HDS Systems #23

[AZPops]

Yesterday morning I had to run around to catch the bus. It wasn't until evening that I noticed my flashlight was missing from my pocket. The next evening, I went to the same spot and searched for it. Over the course of 24 hours, the temperature dropped from +5°C to -10°C and 1.5 inches of snow fell, but the flashlight was still there. It had sunk into the mud and frozen solid. Inspecting the area with the high CRI flashlight revealed a color difference between the black mud and the black body. High CRI is awesome!
Now I attached a carabiner and a cord to it
View attachment 87402

View attachment 87400
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Cool, but scary story! Glad you found it. ...

It gets pretty cold here as well. I think we got to around 50F this morning, .. burrrr. ... lol

OK, obligatory photo. ...

 

[nbp]

Losing a Twisty in the mud would have been devastating! Those don’t pop up all that often. I’m happy you found it!

 

[tex.proud]

The Trinity is complete! 2xAA arrived today.
CR123 SDR50
18650 Don't remember.
2xAA NB35

EDIT: Customization complete. All set the same with pseudo momentary, double-click strobe, and triple-click SOS.

Carry On!

 

[muichimon]

The Trinity is complete! 2xAA arrived today.
CR123 SDR50
18650 Don't remember.
2xAA NB35

EDIT: Customization complete. All set the same with pseudo momentary, double-click strobe, and triple-click SOS.

View attachment 89014

View attachment 89015

View attachment 89016

Carry On!

The 2AA battery tube is very good. I've been wanting different battery compartments lately. The long runtime is also attractive.

 

[dc38]

The 2AA battery tube is very good. I've been wanting different battery compartments lately. The long runtime is also attractive.

You'd get roughly 70% longer runtime vs a cr123, right? Voltage sag and all...

 

[Schokokeks]

You'd get roughly 70% longer runtime vs a cr123, right? Voltage sag and all...

Voltage sag?

I just assume everyone using AA batteries is using an Eneloop...

 

[tex.proud]

You'd get roughly 70% longer runtime vs a cr123, right? Voltage sag and all...

There's an old Review of HDS body tubes that shows battery graph. Seems AA will give longer time at max with a steep drop off, but CR123 gives longer overall with several drop offs earlier.

 

[Random Dan]

If you care about runtime and don't mind losing pocketability then the 18650 body seems like a no-brainer. A single good 18650 can give you over 3x the capacity of two eneloops.

 

[dc38]

Voltage sag?

I just assume everyone using AA batteries is using an Eneloop...

View attachment 89100

Eneloop Pros, maybe...but standard Eneloops would yield only a 10% increase in power capacity vs. A single cr123, per ballpark numbers.
2.4V×2000mAh vs. 3V×1500mAh.

 

[dc38]

If you care about runtime and don't mind losing pocketability then the 18650 body seems like a no-brainer. A single good 18650 can give you over 3x the capacity of two eneloops.

I'm not sure if HDS are the same as Novatacs in this regard, but my "spec ops" novatac body can hold an 18650 if a brass strip is swapped for the signal spring.

 

[Schokokeks]

Eneloop Pros, maybe...but standard Eneloops would yield only a 10% increase in power capacity vs. A single cr123, per ballpark numbers.
2.4V×2000mAh vs. 3V×1500mAh.

Oh, yeah, for capacity. I thought you meant Eneloops wouldn't hold the 2.4V well.

In fact, CR123A batteries have a poor output curve versus Eneloops, as they drop in voltage fairly steadily, while Eneloops hold their voltage throughout most of their output.

I'm still on the fence as to whether I prefer a tapered output (a la CR123A) versus a flat curve. In theory, I like the flat curve, but I think in usage, the slow decline gives me more time to react to lower capacity.

 

[muichimon]

You'd get roughly 70% longer runtime vs a cr123, right? Voltage sag and all...

That's right. Based on my knowledge from reading the HDS FAQ, the brightness level I normally use is around 8-20, so it seems like two AA batteries would significantly increase the runtime. I don't use rechargeable batteries, so I was comparing runtime with two AA primary batteries, either alkaline or lithium.

 

[jon_slider]

A single good 18650 can give you over 3x the capacity of two eneloops.

Agree!
18650 beats all the other options, 2x Ultimate Lithium is second longest (1 hour less than 18650):

3500mAh 18650 is the blue arrow, about 195 min
2x Ultimate Lithium yellow arrow, about 138 min
2x White Eneloop is the brown arrow, about 60 min, (79 min w Pro),
950mAh 16340 is the fuschia arrow, about 51 min
CR123a is the red arrow, about 23 min

I don't use rechargeable batteries, so I was comparing runtime with two AA primary batteries, either alkaline or lithium.

