Zebralight S6330 and S6330b 2400 Lumen flashlights in the making. .

[tonkem]

Yes, the TL2 has better modes than the TL, but that 30 lumen lowest mode is still a bit high. Yesterday I got up in the middle of the night, and with 100% dark adapted vision, I found even the L1 of the S6330 a bit high, so I double clicked it to go lower. The betty's or even the piko tl's low mode would have been an overkill. But I also have to add that it already happened three times that I couldn't switch the S6330 off, 'cause the button was not responding, so I had to remove all the batteries to "reset" it. Or when I washed my SC600 II under the tap, the glass fogged up from the inside..

I am still thinking of ordering a TL2 as a Christmas present for myself. Of course, a redesigned S6330 would have been nice.

Yeah, I am having a time deciding whether to pickup the TL2 head for myself to add to my "extra" 5ah battery. As for the getting up at night, I use my Zebralight Sc52 for that on just above the lowest setting is perfect, and very small. I keep the betty TLs or the Wilma TL on the nightstand in a holster in the case that I should need more light Glad to see another who like the Lupines on this forum, seems there are not many of us

 

[tonkem]

Davpet, did you ever get the TL2?

 

[kj2]

Seeing Zebralight releasing so many XML2 lights, wonder if the 6330 will be updated? Put the light over 3000 lumens? And perhaps a 2nd revision of integrating a lanyard, versus adding a lanyard attachment, or removing the lanyard attachment all together....
I decided to email Zebralight with this very question. Will post back what response I get.
Zebralight's response:

Staff (Lucy Pan) 9/5/2013 8:12:46 PM

Don't know the production plan for the next batch yet. Thank you for your support!

I asked yesterday, and got answer today. They will come with an XM-L2 version, only no known release date.

 

[tonkem]

That sucks that we cannot get any idea of a release date. Say "in a few months" or "next week". The waiting is not fun

I asked yesterday, and got answer today. They will come with an XM-L2 version, only no known release date.

 

[davpet]

Davpet, did you ever get the TL2?

I ordered it about two-three weeks before Christmas.. then on the 20th of December I received an email that it's out of stock, and will only be available in the middle of January. So I decided to cancel my order. Since then I haven't ordered it again. I guess I'll just wait for a brighter light.. like over 5-6000 lumens to really notice the difference.

 

[tonkem]

Agreed, I have decided to hold off as well. I have upgraded one of my Wilma TL's to 1300 lumens with the 26 deg beam and a better color temp, versus the 15 deg beam that I had before. The beam is more like my Betty TL at 26 degrees and really the difference between 1300 and 2600 is not THAT MUCH. The TL2 head, a la carte option, has not materialized, so I am relegated to be content with the Wilma and Betty that I have, as well as my 6330.

Will be keeping my eye on Lupine, hoping they will bring back the Wilma TL at 2800 lumens, although they have said they will not.... I preferred the smaller size of the Wilma to the Betty head, anyway.

I ordered it about two-three weeks before Christmas.. then on the 20th of December I received an email that it's out of stock, and will only be available in the middle of January. So I decided to cancel my order. Since then I haven't ordered it again. I guess I'll just wait for a brighter light.. like over 5-6000 lumens to really notice the difference.

 

[carl]

dear zebralight - please make the new S6330 more like the Lupine and less like the other Asian soda-can sized lights. There are already a bunch of huge one-pound short and fat lights out there.

1) Use 2 batteries instead of 3 or 4. This makes it more compact and much lighter. If buyers want more battery life, make a longer extended battery tube which holds 4 batteries (2 pairs of batteries end-to-end) as an accessory (Lupine offers a longer battery as an accessory).

2) Add another emitter (4 total).

3) Call it the new S444 (4 inches long, 4 emitters, 4000 lumens)

This way, it more directly competes with Lupine in the areas of compactness, weight, and brightness.

Thank you.

 

[tonkem]

Did you send this to them? I just want a new 6330

Did you get any new Lupines?

dear zebralight - please make the new S6330 more like the Lupine and less like the other Asian soda-can sized lights. There are already a bunch of huge one-pound short and fat lights out there.

