Flock cameras?

[pnwoutdoors]

Ai is more dangerous.

The natural combination, of course, is ... wait for it ... surveillance enabled by the newfangled "learning" systems.

Tied to every scrap of "intel" that exists on a person. Full GPS track, whereabouts during the day or night, 'ping' history (ie, at home sleeping during X and Y times), combined with purchase history, etc etc.

Stalin and Hitler, and their minions, would have killed for such systematized data collection on everyone and their goings-on. China has, and now they've got it.

Orwell had it right. And Rand knew it from experience.

Very ugly indeed.

Coming to a neighborhood near you. If we let it.

 

[dc38]

I dont care about looseing a right or 2 if the put bad guys in jail.

as the age old adage goes...Give them an inch...they'll take your smile. Or something like that.

 

[Monocrom]

I dont care about looseing a right or 2 if the put bad guys in jail.

Don't ever trade your freedoms in exchange for promised security.... That's how the Soviet Union came into existence. It was literally evil. Want to know what it's like to live as a slave? Don't ask a Black American. None are around who lived during the latter half of the 1800s. Ask an elderly person who lived through the existence of the former Soviet Union.

 

[Robocop]

From what I have seen with Flock thus far it seems that Flock does not gather any information from vehicle tags or facial scans. It does not know who owns the vehicle only that a certain vehicle has been past this camera x number of times. It can be programmed with a target search such as a vehicle operated by a robbery suspect or a vehicle driven by a person with felony warrants. It will alert every time this vehicle is seen however it is simply searching for a tag entered by the user. The problem here is that the vehicle is flagged and many times police will swarm the vehicle only to find it is driven on this day by the suspects wife....or sister....or neighbor. This has happened however it is usually only a minor inconvenience and the people move on.

Flock is really nothing more than a camera system. It is running all the time in the background and sees pretty much everything in plain view. Many are becoming angry thinking about Flock however again it is just like the security cameras in a store just much larger. You could film your neighbors vehicle every day and even follow them and film everywhere they go. Their actions are in plain view of the public and as such can and often are monitored. Of course your neighbors would most likely get angry yet again it is perfectly legal.

I very much suspect we are all monitored on many levels and for the most part no action is taken as most people are pretty normal. I attended a surveillance class maybe 15 years past and was amazed at what was possible even then. Today I can only imagine as it seems all the spy stuff from Jason Bourne movies is actually real. I know for a fact your cell phone can be tracked even if it is off. The bluetooth in your vehicle can be bypassed. The smart home systems can be hacked and turned into passive listening devices. I also believe that every keystroke on the internet is stored and someone somewhere knows everything you search and watch online. One may go years without any issues however if for some reason you get flagged they can go back and will know everything you have searched, where your car has been, all of your texts, every store you visited....it is simply mind boggling what is possible. Again I could care less as I know what is legal vs illegal and have no concerns as to being watched.

I understand that many believe that giving up the slightest freedom is horrible. You really are not losing any freedom with Flock as you can still drive anywhere, anytime and do so without any concerns. You were probably filmed 100 times within the last week and never knew it. Many were being filmed with Flock for years and never knew it. I believe it was Ben Franklin who made the famous quote referring to something about people giving up any liberty for safety will deserve neither. I often hear this in any discussion concerning Flock ,or any surveillance system, and I get it however this quote was made in the mid 1700s during a time with much less global threats as today.

I will live my life as always and could care less if there are cameras on every street corner. I hope the coming systems will be used correctly as honestly there is nothing anyone can do to prevent the direction we are heading to. Tech is moving fast and we will be under constant surveillance if we are not already. You can take steps to prevent it as some already have. Many go off grid and live a simple life with no real tech. This helps however not everyone wants to live this life. Personally I think it is much ado about nothing really. The sky is not falling and we will be fine just know that you will be most likely filmed several places throughout your day.

 

[lampeDépêche]

How police officers used Flock to spy on their ex-spouses:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/tech...ers-used-vast-network-cameras-spy-their-exes/

Robocop, you are clearly a good guy. Most cops are. But cops are people, and every group of people contains some good ones and some bad ones.
Flock technology makes it too easy to do bad things. Bad people — even some not-so-bad people — cannot resist temptation when you give them too much power.
Yes, the Flock system sometimes catches crooks. We could also catch more crooks if we deleted the Bill of Rights from our Constitution.
But some techniques for crime reduction are not compatible with a free and democratic society. Eliminating the Bill of Rights is one of them. Flock cameras are another.

 

[pnwoutdoors]

From what I have seen with Flock thus far it seems that Flock does not ...

Flock is really nothing more than a camera system. It is running all the time in the background and ...

I will live my life as always and could care less if there are cameras on every street corner. I hope ...

Instances of abuse exist. With "Flock" tech and others. And with the NSA sucking up the digital trail of most every electronic "packet" in existence on the open 'net (incl phone and other data traffic), it's hard to imagine what part of the record of individuals' goings-on aren't capable of being leveraged.

