# Am I reading this correct? Surefire G2 LED??? Can someone confirm?



## Marion David Poff (Jul 22, 2007)

Howdy,

It looks like Surefire is coming out with a G2 LED light.... I have only seen these at KnifeCenter...

http://www.knifecenter.com/kc_new/store_detail.html?s=SFG2LBK


But, if so that is cool....

Million Dollar Questions... Is it just a different lamp? If so, what lamp is it? Cause then I will load it in my G2Z....

Thanks,
Marion


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## rookie (Jul 22, 2007)

Yes, Matt at BatteryJunction mentioned it earlier. It appears the LED is going to be a SSC, not a Cree. Also, Surefire is coming out w/ a 6P, also w/ the SSC.

It's also suppose to come out on the first week of August.


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## NA8 (Jul 22, 2007)

Interesting specs, but how reliable ?

SFG2L

http://www.knifecenter.com/kc_new/store_detail.html?s=SFG2LBK

Max Output: 80 lumens
Runtime: 12 hours 

compared to a Fenix P3D CE 

40 lumens (13 hrs), 90 lumens (4.8 hrs)


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## Erzengel (Jul 22, 2007)

How does the Surefire regulation circuit work? The Fenix is designed to deliver a constant output for nearly the complete runtime. This is a huge stress for the battery.


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## yaesumofo (Jul 22, 2007)

I am definition ALL IN for one of the 6P versions of the new SureFire lights.
In terns of value for money? SureFire has a great market share in the LEO equipment must haves. I rarely see a police officer without a 6P.
That said these are drop in replacements for those end users. The advantages are obvious. Keep in mind that the target market for these lights are truly professional users. They EDC these every day. The 6P Is extremely reliable. as such it has developed a Great reputation.
So it would be natural for them to retire their old 6P and replace it with one of the new lights form SureFire.
My first "real" flashlight was a green 6P from laserdevices (I think) I still own it.
All that said I have a feeling that this light will be a fine and very cost effective addition to m collection.
It might even replace my 6P on my work belt.
I really like the 2 cell form factor.
As of late I have noticed that many manufactures have gone to a slimmer 2 cell body. They aren't nearly as robust as the thicker walled 6P and 27lt type of light.
The heavy duty 6P really is extremely durable. I am quite sure the G2 version will also be extremely strong and able to take a whole bunch of abuse.
At somewhere between $50 and $60 these new lights represent a great deal. Knowing SureFire they will have put a lot of effort to make the beam as perfect as possible.
To me this is much more exciting than the smaller Surefire lights with Cree/Seoul emitters.
I wonder if SF will sell a turbo head for these?
I have a 6P which I added a turbohead and extension making it a 9P with the turbo head Man what a light. I hope we will be able to play surefire legos with these!!
Count me IN.
Yaesumofo


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## Size15's (Jul 22, 2007)

Both the 6PL and G2L use the same P60L LED Lamp Assembly featuring a SSC LED in a reflector.
As for the specs, I feel that we should wait to see the output/runtime charts people do for these as SureFire's runtime rating is the total runtime rather than the runtime to 50% that CPFers are normally more interested in.


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## cosine (Aug 1, 2007)

*G2 incan versus G2 LED*

Had anyone compared the two?


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## Valpo Hawkeye (Aug 1, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*

No, since the G2L isn't out and likely won't be for several weeks if not months.


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## cosine (Aug 1, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*



Valpo Hawkeye said:


> No, since the G2L isn't out and likely won't be for several weeks if not months.



Darn. I saw it on Surefire's site, and thought it would have been available.

Thanks for letting me know.


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## Valpo Hawkeye (Aug 1, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*



cosine said:


> Darn. I saw it on Surefire's site, and thought it would have been available.



Good eye, I hadn't even noticed that they were up on the SF site. What's wierd is the 6PL is listed at 11 hours, the G2L at 12 hours. I'd have to imagine they use the same LA if they're anything like their incan counterparts.


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## jbosman1013 (Aug 1, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*

if you noticed it said 11 hours of useful light levels. I tried going to their web site yesterday and it was down, i had a feeling something new was going to be there.


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## Pax et Lux (Aug 2, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*

Does anyone know when the G2L will start shipping?

There must be some dealers here, or people that otherwise have contact with Surefire reps.


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## TxTroubleMaker (Aug 2, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*

Which LED are they running in these??? Is it a Lux or Cree???


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## lightr07 (Aug 2, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*



Pax et Lux said:


> Does anyone know when the G2L will start shipping?
> 
> There must be some dealers here, or people that otherwise have contact with Surefire reps.



It should be shipping to dealers as i speak. And then dealers should begin shipping out pre-orders when they get them.

"Lux or Cree?"

I don't know yet. I would probably say Lux but it would be a pleasant surprise if it was Cree.


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## jbviau (Aug 2, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*

In other threads I've read that the G2L and 6PL have Seoul emitters.


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## filibuster (Aug 2, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*

OpticsHQ is having a pre-order for the G2L and 6PL on a thread over on cpfmarketplace.com

http://www.cpfmarketplace.com/mp/showthread.php?t=167585

He said " The *6PL-BK*, *G2L-BK*, and *G2L-YL* are *ALMOST* here. As of today (July 25), they are scheduled to ship either last week of this month or first week of August (which means we should have them next week or so)!"


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## Pax et Lux (Aug 2, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*

Latest entry - today - in the above marketplace thread:

"These have been shipped from SF yesterday and will be in our warehouse tomorrow!!!"

Expect first reviews then for the weekend!

EDIT: Filibuster - Thanks for the above link. I was unaware of this thread, so you've saved me a lot of searching.


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## Valpo Hawkeye (Aug 2, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*

Awesome. I had no idea they were this close to being out. My concern in deciding between the two is the heat-sinking of the G2 since it has the nitrolon body. Anyone have any ideas?


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## jbosman1013 (Aug 2, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*



TxTroubleMaker said:


> Which LED are they running in these??? Is it a Lux or Cree???


 

I heard it was a seoul


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## Lighthouse one (Aug 2, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*

I put my own drop in...with a cree...sold by DX and others. I haven't run it for more than 20 minutes...gets warm.....it's my favorite small light. I'm sure the Surefire version will be even better than a drop in, but it's very good like this. MY drop in is not extremely powerful- which is probably better- since the light body won't conduct heat as well.


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## Illum (Aug 2, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*

General spec sheets
http://rapidshare.com/files/39714221/6PL.pdf.html

http://rapidshare.com/files/39714439/G2L.pdf.html

Most likely its going to be CREE based....as with the ExL series





I wonder if they are going to sell the lamps... 
P60L-WH...which may suggest they might use different colors

SOURCE: http://www.shoudian.com/dispbbs.php?boardid=9&id=35546&page=1


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## Wolfhound 9K (Aug 2, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*

hmm... SureFire rates their L5 at around 100 lumens, Doug's Flashlight Reviews site shows Fenix's L2D-CE beating out SF's L5 on "high" (not even turbo), and SureFire rates their new P60L lamp assembly at only around 80 lumens??

