Some Fenix brand 16340 Lithium Ion battery testing in the HDS

[jon_slider]

it starts to flash before it goes out completely

that is normal HDS behavior when the LiIon drops to 3.0v

the videos are not HDS lights, and they are painful..

 

[desert.snake]

that is normal HDS behavior when the LiIon drops to 3.0v

I meant battery Eagletac. It starts flashing before disconnecting, even on a SF 6P, which has only a P60 xenon lamp.


thank you for reminding me about loudness, I added a warning

 

[jon_slider]

I meant battery Eagletac.

in an HDS your Eagletac battery flashes at what voltage?

 

[RCS1300]

Totally understand your desire not to bother Henry

one way or another, I hope you eliminate the resets that are evidenced by the enabled locator flash turning itself on.

Thanks for the well wishes. Over three days of usage with the same battery, one of my lights seems to be stepping down in lumen brightness sooner than I would have anticipated. (I realize this sounds like the Power Supply issue from the other thread but I am still not convinced, yet).

Starting last night on both HDS lights mentioned above I am running a parasitic drain test which is basically performing a load test and voltage test on the batteries (both new Duracell primary batteries) and leaving them in the lights for ten days of non-use. On day 10, I will perform the same load (ZTS-MBT-1) and voltage tests on the batteries and hopefully see a very minor or non-existent power drain on each of the batteries.

If anyone knows how to do a live parasitic drain test, please let me know. I imagine it is using an amp meter to connect the positive battery to the head and a wire jumper to connect the aluminum head to the aluminum base. Is that right?

 

[desert.snake]

in an HDS your Eagletac battery flashes at what voltage?

I cannot insert this battery into the HDS and check that it is too long. When I have a body of 18650, I will do it. I just showed in this example that there are protection boards that do not go out during overdischarge, like most protected batteries, these boards begin to interrupt the current themselves with some flicker frequency. What can be perceived as a HDS reset to factory settings. If the condition is met - that flicker battery response threshold is higher than 3 volts (when the built-in HDS protection is activated).

I will try to find the same batteries as in @RCS1300 and check them for flicker. But this may be a deviation in a particular batch of batteries.

There is a second possibility - the response threshold of the HDS in this case is below 3 volts and lower than the response threshold of the built-in battery protection.

 

[jon_slider]

one of my lights seems to be stepping down in lumen brightness sooner than I would have anticipated.

I would measure the voltage of the battery
My HDS begins to step down at 3.4v, and goes into minimum mode flashing at 3.0v
It is good to recharge LiIon when it gets below 3.6v
It is not bad to recharge LiIon even when its at 3.9v

I cannot insert this battery into the HDS
...
the response threshold of the built-in battery protection.

Im only interested in discussing HDS lights here.
Overdischarge protection circuits in LiIon batteries kick in below 2.7v
HDS flashes minimum mode at 3.0v

 

[desert.snake]

Im only interested in discussing HDS lights here.
Overdischarge protection circuits in LiIon batteries kick in below 2.7v
HDS flashes minimum mode at 3.0v

Absolutely right In case everything is done correctly and works correctly. But in this case, something is not going the way it should be.

My goal was to show that some types of protection boards have blinking properties that can lead to a flashlight reset. I use other lights that do not have HDS functions, only to show this possibility of flashing on the battery. If I had a separate LED, I would wire it to the battery to show it, but I do not have it. In this example, the main thing is the battery, do not look at the names of what used to discharge this battery before the battery protection threshold. Guess is that the "possibly" Fenix protection board works like a protection board on Eagletac battery, ie also has some blinking. And therefore a reset occurs. But to exclude this scenario, we must place the Fenix battery in any non-automatic flashlight and discharge it before the battery protection board trips.

 

[RCS1300]

I would measure the voltage of the battery
My HDS begins to step down at 3.4v, and goes into minimum mode flashing at 3.0v
It is good to recharge LiIon when it gets below 3.6v
It is not bad to recharge LiIon even when its at 3.9v

My HDS, nichia 219b 4000K R9050, was stepping down after two or three very short, 40 second each, uses of a 4.20v freshly charged Fenix rechargeable battery over a three day period. Way, way too fast to begin the step down.

My 10 day long parasitic drain tests, started last night, are using Duracell CR123a primary batteries beginning at 3.26 volts each and 100% capacity as measured by my ZTS - MBT-1 battery load tester. I did perform the reset before replacing rechargeable with Primary batteries. We will see in 10 days if the voltage and capacity of these primaries is still the same or very close to the same.

 

[peter yetman]

DS, I think you're onto something, thanks for doing the research.
I loved the Fairy Story - more please.
P

 

[jon_slider]

My HDS, nichia 219b 4000K R9050, was stepping down after two or three very short, 40 second each, uses of a 4.20v freshly charged Fenix rechargeable battery over a three day period. Way, way too fast to begin the step down.

In this case you are not reporting activation of the locator beacon, from an unintended reset.

imho
Low battery capacity will just lead to stepping down sooner than normal, it wont reset the light.

If you dont own a meter that can measure the capacity of the battery...

I propose a test to see if the voltage drops more than on another battery.
Do a 30 minute run on Maximum, and note the voltage after that.

Repeat with another battery for reference.

imho
Battery capacity is a separate issue from an intermittent power supply that causes the light to reset.


This must be very frustrating for you.. it pains me that you are struggling to figure out what is causing your light to reset and turn on the locator beacon.

if it was me, I would send the light to Henry to see if the following applies:

It is the power supply, and won't fix itself. Sometimes the elf just needs a good beating... or replacing.

I think Henry would be happy to help you confirm that the issue is or is not a power supply problem. That would be definitive. Instead of speculating about firmware 2.18 and Fenix Batteries.

 

[desert.snake]

Hurray, I caught this moment! I took the battery and inserted it into the luminous resistor hold device. I waited for about an hour when the protection board starts working, which does not completely shut off, like an Olight battery, but begins to report that there is little light : **You look here!! I'll turn off now, but first I will show you a strobe light!!!**

This holder of the luminous resistor in its design has no electronic components, except the luminous resistor. That is what we see, this behavior is only and only the battery protection board itself. Unfortunately I do not have a multimeter to measure the voltage on the battery.

I also decided to put this battery in two other light-emitting diode holders that do not have advanced functions like the HDS. One of them showed no blinking of light, the second showed blinking of light.

Precisely because of this potential opportunity, it is desirable to place the Fenix battery in the luminous resistor holder and detect or not detect such behavior.

This video closer to the middle (02:46) again contains a small strobe, so do not turn on those who suffer from epilepsy or have sensitivity to flickering light.



My late grandfather suffered from epilepsy, I know how dangerous it can be. It's good that jon_slider reminded me of this.

 

[RCS1300]

if it was me, I would send the light to Henry to see if the following applies:


I think Henry would be happy to help you confirm that the issue is or is not a power supply problem. That would be definitive. Instead of speculating about firmware 2.18 and Fenix Batteries.

I am not ready to contact Henry yet. At this time I can only confirm that the manufacturing quality control of the Fenix rechargeable batteries with a protection circuit is poor and that my resets may very likely be caused by these Fenix batteries since the resets happened in two different HDS lights using the Fenix batteries.

Future testing plan

My next step is to rule out a parasitic drain, in the next ten days, using CR123a primary batteries (I know it may be unrelated to resets but the early lumen step down I experienced with the Fenix rechargeable batteries was more concerning than the random resets).

After that, I will exclusively run CR123a primaries in these two lights for up to two months, or the first reset experienced. If I do not experience any parasitic drain or resets with CR123a primary batteries after this period of time and tests there is no need to contact Henry again.

 

[bigburly912]

Im only interested in discussing HDS

You may be but some of us would like more Info as to what is going on.

 

[jon_slider]

You may be but some of us would like more Info as to what is going on.

I realize you dont like to stay on topic ;-)


I DO like to be ON Topic:
Some Fenix brand 16340 Lithium Ion battery testing in the HDS

so to be relevant
the tests should be done in an HDS,
with the benefit of a voltmeter

 

[thermal guy]

Well that escalated pretty quick. Can't we all just get along here.were all one big happy family are we not.

 

[bigburly912]

I realize you dont like to stay on topic ;-)


I DO like to be ON Topic:
Some Fenix brand 16340 Lithium Ion battery testing in the HDS

so to be relevant
the tests should be done in an HDS,
with the benefit of a voltmeter

So you don't like variables and outliers in testing? And I can read. You don't need to quote constantly.

 

[Hogokansatsukan]

It is mostly up to the OP how much he wants to stay on topic... I understand this as I will sometimes focus things like a laser... other times, threads wander... which is good and bad.

This issue (Fenix Rechargeable Batteries, not off topic discussion) has already been discussed with Henry, and yes, it is the batteries. The protection circuit is shutting off for a millisecond after the light is turned on, then the protection circuit kicks in again letting juice flow. They are cobalt oxide batteries that require a protection circuit to be safe, and those circuits are shutting the battery down during turn on, which causes the erratic behavior. This has been seen before in cobalt oxide non AW batteries. The protection circuit is what is causing the issue.

Thread closed unless RCS1300 requests it to be opened again. This is his thread. He can decide if things are off topic or not and where and what he wants to discuss. If I want to see bickering, I'll go see my girlfriend's teenagers.

 

[Hogokansatsukan]

Closed unless RCS1300 wants it reopened.