What makes a light "tactical"?
- Thread starter Curious_character
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enLIGHTenment
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Curious_character said:
Marketing.
sysadmn
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Curious_character said:
The Marketing Department.
I'm just waiting for the "Strategic" lights. Qualified for use in B-2s? Capable of being strapped to a cruise missile? Just the thing to shine in a diplomat's eyes during negotiations?
2xTrinity
Flashlight Enthusiast
Another one that I will list is that a tactical flashlgiht will usually have a well concentrated, "stealthy" beam. A lot of Surefire's LED flashlights for example use Total Internal Reflection lenses to concentrate all of the light into a beam, without spill, which might give away ones position. For the sake of an everyday carry light, or a practical light though, I actually prefer more of a flood light -- the typical Cree LED pattern is quite useful IMO -- tight centered hotspot, with ridiculously bright spill for providing peripheral vision. Great for looking for dropped items, not so great in that you can easily give away position in a combat situation with such a wide flood light, or create irritating glare for others around.
Any sort of multilevel light with electronics, tactical or otherwise, should use a capacitive switch IMO -- similar to a key on a keyboard, or the button used on the Photon Freedom. With one of those, the switch itself is not actually completing the circuit, so it can be designed to be absolutely quiet, to accept mutliple consecutive clicks, or to do things like "click and hold" for dimming. (A hard "lockout" switch somewhere else on the light, or perhaps a twisty for lockout to prevent accidental turn-on is a good idea with this type of switch) Also, there are no mechanical components to wear out/break. It should be easy to extend such a system to work with external controls such as gun mounted switches as well.
I agree that this is something I'd like to see more of. Simple one-mode flashlights should all use forward clicky IMO. A lot of the Chinese lights use reverse clicky as it's easier to implement a two level resistor switch, or use with a computerized UI, such as Fenix or Rexlight.
Any sort of multilevel light with electronics, tactical or otherwise, should use a capacitive switch IMO -- similar to a key on a keyboard, or the button used on the Photon Freedom. With one of those, the switch itself is not actually completing the circuit, so it can be designed to be absolutely quiet, to accept mutliple consecutive clicks, or to do things like "click and hold" for dimming. (A hard "lockout" switch somewhere else on the light, or perhaps a twisty for lockout to prevent accidental turn-on is a good idea with this type of switch) Also, there are no mechanical components to wear out/break. It should be easy to extend such a system to work with external controls such as gun mounted switches as well.
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cutlerylover
Banned
I always thought a light had to have 2 thing to make it tactical...more than 65 lumens (surefires standard for tactical) and some kind of impact device, normally a bezel with soem kind of points or jagged edges on it by design...just my opinion...
sysadmn
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beezaur said:
Remind me not to ask for the double shot.
kelmo
Flashlight Enthusiast
Your intent!
Maybe we should start our own "non-tactical" group.
We'll call ourselves "CPFers for the ethical treatment of flashlights."
Flashlights don't kill people. People talking on cellphones while driving kill people!!!
Maybe we should start our own "non-tactical" group.
We'll call ourselves "CPFers for the ethical treatment of flashlights."
Flashlights don't kill people. People talking on cellphones while driving kill people!!!
petersmith6
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I have a tactical maglite,its a 6D.trust me,if i hit some one...there down!! bright as well
LoneWolfUSMC
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Since I actually use "tactical" lights on a daily basis while employing "tactics" I feel mildly qualified to comment on this.
As previously mentioned "tactical" is a marketing term. It means if all you do is sit behind a computer screen in camo boxers, then you HAVE to buy this item!!
For quite a few years in the Marine Corps my "tactical" light was a AA Mag with a red filter, and a small red LED keychain light. For real field work a light needs to be able to put out just enough to read a map with it 2" away from your nose without alerting enemy recon units (that might have NVG's) to your presence. I had little use for a light capable of blinding an opponent. If he was close enough to "blind" then he was more than close enough to shoot. I needed something that was easy on batteries and lightweight. Durability is a primary concern. In the field the light was generally used more for briefing teams and comm tasks than for "tactical" patrolling.
I do realize that military tactics have changed and the vast majority of our current conflict has to do with MOUT (Military Operations in Urban Terrain). A weaponlight is crucial to operating in windowless buildings in broad daylight. Your eyes cannot adjust fast enough from bright desert sun to dark rooms. In this environment, a "tactical" light can give you an edge by illuminating your target and blinding you opponent who's eyes have hopefully adapted to the dark.
