# Sanyo announces Eneloop Pro and Eneloop Plus cells



## Eismagier (Jun 10, 2011)

Source



Sanyo said:


> The new “eneloop pro” battery has a 25% higher capacity than regular eneloop batteries, making it especially suitable for gadgets with high power consumption, such as digital cameras, strobe lights and flashlights etc. The new “eneloop plus” battery, with its overheat prevention function which suppresses overheating in case of improper use, is ideal for toys.



Sanyo notes that "An equivalent model of the “eneloop pro” has been marketed in Europe as “XX (double X)”. I guess I was right about the naming scheme after all


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## Groundhog (Jun 10, 2011)

Those Pro's look NICE!


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## s0lar (Jun 10, 2011)

My own storage test "proved" that after 4 months the Sanyo 2700 still has around 100mAh of capacity compared to the XX. 2100 (S2700) vs 2000 (XX).
From the info provided by Panasonic/Sanyo we finally know what kind of remaining capacity we should expect after a year. 1250mAh for the 2700's after 1y is decent.


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## RepProdigious (Jun 10, 2011)

Black loopies!! Cool!


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## vali (Jun 10, 2011)

I guess that's only when new or low use. We need more tests to find how they actually withstands frequent use after several dozens of recharges. Will they be tough like the eneloops or fragile like most high capacity ones?


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## flame2000 (Jun 10, 2011)

Eneloop Pro are basically the XX in Europe. Then there is also the red Harmolattice 2500mAh with the Eneloop technology. Wonder why the Eneloop 2500 have so many packaging type for different market while the Eneloop 2000 comes only in white as standard? I know they do come in colour and glitter series as well. That's more for collection!


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## Eismagier (Jun 10, 2011)

flame2000 said:


> Eneloop Pro are basically the XX in Europe. Then there is also the red Harmolattice 2500mAh with the Eneloop technology. Wonder why the Eneloop 2500 have so many packaging type for different market while the Eneloop 2000 comes only in white as standard? I know they do come in colour and glitter series as well. That's more for collection!


 The Harmolattice brand has been used in Asia for some time, so it's not terribly unusual that they released their 2400/2500 LSD cells branded as such. Then again, I thought "XX" was a pretty stupid name to begin with, which is why I said they'd eventually rebrand them as "Eneloop Pro" when they first came out. The Eneloop Lites first surfaced as Harmolattices too.

I wonder if they're going to phase out the regular Eneloops in favor of the Eneloop Plus eventually, considering that they're essentially the same with added protection. Or can anyone think of an application where you'd actually _want_ the possibility of the cell overheating?


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## flame2000 (Jun 10, 2011)

Eismagier said:


> The Harmolattice brand has been used in Asia for some time, so it's not terribly unusual that they released their 2400/2500 LSD cells branded as such. Then again, I thought "XX" was a pretty stupid name to begin with, which is why I said they'd eventually rebrand them as "Eneloop Pro" when they first came out. The Eneloop Lites first surfaced as Harmolattices too.
> 
> I wonder if they're going to phase out the regular Eneloops in favor of the Eneloop Plus eventually, considering that they're essentially the same with added protection. Or can anyone think of an application where you'd actually _want_ the possibility of the cell overheating?



I haven't heard any case of regular Eneloop over heating. Perhaps in their lab test they do experience over-heating when inserted wrongly. That's why they stress on this "_suppresses overheating in case of improper use, is ideal for toys". _


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## Eismagier (Jun 10, 2011)

I'm curious if the thermistor has any negative effects, such as current limitations or reduced durability. Otherwise it seems stupid to keeping producing the vanilla version.


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## Wrend (Jun 10, 2011)

I'll wait for you guys to test them all before I decide whether or not it's worth investing in them. Until then, I'll have to make do with the 1500s.

:thumbsup:


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## rick45acp (Jun 10, 2011)

So, is there any advantage to the PRO??


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## QwertyAccess (Jun 10, 2011)

*Eneloop Pros and Eneloop Plus*

Has anyone seen the new Eneloop Pros and Plus that was just announced yet?

Sounds like I need to get my hands on some!

http://panasonic.net/sanyo/news/2011/06/09-1.html


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## 45/70 (Jun 10, 2011)

*Re: Eneloop Pros and Eneloop Plus*

You should have checked the Forum before posting, Qwerty. There has already been a thread started by Eismagier today about the Sanyo cells.

