Anyone worried about this?

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jtr1962

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Knocking out the grid is easy, and for a helluva lot longer than just a couple of months. You just need one item and a delivery system for it. As well as knowing where the right target is. Thankfully that item is not cheap nor easy to acquire.

As for the details?.... Hell no, I'm not posting that on a Public Internet forum!
This is one great reason we should be strongly encouraging distributed generation, including home battery-backed solar and wind. If one of the main transformers is knocked out, it can take months to fix. In the meantime, without power, many will literally die. If you have the ability to generate locally, you can keep the lights on using just the local distribution system.

Ultimately, we would be far safer from attack if every building produced its own power.
 

Monocrom

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Oh no, I don't mean knocking out one of the transformers. I mean all of them. It's easier than you'd think it is. And you're not getting them back up once all of them are essentially fried.
 

jtr1962

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Oh no, I don't mean knocking out one of the transformers. I mean all of them. It's easier than you'd think it is. And you're not getting them back up once all of them are essentially fried.
From what I read, they could be hardened. It wouldn't even cost that much. I don't get why hardening the grid isn't close to our number one priority.
 

Monocrom

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From what I read, they could be hardened. It wouldn't even cost that much. I don't get why hardening the grid isn't close to our number one priority.
Completely agree with you. No clue why.
I'm sure some bean-counter will say it can't be done due to the costs involved. Yeah, that's absolute B.S.!
 

idleprocess

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This is one great reason we should be strongly encouraging distributed generation, including home battery-backed solar and wind.
Usage of distributed in this case tends to mean residential. Rooftop solar makes sense in some regions, albeit with considerable project overhead covering so many small variable sites. Small-scale wind makes no sense if the grid is at all accessible due to its stupid unit costs and associated amortized production cost, even when well-sited. Home batteries are ... complicated ... since they're marketed as whole-house UPS but their macro value would be in the frequency stabilization role presently done by grid-scale batteries (a function for which the residential customer is not always properly compensated).
 

jabe1

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We, as Americans generally only look at the short term cost/benefit ratio; discounting the longer term savings, negative ramifications of inaction.
We don't see progress because we're too short sighted.
Most people I know don't even do proper preventive maintenance on their cars, let alone consider the possibility of investment in larger infrastructure, even if it's for personal use.
 

Monocrom

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We, as Americans generally only look at the short term cost/benefit ratio; discounting the longer term savings, negative ramifications of inaction.
We don't see progress because we're too short sighted.
Most people I know don't even do proper preventive maintenance on their cars, let alone consider the possibility of investment in larger infrastructure, even if it's for personal use.
Experienced mechanic once told me than only 1 in 4 car-owners on average even bother with preventative maintenance. Definitely pay a mechanic to check out any used car before buying it.
 

jtr1962

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Usage of distributed in this case tends to mean residential. Rooftop solar makes sense in some regions, albeit with considerable project overhead covering so many small variable sites. Small-scale wind makes no sense if the grid is at all accessible due to its stupid unit costs and associated amortized production cost, even when well-sited. Home batteries are ... complicated ... since they're marketed as whole-house UPS but their macro value would be in the frequency stabilization role presently done by grid-scale batteries (a function for which the residential customer is not always properly compensated).
I'm also thinking solar panels over parking lots, expressways, perhaps even some local streets, although the latter might be objected to on aesthetic grounds. Wind would be primarily utility scale wind given that costs for a home wind installation generally don't pencil out. The idea is to create microgrids which could still function if the main grid was down.
 

jtr1962

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Experienced mechanic once told me than only 1 in 4 car-owners on average even bother with preventative maintenance. Definitely pay a mechanic to check out any used car before buying it.
True story here. My late father always ran his cars into the ground. My favorite anecdote is the time he let his brake rotors wear down to the point that the entire surface ground off. Yes, the brake pads were hitting the fins inside the rotors! And he didn't really notice at first. One day he tells my brother that the brakes are making a funny, grinding sound. My brother was shocked when he saw the rotors.

In general, my father was dead from the neck up. There was the time someone stole his front bumper overnight in the driveway. He took the car out that day, and didn't even notice the bumper was missing until he got home.
 

jtr1962

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Funny you mentioned hammers. That was my father's go-to tool for every problem, no matter what. Every time we heard him hammering away, we were thinking what is he going to break this time around?
 