In a Police role a "tactical" light would be one that allows you to identify suspects and weapons easily. The "blinding" effect of the light is desirable because you want to be able to disorient suspects without actually causing them physical harm. A prime example would be using all the white light available from a police cruiser to blind the occupants of a motor vehicle prior to the officer approaching. Since the suspects are blinded they could not possible acquire a target should their intention be to harm the officer.
When you start identifying individual features that make a light "tactical" you are giving in to the marketing hype.
Identify what "tactics" you employ. Then determine what features would compliment those tactics.
As previously mentioned "tactical" is a marketing term. It means if all you do is sit behind a computer screen in camo boxers, then you HAVE to buy this item!!
For quite a few years in the Marine Corps my "tactical" light was a AA Mag with a red filter, and a small red LED keychain light. For real field work a light needs to be able to put out just enough to read a map with it 2" away from your nose without alerting enemy recon units (that might have NVG's) to your presence. I had little use for a light capable of blinding an opponent. If he was close enough to "blind" then he was more than close enough to shoot. I needed something that was easy on batteries and lightweight. Durability is a primary concern. In the field the light was generally used more for briefing teams and comm tasks than for "tactical" patrolling.
I do realize that military tactics have changed and the vast majority of our current conflict has to do with MOUT (Military Operations in Urban Terrain). A weaponlight is crucial to operating in windowless buildings in broad daylight. Your eyes cannot adjust fast enough from bright desert sun to dark rooms. In this environment, a "tactical" light can give you an edge by illuminating your target and blinding you opponent who's eyes have hopefully adapted to the dark.
In a Police role a "tactical" light would be one that allows you to identify suspects and weapons easily. The "blinding" effect of the light is desirable because you want to be able to disorient suspects without actually causing them physical harm. A prime example would be using all the white light available from a police cruiser to blind the occupants of a motor vehicle prior to the officer approaching. Since the suspects are blinded they could not possible acquire a target should their intention be to harm the officer.
When you start identifying individual features that make a light "tactical" you are giving in to the marketing hype.
Identify what "tactics" you employ. Then determine what features would compliment those tactics.
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Lee1959 said:
There's no need to apologize Lee. Seriously, all Curious_character (or anyone for that matter) had to do was look it up in the dictionary... if the definition isn't blatantly obvious I don't know what is.
Yes c_c any flashlight can be used tactically, but let's use an analogy with a gun. If you're fending off a threat, would you want to be using a cheap Lorcin or a well made Glock? Sure they're both guns, but which one would you depend your life on? In the same way I doubt you'd bet your life on a $1 flashlight, but if that's what you'd use then be my guest. Therefore I do think the use of the word "tactical" by a few manufacturers does hold some weight, Surefire for example has a line of well built tactical lights and has customer feedback to back up their claims.
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Robocop
Mammoth Killer
I am actually doing some weekend tactical training classes this weekend and yes I have brought many lights with me to play with.....I like the way LoneWolf described tactical as in it is different for many people and their work areas.
My idea of a tactical light is much different than a soldier hunkered down in a foxhole in some jungle. Their objective may be stealth where mine is to light up as big of an area as possible. I do firmly believe that for a light to truly be useful in combat situations (both on the streets and other areas of combat) it must be reliable and very simple.
In any tactical combat scenario my light must work every time I use it and I must have confidence in the light. I simply must know that when I truly need it that it will work...period. It is also important for the light to be simple and easy to operate....."click" it makes light then "click" it goes off. I know some will disagree here but it is plain old BS that a tactical light for patrol needs a strobe or SOS or even several levels of light. Believe me when I say that fine motor skills are gone in a crisis situation and one will be hard pressed to simply activate a single level light much less cycle through all the other stuff.
I have seen videos of seasoned officers being killed during reloading of their weapon when they tried to put the magazine in backwards under stress.....also many simply forgot to deactivate their safety or even forgot to let go of their ticket book and return fire when fired upon.....point is that all the bells and whistles are fine when camping or simply to WOW your friends but again many of those features labeled as tactical in my opinion are marketing hype.
I myself have had tunnel vision during a gunfire situation and I was shocked at how truly time slows down but your ability to perform simple tasks decreases greatly.....This is why I do not use the "tactical" laser sights as it is just one more thing to get in the way in a true to life combat scenario. Plain old combat sights are best in my opinion and believe me when I say if you are being fired upon you will be hard pressed to find that little red dot under all the stress.....while you are trying to get on target the bad guy is firing away.
We train by repitition in doing things over and over until we can draw and fire in our sleep if we have to. I do not want to come to rely on gadgets and gizmos when plain old tried and true tactics come first. Yes a tactical light can be seen as many types however there are very few that are truly worthy of actual combat and this is where SureFire caters to the market and does it very well.......for several years my old Commander simply worked every time I needed it and it was a simple switch to operate....one level and also served as an impact weapon many times up close. Stinger does this also very well and thus far my Wolf-Eyes Raider is doing very well with the exception of one 13 volt lamp failure.....I was showing off at the range and was not in danger at the time and regardless my 9 volt factory set up has never failed me yet.