I'm not impressed by this new offering at all.. if I'm going to have a utility light it will be something much more practical and versatile than a single stage weak(er) LED sucking up my beloved 123as. Perhaps some beamshots and rave reviews this weekend will change that though


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## wjf2000 (Aug 2, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*

The run time sounds good but the output seems alittle on the low side (80 lumens). Wolf eyes claims a 170 lumens on high with their lamp. With similar run time and two other output levels plus tactical strobe. www.pts-flashlights.com/products/product.aspx?pid=6356&tb1


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## Valpo Hawkeye (Aug 2, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*



wjf2000 said:


> The run time sounds good but the output seems alittle on the low side (80 lumens). Wolf eyes claims a 170 lumens on high with their lamp. With similar run time and two other output levels plus tactical strobe. www.pts-flashlights.com/products/product.aspx?pid=6356&tb1



SureFire always understates their output, as opposed to other manufacturers who overstate.


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## h2xblive (Aug 3, 2007)

And why would the 6P LED have a rating of 80 lumens at 11 hours while the G2 LED is rated at 80 lumens, but 12 hours?


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## jsr (Aug 3, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*

Wolf-Eyes uses Bulb Lumens in their claims.

The G2L and 6PL use SSCs.


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## Mr Ted Bear (Aug 3, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*

The reason the G2L has a longer run time than the 6pL, is because the LED module has a thermal sensor. The nitrolon G2 is not as efficient as the aluminum 6p in thermal management so the sensor kicks in reducing the output, and extending the run time.


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## Mr Ted Bear (Aug 3, 2007)

Because the led module has a thermal sensor. The nitrolon body is not as efficient as the aluminum body in terms of thermal management. When the module reaches a certain termperture, the sensor cuts the current to reduce the temperature, and extending the run time.


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## lightr07 (Aug 3, 2007)

Marion David Poff said:


> Howdy,
> 
> It looks like Surefire is coming out with a G2 LED light.... I have only seen these at KnifeCenter...
> 
> ...



One thing to remember. If you can wait a few months that i would wait until Just the P60L module is released. You could buy a G2L, Take out the module then put the module in your G2Z and then sell the G2 body or use if for parts. (The P60L is a P60 LA only with a SSC LED in it)

Here is a pic for those of you who like pics:
(Picture credit to Illum_the_nation)


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## Pax et Lux (Aug 3, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*



Mr Ted Bear said:


> The reason the G2L has a longer run time than the 6pL, is because the LED module has a thermal sensor. The nitrolon G2 is not as efficient as the aluminum 6p in thermal management so the sensor kicks in reducing the output, and extending the run time.


 
Ah, it's obvious now someone explains it to me (there I was thinking the difference was some sort of typo on Surefire's behalf - doh!)

Let me wade in and say I don't think 80 lumens is pitiful. Personally, I'd rather have the runtime - even if it resulted in slightly less light. IMO a plastic bodied light is a utility light, and would rather have a tougher, dependable light than something that might not work again if I dropped it on the floor.

EDIT: I did not mean to imply that Wolf Eyes lights or modules would fail if dropped, as, from what I've read they are every bit as tough as Surefire. I was thinking more of reports I've seen of other makes.


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## WildChild (Aug 3, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*

I still got the Cree E2L even if it's only 45 lumens! It only looks as bright as my L0D-CE on high with NiMH (ceiling bounce test - and I think the L0D-CE has been tested around 45 lumens by flashlightreviews.com) but the 9h flat regulation is impressing! I also have bright lights (L2D-CE/Maglite 2D Cree modded driven at 1A) and I'm waiting for another (Wolf-Eyes Defender II 170 lumens) but brighter is not always better. 

My guess is that the G2L and 6PL will run under flat regulation for maybe 4-5h, then diminishing till 11-12h based on the E2L 9h flat regulation then diminishing (16h total advertized runtime).


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## Size15's (Aug 3, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*

Remember that the P60L is the LED version of the P60 so the output is going to be similar - it so happens that doing this results in much longer runtime.
Feedback to SureFire tells them that users want longer runtime - not higher output so the LED versions of the 6P and G2 do exactly what the market want.

If SureFire wanted to making a higher output version then perhaps they'd have called it the P61L. Perhaps SureFire are not as aware of customer demand for a higher output version?

Al


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## MattK (Aug 3, 2007)

FYI - 6PL's and G2L's should be in stock around next Wednesday.


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## jlomein (Aug 3, 2007)

I haven't been keeping up with the P60L news, has there been any talk about Protected 3.7V Li-Ion cells being compatible?


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## dmz (Aug 3, 2007)

Does it have a clickie?


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## bigfoot (Aug 3, 2007)

Surefire 6P LED offered at TAD Gear:

http://tadgear.com/x-treme gear/flashlights main/surefire_6p_led.htm


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## bhartke (Aug 4, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*

I just received my g2 led from LAPolice gear. I also have a standard g2. Led version uses the seoul led ( note I had to call surefire to verify this, as many had mentioned it had the cree) and produces 80 lumens ( per surefire). I have not tested them but have found the led model to be very bright with quite a "hot spot" in the center. Not as flooding as the incan. Thats all to report as I just got it today  I still like them both!


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## flash_bang (Aug 4, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*



Size15's said:


> Remember that the P60L is the LED version of the P60 so the output is going to be similar - it so happens that doing this results in much longer runtime.
> Feedback to SureFire tells them that users want longer runtime - not higher output so the LED versions of the 6P and G2 do exactly what the market want.
> 
> If SureFire wanted to making a higher output version then perhaps they'd have called it the P61L. Perhaps SureFire are not as aware of customer demand for a higher output version?
> ...


will there be a P60L drop in for those who have incans and want to switch? 
thanks,
Flash


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## Size15's (Aug 4, 2007)

dmz said:


> Does it have a clickie?


No.
The 'L' versions of the standard lights are simply LED versions of the standard lights - 
The G2L is a G2 with a P60L instead of a P60.
The 6PL is a 6P with a P60L instead of a P60.


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## Size15's (Aug 4, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*



flash_bang said:


> will there be a P60L drop in for those who have incans and want to switch?
> thanks,
> Flash


In time I have no doubt but remember that SureFire likes to release whole flashlights first before releasing new components as accessories so I would suggest getting a G2L unless you are in no rush and can wait for an unknown length of time.

Al


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## Phaserburn (Aug 4, 2007)

G2L price?


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## rookie (Aug 4, 2007)

Phaserburn said:


> G2L price?



$65 for the G2L and $85 for the 6PL :thumbsup:


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## Neil (Aug 4, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*

Does anyone have any information on rechargeable options for this, an the 6pL yet? If we were able to use rechargeable, this would be a big incentive for me to buy this great new light!


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## Illum (Aug 4, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*



Neil said:


> Does anyone have any information on rechargeable options for this, an the 6pL yet? If we were able to use rechargeable, this would be a big incentive for me to buy this great new light!



we don't know much about it...but no matter how throughly constructed it may be...theres always the possibility of modding it to fit rechargeable


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## dmz (Aug 6, 2007)

Too bad it does not have the new G3 bezel and a clickie but it will be a great light.

