisar/Noctigon. Not up to par in terms of efficiency but lots of nice features and LEDs to choose from.



Agreed, except that they use linear and FET drivers. But, I like their design and the pocket-rocket feature is fun. The color bling LEDs isn't a big draw for me, but Anduril likes those toys.


----------



## Connor

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> The color bling LEDs isn't a big draw for me, but Anduril likes those toys.


They're quite nice if you use them as an always-on battery indicator ;-)


----------



## Cemoi

They may still be some hope: when I asked them less than two months ago about the availability of optional tailcaps with magnets, they answered:
"_The *upcoming A6* will come with magnets. The *H600 Mk V, to be released* (maybe mid) next year, will have magnets as well as charging ports._"


----------



## Outdoorsman5

Good news. I asked ZL if business was good and if they would remain in business for the foreseeable future. The response was positive: “So far so good.” We’ll be in business for the foreseeable future. That being said, there will be some changes in the future in terms of our products and sales. Our current website (online store) will be dedicated to the U.S. customers only, because starting with the A6, which will be announced shortly, 18650 batteries will be included in the package.” 

Looks like good news to me: A) They are making a new light. B) They are doing well enough to remain open in the foreseeable future. C) But, changes are coming, perhaps good, but seems likely not as good as we would hope since some of their key lights have been discontinued and limiting website sales to U.S. only. A big question mark now is, how are non-US people going to order these lights?? Maybe Amazon??


----------



## gurdygurds

GREAT NEWS! Thanks for looking into this!


Outdoorsman5 said:


> Good news. I asked ZL if business was good and if they would remain in business for the foreseeable future. The response was positive: “So far so good.” We’ll be in business for the foreseeable future. That being said, there will be some changes in the future in terms of our products and sales. Our current website (online store) will be dedicated to the U.S. customers only, because starting with the A6, which will be announced shortly, 18650 batteries will be included in the package.”
> 
> Looks like good news to me: A) They are making a new light. B) They are doing well enough to remain open in the foreseeable future. C) But, changes are coming, perhaps good, but seems likely not as good as we would hope since some of their key lights have been discontinued and limiting website sales to U.S. only. A big question mark now is, how are non-US people going to order these lights?? Maybe Amazon??


----------



## gunga

Good and bad since I'm not in usa. But as long as they stick around.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

I'm suspicious that's just BS. No company is going to tell you they're going out of business, until they're ready to announce it publicly.

Besides, why would they ignore every market outside of the U.S.? That might be okay if they were a US-based company that has never sold on-line, but they're not. They're clearly a Chinese company, and the one thing the Chinese are good at is selling to the entire world.

Including batteries as an excuse to not sell anywhere else? It doesn't make sense. Maybe they have a supply of A6, and they want to find a way of bundling it so they can sell it off fast (perhaps because they also have a supply of batteries to get rid of).

And why are their Texas operations permanently closed? Why discontinue some of their best lights? None of that adds up.


----------



## markr6

Regardless, you guys got me! Just purchased the H600Fc to future-proof myself. It will be my goto light if I like it and my H600w II will be a backup.

The new stuff sounds cool...that Q50 though!


----------



## AstroTurf

Why the jump from H600w II to H600Fc IV if I may ask?



markr6 said:


> Regardless, you guys got me! Just purchased the H600Fc to future-proof myself. It will be my goto light if I like it and my H600w II will be a backup.
> 
> The new stuff sounds cool...that Q50 though!


----------



## markr6

AstroTurf said:


> Why the jump from H600w II to H600Fc IV if I may ask?



While I've had zero issues with it since 2013 and it gets used a lot, I figured I would get another just in case they in fact do close up shop. Plus the high CRI will be a nice upgrade. I use it a lot backpacking at night so I went with the 4000K. Not that there is anything wrong with my old one; it has a very nice tint. So often in life, when I realize I like something so much to get another, it's already too late and they changed something or discontinued it altogether.


----------



## knucklegary

If ZL was going out of business wouldn't all flashlight sales sold "as is" nomo company, no warranty ?


----------



## AstroTurf

Makes sense, Thanks!!!



markr6 said:


> While I've had zero issues with it since 2013 and it gets used a lot, I figured I would get another just in case they in fact do close up shop. Plus the high CRI will be a nice upgrade. I use it a lot backpacking at night so I went with the 4000K. Not that there is anything wrong with my old one; it has a very nice tint. So often in life, when I realize I like something so much to get another, it's already too late and they changed something or discontinued it altogether.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

markr6 said:


> Regardless, you guys got me! Just purchased the H600Fc to future-proof myself. It will be my goto light if I like it and my H600w II will be a backup.



I bought that model a year ago. Great light! The tint is great, high CRI is a good bonus, and there's no green or tint-shift (probably due to the frosted lens). I use it almost every day. It's not much good except for close-up, so you definitely want a regular flashlight as well if you're on a walk. But, good for seeing really well out to maybe 10 meters.




knucklegary said:


> If ZL was going out of business wouldn't all flashlight sales sold "as is" nomo company, no warranty ?



Why would they? They can sell anything they want with a lifetime warranty if they choose to, because once they're out of business they don't have to honor it anymore.


----------



## knucklegary

Good point WTL.. I was hoping for some ZL TX house sales deals across their site..
So far I see nothing I can't live without


----------



## SubLGT

Outdoorsman5 said:


> OH NO!!!! I just pulled them up on google maps and saw both locations in Irving, TX show up as permanently closed. I hope they are at least planning on keeping their China operations going. I’ll ask them on their website and see what comes up. I’ll report back if they answer.



No more warehouse in Texas? Has the inventory been relocated to the personal garages of the company owners?
Perhaps the Chinese company that manufactures the ZL flashlights can take over the entire ZL business.


----------



## Outdoorsman5

WalkIntoTheLight, all REALLY good points. I work for a Fortune 500 company. Even though I’m medium level, I bet I’d still be among the last to find out we were going out of business. So, it’s likely a customer service rep for ZL would be among the last to find out for sure. Man I hope we’re wrong about our suspicions here.


----------



## WebHobbit

I sure hope they are OK. For me there are no clear candidates to "replace" ZL. They just seem to embody the perfect mix of cutting edge drivers/efficiency/UI/build quality all at a decent price. I think Fenix has a similar build quality and comparable efficiency but their UI and lack of choice on color temp (all they do is cool white) is several notches below what we enjoy with ZL.


----------



## brightasday

I see they did add the A6 to their spreadsheet: "entry level, uni-body, black anodizing, TIR, ..." TIR is a little interesting. 

Mostly it seems a step down from the current lights (lower CRI, fewer modes, lower max, higher min, . . .). I guess that is what they mean by "entry level".


----------



## aginthelaw

Robot Mania FU said:


> I still periodically fall back on my h600fc as my light that I carry for the day once it gets colder out. I wear a lot of flannels and heavier shirts with chest pockets and have grown to love clipping a right angle light to my pocket to still have hands free use when I'm just doing quick tasks. As much as I love my sc64c LE and my new found love for malkoff's....I still end up with the h600fc in my pocket once the fall/winter hits.



Do any of these flannels have a quilted lining? Mine died within months of each other and I haven’t found a replacement yet

And now, back to our regularly scheduled program...


----------



## aginthelaw

I saw on the website they’re only selling in USA as of January


----------



## Mr. LED

SubLGT said:


> No more warehouse in Texas? Has the inventory been relocated to the personal garages of the company owners?
> Perhaps the Chinese company that manufactures the ZL flashlights can take over the entire ZL business.



There’s a misconception around the Internet forums, that Zebralight is an American company with a third party production in China. The truth is Zebralight is a 100% Chinese company, the owner is Chinese and lives in China. I have been in China many times and used to buy factory direct, and I have a contact inside. They confirmed me this information. But it changes nothing about how much we like Zebralight.

I’ll try to find out what’s going on about this January 01 US customers sales only, and I’ll report back if I have an answer.


----------



## Mr. LED

I’ve just talked to my factory contact and I was told that Zebralight is NOT going out of business.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

brightasday said:


> I see they did add the A6 to their spreadsheet: "entry level, uni-body, black anodizing, TIR, ..." TIR is a little interesting.
> 
> Mostly it seems a step down from the current lights (lower CRI, fewer modes, lower max, higher min, . . .). I guess that is what they mean by "entry level".



Yeah, I never understood why they would try to get into a lower-end market while still trying to sell it at a fairly high price. Doesn't seem like a good strategy. My bet is that they already did the design and manufacturing of the A6 some time ago, and now they want to sell off the supply.

From what I have gathered on-line, Zebralight is a Chinese company owned by two family members, with all design and manufacturing done in China. They (used to) have a US warehouse and company registered in Texas, with just a handful (or less) employees. I'd guess the owners have got into another business, and are winding down the flashlight operations. It looks like they've been doing that for at least a year, with perhaps the exception of the A6 (which is something they planned a long time ago).

Or, I could be totally wrong, and they are just selling off old models before introducing a brand-new line-up of lights in the new year. Doesn't explain them closing up shop in the US, while only selling to the US in the new year. That is more easily explained by selling off remaining inventory. Though, I'm still not sure why they wouldn't sell world-wide, since they already know how to do that. For me, that's the most perplexing part.

Zebralight was always a niche company. Maybe they've saturated their market niche, and are just not seeing any growth opportunities. 5 years ago, there were a lot less budget flashlight options. Now, you can get a kick-*** light for half the price of a Zebralight. That's tough to compete against. The budget offerings aren't as nice as zebralights, but the vast majority of potential customers don't care.


----------



## adamlau

Outdoorsman5 said:


> These are my favorite lights to...give as gifts.


Same here. Better than average products and priced where f&f won't drop a sneer when they look up the cost.


----------



## this_is_nascar

If nothing else, ZL has gotten more PR over the last 48-hours than they have all year. Maybe that's part of the problem, if there is one.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## Connor

Mr. LED said:


> I’ve just talked to my factory contact and I was told that Zebralight is NOT going out of business.



Good news I guess but at this point I'll reserve judgement until they actually announce and sell new models .. it really has been a bit too long for a company in a rather quickly evolving market.


----------



## jak

markr6 said:


> Regardless, you guys got me!


Same here! Just snagged a couple of lights too. (64w HI & 600w IV Plus). It's been a while since I've upgraded (and been a while since I've posted here). I was bored and coincidentally curious if there was any chatter here with what Zebralight has been up to. Regardless of the truth, I'm excited about my forthcoming lights.

(Dang it, should have ordered the H600Fd IV -that's now back ordered too as of this morning!)


----------



## The Whispering Gallery

Got me too. Just ordered an H503w. Should be a good upgrade in terms of output/efficiency vs. my H502 with the Philips LED. I almost ordered an SC64w HI as well.


----------



## Mr. LED

Connor said:


> Good news I guess but at this point I'll reserve judgement until they actually announce and sell new models .. it really has been a bit too long for a company in a rather quickly evolving market.



Let’s hope so. Zebralight is always slow to release new stuff and after the COVID crisis hit, I’m just happy they stay in business.


----------



## Outdoorsman5

Gnolg said:


> Why is not Zebralight SC5w Mk II on your list? (why do you prefer SC53w?)



Hey Gnolg, 
After I posted my reply to you regarding my preference for the SC53w over the SC5w, I began to think on which zebralights I ought to get in case ZL is going out of business. I hadn’t looked at the SC5w in a LONG TIME, but after I replied to your post, I noticed something I had never noticed before - the SC5w is a good bit more throwy (80*spill & 10*hotspot) than the SC53w (80*spill & 12*hotspot.) By those numbers the SC5w is around 20% more throwy! This is good news for me. I have been wishing for quite some time that ZL would come out with a “HI” version for the AA lights. Zebralight told me a couple of years ago that they had no plans to make a “HI” AA light. Well, over these recent years I never noticed that the SC5w has a smaller hotspot than my other favorite SC64w HI (which has a beam pattern 80* spill & 11*spot.)

Why this matters to me: Our Scout Troop has 3 backpacking trips a year where we leave on Fridays after school and hike 20+- miles through Sunday. We hike into the night on Fridays, so we can more comfortably cover the distance those next 2 days (plus I love night hiking and I’m the Scoutmaster organizing these trips - with usually 20-30 of us hiking.) I like for my headlight to be more floody than throwy, and I like for my flashlight to be more throwy than floody. For cold weather trips (like our January backpacking trips) I prefer to use AA lights so I can use lithium primary batteries (which survive the cold MUCH better than all other chemistries.) But, I haven’t had a good throwy AA zebralight option I could use. I am just now noticing that I can get a more throwy AA Zebralight with the SC5w!!

Conclusion: I ordered 2 of them yesterday!!! Thanks for asking your question. It hopefully is leading me to a new favorite!


----------



## Robot Mania FU

this_is_nascar said:


> If nothing else, ZL has gotten more PR over the last 48-hours than they have all year. Maybe that's part of the problem, if there is one.
> 
> 
> Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk



It certainly doesn't help. Almost everyone that has used my zebralights have never heard of them, and almost all of them have gone out and bought one afterwards. Getting the word out a little more would definitely help sales....it's just whether or not the production could keep up.


----------



## Owen

They're killing me with all these neutral H600F models.
H600Fw XHP35 4500k
H600Fc XHP50.2 4000k 
H600Fd XHP50.2 5000k

Ok, they're all Floody, all cost the same, the difference in output between versions isn't enough to make a practical difference, and the overall tint's more of a factor to me than the 80+ vs. 93-95 CRI.

I don't need a breakdown on temps, just am not familiar with the idiosyncrasies of these LEDs(I'm almost a decade behind on emitters!), so:
-Do any of them have a tendency to lean toward green?
-What about the beam profile? More punch on the XHP35, more peripheral light with the 50.2s, or can you really tell much difference with the frosted lens?
Thanks!


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Outdoorsman5 said:


> After I posted my reply to you regarding my preference for the SC53w over the SC5w, I began to think on which zebralights I ought to get in case ZL is going out of business. I hadn’t looked at the SC5w in a LONG TIME, but after I replied to your post, I noticed something I had never noticed before - the SC5w is a good bit more throwy (80*spill & 10*hotspot) than the SC53w (80*spill & 12*hotspot.) By those numbers the SC5w is around 20% more throwy! This is good news for me. I have been wishing for quite some time that ZL would come out with a “HI” version for the AA lights. Zebralight told me a couple of years ago that they had no plans to make a “HI” AA light. Well, over these recent years I never noticed that the SC5w has a smaller hotspot than my other favorite SC64w HI (which has a beam pattern 80* spill & 11*spot.)



Yes, the SC5w is a moderately throwy light. Too throwy for indoor use, IMO. But it's not bad outdoors, certainly when compared to other 1xAA lights.

I really like it as a night-light, ceiling-bounced. The lowest moonlight mode is perfect for middle-of-the-night. Or, second lowest moonlight if your house isn't pitch dark. It has a wide flat base, so it tail-stands really easily on any flatish surface.

The only downside is that getting max output is sometimes difficult, unless you're using new Eneloops (preferably Pros). I just set H2 to the second-highest level, and that's reliable. Not too big a deal, since max output (on a new regular Eneloop) only lasts a little over 20 minutes (if you keep boosting it up every 3 minutes, which is the timed step-down). So, it's not an output you'll use much. Still, be aware that 500 lumens is borderline.


----------



## Outdoorsman5

Thanks WITL!

I just found some bad news. If you look at ZL’s spreadsheet under “discontinued products,” you’ll see the SC5c and the SC5w are both on that list. Looks like ZL is about to retire two more key lights.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Outdoorsman5 said:


> Thanks WITL!
> 
> I just found some bad news. If you look at ZL’s spreadsheet under “discontinued products,” you’ll see the SC5c and the SC5w are both on that list. Looks like ZL is about to retire two more key lights.



Heh, well it sounds like the only one that won't be on the discontinued list next year is the A6 (and nobody will want that one).


----------



## Outdoorsman5

Owen said:


> They're killing me with all these neutral H600F models.
> H600Fw XHP35 4500k
> H600Fc XHP50.2 4000k
> H600Fd XHP50.2 5000k
> I don't need a breakdown on temps, just am not familiar with the idiosyncrasies of these LEDs(I'm almost a decade behind on emitters!), so:
> -Do any of them have a tendency to lean toward green?
> -What about the beam profile? More punch on the XHP35, more peripheral light with the 50.2s, or can you really tell much difference with the frosted lens?
> Thanks!



I have bought several “w” and “d” Zebralights this year and have not seen any green in my lights. 

I don’t know the answer to your other question as I only have frosted lenses riding on my XHP35 and XP-L2 frosted lights. Regarding the XHP35 LED with a frosted lense, it does have a bit of throw even though the lense is frosted. It’s definitely not like a bare LED like like you see in the a H503 or H603 or the like. My frosted lenses on my H53Fw and H600Fw are awesome. Both have a broad flood that is brightest in the center and the light spreads out getting a bit dimmer as it spreads out to the edges. I bet the XHP50.2 would have a more broad and even spread of the light, but prolly only a little bit (again, I’m guessing.) Hopefully someone else will weigh in for you.


----------



## Outdoorsman5

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Heh, well it sounds like the only one that won't be on the discontinued list next year is the A6 (and nobody will want that one).



Agreed!


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Outdoorsman5 said:


> I have bought several “w” and “d” Zebralights this year and have not seen any green in my lights.
> 
> I don’t know the answer to your other question as I only have frosted lenses riding on my XHP35 and XP-L2 frosted lights. Regarding the XHP35 LED with a frosted lense, it does have a bit of throw even though the lense is frosted. It’s definitely not like a bare LED like like you see in the a H503 or H603 or the like. My frosted lenses on my H53Fw and H600Fw are awesome. Both have a broad flood that is brightest in the center and the light spreads out getting a bit dimmer as it spreads out to the edges. I bet the XHP50.2 would have a more broad and even spread of the light, but prolly only a little bit (again, I’m guessing.) Hopefully someone else will weigh in for you.



The H600Fc doesn't have any green either. The tint and beam are very nice.


----------



## Buck91

Owen said:


> They're killing me with all these neutral H600F models.
> H600Fw XHP35 4500k
> H600Fc XHP50.2 4000k
> H600Fd XHP50.2 5000k
> 
> Ok, they're all Floody, all cost the same, the difference in output between versions isn't enough to make a practical difference, and the overall tint's more of a factor to me than the 80+ vs. 93-95 CRI.
> 
> I don't need a breakdown on temps, just am not familiar with the idiosyncrasies of these LEDs(I'm almost a decade behind on emitters!), so:
> -Do any of them have a tendency to lean toward green?
> -What about the beam profile? More punch on the XHP35, more peripheral light with the 50.2s, or can you really tell much difference with the frosted lens?
> Thanks!




My sc64w with the xhp35 has a fantastic tint. Yellowy-neutral and not green at all.

I do t have a ZL with xhp50 but my armytek xhp50 is a similar creamy neutral. My astrolux fr03 with a 5700k xhp50.2 shows a bit of tint shift through the reflector profile and is significantly cooler.

Not sure how much that helps but there ya go.


----------



## Owen

Mr. LED said:


> There’s a misconception around the Internet forums, that Zebralight is an American company with a third party production in China. The truth is Zebralight is a 100% Chinese company, the owner is Chinese and lives in China.


Probably something to do with that American flag with "American Owned & Operated" that's on every page of their site...


----------



## Owen

Thanks for the feedback on the tint, guys.
Since I have a SC64w HI on the way, I'll see how I like that before ordering. But that's a different XHP35 from the one in the H600Fw, I think. Gosh, I've turned into a layman about flashlight stuff!


----------



## NPL

I noticed that when I go to www.zebralight.com, I get redirected to Zebralight.3dCartStores.com
Is this happening to anybody else? 

Sent from my Pixel using Candlepowerforums mobile app


----------



## this_is_nascar

NPL said:


> I noticed that when I go to www.zebralight.com, I get redirected to Zebralight.3dCartStores.com
> Is this happening to anybody else?
> 
> Sent from my Pixel using Candlepowerforums mobile app


When I clicked your link.






Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## WebHobbit

Same here. And last time I tried typing zebralight.com into the address bar without WWW in front it actually threw a 404. This usually indicates some change in the web server....could be just some minor/temporary host reconfiguration....maybe



Just tried again and it still throws up an error page. when the WWW is REQUIRED it's generally a sign of amateur hour web-hosting. So this COULD indicate they moved to a cheaper host than they had previously hence the mismanaged web configuration


NOT A GOOD SIGN


----------



## Bob_McBob

Their site has been wonky like that for ages, so I wouldn't read into it too much.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

_Edited out domain name problem._


Okay, I see from the posts below that this is probably just a server problem, and nothing new.


----------



## WebHobbit

Nah - it's been 3dcartstores for a LONG time.....it was just configured to resolve as zebralight.com. I don't know how much you know about web-servers (I know a little as I use to do some website management and lite HTML/CSS coding on the side) but once you own your own domain you can either host it yourself (on your own computers) or pay a fee to a hosting company (most people do THAT). With a lot of small/medium eCommerce sites they use a company that runs a cart service as their host. But when it's configured correctly the cart service part is largely INVISIBLE to the visitor. Obviously SOMETHING is OFF here or we wouldn't be seeing this


----------



## WebHobbit

a WHOIS registration lookup:

*Domain Information*



 Name: ZEBRALIGHT.COM 
 Registry Domain ID: 894786000_DOMAIN_COM-VRSN 
 Domain Status:  clientDeleteProhibited 
 clientRenewProhibited 
 clientTransferProhibited 
 clientUpdateProhibited  
 Nameservers: DNS1.3DCART.COM
DNS2.3DCART.COM 
 Dates 

 Registry Expiration: 2028-03-26 09:00:51 UTC 
 Created: 2007-03-26 09:00:51 UTC


*Contact Information*

Registrant: 
 Organization: ZebraLight, Inc. 
 Mailing Address: Texas, United States 
 Technical: 

 Organization: ZebraLight, Inc. 
 Mailing Address: Texas, United States 
 Administrative: 

 Organization: ZebraLight, Inc. 
 Mailing Address: Texas, United States 
 Billing: 

 Organization: ZebraLight, Inc.
 Mailing Address: Texas, United States


---------------

This could all be just a misconfiguration on the part of 3dcart....they don't seem too stable


----------



## NPL

The latest signs of closure make me skeptical, but I think they aren't going out of business, and actually think we'll see a new set of models get released within the next 6 months. Either way, all this drama and it made me buy another Zebralight !


----------



## Mr. LED

Mr. LED said:


> I’ve just talked to my factory contact and I was told that Zebralight is NOT going out of business.



I think the conspiracy theorists didn’t read my post.


----------



## AstroTurf

i did, and it makes me think all the more... they are going out of business.



Mr. LED said:


> I think the conspiracy theorists didn’t read my post.


----------



## AstroTurf

the real question oughta be... which model will be the last one you buy before they pull the plug?!?


----------



## amanichen

Mr. LED said:


> I think the conspiracy theorists didn’t read my post.



Haha, conspiracy theorists seems to be an apt description; taking pieces of unrelated, ambiguous, and unconfirmed information and trying to come to a conclusion.

Zebralight is historically isolated in its communications (no PR department) which adds to the drama. This means the community builds the narrative for you.

I don't think theres ever been drama-free events surrounding what Zebralight does or doesn't do - they once released the world's best AA light and a handful of folks on CPF lost their S*** and felt the need to trash its performance claims. Most folks would just move on emotionally and just not buy the light if they feel it doesnt fit their needs, but something about Zebralight gets people all riled up, whether it's a good or "bad" move that the company makes.


On a related note, how does the American owned part (as claimed on its website) work? I get there is a "Zebralight Inc." registered in Delaware and Texas, but how does the ownership wotk? A quick google search identified it as a "foreign profit corporation".

So, is the statement on their website a lie, a half truth, or just a technicality due to US corporate laws being convoluted and full of loopholes?


----------



## WebHobbit

The problem is even after all these years we know very little about ZebraLight Inc. Why am I so passionate about their stuff? Well not to get too sappy (too late?) but personally I have always been "odd man out" my whole life. Things just don't seem "built for me". So when I find a product that seems MOLDED to fit my wee hobbit hands I tend to LATCH onto those items as best I can. it's happened a few times over the last few years...the Smith & Wesson J-Frame Revolver with boot grips....the CRKT Minimalist fixed blade knives...the Smith & Wesson Shield auto-pistol...& the ZebraLight 600 & 700 series flashlights.


----------



## SubLGT

Mr. LED said:


> I think the conspiracy theorists didn’t read my post.



Conspiracy? What conspiracy are you referring to?


----------



## adamlau

NPL said:


> I noticed that when I go to www.zebralight.com, I get redirected to
> Zebralight.3dCartStores.com


Web dev here. zebralight.com did not have a cert to support HTTPS. So rather than purchase and maintain a cert on their own for a mostly static site, they leveraged their current shopping cart provider to provide both the static and cart components of their website over HTTPS.



WebHobbit said:


> Same here. And last time I tried typing zebralight.com into the address bar
> without WWW in front it actually threw a 404. This usually indicates some change in the web
> server...


It only means that a URL forwarding rule has not (yet) been created via the DNS provider. For example: 

CNAME: www
Value : zebralight.com


----------



## WebHobbit

> It only means that a URL forwarding rule has not (yet) been created via the DNS provider. For example:
> 
> CNAME: www
> Value : zebralight.com




Right....but this was a change as it was working a couple of weeks ago


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

I don't think it's a conspiracy theory to think Zebralight is going out of business soon. All the discontinued models, not selling anywhere other than the US next year, closing their Texas locations permanently, etc. That certainly doesn't add up to a thriving business.

And do you really expect a company is going to tell you that they're going out of business, until they want to announce it??? The owners aren't even going to tell their employees that!

That said, they may not be going out of business. It's certainly possible they're just reorganizing for some kind of change next year. Maybe they're licensed a distributer to handle all non-US sales? But... that's not as likely as going out of business.

I hope they're still going to be in business, and selling world-wide! As long as the future isn't crap like the A6...


----------



## markr6

It's been a long time since I purchased any kind of light. I'm excited to try the H600Fc I have arriving tomorrow, just in time for another trip.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

markr6 said:


> It's been a long time since I purchased any kind of light. I'm excited to try the H600Fc I have arriving tomorrow, just in time for another trip.



That was my last Zebralight purchase, as well. Great little headlamp. Sadly, it will probably be my last Zebralight. I stopped buying this year when they jacked up shipping rates to Canada to about 50% of the price of a light! Next year, no shipping at all. And, probably gone everywhere, shortly afterwards.

If they survive, and come out with more lights, maybe I'll try nkon in Europe. If they still sell them.

But not the A6. Dumb model. I hate companies that sell crippleware just to try to compete in the budget market. It's going to be a "meh" light, but still sold at a premium price. I don't see how that is going to be a success. Maybe that's part of the problem.

I remember the crap that 4sevens came out with, shortly before they went bankrupt. I know that was a different situation (surefire sued them and killed their Quark interface), but their new designs were just awful. And their arrogance and distain for the flashaholic community didn't help. They never did recover.


----------



## nightshade

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> And their arrogance and distain for the flashaholic community didn't help. They never did recover.


 
I purchased several of the discontinued H52 variety when the design went bye-bye. 14500 support went away as well. I enjoy a quality light source and I'm not a battery snob or tint snob by any means. But it is odd to me to take away features from a design.
IMO, there are a few manufacturers, some very popular here, that carry that same disdain and arrogance. I've watched many a bubble get popped here, and it's the forum and community that gets along just fine without them.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

nightshade said:


> I purchased several of the discontinued H52 variety when the design went bye-bye. 14500 support went away as well. I enjoy a quality light source and I'm not a battery snob or tint snob by any means. But it is odd to me to take away features from a design.
> IMO, there are a few manufacturers, some very popular here, that carry that same disdain and arrogance. I've watched many a bubble get popped here, and it's the forum and community that gets along just fine without them.



I have two SC52 lights, and I also like that they can take a 14500 for the extra boost in output. I hardly ever use a 14500 in them, but it's a nice feature.

I think they dropped it in later AA lights, because they were trying to get the most out a 1.2v boost driver. My SC5w can get almost as bright with an Eneloop, but it absolutely requires clean contacts and a new cell. I'm not sure how I feel about that. I appreciate they were trying to make the highest output 1xAA light, but I think they need just a little better driver or battery to do it reliably.

I think this forum is a bit of a "canary in the coal mine" for flashlight companies that aren't competing in the "cheap department store" category. When they start scoffing at the idea of neutral tints or hiding away their annoying flashing modes, I think it's only a matter of time before their customer base is lost. Flashaholics are just a tiny market, but tend to be where the larger market is going, not where it has been in the past.


----------



## this_is_nascar

I read that 14500 support when away, so they could introduce the H1/H2, M1/M2 and L1/L2 support into their 1xAA offering.

They couldn't do both and decided the latter.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## Christoph

Which one were the last to support 14500's I have several older ones and don't want to fry any by trying.
TIA Chris


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

this_is_nascar said:


> I read that 14500 support when away, so they could introduce the H1/H2, M1/M2 and L1/L2 support into their 1xAA offering.
> 
> They couldn't do both and decided the latter.



No, my SC52's have all those functions, and still support AA and 14500. The only difference in modes is that H1 is a higher output with 14500. All other modes have the same level on AA or 14500.



Christoph said:


> Which one were the last to support 14500's I have several older ones and don't want to fry any by trying.
> TIA Chris



I believe the 52 series were the last ones to support 14500.


----------



## this_is_nascar

What would one expect to see when comparing an SC600w Mk IV HI to an SC600w Mk IV Plus?


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## NPL

this_is_nascar said:


> What would one expect to see when comparing an SC600w Mk IV HI to an SC600w Mk IV Plus?
> 
> 
> Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


Completely different lights. 

Sc600w Hi has much better tint, throws significantly further, and not well suited for up close use. Best for mid range to far illumination.

Sc600w plus is brighter, but tint is noticeably greener (can be corrected with a lee zircon filter). It's very floody, best suited for close up use. Best for close up to midrange illumination.
On highest setting, it will overheat faster than sc600w hi. 




Sent from my Pixel using Candlepowerforums mobile app


----------



## this_is_nascar

Thanks. Appreciate the response.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## Lou Minescence

So after reading the last 40 posts over the weekend while I was at camp about going out of business I decided I needed a H600W headlamp and would order one on Sunday when I got home to my computer. Sunday evening I go to the Zebralight site and just about everything is out of stock. Thanks a lot guys !


----------



## this_is_nascar

Lou Minescence said:


> So after reading the last 40 posts over the weekend while I was at camp about going out of business I decided I needed a H600W headlamp and would order one on Sunday when I got home to my computer. Sunday evening I go to the Zebralight site and just about everything is out of stock. Thanks a lot guys !


You snooze, you loose unfortunately.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## chillinn

All this talk and activity in the Zebralight thread made me anxious, so I've ordered 2 more SC5c II, along with a desperate request I expect will be ignored or denied. Worth a try. I don't mind the Cree XP-L2 EasyWhite tint during the day, but into the evening and night, the green cast starts to bother me. FWIW, I'd like these in sw30k and sw40k. Wish me luck.


----------



## PoliceScannerMan

Great marketing strategy happening here lol! Highly doubt they going out of business. Probably just a revamping.


----------



## Mgizler

PoliceScannerMan said:


> Great marketing strategy happening here lol! Highly doubt they going out of business. Probably just a revamping.




No kidding. I always thought their site was goofy and they always seemed to have no stock or back ordered on just about every light I ever looked at. So it doesn’t seem to me that they are going under.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

NPL said:


> Completely different lights.
> 
> Sc600w Hi has much better tint, throws significantly further, and not well suited for up close use. Best for mid range to far illumination.
> 
> Sc600w plus is brighter, but tint is noticeably greener (can be corrected with a lee zircon filter). It's very floody, best suited for close up use. Best for close up to midrange illumination.
> On highest setting, it will overheat faster than sc600w hi.



I agree with that completely. I use the SC600w IV HI as a general-purpose outdoor light for hiking. It has enough of a spill to use up close, though it's best for medium or farther distances. It's not going to compete with a dedicated thrower, but it's useful enough that you only need to use one light.

The SC600w IV Plus I use as a cycling light. It has a wide bright spill to see to the sides, but a good hotspot that can show things out to medium distances very well. It's also very efficient. I can run it for almost 3 hours at 700 lumens, using a Sanyo GA battery.




PoliceScannerMan said:


> Great marketing strategy happening here lol! Highly doubt they going out of business. Probably just a revamping.



Lol. If this is all fake, I expect they'll be having a bankruptcy sale every Christmas!


----------



## markr6

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Lol. If this is all fake, I expect they'll be having a bankruptcy sale every Christmas!



Like the furniture store that's been going out of business for 23 years straight now.


----------



## JimIslander

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Lol. If this is all fake, I expect they'll be having a bankruptcy sale every Christmas!



But this is real (from their site): "Starting Jan 1, 2021, we will accept orders from U.S. customers only." :thumbsup:


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

JimIslander said:


> But this is real (from their site): "Starting Jan 1, 2021, we will accept orders from U.S. customers only." :thumbsup:



Yes, and right now, most of their lights are back order or out of stock. I suspect most of those back-orders will never be filled, but we'll see next year.

If this is a ploy to get sales, they really suck at it if they don't have stock.

Personally, there's a couple of lights I'd like, but there's no way I would trust placing an order now. Zebralight charges your credit card or paypal as soon as you place the order, not when they ship. I guess you're protected with paypal, though.


----------



## markr6

I went with amazon just to be safe...but really for the prime shipping.


----------



## AstroTurf

are they gonna get you the best tint sample?



markr6 said:


> I went with amazon just to be safe...but really for the prime shipping.


----------



## chillinn

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Yes, and right now, most of their lights are back order or out of stock. I suspect most of those back-orders will never be filled, but we'll see next year.



It is absolutely normal and unremarkable that Zebralight has so many models on backorder. I had 6 lights ordered and fulfilled since September (obviously not counting my order today) of backordered SC5c/w II, and they were never _not_ on backorder. First couple orders were fulfilled in 2 weeks, my last order took a month



WalkIntoTheLight said:


> If this is a ploy to get sales, they really suck at it if they don't have stock.



I agree, but this practice of running out of stock is all too common by sellers of pretty much everything. 



WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Personally, there's a couple of lights I'd like, but there's no way I would trust placing an order now.



Maybe wait until or after Jan. 1, 2021? See my point? You have 30 days to order a Zebralight, or forget it, or have a friend in the South proxy for you.




WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Zebralight charges your credit card or paypal as soon as you place the order, not when they ship. I guess you're protected with paypal, though.



This is pretty normal, too. Without experience ordering from Zebralight, you're right to be paranoid WalkIntoTheLight. But they're a good seller, many many satisfied customers, and no complaints of unfulfilled orders. It is ok, really... they won't screw you. It might take a month to get to you, but IKEA takes 6 weeks just to ship a quad of NiMH cells, and I have a Convoy I ordered 3 months ago that still hasn't arrived. Sometimes getting a flashlight is a slow process, for whatever the reason, but it doesn't mean there's a scam or risk here.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

chillinn said:


> This is pretty normal, too. Without experience ordering from Zebralight, you're right to be paranoid WalkIntoTheLight. But they're a good seller, many many satisfied customers, and no complaints of unfulfilled orders. It is ok, really... they won't screw you. It might take a month to get to you, but IKEA takes 6 weeks just to ship a quad of NiMH cells, and I have a Convoy I ordered 3 months ago that still hasn't arrived. Sometimes getting a flashlight is a slow process, for whatever the reason, but it doesn't mean there's a scam or risk here.



I've ordered half a dozen lights from Zebralight in the past. And yes, I'm aware they're slow. I'm saying that I'd be hesitant to do that _now_, given all the signs they might be going out of business.

So, yeah, I'll be missing out on ordering my last zebralight. If they no longer want to sell to me, that's okay, it's their choice. Very strange business practice, if they're actually _not_ going out of business. A Chinese company that doesn't want to sell world-wide anymore? That's a first.


----------



## chillinn

Sorry, I read the comments above and saw the speculation, but I see absolutely no signs of anything. What signs?

I agree their business practices are strange compared to what business should be (stock up, sell stock, stock up, sell stock... why is this so hard?), and it doesn't excuse it, but there are a lot of weird flashlight businesses. Surefire is friggin weird. McGizmo is super great and all, but the business is weird. Maratac and County Comm are weird. So many flashlight makers are weird, that if one wasn't weird, it would be weird.


----------



## markr6

AstroTurf said:


> are they gonna get you the best tint sample?




LOL!! I haven't played that game for a long time, so maybe I'll do well. It just got delivered 10 minutes ago so I'll know here soon...



chillinn said:


> ...there are a lot of weird flashlight businesses. Surefire is friggin weird. McGizmo is super great and all, but the business is weird. Maratac and County Comm are weird. So many flashlight makers are weird, that if one wasn't weird, it would be weird.



There are a lot of weird people out there...glad I'm not one of them


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

chillinn said:


> Sorry, I read the comments above and saw the speculation, but I see absolutely no signs of anything. What signs?
> 
> I agree their business practices are strange compared to what business should be (stock up, sell stock, stock up, sell stock... why is this so hard?), and it doesn't excuse it, but there are a lot of weird flashlight businesses. Surefire is friggin weird. McGizmo is super great and all, but the business is weird. Maratac and County Comm are weird. So many flashlight makers are weird, that if one wasn't weird, it would be weird.



Well, it's already been mentioned in this thread, but I think it's the recent changes in Zebralight's business that points to them closing soon. They are not selling anywhere other than the US starting next month, they have permanently closed their Texas location, and they are discontinuing some of their best models (without replacements).

Sure, the fact their website sucks is nothing new, but the other things definitely point to rapidly shrinking business. My guess is that the owners (who live in China) have moved on to something else. I think they've been doing this for almost 10 years. Perhaps they found a better opportunity, or got bored with it. It's been 3 years since the last major shake-up of their models. Just the SC700d, earlier last year, for anything new. That's pretty slow design for an electronics company, if they were serious about the business.


----------



## WebHobbit

markr6 said:


> I went with amazon just to be safe...but really for the prime shipping.



Amazon is rife with "unintentional" knock-off fakes due to binning. I haven't heard of any knock-off ZLs....but I wouldn't be surprised if there were.


----------



## WebHobbit

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Well, it's already been mentioned in this thread, but I think it's the recent changes in Zebralight's business that points to them closing soon. They are not selling anywhere other than the US starting next month, they have permanently closed their Texas location, and they are discontinuing some of their best models (without replacements).
> 
> Sure, the fact their website sucks is nothing new, but the other things definitely point to rapidly shrinking business. My guess is that the owners (who live in China) have moved on to something else. I think they've been doing this for almost 10 years. Perhaps they found a better opportunity, or got bored with it. It's been 3 years since the last major shake-up of their models. Just the SC700d, earlier last year, for anything new. That's pretty slow design for an electronics company, if they were serious about the business.



Didn't we find out a few years back that the owners name was "George something" and he lived and ran the business from his home in Texas (manufacturing being in China)? Didn't the story say he was an expatriate from China?


----------



## adamlau

Contracting services seems to be the norm for most businesses these days. Personally, I am not overly concerned.


----------



## Owen

Owen said:


> I have a pair of unprotected Orbtronic 3500mAh IMRs(bought by accident instead of protected cells) listed as 18.5x65.6mm, but saw the Sanyos on the ZL site are 18.2x65.1mm. Doesn't seem like much difference, but I didn't want to take any chances.


FYI, after finding the Orbtronic data pdf, plus weighing and putting the calipers to them, anyway, these are the same cells.
$10.75 from Orbtronic, $6.00 on sale from ZL.


The SC64w HI is just freaky good. Phenomenal tint, and what a range of output. I'm used to my old SC52w, and the difference between its dingy tint and the new light's is pretty drastic. Between that and the tighter spot, it seems brighter, and provides noticeably better illumination, at similar output.
Most impressive to me is the output on the H2 level I chose, that's rated at 467 lumens. Sure, it pulls 240mA more(1.1A vs 860mA from the same battery) at the tail than my beloved old ~300 lumen Malkoff M61N, but I wasn't expecting it to just walk all over it. The comparison did confirm what I'd always thought-that my M61N has exceptionally good tint. Just a fuzz warmer, and a bit rosy in the spill(which actually makes natural colors stand out). Man, these newer LEDs are awesome, though...


----------



## chillinn

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Well, it's already been mentioned in this thread, but I think it's the recent changes in Zebralight's business that points to them closing soon.



I missed the bit about closing their Texas location, but I would question the source of this news, as the website still lists a TX address for returns and warranty. 

But more poignantly, you may have an opinion, and that is fine, but I see no support for the argument: "facts x, y, z, therefore they're going out of business." Support might be something along the lines of, "I saw three other companies that did z, and they went out of business," even if that is weak, it does support the argument.

In my experience, product companies do not prepare to go out of business, other than filing chapters 11 and 13... and do not give signs of going out of business other than reporting poor revenue for a long time. Rather, they just pop out of existence with no warning, and all their stock shows up on eBay. I just don't see the evidence as evidence of anything, but I am willing to entertain the idea they are going out of business, if only there was support for the argument.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

WebHobbit said:


> Amazon is rife with "unintentional" knock-off fakes due to binning. I haven't heard of any knock-off ZLs....but I wouldn't be surprised if there were.



I doubt it. Zebralights would be too hard to fake (unibody), and are not popular enough to be worth it.



WebHobbit said:


> Didn't we find out a few years back that the owners name was "George something" and he lived and ran the business from his home in Texas (manufacturing being in China)? Didn't the story say he was an expatriate from China?



Zebralight's directors are listed as George and Ling Yao. Not sure where they live, but someone else said China and they sounded pretty certain about it. I think that is most likely, since all the manufacturing is done there. (And probably design, when they used to do it.)

But, you could be right. There was probably some reason they incorporated in Texas. Might have been legal or tax reasons, though.


----------



## WebHobbit

https://www.corporationwiki.com/Texas/Irving/ling-yao/39425465.aspx

https://www.corporationwiki.com/Texas/Irving/george-yao/39425457.aspx


[url]https://businessprofiles.com/details/zebralight-inc/TX-0801189019/george-yao
[/URL]


----------



## SubLGT

PoliceScannerMan said:


> Great marketing strategy happening here lol! Highly doubt they going out of business. Probably just a revamping.



Probably a downsizing, like ArmyTek has done


----------



## Outdoorsman5

chillinn said:


> I missed the bit about closing their Texas location, but I would question the source of this news, as the website still lists a TX address for returns and warranty.



I think you missed this as well. Regarding our “source,” a couple of us looked up ZL on Google Maps in Texas. The plant is listed as “Permanently Closed.” Why would that not serve as a “sign” that ZL could be closing?



chillinn said:


> But more poignantly, you may have an opinion, and that is fine, but I see no support for the argument: "facts x, y, z, therefore they're going out of business." Support might be something along the lines of, "I saw three other companies that did z, and they went out of business," even if that is weak, it does support the argument.



You “see no support for the argument?” Ok
- Texas plant “permanently closed.”
- Key lights discontinued. 
- ZL responded to questions about the discontinued lights and were told “no replacement lights planned.” 
- Their website states they are only selling to the US market starting in Jan. 
- VERY few new products in recent years. 

Those reasons are concerning to a ZL fan like me, and they appear to be symptoms of a failing company. This line of thinking looks logical to some of us. 



chillinn said:


> In my experience, product companies do not prepare to go out of business, other than filing chapters 11 and 13... and do not give signs of going out of business other than reporting poor revenue for a long time. Rather, they just pop out of existence with no warning, and all their stock shows up on eBay. I just don't see the evidence as evidence of anything, but I am willing to entertain the idea they are going out of business, if only there was support for the argument.



I’d recommend reading the the last few pages in this post. Regarding your comment stating, “companies do not prepare to go out of business,” I think it’s the opposite. When a company knows they are shutting down, they plan it out. I watched my dad plan the closure of his business. It took him about 5 years to wind it down. I was in upper management with a large builder in the SE U.S. that went under in 2009. We planned our exit from the market over the course of 1.5 years. We started with office closures, layoffs, cutting costs, stopped new construction, and liquidated assets. We even planned out our exit with our creditors. I remember telling our creditors in Oct 2008 that we would be out of money by Feb 2009. 

I hope these aren’t symptoms of Zebralight failing. There’s no one else out there that I’m interested in, so I’m hoping this evidence is just coincidental.


----------



## chillinn

Outdoorsman5 said:


> I think you missed this as well. Regarding our “source,” a couple of us looked up ZL on Google Maps in Texas. The plant is listed as “Permanently Closed.” Why would that not serve as a “sign” that ZL could be closing?



First of all, how do you have any idea what that address was used for? Why is it a "plant?" Are you assuming they make stuff there? Why? What evidence is there it is anything more than a business office or small warehouse? I looked it up on Google Maps Street View. It is completely unremarkable, and small. Why would it serve as a sign some location was closed? Businesses move, restructure, change, grow, shrink. You can just hold up some fact and say, "see?" But that doesn't prove anything, and it doesn't even suggest anything but confirmation bias. You're just seeing what you want to see without anything to actually support the conclusion.





Outdoorsman5 said:


> You “see no support for the argument?”



Nope. Not one little doggone thing to indicate that whatsoever.



Outdoorsman5 said:


> Ok
> - Texas plant “permanently closed.”



deja vu. What _plant??_

You have an address. Suddenly, somehow, without any evidence whatsoever, it is a manufacturing plant! 




Outdoorsman5 said:


> - Key lights discontinued.



Completely meaningless, and entirely ordinary and unremarkable for Zebralight. That is what they do. They develop a model, sell it for a few years, then stop when the parts are all gone, discontinue the model. There is a spreadsheet on the site of all their current and discontinued models. and every single one of those dozens of discontinued models could be described as "key" (why not?), and yet Zebralight never went out of business each time they discontinued a model. It is a ludicrous suggestion. 



Outdoorsman5 said:


> - ZL responded to questions about the discontinued lights and were told “no replacement lights planned.”



Again, completely ordinary and unremarkable of correspondence with Zebralight. What does it even mean? Is it possible that they were saying one thing and you were interpreting something else entirely? Could it possibly be that they might not consider some new model in the works as a replacement? I am telling you it means nothing, and there is no evidence to suggest otherwise.




Outdoorsman5 said:


> - Their website states they are only selling to the US market starting in Jan.



Again, so what? How on earth are you connecting this to "going out of business?" 



Outdoorsman5 said:


> - VERY few new products in recent years.



Hmm... I think the same thing is true of Apple, Inc. OMG!!! Apple must be going out of business!!! That's called counter-example and it decimates your insinuated argument (because there is no actual supportive argument here... just a "hey look! Fact X!" With a conclusion drawn that simply in no way shape or form follows from "Fact X" alone.



Outdoorsman5 said:


> Those reasons are concerning to a ZL fan like me, and they appear to be symptoms of a failing company. This line of thinking looks logical to some of us.



Show me any other failed company with the same characteristics or description, show me any failed company whatsoever that closed one location, that discontinued "key products," that corresponded with customers saying they would not replace some product, and that ceased global sales and only sold in the US. Do that, and your suspicions may not be off the wall. But if you can not... your suspicions are off the wall.





Outdoorsman5 said:


> I’d recommend reading the the last few pages in this post. Regarding your comment stating, “companies do not prepare to go out of business,” I think it’s the opposite. When a company knows they are shutting down, they plan it out. I watched my dad plan the closure of his business. It took him about 5 years to wind it down.



Oh, good. At least Zebralight will be here for another 5 years. See? Now you have ME jumping to conclusions without any evidence to believe such a thing.



Outdoorsman5 said:


> I was in upper management with a large builder in the SE U.S. that went under in 2009. We planned our exit from the market over the course of 1.5 years. We started with office closures, layoffs, cutting costs, stopped new construction, and liquidated assets. We even planned out our exit with our creditors. I remember telling our creditors in Oct 2008 that we would be out of money by Feb 2009.



How much inventory did you have? Oh, it was a building company, so there was no inventory. I guess that is really identical to Zebralight's business. 



Outdoorsman5 said:


> I hope these aren’t symptoms of Zebralight failing. There’s no one else out there that I’m interested in, so I’m hoping this evidence is just coincidental.



No one as of yet has explained why they might be symptoms of Zebralight failing... and yet the belief just comes out of nowhere. 

Do not believe your worst fears simply because they are your worst fears. Have reasons that explain why you believe what you do, not simply a list of completely unrelated and unremarkable facts, which is what that short list is... it is just barely enough for a conspiracy theory.


----------



## Owen

You jokers are just pathetic.


----------



## chillinn

Owen said:


> You jokers are just pathetic.



Owen
Kevin Klein's daughter has a pretty cool band, but she sort of sings like Nico (Christa Päffgen) ala Velvet Underground. (The better version of Femme Fatal is a cover)


----------



## Outdoorsman5

Chillinn, I’m not quite sure why this has gotten your panties all up in a wad. How the points of this discussion that are concerning to us ZL fans are sooooo outlandish. You took every observation I/we laid out and discredited each one quite childishly & deceitfully. If you don’t want to participate in a “discussion” then I don’t care one little bit. If you want to turn a discussion into an argument like a little child, then again, I don’t care. You have turned this thread into a WASTE OF TIME FOR EVERYONE. If I were a mod, I’d peal you back a bit. It’s guys like you that ruin good places like CPF.


----------



## markr6

Got the H600Fc last night. Warmer than I prefer but that CRI totally makes up for it!!!

Now the new (to me) headband SUCKS BIG!! Hard crunchy elastic just feels cheap and less maneuverable. It's also VERY hard to adjust because the one side you use to grab and pull is now static...fixed to the plastic D-ring. So you have to reach UNDER the band to pull the loose end...and a bunch of hair with it. Just horrible!

The top band is now permanently attached too! I never use it anyway, but it was nice to have the option to remove/reattach it.

I ordered a separate headband from ZL hoping it's the old version, since I can't imagine they sell may of those and hopefully have old stock. Worth a $7 gamble I guess.


----------



## Christoph

I just got a H600c MK IV and the top head strap is not permanently attached each band can be taken off the band is a stiffer one than came on my other head lamps though I have no idea if it is better or worse yet. I adjust it before I put it on my head so no issues with it grabbing my hair .
Chris


----------



## markr6

Christoph said:


> I just got a H600c MK IV and the top head strap is not permanently attached each band can be taken off the band is a stiffer one than came on my other head lamps though I have no idea if it is better or worse yet. I adjust it before I put it on my head so no issues with it grabbing my hair .
> Chris




Mine was attached permanently, unlike the old one with a slot in the rubber that you could undo. Regarding the adjustment I'm just used to tightening/loosening it often depending on if I'm wearing a hat in the winter. I supposed I could get used to it.


----------



## chillinn

Outdoorsman5 said:


> Chillinn, I’m not quite sure why this has gotten your panties all up in a wad. How the points of this discussion that are concerning to us ZL fans are sooooo outlandish. You took every observation I/we laid out and discredited each one quite childishly & deceitfully. If you don’t want to participate in a “discussion” then I don’t care one little bit. If you want to turn a discussion into an argument like a little child, then again, I don’t care. You have turned this thread into a WASTE OF TIME FOR EVERYONE. If I were a mod, I’d peal you back a bit. It’s guys like you that ruin good places like CPF.



You are making it personal, and you are projecting. I am not in the slightest bit disturbed by this, nor have I claimed anything other than that the "evidence," if it can be called that, does not in the least bit support the conclusion that Zebralight is going out of business. Maybe they are going out of business, but the offered evidence does not support that conclusion, nor any conclusion. That ZL closed one address (maybe they moved or downsized), and told someone they would not replace some model (maybe they meant only that particular model), and starting 2021 will only sell to US customers (maybe their international sales are so low, it isn't worth pursuing), in and of themselves, simply quite says _nothing at all_. I once worked at a small firm that had many clients, but one major client. The revenue from that one major client was larger than all the rest put together. The business failed because we were spending equal amounts of time on all the clients, rather than all the time on the one major client. That could easily be the reason ZL has decided to only sell to US customers, because the revenue from US sales may and probably does exceed all international sales combined, and it simplifies things and makes it less expensive to simplify. 


Chances are good that you're going to interpret every bit of evidence as confirmation of your beliefs. I'm only trying to persuade you that the evidence doesn't really mean much if anything important whatsoever. It really doesn't bother me at all that some have minds that are completely illogical and/or irrational and tend to leap to unsupported conclusions. Some get an idea in their head, and there is just no dislodging it. Rumors and fretting serve no valid purpose and at the same time can be damaging. What is elementary here is we simply do not know, and there is no valid, incontrovertible reason to remotely entertain such a fantasy. Whereof one does not know, thereof one can not speak.


----------



## markr6

If history tells us anything about Zebralight, we should expect to be surprised at any moment. And never really know what's going on. I hope they keep on going, even if there aren't huge changes to the product lineup.


----------



## MB320

On the topic of ‘discontinued key models’ - I’m struggling to see it? The SC600 HI emitter isn’t available anymore so their hand was forced with that. So the only other is the SC5 series which is unfortunate but not a huge departure I would say.

I’m hopeful for their future even though I would be affected with the new US only shipping.


----------



## Outdoorsman5

chillinn said:


> You are making it personal, and you are projecting. I am not in the slightest bit disturbed by this, nor have I claimed anything other than that the "evidence," if it can be called that, does not in the least bit support the conclusion that Zebralight is going out of business. Maybe they are going out of business, but the offered evidence does not support that conclusion, nor any conclusion. That ZL closed one address (maybe they moved or downsized), and told someone they would not replace some model (maybe they meant only that particular model), and starting 2021 will only sell to US customers (maybe their international sales are so low, it isn't worth pursuing), in and of themselves, simply quite says _nothing at all_. I once worked at a small firm that had many clients, but one major client. The revenue from that one major client was larger than all the rest put together. The business failed because we were spending equal amounts of time on all the clients, rather than all the time on the one major client. That could easily be the reason ZL has decided to only sell to US customers, because the revenue from US sales may and probably does exceed all international sales combined, and it simplifies things and makes it less expensive to simplify.
> 
> 
> Chances are good that you're going to interpret every bit of evidence as confirmation of your beliefs. I'm only trying to persuade you that the evidence doesn't really mean much if anything important whatsoever. It really doesn't bother me at all that some have minds that are completely illogical and/or irrational and tend to leap to unsupported conclusions. Some get an idea in their head, and there is just no dislodging it. Rumors and fretting serve no valid purpose and at the same time can be damaging. What is elementary here is we simply do not know, and there is no valid, incontrovertible reason to remotely entertain such a fantasy. Whereof one does not know, thereof one can not speak.



All any of us around here want to do is discuss the things that interests us. I (and I believe we all) would like to have the freedom to speak openly without some condescending know-it-all arriving on the scene to correct our every word with their vast so-called knowledge. The fact is, some alarming things have taken place with ZL, and that naturally makes us fans concerned. You were clearly offended that I/we were concerned by the closure of the Texas plant (and yes, it was a manufacturing plant as described to me 8ish years ago by James Walker who was the marketing director) and by the changes on their website to sell to US market only, etc., and you saw fit to put us all in our place. You also sucked the fun out of the discussion. You will be blind to this, but you have been deceitful and self-righteous in everything you posted above. My interest in continuing this with you has dropped to exactly 0.


----------



## AstroTurf

markr6 said:


> Got the H600Fc last night. Warmer than I prefer but that CRI totally makes up for it!!!
> 
> Now the new (to me) headband SUCKS BIG!! Hard crunchy elastic just feels cheap and less maneuverable. It's also VERY hard to adjust because the one side you use to grab and pull is now static...fixed to the plastic D-ring. So you have to reach UNDER the band to pull the loose end...and a bunch of hair with it. Just horrible!
> 
> The top band is now permanently attached too! I never use it anyway, but it was nice to have the option to remove/reattach it.
> 
> I ordered a separate headband from ZL hoping it's the old version, since I can't imagine they sell may of those and hopefully have old stock. Worth a $7 gamble I guess.



