# AN/VSS-1|3 Power Supply



## modamag (Jan 31, 2007)

Guys, I'm in the process of acquiring parts/supply for my next little toy.

I ran accross a company (in the states) that have a stash of Loraine A100F25 Power Supply for pretty cheap (<$250).

Here's the spec on them.

_Input Volts 120/208/240
Input Amps : 21/24/38
Input Frequency : 60hz
No . Phase : 1 Phase
Output Votage: 29 VDC
Output Amps: 100Amp
Condition: New/Used? TBD
Misc: High Frequency
_







According to the listing on ebay, it's adjustable voltage up to 29V and can be use with the VSS 1 or 3.

I'm not a EE guys, so is this unit REALLY sufficient to drive our toy?
Further functionality of this unit would really help.

If any of the VSS owner need one of these power supply let me know.


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## billhess (Jan 31, 2007)

I believe that would work definatly for the 3a. the 1 you might need a battery inbetween cause you are cutting it close. I would doubt if it really puts out 100 amps and a battery or 2 would give you a little buffer.


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## tvodrd (Jan 31, 2007)

Jonathan, billhess has a tested VSS-1 available. 

Larry


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## mattheww50 (Feb 1, 2007)

billhess said:


> I believe that would work definatly for the 3a. the 1 you might need a battery inbetween cause you are cutting it close. I would doubt if it really puts out 100 amps and a battery or 2 would give you a little buffer.


I wouldn't doubt it for a second that it can put out 100 amperes. However the current demands are reversed in the spec, it would be 21 amps at 240V, 24 amps at 208V, and 38A at 120A. So roughly 5000VA in for 2900Watts Out, thats 57%, so the power factor is probably in the mid 60's. That's about right for a big switching supply.


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## modamag (Feb 1, 2007)

So this PS is gonna dump 2KW of heat 
But it's enough to power either a VSS1 or VSS-3A :devil:


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## Xzn (Feb 1, 2007)

It'll dump 2kw of heat if it's being pushed to it's full capacity. For example, when my dual core laptop is idle, the power brick is semi cool to the touch. Push both cores to 100% and put the screen on max brightness, the power brick is actually hot.


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## CarbonArc (Feb 1, 2007)

I have a working vss-1 as well.


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## ShortArc (Feb 1, 2007)

The VSS1 startup current will easily exceed 100amps momentarily during startup, so I agree with billhess a set of batteries may be required. Besides heat rejection the blowers in these switch power supplies tend to be very loud so get ear plugs and shades.


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## mattheww50 (Feb 2, 2007)

Xzn said:


> It'll dump 2kw of heat if it's being pushed to it's full capacity. For example, when my dual core laptop is idle, the power brick is semi cool to the touch. Push both cores to 100% and put the screen on max brightness, the power brick is actually hot.


Not going to dump anywhere 2kw heat in the supply. Power= V*I only if V and I are in phase. One of the problems with large switching supplies is they have a very large reactive component, so the voltage and current are not in phase. In the case of a switching supply, V*I on the input side is always higher watts.

This is the reason AC equipment like transformers is rated in VoltAmps rather than watts. If the current is at quadrture (90 degress out of phase), you can still blow a circuit breaker, or burn up wiring because of the current draw, but there is no assurance at all that much actual power consumed in the load.

The power supply is probably about 85-90% efficient, so the heat loss at 2900 watts output is not likely to exceed about 400 watts.


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## IgNITEor (Feb 4, 2007)

Hey everyone. As I was reading through the posts on this power subject, I see that we're getting into switch-mode territory! Modamag, if your Lorain rectifier weighs anywhere near fifty or so pounds, it's not a switching power supply. I've had the aching pleasure of humping the vast Lorain Flotrol line of beast power supplies out of many a telecom shelter. What you have is a FINE source of gnarly, well regulated power. Be careful on tweaking the voltage up too high as this will send the output monitoring board into alarm, and you may have to power-down to reset this. 
As with billhess & ShortArc, I would place a beefy truck battery in parallel with the Lorain as well. In the event you accidently (whoa!!!) trip your rectifier off, you'll keep the blower running while recovering that special screwdriver used for voltage adjusting!
Have some great fun with that monster!


