LED Q4559X

[japudjuha]

Has anyone had a chance to have a Look at these new
LED par 64 QX replacements?
They claim similar output with much reduced current draw.

http://www.hoffmanengineering.com/products_detail.php?item_id=142&cat_id=88

 

[get-lit]

Interesting.. it's a large triple reflector. Looks well done.

 

[XeRay]

Interesting.. it's a large triple reflector. Looks well done.

A good strategy but based on the claimed watts, I doubt the lumens are there compared to the incandescent original. Yes it uses 3 duplicate "sections" of a parabola (not a single parabola), more expensive to make this reflector. Not sure what it is made from, but I would hope it is cast and not stamped. The cast aluminum reflector can be much more precise. I doubt they use electroformed due to the cost factor. Also, a cast aluminum reflector is a good heatsink. It could also be molded plastic but then it has no heatsink abilities.

 

[get-lit]

It appears cast by looking that how the edge of the lip of the reflector's aperture has no bend you would see if it were stamped.

 

[BVH]

Is a good performing LED about 100 Lumens per Watt now-a-days? If so, the max Lumens would be around 6,000 give or take. About half the Lumens of the Incans. If the LEDs Candela is the same, then it must be focused tighter which would reduce the flood Lumens while maintaining the throw. It's higher color temp which is great! I'd like to get one, wonder how much they are. A potential replacement for the LarryK. Nice find, Japudjuha.

Specs on their web page say housing is cast Aluminum.

 

[XeRay]

Is a good performing LED about 100 Lumens per Watt now-a-days? If so, the max Lumens would be around 6,000 give or take. About half the Lumens of the Incans. If the LEDs Candela is the same, then it must be focused tighter which would reduce the flood Lumens while maintaining the throw. It's higher color temp which is great! I'd like to get one, wonder how much they are. A potential replacement for the LarryK. Nice find, Japudjuha. Specs on their web page say housing is cast Aluminum.

I would bet is closer to 5000 or 5500 lumens with the regulation circuitry losses.
I have known about this unit for a couple of months. Like anything with aviation, it is expensive.
You are likely looking at between $1,500.00 (VERY conservative and more likely $3K or $4K). I would bet you are looking at $2,500 or higher.
We produce a 75 watt HID in Par-64 format and its well under $800.00, it produces about 8300 bulb lumens.

 

[BVH]

Might make sense for the big boys operations with labor, downtime, reduced generator load factors etc. Are the Q4559x's in danger of being discontinued or are they already discontinued and we are just coming across NOS? IIRC, they are rated for 50 hours and the 4559 for 25. I don't know how many "flights" that equates to. 30 minutes use per flight maybe so 100 flights. Used only on the larger aircraft so maybe 1 flight per day so changed every 3 months? Mechanic at $75.00 per hour fully burdened? .5 hour to change so about $150 per year in labor. Reduces landfill load so maybe good for green depending on amount of energy consumed and pollutants created during mfg versus the incan. At $2,500 seems like it might not be a good investment. Will more lamps per aircraft be needed due to loss in flood Lumens or were incans overkill?

 

[larryk]

I do not know much about aircraft, but don't the larger airliners have problems with icing ? An incandescent or HID lamp would quickly de-ice itself. I do not believe an LED lamp would do the same. Here in Wisconsin some of our stop and go lights were converted to LED. In the winter months when it snows the old incandescent lights stay clear, and the snow collects on the LED ones.

 

[Patriot]

I can't identify it in the picture but output really depends on the diode technology. The large LED's typically aren't very efficient, because they don't have to be. If each LED is really consuming less than 20W they're probably getting less than 2000L per LED. Without active cooling they're likely sinking directly to a reflector housing tower as it's the only thing large enough to get rid of all that heat. Seems like a good design.

 

[XeRay]

I do not know much about aircraft, but don't the larger airliners have problems with icing ? An incandescent or HID lamp would quickly de-ice itself. I do not believe an LED lamp would do the same. Here in Wisconsin some of our stop and go lights were converted to LED. In the winter months when it snows the old incandescent lights stay clear, and the snow collects on the LED ones.

Turbine / jet aircraft use "bypass air" from the engines to heat the fuel (mostly for high altitude flight), the fuel can "Gel" at very very cold temps, so they keep ALL the fuel warm. They also use this same bypass air to heat the wings to prevent ice build up. So putting a small amount of heat to the front lens, in front of the light, would not present a problem.
That is, when the air craft is designed or they likely can provide a "blast tube" of heated air to that location as a minor engineered alteration.

 

[XeRay]

Will more lamps per aircraft be needed due to loss in flood Lumens or were incans overkill?

We have only sold our Par-64 systems for crop dusting type aircraft (airplanes and Helicopters both). AirTractor and other Ag spray aircraft use these for Night Ops. They are retractable units on the underside of the wing.

You would be surprised how much crop spraying nation wide, occurs at night, lots of it (a sizable percentage). There are a few reasons for this (not in any particular order): 1. The daytime summer can be stiflingly hot for the pilot, especially in the central valley of California and Arizona. 2. They can carry bigger loads (less trips) of chemicals at night, when the air is not so hot and less dense (called "density altitude"). 3. The bees are not out pollinating at night, killing bees is not a good thing in the Agriculture business. They do end up hitting some owls (not often) and bats though instead of bees. 4. You will be surprised at this one. There are people who try to get sprayed on purpose so they can file a lawsuit against the spraying companies. Its MUCH harder for people to see exactly where the planes and spray helicopters are going at night, so this pretty much eliminates that problem.
Added: (Reminder from BVH) 5. Less surface winds (on the average) more accurate spray application and better spray deposition.

For the crop dusters not overkill, they need to see whats ahead well before its a "problem", power-lines, hills fences etc., when they are flying "on the deck". They don't use them for flood purposes, so its not overkill. As far as I know, these Par-64's are mostly needed for spot beam (landing).
These current aviation LED's are not likely to do the job as currently configured. We have a solution in the works for LED in a Par-36 size first, then a Par-46 and then possibly in a Par-64. When we do it, "the lumens will be there". I can't say more at this time, we will unveil on our website in the next 3 to 6 months. We have been working on it for about 10 months, prototypes basically finished.

 

[get-lit]

Crop chasers lol

 

[BVH]

Excellent reasons for dusting at night! I'd guess the winds are lighter on average too at night so less pilot work load and less of the spray material being blown off target. Although I haven't flown pilot in command since '94, I still remember the principle of density altitude and the payload relationship.

 

[Patriot]

There are people who try to get sprayed on purpose so they can file a lawsuit against the spraying companies. Its MUCH harder for people to see exactly where the planes and spray helicopters are going at night, so this pretty much eliminates that problem.

I'm surprised but I guess I shouldn't be.

 

[japudjuha]

XeRay, Please keep us posted on the new LED lights your working on.
I would be very keen to see them when they're released!!!