Why are there no good lanterns out there?

[Richwouldnt]

Per the reviews on Amazon with 72 of 227 reviews, or about 1/3, of the rechargeable battery being one star the CPX6 battery is a disaster. Based on voltage readings fully charged this is apparently a three series cells SLA battery pack and they are notorious for dying on the shelf unless regularly charged. A VERY POOR choice of battery technology to power a lantern that is likely to see seasonal and/or emergency use patterns. Far better to get a set of D size NiMH high capacity LSD batteries or two sets for this and a D cell NiMH charger.

 

[martinaee]

If there is one company I WANT to see make a good lantern it's Fenix. They've been doing headlamps so long and other camping/caving type stuff.

Imagine maybe 2 different lanterns using 1 or more XM-L2s: Maybe one using 2 18650's and then one using 4. If they made it pretty massive (weight wise) they could have TK61 output in a neutral tint and great diffusion. I really hope they do something like this in the future. Everyone these days is making super tiny lanterns, but I want to see a pretty big one so that led heat isn't an issue and also so that the actual diffusion element is pretty big causing less intensity glare when using it in a room or outdoors.

 

[Richwouldnt]

Fenix could definitely do it. Convince them there is a adequate market for it.

Per listings from Target and REI the Coleman CPX6 is verified to be a SLA battery. The Target listing in the header says NiMH but in the technical information lists it as a SLA technology battery and REI merely says Lead Acid under battery type in the specifications listing. IMO a totally stupid decision on Coleman's part as they have chosen a high maintenance and low long term reliability battery technology for a application with seasonal and/or emergency use patterns. Too many people will follow a "put it away until we need it" use pattern which practically guarantees a dead battery when needed. Unfortunately I mean DEAD as in no longer capable of being recharged in many instances. This is directly reflected in the Amazom product reviews noted above in my first post. Definitely NOT IDIOT PROOF!

 

[Poppy]

Fenix could definitely do it. Convince them there is a adequate market for it.

Per listings from Target and REI the Coleman CPX6 is verified to be a SLA battery

Kmart sells a NorthWest Territory spiral tube fluorescent rechargeable lantern with a 6V SLA. I got it about two years ago. IIRC it will run for about 5 hours. When I bought it, I noted that there were a number of complaints about it not lighting, nor holding a charge. The same for the CPX6 battery products. Yes I recall the CPX6 being a 6V SLA battery.

Before I discovered 18650 batteries, and lights, I bought four extra 6V SLAs so that I would have redundant power, and the ability to charge them from my car if needed. Except for the fact that the batteries need to be periodically charged, I'd give them to my father in law. So for me, I guess they are in my lights to loan out during an outage.

I currently have the batteries in an electric Razor Scooter.

 

[Poppy]

The XM-L2 LED offers .... 1198 lumens at 116 lumens-per-watt efficacy at 3 A, 25°C.

The XB-D White LED delivers 136 lumens per watt in cool white (6000 K) or 105 lumens per watt in warm white (3000 K), both at 350 mA and 85°C.

The above is taken from Cree's site.

It appears that the XB-D is more efficient than the XM-L2 at low drive points. Low drive points are easier on batteries. I don't know how much that matters to SLAs, or Li-Ions, but it is important to Alkalines and Carbon-Zinc batteries.

A few days ago, I bought a $14.97 Ozark Trail lantern @ Walmart. It is similar in appearance to the Siege, and UST. It has a single XB-D emitter cool white. On three D cells, I imagine that it will give similar performance in lumens, and run-times to the Siege, and UST three D lanterns. None of the above are regulated. Since they are not regulated, they can get crazy long run-times, with continually reducing output. this may be great for disaster length power outages, but IMO, not so good for a weekend campout, or a one or two day power outage.

The relatively new Energizer lantern with light fusion technology that zespectre did a nice review on, really is a nice lantern, for a number of reasons. First, the light starts out nicely diffused. Second, it is regulated, and third, the output is variable.

The biggest problem, with lanterns is the amount of glare. It has been many years since I used a petrol lantern, but I recall having to approach it with my hand in front of my eyes.

In my mind, a low glare lantern that emits a fair amount of diffuse light is a GOOD lantern. If the light also has a reflector so that it can be directed somewhat, that's a plus. If it is regulated, that is another plus. Neutral white option, another plus.

The energizer meets 4 out of 5 (it doesn't offer a neutral white).

It seems that this thread presupposes that a super-high output lantern is a GOOD lantern. I don't know, I think that multiple lower output lanterns might be better for lighting an area.

