Lumintop Tool Ti (Nichia 219BT, 1xAAA, Titanium) Review: RUNTIMES, BEAMSHOTS and more

[tops2]

Re: Lumintop Tool Ti (Nichia 219BT, 1xAAA, Titanium) Review: RUNTIMES, BEAMSHOTS ...

I wonder also if there's an internal cap/battery in the tail cap. Maybe if while disconnected, keep pressing the button to see if there's any switching current? Or if left there for extended time for any leakage current to drain (if any). Otherwise, it did seem like marketing speak when first reading the comment about electronic switch statement on Lumintops site.

 

[selfbuilt]

Re: Lumintop Tool Ti (Nichia 219BT, 1xAAA, Titanium) Review: RUNTIMES, BEAMSHOTS ...

contact the probes of your dmm in the uA or mA setting to the tailcap
click the switch and try again.

I have a couple electronic switches for sunwayman v10r. They work as you describe. I can click on and off 20 times with no battery connected and they will remember their state. There is an internal capacitor that charges up to power the switch.
Perhaps after a while or a lot of clicking they will stop functioning until charged up again.

Good points. I've just tried taking a current reading across the bare switch contacts, and get a -0.01uA current when open and 0.04uA current when the switch closed. So there is clearly something in there providing state memory. A small capacitor would make sense.

I will update the review, and add in the standby drain I detected with the switch in the off position.

 

[Crazyeddiethefirst]

Thanks for another excellent review Selfbuilt, I ordered mine a while ago just based on my experience with my other Lumintop Tools(Twisty, Al & Cu). It is so awesome the consistency of your reviews and being able to learn from post review questions-this is what brought me to CPF & I'm still here!(OK, I admit to hypocrisy-I joined "the other" forum recently,because they had some awesome lights(copper X5, X6, S6SE, CPFItalia Cometa) just to name a few), but your reviews always seem to give me the critical info I need as well as a common sense description of the important points with the science & graphs to back it up.

 

[kreisl]

i started a tint comparison thread, some might find it helpful
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...w-Preon-Tool-Ti-Ti5T-K18-SS-A-layman-s-review

 

[selfbuilt]

It is so awesome the consistency of your reviews and being able to learn from post review questions-this is what brought me to CPF & I'm still here!

Thanks for that. And I agree - the post-review discussions are what make CPF particularly valuable. I hadn't come across an electronic switch a capacitor before, so it was good to hear from the experience of members here. It certainly had me a little puzzled until the discussion unfolded.

 

[kreisl]

i don't have access these days to my unit

i think it's not a capacitor, no way

it's a tiny battery inside, you can check

doesn't matter anyway whether battery or capacitor

switch works fine, it's likable switch imo

 

[joechina]

So is it possible to fix a magnet at the tail cap? I would love the ability to stick that thing to metal.
JoeChina

 

[selfbuilt]

i think it's not a capacitor, no way
it's a tiny battery inside, you can check
doesn't matter anyway whether battery or capacitor
switch works fine, it's likable switch imo

Unfortunately, I can't access my switch to verify the internals - none of my tweezers are strong enough to unscrew the switch (i.e., it is in there too tight, and holes on the contact board are too small). :shrug:

 

[write2dgray]

Same problem here, I gave it a pretty good effort. Quite probably threadlocked in. May need heat to solve this mystery.

 

[Thetasigma]

My poor tweezers have made the ultimate sacrifice...I opened mine up since it was DOA for the switch though it does turn on now. Still only has Low-Medium-Medium though, no high mode.

Anyhow, definitely an electronic switch. The titanium button sits on a silicone rubber pad that seals the tail, and bumps the electronic switch off to the side. Looks more like a battery than a capacitor though.

 

[KITROBASKIN]

Bravo Sir

Any way we can determine if it is a battery or capacitor?

 

[gottawearshades]

Stupid question: it would be a *rechargeable* battery if not a capacitor?

 

[sticktodrum]

Likely.

