Surefire 6P LED + Malkoff M60 + LIGHTSAVER Miser ?

[dezertdog]

Ran home at lunch and picked up the other meter, dead batt too. I really need to buy some auto off meters! Scrounged some AAA batts and did some testing.

For this test I used two AW RCR123 batteries measured at 3.7 volts each (not fully charged, but realistic for an EDC light after some use). The two cells measure 7.1 volts in series. Using these batteries, all LIGHTSAVER "ON" settings read an output of 6.1 volts. Seems you can expect a ~1V drop in output using this tailcap, and this gap seems to increase as the cells drop in voltage (although I was not specifically testing for this, it's just an observation).

Using a Craftsman 82062 clamp meter. I've run some 6" 12g leads out of the 6P body to the M60. Hitting the zero adj, then clamping it around the positive lead at a 90 degree angle I get the following readings:

1 click: .8A (4.88W) (100%)
2 clicks: .5A (3.05W) (62.5%)
3 clicks: .3A (1.83W) (37.5%)
4 clicks (slow beacon): .4A ON/.1A OFF
5 clicks (fast beacon): .5A ON/.3A OFF
In all cases after clicking the tailcap to "OFF" the meter reads .1A/.4v (.04W)

So who's got the formula to determine runtime in minutes?

As a baseline the stock 6PL tailcap "ON" measures .6A/7.3V (4.38W) using the same testing rig.

 

[dezertdog]

I found this link in another post.

For 100% I get 1:45 hours, 62.5% give me 2:47 hours and 37.5% gives 4:39 hours. I can live with that.

 

[Bullzeyebill]

Still would like to see testing done with the cells charged up more, over 4 volts, at least 4.1 volts. I recharge my cells when I notice they are reading 3.7 volts, even when in series. Cells will perform better to their specs when they have a higher capacity, compared to only about 10-15% capacity at 3.7 volts.

Bill

 

[dezertdog]

Retested using new batteries in the meter and two cells fresh off the charger. Each cell reads 4.13V, 8.24V in series.

Stock 6PL tailcap draws .5A @ 7.7V.

LIGHTSAVER Miser draws:

1 click: .7A @ 6.85V, 4.8W, 100%
2 clicks: .4A @ 6.85V, 2.74W, 57%
3 clicks: .2A @ 6.85V, 1.37W, 29%
4 clicks: Not tested
5 clicks: Not tested
Off: .0A @ .4V Last test I was getting a strong .1A, now it's reading zero. This meter might not have a low enough range in the DCA setting (only reads in 400A).

 

[Bullzeyebill]

Thanks. Seems to be following regulation. Current went up in each stage as voltage went down (3.7 X2 volts). Lightmeter test checking lux, or bounce comparision between standard tailcap and Lightsaver would be illuminating (pun not intended).

Bill

 

[etc]

Clicks are
1st: 100%
2nd: 50%
3rd: 25%
4th: slow beacon
5th: fast beacon

Once on any setting for 3 seconds, the next click is off.

Press/hold = momentary. A click is pressing the button for less than 1 second, a hold is anything over 1 second. So pressing and holding for 1 second is momentary 100%, and when released the light turns off.

There is zero delay in the light turning on when the button is pressed (like the LiteFlux LF5XT for example).

Can you turn it off from any mode? That is push and hold?

 

[dezertdog]

Can you turn it off from any mode? That is push and hold?

Any click after it's been on in any mode for 3 seconds turns it off.

Any push/hold longer than 1 second is treated as momentary and when released it turns off.

If you wanted to go to 25%, then turn it off you would do: Click, click, click, wait 3 seconds, click.

 

[dezertdog]

Also there is another behavior I noticed, you can momentary any setting by press/holding the button once you reach that setting.

So say you wanted to momentary 25%, you would do :click, click, press/hold (for as long as you wanted it on), then releasing the button would turn the light off.

 

[etc]

I wonder if all these multi-mode tailcasps ultimately reduce reliability... We know that Z41 for example is known for 100% reliability in all conditions but how well tested is this product, other than lab environment?

 

[Bullzeyebill]

I wonder if all these multi-mode tailcasps ultimately reduce reliability... We know that Z41 for example is known for 100% reliability in all conditions but how well tested is this product, other than lab environment?

If you need to be assured that your flashlight comes on every time then use a twisty/momentary switch such as the Z41. I look at these multi-mode lights, all of them, as lights to be used in non demanding situations, and I carry a backup or two when they fail. BTW, a good many of my lights either have built in multi-mode functions, or add on circuits such as AW's soft start three mode mod, or my UNIQUE tailcap. I am not a LEO, or a solder, so I have no problem using my multi-mode lights, but when I search the house for strange noises, I use a twisty/momentary switch light.

Bill

 

[UWAK]

I'm a retard on electronics, so this miser will work on 9P+Malkoff M60?

 

[J Smyth]

I am sold. I just ordered a M60 over the weekend for my 6P and now just ordered the Lightsaver tail switch. That should be the ticket! Thanks for the recon.

 

[etc]

If you need to be assured that your flashlight comes on every time then use a twisty/momentary switch such as the Z41. I look at these multi-mode lights, all of them, as lights to be used in non demanding situations, and I carry a backup or two when they fail. BTW, a good many of my lights either have built in multi-mode functions, or add on circuits such as AW's soft start three mode mod, or my UNIQUE tailcap. I am not a LEO, or a solder, so I have no problem using my multi-mode lights, but when I search the house for strange noises, I use a twisty/momentary switch light.

