# Toughest survival flashlight



## seanflash (Apr 14, 2009)

Hi All:

I have been researching a few threads posted on emergency lights but I have a speceific question that could use some advice. I am looking for suggestions on a _*tough as nails*_ flashlight that can handle a lot.

I want a light that satisfies two requirements: 1) _Incredible_ run time 2) A tactical light that's insanely _tough_. If I want to use it as a hammer, I could. Basically reliability is a priority.

I hike a lot and often camp out alone. In the odd event, I can't make it back to my starting point-I want to be sure I have light for a long time. I also want it to be able to handle tough weather, use, drops etc.. 

I appreciate everyone's input and value it just as much. Thanks in advance.


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## Marduke (Apr 14, 2009)

TK20 is close, if you are satisfied with the runtime in low (11 hours). It is definitely tough as nails.


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## :)> (Apr 14, 2009)

Ra Clicky or the Ra Twisty!


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## etc (Apr 14, 2009)

I dropped my Leef/Malkoff M60 from the roof. It landed pretty hard, with evidence to prove this. All keeps working.


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## BlueBeam22 (Apr 14, 2009)

seanflash said:


> I have been researching a few threads posted on emergency lights but I have a speceific question that could use some advice. I am looking for suggestions on a _*tough as nails*_ flashlight that can handle a lot.
> 
> I want a light that satisfies two requirements: 1) _Incredible_ run time 2) A tactical light that's insanely _tough_. If I want to use it as a hammer, I could. Basically reliability is a priority.


 
SureFire 6PL Defender.


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## Burgess (Apr 14, 2009)

Interesting, thought-provoking question.


Tell me . . . .


Is "water-proof" one of your requirements ?


Ability to withstand being submerged,

or even being *used* while submerged ?


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## seanflash (Apr 14, 2009)

Okay_ I should point out what I need it for. Perhaps a mock-worst case scenario would better define what I need: Critical ejection from my fighter at 20K feet. Landing (safely I'd hope) in unfriendly territory with my survival sack and _this _flashlight. What would I need at my side? The military provides us with an okay led light, but I need something damned tough that I could count on for days if need be. I'd like something that I could also use to whack bad guys with ...or tree stakes for my tent-whichever comes first. Surely the best minds on this forum could come together to recommend one better than my government grade one. 
Thank you to all for your help. Regards.


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## Splunk_Au (Apr 14, 2009)

Considering this light will be used in pretty crucial situations, I feel that you should first single out the part which is most prone to malfunction. That is the clicky switch, why take the risk right?

Definitely get a twisty light, but since you want something big enough to hit people and tent stakes, not sure if there is a twisty light big enough for that.


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## richardcpf (Apr 14, 2009)

I think most people will come up with different answer because that is the flashlight they own.

Most quality flashlights are tough and durable, but only few have *proven* reliability, Fenix T series is one of them. You can do a search in youtube, there are plenty videos showing the Fenix T1 in several torture test.


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## youreacrab (Apr 14, 2009)

You want the Surefire E2L. Tough, slim, lightweight, proven. Powerful 60 lumen high spot for 4-5 hours and a decent low at 3 lumens with usable light for 100 hours. Fenix E01 1xAAA for backup.


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## Zeruel (Apr 14, 2009)

seanflash said:


> I want a light that satisfies two requirements: 1) _Incredible_ run time 2) A tactical light that's insanely _tough_. If I want to use it as a hammer, I could. Basically reliability is a priority.



Surefire E2DL - (manufacturer rated 76 hours on low)
Inova T2 (125 lumens 4 hours)
For these 2, you don't hammer to test, you use tanks, specifically Abrams :naughty:

My 2¢. I'm sure there're more that fit these 2 criteria, example Gerber Infinity Ultra etc.


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## Forgetful (Apr 14, 2009)

Good tight 2-3 cell P60 host with a Malkoff M60l. 4.5 hours of full brightness then a few hours of decent brightness and another few hours of usable brightness.


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## Woods Walker (Apr 14, 2009)

I think my overall most bomb proof light is the Surefire G2Z with P60L LED drop in but I really want to get a M60LL drop in for better regulated runtimes. Still there is just one mode so the requirement for incredible runtimes might not be met. But my G2Z has been around the woods and never failed so guessing the tough as nails part might be covered.


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## Dan FO (Apr 15, 2009)

seanflash said:


> Okay_ I should point out what I need it for. Perhaps a mock-worst case scenario would better define what I need: Critical ejection from my fighter at 20K feet. Landing (safely I'd hope) in unfriendly territory with my survival sack and _this _flashlight. What would I need at my side? The military provides us with an okay led light, but I need something damned tough that I could count on for days if need be. I'd like something that I could also use to whack bad guys with ...or tree stakes for my tent-whichever comes first. Surely the best minds on this forum could come together to recommend one better than my government grade one.
> Thank you to all for your help. Regards.



Ok, what light did the government issue you? Let's start from there.

Do you want 1 or 2 cells?


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## old4570 (Apr 15, 2009)

whoa , tail clicky is out then , as it would deff be a weak point .

I think your looking at a custom Maglite . Deff can use the tailcap of a maglite to hammer tent pegs etc . 

tough ask there , maybe you need a survival knife for hammering or striking . 

??? Dont they issue K-Bars for that stuff . 

Only flashlight Id consider is a 2D Custom maglite , multi level driver and some 10,000mAh Batts , aaaaw heck , even a 2D Maglite with Terralux and 2 x D 10,000 mAh batts .. Top of the line D's may go 14,000mAh .

My oldest Mag is nearly 20 years old :


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## Dan FO (Apr 15, 2009)

You asked for it. --> http://www.bugoutgearusa.com/jemiti.html

Or the budget model. --> http://www.bugoutgearusa.com/jemi.html


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## bullfrog (Apr 15, 2009)

Woods Walker said:


> I think my overall most bomb proof light is the Surefire G2Z with P60L LED drop in but I really want to get a M60LL drop in for better regulated runtimes. Still there is just one mode so the requirement for incredible runtimes might not be met. But my G2Z has been around the woods and never failed so guessing the tough as nails part might be covered.



+1

I was thinking a G2L host with an M60LL.

I would also trust my Ra Twisty or a Surefire L1.

I would be inclined to avoid clickies.


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## rkJr (Apr 15, 2009)

:)> said:


> Ra Clicky or the Ra Twisty!



+1 for the Ra Clicky or Twisty!!!


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## FlashlightsNgear.com (Apr 15, 2009)

Olight Warrior, any version, super long run times and theirs not a better built light, that Ive seen. Plus it will run 150 hours on low with one battery (18650) , double o-ring sealed with a holster that allows you to carry 2 more 18650 batteries, you could die of starvation long before your light would run out lol.


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## Sgt. LED (Apr 15, 2009)

Where in this state are you?
I'm in Huntington.


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## PhantomPhoton (Apr 15, 2009)

+2 For a Ra Twisty. It has the long runtime requirement covered and is tougher than anything else out there which I'm aware of.


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## FlashlightsNgear.com (Apr 15, 2009)

Hello, I am just North of Charleston off I77, a place called Goldtown in Jackson County, good to see a few West Virginians in here, great forum with alot of really nice and very helpful people. Go Errs, opps - I root for the Herd too, when they are not playing WVU lol.


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## carrot (Apr 15, 2009)

Ra and Surefire are your best bets.


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## ampdude (Apr 15, 2009)

Since this is the LED forum, I'd say Surefire L5, G2L, something like that.