1) Use 2 batteries instead of 3 or 4. This makes it more compact and much lighter. If buyers want more battery life, make a longer extended battery tube which holds 4 batteries (2 pairs of batteries end-to-end) as an accessory (Lupine offers a longer battery as an accessory).

2) Add another emitter (4 total).

3) Call it the new S444 (4 inches long, 4 emitters, 4000 lumens)

This way, it more directly competes with Lupine in the areas of compactness, weight, and brightness.

Thank you.

 

[StarHalo]

2) Add another emitter (4 total).

Not necessary in the age of the MT-G2..

 

[carl]

Did you get any new Lupines?

I wish!

 

[carl]

Not necessary in the age of the MT-G2..

ok, agreed.

It will be a 1xMT-G2 and 2x18650.

So now we'll call it the S432 (4 inches long, 3000 lumens, 2 batteries).

This configuration will give us something we have come to expect from Zebralight - a much much smaller and lighter torch than the competition. And most importantly, something DIFFERENT from the many other 1+ pound, soda can shaped lights that are so big they sit on the shelf not being used 99% of the time.

 

[davpet]

Actually Zebralight should manufacture something similar to the Niwalker Minimax, which will be out soon. I personally think that 2x18650 is not enough for these high output lights - the Minimax will have 4 of them. I could live with it if my Lupine Betty had somewhat thicker body.. and more modes. So, new "big" light from Zebra, (at least) 2xMT-G2 leds, and the battery tube should not be bigger than the S6330's. I was also fantasizing about Lupine releasing a new model with at least 3 MT-G2s under a lens system.. lots of lumens!

 

[WmArnold1]

dear zebralight - please make the new S6330 more like the Lupine and less like the other Asian soda-can sized lights. There are already a bunch of huge one-pound short and fat lights out there.

1) Use 2 batteries instead of 3 or 4. This makes it more compact and much lighter. If buyers want more battery life, make a longer extended battery tube which holds 4 batteries (2 pairs of batteries end-to-end) as an accessory (Lupine offers a longer battery as an accessory).

2) Add another emitter (4 total).

3) Call it the new S444 (4 inches long, 4 emitters, 4000 lumens)

This way, it more directly competes with Lupine in the areas of compactness, weight, and brightness.

Thank you.

I hope that ZL designs the S6330 to compete better with the Lupines too - however;

1) Recall that one of the big features of the S6330 was three separate drivers; one for each LED / Battery. Personally, I love the failsafe-ness of that! Extending the battery tube to accommodate twice the batteries in series would allow twice the run-times. Which would become 4-hours in high gear!

2) Adding another emitter would be okay; but ZL's design would probably be 4-emitters + 4-batteries. That would be okay with me tho..

3) ~ no arguments here ~
________________________________

Something nobody has mentioned for a while, and my greatest hope, is that ZL incorporates TIR optics to better manage what I consider excessive spill. Because, the Lupines have TIR... ~grins~

Don't get me wrong; I love the 80-degree spill-cone of my SC600, I would just rather collate some of those lumen into the hot-spot. Imho, one only needs 200 Lm or so to avoid stepping into holes; imagine having all but that focused within the hot spot! ANSI-throw would be phenomenal because TIR optics can allocate lumens nearly independently of beam pattern.

Bottom line; my pocket EDC is a flooder - the SC600. It covers me well until I need to focus on objects that are more than, say, 20 meters away. If I'm going to buy another light for more *throw*, I'd rather keep (or even reduce) the spill I enjoy from my SC600 and boost the hot-spot by more than 3 times. Imho, TIR optics can collate 75% or more of OTF lumens into the spot-cone!

 

[davpet]

Something nobody has mentioned for a while, and my greatest hope, is that ZL incorporates TIR optics to better manage what I consider excessive spill. Because, the Lupines have TIR... ~grins~

Don't get me wrong; I love the 80-degree spill-cone of my SC600, I would just rather collate some of those lumen into the hot-spot. Imho, one only needs 200 Lm or so to avoid stepping into holes; imagine having all but that focused within the hot spot! ANSI-throw would be phenomenal because TIR optics can allocate lumens nearly independently of beam pattern.