I just use the back strap on a baseball cap. Works Great!!!


----------



## AstroTurf

MB320 said:


> On the topic of ‘discontinued key models’ - I’m struggling to see it? The SC600 HI emitter isn’t available anymore so their hand was forced with that. So the only other is the SC5 series which is unfortunate but not a huge departure I would say.
> 
> I’m hopeful for their future even though I would be affected with the new US only shipping.



Don’t discount the SC64 HI, which is still available on their website, It’s pretty good too!!!


----------



## MB320

AstroTurf said:


> Don’t discount the SC64 HI, which is still available on their website, It’s pretty good too!!!



Oh totally! That’s sort of my point. There’s noise being made about key models being discontinued, but they haven’t been. Not without good reason at least.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

markr6 said:


> Mine was attached permanently, unlike the old one with a slot in the rubber that you could undo. Regarding the adjustment I'm just used to tightening/loosening it often depending on if I'm wearing a hat in the winter. I supposed I could get used to it.



I bought a couple of headbands when I bought my H600Fc IV (I like the GITD option). To be honest, I haven't even opened any other than the one that came with the light, but I like it. The only problem I find is that it does tend to loosen over time. The straps are too slippery for a good grip on the buckle. But other than that, it's comfortable, doesn't move around, and holds the light in place really well. If they would make the straps a bit more grippy, it would be perfect.

I have headbands on other lights that really suck in comparison. Way too flimsy, or really difficult to fit my fat skull.

On the subject of zebralight closing, I guess we'll just have to wait a few months and see. The only thing that really concerns me is the reduction of sales to US only. That can't be a good sign, no matter how you spin it. I suppose it's possible they signed some kind of exclusive dealer licensing arrangement that handles all international sales. But, since they've been selling international just fine up to now, I don't understand why they would do that.


----------



## PoliceScannerMan

AstroTurf said:


> Don’t discount the SC64 HI, which is still available on their website, It’s pretty good too!!!



Honestly my favorite ZL. And I have had a ton of em.


----------



## chillinn

Outdoorsman5 said:


> All any of us around here want to do is discuss the things that interests us. I (and I believe we all) would like to have the freedom to speak openly without some condescending know-it-all arriving on the scene to correct our every word with their vast so-called knowledge. The fact is, some alarming things have taken place with ZL, and that naturally makes us fans concerned. You were clearly offended that I/we were concerned by the closure of the Texas plant (and yes, it was a manufacturing plant as described to me 8ish years ago by James Walker who was the marketing director) and by the changes on their website to sell to US market only, etc., and you saw fit to put us all in our place. You also sucked the fun out of the discussion. You will be blind to this, but you have been deceitful and self-righteous in everything you posted above. My interest in continuing this with you has dropped to exactly 0.



I think I should know when I am offended or not, and I am just not that delicate. So you speak for everybody here, even me. And only YOU are allowed to say what you want, but any rational dissent is not tolerated?!? Sounds familiar. Really great board you run here, Outdoorsman5. Keep up the good work, we're all counting on you.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

PoliceScannerMan said:


> Honestly my favorite ZL. And I have had a ton of em.



Yeah, the SC64w HI is a really sweet EDC. I used to EDC their AA lights, but once I got the SC64w HI that's the only one I'd consider now. Not much bigger than their AA lights, and packs so much more punch with far nicer tint. I'd like to get the LE version, but, well, I guess that's not happening.

I still prefer the larger SC600 lights if I'm going for a walk, though. A bit easier to carry, and since I'm using them all the time, I don't have to worry about the extra size in my pocket. The split ring on the SC600's is great for a lanyard, so I don't drop it. That's not as easy with the SC64.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

BTW, I just went to nkon, to check out what Zebralights they have, and they're out of stock of almost every model too! Even worse than zebralight.com. It sure seems like production stopped sometime in the past month or two.


----------



## Greta

*chillinn*.... Time to take some more time off. Not even going to give a warning this time. You already know. See you after Christmas. :wave::santa:


----------



## this_is_nascar

Damnit.... I couldn't control myself, again, and just ordered a "SC600w Mk IV Plus 18650 XHP50.2 Neutral White Flashlight", that I probably really don't need.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

this_is_nascar said:


> Damnit.... I couldn't control myself, again, and just ordered a "SC600w Mk IV Plus 18650 XHP50.2 Neutral White Flashlight", that I probably really don't need.



Depends. It makes a fantastic bike light. But, not so great for a general-purpose light. Too much flood to see very far with it, so it's limited to moderate distances outdoors. And, it's a bit big for comfortable EDC. Good for around the house, though.


----------



## PoliceScannerMan

I was researching that model, seems like a lot of complaints about green tint.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

PoliceScannerMan said:


> I was researching that model, seems like a lot of complaints about green tint.



It's not that bad. But, there's definitely some green in the corona. Not noticeable in normal use, though. The tint is definitely better than Zebralights from 5 years ago. But, it's not nearly as good as the lights using the XHP35 HI emitter.


----------



## PoliceScannerMan

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> It's not that bad. But, there's definitely some green in the corona. Not noticeable in normal use, though. The tint is definitely better than Zebralights from 5 years ago. But, it's not nearly as good as the lights using the XHP35 HI emitter.



I know what you mean, real use all that tint stuff goes away. I jog at nite, sounds like a winner, I may order one.


----------



## this_is_nascar

I know of the current ZL offerings, this should be the last one I'm ordering. Famous last words......


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## AstroTurf

I would also say a SC700d should be considered also.



PoliceScannerMan said:


> I know what you mean, real use all that tint stuff goes away. I jog at nite, sounds like a winner, I may order one.


----------



## AstroTurf

Depends on which models you currently have?!?



this_is_nascar said:


> I know of the current ZL offerings, this should be the last one I'm ordering. Famous last words......
> 
> 
> Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## gunga

I tried to look into one, dang $33 DHL shipping. I guess gone are the days of free shipping. I'll pass.


----------



## AstroTurf

nkon may be a better bet?



gunga said:


> I tried to look into one, dang $33 DHL shipping. I guess gone are the days of free shipping. I'll pass.


----------



## NPL

gunga said:


> I tried to look into one, dang $33 DHL shipping. I guess gone are the days of free shipping. I'll pass.


Does the shipping fee go away after a certain amount is reached? 

Sent from my Pixel using Candlepowerforums mobile app


----------



## holygeez03

I am still hoping that ZL upgrades the SC600w IV Plus with a nicer emitter... It is my most used light before... I would order a second, but I really want a better LED in it. I have heard that ZL has at least omitted the coating that supposedly helps eliminate the purple ring around the outer edge of the beam.


----------



## this_is_nascar

AstroTurf said:


> Depends on which models you currently have?!?


Some of the 53, 64 and 600 series. Not looking to get them, just to get them. I don't want a 21700 based ZL.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## AstroTurf

Thanks



this_is_nascar said:


> Some of the 53, 64 and 600 series. Not looking to get them, just to get them. I don't want a 21700 based ZL.
> 
> 
> Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

NPL said:


> Does the shipping fee go away after a certain amount is reached?



Not for Canada. They've been slowly increasing the shipping fee here for years. It used to be free, when I started buying from them. Up until this year, it was around $15. Now, it's just ridiculous. They clearly don't want to sell to Canada, and they're making that certain next month anyway.

Yeah, you can check out nkon, but I just did and they have very little in stock.

Like I said before, Zebralight is not a business that seems like it wants to do business. Other than kind-of in the US, anyway (at least until they shut down there too).


----------



## NPL

There's a really cool modded Zebralight sc64w with 90 cri xhp35 hi for sale on the other forum. Very tempting! 

Sent from my Pixel using Candlepowerforums mobile app


----------



## JStraus

Did you check to see if you have the ability to remove the top band by disconnecting the band's end loop/sleeve that's attached to the middle 'bar' of the adjustment slider? That middle bar has a gap in it that you can wiggle the elastic free from and then remove the top band. Let me know if this doesn't make sense! (Or if it works!)



markr6 said:


> Mine was attached permanently, unlike the old one with a slot in the rubber that you could undo. Regarding the adjustment I'm just used to tightening/loosening it often depending on if I'm wearing a hat in the winter. I supposed I could get used to it.


----------



## WebHobbit

holygeez03 said:


> I am still hoping that ZL upgrades the SC600w IV Plus with a nicer emitter... It is my most used light before... I would order a second, but I really want a better LED in it. I have heard that ZL has at least omitted the coating that supposedly helps eliminate the purple ring around the outer edge of the beam.



I love my SC600w IV Plus. For me it's my EDC on my days off work. Any odd tint shift it has I NEVER notice when actually using the light other than white wall stuff. The size fits perfectly in my left front pants pocket. Now I will admit the HI version IS cleaner on a white wall....and that light is my EDC for work days as I find the the less floody slightly brighter spot is better for my job (inspecting cartons of merchandise and reading the markings in often shadowy areas). I love them both.


----------



## this_is_nascar

My Plus has shipped. Looking forward to it.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## PoliceScannerMan

this_is_nascar said:


> My Plus has shipped. Looking forward to it.
> 
> 
> Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk



Quick heads up. They shipped mine real quick last order but it didn’t actually ship for a few days. I may sell something and get one of these too.


----------



## AstroTurf

The last light to complete my collection is on the way.

A SC600w MK IV HI, w00 h00!!!


----------



## markr6

JStraus said:


> Did you check to see if you have the ability to remove the top band by disconnecting the band's end loop/sleeve that's attached to the middle 'bar' of the adjustment slider? That middle bar has a gap in it that you can wiggle the elastic free from and then remove the top band. Let me know if this doesn't make sense! (Or if it works!)




I see what you're saying, but one end is still permanently attached to the rubber lamp holder part. No big deal since I can cut it off; I never used that over 7 years now. I still like the old adjustment though. It turns out I did waste $7 on a replacement - even though the photos show the old one, ZL confirmed I will be getting the new version. Darn!!!

But with all the manufacturers out there now I should be able to fund another I like better. Maybe Fenix or Thrunite.\

This looks like a good option. Question is, will it just be the same setup? https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07RTHSHVW/?tag=cpf0b6-20


----------



## JStraus

@markr6 That does look like a good option. And I know people rave about the Amytek headband for the Zebras.

To be absolutely sure, is your top band different than this? Because the bottom buckle with the slider perpindicular to the band is the one that detaches from itself and I can wiggle it through the rubber loop on the top of the light mount. The top buckle in the pic for me is the one that attaches to the rear of the side band.


----------



## Outdoorsman5

JStraus said:


> @markr6 That does look like a good option. And I know people rave about the Amytek headband for the Zebras.



Hey JStaus,

I haven't tried out the Armytek headbands and wasn't actually aware of them. What are the advantages over the zebras? I might need to try them out. Thanks


----------



## JStraus

Sorry I have no idea, I'm happy with my ZL band without the top strap. Over a few years it has worn a bit so I get a backup when I placed my last Zebralight order... One of the replacements by Amytek looks like you can just clip the light in instead of pushing it through the loops but I'm not sure if it would fit the Zebra's tube. If it would that would be nice to be able just unclip to use handheld. I think others say that it's just more comfortable. 



Outdoorsman5 said:


> Hey JStaus,
> 
> I haven't tried out the Armytek headbands and wasn't actually aware of them. What are the advantages over the zebras? I might need to try them out. Thanks


----------



## Ev148

Trying to choose an 18650 flashlight. I hope you guys can help! I've been a fan of Zebralight since they first started up and although I have a few other flashlights, I turn to my Zebralights for serious use. I live on a small homestead/farm in a rural area. When night falls it's gets freakin' dark and when I go outside to lock up my animals for the night there's all kinds of noxious and even dangerous critters out there creeping around. I have a H600w mk lV and an SC5W mk ll. I want to get a hand held compact light along the lines of of the h600w, but with more throw if possible and better CRI. The SC5w is a great indoors light, but it just doesn't have the throw I wan t outdoors and I do notice the lack of CRI (though it's pretty good). The SC600w Hi seems great, but a little too big to pocket and forget about. So I've settled on an SC64. I just can't figure out which one. The SC64w Hi and the SC64c LE both seem awesome. I love high CRI, but I'm hesitant to go for the LE because it might not have enough throw--I'd like to be able to briefly ramp up to full power and see what creature those reflecting eyes 100 yards out there belong to. I can do this with my H600w, barely, and I'm hoping for at least that much throw in the SC64 I get. So... my question: Should I go for the SC64w Hi and forgo some CRI in favor of more throw or is the LE with higher CRI going to have enough throw to do what I need and in addition have awesome CRI. I'd love that, just don't want it at the sacrifice of throw.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Ev148 said:


> Trying to choose an 18650 flashlight. I hope you guys can help! I've been a fan of Zebralight since they first started up and although I have a few other flashlights, I turn to my Zebralights for serious use. I live on a small homestead/farm in a rural area. When night falls it's gets freakin' dark and when I go outside to lock up my animals for the night there's all kinds of noxious and even dangerous critters out there creeping around. I have a H600w mk lV and an SC5W mk ll. I want to get a hand held compact light along the lines of of the h600w, but with more throw if possible and better CRI. The SC5w is a great indoors light, but it just doesn't have the throw I wan t outdoors and I do notice the lack of CRI (though it's pretty good). The SC600w Hi seems great, but a little too big to pocket and forget about. So I've settled on an SC64. I just can't figure out which one. The SC64w Hi and the SC64c LE both seem awesome. I love high CRI, but I'm hesitant to go for the LE because it might not have enough throw--I'd like to be able to briefly ramp up to full power and see what creature those reflecting eyes 100 yards out there belong to. I can do this with my H600w, barely, and I'm hoping for at least that much throw in the SC64 I get. So... my question: Should I go for the SC64w Hi and forgo some CRI in favor of more throw or is the LE with higher CRI going to have enough throw to do what I need and in addition have awesome CRI. I'd love that, just don't want it at the sacrifice of throw.



I don't think you're going to get the throw you want from the SC64 form factor. If you really want to try it, the SC64w HI is your best bet, but you'll probably find it doesn't throw as far as you want. It sounds like you need a dedicated thrower. Something in a C8 form is both cheap and effective. It's not pocketable, but it works. The best bet for a pocketable light with decent throw is the SC600w HI, but you already said that's too big, so...

Another suggestion is the BLF GT mini. Again, not pocketable, but still fairly small and effective.


----------



## SYZYGY

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> I don't think you're going to get the throw you want from the SC64 form factor. If you really want to try it, the SC64w HI is your best bet, but you'll probably find it doesn't throw as far as you want. It sounds like you need a dedicated thrower. Something in a C8 form is both cheap and effective. It's not pocketable, but it works. The best bet for a pocketable light with decent throw is the SC600w HI, but you already said that's too big, so...
> 
> Another suggestion is the BLF GT mini. Again, not pocketable, but still fairly small and effective.



agreed. and i'll add that sc64c LE is in no way a thrower.


----------



## PoliceScannerMan

I would go 64 HI, the tint is real nice, and I'm a CRI guy. Good throw for its size.


----------



## Ev148

PoliceScannerMan said:


> I would go 64 HI, the tint is real nice, and I'm a CRI guy. Good throw for its size.



Thanks for the input! I went ahead and ordered an SC64w Hi. I want throw, but the small size is real important to me too. If it has just a little more than my H600w Mk lV that will be enough. The LE version is 3-4 weeks back ordered anyway. The Hi shipped within an hour or two of of my order. My H600w has decent tint and a great beam, but it does wash out colors just a bit. I hope the Hi is better in that regard.


----------



## aginthelaw

AstroTurf said:


> The last light to complete my collection is on the way.
> 
> A SC600w MK IV HI, w00 h00!!!



Where’d you get it?


----------



## AstroTurf

Same as you... Fingers Crossed, until it is in my hands.



aginthelaw said:


> Where’d you get it?


----------



## MB320

Well I was quoted 4 weeks for my backordered SC700d, shipped today after 6 days. My last direct order from them.


----------



## ktsl

AstroTurf said:


> Same as you... Fingers Crossed, until it is in my hands.


Which is?


----------



## AstroTurf

ktsl said:


> Which is?



Nkon


----------



## this_is_nascar

Being into flashlights for over 20-years and being a ZL owner for less than a year, I could have saved mucho dollars of I had tried one sooner.

I'm finding that I'm ready to sell off a bunch of my remaining lights,


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## AstroTurf

this_is_nascar said:


> Being into flashlights for over 20-years and being a ZL owner for less than a year, I could have saved mucho dollars of I had tried one sooner.
> 
> I'm finding that I'm ready to sell off a bunch of my remaining lights,
> 
> 
> Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk



Quoted for TRUTH!!!


----------



## Ev148

AstroTurf said:


> Quoted for TRUTH!!!



Most of my lights are Zebralights. I really like how the interface eventually becomes so intuitive that I can pick one up and get the level I want without conscious thought.


----------



## Streak

It's been a long time since I bought a Zebralight. All my existing ones I bought directly off their website.
I would like to order an SC64w HI which is indicates as being back ordered but will allow the transaction to take place.
How long is is taking for these backordered items to be fulfilled?
I am in the US.


----------



## PoliceScannerMan

Ev148 said:


> Thanks for the input! I went ahead and ordered an SC64w Hi. I want throw, but the small size is real important to me too. If it has just a little more than my H600w Mk lV that will be enough. The LE version is 3-4 weeks back ordered anyway. The Hi shipped within an hour or two of of my order. My H600w has decent tint and a great beam, but it does wash out colors just a bit. I hope the Hi is better in that regard.



Awesome, looking forward to your impression when you receive it. I’m sure you’ll like. Love mine!


----------



## this_is_nascar

Streak said:


> It's been a long time since I bought a Zebralight. All my existing ones I bought directly off their website.
> I would like to order an SC64w HI which is indicates as being back ordered but will allow the transaction to take place.
> How long is is taking for these backordered items to be fulfilled?
> I am in the US.


For what's it's worth, I ordered either my SC64w HI or SC64c LE (I don't recall which) when shown in a backordered status and it arrived within a week.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## Streak

this_is_nascar said:


> For what's it's worth, I ordered either my SC64w HI or SC64c LE (I don't recall which) when shown in a backordered status and it arrived within a week.
> 
> 
> Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk



Thanks. How long ago was that? I have also emailed ZL and await their reply.
Am I right that the SC64 LE version is no longer available even though both it and the HE version say back ordererd?


----------



## this_is_nascar

Streak said:


> Thanks. How long ago was that? I have also emailed ZL and await their reply.
> Am I right that the SC64 LE version is no longer available even though both it and the HE version say back ordererd?


Sorry, I'm not the one to ask about availability and what is still or not in production. My example was several months ago.



Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## this_is_nascar

The latest member of the family, a new Plus version.










Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## AstroTurf

love the dark anno, congrats!!!

ps is that a gerber back there?



this_is_nascar said:


> The latest member of the family, a new Plus version.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## this_is_nascar

AstroTurf said:


> love the dark anno, congrats!!!
> 
> ps is that a gerber back there?


Sure is....


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## elzilcho

I was thinking about an SC53, probably better to hold off until spring or summer to see how ZL's business is doing. If they're still viable for warranty repair and support then I'll consider it again but no sense buying something now that might be orphaned in the near future. The SC64 I have is nice and I wouldn't mind getting something from them that runs on a more common battery.


----------



## this_is_nascar

Wow. Just took this Plus in the backyard and compared it to the HI. The Plus definitely puts out a wall of light, illuminating everything in its path.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## NPL

Just received my new sc700fd. Very impressed. Beam looks fantastic, smooth, with zero tint shift. Colour rendering is very good, and not much green compared to sc600w plus. Pretty amazing range from moonlight to 3000L of high cri pure white light. This light is going to become a regular dark winter pocket carry. 

Sent from my Pixel using Candlepowerforums mobile app


----------



## Ev148

Just received my SC64w Hi. I think I got a good one, nice tint, anodizing, switch, and I love the form factor. But... I did some comparisons with a AAA light I have with a Nichia 219 emitter, and I guess I'm rethinking my priorities--colors just look so much more vivid and 3 dimensional with the higher CRI and warmer tint. I contacted Zebralight to see if I can exchange it for an SC64c LE. I'm not totally sure I'm going to do the exchange, but I probably will.


----------



## Ev148

Ev148 said:


> Just received my SC64w Hi. I think I got a good one, nice tint, anodizing, switch, and I love the form factor. But... I did some comparisons with a AAA light I have with a Nichia 219 emitter, and I guess I'm rethinking my priorities--colors just look so much more vivid and 3 dimensional with the higher CRI and warmer tint. I contacted Zebralight to see if I can exchange it for an SC64c LE. I'm not totally sure I'm going to do the exchange, but I probably will.



I went outside tonight and tested the light in the hay field behind my house. The amount of light that little thing puts out is pretty astonishing. It's going to be a difficult choice, because I really like having the potential for all that output even if it's at the expense of a little CRI and warm tint. But I do love high CRI. I wonder how much less output and throw I'd get with the SC64c LE.


----------



## NPL

Ev148 said:


> I went outside tonight and tested the light in the hay field behind my house. The amount of light that little thing puts out is pretty astonishing. It's going to be a difficult choice, because I really like having the potential for all that output even if it's at the expense of a little CRI and warm tint. But I do love high CRI. I wonder how much less output and throw I'd get with the SC64c LE.


Sounds like the best solution is owning both!


----------



## this_is_nascar

The LE won't throw as far or have as pronounced a hotspot as the HI does.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## PoliceScannerMan

Correct you will lose probably 40-50% throw. Just a guess.


----------



## Ev148

PoliceScannerMan said:


> Correct you will lose probably 40-50% throw. Just a guess.



Bummer. The throw and overall pattern is just right. Tint and CRI actually pretty good, it just doesn't hold up to a side by side comparison with a Nichia emitter. Yes owning both may be the way to go, redundant as it sounds, but that would be admitting that I have an obsession. Can't do that.


----------



## PoliceScannerMan

I would give it a few days, may grow on you.


----------



## neutralwhite

*Starting Jan 1, 2021, we will accept orders from U.S. customers only.*


----------



## AstroTurf

w00 h00, Moar 4 mE!!!



neutralwhite said:


> *Starting Jan 1, 2021, we will accept orders from U.S. customers only.*


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

AstroTurf said:


> w00 h00, Moar 4 mE!!!



Or less, when they decide to go out of business.


----------



## AstroTurf

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Or less, when they decide to go out of business.



With 20 ZL on my desk... I prolly need to stop now.


----------



## NPL

AstroTurf said:


> With 20 ZL on my desk... I prolly need to stop now.


Now you need to rank them for us, from fav down. 

Sent from my Pixel using Candlepowerforums mobile app


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

AstroTurf said:


> With 20 ZL on my desk... I prolly need to stop now.



I only have 8, but yeah, maybe it's a good thing they're no longer going to sell to me.


----------



## adamlau

Their site has been down since yesterday. Was going to pick up a couple as gifts


----------



## PoliceScannerMan

adamlau said:


> Their site has been down since yesterday. Was going to pick up a couple as gifts



Working for me


----------



## Netter1283

I finally bit the bullet and bought a roll of d-c fix for my SC64c LE and I’m very pleased with the results. That said, I have a ton of this stuff leftover...

If anyone is interested for a 4x9” piece of the d-c film, I will mail you one for $3 (PayPal) via USPS first class. I figure it’s a win-win. It’s the ‘milky’ color and is self-adhesive. Sticks great and removes easily without any residue.


----------



## adamlau

PoliceScannerMan said:


> Working for me


Seems as if the old HTTP site is active again and HTTPS fails to resolve.


----------



## likethevegetable

^ I bought a roll of DC-Fix from Home Depot, cut out a few inches then returned it. I'm going to hell :devil: haha


----------



## this_is_nascar

likethevegetable said:


> ^ I bought a roll of DC-Fix from Home Depot, cut out a few inches then returned it. I'm going to hell [emoji317] haha


SMH... says a bunch about your character. Hope you're proud.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## bigburly912

likethevegetable said:


> ^ I bought a roll of DC-Fix from Home Depot, cut out a few inches then returned it. I'm going to hell :devil: haha



So you stole 20 bucks and bragged about it on a flashlight forum. Congratulations.


----------



## DTW1

I ordered an H600c Mk IV (backorder status) on 12/4. This will be my first "real" flashlight so trying to be patient and hope the wait is worth it.


----------



## neutralwhite

+1.



bigburly912 said:


> So you stole 20 bucks and bragged about it on a flashlight forum. Congratulations.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

likethevegetable from Canada said:


> ^ I bought a roll of DC-Fix from Home Depot, cut out a few inches then returned it. I'm going to hell :devil: haha



I emailed Zebralight, several years ago, to ask why they dropped the free shipping option for Canadian customers. They responded that Canadians were ripping them off, by claiming they never received the light, and getting their paypal reversed. So, Zebralight would now only use services that required a in-person signature from the customer on delivery, for Canada.

I thought they were probably just mistaken, because why would so many Canadians be scummy enough to do something like that? Now, I finally have my answer.


----------



## this_is_nascar

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> I emailed Zebralight, several years ago, to ask why they dropped the free shipping option for Canadian customers. They responded that Canadians were ripping them off, by claiming they never received the light, and getting their paypal reversed. So, Zebralight would now only use services that required a in-person signature from the customer on delivery, for Canada.
> 
> I thought they were probably just mistaken, because why would so many Canadians be scummy enough to do something like that? Now, I finally have my answer.


As a private seller here on CPF for more years than I care to count, I stopped shipping to Canada for similar reasons.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## this_is_nascar

Of the two SC700 offerings remaining on the website, how do they differ in real world usage?


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## 1313

I have a regular Sc700d and it’s plenty floody... not sure what you’d gain with the Fd.


----------



## Lou Minescence

I have the non floody SC700 and it can flood my entire yard. It has 2 rings on the outer edges of the beam. If you wanted to perfectly flood your yard with no rings in the beam I guess the floody version is the one to buy.
I’m happy with the non floody version I have.


----------



## NPL

I consider myself very picky with beam quality and tint shift. Having used the xhp70 in a reflector in other lights, I found the tint shift very bothersome especially indoors. In practical use, it's fine, but it bothered me and ended up adding diffusion (DC Fix) to make for an even tinted beam. There's also something beautiful about a hot spot that blends smoothly into the spill. I just acquired the sc700fd, and the beam is beautiful because of the very lightly frosted lens. It does sacrifice some throw, but you aren't buying the sc700d or fd for throw anyways. If you aren't sure, safer bet is to get the clear lens version, and add DC Fix to the lens if you want to clean up the tint shift. 

Sent from my Pixel using Candlepowerforums mobile app


----------



## this_is_nascar

Thanks for all the feedback everyone.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## AstroTurf

likethevegetable said:


> ^ I bought a roll of DC-Fix from Home Depot, cut out a few inches then returned it. I'm going to hell :devil: haha



I got one better...

I’ll go buy the tool I need for a job, and return it when I’m done.


----------



## Owen

Gosh, I think they sold out of just about everything overnight.
The models I had an interest in, anyway, including 2 I just gave someone links to yesterday.
You can put a "Back Order" item in your cart, but not one that's "Out of Stock":shrug:


----------



## PoliceScannerMan

The ones "back ordered" are they still shipping out quick?


----------



## id30209

Owen said:


> Gosh, I think they sold out of just about everything overnight.
> The models I had an interest in, anyway, including 2 I just gave someone links to yesterday.
> You can put a "Back Order" item in your cart, but not one that's "Out of Stock":shrug:



That’s how i placed an order 2 days ago. Last chance to get them while shipping to EU still available. EU stores won’t have them any time soon. 


Sent from Tapatalk


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Their website is no longer secure. If I try to use https, it goes to their host 3dcartstores and says the page is no longer active. Be cautious about using Zebralight's website... something isn't right.


----------



## SYZYGY

this_is_nascar said:


> Of the two SC700 offerings remaining on the website, how do they differ in real world usage?



i have the sc700d and would not want it any more floody.
it's not the light for you if you're a tint snob though.



AstroTurf said:


> I got one better...
> 
> I’ll go buy the tool I need for a job, and return it when I’m done.


----------



## desmobob

bigburly912 said:


> So you stole 20 bucks and bragged about it on a flashlight forum. Congratulations.



+1. Shows great character. :thumbsdow


----------



## jak

Greta said:


> *chillinn*.... Time to take some more time off. Not even going to give a warning this time. You already know. See you after Christmas. :wave::santa:


Sorry, I'm late to this discussion, but what exactly did that guy say to get banned? Is there something that you can quote? I'm only asking because I agreed with many of the points/counterpoints he addressed/made, and wish not to be banned. Maybe I missed something?
(DM/PM me if this is not the suitable place to respond.)


----------



## MB320

jak said:


> Sorry, I'm late to this discussion, but what exactly did that guy say to get banned? Is there something that you can quote? I'm only asking because I agreed with many of the points/counterpoints he addressed/made, and wish not to be banned. Maybe I missed something?
> (DM/PM me if this is not the suitable place to respond.)



I agree, thought he added needed balance to the discussion. A 'ban' seemed pretty hasty.


----------



## likethevegetable

this_is_nascar said:


> SMH... says a bunch about your character. Hope you're proud.





bigburly912 said:


> So you stole 20 bucks and bragged about it on a flashlight forum. Congratulations.



Guys, me admitting to my shiesty antics is not bragging about it, I'm definitely ashamed, haha. Am I going to lose sleep over borrowing a fews cents worth of adhesive plastic from a multi-billion dollar corporation (that othwise would have costed 1/5 of my ZebraLight)? Heck no. But would I purchase something of more substantial value, abuse it, and return it to a small company that is owned by hard-working people more like me? Definitely not.

It's easy to be sanctimonious over the internet. I'm sure you guys have done a few greasy things in your days.


----------



## AstroTurf

No more terrible than those that would purchase multiple lights of the same model, pick the best tint of the bunch, then return the rest...

He who is without sin, let him cast the first stone.

I find no fault here!!!

Cheers, Jim


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

likethevegetable said:


> Guys, me admitting to my shiesty antics is not bragging about it, I'm definitely ashamed, haha. Am I going to lose sleep over borrowing a fews cents worth of adhesive plastic from a multi-billion dollar corporation (that othwise would have costed 1/5 of my ZebraLight)? Heck no. But would I purchase something of more substantial value, abuse it, and return it to a small company that is owned by hard-working people more like me? Definitely not.
> 
> It's easy to be sanctimonious over the internet. I'm sure you guys have done a few greasy things in your days.



You're not screwing Home Depot. You're screwing the next guy that buys the roll of DC-Fix, after Home Depot puts it back on the shelf.

And, in any case, it's still not okay to steal from HD.


----------



## this_is_nascar

So much to say, but it's just not worth it.


----------



## PoliceScannerMan

It would be nice if we could move on and get back to talking ZL.


----------



## desmobob

likethevegetable said:


> Guys, me admitting to my shiesty antics is not bragging about it, I'm definitely ashamed, haha. Am I going to lose sleep over borrowing a fews cents worth of adhesive plastic from a multi-billion dollar corporation (that othwise would have costed 1/5 of my ZebraLight)? Heck no. But would I purchase something of more substantial value, abuse it, and return it to a small company that is owned by hard-working people more like me? Definitely not.
> 
> It's easy to be sanctimonious over the internet. I'm sure you guys have done a few greasy things in your days.



The person who pays their hard-earned money to buy that returned roll is the one who has to deal with your actions, not the multi-billion-dollar corporation that you have decided it's OK to steal from. If you try hard enough, you can justify stealing anything from anyone...

And no; I'm no angel, but that doesn't mean I can't find issue with your ethics. 

Still enjoying my H600w MkII and trying to be an honest person,
Bob


----------



## this_is_nascar

PoliceScannerMan said:


> It would be nice if we could move on and get back to talking ZL.


I agree. I was on the fence about the SC700d, but I really don't want to introduce yet another battery platform.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## this_is_nascar

desmobob said:


> The person who pays their hard-earned money to buy that returned roll is the one who has to deal with your actions, not the multi-billion-dollar corporation that you have decided it's OK to steal from. If you try hard enough, you can justify stealing anything from anyone...
> 
> And no; I'm no angel, but that doesn't mean I can't find issue with your ethics.
> 
> Still enjoying my H600w MkII and trying to be an honest person,
> Bob


Nicely said.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## PoliceScannerMan

this_is_nascar said:


> I agree. I was on the fence about the SC700d, but I really don't want to introduce yet another battery platform.
> 
> 
> Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk



The green tint has me from pulling the trigger.


----------



## NPL

PoliceScannerMan said:


> The green tint has me from pulling the trigger.


The green tint is not nearly as bad as XP-L2 high cri ZLs. If you add a Lee Zircon minus green filter, will remove any green. I added a Lee Zircon minus green to my sc64c LE and beam is perfect now.

I have even used stronger Lee filters on the XP-L2 to make the beam rosy, but at a bigger sacrifice on output.


----------



## Greta

jak said:


> Sorry, I'm late to this discussion, but what exactly did that guy say to get banned? Is there something that you can quote? I'm only asking because I agreed with many of the points/counterpoints he addressed/made, and wish not to be banned. Maybe I missed something?
> (DM/PM me if this is not the suitable place to respond.)





MB320 said:


> I agree, thought he added needed balance to the discussion. A 'ban' seemed pretty hasty.



Rule #4

Nothing more to see here. Move along.

How about those Zebralights, eh?


----------



## MB320

Strange... Moving along indeed.


----------



## desmobob

I'm sure this has been covered somewhere, but why did Zebralight stop supporting the use of 14500s in the AA lights? Once I discovered AA lights that could use a 14500 (I love my Tool AAs and EagTac D25A MkII), I started thinking about picking up another Zebralight headlamp in AA size. Then I found out they didn't support the 14500 and the desire to purchase one kind of waned.

I know it's not really a big deal, but it did make the difference in my deciding to pass on another one headlamp from Zebralight.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

desmobob said:


> I'm sure this has been covered somewhere, but why did Zebralight stop supporting the use of 14500s in the AA lights? Once I discovered AA lights that could use a 14500 (I love my Tool AAs and EagTac D25A MkII), I started thinking about picking up another Zebralight headlamp in AA size. Then I found out they didn't support the 14500 and the desire to purchase one kind of waned.
> 
> I know it's not really a big deal, but it did make the difference in my deciding to pass on another one headlamp from Zebralight.



Probably they just started using a different driver, and it didn't support dual-chemistry. I'm sure that Zebralight doesn't design their own drivers, they just use off-the-shelf components. Basically, the NiMH-only driver got close-enough to the output of the dual driver, so they figured it didn't add all that much value anymore. At the time, lithium-ion 14500 cells didn't have any more energy than an Eneloop, so run-time wasn't a concern.


----------



## likethevegetable

I thought maybe supporting the two chemistries, therefore voltage ranges, required more logic, and the updated UI consumed more memory? But then again, memory is cheap nowadays. I would wager that WalkIntoTheLight is probably correct, and perhaps they updated their choice in driver and they didn't feel like the extra work was worth it. Then again, ZL likes to put in the design work it seems (I would argue that a PID controller is overkill and PI would be simpler and just as a effective, and likely would have saved them the oscillation issues some of the Mk IVs got)


----------



## AstroTurf

WoW, Nkon only has 1 ZL left in stock...

bummer


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

AstroTurf said:


> WoW, Nkon only has 1 ZL left in stock...



Yeah, I figure there are two possible outcomes in the new year:

1. Zebralight goes out of business, or

2. They carve off a separate unit for international sales, and all orders must go through them. That would explain why dealers are no longer getting lights. Maybe launch a new lineup of models for this.

Frankly, (2) seems weird, and doesn't explain the lack of lights available for this Christmas season. Their business model just sucks this year, and the only new light they've come up with in years is the SC700. (1) seems more likely.


----------



## AstroTurf

Agreed


----------



## likethevegetable

ZebraLight going out of business would be tragic for the flashlight world. They truly create an unmatched, well-engineered product. Really hope they are holding on. Wish they would communicate better with their buyers. Based on what we see here, Reddit, TLF, BLF, backpacking forums, they are only increasing in demand and with a bit of marketing, I don't see why they couldn't thrive.


----------



## Netter1283

Anyone interested in a brand new SC600Fc IV Plus? GP Knives had two left so I ordered them both. They're identical and perfect. I would keep it as a backup but would be happy to pass it off to someone who would actually use it. $99 shipped, Priority Mail.


----------



## moshow9

I hope this isn't the end for Zebralight. The 501w and SC32w were my favorites and I regret selling them.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

likethevegetable said:


> ZebraLight going out of business would be tragic for the flashlight world. They truly create an unmatched, well-engineered product. Really hope they are holding on. Wish they would communicate better with their buyers. Based on what we see here, Reddit, TLF, BLF, backpacking forums, they are only increasing in demand and with a bit of marketing, I don't see why they couldn't thrive.



It might just be they're not too profitable at the current price point. Illum once told me that they stopped selling zebralights, because the margins that zebralight left them were the lowest in the business. So, it may just be that producing the lights is rather expensive, and they can't raise the price much more or they'd kill the market.

They could go with something like the ridiculously high price point that HDS uses. But, that's a very small market, and I don't think they could get away with tripling prices because they've already established the price at current levels. So, they may just be stuck.

Or, perhaps the owners have just gotten bored and moved on to more interesting or better paying jobs.

I'm surprised they wouldn't try to sell the company. Maybe they have, and that's why things are changing next month? It might explain why there's no stock, or dealers, and why their website is almost abandoned. It also might explain why they shut down the Texas location. It could be a rebranding is about to happen. I think that's the best outcome we could hope for.


----------



## markr6

Oh man juicy thread yesterday and I missed all off it! Anyway...

Speaking of dc fix though, I'm starting to think I like that on a standard model better than the F versions. They're close, but still a slightly more useful beam with the dc fix. And it hasn't budged the slightest bit on my H600w that I've been using for 7 years. No peeling, not even collecting lint or grime around the edges.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

markr6 said:


> Oh man juicy thread yesterday and I missed all off it! Anyway...
> 
> Speaking of dc fix though, I'm starting to think I like that on a standard model better than the F versions. They're close, but still a slightly more useful beam with the dc fix. And it hasn't budged the slightest bit on my H600w that I've been using for 7 years. No peeling, not even collecting lint or grime around the edges.



The dc fix must cut down on some light, though. There are more surfaces for the light to go to, so more diffractions each time the light has to pass through a surface. With the frosted lens, there's only 2 surfaces. With dc fix, you now have 4 surfaces. It may not have a significant effect, but I'd be interested to see some tests from someone who has an accurate sphere to measure it.

Aside from that, though, I agree that it's a good solution. If you don't like it, you can simply remove it. You can't really do that with a frosted lens.


----------



## likethevegetable

My experience, having owned and tested a H53c + DC-Fix and H53Fc at the same time, is that they are perceptibly identical. The beam shape, and brightness, were indistinguishable to me (except for greenish tint on the H53Fc due to lottery). I later used the Ceiling Bounce app and the measurements were very close, to what I'd call within error.

I've gotten to the point where an imperceptible drop in efficiency, say 1-3%, does not matter to me (putting on the practical engineer hat), because it is, well imperceptible! I (fortunately) don't find myself in situations where that 1% extra of battery juice or brightness would have saved my life (if that was the case, I'd use a cool white beam). Although the analytical engineer hat on wants to see the actual measurements with precision instrumentation.

And markr6, I'm also astounded at how reliable DC-Fix is, to the point where the non-F models would be my first recommendation if someone isn't 100% sure they want the floody beam.


----------



## markr6

If it does cut light, I can only say it's a good thing. I rarely use H1 mode, and in every other mode the output seems perfect. I'm never looking for more lumens. In fact, sometimes M1 is a bit too bright and L1 is too dim, so the M2 is perfect. I can't say for certain that's because of the dc fix, but it sure isn't hurting. I use M2 a lot in camp while backpacking.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Agreed that the default M1 and M2 are the only modes I use on my H600Fc IV. H1 is just stupid-bright. H2 is a waste of light, too. L1 (or lower) are just too dim unless I only want to see my own feet. M2 is perfect for working on things up-close, and M1 is perfect for walking around outside.


----------



## pappajohan

All this activity in this thread got me carrying my Zebras again.

Currently my SC600W MK IV Plus, gotta say that i cannot remember why instopped EDCing theese things...

Who needs magnetic charging, right?

Skickat från min SM-N986B via Tapatalk


----------



## Outdoorsman5

this_is_nascar said:


> Of the two SC700 offerings remaining on the website, how do they differ in real world usage?



Hey Nascar,
I just got a SC700Fd sent to me. I already own the SC700d. The two lights are very similar, but the SC700d is a bit more throwy (than the frosted version) even though it's so floody. I'm thinking I will use the frosted version indoors and the other for both indoors and outdoors. If I could only have one, it'd definitely be the SC700d. You could always add dc fix to it as discussed above to match the frosted version. I should have done that. 

One more thing to mention to you or anyone who might care - The SC700d lights are, in my opinion, the most attractive Zebralights of them all (I'm talking about the light itself; I'm not talking about the beam which is also awesome - a perfect 5000k color with no blues or greens!!) The light is really nice looking. I now own 3 (two SC700d's and one SC700Fd). All three are for use at home mostly. 

I go camping every month with our scout troop and prefer the smaller lights on those trips, but my wife & I just hiked up a mountain for sunset with friends. I carried the SC700d for the 2.5 mile hike down the mountain in the dark and was so impressed with it's bright perfect white floody output. I normally prefer a more throwy handheld, but this light was very nice for us all to see the trail (I had my SC600w HI with me too, but mostly used the 700 that night.)

Hope that helps!


----------



## PoliceScannerMan

Outdoorsman5, you just sold me, order placed for a SC700d!!!


----------



## Outdoorsman5

PoliceScannerMan said:


> Outdoorsman5, you just sold me, order placed for a SC700d!!!



 I'd be surprised if you didn't love it too (and then want another one like I did!)


----------



## PoliceScannerMan

Outdoorsman5 said:


> I'd be surprised if you didn't love it too (and then want another one like I did!)



I jog at nite with my wife, and I prefer a flooder (with some throw for dogs/critters) that fills the road right to left 10 ft in front of us. This should be nice for that.


----------



## Outdoorsman5

PoliceScannerMan said:


> I jog at nite with my wife, and I prefer a flooder (with some throw for dogs/critters) that fills the road right to left 10 ft in front of us. This should be nice for that.



I agree. Good choice!


----------



## NPL

Anybody here own the Sc600fc mk4 plus? Feedback? 

Sent from my Pixel using Candlepowerforums mobile app


----------



## Outdoorsman5

Hey, I just wanted to report the following: I ordered a few lights from ZL recently, and two lights are defective. Also, the "My Account" portion of ZL's website is not currently working (hopefully that's just temporary.) So, at the moment, I can't report this to ZL to get replacements. Hope the problem with their website isn't lasting.

So anyone else receiving new lights can be on alert, the defects are as follows: 

- One of my SC5w II does not have the lowest two settings programmed in the light. The .33 mode and the .09 mode = no light at all. So, the light will allow me to pick one of those settings, but there is no light when I am in either of those settings. In other words, if I have .09 programmed in L2 then when I select L2, there is no light coming out of the flashlight - same with the .33 mode. Bummer. I alerted ZL yesterday on their website, but they have not responded. Today, I discovered another one of my new lights has a different defect detailed below, but since their website isn't currently working I can't report this one.

- My new SC600w IV abruptly cuts off when in H1 max. It does this quite frequently as well. Sadly, I had this problem with 4 lights in a row a few years ago. I even posted videos here on CPF after being told by a few people that I was doing something wrong. The fact was that the lights were defective, and now that same defect has shown up again. Thankfully, just in this one light though. 

So, be aware and watchful for these defects, and hopefully ZL's website will be working again soon.


----------



## MB320

Shame that you're having issues. Although the 'my account' section seems to be working fine for me so maybe that's fixed


----------



## this_is_nascar

Outdoorsman5 said:


> Hey Nascar,
> I just got a SC700Fd sent to me. I already own the SC700d. The two lights are very similar, but the SC700d is a bit more throwy (than the frosted version) even though it's so floody. I'm thinking I will use the frosted version indoors and the other for both indoors and outdoors. If I could only have one, it'd definitely be the SC700d. You could always add dc fix to it as discussed above to match the frosted version. I should have done that.
> 
> One more thing to mention to you or anyone who might care - The SC700d lights are, in my opinion, the most attractive Zebralights of them all (I'm talking about the light itself; I'm not talking about the beam which is also awesome - a perfect 5000k color with no blues or greens!!) The light is really nice looking. I now own 3 (two SC700d's and one SC700Fd). All three are for use at home mostly.
> 
> I go camping every month with our scout troop and prefer the smaller lights on those trips, but my wife & I just hiked up a mountain for sunset with friends. I carried the SC700d for the 2.5 mile hike down the mountain in the dark and was so impressed with it's bright perfect white floody output. I normally prefer a more throwy handheld, but this light was very nice for us all to see the trail (I had my SC600w HI with me too, but mostly used the 700 that night.)
> 
> Hope that helps!


Thanks. I really appreciate the response and information. It's certainly tempting, but I really don't want another battery type to support.

That being said, I'm not totally discounting the idea of getting one and it's the D that I'd get.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## moshow9

As mentioned by WalkIntoTheLight, Zebrslight's website is not secure at this moment. I wouldn't want to login or place an order st this time until it becomes secure again.



WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Their website is no longer secure. If I try to use https, it goes to their host 3dcartstores and says the page is no longer active. Be cautious about using Zebralight's website... something isn't right.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Outdoorsman5 said:


> - My new SC600w IV abruptly cuts off when in H1 max. It does this quite frequently as well. Sadly, I had this problem with 4 lights in a row a few years ago. I even posted videos here on CPF after being told by a few people that I was doing something wrong. The fact was that the lights were defective, and now that same defect has shown up again. Thankfully, just in this one light though.



That is a pretty common problem with Zebralight's XHP35 lights. I have two MkIV lights with the XHP35 HI emitter, and they both have the problem where they will shut off when first turning them on to H1. Luckily, it only happens in cold weather with my lights. And, they work fine in H1 on the second attempt. Lights with different emitters seems to be okay, though I don't use them as much in cold weather so I can't be sure.

Anyway, I'm convinced it's a problem with the driver that Zebralight uses with the XHP35 LED.


----------



## NPL

Any recommendations for bike mounts to put a Zebralight on ones helmet or handlebars?

Sent from my Pixel using Candlepowerforums mobile app


----------



## likethevegetable

I like the Olight FB-1 for a handlebar mount (https://www.amazon.ca/dp/B076D84CQQ/).

It's simple and effective. I did have one break though--the collar holding the screw-head that joins two brackets together basically ripped off after a couple years. Ripped off when I was pulling the silicon to put a light on.
For the price though, I bought another one. I usually have a lanyard fixed on my FL to the bars for backup, so my ZL babies won't catastrophically fall off.


----------



## markr6

Or these: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B001CJXB5E/?tag=cpf0b6-20

I like the velcro since you can really adjust it to whatever size you need and crank it down tight.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

I've tried a couple of the velcro varieties, and I don't really like them. Yes, they're easy, but they also tend to gradually slip during a ride, so you have to readjust your light at least a couple of times during a ride. Not a bit deal, I suppose, but I much prefer the hard plastic grippers. Once you fix them, they'll stay that way pretty-much forever. I can't post a link, but I got a couple of them from banggood. They look like two plastic circles on top of each other, offset by 90 degrees.


----------



## holygeez03

I REALLY hope I am wrong... but there do appear to be some signs of ZL "re-structuring".

It's possible that another entity has or will be buying the brand.

Either way... I think I will buy a backup SC600w IV Plus while it exists... have been waiting for an upgrade, even if only slightly better tint or CRI.


----------



## id30209

Yeah i agree with this ^^^^^^
I also bought few models so now i’m covered with every CRI model except SC700. Just too ugly and Theunite T2 does great job also


Sent from Tapatalk


----------



## NPL

Fenix bike mount looks good too but pricey. Does the olight stay in place if your light is angled downwards? 

Sent from my Pixel using Candlepowerforums mobile app


----------



## Climb14er

I'll jump in and say that Zebralight has served me very well for the last nine years as I regularly, every day, use their first gen SC600, 52cw and 62cw. My other lights get use but the ZL's are everyday lights that work incredibly well. Maybe I need to buy another, who knows? I do hope they stick around, survive and deliver lights like the three, none of which has ever given me a single problem. Kudos ZL.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

holygeez03 said:


> I REALLY hope I am wrong... but there do appear to be some signs of ZL "re-structuring".
> 
> It's possible that another entity has or will be buying the brand.
> 
> Either way... I think I will buy a backup SC600w IV Plus while it exists... have been waiting for an upgrade, even if only slightly better tint or CRI.




Yeah, it's too bad they don't offer the SC600 Plus with the same XHP50.2 emitter as the H600Fc IV. It's a really nice high CRI emitter, with a warm tint. It would be a huge improvement over the regular 50.2 they use in the SC600w IV Plus.


----------



## Pi_is_blue

NPL said:


> Any recommendations for bike mounts to put a Zebralight on ones helmet or handlebars?
> 
> Sent from my Pixel using Candlepowerforums mobile app



The TwoFish Megablock pump holder works extremely well with the right-angle Zebralights: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B001F307JK/?tag=cpf0b6-20

I use it on my mountain bike and it is very secure. Very easy to adjust the beam up and down by rotating the light in the holder. It's also quite low-profile being mounted parallel to the bars, making it less likely to snag on something than a perpendicularly mounted flashlight.








I run a pair of H600c MKIV's for mountain biking at night - one on the bars as above and one on my helmet using a spare Zebralight rubber mount and some zip ties. This helmet mount is so light I just leave it on permanently. The wide beams from the XHP50.2 LEDs are perfect for twisty trails and looking through corners.


----------



## TILL-22

moshow9 said:


> As mentioned by WalkIntoTheLight, Zebrslight's website is not secure at this moment. I wouldn't want to login or place an order st this time until it becomes secure again.



Important piece of cyber security here. It doesn't matter who's the owner of the site, if the https doesn't work, don't provide the webpage with any of your info.



markr6 said:


> Or these: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B001CJXB5E/?tag=cpf0b6-20
> 
> I like the velcro since you can really adjust it to whatever size you need and crank it down tight.



I have these too and it doesn't move at all even when on a bumpy road where it might rattle vertically.


----------



## NPL

Pi_is_blue said:


> The TwoFish Megablock pump holder works extremely well with the right-angle Zebralights: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B001F307JK/?tag=cpf0b6-20
> 
> I use it on my mountain bike and it is very secure. Very easy to adjust the beam up and down by rotating the light in the holder. It's also quite low-profile being mounted parallel to the bars, making it less likely to snag on something than a perpendicularly mounted flashlight.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I run a pair of H600c MKIV's for mountain biking at night - one on the bars as above and one on my helmet using a spare Zebralight rubber mount and some zip ties. This helmet mount is so light I just leave it on permanently. The wide beams from the XHP50.2 LEDs are perfect for twisty trails and looking through corners.


That's a sweet setup! I am tempted to get that headlamp. I use to have the FC and sold it as I found it a little too floody. I regret selling it now. Thanks for the Amazon link. The headlamps look much nicer on the handlebars than regular flashlights.


----------



## Connor

NPL said:


> Anybody here own the Sc600fc mk4 plus? Feedback?



I own the SC600Fd IV Plus, it's one of my all time favourites. What you give up in range (frosted lens) you get back in the form of a perfect beam shape, there is still a centre area that's brighter but the transition is just perfect, no artifacts at all. The frosted lens also removes most of the XHP50's colour shifting. 
Just a really nice light for indoors and closer range outdoor use (up to ~25 meters on max).


----------



## NPL

Connor said:


> I own the SC600Fd IV Plus, it's one of my all time favourites. What you give up in range (frosted lens) you get back in the form of a perfect beam shape, there is still a centre area that's brighter but the transition is just perfect, no artifacts at all. The frosted lens also removes most of the XHP50's colour shifting.
> Just a really nice light for indoors and closer range outdoor use (up to ~25 meters on max).


Thanks. I was thinking of getting the sc600fc to complement the cooler sc700fd. Sounds like a winner.

Sent from my Pixel using Candlepowerforums mobile app


----------



## this_is_nascar

I may be interested in snagging one of these SC700d units, but not with the website being in its current state. Probably just as well, as I really don't need another light.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## PoliceScannerMan

Ordered one a few days ago. Says backordered. No shipment yet. I’m good with that though, the usps is quite overloaded at the moment.


----------



## Streak

I was in touch with the folks at ZL this week after ordering an SC64. Product expected from China by the end of this month after which they will ship from their local offices.
I also mentioned this thread and said it may be an idea to come here and deal with all of the speculation.
They have been very communicative and replied to all of my questions within 24 hours.
I have carried their products since they were first launched more than 10 years ago. There is still nothing to beat their UI. There is not a day when I don't use my SC63.
I also have 100's of 18650 batteries so there is never an instance when the light does not have a charged battery in it.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Tell them to fix their website, and add https secure transactions back to it. Right now, I would never advise anyone to order something from it. Their website seems very amateurish, like they really don't care.

Great lights! But, they seem to be doing everything this year to make sure they go out of business.


----------



## LogansRun

moshow9 said:


> As mentioned by WalkIntoTheLight, Zebrslight's website is not secure at this moment. I wouldn't want to login or place an order st this time until it becomes secure again.


Thanks for the head's-up! I was wondering about their website and wondering about the change. I noticed too, that they indicate "_Starting Jan 1, 2021, we will accept orders from U.S. customers only_". Guess that means us International customers may be SOL. 

It would be a shame if they were were no longer making lights or limiting where they sell.


----------



## Dave_5280

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Tell them to fix their website, and add https secure transactions back to it. Right now, I would never advise anyone to order something from it. Their website seems very amateurish, like they really don't care.
> 
> Great lights! But, they seem to be doing everything this year to make sure they go out of business.



I think I’ve seen this kind of problem before and it was caused by our SSL certification getting disconnected from our domain. Our IT guy fixed it pretty quick.


----------



## AstroTurf

PayPal is my security when dealing with ZL...


----------



## Lou Minescence

When I go to the Zebralight website it is not secure. It does not have a secure cart. When I try to check out with the cart the checkout IS secure. At that time during checkout you could log into your account securely.


----------



## CoherentRays

Lou Minescence said:


> When I go to the Zebralight website it is not secure. It does not have a secure cart. When I try to check out with the cart the checkout IS secure. At that time during checkout you could log into your account securely.


That's true for me too. When I'm logged into my account I'm on a secure site but when I start to browse the headlight or flashlight selections the site switches to a non secure mode. Back to secure when I go back into my account to place or check orders.


----------



## Ev148

I frequently bike at night. My bike has a SON dynamo front hub which powers their Edelux II headlight as well as a tail light mounted on the seat tube. All the wiring is internal. It's sufficiently bright except for twisty high speed descents (frame mounted light points straight ahead when you want to see around the corners). Not having to rely on batteries was actually life changing. That said, if I know I'll be riding for hours after dark or doing big descents I also carry an H600w mk IV. I find the headband fits pretty well beneath my helmet and places the light where it needs to be. The default H1 setting is as bright as I'd ever want, it can be blinding to oncoming traffic, though.


----------



## Ev148

I ordered an SC64 LE about a week ago and got a notification yesterday that it has shipped. The site indicated that these were back ordered, so I thought I would be in for a longer wait.