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## Sgt. LED (Apr 15, 2009)

That's great to hear! I hope to see you on here in the future.

Spread the WV point of view! 

You need anything or have questions just PM me anytime. :twothumbs


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## Strauss (Apr 15, 2009)

Another vote for the Ra Clicky or Twisty! The Twisty is hands down the toughest light known to man. With that said, I am sure the Clicky would take any and all the abuse you could possibly throw at it in that type of situation. 

The Ra's are well known for their bomb-proof construction, and the Twisty is the toughest since it has no switch to possibly fail.


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## Hooked on Fenix (Apr 15, 2009)

Fenix TA30.


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## old4570 (Apr 15, 2009)

should send this one to mythbusters ...

Let them smack some lights around to see what happens ..

They can afford it !


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## woodrow (Apr 15, 2009)

I would stay away from the SF lights (with the possible exception of te e2dl...not sure about water tight ness) because they have been proven in various threads to not be all that watertight. I would also want a long low level. 

The Fenix TA30 might fit in these regards...but it looks like a Big light...will know tomorrow when I get mine. I like the TK20 on lithiums...but if you have 2 sets...thats only 26 hours on low. 

The RA lights look tough as nails...and should not take a lot of space. They would most likely be my first choice.


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## adnj (Apr 15, 2009)

From the Ra website:

This production Ra Twisty was dropped repeatedly from a height exceeding 6 meters (20 feet) on to concrete, pavement and rocks. After 20 drops, the light was repeatedly thrown at concrete, pavement and rocks. The light still functions normally. The glass lens did not break even with this severe punishment. Can your flashlight survive this kind of treatment?


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## knivesandguns (Apr 15, 2009)

d1live said:


> Olight Warrior, any version, super long run times and theirs not a better built light, that Ive seen. Plus it will run 150 hours on low with one battery (18650) , double o-ring sealed with a holster that allows you to carry 2 more 18650 batteries, you could die of starvation long before your light would run out lol.



+1, people have accidentally (and purposely) tossed them around, off of the second story, thrown them around. They do have an insanely long runtime.


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## Bluehinder (Apr 15, 2009)

Dan FO said:


> You asked for it. --> http://www.bugoutgearusa.com/jemiti.html
> 
> Or the budget model. --> http://www.bugoutgearusa.com/jemi.html


 
Right on.


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## elugelab (Apr 15, 2009)

A 3d Maglite (for clubbing needs) modded with this, this (for breaking glass and poking in the eyes) and this (for... more poking?).

6+ hours for 3D-Cells at the rated output (240 lumens). It will continue to operate at reduced output for several more hours. That's with the alkalines.


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## elugelab (Apr 15, 2009)

Actually, just an ordinary Maglite 3D LED would be your best option. It's cheap, tough, has a very long runtime and can be used as a club.


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## nikon (Apr 15, 2009)

Here's an old review of a light that meets all of your requirements. You can literally drive nails with it, it's waterproof, completely reliable, can be used as a club on the enemy and will run continuously for a couple of days. The review is about five years old and the current model is far brighter than the one tested. It's the first light I'll grab when the SHTF..... http://www.flashlightreviews.com/reviews/tektite_excls4.htm


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## HoopleHead (Apr 15, 2009)

Ra Twisty is my current choice for this, and am actually building a small EDC kit around it.


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## carrot (Apr 15, 2009)

Hmm, Inova T series too.


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## Christoph (Apr 15, 2009)

Any HDS EDC
The toughest I've seen in real life.


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## glockboy (Apr 15, 2009)

+1 for the Fenix T1.




richardcpf said:


> I think most people will come up with different answer because that is the flashlight they own.
> 
> Most quality flashlights are tough and durable, but only few have *proven* reliability, Fenix T series is one of them. You can do a search in youtube, there are plenty videos showing the Fenix T1 in several torture test.


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## flashy bazook (Apr 15, 2009)

You should drop the requirement to hammer nails and what not. The weight penalty from 3xD Maglites is way too much for that! You could use your knife or a local rock to hammer things with if you need to.

Something like the Ra Twisty (my comments are based on reviews I read here as I do not, as yet, own one!) plus a couple of extra lithum primary cells (which weigh very little and are good against cold and heat--leak much less than other types) should satisfy all "reasonable" requirements.

If you are able to carry something a bit larger, the original Fenix tactical light (T1) has a stainless steel bezel and is plenty tough with good runtimes with large lumen outputs (2-stage).

If you go the Surefire 6P (or clone) plus drop-ins route, you can experiment with tailcaps with variable output to get the longer runtime/lower lumen outputs.


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## Flying Turtle (Apr 15, 2009)

From the lights I now own I think the Surefire L1 would meet most of your requirements. Not too big, twisty switch, good runtime on low, and plenty tough. A tiny backup like the E01 wouldn't hurt, too.

Geoff


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## AlecGold (Apr 15, 2009)

Surefire E1b is a good option, low and high mode, good focus, tough as nails, easily available, not cheap but certainly not that expensive, uses one 123 so a second is easily taken with you, lasts around 40 hours on low, so that is easily enough for 3 or 4 nights. E&Eding for more than 3 nights is hard, if you have a spare 123 you can do 6 nights. After that it is at least unlikely you are not picked up by a hostile searchparty or SAR-team. And if you want to flash, 100 lumens can be seen afar. Lithiums can easily be stored for 5 years. And the E1B has a no-snag design, so it's not tough on pockets like some other lights that eat through clothing and webbing. Most important IMHO is that the light is so small you can always have it with you, having a light at home is no good if you want to E&E with it. And Maglight 3D isn't small enough to have with you always. Ow and add a red filter, red light saves a lot of night vision if you need it and is a lot less visible if you don't want to be seen from long distances.


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## nudel (Apr 15, 2009)

Definately the Ra Clicky or twisty !!! 

It can run for weeks on the lowest setting and is build like a tank+small+waterproof to 20 meters+ +++ etc. That is what I would count my life on if I had to choose.


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## carrot (Apr 15, 2009)

BTW, why are we hammering nails?


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## f22shift (Apr 15, 2009)

hammering nails = maglite with some sort of drop in depending on the runtime you expect.


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## NonSenCe (Apr 15, 2009)

carrot: because nails and tent pegs is what true survivor considers most important to take with?



hmm.. my vote goes to twisty light too. and if possible 2. as "one is none." second one is spare battery carrier also. and if BOTH fail you might be able to cobble up One working sample (worst case scenario) 

but if u need to take that issued light with you, you have a backup light already... what batteries does it use? best option then might be that both would use the same battery. (same thing as weapons in army, same ammo and parts, know one, know them all approach )

edit: also, instead of carrying 3d maglite i rather would carry separate blunt force tool for those hammering tasks. shorty fiskars axe the campsite model weighs about a pound ( i think they are caller gerber in usa.. the orange and black plastic handle axe) and that way u have an axe too.


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## John_Galt (Apr 15, 2009)

Another qestion...
Are you looking for a light with multiple color filters/outputs?
Other than that, going by the reviews here, I'd say a RA Clicky or Twisty, and I'll third a small backup like the E01.


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## mbassoc2003 (Apr 15, 2009)

I'd go for the Ra Twisty with the red beam at low setting (if they're still available). No need for higher than 85 lumen output. Failing that, I'd look at the Ra Clicky range and the Novatac range. The now obsolite Novatac EDC 120 range is more compact than the Ra Clickies and just as robust. Add to this, the fact that you can buy them cheap and there is a backdoor crack to turn the cheap NT EDC 120E into and EDC 120P, and you have a deffinite candidate. I deffinately wouldn't go looking beyond a Henry designed/made light. Those who espouse differently, either don't have an Ra Clicky or Novatac, or don't understand the question you asked. It's the difference between a Chris Reeves blade and a Ka-Bar.


