# My Raider is here...



## Robocop (Mar 31, 2006)

I got my package from Pacific Tactical today and like a little kid with a new toy could not get it open fast enough......Let me first just say INCREDIBLE.

I must have simply been out of the loop for some time as far as incandescents goes and for years I got by with my 3.7 volt Commander. I never knew what I was missing as this new Raider by Wolf-Eyes is simply beautiful.

My friend Owen is here and the first comparision of the 9D was with his Surefire Z3 with SRTH/N2 Lamp Assembly as well as the TL3 by Streamlight.
The Raider simply beat both of them in our opinion as it had much brighter spill and perfect beam with the same throw as the SureFire...amazing. The single best feature I noticed first was the Raiders ability to light up an entire room with bright spill yet still has a perfectly round hot spot. It lights up my entire neighbors yard at about 50 yards away.

If this light proves to be as reliable as it looks then it will be a new favorite of mine as well as any other officer looking for a duty light. I will give some long term impressions after some usage but for now this light has been money well spent and actually got me excited again about incandescents.

This really makes me wonder how well other Wolf-Eyes products perform and I am simply dying to try the 12 volt set up. It also came in a very nice box with very quick shipping as well. I will also say that so far this D36 lamp is the most "white" incandescent I have yet seen. It really makes my Commander look like a dull rust color.

Any officer looking for a duty light will be very pleased with this set up and it is a pretty small package. Mine had the holster ordered as an option and it is also very nice. Time will tell with this light however first impressions are excellent so far.


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## jclarksnakes (Mar 31, 2006)

Robocop,
....I got an M90 Rattlesnake from Pacific Tactical Solutions a couple weeks ago. It is an impressive light. It has a very bright hotspot and a big clean spillbeam. I have had it out in the woods and it really lights things up. In comparison to my TL-3 with 1499 Carley bulb and rechargeable cells this light throws just about as far but has a bigger rounder hotspot and the spillbeam is bigger and much, much cleaner. I also have an M3 Microfire I got from Pacific Tactical Solutions. It is an excellent light but with the combination LED incandescent lamp assembly it does not have the perfect round clean spillbeam of the Rattlesnake and of course with three cells is not as bright as the Rattlesnake. I am using AWs rechargeable cells in both of these lights. I like these lights so much that I am trying to decide which model to buy next. It will probably be the Raider.
jc


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## Robocop (Mar 31, 2006)

JC...
I have not yet used the light on duty so I really do not know how it will do in an urban environment with ambient lighting however for a building search this light is perfect. It really is a huge upgrade from what I carried for several years.

I should also say that above I said the light simply beat Owens Surefire when actually it did only for my purposes of a patrol light. The SureFire does throw further with that massive reflector however the W/E seems to throw more total light for a distance of about 50 yards. There is a huge difference in the sidespill with the winner clearly being the W/E. The SureFire is a fine light and for a long time the Z3 with the SRTH head and N2 lamp was the best incandescent I had seen. It still beats the W/E in throw and most likely fit and finish however for the money the W/E is holding its own with the mighty Z3.

The beam quality is what suprised me. There are zero artifacts and looking at the heavy textured reflector it seems strange that it does throw so well. For the purpose of a duty light in my environment this beam pattern is nearly perfect. I think the Z3 may be a better light but it is pretty large on the bezel end. W/E did a good job of making this type beam pattern with a smaller reflector. I was expecting a nice light however it is nice to be suprised and I was not expecting this Raider to be this much of an improvement. I do feel as if I got my moneys worth on this deal.

If I had to say what type of beam this light makes I would describe it as a wall of light with a larger than most hot spot. When I say wall of light I am trying to describe the spill. Yes the spot is very defined but the sidespill is very usable all the way to the outer edge. I would not call this a flood type beam but it is simply a perfect combo of intense hotspot with a very bright and white corona......yes I am truly happy with this purchase.


