Armytek Wizard Pro Prototype Long-Term Testing

[lightcycle1]

I'm very very glad I did not spring for one of these
It seems as it it were hastily designed and released with a plethora of faults and design oversights. By rights Armytek should recall every one of these, get the niggles worked out and send out new versions to those who bought them. Cant be more than a couple hundred units sold by now.


Sent from my SCH-S720C using Tapatalk 2

 

[Knight_Light]

Re: New issue with Wizard Pro, 100% reproducible

you think a customer should eat the cost of an improper R&D done by the engineers when said light fails once in a customers hands? If this was a car, then this would be a typical recall issue not a cosmetic upgrade or add-on.

I don't think the customer should eat the cost of improper R&D, as you recall I was one of the 1st ones to tell people to get warranty work done with the lockout problem. This however is not a case of improper R&D, nowhere is it stated that the light is supposed to suffer impact without the light being interrupted, and it works under normal circumstances with almost every imaginable 18650 battery out there. I have even dropped this light outdoors and it continue to work without shutting down.

 

[dailydR1ver]

Re: New issue with Wizard Pro, 100% reproducible

I don't think the customer should eat the cost of improper R&D, as you recall I was one of the 1st ones to tell people to get warranty work done with the lockout problem. This however is not a case of improper R&D, nowhere is it stated that the light is supposed to suffer impact without the light being interrupted, and it works under normal circumstances with almost every imaginable 18650 battery out there. I have even dropped this light outdoors and it continue to work without shutting down.

Correct, this is not an R&D issue. This light is marketed as a HEADlamp. I challenge someone to post a video of this light cutting off while being used as a HEADlamp and not get a concussion or neck injury as a result. How about this: try not to drop your light or smash it on something and it won't cut off.

 

[tony613]

Re: New issue with Wizard Pro, 100% reproducible

Unfortunately, as it stands now I cannot depend on it to work under my "normal circumstances", one of which being used while bicycling (that is, without modification from me in the form of magnets or mods to the spring). Understand I'm not against making modifications, but I want the modification recommendations to come directly from Armytek so that I do not void the warranty.

I have had the Wizard Pro go out three times on two road rides, mounted horizontally so the majority of the jarring has been laterally, not vertically. As a point of comparison I've used the ZebraLight H600w under the same conditions, and also while mountain biking (more demanding conditions) without issue, so I did not believe my use was too extreme for the Wizard Pro.

Additionally, I have now also reproduced the light "going out on being jarred" using the AW 2900 mAh protected battery (this is the battery with the three bumps on the negative terminal, to facilitate them being used in serial). For me, three out of three batteries, although it may be argued this is another poor choice of battery for this application because that battery is only about as long as the EagleTac.

Batteries tested thus far by me personally that exhibit the problem of the light going out:

EagleTac 3100 (protected) - during normal use
AW IC 2900 (protected) - hand held intentional tapping
Panasonic unprotected (generously supplied by Armytek) - during normal use
​

Note I'm not throwing stones. Since the issues began, my posts are simply reporting my personal experiences but leaving out personal opinions wherever possible (or at least that is my goal). Hopefully the information comes across that way.

 

[Knight_Light]

Re: New issue with Wizard Pro, 100% reproducible

Unfortunately, as it stands now I cannot depend on it to work under my "normal circumstances", one of which being used while bicycling (that is, without modification from me in the form of magnets or mods to the spring). Understand I'm not against making modifications, but I want the modification recommendations to come directly from Armytek so that I do not void the warranty.

I have had the Wizard Pro go out three times on two road rides, mounted horizontally so the majority of the jarring has been laterally, not vertically. As a point of comparison I've used the ZebraLight H600w under the same conditions, and also while mountain biking (more demanding conditions) without issue, so I did not believe my use was too extreme for the Wizard Pro.

Additionally, I have now also reproduced the light "going out on being jarred" using the AW 2900 mAh protected battery (this is the battery with the three bumps on the negative terminal, to facilitate them being used in serial). For me, three out of three batteries, although it may be argued this is another poor choice of battery for this application because that battery is only about as long as the EagleTac.

Batteries tested thus far by me personally that exhibit the problem of the light going out:
EagleTac 3100 (protected) - during normal use
AW IC 2900 (protected) - hand held intentional tapping
Panasonic unprotected (generously supplied by Armytek) - during normal use


Note I'm not throwing stones. Since the issues began, my posts are simply reporting my personal experiences but leaving out personal opinions wherever possible (or at least that is my goal). Hopefully the information comes across that way.

tony613 I totally understand your frustration, I myself am not too happy with this behavior because the last thing I need is to bump this headlamp underground while caving and have it go out. So the only thing I can do is share my solution for the problem. And that is magnets attached to the negative side of the battery, 5 mm worth of magnets seems to do the trick on the unprotected cell. It's a very inexpensive solution, give it a try maybe it will make the light usable for you.

 

[KarstGhost]

Re: New issue with Wizard Pro, 100% reproducible

Took my wizard on a six hour cave trip today and it performed flawlessly. This cave had some of the nastiest mud crawls I have ever been through. I used the 250 lumen I think most of the time and notched it up to turbo a couple times. I'm very pleased.

