# Kitchen Knives Experiences



## P_A_S_1 (May 11, 2015)

Was wondering what other members use for their kitchen cutlery, what they thought of them, and would they recommend them or purchase them again. 

I've been using Henckles 5 Star Series for about 18 years now and while I like them I would probably look for something better if I was going to buy a new set. I like how easy they are to sharpen and the edge I can get on them. I like that they are robust and rust has never been an issue even when I wasn't very kind to them. And I like the way they feel in my hands. I would like if they held their edge better, I frequently touch them up to maintain the edge even after light use and while I don't mind I'd much prefer a stronger edge. I don't like that they don't always cut very well despite being very sharp. I've thinned out the metal behind the edge to help but wedging and snapping is still an issue with certain foods like carrots and squash (I'm thinking this is due to the knife's grind and perhaps a thinner ground knife would suit me better). I've read the newer Pro Series is thinner in overall grind, wonder if that makes wedging and snapping less of an issue. Overall I'd say they're good but not excellent (IMO).


----------



## Dipti13 (May 11, 2015)

I am using cold steel kitchen knives set from last 2 years and these are very good If I talk about my experience. Although now looking to sharpen their blades soon.


----------



## smokinbasser (May 11, 2015)

We have been using the Ontario cutlery since the 1960s. I used French's mustard to produce a patina/rust proofing since acquiring the knives.


----------



## Str8stroke (May 11, 2015)

Due to family members not respecting my kitchen tools, I have a cheap Amazon Hampton Forge Tomodachi "titanium" knife set. $29.99
They work, come sharp as all get out, are easy to clean and resharpen when family damages them. The last knife set I had got the disposal treatment. Totally trashed 2 of them.


----------



## Berneck1 (May 11, 2015)

I have the Henkels also, and I notice the same thing. They can be sharp but not sharp enough for some tasks. 

Looking back, I probably would have not bought a set. I would probably buy individual knives that fit each task better. I really only use two or three knives. Also, if you go into any restaurant, they aren't using any kind of high-end knives or pans, and they do fine.

For the most part, the high-end kitchen knives are there to look good and match. I don't really care about that anymore. Some like to have sets, but my next knives will probably be a mix of different brands.


Sent from my iPhone using Candlepowerforums


----------



## P_A_S_1 (May 11, 2015)

Berneck1 said:


> Also, if you go into any restaurant, they aren't using any kind of high-end knives or pans, and they do fine.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Candlepowerforums



I was told that most restaurants, at least here in NYC, rent almost everything including their knives from restaurant suppliers. The supplier maintains the knives for the kitchen, sharpening them, or replacing them as needed.


----------



## ForrestChump (May 11, 2015)

I dig Japanese Cutlery. Love the style of the blades and the exotic steel choices. Lots of art in those blades.

That said, Spyderco has their own cutlery line. May not be so fancy, but Im sure fit and finish are great and they're priced right. Might be worth a look.


----------



## desmobob (May 11, 2015)

Most kitchen knives (even the pricey ones) are soft stainless steel. Using old-school carbon blades like the Old Hickory brand from Ontario will give better performance, but require some extra care to keep them from rusting. And they ain't as pretty to look at... 

Take it easy,
Bob


----------



## archimedes (May 11, 2015)

I've used quite a variety of kitchen knives, and I find the Shun Classic Pro line to be fantastic (although expensive).

In general, I think spending the same amount of money on just one or two top quality general purpose "chefs knife" has more value than buying a huge set of various cutlery (with many pieces, of lesser quality).


----------



## P_A_S_1 (May 11, 2015)

archimedes said:


> I've used quite a variety of kitchen knives, and I find the Shun Classic Pro line to be fantastic (although expensive).
> 
> In general, I think spending the same amount of money on just one or two top quality general purpose "chefs knife" has more value than buying a huge set of various cutlery (with many pieces, of lesser quality).



I agree. My set consists of four, a chef, a paring, a slicer, and a serrated bread knife. Doing it over I'd skip the slicer and look for a thinner chefs and I'd get a cheaper bread knife as any serrated knife works on crusty bread.


----------



## jabe1 (May 11, 2015)

I also have the 5 stars, but only three of them. Chef's, paring, and serrated slicer. Always hand washed, always touched-up on a ceramic rod. I'm sure there are much better knives out there, but I love the feel of these.
I have a few cuisinart branded SS santokus, and a few cheaper Henkels to round out my set, and they all get used frequently.
if I had to replace them, I'd probably go Japanese, or do the cheap thing and get Victorinox, which get fantastic reviews.


----------



## Str8stroke (May 13, 2015)

archimedes said:


> I've used quite a variety of kitchen knives, and I find the Shun Classic Pro line to be fantastic (although expensive).
> 
> In general, I think spending the same amount of money on just one or two top quality general purpose "chefs knife" has more value than buying a huge set of various cutlery (with many pieces, of lesser quality).



I like those. Too bad I can't own them with out them getting destroyed. I may get their shears. Those I can use and keep away from everyone.


