# Suitable Headlamp???



## Kangimark (Oct 25, 2007)

I’ve been on the internet for about 4 days now trying to find the “ultimate headlamp”. Yet, I’m no closer to finding the headlamp that suits me. In fact, I didn’t even realize that a headlamp could cost more than a $100—silly me!:laughing:
So…I need your help…all of you…before I go nuts trying to weed through all the possibilities.

Here is my situation:
-I live in the far North. The nights are starting to get longer and colder already. Most of my non-working day is spent in the dark during the winter months—and I spend a lot of that time outdoors.
-I mush dogs. I would like a headlamp I can use while I’m mushing. More importantly, I need a light for handling the dogs, checking on them from a distance, etc.
-I winter camp (and summer camp) very often. I’m very rough on all my gear. The lamp will inevitably bumped and banged often.

I currently have a Petzel MYO 5 (and 4 other cheap headlamps) and am not that happy with any I should have got the MYO with the battery belt pack. I go through batteries fast when I use the xenon bulb for any length of time—especially when the batteries get cold.

In my own (very novice) mind, I feel the most suitable light for me should be:
-very durable, yet light
-have a battery pack that can be worn on the head or put inside my parka.
-one with a rechargeable battery pack (that’s a preference thing)
-one that casts a beam of good distance when I'm mushing but can also be used for close-up activities when at camp.

I’m willing to pay the $$$ required to get the light I’ll be happy with—I just want to make sure that I make the right choice.

Recommendations?????


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## vader (Oct 25, 2007)

looks like this would fit the bill.

http://www.brightguy.com/products/Princeton_Tec_APEX.php

I have used one of these for caving for a few years now and it works great. Battery life is good. The main spot light on high is very bright and the switches are easy to operate with big muddy gloves on. I am sure if it's cold up there that would be a plus to you. If the spot is not bright enough for you there is a mod that can be done to the light for cheap that makes it much brighter. 

There are two models. One that runs on 4-AA's and one that runs on CR 123's. I'm not sure which type of battery would do better in the cold, but I am sure somebody else will chime in. As far as rechargable goes, just get a charger and batteries.

Bright guy is out of stock on some of these right now, but I think you could get a better price else where if you shopped around on the net.

Good luck


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## Sigman (Oct 26, 2007)

Here's a couple Petzl Myos worth checking out. The Myobelt 5 looks pretty good...


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## Kangimark (Oct 26, 2007)

I had considered the PT Apex but...
-battery pack on the back of the head exposed to the cold
-battery life is not as long as I might like (around an hour on high)

Some lights I considered that are a bit higher end:
-Stenlight S7 (as long as I don't lick it in the winter & no headband)
-Brunton L5 (haven't found many reviews on this product)
-Foxfury Pro III

Are these lights real "overkill" for what I need?


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## TigerhawkT3 (Oct 26, 2007)

Kangimark said:


> I had considered the PT Apex but...
> -battery pack on the back of the head exposed to the cold
> -battery life is not as long as I might like (around an hour on high)
> 
> ...


Actually, I was planning on recommending the Stenlight but didn't chime in earlier because the Apex is a fine headlight and much cheaper. However, if you're already considering it (i.e. you know how much it costs), I'd say it's a good fit for traipsing around in the snow. Some users have modded it for higher output.


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## greenLED (Oct 26, 2007)

The Stenlight is an amazing headlamp and will certainly take the abuse and conditions you're working in. That would be the headlamp I'd get if I needed one "for real". Finding a suitable attachment system can be a challenge, though.

:thinking: Would a bike headlight work for your needs? I'm picturing you attaching one of the newer multi-LED headlights (Dinotte, NiteRider, or some of the others) to your rig and using that as your main light while in transit. You could supplement that with a smaller headlamp when you're away from your dogs, etc. That way you don't have to worry about carrying a large battery pack on you all the time.


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## ROVER (Oct 27, 2007)

One nice option to consider with lights with seperate battery packs (such as the Apex) is you aren't limited to using that battery pack. You can easily snip the power wires and run them to a different battery pack. 

It's good you already understand what you need- higher battery capacity, and relocating batteries somewhere warm. Imagine two longer wires leading to a cheap battery holder for maybe 4 NIMH D cells. You could have long runtime, and keep those batteries snuggled warmly in your coat.


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## Daekar (Oct 27, 2007)

ROVER said:


> One nice option to consider with lights with seperate battery packs (such as the Apex) is you aren't limited to using that battery pack. You can easily snip the power wires and run them to a different battery pack.
> 
> It's good you already understand what you need- higher battery capacity, and relocating batteries somewhere warm. Imagine two longer wires leading to a cheap battery holder for maybe 4 NIMH D cells. You could have long runtime, and keep those batteries snuggled warmly in your coat.


