# What about JIL-CR2?



## Dawg (May 5, 2006)

Will there ever be more?


----------



## Somy Nex (May 5, 2006)

*Re: What about JIL?*

i certainly hope so. they're small, bright, versatile (especially with Goldserve's FLuPIC), and very tough. =)


----------



## Planterz (May 5, 2006)

*Re: What about JIL?*

I think the Jil is between version revisions. I think they should be available again in the not-too-distant future. At least, I hope so.


----------



## vortechs (May 5, 2006)

*Re: What about JIL?*

I hope you don't mind if I use this thread to ask for feedback on the JIL information document I've been working on. I've been meaning to post this for weeks but there always seems to be one more revision I want to do to it. I would eventually like to make this the first post in a new thread specifically dedicated to the JIL series (perhaps in the Reviews forum). Let me know what you think [note that this post has been edited several times to include additional information]. 

----

Information about the JIL CR2 series:

It can be rather confusing for a newcomer to understand the JIL CR2 series of flashlights. It is hard to find information about the JIL CR2 outside of CPF and it is difficult to search on short strings like “JIL” in CPF. I will try to summarize some information about the JIL series for the benefit of all.

JIL CR2 flashlights are made in South Korea and exported in small quantities. Production so far has been limited. The name "JIL" is an acronym that stands for "Jesus In Light" (which explains why it is also sometimes written as JiL with a small "i"). 

Note that this post still uses the original names for the JIL CR2 series (DD, 1.3W, Intelli). In July of 2006 the JIL series was updated (updates include a matte gray HA3 finish and McR-18 reflector). The new name of the series is JCR2 and the new names for the models are as follows: JIL CR2 DD --> JCR2 LR (LongRun), JIL CR2 1.3w --> JCR2 HI (High Intensity), JIL CR2 Intelli --> JCR2 IT (Intelli), JIL CR2 UV --> JCR2 UV. 

*JIL CR2 series flashlight heads:*
*JIL-DD:* The JIL-DD direct drives the LED. The input voltage that can be used depends on the bin of the LED that is installed in the JIL-DD head. Using a voltage less than the Vf for the LED is referred to as ‘underdriving’ and results in dimmer light from the LED. Using a voltage higher than the Vf for the LED is referred to as ‘overdriving’ and will increase brightness but will reduce energy efficiency and shorten the LED lifespan. Voltages much higher than the Vf for the LED will shorten its lifespan to zero (poof) unless a resistor is used. The stock JIL-DD (with either the TW0J or TW0H emitter) is significantly underdriven by a 3V primary battery (CR2) which is why the JIL-DD @ 3V is not as bright as the JIL-1.3W (which boosts the battery voltage). The stock JIL-DD with either a TW0J or TW0H LED would be overdriven by a 3.6V LiIon rechargeable cell (RCR2). The TW0J emitter (Vf = 3.27-3.51) would be mildly overdriven by a 3.6V LiIon, while the TW0H emitter (Vf = 3.03-3.27) would be significantly overdriven, especially since a “3.6V” LiIon cell produces up to 4.2V when it is fresh off the charger. Technically an xxxK bin emitter (Vf = 3.51-3.75) would be much better suited for direct drive with a 3.6V LiIon rechargeable cell.
*JIL-1.3W:* Contains a LEDdynamics LuxDrive MicroPuck controller (model 2009-HI, or maybe HO???) to boost the voltage of a 3V Lithium primary cell, in order to achieve increased brightness with 3V primary batteries at the expense of reduced runtime. The MicroPuck is designed for a battery voltage of 1V to 3V with 3V giving the rated current (400mA) to the LED and lower input voltages providing less current to the LED. The optimal input is 3V from either a Lithium primary CR2 cell or two 1.5V cells in an optional battery extension (such as two AA Alkaline cells in the JIL-Bus extension). Using 3.6V LiIon rechargeable cells with the 1.3W head is not recommended because the MicroPuck controller is only rated for up to 3V input (in its typical boost configuration in the JIL-1.3W). (At least one person has tried a Li-Ion cell in the 1.3W UV and it does not immediately fail, but the long term effects are uncertain). Two 1.2V NiMH cells (2.4V) will work with the JIL-1.3W head but the light output will be a bit lower (probably about 280mA to the LED = 70% as bright as a 3V input). The MicroPuck can even boost a single 1.2V or 1.5V cell enough to power the LED, but it will be much less bright (probably about 100mA to the LED from a 1.2V input and about 150mA to the LED from a 1.5V input = 25% to 40% as bright as a 3V input ). The data sheet for the MicroPuck boost converter is available here: http://www.leddynamics.com/LuxDrive/datasheets/2009A-MicroPuck.pdf . Note that the 1.3W head is longer than the DD head; some people have commented that this makes the head easier to turn with one hand when using the CR2 body, especially if some o-rings are fitted into the 3 grooves in the head. The 1.3W model can be identified by the longer head and because it has 3 grooves and two rows of 'texture' bars (knurling). The DD model has a shorter head with only 2 grooves and one row of 'texture' bars. The 'texture' bars on the newer (Up) models are at a 45 degree diagonal, while the 'texture' bars on the original pre-Up version seem to be longitudinal. 
*JIL-1.3W modded with FLuPIC:* The first version of the JIL CR2 that was modified to use the FLuPIC controller was the 1.3W version, because it had more room in the head for the FLuPIC electronics. However, the MicroPuck controller was removed from the head to make room for the FLuPIC so this mod cannot boost brightness with primary batteries like the normal JIL-1.3W head. Eventually the size of the FLuPIC mod was reduced to fit inside the smaller JIL-DD head and the FLuPIC mod for the JIL-1.3W was discontinued.
*JIL-DD modded with FLuPIC, or “Intelli”:* A variant of the JIL-DD that includes a FLuPIC module (developed by CPF member goldserve) that limits the maximum current to the LED and offers variable brightness levels and modes such as strobe and SOS. The FLuPIC uses pulse width modulation to control the brightness of the light. The FLuPIC mod for the JIL-DD can be purchased from its creator, CPF member goldserve. The FLuPIC for the JIL-DD can also be included by the manufacturer/distributor, in the “Intelli” version; this version is marked “INTELLI”on the side of the bezel and was first introduced as a special to CPF members for the holiday season at the end of 2005. Input voltage to the FLuPIC can be 2.4 to 4.5V (a fresh “3.6V” LiIon produces 4.2V for a short time). I am not certain of the maximum voltage that the FLuPIC can tolerate beyond 4.5V, but goldserve has said that 4.5V from three 1.5V cells in series would be ok and has specifically said to NOT use two LiIon cells in series (8.4V peak). Here is some clarification from goldserve: "I'd say 4.5, 4.8V is okay to power a K or J bin led. The board will handle up to 5.5V if you power something within the range of 4.5-5V led. Maybe the K2s could use this combination. I will try the K2 leds with a 6V input in the future. Stress test it to make sure the uC will last at 6V." When using a Li-Ion RCR2 cell, the FLuPIC will deliver about 600mA to the LED at the maximum brightness setting (20 of 20) and perhaps 800-1000mA in the maximum (or 'burst') setting (I have seen different numbers in posts and haven't measured it myself yet). 

*LED: *
The JIL CR2 uses a Luxeon III LED (sometimes referred to as a “3 watt” LED). Most early versions used a TW0J LED, although apparently some TxxK bin (K-bin Vf) JIL-CR2 DD models were made in the early time of production. At that time you could get a TxxK LED by special request, if you intended to use RCR2 Li-Ion rechargable cells (very bright, very hot and about 20mins of runtime), however this has been mostly superseded by the Intelli or DD with FLuPIC. In August of 2005 versions with a TW0H LED were introduced (these first shipped on 09-26-2005). There is also a version of the 1.3W model with an ultraviolet (UV) LED (Cree 7090 UV LED, 395nm). For someone who is skilled at soldering, it is fairly easy to change the LED in the JIL so there may be variations with other types of LED’s (especially for JIL-DD’s that have been modded with a FLuPIC). In February 2007, CPF member goldserve introduced a mod to install a Seoul P4 LED in the newer JCR2 series lights (see here for details). 

*Reflector: *
I believe there are at least four reflectors available for the JIL CR2 head: the original reflector, the (Up) reflector, the slightly longer (Up) reflector for the "Joker" TW0H LED, and a McR-18 reflector for a "Joker" LED. The original reflector was changed to the (Up) reflector in the (Up) upgrade package. The (Up) reflector is slightly different between the original TW0J lights and the newer TW0H lights due to a difference in the height of the LED. I believe the change occurred in late 2005. The TW0H lights had a “Joker” style LED (which have a lower die height than a non-Joker LED). The JCR2 model (introduced in July of 2006) uses a McR-18 reflector (optimized for whichever type of LED that particular light has (“Joker” or non-“Joker”) [I believe]. 

*Lens: *
Early versions of the JIL CR2 had a plastic lens. An ultra clear mineral glass lens (ultra-clear lens or UCL) was made available as an upgrade. When the UCL was included at the factory, the designation “(Up)” for Upgraded was added to the name engraved on the side of the body. This is now the standard configuration, so the (Up) simply identifies the light as one of the newer versions where the UCL is standard (along with the (Up) reflector).

*JIL CR2 series flashlight bodies and body extensions:*
*JIL-CR2 (1 x CR2 size):* This is the normal ‘stock’ body for the JIL-CR2 series. The normal JIL CR2 body does not have a tailcap (the body must be unscrewed from the head to replace the CR2 battery). There is no way to mount a tailcap switch on the JIL CR2 body, however both the JIL-Cab and JIL-Bus body extensions for the JIL have tailcaps that can be replaced with a ‘clickie’ switch like the Kroll switch. The CR2 body is intended for one 3V CR2 primary cell with the JIL-DD or JIL-1.3W heads, or for one 3.6V LiIon RCR2 rechargeable cell with the JIL-DD Intelli head (or other FLuPIC modded head). The Intelli head can also be used with a 3V CR2 primary, but the brightness will be similar to the JIL-DD. A 3.6V LiIon RCR2 could also be used in combination with a JIL-DD head that does not have a FLuPIC but contains an LED that is capable of tolerating the 3.6+ volts of a LiIon cell such as an xxxK bin Luxeon III. Running an xxxJ bin on direct drive from a 3.6V LiIon is not recommended, but several people on CPF have reported doing it and there have not been any reports of LED failures yet. Running an xxxH bin on direct drive from a 3.6V LiIon is not recommended and I am not aware of any reports of this being tried. Note that there have been reports of some RCR2’s (15270 or 15266 cells) being too wide to easily fit in the JIL CR2 body. Removing the battery label usually solves this. There have also been reports of some RCR2’s being a bit too short to make contact. A small spacer magnet or a piece of folded aluminum foil will solve this. If you’re worried about the 15270 RCR2 fitting the JIL CR2 body, AW also sells LiIon batteries in size 14270 (310 mAh, unprotected) which is a slightly smaller diameter than the CR2 (15270) and easily fits the JIL CR2 tube (in fact, AW says they’re loose enough to rattle).
*JIL-Cab (1 x AA size):* The JIL-Cab is primarily intended to allow a single AA-sized (14500) rechargeable 3.6V LiIon cell to be used with the JIL CR2 DD-Intelli head (or any other JIL with a FLuPIC controller that can limit the current to the LED) to achieve increased runtime over the smaller CR2-sized cell. The JIL-Cab extension could also be used with a JIL CR2 DD head that does not have a FLuPIC but contains an LED that is capable of tolerating the 3.6+ volts of a 14500 LiIon cell. Another option is that two 3V AA-sized lithium primary cells can be obtained by splitting up a CRV3 battery; one of these 3V AA-sized lithium primary cells can be used to run either the DD or the 1.3W version with the JIL-Cab body. There is also a 3.6V AA-sized primary cell available (SAFT, TADIRAN, etc.), it cannot deliver the current necessary to run the DD or DD-Intelli at full brightness but the boost circuit in the 1.3W seems to be able to get full brightness from some of them. The JIL-Cab can be used with the 1.3W head and 1 x AA alkaline or NiMH battery but it will be much less bright with only 1.2-1.5V of input compared to 3V input, however it should still be brighter than the JIL-DD with 3V input. The JIL-Cab cannot be used with the DD or DD-Intelli heads with only 1 x AA alkaline or NiMH battery because the 1.5V of a single alkaline cell or 1.2V of a single NiMH cell is not sufficient to power the LED. The JIL-Cab has a tailcap that can be replaced with a ‘clickie’ switch like the Kroll switch. The back end of the JIL-Cab and JIL-Bus are designed to be compatible with a SureFire Z60 lanyard. 
*JIL-Bus (2 x AA size):* The JIL-Bus is primarily intended to allow 2 alkaline AA or 2 NiMH AA cells to be used with the JIL-1.3W head to provide a nearly constant light output for a much longer time than the approximately 90 minutes from a 700 mAh CR2 primary. The JIL-Bus can also be used with the JIL-DD head and 2 alkaline AA cells to provide an extremely long runtime (several days of continuous operation), although the light output will decrease as the voltage of the alkaline batteries drops as they discharge (using two 1.5V Lithium AA cells instead of alkaline would provide a more constant light level because the Lithium AA cells have less variation in voltage as they discharge). While the JIL-Bus could be used with the JIL-DD head (or JIL-DD Intelli head) and 2 NiMH cells, the 2.4V from the cells would significantly underdrive the LED and the light would be fairly dim (but would have outstanding runtime, I intend to eventually try this and see how many days or weeks it runs). The JIL-Bus has a tailcap that can be replaced with a ‘clickie’ switch like the Kroll switch. The back end of the JIL-Cab and JIL-Bus are designed to be compatible with a SureFire Z60 lanyard. 

*Finish:* 
The JIL-CR2 series is coated with a very durable Type III Hard Anodized (or HA3) finish that is a semi-glossy gray color. There is no brown or green tint, it is completely gray. The darkness of the gray can vary somewhat from one batch of annodizing to another, which is typical of natural HA3 annodizing, so JIL's that were annodized in different batches may appear to be slightly different shades of gray. There were a few JIL-CR2 DD models made with a shiny chrome finish. The chrome finish has been reported to be even more durable than the HA3. The new JCR2 series is coted with a HA3 finish that is a matte silvery-gray color (a chrome version of the JCR2-LR will be available). 

*Reported measurements for JIL head/body combinations:* (various sources) 
JIL-DD head with CR2 body: 51.5mm long, 18mm body diameter, 20mm head diameter, 28 grams with battery (2.027in long, 0.71in body diameter, 0.787in head diameter, 1oz with battery). 
JIL-DD Intelli head with CR2 body: same dimensions as the JIL-DD (maybe a tiny bit longer), 32 grams with battery (1.13oz).
JIL-1.3W head with CR2 body: 60mm long, 18mm body diameter, 20mm head diameter, 38 grams with battery (2.363in long,0.71in body diameter, 0.787in head diameter, 1.34oz with battery). 