----------



## MrJino (May 18, 2015)

I used to have a wustof for my kitchen in my apartment, plenty o knife for many tasks, especially with a pairing knife.

I'm a chef by trade, i only use japanese knives for their carbon and excellent blade geometry, also handles are superb.


----------



## P_A_S_1 (May 18, 2015)

MrJino said:


> I used to have a wustof for my kitchen in my apartment, plenty o knife for many tasks, especially with a pairing knife.
> 
> I'm a chef by trade, i only use japanese knives for their carbon and excellent blade geometry, also handles are superb.



Between the Wustofs and the Japanese knives, when you refer to the blades geometry are you referring to the overall thickness/thinness of the grind or something else?


----------



## MrJino (May 18, 2015)

Both thinness and The tapering from spine to edge is different. I'm guessing the harder steel they use allows for thinner blades and edges.
They cost more, but when you're using a knife nearly 10 hours a day, it makes sense.


----------



## Berneck1 (May 19, 2015)

guest-knife said:


> I have been using some Victorinox kitchen knives which are good enough for my modular kitchen.



The Victorinox knives always get good reviews. The cost is a huge plus also. They are reasonably priced. 


Sent from my iPhone using Candlepowerforums


----------



## charlescuatan (May 19, 2015)

I wanna purchase this chef knife but haven't seen a proper review for this knife 

http://www.aplusrstore.com/product/1499/furtif-evercut-knives

Anyone of you guys tried this knife?


----------



## MrJino (May 21, 2015)

charlescuatan said:


> I wanna purchase this chef knife but haven't seen a proper review for this knife
> 
> http://www.aplusrstore.com/product/1499/furtif-evercut-knives
> 
> Anyone of you guys tried this knife?



I could never purchase a knife like that...

IMO, wustof, victorinox, Henkel are all good knives for basic home chefs. I would not go cheap, and never buy exotic material for blades like ceramic or what have you.

Stainless is good for durable use, easy to sharpen.
Carbon is good for screaming sharp edges and long edge retention, Harder steel so harder to sharpen.


----------



## bladesmith3 (May 23, 2015)

I still use the 12" and 10" Sabatier chef knifes that my grandmother used before I was born and I am on social security. LOL.. yes carbon steel. yes they blackened and stained over the years but I would never polish them. BTW.. I was/am a top grad of the culinary institute of America NY.


----------



## MrJino (May 23, 2015)

Those old Sabatier knives are awesome, they have history and to be able to use one after a long time, shows craftsmanship.
I think their geometry is similar to japanese knives where there isn't much belly in the profile.


----------



## AA#5 (May 23, 2015)

I'm not much of a chef - I mostly use a chef's knife for making salads. I bought a "Mercer" knife & I couldn't believe how good is was for the low price. I've been using it on a bamboo cutting board for a few months & it's still razor sharp. I got the softer handle. Very comfortable & just the right weight. I was so impressed, I bought three of their paring knives.


----------



## P_A_S_1 (Jun 8, 2015)

Recently went to the Korin store in the city, for those members in or close to the NYC area it's worth stopping in just to check it out. A substantial collection of various traditional and western style Japanese knives and water stones.


----------



## Dipti13 (Jun 11, 2015)

MrJino said:


> I could never purchase a knife like that...
> 
> IMO, wustof, victorinox, Henkel are all good knives for basic home chefs. I would not go cheap, and never buy exotic material for blades like ceramic or what have you.
> 
> ...



I would prefer to go with victorinox or cold steel knives. Till now the best kitchen knives set I got from Cold Steel. I hope you will also enjoy it.


----------



## kensington (Jun 11, 2015)

My wife has always done a lot of cooking but due to recent food sensitivities and general health concerns she has really been getting into it so I picked up a Fujiwara FKM-09 and she loves it. I was going to get a MAC Professional 8" but figured it was a bit much and more maintenance then she would want at twice the price of the Fujiwara.


----------



## michiganmade (Jun 16, 2015)

Check out Blade Forums, there is a guy on there P. Wheeler that makes great knives. I am very happy with mine.


----------



## MrJino (Jun 16, 2015)

Dipti13 said:


> I would prefer to go with victorinox or cold steel knives. Till now the best kitchen knives set I got from Cold Steel. I hope you will also enjoy it.



I only use japanese knives. Any other style of knife will slow me down.

I'm no a fan of anything cold steel.


----------



## xxo (Jun 16, 2015)

I'm not much of a cook, but I get a lot of use out of my old plain edged Cold Steel K5 and K4. These have very thinly ground blades that slice real well and their VG1 steel takes and holds a great edge (though it will take a slight patina if not cleaned and dried shortly after you are done using it). The kraton handles on these are not the best, but they a good enough for my use. 


I also get a lot of use out of a couple of Victorinox paring knives (plain and serrated), a old Gerber Gator fillet knife (makes a great watermelon knife), a Spyderco Catcherman in MBS-26 steel (holds a great edge).