 
Now that you mention it, I did that. There are (or were) pictures on the board somewhere. I bought a Pelican 4D hip pack designed to go with a couple headlamps they build and then spliced the appropriate female connector into the circuit on my Apex. It's a stereo headphone jack, believe it or not. I did a test run a while back, and with the PowerEX D NiMH cells, I got something ridiculous like 14 hours on high before the little battery indicator turned yellow! I'd have to say that if you go the Apex route, you should mod the emitter with a Seoul P4, it doubles the brightness on the primary beam. A word of warning - the batteries will rattle a bit - so I lined the thing with electrical tape and they fit snugly with no rattiling. I'm sure there's a more elegant way to prevent that, but it works. :naughty:

And also... if you're going to spend money on NiMH D cells, get the new LSD ones that have been mentioned in a few threads in the battery section of the forum. More convenient. :thumbsup:


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## Kangimark (Oct 27, 2007)

Daekar said:


> Now that you mention it, I did that. There are (or were) pictures on the board somewhere. I bought a Pelican 4D hip pack designed to go with a couple headlamps they build and then spliced the appropriate female connector into the circuit on my Apex. It's a stereo headphone jack, believe it or not. I did a test run a while back, and with the PowerEX D NiMH cells, I got something ridiculous like 14 hours on high before the little battery indicator turned yellow! I'd have to say that if you go the Apex route, you should mod the emitter with a Seoul P4, it doubles the brightness on the primary beam. A word of warning - the batteries will rattle a bit - so I lined the thing with electrical tape and they fit snugly with no rattiling. I'm sure there's a more elegant way to prevent that, but it works. :naughty:
> 
> And also... if you're going to spend money on NiMH D cells, get the new LSD ones that have been mentioned in a few threads in the battery section of the forum. More convenient. :thumbsup:



Modifying the battery pack is a cool idea. Maybe I could put connectors on both the factory battery pack and a Pelican 4D hip pack--I could use either 
depending on the situation. 

To be very honest though, I'm not too excited about doing too many modifications. First, I really don't have much experience in that department. Second, I'm living in a very remote community where there are only two very small general stores. If I need any parts, I'll have to get them all by ordering on the net. If I run into problems, there is nobody I can get to assist me. Perhaps I am overestimating the skill required to do these modifications...hmmmm...

All expense aside, is there a headlamp with all these options that would not require too many modifications? It surprises me that with all the companies making flashlights and headlamps, there are very few that make "great" lights with lots of different options. If the companies were making higher end lights with options, everyone wouldn't have to do their own modifications.


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## cave dave (Oct 27, 2007)

The stock Apex is a great light and as it is will probably be a lot brighter than you are using now, but any headlamp maunfacturer is going to be a year or so behind the latest and greatest LED out there, so we here at CPF mod because we can, not always because we need too. If you wait until '08 petzel is going to start using Seouls and I expect PT will start as well.

I can take a stock $60 Apex and mod it to make it brighter than a stock $300 Stenlight. Now as it happens I have a modded Stenlight as well, because that situation was unacceptable. But I expect that will be obsolete in a year. 

So if you are not willing to mod would you rather have a $60 obsolete light or a $300 obsolete light?

PS I live near a major city and I still buy all my supplies and get all my advice online.


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## Daekar (Oct 27, 2007)

cave dave said:


> The stock Apex is a great light and as it is will probably be a lot brighter than you are using now, but any headlamp maunfacturer is going to be a year or so behind the latest and greatest LED out there, so we here at CPF mod because we can, not always because we need too. If you wait until '08 petzel is going to start using Seouls and I expect PT will start as well.
> 
> I can take a stock $60 Apex and mod it to make it brighter than a stock $300 Stenlight. Now as it happens I have a modded Stenlight as well, because that situation was unacceptable. But I expect that will be obsolete in a year.
> 
> ...


 
I'll second that - depending on what you're coming from, the Apex is going to be great even if it's stock. Unless you're just absolutely terrified of modding in any way, I'd still recommend you replace the emitter, that way low will be approx equivalent to the old high mode. I'd say that unless you're pretty comfortable with modding and are pretty competent then you should avoid the battery-pack mod for now. The way I did it I compromised the water-tightness of the light, but I'm sure it can be done better. Still, better safe than sorry. I'd get a SSC P4, some Arctic Alumina epoxy, and an Apex and call it problem solved unless you're going to be dealing with extreme cold where the batteries can't perform. For cold, well, I don't know of any 18650 headlamps... somebody else may be able to offer some insight there...


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## Kangimark (Oct 27, 2007)

cave dave said:


> The stock Apex is a great light and as it is will probably be a lot brighter than you are using now, but any headlamp maunfacturer is going to be a year or so behind the latest and greatest LED out there, so we here at CPF mod because we can, not always because we need too. If you wait until '08 petzel is going to start using Seouls and I expect PT will start as well.
> 
> I can take a stock $60 Apex and mod it to make it brighter than a stock $300 Stenlight. Now as it happens I have a modded Stenlight as well, because that situation was unacceptable. But I expect that will be obsolete in a year.
> 
> ...



ok, ok, ok...I'm convinced the modification of the Apex is the way to go. Afterall, I was nervous about sex the first time I did it and that didn't stop me!