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## BVH (Jul 4, 2012)

Revival! As to the adjustability of these, I want to go the other direction - down to 28, maybe 28.5. Is this done by opening up the unit or can it be done externally? Where and what will I be looking for for those that have gone before me?

If it's not a switcher, is it a Linear? I've popped two cheap Mastech 30V/50A PS's, one with a Schottky Diode in-line running ballasted lights. I've been told that switcher's are not a good match for high inductance loads. Can those knowledgeable comment?


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## larryk (Jul 5, 2012)

A little off topic but I bought one of BVH's VSS-3's and noticed a 65 percent increase in brightness going from 24.1 volts under load to 27.5 volts. Anyone else have similar results ?


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## Norm (Jul 5, 2012)

modamag said:


> _Input Volts 120/208/240
> Input Amps : 21/24/38
> Input Frequency : 60hz
> No . Phase : 1 Phase
> ...



Do you think the Amps are reversed? it should draw less Amps at 240V than at 120V.

Norm


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## larryk (Jul 5, 2012)

Yes, the amps are reversed. Here is modamag's post with pictures.
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?198335-AN-VSS-1-and-AN-VSS-3-Power-Supply


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## IgNITEor (Jul 11, 2012)

larryk said:


> A little off topic but I bought one of BVH's VSS-3's and noticed a 65 percent increase in brightness going from 24.1 volts under load to 27.5 volts. Anyone else have similar results ?



Yes indeedy. I run the Death Ray at just below alarm level, about 28.4 Volts for the 125 Amp main power supply
and slightly less with the back-up unit. Really likes that 28 Volts! Hot air exhaust pumps out plenty for the chilly fingers.
Most of the telecom grade power supplies, either the big iron units or the switch mode types have the adjustable 
pot on the front panel. These were often "tweaked' when multiple units were operating in parallel (for several hundred amps output) to enable safe load sharing.
There was always one master unit working a little harder than the rest :thinking: I'm guessing it was in charge of keeping all the other units operating in fine form.


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## Phased_Array (Aug 18, 2012)

My 3 never came close to the Amps it said it needed, the 1 may be different tho.


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## nealitc (Sep 30, 2012)

Phased_Array said:


> My 3 never came close to the Amps it said it needed, the 1 may be different tho.


How much does it actually draw?

Just got my VSS-3 (not A). Considering using a 1500W switch mode supply (Mean Well RSP-1500-27, about $350 new) output 27V at 56A, so I can plug the thing into a 120V/20A outlet. Anyone have any experience using these, or better/cheaper ideas?

Looking forward to some light from my brightest flashlight!


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## IgNITEor (Oct 4, 2012)

nealitc, welcome to CPF and the wild big lights department! Better keep your welding hood close at hand.
I just looked at the spec. page for the model you described. It shows inrush current at 120 Volts requiring a 30 Amp circuit.
If you use a pair of healthy 12 Volt batteries (connected in series for 24 Volts) in the circuit between the power supply and your VSS-3, this will help with starting your light. 
Be careful where you "plug" in your power supply. I wouldn't do this with anything less than a dedicated circuit. If you're not certain of this, carefully check out the circuit your considering to use. Not worth the 
risk of damaging an existing circuit that cannot carry the load. 
If you can, show us some pics of your gear.


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## BVH (Oct 4, 2012)

After frying two switchers on HID lights, and learning that switchers do not like high inductance kickback produced by ballasts, I got a Lorain 29V, 100 Amp rectifier from member Modamag for $150 and haven't looked back. My VSS-3a at only 25.5 Volts, is drawing 58 Amps fully warmed and thru the start and boost cycles. Powering with a full 28 Volts is probably going to kick that figure up significantly as these are not regulated lights. I remember a post years ago by another member showing his military rectifier reading 60 Amps while running his VSS-3.