Dave


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## RepProdigious (Jun 10, 2011)

rick45acp said:


> So, is there any advantage to the PRO??


 
They're black...... oh yeah, and 2400mAh but supposedly still very LSDish, like the XX-series only cooler.


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## cave dave (Jun 10, 2011)

Hate the black, they look too much like my 14500's.


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## beerwax (Jun 10, 2011)

.............


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## Napalm (Jun 10, 2011)

Can we please have an XXX version that comes with appropriate trading cards in the package???

Nap.


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## SilverFox (Jun 10, 2011)

If some of the comments in this thread seem a little off it is because I merged two threads discussing these cells.

Tom


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## Chrontius (Jun 12, 2011)

Eismagier said:


> I'm curious if the thermistor has any negative effects, such as current limitations or reduced durability. Otherwise it seems stupid to keeping producing the vanilla version.


 
It will certainly limit the short-circuit current, but the question is to what will current be limited? Ten amps will be the practical upper limit of the cells, and five amps will be adequate for most of the uses a flashaholic will have.


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## snakebite (Jun 12, 2011)

was a ptc added?
how much volume does it take up?how big a capacity hit from the space taken by it?
and multple product names for the same thing is nothing new.rayovac hybrid,4.0,and platinum being the same cell.
so maybe the sanyo marketing folks will introduce the xxx."made especially for personal entertainment devices"


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## ScaryFatKidGT (Jun 13, 2011)

So Pro=XX and Plus=extra money for overheat protection?


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## beerwax (Jun 13, 2011)

..................


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## Burgess (Jun 13, 2011)

Waiting for these to FINALLY be available in U.S.A.



_


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## EZO (Jun 13, 2011)

Burgess said:


> Waiting for these to FINALLY be available in U.S.A.
> _


This is America, Dagnamit! Why ain't these available here first! It must these Republi...cans.......or the Demo...crats or maybe those Tee...Partie...erz, or sumpin'. :huh:


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## Marc999 (Jun 13, 2011)

Sexy looking wrappers. I picked up the Sanyo xx awhile ago. They're fine but certainly not worth the premium paid for that extra ~25% capacity. I also see no reason to get the Eneloop Plus if you already have a stockpile of regular/tones/glitter whatever loops. At least they're keeping the name Eneloop fresh in our minds.


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## ecrbattery (Jun 13, 2011)

Anybody else seeing this 







and this






The original high-res photos are here: (you will need to zoom in)

Eneloop Pro
Eneloop Pro with charger

Eneloop Plus
Eneloop Plus with charger


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## Wrend (Jun 13, 2011)

> Anybody else seeing this


The two cells have the same + end?


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## PapaLumen (Jun 14, 2011)

vent hole?


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## ecrbattery (Jun 14, 2011)

PapaLumen said:


> vent hole?



Yup, look like the eneloop signature vent holes are back.

Did Sanyo read the comment by Mr Happy?



Mr Happy said:


> My observation about this is that Sanyo has made a big *marketing mistake*. Wittingly, or unwittingly, Sanyo established a particular design in everyone's mind as a trademark of the Eneloop cell. When they then changed it, they confused everyone, as evidenced by the huge amount of discussion and number of questions generated. If Sanyo had been properly aware of this they would not have changed the design in the way that they did.




Look like Sanyo may have to update their FAQ again from this:



> Why is there no vent holes on the top of an eneloop battery?
> The eneloop battery without vent holes is a design change for improvement (performance and appearance) by our factory in Japan. These newly configured batteries were changed from November 2010 shipping.



To this: 



> Why is there vent holes on the top of an eneloop battery?
> The eneloop battery with vent holes is a design change for improvement (capacity and overheat protection) by our factory in Japan. These newly configured batteries were changed from July 2011 shipping.


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## Wrend (Jun 14, 2011)

Now that's funny, and a little suspicious. 

Wonder if my older Eneloops have "overheat protection," unlike my newer crown ones... Does Plus _translate_ into, "venting holes for explosion prevention," or something?

It sounds to me like Panasonic might be having Eneloop market growing pains.

Except for those in the know, most people over here (in the USA) have never even heard of Eneloops, let alone Eneloop varieties.

I've always been rather baffled how that could be, because they seemed to clearly offer such an advanced and attractive product.

...

Anyway, if you look at the surface textures on the + ends, they look practically identical. Kind of odd.


