M61HOT v2

[etc]

So I see there is a new M61HOT v2.0

apparently it's almost exactly the same as M91T, same lux, the same lumens, the same LED but the voltage range is shifted downwards. Can't use 12V/MD4. It's like a regular M61.

 

[QMT93]

From Malkoff website:
"The M61HOT Head was designed specifically for use on the Malkoff MD2, MD3, or MD4 Body with one or two protected rechargeable 18650 Li-ion Battery(s) or two or three CR123 primary batteries. The input voltage is 3.8 - 9 volts. Below 3.8 volts it will drop out of regulation and run direct drive. This head is protected against reverse polarity."
Furthermore, the outputs between one or two cells are negligible, if not identical, also according to Malkoff website. In other words, we're getting the best of both worlds: using one rechargeable cell to maximize the number of available flashlights, while minimizing the size to carry, or using two rechargeable cells to maximize runtime and grip.

 

[Megalamuffin]

I have an m91t on my purchase list, but now I can just go with the m61 hot v2 and get what I wanted out of the 91t but also be able to use it in md1/md2 form with full output. Seems like an excellent choice.

 

[QMT93]

I have an m91t on my purchase list, but now I can just go with the m61 hot v2 and get what I wanted out of the 91t but also be able to use it in md1/md2 form with full output. Seems like an excellent choice.

Right? I think the only upside of the M91T over the M61HOTv2 now is that the former can run 4xCR123s or three rechargeable cells for even longer runtime thanks to its 12V limit.

 

[Megalamuffin]

I don't know how the runtime will compare between the 61hot v2 and 91t when both are at the same voltage. Aside from that the hot v2 seems to be more versatile, definitely so for my purposes. As soon as I'm able I'll buy one.

With the m61sho and hot v2 I'm not quite sure what to do with the m61t anymore. It could be a good emergency backup light to keep in the truck but I'd need a new host light for it.

 

[thermal guy]

The 61T has much better runtimes than the sho and just as much throw. The sho just has a much brighter spill. The 61T would make a great backup

 

[NH Lumens]

I very much like the MD3 body for ergonomics, and using a M91T with two 18500 Li-ion cells has long been one of my favorite combos;




My M61HOT v.2 should show up tomorrow and I plan on doing a direct comparison to the M91T. I suspect they will be identical in performance but I'll make some observations and take some measurements and report back what I find.

 

[thermal guy]

I'm actually pretty stoked about this V2. Your right it should mimic the 91T but have the ability to run in a MD2 at full power with primaries or off of 2 lithium's.

 

[tech25]

I would like to see how this is vs. The wildcat without the diffuser.
I like how my M91BN runs on an MD3 but as I'm keeping it in my bag, idk if I should get the bigger head of the wildcat or the new M61hot V2

 

[thermal guy]

Oh I'm thinking the wildcat will out throw it She's a beast!

 

[Lights and Guns]

So, I did like the original M61HOT but for using it outdoors it just lacked a bit of "punch" (throw) for my liking, especially when compared to something like the Modlite PLH-V2 or OKW handhelds I have.

With that said, do you think the M61HOT V2 is worth me picking up?

Correct me if I'm wrong but It's a bit higher output then V1 and a lot more throw?

I like these sized lights, that take (1) 18650 .... I have been using the Modlite PLHv2 for work for the past few years, with that said I'm aware the modlite steps down to about 50% of its advertised specs after being on for about 6-7 minutes straight ( give or take)

Anybody know if the malkoff steps down, and if so... how much and approx. when?

Just checking to see if It's worth me picking up the M61HOT V2 or just stick with the modlite for work.
(the thing I REALLY like about the malkoff over the modlite is the construction - I feel like the malkoff is a tank and just won't stop working no matter what, also what I like mostly VS the modlite is that the malkoff has that HI/LO ring for high/low modes... the modlite I'm stuck with just 1 mode (HIGH) ... and stuck carrying a second smaller light at work, for "admin" tasks with less lumens/ modes.

