Anyone else completely against lights with built in batteries?

lampeDépêche said:

That's something that I like about the Streamlight Sidewinder series. The highest output, when running a CR123, is 275 lumens. That is a sustainable output for that cell. The highest output when running a single AA, is 140 lumens. That too is a sustainable output for that cell.

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Can't speak to the Sidewinder-series, but that is what I like about the Streamlight PolyTac (the old gen 1). 2x CR123 or 1x 16650. Also 275 Lumen as far as I know.
Takes both primaries and rechargeables (though the CR123 isn't always an off the shelf size), very simple operation, no BS modes like strobe or SOS, rugged design, and available in colours easily seen if dropped in snow. The very definition of an emergency light, I would say. We keep one such light in each car.

EDIT:
My pair of Safety Yellow PolyTac is 130 Lumen.

ven said:

Yes!!!!

Pros and cons and even though I have several more, if want crazy outputs off the shelf, manufacturers only seem to provide built in packs for safety reasons. Now as with most I’m not a fan, end of day it’s an expensive paper weight in 5-10yrs!

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Let's be honest though - even if it's an expensive paper weight in 5-10 years, that's a lot of novelty and online bragging rights for the money. And that's before we get into the actual usability of the lights.

Unless you're only waving them around, showing off (it's okay, I know I would do that - reason why I sold my LR80R, because I knew I would only be doing that), such a light would pay for itself even if you really needed it only once. I am hating on the Lumen race, but it's undeniable that if you need the output power at some point, it's very nice to have it.

I would perhaps not own that many lights of that class at the same time though. Preferably just one such light, overlapping with a new one once it nears the end of its lifespan. But I have to admit...a part of me is jealous of your collection.

PaladinNO said:

Let's be honest though - even if it's an expensive paper weight in 5-10 years, that's a lot of novelty and online bragging rights for the money. And that's before we get into the actual usability of the lights.

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At least flashlights will age better than smartphones, smart watches, and other technology. At the end of the day, it's still going to produce light, quite a bit of usable light for these. I'm sure in 10 years there will be brighter and more efficient lights available, but that doesn't negate the utility of these. I'm still using my PAL Lights after all of these years. I bought mine when they were still being made in a small office in Sarasota, FL. 25-28 years old?

TPA said:

At least flashlights will age better than smartphones, smart watches, and other technology.

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Here is a fun fact for you: I bought my current Nokia back in 2009, for 130 USD. Then I bought a Samsung Galaxy A21S back in 2019, also for 130 USD equivalent, because the 2G net would be shut down and my Nokia would no longer receive a signal. Something that has been delayed and postponed over and over, and the 2G net is still active, so I am still using my Nokia. Works perfectly fine as a phone, and I don't need a "phone" for anything else.

So, my brand new Samsung Galaxy A21S - I have connected it to my home WiFi, set it up and updated it, I have bought a SIM-card and need only activate it online. Phone otherwise unused.
...It got its final security update in 2024.

The whole world currently seems set on producing junk, destined for the landfill the moment it is conceived by the designers.
Ugh, I need to stop now, else I will just rant and rage on literally everything made today. >-<

My Samsung S10+ is 7 years old now, 4G. Which is funny, as everyone else in my family has 5G phones, yet I'm the techie. There are so many things it can do which modern phones can't, so I'm going to keep it going as long as possible. I'm still getting very respectable speeds out of the phone, both in program performance and data transfer speeds, so I'm happy.

Also ironic, the phone switches to EDGE when I drive on a particular section of road in my neighborhood, which I did today. The car's screen shows EDGE above the signal bars.

TPA said:

I used to carry a Rovyvon A5 on my keychain. I like it as a light, but invariably it was always dead or near dead when I needed it. A Lumintop EDC01 is about the same size and I've never seen it fail. I replaced the Rovyvon with an EDC15/Tool AA 2.0 mutt. I don't notice the size/weight difference and it's brighter with better runtime.

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What was the issue with the A5? Self-discharge, pocket lighting or just running it down in regular use? My A3 and A8 either sit in a pocket or drawer for most of the time but I rarely find the A3 dead when needed (and that's why the *other* pocket has another keychain light).

There's no question going to the larger size and capacity of a LiIon 14500 buys a *lot* more endurance at this scale. The EDC 15 is even cheaper than the RovyVons.

My only anxiety is the twisty head - after a couple of Titanium Innovations lights dismantled themselves in my pockets, or in the better-half's purse, I gave up on twistys.

I still have my old version Fenix LD02 which had a nice big button on the back and was quite reliable, though nowhere near the lumens of a more recent light. Easy to swap AAAs in it, though.

JimIslander said:

I've never once cleaned a battery contact on my replaceable battery flashlights, nor needed to. That's with 100% rechargeable batteries or lithium primaries only, cause friends don't let friends use alkalines. All my lights are top quality (26 Zebralights, Malkoffs, etc.). Not sure if it's the metal in these lights, and my environment is harsh (the hot wet South), but there is no noticeable corrosion on my lights.

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Your experience is better than mine. I'm not near the ocean, and it's usually cool and dry here,, but any light left alone for a time almost always acts up if called on to go to "turbo" mode till I at least loosen and tighten the head or wipe the contacts down.

The poshest light I own is an Olight S2R in titanium and (after a couple of weeks of standing by) that one will not stay in turbo till I work the head back and forth - not sure if that is wiping the battery contact or if it's a titanium thing and I'm just cleaning the threads.