How will the Surefire G2 LED SSC LED compare to cree drop ins?

Are there any knoll clickie switches that you can drop in the nitrolon twistie tailcap?


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## Size15's (Aug 6, 2007)

dmz said:


> Too bad it does not have the new G3 bezel and a clickie but it will be a great light.


I'd rather have the more durable Lexan polycarbonate window of the G2 to the Pyrex glass window of the G2Z (& G3). Sure Lexan scratches but I've never seen one cracked or broken.


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## jumpstat (Aug 6, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*

Well at least its by surefire. Shouldn't be any fit or contact issues like using 3rd party drop ins. As it is the G2 is a nice general utility light being an incan but now with led it would be better as it minimizes maintenance. Only thing is the price from surefire.........

Hope it can run on single 17670 fully regulated.......


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## KeyGrip (Aug 6, 2007)

dmz said:


> Does it have a clickie?


Doesn't the 6P Defender have a clicky? You could just post a WTB for the Defender's switch.


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## Size15's (Aug 6, 2007)

KeyGrip said:


> Doesn't the 6P Defender have a clicky? You could just post a WTB for the Defender's switch.


The 6PD has the Z59 Clickie TailCap.


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## cosine (Aug 6, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*

Has anyone else here besides bhartke gotten their G2 Led yet, and has anyone put together the good stuff; i.e., beamshots, runtime graphs?


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## NickDrak (Aug 7, 2007)

*Here is a post from another forum with some additional info on the P60L lamp:*

_"The P60L was conceived by Surefire's Advanced Research & Development department in an effort to enable owners of Surefire handheld and weapon lights with a 1.25" bezel diameter to upgrade to the latest LED technology. The drop in module utilizes the Seoul Semiconductor LED which is the CREE die packaged in the SSI optic. The circuitry is thermally regulated and the reflector is machined aluminum with a light stipple coating. The P60L will be formally introduced on August 8, 2007 in the aluminum 6P LED and nitrolon G2 LED. The advantages over incandescent lamps are higher peak output, longer runtime, a more gradual drop off in output and no filament bulb to burn out or break. The target introduction date for the P60L is November, 2007 and it will retail for $36.00.

When handling the P60L, care must be taken to keep sharp objects, oil and particulate matter away from the surface of the LED since foreign materials in the open reflector design could adversly affect the beam quality. The beam was designed to provide a slightly diffused hot center with a large peripheral. The P60L can be used with either the Surefire 6 volt or 9 volt systems. It is one of the first of a new generation of LED products that will include even higher output derivatives."

*Charles Koomruian, Jr.
General Manager, Advanced R&D
Surefire, LLC*_


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## MattK (Aug 7, 2007)

6PL-BK, G2L-BK and G2L-YL all arrived today and are listed.


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## cave dave (Aug 7, 2007)

That SSC gummy dome is going to attract dust like crazy. 

I wonder why they didn't use more metal in the lamp assembly. They should try to get as much contact with the body as possible.


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## jlomein (Aug 7, 2007)

NickDrak said:


> The P60L can be used with either the Surefire 6 volt or 9 volt systems.



Sounds like two 3.7v RCR123 rechargable cells should work!


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## NickDrak (Aug 7, 2007)

jlomein said:


> Sounds like two 3.7v RCR123 rechargable cells should work!


 
Im psyched about dropping one in a 3xCR123 9P


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## Size15's (Aug 7, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*

There are quite a few threads on SureFire's new P60L products at the moment. I am not sure whether to combine them...

Anyway, it seems that the P60L LED Module will have a 'peak' output of 80 lumens when used 'momentarily' / briefly.
Due to thermal regulation considerations - constant-on the output is better described as approximately 65 lumens regulated for 3 hours in the G2, or approximately 75 lumens regulated for 2 hours in the 6P. The output will then decrease considerably for another 9 hours or so of usable light.

I would like to see this tested by a number of CPF members output/runtime charts.


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## lightr07 (Aug 7, 2007)

NickDrak said:


> *Here is a post from another forum with some additional info on the P60L lamp:*
> 
> _"The P60L was conceived by Surefire's Advanced Research & Development department in an effort to enable owners of Surefire handheld and weapon lights with a 1.25" bezel diameter to upgrade to the latest LED technology. The drop in module utilizes the Seoul Semiconductor LED which is the CREE die packaged in the SSI optic. The circuitry is thermally regulated and the reflector is machined aluminum with a light stipple coating. The P60L will be formally introduced on August 8, 2007 in the aluminum 6P LED and nitrolon G2 LED. The advantages over incandescent lamps are higher peak output, longer runtime, a more gradual drop off in output and no filament bulb to burn out or break. The target introduction date for the P60L is November, 2007 and it will retail for $36.00.
> 
> ...


Aaaaah. My birthday is in November. So now i'll be getting a L2 or L4 AND A G2 AND a P60L. That actually sounds like a pretty good birthday combo to me! Maybe a Fenix too. :twothumbs (Can you send me a link if that was posted on a forum?)


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## Size15's (Aug 7, 2007)

It seems that the P60L LED Module will have a 'peak' output of 80 lumens when used 'momentarily' / briefly.
Due to thermal regulation considerations - constant-on the output is better described as approximately 65 lumens regulated for 3 hours in the G2, or approximately 75 lumens regulated for 2 hours in the 6P. The output will then decrease considerably for another 9 hours or so of usable light.

I would like to see this tested by a number of CPF members output/runtime charts.


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## geepondy (Aug 7, 2007)

The G2L is looking like an excellent choice for my next car light. 

-Non metal so won't be cold in the wintertime nor possibly conduct electricity if somehow dropped in a sensitive engine area.

-A decent runtime and it looks like gradually declining light rather then a sudden shutoff. I don't like my emergency lights to suddenly shut off on me like so many regulated lights do.

-Surefire reliability and a relatively speaking affordable price. I might go six months without using this light but might need it on a -20 degree F night so I want it to work when I need it.

-And I'm hoping a broader, more flood beam then my current car light, a Streamlight Polypro Lux.

Am really looking forward to seeing some reviews. I've been caught up in the Fenix/affordable LED craze and my last Surefire purchase was an original Lux 1 KL1 which still sits on my E1L body so I'm looking forward to buying another Surefire.

-


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## cue003 (Aug 7, 2007)

Even at 75 lumens for 2 hours that seems "better" than the standard p60 or p61 runtimes and shouldn't be as hot and should use up all the battery power after the 2 hour mark. 

The G2L should make great emergecy lights and the 6PL would make a good duty light.

I am going to wait until some runtime tests are performed to decide whether or not I will be picking these up.

Where is the regulation circuits for these things? on the back of the reflector or in the light?


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## StainlessSteel (Aug 8, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*

Just out of curiosity here:

For those who are not interested in longer runtime, but MAXimum output in the G2 or 6P... why not just get one of the cree drop ins from anywhere... including the Bug out gear version?

Reason I ask is.... I just ordered the "Premium Plus", 170 lumen BOG drop in, and it will be put into my brand new 6PD. That kinda solves all my problems.


