hombreluhrs
Enlightened
OP reflectors? For the list
HDS Systems EDC # 19
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tech25
Flashlight Enthusiast
Now that you mention it... :grin2:
Thought the same thing. Could easily move this to a 500 lumen light. Mine is an XP-L 4000k at 325 lumens
Hogokansatsukan
Flashlight Enthusiast
Reflectors are one of the items we are looking at. The reason the OP reflector went away is simple... the one vendor in the U.S. who could do OP, closed their doors due to Chinese competition about 3 years ago. We try to source everything we possibly can in the U.S. hence OP went away. We are looking into other options but will continue to use U.S. businesses.
Hogokansatsukan
Flashlight Enthusiast
Yes, it could be made to 500 but there are 3 issues. First, the difference between 325 and 500 lumens is barely perceptible to the human eye. Remember, eyes work in a logarithmic fashion. The second issue is that run time gets severely cut. The third issue is heat management on the light. Henry sees this as a poor tradeoff for what is basically, as he sees it, simply padding the spec sheet. HDS has never been into chasing lumens or competing with those companies that do. It's all about reliability, durability, and utility.
peter yetman
Flashlight Enthusiast
....and so say all of us. Well, nearly all.
P
P
JKolmo
Enlightened
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Amen to that!
the.Mtn.Man
Flashlight Enthusiast
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I imagine, of course, that this would require a new AA head... unless Henry can work some sort of magic that would allow existing heads to work with a 1AA battery, but I can't see that happening.
Needless to say, I would be extremely interested in a 1AA high CRI Rotary.
the.Mtn.Man
Flashlight Enthusiast
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All other things being equal, 325 lumens will not look substantially brighter than 250 lumens, that is if you can see the difference at all. Remember, you need a 4x increase in lumens for a perceived doubling in brightness.
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Hogokansatsukan
Flashlight Enthusiast
Correct on all accounts!
It is the very cool thing about HDS, Henry is never done improving... even if it takes awhile.
Hondo
Flashlight Enthusiast
:crackup: This always makes me chuckle, as my brightest (of many) HDS is 140 Lumens. And I spend very little time on high. Guess I still appreciate when the Ultimate 60 was considered a beast, and an incandescent killer.
Pretty much:
- Middle of the night: 0.05 - 0.2 lumens
- Around the house in the evening: 3 - 10 lumens
- Hiking out of the woods at night: 10 - 20 lumens
- Wazzat? - MAX
120 - 140 lumens is stunningly bright in the Michigan woods when you have turned down to ~10 lumens after the dusk light has faded and your eyes fully dark adapt. Of course, for other uses, especially biking, I have other lights with big numbers, but there's no need for what I use the HDS for. He made them for caving, and mine have been in several caves. Never felt short of light.
ironhorse
Enlightened
I also miss the triple click lockout. Easy to do one handed. Twisting to lockout or unlock, I cannot do it one handed.
tech25
Flashlight Enthusiast
in the dark you are correct, I started off my EMS career with an Incan AA minimag. However, some of my uses are in the city with street lights and I'm trying to look into a mangled wreck of a car for anyone pinned in a corner or footwell, that's where more lumens come into play. I tend to use brighter quick bursts. I was thinking of an 18650 rotary that I can adjust the dial up or down as needed.
At work, I currently use a Malkoff M61N with ~325 lumens. Truth is, that's more than enough but I like flashlights and even if it's not useful, I like some more lumens available. I tend to charge my batteries after each shift and have extras in the ambulance. I totally understand Henry's viewpoint- but one can wish...
That's enough from me about this. As far as Hogo's list, I think that pretty much sums up the major wishes that people have mentioned in the past year or so.
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Tejasandre
Flashlight Enthusiast
If I promised to see the difference & not use it too often & carry a spare battery, will he make me a 500 lumen 4500?
Hogokansatsukan
Flashlight Enthusiast
Well, I don’t know about the 4500 but we are discussing improved output without sacrificing Henry’s 3 principle of the light.