Even my ancient TK 70 would not sustain full mode if it had been standing for a while with the batteries in it - till I wiped the threads and polished the battery buttons. This is with NiMh D cells, which back when the TK70 was new was still considered a viable power source.

( I will not speak of all the lights I destroyed with alkalines...it was before I was Enlightened, forgive me for I knew not and trusted the battery maker's lies.)

Kitchen Panda said:

What was the issue with the A5? Self-discharge, pocket lighting or just running it down in regular use? My A3 and A8 either sit in a pocket or drawer for most of the time but I rarely find the A3 dead when needed (and that's why the *other* pocket has another keychain light).

There's no question going to the larger size and capacity of a LiIon 14500 buys a *lot* more endurance at this scale. The EDC 15 is even cheaper than the RovyVons.

My only anxiety is the twisty head - after a couple of Titanium Innovations lights dismantled themselves in my pockets, or in the better-half's purse, I gave up on twistys.

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My Fenix E05 is 12 years old and still going strong. That was my keychain light until I tried the Rovyvon, then Tool/EDC15 mutt.

I'm not sure what exactly was going on with the A5, but more often than not it left me stranded. Perhaps it was activating in my pocket, but I never felt it getting hot in my pocket either. For me, long runtimes are what I need, so the slightly larger size of the EDC15 is more than worth it to me. Also knowing that OFF = OFF. No circuitry in the loop when off.

Kitchen Panda said:

Your experience is better than mine. I'm not near the ocean, and it's usually cool and dry here,, but any light left alone for a time almost always acts up if called on to go to "turbo" mode till I at least loosen and tighten the head or wipe the contacts down.

The poshest light I own is an Olight S2R in titanium and (after a couple of weeks of standing by) that one will not stay in turbo till I work the head back and forth - not sure if that is wiping the battery contact or if it's a titanium thing and I'm just cleaning the threads.

Even my ancient TK 70 would not sustain full mode if it had been standing for a while with the batteries in it - till I wiped the threads and polished the battery buttons. This is with NiMh D cells, which back when the TK70 was new was still considered a viable power source.

( I will not speak of all the lights I destroyed with alkalines...it was before I was Enlightened, forgive me for I knew not and trusted the battery maker's lies.)

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That might be the key. I keep unused lights with the cap twisted just enough to disable them. So every use of a long unused light starts with twisting the cap.

However, Zebralights, Malkoffs, and other quality lights have never shown the slightest hint of corrosion when inspected.

Kitchen Panda said:

( I will not speak of all the lights I destroyed with alkalines...it was before I was Enlightened, forgive me for I knew not and trusted the battery maker's lies.)

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I absolve you of your sins. Go, and sin no more.

PaladinNO said:

Can't speak to the Sidewinder-series, but that is what I like about the Streamlight PolyTac (the old gen 1). 2x CR123 or 1x 16650. Also 275 Lumen as far as I know.
Takes both primaries and rechargeables (though the CR123 isn't always an off the shelf size), very simple operation, no BS modes like strobe or SOS, rugged design, and available in colours easily seen if dropped in snow. The very definition of an emergency light, I would say. We keep one such light in each car.

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Those would be the 2nd generation. The first was only 60 or 80 lumen. The one I have will not run off at 16650 cell. IIRC they were only available in black, tan or safety yellow.

ghostguy6 said:

Those would be the 2nd generation. The first was only 60 or 80 lumen. The one I have will not run off at 16650 cell. IIRC they were only available in black, tan or safety yellow.

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Then I honestly don't know which one I have. Likely the first generation then. It was purchased off of Amazon years ago (EDIT: checked my records, purchased in 2010). And based on the numbers I have in my Excel sheet, it's a Streamlight PolyTac 88853, 130 Lumen. Design wise, it's in Safety Yellow, with no pocket clip.

Related to proprietary batteries, I dislike it when manufacturers makes a "Gen. 2", but keep the model number the same. It adds uncertainty.
The exact same Amazon link as I had saved now shows a 600 Lumen version. Same model number.

Here's my ancient Leatherman Serac S3, which was introduced in 2008, still going strong after nearly 18 years, although it hasn't been my primary EDC light since 2015. The picture is from May 2026.

It's now my kitchen table light, and it's still such a great light.

Physical tail switch, no parasitic drain, no memory, so it always turns on in the lowest mode (7 lumens), half press to medium 43 lumens, half press to high 100 lumens, half press to go back to 7 lumens. Deep reflector with even beam characteristics, reversible clip.

There is no lithium-ion battery in the world that would still have significant capacity after 18 years, and this little light shows no signs of quitting. Are newer lights "better"? In some respects, yes, but 100 lumens is enough for utility purposes around my home, and really the low and medium modes are what get used, mostly, so this light is still capable of doing the job.

Since it's infrequently used, I'm fine with a relatively expensive CR123A primary cell in it, which can sit for years without significant self-discharge. I have no idea if the Serac S3 is capable of withstanding a nominal 3.7 V 16340, and I don't want to blow up a perfectly good light to find out. Nor do I know if a 3 V regulated RCR123A will be tolerated well, since they are generally longer than the actual CR123A specifications.

I have the same one, used to edc it for years. still works. thou it lives on a shelf now. The store where I bought it on park row, it does not exist anymore, used to be my go to store when I worked downtown. They had some cool flashlights and multitools, it was one of few hardware store that sold SF lights.