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## Size15's (Aug 8, 2007)

cue003 said:


> Where is the regulation circuits for these things? on the back of the reflector or in the light?


All the electronics is contained within the P60L LED Module - which is a direct replacement for the P60.

Note that the P60L is intended for two-SF123A (in a G2, 6P etc) but will also work powered by three-SF123A batteries (in a G3, 9P etc) although I don't have any information on how the P60L performs with the additional SF123A.

Al


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## batman (Aug 8, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*

the main reason is bc many of them don't exactly fit in the flashlight very well. If you ask me, that's a bit crap, plus I'm sure SF will be backed by the unbeatable warranty, have better tint, etc. (i'm sure the pieces actually fit together too.)


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## Chazzy151 (Aug 8, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*

I have the premium plus (170lm BugOutGear dropin) in my g-2, I can tell you that it fits perfect (no gap at all), has great tint, super bright, built very robust and has an excellent warranty. Best money i've spent in a long time, excellent product!


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## sysadmn (Aug 8, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*



Size15's said:


> There are quite a few threads on *SureFire's*​ new P60L products at the moment. I am not sure whether to combine them...
> 
> Anyway, it seems that the P60L LED Module will have a 'peak' output of 80 lumens when used 'momentarily' / briefly.
> Due to thermal regulation considerations - constant-on the output is better described as approximately 65 lumens regulated for 3 hours in the G2, or approximately 75 lumens regulated for 2 hours in the 6P. The output will then decrease considerably for another 9 hours or so of usable light.
> ...



I would expect Surefire to do thermal regulation - hey, they're Surefire! I'm a little surprised that they advertise "Max Output: 80 lumens" and "continues producing useful light levels for an impressive 12 hours on a single set of batteries" (both true, I'm sure). Since they're scrupulous about advertising torch lumens instead of bulb lumens, I would expect they'd characterize the output more carefully.

Can't wait for the CPF science squad to publish :twothumbs


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## Size15's (Aug 8, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*

Erm, SureFire have used "max output" and "total runtime" for quite a while.

Regarding the P60L - it _has_ built-in thermal regulation.
The concept is that before the LED gets too hot, the output is 80 lumens. The thermal regulation takes control as the LED heats up to decrease the current to prevent the LED from over-heating.
Effectively the constant-on runtime/output chart will show output drop from about 80 lumens to 65/75 lumens pretty quickly depending on the thermal conditions, and then be regulated at either 65lu/3hrs (for the G2) or 75lu/2hrs (for the 6P) before dropping out of regulation.

I don't have any means of doing runtime/output measurements myself but I'm sure there will be charts posted on CPF before long

Al


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## Pax et Lux (Aug 8, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*

This has me worrying. . .

The G2L then apparently gets 65 lumens for three hours (albiet initially higher) compared to the E2L's nine hours at 45 lumens. . . hmm. I would probably struggle to tell the difference between 65 and 45 lumens (though I bet the higher one would have more throw), but even I know that one regulated runtime is three times the other. I guess that's the non-linear sacrefice you make for higher output.

And let me state that I know I'm comparing apples and oranges, but when it comes down to _using_ a light I do not care what LED it is running. It's only the output I can see.

Maybe the G2L will have a longer out-of-regulation tail, and could be more use as an emergency preparedness light.

This is not to say that the G2L is a bad light. I'll probably get one. But I'll definately get an E2L.

I do not mean to start knocking this light, I'm writing as someone trying to chose between the two 'new' Surefires.


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## Size15's (Aug 8, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*

It would be useful for somebody to perform runtime/output charts for SureFire's new LED products using the same test method so the change in output over time can be compared.

It is not usually possible for CPFers to measure total output - only intensity of the beam at one point. Still, the geometric area under each line may tell us something about which product is getting more light out of the batteries.

Al


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## Pax et Lux (Aug 8, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*

Ah, if someone knew enough about math they could use geometry to figure out what was the most efficient flashlight (as opposed to brightest or one with the longest runtime).

I too would like to see tests conducted by the same person. Right now we are in the realms of assumption (and I always make an *** of myself with that). I'm assuming, however, that the real information will be in the tail of the G2L output.


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## leprechaun414 (Aug 8, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*


----------



## Grun (Aug 9, 2007)

NickDrak said:


> Im psyched about dropping one in a 3xCR123 9P



Hi, Can you explain this more to me? Does this mean the light will be brighter?

I am still new and not sure how brightness will be determined.

3XCR123, won't this mean I can push the light to 9.0V? Is brightness determined by more volts, or more mA?

I was thinking of getting a 9P and adding a Cree dropin and using 3.0Vx3 CR123, and trying for a brighter light. Would this be brighter, or just be as bright as the 6P, but last longer than the 6P? oo:


----------



## dmz (Aug 10, 2007)

Does any one have one yet? I would like to hear their review.


----------



## MattK (Aug 10, 2007)

We opened one yesterday at the office. Beam quality is very smooth and the light is pretty bright - brighter than an Inova T1 for sure and brighter than a standard G2 as well with much better beam characteristics and color.


----------



## sysadmn (Aug 10, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*



Size15's said:


> Erm, SureFire have used "max output" and "total runtime" for quite a while.
> 
> Regarding the P60L - it _has_ built-in thermal regulation.


 
My comment wasn't clear - what I meant was, "I am not surprised that Surefire has thermal regulation. That quality of engineering design is what I expect from Surefire, and one way they justify a premium price. I am surprised that they don't use a bulb-lumens type description for light output (in spirit, if not in fact). If I can't get a manufacturer's runtime chart, I'd like something like MD's system "So.. when I say "SF P91: 20W, 330 - 175 lumen in 31 minutes"
I am saying, "330 torch lumens fresh off the charger, diminishing to 175 torch lumen in 31 minutes, probably has a few minutes left of quickly dimming output followed by protection kicking in." 

The CPF science team produces great charts - unfortunately, I doubt if .01% of Surefire purchasers have even heard of CPF.


PS - For other interested in regulation, Newbie's dissection of the Mag Led is amazing.


----------



## Size15's (Aug 10, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*



sysadmn said:


> I am surprised that they don't use a bulb-lumens type description for light output (in spirit, if not in fact)


To me it is logical that the light output rating of a flashlight should be based on the light output of the flashlight - that is the light that is leaving the flashlight.

In my opinion there is no practical need to know the output of the actual light source, powered by a bench supply and under ideal temperature (etc) conditions (in other words - the best output value it is possible for the light source to achieve).


----------



## sysadmn (Aug 10, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*

I agree, and it is unfortunate that SF is about the only manufacturer using that measurement methodology.


----------



## carrot (Aug 10, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*

One of my G2Z's is totally gonna be a G2ZL, if the new P60L modules work as well as they sound they might. Lately I've been a huge sucker for runtime.


----------



## dmz (Aug 11, 2007)

Does any one have beam shots? How does it compare to a G2 with a dealextreme.com cree led drop in?