The Apex is ordered and on the way.
I will read the thread about the Apex mod more carefully in the morning and then order what I need for upgrading the emitter.
I will also add an alternate power source--the Pelican D cell belt case.
Because I want to use either the stock AA power source or the new D belt case, I will want connectors for the lamp and the two power sources--any recommendations??
Any good links to rechargeable NiMh D cell batteries and chargers?

I'm starting to have a good feeling that this is going to work out really well!:thumbsup:

Thanks CPF people!


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## cave dave (Oct 27, 2007)

4D's are really really heavy. You could use a RC car SubC NiMh battery pack and charger instead and then use RC type connectors to attach.

Or a C pack
http://www.batteryspace.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=1307


Or even go with 7.2v LiIon battery.
http://www.batteryspace.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWCATS&Category=842


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## Daekar (Oct 27, 2007)

Kangimark said:


> ok, ok, ok...I'm convinced the modification of the Apex is the way to go. Afterall, I was nervous about sex the first time I did it and that didn't stop me!
> 
> The Apex is ordered and on the way.
> I will read the thread about the Apex mod more carefully in the morning and then order what I need for upgrading the emitter.
> ...


 
Well... for the belt case, I got a female headphone jack at radioshack. I learned that the one that I got was a core wire (one polarity), some rubber, and then a ring of wire surrounding the core (the other polarity). Took a bit of guessing with the wire strippers to get it right. Maybe you'll find one with discrete wires instead of a combination. Anyway, I actually joined the wire at the battery case instead of cutting the wire which goes to the lamp unit. In retrospect, cutting the wire would've been the way to go, but I wasn't confident I could even make it work so I took the safe way out. The way mine's set up, _it is unsafe to have AAs in the pack and hook up the hip-pack_ because it forms a complete circuit - shorting things out, essentially. Depending on how you do it, that may or may not be a problem.

I would check Thomas Distributing for charger/batteries. Offhand, my picks would be: 
Batteries
Cheap Charger
Better Charger (if you can afford it get this one!)


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## Dung Beetle (Oct 28, 2007)

Kangimark said:


> I’ve been on the internet for about 4 days now trying to find the “ultimate headlamp”.




I think the 12 volt rebel is pretty good $150.00

http://www.cabelas.com/prod-1/0028418516546a.shtml

The Lupine Edison 10 would be the ultimate, bit pricey about $1000.00 

Look up, some of CY threads he has some neat headlamps.


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## NoFair (Oct 28, 2007)

I'd get one or 2 of the RC 7.2V NiMH packs for your Apex. 

http://www.batteryspace.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=2903

And an extra set of connectors; one for the stock 4AA pack and one for the lamp.

http://www.batteryspace.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=535

That should set you up for a great headlamp. Runtimes are about 3 hours on high with 4 AA NiMH and should be 2-3 times longer. Runtimes on low should be 30+ hours.. 

If you put a Seoul in it you will use low a lot more since everything becomes about twice as bright. :twothumbs

You just need a soldering iron, thermal paste and a Seoul for the mod which is described pretty well in other threads.

And BTW :welcome:

Sverre


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## TorchBoy (Oct 28, 2007)

Kangimark said:


> I had considered the PT Apex but...
> -battery pack on the back of the head exposed to the cold


Are you going to be exposing your head to the cold?


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## cave dave (Oct 28, 2007)

NoFair said:


> I'd get one or 2 of the RC 7.2V NiMH packs for your Apex.



I wouldn't recommend the 7.3 v NiMh packs. The Apex will continue to run them down till they drop out of regulation at ~ 3.6v, and will continue out of regulation after that till about 3v. That will trash the battery pack. It would work but you would not want to run the pack down below 5.4v.

With 7.2v LiIon the protection circuit will kick in and the light will go dead without any warning.


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## whippoorwill (Oct 28, 2007)

Petzl makes a MYO XP Belt. The mod for a MYO XP to a SSC P4 is about the easiest one out there. The only issue is regulation which this particular headlamp does not have.

This would be the easiest IMO. Also, after you get the MYO XP belt, it might serve your purposes without a mod.


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## NoFair (Oct 28, 2007)

cave dave said:


> I wouldn't recommend the 7.3 v NiMh packs. The Apex will continue to run them down till they drop out of regulation at ~ 3.6v, and will continue out of regulation after that till about 3v. That will trash the battery pack. It would work but you would not want to run the pack down below 5.4v.
> 
> With 7.2v LiIon the protection circuit will kick in and the light will go dead without any warning.


 
Good point Dave. 