----------



## PoliceScannerMan

Ev148 said:


> I ordered an SC64 LE about a week ago and got a notification yesterday that it has shipped. The site indicated that these were back ordered, so I thought I would be in for a longer wait.



Same with my SC700d, ordered last week as backordered, shipped yest, still pre-shipment status.


----------



## holygeez03

Based on my observations, "backorder" means "low stock" to ZebraLight... and they don't appear to change items to "In Stock" unless they have plenty on-hand, ready to ship immediately.

Also, "Shipped" means it _will _be shipped in a few days.


----------



## PoliceScannerMan

Exactly my findings too past few orders.


----------



## id30209

I only see in order status : New(shipping from China)
Whatever that means[emoji15]


Sent from Tapatalk


----------



## SubLGT

Are ZL orders still shipping from Texas? Or are all orders now being shipped from China? The ordering and shipping process at ZL is uniquely ambiguous and mysterious.


----------



## brightasday

SubLGT said:


> Are ZL orders still shipping from Texas? Or are all orders now being shipped from China? The ordering and shipping process at ZL is uniquely ambiguous and mysterious.



I just received an H600w Mk IV shipped from Texas. (So far, I really like the light)


----------



## DaveSebring

SubLGT said:


> Are ZL orders still shipping from Texas? Or are all orders now being shipped from China? The ordering and shipping process at ZL is uniquely ambiguous and mysterious.



Mine just shipped from Texas.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## NPL

brightasday said:


> I just received an H600w Mk IV shipped from Texas. (So far, I really like the light)


Do you own any other headlamps? How does it compare?


----------



## brightasday

NPL said:


> Do you own any other headlamps? How does it compare?



This is my 9th Zebralight, but only my second headlamp. My only other headlamp is an original Zebralight H600w from early 2012. The old one was my second most frequently used flashlight, and then I misplaced it for a few days and realized I really _need_ a second headlamp . 

The new H600w Mk IV is really not that different from the original H600. It looks the same other than having a darker body and a section without ribbing. The basic UI is the same as the new one, though the new one has a lot of new features (e.g. "groups", battery tester, thermal regulation, . . .). The tint is a little yellower on the old model, but both are fine for me. I like the headband on the new one better than the old. The biggest difference is that the new model is A LOT brighter. Given the added features and big difference in brightness, and inflation between 2012 and now, I feel lucky the price has not changed since 2012.


----------



## NPL

I was curious about your feedback because it seems the floodier xhp50 versions are more popular. I had the h600w mkii in the past and found the beam profile perfect for outdoor sports where speed and longer visibility was required. The floody ones are better up close, but lack the throw. 

Sent from my Pixel using Candlepowerforums mobile app


----------



## Ev148

NPL said:


> I was curious about your feedback because it seems the floodier xhp50 versions are more popular. I had the h600w mkii in the past and found the beam profile perfect for outdoor sports where speed and longer visibility was required. The floody ones are better up close, but lack the throw.



I totally agree. I've owned an H600w mk IV for a couple of years now. I got it for auxiliary/backup lighting for my bicycle (see my post above) and also to use on my nightly walk across a dark pasture to lock up my chickens. It's floody enough for great situational awareness and has just enough throw to reach out 150-200 yards at the highest setting. I really like the compromise, perfect for an outdoor headlight IMO--I wouldn't want to give up throw for more flood or visa versa. On the bike I adjust the tilt of the light so that the hot spot floats just above the road surface and reaches out into the distance. I don't see a bright spot where it would compromise my peripheral vision and the illumination stays pretty even.

To reply to the posts about shipping: I got the pre shipment notice for my back ordered SC64 LE about a week ago and it looks like it entered the USPS system on 12/24 with an estimated delivery date of 12/29. It shipped from Texas.


----------



## holygeez03

I bought another SC600w IV Plus just in case something crazy happens with ZL in 2021... it has become my most used light by far around the house and in the yard... I can confirm that the newer copies do NOT have the purple AR coating and this does eliminate the purple ring that reflects off the bezel... It also seems to help with tint-shift across the entire beam when looking really close.

So I am happy about that... especially since it's winter and the purple ring is especially annoying when there is snow on the ground.


----------



## NPL

I just read on reddit that someone was told by Zebralight that they plan to release a new H600 using SST20 in 4000k. That is music to my ears! 

Sent from my Pixel using Candlepowerforums mobile app


----------



## NPL

https://m.imgur.com/gallery/BKlYPEk

Sent from my Pixel using Candlepowerforums mobile app


----------



## id30209

So that’s SC64C LE replacement 


Sent from Tapatalk


----------



## NPL

Sounds like it will be in their entry level headlamps. I am curious to see what their MkV lights be be like. 

Sent from my Pixel using Candlepowerforums mobile app


----------



## marinemaster

Cant wait.


----------



## this_is_nascar

NPL said:


> I just read on reddit that someone was told by Zebralight that they plan to release a new H600 using SST20 in 4000k. That is music to my ears!
> 
> Sent from my Pixel using Candlepowerforums mobile app


Why such a thrower emitter in a headlamp platform? The SST-20 would be more suitable for one of the SC series.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## NPL

I personally like a throwy emitter to a certain extent in a headlamp. I find I can use it at a much lower setting helping consevre battery life, it's far less blinding to your peers when camping as it focused the beam to your food instead of white washing everyone's faces, and when doing an activity requiring speed at night, the extra throw is necessary. If I need floody, I can diffuse it, bit I can't make a diffused beam more focused... 

The LH351d is still probably a better led option in a headlamp over the SST20.


----------



## marinemaster

I recall tons of threads here regarding the unprotected vs protected batteries. I have the SC62W and just got some protected 18650. The batt is all the way up to the end of the tube so when i screw down the cap is really tight. I thought the SC63 and SC64 have this issue. Do you guys use protected batt in the SC62W ? Reason i got protected i have some other lights that need to use them also.


----------



## Mr. LED

SC63 and 64 are shorter and don’t fit protected batteries. The 62 can work with either, but unprotected is recommended.


----------



## Climb14er

I can use either protected or unprotected cells in my SC62, but prefer unprotected.


----------



## marinemaster

Just thinking long term if i leave the protected battery in say months will it have any effect on the spring in the tail ? cant be seen but sure feels like is compressed at the absolute limit.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

marinemaster said:


> Just thinking long term if i leave the protected battery in say months will it have any effect on the spring in the tail ? cant be seen but sure feels like is compressed at the absolute limit.



It's possible. But, you can always stretch a spring back out again, if you need to. I've had to do this sometimes with twisties. Just grab them with a paperclip and pull. You probably won't have to worry about it with a switch light, such as Zebralight, but again, it's possible.


----------



## Ev148

I posted a while back for some recommendations and help in deciding between the SC64 LE and the SC64w HI. I couldn't make up my mind so I bought both. I was sure I'd like the LE better, but it turned out I preferred the greater intensity and throw of the HI as well as the cooler tint. The CRI did not look that different in my examples. I'm probably returning the LE.


----------



## Owen

^^^Love the SC64w HI. I'm super impressed with it.
Just ordered the headlamp version for work, so don't have to wonder what my first light of 2021 will be
I guess the emitter is the HD version, and will be floodier, but here's hoping the tint is similar!


----------



## Streak

Ev148 said:


> I posted a while back for some recommendations and help in deciding between the SC64 LE and the SC64w HI. I couldn't make up my mind so I bought both. I was sure I'd like the LE better, but it turned out I preferred the greater intensity and throw of the HI as well as the cooler tint. The CRI did not look that different in my examples. I'm probably returning the LE.



Pleased to hear that. My SC64w HI arrives next week. I have been carrying the SC63W since the day they were released. It gets used every single day and has travelled the world with me.
Will be interesting to compare them side by side.


----------



## PoliceScannerMan

And now it’s 2021. ZL only shipping to USA.


----------



## marinemaster

They should have also said all our 2021 models will be few mm longer to handle protected 18650....


----------



## Ev148

Zebralight should really update their website. It just looks so primitive.


----------



## Outdoorsman5

This type of setup with each of my zebras has increased my appreciation for the new UI and the overall usefulness of these awesome lights. Maybe this will be helpful to someone. This is my setup on my SC64w HI (but all my ZL’s are set in similar fashion.)
*CURRENT SETUP:*
*G5: H 1300/467 — M 118/52 — L 2.7/.24 GENERAL MODE*
*
G6: H 1300/245 — M 118/52 — L 7.9/2.7 OUTDOOR/HIKING MODE*
*
G7: H 245/52 — M 7.9/2.7 — L .24/.06 INDOOR/CAMP MODE*


----------



## AstroTurf

this is exactly how ima gonna setup my sc600w hi when it arrives!!!



Outdoorsman5 said:


> This type of setup with each of my zebras has increased my appreciation for the new UI and the overall usefulness of these awesome lights. Maybe this will be helpful to someone. This is my setup on my SC64w HI (but all my ZL’s are set in similar fashion.)
> *CURRENT SETUP:*
> *G5: H 1300/467 — M 118/52 — L 2.7/.24 GENERAL MODE*
> *
> G6: H 1300/245 — M 118/52 — L 7.9/2.7 OUTDOOR/HIKING MODE*
> *
> G7: H 245/52 — M 7.9/2.7 — L .24/.06 INDOOR/CAMP MODE*


----------



## Outdoorsman5

AstroTurf said:


> this is exactly how ima gonna setup my sc600w hi when it arrives!!!



I hope you find it or something similar as useful & awesome as I do. 

Since we can’t customize G5 (uses original UI so H1, M1, & L1 are all locked in) as much as you can customize G6 & G7, it made since to me to use G5 to cover the spectrum of settings, highs to lows, that are really useful plus a good selection of mediums to cover outdoor & indoor use. 

With G6 (hiking/outdoor mode) I took out the really low settings (which I don’t use outdoors or when hiking) and plugged in lows that are really useful (can still see and not be blinding.) I selected my most used settings when hiking in H1 & H2 and M1 & M2. We are about to do a 20 mile backpacking trip this month. Our hike starts Friday after school and plan to hike into the evening (to around 8:00 pm that night to set us up for an easier Sat hike.) I’m betting I will be in G6 while hiking and in G7 when at camp & in my tent. My son set his up the same way (headlights too.)

G7 is my most used mode on a daily basis at home when walking into my bedroom if my wife is already in bed or when going to the bathroom in the middle of the night. We had the power go out for 3 days & nights, and this mode was what I used the whole time except when I went outside with our dogs (my G6 setup is better for that.)

I’ve been a zebra fan for a loooooong time. It took me way to long to see the brilliance of Zebralight’s NEW UI. I’ve been missing out for too long. Glad I grabbed some new zebralights recently.


----------



## AstroTurf

Oh, I willl. It'll be here tomorrow!!!

As for finding other ZL's that I like... I've got twenty ZL's in front of me.

Guess I could say that for me, 2020 was the year of the flashlight!!!

Jim



Outdoorsman5 said:


> I hope you find it or something similar as useful & awesome as I do.


----------



## Outdoorsman5

Me too Jim. I bought several zebras in Nov/Dec. Markr6 would say “hardcore” right about now! Wish I had bought another SC600w Mk IV HI before it got discontinued. Anyone out there wanting to get rid of their’s, I’ll pay. 



AstroTurf said:


> Guess I could say that for me, 2020 was the year of the flashlight!!!
> Jim


----------



## NPL

Outdoorsman5 said:


> Me too Jim. I bought several zebras in Nov/Dec. Markr6 would say “hardcore” right about now! Wish I had bought another SC600w Mk IV HI before it got discontinued. Anyone out there wanting to get rid of their’s, I’ll pay.


I suspect they will release a mkV using the new xhp35.2 Hi.



Sent from my Pixel using Candlepowerforums mobile app


----------



## AstroTurf

my finger is on the order now button!!!


----------



## Outdoorsman5

MAN, I hope so!! And makes sense they would. Any idea on how much bigger the XHP35.2 HI LED will be compared to the xhp35 HI LED? I’m concerned that the new version will become less throwy compared to the discontinued SC600w Mk IV HI. 



NPL said:


> I suspect they will release a mkV using the new xhp35.2 Hi.


----------



## id30209

Outdoorsman5 said:


> MAN, I hope so!! And makes sense they would. Any idea on how much bigger the XHP35.2 HI LED will be compared to the xhp35 HI LED? I’m concerned that the new version will become less throwy compared to the discontinued SC600w Mk IV HI.



It’s the same size emitter. More info can be found by entering their names in Google...
Downside of XHP35.2 is if used HD version most likly you will have unpleasant yellow-green corona. Just like XHP50.2 (the reason they made Floody options)
Let’s hope they will source HI emitters


Sent from Tapatalk


----------



## wiiawiwb

I just received a ZL headlamp and a flashlight is on the way. I'm new to ZL and was hoping to find a video that shows how to access the pre-programmed light levels but didn't find one on YouTube. Lots of reviews of flashlights.

Is there a YT video or other source you could recommend that shows the basic operation of a ZL and how to access the various sub-levels?


----------



## AstroTurf

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zob_8_jtOGk



wiiawiwb said:


> I just received a ZL headlamp and a flashlight is on the way. I'm new to ZL and was hoping to find a video that shows how to access the pre-programmed light levels but didn't find one on YouTube. Lots of reviews of flashlights.
> 
> Is there a YT video or other source you could recommend that shows the basic operation of a ZL and how to access the various sub-levels?


----------



## wiiawiwb

Thank you, an excellent video. I'm using the H53Fc. Its modes are listed below. If I want to access and use the 102 lumens, is that what is preprogrammed in G7? If so, do I click 7 times and now I can use 102 Lm in Hi, 3.4Lm in Medium and .001Lm in Low?

Light Output (runtimes) 

High: H1 *276* Lm (0.9 hr) or H2 *230* Lm (1.6 hr) / *165* Lm (2.3 hrs) / *102* Lm (4.2 hrs)
Medium: M1 *55* Lm (8.5 hrs) or M2 *25*Lm (21 hrs) / *10* Lm (41 hrs) / *3.4* Lm (4.5 days)
Low: L1 *1.0 *Lm (13 days) or L2 *0.26* Lm (1.1 month) / *0.06 *Lm (2.2 months) / *0.01 *Lm (3.3 months)


----------



## AstroTurf

not really sure what may be preprogrammed into g6 or g7?

I always clear everything and then enter my own programming.



wiiawiwb said:


> Thank you, an excellent video. I'm using the H53Fc. Its modes are listed below. If I want to access and use the 102 lumens, is that what is preprogrammed in G7? If so, do I click 7 times and now I can use 102 Lm in Hi, 3.4Lm in Medium and .001Lm in Low?
> 
> Light Output (runtimes)
> 
> High: H1 *276* Lm (0.9 hr) or H2 *230* Lm (1.6 hr) / *165* Lm (2.3 hrs) / *102* Lm (4.2 hrs)
> Medium: M1 *55* Lm (8.5 hrs) or M2 *25*Lm (21 hrs) / *10* Lm (41 hrs) / *3.4* Lm (4.5 days)
> Low: L1 *1.0 *Lm (13 days) or L2 *0.26* Lm (1.1 month) / *0.06 *Lm (2.2 months) / *0.01 *Lm (3.3 months)


----------



## Owen

Guys, I only have one of the newer ZLs with G6 and G7, a SC64 model, but those groups' default as received is the same as G5.


----------



## Fespe

Since zebralight now sell to US customers only, what about european online store like nkon? would they be able to get some zebra?


----------



## wiiawiwb

Owen said:


> Guys, I only have one of the newer ZLs with G6 and G7, a SC64 model, but those groups' default as received is the same as G5.



Going from left to right with High, H1=276lm, H2=230Lm. How do access the 165Lm or 102Lm that are listed?

Light Output (runtimes) 

High: H1 *276* Lm (0.9 hr) or H2 *230* Lm (1.6 hr) / *165* Lm (2.3 hrs) / *102* Lm (4.2 hrs)
Medium: M1 *55* Lm (8.5 hrs) or M2 *25*Lm (21 hrs) / *10* Lm (41 hrs) / *3.4* Lm (4.5 days)
Low: L1 *1.0 *Lm (13 days) or L2 *0.26* Lm (1.1 month) / *0.06 *Lm (2.2 months) / *0.01 *Lm (3.3 months)


----------



## Owen

wiiawiwb said:


> Thank you, an excellent video. I'm using the H53Fc. Its modes are listed below. If I want to access and use the 102 lumens, is that what is preprogrammed in G7?


You program each mode individually. Any mode can be any of the available brightness levels. It can be a PITA, and is poorly explained in all the videos I've seen. 

It's fairly simple, I suppose, at least it seems that way after having gotten to where I can successfully do it at will, but there was a bit of a learning curve. I gave up out of frustration a few times, and would go back to G5 for a day, then try again. 
I got confused, and was double clicking instead of single clicking, thinking I was getting into G6, and then programming mode, but wasn't actually doing anything.

So, for G6:
Step 1: Turn off the light(I untwist and twist the tailcap)
Step 2: Click 6 times
-light is now off, but in G6
Step 3: go to mode you want to program
Step 4: click 6 times 
-light is now off off again
Step 5: go back to the mode you wanted to program
Step 6: start double clicking(I guess 6x, I just keep going til the brightness starts ramping up with each double click, or doesn't change any more). If you're starting in H1, which starts at max brightness, just keep double clicking until it doesn't go back into H2 any more.
-Now you're setting a level. Double clicking to go up, or triple clicking to go down. *A single click sets the brightness.*

But here's the deal: you HAVE to double or triple click *rapidly and without pause*. Double click up, triple click down. If you pause, like double click, and say "oh, wait, I meant to go the other way" and click a third time, it's too late. You've just screwed up. The light is going to read that as a single click, and that mode is going to be programmed right where it's at. To change it, you will have to start all over again. You're going to have to start all over again for every single mode, anyway, so this can get frustrating quick if you don't keep it straight.
Here's my helpful hint:
Write down all of your light's levels in a column.
276
230
165
102
55
25
10
3.4
1.0
.26
.06
.01
Decide which levels you want to set beforehand. You can see each of them by playing around setting L2/M2/H2 in G5 before you start messing with G6 or G7.
Check off those brightness levels on your column. Better yet, make a new column for each level.
Now, when you get to step 6, no matter which mode you're programming, double click double click double click, go all the way up, so you're in the highest mode.
Look at your column. 276 lumens. Say you want 165.
Ok, triple click, 230. Triple click, 165. Stop. One click. Mode is set.
And so on, and so on, one mode at a time. 
If you're programming a dimmer mode, and get confused about where you're at(it can be hard to tell, especially with sub-lumen modes) just keep going all the way down to .01. Give it a few extra triple clicks so you know for sure that you're there, then double click your way back up to the mode you wanted.

All I can say is take your time, and be patient. Hopefully, you're more high tech than me. I had already developed some familiarity by programming my G6, and went through programming some modes in G7 while writing this description. I still had to start over at least once for each of the 3 modes I programmed:ironic:

Programming G7 is the same as G6, you will just click 7x in steps 2 and 4.


----------



## AstroTurf

i agree very confusing!!!



Owen said:


> You program each mode individually. Any mode can be any of the available brightness levels. It can be a PITA, and is poorly explained in all the videos I've seen.
> 
> It's fairly simple, I suppose, at least it seems that way after having gotten to where I can successfully do it at will, but there was a bit of a learning curve. I gave up out of frustration a few times, and would go back to G5 for a day, then try again.
> I got confused, and was double clicking instead of single clicking, thinking I was getting into G6, and then programming mode, but wasn't actually doing anything.
> 
> So, for G6:
> Step 1: Turn off the light(I untwist and twist the tailcap)
> Step 2: Click 6 times
> -light is now off, but in G6
> Step 3: go to mode you want to program
> Step 4: click 6 times
> -light is now off off again
> Step 5: go back to the mode you wanted to program
> Step 6: start double clicking(I guess 6x, I just keep going til the brightness starts ramping up with each double click, or doesn't change any more). If you're starting in H1, which starts at max brightness, just keep double clicking until it doesn't go back into H2 any more.
> -Now you're setting a level. Double clicking to go up, or triple clicking to go down. *A single click sets the brightness.*
> 
> But here's the deal: you HAVE to double or triple click *rapidly and without pause*. Double click up, triple click down. If you pause, like double click, and say "oh, wait, I meant to go the other way" and click a third time, it's too late. You've just screwed up. The light is going to read that as a single click, and that mode is going to be programmed right where it's at. To change it, you will have to start all over again. You're going to have to start all over again for every single mode, anyway, so this can get frustrating quick if you don't keep it straight.
> Here's my helpful hint:
> Write down all of your light's levels in a column.
> 276
> 230
> 165
> 102
> 55
> 25
> 10
> 3.4
> 1.0
> .26
> .06
> .01
> Decide which levels you want to set beforehand. You can see each of them by playing around setting L2/M2/H2 in G5 before you start messing with G6 or G7.
> Check off those brightness levels on your column. Better yet, make a new column for each level.
> Now, when you get to step 6, no matter which mode you're programming, double click double click double click, go all the way up, so you're in the highest mode.
> Look at your column. 276 lumens. Say you want 165.
> Ok, triple click, 230. Triple click, 165. Stop. One click. Mode is set.
> And so on, and so on, one mode at a time.
> If you're programming a dimmer mode, and get confused about where you're at(it can be hard to tell, especially with sub-lumen modes) just keep going all the way down to .01. Give it a few extra triple clicks so you know for sure that you're there, then double click your way back up to the mode you wanted.
> 
> All I can say is take your time, and be patient. Hopefully, you're more high tech than me. I had already developed some familiarity by programming my G6, and went through programming some modes in G7 while writing this description. I still had to start over at least once for each of the 3 modes I programmed:ironic:
> 
> Programming G7 is the same as G6, you will just click 7x in steps 2 and 4.


----------



## Owen

Tell you what, let me repost that without all the extra yapping.

G6:
Step 1: Turn off the light(I untwist and twist the tailcap)
Step 2: Click 6 times
-light is now off, but in G6
Step 3: go to mode you want to program
Step 4: click 6 times 
-light is now off off again
Step 5: go back to the mode you wanted to program
Step 6: start double clicking(I guess 6x, I just keep going til the brightness starts ramping up with each double click, or doesn't change any more). If you're starting in H1, which starts at max brightness, just keep double clicking until it doesn't go back into H2 any more.
-Now you're setting a level. Double clicking to go up, or triple clicking to go down. *A single click sets the brightness.*

Programming G7 is the same as G6, you will just click 7x in steps 2 and 4.


----------



## brightasday

If you only want to access the 102 lumen setting, you do not have to program G6 or G7 groups. You can just program it as the H2 setting of the G5 (default) group. Programming G6 and G7 is relatively complicated compared to programming H2 of the default group. Here are the instructions for the simpler change:

"The second sub-level (H2, M2 and L2) of each main levels can be further programmed to different brightness levels. *At a main level,* *double-click 6 times to start configuration. On subsequent double-clicks the light will cycle through different brightness levels. Short click to turn off the light when finishing configurations*. The selections for the second sub-levels are memorized after the light is turned off and through battery changes."

So basically turn the flashlight on to High, double-click 6 times to get to the programming mode. Lowest setting (102) will be active. Then single click to lock that as H2.


----------



## wiiawiwb

You guys are fantastic and thank you for your thoughtful help. I'm doing something wrong because I can't a setting in either G5 or G6. After I double-click to begin the programming mode, I can not get the light level to go up or down no matter what I do. I tried double-clicking to get it to go up and tried triple click to get it to go down. In each case, I when entering a triple click the strobe came on. 

I'm a failure despite fantastic teachers!!!


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Fespe said:


> Since zebralight now sell to US customers only, what about european online store like nkon? would they be able to get some zebra?



Dunno. Unfortunately, I've now been forced to move on from Zebralight. I'll keep using all the ones I have now, but I think I won't be buying any more. Well, I can't buy any more, so that solves it.

I just ordered a Emissar D4v2, to see how it compares. Probably not as small or efficient, but they do come in a great variety of tints. Looking forward to the 2700K CRI95 version I ordered. I really love the warm white lights I have now, especially for indoors. Zebralight 4000K is nice for outdoors, but sometimes I find it a little cool for ambient indoor light (ceiling bounced).

There was a 2000K version of the D4v2 I almost bought. But, that might be too warm, even for me. Might be kind of fun in the Anduril "candle mode", though. Perhaps next time.


----------



## Connor

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> There was a 2000K version of the D4v2 I almost bought. But, that might be too warm, even for me. Might be kind of fun in the Anduril "candle mode", though. Perhaps next time.



Uuhh .. your wallet will hate me pretty soon: there is a 2000K version with E21A LEDs. :candle:


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Connor said:


> Uuhh .. your wallet will hate me pretty soon: there is a 2000K version with E21A LEDs. :candle:



Yeah, that's the one I almost bought. I probably will end up buying it, but I thought it might be too warm. Has anyone tried it? What's it like? It sounds pretty-much around the same color temp as real candlelight.


----------



## Connor

If you have/make a user account at the German TLF you can view a couple very nice E21A 2000k beamshots here: https://www.taschenlampen-forum.de/threads/emisar-d4v2-nichia-e21a.77145/ 
2000K seems to be real nice as a "candle replacement". Just don't expect "high CRI", it's a bit too warm for that, i.e. everything looks orangeish ;-)

I wish ZebraLight would offer the same choice of LED types we can get from Emisar .. are you guys listening?


----------



## Tapis

Zebralight does not ship to Canada anymore. Is there a store in the USA that has the H53Fc in stock? It is out of stock anywhere I check, including at Nkon in Europe.


----------



## brightasday

Tapis said:


> Zebralight does not ship to Canada anymore. Is there a store in the USA that has the H53Fc in stock? It is out of stock anywhere I check, including at Nkon in Europe.




Can you get it from Amazon? It shows up in US Amazon.


----------



## Tapis

It's unavailable on Amazon US and is selling at four three times the price on Amazon Canada.


----------



## MB320

I am also moving on from Zebralight, order for a Noctigon KR4 is in. Looking forward to new experiences with Andruil.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Yup, looks like Zebralight doesn't want to sell there lights anywhere other than on their own (broken) website and only to the US. Very strange business model. I still think they're in trouble, or have perhaps decided they just don't give a **** anymore about sales, and are just running it as a hobby now.

In any case, ordering from Amazon US to Canada isn't usually worth it, unless you really need an item badly that is only available from Amazon. You pay a lot for shipping, duties, taxes, etc., etc. if you order from the Amazon US website.


----------



## MB320

Totally agree. Even if Nkon could get stock ZL’s recent shipping practices have driven prices up ~30%, not worth it for me anymore.

Actually looking forward to a change, the choice of a large range of emitters amongst other things is refreshing.


----------



## Fespe

I agree with mostly everyone but for me it's really sad that a company with this kind of following and "worship" from around the world decide to cut everyone out! Maybe it's just temporary for sorting things out. And I really hope it's like that. 
I dont mind try new flashlight and new technology from other company but I will gladly continue to buy more zebralight too! If possible!!


----------



## this_is_nascar

Sorry, you guys can **** all over ZL if you want, but you won't find anything as efficient or sized as the ZL.

I can only speak of those I own, as in the SC53, SC64 and SC600 series.

It took me a few minutes to understand the programming, but now it's second nature. In the instructions above, I don't understand your Step 4 and why you're clicking 6-times at that point. I'll have to read it again, as maybe I'm reading it wrong.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## this_is_nascar

Fespe said:


> I agree with mostly everyone but for me it's really sad that a company with this kind of following and "worship" from around the world decide to cut everyone out! Maybe it's just temporary for sorting things out. And I really hope it's like that.
> I dont mind try new flashlight and new technology from other company but I will gladly continue to buy more zebralight too! If possible!!


I think folks would take it better if we simply knew why they made that decision.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## Fespe

I agree. It's not knowing that **** people off!


----------



## id30209

Nascar is right you know...
Just enjoy in what you have and be happy if something new comes up.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

I still consider my Zebralights to be my most favorite lights by a long-shot. But, Zebralight's recent FU attitude towards buyers (especially non-US buyers), has me soured on the company. Even if I could buy zebralights, I don't think I would right now.

Personally, it's a great opportunity to get back into trying some other companies' flashlights. There's a lot of choice out there, especially in emitters, that Zebralight never had an interest in offering. And, most of it is quite a bit cheaper, too.

I love zebralight's small size and UI, but other companies are starting to close that gap. Zebralight hasn't really updated their line-up in 3 years. That's a lonnnnng time.


----------



## Mgizler

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Dunno. Unfortunately, I've now been forced to move on from Zebralight. I'll keep using all the ones I have now, but I think I won't be buying any more. Well, I can't buy any more, so that solves it.
> 
> I just ordered a Emissar D4v2, to see how it compares. Probably not as small or efficient, but they do come in a great variety of tints. Looking forward to the 2700K CRI95 version I ordered. I really love the warm white lights I have now, especially for indoors. Zebralight 4000K is nice for outdoors, but sometimes I find it a little cool for ambient indoor light (ceiling bounced).
> 
> There was a 2000K version of the D4v2 I almost bought. But, that might be too warm, even for me. Might be kind of fun in the Anduril "candle mode", though. Perhaps next time.




I love the D4v2. The andruil software is fantastic and the light output is amazing. For the price of this light and what you get out of it, it’s really hard to beat. I honestly don’t even use my zebralights (only headlamps)or hds anymore.


----------



## id30209

https://i.imgur.com/QsZccYa.mp4


Sent from Tapatalk


----------



## MB320

Nobody is ‘pissing’ on Zebralights, they’re great lights. However I think they’ve damaged their following by closing shop to outside of the US. Like Walkintothelight I wouldn’t buy any now even if I could.


----------



## bigburly912

I have no horse in this race because I don’t own any zebra lights. I will say this however. Have any of you all complaining about the shipping tried to ship worldwide recently? It’s an absolute disaster. I don’t blame them at all for not wanting to do that on any kind of a large scale because customer complaints would be out the wazzoo. It took almost 2 months for me to ship a bezel to the UK. 

It’s impossible to handle the outside factors for a company with such a good rep as zebra light. And you all know how humans are. Ship something out of country and it takes more than a couple days you are already getting bitchy emails. I don’t blame them a bit. We ARE still in the middle of a pandemic. I see these threads every few years on here, on Reddit, on edcforums. “Is zebralight closing up shop”? 
Google it same topic every few years for the same reasons then things go back to normal. This year we have extenuating circumstances of course.


----------



## Ev148

International shipping is very unreliable in these pandemic times. If that's the reason they stopped international orders it makes sense, but it's a shame they don't offer premium shipping options like DHL for those willing to pay a little extra.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Just about every other Chinese company is shipping just fine during the past year. In fact, I think I'm getting stuff more reliably now than I was a year ago! (Not a single lost package from China.) Delivery time is about the same, too.

It's not like Zebralight is shipping gold bars or nuclear material around. Other companies are doing business just fine. If they're using the pandemic as an excuse not to do mail shipments, that's pretty lame.


----------



## PoliceScannerMan

Maybe someone in the USA can organize a overseas ZL group buy. Create a thread and post interest. From that thread order the ZL’s and mail them to someone overseas where they can then dispatch to the new owners. Be a lot of work but doable. Lol.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

PoliceScannerMan said:


> Maybe someone in the USA can organize a overseas ZL group buy. Create a thread and post interest. From that thread order the ZL’s and mail them to someone overseas where they can then dispatch to the new owners. Be a lot of work but doable. Lol.



Sounds like working for Zebralight, without pay. :thinking:


----------



## this_is_nascar

this_is_nascar said:


> I think folks would take it better if we simply knew why they made that decision.
> 
> 
> Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


I absolutely agree.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## neutralwhite

Good Idea.


----------



## AstroTurf

30 days and counting on a sc600w hi from nkon.

my thoughts, i'd rather sooner than later, but later is better than not at all.

i doubt that, for the longterm zl leaves anyone without a light. we just don't know all the details yet. much like most other flashlight manufacturers.

ps why won't my tool 2.0 take flattop batteries? never heard a word from lumentop about this?!?

Jim


----------



## this_is_nascar

bigburly912 said:


> I have no horse in this race because I don’t own any zebra lights. I will say this however. Have any of you all complaining about the shipping tried to ship worldwide recently? It’s an absolute disaster. I don’t blame them at all for not wanting to do that on any kind of a large scale because customer complaints would be out the wazzoo. It took almost 2 months for me to ship a bezel to the UK.
> 
> It’s impossible to handle the outside factors for a company with such a good rep as zebra light. And you all know how humans are. Ship something out of country and it takes more than a couple days you are already getting bitchy emails. I don’t blame them a bit. We ARE still in the middle of a pandemic. I see these threads every few years on here, on Reddit, on edcforums. “Is zebralight closing up shop”?
> Google it same topic every few years for the same reasons then things go back to normal. This year we have extenuating circumstances of course.


Good post. I agree with the international shipping. It's a no win situation. Also, I can imagine much fraud occurring, whereas a customer would say he never received a product and ZL, to save their reputation, mail out a replacement on their dime.

I just really think allot of hard feelings and speculation could be avoided if ZL would just come out with an official statement.

For me, I'm just sorry I never tried a ZL a decades or so ago. It would have saved me thousands of dollars. It seems to me that theses other makers coming into the game are just looking to make lights as bright as possible.

No regulation, no efficiency, etc. I don't want a light that will set poop on fire, but that seems to be the gauge nowadays for these new gimmick lights. Between the lack of temperature control, regulation and ghetto backlighting of the lens, etc, you can keep them all. They will never have a home here with me 


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## this_is_nascar

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Just about every other Chinese company is shipping just fine during the past year. In fact, I think I'm getting stuff more reliably now than I was a year ago! (Not a single lost package from China.) Delivery time is about the same, too.
> 
> It's not like Zebralight is shipping gold bars or nuclear material around. Other companies are doing business just fine. If they're using the pandemic as an excuse not to do mail shipments, that's pretty lame.


This has not been my experience. Oversees shipments taking twice as long as they ever have in the past is what I've been seeing.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## this_is_nascar

AstroTurf said:


> 30 days and counting on a sc600w hi from nkon.
> 
> my thoughts, i'd rather sooner than later, but later is better than not at all.
> 
> i doubt that, for the longterm zl leaves anyone without a light. we just don't know all the details yet. much like most other flashlight manufacturers.
> 
> ps why won't my tool 2.0 take flattop batteries? never heard a word from lumentop about this?!?
> 
> Jim


That little round ring is in the way. It's how they control reverse polarity via hardware vs software. I've seen some remove it.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## marinemaster

100% what Nascar said.


----------



## AstroTurf

It’s here!!!

The last SC600w HI on the planet has arrived!!!

w00 h00!!!

Happy Camper, Jim


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

AstroTurf said:


> It’s here!!!
> 
> The last SC600w HI on the planet has arrived!!!



It was the best general-purpose light they made, IMO. Perfect for outdoor hikes. Really weird they discontinued it. Their business strategy is a total mystery, to me.


----------



## AstroTurf

hopefully a bigger and better version is on the way!

ps a lot of your opinions have cost me a lot!!!

Keep the Faith

Jim



WalkIntoTheLight said:


> It was the best general-purpose light they made, IMO. Perfect for outdoor hikes. Really weird they discontinued it. Their business strategy is a total mystery, to me.


----------



## Outdoorsman5

AstroTurf said:


> It’s here!!!
> 
> The last SC600w HI on the planet has arrived!!!
> 
> w00 h00!!!
> 
> Happy Camper, Jim



That's funny.....now how much you want for it? Ha Ha


----------



## AstroTurf

to tell you the truth, i sold my other sc600w hi a while back...

it disrupted my collection and sanity pretty badly.

so for now, ima keep it.

don't lose heart though, there is one out there with your name on it!

Cheers, Jim



Outdoorsman5 said:


> That's funny.....now how much you want for it? Ha Ha


----------



## markr6

The new version of the SC600w HI is really, REALLY weird looking!

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0793QN3SJ/?tag=cpf0b6-20


----------



## AstroTurf

Too Funny!!!


----------



## Outdoorsman5

markr6 said:


> The new version of the SC600w HI is really, REALLY weird looking!
> 
> https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0793QN3SJ/?tag=cpf0b6-20



HAAAAAAAA!!! I STILL WANT ONE!!!!!


----------



## Fespe

A couple of days ago I send an email to Nkon asking if they will be able to restock Zebralight since they don't sell to Europe anymore. They responded yes! Zebralight told them that they will continue to sell to Nkon. So I think maybe they just stopped selling to the single person due to the problem right now.
For now I'm happy 😁


----------



## markr6

Fespe said:


> A couple of days ago I send an email to Nkon asking if they will be able to restock Zebralight since they don't sell to Europe anymore. They responded yes! Zebralight told them that they will continue to sell to Nkon. So I think maybe they just stopped selling to the single person due to the problem right now.
> For now I'm happy 




That's good. Makes sense because when I visited a local dealer he had a box from ZL with, I'm guessing, 100 lights in one box. So to ship one of those to a seller, even international, would be cost effective. I suppose they could use different size boxes, but nkon is legit enough to stock more than just a handful at a time.


----------



## congo

Please forgive my negativity... For example in the case of H600w MkIV, $89 incl. shipping from Zebralight, but 103,5 EUR + 5 EUR shipping from NKON. So it would take around $134 instead of $89 to buy one. I would call it a significant difference. Zebralight's new policy is kind of disappointing.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

congo said:


> Please forgive my negativity... For example in the case of H600w MkIV, $89 incl. shipping from Zebralight, but 103,5 EUR + 5 EUR shipping from NKON. So it would take around $134 instead of $89 to buy one. I would call it a significant difference. Zebralight's new policy is kind of disappointing.



Yeah, I think this is likely because Zebralight is not giving much of a wholesale discount to retailers, so the retailer has to jack up the price to make a reasonable profit. Illumn told me awhile ago that they no longer sell Zebralights because they couldn't make a profit on the slim margins, it was lower than any other brand.

In any case, I find it's too expensive to buy from nkon, and zebralight won't sell outside the U.S. So, they clearly don't want international buyers for whatever reason. That's their right, but they've lost a fanboy. I won't be buying any more, unless they change their policy. I haven't bought any new zebralight in almost exactly 1 year, because they started charging rip-off shipping rates to Canada last year. The year before that, I bought 4.

I'm just really disappointed in Zebralight. Great lights, crappy company.

Looking forward to the Emisar I ordered... (free shipping, too!).


----------



## AstroTurf

not so...

check nkon pricing.

at least for me, a usa resident.

Jim

edit... vat sux



congo said:


> Please forgive my negativity... For example in the case of H600w MkIV, $89 incl. shipping from Zebralight, but 103,5 EUR + 5 EUR shipping from NKON. So it would take around $134 instead of $89 to buy one. I would call it a significant difference. Zebralight's new policy is kind of disappointing.


----------



## Owen

Owen said:


> ^^^Love the SC64w HI. I'm super impressed with it.
> Just ordered the headlamp version for work, so don't have to wonder what my first light of 2021 will be
> I guess the emitter is the HD version, and will be floodier, but here's hoping the tint is similar!


My H600w Mk IV XHP35(not HI)'s tint isn't on par with my SC64w HI's, which brings the word "perfect" to mind. The H600w has some visible green in both the spot and corona, while the outermost spill has an almost violet hue.
That's on a white wall. In actual use, it is not noticeable at all.
I took it on an overnight hike, and used it around camp, collecting firewood, and trying to light up a (big)waterfall.
If I hadn't shined it on a white wall, my comments would have been "whoa", and "holy crap!", though those brightest modes will soon be programmed out. I don't need more output than the AA models have, but will appreciate the runtime from an 18650. Goes on a hardhat in a few hours, so I'll be playing flashlight nerd at work all night:naughty:


----------



## likethevegetable

Owen, I share similar sentiments towards whitewall hunting. It's so easy to dislike a tint on a white wall, especially one that's slightly above the BBL when compared to one that's below the BBL. My SC64w HI has a slightly "dirty" corona, but in use it's hardly noticeable. It looks like an awful green compared to my Nichia 219C light, but in actual use when only using one light (as is my typical use) I prefer the HI as it feels a bit softer and warmer, and not as intense as the rosy Nichia. The color performance isn't too far off to me eyes either.


----------



## MrStrumpan

Today my *Zebralight H600Fd Mk IV - 18650 XHP50.2 Floody 5000K High CRI Headlamp *arrived (to EU).
I order it from ZL around a month ago, 5 Dec 2020.
I had the old *H600w MK III *since before. Wow, much light in the new one 
I have two *SC700d*, order the last one 1st Dec 2020 from nkon.nl and it arrive shorty after.
It´s darker in color than my other one from Nov 2019. The new H600Fd is also darker.








In Picture:
Zebralight H600w MK III - 18650 XHP35 Headlamp
Zebralight H600Fd Mk IV - 18650 XHP50.2 Floody 5000K High CRI Headlamp

Zebralight SC700d - 21700 XHP70.2 Neutral White High CRI Flashlight
Zebralight SC600W MK III - 18650 Cree XHP35 Flashlight
Zebralight SC32w - CR123 XM-L2 Flashlight


----------



## likethevegetable

Nice collection! Your photo of the SC700d doesn't make the head look massive compared to the body, like I've seen in other photos. Maybe I'm leaning towards one now... hah.


----------



## AstroTurf

likethevegetable said:


> Nice collection! Your photo of the SC700d doesn't make the head look massive compared to the body, like I've seen in other photos. Maybe I'm leaning towards one now... hah.



Feels nice in the hand too!!!

LOLz


----------



## Derek Dean

likethevegetable, the SC700d feels like a finely sculpted piece of art when held. It really is a beautifully crafted light and is the one I keep on my nightstand, however, it IS a bit heavier than the SC600 series of lights, which should be taken into account. For my uses, I appreciate that extra heft. I also love that it's got not only extremely high output when needed, but also extremely low output as well, which I use for my nightly trips to the bathroom. All that with a HI CRI LED. In my opinion, one of Zebralight's most versatile lights.


----------



## SYZYGY

*Re: The Official Zebralight Thread*

to those crying about ZL not shipping internationally:

i'm sorry it's not as cheap and/or convenient anymore, but there's no need to act like the sky is falling or start vilifying ZL.

unfortunately, the US is not structured for economical, low-volume export. the closest thing we have to a good option is USPS, and international USPS shipping is SUPER slow and unreliable to many destinations right due to COVID. it wouldn't surprise me if ZL resumes selling internationally to end-users when the COVID situation improves.

moreover, i never understood the expectation for a good to automatically cost the same in a foreign market as in a domestic market. really?

as said, you still have the option of convenience to buy from international shops like nkon. there's an upcharge (45usd in the example given above) yes.. not cheap, but what's 45 extra dollars on a hobby item you probably buy at most a few of each year? that's nothing.

also, even if there weren't international sellers, why not just nut up and use a package forwarding service? i do this all the time for goods i can't ordinarily buy online. i never automatically expect a company to sell anything internationally. in fact, it wouldn't surprise me if you could get it cheaper that way than via nkon if the markup is actually 45usd. be a big boy and do some research. there are many ways to be resourceful.

i hope the situation improves and that you can buy from ZL directly again one day soon, but calling them a terrible company over this is pretty stupid.

edit: fwiw, i'm willing to occasionally forward packages for free to non-US people in need. i'm sure others are, too. just ask.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

SYZYGY said:


> to those crying about ZL not shipping internationally:
> 
> i'm sorry it's not as cheap and/or convenient anymore, but there's no need to act like the sky is falling or start vilifying ZL.
> 
> unfortunately, the US is not structured for economical, low-volume export. the closest thing we have to a good option is USPS, and international USPS shipping is SUPER slow and unreliable to many destinations right due to COVID. it wouldn't surprise me if ZL resumes selling internationally to end-users when the COVID situation improves.
> 
> moreover, i never understood the expectation for a good to automatically cost the same in a foreign market as in a domestic market. really?



First, I'll point out that Zebralight is a Chinese company, which makes their lights in China, and for every country except the US, they shipped their lights to the consumer directly from China. (The US has/had a Texas warehouse where they shipped from.)

Second, I ordered a Emisar D4v2 from International Outdoor last week. Again, a Chinese company, shipping their lights from China. It was FREE shipping, and tracking shows it's going to get delivered to me today in the regular mail (Canada). That's LESS THAN 2 WEEKS from China. That's actually better time than I would normally get before the pandemic started! (For free shipping.)

There's absolutely no excuse why Zebralight can't do what every other Chinese company is able to do. Using the pandemic as an excuse not to do mail-order? That's not only ridiculous, but completely contrary to what every other company is doing now, including traditional brick & mortar retail stores. Zebralight no longer seems interested in running a proper business.


----------



## SYZYGY

*Re: The Official Zebralight Thread*



WalkIntoTheLight said:


> First, I'll point out that Zebralight is a Chinese company, which makes their lights in China, and for every country except the US, they shipped their lights to the consumer directly from China. (The US has/had a Texas warehouse where they shipped from.)
> 
> Second, I ordered a Emisar D4v2 from International Outdoor last week. Again, a Chinese company, shipping their lights from China. It was FREE shipping, and tracking shows it's going to get delivered to me today in the regular mail (Canada). That's LESS THAN 2 WEEKS from China. That's actually better time than I would normally get before the pandemic started! (For free shipping.)
> 
> There's absolutely no excuse why Zebralight can't do what every other Chinese company is able to do. Using the pandemic as an excuse not to do mail-order? That's not only ridiculous, but completely contrary to what every other company is doing now, including traditional brick & mortar retail stores. Zebralight no longer seems interested in running a proper business.



you're saying that ZL only shipped domestically from the US?
only US customers got their lights from the US, and everyone else got their lights shipped to them directly from china? that's interesting.

i've never heard that before, and that changes my impression of the situation.

i wonder if they're trying to make their business seem more american or something. or they're having problems with their chinese order fulfillment. or they want to do only US-based QC. i dunno.

where were non-US customers supposed to send their lights for warranty issues?

still though, they have to be an american company, right? are you doubting that they're registered as a business in the US and pay taxes?


----------



## id30209

Well folks, as i’m in Europe, getting ZL is always pricey for me but as long as i can get even used ones i’m happy. 
Nkon will have them for sure so i’m good. 

Now talking about SC64w HI (i love the tint on that one) and just recently arrived SC600Fc IV+ i was really disapointed in the last one. 4000K but beam is so yellow and green.
So i decided to upgrade to Fd standard. I have 5000K XHP50.2 90CRI laying around and i think it will be better than Fc.














Sent from Tapatalk


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

SYZYGY said:


> you're saying that ZL only shipped domestically from the US?
> only US customers got their lights from the US, and everyone else got their lights shipped to them directly from china? that's interesting.
> 
> i've never heard that before, and that changes my impression of the situation.
> 
> i wonder if they're trying to make their business seem more american or something. or they're having problems with their chinese order fulfillment. or they want to do only US-based QC. i dunno.
> 
> where were non-US customers supposed to send their lights for warranty issues?
> 
> still though, they have to be an american company, right? are you doubting that they're registered as a business in the US and pay taxes?



Yes, it's always been the case (for at least several years, anyway) that US customers get their lights shipped from Texas, whereas anyone else in the world got their lights shipped from China. AFAIK, all lights are made in China, but they were sent to a warehouse in Texas for distribution locally. The owners are Chinese, but there's some evidence that they live in Texas, so perhaps that's why they set up the distribution there.

Zebralight is registered as a company in Texas, yes. But, they do everything else in China. Though, perhaps with the recent changes, maybe that has changed. Anything is possible. I think at one time they were going to do some manufacturing or something like that in Texas, but I don't think that ever happened. You only have to look at the prices from companies like HDS or Surefire or Malkoff, to understand why.

For warranty service, I think you send it to Texas, then they just mail it off to China to be fixed. That's why it takes so long. Everywhere else in the world, you just mail it to China. I've never had to get warranty work, but it was a pretty good deal outside of the warranty period, just $15, if they still had parts.


----------



## The Whispering Gallery

id30209 said:


> Sent from Tapatalk



That's before the LED swap, right?

How are you planning to install the new LED? By prying out the driver completely like others have done?


----------



## id30209

Yeap, heating it a bit to soften the silicone beneath and pull with the tweezers.
Now to the swap


Sent from Tapatalk


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Aren't zebralights supposed to be potted? How did you get that out, if it was potted?


----------



## id30209

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Aren't zebralights supposed to be potted? How did you get that out, if it was potted?



Soft silicone...






Sent from Tapatalk


----------



## SYZYGY

*Re: The Official Zebralight Thread*

i'm wondering if someone can please give me some insight and educated guesses about what the new ZL offerings could be.

i'm not an emitter nerd, so i don't even know what SST20 is. it appears to be a series of high-CRI emitters by Luminus that may be as good as or better than those of nichia fame? is that right?

what are the beam characteristics like? are they large or small emitters in terms of physical footprint?

just asking because i bought SC64w HI and H600d Mk IV as gifts, and i'm wondering if i should cancel the order and wait to see what's coming.
anyone suspect that these lights are about to get refreshed very soon?

thanks. and don't be afraid to dumb it down for me. assume i don't know much about flashlights


----------



## NPL

SST20 is offered in 4000k down to 2700k in 95 CRI, matching closely to the 9080 cri of the 219b. It's a small LED so it has much better intensity and can outhrow the lh351d and 219c. 

I really like it, but it comes with one major downside. At low power settings, the SST20 turns more green. Not ideal for low and moonlight levels. 

The sc64 hi will give similar throw to an SST20 high cri emitter, but more lumens and better tint across all output levels. The xhp50 led will be far brighter, but also way more floody with not as much reach against an SST20.

I'd say stick to your order, as we don't know if Zebralight will release any new lights and if they do, might be a while until we see one. 

Sent from my Pixel using Candlepowerforums mobile app


----------



## this_is_nascar

I agree in recommending to stick with your purchase. It's a great light.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Yeah, it's been over 3 years since Zebralight updated their line-up, and there's no indication they have any plans to do so in the future. This seems bad on the surface, but in reality, there hasn't been a huge change in LEDs or batteries over the past 3 years that requires an update. So, if you're waiting for an updated line-up before you buy, you might be waiting a long time.

A wider selection of LEDs would be a nice addition to their line-up, but they probably don't want to introduce too many skews. Probably a smart thing for a business to do, even though it kind of sucks for the consumer. Other companies, like Convoy and Emisar, seems to be able to handle a large variety of emitters. But, most companies just stick with the ugliest cool-white they can find. Zebralight is in the middle.


----------



## Outdoorsman5

SYZYGY, I agree with the recommendation to stick with your purchase. If I could have only one flashlight, it’d be the Zebra SC64w HI. You’ve also picked a great headlight too. Odds are, you’ll LOVE em, especially the UI!!


----------



## SYZYGY

*Re: The Official Zebralight Thread*

thanks for the responses guys!

those were just going to be gifts for family members.

btw, i already have sc64w hi, sc600w plus, sc700d, and h600w for myself (i like h600w more than h600c/h600d because of the slightly narrower beam angle).
the sc64w hi especially is great. it's always in my pocket. barely noticeable. small enough to not get in the way but throwy enough to not be useless outside.

indeed, the UI is nice. i only use G6/G7. G6 i have low modes on single click (H1/H2) and high modes on long click (L1/L2). G7 i pretty much just use to access the (rarely used) very lowest and highest mode since i didn't put them in G6. i don't like that it takes about 200 clicks to fully program G6 and G7, but oh well. you only have to do it each time you get a new light :duh2:

mostly i was looking for a possible excuse to get a hands on look at a new model i might like more. if i did, then i'd know what to upgrade to later lol


----------



## Owen

*Re: The Official Zebralight Thread*

I'm getting more and more interested in the A6 headlamp. 
I'd already had several coworkers asking about my H600w after seeing it in action, but last night I spent nearly 6hrs acting as an extra mechanic. They all have headlamps, but nothing like this, and it made things better for everyone.
It makes for really short conversation, though.
"Hey, how much did that cost? $90?!? Oh, hell, no!" 
I was thinking that if they could make one model that was waterproof, with a floody beam, neutral emitter, and simpler UI at a lower cost, it might go over really well. So I finally got around to looking at their product comparison page, and there it is. 5 mode, 5000K, Floody.
I was hoping for 3 easily programmable modes with less max output('cause with 800 lumens on tap, people will naturally be running around with it on high, burning through batteries like crazy), but whatever.

Just not sure what price point they'd need to hit.
In years past, having something like that issued by the company could have been a very realistic expectation where I work, but in our current ownership's case, they'd definitely have to be bought by the individual employees.


----------



## markr6

*Re: The Official Zebralight Thread*

Even with the price tag, I still can't believe all my camping friends don't go home and buy one after seeing my perfect neutral white tint on the leaves and snow next to their dim, PWM, purple crap.


----------



## SYZYGY

*Re: The Official Zebralight Thread*

the headlamp straps and rubber holders have changed.

the rubber holder has a new mold. if you look, the shape is a bit different.
the material is also different. the new rubber is stiffer, firmer, less compliant. it was harder to get the headlamp into it.

the strap is also totally different. different process and material.
the old strap had the same zebralight art pattern on both sides, but the color was inverted on the reverse side.
the new one has the zebralight pattern on one side, but the reverse side is one solid color (no pattern). it's somewhat shiny.
the material also has a significantly different feel. the old style has a softer feel. the new one feels stiffer and thicker, but it's still stretchy.
it feels kind of like nylon webbing when it's not stretched. it's silky smooth (especially if you feel it "along the weave" in one direction) and yet also kind of harsh feeling.
the older one felt a bit like terrycloth in comparison. i haven't tested, but i would imagine that velcro would stick to the old style much better just to give you an idea of its texture.
i think i prefer the old strap material more (seems more comfy), but the new one's also fine.

the adjustment buckles appear to be identical.

in these pics, the new headlamp is on top, and the old is below:












i got two sc64w hi and one h600w.
fwiw, the anodization is the same on them. the current batch is a fairly dark color with a rougher, more satin-like texture.
it's not glassy smooth like some other batches.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

*Re: The Official Zebralight Thread*

It's been like that for at least a year. The H600Fc I bought last year has the same strap as yours. (Well, I bought two straps for a backup, but I never opened the other one yet. Maybe it's different.)


----------



## SYZYGY

*Re: The Official Zebralight Thread*

whoops. just consider it another review then


----------



## Lou Minescence

As a note i ordered a few replacement headbands for the 600 series headlight and they are the newer style.


----------



## AstroTurf

*Re: The Official Zebralight Thread*

Good Info!!!



SYZYGY said:


> the headlamp straps and rubber holders have changed.
> 
> the rubber holder has a new mold. if you look, the shape is a bit different.


----------



## tonkem

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Yeah, it's been over 3 years since Zebralight updated their line-up, and there's no indication they have any plans to do so in the future. This seems bad on the surface, but in reality, there hasn't been a huge change in LEDs or batteries over the past 3 years that requires an update. So, if you're waiting for an updated line-up before you buy, you might be waiting a long time.
> 
> A wider selection of LEDs would be a nice addition to their line-up, but they probably don't want to introduce too many skews. Probably a smart thing for a business to do, even though it kind of sucks for the consumer. Other companies, like Convoy and Emisar, seems to be able to handle a large variety of emitters. But, most companies just stick with the ugliest cool-white they can find. Zebralight is in the middle.



I emailed Zebralight asking when the SC600 MK V would be coming and the replied with: From what I know of, we'll focus on the A6 and H600 mostly this year. The SC65 will be released early next year and then the SC600 V series. 

The A6 may look like an entry level thing, but in reality it's our first try of a new (groundbreaking!) driver design that is far more efficient than anything on the market, along with some goodies (~6.8mm shorter than the H600, built in magnets, etc.)
The H600 V will come with a magnetic charging port.

