# Smith & Wesson delta force 6v



## uz2busmc (Mar 28, 2006)

Anyone had experience with this particular light?


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## Brighteyez (Mar 28, 2006)

Other than firearms and handcuffs, the Smith & Wesson branding on just about anything else seems be an indicator that it is of pretty low quality. A quick check on web sites seems to reveal that the flashlight you inquired about is being sold at a price that is pretty close to what you would pay for one of the lower priced Surefire or Streamlight 6V Xenon lights (like a G2 or a Scorpion. Your money would probably be better spent on one of those two lights than the unknown entity (also better warranties from the established flashlight companies.)



uz2busmc said:


> Anyone had experience with this particular light?


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## uz2busmc (Mar 28, 2006)

A buddy of mine had already picked one up, I was more or less just curious on the value per dollar of the light. To see how it might happen to stack up against some of the contenders that you mentioned. I do appreciate the feedback though.


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## jarobi (Mar 28, 2006)

Sorry to hijack your thread...Would you ask your friend what he thinks of the holster that ships with the light? A good friend of mine works with drains/sewers and that holster would be perfect for him if it's reliable/durable. 

Thank you and regards,
jarobi


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## uz2busmc (Mar 28, 2006)

yep, i'll ask tomorrow. looks cheap on the website though.


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## Icebreak (Mar 28, 2006)

uz2busmc said:


> yep, i'll ask tomorrow. looks cheap on the website though.


Possibly my least favored torch is a ChinaLight badged with a firearms manufacturer's label.

If you post a link to this light it's possible that the manufacturer/model might be identified. Then you might get opinions or direction to a review. Many members like some of the Nuwai torches.

I would encourage you to consider a 3 cell SureFire...BST or the above mentioned sources. Some good prices can be had.


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## uz2busmc (Mar 29, 2006)

Jarobi,
Well, took a look at the case today, seemed to be "ok". It seems to have a little bit of durability, I think it wood do well for your friends application, I don't care for the light though, too many artifacts in the beam as it has a smooth reflector.

Icebreak, 
I already have a 12v Cabela XPG, I was just inquiring about the S & W for a friend. As far as the SF lights - I'll pass, the XPG has a nice beam, really good throw, and over 200 lumens with 80min. runtime. All for $57 shipped... although I do like some of the 3v surefires...


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## jarobi (Mar 29, 2006)

Thank you for your reply.


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## Icebreak (Mar 29, 2006)

12v Cabela XPG

Looks good for $57 shipped. Nice reflector.


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## SmithWessonLites (Apr 20, 2006)

I wanted to clarify some things about the Delta Force Tactical Light 
( SW700XT ). 

PowerTech (Smith & Wesson Flashlights) takes great pride in the name Smith & Wesson. We always put quality first in everything we make. One of the reasons why our lights are selling so well in the market now is because of the improvements we're always making with our lights and also the value we offer with the quality.

For example, the Delta Force is certified at 93 Lumens. It runs up to 2 hours on a set of batteries. I've actually got 130 minutes in my personal experiences. But not only does it have these impressive performance features but it also comes with the holster, a spare Xenon bulb & Energizer Lithiums. All this AND it retails for normally $ 34.99. 

We have improved the bulb quality this year and beam focus. Right now we are in the process of developing a parabolic reflector which will improve the beam quality even more.

And as for our warranty. It's Limited Lifetime. The only things NOT covered are the bulb & batteries.


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## Brighteyez (Apr 20, 2006)

Thank you. It's good to know the name behind classic product brands like Smith & Wesson, and Coleman.



SmithWessonLites said:


> PowerTech (Smith & Wesson Flashlights) takes great pride in the name Smith & Wesson. We always put quality first in everything we make. One of the reasons why our lights are selling so well in the market now is because of the improvements we're always making with our lights and also the value we offer with the quality.


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## uz2busmc (Apr 20, 2006)

Can you say when the parabolic reflector will be available???