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## BravoKilo (Oct 4, 2012)

Based on your post to the thread on my AN/VSS-3 and this post, I have been looking at filtering equipment for my light. But I realize something - my ballast is not solid state at all, it is a strip resistor that is cooled from the out flow of the heat exchanger for the light - built into the back of the housing. That being the case, and not having an O-scope, I wonder just how much of a spike I am getting when firing the light? I do not see any highly inductive components in the light at all. Being a DC light, the power factor is not an issue as that is only a function of capacitance and inductance in an AC circuit. My switchmode rectifier does not have a transformer in it so the only other inductance would come from the power to the rectifier itself. 

All the same, I do want to protect my gear so I am researching this and designing a power conditioning system that will handle the current requirements of the lamp and I will let everybody know what I come up with. The suggestions you gave to me have really helped, BVH.

IgNITEor - what are you running for your AN/VSS-1? batteries, rectifier, etc? Also, I remember parts of a discussion we had years ago on the playa about your ballast - didn't you have a solid state ballast that you converted back to resistor? That was back in the day when you had your lamp mounted on the back of that trailer if you can remember back that far.


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## BVH (Oct 4, 2012)

BK, PM sent


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## BravoKilo (Oct 6, 2012)

BVH - do you have a solid state ballast on your VSS-3? or the flat wire 0.130 ohm resistor on the fan outlet? Looking over all of the schematics, I see no inductance in these lamps. And also, thanks to your forwarding the manual, I see that the lamp has some rudimentary filtering from the 2160uF capacitor that forms an RC low pass filter which, if negating bulb resistance, has a modest rolloff at about 560 hertz. In fact that bank is there to smooth the hash from the bulb in the first place. 

I am looking at this because I am thinking about making my own high current power filter/metering system hacked out of an old microwave transformer and a big old juicy cap. But looking at this, I see only possible harmonics from a switchmode rectifier as being MAYBE reflected back to the supply in some way as to do damage. That is fairly easy to filter. God I need to get an O-scope!


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## BVH (Oct 6, 2012)

BK, you're far beyond my electronics knowledge. I do understand what you're saying above about the filtering etc but all that about the microwave parts conversion.....well.... I have the strip ballast resistor in the fan path. When I say high inductance kickback, it's the term I've heard from others more knowledgeable than myself and was told that any HID ballast produces this. When I think VSS-3 "ballast" I think of all the parts inside the case as constituting a ballast.

What is your goal by wanting to do the conversion?


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## BravoKilo (Oct 6, 2012)

Maybe I should better explain what I would like to do. First of all, I am not going to take it for granted that the lamp is not producing noise that could be reflected back to my power supply which may damage it. The switchmode rectifier I have is designed to deliver nice smooth power to electronic equipment that probably does not produce appreciable harmonics and noise of its own. So, my plan is to make a power conditioning and metering system to monitor my light. Probably overkill but I am having fun geeking out. 

What I am looking at is making my own high current DC line filter which will be similar to that listed in this PDF - http://www.spectrumcontrol.com/pubs/pp78-79.pdf. This device is designed to filter much higher frequency response than what I want. I would like something that filters down to a much lower frequency, so I plan to make it myself. 
I am going to take a discarded Microwave Oven Transformer, cut off the old core and rewind it as a choke coil. You can see HERE how people have removed one core to make things like a spot welder with an old transformer MOT. So, this would be a very easy mod to make a 1 or 2 winding choke of my own by winding a bunch of turns of heavy gauge wire on that core where the old coils were. That will handle full current without worrying about heating issues. If I add a couple of robust capacitors to that homemade choke, I have a nice little high current filter. To that I will add voltage and current metering and I have a nice little power conditioning and monitoring platform for my light.