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## ecrbattery (Jun 14, 2011)

Wrend said:


> Anyway, if you look at the surface textures on the + ends, they look practically identical. Kind of odd.



I noticed this too. It does look like someone in the marketing department is photo-chopping the positive end for all the photos. Either that or the quality control is so good that all batteries are identical clone. We will just have to wait and see 

I do believe the eneloop plus is a new design. Sanyo stated that it has a PTC thermistor for thermal protection. It also have a different product number of HR-3UPT. Like others here, I wonder how the thermistor will affect the current and voltage of the battery. It may not be compatible in device like the Sanyo KIR-SL2S hand warmer which heat up the batteries quite a bit in "Turbo" mode.


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## ScaryFatKidGT (Jun 16, 2011)

Its the same battery they just photo shopped the wrapper on


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## beerwax (Jun 16, 2011)

..........


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## Bolek (Jun 17, 2011)

According to the marking on the Sanyo eneloop marketed in Europe as XX 2500mAh they can be recharged only 500 times


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## Lite_me (Jun 17, 2011)

Bolek said:


> According to the marking on the Sanyo eneloop marketed in Europe as XX 2500mAh they can be recharged only 500 times


Yeah but, IF you were to recharge them about once a week, they'd still last you close to 10yrs! Good enough for me! Something even better may be available by then... if I'm even still here. 

I just picked up a 4-pack of the XX to play with.


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## yliu (Jun 18, 2011)

wait... does it mean that the eneloop pro is the same as the eneloop XX?


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## Eismagier (Jun 18, 2011)

yliu said:


> wait... does it mean that the eneloop pro is the same as the eneloop XX?


 Yes, Sanyo specifically states that on the page linked in the original post.


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## cave dave (Jun 18, 2011)

Burgess said:


> Waiting for these to FINALLY be available in U.S.A.



You might need a few more bags of popcorn. According to the press release:



> The “eneloop pro” will be available from July 21, 2011 and the “eneloop pro” charger set will go on sale from September 21 *in Japan only*. The “eneloop plus” and its charger set will be available from December 1, 2011, also *in Japan only*.


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## flame2000 (Jun 18, 2011)

More than a month ago I wrote Sanyo SG an email asking if there are any plans to release XX over here (I was looking for a higher capacity LSD NiMh) and I was inform that XX is for the European market and there is an equivalent Harmolattice 2500mAh (with the Eneloop technology) for the Asian market. Unlike the XX, Harmolattice are not pre-charged. Now they announced the Eneloop Pro and Plus. Are these only for the Japanese market?

Edit: Saw cavedave post, so it's for Japan only.  Think I'll just go for the XX or Harmolattice instead.


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## Eismagier (Jun 18, 2011)

Wouldn't importing from Japan be cheaper for US resellers than importing from Europe? I'd assume imported Eneloop Pro cells will replace imported XX cells before too long.

Whether Sanyo will bring them to the US officially will probably depend on the recovery of the dollar.


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## cave dave (Aug 16, 2011)

Thomas Distributing is now carrying the Eneloop XX. 

Not sure if that means the US version will be XX or if they got them through a European distributor. Not cheap at ~ $21, but better than amazon.


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## Burgess (Aug 17, 2011)

to Cave_Dave --


Thank you for that Heads-Up !


:thumbsup:
_


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## gopajti (Aug 18, 2011)

Eneloop Pro available on ebay

Ships to: N. and S. America, Europe, Asia, Australia

http://cgi.ebay.com/OFFICIAL-Sanyo-...ies_Chargers&hash=item5d2fad1832#ht_658wt_905


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## flame2000 (Aug 18, 2011)

That's a high price to pay for getting the latest Eneloop Pro batteries! 
I just picked up 8pc of Eneloop XX for $37 (including shipping) from eBay, seems like a better deal.


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## Lite_me (Aug 18, 2011)

gopajti said:


> Eneloop Pro available on ebay
> 
> Ships to: N. and S. America, Europe, Asia, Australia
> 
> http://cgi.ebay.com/OFFICIAL-Sanyo-...ies_Chargers&hash=item5d2fad1832#ht_658wt_905


That's $4.50 more than I paid for the XX's on Amazon! They're the same thing.


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## gopajti (Aug 20, 2011)

??

Eneloop Pro and XX not the same..


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## Eismagier (Aug 20, 2011)

Same cell, different wrapper.



> An equivalent model of the “eneloop pro” has been marketed in Europe as “XX (double X)”.


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## gopajti (Aug 20, 2011)

Ok I understand but the difference 100mAh. Why?


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## Eismagier (Aug 20, 2011)

There's no difference. Both are rated 2400 mAh minimum, 2500 typical.


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## degarb (Oct 15, 2011)

My first google of this xx cell told me 1500 cycles. I thought for a moment that I found my perfect cell. 500 cycles isn't good, unless you could actually get 500 deep cycles. I read most people with smart chargers are only going to get 100 to 200 cycles. To get to 1000 you need only charge to 85 percent, use every day, and only draw out at .1 C or some such low number. 

To name them the triple x would hurt their sales as many adult filters would kick in. I think the double is appropriate since we are only seeing a little nipple, which explains why these hit Europe before the US.


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## kodi (Oct 15, 2011)

Actually I have a pair of XX which are more than 500 cycles. Yes - I was purposely charging them 0.5A and discharging 0.75A with 2 hours brake between cycles. The main problem with charging them is termination - some chargers (like BC-900 with v27 software) have problem with termination of these cells, overcharging them. Good smart chargers and dedicated ones (I was using iChargers with custom defined dV detection for this test) should give you over 500 cycles. This pair still has capacity over 1900mAh.


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## Wrend (Oct 15, 2011)

So you're saying you tested them and put them through more than 500 cycles? At the rates you mentioned, that's over 6 months worth of cycling the cells strait (with the 2 hour resting period only after both a charge and discharge or discharge and charge cycle, more if they rested between each phase), while taking into account their diminishing capacity down to 1960mAh (80% capacity).

Either way, I don't think this accurately reflects their more common uses, shelf aging, and real world application cycle life expectancy.

I still prefer the "1500" cycle "2000" mAh Eneloops, which should have a cumulative lifetime capacity total of about 2.4 times that of the XX cells. I'll take the 2.4x cumulative capacity of the "1500" cycle Eneloops over the 1.25x per use capacity of the XX cells.


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## kodi (Oct 18, 2011)

Actually my job is to test different types of equipment - various types of energy sources as well. And believe me - Eneloops XX were easy. One company requested a test of 15000 cycles (fortunately - the future environment of those cells required to be discharged at up to 20C and charged at up to 10C, so the test could be done a little faster  )

Regarding the shelf aging - eneloops in general are one of the top cells regarding this parameter.


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## Battery Guy (Oct 18, 2011)

s0lar said:


> My own storage test "proved" that after 4 months the Sanyo 2700 still has around 100mAh of capacity compared to the XX. 2100 (S2700) vs 2000 (XX).
> From the info provided by Panasonic/Sanyo we finally know what kind of remaining capacity we should expect after a year. 1250mAh for the 2700's after 1y is decent.



But consider that the self discharge rate of a conventional NiMH cell will increase with use as the metal hydride alloy corrodes, releasing manganese into the electrolyte. Manganese compounds build up in the separator and produce high resistance short circuits that greatly increase the self discharge rate.

The eneloop metal hydride alloy does not contain manganese, and therefore the self discharge rate should not increase with usage.

Cheers,
BG


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## Battery Guy (Oct 18, 2011)

kodi said:


> Actually my job is to test different types of equipment - various types of energy sources as well. And believe me - Eneloops XX were easy. One company requested a test of 15000 cycles (fortunately - the future environment of those cells required to be discharged at up to 20C and charged at up to 10C, so the test could be done a little faster  )
> 
> Regarding the shelf aging - eneloops in general are one of the top cells regarding this parameter.



Kodi

Can you clarify that statement? 20C discharge would be approximately 50 A, and 10C approximately 25 A. The eneloop and eneloop pros might be capable of very short pulses at these discharge rates, but I have a hard time believing that anyone would cycle these cells at that rate, or that 15000 cycles would be possible under any conditions other than limited SOC window cycling.

BG


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## kodi (Oct 19, 2011)

Battery Guy said:


> Kodi
> 
> Can you clarify that statement? 20C discharge would be approximately 50 A, and 10C approximately 25 A. The eneloop and eneloop pros might be capable of very short pulses at these discharge rates, but I have a hard time believing that anyone would cycle these cells at that rate, or that 15000 cycles would be possible under any conditions other than limited SOC window cycling.
> 
> BG



The test for those 15k cycles was for another company (and different chemistry of cells). Sorry for the confusion


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