What makes a light "tactical"?

[Robocop]

Many years back we had a huge discussion here concerning the term tactical strobe and if adding strobe to a light made it "tactical". It was a very long discussion and many members (myself included) believed that strobe was a marketing gimmick and not very tactical at all. I have worked almost 30 years as a police officer and all 30 have been in patrol on night shift. Of course as a flashaholic I have tried all types of lights and as such have found what works best for me as a tactical light.

I think the term tactical ,as far as lights go, should be replaced with dependable. For lighting in a tactical scenario the light absolutely needs to work and work every time I need it. Of course this applies to any equipment in a tactical scenario. With a flashlight I believe a true tactical light should have a simple one click on and one click off mechanical tail switch. It should also have a potted circuit for durability as well as a shatter proof lens. It should also have the ability to be serviced quickly in the field with the operator having a spare battery or even a spare tail switch. It should also offer a single high level output level rather than various additional modes that can be confusing or even get in the way when you just need light. I also prefer lights that require the batteries to be removed for charging. This is again as I like it to be simple without any weird USB ports or other areas for moisture intrusion or electronic failure.

I carry 3 lights on duty with my main light being a single 21700 set up. My small back up light runs a single 16340 and my mounted weapon light also runs the 16340. I carry spare batteries for each and they can all be swapped in a few seconds if needed. Lights have come a long way and today it is easy to have all the light I need for a 12 hour shift with this simple set up and very rarely will I have to swap batteries during a shift.

I personally do not like products that have a proprietary battery set up or even an internal battery that can not be swapped. A single 18650 or 21700 set up is just fine as again spares are easily and quickly swapped. I have many lights with all types of features and odd battery set ups however these are used for fun and never work. I believe the old saying "simple is smooth" always applies as far as any true "tactical" gear is concerned.

 

[dc38]

Many years back we had a huge discussion here concerning the term tactical strobe and if adding strobe to a light made it "tactical". It was a very long discussion and many members (myself included) believed that strobe was a marketing gimmick and not very tactical at all. I have worked almost 30 years as a police officer and all 30 have been in patrol on night shift. Of course as a flashaholic I have tried all types of lights and as such have found what works best for me as a tactical light.

I think the term tactical ,as far as lights go, should be replaced with dependable. For lighting in a tactical scenario the light absolutely needs to work and work every time I need it. Of course this applies to any equipment in a tactical scenario. With a flashlight I believe a true tactical light should have a simple one click on and one click off mechanical tail switch. It should also have a potted circuit for durability as well as a shatter proof lens. It should also have the ability to be serviced quickly in the field with the operator having a spare battery or even a spare tail switch. It should also offer a single high level output level rather than various additional modes that can be confusing or even get in the way when you just need light. I also prefer lights that require the batteries to be removed for charging. This is again as I like it to be simple without any weird USB ports or other areas for moisture intrusion or electronic failure.

I carry 3 lights on duty with my main light being a single 21700 set up. My small back up light runs a single 16340 and my mounted weapon light also runs the 16340. I carry spare batteries for each and they can all be swapped in a few seconds if needed. Lights have come a long way and today it is easy to have all the light I need for a 12 hour shift with this simple set up and very rarely will I have to swap batteries during a shift.

I personally do not like products that have a proprietary battery set up or even an internal battery that can not be swapped. A single 18650 or 21700 set up is just fine as again spares are easily and quickly swapped. I have many lights with all types of features and odd battery set ups however these are used for fun and never work. I believe the old saying "simple is smooth" always applies as far as any true "tactical" gear is concerned.

this is why the malkoff/elzetta low/high ring is ingenious...tight is always max, loosened head or tail gives the lower mode. I do wish they had gone lower with the low, maybe like 5 lumens, but that's just a personal preference

 

[alpg88]

I think it is all marketing BS. sellers want people to associate their product with military thinking they would sell more of it and can mark up the price, and it works especially for military wannabes, and couch seals, they'll buy any crappy light that makes them feel they have stuff that military uses. Some sellers even claim they are military and sf forces suppliers, without a single evidence of it in existence. We all know 1 such company, they even have word army in its name.