Didn't think of this since I usually recharge pretty regularly and don't depend on the indicator. 

I mostly use Li-ions though... 

Sverre


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## Kangimark (Oct 28, 2007)

"4D's are really really heavy. You could use a RC car SubC NiMh battery pack and charger instead and then use RC type connectors to attach."

I have no idea what you just suggested above.:thinking: 
Do you have links to these kinds of packs and chargers?
I assumed I would get a longer burn time from 4D's than C's--that's why I didn't worry about the extra weight.


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## Kangimark (Oct 28, 2007)

TorchBoy said:


> Are you going to be exposing your head to the cold?



I wear a hat on my head and the headlamp over my hat. Sometimes I put my hood up to keep the lamp batteries warm, but I prefer not to wear my hood--so the batteries are exposed to the cold.


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## NoFair (Oct 29, 2007)

Kangimark said:


> "4D's are really really heavy. You could use a RC car SubC NiMh battery pack and charger instead and then use RC type connectors to attach."
> 
> I have no idea what you just suggested above.:thinking:
> Do you have links to these kinds of packs and chargers?
> I assumed I would get a longer burn time from 4D's than C's--that's why I didn't worry about the extra weight.


 
The subC Nimh packs are 7.2V while the 4D pack will be 4.8V. SubC's are often pretty high capacity as well since development has been pushed along by the RC car users. These use a standard type of connectors.

Using a 4D pack has advantages since the battery indicator on the light will give a reliable reading and the headlamp won't kill the batteries if you use it too long. RC packs can be damaged if left to run too long with the Apex.

They should be pretty close in weight/performance. At least if you get good D cells.

Sverre


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## mountainpenguin (Oct 29, 2007)

lithium pack.
Why not spend a bit extra and get a lithium rechargeable rc pack and charger. It will work better in the cold and you can get protected versions that should be safe. 
From your description you might like to get an apex pro where you can have 2 cr123's ready to go in an emergency by just swapping the connections but light enough so you don't notice them most of the time. Then most of the time your big rechargeable pack stowed somewhere safe.


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## Kangimark (Oct 29, 2007)

mountainpenguin said:


> lithium pack.
> Why not spend a bit extra and get a lithium rechargeable rc pack and charger. It will work better in the cold and you can get protected versions that should be safe.



Any links?


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## mountainpenguin (Oct 29, 2007)

http://www.component-shop.co.uk/html/li-po_flight_packs.html


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## Kangimark (Oct 29, 2007)

mountainpenguin said:


> http://www.component-shop.co.uk/html/li-po_flight_packs.html




I can't get that link to work.


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## mountainpenguin (Oct 30, 2007)

hmm works for me
just google for lithium polymer flight packs


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## Kangimark (Oct 30, 2007)

mountainpenguin said:


> hmm works for me
> just google for lithium polymer flight packs



Ok...the link worked this time.
Wow! Lots of choices. Which do you recommend?
Will the Apex "trash the battery pack" as described in the post by CaveDave.
Or, are these batteries self-protected from draining too low?

I'm really lost about what to do with the battery modification. Some posts suggest going with a D cell pack and others strongly believe I should be going with the lithium pack.

The D cell pack seems like the "easy" option--its just that its also the "heavier" option.

I plan to keep the stock AA battery pack for when I use the lamp close to home. The auxiliary pack needs to give me lots of hours for long trips--lots of hours being the key.

Hmmm....:shrug:


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## Kangimark (Oct 30, 2007)

Except for my battery woes, my plans for the Apex modification are taking shape.
After reading the thread about "PT Apex Mod" I have decided to change the emitter and the reflector. I'm quite excited--the improvement in lighting quality looks great! I'm also excited because its my first mod--hope I don't screw it up.

I contacted PhotonFanatic about getting the supplies I'll need:
-Seoul P4 SW0 emitter
-thermal compound (which one??--there are many to choose from)
-Khatod 20mm reflector (is this a good sub to the MCR20?)

Hoping my Apex will arrive by next week.


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## cave dave (Oct 31, 2007)

Kangimark said:


> I contacted PhotonFanatic about getting the supplies I'll need:
> -Seoul P4 SW0 emitter
> -thermal compound (which one??--there are many to choose from)
> -Khatod 20mm reflector (is this a good sub to the MCR20?)
> ...


-Get the thermal epoxy not the compound. I use the cheaper stuff.
- 20mm will be hard to fit. You will have to grind off the front of it and I can't seem to do that without damaging the reflector myself. The 17mm works with room to spare. Some people don't like that because it doesn't look perfect. But it works great all the same. There is a smooth version which will get you more throw but has some minor ringyness, and the textured version which is more floody and very smooth beam. At $4 each buy both and try them.