If I was a Chef, I could see myself getting into the higher end Japanese knives.


----------



## Dipti13 (Jun 18, 2015)

MrJino said:


> I only use japanese knives. Any other style of knife will slow me down.
> 
> I'm no a fan of anything cold steel.


I would prefer victorinox but not japanese knives.


----------



## MrJino (Jun 21, 2015)

I would love to use this at work, but far too costly.




My work knives


----------



## P_A_S_1 (Jun 21, 2015)

MrJino, very nice knives. The one with the western style handle, the blade kinda looks like a French style. The two rods on the left, knife steels or something else?


----------



## MrJino (Jun 21, 2015)

The western handled knife is by Misono, a Japanese brand.

French knives are similar to japanese knives, sabitier or something like that? It's a misono sujihiki with Swedish carbon steel.

The 2 sharp things are sushi chopsticks, they're used to pick up and place sashimi so you don't touch the fish with your hands.

My knives have never touched a steel rod! It's blasphemy lol


----------



## P_A_S_1 (Jun 21, 2015)

I was going to ask what those chop stick looking things were .... Funny. 

I refresh my edges with a piece of leather instead of steel but I'm using steel that's probably a lot softer then anything you have pictured there.


----------



## MrJino (Jun 21, 2015)

I've been using these for a decade and will never change haha


----------



## FlashKat (Jun 28, 2015)

How good are Shun knives?


----------



## MrJino (Jul 6, 2015)

As a career chef, i wouldn't take a free shun.

Their edges chip frequently, likely heat treat issues. Their handles are terrible for use, very slippery and awkward shapes. 

Shun simply goes for looks. 

Terrible knives for chefs. Yet home chefs like them, because of the looks.


----------



## more_vampires (Jul 6, 2015)

As some have mentioned before: Wusthof. Love em, particularly their paring and small utility blades. I have an 8" santoku Wusthof that I love. A girl over at my house decided to use it once and said "This knife is scaring me. Don't you have any duller knives?"

Also, I saw no mention of my favorite larger knife: NSF. You know, the white handled ones? I absolutely love their santoku pattern blades. The fully dropped point seems to help protect the edge from the more inept people who come into my kitchen to ruin my knives. I caught one of these jerks *using my medium saucepan and my 8" NSF santoku in the machine shop.*  Sure, I got mad. Do any good? NO! I know why he did it. He saw the movie "The World's Fastest Indian" and did it because Burt was crap in the kitchen, as well. Believe it or not, you can get the spots off with a pink pencil eraser. The worst spots can get rubbed with tomato juice and green scotch brite scrub pad, then rinsed with water.

Not certain of the steel, but it takes a shaving razor edge. It gets spotty brown when people other than me insist on running them through the dishwasher, so it's obviously not stainless. I like to touch mine up frequenly before/during/after use with a Fiskars rolling ceramic wheel. I hide the largest and sharpest ones.

As many have stated earlier, people come into my kitchen to ruin my knives regardless of what I do or say or how red I turn. My simple and elegant solution? I grabbed a crappy $1 China "Brandware" serrated steak knife and turned it into a smooth edge on a bench belt sander with a fine belt, dipping it into water repeatedly though it's stainless and has no real temper to ruin. Force of habit. Touch it up on the belt sander once every few weeks or months. They are inherently lazy, so I leave it out where they grab it first because they are too apathetic to get the proper tool for what they are doing and use it correctly. Not one of them can sharpen to save their lives, so I end up being the knife sharpener for everyone.

I catch people stirring coffee cups with this modified steak knife. I caught someone scraping crud from the bottom of the fridge with it. Thank god they are lazy and grab the first thing at hand.

OCD IN THE KITCHEN! :mecry:


----------



## FlashKat (Jul 7, 2015)

Thanks MrJino!!! I almost bought a Shun.


MrJino said:


> As a career chef, i wouldn't take a free shun.
> 
> Their edges chip frequently, likely heat treat issues. Their handles are terrible for use, very slippery and awkward shapes.
> 
> ...


----------



## P_A_S_1 (Oct 23, 2015)

Stopped by the Bowery Kitchen, a kitchen supply shop here in the city, and was checking out some of their knives. They actually have a decent amount of F. ****s knives, a German brand that's pretty hard to find in person. Out of any German knife I've handled it had the best factory edge by far however I wasn't a fan of their '1905' handle, not for me looks wise. While the name always gets a chuckle the knife itself seemed pretty good, not much different from the other big German knives but finished well and less expensive. Would have loved to do some real use comparisons side by side with my Henckles for a week or two .


----------



## ganymede (Oct 25, 2015)

MrJino said:


> My work knives



That two Konosuke White #2 in Wa handle are beautiful! My daily beaters are: 1) Hiromoto Aogami Super 240mm gyuto, 2) Hiromoto Aogami Super 190mm Santoku

Yes, they earned their tiger stripes as well (not my pic):


----------



## more_vampires (Oct 26, 2015)

Beautiful stuff, Mr G.