I believe simple and reliable make a light or any combat item tactical however this is strictly from a street cops point of view.....your everyday librarian or maybe mechanic may need a tactical light with strobe, SOS , can opener , timing light attatchment , toothbrush , and 400 decreasing levels of light however for me I will stick with plain old basic every time.
My idea of a tactical light is much different than a soldier hunkered down in a foxhole in some jungle. Their objective may be stealth where mine is to light up as big of an area as possible. I do firmly believe that for a light to truly be useful in combat situations (both on the streets and other areas of combat) it must be reliable and very simple.
In any tactical combat scenario my light must work every time I use it and I must have confidence in the light. I simply must know that when I truly need it that it will work...period. It is also important for the light to be simple and easy to operate....."click" it makes light then "click" it goes off. I know some will disagree here but it is plain old BS that a tactical light for patrol needs a strobe or SOS or even several levels of light. Believe me when I say that fine motor skills are gone in a crisis situation and one will be hard pressed to simply activate a single level light much less cycle through all the other stuff.
I have seen videos of seasoned officers being killed during reloading of their weapon when they tried to put the magazine in backwards under stress.....also many simply forgot to deactivate their safety or even forgot to let go of their ticket book and return fire when fired upon.....point is that all the bells and whistles are fine when camping or simply to WOW your friends but again many of those features labeled as tactical in my opinion are marketing hype.
I myself have had tunnel vision during a gunfire situation and I was shocked at how truly time slows down but your ability to perform simple tasks decreases greatly.....This is why I do not use the "tactical" laser sights as it is just one more thing to get in the way in a true to life combat scenario. Plain old combat sights are best in my opinion and believe me when I say if you are being fired upon you will be hard pressed to find that little red dot under all the stress.....while you are trying to get on target the bad guy is firing away.
We train by repitition in doing things over and over until we can draw and fire in our sleep if we have to. I do not want to come to rely on gadgets and gizmos when plain old tried and true tactics come first. Yes a tactical light can be seen as many types however there are very few that are truly worthy of actual combat and this is where SureFire caters to the market and does it very well.......for several years my old Commander simply worked every time I needed it and it was a simple switch to operate....one level and also served as an impact weapon many times up close. Stinger does this also very well and thus far my Wolf-Eyes Raider is doing very well with the exception of one 13 volt lamp failure.....I was showing off at the range and was not in danger at the time and regardless my 9 volt factory set up has never failed me yet.
I believe simple and reliable make a light or any combat item tactical however this is strictly from a street cops point of view.....your everyday librarian or maybe mechanic may need a tactical light with strobe, SOS , can opener , timing light attatchment , toothbrush , and 400 decreasing levels of light however for me I will stick with plain old basic every time.
Raptor#
Newly Enlightened
Red may also be acceptable, if it is bathed in the blood of your fallen enemys. :sssh:TorchBoy said:
Just a civilian here, but yeah, i'd also say tactical depends on the use, not on the attributes of the light...
The millitary probably uses most of its flashlights in a manner that wouldn't be called tactical by most folks.
I remember the post of a member telling about his experiences using a Fenix L2P in the artillery: http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=132328&highlight=L2P
Now, by most definitions of a tactical flashlight the L2P would be anything but a tactical light...
In my opinon, the word "tactical" in a flashlights name isn't anything worth paying attention to. Who cares if a light is called tactical or not, the only important thing is that it does what you need it to do.
Jumpmaster said:
Very well said. Totally agree.
Both satisfy the minimum requirements to me (my opinion) It has to be bright enough to be capable of possible disorientation when shone upon a subject, and it has to be bright enough to clearly identify your target from typical "social" distances. Dead-man (momentary) switch so that (law enforcement applications) if you somehow get hurt and drop the light, it goes off by itself thereby not giving your position away.
One last thing if i may add. RELIABILITY. There are a few manufacturers whose lights I would actually trust based on my taking their stuff apart and seeing how they're put together. Many cheap lights may look nice on the outside but after looking under the hood of many lights to see how well their electronics are put together (ie, cold solder joints, parts that are barely hanging on a pad etc.) I probably only trust a handful of manufacturers as producing "quality" and reliable products that satisfy the above criteria.
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Lee1959 posted a definition. Take a look. For the most part it describes circumstances beyond the individual's control in every respect. Anything can happen.