Lithium, yellow arrow, is 2x better than Eneloop:

 

[Schokokeks]

Agree!
18650 beats all the other options, 2x Ultimate Lithium is second longest (1 hour less than 18650):

3500mAh 18650 is the blue arrow, about 195 min
2x Ultimate Lithium yellow arrow, about 138 min
2x White Eneloop is the brown arrow, about 60 min, (79 min w Pro),
950mAh 16340 is the fuschia arrow, about 51 min
CR123a is the red arrow, about 23 min


Lithium, yellow arrow, is 2x better than Eneloop:
View attachment 89119

I think the most interesting part of this is how much the CR123A steps down.

Was that intentional? Or just because of the way the voltage drops?

It seems like everything else just runs regulated and dies, but the not the CR123A.


And finally, while the runtime of disposable lithium AA cells is much longer, those single-use cells are about as much as an Eneloop, so unless you've got some really particular circumstances where extended runtimes are critical, I can't see that being worth it. Carrying a few spare cells in a case seems like it's be the better way to go.


I almost wonder how practical it'd be to make an HDS do a side-by-side AA battery configuration. I absolutely love AA lights, but I don't get real into the 2xAA configurations because they are longbois. The slim size of AA cells makes the side-by-side surprisingly compact, too.

 

[muichimon]

Agree!
18650 beats all the other options, 2x Ultimate Lithium is second longest (1 hour less than 18650):

3500mAh 18650 is the blue arrow, about 195 min
2x Ultimate Lithium yellow arrow, about 138 min
2x White Eneloop is the brown arrow, about 60 min, (79 min w Pro),
950mAh 16340 is the fuschia arrow, about 51 min
CR123a is the red arrow, about 23 min


Lithium, yellow arrow, is 2x better than Eneloop:
View attachment 89119

The runtime graph is very clear. I learned once again that the 2AA has an incredible runtime. I also learned that the CR123A's power degradation occurs sooner than I expected when used at full power. I didn't notice it at all because I use the brightness level at low-medium.

 

[dc38]

Hi all,

Wanted to ask about the Novatac Spec Ops, it being a legacy product and all...the documentation states that it takes a voltage range of 4 - 6.5V, but does not specify the V-out to the LED...

Q1) Could I just drop a 519A in there and expect it to function normally?
Q2) Does the SpecOps driver just cut out below 4V, i.e. when a single LiIon drops below 4V?

Thanks in advance!

 

[desert.snake]

Eneloop Pros, maybe...but standard Eneloops would yield only a 10% increase in power capacity vs. A single cr123, per ballpark numbers.
2.4V×2000mAh vs. 3V×1500mAh.

For some reason, the Pro versions die much more often than the stated 500 cycles, I switched to white Eneloop 2000 mAh

519a will work great!

I think it's better to check with Henry or Hogo, but if I understand correctly, different names are just different factory presets, and the driver is the same which on all Novatac

 

[dc38]

For some reason, the Pro versions die much more often than the stated 500 cycles, I switched to white Eneloop 2000 mAh

I've heard this alot, lol...something like 120 charges in and they don't hold charge well...

Not to derail the thread, but they're about on par with the Olight beta tested 2500 mAh NiMH. I don't think the olights are LSD, as over a year sitting in a battery caddy, they lost about 400mAh a piece. I have over a dozen others that I've been repeatedly draining and charging, but after about 200-250 charges each, they seem to be maintaining alot of their stated 2500mAh capacity based on a known discharge on a given flashlight. The worst performer lost about 10% of its initial capacity holding, but still stayed above 2200mAh. The average is maintaining above 2350, and I have an outlier at 2525 fresh off the charger, but I suspect that one might be dying soon. I'll be testing their rested capacities soon after so much "abuse".
Degradation testing under variable feasible use:
1) charging at 200, 400, 1000mAh respectively with different groups
2) discharging with the same devices at around 700mAh ( known flashlights running around 80 lumens)
3) Untouched pair, sitting on a desk for ambient self discharge
4) untouched pair, in a battery caddy

I think it's better to check with Henry or Hogo, but if I understand correctly, different names are just different factory presets, and the driver is the same which on all Novatac

@Hogokansatsukan , as one of the resident authorities on current and legacy HDS products, would you mind chiming in? I understand that the specOps had an operating voltage between 4v and 6.5v, could I just swap the LED for a 519 and expect normal operation on two cr123?

519a will work great!

I certainly hope so! I have a whole slew of different color temps...2700k all the way to 5700k. I plan on dedoming the 5700k to get a nice 4300k and more throw, and already have a standard SPA120 with a dedomed 3500k (resultant around 2700k/2800k)

I've been slowly getting braver and braver with the LED swapping. Only a matter of time until I grind a star to fit the slotted pill/driver assembly...I just want to make sure I've got the LED CCT choice JUST right...

 

[Lungbarrow]

I’ve been debating replacing an HDS EDC I lost some time ago—I really miss it!

Any idea what the shipping time frames are for stock rotaries and customs?

Thanks!

 

[tex.proud]

I recently ordered a custom AA rotary and it shipped in a couple days.

Carry On!