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## Daekar (Oct 31, 2007)

Sounds like you're on the right track! Looking forward to hearing about the results... :thumbsup:

As far as the battery pack is concerned, let me explain it in simple terms (they're the only ones I know :naughty... Ideally, you would find a lithium-ion pack that works - it would have great capacity for its size, perform well in the cold, and if you used some of the newer chemistries you could charge it very quickly. However, AFAIK most lithium-ion batteries come with voltages somewhere around 3.6V-3.7V nominal (4.2V hot off the charger) whereas the Apex is designed for nominal input voltages from 6V to about...4V? The problem is that you can't use one lithium (3.6V) but you also can't use two (7.2V) - one wouldn't power the circuit properly and the other would fry it. At the very least, if the Apex weren't fried by the extra voltage it would be generating a lot of extra heat from converting that energy, and when the batteries got worn down the internal protection circuitry in the battery would kick in before the Apex decided to stop running - so as someone already said, you'd get instant-blackness.

You sound like you're not terribly concerned about the extra weight, and if that's so then the NiMH D-cells are probably your best bet, either using the Pelican belt-pack or building your own pack with an RC-type connector. If the weight DOES bother you, you can try NiMH C-cells, and somebody already mentioned Sub-C NiMH batteries as an alternative. They're smaller and tend to have pretty high capacity for their size because of constant improvement for the RC crowd. Just make sure that whatever kind of cells you use there are 4 in series. More than 4 cells is OK, just make sure anything more than that is parallel to keep the voltage the same (shooting for 4.8V, 1.2V from each cell).


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## Kangimark (Nov 9, 2007)

I finally received my PT Apex yesterday. I'm very impressed with it already --and I have not even done any modifications.

I have not been out mushing with the light yet, but I'm thinking it will suit my needs well--a good combination of spot and flood. A brighter emitter might not even be entirely necessary, but I'm known for over-doing things that are not necessary. 
The emitter and reflector have not arrived yet--hopefully next week.

I am still planning on adding a Pelican D-cell pack to give a longer burn time and to keep the batteries inside my parka where they will be warm.
Any recommendations for water tight connectors? I want to be able to use either the stock AA pack or the D-cell pack, depending on my needs.


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## Daekar (Nov 10, 2007)

Hrmmm... watertight connectors is a place I can't help you, my experience in electronics/building isn't very comprehensive. Have you googled that yet? The Pelican pack will come with the male stereo headphone jack as I mentioned - and although it doesn't sound like it, I can't imagine that there would be a water-tightness problem with the system... Pelican did make it for their headlamps after all. I was checking their website and they say that the system isn't dive rated, but that's it. If you're worried about water entry I would say you might want to work up a rubber-ish boot to shelter the connection from falling rain... beyond that I'm afraid I'm no help. :thinking: Maybe there are watertight audio connectors out there? I'm sure there is SOMETHING...


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## Offroad'Bent (Nov 13, 2007)

Kangimark said:


> I am still planning on adding a Pelican D-cell pack to give a longer burn time and to keep the batteries inside my parka where they will be warm.
> Any recommendations for water tight connectors? I want to be able to use either the stock AA pack or the D-cell pack, depending on my needs.



Here you go:
http://www.batteryspace.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWCATS&Category=979
PS PT is coming out with a remote-batterypack Apex that holds 8AAs I believe. :thumbsup:


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## LED_Thrift (Nov 13, 2007)

Daekar said:


> ... Just make sure that whatever kind of cells you use there are 4 in series. More than 4 cells is OK, just make sure anything more than that is parallel to keep the voltage the same (shooting for 4.8V, 1.2V from each cell).


 
If you are making your own battery pack and planned to use NiMH batteries [~1.2v each] could you use *five* for a total of 6.0v or would there be more than 6.0v when the batteries are fresh off the charger? If so, would this slightly higher than six volts be too much for the light? 

If this light is designed to run on four 1.5v batteries [6.0v total], it may not be as bright on 4.8v - even with regulation. Of course you would have to have a way [dummy cell?] to run it on alkalines in an emergency, and you would have to make sure no one put five fresh alkalines in it.

I wonder if the board in the Apex Pro could handle the peak voltages of two RCR123s. If so, you could make a battery pack using two 18650s. Using lithiums in cold weather has a lot of advantages.


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## half-watt (Nov 13, 2007)

PT Apex - have several, both Pro & Non-Pro versions.


1. when i'm winter backpacking, i have a hood-type of balaclava (see www.backpackinglight.com where one can purchase something similar in their online store - i also have one of BPL's and it's very nice) that i wear over my normal head gear. 

the PT Apex is worn underneath the 'clava, keeping the batts warm.