That is good news, but I was hoping the SC600 would be released this year. Oh well. I will have to just enjoy using my current line up of zebras: SC600 MK III, SC700d, SC63(edc), H600 MKIV. Zebralight is my favorite manufacturer and almost use them exclusively. I have a Nitecore P30 for throw, and Noctigon Meteor for high output.


----------



## Outdoorsman5

Great info tonkem! Thanks!!


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Interesting. Sounds like good news, mostly. Very slow to release new products, but they seem to be planning to stay in business.

Not interested in the A6. Nor am I interested in anything with magnetic charging. Hopefully, they'll keep the Mk IV designs for those of us that prefer to charge separately and want to keep the lights as small and light as possible.

(Well, assuming they decide to sell outside the US at some point in the future.)


----------



## ieslei

tonkem said:


> I emailed Zebralight asking when the SC600 MK V would be coming and the replied with: From what I know of, we'll focus on the A6 and H600 mostly this year. The SC65 will be released early next year and then the SC600 V series.
> 
> The A6 may look like an entry level thing, but in reality it's our first try of a new (groundbreaking!) driver design that is far more efficient than anything on the market, along with some goodies (~6.8mm shorter than the H600, built in magnets, etc.)
> The H600 V will come with a magnetic charging port.
> 
> That is good news, but I was hoping the SC600 would be released this year. Oh well. I will have to just enjoy using my current line up of zebras: SC600 MK III, SC700d, SC63(edc), H600 MKIV. Zebralight is my favorite manufacturer and almost use them exclusively. I have a Nitecore P30 for throw, and Noctigon Meteor for high output.


That sounds great! But next year like 2021? Hahah are you sure the email was not replied on December 31? Hahaha

Cheers!

Enviado de meu MI 9 usando o Tapatalk


----------



## AstroTurf

+70 cri, no thanks...



tonkem said:


> I emailed Zebralight asking when the SC600 MK V would be coming and the replied with: From what I know of, we'll focus on the A6 and H600 mostly this year. The SC65 will be released early next year and then the SC600 V series.
> 
> The A6 may look like an entry level thing, but in reality it's our first try of a new (groundbreaking!) driver design that is far more efficient than anything on the market, along with some goodies (~6.8mm shorter than the H600, built in magnets, etc.)
> The H600 V will come with a magnetic charging port.
> 
> That is good news, but I was hoping the SC600 would be released this year. Oh well. I will have to just enjoy using my current line up of zebras: SC600 MK III, SC700d, SC63(edc), H600 MKIV. Zebralight is my favorite manufacturer and almost use them exclusively. I have a Nitecore P30 for throw, and Noctigon Meteor for high output.


----------



## justanotherguy

Ok zebra heads.. I currently am married to :

SC64
SC700d 
SC600w mk III HI
SC600fd mk IV plus

DOES the SC600F Mk III Plus fill any holes?

I am not a CRI baby, perhaps the mk III surplants the high CRI mk IV ?

The reason I ask is that the mk III is $69 on clearance


----------



## AstroTurf

not with this on hand it doesn't: SC600fd mk IV plus

it just creates one in your pocket.



justanotherguy said:


> Ok zebra heads.. I currently am married to :
> 
> SC64
> SC700d
> SC600w mk III HI
> SC600fd mk IV plus
> 
> DOES the SC600F Mk III Plus fill any holes?
> 
> I am not a CRI baby, perhaps the mk III surplants the high CRI mk IV ?
> 
> The reason I ask is that the mk III is $69 on clearance


----------



## Luminesce

I've been looking for a way to carry a SC700F on my belt. The 1.5 inch head could make some of the knife holsters a tough fit as I've found many show a 1.5x1" ID. Looked at light holsters like the Lumintop FW21 Pro Nylon Holster and many others but still not finding what I'd prefer. Don't want a molded holster, nylon with stretch sides would be best. I can always sew a Velcro strap across the top to hold the light in. A friend mentions she might be able to stitch together a case made from heavy denim, which would be flexible and less likely to feel uncomfortable like a molded case while bending or sitting. Has anyone found something they like and be suited for the SC700?

And while at it, does anyone have both the F and Fd versions? Looking for feedback from someone who can compare the two side-by-side. I have the floody version and for my typical use it's perfect. Would consider getting a F version too if there is that much difference between them, throw vs floody. The size and power make it a winner. Was surprised at how well it works for me. Bought it as a backup for those times when I didn't want to bring along the slightly bulkier GX30A3D. With the right holster it might give my P10A's competition as an EDC.


----------



## tonkem

ieslei said:


> That sounds great! But next year like 2021? Hahah are you sure the email was not replied on December 31? Hahaha
> 
> Cheers!
> 
> Enviado de meu MI 9 usando o Tapatalk



I gathered next year is 2022, as I emailed yesterday and they replied today.


----------



## likethevegetable

SYZYGY, thanks for sharing! I use the ArmyTek Wizard mount and pocket clip (and grind the clamps down slightly), and much prefer them.

tonkem, also thanks for sharing. Looks like they're in less trouble than we speculated, hah. Magnetic charging will be interesting, although I must admit I'd rather have a ZL that's as compact and reliable as possible, which seems to fit their current design ethos. Only things I would ask for are better LEDs, shorten the H600's a few mm, and add some more customizability to the UI (a few ideas come to mind), a switch that felt more durable, and some consistent anodizing, haha I guess that list went on... However, if the charging circuit was bi-directional, ie, allowed us to use our ZL as a battery bank, I'd take that.


----------



## holygeez03

I wonder what emitter the SC600w MkV Plus will use?

And will the SC65w out-throw the the SC64w HI?


----------



## this_is_nascar

I have zero interest in a ZL that has either magnetic or USB on-board charging. If I had one suggestion, it would be to allow for any sized 18650 sized cell on the SC64 and SC600 Series.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## Bob_McBob

I think it's a pretty safe bet the next generation of lights will be XHP35.2, XHP50.2, and XHP70.2 for the most part. AA lights will probably be LH351D or SST-20. I suspect the SC64c LE will become another XHP35.2 variant of the SC65 unless Zebralight wants to save a few dollars on the LED.


----------



## Luminesce

*id30209*: How did you remove the bezel ring and lens on your SC600Fc? In the 1st photo the ring on your 600 looks to be sticking out a tad above the head of the light vs my SC700Fd which is flush if not a tiny bit recessed.


----------



## SYZYGY

*Re: The Official Zebralight Thread*



Luminesce said:


> *id30209*: How did you remove the bezel ring and lens on your SC600Fc? In the 1st photo the ring on your 600 looks to be sticking out a tad above the head of the light vs my SC700Fd which is flush if not a tiny bit recessed.



i would link to a topic on another forum, but as i've heard that -- for bizarre reasons beyond my comprehension -- i could get reprimanded or even banned for doing so, i'll just play it safe and repost this here. basically you just need to slip a thin (probably ground down with sand paper) metal wedge of some sort under the bezel ring (between the glass and the ring) and work your way around.

i suggest not using a razor blade. they're too brittle. you'll snap the edge off under the bezel.

it wasn't clear to me if you're trying to open sc700 series or sc600. sc700 is harder, and i have not succeeded yet. good luck:



SYZYGY said:


> using sandpaper, i ground down handle end of a lockpick stamped from a single sheet of 0.5mm spring steel. spring steel is nice because it's stiff, tough, and not brittle.
> 
> my initial impression is the sc700 is probably more annoying to open than sc64. i'm able to slip my tool much deeper under the sc64 bezel, and it's much easier going. i didn't actually try to open up my sc64 since that's not my goal, but i think i could probably do it with the tool i made.
> 
> 
> i tried to get the sc700 open, but i don't know if i actually made any progress. i might've lifted the bezel a little, but it's probably my imagination.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i wonder if the sc700 bezel tolerances are different, or if the oring is compressed more. or if the oring sits in a deeper retention channel, and the bezel is basically sitting right on a metal lip. maybe they wanted a positive stop for sc700 assembly.
> 
> 
> i guess i could try pressing the glass in a vise or something in case the oring will give a little. will update if i learn anything else.
> 
> 
> edit: this is a stubborn SOB. obviously breaking the glass to get into the light is admitting failure. i'm not there yet.
> 
> 
> i think what i may do is use a pin vise to drill a small hole into the face of the bezel. that would give me a spot to insert a dental pick or something as a pry tool to lift up and get one spot started. with one spot lifted up a little, maybe then i could work the other tool around like how bob was doing it.



has anyone here gotten sc700d open?


----------



## Luminesce

*Re: The Official Zebralight Thread*



SYZYGY said:


> i would link to a topic on another forum, but as i've heard that -- for bizarre reasons beyond my comprehension -- i could get reprimanded or even banned for doing so, i'll just play it safe and repost this here. basically you just need to slip a thin (probably ground down with sand paper) metal wedge of some sort under the bezel ring (between the glass and the ring) and work your way around.
> 
> i suggest not using a razor blade. they're too brittle. you'll snap the edge off under the bezel.
> 
> it wasn't clear to me if you're trying to open sc700 series or sc600. sc700 is harder, and i have not succeeded yet. good luck:
> 
> has anyone here gotten sc700d open?



Thanks 4 the reply. I was afraid you'd say what you said, when you said what you said. I see the breaking of the glass as a real problem I'd prefer to avoid. Don't need to get inside that badly, just curious. Rules are rules, cross post and all. It ain't our forum so we play by the rules but you could aways PM me with the link, doubt if that is breaking any rules. All in all, I still am pleased with the Fd version but I don't generally need a thrower during my night time activities. Maybe if we actually get the promised $2000 kickback from Uncle Sam, I can justify getting the F version too.

Need to do a bit of research and see which of the 21700 batteries out there will fit these lights. Perhaps something with a bit more kick than the Samsung 40T that ZL sells but so far they are doing the job and with a small thin washed inserted at the positive end of the battery to insure contact when placed into my XTAR Dragon VP4 charger, I can charge the battery up in ~2 hrs.


----------



## quahog

I'm curious if anyone has seen this issue I'm seeing. I received my first ZL today, an H600Fc Mk IV and I've noticed some visible flickering on L1 (3.3lm) and only on this mode. It's not a huge deal because I can use G6/G7 and skip this mode.

Here's a close-up video using my phone:
https://streamable.com/5072fz

The flickering is quite visible to the naked eye looking directly at the light or when viewing it normally lighting up the room/wall.


----------



## NPL

If adding a magnetic charging feature adds weight or size to the headlamps especially, I prefer without. If they manage to implement it in such a way that doesn't compromise the super light and compact design, no harm to me. Very curious to find out more about this new ground breaking efficient driver they mentioned.... The likely xhp35.2 xhp50.2 etc is nothing to be excited about... 

Sent from my Pixel using Candlepowerforums mobile app


----------



## SYZYGY

*Re: The Official Zebralight Thread*



quahog said:


> I'm curious if anyone has seen this issue I'm seeing. I received my first ZL today, an H600Fc Mk IV and I've noticed some visible flickering on L1 (3.3lm) and only on this mode. It's not a huge deal because I can use G6/G7 and skip this mode.
> 
> Here's a close-up video using my phone:
> https://streamable.com/5072fz
> 
> The flickering is quite visible to the naked eye looking directly at the light or when viewing it normally lighting up the room/wall.



just tried with a recently-received h600d. no flickering on L1 or L2 via G5.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

quahog said:


> I'm curious if anyone has seen this issue I'm seeing. I received my first ZL today, an H600Fc Mk IV and I've noticed some visible flickering on L1 (3.3lm) and only on this mode. It's not a huge deal because I can use G6/G7 and skip this mode.
> 
> Here's a close-up video using my phone:
> https://streamable.com/5072fz
> 
> The flickering is quite visible to the naked eye looking directly at the light or when viewing it normally lighting up the room/wall.



It's really hard to tell from your video. But, anyway, I have that exact light, and there's no visible flickering or changes in brightness on the default L1 (or any other mode). Sounds like it may be a driver issue. I'm surprised you don't notice it on the moonlight levels too, if it's having problems at low output.


----------



## quahog

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> It's really hard to tell from your video. But, anyway, I have that exact light, and there's no visible flickering or changes in brightness on the default L1 (or any other mode). Sounds like it may be a driver issue. I'm surprised you don't notice it on the moonlight levels too, if it's having problems at low output.


Yes, very strange that it's only on this single mode. I've programmed G6 and tested all modes.

You won't see the flickering on the video but it does show up as the vertical black bars (rolling shutter effect). The vertical bars don't seem to have a pattern and are random which is how the flickering looks like to my eye (random changes in brightness).

Just made another video by pointing the light at the wall (a few inches away) and then recording:
https://streamable.com/jdi76t

I guess I need to decide if I can live without the 3.3lm level otherwise I need to do an RMA.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

quahog said:


> I guess I need to decide if I can live without the 3.3lm level otherwise I need to do an RMA.



Personally, I find that one of the most useful modes, if you just want dim illumination outdoors. I'd return it, unless you're absolutely sure you'll never use that mode.


----------



## Bob_McBob

quahog said:


> I guess I need to decide if I can live without the 3.3lm level otherwise I need to do an RMA.



I would not accept a light with any unusual driver behaviour, especially for $89. There is clearly something wrong with it, and it's possible it could get worse in the future.


----------



## quahog

Bob_McBob said:


> I would not accept a light with any unusual driver behaviour, especially for $89. There is clearly something wrong with it, and it's possible it could get worse in the future.


Thanks for the input. I'll contact NKON and see about a replacement.


----------



## Luminesce

quahog said:


> I'm curious if anyone has seen this issue I'm seeing. I received my first ZL today, an H600Fc Mk IV and I've noticed some visible flickering on L1 (3.3lm) and only on this mode. It's not a huge deal because I can use G6/G7 and skip this mode.



Since it's only on one mode I would think it's not the LED itself. That leaves the software side as the suspect. I'd be concerned that it could popup on other modes (probably unlikely) and ask for a replacement under manufacturer's warranty or seller's return policy to avoid dealing with a worsening future issue.


----------



## this_is_nascar

I can honestly say that I've never regularly used any of my ZL's on G5. The 1st thing I do when getting one is to program G6 and G7 and toggle between them.

I'd definitely return the light if you're concerned.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## PoliceScannerMan

So after years of ZL ownership I finally programmed mine to my liking. Click comes on to a good EDC medium, double click from there is a slightly lower yet usable level. Long press is the second from lowest level, double click to 3rd from lowest. Two clicks from off is max, double click to get 3 from max. Love it!!


----------



## Owen

Some years ago, I put a H60w, one of the original 18650 Zebralights, on my hardhat. It eventually succumbed to water ingress around the optic(I'm out in all weather, and the worse the weather, the more time I spend out in it), and left me a bit disillusioned about both Zebralight and the idea of having a "nice" light on my hardhat. 

After ~9yrs of using a variety of 3AAA headlamps supplied by my employer, my own comment here that my work headlamp saw more runtime than all my other lights combined drove me to buy another Zebralight. They have the only UI that I really like, aside from a simple forward clicky, and my EDC light and backpacking headlamp for the last 8yrs are Zebralights, so I decided to put aside any misgivings, and give them another shot as a heavy user.

Last night made 3 weeks for my new H600w XHP35. 
18 night shifts, plus a couple of evenings, and >60hrs of use.
Its combination of large spot and broad spill has proven much more useful than the flood and narrow beams, respectively, that preceded it, and the long runtime at steady, usable outputs makes it very practical. 
The modes I use, almost exclusively, are the 127Lm/13.8hr and 264Lm/6.3hr ones. 
I work 11-7, and the sun doesn't come up until after 6 right now. The 127Lm mode is on whenever I'm busy. 
I love it. Where there's lots of ambient light, I can't even tell it's on until I look at something, or into areas, the light doesn't reach...and I can see.
The 264Lm mode gets used for the same stuff, only when I need to see things a little better, it's raining, etc. It may or may not get bumped back to G5 for a taste of that 1400Lm H1, now and then, too

So far, so good. It's seen quite a bit of rain, already, along with being washed and scrubbed in the sink a few times. 
I just hope it remains reliable over time, and earns my wholehearted endorsement in addition to the good first impression. 





Can't believe I was running around with a dang Rayovac on my head:ironic:


----------



## PoliceScannerMan

Great report Owen, love it man.


----------



## markr6

Good real-life use. Kinda makes me want to find a job to fit my flashlight, not a flashlight for my job


----------



## marco.weiss

hello.
where i can find an H600Fc Mk IV?


----------



## AstroTurf

in the wtb section?!?



marco.weiss said:


> hello.
> where i can find an H600Fc Mk IV?


----------



## marco.weiss

I would like to buy a new one ...
most sites have this model out of stock and the official website said the model was in back order.


I contacted zebralight on the website and found out that they can make one available within 2 weeks.
I was very happy with that


----------



## AstroTurf

so, are they now allowing worldwide shipping?

that would be great news!!!



marco.weiss said:


> I would like to buy a new one ...
> most sites have this model out of stock and the official website said the model was in back order.
> 
> 
> I contacted zebralight on the website and found out that they can make one available within 2 weeks.
> I was very happy with that


----------



## marco.weiss

no, only to USA


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

marco.weiss said:


> no, only to USA



If you live in Brazil, why are you happy?


----------



## marco.weiss

i'm brazilian, i live in brazil, but i have a postal address in the united states to receive orders ... 


I was happy because I didn't think they would accept an order and it would be ready so quickly ... two weeks is a deadline that I wait with a smile on my face.


----------



## ieslei

marco.weiss said:


> i'm brazilian, i live in brazil, but i have a postal address in the united states to receive orders ...
> 
> 
> I was happy because I didn't think they would accept an order and it would be ready so quickly ... two weeks is a deadline that I wait with a smile on my face.


Hi, Marco. I am also brazilian, and will do the same thing in order to have more zebras 

Enviado de meu MI 9 usando o Tapatalk


----------



## marco.weiss

Happy to see another Brazilian here.
In the past they were more numerous and active in the CPF forum.
I also believe that many are just spying on topics ... lol


That morning zebralight answered my last question and really, the estimated time is two weeks.


----------



## ieslei

Seriously? I am a member since 2010, and never noticed them. They might be passive though..... Hehe 
Cheers

Enviado de meu MI 9 usando o Tapatalk


----------



## marco.weiss

Great report Owen, love it man. +50

I love zebralight
In fact the user interface is excellent
After years away from the brand I turned my eyes to zebralight and decided to purchase the h53fc model (compact, light and with good autonomy te 50 lumens) and possibly the h600fc model as well


----------



## GPS Rider

Stepping out of lurker mode to share my recent not great experiences with ZL.

I've got five ZebraLights and they are some of my favorite lights to EDC. I'm a first responder and don't consider them duty grade, primarily because of my experience below, but I do carry either my SC63w or SC600w Mk IV Plus as a backup light when I'm in uniform. I've been very pleased with all my ZL's as having great features, color, and tint, and regularly recommend them to friends and coworkers, which makes my recent experiences all the more frustrating.

First strike was last year when I dropped my SC600w Mk IV Plus from waist height. The light became intermittent and when I opened it up, I discovered that the top of the battery had crushed in, making the battery too short to make good connnection. So I wrote to ZL to let them know of what I consider a product flaw and expected them to at least offer a replacement battery. Their one-line response was that I could order a new battery and included a link for same. Frustration factor = 50%.

More recently, after wanting a SC700d since they were released, but not wanting to add yet another new battery model to the inventory, I finally decided to bite the bullet and ordered one two days after Christmas. Now, these lights have been listed as backordered every time I have checked their inventory ever since they were released, so I first sent a query to their CS asking what their anticipated shipping time was. Their one line response was, "in a few days."

So I ordered one along with an H502 that was on sale, expecting they would ship in a week or two. I especially expected they would when my credit card was charged immediately. So when over two weeks had gone by with nary a word, I sent another query to CS and was told they would get back to me on Monday. Of course, Monday came and went, so I enquired again on Wednesday and was told the SC700 would ship in two weeks and the H502 in three. Frustration factor = 70%.

Fast forward to two weeks later, ala today, when I'm checking my credit card and notice that they refunded my purchase LAST WEEK and did not send any kind of update. So, again to CS, asking if they will be fulfilling the order, and they respond that the order was cancelled and, "Please make another order if you would like." Frustration factor = 80%.

I have to say, at that point I did send them a rather blunt opinion of their crappy CS. Their response was that if I order today, it will be shipped later this week or early next week. Frustration factor = 90%.

Well, since I've got two boxes of 21700 batteries sitting on the table here looking for a light to power, I went ahead and placed a new order. Wish me luck, because at this point, I think that's all I've got.

Such a bummer that a light as good as the ZL's get this dismal CS support. Things that make you go, "hmm."

- GR


----------



## Luminesce

Hi GPS Rider, based on my recent experience with ZL, I believe the model you order makes all the difference in how fast it's shipped. My 1st SC700DF shipped a day after I ordered it last month. After seeing how well I liked it, I then decided to also order the SC700D along with some other items. So far it's been 11 days w/o any shipping info. My guess is, the floody version doesn't sell as well so the one I got happened to be in stock. Or maybe, one of the other items I ordered is OS and they are waiting for everything to be in stock before shipping. 

It did take ZL 5 months to repair a light for me not too many years ago, so I know turn around can be slow but this seems to be par in many businesses. A two-way radio I sent in on Dec 19 for repair, is just now is being serviced by the techs, almost 7 weeks before they got to it. Sometimes things don't work out the way we want. Hopefully ZL gets some stock in soon. I don't like paying for something and being told to wait 2 months before I can get it. 

I do agree with anyone who says, the item (no matter what it is) should not be billed until the company ships it, no matter who the company is. But having worked in retail, I do know that some companies do this to bank on your money, even if it only makes them a tiny profit. "Not saying" ZL is doing this but it doesn't sit well with consumers when "any" company works in this fashion. Hope you get your light soon.


----------



## justanotherguy

Personally GPS rider.. dropping something and damaging it are not defects...


----------



## Bob_McBob

GPS Rider said:


> First strike was last year when I dropped my SC600w Mk IV Plus from waist height. The light became intermittent and when I opened it up, I discovered that the top of the battery had crushed in, making the battery too short to make good connnection. So I wrote to ZL to let them know of what I consider a product flaw and expected them to at least offer a replacement battery. Their one-line response was that I could order a new battery and included a link for same. Frustration factor = 50%.



This is a potential issue with any light that doesn't have traditional springs for both cell terminals. It was far more of a problem with the original pogo pin configuration they used on the SC600w III, so they have addressed it. They don't claim the light is rated for any kind of fall, so the fact it survived with no damage beyond a dented terminal on a $6 cell seems reasonable to me.

As for the rest, it all sounds very familiar and is basically just a part of dealing with Zebralight. They have no real competition in their market niche, and their production can't keep up with demand, so unfortunately they don't have much motivation to improve their customer service. It sucks, but there's not much you can do about it other than warn others.


----------



## adamlau

I always add a 16mm x 1mm (ID x CS) o-ring up front when applicable. Works great with the raised positive of the GA. 







I have also experienced the misfortune of dented cells with ZL in the past. None since installing a bumper at the positive.


----------



## NPL

Dropping your light and denting the battery is not a product flaw, and it's unfair to expect Zebralight to give you a free battery. They use pogo pins to make the light as compact as possible. 
Maybe an opportunity to improve the design, but that's as far as I would go.

Love the O-ring idea!


Sent from my Pixel using Candlepowerforums mobile app


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

I have used a couple of cardboard rings used for 18650 battery re-wraps. I stick them on the positive ends of the cells. It works well.

However, I no longer do it, since it can make recharging them a bit finicky on some chargers. Also, I agree this really shouldn't be necessary.

Best thing to do is just never drop your light.


----------



## Connor

To be fair all of the flat-top cells are not _meant_ to be used "loose" by end users .. they're industry cells. They just happen to be the cheapest/shortest/most available option.


----------



## adamlau

Or we can say that ZL designed certain models around flat tops. Hence, our expectations.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Yeah, even though Zebralight doesn't publish any drop specs, I think it's reasonable to expect that both the light and the battery will survive a 1 meter drop onto a hard surface. These are not inexpensive lights!

Personally, I have dropped some of my AA zebras, and they have survived fine. I'm more careful of the 18650 models, since I don't like to trash my cells. IMO, this is a design flaw that should be addressed. Even if it means adding 1mm to the length of the light. I think they may have partially addressed the issue by adding more pogo pins, but from what I've read, it doesn't seem to eliminate the problem.


----------



## this_is_nascar

I've said it before. I'd take a ZL that was 1/4-1/2 inch longer, to better accommodate and protect the cell. I'm actually disturbed to hear that these lights are so fragile, if that's really the case.

WTF good is an EDC, if you have to hope and pray that every time you drop it, it will refire? I'm not one that drops my stuff, but damn, a waist high drop onto any surface should not render a product useless.

Maybe I should reconsider my EDC going forward.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## PoliceScannerMan

Personally I have sent back 2 ZL’s that were dead after a drop. Both 18650 one headlamp one SC600. If you’re concerned about a drop proof light I’ll highly suggest a HDS. Can’t have it all, ZL’s are great lights, just don’t drop them lol.


----------



## this_is_nascar

PoliceScannerMan said:


> Personally I have sent back 2 ZL’s that were dead after a drop. Both 18650 one headlamp one SC600. If you’re concerned about a drop proof light I’ll highly suggest a HDS. Can’t have it all, ZL’s are great lights, just don’t drop them lol.


Seriously, hearing this really makes me give 2nd thoughts to keeping a ZL as my EDC. Why would I or anyone else want to risk this? I always have a 1xAAA as a secondary light, just in case, but obviously the output isn't comparable.

Is this this case for all 18650 iterations of ZL? What about there AA platform?

This really bums me out hearing this. What's the point of potting?


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## nightshade

Mine are older models, and it's purely anecdotal, but my H52 and H600 have endured dozens of falls. Many to concrete and steel surfaces and most greater than 1 meter height.


----------



## Connor

PoliceScannerMan said:


> Personally I have sent back 2 ZL’s that were dead after a drop. Both 18650 one headlamp one SC600. If you’re concerned about a drop proof light I’ll highly suggest a HDS. Can’t have it all, ZL’s are great lights, just don’t drop them lol.



Could you tell us what exactly was broken after these drops? I had the impression that ZLs are reasonably robust (except for the "flat-top terminal getting smashed in on an unlucky drop" thing).


----------



## id30209

Talking about damage, i droped SC64w HI last week from aircraft cockpit by accident. Roughly 10ft hight. Other than dented tailcap, no other damage or malfunctions.
Maybe there are Monday batches that are a bit more sensitive then others...


Sent from Tapatalk


----------



## SYZYGY

these lights seem designed to be small and light. you can probably only make them so sturdy.
that said, i've dropped mine from waist height onto concrete a few times with no issues. just lucky i guess.


----------



## Derek Dean

this_is_nascar said:


> Seriously, hearing this really makes me give 2nd thoughts to keeping a ZL as my EDC. Why would I or anyone else want to risk this? I always have a 1xAAA as a secondary light, just in case, but obviously the output isn't comparable.
> 
> Is this this case for all 18650 iterations of ZL? What about there AA platform?
> 
> This really bums me out hearing this. What's the point of potting?
> 
> 
> Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


I think you're over reacting a bit. I've used my Zebras at work every night for many years, and while I'm careful with my gear, they do get dropped occasionally, and it's never resulted in a light that wouldn't fire. Of course, I always have a 2nd light, just in case, but typically, the only time I need it is when I actually need two lights simultaneously for lighting a path.

I'm sorry GPS Rider had a bad experience with his light as well as with ZL customer service, but no light is perfect, and no company is perfect, not even HDS. Anything man made is going to have a chance of failure, which is why one of our flashaholic tenants is to always carry a backup, especially in mission critical situations. 

As others have mentioned, I don't believe the dented cell experienced by GPS Rider was the result of a "defect", but rather, bad luck in the way his light landed. However, it does point out an area where there might be room for improvement in ZL's design, and should, by all means, be brought to their attention. 

I do occasionally purchase a light from a different company, just for grins and to see what's out there, but I've yet to find a light that I prefer to any of my Zebras, and so, I will continue to use them nightly at work.


----------



## Luminesce

Just watched the video of post #311 for the "Re: Fraz Labs Mechanical Flashlights thread...". I'm sure others have "abused" their lights by accident but the video shows taking abuse too a whole new level, enjoy!


----------



## GPS Rider

Excellent suggestion, sir, thank you!



adamlau said:


> I always add a 16mm x 1mm (ID x CS) o-ring up front when applicable. Works great with the raised positive of the GA.
> 
> I have also experienced the misfortune of dented cells with ZL in the past. None since installing a bumper at the positive.


----------



## GPS Rider

I've got three of Henry's lights, and while they are exceptional lights and very sturdy, they are not really well suited for duty use, either. My duty use lights are all made by Mr. Malkoff.



PoliceScannerMan said:


> Personally I have sent back 2 ZL’s that were dead after a drop. Both 18650 one headlamp one SC600. If you’re concerned about a drop proof light I’ll highly suggest a HDS. Can’t have it all, ZL’s are great lights, just don’t drop them lol.


----------



## SYZYGY

*Re: The Official Zebralight Thread*



Luminesce said:


> Just watched the video of post #311 for the "Re: Fraz Labs Mechanical Flashlights thread...". I'm sure others have "abused" their lights by accident but the video shows taking abuse too a whole new level, enjoy!



would enjoy it more with a link to the post (or better yet, the video) in question. why make us search?

https://www.candlepowerforums.com/v...ttery-Crush)&p=5405552&viewfull=1#post5405552

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qexi1iPo_4k

it was satisfying seeing it fly through the air.


----------



## PoliceScannerMan

Ha ha I didn’t mean to create a poop storm by my comment. Please note I have had at least 15 maybe more ZL’s over the years and have dropped some of them with no harm. Guess the 2 that quit working I dropped them just right. Both on to hard surfaces. 

Nascar, I wouldn’t stop carrying ZL man, they are great. Loving my SC64 LE with Samsung 4000K. Probably my favorite.


----------



## this_is_nascar

PoliceScannerMan said:


> Ha ha I didn’t mean to create a poop storm by my comment. Please note I have had at least 15 maybe more ZL’s over the years and have dropped some of them with no harm. Guess the 2 that quit working I dropped them just right. Both on to hard surfaces.
> 
> Nascar, I wouldn’t stop carrying ZL man, they are great. Loving my SC64 LE with Samsung 4000K. Probably my favorite.


I agree. I'm not going to cease carrying what I think is my best EDC for a potential problem that's never occurred to me. If and when it does happen, I'll make a decision at that time.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## this_is_nascar

I'll have to check out that video.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## Luminesce

*Re: The Official Zebralight Thread*



SYZYGY said:


> would enjoy it more with a link to the post (or better yet, the video) in question. why make us search?
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qexi1iPo_4k
> 
> it was satisfying seeing it fly through the air.



I may be wrong in my understanding of CPF posting rules but I thought that they do not want us to Double or Cross Post links to other CPF posts. Didn't think about posting the link to youtube. Since no one has mentioned it yet, even though the 1st video may cause a few people to say "ouch", Fraz's 2nd video, https://youtu.be/oISuKpfAZrk is even better, if not a bit painful to watch 

If I didn't already have a variety of ZL's to suit my needs at this time, one of his lights would make a good bedside light with its variable brightness ability. Interesting flashlight, would make a unique gift for someone who can appreciate such a gift.


----------



## this_is_nascar

Well, that's it, I've totally lost it. You know you're getting old when you forget about one of the spares you have, that's been tucked away, just in case.







Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## SYZYGY

*Re: The Official Zebralight Thread*



Luminesce said:


> I may be wrong in my understanding of CPF posting rules but I thought that they do not want us to Double or Cross Post links to other CPF posts. Didn't think about posting the link to youtube. Since no one has mentioned it yet, even though the 1st video may cause a few people to say "ouch", Fraz's 2nd video, https://youtu.be/oISuKpfAZrk is even better, if not a bit painful to watch
> 
> If I didn't already have a variety of ZL's to suit my needs at this time, one of his lights would make a good bedside light with its variable brightness ability. Interesting flashlight, would make a unique gift for someone who can appreciate such a gift.



you even edited the link out of the post you quoted. haha 

i believe you misinterpreted the rule (my emphasis on the operative words):



CPF Rule 9 said:


> DO NOT post a *thread* whose *sole purpose* is to link to or refer to another thread on the board, whether it is yours or someone else's.



also, that light you linked to looks tough. he gave it a good smack.

-----

on another note, maybe i misunderstood, but it sounded like it was implied that ZL designing around unprotected cells makes for a worse situation in drops due to denting or whatever. if that's the case, can someone please explain?


----------



## this_is_nascar

This is one of my SC64w Hi versions, that's been my EDC since owning it. I continue to try and trick it out, so it better meet my needs.

My 1st addition was the magnet. It holds pretty well, but I do want to find a greyish colored marker or something, so it blends in a bit better. My 2nd thing was wrapping a piece of D-C Fix around the 18650 for those few times that I want or need to smooth out the hotspot.

My 3rd and most recent modification was to install this green tritium glow vial, which allows an easier means to find the light on my dresser.


















Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## AstroTurf

Very Trick Indeed!!!



this_is_nascar said:


> This is one of my SC64w Hi versions, that's been my EDC since owning it. I continue to try and trick it out, so it better meet my needs.
> 
> My 1st addition was the magnet. It holds pretty well, but I do want to find a greyish colored marker or something, so it blends in a bit better. My 2nd thing was wrapping a piece of D-C Fix around the 18650 for those few times that I want or need to smooth out the hotspot.
> 
> My 3rd and most recent modification was to install this green tritium glow vial, which allows an easier means to find the light on my dresser.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## Luminesce

Hello This_is_nascar. Like the changes. The magnet would be the most useful for me. I have bought a variety of neodymium magnets from All Electronics (which I've dealt with for decades) in the past and they do their job well, very hard to remove if layed flat on a metal surface. But none of them were round magnets. I do see they offer a 1" dia x 1/8 thick magnet and a 20mm x 4mm one with a countersunk hole to mount it with a screw. Is yours neodymium? Who did you buy it from if it's a neodymium magnet?


----------



## this_is_nascar

These are the ones I got from this place.

https://www.kjmagnetics.com/





Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## Shooter21

For some reason my 18650 zebra light steps down at 75 percent from max to low after running for a short time in cold weather.


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

Shooter21 said:


> For some reason my 18650 zebra light steps down at 75 percent from max to low after running for a short time in cold weather.



Yup. I've brought up this problem, before. In my case, it affects all my zebras using the XHP35 HI emitter. It turns off from H1, in cold weather. That's what you get when you try to use a light in cold weather, that was designed and tested in Texas summer. Lots of others have complained about this problem, too. They clearly have a driver design problem with some of their models.


----------



## this_is_nascar

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Yup. I've brought up this problem, before. In my case, it affects all my zebras using the XHP35 HI emitter. It turns off from H1, in cold weather. That's what you get when you try to use a light in cold weather, that was designed and tested in Texas summer. Lots of others have complained about this problem, too. They clearly have a driver design problem with some of their models.


Damn. Just when I calmed down from learning about one issue, I learn of another one.

How widespread is this?


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## Luminesce

this_is_nascar said:


> These are the ones I got from this place.
> 
> https://www.kjmagnetics.com/
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk



Thanks for the link. They have a large selection of magnets so I can easily outfit all my ZL's at one time. Nice info about magnets, how they work, are made, etc...on the web site too.


----------



## Netter1283

How have people attached the magnets? I was thinking silicone since it could probably be removed with some effort, unlike epoxy which would be more or less permanent.


----------



## this_is_nascar

Netter1283 said:


> How have people attached the magnets? I was thinking silicone since it could probably be removed with some effort, unlike epoxy which would be more or less permanent.


Gorilla Glue Clear. I was going to put some gray duct tape on the shinny surface, but it took too much holding power away.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## dydx

this_is_nascar said:


> Damn. Just when I calmed down from learning about one issue, I learn of another one.
> 
> How widespread is this?
> 
> 
> Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk



Yep my H6000c Mk IV with XHP50.2 drops down in about 2 seconds in below freezing weather.


----------



## Fespe

I can't decide between the sc700d or the SC600w Mark IV Plus. Some people say the sc700d is too floody! At the point that the spill it's annoying because it's too bright.
I would use the light for an "all purpose light" so outdoor and indoor. Working around the house and walking the dog in the woods close where I live.

Inviato dal mio Mi 9T utilizzando Tapatalk


----------



## this_is_nascar

Fespe said:


> I can't decide between the sc700d or the SC600w Mark IV Plus. Some people say the sc700d is too floody! At the point that the spill it's annoying because it's too bright.
> I would use the light for an "all purpose light" so outdoor and indoor. Working around the house and walking the dog in the woods close where I live.
> 
> Inviato dal mio Mi 9T utilizzando Tapatalk


2-different battery types, if that's a consideration.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## this_is_nascar

dydx said:


> Yep my H6000c Mk IV with XHP50.2 drops down in about 2 seconds in below freezing weather.


I don't keep any of my ZLs in the outdoors. My SC64w Hi EDC stays on my person, so I may never run into this situation, but it sucks that the condition is present.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## NPL

I wonder if the cold weather issue would persist if a cold specific battery was used. There are some lithium ion 18650 with less capacity designed for colder weather use. 

Sent from my Pixel using Candlepowerforums mobile app


----------



## Fespe

this_is_nascar said:


> 2-different battery types, if that's a consideration.
> 
> 
> Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


No I don't mind the different battery. I would have loved an hi version but right now in europe I can't find any. Now Nkon have this models available and I was thinking of getting one. 


Inviato dal mio Mi 9T utilizzando Tapatalk


----------



## Derek Dean

Fespe said:


> I can't decide between the sc700d or the SC600w Mark IV Plus. Some people say the sc700d is too floody! At the point that the spill it's annoying because it's too bright.
> I would use the light for an "all purpose light" so outdoor and indoor. Working around the house and walking the dog in the woods close where I live.
> 
> Inviato dal mio Mi 9T utilizzando Tapatalk


Fespe, I have both lights, and I use them both, frequently. I use the SC600 mk IV+ at work, because it's smaller, lighter, and fits easily in my front left pocket, which makes for quick one handed retrieval and use. The beam is reasonably floody, but there is a strong yellow color to the corona around the central spot, so I've added some diffusion material to the front glass, which helps even that out and gives me a nice even flood. 

I use the SC700d as my around-the-house light. It's a bodaciously good light. It goes both dimmer AND brighter than the SC600 IV+, AND it's got a high CRI LED, which is very important to a picky flashaholic like me. I also like that it's larger battery gives me more runtime, and the slightly larger size gives it a heft that feels very nice in the hand. I will say this, though, that extra heft might start to feel "heavy" after holding the light for an extended period of time, say an hour or so. For my uses, it's typically just quick uses here and there around the house, and for having on the nightstand by my bed at night (the lowest level is perfect for navigating to the bathroom late at night). I've tried using the SC700d as an EDC, but it's to large for my front pants pocket, however, it does work fine in a coat pocket.

Comparing the beams, I'd day they are similar, with the SC700d having a slightly more defined central spot, but honestly, they are similar enough that I wouldn't use that as a criteria for choosing one over the other, but rather base it on size, battery life, etc, with the SC600 IV+ being smaller and lighter, and therfore more EDC friendly, and the SC700d having more runtime, a lower low and higher high, and having the high CRI LED.


----------



## WebHobbit

Well said Derek Dean. I also have both and concur on all points. I also have the SC600w MKIV HI version. I prefer to carry the HI on workdays as I find the more intense hot-spot and slightly less flood/spill gives me a SLIGHT edge in my job as an auditor/inspector. The SC600w MK IV+ I prefer for general non workday EDC. And the 700d is my go to around the house and farm...when I don't need a long range light.

I would also add if someone would make a really nice Kydex belt holster for the 700d I'd probably try carrying it....but not in the pocket like my 600s


----------



## raphaello

Hey guys! 
I’m about to purchase a Zebralight SC700d but can’t decide on a battery for it. I was recommended a Keeppower 21700 (protected) 5000 mAh - 10A. Has anyone used this in their SC700d? Is there a better choice for it and if yes - which one and why? 
Thanks in advance!


----------



## WebHobbit

ZLs don't work with protected cells. They require a flat top unprotected batt. I use the Samsung 50E in mine. These are like $6.50 at BatteryJunction


----------



## Fespe

Thank you Derek Dean and WebHobbit! Yes I would definitely like the high CRI but I would have preferred a little warmer around 4000k.
That said I think I'm going to try the sc700d just because is new (and longer battery life) and worst case scenario I will keep it as an house light. I'm going to wait a couple of days to be sure! Thank again for the tip, really helpful!! 

Inviato dal mio Mi 9T utilizzando Tapatalk


----------



## WalkIntoTheLight

NPL said:


> I wonder if the cold weather issue would persist if a cold specific battery was used. There are some lithium ion 18650 with less capacity designed for colder weather use.



I've tested it with all kinds of batteries, from low drain to high drain. The battery doesn't seem to make any difference. It's the driver, it doesn't like the cold on H1. Note, the problem doesn't happen all the time, and once the light is warmed up (just takes a couple of seconds on H2), it goes away completely. So, while it's an annoying problem, it's not a game-stopper.

Since Zebralight has stopped shipping to anywhere other than the US, it's probably going to only affect Alaskan people. :ironic:


----------



## Rhodie

I read in another forum that the tint is greenish in color? It's advertised as NW with a CRI 90+ rating? Any truth to the Greenish in color comment? Thanks.


----------



## WebHobbit

It DOES have a slightly greenish corona but I generally only notice it on a very white surface...or when directly comparing it to other lights. It's a problem with a LOT of modern CREE LEDs


----------



## Derek Dean

Rhodie said:


> I read in another forum that the tint is greenish in color? It's advertised as NW with a CRI 90+ rating? Any truth to the Greenish in color comment? Thanks.


EVERY single LED based light I've gotten that has been listed as "neutral", with a color balance of 4500k to 5000k, has had a greenish tint, and that goes for all brands of lights. Maybe I'm just more sensitive to it, but I've solved the problem by simply adding a magenta filter to every new light I get.


----------



## Rhodie

Derek Dean said:


> EVERY single LED based light I've gotten that has been listed as "neutral", with a color balance of 4500k to 5000k, has had a greenish tint, and that goes for all brands of lights. Maybe I'm just more sensitive to it, but I've solved the problem by simply adding a magenta filter to every new light I get.



Then maybe the Nitchia Led's are an outlier whereas the Acebeam RK18 is pure white to my eyes, great for inspecting underneath a tractor seeing if the leak you might observe is either motor oil or coolant. Not slamming ZebraLight. I may pick up the SC700d, just trying to get a feel for the tint before I plunk down $120.


Thanks for your replies...


----------



## Fespe

Derek Dean said:


> EVERY single LED based light I've gotten that has been listed as "neutral", with a color balance of 4500k to 5000k, has had a greenish tint, and that goes for all brands of lights. Maybe I'm just more sensitive to it, but I've solved the problem by simply adding a magenta filter to every new light I get.


Can I ask you what kind of specific filter do you use? By the way I order the sc700d. If I hadn't hurry I wouldn't be able to get it! It's already sold out on Nkon.

Inviato dal mio Mi 9T utilizzando Tapatalk


----------



## burntoshine

WalkIntoTheLight said:


> Yup. I've brought up this problem, before. In my case, it affects all my zebras using the XHP35 HI emitter. It turns off from H1, in cold weather. That's what you get when you try to use a light in cold weather, that was designed and tested in Texas summer. Lots of others have complained about this problem, too. They clearly have a driver design problem with some of their models.



So, my pal was just experiencing this cold weather problem with his H600W (mkii, i think) using a AW 18650. The light gave 3 flashes with the four-click capacity test. He said it was 12 degrees outside and it would immediately step down from high to low. Later the light worked at full power with the same battery when it was at a warmer temperature.

Can anyone recommend a 18650 that works best in ZLs; for cold weather, but in general, too? I bought a couple ones based on a recommendation on CPF a few years ago, but am unsure as to what it was I bought; possibly a sony - they're green with a white label that reads "18650 3000mah 3.7V".

Thanks bunches in advance!

cheers


----------



## likethevegetable

I have the issue of H1 "tripping" to a low level with about 3.7 V left in my H600Fc IV. No issues observed with my SC64w HI, even at -30C.

For 18650, can't go wrong with NCR18650GA (3500 mAh). For cold weather, I suspect Sony VTC6 would be what you mention.


----------



## dydx

likethevegetable said:


> I have the issue of H1 "tripping" to a low level with about 3.7 V left in my H600Fc IV. No issues observed with my SC64w HI, even at -30C.
> 
> For 18650, can't go wrong with NCR18650GA (3500 mAh). For cold weather, I suspect Sony VTC6 would be what you mention.



Good luck....I've NCR18650GA, fully charged, in my H6000c Mk IV, minus 5°F this morning.....instant step down. Doubt the battery hypothesis.


----------



## Connor

-20°C is *well* out of the "comfort zone" of a NCR18650GA, though .. as soon as this battery goes below 0°C (actual cell temperature) it gets pretty weak.


----------



## Derek Dean

Fespe said:


> Can I ask you what kind of specific filter do you use? By the way I order the sc700d. If I hadn't hurry I wouldn't be able to get it! It's already sold out on Nkon.
> 
> Inviato dal mio Mi 9T utilizzando Tapatalk


I started off by getting a Lee Filter Swatch book (the Designer edition), with is a neat little deal that has about 200 or so different color swatches of gel material, with each one measuring about 1.25" x 3.25", so big enough to cut out 2 or 3 circles and place over the front glass of the light. These are also made by Roscolux and Cinegel. Here is an example, but look around, as you can often find them for less:

https://www.cinemagadgets.com/leeswatchbook.html

These are neat because you can play with the different amounts of filtration, so just a little, or a bit more color correction, plus many of them also have swatches of diffusion material that is good for softening the light, so making a light floodier. 

If you can remove the bezel, you just cut to size, place under the glass, and put the bezel back on. If the bezel doesn't come off, simply cut to size and attach with a tiny piece of double sided tape in the middle. 

Personally, I've found that almost all my lights look better with either a minus 1/4 green or minus 1/2 green filter (which are magenta filters), so ended up purchasing a 21" x 24" square and just cut out what I need because remember, you'll only get 2 or 3 circles from each swatch in the swatch book, and most of the colors you won't be using. By the way, you can stack filters, so stacking two -1/4 green filters is equal to one -1/2 green filter. And do remember, adding any filter will decrease light output, but with most of today's high powered lights that is rarely a problem. 

https://www.cinemagadgets.com/31-lee-s249.html

https://www.cinemagadgets.com/31-lee-s248.htm

One other thing. Lee has a new filter material specifically made for LEDs. I believe it's the Zircon series, and I think it's more heat resistant (but also a bit more expensive). I've never tried it, but I've never had any problems with the regular filter material on my 2300 lumen lights, but if interested, you can read all about it on the Lee Filter website:

https://www.leefilters.com/lighting/zircon.html


----------



## Fespe

Derek Dean said:


> I started off by getting a Lee Filter Swatch book (the Designer edition), with is a neat little deal that has about 200 or so different color swatches of gel material, with each one measuring about 1.25" x 3.25", so big enough to cut out 2 or 3 circles and place over the front glass of the light. These are also made by Roscolux and Cinegel. Here is an example, but look around, as you can often find them for less:
> 
> https://www.cinemagadgets.com/leeswatchbook.html
> 
> These are neat because you can play with the different amounts of filtration, so just a little, or a bit more color correction, plus many of them also have swatches of diffusion material that is good for softening the light, so making a light floodier.
> 
> If you can remove the bezel, you just cut to size, place under the glass, and put the bezel back on. If the bezel doesn't come off, simply cut to size and attach with a tiny piece of double sided tape in the middle.
> 
> Personally, I've found that almost all my lights look better with either a minus 1/4 green or minus 1/2 green filter (which are magenta filters), so ended up purchasing a 21" x 24" square and just cut out what I need because remember, you'll only get 2 or 3 circles from each swatch in the swatch book, and most of the colors you won't be using. By the way, you can stack filters, so stacking two -1/4 green filters is equal to one -1/2 green filter. And do remember, adding any filter will decrease light output, but with most of today's high powered lights that is rarely a problem.
> 
> https://www.cinemagadgets.com/31-lee-s249.html
> 
> https://www.cinemagadgets.com/31-lee-s248.htm
> 
> One other thing. Lee has a new filter material specifically made for LEDs. I believe it's the Zircon series, and I think it's more heat resistant (but also a bit more expensive). I've never tried it, but I've never had any problems with the regular filter material on my 2300 lumen lights, but if interested, you can read all about it on the Lee Filter website:
> 
> https://www.leefilters.com/lighting/zircon.html


Thank you! For sure I'm going to try some of this filters after I play a little bit wit the flashlight! 

Inviato dal mio Mi 9T utilizzando Tapatalk


----------



## SubLGT

Derek Dean said:


> Lee has a new filter material specifically made for LEDs. I believe it's the Zircon series, and I think it's more heat resistant (but also a bit more expensive). I've never tried it, but I've never had any problems with the regular filter material on my 2300 lumen lights, but if interested, you can read all about it on the Lee Filter website:



Here is an interesting little filter durability test:
https://budgetlightforum.com/node/75045



> ....After putting an eight minus green filter on a H600Fc IV I saw it losing its effect quite rapidly, like after one or two runtimes. This prompted me to switch to Zircon filters as they are supposed to be more durable.
> 
> Since then I got a spectrophotometer so I decided to test their durability....


----------



## Derek Dean

SubLGT said:


> Here is an interesting little filter durability test:
> https://budgetlightforum.com/node/75045


Thanks for that link, SubLGT. I've haven't noticed any issues with my filters, but I typically only use my lights for short bursts and doubt any of them have seen anywhere near that kind of runtime.


----------



## AMD64Blondie

Have a H600d on the way from Amazon.com.


----------



## AstroTurf

I recently received one...

A very good light.


----------



## mcantu

What happened to Zebralight? Their site no longer exists


----------



## Yates

mcantu said:


> What happened to Zebralight? Their site no longer exists


You need to visit the non secure site http://zebralight.com/

For some reason, using _https_, redirects to 3dcartstores


----------



## Derek Dean

mcantu said:


> What happened to Zebralight? Their site no longer exists


They may have taken it off-line for some type of maintenance, but whatever the case, they are certainly there now:
http://zebralight.com/


----------



## WebHobbit

But they SERIOUSLY need to update their SSL certs. Non secure eCommerce is NOT a good look in 2021


----------



## Fespe

Today I received the sc700d and playing a little bit with it I notice the greenish corona quite a bit (of course I'm not complaining I know what I was buying). Probably the snow didn't help either! I would like to try the zircon lee filter just to see if the result it's something acceptable and practicle to do if needed, like if I'm going to use the light indoor a lot, but I'm not sure what is the right one for this tint. For what I understood serching the zircon 803 or 802 are the ones to get? Am I right? And just to know does anyone tried putting dc-fix on it? Otherwise I'm really liking the sc700d! It's REALLY bright! And the stable output on higher level it's amazing. 

Inviato dal mio Mi 9T utilizzando Tapatalk


----------



## Derek Dean

Fespe, remember, you can stack the filters. I have the equivalent of an 801 on my 700d, and that's perfect for my taste, but you might want to simply get an 802, and if you need more, just put two of them on. I don't think an 803 is even worth the effort, as it's just not nearly enough.

As far as dc-fix, sure, that will help even out the beam so the corona is not so apparent. I don't use it on my 700d, but I do use it on my 600w mkIV, along with a minus 1/2 green, and it' superb.


----------



## NPL

Lee filter will improve the green tint, but you will still have the tint and CCT variation from spot to spill unless you diffuse the beam with something like DC fix. It's an unfortunate compromise between beam throw or floody and even beam tint. I have the sc700fd and put a Lee Zircon filter on it. Perfect pure white, no more green, and smooth consistent beam, but very floody and good for indoors or up close use. 

Sent from my Pixel using Candlepowerforums mobile app


----------



## Fespe

Thanks! I'm going for the 801! About the dc-fix, it's ages than I see people talk about it but I never tried it. The sc700d it's already floody, compared my Sc64c le it's a thrower and the tint it's beautiful. 
I would use the dc-fix only if improved the tint considerably. Otherwise I'm good with a little bit of tint shift. 

Inviato dal mio Mi 9T utilizzando Tapatalk


----------



## NPL

I think 801 will be way too much. I usually use 804 or 803.

Sent from my Pixel using Candlepowerforums mobile app


----------



## Fespe

Yes serching a little bit more maby the 801 is too much. I'm ordering the 802

Inviato dal mio Mi 9T utilizzando Tapatalk


----------



## NPL

For reference, the 802 which has a 75% light transmission will turn the nasty XP-L2 high cri into a rosy tint.
The 801 has a 60% light transmission.

The sc700d is less Green than the XP-L2 of the Sc64c and sc5c.

The 803 has a much better 80% light transmission, and will probably be perfect to correct the tint. Or go with 804 if you want better light transmission.

Sent from my Pixel using Candlepowerforums mobile app


----------



## Derek Dean

Fespe said:


> Yes serching a little bit more maby the 801 is too much. I'm ordering the 802
> 
> Inviato dal mio Mi 9T utilizzando Tapatalk


I do have to say, I'm VERY sensitive to any green in the tint, so I tend to over compensate with filters, giving me a bit of a rose tint, but that's me, so either an 803 or 802 might be better for you. But do remember, every LED is slightly different, some will be more green and some will be less green. The only constant I've seen is that they ALL seem to be at least a little green. 

That's one of the reasons I suggested you start with the Lee filter swatch book, as it gives you ALL the different levels of correction so that you can find exactly the one that works best for your light.


----------



## Fespe

Derek Dean said:


> I do have to say, I'm VERY sensitive to any green in the tint, so I tend to over compensate with filters, giving me a bit of a rose tint, but that's me, so either an 803 or 802 might be better for you. But do remember, every LED is slightly different, some will be more green and some will be less green. The only constant I've seen is that they ALL seem to be at least a little green.
> 
> That's one of the reasons I suggested you start with the Lee filter swatch book, as it gives you ALL the different levels of correction so that you can find exactly the one that works best for your light.


You are right, mine is pretty green for my eyes. I wanted to get the swatch but I can't find one and they're expensive. 

Inviato dal mio Mi 9T utilizzando Tapatalk


----------



## Derek Dean

Fespe said:


> You are right, mine is pretty green for my eyes. I wanted to get the swatch but I can't find one and they're expensive.
> 
> Inviato dal mio Mi 9T utilizzando Tapatalk


Yes, I understand. Remember, Roscolux has a swtach book that is basically the same thing as the Lee Filters, and you might be able to find those more easily and at less cost. By the way, something else that works, but is kind of weird..... you can take a pink highlighter pen and color the front of the glass, seriously. I comes off very easily, but if you like how it looks, you can just put clear tape over it to keep it from smudging. Like I said, kind of weird, and definitely not as good as a filter, but it works in a pinch : ) 

Anyway, I hope you're enjoying your new light. One of the things I dig about the SC700d is the way the body feels like it's been sculpted, like a piece of art, just amazing quality that feels nice to hold. Definitely one of my favorite lights.


----------



## Fespe

Derek Dean said:


> Yes, I understand. Remember, Roscolux has a swtach book that is basically the same thing as the Lee Filters, and you might be able to find those more easily and at less cost. By the way, something else that works, but is kind of weird..... you can take a pink highlighter pen and color the front of the glass, seriously. I comes off very easily, but if you like how it looks, you can just put clear tape over it to keep it from smudging. Like I said, kind of weird, and definitely not as good as a filter, but it works in a pinch : )
> 
> Anyway, I hope you're enjoying your new light. One of the things I dig about the SC700d is the way the body feels like it's been sculpted, like a piece of art, just amazing quality that feels nice to hold. Definitely one of my favorite lights.