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## Oddjob (Apr 15, 2009)

Ra Clicky or Twisy IMO.


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## Lithium Juice (Apr 15, 2009)

seanflash, there are only a few flashlights that come to mind for E&E after ditching your airplane: the Ra Twisty, Photon Freedom,maybe a McGizmo (I don't know if they have a low low or not), or a special ordered low low output Peak LED flashlight. 

The photon is not that tough, you certainly couldn't hammer nails with it, but in enemy territory I would assume that you would want the dimmest light possible.

I would think that a club would be much more effective for hammering nails and bad guys than using your light source for those ends.

Just out of curiosity, why is there a tent in the survival pack in your fighter?
It seems like a big waste of space and weight to me:thinking:


Danny


disclaimer: I have no training whatsoever, ymmv, etc...


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## dcycleman (Apr 15, 2009)

my sf e2l was plowed into a snowbank and stayed there frozen and thawed repeatedly for 2 months before being found, and it works like new. if thats any help. another vote for the e2l, the 60 lumen high is very throwy throws as far as some other lights I have rated 3 times as high, and the 3 lumen low for 100 hours is perfect for navigating woods at night. throw a red filter on it and its perfect for the cockpit too, as low comes on first.


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## Sgt. LED (Apr 15, 2009)

PEAK


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## AvidHiker (Apr 15, 2009)

I guarantee there will be no solid concensus here, HOWEVER...

I challenge anyone to find a light that's more solidly built than an HDS/Ra, twisty style being the simplest and most reliable. If you filter your responses down to those with high threadcounts, there seems to be some concensus on this. No, it's not much of a weapon or tool (might be useable for hammering though), but I think most experienced people around here would promise that it won't die on you.

http://ralights.com/?id=Twisty

A titanium McGizmo (if you have the means), mizer version, should also fit the bill. Once again though, these are *small* tough-as-nails lights. You won't find nearly as much interest or experience around here with oversized lights from what I've seen. Personally, I wouldn't trust a Maglite with my life (I've had reliability issues in the past).

+1 for keeping a very small backup light as well.


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## carrot (Apr 15, 2009)

McGizmo lights are damn tough but unfortunately for some users are not potted which makes them more susceptible to water damage. They are watertight, but if you get water inside (open it up in pouring rain, for instance) you may very well ruin the circuit. I ruined a McLux PD-S Mizer by letting water enter the circuit... high worked perfectly but low was lost. I would also trust Muyshondt lights and they are ideal for those who prefer long runtime without sacrificing too much output. There's no doubt in my mind that both these custom makers know how to make a robust light.

Surefire's lights, to my knowledge are coated with a conformal coating to protect the electronics.

Ra lights, and Arc lights are potted... although I'm not sure about the Arc6/ArcLS.

Inova are very tough but as to being susceptible to damage in case of water breach... I have no idea. The X5 seems to me to be potted but I can't say for certain... maybe email their customer service and get back to us.

Pelican and some Streamlight are also very tough, but I have no idea about water damage as well. A fair amount are designed for diving though?

I admit I have little faith in Maglite... the bodies may be tough but the internals seem a bit more fragile. At least in the case of the Mini's.

Many of the China lights seem durable and well-made, particularly the Fenix lights but they do make some compromises to to meet such a low price point (for instance, threading is definitely not as robust) and have really not been around long enough to be certain. Examples of Fenix lights taking quite a beating are pretty common around here though but I have seen enough failure modes that I simply don't trust them as my "only" flashlight. Great lights otherwise. If you go this path get two battery-compatible models for greater reliability. I do not think they are potted, except for the E01, although Fenix's track record on potting has been spotty -- the predecessor E0 was sometimes potted and sometimes not, a roll of the dice really.


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## StandardBattery (Apr 15, 2009)

*+7* I think it is now for the *RA Twisty*


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## BBnet3000 (Apr 15, 2009)

theres plenty of very durable lights out there.

i wouldnt be hitting tent pegs in even with a surefire or maglite though. (i picked these two in my mind for surefire durability and maglite ease of hitting things with)


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## PhotonSuperposition (Apr 15, 2009)

I'm surprised that no one has mentioned the Nitecore D20 yet; more than 200 hours of runtime on low, heavily overbuilt (stainless steel on both ends!) with excellent beam quality. It's quite bright on high, yet low enough on low to not give away your position. And it runs on 2AA, which are easy to find anywhere, even in whatever sandbox you happen to bail into. Plus a lot cheaper than many of the excellent lights from RA/Surefire.

Good luck with your search!


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## OceanView (Apr 15, 2009)

Since we're talking E&E, when you could be half-frozen and physically and mentally dead tired and also extremely stressed out at times, I think that most multimode lights could be a liability since you could easily accidentally turn it on at a much higher setting in the worst possible moment and give your position away.

I would choose something simple and low output. Just two options among many: Peak Killimanjaro or the Gerber Infinity Ultra-M series.

And using your light as an impact weapon or pounding tool should be the absolutely last resort. These lights are small plus you need them to keep working. A rock or even your boot would be far better suited to hitting someone or pounding in a tent stake than a small flashlight IMHO. A light that is truly tough enough to smash someone with--like a "tactical" light--is going to be far too bright for your purposes so you wouldn't even be packing it in your survival gear, I would think.


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## vb14 (Apr 15, 2009)

adnj said:


> From the Ra website:
> 
> This production Ra Twisty was dropped repeatedly from a height exceeding 6 meters (20 feet) on to concrete, pavement and rocks. After 20 drops, the light was repeatedly thrown at concrete, pavement and rocks. The light still functions normally. The glass lens did not break even with this severe punishment. Can your flashlight survive this kind of treatment?


 
Yes, and then some.


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## Sgt. LED (Apr 15, 2009)

It'll be real interesting to read your reports on which of these flashlights can survive the forces of being jettisoned out of a fighter.

You are going to test it first right? I mean before you have to punch out during WWIII and crawl your way out of North Korea and all............LOL

I kid, I kid. So any of these suggested lights tempting you to buy yet?


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## lrp (Apr 15, 2009)

My vote is for the RA Twisty!!


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## GPB (Apr 15, 2009)

Don't pilots carry a knife and sidearm when they ditch ? I think when you try to get one piece of gear to do too many things, you give up a lot. (ie: a combo radio flashlight isn't a very good radio or a flashlight ) My advice would be get a light that's a great light, use something else for banging nails, hitting home runs, etc. I'd think one of the biggest requirements would be to be small enough that its already in your pocket when things go bad. I would imagine there is a lot to think about when ejecting from a plane....remembering to grab your light might not occur to you at the time. Another thing to consider is that it only has to be as tough as you are. There's no sense having a light that can survive 10 g's if you can't. What kind of batterries does the US Gov't issued light use ? It might make sense to use the same kind if you are supplementing that light. 

Here's hoping you find the perfect light.....and never need it. Stay safe.


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## HoopleHead (Apr 15, 2009)

In a survival situation, a knife and fire are MUCH more important than a flashlight. In fact, I don't think any survivalist out there would ever recommend a flashlight as one of your kit items. It's really a "luxury" item, albeit a useful one.