 

[Phaserburn]

Poppy, I agree with you. I think it's a matter of how large a surface area is devoted to the light emission. Bare leds = terrible glare while large fluoros (just for ex.) = less glare. That's why the Energizers do so well; they make it appear that light is being emitted from a much larger area.

Thing is, a low current draw will allow D cells to run a long time, that's true. But I think you'll see that regulation really isn't necessary for these; remember that at lower current draws, the led is at it's most efficient, so the drop off in output is very gradual and often not really noticeable until a great many hours have passed. To me, these lanterns are the reason to be for Alk D cells. Very surprised to hear the Ozark has an XB-D, though.

 

[martinaee]

You guys are absolutely right. I am fine with multiple smaller emitters being used and in a lot of ways think it's better as it spreads out the light more evenly. I do want neutral emitters to be used though. It's one of the only flaws in the Seige in my opinion.

I think I'm going to experiement and see what kind of enclosure I can make as a DIY lantern so that I can set my E50 down in the middle. With the right diffusion and direction it would make a great lantern. The problem of course is quality of build.

It's fairly ghetto in comparison to nice lanterns, but you know what makes a really nice diffuser and can act as a lantern? A used white milk jug. With a high powered light you could also put the light upside down into it if it's filled with clean water and it would act as a great heat sink as well. You need a light that won't auto drop down after a certain time though. I wish my E50 had a 500 lumen mode for that reason...

DIY diffusion solutions work well if you are just staying in your home with a lantern and want a long term power outage solution but not as much outdoors where you need it to be one solid piece.

 

[Poppy]

<BIG SNIP>

It seems that this thread presupposes that a super-high output lantern is a GOOD lantern. I don't know, I think that multiple lower output lanterns might be better for lighting an area.

You guys are absolutely right. I am fine with multiple smaller emitters being used and in a lot of ways think it's better as it spreads out the light more evenly. I do want neutral emitters to be used though. It's one of the only flaws in the Seige in my opinion.

martinaee,
I think you misunderstood me.

Perhaps a FEW strategically placed lanterns of 150-300 lumens is better than ONE super glaring 1200-2000 lumen lantern.

 

[mcnair55]

If i had the chance go camping for some reason i would take one of the modern tilting builders lamps angled upwards,they recharge off the mains and builders vehicle,they produce good usable light and the footprint is no bigger than about 9" x 9",the builder can say plaster a wall when mains hook up is not possible so more than adequate to mess around in a tent.

 

[Poppy]

I think I'm going to experiement and see what kind of enclosure I can make as a DIY lantern so that I can set my E50 down in the middle. With the right diffusion and direction it would make a great lantern. The problem of course is quality of build.

It's fairly ghetto in comparison to nice lanterns, but you know what makes a really nice diffuser and can act as a lantern? A used white milk jug. With a high powered light you could also put the light upside down into it if it's filled with clean water and it would act as a great heat sink as well. .

I played a little bit.
Here are some observations:
I used a pair of pine wood wedges. With the hot spot aimed at the point of the wedge so that it spreads out onto the wedge, that spread out the glare a lot. Within reason, the farther away the LED is from the wedges, the hot spot is already spread out, so your lantern may be a little BIG. Also, there should be another diffuser (like the milk carton) to capture the corona of the light.

The neat thing is that the natural color of the pine wood changed the cool light from the flashlight to a more neutral color.

 

[Poppy]

Heck, that Coleman looks great! Ordered!

They say they are using a special phosphor called intematix to control color temp. I thought that was just sales make believe, but intematix is a real company and the product looks interesting.

Poppy, I agree with you. I think it's a matter of how large a surface area is devoted to the light emission. Bare leds = terrible glare while large fluoros (just for ex.) = less glare. That's why the Energizers do so well; they make it appear that light is being emitted from a much larger area.

Phaserburn,
That Coleman looks interesting, but I imagine that unless those phosphers work like magic, that the light puts out a LOT OF GLARE on high.

Did you get the lantern?
Thoughts?

 

[mcnair55]

You can always buy a proper Welsh Miners lamp.

 

[Phaserburn]

Actually, the glare isn't as bad as you'd think. The entire inner diffuser with the intematix on it appears to be the emitter, making the surface area tolerable. It's a go for broke super bright lantern, and I use 4xnimh Ds to get full advantage of it on high. I posted the current draws on another thread.

 

[angerdan]

Since Fenix has brought the CL25R and CL30R, this thread could use an update