I just bought the 803 too. I'm gonna tried them both and see the result. 
I'm too trying different things just for fun, I tried putting a pink rubber glove on the head of the light but it's to rosy. Otherwise I am really satisfied with the sc700d, like I just said the runtime it's awesome even at higher output. I'm not one who test lumen and runtimes but compered to my other 18650 lights it's definitely something else. It's a flooder light so if you like that you would not be disappointed! The weight it's not a problem for me but I'm not walking for hours with it. For real the only cons that I can find is the green tint!

Inviato dal mio Mi 9T utilizzando Tapatalk


----------



## BigusLightus

Is anyone else having trouble with the ZebraLight web site?


----------



## SubLGT

Derek Dean said:


> Yes, I understand. Remember, Roscolux has a swtach book that is basically the same thing as the Lee Filters, and you might be able to find those more easily and at less cost.....



https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/prod...0103_Roscolux_Swatchbook.html/qa?sts=pi&pim=Y

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/45184-REG/Rosco_950SBCNG0103_Cinegel_Swatchbook.html

Both of these Rosco swatchbooks are on backorder. I think they have over 200 filters in each book. Not dirt cheap, but $10 per book seems reasonable.


----------



## SubLGT

WebHobbit said:


> But they SERIOUSLY need to update their SSL certs. Non secure eCommerce is NOT a good look in 2021



I agree 100%.


----------



## markr6

Everyone that says "the green/yellow tint is not noticeable is real life" lets me down in the winter, when most things are a white wall (floor). I still like my SC700d though.


----------



## holygeez03

Yeah... snow cover is rough for crappy tints. It's also when I notice the purple ring on my SC600w Plus... as mentioned in another post, ZL did remove that coating, so my newer SC600w doesn't have it.


----------



## Luminesce

BigusLightus said:


> Is anyone else having trouble with the ZebraLight web site?



I placed an order on the ZL web site on the 17th and they shipped yesterday. Other than the insecure transaction, it seems to be working OK. I didn't buy another SC700 this time and perhaps that is the reason for the quick turn around, as some have found it can take quite a while to get your order filled at times.


----------



## likethevegetable

markr6 said:


> Everyone that says "the green/yellow tint is not noticeable is real life" lets me down in the winter, when most things are a white wall (floor). I still like my SC700d though.



Why I like to use my SC64w HI in winter, H600Fc (yellowish) in summer


----------



## recDNA

I wish I could find one of their 18650 at another dealer. Seems like nobody carries them any more.

Sent from my SM-N960U1 using Tapatalk


----------



## id30209

My OCD won’t let me be at peace sooooo i’ve modded all my ZL’s to 90CRI standard.

SC5c II - shaved 351D 5000K to match ~4500K and rosy like 219B 
SC64w HI - 90CRI XHP35 4500K
SC600w HI - 90CRI XHP35 5000K
SC64 - 90CRI XHP35 5700K
SC64c LE - 90CRI 219C 5700K



















Sent from Tapatalk


----------



## AstroTurf

now, this right here is a great idea that ZL could do...



id30209 said:


> My OCD won’t let me be at peace sooooo i’ve modded all my ZL’s to 90CRI standard.
> 
> SC5c II - shaved 351D 5000K to match ~4500K and rosy like 219B
> SC64w HI - 90CRI XHP35 4500K
> SC600w HI - 90CRI XHP35 5000K
> SC64 - 90CRI XHP35 5700K
> SC64c LE - 90CRI 219C 5700K
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from Tapatalk


----------



## id30209

AstroTurf said:


> now, this right here is a great idea that ZL could do...



I doubt they’ll do it but you never know.
XHP35 gen1 is now discontinued and maybe that’s the reason they don’t have any new model recently. XHP35.2 is still hard to reach.
These emitters i have were taken from other flashlights, mostly Olights  


Sent from Tapatalk


----------



## Luminesce

id30209 said:


> My OCD won’t let me be at peace sooooo i’ve modded all my ZL’s to 90CRI standard.
> 
> SC5c II - shaved 351D 5000K to match ~4500K and rosy like 219B
> SC64w HI - 90CRI XHP35 4500K
> SC600w HI - 90CRI XHP35 5000K
> SC64 - 90CRI XHP35 5700K
> SC64c LE - 90CRI 219C 5700K
> Sent from Tapatalk



Were you able to remove the bezels easily, w/ damaging the lens or bezel? What kind of tools did you use?

------------------------------
Still looking to buy SC50's or 51's in good condition, neutral tint. PM me if you have one or more for sale. - Luminesce


----------



## NPL

Impressive mods and great emitter choices? I would love it if my sc600w hi had a 90 cri emitter. 

Sent from my Pixel using Candlepowerforums mobile app


----------



## this_is_nascar

id30209 said:


> I doubt they’ll do it but you never know.
> XHP35 gen1 is now discontinued and maybe that’s the reason they don’t have any new model recently. XHP35.2 is still hard to reach.
> These emitters i have were taken from other flashlights, mostly Olights
> 
> 
> Sent from Tapatalk


Taking an emitter from an Olight to put into any other light is the funniest thing I've read all week.

I find it interesting because the #1 complaint about Olight has always been concerning their chosen emitters.

Glad you found success in using them.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## id30209

this_is_nascar said:


> Taking an emitter from an Olight to put into any other light is the funniest thing I've read all week.
> 
> I find it interesting because the #1 complaint about Olight has always been concerning their chosen emitters.
> 
> Glad you found success in using them.
> 
> 
> Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk



So sorry for missunderstanding folks...
These 90CRI emitters were taken from previously modded Olights (M2R and M2RP).
Olight stock emitters were flushed down the toilet. 
After having side by side O’s and ZL, wow and edc factor goes straight to ZL. That’s why Olight was stripped from these emitters and they are running ZL’s stock LED’s. [emoji23]


Sent from Tapatalk


----------



## id30209

Luminesce said:


> Were you able to remove the bezels easily, w/ damaging the lens or bezel? What kind of tools did you use?
> 
> ------------------------------
> Still looking to buy SC50's or 51's in good condition, neutral tint. PM me if you have one or more for sale. - Luminesce



I cracked one lens but a friend of mine has a watch shop so he got me one saphire replacement lens.
On SC64w HI and SC64 there are some tiny marks on the bezel ring cause i was opening them twice (!!!!i couldn’t decide which emitter goes where!!!).
Other than that no issues or other damages.


Sent from Tapatalk


----------



## AstroTurf

Again I say...

an emitter update would be an easy update to the current ZL lineup.

ZL are you listening?!?


----------



## this_is_nascar

id30209 said:


> So sorry for missunderstanding folks...
> These 90CRI emitters were taken from previously modded Olights (M2R and M2RP).
> Olight stock emitters were flushed down the toilet.
> After having side by side O’s and ZL, wow and edc factor goes straight to ZL. That’s why Olight was stripped from these emitters and they are running ZL’s stock LED’s. [emoji23]
> 
> 
> Sent from Tapatalk


Awesome...

Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## this_is_nascar

Edited......


----------



## quahog

Follow-up question: which ones are you keeping and are your favorite? SC64w HI for EDC I assume.


----------



## id30209

I need one more LE in my life...


Sent from Tapatalk


----------



## this_is_nascar

quahog said:


> Follow-up question: which ones are you keeping and are your favorite? SC64w HI for EDC I assume.


Yes, this and a spare. Sorry, not been able to engage because of work. I guess I should have waited before saying anything, but its unexpected.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## hatman

Is Zebralight's site encrypted and secure or not?
On 4/22/21, Zebralight's site showed that two flashlights I had been waiting for were back in stock -- the SC64w HI and the SC600w IV Plus. 
But when I went to check out, my softwear showed that the site was not secure and that a third-party could capture my information.
The site read "http" instead of the customary "https" to indicate that it was encrypted.
I wrote ZL customer service and asked why the site wasn't secure and when would it be safe to check out.
I received no immediate response, not that I expected one that quickly.
Later that evening, I checked again and this time the site showed "https," indicating that it was now encrypted and secure.
I placed my order, paying with PP so I wouldn't risk using a credit card.
Still later that evening, I checked a third time and now the site was back to showing "http," indicating that it was once again not secure.
I'm not sure what's going on and I pass this on for your information.


----------



## amanichen

hatman said:


> Is Zebralight's site encrypted and secure or not?
> On 4/22/21,...


 For me, when I go to my account page or the checkout page it shows a secure connection. However, when I look at the product listings it shows an insecure page.


----------



## hatman

amanichen said:


> For me, when I go to my account page or the checkout page it shows a secure connection. However, when I look at the product listings it shows an insecure page.



For me, it showed not secure the first half-dozen or so times I tried to check out and pay. So I backed up and refused to finish until later that day when the "https" returned.

I checked again today (4/23/21) in checkout mode and the "https" is gone and I'm once again getting a warning that the site is not secure.

Zebralight has now responded in a message that says, "We'll take a look at this."


----------



## quahog

Seems like the "Proceed to Checkout" link doesn't always go correctly to the secure checkout page.
Maybe try going directly to it: https://zebralight.3dcartstores.com/checkout_one.asp

I ordered a SC64w HI today without issue. Better grab one before they go out of stock again.


----------



## Romanko

quahog said:


> Seems like the "Proceed to Checkout" link doesn't always go correctly to the secure checkout page.
> I ordered a SC64w HI today without issue. Better grab one before they go out of stock again.


Let us know when you get it please. Because it is possible that xhp35.2 will be installed. I saw on reddit one post about h600 with xhp35.2.


----------



## quahog

Oh, interesting, I guess I'll find out. As long as it's a HI and not a HD it should be ok?


----------



## hatman

ZL lists the SC600w IV HI as discontinued and unavailable.
Is it available anywhere?
What do you recommend as an alternative?
How different is the SC600w III HI?


----------



## NPL

Romanko said:


> Let us know when you get it please. Because it is possible that xhp35.2 will be installed. I saw on reddit one post about h600 with xhp35.2.


Link?

Sent from my Pixel using Candlepowerforums mobile app


----------



## quahog

https://www.reddit.com/r/flashlight/comments/mnqamh/i_ordered_a_h600w_mk_iv_and_it_doesnt_look_like/


----------



## NPL

Thanks. Looks like an XHP35.2 HD. Still waiting to see them use the Xhp35.2 Hi in a new light... 

Sent from my Pixel using Candlepowerforums mobile app


----------



## quahog

Romanko said:


> Let us know when you get it please. Because it is possible that xhp35.2 will be installed. I saw on reddit one post about h600 with xhp35.2.



New SC64w HI arrived and it's a XHP35 HI for sure (not a XHP35.2 HI).


----------



## id30209

quahog said:


> New SC64w HI arrived and it's a XHP35 HI for sure (not a XHP35.2 HI).



What CRI index?


Sent from Tapatalk


----------



## DayofReckoning

Any of you guys with the SC600W IV Plus with XHP50.2 care to check on something for me? I noticed today, while looking into the light on the lowest moonlight mode, that 1 of the 4 dies of the XHP50.2 is slightly brighter than the other 3. 

Also, when enabling the dim, slow beacon mode, if I quickly look at the LED die before the blinking starts, I can see that 1 die glows for a brief moment whereas the other 3 die go dim instantly. Strange.

Anyone else's display this behavior? Other than this, the light works and outputs flawlessly.


----------



## quahog

DayofReckoning said:


> Any of you guys with the SC600W IV Plus with XHP50.2 care to check on something for me? I noticed today, while looking into the light on the lowest moonlight mode, that 1 of the 4 dies of the XHP50.2 is slightly brighter than the other 3.
> 
> Also, when enabling the dim, slow beacon mode, if I quickly look at the LED die before the blinking starts, I can see that 1 die glows for a brief moment whereas the other 3 die go dim instantly. Strange.
> 
> Anyone else's display this behavior? Other than this, the light works and outputs flawlessly.



I also have a SC600w Plus and all 4 quadrants of the LED illuminate at the same level. Also no strangeness with the slow beacon.


----------



## this_is_nascar

No issues with mine either.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## this_is_nascar

SC600 IV Hi vs Plus, only wanting to keep one, already own SC64w HI. Which to keep and why? I could have sworn I asked this in the past, but couldn't find it.



Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## NPL

If you are keeping the Sc64 hi, then the plus makes more sense to keep.

Sent from my Pixel using Candlepowerforums mobile app


----------



## AstroTurf

the tint lottery is real...

pick the one you like best.



this_is_nascar said:


> SC600 IV Hi vs Plus, only wanting to keep one, already own SC64w HI. Which to keep and why? I could have sworn I asked this in the past, but couldn't find it.
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## holygeez03

In my opinion, the SC600w IV Plus and the SC64w HI make the most sense... I would keep and use those two. 

SC600 is for counter-top, nightstand, bag... SC64 is for pocket.


----------



## this_is_nascar

holygeez03 said:


> In my opinion, the SC600w IV Plus and the SC64w HI make the most sense... I would keep and use those two.
> 
> SC600 is for counter-top, nightstand, bag... SC64 is for pocket.


That's somewhat the way I've been leaning. I've been carrying the 64 high since I got it and my 600s just kind of sit there. And comparing them both, I would probably lean towards keeping the Plus for the wall of light versus the more pinpoint being of the 600.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## SYZYGY

*Re: The Official Zebralight Thread*



holygeez03 said:


> In my opinion, the SC600w IV Plus and the SC64w HI make the most sense... I would keep and use those two.
> 
> SC600 is for counter-top, nightstand, bag... SC64 is for pocket.



i feel the same way except sc700d instead of sc600w iv plus


----------



## Outdoorsman5

this_is_nascar said:


> That's somewhat the way I've been leaning. I've been carrying the 64 high since I got it and my 600s just kind of sit there. And comparing them both, I would probably lean towards keeping the Plus for the wall of light versus the more pinpoint being of the 600.



Hey nascar, I'll buy your SC600w HI Mk IV if you still have it. Shoot me a PM if interested. Thanks!


----------



## AMD64Blondie

Wow...demoting the SC600w to non-pocket status?

Having bigger pockets is always a real help.

(I EDC a SC700d with my Draggin jeans in my front left pocket, and it fits fairly comfortably..)

I'll agree the SC64 is easier to pocket carry, though.

Love the wall of light effect from the SC700d.


----------



## this_is_nascar

AMD64Blondie said:


> Wow...demoting the SC600w to non-pocket status?
> 
> Having bigger pockets is always a real help.
> 
> (I EDC a SC700d with my Draggin jeans in my front left pocket, and it fits fairly comfortably..)
> 
> I'll agree the SC64 is easier to pocket carry, though.
> 
> Love the wall of light effect from the SC700d.


The SC600 was never an EDC for me. It's been the SC64w Hi.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## Celery

I’ll take that SC64c LE, nascar!


----------



## archimedes

A brief reminder that sales transactions happen in the MarketPlace subforums please (and/or by PM) ... not in the discussion side, thanks


----------



## this_is_nascar

archimedes said:


> A brief reminder that sales transactions happen in the MarketPlace subforums please (and/or by PM) ... not in the discussion side, thanks



My bad. Sorry about that.


----------



## this_is_nascar

Anyone here using an SC53w or SC53c on a regular basis or for EDC?


----------



## AstroTurf

i do on weekends...

watch pocket perfect!!!



this_is_nascar said:


> Anyone here using an SC53w or SC53c on a regular basis or for EDC?


----------



## Fireclaw18

I wonder how much longer Zebralight will be around as a company.

It looks like it has been a few years since they released any new models. This suggests a lack of money to afford to develop new models. 

I can't imagine a flashlight company can continue too long that no longer produces anything new.


----------



## Burgess

Agreed !


I *still* hope to see the Q50 model.

:mecry:
_


----------



## AstroTurf

here we go again...

if i only had a penny for everytime this type of post occurred.

i'd be able to buy the entire ZL line.



Fireclaw18 said:


> I wonder how much longer Zebralight will be around as a company.
> 
> It looks like it has been a few years since they released any new models. This suggests a lack of money to afford to develop new models.
> 
> I can't imagine a flashlight company can continue too long that no longer produces anything new.


----------



## this_is_nascar

At this point in time, I personally don't need a new ZL model. The few that I have are just fine with me. I've been carrying my SC64w Hi since getting it. My needs really don't require anything else, 99% of the time.

I'd love to see them advance, but I'm not losing any sleep thinking about it.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## PoliceScannerMan

I dropped my SC64LE last nite onto concrete from about 4.5ft, the light was on. To my surprise it survived like a champ.


----------



## AstroTurf

PoliceScannerMan said:


> I dropped my SC64LE last nite onto concrete from about 4.5ft, the light was on. To my surprise it survived like a champ.



How bout the concrete?!?

LOLz


----------



## PoliceScannerMan

AstroTurf said:


> How bout the concrete?!?
> 
> LOLz



Haha, I thought the light was a goner. Really surprised me, hard lick.


----------



## SYZYGY

PoliceScannerMan said:


> I dropped my SC64LE last nite onto concrete from about 4.5ft, the light was on. To my surprise it survived like a champ.



drops like those are usually fine. however, if you drop it on the tailcap or emitter, you can dent the battery cathode due to it slamming against the light's pogo pins. once that thing gets dented in, sometimes it doesn't make good contact with the pogo pins anymore. on high modes, the output will drop after a second or so. if that's the case, try changing the battery orientation. rotate it slightly. otherwise a new battery fixes that ofc.


----------



## Bob_McBob

SYZYGY said:


> drops like those are usually fine. however, if you drop it on the tailcap or emitter, you can dent the battery cathode due to it slamming against the light's pogo pins. once that thing gets dented in, sometimes it doesn't make good contact with the pogo pins anymore. on high modes, the output will drop after a second or so. if that's the case, try changing the battery orientation. rotate it slightly. otherwise a new battery fixes that ofc.



Coincidentally they just got rid of the pogo pins in the SC64c LE and SC64w HI. There has been a lot of debate on Reddit about whether this is an improvement.


----------



## PoliceScannerMan

Probably cheaper for them to make, but idk.


----------



## id30209

Also, that shelf doesn’t look solid anymore. Or is it just me?


Sent from Tapatalk


----------



## SYZYGY

Bob_McBob said:


> Coincidentally they just got rid of the pogo pins in the SC64c LE and SC64w HI. There has been a lot of debate on Reddit about whether this is an improvement.



actually no, that is where you put the sim card. 

wow. thanks for the pic.

i just bought and gave away three sc64w hi lights and didn't even notice. i wish i knew that a couple of days ago. would have checked it out for fun.


----------



## this_is_nascar

PoliceScannerMan said:


> I dropped my SC64LE last nite onto concrete from about 4.5ft, the light was on. To my surprise it survived like a champ.


Why a surprise? I'd be extremely disappointed if it faulted.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## this_is_nascar

Bob_McBob said:


> Coincidentally they just got rid of the pogo pins in the SC64c LE and SC64w HI. There has been a lot of debate on Reddit about whether this is an improvement.


I don't know why they just don't make the light 1/2" longer to accommodate springs and better contacts.

How nice it would be to not be locked into only certain 18650 cells.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## WebHobbit

My ZL 600 series lights were my EDC for years....until I discovered the Emisar D4v2 and Anduril's ramping UI. The ZLs are better in several different ways (better regulation and efficiency...maybe a tiny bit better build quality)....but the ZL UI is just absolute poop compared to the utter simplicity of Anduril (click once to turn on.....hold to ramp up stop quickly and hold again to reverse direction...click once to turn off). Yes of course Anduril has a whole slew of advanced stuff it can do and some of it is downright silly but you NEVER have to touch any of it if you don't want to. And I have NEVER ever accidentally hit the lame disco mode. I have a few times with ZL but not often. If Emisar ever put out a nice D4v2 sized light with a single emitter option and reflector it's Game Over ZL for me anyway. I wish I could get a ZL600 series light with Anduril!


----------



## id30209

And i’m actually impressed by ZL UI. Simplicity is what i like the most. 


Sent from Tapatalk


----------



## WebHobbit

Heh....but what could be simpler than click once and hold for ramping?


----------



## AstroTurf

you mean like the ZL does?!?



WebHobbit said:


> Heh....but what could be simpler than click once and hold for ramping?


----------



## WebHobbit

AstroTurf said:


> you mean like the ZL does?!?






well to be fair it KIND OF does that with a few STEPS. Not a smooth ramp with seemingly hundreds of levels


----------



## AstroTurf

ZL, push and hold...

low, medium, high.

ps, just one of those seemingly hundreds of levels above what you need blows out your night vision.

i'll stick with my primitive ZL.



WebHobbit said:


> well to be fair it KIND OF does that with a few STEPS. Not a smooth ramp with seemingly hundreds of levels


----------



## PoliceScannerMan

I’ve tried to like auduril, I’ll take ZL interface all day long. Don’t like the ramp. At all. I know 3 clicks gets u to steps. Still don’t care for it


----------



## this_is_nascar

WebHobbit said:


> My ZL 600 series lights were my EDC for years....until I discovered the Emisar D4v2 and Anduril's ramping UI. The ZLs are better in several different ways (better regulation and efficiency...maybe a tiny bit better build quality)....but the ZL UI is just absolute poop compared to the utter simplicity of Anduril (click once to turn on.....hold to ramp up stop quickly and hold again to reverse direction...click once to turn off). Yes of course Anduril has a whole slew of advanced stuff it can do and some of it is downright silly but you NEVER have to touch any of it if you don't want to. And I have NEVER ever accidentally hit the lame disco mode. I have a few times with ZL but not often. If Emisar ever put out a nice D4v2 sized light with a single emitter option and reflector it's Game Over ZL for me anyway. I wish I could get a ZL600 series light with Anduril!


You've just made the case on exactly why I prefer the ZL interface. I don't have to hold and ramp, let go, reverse, etc.

Most of what I read about people getting that D4v2 is because they want to do stupid sh*t like starting fires, ghetto flashing different colors and strobes, etc. I've read very few posts about people usi g them to light and object to perform a task, you know, what's flashlights are typically used for.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## this_is_nascar

id30209 said:


> And i’m actually impressed by ZL UI. Simplicity is what i like the most.
> 
> 
> Sent from Tapatalk


+1

Most of those that don't like the interface, never learned how to use it properly.


Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk


----------



## WebHobbit

Agree to disagree guys I have accidentally tripped the disco mode more than a few times with my ZLs.....but NEVER with Anduril. Don't get me wrong though ZL is better than ANY OTHER UI (besides Anduril). What I really wish is for someone to just STOP having disco modes! dumbest thing ever conceived


----------



## SYZYGY

*Re: The Official Zebralight Thread*

i use the strobe in safety situations like when i want to be visible to cars. it is important.

if you accidentally trigger strobe all the time and don't like the feature, consider setting the frequency to something that doesn't annoy you. they have some very slow ones.

as for ramping... i don't find it useful.
doesn't hurt to have as an option, but i prefer ZL UI for everyday use because it forces me to use premeditated, known output levels. i get a lot of runtime, and it's relatively predictable. i have the estimated runtimes more or less memorized for the 6 output levels in my settings bank (group 6).

if you're using ramping, you don't really know the output level, and you may be using more power than you think/need.

ZL firmware is more practical.


----------



## Fireclaw18

*Re: The Official Zebralight Thread*

What I like about my SC64w HI is that it sustains output for quite awhile.

I love my D4v2 and FW3A for their "blow your socks off output" and ability to have very high CRI at very high output. 

However, when I need to actually perform a task that is going to take more than a couple minutes the Zebralight is just better. Peak output isn't nearly as high as those pocket rockets... but those lights get hot fast and ramp down quickly. The Zebralight with its superior unibody construction manages heat much better for extended periods.


----------



## Connor

Bob_McBob said:


> Coincidentally they just got rid of the pogo pins in the SC64c LE and SC64w HI. There has been a lot of debate on Reddit about whether this is an improvement.




Are these just bent copper bands? This does _not_ look like an upgrade/improvement over pogo pins to me. 
It _does_ look a lot cheaper to manufacture, though ...


----------



## Bob_McBob

Connor said:


> Are these just bent copper bands? This does _not_ look like an upgrade/improvement over pogo pins to me.
> It _does_ look a lot cheaper to manufacture, though ...



I think it's a compression connector of this style. It may be cheaper, but I suspect the change was largely due to complaints about the pogo pins damaging cell terminals. I did a bunch of testing, and the only cell I have that doesn't work is a severely dented NCR18650GA, because there's just no way for it to physically make contact. That cell _does_ work with the pogo pins though.


----------



## JimIslander

GIANT fan of Anduril. And I definitely know how to use the heck out of the multiple interfaces of my 22 Zebralights. Would LOVE for ZL to have an option for Anduril. Doubleclick = high (high, or whatever level you already programmed). Press and hold and goes from dim to bright, unless you release and press again to go the opposite way. I love all the different options of Anduril.

No matter how careful I am, I have triggered medium on my ZLs while trying to press and hold long enough for low. Typically this happens when I'm using a light while being active and I blow through low, either because I didn't see that it was on low or I held it for a few milliseconds too long. To prevent this, I generally program single click for low, second click for high. That gives you two options with clicks, unless you click a third time and launch strobe. Or I don't hold it long enough and go straight to high (if not programmed for low).

Anduril solves the biggest issues I have with the ZL interface. I never blow my night vision. I can get to full blast instantly. I can adjust in less in seconds to the exact level I want.


----------



## Bob_McBob

id30209 said:


> Also, that shelf doesn’t look solid anymore. Or is it just me?



Looks the same inside and out, with the usual solid shelf and machined cavity. They just updated the little cell terminal PCB to hold the new style connector.


----------



## Fireclaw18

JimIslander said:


> GIANT fan of Anduril. And I definitely know how to use the heck out of the multiple interfaces of my 22 Zebralights. Would LOVE for ZL to have an option for Anduril. Doubleclick = high (high, or whatever level you already programmed). Press and hold and goes from dim to bright, unless you release and press again to go the opposite way. I love all the different options of Anduril.
> 
> No matter how careful I am, I have triggered medium on my ZLs while trying to press and hold long enough for low. Typically this happens when I'm using a light while being active and I blow through low, either because I didn't see that it was on low or I held it for a few milliseconds too long. To prevent this, I generally program single click for low, second click for high. That gives you two options with clicks, unless you click a third time and launch strobe. Or I don't hold it long enough and go straight to high (if not programmed for low).
> 
> Anduril solves the biggest issues I have with the ZL interface. I never blow my night vision. I can get to full blast instantly. I can adjust in less in seconds to the exact level I want.




The most recent Zebralights allow you to program the different mode groups. It's fairly easy to setup an Olight style UI so that a single-click goes to low, double-click goes to high, and click and hold cycles upwards from low to medium.

This setup solves the problem of accidentally blasting yourself with high when you wanted low.


----------



## likethevegetable

I like to think of the UI as a "coarse" ramp. I program click to low, hold to medium, double to high. I think 6 modes is a nice amount.

The only qualm I have is sometimes I forget which sub-mode I'm in and if a double-click will get me brighter or not.

I think a cool way ZL could handle this is by adding a click-hold feature that takes you to the next lower mode, and maybe make double-click take you up to one higher mode, and these clicks could traverse the groups. That way, pressing and holding is a coarse ramp, double-click is step up, click-hold is a step down (or maybe use triple click, that's kinda useless for most of us). Whichever sub-mode you were last in is remembered the next time you coarse ramp.


----------



## id30209

Well gents, i just ordered 10pcs of XHP50.3 HI 90CRI 4500K
I have 2 SC600 MkIV+ just dying to get upgraded emitter without ugly yellow corona and extra throw

https://hr.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Cree-LED/XHP50D-H0-0000-0D0UH245G?qs=ljCeji4nMDnxlRN1Ckk1mw==


----------



## PoliceScannerMan

That sounds delicious


----------



## AstroTurf

Zl has a couple of h32 on sale!!!


----------



## GarageBoy

I'm one of the few that don't like ramping. I like knowing roughly how long the light will run for at each setting.


----------



## AstroTurf

anybody picked one of these up?

i picked up a w tint model.

best user of half worn cr123 out there!!!



AstroTurf said:


> Zl has a couple of h32 on sale!!!


----------



## Celery

I’m seeing a 6300K CW option. Does that mean the W tints are gone?

My only experience with ZL is about a month with a SC64c. Would the H32 be able to be programmed to single click to Low? It looks like to get to Low you have to press-and-hold (then release before it cycles to Med).


----------



## Bob_McBob

Celery said:


> I’m seeing a 6300K CW option. Does that mean the W tints are gone?
> 
> My only experience with ZL is about a month with a SC64c. Would the H32 be able to be programmed to single click to Low? It looks like to get to Low you have to press-and-hold (then release before it cycles to Med).



This is the neutral white version: http://zebralight.com/H32w-CR123-Headlamp-Neutral-White_p_242.html

The H32 is a previous generation Zebralight model, so it only has the "G5" programming of current models. You can program the lower level on each mode, but you can't do stuff like single click to low.


----------



## Celery

Thanks for the reply, Bob!


----------



## AntoninusPius

AstroTurf said:


> Zl has a couple of h32 on sale!!!



Woah! Just ordered a H32W. I've been wanting one of these for a backpacking light for quite a while, glad to see they're making them again.


----------



## Bob_McBob

AntoninusPius said:


> Woah! Just ordered a H32W. I've been wanting one of these for a backpacking light for quite a while, glad to see they're making them again.



They aren't making them again, it looks like they just found some random old stock to put up for sale. There are only four of the H32w and one of the H32 in stock. The stock level went down by one with your order. If anyone wants one of these they should grab it now, because this is probably the last new in box inventory in the world.


----------



## TIP AND RING

Refurb, not NOS, water test on arrival, for sure.


----------



## AstroTurf

your opinion, or fact?!?

there is a difference.

site says nothing of refurb...

so i assume you are assuming.



TIP AND RING said:


> Refurb, not NOS, water test on arrival, for sure.


----------



## Bob_McBob

That little stock of H32 is now sold out.


----------



## AstroTurf

Thanks Bob

I got mine coming

and i’ll flip it to any who are willing to pay…

one million dollars!!!

LOLz



Bob_McBob said:


> That little stock of H32 is now sold out.


----------



## Mr. LED

I just got another SC64w HI, and the pogo pins are replaced with some other type of small pins, I think it was already posted on this thread. What I found out is that any flat top cells that were dented by other pogo pins will not make contact with the new pins. Bummer.

Also, the moonlight is lower (I guess 0.03 lm), finally they brought it back, as the 0.07 lumen is too high for me. The texture of the anodizing is rougher, but probably batch variations. I have anodizing in all kinds of shades and textures from Zebralight. The cardboard box is also smaller, almost half the size now.


----------



## Mr. LED

AstroTurf said:


> Thanks Bob
> 
> I got mine coming
> 
> and i’ll flip it to any who are willing to pay…
> 
> one million dollars!!!
> 
> LOLz


I know how you feel, my two H32Fw are well kept in a safe!


----------



## parang

Is zebralight out of business? zebralight.com is gone.


----------



## raggie33

works fine here


----------



## Mr. LED




----------



## this_is_nascar

Working fine for me.


----------



## KITROBASKIN

parang said:


> Is zebralight out of business? zebralight.com is gone.


Hi parang,
Zebralight.com will only accept orders from USA customers now. I forgot what other vendor ships to additional countries.


----------



## parang

KITROBASKIN said:


> Hi parang,
> Zebralight.com will only accept orders from USA customers now. I forgot what other vendor ships to additional countries.




Thanks. Yes, I'm in Europe. I was just surprised that it won't even load outside of the US..


----------



## raggie33

ill post it here to my zebra light aa light is a lot dimmer if i use energizer l91 cells. kind of bumming me out since the cells cost me so much


----------



## AstroTurf

raggie33 said:


> ill post it here to my zebra light aa light is a lot dimmer if i use energizer l91 cells. kind of bumming me out since the cells cost me so much


use good cells then?!?


----------



## raggie33

the l91 is the best aa cell .i shoukd say best throw away


----------



## id30209

raggie33 said:


> the l91 is the best aa cell .i shoukd say best throw away


Eneloop is…for ZL


----------



## raggie33

i kind of like ones i can buy at walmart or home depot etc etc that dont need to be charged .i guess it comes from my homelless days


----------



## raggie33

so im bummed that my zebra sucks on l91 energizer cells. but tonight is the first time i recall seeing in on eneloops . man what crazy high light output mind blowing


----------



## Mr. LED

parang said:


> Thanks. Yes, I'm in Europe. I was just surprised that it won't even load outside of the US..


I can access the site no problem in Europe. If you’re in Europe, buy from Nkon, they’re the Zebra dealer.


----------



## id30209

raggie33 said:


> so im bummed that my zebra sucks on l91 energizer cells. but tonight is the first time i recall seeing in on eneloops . man what crazy high light output mind blowing


Told ya...


----------



## Olumin

parang said:


> Thanks. Yes, I'm in Europe. I was just surprised that it won't even load outside of the US..


Loads for me. Nkon sells zebra in europe.


----------



## dts71

PoliceScannerMan said:


> I dropped my SC64LE last nite onto concrete from about 4.5ft, the light was on. To my surprise it survived like a champ.


Nice 👍
My old SC600w - the one with easily replaceable LED hit a tile floor from 4ft. It didn't survive 😢
I will probably replace it with a SC64w hi. It would have been nice if there was an update coming like SC65 but considering the lack of news about new modells from Zebralight I should probably buy the SC64w hi while it's still available. I hope they stay in business but my gut feeling is they won't.


----------



## Mr. LED

I’ve never seen people so afraid of Zebralight going out of business, everyday there’s someone around here to say it. C’mon guys, Zebralight has always been slow to update products, always had a terrible website, and has stayed in business and we continue to like their products. Let’s just relax and enjoy, they’re doing fine.

About the SC64w HI, grab them while you can, when these HI emitters are gone, it’s history. The SC600w IV HI is gone… luckily I found a spare. And I have 4 SC64w HI now, because I know they’ll be gone soon. I hate to want lights that are discontinued because I like them so much, I’ve learned my lesson.


----------



## Derek Dean

dts71, I'm not sure of your location, but you might contact ZL and see if they are still offering their $15 repair service. If they are, then you simply mail your light to their Texas office (with a $15 check) and they'll fix it and send it back, which usually takes about a month.


----------



## Mr. LED

If you’re outside USA, Zebralight asks to mail directly to the factory in China, and the 15 dollar flat rate includes the shipping back.


----------



## KITROBASKIN

I think the repair fee is $18 now. This comes from a member here who purchased from me recently.


----------



## KITROBASKIN

I'm just wondering if member parang has set his browser to not allow http websites to load? Zebralight.com is still not https "secure".


----------



## Connor

KITROBASKIN said:


> I'm just wondering if member parang has set his browser to not allow http websites to load? Zebralight.com is still not https "secure".


... which is completely unacceptable for any shopping site in 2021.


----------



## AstroTurf

Connor said:


> ... which is completely unacceptable for any shopping site in 2021.


so says you?!?

LOLz


----------



## KITROBASKIN

Yes, we are so glad no one is required to purchase anything from the ZL website if they so choose. 
Perhaps this is one aspect (ZL not using https) that makes people think Zebralight is on the verge of obliteration?


----------



## Mr. LED

The CR123 gang


----------



## GarageBoy

Mr. LED said:


> About the SC64w HI, grab them while you can, when these HI emitters are gone, it’s history. The SC600w IV HI is gone… luckily I found a spare. And I have 4 SC64w HI now, because I know they’ll be gone soon. I hate to want lights that are discontinued because I like them so much, I’ve learned my lesson.


Like many, I'm debating of whether or not to go with the sc64w HI or the sc64c LE. Was there ever a sc64w (not high) ? I primarily use flashlights indoors, and I'm worried the HI has too tight a beam. I could use the extra lumens.


----------



## PoliceScannerMan

I have both, rarely reach for the HI, the LE beam is so nice and useful, with high CRI.


----------



## SYZYGY

GarageBoy said:


> Like many, I'm debating of whether or not to go with the sc64w HI or the sc64c LE. Was there ever a sc64w (not high) ? I primarily use flashlights indoors, and I'm worried the HI has too tight a beam. I could use the extra lumens.



primarily indoors.. i'm thinking you want LE, however...

it's personal taste. you need to try both to really know.
buy both and return the one you don't want.

i tried the LE and kept the HI. i use my HI every day.


----------



## Mr. LED

Get both and keep both, there’s never too many Zebras 🥸


----------



## PoliceScannerMan

Agree, you really cant go wrong here.


----------



## Barrington

This looks like the place to ask.....
Does anybody know if Zebralight is going out of business? Most of their models are completely unavailable in the UK now. And the situation seems to be similar in the rest of Europe. There seems to be a small amount of stock at NKON but they only deal in Euros and the shipping cost is very high.

I bought a SC5w in the UK a couple of years ago which quickly failed. I sent it back asking for a replacement. Instead I received a (partial) refund and it has remained out of stock ever since!


----------



## Mr. LED

They’re NOT going out of business, it has been said dozen times in this thread. Maybe the UK dealers don’t want to restock. NKON has almost all models in stock, including the limited LE, so it’s not just a “small amount of stock”. And their shipping is very reasonable, I pay only 6,50 Euro from Netherlands to Germany and I receive it in 2 days.

The SC5 models have been discontinued for some time now, that’s why you don’t usually see them in stock. But NKON has the SC5w in stock.


----------



## Owen

GarageBoy said:


> Like many, I'm debating of whether or not to go with the sc64w HI or the sc64c LE. Was there ever a sc64w (not high) ? I primarily use flashlights indoors, and I'm worried the HI has too tight a beam. I could use the extra lumens.


The HI is still pretty floody. Domed or not, it's still a big emitter using a small reflector with an orange peel texture. The fact that it has a tighter beam and more throw is relative. The SC64w HI has an 11° hotspot vs. a 12° for the SC64c. I think this gets blown way out of proportion, perhaps based on the differences between the SC600 models with larger reflectors, where the HI version had an 8° hotspot vs. 14° for the regular one.

And yes, there was a SC64w, but it was discontinued.


----------



## Barrington

Mr. LED said:


> They’re NOT going out of business, it has been said dozen times in this thread. Maybe the UK dealers don’t want to restock. NKON has almost all models in stock, including the limited LE, so it’s not just a “small amount of stock”. And their shipping is very reasonable, I pay only 6,50 Euro from Netherlands to Germany and I receive it in 2 days.
> 
> The SC5 models have been discontinued for some time now, that’s why you don’t usually see them in stock. But NKON has the SC5w in stock.


Thanks Mr LED. I didn't realise the SC5 range had been discontinued. I thought it was one of their more recent ones! It's a shame because I really liked mine for the short period it was working. You are right about NKON. I baulked slightly at the price €75 and the shipping £13.50 to the UK. In effect this means it would cost around £90 for a model that costs $69 (£55) in the States. Not something I would wish to encourage!


----------



## Mr. LED

I feel your pain, lad. Unfortunately we have to pay higher prices. This has been holding me to afford a HDS for a couple of years.

Actually it was the latest model but was discontinued nonetheless, and had not been replaced by a successor. Also discontinued was the SC600w IV regular and HI versions, SC64w and c versions. The HI version I guess they can’t source any more high intensity emitters, so I assume the SC64w HI will be next when they run out of boards. Grab them while you can, it’s the best Zebralight so far, in my opinion.


----------



## raggie33

i am haveing issues programing g7 mode i click 3 times to go lower and it just shuts off. i think i have to start off in the mode i want to program like set light to a certain level then shut light of then go sttraight to that mode from off then 6 double cllicks


----------



## ohio72

raggie33 said:


> i am haveing issues programing g7 mode i click 3 times to go lower and it just shuts off. i think i have to start off in the mode i want to program like set light to a certain level then shut light of then go sttraight to that mode from off then 6 double cllicks


From off did you click 7 times to get to g7? Here is a graph that might help you.


----------



## Stefano

Hello everyone
I have found that I have a problem with a H604c.
I bought it at the beginning of 2019, followed shortly after by H600Fc and then by H604d (three lights bought at 3 different times)
For various reasons I used these lights very little, after initial tests they remained unused.
The H600Fc had a high parasitic discharge, I sent it back to China and it was repaired.
Only now do I notice that the H604c has a problem with thermal management.
Testing it at H1 I realized that after a few seconds the power was dropping visibly but too quickly.
The H604d does not have this problem.

Afterwards, I did a lt of tests using a stopwatch and a lux meter.
The H604d (on H1) maintains constant power for about 50 seconds then begins a slow decline in brightness.
The H604c holds power for only 25 seconds then begins a very fast descent.
After one minute the H604d loses only around 10/15%
After one minute the H604c loses around 50/60%
I have tried various batteries (red Sanyo GA and Samsung 30Q 15A) and also to do the test using the same battery.
Changing the PID appears to have no effect on the H604c.
I tried to use the H604d tailcap on the H604c and nothing changes.
I add that this problem happens at H1 level but I have tried both lights also at H2 level (H2 = 1010 lumens)
Here, too, the H604c loses brightness much faster than the H604.
I also tried resetting the PID to factory settings but everything stays the same.
I remember reading that the first MKIV lights had PID issues but this was fixed at the end of 2018.
I do not understand if it is a defective light or if all the first H604c have this problematic PID, but it seems strange to me such a strong drop, it drops in 50/60 seconds from 1600 lumens to about 300 lumens.
Any idea on this?
I have many Zebralights but so far I have only had problems with this MKIV series
I tried to write to customer service (2 times) but I don't get a reply, strange because they usually reply immediately, even if just for information.
Does anyone know if after two and a half years I can get a replacement or repair for this H604c?


----------



## soli

Does Zebralight have any social media presence? Trying to find out if there's any word on when their site will be back up or would I be better off going via a re-seller


----------



## AstroTurf

soli said:


> Does Zebralight have any social media presence? Trying to find out if there's any word on when their site will be back up or would I be better off going via a re-seller


didnt know the site was down?!?

are you sure?!?


----------



## soli

AstroTurf said:


> didnt know the site was down?!?
> 
> are you sure?!?


Zebralight.com (unless it's something different now) redirects to an ecommerce site with the message "The Page You're Looking for is No Longer Active"


----------



## Olumin

The site works fine for me.


----------



## soli

Olumin said:


> The site works fine for me.


:/ what URL? Multiple browsers and computers via multiple internet connections trying to reach https://www.zebralight.com and http://zebralight.com and all redirect me to the ecommerce site


----------



## soli

OK figured it out, it seems to be they are filtering by location, all my tests were via european based internet connections.

When I try via a US based one it works.

I guess when they say "We now accept orders from U.S. customers only." they went all out to make sure that it really is US customers only.


----------



## Olumin

soli said:


> OK figured it out, it seems to be they are filtering by location, all my tests were via european based internet connections.
> 
> When I try via a US based one it works.
> 
> I guess when they say "We now accept orders from U.S. customers only." they went all out to make sure that it really is US customers only.


I am in Germany not US and both links work fine.


----------



## soli

Olumin said:


> I am in Germany not US and both links work fine.


ack 

Thanks for confirming. I guess as they don't ship wold wide any more I'll not worry about it. I'll go the re-seller route.


----------



## fnsooner

The SC64c LE is out of stock again, but not before I grabbed three. I received two yesterday in the mail and my spydie senses started tingling, so I ordered another and got a shipping notice.

I just looked and they’re gone.


----------



## AstroTurf

Olumin said:


> The site works fine for me.


me as well...


----------



## Stefano

It doesn't work for me either, 3dcartstore appears.
Until yesterday I saw the Zebralight site working
I then received a reply from Zebralight cs (after about 3 days) from the IP address of the email I saw that they replied to me from Dallas TX.


----------



## fnsooner

Which is the best battery these days for the SC64c LE? I still have a few of those red Sanyo 10A cells that Zebralight sells. I know the 64 is picky about its battery and needs unprotected. So if I were to pick up a couple more cells dedicated to the 64, which would you all purchase?


----------



## fwafwow

fnsooner said:


> Which is the best battery these days for the SC64c LE? I still have a few of those red Sanyo 10A cells that Zebralight sells. I know the 64 is picky about its battery and needs unprotected. So if I were to pick up a couple more cells dedicated to the 64, which would you all purchase?


+1 on this question - for the SC64w HI. (Sorry for imposing on your post @fnsooner )


----------



## AstroTurf

batts in my ZLs...

18650 Samsung INR18650-35E 3500mAh High Discharge FLAT Top


----------



## fwafwow

AstroTurf said:


> batts in my ZLs...
> 
> 18650 Samsung INR18650-35E 3500mAh High Discharge FLAT Top


Thanks @AstroTurf. I've got two ZLs (SC64w HI, currently for pocket carry, and the H600c Mk IV for hunting) and only two batteries at the moment - a Samsung 30Q 3000mAh, and a Sanyo NCR 18650GA 3500 mAh. Sorry for the newby questions, but until I can get a few more for options, as between the two, what's the best to use for my carry FL? And where do folks recommend purchasing their batteries?


----------



## AstroTurf

i like this site: https://www.illumn.com

but, there are others...


----------



## raggie33

is the 21700 zebra lights good? as most of you all know my fav traight in lights is how many lumens they can get out of a watt .i dont see how they can compare with lights who have 4 emiters


----------



## Fireclaw18

I don't own one myself, but supposedly the SC700d is supposed to be extremely good. It features a quad-die LED (XHP 70.2), so output isn't too far off from multi-emitter lights.

At 2600 lumens, The SC700d's max output is lower than some multiemitter lights. However, where it really shines is runtime and efficiency. It can maintain almost 1000 lumens for nearly 2 hours. Very few other lights can do that. An Emisar D4 has a higher max output, but ramps down very fast and levels off within a couple minutes at 500 lumens.

Zebralight accomplishes this via Zebralight's extremely efficient drivers, coupled with the best heatsinking design of any similar-sized flashlight.

It should also be mentioned that multi-emitter lights tend to have a wide hotspot with little spill. The SC700d's beam pattern should look more like other traditional reflector lights with a distinct narrower hotspot plus lots of spill.


----------



## sgt253

Has anyone heard anything about Zebralights demise? Are they still in business? I went to the website just now to purchase a headlamp and it states that the page is no longer active. Did I miss something?


----------



## Burgess

Website works FINE for me !
< just sayin' . . . . >


----------



## nollij

I'm confused. zebralight.com is down... where is the official site? I bought my first ZL back in the early 2000's and it's still one of my best headlamps in terms of UI and portability. I don't love the headband but the light still holds up great. WTF?


----------



## Owen

Site's not down. I have it open in another window looking at headlamps right now.


----------



## nollij

Owen said:


> Site's not down. I have it open in another window looking at headlamps right now.


Ok... I figured it out. Their host must be blocking VPN's because when I visit them through startpage.com and use the anonymous option, I can see the page. When I click directly on the link in a search engine or try to access it by direct URL entry, I get a weird message and redirect from https://www.3dcartstores.com/. I tried from at least 7 different servers (and several in different countries)and get the same result each time. Don't know if they just don't like MY VPN or if it's ALL VPN's they are blocking. Too bad... really was interested in buying another ZL. If anyone here feels like reaching out to their customer support for me via email and asking, I'd appreciate it... come to think of it, I think I can still order on the phone?


----------



## nollij

sgt253 said:


> Has anyone heard anything about Zebralights demise? Are they still in business? I went to the website just now to purchase a headlamp and it states that the page is no longer active. Did I miss something?


Apparently they don't like VPN's. Maybe too much fraud?


----------



## this_is_nascar

Seems like ZL lights are never discussed anymore. The two biggest topics are 1) are they/did they go out if business and 2) why not shipping outside US.

Oh well, I'll just continue to use mine, without a desire to discuss them.


----------



## JimIslander

sgt253 said:


> Has anyone heard anything about Zebralights demise? Are they still in business? I went to the website just now to purchase a headlamp and it states that the page is no longer active. Did I miss something?



Add the www.


----------



## Fireclaw18

this_is_nascar said:


> Seems like ZL lights are never discussed anymore. The two biggest topics are 1) are they/did they go out if business and 2) why not shipping outside US.
> 
> Oh well, I'll just continue to use mine, without a desire to discuss them.


Zebralight is still in business. Supposedly they are even working on new models (SC65 etc.).

However, it *HAS* been a very long time since they actually released any new models, which isn't a good sign. Hopefully we'll see something new from them this year.


----------



## Derek Dean

Yep, it has been a loooooong time since ZL released a new model, and it's usually at this time of year. I'm still happily using my Zebralights every day and night and enjoying them as much as ever, but I'd love to see something new and would more than likely purchase a new release just to help support the company. Hope you're listening ZL : )


----------



## hatman

Hmmm.... Can anyone who's owned one verify that the SC700 can run for nearly two hours?

If so, what battery are you using, please?


----------



## id30209

hatman said:


> Hmmm.... Can anyone who's owned one verify that the SC700 can run for nearly two hours?
> 
> If so, what battery are you using, please?


Of course...
I have 2 and i can confirm it does run 2+ hours.
See zeroair review here.
And a quick runtime graph


----------



## holygeez03

It's a sad time when The Official Zebralight Thread slips to Page 2.

I guess we aren't expecting any new models this year?


----------



## AstroTurf

holygeez03 said:


> It's a sad time when The Official Zebralight Thread slips to Page 2.
> 
> I guess we aren't expecting any new models this year?


Solomon said it best...

There is nothing new under the sun.


----------



## turbodog

Going to send back an sc62 for out of warranty repair. Drains batteries below 2.7 volts, way below.


----------



## InspectHerGadget

What is the reason that Zebralight accept only U.S. Customers?

It seems an odd thing to do in this global age.

Obviously they are doing well and don't want the complexity?


----------



## AstroTurf

InspectHerGadget said:


> What is the reason that Zebralight accept only U.S. Customers?
> 
> It seems an odd thing to do in this global age.
> 
> Obviously they are doing well and don't want the complexity?


Or theft?!?


----------



## this_is_nascar

At this point it doesn't much matter. Even if they did still ship internationally, it would be sitting on a container ship in the middle of the ocean somewhere.


----------



## InspectHerGadget

this_is_nascar said:


> At this point it doesn't much matter. Even if they did still ship internationally, it would be sitting on a container ship in the middle of the ocean somewhere.


I think mostly small items like this are shipped by air using USPS. I get a lot of things from the USA and the best is DHL. I can get things very quickly.

It is true though that supply chains are gummed up. I bought a Merida E160 eMTB recently but since then they have become special order items and the shop has got only one eMTB in stock...


----------



## Duster1671

Maybe they're having trouble sourcing ICs just like everyone else and limiting sales to the US is a way of temporarily keeping demand down?


----------



## hatman

Thanks for the info re the SC700d. It has quickly become one of my favorite lights. But I don't get anywhere near two hours to a battery.
I have been using the ZL-recommended Samsung 40T as well as the Sony VTC6A.
Terrific light. Terrific tint. Terrific beam. Nowhere near two hours anywhere near on high.

Update -- terrific review, too. And I see that the full two hours claimed is at no more than 729 lumens. I was going higher, so I get that. 
Thanks again!


----------



## PoliceScannerMan

SC700d about 180ft to bat house 🦇


----------



## holygeez03

I have a H502c on my nightstand... it sits in a block of wood with a hole drilled in it so it doesn't get knocked over... works well.


----------



## 3oni

Yet Another Jon said:


> My primary use will be as a handheld running light.


Out of curiosity, why not just use it as a headlamp?

That would avoid needing to "muffle" the beam, since you could tilt/rotate it to point at the ground in front of you, not at oncoming pedestrians, and you wouldn't have to carry it or fiddle with finger loops.


----------



## dydx

During snake season, lowering the beam increases the shadow definition of shapes on the trail, as opposed to a beam from near the eyes.


----------



## Fireclaw18

Yet Another Jon said:


> 4. Booties to absorb shock when dropped. Mostly, I want to avoid the noise and floor-denting that'll come when I drop the flashlight, but extra durability won't be unwelcome. Something over the tail should be easy, but I'm not sure how to get started around the head, unless in combination with a beam-shaping hood, but that might be heavier than I want to run with... this is 4th because I don't think I'll pursue it, but I'd embrace any ready solutions.



Try *Sugru*. Sugru is a moldable rubber that comes in a little foil packet. After you open the packet, you can kneed it like putty and put it into position on your light. Fashion it into a ring covering the front edge and bezel. Maybe a few lines going to another ring behind the switch. And a bumper on the tailcap. Be creative.

Once the Sugru is in position just let it sit for 24 hours. The stuff will cure into a flexible rubber.


----------



## Bob_McBob

Quite a few models have been discontinued recently. It seems like Zebralight is paring things down to the more popular models as they start to run out of current LEDs. The H53Fc is now the only remaining high CRI XP-L2 model, and of course they have already used up all remaining inventory of their discontinued CRI 80 4500K XHP35 HI on SC64w HI drivers. It would be nice if this forced their hand to consider newer enthusiast LEDs like Nichia B35 and 519A, but I'm not hopeful, especially as XHP35.2 and XHP50.3 become more widely available. I noticed the price of the SC64w HI has now been increased to $84 from $79, and I'm also a little worried that many of the major components on their drivers like MCUs and voltage converters have enormous lead times now due to the global supply issues.


----------



## Duster1671

Bob_McBob said:


> The H53Fc is now the only remaining high CRI XP-L2 model, and of course *they have already used up all remaining inventory of their discontinued CRI 80 4500K XHP35 HI on SC64w HI drivers.*


?

The SC64w HI is showing In Stock on their website.


----------



## KITROBASKIN

The LE is in stock.


----------



## quahog

Duster1671 said:


> ?
> 
> The SC64w HI is showing In Stock on their website.


Yes, it's in stock on their website. What Bob_McBob was saying is that ZL has soldered all the XHP35 HI LEDs onto drivers for SC64w HI. So, they can still continue making SC64w HIs until they run out of the drivers (with the LEDs).


----------



## Duster1671

quahog said:


> Yes, it's in stock on their website. What Bob_McBob was saying is that ZL has soldered all the XHP35 HI LEDs onto drivers for SC64w HI. So, they can still continue making SC64w HIs until they run out of the drivers (with the LEDs).


Oh I see. So they won't be making any more lights with the XHP35 HI other than whatever is left of the SC64w HI. I noticed a few weeks ago that the SC600w HI is discontinued. I'm glad I got one when they were available!


----------



## Duster1671

In case anyone is wondering, here is the source for the info that all the XHP35 HI emitters have been soldered onto SC64w HI drivers:


----------



## Fireclaw18

I asked Zebralight a month ago when they were going to release new models. They told me they were waiting for a more dependable supply of parts.

Sounds like the worldwide supply issues due to COVID are affecting them.


----------



## this_is_nascar

Fireclaw18 said:


> I asked Zebralight a month ago when they were going to release new models. They told me they were waiting for a more dependable supply of parts.
> 
> Sounds like the worldwide supply issues due to COVID are affecting them.



Unfortunately, Covid has been and will be an excuse for many things and people for years to come.

Not saying you were being bullshitted by ZL, but they were lacking new models long before Covid.

For the next 3-5 years, Covid will be everyone's excuse for mistakes, lack of accountability, reason for sub-par workmanship, etc.


----------



## PoliceScannerMan

Facts TIN


----------



## JimIslander

BACK ON TOPIC:
Bought 2 SC64c LE's and a SC64w HI last night. They shipped already this afternoon. I think that brings my collection total to 25.


----------



## Mister Ed

Please keep this on topic, or take it to the underground.


----------



## Duster1671

Knowing they won't be available forever, I ordered a SC64w HI last week.

Wow, what a flashlight. I also have a SC600w HI and SC64c LE, and the SC64w HI is a really nice compromise in beam shape between the two. Just the perfect mix of throw and flood for general use, and excellent tint as well.