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## gmcjimd (Apr 15, 2009)

+8 for the Ra twisty!:twothumbs


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## Outdoors Fanatic (Apr 15, 2009)

Easily the *SureFire Saint *


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## BBnet3000 (Apr 15, 2009)

GPB said:


> I'd think one of the biggest requirements would be to be small enough that its already in your pocket when things go bad.


this is my strat, its why i have a long runtime EDC


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## FrogmanM (Apr 15, 2009)

Another vote for the HDS Twisty

-Mayo


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## Kestrel (Apr 15, 2009)

Forgetful said:


> Good tight 2-3 cell P60 host with a Malkoff M60l. 4.5 hours of full brightness then a few hours of decent brightness and another few hours of usable brightness.


+ 0.75, a SF 9P/C3 with a Malkoff M60*LL*. You're talking ~16 hours of relatively-high-output runtime with the absolute simplicity of a single output level (no additional mechanical or electronic switch), this is about the only fashlight I can imagine sucessfully making a field repair on. I've been wanting an M60*LLL* and Gene says he can do it (perhaps 35 hours @ 30-40 lumens from 3xCR123A? - my numbers, not Gene's). A covert low level can be obtained from a red filter (per AlecGold) or the issued flashlight - always have a backup. 


flashy bazook said:


> You should drop the requirement to hammer nails and what not. [...] use your knife or a local rock to hammer things with if you need to.


+1, also +1 with the poster who said multiple-use tools aren't as good as two optimum tools. 

Us 'P60 host' fans seem to be outnumbered though...


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## oldpal (Apr 15, 2009)

I suggest the Ra Clicky for the toughest. :twothumbs

Hugh


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## Sgt. LED (Apr 15, 2009)

M60LLL!?!?!?!?

 That sounds good to me.


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## american lockpicker (Apr 15, 2009)

HoopleHead said:


> In a survival situation, a knife and fire are MUCH more important than a flashlight. In fact, I don't think any survivalist out there would ever recommend a flashlight as one of your kit items. It's really a "luxury" item, albeit a useful one.


 
What about the Arc?


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## Dead_Nuts (Apr 15, 2009)

Ra Twisty! It's not big and heavy enough to pound nails, but if you really have enough room on you to carry a Mag 3D, you can carry a Twisty plus other stuff. The Tr model with low red output would be ideal for viewing maps or charts without drawing attention or affecting night vision. The Clicky is easier to use, but the Twisty is bullet-proof beyond words.


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## dougie (Apr 15, 2009)

I'm really surprised that your survial training hasn't taught you better. As others have said a light is a luxury and in E&E more likely a liability. The fact is that hunters will be using dogs, image intensifiers and thermal imaging to look for you and nothing is more of a give away at night than white light no matter how low the lumens or how short a time you use it. The darkness is the time to be on the move and I seriously doubt that you'd want to risk using a light (any light) for navigation. Of course you may need to hole up somewhere dark and for that purpose a small flashlight is all you'll need. It's for that reason your issued a small LED as part of your E&E kit and not a light cannon. 

For what its worth a small lithium LED light which is waterproof and has a proven history is all you'll ever really need. As others have said size really does matter in survial situations and a something you can carry in a pocket attached to a small lanyard is to be preferred. FWIW my money would be on a Ra light or something like the Surefire E1b. :thumbsup:


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## cave dave (Apr 15, 2009)

Ra Twisty is the vote for the toughest. At a $100 its cheaper, tougher and way more versatile than many of the surefires previously mentioned. The Ra lights are also an evolutionary step beyond the HDS and Novatac also previously mentioned.
http://ralights.com/?id=Twisty

It comes programmed with 3 well chosen levels but you can reprogram it to suit your needs.

(Re programing is deliberately difficult, so you won't stumble across it accidentally)

If its going into your BOB never to be used till the day the SHTF then the twisty is the way to go. If you are actually going to use it occasionally for camping and such I'd go with the Ra Clicky because the tail switch and reprogramming is more convenient.


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## Patriot (Apr 15, 2009)

woodrow said:


> I would stay away from the SF lights (with the possible exception of te e2dl...not sure about water tight ness) because they have been proven in various threads to not be all that watertight. I would also want a long low level.
> 
> The Fenix TA30 might fit in these regards...but it looks like a Big light...will know tomorrow when I get mine. I like the TK20 on lithiums...but if you have 2 sets...thats only 26 hours on low.
> 
> The RA lights look tough as nails...and should not take a lot of space. They would most likely be my first choice.






Traditionally Surefire is the first light that comes to mind but I think woodrow makes a pretty good point at least on the surface. It's usually agreed that most SF lights will survive a quick dunk or at the very least you could rinse them under running sink water but there are some really tough light's available that have and actual water resistance rating like IPX-8 for example. It's my opinion that the TA30 is a bit large but the TK10 and TK11 have and impressive track record while being a bit smaller. I know that I would personally trust the TK11 during an extreme situation like the one you described.


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## HoopleHead (Apr 15, 2009)

american lockpicker said:


> What about the Arc?


 

Same thing. When every inch and every oz matter, you don't depend on something that has limited use (ie dependent on batteries).


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## Kestrel (Apr 15, 2009)

Sgt. LED said:


> M60LLL!?!?!?!?
> That sounds good to me.


Dude, I *so knew* that would get your attention. I've been wanting one for a while (for my G3 - just imagine the runtime: ~40 lumens from 0.055 amps @ 9v), Gene says he's ready anytime I want one, but .

I kinda wanted to get one before letting the cat out of the bag though...


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## Sgt. LED (Apr 15, 2009)

I'm going to call him tomorrow and order one! Thanks for not keeping the cat all pent up like that!


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## :)> (Apr 15, 2009)

Kestrel said:


> Dude, I *so knew* that would get your attention. I've been wanting one for a while (for my G3 - just imagine the runtime: ~40 lumens from 0.055 amps @ 9v), Gene says he's ready anytime I want one, but .
> 
> I kinda wanted to get one before letting the cat out of the bag though...



I would take one of those in a heartbeat!


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## GPB (Apr 15, 2009)

This is only indirectly related to lights, but very germain to this discussion so I hope a moderator won't delete it or banish me, but...what the heck is "E&E" ??


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## Sgt. LED (Apr 15, 2009)

Escape and Evade perhaps.


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## OceanView (Apr 15, 2009)

GPB said:


> This is only indirectly related to lights, but very germain to this discussion so I hope a moderator won't delete it or banish me, but...what the heck is "E&E" ??


Yes, E&E is escape and evasion. One of those military phrases. And it is exceedingly important to this thread since it is part of the original poster's question, which he lays out unfortunately not in the first post, but in post #7.

The requirements for a light which is good for night hiking or survival purposes when backpacking are quite different IMHO than a light that a fighter pilot would need when violently punching out of a high speed jet and ending up behind enemy lines. Think of a Capt. Scott O'Grady shot down over Bosnia and engaging in yes--E&E--for six days, evading Serb patrols out looking for him, before being rescued.


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## AvidHiker (Apr 15, 2009)

carrot said:


> McGizmo lights are damn tough but unfortunately for some users are not potted...


 
I completely agree, potted circuitry should be mandatory for critical applications such as this. Of course, there really is nothing preventing you from having your McGizmo potted (been done before, IIRC).

Yet another + for Ra. Guts are potted to provide maximum protection from shock and water damage.


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## Lightraven (Apr 16, 2009)

I understood the scenario (including employment as a fighter pilot) to be hypothetical. The alternative reading, currently employed as fighter pilot, is understandable the way it was written, but unlikely based on my limited knowledge of such things.