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## Chronos (Mar 31, 2006)

I also received an M90X from PTS a few weeks ago and am totally blown away by the light's quality and "wall of light." I think it was Paul_in_Maryland who first said I'd be amazed, and I am! The throw of the 12v is incredible, and I love the spill beam. I'm now going to pick up the M100 turbo head. 

Oh, I also got the LED tailcap and recommend it. Nice source of bluish light, just enough to illuminate the path ahead. If I need the incan I can easily engage the tailcap button for a temporary wall of light.:rock:


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## Paul_in_Maryland (Mar 31, 2006)

Guys,
I intend to finish my long review of the 9A and 9D and post it this weekend. But Robocop and the others in this thread have covered several of the Raider's salient features. 

Robocop, did you get the 9A (26mm reflector, clickie tailcap), the 9T (26mm reflector, LED tailcap), or 9D (36mm reflector, clickie tailcap)? The 9D outthrows the 9A/9T by a considerable margin.


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## madecov (Mar 31, 2006)

I've been a fan of the PILA Wolf-Eyes line for years.

The only light I don't have is the M100

If the new lamps are that much nicer than the old ones, I may need to check them out. I have gotten a chance to handle the new PILA lights and can say they are not the same as the W.E. line, the 2 companies have completely diverged. The PILA line is a giant step up from the old line.


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## bwaites (Mar 31, 2006)

So the Raider looks exactly like my 3 123 cell Pila!

I assume the lamps have been changed or upgraded?

Bill


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## Paul_in_Maryland (Mar 31, 2006)

bwaites said:


> So the Raider looks exactly like my 3 123 cell Pila! I assume the lamps have been changed or upgraded?


Precisely. The new lamps deliver about 20% more light, using about 20 percent less current. The new beams are whiter, cleaner, and more tightly focused.


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## bwaites (Mar 31, 2006)

Can you just buy the lamps?

Bill


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## MadMag (Mar 31, 2006)

Same good comments here. I received my 9A Raider Li-ion from PTS about a month ago and it has moved to be my most favorite light. The beam is perfectly round, bright, great side spill, and I love the re-chargeable Li-ion's. Also, I think they have the clickie tail switch with exactly the right amount of extension past the body. A little on the heavy side but at least you know it is in your pocket.

Also, thanks to Paul for his guidance when I made my purchase.

Paul, I think I can get the larger bezel for the 9A for better throw...correct?


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## Chronos (Mar 31, 2006)

Won't the 9D head fit? http://www.pts-flashlights.com/products/product.aspx?pid=1-25-50-6115&tb=1


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## MadMag (Mar 31, 2006)

Chronos said:


> Won't the 9D head fit?
> 
> Yes, thanks Chronos. I missed that on PTS.


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## Paul_in_Maryland (Mar 31, 2006)

MadMag said:


> Paul, I think I can get the larger bezel for the 9A for better throw...correct?


Yes, and PTS's price appears to include the D36 lamp.


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## jclarksnakes (Mar 31, 2006)

Okay, that settles it.  My next purchase from Paciifc Tactical will be a 9D which is the 3 cell Raider with the turbo head. Thanks to Paul :goodjob: for initially pointing me towards these great flashlights and thanks to others :goodjob: for more information along the way. Robocop mentioned the comparison to Surefires. IMO the Wolf Eyes and Microfire products are almost as good as Surefires for a whole lot less money. 
jc


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## Owen (Mar 31, 2006)

Paul_in_Maryland said:


> Robocop, did you get the 9A (26mm reflector, clickie tailcap), the 9T (26mm reflector, LED tailcap), or 9D (36mm reflector, clickie tailcap)? The 9D outthrows the 9A/9T by a considerable margin.


He has the 9D. 
The SRTH w/N2 and TL3 will both outthrow it, but it absolutely destroys them in total light output, and makes them look quite yellow in comparison. I've never seen a perfect beam on an incan before, but the 9D has it. That thing is amazing. It smokes anything SF makes in a 3 cell light by a huge margin, and feels better in the hand, too. 
I'm thinking of getting another std. head for my Z3(only have the turbohead anymore since P90s suck so bad I got rid of them long ago) and try a couple of D26 LAs, or buy a Wolf Eyes 9D for its D36. After seeing my Surefire and Streamlight compared to that 9D I felt like throwing them in the trash. It's that much better.
btw, in spite of its increased output, the 9D's D36 pulls on 200mA more from 3x123 than my lights(1.3A vs ~1.1A).