Thanks

 

[thermal guy]

I think this V2 has the same output and throw. It just has more of a voltage range.

 

[Lights and Guns]

I think this V2 has the same output and throw. It just has more of a voltage range.

Ah..... okay

Thanks for clearing that up.

I'll stick with what I have then!

 

[QMT93]

@Lights and Guns :
The M61HOT and the M61HOTv2 have the same output (750 lumens, 20kcd). They both produce this full, regulated output for at least an hour using 1x18650 at 3,500mAh. After this, the light will drop out of regulation, and run direct drive.
The difference is the M61HOT can ONLY run 1x18650, 1x21700, or 2xCR123, while the M61HOTv2 can run one or two rechargeable cells, or two to three CR123's, providing potentially even longer runtime, and more grip.

 

[Lights and Guns]

@Lights and Guns :
The M61HOT and the M61HOTv2 have the same output (750 lumens, 20kcd). They both produce this full, regulated output for at least an hour using 1x18650 at 3,500mAh. After this, the light will drop out of regulation, and run direct drive.
The difference is the M61HOT can ONLY run 1x18650, 1x21700, or 2xCR123, while the M61HOTv2 can run one or two rechargeable cells, or two to three CR123's, providing potentially even longer runtime, and more grip.

Ah thank you very much for this.

So by "regulation" does that mean for the first hour or so it'll stay at stated output without any drop until its running direct drive over an hour into the life of the battery?

If so, that is quite appealing. Steady light output without any drops. "What you see is what you get" ...

As opposed to the modlites which pump out an insane amount of light for the first 3 minutes or so, then starts to step down quite quickly after 5 minutes or so of being on even with a fresh battery.

At turn on there is a huge difference between the modlite and malkoff, and for the first few minutes I'd say. Which is why I stuck with the modlite over the malkoff for work purposes. At turn on and for the first few minutes the modlite clearly is the winner in terms of output/throw.

But again, I would really love the Hi/Lo feature the malkoff has that the modlite doesn't. --- Indoors the difference between the modlite and malkoff aren't really worth speaking too, both light up a house/apartment great... my thing was outdoors, reaching out to 50 yards and beyond, the modlite beats out the malkoff quite easily and very noticably. (At least within 3-5 minutes of turning the lights on)...

By the sounds of it, due to regulation the malkoff might end up outperforming the modlite over the long term if both lights are on and being used for a great duration ... such as 30+ minutes without a break...

I've always had this dilemma...

Going with modlite or malkoff... and have switched back and forth twice, but usually coming back to the modlite.

Modlite, I gain performance up front for first 5-6 minutes.... much more throw and output at turn on. (very noticeable amount)

BUT

Malkoff has Hi/Lo which I really like, and also is steady and regulated throughout the first hour so no step-down if ever needing the light to be on for longer periods of time. (If I understood that point you were speaking too). Also the malkoff won't get super hot like the modlites do in hand, which can be annoying at times.

Also, any rough idea of how long the malkoff can stay on in the low mode and high mode on a single 18650 at stated outputs before then start stepping down?

Thanks

 

[QMT93]

No problem! I'll clarify some more:
_ "Regulation" means the light will stay at, or close, to its advertised output, which, in this case, is 750 lumens, 20kcd, for at least an hour on 1x18650 at 3,500 mAh, before dropping out of regulation and running direct-drive. This is one of Malkoff's selling point: What You See Is What You Get. Most of the lights I've read about, including Modlite, unfortunately, can only sustain the advertised output for a few minutes, or even seconds, before dropping down drastically. Here's the runtime graph of an older version (625 lumens) of the M61HOT (near advertised output of 625 lumens for about 80 minutes on 1x18650 at 3,500 mAh)
_ If you're interested in runtime graph, this is the most comprehensive thread by @INFRNL. It may not include all lights, but will give you an idea of how long your Malkoff might run. I don't know how long the M61HOTv2 can run on low at 3,500mAh, but I'm sure it'll be significantly longer than an hour.
_ Malkoff's answer to the PLHv2 is the E2XT (using Surefire E-series thread), and E2XTL (using Surefire Dual Fuel -DF- thread). Both are advertised at 500 lumens, 55kcd. As most Malkoff lights, they are regulated. E2XT thread, with discussion on E2XT, E2XTL, and the discontinued E2XTD. E2XTL body thread.
_ If you need an upgrade for your usage, my recommendations are E2XT or E2XTL for outdoors, and M61HOTv2 with H/L ring, for indoors, both on protected button top 18650.

