Are the Nitecore D10/EX10 Lights Industry Changing?

[LED-holic]

I'm a bit surprised and saddened by the negative tone this thread took.

PS. I will probably never buy a custom light. I just can't afford it. I like flashlights too much, and if I were to start collecting custom lights, the divorce would be quickly finalized. The ND10 and LF5XT bring to budget consumers like myself what people who pay custom builders to at much higher prices.

That to me is revolutionary, and my wallet thinks so as well.

 

[LED-holic]

Aside from being good value, the only thing that I see as industry-changing, is that once upon a time, anyone could pick up any flashlight and turn it on and use it.

Now, the UIs have become so complicated that you need a half-day of training and practice to be able to use your flashlight.

If you opened a shopping-center flashlight kiosk, you would spend almost all of your time teaching people how to use these wildly different UIs, and the rest trying to keep them from being stolen.

Not a step in the right direction, IMHO - a flashlight should be intuitive and obvious, without a training session.

I don't know about you, but I didn't even read the instruction manual of the ND10. I just watched the video by 4Sevens one time, and I was able to use the light.

This was what I had been requesting with other lights, like the LF2X, Jet-1 IBS, etc. People are lazy and don't want to spend a lot of time learning how to use stuff, myself included. WadeF's video on the NDI really helped me figure out how to use it. BabyDoc wrote some fantastic instructions on how to use the NDI, but until I saw WadeF's video just one time, I couldn't quite figure out the NDI.

Videos are the way to go for the future, imho. As people get more familiar with micro-chip embedded products, and flexibility increases, videos will help make it very easy to use products.

The ND10 is one of the simplist lights to use, compared to the LF2X, NDI, etc, imho. :twothumbs

 

[Patriot]

If you are looking at it from the consumer aspect, than no they are not industry changing. But from the "industry" standpoint they might be. Nitecore has managed to put together a quality manufactured light with a fair amount features the consumer wanted and has done it at a reasonable price. Now this may "change the industry" in the sense that consumer expectations have been raised for the dollars they spend and manufacturers who do not comply will undoubtedly lose market share. It is the concept of adapt or die at work.
I guess the key phrase is "industry changing" as opposed to "revolutionizing the industry" Revolutionary no, industry changing yes.
JMO

Exactly what olrac said. It's not that any one characteristic is new or industry changing, it's the combination of features brought together at a very reasonable price.

 

[Krakenbound]

Nice features and design, but at 3" its too short for anything but civilian use. Sign me up for the 2 cell version when it come out!

 

[rizky_p]

yeah 18650 version of Nitecore PD would be nice 50 bucks is a steal IMO.

 

[matrixshaman]

I think 4sevens and Nitecore have taken the cutting edge best of ideas and put them together in one light. There is no other light using a multi-mode full ramping UI with a piston drive and MCU controlled switching. In fact there are only a couple lights up to now that have used MCU controlled switching - something I have been pushing to see more of for a long while. Combined with the silent piston drive and other features I see these lights as groundbreaking. To the average Joe on the street he wouldn't know but for flashaholics I see it as a big thing and one that could be a new standard in terms of feature sets. I believe it is also the first light that can be operated as a twisty, a tactical momentary tail switch or a multi-mode forward clicky (pushy? pressy?) MCU controlled flashlight. That is quite an accomplishment in one light. IMO groundbreaking.

 

[WadeF]

Maybe industry changing on a small level, to a certain niche in the industry. I think the EX10/D10 are going to make other flashlight makers in the same niche market step it up.

If we say the EX10/D10 competes with the Fenix P2D, and other similar small EDC's, then companies like Fenix may have to step up their game. Nitecore sells a small light made from quality materials, premium Cree Q5 WC emitter, piston switch, etc, for $59.00, about the same price as a premium P2D. When looking at the Fenix we have a Q5 in the premium, but we don't know what bin, and we have a reverse clicky switch. So will Fenix step it up, or drop their price?

 

[daimleramg]

yeah 18650 version of Nitecore PD would be nice 50 bucks is a steal IMO.

$59.00 - 8% = $54.28 lol

When can I start stealing?