Poppy

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Funny you mentioned hammers. That was my father's go-to tool for every problem, no matter what. Every time we heard him hammering away, we were thinking what is he going to break this time around?
Sometimes a hammer IS THE TOOL FOR THE JOB.
One day before my son realized that SOMETIMES the old man knows some stuff, he was out in the driveway doing a brake job on his bronco.
It was taking him too long so I went out to investigate.

He couldn't get the rotor loose.
I went to his tool box, got out a BFH Big F Hammer, and gave it a good smack.
It was instantly loose. I put the hammer away and went back to binge watching The Walking Dead.

So a couple of weeks ago, I did a brake job on the rear brakes on my daughter's car. I got out a BFH and gave the rotor a few taps, and it wouldn't come loose. Then I gave it one good smack, and I was on my way.
 

Poppy

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Oh and another hammer story.

There were a couple of guys who needed to measure the height of a flag pole. They were challenged, because as they tried to run their ruler up, it always bent before it got to the top.

A carpenter comes by and sees them struggling and asks them what they are doing?
One explains that they want the height of the flagpole, but their ruler keeps bending before it gets to the top.

The carpenter pulls out his hammer, knocks the pin out of the bottom, and lays the pole on the ground. He runs his tape measure and tells them, "It's 22 feet long".

One guy turns to the other and says, "Stupid Pollack, I ask for the height, he gives me the length!"
 

Monocrom

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True story here. My late father always ran his cars into the ground. My favorite anecdote is the time he let his brake rotors wear down to the point that the entire surface ground off. Yes, the brake pads were hitting the fins inside the rotors! And he didn't really notice at first. One day he tells my brother that the brakes are making a funny, grinding sound. My brother was shocked when he saw the rotors.
Honestly, my Late father was practically as bad when it came to the family vehicle. Red Dodge sedan some drunk driver totaled while it was parked. Dad knew a businessman who insisted on driving a new vehicle every single year. Problem was, this was the late-1970s, early-1980s. So leasing did not even exist yet. Dad bought the 1981 silver Oldsmobile Cutlass Supreme off of him. Kept it for 17 years. Which was about 4 or 5 years longer than he should have! My 2009 Mazda 6 V6 is pushing that age too. But a horribly neglected car vs. a well-maintained one are two very different creatures. Aside from oil changes, he never did preventative maintenance. Light blew, sure he'd have it replaced.

He wanted to keep it longer, but mom put her foot down on his cheapness when he accidentally destroyed the engine because he left it bone dry. Oh no, no cheap as hell re-built engine from the shady mechanic shop. It left me stranded at least once. Maybe twice. Looking back, I can't blame the car.
 

Guitar Guy

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From what I read, they could be hardened. It wouldn't even cost that much. I don't get why hardening the grid isn't close to our number one priority.
Yes, it should be number one. If there's anything that we all should be contacting our representatives about, it is the grid.

According to a special I watched about it on TV, securing the grid would not be all that expensive or difficult to do, but the power companies and FERC keep pointing the finger at each other on who should bear the cost. As a result, the grid has been vulnerable for years. A coordinated attack on the grid, and as a result, the internet, would bring this country to a halt for a long long time. Many would die. I don't want to go into any more detail here.
 

Poppy

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Honestly, my Late father was practically as bad when it came to the family vehicle. Red Dodge sedan some drunk driver totaled while it was parked. Dad knew a businessman who insisted on driving a new vehicle every single year. Problem was, this was the late-1970s, early-1980s. So leasing did not even exist yet. Dad bought the 1981 silver Oldsmobile Cutlass Supreme off of him. Kept it for 17 years. Which was about 4 or 5 years longer than he should have! My 2009 Mazda 6 V6 is pushing that age too. But a horribly neglected car vs. a well-maintained one are two very different creatures. Aside from oil changes, he never did preventative maintenance. Light blew, sure he'd have it replaced.

He wanted to keep it longer, but mom put her foot down on his cheapness when he accidentally destroyed the engine because he left it bone dry. Oh no, no cheap as hell re-built engine from the shady mechanic shop. It left me stranded at least once. Maybe twice. Looking back, I can't blame the car.
Keeping and maintaining an older car has its merit. At some point they essentially stop depreciating in value, which is the biggest annual cost of owning a new car.

I believe that if you have the knowledge, tools, and ability to fix it and maintain it as it ages, then it may behoove you to keep it and do so. However, if you don't have the ability, and you have to take it to a mechanic as things break down, more often, then it is time to buy a newer vehicle.
 
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