Can LED lights now throw at the same level as HID?

[XeRay]

I fly large aircraft and I can tell you that all of our HID landing and taxi lights have been replaced by LED landing lights and they throw allot more light out and use hardly any current.

I fly FAST aircraft too, that's a half truth at best. HID still out-throws LED and not all HID's or LED's are created equally. LUX values at a large distances, LED's cant match. Most LED's are very good for taxi purposes, for landing lights HID still punches out farther.
Which brands / models and sizes of LED Landing or Taxi lights have you flown behind ??

 

[XeRay]

Lemax lights are by the definition of the term, not production lights.

XeVision meets all of your requirements, we use only the CNC'd parts and batteries etc. from Lemax.
We use our own Proprietary Ballasts (military EMI/RFI grade) and Igniters, also offering high wattage rated bulbs.
We always have std. units available at all times with no waiting lists.
We sold close to 100 units last year.
We have been offering this product for more than 10 years.
.....

 

[idleprocess]

I fly FAST aircraft too, that's a half truth at best. HID still out-throws LED and not all HID's or LED's are created equally. LUX values at a large distances, LED's cant match. Most LED's are very good for taxi purposes, for landing lights HID still punches out farther.
Which brands / models and sizes of LED Landing or Taxi lights have you flown behind ??

These look to be standard on 737 NGs:

Not sure what other airliners use. An image search suggests that there are numerous LED drop-in replacements for incandescent form-factors.

Living under a flight path for DFW I see a lot of aircraft on approach at night and can claim with some confidence that incandescent lights are on the way out for airliners. Whether the blue-white beams of light I'm seeing most of the time are HID or LED is not something I can conclusively evaluate, but when they're a ways off and I'm in the primary beam cone the spectrum resembles white LED to my eyes.

 

[XeRay]

These look to be standard on 737 NGs: Not sure what other airliners use. An image search suggests that there are numerous LED drop-in replacements for incandescent form-factors.

Living under a flight path for DFW I see a lot of aircraft on approach at night and can claim with some confidence that incandescent lights are on the way out for airliners. Whether the blue-white beams of light I'm seeing most of the time are HID or LED is not something I can conclusively evaluate, but when they're a ways off and I'm in the primary beam cone the spectrum resembles white LED to my eyes.

A lot of that change to LED is not due to only performance benefits compared to incandescents, but greatly for aesthetics and the ability to fit LED luminaries into a more "creative location" and shape, not stuck with mostly round form factors as traditional and most HID. The same styling as much of what's being done cosmetically today on high end cars.

With the very significant heat management issues of high powered LED's and the power and cooling requirements for such, bulb Lumens per watt is still higher on higher powered HID than on High powered LED including sustained FULL output and active cooling power requirements.
For a true continuous or long run time output level, high powered LED's must have active cooling to prevent significant dimming.

Example 75 watt HID offers about 8500+ bulb lumens. A 110 (total) watt LED Landing light package with active cooling will produce under 10,000 Lumens (again not including optics losses), thats about 91 Lumens per watt.
75 watt HID is about 100 bulb lumens per watt including ballast efficiency losses. 50 watt HID is also about 100 Lumens per watt, including ballast efficiency losses.
When including everything, apples to apples, HID is still about 10% more efficient than HIGH powered LED lighting packages.

 

[search_and_rescue]

I've relegated all my LED flashlights to pest control and plant growth. My Acebeam K75 cannot light up an El Monte Airport hangar building direct line at the end of Arcadia wash. That was the moment I realized LED's still are not meant for throw. Haha! lovecpf

 

[idleprocess]

A lot of that change to LED is not due to only performance benefits compared to incandescents, but greatly for aesthetics and the ability to fit LED luminaries into a more "creative location" and shape, not stuck with mostly round form factors as traditional and most HID. The same styling as much of what's being done cosmetically today on high end cars.

With the very significant heat management issues of high powered LED's and the power and cooling requirements for such, bulb Lumens per watt is still higher on higher powered HID than on High powered LED including sustained FULL output and active cooling power requirements.
For a true continuous or long run time output level, high powered LED's must have active cooling to prevent significant dimming.

Example 75 watt HID offers about 8500+ bulb lumens. A 110 (total) watt LED Landing light package with active cooling will produce under 10,000 Lumens (again not including optics losses), thats about 91 Lumens per watt (the same as only 35 watt HID). 75 watt HID is about 100 bulb lumens per watt including ballast efficiency losses. 50 watt HID is also about 100 Lumens per watt, including ballast efficiency losses.
When including everything, apples to apples, HID is still about 10% more efficient than HIGH powered LED lighting packages.

Unlike GA aircraft, airliners likely have volume to spare for active cooling - they've surely got the power margins. A 10% difference in efficiency suggests that other merits will be determining factors in which system gets selected for new designs or retrofits. LED is still seeing bumps in lm/W efficiency at higher operating temperatures which will likely obviate the need for active cooling and the selection criteria may boil down to design flexibility, maintenance, and the greater difficulty 2D LED die presents to collimation relative to pseudo 1D HID arc for long-throw applications.

 

[justanotherguy]

Ahh that makes sense. Can't the BLF GT90 do like 1-2 miles?