2. Li AA batts offer better cold-weather performance.


3. one of the easiest MODS to make is to add a remote 4C or 4D (available from Pelican with a 1/4" phone plug on the end) remote battery pack.

a. remove batts from Apex battery pack

b. cut the cord about 1/3 of the distance from the rear battery compartment.

c. strip the wires appropriately

d. at Radio Shack, or similar location, purchase one 1/4" phone jack and one 1/4" phone plug (if you want to be able to reuse the original battery compartment with Li AA's as your "back-up" battery source.

e. solder the plug to the cable attached to the original battery compartment

f. solder the jack to the cable attached to the head of the light and you're done.



i have 4C, 4D, and 6V lantern battery (just for fun, the 4D is, IMO, a better way to go than the lantern batt.) setups for use with the PT Apex. all give excellent burn times on high-output, IMO.

i've made somewhat similar mods to the Petzl MyoBelt XP.

the PT YukonExtreme might be an option if you are dead set on an incandescent+LED combo.

in warmer weather, when AA Li primaries are being used, AA NiMh are an inexpensive option for all of the above mentioned.


none of the above solutions address supreme durability in a light, though an ALL-LED solution (i.e., no incandescent lamp) is more robust - though, perhaps???, it was the plastic housings that were the intent/target of your robust-related comments.

i have the Silva/Brunton L5 (also the L3 and L1, and LR6). not overly impressed with it, but haven't used it that much. The PT Apex is a more flexible light, IMO, with the inclusion of 4x5mm LEDs for task/proximity lighting (but their still too bright, even on lo-output mode for most task/proximity uses, IMO).

if you're going to be out-and-about for days at this time of year, a rechargeable like the L5 may not be the best choice. you can't easily carry spare battery packs without spending a lot of $$$ for a couple of spare L5 rechargeable battery packs and there's too much darkness if you're out for days (how do you recharge?).

i don't know of any backpacker out for more than just a weekend that would used a dedicated rechargeable headlamp. batt. life just isn't there without spending big-$$$ for spare packs which include too much extra weight in duplicating batt-housings and cabling (for the backpacker an issue, though perhaps not as much of an issue for the musher - but, even there your dogs might appreciate lighter weight - my Akitas and/or Rotties sure pulled the toboggan back up the long, steep hill in my backyard faster when just my two kids were on it without me or my wife).

------------------------
now, the above was done before i discovered small, light, flashlights. these are now my preference for hands-free use by either clipping them to a ballcap brim (nearly always worn, even under some cold-weather headgear), or using a "JakStrap" to mount the flashlight on me 'noggin.

rarely use headlamps anymore as the flashlights (any of several Fenix, LumaPower, Surefire, and others) make, IMO, superior "headlamps". 

i find that for nearly all outdoor uses (SAR might be an exception), the variable output modes, long battery life (at lower output levels), and light weight sway this ultra-light backpacker (now retired) towards flashlights vs. "true" headlamps. newer, higher powered Cree and SSC LEDs offer plenty of "throw" for mountain biking (even downhill where speeds can get pretty fast) and perhaps also sledding/mushing (don't know first-hand 'bout mushing).


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## LED_Thrift (Nov 13, 2007)

@Half-watt: you probably already have enough lights, but if you are still interested in light backpacking, check out the ZebraLight Q5. A single strap [nothing over the head] with a glow-in-the-dark silicone rubber holder holding the smallest single AA light I've seen. It has no optics or reflector -so it's all spill/flood. It's a twisty that has three levels. The Q5 gives it great efficiency and the high mode is very bright. It puts out a beautiful flood of light. 

If the OP didn't have any headlamps already, I would have recommended getting a ZebraLight and another light, either headlamp or hand held, for longer range spotting. They are also comming out with a Cr123 version and a 18650 version.


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## half-watt (Nov 14, 2007)

LED_Thrift said:


> @Half-watt: you probably already have enough lights, but if you are still interested in light backpacking, check out the ZebraLight Q5. A single strap [nothing over the head] with a glow-in-the-dark silicone rubber holder holding the smallest single AA light I've seen. It has no optics or reflector -so it's all spill/flood. It's a twisty that has three levels. The Q5 gives it great efficiency and the high mode is very bright. It puts out a beautiful flood of light.
> 
> If the OP didn't have any headlamps already, I would have recommended getting a ZebraLight and another light, either headlamp or hand held, for longer range spotting. They are also comming out with a Cr123 version and a 18650 version.