 

[Knight_Light]

Re: New issue with Wizard Pro, 100% reproducible

Took my wizard on a six hour cave trip today and it performed flawlessly. This cave had some of the nastiest mud crawls I have ever been through. I used the the the 250 lumen I think most of the time and notched it up to turbo a couple times. I'm very pleased.

I have taken this headlamp on a few caving expeditions and it has performed flawlessly. My favorite level is the 250 lm.:thumbsup:

 

[Trevtrain]

Re: New issue with Wizard Pro, 100% reproducible

Considering we bought a light that should work without problems right from the factory, whose dime will this be on to get these magnetic spacers? Armytek going to send us out free magnetic spacers?

I don't think you will need to spend the few cents on magentic spacers Beacon. You have clearly posted many times that you never need more than 2.7lm for your "high" mode and will only ever use the Firefly settings.
I've tried the tailslapping test numerous times on my Wizard and I cannot get it to cut out in either of the two Firefly modes.
Perhaps you will also be lucky in this respect.

 

[Trevtrain]

Re: New issue with Wizard Pro, 100% reproducible

Unfortunately, as it stands now I cannot depend on it to work under my "normal circumstances", one of which being used while bicycling (that is, without modification from me in the form of magnets or mods to the spring). Understand I'm not against making modifications, but I want the modification recommendations to come directly from Armytek so that I do not void the warranty.

I have had the Wizard Pro go out three times on two road rides, mounted horizontally so the majority of the jarring has been laterally, not vertically. As a point of comparison I've used the ZebraLight H600w under the same conditions, and also while mountain biking (more demanding conditions) without issue, so I did not believe my use was too extreme for the Wizard Pro.

Note I'm not throwing stones. Since the issues began, my posts are simply reporting my personal experiences but leaving out personal opinions wherever possible (or at least that is my goal). Hopefully the information comes across that way.

I think most of us can see you are not just throwing stones tony613. The information you are posting is very useful and reflects a usage scenario where the light clearly is unsuitable in its current state.
(An argument could possibly be made that the Wizard is sold as a headlamp and not a bike light but I think that would be skating on pretty thin ice.)

Armytek have pretty much said in the CPFMP thread that magnets are the likely answer and that you won't be voiding any warranty by using them.

I had also planned to use the Wizard as a bike light but I haven't tested it in this role yet. If you haven't returned yours yet (hard to keep track of who has done what so far) would you be prepared to re-test the bike riding with the magnetic spacer and report back as to whether the problem is eliminated in your sample?

 

[tony613]

Re: New issue with Wizard Pro, 100% reproducible

tony613 I totally understand your frustration, I myself am not too happy with this behavior because the last thing I need is to bump this headlamp underground while caving and have it go out. So the only thing I can do is share my solution for the problem. And that is magnets attached to the negative side of the battery, 5 mm worth of magnets seems to do the trick on the unprotected cell. It's a very inexpensive solution, give it a try maybe it will make the light usable for you.

Hey Knight,

Understood and agreed - I've been waiting for Armytek's official response. Because Armytek is so responsive and open to suggestion, I wanted to see this through to completion. I know you've been following their official thread in the marketplace and I'm very pleased at how they are responding to this issue (in addition to the other issues and suggestions). Besides planning on offering magnets, at extra cost which is fair in my opinion, they are going to reproduce the light going out issue (using the video) and see how the firmware handles it.

When the issue occurs, besides being left in the dark, the headlamp has behaved differently in my case. Twice it went into tactical mode, and often it has gone into lockout mode. Much of that will probably be fixed with the new firmware revision but now they've got more test cases with reproducible issues to make the software even more robust.

Now I am assured their official work around (magnets) will not void the warranty, and the firmware will be wrung out. That was everything I wanted.

 

[tony613]

Re: New issue with Wizard Pro, 100% reproducible

I think most of us can see you are not just throwing stones tony613. The information you are posting is very useful and reflects a usage scenario where the light clearly is unsuitable in its current state.
(An argument could possibly be made that the Wizard is sold as a headlamp and not a bike light but I think that would be skating on pretty thin ice.)

Armytek have pretty much said in the CPFMP thread that magnets are the likely answer and that you won't be voiding any warranty by using them.

I had also planned to use the Wizard as a bike light but I haven't tested it in this role yet. If you haven't returned yours yet (hard to keep track of who has done what so far) would you be prepared to re-test the bike riding with the magnetic spacer and report back as to whether the problem is eliminated in your sample?

Thanks Trevtrain. No, I haven't returned the light yet and yes, if I get the chance to buy magnets I will definitely post results. Note I was replying at the same time you were so our answers overlap a bit.

 

[tony613]

Re: New issue with Wizard Pro, 100% reproducible

... I've tried the tailslapping test numerous times on my Wizard and I cannot get it to cut out in either of the two Firefly modes...