----------



## lightemup (Aug 11, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*

+1 with Carrot

I don't mind sacrificing some runtime for brightness though. I'm hoping a P61L will be around the corner - 200 lumens or so would be great


----------



## dmz (Aug 11, 2007)

Is it available in OD color?

http://www.surefire.com/maxexp/main/co_disp/displ/carfnbr/0/prrfnbr/24460/G2andreg-LED


----------



## Size15's (Aug 11, 2007)

dmz said:


> Is it available in OD color?
> http://www.surefire.com/maxexp/main/co_disp/displ/carfnbr/0/prrfnbr/24460/G2andreg-LED


Not at the moment. The G2L-BK (Black) and G2L-YL (Yellow) are currently being offered. Whether they will offer TN (Tan) and (OD) Olive Drab in the future - who knows.


----------



## Monocrom (Aug 11, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*



jumpstat said:


> Well at least its by surefire. Shouldn't be any fit or contact issues like using 3rd party drop ins. As it is the G2 is a nice general utility light being an incan but now with led it would be better as it minimizes maintenance. Only thing is the price from surefire.........


 
Well, for those who ever wanted to convert their G2s with a Surefire "drop-in," there's always been the KL3 head.


----------



## flash_bang (Aug 11, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*

I think I would just like to get a G3ZL (basically a 3 cell G2z but with an LED). I would love to see runtime around 10 hours regulated and 100-130 lumens.
YMMV,
Flash


----------



## dizzy (Aug 11, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*

I ordered a G2L and a new E1L from Optics HQ thursday, so they should be in my hands next week. I will compare the G2L with my old G2's and post what ever I can detect with my bionic eyes (lasik enhanced).


----------



## GarageBoy (Aug 11, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*

The G2L is nice
P60 style beam- decent spill, decent throw. Pretty well made. Lovely tint too..
Way better than that REAL tiny hot spot of the EXx heads


----------



## wjf2000 (Aug 13, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*

The g2 led is available at www.batteryjunction.com/g2-led-.html


----------



## leprechaun414 (Aug 13, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*

I have compared the two and seems like to my naked eye that they are about the same brightness. The tint on the LED is nice.
Here are a couple beam shots that I was playing around with.
This is my first photo post so I hope it looks ok.

G2






G2L


----------



## lightr07 (Aug 13, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*



leprechaun414 said:


> I have compared the two and seems like to my naked eye that they are about the same brightness. The tint on the LED is nice.
> Here are a couple beam shots that I was playing around with.
> This is my first photo post so I hope it looks ok.
> 
> ...



Brilliant. Exactly what i was hoping it would look like. Smooth focused, And a nice tint. Looks like the G2L might be a good addition to the SureFire line up after all. How does it do heat wise? And can you post a picture of the LED? (or the packaging so i know what to look for when i get one)


----------



## jbviau (Aug 13, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*

Nice, thanks for the first beamshots! Is there any spill on the G2L?


----------



## Owen (Aug 13, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*

Could someone who has the P60L try it on a 17670 or 18650?
With the low Vf that I've seen published for many SSCs, it may be that we can get full brightness for a good part of the usable battery life of a high capacity Li-ion, even with the buck circuit.
I'll buy a G2L soon, regardless, but the extra battery option would be another selling point for me.


----------



## leprechaun414 (Aug 13, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*

Okay so here are some other shots I took of the G2L
I took the LED out and took some shots.
I also compared it to a Wolf Eyes drop in and might post some beam shots if someone wants to see them. 

G2L Front 1




G2L Front 2




G2L side 1




G2L side 2




G2L Package




G2L Beamshot 2


----------



## Owen (Aug 14, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*



leprechaun414 said:


> I also compared it to a Wolf Eyes drop in and might post some beam shots if someone wants to see them.


I got a Wolf Eyes drop-in today, and would love to hear(or see) how they compare. 
Thanks for the pics.


----------



## lightr07 (Aug 14, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*

Thanks for the pictures. It looks like the reflector in the P60L isn't as deep as the one in the P60. Also i notice it says "P60L-WH" so i wonder if that means that we could be seeing different colored P60L's in the coming year.


----------



## Size15's (Aug 14, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*



lightr07 said:


> ... i notice it says "P60L-WH" so i wonder if that means that we could be seeing different colored P60L's in the coming year.


It is standard for SureFire to state the colour of the output [even though no alterntives will be offered, nor are intended to be offered]


----------



## jbviau (Aug 14, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*



Owen said:


> I got a Wolf Eyes drop-in today, and would love to hear(or see) how they compare.
> Thanks for the pics.



I second that request for a comparison with any WE drop-in!


----------



## NickDrak (Aug 14, 2007)

Grun said:


> Hi, Can you explain this more to me? Does this mean the light will be brighter?
> 
> I am still new and not sure how brightness will be determined.
> 
> ...


 
It will be slightly only brighter, or not much brighhter at all depending on Surefires regulation, but the run time will be extended quite a bit.


----------



## lightemup (Aug 14, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*

Well, i've got my G2L ordered  

I thought waiting for a genuine drop in module was a pipe dream, but she's real! It was hard resisting the aftermarket ones. 

Now to start saving for the P61L and P91L modules hint hint nudge nudge PK  

I don't know what to do with mine, maybe straight into the g2z, into the 9p, or keep it in the g2. Decisions Decisions!


----------



## tussery (Aug 14, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*



lightemup said:


> Now to start saving for the P61L and P91L modules hint hint nudge nudge PK



According to information that Surefire has provided to OpticsHQ is the P60L will run in a 9P. So most likely they will only make a P61L that runs in both the 2 and 3 cell lights. That is if they make one at all.


----------



## dizzy (Aug 14, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*



tussery said:


> According to information that Surefire has provided to OpticsHQ is the P60L will run in a 9P. So most likely they will only make a P61L that runs in both the 2 and 3 cell lights. That is if they make one at all.


So I guess it will also run on 2, 3.7volt rechagables too, with no adverse effects?


----------



## dmz (Aug 14, 2007)

Does SF have any plans for a nitrolon clickie version? Any one have pics of a G2 with a z58 tailcap?


----------



## Size15's (Aug 14, 2007)

dmz said:


> Does SF have any plans for a nitrolon clickie version? Any one have pics of a G2 with a z58 tailcap?


No idea about a Nitrolon Clickie TailCap. Perhaps if SureFire find the time?


----------



## geepondy (Aug 14, 2007)

Other then the appreciative comments by MattK, nobody else has received this light yet? I come home every night hoping to read a review!


----------



## leprechaun414 (Aug 14, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*

Ok so here are some shots of the Wolf eyes drop in and some beam shots of the G2 Incan, G2 L and G2 Wolf Eyes drop in. I used 3.7 Rechargeables in both led and Surefire in the G2 Incan

I think the Wolf Eyes Drop in is the brightest and smoothest beam.

Let me know what you think of the pics








G2 LED Wolf Eyes Drop in






Wolf Eyes Drop in front





Wolf Eyes Drop in side










G2 Incan





G2 L





G2 Wolf Eyes drop in





G2,G2 Incan,G2 Wolf Eyes Drop in


----------



## jbviau (Aug 14, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*

Nice--thanks! In those pictures do you have the high-output WE drop-in (170 bulb lumens) or the regular one (130 bulb lumens)?


