# Tri-EDC 18650 prototype



## Thetasigma (Mar 28, 2016)

I love Mac's Tri-EDC lights, however the secondhand price is frankly, absurd.
I also like 18650's for their balance of size, capacity, and discharge current. So the goal was to design a 18650 light with styling similar to a Mac and a McClicky switch.

I used a Nichia 219C array due to their superior Vf, tint, and CRI to XP-G2's. The combination of a 7135 linear driver and the low forward voltage of the 219Cs makes for a very efficient, regulated light.
The body is 7075 Aluminum, 1"x 5 1/16".

Thanks to mcbrat for specs for the pill.














Next to a Copper Sinner.


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## gunga (Mar 28, 2016)

Interested. Subscribed.


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## kellyglanzer (Mar 28, 2016)

gunga said:


> Interested. Subscribed.



what he said ^


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## gunga (Mar 28, 2016)

Can it be done shorter?


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## Skeeterg (Mar 28, 2016)

I am liking it to.


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## Tejasandre (Mar 28, 2016)

Nice!


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## DrafterDan (Mar 29, 2016)

Nicely done! No need for a shorter version, it fit his design specs. 
Any plans for a clip? Would help keep it from rolling about


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## Thetasigma (Mar 29, 2016)

Thanks guys, this version has perhaps 2-4mm of extra material that could be trimmed once I refine the process, and depending on how thick of a bezel there is. I am inclined to leave a thicker bezel to protect the front of the light in the event of impact.
I don't currently have any way to accurately drill holes for a clip, but I would like to outfit it with either a McGizmo or Okluma clip. Jeff has kindly suggested some ways to hold the piece that I will have to explore when I get more time.


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## peter yetman (Mar 29, 2016)

Lovely light. Subscribed.
Actually I like the length, I find 18350 lights far too short for my hand. I also love the simplicity of the design - smooth and without a waist. it makes the Sinner in the photo look quite dumpy. I'll take one, if you make a few. It's the shape I've been looking for, for ages.
P


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## Tejasandre (Mar 29, 2016)

Put me on the take one if you sell em list too.


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## Thetasigma (Mar 29, 2016)

Thanks guys, I do plan on making some for sale once I nail down the final dimensions. I aim to reduce the light to an nice round 5" in length and perhaps adjust the length of the tail shroud section slightly. You have both been noted on the list.


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## Tejasandre (Mar 29, 2016)

Can't wait.


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## Skeeterg (Mar 29, 2016)

Thats a perfect length for my hands.will any have anodizing?


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## Thetasigma (Mar 29, 2016)

I don't have the capability to do anodizing and I don't know of any place locally that does it. Shoot I don't even think there is a real machine shop within the county these days.


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## Tejasandre (Mar 29, 2016)

Don't cover up that beautiful work.


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## gunga (Mar 30, 2016)

No point. The TinyDC is not anodized. Nor are Macs (most). Why bother?


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## Thetasigma (Mar 30, 2016)

I understand why some may want to anodize or coat their light, however I will leave that for the end user since the 7075 aluminum with its natural oxide layer is sufficiently durable provided it isn't being dunked in an acidic or caustic solution. I actually had the buffing wheel launch the light in the photos across the shop twice with only two tiny little dents resulting.


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## gunga (Mar 30, 2016)

But I like to clean my lights in caustic solution!


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## peter yetman (Mar 30, 2016)

Who doesn't?
P


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## mcbrat (Mar 30, 2016)

I'm in!


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## Thetasigma (Mar 30, 2016)

Glad to hear it Mick, thanks again for the pill specs!


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## maxspeeds (Mar 30, 2016)

I'm in too (pending pricing and metallurgy). Please put me on the list


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## mick238 (Mar 30, 2016)

This looks pretty nice. Well done


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## Thetasigma (Mar 30, 2016)

maxspeeds said:


> I'm in too (pending pricing and metallurgy). Please put me on the list


Done, lights will be 7075 aluminum for now, and perhaps some C360 brass ones at some point.


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## kellyglanzer (Mar 30, 2016)

Please add me to your list.


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## Thetasigma (Mar 31, 2016)

kellyglanzer said:


> Please add me to your list.



Noted and thanks for the interest.


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## gunga (Mar 31, 2016)

You know I'm in right?


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## Thetasigma (Mar 31, 2016)

gunga said:


> You know I'm in right?


Yep, you are first on the list currently.


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## gunga (Mar 31, 2016)

Nice...

I'll be ordering parts for the build in the coming weeks. I need a worthy host for the wicked H17F circuit I want to try. I may use 219C for good tint and nice output.


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## Thetasigma (Mar 31, 2016)

gunga said:


> Nice...
> 
> I'll be ordering parts for the build in the coming weeks. I need a worthy host for the wicked H17F circuit I want to try. I may use 219C for good tint and nice output.



I am rather partial to the Nichia 219C now, they seem to me to be rather near perfect for a general purpose emitter. Good clean tint at ~5000k with reasonable 80+ CRI, and the low forward voltage makes them easier to drive in combo with good output. The only way they could get better is 90+ CRI with similar performance. Only thing that I've read that you might have an issue with is that the 219C will rather happily gobble up more amps than one should reasonably feed it. Might be less of an issue with the parallel array though.


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## gunga (Mar 31, 2016)

Actually, good point. With a fet driver, I think a triple 219C will go to 8-10+ Amps? I'll stick with 219B.