----------



## RGRAY (Oct 26, 2015)

One word *GLOBAL*.


----------



## MrJino (Oct 26, 2015)

RGRAY said:


> One word *GLOBAL*.



One of my good buddy uses global at work. They're not bad.


----------



## ganymede (Oct 27, 2015)

P_A_S_1 said:


> Stopped by the Bowery Kitchen, a kitchen supply shop here in the city, and was checking out some of their knives. They actually have a decent amount of F. ****s knives, a German brand that's pretty hard to find in person. Out of any German knife I've handled it had the best factory edge by far however I wasn't a fan of their '1905' handle, not for me looks wise. While the name always gets a chuckle the knife itself seemed pretty good, not much different from the other big German knives but finished well and less expensive. Would have loved to do some real use comparisons side by side with my Henckles for a week or two .



Hi P_A_S_1,

What is your budget? You looking for a chef/gyuto knife?

I looked at Bowery Kitchen's website and noticed that they have quite a few Kikuichi and Masamoto. Not sure if you are interested in J-knives, if you are then take a look at these two makers and you will not be disappointed. Good luck! :wave:


----------



## P_A_S_1 (Oct 27, 2015)

Ganymede, 
Just looking for now, happy with the Henckles for what I do. When the time comes I'll probably be leaning towards some Japanese knives however that will require me to also pick up new sharpening supplies for the harder steels. I've been on the Korin site and even went to the store, nice stuff, but reading specs and even handling the knife a little isn't enough to tell how well it will work (IMO), need to really use it to know. If your into Japanese stuff check them out, pretty unique.


----------



## Echo63 (Oct 27, 2015)

Im not much of a cook, and my wife isnt great with knives (frequently knicks and cuts herself) so we have a deal, i take ingredients and make them smaller, she makes smaller ingredients into food.

I have a bunch of kitchen knifes, of the lot, my favorite is the Spyderco Santoku (old MBS-26 model without the trademark hole)
its handle fits my hand really well, it gets and stays scary sharp - due to the size it makes a great "shovel" for scooping stuff off a chopping board.
easy to resharpen too - a dozen swipes on my sharpmaker with UF rods once a week or two to bring back the scary edge (feels like its trying to nibble your fingerprints off)
if i lost or broke it, i would find another one.

i have two Ran Santokus, (VG10 laminate Micarta handle - like a Shun) 
good knives, hold an edge well but seem to chip a bit, havent seen any major issues since removing all the chips with a diamond plate, so it may have been fatigue issues (the chips started suddenly, and have now stopped again - other option is my wife has been abusing them while i am at work)
these have been a pain to resharpen - given the chips, better to keep them sharp with a few swipes on a sharpmaker every week

Wife has a Victorinox - comfortable handle, gets very sharp, doesnt hold an edge as well as the others, but it is a typical "german" knife, softer steel designed to be regularly steeled to freshen the edge, rather than the others that are all harder steels with better edgeholding.
it is incredibly rust resistant though.
needs frequently touching up, i give it a half dozen strokes on the sharpmakers brown rods every time i use it.

Globals - we have a block full (6knives)
they cut well, hold an edge decently (i believe the steel is roughly equivalent to aus-6) and are a piece of cake to sharpen
they dont stay as scary sharp as the Spyderco and Ran knives, but are easily touched up on the Sharpmaker - ultrafine stones every few days.


i should note that i am an edge nut, and i like really sharp knives 
maintenance is done with an Sharpmaker, and heavy sharpening is done with an Edgepro Apex (up to 1000 grit stones the 2k and 3k tapes) on all except the victorinox, which gets a 600grit diamond stone and a quick strop with chromium oxide on balsa wood (in the edgepro) as it loses its edge so quickly its not worth the effort of polishing.


----------



## ganymede (Oct 27, 2015)

P_A_S_1 said:


> Ganymede,
> Just looking for now, happy with the Henckles for what I do. When the time comes I'll probably be leaning towards some Japanese knives however that will require me to also pick up new sharpening supplies for the harder steels. I've been on the Korin site and even went to the store, nice stuff, but reading specs and even handling the knife a little isn't enough to tell how well it will work (IMO), need to really use it to know. If your into Japanese stuff check them out, pretty unique.



Hi P_A_S_1,

I am familiar with Korin and they do have a good range of J-knives. There are a few other well stocked dealers online e.g. chefknivestogo (CKTG), japaneseknifeimports (JKI) and japanesechefsknife (JCK). I bought my Hiromotos and Kagayakis all from JCK.

If you look at major forums on kitchen knives you will discover that there is a quantum shift from Germans to J-knives, the Germans akin to Mag-lites here on CPF are good for what they do but there are better ones out there for serious knives user (flashaholics). As such, the Germans (mag-lites) get very little ink and hardly anyone talk about them. I do understand Germans vs J-knives is all down to personal preference and I respect that very much. Good luck in your search.