L_T,

many thanks for the reply.

i've observed the ZebraLight Postings on CPF since b/f the product was actually available. though i stopped reading the Posts a while back just about the time the product came to fruition. had made up my mind not to buy 'bout that time.

perhaps erroneously, i rejected it as a viable option for nighttime trekking, though saw its worth as a task/proximity light.

my reticence to "bite", so to speak, comes from needing ~30' of distance viewing to pick out low-contrast, faded blazes on rocks and tree when hiking unfamiliar indistinct autumn leaf-covered trails.

not sure that even a Q5 w/o optics or reflector is up to the task of a 30' throw, or even 20'??? please correct me if i'm mistaken. if i am, Zebralight has a new customer (and i usually buy two of anything i like - except SF lights due to the cost, of which i have a dozen of so (i'm afraid to actually count them - or, let my wife even see them in case she discovers the $$$ of them) - besides i've yet to have a SF fail, even the L1 Cree - excellent products that SF lights generally are.

a Fenix L0D-CE on minimum o.p. (output) at 7.5 lumen, or sometimes, even a Novatac EDC-120P programmed to 0.47 lumen (once eyes have achieved full dark adaptation & no ambient light is present) is fine for me for most task/proximity purposes. for nighttime trekking, if the trail is non-demanding, 15lumen o.p. cuts it for me (though sometimes only with a smooth reflector), and sometimes 12lumen with a smooth reflector works well enough if i'm moving slowly. Other times 25lumen (WITH THROW, so, some spot & NOT all flood is mandatory), or more, on more demanding terrain is my preference.

still, i'm looking for a good reason to purchase a Zebralight. maybe you can provide it? how far is the "throw" (i know,...it's all flood, but i'm sure that you get the idea) on the Zebralight? 15'? 20'?? 30'???


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## Offroad'Bent (Nov 14, 2007)

Kangimark said:


> I finally received my PT Apex yesterday. I'm very impressed with it already --and I have not even done any modifications.



I just got my p4s and thermal grease yesterday, and modified one of my Apex lights. It is as bright now on low spotbeam as the original on high spot. On high it's probably twice as bright.


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## LED_Thrift (Nov 15, 2007)

Offroad'Bent said:


> I just got my p4s and thermal grease yesterday, and modified one of my Apex lights. It is as bright now on low spotbeam as the original on high spot. On high it's probably twice as bright.


 
Nice! I'm getting so tired of waiting for PT to come out with a Cree Apex, I may have to do this mod myself. 


@halfwatt: the Zebra is all flood, so you could probably see well out to 15' to 20' or so walking speed. For mountain biking or XC skiing etc, you would need something with more throw. One other advantage it has is that, like a small edc, you can take it with you everywhere and therefore have it if you need it.


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## FlashSpyJ (Nov 15, 2007)

wanted to thrown in what my friend are using. He is using the Lumapower M1 (http://batteryjunction.com/lumahunterm1.html), has high and low, throws real good, very long runtime both on high and low. Uses a 18650 batt, or RCR or regular cr123 batts. He use the light as a headlight with http://batteryjunction.com/niizehemihon.html


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## half-watt (Nov 15, 2007)

Offroad'Bent said:


> I just got my p4s and thermal grease yesterday, and modified one of my Apex lights. It is as bright now on low spotbeam as the original on high spot. On high it's probably twice as bright.



i'd like to do this mod. can you please provide sources for the P4's & th.grease?

many thanks,
half-watt


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## Offroad'Bent (Nov 15, 2007)

half-watt said:


> i'd like to do this mod. can you please provide sources for the P4's & th.grease?
> 
> many thanks,
> half-watt



I got it all from Fred Pilon. Fast and efficient.
Just go to this thread and check out posting #52 for excellent instructions and a link to buy from Fred.
http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=141392&page=2&pp=30

Happy modifying!- Richard


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## NoFair (Nov 15, 2007)

Daekar said:


> Sounds like you're on the right track! Looking forward to hearing about the results... :thumbsup:
> 
> As far as the battery pack is concerned, let me explain it in simple terms (they're the only ones I know :naughty... Ideally, you would find a lithium-ion pack that works - it would have great capacity for its size, perform well in the cold, and if you used some of the newer chemistries you could charge it very quickly. However, AFAIK most lithium-ion batteries come with voltages somewhere around 3.6V-3.7V nominal (4.2V hot off the charger) whereas the Apex is designed for nominal input voltages from 6V to about...4V? The problem is that you can't use one lithium (3.6V) but you also can't use two (7.2V) - one wouldn't power the circuit properly and the other would fry it. At the very least, if the Apex weren't fried by the extra voltage it would be generating a lot of extra heat from converting that energy, and when the batteries got worn down the internal protection circuitry in the battery would kick in before the Apex decided to stop running - so as someone already said, you'd get instant-blackness.


 
PT has stated that the Apex is fine with the 8.4V gotten from 2 li-ions. I use this in my pro all the time. 

The driver in the light is made to adapt to varying voltages as long as they are not too high or below the Vf of the led (probably around 3.5V). The only problem is that the low battery indicator will show green until your batteries are dead with 2 li-ions.

Sverre


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## hopkins (Nov 21, 2007)

Hi Kangimark - The Petzl MYO XP flip up diffuser works great.
If you wear a balacava or 2 it'll keep the rear battery pack warm too,
and the hood to your parka will help even more.

Do you wear the headlamp all day just so its ready to go when it gets dark and no searching pockets to find it ? Seen this done in the Sierra.