*Brightness: *
See Cones' review (link below). From Cones' reviews of the JiL's, the JIL-DD Intelli with a RCR2 cell is about 800-900 lux on full power (for 15 minutes) while the JIL-1.3W with a CR2 primary cell is about 400-450 lux (for 90 minutes) and the JIL-DD with a CR2 primary cell is about 80 lux (for 12+ hours). The new JCR2 versions should provide somewhat higher lux readings due to the more focused hotspot provided by the McR-18 reflector, however the total light output (lumens) should be the same as the previous versions (assuming the same bin LED and battery type are used). 
 
*Other possible battery sizes and combinations:*
The JIL-DD (or Intelli) head with the JIL-Bus body could use one 14670 LiIon cell along with a fairly long spacer (33mm). This would provide about 30% more capacity than a 14500 (AA size) cell.

The JIL-DD (or Intelli) head with the JIL-Bus body can use three 2/3AA-sized NiMH cells (3 x 1.2V = 3.6V). This requires a small spacer because three 2/3AA size cells are actually shorter than two AA size cells. Three high current NiMH cells (3.6V) drive the JIL-DD or Intelli head at nearly the brightness of a LiIon cell (3.6 to 4.2V) but the head does not heat up as quickly because the LED is not being overdriven as much. Note that since the three 2/3AA NiMH cells are in series, their capacity does not add (although their voltages do), so this combination only provides the same mAh capacity as one cell (about 650-750 mAh).

The JIL-DD (or Intelli) head with the JIL-Bus body could use three N-sized cells (with appropriate spacers and perhaps an outer tube or tape to keep them from rattling). NiMH N cells should be similar to the 2/3AA cells described above but with somewhat less capacity. Alkaline N cells should only be used with the Intelli head, which can limit the current to the LED; this configuration preforms similarly to thee NiMH 2/3AA cells. There doesnt seem to be much difference in brightness between level 20 and burst (Maximum Brightness) and it doesn't heat up as quickly as it does on the burst setting with a single fully charged LiIon RCR2 cell. 

The JIL-DD (or Intelli) head with the CR2 body can use four 1.5V alkaline coin cells (LR44, 357, AG-13) in series (reported by CPF member vcal). The voltage sag of the coin cells under load means that the LED does not actually see 4 x 1.5V = 6V. A spacer (such as a nut) is needed to make the stack of coin cells long enough and it is necessary to wrap something around the cells (such as a strip of paper from a business card) so that the smaller diameter cells will not rattle in the body. (When I tried this with an Intelli, I had difficulty getting a good contact and it tended to switch modes somewhat erratically.) Note that 6V is the maximum for the electronics such as the uC and LDO.

CPF member vcal reported that a 476A 6V alkaline cell (also known as a 4LR44) with a 1/16" spacer works amazingly well in the JIL-DD with CR2 body. The voltage sag due to the high current draw apparently protects the LED, although note that this report must have been using the TW0J LED because it was before the TW0H version was released.

DO NOT attempt to use two 3.6V Lithium Ion cells in the JIL-Cab or JIL-Bus body since no normal JIL head can take the resulting 7.2V (actually up to 8.4V for two fully charged cells). Even the Intelli or a FLuPIC mod cannot handle two LiIon cells. 

*Lithium Ion (Li-Ion) battery care: *
Anyone who is not familar with 3.6V Lithium Ion (Li-Ion) rechargeable cells should definitely do some research on CPF before buying or using them. They require some caution to charge and use safely and can be dangerous if mishandled (they can vent hot gasses or explode). Note that you'll need a smart Li-Ion battery charger with fairly low charging current for the RCR2 3.6V Li-Ion cells. When charging Li-Ion cells the charging current in mA should be kept under the rated capacity of the cell in mAh (this is called 1C). Charging current greater than 1C is bad for Li-Ion cells. Most currently available RCR2 cells have a capacity of 300-350mAh so they can be charged on any smart Li-Ion charger with a rate of less than 300mA. The Nano CR123 charger (available from Lighthound, AW, or Dae) is reported to have a charging current of about 150mA (once it settles down). The light on the Nano goes green somewhat below 4.1V but the Nano continues to trickle charges at 15-30mA after the light is green (probably up to the charger open voltage of about 4.21V). The Nano CR123 charger with a 7mm conductive spacer is ideal for RCR2 (15266 or 15270) cells. You could also use a Nano AAA charger with some wires to connect the cell to the charger leads. Other Li-Ion battery chargers may have too high of current for the tiny RCR2 cells so do some research before trying one. You definitely don't want to try charging a tiny RCR2 cell on a charger with a high charging current which is designed for the much higher capacity 17670 or 18650 cells. The stock DSD charger typically has a charging current of about 350mA, but this can vary depending on the transformer (wall wart) that is used with the DSD, so be careful. CPF battery dealer AW recommends NOT charging his 300mAh unprotected RCR2 cells on the DSD charger, but the DSD should be ok for the 350mAh protected RCR2’s (unless you are using a different wall wart). The message about Li-Ion cells should be clear: Do not use Li-Ion cells until you have done some research and understand how to handle them. 

*Other battery types: *
There are some other types of batteries that have been discussed for potential use in the JIL. 

SAFT, TADIRAN, and LISUN (3.6v Lithium Thionyl Chloride primary cells): 
SAFT lithium batteries are 3.6V primary batteries that are optimized for high capacity but cannot deliver high current. According to reports on CPF, SAFT batteries can only deliver about 100-200 mA, so they cannot produce the current required to drive the JIL at full brightness. LISUN batteries have similar limitations to SAFT batteries, they can only deliver about 100 mA to a direct-drive light. You shouldn't expect much more brightness from a 3.6V lithium primary cell than a 3V lithium primary cell due to the high internal resistance of the 3.6V cell. However the ability of the 3.6V cells to deliver power to the JIL 1.3W is less certain (please post if you have tried one of these cells with a JIL 1.3W). 

TADIRAN 3.6V Lithium primary cells (details and test results): 
In a test, a TADIRAN cell drove a JCR2-LR at about 65mA (slightly above what a normal 3V lithium primary will do). The TADIRAN batteries seem to be able to deliver much more current to the JIL 1.3W, a test with a 3.6V TADRIAN cell showed the MicroPuck could draw about 500mA from it. A 1/2-AA size TADIRAN battery may be a potential choice for the JIL-DD in the CR2 body when maximum runtime is desired and maximum brightness is not a concern. Similarly an AA-size TADIRAN could be used in the JIL-Cab body. Either option should produce normal brightness for for the 1.3W head but the long-term results of the increased static cell voltage on the MicroPuck converter are not known. 

(some more info about SAFT batteries can be found in this thread and a good review of the results of a SAFT in a direct-drive Orb Raw NS can be found in this thread thread; test results for the TADIRAN cell can be found later in this tread) 

3V AA: 
It may be possible to get an AA-size 3V lithium primary cells (for use in the JIL-Cab) by disassembling a CRV3 battery. It has been reported that CRV3 batteries that have two flat contact plates visible through the holes at one end are constructed of two 3V lithium primary cells; however Energizer CRV3 batteries that have a raised positive contact visible through the ‘holes’ at one end are purportedly constructed of two 1.5V lithium primary cells. 
(some more info about dividing CRV3 batteries can be found in this thread)

*FLuPIC User Information:* 
If you get a JIL-CR2 Intelli or a JIL-CR2 that has been modified with a FLuPIC, you will want to read the Users Guide for the FLuPIC V2.1 firmware, which shows the state transition diagram for how to use all the settings and modes. You will want to review the diagram carefully and probably print a copy. See the first post in this thread for the diagram (http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=88623 ). Note that the JIL-CR2 with FLuPIC will flicker once after 1.2 seconds to indicate that it is now 'locked' into that setting. If you turn the light off before the 'flicker' it will advance to the next setting (the next time you turn it on). If you turn the light off after the 'flicker' it will return to the 1st setting for the current mode (typically the low brightness setting). Note that you can 'preset' the light to turn on the next time at a given setting by turning it on and off quickly until the appropriate setting will be the next one to turn on, then simply leaving the light off; the next setting will be the first one to appear the next time the light is turned on.

*FLuPIC modding info:* 
The JIL-CR2 DD Intelli and JCR2-IT use CPF member goldserve's 0.55" (13.96mm) Sammie size board, 0.6mm thick (see this thread https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/112678 ). These short lights use a 0.55" and 0.6mm thick board so it can be recessed in the light body. The 0.55" board uses a metal retaining ring to hold the FLuPIC board in place. The ring is necessary to install a FLuPIC in a JIL DD or JCR2-LR head. The ring is available from CPF member goldserve. The retaining ring on the JIL Intelli is accessable from the bezel, beneath the reflector. 

The JIL-CR2 1.3W and JCR2-HI use either the 0.6" (15.24mm) sized emitter board, 0.9mm thick or the 0.6" (15.24mm) Fenix sized, 1.2mm thick. The board diameter needs to be 0.6", but the thickness does not really matter with the JIL 1.3W and JCR2-HI since there is plenty of room in the head after the MicroPuck driver is removed. The 0.6" board so it sits inside the light without the assistance of a metal ring. The emitter board can then be adjusted to take the space that was taken by the MicroPuck driver, which is removed to install the FLuPIC.


*JIL timeline (a work in progress):* 
2003: original JIL prototype (the first 100 pieces were direct drive with an NX05 optic rather than a reflector and had a totally different body appearance). 
03-12-2005: LITEmania (Warren) starts his first JIL sales thread for the JIL CR2 1.3W (not Up yet). 
 

*Sources for JIL flashlights and related items: *
JIL CR2 DD, 1.3W, Intelli: 
--LITEmania (Warren)'s new thread for updated version (http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=123082)
--JIL-Lite shop (the manufacturer's website, in Korean) (http://www.jillite.com) 
--LightHound (http://www.lighthound.com/sales/jil_cr2_keychain_flashlight.htm )
JIL CR2 series accessories: 
--LITEmania (http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=101183)
Drop in FLuPIC controller for JIL CR2 DD: 
--CPF member goldserve (https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/95886 or )
Drop in FLuPIC controller for JIL CR2 DD or 1.3W (with U-bin LED): 
--CPF member goldserve (https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/119470 ) 
Seoul P4 LED upgrade for JIL JCR2 series lights: 
--CPF member goldserve (https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/153078 ) 
Kroll switches for the JIL-Cab or JIL-Bus body: 
--The Sandwich Shoppe or PhotonFanatic (https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/85330 ) 
Light engines for JIL-DD (this is the circuit board that holds the LED, it is the part that is left over when you upgrade a JIL-DD with goldserve's drop in FLuPIC mod): 
--CPF member this_is_nascar (http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=108084)
Rechargeable RCR2 3.6V LiIon batteries: 
--AW (http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=97268)
--LightHound (http://www.lighthound.com/sales/unprotected_lithium_batteries.htm)
--Emilion (http://lights.emilionworkshop.com/)
Inexpensive primary CR2 batteries: 
--batterystation (http://www.batterystation.com/cpf.htm)
--amondotech (http://www.amondotech.com/index.asp)
--LightHound (http://www.lighthound.com/sales/cr2_battery.htm)
--Emilion (http://lights.emilionworkshop.com/)
Sheaths (or Holsters) for the JIL CR2: 
--Kydex: LITEmania (http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=108356)
--leather: AW (http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=112729) 
MicroPuck boost converter (for 1.3W or JCR2-HI): 
--LEDdynamics LuxDrive 2009-HI (http://www.leddynamics.com/LuxDrive/micropuck.php )
*
Links to information about JIL flashlights and related items: *
--Review of the JIL by respected CPF member Cones: (http://www.cones-stuff.co.uk/) (look on the ‘torches’ page for reviews of the “JIL-Lite CR2 1.3W UP”, “JIL-Lite CR2 DD UP”, and the “FluPIC JIL DD”)
--Review of the JIL-DD Intelli by LED Museum (http://ledmuseum.candlepower.us/fifth/jildd.htm)
--CPF member goldserve’s FLuPIC threads: 
*Introducing FLuPIC V2.1 firmware!* (http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=88623 ) (note that the JIL-CR2 Intelli used V2.1 firmware) *
Introducing FluPIC V2.2 firmware - User Guide UP!* (http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=123520 )
 *FS: FluPIC JIL DD sandwhiches!* (https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/95886)
--Old JIL sales threads 
----LITEmania's last JIL-CR2 sales thread (before the JCR2 version)*FS : JIL CR2 Series* (http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=101183 )  
--Miscellaneous CPF threads that discuss the JIL (included because of the difficulty of searching)
*JIL-CR2 1.3W with Goldserve's Piglet driver and Seoul P4 LED*(https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/158912) 
*JIL CR2 DD battery*(http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=113833)
*Battle** of the Small Lights : Which to choose?*(http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=112939)
*Jil DD output vs. other lights and any Jil DD owners in socal?* (http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=110089)
*JIL Intelli light mod* (http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=111695)
*Which is better..JIL or AmiLite Neo T3?* (http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=111171)
*anyone know where I can buy the orange O-ring for the Jil DD UP?* (http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=110970)
***closed**FS : Limited Run TW0H JIL CR2 ( 100set )* (http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=90290)
*Feeler : JIL CR2 series with FluPic* (http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=96961)
*[TIN's] Quick Jil Review *(http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=84328) 
*JILLITE HA3 2AA Body Extension* (http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=92572)
--This thread has some good testimonials about how durable the JIL's HA3 finish is: 
* How well does HAIII hold up to keychain use?* (http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=126768&highlight=JIL ) 
--Info about the JIL-CR2 1.3W UV (Ultra Violet) version: 
*Feeler : JIL CR2 1.3W UV* (http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=91749 )
*FS : JIL CR2 1.3W UV* (http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=92104 ) 
*Does anyone else own a Jil 1.3W UV?* (http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=118359 ) 
* JIL UV First impression. *(http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=128806 ) 
--Thread about "joker" (lower die height) Luxeon LED's
* The New Luxeon III Generation Issues* (https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/94722 ) 

(If anyone has links for other threads that have valuable information about the JIL, please post them and I’ll include them.) 


*Notes: *
Because of the difficulty of searching on a short word like “JIL”, I suggest that all people who make posts about the JIL use the name “JIL-CR2”, since this is long enough to search for in CPF. 

Suggestion to Warren (LITEmania): Change the markings of the JIL series to mark the bezel with “JIL-DD” or “JIL-1.3W” or “JIL-Intelli” and mark the body with “JIL-CR2” or “JIL-Cab” or “JIL-Bus”. Use the hyphens so that the names will be easier to search for on Google or CPF.

*Keywords (so this post will appear in searchs for JIL info): *
Normal: JIL JILLite JIL-Lite JIL-CR2 CR2 RCR2 JIL-DD JIL-DD(Up) DD(Up) JIL-1.3W JIL-1.3W(Up) 1.3W(Up) (Up) upgrade UCL JIL-UV ultraviolet JIL-Intelli Intelli JILLite-JCR2 JIL-JCR2 JCR2 JCR2-LR JCR2-HI JCR2-UV JCR2-IT JCR2-Intelli JIL-Cab Cab JIL-Bus Bus LITEmania Warren Korea
Non-standard or Incorrect: JCR2-DD JCR2-1.3W JIL-Car JIL(Up) JIL-Lite-JCR2


----------



## Dawg (May 6, 2006)

*Re: What about JIL?*

I like it! I have saved a copy for later perusal.