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## Bhustan (Mar 31, 2006)

These lights look amazing. I'm strongly considering adding a 9D to my collection. Does anyone know if Pila 150S batteries will power the P36 LA?

Thanks in advance,
Mike


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## Phaserburn (Mar 31, 2006)

Just ordered a new D26 lamp for my Pila G3L from PTS. Can't wait to see the comparison for myself. Thanks for the info, Paul.


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## Paul_in_Maryland (Mar 31, 2006)

Bhustan said:


> These lights look amazing. I'm strongly considering adding a 9D to my collection. Does anyone know if Pila 150S batteries will power the P36 LA?


Yes, it will. So will a pair of protected AW 18500 or 17500 cells, old or new.


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## Robocop (Mar 31, 2006)

The only thing I may add to this light will be the LED tailcap however I am not really sure how it functions. The clicky that came with the light does very well and has a very silent but positive click to it when activated. It also has the lock out feature and closed top holster that I like.
Has anyone got any experience with the LED tail caps and if so how do they hold up as far as durability. If the LEDs fail will the tail cap still function the main light?


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## Robocop (Apr 1, 2006)

First night on duty and it performed flawless. I was working a bad accident on the highway and it was a dark stretch of road. I must have had the light on for a total of 20 minutes with much of that using the switch as a strobe type action to warn other cars. No problems with the switch or the light and it was very much brighter than what I am used to.

Next I had an alarm call to find a busted window upon arrival. It was a house with 4 bedrooms and myself and one other officer began our search. My back up officer had a Stinger that is about 3 years old. He was looking inside the open window with his light and I was behind him at about 10 feet. When I turned the Raider towards the window it lit up the entire side of the house and his comment was..."damn thats a nice light " It was really amazing and made the tried and true Stinger look pretty weak. On the search the Raider lit up the entire hallways as well as each room with that great spill light.

The most important factor with this light is confidence. I did feel very confident with the light on duty and it does allow me to do my job better if I trust my equipment. As far as actual output I do trust this light however can not comment on long term reliability as of yet. In a few weeks I will give my longer term impressions of this light....so far so good.


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## Paul_in_Maryland (Apr 1, 2006)

Robocop said:


> If the LEDs fail will the tail cap still function the main light?


No one has ever asked that question on CPF, and I don't know the answer.

The usual question is, "If the main light fails, will the LEDs still work?" The answer is No.


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## Longbow (Apr 1, 2006)

The led's ground is thru the main bulb filament, hence burnt filament=no leds. the main bulbs circuit is independant of the leds, thus should continue working if leds fail.


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## Chronos (Apr 1, 2006)

Thanks for the update Robocop! Really well thought out. I'll keep this thread bookmarked for updates.

The following is probably OT as it is regards to my Rattlesnake, but maybe it is applicable here?

I did an informal beamshoot last night. I've took an LEDBeam (great LED thrower) and compared it against my M90X, shooting in the dark into the woods behind my beach place. The M90X is absolutely stunning. It cut right through the trees to the other side of the woods (easily 30+ yards of trees). It has a HOT centerbeam with a nice, white spillbeam. I think the centerbeam was almost too hot to look at at a distance less than 15'. It is that intense. The LEDBeam did throw well, but not nearly as far. It has a nice spillbeam but it is much dimmer. If I passed the M90x beam over the LEDBeam's beam the LEDBeam was completely washed out.

Interesting to note that both of the spillbeams from both lights are the same diameter. The spillbeam on the M90X is much brighter.