IMO, it's naive to imagine the abuses won't at some point find any one of us. All it takes is someone deciding to do so.

 

[lampeDépêche]

We know how Zuckerberg, Bezos, and the other billionaires want the future to look. Universal surveillance watching your every move. Data centers everywhere, processing the surveillance data and turning it into tailored manipulation of your life — data centers that you pay for with higher utility costs, higher water bills, or no water at all.
We also know that the billionaires are buying their way into the government, so that they can extend their webs of surveillance even further. Peter Thiel thinks democracy is a mistake, and he is using his Palantir surveillance network to correct that mistake.
Thiel cofounded Flock and sits on its board. Yes, Flock says that Palantir does not use Flock data. And maybe that’s even true, this minute. But it just takes a flip of the switch to integrate the two systems. And they will never tell us when the switch is flipped.

 

[alpg88]

Never believe claims of intent, always look at capabilities, if it can be done, it will be done.

Visual data is only small part of the problem, intercepting your phone, smart watch, bt earbuds signal, is what creates unique identifier even with no cameras, those signals are how they can track your movement in real time. no camera footage needed. all you need is to get phone number thru IME number, and find out who it is registered to, (carriers will provide that), then associate other devices (earbuds, watch...) with the person who owns the phone. So even if this person leaves phone/earbuds somewhere, you can still track him by his watch signal. Hospitals have similar systems to track their equipment, flock is doing it for people on a nationwide scale, maybe even global.
Flock cams are installed in places where cars never drive, parks, bike lanes, walking trails, and they tell us they only watch cars passing by., lol sure thing, we believe you. I have a feeling we will have USSC and congress step in about this issue, in a not so distant future,

 

[pnwoutdoors]

Bill Binney, creator of "ThinThread" back in the 1990s, which had all the essential constitutional controls you would suppose ought to exist in any software of that sort. Could apparently quickly and easily target an authorized suspect's presence (in data and comms).

He was destroyed. Another system was developed, for countless $billions, and it took years to develop and fix the bugs due to the "rushed" creation. Without any of the constitutional controls, of course. The ThinThread system's particulars were largely rolled into the newer system, minus the lawful stuff that was deemed "in the way" of the abusers.

2005 rolls around, and we get a very public appreciation for the tapping of data (through key comms/data centers) across the country. And few people bat an eye. The "fix" was in. At which point, everything got Hoovered-up and dropped into the sink at Fort Meade (and wherever else). And nary an NSA or CIA or other gov't hack acknowledged it was even done, let alone abused. Until the 2013 disclosures made by Ed Snowden.

 

[dc38]

You could film your neighbors vehicle every day and even follow them and film everywhere they go.

Not quite the same, could constitute stalking and intimidation, regardless of intent...

Their actions are in plain view of the public and as such can and often are monitored.

Maybe...ever watch the movie Shooter?

The sky is not falling and we will be fine just know that you will be most likely filmed several places throughout your day.

Closed Circuit vs. Cloud access vs. IP cams, public vs. private property cams, etc...mapping your schedule, noting your presence...too much loopholes and spillover, in my uneducated opinion.

Tools exist for specific purposes: Cameras exist solely for documentation. Intentful implementation alters or specializes that purpose; i.e. increasing self awareness or accountability, etc. Flock is already tied into advertising and location specific databases, effectively negating privacy tools like VPNs, data scrubbers, while creating an overwhelming market for them: big pharma style. Even if you keep yourself in the clear, you might become useful as a scapegoat or unintentional patsy one day...for example, is Palm Beach Pete really Palm Beach Pete?

 

[orbital]

+

from a Google search::
1: London remains one of the most heavily monitored cities in the Western world,
featuring an estimated 500,000 to over 900,000 CCTV cameras

2: Estimates suggest there are around 1 billion CCTV cameras operating worldwide. Industry research and data analysis indicate that Asia holds the majority of these devices, with China alone accounting for roughly 700 million units as part of projects like SkyNet


why & how did we get there?
what's the total resource number globally to do this surveillance?
again, why?

 

[lampeDépêche]

1: London remains one of the most heavily monitored cities in the Western world,
featuring an estimated 500,000 to over 900,000 CCTV cameras

....why & how did we get there?....

I lived in London during one of the IRA's bombing campaigns -- I was woken up by the "Billion Dollar Bomb" in the middle of the financial district. A different bomb went off in a bus right near my work-place -- a week later, I walked around the crescent of trees and could practically pinpoint where the bus had been by the pattern of shattered glass embedded in the bark.
At that time, it made a kind of sense to ramp up the number of cameras in the city, because it was under siege by terrorists who cared literally nothing about blowing up innocent civilians.
Luckily, the "Troubles" have been over for years now, and Ireland has healed up to a large extent.
Time to take the cameras out again, don't you think?
But that's the problem: once you let them put in the cameras, it becomes very, very hard to get them out again. Between inertia, turf-protection, fear of the future, and simple power-hunger, the people who put the cameras in will not want to take them out, even when the original reason is no longer operative.
You have to start right now, saying "no more," and working to remove the cameras that have gone up.
Otherwise, we will come to envy the Russians under Brezhnev -- the KGB would have loved the resources of Flock cameras, and the data centers to analyze them.