----------



## LouRoy (May 6, 2006)

Great work! The Jil series is one of my favorites and I have always wondered why they have gotten so little fanfare on CPF. They are very well built, have nice beams, and are tiny. With the Cab and Bus extensions, they are also very versatile. The Intelli may just be the optimum EDC with its adjustable light output and small size.

We do need some runtime charts for all the Jil lights. I think TIN did a few for the DD and the 1.3, but none have been done with the Intelli as far as I know. If I ever get set up to do runtimes, I will post the results.

I am looking forward to the new and revised versions that Warren has hinted at. I hope they become a reality. 

Thanks again for compiling such a comprehensive collection of information on the Jil series. :goodjob:


----------



## onthebeam (May 6, 2006)

*Re: What about JIL?*



vortechs said:


> I hope you don't mind if I use this thread to ask for feedback on the JIL information document I've been working on.



Vortechs! You are the man!!!(or the woman, for all I know )This is one of the single best posts I've ever seen on CPF.

I had the pleasure of meeting JIL's inventor last fall in Seoul and I know he has some good things planned. I'm guessing he has many demanding projects in front of him.

I have the 1.3 UP and love it. One of the best beams I've got and probably the best of any small light. Perfect color and combination of spot and flood. The flood is very smooth and bright and I do believe that's most useful in a tiny light.

However, it's now become stiff to turn. What's the best lube? If I buy Nyogel--which Nyogel type should I order?


----------



## onthebeam (May 6, 2006)

There is one thing I do worry about-Litemania is by far the biggest distributor of the fantastic JIL lights and has worked closely with the manufacturer. For whatever reason, despite the best intentions, Litemania has not been very reliable of late. He has apologized here, and things do come up in life, of course. But with the great reliability of JIL lights, and their superior quality, we really do need a fast and reliable distributution network. This needs to be said frankly and has proved to be a problem for many here over the last six months. This is not meant out of disrespect to Litemania but if JIL is to thrive, it has to have a reliable sales and distribution network, just like any quality product.


----------



## Dogliness (May 6, 2006)

Vortechs, since you asked for suggestions, I will give a few. I think additional information in the following areas would be nice: length, weight and diameter of each version of the flashlight; runtime; body material and anodization; how tough and scratch resistant the lights actually are in practice; beam type (flood versus throw); and possibly a short discussion of TWOJ and TWOH. Everything I have read is that rechargeable batteries should not be used in the Jil 1.3 (I certainly do not want to test it). Consider so stating more definitively. 

Some of the above information is included in reviews of the Jil 1.3 Up and Jil DD at http://www.cones-stuff.co.uk/ . I suggest a link to those reviews as well. [I just edited this post to add this, since I noted you already referred readers to the link].

I join in the chorus that the Jil is a terrific flashlight that doe not get its share of attention and praise, and that you have done great work on your article on the Jil.


----------



## Perfectionist (May 6, 2006)

Wow !! Superb post !! Should be permanently stuck somewhere for all to see 

I LOVE my Jil ..... a new and improved version is gonna force me into marrying it ..... watch out for me on Jerry Springer 

What are the improvements they are planning on doing ..... would it be posssible to make additional requests ?? 

I mean if they could somehow add the option of embedded Tritium on the head of the light ..... I wouldn't complain !!


----------



## Outdoors Fanatic (May 6, 2006)

Dawg said:


> Will there ever be more?



www.lighthound.com still have them for a good price. Check it out. The Jil 1.3w up will be my next EDC.


----------



## goldserve (May 6, 2006)

The JIL CR2 is the best keychain light. A durable finish (even the supposed great ARC-AAA wore out in months), small small size and amazing output makes it wonderful to carry around. Of course when you need a real light, I'd have my U2 or something alike =P

I'm really anxious to see the fruits of the upgraded JIL CR2 light...


----------



## Dawg (May 6, 2006)

Outdoors Fanatic said:


> www.lighthound.com still have them for a good price. Check it out. The Jil 1.3w up will be my next EDC.


They have been out of stock as long as I have been a CPF'er. That was one of the first places I checked, and I check back regularly.


----------



## Trashman (May 6, 2006)

I've got one of the TWOH's, and it's a keeper. I bought in on the first run of 1.3w UPs and loved it, so when I saw the TWOH model offered, I sold the first one and bought it. The TWOH model is quite a bit brighter than the original one I had and the beam is whiter (the first one (UP) had a slight hint of blue). I keep it on my keychain, so it's with me at all times. The TWOJ model, for those interested, was made with the idea for it to be capable of being run with rechargeables. In fact, it was my search for the Jil that brought me to CPF in the first place! I found Warren's (Litemania's) website and his email address and had asked him how I could get one of these lights (Jilite, who I tried contacting first, wouldn't accept mail from my address, it may have been Korean only, or just not accepting from a Yahoo sender) and if he shipped to the U.S. and he linked me to his CPF sales thread--I've been here ever since.

All in all, I don't think you can go wrong with a Jil. The one I have is easily one of my favorites and is of the 2 or 3 that I most use.


----------



## tvodrd (May 6, 2006)

I have the 1.3W (UP) TWOH and the DD (UP) TWOH, and the latter isn't too much larger than my avatar.  The reflectors, while having a decent profile, appear to be electroless nickel. That's costing a lot of photons out the front. Hopefully, they will correct that. 

Larry


----------



## buzzme (May 7, 2006)

Vortechs, a *REALLY* great post :goodjob: . As a newbie, it addresses a lot of the frustration that I have/had trying to find info about the JIL-CR2. It also addresses and answers some of the frustration that I have when using the CPF search function. 

Any speculation about what the newest JIL-CR2 will have?


----------



## cave dave (May 7, 2006)

vortecs,
Good Post. Just one question. I don't have a Jil (yet) but I do have a headlamp running a micropuck and a 1w Lux and it works OK on just one AA battery. Not super bright or anything but brighter than direct drive on 2 AA alkaline and it runs for a long time. Are you sure this combo won't work?


----------



## xochi (May 7, 2006)

Great info Vortechs. 

While I don't want to turn this into a Arc Vs Jil thread, my Jil 1.3 has been relegated to a drawer on account of runtime and battery type. The Jil is absolutely the best bang for the buck in a quality Cr2 light available (Peak pacific may be a contender as well) but many who _experience _the new nichias in action may prefer the Arc as EDC keychain light. I personally find the Arc to be much less obtrusive on a keychain than the jil and while the beam tint and brightness is clearly superior to the Arc, in practice I've found that there is a heavy price to pay in terms of keeping it fed. Visually and in practice, I found that the jil isn't so much brighter that it's usefullness is much greater than the Arc. 

As for the finish on the Arc, it's excellent and I've chipped up the Jil as well, the main difference is that on any gnurled light there will be a greater tendency to lose ano than on a smooth light. Tint on the new nichias is greatly improved as well, while not luxeon quality, those who complain of "angry blue beams" tend to be apeing old posts about old nichias. 

Clearly neither light is for everyone, nor is any light. The merits of each should be objectively explored if a trully useful tool that meets our need is to be discerned.

What would be nice , though, is if Jil expanded their repetoire and included a version that can run on a variety of battery chemistries.


----------



## xochi (May 7, 2006)

cave dave said:


> vortecs,
> Good Post. Just one question. I don't have a Jil (yet) but I do have a headlamp running a micropuck and a 1w Lux and it works OK on just one AA battery. Not super bright or anything but brighter than direct drive on 2 AA alkaline and it runs for a long time. Are you sure this combo won't work?



No boost, therefore no single alkaline. Not enough voltage.


----------



## Planterz (May 7, 2006)

The Jil 1.3W is, as I see it, the ugly duckling of the group. It's longer than I would want to carry on a keychain, and the cost of batteries is a bit of a bummer. You get about 1:10 of good brightness, and at about 1:30 it craps out and it's time for a new battery. It can't (or at least shouldn't) use lithium ion rechargables. IMO, the only thing a 1.3W is good for is with the BUS extension, which should give you very long runtime. 

This leaves either the DD or the Intelli. A DD will last an almost ridiculous amount of time on a CR2 primary (20+ hours), and even if you buy Energizer CR2s, it's an inexpensive light to keep running. Even moreso if you feed it Batterystation or other bulk lithiums. The Intelli of course can take either primaries or lithium-ion RCR2s. Runtime on lower levels is very long, possibly matching (or beating) DD runtimes. On higher levels it's quite bright considering its size, especially on "burst". The disadvantage of using the Intelli as a low-level light is the flickering (from the PWM-Pulse Width Modulation "dimming") which might bug some people. The other difference of course is the cost.


----------



## xochi (May 7, 2006)

I really don't have any experience with the DD or intelli. The flupic interface really isn't my cup of tea (gave away my hybrid 2.0-2.5 fenix/McR-/flupic/3w). By expensive , I mean the the whole experience of dealing with Cr2's vs AAA's. AAA's are so cheap and universally available that if 3 dead AAA's got mixed up in a pack of 12 , I could pitch the whole lot into the recycling bin without a second thought. They are easily swiped from other devices, require no shipping charges, cheap in convenience stores, don't require an internet connection or phone to buy cheaply (not to mention a credit card or paypal account or even an address) nimh AAA's can be charged with solar, crank, 15min, 30min, slow, dc. The very high quality brands are also cheap and figuring out which is which requires next to no energy. Availability means even carrying a backup AAA is likely a waste of energy when they can be had in just about every store known to man short of a nail salon or hamburger joint. Pitching a AAA after only 2 hours of use is cheap and means you've always got a minimum of 3-5 hours on tap. The idea of pitching a Cr2 after only using 40% of it's capacity rankles me as does wondering how many charge cycles I'll get from highly specialized rcr2's. Getting a bunk batch of alkalines is almost unheard of yet even if it does, pitch'em . They are cheap enough that even returning them might be a waste of time/money and there is no RMA required, paypal/cc refund, waiting for return acknowledgement/testing, shipping, wondering how many of the new shipment are bunk, etc.

I could go on but I think you get the point and I'm sure that the costs of depending solely on rechargeable li-ions don't need to be enumerated.

BTW, is there a link to the jil dd runtime graph? 

With all the options that are available for the Jil , and given it's popularity, the ability to run on single alkaline voltage would be a huge selling point.


----------



## Planterz (May 7, 2006)

xochi said:


> BTW, is there a link to the jil dd runtime graph?


There's one here. Only 13 hours worth, but others have reported leaving it on for over 20 hours and still producing usable light.

20 hours of intermittent use of a keychain light would span several months, if not years. I had an Arc AAA-P on my keychain for several months, and this was before I started carrying a full-sized light regularily, so it was my primary light of use. In those several months I never changed the battery; in fact it still has the original Duracell alkaline in there. It's somewhat dimmer than my other Arc AAA-P (uncarried, with a practically new battery), maybe 60-70% of full brightnes, but still gives plenty of usable light. Several months of use (and non-use, which still drains an alkaline), and it still hadn't reached it's 50% point, which is estimated at 5 hours of continuous use. A TWOH Jil DD would last a _long_ time on a single lithium primary. It may be a 3W LED, but it only draws .4W.


----------



## LouRoy (May 7, 2006)

Hey, Vortechs, here is a link you may want to add to your information. It is a review by this_is_nascar and includes runtime graphs:

http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=84328&highlight=my+quick

Here is a tantalizing snippet from that review:

"For the last 3 nights, tonight is night 4, I've taken my Jil DD and powered it on at 7pm and left it burn until 5am the next morning. Like I said, I've done this 3-time so far and have started the 4-attempt a few minutes ago (a bit earlier tonight). The light is still producing very useable light and it's still on the same Battery Station CR2 cell.

That's 30-hours so far folks."

I agree with Planterz about the 1.3 being the ugly duckling. The DD puts out plenty of light for most uses and lasts forever. I put one in the purses of my wife and my daughters so they will always have a light with them.


----------



## legtu (May 7, 2006)

*Re: What about JIL?*



vortechs said:


> I am not certain of the maximum voltage that the FLuPIC can tolerate beyond 4.5V, but goldserve has said that 4.5V from three 1.5V cells in series would be ok and has specifically said to NOT use two LiIon cells in series (8.4V peak).



AFAIK, the uC and LDO are rated upto 6v max.


----------



## vortechs (May 8, 2006)

*Re: What about JIL?*



onthebeam said:


> I have the 1.3 UP and love it... However, it's now become stiff to turn. What's the best lube? If I buy Nyogel--which Nyogel type should I order?



onthebeam: I'm still fairly new to all this, so I can't recommend a particular type of lube from personal experience. I know that Magnalube has been discussed on the JIL sales thread and I recently got a tube of it thanks to jar3ds doing a mini group buy, since it is sold in lots of 4 tubes. I would be curious myself to know how well the other types of lube perform, especially the Nyogel. I can caution people that colubrid reported that miltek1 grease and metal conditioner will damage the orange o-ring (see http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=110970). 




onthebeam said:


> There is one thing I do worry about-Litemania is by far the biggest distributor of the fantastic JIL lights and has worked closely with the manufacturer. For whatever reason, despite the best intentions, Litemania has not been very reliable of late...



onthebeam: I have been following the JIL sales thread for months and would highly recommend that anyone who is planning to order a JIL on LITEmania's sales thread should read the entire thread so that they know what they are getting into. As far as I know, LITEmania (Warren) has never failed to deliver a light, but there have been some long waits with limited communications. Hopefully things will improve, but for impatient buyers I recommend Lighthound, who is well known for excellent customer service. Lighthound is currently out of stock on the JIL-CR2's but maintains a waiting list and will email people on the list when they come in. 




Dogliness said:


> Vortechs, since you asked for suggestions, I will give a few. I think additional information in the following areas would be nice: length, weight and diameter of each version of the flashlight; runtime; body material and anodization; how tough and scratch resistant the lights actually are in practice; beam type (flood versus throw); and possibly a short discussion of TWOJ and TWOH. Everything I have read is that rechargeable batteries should not be used in the Jil 1.3 (I certainly do not want to test it). Consider so stating more definitively.



Dogliness: Thanks for the suggestions. The info I collected was originally intended as a supplement to the info that is available on Lighthound's web site and cone's review. That is why it doesn't include a lot of the basic statistical or review info. However, you are correct that I should include more of that basic info to make this a more useful "one stop" information source for the JIL-CR2. 




Perfectionist said:


> Wow !! Superb post !! Should be permanently stuck somewhere for all to see



Perfectionist: Thanks! While it may not be practical to try to get the info in a 'sticky' thread. I think the next best thing would be for me to start a JIL-CR2 thread in the "Reviews" forum, since things stay around longer in that forum than they do in the "General Flashlight --> LED" forum. Perhaps LITEmania/Warren may also use some of the info when he creates his next JIL sales thread. 




Outdoors Fanatic said:


> www.lighthound.com still have them for a good price. Check it out. The Jil 1.3w up will be my next EDC.



Outdoors Fanatic: Unfortunately, I believe that www.lighthound.com is out of stock right now, but I know that he has excellent customer service and if you email him about the JIL, he will put you on a list to be notified by email when some arrive.




Trashman said:


> In fact, it was my search for the Jil that brought me to CPF in the first place!



Trashman: Searching for information about the JIL was what brought me to CPF as well. I saw them advertised on Lighthound's website and went searching for more information and eventually ended up on CPF. Now I'm trying to do a service for other people so the search isn't quite as difficult. 




tvodrd said:


> I have the 1.3W (UP) TWOH and the DD (UP) TWOH, and the latter isn't too much larger than my avatar. The reflectors, while having a decent profile, appear to be electroless nickel. That's costing a lot of photons out the front. Hopefully, they will correct that.
> 
> Larry



Hi Larry: If you happen to know of an improved reflector for the JIL-CR2, I'm sure there's a lot of JIL owners that would be interested. Your avatar is certainly an excellent custom light to compare to the production JIL. Once upon a time I might have said that the JIL had the advantage of being easier to obtain, but now I'm not so sure. Anyone who hasn't looked at Larry's lights, should do so; they are very impressive. 




buzzme said:


> Vortechs, a *REALLY* great post... Any speculation about what the newest JIL-CR2 will have?



buzzme: Thanks! I'm hoping JIL will eventually have a version with electronics that combines the features of all of their current models: the ability to boost 3V primary CR2's, limit the 3.6-4.2V of Li-Ion RCR2's, and a FLuPIC for multiple levels and adjustable modes. I am eventually going to request a special mode from goldserve but I can wait until he has more free time to work out the details. 




cave dave said:


> vortecs,
> Good Post. Just one question. I don't have a Jil (yet) but I do have a headlamp running a micropuck and a 1w Lux and it works OK on just one AA battery. Not super bright or anything but brighter than direct drive on 2 AA alkaline and it runs for a long time. Are you sure this combo won't work?



cave dave: I am not sure. My comment about the 1.3W version not working with a 1.5V input is copied from the JIL sales thread. I don't have a 1.3W version. From xochi's post, it appears that xochi has a 1.3W and has confirmed that it does not work on a single alkaline. 




xochi said:


> Great info Vortechs. While I don't want to turn this into a Arc Vs Jil thread, my Jil 1.3 has been relegated to a drawer on account of runtime and battery type... What would be nice , though, is if Jil expanded their repetoire and included a version that can run on a variety of battery chemistries.
> 
> xochi: Thanks. I'll agree we don't want to turn this into a JIL vs Arc AAA thread, they are both great lights with somewhat different pros and cons. BTW, let me know if you consider selling that 1.3W shelf queen...
> 
> ...


----------



## Somy Nex (May 8, 2006)

This really is a great post and deserves to be a thread of its own so it can be made into a sticky. :thumbsup: 

Here's Goldserve's thread on the FLuPIC v2.1 as taken from his signature line: http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=88623 
still don't know what it stands for though.

And the LED Museum also has a review on the JIL series here: http://ledmuseum.candlepower.us/fifth/jildd.htm

cheers =)
somy


----------



## legtu (May 8, 2006)

*Re: What about JIL?*



vortechs said:


> legtu: Thanks of the info about the maximum voltage for the FLuPIC. If I decide to take a CRV3 apart for two 3V AA's, I might try them in my JIL-Bus if I'm feeling particularly brave. However, I'd like to know for sure that 6V would be a problem for the LED and if the burst mode (Max Brightness) would risk burning out the LED. I'm sorry I haven't done more research about the details of the electronics yet.



AFAIK, 6v in won't damage the LED but it'll cause some major heat in the LDO, especially at high current levels. Depending on what LDO goldserve used, some of them have built-in thermal protection so it should shut down before causing any damage. LED damage can only result from heat due to poor or inadequate heat sinking.

In my circuit, heat is caused by the voltage differential of the LED vf and input voltage plus current.



vortechs said:


> By the way, can anybody tell me what FLuPIC stands for and what the correct capitalization is?



Hmmmm... Flashlight(Fl) micro-controller(uPIC)? The PIC/uPIC, which is the 'brain' of the circuit is a micro-controller produced by Microchip. I call mine, uCF which stands for micro-controlled flashlight.


----------



## jsr (May 8, 2006)

*Re: What about JIL?*

Wow, great consolidation of Jil info Vortechs! I found CPF before the Jil, but CPF was what prompted me to look for more Jil info. It took a LOT of searching both on CPF and the web (conestuff's site has great info) to find out much about the Jil.

I'd just like to add that since the FluPIC uses an LDO, running an Intelli off a 3V primary will likely make it dimmer than the Jil DD due to the voltage drop through the LDO. Likely useless info since I believe all Intelli owners use RCR2s.
I don't own one (yet), but I've been waiting for Litemania to offer them again (which I believe is the only distributor...I think other sellers get them through Warren also). I must say, the delays many have experienced in the past few months with receiving their Jils have made me more cautious in ordering one (back when they were still available, and even now waiting for them to be re-offered with the new reflector).


----------



## tvodrd (May 8, 2006)

*Re: What about JIL?*

vortechs,

Thanks for the complement. :blush: On a whim, I took one apart and found a McR 18 in the box. :thinking: I went into the garage and turned it down to just fit the Jil. It came up a little short, but if the inside of the Jil's head were opened-up a little, I think it could be made to work. I used the bezel O-ring to take up the space and it seems to work.

I completely forgot that the TWOH premium ones have "joker" LEDs! Instant floodlight!  I mean the distinct hotspot is history and spill much increased. :shrug: I tried. 

Larry


----------



## vortechs (May 9, 2006)

Somy Nex said:


> This really is a great post and deserves to be a thread of its own so it can be made into a sticky.
> 
> Here's Goldserve's thread on the FLuPIC v2.1 as taken from his signature line: http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=88623
> still don't know what it stands for though.
> ...



Somy Nex: Thanks. I am planning to eventually make it a thread in the "Review" section, since theads there are easier to find than ones in the general LED section. I already had a link for goldserve's thread and I just added one for the LED Museum review. 




legtu said:


> AFAIK, 6v in won't damage the LED but it'll cause some major heat in the LDO, especially at high current levels. Depending on what LDO goldserve used, some of them have built-in thermal protection so it should shut down before causing any damage. LED damage can only result from heat due to poor or inadequate heat sinking.
> 
> In my circuit, heat is caused by the voltage differential of the LED vf and input voltage plus current.
> 
> Hmmmm... Flashlight(Fl) micro-controller(uPIC)? The PIC/uPIC, which is the 'brain' of the circuit is a micro-controller produced by Microchip. I call mine, uCF which stands for micro-controlled flashlight.



legtu: Thanks for the info on the electronics, especially for the notes about using a 6V input with the FluPIC. I guess FLuPIC might stand for FL=flashlight, uP=microprocessor (u for micro), IC=integrated circuit. If that is the situation, I suppose the capitalization should be "FluPIC". 




jsr said:


> Wow, great consolidation of Jil info Vortechs! I found CPF before the Jil, but CPF was what prompted me to look for more Jil info. It took a LOT of searching both on CPF and the web (conestuff's site has great info) to find out much about the Jil.
> 
> I'd just like to add that since the FluPIC uses an LDO, running an Intelli off a 3V primary will likely make it dimmer than the Jil DD due to the voltage drop through the LDO. Likely useless info since I believe all Intelli owners use RCR2s.
> 
> I don't own one (yet), but I've been waiting for Litemania to offer them again (which I believe is the only distributor...I think other sellers get them through Warren also). I must say, the delays many have experienced in the past few months with receiving their Jils have made me more cautious in ordering one (back when they were still available, and even now waiting for them to be re-offered with the new reflector).



jsr: I believe that at least one person has ordered a JIL-CR2 from jillite.com before they saw LITEmania's sales thread. However, if the manufacturer is out of stock due to a product upgrade then it probably won't make much difference. I do wish there were more frequent status updates from LITEmaina about what is going on with the JIL series. I feel like we're in the dark about what is going on. 

I should mention that I am not concerned about ordering from LITEmania since he has never failed to deliver. I eventually intend to order a Cab extension. 




tvodrd said:


> vortechs,
> 
> Thanks for the complement. :blush: On a whim, I took one apart and found a McR 18 in the box. I went into the garage and turned it down to just fit the Jil. It came up a little short, but if the inside of the Jil's head were opened-up a little, I think it could be made to work. I used the bezel O-ring to take up the space and it seems to work.
> 
> ...



Larry: Thanks for trying a McR 18 in the JIL. Also thanks for confirming that the TW0H version uses one of the shorter "joker" LED's. I read some comments in the thread that introduced the TW0H version about needing to change the reflector for the new LED, but I wasn't sure if that meant that the TW0H was a "joker". Thanks for confirming that it is. 

I am trying to understand LITEmania's recent comments about a new reflector for the JIL. He said the new version would have a "McR 18-joker inside", so apparently the interior dimensions of the head might be changing a bit to accomodate the McR 18. I guess the current reflector for the JIL lights with the TW0H LED is designed for a "joker" but it is not a McR 18. 

Can anybody comment on how the beam from the McR 18 reflector differs from the TW0H Intelli reflector (the TW0H reflector)?? Does the McR 18 have a tighter hotspot for more throw? I am happy with the broad hotspot and generous spill of the Intelli reflector.


----------



## jsr (May 9, 2006)

vortechs said:


> jsr: I believe that at least one person has ordered a JIL-CR2 from jillite.com before they saw LITEmania's sales thread. However, if the manufacturer is out of stock due to a product upgrade then it probably won't make much difference. I do wish there were more frequent status updates from LITEmaina about what is going on with the JIL series. I feel like we're in the dark about what is going on.
> 
> I should mention that I am not concerned about ordering from LITEmania since he has never failed to deliver. I eventually intend to order a Cab extension.


 
Yeah, I know Warren's been good at filling in all the orders and making sure no one is left without their order in the end. But personally, waiting 3-4 months for a purchase that was promised/expected in 2-3 weeks is not my idea of a pleasant transaction. I know it's likely not Warren's fault and I'm not blaming him for it, I'm just stating that the transaction isn't a smooth and clean one which gives me reservations. I am looking forward to seeing the improved Jil and Warren catching up with orders. I never considered ordering from Jillite.com since everything's in korean with no translation available on the website. I usually don't take the risk of ordering from sites/shops/businesses that don't support any english as if problems arise, how do I get my money back?
Oh, for the FluPIC, I think letgu meant the "PIC" is from the PIC ucontroller from microchip. I've used one of these before...the uC is actually called a "PIC" controller (microchip's name for their uCs).


----------



## onthebeam (May 9, 2006)

The Jillite.com website is by the inventor and he uses Warren as his main distributor. As has been said, Lighthound in the US also stocks JIL lights. They are incredible tools and I hope the distribution system will improve to match their superior quality.


----------



## vortechs (May 13, 2006)

I updated my long post (above) to add a link to this_is_nascar's sales thread for JIL-DD light engines: 

Light engines for JIL-DD (this is the circuit board that holds the LED, it is the part that is left over when you upgrade a JIL-DD with goldserve's drop in FLuPIC mod): 
--CPF member this_is_nascar (http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=108084)

The spare light engines would be useful for converting an Intelli back to a DD and possibly for experimenting with different types of Luxeon LED's (colors, UV, U-bins, etc.).


----------



## vortechs (May 14, 2006)

I think I have the reflector issue partially figured out. Please let me know if anyone has something to correct or add. 

1) The original JIL-CR2's with non-joker TW0J LED's used a JIL-designed relector profile. I'm not sure if there were both plastic and metal versions of the reflector. Would somebody who is familiar with the early JIL's please let me know if a metal reflector was part of the (UP) upgrade?? 

2) When the TW0H version of the JIL was introduced, it was discovered that these LED's were the shorter "joker" style. This changed the focus of the reflector and created a tiny "donut ring" around the central hotspot. As a result the metal reflector was changed to accomodate the new "joker" LED die height. The new reflector has the same profile as the previous one but is designed for the slightly shorter die height of the LED (about a 0.3-0.4mm difference). See posts #35, #37 and #39 of the old sales thread for the TW0H version of the JIL-CR2 (http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=90290). 

3) The JIL-CR2 head design is currently being changed very slightly to accomodate a "standard" McGizmo-designed McR-18 reflector rather than the JIL-designed relector. Apparently the McR-18 wouldn't quite fit in the original JIL head. The new design with the McR-18 reflector will be for use with the lower die height "joker" LED's.


----------



## vortechs (May 19, 2006)

Does anybody know if the very early JIL's had different reflectors? 

Was the reflector one of the things that was changed in the (Up) upgrade package?


----------



## LITEmania (May 19, 2006)

vortechs said:


> Does anybody know if the very early JIL's had different reflectors?



YES.






vortechs said:


> Was the reflector one of the things that was changed in the (Up) upgrade package?



YES. The reflector at Up version was changed from the first original one.

In according to the New slug of Lux-III, this reflector was changed again.

Now, we are making all JIL CR2 using the reflector of McR18 Joker.

thanks


----------



## vortechs (May 19, 2006)

Thanks Warren, 

I would appreciate it if you would review post #4 of this thread and inform me if you have any corrections. I will be happy to include any updates or additional information you can suggest.


----------



## LITEmania (May 19, 2006)

PM sent. Thanks for your effort.


----------



## vortechs (May 19, 2006)

Warren, thanks for the PM. 

I did not know what JIL stood for before now. I have updated post #4. 

If you have any other comments please let me know. 

It is good to see that you have been posting regularly in many threads recently. I hope this helps relieve the concerns some people had expressed when you were not posting regularly. I assume you were very busy and did not have much time to deal with CPF. 

Welcome back! :wave:


----------



## LITEmania (May 19, 2006)

vortechs said:


> Does anybody know if the very early JIL's had different reflectors?
> 
> Was the reflector one of the things that was changed in the (Up) upgrade package?




Left : Up version 
Right : Early version


----------



## jsr (May 19, 2006)

One of Photonfanatic's threads selling Luxs said the old die height (non-Joker) Lux3s are "back", implying Lumileds won't be making Joker Luxs anymore. Does anyone know if this is true? Because if it is, that nullifies the new/latest reflector that the Jil will use that is specifically made for the Joker Luxs.


----------



## LITEmania (May 19, 2006)

jsr said:


> One of Photonfanatic's threads selling Luxs said the old die height (non-Joker) Lux3s are "back", implying Lumileds won't be making Joker Luxs anymore. Does anyone know if this is true? Because if it is, that nullifies the new/latest reflector that the Jil will use that is specifically made for the Joker Luxs.



Will be checking. Thanks for input.

warren,


----------



## jsr (May 19, 2006)

No problem Warren! I'm looking forward to the new Jil.
BTW, here's the link to Photonfanatic's thread in the Custom B/S/T section:

http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=118427

and the quote from his thread:

"These are the newest version--back to the old die height, i.e., these are not Jokers, but they do have the round slug."


----------



## vortechs (May 20, 2006)

I remember reading in another thread somewhere that Lumileds was going back to the original die height and would not be continuing to produce the "jokers", but I do not remember where. I do not really know what the situation is, but hopefully some searching or asking one of the experts will give us more info.


----------



## jsr (May 21, 2006)

Hmm, if that's so, all the efforts manufacturers are doing to accomodate the "joker" LEDs will be nullified and possibly make the beam worse, or back to, what they were trying to resolve. Hope Warren finds out more on this.


----------



## vortechs (May 21, 2006)

Perhaps Warren can ask the manufacturer to mark the relectors for whether they are designed for the "joker" LED die height or not (maybe by printing a "J" on the ones designed for the "jokers"). That way, when somebody wants to mod their JIL-CR2 to upgrade the LED (with a U-bin or K2, for instance), they can tell which LED die height their reflector is optimized for.


----------



## vortechs (May 27, 2006)

I added the following info about the FLuPIC to post #4: 


*FLuPIC User Information:* *
*If you get a JIL-CR2 Intelli or a JIL-CR2 that has been modified with a FLuPIC, you will want to read the Users Guide for the FLuPIC V2.1 firmware, which shows the state transition diagram for how to use all the settings and modes. You will want to review the diagram carefully and probably print a copy. See the first post in this thread for the diagram (http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=88623 ). Note that the JIL-CR2 with FLuPIC will flicker once after 1.2 seconds to indicate that it is now 'locked' into that setting. If you turn the light off before the 'flicker' it will advance to the next setting (the next time you turn it on). If you turn the light off after the 'flicker' it will return to the 1st setting for the current mode (typically the low brightness setting).


----------



## vortechs (May 27, 2006)

vortechs said:


> Larry: Thanks for trying a McR 18 in the JIL. Also thanks for confirming that the TW0H version uses one of the shorter "joker" LED's. I read some comments in the thread that introduced the TW0H version about needing to change the reflector for the new LED, but I wasn't sure if that meant that the TW0H was a "joker". Thanks for confirming that it is.



Goldserve just introduced the option of getting one of his drop-in FLuPIC sandwiches for the JIL-CR2 DD (or JIL-CR2 1.3W) with a UW0J Lux-III already mounted on it (http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=119470 ). 

This particular UW0J (from PhotonFanatic) apparently has the normal (non-joker) LED die height, while the reflector in JIL-CR2's with TW0H LEDs is apparently optimized for the "joker" die height. 

Larry, do you think your modified McR 18 reflector for the JIL will work for people who have a TW0H Intelli (with a joker?) that want to install one of goldserve's new UW0J drop-in sandwiches? I think there are a couple of people who might be interested in getting one (including me).


----------



## vortechs (May 28, 2006)

I added some information about Li-Ion cells care and handling to post #4, since the Intell is essentially designed to use Li-Ion's and anyone getting Li-Ion batteries for the first time needs some basic warnings and info about them. Additional suggestions are welcome. 

---------

*Lithium Ion (Li-Ion) battery care: *
Anyone who is not familar with 3.6V Lithium Ion (Li-Ion) rechargeable cells should definitely do some research on CPF before buying or using them. They require some caution to charge and use safely and can be dangerous if mishandled (they can vent hot gasses or explode). Note that you'll need a smart Li-Ion battery charger with fairly low current for the 300-350 mAh RCR2 3.6V Li-Ion cells. When charging Li-Ion cells the charging current in mA should be kept under the rated capacity of the cell in mAh. The Nano CR123 charger (available from Lighthound, AW, or Dae) with a conductive spacer is ideal for RCR2 (15266 or 15270) cells, but you could also use a Nano AAA charger with some wires to connect the cell to the charger leads. Other Li-Ion battery chargers, such as the DSD charger, may have too high of current for the tiny RCR2 cells so do some research before trying one. You definitely don't want to try charging a tiny RCR2 cell on a charger designed for the much higher capacity 17670 or 18650 cells.


----------



## vortechs (Jun 1, 2006)

I saw a request for info about the JIL-CR2 series, so I decided to bump this thead to the top with a new post. 

I'd prefer not to compare the JIL to other lights in this thread, but for anyone who has questions about the JIL series, please read this thread (especially post #4) then ask any questions you still have.


----------



## nerdtoy (Jun 2, 2006)

vortechs said:


> I added some information about Li-Ion cells care and handling to post #4, since the Intell is essentially designed to use Li-Ion's and anyone getting Li-Ion batteries for the first time needs some basic warnings and info about them. Additional suggestions are welcome.



They are great for fishing when they become unreliable, they explode like dynamite when submerged 

that should be enough to warn of the Li-Ion potentials for trouble. 

PS: I LOVE MY JIL with the INTELLI


----------



## vortechs (Jun 2, 2006)

nerdtoy said:


> They are great for fishing when they become unreliable, they explode like dynamite when submerged
> 
> that should be enough to warn of the Li-Ion potentials for trouble.
> 
> PS: I LOVE MY JIL with the INTELLI



Hi Kevin, 

I laughed so hard when I read this... 

It is good for people who are new to Li-Ion cells to be warned that they need to learn more about them, but we shouldn't scare people too much, after all, they've probably already got one in their cell phone. One nice thing about the tiny RCR2 Li-Ion cell (15266 or 15270 size) is that it is very small so its potential for doing damage is much less than a large 18650 cell. Also, CPF member AW has protected RCR2 Li-Ion cells available, which contain a protection circuit to prevent the battery from being overcharged or overdischarged (which is what would typically cause a Li-Ion to fail) and will shut down the battery if it does get shorted. 

Glad to hear you like the JIL-CR2 with FLuPIC.


----------



## LITEmania (Jun 2, 2006)

This was the first 100pcs made prototype. [edit] prototype in 2003 [edit] 
Enjoy ! (NX05, Direct Drive)


----------



## goldserve (Jun 2, 2006)

Optics....interesting but not a huge fan of optics! Where's the MCR-18 JIL? =D


----------



## LITEmania (Jun 2, 2006)

goldserve said:


> Optics....interesting but not a huge fan of optics! Where's the MCR-18 JIL? =D



Kevin : the PIC shows first prototype in 2003


----------



## goldserve (Jun 2, 2006)

OIC..that explains the look!


----------



## vortechs (Jun 12, 2006)

I added some notes to post #4 of this thread about how to remove the FLuPIC from the Intelli. This was based on Planterz posts #108-117 over in this thread. If somebody wants to write some more details about how to install or remove the FLuPIC from the JIL-CR2 head that would be great. 


 JIL-CR2 Intelli FLuPIC installation/disassembly: 
The Intelli (or other JIL-DD with a FLuPIC) has a retaining ring to hold the FLuPIC in place. The retaining ring on the JIL is accessable from the bezel, beneath the reflector.


----------



## Planterz (Jun 12, 2006)

I'm not going in again just yet, but when I do the swap with my UWOJ sandwich when it gets here, I'll snap some pictures.


----------



## Blindasabat (Jun 12, 2006)

Planterz,
Before you change to the UWOJ, can you take beamshots, lumens, or some other brightness measurements then repeat after? Or at least your impression. I'm really curious what a straight T-bin to U-bin swap will do - all other things being equal. I have a UW0K I'm thinking about putting in either a TWOJ or SV1K, but would like to know which one is more worth the effort since on one the Vf bin will drop and be less overdriven.
Or should I just get a UW0J?
Thanks!


----------



## Planterz (Jun 12, 2006)

I was planning on taking beamshots.


----------



## bpfsu (Jun 12, 2006)

I have both the DD and 1.3W and have been EDC the DD for about a year on my belt loop. Don't even know it's there until I need it. If anybody is questioning getting one of these, don't question, just get it. Mine doesn't show any signs of wear and it's been banged around like nobody's business. And as far as "waterproofness", mines been through the wash at least twice (and the dryer for that matter) and worked fine with no water entering the light - or maybe the dryer took care of that!

I do have one question though... how do I know what bin led my Jil has?

BP


----------



## vortechs (Jun 12, 2006)

bpfsu said:


> I do have one question though... how do I know what bin led my Jil has?



Based on what I've been able to learn about the JIL-CR2 from reading CPF, here's my opinion: 

It depends on when you got them and how the bezel is marked. I believe the TW0H version was first announced on 8/16/2005, so if you got them before that they are probably TW0J Lux-III. I think the TW0H version is marked "TW0H" on the bezel. 

But Warren (LITEmania) could probably give a better answer.


----------



## vortechs (Jun 13, 2006)

bpfsu said:


> I do have one question though... how do I know what bin led my Jil has?



Check out the first post in the thread where you ordered your JIL's: 
http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=82112


----------



## vortechs (Jun 26, 2006)

Well, to finally answer the post that started this thread full of JIL info, Warren (LITEmania) has just posted an interest thread for the new version of the JIL-CR2: 
http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=123082


----------



## LITEmania (Jun 26, 2006)

vortechs : thanks so much.


----------



## vortechs (Jul 2, 2006)

I recently found out that a TxxK LED was available as a special request option in the early JIL-CR2's (see here). I edited the LED section of post #4 of this thread to the following: 


*LED: *
The JIL CR2 uses a Luxeon III LED (sometimes referred to as a “3 watt” LED). Most early versions used a TW0J LED, although apparently some TxxK bin (K-bin Vf) JIL-CR2 DD models were made in the eary time of production. At that time you could get a TxxK LED by special request, if you intended to use RCR2 Li-Ion rechargable cells (very bright, very hot and about 20mins of runtime), however this has been mostly superseded by the Intelli or DD with FLuPIC. In August of 2005 versions with a TW0H LED were introduced (these first shipped on 09-26-2005). There is also a version with an ultraviolet (UV) LED. For someone who is skilled at soldering, it is fairly easy to change the LED in the JIL so there may be variations with other types of LED’s (especially for JIL-DD’s that have been modded with a FLuPIC).


----------



## LITEmania (Jul 6, 2006)

Here is new laser marking of model names.


----------



## LITEmania (Jul 6, 2006)




----------



## Xygen (Jul 6, 2006)

That looks promising, Warren! The HA looks much better. I'd like to see macro shots of the tail.
Any idea about price?


----------



## LITEmania (Jul 6, 2006)

Xygen : Price will be announced on coming Saturday (7/8)

warren,


----------



## goldserve (Jul 6, 2006)

LITEmania said:


> Xygen : Price will be announced on coming Saturday (7/8)
> 
> warren,



Aww..we gotta wait for another light on saturday?? =D


----------



## Outdoors Fanatic (Jul 6, 2006)

LITEmania said:


> Here is new laser marking of model names.



Those are gorgeous shots! Thanks Warren. I can't wait for this one...


----------



## vortechs (Jul 16, 2006)

Since this seems to be the thread for collecting info about the JIL-CR2 (and now the JCR2), I thought I'd post a few more links to threads with relevant info. 

The FLuPIC sandwich from the Exolion may be able to fit in the JIL-CR2 DD. See this thread for some notes about it: http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=123808

Note that the Exolion FLuPIC sandwich has a custom program, rather than the standard V2.1 firmware found in the JIL-CR2 Intelli. See the Exolion thread for the user interface: http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=105666

The JIL-CR2 DD needs a ring to hold the FLuPIC sandwich in place (the ring is available from Goldserve for about $5). There are some notes about it in Goldserve's recent sales thread for the U-bin sandwiches: http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=119470. See post #57, 93, and 94 for info on using the Exolion sandwich in a JIL-CR2 DD. Post #154, 159, 160, 165, 166 might be helpful as well.

According to CPF member and battery dealer extraordinaire, AW: "I have a converted Jil DD without using the ring and it still performs great. Without using the adapter ring, you won't see the exposed o-ring." (quote taken from here )


----------



## vortechs (Jul 19, 2006)

Below is a link to a good post about running an Orb Raw NS on a SAFT 3.6V Lithium primary cell. As the post shows, even though the cell has the voltage to run a Luxeon, it cannot deliver enough current to make it very bright. Since the topic of using SAFT cells in the JIL-CR2 has come up before and I addressed it in post #4, I thought I'd include this link here. I'll also update post #4 to include it. 

http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?p=1508174#post1508159


----------



## vortechs (Jul 19, 2006)

I edited post #4 to add some notes about the new names for the JIL CR2 series. Here is what I added to post #4: 

Note that this post still uses the original names for the JIL CR2 series (DD, 1.3W, Intelli). In July of 2006 the JIL series was updated (updates include a matte gray HA3 finish and McR-18 reflector). The new name of the series is JCR2 and the new names for the models are as follows: JIL CR2 DD --> JCR2 LR (LongRun), JIL CR2 1.3w --> JCR2 HI (High Intensity), JIL CR2 Intelli --> JCR2 IT (Intelli), JIL CR2 UV --> JCR2 UV.


----------



## vortechs (Jul 21, 2006)

I updated post #4 with some more info about the JIL 1.3W UV model. 

Most of the useful info was sumarized in LITEmania's original sales thread for the UV model (before the different JIL-CR2 sales threads were combined): 

PRODUCT ;
1.3W UV LED Torch with Key-ring.

FEATURE ;
LED : Cree, 7090, UV, 395nm, 200mW
HostBody/Lens/Reflector : Same as JIL CR2 1.3W UP
Driver : MicroPuck HighOutput 400mA
Marking : ‘UV’ on Bezel.
Alert : DO NOT use RCR2. 


 Here are the links to the threads I could find with data and reviews of the UV model: 
* Feeler : JIL CR2 1.3W UV* (http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=91749 )
* FS : JIL CR2 1.3W UV* (http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=92104 ) 
*Does anyone else own a Jil 1.3W UV?* (http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=118359 ) 

Planterz reported successfully running the JIL 1.3W UV with a RCR2 Li-Ion cell, and also with a 14500 (Li-Ion) cell in the Cab body. Note that this does not necessarily mean that Li-Ion cells will work in the normal JIL 1.3W (with a TW0J or TW0H white Lux-III LED). According to some of the old posts, the Cree UV Led apparently has a fairly high Vf of 4V.


----------



## vortechs (Jul 22, 2006)

*Re: What about JIL?*



tvodrd said:


> vortechs,
> 
> Thanks for the complement. :blush: On a whim, I took one apart and found a McR 18 in the box. :thinking: I went into the garage and turned it down to just fit the Jil. It came up a little short, but if the inside of the Jil's head were opened-up [bored out] a little, I think it [an unmodified McR-18] could be made to work. I used the bezel O-ring to take up the space and it seems to work.
> 
> ...


 
I recently got a JIL-CR2 1.3W with a TW0J non-joker LED, so I PM'ed Larry to ask about the McR-18 reflector he modded to fit in the JIL head but didn't work well with the TW0H "joker" LED's in his JIL's. He mailed the reflector to me to try in my JIL-CR2 with the non-joker LED wow: thanks Larry!). 

The modified McR-18 fits in the head of my JIL-CR2 1.3W. It seems a bit tight if anything and doesn't want to drop freely out. The edges of the reflector seem to protrude just slightly over the top of the head. This is different from Larry's experience with his JIL where the modified reflector dropped slightly below flush and he used the bezel skirt O-ring under the window to take up the slack.

The modified McR-18 reflector works well with the non-Joker TW0J in the 1.3W. It gives a nice hotspot and a very smooth transition to the spill. The emitter wire lines that I could see with the JIL's stock smooth reflector are gone when using the stippled McR-18. I now understand why JIL decided to use the McR-18 reflector in their new upgraded model of the JIL-CR2 (the JCR2). :goodjob:


----------



## LED Zeppelin (Jul 23, 2006)

Vortechs,

Hats off to you for your herculean effort in this thread. You have taken me to school on the JILs.

It is quite possible that I missed it, but I'm not sure if the availability of the chrome DD TXOH was mentioned. I got one from the first batch late last year and am running the FluPIC in it. The XO tint was chosen to complement the chrome.


----------



## vortechs (Jul 23, 2006)

Thanks. Info about the JIL's was so scattered across various threads that I thought somebody should try to collect it or links to it for the benefit of people who are new to the JIL series. 

You're right, I didn't mention the chrome finish. I suppose I should add a section about finishes. There is the original JIL-CR2 glossy gray HA3, the few chrome ones, and the new JCR2 matte gray HA3; does anybody know of any others? 

How has the chrome finish been holding up? I remember reading that it seemed very durable. Are you using it as an EDC?


----------



## LITEmania (Jul 23, 2006)

Chrome version LR (=DD) will is available soon.


----------



## vortechs (Jul 23, 2006)

Hi everybody, 

Does anybody have a JIL-CR2 with a serial number below 1000 or above 2000?


----------



## LED Zeppelin (Jul 24, 2006)

vortechs said:


> How has the chrome finish been holding up? I remember reading that it seemed very durable. Are you using it as an EDC?



I have only carried the chrome JIL a few times. The combination of tiny size and smooth surface make the twisty difficult enough to use that it's relegated to the shelf. It is a nice chrome job though, and I'm confident it would hold up well under normal circumstances.


----------



## vortechs (Jul 25, 2006)

LED Zeppelin said:


> I have only carried the chrome JIL a few times. The combination of tiny size and smooth surface make the twisty difficult enough to use that it's relegated to the shelf. It is a nice chrome job though, and I'm confident it would hold up well under normal circumstances.



Thanks LED_Zeppelin, I guess I was thinking of CroMAGnet, who posted in the JIL sales thread that he was EDC-ing his Chrome JIL-CR2 (see post #380 here http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?p=1315154&highlight=chrome#post1315154 ).


----------



## CroMAGnet (Jul 25, 2006)

CHROME Jillie Still RAWKS :rock:

Been EDC-ing my modded CHROME Jil DD since January and it is pristine as good as new. Can't say that about a few other lights that shall remain nameless for now. Pretty disapointed in one of my other favorite lights.

I missed this thread though. Thanks for the heads up Vortech! That Jil Cr2 looks great! The HA looks sweeeeet. Is there a DD version? How do we get?


----------



## vortechs (Jul 25, 2006)

CroMAGnet said:


> CHROME Jillie Still RAWKS :rock:
> 
> Been EDC-ing my modded CHROME Jil DD since January and it is pristine as good as new. Can't say that about a few other lights that shall remain nameless for now. Pretty disapointed in one of my other favorite lights.
> 
> I missed this thread though. Thanks for the heads up Vortech! That Jil Cr2 looks great! The HA looks sweeeeet. Is there a DD version? How do we get?



Hi CroMAGnet, 

Welcome to what has become the great JIL information thead (see post #4 ). Let us know if you have any suggestions or updates for it. 

Wow, 7 months of EDC (everyday carry) and it's still like new. :huh: Very impressive! 

The updated version of the JIL-CR2, called the JCR2 is available from LITEmania (Warren) over here: http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=123082

According to Warren (see above), the chrome version of the JCR2-LR (the new name for the JIL-CR2 DD) will be available soon. I remembered that somebody had posted about EDC-ing a Chrome JIL, but it took a search to find the post. Thanks for letting us know how it is holding up.


----------



## LITEmania (Jul 25, 2006)

CroMAGnet,

LR stands for Long Run


----------



## vortechs (Jul 31, 2006)

Note that AW's newest batch of RCR2 cells may be a bit too long for the JIL-CR2 lights: 
http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showpost.php?p=1523331&postcount=1175


(AW's original batch of protected RCR2 cells fit my JIL-CR2 Intelli after I removed the label from the cell. The length of the original AW protected RCR2 cell was fine for my Intelli)


----------



## vortechs (Aug 3, 2006)

I just noticed that Lighthound now has the JIL showing as available (rather than 'out of stock'). It looks like he still needs to finish updating the web page so the pictures show the new JCR2 version but he is using the new names "High Output" and "Long Run" and since he had been out of stock of the older models for months these must be the new models. 

JIL High Output Regulated CR2 Flashlight : *$101.99 ea*
JIL Long Run CR2 Flashlight : *$85.99 ea*

http://www.lighthound.com/sales/jil_cr2_keychain_flashlight.htm

Enjoy!


----------



## goldserve (Aug 3, 2006)

He doesn't have the IT version =p

Also, needs to update the pictures or else it could be false advertisement..unless you put *product is not exactly as shown*


----------



## vortechs (Aug 3, 2006)

The amount of work involved in updating the website is probably what has been delaying Lighthound from listing the new models. At least we now know he has them in stock.

When I emailed Lighthound many months ago, he was planning to carry the Intelli. I assume it just hasn't been listed yet because it will take more work to redesign the webpage to describe the Intelli (or JCR2-IT). If anyone emails Lighthound about availability and price for the JCR2-IT, please let us know.


----------



## geepondy (Aug 3, 2006)

Where do you guys buy your CR2 batteries?


----------



## Somy Nex (Aug 3, 2006)

AW from the dealers section sells protected RCR2s that work great in the JiL :thumbsup:


----------



## geepondy (Aug 4, 2006)

I don't see many/any beamshot pics of this light. I would love to see one against some modern competitors such as an LOP and ArcAAA P. I asked about the comparison against an Arc AAA P and I got answers such as it blows away the Arc and it's not really brighter but the beam pattern is better. I'm not really getting a good feel for what the beam pattern and intensity looks like from this light.


----------



## Somy Nex (Aug 4, 2006)

i've got this light in my "long-range" corridor beamshots but not within my "close-range" exercise bike shots...(not sure why, really should be the other way round ) i'll try and get those up this weekend.

In the meantime if you are interested, here are some of the corridor beamshots. i don't have the Arc AAA-P or the L0P, and I don't know what lights you have to compare it to, but you can follow the link in my sig for the whole gallery. click on any pic for a larger size =) all are directly comparable. Shots taken at ISO64, f4.0, daylight wb, 4s, 2s, 1s with an Olympus 5050 

one thing i should add, my Intelli has a joker led, but a non-jokerized old reflector. as a result, my beam is relatively quite floody (which I personally like in a small light like this). The FFIII uses the (old) Jil reflectors and shows you what the old reflectors look like (floody but not as floody as my unfocused reflector). but if you look at the new sales thread by Warren (Litemania), the new JiLs now use new McGizmo reflectors, which should (i think) be similar to the McLuxIII or Orb Raw Ns? :shrug: but all this is speculation as I don't own any of the new JiLs. 

Reference: 30 yards to end of corridor, 



Jil Intelli, burst:




Fenix L1P:



Peak Caribbean:



Fenix P1:



McLuxIII PD UX1K 500mA:



DSpeck FFIII, Burst:




lineup of small lights


----------



## vortechs (Aug 5, 2006)

I noticed that this thread (here) contains some good testimonials about how durable the Hard Anodized (type 3) finish on the JIL is and even one about the Chrome version. I thought I'd include a link to it in the big info post (#4). I added the following link to post #4: 

 --This thread has some good testimonials about how durable the JIL's HA3 finish is: 
* How well does HAIII hold up to keychain use? *(http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=126768&highlight=JIL )


----------



## vortechs (Aug 5, 2006)

geepondy said:


> I don't see many/any beamshot pics of this light. I would love to see one against some modern competitors such as an LOP and ArcAAA P. I asked about the comparison against an Arc AAA P and I got answers such as it blows away the Arc and it's not really brighter but the beam pattern is better. I'm not really getting a good feel for what the beam pattern and intensity looks like from this light.



I agree, more beamshots and comparisons would be nice. Unfortunately, I don't have a good camera to do them myself. 

The only versions of the JIL that I would even try to compare with an ArcAAA-P are the direct drive versions when they are running on a 3V primary lithium CR2 cell. The Lux-III LED is significantly underdriven with only a 3V input, so the light will last a very long time (12+ hours). The direct drive versions are the JIL-CR2 DD (or JCR2-LR) and the FLuPIC equipped JIL-CR2 DD (aka JIL-CR2 Intelli, or JCR2-IT). 

The brightness of the versions of the JIL with the Micropuck boost converter (JIL-CR2 1.3W and JCR2-HI) will far exceed the ArcAAA-P, unless you happen to have a MillerMods version that has been modded with a Luxeon LED and MillerMods' 1.5W boost circuit. 

The brightness of the direct drive versions of the JIL when using a Li-Ion RCR2 cell will exceed all the other versions of the JIL and the L0P, and far outshine an ArcAAA-P. With a Li-Ion cell the JIL can easily compare with any Luxeon-III light (with a similar bin LED and that uses an 18mm reflector). See post #4 about which versions of the JIL can use Li-Ion cells.


----------



## geepondy (Aug 5, 2006)

Thanks for the pictures Somy Nex and comments by others. From the pictures I would assume the Jill (it is a DD model, right?) is brighter then an L1P and I know an L1P is definitely brighter then an Arc AAA. Am I right about these assumptions? I would only be running primaries in these lights. The light would be a pocket light and complement the Arc AAA. I was considering a P1 but then I hauled out my old original Arc LS with a 123 twisty, the most compact CR123 light, Arc ever made, and it still felt too bulky in the pocket, diameter-wise. I can't think a P1 is significantly smaller but maybe the Jil is and I really like the looks of the light.


----------



## Somy Nex (Aug 5, 2006)

geepondy said:


> Thanks for the pictures Somy Nex and comments by others. From the pictures I would assume the Jill (it is a DD model, right?) is brighter then an L1P and I know an L1P is definitely brighter then an Arc AAA. Am I right about these assumptions? I would only be running primaries in these lights. The light would be a pocket light and complement the Arc AAA. I was considering a P1 but then I hauled out my old original Arc LS with a 123 twisty, the most compact CR123 light, Arc ever made, and it still felt too bulky in the pocket, diameter-wise. I can't think a P1 is significantly smaller but maybe the Jil is and I really like the looks of the light.



Geepondy: you're most welcome =) just a few comments after reading that you intend to run primaries.

My pics are of the Jil Intelli, running on a RCR2. The Jil Intelli uses the FLuPIC sandwich by Goldserve and operates at full brightness only on RCR2s. if you intend to run primaries, then i believe you'd be better off with the JIL-1.3W UP, which has a micropuck circuit inside which will boost & regulate the output. unfortunately though, the micropuck will only accept voltages up to 3.0 (for the old versions at least, not sure about the new). On primaries, the Jil Intelli will give you all modes & functions, but will be much dimmer (but will have much longer runtime just as the DD i'd think). 

number-wise, the Cones' Arc4 had 180 engraved as its kLux measurement at level 1, 1.3wUP measures 590 lux on Cones' light meter, the Jil DD 180 lux, and the Intelli measured ~900 lux on burst on RCR2s, and ~130 lux on burst on CR2s. 

Cones has reviewed all the old Jils (1.3wUP, DD, and Intelli) and also has older reviews of the Arc LS LSH & Arc4, and you can get lux readings (for the Jils at least, not the Arcs, runtime graphs, and some great pics from his reviews at www.cones-stuff.co.uk. For whatever reason I can't get the pictures on his site to load right now (net problems on my end) but there's a wealth of additional information contained on Cone's site =)

hope this helps =)

-----

on another note, I finally caused a signifiant gouge the size of a pinhead on my Jil today, when, taking my keys out of my pocket rather quickly, it also pulled my Jil out of the pocket, up into the air, and bezel down onto the asphalt  the dent is noticeable, but it has not gone through the anodize (!) which is still intact. but well, i wouldn't expect any light to come out of that unscathed anyway


----------



## vortechs (Aug 9, 2006)

I was taking some current measurements a couple of days ago using my JIL-CR2 Intelli in burst mode (TW0H Lux-III). I thought I'd post them here in case anybody else is interested. I was using the Intelli as a standin for a JCR2-LR (aka JIL-CR2 DD) and adding resistance to the circuit to determine what value of resistor would make a good two stage switch mod for the JCR2-LR (using a Kroll switch and the JIL-Cab or JIL-Bus body). I used 10 watt wirewrap resistors for this test so I didn't have to worry about them overheating. A two-stage switch application would need to know how much power was being dissipated in the resistor, so I computed that as well (P=I*I*R). 

Here are the measurements, all taken using a Fluke77III DDM: 

14500 Li-Ion cell @ 4.11V (4.07V at end of testing): 
no resistor = 1.18Amps = 4.85 watts total
1 ohms = 0.63Amps = 2.58 watts total = 0.397 watts in the resistor
2 ohms = 0.43Amps = 1.76 watts total = 0.370 watts in the resistor
3 ohms = 0.30Amps = 1.23 watts total = 0.270 watts in the resistor
4 ohms = 0.25Amps = 1.03 watts total = 0.250 watts in the resistor [measured on 10A connection]
4 ohms = 125mA = 0.51 watts total = 0.063 watts in the resistor [measured on 300mA connection; the light was dimmer when using the 300mA connection so it must add some resistance itself]
5 ohms = 115mA = 0.47 watts total = 0.066 watts in the resistor
10 ohms = 81mA = 0.33 watts total = 0.065 watts in the resistor
20 ohms = 52mA = 0.21 watts total = 0.054 watts in the resistor
30 ohms = 38mA = 0.15 watts total = 0.043 watts in the resistor

CR2 primary cell @ 3.1V
no resistor = 50mA (on burst) = 0.15 watts total
10 ohms = 20mA = 0.06 watts = 0.004 watts in the resistor
20 ohms = 13mA = 0.04 watts = 0.0034 watts in the resistor


I thought it was interesting that I got different measurements using the 10Amp vs. the 300mA DDM connection when the current was just about between the two ranges.


----------



## vortechs (Aug 10, 2006)

I measured the current in my new JCR2-LR (TxxJ Luxeon-III). It reads 45mA with a fresh CR2 primary cell. 

The new version's McR-18 reflector do make the light seem brighter, probably because more of the light is concentrated in the hotspot.


----------



## vortechs (Aug 13, 2006)

vortechs said:


> I measured the current in my new JCR2-LR (TxxJ Luxeon-III). It reads 45mA with a fresh CR2 primary cell.



I measured the current in my JCR2-LR with some other battery configuratons: 

14500 Li-Ion at 4.0V --> 1.35 Amps at start, dropping to 1.30 Amps after about 15 seconds as it heats up (I didn't run it for long). 

3V AA primary lithium cell (from taking apart a CRV3 battery) at 3.115V --> 45mA. 

Two Alkaline AA cells @ 3.0V --> 35mA

3.7V AA-size TADIRAN primary lithium cell at 3.67V --> 65mA. It started at about 80mA initially, quickly dropped to about 70mA and stabilized at 65mA after about a minute. The TADIRAN is designed to be a computer memory battery; the chemistry and design of this cell highly limit the current it can produce. However you can see it produces a more light than a 3V primary lithium cell and the cell has a higher mAh rating as well, so it might be a good choice for an EDC cell in a JIL-CR2 DD or JCR2-LR with a xxxJ bin LED.


----------



## hivoltage (Aug 15, 2006)

So are they available yet? I want the brightest possible that has the strobe and different light levels. Which one would that be? Thanks


----------



## goldserve (Aug 15, 2006)

The JIL Intelli has what you are looking for. Warren is shipping them immediately so you can order from him. I'm not sure that lighthound has the Intelli in stock but you can inquire with him first. Cheers!


----------



## vortechs (Aug 15, 2006)

hivoltage said:


> So are they available yet?



There are links about where to get the new JIL's at the bottom of post #4 in this thread. 

There is a sales thread in the Dealers Forum: https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/123082 
You can also try LightHound: http://www.lighthound.com/sales/jil_cr2_keychain_flashlight.htm

I try to keep post #4 up to date. I will eventually create a new thread for JIL info, questions, and ideas using post #4 from this thread as the first post.


----------



## vortechs (Aug 16, 2006)

goldserve said:


> The JIL Intelli has what you are looking for. Warren is shipping them immediately so you can order from him. I'm not sure that lighthound has the Intelli in stock but you can inquire with him first. Cheers!



I saw the JCR2-IT (Intelli) on LightHound's website a couple of days ago, but it isn't there now. I don't know what happened to it. Maybe he is out of them already. It looks like he has been updating the page to give information and pictures that show the updated JCR2 version. 

LightHound's website: http://www.lighthound.com 
LightHound's JIL page: http://www.lighthound.com/sales/jil_cr2_keychain_flashlight.htm


----------



## goldserve (Aug 16, 2006)

Really eh...i don't think i've ever seen it on his site. Plus, there isn't much indication (by the means of description) that he carries the IT version at all.


----------



## vortechs (Aug 16, 2006)

goldserve said:


> Really eh...i don't think i've ever seen it on his site. Plus, there isn't much indication (by the means of description) that he carries the IT version at all.



Really. I'm very sure it was there, since it surprised me too. The site had all 3 of the current JIL models listed side by side with the Intelli on the left, then the High Intensity, then the Long Run on the right. I think the price on the Intelli was about $136 (I'm just going from memory, I'll edit this if it reappears on the site). 

Someone could get a JIL a bit cheaper by ordering directly from LITEmania if they didn't mind waiting a while for an international shipment. LightHound has faster shipping to people located in the USA and has legendary customer service (and includes a free keychain light with each order over $20). 

I got my new JCR2-LR directly from LITEmania.


----------



## hivoltage (Aug 16, 2006)

Is the High Intensity brighter than the Intelli.? How long will the Hi intensity burn compared to the Intelli. ? Does the High Intensity have just 1 brightness. 


This is ONE confusing flashlight:lolsign:


----------



## vortechs (Aug 16, 2006)

hivoltage said:


> Is the High Intensity brighter than the Intelli.? How long will the Hi intensity burn compared to the Intelli. ? Does the High Intensity have just 1 brightness.



The JCR2-HI (aka 1.3W) only has one brightness level. The only JIL light with multiple brightness levels is the JCR2-IT (aka Intelli). The JCR2-HI (using a primary CR2) is about half as bright as the JCR2-IT on burst (using a RCR2 Li-Ion). The JCR2-HI runs about 1.5 hours on a primary CR2. The JCR2-IT runtime depends on what brightness setting is used, it runs about 20 minutes on burst on a RCR2 Li-Ion. See CPF member Cones' review of the JIL-CR2 1.3W (JCR2-HI) and FluPIC JIL-CR2 DD (JCR2-IT). 

--Review of the JIL by respected CPF member Cones: (http://www.cones-stuff.co.uk/) (look on the ‘torches’ page for reviews of the “JIL-Lite CR2 1.3W UP”, “JIL-Lite CR2 DD UP”, and the “FluPIC JIL DD”)


----------



## hivoltage (Aug 16, 2006)

Great, Thanks. I want to order an Intelli and Lighthound does not have 1...so where do I order from.

Sorry for all the questions!!!!


----------



## goldserve (Aug 16, 2006)

warren seems to be cheaper and he's more reliable lately. Order with confidence.


----------



## hivoltage (Aug 16, 2006)

Who is Warren?


----------



## vortechs (Aug 16, 2006)

hivoltage said:


> Who is Warren?



Warren = CPF member LITEmania. 

LITEmania (Warren) is a dealer in South Korea and is the source for the JIL series of flashlights on CPF (the manufacturer is JIL-Lite). His sales thread for the current models of the JIL (the JCR2 series) is here: http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=123082

You can find all of the threads LITEmania (Warren) has started with this link: http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/search.php?do=process&showposts=0&starteronly=1&exactname=1&searchuser=LITEmania 


P.S. Here is that search in text format:
http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/search.php?do=process&showposts=0&starteronly=1&exactname=1&searchuser=LITEmania


----------



## vortechs (Aug 23, 2006)

I did a quick test with my JIL-CR2 1.3W (with TW0J Lux-III) to see what the current it would draw with various types of batteries. 

[measured on a Fluke77III DDM using the 300mA connection]
Sanyo CR2 3V lithium primary = 275mA
AA-size 3V lithium primary (from taking apart a Kodak CRV3) = 285mA
TADIRAN AA-size 3.6V lithium primary (a computer memory cell) = 225mA

[After I finished those measurements, I realized that they weren't reliable because I was using the 300mA connection on the DDM. I needed to use the next higher current connection, so I measured again with the 10A connection on the DDM.]
Sanyo CR2 3V lithium primary = 560mA
AA-size 3V lithium primary (from taking apart a Kodak CRV3) = 580mA
TADIRAN AA-size 3.6V lithium primary (a computer memory cell) = 500mA

The 3V lithium primary cells had a stable current reading in a few seconds, but the TADIRAN cell's current took a while to settle down and varied quite a bit before it settled down. I should repeat the test when I get some more time to see if that is normal. [edit: the TADIRAN cell was stable in the second test, below]

My previous tests with the 3.6V TADIRAN cell showed that it could only deliver about 65mA to a JCR2-LR (a direct drive light). However it appears that the cell can deliver quite a bit more current in a light with a boost circuit like the JIL-CR2 1.3W (and JCR2-HI). 

I guess the TADIRAN cell has a high enough internal resistance to significantly limit the current it can deliver to a direct drive light (65mA), even though it might appear to be more capable if you only looked at its voltage rating (3.6V). However the TADIRAN cell appears to be capable of putting out over 200mA when used with a boost circuit. Interesting.


----------



## vortechs (Aug 28, 2006)

vortechs said:


> I did a quick test with my JIL-CR2 1.3W (with TW0J Lux-III) to see what the current it would draw with various types of batteries.
> 
> [measured on a Fluke77III DDM using the 300mA connection]
> Sanyo CR2 3V lithium primary = 275mA
> ...



I tried the AA-sized 3.6V TADIRAN cell with the JIL-CR2 1.3W head (with TW0J Lux-III) again. 

Initial static cell voltage = 3.67V. 

Measuring with the 10Amp connection on a Fluke77III DDM, the current started at 0.45 Amps and stayed fairly stable. It did slowly drop to 0.43 Amps over the first 30 seconds or so, then slowly increase to 0.47 Amps over the next minute or so. 

I let it sit for about 5 minutes and typed the notes above, then tried it again. 

The current was very stable at 0.49 Amps for over 2 minutes. It actually started at 0.50 Amps then immediately dropped to 0.49, stayed at 0.49 for a full minute, dropped to 0.48 for another full minute, then raised to 0.49 again at about the end of the second full minute. 

Static cell voltage tested just after the 2 minute run = 3.48V and recovering. 

Static cell voltage tested after about 5 minutes of rest (while typing the above) = 3.60V 

Conclusion, the JIL-CR2 1.3W can draw about 500mA from a 3.6V TADIRAN primary lithium cell. Since this is similar to the current draw from a normal 3V primary lithium cell, it looks like the AA-size TADIRAN cell will be practical to use in the JIL-CR2 1.3W with the JIL-Cab (1AA) body. The advantage of the TADIRAN cell (or a SAFT cell) is that they have a somewhat greater capacity (mAh) than a normal 3V lithium primary cell, plus they are much more available in AA-size. The only way I know of to get an AA-size 3V lithium primary cell is to take apart a CRV3 battery. 

Remaining questions: 

I don't know if the effective mAh capacity of the TADIRAN cell will be reduced at a 500mA current, since I've heard the cell is optimized for very low current drain applications like computer memory. 

I also don't know if the amount of current the TADIRAN cell can deliver will decrease as the cell is drained. My test about are with a mostly fresh cell.

I don't know if the 3.6V static cell voltage of the TADIRAN will be a problem for the micropuck converter in the JIL-CR2 1.3W (and JCR2-HI). The cell voltage seems to drop under a 500mA load, but I didn't measure how much it drops. Since the TADIRAN cell voltage is lower than a fully charged Li-Ion and drops under load, I suspect the TADIRAN cell is a better match for the JIL-CR2 1.3W than a Li-Ion, but I don't know the long-term effects on the micropuck boost converter in the 1.3W.


----------



## vortechs (Aug 28, 2006)

Since this thread contains one of the largest collections of JIL info available in one spot, I thought I should include my notes about using 3 Alkaline or 4 NiMH cells with the JIL-CR2 DD Intelli head. This helps answer some questions about how much voltage the FLuPIC can handle (at least for a short time). 

-------------

I put 3 Alkaline AA cells and an AA dummy cell in a 4 AA battery holder. The voltage read 4.51V on my Fluke 77III multimeter. I took the head off my JIL-CR2 Intelli and used the AA battery carrier and my multimeter's wires to touch the contacts in the head. With 2 quick taps to get it into burst mode then holding the wires to the contacts, I measured about 1.05 Amps at the start, dropping to about 0.95 Amps as it heated up (using the 10Amp connection on the multimeter). The head gets warm very quickly and I don't want to run the Intelli head for long on the burst (maximum) setting at this voltage without the body attached to help heatsink it. It is also a bit difficult to get a really good connection with this setup. I tried measuring the current a few times and got a bit less than 1 Amp each time. The battery holder voltage after the tests read 4.35V (and slowly increasing). 

Summary: 3 AA Alkaline cells, 4.5V, about 1 Amp.

-------------

I put 4 AA NiMH cells in the 4 AA battery holder. The NiMH cells were fully charged two days ago. Initial static voltage reads 5.42V. I touched the wires to the Intelli head and measured the current. It started at 1.15 Amps and seemed to stabilize at about 1.10 Amps. I tried it twice, but didn't run it too long either time since that I compute that is about 6 watts. The battery voltage measured 5.36V after the test.

Summary: 4 AA NiMH cells, 5.4V, about 1.1 Amps.

-------------

It looks like the JIL-CR2 Intelli gets full brightness when powered by 3 AA Alkaline cells or 4 AA NiMH cells. I couldn't tell if it was brighter than when using a fully charged (4.15V) Li-Ion. Unfortunately since I was holding wires to the head to get it to run in this configuration, I couldn't easily compare the beam to something else. 

Maybe JIL-Lite will develop a body designed to hold 3 AA cells or even one that holds 4 AA cells. Since the 1AA body is called the JIL-Cab and the 2AA body is called the JIL-Bus, I wonder what even longer bodies would be called; perhaps the JIL-Truck or JIL-Train.


----------



## hivoltage (Aug 28, 2006)

I just got a JCR2 IT and it came with no instructions as how to set the modes, ect. Also, the rechargeable battery I had appears longer than the one that came in it, the O ring barely gets covered up. Bright little light though!!!!!! So where can I get some instructions? Thanks


----------



## vortechs (Aug 28, 2006)

hivoltage said:


> I just got a JCR2 IT and it came with no instructions as how to set the modes, ect. Also, the rechargeable battery I had appears longer than the one that came in it, the O ring barely gets covered up. Bright little light though!!!!!! So where can I get some instructions? Thanks



See the links at the bottom of post #4.


----------



## vortechs (Aug 29, 2006)

hivoltage said:


> I just got a JCR2 IT and it came with no instructions as how to set the modes, ect. Also, the rechargeable battery I had appears longer than the one that came in it, the O ring barely gets covered up. Bright little light though!!!!!! So where can I get some instructions? Thanks



What type of rechargeable battery do you have (manufacturer, protected/unprotected, purchase date)? What is the measured cell length? I have read that AW's second run of protected RCR2 Li-Ion cells was a bit longer than the first run. The longer RCR2 cells help some types of flashlights make contact without spacers, but are a bit long for the JIL. I have some of AW's original protected RCR2 cells for my Intelli and the o-ring is fully covered. 

Here is the section from post #4 about how to use the Intelli: 

---------------------

*FLuPIC User Information:* 
If you get a JIL-CR2 Intelli or a JIL-CR2 that has been modified with a FLuPIC, you will want to read the Users Guide for the FLuPIC V2.1 firmware, which shows the state transition diagram for how to use all the settings and modes. You will want to review the diagram carefully and probably print a copy. See the first post in this thread for the diagram (http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=88623 ). Note that the JIL-CR2 with FLuPIC will flicker once after 1.2 seconds to indicate that it is now 'locked' into that setting. If you turn the light off before the 'flicker' it will advance to the next setting (the next time you turn it on). If you turn the light off after the 'flicker' it will return to the 1st setting for the current mode (typically the low brightness setting). Note that you can 'preset' the light to turn on the next time at a given setting by turning it on and off quickly until the appropriate setting will be the next one to turn on, then simply leaving the light off; the next setting will be the first one to appear the next time the light is turned on.


----------



## vortechs (Aug 30, 2006)

CPF member meeshu had made a runtime graph for the JCR2-HI (aka JIL-CR2 1.3W). See http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=131008

The quick summary is that with good Sanyo or Duracell CR2 primary cells the JCR2-HI regulation (a micropuck boost converter) gives pretty much full brightness for about 60 minutes, drops to half brightness at about 90 minutes and is pretty much done at about 120 minutes.


----------



## vortechs (Sep 1, 2006)

CPF member goldserve has pointed out the location for further information about the MicroPuck boost converter in the JIL 1.3W head (and JCR2-HI), including the data sheet for the converter that shows input voltage vs. output current and circuit efficiency. 

http://www.leddynamics.com/LuxDrive/micropuck.php

The model in the JIL is the LuxDrive 2009 HI (the 400mA version). 