Now - on the topic of ballasts, I am learning still - mostly in the area of electronic/digital ballasts. The type of ballast that the VSS-3 had (and the VSS-1 I am sure) is a resistive ballast. It's whole purpose in life is to limit the amount of current through the bulb. The reason is that once the arc is established in the bulb, current will flow practically unimpeded - you could push as much as that bulb will take before it explodes. The ballast, which is really nothing more than a current limiting resistor, limits that current flow through the bulb as reliably as possible. A resistive ballast Its not that much different than limiting the current through an LED with a resistor. A resistive ballast is normally not adjustable - as in the case of the VSS-3 and should not produce any noise or hash - leaving only the bulb to make noise. I think this is the case anyway.


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## IgNITEor (Oct 6, 2012)

Hey BK, happy to read your -3 project is happening nicely!

My resistor ballast? That was (and still is) used for the KK light with the 1200 Watt HMI lamp.
I do have a magnetic ballast for that lamp but I haven't got it to match up with the KK light's
ignition system. The HMI lamp performs better with the mag ballast and uses 
about half the fuel.

Only the Deathray has the battery set under the tool box, which is in parallel with the rectifier 
inside the tool box. And yes, both the -3 and -1 have ballast resistors in the exhaust ducting. 
If these were AC lamps they would have chokes in series with the output of the transformer 
in the magnetic ballast. 

When the KK light is running and warmed-up with the Frankenstein resistor ballast, it has this 
soothing resonant ring between the lamp, ballast and generator. I'm thinking it's because the 
generator provides an inverter output that does some kind of phase reaction with the lamp. 
It doesn't do that with the magnetic ballast.:thinking: 

Yeah, I do remember the trailer days! We were using the rented diesel MQ generator then. We also had 
that humongous IR snoot attached to the front. 

And for a cool 3 large, you can have this fine instrument to see what's happening with your power supply!
Still drooling for that puppy after so many years now. Someday, if only......


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## BravoKilo (Oct 7, 2012)

oh, I remember now - for some reason I thought that was for the Death Ray that ballast of yours. I remember you said you had problems with it. You were describing it to me, showed it to me, I remember a plexiglass cover to see the parts inside - that is what I _remember _anyway.

I have to tell you that I am having as much fun as I thought I would with this light. I do understand what your joy was now - and it only took that one night you were working lighthouse (and Magpie's follies) to get me there. It took a lot of trust and I am really glad I had the opportunity to do it.


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## BVH (Oct 7, 2012)

BK if you concerned about damaging your PS with the -3, why not just pick up one of the cheap and -3 field proven $150 Lorains off Modamag or Ebay?

I know what you mean by having fun with the light! I've been tinkering with power supplies lately. Both variable regulated old heavy linears and also arc lamp supplies. It's sort of like Christmas when I get one, I can't wait to pop the top and look around inside.


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## BravoKilo (Oct 7, 2012)

I actually would like to get one and he doesn't live too far away from me so shipping would not be too bad. It looks My biggest hurdle is that I have already spent about $1500 on this light (and I don't have batteries yet). I don't think my wife would take too kindly to me buying this right now if you know what I mean. 

I looked for information on this power supply and the one I have as well. There is precious little information like a PDF manual or anything with specs. But I have the impression that this rectifier is a switcher like mine. The differences I see are that it is in a larger case, it doesn't have fans like mine does and it will operate on 120/240 whereas mine will only operate on 240 volts. And this one has a current meter and more easily accessible controls on the front whereas mine has no real controls on the front and a port to plug in a multi meter if you want to read the current. This one has a big old heat sink on the back and mine has a smaller heat sink inside in the path of the fan mounted on the front. 

Both of them are labeled as a rectifier - the Loran as a High frequency rectifier and mine is labeled as a switchmode rectifier. If there is a PDF on this unit I would love to see it. For mine....nothing that I could find at all. 

I am not too worried about blowing my supply too much, but want to err on the side of caution. Having some low pass filtering will not hurt and its a nice compliment to the metering I am planning on incorporating. Besides my unit, I have only seen one other working AN/VSS-x light - that of IgNITEor's. I don't know what power supply he has but I think it is about the same physical size as mine and I am willing to bet dollars to doughnuts it's a used telecom switchmode rectifier like mine.


