Armytek Wizard Pro Prototype Long-Term Testing

[RedForest UK]

If it continually cuts power and steps down at only 5-6 minutes on high power the information provided is completely false.

The thing is that it doesn't always do that, it's temperature based rather than timer. So while in a warm room it will step down after 5 minutes, outside in colder temperatures it could run for much longer or even the full hour. Armytek listed the capabilities of the light, they can't be expected to vary their specs according to specific usage scenarios.

 

[Knight_Light]

If they have they have not changed their specs on their web site. They still advertise 1hr 6min at high output: "Output levels and runtimes: 1010 lm (1h 6min), 550 lm (2h 48min), 250 lm (7h), 115 lm (15h), 30 lm (50h), 7 lm (9d), 0.5 lm (100d), 2 Strobes." If it continually cuts power and steps down at only 5-6 minutes on high power the information provided is completely false. It only has a runtime of 5-6 minutes on high, not 1hr 6min. This production run must either be defective or they are swindling their customers. Many based their decision to buy this light based on its long available runtime on high. Fudging their lumens ratings is just misleading; this is blatant falsehood.

I don’t think that they are fudging their lumen ratings just because they are not quoting them in OTF fashion. I definitely think that it is probably confusing to a lot of people and a different standard should be adopted. The ANSI standard is somewhat goofy also. Like I said in previous posts it should be lux @ 1m and lux@ 20m (or some other agreed-upon distance), but good luck trying to get manufacturers on board with this.

As far as the light thermal protection being tripped I don’t think the lights are defective or that it is a swindle. It seems they simply lowered the threshold. Remember most manufacturers high outputs are limited by time this one is limited by temperature. So if you can keep the light cool enough it will run longer on Turbo.

 

[Trevtrain]

If they have they have not changed their specs on their web site. They still advertise 1hr 6min at high output: "Output levels and runtimes: 1010 lm (1h 6min), 550 lm (2h 48min), 250 lm (7h), 115 lm (15h), 30 lm (50h), 7 lm (9d), 0.5 lm (100d), 2 Strobes." If it continually cuts power and steps down at only 5-6 minutes on high power the information provided is completely false. It only has a runtime of 5-6 minutes on high, not 1hr 6min. This production run must either be defective or they are swindling their customers.

I suppose you could see it that way.
But perhaps could you show me any other manufacturer that quotes runtimes on anything other than battery capacity and current draw. Not to mention those with "timed stepdowns" or blatant bold-print warnings NOT to run the light on High for more than a few minutes.

I'm not trying to apologize for Armytek but would you rather they just took out the thermal cutoff like most of the other cheaper high-powered lights so you could run it to destruction? Remember, these are tailstanding tests on Max output with no active cooling so you need to keep it a little bit real.

Many based their decision to buy this light based on its long available runtime on high. Fudging their lumens ratings is just misleading; this is blatant falsehood.

Can you show me where they quoted this long runtime with no cooling? Did you read and understand that thermal stepdown was used before you bought the light?
The only claim I saw of an uninterrupted runtime on Max was Knight_Light's test where he has clearly stated he thought the heat generated was probably excessive anyway. He also made it clear that his was a pre-production model for reveiw and that the final version may be different.

My comment about the light not being defective was simply in the spirit of stopping one member from worrying he had a faulty light when in fact there seem to be other people getting the same results.

 

[petr9999]

I went to my local armytek dostributor today, and they were quite clueless as well... I am wondering if i should write an email to amrytek as well? So they know that this is not an isolated issue...

 

[Trevtrain]

From what I am seeing on these posts, it seems to me that they lowered the temperature threshold for the production model. On one hand it is really a shame because to get an hour on Turbo is pretty awesome (even though in my opinion it’s useless most of the time), on the other hand the temperatures that I recorded were getting extremely high (in my opinion), and I have to admit that my own personal comfort level was slightly tested (utilized a complete face shield when taking temperature at the head).

This is how I read the situation as well. I would prefer they err on the side of caution anyway.

The bigger shame is that they seem to have lowered the threshold without altering the circuitry controlling the indicator LED. The fact that we now don't get the yellow-to-red warning before stepdown is a valid point for criticism even if it doesn't really affect the day to day operation of the light.

But in the end I have to re-iterate that in my opinion this tailstanding test is really not indicative of typical real-world usage.

