Coronavirus - II

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lion504

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Lion504- Not even from a holding them accounable point of view, but from a "pc" perspective: We have no problem calling the Spanish flu of 1918 what it was based on origin. Had no problem with that for 102 years. I wonder why the public distaste for Chinese or Wuhan flu? It's where it originated.

True. Heard San Antonio just passed a resolution declaring "Chinese" or "Wuhan" pandemic labels as hate speech. Not sure if that is fake news.

A good friend of mine is Chinese-American. He is 100% anti-CCP and regularly says "Wu-flu."

It's possible to simultaneously be outraged by the actions of the Chinese government (and want to hold them accountable) while rejecting discrimination and hate crimes against American citizens and the Chinese people.
 
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Tejasandre

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True. Heard San Antonio just passed a resolution declaring "Chinese" or "Wuhan" pandemic labels as hate speech. Not sure if that is fake news.

A good friend of mine is Chinese-American. He is 100% anti-CCP and regularly says "Wu-flu."

It's possible to simultaneously be outraged by the actions of the Chinese government (and want to hold them accountable) while rejecting discrimination and hate crimes against American citizens and the Chinese people.

I'm in San Antonio, hadn't heard that.
 

Poppy

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Everybody who contracts covid-19 will die.
Everybody who does not contract covid-19 will die.

Each of us realizes we will die some day but spend our lives pretending that isn't the case. For if we did not we would remain paralyzed our whole lives trying to prevent it.

Yesterday one of my retired coworkers stopped by the project to say hello. He instinctively stuck his hand out to shake it. I replied "if you aint scared, I aint scared". He's 78 years young and stays pretty isolated. We talked about things and he went on his way. We did bump elbows at his departure though.

Another fellow had on latex gloves to rub some concrete on a damaged section of concrete pipe to patch it. When he removed his gloves he pulled the second one off inside of the first one like a nurse or doctor would. I remarked about that to him and he said he was an EMT in his spare time. He indicated he was not afraid to be around people right now but instead is more afraid that if everybody sterilizes everything, wears masks and gloves all the time they will get sick from something else due to no germs reaching their immune systems due to all of the disinfecting they do. He said as long as he doesn't live in New York, New Jersey or Massechussetts he aint afraid.

The take away from both people was yeah, this thing is serious but we're all going to die someday so why not live life until then.

That's not MY take away from your two discussions.

Regarding the 78 year old, he may be the type who lived his life with an effective immune system, and rarely if ever gets sick. He may have developed an arrogance and expects that even if he gets exposed, he'll beat it. Some people are still vaping, and others still smoking cigarettes. Their arrogance leads them to believe that THEY are NOT the ONE who will get CANCER.

Up until recently, most EMTs didn't wear PPE when picking up, treating, and transporting sick and injured patients, other than gloves (if they had gloves on). They like doctors, nurses, and teachers (who work in a petri dish) usually develop a superbly adapted immune system. He too, like the 78 year old man, may have developed an arrogance.

" but instead is more afraid that if everybody sterilizes everything, wears masks and gloves all the time they will get sick from something else due to no germs reaching their immune systems due to all of the disinfecting they do."
Like pancreatic cancer? Liver disease, or heart attack?
But not viral induced, or pneumococcal induced pneumonia?

That's not such a bad trade off.

Perhaps he spoke imprecisely, or was quoted incorrectly.

My take is that masks and gloves are uncomfortable and inconvenient. Some people are either arrogant, or are willing to take their chances, rather than be inconvenienced for a few months until there is a proven herd immunity.
 

orbital

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Common denominators in covid deaths have to be looked very closely, you simply have to.

Age
Overall health & exercise frequency
Smoker
Population density
Diet
*Prescription medication & antagonistic combinations of

How many optional & debatable prescriptions are pushed, where the number one negative side effect (of many) is "may effect the ability to fight infections"

note: other than a prescription for mild pain reliever in the mid 90s' post surgery , I truly can't remember my last prescription..
so, a very long time
 

StarHalo

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THEY are NOT the ONE

Some people are either arrogant, or are willing to take their chances, rather than be inconvenienced for a few months until there is a proven herd immunity.

That's the heart of the threat-to-self worldview; it's not going to get ME, so everything is squared away here, now you pull your weight and square it away with YOU. Those other people who get it were just going to die anyway, they shouldn't have been ill, that's not on me. You have to be aware of this concept for ~30% of the media coverage/posts here to make any sense at all.
 

Lumen83

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Everybody who contracts covid-19 will die.
Everybody who does not contract covid-19 will die.

True. But, I'd prefer not to extradite the process by putting myself at risk without reward. I lead a life that includes activities that put me at a much higher risk of death from said activities than the average member of society probably has from the activities that they pursue. But, there is also a great level of reward in them. There isn't much reward for me in ignoring what I would consider standard safety practices with regard to this virus. So, I tend to avoid things that could expedite the death process without bringing a certain level of reward/benefit to me. Shaking hands with people right now is one activity that is in the low-reward category for me.
 

Dave D

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Lion504- Not even from a holding them accounable point of view, but from a "pc" perspective: We have no problem calling the Spanish flu of 1918 what it was based on origin. Had no problem with that for 102 years. I wonder why the public distaste for Chinese or Wuhan flu? It's where it originated.

The Spanish flu did not originate in Spain, World war 1 was in full flow and neither side would allow their press to publish matters referring to the outbreak in case it showed a weakness in their military.

Spain was a neutral country and their press were the first to publish articles about the outbreak.

To this day the Spanish still find it offensive that it is referred to as Spanish flu!

It has been suggested that it originated in Kansas USA and was spread to Europe on the troop ships, it then devastated the troops in the unhygienic conditions of the trenches and was then brought back to the USA with returning troops.
 

scout24

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Interesting, DaveD, thank you for the info. I was unaware of some of those details. We here in the US still call it the Spanish flu, regardless of origin, and we here in the US are the ones with the public distaste for calling Covid 19 the Chinese or Wuhan flu. I just found that sudden change a bit hypocritical. I've heard nobody call it the 1918 flu.
 

StarHalo

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A Chinese hospital team has found evidence that COVID can be transmitted sexually even while in recovery; only 16% of their 38-person males-only sample showed this symptom.
 

turbodog

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The Spanish flu did not originate in Spain, World war 1 was in full flow and neither side would allow their press to publish matters referring to the outbreak in case it showed a weakness in their military.

Spain was a neutral country and their press were the first to publish articles about the outbreak.

To this day the Spanish still find it offensive that it is referred to as Spanish flu!

It has been suggested that it originated in Kansas USA and was spread to Europe on the troop ships, it then devastated the troops in the unhygienic conditions of the trenches and was then brought back to the USA with returning troops.

Yup. So for those US citizens concerned about China suppressing factual news you might want to look in the mirror.

We call it the 1918 flu or 1918 pandemic and make sure our kids know why it was called Spanish flu.

On a related note, I read a recent whitepaper, should be in peer review now, that is trying to track 1918 spread to military horses being shipped all over the world. Was very interesting. Can't find it now though...
 

lion504

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Origination of the pandemic in 1918 is debated. This article attributes it to China.

It is natural that any county that is blamed (rightly or wrongly) will protest. In this case, it is expected that China will be upset.

A separate issue is whether a second country should consider itself racist for attributing responsibility to another country. For example: Wu-flu, Belgian waffles, Mexican sombrero.
 
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bykfixer

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The Spanish flu actually began in 1915 or 16.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3291398/
It was not seen as a big deal that year yet by todays standards it would have been deemed a pandemic.

When people started moving around in small spaces like troops moving over seas it really took off.

Once it died down there was actually a 3rd out break, mostly in California.

In the 1930's a version of it wiped out lots of people. There was another deadly flu period in the 1950's thought to be a strain of it.

In the 1970's it came back. More people died from the vaccine that the actual flu. That's one reason most people I know in their 70's absolutely refuse current flu shots. They have not forgotten that 1970's fiasco.

In the 1990's yet another version of it spread. That one had me ill for weeks and took months to recover.

We will probably never know where it began though. The first (known) reported case was a soldier who grew up on a pig farm in Kansas USA.
There still isn't a vaccine for the Spanish flu.
 
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