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## BVH (Oct 8, 2012)

I hear you there on the expenditure!!

No luck at all finding anything on the Lorain! Let me know what you end up doing and if if I can repeat it with my skill levels and parts are available, I might just do the same thing.



BravoKilo said:


> I actually would like to get one and he doesn't live too far away from me so shipping would not be too bad. It looks My biggest hurdle is that I have already spent about $1500 on this light (and I don't have batteries yet). I don't think my wife would take too kindly to me buying this right now if you know what I mean.


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## BravoKilo (Oct 8, 2012)

I will - I'll write it up with pictures, etc. I am actually excited about playing with this and seeing what I can do with it all. I'll post on the thread on my light as I chip away on this.


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## nealitc (Oct 16, 2012)

*AN/VSS-3 alive - with COTS power supply*

Got the AN/VSS-3 running, this thing cranks out some light. Now I just need build/buy a tripod to figure out a "use" for it, and how to put bat-signal mask on it for halowwen...
Its really IgNITEor fault - I've been interested in these for a while, let it slip, then saw his AN/VSS-1 on the playa.

My recipe:
- AN/VSS-3 kit (mine purchased from Len at Found Objects of Industry, he has dozens). Included AN/VSS-3 searchlight, controller, main cable, bracket. Did not include remote.
- 28V power supply/rectifier. I chose the Mean Well RSP-1500-27, as it will run on 120V/20A and put out 56A. $335 + tax and shipping from PowerGate. I looked at other options, including a bunch of 27V and 28V rectifiers on eBay but didn't find anything for 120V except a monster 28V 100A linear supply that would cost me more to ship and would need its own small building.
- Power connector (MS3106R32-5S, MS3106E32-5S, MS3106F32-5S, 97-3106A-32-5S). I looked for used, gave up, got a new one for $50 from Connector Distributor Corporation. (I thought about buying a NATO power adapter on eBay and hacking it, probably would have gone that route if I had to pay $150 for the connector).
- Temp power cables (I used 6-ga THHN) and connectors.
- Manuals TM 11-5855-217-12 and TM 11-5855-217-35 online PDF free from http://www.liberatedmanuals.com .

Amazing beam, a spike ending never. On wide, its a perfect circle.
The fan is noisy, this is not a stealth light.

Notes:
The AN/VSS-3 showed up with 2hrs on the meter, though the mirror has some corrosion and the glass was dirty.
Cable connectors were oxidized but work ok, still want to clean them up nice and shiny.
I fired it up with a pair of 12V batteries nearby, so I could run the fan if the power supply failed.
Wired it up directly, as I'm still deciding the cable configuration and didn't want to solder wires to the connector yet.
Draws about 53A running at 28V (calculated from wire voltage drop).
Fan does not lock on after 15 minutes run (its about 60 degrees tonight). Not sure if fan temp switch is broken. To be safe, I ran the fan manually for 5 minutes.
Once its been lit, relight is immediate.

There is a container load of 10 AN/TVS-3 (20KW liquid cooled short-arc trailer mounted "battlefield illuminators") and 3 70KW generators. I should not even be thinking of this. Group buy anyone?


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## BVH (Oct 16, 2012)

*Re: AN/VSS-3 alive - with COTS power supply*

Congrats!! The 53 Amps sounds low. It should be closer to 58 to 60 if supplied with sufficient power. You're really taxing that Meanwell and under-powering the light which results in less light than it's capable of producing. Member Modmag (in your area) has two more Lorain 29V/100 Amp rectifiers left and it will run off 120V. Cost only about $150. They are somewhat heavy but can be lifted by one person, done correctly. Were you getting a full 28V under load? Max Amps in 120 Volt mode is 38. However, you could probably get by with a 30 Amp circuit since you'd be pulling only 60% from the PS.

Don't even think of the An/TVS-3. Saw a blog about a guy back east that mounted one on a fire engine. They are liquid cooled and are super-sensitive about the blend of coolant needed to prevent corrosion. He is a very technical guy and was never able to over come his corrosion problem despite dropping a ton of money into it and working directly with coolant mfg's to try to copy the OEM blend. The light pretty much sits unused.