Any recommendation for a very good thrower HID that is easily available right now? I have the ebay one but looking for something more powerful.

My GT90 looks decent at 1.05 miles.. I doubt itll look like much at 2.0 though

 

[Monocrom]

I wish there was a light like the Acebeam w30 but with a lot more lumen output. Its like 500, id love if it was like 5000 !

Maybe in another 5 years, it'll happen.

 

[search_and_rescue]

I tested the Acebeam K75 again tonight. There is a halo around the defined hotspot. That halo is what causes the beam to not be able to hit the El Monte Airport hangar building located directly 0.6 or 0.7 mile or so "downstream" the Arcadia Wash. What I am saying is that the hotspot becomes like a flood beam at its tip. Yes it throws far but at its tip it is not tight enough of a defined hotspot to lay bright light on anything beyond 500 meters. The beam floods out before it reaches the end of the wash, 0.6 or 0.7 mile or so distant. lovecpf

 

[Gigaslux]

some of the Lemax and Polarion lights can still output higher continuous output. But LED's are getting perilously close to that threshold.

Yes, but not with a continuous output. LED lights have a Turbo run ridiculous

 

[nitebrite]

I wanted a lep. Problem is it is not legal in many places and more coming, Plus get caught pointing it in the sky. Even accidentally. Looking at some big trouble. I prefer things that are a safer bet. Put it this way. I have concealed carry. So a can of worms I would rather not open. Plus I find the beam too narrow to be of any use to me. Another thing, in many instances given the terrain who can see ten or more miles? I do not mean to spoil the party but personally I am very happy with a 1/2 mile wide beam. That is also a small, cool light. I have some of the monsters, MF05 ETC. They do not see much use by me. Mostly a novelty. I take some thing handheld close to a million cd. That is a modified light of course. I am most pleased with that right now though. I am just mentioning how I feel. I by no means meant to rain on anyone's parade. I just like moderation.

 

[orbital]

+

For overall quality & performance..

Acebeam + SBT90.2 in multi cell configuration is very strong







what HID?

 

[richbuff]

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For overall quality & performance..

Acebeam + SBT90.2 in multi cell configuration is very strong

I have been reapeatedly asking Acebeam for multiple SBT90.2, but they have been as silent as a fish.

HID versus LED: Consider size, weight, power, throw, runtime, and other criteria, then buy what you want. The path that I took is K70, TN42, K75, MF05; and MT90 ordered. When I arrive at the point that I want more runtime, I will jump into HID. For me, maximum throw/most light on furthest target is the MF05.

 

[orbital]

+

What about your GT94s?

 

[richbuff]

+

What about your GT94s?

GT94 has more power than HID and MF05, but not as much throw.

 

[orbital]

GT94 has more power than HID and MF05, but not as much throw.

+

You'll have to get a gun safe for your throwers,:naughty:

btw: I picked up a Osram KW CSLPM1.TG mounted on 20mm DTP copper ($8)
Looking to install it in my Catapult V2, I believe it's 3A at 8.4V,, so that'll push the Osram* hard, but I bet it'll do 1.5km


*Newer Osram units are rather rugged

 

[richbuff]

+

You'll have to get a gun safe for your throwers,:naughty:

btw: ... ... ... ...

I don't keep my lights in a gun safe. Instead, I keep my lights in a 3,250 pound TRTL30X6 ISM Super Treasury diamond vault.

Not shown are MT90vn coming soon, HK90 coming tomorrow and HK90vn on my hip. Five dollar bill is shown for size reference.

Shown are My lights.

 

[Magio]

I don't know where the idea that LED can't throw as far as HID comes from but everybody that has ever stated such never provided any proof that its true. There is however abundant evidence that LEDs are quite capable of meeting or exceeding HIDs for short durations of time. And with the release of the BLF GT94 and the Astrolux MF05, it has been proven that the technology is there for LED to meet or exceed HID in both lumens and throw for extended periods of time too. When you look at the pics below it is quite easy to see that the LED light easily has more lumens and intensity than the HID light.

Firefoxes FF4S 65 Watt HID
DSC_4995 by Imagio X1

BLF GT94
DSC_4983 by Imagio X1

 

[BVH]

It would be very helpful to post beam shots that represent what you see. I've taken hundreds if not a thousand beam shots and not even my 1600 Watt Nightsun "disappears" a green lawn as in your GT94 shot above. It takes a 1000 Watt plus short Arc to produce a beam with that intensity. Maybe both pics are well overexposed, I don't know but the bottom one is not representative of real life.

 

[Magio]

It would be very helpful to post beam shots that represent what you see. I've taken hundreds if not a thousand beam shots and not even my 1600 Watt Nightsun "disappears" a green lawn as in your GT94 shot above. It takes a 1000 Watt plus short Arc to produce a beam with that intensity. Maybe both pics are well overexposed, I don't know but the bottom one is not representative of real life.

I agree, but when you are comparing 2 lights, and not changing the camera's exposure between pics, and one light is significantly brighter than the other, that's hard to do. The dim one is just about always going to be under exposed and the bright one over-exposed. I don't know how to solve that problem.