Ozythemandias
Flashlight Enthusiast
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Can we get a video interview? Maybe one where you go over the list with him?
Also, out of curiosity. HDS isn’t a showy brand or product, how well is it received at shows like SHOT?
Also, out of curiosity. HDS isn’t a showy brand or product, how well is it received at shows like SHOT?
Tejasandre
Flashlight Enthusiast
recDNA
Flashaholic
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Put me on the list. I would love a higher output XP-L high but any increase in output is welcome. BTW, I actually like the smooth reflector. My 3 o'clock high beam is perfect.
Hogokansatsukan
Flashlight Enthusiast
Neither Henry nor myself particularly like being on camera. My hands, I don't mind. Henry is the same way.
SHOT is an interesting place. People who stop to look at the light and hear it explained are very impressed with it. The problem is this... and this is me talking (Hogo) The HDS light is not a light for stupid people. It's not a light for people who really don't put thought into their gear and how they use it. I like to think of it as a "thinking man's" light. If people purchased cars the same way they purchase lights, folks would only be looking at how much horsepower the car has. Now, someone who thinks about how they use a light for utility, falls in love with the light right away. The UI is very simple, especially on the Rotary or Tactical model (even my girlfriend can figure those out) and is far more versatile than any other light out there. Some understand this, and some just want a 800 horsepower light for $100. It's pretty easy to tell when the first question is "how many lumens"? Now, when they ask what makes this light different from the 754 lights they have already seen, this at least shows they know lumens isn't the entire criteria.
Another issue is, of course, price. Again, if price were the only consideration in buying a car, the U.S. would be flooded with Yugos. SHOT has a lot of vendors looking for "cheap crap" to cashier with a high margin. I say "cashier" because there is no selling. They want to put a product up on their web page and just collect the money when it sells. Anyone who has dealt with the general public knows you are not dealing with an "enlightened" group. Henry's light is popular with, and I'll use the term again "the thinking man".
So, those who are not simply looking for lumens or for cheap stuff to sell, the reception is quite good. The problem with the show is there are too many who fall into "unenlightened" category.
We get some larger manufacturers of things like knives who have an interest in doing a partnership (they suggest it) but they want to copy the light and make it cheap. Not going to happen. They have no clue what the production cost of the light is (it's way high as you may have guessed) and there are a lot of man hours in each light. Big business doesn't like that, and HDS will never cheapen it's products EVER. Sure, HDS is always trying to figure out a way to make the light for less, but never at the expense of quality.
An interesting thing is that we don't sell lights at the show. It's not why we are here, but we get a lot of requests to buy one from folks who want one for themselves, but realize their typical customer won't buy one (a lot having to do with wanting to cashier rather than educate the customer). Lights in the $80-$120 range sell fast, and the higher the lumen number, the faster they fly of the internet shelf because most folks simply won't take the time to research (CPFers are NOT in this category).
In fact, I was just talking with someone who is a buyer for a retail chain. He owns several HDS lights, but won't get them for the stores because it takes too much to educate potential customers (general public).
Where the light is best received is with the instructor community (firearms and survival). These folks love the light.
So, I have just insulted the general public (and I am perfectly fine with that). The reality is, the folks at CPF are far more light educated, and especially in this particular corner of the forum that has thread after thread and page after page regarding this light... well, you guys are the brightest guys out there.
It is probably one of the reasons Henry and I get along so well. It is exactly the same way with my leather business. The majority of folks wouldn't know a good holster from a bad one, and focus more on price than what the holster is for and it's importance to the entire weapon system. A light is just a light and a holster just holds a firearm. Not exactly correct.
Anyway, this is the last SHOT Show we will be attending. There are more important things at this time for HDS, and those are the things on the list you already have seen. 2018 is going to be a banner year for HDS in many ways, and you should start seeing this relatively soon (a combination of Henry soon and Hogo soon).
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