----------



## P_A_S_1 (Nov 1, 2015)

Been reading up on the Misono Swedish carbon steel chef knives, anyone here have any experience with them? 



http://korin.com/Misono-Swedish-Carbon-Steel-Gyutou


----------



## ganymede (Nov 2, 2015)

P_A_S_1 said:


> Been reading up on the Misono Swedish carbon steel chef knives, anyone here have any experience with them?
> 
> 
> 
> http://korin.com/Misono-Swedish-Carbon-Steel-Gyutou



Perhaps MrJino above can shed some light on Misono as the 2nd knife from the right in his photo is a Misono?


----------



## MrJino (Nov 2, 2015)

Good eye!

The misono swedish steel is a very good knife. It has excellent geometry, materials, and fit and finish is above its price range.

I sold mine years ago, my coworker is still using it. I almost regret the sale, but it's in good hands.

One thing I'd like to add, it is not for a beginner chef. Any carbon needs pepper knowledge of steel, as it will rust in minutes if in the wrong hands.
As long as it's wiped dry after use, doesn't have to be bone dry, there just can't be spots of moisture on it, or it'll rust and pit very quickly.

Here is the sujihiki version, with patina that I made for it.



backside


----------



## P_A_S_1 (Nov 2, 2015)

MrJino, I've been reading the pros and cons on various sites but would like to know a few things if you don't mind. I use two stones for sharpening, medium india and a translucent Arkansas, will the carbon steel respond to these stones or are more aggressive stones likely needed? Also, did you find the steel to be tough or chippy?


----------



## P_A_S_1 (Nov 2, 2015)

The second photo looks nice, how did you get the 'pattern' on the knife?


----------



## MrJino (Nov 2, 2015)

P_A_S_1 said:


> MrJino, I've been reading the pros and cons on various sites but would like to know a few things if you don't mind. I use two stones for sharpening, medium india and a translucent Arkansas, will the carbon steel respond to these stones or are more aggressive stones likely needed? Also, did you find the steel to be tough or chippy?



I've never used those stones before, but I would day this is a fairly easy steel to sharpen.
It has never chipped, but I've never used it in a way it would chip, as mine was a dedicated slicer, not chopper.

I used kitayama 8000 and chosera 6000 only.


----------



## P_A_S_1 (Nov 2, 2015)

MrJino said:


> I've never used those stones before, but I would day this is a fairly easy steel to sharpen.
> It has never chipped, but I've never used it in a way it would chip, as mine was a dedicated slicer, not chopper.
> 
> I used kitayama 8000 and chosera 6000 only.




OK, Thanks. I'm considering this knife so any info is appreciated. Not a chef, home use only, but I'd like to get a substantially better knife then what I'm using now (Henckle).


----------



## MrJino (Nov 2, 2015)

P_A_S_1 said:


> OK, Thanks. I'm considering this knife so any info is appreciated. Not a chef, home use only, but I'd like to get a substantially better knife then what I'm using now (Henckle).



Any reason you want the carbon version over the stainless steel?

If it were for home, I'd get stainless personally, as I know other people will use the knife and eventually rust.


----------



## P_A_S_1 (Nov 2, 2015)

MrJino said:


> Any reason you want the carbon version over the stainless steel?
> 
> If it were for home, I'd get stainless personally, as I know other people will use the knife and eventually rust.



The performance and ease of sharpening. I never had a carbon steel knife so there is some allure there as well.


----------



## MrJino (Nov 2, 2015)

P_A_S_1 said:


> The performance and ease of sharpening. I never had a carbon steel knife so there is some allure there as well.



Well, that is true. Stainless does not perform the same as carbon, in my line of work, sushi.

But it's not that much easier to sharpen, I'd say barely makes a difference, some stainless is very as to sharpen for me.
But I have pretty decent stones to help me.


----------



## ganymede (Nov 2, 2015)

P_A_S_1 said:


> The performance and ease of sharpening. I never had a carbon steel knife so there is some allure there as well.



You could go for stainless steel cladded carbon steel knife.


----------



## more_vampires (Nov 3, 2015)

MrJino said:


> Any carbon needs pepper knowledge of steel, as it will rust in minutes if in the wrong hands.
> As long as it's wiped dry after use, doesn't have to be bone dry, there just can't be spots of moisture on it, or it'll rust and pit very quickly.


I spray my carbon knives with cooking spray after use and cleaning. It seems to stop corrosion cold.


----------



## MrJino (Nov 3, 2015)

It's not uncommon that sushi chefs will use camellia oil to protect their carbon, as camellia does not spoil (I believe).


----------



## Trip Miller (Nov 18, 2015)

If you have not bought yet I just purchased a 8 & 10 gyuto (one for me and one for a second or spare as I cook with my brother a lot) a Santuko and a 6 petty and 3.5 paring all made by Tojiro and are the DP models. Great J-knife, VG-10 core steel with a stainless sanwich. They are VERY affordable for what they are and are a really nice transitional knife from G knifes to J knifes. Fit and finish is really good for the money. You can see them at chefsknifestogo but check out Amazon....