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## 250Brider (Apr 20, 2006)

smithwessonlites sorry to be off topic, but I am trying to find a new head assy for a s+w fl10, any ideas where I might find one. thanks.


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## Brighteyez (Apr 20, 2006)

I don't think he posts here very often, at least not by his posting history. I suspect his company is actually the importer rather than being the manufacturer, since those lights are made in China and he's in TN. You might want to contact PowerTech directly to see if they have replacement parts available,

Phone: 901 850-9393
E-mail: [email protected] 




250Brider said:


> smithwessonlites sorry to be off topic, but I am trying to find a new head assy for a s+w fl10, any ideas where I might find one. thanks.


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## Icebreak (Apr 20, 2006)

SmithWessonLites said:


> PowerTech (Smith & Wesson Flashlights) takes great pride in the name Smith & Wesson. We always put quality first in everything we make.



Make? It's doubtful PowerTech manufactures these. It's more likely that PowerTech is an exclusive licensed distributor and that the manufacturer is an outsource.


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## Brighteyez (Apr 20, 2006)

Generally, companies will contract with one of the factories in China to produce the designed product. Some larger companies may actually have their own factories and US personnel in-country for QC purposes. In other cases they may just import a pre-designed product that has had a brand logo and unique color.




Icebreak said:


> Make? It's doubtful PowerTech manufactures these. It's more likely that PowerTech is an exclusive licensed distributor and that the manufacturer is an outsource.


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## Icebreak (Apr 20, 2006)

Brighteyes -

I got distracted and left my preview sitting for hours, then didn't re-preview so I didn't see your post.

It sounds like we came to the same conclusion.

I believe this is Jack Pyles.

He's claimed manufacturing SW lights before. Previous claim.

However, on an S&W forum he says something closer to reality.

Something similar was posted a couple of years ago by a guy that said his friend designed Browning BlackIce lights.


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## Brighteyez (Apr 20, 2006)

Jack Pyles is indeed the name he used for his registration on this site and he indicates that he's in sales for that company. 

It would appear that they are actually the company behind the use of the S&W and Coleman names for portable lights.

It's not unusual for importers to claim to be manufacturers, it's probably just a good idea to take it with a grain of salt and not waste a lot of effort with it. Kind of reminds me of the days when computer assemblers ran mom&pop store fronts, and they all claimed to be the motherboard manufacturer as well. (the absence of a wave soldering machine in the back room kinda made me suspect that something may have been lost in the translation  ).




Icebreak said:


> Brighteyes -
> 
> I got distracted and left my preview sitting for hours, then didn't re-preview so I didn't see your post.
> 
> ...


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## Icebreak (Apr 20, 2006)

Brighteyez said:


> It's not unusual for importers to claim to be manufacturers, it's probably just a good idea to take it with a grain of salt and not waste a lot of effort with it.



I totally understand that point of view. In fact I'm not nearly the ChinaLight sentinel or BS detector I used to be. The interests of the members of this growing board are more varied than in years past. There used to be a group of us that quickly shunned introductions of ChinaLights especially if we could tell the presenter was just some schmuck using drop shipping and knew what Alibaba was. Anymore I don't think it's good to poo poo every ChinaLight that shows up. I did jump on that 7 watter but backed off because the guys were having fun with it.

I've noticed that you too like to keep facts straight. A certain drop-in LED replacement comes to mind. Those were some good and informative posts you made about that product and the large shipping charge.

On this Smith and Wesson light I think we both gave uz2busmc a good heads-up but it turned out he knew what he was doing and one of those things was having fun helping out a buddy. So I backed totally off of this one until Mr. Pyles posted up using his relaxed definition of what a manufacturer is.

I don't think I'll be able to let go of my disdain for Browning or Smith and Wesson or even Hummer lights even though some of them might not be too bad. My dislike of them is not for my sake or the sake of well informed flashlight aficionados. It's for the less informed consumer. Here is a snippet of something I posted in 2004:

May I share a nightmare? Here’s the scene:

A good kid is watching the History Channel with his older brother or uncle or dad or grandpa. They are fascinated with the background of the firearms manufacturer the program is highlighting. They are in wonderment seeing the skills being passed from generation to generation. The excellent design of the action of the gun is interesting to them. The view of the factory processes causes them to wink at each other because they actually own some of these shotguns.

Later that night Junior is researching the internet and exclaims, “Hey, look at this!” Sure enough, he has found where to get a Browning flashlight on-line. Oh my! Powerful, dependable and handsome. Having mental images of talented men with skilled hands guiding barrels through series of dripping lathes and tooling, they nervously fill out the order. They hit the buy button then become thrilled and filled with excited anticipation.

Little do they know, that flashlight they just ordered was possibly cooked up for stock by the Guangdong Foundry in China, likely shaped and cut by the Shyquang Corporation then trimmed out by a subcontractor in Taiwan and finally shipped out by Nuwai to the US distributor.

Some nightmares may not always be scary but they can result in an ill feeling.

My apologies to uz2busmc for the OT.



Brighteyez said:


> ...Kind of reminds me of the days when computer assemblers ran mom&pop store fronts, and they all claimed to be the motherboard manufacturer as well. (the absence of a wave soldering machine in the back room kinda made me suspect that something may have been lost in the translation  ).


Yep.


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## SmithWessonLites (Apr 21, 2006)

I apologize for the delay in my replies to the other comments. 

You are correct. PowerTech Inc. is the worldwide exclusive licensee of Smith & Wesson Flashlights. We design the lights here in Collierville, TN and have them produced in China. I apologize for claiming to be the manufacturer of the lights without specifying what that means in detail. Sometimes it's just easier to say we make the lights (because we do HAVE them made, our factory workers are just in another country) rather than explain the whole licensee thing because most people don't understand how that works. Obviously, CPF members are smarter than the average bear and know the difference. I was not trying to imply that we physically MAKE the lights here in the U.S.

As for us just "slapping" the name on a pre-made light, that is NOT true. While some of our flashlights do favor other import lights on the market (i.e.-the Costco 2AA I've seen discussed on CPF), we do not just slap the name on the light. We sometimes take a basic light and "tweak" a few things like a better bulb and head design,thicker aluminum or better guts in general, but in many lights (especially in the past couple years), we truly focus on creating an original design and idea. We submit the artwork and they make it for us. We can't help if other Chinese factories copy our ideas.

Another point is the fact that our lights are tested and approved by S&W hqtrs before anything is produced. I can't speak for other gun manufacturers and the quality standards they may or may not have for their licensed products but I promise you that S&W takes great pride in their name and they have turned down products in the past because they didn't think it lived up to the S&W name.


Here's my personal opinion (Jack Pyles, not PowerTech)

I would like to point out that the CPF members are "flashaholics" as you call it. You seek out THE best in lights and related items. Please understand. PowerTech has never claimed that we have BETTER lights than SureFire,ARC,Pila, etc... We focus on the average joe that may see one of those lights and faint at the price tag. When it comes to the custom lights CPF members make themselves, I believe there is NO light that compares to a hand built light; not even SureFires. We emphasize quality AND value in a name brand. CPF members are the people that pay $500 for a flashlight which is fine, but the customer we target is the average guy that just wants a good light and a fair price. I'm look forward to any comments. Just be nice

You may reply here or to me directly - 

[email protected]
(901) 850-9393 Phone

P.S.- The FL-7 and FL-10 were never made by PowerTech. PowerTech acquired the license in 1999 and I believe they only made those 2 lights before we had the license. Those lights were made by a company called Bell Sports which also makes bicycle helmets. Ebay is really the only place I know to get replacement parts other than maybe Bell Sports themselves.


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## chevrofreak (Apr 21, 2006)

I've heard the same stuff from another MFG before and it turned out to be BS. 