The M90x was illuminating the woods with a white, clean source of light. I could make out details that I missed with the LEDBeam. It is an amazing floodlight with a hot, intense throw. If this is 300 lumens, I wonder what those 1000+ lumen HID lights (AE Powerlight) are like? Probably the throw without the useable spill.

I now realize the value of a good spillbeam!


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## Paul_in_Maryland (Apr 1, 2006)

Chronos,
Wouldn't it be great if we could "have it all" by running the 12V, 300-lumen lamp with three lithium-ions that exactly fill the 2x168A body? See this thread. I can't understand why Wolf Eyes, Pila, and Microfire all ignore the pent-up demand for such a cell size.


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## jclarksnakes (Apr 2, 2006)

Paul,
....I think we could probably get one of the battery pack places like CBP to make up some cells like you describe. I have tried two different combinations of AW's unprotected cells in my M90. First I ran an extended runtime test with 4 primary cells to get an idea about how hot it would get as well as how long it would run. I wanted to know what would be abnormally hot when later doing runtime test with rechargeable cells. With four very slightly used Streamlight 123 cells it got very warm within 20 minutes and so I held it under the kitchen faucet for just a second which cooled it right down. At the 30 minute point it was noticeably a little dimmer. Around the 40 minute point it was very warm again and so I ran water on it again for just a second. Soon after that I compared the output to my Microfire M3 with fully charged cells and the M90 was a little less intense than that. This seems in line with the flashlight review which reached 50% in 50 minutes or thereabouts. The output was still very useable (questimating 100 lumens) at 1 hour and 15 mintutes when I quit the run. The primary cells were hot but not too hot to hang unto when I took them out of the light. Next I loaded the light with two unprotected 18500s and an unprotected LIR 123. The light worked great with this combo and heated up at about the same rate as it had with 4 primary cells so I cooled it under the faucet at 20 minutes. At 40 minutes the light was noticeably less dim (guestimating 200 lumens) so I quit the run rather than risk damaging the unprotected cells. I quickly opened the light up (wearing safety glasses) to see how hot the cells would be. Both 18500s and the LIR 123 were hot to the touch but not too hot to hang onto which would probably be around 145 degrees. All three cells measured around 2.7 volts on the DMM and recharged with no problems. I currently have three unprotected LIR 123s and a dummy cell in the M90. This is working well but I have not checked runtime yet. My guess is that I will get around 30 or 40 minutes to approximately 50% of full brightness. I am guessing that this light will work well and have okay runtime with two 18650 cells but will be less bright from the start than what most of us want from this light. Yes, three equal sized cells to fill this and other 4 cell lights would be good. 
jc


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## jclarksnakes (Apr 2, 2006)

Looking at some of the threads about how far to run unprotected cells it looks like I exceeded what many knowledgeable CPF folks consider to be the safe limits of these cells. So "kids, don't try this at home". I will take the advice of others seriously and not mismatch these cells again and not run them past the point of noticeable dimunition of light output.
jc


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## Chronos (Apr 2, 2006)

Paul_in_MD I am on the same bandwagon! That would be great. Why hasn't anyone done this yet??? jclarksnakes you are one wild and crazy guy!!!


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## Robocop (Apr 2, 2006)

When I got this light the batteries were inside with the positive end facing up towards the tail cap. I thought this was to keep it from turning on during shipping so I quickly reversed the batteries with positive end facing down like normal.
My light worked fine like this until I read that you are to use the positive end facing out so I reversed the batteries. The light works both ways and I am wondering if it really matters how the batteries are installed. I do not notice any real difference in use and am curious how this light will function both ways.


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## bwaites (Apr 2, 2006)

Incandescents don't care which direction the current flows.

Pila/Wolfeyes reverses the cells because of the LED tailcaps.

Bill


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## Robocop (Apr 2, 2006)

So it works either way as long as I have a standard clicky tail cap....if I decide to get the LED tail cap I will have to keep the batteries reversed in order to use the LED tail cap?
I have a few of the DLG protected cells coming to me on Monday with a few other goodies. If these cells work as well as the factory W/E brand this light will sale very well to several of my co-workers. I have already had at least 20 officers on my shift comment on how nice it is. It really does make the old Stingers look bad and I have one co-worker who keeps a TigerLight in his duty bag and this is the only light that comes close. Output is similiar however the Tiger looks very brownish when compared to the D36 lamp. The Raider throws more total light I believe and the throw is a little better as well.

The TigerLight is much larger as well however still a very nice light. This was a tough decision for me as I take my duty gear very serious. I feel I made the right choice as this light continues to amaze me each time I use it.


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## Keltec (Apr 4, 2006)

Robocop said:


> It really does make the old Stingers look bad and I have one co-worker who keeps a TigerLight in his duty bag and this is the only light that comes close. Output is similiar however the Tiger looks very brownish when compared to the D36 lamp. The Raider throws more total light I believe and the throw is a little better as well.
> 
> The TigerLight is much larger as well however still a very nice light. This was a tough decision for me as I take my duty gear very serious. I feel I made the right choice as this light continues to amaze me each time I use it.



Robocop, could you write a bit more about comparision between the Tigerlight and the Raider ? Is really the Raider producing more light and has better reach that the Tigerlight ? Maybe that Tigerlight is unuasually weak ? Does it have LA gen 4 and a new bettery pack ? According to flashlightreviews.com a Tigerlight has 240.00 units of overall output and 144.91 of throw (comparison chart equivalent). 
Wolf-Eyes Rattlesnake M90X: 170.00 and 89.44.
Wolf-Eyes Eagle 3AX: 120.00 and 77.46.

Does a Tigerlight (FBOP version without OC spray) has any advantages over a Raider ?


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## Robocop (Apr 5, 2006)

Keltec the Tiger Light my co-worker uses is about 2 years old and it is most likely still on the original battery pack. The Tiger is a very nice light however for my personal opinion it was a little too bulky to carry on my belt.

When comparing the Raider to my friends Tiger Light the spill beam of the Raider was brighter and the spot was also a whiter tint. This may make the Raider "look" brighter however it was a much more pretty beam in my opinion.

The area we tested them in was the parking lot under an overhead expressway. There was a little ambient light however it was pretty dark. The Tiger light threw a beam very well however at about 40 yards the spot was more concentrated than the Raider. The Raider seemed to throw a bigger hotspot of light for the same distance just not as concentrated as the TL. The spill of the Raider also makes the light look brighter simply as it lights up a larger area with more usable light. With the Raider the entire beam both spot and corona can be used very well to see a large area.

If I were shining both lights into a large 2 car garage from about 30 feet away the Tiger would do well however I do not think my friends light would light up both sides of the room. The Raider would concentrate a large hotspot in the middle and the spill would light up the rest of the area with usable light. You have to actually see the beam of the Raider to understand what I am trying to say here but it is a very nice light. For patrol work it is perfect. Most of my critical lighting incidents involve people within 30 to 40 feet or most often a building search. If I enter a room and find a person inside I can clearly see them with the hotspot and will also be able to see any other threats left or right due to that incredible spill light of the Raider.

It reminds me of an incandescent version of the KL4 with much better throw. I was a little afraid at first as some had described this Wolf-Eyes lights as having a wall of light type beam. I kind of see why now as the new style lamps do have a wall of light but it somehow throws this huge size spot and spill a good distance. I am truly very happy with this light however I will not knock the TigerLight. I am sure the new versions are much improved however again I feel they are a bit bulky. The one my friend uses has seen many hard nights and it keeps going however he does not carry it on his person but in a duty bag. The beam is excellent but compared to the Raider it looks brownish in color. It may actually be putting out more light however if so it is not very much more according to our results.


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## Alan1224 (Apr 5, 2006)

Paul_in_Maryland said:


> Chronos,
> Wouldn't it be great if we could "have it all" by running the 12V, 300-lumen lamp with three lithium-ions that exactly fill the 2x168A body? See this thread. I can't understand why Wolf Eyes, Pila, and Microfire all ignore the pent-up demand for such a cell size.