----------



## jbviau (Aug 14, 2007)

See the related thread under general flashlight discussion for beamshots.


----------



## leprechaun414 (Aug 14, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*

Its the High output 170 lumen. I can tell you that it is heavy, and built like a tank. I would highly suggest it. I also like the G2L. I think everyone should get both


----------



## KeeperSD (Aug 14, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*

Great pics

Does anyone know the purpose of the lip around the outside of the WE LA? Makes the reflector diameter noticably smaller than the G2. Also appears that the OP is heavier on the WE than the G2? 

Would love to see some outdoor pics of all 3


----------



## cue003 (Aug 15, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*

Is the WE 170 lumens setup direct drive or will it run as long as the P60L ? The P60L should run in solid regulation for 3 hours and then drop down to a lower output for the remainder of the runtime. How does the WE 170 lumen light behave?

Lastly, does the WE drop in you have run brighter on R123? Just curious and wondering if there was a difference in output of the P60L when run on R123 vs. primaries.

Thanks.


----------



## leprechaun414 (Aug 15, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*

Hope this answers your questions.


*Specifications:*  Brightness: 170 lumens (maximum stage) 

 Runtime: 1 - LRB168A Rechargeable battery

Full brightness stage: 110 minutes with regulated output and 30 minutes with unregulated output.
Strobe stage: 220 minutes with regulated output and more than 30 minutes with unregulated output

20% brightness stage: more than 550 minutes 
2% brightness stage: more than 5500 minutes 
 Runtime: 2 - CR123A Rechargeable battery: 

Full brightness stage: 80 minutes with regulated output and 4 hours with unregulated output.
Strobe stage: 160 minutes with regulated output and about 8 hours with unregulated output

20% brightness stage: more than 400 minutes
2% brightness stage: more than 4000 minutes


----------



## KeeperSD (Aug 15, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*

leprechaun414 i'm guessing with the runtimes you quoted that you have the 3.7-6V WE drop in? 

On a side note I was just looking on the website and the 3.7-13V drop ins have some loooong runtimes quoted with use of 3.7 or 6V cells. Obviously with the lower voltage there is no regulation, well none is quoted anyway

it would be interesting to see what sort of light they put out towards the end of the battery life, similarly i would like to see the output of the G2L, or the usable light towards the end of the battery life.


----------



## Owen (Aug 15, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*

If someone could give the current draw for the P60L, I think we can get some realistic runtime numbers based on the capacity of the cells used vs. the manufacturer's advertised times. 

Here are some actual draws for the Wolf-Eyes "170 lumen" 4 mode drop-in.
2 brand new Battery Station CR123 cells(only NIP 123s I currently have), 3.29V/ea:
Hi mode: 980mA
Strobe: 470-490mA
20% mode: 240mA
2% mode: 100mA

1 AW 2200mAh protected 18650(I will edit in these numbers after I've checked them on a fresh battery)
Hi mode: 940mA
Strobe: 470-490mA
20% mode: 240
2% mode: 90

I've edited in the 18650 measurements, and this makes no sense. It should be drawing more current from the 18650, not less on Hi and 2%, or the same on strobe and 20%. Very strange.


----------



## jbviau (Aug 15, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*



KeeperSD said:


> Does anyone know the purpose of the lip around the outside of the WE LA?



Keeper, I'd always assumed that the lip on the WE drop-in was there to provide a good fit with the bezel on a compatible WE light. Not having a WE light, though, I've never been able to see for myself. You've got one, right? Do you think there's some other purpose for the lip to do with beam profile?


----------



## elgarak (Aug 15, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*

How does one switch modes on the WE drop-in?


----------



## jbviau (Aug 15, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*

Elgarak, see post #3 in this thread: https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/170139


----------



## Grun (Aug 15, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*

rechargeables for the wolfeyes 170lumens?


----------



## jbviau (Aug 15, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*

I use a 17670 with my 170-lumen WE drop-in in a G2. The 18650 is too big for the G2 but fits perfectly in a WE light. The WE drop-in runs fully regulated with either the 17670 or the 18650 provided that you get the 3.7-6v version of the drop-in (*not* the 3.7-13v).


----------



## TXArsonCop (Aug 15, 2007)

The only difference between the Z58 and Z59 is the color right? Can't find anything else on Surefire's site. If so, don't know why they don't just list it as an option... :thinking:


----------



## Cyblade (Aug 15, 2007)

wonder when the lamp will be available. I got an old G2 thats been sitting because I burnt out like 3 lamps in what I consider a very short time and I'd like to just pop this one in and start using it again. Also wonder what it's gonna cost.


----------



## Size15's (Aug 15, 2007)

TXArsonCop said:


> The only difference between the Z58 and Z59 is the color right?


Yes - the Z58 is natural HA, and the Z59 is type II black (not HA)


----------



## elgarak (Aug 15, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*

jbviau,

Thanks.

That's what I feared -- not for me.


----------



## KeeperSD (Aug 15, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*

TO be honest, i really don't know. The lip doesn't provide any support or alignment in the Defender II, maybe it does in other non WE lights. 

elgarak what did you fear?


----------



## jbosman1013 (Aug 15, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*

have you done any runtime tests and how long does the G2L stay at max output.


----------



## elgarak (Aug 15, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*



KeeperSD said:


> elgarak what did you fear?


That dropping that WE drop-in in a G2 would produce the most horrible UI, for me. YMMV.


----------



## MattK (Aug 16, 2007)

Cyblade said:


> wonder when the lamp will be available. I got an old G2 thats been sitting because I burnt out like 3 lamps in what I consider a very short time and I'd like to just pop this one in and start using it again. Also wonder what it's gonna cost.




My GUESS: December/January and ~$40-50


----------



## jbviau (Aug 16, 2007)

Size15's, would you please reconsider merging this thread with the one below? There's a lot of duplicate info. Thanks!

https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/171049


----------



## Size15's (Aug 16, 2007)

Done.


----------



## mx125 (Aug 16, 2007)

I'll just add another annoying bump hoping for a runtime graph . . .


----------



## Miracle (Aug 19, 2007)

which is a better light?

G2L

or 6PL

y?

what I can think of at the moment :

G2L has 1 extra hour

6PL = metal


----------



## Monocrom (Aug 19, 2007)

Miracle said:


> which is a better light?
> 
> G2L
> 
> ...


 
That's more personal preference than anything else. Do you prefer aluminum or polymer.

I'd say G2L ..... But only because it feels more comfortable in my hand than the 6PL, and the polymer version fits better in Surefire's kydex Speed holster than the aluminum one.


----------



## Miracle (Aug 19, 2007)

Monocrom said:


> That's more personal preference than anything else. Do you prefer aluminum or polymer.
> 
> I'd say G2L ..... But only because it feels more comfortable in my hand than the 6PL, and the polymer version fits better in Surefire's kydex Speed holster than the aluminum one.



I wonder how the polymer will react as the LED's heat increases?

will the polymer corrode slowly with time?

any kind souls with original G2 can comment?


----------



## Monocrom (Aug 19, 2007)

Miracle said:


> I wonder how the polymer will react as the LED's heat increases?
> 
> will the polymer corrode slowly with time?
> 
> any kind souls with original G2 can comment?