Your "Galaxy Luxeon" sure does look familiar


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## Brighteyez (Apr 21, 2006)

Maybe Costco copied it before it came out with the S&W moniker? 

Seriously though, the Chinese plants often use the same molds with different guts (or different components.) Or since Costco was no longer using that mold, it went up for grabs? 



chevrofreak said:


> I've heard the same stuff from another MFG before and it turned out to be BS.
> 
> Your "Galaxy Luxeon" sure does look familiar


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## Icebreak (Apr 21, 2006)

SmithWessonLites - 

Referencing this: _"Another point is the fact that our lights are tested and approved by S&W hqtrs before anything is produced."_

Many members know that QC for a licensed distributor can be a horrifically challenging task. Specifications are given to a manufacturer. Eventually a prototypical offering is delivered that closely meets those specs and it is presented by the licensee for approval to the agents and representatives of the company that allows the license. The prototypical offering gets approved. After that, a myriad of variables can come into play that can compromise or defeat the initiative.

_"We submit the artwork and they make it for us."_

I don't think that Powertechinc designed Delta Force lights but more likely, submitted specs. I recognize too many engineering elements of Delta Force to think otherwise. Powertechinc's site says that these lights are made from TiAl. If they truly are you may have a bunch of incoming sales. If they are just TiAlN coated, that would still be well received.

It's good that your latest post strives to come closer to defining what Powertechinc actually does. If Powertechinc can successfully QC an acceptable light from China, that is an accomplishment that might cause the light to be attractive to some.

I won't be a buyer but it would be worthwhile to consider that CPF2006 is not CPF2000, CPF2002 or CPF2004. Some members might like to try this light out if it has good QC.


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## McPig (Jan 29, 2007)

Rather old thread, but I purchased several of these for use on department issued AR-15 carbines. 

We compared side by side with a SF 6P. The size, quality, fit, finish and brightness appeared to match that of the more expensive light. Have only been running it for about a month but so far very pleased with the light. Good value for the money IMNSHO. 

Holster/pouch is black with black flap snap. It's also well made and the velcro straps on back work on MOLLE loops. Has a side pouch for two more CR123 batteries. Also comes with a small mini-case for the spare bulb. This is a small, black anodized, aluminum tube with a screw threaded top to hold you spare in armored safety. Even has an attachment point on the cap for a split ring or para-cord string to attach to key ring, or to your vest.


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## Blacklight (Jan 31, 2007)

Why does Coleman keep getting mentioned here? I can tell you without a doubt they have nothing to do with Coleman branded products. Coleman lighting products are designed, inspected and built in factories that in most cases are exclusive partners. The only lights that this is not the case is Spotlightss (Claimed 1 million and higher candle power), which are made by a licencee through the end of this year. In 2008, even those built after that time will be built in that manner. If there is ever a question on Coleman branded lights feel free to ask me or PM me, I am the one responsible for lighting at Coleman.





Brighteyez said:


> Jack Pyles is indeed the name he used for his registration on this site and he indicates that he's in sales for that company.
> 
> It would appear that they are actually the company behind the use of the S&W and Coleman names for portable lights.
> 
> It's not unusual for importers to claim to be manufacturers, it's probably just a good idea to take it with a grain of salt and not waste a lot of effort with it. Kind of reminds me of the days when computer assemblers ran mom&pop store fronts, and they all claimed to be the motherboard manufacturer as well. (the absence of a wave soldering machine in the back room kinda made me suspect that something may have been lost in the translation  ).


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## jayflash (Jan 31, 2007)

If it's anything like the 2XCR123 Winchester incan I got for $9, the glove compartment may be a good place for it.


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## Offeror (Jan 31, 2007)

I'm a new member who has to start somewhere, and I think this is a good spot because I have worked in the Merchandising Division of a major motion picture company and sold licenses for popular movie "brands" like Knight Rider, A-Team, E.T., and some others. 

Licensing isn't that hard to understand. It is a relatively recent development in terms of gun industry name brands.