Rear battery-packs and sleeping are not comfortable so modify the 
straps so you can slide it (battery pack) to the top of your head and
still have the headlamp strapped on securely to your head in the 
sleeping bag. Pics of my mod'd MYO XP for sleeping bag mode.


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## Kangimark (Dec 10, 2007)

Well, I finally got around to doing the modification for my Apex (it took way too long for the materials to arrive). It wasn't something I had done before, but everything went well. The very detailed instructions provided by the folks at CPF really helped--thanks everyone!!
The brightness of the new emitter is much better. But I think the best improvement is the new reflector. The factory reflector had a gray ring in the beam--the new one does not. The new reflector had to be resized a bit to fit--that was a bit tricky.
Now when I'm mushing at night, I can really see all the dogs and the trail--its great. When I have to feed or tend to the dogs, I use the area lighting set on low--I don't blind the dogs that way.
I'm just waiting on my Pelican D-cell battery pack to come in--it was ordered about a month ago. Until it arrives, I will wear my hood up to keep my battery pack warm.


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## NoFair (Dec 11, 2007)

Happy your mod went well. Now we need pics of the light in action:naughty:


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## eebowler (Dec 11, 2007)

How have you decided to connect the battery pack to the headlamp?


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## angelofwar (Dec 11, 2007)

Foxfury signature series in the hiz-zouse!!! I used this light in Iceland, and with all the wind and wet weather, this light never once let me down...the Fact that it uses AA's Easy to get, and useable with rechargeables), and has a bunch of smart features "Automatically" shut's off during the day (with enough light of course), and powersave modes...these are dureable, and water"proof "(i.e. submersible), but are built more for periphial vision (which I think would be better in your situation?) than throw. And the battery pack can be head/belt/or even pack mounted. I own I own five brands of headlamps (Rayovac/Gerber, etc.), and they all are good lights in the own right, but for continous use in extreme conditions, I would take my Foxfury over any other.


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## hopkins (Dec 17, 2007)

suggest that you make every attempt to strengthen the battery wire
between the pack and the lamp.

You 'WILL' catch it on stuff and pull the lamp off your head and/or
the pack out of your coat pocket where it will swing down and knock the cooking pot over.

make it twice as strong as you think you'll ever need.


Wishing you fast dogs, a starry night, and loaded rifle ditto's!:wave::tinfoil:


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## half-watt (Dec 17, 2007)

Kangimark said:


> I’ve been on the internet for about 4 days now trying to find the “ultimate headlamp”. Yet, I’m no closer to finding the headlamp that suits me. In fact, I didn’t even realize that a headlamp could cost more than a $100—silly me!:laughing:
> So…I need your help…all of you…before I go nuts trying to weed through all the possibilities.
> 
> Here is my situation:
> ...





BrightGuy.com has a recently added a Princeton Tec ApexExtreme to it line of headlamps for sale.

it use 8xAA cells (easy enough to find NiMH rechargeable cells) for a both a slightly brighter light and longer burntimes.

however, it's easy enough to mod a PT Apex for use with a (sold separately) Pelican 4D battery box (i've done this mod - D's come in NiMH rechargeables also).


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## george tichbourne (Dec 17, 2007)

As for waterproof plugins what about snowmobile electrical harness plugins? Used in same climatic conditions, readily available.

George


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## half-watt (Dec 17, 2007)

george tichbourne said:


> As for waterproof plugins what about snowmobile electrical harness plugins? Used in same climatic conditions, readily available.
> 
> George



in the field, i've used duct tape to fashion a temporary, make-shift waterproof seal.


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## TMorita (Dec 18, 2007)

You should look at Lupine Lighting Systems stuff.

http://gretnabikes.com/item.asp?PID=75&cID=0


Toshi


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## TMorita (Dec 18, 2007)

Another option is the Niterider stuff.

http://www.niterider.com/prod_minewtx2.shtml

Apparently they have a headband which fits all their bicycle lights and converts it to a headlamp:

http://www.niterider.com/store_mounts.shtml

I think you're gonna be better off with a bicycle light than a regular headlamp, since a bicycle lamp is designed for a moving vehicle.
Also, bicycle lamps have a separate battery pack, so you can keep it under your jacket.

Toshi


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## GaryF (Dec 19, 2007)

I'll point out another light... It doesn't meet all of your criteria, as it doesn't have a detachable battery pack, and possibly not a low enough low. The high should be pretty incredible, and the rechargeable lithium battery should do well in colder conditions. You can also run it off of CR123A's, which gives good backup power options. At the current (On sale) price of $99.99, it's also considerably cheaper than some of the other headlamps mentioned.

http://www.cabelas.com/cabelas/en/t...&parentType=index&indexId=cat20160&hasJS=true

I don't have one, so I can't add any details beyond what Cabelas says about it. Seems like a good tough design, though.

Edit: Realized after posting this that Kangimark already has his headlamp.


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