Bottom line; my pocket EDC is a flooder - the SC600. It covers me well until I need to focus on objects that are more than, say, 20 meters away. If I'm going to buy another light for more *throw*, I'd rather keep (or even reduce) the spill I enjoy from my SC600 and boost the hot-spot by more than 3 times. Imho, TIR optics can collate 75% or more of OTF lumens into the spot-cone!

Well, the Piko TL has 22 degree optics, is about 1.5 times more powerful than the SC600 II (according to my measurements), and still has about the same throw. The Betty has 26 degree optics, has at least a few hundred lumens more output than the S6330, and still has less throw. While there is almost no spill to speak of, the hotspot is much larger than the Zebra's. I've had them both for quite some time now, but still can't decide which beam pattern I like better. Still, the Lupines look more advanced, those optics probably cost more than simple reflectors.

 

[davpet]

Agreed, I have decided to hold off as well. I have upgraded one of my Wilma TL's to 1300 lumens with the 26 deg beam and a better color temp, versus the 15 deg beam that I had before. The beam is more like my Betty TL at 26 degrees and really the difference between 1300 and 2600 is not THAT MUCH. The TL2 head, a la carte option, has not materialized, so I am relegated to be content with the Wilma and Betty that I have, as well as my 6330.

Will be keeping my eye on Lupine, hoping they will bring back the Wilma TL at 2800 lumens, although they have said they will not.... I preferred the smaller size of the Wilma to the Betty head, anyway.

Tonkem, I just checked Lupine's website and they sell a DIY upgrade for the Bettys with XM-L2 leds. It increases output from 2600 to 3000 lumens and it's 95 Euros. Not that expensive, compared to their new lights. Ok, I know it is only 400 lumens plus, but still..

 

[WmArnold1]

Well, the Piko TL has 22 degree optics, is about 1.5 times more powerful than the SC600 II (according to my measurements), and still has about the same throw. The Betty has 26 degree optics, has at least a few hundred lumens more output than the S6330, and still has less throw. While there is almost no spill to speak of, the hotspot is much larger than the Zebra's. I've had them both for quite some time now, but still can't decide which beam pattern I like better. Still, the Lupines look more advanced, those optics probably cost more than simple reflectors.

Thanks for sharing your findings Davpet! Technically, there's only two throw parameters; spot-cone angle and OTF lumens within that spot-cone. But, deciding which beam pattern we like is the biggest factor affecting what throw we will get.

I have upgraded one of my Wilma TL's to 1300 lumens with the 26 deg beam and a better color temp, versus the 15 deg beam that I had before. The beam is more like my Betty TL at 26 degrees and really the difference between 1300 and 2600 is not THAT MUCH. The TL2 head, a la carte option, has not materialized, so I am relegated to be content with the Wilma and Betty that I have, as well as my 6330.

Ditto Tonkem; I find it most interesting that you switched a 15° beam to a 26° beam on one of your TL's. 20° or so seems to be the EDC sweet-spot for my lifestyle. Do you keep two TL's handy? One with 15° and the other with 26°?? That sounds like what I want to accomplish with a SC600 & S6330 - separate flashlights; one for near work and one for far work.

And, as a secondary "far work" flashlight, I wouldn't mind if my S6330 had six or even eight 18650's because I'd only bring it into play when I need more throw than my EDC provides. Meantime, I'd keep it in the glovebox, toolbox, or maybe even strapped onto the far side of my Bat-utility-belt. But the separate EDC will always be nearest & dearest to my heart and I can't imagine anyone EDC'ing any size of the S6330 without carrying something else too; maybe a key-chain light.. ~grins~

Sorry for rambling a little.. I envy you guys with the Lupines. Although TIR's are a lot more expensive to design & tool-up for, in the end, they're just injection molded parts too. ZebraLight could sell millions of them!!!