 

[Rzr800]

The OP mentions both the industry and the hobby; both having many important subcategories not the least of which being real time discussions up here on CPF.

Nitecore changed CPF (period) in terms of the attitude that this newbie witnessed up here the very day that this brand new company made their very first post.

We've been buying industry changing lights at reasonable prices with excellent customer service ever since...and frankly?...it has made many of us take stock of our attitudes towards not what turned out to be the excellent Nitecore overseas model...but those manufacturers and vendors having partied like rock stars on our dime for far to long with not very darn much in return but extremely high prices and (what turned out to be) very outdated technology.

I've been an Edgetac fan since day one probably because I simply despised the arrogance of those who were obviously in very thick with their competition...and who now wish that we would all quit driving the post count up past levels that this board has never seen previously in so short a period.

Congratulations, Nitecore (and now 4 sevens) for quite simply dominating this board of late...and putting quality products finally within the non government funded or private sector employee's financial reach (ie. the common man or woman in countries around the world who simply desire a quality light and who don't necessarily care to fund some rep's expense account when purchasing it).

 

[McGizmo]

I think it is reasonable to state that 4sevens and NiteCore have had a recent and significant impact on CPF with these lights. Will this have influence on other manufacturers who target CPF? If yes, will this influence spread beyond CPF to what I think most of us consider as the "industry"? :shrug: :thinking:

It would be interesting to have a measure on how much if any, CPF, itself, has influence on the "industry".

I think the industry has changed with the advent of LED light sources and electronic circuits which drive these sources and often at more than one level. That is to say, the industry has changed now that hot wires are not the only type of flashlight. The industry has changed because there is a revolution under way in SSL and new designs, engineering and manufacture based on this revolution has not been limited to in house R&D of the manufacturers who, prior to the revolution, controlled and serviced the market. In fact, in many cases, these "old school" manufacturers have had to outsource and seek new expertise well beyond their engineering and knowledge base.

I think there is a lot of pressure on the industry for change and this will continue I believe. Some of this pressure is a result of competition among the manufacturers and some of it is from consumers but much is also from the LED industry itself and the LED manufacturers doing what they can to see their latest and greatest LED be integrated in a new flashlight.

I see change as a given. What is more to the point is where does the influence and opinion, which drives this change, come from?

I suspect that the body of content of CPF does have some influence on the "industry" and yet it has to be consumed with a lot of salt. For some in the industry on a low sodium diet, I would imagine they totally ignore CPF.

Some members of CPF are quite knowledgeable and serious about their interests in flashlights and frankly are a wealth of information, worthy of consideration. Others will contrive a new identity for a single meaningless and senseless post as in example above. There are some real gems in this forum but there is a lot of crap to wade through to fine them unfortunately. If CPF wants to influence the direction and change in the industry it would behoove the membership to attempt to limit the crap and reinforce the gems.

CPF as a market is now large enough to have the interest and ear of some manufacturers who do indeed cater to the community. There is no reason to think that some of the success and design that arises to satisfy flashaholics doesn't inevitably flow into the more mainstream market and industry.

 

[1dash1]

McGizmo:

Well said.

 

[olrac]

Aside from being good value, the only thing that I see as industry-changing, is that once upon a time, anyone could pick up any flashlight and turn it on and use it.

Now, the UIs have become so complicated that you need a half-day of training and practice to be able to use your flashlight.

If you opened a shopping-center flashlight kiosk, you would spend almost all of your time teaching people how to use these wildly different UIs, and the rest trying to keep them from being stolen.

Not a step in the right direction, IMHO - a flashlight should be intuitive and obvious, without a training session.

Have to disagree with you, it is not uncommon to have a learning curve when technology changes or upgrades ie. Automobiles of the 1900's vs. 2000's computer operating systems are another example. When a technology becomes the standard and used by the masses it is defacto "intuitive". If we resisted technology and only used what felt natural we would still live in caves and hunt with clubs. JMO

 

[pdelagar]

I do not have a D10 or EX10, but based on what I've read and what I see here are my impressions:

These new lights are a good example of integrating technology and form factors as well as a simple interface at an accessible price

Is it changing the industry? Let's start defining what do we mean for industry. Do we refer to all the flashlight manufacturers? Do we refer only to those manufacturers that produce lights with a higher technological component? Should we define the industry in this case on the market? Do we mean niche markets or mass market?