 
I've got two G2 inca models. One of them has the 120 lumen P61 assembly in it. 

Lights the size of a G2 are not designed for constant-on use over extended periods of time. Incas tend to heat up a flashlight faster than LEDs. (At least, that's been my experience). So far, no problems with heat with either of my G2 inca lights. No need to worry about the polymer melting or becoming too hot to touch. 

I don't think the polymer will corrode over time. But the yellow polymer G2s do tend to turn black as one EDCs the light. 

My first Surefire was the C2 model. For a lot of folks who own Surefires, their first one was the G2. If there were problems with the G2 form-factor, we would have seen threads about it on CPF.


----------



## Miracle (Aug 19, 2007)

Monocrom said:


> I've got two G2 inca models. One of them has the 120 lumen P61 assembly in it.
> 
> Lights the size of a G2 are not designed for constant-on use over extended periods of time. Incas tend to heat up a flashlight faster than LEDs. (At least, that's been my experience). So far, no problems with heat with either of my G2 inca lights. No need to worry about the polymer melting or becoming too hot to touch.
> 
> ...



thankx for the input.

R the core of the G2 polymer + metal? ie. inside metal, outside polymer?

or is the entire core polymer?


----------



## Bullzeyebill (Aug 19, 2007)

Thin metal tube in the lower body of G2. Where battery's sit. Metal does not extend to upper part of body. Electirical onductivity through metal tube. Metal tube is not thick enough to provide good heat sinking.

Bill


----------



## lightemup (Aug 20, 2007)

Just got my G2L. Review in two words:

Love it 

Slightly more detailed review:

Slightly less bright than my Gladius (in the centre beam). Better Sidespill, substantially better than Gladius. 

Brighter than L4 in its hotspot, L4 is brighter in the sidespill. 

Sidespill is very impressive compared to the x200a. 

Haven't done any 'throw' tests yet but I think the gladius will slightly beat it.

Against P60? If you are using one it is definitely worth the upgrade. Much whiter light, better colour rendition, a bit brighter, or at the very least as bright. Here's the clincher: Just pulled out two 'dead' batts out of a nearly 'dead' G2. Threw them in the G2L and hey presto nice, bright and white again. Don't know how long that will last but I will give an update.
As far as it replacing my P61 I have yet to compare them. The much longer runtime will be a plus though.

For my purposes: A Emergency / Stash light etc it is perfect. Great amount of light, LOTC, long run time, and no bulb to have to carry spares for. I will even be watching b/s/t to pick up another p60L.

Thumbs Up! That is my informal 2 cents worth. Sorry can't do any pics.


----------



## mx125 (Aug 20, 2007)

lightemup said:


> Just got my G2L. Review in two words:
> 
> Love it
> 
> ...


 
Thanks letemup. Could I ask a couple of questions?

I'm not sure if you own other lights that I would be familiar with (I'm new to all this) but could you describe the 'eyeball' brightness and beam quality vs. any other brands of cree lights? I own a fenix P2D and on high it's advertised at 80 lumens. My anderstanding is Surefire errs on the conservative side in advertising, so wondered how that 80 lumes appears in use. Do you find it a more complromised "useful" amount of light or a noticibly "bright" hot beam. Also, is the beam ring free like some of the OP type reflectored crees? 

Thanks in advance.


----------



## lightemup (Aug 20, 2007)

Hi MX,

1. Sorry don't have any Fenix's. I've been meaning to get one to try out. I'm interested in a comparison too against the Malkoff drop in module. For all I know the Malkoff could completely outshine the p60L. The reason that I have not jumped on aftermarket bulbs before is my first priority is reliability and durability. I don't want to fiddle with contacts, worry about dimensions etc. I know that when I buy SF it will work. If it doesn't, they'll fix it. I've got enough Surefires now to be called a wally, and i've never needed one light fixed, and touchwood never blown a lamp (throwing a E1e lamp in an E2e body in Vegas doesn't count, that was my stuff up, Daloosh knows all about that  ). 

2. Yes, from my experience Surefire is conservative in the lumen output statistics. Can't comment on Fenix. I bet others can jump in and answer this question for you  Compared to my p60 and my other Surefires though, 80 lumens sounds very close to the money. I've had '100' lumen lights that my old style L1 has beaten in output (and my L1 is no powerhouse) so it does depend on the manufacturer's measurement style.

3. Compromised Useful or Bright Hot Beam. Not wanting to sound like a fence sitter but it is somewhere between the two. My goal was for useful compromised (i.e. emergency light), but I am seriously considering putting it in my g2z to replace the p61. The main benefit would be runtime, durability and colour rendition. It should be noted I wasn't expecting it to be a barn burner, and I was very happy it was brighter than the p60 along with its other benefits over it. 

I will add though to frame my response: Imho I believe that 200 lumens is the minimum for 'tactical' (for want of a better word) use. Surefire's 65 lumen minimum is fine for dark adjusted eyes etc, but when there is wash out from ambient light / person is a bit further away etc 200 lumens is substantially better. My 9p with P91 and M3 with HOLA still have a position in my stable.

4. Beam is flashaholic perfect  For the White Wall chasers when the light is about 40cm away from a wall and closer you can see a donut in the centre, but any further than that and it is Shelby Chan photography perfect  

Hope that helps, let me know if I can help further.


----------



## mx125 (Aug 20, 2007)

lightemup said:


> Hi MX,
> 
> 1. Sorry don't have any Fenix's. I've been meaning to get one to try out. I'm interested in a comparison too against the Malkoff drop in module. For all I know the Malkoff could completely outshine the p60L. The reason that I have not jumped on aftermarket bulbs before is my first priority is reliability and durability. I don't want to fiddle with contacts, worry about dimensions etc. I know that when I buy SF it will work. If it doesn't, they'll fix it. I've got enough Surefires now to be called a wally, and i've never needed one light fixed, and touchwood never blown a lamp (throwing a E1e lamp in an E2e body in Vegas doesn't count, that was my stuff up, Daloosh knows all about that  ).
> 
> ...


 
Thanks very much for the thoughful response. That is very helpful. I think I can see where it fits in and agree with you (and I suppose Surefire designers) that for such a popular (mainstream?) and emergency light candidate they hit the right compromise at 80 lumens. 

Although I don't own an L4 or L2, they sound like the flood beam masters. Would you classify the G2L as "a little less bright" and "a little less floody" than an L2/4? 

I admit I have a bit of a thing for the polymer shell. Maybe I'm wishing for an L2 with a yellow polymer shell?!


----------



## lightemup (Aug 20, 2007)

1. "a little less bright" vs "a little less floody:" Sorry can't help you with the L2. Hopefully someone else can jump in. Centre hotspot is brighter than the L4, but the sidespill on the L4 is brighter. I would describe my L4's light as you say: A Wall, perfect for indoors . The p60L has a noticeable hotspot in the centre and sidespill. The P60L throws further because of this. As far as usefulness of the sidespill of the P60L, it will do nearly everything the L4 will performance wise. In practical use, its no less bright than the L4, it is more bright in the middle and less bright in the sidespill. As far as Floody, yep, a little less floody. 