I do have some quibbles with the ZL UI, but if we're looking at performance metrics, the SC64w HI has a strong case for best light in my collection.


----------



## this_is_nascar

Mister Ed said:


> Please keep this on topic, or take it to the underground.



ZL is being discussed, right? That's the name of the topic, right? What am I missing?


----------



## Limit_hex

Duster1671 said:


> Knowing they won't be available forever, I ordered a SC64w HI last week.
> 
> Wow, what a flashlight. I also have a SC600w HI and SC64c LE, and the SC64w HI is a really nice compromise in beam shape between the two. Just the perfect mix of throw and flood for general use, and excellent tint as well.
> 
> I do have some quibbles with the ZL UI, but if we're looking at performance metrics, the SC64w HI has a strong case for best light in my collection.


The SC64w HI is incredible. I even like the UI, direct access to both high and low, and medium can be reached both from ”below” by hold, and from ”above” by double click. And can be reprogrammed as you like, including levels not in the original set of six. It’s small enough to use as a backup, and even as a holder for a spare 18650


----------



## Duster1671

LH - what I dislike about the UI really are just quibbles. It's overall very functional and versatile.

However, here are a few points that I don't like:

1. Sub-mode memory - Unless you're diligent about changing each mode back to the same sub-mode before turning the light off each time, you don't know what state the light will be in when you turn it on. This leads to a lot of double clicking to see if the brightness goes up or down, and then maybe double clicking again to go back.

2. The default of single click to High, double-click to Medium - I find this counterintuitive and it's the reverse of the way other popular UIs work. Plus, it results in the quick flash of High when you turn on at Medium. The solution I use it to switch the H and M mode groups in G6, but that causes...

3. Press and hold to cycle now becomes L-H-M-L-H-M etc. Not as nice as the default L-M-H.

If I could turn off sub-mode memory and reprogram the press-and-hold cycle order, the ZL UI would be really excellent.


----------



## 3oni

Duster1671 said:


> If I could turn off sub-mode memory and reprogram the press-and-hold cycle order, the ZL UI would be really excellent.


I believe you can eliminate the sub-mode memory by setting your sub-modes to the same brightness level as their associated primary modes.


----------



## Duster1671

Oh, yes that would work. But then I would only have three levels instead of six.


----------



## PoliceScannerMan

I have all my ZL's programmed to come on in medium with a click, press hold for low, double click for high. Its quite easy to program.


----------



## JimIslander

this_is_nascar said:


> ZL is being discussed, right? That's the name of the topic, right? What am I missing?



We got a bit off topic. I edited that out of my post. This is a nice place for discussing flashlights, so I'm a huge fan of the mods reminders when I or anyone strays off track.


----------



## LRJ88

Just asking this here because it seems the most frequented by the relevant people.

My SC5 Mk.II started flashing randomly when i turned it on the other day, clicking the button again to turn it off it started ramping low to high over and over again, i unscrewed the tailcap and screwed it back on again only to find it go on in low mode. After unscrewing the tailcap again i actuated the switch a couple of times to make sure there wasn't an issue there and tightened the tailcap again, once more met with the light turning on. I replaced the battery, figuring maybe that'd help, but i was met with the same result again. Finally i turned it off and let it rest for a few minutes with the tailcap off, and once i put it back on again the flashlight was back to factory settings, all my mode groups had been reset to factory settings.

I've attempted to find anything on this a bit all over the place, but i haven't found anything relevant to this issue. If anyone has experienced something similar or knows what's going on i'd appreciate hearing about it.


----------



## JimIslander

LRJ88 said:


> Just asking this here because it seems the most frequented by the relevant people.
> 
> My SC5 Mk.II started flashing randomly when i turned it on the other day, clicking the button again to turn it off it started ramping low to high over and over again, i unscrewed the tailcap and screwed it back on again only to find it go on in low mode. After unscrewing the tailcap again i actuated the switch a couple of times to make sure there wasn't an issue there and tightened the tailcap again, once more met with the light turning on. I replaced the battery, figuring maybe that'd help, but i was met with the same result again. Finally i turned it off and let it rest for a few minutes with the tailcap off, and once i put it back on again the flashlight was back to factory settings, all my mode groups had been reset to factory settings.
> 
> I've attempted to find anything on this a bit all over the place, but i haven't found anything relevant to this issue. If anyone has experienced something similar or knows what's going on i'd appreciate hearing about it.


Haven't seen this, but it sounds like a stuck switch. I'd cycle it about 100 times and see if it fixes it. Any exposure to chemicals or syrup?


----------



## LRJ88

JimIslander said:


> Haven't seen this, but it sounds like a stuck switch. I'd cycle it about 100 times and see if it fixes it. Any exposure to chemicals or syrup?


It isn't doing it now, and i've attempted to replicate it without the switch doing anything like that again. No exposure to anything apart from random water splashes, sweat, rain etc. that shouldn't affect the switch like this. I could understand the stuck switch, but that wouldn't also reset the flashlight like this.

Full disclosure, the flashlight has been serviced earlier due to it having abnormally high parasitic drain, it drained a 2,000 mAh battery in just a few days when off, i'm unsure if that can have anything to do with this either.


----------



## this_is_nascar

Occasionally, all of my ZL will act funny when 1st powered on. I then unscrew the tailcap and it resets everything and it works for another couple of months before it does it again.


----------



## KITROBASKIN

A 2014 purchased SC62d got plum wore out. I sent it to ZL. Months later got it back all spiffy. No sure how many months later started randomly turning itself off on dog walks. Initially, removing and replacing the tailcap got back on track but then even that began to not work most of the time. I'm not sending it back; ended up buying a new Zebralight and pleased with the LE.


----------



## LRJ88

this_is_nascar said:


> Occasionally, all of my ZL will act funny when 1st powered on. I then unscrew the tailcap and it resets everything and it works for another couple of months before it does it again.


Does it do anything else prior to fudging up again?


----------



## this_is_nascar

LRJ88 said:


> Does it do anything else prior to fudging up again?



Nope. It never happens on its own. I'll go to click it on to use it and it will start randomly blocking and going off and on. Clicking the switch at that point does nothing.

Unscrewing the tailcap to break the connection, then retightening, fixes it until the next time it happens.


----------



## LRJ88

this_is_nascar said:


> Nope. It never happens on its own. I'll go to click it on to use it and it will start randomly blocking and going off and on. Clicking the switch at that point does nothing.
> 
> Unscrewing the tailcap to break the connection, then retightening, fixes it until the next time it happens.


So in other words there's no way to really predict it either. Out of my 2 Zebralights only the SC5 II has been acting iffy on its own rather than from outside influence.


----------



## this_is_nascar

LRJ88 said:


> So in other words there's no way to really predict it either. Out of my 2 Zebralights only the SC5 II has been acting iffy on its own rather than from outside influence.



Correct. It's particularly noticable on my SC64w-HI that I EDC. I don't carry any of my others enough to get a sense of what effects it, but I can tell you it's happened on my SC53* as well.


----------



## LRJ88

this_is_nascar said:


> Correct. It's particularly noticable on my SC64w-HI that I EDC. I don't carry any of my others enough to get a sense of what effects it, but I can tell you it's happened on my SC53* as well.


My SC52F has been working perfectly since i got it apart from when it took a small tumble and seemingly landed just bad enough to mess something up inside, after it was sent off for service and i got it back it's been kicking along without any issues whatsoever, so i'm half wondering if it's something with the memory in the newer one having a hiccup and just resetting itself after power's been on for x amount of time.


----------



## Fireclaw18

My SC64w Hi has a minor glitch. 

Occasionally, when I click the switch to turn the light on to high from off, the light will turn on, but then after 1 second turn off again. This happens even when my finger isn't on the button when it turns off.

It's rare. At a guess, this happens once every thirty times I turn on the light. To fix, just wait a second then click the button again. The light turns on and acts normally.

I received it from the factory with this minor defect.


----------



## josekym

Hello ZL users, I would just like to ask if there is official/non-official documentation on the ZL 19Hz strobe mode (for later models)? Is H1 the default level for it?

I observe that on my recent SC600w MK4 Plus and SC64w HI, the default strobe level is not H1. If you cycle from L1-H1, turn it off, then triple-click to strobe, you get the H1-level strobe output. However, when you remove the battery, the level resets to whatever default setting it is (but it is not H1 as far as I can tell, since it is dimmer). Happens on G5, G6, G7 as well.

This issue does not happen to my older MK3 HI and SC5w II. Both appear to me as using H1-level for 19Hz strobe.


----------



## Duster1671

Fireclaw18 said:


> My SC64w Hi has a minor glitch.
> 
> Occasionally, when I click the switch to turn the light on to high from off, the light will turn on, but then after 1 second turn off again. This happens even when my finger isn't on the button when it turns off.
> 
> It's rare. At a guess, this happens once every thirty times I turn on the light. To fix, just wait a second then click the button again. The light turns on and acts normally.
> 
> I received it from the factory with this minor defect.


I have a SC600w HI MkIV that does this in cold weather. And it doesn't even have to be very cold. I can replicate it reliably by putting the light in the fridge for a few minutes, but it also happens intermittently when I walk out the front door on a 30-40F night and turn the light on, after having stored it in a 60F house.

It comes on H1 for a second and then goes dark. If I click once, nothing happens, but then a second click turns the light back on. It's as if the driver is still running, just without pushing power to the LED. So the first click turns the driver off, then the second click turns it back on.

I corresponded with Zebralight about this and they blamed it on the battery. I typically use a VTC6 in this light that are, granted, a couple of years old. But they have very few cycles and their capacities and internal resistances haven't changed much from new. And they work flawlessly in other high-current lights.

I suspect there's a design flaw with the XHP35 HI boost drivers that causes this to happen sometimes. Maybe a component tolerance that's just on the edge of acceptable. But Zebralight sticks by their story that I need to buy new batteries every six months or whatever for this light to work reliably. Imo, a light that cannot tolerate a moderately aged battery with plenty of cycle life left has a design flaw.


----------



## dydx

Same with my H600 MkIV... I'll try the double click next time. Same battery response from ZL. Thanks


----------



## neutralwhite

does ZL still respond to messages ? 
I am wondering if anything is coming in 2022


----------



## geokite

Same on my SC700d, but I'm always running the strobe on 4Hz. Haven't emailed ZL about it.


----------



## josekym

geokite said:


> Same on my SC700d, but I'm always running the strobe on 4Hz. Haven't emailed ZL about it.


I see. I tested 4Hz strobe and do not observe the above issue I have with 19Hz strobe. Even after battery change.

Maybe it is with the driver then? Or by design? So far, my older ZLs with the mode groups do not exhibit the same. They all use H1 level for the 19Hz strobe.

Also I am using the recommended Sanyo GA 18650 cells on all my ZLs.

Anyway and unrelated, I just recently dropped my SC64w HI onto granite tile from about 5ft... My light survived (although it now has little dents in the head and tail), and got my battery anode slightly dented as well.


----------



## twistedraven

Zebralight needs to get on the ball. SFT40, B35AM and XHP50.3 HI are such juicy emitters to use in EDC style lights.


----------



## JimIslander

Duster1671 said:


> I have a SC600w HI MkIV that does this in cold weather. And it doesn't even have to be very cold. I can replicate it reliably by putting the light in the fridge for a few minutes, but it also happens intermittently when I walk out the front door on a 30-40F night and turn the light on, after having stored it in a 60F house.
> 
> It comes on H1 for a second and then goes dark. If I click once, nothing happens, but then a second click turns the light back on. It's as if the driver is still running, just without pushing power to the LED. So the first click turns the driver off, then the second click turns it back on.
> 
> I corresponded with Zebralight about this and they blamed it on the battery. I typically use a VTC6 in this light that are, granted, a couple of years old. But they have very few cycles and their capacities and internal resistances haven't changed much from new. And they work flawlessly in other high-current lights.
> 
> I suspect there's a design flaw with the XHP35 HI boost drivers that causes this to happen sometimes. Maybe a component tolerance that's just on the edge of acceptable. But Zebralight sticks by their story that I need to buy new batteries every six months or whatever for this light to work reliably. Imo, a light that cannot tolerate a moderately aged battery with plenty of cycle life left has a design flaw.



Can you duplicate the problem with new batteries? Not that this is acceptable, but curious if you have tried this?


----------



## KITROBASKIN

Saw on the news today that about 25% of online orders get returned, and the vendor cost and (fuel, manpower, and material) waste dealing with that is real. Can't help wondering if this is a factor with Zebralight, limiting available funds for development of future flashlights. We have read of members here buying multiple units to try similar models, or hoping to find a best 'tint'. The rest of us pay for that behavior. One opinion.


----------



## Duster1671

JimIslander said:


> Can you duplicate the problem with new batteries? Not that this is acceptable, but curious if you have tried this?


To their credit, ZL did send me a fresh VTC6 at the time and the problem went away for a while with that battery. Since then the problem has come back and I gave up trying to figure it out.

I just remember to do a power cycle if it shuts off unexpectedly. Or program H1 down one level from max output. But that's kind of a bummer.


----------



## AstroTurf

Duster1671 said:


> To their credit, ZL did send me a fresh VTC6 at the time and the problem went away for a while with that battery. Since then the problem has come back and I gave up trying to figure it out.
> 
> I just remember to do a power cycle if it shuts off unexpectedly. Or program H1 down one level from max output. But that's kind of a bummer.


huh, let me get this straight...

with a new battery, the problem goes away.

over time, as the battery wears/ages, the problem comes back.

interesting


----------



## Duster1671

AstroTurf - yes, that seems to be the case. A moderately worn battery in moderately cool (or colder) temperatures is the combo that causes it.


----------



## Romanko

The design of ZL Homepage was just changed. And link to spreadsheet disappeared.


----------



## Connor

... and it's still not using https. 


=> https://doesmysiteneedhttps.com/


----------



## Duster1671

Perhaps the lack of new models is part of a "security through obscurity" strategy.


----------



## Beacon of Light

I have a H600 Mark IV and the strap came undone. Is there a video or decent tutorial on how to thread the headband through the buckles. I tried doing it intuitively but it never tightens and is always to loose. BTW I’m not even using the top strap as I never do them on any of my Zebralights


----------



## Duster1671

Beacon of Light said:


> I have a H600 Mark IV and the strap came undone. Is there a video or decent tutorial on how to thread the headband through the buckles. I tried doing it intuitively but it never tightens and is always to loose. BTW I’m not even using the top strap as I never do them on any of my Zebralights


Here's a photo of mine that might help you decipher. It's upside down here:


----------



## fnsooner

Just ordered a couple of SC64c LE 18650 lights. I’ve been carrying an 18650 ZL since the SC60 of some sort. Didn’t even look at anything else. I sure am glad Zebralight has stuck around. Quirky company. Great light.


----------



## josekym

Connor said:


> ... and it's still not using https.
> 
> 
> => https://doesmysiteneedhttps.com/



They should go ahead and use free SSL certificate by LetsEncrypt: https://letsencrypt.org/


----------



## josekym

josekym said:


> Hello ZL users, I would just like to ask if there is official/non-official documentation on the ZL 19Hz strobe mode (for later models)? Is H1 the default level for it?
> 
> I observe that on my recent SC600w MK4 Plus and SC64w HI, the default strobe level is not H1. If you cycle from L1-H1, turn it off, then triple-click to strobe, you get the H1-level strobe output. However, when you remove the battery, the level resets to whatever default setting it is (but it is not H1 as far as I can tell, since it is dimmer). Happens on G5, G6, G7 as well.
> 
> This issue does not happen to my older MK3 HI and SC5w II. Both appear to me as using H1-level for 19Hz strobe.



Just to add to this, I found that the 19Hz strobe always gets reset to lower mode even just by changing mode groups on the newer lights. My older lights do not have this "issue".


----------



## geokite

Not sure when it happened, but ZL has a newer version of their website. Looks good! Same info as before, just a different package.

Noticed they no longer have the most recent light I had purchased, H600d IV. Sooo glad I splurged and got that when I did. It goes on my helmet for mtn biking, along with a pair of H600Fd IV on the handlebars, and joins the other 22 zebras.


----------



## neutralwhite

I hear a lot about Andruil is better than the ZL UI 
do you agree ?.
is the ZL UI outdated ? 
still love for it ? 
thanks !


----------



## Connor

neutralwhite said:


> I hear a lot about Andruil is better than the ZL UI
> do you agree ?.
> is the ZL UI outdated ?
> still love for it ?
> thanks !


You almost can't compare the two UIs.
ZL's is a simple straight-forward UI usable by about anyone but has everything you really need in an EDC flashlight.
Anduril2 is quite the opposite, it has "everything" and is _way_ more complex and targets enthusiast users.
See http://toykeeper.net/torches/fsm/anduril2/anduril-manual.txt for the manual.


----------



## KITROBASKIN

neutralwhite said:


> I hear a lot about Andruil is better than the ZL UI
> do you agree ?.
> is the ZL UI outdated ?
> still love for it ?
> thanks !


Anyone who loves flashlights should get an Anduril flashlight; very basic to use unless a person starts clicking Willy-Nilly.


----------



## this_is_nascar

Owning my ZL, I see no reason to even consider a new or different UI. The ZL UI has everything that I'd want.

The fact that I've instant access to 3 different, user configurable, levels from off is just about all I need. Then, once on, I have simple access to even more levels of brightness.

Anything more than Thai would just be overkill for me and more opportunities to mess it up.


----------



## Duster1671

I've written about this before, but I'll reiterate...

The only real gripe I have with the ZL UI is the fact that it remembers sub-modes. It's great that I can shortcut to say, High mode, but will I get H1 or H2? I won't know until I turn the light on and do a double click.

On paper, the ZL UI is fairly simple and Anduril is ultra-complicated, but in actual use I find the opposite. The basic operation of Anduril is simple and elegant while ZL has me doing a lot of double clicks and mode checking that shouldn't be necessary.


----------



## PoliceScannerMan

I'll take ZL UI over Anduril .


----------



## neutralwhite

PoliceScannerMan said:


> I'll take ZL UI over Anduril .


because ?....
isn't ZL UI old now ?


----------



## PoliceScannerMan

I got mine to come on at a nice medium EDC level with single click from off. Double click from off for hi. Long press for low. It just works for me. As much as I try, I just dont love Anduril. I can tolerate it, just like the ZL better.


----------



## twistedraven

I'm so spoiled off the smooth ramping of Anduril lights that it's hard to consider Zebralight anymore.


----------



## JimIslander

this_is_nascar said:


> Owning my ZL, I see no reason to even consider a new or different UI. The ZL UI has everything that I'd want.
> 
> The fact that I've instant access to 3 different, user configurable, levels from off is just about all I need. Then, once on, I have simple access to even more levels of brightness.
> 
> Anything more than Thai would just be overkill for me and more opportunities to mess it up.



I have 26 Zebralights and about 10 Anduril lights. I would love Anduril in at least some of my Zebralights. You have the same instant access to three light settings, plus instant ramp up/down.

Hold Briefly = Firefly mode (if set low in your ceiling setting)
Click = Memory
Click Twice = full bright (whatever your high ceiling level is)
Click Twice again = Turbo!

The only one you can't chose is single click level. Wait, yes you can since the update a few years ago. You can now choose between manual memory and auto memory.


----------



## KITROBASKIN

Good posts about Anduril flashlights in this Zebralight thread!
Respect for PoliceScannerMan for his preference. 

It stands however that things can go kersplat quite quick with Anduril when button-clicking-mistakes happen. A user guide is needed for most of us to get back on track. Earlier production Anduril torches also did not always function as requested for me.

One could say that switches on the 4 or so Anduril flashlights that I've possessed were not in the same league as a high quality Zebralight switch. The ZL anodizing is really good and the lenses are said to be tough. Compactness won me over to ZL in 2013, but that whole double clicking thing to see if I was in L1, L2, M1, M2, H1 or H2 got old after the smooth ramping of Anduril made its debut. My wife still uses a ZL LE in rotation with an Anduril for our nightly dog walks.


----------



## amanichen

A ramping UI would be nice on a ZL. They already have room for 3 sets of UIs that can be customized, why not make ramping one of them? Unfortunately, Anduril generally runs on lights with PWM and linear/mosfet drivers which are antithetical to ZL's design philosophy of high efficiency.


----------



## Duster1671

It is true that Anduril can get all kinds of borked with the wrong series of clicks, which just doesn't happen with Zebralights. Though in most cases it's as simple as loosening and re-tightening the battery cap to get back to baseline.

With Zebralight and Anduril both, any sort of programming demands that the manual is in front of me. I just don't have the space in my brain for that stuff. It is a little irritating that I now need to figure out _which_ Anduril manual I need for whatever light I'm trying to program, because 1 and 2 program very differently.

amanichen - I don't think there's any technical reason Anduril needs to run on lights with PWM and FET drivers. That's just the market space where it was popularized.


----------



## amanichen

Duster1671 said:


> amanichen - I don't think there's any technical reason Anduril needs to run on lights with PWM and FET drivers. That's just the market space where it was popularized.


Yeah, someone on another forum developed a boost driver, and a buck-boost running Anduril (#1 or #2?) but neither are yet on any production lights that I'm aware of.


----------



## Connor

Duster1671 said:


> I don't think there's any technical reason Anduril needs to run on lights with PWM and FET drivers. That's just the market space where it was popularized.



There isn't. My recent "custom" Emisar D4V2.5 has the 9A+FET linear driver which is fully regulated/PWM-free up to 9 amps (basically any level but turbo) and has comparable runtimes at low to medium levels to what ZL's drivers are offering.


----------



## this_is_nascar

neutralwhite said:


> because ?....
> isn't ZL UI old now ?



Since when does old equal bad 😔?


----------



## neutralwhite

Ticket status: New

Department: Customer Service

Subject: ZebraLight, Inc.: Update Tracking #52996

We have no plans to close down in the forseeable future.

Sincerely,

ZebraLight, Inc.
PO BOX 92307
Southlake, TX 76092


----------



## this_is_nascar

neutralwhite said:


> Ticket status: New
> 
> Department: Customer Service
> 
> Subject: ZebraLight, Inc.: Update Tracking #52996
> 
> We have no plans to close down in the forseeable future.
> 
> Sincerely,
> 
> ZebraLight, Inc.
> PO BOX 92307
> Southlake, TX 76092



Thanks, but this won't matter. By the end of the month, someone will be out here speculating the ZL must be closing the doors, since nothing new has been released or announced.


----------



## neutralwhite

this_is_nascar said:


> Thanks, but this won't matter. By the end of the month, someone will be out here speculating the ZL must be closing the doors, since nothing new has been released or announced.


that is true, I think going back to 2017, I see they have been closing down ( speculation )


----------



## Connor

I am/was a ZL fan, I bought 6 lights from them and I still own and use 3 of these.

That being said I am disappointed by 4 years of no innovation. LEDs, like other semiconductors, are constantly being improved upon and there's a wide variety of newer and *better* LEDs you can get now (SST-20, SFT-40, E21A, B35AM just to name a few) ... alas, you can't get them from ZL. Add to that a couple of really nifty new ideas that actually improve flashlight usage like e.g. Aux-LEDs and illuminated switches and it's hard to deny that ZL is falling behind, even though I still appreciate their efficient drivers and the unibody design.


----------



## AstroTurf

Just received a new H53w today.

new box is smaller, a little.

new clip is a dual type of clip.

and the anno color is more gray than green.

very happy boy, am i.


----------



## this_is_nascar

Connor said:


> I am/was a ZL fan, I bought 6 lights from them and I still own and use 3 of these.
> 
> That being said I am disappointed by 4 years of no innovation. LEDs, like other semiconductors, are constantly being improved upon and there's a wide variety of newer and *better* LEDs you can get now (SST-20, SFT-40, E21A, B35AM just to name a few) ... alas, you can't get them from ZL. Add to that a couple of really nifty new ideas that actually improve flashlight usage like e.g. Aux-LEDs and illuminated switches and it's hard to deny that ZL is falling behind, even though I still appreciate their efficient drivers and the unibody design.



I guess it comes down to what's important to you. New and upgraded doesn't necessarily mean better. Aux lights, lit switches, ability to start fires, etc are all available if other, less expensive, offerings. I consider those gimmick items, not required in my day to day lighting needs.


----------



## Burgess

I'm STILL waiting for the Q50 . . . . . .

:-\


----------



## Connor

this_is_nascar said:


> Aux lights, lit switches



Of course .. different strokes for different folks. 
But I'm sure you can see the value of being able to find your flashlight in complete darkness .. or having a flashlight that's always producing a little bit of light even when "off" (with no impact on battery life).


----------



## AstroTurf

Connor said:


> Of course .. different strokes for different folks.
> But I'm sure you can see the value of being able to find your flashlight in complete darkness .. or having a flashlight that's always producing a little bit of light even when "off" (with no impact on battery life).


great point...

the h53w has a low output of 0.013 lumens that will last over three months.

i couldn't be happier!!!


----------



## AstroTurf

AstroTurf said:


> great point...
> 
> the h53w has a low output of 0.013 lumens that will last over three months.
> 
> i couldn't be happier!!!


and a beauty she is too...


----------



## AstroTurf

AstroTurf said:


> and a beauty she is too...
> 
> View attachment 23519


closer...


----------



## this_is_nascar

Connor said:


> Of course .. different strokes for different folks.
> But I'm sure you can see the value of being able to find your flashlight in complete darkness .. or having a flashlight that's always producing a little bit of light even when "off" (with no impact on battery life).



I'd it's creating light, it's impacting battery availability.


----------



## Connor

this_is_nascar said:


> I'd it's creating light, it's impacting battery availability.


The D4V2 Aux LEDs on low use 60-170 µA (depending on the RGB colour(s)) which is less than the battery self-discharge. Unless you never use your flashlight over years it's not impacting battery life in any meaningful way. (you can turn them off completely and for storage you should disconnect the battery anyway)


----------



## desert.snake

There is an idea to add a lock for changing the parameters G6 and G7. Something like unscrew and screw the lid when the flashlight is on in any mode and press the button, when (for example) 3 or 4 cycle changes H/M/L pass (9/12 level changes), then the lock will be turned on. Almost like entering a PID controller. Lock - I mean that it will be possible to endlessly switch between H1 and H2 modes, for example, without entering the brightness setting with 6 double clics. If you want to change modes, you can again remove this lock. Every time when a zebra is put into the hands of comrades, they click it and as a result I have several pieces of levels 12. I also bought a bunch of zebras for work, some of these people also go into brighter and brighter modes and I end up having to reconfigure everything again and again.


----------



## this_is_nascar

desert.snake said:


> There is an idea to add a lock for changing the parameters G6 and G7. Something like unscrew and screw the lid when the flashlight is on in any mode and press the button, when (for example) 3 or 4 cycle changes H/M/L pass (9/12 level changes), then the lock will be turned on. Almost like entering a PID controller. Lock - I mean that it will be possible to endlessly switch between H1 and H2 modes, for example, without entering the brightness setting with 6 double clics. If you want to change modes, you can again remove this lock. Every time when a zebra is put into the hands of comrades, they click it and as a result I have several pieces of levels 12. I also bought a bunch of zebras for work, some of these people also go into brighter and brighter modes and I end up having to reconfigure everything again and again.



I could see this as a possibility. As long as they don't change the quick method of getting to G6 and G7 for normal use.


----------



## turbodog

Just got my sc602 back from out of warranty repair. Was gone about 2 months. Seems to have fixed the problem (draining cells below the min voltage).


----------



## josekym

I have a few Zebras, but even fewer Anduril lights (FW3As and EDC18s only). The Anduril lights are fun to play with for sure, but for practicality reasons, Zebras have been my EDC lights for years now. Most of the time (at home and at work) I just need a light to work reliably with one click.

Similar to what was mentioned earlier, I program all my newer SC Zebras to always come on at M-level on a single click, H-level on 2-click and L-level on long press. For my older SC600 Zebras (i.e. no G6, G7), I set H2 to ~200-300 lumens if possible, and I find it minimizes my need to have to use the max output on H1.


----------



## Pi_is_blue

I sent an inquiry to Zebralight about a successor to the recently discontinued H53Fc and received the following reply:



> We'll have H53c LE, H53Fc LE, and SC53c LE, all with the Samsung LH351D, in about 2-3 months.



Not quite the Nichia 519a I was hoping for, but quite an improvement over the Cree XP-L2!


----------



## AstroTurf

Pi_is_blue said:


> I sent an inquiry to Zebralight about a successor to the recently discontinued H53Fc and received the following reply:
> 
> 
> 
> Not quite the Nichia 519a I was hoping for, but quite an improvement over the Cree XP-L2!


Hey Now...

The Samsung LH351D, the led said to be used to illuminate Heaven!!!

I've got my money ready.

Thanks


----------



## this_is_nascar

Yea, the LH351D seems to be the new go-to high-CRI emitter. I have several other lights, from other makers, with that led.


----------



## id30209

And then there is a whole new level of modding Zebralights...


----------



## this_is_nascar

Yeah, but at that point is it really still a Zebralight?


----------



## AstroTurf

id30209 said:


> And then there is a whole new level of modding Zebralights...



yeah, no, not happenin to my lights...

I like em just the way they are.


----------



## Pi_is_blue

AstroTurf said:


> I've got my money ready.


I'll probably pick up one of each of the headlamp options. The LH351D is a good emitter, just second rate when compared to most Nichia options!



id30209 said:


> And then there is a whole new level of modding Zebralights...


That is a beautiful bit of work. Get rid of the light-up switch and add a deep-carry titanium clip and it would be the ideal EDC light!


----------



## twistedraven

Better UI, better emitter, and still with a buck driver using a Zebralight housing. Seems like a better Zebralight to me. I don't need the aux led in the switch though.


----------



## Bob_McBob

I'm sure many people have already heard, but the SC64w HI was moved to the discontinued product section in the spreadsheet a couple days ago, along with a couple other XHP35 models. No word on whether it might get the LE treatment with something like XHP35.2 HI.


----------



## this_is_nascar

twistedraven said:


> Better UI, better emitter, and still with a buck driver using a Zebralight housing. Seems like a better Zebralight to me. I don't need the aux led in the switch though.



Better UI? That's subjective. Agreed on the aux led in the switch.


----------



## SYZYGY

i personally think ZL is a better UI for a tool light. anduril is better for a toy light.


----------



## id30209

Just a note to everyone concerned, Anduril can be set with only 3 modes as in ZL or linear ramp up and down…


----------



## this_is_nascar

Not sure why so many continue to push Anduril when it comes to ZL. There's a reason most of that own a ZL don't want an Anduril device.


----------



## Connor

this_is_nascar said:


> Not sure why so many continue to push Anduril when it comes to ZL. There's a reason most of that own a ZL don't want an Anduril device.


Says what statistic? 
I own 3 ZLs (+I sold a couple older models) and I also own 4 Emisars. 

They're both good in slightly different ways but since ZL has been asleep at the job for 5 years now Emisar is kind of a worthy successor to me (and apparently quite a few other people, too). 
BTW, Hank offers some of the lights/LEDs with a 95% efficiency boost driver now. That should make some of the ZL enthusiasts very happy.


----------



## hatman

AstroTurf said:


> yeah, no, not happenin to my lights...
> 
> I like em just the way they are.





id30209 said:


> And then there is a whole new level of modding Zebralights...



How does the 519A compare to other Nichias?


----------



## SYZYGY

Connor said:


> BTW, Hank offers some of the lights/LEDs with a 95% efficiency boost driver now. That should make some of the ZL enthusiasts very happy.



like what? first i've heard of it.

i wouldn't mind a new light


----------



## this_is_nascar

Connor said:


> Says what statistic?
> I own 3 ZLs (+I sold a couple older models) and I also own 4 Emisars.
> 
> They're both good in slightly different ways but since ZL has been asleep at the job for 5 years now Emisar is kind of a worthy successor to me (and apparently quite a few other people, too).
> BTW, Hank offers some of the lights/LEDs with a 95% efficiency boost driver now. That should make some of the ZL enthusiasts very happy.



You miss my point, so I'll disengage.


----------



## twistedraven

Anduril can be made as simple as Zebralight's interface. Its strength lies in its customization. 

519A compares very, very favorably against 219B (I'm assuming we're talking about the SW45K variant of 219B since that's the famous rosy one). Higher output, same R9080 grade CRI, more efficient, when dedomed just as rosy, and also more throw. Dedoming lowers its CCT by roughly 1000k to 1200k, so dedoming a 5700k 519A gets you roughly a SW45K.


----------



## AstroTurf

twistedraven said:


> Anduril can be made as simple as Zebralight's interface. Its strength lies in its customization.
> 
> 519A compares very, very favorably against 219B (I'm assuming we're talking about the SW45K variant of 219B since that's the famous rosy one). Higher output, same R9080 grade CRI, more efficient, when dedomed just as rosy, and also more throw. Dedoming lowers its CCT by roughly 1000k to 1200k, so dedoming a 5700k 519A gets you roughly a SW45K.


Its weakness is its instability. Ie it forgets what was programmed.


----------



## radellaf

I'd probably get a SC53 with a LH351 but what's really sad is if they're truly discontinuing the SC5mkII. I liked that it was a little chunkier and more efficient than the 53. Also a good bit more expensive, but it got you something for the money. I never did get the "c" version of that so a LH351 would be great. I guess nobody wanted to spend the extra on an AA light that couldn't take 14500. Sad.


----------



## Connor

SYZYGY said:


> like what? first i've heard of it.
> 
> i wouldn't mind a new light


"KR4 / D4S V2 boost driver (single channel) option is now available.
The boost driver upgrade is available for the quad version of XP-L HI, SST-20, Osram W1/W2, Nichia 219B R9080 versions, each LED receives 2A current. The driver is not compatible with Nichia E21A, Nichia E17A, and mule versions of the flashlight. Please be noted that the boost driver version does not mean higher output than the regular version, it is a more efficient driver(90-95%)."

It's also available for some of the single LED lights with 6/12V LEDs. Check Hank's thread on BLF for more info.


----------



## KITROBASKIN

Hey, is that 519a the same size or smaller than a 219b?


----------



## twistedraven

KITROBASKIN said:


> Hey, is that 519a the same size or smaller than a 219b?



Same footprint: 3535.

The actual emitting die might be slightly larger, I'm not too positive, but when you dedome it, it's going to throw noticeably further than the 219B. I take it most people are going to be dedoming it to make it rosier.


----------



## this_is_nascar

....and all of this has what to do with ZL exactly?


----------



## AstroTurf

this_is_nascar said:


> ....and all of this has what to do with ZL exactly?


I agree, Mods delete trash posts!!!


----------



## Marvin8

Geez, I'll delete it myself.


----------



## jon_slider

hatman said:


> How does the 519A compare to other Nichias?


519a is up to 50% brighter, has equally fantastic 9080 CRI, without the pink tint, unless dedomed, which produces a color that I cannot resist. They are the same 3535 footprint size, same solder pads, the dome is larger on the 519a (larger hotspot, like LH351d and XPL).

I have been carrying a dedomed 4500k 519a since I got it (it is now 3500k), the middle light:







You can get a Zebra w dedomed 519a, and experience it for yourself:



Bob_McBob said:


> Zebralight SC64c LE with rosy dedomed Nichia 519A goodness






Bob is one of the only people that offers Nichia 9080 CRI LED upgrades for Zebras. He has 219b options also. Highly Recommended.

fwiw, the LH351d is a 9050 LED, it is weaker in Red Color Rendering than the 9080 Nichias.


----------



## KITROBASKIN

Slider, how is the beam profile different between the LH351d and the dedomed 519a in a ZL LE? That is, do you think the 519a without dome is a suitable general purpose light, or has quite a bit more throw?


----------



## jon_slider

KITROBASKIN said:


> Slider, how is the beam profile different between the LH351d and the dedomed 519a in a ZL LE? That is, do you think the 519a without dome is a suitable general purpose light, or has quite a bit more throw?


I use 519a dedomed for EDC. the Hotspot is just slightly smaller than 219b, similar to SST-20. Also similar to SSC-P4 in a Novatac...

I dont consider those "too" throwy, Im used to tight, focused, HDS/McGizmo/Malkoff style hotspots. I find them very versatile. Im not a fan of diffused beams, dont use DCFix, and I dont usually EDC a Floody beam. I do like floody beams for headlamps and camp cooking, arms reach tasks.. but I edc a single LED in a conventional reflector.

For dogwalking, you may prefer the domed version, with its slightly larger hotspot. If you like XPL and LH351d hotspot size better than 219b..., then you can leave the dome on 519a, and get a very neutral tint with a larger hotspot, and better Red Color Rendering than LH351d, and less green tint.

I dont own a selection of Zebras to post a beam profile comparison, suggest you ask Bob_McBob.. he probably has one of everything.. lol


----------



## neutralwhite

Ticket status: New

Department: Sales

Subject: ZebraLight, Inc.: Update Tracking #53354

No changes/updates planned for the SC64c LE or UI of any of our lights.

Sincerely,

ZebraLight, Inc.
PO BOX 92307
Southlake, TX 76092


----------



## this_is_nascar

Nice to hear that they're leaving the UI alone.


----------



## AstroTurf

more details on zebralight model A6 appear on their compare all spreadsheet...


----------



## brightasday

Over the years Zebralight has listed a number of "A" models. To the best of my knowledge, not one has ever been released. I think the A6, the latest in the series to be listed on the spreadsheet, has been listed for more than a year now. Because of the history of the other A models, I'm skeptical this one will ever be sold.


----------



## Derek Dean

I've noticed many lights on the ZL website are out of stock, so last week when I saw that theSC53w was back in stock, I jumped on it, and now that it's arrived, I'm really glad I did. Super small and light, absolutely perfect fit and finish, and of course that wonderful ZL UI. 

This little puppy is plenty bright for 99% of my needs, and that lovely .013 lumen moonlight level is just right for my late night bathroom visits, with enough light to navigate, but not so much as to make it difficult to get back to sleep.

Of course the LED, while perfectly centered, has the usual light green/cyan tint, but that was easily corrected with a minus green filter, and the beam profile is quite nice, with a good balance of center spot and fill. The color rendering, once filtered, is still not quite as good as my HI CRI Zebra lights, but it's quite close. 

All-in-all, a near perfect single AA light in my opinion, and highly recommended if and when you can find it in stock.


----------



## Mr. LED

The SC53c does not suffer from the green tint, although it’s discontinued.


----------



## Derek Dean

Mr. LED said:


> The SC53c does not suffer from the green tint, although it’s discontinued.


I'd probably still have needed to filter it, as 4000K is typically a bit warm for my tastes.


----------



## Romanko

Maybe somebody need old


Spoiler: Zebralight SC31w, Zebralight SC60w









WTS [UK] FW3A Glow Gasket, Zebralights, Thrunite and meters | BudgetLightForum.com







budgetlightforum.com


----------



## Duster1671

In the mail today came a SC64w modded with a 3000K 90+ CRI XHP35 HI. This essentially turns the otherwise unappealing (to me) SC64w into a warm white high CRI SC64w HI.

Really incredible beam on this. ~850 lumens on level 12 with quite neutral tint that has almost no shift across the beam. Color rendering is not at 219b level, but a respectable Ra of 90 and R9 of 60.

I'll add some beamshots later...

Edit: "level 12" was "level 10". This makes 850 lumens max...


----------



## Duster1671

This photo was taken with WB at 5000K and is reasonably close to what I see by eye.

As with any comparison of this nature, the differences are magnified by comparing lights side-by-side. This is true for the photo and what I see in person.


----------



## raggie33

zebra needs to change there name to out of stock.com


----------



## E=mAh²

raggie33 said:


> zebra needs to change there name to out of stock.com


I suppose zebra is kinda fitting tho cuz it's just like the real life animal (probably named after the flashlights) in that when they were first discovered by people not native to Africa everybody just thought they were the coolest thing since fruity flavored gum with tattoos on the wrappers (also most likely named after the illumination tools...) 

Untill... One day there was a one less than the day before, then less and less zebras and eventually several hundred/thousand +?? Less... When at one time they were thriving in abundance now not so much... Sounds a little familiar??🤔


----------



## AstroTurf

sounds like covid may still be affecting production...


----------



## this_is_nascar

AstroTurf said:


> sounds like covid may still be affecting production...



Oh, of course. For the next 3 to 5 years, covid is going to be the excuse for absolutely everything. Companies, people and politicians will use it as the primary excuse rather than admit to their incompetence and lack of responsibilities.


----------



## hatman

Any chance of finding an SC51c in good condition?
Mine was stolen by my former dog walker.
Then I watched as she sold much of my collection on eBay, which refused to stop the sales, divulge who purchased my items or help in any way.
The thief confessed to police and was sentenced to make restitution but then didn't for three years.
I loved my 51c.
If I can't find another, could I somehow mod my SC52w to give it roughly the same beautiful tint?
Thanks for any help.


----------



## Bob_McBob

For SC700 enthusiasts, here's a 3500K dedomed XHP70.3. Nice evenly tinted beam and negative Duv throughout the entire output range. A considerable improvement over the original XHP70.2.

H1 M1 L1:

CCT = 3551K (Duv -0.0007)
Color Rendering Index (Ra) = 90.7 [ R9 = 58.7 ]

CCT = 3348K (Duv -0.0009)
Color Rendering Index (Ra) = 93.6 [ R9 = 68.8 ]

CCT = 3343K (Duv -0.0005)
Color Rendering Index (Ra) = 94.1 [ R9 = 70.4 ]00:25 AM


----------



## twistedraven

What is the difference between a dedomed XHP70.3 vs a factory XHP70.3 HI?

Also, where do I send my money?


----------



## Bob_McBob

twistedraven said:


> What is the difference between a dedomed XHP70.3 vs a factory XHP70.3 HI?
> 
> Also, where do I send my money?


The difference is I can produce an LED with a tint like that rather than the 0.0045-0.0060 I've measured from the few available high CRI XHP70.3 HI. Same with XHP50.3 HI. The only issue it's difficult to get much over 4000K through dedoming, so for the SC700 the best options so far are 3500K and 4000K. Plenty of options if you don't mind green tint, but the whole point for me was to get a neutral to rosy tint and clean even beam.

This wasn't intended to be an advertisement, but feel free to PM me. These are a little pricey given the cost of the original light and a new XHP70.3, but it's a pretty huge improvement unless you _really_ don't notice the Cree rainbow on the original light.


----------



## Derek Dean

Nicely done, Bob, but a minus green filter cleans up the beam on my original SC700 just fine, and to be honest I tend to prefer a wider beam profile, but it's nice that you've been able to get your SC700 to where you like it. The SC700 is such a useful light.


----------



## twistedraven

I'm sure there'll eventually be rosy binned XHP70.3 HIs out there eventually. That 5000k dedomed is a little too warm for my tastes. Minus green filters are great as well, but they don't get rid of the CREE rainbows.

I was at one point in time looking at the SC700D as a new EDC workhorse, but I'm waiting for Hank to get 519As in so I can get some dedomed ones in a KR4.

Amazing work though!


----------



## J_C_S

Ordered my first zebralight, an SC64c LE. Any recommendations on battery?


----------



## brachypelma44

J_C_S said:


> Ordered my first zebralight, an SC64c LE. Any recommendations on battery?



Can't go wrong with the Samsung 30Q in my opinion. 3000mAh capacity, 15A continuous discharge.


----------



## AstroTurf

my choice:









18650 Samsung INR18650-35E 3500mAh High Discharge FLAT Top


18650 Samsung INR18650-35E 3500mAh High Discharge FLAT Top




www.illumn.com


----------



## J_C_S

brachypelma44 said:


> Can't go wrong with the Samsung 30Q in my opinion. 3000mAh capacity, 15A continuous discharge.





AstroTurf said:


> my choice:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 18650 Samsung INR18650-35E 3500mAh High Discharge FLAT Top
> 
> 
> 18650 Samsung INR18650-35E 3500mAh High Discharge FLAT Top
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.illumn.com


Thank you both! 

Do they need to be flat top or will buttons work?


----------



## AstroTurf

J_C_S said:


> Thank you both!
> 
> Do they need to be flat top or will buttons work?


buttons might be a bit too long.


----------



## brachypelma44

AstroTurf said:


> my choice:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 18650 Samsung INR18650-35E 3500mAh High Discharge FLAT Top
> 
> 
> 18650 Samsung INR18650-35E 3500mAh High Discharge FLAT Top
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.illumn.com


So, this battery has a slightly higher capacity (better runtime) but only has an 8A continuous discharge. Depending on the draw of your light on the highest setting that you actually use, that may or may not be a problem. Another thing to consider is whether or not that battery will ever be put into other devices in the future, and if those devices are also going to draw 8A or less. Totally depends on your situation.

All of my Zebras seem to work on flat tops. Not sure if button top would fit or not.


----------



## Duster1671

Sanyo NCR18650GA is the way to go, imo. Good fit in the Zebralights, plenty of discharge at 10A, and just about as high capacity as you can get.


----------



## this_is_nascar

Whenever I order a new ZL, I automatically order the red-wrapped flat-top 18650 they sell.


----------



## KITROBASKIN

8A or 10A should be fine. Doubtful anyone could demonstrate impaired performance in everyday use. Test graphs do not always jive with what the eyes perceive. 

It is easy to order a GA from ZL for a decent price.

Illumn is a good choice for purchasing batteries. Orbtronic is another option.


----------



## raggie33

if this help i have both sanyo reds and sony green vtc5a the sonys was brighter in my emisar dv42


----------



## Duster1671

raggie33 said:


> if this help i have both sanyo reds and sony green vtc5a the sonys was brighter in my emisar dv42


Yup, that is a light that will eat as much current as you can feed it. A VTC5A will be brighter than a GA.

Zebralights only draw as much current as the driver needs, so any battery that meets that minimum will work fine.


----------



## brachypelma44

KITROBASKIN said:


> 8A or 10A should be fine. Doubtful anyone could demonstrate impaired performance in everyday use. Test graphs do not always jive with what the eyes perceive.


AFAIK, it depends if the light in question only draws a specific amount of current, or if it will allow more if it's available (in which case you'll get higher output.)

It's also a good thing to think about the future, and what devices that battery will be put in throughout its lifetime, and what their performance might be with the battery in them. There's no such thing as future-proofing, but you can sort of future-resist!


----------



## KITROBASKIN

Any claims that purport to say one (fully charged, good condition) quality battery is effectively brighter in a flashlight than another (fully charged, good condition) quality battery of similar design, is highly likely to be based on sketchy belief unless specific, accurate test equipment is used that reports a *substantial* increase. There is no way a person can discern the difference by looking at the light produced, then removing a battery and inserting another battery and eyeballing the difference. It also simply won't be enough to make any practical difference in actual use. Rapid heating will reduce the brightness soon enough. 

LED/battery technology at this point is pretty evolved. Unless something big pops up, just not sure a battery rated for 8A continuous is going to be a pitiful loser compared to a 10A continuous. It is easy to forget but important to remember that when using flashlights up to maximum levels , they are going to be limited by resistant spring(s) and circuits with internal heat buildup. Now if anyone wants to bring forth solid test data demonstrating this post is erroneous... otherwise we're engaging in mere claptrap. (Apologies if you all are just kind-of chatting-it-up informally)


----------



## J_C_S

Whoa this thing is tiny for an 18650 light! I get the appeal! One question, is it normal when quick pressing once to high for the light to step up quickly from low to high? It’s so fast it’s hard to notice but it seems to step up to high from a lower brightness.


----------



## PoliceScannerMan

That is normal, its low for a bit just in case the light was getting a long press that goes to low.


----------



## Derek Dean

Anybody interested in the two new little lights released by ZL today.... H53c LE and H53Fc LE?


----------



## Pi_is_blue

Already ordered an H53Fc LE!


----------



## PoliceScannerMan

Nichia 519a ZL, give it to us.


----------



## 3oni

J_C_S said:


> Whoa this thing is tiny for an 18650 light!


The size and efficiency of this series are fantastic. 

I actually just picked up an SC64c LE myself, replacing my 2016 SC62w. One thing to note if you're new to ZL, you can switch to one of the other mode groups (G6 or G7) and have total control over the brightness of every mode and sub-mode.

I loathe the way ZL's default setup makes a double-click for medium pass through a burst of high (the first click), so the first thing I always do with mine is change that.  My SC64c LE is set up with click and hold for low, single click for medium, and two clicks for high.


----------



## NutSAK

Derek Dean said:


> Anybody interested in the two new little lights released by ZL today.... H53c LE and H53Fc LE?



Thanks a lot Derek... H53Fc LE on the way. 

 Hopefully it will be a worthy successor to my H52fw. The high CRI is welcome, but I will miss 14500 compatibility.


----------



## AB8XL

I ordered a H53Fc LE too along with a few more 18650's, this will bring my Zebra collection up to 8. Love their lights.


----------



## moozooh

Has anyone noticed that output numbers for H53c LE and H53Fc LE seem to be copied wholesale from their non-LE counterparts? Hard to believe they've matched it precisely for two completely different LEDs with different output specs. Going by the difference between SC64c and SC64c LE which use the same pair of LEDs (Cree XP-L2 and Samsung LH351D respectively), the LE output numbers should be roughly 8% lower.

This should put the numbers at ~254 and ~51 lm for H1 and M1 respectively on the frosty one. Still very good and comparable to H52Fw, mind you. I've already notified ZebraLight's sales department, so just take it as an FYI.

That being said, if anyone has both H53Fc and H53Fc LE, could you post a photo comparison for light quality between the two? Doesn't have to be fancy, just point both of them at a white wall side by side. I'm interested in getting one of them because my H502d turned 10 this year, and I'd like an upgrade, but I'm not sure which of the two would feel better.


----------



## Repsol600rr

OK ZL now make and SC53 LE package and you've got a sale....


----------



## NutSAK

Repsol600rr said:


> OK ZL now make and SC53 LE package and you've got a sale....



According to some second-hand information I've read from the Zebralight sales department, that model will be available in about 1 month.


----------



## Repsol600rr

Excellent. I'd love to see a direct comparison between the SC53c and the SC53c LE whenever that happens. But yeah I'll end up buying it surely.


----------



## Duster1671

NutSAK said:


> Thanks a lot Derek... H53Fc LE on the way.
> 
> Hopefully it will be a worthy successor to my H52fw. The high CRI is welcome, but I will miss 14500 compatibility.


Word on the street is that the H53 works just fine with 14500, the only issue is that if you switch back to a 1.5V battery, the driver will not detect the change and treat it as if it's a depleted li-ion. Perhaps the addition of G6 and G7 used more of the microcontroller's memory, and so they had to drop the auto cell detection.

The workaround is to hold the button down when you tighten the tailcap when switching from li-ion to 1.5V.

ETA: here's where I read it:


----------



## NutSAK

Duster1671 said:


> Word on the street is that the H53 works just fine with 14500, the only issue is that if you switch back to a 1.5V battery, the driver will not detect the change and treat it as if it's a depleted li-ion. Perhaps the addition of G6 and G7 used more of the microcontroller's memory, and so they had to drop the auto cell detection.
> 
> The workaround is to hold the button down when you tighten the tailcap when switching from li-ion to 1.5V.
> 
> ETA: here's where I read it:




Thanks Duster. I had just read the same on another forum a couple of hours ago after I posted above.

Great to know! I will try this as soon as the H53 arrives. I'd have been happy if they'd left the cell detection in and left out G6 and G7, but oddly they didn't ask my opinion!


----------



## this_is_nascar

Repsol600rr said:


> Excellent. I'd love to see a direct comparison between the SC53c and the SC53c LE whenever that happens. But yeah I'll end up buying it surely.



I'm trying to remember the differences between the current SC53c and SC53w.


----------



## AstroTurf

this_is_nascar said:


> I'm trying to remember the differences between the current SC53c and SC53w.


color temp?


----------



## NutSAK

this_is_nascar said:


> I'm trying to remember the differences between the current SC53c and SC53w.


There isn't a current SC53c, but the difference would be CRI. 
In Zebralight terminology, "w" = neutral tint (warm), "c" = high CRI.


----------



## AstroTurf

NutSAK said:


> The difference is CRI.
> In Zebralight terminology, "w" = neutral tint (warm), "c" = high CRI.
> 
> *SC53w:*
> 
> Cree XP-L2 EasyWhite LED
> Nominal CCT 4500K
> Minimum CRI: 80
> 
> 
> *SC53c:*
> 
> Samsung LH351D
> Nominal CCT 4000K
> Color Rendering Index: 90+


current sc53c did not use the samsung lh351d led.


----------



## AstroTurf

Derek Dean said:


> Anybody interested in the two new little lights released by ZL today.... H53c LE and H53Fc LE?


im waiting on an h600 series light.


----------



## NutSAK

AstroTurf said:


> current sc53c did not use the samsung lh351d led.


 
You're correct that the discontinued SC53c didn't have a Samsung emitter, and I've edited my post above. But technically there is no current SC53c. The SC53c LE will have the Samsung emitter.


----------



## AstroTurf

NutSAK said:


> You're right, and I've edited. But, technically there is no "current" SC53c. The difference would still be CRI between "w" and "c".


ok, is that anything like color?


----------



## NutSAK

The color temperature of both would be similar, in the neutral 4000-4500K region. The difference indicated by "c" is in the Color Rendering Index (CRI), or the ability of the emitter to accurately reveal colors faithfully. Zebralights marked with "w" have a CRI of ~80, and those marked with "c" have a higher CRI than the "w" models of the same generation. The SC53c had a Cree emitter with a CRI rating of 93-95, whereas the Samsung emitter used in the "c LE" models has a CRI rating of 90+, both higher than the same model with the "w" designation.

A "d" designation would mean that it is likewise rated at a higher CRI, but also has a higher color temp of ~5000K.









Color rendering index - Wikipedia







en.wikipedia.org


----------



## NutSAK

I'm doing inventory of a couple of my bugout bags this morning. Here is a quick shot of the H50-Q5 headlamps I keep in them--simple, reliable, and compact.


----------



## AstroTurf

NutSAK said:


> I'm doing inventory of a couple of my bugout bags this morning. Here is a quick shot of the H50-Q5 headlamps I keep in them--simple, reliable, and compact.
> 
> View attachment 28801


nice!!!


----------



## NutSAK

While they're out, a quick comparison of some AA models. Back in 2007 I was shocked at how small the H50 was and, honestly, it's still shocking.

Left to right: H50-Q5, H51fw, H52fw, SC52w L2


----------



## Repsol600rr

Yeah the "w" model is 4500k and lower cri. I had one and didnt like it. The old sc52w was glorious to my eyes. The "c" was I think the xpl2 easywhite in 4000k and higher cri with a 93-95 I think cri 2 step binned emitter. I do have this. They haven't made a "d" model since the sc62 and sc52 I think. I have both. Those were 85ish cri 5000k phillips luxeon t emitters. They also made a sc52 and sc62 "c" model that was also 4000k but I don't remember the emitter, never had one.


----------



## NutSAK

Rather than speculate, just go to the comparison spreadsheet on the Zebralight website. All the old models and their specs are there, except for the original H50 and H30.


----------



## this_is_nascar

I'll have to compare each of the beams when I get home tonight. I can usually tell a high CRI light, by shining it on my dresser.


----------



## NutSAK

I received my H53fc LE yesterday. It's a worthy successor to the H52fw, with a slightly lower color temperature and much better color rendition. It may still unofficially support 14500 as has been suggested, but my Keeppower 14500s don't fit length-wise in the battery tube, so I can't test it. It is clearly shorter than the H52. The switch has a better feel and the new headband material seems like a good upgrade too. I think it's a keeper!


----------



## nollij

3oni said:


> The size and efficiency of this series are fantastic.
> 
> I actually just picked up an SC64c LE myself, replacing my 2016 SC62w. One thing to note if you're new to ZL, you can switch to one of the other mode groups (G6 or G7) and have total control over the brightness of every mode and sub-mode.
> 
> I loathe the way ZL's default setup makes a double-click for medium pass through a burst of high (the first click), so the first thing I always do with mine is change that.  My SC64c LE is set up with click and hold for low, single click for medium, and two clicks for high.