 

[Knight_Light]

The bigger shame is that they seem to have lowered the threshold without altering the circuitry controlling the indicator LED. The fact that we now don't get the yellow-to-red warning before stepdown is a valid point for criticism even if it doesn't really affect the day to day operation of the light.

+1

 

[RedForest UK]

It seems like they simply lowered the threshold for temperature protection kicking in to 65 or 70 celsius, but didn't change the temperatures at which the colour LEDs blink at. I have certainly never seen anything other than green in temperature indication. That is a bit of an oversight, and I think they may have gone a bit over the top in the magnitude of the drop itself.

My personal opinion is that the drop down from turbo should be to a higher level than 100 lumens, but for longer, to allow temperature to slowly drop without a massive sudden loss in output. However, there are not many times I would need turbo, and when I tested it outside on a warm night it didn't drop out of it for at least 5 minutes of continuous use, so in real life I don't think it's such an issue. If it does ever drop-down a quick double click takes you back to the main modes anyway.

 

[paja-jojo]

I made another thermal test - i submerged the headlamp in a glass of watter and the lamp hold 1h and 5 mins on max with the original battery - no thermal protection kicked in.
So the problem is really in the temperature and the way the lamp is cooling.
If i use the lamp on 550lm - it newer reaches the 65°C threshold - it would be nic not to drop the intensity from MAX to 100lm but only to 550lm.

 

[petr9999]

the problem is, i bought this light with the intention of using it on max as a bicycle light... I just tried standing the light on max right under the A/C unit which is blowing cool air, and it steped down after 15 mins or so!

 

[Knight_Light]

the problem is, i bought this light with the intention of using it on max as a bicycle light... I just tried standing the light on max right under the A/C unit which is blowing cool air, and it steped down after 15 mins or so!

Why would you pick this particular headlamp as a bicycle light? When you can get lights with bigger reflectors, bigger battery capacity, and better thermal management.

 

[petr9999]

i use it as a headlamp and edc as well, I bought this light because it promised a nicer beam check and higher output with no stepdown ​see above


I debated whether to get the Fenix BT20 bike light instead, but i use the light on a bike for only around 25% of the time

 

[Trevtrain]

So in the interests of science, I have conducted another test.

It's now just after 10pm here. This is an outdoor tailstanding test. Light is sitting on a chair in the driveway with a decent airflow across it.

Ambient temperature is 18C and there is a gusty breeze blowing. Again, I have no IR equipment so results are subjective.
Same Panasonic cell as earlier today - recharged and with a resting voltage of 4.16V

At 3 min mark the head is warm and the body somewhat cooler At 5 min mark it is definitely warmer but not uncomfortable to touch in any way. Indicator light still blinking normally
At 10 min mark, I can still grip the head comfortably though it is now what I would call quite warm. Indicator light still normal

At 15 mins, no obvious change that I could detect. Body of light has increased in temperature and is no doubt helping to shed heat
At 30 mins I decided to stop the test as we seemed to have reached equilibrium and I didn't see the need to run any longer. Indicator LED still normal slow green flash.

Resting battery voltage 3.65V

My conclusions:

The heatsinking on the headlamp seems to be very well-done considering size and output. Remember, we are not dealing with a TN31 here but a tiny light that fits into the palm of your hand. The fact that the whole body warms as the light heats up indicates to me that the thermal path is well-engineered and performing its job properly.

I'll be interested in re-testing during summer when the ambient night temperatures can sometimes exceed 30C but for the moment I am very satisfied that this thermal stepdown "problem" won't be an issue for me in daily use.

In the event of a blackout, I would consider that the 550lm mode would provide more than enough light for ceiling bounce and others have reported no stepdown issues at this level.

Make of these results what you will.

 

[petr9999]

I will try again tonight while walking the dog ;) BTW, Currently its around 30C outside with really low humidity, this might be a part of the reason....

 

[Trevtrain]

the problem is, i bought this light with the intention of using it on max as a bicycle light... I just tried standing the light on max right under the A/C unit which is blowing cool air, and it steped down after 15 mins or so!

You would need to look at how the mount might affect the airflow and cooling but in my opinion you'd need to be riding on a very hot night and/or at a snail's pace to run into thermal issues on a bike.
I'm not well-versed on the Fenix light you mentioned but I've seen other bike lights that advise to manually turn down the output to a lower mode if not moving.

The beam is great for flood but don't expect any real throw to illuminate distant objects at speed. I would personally use another light with a spot beam as well.