I have two night jumps--one military, static line, in training using a Fulton anglehead with red lens and one recreational freefall using a white strobe to be activated after parachute deployment.

As for military ground operations, we barely used flashlights at all in training--and only red lensed ones. If I were alone in hostile territory, I would pull the batteries out of any flashlights I had, just to be extra safe. I wouldn't use a flashlight under any circumstances. I would use an IR strobe in coordination with rescue protocols that are outlined in SERE training, which all fighter pilots and special forces receive.

For a true story of a fighter pilot shot down in Vietnam, I recommend the movie Rescue Dawn, with Christian Bale. The final act is so dramatic, it's hard to believe it really happened.


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## Twinkle-Plank (Apr 16, 2009)

Hooked on Fenix said:


> Fenix TA30.



+1


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## andylondon (Apr 16, 2009)

There are many tough lights out there in this catagory, but i would only use the Wolf-eyes Sniper as a hammer, and the multi mode version will give you a long runtime. If you manage to obtain one with a low vf value the runtime will be increased.


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## gsxrac (Apr 16, 2009)

Well I don't own a RA twisty but From what I've read that'd be my recomendation for you. However I would urge you NOT to get the olight warrior as mentioned for this duty. I am particularly rough with my lights (rougher than most) and my M20 warrior only lived a few months. My 4d mag however was used to literally BEAT my trailer hitch out of my truck. And it's been used for beating dammaged parts out on mud trucks and it's been dropped hundreds of times and submerged in mudholes and waterholes. Only replaced the stock bulb once. I'll take pics tonight if I think about it.


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## mwaldron (Apr 16, 2009)

I've been playing with my first Ra product for the last 2 weeks now, it's a Ra Clicky. 

Based on what I have seen, Ra's attention to design detail is spectacular. I don't ever see the light engine in this failing. 

However, based on what I have seen personally, and what I have read, I could not recommend the Ra Clicky. It has too many problems with that clicky switch. I really like the Ra in general though, and would have to say you owe it to yourself to check out a Ra Twisty. Clicky is fine for EDC, but I think in the situation you describe I'd want a twisty.


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## Kestrel (Apr 16, 2009)

Kestrel said:


> Dude, I *so knew* that would get your attention. I've been wanting one for a while (for my G3 - just imagine the runtime: ~40 lumens from 0.055 amps @ 9v), Gene says he's ready anytime I want one, but .
> 
> I kinda wanted to get one before letting the cat out of the bag though...





Sgt. LED said:


> I'm going to call him tomorrow and order one! Thanks for not keeping the cat all pent up like that!


Here ya go, the best I could do from my own small collection:









BTW that amp figure was just my estimate, Gene has not supplied any specific numbers. I was just imagining half of the current draw of the LL, as the L and the LL are each halved, plus my ma estimate is 1/3 lower since I'd be taking it off of a higher-voltage 3-cell stack rather than a 2-cell. Just a disclaimer on my part. Enjoy your new survival-flashlight drop-in, let me know how it turns out.:mecry:


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## cave dave (Apr 16, 2009)

Lightraven said:


> I understood the scenario (including employment as a fighter pilot) to be hypothetical. The alternative reading, currently employed as fighter pilot, is understandable the way it was written, but unlikely based on my limited knowledge of such things.
> 
> I have two night jumps--one military, static line, in training using a Fulton anglehead with red lens and one recreational freefall using a white strobe to be activated after parachute deployment.
> 
> ...



You do realize that few CPF's read other peoples posts right? Usually they only read the original title before they respond. Anyway good post and I repeated it in case that increased the chances of it being read. I imagine the OP is about as likely as I am to find himself in the situation described. Which is virtually nill. Still love my Ra lights though! 

Where is that ejection lever on my armchair anyway? :thinking: 
Ahh, there it is, time to get myself a snack and some beer! 
 :drunk:


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## Lightraven (Apr 16, 2009)

You're probably right--still a little disconcerting. 

Oh, well, who knows for sure except the people who really do this?

Other true "behind enemy lines" books and movies:
Bat 21 with Gene Hackman and Danny Glover
Lone Survivor by Marcus Luttrell, former Navy SEAL
Bravo Two Zero, former SAS
another account of B20 by another SAS team member, forgot title
a book by a SF soldier who had a similar experience to Luttrell in the first Iraq war, forgot title

A common theme is the decision to kill or not kill non-combatants to silence them. It's a tough moral conundrum with lives lost in the choices made. Choice of flashlight? Less so.


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## MattInTheCouv (Apr 16, 2009)

I'm not nearly as big of a flashlight nut as most of the folks around here, but i am a fighter maintenance troop so i feel im pretty qualified. I would recommend to any of our pilots what i carry, and that is a blackhawk gladius (the "maximus" version is the same light just with a bit brighter LED). It has an NSN and has therefore been approved to be purchased with the governements money so you might be able to acquire it that way, lots of ground troops have carried them with few complaints. It has a magnetic switch in the tailcap, not mechanical, which helps it cope with pressure differentials well and makes it pretty waterproof. It has a variable output mode with a SUPER low level that is measured in days, not hours of runtime. It can be set to come on at this output FIRST which will preserve night vision and keep someone nearby from catching a brief glimpse of a bright light. The tailcap locks out to prevent accidental turn-ons and dead batteries. It has a strobe function which is easily accessed and could come in handy if [god forbid] you were put in a close-quarters situation with a hostile but didn't want to risk discharging your weapon. It uses CR123 size batteries which some might see as a drawback, but they are easy to find here and in the sandbox because most of the military's issued tactical lights use them. If you can't acquire the light through the supply system, the actual manufacturer of the light is a company called "insight technologies" and they call it the "h2x typhoon" and also have the brighter model called the "h2x typhoon ii". Check the internet, you can get them for anywhere from 90-200 bucks. I've heard some say that their is a parasitic drain for the electronics in the flashlight, but i do not believe that is so. I had one of them in my drawer for 2 years without turning it on (i own a couple), and it's still just as bright. Being that this would be survival kit, you should change the batteries on a 6month or yearly basis anyhow, right? I don't think it's a concern.


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## angelofwar (Apr 16, 2009)

My first choice as a light would be E2L w/ a Z68 tailcap (to help prevent accidental activation) with a F05 (Red Filter). First click "Low", check your map/footing/injury/etc, and move. 100 hours of runtime on low, and the batteries you have in there will last until the PJ's show-up (assuming they're fresh). The thin size and rigidness are great for handling, along with the long clip, make it ideal for the survival vests you'll be wearing. The second smart choice would be a rigid AA, like a 2-Cell fenix, so you could use the batteries in your 2120 Strobe, or vice versa, if either run's out. Remember...AIM-HIGH!