If you don’t mind me asking, how exactly did you set that up? It sounds like a worthy bit of reprogramming as I also don’t like getting blasted to get into Medium mode quickly.


----------



## 3oni

nollij said:


> If you don’t mind me asking, how exactly did you set that up? It sounds like a worthy bit of reprogramming as I also don’t like getting blasted to get into Medium mode quickly.


ZL's walkthrough (linked below) is probably better than mine, but I'll take a stab at it. The timing of the double-clicks can sometimes be a bit fussy, but you can't break anything and you only need to do it once. 

From off, 6 clicks to switch to G6.
Turn on the light to the mode or sub-mode you want to program, e.g. double-click to program the default medium mode (which you're going to adjust to be high).
6 double clicks to enter programming for that mode/sub-mode, with a very brief pause between double-clicks. You can pretty much just click 12 times and keep going, because once you're in programming mode a double-click increases brightness so you'll know you did it right. 
Double-click to increase brightness, triple-click to reduce it, stop when it's at the level you like.
Turn the light off.
Repeat steps 2-5 for each mode you want to program.
To set a single click to be medium, you'll just lower the brightness on that mode; then increase the brightness on the two-clicks mode; and finally adjust low (click and hold) to whatever level you like.



https://www.zebralight.com/assets/images/ZebraLightUserGuide2019.pdf


----------



## moozooh

moozooh said:


> Has anyone noticed that output numbers for H53c LE and H53Fc LE seem to be copied wholesale from their non-LE counterparts? Hard to believe they've matched it precisely for two completely different LEDs with different output specs. Going by the difference between SC64c and SC64c LE which use the same pair of LEDs (Cree XP-L2 and Samsung LH351D respectively), the LE output numbers should be roughly 8% lower.
> 
> This should put the numbers at ~254 and ~51 lm for H1 and M1 respectively on the frosty one. Still very good and comparable to H52Fw, mind you. I've already notified ZebraLight's sales department, so just take it as an FYI.


Okay, an update on this since ZL's sales dept got back to me.

According to their response, it's *not the output* that is different (they have indeed designed it to match the non-LE versions), *but the runtimes*. So yeah, those should be proportionally lower then.

I also asked them about the new tech, specifically the UI update that should introduce, among other things, the ability to tone down slow strobe in the high-end lights (because in the current lights it defaults to the H1 output which is so damn bright it renders the feature unusable, and it's a big deal if you want to use them as a bike strobelight or some such). This is indeed still coming, but apparently it fell victim to the same delays that plague A6 and the next-gen SC/H models which were supposed to feature it in the first place.

Hopefully they'll be able to resolve it soon; I'm super interested in what else they've cooked up in the meantime.


----------



## Mr. LED

So which runtime is longer, the new LE or the older version?


----------



## Duster1671

3oni said:


> ZL's walkthrough (linked below) is probably better than mine, but I'll take a stab at it. The timing of the double-clicks can sometimes be a bit fussy, but you can't break anything and you only need to do it once.
> 
> From off, 6 clicks to switch to G6.
> Turn on the light to the mode or sub-mode you want to program, e.g. double-click to program the default medium mode (which you're going to adjust to be high).
> 6 double clicks to enter programming for that mode/sub-mode, with a very brief pause between double-clicks. You can pretty much just click 12 times and keep going, because once you're in programming mode a double-click increases brightness so you'll know you did it right.
> Double-click to increase brightness, triple-click to reduce it, stop when it's at the level you like.
> Turn the light off.
> Repeat steps 2-5 for each mode you want to program.
> To set a single click to be medium, you'll just lower the brightness on that mode; then increase the brightness on the two-clicks mode; and finally adjust low (click and hold) to whatever level you like.
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.zebralight.com/assets/images/ZebraLightUserGuide2019.pdf


Very good crash course on ZL programming.

One tip I'll add—it's easy to make the mistake of trying to enter programming too quickly after switching sub-modes. That first double click will get counted as one of the six to enter programming and you'll wind up all wrapped around the axle.

If you always turn the light on directly to the sub-mode you want to program, the above will never be an issue. (You can also just wait an excessive amount of time after switching sub-modes before going into programming).


----------



## moozooh

Mr. LED said:


> So which runtime is longer, the new LE or the older version?


Older version has slightly longer runtimes (by less than 10%, in theory).


----------



## Nuppet

It's good to see that Zebralight released new lights after three years, and I'm looking forward to new lights with new UI for better strobing (even turn it off completely). It's so very easy to turn on strobing by mistake when in the middle of the night.

I assume that availability of Zebralight flashlights around the world will improve as well.


----------



## Mr. LED

Don’t get your hopes high, they already released new lights now, with the same UI. If more will come, they won’t change the UI.

Strobe is activated with a triple click, and I don’t see how it’s easy to activate it in the middle of the night, since moonlight is a long press on the button (by default). I have never accidentally activated strobe in any situation. I suggest you change the strobe mode to moonlight beacon and leave it there, so in case you accidentally activate it, it won’t blind or startle you while waking up.

To change it, just activate strobe using a triple click, and then double click to cycle through the modes from: low beacon, high mode beacon, slow strobe and fast strobe.
Also, the low beacon will have the output currently set on the low mode, so it can be moonlight (L2) or low (L1). It’s pretty neat.


----------



## 3oni

Mr. LED said:


> I suggest you change the strobe mode to moonlight beacon and leave it there, so in case you accidentally activate it, it won’t blind or startle you while waking up.


Dang, I had no idea you could do this! Thank you. Just changed my SC64c LE to never bug me with strobe again.


----------



## Stefano

NutSAK said:


> I received my H53fc LE yesterday. It's a worthy successor to the H52fw, with a slightly lower color temperature and much better color rendition. It may still unofficially support 14500 as has been suggested, but my Keeppower 14500s don't fit length-wise in the battery tube, so I can't test it. It is clearly shorter than the H52. The switch has a better feel and the new headband material seems like a good upgrade too. I think it's a keeper!


Where did you buy this H53Fc LE ? 
The Zebralight site says it only accepts purchases from US customers. 
I wrote to customer service and they reply that maybe the Dutch NKON could have it in a month or two.


----------



## Nuppet

Mr. LED said:


> Don’t get your hopes high, they already released new lights now, with the same UI. If more will come, they won’t change the UI.
> 
> Strobe is activated with a triple click, and I don’t see how it’s easy to activate it in the middle of the night, since moonlight is a long press on the button (by default). I have never accidentally activated strobe in any situation. I suggest you change the strobe mode to moonlight beacon and leave it there, so in case you accidentally activate it, it won’t blind or startle you while waking up.
> 
> To change it, just activate strobe using a triple click, and then double click to cycle through the modes from: low beacon, high mode beacon, slow strobe and fast strobe.
> Also, the low beacon will have the output currently set on the low mode, so it can be moonlight (L2) or low (L1). It’s pretty neat.



Pretty easy to get to strobe by a double click and a click where the single click is to short after the double click.


----------



## NutSAK

Stefano said:


> Where did you buy this H53Fc LE ?
> The Zebralight site says it only accepts purchases from US customers.
> I wrote to customer service and they reply that maybe the Dutch NKON could have it in a month or two.



I'm in the US.


----------



## Mr. LED

Nuppet said:


> Pretty easy to get to strobe by a double click and a click where the single click is to short after the double click.


Using the standard UI (G5), from off, a double click will turn on medium, then a click will turn it off. I don’t see the point?


----------



## NutSAK

...or click-hold from off to advance through low to medium. If this method is used, it's very unlikely you'll accidentally activate strobe.


----------



## Nuppet

Mr. LED said:


> Using the standard UI (G5), from off, a double click will turn on medium, then a click will turn it off. I don’t see the point?



And then a fast single click will on strobe instead of off. Is that so hard to understand?


----------



## this_is_nascar

3oni said:


> Dang, I had no idea you could do this! Thank you. Just changed my SC64c LE to never bug me with strobe again.



With absolutely no disrespect directed at you, that's seems to be a huge issue with casual ZL users. They criticize the UI, without ever learning its full capabilities.

Regardless, I'm glad this was worked out and you can enjoy your ZL. It's really the best UI I've ever used in a flashlight.


----------



## Mr. LED

Nuppet said:


> And then a fast single click will on strobe instead of off. Is that so hard to understand?


Yes it’s hard. Why would you turn it on medium quickly using a double click, just to turn it off half a second later (and activate strobe)? 

Did you know you can change the strobe to a low beacon, instead?


----------



## 3oni

Mr. LED said:


> Why would you turn it on medium quickly using a double click, just to turn it off half a second later (and activate strobe)?


For me accidental strobe happens most often when I turn the light on with a single click (which I have set as medium brightness) and then double-click "too soon" to switch to my medium sub-mode.

In the years between carrying my first ZL regularly and carrying my new one, I got used to UIs that didn't feature strobe, or which buried it outside of the realm of casual activation. The timing just takes a bit of getting used to, and I'll get used to it again. But in the meantime, switching strobe to low beacon is lovely.


----------



## moozooh

3oni said:


> For me accidental strobe happens most often when I turn the light on with a single click (which I have set as medium brightness) and then double-click "too soon" to switch to my medium sub-mode.


Yeah, this is totally a thing. Not something that happens often, but can cause quite a bit of annoyance when it eventually does.


----------



## Duster1671

this_is_nascar said:


> With absolutely no disrespect directed at you, that's seems to be a huge issue with casual ZL users. They criticize the UI, without ever learning its full capabilities.
> 
> Regardless, I'm glad this was worked out and you can enjoy your ZL. It's really the best UI I've ever used in a flashlight.


This sounds quite like the "you don't like it because you just don't understand it" fallacy.

I, for one, know the ZL interface inside and out and find it significantly flawed in a couple of ways. I've seen plenty of valid criticism from others too with no indication that the critics don't understand the UI.


----------



## Megalamuffin

Does anyone have a new h600c mk4 with the 4000k xhp50.2? If so how do you like it and how is the tint compared to other high cri 4000k emitters? 

I’m thinking of that model to give zebras a try, but still not 100% sure yet.


----------



## Pi_is_blue

Megalamuffin said:


> Does anyone have a new h600c mk4 with the 4000k xhp50.2? If so how do you like it and how is the tint compared to other high cri 4000k emitters?
> 
> I’m thinking of that model to give zebras a try, but still not 100% sure yet.


I have two of the H600c. The beam really isn't the best. It is hard to capture, but the center of the beam is slightly blue, and there is some tint shift from the corona to the spill (which are both rather yellowish). Both of my H600c lights exhibit these beam defects. I used to have the H600Fc variant, and the tint was much more uniform with the frosted lens, though still rather yellowish. 

Some comparisons: 

Armytek Wizard C2 Pro Nichia (4500k) on the left vs. H600c on the right. I should note that by itself, the Armytek has a very slightly yellowish tint, but the H600c really overpowers it.







Next, Emisar DW4 with dedomed 5700k Nichia 519a (should be close to 4000k after the dedome - nice and rosy, very comparable to the Nichia 219b sw40 that I have in several Peaks). 






If only I could get a slightly rosy XHP50.3 HI in the Zebralights...

As for form factor, there is an obvious winner:


----------



## Pi_is_blue

All three lights from above in one shot (left to right: Armytek Wizard Nichia, DW4 Dedomed Nichia 519a, H600c). Quite close to how I see things in real life, and not so favorable for the H600c!


----------



## Megalamuffin

Thanks for the comparisons.


----------



## KITROBASKIN

Very interesting images. Using a wood type horizontal surface with the white wall is really nice for comparisons! But can't help thinking that the xhp50.2 would most likely be "ok" for woods walking and such.


----------



## Pi_is_blue

The H600c is ok outdoors. I have two mainly for mountain biking - I run one on the handlebars and one on my helmet. As long as the tints match between paired lights things are acceptable. I like the wider hotspots so that I don't get tunnel vision (which was an issue with an older H600w mk II that I had). I will say, the XHP50.2 doesn't bring out the reds we have in rocks and soil in Utah nearly as well as the Nichia lights I have.


----------



## Fireclaw18

I wish Zebralight would come out with some new flashlight models.

It's been literally years since they came out with anything new.


----------



## this_is_nascar

Fireclaw18 said:


> I wish Zebralight would come out with some new flashlight models.
> 
> It's been literally years since they came out with anything new.



There's something to be said to the "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" philosophy. That being said, I can see why many want the latest and greatest emitters.

Based on how I use my ZL, the only thing I'd want new or different is an optional magnetic tailcap. Sure, it will at a few mm to the overall length, but it would be worth it, to me. That would totally be an optional accessory and wouldn't change the light offering in any way.


----------



## Megalamuffin

I ordered an sc64c le as my first zebra. If I end up liking it there may be more modes in the future. I want to like them so I can consolidate my amount of lights in a significant way.

Has anyone used samsung 35e batteries in the sc64? The specs seem to check out for fitment and I have a bunch of them so I didn’t buy the batteries zebra sells.

Also, I noticed the voltage range for the sc64c le goes up to 6v. Are two cr123’s too long to fit?


----------



## Fireclaw18

"If it ain broke don't fix it?" .... well, the SC64 is by no means perfect. There's plenty of room for improvement, such as:

SC64 host is very slippery. Replace the smooth body with knurling. Keep the light the same size.
Deep carry clip. There are deep carry clip options available from 3rd party sellers, but perhaps Zebralight can come up with something better.
Thicker lens. The SC64 lens is extremely thin. It would be nice to have a thicker, more durable lens option.
Emitter. All the emitters offered by Zebralight are quite old. Even the LH351D in the SC64 LE is old. It might be nice to have a selection of more modern emitters. For those who like lumens and throw, perhaps SFT-40. For those who like high-CRI, perhaps 519a.
Onboard charging. This one isn't for everyone, but it is sometimes a nice feature to have. Supposedly the SC65 will have it, but the SC65 seems to be vaporware. Meanwhile, Zebralight hasn't come out with a new product other than just minor emitter changes for something like 4 or 5 years now.


----------



## ieslei

Hi guys! Sorry to interrupt any on going subject but I really want another zebra and I am in between two emitters H53c LE NW and H53w. One uses xp-l2 easywhite and the other lh351d.... I have one sc64w HI and love it so much, the tint is perfect for me. I know the Samsung's is warmer but wich one is closer to 64w HI? Please, give me some light....


----------



## Mr. LED

SC64w HI is kinda unique, very nice tint without any shift. XP-L2 is most of the time greenish with a big shift, and LE is warmer but high CRI, no shift. I would go for the LE.


----------



## ieslei

Mr. LED said:


> SC64w HI is kinda unique, very nice tint without any shift. XP-L2 is most of the time greenish with a big shift, and LE is warmer but high CRI, no shift. I would go for the LE.


One vote for the Samsung. Thank you. I have a manker e02 ll that has sst20, maybe the Samsung's is closer to that.


----------



## AstroTurf

of the two you mentioned...

H53c LE NW


----------



## Megalamuffin

My first zebralight has arrived and I’m thrilled with it. It’s incredible how small this is for an 18650 light, it’s more like a beefy aa.


----------



## Megalamuffin

After messing with the zebra I’ve realized how amazing this UI is, and now have G6 set up just how I want it. What an awesome light.


----------



## this_is_nascar

Megalamuffin said:


> My first zebralight has arrived and I’m thrilled with it. It’s incredible how small this is for an 18650 light, it’s more like a beefy aa.
> 
> View attachment 29829
> View attachment 29830



I like how dark that one is.


----------



## Romanko

Some more were discontinued.
SC600Fc IV Plus, H600w Mk IV, H600F Mk IV, SC53w


----------



## Mr. LED

New models should come, sometime.


----------



## Megalamuffin

The sc64 has been carried every day since I got it. It’s an incredibly good light and I’m sold on zebras now.

I was thinking of buying the sc5w mk II but now they aren’t available. I could have sworn they were available a couple weeks ago?


----------



## Burgess

Zebralight SC-700 is Wonderful !

Anyone know of a RipOFFS belt holster
that would fit this flashlight ? ? ?






Flashlight Holsters – Ripoffs







ripoffs.com





Thank You


----------



## PoliceScannerMan

We need a ZL with 519a, would be heavenly.


----------



## id30209

PoliceScannerMan said:


> We need a ZL with 519a, would be heavenly.


I modded one LE with 519A 5700K but i didn't took it with me on a trip.
I'll post a photo or two when i get back home.
R9080 and throwier than 351D...


----------



## Megalamuffin

id30209 said:


> I modded one LE with 519A 5700K but i didn't took it with me on a trip.
> I'll post a photo or two when i get back home.
> R9080 and throwier than 351D...



Roughly how much output do you lose with the 519a?


----------



## neutralwhite

id30209 said:


> I modded one LE with 519A 5700K but i didn't took it with me on a trip.
> I'll post a photo or two when i get back home.
> R9080 and throwier than 351D...


thanks


----------



## Mr. LED

Burgess said:


> Zebralight SC-700 is Wonderful !
> 
> Anyone know of a RipOFFS belt holster
> that would fit this flashlight ? ? ?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Flashlight Holsters – Ripoffs
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ripoffs.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thank You


Hi, I tested my SC700 here and it fits a 6P holster, two different brands (Surefire and Solarforce holsters). SC700 is a tad shorter than a 6P but it’s OK. If you use the clip, maybe it will but very snug, but doable. I hope it helps.


----------



## id30209

Megalamuffin said:


> Roughly how much output do you lose with the 519a?


None...it's a bit throwier unlike stock 351D but if you remove the dome also it becomes even more throwier, all the light coming out is concentrated in a hotspot.


----------



## Megalamuffin

id30209 said:


> None...it's a bit throwier unlike stock 351D but if you remove the dome also it becomes even more throwier, all the light coming out is concentrated in a hotspot.



The 519 is less efficient than the 351d right? Would runtimes be a little shorter?


----------



## id30209

Megalamuffin said:


> The 519 is less efficient than the 351d right? Would runtimes be a little shorter?


Trust me, if you will use it as it was meant to be, an EDC gear and not Lab test equipment, you won't notice and i mean any slight difference in runtimes...


----------



## Megalamuffin

id30209 said:


> Trust me, if you will use it as it was meant to be, an EDC gear and not Lab test equipment, you won't notice and i mean any slight difference in runtimes...



That’s good enough for me, thanks. More than likely at some point I’ll have a 519 put in my sc64c.


----------



## Outdoorsman5

Romanko said:


> Some more were discontinued.
> SC600Fc IV Plus, H600w Mk IV, H600F Mk IV, SC53w


I hope more/new zebra’s are coming out. Does anyone know for sure? I’ve been watching their list of lights dwindle down to the few that are left on their website. I’d love to see if anyone knows more. Thanks!


----------



## ieslei

Mr. LED said:


> SC64w HI is kinda unique, very nice tint without any shift. XP-L2 is most of the time greenish with a big shift, and LE is warmer but high CRI, no shift. I would go for the LE.


My h53c LE NW has arrived. I am I little bit disappointed by the tint indoors, but I guess I won't notice it outdoors. The sc64w hi is outstanding, VERY UNIQUE INDEED. The LE is a bit greenish in comparison, even compared to SST20.


----------



## holygeez03

It seems like a lot of Zebralight models are discontinued... especially concerning is the H53w/Fw... is something going to replace it?


----------



## AstroTurf

holygeez03 said:


> It seems like a lot of Zebralight models are discontinued... especially concerning is the H53w/Fw... is something going to replace it?


already has...

the h53c le, and h53fc le


----------



## ieslei

holygeez03 said:


> It seems like a lot of Zebralight models are discontinued... especially concerning is the H53w/Fw... is something going to replace it?


That is weird though..... I emailed them asking if they intent to launch a new AA headlamp this year and they said they will keep with the h53c and h53fc for now. That was essential for me to decide whether to buy or not.


----------



## ieslei

I was wondering if these limited editions will be out there only untill they come up with a replacement, and it is limited because they intend to replaced it very soon... Why call a product a LE... What makes it limited? Just wondering....


----------



## Mr. LED

Limited supply of emitters, when they’re gone, they’re gone. That happened to the HI editions, although they were not called limited.


----------



## ieslei

Mr. LED said:


> Limited supply of emitters, when they’re gone, they’re gone. That happened to the HI editions, although they were not called limited.


Wow. Thanks. That also means there won't be HI anymore? I didn't know that. The sc64w hi was there for a good time though, and I simply love mine.... Hopefully they make another sc64w ou sc65 with an updated HI Led.
Cheers


----------



## Mr. LED

No, all HI lights were discontinued.


----------



## ieslei

Mr. LED said:


> No, all HI lights were discontinued.


No kidding?! That is too much for me to handle right now.... 😩


----------



## holygeez03

AstroTurf said:


> already has...
> 
> the h53c le, and h53fc le


Considering a Limited Edition model as a replacement doesn't really make sense to me.

I hope the H54Fw is coming...


----------



## Mr. LED

Exactly, and knowing companies as I’ve worked for many, they just used emitters from the SC64w LE edition when they ran out of LEDs for SC and H53 models. So no need to introduce a new 54 model, yet. Or ever.


----------



## ieslei

holygeez03 said:


> Considering a Limited Edition model as a replacement doesn't really make sense to me.
> 
> I hope the H54Fw is coming...


I was just thinking about why call this version LE. Compared to the previous model this one has a different LED(not the most efficient, currently), it lacks of 14500 support. And for these differences It might not be out there for long... I didn't considered that the emitter supply was limited...


----------



## Luminesce

Question about the Sanyo NCR18650GA 3500mAh 10A 18650 Li-ion Flat Top battery that Zebralight sells. I bought two of them in 2021 for my SC600. Didn't use the light much over the next year, preferred another lighter model as my EDC at the time. 

I charged the batteries about a month ago as I was now using the SC600 more often and wanted to have two fully charged batts ready to go. Both charged up to ~3400 mAh, the voltage for both batts was the same after charging and I tried them out, one works just fine but the light will not work with the other batt.

I decided to try the batts on a 18650 laser I have and both work well. What may be the cause of the light not working with one of the batts? They both are pretty much brand new, doubt if I had charged them more than twice over the course of a year. For now I'll keep the problem batt in the laser but it would be nice to find out what prevents the SC600 from working with that one batt, any ideas?


----------



## Mr. LED

Check the positive flat top contact, is it bent inwards? When the light is dropped it may get bent and prevent contact.


----------



## Luminesce

Mr. LED said:


> Check the positive flat top contact, is it bent inwards? When the light is dropped it may get bent and prevent contact.


Yes, it was the 1st thing I looked at. I'd read the report in this thread about someone damaging their battery so I was aware of that possibility. But I've never dropped the battery or light. Measured my two batts and everything is the same length wise.

When I get some new batts I'll compare them to what I now have and see if there is even a tiny difference. For now the batt that won't work in the light will be relegated to just powering my laser pointer where it works just fine.

BTW, what other brand of battery can I use in my SC600w IV light, anyone have one that works well?


----------



## holygeez03

Luminesce said:


> Yes, it was the 1st thing I looked at. I'd read the report in this thread about someone damaging their battery so I was aware of that possibility. But I've never dropped the battery or light. Measured my two batts and everything is the same length wise.
> 
> When I get some new batts I'll compare them to what I now have and see if there is even a tiny difference. For now the batt that won't work in the light will be relegated to just powering my laser pointer where it works just fine.
> 
> BTW, what other brand of battery can I use in my SC600w IV light, anyone have one that works well?



It's been years since I researched 18650 cells... The Sanyo cell you are using is probably the most common, but as I recall the Sony VTC6 and Samsung 30Q are great options.

A quick search shows a Sony VC7 and a Samsung 35E... I know nothing about them but I am assuming they are newer versions with higher capacity.


----------



## Romanko

Miracle!!!
SC600w IV Plus HI, Cree XHP50.3 HI.


----------



## PoliceScannerMan

Sounds pretty good!


----------



## PoliceScannerMan

Just in case ZL looks at this thread, SC64 and SC600 with Nichia 519a 5000K dedome would be the end all of ZL's, perfection!


----------



## jon_slider

PoliceScannerMan said:


> SC64 and SC600 with Nichia 519a 5000K dedome would be the end all of ZL's, perfection!


it can be yours:


----------



## PoliceScannerMan

Take my money!!


----------



## SYZYGY

i have some 519As coming hopefully today. looking forward to putting a 3500K dedome in my sc64c LE.


----------



## PoliceScannerMan

5000K dedome is fantastic, @kerneldrop made me a P60 with one.


----------



## SYZYGY

modded mine last night, and it's my new favorite flashlight.

beam shot of three modded sc64 and a stock d4v2:







left to right:

sc64w hi (high cri 4000K 90+ XHP35 HI, bob)
sc64c le (Nichia 219B R9080 sw35 3500K, bob)
*sc64c le (Nichia 519A R9080 sm353 3500K M400 L5 dedomed, me)*
d4v2 (Nichia 519A R9080 sm353 3500K dedomed, stock from hank)


----------



## jon_slider

beautiful photo, congrats on your DD3500K
you have some great options
The floortiles second from left, look nicest to me


----------



## bmo

Been out of the Zebralight handheld game for a long time, almost a decade now. Used to own an SC52w and SC62w and really loved them at the time, but ended up selling them as I had an obsession with tailswitches for handhelds for some reason. Additionally, the Zebralight tailswitch model never materialized as far as I know, so that ultimately led me to sell the SC52 and SC62 (though I regret not keeping the latter). Still own one of their headlamps, an H600fw mkII, which I still use quite often but it has some quirks. Namely a mushy switch and not the famous tactile clicky that ZL's were known for and the light will intermittently step down immediately from H1 for some reason.

At any rate, now I'm back and glad I jumped back in. Grabbed an SC5c II LE, SC64c LE, and the SC700d recently. The output on these things is really impressive compared to their older counterparts and absolutely love the tint on the LE models. Really missed the ZL UI on a handheld. I see that ZL's anodizing is a lot more consistent these days as well. I remember it used to be a crapshoot as to which shade of grey you'd get lol. The SC700d is really impressive for how small it is. I always wanted an S6330 when they were still making them because of the output and relatively small size (at the time), but it was still a little too chunky for my taste. I'll probably grab that SC600w IV Plus HI whenever it releases along with maybe one of their AA headlamps. Good to be back


----------



## holygeez03

bmo said:


> I'll probably grab that SC600w IV Plus HI whenever it releases along with maybe one of their AA headlamps. Good to be back



I didn't think the HI models were coming back? The SC600w Plus is probably my most used light at this point and I like it way more than HI model. I compared the SC600w Plus and HI directly and the Plus beam was far more useful in my opinion... my eyes could not tell any significant different in the HI throw, just narrower beam.

The SC64w makes more sense in the HI version to me, which I also have. The combination of SC600w Plus, SC64w HI, and H53Fc pretty much covers all my needs.


----------



## bmo

holygeez03 said:


> I didn't think the HI models were coming back? The SC600w Plus is probably my most used light at this point and I like it way more than HI model. I compared the SC600w Plus and HI directly and the Plus beam was far more useful in my opinion... my eyes could not tell any significant different in the HI throw, just narrower beam.
> 
> The SC64w makes more sense in the HI version to me, which I also have. The combination of SC600w Plus, SC64w HI, and H53Fc pretty much covers all my needs.


The SC600w IV Plus HI was listed on their spreadsheet as coming out "very soon" so I didn't have any reason to doubt it. Been out of the game a long time so maybe things changed, but the spreadsheet looked like it was updated somewhat recently as of last month.

The HI just sounded pretty interesting to me and have never owned a HI variant so wanted to try it.


----------



## holygeez03

bmo said:


> The SC600w IV Plus HI was listed on their spreadsheet as coming out "very soon" so I didn't have any reason to doubt it. Been out of the game a long time so maybe things changed, but the spreadsheet looked like it was updated somewhat recently as of last month.
> 
> The HI just sounded pretty interesting to me and have never owned a HI variant so wanted to try it.



I don't follow things too closely these days either, but I was under the impression the HI models were discontinued... maybe ZL found a source and plans to bring back the SC600 HI.

Like I said, I was much more impressed with the overall output and beam of the Plus and did not see significant additional LUX from the SC600 HI over the plus.


----------



## AstroTurf

bmo said:


> Been out of the Zebralight handheld game for a long time, almost a decade now. Used to own an SC52w and SC62w and really loved them at the time, but ended up selling them as I had an obsession with tailswitches for handhelds for some reason. Additionally, the Zebralight tailswitch model never materialized as far as I know, so that ultimately led me to sell the SC52 and SC62 (though I regret not keeping the latter). Still own one of their headlamps, an H600fw mkII, which I still use quite often but it has some quirks. Namely a mushy switch and not the famous tactile clicky that ZL's were known for and the light will intermittently step down immediately from H1 for some reason.
> 
> At any rate, now I'm back and glad I jumped back in. Grabbed an SC5c II LE, SC64c LE, and the SC700d recently. The output on these things is really impressive compared to their older counterparts and absolutely love the tint on the LE models. Really missed the ZL UI on a handheld. I see that ZL's anodizing is a lot more consistent these days as well. I remember it used to be a crapshoot as to which shade of grey you'd get lol. The SC700d is really impressive for how small it is. I always wanted an S6330 when they were still making them because of the output and relatively small size (at the time), but it was still a little too chunky for my taste. I'll probably grab that SC600w IV Plus HI whenever it releases along with maybe one of their AA headlamps. Good to be back
> 
> View attachment 31181


a very nice welcome back lineup!!!


----------



## bmo

Couldn't find any diffusers specifically for the SC700d so went ahead and designed a quick and dirty one myself, then printed it out on my 3D printer. Should be great for camping and such. Works perfect with any of the medium or lower modes, but I think with the high modes it may warp it after awhile, though haven't actually tested it (used PETG filament). I don't see myself using the diffuser with any of the high modes anyway.






ETA: posted the model here if anyone has a 3D printer and wants to make one for themselves
https://www.printables.com/model/265752-zebralight-sc700d-flashlight-cone-diffuser


----------



## kerneldrop

SYZYGY said:


> modded mine last night, and it's my new favorite flashlight.
> 
> beam shot of three modded sc64 and a stock d4v2:
> *sc64c le (Nichia 519A R9080 sm353 3500K M400 L5 dedomed, me)*


Very Nice!
What tool did you use to remove the bezel? 
All this ZL talk has me wanting to order an sc64c le
I'd want to crack it open and swap the LED.

I think Bob uses a convex wood carving tool?


----------



## SYZYGY

kerneldrop said:


> Very Nice!
> What tool did you use to remove the bezel?
> All this ZL talk has me wanting to order an sc64c le
> I'd want to crack it open and swap the LED.
> 
> I think Bob uses a convex wood carving tool?



thanks!

i ground down the handle of some random steel spudger tool. i can give you more detailed measurements of it if you want, but you can probably judge from the pics. you can probably make a tool out of almost anything e.g. the handle of an old piece of silverware.






i posted about it here in more detail:






[MOD] Zebralight SC64c emitter swaps | BudgetLightForum.com







budgetlightforum.com


----------



## SYZYGY

what emitter are you thinking of using?


----------



## kerneldrop

SYZYGY said:


> what emitter are you thinking of using?



That tool worked out well. 
I looked at the link...good job for sure. 
Not many mod the ZL. 

If I went with one today I'd say 219b 4500k. 
Maybe XHP35.2 90CRI 4500k if the ZL driver can get the lumens that high.
I have 519a, but my 219b need a place to go. 

I'd use a hot air station with the small nozzle and see what happens.


----------



## PoliceScannerMan

The Wizard has spoken.


----------



## Burgess

Yesterday I received (from ZebraLight) my new
H600Fc Mk IV 18650 XHP50.2 headlamp.

Try as I might, I simply just CANNOT manage
to get it to program/re-program ANY level at all !
Not G5, nor G6/G7 modes ! < sigh >

I own several ZebraLight models,
which I've successfully programmed to my tastes.

But THIS one just WILL NOT let me !
  

Is it DEFECTIVE ? ? ?

What could I possibly be over-looking here ?
Any IDEAS ? ? ?


_


----------



## Mr. LED

Did you try removing the battery, clicking the button to discharge any capacitors and reinstalling the battery? Or resetting the G5, G6 and G7 programs? (G5 15 clicks from off, G6 18 clicks and G7 21 clicks).

If it doesn’t work, I would say it’s defective.


----------



## Burgess

Thank You for your suggestions.

Just tried 'em all,
but (alas), without any success.


_


----------



## Mr. LED

Bummer


----------



## FAAbUlights

The new SC600w mkIV Plus Hi with the new XHP 50.3 Hi emitter is available for pre-order on Zebralights website. Just placed my order.


----------



## WebHobbit

That does look tempting


----------



## bmo

FAAbUlights said:


> The new SC600w mkIV Plus Hi with the new XHP 50.3 Hi emitter is available for pre-order on Zebralights website. Just placed my order.



Thanks for the heads up! Placed a preorder


----------



## id30209

I have one with better emitter for 6months now. Unfortunately yellow ugly corona is still there, not so much visible but it’s there.
Not so impressed. I’ll be waiting for real update like MkV.
Atm i have 6xSC600 MkIV with different Cree emitters and they all are meh.
The best of them all is with XHP50.3 HI 5700K 90CRI where yellow corona is the least visible with almost perfect white hotspot


----------



## this_is_nascar

FAAbUlights said:


> The new SC600w mkIV Plus Hi with the new XHP 50.3 Hi emitter is available for pre-order on Zebralights website. Just placed my order.



Order placed. Thanks for the heads-up.


----------



## this_is_nascar

this_is_nascar said:


> Order placed. Thanks for the heads-up.



Well, if this is in fact, a pre-order vs. ZL having a product ready to ship in the next day or two, I'm not sure I appreciate the CC getting charged right away, rather than waiting until it's available to ship.


----------



## PoliceScannerMan

Order placed, don't need it, but why not.


----------



## Duster1671

id30209 said:


> I have one with better emitter for 6months now. Unfortunately yellow ugly corona is still there, not so much visible but it’s there.
> Not so impressed. I’ll be waiting for real update like MkV.
> Atm i have 6xSC600 MkIV with different Cree emitters and they all are meh.
> The best of them all is with XHP50.3 HI 5700K 90CRI where yellow corona is the least visible with almost perfect white hotspot


It sounds like the XHP50.3 HI in 4500K is not as nice tint as the XHP35 HI found in the SC64w HI and SC600w HI. Is that correct?


----------



## id30209

Duster1671 said:


> It sounds like the XHP50.3 HI in 4500K is not as nice tint as the XHP35 HI found in the SC64w HI and SC600w HI. Is that correct?


XHP35 is a different emitter than XHP50.3 and all my HI's with XHP35 are amazing. XHP50.2 is terrible but 50.3 is a bit of a lottery...


----------



## ieslei

But there is no output specifications yet.... 🤔


----------



## FAAbUlights

this_is_nascar said:


> Well, if this is in fact, a pre-order vs. ZL having a product ready to ship in the next day or two, I'm not sure I appreciate the CC getting charged right away, rather than waiting until it's available to ship.


Yea…I had the same reaction when I saw the charge hit my CC shortly after placing the order. Normally that means an order has shipped or is in stock and shipping. It’s Zebralight so I’m ok with it, but I wasn’t expecting to be charged until it shipped since that’s the general standard. 

I’m like policescannerman. I don’t need it but why not. Its the latest model and I want to check out the beam profile of this new emitter in the SC600 reflector.


----------



## Outdoorsman5

I wanted to drop in to let my fellow CPF’ers know the good news as well, but you all beat me to it. I just pre-ordered the new HI light (hope it's great). I noticed the beam profile is a bit different from the previous SC600w HI. The new light is 80*9*; whereas, the older version was 80*8*. This is due to the larger LED, I'm sure. So, it might mean the new version won't be as throwy, but with the added lumens, it prolly won't matter much. We will see.

I've been visiting ZL's website once in a while over the past couple of years just to see if anymore lights get discontinued. I've been shocked by seeing light after light get the axe (some of their VERY best lights too.) I've also been worried for a while that they were quietly going out of business. Today is really good news for us fans - that they have finally listed a new light for sale. Hopefully we will see more of this, and HOPEFULLY we will see an SC700 HI version one day...one day!!!


----------



## radellaf

PoliceScannerMan said:


> Order placed, don't need it, but why not.



Money?

I've been kind of wondering about the slowly going out of business thing, too. I did just get my repaired SC53 from them... after like 5 months on slow boats to China for repair.

I'll bite on the pre-order. My HI is a Mk III, so the upgrade is kinda worth it. I'll get a GA battery, too, even if it's $9 (on sale!) there vs the usual $7.


----------



## PoliceScannerMan

$100 doesn't get you much these days, great value here IMO.


----------



## radellaf

PoliceScannerMan said:


> $100 doesn't get you much these days, great value here IMO.


Depends on your income, of course. $100 isn't huge to me, but it's not pocket change.
Buys 3-4 weeks groceries for me, or a pretty good order for my fountain pen hobby.

ZL is a decent value. I consider them pricey but worth it. The upgrade is... not that significant, so a pretty poor "value" for the amount of upgrade. But, it is significant enough at $100 for me to order it without much deliberation, though, so there ya go. Supporting ZL is also something that matters to me as they are pretty much my favorite flashlight maker, tho Lumintop comes close.

I'll take it there is no word as to when the new model might ship, of course. Late Nov would be cool with me.


----------



## this_is_nascar

Anyone actually know when the product is due to be shipped?


----------



## FAAbUlights

this_is_nascar said:


> Anyone actually know when the product is due to be shipped?


I sent an inquiry and they replied back to me yesterday. Their reply:

“We expect to receive a shipment of SC600w IV Plus HI from China in about 3-4 weeks.”


----------



## PoliceScannerMan

Dang, so Oct 6-15th to us, approx.


----------



## FAAbUlights

PoliceScannerMan said:


> Dang, so Oct 6-15th to us, approx.


That’s about what I expect.


----------



## this_is_nascar

PoliceScannerMan said:


> Dang, so Oct 6-15th to us, approx.



Oh wow. Would have been nice to have known that upfront. I know it's a pre-order, but damn.


----------



## this_is_nascar

FAAbUlights said:


> I sent an inquiry and they replied back to me yesterday. Their reply:
> 
> “We expect to receive a shipment of SC600w IV Plus HI from China in about 3-4 weeks.”



Thanks. That blows.


----------



## PoliceScannerMan

My SC600w MKIV Plus HI shipped!


----------



## this_is_nascar

PoliceScannerMan said:


> My SC600w MKIV Plus HI shipped!



Mine too. Just got the notice.


----------



## FAAbUlights

PoliceScannerMan said:


> My SC600w MKIV Plus HI shipped!


Mine too!


----------



## Burgess

Tell me, please --

I have the WONDERFUL Zebralight SC64c LE.

What's the difference with the SC600w MKIV Plus HI ? ? ?

< me dumb >

Edited to add:
Somehow, I think your answers are gonna' convince me
to purchase yet another Zebralight flashlight . . . . .
 
_


----------



## kerneldrop

Burgess said:


> Tell me, please --
> 
> I have the WONDERFUL Zebralight SC64c LE.
> 
> What's the difference with the SC600w MKIV Plus HI ? ? ?
> 
> < me dumb >
> 
> Edited to add:
> Somehow, I think your answers are gonna' convince me
> to purchase yet another Zebralight flashlight . . . . .
> 
> _



Way more lumens


----------



## OkestEngineer

Mine shipped too. Ordered three. Strange, their free shipping is so fast, I wouldn’t be surprised if it shows up tomorrow.


----------



## PoliceScannerMan

Last few Zebra's I have bought, the "shipping label created, not in system" lasted about a week. This shipment however is already on the move.


----------



## this_is_nascar

It's lovely.....


----------



## PoliceScannerMan

Oh Dang nice! How is the beam?


----------



## Mr. LED

Beamshots or it didn’t happen!


----------



## OkestEngineer

Mine are out for delivery. I feel like a little kid with excitement…


----------



## this_is_nascar

Not a big pic guy, but this shows the Plus Hi on the the right and the Plus on the left. Both set to there dimmest brightness setting.

Yes, the Plus Hi really does have that much less yellow in the beam.


----------



## SYZYGY

wow, looks great

does xhp70.3 hi exist?
they should make a sc700d hi


----------



## PoliceScannerMan

Awesome, any green in the tint?


----------



## this_is_nascar

Plus Hi on the right. Brightness level-3, WB set to 4900k on phone. Sorry, taking pics is not in my wheelhouse.


----------



## Mr. LED

Any chance anyone can compare it to SC600w IV HI and/or SC64w HI?


----------



## this_is_nascar

Mr. LED said:


> Any chance anyone can compare it to SC600w IV HI and/or SC64w HI?



Different sized bezels.


----------



## FAAbUlights

this_is_nascar said:


> Different sized bezels.


Interesting…I thought the bezel on the discontinued SC600w mk IV HI would be the same size as the new SC600w mk IV Plus HI. 

The new Plus HI bezel is obviously larger than the SC64w hi, but I am interested to see the beam comparison that that one as well. 

Mine was supposed to be here today, but USPS must have dropped the ball. Expected delivery date is still today, but never made it to “out for delivery” status. I’m going to guess it will be tomorrow now.


----------



## kerneldrop

dang that does look nice. I'll have to order one.


----------



## OkestEngineer

SC600w on left, SC64W on right


----------



## this_is_nascar

FAAbUlights said:


> Interesting…I thought the bezel on the discontinued SC600w mk IV HI would be the same size as the new SC600w mk IV Plus HI.
> 
> The new Plus HI bezel is obviously larger than the SC64w hi, but I am interested to see the beam comparison that that one as well.
> 
> Mine was supposed to be here today, but USPS must have dropped the ball. Expected delivery date is still today, but never made it to “out for delivery” status. I’m going to guess it will be tomorrow now.



All SC600 series lights have the same bezel size. All SC64 series lights have the same bezel size. The bezel on the 600s are larger than the bezel on the 64s.

My comment was made based on your request to compare a 600 to a 64.


----------



## Mr. LED

Yes, that we know. What we want to know, is how the throw compares between this HI version, to the older HI versions (SC64w HI and SC600w IV HI).


----------



## kerneldrop

Mr. LED said:


> Yes, that we know. What we want to know, is how the throw compares between this HI version, to the older HI versions (SC64w HI and SC600w IV HI).



What LEDs are in them ?


----------



## Mr. LED

XHP35 HI


----------



## this_is_nascar

Mr. LED said:


> Yes, that we know. What we want to know, is how the throw compares between this HI version, to the older HI versions (SC64w HI and SC600w IV HI).



Larger reflector usually to mean more throw. Maybe someone will post.


----------



## id30209

SYZYGY said:


> wow, looks great
> 
> does xhp70.3 hi exist?
> they should make a sc700d hi








Yes…diy
XHP70.3HI 6500K 80CRI
Nichia 519A sm573 dedomed
47 Turbo with domed Nichia 519A sm573


----------



## FAAbUlights

Show off ^^^


----------



## SYZYGY

id30209 said:


> Yes…diy
> XHP70.3HI 6500K 80CRI



nice one! i want to do it to my sc700d.

any particular reason you went with 6500K? just asking in case you have an opinion about the range of 70.3HI offerings. simply preferring cold temps is a fine answer, though.

this is the only report i've seen of someone taking one apart:






<< Lume X1: 40W Single-Cell Boost Driver with Anduril2 and UDR >> | BudgetLightForum.com







budgetlightforum.com









<< Lume X1: 40W Single-Cell Boost Driver with Anduril2 and UDR >> | BudgetLightForum.com







budgetlightforum.com





any tips to share beyond that? seems like removing the bezel and desoldering the main board from the cathode-spring board are the main challenges. reflowing sounds possibly annoying too without a preheater since its pads are on both the pcb and the copper block. can't just reflow it by heating the copper block alone.


----------



## id30209

SYZYGY said:


> nice one! i want to do it to my sc700d.
> 
> any particular reason you went with 6500K? just asking in case you have an opinion about the range of 70.3HI offerings. simply preferring cold temps is a fine answer, though.
> 
> this is the only report i've seen of someone taking one apart:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> << Lume X1: 40W Single-Cell Boost Driver with Anduril2 and UDR >> | BudgetLightForum.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> budgetlightforum.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> << Lume X1: 40W Single-Cell Boost Driver with Anduril2 and UDR >> | BudgetLightForum.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> budgetlightforum.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> any tips to share beyond that? seems like removing the bezel and desoldering the main board from the cathode-spring board are the main challenges. reflowing sounds possibly annoying too without a preheater since its pads are on both the pcb and the copper block. can't just reflow it by heating the copper block alone.


This SC700 is not mine, i just did emitter swap for it’s owner. 
I had 2 of these emitters just for testing and to my surprise the owner decided to go with that temp. Once lighted up i was left in WOW.
This specific emitter is the first Cree XHP70 (all gens) that don’t have any hint of ugly yellow corona. Yes, even XHP50/70.3 have it 

About modding, nothing else to add what Loneocean haven’t said it. Maybe that i’m using 20$ hot air gun instead of hotplate(?)


----------



## markr6

I'm hurtin for some new ZL action. I wish they would come out with some new stuff. But honestly, there's not much room for improvement. I'm still happy with my current collection.


----------



## Romanko

markr6 said:


> But honestly, there's not much room for improvement.


Release Q50, update SC80 and make 2*AA side by side.


----------



## Outdoorsman5

I received my new SC600w IV Plus HI (3 of them). The beam profile is almost identical to the smaller SC64w HI (discontinued light) with one more higher output mode (around 2400 lumens I'd guess --- as of the writing of this, Zebralight has not yet posted outputs for each level.) ZL's website says the beam type is 80 degree spill and 9 degree hot spot. I'd say it's really 80 degree spill and 10 degree hotspot like the SC64w HI. The older SC600w IV HI beam profile, by the way, was/is 80 degree spill and 8 degree hotspot, and I'm pretty sure the smaller SC64w HI was/is 80 degree spill and 10 degree hotspot (both are 2 of the greatest lights ever made to me and my son for the last decade+!!)

The older SC600w IV HI has a tighter and more throwy beam, but it tops out at 1400 lumens (still really great though). Comparing the the highest output of the older SC600w IV HI on max (1400 lum) to the new SC600w IV Plus HI on max (around 2400 lumens), the throw is a similar distance between the two lights since the newer model is a decent amount brighter, plus the overall spill is brighter too on the newer model. Some might like the older model (a little bit more) for the more throwy hotspot with less of a blinding spill (trail hiking/running for instance), and some will like that this new light has a little bit more flood than the older model with admirable throw (similar to the SC64w HI.)

My perception of the additional 1000ish lumens on the newer model is what you would expect. It appears to be around 15-20% brighter to my eyes than the older model (2400ish lumens vs 1400 lumens. So the math on that is: 1000ish extra lumens divided by 1400 lumens = 71% brighter on paper, times the expected 25% perceived difference in increased output = 17.86% perceived increase in output). In other words, increases in light output "appear" to our eyes to be only around 25% of the overall additional output (hope that made sense to new folks, but most reading this already knew all this.)

This new SC600w IV Plus HI is very interesting. I like to use my HI zebras when hiking/walking into the evening, so I can see farther ahead than with a standard flashlight. The older SC600w IV HI punches through the dark a bit further without blinding me with a bright spill, but the hotspot is a bit too tight for closer in. I usually leave my slightly less throwy SC64w HI at home when backpacking since it doesn't throw a beam as far, and I'm already wearing a headlight providing plenty of flood (either an H53w or an H600w Mk IV). This new SC600w IV Plus HI offers more of a distributed beam, and with the higher output, it appears to reach out as far as the older version with sheer power. This new version might be a better option when walking on the beach at night or walking in wide open terrain, so the spill (when on max) doesn't blind you (the spill is quite nice on all levels though once your eyes adjust.) It has good throw but more flood than the older model, so I might not need a headlight on my head while I'm backpacking into the night when using the new model.

For the tint nerds out there (I'm sort of one too), the beam color of the new SC600w IV Plus HI is not great. Out of the 3 I bought, one is a bit greenish, while the other two are an ok white. None of the 3 new lights have the nice warmish looking beam color like the older SC600w IV HI or the SC64w HI (bummer). The tint on these new lights look just like my older SC600w Plus (not HI) if you have one of those. 

I'm keeping all 3 lights though. The greenish one is only slightly green, and I'd still use it or hand it off to a friend -- We've had friends and family come to visit us here in the North GA Mountains, and we take them to our favorite sunset spot on top of Mount Yonah. It's baffling to me, but NONE of them EVER think to bring their own flashlight for this hike (1.5 hours up in the daylight and 45 min back down in pitch black). But it's always a whole lot of fun to put an SC64w HI in there hands, and will now be fun to put an SC600w Mk IV HI in their hands for the hike. These lights make good conversation pieces. They also beat the crap out of using a phone light to cover the 2.5ish miles back down in the dark.

My Conclusion - Once again this beam profile (spill and hotspot) looks a whole lot like the SC64w HI but with one more higher output mode. I consider the discontinued SC64w HI to be the BEST all-around flashlight ever made as it offers a good balance for every day use (not too throwy and not too floody). I have considered for years that the older SC600w IV HI is the BEST backpacking/trail running flashlight ever made due to the extra throw with a reasonable amount of spill (all of my other throwy lights don't have enough spill and therefore get left at home most of the time, and all of my floody flashlights get left at home too for the opposite reason though.) This new SC600w IV Plus HI is an EXCELLENT "in-between" model like the SC64w HI always was. One could argue that this new model does what both the older SC600w IV HI does with beam distance and what the SC64w HI does with a combination of throw & flood - a nice marriage of the two lights. Glad I bought them, and I hope this helped you!!

I'm going night hiking up next month, and I will report back on my impressions of this new awesome light from ZL.


----------



## PoliceScannerMan

I find the tint on mine fantastic. It looks almost identical to a 4500K dome on 519a.


----------



## SYZYGY

even as a ZL fan, sometimes it's hard for me to keep the meaning behind the model names straight.

what is Plus probably supposed to mean in sc600 context again?


----------



## Outdoorsman5

The names are confusing. The "Plus" refers to the use of either the XHP50.2 or the XHP50.3 LED's. These LED's push 2400 lumens compared to the previous LED used in the SC600w MK IV HI that pushed 1400 lumens. You probably already know this, but the large 50.2 and 50.3 LED's make the light less throwy compared to a smaller LED like was was used in the previous SC600w Mk IV HI. Hope that helped.


----------



## knucklegary

Is 2400 lms still running on ga18650 10a max batts?

SC600w mk4 hi, ordering status "backordered" are they being delivered directly from China?


----------



## Outdoorsman5

knucklegary said:


> Is 2400 lms still running on ga18650 10a max batts?
> 
> SC600w mk4 hi, ordering status "backordered" are they being delivered directly from China?


I don’t know the answer to either question, but my order took 21 days to arrive.


----------



## Repsol600rr

I just received my sc5c mkii le. What a massive improvement in tint from the sc53c. I'm super happy with it. The size difference is noticeable but being much smaller than a 64 series I think it'll be OK if I decide to carry it though I'm trending towards 18350 or 16340 sizes for carry these days. It's much brighter as expected. Overall very pleased. I'd be happy with this emitter in the 53 format in the future if they decided to do it. Might get a h53c le to supplement my older h52w.


----------



## SYZYGY

Outdoorsman5 said:


> The names are confusing. The "Plus" refers to the use of either the XHP50.2 or the XHP50.3 LED's. These LED's push 2400 lumens compared to the previous LED used in the SC600w MK IV HI that pushed 1400 lumens. You probably already know this, but the large 50.2 and 50.3 LED's make the light less throwy compared to a smaller LED like was was used in the previous SC600w Mk IV HI. Hope that helped.



thanks, i see now. and the non-plus was xhp35.


----------



## Repsol600rr

Well, unfortunate I seem to have an issue with my sc5c mkii le. No mode seems to activate with any consistency. At first I was having issues getting h1 to work at full brightness. I tried four batteries and it wouldn't get brighter than low medium. But would still cycle LMH just at reduced power. Eventually is just ramped itself to full power. Now I can't get it to go to low. I've tried in g5 and g6. If I do double taps to get a different sublevel it just flickers and doesn't work right. I'm not sure what's happening here. But it ain't right. First zebralight issue I've had. This one's gotta go back.


----------



## Romanko

H503r Deep Red AA Lumileds LUXEON C 665nm


----------



## knucklegary

@Romanko, Keeping it stealth with Deep Red!
Inner city, day or night, do you wear arm and ankle band colors to avoid being shot by friendlies?


----------



## AstroTurf

Romanko said:


> H503r Deep Red AA Lumileds LUXEON C 665nm


absolutely love how zl is no longer giving light specs...


----------



## Romanko

It has 2 leds !!!


----------



## knucklegary

Mule


----------



## PoliceScannerMan

dang thats sweet!


----------



## gurdygurds

I was told they’d be releasing the SC53c LE in two months.


----------



## AstroTurf

Romanko said:


> It has 2 leds !!!


ordered...


----------



## TimMc

I was looking at Bright Nite in Australia during their recent sale and bought a ZebraLight SC700d.

I wish I bought the SC700d two years ago instead of the SC64c LE. It's a bigger and better version.

Similarly, I bought the H502pr a few years ago and now a H503r is available.


----------



## AstroTurf

TimMc said:


> Similarly, I bought the H502pr a few years ago and now a H503r is available.


you gonna upgrade?


----------



## TimMc

AstroTurf said:


> you gonna upgrade?


Probably not this time. The H502pr is ok despite having the older UI.


----------



## AstroTurf

TimMc said:


> Probably not this time. The H502pr is ok despite having the older UI.


and lower battery life too...

i figure with two leds, it's gotta be twice as good.

LOLz


----------



## Megalamuffin

Got my mcbob sc700d about a week ago. 5700k xhp70.3 HI, 90+ cri, incredibly bright. You could say it’s something of a “professional” edc light.


----------



## KITROBASKIN

Let’s see a head shot, then some beams…


----------



## knucklegary

@Megalamuffin.. on default how fast does turbo thermal step down?
Anodize looks great!


----------



## Megalamuffin

knucklegary said:


> @Megalamuffin.. on default how fast does turbo thermal step down?
> Anodize looks great!



Not quite sure, haven’t tested it or really noticed it in use. When I get a chance I’m going to leave it on turbo until the battery runs down and see what happens.

Turbo at the park. This should be around 2700 lumens. As far as the lights I own nothing comes close to this much output in a compact size as the sc700. It even rivals the sofirn sp36’s output.


----------



## knucklegary

Like the beam, reflector, spill, tint.. K9 is digging it too!


----------



## KITROBASKIN

Wow!
Clearly mcbob does some quality work.
That family member in the photograph looks like a useful set of eyes, ears and nose.


----------



## KITROBASKIN

Wife probably had a ZL SC62d in her pocket back then. Nowadays it is the SC64 LE.


----------



## AstroTurf

AstroTurf said:


> ordered...


picked it up today...


----------



## PoliceScannerMan

How is it?


----------



## AstroTurf

PoliceScannerMan said:


> How is it?


well, it has the newer body style (on right)

and it seems to have a lower low (both are currently turned on at their lowest setting)

the ano is great, time and darkness will tell...


----------



## neutralwhite

is ZL coming out with new bodies ?


----------



## Mr. LED

No, this new style was introduced a few years ago.


----------



## AstroTurf

darkness, both on L1

older on left, newer on r

seem about the same to me?!?

will leave them in position, and turned on until i see a difference.


----------



## radellaf

Just got shipping notice for SC600w Mk IV Plus HI , possibly a 2nd batch came in. Should be here Saturday - looking forward to it.