Bill

Reason for asking, I've had a few "digital" lites fail on me and so I am concerned about reliability.

 

[Blindasabat]

Thanks for testing desertdog!
These have been mentioned before, but since they said "no LED!" I kept away. Maybe they couldn't be sure of it working with all the various LED drivers out in the world.
I see they have an E-series version too. I may have to try one of those on one of my direct drive E-series (L1 heads on E1e bodies, 18500, or 18650 bodies). Hmm, upgrade the G2 in the car (currently single level 150L and always wanted a low/med on it) or get another L1/E-series toy to play with.

Good work.

 

[Jim Holzemer]

etc and Bullzeyebill make excellent points.

Time will tell w/ these tailcaps as far as reliability. As far as carrying them, I've used the Unic, TLS(current favorite) as well as the Lightsaver and they are indeed very versatile. Much to be said for the ability to dramatically lower the light output when needed. I do, however, always slightly rotate the bezel to store..

But when push comes to shove, only a twist/momentary switch will always work. Another reason for "one is none, two is one."

And who in THIS bunch only carries one?

 

[madi05]

i thought the m30 was for the 6p (used for 2X r123 or 1X 18650) , why are people using the m60? i thought the m60 was to be used for like( 2 X 18650)

also what would the diff. be?

i just purchased me a surefire 6pled ,, what kind of difference will these dropins be than what comes in it?

thanks
madi05

 

[dezertdog]

i thought the m30 was for the 6p (used for 2X r123 or 1X 18650) , why are people using the m60? i thought the m60 was to be used for like( 2 X 18650)

also what would the diff. be?

i just purchased me a surefire 6pled ,, what kind of difference will these dropins be than what comes in it?

thanks
madi05

The M60 is designed to run on 2 cells (~7.4 volts) The M30 is designed to run on 1 cell (~3.7 Volts). You must never run two cells with an M30, it will destroy it.


From their site:

M60
"The input voltage is 3.8 - 9 volts. Below 3.8 volts it will drop out of regulation and run direct drive."


M30
"It was designed specifically to fit SureFire 3P, 6P, 6Z, C2, M2 and G2 flashlights WITH A SINGLE LITHIUM RECHARGEABLE CELL."

"The input voltage is 1 - 5.5 volts."


So if you run 2x CR123 cells you would use the M60 like I have here. If you are going to use 1x 18650 (which doesn't fit in the 17.5mm body tube of a 6P) you would use the M30.

If you want to run the M30 and one cell (like the 18650) you need to get an 18mm body tube like the Solarforce L2. The only way to run one cell in the stock Surefire body tube would be to use an M30 and a 17670 cell which has a smaller outside diameter.

 

[dezertdog]

i just purchased me a surefire 6pled ,, what kind of difference will these dropins be than what comes in it?

thanks
madi05

The stock LED is about 100 Lumens or so, the M60 is about 235. The reason I started this tailcap thread is because it SO bright that I needed lower levels for things like reading maps in cars etc. It's a great drop-in, I wouldn't run anything else after owning this.

 

[madi05]

thanks for your answers, a few more questions,, so i cant use 2 rcr123 aw with the m60 it is only for primaires cr123? and if i chose the m30 i can only use either 1Xrcr123 or 1X18650 and the 1X18650 will give me alot more run time correct? i can bore out the body of the 6p to fit this i believe , right?

also when u say low , how much low would u say roughly is ? because i would want a low and maybe a medium as well as a high ,, or maybe a med high for longer run times, ?

i read about others moded dropins like the DX ones what is your take on those ?

basically i would like to be able to go from low to high and if there are other modes i can click to easy i would like that to but i would like it to remember last mode , is this possible if so can u direct me please? this is my first surefire purchase and i like the small size of the 6p

thanks for your help

madi05

 

[dezertdog]

thanks for your answers, a few more questions,, so i cant use 2 rcr123 aw with the m60 it is only for primaires cr123?

I use 2x AW RCR123 cells with my M60 and it works great, this is the ideal setup for this drop-in.

and if i chose the m30 i can only use either 1Xrcr123 or 1X18650 and the 1X18650 will give me alot more run time correct?

Yes the M30 is designed for only one cell. I'd use either an 17670 with the stock body tube or an 18650 with a Solarforce L2 tube.

i can bore out the body of the 6p to fit this i believe , right?

I've heard of this done, but for $14 I'd say that a new 18mm Solarforce L2 body is a better choice.

also when u say low , how much low would u say roughly is ? because i would want a low and maybe a medium as well as a high ,, or maybe a med high for longer run times, ?

I don't have a light meter, but you can use the percentages above to come to a rough Lumen value for each setting.

i read about others moded dropins like the DX ones what is your take on those ?

I've only owned the stock 6PL and the M60 so I can't say.

basically i would like to be able to go from low to high and if there are other modes i can click to easy i would like that to but i would like it to remember last mode , is this possible if so can u direct me please? this is my first surefire purchase and i like the small size of the 6p

This Miser tailcap doesn't remember any settings, and I havn't heard of one that does. The idea is you want the same behavior every time so that in a stressful situation you can use muscle memory to get to where you want to be, instead of trying to figure out what it's set on based on the last time you used it.