Police Study of tactical use of Strobe

The strobe on my Zebralight SC5 makes me feel nauseous at even when I'm pointing it away from me... I would think it would be effective at disorienting/deterring individuals if their eyes react the same way that mine do....

Edit: I believe the strobe mode I'm referring to is 19Hz

bdogps said:

Hey mate, is there a reason why LEO do not use headlamps? My assumption is that they would be more advantageous since you have a free hand. I know surefire made the watch with the torch built in, but I reckon a headlamp would be better. Thanks mate.

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You're right, man All the evil one will need to do is to fire at the light source to score a headshot

Hopefully back on topic:
It would be great if the manufacturers would place the frequency on the package (or in e-literature) so the officer on a budget could decide if said product sold by A B or C has the frequency that was determined to be disorienting yet not allow unseen subtle movements by the perp.

Those folks starting out work for peanuts and in many cases choose their own edc as a backup to the dept issued SL20x or what-have-you. So they don't have the extra coin for trial and error in many cases. And when it's up to you if you go home safe or not many times taking others word for something isn't the best idea.

OT post and references to it removed.

Bill

Dave D said:

The Tactical Lights are available from the below website.

The Original.

http://www.knivesandtools.nl/nl/pt/-eden-tdl-20-tactische-zaklamp.htm

Which has now been upgraded.

http://www.knivesandtools.nl/nl/pt/-eden-tdl25-police-version-tactische-zaklamp.htm

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The batteries they advertise with it are flat top. Can it take button top or is the battery compartment too short?
A pocket clip would be very useful for this small light. Lens down.

British site (English descriptions)
https://www.knivesandtools.co.uk/en/ct/eden-torches.htm

Not sure what they mean in the description of the holsters:
" The open loop holsters are more compact and can therefore be used better if you can not carry the flashlight completely to the side of your body. The closed loop holsters are better if you can carry the holster aside of your body."

"side of the body" in the original language is unclear -- are they talking about carrying at 9 o-clock (side of body) vs 7 o-clock? Or "on your belt" vs "attached to a strap on a vest?"

Grizzlyb said:

In bright daylight on a distance of 2 meters you can't look in the strobelight anymore. You simply can't. You 100% Will close your eyes, put your hands up to protect your eyes or turn away.
Eather way, our advantage.

This light is comming close to the results we have with Pepperspray. Without all the known problems of spray.
But it will only last for a few seconds, so it still is only the short term tactical advancement of arresting a temporary blind person.
The LED is changed to a XP-L HI with a color temp 4200 Kelvin. It has 2800 lux at 3 meters.

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Why did you choose 3 meters as the distance for your spec -- maximum practical engagement distance given achievable brightness?
What is the diameter of your light's hot spot at 3m (important for hitting the target)?
Lux is an odd measurement, candela is more commonly stated by light manufacturers.

The Mag-Tac primary cell model with 320 Lumen has 9267 Cd which converts to 1030 Lux at 3m.
The rechargeable with 543 Lumen has 8171 Cd which converts to 908 Lux at 3m.

http://www.rapidtables.com/calc/light/candela-to-lux-calculator.htm

Grizzlyb said:

But it will only last for a few seconds, so it still is only the short term tactical advancement of arresting a temporary blind person.
The LED is changed to a XP-L HI with a color temp 4200 Kelvin. It has 2800 lux at 3 meters.

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When the lumens are about 1000,the blindness lasts a few seconds,but if they are 32,000,how much time would the blindness last?I say this,because I have ordered a Imalent DX80 with 32,000Lm and 163,000Cd, and it is on its way now.

bykfixer said:

Hopefully back on topic:
It would be great if the manufacturers would place the frequency on the package (or in e-literature) so the officer on a budget could decide if said product sold by A B or C has the frequency that was determined to be disorienting yet not allow unseen subtle movements by the perp.

Those folks starting out work for peanuts and in many cases choose their own edc as a backup to the dept issued SL20x or what-have-you. So they don't have the extra coin for trial and error in many cases. And when it's up to you if you go home safe or not many times taking others word for something isn't the best idea.

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I agree. I think Eagtac is the only manufacturer I've seen that states the strobe frequency. All should do it. There is also a trend towards strobes that change between two frequencies, rather than a constant frequency. As a light painting photographer who uses strobes for artistic purposes, I prefer constant frequency strobes.

I think K70 is such a double frequency strobe.

Theodore41 said:

I think K70 is such a double frequency strobe.

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Is has. Played with it last weekend

Dear friends,

I´ve been at CPF since 2007 (when Fenix L2T was a dream for people in South America). Unfortunately I´ve lost my log in. Now I created a new one just to get more info about this topic.

I know this topic is pretty old but is also pretty informative and I did not find this level of discussion on any other site. I am a police officer and I want to use this info during instructions to my colleagues in my country.


Dear Grizzlyb, do you have any uupdated article, any paper that I can use as basis for my lecture?

Thanks in advance.

He hasn't been logged-in for 3 years now. Doubt he will respond..

Might just be busy. 🤔😁😁

Moreira said:

Dear Grizzlyb, do you have any uupdated article, any paper that I can use as basis for my lecture?

Thanks in advance.

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Grizz retired from the Police in 2015 and no longer visits CPF.

I have emailed him but don't know if the email address that I have for him is current or not.

Dave D said:

Grizz retired from the Police in 2015 and no longer visits CPF.

I have emailed him but don't know if the email address that I have for him is current or not.

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Visited him, at his work, before he retired. Cool guy. Talked flashlights and stuff. Showed me around the Amsterdam police training ground. Great experience

Does anybody knkow, if the project is still active after Koen's retirement?
The Eden TDL25 flashlight disappeared from the German/Austrian knivesandtools website because of missing certification. It is still available on the UK/NL website..

Very good thread. There doesn't seem to be a lot of information on strobing outside of marketing materials.

That Eden light is EOL. Don't seems like KATO is producing any new.

With this article being over a decade old, I'm wondering what the current climate of this subject is? As a defensive tool and knowing that everything is situational, is strobe functionality on a TL advantageous or not? I'm not really looking for personal opinions as much as I'm looking for reliable third-party sources that can be cited. Can anyone provide some?

Yea, me too i'm still looking for anyone with factual experience using strobe for self defence, so far nothing. either it is not used, or those who tried, will never be able to tell us, which in itself is telling, lol