Why no 10W Cree RB led?

[anuragwap]

The XM-L goes upto 3A. Then why no royal blue version of it?

 

[AnAppleSnail]

I guess there hasn't been much demand for it? My very limited understanding of the situation is that Cree's dies are among the best, and their phosphor deposition is among the best, giving them rather efficient white LEDs. If they sold off their high-power blues for any mook to put in a remote-phosphor application before they get their patents in, well they'd lose money.

But I think it's mostly demand. You can always tack together 7 XT-Es.

 

[blasterman]

Bridgelux won't do it either. I've asked them.

The alternatives aren't very efficient, especially the generic arrays floating around Ebay. Luminous / Phlatlight newer models might be the only solution.

 

[idleprocess]

They don't want to add another SKU for what they see as a niche application? Flashlight OEM's probably bidding up the price for their premium dies well over what the fixed-lighting guys will pay and buying all that Cree can make.

Bleeding-edge efficiency likely isn't so important for the applications where they'd want blue LED's anyway.

 

[anuragwap]

Just noticed that Future has made 10W royal blue Luxeon M available (in MOQ 1, no idea about the flux bin or price though). Its a quad die emitter, not quite what I wanted. Still kind of a unique product among royal blue LEDs. Typical performance is quite good, 4.2W output at 11.2V and 700mA, binned at 85degC.

EDIT: They are effectively gone, the MOQ is 500. Future doesn't like small volume purchasers anymore.

 

[WeLight]

There are multiple suppliers of multi die Royal Blue emitters

 

[2xTrinity]

I guess there hasn't been much demand for it? My very limited understanding of the situation is that Cree's dies are among the best, and their phosphor deposition is among the best, giving them rather efficient white LEDs. If they sold off their high-power blues for any mook to put in a remote-phosphor application before they get their patents in, well they'd lose money.

But I think it's mostly demand. You can always tack together 7 XT-Es.

Probably this. They want to keep the best blue LEDs for white LED applications, or their own remote phosphor products.

For white LEDs to be emitting over 200 lumens per watt, the radiometric efficiency of those blue dies has to be 75%+ whereas the efficiency of royal blue dies for sale based on the datasheets is way under 50%. This means Cree is internally binning their LEDs and selling the ones that don't make the cut to be sold as whites, as royal blue.

In applications where I've used royal blue LEDs ay work -- such as photobleaching / curing photopolymers -- efficiency of the process is more or less irrelevant so long as I get light at the right wavelength.

 

[anuragwap]

For white LEDs to be emitting over 200 lumens per watt, the radiometric efficiency of those blue dies has to be 75%+ whereas the efficiency of royal blue dies for sale based on the datasheets is way under 50%.

The situation is not so bad, both Luxeon M and top bin(Q04) XT-E royal blue LEDs are 53% efficient at 700mA. The 200lm/W is to some extent a marketing hype by CREE, since its only possible at 100mA. (The Luxeon M typically is 69% efficient at 100mA.)

 

[VegasF6]

Would ledengin LZ4-00DB00 be helpful? It's a 10W 460nm led, "dental blue" they call it.
But I notice the Lux-M has wavelength of 445-460,Cree 450 - 465.
http://www.ledengin.com/files/products/LZ4/LZ4-00DB00.pdf

 

[croled]

There are also Luxen K royal blue arrays: LXK0-PR04-0008 and LXK0-PR04-0016 with typical efficiency of 62% and maximum efficiency of 71+%,at 350mA,85C,highest numbers I've seen for royal blue.Over 20W of pure light is possible at 1A and efficiency of 50% in real conditions.

 

[anuragwap]

Thank you very much for the find. The 0016 part has MOQ 4 and I might order some, it has around 75% efficiency at 100mA.

Anyways, the reason for starting this thread was to get a single die 10W RB emitter like XM-L which can be driven from a single 18650 without fancy boost drivers. But no manufacturer is offering that.

 

[bshanahan14rulz]

Why don't you look for a wavelength of blue? Royal blue doesn't mean anything specific, does it? What wavelength are you looking for? Should be lots of offerings for ~450nm.... The XML Color has 4 dice, but apparently the lowest wavelength bin for blue is K at 450-455nm @ 350mA.

edit: Luxeon defines royal blue for their Luxeon M as 445-460nm.

Also, to get 10W of output power, you'd need probably three Luxeon M, 11 or 12 rebels, or if you need higher power density, 6 newer generation laser emitters.

Also, with white LEDs, 10W means 10W electrical input.

With direct injection lasers, you can drift their wavelength by a nm or two by cooling them actively.

10W in, @ what seems to be the average efficacy of 50%, does this mean that the underlying chip is probably radiating ~5000mW?

Do you really need single die? You can combine two lasers using polarization combination, but to get that much total output, you would have to sacrifice power density.

Just some thoughts to keep you going ;-)

 

[WeLight]

Cree XML Colour has a Royal Blue 450nm not Blue which is around 485

 

[bshanahan14rulz]

Yeah, WeLight's right. I think you folks are constraining yourselves to wavelengths that the manufacturer labels as "Royal Blue," when really you ought to be looking for an LED's dominant wavelength.