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## mcbrat (Apr 1, 2016)

DrafterDan said:


> Nicely done! No need for a shorter version, it fit his design specs.
> Any plans for a clip? Would help keep it from rolling about





Thetasigma said:


> Thanks guys, this version has perhaps 2-4mm of extra material that could be trimmed once I refine the process, and depending on how thick of a bezel there is. I am inclined to leave a thicker bezel to protect the front of the light in the event of impact.
> I don't currently have any way to accurately drill holes for a clip, but I would like to outfit it with either a McGizmo or Okluma clip. Jeff has kindly suggested some ways to hold the piece that I will have to explore when I get more time.



as long as you use a punch to accurately mark your location for the hole, they can be done by hand...

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...-not-to-Clip&p=4781396&viewfull=1#post4781396

just not necessarily time effective. the biggest issue with long bodies is the clip fitment. Mac didn't want to design a new clip to reach down to the body. McGizmo made his 2x123 Pak "swell" in the middle by design, so the same clip can be used without bending it differently. looks like Sinner 18650 lights just utilize a different bend in the clips.


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## Thetasigma (Apr 1, 2016)

Thanks for the tip Mick, I find the McGizmo clip fits very nice on a Sinner as is, no bending needed. As it stands currently a Mcgizmo clip would fall between two rings, giving it a nice bite.


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## phil7153 (Apr 1, 2016)

I'm in. Would also be in for a 18350 tube as well


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## Thetasigma (Apr 2, 2016)

Noted, I haven't decided on a 18350 design yet.


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## peter yetman (Apr 2, 2016)

Keep 'em 18650.
Big hands, big tube.
P


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## Jannojj (Apr 2, 2016)

Please put me down for one . I to will need to cost too! [emoji106][emoji868]


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## gunga (Apr 2, 2016)

I'd stick with 18650. Not worth the hassle of different sizes. Maybe after getting established.


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## Thetasigma (Apr 2, 2016)

Fair enough, and I do of course love the superior capacity of 18650's.

I finished #3 today and I believe I just about have the design nailed down to something I am happy with it.
I tried it in brass since I have another project in brass for next weekend.

Numbers 1, 2, and 3 left to right.









Components






















I changed the ring design to 7 rings with a small groove and smaller diameter. The result is a bigger ratio between the ring diameter and OD, which yields a nice comfortable grip in addition to the smaller grooves. I also utilized a 45 degree chamfer on both the bezel and the tail. I also shaved 1/8" off from 5 1/16" to 4 15/16", small difference but it feels right in the hand.


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## mcbrat (Apr 2, 2016)

ohhhh. I like the brass!!!


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## kellyglanzer (Apr 2, 2016)

Sweet! Going to do copper?


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## Tejasandre (Apr 2, 2016)

Looking good. Take my Money. ;p


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## gunga (Apr 2, 2016)

Sweet. Put a clip on it and sell it to me.


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## Tejasandre (Apr 2, 2016)

I'd be really happy with #2


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## gunga (Apr 2, 2016)

I'm good with 7075


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## akhyar (Apr 3, 2016)

That brass is sweeeeeeet!
Put me in for one one you decided to go commercial


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## Thetasigma (Apr 3, 2016)

I thought you might Mick.

Copper is up in the air until I figure out how to get a good surface finish on it. I'm not too keen on experimenting on it just yet as it is about x2 as expensive as brass and about x4 expensive as aluminum.

This one will serve as the blueprint now that I am happy with the design, so the next few will be 7075 since I have 4 feet of the stuff to use up.

Janojj and akhyar, you've been added.


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## mcbrat (Apr 3, 2016)

Hmm. With the conversion pill and a long spring on the driver you could run an 18500...


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## jal (Apr 3, 2016)

Very interested, too.


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## peter yetman (Apr 3, 2016)

gunga said:


> I'm good with 7075




Me too.
P


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## Crazyeddiethefirst (Apr 3, 2016)

Sign me up please, to steal from a McDonald's commercial "I'm loving it"!


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## Jannojj (Apr 3, 2016)

I like polish aluminum one the best , just groves look good too & yes to 18350 . Maybe tap it for a clip would be nice .


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## Thetasigma (Apr 3, 2016)

With a McGizmo clip. I still need to make a jig to accurately drill the holes, but it can be done if marked carefully.


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## gunga (Apr 3, 2016)

Perfect! Though I've usually seen them a bit closer to the tail.


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## Tejasandre (Apr 3, 2016)

Looks awesome!


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## DellSuperman (Apr 4, 2016)

Thetasigma said:


> With a McGizmo clip. I still need to make a jig to accurately drill the holes, but it can be done if marked carefully.


Oh man, i gotta say that brass looks pretty good. No... Awesome! 
And btw, are the threads compatible with a Mac?


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## Thetasigma (Apr 4, 2016)

Yeah, that is due to the 45 degree chamfer, any higher and it would poke through into it. If I use a shallower chamfer I can move the clip upwards, though I like the ease of access the sharper chamfer adds.

I don't have a Mac, and the design required a different head depth, so most likely no.


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## peter yetman (Apr 4, 2016)

Just out of interest, when you made your first post here, did you imagine the feedback it would provoke?
P


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## Thetasigma (Apr 4, 2016)

No, I just hoped some others would appreciate the design.


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## gunga (Apr 4, 2016)

I certainly appreciate it! Great job. I was planning a nice 18650 triple build. This could be ideal.

I was going to use a convoy host but this is just too nice.

I think Okluma uses a shallower chamfer but it still rocks.


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## MAD777 (Apr 4, 2016)

Thetasigma said:


> No, I just hoped some others would appreciate the design.


I have been following intently and very much appreciate the design. Another potential buyer here!


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## ven (Apr 4, 2016)

Very nice, very easy on the eye, the design just flows................nice and smooth without mall ninja heat sinking fins.


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## neutralwhite (Apr 4, 2016)

Add me if its ok.
Im waiting on your copper 18650 to be available.
Paypal ready, just tell me!!!.

thanks


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## andrewmac (Apr 4, 2016)

Wow, this looks quite interesting. Count me in!


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## Thetasigma (Apr 4, 2016)

Thanks guys, you've been added.

Thanks ven, the size is a tricky one to nail down.

Initial lights will mostly be Aluminum, but I would like to do some Copper ones down the road as well.


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## neutralwhite (Apr 5, 2016)

well make sure that road is not tooooo long!. 
Lol.
thanks.



Thetasigma said:


> Thanks guys, you've been added.
> 
> Thanks ven, the size is a tricky one to nail down.
> 
> Initial lights will mostly be Aluminum, but I would like to do some Copper ones down the road as well.


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## Danny70 (Apr 5, 2016)

Please add me in for a copper too. Thanks.


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## neutralwhite (Apr 5, 2016)

Great choice.
im with you on that!.



Danny70 said:


> Please add me in for a copper too. Thanks.


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## neutralwhite (Apr 5, 2016)

What's the size of the o rings ?. 
Thanks.


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## Thetasigma (Apr 5, 2016)

I don't have the size on hand, but they are just common epdm o-rings from a hardware store. Any good store should have a nice selection of them. I'll post the exact size later.


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## Ladd (Apr 5, 2016)

Count me in, pending the delivery terms.


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## neutralwhite (Apr 5, 2016)

Thanks, The reason why I ask, is that I might place some of those blue flourosilicone rings 
instead.



Thetasigma said:


> I don't have the size on hand, but they are just common epdm o-rings from a hardware store. Any good store should have a nice selection of them. I'll post the exact size later.


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## Thetasigma (Apr 6, 2016)

neutralwhite said:


> Thanks, The reason why I ask, is that I might place some of those blue flourosilicone rings
> instead.



Ah, I see. I always did like the royal blue ones.


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## neutralwhite (Apr 6, 2016)

Maybe have those as an option?.



Thetasigma said:


> Ah, I see. I always did like the royal blue ones.


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## Thetasigma (Apr 6, 2016)

neutralwhite said:


> Maybe have those as an option?.



Perhaps, though if I do I'd be tempted to use green HNBR on the brass ones.
Performance wise Aflas is ideal, but the boot is still the limiting factor.


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## neutralwhite (Apr 7, 2016)

Yes , green on brass would be different, and blue with copper would be nice.
i am hoping to catch your copper run.
Thank you for this.




Thetasigma said:


> Perhaps, though if I do I'd be tempted to use green HNBR on the brass ones.
> Performance wise Aflas is ideal, but the boot is still the limiting factor.


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## Slayer1 (Apr 7, 2016)

Add me in too.

S1


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## fizeau (Apr 15, 2016)

Sweeeeeeeeeet!

Count me in!


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## neutralwhite (Apr 15, 2016)

Add me too please bro.
thank you kindly.


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## Thetasigma (Apr 17, 2016)

In the midst of finals here, but a part of the design is in the back of my head.

Regarding the tailswitch what would you guys prefer, the chamfered approach as pictured but with a shallower angle, or a straight well?
The shallower chamfer would be 30-35 degrees instead of 45.
If I did a straight well it would either be slightly chamfered or rounded over.

Regarding o-rings, default material will be black Viton for Aluminum and green Viton for brass lights.
#17- 11/16" x 13/16" x 1/16"
#18- 3/4" x 7/8" x 1/16"


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## gunga (Apr 18, 2016)

I prefer whatever Okluma is using. I assume a smaller chamfer.


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## Thetasigma (Apr 18, 2016)

No other commenters?

Thanks gunga, I'm not sure what angle he uses but it is definitely shallower.


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## kellyglanzer (Apr 18, 2016)

Straight and rounded over is more like MAC did correct?


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## mcbrat (Apr 18, 2016)

kellyglanzer said:


> Straight and rounded over is more like MAC did correct?



yes


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## kellyglanzer (Apr 19, 2016)

Rounded over is my preference. My MACs are still my nicest so far in this style. So refined.


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## oneinthaair (Apr 19, 2016)

kellyglanzer said:


> Rounded over is my preference. My MACs are still my nicest so far in this style. So refined.



100% agree Mac's has the tail end to die for! Not even the Hanko tridents are that nice.


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## gunga (Apr 19, 2016)

So you guys don't like the McGizmo haiku tail? Okluma tails are similar.

I.much prefer this to a Mac tail. More elegant and refined.


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## kellyglanzer (Apr 19, 2016)

It's not that I dislike any of them and yes the Haiku is gorgeous. It would not / has not stopped me from purchasing. I do like both. However if pressed for my preference currently it is the mac tail. Subject to change my ever fickle opinions. Lol. [emoji6]


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## Tejasandre (Apr 19, 2016)

Here are some side by side picks of a Mac & prototype #2 in the wild.


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## kellyglanzer (Apr 19, 2016)

The switch and even the LED seem very deep into the light comparitively to the mac.


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## peter yetman (Apr 19, 2016)

That looks very nice, I'd be happy with that one.
P


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## gunga (Apr 19, 2016)

kellyglanzer said:


> The switch and even the LED seem very deep into the light comparitively to the mac.



Yes. I agree. Seems a tad deep.


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## kellyglanzer (Apr 19, 2016)




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## Tejasandre (Apr 19, 2016)

Tail shots , for you tail lovers.


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## Thetasigma (Apr 19, 2016)

Thanks for the photos guys, they are very helpful.

Regarding the depth of the switch and LED, #2 is the longest of the 3 prototypes to date, but the future ones will be 4 7/8"-5" depending on the final internal specs, so the bezel will be thinner and the switch a little shallower.

Regarding the tail shape, from the photos I am starting to like the rounded end, and I can make one similar using the o-ring fit boot as I have already done. I expect it is easier on the thumb that the chamfer?

The head will remain chamfered, but shallower, somewhere around 30-35 degrees instead of the sharp 45 degrees.
Ignore the o-ring, it is the wrong one, but the shorty is chamfered at 30 degrees vs the 45 on the right.




Size vs 18650,


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## Tejasandre (Apr 19, 2016)

Here's a closeup of the business end.


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## Jannojj (Apr 19, 2016)

Triples look great in aluminum or titanium ! Will there be any trits on this torch ? The pictures look gorgeous has to be able triples


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## Ladd (Apr 19, 2016)

It may be a matter of personal preference, but I like the looks of the rounded tail.


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## gunga (Apr 19, 2016)

Trits are nice but I plan to use a drilled optic for trits. And my glow sticker of course!


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## Jannojj (Apr 19, 2016)

I like that idea of the drilled optic &a glow sticker that is better idea !


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## gunga (Apr 19, 2016)

Yes. Works well.


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## kellyglanzer (Apr 19, 2016)

I will be the odd man out that has no use for trits nor do I particularly even like them. 😨😎


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## write2dgray (Apr 19, 2016)

Macs style tail is my preference. Sooo smooth .


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## az2ak (Apr 19, 2016)

This looks like a great project, also subscribed!

I'd be very interested to get in on a brass if that's possible...


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## Thetasigma (Apr 19, 2016)

No trits, I don't have the setup for it. You could get a drilled optic and load it with trits as gunga suggests though. The glow stickers are nice as well.

I'll have to try both tail styles and see what works best with the design. I'm leaning towards rounding both ends, has a sort of elegance to it.

Added to the list az2ak.


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## gunga (Apr 19, 2016)

That works. I think less material around the ends would look better. Rounded it is! It is, after all, your vision. 

I like a few trits but the optic is much less troublesome and costly vs milling trit slots. Also the glow sticker is a nice compliment and surprisingly bright (especially green).


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## sal415 (Apr 20, 2016)

I really like the design of this and really want either a al or brass 18650 if you get a list I would like to be added and what is the estimated cost?


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## Thetasigma (Apr 20, 2016)

Absolutely, an optic is an easy solution. Also easier to change down the road once the trits fade.

Estimated cost at the moment is $220 for 7075 Aluminum and $255 for 360 Brass. Copper is undecided, but would be higher. Once I have nailed down the design I will post a proper sales thread in the custom sales section.


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## Arcade (Apr 21, 2016)

These are looking great, nice job. With AL and Brass, can you get a duller finish material, or is that something that can be done later (steel wool etc on it?)?


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## Jannojj (Apr 21, 2016)

I like what you have there with trits & glow sticker . Is part of the package of the flashlight?


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## Jannojj (Apr 21, 2016)

I would like to have aluminum one myself $220.00 is not a bad price?


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## Thetasigma (Apr 21, 2016)

Arcade said:


> These are looking great, nice job. With AL and Brass, can you get a duller finish material, or is that something that can be done later (steel wool etc on it?)?



The light is buffed smooth to even out any slight variations in surface cut and remove any slight burrs on the rings and other edges. The light is then sanded with a 1500 grit abrasive pad to give the light a "satin-brushed" look that breaks up the reflective surface left by the buffing.
A coarser surface could certainly be created with some steel wool or a really coarse finish with brillo pad.



Jannojj said:


> I like what you have there with trits & glow sticker . Is part of the package of the flashlight?


Glow stickers would be an extra $5 installed from me, or you could acquire them directly from gunga.
I do not currently have a means to put trits on a light. If you wanted to, I would recommend sourcing a drilled optic.


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## gunga (Apr 21, 2016)

Gonefishing or Okluma can provide drilled optics. Those are my sources.


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## neutralwhite (Apr 21, 2016)

Are there plans for a copper 18650?.


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## Thetasigma (Apr 21, 2016)

neutralwhite said:


> Are there plans for a copper 18650?.



Early lights will be Aluminum or Brass, but yes Copper is planned.


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## neutralwhite (Apr 25, 2016)

Thanks, I'm in for one of those!!.
Thanks.




Thetasigma said:


> Early lights will be Aluminum or Brass, but yes Copper is planned.


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## Thetasigma (Apr 25, 2016)

neutralwhite said:


> Thanks, I'm in for one of those!!.
> Thanks.


Glad to hear it.


I have posted a proper sales thread which I will update with more information and final specs as things are nailed down. 
Due to my discomfort with taking payment ahead of time and concerns with time frames, I have decided to fulfill requests on a reservation basis, as I make the lights. I feel this provides the best balance for both parties. As such you guys don't have to worry about handing money over until a light is ready, and I am less stressed on my end. This should help maintain a semblance of sanity for all involved parties.
As noted anyone who has expressed interest has been recorded, so no worries.
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?418381-Sigma-Customs&p=4886432#post4886432


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## neutralwhite (Apr 26, 2016)

Nice-I'm on the reservation list (15).
how would I know when my number comes up?.
Communication via pm?.

...also is the light built as per stated spec in your new thread, or can it be subject to buyers custom changes such as a flamed clip and so on?.


thank you very much.
these lights are excellent!.

good day.


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## DellSuperman (Apr 26, 2016)

Thetasigma said:


> Due to my discomfort with taking payment ahead of time and concerns with time frames, I have decided to fulfill requests on a reservation basis, as I make the lights. I feel this provides the best balance for both parties.



This is really an awesome manner to deal with your buyers. [emoji106]


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## Thetasigma (Apr 26, 2016)

neutralwhite said:


> Nice-I'm on the reservation list (15).
> how would I know when my number comes up?.
> Communication via pm?.
> 
> ...



Yes, once the light is ready I would contact you, then exchange payment and shipping information.
I'll update the thread to be clearer but the specs would be a standard configuration. You would be able to request a custom setup though it might cost extra depending on the option. I am hoping to source some clips from Jeff and Don to offer for the lights as well. I am looking for a nice set of warm LEDs but haven't found what I am looking for yet since I don't like the weird tints of the warm Cree XP-G2s.
I am hoping to get a setup for stonewashing so I can offer that option in the future.



DellSuperman said:


> This is really an awesome manner to deal with your buyers. [emoji106]


Glad to hear it.


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## neutralwhite (Apr 26, 2016)

I better start emptying my inbox!.



Thetasigma said:


> Yes, once the light is ready I would contact you, then exchange payment and shipping information.
> I'll update the thread to be clearer but the specs would be a standard configuration. You would be able to request a custom setup though it might cost extra depending on the option. I am hoping to source some clips from Jeff and Don to offer for the lights as well. I am looking for a nice set of warm LEDs but haven't found what I am looking for yet since I don't like the weird tints of the warm Cree XP-G2s.
> I am hoping to get a setup for stonewashing so I can offer that option in the future.
> 
> ...


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## Thetasigma (Apr 28, 2016)

#5 in brass with rounded edges




















A line of Copper pills












Did a run of retaining rings as well.





Rounded tails on #5, #2, and a Mac EDC.









Side view, #4, Mac EDC, #5, #2.


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## mcbrat (Apr 28, 2016)

Rounded!!!


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## Thetasigma (Apr 28, 2016)

mcbrat said:


> Rounded!!!



Rounded indeed!
So far I prefer it to the chamfers.


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## akhyar (Apr 28, 2016)

Sweeeeeeet!


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## DellSuperman (Apr 28, 2016)

It definitely looks much better & smoother with the rounded edge! 
I like this design better. 
Thanks for making it happen


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## Ladd (Apr 28, 2016)

Another vote for rounded. Looking forward to this!


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## Tejasandre (Apr 28, 2016)

Looking good!


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## neutralwhite (Apr 28, 2016)

You have my Rounded vote!.


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## oneinthaair (Apr 28, 2016)

Rounded for sure!!!


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## gunga (Apr 28, 2016)

Yeah. I have to agree. The design flows better.


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## neutralwhite (Apr 28, 2016)

I believe The BLF 348 AAA uses a 219b 5000k at around 90cri.




Thetasigma said:


> I am rather partial to the Nichia 219C now, they seem to me to be rather near perfect for a general purpose emitter. Good clean tint at ~5000k with reasonable 80+ CRI, and the low forward voltage makes them easier to drive in combo with good output. The only way they could get better is 90+ CRI with similar performance. Only thing that I've read that you might have an issue with is that the 219C will rather happily gobble up more amps than one should reasonably feed it. Might be less of an issue with the parallel array though.


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## Thetasigma (Apr 28, 2016)

Glad to see everyone likes the rounded edges.




neutralwhite said:


> I believe The BLF 348 AAA uses a 219b 5000k at around 90cri.


219Bs are nice but they aren't quite as efficient in a one cell setup due to the higher forward voltage and lower output. 219C's also have a cleaner white tint despite the slightly lower CRI so it makes up for the CRI difference in an EDC light.


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## Jannojj (Apr 28, 2016)

Wowzer they look great. just marveless[emoji1364][emoji1303][emoji851]


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## vinte77 (Apr 29, 2016)

Another vote for rounded!


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## neutralwhite (May 1, 2016)

this is all such a good looking light outta nowhere!.


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## Thetasigma (May 1, 2016)

Thanks guys, the idea has been kicking around in my head since I discovered the Macs and that I couldn't buy one. Just the last two months it has become possible for them to become reality.

I'm considering the design and logistics for the copper body, would everyone be fine with changing the diameter from 25.4mm (1 inch) to 25mm (slightly under 1 inch)?


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## write2dgray (May 1, 2016)

Sounds good to me .


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## neutralwhite (May 1, 2016)

The size change is fine to me.
would be good to see what design you have for the copper.

thanks.


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## nfetterly (May 1, 2016)

Another "Rounded" - when I saw it it was a no-brainer. 

A little smaller diameter is fine with me.


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## oneinthaair (May 1, 2016)

Smaller the better! Easier pocket carry!


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## neutralwhite (May 1, 2016)

+1 right there!.



oneinthaair said:


> Smaller the better! Easier pocket carry!


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## kitman22 (May 2, 2016)

Rounded edges just upped this to another level of finish.
Fantastic work!


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## neutralwhite (May 2, 2016)

excellent work.
i wish sigma best luck on this fast moving exciting build project.



kitman22 said:


> Rounded edges just upped this to another level of finish.
> Fantastic work!


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## Tejasandre (May 2, 2016)

With mcgizmo clip.


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## neutralwhite (May 2, 2016)

Very nice clip and fit indeed.





Tejasandre said:


> With mcgizmo clip.


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## neutralwhite (May 2, 2016)

how many lumens would this light put out ?.
any idea of the lux?.

thanks.


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## Thetasigma (May 2, 2016)

Good to hear, that should allow me to make the Copper out of 1" rod which should allow to offer it at a slightly lower price than I was originally anticipating depending on how well my lathe cuts it.

Glad to see #2 made it back to Texas alright. I won't be able to offer McGizmo clips directly from me since Don declined to supply them, but I could mount them for those that are interested.

Being that this is a triple, lux will be lower than a reflector since the output is diffused by the optic.
I can only offer conservative estimates based on the spec sheet and the 3.04 amp current, which by my possibly incorrect math would be 850-900 lumens with a D280 binned 219C.


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## Tejasandre (May 2, 2016)

The rounded tail feels & looks awesome. Thanks thetasigma!


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## recDNA (May 2, 2016)

This is too good now. If you sell them I know I cannot afford them. Don't worry though. They will sell out in 5 minutes. I will grieve.


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## Jannojj (May 2, 2016)

Hello , help is needed I would like a clip added to my flashlight and I can't wait to get it .


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## Tejasandre (May 3, 2016)

How about some beam shots? 219c triple. Wall shots: 6-7 ft (iPhone)
Low




Med




High




Turbo




Color rendition oak tree




Distance - 70 ish feet mesquite tree




Color dog - medium


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## Tejasandre (May 3, 2016)

Mesquite shot wasn't great , here's a 50 footer with the house lights off


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## Espionage Studio (May 8, 2016)

I've wanted an 18650 Tri EDC for a long time, cool looking light. I might be in the minority, I would like to see one with a shorter bezel. Give me an 18650 body with a Tri EDC head on it with a McGizmo clip and that is my dream light! I will be following this thread with interest.


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## neutralwhite (May 8, 2016)

Sigma is very close to that!.



Espionage Studio said:


> I've wanted an 18650 Tri EDC for a long time, cool looking light. I might be in the minority, I would like to see one with a shorter bezel. Give me an 18650 body with a Tri EDC head on it with a McGizmo clip and that is my dream light! I will be following this thread with interest.


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## neutralwhite (May 8, 2016)

Sigma is very close to that!.



Espionage Studio said:


> I've wanted an 18650 Tri EDC for a long time, cool looking light. I might be in the minority, I would like to see one with a shorter bezel. Give me an 18650 body with a Tri EDC head on it with a McGizmo clip and that is my dream light! I will be following this thread with interest.


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## mcbrat (May 8, 2016)

He was trying, but the limitations for some things on a mini lathe limited how long the body could be.


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## Espionage Studio (May 8, 2016)

That makes perfect sense, thanks for explaining mcbrat. Awesome light, congrats to those getting one.


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## Thetasigma (May 8, 2016)

Espionage Studio said:


> I've wanted an 18650 Tri EDC for a long time, cool looking light. I might be in the minority, I would like to see one with a shorter bezel. Give me an 18650 body with a Tri EDC head on it with a McGizmo clip and that is my dream light! I will be following this thread with interest.



With a shorter head? The head length on these is a balance of aesthetics as well as limitations of my machine, since the body is already as long as I can make it and still bore it out. One that is directly compatible with a Mac Tri-EDC would require a slightly longer body. I personally like the looks of the converted EDC's since they have the longer heads, which coincidentally, is about how long the heads on these are.
Thanks for the interest!


I haven't gotten as much done this week as I would like, however I did get a copper one made. Trickier to bore and get a decent surface finish on, but it did thread and form cut decent.


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## Ladd (May 8, 2016)

Nice. 

Well, that makes it hard to choose which one......


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## Ladd (May 8, 2016)

I wonder what the weight difference is between copper and brass?


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## Tejasandre (May 8, 2016)

Looking very very nice


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## neutralwhite (May 8, 2016)

It's gotta be copper !


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## Thetasigma (May 8, 2016)

Ladd said:


> I wonder what the weight difference is between copper and brass?



Good question, I'll have to empty all three hosts and see what the raw weights are.

Material wise, brass is my personal favorite. Nice golden sheen when polished and a unique slow patina, only slightly less thermal conductivity than 7075 AL, superior electrical conductivity (qlite moonlight mode is actually brighter in a brass host), and a heft in the hand that has to be held to be appreciated. Copper certainly has a unique quality to it and has performance benefits, not to mention a drastic patina that some like. Aluminum is my least favorite, just doesn't do it for me, however as a material it is a good choice of price, weight, performance, and raw strength, though it shows scratches poorly since it has no real patina to blend them in, though a fine stonewash can work wonders.


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## Ladd (May 8, 2016)

Well said! The man is a poet as well as a machinist


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## neutralwhite (May 9, 2016)

Explained even better than Shakespeare!.
its great to get feedback from the maker.




Ladd said:


> Well said! The man is a poet as well as a machinist


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## Thetasigma (May 10, 2016)

Thanks guys. Here is a picture of the same three with Okluma clips mounted.
So far, the hardest thing post-maching is keeping the surface free of stray scratches while fitting and assembling them.


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## oneinthaair (May 10, 2016)

Thetasigma said:


> Thanks guys. Here is a picture of the same three with Okluma clips mounted.
> So far, the hardest thing post-maching is keeping the surface free of stray scratches while fitting and assembling them.



Wow Devin! These are amazing! Can't wait to get my grubby hands on one!


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## Thetasigma (May 10, 2016)

oneinthaair said:


> Wow Devin! These are amazing! Can't wait to get my grubby hands on one!


Well the copper on the left is your's, just waiting on the glow stickers now.


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## Tejasandre (May 10, 2016)

These are definitely gonna be a big hit.


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## neutralwhite (May 11, 2016)

+1.
i highly agree.
keep them coming if you can.



Tejasandre said:


> These are definitely gonna be a big hit.


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## George7806 (May 12, 2016)

Great looking lights, nice work!


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## ven (May 12, 2016)

Stunning , awesome work there


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## neutralwhite (May 12, 2016)

That copper is wow!. 



ven said:


> Stunning , awesome work there


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## Tejasandre (May 14, 2016)

Hey @thetasigma, where can I find the programming information? Accidentally found programming mode & set to an undesirable mode.


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## recDNA (May 14, 2016)

I bet you will always be able to sell these faster than you can build them if you can take the aggravation.


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## DellSuperman (May 14, 2016)

Tejasandre said:


> Hey @thetasigma, where can I find the programming information? Accidentally found programming mode & set to an undesirable mode.


U might wanna try this page.. 

http://drjones.nerdcamp.net/#guppy2


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## Tejasandre (May 14, 2016)

DellSuperman said:


> U might wanna try this page..
> 
> http://drjones.nerdcamp.net/#guppy2



Thanks dell


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## Thetasigma (May 14, 2016)

H17F: http://drjones.nerdcamp.net/h17f.html

The Qlite is flashed with guppydrv univeral. Per Mountain Elecontronic's website,
This firmware allows the ultimate in user customizability, with *22* built-in mode groups, that the user can select via a series of button presses and a user programmable turbo timer (see below for instructions). 
 
User Selectable Groups:


2% - 25% - 100% | Memory
100% - 25% - 2% | No Memory
2% - 25% - 100% - Strobe - Beacon | Memory
2% - 25% - 100% - Strobe - Beacon | No Memory
15% - 100% | Memory
100% - 15% | No Memory
100% Only
100% - Strobe | No Memory
Strobe - 100% | No Memory
ML - 5% - 33% - 100% | Memory
100% - 33% - 5% - ML | No Memory
ML - 5% - 33% - 100% - Strobe - Beacon | Memory
ML - 5% - 33% - 100% - Strobe - Beacon | No Memory
ML - 100% | No Memory
100% - ML | No Memory
ML - 100% | Memory
ML - 5% - 15% - 50% - 100% | Memory
ML - 5% - 15% - 50% - 100% | No Memory
100% - 50% - 15% - 5% - ML | Memory
100% - 50% - 15% - 5% - ML | No Memory
2% - 15% - 50% - 100% | Memory
2% - 15% - 50% - 100% | No Memory
*Guppydrv ​Instructions*
*To switch mode groups:* rapidly tap the switch 8 times, the light will then enter the programming mode and begin to flash. With the light in programming mode, tap the switch the same number of times as your desired mode group. The light will blink and your mode group will be memorized. 
 
Example: To select mode group 3, tap the switch 8 times quickly to enter programming mode. As soon as the light enters programming mode and starts flashing, tap the switch three times (for group 3). The light will blink to recognize the mode group change.
 
*To set the turbo timer:* rapidly tap the switch 8 times, the light will then enter the programming mode and begin to flash. With the light in programming mode, tap the switch 30 times to enter the turbo timer set mode. The light will then switch to 100% power. When the light is at the desired temperature for the turbo step down, turn the light off. The turbo timer will then be set. *Turbo timer drops down to 50% output.*
 
*To lock the mode groups: *Solder Star 2 to ground. The other stars have no function with this firmware.


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## Tejasandre (May 14, 2016)

Thetasigma said:


> H17F: http://drjones.nerdcamp.net/h17f.html
> 
> The Qlite is flashed with guppydrv univeral. Per Mountain Elecontronic's website,
> This firmware allows the ultimate in user customizability, with *22* built-in mode groups, that the user can select via a series of button presses and a user programmable turbo timer (see below for instructions).
> ...



Thank you sir.


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## Espionage Studio (May 24, 2016)

I realize some like the look of the longer head, I've heard others say they preferred the converted triples as well. I understand now that's it's a limitation of your machine, and a bit of your aesthetic preference. Regardless, those are perty!


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## Espionage Studio (May 24, 2016)

That being said, I'd love an 18650 body to pair with my Mac Tri head (Ti) ;-)


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## mcbrat (May 24, 2016)

the shop I'm working with on the retaining rings, and pills, Drew up extensions, but with them, or a 2x13500 body like mac's is the threads were inconsistent (especially with Ti) over the years... So to risky cost wise to make Lego parts..


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## jdboy (May 28, 2016)

gunga said:


> Nice...
> 
> I'll be ordering parts for the build in the coming weeks. I need a worthy host for the wicked H17F circuit I want to try. I may use 219C for good tint and nice output.





Thetasigma said:


> I am rather partial to the Nichia 219C now, they seem to me to be rather near perfect for a general purpose emitter. Good clean tint at ~5000k with reasonable 80+ CRI, and the low forward voltage makes them easier to drive in combo with good output. The only way they could get better is 90+ CRI with similar performance. Only thing that I've read that you might have an issue with is that the 219C will rather happily gobble up more amps than one should reasonably feed it. Might be less of an issue with the parallel array though.



Is this something we need to keep in mind when programming the H17F driver?


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## Thetasigma (May 28, 2016)

jdboy said:


> Is this something we need to keep in mind when programming the H17F driver?



Main concern in my hosts would be the McClicky switch, which is rated for 5A max I believe, so with a Nichia 219C array and the correct battery you could easily exceed that and fry the switch on modes 23 and 24.
Modes 1-22 should be just fine though.


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## jdboy (May 28, 2016)

Thetasigma said:


> Main concern in my hosts would be the McClicky switch, which is rated for 5A max I believe, so with a Nichia 219C array and the correct battery you could easily exceed that and fry the switch on modes 23 and 24.
> Modes 1-22 should be just fine though.



This is exactly the information I needed to know. So program responsibly or invest in spare switches. Can't wait to get my hands on one of these. Thanks again!


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## Thetasigma (May 28, 2016)

jdboy said:


> This is exactly the information I needed to know. So program responsibly or invest in spare switches. Can't wait to get my hands on one of these. Thanks again!



Yep, I have accidentally hit 23 and 24 with my prototype shorty however that is with an AW 18350 which may not have provided enough current in the moment to fry the switch, since it was just on the mode selection as it flicked through. With an MJ1 though it might provide enough current in the short timespan to do damage to the switch.
The default settings are quite nice for the H17F other than perhaps setting a lower first mode and changing the memory type, both of which are fairly simple.


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## jdboy (May 28, 2016)

Thetasigma said:


> Yep, I have accidentally hit 23 and 24 with my prototype shorty however that is with an AW 18350 which may not have provided enough current in the moment to fry the switch, since it was just on the mode selection as it flicked through. With an MJ1 though it might provide enough current in the short timespan to do damage to the switch.
> The default settings are quite nice for the H17F other than perhaps setting a lower first mode and changing the memory type, both of which are fairly simple.



Good to hear as these would probably be my only changes. I like a really low firefly/moonlight mode and the Short-Cycle Memory sounds the same or similar to that of the hybrid memory I'm running with my Oveready V5 and on the Icarus Alpha light.


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## neutralwhite (Jun 7, 2016)

How's the drop/shock resistance on these lights?. 
The reason i ask this is I have a sinner 18650 old version and it landed on its head-onto wood flooring from waist height, and it's seems it's knocked something wrong as the light doesn't function as it did such as clicking on / off from mode to mode, it stays on even if I click it off and sometimes flickers. 

The battery also took a direct hit too and the top metal part has kind of dented inwards.


Thanks


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## Tejasandre (Jun 7, 2016)

Thetasigma said:


> Yep, I have accidentally hit 23 and 24 with my prototype shorty however that is with an AW 18350 which may not have provided enough current in the moment to fry the switch, since it was just on the mode selection as it flicked through. With an MJ1 though it might provide enough current in the short timespan to do damage to the switch.
> The default settings are quite nice for the H17F other than perhaps setting a lower first mode and changing the memory type, both of which are fairly simple.



You gonna run shorties in the next run?


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## Thetasigma (Jun 7, 2016)

Tejasandre said:


> You gonna run shorties in the next run?



I would like to, I like to EDC the 18350 format, and 18650s for work lights. May do a lotto/ready to ship setup for lights after this run, not sure yet.


neutralwhite said:


> How's the drop/shock resistance on these lights?.
> The reason i ask this is I have a sinner 18650 old version and it landed on its head-onto wood flooring from waist height, and it's seems it's knocked something wrong as the light doesn't function as it did such as clicking on / off from mode to mode, it stays on even if I click it off and sometimes flickers.
> 
> The battery also took a direct hit too and the top metal part has kind of dented inwards.
> ...



The lights aren't rated, and while the hosts should do fine for EDC use, the main concern would be dislodging any of the solder connections, or denting the battery and causing an internal short. Even with double springs there is potential for battery damage with a hard enough impact. Other potential issues would be disrupting the ground connection on the pill, or dislodging the McClicky switch which would require re-tightening.
On the Sinner, it sounds like the switch connection is being bypassed, might be worth taking the tail apart and seeing if you can find the problem with the switch. If I remember correctly, the switch has two tabs, and there is a delrin ring for isolating the switch and negative post.


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