2. Polymer Shell / L2 / Yellow: Now we are starting to talk a little apples vs oranges. Firstly I don't think the Polymer would be practical in such a thin body. Heat Sinking / durability etc comes to mind. But I am no expert. If it'll be tough, I'm with you, bring it on  . Secondly the purpose of the lights are different (at least for me). I can throw my L4 with pilas in any of my pockets and carry it comfortably. For me to pocket a g2 / g2z / 6p / 9p etc i've either lost my L4 or i'm expecting trouble  I have a friend though that pockets a 6p no worries in jeans. My g2z/g2/9p etc live in bags, the car, on the belt or in the house. As far as colour, give me tan  


I am closely looking at the new Cree L1, and once the kinks get ironed out I think i'll be grabbing one for pocket carry if it is at least 65 lumens. I am interested in the Fenix p3D with 200 lumen turbo mode, but i'm going to be doing a fair bit more homework about their QC before I jump. If it is durable / built to tight tolerances / actually 200 lumens with a good switching system the L4 might be semi-retired.

I've got this overwhelming want to go to the paddock, turn the G2L on and throw it as far as I possibly can. And I think it is the closest light i've yet seen that would have a high chance of surviving it


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## elgarak (Aug 20, 2007)

It's a "little less bright" and a "lot less floody" than the L2/4, which is mainly due to the L2/4 being extremely floody.


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## mx125 (Aug 20, 2007)

lightemup said:


> 1. "a little less bright" vs "a little less floody:" Sorry can't help you with the L2. Hopefully someone else can jump in. Centre hotspot is brighter than the L4, but the sidespill on the L4 is brighter. I would describe my L4's light as you say: A Wall, perfect for indoors . The p60L has a noticeable hotspot in the centre and sidespill. The P60L throws further because of this. As far as usefulness of the sidespill of the P60L, it will do nearly everything the L4 will performance wise. In practical use, its no less bright than the L4, it is more bright in the middle and less bright in the sidespill. As far as Floody, yep, a little less floody.
> 
> 2. Polymer Shell / L2 / Yellow: Now we are starting to talk a little apples vs oranges. Firstly I don't think the Polymer would be practical in such a thin body. Heat Sinking / durability etc comes to mind. But I am no expert. If it'll be tough, I'm with you, bring it on  . Secondly the purpose of the lights are different (at least for me). I can throw my L4 with pilas in any of my pockets and carry it comfortably. For me to pocket a g2 / g2z / 6p / 9p etc i've either lost my L4 or i'm expecting trouble  I have a friend though that pockets a 6p no worries in jeans. My g2z/g2/9p etc live in bags, the car, on the belt or in the house. As far as colour, give me tan
> 
> ...


 
Your description again helps a great deal. And thanks Elgarak below. 

You've bracketed it well and I can visualize right where the relavant players line up in comparison. 

I really like you last comment. Funny and confidence inspiring. 

All that's left for me is a runtime graph. By comparison, I see a runtime graph by Chevrofreak for the Fenix P3D (2x123) on high (65ish lumens) producing between 5 and 6 hours regulated output. I can't see the G2L making 12hours regulated at a higher output as some note. Maybe 3-4 hours? 

Many thanks for your reply.


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## Bullzeyebill (Aug 20, 2007)

For runtime graphs go to search at top of each CPF page and type in chevrofreak. Pick his threads and skroll down to his runtime graphs.

Bill


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## mx125 (Aug 20, 2007)

Bullzeyebill said:


> For runtime graphs go to search at top of each CPF page and type in chevrofreak. Pick his threads and skroll down to his runtime graphs.
> 
> Bill


 
I don't believe he has done any runtimes on the G2L. Maybe I'm not seeing that on his site.


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## Bullzeyebill (Aug 20, 2007)

Right, no G2-L runtime tests, but source of good info on other lights. 

Bill


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## flash_bang (Aug 23, 2007)

Any ETA on the P60L? what about P61L or the development of 3 cell Led's?(will we be seeing P90L's or maybe even MN15L's?)
HAGO,
Flash


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## KentuckyMike (Aug 23, 2007)

*Re: Am I reading this correct? Surefire G2 LED??? Can someone confirm?*



flash_bang said:


> Any ETA on the P60L? what about P61L or the development of 3 cell Led's?(will we be seeing P90L's or maybe even MN15L's?)
> HAGO,
> Flash




Flash, I wish they would. I would bet they only do the P60L though, I doubt they would go to the trouble to add a 3-cell version when the P60L already handles 3 primaries. A P61L that would work in 6-9v would be good, though.

And since SF is in the primary business...I guess a 9-13v version for the 3 cells that can handle RCRs is out of the question.

I'm excited about these P60L's, though. Should make great EDC, duty, and worklights....in addition to emergency lights for the house and car. 3 hours of bright, white light, heat/cold resistant power with a 10-year shelf life, unbreakeable/unblowable lightsource, tough-as-nails SF construction, lifetime warranty, and well under $100...not too shabby at all!!!


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## flash_bang (Aug 24, 2007)

*Re: Am I reading this correct? Surefire G2 LED??? Can someone confirm?*

This sounds awesome! I'm kind of thinking about getting a 6PL. Then if I wanted to I could just swap the P60 in my G2 with the P60L in the 6PL if I wanted to. That would be nice. that way I'd get more usage out of the two LA's, rather than if I had my G2 with P60 and a P60L(when SF starts selling em separately) I could not use both at the same time, and plus it would be a lot more useful if I was in a rainy environment and couldn't change batteries, I could just switch to the 6PL when my G2's batts ran out. 
HAGO,
Flash
PS, I'm kind of wondering if I should put off getting an E2L and get a 6PL instead, or get an E2L then a 6PL later…decisions, decisions…


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## Bullzeyebill (Aug 25, 2007)

Be nice to have some objective data here. Anyone have a lightmeter and a SF G2 LED? Lux? A simple runtime test using bounce or lux measurements, posting results?

Bill


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## hanzo (Sep 18, 2007)

*Re: G2 incan versus G2 LED*



leprechaun414 said:


> I have compared the two and seems like to my naked eye that they are about the same brightness. The tint on the LED is nice.
> Here are a couple beam shots that I was playing around with.
> This is my first photo post so I hope it looks ok.
> 
> ...




From your pictures, it looks like the light from the G2 is more intense than from the G2L. Is that true or just my eyes?

I have a couple of G2's and was thinking of getting a G2L or a BOG Premium Plus Cree drop-in. What do you guys think will be the better option? I like the 12 hour runtime but am reading that the light will likely drop off after a few hours. 170 lumens for 3+ hours sounds really attractive to me! I am just wondering how much difference the 80 SF lumens are compared to the 170 BOG lumens, since they are probably measuring differently.


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## Shalom (Sep 30, 2007)

For how many hours will a G2 Led run at 80 ?
After how much time will it hit 60?
40?
Any info on runtime appreciated.
Thanks
Shalom
[email protected]

The question has come up several times but I haven't found anyone's answer!!


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