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## PhantomPhoton (Apr 17, 2009)

MattInTheCouv said:


> I'm not nearly as big of a flashlight nut as most of the folks around here, but i am a fighter maintenance troop so i feel im pretty qualified. I would recommend to any of our pilots what i carry, and that is a blackhawk gladius (the "maximus" version is the same light just with a bit brighter LED). It has an NSN and has therefore been approved to be purchased with the governements money so you might be able to acquire it that way, lots of ground troops have carried them with few complaints. It has a magnetic switch in the tailcap, not mechanical, which helps it cope with pressure differentials well and makes it pretty waterproof. It has a variable output mode with a SUPER low level that is measured in days, not hours of runtime. It can be set to come on at this output FIRST which will preserve night vision and keep someone nearby from catching a brief glimpse of a bright light. The tailcap locks out to prevent accidental turn-ons and dead batteries. It has a strobe function which is easily accessed and could come in handy if [god forbid] you were put in a close-quarters situation with a hostile but didn't want to risk discharging your weapon. It uses CR123 size batteries which some might see as a drawback, but they are easy to find here and in the sandbox because most of the military's issued tactical lights use them. If you can't acquire the light through the supply system, the actual manufacturer of the light is a company called "insight technologies" and they call it the "h2x typhoon" and also have the brighter model called the "h2x typhoon ii". Check the internet, you can get them for anywhere from 90-200 bucks. I've heard some say that their is a parasitic drain for the electronics in the flashlight, but i do not believe that is so. I had one of them in my drawer for 2 years without turning it on (i own a couple), and it's still just as bright. Being that this would be survival kit, you should change the batteries on a 6month or yearly basis anyhow, right? I don't think it's a concern.




Thanks for your insight (I crack myself up sometimes); always good to get more opinions from people who use and depend on their lights.


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## dandruff (Apr 17, 2009)

look no further than BARBOLIGHT!

I saw this guy flinging a barbolight at a concrete wall repeatedly at a tradeshow once. was really impressive. waterproof to 200m as well.


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## guiri (Apr 20, 2009)

Dan FO said:


> You asked for it. -->http://www.bugoutgearusa.com/jemiti.html
> 
> Or the budget model. --> http://www.bugoutgearusa.com/jemi.html



Perfect for me Dan but how do you set the different levels? My current JetBeam III Pro is too complicated for me to figure out. Ok, so I'm stupid but bottom line is, I need a simple light and I love the jetbeam look.

Thanks

George


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## guiri (Apr 20, 2009)

Personally, I think you should focus on a light that's smaller and instead bring a bigger knife or even a very small axe if you think you need to bang on stuff. Frankly, I think you would be better off with a bigger knife. Not sure where you are going to store this but if you don't have a back pack, you really need to keep size down.

Let's say you get stuck in some jungle and have to hoof it out. You could be looking at a week or two in the jungle. I would be looking for something with at least 100 hours of runtime on some low setting and sturdy as hell. I can think of several knives I like for survival.

I would rather do other stuff like matches/lighter/fire starter/signal pen/flare and other stuff you might need including survival blanket and water purifiers and some rope.

Also, how come you guys when you reply to threads like these, never post links to the lights, assuming everyone knows the different models and so on...I know, I have no clue..


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## s.c. (Apr 20, 2009)

I'm not sure what the exact scenario is (lost hiking, behind enemy lines, z-day, etc.) but I'm going to go against the grain here and recommend the solar powered lights from costco (hybridlite, i believe). 

They're cheap, waterproof, shock resistant, buoyant, lightweight, have backup lithium batteries,and usable output that will last the night. Sure, its not as cool as my jetbeam military, or as tough as my TK10, or can't be used like a club like my mag, or have the best continuous runtime; but if I was told I'll be stuck in the middle of nowhere for an indefinite period without access to spare battieries, I'd definitly pick the solarpowered light.


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## cave dave (Apr 20, 2009)

guiri said:


> Also, how come you guys when you reply to threads like these, never post links to the lights, assuming everyone knows the different models and so on...I know, I have no clue..



That is how you can tell who the CPF's who really know what they are talking about from the ones who don't. And why Post 74 is the only one the Op needs to read!


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## thermal guy (Apr 20, 2009)

Cave Dave and many others have the right answer.Get yourself an RA TWISTY and be done with it Preferably the low red model.


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## thermal guy (Apr 20, 2009)

elugelab said:


> Actually, just an ordinary Maglite 3D LED would be your best option. It's cheap, tough, has a very long runtime and can be used as a club.



Yep and the first thing you should do to mod it would be to stuff as many RA TWISTY lights in it as you can


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## chaoss (Apr 20, 2009)

thermal guy said:


> Cave Dave and many others have the right answer.Get yourself an RA TWISTY and be done with it Preferably the low red model.


 
Agreed :thumbsup:.


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## angelofwar (Apr 20, 2009)

While the E2L w/ an F05 was my personnel recomendation, this is what these guys use...

https://www.candlepowerforums.com/posts/2808412&postcount=456

This guy was a helicopter pilot, and they were good enough for his guys...most of the 130 crews had these as well, in red or YG...but in all honesty, I would look at ALL the quality lights mentioned here, and pick what works for you. I've ordered lights, and hated the feel, and even though they were nice quality, they just didn't cut it. The two lights I'm taking with me on my next trip to the sandbox is my C2L and L1...cause those are the two I'm most comfortable with.


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## CdBoy (May 19, 2009)

seanflash said:


> Okay_ I should point out what I need it for. Perhaps a mock-worst case scenario would better define what I need: Critical ejection from my fighter at 20K feet. Landing (safely I'd hope) in unfriendly territory with my survival sack and _this _flashlight. What would I need at my side? The military provides us with an okay led light, but I need something damned tough that I could count on for days if need be. I'd like something that I could also use to whack bad guys with ...or tree stakes for my tent-whichever comes first. Surely the best minds on this forum could come together to recommend one better than my government grade one.
> Thank you to all for your help. Regards.



Expensive but great!: Surefire E2D LED Defender using CR123x2

Great price and greater: Fenix LD20 using AAx2 (inexpensive battery)

Good flashlight for the price: Fenix TK11 R2 or TA30

hope this helps.


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## Fooboy (May 20, 2009)

seanflash said:


> Okay_ I should point out what I need it for. Perhaps a mock-worst case scenario would better define what I need: Critical ejection from my fighter at 20K feet. Landing (safely I'd hope) in unfriendly territory with my survival sack and _this _flashlight. What would I need at my side? The military provides us with an okay led light, but I need something damned tough that I could count on for days if need be. I'd like something that I could also use to whack bad guys with ...or tree stakes for my tent-whichever comes first. Surely the best minds on this forum could come together to recommend one better than my government grade one.
> Thank you to all for your help. Regards.


 
Most of these suggestions are totally idiotic. He's behind enemy lines and you think he needs 200 lumens? 

If you use a lot of lumens you kill your runtime and call attention to yourself.

You need something with a low low and max is probably 30 lumens. You probably want something in Red light so you can navigate at night without drawing attention to yourself.

What about a gerber infinity ultra with RED led?


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## Nimravus (May 20, 2009)

Ever think of a decent survival knife like a Ka-Bar of Falkniven that has a stryker plate for hammering then you could get something like Fenix PD30 or LD20. Yes they do put out +/- 200 lumens but can also be dialed down to 9 for super long runtime and you can as a red filter that could be easily removed.

As pointed out by many the clicky switch is located at the back bottom and this is more then likely where you would stryke if used as a hammer. So I would consider a knife that can hammer as you will need one and a good light with multiple modes including strobe or flash to be used as a becon or attention graber for easy locasion marking to SAR techs.


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## chiphead (May 20, 2009)

Inova...any model!

chiphead


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## Burgess (May 20, 2009)

chiphead said:


> Inova...any model!


 

Certainly *not* the X1 (Generation 2) model !


Mine fell a distance of 1 meter, and landed on a hardwood floor. 


It was not "Tough" enough to "survive" this little incident. :sigh:





_


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## Kevin1322 (May 20, 2009)

All the suggestions, but really only you know what you want it for or to be capable of. I own the Olight M20 Warrior premium Tactical LED Flashlight w. Cree R2 and I love it. It is versitile with the high bright spot (great throw for the size), a very low level, plus a medium level and flash, and colored filters alailable should you need/want them. Long run times on low and can carry spare batteries with the holster. Quality, premium light for under $100. Maybe it's not the one, but I would at least take a look at it.
 
http://www.batteryjunction.com/premium-olight-m20-warrior.html
 
Let us know what you decide (and why)!


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## Burgess (May 20, 2009)

Just for the record . . . .


The Olight M20 Warrior does NOT have S-O-S mode.


Just a Strobe mode.



In addition to Low - Medium - High.





It's truly a GREAT flashlight !


:twothumbs

_


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## Kevin1322 (May 20, 2009)

Wow, I can't believe I did that. Too much on the brain I guess. Thanks for the correction. I'll fix it.


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## Marlinaholic (May 21, 2009)

Surefire L1 or E1L or E2L. The L1 might be a hair more reliable with its twisty switch. Very long runtime on low for any of these models. Best service and parts availability of about any company in my opinion. You can take a 6P from 20 years ago and if the rubber switch is wearing through they will send you a whole new tail switch! Hard to beat that kind of service.


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## monkey1368 (May 21, 2009)

I think the RA Twisty with the red capability would give you the options for camping and for military use - i.e. everyday tasks which is most likely what you'll need it for. On a budget I would go with the Gerber Infinity Ultra M series.
 
As far as a survival in a combat zone, you might only use the red when you absolutely need to (i.e. find critical gear in your bag. Also you will probably want to use some 100 mph tape (duct tape) to tape over the lense and put a small pin hole in it for the proper amount of light (less is more). I've never used a light on night patrols - after my eyes adjusted a bit of moonlight was sufficient - that being said an ankle injury could leave you SOL so you might want to take it easy on rough terrain.
 
Also, if your kit doesn't include it, and the enemy is not likely to have night vision and IR signal light might be handy.
 
As far as pounding tent stakes and whacking the enemy with a flashlight - I believe the RAT SERE 5, Fallkniven A1, or Bark River Bravo knives would serve your purpose much better that a mag type light, besides, extra gear weight would not be desirable.


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## callmaster (May 21, 2009)

Big fan of sniper movies. And that's one place you won't find lights. One wrong flash and it's all over for em. Amazing how one little mistake made and that's that.


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## Nightwatch (May 21, 2009)

I have to agree with the calls for a modified Maglight. I used to carry a 4D Mag when doing campus security. Not so much for the throw, which was decent, but more as a hammer to use on 50 year old doors that often had some part or another come out of alignment.


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## liam_995 (May 21, 2009)

Modded Maglight with a Bust-A-Cap end on it - good for breaking glass - and anything else it might be needed for...


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## Outdoors Fanatic (May 21, 2009)

A freaking Maglite for survival? Anybody using that as a survivor tool doesn't need to survive, let nature do its job.

If you going to haul such behemoth you might as well pack a GPS, a satellite phone, a personal locator beacon and a good pistol.


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## Kevin1322 (May 21, 2009)

Hahaha. Might as well carry a S&W 500 Magnum with a couple hundred rounds just in case too.


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## Yucca Patrol (May 21, 2009)

No matter how tough my flashlight is, in a survival situation I am going to use a rock as a hammer before I risk harming a tool that might save my life.


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## Alankujala (May 14, 2011)

I am new here so I have probably missed it. What would be a good suggestion now since there has been so many new lights on the market in the last couple of years?


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## Draz (May 14, 2011)

I just picked up a surefire LX2 and I must say the low is a nice 15 lumen throwy beam for 48 hours and high is a 200 lumen beam for about 2 hours. This is my new get home bag light as well as my L1 I edc. Can't go wrong with any surefire imo. I do prefere twisty tailcaps in survival situations over clickies due to the very very rare failure


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## chaoss (May 14, 2011)

oldpal said:


> I suggest the Ra Clicky for the toughest. :twothumbs
> 
> Hugh


 
This gets my vote hands down.


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## angelofwar (May 15, 2011)

Draz said:


> I just picked up a surefire LX2 and I must say the low is a nice 15 lumen throwy beam for 48 hours and high is a 200 lumen beam for about 2 hours. This is my new get home bag light as well as my L1 I edc. Can't go wrong with any surefire imo. I do prefere twisty tailcaps in survival situations over clickies due to the very very rare failure



L1's are hard to beat...I'd take an L1 over an LX2/L2 though, since they only take one cell...and I'd take the L2 over the LX2 since the L2 is floody...and the 18 hours runtime on low isn't bad neither.

Of course, I'm still sticking to my guns and going for the E2L...100 hours runtime on low...had mine for 3 years and have yet to change the batteries.


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## yliu (May 15, 2011)

Marduke said:


> TK20 is close, if you are satisfied with the runtime in low (11 hours). It is definitely tough as nails.


 
Someone reported that his TK20 stopped working after being dropped.


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## Z-Tab (May 15, 2011)

Surefire C3 with a Malkoff M61WL. If I had to stake my life on a light working when I needed it to, then that would be the winner. 7.5 hours of regulated output on CR123s, plus more than adequate output on 2xAA.


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## DivineStrike (May 15, 2011)

the new armytek predator seems like it can take a really good beating, I personally wouldn't want to use a light as a hammer but a bezel would do just fine as a defense striking tool. And it has customization out of the *** ;-)


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## RedForest UK (May 15, 2011)

yliu said:


> Someone reported that his TK20 stopped working after being dropped.



Could you post a link? I find this hard to believe, unless is really was a complete freak occurance.. 

The light and electronics are well potted as far as I know, perhaps the ring in the tailcap came loose?


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## monkeyboy (May 15, 2011)

I've got the Tektite expedition LS4 cree 3C version.

There's a video of a tank running over it somewhere on the web. It's built like a brick and weighs about the same too. It's a twistie, so there's no switch to go wrong and it direct drive through a resistor so there's no electronics to go wrong either. 3 cells with resistor drive is actually a very efficient way to drive an LED. Waterproof to a billion metres too!
If I had to bring one survival light with me and weight and size were't too much of an issue then this would be it.


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## Draz (May 15, 2011)

angelofwar said:


> L1's are hard to beat...I'd take an L1 over an LX2/L2 though, since they only take one cell...and I'd take the L2 over the LX2 since the L2 is floody...and the 18 hours runtime on low isn't bad neither.
> 
> Of course, I'm still sticking to my guns and going for the E2L...100 hours runtime on low...had mine for 3 years and have yet to change the batteries.


 
That's why its nice to be a cpfer...we take both. We don't like choosing just ONE light


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## ATF628 (May 15, 2011)

Thanks, Seanflash, for asking this. I actually wanted to know of a super-strong light as well and then I saw your post. Imma look through all the light suggestions.


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## Fluffy Ops (May 15, 2011)

Like my fellow friends have mentioned, go for the Ra/HDS Clicky. The Twisty is jsut as durable but since this light is going to be used for military purposes, a tailcap would be more practical.