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## BravoKilo (Oct 16, 2012)

*Re: AN/VSS-3 alive - with COTS power supply*



nealitc said:


> There is a container load of 10 AN/TVS-3 (20KW liquid cooled short-arc trailer mounted "battlefield illuminators") and 3 70KW generators. I should not even be thinking of this. Group buy anyone?



What?? Where?? I want one! Can't afford it but want one. Hey, IgNITEor did the same thing to me at the same place so don't feel bad. I got to run his light for a Friday night Trojan burn in 2011 when he and his designated alternate were unavailable to run the DeathRay. I was at least knowledgeable and sober enough to be trusted.


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## nealitc (Oct 16, 2012)

*Re: AN/VSS-3 alive - with COTS power supply*

MeanWell is putting 28V under load, no issues (only ran it for 15 minutes).
Thanks for the referral, will follow up w/Modamog on the Lorain.

TVS-3 lot comes with a bunch of spare coolant, but yes, that would be a ~rather substantial~ project.


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## Jeep1234 (Apr 22, 2014)

*Re: AN/VSS-3 alive - with COTS power supply*

Bump for an old thread. 

Hello, My name is Jeep and am a friend of the owner of Found Objects of Industry, I will tell him of the sucesses you have had investigating our options to power these lamps. Keeping in interest with the thread, I guess the best way to wire a VSS-3 or yet a VSS-1 to a 120v receptacle is with a " Lorain Rectifier? How does one wire the pinout, I guess pdf's are available online for the rectifier/ power supply? What were these rectifiers originally purposed for? 

Would this power a VSS-1? What do you guys think? im not worried about 200v input, it seems like a good price. 

http://www.ebay.com/itm/331102677851?_trksid=p2055120.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK:MEBIDX:IT

We have had no problem lighting many lamps (Vss-3 and 3a)with a 2.5 ton military truck, running 30v. However, i have only had lesser luck with the vss-1 systems. We are working on simplifying (foolproofing) the Vss-1 control box and power input. Starting amps in the 100+ range is one of the factors that we are trying to work with. Not much off the shelf supply for stuff like that. Soon I will know every function of these lamps and how they were designed. We want a transportable package that will work flawlessly with the Vss1 and its system. 

I look forward to any input.


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## IgNITEor (May 4, 2014)

*Re: AN/VSS-3 alive - with COTS power supply*

Hey Jeep! Welcome to our high wattage group!
I have been running the Deathray, a VSS-1, on a vintage TPS 120 Amp rectifier and a pair of Northstar 170's. 
The rectifier was recovered from a dumpster during a network-wide decommissioning project. It must be at least 
15 years old! For the VSS-1, it demands about 3.2-3.4 kW for the -1's 2.2kW lamp at 28 VDC. Most of the older 
telecomm rectifiers seem indestructible.
The back-up rectifier (another dumpster score) for the Deathray is a Lucent SR-100 It's about twice the size of 
TPS unit and has a huge, loud 7" rotron fan in the back.
I have had no problems running the -1 on the 100 Amp rectifier with a fully charged battery set in the circuit.
The telecom-grade rectifiers seem to have a little extra built in. Running the Deathray on the backup rectifier 
will peg the ammeter but is able to maintain full voltage. As stated previously in this thread, a battery set is 
crucial to have if you're going to run your system for a length of time. After as little as 15 minutes, the Deathray's 
cooling system continues to run for several more after the lamp is off. 
The battery set will indeed absorb the bulk of starting current that will max-out your 100 Amp. power supply and
allow it to catch up as the lamp current decreases slightly with run time. Good AC power is also important, best 
to use14 AWG minimum wiring even for shorter distances at 240 Volts, and 10 AWG if you're running on 120 Volts.

Have fun, and wear safety gear when making connections. Some switch-mode rectifiers draw a very hefty spark 
when connecting to the battery set. A DC battery disconnect switch is recommended.


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