Here's how it works at the minimum -- A producer of some product, like T-shirts, knives, flashlights, gloves, toys, lunch buckets -- you name it -- thinks it can make good profits by placing the respected name on a portion of its production. It makes a contract with the owner of the brand, and the brand owner takes a percentage -- 3, 5, maybe 10% -- for allowing the producer of the licensed merchandise to use its name. 

As an example, you might permit a glove importer with a Chinese manufacturer to sew a Knight Rider label onto its gloves. The glove seller is betting that he will make a lot more sales on "Knight Rider glovers," and the owner of the brand gets a percentage of every pair of gloves sold. 

Recently, somebody has started actively seeking licenses on names like Winchester, Uzi, Remington, S&W, and so forth. I'm surprised, actually, that they didn't do it sooner. Now we have, for example, a lot of knives made by mediocre-grade companies being sold at 2 or 3 times the price of the same knife without the logo, precisely because the brand name is on them. 

I'm not saying all licensed merchandising is junk, because each licensed brand has the option to scrutinize, test, review, and specify hi-grade materials for its licensed merchandise. But of course there are always going to be manufacturers who will take the profit available by leasing their name to the best bidder, even if their branded knives are made by Frost or Buddy-L (is that the name?) rather than SOG or Kershaw or Cold Steel. 

The moral of this explanation is that each licensed product has to be judged on its own merits. Smart consumer buys are usually made unnecessarily difficult on licenced products by the fact that the actual maker of the item is hard to discover. I don't buy knives OR flashlights which fail to include all the technical specs on the packaging. In the case of flashlights, that might be Lumens or candlepower, for example. I had to go home and search the Internet before buying a Brinkmann CR123/Xenon light, because the fine print said nothing about comparative brightness. 

When AT&T contracted to make E.T. telephones, everybody was going to be aware that the maker & seller was AT&T. But when a low-grade ten-dollar knife maker sells Winchester, Hummer, or Harley Davidson knives at a price higher than the same knife without the logo (maybe 35 bucks vs. 10 on the plain one), you often will not be told who made it, or on what quality scale. 

Some brands do participate strenuously in assuring that only high quality products bear their name -- the Cold Steel Gunsite knives come to mind, as does the whole line of E.T. merchandise, every aspect of which had to be approved by Spielberg's office. But other times the deal is made as a source of ancillary income, and the brand will go wherever the money happens to be. 

One final note: I don't hate everything from China. The Brinkmann MiniMax LX I just bought cost me $20, and replacement bulbs will only cost me $5, while the Surefire G2 Nitrolon I've been using cost $33, with replacement bulb assemblies at $17. Since these flashlights have a habit of crapping out after being dropped only once in a parking lot or on a sidewalk (where most people will routinely use their lights in the real world), the actual cost of an entry-level Surefire G2 Nitrolon can quickly become prohibitively rich. And an imprudent choice for the market's best consumers. 

After replacing my G2's assembly once, when it died a second time I retired it -- since the bulb assembly would cost me almost the same as a new Brinkmann, which provides equal Lumens for less than $20 and offers replacement bulbs for about $5. Let this be an open letter of warning to Surefire. By the way, they should be offering the rechargeable batteries as well as the regular 123's. I've been using rechargeables for quite a while now and am absolutely delighted with the quality, the equal power, the longevity, and the huge sums of money I've saved. 

I can't see paying Surefire $17 for a replacement bulb just because they can't make their lights even a little bit drop-proof (they don't even give you a lanyard loop to lash the thing to your wrist as a preventative). I may go back to Surefire, of course, if they ever warranty their bulbs and provide free replacements for non-abusive failures, or if they offer cheaper bulbs instead of the over-complex, over-priced "assemblies," or if they make their flashlights as tough as Glocks when it comes to reasonable real-life abuses.

But until then I've decided to go with the comparable products that don't require the price of a new flashlight to replace some fragile bulb filament.


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