Certainly, as McGizmo said, the LED technology has changed the industry, now almost all the manufacturers offer products using this technology. Is this the case with these new lights? I don't think so.

I usually don't post but I enjoy reading the comments of very knowledgeable people regarding new products, but I see the CPF community as a niche market where the manufacturers can present new technologies that maybe can reach the mass market.

Let's understand that this community represent the early adopters of technology, that does not mean that the mass market will assimilate the same technology at the same pace. I don't see a person going to Walmart or Target buying a programmable light (I may be wrong, though), but I think that at leaset part of the technology presented to this community will eventually pass to the mass consumer.

 

[Rzr800]

Edited per clarification by McGizmo

 

[half-watt]

Well, McGizmo...since my opinion/post is "above" your attempt here to sway forum membership into discarding it...who is "above" who now in your estimation.

by "above", he did *NOT* mean IMMEDIATELY above. "immediately above" would have referred to your fine Post. he was referring undoubtedly (in my mind at least) to the individual who registered under a new name for the purposes of trashing Yaesumofo. [Note: just remembered DM51's instructions in another Thread, i should have Posted that i reported that Post to the Admin/Moderators. i failed in that regard.]

IME (in my experience) of 30+ years in engineering, "above" vs. "immediately above" are phrases used in technical writing and have the meanings that i attempted to indicate in the paragraph immediately above.

had he meant you, he probably would have written something like "in the Post immediately above", or just "immediately above".

i hope this Post helps to clear up what i, for one, perceive as a simple misunderstanding.

 

[Jarl]

Well, McGizmo...since my opinion/post is "above" your attempt here to sway forum membership into discarding it...who is "above" who now in your estimation?

I think that I've just discovered a side of CPF that I really don't care for very much and likely stumbled upon the very reason that a good number of members that I don't see up here any more were 'ousted' in short order.

Read through the first page of the thread. Which post comes across as offensive, pointless and rude? (it's actually been removed, but it's quoted by illumination). It wasn't your post, in case that's what you think- there's nothing against helpful members of a forum making a contribution, though there is something against people registering a new account, flinging a baseless insult at a respected member of CPF and hiding behind internet anonymity.

 

[Rzr800]

Edited per clarification by McGizmo

 

[Unforgiven]

Administrative note:

A baiting post as well as some replies to that post have been removed.

 

[Paul6ppca]

I have read too many posts re D10 EX10 ,(mine is still lost in the mail,but a new one on the way)from what Ive read on the UI is it really that different from MR bulk lion cub/lion heart?Ramping using an MCU.I dont see it as revolutionary.Using a piston is a new twist though.
I am looking forward to using this light and comparing it to my NDI.


BTW has anyone tried a led swap to a soeul P4?

 

[McGizmo]

Rzr800,

Sorry for the confusion. Beyond your post qualifying along with 29 (or was it 30+ since the one intended, along with others, are now removed), I don't see how you could comprehend that my comment was directed at you?!? :shrug: However, it does bring to my mind your comprehension or attention to other posts in this thread and their content. Did you even read the post which prompted my comment?

Does "..contrive a new identity for a single meaningless and senseless post." apply to you in any possible way, manner or form?

Prior to my post here, you have already edited two posts, which I never got to read or see and you have stated that this was due to "clarification by McGizmo" ?!? I didn't clarify diddly squat!

This thread is now corrupt and portions won't make any sense to someone now visiting it. Bummer.

Are the Nitecore D10/Ex10 Lights Industry Changing?

No idea.

I do think these lights may be indicative of change on CPF and might change how others even approach CPF in regards to comprehension. I know I have a mild interest in these lights and yet simply refuse to read all that has been posted on them and in all of the various threads! Unfortunately it may be my loss as I may miss a real gem of insight or information lost in a sea of simply too much information and comment!

Am I in a position to be critical of you due to perceived lack of comprehension when I admit that knowingly, I have no plan to comprehend these lights myself or at least all that is being said about them? Probably not! :nana: