Fenix First Global Flashlight Design Contest

[Labrador72]

Exactly! I never understood why for the PD32 they increased the lumens output on Low!
PD32 XP-G R5: 9 lumens
PD32 XP-G S2: 6 lumens
PD32 XP-G2 R5: 5 lumens

For me moonlight is not even a deal-breaking feature but definitely very nice to have. I have to admit I find even the 2 lumens Low on the PD31 borderline for middle of the night stuff where you don't want to bother other people or simply your own eyes. I can see where the logic lies and that 2 lumens is maybe a decent compromise between not overly bright but still giving enough light for some general tasks, especially considering the next level on these lights is between 60 and 70 lumens so way brighter. The only other solutions would be having 5 brightness levels.

I'm surprised they are still offering 5 lumen Low as it means losing a lot of potential customers who want to have a moonlight mode!

 

[Cataract]

Fenix aims at military, LEO and hiker markets, so a low low can be in the way. It still would be nice to have a few models with one very low output.

+ 1 on AAE05 and an AA version of the E01

 

[Scooby214]

Exactly! I never understood why for the PD32 they increased the lumens output on Low!
PD32 XP-G R5: 9 lumens
PD32 XP-G S2: 6 lumens
PD32 XP-G2 R5: 5 lumens

For me moonlight is not even a deal-breaking feature but definitely very nice to have. I have to admit I find even the 2 lumens Low on the PD31 borderline for middle of the night stuff where you don't want to bother other people or simply your own eyes. I can see where the logic lies and that 2 lumens is maybe a decent compromise between not overly bright but still giving enough light for some general tasks, especially considering the next level on these lights is between 60 and 70 lumens so way brighter. The only other solutions would be having 5 brightness levels.

I'm surprised they are still offering 5 lumen Low as it means losing a lot of potential customers who want to have a moonlight mode!

I like the 3 lumen low on my PD22 and LD12 much better than the 5 lumen low on my PD32 G2 or the 7 lumen low on my E35 with the XP-E2. If they can do a 3 lumen low on the PD22 and LD12, both with the XP-G2, one would think they could do it on the PD32 with the XP-G2.

 

[DavidMB]

The winners were to be announced on the 15th, but I also can't find the gold and copper winners.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Candlelight]

Quote from the contest note #3. "The actual number of the awards will depend on the quality of the entries. Therefore, chances are that some prizes will remain vacant."
Sad to said but it is all the list of winners, It look like there is no gold and copper winners.

 

[DavidMB]

They take in all these ideas, but they don't award the the top and second to top spot. They now have my idea. If I or someone else decides to produce my design will they claim intellectual property? My problem with this is that if they did, why was the design not good enough to reward, but it's good enough to claim intellectual property to.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[dc38]

They take in all these ideas, but they don't award the the top and second to top spot. They now have my idea. If I or someone else decides to produce my design will they claim intellectual property? My problem with this is that if they did, why was the design not good enough to reward, but it's good enough to claim intellectual property to.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

That's why I don't participate unless I can have a say in contract. Otherwise it's a shaft.

 

[leon2245]

They take in all these ideas, but they don't award the the top and second to top spot. They now have my idea. If I or someone else decides to produce my design will they claim intellectual property? My problem with this is that if they did, why was the design not good enough to reward, but it's good enough to claim intellectual property to.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

When you submitted your design, was there a terms & conditions page you had to accept, disclaimers about all designs becoming their property, or guarantees about minimum number of prizes awarded etc. that you normally see in the fine print of these types of contests? Either way, beyond hurt feelings, this was just a bad idea all around imo. We don't have any direct knowledge of their manufacturing costs or marketing/sales realities, that we could even know what's possible/profitable for them.

 

[dc38]

When you submitted your design, was there a terms & conditions page you had to accept, disclaimers about all designs becoming their property, or guarantees about minimum number of prizes awarded etc. that you normally see in the fine print of these types of contests? Either way, beyond hurt feelings, this was just a bad idea all around imo. We don't have any direct knowledge of their manufacturing costs or marketing/sales realities, that we could even know what's possible/profitable for them.

4. The intellectual property right of all designed works from contestants shall belong to the Organizer. Contestants have the right of signature. Please keep the original draft; all submitted works shall not be returned. By submitting an Entry, you agree that your submission is gratuitous and made without restriction and will not place Organizer under any obligation, and that Organizer are free to use the ideas without any additional compensation to you. You acknowledge that, by accepting your Entry, Organizer do not waive any rights to use similar or related ideas previously known to Organizer, or developed by their employees, or obtained from sources other than you.

thats not even fine print...basically, if you send them your idea, it is now their idea. if you develop a similar light by altering what you sent them, they can take legal action against you, because your idea becomes their "previously knowledge". And that's why I do not participate in these things without first sending legal notice of MY terms. They can highway rob your idea, and it costs them less than commissioning their own designers. On top of that, they have hundreds, if not thousands to choose from, all pretty much for free.

 

[leon2245]

YEah I figured contestants would have had to consent to something like that, and that sounds pretty straightforward.

 

[wjv]

Fenix aims at military, LEO and hiker markets, so a low low can be in the way. It still would be nice to have a few models with one very low output.

One would think that those folks would appreciate a setting that helps preserve night vision while preforming tasks such as map reading, taking notes, looking in a back pack. . .

 

[DavidMB]

The rules are written so that Fenix can claim intellectual property to every design submitted in their Global Flashlight Design Contest, yet they don't even declare a gold or a copper prize winner. To not have a complete list of winners and to not give an explanation, when the rules are written so that they retain rights to all the non-winning entries--it feels like a set-up. They may have every legal right to do this, but I don't think this is a good or fair way to treat their loyal customers and followers who decided to participate. I'm sorry that I ever submitted my design.

 

[dc38]

The rules are written so that Fenix can claim intellectual property to every design submitted in their Global Flashlight Design Contest, yet they don't even declare a gold or a copper prize winner. To not have a complete list of winners and to not give an explanation, when the rules are written so that they retain rights to all the non-winning entries--it feels like a set-up. They may have every legal right to do this, but I don't think this is a good or fair way to treat their loyal customers and followers who decided to participate. I'm sorry that I ever submitted my design.

If it really bothers you, try and work your way up the ladder until you're talking to the right people. Based on the way the contest is set up, it seems like it was not Fenix corporate who set it up. Perhaps their R&D contractor took an easy way out and commissioned laymen around the world to do their jobs because it cost less. Maybe it was a third party unrelated to corporate who just sets up these events so that they can sell designs to whichever manufacture they please when all is said and done. Maybe Fenix was just the highest bidder for their services so they got first pick. That way, they would have to cover reward base with just ONE manufacturer and a few winners, and sell the designs to other manufacturers without any further consumer headache.

I would be disappointed (but not surprised) if other manufacturers started rolling out designs taken from 'us' (us being the global entries) with impunity.

In short, third party collects ideas. shirks all responsibilities except prize obligation, which they let top bidding manufacturer sift and choose their favored design. Sell them licensing and/or IP rights / royalties, give prize to winning designer, end of that. Then leftover designs divvied up between tiered bidding manufacturers, without further obligation to award any other design entries. They make money per design, etc.

Any submitting party claiming that the 'Organizer' was collecting designs on false pretenses because they were submitting for Fenix prizes would be shot down because of the contest agreement to relinquish all IP rights.

**DISCLAIMER**(I do NOT do any legal related things for a living, this is all purely devil's advocate speculation. I ALWAYS look for the worst in people when it comes to corporate and big business scenarios. If I were a 'superhero', I'd be Question)

 

[Fast LT1]

Is it just me or are the people that "must" have low low light mode are all so damn picky? If 5 lumens is too much then you shouldn't be doing what you're doing.

 

[dc38]

Is it just me or are the people that "must" have low low light mode are all so damn picky? If 5 lumens is too much then you shouldn't be doing what you're doing.

I used to wonder and think the same thing...anything below .5 lumen is just quirky (but almost useless imo) and great as an indicator light, but hardly useful for anything else as it strains the eyes...at the same time, as few as 3 lumens is blinding in pitch blackness, so horses for courses I guess.

 

[beamis]

Is it just me or are the people that "must" have low low light mode are all so damn picky? If 5 lumens is too much then you shouldn't be doing what you're doing.

I'm starting to wonder if a lot of CPF'ers suffer from night blindness because 5 lumens switched on in a pitch black house is blindingly bright.

 

[leon2245]

Is it just me or are the people that "must" have low low light mode are all so damn picky? If 5 lumens is too much then you shouldn't be doing what you're doing.

I'm not one of the militant sublumenites, but guys shouldn't be taking a leak while their wives are sleeping?!

Also, Idk that it makes them any more or less picky than using any other feature preferences as buying criteria.

 

[Brasso]

I won't buy an edc light unless it has a moon light mode. I don't know if that makes me a minority or majority. It's just a deal breaker for me. Same with being able to tail stand. If it can't tail stand, I don't buy it for edc use.

This is why I only have one Fenix light, an LD12, and it's not for edc. Unless they offer a moon light mode and the ability to tail stand it will remain my only Fenix light. Sadly, because I love everything else about it.

 

[DavidMB]

Fenix got people to spend a lot of time and thought designing the kind of flashlight they wanted for a partial list of awards and bunch of certificates, you usually have to pay a lot of money to get that kind of market research.

At this point I don't know if I'd have anything to gain by contacting them. Whether they organized it or not, they let their reputation and goodwill with customers and followers get used. The whole contest feels dishonest


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[beamis]

At this point I don't know if I'd have anything to gain by contacting them. Whether they organized it or not, they let their reputation and goodwill with customers and followers get used. The whole contest feels dishonest

That's the whole point of design competitions: to outsource your R&D and design to unpaid volunteers. I bet Fenix won't even give a cut of the sales to the winning designer. I'd be surprised if they even credit the designer in the product packaging.