I had one DOA and one with no high mode. An hour each sitting with a full Eneloop Pro, and they both function perfectly.

 

[gunga]

Nice! Yes. The Sunwayman v10r ti e-switches are the same. I think they are similar in construction.

 

[selfbuilt]

My poor tweezers have made the ultimate sacrifice...I opened mine up since it was DOA for the switch though it does turn on now. Still only has Low-Medium-Medium though, no high mode.

Well done sir - thanks for the pics. :thumbsup: And yes, that definitely looks like a battery (presumably rechargeable).

I had one DOA and one with no high mode. An hour each sitting with a full Eneloop Pro, and they both function perfectly.

Very interesting. I noticed some issues on mine where at times there seemed to be no high mode, or it was reduced in output (i.e., light still cycled through all 3 modes, but there didn't seem much visual difference between Med and Hi). Thorough cleaning of the threads seemed to help ... but I do recall noticing the output slowly rising in my lightbox on one occasion. Since the light has been sitting without a battery for a couple of days now, I'll do some more tests to see if I can elicit this behaviour again.

I'm thinking this may also explain why I noticed a diminishing drain when connecting the tailcap and battery without the head (i.e., perhaps it drains the AA battery faster initially). I'll experiment tomorrow and report back.

 

[Ladd]

Nice! Yes. The Sunwayman v10r ti e-switches are the same. I think they are similar in construction.

Now that's interesting.

One begins to wonder about the network of relationships between the numerous overseas light fabricators, parts suppliers, brands, and distributors.

 

[Thetasigma]

After a day of sitting the light appears to be functioning correctly now, so a rechargeable cell makes sense.
Curious how the circuit works on this because it functioned properly when shorted but not when the tailswitch was connected initially.

 

[sticktodrum]

I imagine the driver works as if there were a regular mechanical clicky, but they just used an electronic on/off switch at the tail.

 

[selfbuilt]

After a day of sitting the light appears to be functioning correctly now, so a rechargeable cell makes sense.
Curious how the circuit works on this because it functioned properly when shorted but not when the tailswitch was connected initially.

After further testing, I think I have the answer.

The tailcap switch is likely using a rechargeable battery - and one that must be fully charged for all the light output modes to work correctly. This rechargeable battery is recharged (slowly) when a AAA battery is inserted in the light and all contacts are made (i.e., even with the light off). Because the switch is electronic, there is a constant standby drain on the switch's rechargeable battery. Only with an AAA battery installed in the light is the rechargeable battery in the switch able to keep itself fully charged. In my testing to date, there is a fluctuating standby drain on the AAA battery when connected to the switch but not the head (typically ~2~30uA), which is presumably required to keep the switch rechargeable battery fully charged.

When the light is stored for a period of time with no AAA battery installed, the rechargeable switch battery slowly drops in charge (due to the electronic nature of the switch, with its own standby current draining its rechargeable battery). After ~4 days with no activity (and no AAA battery installed), I measured the initial standby drain when an AAA is re-installed at ~50uA. At this point, the Hi output level was significantly reduced: while Lo and Med were normal, Hi was ~45% of max output initially (although this recovered to ~55% of of max output after 1 minute of runtime).

Now, ~50uA standby is not enough on its own to explain that drop in output, so I can only presume it takes some time for the rechargeable battery to build up enough charge to allow all the modes to function properly. Note the light always functions properly if you short the base instead of using the tailcap - it is clearly the tailcap that is limiting max output. Based on anecdotal reports so far, it sounds like if you let the switch sit alone long enough, the Med and Lo modes could be affected - right down to the light not turning on at all. But if you let it sit for an hour with an AAA battery inside the light with all contacts made, that is enough time to fully recharge the switch rechargeable battery, and give you all modes again.

I'm still testing, but that's how it looks so far. :shrug:

 

[jon_slider]

it's a tiny battery inside

rechargeable battery

thank you gentlemen!

mine should be here any day now