I am not a kitchen knife expert at all but have well into 5 figures in folding and fixed blade knives so I am very familiar with quality (and crap) knives and these are a best buy I am positive.

Good luck.


----------



## MrJino (Nov 18, 2015)

Trip Miller said:


> If you have not bought yet I just purchased a 8 & 10 gyuto (one for me and one for a second or spare as I cook with my brother a lot) a Santuko and a 6 petty and 3.5 paring all made by Tojiro and are the DP models. Great J-knife, VG-10 core steel with a stainless sanwich. They are VERY affordable for what they are and are a really nice transitional knife from G knifes to J knifes. Fit and finish is really good for the money. You can see them at chefsknifestogo but check out Amazon....
> 
> I am not a kitchen knife expert at all but have well into 5 figures in folding and fixed blade knives so I am very familiar with quality (and crap) knives and these are a best buy I am positive.
> 
> Good luck.



Tojiro is a good entry into japanese knives. Many of my chefs have used tojiro starting out.


----------



## P_A_S_1 (Nov 18, 2015)

Recently was at a store that had a selection of Japanese and German knives on display, some of the Japanese knives were Damascus and pricey, when a women came in to complain about the knives she recently brought. She proceeded to take out of a plastic shopping bag about 5 of the Japanese Damascus knives that were on display and put them on the counter, they all were chipped like I never saw before. The chips were huge, some the size of a half nickel, and overall the knives were destroyed. The sales person actually asked if they were used for opening cans. The women was dismayed by the knives stating 'these were the most expensive knives you carry, how can this happen?'. In talking to the women it was obvious she knew little about knives and just equated high price to being the best. To see such nice knives so badly damaged was a shame but it does highlight one advantage of the German knives over the harder Japanese knives, toughness.


----------



## MrJino (Nov 18, 2015)

Yeah, if you can't use a knife properly go german.

Japanese knives are for professional chefs who can care for their tools.
the Japanese also say stainless is for women and children. I didn't say it! 

I keep a wustof only because the household can't properly use a japanese knife, i keep them at work.


----------



## P_A_S_1 (Nov 19, 2015)

While I know everyone has their preference I've read quite a few sources that favor stainless over carbon in the professional setting. In one book I read by John Juranitch who serviced the textile and meat/poultry industries in North American he was adamant that carbon held no real advantage over stainless attributing the belief to lack of knowledge of proper sharpening. I've also read culinary schools steer their students away from Japanese knives for whatever reason. Regardless I recently brought a small carbon steel knive, swedish carbon, to try out and form my own opinion. One con I've noticed is the carbon has a metallic smell I've not noticed on my stainless and on some foods the smell transfers, not crazy about that.


----------



## Chauncey Gardiner (Nov 20, 2015)

Back in the 60's, I was probably six or seven years old at the time, I took a couple of mom's good knives outside to play with. Dad was in the Airforce and we were stationed in Okinawa. The only cartoons we had to watch on TV were ones about ninjas........... When I brought them back inside the blades had some big chips. Neither mom or dad took them back to the store, but I'm pretty sure there was a trip to the "woodshed." 

~ Chance


----------



## ganymede (Nov 21, 2015)

P_A_S_1 said:


> While I know everyone has their preference I've read quite a few sources that favor stainless over carbon in the professional setting. In one book I read by John Juranitch who serviced the textile and meat/poultry industries in North American he was adamant that carbon held no real advantage over stainless attributing the belief to lack of knowledge of proper sharpening. I've also read culinary schools steer their students away from Japanese knives for whatever reason. Regardless I recently brought a small carbon steel knive, swedish carbon, to try out and form my own opinion. One con I've noticed is the carbon has a metallic smell I've not noticed on my stainless and on some foods the smell transfers, not crazy about that.



Hi P_A_S_1,

On reactivity, carbon knives are generally more reactive to food than stainless steel knives. Good quality mono steel carbon knives while still reactive (forming patina) to certain food but it won't affect the taste of the food. Pro sushi chefs use carbon knives because of its excellent sharpness and edge retention qualities. That said, no pro sushi chef would use a carbon knife if it affect the taste of the food especially raw food like sushi/sashimi right? 

On maintenance, carbon knives do generally require more maintenance than stainless steel knives but if the chef knows what he is doing, I am sure he wouldn't mine that extra maintenance in return for much better cutting performance. If one spend a lot of time working on the chopping board especially in a fast pace commercial setting, better cutting performance and edge retention translate to faster prep time and less time spent on sharpening. This is important to Japanese cuisine especially in preparing sushi and sashimi where the ingredients are raw and visual part (5 senses) of the food presentation is extremely important. In Japanese cuisine, cleanness of the cut/slice is a real test of the chef's competency and any pro sushi chef worth his salt wouldn't want his plate of sashimi looks like being cut with a saw. It probably won't matter if this is a 10oz steak, noone can't tell whether the meat was cut with a Wushtof or 15 bucks kitchen knife from Target. 