Really - wow. I can get it to happen beginning in Firefly 1. I did it just now, and locked it up good and tight. It took me twice unscrewing the tail cap to get it back on again. Too bad they don't have my light on which to test. :)

 

[Trevtrain]

Re: New issue with Wizard Pro, 100% reproducible

Really - wow. I can get it to happen beginning in Firefly 1. I did it just now, and locked it up good and tight. It took me twice unscrewing the tail cap to get it back on again. Too bad they don't have my light on which to test. :)

Curious...

Could be down to battery then? I am using the unprotected Panasonic supplied by Armytek. And I really have given it some pretty fair thumps to make it cut out - but only with my palm. In any case, much more severe than I would expect from anything but a drop directly onto the tail.

Sounds like bad news for Beacon then - I had hoped he wouldn't have this issue.

 

[Beacon of Light]

Re: New issue with Wizard Pro, 100% reproducible

I haven't had the issue but then I haven't tried tapping the light.

Who has these magnets to fit this light? How much do they cost? Would love to find it online if possible. Still think it's bogus to have to buy magnets now and out of the over 100 lights and headlamps I own, I have never needed to use a magnet before.

Also, now with having to use a magnet it will affect resistance and it will also affect runtime and not in a positive way.

 

[Knight_Light]

Re: New issue with Wizard Pro, 100% reproducible

Besides planning on offering magnets, at extra cost which is fair in my opinion, they are going to reproduce the light going out issue (using the video) and see how the firmware handles it.

I think that for new customers the magnets should be included and not be charged extra. Existing customers can get the magnets on their own. They are like 3 for a dollar so it’s not that big of a deal.

 

[Beacon of Light]

Re: New issue with Wizard Pro, 100% reproducible

Where are you finding them 3 for a dollar? This is what I am finding and this is on the low end price wise...

http://www.ebay.com/itm/5-Pcs-Neody...495?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3f26a51c1f

 

[cronus]

Re: New issue with Wizard Pro, 100% reproducible

Brad, the shipping did not give a time estimate, but based on posts that came after you asked, it looks like you have better options than I do here in Canada (i.e. tracking for cheap).
The tailslap issue is easy to reproduce, at least to get it to turn off. Drop the light on it's tail onto a mousepad from about 1-2 inches. Turns off every time (unprotected cells). I haven't seen it lockup yet. Disconnect is inevitable with no positive end spring, it happens on my Viking too. The difference on the Viking is that it turns right back on (not an electronic switch).

I was going to send mine back tomorrow, but I think I'll wait until the dust settles a little, plus I will be using the light extensively over the next few weeks. I might even wait for the first 'fixed' ones to be received by owners to see if it really is better.

Update on the 'bad' AR lens coating. Recall I posted how my lens had a poorly coated lens, and cleaning had no effect? Well I noticed that the pattern had changed since I took the picture. This surprised me since I thoroughly cleaned it trying to remove any oils that might be on there. So, I took a piece of soft cotton, pressed it hard against the lens and wiped in a swirling motion. After about five minutes of scrubbing, the lens looks good now. There are three or four hair-lines in the middle where I probably scratched the coating, but it's acceptable now for sure. If they change it or not when I send it, no problem either way.

 

[Trevtrain]

Re: New issue with Wizard Pro, 100% reproducible

Update on the 'bad' AR lens coating. Recall I posted how my lens had a poorly coated lens, and cleaning had no effect? Well I noticed that the pattern had changed since I took the picture. This surprised me since I thoroughly cleaned it trying to remove any oils that might be on there. So, I took a piece of soft cotton, pressed it hard against the lens and wiped in a swirling motion. After about five minutes of scrubbing, the lens looks good now. There are three or four hair-lines in the middle where I probably scratched the coating, but it's acceptable now for sure.

So it now seems that it was actually a surface contamination of some kind rather than a defect in the AR coating?
If this is the case, I wonder if photographic lens cleaning tissue and/or fluid might be a better option for anyone else tempted to try cleaning it this way. Certainly, using a soft cloth and a gentle motion is the next best thing but pressing it "hard" is probably a last resort.

Not that a few minor scratches are all that serious - but anyone with camera equipment may have access to this stuff already.

 

[tony613]

Re: New issue with Wizard Pro, 100% reproducible

Additionally, I have reproduced the issue with the headlamp turning off using three different batteries:

Panasonic unprotected (generously supplied by Armytek) - during normal use road cycling as described
EagleTac 3100 (protected) - during normal use road cycling as described
AW IC 2900 (protected) - hand held intentional tapping - both on the bottom (as in the video), and on the side​

Dear tony613.
We have fixed this by firmware changing. :twothumbs
You are welcome.

You mean with the new firmware the light no longer cuts out/turns off when being jarred, even with the short Panasonic battery? Does that mean magnets are not needed?

Yes.

Outstanding. Excellent work and excellent customer service.

Thought you all might be interested in seeing this.

 

[bradthebold]

Re: New issue with Wizard Pro, 100% reproducible

Thought you all might be interested in seeing this.

Agreed with the customer service to a point. I mean they sent the lights out early with all these defects and dealing with their email service is painfully slow, but the cpfm thread is very encouraging. I am surprised by how much they are with with us and taking/adapting our ideas.