A tactical rifle, tactical knife, tactical flashlight, are how we see the term used most frequently, and in the true sense of the word, are supposed to handle any number of uses under any number of conditions that each might be called on for.
-A knife might be overbuilt, sacrificing an efficient geometry that maximizes its performance at its basic function as a cutting tool in favor of a more robust one that allows the knife to be used for other things, like extra thickness for prying, added length in the form of an extended tang, a compromise in handle comfort for the sake of security, for example(s).
-A rifle might have a variety of mounting systems for optics, lighting, support, etc. that sacrifice weight and ease of handling for options that widen the scope of its usefulness.
-For a light, the basic requirements really encompass reliability, durability, ease of use/carry/deployment, size, and a relatively high degree of output to begin with. That isn't necessarily enough to handle *any* situation.
SF is a good example for flashlights.
Where do you find most of the options-beamcovers and filters. You have a light that is built to cover a basic set of needs, but might be required to fill many other uses as well. How do you fill those needs while minimally affecting the normal function of the light?
SF's solutions(while including compatible LED heads, shock isolated bezels, turboheads, switching options, and things of that nature) are mostly add-ons that can filter, diffuse, and/or change the color of the beam, making it suitable for blackout use, lowlight navigation or mapreading, or even directing traffic.
The light by itself isn't "tactical".
That's the way I see it, anyhow...
A tactical rifle, tactical knife, tactical flashlight, are how we see the term used most frequently, and in the true sense of the word, are supposed to handle any number of uses under any number of conditions that each might be called on for.
-A knife might be overbuilt, sacrificing an efficient geometry that maximizes its performance at its basic function as a cutting tool in favor of a more robust one that allows the knife to be used for other things, like extra thickness for prying, added length in the form of an extended tang, a compromise in handle comfort for the sake of security, for example(s).
-A rifle might have a variety of mounting systems for optics, lighting, support, etc. that sacrifice weight and ease of handling for options that widen the scope of its usefulness.
-For a light, the basic requirements really encompass reliability, durability, ease of use/carry/deployment, size, and a relatively high degree of output to begin with. That isn't necessarily enough to handle *any* situation.
SF is a good example for flashlights.
Where do you find most of the options-beamcovers and filters. You have a light that is built to cover a basic set of needs, but might be required to fill many other uses as well. How do you fill those needs while minimally affecting the normal function of the light?
SF's solutions(while including compatible LED heads, shock isolated bezels, turboheads, switching options, and things of that nature) are mostly add-ons that can filter, diffuse, and/or change the color of the beam, making it suitable for blackout use, lowlight navigation or mapreading, or even directing traffic.
The light by itself isn't "tactical".
That's the way I see it, anyhow...
Blindasabat
Flashlight Enthusiast
I agree!2xTrinity said:
For the resistor mod maybe, but a reverse clicky is not needed for the computerized UI. It is being marketed that way, but short momentary presses to get to the mode you want, then a full press to stay there makes more sense and is more natural to me. Many people are implementing the Kooter tube with a SF Z57 momentary clicky on their P1Ds and finding they work more naturally that way.2xTrinity said:
IMO the reason low end flashlights use reverse must be simplicity, availablility / easy to find in a catalog, size (look how big Mag's switch is), or reliability. I have found the Lightflux momentary is not designed so well if you try to use the low stage (untwist tailcap). SF, Streamlight, (and Mag) must have come up with good designs and either patented them or they are too expensive for others to use.
+
That full quote from above is over 14 years old ^
If someone's not doing cqb/cqc,, can there be a tactical thrower?
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In a close quarters situation a thrower can make up for lack of lumens with beam intensity that makes it……well a thrower.
Think about it this way. It's pitch black, you're a teenager at lovers leap making out with oh I dunno you decide…… when suddenly BAM "outta the car long hair!" and you are blinded by the beam of John Q Law's 3D Rayovac Sportsman. You squint and put your hand over your eyes shielding them from the light saying "please turn out that light sir"……Oh, by the way it's 1964. Long before those "tactical" lights were invented. Yet back then your pupils were huge in order to have that cat-like vision under a moonless sky.
If surprise is paramount an incan SureFire E1 can get it done at close quarters. I keep the 200 lumen EB1c on my night stand for it's snoot like beam in order to scare the bejezus out of anybody intent on harm who managed to get past the hounds at 3am. I'm not blinded by my light while the person on the wrong end of the beam is. Actually the early LED versions of Streamlights, Maglites, SureFires and Inovas did not put out a ton of overall lighting from those little LED chips but their pencil beam made up for it at those times where "surprize!!" was important. A 37 lumen Maglite solitaire with it's tiny Luxeon can potentially be a CQB light.