 

[Candleometry]

I think it is all marketing BS. sellers want people to associate their product with military thinking they would sell more of it and can mark up the price, and it works especially for military wannabes, and couch seals, they'll buy any crappy light that makes them feel they have stuff that military uses. Some sellers even claim they are military and sf forces suppliers, without a single evidence of it in existence. We all know 1 such company, they even have word army in its name.

You think marketing is BS? They’re not telling us the truth?

Yup, it’s in every hobby. It’s like water resistance in watches. Most people never get their watches close to water but 300m wr! Need it!

 

[Robocop]

The marketing does appeal to the tactical types very well and I have seen it so very many times. In my 30 years I have been a training officer for 20 of that. I have seen so very many recruits arrive their first day out of the academy with all kinds of gadgets strapped to their vest and duty belts. I always ask what made them choose certain items and they always say they saw it on some tactical website and it was an absolute must have for duty use. I have seen them with crazy huge karambit knives, all types of lasers and range finders, night vision, hard knuckle gloves, glass breakers, tactical pens with tactical notebook and even a dang portable butane torch thing that was supposed to cut through anything...yes a tactical cigarette lighter marketed as a tactical cutting torch.

Fast forward a few weeks in their training and they often begin to shed various gadgets that they now see are actually useless for their actual position. So many arrive with a crazy complicated flashlight with all types of colored filters and yes the strobe with SOS and disco mode are common. Without fail each recruit has always changed their set up to a single powerful main light and a smaller back up. Some will purchase a light with a lock out strobe mode for traffic use on a busy interstate as the strobe can actually be pretty useful in this scenario.

I just realized that I forgot to mention for my personal set up I also have a small Olight Oclip attached to the center of my vest. It is perfect for just a little light when writing in my notebook or fumbling with something in my patrol car.

 

[alpg88]

You think marketing is BS?

marketing bs, is not the same as marketing is bs, very different meanings.

 

[dc38]

I think marketing is all BS, lol. It has pervaded into TECHNICAL standards, I.E. ANSI FL1 ratings. 5000 LUMENS but only lasts for a minute, the rest is ANSI standard FOR 15 HOURS but you go look up what that says kthxbai!

marketing bs, is not the same as marketing is bs, very different meanings.

 

[alpg88]

I think marketing is all BS, lol. It has pervaded into TECHNICAL standards, I.E. ANSI FL1 ratings. 5000 LUMENS but only lasts for a minute, the rest is ANSI standard FOR 15 HOURS but you go look up what that says kthxbai!

That is exactly what I mean, 500000lm, 1004 hours, tactical, we supply army and SF, military grade anodizing... are all marketing tricks, aka marketing bs. But marketing as a concept is sure not bs, it is extremely effective and working concept, hence so many buy into this and actually buy those products.

 

[orbital]

+

Years ago I was at an outdoor everything type store,, they carry nice things usually.

One day I was looking at the boots on sale and there was this guy next to me who was trying really hard to look all big game hunter/tactical badazz,
so over the top. He was probably in his mid to upper 40's'
This clown looked sooo ridiculous I completely lost focus and nearly my shoe size,,, was laughing so hard on the inside I left the store.
== Sitting in my car I almost went back in to ask him 'what time does your mom need the car back'

This is the exact type of guy who buys """"""""" tactical""""""" stuff// ffffffffffffffffffffffff

 

[Erick Tamberg]

Many years back we had a huge discussion here concerning the term tactical strobe and if adding strobe to a light made it "tactical". It was a very long discussion and many members (myself included) believed that strobe was a marketing gimmick and not very tactical at all. I have worked almost 30 years as a police officer and all 30 have been in patrol on night shift. Of course as a flashaholic I have tried all types of lights and as such have found what works best for me as a tactical light.

I think the term tactical ,as far as lights go, should be replaced with dependable. For lighting in a tactical scenario the light absolutely needs to work and work every time I need it. Of course this applies to any equipment in a tactical scenario. With a flashlight I believe a true tactical light should have a simple one click on and one click off mechanical tail switch. It should also have a potted circuit for durability as well as a shatter proof lens. It should also have the ability to be serviced quickly in the field with the operator having a spare battery or even a spare tail switch. It should also offer a single high level output level rather than various additional modes that can be confusing or even get in the way when you just need light. I also prefer lights that require the batteries to be removed for charging. This is again as I like it to be simple without any weird USB ports or other areas for moisture intrusion or electronic failure.