 
Can solve the problem by design a special longer tailcap, if want it shorter, would better weld the tree LRB-150A together.

Another way is to make extender body. If so, can use both three LRB-150A and LRB-168A! shorter extender body for LRB-150A, longer one for LRB-168A. Not sure if would be good looking!:laughing:


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## [email protected] (Apr 5, 2006)

> Originally Posted by Paul_in_Maryland
> Chronos,
> Wouldn't it be great if we could "have it all" by running the 12V, 300-lumen lamp with three lithium-ions that exactly fill the 2x168A body? See this thread. I can't understand why Wolf Eyes, Pila, and Microfire all ignore the pent-up demand for such a cell size.





> Originally Posted by Alan1224
> Can solve the problem by design a special longer tailcap, if want it shorter, would better weld the tree LRB-150A together.


Thanks guys, you now have Wolf Eyes attention! :twothumbs 
They emailed me last night and suggested making an extended tail cap. Gee I wonder how they got that idea? :thinking:
I’ll start working out the details tonight with Wolf Eyes and keep you posted.


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## Paul_in_Maryland (Apr 5, 2006)

Thanks, Alan and Mike. I submitted the extender idea to Wolf Eyes of Canada at least a year ago, but never got a reply. I also posted the plea for such an extender in CPF's Mod forum but no one felt it would be a money maker.


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## Chronos (Apr 5, 2006)

Great news! Sign me up!


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## Robocop (Apr 6, 2006)

Ok after about a week of use no problems here and it holds a charge very well so far. I have cycled the batteries about twice so far and have also used some of AWs 18500s as spares with no problems.

The only thing I have noticed is the holster. While a pretty nice holster for daily carry the Velcro strap is starting to curl upwards and the light also seems to "snag" when pulling it out from a side draw on my hip. The tail cap grabs almost every time and has almost forced me to drop the light a time or two. I was able to get my older Duty holster to Fit this light and it works well however is an open top holster. This is ok with me as it is what I am used to carrying.

I think I will stay with the use of my leather older holster and use the W/E holster for something else. I was able to use the light in a pretty heavy rainstorm for about 15 minutes and it worked perfectly. I also have dropped it twice both from hip level and no problems there so far either. I did find myself worrying at first about scuffing up the light however this is un-avoidable in my line of work so character marks are many more to come.


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## Paul_in_Maryland (Apr 7, 2006)

[email protected] said:


> Thanks guys, you now have Wolf Eyes attention! :twothumbs
> They emailed me last night and suggested making an extended tail cap. Gee I wonder how they got that idea? :thinking:
> I’ll start working out the details tonight with Wolf Eyes and keep you posted.


Mike just kept us posted in this new Wolf Eyes 3x150A adapter thread. Our prayers may be answered.


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## smoking (Apr 9, 2006)

i got my Wolf Eyes 9AX last friday. i had the turbo bezel as well to convert it to the 9D. since i was on night shift i took the opportunity to bring it to work and use it. the light is very well made. here are some beam shots i took using my 6230i mobile phone. i'm using 3 primary 123 energizer e2 lithium cells. 
an outdoor shot using standard mode. the silver wall cladding is about 20 feet away. the area has got lots of ambient light from surrounding buildings.







an indoor shot using standard mode. about 40 feet away. actually the room was very well lit up with the 9D. plenty of side spill.





this the KL 1/VG 1 beam shot.





this shot is taken using night mode. slightly more realistic but the end of the wall is not as white washed. the side spill and the faraway spot at the end was very pleasing to my eye.






this how the room looks like after the lights are turned on. the lights are placed on the edge of the brown table when taking the beam shots.


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## Keltec (Apr 9, 2006)

Smoking, do you have access to a Tigerlight ? Could you compare Wolf Eyes 9AX with it ?


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## smoking (Apr 10, 2006)

i do not have a tiger light to compare with it.



Keltec said:


> Smoking, do you have access to a Tigerlight ? Could you compare Wolf Eyes 9AX with it ?


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## Robocop (May 17, 2006)

Ok I have now had this light on duty nightly for several weeks and the batteries are holding up very well. Performance in general is incredible however there are a few differences between the Raider and my old SureFire.

First my older Commander was used for several years and the anodizing was simply perfect. Not much wear at all however the Raider is showing signs of wear around the tailcap from sliding in and out of the leather holster. This is not a problem for me at all however it was the first thing I noticed.

The only problem I have had thus far would be the lens assembly. Now this was not at all a problem with the light and my fault entirely. I dropped the Raider last night during a footchase when I leaped a fence. It was about a 3 foot drop to concrete and suprisingly enough showed no damage to the bezel itself however the lens cracked. It is not a horrible crack and the light works perfectly however the lens is cracked and I fear it may become much worse with another drop. I do plan to happily buy a spare lense however I am now curious if the glass used in the SureFires are somehow different.

I must have dropped my old Commander several hundred times over a few years and never had a cracked lens. I do remember the lens being very thick as I often removed it for cleaning. The Raider lens does not seem to come out however the bezel can be removed for cleaning. I can not tell how thick the Raider glass is just by looking into the bezel. I am wondering if I have any other options for a lens as I am sure this light will see many more hard nights of use. Maybe the replacement I order will have better luck...it may have simply been one of those things that happen and will never happen again...who knows.

All in all the light and service I received from Mike at pacific was incredible and I am already planning additional purchases. It is hard to pass up the special he has now on the standard Raider model and I am planning on purchasing one of those as well as the 13 volt lamp just to experiment with. I may even get one of the M90 models to use the extension with and have a 13 volt set-up.

So any ideas of the lens problem...do I have any options to use another material or is it common for a drop to crack any lens at any time?


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## Lightraven (May 17, 2006)

Surefire uses tempered Pyrex, which is hardened. From the Surefire 2006 catalog, "[Tempering] gives the piece several times the structural strength of common slow-cooled, or annealed, glass."

I dropped my M6 jumping out of my vehicle and it hit a rock bezel down and scratched the lens/window, but did not crack, chip or break it. The drop was only 2-3 feet, but a loaded M6 is a heavy weight for the glass to absorb. The lamp was fine, too. 

Generally, I trust Surefire to build their equipment to be fairly rugged, even if not always reliable.


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## Robocop (May 17, 2006)

Well after a little research I know know that there are many different types of glass used for lenses. I am not complaining at all as the light is very well suited for my uses however I feel it is not the same quality lens used in the SF lights. I plan on keeping a few spares handy.


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## Somy Nex (May 17, 2006)

hmmm.. i know that the lens on my Pila GL4 is made out of 'tempered glass', but perhaps there might be different grades of tempered glass, or maybe yours fell at a particularly bad angle for it. i've dropped mine on soft-wood floors before, but never on concrete or anything too hard. in any case, i hope you can find some replacement lenses for it. 

that offer from PTS is very tempting, and if only i weren't broke right now


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## Robocop (May 17, 2006)

I have tried to push the lens out in order to get a measurement and maybe see about a sidebrand replacement. It does not seem to move any and I am afraid to push it too hard as I do not want to break it further. It still works well and really does nothing to the beam as it is a crack just around the outside diameter and is not in the way.

I am mostly afraid of it breaking much worse if I keep trying to remove it. A future impact could break it out completely so for now I am leaving well enough alone.

I do think it most likely just hit at a bad angle as I can see no real scratches or other damage to the bezel. I do know it was the impact from dropping it as I had just showed the light to a co-worker about an hour before the drop and it was fine.
I found the specs on Mikes website however only the bezel attatchment itself is offered. I found no mention of the type glass used in the lens however I will say mine is beautifully clear.I may try to check with someone light flashlightlens.com for a suitable replacement that is if I can remove the lens from the bezel. Can anyone with the same light check and see if your lens will seperate from the bezel?


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## Paul_in_Maryland (May 17, 2006)

I don't think the lens can be removed.


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