Which Eneloops for my Amateur Radio HT?

[archimedes]

Thank you for that information, sounds like pretty recent stock then

 

[Timothybil]

Still curious about the production date ?[/QUOTE

I don't see any date code on the package or on the batteries. All batteries in the pack show a good charge though - not sure if a full charge, but on my 'el-cheapo- battery tester, shows green.

At one time the NiMH cells I was purchasing stated on the package that they were shipped with 80% charge as that was the optimum level for long term storage (aka sitting on the shelves). I have seen that number in other places as well.

 

[WalkIntoTheLight]

At one time the NiMH cells I was purchasing stated on the package that they were shipped with 80% charge as that was the optimum level for long term storage (aka sitting on the shelves). I have seen that number in other places as well.

I've heard 75% as well, which seems to be about the level of the Eneloops I've bought. I store at 100%, and I haven't noticed any issues with that over the past 13 years I've been using Eneloops.

75% or 80% may be for optimal long-term storage, though I've heard it is because they can mass-charge cells at the factory quickly to 75%, without risking heating up the cells or worrying about any balancing issues. NiMH chemistry tends to get hot only near the end of charge.

 

[AVService]

Re: Which Eneloops For My Amateur Radio HT?

I just received the 16-pak of white Eneloops (BK3MCCA). I chose the white ones because I don't really have a dedicated use for them. I do use them in my VX-150 and FT60 radios, but other devices as well.
Should I run each bran-new battery through the 'Break-In' mode on the MHC9000?, or just charge them up to full?

I have never paid any attention to breaking them in.

I do usually number pairs or sets of 4 or 6 though so that I can keep them together for a certain device like the VX150 which needs 6 cells.
I started doing this when I bought a lot of them for camera flashes and I had read that it was better to keep them together somehow.

I am not sure it makes any difference but I feel better doing it so.....

 

[WalkIntoTheLight]

Re: Which Eneloops For My Amateur Radio HT?

I do usually number pairs or sets of 4 or 6 though so that I can keep them together for a certain device like the VX150 which needs 6 cells.
I started doing this when I bought a lot of them for camera flashes and I had read that it was better to keep them together somehow.

I am not sure it makes any difference but I feel better doing it so.....

It's probably a good idea (I do the same). However, I don't think it makes a big difference, nor is it important for safety (like it is with lithium-ion).

I find that when Eneloops start getting old (i.e., more than about 300 full cycles), they go bad very quickly. Their capacity will start to drop, and the biggest difference is their internal resistance sky-rockets. You'll notice when you have a mis-matched set, especially if it's used in anything using more than about 250mA of current.

Until then, Eneloops tend to be very consistent with their capacity and internal resistance, even when their age is years apart. I can't really tell the difference in performance between new Eneloops and ones that are 10 years old.

 

[ultrarunner2015]

Re: Which Eneloops For My Amateur Radio HT?

I have never paid any attention to breaking them in.

I do usually number pairs or sets of 4 or 6 though so that I can keep them together for a certain device like the VX150 which needs 6 cells.
I started doing this when I bought a lot of them for camera flashes and I had read that it was better to keep them together somehow.

I am not sure it makes any difference but I feel better doing it so.....

It would make sense to keep batteries with nearly the same capacity together, so, as they discharge, you don't wind up with one or more completely dead cells while others still have some juice left in them.
I have been keeping a database (MS Access) of all my Eneloops. When I run an Refresh/Analyze cycle, I record the reported capacity, the starting voltage, which I understand would be the 'IR' number, and the ending voltage.
I can then sort batteries by capacity for the VX-150 and FT60 packs.

For the new 16-pack I just received, I have decided to do a little experimentation.
For the first 4, I have run first a discharge cycle at 500mA, then a Break-In cycle, setting the capacity to 2,000mAh. That cycle is still running on the first set of 4.
After the Break-In, I plan to run the Refresh/Analyze cycle, so I get the true capacity. For that I will use the recommended 0.3C (700mA) charge rate. I'm not sure about the discharge rate. I guess the same 700mA would be good, but in the past, I had been using 500mA for both charge and discharge when running the R&A cycle. This was before I studied the MH-C9000 manual once more, and realized that I should not be charging at rates lower than 0.33C, thus the 700mA for a 2,000mAh battery.

For the second set of 4, I plan to only run the R&A cycle. I will compare the results, and decide whether it's worth the extra time to run the Break-In cycle.
I know I'm over-thinking all of this, but what the heck... I've got the time, and have the curiosity.

 

[AVService]

Re: Which Eneloops For My Amateur Radio HT?

It's probably a good idea (I do the same). However, I don't think it makes a big difference, nor is it important for safety (like it is with lithium-ion).

I find that when Eneloops start getting old (i.e., more than about 300 full cycles), they go bad very quickly. Their capacity will start to drop, and the biggest difference is their internal resistance sky-rockets. You'll notice when you have a mis-matched set, especially if it's used in anything using more than about 250mA of current.

Until then, Eneloops tend to be very consistent with their capacity and internal resistance, even when their age is years apart. I can't really tell the difference in performance between new Eneloops and ones that are 10 years old.

Yeah I don't have any safety concern I do it for performance.......hopefully.

I wonder too about the Eneloop Pro vs the Standard which are not labeled with as high energy storage but claimed to last more charge cycles?

 

[WalkIntoTheLight]

Re: Which Eneloops For My Amateur Radio HT?

Yeah I don't have any safety concern I do it for performance.......hopefully.

I wonder too about the Eneloop Pro vs the Standard which are not labeled with as high energy storage but claimed to last more charge cycles?

IIRC, testing indicates you get about double the number of cycles from the standard Eneloops, compared to the Pros. You probably get a lot more than that, but internal resistance starts to become an issue for high-drain applications like flashlights. If you're just using them in low-drain stuff like remote controls, the standard Eneloops are the clear winner because they have lower self-discharge.

Shelf-life may also be an issue with the Pros. I have standard Eneloops from 2006 that still work well. I doubt the Pros would last that long.

 

[apagogeas]

Re: Which Eneloops For My Amateur Radio HT?

Regarding Eneloop Pro (Panasonic version), I got 16 of them back in May 2015 for camera flash use, all gone through a break-in in my Maha mc9000 to record the capacity (2500mA setting). Got around 30-40 uses each and in reality over the last year they sat unused in plastic cases (virtually stopped doing that job). My usage plan is I do not charge them till I need them for the next event; I leave them as is after the event to whatever charge they have. So, it is now 4 years later and I did a break-in again to check their condition. Also never tried to use every last bit of energy they have (avoid overdischarge). Tested every year at the start of the season with a refresh cycle to see if some go bad for assurance.

First column is the initial break-in in 2015 (IRC voltage) and the latter is in 2019 (and IRC voltage)
2558(1.46), 2457(1.40)
2517(1.42), 2431(1.46)
2523(1.46), 2421(1.44)
2559(1.44), 2460(1.44)
2536(1.48), 2468(1.44)
2542(1.45), 2491(1.41)
2501(1.44), 2458(1.43)
2547(1.45), 2482(1.42)
2546(1.48), 2461(1.45)
2514(1.47), 2456(1.46)
2519(1.45), 2434(1.46)
2551(1.45), 2486(1.44)
2537(1.46), 2419(1.47)
2542(1.46), 2455(1.46)
2567(1.47), 2397(1.71)
2560(1.45), 2498(1.43)

Well, I see around 100mAh drop give or take over a 4 year period and virtually no increase in resistance (except the 2nd last from the end, not sure what happened here). In short, Pros hold brilliantly too.