 

[Fireclaw18]

I hope that ZL designs the S6330 to compete better with the Lupines too - however;

1) Recall that one of the big features of the S6330 was three separate drivers; one for each LED / Battery. Personally, I love the failsafe-ness of that! Extending the battery tube to accommodate twice the batteries in series would allow twice the run-times. Which would become 4-hours in high gear!

2) Adding another emitter would be okay; but ZL's design would probably be 4-emitters + 4-batteries. That would be okay with me tho..

3) ~ no arguments here ~
________________________________

Something nobody has mentioned for a while, and my greatest hope, is that ZL incorporates TIR optics to better manage what I consider excessive spill. Because, the Lupines have TIR... ~grins~

Don't get me wrong; I love the 80-degree spill-cone of my SC600, I would just rather collate some of those lumen into the hot-spot. Imho, one only needs 200 Lm or so to avoid stepping into holes; imagine having all but that focused within the hot spot! ANSI-throw would be phenomenal because TIR optics can allocate lumens nearly independently of beam pattern.

Bottom line; my pocket EDC is a flooder - the SC600. It covers me well until I need to focus on objects that are more than, say, 20 meters away. If I'm going to buy another light for more *throw*, I'd rather keep (or even reduce) the spill I enjoy from my SC600 and boost the hot-spot by more than 3 times. Imho, TIR optics can collate 75% or more of OTF lumens into the spot-cone!

I liked that the S6330 was probably the safest multi-18650 light in existence. Having each cell separately power a different LED was inspired. No need to use cells of the same capacity or charge level. No risk of having one cell deplete, get reverse charged by the other cells and explode.

Personally, I'd like to see an even smaller version of the S6330... same triple LED setup, but with XM-L2 neutral LEDs. I'd like the bezel to be the same width as the battery tube to make.

TIR optics would be nice. Note that TIR optics can be made with spill to give a more traditional beam pattern. A TIR optic could be shorter than a reflector and make for a smaller light.

 

[WmArnold1]

TIR optics would be nice. Note that TIR optics can be made with spill to give a more traditional beam pattern. A TIR optic could be shorter than a reflector and make for a smaller light.

Exactly! The spill from a conventional reflector is just the raw LED spatial emission between 40 degrees and 10 degrees or so. (Ref) A TIR can "spill" a much smaller percentage of the total spatial emission into the same angular range.

 

[tonkem]

Thanks for sharing your findings Davpet! Technically, there's only two throw parameters; spot-cone angle and OTF lumens within that spot-cone. But, deciding which beam pattern we like is the biggest factor affecting what throw we will get.



Ditto Tonkem; I find it most interesting that you switched a 15° beam to a 26° beam on one of your TL's. 20° or so seems to be the EDC sweet-spot for my lifestyle. Do you keep two TL's handy? One with 15° and the other with 26°?? That sounds like what I want to accomplish with a SC600 & S6330 - separate flashlights; one for near work and one for far work.

And, as a secondary "far work" flashlight, I wouldn't mind if my S6330 had six or even eight 18650's because I'd only bring it into play when I need more throw than my EDC provides. Meantime, I'd keep it in the glovebox, toolbox, or maybe even strapped onto the far side of my Bat-utility-belt. But the separate EDC will always be nearest & dearest to my heart and I can't imagine anyone EDC'ing any size of the S6330 without carrying something else too; maybe a key-chain light.. ~grins~

Sorry for rambling a little.. I envy you guys with the Lupines. Although TIR's are a lot more expensive to design & tool-up for, in the end, they're just injection molded parts too. ZebraLight could sell millions of them!!!

Currently I have the 15 deg 1100 lumen Wilma and a 26 deg 1300 lumen Wilma. I actually prefer the smaller head of the Wilma versus the larger head of the Betty. The 1300 more lumens of the Betty is not THAT much brighter, so I am content using and carrying the Wilma most of the time. The 1100 15 deg model does not throw that much further and has a bluer tint than the 26 deg with a warmer tint that is more like the Betty.

I use the Betty on occasion, but grab for the 1300 lumen Wilma for most cases.

 

[markr6]

I would really like to see this light come back! Ever since it came out I didn't see a need for it, and I guess I still don't...but the wow factor from such a small light and great UI is pulling me in.