I carry 3 lights on duty with my main light being a single 21700 set up. My small back up light runs a single 16340 and my mounted weapon light also runs the 16340. I carry spare batteries for each and they can all be swapped in a few seconds if needed. Lights have come a long way and today it is easy to have all the light I need for a 12 hour shift with this simple set up and very rarely will I have to swap batteries during a shift.

I personally do not like products that have a proprietary battery set up or even an internal battery that can not be swapped. A single 18650 or 21700 set up is just fine as again spares are easily and quickly swapped. I have many lights with all types of features and odd battery set ups however these are used for fun and never work. I believe the old saying "simple is smooth" always applies as far as any true "tactical" gear is concerned.

I agree with almost all of my esteemed colleague's points – except for the need for a tailcap switch.

Having used Mag-Lite for a long time, I've become accustomed to this standard. I'm not saying against the tailcap switch, but I don't see it as indispensable.

In some cases, it's even disadvantageous, as it's more prone to accidental activation, draining the battery charge.

Since I'm on internal duty now, I'm only taking one Caterpillar penlight (2xAAA). Only On-Off modes. I'm also taking three pairs of spare batteries. The AAA size has the advantage of fitting in older ammunition belt pouches for .38-.357 caliber cartridges. It's better than carrying loose batteries and takes up less space than the original blisters.

 

[dc38]

That is exactly what I mean, 500000lm, 1004 hours, tactical, we supply army and SF, military grade anodizing... are all marketing tricks, aka marketing bs. But marketing as a concept is sure not bs, it is extremely effective and working concept, hence so many buy into this and actually buy those products.

marketing, by definition, is being able to lie by omission and misdirection..."what are selling points, and how can we rationalize the weaknesses into features?"

case in point:
con: falls out of regulation under x volts...
marketing pro: it's regulated until x volts, followed by a nice long taper, which lets you visually gauge cell runtime. (This one is actually the most honest of the bunch, and is making an objective observation, could go either way.)

con: cheaply made, low quality
marketing pro: easily accessible, a good entry point that won't break the bank, and not too bad if you lose it.

con: common 6061T Aluminum
pro: Aerospace grade materials

con: cheap cutco 440A steel
pro: it's 440 steel, the same class and range as surgical stainless! (I will say their heat treating is better than most)

con: recession/depression causing drop or reduction in consumer spending
pro: corporations sympathize, and offer SALE! SALE! SALE! and are "taking a loss per unit sold to help the public" (while downsizing everything to match the new lower price)

con: samurai swords use cheap steel
pro: katanas are steeped in tradition, and being able to refine materials is becoming a lost art.

marketing is greed driven, a.k.a. sales, and is ALL BS, and I will die on that hill. It is designed to exploit human desires. It's even evident in organized religion when it perverses spiritual truths when appealing to fleshly desires. "when you eat of it, your eyes will be opened, and you will become like God, knowing good and evil". What preceeded that, in the bold print? "YOU SHALL SURELY DIE".

**P.S., mythbusters has proven that using traditional asiatic methods, it is indeed possible to polish a turd.

 

[alpg88]

marketing is greed driven, a.k.a. sales, and is ALL BS, and I will die on that hill. It is designed to exploit human desires. It's even evident in organized religion when it perverses spiritual truths when appealing to fleshly desires. "when you eat of it, your eyes will be opened, and you will become like God, knowing good and evil". What preceeded that, in the bold print? "YOU SHALL SURELY DIE".

No arguments here, but it works extremely well, and very effective, so it is a sound concept even if morally wrong. If you own a company that sells product or service, you will take marketing very seriously, it would not be BS to you. It is kinda mind control, it shoudl n ot be taken as bs and dissmissed by either side imo, espacially by those who it is aimed at, or you will not separate facts and tricks.

 

[dc38]

No arguments here, but it works extremely well, and very effective, so it is a sound concept even if morally wrong. If you own a company that sells product or service, you will take marketing very seriously, it would not be BS to you. It is kinda mind control, it shoudl n ot be taken as bs and dissmissed by either side imo, espacially by those who it is aimed at, or you will not separate facts and tricks.