(I have also seen references to an HO model, I'm not sure if this is the same as the HI or if it is something different)


----------



## vortechs (Sep 1, 2006)

I've noticed that I needed to correct post #4 about using the JIL-1.3W head with low input voltages, such as a single AA 1.5V Alkaline cell or even a single AA 1.2V NiMH cell. The MicroPuck boost converter in the 1.3W head works with input voltages as low as 0.8V, so 1.2-1.5V is enough to get the 1.3W head to light. The 1.3W head will be less bright with the lower input voltages, but it will work. I've updated post #4 as follows: 


*JIL-1.3W:* Contains a LEDdynamics LuxDrive MicroPuck controller (model 2009-HI, or maybe HO???) to boost the voltage of a 3V Lithium primary cell, in order to achieve increased brightness with 3V primary batteries at the expense of reduced runtime. The MicroPuck is designed for a battery voltage of 1V to 3V with 3V giving the rated current (400mA) to the LED and lower input voltages providing less current to the LED. The optimal input is 3V from either a Lithium primary CR2 cell or two 1.5V cells in an optional battery extension (such as two AA Alkaline cells in the JIL-Bus extension). Using 3.6V LiIon rechargeable cells with the 1.3W head is not recommended because the MicroPuck controller is only rated for up to 3V input (in its typical boost configuration in the JIL-1.3W). (At least one person has tried a Li-Ion cell in the 1.3W and it does not immediately fail, but the long term effects are uncertain). Two 1.2V NiMH cells (2.4V) will work with the JIL-1.3W head but the light output will be a bit lower (probably about 280mA to the LED = 70% as bright as a 3V input). The MicroPuck can even boost a single 1.2V or 1.5V cell enough to power the LED, but it will be much less bright (probably about 100mA to the LED from a 1.2V input and about 150mA to the LED from a 1.5V input = 25% to 40% as bright as a 3V input ). The data sheet for the MicroPuck boost converter is available here: http://www.leddynamics.com/LuxDrive...A-MicroPuck.pdf .

*JIL-Cab (1 x AA size):* ...The JIL-Cab can be used with the 1.3W head and 1 x AA alkaline or NiMH battery but it will be much less bright with only 1.2-1.5V of input compared to 3V input, however it should still be brighter than the JIL-DD with 3V input. The JIL-Cab cannot be used with the DD or DD-Intelli heads with only 1 x AA alkaline or NiMH battery because the 1.5V of a single alkaline cell or 1.2V of a single NiMH cell is not sufficient to power the LED...


----------



## vortechs (Sep 8, 2006)

I got some useful trivia about the MicroPuck in the JIL 1.3W and thought I'd post it here for anyone who is thinking of modding a JIL 1.3W: 

The MicroPuck as installed in the JIL 1.3W has one wire snipped off. The green one as the body provides the path for -v.


----------



## vortechs (Sep 24, 2006)

Does anybody know if there are any sandwiches that will fit in the JIL-CR2 1.3W head (in the space typically occupied by the MicroPuck-HI 400ma driver)?


----------



## vortechs (Oct 3, 2006)

Here is some info about FLuPIC board sizes, for people who want to mod the JIL. 

The JIL-CR2 DD, Intelli, and JCR2-IT use CPF member goldserve's *0.55" (13.96mm) Sammie size board, 0.6mm thick* (see this thread). The JCR2-LR uses a 0.55" and 0.6mm thick board so it can be recessed in the light body. The 0.55" board requires a metal retaining ring (available from goldserve). 

The JIL-CR2 1.3W and JCR2-HI use either the *0.6" (15.24mm) sized emitter board, 0.9mm thick* or the *0.6" (15.24mm) Fenix sized, 1.2mm thick*. The board diameter needs to be 0.6", but the thickness does not really matter with the JIL 1.3W and JCR2-HI since there is plenty of room in the head after the MicroPuck driver is removed. The 0.6" board so it sits inside the light without the assistance of a metal ring. The emitter board can then be adjusted to take the space that was taken by the MicroPuck driver, which is removed to install the FLuPIC.

See this post for the source of this info: https://www.candlepowerforums.com/posts/1623200#post1623200


----------



## vortechs (Oct 13, 2006)

I added a note to post #4 about using a SureFire Z60 lanyard with the JIL-Cab and JIL-Bus. I hope I got the model number right, I noticed this in the old thread where the Cab and Bus were first introduced.


----------



## vortechs (Oct 19, 2006)

Here is a link to a question about how 300-350mAh RCR2 Li-Ion cells can handle the high current draw in an JIL-CR2 Intelli in the Max/burst setting (or the really high current draw in a JIL-DD with a xxxJ LED): https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/137464


----------



## Wal44 (Oct 20, 2006)

I bought a Jil DD a little over a year ago and have been very pleased with it. It's my EDC and has been in my pocket every day along with coins, knife, etc. and still looks brand new. I use it a couple of minutes a day and am still on the original battery and the light is still very bright. I got a Fenix LO (got to keep up with the new lights) but the Jil appears brighter.


----------



## bombelman (Oct 31, 2006)

Nice collection of links man !


----------



## vortechs (Nov 1, 2006)

bombelman said:


> Nice collection of links man !



Thanks! It was a lot of work, but I hope it saves other people the time of searching for information. 

I want to update post #4 and make a separate thread for JIL information, but I haven't had enough time.


----------



## goldserve (Feb 1, 2007)

This place seems like a good place to start talking about seoul upgrades for the JIL-DD and JCR series. 

I've got lights on the way to test out the mod so i'll report back!


----------



## ledvador (Feb 1, 2007)

goldserve said:


> This place seems like a good place to start talking about seoul upgrades for the JIL-DD and JCR series.
> 
> I've got lights on the way to test out the mod so i'll report back!




WOW! nice news here!
I will keep the line on too see.
Thanks for this news goldserve.


----------



## Diode (Feb 1, 2007)

goldserve said:


> This place seems like a good place to start talking about seoul upgrades for the JIL-DD and JCR series.
> 
> I've got lights on the way to test out the mod so i'll report back!


I'd like a Seoul or CREE upgrade for my JIL Intelli.

I'd also like to upgrade the reflector to McR18, if possible. I read somewhere that the McR18 reflector doesn't fit the old JIL bezel.


----------



## goldserve (Feb 1, 2007)

You are probably right. I'll see what has to be done to get the mcr into an old style JIL-DD but will you be happy with JUST a seoul upgrade? =D


----------



## vortechs (Feb 1, 2007)

Diode said:


> I'd also like to upgrade the reflector to McR18, if possible. I read somewhere that the McR18 reflector doesn't fit the old JIL bezel.



LITEmania mentioned that the McR-18 reflector would not fit the JIL-CR2 bezel in his sales thread for the upgraded JCR2 model (which uses a McR-18). 

There is a discussion of putting a McR-18 reflector in a "old JIL" (JIL-CR2 DD or 1.3W) bezel earlier in this thread. Larry (tvodrd) tried it and found that a McR-18 reflector would fit in a JIL-CR2 bezel only if the reflector was modified ("turned down") a little. Unfortunately the reflector that Larry modded was a McR-18 (non-joker) and his JIL-CR2 1.3W lights both had "joker" LED's (that have a different die height than other Luxeons), so the focus was poor and the result was a flood reflector. He graciously gave me the modified McR-18 reflector and it works great in my JIL-CR2 1.3W, which has a "non-joker" LED.


----------



## Diode (Feb 2, 2007)

goldserve said:


> You are probably right. I'll see what has to be done to get the mcr into an old style JIL-DD but will you be happy with JUST a seoul upgrade? =D


Well, I *was* happy with the old reflector, until I found out about the McR18-equipped JILs. Oh well. Lumens are more fun than beam shape anyway.  Will you make a complete drop-in FLuPIC module? If so, can I have it locked at Mode 4?

I don't want to send my Intelli away for modding because I don't think I can live without a flashlight on my keychain. My only spare is a cheap 5mm button light. I can't use that! What if I bump into a flashaholic?


----------



## goldserve (Feb 2, 2007)

I do plan on making new modules for those that way and a fee to upgrade the existing modules. However, I can't be responsible for things lost in the mail. I usually end up responsible because I feel guilty.


----------



## Diode (Feb 9, 2007)

Hey goldserve,

Any updates on the Seoul+FLuPIC module?


----------



## D-Dog (Feb 9, 2007)

What would be the difference in apparent brightness vs the TWOH that's in my intelli now?**Are we looking at increased runtime with the same brightness, or increased brightness with the same runtime?**Lastly, do you have any lumen approximations with the new configuration yet?


----------



## goldserve (Feb 9, 2007)

I used up all my seoul leds =<

I'm waiting for those to come in before I can mount one. There will be improved brightness and runtime I would guess.

Cheers!


----------



## goldserve (Feb 9, 2007)

Good and bad news:

The JILs with the McR-18-Joker meaning the latest JCR2s should work perfectly without modifications to the reflector.

The JILs with the OLD style, first generate reflectors also work perfectly fine without modifications.

The JILs with the upgraded reflector does not work well with the seoul leds.Can someone tell me if these reflectors are plastic or not? If i can maching off the bottom? I can't really hold it in the machine either....hrmmm

The JILs, if there are any with non-joker McR18s will need 0.03" machined off the bottom.

Cheers. When I actually have lights with seoul leds in them, I'll let everyone know.


----------



## Diode (Feb 12, 2007)

goldserve said:


> The JILs with the upgraded reflector does not work well with the seoul leds.


This includes the original Intelli, right?



> Can someone tell me if these reflectors are plastic or not?


Mine feels like plastic.


----------



## goldserve (Feb 12, 2007)

Yeah...the original intelli has the upgraded reflector. I can try to put one in and see but I think it has some little artifacts. May be acceptable to some.


----------



## MarNav1 (Feb 12, 2007)

What about it? Our JILs will not be forgotten. Give it a llittle time and wala!


----------



## goldserve (Feb 12, 2007)

Correction:

Looks like the McR-18 reflectors do need tweaking and how much will be determined tomorrow. I suspect another 0.015" needs to be taken off.


----------



## goldserve (Feb 13, 2007)

:Waiting for it to get dark:

I just trimmed the reflectors and it seems like it is more focused. Cheers =D


----------



## vortechs (Feb 19, 2007)

It looks like goldserve has perfected the Seoul P4 LED upgrade for the JCR2 series lights (the ones that use the McR-18 reflector). He has a thread about it over here. I've updated post #4 of this thread with the link to goldserve's Seoul P4 upgrade.


----------



## vortechs (Feb 19, 2007)

goldserve said:


> The JILs with the OLD style, first generate reflectors also work perfectly fine without modifications.
> 
> The JILs with the upgraded reflector does not work well with the seoul leds.Can someone tell me if these reflectors are plastic or not? If i can maching off the bottom? I can't really hold it in the machine either....hrmmm
> 
> The JILs, if there are any with non-joker McR18s will need 0.03" machined off the bottom.



I believe the reflector in the first JIL-CR2 1.3W lights (before they got the "Up" in the name) may have been plastic because I remember the description of the upgraded reflector in the "Up" models mentioned that the upgraded reflector was metal. I could search some of the old JIL threads for info about the original, upgraded, and upgraded-Joker reflectors, however it may be easier to ask Warren (LITEmania).


----------



## Russianesq (Mar 9, 2007)

Is there any brightness (lumen) information available for the JIL series?

Specifically what is the brightness of the JIL Long Run

Any information would be greatly appreciated.


----------



## vortechs (Mar 10, 2007)

Russianesq said:


> Is there any brightness (lumen) information available for the JIL series?
> 
> Specifically what is the brightness of the JIL Long Run
> 
> Any information would be greatly appreciated.


You have asked a particularly difficult question. 

Brightness can be measured several ways. Total output is in lumens, which is difficult to measure without special equipment to catch all the light being emitted and direct it to a sensor. Brightness at one particular point (typically a point in the hotspot) is in candlepower or lux, which can be measured much more easily than lumens. 

Most information that can be found about the lumens rating of various lights is based on approximations, estimates or visual comparisons to other lights, which is one of the reasons why the values can vary so much for the same model of light. I am not aware of any laboratory tests of the lumen output of the JIL series. We can estimate the output of a light by looking at the bin rating of LED used, the current it draws, and estimating the losses in the reflector and lens/window. Unfortunately this is particularly complex for a direct drive light like the JIL-CR2 DD or JCR2-LR, since the current will depend on the Vf of the LED, as well as the voltage and other characteristics of the battery being used. 

Information about the candlepower or lux ratings of some JIL's can be found in some of the reviews that are mentioned in post#4 of this thread. I don't have a light meter to measure a JIL myself. Again note that for a direct drive light (JIL-CR2 DD or JCR2-LR), the lux measurement will vary a lot depending on the bin and Vf of the LED as well as the voltage and internal resistance of the battery. 

Here are links to some other threads that ask similar questions about lumens: 
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/129008
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/128828

(After all those caveats, I will guess that a direct drive JIL with a Luxeon-III LED produces somewhere in the range of 10-20 lumens using a 3V lithium primary cell.)


----------



## Russianesq (Mar 11, 2007)

thank u


----------



## vortechs (Mar 14, 2007)

vortechs said:


> It looks like goldserve has perfected the Seoul P4 LED upgrade for the JCR2 series lights (the ones that use the McR-18 reflector). He has a thread about it over here. I've updated post #4 of this thread with the link to goldserve's Seoul P4 upgrade.


I got my JIL-CR2 DD and JCR2-LR back from goldserve, modded with a FLuPIC and Seoul P4 LED. They are now significantly brighter than my JIL-CR2 Intelli and have MUCH better throw. Beamshots are available over in post #37 of goldserve's thread.


----------



## vortechs (Mar 15, 2007)

There have been a couple of reports that the Seoul P4 LED may emit a very bluish light when it is overdriven too hard. At least one of these reports was with a JIL/Seoul P4 mod using a fully-charged 14500 cell in the CAB body. I managed to repeat the effect in one of my two Seoul-modded JIL's, but only when I used a fully charged 14500 cell (above 4V). If anyone else sees this problem, the solution is to avoid using the Maximum (Burst) mode with fully charged Li-Ion cells. 

See this thread for details.


----------



## vortechs (Mar 26, 2007)

CPF member goldserve has modded a JIL-CR2 1.3W with one of his "Piglet" two-level buck-boost drivers that include strobe, beacon, and SOS modes. Information can be found over in this thread: https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/158912 

More info on the Piglet driver itself can be found here: https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/157776

The Piglet driver will give the JIL-CR2 1.3W similar although not identical functionality to the FLuPIC in the Intelli. The main difference is that the FLuPIC is buck only (using LDO's) so the battery voltage needs to be close to or above the Vf of the LED, whereas the Piglet is buck-boost so the battery voltage can be below or above the Vf of the LED. Another difference is that the FLuPIC can produce many different brightness levels by PWM (pulse width modulation) while the Piglet driver only has two fixed brightness levels available (which are determined when the Piglet is made) that do not use PWM. This distinction can be important because some people don't like PWM because looking at moving objects at low brightness levels can produce a bit of a 'strobe' effect.


----------



## goldserve (Mar 26, 2007)

With the mod, the light should be able to use 1 CAB (14500) and the BUS tube that uses 2 x 1.5v!


----------



## X_Marine (Jun 4, 2007)

Wow, really nice collection of information vortechs..
You must have many hours in putting this all together and it is really appreciated.. :twothumbs

ThanX
X.


----------