 

[NH Lumens]

I've always had this dilemma...

Not a bad dilemma to have! ;-)

The Modlite PLv2 (1,350 lumens / 54,000 cd) is a beast.

A few years back I was advising a warrants officer on hand held light selection for work and recommended a M91T head (same as the M61 HOT, different voltage range) on a MD3 body. He rolled with that (and very much liked it) until he purchased a PLv2, which as you already know greatly outperforms anything Malkoff makes with the exception of the Hound Dog Super. We had many conversations about how the light was used for his line of work and through those conversations I learned a great deal.

FYI, the slightly longer MD3 body serves better as an impact tool compared to shorter 18650 body. With Malkoff's tough-as-a-hammer construction there's no worry about damaging the light.

FWIW, here is how I'd set up the light for your application;

• MD3 body
• M61HOT v.2 with high/low switch
• Grip ring from extender kit
• Cloud Defensive deep carry pocket clip (full size)
• EDCLB finger ring kit (optional)
• Run the light on three CR 123 batteries or two 18500 2300 mAh Li-ion cells

Here's the run time graph for this set up compliments of INFRNL (2000 mAh cells)




Close-up of the grip ring, pocket clip and finger ring (for hands-free retention);




If you want all the benefits of a Malkoff light (bullet proof construction, regulated output/flat output, high/low switch) and exceed the performance of the PLv2, you could do something like this;




Feel free to reach out to me via PM and I'd be happy to help.

 

[Lights and Guns]

No problem! I'll clarify some more:
_ "Regulation" means the light will stay at, or close, to its advertised output, which, in this case, is 750 lumens, 20kcd, for at least an hour on 1x18650 at 3,500 mAh, before dropping out of regulation and running direct-drive. This is one of Malkoff's selling point: What You See Is What You Get. Most of the lights I've read about, including Modlite, unfortunately, can only sustain the advertised output for a few minutes, or even seconds, before dropping down drastically. Here's the runtime graph of an older version (625 lumens) of the M61HOT (near advertised output of 625 lumens for about 80 minutes on 1x18650 at 3,500 mAh)
_ If you're interested in runtime graph, this is the most comprehensive thread by @INFRNL. It may not include all lights, but will give you an idea of how long your Malkoff might run. I don't know how long the M61HOTv2 can run on low at 3,500mAh, but I'm sure it'll be significantly longer than an hour.
_ Malkoff's answer to the PLHv2 is the E2XT (using Surefire E-series thread), and E2XTL (using Surefire Dual Fuel -DF- thread). Both are advertised at 500 lumens, 55kcd. As most Malkoff lights, they are regulated. E2XT thread, with discussion on E2XT, E2XTL, and the discontinued E2XTD. E2XTL body thread.
_ If you need an upgrade for your usage, my recommendations are E2XT or E2XTL for outdoors, and M61HOTv2 with H/L ring, for indoors, both on protected button top 18650.

Thanks, I currently carry 2 lights at work.

A big selling point and why the M61HOTv2 was appealing to me was the HI/LO so I could just carry the one light and not 2 lights like I currently do.

I Agree with you, that best of both worlds would probably be the V2 for indoors / E2XT or TL or outdoors. But its not super practical for me to carry both lights, currently I carry the modlite and a smaller admin type light for admin tasks. To carry the V2 and E2XT that would mean more weight / space taken up, which I don't really want to do.

Thanks for your response, I feel like I certainly did learn a bunch from you.

I wish the E2XT was able to have a Hi/LO ring, that would have been perfect.

I did try the M61HOT but again at turn on and for the first few minutes side by side to a modlite, the modlite is in another class in terms of output and throw. Which is why I've continued to carry the modlite. Usually I don't need a light to remain on for 30+ minutes. My use-cases are generally needing as much light as possible for a 2-5 minute window.

I have always like malkoffs though, which is why my interest peaked upon hearing a V2 of the HOT, which brought me here haha.

 

[QMT93]

Haha, no problem! Glad I can help. I learned a lot from other Malkoff moths here as well.

 

[NH Lumens]

My M61HOT v.2 arrived yesterday and I've had time for an initial evaluation. I compared it directly to my M91T (about 5 years old), the M61SHO I recently purchased and an old M61T. The comparison proved eye opening.

Measurements

A while back I set up a DIY integrating sphere (a $10 Styrofoam cooler) and a $30 lux meter to take readings. While this set up won't give precise lumen readings, it does serve nicely to compare the output of one light to another;




The process is to take a light of known output and shine it into the integrating sphere (in a professional setting, this would be a calibrated reference light in a true integrating sphere) and then divide the lux reading into the known output of the reference light. This produces a multiplier that is used to determine the output of the lights being tested: lux reading from meter X multiplier = output in lumens.

I had established this multiplier for my DIY rig from previous testing and used it to test the lights. The results are as follows;

• M91T on two cells = 780 lumens (rated at 750 lumens)
• M61HOT v.2 on one or two cells = 635 lumens (rated at 740 lumens)
• M61SHO on one or two cells = 570 lumens (rated at 825 lumens)
• M91B on one cell = 450 lumens (no single cell rating)
• M61T on two cells = 425 lumens (rated at 425 lumens)

The important consideration is not the calculated output (which has plenty of potential error), but the comparative output of each module (which has little potential error).

The M91T and M61T are pretty much on target with their ratings. This has generally been the case with all Malkoff lights I've tested in the past.

My sample of the M91B has always been a dog - there's no way it hits the rated 1,000 lumens no matter how many cells it's run on. On four CR123 batteries, the Bodyguard v.2 on a single Li-ion cell still blows it away.

My sample of the new M61HOT v.2 does not reach its 740 lumen rating. Even if I use 900 lumens for the M91T to calculate the multiplier, the M61HOT gets to 730 lumens. I'm inclined to give it a pass due to the potential error in my measuring process.

My sample of the M61SHO was not even close to its rated output, and even any error in my process does not account for it. This was no surprise as my Surefire E2T Tactician (rated at 800 lumens, measured in this testing at 804 lumens) is clearly more powerful by simple observation. According to my measurements and observations, the M61SHO does not match the M61HOT v.2 in either lumens or candela.

Observations - M61HOT v.2 vs. M91T

I had always assumed based on their ratings that the M61HOT and M91T were essentially identical in output. At least with my samples, this appears not to be the case;

• The M91T has greater output (measured and observed)
• The M91T has a substantially tighter and brighter hot spot, and substantially higher observable candela
• The M61HOT v.2 is noticeably cooler in color temperature
• The M61HOT v.2 has a MUCH more uniform beam pattern and no "Donut of Darkness" surrounding the corona like the M91T
• The output of the M61HOT v.2 is rock solid vs. voltage: from 4.0 volts to 8.4, the lux reading remained the same

Conclusions

Even though the output does not match my sample of the M91T (and according to my measurements struggles to meet its rated output), the new M61HOT v.2 remains the top dog of the Malkoff M61 series. Though a bit cooler than I care for, and the noticeable square corona caused by the TIR optic projecting the shape of the emitter, the overall beam is more uniform with brighter spill compared to my sample of the M91T. With the high/low switch installed, the low setting is perfect for night adapted vision inside the house.

As planned it has been installed on my night stand light where it provides a better-than-expected upgrade over my M91B running on a single Li-ion cell.