If you want a compromise then try "San-Mai" carbon knives like my Hiromoto AS which the carbon steel core is sandwiched (hence "San-Mai") between stainless steel clad, so only the cutting edge of the carbon steel is exposed and slightly less in maintenance. You will get the cutting performance of carbon steel and the ease of maintenance (aesthetic) of stainless steel. That said, I still diligently wipe dry my knives after cleaning.

Also, it is important to remember that carbon knives being carbon knives, they are more delicate because the hardness of the steel make it brittle and more prone to chipping and you wouldn't want to use your 200 dollars hand made J-knife to pry open a can of spam. :laughing:

An artisan made quality knife is something you have to use to appreciate its craftsmanship. Mind you, like custom titanium flashlights (ala SPY, McGizmo et al) after you tried an artisan made knife there will be no turning back, it is all down hill from here.


----------



## MrJino (Nov 24, 2015)

Wow, very good explanation of carbon knives.

Today I'm sharpening and polishing my fixed blades while polishing my kitchen knives. It's a slow day at work.


----------



## Maven (Nov 25, 2015)

My kitchen has been filled with Wusthof Tridents for about 15 years now, they go in the dishwasher, they lay in the sink...they are still great. Doesnt matter who uses them, they come out no worse for the wear and still keep a very good edge with just light steel hone before use, I think Ive had most of them actually sharpened just once.

Ive had a ZJAH/Bob Kramer 10" carbon for about a year and half or so I guess now, and really enjoy using it, even in a mass produced licensed knife theres a character that the WT's just dont have. My aunt, a chef, provided it as a gift after I fell love with her $4,000 custom BK 10"


----------



## MrJino (Dec 11, 2015)

Maven said:


> My kitchen has been filled with Wusthof Tridents for about 15 years now, they go in the dishwasher, they lay in the sink...they are still great. Doesnt matter who uses them, they come out no worse for the wear and still keep a very good edge with just light steel hone before use, I think Ive had most of them actually sharpened just once.
> 
> Ive had a ZJAH/Bob Kramer 10" carbon for about a year and half or so I guess now, and really enjoy using it, even in a mass produced licensed knife theres a character that the WT's just dont have. My aunt, a chef, provided it as a gift after I fell love with her $4,000 custom BK 10"



What is a BK and why is it 4000?


----------



## ChiefK (Dec 20, 2015)

MrJino, may I ask the name of the maker and the model of the knife in the middle of your most recent pic?

I love the shape of the handle.

I'm not a professional chef, but I do cook at home very frequently and love the knife/prep work.

I've tried keeping our "good knives" in shape, but it's a losing battle at home.

I would like to get one really good chef's knife and keep it hidden from my wife.


----------



## archimedes (Dec 20, 2015)

MrJino said:


> What is a BK....



My guess would be that @Maven is referring to a fully custom Bob Kramer knife ....



MrJino said:


> ....and why is it 4000?



.... Because he is referring to a fully custom Bob Kramer knife 

EDIT - here's a link to examples of his work ...

http://kramerknives.com/auctions/gallery/


----------



## MrJino (Dec 21, 2015)

ChiefK said:


> MrJino, may I ask the name of the maker and the model of the knife in the middle of your most recent pic?
> 
> I love the shape of the handle.
> 
> ...



The middle one is a konosuke fujiyama gyuto, at 270 mm. The handle is ebony I believe. 
Excellent knife, but at about 350-400 it is not for everyone.


----------



## MrJino (Dec 21, 2015)

archimedes said:


> My guess would be that @Maven is referring to a fully custom Bob Kramer knife ....
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Good lord that's expensive, but to me the short necks of the knives is an annoyance for sharpening... japanese knives come with longer necks, since we tend to love sharpening our own knives.


----------



## P_A_S_1 (Dec 21, 2015)

That's some web site. I almost fell over laughing when I read this;


*The Lottery

**This is the current way to order a custom Kramer knife that you design from tip to heel. As Bob has room in his schedule, we select names from our email list to place an order.
*​


----------



## Chauncey Gardiner (Dec 22, 2015)

MrJino said:


> Good lord that's expensive, but to me the short necks of the knives is an annoyance for sharpening... japanese knives come with longer necks, since we tend to love sharpening our own knives.



Considering a knife of that quality will be handed down for many genarations, its price is a great value when contrasted to the $500 your former boss paid for a four ounce steak. 

~ Chance


----------



## P_A_S_1 (Dec 22, 2015)

Had a left over turkey carcass I used for a soup (I like to debone and stuff poultry as opposed to cooking the birds w/ their bones in), a seventeen pounder who wouldn't fit in the pot. No meat cleaver so I took the Henckles large knife and a rolling pin and battoned right threw the backbone, three strikes total. When done about one inch of the edge was wrecked, as expected, but not as bad as I thought it would be. Ten minutes on a India/Arkansas and all damage corrected and it was back to shaving sharp. I keep a low back bevel and only a slightly higher micro bevel on it so it held up well all things considered. While it's something I wouldn't recommend doing it was pretty cool nonetheless and in the case of a total failure I've had my eye on a Misono anyway .