----------



## PoliceScannerMan

Its a winner


----------



## AstroTurf

AstroTurf said:


> darkness, both on L1
> 
> older on left, newer on r
> 
> seem about the same to me?!?
> 
> will leave them in position, and turned on until i see a difference.
> 
> View attachment 33924


Well, the older style is flickering.

At L1 one lumen for either…

Older is rated for four days, and newer is rated for five and a half days.

Therefore the newer unit wins!!!


----------



## NPL

I just experienced the same issue on my sc5c. I swapped out my old eneloop pro with a regular white eneloop and problem went away.


----------



## radellaf

After using the (deep breath) SC600w Mk IV Plus Hi... for a while, it is a winner. It's more or less the beam of the plain SC600, minus the cree rainbow and much higher maximum brightness. The regular Hi was a bit spot-y for me, and the plain Plus was both a bit floody (fine, tho) and had way too much of a yellow-green transition zone. I'm not sure it was any worse than the straight SC600 in that respect, though.
I wanted a floodier "HI". Got it. Also my Hi is a Mk III, so, bonus there as well as the ton of extra lumens.
My SC600w may be a Mk II, if they were Mk-ing them at that time. I also have the one even older than that, with the totally different shape (longer, bigger head). Got that one repaired as the button was getting dodgy. I still love that light. Very comfy in the hand.


----------



## Repsol600rr

Repsol600rr said:


> Well, unfortunate I seem to have an issue with my sc5c mkii le. No mode seems to activate with any consistency. At first I was having issues getting h1 to work at full brightness. I tried four batteries and it wouldn't get brighter than low medium. But would still cycle LMH just at reduced power. Eventually is just ramped itself to full power. Now I can't get it to go to low. I've tried in g5 and g6. If I do double taps to get a different sublevel it just flickers and doesn't work right. I'm not sure what's happening here. But it ain't right. First zebralight issue I've had. This one's gotta go back.


Forgot to update that zebralight took care of me with no issues or hassles and my replacement seems to be working just fine. Everyone has flukes, zebralight makes it right.


----------



## AstroTurf

Repsol600rr said:


> Forgot to update that zebralight took care of me with no issues or hassles and my replacement seems to be working just fine. Everyone has flukes, zebralight makes it right.


how they made it right would be my question...


----------



## SYZYGY

i'm also curious. i've heard mixed reviews of the ZL warranty process.


----------



## ilikeguns40

New Sc600w HI came in couple days ago. Really enjoying this beast


----------



## sandalian

I'm expecting to receive a new H53c LE within a few days. I can't wait.


----------



## ilikeguns40

sandalian said:


> I'm expecting to receive a new H53c LE within a few days. I can't wait.


I owned the new H53Fc LE and it was very nice


----------



## Repsol600rr

AstroTurf said:


> how they made it right would be my question...


I messaged them from the "contact us" page and gave them a description of what was happening, then asked them what I should do. They asked for my order number. I sent that. They gave me an rma number and a po box to send it to. I sent it with a note of my order number and that I wanted a replacement. I did have to pay shipping but it was a few dollars. Off it went, and then a while later a new one arrived.


----------



## SYZYGY

huh. i wonder if the key is asking for a replacement. i've heard their repairs take a long time.


----------



## AstroTurf

SYZYGY said:


> huh. i wonder if the key is asking for a replacement. i've heard their repairs take a long time.


slooooooooooow boat to china long...


----------



## Repsol600rr

I think it depends because it was still within the 30 day return window. It was a brand new light that didn't work right almost immediately. Idk what time it would have taken them should it have been outside of that window or been an older model. I've never had an issue with my older models.


----------



## gurdygurds

Is it a safe bet that the new SC53c LE they will be releasing will look the same but have the LH351D like the H53c LE has? How do folks like the LH351D led by the way? Thinking of grabbing one when they’re released.


----------



## gurdygurds

Which type of DC Fix do you use to smooth out your Zebra? I ordered an H53C LE and want to play around with some diffusion. Like the idea of non permanent since I used these little headlamps as around the house lights as well and at times want the hotspot/ throw.


----------



## ilikeguns40

Hmm


SYZYGY said:


> huh. i wonder if the key is asking for a replacement. i've heard their repairs take a long time.


i was thinking that actuall


gurdygurds said:


> Which type of DC Fix do you use to smooth out your Zebra? I ordered an H53C LE and want to play around with some diffusion. Like the idea of non permanent since I used these little headlamps as around the house lights as well and at times want the hotspot/ throw.


i don’t use DC fix. I just ordered the permanent models which uses it best. My wife does have some dc fix she uses for crafts that I’ve used but IMO dc fix isn’t worth the lumen drop unless it’s from factory


----------



## gurdygurds

ilikeguns40 said:


> Hmm
> 
> i was thinking that actuall
> 
> i don’t use DC fix. I just ordered the permanent models which uses it best. My wife does have some dc fix she uses for crafts that I’ve used but IMO dc fix isn’t worth the lumen drop unless it’s from factory


Been going back and forth on changing to the F version for my headlamp. Hmmmmmm.


----------



## ilikeguns40

gurdygurds said:


> Been going back and forth on changing to the F version for my headlamp. Hmmmmmm.


I definitely would if I were you


----------



## ilikeguns40

gurdygurds said:


> Been going back and forth on changing to the F version for my headlamp. Hmmmmmm.


You will love it. I never steer anyone in a bad direction. Frosted lens is 🤌


----------



## Mr. LED

Frosted is better.


----------



## SYZYGY

haha. depends how you use it.

imo frosted is if you're mostly using it close up and/or you don't care about battery life.
non-frosted spot/spill is for everything else.

i never go frosted. with non-frosted, you get a usable close-up beam even at very low output, and you also get much better throw.


----------



## gurdygurds

I'm nervous and shaky! What do I do??!!


----------



## SYZYGY

unfortunately, the real way to know is to try both and see what works better for you. 

my personal suggestion (which is worth almost nothing) is to get H600c and a couple of NCR18650GA batteries. why do you want AA? AA sucks, and the h600 series is already so small.


----------



## ilikeguns40

I definitely recommend the H600Fc such a great light with long runtimes


----------



## AstroTurf

Don’t go flood or floody.

Create your own reversible flood with a removable film.

You'll thank me later.


----------



## gurdygurds

I've had a regular and a floody. The floody beam was probably better for headlamp usage, but the only downside is that you can't gaze into the barely lit led on the super low low modes. This is why I was thinking dc fix.


----------



## kj2

Has been a loooong time that I ordered a Zebra. But just pulled the trigger on the SC5c Mk II and SC64c LE.
Am also looking at the SC700d.


----------



## burntoshine

I thought I read that the frosted lenses are more prone to cracking. 🤷‍♂️


----------



## gunga

DC fix sand pattern works well.


----------



## gurdygurds

I need to try one of those fatty AA bodies at some point.


----------



## gurdygurds

gunga said:


> DC fix sand pattern works well.


I’ll give it a go Gunga. Thanks


----------



## gurdygurds

AstroTurf said:


> picked it up today...
> 
> View attachment 33700


Astro you could make a pretty sweet chess set with all your Zebralights. ♟


----------



## gurdygurds

Hey….I’ll talk to myself on this forum all night. Doesn’t bother me at all. Here’s a question….is it worth it to seek out some of the older Zebra models? My problem is that I really like the older body styles like the H600 and Sc62 better than the current bodies, but these are lights they have been disco’d a WHILE ago. Older tech…..yes…..lower cri……yes…..less efficient….I’m sure. But they just look so stinking nifty!


----------



## AstroTurf

gurdygurds said:


> Hey….I’ll talk to myself on this forum all night. Doesn’t bother me at all. Here’s a question….is it worth it to seek out some of the older Zebra models? My problem is that I really like the older body styles like the H600 and Sc62 better than the current bodies, but these are lights they have been disco’d a WHILE ago. Older tech…..yes…..lower cri……yes…..less efficient….I’m sure. But they just look so stinking nifty!
> View attachment 34465


sure, why not?

if you like it, go for it.

Jim

Ps Light is light.


----------



## gurdygurds

AstroTurf said:


> sure, why not?
> 
> if you like it, go for it.
> 
> Jim
> 
> Ps Light is light.


How rare are these bad boys at this point? H600 and Sc62 models. You can shoot me straight kids. Tell me….TELL ME!!! You’re silly Gurdy! Just look at the current models. Don’t be an *** Gurdygurds! Why would spend time and effort tracking down old tech? Grow up Gurdy! Everyone knows the older ones are more robust and make you happier and more witty.


----------



## AstroTurf

e b a y . . .


----------



## SYZYGY

gurdygurds said:


> Hey….I’ll talk to myself on this forum all night. Doesn’t bother me at all. Here’s a question….is it worth it to seek out some of the older Zebra models? My problem is that I really like the older body styles like the H600 and Sc62 better than the current bodies, but these are lights they have been disco’d a WHILE ago. Older tech…..yes…..lower cri……yes…..less efficient….I’m sure. But they just look so stinking nifty!



they do look cool, but i don't see the point. everything i could want is currently offered (except sc64w hi, but they will probably make a new one eventually)


----------



## AstroTurf

gurdygurds said:


> Astro you could make a pretty sweet chess set with all your Zebralights. ♟


ha ha, not sure i have enough for that...

but, i have enough for a mean game of desktop dominos!!!

LOLz


----------



## kj2

Look what the mailman brought 

Current Zebra line-up. Had a SC5 and SC32w previously but sold those few years ago.
*H602w headlamp is somewhere. But where.. I don't know


----------



## gurdygurds

kj2 said:


> Look what the mailman brought
> 
> Current Zebra line-up. Had a SC5 and SC32w previously but sold those few years ago.
> *H602w headlamp is somewhere. But where.. I don't know
> 
> View attachment 34490


What’s your first impression of the bottom two KJ?


----------



## KITROBASKIN

Gurdy there’s no getting around the fact that the earlier “ribbed for her pleasure” Zebralight flashlight models are classic; light, strong, good traction in-hand. Seems like there is a fellow who can mod ZL (member Jon slider is savvy on this) Bob McBob or something. Spendy but such a temptingly desirous prospect. The emitter on the SC62d is pleasant to use, but I had basically three of them eventually fail with old age and considerable use.


----------



## gurdygurds

KITROBASKIN said:


> Gurdy there’s no getting around the fact that the earlier “ribbed for her pleasure” Zebralight flashlight models are classic; light, strong, good traction in-hand. Seems like there is a fellow who can mod ZL (member Jon slider is savvy on this) Bob McBob or something. Spendy but such a temptingly desirous prospect. The emitter on the SC62d is pleasant to use, but I had basically three of them eventually fail with old age and considerable use
> 
> 
> KITROBASKIN said:
> 
> 
> 
> Gurdy there’s no getting around the fact that the earlier “ribbed for her pleasure” Zebralight flashlight models are classic; light, strong, good traction in-hand. Seems like there is a fellow who can mod ZL (member Jon slider is savvy on this) Bob McBob or something. Spendy but such a temptingly desirous prospect. The emitter on the SC62d is pleasant to use, but I had basically three of them eventually fail with old age and considerable use.
> 
> 
> 
> Love the look but I’m a bit wary. I’ve purchased “classic” lights in the past due to the body styles only to be disappointed by the led. Don’t think I’d drop a ton on modding a Zebra. Doesn’t seem like the $20 led swap that’s possible with other lights. If something comes up, I’ll have to see how frisky I’m feeling.
Click to expand...


----------



## KITROBASKIN

To see the gurdygurds response to post #4407, “click to expand”


----------



## kj2

gurdygurds said:


> What’s your first impression of the bottom two KJ?


That I really the like form factor. Tint is always a bit difficult to explain, let alone capturing it correctly on a photo.
For me it's not to warm but also not white. It has some creamy-white, mixed with some yellow and green. Am very pleased that both of them have the same tint to my eyes. Color difference is something that I really hate when two lights use the same led.
Size-wise they're great. Since it is getting dark early here I start carrying more and more. The SC64 is indeed more classic like KITROBASKIN says. But I also like the grip of the SC5.


----------



## gurdygurds

Nice. I’ve got the AA headlamp version arriving today. I’m sure I’ll pick up some version of the Sc5 at some point and I’m keeping an eye out for an older body headlamp.


----------



## gurdygurds

Behold! Nice little headlamp. Tint is a def improvement from SC52w, nice dark anodizing, cool new two-way clip, and readily accepts a AAA battery as a bonus. Clear lens….so I can see into its soul. 😍


----------



## Repsol600rr

I mean.... I went well out of my way to track down an NOS sc62d years after it was discontinued and I thought it to be unobtainium after quite a lot of searching. It ended up coming from some shop in Cardiff, Whales in the U.K. which miraculously actually had it and shipped it to U.S. no problem, and it was just its normal price. They had no idea they had what may well have been the last retail sc62d left in the world 😆 🤣 😂. After years of loving the sc52d I wanted it's bigger brother, never to carry or use as an edc, but to simply have and play with. So....... ya know...... 😆 🤣 That being said my sc64w hi is an objectively better product. But tis a hobby after all.


----------



## gurdygurds

Repsol600rr said:


> I mean.... I went well out of my way to track down an NOS sc62d years after it was discontinued and I thought it to be unobtainium after quite a lot of searching. It ended up coming from some shop in Cardiff, Whales in the U.K. which miraculously actually had it and shipped it to U.S. no problem, and it was just its normal price. They had no idea they had what may well have been the last retail sc62d left in the world 😆 🤣 😂. After years of loving the sc52d I wanted it's bigger brother, never to carry or use as an edc, but to simply have and play with. So....... ya know...... 😆 🤣 That being said my sc64w hi is an objectively better product. But tis a hobby after all.


Very cool! I bet the 62 feels better in hand. Just enough extra length.


----------



## Repsol600rr

It is nice in the hand. Even though I've just played with this one I extensively used my sc62w. Just a bit too big for me to edc regularly. It was a great series of lights and I'm glad I have them, even if I don't use them much any more. The older ones, can still fit the bill just as easily as they did back then. I'd be happy to drop any of the older series in my pocket knowing I've got my daily lighting needs perfectly covered. I just don't these days because I'm paranoid I'll loose one and not be able to replace it. These days I only carry stuff I can readily replace.


----------



## gurdygurds

Well got the Sc5c today. Had to try this body style. I like the light and the tint seems basically identical to the H53c. One thing that’s odd, is that the Sc5c gives off a green reflection from certain angles when it’s turned on, while the H53c just gives this beautiful golden glow no matter what angle or how you look at it. Different lens coating maybe? Tried to take a few pics to show what I mean. Middle pic without green is H53c. Any ideas? Your light the same? Orange peel plus anti-reflective coating?


----------



## gurdygurds

I decided to go straight to the source. Again this doesn't bother me, (luckily green is my favorite color and it doesn't affect the beam) but man it's a clearly noticeable almost emerald green cast on the lens. Here is the reply from Zebralight.

The lenses on most of our current lights are made of Corning Gorilla Glass, for its strength and durability. Over the years, we've been using different generations of Gorilla Glass, ranging from 2nd Gen all the way to 5th Gen in some of our most recent production batches. The lenses we use went through an extra 'chemical strenthening' process on top of the already very strong Gorrila Glass. This extra strenthening process varies slightly with each generations and occasionaly each batches. That greenish hue over and above certain degree of viewing is likely resulted from that process.

Sincerely,

ZebraLight, Inc.
PO BOX 92307
Southlake, TX 76092


----------



## Repsol600rr

Interesting. I noticed the same thing in mine. Cool to know why.


----------



## gurdygurds

Yea glad they responded about it and so quickly. 👍🏼 Also I posted earlier that it’s noticeable when the light is on. Think that’s cause I was playing with it constantly but you can angle it while the light is off and it’s obviously still visible. Anyway, this is an absolute keeper. Never had a Zebra with knurling before and I really dig it. Once I decided I was keeping it, I promptly took the clip off, grabbed my Victorinox Classic, and used the file to knock down those super sharp corners where the clip attached. Now it’s super hand friendly without the clip and it doesn’t affect it when I want to put it back on.


----------



## Repsol600rr

Hope it doesn't break down like mine did.... cuz I think they might notice that.


----------



## AstroTurf

i believe these clips will work on an sc5c II zebralight also...



https://www.zebralight.com/Pocket-Clip-for-H5x_p_243.html


----------



## gurdygurds

Repsol600rr said:


> Hope it doesn't break down like mine did.... cuz I think they might notice that.


How do you mean?


----------



## Repsol600rr

Recently my sc5c had issues crop up that I didn't notice until a few days after I got it. I reported it a couple pages back. I had to send it back for a replacement. Hopefully yours works fine, because I don't think they'd like a returned light that's been filed like that.


----------



## gurdygurds

Oh i see what you're saying. Well yea at this point if I run into an issue it will be a repair. Hopefully it's a solid copy.


----------



## jon_slider

gurdygurds said:


> Clear lens….so I can see into its soul. 😍


Congratulations! That Zebra has a beautiful Golden Eye. Very happy for you


----------



## gurdygurds

Thanks Jon! Question for the Sc600 users out there. Plus vs Plus HI and why?


----------



## ilikeguns40

gurdygurds said:


> Thanks Jon! Question for the Sc600 users out there. Plus vs Plus HI and why?


High has much better tint and the beam is much throwier but also has very nice spill


----------



## gurdygurds

Going with clip and lanyard today. This light is sweet.


----------



## ilikeguns40

gurdygurds said:


> Going with clip and lanyard today. This light is sweet.
> View attachment 34702


Gotta be the OD Green paracord. Just picked up a big roll from Walmart today for 5 bucks


----------



## gurdygurds

Yeeeaaaa buddy!


----------



## this_is_nascar

Just curious as to whether or not there's anyone else like me that just grabs his ZL and uses it, as is, straight out of the box, without fretting too much about beam, tint and build?

Each of my ZLs have a variation of one type or another, but when in use, you'd never know it.


----------



## ilikeguns40

this_is_nascar said:


> Just curious as to whether or not there's anyone else like me that just grabs his ZL and uses it, as is, straight out of the box, without fretting too much about beam, tint and build?
> 
> Each of my ZLs have a variation of one type or another, but when in use, you'd never know it.


I keep mine stock. I think they are pretty much all decent as is and no need to change anything.


----------



## gurdygurds

Stock here as well, aside from a little file work to make clipless carry a little more comfy. The two little C LE models I got recently have a really nice tint so no wishing for different led either. I have an SC52w en route from Gunga that I wanted just because I love the older gray anodizing and body style and will keep that stock as well.


----------



## ilikeguns40

I see a lot of people have their Zebras modified with different LEDs. To me I’m not all about removing potting and factory components, same goes with any other light. I like my lights to be stock from manufacturers. It kills me when I see someone modify a McGizmo. Defeats the purpose of it being a unique and genuine light IMO


----------



## gurdygurds

Wouldn’t it be the cat’s potatoes if Zebralight made a AAA light?


----------



## ilikeguns40

gurdygurds said:


> Wouldn’t it be the cat’s potatoes if Zebralight made a AAA light?
> 
> View attachment 34725


Yeah I always thought how nice that would be and make it so it could handle a 10440 3.7v as well. Still wish their newer AAs accepted 3.7v 14500s


----------



## Repsol600rr

The sc53 series is documented to take 3.7 volt 14500 batteries. The only thing you need to do is click the switch several times with the tailcap off when changing voltages from 1.5 volts to 3.7 volts. Otherwise they seem to run fine on 14500 batteries according to others. I have run my sc53c on a 14500. It seems to work just fine. But I dont do it regularly so cant report on the overall long term effrcts personally. There's a thread about it somewhere on here. Note, the sc5 series does not do this. They are AA only no matter what.
Edit: still an at your own risk type thing


----------



## ilikeguns40

Repsol600rr said:


> The sc53 series is documented to take 3.7 volt 14500 batteries. The only thing you need to do is click the switch several times with the tailcap off when changing voltages from 1.5 volts to 3.7 volts. Otherwise they seem to run fine on 14500 batteries according to others. I have run my sc53c on a 14500. It seems to work just fine. But I dont do it regularly so cant report on the overall long term effrcts personally. There's a thread about it somewhere on here. Note, the sc5 series does not do this. They are AA only no matter what.
> Edit: still an at your own risk type thing


Yeah I ran my sc53 with a 14500. You get 60 seconds of turbo until step down. When going back to a regular AA you need to hold the switch when tightening the tailcap

Just wish they could actually implement it where you could get longer runtimes when using a 3.7v


----------



## Repsol600rr

Yeah that was the same as the 52 series with the timed step down. It would have been nice if they had used PID to keep it higher longer, with corresponding lower runtimes. But I'm sure that was the compromise to also run the lower voltage batteries.


----------



## ilikeguns40

Repsol600rr said:


> Yeah that was the same as the 52 series with the timed step down. It would have been nice if they had used PID to keep it higher longer, with corresponding lower runtimes. But I'm sure that was the compromise to also run the lower voltage batteries.


True. I’m really just glad Eneloops are a thing I’d probably just choose to run those anyway regardless


----------



## gurdygurds

Eneloops for the win! Also think it would be amazing if they made a 2xaa light. Been thinking hard about picking up an 18650 Zebra but I'm not there yet.


----------



## ilikeguns40

gurdygurds said:


> Eneloops for the win! Also think it would be amazing if they made a 2xaa light. Been thinking hard about picking up an 18650 Zebra but I'm not there yet.


You might as well just get one, you will eventually haha!. Total game changer in runtimes and outputs. You could use it every night as a night light for 6 months running at .3 lumens if you wanted or 24/7 for 3 months


----------



## tech25

Repsol600rr said:


> Yeah that was the same as the 52 series with the timed step down. It would have been nice if they had used PID to keep it higher longer, with corresponding lower runtimes. But I'm sure that was the compromise to also run the lower voltage batteries.


The 52 series work on 14500s? (Even unofficially)


----------



## AstroTurf

gurdygurds said:


> Eneloops for the win! Also think it would be amazing if they made a 2xaa light. Been thinking hard about picking up an 18650 Zebra but I'm not there yet.


21700 for the win!!!


----------



## Repsol600rr

tech25 said:


> The 52 series work on 14500s? (Even unofficially)


The 52 series fully supports 14500s offically


----------



## tech25

Thank you!

I realised that I have the H51fw and got excited that could run on 14500s. I should read this after I have my coffee.


----------



## Repsol600rr

Never had a 51 series. I think they work on 14500s but someone more knowledgeable than me would be required to confirm.


----------



## AstroTurf

h51fw specs stolen from the web...

ZLH51FW: H51FW AA Flood Headlamp, 164 Max Lumens_ZebraLight_This light has 3 main levels (High, Medium, and Low). Each main level can be programmed to one of its two sub-levels. The second sub-level of each main levels can be further programmed to different brightness levels or strobes.
Basic OperationShort click turns on the light to High or turns off the light.
Long click (press and hold for about 0.6 seconds) turns on the light to Low.
Advanced Operation and ConfigurationShort click turns on the light to High. Short click again quickly to cycle from High to Medium, and Low.
Press and hold to cycle from Low, Medium and High, release to set. When press and hold, the light always cycle from Low to High regardless which level you are currently in.
Double click to toggle and select between the two sub-levels for that main level. Sub-level selections (except the strobe) for the 3 main levels are memorized after the light is turned off and through battery changes.
The second sub-level of each main levels can be configured after 6 double clicks. Double click (startng with the 7th) to cycle and select different brightness levels or strobes. Short click to turn off the light when finishing configurations. The selections for the second sub-levels are memorized after the light is turned off and through battery changes.
Comes with one black and one GITD silicone holder with headband, pocket clip, and two o-rings.
Features
Electronic soft-touch switch, with a 200,000 cycle operating life
Smart user interface provides fast and easy access to all brightness levels
Precision machined unibody casing from premium grade Alcoa aluminum bar stock
Proprietary heat sinking design bonds the LED board directly to the unibody aluminum casing, providing unblocked thermal paths to over 94% of the surface area.
Durable natural hard anodized finish (Type III Class I)
Tempered optical grade ground glass
Battery power can be locked out by slightly unscrewing the tailcap to prevent unwanted activations or parasitic drain
Waterproof to IPX8 (2 meters, 30 minutes)
Specifications
LED: Cree XP-G Neutral White (color temperature 4200 K)
User Selectable Levels: 3 main level (High, Medium and Low). Each main level can be configured to one of its two sub-levels. The second sub-level of the High can be further configured to different brightness levels or strobes.
Light Output
High: H1 *164* Lm (0.9 hrs) or H2 *82* Lm (2.4 hrs) / *115* Lm (1.7 hrs) / 4Hz Strobe
Medium: M1 *25* Lm (10.5 hrs) or M2 *6.5* Lm (26 hrs)
Low: L1 *2.0* Lm (3 days) or L2 *0.16* Lm (16 days)
Light output are out the front (OTF) values. Runtime tests are done using Sanyo 2000mAh Eneloop AA batteries.
Operating Voltage Range: 0.7V - 2.5V
Battery: One 1.5V AA (NiMH, lithium or alkaline). 14500 Li-ion batteries are not supported. Batteries are not included in the package.
Parasitic Drain: Negligible (equivalent to 16 years)
Beam Type
Flood beam from frosted lens, 90 degree beam spread
Dimensions
Diameter: *0.90* inch (23 mm)
Length: *3.2* inch (81 mm)
Weight
*1.2* oz (35.8 gram)
*2.2* oz (61.9 gram) with an Eneloop AA
*3.0* oz (84.9 gram) with an Eneloop AA and headband


----------



## AstroTurf

now the h52fw on the other hand will accept 14500s...

ZLH52FW: H52FW AA Floody Headlamp, 266 Max Lumens_ZebraLight_This light has 3 main levels (High, Medium, and Low) and a beacon-strobe mode. Each main level can be programmed to one of its two sub-levels. The second sub-level of each main levels can be further programmed to different brightness levels.
Basic OperationOne short-click turns on the light to High or turns off the light.
Two short-click turns on the light to Medium.
Three short-click turns on the light to the beacon-strobe mode.
Press and hold (for over 0.6 seconds) turns on the light to Low and then Medium and High. Release at the desired level.
Advanced Operation and ConfigurationPress and hold to cycle from Low, Medium and High, release at the desired level to set. When press and hold, the light always cycle from Low to High regardless which level you are currently in.
Double click to toggle and select between the two sub-levels for that main level. Sub-level selections for the 3 main levels are memorized after the light is turned off and through battery changes.
The second sub-level (H2, M2 and L2) of each main levels can be further programmed to different brightness levels. At a main level, double-click 6 times to start configuration. On subsequent double-clicks the light will cycle through different brightness levels. Short click to turn off the light when finishing configurations. The selections for the second sub-levels are memorized after the light is turned off and through battery changes.
This light uses the main LED (flashing 1 to 4 times) to indicate the estimated remaining capacity of the battery. To start the battery indicator, (from Off) short-click 4 times without pause.
Beacon-strobe mode can be accessed from 3 short-clicks when the light is Off. Once in the beacon-strobe mode, you can double-click to cycle through different types of beacons and strobes. Beacon-strobe settings are memorized when the light is turned off and through battery changes.
Comes with one black silicone holder with headband, pocket clip, and two o-rings.
Features
Battery capacity indicator (LED flashes 1-4 times, 4 short clicks to start)
All levels are current regulated
Low battery alert when the light is switched Off (LED flashes if the battery voltage is below 1.06V)
Automatic stepping down to lower output when battery (AA and 14500) capacity is low
Built in over-discharging protection for 14500 batteries at 2.8V cutoff
Durable electronic soft-touch switch
Smart user interface provides fast and easy access to all brightness levels and beacon-strobes.
Precision machined unibody casing from premium grade aluminum bar stocks
Proprietary heat sinking design bonds the LED board directly to the unibody aluminum casing
Durable natural hard anodized finish (Type III Class I)
Sealed and potted LED driver circuitry
Tempered optical grade glass
Battery power can be disconnected by slightly unscrewing the tailcap to prevent unwanted activations or parasitic drain
Waterproof to IPX7 (2 meters, 30 minutes)
Specifications
LED: Cree XM-L2 Neutral White (Norminal CCT 4400K)
User Selectable Levels: 3 main levels (High, Medium and Low). Each main level can be programmed to one of its two sub-levels. The second sub-level of the each main levels can be further programmed to different brightness levels.
Light Output
High: *266* Lm (0.9 hrs) or H2 *163* Lm (1.7 hrs) / *102* Lm (3 hrs)
Medium: M1 *47* Lm (7.5 hrs) or M2 *23* Lm (12 hrs) / *11* Lm (27 hrs)
Low: L1 *2.6* Lm (4 days) or L2 *0.32* Lm (3 weeks) / *0.06* Lm (2 months) / *0.01* Lm (3 months)
Beacon Strobe Mode: 4Hz Strobe at H1 / 19Hz Strobe at H1
Light output are ANSI out the front (OTF) values. Runtimes tested (and parasitic drain estimated) using Sanyo 2000mAh Eneloop AA batteries. Light output with 14500 batteries are the same except that the H1 is 475Lm for the first minute and then step down to 266Lm.
Operating Voltage Range: 2.7V - 4.2V
Battery: One 1.5V AA (NiMH, lithium or alkaline) or 3.7V 14500 li-ion rechargeable. Batteries are not included in the package.
Parasitic Drain: Negligible (much less than the self discharging of a battery)
Beam Type
Floody beam from frosted lens, with 90 degree beam spread
Dimensions
Head Diameter: *0.86* inch (21.8 mm)
Length: *3.0* inch (76.5 mm)
Weight
*1.1* oz (32 gram)
*2.9 oz* (80 gram) with an Eneloop AA and headband


----------



## AstroTurf

this old thread can shed some light on the age old battery comparo...






14500 or Eneloops?


I know the 14500 are brighter but the Eneloops seem to be a little cheaper. Any reason to go with the Eneloops over the 14500 besides price? Also for the Eneloops should I go with the $16 4pack with a charger on amazon or buy a 4 pack of Eneloops with the Lacrosse $30 charger?




www.candlepowerforums.com


----------



## Repsol600rr

Well there you go, thanks for that. Like I said I had no experience with the 51s, I just know I use 14500s in the 52s.


----------



## gurdygurds

Knocked my Sc5c LE off the bathroom counter last night. Smacked hard on the tile, bounced into the floorboard, spun around a few times flickering, and then shut off. I picked it up and tried to click it back on….nothing. I pulled the the battery, put it back in…nothing. Put the same battery into the SC52w and it fired up no problem. Tried a dif battery in the Sc5 and it works perfectly. Upon inspection, the original battery in the Sc5 has the bottom pushed in quite a bit from who knows which light in the past. Guess the impact smacked the battery just enough to push it over the edge so that the pogo pins weren’t making good enough contact. Anyway, got the first good drop out of the way and all is well. Small ding to the tailcap anodizing.


----------



## AstroTurf

gurdygurds said:


> Knocked my Sc5c LE off the bathroom counter last night. Smacked hard on the tile, bounced into the floorboard, spun around a few times flickering, and then shut off. I picked it up and tried to click it back on….nothing. I pulled the the battery, put it back in…nothing. Put the same battery into the SC52w and it fired up no problem. Tried a dif battery in the Sc5 and it works perfectly. Upon inspection, the original battery in the Sc5 has the bottom pushed in quite a bit from who knows which light in the past. Guess the impact smacked the battery just enough to push it over the edge so that the pogo pins weren’t making good enough contact. Anyway, got the first good drop out of the way and all is well. Small ding to the tailcap anodizing.
> View attachment 34844


how'd the floor fair?

LOLz


----------



## rwolfenstein

I am tempted to get a zebralight headlamp, it would be useful when I am doing my car stuff.


----------



## ilikeguns40

rwolfenstein said:


> I am tempted to get a zebralight headlamp, it would be useful when I am doing my car stuff.


They are very useful. It’s so nice having one. I have the h600Fc. Beam and tint is perfect


----------



## rwolfenstein

ilikeguns40 said:


> They are very useful. It’s so nice having one. I have the h600Fc. Beam and tint is perfect


I want one that runs on AA so I can run alkaline, lithium and rechargeable.


----------



## holygeez03

rwolfenstein said:


> I am tempted to get a zebralight headlamp, it would be useful when I am doing my car stuff.


Everyone should have a Zebralight headlamp... My H52Fw is my most used/carried light and I rarely use it as a headlamp. It makes a great EDC with just the clip and is quite useful handheld or as a right-angle work light.

Now I carry an H53Fc with 14500... but the H52Fw still gets plenty of action (and has a better clip).


----------



## awyeah

I just looked it up, and I've been carrying the same Zebralight SC62w for over 7 years now! Maybe it's time to upgrade. I like the permanently-attached clip and the overall size. Is the 64w a worthy upgrade?


----------



## Mr. LED

awyeah said:


> I just looked it up, and I've been carrying the same Zebralight SC62w for over 7 years now! Maybe it's time to upgrade. I like the permanently-attached clip and the overall size. Is the 64w a worthy upgrade?


The 64w HI version was a clear upgrade to me, better tint, more power, better ergonomics (the body is smoother and the edges are rounded and shorter). About the LE version I can’t comment, I’ve never tested.


----------



## ScottsoSmith

I think I found my perfect EDC. I just entered the world of Zebralight and I’m very impressed. The photo shows a Zebralight S64c LE with a silicone rubber diffuser I found on Amazon. I removed the standard clip and added a reversible Olight S1 Baton clip (fits perfectly). I use this light with the diffuser as a backpacking lantern and it works great for my purposes. I clip it onto a baseball hat (w/o diffuser) and it works great as an outdoor headlamp (probably not as good for an indoor, close work headlamp). It uses unprotected 18650 batteries, and it is only slightly bigger than the 1xCR123 lights. Good runtime, plenty of levels, and programmable. The 4000K CCT is very pleasing.

I’m hooked!!


View attachment 35457



View attachment 35458


----------



## Repsol600rr

Not that I'm going to do it, but it's interesting that clip fits like that. Never would have thought...


----------



## Limit_hex

rwolfenstein said:


> I am tempted to get a zebralight headlamp, it would be useful when I am doing my car stuff.





holygeez03 said:


> Everyone should have a Zebralight headlamp... My H52Fw is my most used/carried light and I rarely use it as a headlamp. It makes a great EDC with just the clip and is quite useful handheld or as a right-angle work light.
> 
> Now I carry an H53Fc with 14500... but the H52Fw still gets plenty of action (and has a better clip).


This is my favourite flashlight review  Great headlamp:


----------



## rwolfenstein

Limit_hex said:


> This is my favourite flashlight review  Great headlamp:



The Surefire Minimus that I use eats up a bunch of primaries and doesn't seem to like the RCRs that Surefire currently makes. So something that I can run AA or rechargeables with would be quite useful.


----------



## Fespe

I just ordered the h53c but why the cost differenze compared to the h53fc? Is it the frosted lense? But on the sc700d the price (on nkon) it's slightly lower with frosted lense.


----------



## SYZYGY

Fespe said:


> I just ordered the h53c but why the cost differenze compared to the h53fc? Is it the frosted lense? But on the sc700d the price (on nkon) it's slightly lower with frosted lense.



can't believe you made me google that. sigh.



https://www.zebralight.com/H53c-LE-Neutral-White-High-CRI-AA-Headlamp_p_244.html




https://www.zebralight.com/H53Fc-AA-Headlamp-Floody-Neutral-White-High-CRI_p_195.html



they are the same price. 59usd.

ask your retailer why they're selling them for different prices. it's nkon's decision. no one else would know.


----------



## rwolfenstein

I broke down and got a new Zebralight on the way. I went with the High CRI H53c LE model so I could use AA cells or rechargeable cells. It will be quite nice whenever I am working on cars now.


----------



## gurdygurds

rwolfenstein said:


> I broke down and got a new Zebralight on the way. I went with the High CRI H53c LE model so I could use AA cells or rechargeable cells. It will be quite nice whenever I am working on cars now.


I think you’ll really like it. I’ve been using mine as a headlamp on runs and as a handheld for around the house. Versatile little light that can also run AAA batteries no problem.


----------



## Fespe

The h53c LE is just arrived today! It's a beautiful little light. I just play with it a little bit and it's seems perfect for me! The tint it's a little bit warmer compared to my sc64c LE and I really like it. The clip it's not bad.


----------



## rwolfenstein

What does LE mean in terms of the light? I am trying to find information on this but have alas come up with no information.


----------



## ilikeguns40

Limited Edition


----------



## KITROBASKIN

Limited Edition is my understanding as well, but it could stand for LED Excellence maybe.


----------



## knucklegary

I thought LE stood for Law Enforcement 🤔


----------



## Mr. LED




----------



## knucklegary

I like Law Enforcement better (-;


----------



## rwolfenstein

I got my zebralight in the mail today and all I have to say is whoa. This H53c LE is super small and super bright. The fit and finish is fantastic for a 60 dollar light. I am impressed to say the least.


----------



## Fespe

rwolfenstein said:


> I got my zebralight in the mail today and all I have to say is whoa. This H53c LE is super small and super bright. The fit and finish is fantastic for a 60 dollar light. I am impressed to say the least.


Yes! I think I would have preferred the h53fc though, considering that I'm gonna use it primarily for close up things. But reading a lot of people saying that with h53c you have the option in case you want more "throw" I bought this. Now I'm gonna buy the famous dx fix and see if it's good. I already put on the lens the magic tape and it's a lot better.


----------



## bonC

I wonder why they don't put brand and model type on a headlamp. Quite confusing if you got multiple 18650 headlamps or AA headlamps. Anyone knows the reason why?


----------



## ilikeguns40

Most people who buy Zebralights know exactly what they are getting. You can usually tell which one is which just by the LED itself


----------



## bonC

Well my first Zebralight I bought it was 4 years ago (SC64w Hi). If it wasn't for the model type stamped on it, I wouldn't remember if it was the Hi version or without Hi after not using it for long time. Just as an example.

edit: I'm not enough of an expert to recognize it by the beam/tint , just a regular user with too many flashlight existing of several brands.


----------



## SYZYGY

i guess check email receipt if you can't remember


----------



## rwolfenstein

Zebralight should make a flashlight with a tailcap switch.


----------



## ilikeguns40

rwolfenstein said:


> Zebralight should make a flashlight with a tailcap switch.


Yes, and make it user replaceable


----------



## aginthelaw

Why does my zl flicker in low mode. Doesn’t matter what battery I use. I don’t even remember what model it is


----------



## Mr. LED

It shouldn’t. Contact Zebralight for warranty.


----------



## bonC

SYZYGY said:


> i guess check email receipt if you can't remember


No need to till yet, but I think I will in the future for my first headlamp arrived yesterday 

See post #4483, this is exactly what I meant. Sometimes people just can't remember what model they have. Sure they can lookup their receipt to find out but isn't it much easier if the model is just stamped on it just like any other non-headlamp flashlights?


----------



## rwolfenstein

I can see they make a headlamp in red, I wonder why they don't have multi-color headlamps or lights.


----------



## bonC

After being clean for two years, I had a set back and got this H600Fw Mk IV XHP35 yesterday . I read XHP35 4500+ is discontinued so I had to get this before it's gone.


----------



## aginthelaw

Mr. LED said:


> It shouldn’t. Contact Zebralight for warranty.


They don’t have parts for it anymore so I’m on my own they say


----------



## SYZYGY

the warranty's only for one year anyway


----------



## PoliceScannerMan

They will still repair after warranty, think it's $15-20.


----------



## aginthelaw

PoliceScannerMan said:


> They will still repair after warranty, think it's $15-20.


They didn’t even offer that to me in this case, but they did repair my original 600’s (the ones with removable bezels) for $15 each and they were beat to poop


----------



## Romanko

SC700d discontinued.


https://www.zebralight.com/Discontinued-Products_c_18.html


----------



## knucklegary

Possibly just sold out? Doesn't show on their discontinued list


----------



## chillinn

idk if they're running more than one site, but after clicking on "Discontinued Products" heading on the front page, SC700d is in the 5th row down, 3rd from the left. Maybe they haven't updated the spreadsheet yet.


----------



## knucklegary

I must not be getting full site at my end.. However, looking at remaining stock, appears very slim pickens like they are closing store?


----------



## Derek Dean

aginthelaw said:


> Why does my zl flicker in low mode. Doesn’t matter what battery I use. I don’t even remember what model it is
> View attachment 36198


I suppose you've cleaned all the contact areas in the tail cap (spring, and circle area at the bottom outside of spring), and the end of the battery tube, and the little positive contact in the head?


----------



## SYZYGY

haha this comment cycle is never ending

no longer selling directly outside of usa! are they shutting down?
these models might be discontinued! are they shutting down?
they aren't updating models! are they shutting down?
aren't lights still available internationally through resellers/distributors? they are not shutting down!
is there even anything worthwhile to improve upon atm? they are not shutting down!
didn't they just come out with a new model? they are not shutting down!


----------



## knucklegary

SYZYGY said:


> haha this comment cycle is never ending
> 
> no longer selling directly outside of usa! are they shutting down?
> these models might be discontinued! are they shutting down?
> they aren't updating models! are they shutting down?
> aren't lights still available internationally through resellers/distributors? they are not shutting down!
> is there even anything worthwhile to improve upon atm? they are not shutting down!
> didn't they just come out with a new model? they are not shutting down!


Downsizing? I've never seen so few models offered


----------



## SYZYGY

and so the cycle continues


----------



## ilikeguns40

Supposed to be a new SC53c LE coming out soon with the high CRI LH351D emitter


----------



## knucklegary

SYZYGY said:


> and so the cycle continues


Hey, I haven't checked out their website in long time. Last time I viewed dozen models..

When you mention "cycle" are you meaning it's that time of the month for you?


----------



## knucklegary

ilikeguns40 said:


> Supposed to be a new SC53c LE coming out soon with the high CRI LH351D emitter


It would be nice to see 519a in AA format. Is that permitted to say on this thread?


----------



## PoliceScannerMan

I love it how they never tell anyone anything. Keeps it a mystery and they keep selling lights haha. Love my 700d!


----------



## knucklegary

PoliceScannerMan said:


> I love it how they never tell anyone anything. Keeps it a mystery and they keep selling lights haha. Love my 700d!


If I'd known they were discontinuing 700d I would have grabbed one before Holidays. No worries, nothing I can't live without..


----------



## ilikeguns40

knucklegary said:


> It would be nice to see 519a in AA format. Is that permitted to say on this thread?


It is but make it quick..

Yes fivenineteenA would be great, especially in a Zebralight. I also wish they would bring back another sc64w HI model


----------



## Mr. LED

knucklegary said:


> Downsizing? I've never seen so few models offered


Tough times, maybe they have to downsize, to NOT shutdown. Compared to other Chinese brands, Zebralight is a micro company, and economics/COVID/government in china has been terrible for some time. We’re lucky they haven’t shutdown during the worst of pandemic.

Let’s keep buying their lights and supporting them.


----------



## AstroTurf

ilikeguns40 said:


> Supposed to be a new SC53c LE coming out soon with the high CRI LH351D emitter


nice!!!


----------



## knucklegary

Supply strain on PRC mfgr is the issue.
Here's a message received from ZL;


----------



## AstroTurf

now, may be time to pick up the sc700fd...

already have the sc700d model.

decisions decisions


----------



## Mr. LED

Do it while they exist…


----------



## knucklegary

AstroTurf said:


> now, may be time to pick up the sc700fd...
> 
> already have the sc700d model.
> 
> decisions decisions


Only difference, that I can see, between d & fd is frosted lens.

How easy is bezel rings removed?


----------



## ilikeguns40

For those wondering the tint of the Zebralight SC64c LE LH351D 4000k emitter vs Malkoff SST20 4000k. Pretty much identical

Zebra left. Malkoff right


----------



## SYZYGY

knucklegary said:


> When you mention "cycle" are you meaning it's that time of the month for you?



hurr durr doh hohohoho


----------



## lampeDépêche

Double emitter??
The new AA-headlamp with a deep red hue seems to have a pair of emitters. Why, exactly?
The outputs are roughly in line with the old XPE red emitters. 
(And lumen levels are always low for red lights, because the lumen measurements are optimized for a different part of the spectrum). 
Anyhow -- I'm sure it will be fine, and if I did not already have two H503rs I would pick one up.
But I'm still curious....


----------



## AstroTurf

lampeDépêche said:


> Double emitter??
> The new AA-headlamp with a deep red hue seems to have a pair of emitters. Why, exactly?
> The outputs are roughly in line with the old XPE red emitters.
> (And lumen levels are always low for red lights, because the lumen measurements are optimized for a different part of the spectrum).
> Anyhow -- I'm sure it will be fine, and if I did not already have two H503rs I would pick one up.
> But I'm still curious....


two is one, and one is none...

LOLz


----------



## Romanko

A new cell appeared Vapcell INR14500 F12 1250mAh.
For example IKEA LADDA has 2450mAh.
1.2*2450 = 2940
3.7*1250 = 4625
Now I think it is a good idea to add Li-ion support.


----------



## lampeDépêche

Romanko said:


> A new cell appeared Vapcell INR14500 F12 1250mAh.
> For example IKEA LADDA has 2450mAh.
> 1.2*2450 = 2940
> 3.7*1250 = 4625
> Now I think it is a good idea to add Li-ion support.


In an earlier thread, I showed that some ZL AA models work fine on Li-ion, even if they do not officially support it. See details here:





ZL H53 on 14500?


When ZL moved from the H52 to the H53, they stopped supporting 3.7v Li-Ion batteries. Now, you can use only 1.2v Ni-MH, 1.5v alkaline (boo!) or 1.6v lithium primaries. That's the official line. But as we all know, there is a difference between what is officially true, i.e. what the legal...




www.candlepowerforums.com


----------



## Mr. LED

I can confirm that, the AA (SC53 and H53 variants) models work on 14500, except the SC5w. Just press the switch with the battery removed to reset the driver when changing battery chemistries.


----------



## lampeDépêche

Mr. LED said:


> I can confirm that, the AA models work on 14500. Just press the switch with the battery removed to reset the driver when changing battery chemistries.


Well, I don't know about the SC5's. Those used a different driver from the start, optimized for 1.2v sources. So, I'd be nervous about using a 14500 on those drivers, and I'm not going to be the first one to sacrifice my SC5 to find out.
But at least on the SC53 and H53 models and their variants, the 14500 works okay, provided the reset you mention.


----------



## AstroTurf

batteries are cheap...

zebralights, not so much.

why risk it?


----------



## lampeDépêche

AstroTurf said:


> batteries are cheap...
> 
> zebralights, not so much.
> 
> why risk it?


There's no risk in running your SC53 or H53 on Li-ion. Lots of people have tried it, and it works without any damage to the lights. I don't know about the SC5, so there may be some risk there.
Why do it? I run my H53 on Li-ions not because it's cheap or expensive, but because it puts out ~500 lumens that way instead of ~300 lumens. The bump in output makes it worthwhile.


----------



## id30209

lampeDépêche said:


> Well, I don't know about the SC5's. Those used a different driver from the start, optimized for 1.2v sources. So, I'd be nervous about using a 14500 on those drivers, and I'm not going to be the first one to sacrifice my SC5 to find out.
> But at least on the SC53 and H53 models and their variants, the 14500 works okay, provided the reset you mention.


SC5 does not work with 14500 and never try using it with those cells.
All other SC5x are good to go.


----------



## chillinn

lampeDépêche said:


> But at least on the SC53 and H53 models and their variants, the 14500 works okay, provided the reset you mention.



I thought the SC53 was AA only:
Operating Voltage Range: 0.7V - 2.0V

vs. SC52
Operating Voltage Range: 0.7V - 4.2V

I've said before, but I don't really see the point of Li-ion as opposed to AA when the light is regulated. Won't top brightness be exactly the same, even if it could take 14500?

I suppose the new higher capacity INR14500 have a third more energy and cost about the same or a little more than Eneloop AA, but not considering number of recharge cycles, maybe 400 if lucky vs 2100+, respectively.


----------



## holygeez03

Several ZL's have a much higher "burst mode" when using 14500... this was supported in the H52 and SC52. The 53 series dropped official support, but it has been verified that the "burst mode" still exists with the 53's.

I use 14500 in my H52Fw and H53Fc and I really enjoy the burst mode.


----------



## lampeDépêche

holygeez03 said:


> Several ZL's have a much higher "burst mode" when using 14500... this was supported in the H52 and SC52. The 53 series dropped official support, but it has been verified that the "burst mode" still exists with the 53's.
> 
> I use 14500 in my H52Fw and H53Fc and I really enjoy the burst mode.


Exactly.


----------



## chillinn

How bright is burst mode with 14500?


----------



## rwolfenstein

Ive used alkies with my Zebralight headlamp and its plenty of light for what I am doing. The most I have to worry about is taking the battery out when its gonna sit for a while to prevent it from having a burst cell in it.


----------



## GaryF

chillinn said:


> How bright is burst mode with 14500?


Per Zebralight, the H52 is 500 lumens for the warm white, and 535 for the regular tint on 14500. For AA, they show 280 and 300 lumens respectively.

They don’t list any figures for the H53 on 14500, which as others have noted, was not listed by ZL as supporting the higher voltages.


----------



## shane1

Looking to get a new EDC. How is this one? SC600w Mk IV Plus HI 18650 Flashlight with XHP50.3 HI Neutral White LED


----------



## ilikeguns40

shane1 said:


> Looking to get a new EDC. How is this one? SC600w Mk IV Plus HI 18650 Flashlight with XHP50.3 HI Neutral White LED


It’s very nice. You’ll definitely enjoy it


----------



## chillinn

I wanted a High CRI version of that light, but Zebralight only had one similar in floody, and 1800Lm. Different enough, I don't think it was the same light, if it was, it should have been able to breach 2000Lm. 

Am I the only one that wishes I could get a High CRI 3500K Zebralight? 4000K is barely ok for me, but 3500K is spot on perfect. I guess most are seduced by cool white with more lumens. Seems like almost no one appreciates warm, which is far more natural. I was raised in natural light.


----------



## ScottsoSmith

shane1 said:


> Looking to get a new EDC. How is this one? SC600w Mk IV Plus HI 18650 Flashlight with XHP50.3 HI Neutral White LED



I have the Sc600W MkIV HI and the SC64 LE. Both are excellent EDCs in my opinion. Nice tint and color rendering on both lights. Both beam patterns are ideal for EDC with a good balance of flood and throw. The SC64 has a good bit less lumens but still plenty for typical EDC tasks. The Sc600 rides a bit bigger in the pocket. The SC64 finds it way into my pocket more often than the SC600.


----------



## Batuche

Difference in size between these three diminutive Zebralight flashlights:

SC600w IV Plus - Single 18650 - 2300 Lm
SC64w HI - Single 18650 - 1300 Lm 
SC5c II LE - Single AA - 475 Lm


----------



## AstroTurf

Batuche said:


> Difference in size between these three diminutive Zebralight flashlights:
> 
> SC600w IV Plus - Single 18650 - 2300 Lm
> SC64w HI - Single 18650 - 1300 Lm
> SC5c II LE - Single AA - 475 Lm
> 
> 
> View attachment 37427


Nice!!!


----------



## Batuche

rwolfenstein said:


> Ive used alkies with my Zebralight headlamp and its plenty of light for what I am doing. The most I have to worry about is taking the battery out when its gonna sit for a while to prevent it from having a burst cell in it.


Great idea. I can't count the number of times I've forgotten an alkie in a product and had it corrode the heck out of it


----------



## Batuche

Sorry I forgot to post this. 

On 12/30/2022 I inquired with Zebralight about the availability of the SC700d and received the following reply: 


Department: Sales

Subject: ZebraLight, Inc.: Update Tracking #56495

We were told by our Cree distributor that the emitter we use in the SC700d won't be available during the next 2-3 months.

Sincerely,

ZebraLight, Inc.
PO BOX 92307
Southlake, TX 76092


----------



## rwolfenstein

Batuche said:


> Sorry I forgot to post this.
> 
> On 12/30/2022 I inquired with Zebralight about the availability of the SC700d and received the following reply:
> 
> 
> Department: Sales
> 
> Subject: ZebraLight, Inc.: Update Tracking #56495
> 
> We were told by our Cree distributor that the emitter we use in the SC700d won't be available during the next 2-3 months.
> 
> Sincerely,
> 
> ZebraLight, Inc.
> PO BOX 92307
> Southlake, TX 76092


I think when I read the specs on my H53C AA headlamp, they used a samsung built LED that gave it that white tone. Its rather nice.


----------



## shane1

Batuche said:


> Difference in size between these three diminutive Zebralight flashlights:
> 
> SC600w IV Plus - Single 18650 - 2300 Lm
> SC64w HI - Single 18650 - 1300 Lm
> SC5c II LE - Single AA - 475 Lm
> 
> 
> View attachment 37427


Which is your favorite for edc?


----------



## Batuche

shane1 said:


> Which is your favorite for edc?


Both the SC64w HI and the SC5c II LE slip into the coin pocket on jeans, plus their screwed on pocket clips hold/grip much better than the removable one on the SC600w IV Plus, so much less chance of losing them. So to answer your question, these are the two I carry the most. I only recently purchased the SC5c and thrilled with the amount of light it puts out. 

I didn't need the SC5c but have so many eneloop AA batteries that I used that excuse to justify my purchase. Anyway, does anyone really need a reason to buy another flashlight?


----------



## holygeez03

shane1 said:


> Which is your favorite for edc?


The SC64w HI has got to be the best overall light if you must choose one... the SC600 is great around the house/yard, but it is too big for EDC... the AA sized lights are fantastic for EDC, but don't have the power for some outdoor tasks. The SC64 will fit in a pocket fine and has the power for outdoors.

I have the SC600w Plus for around the house/yard and I EDC a H52Fw or H53Fc... and I have two SC64w HI for travel, car, etc.

Sadly, it appears the SC64 offerings are scarce... hopefully that means a 65 is coming, but I'm not hopeful.

Also, in my opinion the SC600w Plus is better than the HI version.


----------



## PoliceScannerMan

SC65w LE with dedome 5000K 519a would be amazing


----------



## Batuche

"The SC64w HI has got to be the best overall light if you must choose one."

Agreed! It's the one I reach for first. It's just great in so many ways. Wish I bought two when they were available - File under: woulda/coulda/shoulda. To really light up an area I go with the SC600w - great for hiking, although I also use a H53Fw AA Headlamp a lot too. I haven't owned the SC5c long enough to get a good feel for battery life but expect it will be about like an H53Fw - using eneloop pro for all AA requirements.


----------



## Batuche

holygeez03 said:


> Several ZL's have a much higher "burst mode" when using 14500... this was supported in the H52 and SC52. The 53 series dropped official support, but it has been verified that the "burst mode" still exists with the 53's.
> 
> I use 14500 in my H52Fw and H53Fc and I really enjoy the burst mode.


It is my understanding that I cannot use a 14500 in my H53Fw AA Headlamp*.*


----------



## Mr. LED

Batuche said:


> It is my understanding that I cannot use a 14500 in my H53Fw AA Headlamp*.*


You can, just make sure to press the power button without the battery, when you change battery types.


----------



## holygeez03

Batuche said:


> It is my understanding that I cannot use a 14500 in my H53Fw AA Headlamp*.*



As stated many times by myself and other users... 14500 is not officially "supported" by ZL, but several of us use 14500 cells in H53 lights (and SC 53 I think) without any issues reported so far.

It is not known why official support was dropped... maybe they don't guarantee voltage protection, maybe because it temporarily goofs up the capacity check... who knows.

But it appears to work fine and does provide a "burst mode" with stepdown after a minute, just like the H52 series.

*One caveat is that some 14500 cells may be too long*... I can check and see which cells I am using if you need a recommendation or the info is in the other thread regarding 14500 usage in ZL 53 lights.


----------