48 laws of power vibes lol...but yeah...I haven't ever sold myself in terms of capability, I have only ever presented myself. An episode of "The Office" portrayed marketing very well,

"Oversaw the distribution of over 1 billion units of inventory"
"...1 billion? 1 billion of what?"
"1 billion...pieces of paper, ma'am..."

 

[Candleometry]

+

Years ago I was at an outdoor everything type store,, they carry nice things usually.

One day I was looking at the boots on sale and there was this guy next to me who was trying really hard to look all big game hunter/tactical badazz,
so over the top. He was probably in his mid to upper 40's'
This clown looked sooo ridiculous I completely lost focus and nearly my shoe size,,, was laughing so hard on the inside I left the store.
== Sitting in my car I almost went back in to ask him 'what time does your mom need the car back'

This is the exact type of guy who buys """"""""" tactical""""""" stuff// ffffffffffffffffffffffff

I can picture it in my mind because that guy is everywhere! Mr. tactical bozo.

 

[jabe1]

Tacti-cool

 

[dc38]

I can picture it in my mind because that guy is everywhere! Mr. tactical bozo.

it's the same guy at the shooting range who is fully decked out, and the only shots he fires are advice and gear shaming...

 

[PaladinNO]

To me, a "tactical" light is one designed to be held over the shoulder. I.e. one with all the control buttons in the tailcap.

Any light you would primarily hold like this:
Held close to your eyes and mostly in sweeping / tracking motions.

Holding a non-tactical light would be like this:
Held casually, like a grocery bag, close to the midsection of the body.

I find tactical lights highly fatiguing to hold over time, as I don't want to have my thumb near the tailcap all the time in case I need to make adjustments.
On / Off on the tailcap is fine, but I want an additional sideswitch for mode control.

In my case:
Fenix LR35 - good (single side button).
Fenix TK35 - not good (2 tailcap buttons).
Fenix PD35 (not a fan of the PD36 rotary system) - excellent (On / Off button on tailcap + mode control on side button)

 

[Robocop]

I have seen the type my entire career. It first starts with some type of tactical related tattoo. Then comes the blue line shirts and clothing style. Then they want to sign up for every tactical class they can get. Then they post pics online while wearing night vision goggles in full tactical gear. These are the guys with all the patches on their uniform and the punisher symbol on their Glock. They laugh at normal policemen when in fact most of the entire unit is actually laughing at them....they are a joke yet in their mind they are elite.

In reality they are actually dangerous to co-workers as they worry so much about the tactical cool image they forget the basic fundamentals. Real police do not act like this as they are humble and not at all the super tactical type. You can spot them a mile away once you know what to look for. The above statement rings true as a good indicator as if you have ever posted a photo online with night vision goggles and an outer plate carrier then this most likely applies to you.

 

[PaladinNO]

One day I was looking at the boots on sale and there was this guy next to me who was trying really hard to look all big game hunter/tactical badazz,
so over the top. He was probably in his mid to upper 40's'

Oof, that sounds much worse than me, 20 years ago. Back then, I had a real preference for the "urban camo"-look (white, black, 2 shades of grey camouflage).
This design:

Spoiler: Urban camo

Nothing over the top, I'd argue - jacket and pants, but no empty holsters or "tactical pouches" (and certainly no symbols, insignias, badges or fake stripes). I wanted to have that military look, but not so that those in the know would have to do a second take to know that I wasn't. Most "civilians" still cleared away from me in the grocery store, no words spoken, so mission accomplished as far as I was concerned.

I still like the design, but having doubled in age since then, I don't dress like that anymore.

 

[dc38]

Oof, that sounds much worse than me, 20 years ago. Back then, I had a real preference for the "urban camo"-look (white, black, 2 shades of grey camouflage).
This design:

Spoiler: Urban camo

View attachment 90887

Nothing over the top, I'd argue - jacket and pants, but no empty holsters or "tactical pouches" (and certainly no symbols, insignias, badges or fake stripes). I wanted to have that military look, but not so that those in the know would have to do a second take to know that I wasn't. Most "civilians" still cleared away from me in the grocery store, no words spoken, so mission accomplished as far as I was concerned.

I still like the design, but having doubled in age since then, I don't dress like that anymore.

talk softly and behave as if you're carrying a big stick?