# Does lower Kevin HID lamp gives higher lumen output?



## ma_sha1 (Oct 8, 2010)

HID isn't new to me, I've played with Car headlight HID mods when I was into car modding & I have made the first HID Reef tank a few years back back when people didn't believe HID spectrum could sustain corals & clams in a reef tank: http://www.nano-reef.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=140575

Fast forward to a few years & a few new hobbys later, I find my self playing with HID again. 

One thing that almost everyone believes in is that Lower kelvin HID lamps gives higher lumen. People often quote Philips spec sheet where a 6000K lamp was rate 2400 lumen & a 4300K lamp was rated 3200 lumen, it's quoted enough that it almost became truth applicable to all HID lamps: lower kevin = higher lumen output. 

What it always puzzled me is that I could not find anyone who actually measured them in the same ballast to get a semi scientific conclusion, people just pass stories from one to another. 

I have a Mozo HID (L35 clone) that I got to compare to MagDaddy, 
the light came in with 6000K lamp, measured about 180K [email protected] 1 meter. 

I changed the bulb to Ebay generic 4300K, the color is less blue, more white, which is nice but it did nothing to the lux, it's still masured out to be 180K lux. 

I am not saying my measurement alone is enough to overturn the notion, just wondering if anyone else have measured different kelvin HID bulbs to see if they are much different under the same ballast?
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## XeRay (Oct 8, 2010)

ma_sha1 said:


> HID isn't new to me, I've played with Car headlight HID mods when I was into car modding & I have made the first HID Reef tank a few years back back when people didn't believe HID spectrum could sustain corals & clams in a reef tank: http://www.nano-reef.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=140575
> 
> Fast forward to a few years & a few new hobbys later, I find my self playing with HID again.
> 
> ...


 
For the HID (metal Halide) technology found in automotive headlights, it is absolutely true, all other things being equal, the higher the Kelvin above the std ~4200K OEM std bulbs the less lumens you get per watt input. The ballast controls the watts to the bulb. So if you use the same output rating ballasts to make a comparison it is absolutely true. Idealy you could use the same ballast to make the comparison to be more exact in the measurements.


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## Mr. Tone (Oct 8, 2010)

It is too bad this isn't true for LED's as well. There are many who would opt for neutral white if it had the higher output number on paper. Then they would have to have special runs of cool white lights, instead of neutral!

Why is this the case with HID? Are they adding more salts or something to get the higher Kelvin? Is it a case of being the opposite of LED then?


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## ma_sha1 (Oct 8, 2010)

XeRay said:


> For the HID (metal Halide) technology found in automotive headlights, it is absolutely true, all other things being equal, the higher the Kelvin above the std ~4200K OEM std bulbs the less lumens you get per watt input. The ballast controls the watts to the bulb. So if you use the same output rating ballasts to make a comparison it is absolutely true. Idealy you could use the same ballast to make the comparison to be more exact in the measurements.




I did just that, I used *the same ballast*, tested a 4300K bulb vs 6000K bulb, got exactly the same lux reading. :thinking:

Human eyes may perseive lower kevin as "brighter", but lux meter did not.


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## richardcpf (Oct 8, 2010)

They will read pretty much the same in the lux meter. But a whiter tint is brighter to the human eyes, better color rendition. I had 8000k and now 5000k in my car, it is not any brighter, but I see better with the whiter tint.

BTW where did you buy the mozo L35 clone? It looks pretty good.


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## mvyrmnd (Oct 8, 2010)

I don't know about lux readings from different HID temperatures, but I sure know which I can see better with:

The human eye has less Cone cells sensitive to blue light, than either red or green. Also, the part of the spectrum that the Blue cones detect in narrower than either red or green.

Blue is the absolute worst colour for the human eye. We see much better in red light.

The lower the colour temp, the more red light, the better we can see.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Color_vision

We're actually built to see green the best - as it's the colour of food 

Yellow and red are the next best things.


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## Hamilton Felix (Oct 9, 2010)

There's good reason that factory and high quality aftermarket HID headlights are supplied with bulbs that produce light of 4200 degrees Kelvin.


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## XeRay (Oct 9, 2010)

ma_sha1 said:


> I did just that, I used *the same ballast*, tested a 4300K bulb vs 6000K bulb, got exactly the same lux reading. :thinking:
> 
> Human eyes may perseive lower kevin as "brighter", but lux meter did not.


 

I cannot explain your results however the Philips, Osram and GE spec sheets cannot be all lies.


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## jasonck08 (Oct 10, 2010)

I'm curious... try a ceiling bounce lux reading. This may be more accurate for determining what is brighter.


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