 

[RedForest UK]

the problem is, i bought this light with the intention of using it on max as a bicycle light... I just tried standing the light on max right under the A/C unit which is blowing cool air, and it steped down after 15 mins or so!

Ah, ok. I understand your frustration with the lower temperature stepdown now. However I would think that with the airflow on a bike it should have no problems maintaining turbo. Mine was certainly fine on a run yesterday (around 8mph, 20 celsius, very little wind), so at cycling speeds of 10-20mph I wouldn't see you having any issues at all unless it was crazily hot.

I suggest actually taking it out on a ride and seeing if there's any problem. If so, then return it, if not then be happy with your new headlamp :)

 

[Knight_Light]

At 3 min mark the head is warm and the body somewhat cooler At 5 min mark it is definitely warmer but not uncomfortable to touch in any way. Indicator light still blinking normally
At 10 min mark, I can still grip the head comfortably though it is now what I would call quite warm. Indicator light still normal

At 15 mins, no obvious change that I could detect. Body of light has increased in temperature and is no doubt helping to shed heat

You do realize by touching the headlamp you are taking heat away from the headlamp effecting the tests (not a gripe just pointing it out).

At 30 mins I decided to stop the test as we seemed to have reached equilibrium and I didn't see the need to run any longer. Indicator LED still normal slow green flash.

You couldn’t hold out for another 40 minutes? LOL

Now you know what I had to go through when doing the lower level runtime tests. :)

In the event of a blackout, I would consider that the 550lm mode would provide more than enough light for ceiling bounce and others have reported no stepdown issues at this level.

I would never consider running this headlamp at 550 lm during a blackout. The amount of brightness increase from 250 lm is not that significant but the ability to continue using the light significantly increases with a lower output. Like stated before, for me the perfect level on this headlamp is 250 lm and 30 lm. Love those 2 levels.

 

[Knight_Light]

Mine was certainly fine on a run yesterday (around 8mph, 20 celsius, very little wind), so at cycling speeds of 10-20mph I wouldn't see you having any issues at all unless it was crazily hot.

Can you elaborate on your running experience, as others have asked me about this topic in the past (so that we have another data point). For the few runs that I took this headlamp I found it to be quite adequate for the job. Fairly steady in the headband with no flop. Good illumination at the 250 lm level.

 

[ArcticHighlander]

Imade another thermal test - i submerged the headlamp in a glass of watter andthe lamp hold 1h and 5 mins on max with the original battery - no thermalprotection kicked in.

Can you show me where they quoted this long runtime with no cooling?

I guess Armytekbased their run time numbers on keeping your head submerged under water for anhour and 5 minutes while wearing it. Clearlytheir numbers are correct then. Possiblyalso if you are mountain biking at minus 70 degrees with a stiff wind in theAntarctic.

 

[Trevtrain]

You do realize by touching the headlamp you are taking heat away from the headlamp effecting the tests (not a gripe just pointing it out).

Yep, didn't hold it per se, just gripped it for a few seconds to feel the temperature and then let it go again. Best I can do without IR equipment.

You couldn’t hold out for another 40 minutes? LOL

Sitting out in the dark with my laptop on my knees - sure I could have but I was also concerned about the risk of blinding my neighbour if he turned into our driveway after work and was smacked in the face by a ruddy great high beam. :grin2:

Now you know what I had to go through when doing the lower level runtime tests. :)

Sure, and I think the majority of us here are appreciative of the work you've done.

I would never consider running this headlamp at 550 lm during a blackout. The amount of brightness increase from 250 lm is not that significant but the ability to continue using the light significantly increases with a lower output. Like stated before, for me the perfect level on this headlamp is 250 lm and 30 lm. Love those 2 levels.

Agreed that 550 is overkill but I was more making the point that you could do it if you wanted to. Kind of in response to some of the negative comments regarding not being able to tailstand at Max indoors and trying to think of a scenario where anyone would actually need to.
The 250lm setting is very nice.
I'd maybe like to see something in between 7 and 30 but overall, the choice of levels seems pretty good. I haven't had much chance to use it outdoors for anything useful yet however.

 

[Trevtrain]

I guess Armytekbased their run time numbers on keeping your head submerged under water for anhour and 5 minutes while wearing it. Clearlytheir numbers are correct then. Possiblyalso if you are mountain biking at minus 70 degrees with a stiff wind in theAntarctic.

I'm sorry you seem to be so unhappy with your purchase.
Seriously dude - mountains.....molehills......