For room sweeping or a warehouse raid the broader beam is better. But those TIR lights folks hated so much back in the day were awesome at close quarters situations. So that is one reason old cop lights with a 2.4 volt, sub 1amp bulb could be so effective.
If the "non tactical" scenario involves finding your kids football in the bushes a thrower will place the beam between the branches without lighting up branches and brush nearby. Plus in the case of escaping a house on fire the pencil beam held at waist height or way overhead is better at cutting through smoke to find the exit.
Now to the tactical manuvering question, in the case of the Inova back when this began, when trying to locate a wounded comrad or another rescue type tactic then carrying or dragging the victim out of a dark building to safety and both hands are required to aid the retrieval a head lamp is practical.
Think about it this way. It's pitch black, you're a teenager at lovers leap making out with oh I dunno you decide…… when suddenly BAM "outta the car long hair!" and you are blinded by the beam of John Q Law's 3D Rayovac Sportsman. You squint and put your hand over your eyes shielding them from the light saying "please turn out that light sir"……Oh, by the way it's 1964. Long before those "tactical" lights were invented. Yet back then your pupils were huge in order to have that cat-like vision under a moonless sky.
If surprise is paramount an incan SureFire E1 can get it done at close quarters. I keep the 200 lumen EB1c on my night stand for it's snoot like beam in order to scare the bejezus out of anybody intent on harm who managed to get past the hounds at 3am. I'm not blinded by my light while the person on the wrong end of the beam is. Actually the early LED versions of Streamlights, Maglites, SureFires and Inovas did not put out a ton of overall lighting from those little LED chips but their pencil beam made up for it at those times where "surprize!!" was important. A 37 lumen Maglite solitaire with it's tiny Luxeon can potentially be a CQB light.
For room sweeping or a warehouse raid the broader beam is better. But those TIR lights folks hated so much back in the day were awesome at close quarters situations. So that is one reason old cop lights with a 2.4 volt, sub 1amp bulb could be so effective.
If the "non tactical" scenario involves finding your kids football in the bushes a thrower will place the beam between the branches without lighting up branches and brush nearby. Plus in the case of escaping a house on fire the pencil beam held at waist height or way overhead is better at cutting through smoke to find the exit.
Now to the tactical manuvering question, in the case of the Inova back when this began, when trying to locate a wounded comrad or another rescue type tactic then carrying or dragging the victim out of a dark building to safety and both hands are required to aid the retrieval a head lamp is practical.
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These kinds of threads abound on CPF, and almost all end up being pointless goat-roping, cat herding exercises; ie: largely a waste of bandwidth. Let me lighten it up a bit with one of my personal favorite lines though (since the subject has been brought up yet again):
There's an old, somewhat humorous 'saying' that I never really liked and never used, but heard a lot:
Someone asks: "How much does that cost?"
The reply was: "If you have to ask, you probably can't afford one".
I've borrowed from that old line and modified it.
Someone asks: "What is a tactical flashlight - what does that mean?"
My response is: "If you have to ask, you probably don't need one".
While they both sound similar and frankly a bit 'smart-A', there's a difference. The first one often wasn't really true, but if you think about it a minute, I believe you'll find the second (my version) almost always turns out to be true.
There's an old, somewhat humorous 'saying' that I never really liked and never used, but heard a lot:
Someone asks: "How much does that cost?"
The reply was: "If you have to ask, you probably can't afford one".
I've borrowed from that old line and modified it.
Someone asks: "What is a tactical flashlight - what does that mean?"
My response is: "If you have to ask, you probably don't need one".
While they both sound similar and frankly a bit 'smart-A', there's a difference. The first one often wasn't really true, but if you think about it a minute, I believe you'll find the second (my version) almost always turns out to be true.
parang
Newly Enlightened
- Joined
- Dec 28, 2020
- Messages
- 183
Attributes of a tactical light AFAIK:
matte black color,
the ability to break glass (or bones) with pronounced crenulations,
a switch positioned on the end cap, to be operated with the thumb,
strobe (possibly variable) mode to disorient an attacker/victim,
throw rather than flood configuration,
CW rather than high CRI light,
extra red, blue or green color leds for tactical signaling,
a name such as Warrior, Defender, Dominator, Fury, etc.
matte black color,
the ability to break glass (or bones) with pronounced crenulations,
a switch positioned on the end cap, to be operated with the thumb,
strobe (possibly variable) mode to disorient an attacker/victim,
throw rather than flood configuration,
CW rather than high CRI light,
extra red, blue or green color leds for tactical signaling,
a name such as Warrior, Defender, Dominator, Fury, etc.
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