 

[pnwoutdoors]

I lived in London during one of the IRA's bombing campaigns ...
Time to take the cameras out again, don't you think?
But that's the problem: once you let them put in the cameras, it becomes very, very hard to get them out again. Between inertia, turf-protection, fear of the future, and simple power-hunger, ...

A ton of nefarious crap has been done with the rationalizing of a budget, over the years.

As you remind everyone: once in, almost never out. Once liberty is handed over, even through seemingly innocuous "crime control", almost invariably all sorts of other chicanery occurs that ends up almost impossible to quash.

Definitely a subject area worthy of everybody's extreme circumspection and evaluation.

 

[orbital]

+

weave in AI mega centers to this all this **** The military grade data gathering, spying, compilation on you.

One is being built just south of me on 627 acres

 

[alpg88]

Otherwise, we will come to envy the Russians under Brezhnev -- the KGB would have loved the resources of Flock cameras, and the data centers to analyze them.

Actually KGB would not allow any private company to spy on entire nation, nor they needed it, KGB was not about crime, or public safety, it was about ideology, they also had agents everywhere, every school had a so called political officer, who had informants, who was not a member of KGB directly, but was reporting to local politburo chapter, every factory had one too, and people loved to write anonymous reports about their neighbors and even friends.

 

[Robocop]

Gentleman I very much agree there is no doubt abuse and although I will usually defend most police I fully understand they are not all great people. Some of them are actually horrible people and have used their authority ,and tools, in ways they never should be. The only comfort I get is I can honestly say as the tech increases to allow a safer public the tech also increases to catch the ones abusing it. Every call I go on now will activate a body cam video and audio of my behavior. It is a passive system that runs constantly and is activated to actually record events on each call.

My camera and audio will automatically activate if I turn on my patrol lights and sirens and it will also activate every time I turn on my taser. My system will also automatically activate if I get within 20 feet of any other officer that has their camera activated. If there are 20 officers on a scene and only one officer arms their taser all 20 officers cameras automatically activate. It is totally bananas and has really helped greatly with officers behaving badly. Every single search I enter is logged and although it is not actively monitored any allegation of a complaint can be checked going back I know for at least 10 years. It simply can not be erased or altered. Some activity can fly under the radar however the algorithms will catch you eventually.

I know a dispatcher that went to prison for abusing the federal data base and they found illegal searches going back to her first year on the job and she had 8 years when she was charged. It is getting a little scary for the street level officers as well as they really do not want much to do with using any of the systems. We agree that there have been mistakes with many different systems and these mistakes have made some civilians lives difficult. I am now worried that the same systems may make a mistake that effect the user as well. Most officers are afraid it may flag them by mistake and many just try not to use it at all.

If you google my name I have a very limited digital footprint. You will find a few award ceremonies and some info on my police career however very little else. I stay away from social media and never carry a phone on my person. I just never got into the tech stuff really and I am happy that I never did. The more we allow the convenance of all this modern cool stuff the easier it will be to know our every move. I am so confused as to how these digital home systems became so popular. "Alexa turn on the TV" "Alexa play my music list"....blah blah blah. When did we get so lazy that we cant turn on a light switch or set the thermostat manually?

Although my career is under a microscope due to recent abuses of Flock I really would rather go back 30 years as it was so much easier to be a police officer then. I could seriously do without many of the advances that have popped up during my police life. So to sum it up I am not a fan of todays police world however I have to be in it. The good news is that I only have to do it two more years and will retire for the 2nd time. I plan on leaving for good and living a nice little tech free life of fishing and playing with all my lights.

 

[lampeDépêche]

Robocop, if everyone in authority were as decent as you are, we wouldn’t need to worry.

“If men were angels, no government would be necessary. If angels were to govern men, neither external nor internal controls on government would be necessary. In framing a government which is to be administered by men over men, the great difficulty lies in this: you must first enable the government to control the governed; and in the next place oblige it to control itself.”
Federalist 51
Since in a democracy, *we* are the ultimate government, it is we who are obliged to control the government’s other powers. We limit the powers of the government, not because we believe that the citizens are all angels, but because we know that our servants in government are not all angels, either.

 

[alpg88]

There was already few cases when flock made false ID, and innocent people had been affected. Worst part responders did not do due diligence and confirm, they just used force indiscriminately as it was 100% good intel. They just do not care, no consequences for them, there is a lot wrong with "justice system" which is more of a prison cartel rather than anything to do with justice, flock is just 1 aspect of it, Flock absolutely must be responsible for its mistakes.

 

[raggie33]

Once a flock camera mistook me for a moron I spoke to my lawyer he took one look at me and said I have no case

 

[lampeDépêche]

Once a flock camera mistook me for a moron I spoke to my lawyer he took one look at me and said I have no case

So I said, “ but you’ve got a case, don’t you?”
He said, “yes, but only a brief one.”