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## Fusion_m8 (May 15, 2011)

First of all how much is your budget? Lights with those type of requirements don't come cheap. Lets say US$1000-$2000 as a starting point, you could get someone like elektrolumens to custom build one cut from a solid billet of steel or titanium, use 25-30mm tempered glass as the lens so it can withstand shock if you decide to use the flashlight like Thor's hammer. Definitely go with an LED because of their shock resistance, no clicky switches of any sort, only a twisty where the the contact spring is made from tempered spring steel. Not too sure about the type of batteries you should use as I reckon all batteries are the weakpoint as most if not all are not exactly impact/shock resistant if they are designed to be handheld.




seanflash said:


> Hi All:
> 
> I have been researching a few threads posted on emergency lights but I have a speceific question that could use some advice. I am looking for suggestions on a _*tough as nails*_ flashlight that can handle a lot.
> 
> ...


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## jabe1 (May 15, 2011)

In a behind enemy lines scenario, I'd be worried about my IR signature more than anything else.

Rocks make adequate hammers, so why carry the weight?

I wouldn't need alot of light except to signal with, and fire works best there.

That leads me to a single 5mm LED in green, or teal.
Peak Kilimanjaro, CMG infinity, or even a PAL light. The Peak and CMG could use a QTC pill to further cut the output.

A white or red light will show up like a house on fire to anyone with the proper equipment...

Has anyone ever_ tried_ to kill a single 5mm Peak light? Might be interesting, especially a SS bodied one.


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## RedLED (May 16, 2011)

Surefire L1 with the red filter, and a new cell installed before the mission, and one, or two spares if you have the room. I doubt some of the lesser lights would not be allowed on a mission, but the L1 meets Mil. Specs. 

No way he is going to be pushed off the flight deck with a Mag or Inova in a $57 Million Dollar F/A18 with lights from Mega-Lo-Mart.

Also, would you really want a Chinese light under these circumstances...I doubt any US fighter pilot would?


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## VLAD1690 (Dec 28, 2011)

Tektite Excursion or Expedition LS5 model all the way!:rock: Would feel confident in a Peak Night Patrol also.:thumbsup:


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## Double_A (Jan 8, 2012)

A few days ago I got my Peak Logan SS QTC 17500/AA long keychain tail.

This is one tough light! Very nice output, single cell size. I also picked up the adapter kit, 123/AA/AAA.

So I can use dang near every common battery seeing as it can handle anything up to 4V or so. I'm using the 17500's from my SF C3, so it looks like I'm going to have to pick up some spares.


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## Noobiwan (Jan 8, 2012)

Elzetta ZFL with a Malkoff drop-in:
http://elzetta.com/

Here is another video of the Ezletta driving some nails in a couple of 2X4's
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C6bYZZUS3WA&feature=player_embedded

Fenix T1: (the head survived almost 21,000lbs of pressure)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0WvhJWE3_Oc


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## duro (Jan 8, 2012)

Marduke said:


> TK20 is close, if you are satisfied with the runtime in low (11 hours). It is definitely tough as nails.



I would advise against Fenix. Their warranty are lies. It's been weeks since I've attempted to get a new switch, mailed in the old one to their "distributor" etc...Long story short, you are jerked around, and their warranty means nothing.


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## mrlysle (Jan 8, 2012)

I too, favor the HDS lights for their ruggedness, and own a 170t and the new rotary model. They're among my favorite lights! But the OP suggested he might possibly want to use his light for pounding tent stakes, or using it as an improv weapon. Now for those of you that have one, pick it up and hold it in your hand like you were about to use it as a hammer. Doesn't feel much like one does it? It's just physically too small for anything but a bombproof light! The op needs something bigger than an HDS if he's sure it would have to serve dual purpose as both light and tool/weapon. Just thinking out loud here.


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## jamesmtl514 (Jan 8, 2012)

I vote for the surefire A2l-red. 
Bright white beam. Very efficient low, red preserves night vision,.when you'll be on the move. 
Very reliable twist tail.

It's not a hammer, or much of a defensive weapon. I would think you're already carrying better suited tools got that.


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## RedForest UK (Jan 8, 2012)

duro said:


> I would advise against Fenix. Their warranty are lies. It's been weeks since I've attempted to get a new switch, mailed in the old one to their "distributor" etc...Long story short, you are jerked around, and their warranty means nothing.



Sounds like a dealer problem, which is a shame as Fenix have some of the best dealers in the business.


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## Flight_Deck (Jan 8, 2012)

RedForest UK said:


> Sounds like a dealer problem, which is a shame as Fenix have some of the best dealers in the business.



I second that!


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## dougie (Jan 8, 2012)

As I imagined, this is a real difficult one to nail. My suggestion is for you to remember that the best light of all is the one you carry on your person? Unless you are really fortunate there are a hundred and one things that can go wrong to stop you accessing a light which isn't carried on you after an ejection! Survival training should have taught you to have survived without a hammer. However, being without a torch might be a disaster. At night in the wilderness the minimum level of light should allow easy navigation with dark adapted eyes whilst also limiting your light giving your position away. Because the greatest threat to the light working apart from mechanical or electrical failure is running out of juice the ability to have a light run on the very lowest settings is vital. It also needs to be shock and water resistant. As others have said the best light for you would probably be a Ra light. However, whatever you decide on it'll be interesting to hear your rationale for choosing it?


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## pjandyho (Jan 8, 2012)

When I was in the army, we were trained never to use a light. Everything we do in the field we do it by feel. Enemy in the field could spot a lit cigarette miles away so we are not allowed to smoke in the field too. In fact I have gotten so good with it I never understood why we needed a light. In fact, I am a flashaholic now because I love flashlights, not because I needed one. So in my opinion and experience, I wouldn't place flashlights as something of a real lifesaver in the event where one gets lost or something of that sort. A knife would be a lifesaver, never a flashlight. But of course, being a flashaholic now, I try to find every possible reason to use a flashlight.


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## Shooter21 (Jan 8, 2012)

pjandyho said:


> When I was in the army, we were trained never to use a light. Everything we do in the field we do it by feel. Enemy in the field could spot a lit cigarette miles away so we are not allowed to smoke in the field too. In fact I have gotten so good with it I never understood why we needed a light. In fact, I am a flashaholic now because I love flashlights, not because I needed one. So in my opinion and experience, I wouldn't place flashlights as something of a real lifesaver in the event where one gets lost or something of that sort. A knife would be a lifesaver, never a flashlight. But of course, being a flashaholic now, I try to find every possible reason to use a flashlight.


i wouldn't say that since a flashlight can save you from falling off a cliff while hiking.


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## pjandyho (Jan 8, 2012)

Shooter21 said:


> i wouldn't say that since a flashlight can save you from falling off a cliff while hiking.


I have never fallen off a cliff before and neither have I heard of anyone falling off one. Maybe because Singapore is a small urban country so even when we are in the jungle we don't get totally pitch dark sky due to city lights reflecting off the clouds. That's my guess. When I am in the jungle, or hilltop, I could see forms and shapes when my eyes are adapted so there is no way I would fall off, but of course we move a lot slower for sure.


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## Sub_Umbra (Jan 8, 2012)

Dollar for dollar IMO the the toughest, most rugged lights are *DIVE LIGHTS.* Even on the lower priced end of the dive light choices you will find very simple, very rugged lights. I've had at least four inexpensive Tektite dive lights for over ten years. One has batteries in it all the time though I rarely grab it intentionally as my arthritis makes two-handed twisties painful for me. 

That said, the dive twisties are my 'goto' lights when the world turns to crap. When properly maintained cheap dive twisties have the potential to keep on shining after everything else stops working. It certainly does not hurt that they are cheap enough to be bought in sufficient numbers to provide the Prepper with *both* redundancy *AND* something to barter.

I never had to break them out during our *six week power outage* after Katrina but I was very glad to have them in reserve.


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