----------



## Chauncey Gardiner (Dec 22, 2015)

P_A_S_1,

Did you take any before & after pictures?

~ Chance


----------



## P_A_S_1 (Dec 22, 2015)

Chauncey Gardiner said:


> P_A_S_1,
> 
> Did you take any before & after pictures?
> 
> ~ Chance



No. Didn't even cross my mind.


----------



## Chauncey Gardiner (Dec 22, 2015)

P_A_S_1 said:


> No. Didn't even cross my mind.



That's too bad. Going from wrecked to razor sharpe in ten minutes constitutes braggin rights. :thumbsup: If I had your skills back in Okinawa I might have saved myself a trip to the woodshed. :whoopin:

~ Chance


----------



## P_A_S_1 (Dec 22, 2015)

Well I've thinned out the edge well in previous sharpening so that helps but thanks. It's funny though I've read and been told by others how hard German stainless steel is to sharpen but I don't find that to be the case at all.


----------



## Chauncey Gardiner (Dec 22, 2015)

It might be a simple case of comparison. Perhaps you've never had to sharpen any cheap steel, therefore, you don't have anything really easy to compare your German stainless to. 

~ Chance


----------



## CLHC (Jan 22, 2016)

The Victorinox Forschner Chef's Knife is my go to knife in the kitchen:





Something about that [in]expensive knife that I'm not too overly concerned when family members stay with me and use that knife for preparing. Not to say that it is not a good knife, but it is a great knife and one that has to be "fit to be tried." Easy to maintain and hone.

But since acquiring the Mora 748 and 749, I'll be giving these two a work out.


----------



## P_A_S_1 (Jan 22, 2016)

Those Victorinox Fibrox knives get good reviews from everyone and are cheap too. Should be more or less the same steel used in the Wustoff and Henckles but ground thinner then both. The F. ****s looks nice, how do you like that one?


----------



## CLHC (Jan 24, 2016)

P_A_S_1 said:


> Those Victorinox Fibrox knives get good reviews from everyone and are cheap too. Should be more or less the same steel used in the Wustoff and Henckles but ground thinner then both. The F. ****s looks nice, how do you like that one?


Growing up with the white handle[d] Forschner's that my parents used when I was five (5) years young were all that I knew about kitchen knives. So when I found the now SAK-Forschner, I simply had to get one.

The VSAK-F Chef's Knife is really light and easy to use and RaZoR Sharp out of the box. I'm no ProExeChef or Cook, but do manage my own home cooked meals. When preparing vegetables or beef or chicken or fish, the VSAK-F Chef's Knife is great to us since I do take my time cutting/dicing/slicing. Being that I have a one track mind/tunnel vision when preparing, it does take me quite a while to do so. And no! I don't "point my index finger" when using the knife. I'm using the grip "pinch" method on the blade with thumb and index finger with the remainder of fingers on the handle. Here's an interesting video of Alton Brown on knife techniques:



I notice than the VSAK-Forschner CF does not "fatigue" my hand/wrist when using it for an extended period as much as I can "feel" when using the Eberhard Schaaf Goldenhamster. Personally, I really like this knife and is my personal favorite. Did I say it was RaZoR Sharp? When I was slicing an Onion, it sliced of my fingernails from the index and middle fingers! Good thing it did not go through to skin!

Here's the weight difference:












Oh by the way, I hand wash and dry my knives straightaway after use.


----------



## CLHC (Jan 24, 2016)

Here's the weight of my Eberhard Schaaf Goldhamster First Class






I'd say that every ounce/gram makes a big difference.


----------



## CLHC (Jan 24, 2016)

P_A_S_1 said:


> The F. ****s looks nice, how do you like that one?


This one is quite a Knife in its own respects. Very nice, Very Very Sharp, very "Nobel" I'd say. In my hands, this one is balanced and quite easy to maneuver in the kitchen when prepping. Me thinks the handle is hollow, pretty much like the Shun. Personally, I've no regrets getting this Friedrich **** 1905 Exclusive Chef's Knife.


----------



## P_A_S_1 (Jan 24, 2016)

I like the 1905 series, it had the best 'factory' edge of any German knife I handled, finished well. I like the shape of the blade and the balance too.


----------



## CLHC (Jun 8, 2016)

While not considered a Kitchen Knife, this is my Shun Higo-No Kami's first slice into steak!






Let me say that it required no effort whatsoever to slice! Very sharp for a Gentleman's Pocket Steak Knife.


----------



## Chauncey Gardiner (Jun 9, 2016)

MWM! Mouth watering meat! 

~ C.G.


----------



## CLHC (Jun 9, 2016)

Chauncey Gardiner said:


> MWM! Mouth watering meat!
> 
> ~ C.G.


Indeed it truly was! Thanks!


----------



## CelticCross74 (Sep 24, 2016)

BK2 cut up, hacked up a giant turkey last Thanksgiving shockingly well


----------

